#ubuntu-discuss 2012-12-17
<dingoateyourbaby> yeah there's nobody here
#ubuntu-discuss 2012-12-19
<JBzh> Hi
<jussi> o/
#ubuntu-discuss 2012-12-22
<Captain_Crow> will ubuntu ever be good/mainstream for gaming?
<IdleOne> they're working on it
<Captain_Crow> like a few years from now could ubuntu become comepatible with mainstream software and games?
<Captain_Crow> compatible*
<IdleOne> if what you are asking is, will software written for Windows ever be 100% compatible on linux? Only if the software devs write linux versions.
<Captain_Crow> well doesnt have to be 100%, but just running the stuff i bought w/o something crashing or the screen going nuts and flickering would be a nice start :P
<IdleOne> I understand what you're saying, it still boils down to software developers need to make the software for linux for it to work on linux.
<Captain_Crow> i havent used ubuntu in a while cause i had a bad experience with it, but if it ran stuff i actually use i wouldnt mind using ubuntu
<IdleOne> if you buy something that wasn't designed to be used on linux, you can't really blame linux now can you?
<Captain_Crow> i heared that linux is not 100% immune to viruses, is there some type of antivirus for it?
<IdleOne> there is, but most viruses are not written to attack linux.
<IdleOne> someone who wants to cause damage goes for the biggest target
<Captain_Crow> does ubuntu have a antivirus software built in?
<IdleOne> you can install clamav
<Captain_Crow> does ubuntu have firewalls or anything like that?
<IdleOne> !ufw
<ubot5> Ubuntu, like any other Linux distribution, has firewall capabilities built-in. The firewall is managed using the 'ufw' command - see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UFW | An alternative to ufw is the 'iptables' command - See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/IptablesHowTo | GUI frontends such as Gufw (GNOME) and Guarddog (KDE from Lucid onwards) also exist.
<Captain_Crow> so ubuntu is safe to use?
<chu> Yep, Ubuntu is fine "out of the box".
<IdleOne> been using it for 5 years as my main OS without problem
<Captain_Crow> how does it work with blender and lmms?
<chu> No problems with blender here, though I haven't used it in a few years, and I was running it on slightly better hardware than what I have now. Not sure what lmms is though.
<Captain_Crow> its for music
<Captain_Crow> http://lmms.sourceforge.net/
<chu> I would imagine it'll be fine, but I can't give a definitive answer.
<IdleOne> lmms is in the ubuntu software center, one click install
<chu> A classic instance of the old "TIAS", aka "Try it and see! (then tell us what you saw)"
<Captain_Crow> does ubuntu have any userfriendly crossplatform programming IDEs?
<chu> Depends on what you're looking for, really.
<chu> It also, to some extent, depends upon your interpretation of an IDE. Some people are fine with the "loose", other people are after the "stricter" definition.
<Captain_Crow> something similar to "mmf2" but for ubuntu, like something that i can use to make a game or simple software app and export to .exe, .swf, etc?
<Captain_Crow> is there anything like these http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clickteam#Products , that work in ubuntu or would those work in ubuntu?
<chu> I don't know what mmf2 is.
<chu> If you want to write a cross-platform application, choice of IDE is almost-irrelevant. It becomes a choice of the libraries you use.
<Captain_Crow> well, mmf2 is a program that uses a universal set of codes that i guess are converted when it exports, and it has a crossplatform exporter, but i dont think the mmf2 program itself will work in ubuntu, so im wondering what the closest alternative is to that for ubuntu
<IdleOne> !alternatives
<ubot5> To change the default applications system-wide, use 'sudo update-alternatives --all' in a terminal.
<IdleOne> hmm
<IdleOne> that is not the response I was expecting
<IdleOne> http://www.linuxalt.com/  There is somewhere you can start looking
<Captain_Crow> ok
<IdleOne> at a quick glance that list is a little dated but should still give you a decent idea of what is available
<IdleOne> here is another http://www.osalt.com/
<chu> I don't think you're looking for an IDE per se, apologies.
<Captain_Crow> idk, i had a friend that refered to it as an IDE, so i could have been misinformed
<Captain_Crow> btw, what is kubuntu? is there a difference?
<chu> I guess we just have different ideas of what an IDE is.
<chu> So, Ubuntu comes packaged, by default, with the Unity desktop environment - it's a shell on top of the GNOME 3 library. On the other hand, kubuntu comes packaged by default with the KDE environment.
<chu> It is *possible* to still install KDE on Ubuntu (and Unity on kubuntu)
<chu> As far as I am aware, the differences are entirely aesthetic, but perhaps someone who knows more about kubuntu could confirm/deny that.
<Captain_Crow> so kubuntu"out of the box" wont play dvds?
<chu> It will.
<Captain_Crow> but ubuntu doesnt?
<chu> They are functionally equivalent out of the box.
<Captain_Crow> i heard that windows8 isnt supporting dvd or bluray playback, so are dvds and bluray obsolete now or something?
<Captain_Crow> i mean cause of operating systems not playing them out of the box anymore
<Captain_Crow> what would happen if ubuntu were the only os?
<Captain_Crow> if everyone used ubuntu would that solve all the compatibility issues?
<chu> I'm not sure that question has meaning really. We could pose it as a thought-experiment, and I guess the answer is "yes" in that case, but it doesn't really give us anything.
<Captain_Crow> im just trying to understand the situation with linux and commercial pc products :P
<chu> I'd pose an analogous question something like "If Ford were the only care manufacturer, would everyone drive a Ford?"
<chu> s/care/car/
<Captain_Crow> what is linuxmint, is it different from ubuntu somehow?
<chu> It may have diverged more since I last cared to look, but as far as I am aware the difference is soley in the desktop environment.
<chu> (Same as the difference between ubuntu and kubuntu, or xubuntu, lubuntu, etc)
<Captain_Crow> is mint more popular than ubuntu?
<chu> I doubt it, though Mint users certainly like to have their opinion heard.
<Captain_Crow> when i typed linux into google, mint popped up before ubuntu
<chu> Yep, because Mint users like to get their opinions heard :)
<Captain_Crow> is mint more like windows or something?
<Captain_Crow> i noticed it had a start menu type of thing
<chu> They are functionally equivalent, just a different aesthetic look.
<chu> You can (easily) achieve the same thing in ubuntu.
<Captain_Crow> does ubuntu automatically install vlc or some other similar video playerback software, or does it have to be installed manually?
<Captain_Crow> playback*
<chu> I don't know what the name of the default video player is, but there is one there automatically.
<Captain_Crow> so basically if someone installed ubuntu and ran updates and stuff, they could pop in a dvd and play it?
<chu> Yes.
<Captain_Crow> but not blurays?
<chu> Not sure why they'd be any different.
<chu> Oh, it's a restricted format. I see.
<chu> You can't play blue rays, or hd dvds, without some effort.
<Captain_Crow> how do i burn ubuntu to a disk?
<Captain_Crow> i put in a disk, opened infrarecorder, and selected the iso file, a box came up, the ok button is greyed out
<Captain_Crow> how do i get a ".msi" file to run on linux?
<popey> Captain_Crow, that's a windows app
<Captain_Crow> i got it, i just forgot to install wine :P
#ubuntu-discuss 2012-12-23
<Captain_Crow> does ubuntu 12 have a option for traditional desktop environment?
<IdleOne> you can install gnome-panel which is similar to gnome2.
<IdleOne> or the "traditional desktop"
<Captain_Crow> which version of ubuntu"out of the box" can play dvd movies?
<IdleOne> Captain_Crow: out of the box they can't for legal reasons, you can install ubuntu-restricted-extras which will give you support for most all codecs.
<Captain_Crow> how is linuxmint able to do it legally, but not ubuntu?
<IdleOne> they don't.
<IdleOne> they ship with the packages installed and they don't worry about it.
<Captain_Crow> so ubuntu will never be able to play dvds out of the box?
<IdleOne> Not so long as it is free of charge.
<AlanBell> Captain_Crow: the ubuntu ISOs get burned as real CDs, I don't think Mint distribute like that
<popey> i wouldn't say "never"
<popey> if you buy a computer with a DVD drive and it ships with Ubuntu, then I'm pretty sure we pre-install that stuff
<popey> e.g. if you buy a dell you get something like PowerDVD installed
<chu> There is the opt-in choice at install (which is obviously necessary for the legal reasons mentioned by IdleOne), which is why I said earlier (i.e. yesterday) that it was possible to play DVDs "out of the box". But, technically it needs to download the package so it's not really "out of the box" per se.
<popey> the opt-in choice at install doesn't install dvd playback stuff though
<Captain_Crow> what if i have a decade old dell that was owned by several dozen people and dont have an os on it, would ubuntu be a good choice?
<popey> it adds codecs, java, flash, fonts
<chu> Ahh, I see.
<Captain_Crow> so to get a traditional desktop do i need to install gnome-panel, or is there any default options built in?
<popey> By default Ubuntu ships Unity
<popey> many other desktop options are available
<Captain_Crow> i like how it snaps windows to the sides and stuff, does that still work with the other desktops?
<chu> Is that a Compiz feature?
<AlanBell> Captain_Crow: that works with gnome-shell too
<AlanBell> Captain_Crow: I would suggest installing the standard unity desktop and adding gnome-shell if you want an alternative option that is going forward
<Captain_Crow> so i need to install the latest ubuntu, and install gnome-shell, and it'll look like a traditional desktop but with unity features?
<AlanBell> Captain_Crow: you will get a choice at the login screen whether you want to start a unity session or a gnome session
<AlanBell> I don't really know what a traditional desktop is
<AlanBell> if you have a tradition of using Windows, or Mac OS, or RiscOS or NeXtStep or OS/2 then it will look somewhat familiar because it uses a WIMP interface :)
<AlanBell> if what you want is a widget at the top left or bottom left for starting applications through a hierachical menu then you might like gnome-shell with https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/6/applications-menu/
<Captain_Crow> is there a difference between ubuntu 12.10 and 12.04lts?
<Captain_Crow> "Ubuntu 12.10 will be supported for two years and includes cutting-edge  new features that make your music, videos, documents and apps much  easier to access."
<Captain_Crow> does "videos" mean 12.10 plays dvds?
<chu> They all play DVDs.
<Captain_Crow> so between 12.10 and 12.04, which is the better choice?
<chu> Depends, do you want bleeding-edge or stability as your first choice? 12.04 is an LTS ("Long-Term Support") version while 12.10 is not. The decision is entirely up to you. Some people tend to use only LTS, others don't mind.
<chu> If it's for a server install, you'd obviously want the LTS, for the desktop it (probably) doesn't matter so much.
<AlanBell> I would go for 12.10 personally
<AlanBell> it isn't bleeding edge, it is a released stable version
<AlanBell> 13.04 would be the brave choice :)
<AlanBell> I think for new technologies like unity and gnome-shell you probably want the extra 6 months of newness
<chu> True, "bleeding-edge" wasn't the correct term, but I had nothing else to use :p
<chu> I think it would be wrong to call it a "testing" or "experimental" release, and other than just saying "one's LTS the other's not" not sure how to really characterise the differences.
<popey> i use 12.04 on my main laptop
<popey> will probably keep it for a while
<Captain_Crow> theres a 13.04?
<popey> in development yes
<AlanBell> Captain_Crow: raring ringtail, the version in development
<popey> not recommended for use yet
<chu> You can imagine that after 12.10 was released development, started on 13.04 and Canonical aren't going to hold it back from the community until deployment. Release won't be until April next year, so we've still got a little over 4 months.
 * AlanBell was installing it yesterday
 * AlanBell has a couple of bugs to file
<Captain_Crow> does ubuntu cost money now?
<popey> no
<popey> never will
<Captain_Crow> i clicked on "get ubuntu 12.04" its asking me to "pay with paypal"
<AlanBell> it is asking if you want to pay for it
<AlanBell> Bug #1093303
<ubot5> bug 1093303 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "can't switch from orca to ubiquity in the 13.04 install" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1093303
<Captain_Crow> is the ubuntu 12.04 the same ubuntu 12.04 as several months ago?
<AlanBell> it will have fixes for things in it
<AlanBell> so the way it works is every 6 months we put out a release, that might have a bunch of things in it like gedit 3.6.1 in it for example
<AlanBell> if there are any *fixes* to that version of that software then they get updated through the repositories
<AlanBell> if gedit 4 comes out with radical new *features* then that goes into the next release of Ubuntu
<AlanBell> for 12.04 we would continue providing fixes for 3.6.1 for the next 7 years
<AlanBell> so 12.04 now is more fixed than 12.04 was several months ago, but it is still 12.04 with the same versions of pretty much everything in it (except for a couple of things like web browsers)
<popey> 5 years, not 7
<AlanBell> ah yes, until 2017
<AlanBell> so if you want cool new stuff for one PC then use most recent stable version and upgrade every 6 months. If you have a fleet of 2000 desktops you are managing and you want them to perform consistently with each other and you don't have the time to upgrade every 6 months then it is LTS all the way for you.
<Captain_Crow> how long should ubuntu 12.04 take to boot from the disk?
<AlanBell> Captain_Crow: from the CD? probably about a minute. When installed it boots in less than 10 seconds on SSD and maybe a bit longer on spinning rust
<Captain_Crow> oh, i been trying to run it like 20 min at a time and cant even get to the main screen
<Captain_Crow> it just loads and loads and loads
<AlanBell> that isn't right ;)
<AlanBell> so what did you do so far? downloaded the iso image, put it on CD, got the bios to boot from CD?
<AlanBell> what did you see on screen? did you get as far as an Ubuntu logo and 5 dots?
<AlanBell> and a picture of a keyboard and the vitruvian man?
<Captain_Crow> i got to the load screen with 5 dots, im going to try another cd
<Captain_Crow> i think it was cause the other cd had a scratch on it
<Captain_Crow> i installed "gnome-shell" and went to the user thing and clicked "gnome (classic)" and i dont see any difference
<Captain_Crow> nvm, i guess it was a glitch
#ubuntu-discuss 2013-12-17
<flavienn> hello everybody!
#ubuntu-discuss 2014-12-21
<artiomjar> when you do the debootstrap with package exclusion parameter, the excluded package is still installed. sudo debootstrap --arch=amd64 --exclude=hostname --components=main,universe --variant=minbase --print-debs utopic .kubuntu ftp://mirror.as43289.net/ubuntu/ is this a bug?
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-12-14
<TJ-> the keyb layout differences always catch me out in a recovery situation where the live env defaults to US and I lose the pipe |
<daftykins> beside 1? Â¬ ? i don't even know :D
<nicomachus> ha, I don't even have that key
<TJ-> and the back-ticks ` get moved
<daftykins> makes for great sunglasses though, Â¬_Â¬
<nicomachus> I love that UK keyboard still has $
<nicomachus> the almight dollar rules all
<daftykins> maybe it's AUD :) or NZD!
<nicomachus> then it's be upside down, du
<nicomachus> duh
<nicomachus> it'd
<nicomachus> wow, putting down the whiskey
<daftykins> :D
<TJ-> we also have the â¬
<nicomachus> yea I have to google that and copy/paste to use it. I'm sure there's an ALT code but idk it
<TJ-> Alt-Gr+4 â¬
<OerHeks> Â¿?
<nicomachus> Constable daftykins on the case
<daftykins> anyone trying to put XP anywhere needs a stern talking to for sure
<daftykins> that's simply unethical
<TJ-> It's fine!
<nicomachus> it's an unintentional honeypot
<daftykins> nooooo
<daftykins> hmm apparently suggestions it's bed time are not enough to dissuade Mischief from trying to steal lap access
<daftykins> 'laptop' has to become 'lap-unless-cat-top'
<TJ-> how about my rack warmer right now? https://iam.tj/photos/19InchRackWarmer.jpg
<OerHeks> If it has a floppydrive, i drop it.
<daftykins> :D
<OerHeks> Is that the runaway?
<TJ-> No, this is Silver, the (usually) sensible one
<daftykins> right! it's sleep o'clock for me
<daftykins> catch you in the week folks :) o/
<OerHeks> :-)
<TJ-> I have to have special Husky filters in front of the 2 UPSs in the bottom of that cabinet, to stop it blocking up
<TJ-> night night
<nicomachus> TJ- I have a persian cat. she thinks my HTPC is her bed. 0_0
<TJ-> nicomachus: oh cripes!
<TJ-> bet that keeps her toastie
<nicomachus> unfortunately.
<nicomachus> TJ-: but it's a new thing to learn and I'm still getting caught up on everything else
<nicomachus> :(
<TJ-> nicomachus: welcome to the wonderful world of IT :D
<nicomachus> lol
<TJ-> I could spend 150% of my time on keeping up... and still not keep up with everything :D
<dotpixis> it's the speed of the internet, isn't it something like x petabites a day or something...
<dotpixis> (x is an interger)
<Tarminquay> "I like Windows 10, it is VERY, VERY light. I have been using Windows 10 for about 3 months and I can say that it is by far lighter than Linux Mint, It uses far less resources than Linux Mint."
<Tarminquay> "Even though Linux Mint is way more resource intense than Windows 10, it has a nice feel."
<Tarminquay> What do you make of this?
<nicomachus> it's completely, utterly false.
<SeriouslyLaugh> sounds anecotal
<Tarminquay> It's anecdotal. It's real-world experience.
<SeriouslyLaugh> there's an objective way to find out how much RAM is being used on each machine
<Tarminquay> It's not just about ram. It's about how an OS feels in actual use.
<SeriouslyLaugh> which is subjective
<Tarminquay> He says "VERY, VERY light" and that he subjectively feels Mint is "way more resoruce intensive."
<SeriouslyLaugh> i've used both and both feel equal to me, i think it depends on the hardware in use
<Tarminquay> I have to admit Windows these days is very good in my opinion.
<nicomachus> lol
<Tarminquay> Why is that funny?
<SeriouslyLaugh> though i've run both on an overclocked i7 with a silly amount of ram so i don't really have a barometer
<Tarminquay> SeriouslyLaugh: That's why.
<SeriouslyLaugh> yeah
<Tarminquay> You can't tell which is lighter if your hardware is way overpowered.
<SeriouslyLaugh> depends on the hardware
<Tarminquay> You have to use minimal specs to notice the reality.
<SeriouslyLaugh> yep
<Tarminquay> With an i7 and 8 GB of ram unless you have hardware issues with a certain distro you're going to find everything equally snappy.
<nicomachus> Tarminquay: I laugh the amount of user-control over Windows has *declined* exponentially with every release, and now with w10 it declines with every *update*.
<nicomachus> I laugh because**
<nicomachus> and *I* control my OS, not Micro$oft
<Tarminquay> nicomachus: The Windows user just wants to use the OS and get his/her work done.
<Tarminquay> They don't want user control.
<Tarminquay> It's like a refrigerator. You don't get much control. You get to choose how cold you want it.
<SeriouslyLaugh> windows 10 has a decent UI -- there's room for improvement but overall it's totally usable
<nicomachus> and when Windows can change the user's work without permission, that's counter-productive.
<Tarminquay> But you're an enthusiast. You want your computer to be a hobby.
<Tarminquay> That's different.
<Tarminquay> If you considerr it, $150 is a bargain for the average user for his/her Windows 10 experience.
<Tarminquay> Depends how important your time is to you as well. I've seen users of every distro having serious problems at one point or another. Troubleshooting and loss of productivity really adds up.
<nicomachus> $150 plus the cost of all your data.
<nicomachus> this was the latest nail in the coffin: http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/2015-11/24/windows-10-update-removing-software
<Tarminquay> I read that. It's overblown.
<Tarminquay> Sites like Wired need things to write about so they take everything they can and make it into as big a deal as they can.
<nicomachus> sure it's overblown, but the problem is still there.
<nicomachus> ##windows is that-a-way --->
<SeriouslyLaugh> woah why am i not in that channel. i like windows. :x
<Tarminquay> I use both Windows and Mint. But there's no doubt Windows is the better OS for most users.
<nicomachus> there's plenty of doubt.
<Tarminquay> I take it you haven't used a Surface Pro.
<nicomachus> My dad has one, I use it occasionally when I go visit.
<nicomachus> it's not a bad device, hardware wise.
<Tarminquay> It's an incredible device.
<nicomachus> idk about incredible.
<Tarminquay> Brilliant touch capabilities, rock solid, smooth as butter OS.
<nicomachus> do you work for M$ or something?
<Tarminquay> I just wish the Linux commnity could finally band together and genuinely surpass Microsoft and Apple.
<nicomachus> surpass in what way?
<nicomachus> the Linux community has entirely different priorities than Microsoft and Apple have.
<Tarminquay> Look at the Caonical founder. He's worth about $500 million, right? The Linux community needs to be more focused instead of working on so many different projects branching out in so many different directions.
<Tarminquay> Canonical
<nicomachus> that's the entire point of the community....
<Tarminquay> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Shuttleworth
<Tarminquay> That was a very rapid fortune. $500 million in how many years?
<nicomachus> why does that matter?
<nicomachus> why is that at all relevant?
<Tarminquay> Because coders need money to survive, and to produce an excellent product you need many talented coders focused on a small number of things.
<nicomachus> I also find it ironic that your go-to resource was a community driven project. lol
<nicomachus> and a non-profit at that.
<Tarminquay> I saw the donations being given to the Ubuntu-MATE leader. People were donating $2.50 each.
<Tarminquay> That's pretty pathetic.
<nicomachus> and you're using Firefox, another community-driven open-source non-profit project.
<Tarminquay> I do like what Zorin OS is doing. You pay $10 for Zorin Ultimate. That's very cheap but over a good userbase gets some much needed cash into the pockets of the developers.
<nicomachus> take your bait elsewhere.
<SeriouslyLaugh> he asked the same question in ##windows nicomachus
<SeriouslyLaugh> very passionate :)
<nicomachus> he clearly read too much Ayn Rand in junior high
<nicomachus> or took Bill Gates' Letter to Hobbyists too seriously.
<Tarminquay> I began using Linux back when Windows was at NT4. Back then I considered Windows the superior OS. Back then there were tons of distros dispersing valauble talent in all directions.
<Tarminquay> Not much has changed. If I'm honest, Windows has a bigger lead today than it had then.
<Tarminquay> The best thing to happen to Linux in recent times was Ubuntu.
<Tarminquay> Just my two cents. Don't take it personally. Spurred by that one man saying how light W10 is compared to Mint.
<Tarminquay> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883218036
<Tarminquay> What do you think about this hardware?
<Tarminquay> Intel Core i3-4020Y (dual core, 1.5 GHz) vs Intel N3150 quad-core 1.6GHz
<Tarminquay> Are these roughly equivalent?
<SeriouslyLaugh> Tarminquay not really
<SeriouslyLaugh> http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core+i3-4020Y+%40+1.50GHz
<SeriouslyLaugh> http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Celeron+N3150+%40+1.60GHz
<Tarminquay> How did you find those pages so fast?
<SeriouslyLaugh> google?
<Tarminquay> But the exact GHz too.
<Tarminquay> So the i3 is definitely significantly superior?
<SeriouslyLaugh> if you google i3-4020Y or Intel N3150 you'll get the passmark scores
<Tarminquay> You think you'd notice the i3 browsing around the web with a few tabs open?
<SeriouslyLaugh> yeah the dual core 1.5 GHz technically outperforms the quad core 1.6 GHz
<Tarminquay> Technically...
<Tarminquay> that's not necessarily noticeable in light usage scenarios.
<SeriouslyLaugh> eh it probably depends on the rest of the hardware and the content of the websites
<Tarminquay>  "History is a selective interpretation of events designed to justify those in power".
<Tarminquay> Who makes good-priced systems with everything but the OS?
<Tarminquay> That's what I want - a good value where I just install the OS.
<Tarminquay> Oops.
<Tarminquay> wrong chan.
<dotpixis> Tarminquay: server or desktop? (you will not be able to find a laptop without an os :( )
<Tarminquay> It's being used a home workstation with light power requirements.
<Tarminquay> as a*
<Tarminquay> Interesting. How did Microsoft get all the manufacturers to sell products with their OS pre-installed? If not for that Linux could have really taken off
<Tarminquay> $20 for a Linux distro on a USB stick would appeal to many if the majority of systems came without Windows.
<dotpixis> Tarminquay: it's been tried, windows did everything that they could possibly do to kill it
<dotpixis> though you should checkout http://minifree.org/product/libreboot-x200/
<dotpixis> Tarminquay: * http://minifree.org/
<Tarminquay> I don't need/want a laptop. I want a desktop.
<Tarminquay> Oh, that's interesting.
<daftykins> afternoon team o/
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<daftykins> heya \o
<BluesKaj> ahh, coffee!
<daftykins> :D just finished mine
<BluesKaj> just got up a few mins ago
<daftykins> i slept in a fair bit this morning, didn't have any specific plans of tasks to perform :)
<BluesKaj> dark, dreary, wet weather here ... a good day to sleep in
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon mates
<daftykins> hallo thar o/
<daftykins> we're all nursing our coffees indoors :>
<OerHeks> oke, calm down guys , lotus is back
<BluesKaj> hey lotuspsychje, OerHeks
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> hey daftykins, OerHeks and BluesKaj
<daftykins> ^_^
<lotuspsychje> shouldnt you guys be outside xmass shopping?
<lotuspsychje> !life
<ubot5> life is something very few people know about in this channel - and anyway, it's probably offtopic, perhaps you want to try #ubuntu-offtopic
<OerHeks> burn the dead trees !
<lotuspsychje> lol
<BluesKaj> finished Christmas  shopping... mostly online
<lotuspsychje> ah 2 million euro's in belgium for online xmass shopping
<lotuspsychje> no pusshing and pulling in the stores anymore :p
<daftykins> never really did gifts growing up
<lotuspsychje> how about food daftykins
<lotuspsychje> filled turkey
 * lotuspsychje will put a xenial alpha under the xmass tree 31 dec :p
<daftykins> my folks will do something yeah, so i'll head over there
<lotuspsychje> cool
<BluesKaj> a couple of my kids are coming home for Christmas, the other 2 are having it with their inlaws... they alternate
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: nice one
<OerHeks> oh dear, xp problem :-D
<lotuspsychje> lolz
<OerHeks> not an xp problem, just a human error, using xp
<BluesKaj> yeah, lotuspsychje I'm looking forward to it :-)
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: there are millions of boxes still running xp
<daftykins> OerHeks: +1 :D
<daftykins> yeah but most are in extended contracts, home users are not
<daftykins> thus they should be denied help, imo
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: plus, its wrong to think other windowses are not vunrable as hell..
<BluesKaj> my bank still runs W2000
<lotuspsychje> lollll BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> it worries me
<lotuspsychje> 'please hack me!!'
<BluesKaj> lotuspsychje, anyway , the last time I checked they did , maybe they've upgraded since
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: to windows 2000 service pack3 lol
<BluesKaj> heh
<BluesKaj> It's quite a large bank , they can afford lots of security
<BluesKaj> Toronto Dominion
<lotuspsychje> dear lord
<lotuspsychje> and probably running vnc, so the owner can see whats happening from home
<lotuspsychje> brb booting into xenial
<daftykins> wouldn't it be great if there were a text based installer so on these systems that have graphics issues, you could boot with 'text' appended, then just run a textmode installer instead?
<daftykins> i feel like someone's going to tell me that's already possible... :D
<BluesKaj> like debian used to do
<lotus|xenial> daftykins: good idea
<BluesKaj> or ubuntu minimal
<daftykins> i don't think i've ever seen that
<BluesKaj> never tried minimal lotus|xenial?
<lotus|xenial> no
<lotus|xenial> i did alternate iso's in the past sometimes
<BluesKaj> iirc it's text based
<daftykins> oh do you mean mini.iso BluesKaj ?
<lotus|xenial> yep
<daftykins> this guy is pointing out he wants an EFI install, which mini.iso can't provide, is the problem
<BluesKaj> tried it a while back, maybe 5 yrs ago
<lotus|xenial> daftykins: 15.10?
<daftykins> not sure
<lotus|xenial> problem is 15.04 and 15.10 got many black screen issues for users
<lotus|xenial> even before plymouth
<OerHeks> lots of new crappy hardware
<lotus|xenial> !info plymouth
<ubot5> plymouth (source: plymouth): graphical boot animation and logger - main package. In component main, is standard. Version 0.9.0-0ubuntu9 (vivid), package size 108 kB, installed size 537 kB
<lotus|xenial> !info plymouth xenial
<ubot5> plymouth (source: plymouth): boot animation, logger and I/O multiplexer. In component main, is standard. Version 0.9.2-3ubuntu5 (xenial), package size 112 kB, installed size 451 kB
<lotus|xenial> aha
<lotus|xenial> just updated xenial, lemme reboot real quick if they changed that already :p
<lotus|xenial> brb
<lotus|xenial> nothing noticable
<lotus|xenial> maybe just a time change
<lotus|xenial> R00TB0X systemd[1]: Starting Tell Plymouth To Write Out Runtime Data...
<daftykins> o0
<lotus|xenial> no other plymouth changes that i can notice
<lotus|xenial> daftykins: would be nice idea: install ubuntu GUI/install ubuntu text base/try live
<daftykins> ja :D
<lotus|xenial> lol
<BluesKaj> bbiab
<daftykins> lotus|xenial: that idiot user can't boot right now, quite how server doesn't boot either is a mystery
<lotus|xenial> lol
<lotus|xenial> daftykins: i had several other users on that same issue like him with gtx 920m
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: alive mate?
<EriC^^> hey
<EriC^^> yeah what's up?
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: i had several users on gtx 920m that cant boot into live or install, several ubuntu versions
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: could it be that trying to dualboot, prevent such thing?
<EriC^^> you mean they get a black screen?
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: im starting to think its not about the card, but uefi messing
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: yeah
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: check this out: http://sprunge.us/ENeI
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: doesnt make sense ubuntu would block intel/nivida right?
<EriC^^> yeah
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: any ideas on this?
<EriC^^> *shrug*
<lotus|xenial> lol
<EriC^^> did he try pressing install ubuntu after he booted the live usb?
<EriC^^> there's an icon on the desktop for it..
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: he doesnt reach that far
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: try live==>black screen
<EriC^^> he said the liveusb is fine
<EriC^^> "The liveusb is fine, I can boot to grub (UEFI computer), still, when I try to boot to the install menu, I get a black screen (nothing, not even a blinking cursor)."
<EriC^^> oh
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: no he said afterwards he cant get into live neither
<EriC^^> he means ..nevermind
<EriC^^> did he try disabling secureboot?
<lotus|xenial> yep just told fastboot and secureboot is off
<EriC^^> it's pretty odd, but some guy reported once after disabling secureboot he wasn't getting a blinking cursor after grub
<EriC^^> i guess it's a graphics issue or the live usb isn't right
<EriC^^> did he try removing quiet splash and putting verbose etc. ?
<EriC^^> it might say what's going on..
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: ive asked to try a lubuntu, maybe he can get in that way
<lotus|xenial> ah good idea EriC^^
<lotus|xenial> wb BluesKaj
<EriC^^> lotus|xenial: did you watch the movie bitcoin - the end of money?
<EriC^^> i saw a picture in the movies site
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: ah not yet, but saw its released
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: finland is voting a lwa right now every citizen 800$ for free!
<lotus|xenial> law
<EriC^^> nice
<lotus|xenial> basic income
<lotus|xenial> will be the future
<lotus|xenial> hey nicomachus !
<BluesKaj> thanks lotus|xenial
<lotus|xenial> EriC^^: if you like docu's liek that try the 'panopticon' docu
<EriC^^> what's that about?
<lotus|xenial> privacy, big brother
<BluesKaj> guaranteed annual income, supposed to save millions by ridding the govt of the welfare/social assistance bureaucracy
<EriC^^> ah i see
<lotus|xenial> and bit hacking
<lotus|xenial> BluesKaj: lets hope it comes up worldwide
<EriC^^> what if i have dual citizenship :D
<lotus|xenial> lol
<lotus|xenial> clone yourself
<lotus|xenial> 2x 800$ and a little dealing by night :p
<EriC^^> :p
<lotus|xenial> OerHeks could buy alot of dog food with 800$
<BluesKaj> http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-33977636
<lotus|xenial> in netherlands their experimenting with basic income aswell
<BluesKaj> my daughter has Canadian-Finnish dual citizenship ...wonder if she's eligable
 * BluesKaj was born in Finland
<lotus|xenial> cool
<BluesKaj> err elegible
<BluesKaj> never get that word correct...well I used to be a good speller
<lotus|xenial> :p
<BluesKaj> it doesn't seem to follow the rule of "able"
<lotus|xenial> bbl fast coffee
<daftykins> TJ-: afternoonings o/
<daftykins> any ideas on removing BIOS passwords from old thinkpads? ;)
<daftykins> guy i know in another channel bought one but the seller doesn't know what it is
<OerHeks> remove the battery and bios battery, etc, press power should wipe it?
<daftykins> apparently no go on that, he said he left it running over night
<daftykins> err left switched off with the CMOS battery out i mean
<nicomachus> maybe !BIOS?
<daftykins> no factoid is going to help with removing a password XD
<nicomachus> heh that's the name of the software, not a factoid. :)
<OerHeks> what thinkpad exactly?
<daftykins> T430
<nicomachus> I used it on Windows once, a long time ago. can't find it now, actually
<daftykins> ah he mentioned !bios , but it only dumps the BIOS and doesn't do anything with the NVRAM apparently o0
<MonkeyDust> is actionparsnip still among the living?
<OerHeks> http://www.ja.axxs.net/t430.htm
 * TJ- waves belatedly
<TJ-> daftykins: usually it requires programming the EEPROM
<daftykins> hrmm
<nicomachus> I found something that mentions using a jumper to short-circuit the 2 password pads... but that sounds risky.
<daftykins> :D
<OerHeks> shortcut 3 legs ..
<TJ-> daftykins: as nicomachus says, if the PC has jumpers for resetting the EEPROM, use those.
<OerHeks> nope, that http://www.ja.axxs.net/t430.htm shows you have to do it with pinns and paperclips :-D
<daftykins> \o/
<daftykins> he wastes so much time with this old gear
<TJ-> well it's only shorting the I2C bus, so do it
<TJ-> "if any device holds the SDA or SCL line low it prevents the master from sending START or STOP commands to reset the bus. Thus it is common for designs to include a reset signal that provides an external method of resetting the bus devices."
<daftykins> :D
<TJ-> SCL is the Clock SDA is Data
<daftykins> thanks all! will have to see if he has any success
<TJ-> I've just had a strange experience with CUPS on 15.10 - couldn't print due to ownership of some files under /usr/share/cups/filters/ having changed from UID 0 to my user UID.  Worked fine 3 days ago; very weird.
<daftykins> :S
<daftykins> printing knows no bounds to stopping being evil :D
<TJ-> I wonder if it's some ununusal side effect of my regular user being 'root' - although I struggle to think where the package manager would make such a basic error, not seen it elsewhere
<TJ-> I'll have to check for recent CUPS updates, maybe a postinst script is responsible
<nicomachus> TJ-: just had a pretty large CUPS update in xenial this morning
<TJ-> right, same here yesterday cups-filters-core-drivers:amd64 (1.0.76-1, 1.0.76-1ubuntu0.1)
<TJ-> I'll have to examine that; looks like something is incorrectly using username 'root' rather than UID 0 during the file installation.
<TJ-> on my systems root == 1000
<nicomachus> Bassem needs google...
<daftykins> indeed :/
<daftykins> guy can't think for himself
<lotuspsychje> there we go xenial box up to date again
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/mycroft-is-now-an-official-ubuntu-iot-partner-497596.shtml
<lotuspsychje> mycroft go get food from the kitchen to EriC^^
<MonkeyDust> a cookie?
<daftykins> :>
<lotuspsychje> :p
<daftykins> EriC^^ needs a pack of cookies just to wake up!
<lotuspsychje> he needs a robot to get him to irc first
<MonkeyDust> star wars bb 8
<MonkeyDust> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BB-8_%28Star_Wars%29
<lotuspsychje> looks a cool one MonkeyDust
<lotuspsychje> seen the new starwars yet?
<MonkeyDust> it's not out yes
<MonkeyDust> yet*
<lotuspsychje> ah
<MonkeyDust> tomorrow is the release
<lotuspsychje> im not such a fan myself
<lotuspsychje> rather like LOTR
<MonkeyDust> i'm first watching the other six
<nicomachus> the script leaked. :/
<lotuspsychje> MonkeyDust: at home?
<MonkeyDust> i'm more into star trek
<MonkeyDust> yes
<lotuspsychje> MonkeyDust: would be cool in theaters, the whole marathon :p
<nicomachus> that would take sooooooo long though. I couldn't sit in a theater that long
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: so wont take long before an rip reaches underground :p
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: well the decryption codes haven't even been released to the theaters yet, so it'll still be a bit. :)
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: did you see blackhat?
<MonkeyDust> xenial up to date here, too
<lotuspsychje> MonkeyDust: wich flavor?
<MonkeyDust> lubuntu
<nicomachus> gotta reboot...
<lotuspsychje> MonkeyDust: did you notice something on plymouth?
<lotuspsychje> MonkeyDust: ive read an rticle they gonna rechange plymouth for fast ssd drives, not seeing the ubuntu logo
<MonkeyDust> lotuspsychje  old frankenstein laptop here
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> MonkeyDust: as long as it works! it must run
<lotuspsychje> im also a fan of not throwing away working hardware
<lotuspsychje> 2nd life ubuntu
<EriC^^> daftykins: lotuspsychje :D
<lotuspsychje> lol
<EriC^^> did you guys play fallout4 by any chance?
<EriC^^> i saw a trailer, it's for ps4 though
<lotuspsychje> thats with that car?
<EriC^^> not coming out for ps3
<daftykins> nah, looked just like 3 to me really, not enough change
<EriC^^> ah i see
<lotuspsychje> makes me think about stalker that game
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: yea I've seen blackhat... why?
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: did you like it
<daftykins> ah man so many ripped opera CDs
<daftykins> nearly there...
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: lol, pretty soon you will chant the 5th of beethoven in your sleep
<MonkeyDust> i've ripped all my cd's, except the classical music
<daftykins> yeah i'm doing a clients opera collection :( ugh
<lotuspsychje> MonkeyDust: what style would that be if i may be curious :p
<MonkeyDust> lotuspsychje  any style you can or can't imagine
<lotuspsychje> MonkeyDust: ok lets try again, whats your fav style :p
<MonkeyDust> death metal to french chanson and medieval music
<lotuspsychje> wide range lover, like me
<MonkeyDust> i'm mainly into blues, these days
<lotuspsychje> mine is techno
<MonkeyDust> never liked that
<lotuspsychje> but i kinda like every style behalf of hardcore
<MonkeyDust> hardcore punk?
<MonkeyDust> that's my style
<lotuspsychje> punk is good
<nicomachus> MonkeyDust: you and I could get along well, I think.
<lotuspsychje> but i love mainly weird music, strange sounds
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks dances in this clip also: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8BWBn26bX0
<MonkeyDust> like hybryds, steve reich ... ?
<EriC^^> lotuspsychje: i saw 1/4 of black hat the other day btw, it kept buffering so much though so i had to turn it off, seemed cool though maybe i'll try tonight :D
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: your streaming movies?
<EriC^^> yeah man, found a really cool site
<nicomachus> it's *ok*, but some parts will make you facepalm.
<EriC^^> you just hit play and it just loads it
<EriC^^> search google for "hd movies no bullshit" it pops up
<EriC^^> moviesnight something
<EriC^^> they aren't lying in the title :p
<lotuspsychje> lets not discuss it here :p
<nicomachus> I mean... if you're gonna go that route, popcorntime is the way to go. I'll just leave it at that.
<lotuspsychje> yeah i hear popcorn is back alive
<nicomachus> there's a community-run version now that's keeping the API's updated, so yea.
<EriC^^> nicomachus: it's free?
<lotuspsychje> but i hear from OerHeks its dangerous to use...
<lotuspsychje> they guys are hunting down illegal stuff
<nicomachus> EriC^^: yes, not exactly legal though...
<OerHeks> vpn does not matter :-D
<EriC^^> i see
<daftykins> that popcorn crap just torrents, so you'd be giving up some bandwidth
<nicomachus> right, it does use your machine to seed others.
<daftykins> had to warn a friend whose kid started using it
<nicomachus> man, I feel for you guys that have bandwidth limits...
<daftykins> well we don't have any where i am, no fair usage policies or download caps... but i wouldn't be happy something uploading away without my control
<nicomachus> I only use it on my HTPC which I also use as a seedbox for some linux distros and other stuff, so I'm not too concerned with it, but I can see how you would be.
<lotuspsychje> !info flashplugin-installer
<ubot5> flashplugin-installer (source: flashplugin-nonfree): Adobe Flash Player plugin installer. In component multiverse, is optional. Version 11.2.202.554ubuntu0.15.04.1 (vivid), package size 7 kB, installed size 137 kB (Only available for i386; amd64)
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/adobe-releases-massive-security-update-for-linux-flash-player-497360.shtml
<daftykins> pesky flash
<lotuspsychje> i wont be using it :p
<MonkeyDust> i see a great potential in containers, just not sure how
<BluesKaj> adobe is responsible for a lot of windows exploits, malware, viruses, and will take no responsibilty
<lotuspsychje> indeed
<nicomachus> they've taken a bit of responsibility...
<lotuspsychje> they will always be 10 steps ahead and abuse adobe 0day exploits on it
<MonkeyDust> adobe is popular, that's one reason
<MonkeyDust> or explanation
<lotuspsychje> yeah, hackers think this way
<lotuspsychje> hunting down popular exploitable services
<lotuspsychje> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Linux-2015-News-So-Far
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: wb
<daftykins> only one opera set left \o/
<daftykins> aaand it's a 12+ disc set ;_;
<OerHeks> so, just burned a dvd for a new user :-) had to boot it for him to make sure it works.
<daftykins> :O
 * OerHeks is awesome \o/
<daftykins> !cookie | OerHeks
<ubot5> OerHeks: Wow! You're such a great helper, you deserve a cookie!
<lotuspsychje> new ubuntu users is our main goal in life :p
<lotuspsychje> opensource Os means opensource thinking life also
<lotuspsychje> open mind= happy life
<OerHeks> this thingy http://web.medion.com/sainsburys/p4011d/uk/?refPage=medion
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: did you install ubuntu on that box?
<OerHeks> No, he is going to try it himself.
<lotuspsychje> cool!
<OerHeks> if it does not work, he will come on irc, else he knows how to get in touch for onsite
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: ive had trouble on that weird bios setting 'intel thing' blocking new Os install on an uefi medion too recently
<OerHeks> i must make business cards..
<daftykins> ^ me too
<lotuspsychje> the whole world on ubuntu :p
<daftykins> mmm no :P
<daftykins> there aren't enough cookies in all the world ;)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<TJ-> No... they're all in the Channel Islands!
 * daftykins whistles
<TJ-> Cornering the cookie market to take over where the financial services are fading :D
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: can you scroll back to that sprunge link from revenolt or something
<lotuspsychje> wanna let TJ- take a look, it keeps flying in my mind
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: http://sprunge.us/ENeI
<lotuspsychje> wanna take a look at it plz?
<lotuspsychje> i let him disable fastboot and secureboot, and try lubuntu aswell
<OerHeks> i have noticed, with dvd .. BE PATIENT ! check the num-lock if it works on/off ... and be patient.
<TJ-> That's possibly a firmware GPU GOP issue
<TJ-> most recent systems provide a UEFI GOP so the boot loader can call GPU services
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: ive had more users with those symptons on gtx 920m aswell
<TJ-> think "VGA BIOS" for UEFI
<lotuspsychje> whats a gop?
<TJ-> Graphics Output Protocol
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: were so used with usb installs :p
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: if that would be the case, whats the solution for it?
<TJ-> There's a well known firmware bug in the E15 and similar models, where it actually fails and needs an update
<lotuspsychje> right
<lotuspsychje> lemme go check on it
<daftykins> :S
<daftykins> lotuspsychje: did i tell you i got SSD #2 today ;)
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: nice, what you gonna do with it?
<daftykins> Bashing-om: o/ wb
<lotuspsychje> het Bashing-om
<lotuspsychje> hey
<daftykins> lotuspsychje: i don't have a clue XD
<BluesKaj> daftykins, keeping it?
<daftykins> well it turns out i did get charged for both, so each were Â£33
<daftykins> but i don't think i really have a use for a 240GB SSD unless any clients come up anytime soon
<Bashing-om> Hiya guys .. Let's see what I can mess up this session . Wonders never cease !
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: lol
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: here's a thinker for ya: http://sprunge.us/ENeI
<daftykins> i was suggesting a server install earlier but got told server wasn't working with EFI install, is that true? o0
<lotuspsychje> not sure
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Maybe as in 15.10 is systemd, try and boot to terminal from grub. If that is good; see then what we can find out . huh ?
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: he cant bypass try/install black screen right after
<daftykins> i'd suggest a xenial daily?
<lotuspsychje> yeah also testable
<TJ-> -server ISOs are hybrid bootable
<daftykins> i had a feeling i was being told lies :)
<TJ-> daftykins: the important part to find out is the exact make/model and firmware revision; oftentimes its a SecureBoot related issue (such as having to mark the boot manager .efi 'trusted' first
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: the guy said something about dualboot, whitelisting efi ubuntu
<daftykins> yeah, we've seen talk that those acers often show more settings once a password is created too
<TJ-> I'm not sure but I have a theory that when its removable media it will boot using ISO9660/El Torito but when its in mass storage mode the firmware sometimes requires the file to be 'trusted'
<daftykins> makes sense, i've had a cheap EFI machine be like that before
<daftykins> CSM ignored my flash drives but booted a DVD just fine, that was Windows too O_O
<lotuspsychje> and another E15...
<daftykins> i saw them come up in the black friday deals a lot :)
<lotuspsychje> what the... http://www.linpus.com/
<daftykins> time to cook i think!
<daftykins> disc 3 of 20...
<lotuspsychje> :p
<nicomachus> "Linpus Lite was one of the first Linux distributions to offer a fully customized UI and dual launchers with a user experience specially designed for those new to computing"
<nicomachus> wat
<TJ-> Yeah, they were very significant, responsible for the 'official' Tiawanese distro
<nicomachus> virtualbox is eating up RAM right now, but the only VM running is xenial and it only reports using 383 MB
<nicomachus> but the windows host shows vbox using 3GB
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: you don't run xenial in a Vm, do you?
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: no, physical on my desktop
<lotuspsychje> i dont very like virtual machines :p
<nicomachus> bummer. trying to figure out what's causing these memory leaks... 2-3 MB every second.
<nicomachus> I gotta kill it. bbl
<daftykins> D:
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: maybe the #vbos guys can sort your leak?
<nicomachus> yea, I tried asking there but no response yet. still waiitng.
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: try launch from terminal, maybe spits out something usefull?
<nicomachus> host is Windows :/
<lotuspsychje> ahhh :p
<lotuspsychje> virtualbox or vmware?
<nicomachus> vbox
<lotuspsychje> kk
<lotuspsychje> maybe the ##windows guys?
<lotuspsychje> anyway im bbl
<lotuspsychje> movietime
<lotuspsychje> cheers guys
<daftykins> i never enjoyed vbox on windows, felt a lot slower
<nicomachus> they sent me to #vbox. haha
<daftykins> \o
<nicomachus> daftykins: it's the only way I can tool around with linux on my work PC. I mainly use the VM to SSH into my home PC and then irssi from there.
<daftykins> i've just always stuck with vmware workstation
<daftykins> i VM a lot too as i run Windows
<TJ-> Overlap is a pain, ignoring all the advice and links; time to be thrown in the deep end and learn to swim!
<daftykins> pesky users :(
<TJ-> It annoys me when Bashing-om was digging and providing links too, that the user plainly ignored them
<daftykins> :/ not good
<Bashing-om> TJ-: Yeah .. I stress we need to 'read' so we have a common background of reference . Several ways to do .. and can cause conflicts mixing modes, huh ?
<pauljw> hi everyone
<daftykins> heya \o
<pauljw> :)
<daftykins> mmm uncle ben, that was some fine chicken in cantonese sauce with white rice
<Bashing-om> hiya pauljw :: Haol hail, the gang is all here now .
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> go team!
<nicomachus> has #ubuntu ever just kicked everyone to kill the idlers?
<pauljw> to what advantage?
<nicomachus> 100% curiousity, I suppose.
<pauljw> :)
<daftykins> i do find it ridiculous what most folk must be doing in there
<daftykins> i'm not fond of these websites that are taking the public logs and hosting them elsewhere, too
<daftykins> e.g. if you google your own nickname you'll find them
<pauljw> i personally find that there is a lot of knowledge to be gained just "listening" in the channel.  i don't have enough know how to be much help and won't make a fool of myself intentionally, but things that you guys do everyday helping others, helps me while digging into my systems.
<nicomachus> that's my intent most of the time, but I just can't keep my fingers off the keys... even when I probably should. :/
<pauljw> heheh...
<daftykins> yeah, i sometimes reply when truthfully i know i've not got the strength to see it through to the end
<pauljw> i've been on other irc channels and have been able to offer assistance, but the level of high quality professionalism here kinda intimidates and impresses me.
<pauljw> ...and you know what they say about opening your mouth and removing all doubt. :)
<daftykins> hehe
<daftykins> i've definitely picked up a lot too, hell i give help and don't even use the OS other than on servers
<pauljw> really, that surprises me daftykins
<nicomachus> ^ me too
<daftykins> i'm typing now from a trusty VM that runs a web server and irssi, nothing else :> SSH'd in from my Windows desktop
<pauljw> :D
<daftykins> 384MB RAM \o/
<daftykins> 60MB free :>
<pauljw> i've just recently mastered ssh'ing into my wife and daughters systems to perform remote updates, that's about the extent of it so far.
<daftykins> if you watch i'm usually useless at telling anyone where to find a setting in the GUI 'cause i just don't use it :D
<daftykins> pauljw: ah ha :D
<daftykins> it's so powerful, i love it
<daftykins> at Uni i had lab sessions VM'ing a whole network of about 8 systems, learning to scp via command line etc for the first time, so good :>
<pauljw> me too, but i struggle to remember command structure but i refuse to give up.
<pauljw> that's cool
<daftykins> my lab sessions at Uni made us keep a log book, i still write up tasks when i set up my web server with newer LTS versions
<pauljw> i had no uni, i'm self taught all the way
<daftykins> well in my experience Uni was just paying to have someone to tell you to go away and learn it
<TJ-> I save such things as scripts in a git repo
<daftykins> no hand holding :>
<nicomachus> pauljw: I use SSH to get into my home HTPC and do updates and irssi, and that's it.
<TJ-> daftykins: ++++1000
<nicomachus> also no uni, unless you count poli sci and philosphy.
<daftykins> it's great to have a known-good resource to go back to, with the logbooks :>
<Bashing-om> pauljw: I learn more from my errors in directions , And when I do make a boo-boo, there are those who point out the error of my ways and re-direct my think'n . Thank goodness ! I accepted a long time past that I am fallable :)
<pauljw> TJ-, above when i mentioned intimidated, i had you in mind... :)
<TJ-> I had to pound that into Eddie because he thought uni would be like school, that he'd have to rely on himself and no one else
<TJ-> :O I'm a big softy!
<pauljw> :)
 * dotpixis hugs the big softy
<pauljw> you must be TJ- or your huskies wouldn't love you...
<daftykins> he does that to me too! i feel like a fake when i give help when TJ-'s active now ;)
<TJ-> why do you think Pepper runs away? :p
<TJ-> Sorry daftykins, don't mean to! I try to share the knowledge around :)
<pauljw> lol, because she's a husky, that's what they do.
<daftykins> hehe :D
<TJ-> She's still recovering from Saturday's adventure
<pauljw> Bashing-om, i too learned a long time ago that i'm fallible
<daftykins> i bet she had a good sleep that night!
<Bashing-om> pauljw: "thats what they do" gonna be another Giego commercial there !
<pauljw> lol
<TJ-> They have "just run!" tattooed on the inside of their eyelids
<pauljw> do you much snow in winter TJ- ?  that's when they're in heaven!
<TJ-> pauljw: rarely nowadays, just lots of mud
<pauljw> :(
<TJ-> I carry on hoping, would love to let them dive around in more than 1/2" of slush
<TJ-> will resin cure faster under a hot lightbulb ?
<daftykins> hmm i would've thought so
<TJ-> I hope so! I've hand-made some lockets and embedded photos of Eddie and me in each half, and sealed them today with clear resin... didn't realise the curing could take 2 days, and we're going out tomorrow night and I want to present them. I've sat them under the magnifier lamp which gives out a lot of heat.
<daftykins> no chance of deformation i take it?
<daftykins> you could just supply gloves :D
<TJ-> No, they're less than 25mm tall
<TJ-> it was a pain trying to accurately measure out such small amounts, because it takes 2-3% catalyst
<TJ-> I already ruined one and had to start again... accidentally put my gloved finger on the soft resin!
<TJ-> thank goodness IPA dissolves it
<daftykins> i'm suddenly in the mood for a guinness, but the cat is on my lap so nevermind :)
<TJ-> Make the cat fetch it :)
<daftykins> aaah i wish i could train her for that, it'd be amazing
<daftykins> perhaps i could send her to EriC^^ to train for kitchen duty, but then she'd never come back!
<EriC^^> lol
<EriC^^> :D
<daftykins> :>
<TJ-> I'm sure Eric isn't *that* hungry
<nicomachus> train a cat? not possible.
<EriC^^> lol
<daftykins> XD
<TJ-> what you need is a skateboard and a tin of tuna
<pauljw> :)
<daftykins> this cat of mine has been known to strut in, jump on the desk and join in watching an episode of Star Trek TOS
<daftykins> i even have it on video, but it's evil dropbox again ;)
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/glkxv14006rf0im/VID_20141122_225136.mp4?dl=0
<TJ-> plus an IoT fridge and an industrial robot... then the robot can grab the Beer and put it on the skateboard, which the cat can push trying to get to the tuna (you have to super-glue the cat's front paws to the back of the skateboard though)
<nicomachus> Lol, my cat will sit on the pillow above my gf's head and watch Vine videos of some guy named Big Cat Derek.
<TJ-> Sounds... iffy!
<TJ-> next thing you know that cat'll be jumping out of a tree onto your head thinking its a leopard
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> i wonder if i should go back over all these CDs and get the cover images...
<nicomachus> can't just fetch them from CDDB?
<daftykins> heh that's long dead
<nicomachus> I just used it a week ago or so... I think
<daftykins> here's the one i'm doing atm, 20 disc set - http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51MPpSlU3QL._SY355_.jpg
<daftykins> probably doesn't matter
<daftykins> i could scan them all ;)
<daftykins> ooh getting late, i'll never finish this tonight
<Bashing-om> strong black coffee, no more guinness for daftykins !
<nicomachus> almost time to go home... Childhood's End starts on SyFy tonight. :)
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Uh Huh ^^ Might be I have to terminate my session early for that .
<nicomachus> I hope they don't butcher it... but the production team is a good one, and I'm excited about Charles Dance as Karellen.
<Bashing-om> I refrain from commercial TV --- commercials! and SyFy generally is fully loaded with commercials. In this case it might be worth it .
<nicomachus> it's a 3 night even, 2 hours each night. supposedly the production itself is 4 hours long. so 1/3 of the time will be commercials... :/
<nicomachus> s/even/event/
<nicomachus> best option is to record it on DVR and then skip through commercials. :)
<daftykins> or just obtain *cough*
<Bashing-om> Ouch ! The better the 'event' the more the commercials . Oh the pain, oH the agony .
<daftykins> i don't even have a broadcast service here :D
<nicomachus> lol. I already have it set to record, and it's supposed to start at 7:00pm local, so I'll start watching around 7:30-7:40 and then fast-forward through commercials.
<nicomachus> ok I'm out, time to go home.
<daftykins> Bashing-om: btw i had coffee too :D
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Oh ? Thoght of you more the tea type . But coffee is GOOD .
<daftykins> :D i dabble with both of late
<OerHeks> 6 coffee with a movie https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XB1Pq1_M-Wg
<Bashing-om> caffine caffine, the lubricant of champions !
<Bashing-om> daftykins: The intro commercial ^ Sprint : I was once upon a time the senior network controller . My how that network has grown .
<daftykins> :O
<daftykins> how come you all have claims to fame ;)
<Bashing-om> no claim,,, just nostalgia :)
<daftykins> what does said senior do?
<daftykins> or did - perhaps!
<Bashing-om> traffic management and get someone else to fix the hardware !
<Bashing-om> we can not handle the load .. get us some more band width !
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> must've been a high pressure role?
<Bashing-om> was a long time adjusting to the loss of adrinalin !
<daftykins> one of the famous British F1 drivers, Damon Hill, said in an interview that after he retired from racing he'd do odd things like leave packing for holidays to the last minute to try and get the buzz back
<Bashing-om> LOL
<Bashing-om> Back then GTE/Sprint merged with US-Telcom. moved control to Atlanta, Georgia from california. Well I decided rather than moving to Atlanta I would go to college - a long time dream . I did and never returned to the real world .
<daftykins> :D
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-12-15
<daftykins> doesn't seem like i've been away from it all that long, but time to head back to bed :) g'night folks
<Bashing-om> sleep tight daftykins . No bed bugs to bite !
<Bashing-om> Our ranks are dwindling - as the world turns and sleep overtakes us - //  No EriC^^ has returned !
<nicomachus> Bashing-om: man, Childhood's End really draws you in right away. I'm only ~15 mins in but it's great so far.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: I was afraid that would happen .. but the commercials .. I just can not cope with them .
<nicomachus> lol, just grab it online tomorrow then. :)
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: I was caught wandering off channel .. IRT maldridge ; nope I would rather not hazard a guess on running a script of that nature. Never done it so do not know much .
<nicomachus> np, I think it's resolved. I just haven't messed around with cron jobs much so didn't want him to do it solely off my suggestion. Only tagged you because I knew you were somewhere close by.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Well I guess we will have to redefine 'close' as in only counts in Love, hand grenades and irc .
<nicomachus> ha
<pauljw> gnite all
<lotuspsychje> good morning guys
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
<EriC^^> what's up?
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: TJ- thinks that gtx 920m issue could be firmware efi GOP bug or something
<EriC^^> i see
<EriC^^> man fuck this weather
<EriC^^> it's so cold and gloomy too
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: yeah here also, grey and cold wind
<lotuspsychje> seems like it gonna be a gray xmass :p
<EriC^^> lol
<lotuspsychje> https://insights.ubuntu.com/2015/12/08/uavia-unveils-first-100-remotely-controlled-drones-powered-by-ubuntu/
<lotuspsychje> soon our world gonna look like half life2
<BluesKaj> 'Morning all
<MooDoo> morning
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon mates
 * TJ- waves
<lotuspsychje> hey TJ-
<BluesKaj> hi lotuspsychje, TJ-
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> lotuspsychje, what's happening today ?
<lotuspsychje> oh nothing much, just came in easy BluesKaj :p
<lotuspsychje> no big ubuntu news articles today neither
<lotuspsychje> OMGubuntu has become very lazy also
<lotuspsychje> 1 month nothing new
<BluesKaj> yeah, the devs are a bit stressed over a kubunt-devel with all the problems plasma 5.5 builds are giving
<lotuspsychje> ouch
<BluesKaj> but they are making good progress
<BluesKaj> IMO at least :-)
<TJ-> we have a GRUB CVE that upstream haven't addressed as yet; might get some folks asking about it. Might not get addressed before the Christmas holiday. http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/2015/CVE-2015-8370.html
<lotuspsychje> welcome slidinghorn
<lotuspsychje> slidinghorn: the idea behind it is, we do support much but never actually can talk in main
<lotuspsychje> so here we are
<slidinghorn> Thanks  -  I'll add this to my faves
<lotuspsychje> cool!
<lotuspsychje> slidinghorn: we discuss also here to get support better, or latest ubuntu news
<slidinghorn> Is there any talk of updating the ubottu information?  Some factoids are gone, and the usage info link is no good
<lotuspsychje> slidinghorn: there is a way to submit new factoid data, but ive tried it few times
<lotuspsychje> and never get changed..
<lotuspsychje> !factoid
<ubot5> Hi! I'm #ubuntu-discuss's favorite infobot, you can search my brain yourself at http://ubottu.com/factoids.cgi | Usage info: http://ubottu.com/devel/wiki/Plugins | Bot channels and general info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Bots | Make a clone of me: /msg ubot5 botclone
<OerHeks> with all these transits (like SystemD), lots of info is version-dependend
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/arnold-s-t-800-terminator-uses-the-linux-kernel-4-1-5-released-today-497653.shtml
<lotuspsychje> lol
<slidinghorn> lotuspsychje: that's awesome
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> bbl guys city walk
<daftykins> those pesky other distro runners
<daftykins> ugh, i was trying to connect up each pin of a bank of 6 ports on this patch panel i have, but they don't reliably have continuity from the first to the 6th
<daftykins> looks like i'm gonna have to send it back =/
<nicomachus> it's an ubuntu variant just like lubuntu or kubuntu, isn't it?
<daftykins> no whole other distro
<slidinghorn> lol
<slidinghorn> he hid it for a while
<nicomachus> uname -a gave: Linux ghost 3.13.0-24-generic #47-Ubuntu SMP Fri  May 2 23:31:42 UTC 2014 i686 i686 i686 GNU/Linux
<daftykins> yeah it's a derivative just like mint might call the packages ubuntu, or elementary would - because it is based on it, but isn't it
<nicomachus> ah I see.
<nicomachus> my mistake then.
<daftykins> OerHeks: hmm i was under the impression 32-bit runs faster on a 64-bit processor because it has twice the registers available
<daftykins> TJ-: what do you make of that claim?
<TJ-> huh? which claim?
<OerHeks> Nope, indeed twice the registers, and longer, but setting to 32 bit uses clockcycles too
<daftykins> TJ-: 32-bit OS faster or slower on a 64-bit CPU due to more registers?
<OerHeks> >> 64 bit processors should be sold with a minimum of 4 gb, to get full power/features. but 2 gb will do, some say it will run -0.5% ... but running 32 bit on a 64 bit processor also runs slower :-D
<TJ-> 32-bit executables on 64-bit are no different to on 32-bit; what is different is that in 'long' mode (64-bit) the CPU can read/write memory in larger chunks. 64-bit mode is much faster since 64-bit exectuables are compiled to use the extra registers, which are also twice as wide, and there are additional instructions available that are faster than the 32-bit equivalents
<OerHeks> but are they activated in a 32 bit os?
<TJ-> what 'they'?
<OerHeks> tose additional instructions/extensions
<TJ-> No
<OerHeks> *those
<daftykins> does a 32-bit OS only make use of the same number of registers in 32-bit mode then, or can it make use of each as two?
<OerHeks> that is what i thought too.
<OerHeks> more registers.
<daftykins> argh typo
<TJ-> the OS is built to an architecture; a 32-bit build knows about the 32-bit registers and instructions only
<slidinghorn> fyi.... _ryan_ is me...just didn't wanna miss the conversation while I had a cigarette, lol
<daftykins> hmm think i don't understand the makeup of a processor well enough then
<daftykins> however i must head out the door, so bbl o/
<TJ-> This is why we have lowest-common-denominator builds.. You recall when we stopped building for any CPU that doesn't support PAE, and MMX
<OerHeks> and there are differences in amd and intel too, but i stopped noting the differences
<TJ-> our 'i386' packages are actually 'i686' builds
<TJ-> The reason ARM is so powerful for its relative size it is more RISC oriented and has always had lots of registers to avoid needing to use memory read/writes - so for example function calls can pass all arguments in registers, rather than on the memory stack
<_ryan_> I need to learn how all this stuff actually works...my eyes just crossed a little lol
<pauljw> hi everyone
<slidinghorn> howdy pauljw
<pauljw> hi slidinghorn
<BluesKaj> hey pauljw, slidinghorn
<slidinghorn> how is everyone during this brief moment of silence in the support channel?  lol
<pauljw> BluesKaj, :)
<BluesKaj> fine here, just not enough sleep
<pauljw> too funny, almost exactly what i was typing
 * slidinghorn hasn't slept and has to leave for work in like 40 min
<pauljw> ouch
<slidinghorn> luckily it should be a short shift...opening bartender on a tuesday afternoon/evening usually gets out by 8 or 9
<pauljw> ah, not bad
<BluesKaj> wide awake at 4AM, been dozing a bit in my easy chair, but think I'll heading for a nap soon
<pauljw> :)
<slidinghorn> now that sounds like a plan I could abide to
<pauljw> bbl guys, just informed that i need to make a run to the store... :)
<BluesKaj> gonna switch over to 14.04, this plasma 5 desktop is slow and clunky after the latest frameworks ppa upgrade it's still missing some kios I think..brb
<BluesKaj> that's better, smooth and fast
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: I see you are diving in deep once more . Amazing what we learn that-a-way - olo - .
<OerHeks> if a client can explain the issue, he could fix it himself, 9 out of 10 times
<nicomachus> idk why I even started to try...
<nicomachus> andddd he left.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Inquiring minds want to know ? You love this operating system of choice, and want to share the joy ? Doing your bit for the benifit of humanity ?
<nicomachus> bored at work, 9 times out of 10. lol
<nicomachus> also I like the challenge.
<Bashing-om> Like one told me long ago .. beats doing jug saw puzzles .
<nicomachus> ha! true.
<Bashing-om> MonkeyDust: o/ ; Welcome to the party ... seems slow presently . ( 15 minutes on here ) .
<MonkeyDust> oi
<Bashing-om> While it is slow - Smokers Draw one !
<OerHeks> CoÂ² make trees grow, so those globalwarmingdudes are wrong
<nicomachus> Noooo I just quit! Don't tempt me.
 * OerHeks smokes another sigaret & combs his long blond curly hair
 * Bashing-om brushes curley locks back out of eyes
<OerHeks> it is sÃ³Ã³Ã³ boring in #ubuntu, even the trolls stay away
<nicomachus> here you go, from another channel:
<nicomachus> <+DANtheBEASTman> ok, bit of a challenge here. i'm on my laptop at work  running a live cd. i have my external HDD. i want to  make an arch install to my exthdd while i'm here that I  can then basically rsync to my desktop at home where i  have no internet
<nicomachus> could he install on the external HDD and then just dd it over to the laptop?
<OerHeks> most of the times, laptops fail to boot from ext hdd
<BluesKaj> a usb stick would solve the problem
<OerHeks> and in ubuntu one could set softwarecenter to download only, maybe arch can do that too
<nicomachus> I think he's intentionally making it harder on himself...
<BluesKaj> dd the iso to the stick then install at home off the stick
<OerHeks> let him download the whole arch repo :-D
<OerHeks> to be sure
<nicomachus> he's always complaining about bandwidth. :/ poor guy probably has strict limits. gets mad when people link to imgur without directly linking the image, stuff like that.
<BluesKaj> why arch anyway it's a pita to install and doesn't have any advantages over ubuntu
<daftykins> nicomachus: +1 to making it harder, typical users ;)
<daftykins> heh sounds like what that guy needs is an estate agent
<nicomachus> because it's #rice... they're mostly script kiddies and think that the harder a distro is to install/use, the better it must be.
<OerHeks> when the 1st time i seen dsl internet 256/64 .. i was amazed :-D
<Bashing-om> If you need to download Ubuntu packages using another machine or OS, check the desired packages in Synaptic and select File > Generate package download cript. See also APTonCD . Linux, if it is hard, you are doing something wrong .
 * EriC^^ heads for the #ubuntu-discuss kitchen
<Bashing-om> ^ again ? ! ( an he gains not an once ) .
<EriC^^> :P
<OerHeks> chicken!
<Bashing-om> Black forest ham .
<nicomachus> steakkkk
<Bashing-om> Did Paul and BluesKaj both look in the #ubuntu-discuss fridge/pantry, and come away disappointed ? recon ?
<OerHeks> chicken :-D
<nicomachus> such circular conversations.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Uh huh .. why can it not be " because we said it " ; and let that be the end of it !
<daftykins> mm i think ikonia is having a daftykins-style bad day
<nicomachus> someone give him a cookie.
<daftykins> oh no that'd be the wrong meaning :D
<nicomachus> did anyone suggest the mini.iso for this guy, or would that be the wrong route?
<nicomachus> I missed the beginning
<OerHeks> sure i did, mini iso and  --no-install-recommends
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Best I recall was recommended, and he threw a fuss at that suggestion .
<OerHeks> but hey, i am just an ubuntu member, hips
<daftykins> nicomachus: the minimalist one? yeah i did
<daftykins> i think the task got sidelined by the argument though ;)
<nicomachus> "lovely"
 * daftykins sings the 'you're wrong' song
<daftykins> this is beginning to feel like pulling teeth
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Uh huh , but what else are we going to do on a beautiful suuny Tuesday - us gluttons for punishment - .
<daftykins> :D
<OerHeks> wow , with the Zorin Look Changer > Windows 7 XP GNOME2 Mac OS X Unity Windows 2000-interface
<daftykins> i'm trying to remember if that was the distro some school kid made
<nicomachus> "Thanks to Zorin OS's immunity to Windows viruses you will never have to worry about any of that nasty malware."
<nicomachus> >never have to worry about malware...
<nicomachus> I can't trust a distro that would say that.
<daftykins> if you take it at face value though, it makes sense... it's clearly geared toward newbies too
<MonkeyDust> i only trust the government, because they told me that i can
<daftykins> MonkeyDust: :)
 * nicomachus is the government
<daftykins> did anyone recently say that they only had luck with nvidia optimus setups when that intel update was also applied from ubuntu-drivers ?
<daftykins> i forget what that helped with
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Then also there are a few cases requiring the PCI data bases to be updated for new hardware .
<daftykins> hrmm might need to see what lspci sees then
<daftykins> ok, i really have to cook though so if anyone spots that user coming back do feel free to take over
<daftykins> (tanepiper)
<Bashing-om> k
<nicomachus> time to go get my shining locks cut off
<daftykins> :O
<Tarminquay> http://ark.intel.com/products/77481/Intel-Core-i3-4130T-Processor-3M-Cache-2_90-GHz
<Tarminquay> http://ark.intel.com/products/76609/Intel-Core-i3-4020Y-Processor-3M-Cache-1_50-GHz
<Tarminquay> Which chip is better?
<daftykins> this isn't a support chan :)
<Tarminquay> It's a discussion channel.
<Tarminquay> Where do you suggest I go?
<OerHeks> http://www.cpu-world.com/Compare/208/Intel_Core_i3_Mobile_i3-4020Y_vs_Intel_Core_i3_i3-4130T.html
<daftykins> you should've given a compare link too
<Tarminquay> How come the 2.9 GHz chip costs so much less?
<Tarminquay> They want $120 vs $280.
<daftykins> the T is a more capable part
<Tarminquay> Is it much faster?
<daftykins> that's because Y's are for mobile.
<Tarminquay> The T costs much less.
<daftykins> http://ark.intel.com/compare/77481,76609
<daftykins> here's what you should've linked
<Tarminquay> Both the boxes utilizing these chips are very small.
<OerHeks> t = top
<daftykins> faster graphics on the T
<Tarminquay> 2.9 GHz is way higher than 1.5 GHz
<Tarminquay> shouldn't that mean the chip is way faster?
<Tarminquay> The T costs almost 1/3 less than the Y. That's just because the Y runs so much cooler?
<Tarminquay> Let me show you the boxes with these chips.
<daftykins> i'm struggling to understand why you can't get that information from the above links
<Tarminquay> http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=7_1203_1157&item_id=074291
<Tarminquay> This has the T.
<OerHeks> 6watt vs 35w
<Tarminquay> http://www.directcanada.com/products/?sku=26671105765
<Tarminquay> This has the Y.
<Tarminquay> Notice that they're about the same price.
<Tarminquay> In fact I found the T unit for the same price exactly as that Y unit there.
<daftykins> the T is more capable due to its' being designed for a less power consumption conscious use-case
<Tarminquay> Yes, the T unit has a fan. The Y unit is fanless.
<Tarminquay> I just wonder if I would notice a difference in daily operations
<daftykins> this is obvious from the TDP
<Tarminquay> I don't do any gaming or anything intensive.
<daftykins> even the T would be basic and suited toward office apps at the most
<Tarminquay> The Y would struggle on even office aps?
<Tarminquay> apps*
<daftykins> 4GB is pretty rubbish for RAM in 2015
<daftykins> why are you looking at these small devices?
<Tarminquay> I want a smaller unit.
<Tarminquay> Just don't want a big noisy box.
<Tarminquay> I can always add another 4 GB of ram for negligible cost.
<daftykins> do you already own a display you'd intend to use with it?
<Tarminquay> yes
<daftykins> well you'd have to check they have two SODIMM slots
<Tarminquay> They do.
<daftykins> what input cable types does said display have?
<Tarminquay> HDMI
<daftykins> all set there then
<Tarminquay> You think I can spend my money better on a larger unit without going for a noisy full-sized box?
<Tarminquay> Like I say I don't need a lot of power.
<daftykins> yes because noisy is defined by what's inside it
<Tarminquay> Which box would you recommend?
<daftykins> i'd recommend going to ##hardware because this channel is for ubuntu discussion
<Tarminquay> I'm already there
<Tarminquay> but it's pretty useless.
<daftykins> yeah i've heard they're not too friendly :)
<daftykins> sadly another channel being useless does not change the topic of another :)
<Tarminquay> Ubuntu discussion isn't happening here anyway.
<Tarminquay> By the way, I am putting Ubuntu MATE on my new unit.
<Tarminquay> Thoughts on that distro?
<Tarminquay> I'm going with 15.10.
<daftykins> DE is a personal choice
<daftykins> you folks that try to bend a channel's purpose to your own needs, it's highly selfish
<Tarminquay> The DEs are developed by different people
<Tarminquay> they're more different than you might think.
<Tarminquay> Which DE are you using>?
<daftykins> explorer.exe
<Tarminquay> The Y chip is much more expensive than the T chip.
<Tarminquay> That tells me that the unit with the Y chip is a better value
<Tarminquay> given that they're priced the same.
<daftykins> wrong.
<Tarminquay> $280 vs $117. Says it right on the Intel page.
<daftykins> we've already said our piece, if you still don't understand, then you'll need to do some reading
<Tarminquay> $280 is pretty costly for a CPU.
<Tarminquay> The whole box is selling for $420 with 4 GB of ram and a 64 GB SSD.
<Tarminquay> And that's $420 Canadian.
<Tarminquay> The $280 is American.
<Tarminquay> Hell of a buy it seems.
<daftykins> those prices are not what end up in systems, you can't just convert and subtract
<daftykins> a Y would be utterly rubbish
<Tarminquay> The manufacturer has to buy the CPUs from Intel.
<daftykins> i'm going to stop replying now
<daftykins> sorry but you don't understand.
<Tarminquay> You sound like you got a tack up yourr ass, dafty.
<OerHeks> y is soldered on
<Tarminquay> Somebody want to remove the tack from his ass?
<Tarminquay> OerHeks: Meaning what?
<TJ-> Tarminquay: don't be rude; daftykins has already provided plenty of advice outside the remit of this channel
<daftykins> all the other Canadians i've met on freenode have been ace :) you let them down by being rude and trying to make something personal
<Tarminquay> "No more desktops for me / would rather eat potato chips and have a heart attack"
<Tarminquay> Why would he say that?
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-12-16
<daftykins> i'm being asked what EGL dev libs are needed to compile software that depends on it - and whether mesa is required
<daftykins> or whether mesa is the only choice o0
<slidinghorn> aw man, i missed fun stuff? Dang job...hows everyones night so far?
<TJ-> daftykins: there's some mesa-egl libs
<TJ-> libegl1-mesa
<TJ-> so for building against it I'd guess libegl1-mesa-dev
<daftykins> yeah he reckons they're the ones now, is concerned their going on might break VDPAU with nvidia though :D
<daftykins> TJ-: thanks :>
<TJ-> well nvidia's implementation is prorietary
<Bashing-om> daftykins: IRT ana_ " ii  linux-headers-generic-lts-quantal  " But with all trusty kernels installed . " iU " for standards > care advised .
<daftykins> TJ-: perhaps ana doesn't have pastebinit installed? could we just go ahead with a dpkg -r <headers package> or are you worried sda6 may be the true root partition and it'd make it moot?
<daftykins> Bashing-om: good spot! looks like before this inodes trouble someone was trying to apply an older HWE
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Been bit a couple of times .. I look now before I leap .
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> all the HWE methods are still messy imo, be great if there was a tool that handled it
<TJ-> daftykins: I think sda3 might be /boot/
<daftykins> hrmm
<nicomachus> TJ-: what do the () do on that cat command? just enclosing what is set to the pastebin?
<daftykins> at 14GB? :O
<daftykins> yeah it's encapsulation of commands i think, i've seen TJ- write multiple then they both get performed :>
<nicomachus> ah cool.
<daftykins> in my head i think of it as the fish pastebin! :D
<TJ-> nicomachus: yes, it's a subshell who's results are delivered to pastebinit via a file-descriptor; as far as pastebinit is concerned it is actually opening a file the same as if it had /var/log/some.log
<TJ-> nicomachus: I use it that way rather than pipes because the command being first makes it clear to the user what we're expecting them to do
<TJ-> nicomachus: plus it's easy to run multiple commands in the one pastebin result
<daftykins> re: ana's latest, i think we're good to go
<daftykins> it's a dualboot
<TJ-> yes but why is sda3 and sda6 both mounted to / - one is overlaying/obscuring the other
<TJ-> the order and size suggests sda3 is supposed to be /boot/
<daftykins> hang on first time we got - http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/14041056/
<daftykins> i don't know why the inode one is wonky but i think it's ok
<TJ-> Oh, so sda3 is / and sda6 is /home/ ?
<TJ-> how the heck has that got messed up?
<daftykins> the df -i paste is confusing :D
<daftykins> huzzah a confirming paste of mounts at last
<TJ-> if only 319M has been used on /home/ what the heck is installed to use up 12G on the root fs?
<nicomachus> manually sticking stuff that should be in /home/ into /?
<nicomachus> Documents, Music, etc
<daftykins> :D
<TJ-> possibly, or something like a bittorrent client storing stuff under /var/
<daftykins> i think making some inode breathing room will help for starters
<daftykins> though i think the utopic HWE is a mistake now
<TJ-> definitely
<Bashing-om> daftykins: IRT ana_ / been my experience one wants to pull the image files prior to purging the headers (??) .
<daftykins> mmm i guess we'll hear about that one very shortly XD
<TJ-> you could give the command as in ... remove linux-{image,headers}-3.3.13.0-{33,34,35,36,37}-generic or whatever the ABI numbers are
<Tarminquay> How much faster is Xubuntu vs Xubuntu MATE?
<Tarminquay> Only noticeable on archaic hardware?
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> TJ-: sounds good, far better than what i would have done
<daftykins> i think i'm going to head off actually, i'm in a zombie state right now - sleep required
<TJ-> it can be hairy ensuring multiple expansions will generate the correct set; I play with it using 'echo ...'
<TJ-> same here, night all
<daftykins> :D
<Tarminquay> I would prefer if possible purchasing from Amazon.
<Tarminquay> I prefer doing business with them because they give no-hassle returns.
<Tarminquay> Wrong chan
<daftykins> you're damn right
<Tarminquay> LOOL.
<Tarminquay> Somebody shirked their duty and failed to remove that tack.
<daftykins> it's actually you who's butthurt, because you couldn't get what you want here despite being given lots of free off topic responses
<daftykins> so i suggest you discover that you are entitled to nothing on this network - and be thankful for what assistance you did receive
<daftykins> growing up a fair amount would also do wonders
<slidinghorn> + a lot...definitely more than 1
<slidinghorn> I really need to brush up on vms, apparently. Lots of questions involve them
<nicomachus> I use one at work to tool around with ubuntu, but don't have a ton of experience with them.
<nicomachus> I set up a xenial VM last week. that was fun.
<nicomachus> just got a... pleasant pm. https://imgur.com/9pn2GPs
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: ^^ a task for #ubuntu-ops ?
<nicomachus> yea I sent them that screenshot. he's already logged off, and I don't see him in any of the user lists, but it's been reported. Â¯\_(ã)_/Â¯
<nicomachus> IP is in Amsterdam, so maybe he's just cold and bitter.
<Bashing-om> some people, if they are not happy .. do what they can to make sure no one else is happy .
<nicomachus> spose so.
<Tarminquay> http://www.amazon.com/Gigabyte-i3-4010U-Barebones-Thickness-GB-BXi3H-4010/dp/B00I05NH9S/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1450235662&sr=8-5&keywords=gigabyte+nuc#customerReviews
<Tarminquay> "Get the best, Cry Once"
<Tarminquay> Looks like everyone should have at least one of these.
<Tarminquay> I'm placing my order for the i3 5010U.
<Tarminquay> I'm gearing it up with Ubuntu MATE for the perfect compromise between desktop elegance and responsiveness.
<Bashing-om> Tarminquay: ^ then you best read up on a core install and xfce for the DE .
<Tarminquay> Why?
<Bashing-om> desktop elegance and responsiveness. // You can have it your way .
<Tarminquay> XFCE isn't as nice as MATE.
<Tarminquay> the i3 with plenty of ram can comfortably handle MATE.
<Tarminquay> What is a core install?
<Bashing-om> Tarminquay: Install a kernel and start building .
<Tarminquay> That's ridiculous.
<nicomachus> Bashing-om: are you following this issue with chull?
<Tarminquay> The MATE version of Ubuntu is all I need.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Yeah some what . But I am not familiar with the app .
<nicomachus> it's just a dock... but she says she removed it, got an error saying it wasn't installed, and then the sidebar icons were removed.
<OerHeks> .. and it was not installed at all :-D
<OerHeks> strange story
<Bashing-om> Tarminquay: Grest . Good 'nuff is good 'nuf .. but you did say performance !
<Bashing-om> I find it real hard to use something that is not installed .
<nicomachus> cue twilight zone theme
<Tarminquay> Bashing-om: Ubuntu MATE is good enough for me.
<nicomachus> pro-tip: realtek wifi drivers + ubuntu != happiness
<Tarminquay> You think that Gigabyte box is going to be troublesome with Ubuntu?
<Tarminquay> Gigabit LAN (Realtek RTL8111G)
<Tarminquay> Here's the card.
<nicomachus> idk, does it use realtek drivers for wifi? because my wifi dongle does and I'd throw it in the trash if I could
<nicomachus> oh I haven't heard about issues with that one. rtl8188 and rtl8192 are the bad ones.
<Tarminquay> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1022411
<Tarminquay> Issues back in 2008.
<Tarminquay> It's a pretty standard product, nicomachus, this Gigabyte i3.
<Tarminquay> I don't see why a mainstream distro like Ubuntu would have any issues with the components.
<Tarminquay> If it has any issues the developers need to get on them ASAP because this is not an obscure product.
<Tarminquay> It's a top selle.r
<nicomachus> chull is starting to sound very, very broken.
<nicomachus> ok, maybe my brain is broken.
<OerHeks> my wallet is broken :-(
<OerHeks> lost 2 dimes today
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: maybe is broken, but you are not . so far no fault with your logic .
<Tarminquay> Hi guys.
<Tarminquay> Any hardware talk in here?
<Tarminquay> I'm a Ubuntu MATE user..
<Tarminquay> Wouldn't use anything else.
<Tarminquay> http://www.itxcanada.com/index.php?p=product&id=1373&parent=129
<Tarminquay> http://www.ncix.com/detail/zotac-zbox-ci520nano-p-u-core-i3-4020y-4gb-9a-105765-1241.htm
<Tarminquay> Which box do you like better and why?
<Tarminquay> These are two very competitive boxes.
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<dotpixis> lotuspsychje: good morning
<lotuspsychje> hey dotpixis
<Tarminquay> http://vishveshtech.blogspot.ca/2015/06/gigabyte-brix-s-gb-bxi3h-5010-intel-i3.html
<Tarminquay> I bought this box.
<Tarminquay> It was rated 10 out of 10.
<lotuspsychje> hey Tarminquay
<Tarminquay> Hi lotuspsychje
<Tarminquay> Do you like the Box I bought?
<lotuspsychje> lets c
<lotuspsychje> Tarminquay: cool, barebone
<lotuspsychje> Tarminquay: gonna put ubuntu on it?
<Tarminquay> Yes.
<Tarminquay> Actually, I bought it from ITXCanada
<Tarminquay> it comes with 8GB of ram and 120 GB SSD.
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> Tarminquay: how much did it cost you
<Tarminquay> $540 + tax.
<lotuspsychje> hmmm bit pricey
<Tarminquay> $30 shipping.
<Tarminquay> It's Canadian dollars.
<lotuspsychje> how much is that in euro or dollars?
<Tarminquay> Well, maybe $400 USD.
<lotuspsychje> kk
<lordievader> Good morning.
<lotuspsychje> hey lordievader
<lotuspsychje> all ok mate?
<lordievader> Morning lotuspsychje
<lordievader> Doing okay here, how are you?
<lotuspsychje> fine thank you
<lotuspsychje> reading bit news
 * lordievader is reading cron-mail
<lotuspsychje> :p
<bonzibuddy> hello
<lordievader> Bonzi? Wow, haven't seen that one in a long time ;)
<lotuspsychje> hi bonzibuddy
<lordievader> Why the nick though?
<bonzibuddy> lordievader: because i can :D
<lordievader> ... XD
<Tarminquay_> Thoughts?
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
 * daftykins groans
 * OerHeks blups
<daftykins> what's a blup? :D
<OerHeks> bubble of air
<daftykins> ah har
<daftykins> mmm warm all butter croissant and pan au chocolate for lunch
<daftykins> *chocolat maybe
<nicomachus> a lot of the scopes were removed from xenial on Monday. Musique, Clementine, etc. all the media scopes. I'm guessing online will be next.
<OerHeks> i think it is a great move, that amazon-thingy, let people be aware of their data
<BluesKaj> amazon is a pita email spam-wise,  but we find shopping online so darn convenient that I just put up with it
<nicomachus> signing up for Micro Center emails was the best thing I ever did. those guys have some great sales.
<nicomachus> hahahaha, have you guys ever done "apt-get moo"?
<BluesKaj> yeah we have a simiar store here in Canada, NCIX ...good deals and fast delivery
<daftykins> i figured there was a whiff in here today still ;)
 * OerHeks smells a husky
<daftykins> :D
<TJ-> After-hectic-noon :D
<OerHeks> hi TJ-
<daftykins> \o
<daftykins> aww finally got a number for the sub repair but no answer
<TJ-> I've got a working talking mobo now, so can use it to fix the others :)
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> nicomachus: i wonder if that user's situation is as simple as using the wrong account / permissions preventing settings change in ~/ ?
<lotuspsychje> good evening mates
<daftykins> \o
<nicomachus> daftykins: good thought. any way to verify that tweak tool has the right perms?
 * lotuspsychje is updating his bq to OTA 8.5
<daftykins> nicomachus: an ls -al ~/ would show whether any of the config paths are owned by another user, often we get users running 'sudo startx' then trashing their home perms
<lotuspsychje> and updated xenial box also
<daftykins> lotuspsychje: :)
<lotuspsychje> hey daftykins
<TJ-> if you want to locate files NOT owned by the user, do "find $HOME ! -uid $(id -u) -ls"
<lotuspsychje> hey eric
<lotuspsychje> hey TJ-
<lotuspsychje> hey OerHeks
<nicomachus> hmm... permissions look fine, daftykins
<daftykins> well there are two folders there that at the root are owned by root instead of the user
<daftykins> but yeah don't seem to be relevant ones, i'd try what TJ- said to be sure
<lotuspsychje> alot of news today: http://linux.softpedia.com/
<EriC^^> hey lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey mate
<EriC^^> how's it going?
<lotuspsychje> fine tnx and you?
<EriC^^> great thanks
<EriC^^> wow 39
<EriC^^> we're becoming a cult :D
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> yeah i keep inviting friendly guys :p
<lotuspsychje> and alot of regulars forget to auto add to favs also :p
<EriC^^> haha
<lotuspsychje> nono its not you :p
<EriC^^> lol
<lotuspsychje> monkey and ioria
<EriC^^> :D
<lotuspsychje> !inof linux-image-generic xenial
<ubot5> lotuspsychje: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<lotuspsychje> !info linux-image-generic xenial
<ubot5> linux-image-generic (source: linux-meta): Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version 4.3.0.2.5 (xenial), package size 2 kB, installed size 11 kB
<lotuspsychje> 4.3 :p
<EriC^^> nice
<lotuspsychje> and a new grub exploit out there: http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/usn-2836-1/
<lotuspsychje> all update to latest :p
<TJ-> nothing major
<TJ-> only affects folks that set a password on their grub.cfg
<lotuspsychje> ah
<lotuspsychje> good to know TJ-
<TJ-> I got Mark to push out a fix yesterday
<lotuspsychje> lol
<TJ-> they were going to leave it until after the winter holiday
<daftykins> TJ-: in the pics of your office i didn't see the red phone to Canonical HQ ;)
<OerHeks> red headset
<lotuspsychje> lordievader: you are the 40th user!!! you have wonthe price today: http://weknowyourdreams.com/image.php?pic=/images/apple/apple-05.jpg
<nicomachus> it's #DD4814 Orange, daftykins
<daftykins> :>
<EriC^^> "you can do it Mark.. *heavy breathing* ho - ho - ho ... push... ho- ho - ho push.."
<lotuspsychje> lol
<EriC^^> i think i see the head, one last big push mark
<daftykins> EriC^^: i didn't realise he had to birth every mythical creature each release was named after...
<EriC^^> lol
<lordievader> Err... Okay?
<TJ-> Security team lead Marc (not Mark) Deslauriers
<lotuspsychje> lol
<daftykins> d'aww that's our entertainment ruined ;)
<nicomachus> well i don't care if it's ruined, I made a render of TJ-'s emergency phone: http://i.imgur.com/B4IScj7.png
<daftykins> :D
<nicomachus> sigh... vbox still leaking memory.
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: have you tried launching from terminal?
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: host is W7
<lotuspsychje> right
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: maybe your w7 is full of spyware :p
<lotuspsychje> and giving memory to rootkits and malware
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: that would be a very serious problem indeed. :) but it's not.
<daftykins> don't let that meanie lotus be nasty about Windows ;)
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: open taskmanager while you vbox and checkout?
<lotuspsychje> and open a netsta
<lotuspsychje> netstat
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: I have it's memory usage graphed in performance monitor
<slidinghorn> so I just logged in to find some jerk sent me a really rude pm from the support channel...not sure who they are or why they felt the need to do that, but yeah....good morning, I guess, lol
<EriC^^> did it involve the word "bastard" ?
<lotuspsychje> slidinghorn: wich one?
<nicomachus> slidinghorn: I got that last night.
<daftykins> slidinghorn: check they're still active and report them to #ubuntu-ops
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: i mserious mate, scan your system with malwarebytes and spybot
<slidinghorn> EriC^^: yeah...
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: I assure you, it's clean.
<daftykins> lotuspsychje: that's not gonna make virtualbox use RAM ;)
<EriC^^> slidinghorn: i get those sometimes
<OerHeks> report them in #ubuntu-ops
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: if other things eat his ram
<slidinghorn> so weird....ok
<EriC^^> some guy picks random people who are active in the channel and starts pm'ing
<OerHeks> got a spam recently to install a firewall with malware :-D
<OerHeks> no, he was not in the channel at all
<OerHeks> :-D
<daftykins> how wude
<daftykins> they've... adapted Â¬_Â¬
<OerHeks> maybe has been, harvesting.
<daftykins> ah wb Bashing-om o/
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: i once had a customer, that bought antivirus 2007, payed 60 $ for it, and had 200 malwares inside
<lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om
<EriC^^> hey Bashing-om
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Howdy - procrastinating, but I will get back to my chores here directly . // EriC^^ How goes your world ?
<OerHeks> ehh ..you sold antivirus with 200 malwares?
<OerHeks> gotcha
<EriC^^> Bashing-om: good good :)
<daftykins> :D yep all ok here
<daftykins> up and out early tomorrow to start cabling up a house for network and phone
<nicomachus> rebooting.
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: Ya finding anything for gainful emploment ?
<EriC^^> Bashing-om: not really
<Bashing-om> daftykins: New construction .. or are you mouseing the cabling ?
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: the guy bought it online somewhere
<daftykins> a friends an electrician so he's put it all in, i've only got to terminate :)
<daftykins> just some folks with a house that they've stripped back to the bare floorboards
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: Bummer, but it turms up when you least expect it .
<EriC^^> yeah that's true
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Test pprior to covering it all up, huh ?
<daftykins> well nothing will be final as they're moving around the house a lot, mostly switching one temporary setup for another temporary setup to keep them online etc :)
<nicomachus> OerHeks: setting to +r might hav helped with the massive flood of spam that came through last night.
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Ouch . Time consumming in making all the switching about . Hope they pay well !
<daftykins> should mean more and more work really :D annoyingly the patch panel i ordered in has to be sent back so now i have to wait for another one
<nicomachus> vbox is so weird.
<daftykins> hmm 3.13.0-73 for trusty
 * slidinghorn snickers but composes self
<daftykins> about what?
<daftykins> also i do like a good Snickers bar
<slidinghorn> I was being mean...someone told another to go to /etc/grub.d/ and they asked if it was an IRC channel
<daftykins> that *was* pretty bad
<daftykins> i wonder what they would've done if told to go /home ...
<slidinghorn> "I'm already there...sitting in my living room as we speak!"
<Bashing-om> daftykins: 3.13.0-73 hit my mirror this morning when I logged onto the system I upgraded .
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> the update notification at login seems a bit broken on mine
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Honestly .. I run bare essentials . Minimal automation - My habit is 1st thing check for updates when logging back on . Then again your morror may not have caught up yet .
<daftykins> gb.archive has actually been oddly slow for me of late
<daftykins> but yeah who knows when it got them :D
<Bashing-om> daftykins: I was using a university's mirror site, I giess the students kept the server up .. was generally a week behind .. then started having lots of access problems .. last time it went down for our ubuntu repo after 4 days I swapped mittor sites . This one I have now is fast in syncing up with mother .
<Bashing-om> mittor/mirror *
<daftykins> pesky students :D
<nicomachus> well, vbox mem leaks seem to be related to 3D acceleration... not sure exactly what yet, though.
<nicomachus> self-driving car running on ubuntu :D
<nicomachus> http://www.bloomberg.com/features/2015-george-hotz-self-driving-car/
<daftykins> *kernel panic*
<OerHeks> grub backslash :-D
<EriC^^> *kernel rage*
<EriC^^> *GTA mode initiated*
<daftykins> lane changed to: pavement
<nicomachus> Wow. during the test with the reporter, the reporter asks what it felt like the first time Holtz got it to work.
<nicomachus> Holtz replies: âDude,â he says, âthe first time it worked was this morning.â
<nicomachus> terrifying.
<lotuspsychje> ooo 42
<lotuspsychje> what did i win?
<nicomachus> wow, I didn't know you get on IRC from Tehran
<lotuspsychje> iran?
<nicomachus> reza_sam's IP traces to Tehran, Iran
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: yeah we had iran users before
<nicomachus> cool.
<daftykins> "run through a gantlet" comes to something when even bloomberg can't avoid typos
<daftykins> i had kind of pictured geohot achieving a bit more in life by this point though :P
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: found a purpose for your 2nd ssd yet mate?
<nicomachus> daftykins: seems like he's bounced around a bit trying to decide what he wants to do
<daftykins> newp not a clue!
<daftykins> almost tempting to just send it back, but it's not like Â£33 is much
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: extra fast ssd storage?
<daftykins> i don't need any storage tbh, already got 10TB on tap
<lotuspsychje> right :p
<lotuspsychje> send it to lotuspsychje by the post
<lotuspsychje> and ill transfer you money
<pauljw> hi everyone
<lotuspsychje> hey pauljw
<pauljw> :)
<Bashing-om> pauljw: Just in time .. the fun has started .
<pauljw> good... ;)
<slidinghorn> daftykins: You can ship international?  I can haz?
<lotuspsychje> lol
<Bashing-om> pauljw: Heads up ... It has been " Oh now you tell us " having to dig to get information .
<pauljw> oh boy
<lotuspsychje> hi philipballew
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: http://news.softpedia.com/news/kde-applications-15-12-launches-for-kde-plasma-5-5-with-spectacle-screenshot-tool-497730.shtml
<philipballew> lotuspsychje, what up dude?
<lotuspsychje> chillin and readin some uubntu news philipballew
<philipballew> lotuspsychje, anything good there?
<lotuspsychje> philipballew: there was some nice news today yes
<lotuspsychje> philipballew: xenial on 4.3 kernel
<lotuspsychje> xenial removed online search from dash
<philipballew>  hum, I should read that tonight then
<philipballew> seems odd
<lotuspsychje> new OTA 8.5 for phones out
<BluesKaj> lotuspsychje, thanks, kubuntu is a little behind in the plasma 5.5 packaging, but we anticipate the backports will have it soon
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: you may have been gone... did you see self-driving car that runs on ubuntu?
<lotuspsychje> yeah mcphail posted it in #ubuntu-touch
<nicomachus> nice.
<slidinghorn> that "smart_pussy" person was a bit of a troll yesterday...be advised
<lotuspsychje> ok tnx for the update slidinghorn
<nicomachus> can a nick break guidelines?
<lotuspsychje> yes nicomachus
<pauljw> got something against cats?  :)
<slidinghorn> I asked him to change it yesterday...he's apparently got it back to it
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks recently had to guideline a nick wich child related issues
<nicomachus> LOL. yesterday he changed it to dumb_dicks or something for a few mins.
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: some nicks have words against freenodes policy
<pauljw> ah geez, probably 12 years old..
<slidinghorn> waits for ban hammer to be drawn....
<pauljw> heheh...
<nicomachus> and the hammer comes down
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> also nice news source, for those who didnt know it yet: https://twitter.com/ubuntu
 * nicomachus wants to learn Russian just so he can type in that beautiful looking script.
<slidinghorn> was completely unaware of that (believe it or not)...thanks lotuspsychje
<nicomachus> how do I not have that on one of my tweetdeck lists...
<lotuspsychje> your welcome :p
<lotuspsychje> im not tweet or fb fan myself, but this ubuntu related can do it :p
<lotuspsychje> the less they know of me the better
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: did you try unity8 on xenial yet?
<slidinghorn> I love twitter...usually
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: no, it still doesn't work in Virtualbox.
<lotuspsychje> kk
<nicomachus> and I'm still afraid to put it on my laptop at home, because I'm starting a new job January 4th and that'll be my main workstation.
<nicomachus> I think. Unless they provide me a laptop. but I doubt they'll do that.
<daftykins> live session alone not cut it for a brief stab?
<lotuspsychje> yeah if work needs windowz
<lotuspsychje> better wait
<nicomachus> I suppose I could, daftykins. I'm using xenial in this VM right now, just not unity 8
<nicomachus> and I don't need windows for the job, lotuspsychje, but I do need stability.
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: yeah things still can break on xenial so
<nicomachus> exactly. :)
<lotuspsychje> but my desktop still looks pretty stable to me
<nicomachus> xenial's been pretty good on this VM except for the mem leaks.
<nicomachus> and of course a ton of PPAs don't have xenial releases yet.
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: talk to the vbox guys perhaps for windows related memory issues?
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: how much ram do you have?
<nicomachus> Been trying. it's likely something to do with the 3D Acelleration.
<nicomachus> 16gb on the host. 2gb allocated to the guest.
<nicomachus> but the guest hasn't used more than 500mb really at any time.
<lotuspsychje> try 4 gig on the guest?
<TJ-> There are several well-known, and some currently unfixed, large memory leaks with VirtualBox according to their bug-tracker. Some of them are triggered by using the Gui Manager, or Preview feature
<daftykins> being asked to look at some apple products tomorrow, blech
<nicomachus> TJ-: yea it looked like there were quite a few reported in VirtualBox 4.x, so I had hoped they were resolved in 5.0.10, but guess not. :/
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: doing what exactly?
<daftykins> just photo transfer from one iPad to another
<nicomachus> easy peasy.
<daftykins> not given i have to go to them
<daftykins> :P
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> your not going to steal their pics daftykins
<nicomachus> the fappening pt. 3, sponsored by daftykins
<lotuspsychje> lol
<daftykins> i don't find that funny
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: whats her name :p
<daftykins> my first thought was just throwing on iCloud photostream and letting that take care of it
<lotuspsychje> this is just why i love ubuntu touch
<lotuspsychje> nice file manager
<daftykins> that doesn't really help you going from one device to another though
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: to give you an idea of the mem leak issue: https://imgur.com/nXybZ9k
<lotuspsychje> the cloud
<TJ-> nicomachus: is the guest accessing shared folders on the host?
<nicomachus> TJ-: nope.
<nicomachus> just clipboard.
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: i would advise to store photo's on other media
<daftykins> that's not really the task at hand though
<TJ-> nicomachus: OK, apparently that's one known scenario. I found this (makes me wonder if you can test woth 5.0.8) https://www.virtualbox.org/ticket/14850
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: something like this? http://www.phototransferapp.com/ipad/
<daftykins> mmm not sure there's a need to go to a third party
<nicomachus> TJ-: found a download of it, I'll give it a shot in the morning. don't have much time left today.
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: im sure the store has something free like that
<daftykins> well it depends if the built in feature is a problem
<TJ-> nicomachus: right. This seems to be direct, tagged list: https://www.virtualbox.org/query?status=!closed&keywords=~leak
<TJ-> there's an interesting one where 3D compositor is enabled in the guest, caused by bad host graphics drivers: https://www.virtualbox.org/ticket/13526
<nicomachus> TJ-: this one seems most similar, minus the stuff about Dash being open: https://www.virtualbox.org/ticket/13526
<TJ-> LOL snap
<nicomachus> well.
<daftykins> randomnoob just asked me how to add "bs=2M" to the dd command :(
<TJ-> well you can test this one by disabling compositing - use a different DE to Unity for a test session
<daftykins> in a PM no less :(
<nicomachus> TJ-: by luck, I have i3 installed and somewhat configured on this VM...
<TJ-> ahhh, you need /umode +g
<TJ-> nicomachus: is it using compositing ?
<TJ-> Because the root of that bug would be - I infer - the host not corretly accounting for 'virtual' GPU memory for textures
<nicomachus> uhhh... I have 3D acceleration enabled inthe Vbox manager
<nicomachus> but it would absolutely make sense that my host has outdated graphics drivers. updates are pushed from sysadmin, who sucks.
<nicomachus> not that I could do better, but surely someone could.
<nicomachus> TJ-: I just realized I have the same graphics chipset as that bug report.
<daftykins> that's harsh, if i were in charge of a network of systems for a firm i would maintain what works, not do what these youngsters do of chasing version numbers
<daftykins> you've got to see your exact situation as niche as hell, right? :)
<nicomachus> well... all of our PC's are still running IE9, and need admin credentials (which someone gave me for some reason) to install ANYTHING else.
<daftykins> must be a web app or program that uses old *shrug*
<nicomachus> the admin credentials part makes sense, but not IE9. IE10 is EOL in January, so we severely need an update.
<daftykins> well some contracts are keeping IE8 going on XP *shrug*
<nicomachus> but the IT department manages thousands of different offices across the country, so I guess I can't blame them too much.
<nicomachus> rebooting
<lotuspsychje> nite nite all
<nicomachus> hmmm... installed the new intel drivers and it does seem to be more stable.
<nicomachus> if I open the dash it does jump up a bit, but falls right back down when I close it.
<TJ-> Result :)
<nicomachus> Yea, that seems to have resolved it so far. :) I'll know more tomorrow when I can let it run a bit longer. Thanks TJ-!
<nicomachus> !cookie | TJ-
<ubot5> TJ-: Wow! You're such a great helper, you deserve a cookie!
 * TJ- is too full :D
<daftykins> ooh speaking of cookies
<slidinghorn> ws that the sameerson again?
<daftykins> slidinghorn: so far you're winning the prize of most vague messages here in -discuss :)
<daftykins> however a little context would be handy!
<slidinghorn> ban hammer came out again in support
<daftykins> ah ok, pretty regular
<daftykins> when they're awake
<TJ-> migraines and programming don't mix; wish I felt tired!
<slidinghorn> I just figured it was the same one as before because of the nick...was another inappropriate one
<pauljw> sorry to hear that TJ- , my wife suffers with migraines, they're miserable...
<slidinghorn> TJ-: that sucks...I get those too from time to time
<pauljw> any of you guys played around in opensuse?  i installed it in vbox and it didn't seem to play well so tonight i'm trying it in kvm hoping it will be better.
<TJ-> yeah, I'll get over it; it's like having a twisted ankle when I want to run :)
<daftykins> mmm never tried i'm afraid
<TJ-> I started out on SuSE in the 1990s :)
<pauljw> :)
<daftykins> i must sleep! later folks o/
<pauljw> later...
<TJ-> night :)
<slidinghorn> later daftykins
<Bashing-om> Gnite daftykins
<pauljw> that's cool TJ- , i like to check things out, new to kvm too so this should be fun...
<TJ-> kvm is actually implemented fully in Qemu now, so KVM is 'just' the acronym for the Linux kernel virtual machine interface
<TJ-> I've been using kvm/qemu since 2007 in earnest. The one thing its not designed for is hosting GUIs that require accelerated 3D graphics
<TJ-> Intel and others are recently focusing on adding that functionality, both GPU PCI pass-through but also full virtualised guest GPUs
<pauljw> ah, good.  so far so good with my install, seems to be more responsive with kvm.
<pauljw> my laptop has plenty of horsepower
<TJ-> as long as the BIOS doesn't disable the CPUs VT extenstions the virtualisation overheard is minimal
<slidinghorn> I wonder how long it takes for freenode to allow more connections...the free shell I use hit their limit and has to ask for more
<pauljw> TJ-, kvm-ok says i'm good... :)
<TJ-> I had to hack Sony's back in 2007 due to BIOS lock-out
<TJ-> and about a week ago I helped daftykins unlock his Sony's VT; was a bit of deja-vu
<pauljw> fun
<pauljw> must say, suse shows nice fit and polish with gnome de, i like it.
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-12-17
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: IRT chull maybe reset to defaults ' delete ~/.dmrc , ~/.config/dconf and ~/.config/compiz-1 ' ??
<nicomachus> does that just restore unity to defaults?
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Yeah .. should . I look at it that a purge will not remove the config files for, /home . A reinstall still has the old config settings .
<nicomachus> not even purge --remove unity*?
<nicomachus> I'm curious about perms right now because settings in the system settings were "greyed out".
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Well, there is a bunch I do not know - I do not run unity - but I do understand that purging any app will not effect files on one's /home .
<nicomachus> ah ok. well after I see if she even has proper ownership of /home, I'll have her try that. thank you.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Permissions too could be an issue !
<nicomachus> oh boy.
<nicomachus> everything is "root"
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Uh Huh ! You hit that nail square !
<InkisJLane> Which flavor of Ubuntu is equivalent in terms of resource consumption to Chrome OS?
<pauljw> bbl
<nicomachus> InkisJLane: no idea, never used Chrome OS.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: IRT chull :: how bout ' sudo chown vir2:vir2 /home/vir2 ' to revert those permisions ?
<nicomachus> would that do it? I've been googling for a bit here and couldn't find that. haha
<InkisJLane> nicomachus: It's very light.
<InkisJLane> Remember, it's a browser OS.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Yeah .. will do it .. seen ya had a lapse of memory .
<nicomachus> InkisJLane: the lightest ubuntu flavors are Lubuntu and Kubuntu
<InkisJLane> Extremely optimized for what it does. Imagine if your browser was your whole OS.
<InkisJLane> Kubuntu?
<InkisJLane> That's KDE!
<InkisJLane> Are you crazy?
<nicomachus> some days.
<InkisJLane> Why would you say Kubuntu?
<nicomachus> because it's resource-light.
<nicomachus> compared to ubuntu with unity.
<InkisJLane> Doubt it.
<nicomachus> I totally meant xubuntu instead of kubuntu. oh well.
<Bashing-om> Gonna go jump in the rain locker, biab .
<Bashing-om> Back, do not know if better, but Wife thinks it is .
<nicomachus> lol. she tell you that you were smelly?
<Bashing-om> Let's say a very strtog g hint -- changed the bed sheets .
<nicomachus> Bashing-om: gonna have chull restore to default. so "sudo rm -r ~/.dmrc ~/.config/dconf ~/.config/compiz-1" should do it?
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Do not recall that the files are nested . Umm . bet -r not required . But shud do it .
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: !!! ouch .. we are in the /home directory .. NO sudo !
<nicomachus> ahhhh. hopefully caught her.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: I got distracted a bit here .. I should also have been quicker . sorry .
<nicomachus> np, I should have known. we just restored those perms...
<Bashing-om> :)
<nicomachus> looks like one of those was a directory. so -r?
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Should be able to reboot and the default files restored for unity .
<nicomachus> oooooooook. fingers crossed. she's been fighting this issue for a couple days now.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Yeah ... been tryimg to follow . I was pleased to no end that you found 'root' owning /home .
<nicomachus> :D
<nicomachus> not sure how that happened, but apparently this is her husband's PC and he had a prior stroke, so has some issues now.
<nicomachus> could the top bar issue be compiz? or is that contained within unity?
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Well ... Unity is a Compiz plugin. And unity has it's fingers deep in the system .
<Bashing-om> Is this 14.04 ? I forget ? ' sudo apt-get install dconf-tools ; dconf reset -f /org/compiz/ ; unity --reset-icons ; setsid unity ' . You can also run the following command to see the Compiz settings you have: ' dconf dump /org/compiz/ ' .
<nicomachus> ronburgendy is trolling, by the way.
<nicomachus> said he did "sudo rm -rf /*" and lost everything.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Yikes .. thanks , failed to make that connection .
<Tarminquay> Monk.
<nicomachus> idk why any time I paste anything into Irssi it automatically sends.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: A line feed at the end of what you are pasteing ?
<nicomachus> yea that's possible. I'll hunt it down later.
<Bashing-om> gotta call it .. later guys !
<nicomachus> later.
<slidinghorn> is also out....gf turns 21 @ midnight lol
<slidinghorn> good night everyone :)
<nicomachus> slidinghorn: have fun! :)
<nicomachus> good lord. 5-6 hours of troubleshooting, and chull just had the wrong DE selected from the login menu.
 * nicomachus is going to bed.
<nicomachus> that was quite the learning experience.
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<slidinghorn> morning lotuspsychje out with the lady friend for her 21st
<lotuspsychje> slidinghorn: nice to hear!
<slidinghorn> sitting at the bar right now...biut time to gi home
<slidinghorn> bout* & go*
<lotuspsychje> lol dont let a girl wait for irc
<lotuspsychje> get outa here!
<lotuspsychje> main repos suffer high load right know, just letting you guys know for support
<lotuspsychje> <blahdeblah> lotuspsychje: it only affects country mirrors which resolve to the main mirror
<lotuspsychje> <blahdeblah> boriseto, lotuspsychje: There are also juju charms which you can download to run your own mirror - search for ubuntu-repository-cache at jujucharms.com
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
<lordievader> Good morning.
<lotuspsychje> afternoon TJ-
<TJ-> morning :)
<lotuspsychje> main repos suffer high load right know, just letting you guys know for support
<lotuspsychje>  <blahdeblah> lotuspsychje: it only affects country mirrors which resolve to the main
<lotuspsychje> spread the word :p
<lotuspsychje> we had some users already not been able to sudo apt-get update this morning
<TJ-> I only see some slight problems around 0700 UTC on that
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: maybe its fixxed already yeah
<TJ-> see http://status.admin.canonical.com/613448
<lotuspsychje> ok cool
<TJ-> you can check status of any of the servers from the overview http://status.admin.canonical.com/
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: ok tnx
<lotuspsychje> TJ-:  i wonder why they dont put that in #ubuntu-mirrors topic
<TJ-> I think it's in the canonical-webadmin or where-ever; I forget the name of the channel now!
<lotuspsychje> aha interesting
<lotuspsychje> alis > lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> !alis > lotuspsychje
<ubot5> lotuspsychje, please see my private message
<TJ->  its #canonical-sysadmin
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: yeah just found :p
<TJ-> and its in the topic
<TJ-> I had to check my logs/ directory to remember it
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: would apt-get issues be asked there also?
<lotuspsychje> or still ubuntu-mirrors?
<TJ-> sysadmin is for underlying infrastruture - the mirrors are generally independently operated so not directly related to canonicals systems
<lotuspsychje> ok
<TJ-> I picked up another USB microscope camera today, and got 2 problems: 1. It has the wrong internals (the model is supposed to be a standard UVC but its a Microdia requiring the gspca_snc drivers) and 2. it doesn't show anything and I can't turn its LEDs on !! So, not sure if its just dead, or there's a driver issue. Annoyed now since I spent a lot of time researching to get one that both was UVC and
<TJ-> had continuous focus adjust
<lotuspsychje> not sure mate
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-1520841.html
<TJ-> it's not the LEDs, they're just a symptom, the entire camera doesn't seem to be working. I've had kernel debugging enabled and data transfers are taking place but it seems as if the camera is not providing data. It not being the UVC chipset I can't be 100% sure its broken
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: got a spare windows to test it on + its default software for it?
<TJ-> I don't use Windows :)
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: does cheese see something?
<lotuspsychje> i hope future ubuntu versions will more support external usb devices
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: or open vlc and change to /dev/video..
<TJ-> there's data packets but they're 'empty'
<lotuspsychje> !info gspca
<ubot5> Package gspca does not exist in vivid
<TJ-> it's not a userspace issue, it's either the driver or the camera
<TJ-> E.g. it supports JPEG mode but "[mjpeg @ 0x7f04a0029980] No JPEG data found in image"
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: did you load that gspca module?
<lotuspsychje> http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/Gspca
<TJ-> Don't need to; the modules are autoloaded by the system based on the device ID
<lotuspsychje> !info uvcvideo
<ubot5> Package uvcvideo does not exist in vivid
<lotuspsychje> grmbl
<TJ-> LOL
<lotuspsychje> http://www.ideasonboard.org/uvc/
<TJ-> I'm annoyed the maker seems to sell different chipsets under the same model number so its impossible, it seems, to know ahead of time whether it'll be UVC or not.
<lotuspsychje> aha
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: sudo apt-cache search uvc shows a few
<TJ-> UVC is the only way to go these days, makes things so much easier.
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: big list of macrodia's here: http://cateee.net/lkddb/web-lkddb/USB_GSPCA.html
<TJ-> OK, it's broken. Inside the lens housing it brings out 2 signals: GND and Vcc (3.3V) and that only has 0.3V on it
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: what have you been able to use to check?
<TJ-> multimeter
<lotuspsychje> kk
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> hey lotuspsychje
<TJ-> Oh! it works! seems like that voltage is for the LEDs only, so there must be a control somewhere to switch them on!
<lotuspsychje> oO
<TJ-> hmmm, so it works in JPEG mode, but the LED control seems to be missing, or else I just can't find it
<lotuspsychje> bbl city
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Hey, Did you get chull's display fixed from last night ?
<OerHeks> i think he did, yes
<OerHeks> still not sure where those missing panel bugs come from.
<Bashing-om> OerHeks: Great ... now I have to wonder , How ?
<OerHeks> some installed drivers without linux-headers, some others the ccsm > compizplugin is deselected somehowe..
<nicomachus> Bashing-om: man... you don't even wanna know what the issue ended up being.
<Bashing-om> :) Just goes to show, somtimes got to do some real deep digging .
<nicomachus> no. we were on the wrong course the entire time.
<OerHeks> let me guess, a ppa ?
<nicomachus> nope.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Tell me - more - I do want to know .
<nicomachus> She was launching the Cairo-Dock "Desktop Environment" instead of unity the whole time.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: OerHeks .. Now it all makes sense !
<nicomachus> cairo-dock sticks an option into the DE selection list on the login menu for some reason, and that's what she was logging into.
<nicomachus> so that's why none of the unity reinstalls were working, why the home folder perms were all messed up, why the config resets didn't work, etc.
<slidinghorn> I felt so bad when that was discovered....all that work
<nicomachus> as soon as she switched back to unity... everything worked fine.
<slidinghorn> however, I'm sure you learned a lot in the process, right?  Not a wasted effort
<nicomachus> slidinghorn: it happens.
<nicomachus> and yes I did, definitely.
<nicomachus> I spent ~5 hours troubleshooting an rsync command that wouldn't go through once, and then finally realized that the directory names were case-sensitive.
<nicomachus> this was back when I first started with linux (aka, a year ago). but it happens.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Yeah been there, not done that .. and yeah .. still happens . ( but I do see it quicker now-a-days ! )
<nicomachus> thinking back, idk how else that could have been caught (the wrong DE being selected).
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: You can bet from now on . initial in the fault isolation will be ' echo $DESKTOP_SESSION " " $XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP ' !
<nicomachus> ha!
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-12-18
<pauljw> hi everyone
<Bashing-om> Gnite all, do this once more tomorrow .
<SeriouslyLaugh> anyone know what happened to daftykins? haven't seen him around lately
<daftykins> mmm rumours of my death are greatly exaggerated ;)
<daftykins> morning team o/
<EriC^^> morning :)
<daftykins> oy, i just walked a mile carrying my sub to a repair shop
<daftykins> my arms feel like snapped elastic bands :P
<EriC^^> lol
<daftykins> i was at my old college gathering last night, christmas time event... my old lecturer i used to teach with asked me if i'd be a part time technician looking after the IT lecturing staff's virtualisation server, a pretty beefy box that runs Microsoft's Hyper-V =
<daftykins> -=
<Tarminquay> Hello.
<daftykins> i'm not fond of the tech but it could be fun
<Tarminquay> Will I be enjoying my Ubuntu experience (Kubuntu) with an N3150 processor?
<EriC^^> cool
<daftykins> still not on topic :)
<n1cky> Are people really happy with the PPA model for bleeding edge / fringe software?
<n1cky> I'm coming from a year of using arch, back on ubuntu because so many times building some random software will give me a list of packages from apt, and using an LTS ubuntu is a good way to get consistent builds
<n1cky> (for example, the chromium build chroot suggests using ubuntu and I've had problems in the past not using ubuntu)
<daftykins> what are you trying to run newer versions of?
<n1cky> It's not that I want to run newer versions of anything, I just build a good amount of software from source and I find it annoying that theres not a great way to register that into apt
<n1cky> the arch linux pkgbuild model is fantastic imo, I'm surprised there's not an analgous dpkg model
<daftykins> doesn't 'check install' or some other action generate packages instead of just compile and install direct?
<n1cky> hey that's really nice
<n1cky> thanks for that, i never knew about that
<daftykins> no problemo :)
<daftykins> i've no idea on its' efficacy first hand, but eh, see how it goes
<n1cky> i wanted to run neovim, for example, because I use some vim plugins that take advantage of the async it provides
<n1cky> and I'm just kind of skeptical of adding some random repository to my system
<daftykins> *nod* it's a pain when only shifty PPAs are out there
<daftykins> i think i use one for makemkv on my HTPC :D
<n1cky> See take that as an example, I'm on my arch laptop right now, and `cower -s makemkv` searches the AUR for that package
<n1cky> cower -d makemkv downloads the pkgbuild to ./makemkv
<lotuspsychje> morning guys
<lotuspsychje> quick in and out today
<daftykins> \o
<daftykins> heyup
<n1cky> i go into that directory, makepkg -s, which checks it out from source and packages it
<lotuspsychje> hey daftykins :p
<n1cky> just so nice.
<daftykins> n1cky: trouble with that is it's like gentoo no, relies on someone having updated a template for fetching and compiling a given version, no?
<daftykins> lotuspsychje: been asked to manage a microsoft hyper-v server, ewww ;)
<lotuspsychje> ouch
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: get alot of request lately dont you :p
<daftykins> indeed!
<lotuspsychje> good sign :p
<daftykins> ran into another lecturer i used to teach with, he wants a part-timer to look after it
<daftykins> when i used to teach i had to use it too, it was a mess ;)
<lotuspsychje> :p
<daftykins> someone in IT support had installed Windows to the RAID10 array and put the VM storage on a single disk, instead of the other way around >_<
<lotuspsychje> we still hunting for new house, where i can start the ubuntu shop
<daftykins> ah har
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: is that the guy TJ- helped with all his ssd's?
<n1cky> daftykins: yeah
<daftykins> lotuspsychje: the one i'm referring to? nah
<lotuspsychje> kk
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: you dont see raid10 every day on irc thats why :p
<daftykins> ^_^
<daftykins> i play with RAID a lot <3
<lotuspsychje> nice to know, might come handy one day
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: desktops or servers?
<daftykins> always file servers ja
<lotuspsychje> :p
<daftykins> well i don't use Linux RAID setups at all really, or at least not to manage the RAID... mostly hardware controller based
<daftykins> like my lovely (but ageing) 3ware 9650SEs
<lotuspsychje> never did linux raid myself
<daftykins> just bought an office 365 license for someone off amazon UK, got the license on her account immediately, hid the email so she doesn't know it's her christmas present... and then installed it on her christmas present MS Surface ;)
<lotuspsychje> nice
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> personally i dont liek those surfaces
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: hey mate
<daftykins> no, like all tablets they're very toy like
<daftykins> it was nice seeing one in the flesh, but... yeah no, glad i originally swayed her off this and onto the Lenovo X1 Carbon instead
<lotuspsychje> lenovo is nice
<lotuspsychje> i wish i could find cheap lenovo or hp barebones for my business
<lotuspsychje> but ordering one by one is hard to find
<daftykins> Lenovo have lost favour with a lot of folk due to all the things they've been doing to their systems
<lotuspsychje> bbl dinner have a nice one
<BluesKaj> Howdy all
<Tarminquay> Is there a sleep finctiom in ubintu?
<lotuspsychje> afternoon mates
<lotuspsychje> !find amdgpu
<ubot5> Found: W:, W:, W:, W:, W:
<BluesKaj> hey lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
<slidinghorn> My google fu is no match for TJ-'s "I actually know this stuff" fu....
<nicomachus> ^^
<TJ-> LOL ... right ... now imagine the quantum of frustration I've suffered!
 * slidinghorn hears "shutdown...forcefully" and immediately thinks "...with a sledge hammer"
<daftykins> that'll fix it for good.
<daftykins> evening all o/
<daftykins> my my what an eventful day
<daftykins> TJ-: one sub carried a mile to a repair shop ;)
<nicomachus> get those ipads taken care of?
<daftykins> oh man that was actually way harder than it should've been
<nicomachus> lol
<daftykins> as i didn't have a laptop with me, due to carrying lots of networking tools for the day... i was first trying to download this app that lets you transfer photos over the same wifi network
<daftykins> hit a brick wall as ipad #2 which was being sold (thus the reason for taking the pics off it) was tied to the owners father's Apple ID - and though he shared the password, the device then demanded to be 'unlocked' by his security questions being entered
<daftykins> he evidently didn't know or didn't fancy coughing those up, so i then had to cave and use someones laptop which i see iPads only allow read only access to the photos of, so i could put them on a flash drive but not onto the destination iPad
<daftykins> (i wasn't willing to contaminate this persons laptop with iTunes)
<nicomachus> gotta love Apple...
<daftykins> so then the ideal end would've been to factory reset the first iPad with the view for it to be given to the person it was sold to, but that too was locked down to the Apple ID before it could be reset, so i had to just give it back saying "you'll need to bend your dad's ear"
<daftykins> so he has to either follow instructions in an email or enter security question answers in order to hit factory reset, so it can be sold
<daftykins> quite the drama :D
<nicomachus> well you missed me spending 5-6 hours trouble-shooting a problem with Unity, only to find out the user had the Cairo-Dock DE selected from the login screen the whole time, instead of Unity.
<daftykins> >_<
<daftykins> #ubuntu would be ace without the users :)
<nicomachus> she was super nice, though... haha. it was her husband's PC and he had a stoke recently so had bad memory and couldn't remember what he did to mess up Unity.
<daftykins> ah right
<daftykins> hmm i might've encountered that one once before, she messages as he can't control his hands so well or speak or something
<nicomachus> and I learned a few things along the way.
<daftykins> \o/
<nicomachus> *sigh*... "I need to install a program that I didn't even download!"
<daftykins> o0
<daftykins> forgot it was the weekend, HERE BE DRAGONS!
 * nicomachus bangs his head on the desk
<nicomachus> whoa. pastebin.ubuntu.com??
<daftykins> you can increase your efficiency by using just 'paste :D
<daftykins> oops missing characters today, ah well i'm keeping you on your toes
<nicomachus> paste.ubuntu.com redirects now.
<daftykins> hmm didn't have that here
<nicomachus> hmm... investigating.
<daftykins> yep the crazy folk are in full force, abandon ship!
<EriC^^> lol
<EriC^^> tux protect us
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> oh Tux, give us a shell that can weather these users
<nicomachus> from #canonical-sysadmin:
<nicomachus> 15:29 <@neale> I didn't realize there was a paste.ubuntu.com
<nicomachus> lol, wat?
<daftykins> well, that's the two of you assessed from a systems analyst point of view and efficiency increased by no longer typing 3 characters more... my invoice for 1,000 cookies is in the post
<daftykins> my work here is done Â¬_Â¬
<nicomachus> there goes that UK-exclusive emoticon.
<daftykins> the whaaaa?
<nicomachus> US keyboards don't have that key. haha
<daftykins> oh yes :D
<nicomachus> well apparently there was a permanent redirect rule put in place in May 2015 to redirect paste.ubuntu.com to pastebin.ubuntu.com... I guess it was slow to catch.
<daftykins> hrmm
<daftykins> funky
<daftykins> alright, goodnight team o/
<nicomachus> night
<Bashing-om> Ready or not, here I come .
<nicomachus> good luck....
<OerHeks> Yes, lets turn up some music, baby
<Bashing-om> Rock And Roll !
<OerHeks> Roll over Beethoven
<nicomachus> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4avM0qzEF5I
<Bashing-om> " < sparqz> " has a failure to communicate ... in general !
<nicomachus> he's sparky.
<nicomachus> I made this for him: https://i.imgur.com/qbp4oLr.png
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-12-19
<nicomachus> *sigh* https://imgur.com/ZIM3t6f
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: ^ Sad, not at all a Christian attitude .
<nicomachus> reported to #ubuntu-ops, but they must all be away because he's still in the channel.
<nicomachus> not quite sure what he's so upset about... never seen the user before.
<Bashing-om> maybe giving enough rope to hang his self ?
<nicomachus> maybe. he just quit though.
<TJ-> seems like a gang of unusual attitudes all at the same time - provocateurs or coincidence
<nicomachus> friday night....
<nicomachus> well, in the states at lesat.
<nicomachus> least*
<Ben64> they're the people who didn't get to see star wars
<nicomachus> LOL
<TJ-> I'll give them some USB packet analysis to keep them busy :)
<TJ-> It's not 'Mint' but hey! they're part of the community so they won't mind :)
<TJ-> oh, now its in -kernel
<nicomachus> hmmm... should I join to watch the struggle?
<TJ-> no ones awake there, its mainly only the Canonical kernel team, and its winter break time now
<nicomachus> Canonical team gets winter break? lucky...
<TJ-> well, lots of folks are breaking for a long vacation
<nicomachus> ah.
<nicomachus> then again, I do get a week a half vacation starting Wednesday while I transition between jobs.
<TJ-> Canonical is London based and generally adopts EU/UK holiday rules which means an allowance of at least 20 days a year
<TJ-> plus the national days (bank holidays in the UK)
<Tarminquay> When's 15.11 being released?
<TJ-> sorry, 28 not s0
<Tarminquay> 15.10 is pretty old now.
<TJ-> not 20
<nicomachus> Tarminquay: there is no 15.11
<nicomachus> TJ-: what's the difference there?
<TJ-> nicomachus: read it as dot, followed by not-dot, followed by anything (this prevents the copy following the ../ into the parent directory when doing recursive operations
<TJ-> nicomachus: it doesn't deal with the files vs directories though - that needs 'find'
<nicomachus> ahhh I see. I didn't consider that it would catch ../ and go into the parent.
<Bashing-om> Good nite .. I expect more fun tomorrow :)
<Tarminquay> We need a version of Ubuntu. The 15.10 is getting obsolete.
<Ben64> no
<slidinghorn> can we ban taminqua from the channel? They only come in here to troll, it seems
<cfhowlett> slidinghorn, send it to !ops
<cfhowlett> slidinghorn, also: if using hexchat, you can personally ignore
<slidinghorn> i have irssi...i can...just figured it'd be for the good of everyone, lol
<lordievader> Good morning.
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<OerHeks> oh, our favorite troll bill gates is back, enjoy!
<BluesKaj> I see that OerHeks ..fun :-)
<OerHeks> meh .. ubuntu /n /l is not dutch
 * OerHeks fooly
<BluesKaj> who cares if he's from china, does he think that gives him extra priveleges ? :-)
<OerHeks> i thought to know he was trolling :-D
<OerHeks> nervermind, i should finish my coffee, but i have walked my dog
<daftykins> hi team o/
 * daftykins gets back to ripping Opera
<EriC^^> lol
<daftykins> wow, this disc has _one_ track
<daftykins> 55 mins 22
<EriC^^> wow
<MonkeyDust> which artist?
<daftykins> it's a 20 disc set of operas by Giacomo Puccini
<daftykins> http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51MPpSlU3QL._SY355_.jpg
<MonkeyDust> hybryds, and steve reich make lo,g tracks, too
<MonkeyDust> nong*
<MonkeyDust> long d'oh!
<daftykins> i do like me some post rock usually that goes quite long :)
<daftykins> haha here we go, it's an opera in one act
<daftykins> Il Trittico - Il Tabarro
<MonkeyDust> have you ever been to a live show?
<MonkeyDust> i mean, an opera?
<daftykins> nah, these are a clients' sets i'm doing for him
<daftykins> he goes regularly with a friend in London from what i understand
<MonkeyDust> !info mp3splt-gtk
<ubot5> mp3splt-gtk (source: mp3splt-gtk): GTK interface to split MP3 and Ogg Vorbis files without reencoding. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.7.2-2ubuntu3 (vivid), package size 432 kB, installed size 1077 kB
<daftykins> i use FLAC :)
<MonkeyDust> is better, lossless, like wav
<MonkeyDust> and .tiff for pictures
<daftykins> my angle is more that you only have to go from the discs once, then you can convert from there to anything else you might need, so still MP3 (V0) for mobile devices
<daftykins> given the cost of storage though, it makes sense to just do it once to FLAC then store the CDs :)
<MonkeyDust> "a cunning plan"
<MonkeyDust> there, e17 DE in my VM
<TJ-> time to upgrade to E20  :)
<MonkeyDust> Germany is getting nervous... should I worry?
<MonkeyDust> the 'sanctions' sounds different when it's said by Germany
<OerHeks> heh, Germany is giving arms to the Kurds, and Turkey bombs them... stupid nato fools
<OerHeks> but Germany closed all nuclear reactors, so i am more affraid of Belgium, MonkeyDust
<MonkeyDust> true
<MonkeyDust> we always seem to need something to be afraid of... the communists, the cruise missiles, isis, refugees...
<OerHeks> Eutopia-disaster
<MonkeyDust> i'm not agains 'Europe', but i'm against *this* 'Europe'
<MonkeyDust> and i hate to say, but a war is needed to accomplish what they want to do with Europe... messing with borders etc
 * OerHeks is now known as FakeSanta but also known as OerHeks
<daftykins> tgm4883: o/
<OerHeks> typical a "it is saturday and i am bored" issue > IISAIAB
<daftykins> where? :)
<TJ-> mmmm, fry-up time. Need a break
<TJ-> if anyone sees "sasha_" in any of the channels, talking about a driver for the RTS5227/A for v3.19, can you point him to https://iam.tj/projects/misc/rts5227.tar.bz2 and tell him to view the README inside it for installation instructions.
<BluesKaj> TJ-, did a whois , he's logged in but not listing him in any channels
<TJ-> hmm, I did and didn't see him
<TJ-> sasha_: No such nick/channel
<TJ-> the user I'm referring to is [sasha_] (~sasha@178.121.118.117) was realname
<TJ-> I was advising on kernel module patching around 0400 UTC, was last on around 1300 UTC
<MonkeyDust> someone remind me what i was doing
<daftykins> establishing world peace, iirc
<MonkeyDust> right
<OerHeks> oh dear
<MonkeyDust> there's a reason why i use FF and not chromium, but i forget the reason
<phunyguy> SemiNus/ShadowM00n, the issue is there are usually close to 2000 users in that channel.  Best to keep it clear for support only.  âº
<daftykins> +1
<SemiNus> phunyguy, yep, I get the idea, it only sounds a little weird when there is a totally silent channel,  and a little life is coming up,  and then... ;-)
<SemiNus> but I totally accept it
<phunyguy> yep, it's easy for one question to get lost in the joins/parts alone
<phunyguy> nevermind offtopic banter/discussion
<ShadowM00n> I filtered those out so long ago I forgot they were a problem. good point.
<daftykins> those of us who support folk, need to keep them on to know when our victims leave
<daftykins> err i mean helpees
<phunyguy> haaah
<SemiNus> looool
<SemiNus> hey guys, I remember when I was 15 years old,  I started using Linux
<SemiNus> and I asked for help
<phunyguy> Come join us in #ubuntu-offtopic as well.  We have cookies.
<SemiNus> and they told me "rm -rf /" as root
<SemiNus> and I did
<SemiNus> :(
<phunyguy> yeah don't mention that command here.  Straight path to the ban-wagon
<SemiNus> they found it funny.   As a matter of fact,  I learned to read before executing commands
<ShadowM00n> isn't it impossible to nuke the system with that now?
<daftykins> nope
<phunyguy> it totally still is.
<ShadowM00n> huh. I must not have tried hard enough.
<daftykins> it'd need sudo in ubuntu land of course ;)
<ShadowM00n> could've sworn when I did that in a vm it refused to do something.
<phunyguy> yeah it needs root privs
<ShadowM00n> this was some time ago though, I may be entirely mistaken
<phunyguy> also it won't delete /proc, /dev etc
<phunyguy> but the rest is gone :P
<phunyguy> and it will inevitably get to a point where stuff starts to fai then you can't delete anyway.
<phunyguy> fail*
<ShadowM00n> I thought I saw some message telling me I was being naughty and then refusing to do it
<ShadowM00n> I'll have to try again
<ShadowM00n> ah, there it is
<ShadowM00n> it is dangerous to operate recursively on "/"
<ShadowM00n> use --no-preserve-root to override this failsafe
<phunyguy> oh nice
<daftykins> what version is that?
<ShadowM00n> 15.10, but I first saw that years ago
<daftykins> i wonder if the forkbomb is protected against yet :)
<ShadowM00n> heh
<ShadowM00n> I haven't tried!
<ShadowM00n> curiously enough, that system reboots cleanly when I switch to upstart. Guess that rules out a global bug, more or less.
<daftykins> no idea what you mean
<ShadowM00n> nope, no protection against the classics
<ShadowM00n> daftykins: sorry, thinking out loud. I was in #ubuntu originally because upstart on my main machine causes said machine to hang during reboot
<ShadowM00n> but yeah, fork bombs are still a valid troll
<daftykins> wow, finished the last opera disc rip... now i have 18GB of FLAC to transcode
<daftykins> 1 hour for a core 2 duo to convert ;)
<daftykins> Bashing-om: o/
<daftykins> heh i'm going to throw that FLAC onto my desktop and see how the quad core likes it instead ;)
<daftykins> i think my i5 laptop would destroy everything else actually
<ShadowM00n> now I wish I had a huge file to feed to my 8-core
<daftykins> smells like AMD
<ShadowM00n> guilty
<BluesKaj> daftykins, converting flac to ?
<daftykins> mp3, the FLAC is for PC playback for the client, mp3 is for *groan* iPods
<ShadowM00n> an appropriate reaction
<Bashing-om> daftykins: \o ... Saturdau, set for a wild ride ?
<daftykins> sure am :)
<daftykins> ok my desktop states 47 mins left compared to the server
<BluesKaj> can't ipods run wav?
<daftykins> Q6600 vs. E6750
<daftykins> i'm gonna get my laptop now and see by how much the i5 trounces those two
<BluesKaj> why lossy..oh well i'm an old audiophile who doesn't understand why mp3 is still used when we have so much mopre storage capacity that mp3 is no longer necessary
<BluesKaj> more even'
<ShadowM00n> my audio player is only 8GB
<daftykins> BluesKaj: he's got a tiny 64GB player that's almost full for the travelling iPod now, the ones that stay beside his amps are classic models with plenty of space though
<BluesKaj> heh, guess I'm  a luddite, I still use cds in my vehicle, but i don't use 'phones or listen to music when I'm walking somewhere
<BluesKaj> compression distortion still bothers my ears
<daftykins> i don't own a car, but if i'm in the mood for something i really like i might throw the FLAC on a device :)
<ShadowM00n> I...literally can't tell the difference on a high-quality mp3 unless I have exceptionally bad speakers/headphones
<ShadowM00n> or exceptionally good, depending on one's outlook, I guess
<BluesKaj> good speakers show the difference, not bad ones
<ShadowM00n> I'd like to think that my desktop's headset is fairly good, though admittedly sound hardware is something I haven't looked into much
<ShadowM00n> not sure where to start, honestly
<BluesKaj> the source hardware and media used
<daftykins> haha, the software tries to run 4 threads on my laptop due to hyperthreading and so it talks 2hrs to do it instead of 40 mins on my really-quad core desktop
<daftykins> that's amusing :>
<daftykins> sorry folks but that mrsam is an asshole, regardless of language barrier.
<ShadowM00n> hahaha
<ShadowM00n> it's been popcorn.gif the whole time, for sure
<OerHeks> asking in at least 2 channels, funny cross posters
<daftykins> mrsam is?
<OerHeks> no, ablest
<daftykins> oh yeah, common criminal that one
<daftykins> rarely learns, too
<daftykins> where's the other spot?
<OerHeks> #u-o
<daftykins> ah cheeky swine! doesn't he know that's offtopic? :D
<BluesKaj>  mrsam is in Iran
<daftykins> that rhymes!
<OerHeks> i might better watch a re-run of MIB II on tv
<daftykins> i don't think i ever saw beyond the first
<OerHeks> i don't think there is a book of it
<ShadowM00n> there was a comic series
<ShadowM00n> which was far more brutal and less Will Smith-y
<daftykins> all 993 converted, excellent - that'll be a fun gift come Monday
<nicomachus> just bought an old LED monitor from a thrift store and assumed that whatever market they used to write the price on the screen would come off easy... I was wrong. Any tips for getting this stuff off?
<TJ-> nicomachus: IPA?
<nicomachus> like the beer?
<TJ-> isoproyl alcohol, surgical spirit possibly
<OerHeks> butter
<TJ-> isopropyl alcohol
<nicomachus> lol ah. I called the store and they said to use a pencil eraser... that seems a bit risky.
<TJ-> I wouldn't use anything abrasive
<TJ-> IPA dissolves superglue it ought to work on permanent ink
<nicomachus> okey doke
<nicomachus> I've got some 91
<TJ-> I use it routinely for all my electronics cleaning jobs
<nicomachus> yea I usually use for internals
<nicomachus> yep it's getting it. slowly.
<daftykins> hmm perhaps IPA would be ok on my laptop screen too? so covered in muck yet some anti-static alcohol wipes had dried out :(
<TJ-> provided its evaporated/cleaned before turning something on it should be fine. I find a mild washing detergent better for laptop screens for general dust/dirt build-up though
<daftykins> hmm think i've only got the dilute-requiring all purpose cleaners
<daftykins> perhaps a big spray bottle with a tiny drop in then filled up with water would be a good supply
<TJ-> 'Fairy' liquid is what I'm talking about
<nicomachus> there we go, all clean.
<TJ-> washing-up liquid
<nicomachus> thanks TJ-
<daftykins> ah-har i've plenty of that :>
<TJ-> daftykins:  not enough to have it foam, just a few bubbles, warm water helps, too, dip clean lint-free cloth in it, squeeze out, then wipe the screen whilst it is horizontal and have a drying cloth to hand to ensure the liquid doesn't escape under the bezel
<TJ-> And for your next challenge, remove each key and wash :)
<daftykins> i've done that a few times with my mechanical here
<daftykins> quite the undertaking!
<daftykins> the laptop however, not sure that'd be wise
<TJ-> yes, it rejuventates keyboards really well
<TJ-> laptops are easier to clean I find because they use small cantilever clips and have silicon domes, no mechanical springs to catch as they fly around :)
<TJ-> once you've figured out the which way to come in with the prising tool to pop the caps off they're pretty fast to strip
<TJ-> and its far easier than reverse-engineering a Windows USB driver :)
<daftykins> they do all have muck on every vertical side :(
<Bashing-om> Gonna go update 15.04 to 15.10 .. be back shortly .
<OerHeks> wait ...
<OerHeks> oh
 * OerHeks facepalms and sits down
<daftykins> weird users.
<nicomachus> s/weird/weekend/
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> install Windows through Ubuntu, good lord.
<nicomachus> do you ever wish you could have a tag on your username that just says "just trust me and do what I say"
<daftykins> well it'd be quickly ignored once i did something wrong :D
<nicomachus> well, probably could have predicted that would turn out as it did.
<daftykins> yip
<Bashing-om> Back on ! On alternate installed system release upgrade to 15.10 went without a hitch or hickup . Smooth !
<daftykins> ^_^
<daftykins> gotta be honest i didn't expect it ;)
<Bashing-om> This ole hardware, I am impressd it even runs !
<nicomachus> non-LTS release on old hardware? You're a brave man
<TJ-> huh?
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Oh ... just a 'testing' install ! .. my workhorse will remain as 14.04 for a bit yet !
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-12-20
<OerHeks> :-)
<daftykins> i believe it's sleep o'clock
<daftykins> enough madness for one day ^_^
<nicomachus> night
<daftykins> \o
<nicomachus> $user somehow has admin control over a server, but doesn't know basic terminology, commands, or procedures.......
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Sounds like a perscription for disaster . ;)
<nicomachus> NitroShare really is a handy program. It's basically just a GUI for rsync, but it makes things easier for users that don't know what rsync/ssh transfers are.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: In this case was his life saver ! Great that you were on hand, watching, and knew the app .
<nicomachus> :D
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: IRT regedit :: What does the pacjage manager show ' dpkg -l | grep linux- ' ?
<Bashing-om> package*
<nicomachus> looks correct to me?
<Bashing-om> Awaiting the dpkg result . That will tell the tale that both the vivid and wily control packages are installed ,
<nicomachus> ah, that's here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/14110905/
<Bashing-om> yeah .. I missed it some how .. look'n at this time .
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Surprised as only " ii  linux-headers-generic " stuff is installed ,,, so how did " ii  linux-image-4.2.0-19-generic " (wily) get in the system ?
<nicomachus> linux-image-generic is buried down in there.
<nicomachus> line 46
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: ueah .. "linux-image-generic" control files will install for vivid .. would not install for the 4.2 kernels with out the related HWE suppirt as 'linux-image-generic-lts-wily' for the 3 or 4 control files .
<nicomachus> looks like there was a bug for Precise where kernel packages were getting marked as manually installed, which meant autoremove wouldn't remove them. possible extension of that?
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Do not know .. perhaps I am confussed . did vivied (15.10) come out originally with the 3.19 kernel ? trying to recall / 3.13= trusty-14.04  3.16=utopic-14.10 then 3.19 would be vivid-15.04 4.2=wily-15.10.... I just upgraded 15.04 to 15.10 this day, and that 15.10 is the 4.2 kernel .
<nicomachus> yea I think that's correct. I'm wondering if when he upgraded to 15.10 from 15.04, he already had those old kernels on the system and they were marked as manual install during the upgrade.
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Well .. I watched the release upgrade I did . and I was a bit concerned that the upgrade process removed my 3.19 kernels ( did leave one but failed to make the backup symlink to it !) .
<nicomachus> interesting
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: I am just wondering how this 4.2 kernels got on the system if this turns out to be a 15.04 install . - lsb_release -a - do us any good ?
<nicomachus> he's on 15.10
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: K .. then we are good as is .. if "autoremove"  will not remove the kernels . then yeah must be set as "manual" . manul apt remove I guess to remove the old kernels . Then I should think the packager manage will be happy and in the furure 'autoremove' will function .
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: My favorite to deal with the 'rc' marked packages ' dpkg --list |grep "^rc" | cut -d " " -f 3 | xargs sudo dpkg --purge ' .
 * nicomachus is dizzy looking at that....
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Boils down if the package is markd 'rc' purge it !
<nicomachus> ha, I see
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: My humbel opinion here IRT regedit is to sic dpkg on all those old 3.19 kernels and get rid of them manually .
<nicomachus> yep, he cleared them.
<Bashing-om> :)
<Bashing-om> all setreled out .. I gonna call it a night .
<nicomachus> night o/
<Ben64> hehe
<Ben64> nolsen (~nolsen@71-88-180-5.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com) has left #ubuntu ("I give up, this support channel sucks.")
<Ben64> great quit message
<nicomachus> I was GONNA help him...
<nicomachus> one of these days I'll have to re-enable joins parts and quits...
<Ben64> i tried, i can't deal with people who refuse to answer basic questions
<Ben64> most of the time people don't want to do what they think they want to do
<Ben64> !xy
<ubot5> The XY problem is when you need to do X, and you think you can use Y to do X, so you ask about how to do Y, when what you really should do is state what your X problem is. There may be a Z solution that is even better than Y, but nobody can suggest it if X is never mentioned.
<Ben64> yeah that
<Ben64> wasn't sure it was a trigger
<nicomachus> what a handy factoid.
<Ben64> most recently someone was asking how to remove the login window at startup, turned out they just wanted to enable auto-login
<lotuspsychje> good morning mates
 * nicomachus checks system time
<nicomachus> where are you, mate?
<nicomachus> 23:45 here
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: belgium, 6h47
<nicomachus> early.
<nicomachus> why are you awake... lol
<lotuspsychje> im always that early
<lotuspsychje> my regular hour
<nicomachus> eek
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> the early bird catches the irc worm
<nicomachus> wanna take a shot at this guy's grub issue? I had no idea.
<MonkeyDust> well
<MonkeyDust> i cant connect to freenode with irssi
<MonkeyDust> "Irssi: Unable to connect server irc.freenode.net port 6667 [Connection timed out]" ... and this goes on for ever
<MonkeyDust> ok, it's because i try it from within a container, it seems
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<daftykins> hrmm best start learning modern Hyper-V i guess :(
<pauljw> hi everyone
<daftykins> o/
<daftykins> pauljw: in relation to your managing systems at home via SSH, have you considered playing with landscape? It's that free for <10 computers remote management service that lets you control the others from a web admin :>
<slidinghorn> howdy :)
<pauljw> hi guys, no daftykins i haven't but i will look into it, thanks.
<daftykins> np ^_^
<daftykins> not used it in a while but it used to be fun to tinker with
<EriC^^> evening all
<daftykins> heya!
<pauljw> hi EriC^^
<EriC^^> hi pauljw daftykins
<EriC^^> how
<EriC^^> how's it going?
<pauljw> peachy, and you?
<EriC^^> good :D
<daftykins> yip all good here ta, just trying to update my knowledge on Microsoft's Hyper-V virtualisation technology (eww) for a potential part time job
<EriC^^> cool
<daftykins> i'd rather just coax them into going to free educational VMware :P
<EriC^^> :D
<daftykins> my spare quad core machine has lightning-fried onboard USB, so doesn't support USB boot anymore :(
<daftykins> blech 3 PCs and one working DVD drive
<nicomachus> have optical drives always been this unreliable or is it just because so few use them now?
<EriC^^> i think they always have
<EriC^^> i used to have to scrub the games i got on cd with alcohol a lot to get them to work sometimes
<daftykins> weird really, the SATA DVD in my desktop died one day when i unplugged it to temporarily put someones hard disk in for some data recovery
<daftykins> just never powered up again after plugging back in o0
<EriC^^> the blue alcohol that smells like peanut butter works wonders on cd's, i dont know the scientific term for it though
<nicomachus> trying to install a distro from a wonky optical drive is one of the worst experiences I've had with linux.
<daftykins> heh, when i used to teach the hardware sessions the donated computers were mostly too old for USB boot, or we just didn't have flash drives on hand... so dealing with dying or dead hard disks and optical drives was a constant
<daftykins> when you think about a lesson that's only maybe 90 minutes long and trying to get 12+ students in one class with a fully assembled and working PC plus an OS installed... blech
<nicomachus> daftykins: PLoP is a life-saver in those situations. You load it on a disk, it's a super-minimal BIOS emulator thing, and then you can boot from USB
<daftykins> nah my point is that you have no flash drives for 12 kids in a class
<nicomachus> ah right
<daftykins> and the optical may be dead so you couldn't even use such a chainloading disc
<daftykins> this is why the department acquired a beefy virtualisation server, the idea being to try and give the kids more exposure to a wider range of OSs by having them all virtualised and ready to go
<EriC^^> i had a super hard time getting an iso to boot from grub yesterday, kept saying init: /dev/sr0 no medium found
<EriC^^> i wanted to try popcorntime in a live session cause i heard it might have malware and it's just a binary
<daftykins> was it looking at a physical drive instead of the mounted image at sr1?
 * daftykins has never used GRUB to boot an ISO
<nicomachus> EriC^^: haven't found any malware in popcorntime yet, but the sources on it aren't as reliable as they used to be now that the original devs are gone.
<EriC^^> i dunno, i tried the stuff in https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Grub2/ISOBoot#Menuentry_Example
<daftykins> i've heard that thing keeps going through many iterations as different sites etc get shutdown
<EriC^^> nicomachus: yeah it's a clone of it i think, time4popcorn
<nicomachus> EriC^^: ohhh. no idea about that one. There is a "community maintained" version of the original popcorntime now that isn't half-bad, but some of the streams aren't seeded well and some of the options on the interface no longer work.
<EriC^^> oh
<daftykins> not sure why you guys don't just go to a reliable source ;)
<daftykins> but then this topic is pretty sketchy for freenode
<EriC^^> reliable source like
<EriC^^> ?
<EriC^^> /msg EriC^^ <reliable source>
<nicomachus> YTS, which is Yify. A pretty well-trusted uploaded. but he/she/they made a deal with the MPAA to "retire", so that source is gone.
<nicomachus> s/uploaded/uploader/
<daftykins> hehehe
<daftykins> oh my word, this person claims to be running 15.10 and look at their policy on 'kodi' - http://paste.ubuntu.com/14116967/
<daftykins> that's such a mess
<nicomachus> 15.04
<EriC^^> debian jessie repo
<EriC^^> that's a ticking time bomb
<daftykins> yep 4 different sources installed for the same program
<daftykins> i know what it really is, hence the 'claim' part of the sentence :>
<nicomachus> daftykins: he said 15.04 though...
<daftykins> what?
<nicomachus> 10:09 < doxinho> I'm running Ubuntu 15.04
<daftykins> i'm referring to a user in another channel :)
<nicomachus> ha, oh!
<nicomachus> my bad.
<daftykins> no worries, i'm keeping you on your toes with talk from #kodi-linux :D
<nicomachus> it looked like the same paste...
<nicomachus> oh. I didn't copy your link... that's why. whoops.
<nicomachus> lol
<EriC^^> :D
<daftykins> i really need to disable the ctrl+click requirement on KiTTY, it's making me try to ctrl+click all links o0
<daftykins> right so i need to obtain a legit windows server eval ISO, burn that to good ol' ghetto DVD, then have a working drive in my spare PC to install it
<daftykins> :/
<EriC^^> i learned a new feature recently, middle clicking in browser opens a link in a new tab
<daftykins> sure does :>
<EriC^^> pretty cool
<EriC^^> i wish xchat did the same, oh well :D
<daftykins> how about all the lovely keyboard shortcuts like ctrl+shift+T to open the last closed tab? :>
<daftykins> *reopen
<nicomachus> EriC^^: I just have all links set to open in new tab.
<nicomachus> in my browser settings.
<EriC^^> daftykins: nice!
<nicomachus> also, here's a super handy list covering multiple programs: https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/2g7wvh/what_is_a_keyboard_shortcut_that_everyone_must/ckghqxe
<nicomachus> most are windows-only, but there's a browser section that's handy.
<EriC^^> nicomachus: thanks
 * daftykins mooches 9600.17050.WINBLUE_REFRESH.140317-1640_X64FRE_SERVER_EVAL_EN-US-IR3_SSS_X64FREE_EN-US_DV9.ISO
<daftykins> what a memorable name
<daftykins> ugh i bet that optical in my server is a DVD reader only
<daftykins> holy tux, a DVD-R writing at 10x sounds like it's going to take off
<nicomachus> vrrrrRRRRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMmm
<daftykins> 14x now as it goes along
<daftykins> 19,000KB/sec O_O
<daftykins> I 17:02:37 Average Write Rate: 17,672 KiB/s (13.1x) - Maximum Write Rate: 25,220 KiB/s (18.6x)
<daftykins> apparently optical grew up toward the end ;)
<daftykins> i wonder what BD is like
<nicomachus> you're brave. I usually stick to 4x on a questionable drive
<daftykins> oh no this is the good one
<daftykins> though amusingly it has a tray issue, takes about 8 presses to eject
<nicomachus> ah... wonder what that must be like... having a good optical drive
<daftykins> it's running the verify now
<daftykins> even my spare desktop has an SSD :D
<daftykins> TJ-: o/
<slidinghorn> wb TJ-
<pauljw> hi TJ-
<TJ-> afternoon :)
<BluesKaj> looking at a ssd for the laptop, then swap out the 1Tb drive and use it for media storage/server
<daftykins> :)
<daftykins> TB! :D
<daftykins> hahaha, server 2012 R2 standard requires 1.225GB of updates at install
<TJ-> Mmmm, all those juicy bugs
<BluesKaj> hey daftykins, TJ-, slidinghorn
<daftykins> yep - i've been asked to manage my old College's virtualisation server, unfortunately they run Microsoft's Hyper-V right now so i thought i'd update myself on it (i.e. see if it's still horrible)
<slidinghorn> afternoon BluesKaj
<daftykins> greetings \o
<TJ-> Windows Server - apart from the damned GUI - is pretty good, until you start adding services like Exchange :)
<BluesKaj> rescued my xenail plasma desktop ...it was a mess, reinstalled the daily to /
<daftykins> i'm hoping Hyper-V doesn't depend on the host being a domain controller anymore, that was horrifying
<TJ-> Really? I don't recall it wanting that originally (2003 version)
<BluesKaj> xenial even
<daftykins> the kids in the class had to have a working physical host which needed to be a member of the domain just so they could log in =|
<daftykins> TJ-: hyper-v didn't exist back then, first release was server 2008
<TJ-> There was something, not sure what it was... a long time ago
<daftykins> possibly VirtualPC
<daftykins> no idea in a server context though
<TJ-> yes, that's right, they renamed it later as the added core OS support in the server
<daftykins> i was saying i'd really rather just switch them over to VMware educational, but i would likely encounter bureaucratic resistance toward that from the IT support department there
<daftykins> which i also used to work for XD
<daftykins> DosTuMai: wb o/
<DosTuMai> Thankies. =]
<DosTuMai> But I've been at work all day. O_o
<daftykins> D:
<daftykins> on a Sunday, that's horrid :P
<DosTuMai> It's Sunday, I get time & half.
<TJ-> You missed a nice balmy sunny day though! Charge them double
<DosTuMai> And has been slow as hell all day. So yah, much staring at the walls.
<daftykins> heh, what do you do?
<DosTuMai> Customer services agent, over the phone dealing with stupid people.
<TJ-> oh, and then you come here for relief?!!?
<daftykins> ah so almost verbal #ubuntu - scary
 * TJ- rolls eyes
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> that's why DosTuMai belongs with us, also a sucker for punishment
<TJ-> This is light relief... you want punishment, you can take over this USB protocol reverse-engineering I'm doing, to make a Linux driver that matches what a Windows driver does :D
<DosTuMai> Yah sure, I'm on like, 4 servers. Loads of people that aren't challenged by unlabelled pull doors.
<nicomachus> TJ-: you've been working on that a few days now
<daftykins> TJ-: what's the requirement behind that one?
<TJ-> Optical microscope; the current Linux driver doesn't handle it correctly. Discovered its sending entirely different command sequences for device config/init and so on, so looks like the Linux driver has always been incorrect
<TJ-> So I have to sniff the USB packets using wireshark with a Windows VM, then figure out what is going on and how to implement that same behaviour in the Linux driver
<slidinghorn> that is WAAAAYYYYY over my head ;)
<DosTuMai> Oh joy.
<daftykins> sounds good :)
<slidinghorn> I mean...I understood what you said, but the act itself is
<nicomachus> yea I'm with slidinghorn o that one
<TJ-> It doesn't help that there is no published documentation on the Sonix USB bridge chipset, and very litle - and what I have is not 100% accurate - for the CMOS image sensor
<daftykins> yay 156 updates just began installing on this server ^_^
<daftykins> gogo SSD
<TJ-> so it requires exactly duplicating the Windows driver behaviour without understanding what it is doing, not knowing if some responses are conditional on values it reads from the device, etc.
<daftykins> sounds like quite the black box!
<nicomachus> TJ-: is this for work, or just to submit to the kernel?
<TJ-> nicomachus: just because it needs doing
<nicomachus> you're a good man.
<nicomachus> or woman....?
<TJ-> or husky :)
<nicomachus> lol
<daftykins> that'd be quite the chimera
<nicomachus> on the internet, apparently you can tell people you're a dog
<daftykins> he used to be a huskie but he's alright noooooooooooooooooow
<TJ-> I was helping Silver remove a thorn from a pad yesterday; her right rear foot swelled up terribly with infection, but we seem to have fixed it today
<daftykins> ah yeah, that's happened a lot to my parents dogs
<daftykins> see them whimpering along nursing a paw, or stopping dead in their tracks!
<TJ-> yes, she was sat in the field several times yesterday nagging at the foot, but you know how they carry on regardless, was hard to tell until later when she looked ill
<daftykins> d'aww
<daftykins> Mischief came in with a small dried leaf attached to one of her whiskers, suspended by spider web material earlier today
<daftykins> looked hilarious :D
<TJ-> she has very sensitive/ticklish feet. It's a battle to wash them when we get back from a muddy walk :)
<TJ-> lol... moustachio
<TJ-> Pepper keeps putting green 'eyeliner' on - don't know where she's getting it from unless she's practicing head-stands when we aren't looking
<daftykins> XD
<nicomachus> LOL, that's hilarious
<daftykins> 116 of 156 updates installed!
<TJ-> I cannot believe, 12 years later, the Windows update process is still so poor
<nicomachus> s/still so poor/worse/
<TJ-> the amount of chugging it does, and repetitive scanning of the registry, it used to drive me crazy. It's sometimes faster to slipstream a new image and write it
<daftykins> not that you can do that anymore :(
<daftykins> i used to keep my install media up to date but it just isn't the way anymore
<daftykins> there are technologies for rapid deployment but it's so once in a blue moon it'd be a waste of time for me atm
<TJ-> right, we used to use an SUS
<daftykins> mmm, i avoid domains like the plague
<TJ-> but the amount of wasted time in applying the updates is just awful.
<daftykins> yip
<daftykins> this box has a 52 minute uptime now, solely been updating ;)
<daftykins> core 2 quad with an SSD
<daftykins> a mechanical would likely have been an overnight job
<TJ-> it wouldn't be so bad if Windows could chroot so you could update 1 image whilst the machine remained fully active, and then switch over
<daftykins> i find it criminal they don't just refresh media constantly
<TJ-> I was about to say this is 1 of the reasons I quit Windows - but realised that list probably has more than 1000 items on it!
<daftykins> good to know the DVD portion of that NEC drive is totally fine ;)
<daftykins> hehe
<daftykins> of course it's far easier in *buntu land where we're handholding folks through getting working wifi drivers, graphics driver quirks, other non-working hardware or EFI drama *cough*
 * daftykins ducks
<TJ-> the point is, at every stage, we have full control and insight into the state of the system, so we can gater accurate diagnostic data and act on it correctly. In Windows, you're mostly operating blind, especially when it comes to device drivers/boot failures/BSOD/ etc
<TJ-> even the windows boot.log only reports the files its reading... so all you can gain from it is where the boot stopped
<daftykins> *nod*
<daftykins> that's only good from a more developer angle though i feel
<TJ-> Give me a dmesg and I'll give you a working system :)
<daftykins> ^_^
<daftykins> 1hr 10 minutes and we've finished update round 1!
<daftykins> this is quite fun to be honest... to have a real task requiring the need to play with new technologies again
<DosTuMai> Woo, now for round 2? xD
<daftykins> yep! that's my standard approach, hit windows update again to see if there were any that depended on the first round :)
<daftykins> i love the way the guy presenting in this free video had a popup about disk encryption whilst trying to deliver...
<daftykins> mrsam is becoming a common troublemaker :P
<nicomachus> wants a network monitor, probably won't understand the outputs...
<daftykins> ugh, asking how to run a program even
<daftykins> yep leaving that one alone
<daftykins> server 2012 R2 restarted \o/
<nicomachus> gksu factoid says to run 'gksudo'....
<daftykins> yeah, write an updated factoid and then bug someone in #ubuntu-ops to apply it
<daftykins> in my experience they ignore me fully.
<daftykins> however at least 'AMD' finally exists now instead of 'ati' - though they ignored my content update for the actual message
<daftykins> i'm totally going to make my old college upgrade it to SSD XD
<EriC^^> we should just hack ubottu
<daftykins> XD
<EriC^^> i wonder how it knows a person is logged in, maybe it looks for is logged in as <nick> in the /whois
<TJ-> I offered to add functionality to it several years ago when it was first languishing... didn't even get a response on the ubuntu-irc mailing list. From that and other interactions I got the distinct feeling the IRC grouping was very cliquish
<EriC^^> maybe just using the realname as that would trick it
<daftykins> i think they kicked out the guy that created it.
<TJ-> EriC^^: it'll do /query nickserv info <nickname>
<daftykins> power struggle on a personal basis
<TJ-> Yes, that was when I offered to take over
<daftykins> ah
<nicomachus> just write a new bot. ha!
<TJ-> It's basedon supybot, and I'd added a load of really useful stuff to it myself already
<EriC^^> so it does /nickserv info <nick> and looks for last seen : now ?
<nicomachus> and prompt the factoids with . instead of !
<TJ-> EriC^^: no, it'll use a combination of what's available from Services and the IRC daemon itself
<nicomachus> ahh... anabain back with the same issue as the last 3 days.
<EriC^^> it has a vulnerability already, it msgs to channel without checking if the person is in the channel or not
<TJ-> something to add you the todo list for Squoosh.os :D
<ubot5> <EriC^> wants you to know: Package bla does not exist in vivid
<EriC^^> pretty easy to flood using it
<daftykins> imo a core feature that's missing with ubottu, is the ability to give her a cookie
<EriC^^> yeah
<Bashing-om> ^ in the case of TJ- ; give our bot an Apple pie .
<EriC^^> what's the actual msg to change a factoid?
<EriC^^> i recall something like @change <factoid> +newstuff
<EriC^^> lol
<EriC^^> i tried to mess with the bot a bit and it said ubot5> Your edit request has been forwarded to #ubuntu-irc.  Thank you for your attention to detail
<EriC^^> that's not going to look good :D
<DosTuMai> xD
<daftykins> oops :>
<daftykins> i've got Hyper-V up and running on this server2012 R2 machine now, got a win7 client installing :O
<daftykins> lets get cocky and have an ubuntu machine too...
<daftykins> ah i do love gigabit, throwing ISOs about at 112MB/sec :>
<BluesKaj> odd card.freenode and dickson don't like my vpn connection , but asimov has no trouble, all settings are exactly the same for all,  ssl, sasl on port 7000
<BluesKaj> gonna recheck something
<TJ-> daftykins: It gets better when you trunk the links; I have a servers here which have 4x GE trunked to the switch, akes moving disk images around a casual thing rather than a should I/shouldn't I debate
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> that'd need at least two hosts with that though eh
<daftykins> well, unless two clients are dealing with a large file copy at once
<TJ-> well yes, with separate storage servers. But it means I can fire up a forensics VM on 1 server and access the disk images on the other with no lag, and ssh from the laptop on its measily 100FE/144WiFi connection
<daftykins> are you using a managed switch to handle that or just the OSs?
<TJ-> managed 48-port POE switch
<daftykins> mmm only got a 16-port unmanaged toy here :>
<TJ-> It's 1U and was noisy but I took out the 4 small side fans and fitted one large 12cm fan in the top instead
<daftykins> http://techblo.gg/stuff/hyperv.png
<daftykins> thar she blows
<daftykins> it's crawling with just two XD
<TJ-> how many vCPUs have you allocated?
<daftykins> it's IO bound right now i think :) one little 500GB mechanical with both VMs on
<TJ-> on my Core2Duo laptop I can generally run 4 VM guests each using 2 vCPUs without much sign of slowdown
<daftykins> so this is the basic operation, but system centre virtual machine manager will install all kinds of junk like SQL server
<daftykins> TJ-: do you think RAID10 is the best choice for the VM store of a box with a hardware controller card and possibly 8+ 1TB WD Greens?
<daftykins> i think that's what it's always been at this place
 * nicomachus needs to find where to get one of these "1tb thumb drives"
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> it's either wrong, or actually a hard disk
<BluesKaj> quite sure it's a hdd with usb connection
<BluesKaj> or he doesn't know the diff between Gb and Tb
<daftykins> GB and TB!
<daftykins> :)
 * BluesKaj shrugs ...
<daftykins> i throw many GB over my Gb LAN
<nicomachus> well apparently they do exist... but theyre like $750
<nicomachus> http://www.amazon.com/Kingston-DataTraveler-Predator-1TB-DTHXP30/dp/B00E65QM8O
<daftykins> XD
<TJ-> daftykins: I always prefer mirrored RAID, so RAID10 is good
<BluesKaj> too small, i've already lost a couple of those little sticks
<BluesKaj> not 1TB mind you :-)
<nicomachus> this guy's getting ripped off all over the place.
<daftykins> i don't quite believe we're getting told the full story, but mmm
<nicomachus> likely.
<daftykins> right now i'm imagining this thing to be a chinese knock-off that claims to be 1TB but actually just loops over and over :)
<daftykins> although it would forget sdb1 existed if so, hmm
<DosTuMai> Great to see a clear desktop, Daftykins. =D
<daftykins> DosTuMai: haha, that is a server i only just installed ;)
<DosTuMai> My most recent desktop: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B1XfDBb8toplSnRxdUJRMGY2bHM
<daftykins> ooh my that's an old school res :)
<DosTuMai> This is an oldskool laptop. Aspire 5315! xD
<daftykins> oy
<OerHeks> what are the pros of an video hdd? like Seagate Video 3.5 HDD ST3320311CS, 320GB
<daftykins> is that really its' name? o0
<OerHeks> yes, got it from a tv mediabox, harddisk recorder
<OerHeks> 15 ms seektime
<daftykins> oic, mmm usually different lines have different ratings for MTBF or whether they're expected to be able to run 24x7
<OerHeks> That would be my thought, 24/7 ..
<TJ-> 'video' generally means poor random I/O performance
<TJ-> e.g. OK for sustained contiguous writes as is typical in video-recording
<DosTuMai> And a lot of segfaults when trying to run it as a desktop HDD.
<OerHeks> oh oke
<daftykins> DosTuMai: you've actually seen that? o0
<OerHeks> anyone who needs a poor hdd, sata300 ?
<OerHeks> :-D
<daftykins> can't see the two being related myself
<daftykins> haha, give it to DosTuMai - it might be an upgrade ;)
<OerHeks> i would swap it for ... ehm .. a fresh keyboard
<DosTuMai> It will be! xD
<OerHeks> ,,, really?
<daftykins> DosTuMai: i actually feel so bad i almost want to post you an SSD.
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> i'd totally expect cookies for that, though
<DosTuMai> I don't think this could handle a SSD! xD
<daftykins> aaah it improves everything :)
<DosTuMai> I'll be buying a proper PC soonâ¢, anyways.
<daftykins> yay
<nicomachus> apparently I got a better deal on this monitor yesterday than I thought: http://www1.la.dell.com/la/en/corp/peripherals/monitor_e207wfp/pd.aspx?refid=monitor_e207wfp&s=corp
<nicomachus> cheapest I can find on Amazon is $62
<OerHeks> not bad, 1680x1050  is my current resolution too
<nicomachus> it's set at 1440x900 now
<OerHeks> ah, maybe because your 1st screen is lower
<nicomachus> yep. only 1366x768
<daftykins> why not 1:1 ? anything less than matched will look blurry and meh
<DosTuMai> 1280x800 >_>
<daftykins> ;]
<nicomachus> daftykins: 16x9 v. 16x10 I suppose
<daftykins> i'm not gonna play the desktop resolution game because then TJ- will say his ;)
<TJ-> why? i'm using standard on all the monitors
<daftykins> haha sure but the total one :>
<daftykins> i.e. i'd have said 3840x1200
<DosTuMai> o_o
<TJ-> I've never added it up, because I use multiple X screens
<daftykins> nicomachus: nah i mean - are you using 1440x900 on that 1680x1050 panel?
<TJ-> but as you insist: W = 1200+1200+1920+1200 , H = 1920+1200
<nicomachus> daftykins: yea, it won't let me select anything higher. could force it with xrandr I suppose
<daftykins> nicomachus: hmm what cable type and graphics?
<nicomachus> VGA, integrated intel
<daftykins> which CPU?
<nicomachus> i3-2350M
<daftykins> ah i have a sandybridge lappy too
<TJ-> Set the external to be the primary; then it should allow it to use full res
<nicomachus> TJ-: it is the primary.
<TJ-> nicomachus: really? then it should be possible to use the max res the EDID reports, provided the framebuffer is large enough
<TJ-> nicomachus: what does "xrandr -q" report?
<nicomachus> 1440x900 as top. wanna see the whole thing?
<TJ-> please, it should show for all
<nicomachus> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/14120861/
<TJ-> nicomachus: OK, well according to that the best resolution is 1440x900.  You need to check /var/log/Xorg.0.log to ensure the monitor is reporting EDID, and if it is, then those are the valid resolutions
<daftykins> it should be pretty apparent if it's not the native resolution
<daftykins> text would be quite ugly
<nicomachus> well, the text is a big ugly.
<nicomachus> s/big/bit/
<nicomachus> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/14120926/
<daftykins> whole file would be handy really
<TJ-> nicomachus: lets see the whole file, a snip isn't useful. It may be corrupted or modes it lists might confirm things
<nicomachus> http://paste.ubuntu.com/14120941/
<daftykins> this is hilarious, to manage this Server 2012 R2 system i need a *second* one to put the management tools on
<TJ-> nicomachus: looks like the 'LGD' is the laptop's panel
<TJ-> nicomachus:  is it 1366x768 ?
<nicomachus> yep.
<daftykins> i'd figure the Dell for a samsung panel
<TJ-> intel(0): switch to mode 1366x768@60.0 on LVDS1
<TJ-> there's no indication of EDID from the VGA1 port there
<daftykins> bad cable?
<daftykins> nicomachus: is this the machine you have Windows on too, or is that different?
<nicomachus> ha, bought the cable for $0.98 out of the bin there. I've got another one I can try.
<nicomachus> and yea this has windows.
<daftykins> i'd see what that does
<nicomachus> ugh. I haven't booted it up in forever. the updates alone will take an hour. lol
<nicomachus> I'll give it a shot later though.
<daftykins> just ignore them :>
<nicomachus> ok, back in a moment.
<TJ-> you could install edid-decode tools
<TJ-> oops
<nicomachus> same resolutions.
<nicomachus> Windows does actually identify the monitor though. the most I could get out of Ubuntu was "Dell Inc 19". Windows shows "Dell E198WP"
<TJ-> nicomachus: either that is correct then, and reported via EDID
<TJ-> or, there's a pretty sophisticated hack in the monitor firmware :D
<nicomachus> I think I had the wrong link before.
<nicomachus> best explanation
<OerHeks> always open an uneven number of tabs on Firefox, like 59 or 61
<TJ-> those are the native resolutions
<nicomachus> still $55 on Amazon, wow
<nicomachus> I feel like I ripped off the thrift store
<DosTuMai> Okidoki, started typing what I said in #ubuntu here, this chan closed and posted in the wrong channel...
<daftykins> oops
<daftykins> DosTuMai: don't you know #ubuntu-discuss is like the Hotel California?
<DosTuMai> Because this channel is on my auto-join list, so you're right!
<OerHeks> uh oh
<DosTuMai> But yah, I never got that: I have 60+ tabs open on my browser, FSM knows how many other programs open, therefore: NEED MOAR RAM!
<daftykins> a client who keeps leaving so many windows and tabs open just plain annoys me
<daftykins> "you're never going to read that! STOP IT!"
<OerHeks> It is just silly, indeed.
 * TJ- hides
<TJ-> I keep them open from support issues, with interesting stuff, and then when about 80 collect I try to file them in groups
<daftykins> i'm quite sad mozilla are killing tab groups from Firefox :(
<DosTuMai> But you don't blame the tech for your habits, TJ-. Or at least, you haven't complained about need more memory...
<nicomachus> TJ-: pinned tabs...?
<TJ-> True :) I keep on trying to get around to filing them away or dismissing them but there's always something in them I think 'ooo, nice, must read that later'
<DosTuMai> I usually dump all those in my unsorted bookmarks and the page never meets my browser again...
<TJ-> I think I get caught up in too much multi-tasking... I push onto the stack and don't pop enough!
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> support queries are so hard for that, before you know it you have 12 pastebins open
<DosTuMai> "This looks interesting, I'll bookmark it for later perusal." 10 minutes later, it's forgotten because things.
<daftykins> what we need is some kind of squoo.sh ...
 * TJ- hides
<TJ-> I'm aiming for a 1.1.2016 launch
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> are you still keen on coming up with a better domain prior? ;)
<TJ-> I think it makes a great name for an OS :p
<TJ-> no, I like it
<TJ-> will be fun watching people trying to explain what it is :D
<DosTuMai> Squoosh... was it sat on by an elephant?
<TJ-> No, by daftykins  :D
<daftykins> :O
<DosTuMai> No comment. =o
<daftykins> i'll have you know i'm a lean, mean, cookie eating machine.
<TJ-> he's the one camped on that name
<daftykins> ^_^
<daftykins> hey i can rally more for my cause!
<TJ-> yup :D
<daftykins> oh man the downside of me creating a second server2012 R2 as a VM, updates x 2 >_<
 * TJ- sniggers
<TJ-> clone the image - oh - you can't :D
<daftykins> i think i could as it goes
<daftykins> as they're an eval copy
<daftykins> hi rww
<TJ-> hmmm, maybe, but it still ties to the drivers, and the wrong drivers will be installed
<TJ-> remember Windows doesn't do dynamic boot-device discovery
<DosTuMai> Noep, because MS wants you to stay with them.
<daftykins> actually...
 * daftykins browses onto the physical host from the VM and copies the downloaded windows updates to avoid a second download
<DosTuMai> Or do that. xD
<daftykins> there's only 37,000 files
<daftykins> ;)
<DosTuMai> Still faster than downloading, or not?
<TJ-> Is that ridiculous, or what?
<daftykins> well it's 'cause i'm just doing the whole directory tree instead of just the 'Download' one, but yeah - WU management is a crime
<daftykins> i think WU will end up sitting looking cocked-headed at the files for a while regardless ;)
<TJ-> might as well go to bed now and it might be ready for morning
<daftykins> indeed!
<daftykins> usually quite like to have everything off overnight though, as i already have my server running 24x7
<TJ-> isn't it cheaper electricity overnight
<nicomachus> usually
<TJ-> During winter I charge the batteries overnight
<daftykins> we pick our bands over here, i think mine is 9pm - midnight
<daftykins> stay tuned for the thrilling result, folks - we're at 90%!
<TJ-> we get 'economy 7' overnight from midnight, or 1am, I forget which
<TJ-> it was a tariff originally designed for heating up storage radiators that contained heat bricks overnight, so they released heat during the day.
<daftykins> hrmm o0
<daftykins> they call ours super economy 12 i think
<daftykins> may've said before, but we have a huge cable link to France, via Jersey - so get our power from them
<DosTuMai> I'm on a pre-pay meter, think my cheap electricity is 5am when I get up.
<daftykins> i bet even i could write a better windows update, this is shocking
<daftykins> i don't see how it can take so long to go "this is what's installed" -> download available list -> "i need these" -> check local folders for 'these' -> batch download the rest
<daftykins> sorry folks, i'd move the rant to ##windows-discuss but i bet it's inhumane in there ;)
<Bashing-om> ^ Just one more reason why I avoid Windows . Do not like it, do not do it .
<DosTuMai> My thoughts exactly, Bashing-om.
<Bashing-om> DosTuMai: Too had good upbring'n .
<daftykins> well, i see issues across all OSs... so as i always say, you just use what you mind picking up after the least
<DosTuMai> Ordered, organised and polite? Sure, guess I was raised to become a decent human being...
<daftykins> in this case however... i'm learning something so i can be fully informed when i say it needs to go :)
<Bashing-om> " Ordered, organised and polite? " Uh Huh .. sounds like linix to me .
<DosTuMai> I was raised by religious fanatic family. Yah, that's the nicest way I can put it.
<daftykins> nasty
<daftykins> so they all owned macs? :D
<Bashing-om> Well. Raise your children in the admonition of the Lord, and in their old age they will still be Ordered, organised and polite . :)
<DosTuMai> They didn't trust computers, my father - despite having more money than he'll ever spend - still has a CRT TV because he doesn't trust flat screens...
<daftykins> oh dear!
<daftykins> sounds like a scary place to be
<DosTuMai> That's fine, I've been disinherited, disowned, and branded heretic. Better off not having anything to do with them. And anyway, this time of year sucks enough without dredging up memories.
<daftykins> DosTuMai: mm, sorry to have enabled it
<daftykins> well here's the exciting result, the physical box only had 500MB of the 1.4GB of updates, but copying those over did indeed spare it from downloading that 500MB again ^_^
<DosTuMai> Yey, joy. xD
<daftykins> installing update 92 of 156
<daftykins> 8D
<daftykins> all this geekery has made this room really warm
<DosTuMai> And the peaceful sound of computers whirring, eh? =]
<TJ-> Hmmm, am I doing something wrong? Mine buzz?
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> it is quite the background *something* yeah :)
<TJ-> apparently daftykins go 'squoosh'
<daftykins> hahahaha
<DosTuMai> xD
<TJ-> that's the water cooling :D
<daftykins> 10 PRINT "SQUOOSH"
<daftykins> 20 GOTO 10
<TJ-> 20 GOTO 10
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> oh dear ;)
<OerHeks> rand usr 0
<TJ-> int main (int argc, char **argv, char **env) { printf("%s\n", "SQUOOSH"); return 0; }
<TJ-> see - no race condition in my code :D
<Bashing-om> ^ But but but .. "SQUOOSH" !! daftykins Has that linked to "  check local folders for 'these' " . Maybe a never ending process ?
<daftykins> :D
<TJ-> I think Juniper are about to be slaughtered
<Bashing-om> SQUOOSH-ed ?
<TJ-> worse. Last week they revealed their ScreenOS (VPN edge concentrator) had 2 source-code compromises
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-12-19
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: It is still here . But tis a slow Sunday .
<lotuspsychje> hey mate
<lotuspsychje> what you guys think of this?
<lotuspsychje> http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/12/fedora-and-ubuntu-0days-show-that-hacking-desktop-linux-is-now-a-thing/
<lotuspsychje> the guy says linux is vunrable as windows and macs these days
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: There is a discussion thread on the forum . Th forun is slow right now in "seraching" . Soon as I can I find the thread.
<lotuspsychje> oh cool, let me know
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Got it : https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2346560&highlight=0-days .
<lotuspsychje> lemme check
<lotuspsychje> seems like updated systems are patched as always
<Bashing-om> Yeah .. I tend to have a high degree of trust in mc4man .
<Bashing-om> One thing about the ubuntu security team .. when an expoit is discovered .. they are some kind of quick .
<lotuspsychje> still scary to know, 0days reaching the regular ubuntu desktops lately
<lotuspsychje> it means the attackers targetting the avarage desktop user that doesnt update daily
<Bashing-om> yes, that is true ! Keep updated . And Chris Evans is to be applauded for his efforts .
<lotuspsychje> yeah i also think this must be taken real serious
<Bashing-om> Chris was not hellering wolf !
<lotuspsychje> morning dax
<dax> hi
<lotuspsychje> dax: you missed out morning security talk: http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/12/fedora-and-ubuntu-0days-show-that-hacking-desktop-linux-is-now-a-thing/
<lotuspsychje> what you think of this?
<dax> I hope it's a warning for the sort of Linux fan who likes to go on about Windows having security vulnerabilities as though Linux doesn't. Past all that sort of thing... Linux desktop really needs more sandboxing.
<dax> We have this bizarre thought process where we protect the stuff that can be gotten back by reinstalling, but everything in $HOME is free game for random browser exploits.
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<lotuspsychje> doesnt apparmor takes care of this stuff?
<dax> More specifically-related to this particular issue... the attack surface presented by gstreamer in Firefox is clearly ridiculously over-large if it includes a SNES emulator.
<dax> lotuspsychje: last I looked a few years ago there was an apparmor profile for firefox that was disabled by default
<lotuspsychje> i see..
<dax> but yes, selinux or apparmor are the sorts of things we need more of
<dax> but they're *really* hard to do in a way that doesn't compromise usability
<dax> see for example fedora users and their tendency to just turn selinux off the first time it stops something they want to do
<lotuspsychje> i guess it will be alway a cat n mouse game with 0days
<lotuspsychje> exploiting peoples bad habbits
<lotuspsychje> even on a more secure Os
<dax> indeed
<lotuspsychje> wasnt there like a sort of sandbox package already?
<lotuspsychje> !info firejail
<ubot5`> firejail (source: firejail): sandbox to restrict the application environment. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.9.38-1 (xenial), package size 138 kB, installed size 491 kB (Only available for linux-any)
<lotuspsychje> but i dont see the avarge john doe using that
<Bashing-om> A pause for the cause - gotta sleep somtimes, and my sometime has arrived . G nite
<lotuspsychje> yeah sometimes :p
<lotuspsychje> bbl
<ducasse> morning all
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<ducasse> greetings and salutations, BluesKaj :)
<BluesKaj> Hi ducasse, how's it going?
<ducasse> just about to wrap my christmas gifts
 * BluesKaj nods
<ducasse> BluesKaj: have you heard anything about whether there will be a new pi next year?
<BluesKaj> ducasse, no, but I haven't researched that possibility either
<ducasse> i read somewhere that new models have typically  been released in february, so i'm just curious.
<ducasse> guess i'll just get another rpi3 now, and wait and see. it's not like it's a big investment :)
<daftykins> ducasse: christmas kittens in 4K! https://www.dropbox.com/s/50xmsuxadlinsy7/VID_20161219_133034.mp4?dl=0
<daftykins> :)
<OerHeks> njummie
<nicomachus> youngins
<ducasse> that squeak really woke up my cat - she's now looking sceptically around to find out where it came from :)
<ducasse> i'm going to play it again >:-)
<nicomachus> film it
<nicomachus> then I'll show that film to my cat
<ducasse> lol
<OerHeks> Drabber would be terrified, finding those 2 in house
<ducasse> daftykins: are these yours?
<OerHeks> the only chihuahua i know that is affraid of cats :-D
<daftykins> ducasse: nah my clients wife picked them up to add to their house of crazy!
<ducasse> some day i'll start collecting kittens, then i'll be the mad cat guy in the neighborhood.
<daftykins> :>
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-12-20
<Bashing-om> That's all folks - for me. G nite
<ducasse> hi all
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<OerHeks> :-)
<BluesKaj> hey OerHeks
<OerHeks> good afternoon, BluesKaj, i overslept the day
<ducasse> OerHeks: drapper didn't wake you? how rude :)
<Bashing-om> daftykins: \o/ ! Sparring of the hard drive to a different SATA port .. and *finally* getting the superblocks restored -> up and running and system seems stable at this time ,
<daftykins> :O huzzah!
<daftykins> is that all spinners on too?
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Yepper ! spinners on a seperate buss seems to be the trick . So far no ATA errors amd the spinners are not spazzing out . ( no unmount remount crazinness ) .
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Several hours effort to restore the superblocks . finally zero'n out the sector allowed to spare the superblock(s) off . File system checks run clean !
<daftykins> sorry, you had to zero a funky superblock at the start? like the first one?
<Bashing-om> That is what I finally did ' dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sdxx bs=4096 count=1 seek=0 ' <- remapp the sector :) When all else had failed .
<Bashing-om> Guys, just updated and 4.4.0-57 kernel is out for 16.04 .
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-12-21
<Bashing-om> Good Nite good Folks
<ducasse> good morning all
<lordievader> o/
<daftykins> \o
<pauljw> hi everyone
<daftykins> \o
<EriC^^> hi pauljw
<EriC^^> hi daftykins
<pauljw> hey guys
<daftykins> heyup
<daftykins> did you see the kitties yet? :) https://www.dropbox.com/s/50xmsuxadlinsy7/VID_20161219_133034.mp4?dl=0
<pauljw> can't chk em out just yet, doing some updates and i'm beyond my data cap so things are crawling...
<daftykins> d'aww
<daftykins> 160MB source size on that one due to being 4K yip :>
<pauljw> oh
<pauljw> i don't have anything that would do it justice
<EriC^^> O.o
<daftykins> nor me XD
<daftykins> it's just what my phone can do 8D
<daftykins> there's a funny effect they've started using in gaming though, if you draw things at a higher res then scale down to a lower one - it genuinely looks better than just a 1:1 resolution
<daftykins> helps with the jaggies (aliasing)
<EriC^^> oh
<pauljw> cool
<daftykins> i played it on my clients' 2560x1600 30" Dell monitor which looked a bit better, but still not 4K :>
<BluesKaj> Hi all
<daftykins> \o
<ducasse> o/ daftykins, BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> hi ducasse
<KingsQuest> i have to avoid a gas station for totaled i need seeds Amsterdam issue 1985 08970067 Genius enhancer with pleasure increase for job well done.  i'm a linux and mac developer.  my work for Microsoft 64 bit Enterprise has already been declared for the US.  it's just a little special thing.
<daftykins> hi troll, your translator is bad
<KingsQuest> i love discussions more than i love offtopic :D
<KingsQuest> it's legal for me under United States Federal law in Texas under TX Statute 08097658430003-2-0-9
<KingsQuest> but i do apologize if it i said the wrong thing.
<nicomachus> your english is bad and you should feel bad.
<KingsQuest> i'm American not United Kingdom.  i didn't have Kings Charles Parliment in June 8, 1988
<DArqueBishop> My Derp to English translator is broken, but I'm pretty sure that almost nothing you said is right.
<daftykins> !ops
<ubot5`> Help! Channel emergency! (ONLY use this trigger in emergencies) - Pici, Myrtti, jrib, Amaranth, tonyyarusso, Nalioth, lamont, CarlK, elky, mneptok, PriceChild, Tm_T, jpds, ikonia, Flannel, genii, wgrant, stdin, h00k, IdleOne, nhandler, Jordan_U, popey, Corey, ocean, cprofitt, djones, Madpilot, gnomefreak, lhavelund, k1l, rww, phunyguy, bazhang, chu
<daftykins> do your job please
<KingsQuest> this is a discussion
<nicomachus> this is solid entertainment, though.
<KingsQuest> i already apologized for thing said out of place
<KingsQuest> i'm on linkedin. see ya
 * phunyguy expects to have his Ubuntu paycheck docked for ignoring this.
<daftykins> how dare you :)
<phunyguy> well I wasn't doing my job.
<daftykins> as is tradition
 * phunyguy wanders off and mutters something about better things to do.
<daftykins> you wish ;)
<Ben64> he has a g35 to drive
<Ben64> every other car feels like a boat now : /
<Ben64> drove a friend's honda last night, was weird
<daftykins> o0
<Ben64> ?
<Ben64> no car i've driven handles nearly as well as a g35
<nicomachus> 325i
<nicomachus> WRX
<daftykins> i don't drive
<Ben64> both of which i haven't driven nicomachus
<Ben64> i really want to rent an aston martin or something fancy like that
<daftykins> oop lost him
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-12-22
<linearain> hi
<Bashing-om> Nighty nite good folks
<ducasse> good morning all
<BluesKaj> Hi all
<ducasse> good morning BluesKaj - how are things?
<BluesKaj> hi ducasse, ok here, and you?
<ducasse> good, thanks. ready for the holidays :) reading the capsman docs before getting into setup, but i hate wifi :-/
<daftykins> o0
<ducasse> \o daftykins
<daftykins> good afty
<daftykins> what's this wifi hatred caused by? :) i mean it's a pretty default state for all, but specifically today? :D
<ducasse> i think it's mainly because i just quit smoking - it's certainly not helping :)
<daftykins> ooh congrats
<ducasse> thanks, it had to be done sooner or later.
<ducasse> i like capsman, i just don't like the underlying tech. wired ftw.
<daftykins> ah i had to look that up, surely that's only relevant to a corporate setup
<ducasse> i'm just using it to learn it, since i've got two mikrotik devices anyway.
<daftykins> *nod*
<daftykins> i just heard a radio discussion program about the UK government finding Â£440 million spare and deciding to help rural folks get broadband with it
<ducasse> oooh, nice!
<daftykins> one person called in and said their village dug a trench themselves for their fiber line, then a company 'b4rn' came in and laid it - sounds kinda neat
<daftykins> https://b4rn.org.uk/ funky
<ducasse> i read about a guy near bergen who laid his own fiber, got a spool from china and paid a local isp to hook him up.
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> that'd be tempting, but i remember TJ said there's a lot of regulations involved plus i'd imagine having to ask every person for permission to dig on their land would get old quick
<ducasse> this was his land -> public -> pole -> isp iirc
<ducasse> he had to talk to the council, that was about it.
<daftykins> mmm that's handy
<ducasse> transport on a full spool of fiber from china was not cheap, though, and it was a lot of work.
<daftykins> i wonder if the island by me has repaired their fiber links yet...
<daftykins> can't even look it up as all results speak of New Jersey
<ducasse> my mother just signed up for fiber, maybe i should rollback 25 years and move into her basement :)
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> or just put a box there you control ;)
<ducasse> seedbox? :)
<daftykins> anything!
<daftykins> are you close enough that regular visits are feasible? :P
<ducasse> about 40km. but i've got more bandwidth than she's likely to go for, i just got upgraded to 250mbps because changed pricing.
<ducasse> what happened to the island near you that broke their fiber?
<daftykins> well everything here carried on as normal but they lost all their links to England - had to shift them all to their routes to France i imagine
<ducasse> hmm. big or small island? smaller often uses microwave, don't they?
<daftykins> Jersey's a bit bigger than the one i'm on
<ducasse> i've been looking for a new desk, want to fit another screen. found a nice, solid slab of a desk that i'm hoping to pick up next week. just need to organize transport, i don't drive...
<daftykins> have you seen those brackets that clamp to one spot on the back of the desk... then arms reach out that have VESA mountings?
<daftykins> that'd be nice to avoid the requirement for desk stands
<ducasse> i've thought about those, but only one of my current screens has a vesa mount.
<daftykins> ah drat!
<daftykins> ooh there's a good channel shuffle, 5 removed
<ducasse> it would be nice, as it would be easier to line screens up edge to edge, but both of my current ones have controls on the right side...
<nicomachus> http://i.imgur.com/48LLlss.jpg
<DArqueBishop> nicomachus: I kinda want that shirt now.
<daftykins> me too :o
<ducasse> nice :)
<daftykins> aaah i am muchly bored until work is available again :P
<daftykins> i think i need to redevelop the ability to enjoy downtime!
<nicomachus> daftykins: my entire office is basically just waiting for Christmas to get here. I've barely done anything productive this week.
<daftykins> hehe
<nicomachus> here's the shirt: https://www.redbubble.com/people/cosmogorilla/works/21144265-obey-sudo?grid_pos=50&p=t-shirt&style=mens
<daftykins> ooh good man
<nicomachus> $24.80, not bad.
<nicomachus> and lots of colors.
<DArqueBishop> Interesting.
<DArqueBishop> I was on Redbubble yesterday because on a whim I was looking for Neuromancer-themed laptop bags.
<DArqueBishop> I saw some laptop skins that made me wish my laptop wasn't a company-provided one.
<nicomachus> oh wow, you can even get it in a hoodie, long-sleeve, graphic, whatever...
<nicomachus> I like this one: https://www.redbubble.com/people/cosmogorilla/works/21144265-obey-sudo?p=mens-graphic-t-shirt&style=mens-graphic-t-shirt&body_color=black
<pauljw> Hi everyone
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-12-23
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Hey. A thought. Hoz that "book" comming along ? I have yet to see my share of the royalties :)
<Bashing-om> To slow for me to keep up . Gone to bed - G nite
<ducasse> good morning all
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<ducasse> \o BluesKaj - hope you are well and have a wonderful xmas :)
<BluesKaj> hi ducasse, thanks, have a very Merry Christmas as well and the best to you and yours for the new year :-)
<Bashing-om> Procrastinating; I can come up with no better way than here on IRC .
<nicomachus> me, all day
<ducasse> hiya Bashing-om - back in business? ;)
<Bashing-om> The rain is is comming .. Rather than get caught out in the rain .. I just pester all yall :)
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Wonder of wonders, moving the spinners off the same SATA buss as the SSD ( and great grieve to fix the file systems on the spinners) .. and YES .. solid and stable !
<nicomachus> we had some ice this morning.
<nicomachus> like... sleet I guess.
<nicomachus> or just frozen rain
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Here is unseasonably warm ! .. no ice .. NO white Christmas . My feelings are not hurt .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: had a similar problem once, turned out to be some bad caps on one controller, causing some drives to work while others failed. resoldered, and everything was fine.
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Yeah, had that same thought of bad caps .. took a flashlight and a magnifing glass to look . saw nothing to get concerned about . Been stable for 2 days now ... but my fingers are still crossed .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: what kind of board is this?
<Bashing-om> ducasse: An old Abit KN9 SLI, nvidia chip sets ! I recently replaced the ATI graphic's card with an nVida card ( just prior to installeing the SSD)  .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: cpu socket?
<ducasse> (too lazy to look up myself ;)
<ducasse> Bashing-om: only reason i ask is because i might  have a functioning board you can use - you're welcome to it.
<Bashing-om> ducasse: It be on AM2 sockets .. but these boards are so old ! Really not worth the effort to keep them up . Besides which I have an newer box ( Asrock board) that I could move the drives to .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: ah,  ok then. let me know if you need anything, though, lots of stuff in my magic box of tricks :)
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Thanks ! .. Always nice to have a shoulder to lean on - sometimes just to cry on ! But really, I have had and worked on this present box so long and so much ... I am kind of partial to it . Still able to do all I want of it and more . Runs 16.04 just fine so I am good 'til 2021 !
<ducasse> Bashing-om: you have the right attitude:  run it till the magic smoke  disappears! ;)
<Bashing-om> ducasse: This ole box is 'most "sailor proof" .. takes a beating and keeps on keep'n on . Sometimes I do have to beat on it .. stubborn mule that it is .
<OerHeks> desktops are out.
<OerHeks> i feel silly with a pc&lcd ready to go stored in a corner.
<nicomachus> desktops are not out.
<nicomachus> desktops are just getting a new purpose.
<Bashing-om> How do you know you are getting  old ? .. can only think straight sitting in front of a desktop machine !
<daftykins> >:)
<Bashing-om> In that catagory of "old" - still use a PS2 mechanical keyboard .. just to old to change now ! The noise is comforting , and the Wife can keep track of me .
<daftykins> PS/2 is better than USB for peripherals i think :) lower level interrupts
<Bashing-om> daftykins: So long as ya keep in mind ... can not hot swap !
<daftykins> indeed! although i did encounter some newer boards that still keep PS/2, which are capable
<Bashing-om> If ya can find them ! Here in backwards county Ark. try and find a PS2 mouse .. Uh Huh .not enough local demand to even stock them .. shucks !
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-12-24
<ducasse> \o all - christmas greetings to all of you! :)
<Bashing-om> ducasse: TY, and same to you , May all be well with you .
<ducasse> i'm sure we'll be fine, i plan to overeat on turkey and get a buzz from the tryptamine :)
<Bashing-om> Christmas ham for us ! .. Yummy .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: is that a regional thing, or pretty widespread in the us?
<Bashing-om> ducasse: well. not real sure .. seems though that turkey in the US is a Thanksgiving thing, and ham for Xmas .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: there are literally tons of regional traditions for christmas dinner here in norway, i'd guess ribs or something called 'pinnekjÃ¸tt' are the most common. i stick with the turkey, though - yum :)
<ducasse> finished shopping etc?
<Bashing-om> ducasse: yeah .. Finished up the shopping and buying last week . May take us another year to pay off the credit cards . Now is that not the American way ?
<ducasse> hehe, heard on the news today that norwegians had bought xmas presents for ~60bn NOK so far in december...
<Bashing-om> ducasse: The biggest shopping season ! What a web we weave for ourselves .
<ducasse> insanity :(
<ducasse> i got an amazing deal today!
<Bashing-om> A 30" LCD monitor for a 100 bucks ?
<ducasse> a really high-quality, nice big desk, ~Â£15. finally my dream of three monitors might come true!
<ducasse> picking it up  on tuesday.
<Bashing-om> nice :))
<ducasse> so next time i get payed i'm ordering a third screen - i can't wait :) will also get a trackpad or similar, my wrist pain is killing me.
<ducasse> *paid?
<Bashing-om> paid, is correct . I wish . This living on the fixed income - retirement - is not all it was cracked up to be .
<Bashing-om> where cracked up is " cracking eggs to make an omelet " kind of thing .
<ducasse> well, i have a couple of disabilities  preventing me from working, so i feel your pine. not that i'm complaining, i live a good life and praise my lucky stars i  was born in norway.
<ducasse> *your pain
<ducasse> Bashing-om: do you know much about either nvidia gpus or monitors - especially the former?
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Well a bit of knowledge of Nvidia GPUs, why ?
<ducasse> my nephew is often here and wants to game, was thinking of getting a gpu that can handle basic gaming, but no idea where to start.
<ducasse> gtg, brb
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Well , I am very impressed with the GT710, has 2 Gigs of of on-board memory to take the load off the CPU, Reasonably priced at $38.00 USD for the EVGA product . No cooling fan but I can not believe how much cooler my box runs with this card .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: i'll check that out, thanks :)
<Bashing-om> ducasse: I did some homework before choosing this card . For the money I do not think you can beat it . I bet it does well in the less graphic;s intensive games . When it comes to gaming and graphic's cards, the sky is the limit cost wise !
<ducasse> Bashing-om: this is just so hew can play some basic games, top performance not neccesary...
<ducasse> *he
<ducasse> got to hit bed, much too late for me!
<Bashing-om> ducasse: N N . As I say this card impresses me. even running with the vesa driver it beats that old ATI card all hollow .
<Bashing-om> And I too am out of here.
<ducasse> good morning all, merry christmas to everyone!
<boshhead> merry christmas eve ducasse! :)
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<boshhead> hi BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> hi boshhead
<BluesKaj> Merry Christmas to and to all a Good Night! :-)
<EriC^^> hey daftykins
<daftykins> o/
<EriC^^> happy holidays :)
<daftykins> and to you sir!
<EriC^^> thank you
<daftykins> you got much planned or are things not done down there?
<EriC^^> not much
<EriC^^> planning to drink some beer now, my grandma's asleep
<EriC^^> trying not to call this girl i was dating
<EriC^^> ..it's a struggle, lol
<EriC^^> what about you?
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> lunch with the family tomorrow, then back to work :D
<EriC^^> cool :D
<EriC^^> i feel like i should call her cause it's xmas eve plus she texted me and i didn't reply, but she's kind of flippy
<daftykins> ooh yeah you should at least say hi!
<EriC^^> she was bitching like crazy though last time we went out
<EriC^^> about my driving, wth like stupid stuff she was going bazerk
<EriC^^> like serious bitch mode
<daftykins> ooh err
<daftykins> might have a screw loose then ;)
<daftykins> or do you drive like you're playing GTA? :D
<EriC^^> lol
<EriC^^> well i was driving not that much
<EriC^^> but she was going nuts on stuff like i'm to the left and there's a car to the right and i can't yet switch lanes and she'd flip out
<EriC^^> she's pretty bossy
<EriC^^> like i was lowering the window and she was bitching that it's freezing (it was like a perfect sunny afternoon)
<EriC^^> she did something i sort of didn't like at all and made me wonder
<daftykins> could be a sign she's worth friend-zoning!
<EriC^^> she's fun most of the time, everything was going great til the last date we had
<EriC^^> i was like O.o
<EriC^^> plus she didn't like i wasn't into religious stuff
<EriC^^> i dont know if that ticked her off or something
<daftykins> hrmm
<EriC^^> i'm kind of like sketchy of what she did, i'll explain in tj's channel
<daftykins> *nod*
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-12-25
<ducasse> good morning all!
<BluesKaj> A very Merry Christmas to all who celebrate it :-)
<ducasse> the same to you BluesKaj (and anyone else lurking here ;)
<ducasse> BluesKaj: your celebrations are today, aren't they?
<BluesKaj> ducasse, we celebrate on Christmas Eve in the Swedish/Finnish tradition and Chriatmas Day in the Canadian Tradition , since our family is made up of both cultures
<ducasse> aha, i see. i got a shaving kit, wondering if i should take that as a hint ;)
<BluesKaj> ducasse, but you celebrate  Scandinavian Christmas , right ?
<ducasse> BluesKaj: yes, we celebrated last night, i just got in the door at home. there's a traditional extended family dinner tomorrow, so the feeding frenzy isn't over yet :)
<ducasse> today i'm setting up an old mac mini i've got for my elderly neighbors, so they can use it to pay bills and stuff online. broadband is included in the rent, so that part is covered.
<ducasse> not a powerful machine, but it will do.
<BluesKaj> that's very kind of you , a gift to your elderly neighbour :-)
<ducasse> they are really nice, and it's better if someone can use it than it just collecting dust here. my thinking was a mac is probably easier for them to use also.
<BluesKaj> yeah, they are very user friendly computers
<ducasse> all they need is a browser, basically. i'll give them a crash course during the holidays :)
<BluesKaj> right ...I'm probly the same age , but I've been a techie all my life
<ducasse> it's really easy to think this should be simple when you've been using computers for decades yourself
<BluesKaj> I started out as an audio hobbyist and after most audio kit manufacturers disappeared I got intersted in computers after retirement which was 18 yrs ago
<BluesKaj> been on linux for about 12 yrs
<BluesKaj> a friend rescued a pc from a dumpster at work and gave it to me thinking I could get it working , that was the first pc I installed linux on. I tried several different linux OSs like knoppix,, slackware, mandrake, redhat, then debian and finally ubuntu
<ducasse> i got my first computer at age 5 (vic20) and started programmming basic. my stepdad had a pc i learned soon after, and i got my hands on slackware quite early (kernel 0.62something).
<BluesKaj> cool, I've never had much interest in proramming /coding , but the ideea od FOSS appealed to me from the get go
<ducasse> after that i got started with redhat but preferred slackware, so i switched back. i had played a little with coherent before i heard about linux, so un*x wasn't completely unknown to me. learned from old library books :)
<ducasse> i'm not much of a coder :) i know a little perl, enough shell to cause trouble, and i'm trying to learn a little python. i've also played with c, but not enough to be useful.
<ducasse> i try to help with translations, documentation etc instead, so i've translated a couple of programs to norwegian. i leave the coding to the pros, only want to know enough to fill my own needs for scripts etc.
<ducasse> i was _amazed_ at the first slackware kit i got. three cd's full of source for everything from x11 to latex. it really opened my eyes.
<BluesKaj>  I finally bought a decent pc in 2006 with 2GB RAM and a 1.8Ghz cpu ...then I discovered KDE and I was in "Linux heaven"
<BluesKaj> we did have windows pc that wife used for email and surfing the net , but I didn't fool witht it much except increase the memory an add a decent soundcard and nic .
<ducasse> i don't remember when i got my first pc, but it was an ibm ps/2 model 80. must have been the early to mid 90's.
<ducasse> one day a friend asked me if i could fix an sgi machine his company had, which i did, and that led to a job admin'ing sgi irix and hp-ux :)
 * ducasse misses _real_ unix boxen
<BluesKaj> good !
<BluesKaj> our windows pc was a 1998 model HP with celeron cpu and not much Ram , not enough to run video etc on it , but that was early days
<ducasse> i've had tons of pc's over the years, but also a few un*x machines. i got a sun ss20 from a place i worked, bought a nextstation and a dec alpha online etc. can't do that anymore, i'm too old to fill up my apartment with essentially useless hardware.
<ducasse> BluesKaj: are you still into audio?
<BluesKaj> I still maintain an interest in audio, yes
<ducasse> do you run a realtime kernel and do production on linux?
<BluesKaj> no
<ducasse> i had a couple of synths and a creamware card once, but decided i had no talent for it. it would be fun to get a midi keyboard and test current state of linux software, though.
<ducasse> my audio interest is mainly in hifi gear, and i can't afford to keep that up as much as i'd like to. as long as i can enjoy the music i'm happy.
<BluesKaj> I'm mainly a listener nowadays ...we used to record our jams a lot back in the 90's on vhs HiFi tapes, and I did transfer some songs to cd using audacity
<BluesKaj> yeah , I've had an interest HIFi equipment since the late 60s
<ducasse> i'm mainly into it because i'm an avid listener and want decent sound quality, but i'm not a complete audiophile nut. i saw an ad for gold ethernet cables costing $10k, that's just silly.
<BluesKaj> ducasse, my experience with HiFi equipment is that reaching audio nirvana seems to be a pursuit restricted only to the very wealthy, however I've listened to some pretty expensive preamps, power amps and especially Hi-end speakers and the sound can be very good , but my conclusion from yrs of experience ids that if you have a decent affordable amplifier and speakers then the source material usually determines how good
<BluesKaj> the sound will be.
<BluesKaj> expensive audio cables is suckers game IMO
<ducasse> i completely agree. back when i could afford it, i bought two fairly good monoblocks, decent speakers, a decent cd deck and stuck to fairly normal cables. the result was good enough for me, i doubt i could have told any difference with expensive cables.
<BluesKaj> my last word about HiFi equipment is that it once the equipment reaches a price point that only wealthy audiophiles can afford then the price reaches the point of diminishing returns in terms of real sound quality.
<ducasse> i always wondered if those monoblocks really sounded so much better than the (good) amp i had before, or if my brain "told" me they did because i had spent >$3k on them...
<BluesKaj> a $12K turntable made by elves in a Scottish cave doesn't sound much diffrent with decent crarteidge and stylus than my old Dual 1219 with an ADC  cartridge and  stylus
<ducasse> lol
<ducasse> a friend had a turntable hand-carved from acrylic by a swiss nuclear physicist. that world is beyond me.
<ducasse> i need a decent (but affordable) turntable, any suggestions?
<BluesKaj> i saw an aydio technica direct drive on amazon for $400 which incudes  a phono preamp ...seems like a decent deal
<BluesKaj> https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B002S1CJ2Q/ref=dra_a_cs_lb_hn_xx_P3392_100?tag=dradisplay0c-20&ascsubtag=3b90cdf4e02d2e67dd92bccadc67f9b0_S
<ducasse> thanks, i'll check that out. i've personally always been a fan of rega, but i don't think they sell them here any longer.
<BluesKaj> depends on your budget of course, there are still some higher end TTs up around $1K if you want to spend that much, but audio salon might be the place to audition that kind of equipment
<BluesKaj> yeah but regas were kind of minimalist TTs were they not?
<BluesKaj> no arm lift when the record was finished
<BluesKaj> I still have an old Philips Labs power amp that gave my home built transmission line 3 way Peerless speakers a little more low end reolution than my old heathkit 4ow/ch amp but otherwise at normal listening levels there wasn't much difference
<ducasse> no arm lift on the regas, no. they were minimalist, but great value for money. came with decent pickups, and good quality builds. i really liked mine.
<ducasse> BluesKaj: i had the predecessor to these, fantastic amps: http://exposurehifi.com/products/item/3010s2-mono-power-amplifier.html
<ducasse> and this: http://www.rega.co.uk/planar-3-2016.html
<BluesKaj> nice! :-)
<BluesKaj> i have a TT , but it's an old elcheapo pioneer belt drive I used in my Dee-Jay business back in the 80s..I switched to cd back around 1986 and hardly used my TT since...my Dual TTs are kaput
<ducasse> i also had a thule preamp (danish company) and matching cd player. both had xlr, as did the exposures, so i used those. if that is really necessary for a home system is another thing, but they were there anyway :)
<BluesKaj> xlr ?
<ducasse> balanced inputs/outputs.
<BluesKaj> oh yeah , that debate '
<BluesKaj> they work for pro sound gear with XLR and other types of inputs
<BluesKaj> lowers hum etc
<ducasse> for pro studio use where there is a lot of equipment that generates noise it might be worth it, i just used them since all my gear had them and the cables weren't really pricey.
<ducasse> BluesKaj: i've gtg, set up that mac. ttyl, enjoy your celebrations!
<BluesKaj> ducasse, same to you, nice talking to you today ..have a good one , enjoy!
<Bashing-om> I am Back .. and Christmas'n is all done with . \O/
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-12-18
<koralg889> ââââââââââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETukdgmjcp: jalcine BenderRodriguez ducasse ikevin jink nicomachus Mr_0 hggdh ReimuHakurei phunyguy LambdaComplex IdleOne guntbert el matsasc leftyfb trijntje freakyy davidcalle pchoo kostkon daftykins Hirppa Met
<koralg889> ââââââââââââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETtxcxwxr: BenderRodriguez popey StanleyHsiao Tesla42 ubot9 harrow acheronuk ubot5` eruditass davidcalle matsasc nicomachus leftyfb daftykins IdleOne Mr_0 Lukewh ubuntulog2 ducasse jink Bashin
<koralg889> ââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETqkoqeypy: kostkon Lukewh ubot5` JanC Hirppa Metacity daftykins boshhead ariver BenderRodriguez Ben64 nicomachus pauljw el dragan-s phunyguy Tesla42 alkisg eruditass trijntje ReimuHakurei matsasc KeithIMyers Mr_0 hggdh leftyfb ikevin Bashing-om EriC^^ harrow ubot9 DJones guntbert freakyy le
<koralg889> ââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETkfxyjgw: Lukewh ubot5` guntbert JanC kkremitzki Hirppa trijntje lordievader DJones alkisg acheronuk EriC^^ diarpi harrow eruditass matsasc pauljw KeithIMyers Ben64 popey Tesla42 leochill1 StanleyHsiao leftyfb hggdh jalcine Bashing-om DalekSec Spydar007 freakyy phunyguy Metacity BenderRodri
<koralg889> âââââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETlgzlzy: eruditass freakyy ubot9 BenderRodriguez jalcine el leochill1 nicomachus phunyguy ubuntulog2 popey ubot5` ducasse guntbert alkisg boshhead lordievader Lukewh matsasc LambdaComplex Ben64 Bashing-om dragan-s IdleOne acheronuk Mr_0 kkremitzki Metacity Spyd
<koralg889> âââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETcgaurtwd: Spydar007 phunyguy Ben64 nicomachus KeithIMyers eruditass IdleOne jink Tesla42 BenderRodriguez pauljw daftykins leochill1 pchoo popey ducasse ariver guntbert trijntje jalcine diarpi DJones harrow EriC^^ Metacity dragan-s ubot9 LambdaComplex lordievader Lukewh ubuntulog2
<koralg889> ââââââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNEThwpomdlqvi: el ubuntulog2 ariver pchoo eruditass Lukewh leochill1 Bashing-om LambdaComplex boshhead ikevin Hirppa trijntje guntbert nicomachus jink dragan-s alkisg StanleyHsiao Ben64 lordievader ReimuHakurei ubot5` ducasse ubot9 Metacity matsasc davi
<koralg889> ââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETffqkcz: ducasse ubot9 diarpi leochill1 pauljw eruditass dragan-s ariver LambdaComplex StanleyHsiao Mr_0 Tesla42 nicomachus BenderRodriguez hggdh el trijntje matsasc ReimuHakurei IdleOne DalekSec Bashing-om kostkon alkisg acheronuk leftyfb ikevin phunyguy ubuntulog2 EriC^^ Hirppa harrow dav
<koralg889> ââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETpvsmel: BenderRodriguez JanC DJones Mr_0 leochill1 matsasc daftykins hggdh kostkon leftyfb ubot5` boshhead ducasse DalekSec popey ubot9 ReimuHakurei kkremitzki nicomachus pchoo StanleyHsiao jalcine acheronuk davidcalle dragan-s phunyguy Hirppa Bashing-om jink alkisg freakyy eruditass el ar
<XXCoder> heys
<Leevancleef> Hi. XXCoder, what year is your Aspire One?
<Leevancleef> Do you know its CPU and RAM?
<XXCoder> first one. the orginial. linux version with ssd lol
<XXCoder> AO-101
<Leevancleef> This is a netbook from 2008?
<XXCoder> yeah
<Leevancleef> You might try Lubuntu 16.04 LTS
<XXCoder> ok
<Leevancleef> Get the Alternate download
<Leevancleef> I'm not sure if your CPU is 32 or 64-bit
<XXCoder> considering its age its hard to tell
<Leevancleef> XXCoder, run the command lscpu
<XXCoder> ah yes AOA110
<Leevancleef> What does it say in the very first line for "Architecture?"
<Leevancleef> and CPU op-modes
<XXCoder> doest say, says no lsb modules aviliable
<Leevancleef> I found the AOA110 on Newegg. It should have 512 MB RAM and the Intel Atom N270 CPU, which is 32-bit
<XXCoder> yeah not surpised, it was pretty cheap
<XXCoder> one of my favorite though
<Leevancleef> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/lubuntu/releases/16.04.1/release/lubuntu-16.04.1-alternate-i386.iso
<XXCoder> I wonder if theres a way to install distro over current distro
<XXCoder> without flash drive and such
<Leevancleef> That's a direct link to the image for Lubuntu 16.04 Alternate 32-bit, which imo is your best hope for running a currently supported version of Ubuntu
<XXCoder> ya downloading now
<Leevancleef> I don't think there's a direct upgrade path from Ubuntu 12.04 to Lubuntu 16.04, unfortunately. You're going to need installation media.
<XXCoder> yeah have to be flash drive as theres no cd drive :) on both pc and laptop lol
<Leevancleef> Remember to back up your personal files
<Leevancleef> You can use the USB as a live image to try out the OS and it should give you some idea of how it runs
<Leevancleef> XXCoder, I should point out that Lubuntu uses the LXDE light weight desktop environment. It's going to be a lot different than the Unity desktop you used in Ubuntu 12.04
<Leevancleef> But I think it might actually run better on your hardware
<XXCoder> I dont use unity
<XXCoder> in least not on pc :) its xfce mint
<XXCoder> laptop not too sure what its on
<Leevancleef> Ah, okay then
<Leevancleef> You said you were running Ubuntu 12.04
<XXCoder> yeah it seems to be custom to AOA. I remember installing it but its been few years
<ducasse> good morning, all
<alkisg> Good morning ducasse, hi all
<ducasse> hi alkisg - all well? ready for a new week? :)
<XXCoder> found old usb drive I modded into lego brick 200 years ago. lets see how much space it has
<alkisg> Yup! Starting with a clone of my disk... and trying to distrupt things less, I'll do dd sda while I'm still using it :D
<XXCoder> 256 mb not enough drat
<XXCoder> oh wait thats free space
<ducasse> alkisg: i'm going to examine that rpi in more detail today, see if it can be salvaged
<ducasse> not sure i have a recent backup of the sd card, but...
<alkisg> ducasse: another plan would be to dd/save the sd card, and dd/write a new image from e.g. mate web site
<alkisg> You can even just write noob, which is a few mb
<alkisg> Not a whole os
<alkisg> *noobs
<alkisg> http://director.downloads.raspberrypi.org/NOOBS_lite/images/NOOBS_lite-2017-04-10/NOOBS_lite_v2_4.zip => 30 MB or so
<ducasse> nah, i'll be using xbian on it, so i'll grab the latest image from their site
<alkisg> ducasse: does that have a working youtube media player?
<alkisg> Ouch "In contrast, XBian offers new package updates at least once a week" => sure method to destroy the sd cards :D
<ducasse> pretty sure the youtube addon worked when i last tried it, yes
<ducasse> i've typically only installed updates every couple of months or so, don't see the need to get them all immediately as long as it works
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<ducasse> hi lotuspsychje
<ducasse> how are you?
<lotuspsychje> morning ducasse all fine here and you?
<ducasse> all good, still quiet :)
<lotuspsychje> +R magic :p
<XXCoder> DD takes a while.
<lotuspsychje> hi XXCoder
<lotuspsychje> XXCoder: what are you doing?
<XXCoder> hey
<XXCoder> oh making flash drive install for ubuntu
<lotuspsychje> cool wich version?Âµ
<ducasse> did you set the block size with bs?
<XXCoder> lubuntu 16.04
<XXCoder> laptop may be one of best netbook ever made, but its still a netbook :)
<lotuspsychje> hardware that works needs ubuntu :p
<lotuspsychje> what you think about adding !usn line on the !eol trigger? good idea?
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^
<XXCoder> Leevancleef: well crap usb drive died lol
<XXCoder> or maybe not as it is detected in lsusb
<EriC^> morning all
<lotuspsychje> hey hey EriC^
<EriC^> hey lotuspsychje
<EriC^> how's it going?
<lotuspsychje> great EriC^ 2 pc jobs yesterday
<EriC^> awesome
<XXCoder> doing md5sum chck :)
<Leevancleef> XXCoder, You need to burn the ISO to the USB drive
<XXCoder> I just did dd
<XXCoder> seems all files verified
<XXCoder> but not too sure if it would stop with file difference or just say "error" and keep going
<XXCoder> gonna check mna
<XXCoder> man
<XXCoder> lol usb drive is now checking "cdrom drive"
<ducasse> hi EriC^ - all well?
<XXCoder> aoa110 is supposely able to have ram upgrade to 1 gb
<XXCoder> but dunno
<XXCoder> theres also touchscreen hack
<XXCoder> but cant buy it now
<EriC^> hi ducasse , yes thanks, you?
<ducasse> all good, thanks
<XXCoder> ram upgrade https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0TDKRqA7TA really nasty lol
<lotuspsychje> bbl work
<XXCoder> umm bit of weird issue
<XXCoder> laptop mouse works fine, but if it goes to sleep, and I wake it up
<XXCoder> mouse is gone unless I switch to tty 1 and back to 7
<XXCoder> besides that strange issue it works nicely. not bad for laptop from 2008
<EriC^^> XXCoder: did you try playing with acpi_osi values?
<XXCoder> oh just put laptop away lol
<EriC^^> :D
<XXCoder> previous os wasnt bad but was years old
<XXCoder> before that it was android laptoo lol
<XXCoder> then linux again for couple years as I used it for homework and programming projects
<EriC^^> aha
<EriC^^> cs major?
<XXCoder> yeah
<XXCoder> before that I used toshiba heavylaptop
<EriC^^> didnt know android had a laptop
<XXCoder> well satelette series but I call it you don't need that shoulder laptop
<XXCoder> theres project android x86
<EriC^^> heh
<XXCoder> it was 13 pounds
<EriC^^> the toshiba?
<XXCoder> acer aspire one the first (and the only good one) was very light at 1 pound or so
<XXCoder> yeah
<EriC^^> my first laptop was a hp compaq my dad sent me
<XXCoder> btw aoa110 was FIRST laptop and first publicily marketed computer with ssd.
<EriC^^> it looked hilarous, then a dell something, then i bought a hp pavilion g6, now an hp pavilion 15
<XXCoder> toshiba was already 6 years old back then, bought at late 2002
<EriC^^> xD
<EriC^^> same here the compaq was kind of dinosaurus looking
<XXCoder> I had one newer laptop, compaq one
<XXCoder> gave it away
<EriC^^> i wonder if they still make any
<EriC^^> hp bought them, and then i dunno what happened
<XXCoder> dunno
<XXCoder> hm maybe its not compaq
<XXCoder> forgot
<EriC^^> ever tried msi?
<EriC^^> its kind of gimmicky, but their hardware is pretty high end
<XXCoder> heh only msi I know is microsoft installer
<EriC^^> haha
<EriC^^> which country are you from?
<XXCoder> usa
<BluesKaj> Howdy folks
<EriC^^> hey BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hi EriC^^
<BluesKaj> what's up today?
<EriC^^> not much
<EriC^^> casual day
<EriC^^> you?
<BluesKaj> yeah, probly just do an errand or 2 later, we have freezing rain here so the roads are probly dangerous atm , wait for the salt trucks to run
<EriC^^> hey pauljw , how's it going? :)
<pauljw> hi everyone
<BluesKaj> hey pauljw
<pauljw> hi BluesKaj :)
<pauljw> hey EriC^^
<EriC^^> hey pauljw :)
<Bashing-om> Annddd we do Monday :) See what the session brings .
<lotuspsychje> good evening to all
<lotuspsychje> installed all machines with bionic
<Bashing-om> confidence !
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: or..drived to bug out :p
<lotuspsychje> 2 out 3 machines dont like wayland already
<lotuspsychje> xorg to the rescue
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: 2 ends on the same rope :)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> Client: HexChat 2.12.4 â¢ OS: Ubuntu "bionic" 18.04 â¢ CPU: AMD C-60 APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics (997MHz) â¢ Memory: Physical: 3,5 GiB Total (2,4 GiB Free) Swap: 2,0 GiB Total (2,0 GiB Free) â¢ Storage: 12,5 GB / 129,3 GB (116,8 GB Free) â¢ VGA: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI] Wrestler [Radeon HD 6290] @ Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD] Family 12h/14h Processor Funct
<lotuspsychje> ion 5 â¢ Uptime: 45m 12s
<lotuspsychje> nite nite
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-12-19
<alkisg> Good morning all
<ducasse> good morning, everyone
<ducasse> \o alkisg
<alkisg> Hey ducasse :)
<ducasse> seems quiet? :)
<alkisg> It's still early :D
<ducasse> yup, i'm hardly awake yet :)
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<ducasse> there you are, i was just starting to wonder :)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> morning ducasse
<ducasse> morning lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: got all my machines on early bionic now
<lotuspsychje> for the heavy bugging out
<lotuspsychje> 2 machines need xorg instead of wayland
<EriC^^> morning all
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^ morning
<EriC^^> heya lotuspsychje
<kkremitzki> lotuspsychje: You don't think it's too early to be running bionic?
<lotuspsychje> kkremitzki: no, some elements are already new and differe from artfull
<lotuspsychje> kkremitzki: even in early stage bugs can matter
<lotuspsychje> kkremitzki: as its LTS, things are pretty solid already too
<EriC^^> will their be unity support for 18.04?
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: thats not clear to me yet, but i read they want unity as a flavor
<EriC^^> nice
<kkremitzki> I have a bionic VM I have used and tested some and while it does seem usable it just seems early w/ risk of breakage
<lotuspsychje> kkremitzki: i understand the risks of breakage, still i havent seen any yet
<lotuspsychje> kkremitzki: can you test a bug for me?
<kkremitzki> Sure
<lotuspsychje> kkremitzki: see if you can reproduce this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/1738517
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1738517 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "Update-manager does not expand details on progress on 17.10 & 18.04" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<kkremitzki> Let me give it a shot
<lotuspsychje> tnx mate
<lotuspsychje> Ben64: you awake mate?
<lotuspsychje> Ben64: we need your graph from #ubuntu now lol
<EriC^^> i can make one if you want
<lotuspsychje> bbl
<lordievader> Good morning
<ducasse> good morning, lordievader
<ducasse> how are you?
<kkremitzki> Awesome, my 1st debian package is now available in bionic too, guess that answers my curiosity about how long it would take
<lordievader> Doing good here, how are you ducasse ?
<ducasse> lordievader: all quiet, ready for another day. bought a new microsd card yesterday, to see if i can get the rpi to boot again...
<Ben64> lotuspsychje: i'm always awake
<lotuspsychje> Ben64: can you pass that graph url you made of #ubuntu?
<lotuspsychje> Ben64: its for the discussion about +r
<lordievader> ducasse: Good luck
<EriC^^_> !info debsums
<EriC^^_> !info debsums xenial
<ubot5`> debsums (source: debsums): tool for verification of installed package files against MD5 checksums. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.2.2 (artful), package size 41 kB, installed size 120 kB
<ubot5`> debsums (source: debsums): tool for verification of installed package files against MD5 checksums. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.1.2 (xenial), package size 41 kB, installed size 213 kB
<EriC^^_> !info libfile-fnmatch-perl xenial
<ubot5`> libfile-fnmatch-perl (source: libfile-fnmatch-perl): Perl module that provides simple filename and pathname matching. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.02-2build2 (xenial), package size 9 kB, installed size 36 kB
<EriC^^_> !info linux-image-generic xenial
<ubot5`> linux-image-generic (source: linux-meta): Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version 4.4.0.104.109 (xenial), package size 2 kB, installed size 13 kB
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<pauljw> hi everyone
<BluesKaj> Hi pauljw
<pauljw> o/ hi BluesKaj :)
<BluesKaj> raining here, hope it goes away soon , we want a white Christmas
<pauljw> cloudy and too warm for snow here.... :(
<BluesKaj> I can live with mild, but snow around Christmas is nice
<BluesKaj> gonna switch over to Bionic to test some stuff ..bbiab
<pauljw> how's the testing going with bionic, BluesKaj?
<BluesKaj> it's going well, pauljw. It's really quite stable so far
<pauljw> good to hear, are you running kde or gnome?
<BluesKaj> KDE/Plasma
<pauljw> cool
<BluesKaj> a lot of gnome users on 17.10 are experimenting on wayland with mixed results...nvidia doesn't support wayland yet, altho it will run to some degree with the opensource nouveau driver, even on kde/plasma
<pauljw> :)
<pauljw> i just upgraded to 16.04 last week, so it's going to be a while before i move up.
<BluesKaj> but it still has a long way to go
<pauljw> well, there's still 4mos to go... :)
<pauljw> bbl...
<BluesKaj> oops spoke too soon,  Bioinic kwin keeps crashimg. no desktop available
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-12-20
<lotuspsychje> good morning guys
<lotuspsychje> anyone grabbed that graph url from Ben64 yet?
<lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om :p
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Hey hey .. Big plans this day ?
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: yes work lol
<alkisg> Good morning all
<lotuspsychje> hey alkisg
<alkisg> :)
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: :D - Well, we do as we must do . Things we do to support the stomach .
 * lotuspsychje pokes Ben64 
<lotuspsychje> we need you mate lol
<Bashing-om> Eyes doing a number . time to cease . g nite all \o
<EriC^^> morning guys
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
<EriC^^> !logs
<ubot5`> Official channel logs can be found at https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ . LoCo channels are now logged there too. Meetingology logs at https://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/
<lotuspsychje> Ben64: waky waky lol
<lordievader> Good morning
<lotuspsychje> hey lordievader
<lordievader> Hey lotuspsychje
<jink> 'sup.
<lordievader> Hi jink
<ducasse> morning all
<alkisg> \o ducasse :)
<EriC^^> morning ducasse
<ducasse> \o alkisg EriC^^ - all good?
<EriC^^> yup thanks you?
<alkisg> I was backing up my hdd and I just discovered that my rarely-used windows installation decided to create a 480 MB hidden/diag partition with just a /Recovery/WindowsRE/ folder in it
<alkisg> ...meh, gparted to the rescue... :D
<ducasse> all well, been snowing again and pretty cold..
<lordievader> Hey ducasse
<ducasse> hi lordievader - how are things?
<lordievader> Doing good here.
<lordievader> Messing with Zabbix :)
<ducasse> i might want to toy with that myself some day :) are you just using the ubuntu packages?
<lordievader> This install runs on Debian, with, I believe, the Zabbix repo.
<ducasse> right, so they provide their own packages - good to know.
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<immu> hi allllll
<lordievader> Hey immu
<immu> hey lord
<immu> hey lordievader
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<daftykins> https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-17.10-BIOS-Corrupter
<daftykins> nasty
<alkisg> Ouch, scary
<immu> hmm
<XXCoder> ouch
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-12-21
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: :) Hey - http://ubuntu-manual.org/ is not connecting . Any idea who we contact to get it resolved ?
<lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: on my side it loads
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: perhaps a country block for the user?
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: perhaps #ubuntu-mirrors guys might know the way?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Humm .. I am in the US .. and I tried it too .. ;emme try again :)
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Nope . pressing 'download now ' and errors out for the routing .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: for me it forwards the manual in my language(dutch)
<lightF> are you in china? /say Bashing-om
<lightF> Bashing-om are you in china?
<Bashing-om> lightF: No ,, not presently - why ?
<lightF> Bashing-om :in china, it's normal.
<Bashing-om> lightF: :(
<alkisg> Good morning all
<lotuspsychje> hey alkisg
<Bashing-om> For me, "that's all folks" g nite \o
<lotuspsychje> nite Bashing-om
<Bashing-om> Take care lotuspsychje catch ya on my flip :)
<lordievader> Good morning
<lotuspsychje> hey lordievader
<lordievader> Hey lotuspsychje
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<lotuspsychje> great here
<lotuspsychje> testing bionic
<lordievader> And?
<lordievader> Runs Wayland (in Ubuntu) right?
<lotuspsychje> lordievader: 2 out 3 boxes still need xorg for me
<lotuspsychje> wayland lags alot
<jink> IS HET AL WEEKEND?
<lordievader> Oh, that doesn't surprise me. There are not many applications which do native Wayland yet.
<ducasse> good morning
<alkisg> \o ducasse
<ducasse> hi alkisg - all well?
<alkisg> I spent a day yesterday backing up my 1 tb disk only to discover that the target disk had bad sectors :/
<alkisg> Oh well a day lost; everything fine otherwise
<alkisg> How are you?
<ducasse> all quiet, still sleepy, but good :) absolutely freezing outside, so probably staying in.
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
<ducasse> hi lotuspsychje - how goes?
<lotuspsychje> all fine this side of the planet :p
<alkisg> Btw, which sides of the planet are you guys from?
<ducasse> norway here
<ducasse> lotus is from belgium
<alkisg> Ah, so we're +-1 in timezones, cool :D
<ducasse> and you?
<alkisg> I'm from Greece
<lordievader> Hey ducasse
<lordievader> Hey alkisg
<alkisg> Here's an old page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlkisGeorgopoulos
<alkisg> Hey lordievader
<ducasse> hi lordievader
<lordievader> How are you all?
<ducasse> i'm good, thanks, and you?
<lordievader> Doing good, trying to solve an advent of code.
<ducasse> lordievader: gotten your coffee yet? :)
<lordievader> Yes, right in front of me ð
<lotuspsychje> all sides of the world :p
<lotuspsychje> now -r and we good to go!
<alkisg> Was anyone at #ops convinced about it?
<lotuspsychje> dax was interested
<lotuspsychje> about the graph from ben64
<lotuspsychje> but we didnt catch his url yet
<lotuspsychje> bbl work
<lotuspsychje> almost holiday
<BluesKaj> Howdy folks
<pauljw> hey BluesKaj :)
<BluesKaj> Hi pauljw ð
<lordievader> Hey BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hi lordievader
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<BluesKaj> good here lordievader, and you?
<lordievader> Doing okay
<Bashing-om> Yukkie outside . Will procrastinate here awaiting improved conditions :)
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> sounds like a plan
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Wonderful .. Hey all your clients happy now ?
<daftykins> Bashing-om: ooh yes all buttoned up for winter, all totally quiet now other than finishing up payments and paperwork with the insurance company for the house stuff
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Well ! All  buttoned up is not good for that bottom line to get " finishing up payments " :(
<daftykins> oh nah we're all good on that front too :D all settled up with folks who owe me
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Let it rain then :P
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> yep i have chocolate, i'm indoors and it's warm, plenty of toys to play with... times are good
<Bashing-om> daftykins: :D
<Bashing-om> Away for a bit .. back soonest .
<Bashing-om> My got-to's are done :) Back here now :)
<daftykins> huzzah \o/
<Bashing-om> Uh Huh daftykins ! That's the way I feel . Freezing this week end and I am now ready .
<daftykins> :D
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-12-22
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> updating bionic
<alkisg> Good morning everyone :)
<lotuspsychje> hey alkisg
<lotuspsychje> hey oerheks
<lordievader> Good morning
<lotuspsychje> hey lordievader
<lotuspsychje> all good there?
<lordievader> Jup, last day of work ð
<lotuspsychje> yessss
<lotuspsychje> holidaysss
<lordievader> ð
<lotuspsychje> !info hashdeep
<ubot5> hashdeep (source: hashdeep): recursively compute hashsums or piecewise hashings. In component universe, is optional. Version 4.4-4 (artful), package size 119 kB, installed size 286 kB
<lotuspsychje> alkisg: is it some sort of md5 wallet with stored hashes?
<alkisg> lotuspsychje: something like that, just a command line tool to calculate hashes, redirect > to mymd5sums.txt, and later on use them to verify the integrity
<lotuspsychje> cool
<alkisg> I'm worried about getting some bad sectors in my disks, and without realizing it, backing up bad versions of files, and months later eventually deleting my older good backups, forever losing the data
<lotuspsychje> alkisg: wich brand
<alkisg> Any brands, it's a general issue that one may face
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<alkisg> Bad sectors can happen in any disk, hdd or ssd...
<lotuspsychje> i always pull out the hd physically and recover all with photorec
<alkisg> I hope it never comes to recovery :D
<lordievader> smartmontools comes with smartd ð
<alkisg> Backups ftw! I would just feel safer if backups had md5sums too
<lordievader> If set up properly it  will email you if it finds bad sectors (or other errors).
<ducasse> alkisg: use zfs, then you get checksums of your data
<ducasse> morning all!
<lotuspsychje> morning ducasse
<alkisg> For example some time you may transfer a backup over the network, and have corrupted files that way without even having bad sectors anywhere
<lordievader> Though often what harddrives do if they know of bad sectors is to use a different sector.
<alkisg> ducasse: how is this integrated? E.g. if I was to open a file, and its checksum was bad, linux would issue an error in dmesg?
<alkisg> lordievader: true, but that's already too late, because the read/relocation usually fails when they realize it. It's only on writes that it's OK
<lordievader> Fair enough
<ducasse> alkisg: yes, and if it's stored on a mirror or raidz device, it will automatically correct it
<alkisg> ducasse: thanks, I'll look into it
<ducasse> everyone ready for the holidays?
<lordievader> Need to survive today first ð
<ducasse> lordievader: don't you think you have good odds of that? :)
<lordievader> Think it will be a slow day.
<lordievader> Slow and quiet.
<ducasse> most likely
<jink> Sssst.
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<BluesKaj> Hey TJ-, think jk^ 's pc is pretty old, the soundcard dates from 2004
<TJ-> Yes, and the 'slowness' is because the GPU is GMA900, very little hardware acceleration support
<BluesKaj> right , it's a wonder the OS runs at all
<TJ-> The arrogance in that person's attitude is contemptable
<BluesKaj>  I guess he thinks he's "special"  :-)
<BluesKaj> probly blaming the gpu driver an unrelated issue , but has concluded so incorrectly
<BluesKaj> for an unrelated issue
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-12-23
<ducasse> good morning
<alkisg> Good morning all
<ducasse> morning, alkisg
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> holiday!!!
<ducasse> hi lotuspsychje - how are you today?
<ducasse> merry xmas! :)
<lotuspsychje> lol tnx
<lotuspsychje> fine here ducasse and you?
<ducasse> i'm ok, just a bit sleepy - lay awake really late.
<lotuspsychje> lol ben64 vanished from the planet when we need him
<lotuspsychje> breakfast guys
<immu> hi all
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<immu> hi all
<immu> again :)
<immu> whats up all
<lotuspsychje> hi immu BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> hi lotuspsychje
<immu> hi BluesKaj lotuspsychje EriC^^ ducasse
<immu> did i forget someone
<BluesKaj> hi immu
<lotuspsychje> alkisg oerheks daftykins TJ- all the good friends
<immu> daftykins, TJ- oerheks yeah they too howdie all
<BluesKaj> and Hi pauljw, TJ-
<pauljw> hey BluesKaj, everyone :)
<immu> whats up allll
<alkisg> Heeey all :)
<BluesKaj> hey alkisg
<immu> can we move past the hi hellosss
<lotuspsychje> updated bug for 18.04 also https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg/+bug/1702347
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1702347 in xorg (Ubuntu) "Graphical glitches in screen by default on 17.10 & 18.04" [Undecided,New]
<lotuspsychje> xorg glitching and wayland lagging..this aint good news
<TJ-> which kernel?
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: Linux R00TB0X 4.13.0-17-generic #20-Ubuntu SMP Mon Nov 6 10:04:08 UTC 2017 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
<lotuspsychje> !info linux-image-generic artful
<TJ-> hmm, i was suspecting kernel DRM but unlikely if it's still on 4.13, must be something in the video driver. might be specific to the GPU
<ubot5> linux-image-generic (source: linux-meta): Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version 4.13.0.21.22 (artful), package size 2 kB, installed size 14 kB
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: ok i got an old ati x800, but xenial running fine on it and lightweight
<lotuspsychje> the other machine i tested had nvidia
<lotuspsychje> 2 out of 3 systems didnt like wayland for now
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: you have 2 reports there, original for nvidia, last for ATI
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: yes, i didnt want to create a double bug for bionic
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: was it the same motherboard both times ?
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: no, 2 different machines laptop and desktop
<lotuspsychje> on my netbook bionic runs without glitches on xorg, wayland lagging
<TJ-> hmmm, hard to say what that might be
<lotuspsychje> all system does not feel as smooth as unity
<lotuspsychje> perhaps a gnome thing?
<TJ-> anything in the logs?
<lotuspsychje> lemme check
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: https://hastebin.com/ganekaminu.vbs
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: i just get blank pages at hastebin
<lotuspsychje> unk
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: https://pastebin.com/x0LwzZq5
<TJ-> maybe related "powernow_k8: Make sure that your BIOS is up to date and Cool'N'Quiet support is enabled in BIOS setup"
<lotuspsychje> hmm lemme go check that
<lotuspsychje> brb
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: was disabled, but glitches persist
<lotuspsychje> scrolling, running windows over others all give looktru and disforming
<lotuspsychje> cant catch in imgur, as i have to move
<TJ-> there's also this: "[    0.084855] acpi PNP0A03:00: fail to add MMCONFIG information, can't access extended PCI configuration space under this bridge."
<TJ-> try adding "pci=realloc" to the kernel commmand line
<lotuspsychje> there was some setting on PNP in bios
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: look what weird error i get on kazam
<lotuspsychje> r300: driver missing
<lotuspsychje> lshw gives me 1 radeon car and the other unclaimed
<lotuspsychje> card
<TJ-> it could just be the AGP card, it's using a 128MB window
<TJ-> actually, the AGP bridge is there but there's no card. maybe the AGP needs disabling in BIOS?
<lotuspsychje> but if this was hardware, unity would go crazy also no?
<lotuspsychje> same system runs fine on xenial
<lotuspsychje> lets have a look about agp
<TJ-> yeah, you'd expect so
<TJ-> I'm just trying to spot obvious problem areas; that's about all there is in the logs
<lotuspsychje> i suspect gnome
<lotuspsychje> handling something different then unity
<lotuspsychje> brb
<TJ-> the glitching could be related to the powernow stuff though, which if I recall correctly, manages CPU frequencies to control power/thermal envelope
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: ill do a few tests later tnx
<lotuspsychje> bbl
<ojeakyun> Hi
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-12-24
<nerdy_ass> What does acpi=off mean?
<nerdy_ass> I am using it to boot into Ubuntu
<nerdy_ass> But whenever i shut it down it get stuck
<daftykins> yes because ACPI is off
<daftykins> the advanced host configuration and power interface allows intelligent power management features between the OS and the BIOS
<nerdyass> Sorry i am a newbie idk where to start
<daftykins> well booting with a kernel boot parameter is not the start :)
<daftykins> also this isn't a support channel, that's #ubuntu
<nerdyass> Ohh thanks
<Bashing-om> nerdyass: Meet you there :)
<nerdyass> Yois
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> 26mb bionic updates
<lotuspsychje> humanity theme & vlc
<lotuspsychje> !info vlc bionic
<ubot5> vlc (source: vlc): multimedia player and streamer. In component universe, is optional. Version 3.0.0~rc2-2ubuntu2 (bionic), package size 31 kB, installed size 154 kB
<lotuspsychje> morning EriC^^
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<EriC^^> what's up my man?
<lotuspsychje> playing bionic :p
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: you got a bug launchpad mate?
<EriC^^> haha
<EriC^^> i think ive a launchpad account yeah
<lotuspsychje> i was thinking to gather all the crews bug pages
<EriC^^> why?
<lotuspsychje> just for mass solving
<lotuspsychje> so we know each others url's
<lotuspsychje> and help to get a faster community solving
<lotuspsychje> i know ducasse alkisg oerheks Tj got bug pages and me
<EriC^^> https://launchpad.net/~ej-112
<EriC^^> i've submitted 0 bugs though :P
<lotuspsychje> hehe
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: your on xenial right?
<EriC^^> yeah
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: know what you will choose for bionic?
<EriC^^> unity if its supported still
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> im not sure yet what to do...
<lotuspsychje> future is in making
<lotuspsychje> i wish ubuntu desktop would be extremely usuable of course
<EriC^^> yeah
<lotuspsychje> for both high end/low end machines
<alkisg> Good morning everyone
<EriC^^> morning alkisg
<lotuspsychje> hey alkisg morning mate
 * alkisg will select Ubuntu MATE because he still has to maintain a few hundred pentium 4's...
<alkisg> gnome/unity require 3d, so they're extremely slow therer
<lotuspsychje> ah i see alkisg
<lotuspsychje> https://hastebin.com/ikokabevuj.scala
<lotuspsychje> anyone else want adding his bug page, let me know
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: :p
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: :D
<lotuspsychje> got a launchpad Bashing-om ?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Not a bug one : https://launchpad.net/~bashing-om ,
<lotuspsychje> ok tnx Bashing-om
<ducasse> good morning all
<Bashing-om> And outta here again . g nite all \o
<lotuspsychje> merry xmass days for all ; )
<BluesKaj> Hi folks and Merry Christmas!
<pauljw> hi everyone
<BluesKaj> hi pauljw, Merry Christmas!
<pauljw> hey BluesKaj, thanks, same to you and yours. :)  we don't celebrate, but i appreciate the thought.
<BluesKaj> thanks pauljw...well I'm happy to have my daughter home for the Holiday...it always bothers me when the kids have to drive long distances this time of year
<pauljw> glad she made it home safely, it's a rough time of year for driving.
<BluesKaj> yeah flying isn't much of an option since the nearest airport is 65 miles away...we live in the boonies
<ducasse> \o guys
<pauljw> hi ducasse :)
<BluesKaj> hey ducasse, Merry Christmas!
<ducasse> merry xmas, BluesKaj :)
<BluesKaj> thanks
<BluesKaj> that aussie just wanted to rant about windows, hopelessly helpless :-)
<pauljw> :)
<ducasse> nothing we could do for him, at least :)
<BluesKaj> made some concrete suggestions which he rejected out of hand
<pauljw> saw that, he should just call geeksquad and be done with it.
<BluesKaj> he should have stayed with W7
<pauljw> yep, he is the perfect windows user.  hope he never figures out how to install linux. :)
<ducasse> looked like the odds of that happening are low :)
<BluesKaj> he probly doesn't have the patience nor the desire
