#edubuntu 2006-03-27
<thedarkener> What's up everyone - I'm considering Edubuntu for a customer of mine (I'm a network consultant and fluent in linux) - Does Edubuntu have any types of internet / URL filtering mechanism?
<Burgwork> thedarkener, currently not packaged
<ogra> sure
<Burgwork> available, however
<ogra> there are squidguard and dansguardian ... they are in universe, not preinstalled and not configured by default though
<thedarkener> awesome... now I've never done a true terminal server setup, if i installed squidguard though, i'm assuming i could just install it on the term. svr and it will effect all clients?
<ogra> the users are logged in on the server ...
<ogra> so what you want is to shape the network access there, not on the clients ...
<ogra> think of the clients as additional mouse/monitor/keyboard for the server, nothing else ...
<thedarkener> right... ok stupid question. ;) do any of you have exp. in squidguard or dansguardian? I've never used either but would like to know impressions of each
<ogra> both need frequent updates of black/whitelists ...
<Burgwork> we use dansguardian at work here. It works if you maintain them
<ogra> and you'll need someone on site who knows it ...
<thedarkener> <--- someone who will need to know it
<thedarkener> ;)
<thedarkener> maintenance...is there a global blacklist to maintain? or are you just talking about users complaining they can't get to site X?
<ogra> the thing is, the setup for such a filtering is a bit tricky ...
<thedarkener> i'm fluent in iptables/firewalls so i don't think the technical aspect will be too difficult for me
<thedarkener> just a bit confused as to "maintenance"
<ogra> you need to maintain the rules and restrictions ...
<thedarkener> i'm sorry if i'm being dumb... can you define 'maintain' on a more technical level for me?
<ogra> keep the lists up to date :)
<thedarkener> lol
<thedarkener> do they have expiration dates? =)
<ogra> add/remove entries :)
<ogra> nope, but the web changes ...
<thedarkener> ok...well i guess i already knew that, just confused
<thedarkener> hehe
<ogra> my preferred solution we hopefully will ship with the october release is willow...
<thedarkener> hrm
<ogra> it uses bayesian filtering and is able to update itself
<thedarkener> tell me more
<thedarkener> nice
<ogra> additionally to white and blacklists you can define
<thedarkener> i'm not sure i agree with bayesian filtering, but again like i said i've never used filtering software before and my customer probably wouldn't mind a more restrictive ruleset than allowing others
<thedarkener> of course a whitelist might seem like a better idea..
<thedarkener> but i won't get into a religious battle ;)
<thedarkener> Thank you guys very much
<ogra> if you have a customer that wants strict rules, thats fine
<ogra> if you have to teach biology at school and your students shall look up stuff about pregnate teens that had sex before 15,, that gets tricky 
<thedarkener> haha
<thedarkener> true
<thedarkener> well how bout this
<ogra> thats where the maintenance gets really hard 
<thedarkener> what about access restrictions? i'm sure edubuntu is good at restricting shell access to sudoers, etc. right? admin tasks?
<ogra> its not as good as it should in breezy ... i'd suggest to wait for the dapper (july) release
<ogra> there you can completely control the desktop access of users
<ogra> it also hides all admin task entries in the menu if youre not in the appropriate group
<thedarkener> ooooo nice
<ogra> breezy didnt do that ...
<ogra> pessulus and sabayon enable you to create lockdown profiles for different groups of users
<thedarkener> in gnome specifically i presume?
<enyc> darn
<enyc> ran out f disk space
<enyc> this edubuntu builds a while LTSP root thing
<enyc> ks...
<enyc> so...
<enyc> too much space usage ;-(
<thedarkener> ick
<thedarkener> hehe
<ogra> for the default install you should have ~3G free space ...
<thedarkener> that shouldn't be a problem
<ogra> ltsp eats some space for the chroot ... and the educational apps are big as well ... so edubuntu is a bit bigger than ubuntu 
<enyc> heh
<enyc> darn
<enyc> this is a weir dlaptop with a 2gb disk;-)
<thedarkener> time to delete some apps ;)
<enyc> so thats why it wont fit then ;-)
<thedarkener> for a server? wow
<thedarkener> hehe
<thedarkener> nice try thou
<enyc> not for server
<enyc> just default install
<ogra> it will get tight, but you could try the workstation install :)
<enyc> i see i see
<ogra> the default install is the server install ...
<enyc> i was jsut stesting the new edubuntu-instaler fluight-5 for you....
<enyc> i see isee
<enyc> aah
<enyc> o
<ogra> it installs ltsp ...
<enyc> i se
<enyc> ewhich installs a seaparate image ?
<enyc> for the ltsp root
<ogra> yep, its a separate system inside the system ...
<enyc> basically a copy of everything
<enyc> i see
<enyc> but..
<enyc> how does that get updated later etc. /
<enyc> ?
<enyc> with updated packages in the host system and soforth
<ogra> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 apt-get update 
<ogra> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 apt-get upgrade
<enyc> aah so you have to do that separately
<ogra> thats it :)
<enyc> i see
<enyc> and you can have a separate chroot for powerpc and thigns?
<ogra> yep, but it gets tricky to set up powerpc on i386 ...
<enyc> i see
<ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/LTSPManager/
<enyc> qemu can be handy !
<ogra> will have a tool to care for updates at some point
<ogra> quemu is far from being usable for that 
<ogra> i did tests 
<enyc> hrrmm
<enyc> darn
<enyc> kk
<enyc> qemu ahs the user-mode-emulation so you can run  ppc binary and thinsg
<ogra> yep, i experimented with it ... i think it might be ready for revisiting in two or three ubuntu releases 
<Burgwork> ogra, with regards to the UI for ltsp manager, you might want to consider http://developer.gnome.org/projects/gup/hig/2.0/controls-notebooks.html
<ogra> its for sure not mature enough ... 
<Burgwork> and you might want to consider changing the first run into an actual wizard
<enyc> erm
<ogra> what for ? 
<Burgwork> the build ltsp enviroment section?
<enyc> how are toools like that pictured for 'LTSPmanager' written?
<ogra> you only can select one thing (if any, thats even a cornercase) and watch the progressbar
<enyc> with all those menus and everything...
<enyc> some kind of scripting thing?
<ogra> thats glade and python
<enyc> aaaaaaaha
<ogra> glade for the gui, python for the rest
<enyc> thats really really handy
<ogra> Burgwork, it will be a prerequisite for running the whole app ... a wizard is really overkill here, i think ...
<enyc> amazing how all these FOSS programming tools have come along well
<Burgwork> ogra, a wizard can be a single screen. It is more about consistency
<ogra> you either click ok and let it create the chroot or you dont and the app exits
<ogra> and all you get is a progressbar ... i dotn want to scare people with too much output ...
<ogra> consistency with what btw ? 
<Burgwork> any other setup dialog
<Burgwork> observe the xchat-gnome or evolution ones
<ogra> <-- is the biggest wizard hater he personally knows
<Burgwork> I am not much of fan, but they can well written
<ogra> yes, thats one of the reasons i dont use xchat-gnome ;)
<crimsun> the gajim one isn't horrible
<ogra> and i dont like the evo one ...
* ogra installs gajim
<Burgwork> http://www.redhat.com/magazine/001nov04/features/evolution/figs/evo-setup.png
<Burgwork> that is what I am talking about
<Burgwork> just make it one page, with a "create ltsp" button
<ogra> yep, thats what i was talking about as well 
<Burgwork> that is what you hate?
<Burgwork> for me, it is about "feels like, smells like, is" idea
<ogra> a huuuge ugly and scary window for a single sentence 
<Burgwork> one sentence?
<ogra> and even the classic "Please click the forward button" *shudder*
<Burgwork> you don't need the splash screen
<Burgwork> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/LTSPManager/ltsp-manager_build_client.png
<Burgwork> that has a lot more than one sentence
<ogra> yes
<ogra> its a prototype of an app ;)
<Burgwork> that is the page I would convert
<iGotNoTime> I have nothing but frustration with the other distros! None would recognize my wifi card in my laptop. I finally installed Edubuntu and it works.
<Burgwork> and then just jump to a dialog box with a prgress bar
<iGotNoTime> So ogra I will be with you all for a while I guess :)
<ogra> the sentence can go away 
<Burgwork> It should say "Choose your client's processor type"
<iGotNoTime> Does Edubuntu somehow utilize the ndiswrapper automatically?
<ogra> (the arch selection will only happen on multiarch systems, people setting up multiple arches wont want to use the gui for maintaining it, they'll do way more fine grained configs)
<Burgwork> is there a use case for allowing people to install two arches on the same machine?
<iGotNoTime> even in Ku I couldn't edit the settings :P
<Burgwork> ie, should it be checkboxes?
<ogra> yes, there is, but you cant do it at the same time ...
<ogra> so checkboxes would be pointless ... you can only have one choice
<Burgwork> you can't create two environments at the same time?
<ogra> but as i said, the case of multiarches does only happen in very specific cases
<ogra> you can create 100, but your guis wont repond anymore and it will take ages ;)
<ogra> bootstrapping is a very slow process done over the network ... :)
<Burgwork> realistically we are only looking at 4 or 5 arches, no?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> 3
<NickGarvey> is there a site that I would be able to give to a network admin at my school to help nudge him to make a room linux based?  and my school uses a windows based network, would they be able to set up linux to access the network?  I have heard of samba but I am unsure after reading their site what it allows linux clients to do
<Burgwork> what about sunrays?
<ogra> ltsp only knows powerpc, i386 and amd64 
<ogra> i have a sparc patch that waits for dapper+1 
<Burgwork> ah
<Burgwork> regardless, this is dapper+1 stuff
<ogra> nobody confirmed sparc being official in dapper ...
<Burgwork> we can talk UI for an LTSP manager at the next conference
<Burgwork> the fact that it exists is cool enough
<ogra> note that there will also be a menu at the top ....
<ogra> i havent had time for a mockup yet ...
<ogra> there shall be some menu driven actions ...
<iGotNoTime> Burgwork, considering that UI for LTSP and what NickGarvey is asking about could you tell me what this is? http://www.redianet.com/img/pantallazo2.gif
<iGotNoTime> is that not similar to what NickGarvey is asking for?
<iGotNoTime> High Voltage gave a link to that a few days ago
<Burgwork> that is a program to control and view students deskops
<ogra> NickGarvey, samba should integrate any linux system fine into a windows network ... i'd suggest the o'rilley samba book ...
<Burgwork> NickGarvey is asking for help about how to use samba to file share in a windows environment
<iGotNoTime> It appears to be a way the 'teacher' could monitor the 'students' desktops and activites?
<iGotNoTime> ok I am way off base then :(
<Burgwork> don't worry about it
<iGotNoTime> ducking back embarassed again :P
<Burgwork> the only way to learn is to chew on a few toes first :)
<iGotNoTime> :P
<NickGarvey> ok so samba would do the job based on what my school would need?
<NickGarvey> sounds like it but want to be sure :)
<ogra> what exactly *does* your school need ... ?
<Burgwork> NickGarvey, access the network covers such a broad range ...
<Burgwork> if they mean, surf the internet, routers and cables don't care what OS is pushing them
<Burgwork> if you mean connecting to windows shares, then samba is what you need
<ogra> as i said, samba will bring your linux machines into a win based network ... but samba cant replace a windows PDC completely for example
<NickGarvey> hoping to do a ltsp connection, have a linux server, and that server be able to access the windows network on the school system, access internet
<Burgwork> if you mean AD single sign on, you need samba4, which isn't out yet
<ogra> no problem then
<ogra> Burgwork, he didnt talk about AD :)
<NickGarvey> what is AD?
<ogra> active directory 
<NickGarvey> to google!
<ogra> a windows authentication mechanism
<ogra> (in fact its microsoft raping ldap and kerberos)
<NickGarvey> I do not believe it is like that..
<NickGarvey> I'm a sophormore, this will be a junior or senior project, plenty of time to learn up
<ogra> just having sammba working on the linux machine should already give you what you want ... edubuntu installs ltsp and samba for you, you just need to configure the samba stuff ...
<NickGarvey> one last question, is there an easy way I could test if the computers were network booting compatible? I can easily run the knoppix terminal server, and I can boot it from my laptop for instance, but not one of the desktops, even though I turned it on in the BIOS, and thus I would like to try to do a quick test to find out if those computers could boot from a terminal server before setting it all up
<ogra> you can always use a ootflopy or bootCD to make them netbootable :)
<ogra> *bootfloppy
<NickGarvey> oh alright thats excellent
<NickGarvey> thanks a lot, lets hope I can convince them to upgrade to linux :)
<ogra> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/BootingClientsWithoutPxe
<NickGarvey> oh good thank you, ubuntu/edubuntu has great documentation, one of my favorite parts of the distro
<ogra> :)
* Burgwork smiles
<ogra> Burgwork, btw, kodos to the docteam, i read the server guide on the weekend ... thats waesome documentation ...
<ogra> *awesome
<Burgwork> I will pass that along
<ogra> i still have to write a ton of ltsp howtos ...
<ogra> you can do a lot of intresting things with our ltsp nobody apart from me knows about :)
<Burgwork> things that you cannot do with other implementations?
<Burgwork> do I understand correctly that our version of ltsp is a groundup rewrite?
<ogra> things that requires only one or two changes to make our ltsp something completely different ;)
<ogra> (while you'd have to create a complete new environment and adjust a lot in other implementations)
<ogra> yes, it is
<ogra> we use one tool from ltsp.org in our iplementation (thats getltscfg, the parser that reads the config file)
<Burgwork> is ltsp.org going to migrate to our implementation?
<ogra> the rest is totally distro specific and brandnew
<ogra> how should they
<ogra> they write a universal tool that builds on top of every distro
<ogra> we have an optimized version that only runs on ubuntu and debian 
<ogra> we share the same specification
<Burgwork> ah
<ogra> both is so called "muecow ltsp"
<ogra> since ltsp.org itself steps back a bit and wants to move the essential bits into the distros
<ogra> they want the distros to use their own packages and just be the glue inbetween
<ogra> (as we do it in ubuntu already)
<Burgwork> ok
<iGotNoTime> wow did you guys know that the Edubuntu still logs IRC while in hibernate mode?
<ogra> i.e. our ltsp uses debootstrap to build the environment and some scripts to install X and the loginmanager ...
<iGotNoTime> I find something more impressive everyday :P
<Burgwork> ogra, how are you with rsync?
<ogra> Burgwork, fine thanks ...
<ogra> :)
<ogra> it works if i need it ...
<ogra> (what the hell do you mean ?? *g*)
<Burgwork> if I have two copies of a home, dir, one old and one new, and I rsync them, will the old one be replaced by the new?
<ogra> oh ...
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> it should replace the old one, yes
<Burgwork> ok
<Burgwork> I am about to put some more glue on our completely broken IT infrastructure at work here
<ogra> ah
<Burgwork> going to rsync the home dirs between three different machines, for distributed backup and ease of changing computers
<Burgwork> a totally hacky solution, but hey :)
<ogra> thats not hacky !
<ogra> thats how things worked since the beginning of time :)
<Burgwork> I am only distributing the home folder, not the actual authentication
<ogra> (at least in the unix world)
* ogra remembers rsyncing /etc/passwd between 5 servers at the ISP he had his first IT job
<ogra> (which meant we couldnt use shadow, but didnt need to use nis)
<Burgwork> is there a switch to tell rsync to mirror the contents? (ie, if something changed in A, change in B and if it changed in B, copy to A?)
<ogra> no idea, i didnt use it for years apart from rsyncing isos ...
<ogra> man rsync shopuld be able to tell you ;)
<Burgwork> hmm, doesn't appear to
<Burgwork> I was hoping for a -m mirror option
<thedarkener> why not just create a script to rsync both ways?
<bimberi> Burgwork: i know 'unison' does 2-way synchronisation
<Burgwork> yes, looking at that right now
<Burgwork> anybody got real world use with unison?
<bimberi> i've used it for synchro between laptop and server (via the internet) as well as home backup.  Works very well.  Doesn't run a daemon, uses ssh (so no extra open ports)
<Burgwork> this would be all internal initially
<bimberi> fairly small scale in my case, so it would prompt me for every change.  However i'm pretty sure you can set it to be more automatic, so that it only prompts you if both ends have changed since the last synchro (and you might even be able to default that to just keep the newest)
<bimberi> ... bit dangerous though :)
<Burgwork> maybe I should but all the home dirs in bzr branches...
<Burgwork> mostly that is not going to be an issue
<ogra> you'd need your users to commit their changes ;)
<ogra> i was planning something like that for ltsp manager
<Burgwork> can I just commit my users?
<ogra> so you can roll back to any point you like
<ogra> you'd need to have a session script that does the commit of changes on logout ...
<Burgwork> hmm, too much work
<Burgwork> this sort of thing should be done by the freaking fs...
<ogra> are you talking RAID ?
<ogra> :)
<Burgwork> no, I am talking revision control in the FS
<ogra> hmm, xfs might do such stuff ...
<ogra> not sure though
<iGotNoTime> My laptop has a touchpad, when I tap the touchpad twice it acts as a double click (supposed to be a good feature?) I can disable that in XP, is there anyway to disable something like that with Edubuntu?
<NickGarvey> http://scottcollins.net/blog/2006/01/disable-touchpad-tap-in-kubuntubreezy.html
<NickGarvey> that might help iGotNoTime
<NickGarvey> its for kubuntu but it might still do it right
* arkan0x is away: .....zzz...b
* arkan0x is back (gone 00:17:21)
<bimberi> <bimberi> !away
<bimberi> <ubotu> Please don't use /away in your client or change your nick to 'someone|away'. We know you're away when you don't respond to messages. See http://sackheads.org/~bnaylor/spew/away_msgs.html
<Burgundavia> arkan0x: please turn off your public away messages
<Burgundavia> bimberi: thanks
<bimberi> :)
<iGotNoTime> I have installed Edubuntu to my laptop now, but really would like an easy to install widget for my wifi signal, something that would stay floating on my desktop.
<iGotNoTime> Does anyone have a suggestion maybe?
<bimberi> iGotNoTime: the "Network Monitor" panel applet
<iGotNoTime> haven't looked yet will do now
<iGotNoTime> ohh no
<iGotNoTime> that is on
<iGotNoTime> I mean something showing signal strength graphically
<iGotNoTime> with numbers too
<iGotNoTime> thanks for trying though :)
<bimberi> hm, i though it had 5 segments which would change color according to the strength
<bimberi> also there might be something in its preferences (right-click on it)
<iGotNoTime> I am sorry I assumed that was a 'show options' button
<iGotNoTime> it could be strength LOL
<iGotNoTime> I guess I am ok then :P
<bimberi> time for a walk :P
<Burgundavia> salut highvoltage
<highvoltage> salut!
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<Burgundavia> highvoltage: did you see the idea on digg of a mmorg of the oregon trail?
<Burgundavia> highvoltage: wouldn't it be great to start and build an educational mmorg?
<NickGarvey> ooo I remember that game, that would be pretty cool as a mmorpg
<Burgundavia> I never owned it but loved it
<Burgundavia> the other game I would love to see was an old mac game about homesteading in canada
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: no, haven't seen it. i don't even know what mmorg is :)
<NickGarvey> massively multiplayer online role playing game
<Burgundavia> http://justplainlukee.livejournal.com/14192.html
<ulinskie> hello
<highvoltage> hi
<JaneW> silly Q, but is edubuntu GPL?
<JaneW> I have looked around and there is just mention of Ubuntu being under several OSS licenses
<Burgundavia> JaneW: depends on what part you mean
<Burgundavia> Edubuntu is mostly GPL, but the distro itself has no license
<Burgundavia> mere agregation does not make a piece fall under the license
<JaneW> I am entering edubuntu for a competition
<JaneW> and the question is "License: Under what kinds of licenses do you make it available? How many copies / licenses have so far been handed out/downloaded?"
<JaneW> so should I just say FOSS licenses?
<Burgundavia> yes
<JaneW> ok, thanks
<Burgundavia> JaneW: incidentally, where is this for?
<JaneW> PrixArs Electronica
<Burgundavia> JaneW: ah. Wikipedia won one last year
<JaneW> tough competition!
<Burgundavia> there are different catagories
<JaneW> we are in digital communities
<Burgundavia> hmm, up against them
<spacey> morning
<JaneW> is ogra in today?
<ogra> sure
<JaneW> hi O
<JaneW> just getting ready to leave for meeting
<JaneW> thought I'd better make sure you had the reigns ;)
<JaneW> btw I entered for Prix Arz Electronica
<JaneW> but I need to ask you to mail it please
<JaneW> it has to be mailed to them to try to get there by thurs
<JaneW> or at least be well on the way
<JaneW> I reckon German is closer then SA to Austria, so would be faster
<JaneW> agreed?
<JaneW> They want the on-line entry printed, signed and posted
* JaneW mails you
<JaneW> and then leaves
<ogra> Salutation: Mrs.
<ogra> First name: Oliver
<ogra> Last name: Grawert
<ogra> lol
<jsgotangco> hey JaneW got your emai ;)
<ogra> ******** edubuntu meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 4min *********
<jsgotangco> err since when did you become the meeting caller
<spacey> i'll be there :)
<ogra> jsgotangco, when jane went to school :)
<jsgotangco> ahhh good point
<JaneW> hi I am back
<JaneW> sorry so late, was a long meeting
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<pips1> back here
<spacey> :)
<spacey> JaneW: will you read back the meeting we had?
<ogra> yeah
<spacey> could you feedback your opinion about what you expect from the cookbook?
<JaneW> argh
<JaneW> again?
<spacey> there was some discussion and jelkner/kjcole see it differently from me
<spacey> :p
<spacey> just read back
<ogra> i really think the ubuntu server guide is a *very* good example ... i'm very impressed
<spacey> communication seems a little though
<ogra> spacey, not only from you ...
<spacey> what do you mean?
<ogra> <spacey> there was some discussion and jelkner/kjcole see it differently from me
<spacey> ah :)
<ogra> i totally agree with you 
<spacey> jelker offered me to take over, i will consider that after I indexed the work done/to be done
* ogra gets fresh coffee
<pips1> highvoltage, I was hoping to meet you on monday eve, as discussed, but it looks like you are very busy..
<spacey> wish it that result came earlier but it took so long which makes the whole progress of finding you disagree later
<spacey> anyway i'll post to list about that later
<highvoltage> pips1: i was on-line, but you weren't?
<pips1> highvoltage, anyway, know I need to get back to work..
<highvoltage> pips1: i sent you another jabber message, did you get it?
<pips1> highvoltage, oh?! 
<highvoltage> pips1: i mean, i sent you a jabber message that you would get when you're back online
<highvoltage> pips1: yep. i said that if you couldn't make it, i'll be online again last night, if you'd like to chat
<pips1> highvoltage, how do I get older messages in jabber?
<highvoltage> pips1: i think you right-click on someone's name and then on view logs
<pips1> oh, nothing there though
<pips1> :-/
<pips1> sorry, I haven't used jabber before
<highvoltage> it's on my jabber logs :/
<highvoltage> pips1: sorry, i don't know what went wrong. could you see me on-line?
<highvoltage> perhaps there was an issue with the jabber server, i have no idea.
<pips1> yes, you *were* only, and I started a chat, but no reply... (I was 5 min late on mon eve, btw)
<pips1> s/only/online
<pips1> oh well
<pips1> did you get my 2 emails from last week?
<highvoltage> pips1: yes, i got your e-mails. i never (not even now) got your jabber messages, so there must have been something weird going on with jabber itself.
<pips1> highvoltage, got to run, when would be a good time for us to meet next? what about tomorrow during the day or friday during the day? (my evenings are all booked until sunday)
<highvoltage> pips1_busy: i'll try to contact you on jabber now... if you'll read this later, i'd prefer to talk to you tonight. tomorrow evening and friday evening is quite busy
<spacey> ogra: btw we forgot to discuss the mailinglist stuff this week
<ogra> i'll just ask jdub to create edubuntu-users ...
<spacey> the ubuntu server guide was it right? which you referred to ealier
<spacey> earlier
<ogra> yep
<ogra> its in ubuntu-docs in dapper
<spacey> where should i be able to read it?
<ogra> in yelp
<spacey> yelp doesn't work it seems
<ogra> just click your help icon
<spacey> just get an empty screen
<spacey> just see help topics
<spacey> nothing more
<spacey> :)
<ogra> hmm, works here 
<ogra> is ubuntu-docs installed ?
<spacey> yup
<ogra> strange 
<spacey> if i do about this document i get an error as well
<spacey> The section x-yelp-titlepage does not exist in this document. If you were directed to this section from a Help button in an application, please report this to the maintainers of that application.
* Yagisan waves too flint 
<ogra> hmmm, intelmac support in dapper ... these thingies should make nice ltsp servers :)
<spacey> pips1: you have an email address
<spacey> ?
<Yagisan> aren't intelmacs supposed to be locked down with a type of drm ?
<spacey> i think it was just a boot method windows didn't support
<spacey> EFI or something
<Yagisan> yeah. pity they dropped powerpc. they were nice chips
<blkdg> hello,
<ogra> hey, but imagine a mac mini intel as ltsp server with these clients: http://www.jack-pc.net/jackpc.asp
<ogra> :)
<spacey> highvoltage: ping
<spacey> ogra: that is fucking cool :)
<spacey> price? :)
<ogra> no idea
<ogra> :)
<blkdg> i was looking around for gcompris earlier this moring, and it lead me to kde edutainment, and from there i read about tux paint, and eventually i stummbled upon edubuntu.  Cool.  Is there a Live CD version of edubuntu comming with this new release?
<ogra> yep
<blkdg> wow.
<ogra> there are daily builds and some milestone releases of it already if you want to test it
<ogra> (see the channel topic for the latest milestone)
* spacey calling a reseller
<blkdg> i'm going to try to find a list of the applications that come with it first. thanks again.
<Yagisan> jackpc look nice, but seem locked to M$. btw, get me a powerpc box, and I'll get back to work on a powerpc multiarch patch ;) (no, I have no money of my own to spend)
<highvoltage> spacey: pong
<ogra> spacey, they use some strange embedded amd CPU, not sure the kernel supports that at all
<spacey> ogra: just asking if it supports PXE now
<spacey> it has windows CE 
<spacey> sucks balls
<ogra> yep
<ogra> but thats fixable ;)
<ogra> you could flash a rom-o-matic image over the CE
<ogra> but the question is if the HW is supported by the kernel at all
<spacey> highvoltage: you and pips do website yes? can you pass me your email addresses?
<spacey> ogra: yeh
<spacey> they will call me back
<spacey> :)
<ogra> :)
* flint in what passes in flint for deep concentration, finally wakes up....
<spacey> poor guy couldn't answer my questions
<ogra> heh, its pretty new
<spacey> http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=edubuntu
<spacey> heh
<spacey> didn't know about that
<spacey> lol
<ogra> yeah, thats cool :)
<spacey> *sigh* i use kde but hey i have to do a demo for edubuntu
<spacey> lol
<spacey> its in the first video
* ogra couldnt watch any of these yet ...
<JaneW> Yes, Dennis Daniels has done loads
<blkdg> i've used damn small linux and knoppix on the machine that i am considering to use for edubutu, will edubuntu live run with the same performace level? is it as taking as knoppix?  the machine is a 500 celeron with 512 ram.
<ogra> no shickwave arch around ...
<spacey> the video suck ass imho
<ogra> blkdg, that should be fine 
<spacey> big WinXP bar in the top
<flint> ogra, that wall compter must be mini-itx form factor beast.  these are fairly cool....
<JaneW> the first one I watched was him driving in his car and chatting
<JaneW> at one point he inadvertently picks his nose
<ogra> flint, mini-itx is something else ...
<ogra> flint, thats waaay bigger 
<spacey> :>
<JaneW> and then says 'er, yes, I did yes pick my nose on camera'
<JaneW> 2nd yes = just
* spacey pokes highvoltage
<jsgotangco> hey!
<spacey> JaneW: that cookbook is stilll quite a lot of work
<spacey> *sigh*
<JaneW> spacey: I should have just done it myself...
<flint> spacey, I like the screencasts, but they are being created in window$...
<spacey> JaneW: i'm preparing a mail now, feel free to contribute :)
<jsgotangco> hey!
<ogra> jsgotangco, hey!
<flint> JaneW, go for it.
<JaneW> spacey: I will just a bit rushed today, I am filling in for another PM too
<pips1> spacey, philipp at din15 dot org
<spacey> JaneW: i'll ping you when i launched the email to the list
<JaneW> and need to attend a meeting on TeamSpeak aka SUCKSASS!
<JaneW> did I say that out loud?
<spacey> :>
<spacey> pips1: you have highvoltage his address too?
<flint> JaneW, excellent!!! you are a goddess unto me.
<spacey> I'll drink another beer for the sake of the edubuntu cookbook
<flint> :^)
<pips1> sure, but I normally don't pass around other ppl's email... sorry for being fussy about it
<ogra> spacey, beer at 4:30 already ? you crazy duch people ... :)
<spacey> ogra: its because of the beautiful afternoon
<spacey> sun and all
<spacey> :)
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> here as well
<spacey> makes me happy
<ogra> me too ...
<pips1> spacey, you can find his email from his postings to the mailing list :-)
<spacey> pips1: i'll do that then
<spacey> :p
<flint> demostudio is the streamcasting tool used... how does wink stand up to this?  Vermonters drink for breakfast (mostly maple syrup :^)
<spacey> pips1: mr carter right?
<spacey> :P
<ogra> launchpad is also very helpful
<pips1> spacey, correct, you can check on launchpad, too :-)
<pips1> ogra, :-)
<blkdg> i am looking for the daily builds, but i can only see the 5.10 releases.
<spacey> getting the addresses was more work then the email but check your mailbox pips1:p
<ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily-live/current/
<blkdg> thank you.  could someone add this infromation to : http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ ??
<ogra> note they might be broken ... the last one thats guaranteed to work is http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/dapper/flight-5/
<blkdg> or, https://wiki.edubuntu.org/DownloadEdubuntu ??
<spacey> you think goals in the edubuntu cookbook should talk about goals of edubuntu or of the cookbook?
<ogra> both ?
<pips1> spacey, thanks, I sure that highvoltage is very aware of it, he is one the original authors of the tuxlab cookbook, AFAIC ;-)
<spacey> pips1: i know
<spacey> but it is just so suited for the website
<spacey> :)
<spacey> and not for the cookbook
<spacey> of edubuntu at the moment
<blkdg> ok, now i'm confused.  the dapper version of ubuntu will have the same educational stuff that edunbunt has?
<blkdg> specifically edutainment and gcompris?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> what makes you think that ? 
<blkdg> i'm comparing the file lists for packages that i wnat.
<blkdg> one sec.
<ogra> where ? 
<flint> spacey, I am thinking that technology may be bypassing the need for the cookbook or any other documentation.  This stramcast think is most painless...
<blkdg> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily-live/current/dapper-live-i386.manifest says it has gcompris and edutainment
<spacey> flint: i absolutely disagree on that
<blkdg> ait.
<blkdg> sorry.  
<blkdg> i ahve to learn to read :)
<ogra> :)
<ogra> flint, its a very valuable source ...
<ogra> they are different for different use cases ...
<ogra> .different for different use cases ...
<ogra> different tools for different use cases ...
<ogra> grr
<flint> spacey, I understand both of your points, if i could not be seduced by technology I would not be here :^)  down olli... remember its all about FITS
<flint> :^)
<blkdg> is there a link from the edubuntu download page to the daily live page? could anyone here make one?
<ogra> the grr was directed at my keyboard :)
<ogra> blkdg, feel free to do it, its a wiki :)
<ogra> but note that the dailies are broken most of the time ...
<spacey> ogra: lol
<flint> spacey, having made a few films in my time, I think that overall guidance in the form of documentation is essential to organizing an effective presentation of any type.  but this streacast stuff is revolutionary, gotta admit it.
<spacey> according to the distributor
<spacey> of jackpc
* ogra is all ears
<spacey> they even designed to processor on it and is not comparable to any existing arch
<spacey> and i don't think he ever heard of PXE
<ogra> heh
<spacey> i think direct contact with chippc is a better idea :p
<ogra> yeah
<spacey> anyway
<spacey> no time now, time to finish up that lengthy email about hte cookbook
<flint> ogra, I know this sounds insane... but I just got an IBM M13 keyboard that cost me $200.00, a 515 style break-spring board with full number pad and a trackpoint  is is the second most fun I can have with my hands...
<flint> spacey, please include me in the flame (flint@flint.com:^)
<ogra> flint, arent you subscribed to the mailing list ? 
<jsgotangco> oohhh spacey is in  planet
<spacey> :)
<spacey> jsgotangco: yes:)
<spacey> hurray
<jsgotangco> with a hackergotchi even!
<jsgotangco> \o/
<blkdg> is there a linux tool that comes with (or could come with one day edubuntu) that acts like apples remote desktop tool ( observe student work, control student work over a network?
<ogra> we have VNC included
<blkdg> i used it recently in an emac lab, an it was useful during a tutorial where i had a projector.
<blkdg> i will look up vnc, thank you.
<jsgotangco> there's also freenx
<ogra> its integrated into the desktop ... you just need to enable it ... and use the terminal server client to connect to it ...
<ogra> its all preinstalled ...
<blkdg> i see that it's called vnc common. i will look into it. this cd will be amazing.
<jsgotangco> it already is!
<ogra> the integration part for the desktop is called vino ... vnc is only the backend
<blkdg> oh, ok, 
<ogra> jsgotangco, vino/vnc and tsclient are...
<ogra> part of the desktop since gnome 2.10 
<jsgotangco> i didnt know about vino/vnc though
<blkdg> ok, it comes with gnome. i get it.
<blkdg> kind of.
<blkdg> sorry about the delay i keep alt tabbing between here and my browser.
<blkdg> ogra how do i add that link to the download page?
<blkdg> it's a locked page.
<blkdg> forget about that last question, i 'm reading the help/
<blkdg> .
<ogra> you need to log in and just edit  :)
<spacey> from the current cookbook: The moo cow server defaults to an IP gateway and firewall when two Ethernet cards are present. This will only be the case in Edubuntu labs that are permanently online, which will usually not be the case.
<spacey> i don't understand any of that
<spacey> i don't think its because of the beer
<jsgotangco> duh
<ogra> ouch
<blkdg> thanks again for you help and patience folks.
<jsgotangco> i gotta sleep
<jsgotangco> cheers
<Yagisan> cool, I just found my house using google maps
<spacey> i hate computers
<spacey> brb
<ogra> spacey, hey, i just saw you have probs with your amd64 acer ? 
<ogra> they are vaccum cleaners, i have to pull out a block of filth every two months from the fan ...
<spacey> already did that
<spacey> :)
<spacey> :)
<ogra> did it help ?
<spacey> no
<ogra> bah
<spacey> i think i need to open it up
<spacey> to clean it
<spacey> inside
<ogra> oh, yes, indeed i meant the cooling unit inside ...
<spacey> you think it will affect my warranty?
<ogra> it collects the filth directly at the fan
<ogra> no idea
<ogra> mine is over, so i had no probs opening it
<spacey> i bought extented warranty since i knew it will break before that ends
<ogra> there is a little piece of aluminium foil glued onto the cover 
<spacey> i don't see that
<ogra> you have to rip it off to open it ... so you wont be able to hide that you opened it
<ogra> its the connection between the fan case and the outer frame in mine ...
<ogra> on the right 
<spacey> nope not here
<spacey> fan is on the left here anyway
<ogra> ah, mine is in the middle
<spacey> at least i cannot see it from the outside
<ogra> ah, no you wont see it with the plastic on top :)
<spacey> ogra: JaneW, posted my proposal for the cookbook to list
<ogra> great 
<flint> spacey, as if I am not getting enough spam, I gotta ask, am I on this list?
<spacey> flint: i think you are on the list
<spacey> at least I have seen your spam on it flint;)
<flint> spacey, the dust thing is pernicious.  Two things to consider, get yourself a backup fan system, and/or get an air compressor and blow it out from time to time.  The air compressor is handy for other parts of your life (e.g. a bycycle :^)
<spacey> :>
<spacey> flint: no place left on this 12 square meters :)
<flint> spacey, maybe I should not digress as to the connubial aspects of air compressors...this may not be an appropriate forum.
<flint> :^)
<spacey> :>
<flint> spacey, i have not gotten any hate mail, as a favor bounce what Jane sent to me, that I may read and obey.
<spacey> i missing some context here flint
<spacey> after my lenghty email i am gonna watch some of my anime crack
<spacey> bbl
<flint> spacey, I would be happy if you woud send or forward any cookbook related mail traffic to flint@flitn.com
<flint> er flint@flint.com (damn typist fire him! :^)
* ogra applauds spacey 
<ogra> nice mail
<ogra> i'm courious about the reactions ...
<ogra> we ssom to have gotten a lot nice people lately that would do doc work ...
<JaneW> spacey: great thanks
<JaneW> spacey: I promise to go through it first thing tomorrow
* JaneW had ubuntu soup for dinner :)
<JaneW> http://janewsblog.blogspot.com/2006/03/ubuntu-is-soup-er.html
* sivang also want ubuntu soup for dinner :-)
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<highvoltage> really? :)
<JaneW> sivang: it's SPICY!
<sivang> I'm sure it is :-)
<sivang> but your blog does not come up
<highvoltage> my word, it is ubuntu soup!
<JaneW> hehe
<JaneW> sivang: huh?
<Burgwork> JaneW, have you been told to crack down on laptop testers not testing?
<JaneW> Burgwork: silbs wanted me to check
<Burgwork> ah
<Burgwork> would be nice to have an official list
<Burgwork> so I can clean up the wiki page
<JaneW> cos she feared we have 30 odd ppl who have run off with laptops
<JaneW> I doubts that's the case
<JaneW> and so far everyone is testing
<JaneW> of course I am sure to have straglers who are non-responsive
<Petaris> hello all
<highvoltage> hi Petaris 
<Petaris> Hi highvoltage
<Petaris> I just got the ok to shop for a second LTSP lab ;)
<Petaris> This one for the high school
<highvoltage> yay :)
<Petaris> yep
<Petaris> Has anyone played with authenticating the server/terminals to AD or NDS/eDirectory?
<highvoltage> not sure :/
<highvoltage> JaneW: why not edubuntu soup?
<Petaris> hrm, it would be nice if they could logon with their existing credentials and have access to all of their files
<JaneW> highvoltage: hey it was a last minute idea!
<JaneW> highvoltage: next time I will plan and execute better
<highvoltage> JaneW: it's very nicely done. i didn't think it would look that nice :)
<JaneW> I was like 'you want chilli? Good, hold on for a sec I have to do something first... no don;t eat it I need my camera!'
<highvoltage> hehe! shame man.
<JaneW> indeed
<JaneW> then I was told 'er this habanero one is like 5 times as strong as tabasco!'
<JaneW> luckilly he LIKES burney stuff
<sivang> JaneW: I'll be a happy laptop tester camper if you send me one :)
<JaneW> sivang: I would if I could...
<JaneW> so far I get to track down what the ppl who have them are doing with them
<sivang> heh, I just wish I was less busy during the laptop testing team  formation
* JaneW is off to a meeting
<JaneW> bye
<sivang> laters
<JaneW> LPI cert stuff
<highvoltage> bye
<ogra> Petaris, usually you only authenticate the usersx against AD ... there are docs on ltsp.org about it
<Petaris> ogra: I'll take a look there, but it would be nice to have them logon with their AD info and get their homedirectory mapped :)
<ogra> i heard thats possible, but due to lack of any MS products around me i cant confirm :)
<Petaris> Anyone know about NDS/eDirectory auth on terminals?
<Petaris> We use AD but I have been considering a switch to Novell for a while now
<spacey> Petaris: as long as PAM can auth against it it will work
<LaserJock> is this the only edubuntu channel?
<ogra> yep
<LaserJock> ok, cool
<LaserJock> ogra: how is wiki.edubuntu.org and wiki,ubuntu.com related? are they totally separate wikis?
<ogra> nope
<Burgwork> LaserJock, they are the same
<Burgwork> merely different skins
<ogra> they are exactly the same
<ogra> as wiki.kubuntu.org is ...
<LaserJock> oh, ok. The pages looked familiar but different ;-)
<Burgwork> I personally think seperate wikis are a good thing, but others disagree...
<ogra> i agree ... i'd have loved to keep them distinct
<highvoltage> i think we'll get a lot of stuff done in drupal, in the future
<highvoltage> it has lots of modules that are wiki-like.
<Burgwork> I would have liked to keep the udu wiki seperate as well, but whatever
<highvoltage> the ubuntu wiki does have lots of good reference for edubuntu users, though
<ogra> we, yes, there is an advantage ... 
<ogra> *well
<emmie> Hi
<Burgwork> salut emmie 
<emmie> Tah shi de lah.
<emmie> Er 
<emmie> Tah shi de lah burgwork
<emmie> I'm speaking a foriegn language
<iGotNoTime> Hello everyone :D
* HedgeMage peeks in
<HedgeMage> Hi, folks
<iGotNoTime> This is not a 'total' noob question but...
<iGotNoTime> I have wine and have run apps through it well
<iGotNoTime> but I am curious if there is a default directory I really should be installing these win32 apps into?
<iGotNoTime> is the home directory fine or should I really be installing to the wine directory?
<iGotNoTime> so home is fine? :)
<HedgeMage> no clue, i've never used wine
<HedgeMage> I only use one Windoze prog, and it's a game, and I'm usually just lazy and borrow one of hubby's windows boxen
<iGotNoTime> :D
<Petaris> home time
<mhz> neurogeek: ping, urgente
<mphill> how does edubntu compare to lstpk12?
<mhz> neurogeek: ping, urgente
<mhz> mphill: in what sense?
<mhz> neurogeek: ping, urgente
<mhz> neurogeek: ping, urgente
<neurogeek> mhz hey
<neurogeek> mhz here i am
<mhz> neurogeek: holas
<mhz> neurogeek: es posible que Ricardo aparezca aca en este instante?
<neurogeek> hmmm.. no lo creo porque no est aqu en la oficina
<neurogeek> mhz, pero si quieres puedes dejarme el mensaje a mi.. yo se lo hago llegar lo antes posible
<mhz> neurogeek: necesito con URGENCIA una especie de Curriculum de el
<mhz> neurogeek: es posible ? No encontre algo hasta ahora sobre ricardo
<mhz> neurogeek: es posible ? No encontre algo hasta ahora sobre Ricardo
<Seveas> JaneW, lol @ ubuntu soup :D
<neurogeek> mhz, hmm djame ver
<neurogeek> mhz, nope.. yo tampoco tengo nada a mano,. pero apenas lo vea le digo que te lo enve
<mhz> please!
<mhz> neurogeek: volvera muy pronto?
<neurogeek> mhz, eso espero,. debera estar por venir
* mhz hace conjuros para que llegue ya
<mhz> :D
<mhz_pickDaughter> neurogeek: I'll be back in 30 mins or so
<neurogeek> mhz, ya habl con Ricardo
<mhz> cool
<mhz> and?
<mhz> neurogeek: ?
<mhz> neurogeek: ?
#edubuntu 2006-03-28
<flint> JaneW, I am not getting any of this great correspondence about the Cookbook.  If the change presents itself.  Please email me a copy. Thanks in advance!
<neurogeek> mhz, I told him that you were looking for him and that you needed a curriculum .. guess he is just doing that
<mhz> ooh, I see, thx
<iGotNoTime> help LOL
<iGotNoTime> I have like 10 apps running but nothing in the taskbar
<iGotNoTime> what did I do?
<Burgwork> maybe the taskbar got removed from your panel
<Burgwork> add the "Windows list" back to your panel
<mhz> neurogeek: any news?
<iGotNoTime> Thank you Burgwork that fixed it
<iGotNoTime> sorry gnome is a new concept for me :P
<Burgwork> iGotNoTime, no problem
<iGotNoTime> next question and this one is really getting to me.... my laptop uses a touchpad but when I tap the surface of the touchpad itself it acts as a double click option. It is frustrating when my palm bumps it while typing. Can I disable this so called 'feature'?
<iGotNoTime> I could with XP, but can not find any option in Edubuntu
<Burgwork> sadly not easily
<Burgwork> you need to edit a text file
<iGotNoTime> hehe
<iGotNoTime> any guess which one or where?
<Burgwork> xorg.conf
<Burgwork> /etc/X11/xorg.conf
<iGotNoTime> you are fast :P
<iGotNoTime> with SUDO?
<Burgwork> check
<iGotNoTime> well I see the mouse area for the touchpad but nothing indicating the feature, going to Google :P
<deang> Running Flight5.  My screensaver keeps kicking on (while I'm actively using GAIM and Browser). Is this a known issue?
<crimsun> yes
<deang> thanks.
<grant> How would you guys say edubuntu compares to the fedora core 4 ltsp repackage?
<grant> Anyone awake?
<HedgeMage> I'm somewhat here
<HedgeMage> I've not used FC, though, so I'm not much help on that question.
<grant> You use edubuntu, I take it?
<HedgeMage> I have it on one of my boxen :)
<grant> did you get it working with thin clients?
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<highvoltage> JaneW: http://gallery.debian.org.tw/albums/10th/DSCN3334.sized.jpg
<c7> hi zusammen (sorry spreche leider sehr schlecht englisch)
<c7> kann mir jemand helfen, ltsp zu konfigurieren?
<c7> booten funktioniert wunderbar
<c7> und nen login screen krieg ich auch..
<c7> bloss kann ich mich nicht anmelden..
<highvoltage> c7: flight4 ?
<c7> ubuntu flight5 installation 
<c7> +edubuntu pakete
<highvoltage> c7: sudo ltsp-update-sshkeys
<c7> ja hab ich schon versucht...
<c7> ndert leider nichts daran
<highvoltage> hmmm... shouldn't be necassary on flight 5, but i suggest you try that
<c7> other suggestions?
<highvoltage> as far as i understand, you said that you get kicked off as soon as you log in? i had that problem with flight4, and ltsp-update-sshkeys fixed that for me, but i'm quite sure it's fixed with f5
<highvoltage> i can't think of anything else though, i suggest you hang around and ask ogra when he wakes up
<mhz> highvoltage: hi there
<highvoltage> mhz: hi!
<c7> it did try this.. yeah i thing think would be the best to ask him.. if i can stay awake ;) 
<highvoltage> :)
<mhz> highvoltage: what is your "profesion", what have you studied (university or instute(
<mhz> highvoltage: and what city you live in
<highvoltage> mhz: i still have to study :/
<highvoltage> mhz: Cape Town
<mhz> highvoltage: where are you studing?
<highvoltage> mhz: i'm not studying, really, not yet.
<highvoltage> mhz: although i'm starting guitar lessons tonight, if that counts
<mhz> lol
<mhz> have you studied?
<mhz> anything ICT related
<highvoltage> i did a linux+ course in 2003
<highvoltage> that's about it :/
<mhz> okis
<mhz> so, you have studied something after school
<highvoltage> i need to make some time to study, i thought about doing a psychology course...
<highvoltage> nope, haven't attended formal education after high school
<mhz> highvoltage: dont worry, it is just to provide a "table like" speakers info
<mhz> and how old are you?
<highvoltage> mhz: ok. i phoned yesterday to find out about the visa, they said i do need one
<highvoltage> mhz: i'll apply for one next week
<highvoltage> mhz: 24
<mhz> cool
<mhz> 24? like the Fox series?
<highvoltage> as in, a dyslexic 42 :)
<mhz> lol
<mhz> highvoltage: and remember to tell us an average of how much a ticket to chile is and how long it takes
<highvoltage> mhz: ok
<mhz> cool
<mhz> oh, I've noticed we are having "operators" implemented. Good!
<Burgundavia> mhz: hmm?
<mhz> Burgundavia: oh, always here!?!
<mhz> :D
<mhz> and there
<mhz> and everywhere
<mphill> does edubuntu come with ltsp?
<mhz> mphill: indeed
<Burgundavia> mhz: I am on irc about 15 hours a day, between work and home
<mhz> mphill: that is one of its main features
<mphill> ltsp gets me hot and bothered
<mhz> Burgundavia: oh, you are single? or your "couple" is a geek too?
<Burgundavia> mhz: currently single
<mphill> mhz: how does k12lstp compare with edubuntu
<mhz> mphill: I have not tried k12ltsp yet
<mphill> besides the debian/ubuntu and redhat base distro
<mphill> i'm running k12ltsp now, it works ok
<mhz> but the LTSP edubuntu has is way different than ordinary LTSP
<mphill> how so?
<mhz> mainly, edubuntu LTSP forwards X via ssh
<mphill> interesting
<mphill> does that require anything extra from thin clients using PXE? I assume not
<mhz> actually, IIRC next LTSP release (for all distros) will include edubuntu modifications
<mhz> nope
<mphill> IIRC?
<mhz> oh, sorry
<mhz> If I remember Correctly :D
<mphill> how long as the ltsp project been around?
<mhz> no idea
<mphill> me either
<mphill> mhz: i gotta sleep
<mphill> good night
<mhz> oh, sleep well
<mhz> Burgundavia: single has its advantages, indeed
<c7> highvoltage: dumb question.. but do i have to create special users for ltsp? like in chroot /opt/ltsp/i386/
<mhz> c7: you shouldn't touch /opt
<mhz> unless you know what you are doing, of course
<c7> mhz: like if i want to add some programms?
<c7> mhz: thunderbir-enigmail etc?
<mhz> c7: hmmm, edubuntu will let the client boot and use ALL resources available just like a normal system
<mhz> so, all users in /etc/passwd are valid
<mhz> so, all apps in /bin /usr/bin, etc will be there for users
<mhz> because it is mainly forwarding X via ssh
<c7> mhz: ok cool. yeah if it would ;)
<mhz> so, if Thunderbird has been installed as usual in the server, then the user will use it
<c7> mhz: the problem is i cant login at all..
<c7> :/
<mhz> oh, dapper or breezy?
<c7> dapper
<mhz> damn, I still can't try any flights!
* mhz is guilty as charged!
<mhz> c7: can I make a couple of questions?
<c7> sure
<mhz> c7: the client get an IP from server?
<c7> yep
<mhz> c7: you see LDM on the client's monitor?
<c7> y
<mhz> the user you want to login is not already logged in in the server side?
<c7> no i dont think so.. but how would i double check?
<mhz> in the server side, in a terminal, type:  who
<mhz> (maybe there's a GUI way... no idea)
<c7> sorry what a dumb question ;)
<c7> no he is not logged in
<mhz> very sure
<mhz> ?
<c7> yes
<mhz> does the user you are trying to login from client side exist in /etc/passwd in the server side?
<c7> yes
<mhz> then, the only idea I have is to use a breezy trick we had
<mhz> for similar simptoms
<mhz> c7: in the server side, run this command:  ltsp-update-sshkeys
<mhz> and try to log in from the client side again
<c7> ive done this like 10 times..
<mhz> oh
<mhz> have you tried with a diff user?
<c7> yes but ill try to create a new one and try again
<mhz> have you tried with a diff client?
<c7> no
<mhz> c7: it is very weired because is you get IP + LDM and you have already updated sshkeys, then it should work ok
<c7> thats what i thought too
<c7> ;)
<mhz> :D
<c7> no it doesnt work with a new user called test
<mhz> I know it is not logical but have you rebooted the client?
<c7> yes
<c7> and the server
<mhz> and all those users can perfectly log in to server, at server side
<c7> yes
<mhz> and what errors/symptoms you get to know you are not looging in successfully
<mhz> ?
<mhz> you get back to LDM ?
<c7> yes
<mhz> is the client really trying to log in?
<mhz> I mean, you hear or see something on the screen?
<c7> first i get a black screen with a clock cursor then the cursor turns to an x and then im back to ldm
<c7> grrr
<mhz> hmmmm
<mhz> so it does try
<c7> yes but it does the same thing when i enter a false passwd
<c7> wrong pwd
<mhz> and you say those same users get X ok when they log in at the server side?
<c7> yes
<mhz> how much RAM do the clients have?
<c7> 512mb
<mhz> wow!
<mhz> each client has 512 MB!!
<mhz> how much ram do the server have?
<c7> 300 and some
<mhz> hmmmmmm
<c7> its just a test setup ... with my laptop as a client
<mhz> I have never used LTSP where clients have more RAM than the server :D
<c7> but i dont think this could be the problem
<mhz> I do know that the bare min. RAM for server is 256 + 128 per each client attached to it
<mhz> and that each client should have a tleast 64 MB
<mhz> c7: which desktop is the default X ?
<c7> MemTotal:       386252 kB
<c7> on the server
<mhz> c7: which desktop is the default X ?
<c7> ?? sorry
<c7> gnome?
<mhz> ok
<c7> :)
<mhz> do you have any other desktop installed?
<c7> dont think so
<mhz> could you install a light desktop?
<mhz> wmaker, or fluxbox ?
<c7> apt-get install fluxbox?
* mhz searching to confimr
<mhz> c7: yes
<c7> installed fluxbox and menu
<mhz> already there?
<c7> yep
<mhz> okis, then in a terminal, cd to a /home/test/
<c7> ok
<mhz> nano .xsession
<mhz> and just inser this line to that file:  exec fluxbox
<c7> vi .xsession
<mhz> oops, sorry
<mhz> :D
<c7> ;)
<mhz> emacs .xession
<mhz> !
<mhz> hehehe
<c7> yeah in the future perhaps
<mhz> save it
<mhz> log in with the user, at the server side and let's see if fluxbox works there, 1st.
<c7> mkay .. switch user
<mhz> I remember, fluxbox used to take looooon time to start in Breezy
<mhz> and wmaker took just a blink to start
<c7> starts in like 3 seconds
<mhz> exellent! (they solved it)
<mhz> now, logout
<c7> allready did
<mhz> and let's try from client side
<c7> nogo
<mhz> with same user, of course :D
<c7> ;)
<mhz> damn!
<c7> ...
* mhz is scratching his head
<mhz> tsktsktsk
<c7> :)
<JaneW> highvoltage: nice debian cake :)
<mhz> cake? yummy
* mhz needs some sweet
<c7> me too
<c7> and some sleep
<c7> 8:34 here
<mhz> c7: 03:30 AM
<c7> 8:35AM
<mhz> c7: ogra might be a good candidate to help you figure out 
<c7> sorry
<mhz> heheh
<mhz> c7: 03:35 AM
<mhz> it is far from logical
<c7> yeah i  know but whos gonna wake him up..
<c7> it is
<mhz> UNLESS the flight has known bugs
<c7> what about firestarter?
<mhz> no idea
<c7> or any other firewall?
<c7> which port would i have to open?
<mhz> nah
<mhz> I am using IP tables..
<mhz> oh, wait..
<mhz> maybe you are right
<mhz> can you ssh to clients and from clients to server?
<mhz> AFAIK, ssh is port 22
<mhz> unless someone has modified it
<c7> yes it is
<c7> port 22 is open 
<c7> and i can connect to the server from (another) client
<mhz> tsktsktsk
<c7> cant try it on the laptop cause i cant login ;)
<mhz> heheh, sure
<JaneW> highvoltage: LOL @ your blog post
<JaneW> highvoltage: I think a cocktail is a bit ambitious for me ;)
<mhz> c7: if ogra  is sleeping, maybe someone at #ltsp could help
<JaneW> I'll happilly sample them though!
* highvoltage will have to take some cocktail making classes then ;)
<mhz> c7: they have worked with ogra
<c7> thought they use an older ltsp?
<highvoltage> JaneW: cool! we'll have an edubuntu cocktail launch for the next release then!
<JaneW> highvoltage: good idea!
<mhz> c7: yup, but they are 100% aware of edubuntu  worjk
<c7> mkay could try it.. but i think it'l have to wait some hours
<c7> mhz: i have to get some sleep 
<mhz> JaneW: 106 cities in Latinamerica are celebrating 1 day of FreeSoftware fest, FLISOL, next saturday
<JaneW> mhz: excellent :))
<highvoltage> 106 cities!? wow. must be a big job to co-ordinate.
<mhz> Ubuntu is being #1 guest at InstallFets
<JaneW> by the way in our Prix arz Electronica entry I mentioned that if we win the money
<mhz> fest
<JaneW> (cos they ask what you'll use it for)
<mhz> highvoltage: HUGE job
<JaneW> we would use it for bounties and for sponsored marketing stuff for events
<JaneW> stickers, banner, t-shirts, CDs etc
<mhz> COLL!!!
<mhz> it is needed badly
<JaneW> we should get some nice stuff with 10 000 euro!
<JaneW> no pray that we win, or at least get placed!
<mhz> mybe not "neeeeeeedddddeeed" but "very useful"
<mhz> :)
<JaneW> it would help with our marketing drive to have budget for some visual stuff
<c7> mhz:  rm -rf /opt/ltsp/i386/
<mhz> 100% agree
<mhz> c7: why?
<JaneW> I didn;t tell them we'd get a BEEEEG cake too ;)
<c7> mhz: ltsp-build-client
<mhz> c7: btw, you just did a fresh edubuntu install, did not touch anything other than stated at wiki:EdubuntuInstallNotes ?
<mhz> c7: ooohhhhh
<mhz> c7: NOPE! big mistake!
<c7> mhz: no, i have a 2 weeks old dapper flight 5 install
<mhz> c7: install notes celarly says: DONT use ltsp standard tools 
<mhz> if you want Edubuntu to work
<mhz> :D
<highvoltage> JaneW: :)
<mhz> JaneW: CNN will cover Flisol in Santiago, Chile, where I'll be installing ubuntu and family
<JaneW> highvoltage: thanks for the mail to toxictoadz :)
<mhz> actually, there's a film company that will start shooting to get material for a documentary during the whole 2006, about FLOSS
<spacey> moin
<mhz> moin moin, spacey  
<mhz> :D
<spacey> :>
<highvoltage> drupal
<mhz> lol
<mhz> highvoltage: Bluekuja asked me today if we'll have edubuntu forum
<mhz> I told him "I have been disspaeared from edubuntu, so not a clue"
<highvoltage> mhz: there's some interest for an edubuntu forum, but imo sticking to the mailing lists is a good idea
<highvoltage> JaneW, ogra: ping
<highvoltage> Bluekuja is also interested in starting an Italian Edubuntu loco team.
<JaneW> highvoltage: pong
<mhz> that was my 1st thought too, but on a second thought I feel many people, esp. end users,are less familiar with ML than Forums
<highvoltage> since there's not such a thing as edubuntu loco teams yet, i thought it might be something that we would want to discuss.
<mhz> indeed
<highvoltage> should someone start an ubuntu loco team with an edubuntu interest, or should we investigate having edubuntu loco teams?
<Burgundavia> highvoltage: the first
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: i've added it to the community council agenda for the next meeting
<mhz> I started the idea of Edubuntu Chile, and I got complaints from some people "who hardly participate in edubuntu" stating I wanted to become the "owner" of it in Chile, so I let the idea rest
<mhz> :D
<spacey> at least for NL i think edubuntu loco team can be easily combined with normal one
<mhz> spacey: indeed, that is what I was doing and promoting.
<mhz> and in flisol, I will repeat same speech inviting all desktops and ubuntu flavours to work under just one LoCo team, at least until each group is big enough to walk their own way
<spacey> JaneW: read the cookbook stuff?
<spacey> not sure what to think of elkners reply
<spacey> mhz: yeah
<mhz> highvoltage: one thing I will end up doing for sure, is to customize Edubuntu in a way we provide Chilean Cd's of it (spanish as default) and native languages (mapudungun, aymara, quechua, etc)
<spacey> we all have to work together :) 
<spacey> thats quite easy
<mhz> spacey: yup, that's the spirit
<mhz> highvoltage: and that will have to be called Edubuntu Chile, even if they dont like it :D
<highvoltage> mhz: wow
<mhz> highvoltage: of course, Chilean CD covers, Chilean everything
<highvoltage> very nice.
<mhz> highvoltage: was Skubuntu intended to do that too?
<spacey> mhz the normal (not edu) ubuntu team is really active in chile?
<mhz> nope :(
<mhz> so far, we are 3 or 4, very active
<mhz> the rest usually wait for us to move 
<mhz> and they follow
<mhz> there are lots of users, though, spacey 
<spacey> ok:)
<mhz> spacey: last time I talked about Ubuntu (last week) I had a room with only 40 people
<mhz> the good thing is that they all wanted to hear about Ubuntu
<spacey> :)
<mhz> and 40 was not a bad number considering that I had to talk at 15:00, right after lunch time, on a friday
<mhz> (that means that 90% of population wanted to go home or do nothing
<highvoltage> mhz: skubuntu is intended to fill the gap between ubuntu and what our requirements in the tuxlab project is
<mhz> gap? really?
<highvoltage> mhz: skubuntu will continue on top of edubuntu, but we'll just call it tuxlabs from now on, to avoid confusion
<mhz> what gaps would you have?
<highvoltage> well, guest accounts is a big thing. there's also some more trivial stuff like our tuxlab theming. and there's also south african content, quite a lot of it, that we add in tuxlabs. unfortunately it's mostly proprietary so we can't distribute it :/
<highvoltage> then there's wikipedia, tuxlab troubleshooter, moodle, and some other stuff too
<mhz> ?????????
<mhz> propietary?
<highvoltage> yeah
<highvoltage> education dept would never let us put in the labs without DoE approved content, which is all proprietary.
<Burgundavia> what sort of license and where is the content from?
* mhz tries to understand Shuttleworth foundation goals and propietary material
<Burgundavia> hmm
<Burgundavia> mhz: I think the issue here is the SA gov, not the foundation
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: see http://www.computers4kids.co.za http://www.learnthings.co.za
<highvoltage> we also have http://www.edupac.co.za, which is at least intended to be OSS, but they don't have a license for their software yet :)
<Burgundavia> ah, that is the "lucrative local content" work that OLPC alludes to
<highvoltage> mhz: ideally we'd have 100% OSS, but there's no OSS content available that's approved by the DoE :(
<mhz> hmmmm
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: in south africa, there are *many* bad guys selling crappy content to schools for *huge* amount of money. it's really disgusting.
* mhz tries to understand it but can't... content is not better or worst based on the licence
<Burgundavia> think they don't milk us here too?
<Burgundavia> mhz: that is what SILC here is trying to do
<Burgundavia> http://silc.ca/
<highvoltage> mhz: OSS content is nice, because that means the kids can take the content home, it also means that people like us can distribute it on a large scale, with very little complications
<mhz> Burgundavia: here? 
<Burgundavia> canada
<mhz> highvoltage: Burgundavia, the speech I usually give is related how KEY is free access to content and information if we want a sound Sustainable Development
<mhz> Burgundavia: oh, thx
<Burgundavia> future proofing, indeed
<mhz> esp. when we talk about subdeveloped regions
<mhz> In all modern societies, access to knowledge is as essential as milk or water or food
<Burgundavia> well, most natives in Canada might as well be living in teh developing world, their quality of life is so crap. It is almost criminal how badly they are off
<mhz> exactly
<mhz> but WE are guilty of that
<mhz> because WE let that happen by accepting it is a reality
<mhz> yeah, I know "we" are doing something to change it
<mhz> but this "we" is tooo little yet
<mhz> and the knowledge growth rate is too BIG
<mhz> highvoltage: BTW, usually, my poresentations are rendered by Moin :D
<mhz> (MoinSlideShow)
<iGotNoTime> can we get pron from synaptic?
<iGotNoTime> LMAO
<iGotNoTime> it was a joke :P
<iGotNoTime> really
* Burgundavia doesn't tell iGotNoTime about pornget
<Burgundavia> :)
<iGotNoTime> ohhh!
<iGotNoTime> doh
<iGotNoTime> LOL
<iGotNoTime> can GAIM work with voice services of any native IM clients or no?
<iGotNoTime> sorry native WIN IM Clients
<Burgundavia> voice? hmm, no idea
<iGotNoTime> I had skype for a day or two but voice would only connect for 5 seconds at a time
<highvoltage> mhz: hehe
<Burgundavia> skype isn't bad. It is just non-free and their UI locks like bollocks
<iGotNoTime> I am not a skype advocate, I really have quite the distain for proprietary networks
<jsgotangco> yeah
<jsgotangco> actually skype is pretty useful for me
<iGotNoTime> I am SIP all the way
<iGotNoTime> but just like XP and MSN you can't fight the numbers
<iGotNoTime> everyone I know uses skype
<iGotNoTime> no matter what I try to convince them to use
<iGotNoTime> Google Talk has some serious potential, but will take some time to win the people over to it
* mhz goes to sleep
<ogra> highvoltage, the plan was to get the whole list of people and send out my bank details with a big CC list once Seveas has feedback from everyone :)
<ogra> http://img114.imageshack.us/img114/5436/openofficesplashedu8to.png
<pips1> hehe, nice bit of branding :-)
<ogra> its going round on the ubuntu-art mailing list, i wonder if our ooo2 package even supports themeing ...
<pips1> ogra, I want to install flight5 server at home now. :-) I'll have a few questions
<ogra> shoot
<pips1> since it's the easiest setup for edubuntu server, you recommended to disable dhcp on my router, right?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> otherwise you'd have to teach your routers dhcpd to handle netbooting, thats the alternative
<ogra> :)
<pips1> I don't want to disturb the internet access of my wife's imac (osX) here at home. She normally get's an ip by dhcp... so I figured I need to give the iMac (and my laptop) an ip manually...
<ogra> or just use the right values for your ltsp dhcpd :)
<ogra> look them up in the router and use the same IP range, gateway and nameserver information
<pips1> however, when i tried to set the ip manually, I lost my internet connection, so I restarted networking (to get an ip via dhcp again)
<ogra> then you dont need to change the other clients
<pips1> ah, ok, I'll look at the router infos
<pips1> my router is 192.168.1.1, for that class of network, what is my range? (how many private ips can I specify?)
<pips1> can i just pick any number for the last digit?
<pips1> wow, there are lots of configuration options for my router 8-O
<pips1> ;-)
<pips1> ogra, is there anything in particular you want me to test / have a close look onto in the installation sequence?
* pips1 is ready to start installing
<ogra> it is tested and should run fine, please tell me if you see any problems
<pips1> right
<pips1> well, for a start, the install menu options don't seem to be fully localised yet, i.e. I chose 'Deutsch' and the options still read 'Install to the hard disk', etc.
<pips1> damm, now i remember
<pips1> sorry,
<pips1> you mentioned several times that edubuntu only has English
<pips1> pardon!
<ogra> if you have a working network connection its fine ...
<ogra> it will just take a bit to get the 15MB of kde langpacks
<ogra> just answer yes if the installer asks if it should download the langpacks
<ogra> (and you can use german in the installer with no problems, its just that the desktop is missing tanslations)
<pips1> it's not really a big issue, however, I would just be very "polished" if those couple of menu options where available translated on the installer cd already, or, the language choose F2 would be disabled in the installer...
<pips1> s/I/it would just...
<pips1> do you understand what I meant?
<ogra> i think thats planned
<pips1> ah
<pips1> still in the works, I see :-)
<pips1> ok
<pips1> well, actually, some of the menu items *did* change (F2 Sprache, F6 Weitere Optionen, the rest is still in English)
<ogra> yep
<ogra> WIP :)
<pips1> so I take it the installer menus is still being worked on/polished quite a bit... if I choose F6 it get a wierd "popup" selection that displays too far to the right, so you can't read the options fully...
<pips1> ok, I won't worry about all those nifty details with flight5 then.. :-) and rather get that ltsp server going!
<ogra> :)
<JaneW> ogra: ping
<ogra> JaneW, pong
<JaneW> ogra: you managed to post our entry form off yet?
<ogra> sure
<ogra> yesterday afternoon 
<ogra> dunno how long it takes though ... our snailmail situation here at the end of the world might not be better than yours :)
<JaneW> ogra: excellnt, thanks so much
<JaneW> ogra: that should be fine, they said as long as the post mark is on or before the 24th, so we should be safe :)
<ogra> hey, its also my price if we win it *g* :)
<JaneW> ogra: indeed!
<ogra> great ...
<ogra> that will happen in any case 
<JaneW> ogra: better dry-clean your suit ;)
<ogra> heh
<ogra> i got fat shortly after i bought it ... i guess i'd need a new one ...
<JaneW> you-fat?
<JaneW> hardly
<ogra> i only look slim ... before UBZ i was as slim as mdz, just taller
<ogra> now i only have two trousers left out of 10 that fit :)
<JaneW> edubuntu did that didn't it :/
<JaneW> before UBZ was 5.10!
<ogra> not getting my ass out of this chair did it :)
<Bluekuja> jane?
<JaneW> Bluekuja: yes hi
<ogra> Bluekuja, hey, welcome, new team member ! :)
* ogra waves to italy
<Bluekuja> hi ogra :)
* JaneW waves to Italy too
<Bluekuja> nice
<pips1> ogra, are there any plans to change appearances of 'ubuntu' in the installer to 'edubuntu'? (pips1 is still in nitpicking mode)
<ogra> dunno, i wouldnt mind it either way ...
<ogra> if someone takes care for it or pokes me to do it, it will be changed, but i dont see a reason to hide our inheritance ...
<Bluekuja> ogra nice to meet you
<ogra> Bluekuja, nice to meet you as well :) 
<Bluekuja> i come to main chat soon , im finishing to talk with jane ;)
<ogra> heh, good :)
* JaneW is honoured to be prioritised ;)
<ogra> pips1, its not on my "urgent" list :)
<pips1> it just happened to me several times that I downloaded both ubuntu and edubuntu installers, did an install, and only realise when it was too late that I had the wrong one...
<pips1> ogra, I fully understand :-)
<ogra> pips1, seems that happens to more people ... i have often pings from #ubuntu ... where people complain they suddenly have the edubuntu usplash :)
<Bluekuja> okie im here
<Bluekuja> i was talking with jane about the creation of a edubuntu forum
<ogra> so it might be worth to change it, even if i think the gfxboot splashscreen is pretty celar its edubuntu ;)
<JaneW> what was the final verdict on the edubuntu forums discussion?
<Bluekuja> coz im creating a template similar to edubuntu website ome
<JaneW> yes/no?
<ogra> Bluekuja, i guess then pips1 is the right person, he just sets up our new website 
<Bluekuja> good hehe
<JaneW> ogra: and highvoltage 
<pips1> I even gave a cd to someone else, and then that guy told me he ended up with edubuntu... 
<Bluekuja> so i might talk with him
<ogra> (based on drupal which also have forum capabilitys)
<Bluekuja> hehe
<JaneW> pips1: can you chat with Bluekuja ?
<ogra> s/have/has/
<pips1> Bluekuja, i'm right here! :-)
<ogra> pips1, but as long as the first screen says edubuntu, i blame the user ;)
<Bluekuja> okie pipsl
<Bluekuja> listen
* JaneW has to chat to silbs
<JaneW> bbl
<pips1> ogra, yep, it does say edubuntu in the middle
<Bluekuja> ur re designing website right?
<ogra> pips1, exactly ... :)
<pips1> Bluekuja, I work with highvoltage on the website, yes
<pips1> we split the work
<Bluekuja> ok good listen , im creating a template for the forum 
<pips1> highvoltage will tackle the look/design
<ogra> JaneW, probably point out that we might get probs with community contributions if the colorscheme changes heavily ;)
<Bluekuja> do u know smf ,forum board?
<pips1> Bluekuja, which forum?
<ogra> JaneW, (i missed that yesterday, but wont scratch on the topic again for now)
<JaneW> ogra: ok
<Bluekuja> there was an idea to create an edubuntu forum 
<JaneW> ogra: although I need to talk to her about the LPI cert ;)
<pips1> Bluekuja, you mean over at ubuntuforums? right?
<ogra> ah :)
<Bluekuja> nope , i mean a separeted one ,linked to edubuntu website
<pips1> Bluekuja, well, we would prefer an integrated one, rather than a seperate one
<Bluekuja> coz in ubuntuforums there will be only a section dedicated to edubuntu not an entire forum
<Bluekuja> u mean integrated in an existing one?
<ogra> integrated into the whole website ...
<Bluekuja> yeah ,i've understood , so the idea is to create a forum inside the website
<Bluekuja> like ubuntu-it one
<pips1> haven't seen ubuntu-it, need to have a look at that!
<Bluekuja> http://forum.ubuntu-it.org
<Bluekuja> see it
* pips1 looks
<Bluekuja> do u mean something like that?
<pips1> well, ours will be probably even more integrated than that
<ogra> very important is that we want the authentication handled by launchpad if possible ... so its easier to have all (webserver,forums etc) in one server 
<Bluekuja> ok ,thats a good idea
<Bluekuja> wat board will use the forum?
<pips1> ogra, yes, I agree, logins should work for both launchpad, wiki and website
<pips1> Bluekuja, ?
<ogra> yep ... single sign on, hehe
<Bluekuja> i mean which forum software wull use
<ogra> drupal
<pips1> ogra beat me to it ;-)
<ogra> heh
<Bluekuja> ok good
<Bluekuja> hehe
<Bluekuja> that sounds good
<pips1> there are lots of communication tools available for ubuntu/edubuntu/kubuntu ... for newbies it can be a bit confusing and overwhelming... since we target teachers & students, we aim for an integrated website
<Bluekuja> yeah ,i agree with that
<Bluekuja> it must be simply
<Bluekuja> and easy to navigate
<Bluekuja> by newbies
<pips1> yes!
<Bluekuja> ok good , im installing in local drupal
<Bluekuja> ^^
<pips1> cool, drupal is a nice tool
<pips1> Bluekuja, have you seen that German Site? http://www.ubuntuusers.de/
<Bluekuja> let me see it :)
<Bluekuja> ok seen
<Bluekuja> thats a nice site
<Bluekuja> isnt it?
<pips1> yes, nicely done
<Bluekuja> that can be the idea of edubuntu website
<pips1> http://www.ubuntuusers.de/map/
<pips1> a map of all users registered on the german site
<pips1> (takes a while to load, that page)
<ogra> ah, a UbuntuWorldwide clone ? 
<pips1> ogra, haven't seen that yet!
<ogra> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWorldWide
<pips1> wow
<pips1> so many users, the names overlap....
<Bluekuja> nice
<pips1> in the german vesion, you can click on the individual users and get more info
<pips1> (you get that member's page)
<Bluekuja> really nice
<Bluekuja> im browsing now drupal
<pips1> did you install the debian package?
<Bluekuja> mmmm...nope
<pips1> what version of drupal?
<Bluekuja> downloaded it from drupal.org
<Bluekuja> 4.6
<pips1> right, ok
<Bluekuja> sorry 4.7
<pips1> ah
<Bluekuja> beta one
<pips1> that's still in beta, yep
<Bluekuja> yeah its a nice software
<Bluekuja> easy too administrate too
<pips1> yes
<pips1> the best feature is the taxonomy (categories)
<pips1> make's it really flexible, for navigation ... menus, etc
<Bluekuja> yes ,thats a really good software for our purpose
* ogra grumbles at jelkner ...
<Bluekuja> i go to eat something back in 30 minutes ;)
<ogra> he should know i'm subscribed to the ML i run ... grr
<pips1> talk to you l8r
<pips1> ogra, what's the plan regarding install option for edubuntu? do you keep the 'workstation' option?
<ogra> sure
<pips1> in F1 Help, that option isn't explained though...
<ogra> i'd love to hide the server option or to rename it to minimal
<pips1> ogra, i agree
<pips1> what's the word? are they up for renaming it?
<pips1> how could be get the 'workstation' option explained under F1 ?
<pips1> (oh, so many typoes)
<pips1> I meant, I am making typoes here on irc
<ogra> thats just a change to the isolinux text .. its trivial
<pips1> oh, so you could easily add a one-liner description for 'workstation' then
<pips1> is that on your list?
<pips1> :-)
* pips1 will be known as "the little nitpicker" aka "pain-in-the-xxx"
<ogra> could you file a bug agauinst debian-installer and assign it to me as reminder ? 
<pips1> ok, will do
<pips1> can I assign you in malone? do I need to "subscribe" you? how do I do it?
<pips1> if found hostmaster at grawert dot net
<pips1> ogra, I don't know how to 'assign' you to the bug in malone, I only see an option to "subscribe" you to get change notes for the bug...
<pips1> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/debian-installer/+bug/36139
<ogra> you click on the package name in the top table ...
<ogra> there you can change asignee severity etc ...
* highvoltage waves to italy too (while catching up on the channel)
<Bluekuja> here i am again
<Bluekuja> pipsl still there?
<pips1> Bluekuja, now I'm eating :-)
<pips1> talk to you later
<pips1> ?
<Bluekuja> hehe oki tell me when u finish
<Bluekuja> ;)
<Bluekuja> hi mhz :)
<mhz> hey
<Bluekuja> how are you?all ok?
<mhz> just reaing emails and getting ready to leave
<Bluekuja> hehe
<Bluekuja> a busy man
<highvoltage> Bluekuja: doin' fine
<mhz> highvoltage: morning
<Bluekuja> wat time is it there?
<highvoltage> mhz: good afternoon from my side
<mhz> 08:40
<Bluekuja> hehehe
<highvoltage> 14:41 here.
<Bluekuja> 13.41 here
<mhz> highvoltage: you know if Luke Yelavich is around or his nick ?
<highvoltage> mhz: i don't know
<ogra> mhz, TheMuso
<ogra> he's in -devel
<Bluekuja> ogra
<Bluekuja> are u there?
<mhz> ogra: Hi!!
<Bluekuja> aww gone hehe
<ogra> nah
<Bluekuja> lol
<ogra> i just do my work aside ... cant always answer immediately
<Bluekuja> yeah :)
<highvoltage> hehe. ogra you make it sound like IRC is your main thing and work is just something you do aside :)
<ogra> highvoltage, it sometimes is ;)
<ogra> on wednesdays for example ...
<ogra> ususally the meeting brings up questions that keep me chatting for hours before i can get to work again ;)
<Bluekuja> hehe 
<pips1> here comes another question for ogra ;-)
<pips1> my router's dhcp range starts at 192.168.1.1 and ends at 192.168.1.63. So for the edubuntu server, do I pick an ip *within* or *outside* of that range?
<ogra> pick the same ;)
<ogra> but start at .2 
<pips1> right
<ogra> .1 should be the router :)
<pips1> but I got a laptop and a imac here too, they areadly might have .2 or .3 or whatnot ?
<pips1> my laptop got .4 actually
<pips1> does it matter if I pick something and there is a "gap" in the numbering, shouldn't be a problem, right?
<ogra> nope 
<ogra> thats fine ..
<pips1> ah sorry, I wrote something wrong
<pips1> my router's dhcp range starts at 192.168.1.33
<pips1> funnily enough, my laptop is at .4, so I don't quite understand how that is possible
* pips1 is confused
<pips1> do I pick 192.168.1.33 for the server then?
<ogra> just pick one :)
<ogra> it doesnt matter :)
<pips1> right, ok
<ogra> it just has to be consistent ...
<ogra> worst case you need to renew the IPs on the other two machines
<pips1> define "consistent" please ;-)
<ogra> use the same ip for the server everywhere ;)
<pips1> ok, gotcha
<pips1> ogra, my router's id is 192.168.1.1 so I used that very same ip for gateway and name server... right?
<ogra> nameserver might be your providers nameserver 
<ogra> gateway is right ...
<pips1> darn... I guess I need to reconfigure the nameserver later in that case
<ogra> use 217.115.139.139
<ogra> thats my server ...
<pips1> what happens if the installer can't resolve ?
<pips1> will the installation proceed, simply without internet access?
<ogra> you wont get langpackages from the repo 
<ogra> yep
<ogra> it will get slower though ...
<pips1> right... well that's what happening now :-)
<pips1> oops
<pips1> debootstrap-warning
<pips1> ...deb was corrupt
<ogra> ouch
<ogra> how fast did you burn ? 
<pips1> udev_079-0ubuntu18_amd64.deb
<pips1> I burnt it at 8x
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> do a integrity check ...
<pips1> so I choose <back> and do that check...
<pips1> it won't really let me go back... it's trying one package after the other...
<ogra> so you didnt have a red screen ? 
<pips1> gives me all those warnings "Couldn't download package ..."
<pips1> yes red screen
<ogra> then start over again ... 
<ogra> either your download or the media is broken
<pips1> i simply reboot?
<ogra> yep
* pips1 is rebooting
<pips1> well, probably download was broken because I used that wrong ip for nameserve
<pips1> r
* pips1 is doing integrity check
<pips1> when asked about proxy, should I enter a ubuntu mirror? or is proxy used for something else?
<pips1> ah, corrupt install cd
<pips1> oh, dear
<ogra> proxy is used if you have a http proxy anywhere ...
<ogra> if you didnt use one before, just ignore it
<neurogeek> mhz, ping
<mhz> neurogeek: pong
<neurogeek> mhz, how is it going? did you get anything from Ricardo?
<mhz> nope, unfortunately
<mhz> and I have asked for extentention and they gae until today in 1 hour
<neurogeek> OK, let me check that again
<mhz> neurogeek: I appreciate it
<mhz> they like the idea of a biz man reglated to FLOSS
<flint> ogra, finally figured out the edubuntu mail delay.  Kinda simple, I set myself up as getting the digest.  This does not make for responsiveness but is great for throughput. so it goes.
<ogra> heh
<ogra> fix that then :)
<flint> ogra, na, I think that I enjoy the rumor mill followed by the facts, kinda like the current Amerikan Media and Bush Administration.  Would feel uncomfortable with the facts prior to the spin. :^)
<mhz> ogra: have you seen Yagisan latey?
<mhz> lately
<ogra> he was here this week, yes
<mhz> ogra: thx
* pips1_ burnt another cd at 4x, did integrity check, went ok, now install
<ogra> great 
<pips1_> is there a way for selecting a local ubuntu mirror during install?
<pips1_> or is the mirror selected automatically?
<ogra> i think in the expert install thats possible
<pips1_> oic
<pips1_> so proxy has nothing to do with that at all...
<ogra> else it will select the mirror based on your language selection
<ogra> nope
<pips1_> i can leave proxy blank, then?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> just hit enter
<pips1_> ok, cheers
<jsgotangco> hey all
<pips1_> I hope it runs through this time :-) I'm still a bit confused about those network settings, I though I understood the basic concepts, about private networks vs. public networks, nat, etc. but it's all a bit abstract :-)
<pips1_> hey jsgotangco 
<neurogeek> mhz, Ricardo will be online in a few mins
<highvoltage> bye!
<mhz> neurogeek: his cv, his cv :D
<Bluekuja> jane?
<Bluekuja> ogra ?
<mphill> does anyone have any suggestions on educational software that does not come with ubuntu?
<mphill> rather edubuntu
<Bluekuja> u mean
<Bluekuja> u need additional software
<mphill> yes
<Bluekuja> educational one
<Bluekuja> in ubuntu
<mphill> additional education software
<Bluekuja> well you can find 
<Bluekuja> in
<Bluekuja> apllications
<Bluekuja> add applications
<Bluekuja> edutainment
<Bluekuja> a lot of educational sofwatre
<Bluekuja> *software
<Bluekuja> that u can easily add
<mphill> does edubuntu have the ltsp included and in the same location of /opt/ltsp?
<ogra> yes
<Bluekuja> i think yes
<Bluekuja> yes it have it
<Bluekuja> ogra
<Bluekuja> i need to talk with u one moment
<Bluekuja> :)
<ogra> you can also look at ofset.org or schoolforge.net for software thats not packaged yet, they have lists
<ogra> Bluekuja, just ask your question :)
<ogra> (no need to ask to ask :) )
<mphill> ogra: have done setup for school?
<mphill> s/school/schools
<ogra> mphill, not personally, no, but there are plenty of people using edubuntu at schools
<mphill> from a principle stand point, do you think its shardy if I were to develope and angel of my business into getting all machinces and setting up linux labs for a fraction of what a lab costs, and make money off that. keep in mind the school would be saving thousands of dollars.
<mphill> i should proof read before i send :)
<ogra> 7me looks up shardy 
<strusberg> Hi Mhz
<mhz> strusberg: hi!!!
<mhz> strusberg, please join #mhz
<strusberg> mhz, ok
<mhz> strusberg: leyendo
<pips1_> ogra, found a wierd localisation bug: the installer ask me if I want to download language support - this question is in english, rather than german, like all the dialog questions before... I downloaded the debian-installer language file (po) from launchpad, but I could find those english strings in the po file at all...
<pips1_> so... against what should I file a bug?
<ogra> look at rosetta, it should be in there 
<ogra> debian-installer as well 
<ogra> oh, no, wait 
<ogra> i think the installer translations are handled by Kamion separately
<pips1_> right
<pips1_> so what do I do?
<ogra> ping him ?
<pips1_> where would i find him? in #ubuntu-dev? or smth?
<ogra> -devel is fine
<pips1_> ah, right
<mphill> i was never prompted to enter a root password
<ogra> see wiki.edubuntu.org/RootSudo
<mphill> can i switch to the traditional way
<ogra> sure, but you'll still need your own password for all the gui tools
<ogra> so you wont gain much with setting a root pw
* pips1_ finished flight5 install
<ogra> sudo -s is fine for becoming root permanently and you only need to keep one PW in mind and dont loose the advantage of a locked root 
<pips1_> ogra, there's no internet access on the server :-( I must have chosen a wrong ip for gateway perhaps... if I do route, i get desination: localnet and gateway: * ???
<ogra> can you ping the gateway ip ?#
<pips1> lemme try
<pips1> nope, host unreachable
<ogra> hmm, but your route has a fixed IP ?
<ogra> *router
<pips1> nope
<pips1> don't thinks so
<ogra> ah... 
<ogra> the router should have a fixed IP you can reach ...
<ogra> damned, i didnt tell you that before ...
<pips1> hold on, there might be a misunderstanding
<pips1> the *external* ip isn't fixed, but my routers ip is fixed, i think?
<pips1> I mean, I can reach my router with the same ip in our private network
<pips1> but I think the provider assigns the public ip to my router dynamically, or smth
<pips1> does this make sense at all???
<ogra> but your ltsp server is attached to the inside of the router, right ? 
<pips1> yes
<ogra> and you choose the same IP parameters the routers IP is in for the dhcp server 
<pips1> setup as such: router - combined hardwarefirewall/8portswitch - hub - server
<ogra> i.e. if the router is 192.168.100.1 you choose 192.168.100.X for the dhcp server
<pips1> yes, me thinks
<ogra> hmm, then you should be able to ping 192.168.100.1 from the server in my above example ...
<pips1> well, my laptop is on the same hub as the server, and i can reach the router from my laptop...
<ogra> whats the ip of the server ?
<ogra> and whats the exact ip of the router ?
<pips1> 192.168.1.33 <-- that is from the dhcp range of my router
<ogra> ok
<ogra> and the router ? 
<pips1> ^^^^^^^^ thats the ip of server
<ogra> 192.168.1.1 ?
<pips1> yes
<ogra> hmm, then something is wrong ...
<ogra> you should even be able to ping it without a route set ...
<ogra> can you paste the output of sudo route ? 
<pips1> ok
<ogra> ah, forget the sudo :)
<pips1> well, I can't paste directly, so i'll copy it manually...
<ogra> Ziel            Router          Genmask         Flags Metric Ref    Use Iface
<ogra> 192.168.100.0   *               255.255.255.0   U     0      0        0 eth2
<ogra> default         192.168.100.1   0.0.0.0         UG    0      0        0 eth2
<ogra> thats a working routing table ...
<pips1> localnet * 255.255.255.0 U 0 0 0 eth0
<ogra> yours should be similar with other ips
<pips1> and the second line:
<ogra> ah, try route -n 
<ogra> we want ips :)
<pips1> default 192.168.1.1 0.0.0.0 UG 0 0 0 eth0
<ogra> looks ok
<pips1> ok
<ogra> localnet should be 192.168.1.0 in the first line if you run with -n
<pips1> 192.168.1.0 0.0.0.0 255.255.255.0 U 0 0 0 eth0
<ogra> looks fine ...
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> thats strange
<pips1> :-D
<pips1> hehe
<ogra> the dhcp server on the router is disabled ? 
<pips1> no, enabled?
<ogra> and you dont have the .33 used anywhere ? 
<pips1> sorry, enabled!
<ogra> ah :)
<ogra> you cant run two dhcp servers easily in one LAN :) 
<ogra> (you can, but it gives even me a cold shower to think about setting it up)
<pips1> i thought you said i could leave it enabled, but that I just needed to put the right ip values, accordingly
<ogra> nope
<ogra> you can only run one ...
<pips1> oh, misunderstood you then
<ogra> else they'll clash 
<ogra> and the router needs a fixed ip ...
<pips1> so, should I just disable the dhcp on the router, then?
<pips1> I didn't apply for a fixed ip with my provider, me thinks, it's more expensive :-/
<pips1> in the router web config menu, it looks as if I could set a fixed ip, I just wouldn't know what ip to use, since I didn't get one from the provider
<ogra> no, the router needs a fixed ip on the inside ...
<pips1> ah, ok
<ogra> (192.168.1.1 ;) )
<pips1> ok, so I simply turn of dhcp on the router and reboot edubuntu?
<ogra> yep 
<ogra> not sure you need to reboot though
<ogra> sudo ifdown/ifup might do it 
<pips1> what happens to my laptop and wife's imac ip's? will they just continue to work?
<ogra> you might need to renew them ... they should pick up the IPs from the ltsp dhcp 
* pips1 goes downstairs to warn his wife that internet might be down for some open source testing geekery
<pips1> :-)
<pips1> ogra, strange, I disabled, dhcp on the router, but no change, i.e. still can't reach the router on the server
<ogra> are you sure that physically is everything ok ? 
<pips1> lemme double check
<ogra> wiring etc ...
<ogra> there is no reason it wouldnt work the way you've set it up
<pips1> well, the wires all seem fine, the ethernet led's on both hub and server nic are blinking...
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> you should be able to ping then ...
<pips1> i'll try to ping my laptop from the server
<ogra> yes, good idea
<pips1> no luck
<pips1> "unreachable"
<ogra> hmm ... 
<ogra> weird 
<ogra> and they all are on the same hub ? 
<pips1> ha! i can successfully ping the server from my laptop !
<pips1> how strange indeed
<ogra> yeah
<pips1> a "one-way" nic on my server ;-)
<pips1> could I try to ssh from my laptop to the server?
* pips1 is wondering how to debug this
* pips1 tries sudo /etc/init.d/networking restart
<pips1> aha, temporary failure in name resolution
<ogra> sure, if you cant reach the internet, you cant reach my server for dns resolution
<pips1> right
<pips1> it's so strange, my laptop reaches the internet just fine
<pips1> do you think my hardware-firewall could be the culprit?
<pips1> not really, eh
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> can you get around it easily to check it ? 
<pips1> yes
<pips1> it sitting under the stairs
<pips1> what could i check though?
<pips1> ogra, I need to investigate about my router and hwfirewall... I think i never actually disabled dhcp on the router, also, I discovered that the hw-firewall *also* provides a dhcp server, what a mess!! 
<ogra> urgh
<pips1> the web interfaces to the router and hw-firewall aren't that terribly conclusive
<lucasvo> better than writing your own rules
<lucasvo> Iptables -d bla bla bla
<pips1> unchecking the dhcp checkbox resulted in a page refresh, but actually, dhcp was still active, I need to press a form button for the change to actually happen... but without dhcp, my laptop couldn't even even reach the router's ip anymore... so I had to hardware-reset the router to get dhcp back up and be able to get to the web interface of the router... bla
<pips1> lucasvo, yes, but at least you see exactly what you configured/wrote in iptables ;-)
<lucasvo> pips1: yeah, but you also have to understand it
<pips1> hehe
<lucasvo> I didn't write my own. fwbuilder is actually quite good
<pips1> no pain, no gain
<pips1> ;-)
<pips1> well, it depends on how many services you need to run... if it's just 4 or so services, it's not that hard to write it yourself in iptables
<pips1> block all, and just open the ports you need...
<pips1> anyway
<HedgeMage> I often do it by hand, mostly out of habit :)
<pips1> ogra, i'll need to continue another day, gotta go, but thanks for all your patient answers! :-)
<ogra> thanks for testing :)
<lucasvo> yes, but I mean with NAT, dns, dhcp, www, and last but not least portmap/nfs
<lucasvo> Lag: 132
<lucasvo> uff
<pips1> I am getting a better idea of what needs to go into a howto for a newbie ;-) all those built-in dhcp and whatnot services in the router/switch/firewall/whatever-hardware are quite confusing
<ogra> why would you forward portmap/nfs to the world ? 
<ogra> thats evil :)
<ogra> an ddhcp wont gain you anything if you forward it
<ogra> pips1, the prob is that every router is different ... you cant cover them all
<pips1> ogra, hmm, well I think i'm starting to understand why it will be difficult for edubuntu to find lots of community testing... every newb can do a workstation install on their own lappie, but setting up a lab, requires two or more machines, networking hardware, etc..
<ogra> yep
<ogra> but i got enough HW to do basic testing and people like spacey are really helpful 
<pips1> ogra, Kamion will merge some translations that he forgot... 
<ogra> yep, i saw
<ogra> :)
<pips1> ok, need to run, see you!
<ogra> bye, and thanks :)
<mwright1night> hello
<mwright1night> Is the new LTSP 4.2 going to be in edubuntu now that the date has been pushed out to 1st Jun
<mwright1night> 4.2 should be released around April 15
<ogra> mwright1night, we ship the ltsp muecow (4.2) implementation since breezy
<ogra> debian just adopted our packages to etch and backports them to sarge
<ogra> if you want to use ltsp.org 4.2 (and loose upgradeability through that), you are free to do so, but we'll ship the muecow implementation ...
<ogra> they are developed very close to each other (i work with jim mc quillian and scott balneaves)
<mwright1night> orgra yes I am aware
<mwright1night> what I am trying to understand is, will the new local devices support and local apps support from the main tree 4.2 be in the dapper drake releasE?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> we postponed that to dapper+1
<ogra> i personally dont like the lbus approach, but jim and scott had no dbus specialist around ...
<ogra> the right way will be to add X transport to dbus, so you can just attach it to the established ssh tunnel ..
<ogra> that needs to be specced out very good, we didnt quite make it at the conference in montreal ...
<mwright1night> will jim change if you get the right people to put it together
<mwright1night> and go dbus
<mwright1night> I actually don't know what lbus vs dbus is actually
<ogra> dbus is the communication system the gnome apps use
<mwright1night> and lbus is?
<ogra> its already established in an ubuntu desktop session
<ogra> and lbus is a reimplementation of the dbus protocol to do the communication between server and client for the mount process
<ogra> if i plug in a camera in ubuntu, the kernel and udev wil automatically create a device in /dev ...
<ogra> to get the server to mount it, the server needs to know that device just appeared
<ogra> so lbus sends a notification from the client to the server 
<ogra> which then executes a mount of the device over the network ...
<ogra> ubuntu ltsp already uses a ssh tunnel to do the X forwarding, and the desktop already uses dbus for the apps ...
<ogra> the idea is to attach dbus to both sides of the tunnel and let the communication go in there instead of opening an extra port (lbus) and have communication via an additional channel
<ogra> jim might not take that path, since i dont know if he can be sure to have dbus available on all desktops ...
<ogra> the ubuntu approach is far more intergrated into the system, ltsp.org 4.2 is for all distros ...
<ogra> they use the same base ... but with ltsp.org you will never be able to upgrade right away... 
<mwright1night> nice approach
<mwright1night> seems like the cleanest option
<mwright1night> we are FC4 moving to FC5 this weekend.
<ogra> i have some other things in mind that go a completely different path ... but lest see ...
<mwright1night> I am waiting for my moment to move to ubuntu
<ogra> what hinders you ?
<mwright1night> if you get this dbus architecture then it is another compelling reason
<mwright1night> not much now, previously things did.  
<ogra> ah
<mwright1night> I will definitely do it at the end of the year, with the next version
<mwright1night> I said that about Dapper Drake as well
<mwright1night> and slipped on that
<mwright1night> what kind of paper do you use where you live?
<mwright1night> A4 or Letter?
<ogra> A4
<ogra> doesnt all of the world apart from the US use A4 ?
<mwright1night> Have you noticed the bug in Firefox where it won't remember the Paper setting, or read the global setting?
<mwright1night> Probably.
<ogra> nope, i never print from firefox ...
<ogra> at least its ages ago i did it the last time
<mwright1night> so you get stuck on American Letter.  To make the system acceptable we had to purchase a new printer that had an A4/Letter auto override
<ogra> nah, there must be a fix
<mwright1night> that is such a bad usability bug,  it's upstream.. I am planning on logging it in the ubuntu bug tracking system cuase the Fedora people haven't cared about it for 1.5 years that I've been harassing them over it
<mwright1night> There is not.. I'm serious
<ogra> and it happens in ubuntu as well ? 
<mwright1night> I will test dapper drake, and if it's fixed I'll flame the Redhat guys to fix it
<mwright1night> did happen in Breezy
<mwright1night> I gave away my Dapper drake test cd the other day
<mwright1night> anyway after the FC5 upgrade, because things are getting so good on the desktop, and we are having so few issues now, I will log any long standing bugs in multiple distributions bugzilla's
<mwright1night> as they have different priorities -- ubuntu cares much more about usability than redhat people in my experience
<ogra> :)
<DeMoNSeEd> ogra are you around
<ogra> DeMoNSeEd, yes, but a bit busy, preparing for a meeting in 10 min
<DeMoNSeEd> k
<DeMoNSeEd> it's just a quickie, GCompris runs super now
<ogra> great :)
<DeMoNSeEd> nut can't seem to get anything but a smartass answer in ubuntu proper room about the multiple floppy thing, i edited fstab and media, but floppy still won't mount, what else do i need to do, getting the suggestion in buntu room of ,"just don't use floppies", just doesn't cut it
<LaserJock> ogra: do you always have edubuntu meetings at the same time?
<ogra> LaserJock, yep
<ogra> 12:00 UTC on wednesdays
<LaserJock> darn
<DeMoNSeEd> are they aware of this multiple floppy bug?
<LaserJock> does Edubuntu have any science minded people on board?
<ogra> there are some on the ML
<LaserJock> ogra: ok, any MOTUs or are you pretty much it?
<ogra> and the clear target is to grow big enough at some point that you can set up a whole university with it
<ogra> i'm pretty much it :)
<LaserJock> ok, I'm just trying to gauge need, etc. so I can plan my dapper+1 work ;-)
<DeMoNSeEd> does anyone know the cure for the multiple flopy thing
<DeMoNSeEd> *floppy
<ogra> LaserJock, i'd definately like to have the mentioned metapackages in dapper+1 in any case, i'm fine doing them myself if you dont want, what i need is someone with a deeper knowledge of the apps to tell me what is good to include and what not :)
<LaserJock> ogra: well, I'
<LaserJock> I'm saying I might be interested in getting more involved with edubuntu ;-)
<ogra> :)))
<DeMoNSeEd> anyone?
<LaserJock> especially if I can integrate it with my MOTUScience work
<ogra> (sorry, dapper dev meeting currently)
<LaserJock> DeMoNSeEd: did you try #ubuntu+1 ?
<DeMoNSeEd> what is that
<DeMoNSeEd> a help room
<LaserJock> the irc channel for Dapper support, I think
<DeMoNSeEd> oh, cool, i had no idea of it, ty
<DeMoNSeEd> it's odd as i have dapper on 2 machines here, 1 is fine, but on this machine here, i end up showing 7 floppies, none of which will mount
<ogra> there is a bug somewhere in launchpad about it ...
<DeMoNSeEd> woulda been nice if they had least told me that
<LaserJock> who?
<DeMoNSeEd> anyone in ubuntu proper room
<DeMoNSeEd> then i'd know that it was to be fixed
<LaserJock> well, they have to know it to tell you ;-)
<DeMoNSeEd> k, i'll try that room for a quick fix for now, i musta missed something after editing fstab and /media
<DeMoNSeEd> i know, when i inquired, i got backm maybe we do know or maybe we don't, coy answers are sometimes the rule
<DeMoNSeEd> not helpful though
<DeMoNSeEd> k, thanks for the room tip
<LaserJock> np
<DeMoNSeEd> LaserJock, do you know off hand if i'll be able to order cd's of Edubuntu as I do in the case of Ubuntu?
<ogra> for dapper, yes
<DeMoNSeEd> cool, I've got 2 schols "interested", so it's looking good, need to get a bug free...or close to...setup before i make a presentation, being able to give then a pro set of cd's will be a great help.....the stigma of free software is not helped by homemade cd's
<DeMoNSeEd> *schools
#edubuntu 2006-03-29
<mhz> strusberg: ping
<mhz> strusberg: are you there?
<strusberg> Yes
<strusberg> mhz, Yes
<mhz> strusberg: podriamos ahora?
<mhz> o te vas a la cama?
<strusberg> Podemos ahora, dime.
<mhz> #mhz, por fis
<strusberg> ok
<datix_> edubuntu is slick :)
<spacey> JaneW: ping
<spacey> ok, nm:)
<c7> hi all
<c7> ogra: hi ogra, hast du rasch zeit?
<ogra> -> #edubuntu-de ?
<spacey> JaneW: the edubuntu cookbook meeting can be in #ubuntu-meeting ?
<JaneW> spacey: pong
<JaneW> very belated
<spacey> :>
<JaneW> spacey: final got report out which had to be finished today
<spacey> ok
<JaneW> um, yes I think we can use #u-m
<spacey> just putting together an announcement/agenda
<spacey> you need to book it somewhere?
<spacey> or how does that work
<JaneW> we only can't if another meeting is booked already
<JaneW> lemme check
<spacey>  30 Mar 02:00 UTC: Dapper Development Status
<spacey> only other that day
<spacey> according to the topic
<spacey> in #ubuntu-meeting
<JaneW> argh Ubugtu The topic of #ubuntu-meeting is managed by me and filled with the contents of http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event/ical - please don't change manually
<JaneW> lemme try set it on the fridge
<spacey> :>
<spacey> :)
<spacey> JaneW: i assume that scheduling will work out
<spacey> so 
<spacey> i'll send out the agenda
<Yagisan> g'day mhz haven't seen you for ages! what have you been up to ?
<mhz> Yagisan: holas!!!!
<mhz> Yagisan: uffff, I'd rather pm you to avoid pity :D
<jsgotangco> mhz: hello there
<mhz> jsgotangco: !!! nice to see ya again
<jsgotangco> mhz: nice to be back
<jsgotangco> on a normal schedule
<mhz> are you on a normal schedule?
* mhz is still 50% oprational
<iGotNoTime> How do I know if I use OSS or ASLA sound with Edubuntu?
<iGotNoTime> does it say somewhere which one I use?
<ogra> alsa is the default 
<iGotNoTime> ok thank you :)
<ogra> (has always been te default in ubuntu)
<iGotNoTime> but next time I ask is there a place for me to find the info?
<iGotNoTime> system?
<ogra> lsmod :)
<iGotNoTime> ok :)
<ogra> if sound modules starts with snd-, they are alsa, else they are oss
<iGotNoTime> excellent :D
<datix_> edubuntu supports sound on the x clients?
<ogra> in dapper yes, in breezy no ...
<datix_> and dapper is not out yet, correct
<datix_> well, its not release at least
<ogra> dapper releases on june 1st
<jsgotangco> good night
<iGotNoTime> can I ask... What is Flight 5?
<iGotNoTime> a new release?
<iGotNoTime> or a package of some sort?
<ogra> the development milestone ...
<iGotNoTime> :D
<iGotNoTime> I think I have 5.10 so I am out of date now?
<ogra> its a snapshot cdrom we make regulary during development
<ogra> nope, 5.10 is the latest realease ...
<ogra> 6.06 is still in the works
<iGotNoTime> ok :)
<iGotNoTime> Have you guys ever used www.logmein.com?
<iGotNoTime> It is kinda like GoToMyPC except free
<iGotNoTime> You all shoudl check it out. I end up using it several times a month to fix my dad's computer. It is very handy.
<iGotNoTime> I am supposed to go install Edubuntu on his computer tonight....
<iGotNoTime> I have never allowed any remote connections through Edubuntu, there is a native app to allow such "remote control" isn't there?
<iGotNoTime> He will need me to install this and once in a while and if we are both using Edubuntu I was thinking there may be an easy way to do it from my house?
<iGotNoTime> ***install this and that ***
<ogra> nothing to install
<ogra> just enable the remote desktop access in the settings
<iGotNoTime> No I mean when he asks me to install Limewire for example
<iGotNoTime> ok
<ogra> and use tsclient on your machine
<iGotNoTime> but I would need to configure the desktop access while I am at his house correct?
<iGotNoTime> ok will play with that now to get a feel for it
<ogra> yep
<iGotNoTime> I thought there was something :D
<ogra> you have to check one checkbox and you should set a password
<ogra> thats all
<iGotNoTime> ok :D
<iGotNoTime> thanks again
<ogra> np :)
<stevo> Hey; anyone know why my sound in Breezy Badger works for everything except the games?
<stevo> Is there something I'm missing?
<stevo> Anyone there?
<crimsun> do you have libsdl1.2debian-alsa installed?
<stevo> Let me check...
<crimsun> dpkg -l |grep ^ii
<crimsun> err
<crimsun> dpkg -l libsdl1.2debian-alsa|grep ^ii
<crimsun> if that returns nothing, install it
<crimsun> I have a meeting now
<stevo> Thanks very much.
<Ju> hi all !
<ogra> hi
<Burgwork> salut all
<ogra> still at work ?
<Ju> Burgwork: you're french ?
<Burgwork> it is only 11am here
<Burgwork> nope, english
<ogra> heh
<Burgwork> Canadian, to be exact
<Burgwork> west coast, hence why it is 11am
<Ju> yep, you are in the same timezone... 
<ogra> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/LTSPCrossArchSetup
<ogra> does that look sane ? 
<Ju> the next meeting will be hard to follow... 4AM for us ;-)
<Burgwork> ogra, if you are already on the commandline, I would use nano
<ogra> yes, it needs some consistency ...
<ogra> i tend to go alt-f2 gksudo ... 
<Burgwork> I really like the edubuntu wiki theme
<Burgwork> I find it much more readable than the ubuntu one
<ogra> yes, me too
<ogra> i also like the new gtk and metacity theme, but seems like silbs and the design company have other plans with us ...
<ogra> (the edubuntu theme i mean)
<Burgwork> we should the dotted-red line on teh ubuntu wiki
<ogra> you mean the frame for sourcecode ? 
<Burgwork> yep
<ogra> i think that was initially in the ubuntu theme ...
<ogra> (warty time)
<neurogeek_> mhz, ping
<mhz> neurogeek_: pong
<neurogeek_> mhz, all good??
<mhz> better, indeed
<mhz> but waitign for a Nathalie to send me some info Ricardo said it was already ready to be used
<mhz> neurogeek_: how are your things?
<mhz> how about Cuaima?
<mhz> "Gentoo Installer based in RedHat's Anaconda by Latinux"
<neurogeek_> mhz, yes, thta was a long time ago.. 
<neurogeek_> Cuaima is very good though.. 
<mhz> yup, sure
<mhz> neurogeek_: afaik, you all will be using Ubuntu ?
<neurogeek_> mhz, we are using ubuntu for a lot of things
<mhz> oh, cool
<neurogeek_> i use ubuntu at home sometimes
<Bluekuja> hey mhz 
<Bluekuja> still there?
<mhz> hey, Bluekuja 
<mhz> yup
<Bluekuja> hi man how are u?
<Bluekuja> ur alwais a busy man hehe
<flint> ogra, the script is finished.
<flint> ogra, that is the gin script...
<flint> if you are interested, the silly thing (435 or so lines of bash) can be found under bzr control at https://docbox.flint.com/~flint/bazaar/gin/
<flint> i have not begun as extensive testing as I would like.... hell it is friday, and I want to go see a maple sugar shack...
<flint> seems like you are all asleep... sksk
<mhz> Bluekuja: sorry, it is just that after being absent for so long, I need to catch up with lots of stuff
<Bluekuja> yeah np :)
<Bluekuja> i know that ur a busy man hehe
<Bluekuja> when ur more free ,tell me see you later
<Bluekuja> ;)
<mhz> Bluekuja: okis
<mhz> i will
<Bluekuja> ;)
<mhz> neurogeek_: ping
<neurogeek_> mhz, hey!!
<mhz> neurogeek_: do you know Nathalie Bertou?
<neurogeek_> mhz, Yeap.. she works here too
<Pygi> JaneW: around?
<Bluekuja> hi neuro
<mhz> neurogeek_: any chance you could motivate her to send me a syllabus (with objectives and all) for a course of office applications (firefox, thunderbird, abiword, gnumeric, and ooo) or something she has ?
<mhz> neurogeek_: never mind, please ignore my request :D
<Bluekuja> lol
#edubuntu 2006-03-30
<mhz> neurogeek: ping
<neurogeek> mhz, pong
<drbreen> hello
<drbreen> i am an admin of a small internet cafe in a school - no more than 5 clients - and i wonder
<spacey> hi
<Burgundavia> drbreen: welcome
<drbreen> if i install edubuntu, that gives me a working ltsp environment out of the box ?
<Burgundavia> yes
<drbreen> because i have some trouble with the current solution which also includes clients that boot over ethernet but
<drbreen> sometimes it does not work
<drbreen> i use kernels on floppy disks that mount their root file system over nfs
<spacey> aha
<spacey> so currently you still run all the applications locally. With LTSP they would all run on the server
<drbreen> now when i tried to move the system to kubuntu breezy and installed ltsp-standalone-server i encountered numberous problems with dhcp and tftp
<drbreen> nay. i run nearly all the apps on the server for i set up X clients
<drbreen> and most people only use x apps
<drbreen> so the clients get a 50 mb or so base system and then aks kindly if they get XDMCP permission or something like this
<spacey> ah ok
<drbreen> the problem i now have is:
<drbreen> i installed ltsp on my kubuntu breezy server with:
<drbreen> sudo apt-get install ltsp-server-standalone openssh-server && sudo ltsp-build-client && sudo emacs /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf && sudo /etc/init.d/dhcp3-server restart
<drbreen> now my etherboot clients sometimes do not find an dhcp server, but more often they just do very little else than printing dot after dot after
<drbreen> Loading 192.168.0.2:/ltsp/pxelinux.0" after they got their ip adress
<drbreen> i suppossed tftp was not running, but ps aux gives me:
<drbreen> nobody  6922 0.0 0.1 2040 604 ?    S  10:24 0:00 in.tftpd -r blksize -s /var/lib/tftpboot
<drbreen> and if i cannot get this fixed fast (over the weekend, it is saturday here) i would prefer to use edubuntu
<spacey> you added correct etherboot section to dhcpd.conf?
<drbreen> wait i will post it
<spacey> use pastebin :)
<spacey> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org
<spacey> I don't use etherboot myself. We only use PXE
<spacey> drbreen: do you know if PXE works?
<drbreen> no
<drbreen> but my /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf is
<drbreen> authoritative;
<drbreen> subnet 192.168.0.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 {
<drbreen>   range 192.168.0.20 192.168.0.199;
<drbreen>   option domain-name "eternal";
<drbreen>   option domain-name-servers 192.168.0.1;
<drbreen>   option broadcast-address 192.168.0.255;
<drbreen>   option routers 192.168.0.1;
<drbreen>   option subnet-mask 255.255.255.0;
<drbreen>   filename "/ltsp/pxelinux.0";
<drbreen>   option root-path "/opt/ltsp/i386";
<drbreen> }
<spacey> <spacey> use pastebin :)
<spacey> <spacey> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org
<spacey> next time please:)
<drbreen> o sorry
<spacey> so
<drbreen> please forgive me
<spacey> you dhcpd.conf only provides PXE
<spacey> not etherboot
<drbreen> the problem is most clients i have here are build from junk and do not have pxe capabilities i suppose
<drbreen> they are really old
<drbreen> so what do i have to change 
<drbreen> to provide etherboot capabilities
<drbreen> ?
<spacey> drbreen: or you should fix etherboot, needs extra images and stuff. it should be in the wiki sometimes
<spacey> uh
<spacey> s/sometimes/somewhere
<spacey> drbreen: if you need quick fix you can also
<spacey> use www.rom-o-matic.net
<spacey> and put it on a floppy
<spacey> then it will PXE boot from there
<drbreen> yeah i _have_ a correct rom from  rom-o-matic but it does _not_ work
<spacey> then look in the logs
<drbreen> it just says "loading 192.168.0.2:/blah/blah" and makes dots
<spacey> drbreen: but you got PXE image from rom-o-matic
<spacey> because in that case
<spacey> you don't use etherboot
<drbreen> so i am dumb, are i ?
<spacey> so you don't have to worry about that
<spacey> i don't think so :) but if you insist ;)
<ogra>  sudo apt-get install mknbi && cd /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/ && sudo mknbi-linux --output=vmlinuz.ltsp --rootdir="/dev/ram0" --append="rw" vmlinuz initrd.img
<drbreen> where are said logs if i have a normal ltsp installation?
<ogra> morning :)
<ogra> use the above line to create etherboot kernels, ubuntu/edubuntu ltsp defaults to PXE ...
<Elias> Good Morning. At next days I install Edubuntu to use LTSP. Please advise me how to install/use LTSP on server and on clients. The clients are NEC POWERMATE VT (Celeron 788/128/66/1.65V or Celeron 733/128/66/1.7V), (RMA 128MB), floppy, NIC Compex 10/100, VGA, M/B GA-6WMM7 Rev.2. The server Pentium4, 1GB ram, 80GB hdd.
<spacey> <drbreen>   filename "/ltsp/pxelinux.0";
<spacey> that line is also wrong path IIRC
<ogra> oh, yes, you need to adjust that for etherboot ...
<ogra> should be  filename "/ltsp/vmlinuz.ltsp"
<drbreen> ok i will try.
<drbreen> many thanks
<ogra> and restart the dhcp server after the change :)
<drbreen> ok
* ogra .oO(wonders if he should look into that for next release, should be possible to make dhcpd pick up changes on the fly)
<ogra> Elias, edubuntu does nearly everything for you ... see https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes
* spacey gonna try open up his laptop
<spacey> bbl
<ogra> just put the CD into the server, hit enter, answer 5 (or so) questions, wait 1h, reboot, follow https://wiki.edubuntu.org/LTSPServerSetup ... done
<ogra> the clients will netboot out of the box if the cards are PXE capable
<Elias> (ogra) What is PXE?
<ogra> a netboot protocol
<ogra> its the default methid to boot from the network for newer NICs
<ogra> *method
<ogra> older ones used the etherboot protocol ...
<Elias> ok....Thanks a lot. I study and I come back when install all of this. Thanks again..
<ogra> if your NICs dont support either, see https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/BootingClientsWithoutPxe
<drbreen> hello again
<drbreen> i did as i was told
<drbreen> but now its just he same
<drbreen> the clients print lines like "loading 192.168.0.2:/ltsp/vmlinuz.ltsp" and slowly many dots
<drbreen> and do nothing
<drbreen> maybe i r really dumb
<Pygi> JaneW: around?
<drbreen> isnt anyone there who could help me ? i feel like every dot takes as long as all dots before together
<Pygi> spacey: fine?
<Pygi> around?*
<spacey> Pygi: hi
<Pygi> hi hi
<Pygi> me Mario
* spacey herman :P
<spacey> what did you want to discuss
<Pygi> well, I wanted to help you maintain the Cookbook and write articles ;)
<spacey> thats great :)
<spacey> i'm happy about that
<spacey> i figure you have read my whole mail about the cookbook status/future
<spacey> ?
<Pygi> yes, I did
<spacey> main focus is the basic stuff to get a new person introduced to Edubuntu and its workings
<Pygi> For deadline, we should go that book should be done one week and a half before the dapper release
<Pygi> that way, we can do a real good work on QA
<spacey> yeah
<spacey> but
<spacey> it slightly depends
<spacey> if ogra want to ship it as a package as well
<spacey> it probably needs to be done earlier
<spacey> ogra: ?:)
<Pygi> o joy, but it depends how much people we will have writing
<spacey> yup
<Pygi> anyone except me and you for now?
<drbreen> what are you going to write
<drbreen> i am just curious
<Pygi> I'll spread the word about the book, so I'll try to collect more people ^_^
<drbreen> ?
<spacey> Pygi: i wanted to spread the word after the meeting next week
<Pygi> drbreen: The Edubuntu Cookbook aka How to cook the Edubuntu ;)
<spacey> so we have a clear vision of what needs to be written
<spacey> :>
<Pygi> spacey: perhaps, but more people on the meeting, means more ideas ;)
<spacey> true
<spacey> Pygi: i will blog about it too
<spacey> so it will get on planet ubuntu
<Pygi> spacey: great ;) I'll talk with some people that I think would be glad to participate, spread around the forum and such ;)
<spacey> Pygi: ok thats fine 
<spacey> :)
<spacey> Pygi: i'm not on the forums at all
<Pygi> About collaboration method, I think Wiki is the best for now ... thoughts?
<spacey> Pygi: yes i think so too
<spacey> because else the barrier is to high to contribute
<Pygi> I registered on forums like a week ago when I needed to inform people about new N-M ;)
<Pygi> spacey: agreed
<spacey> :)
<spacey> we should also find some native english grammer nazi's :)
<Pygi> ;-)
<drbreen> hrhr
<spacey> voor the QA
<spacey> s/voor/for
<spacey> dutch sneaked in :o
<Pygi> lol ;)
<spacey> and i expect ogra to do some technical QA :P
<Pygi> I really think that we need to revise chapters
<spacey> Pygi: yup
<spacey> and seriously limit the scope
<Pygi> yes, at least for Dapper
<spacey> yup
<Yagisan> spacey: so you need non-native english speakers then ;)
<Pygi> then we can go bigger ;)
<spacey> Yagisan: :)
<Pygi> Yagisan: hehe ;)
<Pygi> They are welcome as well, as long as they can write reasonably good ;)
<Yagisan> my wife (non-native) is constantly correcting my grammer (I'm native)
<spacey> :>
<Pygi> spacey: so let's go with the chapters?
<Pygi> suggestions? ;)
<spacey> Pygi: let me get the stuff
<Pygi> kk
<spacey> argh
<spacey> some stuff is double
<Pygi> spacey: huh :-/
<spacey> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuDocumentation/EdubuntuCookbook/Introduction
<spacey> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuDocumentation/EdubuntuCookbook/Chapter_1_-_Introduction
<spacey> but first one seems the most recent one
<spacey> Pygi: anyway I wanted all the stuff that is about how cool it is and benifits etc. out of the cookbook for now.
<spacey> better place on the website imho
<Pygi> yes, and no time
<spacey> exactly
<Pygi> agreed
<spacey> same for testimonials
<spacey> much better for website
<Pygi> are this current chapters?
<Pygi> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuDocumentation/EdubuntuCookbook/Worksheet
<spacey> what about Philosophy?
<spacey> any thoughts on that
<Pygi> vision and goals or? I don't see philosophy?
<spacey> its not in the worksheet
<spacey> oh it is
<Pygi> well, I am not lookin at woorksheet ;)
<spacey> Philosophy, Goals, Testimonials
<spacey> its on both
<Pygi> it's linking on interwiki ;)
<spacey> we should make a new Wiki page
<spacey> Pygi: it doesn't exist
<spacey> :)
<Pygi> spacey: agreed, new wiki page, a organized one ;)
<spacey> CookbookNG :P
<Pygi> bah, why not "How to cook Edubuntu" ;)
<spacey> ok :)
<spacey> sounds great
<spacey> go ahead
<drbreen> "Cooking Edubuntu for Dummies"
<spacey> nah
<spacey> Pygi: you make/i make the page?
<Pygi> spacey: workin' on it right now
<Pygi> I have to do some work as well ... I can't just sleep now when I offered you help to maintain it ;)
<drbreen> "Edubuntu - Cooking humanity in school"
<spacey> :>
<drbreen> err
<drbreen> COCKing humanity in school :)
<drbreen> common typo
<spacey> Pygi: i have to go out for 15 minutes
<Pygi> spacey: k, will talk to you later ^_^
<spacey> yeah i'll brb :)
* Pygi pokes JaneW
<Pygi> spacey: read mail once ur back
* spacey back
<drbreen> hello
<drbreen> i am watching "Loading 192.168.0.2:/ltsp/vmlinuz.ltsp ............" on my diskless client for approx. 2 hours
<drbreen> aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargl
<cortsenc> hello
<flint> ogra, ping
<LaserJock> morning edubuntu people!
<ogra> hey LaserJock 
<LaserJock> ogra: so in general how is edubuntu doing for dapper? Mostly bug fixing now?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> not much else i can do anymore
<ogra> the Cd is constantly oversized, so my main job with edubuntu is shuffling packages around to make them fit in 700MB
<ogra> currently the main tasks are documentation and bugfixes ...
<LaserJock> so are the packages that go on the CD in Main?
<Yagisan> yeah. ogra still won't put mplayer in edubuntu-desktop ;)
<ogra> yep
<ogra> as all packages for all CDs need to be ...
<ogra> cdimage.ubuntu.com only knows main ...
<LaserJock> yeah, that is what I thought. I knew it was that way for Ubuntu and Kubuntu
<LaserJock> so it would be nice to get some universe meta-packages that might help with easily installing some extra packages
<ogra> yep
<ogra> i want to go into app selection mode for dapper+1 again and drop as much kde stuff as we can ... 
<ogra> so there should be more room for new apps
<LaserJock> has there been any thought about an Edubuntu-extras cd that could have the meta packages?
<ogra> i'm thinking about an edubuntu-language CD
<LaserJock> because I would think that educational institutions would like to have everything on cd
<ogra> the DVD is what they should take ...
<LaserJock> ah, yeah. so there is a DVD?
<ogra> and we should get the most intresting apps into main, so it ends up on the DVD
<ogra> sure
<ogra> ubuntu/edubuntu and kubuntu there are DVDs
<LaserJock> I'm a little behind, I haven't "installed" Ubuntu since Breezy was released
<ogra> the DVD contains the live and the install isos as well as all of main
<ogra> but we cant ship edubuntu on DVD since the majority of our users are in third world countries where its relatively unlikely to find a DVD drive
<LaserJock> right, that was why I was thinking of an -extras cd but I guess that might defeat the purpose of trying to keep things small
<ogra> i guess we wont get around thinking about a better solution for dapper+1 
<ogra> currently i cant change it, since we'll be on shipit with dapper
<LaserJock> well, yeah for sure. I was just thinking about Dapper+1 ;-)
<zbyte32> even in 1st world contries DVDs would be a problem, the site I work at has very little funding afterall
<ogra> yep
<ogra> while i'd assume you have decent HW to run a ltsp server though ..
<zbyte32> has anyone ever tried using edubuntu /w openmosix?
<zbyte32> "decent" is relative
<zbyte32> but actually im thinking about using edubuntu, havn't deployed it yet...
<Yagisan> no. haven't had a recent release, and I'm not going back to 2.4.x for it
<ogra> and ubuntu doesnt support 2.4 at all
<zbyte32> hmm, ok
<Yagisan> if a 2.6.x tarball comes out, I may try again but all the userspace tools changed
<ogra> neuralis from #ltsp and #ubuntu-devel did some resarch
<ogra> about openssi
<Yagisan> uses more network bandwidth though IIRC
<Yagisan> I did a test of ltsp setups with it with ltsp a few years ago.
<Yagisan> s/ltsp setups/openmosix setups
<Yagisan> night all
<ogra> sleep tight
<zbyte32> the reason why I ask is because some of the client machines are somewhat decent, while others are really lousy
<zbyte32> thx though
<moonbeam> hello
<moonbeam> Any know issues with Joliet CDs?  I have several that after being mounted give an empty listing.
<moonbeam> They're Windows CD with children
<moonbeam> games
<moonbeam> They've worked in the past... I'm just puzzled why they're behaving like this on #ubuntu.
<NickGarvey> what happens when there are multiple thin client servers on a network and you try to network boot?
<ogra> as long as you dont run multiple dhcp servers and configure your dhcp to point certain clients to certain servers, thats fine
<NickGarvey> oh alright thank you
<ogra> you can also have a centralized server only for booting and have multiple servers serving the user sessions ...
<LaserJock> ogra: so you'd like to get rid of the KDE apps?
#edubuntu 2006-03-31
* arkan0x is away: .....zzz...b
<[1] Robb> mornin
<LaserJock> hi
<iGotNoTime> Good day :)
<iGotNoTime> Does anyone here use SATA drives?
<iGotNoTime> I am having issues on my laptop
<iGotNoTime> it is not kicking my fan on, and it is getting VERY hot
<iGotNoTime> nevermind getting too hot to talk now :P Be back soon enough :)
<Yagisan> iGotNoTime: what about SATA ?
<Yagisan> too slow
<[1] Robb> out of curiosity does anyone know of a way to make edubuntu "live"?
<KaoticEvil> hey everyone :)
<KaoticEvil> anyone installed edubuntu on their kid's computers?
<Burgundavia> KaoticEvil: yes, I know of at least one person that has
<Pygi> spacey: ping?
<spacey> pong
<spacey> Pygi: :)
<Pygi> spacey: perhaps we should make people "sign up" for the meeting?
<spacey> mwah
<spacey> we shoudl just ping some people who might be interested
<spacey> its not needed to get a really big group
<spacey> because then it will become slow
<Pygi> just a few people who are willing to work, yes, I know
<spacey> janew will be there
<spacey> i hope ogra as well
<spacey> me :P
<Pygi> o joy, that's three people ;)
<spacey> maybe my colleague
<spacey> :P
<Burgundavia> meeting?
<Pygi> Burgundavia: yup, about the "How to cook Edubuntu"
<Burgundavia> ah
<spacey> Burgundavia: you can join in?
<spacey> your a real doccie
<spacey> uh
<Pygi> do not insult the book Burgundavia ;)
* Pygi won't allow it ^_^
<spacey> the book?
<Pygi> spacey: well, the "How to cook Edubuntu" thingy ^_^
<spacey> ah
<spacey> :>
<Pygi> bah ;)
<Burgundavia> spacey: it is 2am here. I am tired and somewhat drunk. :)
<Burgundavia> I think I am going to sleep
<Pygi> night burgundavia
<Pygi> spacey: does ogra want to ship it as package or?
<spacey> i think that was his intention
<spacey> but not sure
<spacey> i'll bring it up during the meeting
<Pygi> hm, k, we'll see on the meeting
<spacey> if so we should have to book finished evenearlier
<spacey> :P
<Pygi> yes, like 1 month before dapper ;)
<Pygi> and it would really be a joy if only me and you will be writing ;)
* Pygi hopes that will not be the case
<spacey> yeah
<spacey> joy as in long nights :)
<spacey> hmm
<spacey> long nights can be interperated in different ways :P
<spacey> anyway the crappy one :P
<drbreen> hallo
<highvoltage> hi
<Pygi> spacey, around?
<spacey> yes'
<spacey> whats up Pygi
<Pygi> I'm interested if perhaps we could postpone the meeting ...
<Pygi> for let's say 16:00 UTC?
<spacey> Pygi: its fine with me
<spacey> but
<spacey> check janew about that
<Pygi> bah, she's never here :-/
<spacey> mail :)
<spacey> and its weekend
<spacey> give her a break :P
<Pygi> JaneW:  ping ^_^
<spacey> its sunday :P
<Pygi> bah, yes I know ^_^
<spacey> not everyone is crazy enough to work in the weekend (like us ;))
<Pygi> lol ^_^
* ogra wonders whats crazy about that
<ogra> ;)
<Pygi> o  ogra, hello ;)
<ogra> hey
<Pygi> now to bug you about the book thingy ;)
<Pygi> do you want to ship the "How to cook Edubuntu" as a package?
<spacey> ogra: you will attend the edubuntu cookbook meeting?
<ogra> yes to both
<Pygi> spacey: s/edubuntu cookbook/how to cook edubuntu
<Pygi> ogra: k, just to know...we need to finish book earlier then
<ogra> not sure about a separate package, but it should be in edubuntu-docs
<spacey> Pygi: we'll see where it ends up
<ogra> (either as a depending package or included)
<spacey> Pygi: we can replace the current one
<spacey> later on
<highvoltage> hi everyone, when is the edubuntu cookbook meeting?
<spacey> highvoltage: thursday
<Pygi> highvoltage: currently, thursday, 12:00 UTC
<Pygi> but that might change ;)
<spacey> Pygi can only attend if we postpone it a bit
<ogra> i'm fine with that ...
<Pygi> ogra: does 16:00 UTC suit you?
<ogra> best is mail the listi think 
<ogra> sure, suits me
<ogra> s7is/is to/
<Pygi> ogra: k, great, I'll talk to Jane ;)
<spacey> janew should be there
<spacey> highvoltage: will you attend?
<Pygi> k, I just bothered Jane with a mail ^_^
<Pygi> k, spacey, ogra, talk to you later ;)
<ogra> ciao
<drbreen> hello again
<drbreen> i have a problem: one ltsp client (with d-link dfe-530tx rev-c1) starts with the fitting bootfloppy but it hangs and says
<drbreen> "can't open /tmp/net-eth0.conf"
<drbreen> and "kernal panic not syncing:attempted to kill init"
<drbreen> other clients (with different nw cards) get through
<highvoltage> spacey: yes (sorry, been in and out)
<spacey> highvoltage: at both times?
<highvoltage> both times?
<spacey> highvoltage: 12utc or 16utc
<spacey> pygi suggested to have it at 16utc so he could attend
<flint> ogra, ping
<highvoltage> hi flint, how are you doing?
<flint> highvoltage, Johnathan, I am very happy, I just tested this silly gin script on a real honest to god edubuntu terminal and it worked very well.  The gin script is something I "gin"ed up for elkners bilingual classes over at the Arlandria TWSC.
<flint> highvoltage, jonathan, I am so exited i spelled your name wrong sorry! :^(
<flint> highvoltage, I actually thought the silly thing would be easy, it turned into 433 lines of bash... https://wiki.edubuntu.org/gin
<highvoltage> hehe! completely inderstandable
* highvoltage looks at wiki page
<flint> highvoltage, jonathan, note that you can download the script from docbox.  docbox.flint.com is available as a bzr pull site eh?
<highvoltage> wow, that's cool!
<highvoltage> ok. i haven't used bzr to download stuff before though, but i'll give it a shot!
<flint> highvoltage, jonathan, this is high praise, thank you!  The important thing is not that it is pretty, it is that it works.  now I gotta get that Grawert guy to look it over and tell me how to make it better... 
<highvoltage> yeah.
<highvoltage> i remember one of the big criticisms for gnome from the skolelinux guys...
<highvoltage> is that you can't switch languages as good as in KDE
<highvoltage> ogra would probably take care of the pretty stuff by putting it into one of the edubuntu tools (not sure which would be the right one)
<flint> highvoltage, keep in mind, this is merely a brassboard shell script, this needs to be prettyfied into python and given a gui.
<highvoltage> flint: ok.
<flint> highvoltage, eh the next project is going to be called rump...
<flint> Rump Manual Page
<flint> Realtime 
<flint> Unix 
<flint> Mounting 
<flint> Program
<flint> I am annoyed that you cannot take mtab and magically convert it into fstab.  rump will do this sometime in the future...
<flint> highvoltage, what do you think?
<flint> highvoltage, my great nightmare is re-developing something that already exists...
<highvoltage> flint: i think that the front-end won't be too difficult
<highvoltage> flint: since it can tie in with existing control-panel-like software that ogra is working on
<flint> highvoltage, that jonathan is why i really wanted to keep it simple, so that it would be included in a more sophisticated tool, say as a call if necessary... but as a working document basicall in the tradition of rainforestpuppy....
<highvoltage> :)
<flint> sksk
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
#edubuntu 2006-04-01
<MornHyland> Hello
<MornHyland> I am curious, if I already ubuntu installed is it is easy to add repositories for edubuntu and get just add the educational software?
<Burgundavia> MornHyland: yes
<bimberi> hi MornHyland, edubuntu uses the same repositories, to get the additional packages install the edubuntu-desktop metapackage
<MornHyland> bimberi: cool, so I don't need to add a new repository
<MornHyland> that makes it easy
<MornHyland> I want to show the people in the math dept the great tools
<MornHyland> My congrats goes out to the developers, it is a great distribution
<MornHyland> I'm a convert from a long time with Mandrake, and others before that
<bimberi> MornHyland: yes, i was a bit of a distro-hopper myself before ubuntu came along :)
<Burgundavia> MornHyland: ubuntu, kubuntu, xubuntu and edubuntu share the same repos
<MornHyland> Burgudavia: yeah, that is great actually
<MornHyland> bimberi: I have been a linux user for too long
<bimberi> MornHyland: too long?  never :)
<MornHyland> bimberi: since 1993
<MornHyland> before there really were distros
<MornHyland> I heard about it over fidonet
<bimberi> MornHyland: wow, well good to hear that *ubuntu is keeping the fire burning for you
<MornHyland> I was becoming frustrated with Mandrake
<MornHyland> and ubuntu has given me a new lease
<MornHyland> Something I would really like to see is better notetaking/journaling software for class notes on a tablet pc
<MornHyland> as a student
<Burgundavia> there are a few, not packaged
<Burgundavia> xournal and gournal
<MornHyland> I almost had the wacom tablet working for a moment before a kernel upgrade broke it
<MornHyland> Maybe this summer when I am not so bogged down with classes I will work on something
<gboutwell> I'm looking for a home distro to install for some fun education programs for my 2 boys - 4 yrs (preschool) and 8 yrs (2nd grade but doing really well in school)
<HedgeMage> gboutwell: my son likes edubuntu :)  He's a bit younger, though (3)
<gboutwell> :)
<bimberi> gboutwell: as do my 2 sons (8 and 6)  -  although it's hard to get them out of the Games menu and into the more Educational packages :)
<gboutwell> :)
<gboutwell> Yeah well I have that problem now with Windows... them playing games instead of doing educational stuff. :)
<bimberi> of course you and i were never like that when we were that age :P
<gboutwell> I wasn't ever good at computer games really.  Only game I ever got close to winning was Carmen San Diego... Mostly cause it was just looking up in the reference
<gboutwell> So I moved on and tried computer programming... been enjoying that ever since!
<bimberi> :)
<gboutwell> Of course I didn't get into computers till I was quite a bit older than my oldest
<bimberi> gboutwell: oh yes, but "playing games instead of doing educational stuff" has wider applicability than just computers :)
<gboutwell> True, True
<gboutwell> It'll be interesting to see if they take aliking to Linux or just keep going back to Windows
<gboutwell> Is there a list of packages included in edubuntu or comparisons with like Debian-Jr or Debian-Edu?
<bimberi> gboutwell: there is this (although not strictly a list) - http://www.edubuntu.org/tour.html
<gboutwell> Yeah.. I looked at that.
<gboutwell> It's pretty good.  I especially liked the GCompris section
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<root> it seems I've managed to get here...is anything exciting going on at the moment?
<root> ooops be back in sec...
<root> exit
<jeff_> back...
<jeff_> unimatrix9 do you mean for configuration?
<RasCaL> I am having big problems with the install :(
<RasCaL> can anyone help?
<RasCaL> I downloaded the 386 install ISO via torrent
<RasCaL> burned the ISO and installed
<RasCaL> 50% through the install it ejects the disc and reboots...
<Burgundavia> I would check the md5sum on the iso and then reburn
<RasCaL> starts installing the packages and then says some libraries are no good
<RasCaL> Burgundavia I am done with the disc though?
<RasCaL> you are saying the disc could be bad?
<Burgundavia> yes
<RasCaL> the kernal is fine it is running now
<Burgundavia> or your cdrom
<RasCaL> no GUI
<RasCaL> oops kernel
<RasCaL> no gnome
<RasCaL> I ran apt-get update
<RasCaL> the apt-get upgrade
<RasCaL> then*
<RasCaL> but still no gnome
<Burgundavia> what sort of install did you do?
<RasCaL> I pressed enter
<RasCaL> standard?
<Burgundavia> hmm
<RasCaL> it is active I mean the update and upgrade both got new packages and updated the database
<RasCaL> is there any way to fix this without being forced to download from your servers?
<RasCaL> I mean since it is half running
<RasCaL> I won't be getting it with bit-torrent next time LOL
<Burgundavia> yes
<Burgundavia> bittorrent is not the issue
<RasCaL> I only burned it @ 4x
<RasCaL> that is my lowest setting
<RasCaL> same drive that I burned my other 2 Edubuntu ISO's
<RasCaL> they worked flawlessly
<RasCaL> but they have been 'stolen' by my brothers :(
<RasCaL> is the fix remote somehow using apt-get by chance?
<RasCaL> I ask because I know that is one thing that works :)
<Burgundavia> it is probably pretty easy to fix your system, but sadly I am really busy right now :(
<RasCaL> understand :)
<RasCaL> anyone else maybe have a guess?
<Burgundavia> bimberi: ^
<highvoltage> RasCaL: does the md5sum of your burned CD, cd image, and md5sum on the website match?
<bimberi> huh, what was the question?
<highvoltage> bimberi: edubuntu cd doesn't work
<highvoltage> RasCaL: what does it do wrong again when you boot from it?
<bimberi> ah, ubotu has a factoid pointing to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/VerifyIsoHowto
<bimberi> (which probably says what highvoltage said :) )
<jfc> Hi
<spacey> janeW: ping
<janeW> spacey: pong
<spacey> did you read pygi's mail?
<spacey> i wanted to postpone the meeting a little
<spacey> Mario
<spacey> uh
<spacey> he wanted
<spacey> but its ok with me personally
<spacey> :P
<janeW> spacey: did he send to me?
<janeW> or the mailing list?
<spacey> he said he mailed you
<spacey> personal
<janeW> I am still working through personal mail...
<spacey> Mario Danic 
<spacey> :)
<spacey> ok
<janeW> but I don;t see anything from him...
* janeW checks again...
<spacey> anyway he requested if the meeting could be postponed to 16:00 UTC
<janeW> oops, it goot deleted in my spam-swoop. His mail looks JUST like spam!
* janeW reads it
<spacey> :D
<JaneW> hrm, 18:00 is really not a good time for me
<JaneW> esp after starting that day with a 4am meeting
<spacey> :P
<JaneW> spacey: is he planning on helping you?
<spacey> yup
<JaneW> great
<spacey> he already helped me prepare for the meeting
<JaneW> look I am happy that you can get it on track
<JaneW> I think you are more realistic and organised about it
<JaneW> my goal is to make sure we get *something* finished
<JaneW> which will be useful
<highvoltage> good morning
<spacey> we put up some drafts at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HowToCookEdubuntu
<JaneW> and my opinion is it should be aimed at users, or low-level tech ppl trying to set up a lab
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<spacey> JaneW: mine too :)
<JaneW> advanced users know how to find info and help
<JaneW> spacey: yay, I am glad we agree
<JaneW> I alsp agree about keeping it generic and putting specifics in the back
<highvoltage> JaneW: wasn't that decided at the last meeting? or is it up for discusion once again? *sigh*
<spacey> and for advanced topics you would only start duplicating ubuntu docs anyway
<JaneW> highvoltage: es I am pretty sure it;s agreed
<JaneW> spacey: so I don;t think I am crucial to the meeting
<spacey> JaneW: ok
<JaneW> unless you need me to volunteer for stuff? ;)
<JaneW> spacey: I'd like to read the transcript after though
<spacey> JaneW: well your welcome if you hav etime :)
<highvoltage> cookbook cookies :)
<JaneW> spacey: I think the cook book need your no-nonsense, take-charge approach
<JaneW> it's what's been lacking
* JaneW hands spacey 'TheWhip'(TM)
<spacey> :D
<highvoltage> :)
<spacey> JaneW: can you reply on the agenda and give some points we should know. For example the deadline stuff
<JaneW> spacey: sure
<spacey> then i'll postphone the meeting to 16:00 UTC
<spacey> i'll sent it to list and fridge-devel
<spacey> send
<spacey> highvoltage: you can make 1600UTC btw? :) 
<spacey> would be cool
<highvoltage> spacey: yes
<jfc> Excuse me, I've a problem, I think it's a bug : ltsp-server on a amd64 server generate /opt/ltsp/amd64 instead of /i386
<highvoltage> spacey: oosh, no
<highvoltage> that's thursday, right?
<highvoltage> i have a guitar lesson thursday evening.
<RasCaL> sorry I was at the other computer
<RasCaL> I just got done burning the iso I downloaded from the website
<RasCaL> will let you all know soon
<RasCaL> been a big mess :(
<highvoltage> jfc: that's normal, the chroot that gets generates by default is the same as the one you installed, there is a way around it, i suggest you hang around a bit, ogra knows how to do that
<spacey> highvoltage: ok
<highvoltage> spacey: i should actually be back home just 15 min after the meeting starts, so i'll be there for the latter part
<spacey> highvoltage: ok thats nice :)
<JaneW> spacey: your agenda looks good
<JaneW> spacey: you may want to add something about assigning roles and responsibilities
<JaneW> who is doing what etc
<spacey> JaneW: ok, good point
<JaneW> spacey: also are we going to worry about translations (yet), or just focus on getting it done and then look at stuff like that?
<spacey> JaneW: translations would be nice but I don't see how that could be ready for dapper 
<spacey> but its definitely a document which should be translated
<JaneW> spacey: ok let's get eng finished first and tackle translations as phase 2
<spacey> yup
<spacey> i think it should have high quality
<ogra> jfc, thats not a bug ... remove it (sudo rm -rf /opt/ltsp/amd64) and create a i386 chroot ... (sudo ltsp-build-client --arch i386)
<ogra> jfc, i'd let it build a i386 chroot if i could ;) 
<jfc> thank's a lot
<ogra> sadly there is no space for two architectures on the CD 
<ogra> so i have only amd64 packages available...
<jfc> but in the synaptic package list i don't see any linux-image 386 ?
<spacey> JaneW: what kind of roles and stuff do you recommend for the cookbook? something like, I use the whip to make sure everyone is making progress and is in time, X checks quality control, stuff like that?
<JaneW> spacey: well either assign each chapter to a diff person
<ogra> jfc, the --arch i386 will tell ltsp-build-client to only use i386 packages, it generates its own sources.list then
<JaneW> spacey: or have one writer and one reviewer
<JaneW> or a writer, editor and acceptor etc
<spacey> ok, i'll think about that
<JaneW> some how spread the load, and make sure if responsibility is assigned that that person has an understanding of what is expected of them
<JaneW> and then regularly check that they are delievering on that
<spacey> k:)
* highvoltage pests toxictoads a bit more for wallpaper
<iceman> hi all...
<iceman> am running kubuntu "hoary" and would like to try a dist-upgrade to edubuntu, is it possible and how?
<ogra> you are aware that edubuntu uses gnome as desktop ?
<iceman> yup, dont mind that...
<ogra> if you only want the desktop parts, upgrade your system to breezy and install edubuntu-desktop 
<ogra> the server part needs additional setup if you do it this way
<ogra> (and if you even want ltsp or schooltool on your machine)
<iGotNoTime> Morning all :)
<Pygi> JaneW: around? ^_^
<JaneW> Pygi: hi, yes
<Pygi> JaneW: you got my mail?
<Pygi> JaneW: The one about meeting/Edubuntu cookbook?
<JaneW> Pygi: yes, spacey has changed the time and posted a new message to the mailing list.
<Pygi> yup, saw it ;) great then...
<ogra> make sure the fridge is updated 
<JaneW> ogra: ah good point
<ogra> else i'll miss it ;) my evolution updates its calendar dynamically from there ;)
<Pygi> ogra: hehe ;)
<JaneW> ogra: message sent
<Pygi> JaneW: any idea on how many people are interested in the cookbook?
<ogra> every edubuntu user ? 
<Pygi> ogra: ok, wrong question ;) in contributing to cookbook ;)
<ogra> oh, a handfull have spoken up already iirc
<Pygi> ah,k
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<cbx33> hi all
<ogra> hi
<LaserJock> hi
<cbx33> i work i na school and we just started a LUG....we going to do a podcast and are looking to interview someone at edubuntu.....:p
<cbx33> brb
<iGotNoTime> Does anyone here use SATA?
<iGotNoTime> cbx33, you can interview me, but I warn you I am new here :P
<Yagisan> iGotNoTime: yes
<iGotNoTime> Yagisan, can you really, honestlynotice a difference in speed?
<iGotNoTime> I kinda want to put my nw motherboards ports to us :)
<Yagisan> iGotNoTime: none whatsoever. The disk platters are still the slowest part of the drive.
<iGotNoTime> ok :)
<iGotNoTime> I appreciate the honesty!
<Yagisan> iGotNoTime: I have to SATA and 1 PATA drive (200GB Segate 7200RMP 8M) in a RAID 5
<Yagisan> s/to/2
<Yagisan> there was no price difference, ans no SATA optical drives at the time
<Yagisan> s/ans/and
<Yagisan> iGotNoTime: the one thing I like is the thiner cables. Good for airflow
<iGotNoTime> It actually looks like SATA may soon be cheaper
<iGotNoTime> yes true :)
<Yagisan> moy box could fry an egg some days
<iGotNoTime> they have been cheaper, just do't know if it is only temporary for promoting them
<Yagisan> agh - I can't type at 5am
<iGotNoTime> my drives have serious heat problems, I just got a couple new fans
<iGotNoTime> the case is fine, but the drives do not have enough flow and burn to the touch a few days ago
<Yagisan> yep. 55C for my SATA (but they are in adjacent 5/25 bays) vs 40 for the PATA. 3 fan 5/25 cooler in front of the SATA
<iGotNoTime> if the new fans don't help I may actually be forced to use water (which I normally would say is a waste of money).
<Yagisan> the air out the back of the case is very hot and dry
<iGotNoTime> nice layout I may try something like that
<Yagisan> don't forget to clean the fans and fileters every 3-6 months
<iGotNoTime> wait your SATA runs more hot?!
<Yagisan> they are rather close to each other
<Yagisan> about a 1cm gap
<iGotNoTime> ahhh, like mine :(
<Yagisan> my full tower case is, well full
<iGotNoTime> you sure can cook eggs on that! I know :(
<iGotNoTime> I grabbed them :(
<iGotNoTime> I always thought wate was like a gimmick, but I realize it may be the only option
<iGotNoTime> water*
<Yagisan> I've decided to move  my box to a place with more airflow
<Yagisan> and less direct sunlight
<iGotNoTime> that's a good idea too. I have been pretty good about cleaning it out, but it seems to just not be enough lately
<iGotNoTime> I have 1 optical and 7 HDD's. 4 of them are almost touching :(
<Yagisan> I have 3 optical, 3 hdd
<iGotNoTime> in fact they might even be touching
<iGotNoTime> LOL
<Yagisan> 1 optical seems to be dying from the heat, and it is the furthest from the heat!
<Yagisan> it was also the newest.
<iGotNoTime> works like that! Anything to throw you off :P
<Yagisan> the optical next to the egg cookers, I mean the SATA drives burns great
<iGotNoTime> You use SATA on opticals??
<Yagisan> no
<iGotNoTime> very cool
<iGotNoTime> ohhh 
<iGotNoTime>  :D
<Yagisan> ahh the joys of rsync not working
<Yagisan> spacey: you here ?
<spacey> ola
<Yagisan> spacey: thanks
<spacey> for what
<Yagisan> spacey: I think I stuffed my rsync stuff up
<spacey> ok :P
<Yagisan> spacey: turning up before I go to bed!
<spacey> http://users.lichtsnel.nl/~yagisan/
<spacey> still empty :p
<spacey> just finished dinner
<Yagisan> spacey: I copied a working script to the server, but it doesn't seem to work when I run it from users.lichtsnel.nl
<Yagisan> spacey: any idea what I've done wrong ?
<Yagisan> spacey: script is eselupdate.sh in my ~
<spacey> i think i know why
<Yagisan> spacey: and port 873 is open ..
<spacey> because it doesn't allow connections to the outside
<Yagisan> oh
<Yagisan> spacey: how should I rsync over then ?
<spacey> over ssh
<Yagisan> spacey: :( that didn't work either, so I closed the port.
<spacey> you can simply copy it from your server to mine over ssh with rsync
<spacey> only thing you cannot do is connect to the outside from my box
<spacey> only port 80 is open from inside to outside
<spacey> makes sense?:)
<spacey> Yagisan: Seveas is quite succesful at it: http://users.lichtsnel.nl/~seveas
<Yagisan> spacey: thanks. I've only played with rsync for a few hours now
<highvoltage> goodnight, #edununtu!
<Yagisan> spacey: I think I got it working now
<Yagisan> night all
<cbx33> who heads up development of edubuntu
<Bluekuja> jonathan
<Bluekuja> do u need something
<cbx33> Bluekuja, do you have an email address?
<Bluekuja> to know?
<Bluekuja> yeah of course
<cbx33> well, I work at a school and we just started our very own LUG
<Bluekuja> oo very good
<cbx33> we're hoping to start a PODCast for beginners in linux
<Bluekuja> im working with jon
<cbx33> and I thought might be nice to interview someone over at edubuntu
<Bluekuja> nice
<cbx33> Bluekuja, well you might make a good choice then
<cbx33> what d'ya thik
<Bluekuja> yeah,thats a nice idea
<Ian_> hi all
<cbx33> hey I
<flint>  /msg NickServ IDENTIFY
#edubuntu 2006-04-02
<bob_> anyone got any idea why gnome wont load on the server computer? all the clients work fine...
<Sergi0> what did u try to start it up?
<bob_> just startx
<bob_> the server stopped booting into gnome a while ago anyway, its a bit odd
<bob_> it always usde to work...
<Sergi0> bob_: what error u get 
<bob_> nothing, it just freezes with a flashing cursor in the topleft
<Sergi0> hmm
<bob_> im not sure why it doesnt boot into GDM any more either
<Sergi0> try restarting gdm, wat happens then
<bob_> it wont load gdm i mean
<bob_> it doesnt get that far
<Sergi0> check /var/log/Xlo--
<bob_> the latest one?
<Sergi0> hmm probaly Xlog0.log
<bob_> k
<bob_> am i looking for anything in particular?
<bob_> looks alright really...
<bob_> no obvious errors
<Sergi0> hmm
<Sergi0> im not sure where the probem could occure
<bob_> it is pretty odd...
<Sergi0> try this for testing X:
<Sergi0> type 'X :1.0' or just 'X', kill the X with crtl-alt-backspace, so u can test the basic X, without any other software running on it
<Sergi0> any luck?
<bob_> fatal server error: unrecognised option 1:0
<bob_> oh i missed a colon, sorry
<Sergi0> did't u forget the :   X :1.0 :)
<Sergi0> also try 'X'
<bob_> nope, same proble with both
<bob_> just a black screen with a cursor
<Sergi0> thats weird
<bob_> yeah youd think itd whine about something...
<Sergi0> nah, probaly not
<bob_> ok :p it normally quits with some weird error code
<Sergi0> there is never a weird error code
<Sergi0> !
<bob_> i mean it sometimes says "such and such is not supported?" or something
<Sergi0> :) its ok
<Sergi0> whats ur graphic card
<bob_> not sure
<bob_> ang on
<bob_> ati 3d rage 2+
<bob_> i mean its worked before...
<bob_> some random dapper update i think messed it up
<Sergi0> did u upgrade to another kernel?
<bob_> possibly, yeah
<Sergi0> with nvidia for example u need to configure ur graphic driver for that kernel
<Sergi0> change ur xorg.conf file
<Sergi0> or reboot with the old kernel, if u still got it
<bob_> how do i do either of those things?
<Sergi0> how did u setup ur ati drivers before?
<bob_> hmm i dont think i did. i mean it was just a disk install i might have dpkg-reconfigured xserver-xorg at some point but
<bob_> its probabyl a kernel thing
<Sergi0> u could reconfi ut xserver-xorg package again, but probaly u will have bad graphics, but for server its ok i guess
<bob_> i did it earlier
<bob_> doesnt wrk
<bob_> :(
<Sergi0> it should
<bob_> ypu just does the same thing
<Sergi0> vim /etc/X11/xorg.conf  under "device" check the "Driver" string, change it to something like this "Driver" "vesa"
<Sergi0> is the monitor changed btw? could be a problem too
<Sergi0> but i have to go, good luck
<bob_> nope
<bob_> ok, thanks :)
<bob_> have a good day
<bimberi> bob_: if the vesa driver doesn't work, try deleting ~/.Xauthority and ~/.ICEauthority (issues with those files can hause X hangs)
<bimberi> *cause
<bob_> hey bimberi, doesnt work :(
<bob_> what is vesa? i put it back to ATI
<bob_> argh, ive been on the internet too long, my brain is leaking, try again tomorrow...
<Sergi0> good luck bob_
<thedarkener> Hey all
<Sergi0> hello
<thedarkener> What do you guys think about hosting a 10-client LAN with Edubuntu on a dual PIII 500MHz (1GHz total), 2GB RAM? Will it be comfortable?
<thedarkener> Regular IDE hard disk
<thedarkener> 1GB LAN for server, 100MBit on workstations
<Sergi0> i didnt try edubuntu for network config, but i think it should be no problem, looks all fine
<thedarkener> awesome
<thedarkener> =)
<thedarkener> I will, hopefully by next weekend, start working on my first edubuntu thin client site =)
<Sergi0> just make sure for ur processor u use the correct kernel
<thedarkener> that'll be on the cd boot commandline to choose the kernel?
<Sergi0> nice, im just trying the stuff out. maybe a school project orso, 
<Sergi0> nah, just pick one after the install, then when its real important
<Sergi0> om out, good luck
<thedarkener> ok thanks Sergi0 
<Sergi0> ok
<thedarkener> Anyone else? How does this hardware look for all 10 clients logged in with Firefox, OO?
<iGotNoTime> HedgeMage are you in by chance? I am having some problems and as a last resort came in to ask for help after like 3 hours. :(
<iGotNoTime> I just got a new motherboard so I thought a reinstall would be best....
<iGotNoTime> I installed and some packages couldn't be loaded during install for some odd reason...
<iGotNoTime> luckily though I do have gnome and a GUI
<iGotNoTime> however Python libraries are messed up
<iGotNoTime> Synaptic will not work
<iGotNoTime> niether will the Gnome file browser so I can't easily navigate to find files
<iGotNoTime> I had a warning about E:/ being broken
<HedgeMage> iGotNoTime: I am now
<iGotNoTime> but the dpkg --confgure blah blah wouldn't work
<HedgeMage> what's up?
* HedgeMage reads the backlog
<iGotNoTime> no problem getting a drink while you ponder :)
<HedgeMage> hmm that is really odd
<iGotNoTime> the worst thing is the synaptic
<iGotNoTime> I had to connect to IRC with Gaim because I can't even install an IRC client
<iGotNoTime> I don't even have an FTP client to upload you the copied lines of errors LOL
<HedgeMage> :(
<iGotNoTime> major thing though seems to say broken packages
<iGotNoTime> I can't find any sort of auto update option
<HedgeMage> nothing borked until the hardware change?
<iGotNoTime> yes but was a big hardware change, so I formatted and started fresh
<iGotNoTime> I am happy that the GUI is on or I would really be stuck
<iGotNoTime> E: dpkg was interrupted, you must manually run 'dpkg --configure -a' to correct the problem.
<iGotNoTime> that is a very popular one with me today
<iGotNoTime> but when I try to do that I get this:
<iGotNoTime> dpkg: ../../src/packages.c:191: process_queue: Assertion `dependtry <= 4' failed.
<iGotNoTime> Aborted
<iGotNoTime> I assume if that dpkg --configure would work everything would be fixed on it's own
<iGotNoTime> but can't do it due to the above error
<iGotNoTime> any ideas? anyone?
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<iGotNoTime> I'll just try getting help later on tonight :)
<iGotNoTime> I am gonna reboot
<JaneW> spacey: ping
<JaneW> oops he's not even here, nm
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<highvoltage> ogra: i love the new edubuntu splash screen!
<ogra> thanks, i personally find it a bit dark ...
<ogra> note that we might get a different one from the art studio ... might not be final
<highvoltage> well, it splashed by very quickly, so i didn't notice it being to dark.
<ogra> in case anyone is intrested in testing, the next CD build should be ready for flight 6 testing ...
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<bob_> hey, my edubuntu server is playing up, X wont load. how can i backtrack a kernel?
<highvoltage> bob_: do you have any reason to believe that it's a kernel problem?
<bob_> hmm well im sure it stopped working after a dist-upgrade
<highvoltage> if you log in from a console, and type 'startx', what error message do you get?
<bob_> you dont get an error
<bob_> it just hangs with a black screen and a cursor in the top left
<highvoltage> it's possible that the dist-upgrade didn't complete
<bob_> yeah? ooh
<highvoltage> hmmm :/
<bob_> the clients work fine, its weird...
<highvoltage> i haven't seen that before
<highvoltage> the clients have their own chroot
<bob_> oh yeah
<bob_> any ideas then? how can i fix a broken dist-upgrade?
<highvoltage> log in on one of the thin clients, it at least gives you access to your system
<highvoltage> log in as your admin user from one of the clients, 
<highvoltage> and try sudo apt-get dist-upgrade again
<bob_> yeah theres people on them :) but ill try and kick someone off
<highvoltage> see what it says
<highvoltage> heh :)
<bob_> ill just do it form a terminal?
<bob_> it wants to install 'libbeagle1' and upgrade nautlus
<bob_> shall i do it?
<highvoltage> i suggest you try that
<ogra> hmm, what has libbeagle to do there  ?
<bob_> seems to have run ok, no errors or anything
<bob_> i dont know, what is it?
<ogra> its a library for beagle ...
<ogra> (beagle is a desktop search engine)
<bob_> oh hang on, ive got one x error: "Key <META> added to map for multiple modifiers. Using Mod4 ignoring Mod 1"
<bob_> ahh ok
<highvoltage> ogra: wow, i would've never guesed :P
<ogra> heh
<bob_> maybe someone else put it on?
<highvoltage> i just tried apt-cache show libbeagle, doesn't find such a package on my system.
<ogra> its a universe package
<ogra> apt-cache show libbeagle0
<ogra> ;)
<highvoltage> W: Unable to locate package libbeagle0
<ogra> ogra@edubuntu:/mnt/devel/packages/ttf-ubuntu-title-0.1$ apt-cache show libbeagle0
<ogra> Package: libbeagle0
<ogra> Priority: optional
<ogra> Section: universe/gnome
<ogra> ...
<highvoltage> oh, hold on, that's strange, my universe is disabled in sources.list.
* highvoltage wonders how that happened
<bob_> shall i take it off?
<ogra> bob_, is that breezy or dapper  
<ogra> ?
<bob_> dapper
<ogra> ah, k
<bob_> sorry should have been more specific
<ogra> you have to live with breakage from time to time then :) especially with universe packages
<ogra> time will fix it :)
<bob_> do you think its that thats breaking it then?
<ogra> err ...
<ogra> moment 
<bob_> haha dont worry i have faith in that :p id just be nice to know whats wrong so i can report it or something...
<ogra> it wants to install libbeagle*1* ???
<bob_> incidentally, it stopped logging into GDM by defualt a little while ago
<ogra> sure that wasnt libbeagle0 ?
<bob_> if thats related...
<bob_> libbeagle0 is there
<ogra> <bob_> it wants to install 'libbeagle1' and upgrade nautlus
<ogra> are you sure about the name ? 
<ogra> then its something from a third party repository ...
<ogra> and nothing we can help with ...
<bob_> ummm
<bob_> doh ive done it in a terminal so i cant double check, it was probably right...
<bob_> i mean, do you think its that thats breaking it? i dont see how its related to X not working...
<ogra> dpkg -l |grep libbeagle 
<highvoltage> bob_: cat /etc/apt/sources.list
<highvoltage> bob_: check for something that doesn't contain 'ubuntu.com' in the URI
<highvoltage> or what ogra said :)
<ogra> bob_, if you have a broken package that holds back other essential packages from being upgraded, that not unusual
<ogra> *thats
<bob_> ok only libbeagle0 is there
<ogra> good
<ogra> so did you do apt-get upgrade or apt-get dist-upgrade ? 
<bob_> both
<ogra> why both ? 
<bob_> highvoltage, theres a few in there, shall i comment them all out? i think its been automatix-ed
<bob_> well i dist-upgraded to see if it would fix the x problem, highvoltage suggested it :p
<ogra> dist-upgrade already does what upgrade does, but does the evil stuff as well ...
<bob_> oh i mean
<bob_> ive not done it right now, but ive run it today, like
<ogra> upgrade == only install upgradeable packages, dont change anything else ...
<ogra> dist-upgrade == remove packages if needed, chane essential bits etc
<ogra> *change
<bob_> yeah i gettit :) i just mean ive run them both today
<ogra> ok, if you run startx from a console, does gnome start ?
<bob_> nope
<ogra> whats the error then ? 
<bob_> just get a black screen with a frozen cursor
<ogra> startx should give very precise errors
<bob_> as in, text cursor not X cursor
<bob_> it doesnt tell you anything apart from...
<ogra> either on the commandline or in the logfiles
<bob_> "key <META> added to map for multiple modifiers
<bob_> using mod 4, inoring mod 1"
<bob_> thats the only error, and X doesnt quit out or anything, it just hangs
<LaserJock> ogra: do you know much about squeak?
<ogra> thats niot your issue
<ogra> LaserJock, only that i missed to package the squeak-image package for us
<highvoltage> bob_: you've used automatix?
<LaserJock> ogra: ah ok, I was talking quite a bit with some squeak developers about the image issue
<bob_> when we were on breezy, yeah
<ogra> (but adding the initimage.sh script to squeak-sources should solve it as well)
<ogra> bob_, ouch
<ogra> have fun reinstalling then
<bob_> bit of a mess?
<bob_> hahaha
<bob_> ive got a number of niggles, maybe a reinstall would sort them...
<ogra> automatix f****up isnt easily solvable
<highvoltage> bob_: automatix alters your ubuntu system, it's not a standard ubuntu system any more, so upgrades isn't expected to work
<ogra> use easyubuntu instead ... it wont break the system
<bob_> ahhhh ok
<bob_> ill bear it in mind. probably a good idea to avoid universe in general when using beta software, hey?
<ogra> universe is fine ...
<ogra> just expect breakage from time to time 
<bob_> hmm ok.
<bob_> but you reckon the X problem is coz of automatix?
<ogra> usually universe packages dont have any influence on the system stability itself ...
<highvoltage> bob_: main will, at some time, also give some breakage on development versions...
<ogra> might be ... i refuse to put time into automatix broken systems
<bob_> yeah thats cool, i wouldnt mention this if it hadnt been like it for a week or so
<bob_> fair enough :)
<highvoltage> bob_: but both main and universe are always much safer to use than automatix. automatix is strongly non-recommended.
<ogra> this guy caused enough trouble ... i wont put time into his crappy scripts 
<bob_> ok, cool. but easyubuntu gets the thumbs up?
<ogra> yep
<bob_> ace
<ogra> its developed in a safe manner using the right tools ...
<bob_> looks like its time to sort out that home drive and reinstall the system...
<ogra> automatix just blindly overwrites half of the worls
<ogra> *world
<LaserJock> ogra: were you going to work on squeak-image? I think I could make a source package soon if you like.
<bob_> shall i use a flight 5 iso?
<ogra> LaserJock, that'd be so cool !
<ogra> i'm preparing flight 6 and am particulary busy this week
<LaserJock> ogra: k
<bob_> is flight 5 the reccomended atm?
<LaserJock> well, I went over to #squeak and found out what I needed and there are some source packages floating out there that I can look at.
<highvoltage> bob_: i played around with flight5 quite a bit, worked fine fore me. ymmv.
<ogra> bob_, yesd
<ogra> but flight 6 is due this week :)
<bob_> cool :)
<bob_> dapper is lovely btw, evreything is working fineeee and lovely (apart from recentness)
<highvoltage> bob_: that doesn't count, it's automatix's fault :)
<highvoltage> ogra: you should blog something along the lines of 'top 5 reasons why you shouldn't use automatix' :)
<bob_> ill let you know if thats what it was when i get this harddrive sorted ;)
<ogra> highvoltage, ask Seveas to do that :)
<highvoltage> ogra: k :)
<Seveas> ogra, I don't blog in english
<highvoltage> Seveas: ^^^^^
<ogra> i have my private argument going on with arnieboy on the ubuntu-users ML already
<Seveas> so I'm not on planet Ubuntu
<ogra> and i dont want to extend it 
<ogra> Seveas, so start blogging in english then :)
* ogra *always* blogs in english ...
<highvoltage> tectonic, slashdot, and many other sites promote how wonderful automatix is, it's an epidemic
<ogra> at least the five entrys i made in my blg ;)
<Seveas> highvoltage, it's a virus
<ogra> *blog
<highvoltage> every single day i meet someone who used it and it breaked their system
<highvoltage> and there seems to be no ubuntu doc i can point them to too tell them it's bad
<highvoltage> Seveas: hehe, yeah.
<ogra> Seveas, note that i'll fight for closing down the forums gateway again ...
<ogra> we dont even have a chance to unsubscribe arnieboy at the moment
<Seveas> yes, please
<Seveas> the forums are full of crap
<highvoltage> forums are breeding grounds for trouble in general, which is why i'm so strongly apposed against a forum for edubuntu
<ogra> forums are fine as long as someone knowledgeable cares for them 
<Seveas> ogra, that's the problem with ubuntuforums.org - clueless people are leading it
<ogra> as soon as myths out of missing knowledge start to spread, you are lost
<Seveas> IRC generally is a similar trouble hole
<highvoltage> the thing is, knowledgable people don't use forums, so it tends to be just clueless (maybe a strong word) people who tend to reply
<Seveas> but #ubuntu is refreshingly different because there are knowledgeable people who feel at home there (not meaning myself)
<LaserJock> I started out on the forums because I was a Gentoo user and I was used to the Gentoo forums
<LaserJock> but I got much less "real" help on ubuntuforums
<LaserJock> and there was so much flaming and fighting
<LaserJock> so I turned to #ubuntu-motu
<LaserJock> and I'm glad I did
<ogra> we too :)
<LaserJock> thanks ;-)
<vandenoever> hello, i am here to promote http://www.vandenoever.info/software/cubetest/
<vandenoever> for edubuntu
<vandenoever> it's a great awardwinning game which teaches spatial insight
<ogra> vandenoever, is there a gtk version available ? 
<vandenoever> it's qt3 or qt4
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> i'm planning to get rid of KDE and friends in the next release if possible 
<ogra> it steals to much CD space 
<vandenoever> ogra: qt3 != kde
<vandenoever> qt3 < kde
<ogra> yep
<ogra> i know and i guess QT will stay, but i'm not sure yet ...
<vandenoever> cubetest is not big so it'll fit easily
<ogra> could you send your proposal to the mailing list to make more people aware of it
<vandenoever> it's also mature
<vandenoever> ok what's the address for that?
<ogra> its planned to revisit the app selection for the october release, so there are good chances for little helpful apps ;)
<ogra> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel
<vandenoever> thanks!
<ogra> :)
<ogra> thanks as well :)
<LaserJock> ogra: I'm trying to figure out what to name this squeak-image package
<LaserJock> ogra: the images of any version can be more or less used with any vm
<LaserJock> ogra: so we could have squeak-image3.7 squeak-image3.8 ,etc.
<ogra> do you really want different versions ? 
<ogra> i'd think we only want the basics and leave it to the user/admin to customize it 
<LaserJock> hmm, let me ask #squeak real quick if there is usefullness in having old images
<ogra> since we wont pre-customize the image anyway ...
<LaserJock> what I'm saying is you can use the image from almost any version with the vm from almost any version
<ogra> yep
<LaserJock> so should we provide more than one squeak-image package?
<ogra> will put more maintenance work on our sholders ...
<ogra> i'd go with the latest that works
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> ogra: k
<highvoltage> goodnight, #edubuntu!
<Seveas> ogra, did yo get my mail regarding \sh?
<ogra> Seveas, yep ... its on TODAYS TODO :)
<Seveas> ok
<ogra> (so i still have 3h :) )
<Bluekuja> hi ogra :)
<Bluekuja> jonathan gone?
<ogra> yep
<Bluekuja> awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
<Bluekuja> he gone early
<Bluekuja> today
<ogra> <highvoltage> goodnight, #edubuntu!
<ogra> * highvoltage has quit ("leaving")
<Bluekuja> aww , bad news
<ogra> that was 10 min ago
<Bluekuja> lol
<Bluekuja> too late
<ogra> yep
<Bluekuja> okie but what time is it in south africa?
<Bluekuja> he said goodnight
<Bluekuja> so there might be midnight or something like that
<ogra> its 9pm
<Bluekuja> o
<Bluekuja> its early
<Bluekuja> maybe hes going out with his girlfrend ehehhe
<ogra> heh
<Bluekuja> :)
<cbx33> Bluekuja, hiya
<jelkner> anyone here who could answer an edubuntu support question?
<jelkner> the client machine fails to boot
<jelkner>   /bin/sh: can't access tty; job control turned off
<jelkner> is the last line
<jelkner> mount: Mounting /root/dev on /dev/.static/dev failed: No such file or directory
<jelkner> seems to be the start of the trouble
<jelkner> ok, running  ltsp-update-sshkeys seemed to fix the problem.
<jelkner> i wish i understood this better
<jelkner> hopefully the new author of the edubuntu cookbook will be able to explain things like this
<jelkner> and perhaps it is fixed in dapper?
<jelkner> it seems to happen once every few weeks at the library lab
<jelkner> well, i gotta run...
<jelkner> see you at the meeting tomorrow morning...
<ogra> hmm, not that he'd sound bitter ...
<lns> Hey all
<lns> Does Edubuntu, by default, use SSH as a tunnel for encrypting terminal sessions?
<Burgwork> lns, yes
<ogra> hey Burgwork :)
<lns> Burgwork, thanks! Now what is the correct way of disabling this if I'm using a local LAN and don't need it?
<ogra> lns, you mean you dont need the ltsp functionallity at all ? 
<lns> ogra, no, I don't want ssh tunneling
<Burgwork> salut ogra
<ogra> lns, thats a bit tricky cause our ltsp is totally targeted to that architecture ...
<ogra> we dont use xdmcp at all 
<lns> hrm..
<lns> how about if i installed gdm/kdm? would that easily override ldm, or would it screw everything up?
<ogra> you will have to tweak the setup through your lts.conf file and install GDM or some other xdmcp capable login manager in the client environment
<ogra> ldm would still start ... 
<ogra> hmm, wait a sec ...
<lns> the reason why I want to disable ssh is because i want the sessions to be as quick as possible... unless any of you disagree that it would improve speed by simply using the x11 proto instead of going through ssh
<lns> i'm testing stuff out and things like tuxtyping is incredibly slow due to it's 3d rendering of stuff
<ogra> i guess it will work if you install gdm, its supposed to start at position 13 in rc2 
<ogra> ldm starts at 20
<lns> ok, great
<ogra> it wont improve speed 
<ogra> but test yourself ...
<lns> ok, thanks ogra 
<ogra> also try with NETWORK_COMPRESSION=true in lts.conf :)
<lns> now here's another thing, how do i customize ldm if i wanna keep it?
<ogra> the tunnel is uncompressed by default to support lower specced HW
<ogra> in breezy or dapper ? 
<lns> hrm
<lns> breezy
<ogra> no way ... 
<lns> oh.. :(
<lns> hehe
<ogra> you could try to use the dapper package at own risk
<ogra> its fullscreen themeable and looks like gdm
<lns> yeah that's a catch 22 because i need to demo on friday... ogra IYHO, do you think dapper is ok for a demo at this point?
<ogra> its only pygtk .... i know debian ported it back to sarge
<lns> i haven't tried it yet, but since it's gonna be out on the 20th i'm assuming it's *almost* done?
<ogra> lns, i just ran the flight-6 tests, we'll release a milestone iso this week
<ogra> it runs quite ok
<lns> :)
<lns> good news!!!
<ogra> and ltsp wont see any big changes anymore
<lns> awesome
<lns> i just downloaded flight-5 last night..guess i'll be redownloading ;)
<ogra> it wont be out on the 20th 
<lns> oh
<lns> ok well in any case
<ogra> dapper as a whole was postponed to june 1st
<lns> oh wow i didn't realise
<lns> will upgrading existing servers be pretty seamless?
<ogra> even if edubuntu is ready at 20th, we cant release before the underlying arch is released :)
<lns> will i be able to apt-get dist-upgrade?
<ogra> yep
<lns> w00t =)
<ogra> even if you come from breezy i'd suggest to rebuild tzhe client environment
<shadow> hello!
<lns> hey shadow 
<shadow> hey ogra !
<ogra> the biggest speedups will only happen if you recreate the chroot
<ogra> hi shadow 
<thedarkener> dumb q-how do you do that?
<thedarkener> (rebuild chroot)
<thedarkener> sorry i'm still new to ltsp
<ogra> sudo rm -r /opt/ltsp/i386 && sudo ltsp-build-client
<shadow> ogra, that bug in fstab is killing me...noone knows if it'll be fixed....do you know the fix for it?
<ogra> shadow, ?? 
<ogra> which bug ?
<ogra> (and which bug # ? )
<shadow> Dapper shows 7 floppies, none of which will mount...i removed the extras from fstab and /media...still no good
<thedarkener> ogra, that won't kill the users' home dirs by rebuilding chroot will it?
<ogra> shadow, do yu have the bugnumber handy ? 
<ogra> be sure we wont release in such a state :)
<shadow> not off hand no, but i was told it is on launchpad
<ogra> thedarkener, usually you dont have homedirs in the thin client environment 
<thedarkener> ok.
<ogra> the desktop session and user environment are on the server ... the thin client chroot is only for running the X server and login manager on the client 
<thedarkener> ok, awesome.
<thedarkener> thanks =)
<ogra> :)
<thedarkener> i'm really excited about edubuntu
<ogra> cool :)
<ogra> Burgwork, did you read the automatix thread ? 
<shadow> i tried installing a fully updated Dapper but still same prob, i tried using my fstab from Breezy...no good....
<ogra> shadow, its most likely a udev bug ... look in launchpad, there you'll see the status ...
<shadow> btw, gcompris still runs like a dream for me...no probs i've encountered yet
<ogra> shadow, yvesC will be happy to hear :)
<shadow> it should be fixed by the time Dapper goes gold??
<ogra> the floppy thing ?
<shadow> yes, by all means, tell him it's super
<ogra> shadow, he's here, tell him yourself ;)
<shadow> yup the floppy thing
<ogra> do you think we would release with such a bug ;)
<thedarkener> hey ogra any torrent link / url for flight 6?
<Burgwork> Burgwork, I avoid automatix, as my doctor recommended I need to keep my blood pressure down
<Burgwork> ogra, even
<ogra> thedarkener, not yet, flight-6 doesnt exist yet ;)
<shadow> yvesC, GCompris fonctionne absolument parfait, merci, merci!
<thedarkener> oh ok
<thedarkener> durr... ;) thanks guys..otl, be back later
<ogra> Burgwork, Peter garretts comments are really worth the thread :-D
<Burgwork> ogra, is this on the ubuntuforums?
<ogra> thedarkener, flight-6 is due for thursday or friday 
<ogra> thedarkener, there will be an announcement on the edubuntu mailing list
<ogra> Burgwork, ubuntu-users .... forum gateway
<Burgwork> hmm, one of these days I really should install Edubuntu...
<ogra> heh
<ogra> yes, you should test the new themes :)
<Seveas> Burgwork, you should link your nicknames 
<shadow> brb
<Burgwork> Seveas, think should already be linked
<Seveas> they weren't a few minutes ago
<Burgwork> hmm
<Seveas> /msg nickserv link burgundavia burgundavias_pass
<Burgwork> hmm
<Burgwork> appears I linked them the wrong way
<Burgwork> Seveas, Link failed: circular link detected <-- how do I clear out a linking?
<Seveas> hmm, odd
<Seveas> so you ARE linked, but burgundavia is cloaked and burgwork not
<Burgwork> I think I am linked the wrong way though
<Burgwork> burgundavia --> burgwork, not burgwork --> burgundavia
<ogra> should that matter ?
<Seveas> it shouldn't matter
<Burgwork> hmm
<Burgwork> ogra, oh, joy. A huge thread filled with arnieboy ranting
<ogra> yep
<ogra> but Peter Garret deserves the title "ubunthumorist of the month"
<ogra> his posts are really great ...
<Seveas> Burgwork, try this: /nick asdifvsaufabodf
<Seveas> and then /nick Burgwork 
<Seveas> (asdifvsaufabodf is not literally needed, but it should be an unregistered nick)
<Burgwork> hmm
<Burgwork> the opinion that the coc doesn't count in the forums really scares me
<ogra> yep
<Burgwork> I wonder if it is time for the stick
<ogra> i think its over for now ...
<Burgwork> no, the forums in general
<ogra> but the gateway issue should be solved
<Seveas> --- [Burgwork]  (n=corey@ubuntu/member/burgundavia) : Corey Burger
<Seveas> it worked 
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> i still see a dns name
<Seveas> your client caches it probably
<ogra> yep, a *real* whois shows it right
<Burgwork> excellent. Thanks Seveas 
<bobulator> hey again... im planning on doing this reinstall then.  im gonna back up the whole home directory, but where is all the other system info stored, ie the user database? whats the ebst way to back this up?
<Seveas> bobulator, /etc
<Seveas> and some things in /var
<LaserJock> ogra: can you take a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2218 ?
<cbx33> evenin all
<bobulator> the whole thing?
<ogra> LaserJock, heh, even with alternative :)
<LaserJock> ogra: well, I stole that kinda. I based the package off of Lex Spoon's at http://minnow.cc.gatech.edu/squeak/3616
<bobulator> Seveas: if i just back those up and dump them back in when im done, will everything be ok?
<ogra> ah, well, we probably should change the other packages to his as well ...
<Seveas> probably not bobulator 
<bobulator> haha ok :D maybe easier just to recreate the user accounts manually?
<LaserJock> ogra: I think if squeak-image is done then all we need to do is add a wrapper script to squeak that checks for .image and .changes files
<ogra> yep
<ogra> i think thats already in ... 
<LaserJock> is it?
<LaserJock> I know that Lex's packages have a inisqueak shell script
<ogra> but i might be wrong, i was as well convinced that the image creating tool was in the package
<ogra> yep ..
<ogra> and we're missing it ...
<ogra> LaserJock, the package is fine with me ... dunno if we need any freeze approval currently ...
<ogra> else i'd say upload ....
<LaserJock> ogra: well, I can mdz real quick but I thin the NEW is ok
<ogra> but since its a bugfix ...
<ogra> just upload it, refer to me if anyone asks ...
<ogra> squeak is a edubuntu package ...
<LaserJock> ok, so then should I add Lex's shell script to squeak-vm?
<ogra> (i had 2 weeks discussions with elmo about the license back then)
<ogra> yep
<LaserJock> yeah, I know they have discussed it in debian-legal
<ogra> we're not debian :)
<ogra> luckily :)
<ogra> sabdlf blessed it in the end 
<ogra> elmo wouldnt have left it into the archive
<LaserJock> interesting
<bobulator> Seveas: so where is just the user database info stored? is it in one place or shall i just recreate all the accounts manaually?
<Seveas> /etc/{passwd,group,shadow}
<bobulator> cool
<bobulator> whats shadow?
<ogra> a password database
<bobulator> ah ace, encrypted?
<bobulator> thanks for that, i love finding new useful files.... mmmmm
<ogra> thats an ubuntu system you have currently?
<bobulator> ogra, edubuntu
<ogra> ah,k
<ogra> then its all fine ...
<bobulator> good stuff
<ogra> other distros define other system users and user ids ... so it would get tricky but from edubuntu to edubuntu will be no problem
<ogra> (or kubuntu/ubuntu/xubuntu)
<bobulator> coolcool. well, wish me luck, here we go,....
<ogra> :)
<spacey> goodnight
<ogra> night spacey 
#edubuntu 2007-03-26
<kris> hello everybody
<kris> hi for LaserJock and nixternal
<kris> can you tell me how to check available memory on hdd in edubuntu?
<LaserJock> df -h ?
<kris> oh you are here
<kris> ok thank you very much
<kris> how to install locale spell checking in thunderbird ?
<LaserJock> do you have the language pack for that language?
<kris> yes if it is xpi extension file
<LaserJock> no, you should get it from Ubuntu
<kris> thunderbird-locale-pl installed
<sbalneav> ogra!
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> sbalneav! ;)
<sbalneav> ajmitch! :)
<ajmitch> what's up?
<LaserJock> hi sbalneav
<sbalneav> Sitting here testing Edubuntu
<ajmitch> fun
<sbalneav> rythmbox with built in Jamendo support is going to be a BIG timewaster for me, I can see.
* ajmitch is just sitting here hacking on auth stuff
* ajmitch tried it, it skipped far too much
<sbalneav> I should get off my butt one of these days, and finish off a project I started years ago.
<ajmitch> heh
<sbalneav> I basically started a modern distributed auth backend, using postgresql
<sbalneav> A sql database is ONE HECK of a lot easier to deal with than ldap.
<ajmitch> yes, but why?
<ajmitch> ldap is nice & standardised
* sbalneav rolls eyes
<ajmitch> :)
<ajmitch> plus it's lots of fun
<sbalneav> Tell me, to add a new user, which would you rather do: the whole ldap thing, or "insert into passwd values("sbalneav", "/home/sbalneav", "Scott Balneaves"....)
<ajmitch> the whole ldap thing
<sbalneav> I use ldap all the time, but it's cumbersome, and with the exception of gq, there's no really good frontend.
<ajmitch> since I'd use some tool to do it
<sbalneav> Yeah, which tool?
<ajmitch> you've tried various ones like lat, luma, ldap-account-manager, phpldapadmin, cpu?
<ajmitch> cpu is a nice commandline tool, fwiw
<sbalneav> Yep, don't like 'em.
<ajmitch> what's so bad about them?
<sbalneav> But, hey, that's just me.  Like I say, ldap's out there and we deal with it.
<sbalneav> For where I am, though, dealing with it as a database would be much easier.
<ajmitch> bah, you're just different :)
* ajmitch was even thinking of writing a tool for handling ldap users & groups
<ajmitch> but I don't know if I'd have time, etc
* ajmitch does need to get back to ldap migration stuff
<Bhaskar> goodmorning all, i want to know lts is built in or not in edubuntu
<Burgundavia> Bhaskar: ltsp?
<Bhaskar> ya linux terminal server package
<Burgundavia> yes, very much so
<Burgundavia> the work edubuntu/ubuntu did is now LTSP 5
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, extra installation or packaged in live CD?
<Burgundavia> as part of the regular install
<Burgundavia> there is no room on the live cd
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, we want to use lts in schools
<Burgundavia> ltsp, not lts
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, we want to use edubuntu in schools
<Burgundavia> lts in ubuntu refers to "long term support"
<Bhaskar> oh!
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, i mean ltsp
<Bhaskar> LTSP"Linux Terminal Server Project"
<Burgundavia> yep
<Burgundavia> what sort of help do you need?
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, i want to know whether LTSP package is pre-packaged in edubuntu or not
<Burgundavia> yes, they are
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, in which version?
<Burgundavia> http://edubuntu.org/GettingStarted
<Burgundavia> 6.06 and later
<kgoetz> sigh. deja vu
<Burgundavia> kgoetz: deja vu?
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, can we use edubuntu 6.06 in shools for LTSP
<kgoetz> Burgundavia: Bhaskar and i had this conversation last night (my time). 15 ~ hours ago
<Burgundavia> ahh
<Burgundavia> Bhaskar: yes
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, well
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, i am going to deploy LTSP in schools of Nepal
<Burgundavia> ah
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, so i want to use edubuntu in schools
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, have u use edubuntu?
<Burgundavia> yes
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, how it is ? what is different than Ubuntu 6.06 or 6.10
<Burgundavia> it works well
<Burgundavia> 6.06 is supported for a longer period than 6.10
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, in school edubuntu plays vital role?
<Burgundavia> I don't work in a school
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, ya
<Bhaskar> Burgundavia, for student what are the package in edubuntu?
<sbalneav> gcompris, kmath, tuxpaint, etc.
<sbalneav> Theres a lot of educational content for younger kids, and older ones too.
<Bhaskar> sbalneav, have u found edubuntu  is effective ?
<sbalneav> For the school that I helped out, yes.
<Bhaskar> sbalneav, for schools?
<Bhaskar> sbalneav, in 6.06 LTSP is buit in so we can interconnect thin client for economical
<sbalneav> Yes, but the one in 6.10 is much better
<sbalneav> An the soon to be released 7.04 is even more improved.
<sbalneav> That will come out in April
<Bhaskar> sbalneav, 6.10 Edubuntu?
<Bhaskar> sbalneav, in 6.10 edubuntu thin client support or not?
<sbalneav> Yes, there is thin client support in 6.10
<Bhaskar> sbalneav, in urs view, edubuntu liked by student?
<Bhaskar> sbalneav, i mean it is better solution in schools?
<sbalneav> The one's I've seen seem to like it, and my own kids like it.
<Bhaskar> sbalneav, well
<sbalneav> As for whether it's a better solution, why not try it and see.
<Bhaskar> sbalneav, i want to deploy it in schools in Nepal
<sbalneav> It won't cost you anything :)
<Bhaskar> sbalneav, ya
<Bhaskar> sbalneav, where r u from?
<sbalneav> Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
<Bhaskar> sbalneav, Edubuntu 7.04?
<sbalneav> What's your question?
<Bhaskar> sbalneav, difference between edubuntu 6.06 nd 7.04?
<Bhaskar> for LTSP
<sbalneav> What, you want me to LIST the differences?
<sbalneav> there's hundreds of improvements
<sbalneav> newer == better
<LaserJock> we hope :-)
<sbalneav> :)
<Burgundavia> sbalneav: we had better file an MIR for asterisk
* Starting logfile irclogs/edubuntu.log
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: tell ogra this looks like Edubuntu, doesn't it? http://www.engadget.com/2007/03/25/homebrew-xbox-360-runs-ubuntu/
<edubuntugirl> Righto, highvoltage!
<RichEd> hi highvoltage, rockprincess, edubuntugirl
<edubuntugirl> RichEd: I'm not following you...
<rockprincess> good morning RichEd!
<kgoetz> hi all
* RichEd is relieved that edubuntugirl is no longer stalking me
<RichEd> hey karl\
<kgoetz> hi
<rockprincess> good morning Karl!
<Burgundavia> hey highvoltage
<kgoetz> rockprincess: good afternoon :)
<LaserJock> RichEd!!
<highvoltage> hey RichEd, rockprincess, kgoetz, rockprincess and LaserJock!
<RichEd> hi LaserJock ... been in darkest Africa for a week ... back at my desk & reliable internet again today
<ogra> highvoltage, yes, thats definately edubuntu and not ubuntu, pretty cool :)
<edubuntugirl> ogra: by the way, highvoltage told me to tell you 'this looks like Edubuntu, doesn't it? http://www.engadget.com/2007/03/25/homebrew-xbox-360-runs-ubuntu/' 2 hours, 24 minutes and 22 seconds ago (on Mon Mar 26 09:25:43 2007)
<ogra> hi RichEd !!!!
<RichEd> mr ogra sir ... how are you ?
<RichEd> finally back from Nigeria ... with 50% of my luggage
<ogra> relaxed, beta out the door and head a nice weekend :)
<ogra> *had
<ogra> ugh, where is the rest ?
<RichEd> I'll need to track it down today ... our Virgin Nigeria flight was 4 hours late ... so we were rushed through to our connecting flight back to SA (30 people) without luggage.
<RichEd> We had a choice of wait for luggage, and spend the weekend in Lagos airport, or fly home now, luggage later.
<RichEd> I took option 2 :)
<ogra> heh
<juliux> hey RichEd
<juliux> hi ogra
<RichEd> hi juliux
<juliux> ogra, did you think you can come to linuxtag this year?
<ogra> i think i'm scheduled for a Q&A sessions ...
<juliux> cool
<ogra> -s
<ogra> i havent really cared to be honest, but somebody in the company asked for it and i agreed to come ...
<ogra> so i dont know the exact status :) have to ask ... beta kept me out of such stuff
<juliux> i talked on cebit with several people who want to use edubuntu in germany on schools
<ogra> nice ! :)
<juliux> and we allready have 4 schools on the *ubuntu in de wiki page
<ogra> wow, make sure will gets an info about it if he's back, he will surely want to put it on a success story link or something
<juliux> i will send him the link
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<cliebow_> any way around scrollkeeper error Entity "irc-server" not defined?
<bddebian> Heya
<sbalneav> Morning all
<sbalneav> ogra: ping
<ogra> sbalneav, pongedipong
<sbalneav> hey hey
<sbalneav> Did more testing on the weekend, installed edubuntu on my laptop
<sbalneav> For some reason the restricted modules didn't get installed by default
<ogra> you didnt use the latest iso :P
<sbalneav> I used the beta one, true.
<sbalneav> Was that a known bug?
<highvoltage> sbalneav: did you see the edubuntu screenshot on the playstation?
<sbalneav> Other than that, it went slick
<sbalneav> No?
<sbalneav> Playstation 2?
<sbalneav> As well, what's the recommended way to load the second cd?
<ogra> thats edubuntu booting on an xbox360 :) http://mydedibox.homelinux.com/downloads/x360/ubuntu_360.avi
<sbalneav> Finally!  A use for a Microsoft product!
<highvoltage> oops, meant xbox360, no wonder I couldn't find the link again :)
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<Burgwork> sbalneav: you around?
<sbalneav> yes, for the moment
<sbalneav> Burgwork: yes
<Burgwork> argh, now I am busy
<cbx33> hi all
<Burgwork> hey cbx33
<highvoltage> hey
<cbx33> hey Burgwork
<cbx33> brb
<Petaris> Hello all
<Petaris> my ethernet cards/ports have disappeared, is there anyway to get the system to probe for them?
<Petaris> I know they are working fine because I booted a xubuntu live cd and they were there and working
<Petaris> this is occuring on dapper
<Petaris> all network-admin shows is ethernet 3, 4, and 5
<Petaris> all non-configured
<Petaris> I should mention that I had to swap out this motherboard, it only has three ethernet interfaces on it
<Petaris> Is there a way I can get it to call them eth0, 1, 2 again?
<sbalneav> Petaris: check in /etc/iftab
<sbalneav> You'll have to update the mac addresses of all the interfaces with their respective eth[x]  designations
<Petaris> hrm
<Petaris> is there a way to see their mac addresses?
<Petaris> ifconfig won't show them
<Petaris> nevermind, I just had to "activate them to get the mac
<Petaris> sbalneav: Thanks for your help
<cliebow_> !j
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about j - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<sbalneav> Different bot in this channel cliebow_
<cliebow_> i just figgreed that out
#edubuntu 2007-03-27
<DaveMorri1> hey gang.  What age gorups is edubuntu aimed at?
<LaserJock> pretty much everything
<DaveMorri1> I'm jsut wondering if its suitable for my other 1/2's nursery
<LaserJock> could be, what ages?
<DaveMorri1> 6months (a tad young for computers) to pre-school so 5 I think
<LaserJock> that
<LaserJock> is fairly young
<DaveMorri1> the 6 months or the 5?
<LaserJock> well, both kinda
<LaserJock> I've heard of kids as young as 18 months on Edubuntu
<LaserJock> but I'm not sure how much they get out of it
<DaveMorri1> they have a couple of machines which they play basic games like bob the builder on
<DaveMorri1> well I'll download it and see what she thinks, as she's the one that workers there
<LaserJock> yeah, just try it out
<LaserJock> I'm guessing gcompris would be the app you'd be most interested
<DaveMorri1> cheers
<sbalneav> Evening all
<LaserJock> hi sbalneav
<sbalneav> Hey LaserJock
<sbalneav> rhythmbox + jamendo support = awesome.
<LaserJock> what's jamendo?
<sbalneav> Dude.
<sbalneav> DUDE!!!
<LaserJock> what?
<sbalneav> I just discovered it 2 days ago
<sbalneav> it's awesome
<LaserJock> so I've heard :)
<sbalneav> an entire site full of CC licensed music
<sbalneav> Do you use rhythmbox at all?
<LaserJock> not really
<LaserJock> but if I had something to listen to I might
<sbalneav> ok
<sbalneav> do this
<LaserJock> I use rhythmbox when I listen to music
<sbalneav> (gimme a sec to find the bits>
<LaserJock> I just don't listen to a lot of music
<sbalneav> RB -> edit -> plugins
<sbalneav> check off "jamendo"
<sbalneav> Now, it should show up on the channels area.
<sbalneav> Browse something you like (me, I like folk, plus I'm kind of getting into house/trace/ambient)
<sbalneav> Start playing.
<sbalneav> and if you like it
<LaserJock> hah, RB has a python console
<sbalneav> CLICK ON THE "DOWNLOAD" BUTTON!
<sbalneav> It's awsome
<LaserJock> *everything* has a python console these days
<sbalneav> Everything should have a python console :)
<sbalneav> Plus, I've yet to win against gnuchess
<sbalneav> even on easy,
<sbalneav> ;(
<LaserJock> wow, 1873 artists
* LinuxProbie peers in briefly
<LinuxProbie> can someone post the link for setting up an ATI radeon in ubuntu?
<cbx33> Hi LinuxProbie
<LinuxProbie> Hallo CBX33
<cbx33> hi people.....I've just totally forgotten, where is the gnome splash stored?
<cbx33> ogra?
<highvoltage> cbx33: /usr/share/pixmaps/splash
<cbx33> thanks highvoltage
<cbx33> w00t
<cbx33> stgedubuntu v1.0 is pretty much complete
<highvoltage> what does the stg stand for?
<ajmitch> hey cbx33, highvoltage
<highvoltage> hey there ajmitch
<cbx33> st george
<cbx33> hi ajmitch
<cbx33> if I was using reconstructor to remaster the edubuntu live cd......and I installed the flash plugins
<cbx33> am I right in thinking I couldn't then copy and distribute the cd
<highvoltage> cbx33: I think you may re-distribute the flash plugin, as long as you display the license before installing
<highvoltage> cbx33: best is to check the flash plugins license
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> so a firefox popup about the flash license?
<highvoltage> I think it needs to be displaid /before/ the flash plugin is installed. I don't know how strict they are on that.
<highvoltage> if you're running firefox and the plugin is already loaded, that might count as being installed
<anestis> #edulinux
* highvoltage is too drained to read through http://www.adobe.com/products/eulas/players/flash/ atm
<juliux> anestis, hust another irc channel without topic and traffic?
<juliux> s/just/hust
<cbx33> ok highvoltage
<finalbeta> Starting for what age would Edubuntu be appropriate?
<Kamping_Kaiser> lower primary i suspect
<jsgotangco> even preschool kids can use it with gcompris
<ogra> highvoltage, you cant distribute flash without allowance from adobe ... the license you agree to in the package is a download license ... not one that covers distribution
<rockprincess> finalbeta: my students at the moment are about 16-17 years old
<highvoltage> ouch
<bddebian> Heya
<Kamping_Kaiser> hi
<bddebian> Hi Kamping_Kaiser
<Kamping_Kaiser> bddebian, hi, hows it going?\
<bddebian> OK, thanks.  You?
<Kamping_Kaiser> pretty good, tired, but getting some work done for once :)
<bddebian> Nice :-)
<Kamping_Kaiser> yeh :) trying to build one mac desktop out of two - i'm trying to put a not-apple-certified pci-64 card in it though. *is hoping...* :)
<sbalneav> Morning all
<Kamping_Kaiser> gmornin
<cliebow_> Scottie!!!!!!!!!
<sbalneav> Morning cliebow_
<Kamping_Kaiser> hi cliebow_
<jsgotangco> scottie to hottie
<jsgotangco> too
<cliebow_> Gentlemen!
<cliebow_> boy:i have a dumb one...in one of my fits a deleted bottom panel where minimized programs show..i did add a panel..but minimized xterms still disappear..will some one hiyt me with ugly stick then tell me how to get that function back?
<Kamping_Kaiser> 'window list'?
<cliebow_> hmmm
<cliebow_> Kamping_Kaiser, Ahhhh that is much better..Thanks!
<Kamping_Kaiser> cliebow_, np, sorry, i didnt think to be more verbose
<Kamping_Kaiser> hum. ubuntu ppc iso 735mb?? *wonders if dd introduces overhead*
<ogra> ppc isnt tested ... its not on the official list anymore
<Kamping_Kaiser> this is a dapper image.
<ogra> so i dont monitor it
<ogra> oh, ok
<Kamping_Kaiser> long as it fits on the cd when i need, i dont mind :)
<LinuxProbie> g'mornin
<LinuxProbie> anyone alive in here?
<LaserJock> maybe
<LaserJock> :-)
<pips1> :-)
* pips1 is testing 7.04 beta amd64 server installation
<LinuxProbie> So I have two problems, one with my dell wireless wlan card and the other with the dell wireless 350 bluetooth module
<LinuxProbie> anyone know about those?
<pips1> LinuxProbie: what is the problem?
<pips1> hey sbalneav
<sbalneav> Hey
<cbx33> HI sbalneav
<sbalneav> how's it going?
<cbx33> yeh good good
<cbx33> you?
<pips1> fine, finally managed to get some time for testing the beta
<cbx33> nice
<LinuxProbie> neither of them works, pips1
<pips1> LinuxProbie: a quick google search shows me that you don't seem to be alone with this problem: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=2308248
<pips1> LinuxProbie: on a quick glance, it doesn't look as if you problem was reported in malone bug tracker... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=bluetooth
<pips1> how do I filter bugs by package in Launchpad?
<LaserJock> ogra: ping regarding edubuntu-docs
<diyerxa> Hello
<diyerxa> I am in charge of a project at my college in which I must install a distribution of Linux on many old PCs to be distributed to High Schools around my state.
<LaserJock> cool
<diyerxa> I chose Edubuntu as the distribution.  I have installed it on 23 computers now, and still have more to do.
<LaserJock> neato
<diyerxa> Should any of these schools run in to problems, where should I direct there problems?
<diyerxa> *where should I direct their questions?
<LaserJock> so you're planning on installing Edubuntu and then just letting them have at it?
<diyerxa> That's what my boss asked me to do.
<LaserJock> or are you going to some training?
<diyerxa> My boss asked me to format the HDD, and install an opensource OS
<LaserJock> hmm, is there anybody at these schools who's going to be in charge of them?
<diyerxa> I'm just the techy, I don't really know much aside from what my job duties are.
<LaserJock> :-)
<diyerxa> I'm guessing I'm going to be getting a lot of phone calls as soon as we start distributing these computers. That's why I'm asking now. lol
<LaserJock> well, there's this channel
<LaserJock> and the mailing lists: edubuntu-devel and edubuntu-users
<sbalneav> As well, Canonical offers paid support
<diyerxa> Okay, I'll consider some of these options and try to work out a policy.  Thanks guys.
<diyerxa> Have a good one.
<LaserJock> cya
<LinuxProbie> so I;m trying a different walkthrough on my wireless card, getting stuck when it asks me to do osmething, and this is the output:
<LinuxProbie> rollerce@edubuntu:~$ sudo bcm43xx-fwcutter -w /lib/firmware ~/desktop/bcmwl5.sys
<LinuxProbie> Cannot open input file /home/rollerce/desktop/bcmwl5.sys
<bimberi> LinuxProbie: capital D in Desktop
<LinuxProbie> You're kidding...
<LinuxProbie> it's THAT picky o.o;
<bimberi> yep, Linux/Unix is case sensitive
<LinuxProbie> bleh
<kigurai> Tab-completion is your friend :)
<LaserJock> LinuxProbie: it's a feature not a problem ;-)
<kigurai> LaserJock: :)
<tidrion> hey
<tidrion> anyone else tried edubuntu on an ibook?
<tidrion> getting an error that ELF can't be read or something
<tidrion> any ideas?
<tidrion> okay...
<tidrion> anyone here?
<LaserJock> tidrion: what were you doing?
<tidrion> trying to run the live disc
<tidrion> cd
<LaserJock> did it work at all?
<tidrion> ni
<tidrion> no
<tidrion> just kept giving me that error
<LaserJock> did you get the right disc?
<LaserJock> i386 or powerpc
<pips1> ugh, in gcompris, there is a button to start tuxpaint, and when you click it, the system just freezes :-/
#edubuntu 2007-03-28
<greenflubber> hello
<knix_> where can I find the handbook for edubuntu feisty?
<knix_> !feisty
<ubotu> The next version of Ubuntu (7.04; codenamed "Feisty Fawn") should be released in April 2007. Beta is out! http://www.ubuntu.com/news/Ubuntu704Beta Schedule: !schedule - Specifications (goals): https://features.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/feisty - Help and support in #ubuntu+1 (NOT #ubuntu)
<knix_> !handbook
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about handbook - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<Tm_T> !info feisty handbook
<ubotu> Package feisty does not exist in edgy
<Tm_T> bah
<Tm_T> !info handbook
<ubotu> Package handbook does not exist in edgy, edgy-backports, edgy-seveas
<Tm_T> :(
<jgedeon> Is there a change log for Edubuntu feisty?
<Laser_away> jgedeon: it's very difficult to do a changelog at the distro level
<jgedeon> Ok wasn't sure if I was looking in the right places.
<LaserJock> the release notes will be the best that I can think of
<jgedeon> Yes that was what I was sifting through...
<LinuxProbie> Hello? *peers into quiet room*
<Kamping_Kaiser> *starts creeping forward*
* LaserJock jumps on LinuxProbie 
<cafuego_> *throws spaghetti*
<jgedeon> LaserJock: what did you do to LinuxProbie for him to run like that?
<sbalneav> Evening all
<ajmitch> hi sbalneav
<LinuxProbie> Hallo?
<sbalneav> Hello
* HedgeMage peeks in
<bonbonthejon> hi
<HedgeMage> hi
<HedgeMage> what's up?
<sbalneav> Hey HedgeMage
* LaserJock doesn't jump on LinuxProbie 
<HedgeMage> how are you, sbalneav ?
* HedgeMage jumps on LaserJock 
<sbalneav> Doin' fine.
<sbalneav> You?
<HedgeMage> Quite happy... finally have a new laptop on order.
* HedgeMage bounces impatiently
<LinuxProbie> what brand?
<HedgeMage> A Dell... I have a slight preference for Toshiba, but I'm a girl on a budget.
<bonbonthejon> any one involved in documentation?
<LinuxProbie> Dell = Fantastic warranties
<sbalneav> I'm quite happy with my System76 laptop.
<sbalneav> Which, came with Ubuntu pre-installed, I might add! :)
<HedgeMage> bonbonthejon: I was when I still had time ;)
<HedgeMage> bonbonthejon: are you the jon who just applied for handbook team membership?
<sbalneav> bonbonthejon: I've done a bit
<bonbonthejon> HedgeMage: yeah
<bonbonthejon> sbalneav: I have a rough draft for the networking page in the handbook
<HedgeMage> bonbonthejon: nifty.  the project really needs people... I'm only really there in spirit any more.
<sbalneav> Cool.
<sbalneav> Email it to me, if you'd like
<sbalneav> sbalneav@ltsp.org
<bonbonthejon> HedgeMage: I also am getting some old computers, I was thinking of setting up a edubuntu server and some clients and trying stuff
<HedgeMage> bonbonthejon: awesome.
<bonbonthejon> sbalneav: sent
<sbalneav> thx
<tidrion> how much disk space is needed for edubunutu?
<tidrion> PPC
<tidrion> 6.10 off of live cd
<LaserJock> oh, about 2GB
<tidrion> cool
<tidrion> lol 3.3 gig drive :-)
<tidrion> old laptop
<tidrion> ran OS X 10.3.9
<tidrion> figured edubuntu should scream
<tidrion> okay, scream no
<tidrion> but you know what I mean
<tidrion> does ubuntu not support wpa or am I just an idiot and no linux does
<bonbonthejon> tidrion: there is a package, like wpa_suppliant, or something
<LaserJock> it should work with Network Manager
<tidrion> thanks bonbon
<tidrion> can't wait to get edu up and running
<tidrion> I think my kids will love it
<tidrion> have three other iMacs I may put it on if it works on this laptop
<tidrion> can't wait till the server/client from 7.04 is available for PPC
<tidrion> I think it will be fun just to set up :-)
<cafuego_> tidrion: I've found iMacs work very nicely with ltsp.
<tidrion> okay, this sucks I have to ask this
<tidrion> what is ltsp
<cafuego_> tidrion: I ran 4 of them off a singl amd64 server last year
* tidrion is not a linux guy
* tidrion wants to be, but isn't yet
<cafuego_> tidrion: LTSP = Linux Terminal Server - using the imacs as a thin client.
<tidrion> IAHH!
<tidrion> gotcha
<tidrion> is if LTSP chroot fails on install
<tidrion> worry?
<tidrion> or don't?
<bonbonthejon> !enter
<ubotu> Please try to keep your questions/responses on one line - don't use the "Enter" key as punctuation!
<tidrion> sorry
<bonbonthejon> tidrion: its ok
<LaserJock> lol, I haven't seen that one before
<tidrion> I have
<tidrion> terrible habit of hitting enter after each thought instead of completing it before hitting it
<cafuego_> http://www.cafuego.net/stuff/iMacEdubuntuArraySmall.jp
<cafuego_> g
<bonbonthejon> cafuego_: thats pretty sweet
<tidrion> very sweet
<cafuego_> bonbonthejon: Yep. I set them up for software freedom day, so people could have a poke.
<tidrion> bbiab, need to check the install
<bonbonthejon> cafuego_: was it easy to install the imacs? I might have access to one soon
<cafuego_> bonbonthejon: They all netboot, so all you need really is for open firmware to be set to look for a bootp server.
<cafuego_> bonbonthejon: Or hold down 'n' at bootup.
<tidrion> aight
<tidrion> I'm back
<tidrion> still on the partition
<tidrion> !enter
<ubotu> Please try to keep your questions/responses on one line - don't use the "Enter" key as punctuation!
<tidrion> :-( like I said, bad bad habit
<tidrion> hey
<tidrion> trying to install on my iMac now, getting an orange screen takes me right back to boot disc selector
<tidrion> nvm, just didn't like running off of a firewire cd rom drive
* Kamping_Kaiser casts level 5 foo at imac
<tidrion> night all, thanks for the help and sorry for the enter spam
<cello_rasp> hi, is anyone in here using edubuntu? if so, could you tell me the name of the application theme it uses? the one with the red highlights?
<highvoltage> cello_rasp: I think you can install edubuntu-artwork and choose the edubuntu theme in the gtk theme chooser
<cello_rasp> it dodm
<cello_rasp> didn't come with edubuntu-artwork in edgy..
<chin1> hey guys for some pc's on the network that you would have manual installs... is there some type of server/client type system where you can controll waht updates the clients install ?
<chin1> something like wsus for windows ?
<sbalneav> chin1: Not sure what you're asking for?  Are you looking for an automated installation procedure?
<highvoltage> chin1: are you running LTSP?
<highvoltage> chin1: if so, you can just install the software on the server
<highvoltage> chin1: if it's single workstations running ubuntu, it's probably best that you ask on #ubuntu
<chin1> no im just hypathosizing about the future
<chin1> if you have a machine that is manually installed and not using ltsp
<chin1> as a network admin you want to conrol what  udates ubuntu is advertising if you know what i mean
<chin1> the little systray icon says thre is new updates
<chin1> but then they go and update their kernel without knowing what htey are doing and end up with issues
<chin1> i mean as an admin you would like to have controll over automate updates
<sbalneav> They won't get the tray icon unless they're a member of the admin group
<sbalneav> Normally, you wouldn't add regular users to the admin group.
<bddebian> Heya
<sbalneav> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hello sbalneav
<Finally> Pichour Tout Le Monde !!!
<chin1> ok but like i said this is a special local install mode lets say for a teacher who wants their own ubuntu
<chin1> they want to instal and control stuff
<chin1> you should allow that but at the same time also try to stop them from fucking them selves up as much as possible
<Laser_away> chin1: you'd probably want to either not let the teacher be in the admin group and do the updates yourself or maybe do some sort of apt-proxy that will filter out what you don't want
<Laser_away> on a stable release though updates should be fine
<knix_> I am installing edubuntu feisty beta classroom server as we speak.  Where will I find the documentation on setting up the server for classroom use?
<Laser_away> knix_: in the Help
<knix_> ty Laser_away
<cbx33> hey Laser_away
<Laser_away> knix just type in LTSP in the search bar
<Laser_away> stormchas3r: actually http://doc.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/handbook/C/ might be more updated
<stormchas3r> great, ty
<stormchas3r> is it pretty much the same as the dapper version, with ltsp and all?
<Laser_away> I think things are a bit different
<Laser_away> I think it's easier to set up
<stormchas3r> thats even better
<stormchas3r> ty
<stormchas3r> can you update the beta to the full version when it comes out, or do you have to reinstall?
<Laser_away> you should be able to update
<stormchas3r> great - I cant wait for the feisty to come out.  I am hoping to get this in a technical high school for the labs
<LaserJock> ogra: have you had a chance to see the new About Edubuntu?
<ogra> LaserJock, nope i didnt, i just uploaded it :)
<ogra> i trust you tested it
<LaserJock> ogra: you have to relogin to see it but it works
<LaserJock> I tried it this morning
<ogra> good
<LaserJock> ogra: the only thing I think maybe I need to do is adjust the icon
<LaserJock> I used distributor-logo
<ogra> which one is it using ?
<ogra> thats right
<LaserJock> ok cool
<ogra> without any path i hope
<LaserJock> I tested on an Ubuntu box with edubuntu-docs installed
<ogra> the paths have changed, edubuntu-artwork isnt updated yet
<LaserJock> so it was an Ubuntu icon
<LaserJock> no paths of course
<ogra> yeah, known bug
<ogra> what about yelp ?
<LaserJock> well, I swear mdke did a patch to add the Handbook to the frontpage
<LaserJock> but there's been some changes to that patch
<LaserJock> and I don't see it now
<LaserJock> I gotta chase it up with mdke to make sure it's there
<ogra> ok
<LaserJock> but all the docs are there and the About Edubuntu icon
<ogra> wha does the icon open ?
<ogra> yelp 
<ogra> ?
<LaserJock> if you do a search for ltsp in the yelp you get the edubuntu docs
<LaserJock> yelp ghelp:about-edubuntu
<ogra> ugh
<ogra> the release notes i have here are funny old ...
<ogra> (whats new)
<ogra> thats dapper iirc
<LaserJock> ogra: the Handbook is also not finished
<ogra> i'll look at it
<LaserJock> most of the stuff in the workstation section is no done
<jgedeon> Hello everyone.  I come to your expertise in a problem that I am encountering.  Background is: Main system has Edubutnu 6.10 full installation on it.  Stopped using it and now doesn't support LTSP clients for some reason.  Built new system just for Edubuntu Server default install with single nic dhcpd3 has been romoved.  Now when booting the TC will start to boot off of Edubuntu Server and then go to the main machine.  If I take the main
<jgedeon>  machine off the network then a buzybox error displayed.  /bin/sh: can't access tty; job control turned off
<LaserJock> but I think we can just rely on the Ubuntu docs for that
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> i wonder why i dont get it offered in u-m
<LaserJock> edubuntu-docs?
<LaserJock> cbx33: pingy pingy
<LaserJock> ogra: btw, do you know who's doing Edubuntu SoC mentoring? I only know of myself and Pete
<ogra> LaserJock, nope, dunno about anyone else ...
<LaserJock> :(
<ogra> i will mentor a parental control projec if someone steps up for it
<LaserJock> there are a ton of applications
<ogra> but wont do any random mentoring
* ogra wonders how sbalneav came to 256 + (60 * users) MB for memory requirement computing
<ogra> we require 128M per user
<LaserJock> I wondered as well
<LaserJock> so it should be 256 + (128 * users)MB ?
<ogra> yes
<ogra> with 60 you can probably run xubuntu
<ogra> can you drop priting and upgrading ?
<ogra> from the server docs in the handbook
<ogra> upgrading is handled under maintenance
<ogra> and printing in the lts.conf section
<ogra> urgh
<ogra> and it says Microsoft in some places it seems in the adopted parts of ESA
<ogra> that needs to be wiped/changed
<ogra> we're not allowed to use that trademark i think
<ogra> eeek
* ogra reads Adobe Photosho
<ogra> s//p
<cbx33> pongitypongity
<cbx33> LaserJock,
<LaserJock> cbx33: we need an update to the edubuntu docs for scp -> tcm
<cbx33> i thought i sent that through yonks ago
<LaserJock> cbx33: to where?
<cbx33> well obviously I didn't
<LaserJock> well, that's not exactly obvious
<ogra> i thought you included that in the tcm package
<Burgwork> yay! work gave me a Windows Vista laptop to admin
<LaserJock> I've been chasing down various "things that should be there but seem to have gotten lost"
<Burgwork> I am so please
<Burgwork> d
<LaserJock> Burgwork: can you dual-boot it?
<Burgwork> I plan to
<LaserJock> ogra: we aren't shipping blender anymore are we?
<LaserJock> it's in Universe
<Burgwork> and I also plan to not grant any users admin rights
<ogra> nope
<cbx33> nope
<LaserJock> ogra: so that takes out the photoshop reference ;-)
<ogra> Burgwork, bah, lamer, do a single boot of edubuntu
<cbx33> why?
<cbx33> photoshop != blender
<ogra> LaserJock, nope, thats in the gimp section
<Burgwork> ogra: sadly, I have been told "the sales guys need a windows laptop for the road"
<LaserJock> ogra: you sure?
<LaserJock> bah
<ogra> LaserJock, pretty, yes
<LaserJock> I guess I shouldn't be doing this via grep
<ogra> Burgwork, bah, just tell him its vista
<Burgwork> heh
<ogra> i bet he has never seen it before
<cbx33> heeh
<Burgwork> lol
<cbx33> vista does look rather different
<cbx33> in some places
<ogra> how would he know
<LaserJock> Burgwork: imbrandon has a Vista theme for KDE
<Burgwork> hmm
<cbx33> noooooo
<cbx33> :p
<Burgwork> http://www.gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=28352
<Burgwork> http://www.gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=42875
<LaserJock> so....
<LaserJock> how do we talk about MS Office without saying MS Office
<cbx33> proprietary office suites
<ogra> yeah
<cbx33> commerical office suites
<LaserJock> ogra: are you doing any of these edits?
<LaserJock> ogra: I've got it open so I can do it here
<ogra> i wouldnt even know how :)
<LaserJock> hehe, blame it on ignorance ;-)
<cbx33> hahaha
<ogra> i'm the all time proof reader
<LaserJock> OpenOffice.org is a complete office suite similar to other, commercial,
<LaserJock> office suite.
<cbx33> +s
<ogra> yeah
<LaserJock> yeah
<cbx33> no comma after commercial
<LaserJock> OpenOffice.org can open and convert most documents from the other commerical office suite
<LaserJock> should I use plural again there?
<cbx33> drop the "the"
<cbx33> from other commercial office suites
<LaserJock> can it open Word Perfect files, for instance?
<ogra> well, you dont say how these dcs have to be saved :)
<ogra> *docs
<LaserJock> ah
<ogra> even gedit can open rtf ;)
<LaserJock> the power of being extremely vague
<cbx33> indeed
<cbx33> if M$ can get away with it by saying every next version of their os is "better" in the install procedure
<cbx33> so can we ;)
<LaserJock> ok, what about Photoshop?
<LaserJock> commercial image editor?
<ogra>  Image editing similar to Adobe Photoshop is done using the
<ogra> GIMP. Scribus provides layout and publishing capabilites similar to Adobe
<ogra> Illustrator.
<ogra> and commercial vector editors
<cbx33> hmm
<cbx33> what about commercial desktop publishing software
<ogra> Image editing similar to other professional photo editors is done usong the gimp
<ogra> *using the GIMP
<stormchas3r> Does the install usually hang at 85% for you guys with feisty beta?
<ogra> Scribus provides layout and desktop publiching capabilities.
<ogra> *publishing
<ogra> stormchas3r, not for me, no ...
<stormchas3r> hmmmm
<ogra> i tested all server and desktop isos ... not the dvd though
<stormchas3r> ya, its hanging at 85% br1tty-x11 for me
<ogra> server or desktop ?
<stormchas3r> classroom server
<ogra> hmm, didnt have any probs here ... i did several installs esecially of the server i386 iso
<LaserJock> ogra: so drop Illustrator altogether?
<ogra> yeah
<cbx33> yes
<ogra> or add quark, pagemaker, freehand ... etc
<ogra> :P
<stormchas3r> maybe ill just let it sit there and hope that it finishes
<ogra> stgraber, check on console 4 what its doing
<LaserJock> ok, one more file to fix
<LaserJock> introduction.xml
<LaserJock> Most educational computer networks are a mixture of Microsoft Windows, Apple OS X and Linux systems.
<cbx33> mixture of commercial operating systems
<cbx33> and linux system
<ogra> Most educational computer networks are heterogenous networks consisting of various operating systems.
<LaserJock> ok, so the only Microsoft reference left is:
<LaserJock> X_MOUSE_PROTOCOL = "Microsoft"
<LaserJock> in server.xml
<LaserJock> I think that's ok isn't it?
<ogra> well, that should be microsoft, but yes thats ok
<ogra> ps2 is pointless, its autodetected
<ogra> actually there should be the example file in there we ship in ltsp rather
<tidrion> hello, how is everyone doing?
<tidrion> anyone successfully installed edubuntu on a toilet seat iBook?
<LaserJock> ogra: the Customization section of chpt 4 is empty, should I remove it?
<ogra> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/12571/
<ogra> yes, remove it
<LaserJock> ogra: what do you want me to do with that paste?
<ogra> LaserJock, is it hard to replace the example lts.conf with it ?
<ogra> thats the one we ship in ltsp-client
<LaserJock> np, on it
<LaserJock> gotta fix up the "Documentation and Support" section real quick to reflect Feisty
<ogra> you mean 4.3 ?
<ogra> looks good to me
<LaserJock> except it's for "Supplied Documentation" is written for Edgy ;-)
<ogra> oh, we have no help center anymore
<LaserJock> we do
<LaserJock> it's just topic based
<LaserJock> we don't have a help menu
<ogra> yeah
<LaserJock> just System->Help
<LaserJock> ok, lts.conf replaced
<ogra> yay, thanks
<LaserJock> anything else?
<ogra> not currently, no ...
<knix_> still hanging at 85%, :(
<ogra> what does console4 say ? (hit alt-f4)
<knix_> well it looks like i need to plug it in to the network, i did not know this
<tidrion> knix_ is your install hanging at 85?
<tidrion> knix_ thats what mine was at when I left home
<knix_> tidrion, for like an hour
<tidrion> knix_ crap, I don't have a network on mine yet either, need a hub for it
<ogra> you shouldnt need any network for installs
<knix_> but know that i am looking at the console thanks to ogra, it is installing
<ogra> i usually test the isos on an unplugged laptop
<tidrion> ogra: it asks a bunch of times to setup even after you tell it not to
<knix_> woot - cleaning up phase
<tidrion> ogra: I skipped what it would let me, but mine was at 85% as well
<ogra> did you file a bug on debian.installer for that ?
<tidrion> ogra; nope
<ogra> *debian-instaler
<knix_> tidrion, check the console when you get home
<ogra> grmbl
<ogra> *debian-installer
<ogra> now its right
<tidrion> knix_ I will, thanks
<knix_> you guys take it easy, lata
* tidrion can't wait for edubuntu to install, loves ubuntu and thinks his kids will love edubuntu
<ogra> make sure you have the addon cd ... it has many of the edu apps now
<tidrion> ???
<ogra> in feisty edubuntu was split to a two CD release
<tidrion> Ahhh cool
<LaserJock> ogra: are you going through the whole handbook now?
<ogra> no
<ogra> i just closed it .. i just checked the neural points i found last time i looked
<ogra> and i didnt find any other weird stuff yet ... i'll have a close read on the weekend
<LaserJock> ogra: ok, the only other thing I see is the About Edubuntu
<ogra> you mean the icon ? or the text in yelp ?
<LaserJock> the text
<LaserJock> there's a "What's New" section
<LaserJock> I wonder if that's really for Feisty or Edgy
<ogra> not i mine
<ogra> *in
<ogra> at least not in:  yelp ghelp:about-edubuntu
<ogra> # 1.About the Name
<ogra> # 2.Free Software
<ogra> # 3.The Difference
<ogra> # 4.The Desktop
<ogra> # 5.Version and Release Numbers
<LaserJock> there isn't a "What's new in Edubuntu 7.04"?
<ogra> # 6.Backing and Support
<ogra> # 7.What is Linux?
<ogra> # 8.What is GNU?
<ogra> thats all i have here
<LaserJock> ohhh
<ogra> 0.6-1
<LaserJock> hmm
<tidrion> !enter :-)
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about enter :-) - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<tidrion> !enter
<ubotu> Please try to keep your questions/responses on one line - don't use the "Enter" key as punctuation!
<LaserJock> ogra: I was just looking at doc.ubuntu.com as I'm at work
<ogra> ah
<tidrion> :-) got used on me last night, had to try it
<ogra> that part appears fixed ...
<LaserJock> k, cool
<ogra> 0.5-1 had that wrong with dapper data
<LaserJock> I'll commit what I have here and wait for further stuff from cbx33 and your review over the weekend
<ogra> ok
<tidrion> anything I can do to help guys
* tidrion is a copy editor, online marketer and PHP, ROR programmer exploit him at your will
<tidrion> :-)
<ogra> tidrion, we'Re currently working through the documentation for the release ... do you run feisty ?
<tidrion> nope
<tidrion> but I can
<tidrion> no I can't
<ogra> proofreading is always welcome
<tidrion> no ppc version :-(
<ogra> as well as install tests and software tests
* tidrion is also a mac fan boy
<ogra> i havent cared much for ppc this release as we dropped official support for it ... but i hope i can do at least some testing before feisty is out
<ogra> there should be a ppc iso on ports.ubuntu.com i think
<tidrion> what?
<tidrion> no PPC support?
<LaserJock> no offcial support
<LaserJock> it's community supported now
* tidrion hates that word :-)
<ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ports/daily/current/
<tidrion> the official one not community
<ogra> oh. its oversized ...
<tidrion> score ogra, I'll install on my old iMac gladly proofread
<tidrion> ?
<ogra> will only work from DVD
<ogra> until i find time to chop it
<tidrion> dang
<tidrion> my iMacs only have CD drives
<tidrion> still can proofread
<ogra> install edgy and upgrade :)
<ogra> upgrade tests are good as well :)
<tidrion> !upgrade
<ubotu> For upgrading, see the instructions at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UpgradeNotes
<tidrion> will do
<tidrion> sorry, needed the instructions fastest way I could think of
<SnrWhippy> hey tidrion you using edu then?
<tidrion> both
<tidrion> ubuntu 6.06 edubuntu 6.10
<SnrWhippy> excellent do you work in a school?
<tidrion> nope, doing it for my kids, mom sits on the technology board and I've walked her through edubuntu she loves it
<tidrion> and that was off the live cd :-)
<SnrWhippy> good stuff yeah its great for home use. I'm trying to get used to it so i can run our school off it
<SnrWhippy> bit more complicated its all m$ where i work
<tidrion> lol, always an issue
<tidrion> funny thing was that I inherited my moms old pC, I've been a mac guy since I was 12 and win just totally crawled on this machine, put ubuntu on it and sprang to life
<SnrWhippy> just drivers always the trickiest in linux i always have trouble with graphics and wifi cards
<tidrion> loved the distro and its offspring ever since
<tidrion> my wifi card went smooth, my actual graphics card still doesn't work but the onboard does so thats what I'm using right now
<tidrion> I don't even know what GFX card is in that machine
<tidrion> no label, code anything
<tidrion> can't wait to get a new one
<SnrWhippy> yeah not nice
<tidrion> that machine should totally rock once I slap some more ram and a GFX card in it
<SnrWhippy> yeah always good to pack in the ram
<tidrion> my company is having a fire sale going to buy up some iMacs on the cheap and try running server and client
<cliebow__> tidrion, be sure they have open firmware
<jgedeon> cliebow__: Thank you for your help all the systems are up and running now.  Thanks again!  You saved what little hair I had left.  LOL
<cliebow__> heh,...what did you find out??
<cliebow__> like stale nfs mounts maybe?
<jgedeon> cliebow__: no after taking the IP address out it started working.  Nothing after that was changed.  It was just acting up or something.
<cliebow__> well glad you arte back in action just the same..
<SnrWhippy> anyone good with wine?
<sbalneav> ogra: ping
<ogra> pong
<sbalneav> See planet?
<sbalneav> Guess who blogged.
* ogra looks
<ogra> whee, a long one !
<ogra> thanks for the praise :)
* ogra still didt get around to post his italian sightseeing phototour
<sbalneav> I don't know why my titles keep getting doubled.
<tidrion> cliebow__ open firmware?
<tidrion> cliebow__ do all macs not have it?
<LaserJock> SnrWhippy: drinking it? ;-)
<sbalneav> SnrWhippy: What do you need?
<SnrWhippy> sorry was in other room
<SnrWhippy> yeah drinking it is easier than understanding it
<cliebow__> before a certain time g3 had no open firmware..no netboot..i think macs should be fine..but since i cant be sure what they call the things..it might not hurt to verify
<SnrWhippy> ive got it installed but its like now what
<SnrWhippy> i need an example prog that works
<sbalneav> Well, what was it that you WANTED to use wine for?
<SnrWhippy> i tried google talk and wine didnt run it well at all
<tidrion> cliebow__ what is the easiest way to check
<SnrWhippy> to emulate windows apps
<ogra> ********* Reminder edubuntu meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 10 minutes **********
<SnrWhippy> i was hoping on running a few windows apps with wine
<cliebow__> if you got one boot and quick hold down cmd-opt o f at the same time..
<cliebow__> good exercise if nothing else
<sbalneav> Well, some will work, and others won't.  Best way to learn is to try the ones you want.
<SnrWhippy> how do i direct a question to someone in gaim too
<sbalneav> Ask the question, and if someone knows, they'll answer :)
<tidrion> yeah, I do
<tidrion> I've done that never knew that meant open firmware
<tidrion> thats where i run reset-all
<tidrion> clears up so many issues
<tidrion> SO MANY ISSUES
<tidrion> :-)
<cliebow__> Scottie..nice to sse your mug again 8~)
<sbalneav> :)
<cliebow__> right now a better solution for me would be a sohrt pier to drop em off
<sbalneav> SnrWhippy: at winehq.org, they've got a great database of which windows apps work, and how well they work.
<sbalneav> You might want to check thay out.
<SnrWhippy> yeah i looked at that but it never really explained the process of getting them to work
<SnrWhippy> do you just download an app and run it by typing wine setup.exe in terminal?
<SnrWhippy> and keep your fingers crossed
<sbalneav> Yep, that's about it.
<SnrWhippy> oh really? excellent what do you run in wine?
<SnrWhippy> its nice to hear if anyone uses anything usefull
<sbalneav> I've run a bunch of things in wine.  Several legal programs here at work,
<sbalneav> and at home, for the kids, Warcraft 3, and Starcraft.
<pips1> ah, the games :)
<SnrWhippy> yeah lol always the games
<SnrWhippy> maybe i should try UT
<SnrWhippy> theres probably an ubuntu install though
<sbalneav> Me, I prefer playing warzone2100.  I like tanks :)
<pips1> I've installed Internet Explorer with wine - for website compatibility testing
<ogra> ********* Reminder edubuntu meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 1 minute **********
<cliebow__> ogra:i'll look in from home..
<ogra> ********* Reminder edubuntu meeting in #ubuntu-meeting now **********
<SnrWhippy> yes ie with wine was it easy!
<SnrWhippy> pips1 thats perfect
<SnrWhippy> would be great if i could use ie tab in firefox
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<Burgwork> RichEd-1: ping
<pips1> ogra: just want to run a couple of quick questions of issues I ran into testing 7.04 beta by you...
<pips1> small issues I noticed (tell me if you *aren't* aware of these)
<pips1> GDM Options: icons missing
<pips1> Update-manager: Visible Carriage Returns in German localisation
<pips1> Gcompris: crash after clicking 'Start TuxPaint'
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> thats odd, indeed tucpaint isnt installed by default anymore since the switch to the addon CD
<pips1> right
<pips1> but I have installed tuxpaint from the add-on cd...
<ogra> gdm is known, i'm wroing on it
* pips1 checks again
<ogra> u-m is worth a bug if there isnt one already
<ogra> but given that mvo is german i guess he will see it in time for release :)
<ogra> gcompris needs deeper lookin at ... can you file a bug for that ?
<pips1> ok
<pips1> erm, is tuxpaint available on the add-on cd at all?
* ogra was so happy it works all out of the box in ltsp now .,.. including sound ...
* pips1 pops the add-on cd in
<ogra> yes
<ogra> all the tux* stuff
<ogra> paint/math/tape should be on there
<ogra> *type
<ogra> god i'm to tired to type today
<pips1> I got math & type
<ogra> hmm, i'll check that ...
* ogra makes a note
<pips1> I can't find tuxpaint
<ogra> probably the .desktop file is missing ...
<ogra> i will check before herd6
<ogra> these four are all your complaints ?
<pips1> If I search for it in the add software launched from the add-on, it doesn't show up
<ogra> yeah thats happening if the .desktop file is missing ...
<ogra> as i said i'll look at it
<pips1> well, my real problem is that I can't get the thin client to work
<pips1> my testing has only been on the server itself so far, the thin client fails at the initial dhcp stage
<pips1> I guess it's a problem with my local network setup
<ogra> did you check the cdhcp settings and the static interace etc ?
<ogra> and did you switch off dhcp on your router etc ... you know the drill
<LaserJock> is the tuxpaint think related to bug #32252
<ubotu> Malone bug 32252 in tuxpaint "Installs two desktop launchers in different sections" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/32252
<pips1> shouldn't I be able to simply plug in my "internet network" on one interface (with a running dhcp server from the dsl modem/router dishing out an ip for the edubuntu server),  and have a separate thin client network on the other NIC ?
<pips1> ahhh
<pips1> so I *do* need to switch off dhcp...
<ogra> no not if you have a two nic setup
<pips1> sorry, I thought that it all worked automagically now
<ogra> i didnt know you updated your LAN :)
<ogra> it does
<ogra> but network-manager breaks things
<pips1> huh? how?
<ogra> check if it works if you never logged in on the server
<pips1> h
<ogra> then your client should work properly
<ogra> as soon as you logged in and NM started it will mess up your network
<ogra> its a known bug in progress atm
<LaserJock> hmm, tuxpaint doesn't install a .desktop to /usr/share/applications/ at all
<pips1> is network-manager that avahi thing for zeroconf, or whatnot?
<ogra> no
<pips1> duh
<ogra> avahi is something else
<ogra> NM manages your network devices
<ogra> due to a bug it manages all of them atm
<ogra> but its only allowing one at a time to be up
<pips1> ah, ok, ic
<LaserJock> ogra: mind if I fix up tuxpaint?
<pips1> so at the moment, I need to install and *not* log onto the server and then it migh work
<pips1> *might
<ogra> right
<ogra> NM is started in your gnome session
<ogra> as long as gnome doesnt run it doesnt want to manage anyting
<pips1> from what you just told me about the know bug with network-manager, I assume it is that issue which is causing the error message that pops up on the desktop, telling me that "Network service discovery is disabled"
<ogra> no, thats avahi
<pips1> ah, different thing
<ogra> unrelated
<pips1> what's that then?
<pips1> "Your current network has a .local domain, which is not recommended and incompatible with the Avahi network service discovery. The service has been disabled."
<ogra> what it says
<ogra> it wont work in a network with .local domain
<ogra> obvoiusly you have such a thing
<pips1> ??
<pips1> not intentionally, not that I know of
<ogra> anyway its no important
<ogra> and i need sleep i'm working here since 8am
<pips1> yikes
<LaserJock> ogra: if I fix up tuxpaint I'll send you a debdiff
<pips1> ok, last thing: should I file this bug for tuxpaint? (and against what package)?
<ogra> LaserJock, i'm not sure its tuxpaints fault
<LaserJock> ogra: tuxpaint installs it's .desktop to non-standard places
<ogra> its likely the CD itself (app install data for it)
<LaserJock> seems like that is the likely reason
<ogra> ok
<pips1> oh, just to be clear on this issue: is tuxpaint actually a dependency of gcompris?
<ogra> no
<ogra> then it would be instaled
<pips1> it would seem so, since there is a "hardcoded" (?) button in the gcompris menu "start tuxpaint"
<LaserJock> tuxpaint is a Suggests:
<ogra> Suggests: gnuchess, gnucap, tuxpaint
<ogra> pips1, thats why i said pleas file a bug
<ogra> i'll care for it
<LaserJock> I would think it would be Recommends:
<pips1> 0k, what should I file it against, so you will find it
<ogra> gcompris
<pips1> ok
<ogra> indeed
<pips1> duh
<pips1> :-)
<flubber> hello
* ogra now goes to try to fix his relationship ... since he forgot about the meeting ... and had promised different things for the evening
<pips1> I just noticed that when I click on the gnuchess button, I get an error message (slightly better than crashing) ;-)
<LaserJock> ogra: good night
<ogra> ciao
<pips1> good night, ogra
#edubuntu 2007-03-29
<wizzy> fp
<cliebow> pfff
<flubber> sljf
<flubber> sorry
<kinema> I'm looking into the possibility of setting up a few Edubuntu based kiosks in public library.
<kinema> Are there any tools to enable session time limits?
<sbalneav> Evening all
<atu-> hai,wanna ask please, can anyone tell me where i can find the guidelance for translating edubuntu wiki to my local language?
<atu-> *guidelines *sorry*
<allee> AFAIR the clients use an NFS mounted root fs, right?  In case I'm right, which pkg contains this edu-client kernel that supports NFS root fs?
<juliux> morning
<LinuxProbie> hey folks
<LinuxProbie> so I did the walkthrough to get my wireless card on my inspiron working in feisty and now it doesn't even show up in iwconfig. can anyone help?
<LinuxProbie> So, I am getting totally turned off to linux now because of this issue.
<Tm_T> LinuxProbie: for that issue, you prolly have more help in #ubuntu etc
<frandavid101> hiya!
<frandavid101> I installed thin-client-manager-gnome and am trying to try it, but I don't know how
<frandavid101> is there a command I need to run?
<cliebow> frandavid101, re tcm..cbx33 should be able to help you
<juliux> ogra, ping
<knix_> morning all
<chowmeined> Hello, I have been assigned the task of figuring out if we can implement edubuntu in our school's labs.. Could any of you provide some advice or pointers to documentation for integrating edubuntu into our windows environment (active directory)?
<jsgotangco> well you have to go to a different type of documentation that is specific to samba
<chowmeined> I understand working with samba but I mean are there any specific tools available in edubuntu to make this process easier?
<cliebow_> years ago for several years we used winbind to authenticate to ad
<cliebow_> it was not trivial..and toward the end had to cron a samba/winbind restart every hour
<chowmeined> with the terminals is there any way to configure specific terminals permanently?
<chowmeined> such as.. the terminals in this lab always get that printer set as default etc
<jsgotangco> chowmeined: none at the moment unfortunately
<jsgotangco> but if you look at future developments, there is one
<jsgotangco> http://www.advogato.org/person/Burgundavia/diary.html?start=126
<chowmeined> ah, how interesting
<sbalneav> Morning all
<sbalneav> ogra: Hey, loaded the latest nightly build last night, looked OK
<sbalneav> ltsp chroot built properly
<highvoltage> sbalneav: yay!
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<sbalneav> The /etc/network/interfaces got updated properly too,
<sbalneav> but NetworkMangler is still interfering with it.
<sbalneav> And! I was so proud of myself, I actually figured out why my USB audio card wasn't showing up as /dev/dsp, and instead was showing up as /dev/dsp1
<sbalneav> in /etc/modprobe.d/alsa-base:
<sbalneav> # Prevent abnormal drivers from grabbing index 0
<sbalneav> options snd-usb-audio index=-2
<sbalneav> I don't know if that's a bug or not.  One supposes there should be some kind of logic there to ensure that onboard gets selected first, THEN a usb audio card, if there is one, and if no onboard audio, then just fall through.
<highvoltage> sbalneav: that's interesting
<sbalneav> There's a long story with this USB audio card of mine.
<sbalneav> It's a SoundBlaster Audigy NX 2, really nice unit.  Lots of inputs and outputs.
* highvoltage has never used one before
<sbalneav> I bought it 3 years ago.  And at the time, Linux didn't know what to do with it.
<highvoltage> I considered getting a usb soundcard/phone for skype/ekiga at some point though
<highvoltage> heh
<cliebow_> i fiddled with one in breezy and edgy for a customer..
<cliebow_> the sb
<sbalneav> So I sat on it.  For 2 years.  Every time a new kernel would come out, I'd try it again.  Nope, still not working.
<sbalneav> Then, about a year ago, it started getting functional.  So I'm happy :)
<highvoltage> usb devices in general seems to be more standardised and faster supported all the time
<cbx33> sbalneav: w00t
* cbx33 has a delta 1010 lt
<cbx33> that works great in linux ;)
<cbx33> 10 in 10 out
<sbalneav> cbx33: See my blog post?
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> link me
* jsgotangco had no money to buy such toys
* cbx33 didn't buy it;)
<jsgotangco> brb
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: don't lie. we all know you're loaded!!!
<highvoltage> ;)
<cbx33> ["Rock Hard! Ride Free! All day, all night!"]  - see I knew he was lying
<highvoltage> heh
<bddebian> Heya
<highvoltage> hey bddebian!
<bddebian> Heya highvoltage
<highvoltage> bddebian: will we be seeing you in Sevilla?
<bddebian> Probably not. :'-(
<bddebian> Hopefully Boston though
<highvoltage> ok :(
<cliebow_> Boston?
<bddebian> I've heard that that is where the feisty+1 UDS will be
<highvoltage> bddebian: I believe feisty+1 UDS will be in Sevilla
<bddebian> Well feisty +2? :-)
<highvoltage> (since feisty will already be released by then)
<highvoltage> ah, ok
<knix_> I havent setup up edubuntu server in awhile and need alittle help.  I am trying to setup the dhcp server part.  Do I edit dhcpd.conf to specify the ip range and all?
<cliebow_> knix_:seens so...if you've done ltsp-server-standalone the relevant file will be /etc/lts/dhcpd.conf
<knix_> ty, let me see how it goes
<knix_> every time i start the dhcp server it fails, where can i see the log for this?
<cliebow_> err syslog or messages?
<knix_> ty
<cliebow_> your subnet must match the clients ip address
<knix_> great
<knix_> Is it possible to import a text file for the users?
<LaserJock> knix_: what do you mean?
<knix_> I should of clarified more
<knix_> I have many students here at my job, and instead of creating each user manually, is there any other way to import windows users in edubuntu?
<LaserJock> ah
<LaserJock> I don't know of a tool to do that
<knix_> ok, just checking
<LaserJock> but I put up a project idea for the Google Summer of Code to such a tool
<knix_> great
<cliebow_> knix_:should be able to do an ldifde from active directory and do agrep to get usernames..if that is where you are coming from
<cliebow_> passwords will not transfer...but you can generate new ones and pass em out
<knix_> greatness
<knix_> ty
<knix_> sorry for all the ? but, how do I get x11vnc installed on the client?  I did install it on the server
<LaserJock> I don't think you need it installed on the client do you?
<cliebow_> this 4.2?
<LaserJock> or maybe you do
<LaserJock> I'll just shut up and let cliebow_ do all the talking
<cliebow_> you only need it on client..
<LaserJock> ;-)
<cliebow_> blahblahblahdeblah
<knix_> lol, ok how do you install it on the client? If the client resides on the server
<cliebow_> but it "could"be used to see the :0 desktop on sever
<cliebow_> well install inthe chroot
<cliebow_> no one listens to me anyway..
<knix_> install in the chroot?
<cliebow_> welll that will be the clients filesystem..
<knix_> hmmm
<sbalneav> Back
<knix_> ok, If i have the internet nic unplugged, my thin client can connect to the server.  If I plug the internet nic in, my dhcp-server fails
<cliebow_> if student-control-panel says import studentcontrolpanel.ltcm but what exists is /tcm/ltcm.py
<knix_> i have no idea what your talking about cliebow
<knix_> i dont have scp installed
<sbalneav> knix_: Do you have a dhcp server on your internet gateway box?
<sbalneav> They may be conflicting
<mcsd> does anyone know the default root password for the live cd 6.10?
<knix_> sbalneav, yes
<knix_> sbalneav, how do I reslove this?
<sbalneav> Well, how many nics does your edubuntu box have?
<LaserJock> mcsd: there is no root password in Ubuntu
<knix_> sbalneav, 2
<LaserJock> mcsd: the default user is ubuntu I *think*, although it could be different for edubuntu
<sbalneav> knix_: What's the IP address of each of them?
<mcsd> I installed the live cd to my harddrive creating a user called test
<sbalneav> Then log in as the user test
<sbalneav> That user will have admin rights.
<mcsd> so I show test@test which means I have a user test that belongs to the test group right?
<mcsd> so there is no root user by defualt?
<sbalneav> No, there isn't
<mcsd> !commands
<ubotu> The linux terminal or command-line interface is very powerful. Open a terminal via Applications -> Accessories -> Terminal (Gnome) or K-menu -> System -> Konsole (KDE).  Manuals: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BasicCommands
<knix_> well the one is which is DCHP on my network in my school is 10.5.5.2, and the dhcp-server on edubuntu is 192.168.0.254
<sbalneav> mcsd: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RootSudo
<sbalneav> knix_: Have you been in here before for this?
<knix_> maybe like a year agao
<knix_> but my memory is shot
<knix_> :)
<mcsd> when I do a sudo passwd root does that create a root profile because it prompts for the root=test password then the password change
<sbalneav> mcsd: Creating a root password isn't really recommended, but yes, that will enable root to log in.
<sbalneav> knix_: What I'd do is, go into /etc/default/dhcp3-server, and set the interface to only be for the ethx that the terminals are on.
<mcsd> so I dont have to use adduser I can just do passwd and assign a password and it will create that user by default...is this bad practice
<knix_> sbalneav, i did that,
<sbalneav> You haven't got the internet nic and the thin client nic connected to the same switches, do you?
<knix_> nope, dif switches
<sbalneav> So, what happens when you try to boot a thin client?
<knix_> well if the dhcp-server fails to start, obviously nothing
<LaserJock> mcsd: it's not the Ubuntu recommendation to enable the root password
<LaserJock> but that's the way to do it if you want it
<sbalneav> Well, when the dhcpd server fails to start, what messages do you get in /var/log/daemon.log?
<knix_> let me check
<sbalneav> mcsd: The root user already exists.  It just has the password disabled.
<mcsd> does my user test have less permission than root?
<knix_> no subnet declaration for eth0
<LaserJock> mcsd: not really
<LaserJock> mcsd: it does, but sudo allows you to "act" as root
<sbalneav> knix_: Please paste the contents of your /etc/default/dhcp3-server, /etc/network/interfaces, and /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf file to the pastebin.
<sbalneav> !pastebin
<ubotu> pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<knix_> i will, i have to setup for a meeting in a few minutes, ill brb
<mcsd> which is what I should be doing anyway right?... I should never be loged in as root for security reasons rigjt
<sbalneav> mcsd: It's best to run as root as little as possible.
<sbalneav> I run an entire network of Ubuntu machines, and I don't have any root passwords set.
<mcsd> sbalneav: thanks
<Burgwork> mcsd: setting root passwords is a great way to get yourself into trouble
<LaserJock> Burgwork: but .. but ... Linux has been doing it for years ;-)
<Burgwork> LaserJock: ....
<sbalneav> It's not so much as having a root password will get you into any MORE trouble, if it's a GOOD root password.  However...
<sbalneav> Nothing you do as root is logged.
<sbalneav> Whereas, EVERYTHING you do as sudo is logged.
<sbalneav> So, if you muck something up, you can go back in the logs, and see what happened.
<sbalneav> And, even better, sudo allows fine grained control over what commands
<Burgwork> plus, if you have an employee leave, pulling root privs is so much easier
<sbalneav> Yep
<Burgwork> now I just wish that switches and routers could auth against ldap
<sbalneav> And, in a branch office, I might decide to give the head secretary access to the lprm command, so that they can delete mucked up print jobs from anyone.
<sbalneav> So, it just provides SO much more flexibility than the all-or-nothing root password.
<LaserJock> exactly
<knix_> sbalneav, i think the issue is with the subnet and netmask be for and ip of 192.168.0.254?
<sbalneav> Can you paste /etc/network/interfaces, /etc/default/dhcp3-server, and /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf to the pastebin?
<knix_> it will take some work, i have to email it to my self so please give me a second
<sbalneav> sure
<knix_> sbalneav, http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/12778
<sbalneav> in your dhcpd.conf
<sbalneav> should be "subnet 192.168.0.0 netmask 255.255.255.0"
<knix_> yup, just realized that and changed it.
<knix_> dhcp server is still failing
<sbalneav> Also, uncomment authoritative.
<sbalneav> Did you restart the dhcpd server?
<knix_> sbalneav, yes, it fails
<knix_> would you like to the log for the fail?
<sbalneav> Yes, please
<knix_> sbalneav, http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/12781
<knix_> do i need to edit /etc/dhcpd3/dchpd.conf?
<sbalneav> no, /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
<sbalneav> What does ifconfig eth0 return?
<knix_> the static ip does not show up
<sbalneav> Well, that'd be a problem then.
<sbalneav> What version of edubuntu are you running?
<knix_> fesity beta
<sbalneav> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
<knix_> y
<sbalneav> NetworkMangler is borken
<sbalneav> I have the same problem.
<knix_> jesus christmas
<knix_> hahahahahahaha
<knix_> well i want to thank you for trying to help me
<sbalneav> Wondered why you were having this, I assumed you were edgy
<knix_> nah, i wanted to try the new one
<sbalneav> Network Manager is currently screwing up static interfaces.
<sbalneav> We are VERY aware of this problem :)
<knix_> great
<knix_> i am happy
<knix_> i just wont use the inet
<sbalneav> If you're looking for something to work NOW, then use edgy.  Otherwise, keep doing those updates. :)
<knix_> how about x11vnc on feisty?  having that issue to?
<knix_> roger
<sbalneav> I haven't tried doing that, so if there are issues, I haven't seen them yet.
<sbalneav> I know cbx33 put a lot of work into TCM, and it's supposed to work.
<sbalneav> But I haven't gotten that far in my testing yet :)
<knix_> ok, i install x11vnc on the server and it says that i have to install it on the client
<knix_> God, i love the artwork for feisty
<highvoltage> goodnight edubuntuland!
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: goodnight
<edubuntugirl> goodnight, highvoltage. I'll keep an eye out for the MS spies while you sleep.
<highvoltage> great
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: choose tomorrow will be a good day or tomorrow will be a bad day
<edubuntugirl> I choose tomorrow will be a good day, highvoltage
<highvoltage> makes sense, it is Friday afterall
<LaserJock> wow, you really need a life ;-)
<highvoltage> I think what I need is a good night's sleep, been only having 3-5 hours a night for the last week
<highvoltage> LaserJock: http://jonathancarter.co.za/ubuntu-certified
<highvoltage> ^^^^ in your face!
<highvoltage> goodnight LaserJock
<LaserJock> haha
<telexicon> cool
#edubuntu 2007-03-30
<telexicon> I am pretty sure I have dhcpd set up correctly but I can't get other machines on the same network to lease addresses... I think it has something to do with my switch any ideas?
<racter> hi all - just installed edubuntu server on a test machine and it seems to have missed my second ethernet card during installation; is there some process to try autodetection again or reconfigure manually?
<jgedeon> racter: did the install tell you that you would have to configure dhcp3.conf manually?
<jgedeon> should say dhcpd.conf
<racter> yeah it did
<racter> "there are no free interfaces for use with the ltsp server"
<racter> but now that i'm installed, ifconfig only sees the one card
<jgedeon> Hmm.
<racter> the card seems like it's functional (the light comes on when i plug it in).  but even if i swap it out i'll need to do something to reconfigure /etc/network/interfaces or whatever, right?
<jgedeon> lspci | grep Ethernet only shows the one card?
<racter> oh actually no it shows both of them
<racter> i was just looking at ifconfig
<jgedeon> What does ifconfig eth1 show?
<racter> eth1: error fetching interface information: Device not found
<jgedeon> the lspci | grep Ethernet what does it show for the second missing card?
<jgedeon> They are both wired cards correct?
<racter> yeah
<racter> 00:0a.0 Ethernet controller: Accton Technology Corporation SMC2-1211TX (rev 10)
<racter> that's from lspci
<jgedeon> Ok let me look something up.
<racter> thx
<jgedeon> Do you have another card that you could drop in the computer?
<racter> sure, i'll try that -- is there anything i need to run in order to reconfigure it?
<racter> like `dpkg-reconfigure networking` or something?
<jgedeon> lets just see if we can get it up with one first once your up then we can do the configuration.
<racter> ok i'll brb
<jgedeon> wb racter
<racter> thx ;)
<racter> things are kind of in pieces here so i only have 01 terminal at the moment :)
<jgedeon> I know the feeling.  LOL
<jgedeon> is it showing both cards now?
<racter> so i still get "device not found"
<racter> and ifconfig only has one card
<racter> but i was wrong about which one was working before - it was the 'accton' one that i posted that's up as eth0
<racter> the new card i put in is 'Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL-8139/8139C/8139'
<jgedeon> So what card is it not seeing then?
<jgedeon> Onboard?
<racter> no it's a card
<racter> no onboard ethernet on this machine
<jgedeon> OK.
<jgedeon> so you have a realtek and what installed on the system?
<racter> they're both pci cards
<jgedeon> Are they two realtek cards?
<racter> eth0 which is up and connected to the internet is 'Accton technology corp' and the other is the realtek one
<jgedeon> and its not seeing the realtek?
<jgedeon> lspci | grep Ethernet
<racter> lspci sees it but ifconfig doesn't and `ifconfig eth1` says 'device not found'
<jgedeon> Ok...
<racter> `ifup eth1` gives 'unknown interface eth1=eth1'
<jgedeon> You can use etherconf to reconfigure it you want.  Youi may have to apt-get it.
<racter> cool i'll check that out
<racter> so what's your relation to the edubuntu project?
<jgedeon> After you have it installed if you need to run it again you can use dpkg-reconfigure etherconf
<racter> got it
<jgedeon> No relation..  I just like the project and run one server here at home for the family and am putting some in the local school district here for testing.
<racter> cool - do you work for the school district?
<jgedeon> Not really work.  I sit on the districts tech committee and am now on the Board of Directors for the eschool that we are starting in September.
<jgedeon> Are you using this at home or somewhere else.
<racter> i run a community computer lab & we're trying to move to some kind of terminal server setup
<racter> we have been using xubuntu individually installed but want to be able to support even lower-end hardware and benefit from the administration tools in ltsp setups
<jgedeon> Ok.  If you have dhcp running elsewhere on the network you may run into issues.
<racter> i have a dhcp server running on my router but the terminals will be plugged into a switch connected to the second card in the edubuntu server; right?
<jgedeon> Ok that is one way to do it.
<racter> aha it's up now (as eth2)
<jgedeon> LOL
<racter> weird
<racter> is there another way to do it?
<jgedeon> The system here at home I run with a single card and let the firewall do the dhcp and passing of information that is why I was asking.
<racter> huh - how is the internet connection integrated?
<jgedeon> Internet is still passed through the network.
<jgedeon> Just not running dhcp off the system..
<jgedeon> did you get my PM?
<racter> hm i guess i don't know how to work this irc client ;)
<jgedeon> Ok no registered nick then...  Do you didn't get it.
<racter> nm i got it
<jgedeon> what does cat /etc/iftab show?
<racter> just eth0 mac 00:10:b5:50:2a:32 arp 1
<jgedeon> racter: keep me posted on how things are going.  Would be interested in hearing.
<jgedeon> or reading.  LOL
<racter> thx will do :)
<racter> jgedeon: so you have ppc and i386 clients running side by side?
<jgedeon> racter: not at this time.  I need to get the ltsp client build and then put it on my edubuntu server to host it to the clients.
<jgedeon> Right now only hosting i386 clients.
<racter> so if i build /opt/ltsp/ppc on a ppc machine and then put it in /opt/ltsp/ on my server which is i386, i can serve ppc clients?
<racter> (our lab is 50/50 ppc and i386)
<kgoetz> dont think so
<jgedeon> according to the guess at ltsp basically that is all that has to be done.
<jgedeon> There is a little more too it but that is the basics.  Let me see if I can find it.
<jgedeon> you need to run ltsp-build-client on the correct architecture
<jgedeon>  if you want a ppc client, you need to run ltsp-build-client on a ppc server
<jgedeon>  then, once that's done, you can transfer the result to a x86 server
<jgedeon> Once done you will copy over /opt/ltsp/ppc/*
<cafuego_> And you'll need yaboot entries in the tftpd server config
<jgedeon> install PPC edubuntu on a PPC server, copy over the /opt/ltsp/ppc tree and kernel, and then trash the PPC install
<cafuego_> and enable bootp on the dhcp server.
<jgedeon> it is that easy - besides setting up dhcpd.conf
<cafuego_> I've found it's a PITA to distinguish between PPC and x86 clients in dhcpd.conf
<sbalneav> Evening all
<cafuego_> So is specified a comman nfs_root and then used yaboot.conf to override that for the ppc clients
<kgoetz> sbalneav: hello
<jgedeon> that is what I have from talking to the guys at #ltsp to get it running.
<jgedeon> sbalneav: hello.
<jgedeon> if substring (option vendor-class-identifier, 20, 3) = "ppc" {
<jgedeon>         option root-path "192.168.0.254:/opt/ltsp/ppc";
<jgedeon>      } else {
<jgedeon>         option root-path "192.168.0.254:/opt/ltsp/i386";
<jgedeon>      }
<racter> oic
<racter> great i'll try that out
<jgedeon> racter: after you do the ppc build would you be willing to make it available some how so that it can be downloaded?
<racter> yeah sure
<racter> i'll bz it up and send you a link
<jgedeon> my email address is joe.gedeon@gmail.com then I can get to work on the school even more than then get the lab built and then show it and get them converted.
<jgedeon> It won't take much to get them converted right now at all and get them away from M$
<bimberi> I though it was possible to do 'sudo ltsp-build-client --arch ppc'
<bimberi> to make the /opt/ltsp/ppc tree
<kgoetz> bimberi: apparently only on ppc machines, just as you can only build i386 on x86 or x86_64
<jgedeon> bimberi: I'm not sure.  I was just going off of what I found out from #ltsp and other sources off the internet.
<bimberi> k
<jgedeon> Had to try it.  LOL
<jgedeon> ERROR: unsupported architecture. Check your --arch argument: ppc,       supported values are: i386 powerpc,error: LTSP client installation ended abnormally
<jgedeon> joe@full-edubuntu:~$ sudo ltsp-build-client --arch powerpc
<jgedeon> ERROR: --arch powerpc called on unsupported arch: i686,error: LTSP client installation ended abnormally
<racter> it's zipping now - it builds as /opt/ltsp/powerpc and not /opt/ltsp/ppc
<racter> (building on imac g3)
<jgedeon> KEWL!
<jgedeon> Probably going to be something like 300mb
<bimberi> ah yes, s/ppc/powerpc/ :)
<jgedeon> racter: can you also make available /var/lib/tftboot also.
<racter> sure
<jgedeon> Going to make 50 teachers happy and one sys admin PISSED!  LOL
<jgedeon> racter:  thought you might like to read.  http://elliot.ecowizards.com/wp/archives/2006/05/18/ltsp-booting-old-mac-hardware/
<racter> thanks joe -- the /opt/ltsp/powerpc bzip is only 114M and it's uploading to http://dai5ychain.net/static/ltsp_powerpc.tar.bz2
<racter> should be up in 5-10 min
<racter> /var/lib/tftpboot is at http://dai5ychain.net/static/tftpboot.tar.bz2
<jgedeon> Ok THANK YOU!
<jgedeon> Does anyone know if the Student Control Panel Upgrade is going to be in the fiesty release and/or if the edgy release will be able to upgrade to the new features of it?
<jgedeon> racter: I grabbed the tftpboot..
<jgedeon> The ltsp* still uploading?
<racter> jgedeon: ya 37%; should be another 10min i guess
<jgedeon> ok
<racter> are there logs for this channel somewhere?
<bimberi> !logs
<ubotu> Channel logs can be found at http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs
<racter> thx
<bimberi> yw
<XoMa> Hellow all!
<XoMa> Please help me. I'm download dvd image from http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/dvd/current/, but can't burn him.
<XoMa> Error: content too big.
<racter> dhcpd is still failing even though i have my interface up at eth1 now
<racter> just tried dpkg-reconfigure dhcp3-server and i got the same nondescript "[fail] " as with /etc/init.d/dhcp3-server restart
<racter> is there somewhere that i can see some more detailed information?
<racter> or maybe `dpkg-reconfigure edubuntu-server` will try to set things properly?
<racter> \quit
<XoMa> Hello all!
<XoMa> Please help me. I'm download dvd image from http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/dvd/current/, but can't burn him. Error: content too big.
<LaserJock> XoMa: what are you trying to burn it on?
<XoMa> feisty-dvd-i386.iso
<LaserJock> XoMa: but what kind of media?
<LaserJock> I assume it is a dvd
<XoMa> dvd-r and dvd+r discs
<LaserJock> XoMa: it must be thinking it's trying to burn a CD
<XoMa>  LaserJock:  I burnt an image on dvd, instead of copied as a file
<LaserJock> yes, but I wonder if it thinks it's a CD, not a DVD
<XoMa> LaserJock: In the size in 4.4? :)
<XoMa> LaserJock: log from GnomeBaker: Executing 'builtin_dd if=/home/mikheev/Downloads/ISO/feisty-dvd-i386.iso of=/dev/hdc obs=32k seek=0' :-( /dev/hdc: 2298496 blocks are free, 2325316 to be written!
<XoMa> LaserJock: In the size in 4.4 GB? :)
<Burgundavia> yay! ltsp rocks. I wish I could use it internally at Userful
<XoMa>  I tried to burn in the console so: "growisofs -overburn -speed=1 -Z /dev/dvd=feisty-dvd-i386.iso" and "growisofs -dvd-compat -overburn -speed=1 -Z /dev/dvd=feisty-dvd-i386.iso"
<LaserJock> XoMa: hmm, it could be they are just too big
<LaserJock> XoMa: you might want to try the Herd 5 DVD
<XoMa> All discs is bad :(
<LaserJock> Burgundavia: then do it ;-)
<Burgundavia> LaserJock: my boss has vetoed it
<LaserJock> tell Tim he can just take that Fedora/RHEL disk and ...
<LaserJock> ;-)
<Burgundavia> indeed
<Burgundavia> LaserJock: i forgot, did jason send you a new desktop-multiplier tarball?
<LaserJock> nope
<LaserJock> I don't think so
<LaserJock> let me check my email to make sure
<XoMa> Ahead Nero v.7  yas not helped.
<LaserJock> Burgundavia: ahh, he did give me URLs for them
<LaserJock> Burgundavia: did you do a UVFe?
<Burgundavia> nope, will do taht tomorrow
<LaserJock> XoMa: have you tried Herd 5 disks?
<LaserJock> Burgundavia: k,subscribe me to the bug when you do
<Burgundavia> will do
<XoMa> LaserJock:  To me it is necessary Edubuntu, and download the second image I cannot
<LaserJock> XoMa: I don't quite understand you. Are you asking if it's necessary to download the server addon .iso?
<XoMa> By means of what program it is possible to change iso an image, having kept it as loading?
<XoMa> LaserJock: To me it is necessary Edubuntu.
<XoMa> LaserJock: I am limited in limits on the Internet.
<XoMa>  Excuse for bad English.
<LaserJock> XoMa: well, you don't *have* to have the server addon CD
<LaserJock> but it has all the educational software
<LaserJock> XoMa: where are you from?
<XoMa> Russia
<LaserJock> XoMa: do you know if there is a Russion Ubuntu channel?
<LaserJock> they might be able to help as well
<XoMa> Give me a link, please.
<bimberi> !ru
<ubotu>    #ubuntu-ru       /  Pozhalujsta vojdite v #ubuntu-ru dlq pomoshchi na russkom qzyke
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> ;-)
<XoMa>  Thanks
<XoMa> :-[
<bimberi> :)
<rockprincess> moin all!
<cbx33> ping RichEd
<cbx33> ogra on feisty, what do we have to do to get thin clients booting
<cbx33> should it be ootb?
<cbx33> cos....well....my thin clients don't seem to want to boot up?
<highvoltage> cbx33: someone posted last night that it was working with a daily build
<cbx33> oh
<cbx33> so beta is b0rked?
<highvoltage> beta should be fine afaik
<cbx33>  /bin/sh: can't access tty; job control turned off
<highvoltage> pre-beta had a problem though in the ltsp-server package
<cbx33> (initramfs)
<cbx33> that's it
<highvoltage> cbx33: can you reboot that client, and check for RPC errors during boot?
<cbx33> didn't see any
<cbx33> maybe I'll tell it to boot without splash
<highvoltage> check if nfs is running fine on the server
<cbx33> yeh nfs seems fine
<cbx33> berooting
<cbx33> nfsmount: need a path
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> it seems to be confused
<cbx33> about it's ipaddess
<cbx33> 192.168.145.128 and 192.168.0.250
<cbx33> keeps trying with different stuff
<cbx33> well it's b0rked
<highvoltage> cbx33: :-(
<cbx33> trying to get hold of ogra
* highvoltage wonders what oculd possibly cause that
<cbx33> i have no idea
<cbx33> i don't need to configure anything now do i
<cbx33> it should work ootb
<cbx33> we have a preshipped dhcp don't we
<highvoltage> yep, should work out of box
<highvoltage> dhcpd.conf is indeed pre-shipped and should be in /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> swat i thought
<cbx33> maybe it's vmware....but it's always worked fine
<cbx33> but it normally works fine
<ogra> cbx33, make sure to not log in on the server after boot ... network manager is broken and reconfigures your static interface so the clients cant boot ... Mithrandir is working on a fix afaik
<cbx33> ahh
<cbx33> well then that's the problem
<cbx33> is there anything i can do?
<ogra> according to sbalneav it works fine for him until NM kicks in
<cbx33> ogra: can i have a few mins of your time... -> pm - important
<ogra> uninstall NM or wait for the fix ... in some cases it works to ifdown/ifup the interface after NM did its magic
<ogra> (i.e. for me if it has the dhcp wlan interface running i can just ifdown/up the static one )
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> trying now
<cbx33> is that after disabling NM?
<cbx33> did we know that icons in gdm are broken?
<cbx33> the gdm login screen
<cbx33> ogra: did you get that
<cbx33> https://beta.launchpad.net/bugs/30459
<ubotu> Malone bug 30459 in gdm "Icons in GDM options menu are broken" [Medium,Fix released] 
<cbx33> is back
<ogra> sigh
<ogra> who filed that
<ogra> i'm just uploading the fix
* ogra redos the package with the bugfix info
<ogra> ah, its not edubuntu specific ... ok
<cbx33> yeh that bug is old
<cbx33> sorry ogra just doing my testing bit
<ogra> its fine, i just thought i needed to add it to the changelog, i wasnt aware there was this old bug
<ogra> but its not related to the current breakage anyway
<cbx33> no
<sbalneav> Morning all
<SimonAnibal> Morning, sbalneav
<sbalneav> Morning SimonAnibal
<bddebian> Heya
<mcsd> How old is Hoary?
<tsurc> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HoaryHedgehog
<tsurc> April 8, 2005
<ogra> he already left
<sbalneav> ogra: On specific edubuntu things, where's what I've found on my testing
<ogra> hoary isnt supported anymore
<sbalneav> LTSP build chroot is ok
<ogra> ok
<sbalneav> Second cd apps install fine
<ogra> i'm just doing th elast changes here ...
<sbalneav> Artwork is great
<ogra> (to ltsp)
<ogra> artwork was fixed today ...
<sbalneav> Was it broken?
<ogra> so the menu logo is the right one and th emenu in gdm has icons
<mcsd> so to walk in on the conv but are you guys talking about building a live cd?
<ogra> no
<ogra> we're talking about our edubuntu feisty tests
<mcsd> ohhh I only ask because this tutorial https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LiveCDCustomization
<ogra> and the last fixes before release
<sbalneav> The handbook link doesn't work, but you knew about that.  I notice under "System" menu there's both a "About Ubuntu" and "About Edubuntu".  Might we get around the problem in yelp by simply adding another menu item for "Edubuntu handbook"?
<ogra> yelp was uploaded today
<ogra> should fix the handbook
<sbalneav> ah
<sbalneav> ok then.
<sbalneav> You're too flipping fast for me. :)
<ogra> about edubuntu will get you to that
<ogra> we'll keep about ubuntu this time ...
<sbalneav> excellent
<ogra> if people dont complain i'll keep it later as well, i dont think we need to hide it ...
<mcsd> sorry...this tutorial https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LiveCDCustomization says you have to use a Hoary build
<sbalneav> Other than that, I think things are looking good.  I'm going to do a bit more work on the handbook this weekend, and do the ltsp testing as well.
<mcsd> is there a more current one...am I going to run into problems using that tutorial?
<sbalneav> Do you have a "checklist" wiki page that we can fill out like last time?
<ogra> i'll go over that handbook during the weekend and make sure to close some more ltsp LP bugs
<ogra> yes, there is one somewhere ... dont ask me where :)
<ogra> Testing/Current from the wiki should link to it i guess
<ogra> im just trying to imitate the old ltsp kernel by generating an initramfs with a fixed module list based on the kernel config ... lest see if that speeds up something
<ogra> i'm slightly worried about bug 97456
<ubotu> Malone bug 97456 in ltsp "eBox 2300 boots VERY slow with Ubuntu/LTSP-5" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/97456
<ogra> what strikes me is that you compiled nfs into the kernel ...
<ogra> while we use a module from initramfs
<ogra> i wonder if the constant timeout probs are caused by that
<sbalneav> I wouldn't think that there'd be much of a performance penalty between loading the module, versus statically compiled.
<sbalneav> Other than the penalty of initially loading the module.
<ogra> right
<ogra> which might cause a delay that leads to a timeout
<ogra> if the initramfs defalting takes long on a slow cpu for example
<ogra> *deflating
<ogra> sbalneav, well, according to the logs the ltsp kernel is a *lot* faster with its initramfs ...
<ogra> (jammcq's logs on the bug i mean)
<ogra> even though i blame the speedup jammcq sees mainly on the fact that the ubuntu kernel is compiled for 586 and the ltsp one for 486
<sbalneav> Hmmm
<sbalneav> Wonder what would happen if you compiled a custom kernel not -generic, but with -i386 specifiically.  Everything else the same.
<ogra> we dont use -generic in ltsp
<ogra> there was one herd build where i had to use -generic ... but apart from that we always used -i386
<sbalneav> So, THAT's not the issue then.
<ogra> oh, right i totally missed that jammcq used generic as base
<Laser_away> ogra: as of yelp 2.18.0-0ubuntu3 you should be able to see the handbook in the yelp frontpage
<ogra> yeah, seb128 already told me and recived a big hug :)
<Laser_away> heh
<Laser_away> I also got TCM text from cbx33
<Laser_away> just waiting on some screenshots
* Laser_away is really away for a whil
<Laser_away> +e
<ogra> thats what you always pretend
<mcsd> "can't find /home/test/mnt/ebunto-6.10-live.iso in /etc/fstab or etc/mtab" trying to mount a live cd iso for custom build
<mcsd> did a "sudo mount ebunto-6.10-live.iso -o loop"
<stgraber> mcsd: sudo mount -o loop you-iso-file.iso adir/
<stgraber> mcsd: you have to pass it the directory you want it to mount your iso on
<Borealisphoenix> hello?
<Burgwork> hey Borealisphoenix
<Borealisphoenix> It's working...thnk god
<Borealisphoenix> I have not chatted like this in more than 10 years I think
<Borealisphoenix> HOw's it going
<Borealisphoenix> Pardon my lack of experience but is everyone on the list in the same room?
<sbalneav> Not everyone on the list is in the room, and not everyone in the room is on the list.
<sbalneav> However, several of us are on both :)
<sbalneav> Myself included
<Borealisphoenix> hehe thanks
<Borealisphoenix> I am tryin gto find someone I can talk to about the Edubuntu live CD
<sbalneav> What is it you need to know?
<Borealisphoenix> I am alittl econfused on how to get it to work...I put the CD in and restarted and I got the menu
<Borealisphoenix> When I Tryied the option of starting it started loading a couple files then gavce me a message about the computer being 32bit
<Borealisphoenix>  then stopped working
<Borealisphoenix> I don't like to play around with programs that boot from CD's so I'd rather find out what I am doing wrong than mess everything up
<Borealisphoenix> YOu there?
<sbalneav> What was the message exactly?
<Borealisphoenix> Give me a moment I'll run over to other comp
<Borealisphoenix> ok powering on pooter
<Borealisphoenix> O...K somethings up I can't start it...(notebook maybe needs power hooked up)
<Borealisphoenix> Says "your CPU can not support long mode. (forgot from there to here) Something about getting a 32bit distrabution
<sbalneav> Which live cd did you download
<Borealisphoenix> I looked at the ISO and it says it's edubuntu-6.10-live-i386.iso
<sbalneav> Seems like it's the 64 bit version
<sbalneav> How far does it get in the boot?
<Borealisphoenix> it brings up saper folder loading with "............................................." after it
<Borealisphoenix> after the second file address it goes black then posts the message
<sbalneav> It could be a bad burn of the cd
<Borealisphoenix> this is the web page I am at that I downloaded it from     http://ubuntu.cs.utah.edu/releases/edubuntu/edgy/
<Borealisphoenix> I used the program that the sight suggested
<sbalneav> Maybe try re-burning it.
<Borealisphoenix> Something I should do to have it burn better?
<sbalneav> Don't know.  What did you burn it with?
<Borealisphoenix> Infrarecorder This is the sights suggestion for burning the ISO
<sbalneav> Not familiar with it, so I don't know, but I'd try burning it again, at least.
<Borealisphoenix> Should I increase the size of secondary buffer?
<sbalneav> Try, maybe.
<sbalneav> I haven't used windows since 1998, so I don't know much about that burning program :)
<Borealisphoenix> hehe
<Borealisphoenix> Concepts whould be the same in burning
<Borealisphoenix> Hardwares hardware
<Borealisphoenix> I've looked on google and have founf alot of people having same error one had a CD he ordered
#edubuntu 2007-03-31
<grzegorz> hello!
<grzegorz> Hello! Does anyone knows where I can download Edubuntu 6.10 AMD64 DVD Image ? Torrent or FTP ? There are Edubuntu 6.06.1 AMD64 DVD's available (even with seeds!) but 6.10 AMD64 DVD's dissapeared everywhere! Please help!
<jgedeon> !logs
<ubotu> Channel logs can be found at http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs
<cliebow_> anyone using nxclient in ppc feisty?
<rockprincess> hello friends!
<rockprincess> hello? anyone here?
#edubuntu 2007-04-01
<cliebow_> Whoa: last updates healed my wireless card..
<sbalneav> Evening all
<Burgwork> hey sbalneav
<sbalneav> Hello Burgwork
<Em`Zee> I'm getting errors with ltsp-build-client...
<Em`Zee> root@heidi:~# ltsp-build-client --arch powerpc
<Em`Zee> ERROR: --arch powerpc called on unsupported arch: i686,error: LTSP client installation ended abnormally
<sbalneav> Em`Zee: What are you trying to build it on?
<sbalneav> A i386 based machine?
<Em`Zee> sbalneav; Yes.... that's bad, I take it.
<Kamping_Kaiser> its unsupported ;)
<Em`Zee> D'oh.
<Em`Zee> Is there any way to boot Sparc/PPC off of an Edubuntu i386 LTSP server ?
<sbalneav> Sure
<Em`Zee> Basically I'm running a lab with ancient computers, SPARCstations, and pre-Intel Macs.
<sbalneav> But you'll need to build the chroots on Sparc/PPC machines respectively
<Kamping_Kaiser> <3 sparcstations
<Em`Zee> sbalneav; would I just take an edubuntu livecd and basically tar the tree?
<sbalneav> Then tarball them up, and stick 'em in /opt/ltsp on the i386
<sbalneav> Em`Zee: No, install edubuntu on a sparc, then do the ltsp-build-client on the sparc.
<Em`Zee> got it
<Em`Zee> Next (probably stupid) question...
* Kamping_Kaiser thinks debs to install a basic chroot would be cool (for just this purpose)
<Em`Zee> Does it matter, X binary-wise on multiplatform?
<sbalneav> At one point, we were talking about having pre-built chroots available for download and untar, don't know if that's been done yet.
<Em`Zee> It runs all binaries on the central server, no exceptions, yes?
<sbalneav> No! That's one of the beauties of X
<sbalneav> Sparc client == PPC client == Intel client, for X
<Em`Zee> woo.
<Em`Zee> :D
<Em`Zee> LTSP saved my life for adminning the lab. LTSP is <3
<Em`Zee> Anyways
<Em`Zee> when I do the chroots for Sparc and PPC I'll post them on my websie
<Em`Zee> *website
<sbalneav> Yeah, when you run firefox on a sparc client, you're running the firefox on the i386 box, but the pretty bits display on the sparc.
<sbalneav> That's why I got involved in helping to develop LTSP 7 years ago: it's such an awsome paradigm
<Em`Zee> My plans eventually include syncing authentication to an LDAP server
<Em`Zee> instead of having root@heidi:~# ltsp-build-client --arch powerpc
<Em`Zee> ERROR: --arch powerpc called on unsupported arch: i686,error: LTSP client installation ended abnormally
<Em`Zee> whoops
<Em`Zee> hehe stupid clipboard
<Em`Zee> anyways, instead of making one account for each machine
<Em`Zee> (we name our machines after [not my idea]  porn stars >.<)
<Kamping_Kaiser> LMAO
<Em`Zee> Yeah so we have "Tawnee Stone", "Tori Stone", "Linda Lovelace", "Heidi Fleiss", "Aurora Snow" all on one wall
<Em`Zee> those are some of the LTSP machines
<Em`Zee> the windows ones are named after male porn stars
<Em`Zee> the Mac ones used to be Transvestites but then we decided to quit supporting mac in the lab
* Kamping_Kaiser giggle
<racter> so can i use the live cd to boot a machine in thinclient mode?
<racter> the bios on this machine doesn't seem to know about netboot
<Kamping_Kaiser> racter, no, but iirc you can do boot floppies
<sbalneav> racter: No, but you can go to rom-o-matic.net, and download a etherboot floppy image for your network card.
<racter> it has to be floppy or is there a way i can use a CD?
<sbalneav> There's CD images there too.
* Em`Zee needs to find some tiny old HDs and put netboot images on them :\
<Kamping_Kaiser> :/
<cliebow> Em`Zee, i have tarballs for ppc
<ernierasta> I have a question, how can I install programs on client (I am using edubuntu 7.04 as ltsp server, server is amd64, but clients i386)? I set up everything, and it is working, but I want to install x11vnc on client. Is there someone who want give me some advices?
<ernierasta> it is question about ltsp
<merriam> ernierasta: chroot to /opt/ltsp/i386/ or similar.
<merriam> But I've done that and I still couldn't make x11vnc work.
<ernierasta> merriam: i know, but in chroot apt-get can not find x11vnc
<merriam> You need to change the sources...
<jgedeon_> ernierasta: this will help  understand sources https://help.ubuntu.com/community/HowToCookEdubuntu/Chapters/LTSPManagement
<ernierasta> thank you, i have not much experiences with debian-based distros
<cliebow> merriam:i am usiong it alot in 4.2..not sure about 5...you get xlib error?
<merriam> cliebow: I've been running edubuntu feisty beta with defaults.  I forget the details.  I've switched to ubuntu on that box for now because I couldn't log in on the server with edubuntu.
<merriam> I'm not the only one, am I?  When I log in on the server I get serious errors and long waits, and the panel doesn't respond.  ltsp clients work nicely.
<cliebow> gnome-settings-maNAGER?
<cliebow> error?
<cliebow> anyway..you can read my x11vnc stuff for 4.2 if you like
<merriam> I think so.  But it seems there are more serious problems.
<Em`Zee> cliebow; Did you say you had a tarred chroot for ppc?
<cliebow> i do
<cliebow> http://169.244.3.137/ powerpc.feisty.tar.gz
<cliebow> and  powerpckernel.feisty.tar.gz
<cliebow> i think you'll have to add the yaboot bits
<Em`Zee> yaboot?
<cliebow> the kernel loader for ppc
<cliebow> not unlike pxe;linox.0
<cliebow> yeah it is n there..place yaboot and yaboot.conf in /var/lib/tftpboot and point to ya boot in dhcpd.conf
<Em`Zee> How do you make the macs netboot anyways?
<Em`Zee> Is there a key to hit?
<cliebow> if security-mode=none hit the n key..how old are these?they Do haave open firmware right?
<cliebow> Em`Zee, http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/CpuArchitectures
<Em`Zee> cliebow; We're talking like 400MhZ G3s
<cliebow> as long as cmd-opt-o-f  brings up opfw
<cliebow> ealy ones..like bo ndis may require a reservation
<sbalneav> Afternoon all
<juliux> hi sbalneav
<sbalneav> Hello juliux
<knix_> Has network-manager been fixed yet in feisty?
<sbalneav> not sure
<knix_> sbalneav, ty
<sbalneav> Not yet, apparently.  My static interface still isn't up :)
<knix_> sbalneav, hehe i hear ya,  ty
<racter_> is there a way to burn one of these rom-o-matic.net boot floppies onto a CD?
<cliebow> 1bootfloppy
<cliebow> !bootfloppy
<ubotu> grub is the default Ubuntu boot manager. Lost grub after installing windows: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RecoveringUbuntuAfterInstallingWindows - Making GRUB floppies & other GRUB howtos: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/GrubHowto
<sohail> anyone have any suggestion on how to teach drawing a triangle in logo without introducing trig?
<cliebow>  cliebow: "bootfloppy" is http://etherboot.anadex.de or ftp://k12linux.mesd.k12.or.us/pub/K12LTSP/Universal_boot_flopp
<cliebow> hmmm
<cliebow> should be a univgersal boot cd..
#edubuntu 2008-03-24
<joebake1> Thanks for the comments.
<joebake1> I want to install server johnny_ because  this laptop has a dual core centrino with 3 gigs of RAM and it is screaming fast.  So I'm thinking of demonstrating it as an LTSP server.
<stgraber> RichEd-2: I have something that will be useful with classmates and similar setups using iTalc. I have a working avahi integration script that should work with both LTSP setups and workstations setups.
<stgraber> RichEd-2: I have that working with ugly bash scripts, will write something cleaner tomorrow (probably using python)
<RichEd-2> great :) i'm busy testing the classmate now ...got a few minor hassles ... working through them
<RichEd-2> maybe you have an idea on this one ...
<RichEd-2> i can configure the wireless network manually on the command line using iwconfig and ifconfig
<RichEd-2> but network manager says wlan0 does not exist
<RichEd-2> so i am having to reconfigure the wlan each time i rebot
<RichEd-2> *reboot
<RichEd-2> bit of a pain
<stgraber> and the NIC name doesn't change ? or is something like wlan0_rename at some point (that's the kind of weird thing I had with some intel NICs)
<stgraber> NM logs everything in syslog so you should be able to get more details from it
 * RichEd-2 wil look
<solifugus> Where is the dhcp configuration file?
<solifugus> I need to see how it is configured...
<solifugus> normally, it would be /etc/dhcp.conf  but it isn't..
<solifugus> on edubuntu
<helpmewithhomewo> any any body know stuff on mtn. like their type ex dome, fold, fault..i need to know them for the ghats, drakensberg, ander, atlas, ruwenzori, cameroon. thanks
<ioanna> i'm wondering if anyone may be able to help me
<ioanna> i run a tiny private school and need help with download and installation
<Kamping_Kaiser> ioanna, i'm sure someone can try and help out
<ioanna> thanks
<ioanna> i don't have a working CD drive, can i still install it from just the simple download
<ioanna> or do i save it to a zip drive, or what is recommended
<Kamping_Kaiser> you need to install from cdrom. either an ubuntu cd or an edubuntu cd can be used, because you can download some extra tools onto an ubuntu system and make it into edubuntu
<ioanna> i cant do that as i dont have a working CD drive
<ioanna> im currently downloading edubuntu 7.10
<Kamping_Kaiser> its posable to network install, but thats much more complicated
<ioanna> so in other words, i will need to hire someone to install ubuntu
<Kamping_Kaiser> or find a working cd burner/cdrom (to burn and install off)
<ioanna> okay
<ioanna> thanks
<johnny> or a big usb flash drive possibly..
<johnny> 1gb
<ioanna> who could i ask who would know for sure if i could use a flash drive
<johnny> the internet?
<johnny> a working cdrom drive is a good thing to have tho
<johnny> and they are cheap
<ioanna> my firmware is corrupted for both my cd and dvd drives
<ioanna> i have a hacked windows box
<Kamping_Kaiser> flash sticks are a bit iffy, as bios has to support it
<johnny> yes.. the bios has to support it for sure
<ioanna> i see
<johnny> usually private schools .. even tiny ones can afford to spend the $10-20 USD to get a new cd drive tho..
<ioanna> how do you install the driver tho
<ioanna> for the new drive :P
<johnny> they don't need drivers
<johnny> for windows nor linux
<ioanna> ah, okay
<johnny> which windows/
<johnny> ?
<ioanna> XP
<johnny> then you just need an iso burn option
<johnny> there's a free utility mentioned
<johnny> on the ubuntu install doc
<ioanna> i will look that up, thank you
<johnny> sadly windows xp doesn't let you do it by default :(
<ioanna> naturally
<ioanna> bbiab, thanks for your help
<ioanna> :)
<talntid> Hi all :)
<talntid> Anyone knowledgable alive tonight? :)
<talntid> got an issue that seems unsolvable..
<kgoetz> !ask
<ubotu> Please don't ask to ask a question, ask the question (all on ONE line, so others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely answer. :-)
#edubuntu 2008-03-25
<McEnroe> Oversimplyfied, is edubuntu = ubuntu + ltsp?
<kgoetz> yes
<kgoetz> ubuntu+ ltsp+ educational apps
<manu_ubu> hi
<kgoetz> hi
<manu_ubu> for testing the beta edubuntu can I do choose the alternat Ubuntu and use option on boot LTSP ?
<kgoetz> not sure.
<kgoetz> ogra_cmpc: was working on new installing doco
<manu_ubu> the beta edubuntu is out or no ?
<kgoetz> yeah
<manu_ubu> thank I go download and testing Edubuntu 8.04
<ogra_cmpc> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/HardyClassroomServer
<ogra_cmpc> manu_ubu, its not finished yet but should list all steps
<manu_ubu> ok thank
<stgraber> ogra_cmpc: Did you have a look at italc_1.0.7-0ubuntu2 ?
<ogra_cmpc> stgraber, preparing an upload now, i was afk for the last four days
<stgraber> ogra_cmpc: I'm also working on rewritting the ica-launcher and italc-launcher to use avahi for computers detection
<ulysee798> Newbie question, I have Edubuntu 7.10 and Capio 5 thin client. I am booting with PXE and I see the boot screen with Edubuntu loading on the Capio but then just get a command prompt not a login page. Anyone help?
<stgraber> ogra_cmpc: that way we'll have automatically generated classroom for both LTSP and standard workstation environement
<ogra_cmpc> cool
<ogra_cmpc> ulysee798, do you know what kind of graphics card these devices have ?
<ulysee798> ogra_cmpc, graphics is onboard. I have opened one up but can't see any identifying chips other that the realtek Lan and a Winbond chip
<ogra_cmpc> ulysee798, create an /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf file
<ogra_cmpc> put in the following lines:
<ogra_cmpc> [default]
<ogra_cmpc> SCREEN_02=shell
<ogra_cmpc> SCREEN_07=ldm
<ogra_cmpc> if you then boot a client you have a shell on console 2
<ogra_cmpc> that gives you access to tools like lspci to find out about the VGA controller etc
<ulysee798> ogra_cmpc, OK will do. Do I have to log in to chroot and do it from a terminal or can I use gedit from the desktop?
<ogra_cmpc> you have to boot a terminal after adding that file and hit alt-f2 at the running client
<ulysee798> ogra_cmpc, Ok will try that and see what info I can glean from it. thnx
<ulysee798> ogra_cmpc, after reboot at the root@ltsp:/# prompt lspci returns a SiS 550 graphics chipset - during the boot there were lots of messages of failed module etc.
<ulysee798> ogra_cmpc, many thanks for your help - I deleted SCREEN_02=shell and SCREEN_07=ldm and replaced with XSERVER="vesa" and now the boot splash appears and I can login. Is there anything else the lst.conf needs for sound etc on a sis chipset?
<ogra_cmpc> if you have a sis 7019 there is no way to make it work with modern kernels yet ... sis didnt release any specs and the old oss driver doesnt really work (choppy sound if you move the mouse etc)
<ogra_cmpc> oh, and that oss driver isnt licensed anyhow so it might not even be legal to make it work even if you manage to patch it to compile with newer kernels
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: I'm getting set to do all my edubuntu stuff this morning
<LaserJock> I grabbed the edubuntu-docs translations and will get that uploaded
<LaserJock> the squeak stuff is just messy. I've gotten 0 response from the main maintainer
<LaserJock> but I think I got a decent solution for Hardy
<ogra_cmpc> as long as you get it past pitti :)
<LaserJock> well
<LaserJock> since Debian is using squeak-vm as the source package name I don't need to go through source NEW ;-)
<ogra_cmpc> right *g*
<LaserJock> I used the debian/copyright from our old package
<ogra_cmpc> evil guy you :)
<LaserJock> since it's the exact same licensing files, etc. in the newer package
<LaserJock> so we can't be any worse than our current package
<LaserJock> and I think it's better really
<LaserJock> there's no way that thing is GPL
<ogra_cmpc> i dont actually think anyone ever cared about squeak licensing ever ... apart from distributorsx
<LaserJock> as Matej and Lex were claiming
<LaserJock> the new one is very nice though, MIT and fairly well documented
<ogra_cmpc> neither apple (who own parts) nor upstream ...
<LaserJock> but it just doesn't seem to work very well
<ogra_cmpc> well, SVN you said
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> it's not released
<LaserJock> but when I asked the author he seemed to not remember the GPL/Squeak-L thing
<LaserJock> so whatever
<LaserJock> but I did the work to register the squeak Firefox plugin with the Ubuntuized browsers
<LaserJock> so that it'll hopefully show up in the automatic plugin installer
<ogra_cmpc> woah
 * ogra_cmpc is impressed
<LaserJock> asac helped me out
<LaserJock> I did quite a bit of work on these packages
<LaserJock> I'd rather not throw them away
<ogra_cmpc> yeah
<LaserJock> they also added a binfmt thingy
<LaserJock> so that supposedly a person can click on a squeak image and it'll open up in the VM
<ogra_cmpc> nice
<LaserJock> the Debian package just dies if you try to run it with some bash error
<ogra_cmpc> OLPC is doing good for squeak users it seems
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> I think that was probably a big push for the licensing
<gvy> halo
<gvy> ogra_cmpc, ayt?
<ogra_cmpc> gvy, i am, but extremely busy, i was planning to come to #ltsp later tonight and write a mail as well if i have time ... sorry for that harsh reaction, it was a bit over the top
<gvy> ogra_cmpc, please forgive me
<ogra_cmpc> submit your code :)
<gvy> ~50% done :)
<ogra_cmpc> yay :)
<gvy> now reworking the patch part
<gvy> ogra_cmpc, vagrantc and warren decided to help merging it, vagrantc has a hard time talking to me w/o you
<ogra_cmpc> seriously, i had a bad day and you just were the person to mention it once to much the apology has to come from my side ...
<ogra_cmpc> i'll be back, i just need to sort out a lot work stuff that stacked up over easter
<gvy> ogra_cmpc, i knew it upon reading the replies -- been in your shoes :(
<gvy> yup, thanks!
<ogra_cmpc> :)
<ogra_cmpc> even scottie called me last night ... i didnt want to cause so much fuss
<ogra_cmpc> gvy, thanks for the #, noted down (unregistered user here, cant reply to PM)
 * juliux sends ogra_cmpc a glass of wishky
<ogra_cmpc> i still have the johnny walker here (didnt drink it last time) :)
<cliebow_> ogra:We Love You
 * LaserJock gives ogra_cmpc a hug
<cliebow_> cliebow does likewise!
 * ogra_cmpc hugs everyone back :)
<ogra_cmpc> thanks guys :)
<cliebow_> 8~)
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: \o/ !! I got squeak working on amd64
<ogra_cmpc> yay
<LaserJock> the plugin seems to crash firefox on amd64 though
<LaserJock> but I think it works on i386
<LaserJock> the plugin stuff is a bit sketchy
<LaserJock> built for old netscape browsers
<ogra_cmpc> tried it in a 32bit env for firefox on the amd64 machine ?
<ogra_cmpc> i.e. lib32 and nspluginwrapper
<LaserJock> I'll try it real quick
<LaserJock> I do happen to have a 32bit firefox
<calimer> heya LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi
<calimer> remember how we talked about platinum arts sandbox a while ago?
<calimer> well I'm working on a version where all the content is "debian free"
<LaserJock> yeah
<calimer> and it is called Lite I have a person who is interested in maintaining the deb package (she asked actually if you'd be interested in being a comaintainer)
<calimer> and well it should be all set soon, I actually am sending her a test package for it
<calimer> I just wanted to communicate to you about the Lite version since we haven't talked in a bit, and its status
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> well, unfortunately I'm really busy with my dissertation
<LaserJock> I don't think I could comaintain it
<calimer> wow congrats on being at that level
<calimer> and no worries she just wanted me to ask
<LaserJock> but I could give advice and help were I could
<calimer> awesome, yeah every bit helps
<calimer> that's how things get improved
<LaserJock> bbiab
<LaserJock> bdoin: what's the current gcompris version?
<bdoin> Latest stable is 8.4.4
<bdoin> why ?
<LaserJock> we have 8.4.2 in Hardy
<bdoin> LaserJock: not too bad probably but for sure 8.4.4 is better.
<LaserJock> are there any specific bug fixes we could backport to 8.4.2?
<bdoin> why backport ?
<LaserJock> right now we are pretty far along to request a whole new upstream version
<bdoin> you can read the ChangeLog in trunk, it's well maintained and accurate
<bdoin> the most important is that there is 2 crash cases that where identified and fixed
<bdoin> This one is a must : "Fixed many potential crash of GCompris in the key_press activity callback. A crash has be verified in gletters (falling letters) if you enter a key while the bonus is displayed. (commit 3138)"
<LaserJock> ok, let me try to get  8.4.4 in
<LaserJock> I don't know if it'll be accepted but I'll give it a shot
<bdoin> there is also a new voice set (urdu)
<lns> Does anyone know how to globally set the firefox homepage for all users?
<blue-frog__> lns: the page is in .mozilla/firefox/profile/pref.js
<lns> blue-frog__, that doesn't help me for all users...
<lns> thanks though
<blue-frog__> lns: you change this file and you put what you want for start up page
<blue-frog__> as for new user, you put this file in /etc/skel so that new user will have it directly
<lns> blue-frog__, let me reform my question
<lns> i want to be able to have a mandatory default homepage of google.com for all of my existing users
<lns> i have ~200 existing users on my server
<blue-frog__> lns a script with find , for loop and sed would change this file for your user quite quickly
<lns> I guess that might be the only way
<lns> i saw this bug, looks like the 'real' way is broken in gutsy
<lns> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/19033
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 19033 in firefox "systemwide default startup homepage ignored" [Medium,Confirmed]
<blue-frog__> dunno if it's the only way but it won't take long to do
<lns> ty blue-frog__
<blue-frog__> but then the problem with that is they can change it to what they want
<blue-frog__> did you read https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FirefoxMandatoryPreferences
<lns> blue-frog__, yes
<lns> that didn't work for me at all
<lns> oh i didn't install obscure-tool or whatever that is
<blue-frog__> having a look at it now...
<lns> eww..firefox-dev
<lns> don't really want to install that on production server
<lns> in addition to that, prefs in /usr/lib/firefox will be overwritten upon upgrades
<lns> it's supposed to look in /etc/firefox/* but the above mentioned bug causes it not to
<lns> :( i find there are many global-configuration tools missing from *buntu..i wish i had the resources to hire a programmer to fill in the gaps
<blue-frog__> lns the firefox.cfg lockdown works perfectly...
<lns> blue-frog__, i'm sure it does, but i don't feel comfortable installing firefox-dev for production use
<laga> lns: why?
<lns> unless i'm misunderstanding the concept of -dev packages
<laga>  This package contains the development headers, idl files and static libraries
<laga>  needed to develop applications using Mozilla Firefox.
<lns> laga, oooh wait those are just EXTRAS, it doesn't replace the firefox package installed right?
<laga> yeah, basically
<lns> gotcah
<lns> damn, and i just got done writing my script =p
<lns> cool, thanks
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: squeak uploaded
<lns> laga, blue-frog__, now we still have the issue of firefox.cfg being overwritten when upgrading FF
<lns> but i guess it's not that big of a deal
<lns> considering it's nice that the user can't change their home dir (even though i could just chmod their user.js)
<blue-frog__> lns don't think it will be without asking you
<lns> blue-frog__, i remember debian always asked about config files, ubuntu seems to just replace (and possibly back up originals)
<lns> when upgrading
<lns> cool, the mandatoryprefs work nice
<lns> ty laga and blue-frog__
<blue-frog__> lns: they can bypass it if they edit their launcher and add a page at the end of the command though...
<lns> blue-frog__, well i already have the panels locked down
<blue-frog__> :)
<lns> ;)
<lns> i did find a way to "bypass" the mandatory homepage by setting preferences to start with a blank page instead
<blue-frog__> lns: how do you do that by the way, pls?
<lns> locking down panels?
<blue-frog__> i mean panels lock
<lns> here
<lns> http://lns.wikidot.com/gconf
<lns> i haven't finished all of the content but this should get you started
<blue-frog__> ty
<lns> yw!
<lns> k - if anyone read this conversation and wants a simple method for setting mandatory homepage for all users on a system, look here: http://lns.wikidot.com/firefoxmandatoryhomepage
<crazy_bus> I just got given a computer that has 140mb's of ram.  So it probably won't run the regular install.  Is there an install cd that can install on low memory systems?
<LaserJock> you might try xubuntu or fluxbuntu
<crazy_bus> ok.  I'll try that and install educational packages on top of that
<LaserJock> probably the way to go
#edubuntu 2008-03-26
<oxtub> exit
<RichEd> ogra_cmpc: ping
<stgraber> RichEd: Is it an early or a late meeting today ?
<RichEd> early ... looking for ogra_cmpc now
<RichEd> i have a manic day :(
<RichEd> anyone else here for the education meeting ???
 * gvy leaves for #ltsp
<stgraber> RichEd: looks like we'll be the usual 3, maybe 2 if ogra doesn't show up :)
<RichEd> ogra_cmpc is in #canonical ... he should pop across now
 * ogra_cmpcng waves
<highvoltage> ogra_cmpc: are you there?
<highvoltage> ogra_cmpcng: does it look anything like this? http://www.engadget.com/2008/03/24/intels-netbook-revealed-as-the-2go-pc/
<ogra_cmpcng> highvoltage, i'm not registered, no PM for me
<highvoltage> ogra_cmpcng: ah, of course
<highvoltage> ogra_cmpcng: I guess the ng would look something similar to this? http://www.engadget.com/2008/03/24/intels-netbook-revealed-as-the-2go-pc/
<highvoltage> ogra_cmpcng: when I first saw that, I thought it looked very cmpc'y :)
<ogra_cmpcng> well, i waont say anything :)
<ogra_cmpcng> *wont
<highvoltage> ogra_cmpcng: ok :)
<ogra_cmpcng> but the cmpcng here looks very cmpc'y ;)
<ogra_cmpcng> bah, the touchpad isnt great ... way to sensitive and the buttons somehow get you to tap while clicking
<ogra_cmpcng> not very ergonomic
<RichEd> stgraber / ogra_cmpc : intel just asked for some guidance iTalc
<RichEd> if either of you have a chance could you pop a mail reply to them ?
<RichEd> thanks
<stgraber> RichEd: AFAIK italc-client should currently be installed on the classmates, though italc-master (the teacher interface) isn't
<stgraber> it was planned to have italc-master running on a non-classmate machine
<RichEd> is it possible to let them know what is needed on the teacher desktop & how to connect them ?
<RichEd> no need for a full explanation ... pointing to the page in the iTacl doc manual is fine
<dtrask> as an italc user....italc master is a bit more intensive and the cmpc would probably have a hard time running it
<RichEd> with perhaps a comment on what is different about our implementation
<RichEd> and then point them to dtrask for free user support ;)
<RichEd> hi dtrask
<RichEd> ^ joke
<dtrask> LOL
<dtrask> :-)
<dtrask> I agree with stgraber though....when trying to look at and demo all those screens I think the cmpc would choke on its own vomit ;-)
<stgraber> RichEd: http://paste.stgraber.org/1987
<stgraber> dtrask: did you try 1.0.7 from Hardy ?
<dtrask> not yet
<stgraber> dtrask: we did quite a bit of optimization for low-resolution screen (resizing the image from the teacher, using MMX, ...)
<stgraber> RichEd: the "add classroom and computer" part will be automated with my avahi scripts, but that won't be in Hardy and I'm still thinking of an easy way to solve the "copy keys from teacher computer" part
<RichEd> thanks ... i am multi tasking ... on a conference call, adding moodle users, sending emails ... and trying to get out of here to an appointment in 20 mins
<RichEd> if you could pop me some info via email i could forward on that would make my day
 * RichEd asks nicely
<stgraber> I have 30min before the QA meeting, so I have time to answer your mail :)
<dtrask> stgraber: very cool....I look forward to trying it out
<dtrask> stgraber: hey for the keys part...take a look at an old project called "fanout" http://www.stearns.org/fanout   I've used this to do a lot of stuff with my own network here at school....looks relatively simple and there may be parts you can rip out and use....just FYI
 * dtrask is away: Lunch time...leave a msg
<LaserJock> hmm, did a meeting already take place today?
<stgraber> RichEd: mail answered
<stgraber> LaserJock: yep, it was an early one
<RichEd> thanks
<RichEd> stgraber: thanks
<LaserJock> darn, missed it
<LaserJock> I'm -----| |------ close to having edubuntu-docs uploaded
<LaserJock> just had to do some sed "fixing" of translations
 * RichEd measure the -|   |- with his micrometer
<RichEd> ahhh ... about 10 mins is that ?
<LaserJock> well, you need the right conversion factor to get it into time
<LaserJock> but something like that
 * ogra_cmpc cries ...
<ogra_cmpc> my build server just imploded
<LaserJock> uh oh
 * ogra_cmpc starts another try to get todays classmate image building
<ogra_cmpc> funnily it only fails after 3-4h of work ...
<ogra_cmpc> well, rather not funny
 * dtrask-away is away: I'm back!
 * dtrask-away is back.
<dtrask> I'm back!
<laga> wow
<laga> *four* lines to tell people that you're back
<stgraber> ouch, four lines to say you're back .)
<ogra_cmpc> we couldnt ignore that :)
<stgraber> bah, laga was fater
<stgraber> s/fater/faster/
<laga> stgraber: dude, my BMI is below 25 so you have no right to say that
<stgraber> :)
<LaserJock> hi dtrask
<dtrask> LaserJock: hi!
<dtrask> i screwed up....typed away instead of back
<dtrask> doh!
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: did you see I managed to get a little work done yesterday :-)
 * ogra_cmpc hugs LaserJock madly
<ogra_cmpc> yeah, i saw that
<LaserJock> and edubuntu-docs is off!!!
<Muhammad_Saad> Hello, I am a little confused about why formats like MP3 are called restricted formats. Would someone please explain it to me in simple words? I have searched at google but did not find something that explains this.
<LaserJock> Muhammad_Saad: it means in that in some countries (like the US and Japan) those formats are patented and so they can not be freely used without paying the patent holder, or something along those lines
<Muhammad_Saad> you mean that in those countries I cannot even record a sound in MP3 format without paying the patent holders?
<LaserJock> basically yes
<Muhammad_Saad> that is weird.
<LaserJock> yes, but that's the way it works
<LaserJock> many countries don't allow software patents and so it's not an issue for them, as I understand it
<Muhammad_Saad> so that is why I did not know much about that. :)
<LaserJock> Ubuntu would prefer to use completely free (both in prices and in license) formats because of things like that
<Muhammad_Saad> So if I send an audio file to someone who lives in a country which allows software patents, I am doing something illegal?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> but they may not be able to legally play it
<Muhammad_Saad> so it does not affect me?
<LaserJock> as far as sending files?
<Muhammad_Saad> what about receiving?
<LaserJock> it depends on the country
<Muhammad_Saad> ok
<LaserJock> and I don't know enough about it to know which countries it's ok in
<LaserJock> the US and Japan are the big ones I think that *do* have software patents
<Muhammad_Saad> if someone does not pay those companies, how do they know it?
<LaserJock> they don't :-)
<Muhammad_Saad> so one will only pay if that person's conscience is alive and awake. :)
<Muhammad_Saad> am I right?
<LaserJock> basically yes
<Muhammad_Saad> does it only affect software companies or end users too?
<Muhammad_Saad> I mean who really have to pay?
<LaserJock> end users
<Muhammad_Saad> according to the law?
<LaserJock> unless companies pay for the end users
<Muhammad_Saad> and big companies?
<LaserJock> that's how Microsoft, etc. do it
<Muhammad_Saad> ok
<LaserJock> it's something like $100,000 USD
<LaserJock> for companies
<Muhammad_Saad> so if someone installs VLC media player in US, he is doing something illegal?
<LaserJock> depending on the codecs installed they could be yes
<Muhammad_Saad> ok
<dtrask> Apple is an example of a company who pays for the end users...the bundle MP3 capability in itunes
<dtrask> all that and he just left?
<dtrask> hmmm
<dtrask> does he work for the RIAA
<drue> cheers - is there any content filtering built into edubuntu?  (sorry if it's an FAQ, i've been looking..)
<LaserJock> not by default no
<drue> LaserJock: any brief tutorial available?  or just go dansguardian + iptables?
<dtrask> # apt-get install dansguardian
<drue> excellent.. thanks!
<ogra_cmpc> either that or take a look at willowng
<LaserJock> dansguardian is probably the way to go at the moment
<ogra_cmpc> if you want something lighter that doesnt need a full server
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: Amaranth told me that it's not in working shape
<dtrask> drue: what are you trying to do....filter one machine or a whole network?
<ogra_cmpc> the bayesian learning doesnt
<LaserJock> wish we could get it fixed up
<ogra_cmpc> but black/whitelisting does
<LaserJock> would be great if we had SoC
<drue> dtrask: just a desktop locally, yup
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: ah, and can it be easily defeated like before?
<ogra_cmpc> LaserJock, finishing a SoC project with another SoC project ? :)
<LaserJock> i.e. just change the proxy setting
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: isn't that what SoC is about? perpetual projects ;-)
<ogra_cmpc> you can set up an iptable rule that redirects all traffic towards port 80 to willow
<dtrask> another one is squidguard which is simply a URL filter   #apt-get install squidguard
<ogra_cmpc> thats actually something i wanted to add to the postinst
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: we should write a little HowTo and stick it on edubuntu.org
<LaserJock> Filtering Solutions or something
<ogra_cmpc> yeah
<drue> ogra_cmpc: that's what i had in mind, yeah.  local iptables redirect through a dansguardian proxy
<LaserJock> it's a fairly common question and if we can at least point people in the right direction it'd help
<ogra_cmpc> and advertise willow to attract someone to finish the missing bits :)
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: agreed, it really is a nice app to work with
<ogra_cmpc> yeah
<dtrask> what makes wilow better than DG?
<dtrask> willow
<ogra_cmpc> and i'm not gfond of running a heaviweight like squid for just doing some url filtering
<dtrask> good point
<LaserJock> dtrask: have you ever tried willow?
<ogra_cmpc> dtrask, have a look at willow
<ogra_cmpc> every teacher can understand it within minutes
<ogra_cmpc> it has a nice gui to cinfigure it etc
<dtrask> no I haven't....that's why I'm asking....I use DG here for the school network
<ogra_cmpc> its just not complete
<LaserJock> if the Bayesian filter was working it'd be the killer filtering app
<dtrask> running on SME server and another on IPCop
<dtrask> LaserJock: yes it sounds like it would
<LaserJock> dtrask: with willowng you just install it and basically say "start filtering"
<LaserJock> it's all GUI
<dtrask> do they have a web site other than just the Launchpad page?
<ogra_cmpc> its integrated in the gnome desktop
<dtrask> screenshots?
<ogra_cmpc> they ?
<dtrask> ool
<ogra_cmpc> heh
<dtrask> cool
<ogra_cmpc> thats actually us :)
<dtrask> oh...I didn't realize it was you....cool...so any screenshots anywhere?
 * dtrask is intrigued
<LaserJock> dtrask: just install the darn thing ;-)
<ogra_cmpc> i dug it up as "willow" and specced something based on this ... Amaranth then took that spec for a SoC
<dtrask> LaserJock: is it ready for hardy?  I have a hardy install in Virtualbox
<dtrask> what I mean by ready is "installable"
<dtrask> #apt-get install willowng?
<LaserJock> dtrask: let me see, I just installed it here
<LaserJock> do willowng-config-gnome
<LaserJock> there's also a KDE frontend
<dtrask> after installing?
<ogra_cmpc> sudo apt-get install willowng-config-gnome
<dtrask> got it
<ogra_cmpc> just copy paste
<LaserJock> it seems to crash here
<LaserJock> since it was written during dapper I think it's not a big surprise :-)
<ogra_cmpc> yeah :(
<ogra_cmpc> so much dead code in the archive
<LaserJock> ah
<LaserJock> it seems dbus has changed since it was made
<ogra_cmpc> thats likely
<LaserJock> dbus.exceptions.DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name com.ubuntu.WillowNG was not provided by any .service files
<LaserJock> anyway
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: I've uploaded squeak and friends, edubuntu-menus (thought I had already fixed that), and edubuntu-docs
<ogra_cmpc> right, nothing to fix for hardy
<ogra_cmpc> LaserJock, oyu rock
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: do you have any time to look into a gcompris FFe?
<ogra_cmpc> its so sad you wont come to prague
<LaserJock> yes it is :(
<ogra_cmpc> assign it to me  aned milestone it if its important enough, then slangasek will hunt me down until its done
<LaserJock> bdoin says there are some important crasher bugs fixed
<ogra_cmpc> i didnt see any crashers during my classmate tests yet
<ogra_cmpc> and i tested it a lot
<ogra_cmpc> tuxpaint is da evil
<LaserJock> in the mosaic activity if you click on grey target button it crashes
<ogra_cmpc> i still havent found out why it locks the cmpc if that thing doesnt run at full CPU speed
<LaserJock> "Fixed many potential crash of GCompris in the key_press activity callback."
<LaserJock> what I can do is file a wishlist bug with the changelog entry, etc.
<dtrask> One issue I have with Tuxpaint in Gcompris in  the version I'm using (on Feisty) is that it launches in full screen which my monitors don't like at that resolution.  I have config'd all my menu items and launchers to fire up Tuxpaint in windowed mode
<ogra_cmpc> yeah i will have to reproduce that
<LaserJock> but I think I must be done with Edubuntu for Hardy
<ogra_cmpc> it defaults to windowed in hardy
<dtrask> cool
<LaserJock> my dissertation has really fallen behind in the last couple weeks
<ogra_cmpc> which is merely annoying on the classmate
<ogra_cmpc> LaserJock, take off then ... do your paperwork
<LaserJock> stupid school :-)
<LaserJock> I should have figured out how to get a PhD out of working on Edubuntu
 * dtrask is fondly remembering the lyrics to Pink Floyd's "Another Brick in the Wall"
 * ogra_cmpc needs to do some errands ... bbl
 * dtrask is away: One of my users is exclaiming "I can't do email!"
<LaserJock> Muhammad_Saad: btw, right after you left dtrask said:
<LaserJock> Apple is an example of a company who pays for the end users...the bundle MP3 capability in itunes
<Muhammad_Saad> Thanks.
<laga> i think fluendo gives out a lib for mp3 playback for free.
<Muhammad_Saad> who is fluendo?
<stgraber> Muhammad_Saad: a company working on gstreamer and a streaming application
<Muhammad_Saad> how do they manage to provide a lib for free?
<Muhammad_Saad> I found something that is a little relevant to our discussion: http://www.gnu.org/fun/jokes/hello_world_patent.html :-D
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: well, actually I just decided to merge gcompris and file a FFe and see if it flys
<ogra_cmpc> subscribe me to it
<LaserJock> doko did a lot of patching in the source tree which was fun :/
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: the new version does fix one LP bug though, and probably saves us some more
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: bdoin and at least one other person I think are working more on OLPC support for gcompris
<LaserJock> I think some of that may help the OLPC
<LaserJock> s/OLPC/CMPC/
<ogra_cmpc> heh
<ogra_cmpc> yay freud
<LaserJock> they are working on a skin that will work better on smaller screens I think
<ogra_cmpc> wide would be good
<ogra_cmpc> small is fine already
<ogra_cmpc> i find it quite good as it is in fullscreen on the classmate ... would just be cool to not have the black bars on the sides
<LaserJock> hmm, yeah
<LaserJock> I noticed on my widescreen laptop it does some funky stuff when I open it in fullscreen
<LaserJock> the only thing I dislike about working with gcompris is the size of the .orig.tar.gz
<LaserJock> still waiting on the current ubuntu package to download so I can do a diffstat
 * LaserJock hugs highvoltage 
<LaserJock> in a purely platonic way
 * highvoltage is ok with any kind of hug on IRC
<highvoltage> (as long as it stays on IRC)
<ogra_cmpc> what happens on IRC stays on IRC
<LaserJock> we hope
<ogra_cmpc> (and in the logs ... on google etc etc)
<LaserJock> alright, gotta run
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: I'll sub you to the FFe request when I'm done
<LaserJock> just gotta put the paperwork together ;-)
<ogra_cmpc> thanks :)
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: ok, I got the bug done and you sub'd, just need to wait for Ubuntu Release
<ogra_cmpc> i womnder if i should hide the admin menuitem on cmpc
<ogra_cmpc> its actually quite pointless for a student
<LaserJock> good point
#edubuntu 2008-03-27
<hilands> hi
<hilands> very new here... anyone can help?
<kgoetz> !anyone
<ubotu> A large amount of the first questions asked in this channel start with "Does anyone/anybody..."  Why not ask your next question (the real one) and find out?
<hilands> thanks.
<hilands> bye.
<ogra_cmpc> hmm seems that needs rephrasing
<ogra_cmpc> (if people run away screaming something must be wrong)
 * kgoetz suspects theres a language barrier
<ogra_cmpc> "Why not ask your next question (the real one) and find out?" should become easier grammar then i think
<ogra_cmpc> (but then i didnt even know about the !anyone factoid :) )
<kgoetz> :)
<lns> how about "it's not rude to just ask the actual question" ...maybe a bit sarcastic.. =p
<kgoetz> harder for people with bad english
<ogra_cmpc> but easier to understand for non natives
<ogra_cmpc> "just ask the actual question"
<lns> it would be easy for us to just say "Ask"
<lns> =p
<ogra_cmpc> yeah
<lns> actually what would be cool is to have a bot that somehow can grep certain phrases
<lns> and autorespond, like the other ones
<lns> i'm no advanced scripter and i have no idea how bots work but i'm sure certain things like "if login <= 1min && statement contains "ask" or "question" then autorespond" or whatever syntax applies
<ogra_cmpc> thats tricky to write without having tons of false positives
<ogra_cmpc> "if you want to log in the progam will ask for a password"
<ogra_cmpc> slap ... you get poked by a bot
<ogra_cmpc> you need some good AI skills to write something thats good enough
<lns> i guess so
<lns> i know some chan bots will just give you an initial message (not the topic) that say things like that, or give simple help msgs
<lns> right when you log in
<ogra_cmpc> you can register messages with chanserv ... i think #ltsp uses that
<ogra_cmpc> but thats actually what the topic is supposed to be for
<lns> yea
<ogra_cmpc> thaats what every user sees first on login
<ogra_cmpc> sadly its read rarely
<lns> exactly
<lns> and i'd hate to go all windows and have little bubbles start popping up saying "you have unused desktop icons" "you have updates" "your antivirus is out of date", like lame reminders to do stuff you should be doing already
<lns> maybe a disclaimer when you join the server that says "Will you just ask the question if you have one? (Y/N)"
<lns> =p
<ogra_cmpc> hey gnome power manager now tells you that yu closed your lid :)
<HedgeMage> and "buy milk" and "you are overdue for a dental exam" and "call your mother" ;)
<ogra_cmpc> and that you opened it
<lns> HedgeMage, ha
<lns> Unfortunately windows makes me most of my money right now, and every time i have to rebuild winxp i get so frustrated with all of the things i have to turn off just to feel like i have control
<HedgeMage> lns:  thankfully I work solely with Linux
<lns> HedgeMage, do you work with edubuntu primarily?
<lns> I'm steering my business toward linux-only (*buntu/LTSP installs)... I'm not planning on supporting Vista in any respect
<lns> and want to focus on the educational sector
<lns> it's really what ltsp is best for i think
<lns> plus, you're exposing so many young people to linux, and that's invaluable for the future
<ogra_cmpc> its best for everything where you use more than one machine
<lns> ogra_cmpc, agreed
<HedgeMage> lns:  I use edubuntu in my volunteer work, but at work I use ubuntu, debian, and gentoo
<ogra_cmpc> the major savings you have is not the TCO ...
<ogra_cmpc> its neither the maintenance costs
<HedgeMage> it's your sanity?
 * HedgeMage ducks
<ogra_cmpc> the most you save is on your power bill
<HedgeMage> ahh
<ogra_cmpc> running 10 TCs vs 10 workstations saves you about 80% of power
<lns> that's another thing
<ogra_cmpc> i'm stil trying to get my hands on maddogs talk from the last ubuntulive conf  ...
<lns> ltsp is naturally green (as long as you're not using workstations with spinning hard disks as thin clients)
<ogra_cmpc> he presented a project that aims to set up 175000 thin clients (some with own flash based boot os)
<ogra_cmpc> all over sao paolo
<lns> ogra_cmpc, hehe..i watched one of maddog's speeches a couple months ago, he's funny for how geeky he is =) and that's cool
<lns> wow
<lns> ogra_cmpc, koolus?
<ogra_cmpc> i think koolu was founded for that project initially but not sure
<lns> i've got a koolu thin client, it's nice, minus the whole geode issue
<lns> once that's fixed i want to sell those primarily, standardize on a certain hardware set
<ogra_cmpc> in any case he has some really impressive numbers in tese slides
<ogra_cmpc> it should be fixed with Q-Funks backport
<lns> i used q-funk's backport, i was still having resolution issues (couldn't autodetect above 800x600)
<ogra_cmpc> i have no such HW so its hard to test or fix for me
<lns> unless he's updated it within the past week
<lns> ogra_cmpc, if you'd like i can ship mine to you
<lns> i wouldn't mind
<lns> as long as i got it back ;)
<ogra_cmpc> lns, i usually have the manufacturers send me free samples
<lns> cool, that's what i did with koolu too
<lns> just do me a favor and specify what KIND of shipping you want
<lns> i ended up with a hundred dollar shipping bill for 2 thin-clients
<lns> not very funny on their part
<ogra_cmpc> when i met in boston with maddog at the last UDS we somehow both forgot to talk about that, i think though he gave one to our hw certification guys
<lns> oh cool
<lns> yeah i know ubuntu and koolu are very tightly knit
<ogra_cmpc> i'll poke cr3 to do some testing with hardy so i get some info how far the driver is
<lns> afaik what was found was that x was failing to autoprobe settings in the geode driver
<ogra_cmpc> x was failing because nobody ported the amd driver to the new xorg core code  ...
<lns> =p minor detail
<ogra_cmpc> the one person that worked on it only cared to make the driver work on OLPC
<lns> ugh
<lns> that kind of stuff irritates me..
<ogra_cmpc> which it does wonderfully on redhat ...
<lns> standards people! geez
<lns> in their defense i know it was extremely difficult to get the geode driver done anyway, nobody from amd was allowed to help
<ogra_cmpc> silly politics
<lns> seriously
<lns> when will business grow up
<lns> google has proven that you can still be a billionaire and SHARE
<lns> and intel
<lns> and ibm
<lns> amd is getting there though
<lns> i'm sure it is very hard to shed the skins of the past
<ogra_cmpc> its harder to please your shareholders
<ogra_cmpc> and thats what counts most for all on your list
<lns> unfortunately
<lns> oh well, there must be balance
<ogra_cmpc> as long as you ignore that minor detail, they are all cuddly wolves
<lns> yep
<lns> i plan on expanding my business and making ltsp in educational environments as widespread as i can
<lns> i'm getting such good feedback from my current customers, and the overhead is so small
<ogra_cmpc> i'd also look for small offices etc
<lns> especially compared to my other windows clients
<lns> well, in my experience anyway, in offices no matter how small, people are just so scared to "make the jump"..they are there to make money too
<ogra_cmpc> ten clients on a remotely maintained ubuntu server you get paid a monthly fee for
<lns> right, but i can also do that for education
<lns> also, businesses always have that one windows app they must have
<lns> i'm not ruling it out
<lns> i just think it's much easier to get educational-sector clients for this kind of thing, especially the cost factor and the green factor
<lns> plus, a triple-bonus for me, is that i can say i'm exposing hundreds of kids to linux
<ogra_cmpc> let them show you their bills for repairing and maintainance for getting external guys in and makle them add up how much waiting time they have where the employess cant work ...
<lns> and they'll take that with them when they look for a job or get more into computers
<ogra_cmpc> then show them that ubuntu cdosts only 10% of that and leave a liveCD there ;)
<ogra_cmpc> *costs
<lns> i totally agree w/you
<lns> it's my clients that don't..i have tried to push linux in with business before, the furthest i've gotten is on the server
<lns> take one for example, a small civil engineering firm
<lns> they HAVE to have autocad - not an option
<lns> otherwise they've said more than once they would go to linux on the desktop
<lns> and it's too critical to entrust to wine/other hacks
<ogra_cmpc> a central vmware server
<lns> but i've had overwhelming support and success for schools and after-school clubs that want to have technology for their youth
<ogra_cmpc> yeah
<lns> and kids love tux, so... =)
<lns> i would use vmware
<ogra_cmpc> heh
<lns> but that, to them, is too much of a hassle just to "have linux"
<lns> they'd rather spend the money and get windows
<ogra_cmpc> ugh ... 4:30 ... i should probably go to bed
<lns> haha
<lns> sleep well
<Muhammad_Saad> Hello, I want to remove the permission for sudo from regular users. What do I have to do? Is there a possibility that it may cause some problems?
<calimer> anyone with any copyright license knowledge in here?
<Kamping_Kaiser> probably
<calimer> I have a guy who donated some content to a free doom 3 modification that I work on a while ago, and I ended up having to kick him out of the community do to his behavior and now he is saying he doesn't want his stuff in my mod and that I would be violating his copyright to keep it included
<calimer> is this accurate?
<calimer> or since I already have permission from him to use it from the past, does he not have the right to now say that I can't use it?
<Kamping_Kaiser> probably a bit OT for here. but if you have "written" permission to use it on the old licence, you can keep using it
<calimer> there was no real license or agreement except that he said I could use it and sent it to me
<Kamping_Kaiser> the written is for your proof, fyi. IANAL, TINLA
<ogra_cmpc> hrm
<ogra_cmpc> italc wasnt in the -desktop deps ... but the seed change applied so it was in the task of netinstall
<ogra_cmpc> what a mess
<RichEd> ogra_cmpc: so what are the consequences ?
<ogra_cmpc> that i had to upload a new edubuntu-desktop to fix it
<RichEd> does it need a manual apt-get install now ?
<ogra_cmpc> yes
<ogra_cmpc> until tomorrow
<RichEd> well that's not such a long wait ... given the greater scheme of things
<RichEd> :)
<RichEd> ogra_cmpc: i'm busy with the zsync now 47% ... will install tonight
<RichEd> and let you know if any of my problems persist
<ogra_cmpc> well, thats what i meant this morning with "it constantly improves"
<ogra_cmpc> i'm currrently writing fixes for all app starters to force fullscreen on apps like gcompris and tuxtype ...
<RichEd> and stgraber's instructions I sent on to intel had a "how to check if it is there, or get if not" section
<RichEd> so i am sure intel can manage :)
<ogra_cmpc> until thats in the installer they riun windowed in 800x600 which puts half of them off screen etc
<RichEd> b.t.w. due to the wireless network not being available to network manager, ffox always starts up in offline more
<RichEd> damn annoying
<ogra_cmpc> yeah, its tied to n-m now
<ogra_cmpc> evolution as well
<RichEd> i hope the new image sees the card automatically
<ogra_cmpc> well, i didnt change anything in the wlan area
<ogra_cmpc> neither dis the kernel change between the images
<ogra_cmpc> *did
<ogra_cmpc> so its unlikely it behaves differently, i guess there is a debugging session with you and asac needed to find the bug
<RichEd> okay ... i may have some older chipset or something ...
<RichEd> any chance of sending that mail on the anti-theft issue ?
<RichEd> our meeting starts in 8 mins ...
<ogra_cmpc> \you cant have a different chipset ...
<RichEd> is there any chance it is because my wireless router is not set up to autoconfigure clients with dchp & default g/w etc
<RichEd> i would assume not ... and that the classmate should see the wlan even before it attempts to connect
<RichEd> ogra_cmpc: see /msg over across on the other server
<RichEd> ogra_cmpc: you here ?
#edubuntu 2008-03-28
<SIRavecavec> hi need a bit help
<SIRavecavec> i am new with edubuntu and all i want is to upgrade withount cd my version direct from internet
<SIRavecavec> is it posible?
<SIRavecavec> hi how do i change the language of edubuntu?
<SIRavecavec> hi
<SIRavecavec> need help
<Kamping_Kaiser> SIRavecavec, same problem as before?
<SIRavecavec> yes
<SIRavecavec> but now look
<SIRavecavec> i get a error when i try to add remove programs
<SIRavecavec> (gnome-app-install:4466): HtmlUtil-CRITICAL **: html_stream_cancel: assertion `stream->cancel_func != NULL' failed
<SIRavecavec> i really need to set it in to english language
<SIRavecavec> :((
<Kamping_Kaiser> where do you see that message?
<SIRavecavec> in terminal when i try to manualy add remove programs
<Kamping_Kaiser> what was the command you ran?
<SIRavecavec>  gnome-app-install
<Kamping_Kaiser> just that?
<SIRavecavec> yes
<Kamping_Kaiser> what happens if you run it from the menu?
<SIRavecavec> i do not know to run it from menu
<SIRavecavec> cause its czech language\
<Kamping_Kaiser> are english translations installed?
<SIRavecavec> i do not know
<SIRavecavec> :(
<SIRavecavec> this is what i want to do
<SIRavecavec> but only from terminal
<SIRavecavec> cause i cannot outher wai
<SIRavecavec> way
<Kamping_Kaiser> cant find the jolly lang packs ;|
<SIRavecavec> Kamping_Kaiser,
<SIRavecavec> look
<SIRavecavec> this are my steps
<SIRavecavec> root@edubuntu-server:~# gnome-app-install
<SIRavecavec> warning: could not initiate dbus
<SIRavecavec> ** (gnome-app-install:4466): WARNING **: return value of custom widget handler was not a GtkWidget
<SIRavecavec> Now i see something is wrong but...
<Kamping_Kaiser> well theres the problem
<Kamping_Kaiser> your running it from a root@ console
<SIRavecavec> dbus///
<SIRavecavec> yes
<SIRavecavec> i must be root
<Kamping_Kaiser> why?
<SIRavecavec> to start that command
<SIRavecavec> or?
<Kamping_Kaiser> you dont need to be root to run gai
<SIRavecavec> ok
<SIRavecavec> tabornik@edubuntu-server:~$ gnome-app-install
<SIRavecavec> Introspect error: The name org.freedesktop.AppInstall was not provided by any .service files
<SIRavecavec> no listening object (The name org.freedesktop.AppInstall was not provided by any .service files)
<SIRavecavec> ** (gnome-app-install:5054): WARNING **: return value of custom widget handler was not a GtkWidget
<SIRavecavec> This is when i run it normaly
<Kamping_Kaiser> so your terminal is in english?
<SIRavecavec> yes
<SIRavecavec> but only that
<SIRavecavec> not entire interface
<SIRavecavec> i want the interface in english
<Kamping_Kaiser> are you logging into the server from a client or on the server?
<SIRavecavec> and i receive same erors as root
<Kamping_Kaiser> running gui apps as root is prone to breaking them
<SIRavecavec> :(
<SIRavecavec> so what is best i do  now
<Kamping_Kaiser> how are you logge d in? from GDM on the server or a client?
<Kamping_Kaiser> changing language in GDM is relatively easy
<Kamping_Kaiser> actually, are you ona  terminal server, or  a workstation?
<SIRavecavec> workstation
<SIRavecavec> and is just a simple username
<SIRavecavec> and i enter in terminal the root login
<Kamping_Kaiser> workstation is much easier
<SIRavecavec> cause this wass preinstaled in czeech language
<SIRavecavec> ok
<Kamping_Kaiser> in the bottom left of the login screen is a little menu
<SIRavecavec> can you assist me?
<Kamping_Kaiser> it lets you select your 'session' (eg gnome/kde/other), and language
<Kamping_Kaiser> i cant really tell you past that, because i dont know what it'll say
<SIRavecavec> i cannot find any
<SIRavecavec> if its a way from terminal
<SIRavecavec> then i do it
<SIRavecavec> but from this interface not a chance
<SIRavecavec> i tryed all menus
<Kamping_Kaiser> have you tried looking in the menu?
<SIRavecavec> yes
<Kamping_Kaiser> SIRavecavec, perhaps ask #ubuntu-cz if someone can help you. jenda will be able to perhaps (even though hes currently inactive)
<SIRavecavec> ahh
<SIRavecavec> ok
 * Kamping_Kaiser goes to do some study
<SIRavecavec> if i am root
<SIRavecavec> how can i find gnome sudo pass?
<dtrask> stgraber: I just used your bt headset pairing program....very nice....thanks for doing it.  Made life easier  :-)
<SIRavecavec> hi need some help someone here to help me?
<juliux> SIRavecavec, just ask your question, perhaps somebody is around who can help you
<SIRavecavec> ive updated my edubuntunfrom 6.06 to next version and when i check version on terminal is 6.06 when i try to update again there are no packs available
<SIRavecavec> whe i access add remove programs i get this
<SIRavecavec> (gnome-app-install:7223): HtmlUtil-CRITICAL **: html_stream_cancel: assertion `stream->cancel_func != NULL' failed
<SIRavecavec> juliux,
<SIRavecavec> can you help me?
<ogra> SIRavecavec, did you follow the upgrade docs ?
<johnny> ogra!
<johnny> also, don't bug people by name when they join SIRavecavec, it is bad ettiquette
 * johnny upgrades to hardy on the laptop for testing
<johnny> i lost power during it tho :(
<johnny> hopefully it'll finish properly this time
<ogra> you turn into an ubuntu user slowly eh ?
<johnny> i use ubuntu at the store
<johnny> and maintain multiple ubuntu boxes
<ogra> oh, right, i forgot
<johnny> i need my own ubuntu box to play with , so i can actually know what i'm doing :)
<ogra> all your gentoo efforts made me forget :)
<johnny> and break my own stuff
<ogra> btw, donnie was looking for you yesterday
<johnny> i found him
<ogra> good
<johnny> i was out of town for a few days
<johnny> it was good for my ltsp efforts tho!
<johnny> now i can refocus
<johnny> uggh..scrollkeeper update is taking FOREVER
<SIRavecavec> i did folow the documents
 * ogra *finally* finishes the whisky he has lying around after getting good feedback from the marketing team for the classmate image
<johnny> HURRY UP!
<johnny> aha.. finally
<ogra> SIRavecavec, so you didnt use apget anywhere ... did the update-manager show any errors
<ogra> *apt-get
<SIRavecavec> ogra,  no errors
<SIRavecavec> first time
<johnny> gnome stopped working :(
<johnny> i'm having to use apt-get
<ogra> no
<SIRavecavec> and after i instaled i try to see my version and is steel 6.06
<ogra> johnny, you use update-manager-core
<SIRavecavec> when i try to use again update manager its says im newest version
<johnny> i wish update-manager would hold off on asking questions til the end, i go to sleep.. and it's still waiting for an answer :(
<SIRavecavec> ogra,  i try to much this:((
<ogra> SIRavecavec, did you pull a fresh version from dapper-updates before upgarding ? the upgarde code is usually in these versions
<ogra> johnny, the thing is that apt simply doesnt handle all cases of upgrades, u-m has a lot of special casing for converting setup, removing unsupported stuff and making sure the right replacements are in place
<ogra> using apt only will not give you the same system u-m will
<ogra> thats why we discourage apt usage at all for dist upgrades
<johnny> i don't even have update-manager-core
<ogra> no, its only installed on -server by default
<SIRavecavec> ogra,  no i did not i did what they told me to do upgrade-manager
<ogra> SIRavecavec, for a proper upgrade you need to first install update-manager from your releases updates repository (in your case dapper-updates)
<ogra> the upgrade docs state that i think
<ogra> and explain how to get it
<SIRavecavec> ok can you teach me how or where to read?
<johnny> actually it told me to run dpkg --configure -a
<SIRavecavec> (synaptic:7334): Gtk-CRITICAL **: gtk_tree_view_unref_tree_helper: assertion `node != NULL' failed
<SIRavecavec> i get this erros many times
<ogra> SIRavecavec, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EdgyUpgrades#head-7e4d0a8850f88d770c9e373ca84c3a78703a58ad
<johnny> did they ever add that option to allow you to keep your /home intact?
<ogra> ?
<johnny> in the installer
<SIRavecavec> root@edubuntu-server:~# do-release-upgrade --devel-release
<SIRavecavec> Checking for a new ubuntu release
<SIRavecavec> No new release found
<SIRavecavec> root@edubuntu-server:~# do-release-upgrade
<SIRavecavec> Checking for a new ubuntu release
<SIRavecavec> No new release found
<ogra> home will never ever be touched by any upgrade
<johnny> for an installer .. not upgrade
<ogra> you can do that since the first ubuntu release
<johnny> but only if it's on a seperate partition?
<ogra> just pick custom partitioning and mount the /home wherever you want it
<ogra> right
<johnny> i don't have a mounted /home.. i picked the default when i set it up
<johnny> i was in a rush
<johnny> and the drive wasnt' large
<ogra> for users thats fine imho
<ogra> usually you dont ever need yto reinstall a debian based OS
<ogra> for a developer thats different ...
<johnny> so.. ltsp question.. it's saying tags aren't supported by my current branch format.. is followng the instructions to run bzr upgrade --dirstate-tags the right thing?
<ogra> i need to reinstall from time to time  ... so i keep my home separate
<Muhammad_Saad> Hello, I am looking for a way to get Yahoo Mail in Evolution. If nobody here knows, please guide me to a channel where I can get my answer.
<ogra> johnny, yup
<ogra> Muhammad_Saad, http://gopalkoduri.wordpress.com/2006/06/23/configuring-evolution-mail-to-work-with/ second hit for googling "Yahoo Mail in Evolution"
<Muhammad_Saad> I want to do that for free. :-/
<Muhammad_Saad> just like there is the WebMail extension in Thunderbird.
<Muhammad_Saad> Does anyone know?
<Muhammad_Saad> If nobody knows then please tell me an appropriate channel.
<johnny> we might not know it?
<johnny> look for the gnome irc server?
<ogra> what do you me4an with "for free" ?
<ogra> the page above only shows the data you have to use to make it work
<ogra> it doesnt cost anything
<Muhammad_Saad> I think Yahoo only provides POP to those who pay for it. Please correct me if I am wrong.
<ogra> no idea
<ogra> i would never touch yahoo mail
<ogra> so i dont know
<ogra> ...
<ogra> you asked for instructions how to make tyahoo work with evo
<ogra> google might reveal a lot more here
<Muhammad_Saad> I would never touch Yahoo mail too but I have to use it for messenger service to stay connected with my friends.
<RichEd> ogra: does the image update with zsync but keep the old filename
<RichEd> (old date in the name) ?
<ogra> if you use the -o option
<ogra> (its suboptimal, i know)
<RichEd> fine ... as long as I did not waste my time & bandwidth :)
<ogra> nah
<RichEd> doing the dd now to usb
<ogra> check the date of the file qith ls -l
<ogra> and check the md5sum
<ogra> thats why i generate it ;)
<RichEd> will let you know tomorrow if it breaks like mr liptin seems to manage :)
<ogra> he said he didnt but his colleagues did
<RichEd> well they are skilled over there aren't they ;)
<ogra> shhh
<RichEd> later ... knackered & have to put the boys to bed
<ogra> we're on a public channel :)
<RichEd> till tomorrow
<ogra> ciao
<RichEd> i'm talking about mr lipton the tea fellow ...
<RichEd> nothin to do with *****
<ogra> oh
<RichEd> bye
<ogra> ah
<ogra> thought that was a typo
<ogra> :)
<SIRavecavec> ogra,
<SIRavecavec> it did not worked none of above
<SIRavecavec> i cannot update
<ogra> Sir_Remoz, did you read the instructions on teh page i pasted above
<SIRavecavec> ogra,  yes i did
<ogra> and what does the command under that url give you ?
<SIRavecavec> nothing
<SIRavecavec> i just type it and nothing hapends
<highvoltage> oh wow, not often I see you guys here on a friday eveneing :)
 * SIRavecavec is drunk
<highvoltage> *BSZZZZHT*
 * LaserJock runs
<SIRavecavec> hi LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi
<LaserJock> highvoltage: how's it going>
<LaserJock> ?
<highvoltage> LaserJock: just woke up a few minutes ago
<highvoltage> LaserJock: bad allergies bought me down, so I took a nap, feeling slightly better now
<highvoltage> LaserJock: also going through yet another phase of thinking *everything* through and deciding what is important in life
<LaserJock> highvoltage: heh, me too
<LaserJock> I just made a last minute *buntu push and uploaded a bunch of stuff
<highvoltage> yes, I saw your feature freeze exception request for gcompris.
<highvoltage> glad it came through.
<LaserJock> highvoltage: yeah, sometimes I'm surprised that things get approved
<highvoltage> LaserJock: I think it makes a big difference that you've worked with quite a few different packages in the past, and that you are proven to be competent. So if you ask for an exception, I would think that it's considered very low risk to approve it.
<highvoltage> I wish I can get to that stage one day :)
<SIRavecavec> LaserJock,  i cannnot make my edubuntu upgrade
<SIRavecavec> :( i try all documentation
<LaserJock> SIRavecavec: what version do you have and what do you want to upgrade to?
<SIRavecavec> i have 6.06 but i used update-manager -c and its showing me some upgrades i instaled all
<SIRavecavec> but when i use terminal to check my version its steel 6.06
<SIRavecavec> and when i try to use again update-manager -c is no updates anymore
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> 6.06 is pretty old
<SIRavecavec> yes
<SIRavecavec> :(\
<LaserJock> so do you want to update to 7.10?
<SIRavecavec> yes
<SIRavecavec> or last version
<SIRavecavec> i wass even ready to test the betas
<SIRavecavec> but...
<SIRavecavec> :(
<SIRavecavec> i use romainian language
<SIRavecavec> my native language
<LaserJock> well, a direct upgrade from 6.06 to 7.10 isn't really supported
<opapo> when I restart a client the server restarts
<LaserJock> a direct upgrade from 6.06 to 8.04 which will be out next month will be supported
<opapo> is that a bug, feature, or user error
<LaserJock> opapo: how are you restarting the client?
<opapo> I am in the client and I do sudo init 6
<SIRavecavec> so LaserJock  can i go to 7.04
<SIRavecavec> or a better version
<LaserJock> SIRavecavec: well, you can try, generally upgrade only work very well from one release to the next
<stgraber> opapo: what you see on your client is a session running on the server, so everything you run will be run on the server
<LaserJock> so 6.06 -> 6.10 -> 7.04 -> 7.10
<stgraber> opapo: the only way you have to reboot a client si to close the session then choose reboot at the login prompt
<LaserJock> but that gets really messy
<SIRavecavec> LaserJock,  but what commands i use?
<SIRavecavec> to do that?
<opapo> stgraber: that explains things
<opapo> so, for clarification sake, I get to a login screen that has an ip address given through dhcp
<opapo> and then when I log in, I have the ip address of the server?
<LaserJock> SIRavecavec: check out https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/UpgradeFromOldVersion
<opapo> Can I not have a client running a full OS in a chrooted environment?
<opapo> on the server?
<SIRavecavec> LaserJock,  but its only for version feytsy and ge./..
<SIRavecavec> not for drake mine 6.06
<LaserJock> opapo: I think that's what is called a fat client
<opapo> LaserJock: thanks
<LaserJock> SIRavecavec: "For example, a user of Ubuntu 6.06 LTS (Dapper Drake) could first upgrade to 6.10, then to 7.04, and then to 7.10. For instructions on how to do this, check the UpgradeNotes page."
<opapo> You guys have been helpful and responsive.  Thank you.
<LaserJock> SIRavecavec: which then leads you to https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UpgradeNotes
<LaserJock> opapo: no problem
<stgraber> opapo: np, fat clients may be a solution depending on how fast is your hardware (and your network)
<stgraber> opapo: IIRC we have a wiki page about that but not sure how up to date it's
<opapo> stgraber: The information is out of date by a year or two, but I have enough information to head in the right direction
<SIRavecavec> how to add mc to edubuntu?\
<SIRavecavec> midnight commander
<SIRavecavec> ?
<opapo> does citrix run a thin or thick client?
#edubuntu 2008-03-29
<Carlosweb> hola que tal ...tengo una duda no he podido crear los rom para hacer bootear unos diskless......alguien me podria colaborar? .....
<Carlosweb> I have a dobut .....I cant make a rom for some clients .....somebody could help me? ....
<funwlinux> has anyone tried to upgrade from edubuntu 7.10 server to 8.04 beta?
<SIRavecavec> hi all i have a really big problem newbie and cant do a thing
<SIRavecavec> :(
<SIRavecavec> i updated from 6.06 to 6.10 edgy and when its reeboted its says that could not open x window system
<stgraber> ogra: I have the avahi scripts ready for iTalc !!!
<stgraber> ogra: that just rocks, you start italc and you get an auto-generated classroom with all the computers you have access to (I check the keys too)
<pygi> :P
#edubuntu 2008-03-30
<Muhammad_Saad> Hello everyone!
<Muhammad_Saad> I am a little bit confused. Is someone here who can help me?
<Muhammad_Saad> I requested Edubuntu CD and installed it but I do not see any educational applications. What is the reason?
<Muhammad_Saad> I cannot even find them on the CD.
<Muhammad_Saad> Is anyone here?
<montessori> Hello - anyone have any "must do" suggestons for Edubuntu systems going into a daycare setting for kids 2-5 years old?
<leecohen> Hi everyone
<montessori> Hi
<leecohen> are you running edubuntu right now montessori?
<montessori> Yes, I just installed it on 3 machines for a daycare school donation
<montessori> leecohen you?
<leecohen> I'm dling it right now
<leecohen> going to try using it with Parallels on my mac
<montessori> nice, what's Parrellels though?  like a dual boot?
<leecohen> it lets you run several OS's at once
<leecohen> I have gOS
<leecohen> XP
<leecohen> have you tweaked edubuntu for the daycare school, or are you running it "out of the box"?
 * johnny_ wants to know what tweaks are being refered to
<montessori> that was my question before you arrived, I'm looking for suggestions for the daycare boxes but got no responses, any suggestions?
<johnny_> other than just installing other packages
<montessori> I'll probably tweak it for autologin and adjust the icons for easy launching of the best programs, but other than that I'm still looking for suggestions
<johnny_> i think that's a good start
<montessori> I guess I'm really looking for programs that 2-5 year olds can use that might not be installed by default
<johnny_> oh. i don't know.. sorry
<johnny_> i've only hung out here cuz its' quieter than ubuntu, and the ubuntu ltsp folks are here
<johnny_> than #ubuntu that is
<montessori> nice
<leecohen> wow you're right, it's busy over there!
<johnny_> it's impossible to get any info from those people
<johnny_> all the questions i have are far too advanced
<johnny_> for them
<johnny_> or at least 99% of them
 * montessori higly suggests this sight for any *Ubuntu* install 
<montessori> --> http://www.danielandrade.net/2007/11/10/10-things-to-do-just-after-installing-ubuntu-710/
#edubuntu 2009-03-23
<humbolt> Concerning LTSP: Do only USB disks work as LOCALDEVs? It seems Digicams, which also appear as usb disks, are not seen by LTSP/
<anom1> humbolt: have you got the answer?  maybe in #ltsp instead?
<anom1> humbolt: either this channel is quieter than antarctica, or everyone uses "/query" and i missed out on all the action.
<humbolt> anom1: no, this channel seems pretty slow these days
<humbolt> stgraber: you here?
<Ahmuck> it is slow :(
<Ahmuck> two of the shaker movers got re-involved in school
 * Lns is here
<Ahmuck> ah, yes.  another shaker mover
<Ahmuck> so ... should i hire someone to deelop a user management program or is saybon back on board ?
<humbolt> Ahmuck: shaker movers?
<Lns> Ahmuck: define "user management program" - do you have specifications for what should be included?
<Ahmuck> in ltsp, logging out lists all the users
<Ahmuck> messages are broadcast over every computer for print outs, etc.
<Ahmuck> management of user programs, being able to set a .textfile_of_programs for allowed programs and menu control
<Ahmuck> so that the yearbook would have graphic apps, the music, music apps
<humbolt> Does anybody know how to make Digicams accessible plugged in via USB on an LTSP thin client (removable disk protocol).
<Ahmuck> programs set thier own .config in each directory allowing user cusomizableity
<humbolt> It does not seem LTSP is recognicing
<Ahmuck> and info storage such as score on math test, etc
<Ahmuck> humbolt: #ltsp
<humbolt> recognizing SD card readers
<Ahmuck> video resolution, program defaults, etc.
<Ahmuck> Lns: should i keep going?
<Ahmuck> a public exchange directory
<Lns> Ahmuck: ok, so what you're talking about is almost more of an "ltsp customized DE environment"
<Lns> lol...s/environment//
<Ahmuck> DE environment ?
<Ahmuck> i'm looking for a way to manage user profiles
<Ahmuck> and inventory machines
<Lns> Ahmuck: desktop environment
<Lns> Ahmuck: i think what you're looking for is what MOST multi-user network admins look for
<Lns> so it would be easy to find enough people to pool together resources to get it done
<Ahmuck> currently my machines are all the same.  however ltsp should provide you a way to inventory all machines and report back to the main server.  similar to what ocs inventory does
<Lns> Ahmuck: hmm, i was thinking about this the other day, had an epiphany about how it could work ..trying to remember ;)
<Ahmuck> that way one could drop any machine on the network and the bootup inventory logs would be reported back to the server.  it would be easier to diagnose by machine this way
<Lns> OH
 * Lns gets a lightbulb
<Lns> So lemme know if you guys think this is feasable
<Ahmuck> high schools need simple tools to do simple managment, inventory, etc.  wine configurations, program defaults, etc.
<Ahmuck> even user migration.  the OS400 has user migration
<Ahmuck> so that one can wipe and re-install without data loss
<Lns> I was trying to figure out how you could safely provide administration tasks through an ssh connection and/or tunnel on clients from a server/designated workstation
<Lns> some people didn't like the idea of installing an ssh server in the chroot
<Lns> so i thought, why not, by default, when a client boots up, create an ssh tunnel from the CLIENT to the SERVER, and provide some sort of IPC mechanism through that?
<Ahmuck> user environment and admin enviroonment should be sepearted ?! shouldn't they
<Lns> and then I remembered "ldminfod" and wondered what that was for (might be totally off base with that)
<Lns> What we need is a central "control panel" for all connected thin clients, for inventory, showing what's turned on/connected, who's logged in (kinda like MSFT "Terminal Services Manager" program, which is kinda nice for that)
<Lns> Ahmuck: iTalc does that "kind of" but I think an LTSP specific program would be better...could provide lots of good functionality like what you're talking about
<Ahmuck> ms used to have a small business type of manager as well
<Ahmuck> so, nubae and Laserjock drop out becasue of school?
<Lns> I know laserjock is working on his thesis so he can't be as involved
<LaserJock> morgs: around?
<Lns> I'm trying to troubleshoot this stream not working for one of my schools - can anyone test this URL and tell me whether you're able to see the webcam? It's Quicktime/RTSP proto. http://www2.ucsc.edu/scpbrg/falconcamera.htm
<Lns> (obviously you'd need to have quicktime codecs installed)
<alkisg1> Lns, I see a bird... :P
<Lns> alkisg1: can you tell me what codec package yo uhave?
<Lns> (it's a nestcam :) )
<alkisg1> Urm, how do I check what codec is used to display it?
<Lns> well it's a quicktime/rtsp stream, i know that much
<Lns> alkisg1: are you on a thin client?
<alkisg1> Nope
<alkisg1> Will `dpkg -l 'gstreamer*'` do?
<Lns> if it's gstreamer you're using, probably
<Lns> i'm gonna try from my ltsp svr console
<alkisg> Lns, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/136240/
<Lns> alkisg: ty =) i'll diff that from mine
<alkisg> yw
<Lns> alkisg: you must be on ibex/jaunty huh
<alkisg> Yup, jaunty it is
<alkisg> You still on hardy?
<Lns> alkisg: yeah
<Lns> i've got older versions of gstreamer stuff..that must be the issue
<alkisg> Heh... LTS = long time suffering :P
<Lns> alkisg: 8D
<Lns> nice
 * Lns wonders if installing newest gstreamer stuff will break his system
<alkisg> Lns, does it play if you open it directly with totem?
<Lns> alkisg: it doesn't even seem to try for some reason..brb
<alkisg> Lns, try this: gst-launch-0.10 playbin2 uri=rtsp://nts-prod-bird-mirror-1.ucsc.edu/birdback.sdp
<Lns> alkisg: same thing :( solid gray screen
<Lns> Funny thing was, last week I tried and it was intermittently working
<Lns> sometimes it'd show it, sometimes it'd be garbled, sometimes nothing
<alkisg> I guess it's a gstreamer bug then - is there a ppa with any newer gstreamer versions to try?
<alkisg> (I suppose you do have the *ugly and *bad codecs, right?)
<alkisg> Lns, https://launchpad.net/~gstreamer-developers/+archive/ppa      - no hardy, though :(
<Lns> alkisg: yeah, got the ugly+bad
<Lns> heh...i hate how lts versions are treated like bastard stepchildren :(
<alkisg> Lns, how about `mplayer rtsp://nts-prod-bird-mirror-1.ucsc.edu/birdback.sdp` ? It uses [ffodivx] vfm: ffmpeg (FFmpeg MPEG-4)
<Lns> alkisg: http://pastebin.ca/1369610 :(
<Lns> oh
<Lns> hehe..lemme try the -fps
<Lns> alkisg: http://pastebin.ca/1369611 :(
<alkisg> Lns, mine says: demux_rtp: Guessed the video frame rate as 10 frames-per-second.
<alkisg> Try with fps = 10
<alkisg> Ah, you did...
<Lns> ;)
<Lns> Why can't all the codecs just get along? Heh
<Lns> Can anyone in edu-land tell me where the best deals for a 15-17" LCD (preferably as low-power-consuming as possible, and *buntu/LTSP compatible OOTB) is online?
<faustino3331> stgraber: are you in here
<faustino3331> ?
<stgraber> faustino3331: yes
<faustino3331> stgraber : i'm having the same problem with the getltscfg
<faustino3331> i keeps saying exec format error could it be because the server is an amd64 and the client is an i386
<stgraber> how did you build your chroot ?
<faustino3331> with --arch i386
<faustino3331> but it made a amd64 image to
<faustino3331> before my image for the i386
<faustino3331> automatically
<stgraber> ok, can you check /etc/inetd.conf and tell me what's on port 2000 ?
<stgraber> is that amd64 or i386
<faustino3331> i will check tomorrow morning
<faustino3331> i've taken phtos from the error
<faustino3331> in console 1
<faustino3331> and in console 8
<stgraber> you can probably try the following:
<faustino3331> can it be useful to trace my problem
<faustino3331> ?
<stgraber> - drop the two lines (2000 and 2001) from /etc/inetd.conf
<stgraber> - rm -Rf /opt/ltsp
<stgraber> - rm -Rf /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp
<stgraber> - ltsp-build-client --arch i386
<stgraber> that should get rid of any existing chroot (amd64 and i386) and rebuild a clean i386 one
<stgraber> you should also make sure that /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf (I guess it's the path) points to /i386 and not /amd64
 * stgraber wonders if we should build an image when installing from an amd64 CD ... it's too late for this cycle but I guess that for next we should just not build a chroot as amd64 thin client aren't that common yet and it's most likely to break than to work
<faustino3331> if the path in dhcpd.conf points to  /amd64 it could be enough change it to point to i386?
<stgraber> probably, that's assuming the tftp configuration was generate correctly (it should be)
<faustino3331> i will try it tomorrow morning in school
<faustino3331> the kids ask me almost everyday when will the linux computers be working again
<faustino3331> i tried to upgrade from 8.04.1 to 8.10 and it stopped working
<faustino3331> so i've installed jaunty and tried to put ltsp to work
<faustino3331> and as i was changing ubuntu i've put two more disks
<faustino3331> so now i have 320 GB for the homes and 250 for the system
#edubuntu 2009-03-24
<embrik> I want my ubuntu hardy server to be a domain controller and that my pupils can log on to every workstations at school with a roaming profile - I haven't found any howto on this - does anyone know?
<bdoin> ogra: do you know the status of GCompris on Jaunty ?
<Yagisan> embrik, I'd start with investigating the samba package.
<embrik> Yagisan, I don't think samba is useful with roaming profiles
<embrik> Yagisan, every workstations will bee Ubuntu
<Yagisan> ...
<Yagisan> he did mention a domain controller ...
 * Yagisan goes to bed.
<ogra> bdoin, i'm not doing edu stuff anymore ... LaserJock might know more about the gcompris status
<Yagisan> O-o ogra - you don't do edu anymore ? I have been away for far too long.
<ogra> since about a year now
<ogra> i'm in the mobile team, caring mostly for ARM enablement this release
<Yagisan> cool
 * Yagisan acquired an eeepc to use as his main. I'll be looking forward to seeing anything that makes the battery last longer, and fitting on the screen ok
<Yagisan> anyway - off to bed.
<bdoin> ogra: thanks for the information
<davidgroos> Hi All!
<davidgroos> I'm currently in my classroom--on prep--and am trying to troubleshoot why only some of my LTSP 5 thin clients are booting
<davidgroos> They get to the screen where they attempt to PXE boot, looking for a DHCP and don't succeed and after 30 seconds or so exit.
<davidgroos> Would someone tell me where to start troubleshooting this?  I think it may be iTALC related.
<davidgroos> Somehow.
<davidgroos> Is this helpful?  I see warnings like this all the time and google hasn't been my friend for this one, yet:
<davidgroos> (in client_log)...
<davidgroos> [critical] isdServer::isdServer(...): could not start ISD server: The boutnd address is already in use
<davidgroos> typo: boutnd-->bound
<Ahmuck> david, i know nothing
<Ahmuck> with that out of the way, your ltsp clients are booting thin ?
<davidgroos_> Hi Ahmuck!
<davidgroos_> Thanks again for responding!
<davidgroos_> Yes-- some are booting thin, others aren't booting.
<davidgroos_> I've removed the HD and CD drives...
<davidgroos_> Gotta get back to teaching!
<davidgroos_> But I'll be back later...
<davidgroos_> Maybe I'll check out the LTSP room...  Later...
<faustino3331> stgraber: i've deleted everything in opt/ltsp and in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp and now the thin clients boot
<faustino3331> stgraber : i have an ioctl error in the thin clients but it boots and works so maybe it's not serious
<stgraber> yeah, it's the nbd reconnection process
<stgraber> haven't found a few to make it quiet
<faustino3331> so is not serious?
<faustino3331> it's just some little problem?
<faustino3331> i've tried thin-client-manager but it doesn't see any of my thin clients
<faustino3331> do i need to make something special?
<faustino3331> stgraber: and i've tried italc but it is to slow in control mode
<stgraber> did you try running italc on the thin client instead, I believe we have some doc on the wiki for that
<stgraber> basically installing italc-client in the chroot, syncronize the keys with the host, set START_ITALC=True in lts.conf and rebuild the image
<stgraber> but as I said, I think we have some doc
<Lns> faustino3331: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/iTalc
<faustino3331> thanks Lns and stgraber one more thing to read tomorow at school
<Lns> =) np
#edubuntu 2009-03-25
<kind_man> hello...
<Ahmuck> is there a gnu product similar to www.schoolloop.com?
<HedgeMage> Ahmuck: most of that is done by moodle, though if you want all of it you'll have to build something a bit more custom (I suggest using the open source CMS Drupal -- that plus a few contributed modules would mean almost no code must be written and maintained for it)
<HedgeMage> http://moodle.org/
<Ahmuck> any others come to mind
<Ahmuck> schoolloop is more of an informant to students and teachers and parents
<Ahmuck> to keep everybody on the same page.  moodle looks more like on-line courseware
<HedgeMage> Ahmuck: Not sure, though I've been talking with a teacher I know about doing something similar to that with Drupal... I just haven't had the time lately to dedicate to pro bono work
<Melcom> hi
<Melcom> How to Iknow if mu edubuntu disks is coming
<Melcom> Hi matt
<Melcom> Sorry to reapeat
<Melcom> How to Iknow if mu edubuntu disks is coming
<Ahmuck> how do you know if your edubuntu disks are coming ?
<LaserJock> I was going to ask "where did you get them from?"
<klaus87> Hi.  Is there a special group that I should assign a student to when creating an account?  It seems that when I create a 'regular' user, they have access to system controls. Thanks.
<faustino3333> klaus:do you create with the gui or in comand line?
<klaus87> faustino3333- I create users with the gui.  I don't see a 'special' group for students that would lock down the machine a bit for them.
<faustino333> klaus: in the priviliges tab you can choose what they can and can't do
<faustino333> klaus : i don't know if it's enogh
<faustino333> enough
<vplug> salve, qualcuno sa come cambiare la porta del servizio dhcp di un server linux?
#edubuntu 2009-03-26
<lazzurs> Hello guys, are many people up or are you all mostly US based?
<faustino3333> lazzurs: middle of the atlantic, in Pico island from Azores Portugal
<lazzurs> wow that is kinda cool :)
<faustino3333> why?
<lazzurs> just being on a small island :)
<faustino3333> it's not that small it has 447sqkm
<faustino3333> just 15000 habitants
<faustino3333> where do you live?
<lazzurs> in Scotland
<faustino3333> it's also an island a little bit bigger but it's an island
<lazzurs> indeed :)
<cyclops> hi all, I'm trying to install clustering. Having trouble starting tftpd-ha. it doesn't show as listening in netstat or running in ps.
<lazzurs> cyclops: not that I know anything about the edubuntu setup but are you sure it is not running from inet/xinetd ?
<cyclops> lazzurs, it's actually ubuntu 8.04x ,install docs from edubuntu easyclustering. I did set up as service  in inetd. per wiki-docs
<lazzurs> cyclops: cool well if it is running from inetd then you will only see a process running when it is being used
<cyclops> when I issue command: sudo /etc/init.d/tftpd-hpa restart , nothing happens & nodes do not boot.
<lazzurs> that is what inetd does, it listens on the port for the application and when a connection comes in it starts the application
<lazzurs> if you are going to start it with the init.d script then you will have to reconfigure it to run as a daemon rather than through inetd
<cyclops> I believe that it is set that way .
<lazzurs> cyclops: can you paste in a link to the wiki page you are working from?
<cyclops> stndby
<cyclops> lazzurs, https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EasyUbuntuClustering/UbuntuKerrighedClusterGuide
<lazzurs> cyclops: ok so if you followed that guide then it is running from inetd and is most likely working fine
<cyclops> lazzurs, dhcp3 starts, nfs-kernel starts. testing with default ubuntu image 1st , not kerrighed- though I did patch a kernel.
<cyclops> yet I can't get a node to boot.
<lazzurs> what happens when it boots?
<cyclops> nothing , pxe is looking for dhcp server
<ogra> thats not a tftp error
<cyclops> I am on the server machine now. 2 x nics
<ogra> are you sure there is no second dhcpd running anywhere in your network ?
<lazzurs> ok so the nic eth0 that dhcp will be listening on, is that the same network that the clients are running on
<cyclops> eth1 (100x) dhcp client to internet eth0 (1000x) dhcp3-server ,just 1 node connected right now on a switch.
<lazzurs> and that node is connected to eth1?
<cyclops> no to eth0
<cyclops> eth1 is traight out to firewall & internet
<lazzurs> what address do you have on eth0 and did you copy the dhcp configuration exactly from the wiki?
<cyclops> netstat -lu does not show tftp listening on udp.
<lazzurs> cyclops: it might show inetd listening however...which might need restarted after the reconfiguration
<lazzurs> that document is broken TBH
<alkisg> cyclops: to restart the tftp server, you do: sudo invoke-rc.d openbsd-inetd restart
<alkisg> To test the tftp server, just install a tftp client and try to connect and download a file from the server
<alkisg> To see if the dhcp server is running, you do: sudo invoke-rc.d dhcp3-server status
<cyclops> sudo invoke-rc.d openbsd-inetd restart
<cyclops>  * Restarting internet superserver inetd                                 [ OK ]
<cyclops> Status of DHCP server: dhcpd3 is running.
<alkisg> sudo apt-get install tftp-hpa (that's the client)
<alkisg> tftp localhost
<alkisg> get /ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg
<cyclops> still don't see any change in netstat -lu for tftp , not listed
<cyclops> I am not using ltsp.
<alkisg> OK, use a different test file
<ogra> if your PXE client looks for an address you are not even near the tftp stage
<alkisg> You don't see this in netstat -lu? udp        0      0 *:tftp                  *:*
<cyclops> no
<cyclops> am starting tftp as per the docs - easyubuntuclustering.
<ogra> "<cyclops> nothing , pxe is looking for dhcp server"
<ogra> thats what you said above
<cyclops> ok so then i should look 1st to dhcp3-server error, as node is still looking for dhcp.
<ogra> ltsp or not, if your pxe client is looking for a dhcpd that should be the first issue you solve ....
<cyclops> I have the dhcp-conf set to hand out fixed, no range. i will try to change to a range.
<ogra> woah, thats a broken guide
<ogra> there seems to be not a single default he doesnt set differently for no purpose at all
<cyclops> ogra, thanks for the info. so what scrap the installation?
<ogra> well, it seems to have worked for him
<ogra> just debugging something that was set up after suchg a guide isnt easy, since all defaults are different
<ogra> # /etc/default/dhcp3-server #
<ogra> interfaces="eth0"
<ogra> thats just mean
<ogra> #Defaults for tftp-hpa
<ogra> RUN_DAEMON="YES"
<ogra> OPTIONS="-l -s /srv/tftp"
<ogra> that completely contradicts with the part below
<ogra> your tftp cant start if its run by two daemons ... it will just clash
<cyclops> I realize that, it seems the only guide around dealing with kerrighed.
<ogra_> start with reverting /etc/default/dhcp3-server and /etc/default/tftpd-hpa
<ogra_> (this netsplitting of freenode is annoying today)
<ogra> oh, the inetd setup surely breaks if you dont use xinetd
<ogra> (which isnt the default inetd in ubuntu)
<ogra> trying to apply xinetd configs to openbsd-inetd isnt going to work at all
<cyclops> ogra, so apt-get install xinetd?
<ogra> no
<ogra> use the instealled inetd
<ogra> just remove the cruft you added per that howto
<ogra> then comment in the old tftp line
<cyclops> ok :)...nice vocabulary.
<ogra> and if you really want to go with /srv/tftp change the old line from /var/lib/tftpboot to /srv/tftp
<cyclops> yes, doing that now.
<ogra> then restart openbsd-inetd
<ogra> i dont get why he makes you add xinetd config to /etc/inetd.conf
<ogra> that doesnt make any sense at all
<cyclops> ok restrarted  inetd
<ogra> now try what alkisg told you
<cyclops> i see tftp in netstat.
<ogra> ah, good
<ogra> now to your dhcpd
<cyclops> ok
<ogra> did you revert /etc/default/dhcp3-server ?
<ogra> interfaces="" is the correct setting
<cyclops> u mean revert back to default orig?
<ogra> right
<cyclops> stndby.
<ogra> setting the inetrfaces line enforces dhcpd to start even if it cant serve anything ... thats a very bad thing
<ogra> interfaces="" makes it run a selftest so it tells you if there is actually an interface it can work on
<cyclops> ok have the orig back
<ogra> good
<ogra> try to restart your dhcp3-server
<ogra> and see if it starts up
<cyclops> restart - fail.
<ogra> right, thats what i expected
<ogra> paste the output of "ifconfig -a" to paste.ubuntu.com
<cyclops> ogra,  done: http://paste.ubuntu.com/138395/plain/
<ogra> looks ok so far, do you use exactly the dhcpd.conf file from the howto ?
<LaserJock> highvoltage: ping
<cyclops> I did original, but now i deleted everything below for nodes, & left a range. I could revert-though.
<ogra> try that
<ogra> also you dont have ltsp installed, right ?
<cyclops> sory it is already orig per ur suggestion.
<ogra> else the files needs to be in /etc/ltsp/
<cyclops> stndby.
<cyclops> ogra, /etc/default/dhcp3-server & /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf are orig!
<ogra> and you dont have ltsp-server or ltsp-server-standalone installed, right ?
<cyclops> correct
<ogra> ok, so now copy the exact file from the howto in place for /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf
<cyclops> ok
<cyclops> ogra, there is a mistake with the howto conf, he is missing declaring subnet-mask.
<ogra> subnet 192.168.1.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 {
<ogra> looks ok to me
<cyclops> at the dns section ?
<ogra> # Information about the network setup
<cyclops> shall I try dhcp3 restart?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> it shouldnt fail
<cyclops> * Starting DHCP server dhcpd3                                           [ OK ]
<ogra> good
<ogra> you need to make sure the MAC addresses match for your nodes though
<ogra> else your clients wont get IPs
<cyclops> aw..not an easy thing with built in pxe boot on each.
<cyclops> what if i use etherboot?
<cyclops> do i still need the mac address?
<ogra> if you want fixed ip adresses for your nodes you always need the mac address
<cyclops> oh, i can be without fixed, don't think it's necessary.
<ogra> well, then just drop all the group stuff
<ogra> and add: range 192.168.1.20 192.168.1.250;
<alkisg> ...and also drop: deny unknown-clients;
<ogra> right in the subnet declaration
<ogra> that will serve dynamic IPs between 20 and 250
<cyclops> ok, for now i added the mac, & node 1 is trying to get tftp.
<cyclops> it didn't get tftp.
<ogra> whats the error ?
<cyclops> a timeout.
<ogra> do you have all files in place in /srv/tftp
<ogra> pxelinux.0, pxelinux.cfg, vmlinuz and initrd.img should be in there
<ogra> pxelinux.cfg being a dir with a single file in it called "default"
<cyclops> am defaulting to 1st test scenario, with initrd.img-2.6.24-23-generic & vmlinuz-2.6.24-23-generic & pxelinux.0
<ogra> pxelinux.cfg/default ?
<cyclops> yes
<ogra> and the file is configured right i assume ?
<cyclops> as per the howto 1st test setup
<ogra> try what alkisg said before
<ogra> tftp localhost
<cyclops> u mean local tftpclient?
<ogra> get pxelinux.cfg/default
<ogra> or get pxelinux.0
<cyclops> from where?
<ogra> tftp localhost
<ogra> get pxelinux.0
<ogra> try that
<ogra> after you installed tftp-pha
<ogra> *hpa
<cyclops> no get command
<ogra> can you elaborate ?
<cyclops> sorry, installed tftp-hpa, then tftp localhost, then get pxelinux.0 & transfer timed out.
<ogra> aha
<ogra> grep tftp /etc/inetd.conf ...
<ogra> paste the output here
<cyclops> tftp           dgram   udp     wait    root  /usr/sbin/in.tftpd /usr/sbin/in.tftpd -s /srv/tftpboot
<cyclops> aw, i see the mistake.
<ogra> :)
<cyclops> ok node 1 loading .
<cyclops> ok got a login prompt.
<ogra> good :)
<ogra> congrats
<cyclops> this is with default image, i will try with the kerrighed image-already made.
<cyclops> thank - mucho.
<ogra> enjoy
<cyclops> wait, i am going to reboot node to see if it works.stndby.
<cyclops> it didn't boot , bu i think it's a name problem , I will work on it. Thanks for all the help. the howto should be amended
<ogra> or fixed :)
<cyclops> might be  the patched kernel wasn't built properly , I will redo it.
<cyclops> ogra, I have the kerrighed image booting up now on node1
<ogra> good
<ogra> or bad, whatever kerrighed is :)
<cyclops> is supposed to be a replacement for openmosix using 2.6 kernels, or clustering as SSI.
<ogra> right, and i think there were reasons both was abandoned upstream
<ogra> but i dont have enough insight to judge :)
<cyclops> I understand.  I have some apps for a friend that needs massive  computing & rendering, so I was trying to help him.
#edubuntu 2009-03-27
<n2diy> anybody here concious and alert?
<freetown> no
<freetown> Zzzzz
<freetown> !bored
<ubottu> Sorry, I don't know anything about bored
<freetown> we need a new bot
<cyclops> ogra, hi. thanks again for help. I rebuilt the patch-kernel and made some config changes & cluster nodes now boot up. Have 2 as test units.
<cyclops> diego@jessica:~$ sudo krgadm nodes
<cyclops> 199:1 200:1
<whatch> I installed ubuntu 8.10 on a dell optiplex desktop, and added the education software to make it edubuntu.  It is serving thin clients via xdmcp.  Tux paint is in the education menu but when you select it nothing happens.  I have tried reinstalling from synaptic but with no luck.
<whatch> suggestions to remedy appreciated
<Ahmuck> whatch: ubuntu 8.10 or edubuntu?
<Ahmuck> oh, nm
<Ahmuck> does tux paint work from the server?
<whatch> I initially installed ubuntu 8.10, but have since added the educational software from an additional cd I downloaded.
<whatch> yes, it works on the server directly
<whatch> all other applications seem to work
<stgraber> whatch: tuxpaint won't work without sound
<whatch> ahhh
<whatch> no way to disable sound?
<whatch> thanks.  diable sound in tuxpaint.conf fixed problem
<Ahmuck> stgraber: why ?
<Ahmuck> that's odd
<stgraber> Ahmuck: something buggy with SDL IIRC
<Ahmuck> SDL again
<Ahmuck> is SDL going to get fixed?
<cyclops> hi all , would it be possible to have a swap file inside a chroot directory available to clients booting via tftp?
<alkisg> cyclops: is there a problem with the nbd swapping method?
<cyclops> alkisg, I am running a cluster via tftp boot. nodes are showing up , but with live ram memory. I could use a swap file if it were doable.
<alkisg> cyclops: isn't your chroot transferred to the clients as an nbd image?
<cyclops> yes.
<alkisg> So, a swap file would use tempfs and nbd.
<alkisg> Why not use the nbd swap deamon that is already installed with ltsp?
<cyclops> maybe i didn't create it when installing ubuntu in chroot /nfsroot
<alkisg> cyclops: http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtsConf#USE_NBD_SWAP
<cyclops> I didn't install ltsp, went straight to config cluster for nodes.
<alkisg> It's just an entry in lts.conf...
<alkisg> Ah, so you would just use the same service
<alkisg> *could
<cyclops> I will look into the ltsp swap , thanks
<alkisg> See also this: http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/SwapNbd
<alkisg> It looks ancient, but maybe it'll give you the necessary steps
<cyclops> am reading it now. It might do the job. thanks
#edubuntu 2009-03-28
<Ahmuck-Sr> i inserted a cd to play and the cd dialog came up on all the computers
<LaserJock> anybody alive in here?
<Ahmuck-Sr> what's that program that takes screenshots and put's them into one video for tutorials
<Ahmuck-Sr> LaserJock: /me is
#edubuntu 2009-03-29
<Svenstaro> Is it possible to use a classroom server with a single generic student account for the thin clients?
<alkisg> No - but you may use one for each pc
#edubuntu 2010-03-29
<bencrisford> hello highvoltage :)
<highvoltage> hey there bencrisford
<Yoe> stgraber: I'm a bit confused by how LP#504420 could happen. Do you think it's possible that whatever the SELinux-like thing that Ubuntu uses again (I always forget its name) is interfering with nbd-server, but that this restriction only kicks in once the file is larger than 200MB?
<Yoe> (in short: I'm trying to figure out whether this is a bug in my code, or in yours :-)
 * alkisg has been using 11Gb chroots in lucid with no problems...
<bencrisford> highvoltage: i had a look earlier on lp, there is an identicle bug to the qcad menu one i looked at yesterday
<bencrisford> and it says in the changelog it was fixed for jaunty
<bencrisford> but the bug i saw was for lucid...
<highvoltage> bencrisford: it could have been a regression, sometimes bugs that are fixed are re-introduced
<bencrisford> highvoltage: so i should continue working on yesterdays bug?
<highvoltage> bencrisford: if it's still present, then yes, by all means :)
<bencrisford> highvoltage: ok, im at school right now, but ill check it out when im home :) i had a look at the .desktop specifications earlier
<highvoltage> bencrisford: ok cool :)
<mhall119> highvoltage: stgraber: Comments on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/AppTemplate
<bencrisford> highvoltage: im thinking the problem might not be in the .desktop file..
<highvoltage> mhall119: what is that for and why is it necessary?
<highvoltage> (since that information is already all available in the package descriptions)
<mhall119> highvoltage: I'm making a template to use for documenting all of Edubuntu's games and other apps
<mhall119> not allthe info is available in the package
<mhall119> list age range
<mhall119> like
<mhall119> also, we can include more information about how the game is played, etc
<mhall119> this is part of what I was going to do for global jam
<mhall119> once the template is done, I'll start making pages for each of the games included in Edubuntu
<highvoltage> mhall119: ok. I can't think of any other information, that list seems quite comprehensive
<mhall119> how about which Edubuntu profile it's included in?
<highvoltage> we'll have to review that for the lucid+1 release. we'll probably be able to have tasks in Ubiquity then via a plugin
<highvoltage> so it could be useful
<bencrisford> highvoltage: im thinking of making some 200x200 gif edubuntu web buttons
<bencrisford> do any exist already?
<arauto> hi I am tried to use edubuntu + ltsp, but the thin-clients, 200MHz was very slow. Anyone can help me?
<alkisg> arauto: did you try LDM_DIRECTX=True in lts.conf?
<arauto> yes, i tried.
<alkisg> How much RAM do your clients have?
<arauto> 128M
<arauto> 200 MHz
<alkisg> They should work, not too fast, sure, but bearable...
<alkisg> Are you near a client? Which edubuntu version is that?
<arauto> 9.10
<alkisg> Can you run: ltsp-localapps xterm
<alkisg> while sitting on a client?
<arauto> just a moment
<Lns> i dunno about 200mhz...that's pretty crazy slow these days
<Lns> even for a terminal
 * alkisg has a 333 MHz one in his lab, it starts in 1:10 while the fastest one in this lab, 800 MHz, starts in 1:00...
<Lns> starting times vs. usage is very different, no?
<alkisg> Well... on usage I didn't notice any difference at all
<alkisg> It depends much on the graphics card, but not so much on the cpu with ldm_directx=false...
<alkisg> (of course nothing localapps* related...)
<bencrisford1> 128mb?  im surprised that even runs edubuntu...  i used to have a system with similar specs that failed to run xubuntu
<alkisg> bencrisford1: in LTSP the terminals are only loading a minimal system and are connecting to the server with something like remote desktop. So they can even boot with 64MB RAM.
<bencrisford1> alkisg: ah ok
<bencrisford1> :( pgp is giving me trouble again
<Lns> Yeah, the graphics card at that point is probably the most important piece (besides network of course)
 * bencrisford1 wants debuild to hurry up
#edubuntu 2010-03-30
<bencrisford> highvoltage: im working on packaging the latest scribus (bug 530820), im not assigning it to me, im just gonna see if i can manage to do it, which i probably wont be able to...
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 530820 in scribus "[needs packaging] Scribus 1.3.3.14 / stable for Lucid" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/530820
<bencrisford> do i set the maintainer as core-dev?  because it is in ubuntu main?
<Lns> Hey are there any instructions regarding manually copying a PPA's gpg key to the ltsp chroot? I want to make a wiki page on that
<alkisg> Lns: what about add-apt-repository ?
<alkisg> There are instructions on how to add a ppa on each ppa site...
<Lns> alkisg: well that's not in the default chroot install, i guess i could add that
<Lns> but it'd be nice to not have to put it in there for a single ppa ;)
<alkisg> Lns, afaik it is, karmic++...
<Lns> not in lucid for me...lemme verify
<alkisg> Hmmm o
<alkisg> no
<alkisg> Lns, sorry, you're right
<Lns> yea
 * alkisg has made a script for that purpose... http://ts.sch.gr/repo/add-ppa.sh
<Lns> wanted to write a quick howto to add stgraber's ppa on the wiki since its used so much
<Lns> ahh nice hehe
<alkisg> If you want, you can use that - I'm using it for instructions for greek schools:
<alkisg> wget http://ts.sch.gr/repo/add-ppa.sh -O /tmp/add-ppa.sh
<alkisg> sh /tmp/add-ppa.sh stgraber
<Lns> well it's about the same work to do that than to add add-apt-repository
<Lns> can you give me the line to import the gpg key?
<Lns> i can't find it in the script
<alkisg> sudo apt-key adv --keyserver keyserver.ubuntu.com --recv-keys XXXXXX
<alkisg> It's on every ppa page, if you click on the instructions...
<Lns> oh. i clicked on wrong instructions i guess =/
<Lns> ty
<stgraber> add-apt-repository ppa:stgraber/ppa ?
 * Lns wonders how indicator-applet sucked up volume control
<bencrisford1> lol Lns, what do you mean?
<bencrisford1> it disappeared?
<Lns> bencrisford1: no, it inherited the volume properties applet into itself..so if you remove indicator-applet from the panel, there goes your volume control
<Lns> and no (that i can see) individual volume control applet from "Add to Panel" menu
<bencrisford1> Lns: oh, i see, so you want volume with no email/bluetooth
 * Lns is starting to get really frustrated with the indicator/notification idea of shuttleworth's
<Lns> bencrisford1: I just don't want the stupid notifications, period
<Lns> i want to configure my panel the way i want it
<Lns> not an all-or-nothing applet that is assumed to be the "next big thing" and for everyone to follow suit
<bencrisford1> Lns: the current settings suit me, but id rather i had the option to go back to basics
<Lns> you can't even dismiss the notifications, you have to wait for them to go away on their own
<bencrisford1> and with pidgin for me, i get a notification and if i click it nothing happens :(
<Lns> right
<Lns> it's intrusive when the design is supposed to eliminate being intrusive with notifications...total oxymoron
<Lns> i don't get the reasoning for it...of course i just started looking at it, hopefully there's a way to configure it
<bencrisford1> who is responsible for notifications?
<Lns> ?
<bencrisford1> what team
<bencrisford1> is it desktop?
<Lns> probably..looking
<bencrisford1> well sabdfl stepped down as ceo in order to focus on design, i think we should write to him and ask him to design the old system again
<Lns> indicator-applet session is another one. Every time I click on my username or the little power-button icon, it goes back and forth between the two..they're so close together..yikes
<Lns> horrible design imho
 * bencrisford1 broke his panel fiddling about with indicators :'(
 * bencrisford1 wishes Lns had not got him playing about with it :(
<bencrisford1> just kidding, is fixed ;)
<Lns> heh
<Lns> it's touchy!
<bencrisford1> Lns: dont surpose you know how i can set maintainers name using dh-make?
<bencrisford1> im doing -e for the email
<bencrisford1> but its still setting the name to me
<Lns> no idea :)
<Lns> sorry
<bencrisford1> ill leave it till tommorrow then
<bencrisford1> i have 2 weeks off after tommorrow :D
<Lns> hehe, nice
<bencrisford1> which means staying up late..  fixing bugs...  playing gnometris...
<bencrisford1> anyway, night all
<Lns> Anyone experience complete desktop lock-up when doing things like enabling remote desktop, and it says "Checking the connectivity of this machine" ? As in, you can't click on *anything*, including gnome menus, etc
<Lns> (lucid beta1)
<Lns> hmm, vino-server is pegging the cpu
<Lns> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vino/+bug/31037
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 31037 in vino "Vino-server takes 90% of cpu when only listening for incoming connections" [High,Confirmed]
<Lns> Anyone in front of a Lucid install that can verify this?
 * Lns fires up a VM install of lucid
<Lns> hmm, seems to peg while checking whatever connectivity thingies it checks for..
<Lns> ahh, seemingly fixed with this afternoon's updates
<Lns> crazy how quickly things change in beta
#edubuntu 2010-03-31
<mssmss> hi
<mssmss> I recently set up hP 5145 thin clients with a 8.04 LTS edubuntu server
<mssmss> however the LCD screens are 1366x788 widescreen
<mssmss> however the thin client is not able to pick up the right resolution even when the X_Mode_0 setting in the lts.conf is set to 1366x768
<mssmss> any idea on how to get the thin client to come up with the right resolution ?
<vmlintu> mssms: do you know what display driver it is using?
<mssmss> how do I find out ?
<mssmss> and I thought the new widescreens would be better for the kids :-)
<mssmss> looks like folks are busy ... gotta go now ... will be back in a couple of hours to bug folks here :-)
 * bencrisford has finally got his pgp working under lucid...
<bencrisford> argh, bug 536975 is driving me insane
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 536975 in qcad "Qcad menu entry lacks a category in lucid 10.04" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/536975
<bencrisford> i can fiddle around in qcad.desktop make sure its ok with desktop-file-validate, spend ages running dpkg, to find it wont work :'(
<JackLD> Is there any work on developing Edubuntu curriculum ?
<bencrisford> JackLD: what do you mean exactly?
<JackLD> Well, I've helped set up a couple of computer labs, Edubuntu based. And after everyone gets used to the system, then they want to use it in a guided manner.
<JackLD> Nairobi
<bencrisford> JackLD: well edubuntu itself doesnt actually "teach" it just provides a platform for running educational software more successfully
<bencrisford> i have to go, ill be back soon
<bencrisford> sorry :/
<JackLD> That's right. It doesn't teach itself. But, is there any curriculum that is based on an Edubuntu framework ?
<bencrisford> JackLD: back, sorry about that
<bencrisford> im not sure..
<bencrisford> by curriculum you mean like courses for different subjects?
<alkisg> Something like this? http://www.linux-for-education.org/
<bencrisford> alkisg: isnt that just tutorials for using edu-distros?
<alkisg> bencrisford: not sure, I haven't read through them
<alkisg> nubae has speaking highly of that site..
<bencrisford> alkisg: it seems to be teaching about using edubuntu, and its opensuse conterpart and others
<bencrisford> i understood JackLD as wanting a curriculum for learning all sorts of different subjects
<bencrisford> i might have interpreted wrong though :P
<bencrisford> i do that alot...
<JackLD> Sorry, stepped away and didn't say anything. my bad.
<JackLD> I looked at LinuxForEducation, but the need is for kids who are low on education.
<alkisg> Can you give an example of what you're looking for?
<JackLD> Isn't there school curriculum (of some sort) that is coordinated with Edubuntu ?
<JackLD> K-12
<alkisg> I don't know of any curriculum associated with any OS
<alkisg> I only know of specific courses...
<JackLD> Yeah. I'm not sure I'm asking the right question. Here's the problem: I build a computer lab, but there isn't any tasks for the kids to accomplish.
<JackLD> It's like the computer lab is an "educational" entertainment center.
<bencrisford> is this an official school?
<alkisg> Usually the teachers decide for the tasks to teach
<bencrisford> alkisg: to a certain extent
<bencrisford> there is a national curriculum
<alkisg> right, I don't know the word to express that.
<alkisg> ^^^ that one, thanks
<bencrisford> so the government decides that kids need to be educated on, say..  convection currents in their science class, so the school teaches it
<JackLD> No. It's a children's residence (100 kids, aids orphans)
<alkisg> JackLD: so there will be no teachers around?
<Lns> JackLD: you can try http://frogandowl.org - #frogandowl
<JackLD> Adult supervision is about it.
<bencrisford> JackLD: imo, i think it would be pretty great if there was a curriculum to go with edubuntu
<bencrisford> but there isnt currently one
<bencrisford> what would be good is if included in the documentation was tasks
<Lns> you guys should join up with frog and owl - sbalneav is part of it too, we're trying to rally more people behind the initiative
<JackLD> Doesn't that seem odd ?
<JackLD> I'm looking at Frog and Owl, why do you think it's worth the effort ?
<JackLD> Oh, it's pretty raw. Nothing much in it.
<Lns> JackLD: it's a fairly new project. you have to start somewhere =)
<bencrisford> Lns: looks pretty neat
<Lns> it's worth the effort if you want to help shape the project!
<Lns> you're obviously interested in helping children get quality education
<JackLD> Agreed. I just want to know a little more. You know what, I'll contact them and see what they say.
<Lns> hop onto #frogandowl
<Lns> heh, no pun intended
<JackLD> Well, I think the real impact of FOSS is going to come from FOSS curriculum.
<JackLD> hop. I get it.
<bencrisford> JackLD: in scenarios like yours, it definately will be
<bencrisford> not everyone can afford to spend lots of money on tools like expensive education software, when there are more important things to pay for
<JackLD> Agreed. Thanks ! Oops. I have to go. Thanks
<Lns> The thing is, teachers come up with curriculum on their own most of the time. There just needs to be a facility to share them. It would be so easy to get something going. You just need supporters
<Lns> It doesn't have to cost money
<bencrisford> Lns: well, thats the thing, teachers dont have to, the curriculum is done by the government, well the teachers choose how to teach it i guess
<Lns> to an extent, yes
<bencrisford> i think national curriculums are bad :/
<bencrisford> they are needed for exams obviously
<Lns> bencrisford: teachers agree i'm sure
<bencrisford> but how much do the people who make them up actually know about learning
<bencrisford> they just want to come up with neat, pointless ideas so they get their christmas bonus
<Lns> how much do the F/OSS programmers actually know about coding? ;)
<Lns> meh
<Lns> you're generalizing all teachers
<bencrisford> im not criticizing teachers!
<bencrisford> teachers are awesome :P
<Lns> with a shared system you can find quality stuff because the more people look/add/modify it, the better it becomes
<bencrisford> i am generalizing the curriculum writers though
<Lns> give me an example of a curriculum
<Lns> straight from the writer/creator
<bencrisford> well the government makes the national curriculum
<bencrisford> which dictates everything students have to study
<bencrisford> in each age group
<Lns> ok
<Lns> so it gives generalized subjects they must learn about
<bencrisford> so the nc for science in the uk at gcse (high school) level, will say students must learn about products from oil
<bencrisford> well, it isnt the government at gcse i dont think, its the exam boards, but its approved by the government and the exam boards are closely linked to the government..?
<bencrisford> its complicated :P
<Lns> Tell me more =)
<Lns> I need to learn about this stuff hehe
<bencrisford> i just know what ive picked up from my mum, who teaches...
<bencrisford> and from my teachers...
<bencrisford> but the teachers are given guidelines for what they need to teach
<bencrisford> thats the idea behind it
<bencrisford> and then if they teach all the stuff, the kids do good in the exams
<bencrisford> if they dont, then the kids dont do well, and they get the sack :)
<bencrisford> the system seems to be thought out well
<bencrisford> and it should work well
<bencrisford> but what seems to happen is we only get taught stuff that comes up in exams
<Lns> well what you're saying is extremely generalized
<Lns> it leaves a lot of room for creativity
<bencrisford> which spoils the point
<Lns> right
<bencrisford> Lns: yes, it does
<Lns> that's the clincher...memorizing dates, names, key points...stuff that isn't easy to remember for most I'd guess
<bencrisford> but if you have an exam and a few months to learn all the stuff..  then you cant afford to do stuff that isnt in the exam
<bencrisford> and in subjects like science, it leaves so many areas unexplored
<Lns> bencrisford: yeah... are private schools tied to these curriculums too?
<bencrisford> Lns: yes, well at a higher level anyway
<bencrisford> in sort of primary (elementary) school, it is less strict i imagine
<Lns> interesting
<bencrisford> you have no (at least fewer) exams to prepare for
<bencrisford> i think its quite narrow in maths, because when you move on to middle/high school you need a basic understanding of many topics
<bencrisford> also in science and english
<Lns> so it would basically take an act of god/nature to change the requirements of national exams/tests, standards, etc...
<bencrisford> Lns: erm, curriculums do change
<bencrisford> i think
<Lns> but when I was going through school there were only a few "state exams" we had to do iirc
<mhall119> Lns: more like an act of congress/parlament
<Lns> mhall119: same thing ;)
<bencrisford> mhall119: not even sure it gets to parliament, just to the education minister probably
<bencrisford> or whatever the equivelent is for your country
<highvoltage> in south africa there are many schools who refuse to move to linux because a lot of their curriculum-aligned windows software won't run on it
<mhall119> in my country, Congress can legislate almost anything they want
<highvoltage> mhall119: and they do! :p
<bencrisford> mhall119: parliament could change the curriculum, but the curriculum doesnt need to be changed by pariliament :)
<bencrisford> like all labaradors are dogs, but not all dogs are labaradors
<bencrisford> kind of anyway :P
<mhall119> I don't get it
<mhall119> are you saying they're dogs?
<Lns> highvoltage: same in the U.S. basically
<bencrisford> if pariliament wanted to change something like that, they could, but it doesnt have to be them that changes it
<bencrisford> it could be the education ministry
<mhall119> ok
<bencrisford> i think it works that way
<mhall119> I get that
<mhall119> but the whole laborador thing threw me off
<bencrisford> the labarador thing is something we use in the uk :P
<bencrisford> like an analogy
<mhall119> ah
<mhall119> we use cats and lions
<mhall119> in the USA
<bencrisford> :P
<Lns> highvoltage: basically a tie between the educational software makers' capitalistic ideals/motives and the governments/interests that they lobby for
<mhall119> we also abuse the words "biscuit" and "jam"
<Lns> mhall119: where are you from in the U.S. ?? haha
<mhall119> Lns: Florida
<mhall119> the parts of it that are technically "in the south"
<bencrisford> mhall119: chalk and cheese is another of our favourites
<mhall119> where we do eat biscuits and jam, and drink tea
<Lns> much different than out in california
<mhall119> Lns: much
<mhall119> L.A. was so foreign to me
<bencrisford> tea?  on films you always wind us up about us drinking too much tea...
<mhall119> bencrisford: iced tea
<mhall119> without milk
<bencrisford> mhall119: oh :P i have had that abroad
<bencrisford> but i have never seen it in the uk
<mhall119> because that's just an affront against nature
<Lns> mhall119: L.A. is foreign to everyone outside of L.A. ;)
<bencrisford> well i know it exists
<mhall119> Lns: fair enough
<bencrisford> but i dont know where to get it
<mhall119> it's just the only part of California I've been in
<mhall119> bencrisford: you can make iced tea, you know
<Lns> iced tea is very popular out here
<bencrisford> mhall119: is it just cold tea?
<mhall119> bencrisford: not exactly, no
<bencrisford> oh :/ :P
<bencrisford> i dont really drink tea
<mhall119> first you brew some really strong tea, then if you're really southern (I'm not) you mix in sugar
<bencrisford> but apart from that i fit the british stereotype
<Lns> it's cold tea with lots of sugar!
<mhall119> then you dilute it in cold water and serve over ice
<Lns> or high fructose corn syrup ;)
<bencrisford> mhall119: cool
<mhall119> I was born in south Florida, which isn't really "southern", and was raised on unsweet iced tea
<bencrisford> ill try making some tommorrow
<mhall119> just don't put milk in it
<bencrisford> im on the coffee now, cos i dont want to fall asleep on my keyboard before the meeting
<mhall119> yeah, I've become addicted to coffee too
<Lns> ahh, coffee. The accepted addiction ;)
<mhall119> but iced tea is still my casual drink of choice
<bencrisford> mhall119: i drink my coffee far too strong now..  i started out on coffee very weak
<bencrisford> then i had it a bit stronger cos there wasnt much milk
<mhall119> Lns: there was a movement to ban coffee, but it's proponents got too tired by mid-morning
<bencrisford> the next time i made a weak one i just couldnt taste it
<bencrisford> mhall119: haha
<Lns> mhall119: hahahaha
<mhall119> cuban coffee is really really good
<Lns> it's so crazy out here, starbucks on literally every corner, sometimes 2 in a small shopping center
<mhall119> as strong as espresso, but slighly sweet
<bencrisford> i went through an espresso phaze, and now im hooked on strong black coffee
<mhall119> Lns: that's not just California
<bencrisford> espresso and sugar just dont mix for me
<mhall119> cuban coffee has a caramel sweetness, not sugary
<Lns> I try to limit myself to coffee about 2-3 times a week
<bencrisford> someone told me it was like coffee-syrup, so i tried...  but it was just.. not nice
<Lns> i'm extremely sensitive to caffeine
<mhall119> it's about as thick and smooth as hot chocolate
<bencrisford> it doest affect me too much
<mhall119> Lns: I do that too
<mhall119> only s/week/day/
<bencrisford> keeps me awake, but dont do anything else
<Lns> hehe
<highvoltage>  Edubuntu meeting in 10 minutes
 * Lns sounds the sirens
<mhall119> I had to stop drinking coffee after lunch time though, so I could sleep through the night
<bencrisford> i have a strong, black one to wake me up, but by the time im home is too late or i wont sleep
<Lns> ever try switching from coffee to tea?
<bencrisford> yes
<Lns> it worked well for me for a while
<bencrisford> by accident
<bencrisford> i just felt like a cup of tea
<bencrisford> i cant explain it..
<Lns> =p
<bencrisford> prolly cos i was so cold
<bencrisford> was very snowy
<bencrisford> and for about a week i was having 5 cups a day
<bencrisford> then i realised that coffee was stronger and controlled my caffeine addiction with less cups
<mhall119> you know what makes tea really good?
<mhall119> coffee
<bencrisford> coffee?
<bencrisford> lol
<bencrisford> haha i cant say ive ever tried mixing them
<mhall119> I actually put finely ground coffee in my BBQ rub, it's really tasty
<Lns> hahahah
<Lns> i put coffee grounds on my TOOTHBRUSH!
<mhall119> I use the toothbrush to remove them
<Lns> just kidding. maybe.
<bencrisford> Lns: hahahaha
<bencrisford> toothpaste and coffee actually mix...
<bencrisford> i normally drink my coffee after brushing my teeth
<bencrisford> and i quite like the "hint of mint" that comes with it
<mhall119> irish creme will do that too
<bencrisford> 186 people in ubuntu-meeting..  something tells me there not all there for our session :P
<mhall119> most of us stay there 24/7
<bencrisford> well i only attend edubuntu ones
<bencrisford> i used to attend others, when i was really active
<mhall119> I'm just lazy and never /part
<stgraber> meeting in 5 minutes #ubuntu-meeting
<mhall119> now I've got to go buy a soda, all this talk of caffinated beverages
<bencrisford> get some red bull
<bencrisford> :P
<mhall119> hell no
<bencrisford> lol
<bencrisford> i hate the feeling you get when you're caffeine levels suddenly deteriorate and you realise how tired you are
<highvoltage>  Edubuntu meeting starting in about one minute
<bencrisford> highvoltage: :)
<mhall119> anyway, I know all this information probably exists somewhere, but not all in the same place
<HedgeMage> oops, I meant to be there, but I forgot I'm in a different time zone than usual
<bencrisford> HedgeMage: we can send you minutes/log :)
<mhall119> highvoltage: is there any way to programatically add pages to the wiki?
<Lns> hi HedgeMage =)
<mhall119> without simulating http request/response thatis
<Lns> i mentioned frog and owl earlier to everyone here
<highvoltage> mhall119: short answer: yes
<mhall119> long answer?
<highvoltage> mhall119: few letters longer answer: I haven't done it yet and I'm not exactly sure, but I know it can be done
<highvoltage> mhall119: at the very least you could creat pages by doing the http posts directly
<mhall119> do you know how it would be done?
<mhall119> bitbucket.org lets you manage your wiki as an hg repository, thatn's extremely helpful
<highvoltage> mhall119: I might come up with something way to elaborate and unecessary, perhaps someone in #ubuntu-doc would know if there's alreeady a script for that
<HedgeMage> hi, Lns
<highvoltage> mhall119: if not, let me know and I'll also look into it
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: howdy!
<HedgeMage> bencrisford: if there are minutes lying around it'd be nice
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: hey there
<mhall119> highvoltage: if not, I'll just generate the markup and upload them by hand
<mhall119> not such a big teal
<mhall119> deal
<bencrisford> HedgeMage: i have the raw logs
<bencrisford> i could turn them into minutes
<mhall119> but if I could bzr branch the edubuntu wiki, add files and bzr push it back up, that would be sweet
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: I sent some notes to the list as well, not sure if you're currently subscribed
<highvoltage> (the edubuntu-devel list, that is)
<mhall119> highvoltage, stgraber: akgraner said she'd do an interview with someone about edubuntu
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: Web site update: theme is starting to look good, remaining forum work is dependent on getting that email account set up for it (though I may give up and throw one on my server in the mean time -- it's just a pain to move from one to the other)
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: not currently subscribed, but I'll check the archives, thanks
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: would be nice if you could put it on your server for now
<bencrisford> highvoltage: how does one go about hosting a bug day?  should i talk to bdmurray?
<HedgeMage> Will do
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: kubuntu got their logo today, so ours is probably close
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: Figures...I'll finish this then it'll arrive ;P
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: I have some ideas for colors and some css that you could apply based on the current edubuntu artwork that has been coming together in a kind of ad-hoc way
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: :)
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: "this?" where can we see?
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: give me a minute to check on LF then I'll upload when I'm back at the computer -- still need to finish block and menu styling, but page layout and header are done, as well as the back-end code for Fusion/Skinr compatibility (which I'll explain when I'm back)
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: ok great! thanks!
<bencrisford> highvoltage: where do i start for organising a bug day?
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: I'm back.  While that uploads (slowly...I'm travelling and the bandwidth is so-so) I'll explain the Fusion/Skinr thing.
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: One of my key concerns in putting together the new edubuntu.org is maintainability.  Volunteer turnover and available volunteer time are huge issues for a smallish project whose main focus isn't the web site.
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: In addition to choosing modules that are well maintained and supported, with clean upgrade paths between versions, automating some maintenance tasks that don't really require human attention, etc. I've spent time on making sure that someone without my expertise can help keep the site looking fresh and up-to-date:
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: This includes WYSIWYG editing, pathauto to handle alias creation, some menu system improvements, the forum/ML integration, and Fusion/Skinr, a combination which allows some prepared theming things to be handled in a point-and-click fashion from the Drupal UI...
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: So, if you need a feature block on the front page when I'm not around, you (as back-up administrator) could click-and-drag it off the list to the "above content" region, then hit it's config, set it to 40% the width of the content area, and apply one of a number of pre-written styles to it to draw the reader's eye, all without ever typing any code.
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: It takes longer to code on the front-end, but is much more maintainable in the long run, I think. :)
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: ok, I'm glad that you're thinking of this, we'll sort out that at least 2 people will have filesystem-level access (I think we may have already even, I'll check up)
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: I think we already have a bunch of admin users, but it could be much better co-ordinated
 * HedgeMage nods
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: how is your schedule for the next two weeks? will you still be traveling?
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: I get home this weekend, then I'm home until the 17th, then I'm at DrupalCon in SF until the following Friday, then I'm home again.
<highvoltage> bencrisford: I would say that the first steps is, plan what we're going to do (even if it's just 2-3 bullet points) and then announce it to the list(s), blog about it, etc
<bencrisford> highvoltage: ok sounds good
<bencrisford> it would get so much more publicity if you or another one of the members amongst us posted it to planet
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: ok, I think we should perhaps set a few hours aside at some point where we get the web-team together and put some plans down in terms of maintainability
<highvoltage> bencrisford: I'll certainly do it! just tell me what I should write, or if you blog about it first I could just link to you
<bencrisford> highvoltage: ok :), ill see what i can do tonight, because i have tonight and tommorrow morning, then im busy till sunday
<bencrisford> and after wednesday next week im gone till the following monday
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: That sounds like a plan, though I'd rather not schedule it while I'm on the road -- things can be unpredictable :)
 * bencrisford just set up email on his phone, and has found its quite annoying when ever few seconds its ding-ing
<HedgeMage> lol bencrisford
<bencrisford> i blame bugmail
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: *nod* at least it's not release-critical, and we have until the 29th of April until release
<bencrisford> :P
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: would still be ideal to have the site up by the release
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: np -- we could do something next week, any night except Tuesday or Thursday, or during the business day if we can keep it under an hour.
<HedgeMage> (I'm EDT when at home, for reference)
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: ok
<highvoltage> ok, I'm about 2-3 hours ahead of EDT most of the time
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: who else is involved with the webstuff besides you and I and vikram?
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: I haven't been involved in ages, officially it was Philip's baby... but since he actually had a real life baby he couldn't spend any time on it
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: let me get the access list...
<highvoltage> "4 years 2 weeks"
<highvoltage> wow, that is an old drupal site :
<highvoltage> :)
<bencrisford> highvoltage: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay/Organizing - where would i be without the wiki :P
<HedgeMage> heh
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: hmm, looking at the list itt's basically just myself and stgraber that's really still involved, we'll do some rebooting of the team when we set some time for the site stuff
<HedgeMage> ok
<highvoltage> bencrisford: great!
<highvoltage> bencrisford: yes I forgot about that
<bencrisford> highvoltage: so i email edubuntu-devel, edubuntu-bugs and then have a chat via email/irc with the ubuntu bugsquashers and see if we cant organise some collaboration?
<bencrisford> then ill work on spreading the word, blogging, etc :)
<bencrisford> because the bugs that affect the edubuntu packages also affect the same packages if used in ubuntu, so they're their bugs as well
<highvoltage> bencrisford: yep!
<bencrisford> okey dokey :)
<bencrisford> highvoltage: what are we going to do about the advocacy team..  there are 31 applications dating back as far as 2006 and as recent as 2010...
<highvoltage> bencrisford: what we've done in other similar teams is reject all of them with an explanation and also inviting them to re-apply if they're still interested
<bencrisford> highvoltage: ok
<bencrisford> once lucid is released and things are a little less hectic, could we set up a ppa for the team
<bencrisford> for sharing/uploading marketing material
<HedgeMage> Current web demo now up @ http://edubuntu.frogandowl.org/
<highvoltage> bencrisford: well, ppa's are for packages specifically
<highvoltage> bencrisford: but we could set up a bzr branch for that in LP
<bencrisford> highvoltage: i guess thats what i meant by ppa, i dont know why i say half the things i say somethimes :/
<bencrisford> JackLD: hi
<JackLD> hey, back at ya
<bencrisford> HedgeMage: that looks awesome :)
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: nice! are you going to populate the database today as well!
<highvoltage> oops, meant a question mark there
<bencrisford> JackLD: so, i have been thinking a little about what you were saying before
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: It depends on how sleepy I am tonight...this is LF's spring break trip, and he has me hopping!
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: I will endeavor to do so, but no promises.
<JackLD> OK, I was thinking I needed to write up a case study
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: that's good enought for me :)
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: Speaking of which, I have to get going -- certain burgers were promised to certain munchkins ;)
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: see you later!
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: I'll never stand between anyone and burgers, have fun!
<HedgeMage> hehe, thanks :)
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: before you go... if you have 10 seconds...
<bencrisford> JackLD: well, it would be a nice thing to have, but in edubuntu there are roughly 30-50 packages, so to write excersizes/lessons that are going to keep kids occupied for long for every package..
<bencrisford> it would take alot of work
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: Lady Gaga says in her new music video "You know what they say, once you kill a cow, you gotta make a burger", I found it quite amusing :)
<JackLD> It would take work - - but I have an example. My computer lab was so successful at the orphanage, that the equipment . .
<JackLD> was replaced with laptop. The original equipment (PIII Dell Optiplexs with 384 M of RAM) were repurposed to a village, about 4 hours away. A village with no electricity. They run a generator to get the workstations up and running.
<JackLD> But there is no way that we can get someone savvy in all the things that can be accomplished on Edubuntu. So, the kids sort of pick and choose their way around.
<bencrisford> JackLD: keep following frog and owl, its a shame i cant think of anything to suggest that you can use straight away though, because it sounds like you're doing great work down there
<bencrisford> JackLD: all i can suggest is setting the kids tasks when they're on the computers
<JackLD> Well I'm in DC. I want to go back this summer. I'll look harder at Frog and Owl. Thanks.
<bencrisford> if they're all doing the same thing you can help them easier and they can help each other
<bencrisford> tuxtype would support that quite easily
<bencrisford> so tell them to do a certain game with a certain word list
<JackLD> Tuxtype is great. But, after a week of it, then what ? I don't want to just do busy work.
<bencrisford> JackLD: i understand, it would be so much easier if something existed that could help you
<bencrisford> but im not sure it currently does
<JackLD> Thanks Ben, much appreciated. I'm going to head out. ltr
<bencrisford> highvoltage: its when someone comes on and tells you they've been using edubuntu to educate aids orphans when you really remember why you do this stuff :)
<highvoltage> bencrisford: yeah, that's the kind of thing you never get tired of hearing :)
<bencrisford> highvoltage: are we going with next tuesday for the bug day?
<highvoltage> bencrisford: yep, that sounds good
<Lns> http://www.freetech4teachers.com/ - might be useful information here
<bencrisford> Lns:  Is that for JackLD?
<Lns> for anyone
<bencrisford> oh ok
<highvoltage> I'm off to sleep, goodnight everyone
<bencrisford> Lns: http://pastebin.com/npvNQnju - how does that look as an email to send out to bugsquad and edubuntu-devel?
<bencrisford> i wanted to be as polite to bugs as i could without begging :p
<Lns> Sounds good to me =)
<bencrisford> ok, i wanted to check with someone important first :)
<bencrisford> i feel confident enough to hit send now
<bencrisford> thanks
<bencrisford> :P
<Lns> lol
<Lns> I'm not very important here
<Lns> I'm mostly just a cheerleader
<bencrisford> cheerleaders are important to me .. :0
<bencrisford> :)*
<Lns> haha
<Lns> well i'm glad to toss my pom-poms around for everyone in this chan!
<bencrisford> haha, at the UDS they should have a football game :P
<bencrisford> gnome vs kde :P
<bencrisford> xfce can referee
<bencrisford> its times like this when you get an idea of how my mind works...
<Lns> hahahha
<Lns> it's nice just to chew the fat once in a while
<Lns> i probably do it way too much around here though ;)
<bencrisford> Lns: http://benc235.wordpress.com/2010/03/31/edubuntu-bug-day/ :)
<bencrisford> will you be able to take part?
<Lns> bencrisford: i think i can
<Lns> hopefully the ubuntu bugsquad won't be too hammered for release so they can help us out
<bencrisford> Lns: well, the pakages at http://tinyurl.com/EduBugs are still ubuntu packages
<bencrisford> so technically they are just working on ubuntu bugs
<bencrisford> but they happen to be the packages we need more work on
<Lns> true
<bencrisford> its just like any bug day for them
<bencrisford> but its a very special one for us
<bencrisford> hmm, should i stay up tonight or get some sleep...
<Lns> depends on if you have extra coffee ;)
<bencrisford> Lns: on nights like this i dont use coffee to keep me up...
<bencrisford> else if i decide i want to flop into bed i cant sleep
<Lns> you should look into meditation.. :) helps a lot for getting to sleep
<bencrisford> Lns: they tried to teach us meditation in school, and half the people fell asleep, so i imagine it would help, yeah :P
<Lns> hahaha, yeah
<Lns> it's hard not to fall asleep the first few times
<Lns> or if you haven't done it in a while
<bencrisford> Lns: i dont normally sleep well anyway, so i think that makes it easier for me
<bencrisford> i just found it peaceful :)
<bencrisford> but i couldnt find the time to do it
<bencrisford> not regurlarly anyway
<Lns> haha...that's the catch. you can never find time..but if you think about it, 15-30 min a day is easily gained by cutting out things like procrastination..hehe
<Lns> i have to work on that too
<bencrisford> haha me too
<bencrisford> i have two weeks off now, and i shouldnt have nearly as much schoolwork as i have
<bencrisford> ive just been putting it off for ages
<Lns> that's good
<Lns> not that you've been putting it off, but that you have 2 weeks off with not much school work
<bencrisford> but thats the thing
<bencrisford> i do have quite alot now
<bencrisford> i shouldnt have
<Lns> oh
<Lns> well....get to it! =p
<bencrisford> next week :P
<bencrisford> got stuff to do tommorrow
<Lns> hehe
<bencrisford> and the rest of the week :P
<Lns> well have a nice 2 weeks off anyway, do some fun stuff
<bencrisford> im planning on getting alot of ubuntu stuff done
#edubuntu 2010-04-01
<bencrisford> and hopefully some school stuff...
<Lns> right on
<bencrisford> why is there not an edubuntu app that writes essays for you :/
<Lns> i think there are websites for that ;)
<bencrisford> lol#
<bencrisford> grr, i need to stop shake off my tetris addiction
<Lns> alright i'm out for the day, goodnight all
<Lns> and bencrisford, stop playing tetris =p
<bencrisford> Lns: lol, ive stopped now
<bencrisford> :)
<Lns> have a good one
<bencrisford> night
<bencrisford> i think its time for me to call it a night
<bencrisford> later ;)
<HedgeMage> ping, nixternal
<bencrisford> Morning all :)
 * bencrisford wonders what the difference is between a .desktop and a .desktop.in file
<highvoltage> bencrisford: .desktop.in is used by make to build the .desktop file
<bencrisford> highvoltage: directhex answered me on #ubuntu-motu earlier, but thanks anyway :)
<bencrisford> did you get my email?
<bencrisford> i finished the blog post just after you went, so i emailed it
<highvoltage> I got a bunch from you, will look at them all in a few mins :)
<bencrisford> highvoltage: a bunch?  really?
<bencrisford> oh, the ones i sent to the mailing lists
<bencrisford> 3 of them are probably the same :P
<highvoltage> bencrisford: heh yes, counting in the lists as well
<bencrisford> :)
<bencrisford> highvoltage: i saw the blog post, thanks :)
<highvoltage> bencrisford: cool :)
<bencrisford> highvoltage: i saw your second post on linux.uk.com
<bencrisford> i have a feeling this bud day's gonna go well :)
<bencrisford> ill do some more work on spreading it when i get some time
<bencrisford> possible tonight
<highvoltage> bencrisford: perhaps you should put the bug day on the fridge calendar as well so that it gets on to Ubuntu Weekly News
<bencrisford> highvoltage: i can do that? :S
<highvoltage> bencrisford: yep, let me get the instructions...
<bencrisford> i think ive found them
<bencrisford> i just open the fridge calendar on my gmail account, and add the bugday?
<highvoltage> bencrisford: you have to add it as a guest, here's the instructions: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Fridge/Calendar
<highvoltage> yep
<bencrisford> i add it at the top?  for the whole day?
<highvoltage> I think that's ok
<bencrisford> hmm, it says im adding it to calendar "bencrisford(at)googlemai..."
<bencrisford> highvoltage: is that right?
<bencrisford> i dont think ive added it to the calendar, just to my one :S :(
<highvoltage> bencrisford: yes, that's right
<highvoltage> bencrisford: you do that and then you invite the fridge as a guest (like on the wiki page)
<bencrisford> highvoltage: ok ty
<bencrisford> seems to have worked
<highvoltage> bencrisford: yep, I see it
<bencrisford> :)
#edubuntu 2010-04-02
 * bencrisford thinks its time for sleep
<bencrisford> night all
<bencrisford> morning all
<bencrisford> highvoltage: has anyone spoken to jcastro about edubuntu openweek sessions?
<highvoltage> bencrisford: not sure, previously stgraber organised our openweek sessions
#edubuntu 2010-04-03
<bencrisford> highvoltage: ah ok
<bencrisford> stgraber: are edubuntu hosting any openweek sessions?
<sparker> My clients are not connecting to my new 9.1 install.
<sparker> I already had some trouble configuring dns so guess that my eth1 also needs configuring but I dont know how -
<sparker> Anyone able to help a Noobie?
 * bencrisford thinks 1.10am is time for bed...
<bencrisford> night all
<Noob1e> Is any oneavailable for support?
 * bencrisford is a bit concerned about gcompris
<bencrisford> the games are really neat, my 4 year old cousin really enjoyed himself on it
<bencrisford> but when its not in a game
<bencrisford> it crashes every 30 seconds
<bencrisford> and eventually it renders my pc useless and i have to reboot
<bencrisford> reboot by pressing the power button, which i despise doing
<bencrisford> it makes me wonder whether we should include something in our packages that could damage someones computer...
<bencrisford> it needs *alot* of attention
<mhall119> bencrisford: I've never had a problem with gCompris before, what version are you running?
<bencrisford> mhall119: im not entirely sure, but it is updating so i obviously dont have the latest..  but i came back to ubuntu a week ago so whatever version i have it was the latest a week ago
<bencrisford> i never used to have trouble with it
<bencrisford> but now it hangs, and takes a long time to load up stuff
<bencrisford> once you are in a game it runs fine
<bencrisford> but i have trouble getting back to the main menu and quitting
<mhall119> bencrisford: on 10.04?
<bencrisford> yes
<mhall119> hmm, I'll have to try it
<bencrisford> my lil cousin absolutely loved the games, well the one we got working...
<mhall119> I ran it on alpha 2 without a problem
<mhall119> it has all kinds of good stuff for 4 year olds
<mhall119> childsplay too
<bencrisford> well i dont see how it would be my hardware, when ive just spent 3 hours playing heroes of newerth without trouble :P
<bencrisford> yeah
<bencrisford> i wasnt sure how good the content was, so i was interested to see what he thought
<bencrisford> and he loved the number matching game with the butterflies
<mhall119> could be an sdl bug or something
<bencrisford> hmm
<mhall119> try childsplay and see if it does the same
<bencrisford> well, im just concerned about it because we now know that people are using edubuntu for stuff like educating aids orphans...
<bencrisford> and they cant afford to have their computers broke..
<bencrisford> i dont have childsplay installed, hang on, ill install now
<mhall119> when you're at the main gCompris screen, do you hear music playing?
<mhall119> I ship gCompris with Qimo, which is used by a lot of low income families, or ones with special needs kids, so I know how important it is that things just work
<bencrisford> yeah i hear the music :)
<bencrisford> childsplay seems to work fine btw
<mhall119> hmmm....
<mhall119> I'll check it out, need to rebase Qimo on the beta today anyway
<bencrisford> mhall119: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/~edubuntu-bugs/+packagebugs-search?field.distribution=ubuntu&field.sourcepackagename=gcompris&search=Search
<bencrisford> there seem to be a few reports of crashes/hangs there...
<Johnkx> Hi
<Johnkx> I need help with something
<bencrisford> Johnkx: whats the problem? :)
<Johnkx> Hi
<Johnkx> Uhm
<Johnkx> there's something wrong with the flash plug-in on youtube
<Johnkx> whenever I try to watch
<bencrisford> Johnkx: ok, have you recently installed/upgraded your edubuntu?
<Johnkx> I can't move that bar for viewing and I can't click on the pause button too
<Johnkx> oh.. I'm not using edubuntu, just ubuntu
<Johnkx> >_> I guess there's a difference huh
<bencrisford> oh :/, this is the edubuntu channel, but i might be able to help you anyway
<bencrisford> next time, try #ubuntu
<Johnkx> cool thanks
<bencrisford> so you can view the video?
<Johnkx> oh ok
<bencrisford> just not control it?
<Johnkx> yes I can
<Johnkx> yep
<bencrisford> hmm
<bencrisford> you're using firefox?
<Johnkx> yes
<Johnkx> Firefox ver. 3.5.8 For ubuntu
<Johnkx> canonical - 1.0
<bencrisford> has this suddenly stopped working?  or is it a new install?
<Johnkx> its a new install
<Johnkx> I tried using other flash plugins but adobe's the only one that works
<Johnkx> works but not perfectly :P
<bencrisford> do you have 64bit?
<Johnkx> yes
<bencrisford> did you download the 64bit flash plugin?
<bencrisford> http://labs.adobe.com/downloads/flashplayer10_64bit.html
<Johnkx> oh, I didn't download it from this site
<bencrisford> thats an alpha development version
<bencrisford> so you might not want to try it..
<bencrisford> dont install that just yet..
<Johnkx> I got mine by using the install missing plugins that shows up whenever you don't have a flash plugin
<Johnkx> oh ok
<bencrisford> do you have desktop effects?
<Johnkx> yes
<bencrisford> compiz?
<Johnkx> yep
<bencrisford> run:
<bencrisford> sudo apt-get install compizconfig-settings-manager
<bencrisford> in terminal
<bencrisford> tell me when thats done
<Johnkx> done
<bencrisford> now run ccsm
<bencrisford> and disable the video plugin
<bencrisford> "Video Playback"
<Johnkx> oh ok
<Johnkx> done
<bencrisford> now try youtube
<bencrisford> if it still doesnt work, try re-enabling.  i have looked on forums and someone tried disabling and found it worked when they re-enabled after
<bencrisford> hows it looking?
<Johnkx> i still can't click it
<Johnkx> should I try re-enabling it?
<bencrisford> give it a go
<bencrisford> im not sure why it would work, but people have said it does
<Johnkx> for some reason youtube's site is really slow at this time
<bencrisford> btw, you did restart firefox before testing it?  after you disabled video playback?
<Johnkx> yes
<bencrisford> ok goof
<bencrisford> good*
<bencrisford> and any other apps using flash?
<Johnkx> nope
<bencrisford> well disable video and close all applications using flash
<bencrisford> then open firefox and try youtube
<bencrisford> :)
<Johnkx> ok
<bencrisford> hows it going??
<Johnkx> not working
<bencrisford> and restarting + re-enabling?
<Johnkx> yeah I've been trying it for a while
<Johnkx> no luck
<bencrisford> ok
<bencrisford> alright, im running out of suggestions
<bencrisford> try disabling desktop effects
<bencrisford> and seeing if it will work
<bencrisford> that way we can find out if it is compiz that is the problem
<bencrisford> if it is, then we can re-enable and find a fix, else we can find out what the problem is
<Johnkx> ok
<Johnkx> I just disabled visual effects
<bencrisford> be sure to restart the flash applications first
<Johnkx> from Appearance preference and yea i closed it already
<bencrisford> ok
<Johnkx> omg..
<Johnkx> found the problem
<Johnkx> haha
<bencrisford> ? :P
<Johnkx> It was the visual effects
<bencrisford> ok, now we have to find a fix
<bencrisford> on forums a few people have suggested different things
<Johnkx> so yeah basically whenever I enable Visual effects on Extra my flash doesn't work properly
<Johnkx> and when i turn it off it works
<bencrisford> the problem is compiz+flash
<Johnkx> ahh
<mhall119> Johnkx: try enabling/disabling hardware acceleration in the flash configuration
<Johnkx> ok
<Johnkx> btw just so you know, I can't enable/disable the hardware acceleration when my VE is working
<mhall119> try changing it while VE is off, and see if that makes a difference
<Johnkx> yeah I did that too
<Johnkx> I just turned it off and it did
<Johnkx> and I used VE again and see if it works, but it didn't
<bencrisford> mhall119: it sounds like compiz is fine, flash is fine, but together they dont work
<Johnkx> ohh
<Johnkx> yeah, sounds just like that
<bencrisford> mhall119: hes using 64bit, and compiz has always been a bit buggy there
<mhall119> I didn't even know flash was working on 64bit these days
<bencrisford> i hear its still pretty bad...
<bencrisford> but it must work, because Johnkx can view youtube when V.Effects are off
<Johnkx> yeah I can view youtube even if its on/off
<Johnkx> its just that I can't click it properly
<Johnkx> like pausing it
<Johnkx> or moving the time bar
<Johnkx> sometimes it works, but mostly it doesnt
<Johnkx> like when I spam click on it, It takes maybe 30-50 clicks before it pauses
<Johnkx> lol
<Johnkx> during when V.E is on
<Johnkx> everything works perfectly when its off
<Ahmuck> has anyone seen drawpile?
<Ahmuck> http://sourceforge.net/projects/drawpile/
<bencrisford> Johnkx: i have found another thread on forums...  they seem to be suggesting pretty much the same things we have been
<Johnkx> takes 4ever to download lol
<Johnkx> ohh
<Johnkx> I see
<bencrisford> Johnkx: theres a couple of things there we havent tried
<Johnkx> oh cool lets try it
<bencrisford> try editing /usr/lib/nspluginwrapper/i386/linux/npviewer
<bencrisford> and add this line the line before last:
<bencrisford> export GDK_NATIVE_WINDOWS=1
<bencrisford> thats what the guy on forums says...
<Johnkx> where can I see that /usr/lib/nsplugwin thingy
<Johnkx> should I type it in the terminal?
<bencrisford> you could go into terminal and type:
<bencrisford> sudo nano /usr/lib/nspluginwrapper/i386/linux/npviewer
<bencrisford> then add a line just before the last one
<bencrisford> export GDK_NATIVE_WINDOWS=1
<bencrisford> someone on forums suggested it
<bencrisford> once you have edited it
<bencrisford> press Ctrl+X
<bencrisford> then say yes to saving
<bencrisford> Johnkx: hows it going?
<Johnkx> lol sorry I'm really slow on using terminal. font is screwed up lol
<Johnkx> lol sorry
<Johnkx> whemn
<Johnkx> when I try to press ctrl - x
<Johnkx> it says xoff ignored, mumble muble
<bencrisford> ok, close without saving
<bencrisford> i dont feel confident suggesting this...
<bencrisford> i dont want to risk you breaking anything
<Johnkx> oh
<Johnkx> kk =p
<bencrisford> theres the 64bit flash download...  but thats an alpha version, so it doesnt come without risk either
<Johnkx> oh
<Johnkx> I guess I'll wait for the beta
<Johnkx> just wondering, how come they say Linux is better than windows, but linux has a lot of things that still doesn't work
<bencrisford> sorry about that
<bencrisford> Johnkx: did i miss any messages from you?
<bencrisford> i had computer trouble ;)
<bencrisford> Johnkx: im sorry, i have to go
<bencrisford> are you around later?  we could have another go at your flash
<bencrisford> bbl
<Johnkx> ahh na you didn't
<Johnkx> sorry about the late rep lol
<Johnkx> yeah sure, we can fix it later. Thanks btw
<bencrisford> night everyone
#edubuntu 2010-04-04
<jbicha> howdy, this was just posted about unbuildable packages and anki the flashcard programs was listed https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2010-April/000700.html
<jbicha> I was just checking if y'all knew whether the issues had been fixed already
<bencrisford> Happy easter everyone! :)
 * bencrisford wonders when kate will support vala highlighting...
<Kamping_Kaiser> hi all, long time no see
<bencrisford> Kamping_Kaiser: hi
<bencrisford> :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> bencrisford: :)
<bencrisford> Kamping_Kaiser: im not sure we've met before :), did you used to be active in edubuntu?
<Kamping_Kaiser> bencrisford: i was in the channel for a pretty long time, i never really 'did much stuff' for the project though.
<bencrisford> ive only been around since november-ish, but ive been away for some monthhs
<Kamping_Kaiser> bencrisford: i'm back because i might be about to get sucked in to a project involving edubuntu, so i thought i should start hanging out here again
<bencrisford> Kamping_Kaiser: sweet :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> i note the website references 8.10/9.04 and 9.10 as the latest version (in different places), so i was worried the project was totally gone
<bencrisford> do you think you can make it to our ubuntu/edubuntu collab. bug day on tuesdday? :)
<bencrisford> Kamping_Kaiser: its not in the best shape ...
<bencrisford> but were trying to sort all the problems :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> bencrisford: probably not, i work full time :( but i will stick it in teh calendar. global tuesday or tuesday UTC?
<bencrisford> Kamping_Kaiser: i should be around all day squashing bugs!  so whenever you can drop in, even if its for a few minutes
<bencrisford> it would really make a difference
<bencrisford> some of the bugs are for gutsy!
<bencrisford> it needs sorting
<Kamping_Kaiser> bencrisford: is the doco maintained in the wiki or in a bzr branch somewhere?
<Kamping_Kaiser> bencrisford: its in the calendar, i'll see if i can make it in here for a while
<bencrisford> Kamping_Kaiser: im not sure..
<Kamping_Kaiser> np
 * bencrisford is starting to worry about his caffeine addiction :/
<mhall119> bencrisford: are you stealing money for coffee yet?
<bencrisford> mhall119: not yet....
<mhall119> then you've still got a little ways to go before you should worry
<bencrisford> good point..
<bencrisford> Lns: evening
<Lns> 'morning bencrisford
<bencrisford> any of you have any experience with vala?  im stuck :/
<bencrisford> actually dont worry, all sorted :)
#edubuntu 2011-03-28
<mgariepy> good morning everyone
<highvoltage> good morning mgariepy
<vmlintu> good afternoon
<highvoltage> good afternoon vmlintu
<highvoltage> stgraber: on our todo list we have:
<highvoltage> [ ] Integrate seeded package list with Software Center for comments and ratings
<highvoltage> what's that again? has it been done or does it still need to be done?
<stgraber> highvoltage: website
<stgraber> highvoltage: the plan was to have a module that lists everything that's in our seeds with ratings & reviews + weblive integration
<highvoltage> stgraber: ah ok, so that's something that we should defer to Oreinic?
<stgraber> yeah, not impossible it gets done for natty but still pretty unlikely
<stgraber> it's not tied to the release cycle really, that's Drupal module development
<highvoltage> just tested amd64 live/install, it's looking good
<highvoltage> plymouth is still ugly with text-mode output, but that's not something we can fix now
<highvoltage> (going to check whether ltsp installation worked next)
<Guest56793> Hello,
<Guest56793> i ve a xubuntu in cpu and i ve a problem with my monitor.
<Guest56793> i need some help.
<Guest56793> where can i reach it
<Guest56793> ?
<alkisg> Guest56793: maybe in #xubuntu ?
<Guest56793> scue e,
<Guest56793> scuse me,
<Guest56793> the problem is in gnome
<Guest56793> dont worry,
<Guest56793> i think im solving it
<Guest56793> thanks
#edubuntu 2011-03-29
<alkisg> Good morning
<mgariepy> good morning everyone
<highvoltage> yay, for the first time in 6 years Edubuntu now has an Edubuntu LDM theme by default
<highvoltage> stgraber: and LTSP works fine again
<stgraber> yeah !
<highvoltage> (except that I only get a nautilus desktop and nothing else once I'm logged in without 3D, but at least the LTSP part works)
<highvoltage> mhall119: so ubuntu is all made by canonical?
<mhall119> highvoltage: don't you start :P
<LaserJock> hello Edubuntuland
<highvoltage> hey Lase<tab>
#edubuntu 2011-03-30
<mgariepy> good morning everyone
<highvoltage> Edubuntu meeting in around 10 minutes in #ubuntu-meeting
<vmlintu> highvoltage: are you around?
<highvoltage> vmlintu: I am indeed
<vmlintu> great.. I just read the logs from the debian-edu meeting and realised that uds is coming soon
<vmlintu> I started thinking if I should finally attend and try to actually get involved in something
<highvoltage> that would be great
<vmlintu> are there any plans for the next cycle yet? ideas? dreams?
<highvoltage> they're being formed, there are some things I'd certainly like to see improve
<highvoltage> ltsp live still needs some work
<highvoltage> if I could even just get the race with network manager fixed that would already be a win
<vmlintu> I've been just stuck with puavo development so I have no idea what is coming with natty
<highvoltage> natty turned out to be quite good (I didn't really expect that, it was quite a bumpy ride with early alphas)
<vmlintu> do you know yet who are attending uds?
<highvoltage> not exactly. I expect to be there. stgraber too
<alkisg> highvoltage: race with the network manager? meaning?
<vmlintu> there's also linuxtag in berlin during the same week
<alkisg> For 2 nic systems, you can set eth1 to "manual" in /etc/network/interfaces, then network-manager won't touch it
<highvoltage> alkisg: if you start ltsp-live before network manager has settled down, then network manager resets the IP as set by LTSP live
<alkisg> highvoltage: on 1 nic systems or 2?
<highvoltage> alkisg: either
<alkisg> highvoltage: need any help? I've looked into that
<alkisg> Either from /etc/network/interfaces, with manual, or in /etc/networkmanager/system-connections, define a connection you want
<highvoltage> alkisg: I know what needs to be done, we can basically ask network manager what its status is. I just haven't had time to do it this scycle
<highvoltage> *cycle
<alkisg> OK. Instead of asking, you can tell network manager to set a connection as you want it
<alkisg> And since it uses inotify, you can just drop a file there
<alkisg> And it'll instantly be used
<alkisg> For single nic systems I'd propose proxydhcp
<highvoltage> alkisg: yeah, I remember we discussed that before, but I just haven't had time for that. I'd like to give the  option to either proxydhcp, or start dhcpd on an alias
<alkisg> No need for aliases
<alkisg> Network manager supports multiple ips
<highvoltage> multiple ips without aliases? how does that work?
<alkisg> The aliases along with ifconfig are the old framework
<alkisg> The new one that corresponds to `ip` can handle multiple IPs on each interface without aliases
<alkisg> Don't know the theory there, just the tools
<highvoltage> ok, that's interesting.
<vmlintu> do you have any links for examples?
<alkisg> Supported since linux 2.6 i think
<alkisg> Network manager has a GUI for it
<alkisg> Just add another IP
<alkisg> Then, ifconfig won't show that ip
<alkisg> But ip addr show will show it
<alkisg> (ifconfig doesn't speak the new framework)
<vmlintu> is there some command line tool that supports it?
<alkisg> ip
<alkisg> It supports both adding and displaying IPs
<vmlintu> I guess it's time to learn new things..
<alkisg> E.g. in 2 days I'll do a demo in a lab with public IPs and without a dhcp server. My laptop will have 2 IPs there, one public one and an 192.168.0.1 one, where it will act as a dhcp server with dnsmasq.
<alkisg> highvoltage: so you can drop  2-3 different connections in /etc/networkmanager/system-connections
<alkisg> 1) auto eth0 - proxydhcp
<alkisg> 2) static eth0 192.168.0.1 - normal dhcp
<alkisg> 3) static eth0 based on the current subnet (queried with ipconfig -n) + second IP on 192.168.0.1 + dhcp there
<alkisg> And let the user select one of them with just 2 clicks on the network manager applet
<alkisg> (and it'll probably be easier if "auto eth0/auto eth1" is used first, and wait to see if there's a dhcp server around on each nic or not)
<alkisg> 'night all
<highvoltage> oops, missed alkis
<wolfik> hi
<wolfik>  i teach in gymnasium and i have 18 computers i try use oneconf but it don't work in ubuntu 10.10 if this work just in 11.04?
#edubuntu 2011-03-31
<highvoltage> #edubuntu is one of those channels where something is always happening *just* when I'm not looking
<mgariepy> good morning everyone
<Roasted> Hey guys. Has anybody mass deployed Ubuntu in a school district?
<pleia2> Roasted: there are a number of projects floating around that are working in public schools (I'm involved with one of them)
<Roasted> I guess I was just looking to get into conversation with somebody who had time available, as I'm interested in hearing what avenues other districts have taken for completing certain tasks.
<pleia2> Roasted: what country?
<Roasted> Like what they use for their file server. linux? samba? nfs? email - zimbra? google email? etc
<Roasted> USA
<stgraber> Roasted: Revolution Linux did
<Roasted> I heard a bit about them
<pleia2> much of the infrastructure we use is documented here: https://docs.google.com/Doc?docid=0Aa7wSBzNDXVYZGZ6Y3hjanJfMmNoYzVjcWNn&hl=en
<pleia2> we don't handle email for them though, just their computer lab
<Roasted> nice, nice
<Roasted> thank you for this
<pleia2> welcome :)
<pleia2> http://partimus.org/cacs.php has some details about one of our most successful labs
<pleia2> (mostly pictures though :))
<Roasted> I'm just trying to get a feel for what other areas are doing.
 * pleia2 nods
<Roasted> XP is dying soon and W7 is too expensive.
<Roasted> Couple that with a pathetic economy and budget cuts and you have no option.
<pleia2> yeah
<Roasted> I've used Ubuntu for years. I love it. I swear by it. But a platform change is a massive undertaking, and to be quite honest, scary.
<pleia2> much of our work has been with Charter schools, I'm not involved with the district, it's really hard to get into proper public schools
<Roasted> But it's comforting to hear other places have taken the plunge. I was just finding myself a little lonely in the department of kicking the can with other Ubuntu-using districts to hear what's up and what they're seeing.
#edubuntu 2011-04-01
<mgariepy> good morning everyone
#edubuntu 2011-04-02
<keducahelp> help, how to install keduca on ubuntu 10.10
<keducahelp> ?
<keducahelp> on edubuntu 10.10
<d3vin00> how to install keduca on edubuntu?
#edubuntu 2011-04-03
<sourcenemy> evening ppl i have a quick question: tux4kids does that have support for swedish? or is it all in english?
<sourcenemy> looking for a nice linux for 7-10 yr kids and edubuntu looked ok but need to know whatever i go for have swedish as a option so the kids kan read themself
<alkisg> sourcenemy: if swedish is called "svenska", then at least tuxtype supports it
<alkisg> I don't know about the other members of the tux family, I don't have them installed, but even if they don't, it's very easy to do the translation yourself and send it upstream
<alkisg> tuxpaint should also be translated: /usr/share/locale/sv/LC_MESSAGES/tuxpaint.mo
<sourcenemy> yepp thats the one;)
<sourcenemy> ohh well im getting it either way since im flash booting everything to check it it dont matter;)
<LaserJock> kind quiet today
#edubuntu 2012-03-26
<highvoltage> jbicha: btw, thanks a lot for taking care of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gcompris/+bug/914137
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 914137 in gcompris (Ubuntu) "Please package gcompris 12.01" [Wishlist,Fix released]
<jbicha> highvoltage: no problem, I got it into Debian too :)
<jbicha> gcompris's too massive to really test but I figure it hopefully fixes more bugs than it causes
<highvoltage> jbicha: yeah and getting it in early at least gave some chance for people to test it a bit (hopefully some people who are really familiar with it :))
<highvoltage> jbicha: it's probably not to late to blog about it and call for testing on the edubuntu blog, is it?
<jbicha> highvoltage: it looks like there's several fixes in git.gnome.org , maybe ask Bruno if he'll do another release soon
<sheenzz> ah the educational os from linux that inspirer to leave my windsow os =
<highvoltage> :)
<sheenzz> i only wise the age range would be a little higher
<highvoltage> that's a common request, we've started to include some more university level software like melting and lightspeed. we might include things like fritzing too in the future
<highvoltage> (bbl)
<sheenzz> yes i think they should have a edubuntu for any age group as a main learning os for persons in general =)
<sheenzz> brb
#edubuntu 2012-03-27
<Evilware> Hi you all!
<Evilware> Do u know a site to learn to setup Ltsp? I installed edubuntu and I thought it was in there but thin clients do not see the server. Do I have to install the ltsp server?
<highvoltage> stgraber: I got a bunch of new emails the last week for new images, when should I do iso testing?
<stgraber> highvoltage: today's are the first candidates
<stgraber> highvoltage: there was a pretty bad unity-5.8 mess yesterday that took the day to fix
<uros1> Hello,
<uros1> I have this eeepc, actualy 1028 of them,
<uros1> and must install Edubuntu 10.04 on every single one
<uros1> clonezilla is first choice, but when I try to boot
<uros1> machine granted me with thiss error
<uros1> http://www.sendspace.com/file/8bo1lx
<uros1> any idea how to fi this?
<uros1> *fix
<alkisg> uros1: since that's a clonezilla question, why don't you ask in #clonezilla instead?
<alkisg> You're missing a network card module, ask there on how to include it in the initramfs
<uros1> clonezzila working great with older laptops here
<alkisg> Yes, those have different network cards
<uros1> but with this model no.
<alkisg> Also edubuntu will work fine once you clone it
<alkisg> It's not an edubuntu problem, it's a clonezilla problem
<uros1> I`m shure
<alkisg> It doesn't contain the network module for your network card in its initramfs
<uros1> any way to include them, with custom made edubuntu ?
<alkisg> To include them in clonezilla? We don't use it, we don't know
<alkisg> Again, it's not related to edubuntu at all
<uros1> ok
<alkisg> You could be cloning windows and have the same problem...
<uros1> lets go to clonezilla room
<alkisg> It's a problem in clonezilla, ask them
<uros1> tnx
<alkisg> You're welcome
<Evilware> Someone here!! Hello!
<highvoltage> stgraber: so is http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/dvd/20120327.1/ ready for testing or should I hold on a bit?
<stgraber> highvoltage: we're respinning everything
<highvoltage> stgraber: k
<highvoltage> stgraber: did we have some kind of release checklist last time or should we put one together?
<stgraber> highvoltage: new kernel + an LTSp fix
<highvoltage> ah a new ubuntu kernel I guess
<stgraber> highvoltage: we had one on pad.ubuntu.com with a bunch of language and install scenario to test
<highvoltage> (:p)
<Evilware> Guys, can I ask u something? I installed Edubuntu but I wonder if it come with a Ltsp server already built-in or do I have to install it?
<highvoltage> Evilware: yep, it gives you the option to install ltsp in the installer
<highvoltage> Evilware: (at least since the last few versions)
<Evilware> mm ok
<Evilware> thanks
<highvoltage> Evilware: it asks you in this section: http://edubuntu.org/documentation/11.10/installation-guide#Edubuntu_Options_and_Partitioning_
<Evilware> Ltsp live was not working ..I gues I did not install it then
<highvoltage> Evilware: but it's not ticked by default
<highvoltage> Evilware: ah ltsp live must work without ltsp being installed
<highvoltage> Evilware: but ltsp live is just available on the live cd, it's not available for installed systems
<Evilware> ahh , that is why
<Evilware> I tried it and it worked..but i had issues installing the OS..it got stuck in the middle several times
<Evilware> using an USB
<highvoltage> in the middle?
<Evilware> finally I got it installed but I think I did not check the Ltsp option
<highvoltage> it usually does sit there a long time, unfortunately there's not much progress indication while it installs the ltsp part, but it will finish
<Evilware> may be I was not patience enough, but when I did installed it i alwayed showed the ball spinning, but the other times I it did not move at all
<Evilware> thanks  highvoltage!
<Evilware> I just want to try iTalc on a Ltsp environment
<highvoltage> ah it should still be spinning though.
<highvoltage> for the next version of edubuntu we're dropping italc in favour or epoptes: http://www.epoptes.org/
<Evilware> is it easy to install?
<highvoltage> I haven't tried it yet myself. (although I've been meaning to play with it)
<highvoltage> the author of it (alkisg) usually hangs out here and if you ask a question and hang around, you'll usually get an answer
<alkisg> Evilware: http://www.epoptes.org/installation
<alkisg> It's easier to install than italc
<Evilware> I will do that..thank you guys for your help
<Evilware> It looks promising... ahhh how does youtube play on a thin client with Edubuntu?
<Evilware> have you tried that?
<highvoltage> Evilware: best way to do that is to run your web browser as a local app, that way the video doesn't travel over the network uncompressed
<Evilware> Highvoltage still there?
<Evilware> I had to take a class...:P
<Evilware> do you know a place that explains what a local app is and how to set it up?
<highvoltage> Evilware: there's an LTSP manual that should contain it at http://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/ltsp/index.php?title=Ltsp_LtspDocumentationUpstream
<highvoltage> (it's a PDF)
<highvoltage> if it doesn't contain that info, then it's a bug
<Evilware> Thanks again, I will look into that .. I found some cheap thin clients that I would like to try with Edubuntu ..$40 each..does not look bad!
<highvoltage> beware the cheap thin clients! (although it is possible to get lucky)
<highvoltage> anything that has "via" writen on it anywhere should be avoided
<Evilware> because of quality or scams
<Evilware> ?
<highvoltage> quality
<Evilware> good to know
<highvoltage> you get some really crappy ones that might be ok if you only want to run a point of sales system or a security system or something on it
<highvoltage> but for any actualy use they're pretty much just a waste of money
<Evilware> they are a copy of Ncomputing divices
<Evilware> I understand..
<highvoltage> ah, it depends then, becuase some of the ncomputing type hardware isn't really thin clients, they're just keyboard/video/mouse duplicators
<Evilware> let me show you
<Evilware> http://www.dealextreme.com/p/nc120-uxp-multiuser-100mbps-lan-workstation-terminal-with-kvm-sound-support-windows-linux-28695
<highvoltage> yeah those can't run LTSP
<highvoltage> (or anything else for that matter, except the UXP stuff)
<Evilware> :(
<Evilware> so old computers than
<Evilware> then
<Evilware> I will keep reading..thanks man. Take care
#edubuntu 2012-03-28
 * highvoltage starts syncing current isos
<highvoltage> "For this release we focused on quality and stability and refrained from any important feature change.
<highvoltage> "
<highvoltage> stgraber: can I "s/important/significant/g"?
<highvoltage> "iTalc, our classroom management tool was replaced by Epoptes, that's more stable and better integrated with Edubuntu and LTSP."
<stgraber> highvoltage: sure, sounds better
<highvoltage> "s/that's/which is/g"?
<stgraber> highvoltage: +1
 * stgraber does ISO testing in very-picky mode, reporting everything he sees as a bug (only two so far)
<highvoltage> stgraber: I'm temtped to mention the gnome-fallback improvements too, since we're the only derivative shipping it (even though it's an option)
<stgraber> highvoltage: yeah, we can probably at least mention that we still ship it
<stgraber> highvoltage: I didn't get a session that looks as good as omgubuntu's by default but close enough to it and at least it didn't crash on me this time
<stgraber> highvoltage: looking at it again, the only difference is that I don't have the ubuntu icon next to the menu (or edubuntu in this case)
<highvoltage> stgraber: yeah and that we can easily fix
<highvoltage> alkisg: hmm, we don't have epoptes-client installed by default in the edubuntu chroot, we need it right?
<highvoltage> stgraber: heh, we have a big puppet text logo in the resolv.conf in the default chroot in ltsp in edubuntu
<alkisg> highvoltage: so and so. We lose some functionality, but not all
<alkisg> We lose the ability to control the clients before login (shut them down, vnc to them)
<highvoltage> stgraber: I thought we fixed that by cp'ing resolv.conf and sources.list from the host after installation, but aparantly I'm mistaken :(
<alkisg> And x11vnc then runs in the user session instead of locally, so it's just a bit slower
<alkisg> So it's not very important, but yeah it'd be nice if it was installed. But you'd need the server certificate in the chroot.
<alkisg> (a file copy, or epoptes-client -c in the chroot)
<highvoltage> ok
<highvoltage> alkisg: ah, we extract the ltsp image when installing, and then we're able to make some changes before doign a ltsp-update-image again
<highvoltage> alkisg: so it's possibly something we could fix still
<stgraber> highvoltage: it wasn't easy to install epoptes by default and still make it work with ltsp-live in a secure way
<alkisg> Cool! We just need /etc/epoptes/server.key
<alkisg> Copied in the same location in the chroot
<alkisg> stgraber: if needed, we can easily regenerate the certificate, or symlink to the snakeoil one
<alkisg> *server.crt
<stgraber> alkisg: the problem is with ltsp-live, the chroot is built on a completely different machine and architecture as the rest of the CD
<stgraber> alkisg: we use 4 machines to build the Edubuntu media
<stgraber> 1) builds our ltsp i386 chroot and sends a .squashfs back to nasukan
<highvoltage> stgraber: yeah if we can at least have it work for the installed system out of the box, that would be good
<stgraber> 2) builds our i386 live system and sends it to nasukan
<stgraber> 3) builds our amd64 live system and sends it to nasukan
<highvoltage> (but I don't care so much for ltsp-live and epoptes atm)
<stgraber> 4) (nasukan) generates the .iso including all the .squashfs it received
<alkisg> stgraber: I can add an epoptes-client option to make it run without verifying the certificate, if it helps. Maybe even check for an lts.conf option for that.
<stgraber> nasukan never unpacks/repacks .squashfs, so there's no way to copy a file from the live media to the chroot for ltsp-live
<alkisg> E.g. EPOPTES_CLIENT_VERIFY_CERTIFICATE=False in lts.conf
<stgraber> allowing it to run without certificate would work for ltsp-live indeed, then let the ltsp-server package mangle the chroot when installing
<alkisg> And of course that won't be put in the installed system
<stgraber> but I won't do that for 12.04
<stgraber> might do it for 12.10
<highvoltage> alkisg: cool, that doesn't sound any worse than the ssh security we currently bypass in ltsp-live, so I guess that would work
<alkisg> If it's going in 12.04, I'll do it next week, otherwise I'll leave it for later
<highvoltage> I guess for 12.04 we should at the very least remember to document how to use epoptes on edubuntu
<stgraber> it won't be going in 12.04, adding the extra package will require a change to the Canonical build infrastructure which by itself can take over a week
<highvoltage> (since we say that it's well integrated)
<stgraber> but for 12.10 we can certainly do it
<highvoltage> and create a bug so long for 12.10
<stgraber> highvoltage: as for resolv.conf, it's weird it got in there but it's not a big concern as it gets replaced at boot time anyway
<alkisg> highvoltage: with epoptes preinstalled, and without epoptes-client in the chroot, there's nothing to document, one only needs to launch it :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: sources.list is a bit more annoying though
<highvoltage> alkisg: ah, it didn't work for me and mgariepy like that
<alkisg> I'd like to hear why, it should
<stgraber> highvoltage: can you file a bug against ltsp and assign it to me? I'll make sure I get these two fixed in the next upload, simply re-generating sources.list
<alkisg> For ltsp, that is
<highvoltage> stgraber: yeah but I don't need to change the chroot for that, iirc we did fix that in ltsp-live at some point
<alkisg> highvoltage: Ooops sorry the user needs to be added in the epoptes group
<alkisg> You're right
<highvoltage> stgraber: so it would extract the image, then copy over the host's sources.list and resolv.conf and then ltsp-update-image
<highvoltage> alkisg: ok, mgariepy says there wasn't a certificate on the server, but it's possible that he *might have looked on the wrong place
<alkisg> stgraber, highvoltageI wonder if it would be a good idea to make the socket owned by sudo:epoptes, so that sudoers can run epoptes without using sudo and without being in the epoptes group
<highvoltage> (brb rebooting thin client where my session is currently displayed)
<alkisg> highvoltage: the certificate is auto-generated on postinst, it should be here
<highvoltage> alkisg: ah right, that resulted in a bug where all the certificates on the live media were the same
<highvoltage> alkisg: I believe stgraber recently fixed that, perhaps that's what broke it again :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: http://paste.ubuntu.com/904529/
<stgraber> highvoltage: please just give me a bug number to go with it :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: ubiquity is supposed to generate a new one at install time
<stgraber> but failed at doing it apparently...
<stgraber> highvoltage: can you get me a bug report for that one too please? (against edubuntu-live)
<highvoltage> alkisg: epoptes is working very nicely :)
<alkisg> After spending more than a month stabilizing it, it'd better be! :D
<alkisg> I'll do that sudo-group change though for precise, in order to avoid having to add users in the epoptes group for common cases
<alkisg> And I'll put that lts.conf var option to run without a certificate verification, even if it's not going to be used for 12.04
<alkisg> I hope vagrantc can upload it on debian on monday, so I'll do the last epoptes upload on tuesday
<stgraber> highvoltage: I found a fix for the epoptes missing-certificate bug, just file a bug against edubuntu-live
<highvoltage> stgraber: ah, great! I'll go ahead and file that bug for the files
<stgraber> http://paste.ubuntu.com/904537/ is the fix
<stgraber> something in epoptes' postinst changed that make the rm -Rf of the whole dir break the postinst :)
<alkisg> I declared that in debian/dirs instead, yeah
<stgraber> well, that's the right place for it ;) sadly my code was depending on you creating it in postinst. easy fix anyway
 * alkisg loves the idea of the lts.conf var, which would help troubleshooting a lot of cases where people don't read the installation instructions about epoptes-client -c in the chroot, and the sudo group change, which will make epoptes run out of the box on edubuntu live and on most other cases too
<alkisg> Bah. sudo is a group, not a user, the socket can't be owned by sudo:epoptes :(
<alkisg> I could automatically add all sudo members to the epoptes group, since they'd be able to add themselves to the epoptes group anyway, but I don't really like the idea
<alkisg> 'night guys
<stgraber> highvoltage: I'm taking care of filing the LTSP bug (so I can finally commit that stuff)
<highvoltage> stgraber: ok great
<stgraber> highvoltage: also taking care of the edubuntu-live one
<highvoltage> stgraber: that won't be fixed for the beta (I'm assuming), so can I release not it?
<highvoltage> *note
 * highvoltage adds it so long anyway
<stgraber> highvoltage: yeah, I'll mark them all on the tracker so we can get them from there if we forget to add them as we find them
<rtdos> what's the gnome command to add/remove users and change a users (advanced) permissions?
<stgraber> highvoltage: can you try reporting a bug at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/edubuntu-live/+filebug see if it oops for you too?
<stgraber> highvoltage: I'm trying to report the epoptes one but LP no longer likes me for some reason
<highvoltage> stgraber: which one should I file a bug for? the ltsp-live one for sources.list and resolv.conf?
<stgraber> highvoltage: nope ltsp-live is the one I filed before (and worked fine), I'm trying to file the epoptes one
<highvoltage> stgraber: heh, mine just got slow to the point that loading the page timed out
<stgraber> highvoltage: yeah, spm in #launchpad just told me that they messed up a LP rollout
<highvoltage> ah ok
<stgraber> highvoltage: I'll post my bug again when he tells me that's fixed
<stgraber> edubuntu is now fully tested
<stgraber> highvoltage: Edubuntu 12.04 will ship by Epoptes by => s/by //
<stgraber> highvoltage: (post on G+)
<highvoltage> oops
<stgraber> highvoltage: at least on G+ it's fixable, if you posted somewhere else, well, too bad ;)
<highvoltage> some guy on facebook complained about the pic on user 3's desktop
<highvoltage> (silly people)
#edubuntu 2012-03-29
<stgraber> highvoltage: beta2 released, should we make a blog post about it?
<highvoltage> yeah, we should
<stgraber> highvoltage: "and shouldn't be used in production"
<stgraber> highvoltage: "avialable" => "available"
#edubuntu 2012-03-30
<cog> I found a computer related error where in edubuntu os switching terminals causes the graphical terminal to make artifacts instead of displaying what i wanted, first a blank screen with a cursor, then garbage.
<xT_Bash> hey ppl
<xT_Bash> erm..
<xT_Bash> got some prob with ubuntu server 10.04 LTS
<xT_Bash> any1 free 2 help?
<cog> How do I change the defaulted startup screen & the background for logging in?
<cog> The installation slideshow & the login screen background?
#edubuntu 2012-03-31
<cog> I need an image not depicting animate beings for my startup slideshow & the login screen.
<jbicha> cog: what do you mean "animate beings"?
<cog> Humans, one symbol of a person raising their hand, another symbol for a person looking at a scope, respectively in the sequence the images appear on my screen.  I need them gone, perhaps replaced entirely.
<jbicha> cog: why do you need them gone?
<BroMac> hello
<BroMac> I have a problem with LTSP ;( When I change NIC in server then server doesn't has internet
<BroMac> who can help me or give me link to manual: "how change NIC"
<BroMac> new NIC have good IP, mask and gateway
<cog> jbicha I want them gone for religious reasons, I adhere to Islam.
<jbicha> cog: does Islam not allow you to read the newspaper or aljazeera.net which has all sorts of pictures of people?
<jbicha> it's a bit difficult for me to know what particular images are offensive if you can't send me screenshots of them
<cog> Don't worry about it then.
<jbicha> I'm not trying to be rude, but it seems like it would be difficult for us to comply since pictures of people are everywhere
<cog> Jazakallah khayran (may you get benefit for your compassionate action)
<jbicha> as Ubuntu is open source, it is possible to remove or edit the images used, it just takes time & figuring out the source code
<jbicha> I also recommend you consider installing sabily.org and then add the education apps you want
<cog> Jazakallah khayran.
#edubuntu 2012-04-01
<aphlat> I just installed 11.10 for the first time.  Trying to figure out how to make another user account.
<tommyfun> Hi all
<alkisg> Hello
<tommyfun> do you use unbuntu in a class romm?
<tommyfun> or do you manage a classroom of ubuntu desktops?
<alkisg> Yes, why do you ask?
<tommyfun> I'm trying to find some best practices
<tommyfun> the deployment, do you image a golden master or do you install via a kickstart/preseed
<alkisg> I'm using LTSP, so all clients boot from the server, we don't use their hard disks
<tommyfun> and managing packages, do you install them on all the clients or do you install them on one machine and mount it across the clients
<alkisg> One image for all clients, no seperate installations
<tommyfun> ok, so you're virtualized
<alkisg> No
<alkisg> I'm just using one single network disk for all clients
<alkisg> One image for all
<tommyfun> ok, I'll have to look inot the solution some more
<alkisg> How many clients do you have?
<tommyfun> only about 40
<alkisg> LTSP is fine for that, if you have gigabit network
<tommyfun> hmmm, I don't think we do
<tommyfun> I'll have to look into that
<tommyfun> so your clients have no disks?  you use pxe?
<alkisg> Yes, we're using pxe, but they do have disks, they're old windows machines that we switched to ubuntu
<tommyfun> oh ok, so you have actual thin client hardware?
<alkisg> No
<tommyfun> I loked at the desktop virtualization from vmware, but we don't have the infrastructure for that
<alkisg> We have old and new desktop computers
<alkisg> And we netboot them as ltsp clients
<tommyfun> interesting, sorry, I read that line fast
<tommyfun> I'm looking at the ltsp web page
<tommyfun> do you also automount home directories?
<alkisg> LTSP uses a central home directory, yes
<tommyfun> do you use any type of authentication?
<alkisg> LTSP uses ssh for authentication, please read about ltsp a bit
<alkisg> It has its own display manager, LDM
<alkisg> You enter a username/password and in the background it uses ssh to authenticate you
<alkisg> So it all works out of the box
<tommyfun> right, I meant do you use AD/ldap/nis
<alkisg> There's no need
<alkisg> LTSP handles the client authentication
<alkisg> So no, I'm not using any of those
<cog> I have brasero on Edubuntu not successfully finishing generating a checksum for my new Linux sabily.  How do I correct the process of checksumming?
<cog> It wants to generate a checksum for my new DVD but hasn't finished yet, I started yesterday over 10 hours ago.  How do I correct the program, check my disc, & enjoy my new OS?
#edubuntu 2013-03-27
<sgo11> hi, where can I see the list of programs/packages which edubuntu use (but ubuntu does not) ? Basically what is the difference btw edubuntu and ubuntu? thanks.
<highvoltage> sgo11: we've been meaning to make a good list with more details
<highvoltage> sgo11: currently the edubuntu installer slideshow shows quite a bit of these, but not all
<highvoltage> (one moment...)
<highvoltage> sgo11: here are the slides from the last release: http://people.ubuntu.com/~jonathan/files/quantal/slideshow/edubuntu/slides/
<sgo11> highvoltage, thanks a lot. I will have a look at that slides. :)
<highvoltage> sgo11: we have lots of work to do on presenting that better everywhere. so it's probably good that you poked about it :)
<highvoltage> the new slideshow fixes some of the issues with the old one, but I still need to upload it somewhere
<sgo11> highvoltage, ^_^ nice slides. thanks.
<lessent> hi all..
<lessent> i cant opacity my panel.. cuz the indicator and window list seem the theme color.. i mean it looks radiance or ambiance..
#edubuntu 2013-03-28
<Urgent> Anyone around?
<Urgent> I'll consider myself new to Ubuntu thought I was a linux user years ago
<Urgent> I'm doing a Edubuntu (12.04) ltsp setup for a school, HP Server 10 Gigs ram, HP thin clients 2 gigs ram each, four of them, ltsp-client-build --kiosk still gives me a login page
<Urgent> I've tried setting the screen option in the lts file as was noted on some forums for older versions
<Urgent> infact I think I have tried almost everything including a fresh install,
<Urgent> clients boot fine image is created fine but I get a login page
<Urgent> this has been going on for almost a month and this client expected delivery in January
<Urgent> is there anyone that could asist me please
<Urgent> further information was runing unity switched to gnome
<Urgent> yoko, happen to know about edubuntu ltsp think client kiosk setups?
#edubuntu 2013-03-30
<lessent> hi all
#edubuntu 2014-03-26
<zequence> Hi. You guys don't have a devel channel, or this is it?
<zequence> I was just testing the package selection plugin, which I ripped from you. I suppose I should first see if I have the same symptoms when installing edubuntu, but a quick question:
<zequence> does it ever crash for you, when you select/deselect stuff quickly?
<zequence> No, sorry. Not sure that was it :P
<zequence> We have a couple of metas without recommends. I think unticking those is causing a crash. Anyway, seems like an easy fix.
<stgraber> highvoltage: got time to help with beta 2?
<highvoltage> in the morning I will, will that work?
<stgraber> highvoltage: will be a bit late but if you can do some of the paperwork, sure
<stgraber> highvoltage: what's supposed to be our wallpaper?
<stgraber> highvoltage: our current images render a black screen due to broken symlinks in edubuntu-wallpapers, I'd like to fix that ASAP (unsure how we missed that...) but I need to know what's the right target for that...
<highvoltage> stgraber: hmm, weird it was working in the last milestone
<stgraber> yeah, I have no idea how what was because apparently the symlink has been wrong since december...
<stgraber> *that
<stgraber> oh, could it have been that we were pointing to an Ubuntu wallpaper?
<stgraber> highvoltage: yep, that's it, the wallpaper used to be in ubuntu-wallpapers and isn't anymore...
<stgraber> highvoltage: I'll copy it over to edubuntu-wallpapers and upload
<highvoltage> stgraber: ah yes, that would be it then
#edubuntu 2014-03-30
<stgraber> highvoltage: I'm dropping arkose for 14.04, so I removed the slide, the seed entry and I'm about to file an archive removal bug.
#edubuntu 2015-03-27
<alkisg> Does edubuntu have a beta for vivid?
<alkisg> stgraber, highvoltage: I see that the vidid image uses unity by default... are there any plans to a metacity-based DE by default, e.g. gnome-flashback or mate-desktop?
<alkisg> Or will unity8 run without 3d/llvmpipe as well?
<highvoltage> work_alkisg: hmm, not by my doing. unity also doesn't work well anymore since 14.04 because no nore direct rendering
<highvoltage> work_alkisg: so people should indeed really use it with flashback / mate
<highvoltage> work_alkisg: edubuntu is now LTS-only so no more releases for the in-betweens
#edubuntu 2015-03-29
<roqtek> good afternoon I installed edubuntu 14.04 and really found the applications, location desktop to be the most usefull, unfortunately when I rebooted the computer the desktop(launcher) kicked in and now I do not have the easy access to the programs, because this computer is going to be used by 3rd graders I need the easier interface, is there a way to permantly disable the launcher?  Thanks for any assistance I am a newbie at edubunt
<roqtek> I am not seeing other conversations, is there any body out there?
<work_alkisg> roqtek: are you asking "how to disable unity and use gnome-flashback"?
#edubuntu 2016-03-28
<amy_> oh guys, i installed so easealy edubuntu on my daughter's laptop that i wanted to thank you
<amy_> but i wanted to install it on my second daughter's ras-pi but i saw that there no solution. what a pity :-(
<highvoltage> yeah raspberry pi is a whole nother architecture, you can still install the edubuntu packages on top of ubuntu on there though
<jbayfield> evening
<jbayfield> or morning/afternoon wherever you are
#edubuntu 2017-03-29
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (zesty-proposed/main) [0.7.9-77-g4a2b2f87-0ubuntu1 => 0.7.9-82-g0e2030ca-0ubuntu1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2017-03-30
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (zesty-proposed/main) [0.7.9-77-g4a2b2f87-0ubuntu1 => 0.7.9-82-g0e2030ca-0ubuntu1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (zesty-proposed/main) [0.7.9-77-g4a2b2f87-0ubuntu1 => 0.7.9-87-gd23543eb-0ubuntu1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2017-03-31
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (zesty-proposed/main) [0.7.9-87-gd23543eb-0ubuntu1 => 0.7.9-89-gbf7723e8-0ubuntu1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2017-04-01
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: gnome-tweak-tool (zesty-proposed/universe) [3.24.0-0ubuntu1 => 3.24.0-0ubuntu2] (desktop-extra, edubuntu, ubuntugnome)
#edubuntu 2018-03-28
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (artful-proposed/main) [17.2-35-gf576b2a2-0ubuntu1~17.10.2 => 18.2-0ubuntu1~17.10.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (xenial-proposed/main) [17.2-35-gf576b2a2-0ubuntu1~16.04.2 => 18.2-0ubuntu1~16.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (artful-proposed/main) [17.2-35-gf576b2a2-0ubuntu1~17.10.2 => 18.2-0ubuntu1~17.10.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
