#ubuntu-us-mn 2010-01-04
<mr_steve> Howdy fellas
<_diablo> 'lo
<mr_steve> How's it going?
<_diablo> not too bad
<mr_steve> Good good
<_diablo> I'm not sure if I really belong on here seeing as I'm a fedora user, I'm currently in michigan, and I only attended one meeting
<_diablo> but I lurk
<_diablo> :)
<_diablo> I'll be back in the cities soo
<mr_steve> Heh, why not. It's fun
<_diablo> exactly
<mr_steve> I haven't been in here much lately, very busy. Starting school next week already
<_diablo> ah, where?
<mr_steve> Minneapolis Community & Technical College
<_diablo> ah, nice
<_diablo> do you know tom ferguson by chance?
<mr_steve> Nope, don't think so
<_diablo> ah, well he's the only one I know there
<mr_steve> Yeah I haven't met anyone there yet. I've only been up there a few times to register and deal with administraiva
<_diablo> ah, just starting? studying cs I assume?
<mr_steve> Computer support & network admin
<mr_steve> At least I well be; I bombed the math test so I have a semester of generals to get through first
<_diablo> ouch. I'm thinking of looking for network admin jobx
<_diablo> *jobs
<_diablo> but I don't really have any experience lol
<mr_steve> I've got about 5-6 yrs experience in support & admin, but in this economy it's worthless without the degree
<_diablo> yeah, fair enough
<_diablo> I'm looking to get linux+ certified
<_diablo> I'm doing a book thing
<mr_steve> Yeah I'm thinking about that too. I want to pick up a few certs while I'm still in school, since alot of the electives are certificate prep classes
<mr_steve> If I gotta take the class, might as well get the cert when I'm done
<_diablo> exactly
<_diablo> no real reason not to do so
<Takyoji__> I looked at Linux+ and it doesn't really seem to be much at all
<Takyoji__> LPI certification looks much better
<Takyoji__> Linux+ is just like the basics of Linux; nothing deep at all
<Takyoji__> File permissions, using the package manager, etc
<_diablo> ah, well, the book is for LPI 1 and Linux+
<_diablo> or should I be aiming for more than that
<Takyoji__> ahh
<zomGreg> hi guys
<Takyoji__> It should give detail on each level of LPI certification: http://www.lpi.org/eng/certification
<_diablo> zomGreg, hey
<zomGreg> I just read about this group somewhere on the intarnets and I'm wondering how active it is?
<_diablo> Takyoji__, is lpi1 even worth it?
<Takyoji__> http://www.lpi.org/eng/certification/the_lpic_program/lpic_1/exam_101_sample_questions
<_diablo> zomGreg, seems pretty active ;)
<Takyoji__> Seems to be general basics, just learning some commands that you might not use much as a desktop user I assume
<_diablo> Takyoji__, wow. that is super basic
<_diablo> what kind of level would I need to be a network admin?
<_diablo> Takyoji__, http://www.lpi.org/eng/certification/the_lpic_program/lpic_1/exam_102_sample_questions
<_diablo> seems to be a little bit more difficult, although still fairly basic
<Takyoji__> At the same time, I haven't taken any LPI certification yet
<Takyoji__> I believe tonyyarusso has
<zomGreg> the debate is ages old. education vs. experience. Spending time in one seems to mean less of the other.
<zomGreg> there was a good article in Linux Journal about certs vs. experience.
<Takyoji__> Yea, I remember reading of it
<mr_steve> I find it comes down to roughly this: Experience is what you need to do the job, certs/degrees are what you need to get the job.
<Takyoji__> What REALLY annoys me is when people take no initiative to learn themself to some extent. Rather than just "oh, I'll take a class in college"
<mr_steve> Yeah. My dad somehow graduated from Brown with a degree in comp. support & net admin, plus a few certs, and he has no clue at all about computers
<Takyoji__> If someone wants to game development, well hey, you can actually LEARN programming and other various concepts, rather than just waiting until college for to take some class
<zomGreg> nothing like trying and failing and taking good notes for an education.
<mr_steve> I just run a needlessly complex home network to keep some of my skills sharp while I'm out of work :)
<Takyoji__> Too bad I don't have any enterprise-level hardware at home to toy with. :P
<Takyoji__> I don't think I've even touched a system yet that uses a RAID array for storage. xP
<Takyoji__> Aside from a SAN I've found..
<Takyoji__> (which I believe has a Windows-only client... )
<mr_steve> That's my problem too. Although I do have an emulator/workbench type program for playing with emulated Cisco gear
<mr_steve> And I helped a buddy of mine build a Raid-5 with the Linux md-tools
<mr_steve> 2.5TB, I'm jealous
<Takyoji__> heh
<zomGreg> nice work!
<mr_steve> Btw I've just remembered the Cisco IOS workbench I was using is called gns3, if anyone's interested. It's a little quirky but it's in the Ubuntu repo.
<mr_steve> Getting a hold of IOS images to play with is left as an excercise for the reader..
<tonyyarusso> haha
<tonyyarusso> There's also the Cisco emulator doohickey that's not too bad.
<tonyyarusso> PacketTracer I think it was.
<mr_steve> I think I might have heard of that one too, never tried it though
<mr_steve> I should be brushing up more on my IOS... I used to pretty much break every device I was dumb enough to connect a console cable to
<mr_steve> I've gotten better tho ;)
 * tonyyarusso high-fives mr_steve for "needlessly complex home network" - me too!
<mr_steve> I have a primary & secondary nameserver! For no reason besides that I can! woohoo
<tonyyarusso> Okay, now that is bad.
<Takyoji__> Isn't that the common procedure? :P
<tonyyarusso> I've started setting up my first nameserver.
<mr_steve> I cheated, I'm using Webmin
<tonyyarusso> Boooooohissssss
<mr_steve> heheh
 * tonyyarusso snuggles his local Ubuntu repo though
<mr_steve> Bind is still a little intimidating for me
<tonyyarusso> Bind is weird-looking, but not actually complicated.
<tonyyarusso> (I set it up to spoof DNS for *.archive.ubuntu.com at the last installfest so people didn't have to change their sources to use the local copy)
<mr_steve> Nifty. I'm still thinking of setting up my own repo here, I've got 5 Ubuntu machines, it seems wasteful to me to have them all hitting the mirrors for updates
<tonyyarusso> Oh hey everybody, y'all should brainstorm a topic or two for tomorrow's meeting and put them together on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MinnesotaTeam/MeetingAgenda
<mr_steve> I'll think on it
<mr_steve> I had forgotten all about the meeting until about 15 minutes ago
<jenkinbr> yay, meeting tomorrow :)
<jenkinbr> I actually remembered :)
<mr_steve> Yeah it just popped into my head a little while ago so I sent a message out to the list, since I hadn't heard anyone talking about it yet
<_diablo> this is 7:30 pm central time right? (first time)
<mr_steve> 7:00PM I think
<mr_steve> That's what we did last time, anyway
<tonyyarusso> Yes, 7:00 was the plan.
<_diablo> this is the december 20 meeting?
<_diablo> the website is a little off :)
<tonyyarusso> Just fixed that :)
<_diablo> gotcah
<tonyyarusso> Seems the last time we used the wiki for an agenda was a year ago
<_diablo> s/gotcah/gotcha
<_diablo> lol
<zomGreg> so is the Dec 20th agenda what is currently planned for tomorrow?
<tonyyarusso> no
<tonyyarusso> Refresheth the page
<zomGreg> k
<tonyyarusso> Then fill in the blanks :)
<mr_steve> Win/lose: i just figured out how to scale the CPU speed on my netbook.. and I've discovered I have a BIOS bug limiting my CPU to 1.33GHz
<zomGreg> what's the max capability of the CPU?
<mr_steve> 1.66
<zomGreg> not a brutal hit, but a hit nonetheless
<mr_steve> Yeah, kinda obnoxious when I just bought it, and intentionally chose the one with the faster CPU
<tonyyarusso> Which model is this?  (And how are they getting away with something so dumb?)
<mr_steve> It's the Acer Aspire One, AOD250
<mr_steve> There's an ubuntu bug about it, bug #422858
<ubot3`> Malone bug 422858 in cpufreqd "Atom N280 frequency scaling not supported" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/422858
<mr_steve> Heh I didn't know ubot would do that in this channel, neat
<jenkinbr> Someone ping me if I am not active at 7 for the meeting :)
<_diablo> kk
<Takyoji__> ICMP ping? IRC ping? Or a private message? :P
<jenkinbr> In channel :)
<jenkinbr> pm's highlight, but I don't notice where they come from because my client doesn't put them in a new tab unless I tell it to, and I no longer am highlighted by notices.
#ubuntu-us-mn 2010-01-05
<jenkinbr> :)
<jenkinbr> 5 minutes :)
<Alpha_Cluster> oh yeah its monday ant it
 * Takyoji__ hyperventilates in suspense
<Alpha_Cluster> um why?
<mr_steve> howdy folks
<_diablo> hola
<Alpha_Cluster> yo
<_diablo> jenkinbr, ping ;)
<jenkinbr> lol
<jenkinbr> _diablo, pong :D
<Alpha_Cluster> ther was a netsplit
<_diablo> uh oh, will the meeting still be fine?
<Alpha_Cluster> are we waiting for tonyh?
<Alpha_Cluster> tony*
<jenkinbr> probably
<Guest2917> Meeting started, right?
<jenkinbr> Guest2917, not yet
<jenkinbr> should be soon though
<Alpha_Cluster> whats on teh agenda for tonight?
<Guest2917> For some reason, I cannot change my screen name here
<zomGreg> hello
<Alpha_Cluster> Guest2917: /nick doesnt work?
<Guest2917> how do I change it?
<Alpha_Cluster> btw nvm i found the very thurough agenda https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MinnesotaTeam/MeetingAgenda
<Alpha_Cluster> Guest2917: just type /nick <name> where <name> is the name you want
<Guest2917> how?
<Alpha_Cluster> just type it in
<Alpha_Cluster> things with a / before them are interpreted as commands
<Guest2917> 10snoopy1
<Guest2917> it doesn't work
<Alpha_Cluster> what did you type?
<Alpha_Cluster> put a spce in front so i can see it
<_diablo> Guest2917, type '/nick newbletz' without quotes
<Guest2917> .... this is what I typed: /nick 10snoopy1
<newbeltz> ok it worked there
<_diablo> there you go newbeltz
<_diablo> probably a misspelling
<Alpha_Cluster> there you go
<Snoopy1> :) I got it
<Alpha_Cluster> now i call that a successful meeting
<Alpha_Cluster> :)
<zomGreg> an early victory
<Snoopy> ok so we are talking about blueprints?
<jenkinbr> Snoopy, numbers are invalid for starting characters of nicknames, unfortunatly
<tonyyarusso> Hey everybody - sorry I'm late (was doing some businessy stuff.
 * tonyyarusso reads scrollback to see where we are
<Alpha_Cluster> tonyyarusso: they decided to wait till you got here
<tonyyarusso> Oh, spiffy.
<tonyyarusso> Well, is everyone else ready to start then?
<Alpha_Cluster> i am
<tonyyarusso> I see we have a pretty short agenda so far - feel free to add to it if you have a last-minute idea.
<Snoopy> Yes here we go!
<zomGreg> yes
<tonyyarusso> 1.)  Welcome!
<jenkinbr> yes
<_diablo> thank you
<tonyyarusso> Good to see it looks like we have a few folks here, some of which I think might be new faces (or new nicks).  If you weren't at our last meeting, could you please give a brief introduction for yourself?
<_diablo> Hello, I went to the install fest for a few minutes (had a 1000HE netbook there) and attend university of minnesota. I'm often busy on the days that meetings are held, so I haven't been to any official meetings but I'd like to go if possible sometime soon :)
<Alpha_Cluster> Hello all I am Nick I was at the starting meeting like 2 years ago now for this LoCo but havent been around much for the last year or so but am back at least for now. Btw I live in Thief River Falls since my wiki info is old.
<_diablo> I lurk here often. :)
<zomGreg> Hello, I am a Ubuntu user although I'm partial to Debian. I have been a Ubuntu advocate for a few years.
<zomGreg> I worked as part of a Ubuntu/Linux advocacy group called HOSEF (Hawaii Open Source Education Foundation) for a year
<zomGreg> So it's good to see a community growing back in my home state of MN.
<tonyyarusso> zomGreg: Hawaii?  Are you going to school there or something?
<zomGreg> nah, just worked there and volunteered.
<zomGreg> I went to St. Thomas. Graduated in '99.
 * zomGreg feels old
<tonyyarusso> Ah, cool.  My dad went to StT for a year or two before transferring to the U.
<zomGreg> I just moved back to MN this summer in time for the wonderful weather we're having
<tonyyarusso> hehe
<Alpha_Cluster> hey zomGreg whereever you are i dont know if it can be as cold as up here
<tonyyarusso> Good to see you again btw Alpha_Cluster
<zomGreg> I'm in Wayzata now
<tonyyarusso> All righty, shall we talk a bit about blueprints then?  (Feel free to still post if you're just typing slower)
<tonyyarusso> website-replace-wiki )
<tonyyarusso> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-minnesota-projects/+spec/website-replace-wiki -  Not a whole lot has happened since last month on this one that I'm aware of.
 * mr_steve is here, mostly :)
<tonyyarusso> The one piece of news I have to report there is that the server was upgraded to Ubuntu 9.10, and the Drupal installation upgraded to the latest point release.
<tonyyarusso> The Drupal user accounts will all be intact, but I didn't bother transferring your server user account Takyoji__ , so we'll have to do that again sometime.
<Snoopy> Ok for now, just call me Snoopy because I wish to have my real identity secret. I like Ubuntu because it is free, I can use it for my work, and I can have a good experience with it compared to windows or mac os x. I would like to learn how to write a game or just a simple program
<Snoopy> ok my text is read
<Snoopy> *red
<_diablo> Snoopy, it's showing up fine
<Snoopy> let me retype my introduction
<tonyyarusso> For those of you who are new, if you're interested in helping with the web site, you can use the register for an account link on the site and then shoot me an e-mail with the username you used and what your skill/knowledge level is and I can grant you appropriate permissions.
<_diablo> tonyyarusso, what kind of help do you need?
<tonyyarusso> Has anyone else done work on that since we last spoke that you'd like to mention?  (I'm guessing most people were kind of on break for the holidays)
<tonyyarusso> _diablo: Anywhere from copy-and-pasting information from the old wiki pages to the Drupal ones to CSS formatting, Drupal plugin management, etc.
<_diablo> okay, fair enough.
<Snoopy> Ok for now, just call me Snoopy because I wish to have my real identity secret. I like Ubuntu because it is free, I can do my work, and I can have a good experience with it compared to windows or mac os x. I would like to learn how to write a simple program and then move onto writing a game for ubuntu in the future.
<tonyyarusso> Cool.
<tonyyarusso> Next up is https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-minnesota-projects/+spec/area-groups
<mr_steve> tonyyarusso: between the holidays and getting ready for school I haven't had much time for the website, I expect that to change once I get back into a routine here
<tonyyarusso> I think the action item for that should be to start listing any groups you know about on the linked spec wiki page, and we can start approaching them in a few weeks.
<tonyyarusso> mr_steve: excellent - that's basically how it's been here too.
<tonyyarusso> (Put your name by a group if you can be a liason to them also, so we know who our connections are)
<_diablo> tonyyarusso, should penguins unbound be added? I don't know anyone there, but is that the same thing?
<tonyyarusso> The third blueprint (https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-minnesota-projects/+spec/launchpad-education) doesn't really fit here too much (it's mostly for me), but what I would say if you have something in particular you'd like to know about let me know, and I'll try to include it.
<tonyyarusso> _diablo: If it's not already listed, yes.  Brian D-G and I have been in touch before also, so it's a relationship to maintain rather than a new one, but also important.
<_diablo> okay
<tonyyarusso> My family is also calling me for dinner (awful timing, oh well) - would someone else be able to continue the next few minutes seeing if there are things people want to bring up?  (I'll read the scrollback again in half an hour or so)
 * zomGreg has to eat too
 * tonyyarusso appoints _diablo - if there's nothing else you can wrap it up around 8:00 :)
<Takyoji__> Any ideas for events to start this year? (if any)
<_diablo> alright, where is the schedule?
<Takyoji__> such as of activism
<mr_steve> I'm still big on the "Ubuntu Hour" idea, did we ever writeup/link to anything about that on the website?
<Alpha_Cluster> one idea is county fairs? I knwo its early but we might want to start thnking about it
<Alpha_Cluster> Ubuntu hour?
<_diablo> I also don't know of ubuntu hour.
<mr_steve> Sure, the idea is to basically go sit at a coffeeshop or something for an hour, with some ubuntu paraphanalia, CDs, etc
<Takyoji__> Ahh yes, now I remember
<Alpha_Cluster> oh
<Alpha_Cluster> i would say yes but im out in boonies
<_diablo> ah, that does sound like a good idea
<mr_steve> To try to engage people and spread the word. It was also suggested that we could announce them on the website, probably with just short notice, and it could be an opportunity for some of us to meet up
<Takyoji__> For reference: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Hour
<_diablo> I would do it with someone else in Minneapolis, but it seems like it would be best in teams of 2 or maybe even 3
<mr_steve> I'm probably going to be doing it on occasional fridays, when I have a 2-hour gap between my classes
<Snoopy> so we are talking about how to spread operating system?
<_diablo> Snoopy, correct
<_diablo> mr_steve, would you like some company? I really have very little experience, I just started about 18 months ago
<mr_steve> _diablo: Yeah, we can probably arrange to link up. The time window will be somewhere between 11:40AM and 1:30PM, and near the MCTC campus
<_diablo> it might just be me, but coffee shops seem like they would show more promise than a fair
<_diablo> but it easily may not be
<mr_steve> I like the idea especially because haunting coffeeshops and leeching wi-fi is something I tend to do anyway, so why not spread out some ubuntu stuff out on the table while I'm at it
<_diablo> mr_steve, I'm free from 12:30 to 1:30 every day, so we'll figure some place to meet, I get back to MSP on the 16th
<_diablo> mr_steve, exactly.
<mr_steve> awesome
<mr_steve> I may eventually try to commit to say, the 3rd friday of the month or something and put in the wiki page, but not for a while while I get the feel of college life
<_diablo> Alpha_Cluster, what exactly did you mean by fairs? care to explain that a bit more?
<Alpha_Cluster> its an expansion on what i brought up in 2008.
<Takyoji__> Another potential topic (as it would be related, and would help with the above): T-shirts
<Takyoji__> In the implication that it's better to buy Ubuntu t-shirts in bulk
<Takyoji__> as of our LoCo
<Alpha_Cluster> We could take advantage of the state fair and county fairs to hand out CDs and whatnot
<Alpha_Cluster> it would be a good way to spread Ubuntu to people who would most likely not know waht it is
<Takyoji__> And the consideration is just to choose a specific spot for promotion, or actually pay for an area?
<_diablo> Alpha_Cluster, that's a good idea.
<_diablo> Takyoji__, it seems far more practical to just stand and hand out CDs seeing how cheap they are
<_diablo> I can donate a large number
<Alpha_Cluster> yep its not to hard
<Takyoji__> Gah, I can't remember how much it's at the Steele County Fair for a small spot
<Takyoji__> (if ever considered at any extent)
<Alpha_Cluster> i dont think its much normallly
<Takyoji__> The only thing that gets in the way is that you have to have an industrial level GFCI for any type of electrical equipment
<Takyoji__> (was in the Steele County Fair; for my brother's company Aqua Eden)
<_diablo> alright, well, would someone like to look into that for next meeting?
<_diablo> shouldn't take too long
<_diablo> Takyoji__ ?
<_diablo> alright, well, we can talk about that later I guess
<_diablo> as far as t-shirts, that seems like a good idea. is anyone else interested?
<mr_steve> I'd rock an Ubuntu T-shirt
<Alpha_Cluster> same
<Takyoji__> Shouldn't be much of an issue to find the number
<Takyoji__> Perhaps someone should suggest it on the mailing list as well
<Takyoji__> (as of the t-shirts)
<_diablo> alright, seems like we have something substantial. that can either be on the wiki or something. I don't know the process
<_diablo> the mailing list might be the best place
<Takyoji__> Someone could probably even throw together a Google Docs poll or something for those that are interested.
<mr_steve> Any really solid ideas can probably go on the website, like the Ubuntu hour thing for sure. Tho I'll still get a nod from tonyyarusso first
<Takyoji__> and simply post that to the list instead
<_diablo> okay. are there any other suggestions? otherwise it looks like we're done
<mr_steve> I've got nothing further. I've been wayy to busy :)
<Alpha_Cluster> yeah we should be done
<_diablo> kk, good meeting all.
<mr_steve> Alrighty then. For everyone who doesn't know, logs are here: http://logs.ubuntu-eu.org/freenode/2010/01/05/%23ubuntu-us-mn.html
<Snoopy> ok just got back... what are we talking about?
<_diablo> Snoopy, we just finished the meeting about what kinds of things we can do to increase activism
<mr_steve> Snoopy: we've wrapped up the meeting, but feel free to stick around and chat
<_diablo> you can see the log for detailed info if you're interested
<_diablo> what is the mailing list? I'm going to send out the t-shirt poll
<Snoopy> what t-shirt poll?
<_diablo> Snoopy, read the log :)
<Snoopy> like for the Ubuntu t-shirts?
<_diablo> yes
<Snoopy> cool
<Snoopy> I am having an issue copying and pasting the websites here for some reason
<_diablo> Snoopy, what client are you using?
<Snoopy> Mozilla Firefox 3.5.6
<_diablo> which website?
<_diablo> and which OS?
<Snoopy> Ubuntu 9.10 With some pre release stuff installed... I can try to copy anything and only a windows appears which I can do the same good with it as what I can do with it here
<Snoopy> Does anyone know if Lucid is stable enough to install yet?
<Snoopy> I had Lucid installed and one night, I had clicked remove obsolete packages for everything (probably a mistake) and the next day, Grub could not find Ubuntu
<Snoopy> I had Kubuntu-desktop installed which may have interfered with Ubuntu
<_diablo> Snoopy, lucid is still in alpha, nowhere near production level yet
<_diablo> but I would recommend using a dedicated irc client like xchat
<_diablo> it is much easier and less buggy than web based clients
<Snoopy> ok, can I find that in synaptic?
<_diablo> yes, just search for 'xchat' without the quotes
<Snoopy> ok there is x-chat and x-chat-gnome
<Snoopy> i mean xchat and xchat-gnome
<_diablo> add xchat
<_diablo> and then run it
<_diablo> and read the help files. they will explain how to set it up
<_diablo> the server you want will be irc.freenode.net
<_diablo> and then you should type '/join #ubuntu-us-mn'
<_diablo> and you'll be here again :)
<_diablo> good luck
<Snoopy> ok one question about the chat stuff, why are some messages in red and others black?
<Snoopy> red = private   black = public?
<tonyyarusso> mr_steve: afaik we have not yet written up a thing about Ubuntu Hour within Minnesota.  We should both describe it and have a listing of places/times people are doing it.
<Takyoji> Any message with your username is specially highlighted (a feature of a typical IRC client)
<tonyyarusso> Takyoji: That would be the main event idea, although another that we had as a holdover from past meetings that would be cool if anyone volunteers to organize it was a winter BBQ.
<tonyyarusso> Alpha_Cluster: I'm pretty sure you aren't far enough into the boonies to not have a coffee shop ;)
<Guest16346> ok i am snoopy
<mr_steve> tonyyarusso: indeed, like I mentioned I might not be able to commit to a specific day just yet, but eventually
<mr_steve> I'll be posting a note to the mailing list before I do it, at any rate
<_diablo> welcome snoopy
<Snoopy> so would anyone here happen to know how to write applications?
<tonyyarusso> Takyoji: For T-Shirts, we did that once in the past (through the German LoCo), and could again, although I'm not sure how many people need them right now, so we'd want a rough indication of scope before committing to it.
<_diablo> Snoopy, btw, if you wanna stay secret, you probably want to change your username.
<Takyoji> Hence the reason for the poll
<_diablo> it displays it
<_diablo> Takyoji, tonyyarusso, I have the poll set up, I'm just getting ready to send it out now. gdocs will collate it for us
<_diablo> (let me know if I'm trying to do too much too fast)
<Takyoji> alright
<_diablo> just trying to be helpful lol
<Snoopy> ok so how does someone private message in xchat?
<tonyyarusso> _diablo: Nifty.
 * tonyyarusso got the wrong size last time, so would probably be game again
<tonyyarusso> Snoopy: /msg otherpersonsnick Some stuff here.
<Takyoji> Double-click on their username, it'll open a tab for a private message session with them
<tonyyarusso> I think you can ...
<tonyyarusso> Takyoji: beat me
<_diablo> tonyyarusso, which email should I share? it works best with a gmail account so you can see it in your gDocs.
<tonyyarusso> _diablo: I'm not sure I understand the question?  (I haven't used the gdocs poll stuff before)
<Snoopy> so how does someone create that stuff with gdocs? I know that gdocs can be used to share files but I did not know it could create that poll stuff
<_diablo> i sent out the poll
<_diablo> tonyyarusso, well, I'll share the results with you (it will show each person and their responses)
<_diablo> Snoopy, you use the 'form' feature. it then itemizes the results into a spreadsheet that is easily readable and manipulateable
<Snoopy> Instead of google docs, I use Jotform
<Snoopy> So I heard about something called "Ubuntu Mobile", is it real?
<tonyyarusso> Snoopy: Yes, although still limited in practical availability.
<tonyyarusso> Snoopy: http://www.ubuntu.com/products/mobile
<_diablo> brrrr, melrose MN is showing a temperature of -8 degrees. I'm so glad I'm not in MN right now.
<Snoopy> Melrose, is that your hometown?
<_diablo> nah, just saw it on a map
<Snoopy> oh
 * Takyoji pokes _diablo
<Takyoji> You have "Sample Question 2" :P
 * _diablo jabs Takyoji
<_diablo> dammit.
<Takyoji> You should have had something for sizes as well
<Takyoji> Medium, Large, etc
<_diablo> wait. sorry, forgot about the code of conduct
<Takyoji> :o
<_diablo> yeah, I totally messed that up.
 * Takyoji runs off to report _diablo
<tonyyarusso> Sizes might be better to wait until we know whether there's a critical mass to bother, so people don't feel like they're placing an order yet?
<_diablo> I sent out the form I accidentally made. not the real one
 * _diablo facepalms
<Takyoji> ahh
<_diablo> tonyyarusso, yeah, I'll pretend I was thinking that
<Takyoji> I think optimal would be: Size, color (I think the option is either brown or black), gender, email
<Takyoji> People who would want a shirt would fill it out
<Takyoji> Could also add quantity as well
<Snoopy> So how can I obtain Ubuntu mobile and put it on my pocket pc?
<tonyyarusso> Takyoji: last time it was black or navy blue actually.
<_diablo> Takyoji, it's been changed
<_diablo> I do kind of agree with tonyyarusso that we shouldn't make it an order just yet. Keep it to checking interest for now
<Takyoji> Add size as well
<Takyoji> So that people can just list it then, rather than having to take another poll for example (of shirt sizes)
<tonyyarusso> (We'd also have to actually find out whether we have a supplier available to make the darn things ya know)
<Snoopy> So how much would the shirts cost and what would it have on it?
<Snoopy> I know where we could have shirts made!
<tonyyarusso> Cost is determined by supplier, type, and number made.
<Takyoji> http://shop.canonical.com/index.php?cPath=14&osCsid=b4af34897e348ec94f03090437bc21ca
<tonyyarusso> Last time they just had the Ubuntu logo on the left breast/shoulder area
<tonyyarusso> Yes, we could order from Canonical if we want.
<_diablo> size, gender, quantity, name, anything else?
<Takyoji> I suppose that should be sufficient
<Snoopy> A place in Freeport, MN can make shirts
<tonyyarusso> Another reasonably priced option for polos is Lands' End, and if you just want to do t-shirts we have a connection with a local outfit in Elk River.
<_diablo> alright, it's editted
<_diablo> edited?
<Snoopy> Would the shirt have the Ubuntu logo and then have Ubuntu Minnesota Team on the back
<tonyyarusso> _diablo: Ideas of what kind of logo style people want - just logo, name, logo & name, location, yadda yadda
<tonyyarusso> Snoopy: It could, but would cost more the more customized it is.
<_diablo> tonyyarusso, do we want to give options or just leave it wide open like that?
<Snoopy> I think that we could get cool shirts for under $20
 * _diablo agrees with Snoopy
<tonyyarusso> _diablo: I'd leave it open at this stage and see what people say probably
<Alpha_Cluster> we should all vote on it tony
<tonyyarusso> Snoopy: t-shirts yes.  Polos you can do for under $30, but probably not under $20
 * zomGreg is back
<Alpha_Cluster> ohh ubuntu polos
<_diablo> Takyoji, could you take a look at it now? does it change or will it need to be sent out again?
<Alpha_Cluster> that might be too professonal looking
<Alpha_Cluster> lol
<Snoopy> ok I think it would be cool to get some shirts/hooded sweatshirts that have the logo and Ubuntu Minnesota Team in White letters on the back
<Takyoji> You can remove the "Would you like a shirt?" prompt
<Snoopy> well what are payment methods to obtain shirts anyways?
<_diablo> Takyoji, why?
<_diablo> Takyoji, seems like it's more user-friendly than having them enter quantity 0 or deleting it. and it gives more information
<_diablo> they are more likely to click no and exit than enter 0 and exit
<_diablo> gives us a better idea of how many people received it
<Takyoji> Because people taking the poll are most likely going to be the ones interested; those that aren't interested most likely won't
<_diablo> imo. I can remove if others disagree
<Snoopy> Bye
<_diablo> tonyyarusso, or Alpha_Cluster  wanna settle this discussion? you're the break votes
<_diablo> ;)
<tonyyarusso> what am I voting on?
<_diablo> it's getting very heated. I think Takyoji is going to swing at me
<tonyyarusso> lol
<_diablo> whether the first question is necessary
<_diablo> or useful
<tonyyarusso> oh.
<tonyyarusso> Probably not.  Count hits if you must.
<Alpha_Cluster> lol
<Alpha_Cluster> what tony said ;)
<_diablo> I can't count hits, but yeah, sounds good. it's gone
<Alpha_Cluster> how are you doing it?
<_diablo> Alpha_Cluster, google docs
<_diablo> via forms
<Alpha_Cluster> ah yeah
<Alpha_Cluster> you could just total the votes ;)
<Takyoji> Google Docs is very convenient.
<Alpha_Cluster> yeah but misses some really helpful features
<_diablo> well, sorta, this way we have all the info we need to actually distribute them assuming we get a critical mass
<_diablo> because it comes with names and stuff
<Alpha_Cluster> like limiting votes for ip's and counting uniques
<Takyoji> That's if you don't trust the data. :P
<Alpha_Cluster> stone tablet!
<Takyoji> Also you can just get an CSV export, shove it in a DB table, and query it as desired for any statistical information needed
<_diablo> Alpha_Cluster, I agree.
<Alpha_Cluster> if its not in stone we cannot say it happend!
<Alpha_Cluster> lol
<_diablo> hahaha, true.
<_diablo> well, I'm going on a wendy's run, I'll ttys
<Alpha_Cluster> Takyoji: well its already in a google spreasheet what more do you need?
<_diablo> lemme know if anything isn't working right or if you can't see it tonyyarusso
<Alpha_Cluster> well besides a real spreadsheet app ;)
<Takyoji> otherwise what would be some reasonable methods of enhancing support for Ubuntu in Minnesota?
<Alpha_Cluster> Takyoji: im partial for throwing CDs at people like ninja stars
<tonyyarusso> Takyoji: The overriding mantra should be seeking out low-hanging fruit.
<tonyyarusso> Find the people who have started looking into doing things with Linux, but need some help to do so.
<Takyoji> I just feel like when you throw the CD at them, that they're on their own; we'd need to have some material promoting our LoCo group as a means of convenient technical support
<tonyyarusso> Schools and libraries likely have situations like that in a few places - we need to find out which ones.
<Takyoji> or moreso that they think that they're on their own
<tonyyarusso> And you're right, it would be good to figure out what we can and can't do for technical support.
<jenkinbr> sorry i missed the meeting, was having connection issues
<tonyyarusso> Should Ubuntu Hour be used as a support opportunity, or just promotion?  Is it feasible to say that the person in the coffee shop can help you?  Or could they at least explain where you can find help?
<Alpha_Cluster> Takyoji: you misinterpreted my meaning i met literally chucking them at people
<Alpha_Cluster> maybe if we hit them heard enough they will wise up to it ;)
<Takyoji> I would mostly lean towards support; after there's at least a few that have Ubuntu installed
<Takyoji> But what if it hurts them? :P
<Takyoji> Otherwise we could sharpen the edges of the discs, if you really wanted to. :P
<Takyoji> (sarcasm implied of course)
<Alpha_Cluster> lol its ok Takyoji i was joking :)
<Alpha_Cluster> i like doing supportt
<Alpha_Cluster> hence me being here
<tonyyarusso> I would suggest that our team is far from having the resources available to actually provide a significant amount of support, but we are very capable of doing "Tier 1" support and being knowledgable about where to go for Tier 2.  For a lot of people the biggest issue is the overwhelmingness of what happens when they google "Ubuntu support" - what the heck is IRC?  Launchpad?  Bug reports?  Forums?  Blogs?  Wikis?  How do I know which 
<Takyoji> We need dedicated beings to watch every thing that goes on in this channel, and be able to have a response time of less than 0.1 seconds. :P
<Takyoji> Otherwise it would be nice to have some form of tools/plugins to aid those providing support
<tonyyarusso> Actually Takyoji, I don't think you're that far off.  I think it would be useful to have an IRC bot that can give a canned response if no human answers a question within X time.
<Takyoji> or simply someone writing a wiki (of our LoCo wiki) of the best setup for such
<Takyoji> Like for example, it would be convenient if I had a way to be explicitly notified of everything in this channel, including people simply joining the channel
<_diablo> I will be in here far more often and will be willing to help where I can
<_diablo> also, mr_steve and I will be doing some coffee shops and I will be willing to help anyone that needs it there
<_diablo> as well and chilling and giving people handouts when we can
<_diablo> what handouts do we have? are they prepared yet?
<tonyyarusso> Takyoji: err, do you not know how to use /hilight?
<_diablo> Takyoji, yeah, xchat can do that
<tonyyarusso> _diablo: we have nothing specific to our team, but spreadubuntu has generic materials.
<_diablo> tonyyarusso, okay, I'll take a look
<Takyoji> It's complaining that it doesn't know of the command
<Takyoji> I'm using GNOME-XChat
<_diablo> Is it okay that I get involved here even though I don't run Ubuntu on my machines exclusively and it usually annoys me? (I do think it's probably the best starter distro at absolute least and some people love it forever, that's their right)
<tonyyarusso> hehe, yes :)
<tonyyarusso> We don't have any exclusivity terms - just the Code of Conduct.
<_diablo> tonyyarusso, okay good :) I figured, but didn't know how fanatical you were :)
<_diablo> sounds good
<tonyyarusso> I'm pretty sure if we excluded anyone who used any other system there'd only be like 3 people left.
<Takyoji> What? You're against Ubuntu, therefore against our culture?!
<Takyoji> Hang him!
<Takyoji> :P
<_diablo> lol, viva el slackware!
<Takyoji> I'd be curious of poking at Slackware eventually
<zomGreg> i tried it once, I don't really remember much.
<_diablo> Takyoji, it's super annoying. I just tried it for a few days. idk, I'm not a compiling guy
<_diablo> it's fun at first, but gets old real fast
<_diablo> although it is very very clean
<tonyyarusso> Apparently using slackware is like a bad night of drinking, eh zomGreg ?
 * zomGreg has gentoo on his x200 laptop.
<zomGreg> indeed it is
<zomGreg> just tea for me tonight, though
<_diablo> slackware is like gentoo for people that are sane :)
<zomGreg> i like gentoo for the challenge of it. it's a great learning tool
<zomGreg> I can see where people get militant about using it. It's a rite of passage to some. Get the system down and it gets in your head
<zomGreg> Nothing like compiling the 10th kernel of the day to hammer in that process.
<Takyoji> I'm just curious of learning the internal structure and so forth
<zomGreg> gentoo has some excellent documentation. Very solid.
<mr_steve> Gentoo is fun.. Not always useful, but definitely fun
<mr_steve> And my Gentoo experience has given me insight into solving problems I run into in other distros as well
<zomGreg> True, I don't really see any performance gains. But it would be easy to chop down a gentoo install for very specific applications
<_diablo> Yeah, I tried linux from scratch. I almost died
<mr_steve> Yeah, it's handy for that
<mr_steve> _diablo: me too
<zomGreg> hah, I was going to ask if anyone had.
<zomGreg> I haven't tried it yet
<mr_steve> I've still got a half-finished LFS build in a VirtualBox VM
<mr_steve> Now that I've been away from it for a couple weeks it's probably impossible to finish
<_diablo> yup. I even was using the book step by step
<_diablo> sigh. it was rough
<zomGreg> Virtualizing gentoo only confused things for me. I had to learn it on bare metal.
<_diablo> I realized I have no idea how to compile.
<_diablo> how difficult is gentoo compared to LFS or slackware, anyone know? mr_steve
<mr_steve> Definitely not as difficult as LFS
<_diablo> also, anyone have experience with sabayan?
<mr_steve> I'm not sure about slackware, I only tried it briefly. There's no dependency handling for packages, right?
<_diablo> mr_steve, correct
<mr_steve> Yeah, I think that'd bug me. Gentoo may compile everything from source, but it does it with fairly intelligent dependencies
 * zomGreg agrees
<mr_steve> emerge -e world makes a great stress test for a new box, too ;)
<_diablo> hmmm, do you know sabayan? isn't that related to gentoo?
<zomGreg> although the masking blocking and crap can get maddening
<mr_steve> _diablo: I've heard of it but never looked into it
<_diablo> don't worry about it too much, I'll look into it otherwise.
<mr_steve> Hey has anyone had the misfortune of dealing with Acer 1st tier support?
<Takyoji> So for Linux from Scratch; that's simply just the kernel; and then you have to get other parts installed and configured like a command prompt, package manager, etc, or?
<mr_steve> Takyoji: No package manager, unless you choose to add one. The basic book just covers compiling *everything* required for a minimal system, from scratch
<_diablo> Takyoji, technically, there's not even a kernel, you have to get one and compile it yourself
<mr_steve> You start with a host system, and you build the compiler and toolchain from source. Then you build the compiler and toolchain from source again, using the compiler you just built. And then you build the compiler and toolchain from source...
<Takyoji> Sounds more and more interesting. :P
<mr_steve> You build other stuff along the way too, but you seriously do build the toolchain 3 times, to eliminate any dependence on the original host compiler
<Takyoji> I have a very deep curiosity in many things
<Takyoji> Wikipedia is my drugs..
<mr_steve> I recommend making sure you have some ability to copy & paste from the LFS book online to the build system's console, or you will go quite mad
<mr_steve> Lots of very hairy sed/awk voodoo involved in configuring the toolchain, especially
<mr_steve> re: Wikipedia, me too :)
<_diablo> Takyoji, also, having a second computer next to you is handly
<_diablo> s/handly/handy
<Takyoji> I may soon
<Takyoji> An old laptop
<Takyoji> Probably like 4 years or so old
<_diablo> getting a nice shiny one? or an old one?
<Takyoji> already has Ubuntu installed; it'll be one handed down to me
<_diablo> ah, nice.
<Takyoji> My brother's wife's laptop.
 * Takyoji annoys tonyyarusso more
<tonyyarusso> what'd I do now?
<Takyoji> It would also be nice to have attendance of whom was at certain events, etc; so the amount of work a person puts in can be measured (in some general form or another), and so a person has bragging rights (where it be for a resume or Ubuntu membership)
<tonyyarusso> This is true.
<tonyyarusso> I think there are some drupal modules that include event attendance tracking...
<arisystems>  anyone here anymore
<Takyoji> Nope, there's nobody here at all.
<tonyyarusso> :S
<Takyoji> I have a feeling it was someone of: http://www.manta.com/coms2/dnbcompany_f5mbf
<_diablo> i'm here!
<Takyoji> A bit sad that there's nobody marked on the map anywhere south of Faribault (on the Launchpad map). :P
<tonyyarusso> I'm a bit sad that still only like half of the people are marked on the map at all.
<Takyoji> At the next installfest we'll stealthily bag any member that comes and put them in a locked room, and force them to add their general location to the map.
<tonyyarusso> haha
<mr_steve> I think I'm on the map. Or at least, a location within a few miles of me is on the map :)
<_diablo> I'm on the map I think
<zomGreg> good morning all
<Snoopy> hello
<zomGreg> Hi Snoopy, I didn't see your reply until just now. I was watching an argument in another channel while working.
<_diablo> Snoopy, we don't really know any of this yet, for now, it's just general interest. If you're interested, just fill out the survey and list any concerns in the comments section. This isn't an order or anything, it's just a straw poll
<CosmicPizza> hi there
<_diablo> hi CosmicPizza
<CosmicPizza> hi _diablo howdy ?
<Snoopy> Hi CosmicPizza
<CosmicPizza> hey Snoopy
<Snoopy> So will the Ubuntu shirts have "Ubuntu Minnesota Team" on them?
<_diablo> Snoopy, we don't know yet, there's an option in the survey for what you want them to say. When you fill it out, you can see that that is one of the choices
<Snoopy> I already filled the survey and I put what i thought should work in there
<Snoopy> I might buy more than 2 shirts if the price is good and they are too cool to not buy
<_diablo> alright, cool. thanks for filling that out
<_diablo> CosmicPizza, what are you up to today?
<CosmicPizza> i' m great
<CosmicPizza> thx
<Snoopy> What versions of Ubuntu are we using here?
<Snoopy> I am using 9.10
<Snoopy> But once I restart, I am in 10.04
<zomGreg> I have a couple 8.04 servers I'm working on.
<h00k> 9.1
<h00k> 0
<CosmicPizza> 9.10
<h00k> I just upgraded to 64bit yesterday
<_diablo> on my netbook I run karmic
<h00k> and Karmic on my netbook as well
<CosmicPizza> but i' m using ubutu since the breezy one
<_diablo> h00k, !! fun! it has been substantially faster imo
<_diablo> CosmicPizza, whoa
<h00k> _diablo: 64bit?
<_diablo> h00k, yeah
<_diablo> there was just a thing that came out that for some things like compiling it was like 50% faster
<_diablo> i mean, you won't see that day to day, but still cool
<h00k> _diablo: I'm not having any problems with it, so far it's been sweet.
<_diablo> h00k, agreed. I'm on 32 only because flash annoyed me in 64. glitched like crazy. although to be fair, I haven't tried it in ages. probably 9 months
<CosmicPizza> breezy looks like karmik
<h00k> flash annoyed me a ton on 32bit, I haven't really tried flash too heavily on 64bit
<CosmicPizza> it ' s a very goog like breezy' s like
<CosmicPizza> good
<CosmicPizza> ""
<Snoopy> Is there a command to enter into the terminal or a package to install to move to the 64-bit Ubuntu when using a 32-bit ubuntu?
<tonyyarusso> Snoopy: No.  You have to re-install the OS.  (Although if you're partitioned off /home you can keep your data)
<Snoopy> What are some of the benefits of the 64-bit software anyways?
<h00k> I just found out this works even if you have your /home encrypted from the "Log in and automatically decrypt" option set on install
<h00k> the reinstall of 64, I mean
<h00k> I used the same username and password, and there were no problems having it automatically decrypt
<h00k> Snoopy: it's the wave of the future!
<h00k> Snoopy: also, faster
<Snoopy> How can someone play an .asf video and hear the audio in Ubuntu?
<_diablo> h00k, Snoopy Ah! I found it :) http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2009/12/ubuntu-64bit-really-is-faster-than.html
<_diablo> for some things it doesn't matter at all, but for some, like apache, it increases by something like 20 times
<h00k> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=ubuntu_32_pae&num=1
<h00k> yeah, I had this tab up
<_diablo> also, is anyone using burg to boot?
<_diablo> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2010/01/make-grub-themes-beautiful-look-nicer.html
<_diablo> because it looks gorgeous
<_diablo> if I dualbooted on an ubuntu machine I'd try it
<Snoopy> I no longer dualboot :)
<_diablo> same
<Snoopy> I had Winxp and Ubuntu and neede to dualboot... Then win7 and Ubuntu and had to dualboot not, I only have Ubuntu and any needs of the windows os I go to virtualbox
<_diablo> yeah, idk, I did that for a while, but now I've even deleted my virtualbox. I only needed it for one program and I eventually told the people that were making me use it to eff off.
<_diablo> this code of conduct is cramping my chat conversations...
<_diablo> and conventions
<Snoopy> what code?
<h00k> heh, we got the point and you didn't even have to break the code of conduct!
<_diablo> sigh, after hanging out on the #linuxoutlaws chat, it's hard to filter myself :)
<_diablo> Snoopy, http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct
<_diablo> actually, nowhere in there or in the mailing lists etiquette does it prohibit language that some may consider de-clase
<_diablo> s/de-clase/dÃ©classÃ©
<Snoopy> in 3 mins, I will have 10.04 lucid lynx on my system
<Snoopy> I have lucid on here now!
<Snoopy> so cool
<Snoopy> but it is more like karmic
<h00k> right now, yeah.
<Snoopy> I like Jaunty more than Karmic for some reason
<Snoopy> maybe because I tested Karmic and Jaunty had way few bugs
<Snoopy> I cannot wait till Ubuntu Lucid Lynx !0.04 Alpha 4!
<Snoopy> less bugs hopefully :)
#ubuntu-us-mn 2010-01-06
<tonyyarusso> !logs | sparklehistory
<ubot3`> sparklehistory: Official channel logs can be found at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ - For LoCo channels, http://logs.ubuntu-eu.org/freenode/
<sparklehistory> tonyyarusso, thanks!
 * Takyoji annoys _diablo. "In which way were they forcing you to use it?" (as in, the reason, etc)
<_diablo> Takyoji, the defaults
<_diablo> they are set to a certain icon set.
<_diablo> I assume you're referring to gnome icon set in ubuntu?
<_diablo> let me clarify again that I don't hate ubuntu and I run it on a machine. I also recommend it a lot.
<Takyoji> You already implied such yesterday. :P
<Takyoji> I was curious of what application you were being forced to use
<_diablo> maybe forced was a strong word for me to use.
<_diablo> but the defaults are set to things and are more than annoying to change
<_diablo> It just seems to be much easier and better for the linux community as a whole to adjust the upstream
<_diablo> also, to leave all options available
<_diablo> I was most discouraged by the ubuntu/empathy team (it may have been them and not y'all) when they prevented options such as choosing notifications
<_diablo> purely for uniform aesthetics. If I would like something different, I want it customized. and there's no reason to prevent it, other than a distro/app thinking it knows better than I do.
<Takyoji> Oversimplifying everything to make it "easier" for the general public?
<_diablo> so I use pidgin :)
<_diablo> Takyoji, I have no problem with very simple defaults and even simple preferences. but give me a gconf-editor way to change it or an advanced tab or something
<_diablo> don't make it impossible without effing around with source code
<_diablo> because that annoys me a lot. There's just no reason
<Takyoji> yea
<_diablo> there's no way my grandfather will "accidentally" install gconf-editor and tweak his notification time and break his system
<_diablo> and if there is, then he deserves it :)
<_diablo> I just like choice.
<_diablo> it's why I run linux
<_diablo> I hate being locked into something because someone else likes it
<_diablo> but my Ayn Rand is showing, so I'll stop my rant :)
<Takyoji> :P
<_diablo> Takyoji, are you an ubuntu dev?
<Takyoji> In terms of developing for Ubuntu, or developing on Ubuntu?
<tonyyarusso> Or being a member of ~ubuntu-dev, more properly
<Takyoji> Gah, I hate when vendors lack care for support of hardware on Linux
<Takyoji> Despite the numerous ways they could have it created.
<tonyyarusso> That's what the nukes are for.
<Takyoji> Apparently I just received a call of someone trying to install drivers for an Alltel wireless card
<Takyoji> on a Dell Mini 10v Ubuntu netbook
<Takyoji> Apparently it works as an analog modem, thus supposedly would work
<Takyoji> http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/mandriva-30/has-anyone-installed-verizon-um150-usb-internet-access-in-mandriva-08-657010/
<Takyoji> What would be the reason for #7?
<Takyoji> First off, is anyone reading the channel at all?
<_diablo> Takyoji, sorry, it doesn't ping unless by name, I meant, are you a member of the ubuntu development team
<Takyoji> Not at all
<_diablo> ah, okay, interesting
<Takyoji> If it's honestly this dead for responses, I'm not entirely sure how swell it'll be for others trying to receive help
<Takyoji> considering I don't think any new users would call everyone right by name if they needed help
<Takyoji> So nobody else has even poked a stick at dialup-related things here?
<Takyoji> Anyone know how to at least say "No"? :P
<_diablo> no.
<_diablo> :)
<_diablo> sorry
<_diablo> I check back every few minutes :/ I know though
<_diablo> it would be very frusturating
<_diablo> maybe we can have a list of people that want to answer questions at the end of the message at start of chat?
<_diablo> also, does it really need to be as long as it is?
<Takyoji> Gah, it kills me when I can't fully resolve a person's issue
<_diablo> seems like a link to one site might be enough
<Takyoji> Yea; that's all that would be necessary. :P
<_diablo> still that mailing list Takyoji?
<Takyoji> Hmm?
<_diablo> can't resolve an issue on the mailing list?
<Takyoji> Actually, we need to make our own special devices with a Linux-based firmware, controlled by a sophisticated custom network protocol, to control the shock of a cattle prod to shock anyone in this channel with if they're not responding.
<_diablo> hahaha, I might disconnect that, we need to solder it to the motherboard too
<Takyoji> Something similar to: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Q_EPUXlyME
<Takyoji> I think I'm probably not going to be able to sleep at night knowing there's another person unsupported..
<_diablo> hahaha, that is hillarious. good share
<Takyoji> There's always a handful of things that can function, but typically through fixing or setting up in an obscure way. It would be convenient if there was a simple Bash script repository or something of things to fix issues, without having to deal with the command line at all.
<Takyoji> There also should be some basic wizard apps for simple tasks like getting pictures from a camera, or scanning an image.
<Takyoji> For anyone who wants to scan an image, you get to scare them away with the mess of a UI of xsane.
<Takyoji> and thus it bothers me that such things haven't even been developed yet (or at least very well)
<_diablo> it's true..
<_diablo> xsane is awful, but there's not much of a userbase either.
<_diablo> L/
<_diablo> :/
<Takyoji> I have a feeling doing such wouldn't even be all that hard for a new Python developer either to make
<_diablo> nope.
<Takyoji> Almost anyone could make a simple wizard for copying files from one location to another..
<Takyoji> And as a photographer, F-Spot isn't all that helpful (or at least for the way I work)
<_diablo> no.
<_diablo> have you tried digikam?
<_diablo> it's nicer
<Takyoji> It obviously doesn't have support for Nikon RAW and other commercial-level formats. (But there are tools available, like Rawstudio)
<_diablo> imho
<_diablo> the GIMP does that doesn't it?
<Takyoji> For Nikon RAW it doesn't last I remember
<Takyoji> *.nef is the file format
<Takyoji> Another gripe I have is that for my SD card interface, it only mounts as read-only (even though the switch for being write-protected isn't enabled or anything)
<_diablo> ah
<_diablo> you mean by HAL?
<_diablo> or even if you manually do so
<_diablo> because you can change that in your fstab
<Takyoji> And I used the "Safely remove hardware" option for unmounting an SD card last time, and has just completely turned it off entirely
<Takyoji> I've tried manually with the mount command as well
<Takyoji> Last time I mentioned it in this channel, someone implied it was something with the driver for SD card readers.
<_diablo> ... that doesn't sound right
<_diablo> I have a 16 gig sd card that I use _all_ the time
<_diablo> what is the make of your card?
<Takyoji> SanDisk
<_diablo> hmmm, I can't say definitively, but my memorex and sony work great
<Takyoji> 2GB and 256MB
<_diablo> I seem to remember using sandisk effectively as well
<Takyoji> I can read, but can't delete or anything
<_diablo> yeah, I've used 2G, 16G, and 512M fine
<_diablo> do you know how to manually umount and mount things?
<_diablo> you should try that
<_diablo> you'll have to do it entirely from a CLI
<Takyoji> That's what I tried
<_diablo> hmmm
<Takyoji> and I've edited /etc/fstab
<_diablo> (sorry if I sounded patronizing, you probably know more than me, just trying to help)
<_diablo> really? and the switch is the right way, so that's not the problem.
<Takyoji> It's fine, the point is you're trying to help
<_diablo> have you tried it on other computers?
<_diablo> i.e. do you know it's the card and not your comp?
<Takyoji> Tried it on my other Ubuntu desktop and the same problem persists
<Takyoji> But before 9.10 was installed on the other system, it worked just fine in terms of r/w
<_diablo> hmmm. I would try it on another distro to make sure. Have you posted on mailing lists for sandisk?
<_diablo> whoa. okay
<_diablo> so it's either the new kernel or more likely something weird with ubuntu
<_diablo> because the new kernel tends not to break things and is pretty back-compatible
<Takyoji> regardless, my SD card interface is completely powered off (thus nothing will show in /dev/ for example if I try to simply put in an SD card; thus I shall do the typical ignorant-Windows-user-style-fix-the-problem method by rebooting my system. :P
<_diablo> have you tried posting on #ubuntu?
<_diablo> hahaha
<_diablo> yeah, good luck
<_diablo> sorry, my limited expertise is exhausted
<Takyoji> Reason for the word "ignorant" is moreso in the implication of "just reboot it, it'll just make it work somehow" in the lines of taking no interest of fixing the source issue. :P
<Takyoji> Anyway, returning in a minute
<Takyoji> Obviously back now
<Takyoji> Here's an example of a Nikon RAW file: http://aquaeden.com/DSC_6215.NEF
<Takyoji> Note: apparently Firefox tried opening it in evince, however evince apparently only shows the thumbnail of the image rather than the full image itself
<_diablo> hmmm
<_diablo> odd
<_diablo> yeah, no clue on that one
<Takyoji> Aside from my point; the implication is that F-Spot supposedly doesn't recognize it at all
<Takyoji> digiKam can read it
<Takyoji> Well apparently F-Spot can as well; they must have added it recently or something
<Takyoji> GIMP apparently can't though
<Takyoji> Opens just a thumbnail of it
<Takyoji> So evince and GIMP can't properly open Nikon Raw files (NEF; Nikon Enhanced Format), which F-Spot and digiKam can
<Takyoji> Apparently the number of users in #ubuntu is 1337. :P
<_diablo> hahaha
<_diablo> that's pretty awesome
<Takyoji> So I take it that you all are working together to secretly plan something for my birthday which happens to be in 2 days? Perhaps a surprise party with some Ubuntu devs invited? :P
<_diablo> nah, it's not a secret, shuttleworth's plane ticket just got purchased
<Takyoji> 18th birthday in fact.
<Takyoji> So then I can finally be applicable to contract law, and sign a few non-disclosure forms! :P
<_diablo> congrats!
<_diablo> sigh. that is not appropriate free software talk
<Takyoji> It's not for any software development firms or anything. :P
<Takyoji> One is in regards of a movie
<_diablo> that doesn't change anything...
<_diablo> still free society. :)
<Takyoji> So I should be freely able to disclose credentials to the DBs and so forth? :P
<Takyoji> credentials of a database/SSH account/etc
<_diablo> sigh. this is not the place for that argument, but I'll say yeah.
<_diablo> </end argument>
<_diablo> :)
<Takyoji> If only deviantART allowed you to choose "No Attribution" for submissions in regards of the Creative Commons license
<Takyoji> For a handful of stuff, I usually allow derivatives and commercial work of it
<Takyoji> http://takyoji.deviantart.com/gallery/
<Takyoji> Bah, watermarks; must remove at some point..
<Takyoji> That was before I was aware of Creative Commons
<_diablo> Takyoji: have you tried blender?
<Takyoji> It would be nice if there was an option for Creative Commons Zero as well
<Takyoji> I'm completely jumping ship to Blender.
<Takyoji> I just haven't done much with it recently at all
<_diablo> good. It's pretty :)
<_diablo> but i gtg. west wing on full screen is too good :)
<Takyoji> heh
 * zomGreg likes takyoji's wallpapers. Did you make those?
<Takyoji> I've made all of that
<zomGreg> very nicely done
<Takyoji> However it's fairly old work
<Takyoji> I haven't added anything for like a year or so
<tonyyarusso> Takyoji: I poked a stick at dialup.  In 2005.  The only answer I have is "Ask the linmodems.org mailing list."
<tonyyarusso> Takyoji: I also had some weird issues with SD cards in 9.10 that I've never seen before.  It appears to be a kernel bug of some sort, but I'm not sure quite what.  I haven't seen them since I started using 2.6.32, but I also haven't done some of the things I had before since installing that, so I'm not sure.
<tonyyarusso> Takyoji: GIMP can handle RAW files *if* you install an extra package for it.
<_diablo> fwiw, I just tried my 16g sd card on 9.10 32 bit and it worked beautifully
<tonyyarusso> !info gimp-dcraw
<tonyyarusso> !info gimp-ufraw
<ubot3`> gimp-dcraw: GIMP plug-in for loading RAW digital photos. In component universe, is optional. Version 1.31-1.1 (karmic), package size 9 kB, installed size 80 kB
<ubot3`> gimp-ufraw: gimp importer for raw camera images. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.15-2ubuntu1 (karmic), package size 307 kB, installed size 892 kB
<tonyyarusso> !info mrwtoppm-gimp
<ubot3`> mrwtoppm-gimp: GIMP-plugin to support Minolta DiMAGE 5/7/7i RAW images. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.1.1-2.2 (karmic), package size 107 kB, installed size 280 kB
<Takyoji> So apparently I was filling out a simple form today for something in regards of school and so forth, and apparently noticed at the end there was a copyright notice implying that any form of reproduction of the sheet is unauthorized and will be penalized; and also implies a bounty of $100 for anyone that finds a person trying to copy the form.
<Takyoji> Also in the extent of implying that the print is in beige, and if it's not, it's stolen, etc.
<Takyoji> and it's just for a typical ordinary form; nothing substantial significant or notable about it..
<Takyoji> Also for art class, the teacher has an assignment where students can choose an artist and write a short paper on them, and also recreate one of their famous works. Apparently any work by Edvard Munch is still withheld by copyright and isn't in the public domain at all.
<Takyoji> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Scream
<Takyoji> Made in 1893, but still held under copyright
<Takyoji> It'll be finally in the public domain by 2015
#ubuntu-us-mn 2010-01-07
<_diablo> that is ridiculous
<_diablo> copyright law annoys me so much
 * Takyoji copyrights diablo
 * Takyoji spraypaints Mickey Mouse on a wall, and runs off chased by lawyers of Warner Chappell
<jenkinbr> lol
 * jenkinbr eats RIAA
<Takyoji> Any thoughts on the Nexus One?
<_diablo> it's sexy as hell
<Takyoji> I wonder if Windows Mobile will continue to supposedly decline. :P
<_diablo> I would guess so
<_diablo> it's awful
<_diablo> they have to rewrite it
<Takyoji> hah http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/12/yahoo-spy-prices
<Takyoji> Gotta love how companies try to sue in the consideration of being a "DMCA violation" of something leaked.
<_diablo> haha, yeeeeah
<__diablo> anyone here using lucid yet?
<Takyoji> I think I downloaded the ISO a while ago of Alpha 1 to poke at in a VM, but haven't done much since with it
<_diablo> Takyoji: you don't know off hand if it's still alpha-1, do you?
<Takyoji> I think it's still Alpha 1
<_diablo> because I seem to recall Snoopy saying he was excited for 10.04a4
<Takyoji> I can check infact
<_diablo> okay, that was a weird comment
<_diablo> yeah, it's on my calendar
<_diablo> lucid A2 was scheduled for jan 14
<_diablo> is there a torrent location for the alpha? I found the direct, but I like sharing ;)
<Takyoji> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/lucid/
<_diablo> Takyoji: beautiful. thanks a bunch!
<Takyoji> #ubuntu is a blackhole; it just sucks me in and doesn't let me out..
<Takyoji> Because I'm too compelled to help others
<_diablo> I understand :) I do that on fedora sometimes
<_diablo> luckily I'm ignorant enough to not be much help to anyone
<_diablo> so I just word vomit all over it
<Takyoji> otherwise apparently nobody had a response for my question about the lack of write-ability for SD cards. :P
<Takyoji> Shall I harass the mailing list about it to see if anyone has an idea?
<Takyoji> (the Minnesota mailing list)
<_diablo> I would
<_diablo> People there are very good with very technical stuff. Put as much info in the first email as possible
<JChristensen> Hi I'm new
<mr_steve> JChristensen: hi!
<JChristensen> I was looking at starting a LoCo team but i see it has already been done
<mr_steve> Yep, that's how I found this team, I was doing some research on starting a local group and found someone had already done it
<JChristensen> have you gone to any events?
<mr_steve> No, not yet. There was an installfest a while ago, but other than that we haven't had many in-person type events
<mr_steve> But I and perhaps _diablo will be trying to do fairly regular "Ubuntu Hour" events at coffeeshops in Minneapolis at least
<JChristensen> Oh ok, I started a consulting firm last august and i'm looking to get do some community events to get the word out about free software
<JChristensen> its amazing how many people i've talked to have never even herd of linux ubuntu etc.
<mr_steve> Yeah, that's the idea behind the Ubuntu Hour, to just sort of sit at a coffeeshop with a bunch of Ubuntu stuff on the table and engage people in conversation
<mr_steve> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Hour
<mr_steve> You might want to check out these guys too, they actually have regular in-person meetings: http://www.penguinsunbound.org/
<JChristensen> ok thank you
<JChristensen> you ever think about doing a community ed class?
<mr_steve> Personally I haven't, I don't know if the idea's been kicked around here before or not
<mr_steve> tonyyarusso would probably know, but he seems to be away at the moment
<JChristensen> i've been working on that idea for a while
<mr_steve> Oh, before I forget, I should mention that we are now trying to have regular IRC meetings in this channel, on the first monday of every month at 7PM CST
<mr_steve> Anyone is basically welcome to contribute topics for the agenda
<JChristensen> i'll have to put that on my agenda
<mr_steve> Yeah, it's not always that active in here, but most of us try to participate in the meetings. It's usually more active in the evenings, too.
<tonyyarusso> JChristensen: I'm not aware of any type of community ed class effort yet, no.
<mr_steve> ah there he is, hey :)
<JChristensen> what do you think of the idea?
<tonyyarusso> Could be interesting - do you have more details of what you have in mind?
<JChristensen> would have to come up with a curriculum, start out with an introduction into free software, offer liveCD's, get into openoffice a little...
<JChristensen> maybe do an install
<Takyoji> Oh come on, nobody Slashdotted news of my birthday; geez! :P
<Snoopy> So the 64-bit Ubuntu is supposed to be faster but it had too many bugs to tell
<Snoopy> I so then I installed the 32-bit 9.04
<_diablo> mr_steve: you and definitely _diablo :)
<_diablo> Snoopy: hi
<_diablo> 64 will be faster. did you say that 64 10.04 had bugs? I mean, it's an alpha
<_diablo> 64 bit 9.04 will be as stable as 32 bit 9.04
<_diablo> although, may I ask why you're not using 9.10?
<_diablo> it's stable as well
<Snoopy> 9.10 has less stuff
<Snoopy> like the screensavers
<_diablo> Snoopy: like what?
<_diablo> you can install those you know...
<Snoopy> I did not know that
<_diablo> but about the shirt: we don't know that information yet. tonyyarusso is the one in charge I believe, but we don't have a critical mass yet. We're going to wait a few days. We should know by next monday or tuesday
<Snoopy> 10.04 is so unstable, the restart after the upgrade was bad... I had trouble getting to the log in page
<_diablo> we want to give people at least a week to respond
<_diablo> Snoopy: yeah, that's what happens with an alpha1 release. it won't be partially stable until a release candidate
<_diablo> even the beta won't be stable
<_diablo> stick with 9.10 unless you're looking for pain like me ;)
<Snoopy> You have 10.04?
<_diablo> Snoopy: in a virtual box
<Snoopy> _diablo: How is the virtual box working for you then?
<_diablo> well, I have only installed it and haven't played with it yet
<Snoopy> ok
<_diablo> but I ran 10.04 for a week or two before the alpha came out
<Snoopy> how?
<h00k> daily builds!
<Snoopy> oh
<Snoopy> I still do not know much about Ubuntu
<Snoopy> But I am trying to not have to rely on windows
<Snoopy> I am having trouble playing videos that need the windows speech decoder
<_diablo> h00k: also, 9.10 using lucid repos :)
<h00k> or this,sure
<_diablo> Snoopy: honestly, if you're looking to move from windows, it will be much easier to just use a stable release. set up a virtual box to test experimental stuff
<_diablo> also, make a lot of backups :)
<Snoopy> how can I make backups to a usb hard drive?
<_diablo> Snoopy: do you mean automatically, or manually?
<_diablo> also, what do you want backed up?
<Snoopy> I want everything backed up and it would be nice to have it automatic. I would like to boot off of the backup
<_diablo> define everything. your entire operating system?
<_diablo> i mean, you can copy your entire filesystem... but you might as well just install your OS to a portable drive like an sd card
<Snoopy> Everything on my hard drive
<Snoopy> what would the easiest way be to have everything on an external hard drive and be able to boot up from the hard drive on a mac?
<_diablo> oof. I don't have much experience with Macs but from what I know, they are hard to configure
<_diablo> and don't interface well with PCs. I am not the right person to ask though.
<_diablo> ummm, I would ask on the #ubuntu channel. Or ask again when someone else is on here
<Snoopy> they can't be that much different because of the intel processor
<_diablo> sorry I couldn't help with that
<_diablo> ahhhh, how wrong that is.
<_diablo> they have weird MBR settings on their hard drives.
<_diablo> and I'm not sure their BIOS allow external boot devices without serious hacking
<_diablo> the CPU isn't the issue, it's the peripherals.
<_diablo> but I gtg, dinner. sorry I couldn't help.
<Snoopy> bye
#ubuntu-us-mn 2010-01-08
<_diablo> anyone wanna come test an IRC game in #linuxoutlaws?
<kermit> i thought this was a game, maybe that's why i never win.
<_diablo> kermit: lol
<_diablo> you're only 4 points behind the leader right now
<Takyoji> So for my extrodinary birthday I received: a new chair, 4 rechargeable batteries, some jelly beans, and corkboard. :P
<_diablo> grats
<_diablo> a new chair sounds nice
<Takyoji> Ooo, Linux Journal
<Takyoji> Would anyone know of a way to setup something for testing dial-up capability, but without using an actual phone line connection?
<Takyoji> because I have not yet made a dial-up connection function on Linux yet
<Takyoji> for other people
<Takyoji> What would be some examples of where using Creative Commons licensing would be beneficial to a business (that made said material)?
 * tonyyarusso is playing with irssi-proxy
<_diablo> fun!
<_diablo> lol @ your old name
<tonyyarusso> :P
#ubuntu-us-mn 2010-01-10
<Takyoji> Anyone made GUIs through Glade at all?
<Takyoji> or generally done anything with GTK
<tonyyarusso> nope
#ubuntu-us-mn 2011-01-03
<ripps> I'm glad everyone is excited about me making a wingpanel package, but it's still in an early revision, I don't have the licesning info properly done. I'm still waiting to hear back from the wingpanel devs about it and I hope to make an official daily PPA for them.
<Takyoji> Woo, 4 months until http://www.weebls-stuff.com/songs/Narwhals/
<ColinHarrington> woot
<ColinHarrington> Thats awesome
#ubuntu-us-mn 2011-01-04
<Takyoji> Anyone know of a "bitbucket" (best way I can describe it) mailserver?
<Takyoji> Then again, I guess I could just have a mail server VM for dumping test email to
<Guest47241> ok newbee with a question... I have Ubuntu 10.10 on a bootable thumb drive. I am trying to install on a desktop that connects to the internet using a usb wireless adapter. When I boot from the thumb drive I can get the wireless to work by installing the "windows wireless drivers" from the software center. The problem is when I install Ubuntu to the hard drive.  Ubuntu does not include the drivers in its default install.  I know t
<Guest47241> hat they are on the thumb drive because I can install and use them  when booted to the thumb drive. How do I find the drivers on the thumb drive and install them?
<tonyyarusso> Guest47241: If they're still cached, they'll be in /var/cache/apt/archives/
<tonyyarusso> well, hrm, and somewhere else actually.
<tonyyarusso> Guest47241: You're looking for ndiswrapper-common and ndiswrapper-utils-{someversion}
<tonyyarusso> or leaving, that works too
<h00k> tonyyarusso: If I were to be the latest deb for tuxdroid, how would I ask you to send me to h00k
<tonyyarusso> I'll have to RDP into work - gimme a minute; I'm actually being slightly productive atm.
<h00k> tonyyarusso: no problem
#ubuntu-us-mn 2011-01-06
<h00k> tonyyarusso: are you around?
<tonyyarusso> h00k: am now
<h00k> tonyyarusso: cools. Mebbe I can beg you for that newer deb...
<tonyyarusso> Coming right up
<tonyyarusso> The version is 3.1.3 btw
<h00k> Yay! Did they go bankrupt?
<tonyyarusso> yeah
<h00k> bah.
<tonyyarusso> h00k: how's DCC suit you?
<h00k> tonyyarusso: that'll work, DCC, Dropbox,whatev
<h00k> tonyyarusso: I love you.
<tonyyarusso> :)
<h00k> tonyyarusso: you don't happen to have the x86_64 packages, do you?
<h00k> tonyyarusso: http://ftp.tuxdroid-community.net/tuxbox/ !
<tonyyarusso> I don't think 64-bit exists?
<h00k> :/
<tonyyarusso> oh hey
<tonyyarusso> nice find
<h00k> it does in French!
<tonyyarusso> um, http://ftp.tuxdroid-community.net/tuxbox/tuxbox-USEnglish-TTS-3.1.4-amd64.tar.gz h00k
<h00k> Yep, I see that
<h00k> trying it
<h00k> downloadin'
<h00k> tonyyarusso: I'm disappointed the whole thing seems to have died
<h00k> tonyyarusso: gmail authentication is broken, twitter authentication is broken,
<tonyyarusso> Twitter doesn't surprise me - OAuth.
<h00k> Yeah...
<tonyyarusso> GMail is a little odd.
<h00k> I can't get it to authenticate
<h00k> I've considered just writing my own python things for it
<h00k> I mean, I already have
<h00k> but a gmail watcher or twitter watcher, things like that
<h00k> severe weather,
<tonyyarusso> You could use my severe weather nagios plugin
<h00k> I could
<tonyyarusso> We want to figure out how to make it react to nagios alerts at work anyway
<h00k> that's pretty sweet.
<h00k> It can't be too hard, just...somehow watch for an alert, call a python script
<tonyyarusso> yeah
<samurai> hello
<tonyyarusso> You say hello, and I say goodbye...
<sparklehistory> tonyyarusso: Are you going to sing for us now?
<Takyoji> This is actually a rather interesting and simple idea for once: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2011/01/force-quit-with-style-yo/
<tonyyarusso> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2011/01/meet-the-transformer-of-computers-the-smartbook-tablet-mid-netbook/
<Takyoji> oh hay, I has an idea; we need to make some Linux/Ubuntu nerdcore. :P
#ubuntu-us-mn 2011-01-07
<tonyyarusso> Takyoji haz a birfday
<Takyoji> Ye even spelled it like I have been.
<Takyoji> I can has $10,000 Linux cluster?
<tonyyarusso> You can haz a picture of one - http://www.ks.uiuc.edu/Development/Computers/Images/ariel-full.jpg
<tonyyarusso> That's actually a lot more than $10,000 probably.
<Takyoji> Sun SPARC station? :P
<tonyyarusso> I think those are amd64 systems actually.
 * tonyyarusso looks
<Takyoji> ahh
<tonyyarusso> "Our fourth Linux cluster, collectively known as Ariel, consists of 72 dual-processor Xeon systems divided into three 24-node clusters."
<tonyyarusso> $183,058.68
<Takyoji> Yea, $10,000 probably wouldn't even be the price of a single node. :P
<tonyyarusso> actually it would
<tonyyarusso> SunFire V60x:  Unit cost $1,997.50
<tonyyarusso> $10,000 buys a LOT of horsepower.
<Takyoji> Didn't Broadcom release the source code of their drivers like half a year ago?
<Takyoji> In September apparently
<Takyoji> http://linux.slashdot.org/story/10/09/09/1925214/Broadcom-Releases-Source-Code-For-Drivers
<tonyyarusso> yeah
<Takyoji> and I wonder why Ubuntu still only has the NDISWrapper drivers yet
<tonyyarusso> FeatureFreeze
<tonyyarusso> also, upstream kernel
<Takyoji> Anything hopefully in 11.04?
<Takyoji> also that one friend is having USB issues again
<Takyoji> As I've said on #ubuntu-bugs:
<Takyoji> (12:29:54 AM) Takyoji: Friend has laptop with XP and Ubuntu 10.10; USB worked fine on both in the past. But recently (within the past few months) stops working in Ubuntu after booting XP. The only way to make it work again, was apparently booting an older version of Linux, which just magically worked, and which made it work under the most recent kernel as well again. Would this be a bug worth reporting; and/or any method of p
<Takyoji> (12:35:27 AM) Takyoji: http://paste.ubuntu.com/551398/
<Takyoji> I would have to agree something like Wayland would be needed.
<Takyoji> The lack of hotpluggability of some things in X11 is annoying
<Takyoji> Such as for a keyboard;
<Takyoji> Can't just reconnect; you have to fully reboot
<Takyoji> (or restart X)
<Takyoji> in my case
<ColinHarrington> Yea, I agree that its needed.
<Takyoji> Friend just got a Wacom tabley
<Takyoji> tablet*
<Takyoji> and due to the nature of X11, it's not hotpluggable.
<ColinHarrington> Take the NotifyOSD for example.  Its really nice that they built this in, but it needs more options.  Other notifiers before it had some better options.
<ColinHarrington> That sucks.
<Takyoji> As workaround, you can jump between virtual terminals to make it work
<Takyoji> in other words, Ctrl+Alt+F1, Ctrl+Alt+F7
<ColinHarrington> yea
<Takyoji> but at the same time, I just realized that USB devices won't work for them.
<Takyoji> Because for some reason their USB bus doesn't fully initialize a USB device due to an issue, which arises when XP is booted prior
<Takyoji> and they also have a broken package manager right now as well. xP
<Takyoji> and the only way to fix it is via terminal
<Takyoji> Just found this: http://ten.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minneapolis-St.Paul
<rlaager> Takyoji: It looks like the Broadcom code might have been merged in 2.6.37 (unless that was some other Broadcom support), so it should show up in Natty.
<ColinHarrington> I hope so.
<ColinHarrington> Is it stable yet?
<ColinHarrington> I used it for a while (a while ago) and it caused lockups, so I ditched next time I updated my Kernel
<ColinHarrington> It worked well (minus the lockups)
<Takyoji> and I think my GRUB menu hasn't been updated at all
<Takyoji> since it never grows
<Takyoji> and I'm apparently running 2.6.35-19
<Takyoji> while a friend is apparently running 2.6.35-24
#ubuntu-us-mn 2011-01-09
<fisch246> no way! it does exist!
<fisch246> Minnesota <3
<tonyyarusso> it does indeed
#ubuntu-us-mn 2012-01-02
<Manito> Good morning
<MachintoshCJ> Anyone online?
#ubuntu-us-mn 2012-01-08
<Takyoji> Grah, why oh why did Canonical drop GNOME 2 in favor of Unity; now the distro is pretty much a joke in an enterprise sense. Right now there's something in the Faribault news of a 'technology committee' of working on city-wide updates on a budget.
<Takyoji> I'd recommend Ubuntu, but Unity would be a joke, I'd recommend Debian but that by itself doesn't have commercial support, I'd recommend Linux Mint especially but it lacks commercial support and some redistribution legalities, I'd recommend Fedora, but I've had a poor experience with the quality of their packaging, etc
#ubuntu-us-mn 2013-01-03
<Walter19> is this channel alive?
<Walter19> looking for some help setting up a home network
<Walter19> annd a linux server
#ubuntu-us-mn 2018-01-07
<Takyoji> Well, that's shocking that this room still exists. Was trying to edit my name out of the Ubuntu Wiki, but apparently all the pages are "immutable"
<Takyoji> and it's been a handful of years now, that this has been itching me
