#edubuntu 2005-10-10
<crimsun> holy, 8 am tomorrow?
<jsgotangco> meeting?
<jsgotangco> heh
<crimsun> yeah
<jsgotangco> its always that time
<ajmitch_> fun
<jsgotangco> its not so bad for me that's 8pm
<crimsun> jsgotangco: I've just joined this channel, so I'm not familiar with the routine
<jsgotangco> oh the meetings are always every wednesday around 12-14UTC
<ajmitch_> it'd be 1AM for me
<ajmitch_> so don't feel bad about 8am
<crimsun> oh I don't, ajmitch_ :)
<crimsun> I'm just trying to work out my sleep schedule so I can make these meetings
<ajmitch_> hah
<jsgotangco> the TBs are worse for me its usually around 4am
<jinty> morning all
<magnon> morning
<JaneW> morning
<jsgotangco> afternoon
<jsgotangco> hehe
<ajmitch_> morning
<JaneW> highvoltage: what were you asking about Fear Factor?
<highvoltage> JaneW: i heard from someone who heard from someone else who heard from someone else that you might be going on Fear Factor.
<jsgotangco> wow
<highvoltage> strange that i'm on this channel. all our international bandwidth is supposedly down :/
* jsgotangco looks forward seeing JaneW jumping off a building or wrestling with alligators
<highvoltage> or eating horseguts
<jsgotangco> pig brains
<highvoltage> or lying in a pool of worms, with lasers attached to their heads
<JaneW> YUM
<JaneW> no I am not doing it
<JaneW> I entered
<JaneW> and I was selected
<JaneW> BUT
<JaneW> the filming is the exact time that I'll be away in Canada
<JaneW> so I had to sadly step-down
<JaneW> SHEW!
<JaneW> would have been fun though
<JaneW> thing is I either would have been out in the first round (if it was one of those killer strength tasks) and been pathetic
<JaneW> or if it was a balance/height, actual fear thing I could have done well, but you never know what you are going to get...
<jsgotangco> i'd still prefer seeing you do the yummy gourmet challenge
<JaneW> heh
<JaneW> my concern with that is not so much what they have to eat but the VOLUME of it
<JaneW> I couldn't eat a delicious meal of that size!
<JaneW> I would rather do a lie in something yucky task than have to eat it though...
<jsgotangco> some of the things they make contestants eat are just normal food over here
<JaneW> nod
* JaneW gets her kids to finish their food by pretending they are on Fear Factor
<jsgotangco> lol
<JaneW> I count down the last minute and yell 'chew and swallow!'
<JaneW> if they get it diwn in time they get a treat ;)
<JaneW> in fact we get lots of stuff done based on reality TV
<JaneW> the Bed Time routine is the Amazing Race
<jsgotangco> ahh where does Tempation Island fit in?
<JaneW> lol
<JaneW> we haven;t watched that!
<JaneW> we do Survivor, Amazing Race, Fear Factor and the Apprentice
<jsgotangco> well of course the kids aren't going be involved in temptation island for sure
<ajmitch_> JaneW: a real shame we won't get to see you on fear factor then :)
<JaneW> ajmitch_: indeed :)
<JaneW> jsgotangco: I hope not!
<JaneW> is ogra up yet?
<jsgotangco> it would be nice if the next conference would be somewhere in asia
* JaneW agrees
<JaneW> jsgotangco: work on sabdfl for that
<jsgotangco> china perhaps
<jsgotangco> japan would be too expensive
<JaneW> THAILAND!!!!!!
<jsgotangco> no not in phuket =) people won't work
<ajmitch_> how about a bit further south, somewhere more exotic
<ajmitch_> like New Zealand
<jsgotangco> we've been in australia already
* jsgotangco hides
<ajmitch_> :P
<jsgotangco> ajmitch_, or probably a few hundred kilometers near the antartic in the south island?
<ajmitch_> sounds good
<jsgotangco> it would be like Ubuntu in permafrost
<ajmitch_> at only 45 degrees south
<jsgotangco> we might actually get real penguins as participants
<ajmitch_> we have penguins near here :)
<jsgotangco> wow
<ajmitch_> I'm sure some people will go to look at them for LCA
<ogra> JaneW, yes, sorry, was reading my new bugs frist
<ajmitch_> ogra!
<ogra> JaneW, nice news from mark :)
<ajmitch_> news?
<jsgotangco> ajmitch_, or some place really hot like in the middle east
<ajmitch_> mm
<ajmitch_> far too hot for me
<jsgotangco> ajmitch_, by chance did you sign my key? i don't think i've seen your email at all...
* jsgotangco has been looking at his archives
<ajmitch_> I probably did
<ajmitch_> whether I remembered to send it is another matter
<jsgotangco> ahh
<jsgotangco> i still receive emails from lamont every now and then
<ajmitch_> yeah
<JaneW> ogra: yes
<JaneW> ogra: now we need to not stuff it up! ;)
<jsgotangco> stuff?
<ogra> JaneW, yup
<ogra> lets send a mail to the ML
<JaneW> ogra: yes, and we'll discuss later at meeting
<JaneW> ogra: mhz already offered to handle artwork
<jsgotangco> errr???
<JaneW> I asked silbs to show my ubuntu breezy artwork
<JaneW> s/my/me the
<JaneW> she sasy it will be on the wiki in a day or so
<ogra> great
<jsgotangco> errr???
<ogra> i dont thin we're in a hurry... as i said before... pressing can go on past release
<JaneW> ogra: I'll start loook for printing and oressing options, but yes lets wait till we are READY rather than rushing
<JaneW> nod
<JaneW> jsgotangco: ?
<jsgotangco> ?
<JaneW> ogra: do you want to look at options in germany?
<JaneW> ?
* ajmitch_ is wondering what this wonderful news is :)
<ogra> JaneW, hmm...
* jsgotangco is lost
* ajmitch_ also
<ogra> we'll get pressed CDs if we can prove they are needed
<jsgotangco> oh that's rather hard people love free stuff
<ogra> 500 max to each country
<ogra> and it needs to be documented in detail where they went
<jsgotangco> including the vatican???
* jsgotangco hides from ogra
<ogra> if the vatican asks :p
<ajmitch_> jsgotangco: sure, I know some people in the Vatican who might be interested :)
<ogra> ajmitch_, serious ?
<jsgotangco> ajmitch_, catholic priests/nuns as hackers can be scary
<ajmitch_> ogra: probably not about edubuntu.. but I do have contacts with web stuff :)
<ajmitch_> jsgotangco: oh I know
<ogra> hey we have gnomesword in universe... its perfect for them to teach the bible
<ajmitch_> :)
<ajmitch_> jsgotangco: like I've got a copy of the catechism marked up in XML, other zope/plone stuff that I'm working on with friends in .au :)
<ajmitch_> but that's probably getting OT even for here ;)
<jsgotangco> sure next time we'll have our cover CD models as a christian priest, a buddhist monk and a muslim imam doing the ubuntu pose
<ajmitch_> haha
<jsgotangco> at least they won't refer as as LinuXXX again
<JaneW> guys this is not religubuntu! ;)
<JaneW> jsgotangco: but I like your photo op idea ;)
<jsgotangco> JaneW, face it you like the idea
<jsgotangco> ok test new updates
<jsgotangco> brb
<JaneW> does the calculator on edubuntu have graphing functionality?
<ogra> JaneW, nope, we have kig for that
<JaneW> ok so kig does graphing of mathematical functions?
<JaneW> I have a Dr asking
<ogra> (or probably drgeo fro next release)
<ogra> drgeo is the gnome equivalent to kig
<ogra> oh, and kmplot as a smaller graphing app...
<ogra> i gess the latter is what he's looking for
<JaneW> ogra: also did you read the review at http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/2619/ ?
<ogra> oh, no, didnt know it
* ogra reads
<JaneW> I think the guys has some valid points
<JaneW> re menus etc
<JaneW> (which we do know about and have discussed)
<ogra> phew
<ogra> they didnt read the install instructions
<ogra> and they used a *very* old snaphot (no wallpaper)
<JaneW> nod
<JaneW> should we contact him and ask him to try again?
<ogra> not before the dhcp.conf generation bug is fixed...
<JaneW> ok
<JaneW> **Reminder** 2 hours to Edubuntu Update Meeting in #ubuntu-meeting
* ajmitch_ decides to skip the meeting & head to bed instead :)
<jsgotangco> i have nothing to update
<ogra> i have a long list :/
<JaneW> ajmitch_: night
<JaneW> ogra: see e-mail please - re WSIS
<jsgotangco> im still waiting for people to actually collaborate on the wiki pages :/
<jsgotangco> (and the release notes for ubuntu itself)
<JaneW> **Reminder** 45 mins to Edubuntu Update Meeting in #ubuntu-meeting
<JaneW> **Reminder** 5 mins to Edubuntu Update Meeting in #ubuntu-meeting
<JaneW> **Reminder** Edubuntu Update Meeting in #ubuntu-meeting NOW
<highvoltage> ogra: how would I know that my rt request is being processed? is there a place i can check?
<ogra> highvoltage, i dont think thats public....
<ogra> and i dont think rt is right for usage by non canonical people...
<ogra> but you'll certainly get answer if it was right or not
<highvoltage> ok. we use rt at tsf too, so i know what you mean :)
<highvoltage> ok, have a good evening. relax a bit too, ogra. i think you also need to take a nice long vacation after release :)
<ogra> no time to relax now :) 
<ogra> but later i will
<highvoltage> cool. cheers!
<jelkner> ogra: hi Oliver, are you here?
<ogra> jelkner, yup
<jelkner> i wanted to ask you about two things:
<jelkner> 1. eclipse
<jelkner> 2. the "sreen blanking bug"
<jelkner> today's update of eclipse broke it
<ogra> i have never used it
<jelkner> it can no longer find the blackdown java sdk installed on the system
<jelkner> i depend on it for my apcsc classes
<jelkner> so i want to file a bug report
<jelkner> that would go in malone, yes?
<ogra> j2sdk1.4 and j2re1.4 are both installed from multiverse... eclipse is in universe, so yesd
<ogra> -d
<ogra> but what do you mean with "it can no longer find the blackdown java sdk installed on the system" ?
<ogra> theer was no cange since weeks...
<ogra> eek
<ogra> there was no change
<ogra> so if you didnt uninstall it, it shouldnt vanish
<jelkner> hmm...
<jelkner> when i did the "apt-get dist-upgrade" today
<jelkner> there was a dependency issue with one of the eclipse packages
<jelkner> so in uninstalled it
<jelkner> finished the dist-upgrade
<jelkner> and reinstalled
<jelkner> (only eclipse, not the j2sdk1.4)
<ogra> never do dist-upgrade in unstable releases
<jelkner> now when we start eclipse, it won't start, saying "can not find a java runtime environment"
<ogra> dist-upgrade means you allow the system to uninstall packages, even if they are essential to fulfill the dependencys
<jelkner> ok, only "upgrade" then?
<ogra> only use upgrade
<ogra> yes
<jelkner> ok
<ogra> it does only upgrade...
<jelkner> i need to go help a student, brb...
<ogra> but dist-upgrade asks you if its ok with you to uninstall stuff...
<jelkner> bell rang, student left, i'm back..
<jelkner> is malone the place to report the bug?
<ogra> for eclipse ? yes
<jelkner> ok, great
<jelkner> i'll do that
<ogra> but really read if apt asks you questions ;) 
<crimsun> (eclipse should just work with breezy's gcj, correct?)
<ogra> it wouldnt just uninstall stuff wihout confirmation normally
<ogra> yup
<jelkner> the java stuff is very confusing
<jelkner> gcj isn't quite ready for the ap course
<ogra> crimsun, but gjc neither brings you the ff plugin, nor does it match the sun tutorials i think
<ogra> its ok to run specifically adjusted stuff though
<jelkner> when you look up "java" on synaptic you get many confusing choices
<jelkner> one of the things i'm hoping to ask for "Dapper" is if we could create an "APCSC" meta package that would install everything needed to teach java on Edubuntu
<ogra> rather look for blackdown
<ogra> sure we can :)
<jelkner> cool!
<jelkner> anyway, the other bug, and then i'm off to my other school...
<jelkner> has anyone mentioned the "screen blanking" bug?
<ogra> screen blanking ? 
<jelkner> Edubuntu clients routinely have their screens go blank for a second or 3
<jelkner> it happens randomly
<ogra> erm
<jelkner> and the screen always comes back
<ogra> that shouldnt happen
<jelkner> it does
<jelkner> my students are used to it
<ogra> are you sure you dont have gnome-screensaver installed or something like that ? 
<jelkner> it is not frequent enough to be a huge problem
<jelkner> only an anoyance
<jelkner> no, it isn't anything like that
<ogra> we temporarily switched to gnome-screensaver, please check if its still there
<jelkner> when was that?
<ogra> if not please file a bugzilla bug with component UNKNOWN
<jelkner> i've been dealing with this all along
<ogra> a bit more than two weeks ago
<jelkner> hmm...
<ogra> or even 2 ...
<ogra> err 3
<jelkner> i'll file the bugzilla report later today then...
<ogra> if thats the case, just uninstall gnome-screensaver
<ogra> please check for it first
<crimsun> in a Terminal, dpkg -l gnome-screensaver|grep ^ii
<jelkner> i just removed it
<ogra> ah, it was there ? 
<ogra> great... 
<jelkner> yup
<jelkner> i'll watch over the next few days and see what happens
<jelkner> well, i gotta run...
<ogra> just make sure xscreensaver is installed now, if you want to use a screensaver :)
<ogra> but it should be anyway, its a dependency of edubuntu-desktop ;)
<ogra> have fun :)
<jelkner> it is there
<jelkner> thanks!
<mhz> hey
<mhz> ogra: ping
<ogra> pong
* mhz is desperately needing help
<mhz> coll
<mhz> ogra: I was finishing edubutu install and we suffered a powercut
<ogra> ouch
<mhz> what's the command to restart dpkg reconfiguration of all pending software???
<mhz> I got up to 68%
<mhz> after having the reboot part, of course.
<ogra> base-config
<mhz> si dpkg was actualli configuring packages
<ogra> and dpkg --configure -a
<mhz> diff?
<ogra> base-config is what starts after reboot
<mhz> and the other?
<ogra> it calls dpkg --configure -a at some point
<mhz> ah, so I should only start with base-config ?
<ogra> but dpkg --configure -a only configures packages, if not all were installed at this time, you might have to reinstall
<mhz> thx
* mhz was chatting in a lent pc
* mhz be away a little
<ogra> good luck
<mhz> base config started from clock setting.
<mhz> is that allright?
<mhz> weel, base-config asked me to set apt, so I decided to manually run dpkg --configure -a
<mhz> anyways, thx.
<mhz> and I f you happen to have any more suggestions I'll be available via mail to mhz AT tecnocimiento DOT cl
<mhz> c ya!
#edubuntu 2005-10-11
<mhz> moin
<mhz> ogra_: ping awake??
<ogra_> mhz, on my way to bed
<mhz> ok, bye then, sleep well
<ogra_> mhz, urgent prob ? 
<mhz> I can wait
<mhz> :)
<mhz> thx
* mhz is gonna install edubuntu for the 2nd time
<JaneW> morning
<jsgotangco> good morning my lady
<JaneW> hi jsg
<JaneW> jsgotangco: welcome to the m/l - it's pretty quiet atm...
<jsgotangco> stir up the natives let's do it
<jsgotangco> JaneW, its just my 2nd ml account heh
<JaneW> heh
<jsgotangco> just ask and I do your bidding =)
<JaneW> hmmm seems our DHCP problem is not going to be fixed in Breezy :(((
<jsgotangco> we'll add that as a known issue then, don't worry about it
<jsgotangco> we'll improve as we go on =)
<JaneW> how much of a big deal is it IYO?
<jsgotangco> oh its pretty big if we're aiming for a really dumbed-down install approach
<JaneW> yes it was meant to be a chicken install...
<jsgotangco> JaneW, can you list down our final "feature" list so i can start hacking up the release notes i am almost done with ubuntu and i can easily lift parts of it for our project
<jsgotangco> mdz says the current doc looks good so we'll build on it
<highvoltage> i initially received lots of criticism from the ubuntu people about the methods i used to dumb down the skubuntu installation, it was the only way i could bring it down to simply running one single script. people underestimate how long it can take to do 'properly'.
<highvoltage> sometimes, something that just works and satisfies the client is good enough.
<highvoltage> you can perfect the ways you do it after time.
<JaneW> highvoltage: agreed
<highvoltage> just ignore me. i have little sleep so i'll probably be grumpy today.
<highvoltage> ooh. ok. that was unexpected ;)
<highvoltage> hi JaneW 
<JaneW> highvoltage: also proper linux ppl want it done 'properly', newbies wouldn;t know or care...
<JaneW> jsgotangco: great, feature list for ub/edu?
<jsgotangco> JaneW, just edu i have the ub covered =)
<jsgotangco> the doc is still in xml but readable if you want to check it out
<JaneW> ok great well edu has all (I think must dbl check with ogra) ub features, plus the stuff in the preview list
<JaneW> I need ogra to check that and confirm if it's changed...
<jsgotangco> yes
<JaneW> I'll get back to you.
<jsgotangco> andk known issues
* JaneW mails ogra
<jsgotangco> the rest is stock ub
<JaneW> yes and known issues :(
<jsgotangco> JaneW, https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos/branches/breezy/gnome/releasenotes/C/breezy-release-notes.xml
<highvoltage> JaneW: the non-commercial license on the wiki, that's not the license that elmo mentioned, or was it decided to be different later?
<jsgotangco> err who is Philipp Schrder?
<highvoltage> Swedish Guy
<highvoltage> artist, web designer. very skilled.
<jsgotangco> i noticed
* jsgotangco looks at his page
<highvoltage> also very keen to be involved.
<JaneW> highvoltage: what do you mean?
<jsgotangco> he seems to be up-to-date on schooltool stuff
<JaneW> highvoltage: we were using GNU GPL or such like and elmo told me to change it to CC Some rights
<jsgotangco> CC by SA
<highvoltage> JaneW: JaneW in an e-mail dated 02/09/2005, elmo said this is the license that Mark wants to use: http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/2.5/
<highvoltage> the one on the wiki is: http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/2.5/
<JaneW> yes
<highvoltage> so why the change?
<JaneW> really
* JaneW checks
<highvoltage> yes, really.
<JaneW> I thought I put the one that elmo wanted up....
<jsgotangco> ok it seems mhz is now editing the wiki on docs
<jsgotangco> heh i guess it was a good idea after all to use moin
<crimsun> jsgotangco: are grammatical changes accepted for EdubuntuDocumentation/AboutEdubuntu this late in the game?
<jsgotangco> crimsun, sure
<crimsun> ok
<jsgotangco> we don't have freeze really =)
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:JaneW] : The discussion channel for Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu | Mailing list: http://lists.ubuntu.com edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://www.edubuntu.org | First official release due in October 2005. NEXT MEETING:  Oct 12 12:00 UTC  on #ubuntu-meeting. | Preview Release: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Installation help http://edubuntu.org/EdubuntuTesting
<JaneW> did I miss anything?
<jsgotangco> nope
<crimsun> meeting in 5 hours, correct?
<JaneW> nope next week wed
<JaneW> there was one yesterday...
<JaneW> crimsun: where in the world are you again?
<jsgotangco> JaneW, that's a lot of issues from last night's meeting
<JaneW> highvoltage: did you look at the tweaks to the html stuff yet? (colour brightness etc)
<crimsun> JaneW: I'm on the eastern coast of the USA.
<JaneW> jsgotangco: yup, ogra did a great status report
<crimsun> (-0400 GMT)
<JaneW> crimsun: what you doing up so late/early!?
<crimsun> apparently I mixed up the dates for the #edubuntu meeting
<JaneW> crimsun: it's each wednesday at 12:00UTC
<JaneW> so 8am your time
<JaneW> same as flint and jelkner
<crimsun> right. Oh well, I'll need to read the report.
<JaneW> crimsun: do you want to read the logs?
<JaneW> some notes -> http://www.edubuntu.org/MeetingRecords
<JaneW> full # log -> http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs/ubuntu-meeting-2005-10-05.html
<JaneW> crimsun: sorry about that, I thought it was clear
<crimsun> k, I'll sort through the former then the latter.
<JaneW> crimsun: basically we need doc and artwork help atm, and testing as always
<JaneW> we agreed at the meeting that fixing the dhcp issue was our main priority
<crimsun> it's my fault; I was sleeping instead since I stayed awake for two days creating an ALSA diff for the Breezy kernel, which unfortunately due to invasiveness, won't go in (understandably).
<JaneW> but we heard last night that the fix will not be allowed through and we have to live with it as a known issue in this release
<crimsun> ok.
<JaneW> crimsun: sounds like same problem as us ;/
<JaneW> we started our dev cycle very late
<jsgotangco> yeah
<JaneW> mid-July really
<JaneW> and we had blocking issues in ubuntu (mainly the X stuff)
<JaneW> and ogra had lost to learn
<JaneW> and we only had ogra
<JaneW> so not a big team
<JaneW> plus no one else saw edu stuff as a priority
<JaneW> so without making excuses ;)
* jsgotangco sits in a corner
<JaneW> we have been a bit on the back foot the whole time
<JaneW> luckilly we had a couple of guys who stepped forward to help out
<JaneW> like jsgotangco , highvoltage , mhz etc
<JaneW> and ogra has done amazingly well considering
<mhz> moin!
<JaneW> moin moin
<mhz> :)
<jsgotangco> well if you ask me although it is my opinion, jelkner and colin didn't do much after UDU
<jsgotangco> and just waited
<JaneW> jsgotangco: I agree
<JaneW> jelkner and colin were the lead and second for the goal
<JaneW> but nothing happened for WEEKS
<jsgotangco> it was already 2 months after UDU and nothing just happened
<jsgotangco> and some people are starting to dismiss it as vaporware
<JaneW> it was only after I raised the concern a few times that sabdfl and matt decided to make another plan
<JaneW> and that's when ogra was pulled on board
<crimsun> well without negotiating the past, we can look at what needs to be done.
<JaneW> so it's not like he's been planning the thing in his mind for years (or even months)
<JaneW> so anyway the point I am making
<crimsun> Sorry, but between regular work, teaching, MOTU, and sleeping, I'm stretched thin - as I'm sure most of you are.
<mhz> JaneW: any chance we urge people (you included :)  ) that upload images, to upload either two sizes (small and large) or upload any size as long as the only add a link to it? This way we'll make moin loading pages less expensive.
<JaneW> (arduously) is that some people are under-impressed by edubuntu at this point
<JaneW> and we need to fight that
<jsgotangco> mhz, thanks for the edits =)
<mhz> np
<JaneW> so lets see what we can do to add the final polish to this release, and then really focus on making the next one great
<JaneW> but we only have one more chance at this, so let's get it right
<JaneW> crimsun: understood
<JaneW> mhz: good suggestion, the wallpaper one is rather huge now
<jsgotangco> JaneW, one more chance?
<mhz> jsgotangco: we could really make excellent use of the many features Moin has if we only had time to explain how much we can do
<jsgotangco> mhz, let's take it a step at a time, we're supposed to support 5.10 for 18 months =)
<JaneW> mhz: the wallpapers have all been added to http://art.ubuntu.com/backgrounds/edubuntu/ now
<jsgotangco> mhz, let's build on that =)
<JaneW> jsgotangco: yes, we have been told as much
<jsgotangco> JaneW, argghhh
<jsgotangco> JaneW, but that's really unfair, Edubuntu has been a one-man show at the moment
<mhz> okidoki to u 2
<JaneW> mhz: so we need the large ones up to be able to link them to upload to http://art.ubuntu.com/backgrounds/edubuntu/, but once they are there, we can reduce the size and just link back to http://art.ubuntu.com/backgrounds/edubuntu/ 
<JaneW> what do you think?
<JaneW> jsgotangco: nod, but that's the word, and that's why I rambled above
* jsgotangco points nuke warheads at CT and London
<JaneW> I honestly think ogra has done amazing things, but ppl are judging us on edu vs ubuntu rather than a 40 strong team vs 1 person.
<JaneW> and that's tough
<JaneW> jsgotangco: hey it's not ME!
<mhz> JaneW: either that or using a picture gallery "plugin" for Moin. I'm 70% sure Moin gang did something like that.
<jsgotangco> ok london then
<JaneW> I am in the firing line already
<JaneW> jsgotangco: and LA
<jsgotangco> right
<jsgotangco> but they'll brand me as a terrorist
<JaneW> mhz: highvoltage was actually going to put the gallery in the HTML part of the page
* jsgotangco points warhead at flint's house
<JaneW> mhz: that's why we have been pushing for the completeion of the HTML stuff, but we had to go with the wiki in the mean time
<JaneW> jsgotangco: that's Washington DC
<JaneW> jsgotangco: you might run into problem there ;)
<jsgotangco> JaneW, wider coverage, much better heh
<JaneW> more birds with one 'stone'
* JaneW suspects we have FBI files on us now... ;)
<jsgotangco> mhz, does our current moin support most of the features we'll need?
<mhz> wiki's fine. how about /SamllSized /LargeSized ?
<jsgotangco> mhz, (config wise that is)
<jsgotangco> talk page?
<JaneW> mhz: have you seen the new wiki skin hno73 did for us?
<mhz> jsgotangco: afaik, yes. Default Moin is 95% ready for documentation
<jsgotangco> mhz, awesome
<JaneW> http://www.omma.org.uk/files/temp/
<mhz> JaneW: nop. Unfortunatelly, I ahave not known from Henrik in quite a long time. We both have tried to do stuff together but time (and my unemployment concerns) have palyed against.
<JaneW> oic
<JaneW> mhz: also he's been busy getting his doctorate(!)
<mhz> jsgotangco: however, i do think that learning some tricks will speed our work lot more
<mhz> JaneW: yep, that too :)
<jsgotangco> mhz, no problem with me, it'll help the current ubuntu wiki as well (skills-wise)
<mhz> JaneW: where can I see his theme?
<JaneW> I posted the link ^^^
<mhz> jsgotangco: meaning you are all set to moin editing?
<JaneW> http://www.omma.org.uk/files/temp/
* mhz looking
<jsgotangco> mhz, collaborative process yes, edubuntu docs are different from ubuntu docs then we'll just move to docbook
<mhz> oh
<jsgotangco> mhz, current GDP strategy is like this
<jsgotangco> mhz, we still have yelp you see
<mhz> :)
<mhz> hnerik did a real edu-cool theme!!
<jsgotangco> we don't have a live docbook editor at the moment so a moin wiki will work for us
<jsgotangco> JaneW, it looks very 5.04
* mhz apologizes for so many miswritings but it's 03:23 here and is secretly awake, else his wife will kick his butt :)
<JaneW> jsgotangco: what?
<jsgotangco> the colors remind me of our 5.04 sleeve
<mhz> jsgotangco: have you testes moin 1.5 editor?
<jsgotangco> mhz, nope no time to install one at the moment
<mhz> have you edited any page in moinmoin.wikiwikiweb?
<jsgotangco> JaneW, and our logo doesn't look great embossed
<jsgotangco> mhz, yeah
<JaneW> jsgotangco: yes I guess so, they are also the edubuntu colours
<mhz> liked it?
<jsgotangco> mhz, it rocked dude
<mhz> :D
<jsgotangco> JaneW, lots of red?
<mhz> .oO(these germans are nuts)
<JaneW> anything wrong with red?
<JaneW> we are looking at toning the brightness down a bit
<jsgotangco> JaneW, nothings wrong with red really, it just looks too similar to the 5.04 sleeve and all the while i thought we're more orange....
<mhz> BTW, is there a final Cd cover for Ubuntu breezy?
<crimsun> please try to mind general UI guidelines, one of which is to shy from generous use of red
<mhz> in defense of hno73, I'd say that Moin is a little mandatory on some CSS stuff and sometimes the use of imagination crashes the theme rendering :(
<JaneW> jsgotangco: the HTML section is more oragne, the wiki is more red
<JaneW> mhz: still can't find it!!!
<mhz> JaneW: what you mean "find it"?
<JaneW> mhz: well there's unofficial stuff, but we haven;t been allowed to see it
<JaneW> let me nag again
* mhz sometimes have big trouble understanding Ubuntu set of rules and regulations :(
<jsgotangco> the licensing?
<JaneW> mhz: me too ;/
<mhz> jsgotangco: the "wait until we decide it is time"
<mhz> jsgotangco: the "wait until we decide we can release under GPL or CC"
<jsgotangco> JaneW, we'll see after 5.10 who knows you'll probably have better control of the project after...
* JaneW has asked again
<mhz> jsgotangco: the "no, you do not have access to that font because we payed for it"
<mhz> :D
<JaneW> someone was worried that if the packaging is released someone will print off eveil stuff and distribute as 'official ubuntu CDs' *shrug*
<JaneW> mhz: that's actually not true
<jsgotangco> JaneW, the artwork/cd stuff?
<JaneW> mhz: it;s not a font per se, it's just 4 letters
<JaneW> jsgotangco: yes
<mhz> that is a possibility, yes. But there are ways to let people know and understand very friendly about why you decide to keep things in control :)
<JaneW> mhz: true they paid for it, but they only had the 4 ubuntu letter designed
<jsgotangco> JaneW, well its understandable unless silbs or whoever is in charge licensed the stuff accordingly
<JaneW> mhz: so there is no complete font.
<JaneW> mhz: I agree, I think in this case things just moved fast and it was hard to organise and control and know what to do where and how
<mhz> JaneW: I asked many times (4 actually) to get tose letters in I file I could separate them easily. I did not get them.
<JaneW> (my own opinion)
<JaneW> mhz: don;t take it personally even our edubuntu logo designer had to cut them himself and design the 'e' himself
<jsgotangco> mmm???
<mhz> JaneW: that's my point :)
<jsgotangco> ubuntu-title-ttf
<JaneW> mhz: I don't think the 'font' exisit outside of the logo
<mhz> in a team, in a community, that is shocking (kind of)
<JaneW> really?
<mhz> JaneW: i know it is only 4 letter. however, if I submit a work (even a logo or the letters of it), I provide the "sources"
<JaneW> I can understand the frustrations in the community, but I can also see how it can be hard from the inside
<mhz> LOL
<JaneW> yes but I think the logo was created, and that's all they got
<jsgotangco> JaneW, just imagine it: book publishers will just grab it and make their own stuff and probably sell a book with a cd
<JaneW> so yes it's a new design, but there is no font, just 4 newly designed letters
<JaneW> jsgotangco: hehe
<mhz> well, let's hope in a very near future we get more closed to community-company work, where sources are available sources
<mhz> imagine someone wanted to design a whole set of ubuntu fonts
<JaneW> mhz: I think that would be great
<JaneW> mhz: I hope someone does
<mhz> I don't know.. ubuntu fonts suck! 
<mhz> (kidding)
<JaneW> anyway I am just trying to let you know that there is no conspiracy, I even couldn;t get the font because there isn't one!
<mhz> lol
<JaneW> so it's not a ploy to keep it out of the community :P
<mhz> i can't help the laugh
<JaneW> sorry :/
<mhz> now, getting back to documentation... and testing...
<JaneW> I wish I could help more, but I am trying to get the &^*($ CD designs
<mhz> this the my 2nd edubuntu install... UNSUCCESSFULL
<mhz> JaneW: I am 100% sure you all do more than your bests
<mhz> so, whatever my opinions are... are about "company response" , not your works.
<jsgotangco> how about the biltong conspiracy
<mhz> Teh good thing is that I am not going to sit ansd wait until I get the official covers.
* jsgotangco hides
<mhz> LOL
<jsgotangco> JaneW, if i remember it right, i had a problem with the artwork before for conference posters. I didn't get any reply at all...so i just dropped it
<mhz> jsgotangco: how far are you planning to go with the edubuntu doc moining? How do you picture the tasks assignments? etc?
<jsgotangco> mhz, oh its wild wild west at the moment, i would appreciate inputs
<mhz> I believe there's no funds for evangelisation support?
<jsgotangco> mhz, nope
<jsgotangco> i'm the self-appointed evangelist at the moment
<mhz> jsgotangco: I can help on moin syntax, moin better use of features (like Category, for instance. BTW, did you like that?), transalting into spanish, but until I get a successfull Edubuntu install, I have no idea about my technical skills :)
<jsgotangco> ive been prsenting all my talks on an edubuntu workstation and people just notice it
<mhz> :)
<jsgotangco> successful install in server mode?
* mhz only presented a kubuntu, ubuntu, and fluxbuntu, so far.
<jsgotangco> fluxbuntu?
<mhz> jsgotangco: I always got errors (many)
<jsgotangco> thats strange
<jsgotangco> the daily builds has always been solid
<mhz> jsgotangco: oh, I mainly use 2nd hand boxes (laptops and desktops), so fluxbos is 90% my desktop
<mhz> my 5.10 is from the very 2nd day it was out
<mhz> and i have never got to dist-upgrade as I always got errors and could not enjoy it
<jsgotangco> its still not out
<jsgotangco> maybe you mean colony 5?
<jsgotangco> strange
* jsgotangco is using edubuntu now
<mhz> 'pre-release-
<mhz> 'preview'
<jsgotangco> ahh
<mhz> I have a presentation of the things I am volunteer on, and I still can't set an edubuntu install. It's kinda frustrating but I am sure it is mainly stupid configs I may have chosen
<mhz> I ahve a presentation = I have to go an present
<crimsun> hopefully you're using aptitude to dist-upgrade
<mhz> crimsun: apt
<mhz> :)
<mhz> Actually, in Tecnocimiento, I have to train 2 people about the use of Edubuntu because we'll be inviting teachers on weekly basis, to try edubuntu.
<mhz> Demonstrations will start in October
<crimsun> mhz: aptitude tends to be more intelligent, try it next time
<mhz> crimsun: maybe right. but the only time I tried it I recall it ended up purging all my debian install :)
<mhz> Anywasy, I'll try again in 4 or 5 more hours. Now I am off to the "envelope"
<jsgotangco> crimsun, thanks for spotting the errors im going to move it again later
<crimsun> jsgotangco: no problem. It's fairly rare I get to use my English diploma. ;)
<jsgotangco> mmm it seems mdz is now making a draft rc announcement
<JaneW> Last night at the UK Linux Awards (associated with the Linux World Expo in London), Ubuntu won the best distro award. :))
<jsgotangco> what did ubuntu get exactly?
<jsgotangco> a thophy?
<mhz> crimsun: just a almost silli doubt... what are the things a person installing edubuntu will deal manually with?
<crimsun> mhz: I'll let you know once I (1) wake up; (2) download an ISO and test
<mhz> lol
<mhz> jsgotangco: could you see my dhcp.conf, please and tell me if it looks ok for you?
<JaneW> http://www.fixx.co.za/pics/imagsafsdfsdfe010.jpg <- 2005 beachwear
<jsgotangco> errr you're going to wear that?
<jsgotangco> you'd look like a character from star wars
<mhz> JaneW: lol
<JaneW> I don't have 4 sets!
<jsgotangco> there's a lot of plastic surgeon in CT im sure
<JaneW> there are actually ;)
<JaneW> 'Surgery 'n Safari'
<jsgotangco> but i'm sure even if mark sponsors for the surgery, you wouldn't do it
<JaneW> no, it's not quite the 6-pack I am after ;)
<jsgotangco> lol
<mhz> LOL
<jsgotangco> JaneW, you might want to monitor this page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BreezyReleaseNotes
<jsgotangco> this is the release notes page after the RC annoucement
<JaneW> great thanks
<jsgotangco> Edubuntu stuff can be easily added into it
* jsgotangco goes back into drafting it again
<JaneW> ta, waiting for ogra to respond to mail (scared of getting anything wrong)
<JaneW> mdz moaned when I wrote the last one
<jsgotangco> lol
<jsgotangco> well mdz got to review this so its a better page
<mhz> jsgotangco: just in case .. coul I see your dhcpd.conf? (edubuntu, of course)
<jsgotangco> mhz, i don't have a working server atm
* mhz cries out
* mhz cries
<mhz> if you see ogra_ before me.. please tell him I thought of him for the last 6 hours trying to set the LTSP here, please.
<ajmitch_> :)
<pere> someone has been talking to me on this channel.
<mhz> he can see my dhcp config while I try to get some sleep before my wife wakes up (in 2,5 hours) at http://www.tecnocimiento.cl/MauricioHernandez/configs/DhcpdConf
<jsgotangco> JaneW, are you going to hvae an edubuntu summit again?
<mhz> and JaneW, I hope once I wake up, you have received answers about th ecd cover
<JaneW> mhz: me too
<JaneW> mhz: I have been nagging belive me, mailing silbs again now
<mhz> np, I do trust you a lot
<mhz> have a nice day you all
<JaneW> does anyone here have a good contact for gettig 8000 CD printed/pressed and packaged?
<JaneW> we need to find the most cost effective option
<JaneW> they'll need to get back to me probably for distribution
<jsgotangco> i can ask a fried who's an editor in chief for a magazine in hong kong
<jsgotangco> but 8000 ain't that much
<JaneW> jsgotangco: better than the few 100 we were looking at a few days ago ;)
<JaneW> but I agree it's a pretty small run
<jsgotangco> i'll ask
<JaneW> thanks :)
<jsgotangco> if you're looking into the same quality as that of the 5.04 sleeves, we can find something
<jsgotangco> but i doubt if we can get it for .45 Euro
<jsgotangco> JaneW, do you have a price point?
<JaneW> well so far we have no LiveCD, and we'll only print for one architecture
<JaneW> so we only need one cover design and it can be a slip cover
<jsgotangco> yes
<jsgotangco> hrmm
<jsgotangco> wonder if i still have a 4.10 cd of ppc
<JaneW> I don't have any other quotes yet, Marilize is looking for an SA one
<jsgotangco> it could be something like that
<JaneW> I ddn't see those...
<jsgotangco> its just a slip cover since its only 1 cd
<JaneW> right, yes like that
<jsgotangco> the x86 had 2 cds while the ppc and amd64 only had the install cd
<JaneW> it's a pity we don't have the liveCD, but such is life
<jsgotangco> i'd imagine how terrible the LiveCD would be in terms of performance in an ltsp environment
<jsgotangco> its probably better for a live cd to be a workstation rather than a server
<JaneW> yes
<JaneW> ok looks like we can do it for about R5.50 per CD here, with the packaging and CD printing and pressing etc
<jsgotangco> how much is that in US$/Euro?
<JaneW> about 0,7EURO
<JaneW> not TOO bad
<JaneW> if you consider the volumes
<jsgotangco> WOW
<spacey> talking about cd's?
<JaneW> yes
<spacey> if there will be edubuntu cd's i would like to order some :)
<jsgotangco> some would probably be a piece or 2
<jsgotangco> we're very limited
<jsgotangco> and will have JaneW's autography
* ajmitch_ wonders if he can pick up a signed copy at UBZ :)
<jsgotangco> its probably too soon to have pressed cds during UBZ
<ajmitch_> unfortunately
<ajmitch_> although we had hoary cds at UDU
<jsgotangco> but that's like 3 weeks before
<jsgotangco> we'll see
<jsgotangco> you can prolly ask courier JaneW 
<ajmitch_> yep :)
<JaneW> prolly won;t be ready by then, but we'll try
<JaneW> you really want ogra's autograph on it though
<ajmitch_> courier a cd round the world, get the various people involved in edubuntu to sign it ;)
<ogra_> JaneW, did you see the /msg win ?
<ajmitch_> hey ogra_ 
<ogra_> morning btw
<jsgotangco> hi
<JaneW> jsgotangco: and that was ubuntu CDs which are official and all
<ajmitch_> speak of the devil.. :)
<JaneW> ogra_:  : no?
<JaneW> hello ogra 
* ogra curses freenode
<ajmitch_> we all do
<jsgotangco> wow getting nice speed on RC atm
<ajmitch_> yeah, ~180K/sec for me
<ajmitch_> 16% through the install cd
<jsgotangco> alright im gonna rest my eyes a bit and just come back later
<jsgotangco> what a long day
<JaneW> ok I added 2 new wiki pages
<JaneW> they are still unlinked to anything else
<JaneW> but check em out
<JaneW> http://www.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuCDPrintingPlans
<JaneW> http://www.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuShippingPlans
<JaneW> sent to mailing list
* JaneW floods jsgotangco's inbox with wiki edits
<spacey> :)
<Zaheer> afternoon all :)
<Zaheer> so what news on the cds? anything i can help with?
<JaneW> ogra: do we have a RC?
<JaneW> Zaheer: did you see mail to list?
<JaneW> and hello
<JaneW> http://www.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuCDPrintingPlans
<JaneW> http://www.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuShippingPlans
<Zaheer> :) hello jane
<Zaheer> looking now, just saw heading :D
<Zaheer> why so quiet today?
<mhz> moin
<mhz> ogra: ping
<ogra> mhz, pong
<mhz> good morning, here
<ogra> mhz, why did you edit dhcpd.conf ? 
<ogra> thats the wrong file :)
<mhz> ..... sighs
* mhz cries a little
<ogra> i told you to read EdubuntuTesting and install like described there (dont touch the IP configuration during install) ... post install you can change the IP and accordingly edit /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf , nothing else :)
<ogra> do a reinstall, its quick if you do the right things ;)
<mhz> ogra: so far, all the installation I did on 2 diff pc's had same similar issues. After copying files to HD, rebooting, auto instal and configure packages (having provided IP's and all, it complains about a error "ocurred" just after the final 86% (if I remember correctly), and that system may or may not have problems. Is that normal?  Adn then, as I am kind of ignorant, I decided to manually edit dhcpd.conf with the following 6 hours waste (even with help o
<mhz> f infinity at #ubuntu-devel).
<ogra> thats completely wrong
<mhz> oh, in EdubuntuTesting, you mention IP is provided during installation, I got no IP "provided", else I input it.
<ogra> you need to use the supplied IP from the installer during install never touch the /etc/dhcpd.conf file we dont use it, it *must* stay in the original condition
<ogra> mhz, which build do you use... the preview ahd ver bad issues that were described there... the nature of EdubuntuTesting is to match always the latest build, so it doesnt reflect this anymore...
<ogra> use 192.168.0.2 thats the right ip
<ogra> the first build after preview uses thid IP
<ogra> *this
<mhz> i now fully understand you and will follow your exact orders, however, what do I do if I get no IP supplied, I just insert 192.168.0.2? how baout DNS ?
<ogra> pick as you like, that doesnt matter
<ogra> the only important thing is that the IP matches the settings in /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf during install...
<ogra> i'm just working on solving this...
<mhz> so, basically, what you say is that I have no interaction or decisions to make, only the IP (192.168.0.2)?
<ogra> yes
<mhz> ok, cool.
<ogra> and the user indeed
<ogra> if you rysnc your iso to a recent build it will already offer ths IP
<mhz> I whish I could but ISP is only 128 kbps :(
<ogra> rsync only downloads the binary difference between the two isos.... its only some 10 MB
<mhz> I propose this: I'll write down every step (very KISS like), I'll follow all your instructions, I'll try to install a IRC application in the windows laptop I have (still can't install linux there) and If I have any doubts, I'll come running to you. Does that sound ok with you?
<ogra> but you can indeed use the preview image
<mhz> rsync, only about 10 MB??? cool!
<ogra> some 10
<ogra> maybe 50 maybe 20... i havent compared todays iso to the preview
<ogra> yet
<mhz> hmmm, and the .iso I already have in my HD, syncs with the server .iso???
<ogra> yup
<mhz> so I endup with 1 .iso per day, or just 1 .iso ata ll
<ogra> thats what rsync does... i usually get the diff to yesterdays iso i 15min over a 768k line here
<ogra> i'd copy the iso into a new dir so you always have yesterdays backup ;)
<mhz> :)
<mhz> and what do you end up burning?
<mhz> ok, so, I'll take my daughter out of the bath, have her see his favourite "finding Nemo" movie while I get to this man rsync and install process
<ogra> the newest indeed... and i only use a CDRW that i always overwrite
<mhz> ogra: as usual, thx very much
<ogra> mhz, come back and ask if you got questions ;)
<mhz> edu-cool
<ogra> :)
* mhz is taking care of his daughter
* mhz bbs
<Yagisan> JaneW, ogra - was my pdf useful ?
* mhz is ircing from MS 2000 :(
<mhz> BTW, so far, no problems during the installation 1st part (10%)
<vmarks> new release yet?
<vmarks> or still preview?
<mhz> me? using preview
<mhz> but you can rsync .iso's and then try the latest stuff, daily :)
<vmarks> meh
<vmarks> I'll wait for final at this point.
<mhz> hehehe
<Yagisan> I played with the preview - it was nice
<mhz> I just hope I can use Edubuntu with Fluxbox, Kde, and Enlightenment. Personally, I am not a fan of Gnome, and also, all the pc's i use are thin ones, mainly
<Yagisan> I'm "butchering" ltsp to forcibly build an i386 environment for my client systems (I use amd64 as the server)
<Yagisan> I have 233MHz and 300Mhz clients 64MB ram
<Yagisan> I've tried to put in a "decent" video card - but other wise they are rather low end
<mhz> nice schools like env.
<Yagisan> mhz: env ? (sorry if it's obvious - 3am here and I'm so tired)
<mhz> environment
<mhz> :)
<mhz> Yagisan: np, been there many times
<Yagisan> mhz: my fault here - I broke it - I fix it - hence up late (should have left it alone when I had it working)
<mhz> lol
<mhz> me too
<Yagisan> I remember clearly thinking - yeah it'll be right right before a failed attempt at flashing etherboot and killing a client m/b
<mhz> oooops
<Yagisan> yep - emergency bios repair didn't work :(
<Yagisan> and I'm not hot swapping bioses - I've been electrocuted once before and I don't wish to repeat that again
<mhz> lol, at least you keep up the sense of humour :D
* mhz back to installation and cooking
* Yagisan has to have a sense of humor - I'm the boss :)
* Yagisan is watching my "butchered" install finishing up
* mhz still on 50% status bar of ltsp
* mhz bbs
* Yagisan is manually bootstrapping it all - I have no status bar :(
<ogra> mhz, yes, the ltsp-client-builder s a bit unresponsive, sorry for that... 
<mhz> np, it was documented :)
<mhz> ogra: after rebooting 1st time, after a while, i get:
<mhz> Error
<mhz> Dhcp server needs manual config and "authotitative" is off.
<mhz> shall i ignore that?
<mhz> Also, I specify eth1 as the interface to listen to. ok?
* mhz sees aptitude working on 61%
<ogra> you didnt take the newer iso ?
<ogra> you shouldnt see any dhcp stuff in newer isos if you used the IP i told you
<mhz> nop, 'coz the box got frozen, dont know why and then it did not even recognized my HD, so I decided to do all again.
<ogra> and no, there is no eth1 planned to be used during install thats all post install stuff...
<mhz> but can i make it work with eth1 after all is set? or i screwd it up?
<ogra> just hit enter if the dhcp server asks any questions, done give any input
<mhz> cool, so i can set all later, good
<ogra> if you give it an interface other than eth0 or nothing, you screw it... thats all solved in post preview releases
<mhz> ????
<ogra> you shouldnt set anything for dhcp... only the ltsp provided file
<mhz> no way I can fix it manually after install??
<mhz> but in you did not say anything about this eth0 thing on the wiki page
<ogra> the /etc/ltsp/dhcp.conf file *must* match the IP data of the interface you want to use your thin clients on, dont touch any other stuff
<ogra> because it doesnt exist anymore...
<ogra> the question doesnt get asked as well as you dont see any other dhcp related stuff in the iso one day after preview
<mhz> ok, so i can edit /etc/ltsp/dhcp.conf manually this time and it will work? 
<mhz> lol
<mhz> ok
<ogra> you dont ned to if you picked the right IP on install
<ogra> *need
<mhz> I used 192.168.0.2 for ip, 192.168.0.1 for gw and dns
<ogra> ok, great...
<mhz> 'coz those values were provided by congis default (except the ip0
<ogra> if you want to use eth1 post install for the thin clients, just make it use this range
<ogra> and make eth0 use other values
<ogra> the dhcp server will magically pick the interface with the matching ip...
<ogra> if you want a completely other range, just edit the /etc/ltsp/dhcp.conf file and change the network settings so they match the interface you want to use your thin clients on
<ogra> by default the thin client network will always use 192.168.0.XXX 
<mhz> ok
<mhz> so, THE only file to edit manually is /etc/ltsp/dhcp.conf ? is that what you say?
<ogra> yes
<mhz> cool
* mhz is then more relaxed
<ogra> if you want to change the IP of an interface, probably /etc/network/inetrfaces, but i'd rather suggest to use the gui for that
<ogra> *interfaces
<mhz> oops, it's hard to trust guis when it comes to settings :)
<mhz> but maybe you are right
<ogra> nope, not the gnome gui
<mhz> ahhh
<ogra> its well tested in ubuntu
<mhz> well? i hopw you are right. we'll see :)
<ivoks> helo
<ogra> hi ivoks 
<ivoks> so, any plans for ldap after breezy?
<ivoks> i would like to help in that area
<ogra> ivoks, we'll talk about it on the conference, and work out a good solution with the ltsp guys
<ivoks> oh, ok
<ogra> currently i cant eve think about "after release" mdz is blocking all my fixes and i have to find workarounds for everything that suit him
<ivoks> :))
<ivoks> need a pair of hands?
<ogra> look at the meeting notes...
<ogra> http://www.edubuntu.org/MeetingRecords
<ogra> but it look like none of thepatches and fixes i prepared will be accepted, so we need to release what we have
* mhz gives Oliver a huge Cheeeer up!!!
<ogra> i'm very unhappy about that
<ivoks> ogra: don;t be
<mhz> and what's the main reason for blocking?
<ivoks> edubuntu is great thing
<ivoks> this is first release, nothing's perfect in it's first release
<ogra> mhz, our release manage holds tight to the ubuntu schedule, even if my fixes dont affec ubuntu at all
<mhz> not even the cd cover will :D
<ogra> *manager
<ogra> i'm not sure anymore if we should release CDs 
<ivoks> ogra: we'll meet mdz somewhere in the dark and "negotiate" :)
<ogra> since if they fail we wont get the opportunity a second time
<mhz> LOL
<mhz> no!!! really!
<ogra> ivoks, thats what i'm doing since two days
<mhz> ?
<ogra> yes
<ivoks> ogra: in the dark? :)
<ogra> ivoks, yes, its dark here
<mhz> but isn't Jane the one in charge of edubuntu crew?
<ogra> mhz, we'll get money for it only once and i'd like to have a quality release if we spend it
<ivoks> ogra: don't spend that oportunity on first release
<ogra> this release wont be high quality... 
<ivoks> ogra: don't do it (imho)
<mhz> ogra, how much our release depends on ubuntu schedule? w
<ogra> ivoks, yes... but JaneW is already looking for printing and pressing opportunitys
<ogra> we thought we could get all my fixes in... but without them i dont think we should spend the money yet
<ogra> mhz, 100% :/
<mhz> what if we dont release/ship a cd until next ubuntu works starts over, could you submit your changes then?
<ivoks> ogra: well, then don't
<ogra> sure, but since we build on top of the ubuntu packages we'd pullin all breakage from there
* mhz propose Edubuntu stike
<ogra> its not an option to release later
<mhz> strike
<ivoks> mhz: edubuntu is part of ubuntu
<ogra> yup
<janimo> hello, is the edubuntu usplash image somewhere online?
<mhz> right BUT not really
<ivoks> mhz: when ubuntu releases, development of all parts stops (for that version)
<ivoks> kubuntu, xubuntu, edubuntu...
<ogra> janimo, http://www.grawert.net/edubuntu/edusplash.png
<ivoks> janimo: xubuntu? :)
<janimo> ogra, thanks :)
<ogra> ivoks, exactly
<janimo> ivoks, yeah the xubuntu artists want to see an example :)
<ivoks> this is so beautifull
<mhz> ogra: I can't understad why can't we release only after your changes get added to the Breezy ubntu work. We could have all sources in our own reps.
<ivoks> mhz: we don't want to fork man :)) not again :))
<mhz> not forking
<mhz> i am talking about a good release thats all
<ogra> mhz, i simply cant, thats not arguable
<ivoks> mhz: there is only one release - ubuntu
<janimo> ivoks, xubuntu devel cannot stop, it has barely started ;)
<mhz> and IF the only problem we have is that ogra can't submit changes... he will be able to if we have our own reposotory this time only
<ivoks> others are subproject
<ivoks> mhz: it's like asking to release writer after oo.o2 releases
<ogra> janimo, i have a xcf anywhere but no time to look it up yet...
<ivoks> janimo: for breezy you will have to very soon :(
<ivoks> janimo: for dapper, i'm your biggest fan :)
<mhz> ogra, so you are saying that we're f*up?
<ivoks> yup
<ogra> janimo, ubuntu buildds will get locked down next week... whats not in cant get in anymore
<ogra> mhz, not really but we'll have to release with known bugs
* mhz is in GUI
<ogra> mhz, no further errors i hope :)
<mhz> can we NOT release?
<ivoks> ogra: or just leave it as a subproject...
<ogra> nope
<ogra> ivoks, we wont split it out
<janimo> ogra, np I dunno what an xcf is anyway :) another graphic format?
<ivoks> ogra: for what it's worth (and i'm no merit, since i didn't do a thing for edubuntu), i think edubuntu should print CDs with dapper
<janimo> ivoks, thanks for being a fan ;)
<ogra> janimo, the base for that image, gimp's default format...
<ivoks> ogra: dapper will be a big hit, it would be nice for edubuntu to hit "shops" with dapper
<janimo> ogra, ah ok the guy just want to see what it looks like
<janimo> to be a simlar concept
<janimo> not like a wallpaper
<ivoks> all those splashscreens have one nasty bug :)
<janimo> ogra, actually I haven't yet talked seriously about buildd and seeds with kamion/jdub yet, I should tomorrow now the RC is off their chest
<ivoks> they don't look so good on 16:9 :)
<mhz> ogra: I changed 0.1 to 0.2 in /etc/ltsp/dhcp.conf  What /etc/init.d/ should i restart now?
<ivoks> dhcpd
<ogra> mhz, 0.1 to 0.1 ??
<ogra> err 0.2 ??
<ogra> what exactly did you change you dont need to change anything in this file except you changed the complete address range
<mhz> dns and router
<ogra> ah, ok
<mhz> :)
<mhz> can I restart dhcp then?
<ogra> you should, yes
<mhz> thas it??
* mhz ll reboot this laptop then
<ivoks> ?
<ivoks> omg
<mhz> ogra, nop
<mhz> :(
<ogra> mhz please take a decent image 
<mhz> but it did boot before breooting
<mhz> I mean, it did work for 2 minutes
<mhz> but it did not provide any GUI, just a busy box
<mhz> (on the client side, i mean)
* mhz take daughter to school and come back in a couple of mins.
<mhz> i wont give up until this works, no sir.
<mhz> could it be because I have eth0 -> web  | eth1 -> internal | dlink router | clients   ??
<ogra> mhz, oh, thats a typical preview bug
<ogra> the second boot will work
<ogra> (it was solved last week)
<mhz> any way i can see if ports are running accordingly?
<ogra> it works if you saw it booting, everything is fine...
<mhz> 3rd try to boot clients... nop
<ogra> its a pain in the ares to fix it with the updated initrd to get rid of the "first boot fails" error
<ogra> whats the error you see ? 
<ogra> note that you use a 1 month old kernel version and initrd-tools...
<mhz> dhcp  gets tired and provides no ip
<mhz> it now does
<mhz> !
<mhz> I used a crossover cable
<mhz> on the 4th try
<mhz> ok, here's the error
<mhz> Mounting /root/dev on /dev.static/dev failed
<mhz> Mounting /dev on /root/dev failed
<mhz> Target filessytem has no /sbin/init
<mhz> So in entered into a Busybox hing
<mhz> :(
* mhz sighs
<mhz> Maybe I should take advantage of the DHCP running and try to work on a TFTP netboot install :D
<mhz> but then, I wouldn't have an edubuntu demo
* mhz take daughter to school and come back in a couple of mins. Now
<ogra> you really should take a decent iso
<ogra> thats all old errors i dont even remember the workarounds for these
<crimsun> ogra: out of curiosity, are there RC images?
<ogra> nope
<crimsun> k.
<ogra> i was waiting for the ltsp fix mdz just uploaded
<ogra> he didnt allow my original fix...
<ogra> but since we work on top of ubuntu, the current daily should be like the RC
<crimsun> fix is in the current daily?
<ogra> (with the missing fix... so dont change the IP during install, then its fine)
<ogra> nope
<ogra> in tomorrows
<crimsun> tomorrow's
<crimsun> gotcha.
<ogra> http://www.edubuntu.org/MeetingRecords
<ogra> holds the remaining buglist....
<ogra> most of them unlikely to be fixed because i dont get the (pending) fixes accepted
<ogra> the artwork changes will still go in i think... 
<ogra> but the rest is blocked
<ogra> (i'm only talking about meeting notes from last meeting btw)
<lucasvo> hi
<ogra> hey
<ogra> lucasvo, the guy i was talking about is called Yagisan... he is in .au TZ ...
<lucasvo> ogra: what do you mean .au TZ
<ogra> australian timezone :)
<lucasvo> aha
<lucasvo> oh
<lucasvo> hm and I am from CH cool on the other side of the globe
<ogra> dunno when he'll show up again
<ogra> germany here ;)
<lucasvo> there isn't any bot here ?
<ogra> what for ?
<lucasvo> ogra: something like !seen
<ogra> nope
<ogra> [19:58]  <-- Yagisan hat sich getrennt (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
<ogra> i'm the living bot  ;)
<lucasvo> ok
<lucasvo> good
<lucasvo> how can I test the floppy whith etherboot image without running ltsp?
<ogra> as i said in #ltsp , i have no experience with etherboot... only PXE around here
<magnon> <ogra> i'm the living bot  ;)
<magnon> I do believe that to be true
<ogra> lol
<mhz> re
* mhz using eLive Cd... rocks!!!
<mhz> ogra, so you suggest rsync for this "new" start, right?
<ogra> yup
<ogra> take a recent image...
<ogra> tomorrows will have a small fix that even prevents the install error if you use another IP
<mhz> :)
<mhz> any good working fool proof howto for that syncing?
<ogra> copy your iso in a dri
<ogra> dir
<ogra> go to that dir
<ogra> run:
#edubuntu 2005-10-12
<ogra> rsync rsync://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/current/breezy-install-i386.iso breezy-install-i386.iso breezy-install-i386.iso
<ogra> (copy and paste the above)
<ogra> err, stop
<ogra> rsync -a --progress rsync://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/current/breezy-install-i386.iso breezy-install-i386.iso breezy-install-i386.iso
<ogra> thats the right one
<mhz> heheh, you really diserve a huge prize for all your patience, spirit and work!, mon
<ogra> if i keep my job after this chaos release, its my biggest price :)
<mhz> re
<mhz> sorry
<mhz> ogra, could you plase re post the rsyn stuff, I had not activated the logs yet :(
<ogra> rsync -a --progress rsync://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/current/breezy-install-i386.iso breezy-install-i386.iso breezy-install-i386.iso
<ogra> in the dir where your iso is
* mhz sings Oliver a song and sends positive vibs
* HedgeMage peeks in
* mhz realizes that not even a Clown would make oliver run a laugh :)
<ogra> :)
<ogra> :-D
<ogra> :)))
<mhz> oh, coolisimo!
<ogra> better ? :)
<mhz> if you do feel better, yes.
<ogra> its ok... could be better... but i have a nice bottle merlot here and relax a bit
<lucasvo> ogra: works
<ogra> ah, fine 
<ogra> logged in ? 
<lucasvo> ogra: no, mouse doesn't work
<lucasvo> and I can't press enter
<ogra> use tab
<ogra> known bug... sorry, my fault...
<lucasvo> ok 
<lucasvo> and mouse?
<ogra> i have already a new login manager ready but that wasnt accepted this late in the release cycle
<ogra> hmm, no mouse at all ? 
<lucasvo> ogra: so what can I do to get the new one/
<lucasvo> ogra: no
<ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/edubuntu/
<lucasvo> and some icons don't work
<ogra> read te instructions
<lucasvo> ogra: ok
<ogra> what kind of mouse do you use ?
<lucasvo> ogra: ps2
<ogra> hmm...
<lucasvo> 3buttons and scroll standard old mouse
<ogra> can you log in on console and run: lsmod|grep psaux ? 
<ogra> (client)
<ogra> and lsmod|grep mousedev
<lucasvo> nothing
<lucasvo> and windows don't come I had to go to tty9
<lucasvo> 0
<lucasvo> and the desktop icon doesn't work
<ogra> log out 
<lucasvo> and the trash icon neither
<ogra> and run modprobe psaux on console
<lucasvo> how can I do that without mouse?
<ogra> ctrl-alt-backspace
<lucasvo> module psaux not found
<lucasvo> aha
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> very strange
<ogra> ouch
<ogra> err
<ogra> modprobe psmouse indeed
<lucasvo> oh
<ogra> sorry... i had wine already :)
<lucasvo> zz
<ogra> after that another ctrl-alt-bakspace on the gui to activate it
<lucasvo> my friend said metaframe is the only working terminal server... >D
<ogra> pfft
<ogra> ltsp is the best :)
<lucasvo> when I have 3 different clients with different vga resolution how can I set that up?
<ogra> you dont...
<ogra> it happens automatically
<lucasvo> no, screen can't be configured by itself
<ogra> thats what we do
<ogra> as i explained, /etc/init.d/ltsp-client-setup does that on boot...
<lucasvo> but it does that wrong
<ogra> but there is something weird with the psmouse stuff currently
<lucasvo> ah ok
<lucasvo> no there is a kernel message
<ogra> about psmouse ? 
<lucasvo> yes
<lucasvo> after I have loaded it manually
<ogra> what did it say ? 
<ogra> i'm to tired to start a edubuntu install now to check it, but i'll solve it tomorrow if its a common prob and i can reproduce it
<lucasvo> input lmPS/2 Logitech wheelmouse on isa0060/serial 
<ogra> thats fine
<lucasvo> ehm and what about trash icon?
<ogra> it just tells you what it loaded
<lucasvo> in gnome bar
<lucasvo> panel
<ogra> doesnt still work ? not even with the mouse ? 
<mhz> ogra, my current ISO is  edubuntu-5.10-preview-install-i386.iso, will that rsyn work anyways
<mhz> ?
<ogra> hmm...
<ogra> rename it to breezy-install-i386.iso
<ogra> should work...
<mhz> simple
<mhz> ok
<lucasvo> ogra: the icons are still a document with a red X
<ogra> but from preview it might be more than 50MB... be warned
<ogra> lucasvo, are you logged in with the same user on the server in X ?
<lucasvo> ogra:  yes
<ogra> ah
<ogra> logout there and relogin on the client...
<lucasvo> ok
<mhz> duh! command not found :)
* mhz apt-getting
<ogra> gnome-settings-daemon cant handle two logins from different hosts
<mhz> nhz!
<mhz> he
<mhz> kde can?
<ogra> no idea
<mhz> i guess it does
<ogra> KDE does wrid insecure things
<mhz> yep
<ogra> *weird
<mhz> hence my favourite desktops are simple: Fluxbox and Enlightenment
<ogra> we had someone who wanted to package e17 for universe... no idea if that happened
<lucasvo> ogra: but my ltsp-client-setup configures my screen wrong! it can run at 1024x786 but it runs at 480x640
<mhz> lucasvo, at least it runs :D
<ogra> what kind of graphics card ? 
<lucasvo> mhz: yes
<lucasvo> ogra: matrox
<lucasvo> mga driver
<ogra> hmm...
<ogra> works for me...
<ogra> i have a client with mga here
<lucasvo> but at ubuntu normal I have to configure it manually as well
<lucasvo> but it should work!
<ogra> did you file a bug ? 
<lucasvo> no :(
<ogra> else it wont get solved
<lucasvo> should I, where?
<lucasvo> at ubuntu or X
<ogra> bugzilla.ubuntu.com
<ogra> xserver-xorg
<ogra> but its intresting that it works fine for me...
<ogra> (with a old G400)
* mhz has an average of donwloading of 19kB/s :)  yaaaaaawwwwny
<ogra> yup rsync speeds up a lot
<lucasvo> I have mga g200 :D
<ogra> should be the same ...
<lucasvo> runs at 720x400 but could run at 1024x768
<lucasvo> oh I have creating accounts everywhere
<ogra> mine runs at 1280x1024
<ogra> out of the box
<lucasvo> strange
<lucasvo> I have a sdm-m51 15" sony lcd flatscreen 
<ogra> probably a problem with your monitor... if it reports the size wrong it might fail
<lucasvo> could be
<lucasvo> but why should it?
<ogra> there is a wiki page about debugging X probs... 
<lucasvo> ogra: not today anymore
<ogra> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingXAutoconfiguration
<ogra> ;) 
<lucasvo> I will submit it and then go to bed when I have time I'll look at it tomorrow
<ogra> for tomorrow
<ogra> note that we'll release on 13th, every minute counts
<lucasvo> ogra: ok
<lucasvo> I wil do try to do it now
* lucasvo donates his sleep to ubuntu
<mhz> root@elive[/home/Users/Rojo/mhz/MhzDownloads/RsYnc] $ rsync -a --progress rsync://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/current/breezy-install-i386.iso breezy-install-i386.iso breezy-install-i386.iso
<mhz> @ERROR: Unknown module 'edubuntu'
<mhz> rsync error: error starting client-server protocol (code 5) at main.c(1171
<ogra> there is a cdimage misisng in the path
<ogra> meh
<lucasvo> do you know why ubuntu is always switching from nonbootsplash to bootsplash during booting?
<ogra> is it ? 
<ogra> not here
<mhz> argh! sorry again
<ogra> you missed one cdimage in the path
<mhz> 128 mb of ram is too little nowdays
<mhz> ?
<ogra> rsync -a --progress rsync://cdimage.ubuntu.com/cdimage/edubuntu/daily/current/breezy-install-i386.iso breezy-install-i386.iso breezy-install-i386.iso
<ogra> before /edubuntu/
<ogra> or did i gie it wrong ? then i'm really sorry
<ogra> *give
<mhz> don't worry
<mhz> I copied pasted
<ogra> meh
<ogra> sorry
<mhz> so, yes YOU did wrong! :D
<mhz> the god thing is we can work it out
* mhz staying positive
<ogra> copy paste the above, it works... 
<ogra> just doing the same here
<lucasvo> ogra: hm ctrl alt F1 doesn't work
<mhz> it seems to be wotking
<ogra> yup
<lucasvo> ubuntu should release pocketubuntu (gpe.handhelds.org
<ogra> lucasvo, on the client ? 
<lucasvo> )
<lucasvo> ogra: yes but with real  ubuntu on hd
<ogra> there is a buntu plan ...
<lucasvo> ogra: public?
<ogra> no
<lucasvo> too bad
<ogra> only planned yet
* lucasvo is compiling his kernel for his pocketpc atm
<ogra> i was thinking about working on it... but then edubuntu became my fulltime project
<lucasvo> that rocks! I always wanted a pocketpc with  ubuntu
<lucasvo> ogra: are you paid for working on ubuntu? or do you do it in your free time?
<ogra> i#m paied
<lucasvo> ubuntu must do it... 
<lucasvo> :D
<mhz> lucasvo, he's paid and we does it in his free time as well
<ogra> haha
<lucasvo> yeah
<ogra> depends where you draw the line
<lucasvo> ogra: are you from germany?
<mhz> or in other words... he gets paid for his free time
<lucasvo> lol
<mhz> :D
<ogra> i'd say i do it all in my free time and get some money ...
* lucasvo still goes to school
<ogra> yes, i'm from germany
<mhz> ogra, what happens with rsync if i suffer a power cut
<mhz> ?
<mhz> lucasvo, we all do
<ogra> you can start where you stopped
<lucasvo> mhz: school or what?
<mhz> school
<ogra> it picks up where it stopped
<lucasvo> ah, but ogra  as well?
<mhz> oh, nice
<ogra> nope
<ogra> they wont take me with 35 ;)
<mhz> lucasvo, it depends of what you define by school.
<lucasvo> mhz: yes
<mhz> I am married have kids and all, but I am always learning and sharing
* lucasvo is done with normal school but will take 3 years more...
<lucasvo> mhz: learning and sharing is much more ehm efficient than being taught in school
<mhz> hehehe
<lucasvo> really
<mhz> we'll start the GNU school
<mhz> where we all can submit changes :D
<lucasvo> I mean do I learn that much in informatics ??? no not really
<lucasvo> what should I do with my ctrl+alt+f1 ?
<mhz> ogra, will at some time see any & progress somewhere?
<mhz> ogra, I mean in rsync
<mhz> any %
<mhz> not &
<ogra> yes, you should
<mhz> root@elive[/home/Users/Rojo/mhz/MhzDownloads/RsYnc] $ rsync -v -a --progress rsync://cdimage.ubuntu.com/cdimage/edubuntu/daily/current/breezy-install-i386.iso breezy-install-i386.iso breezy-install-i386.iso
<mhz> receiving file list ...         
<mhz> 1 file to consider    
<mhz> thats all the output
<lucasvo> W: Failure trying to run: chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 mount -t proc proc /proc
<ogra> now it cmputes the differences ... then you see the progress... patiency...
<mhz> ohh
<lucasvo> W: Failure trying to run: chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 mount -t proc proc /proc
<ogra> what are you trying ?
* mhz goes pickup his daughter from school
<lucasvo> sudo ltsp-build-client
<mhz> lucasvo, see? we all go to school
<mhz> :D
* mhz BBL
<mhz> ohh
<mhz> breezy-install-i386.iso         
<mhz>       681072   0%   21.45kB/s    8:53:26
<mhz> hehehehe
<ogra> yeah
<mhz> it'll take as much as if I downloaded a whole iso :)
<ogra> lucasvo, again ? 
<ogra> it wil go down a bit
* mhz BBL
<lucasvo> ogra: what should I do with my ctrl+alt+f1
<lucasvo> ctrl+alt+del works
<ogra> ctrl+alt+f1 should too
<lucasvo> ogra: but doesn't
<ogra> something is really wrong with your setup
<lucasvo> ogra: why?
<lucasvo> it works 
<lucasvo> except ctrl+alt+f1
<ogra> it doesnt ...
<ogra> psmouse wasnt loaded and ctrl+alt+f1 doesnt work
<lucasvo> it is strange 
<lucasvo> alt+f2 works
<ogra> both should work...
<ogra> oh
<lucasvo> ctrl+alt+del works
<lucasvo> what can be wrong?
<ogra> no idea... as i said, i'll check tomorrow... i have no decent iso here, just syncing
<lucasvo> aha
<lucasvo> ogra: isn't the notification about updates useless when it doesn't updates package lists anyway?
<ogra> why shuldnt it update package lists ? 
<ogra> note that you log in on the normal server desktop 
<lucasvo> ogra: what should I note?
<ogra> that you see the notification from the server desktop :)
<lucasvo> ogra: is there any more infomation about the "miu" ubuntu in the internet or is it kept secret? on what will it be based on?
<ogra> look in the wiki, there was a spec we worked out at the last conference...
<lucasvo> what do I have to look for?
<ogra> buntu ? 
<ogra> dunno...
<ogra> its on the BreezBOFs page probably
<lucasvo> ah
<lucasvo> I found it
<magnon> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/%c2%b5buntu
<magnon> oh, too late
<lucasvo> thanks magnon 
<ogra> :)
<lucasvo> goodnight
<lucasvo> I will postpone my meeting with MR. X-autoconfiguration to tomorrow
<ogra> night
<mhz> re
<mhz> Monsoir Oliver
<ogra> monsieur mhz ? 
<mhz> either I have to much bad luck or you are too wrong.. or a combination of both :)
<mhz> 8515408   1%   18.66kB/s   10:06:10
<mhz> it was 10% before the x server crash
<mhz> now it's only 1%
<ogra> it computes the sizes again... wait a while... it should pick up again
<mhz> are you totaly sure it is like wget -c, allowing you to stasrt form where you were at?
<ogra> pretty sure... 
<mhz> stasrt  = start
<mhz> ok, I still believe you, moon
<mhz> moon = mon
<ogra> oh, damned, i think you would have needed --partial....
<mhz> ?????//
<ogra> after the crash
<mhz> ?
<ogra> to make sure it uses the partial transferred bits...
<mhz> rsync -v -a --progress --partial ... ?
<ogra> yes, but if it started again that wont work...
<ogra> there are hundrets of options... see man rsync
<ogra> oh, -z might be good for you too
<mhz> so, what you say is: everytime X crashes, I should start with --partial and -z ?
<ogra> heh, if X crashes often you probably should rsync on console ;)
<mhz> hm, I thought so
<mhz> but the Eterm looks sooooooo cooool
<ogra> --partial keeps partial synced data around and -z compresses (much better than othe compressions)
<ogra> the manpage has whole paragraphs for both
<mhz> yes, I was reading when it crashes the last 2 times, so I quit reading :)
* mhz preparing dinner
<mhz_at_kitchen> F.Y.I  http://www.linuxandmain.com/tech/xibrettotips.html
<mhz> re
<magnon> hey
<mhz> hey
<magnon> it's still Dapper Drake, right? Someone wrote Dapper Duck on the wiki :)
<mhz> no idea
<Zaheer> morning all
<highvoltage> JaneW: could you please follow up on my domain name request?
<highvoltage> JaneW: i'll call you...
<Zaheer> has anyone here installed the nvidia drivers on gnu/linux box sucessfully?
<spacey> Zaheer, in Ubuntu: yes ofcourse
<spacey> Zaheer, its really easy, only two commands
<Zaheer> no internet :)
<jsgotangco> yes of course
<jsgotangco> sudo apt-get install nvidia-glx =)
<Zaheer> got edubuntu dvd
<jsgotangco> search for nvidia-glx
<Zaheer> and what about the .run file that nvidia provides for linux distro's will that not help?
<Zaheer> also if i install the nvidia-glx pckg will i still need to mod the Xfree/X11 conf?
<jsgotangco> sure both will work
<jsgotangco> its easier to get the deb though
<jsgotangco> ./nvidia-bla.run
<jsgotangco> then do sudo dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg and just choose 'nvidia' instead of 'nv'
<spacey> Zaheer, you should use the deb
<spacey> really
<jsgotangco> spacey, agreed
<spacey> sudo nvidia-glx-enable
<jsgotangco> Zaheer, nvidia-glix is officially supported
<spacey> or something like that
<Zaheer> cool.
<spacey> Zaheer, if you use the deb :p
<Zaheer> ie not the .run pckg
<Zaheer> cause thats the one im trying to use now and its such a pain to get working..
<JaneW> highvoltage: ping
<JaneW> highvoltage: was that your call I missed? worked till after 1am last night and then dreamed about wiki edits the whole night, so decided to go for a run this am.
<JaneW> highvoltage: got your msg, will follow-up for you.
<jsgotangco> hi JaneW 
<jsgotangco> are you really sending me 200 CDs?
<jsgotangco> hehe
<jsgotangco> an autographed cd would be fine really
<jsgotangco> *grin*
<jsgotangco> JaneW, ping
<JaneW> jsgotangco: hi
<jsgotangco> err
<jsgotangco> i forgot what to ask
<JaneW> jsgotangco: if you send a good proposal, then sure
<JaneW> (once we have a working edubuntu to manufacture from)
<jsgotangco> nahh, a JaneW-autographed cd would do for me :)
<JaneW> heh
* JaneW will give ogra first signing rights
<JaneW> since it's his artwork afterall
<jsgotangco> the schooltool people wanted their description changed
<jsgotangco> heh
<jsgotangco> i gave it
<JaneW> ta
<jsgotangco> hmm
* jsgotangco can't remember what to ask
<jsgotangco> i remember now
<jsgotangco> i'll pm you
<Zaheer> are there screens of the cd cover?
<jsgotangco> JaneW, do you have plan B in case you don't get the stock photos?
<JaneW> we got a pdf of them yeserday
<jsgotangco> goodie
<jsgotangco> i guess its copyrighted stuff so i won't ask
<jsgotangco> JaneW, working hard on the specs i see =)
<JaneW> nod
<JaneW> jsgotangco:  enjoying all the spam?
<JaneW> jsgotangco: no it's not copyrighted I don;t think
<JaneW> sent it to mhz already
<JaneW> should I send to you too?
<jsgotangco> cand you send it to me too?
<jsgotangco> sure
<jsgotangco> i can pig out on it
<JaneW> ok
<JaneW> heh
<jsgotangco> is it the stock or the actual breezy cover?
<JaneW> breezy cover
<Zaheer> can i check it out too please :}
<jsgotangco> Zaheer, :P
<jsgotangco> prolly after oct. 13
<Zaheer> pretty please..
<jsgotangco> heh
<JaneW> ok, as long as you aren't planing a coup (cos then I'll be lynched) ;)
<jsgotangco> JaneW, i don't think its a good idea really
<jsgotangco> no offense to Zaheer 
<Zaheer> none taken
<jsgotangco> since the actual print isn't out yet
<JaneW> say you guys release oohbuntu with that same cover on Oct 12?
<jsgotangco> yeah
<JaneW> I still don;t really understand what's public and what's not (and why)
<JaneW> but I do understand that companies like to keep things private until they are official
<jsgotangco> if it doesn't contain anything, just assume its copyrighted
<JaneW> and general public knowledge
<jsgotangco> unless what's sent to you is explicitly stated as CC by SA or whatever license
<JaneW> jsgotangco: well you look and let me know
<Zaheer> look i dont wann get anyone into any trouble so its cool i can wait a few days :)
<jsgotangco> ok
<jsgotangco> we're just being careful really, even the name and the logo have copyrights
<JaneW> yes but people can look at them ;)
<JaneW> (the name and logo)
<jsgotangco> wow
* jsgotangco posts image on planet
<JaneW> I know silbs has been worried about making sure they were finalised and official, but once done they will be put up on the wiki
<jsgotangco> hehe
<jsgotangco> joke
<JaneW> so she just doesn;t want the draft stuff floating around (and printed as the official verion, possibly with errors)
<JaneW> jsgotangco: thwap
<jsgotangco> hey its the kid again
<jsgotangco> JaneW, this is pretty useless the pdf is not the original resolution
<jsgotangco> at least we know the color scheme
<jsgotangco> JaneW, it would hvae been more helpful if we had it full bleed
<jsgotangco> brb
<hilaire_> hello
<hilaire_> I saw people where able to upgrade from ubuntu to edubuntu but I did not found the info on the net. Any clues?
<crimsun> sudo aptitude install edubuntu-desktop
<hilaire_> hum, from ubuntu 5.04?
<crimsun> no, 5.10
<ogra> moin
<crimsun> hi ogra 
<crimsun> hilaire_: dist-upgrade to 5.10, then install it
<crimsun> hilaire_: or just use today's daily cd image
<hilaire_> crimsun: ok
<Yagisan> ogra: ping
<ogra> Yagisan, sorry i still havent read the pdf, th prerelease drawbacks are to much currently...
<Yagisan> ogra: actually - I was about to ask - If I supply a patch to ltsp to allow it to build i386 clients on amd64 are you interested ?
<Yagisan> I've been working a little script to allow "trivial" multiarch support ie i386 on amd64, ppc on ppc64 type of sstuff
<ogra> to late for breezy, but i'm very itereasted for dapper
<Yagisan> yeah - for dapper
<ogra> ogra@ubuntu.com ;)
<Yagisan> I got pissed off that ltsp build amd64 clients for amd64 servers
<Yagisan> I mean - who (currently) uses 64bit thin clients ?
<Yagisan> thats overkill
* ogra whistles inoocently
<ogra> Yagisan, i do :)
<Yagisan> what other arches would support trivial support ?
<Yagisan> ogra - from what you've said I think you live in a pc manufacturing plant
<ogra> i think having multiarch for dapper is essential .... powerpc clients should be possible too there are cheap ppc solutions people might use... or they might reuse old imacs...
<Yagisan> hmm- my thin clients are missing the games menu
<Yagisan> well - all my thin clients are k6/2 (i586) or pentium2 (i686) - both i386 - while my servers are amd64
<ogra> yup
<ogra> i think we need to support all kinds of multiarch....
<Yagisan> I think people are more likely to get the most powerfull server they can get
<Yagisan> If I can get qemu to work - I'll try to add support for ppc clients
<Yagisan> but for now "trivial"
<ogra> if we ave half thick clents at some point amd64 will get intresting too... note that ltsp is not only edubuntu
<Yagisan> I know - but you are the most visible project - and hence the one most likely to gain from having it first
<ogra> its also used in offices... they might use local apps that need cpu power
<Yagisan> ogra: I'm one of the "office" guys
<ogra> but having a base to work on would already be a great start
<Yagisan> I have apps in mind that I want local
<Yagisan> have you also noticed that often you get kicked back to a login screen from the clients ?
<ogra> kicked back ? 
<ogra> do you mean on relogin ? 
* magnon_ 's wallet is crying
<magnon_> eerp
<ogra> Yagisan, might be #15244
<Yagisan> yes on relogin - and when I tried to run some apps
<Yagisan> like the 32bit firefox + flash + java that I had to set up for the wife
<ogra> its a bug we'll have to ship with :/ i'm not allowed to do "intrusive" changes, half of my fixes will have to wait until post release :/
<Yagisan> magnon_: don't worry it'll get used to it - mine stopped crying long ago (it's dead =-O)
<Yagisan> ogra: where are those changes ?
<ogra> i had a long dispute over that already, but no avail...
<magnon_> Yagisan: I just got my new passport. :P
* Yagisan wants *working* logins
<ogra> for this bug there are none yet....
<Yagisan> magnon_ : that reminds me - my daughter needs to get two passports
<Yagisan> ogra: if I filed a severe bug on that - would that enable you to get an update in ?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> i have even to fight for trivial one line changes... the last one took me more that 2 days to get in
<Yagisan> hmm - so we a get a trivial update for dhcp - but none for "I can't log in to my f*cking box" ?
<ogra> (adding a "|| true " to a script)
<Yagisan> ogra: that was you ?
<JaneW> sigh
<ogra> Yagisan, yes
<Yagisan> never enough hours is it
<JaneW> ogra: what's the answer to my question about if we fix bugs AFTER 13 Oct
<ogra> i lost to much due to ubuntu related stuff...
<ogra> JaneW, technically not possible
<JaneW> could we still print CDs of that (with fix) and call it 5.10?
<JaneW> (and hello - sorry)
<Yagisan> G'day JaneW
<JaneW> hi Yagisan 
<ogra> JaneW, the archive contents will be totally broken if it reopens... i cant guarantee that everything works
<JaneW> oh of course we'll be on unstable dapper...
<ogra> yes
<JaneW> and could we freeze on Breezy and just change edubuntu?
<ogra> nope
<JaneW> :(
<JaneW> *sulk*
<jsgotangco> eh?
<ogra> the infrastructure will be switched to dapper
<JaneW> ogra: so is there no way to fix this soon?
<jsgotangco> woohooo
<jsgotangco> software development - you gotta love it
<ogra> expect that for example xorg might be broken from the first day
<Yagisan> revolt peasants revolt ! down with the aristocracy !
<JaneW> me starts with a word that rhymes with DUCK
<ogra> so everything on top of it will be broken too
* Yagisan sorry - couldn't resist
<JaneW> ogra: yes I do expect that! ;/
<jsgotangco> JaneW, BUCK?
<jsgotangco> JaneW, PUCK?
<JaneW> Yagisan: the peasants are revolting ;)
<ogra> YUCK ?
<JaneW> yes
<Yagisan> jsgotangco: The very first word I taught my wife in english :)
<magnon_> Right
<JaneW> Yagisan: shame on you!
<jsgotangco> Yagisan, Love?
<jsgotangco> hehe
<magnon> I just want to show you guys what the new passport rules to the US actually allow
<JaneW> ogra: so now that we have Cds we don;t want them....?
<magnon> http://co.deworks.net/pub/pass.jpg
<jsgotangco> JaneW, yay
<Yagisan> JaneW: I had to explain "real" english - as used by the locals
<magnon> Left picture is two years old, right picture is what I'm getting for my passport
<Yagisan> she can use it perfectly now =-O
<ogra> JaneW, lets decide that if we have a release, lets inspect it carefully if its worth it
<magnon> if I were the border guarad, I'd rather let in a guy with an expired passport than that picture :S
<jsgotangco> magnon, that is sooo like mako's passport pic
<JaneW> ogra: ok
<magnon> jsgotangco: maybe I can steal his ID :D
<JaneW> magnon: cute
<ogra> still g days to fight with mdz for every single pacth and fix
<ogra> s/g/6/
<JaneW> g days?
<JaneW> are you doing a head stand?
<magnon> JaneW: thanks :P
<ogra> sorry the top of the six was to heavy, it fell over ;)
<Yagisan> magnon: In Australia - the passport office would reject that photo
<magnon> Yagisan: because I look criminal?
<Yagisan> magnon: too dark - can't see eyes clearly
<magnon> calibrate your monitor ;) I can see them pretty well
<Yagisan> magnon: but yes - you do look shifty
<jsgotangco> it would have been preferable if you tied up that hair too
<JaneW> ogra: do you know anything about "Open Source Annual 2006", a German publication concerned with the various aspects of open source. ?
<ogra> nope
<magnon> jsgotangco: they accepted it anyway :P
<ogra> you know i live at the end of the world here :)
<magnon> ogra:...Berchtesgaden?
<Yagisan> magnon: monitor is calibrated - it looks like you have completely black irises
<JaneW> if that's what the dude looks like, that's what the photo should look like
<JaneW> D'uh
<magnon> Yagisan: That's not far from the truth
<ogra> magnon, rather in the middle....
<JaneW> ogra: in the restaurant?
<Yagisan> magnon: oh - then it might be ok 
<ogra> magnon, looks a bit like norway countryside 
<magnon> I find Berchtesgaden somewhat at the end of the world
<magnon> JaneW: Ha ha.
<JaneW> at the end of the universe?
<magnon> :)
<ogra> yes... since i'm a MOTU :)
<JaneW> heh
<jsgotangco> see you guys later i'll enjoy my friday night first
<ogra> andwhen i fell off the edge of the universe, i landed on edubuntu :)
<magnon> poor edubuntu
<jsgotangco> you guys should too :)
<Yagisan> back soon - nappy change for bub :(:'(:(
<magnon> is that why the badger has a flat tail?
<magnon> gene manipulations + oliver
<ogra> heh
<JaneW> ogra: check mail box for some light relief
<Zaheer> if i have a 5.04 workstation will i need to format if i wanted to upgrade to 5.10?
<ogra> JaneW, lol, yes, that fits 
<ogra> Zaheer, just change the repositorys and upgrade.... 
<JaneW> :)
<ogra> oh, and CD upgrade should work too
<Zaheer> oh ok... i was under a misconception then that i had to format.
<Yagisan> Zaheer: it not Windows ...
<Zaheer> :D i know it aint!
<ogra> Zaheer, we guarantee sooomoth upgrades ;) 
<ogra> hmm... weird keyboard...
<Zaheer> thats what i like to hear
<Yagisan> Zaheer: only need to reboot  for a kernel upgrade - and I'm sure we can bug someone to fix that too
<ogra> Zaheer, make sure the -desktop meatpackage is installed during the upgrade, then everything should be fine
<ogra> lol
<ogra> metapackage
<ogra> Yagisan, we dont rule the HW world yet :)
<Zaheer> i have a vm with edubuntu and a physical pc with debian.. and the more im using the vm pc the more im tempted to trash the deb pc... the only thing holding me back is that i dont have inet yet at home.
<Yagisan> ogra: As far as I know - latest kernels can load another kernel and transfer control to it
<Zaheer> with deb i could pop in 1 of the 14 dics and install pckgs from there
<ogra> Yagisan, but the underlying one will still need a reboot if you want it up to date
<ogra> Zaheer, you can do that with ubuntu too
<Zaheer> with the dvd?
<Yagisan> Zaheer: yep - but that's just main/restricted
<Zaheer> i dont understand the way the packages are structured.. like main and universe...
<Zaheer> are the main all essentiall pckgs? and universe the extra/optional pckgs?
<Yagisan> Zaheer: basically - yes but
<Zaheer> [listening] 
<Yagisan> it depends on your idea of essential - eg for me mc is essential
<Yagisan> but that is in universe - so I need a net connection to get it
<Zaheer> like i do alot of php/mysql development
<Yagisan> Zaheer - you will most likely need universe then
<ogra> its both in main
<Zaheer> is that part of main?
<Yagisan> parts of it are main
<Yagisan> as far as I know anyway
<ogra> but only on the DVD mysql isnt on the iso afaik
<Zaheer> so is there no universe dvd i can DL or is that a strange request :)
<ogra> nope
<ogra> univrse holds about 17000 packages... thats hard to get on DVD
<Zaheer> :D i figured...
<ogra> you'd need several...
<Yagisan> not a strange request - the have been a few requests - but it would be about 2 dvds
<ogra> more than that
<Yagisan> I mirrored it once
<ogra> i'd rather guess 4 or 5
<Yagisan> ah - dual layer dvds :)
<Yagisan> be back soon - being called for dinner
<Zaheer> one of my bugs has change to UPSTREAM what does that mean?
<ogra> that upstream will care for it
<Zaheer> who dat?
<ogra> ?
<Yagisan> Zaheer: upstream is whoever wrote the application
<Yagisan> heh - never much scrollback here
<Yagisan> anyway - any ideas on why some menu categories aren't showing up on the clients ?
<Yagisan> they appear when logged in locally to the server
* Yagisan misses wesnoth on my clients
<Yagisan> ogra: what arches do you have access too ?
<mhz> moin
<JaneW> moin moin
<ogra_ltsp> JaneW, install gets through...
<JaneW> ogra_ltsp: : did you read Kamion's mail :/
<JaneW> ogra_ltsp: YAY!!!! :)))
<ogra_ltsp> but i just discovered that i have no german keyboard and the language selector seems not to pick up the settings :/
<Yagisan> ogra_ltsp: do you have all your menus ?
<ogra_ltsp> yup
<Yagisan> even games ?
<ogra_ltsp> yup
* Yagisan smacks head into table
<Yagisan> opengl work ? (accelerated)
<ogra_ltsp> the path error still exists though, but mdy knows about it and he will accept a fix if i understood him right
<Yagisan> glxgears  was giving 18fps on my client
<ogra_ltsp> Yagisan, no idea its nothing release critical and i only have a nvidia card here
<Yagisan> I have ati (dri based) and nvidia
<ogra_ltsp> but when i tested in the beginning with my own xorg.conf that uses the binary driver, it always worked fine
<Yagisan> yep - but we are using autogenrated xolrg.conf now aren't we ?
<ogra_ltsp> so there shouldnt be a regression for cards that cne get configured automatically for GL
<ogra_ltsp> Yagisan, you can use a lts.conf as with the classic ltsp
<Yagisan> It gives that delightful message overwriting xorg.conf on boot
<ogra_ltsp> it will read your xorg.conf
<Yagisan> lts.conf ? how where
<lucasvo> ogra_ltsp: I will begin debugging on X now
<ogra_ltsp> lucasvo, everything works fine here, i just did a fresh install 
<lucasvo> ogra_ltsp: well not here...
<ogra_ltsp> lucasvo, i suspect your HD error might have caused a broken config... psmouse gets loaded
<lucasvo> it is probably the problem of the display
<ogra_ltsp> nope
<ogra_ltsp> it was definately the psmouse module missing that prevented your X from starting
<lucasvo> ogra_ltsp: so why does it not autodetect?
<mhz> JaneW, cd design/ so we can use full color design on the cardboard but only 2 colors + white on the cd labels, right?
<lucasvo> ogra_ltsp: yes, but I mean the screen resolution
<ogra_ltsp> no idea, but the autoloading of the module works 
<lucasvo> ogra_ltsp: yes
<ogra_ltsp> oh, thats something else.... indeed
<lucasvo> it worked on second boot up
<lucasvo> ogra_ltsp: but  do you know why ctrl+alt+F1 isn't working? this is strange
<ogra_ltsp> its a xorg thing, the xorg maintainer will need to fix, you said its also not working in non ltsp
<lucasvo> when I enter it into a console, it just gives me ^{07P
<lucasvo> when I enter it into a console, it just gives me ^[07P
<lucasvo> ogra_ltsp: yeah so I should bugreport it or try by myself
<ogra_ltsp> JaneW, Kamions mail from this morning you mean
<mhz> JaneW, cd design/ can you possibly get us the exact sizes (measurements?) of the cd slip parts. Is there any standard size? I have found no info on that yet, here in Chile.
<ogra_ltsp> lucasvo, yup
<lucasvo> ogra_ltsp: I would like to have a working ltsp now, is there any workaround?
<ogra_ltsp> lucasvo, bugreport it with the datea as outlined on the wikipage
<lucasvo> ogra_ltsp: what data as outlined?
<JaneW> ogra_ltsp: yes, that mail
<lucasvo> ogra_ltsp: shouldn't I report it directly to XORG ?
<ogra_ltsp> lucasvo, read the ltsp documentation from ltsp, create a custom xorg.conf that gets loaded through lts.conf
<lucasvo> ok
<ogra_ltsp> lucasvo, xserver-xorg in bugyilla
<ogra_ltsp> bugzilla
<mhz> ogra_ltsp, 656 MB is my current breezy-install-i386.iso You say now I burn it and that's about it. no more pain-in-the-back issues?
<JaneW> mhz: well the current one is 12,5cm high, 14 cm across
<ogra_ltsp> mhz, only with todays image... 
<ogra_ltsp> mhz, yesterdays still needs the IP provided in the installer
<ogra_ltsp> todays works flawless
<JaneW> Linus Torvalds on why not to use specs: "they're dangerously wrong. Reality is different, and anybody who thinks specs matter over reality should get out of kernel programming NOW." Second, "specs have an inevitable tendency to try to introduce abstractions levels and wording and documentation policies that make sense for a written spec. Trying to implement actual code off the spec leads to the code looking and working like CRAP."
<highvoltage> Zaheer: please read the message i left for you while you were away
<JaneW> highvoltage: Znarl said he would TRY to get to your request today
<JaneW> I madea big fuss about being happy that we could go live over the w/e
<JaneW> to spur him on
<highvoltage> JaneW: thank you.
<JaneW> but he emphasized the *try*
<JaneW> so fingers crossed
<mhz> JaneW, does linus say anything about developers not being allowed to subimt changes based on extremely strict rules?
<JaneW> heh
<JaneW> Online auction site eBay has agreed to buy internet telephone company Skype Technologies in a $2.6bn (1.4bn) deal. <- DAMN!
<ogra> why ? 
<ogra> its proprietary stuff anyway
<mhz> ogra, based on your instructions then...  rsync -v -a -z --progress --partial rsync:// blabla
<ogra> they will still offer the software for free i guess
<JaneW> ogra: just a LOT of money
<ogra> mhz, yup :)
<ogra> mhz, you can drop the --partial... it will be quick
<JaneW> So please don't bother talking about specs. Real standards grow up _despite_ specs, not thanks to them. -Linus
<JaneW> ^ that's a quote - not me speaking
<ogra> its a change of some byte only on the CD (will be a bit more to DL)
<mhz> JaneW, :D
<highvoltage> ogra: how is that possible?
<ogra> highvoltage, ? what ?
* JaneW goes back to creating DraftSpecs for UBZ BOFs :P
<highvoltage> ogra: "a bit more to DL", i'm sure it should be more than a bit if it's at least a byte
<highvoltage> since there's 8 bits in a byte
<mhz> lol
<ogra> highvoltage, because positions on the CD might have changed so this must be reflected by rsync...
<highvoltage> ogra: sorry, i made a joke. ignore me :)
<mhz> ogra, 26485813   3%   20.18kB/s    9:05:33 :(
<ogra> mhz, it will speed up...
<ogra> dont worry
<lucasvo> ok I did submit it
<ogra> great
<highvoltage> gtg 
<ogra> its very late in the release cycle... so dont expect it to get fixed now... but it will for dapper at least
<mhz> do you also adjust your clock settings tomorrow at midnight, right?
<ogra> no idea, my PC does that itself :p
<JaneW> we don't
<JaneW> we are sane here
<ogra> hmmm....
<JaneW> the time is the time
<ogra> arguable ? 
<JaneW> lol
<JaneW> true
<ogra> :)
<JaneW> ogra: can I book us seats on this to UBZ? http://www.fixx.co.za/pics/airbus/
<ogra> whee... so our worst bug is fixed... lets see how many additional fixes i can fight through...
<JaneW> yipee
<lucasvo> ogra: first fix mine and then add it to final release! :D
<ogra> yes, but the keyboard thing is worrying, no idea why no tester reported it yet
<ogra> lucasvo, i dont fix xorg bugs
<lucasvo> ogra: should I do bugreport as well?
<ogra> JaneW, looks very tempting :)
<Yagisan> ogra: no idea - I've yet to test Japanese keyboard settings
<ogra> lucasvo, about what ? 
<lucasvo> ogra: the keyboard
<ogra> Yagisan, wont work i fear... not without a lts.conf
<Yagisan> maybe they just used us english
<ogra> yes...
<Yagisan> ogra: that's probably to be expected - at least with Japanese I can use an english keyboard
<ogra> but not for german or spanish
<Yagisan> just have to type it phonetically
<ogra> we'll need some docs ... how to set up a lts.conf properly
<Yagisan> there are some docs
<Yagisan> I'm looking at the ltsp package now as I write my patch
<ogra> but first i have to fix the path error so /usr/games is in the path :/
<Yagisan> but - it's not clear on the Ubuntu changes
<ogra> Yagisan, ubuntu ltsp picks up a configured lts.conf
<Yagisan> ogra: usr/local/bin too ?
<ogra> so the standard ltsp docs should be fine
<ogra> no idea about /usr/local/bin, we dont use it anywhere
<Yagisan> where does it pick the lts.conf from ? /etc /etc/ltsp ?
<Yagisan> I use /usr/local/bin - I'm sure other users do too
<Yagisan> it's where all my pbuilder scripts live
<ogra> they dont do by default in ubuntu
<ogra> nothing goes to /usr/local in a ubuntu system
<ogra> i wont be allowed to fix more tha /usr/games and even this will be a big fight
<Yagisan> ogra: until something 3rd party is installed
<ogra> yes, if you compiled it manually etc... so you should be able to add it to your path then...
<Yagisan> can the mistake be blamed on someone else ? (usr/games)
<ogra> nope
<Yagisan> your fault ? really ?
<ogra> no matter who to blame, i'm the one to fix it
<ogra> my fault that it isnt fixed yet...
<ogra> not my fault that its broken though
<Yagisan> just looking for reasons to justify it going in
<ogra> i have to fix it, regardless of reasons.... its my job
* Yagisan imagines a group of thin clients trying to play vegastrike
<Yagisan> ogra: and we appreciate every fix
<ogra> that'd be very expensive before you even could start
<ogra> GL apps over ltsp networks are a very very bad idea to run on more than one two clients...
<ogra> you'd at least need gigabit 
<Yagisan> yeah - I actually did some performance monitoring a while ago
<ogra> thats why we have no GL screensavers installed in edubuntu for example
<mhz> ogra, i know you ask me for patience, np. however... 44238589   6%   21.48kB/s    8:18:57 seems I need lots of patience :D
<Yagisan> I have 100Mbit here
<ogra> mhz, you are in the right dir ? 
<mhz> JaneW, any chance to get the children photos? Do we have to use them? prefer to use them? can we propose something else?
<Yagisan> but I'll try to run traffic shaping to "optimise" the bandwidth
<mhz> ogra, same dir as yesterday (it took 9hours)
<ogra> it should get very speedy at some point ... it does here at least
<ogra> btw, its easier to just run that by a cron script while you sleep ;)
<mhz> i imagine
<mhz> the iso finished at 07 AM today
<lucasvo> ogra: how do I have to configure my firewall for ltsp, which ports do I need?
<mhz> this one looks like it will finish at 18:00 (an it's now the time I had to install) :(
<ogra> lucasvo, why do you want to run ltsp through a firewall
<ogra> mhz, did you keep a copy of the iso ? why dont you use the one from yesterday and change the IP afterwards ? 
<lucasvo> ogra: I have a firewall on ltsp-server which closes someport...
<ogra> what for ? 
<ogra> i'd rather firewall my network at the gateway, not the ltsp server
<lucasvo> ogra: I have nat on the ltsp server, but there are only port80 and a few others allowed, which one do I have to add for nfs, ssh or whatever
<ogra> hmm, 111 for portmap, 22 for ssh, i think 2049 for NFS....
<ogra> oh, and dhcp and tftp for booting indeed ...
<Yagisan> hmm, ltsp -> firewall -> web -> customers firewall ->customers system && demo && support contract && money++ && happy girl
<ogra> and then your firewall is so wide pen that it doesnt make sense at all anymore
<ogra> s/pen/open
<mhz> ogra, ooops, I did not copy the 1st iso (7am) instead, I just starte rsync :( wwwuuuaaaaah
<Yagisan> now just to do that securely ...
<ogra> alone opening portmap is a security flaw for a firewall...
<ogra> i would do it separately
<Yagisan> ogra: for dapper - over openvpn ?
<ogra> to slow it down ? nah
<ogra> just use two network cards and nat the ltsp network...
<Yagisan> slow it down ?
<ogra> close it to the internet and its fine
<ogra> why another encryption layer to tunnel shh through ?
<ogra> ssh
<ogra> and i doubt the performance over a vpn link would be fun
<Yagisan> I'm just looking at expanding over a wide geographical location
<ogra> and tftp boot via internet ? 
<Yagisan> I would need to minimise the bandwidth
<ogra> that'd be a PITA
<ogra> and we dont plan such things :) 
<Yagisan> heh - I've already build bridged ethernet setups other the web
<ogra> next release shall cover a school ... not a country ;)
<lucasvo> ogra: now my login doesn't work anymore after:
<lucasvo> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/edubuntu/ldm_installation.txt
<ogra> lucasvo, but you installed the packages noted there, yes ? 
<Yagisan> well - I'm in sydney - my parents-in-law are in tokyo. I really don't want to fly over when the pc breaks
<ogra> lucasvo, python-gnome2 is the essential bit, it wont ork without
<lucasvo> ogra: yes I installed it
<Yagisan> gives me something to try (for dapper)
<ogra> lucasvo, in the chroot ? 
<ogra> Yagisan, and a normal ssh access doesnt suffice to maintain it ? 
<lucasvo> ogra: yes
<lucasvo> apt-get install python-gnome2
<ogra> and that really installed fine without errors ? 
<Yagisan> ogra: I like my vpns
<Yagisan> plus it sounds "cool" to my clients
<ogra> lucasvo, it will pull about 20 other packages in from the server
<ogra> there will be a notable installation go on ... 
<lucasvo> ogra: I already did that
<Yagisan> it's oh - you can do an international vpn's - surely you can do our branch office too
<ogra> lucasvo, any errors in ldm.log on the client ? 
<lucasvo> ogra: how can I find out?
<ogra> read the log on the client ? 
<lucasvo> ogra: I can't use the client, doesn't work
<ogra> i'm pretty sure python-gnome2 isnt installed right, else it would start...
<lucasvo> root@lama:/# apt-get install python-gnome2
<lucasvo> Reading package lists... Done
<lucasvo> Building dependency tree... Done
<lucasvo> python-gnome2 is already the newest version.
<lucasvo> 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
<lucasvo> root@lama:/# cd /var/log/
<ogra> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386/ dpkg -l python-gnome2
<lucasvo> and yes it is in chroot
<lucasvo> ok now it works but looks crappy
<ogra> in which way crappy ? 
<lucasvo> there is a big whit bar at the right side
<ogra> its in very early development ;) 
<ogra> but way easier to use than the other login screen
<lucasvo> and lsmod psmouse wasn't loaded
<ogra> what made it work ? 
<lucasvo> ogra: reboot
<ogra> of the client ? 
<lucasvo> yes
<lucasvo> but input doesn't work
<ogra> there are some schools in the US that use it daily... but its not adjusting the resolution very good below 1024x768 yet
<ogra> (thats why you see the white bar )
<ogra> lucasvo, you have a working xorg.conf for that machine ? 
<ogra> (non ltsp that is)
<lucasvo> ogra: I have this in my lts.conf
<lucasvo>         SERVER             = 192.168.1.1
<lucasvo>         X_MOUSE_PROTOCOL   = "PS/2"
<lucasvo>         X_MOUSE_DEVICE     = "/dev/psaux"
<lucasvo>         X_MOUSE_RESOLUTION = 400
<lucasvo>         X_MOUSE_BUTTONS    = 3
<ogra> hmm
<lucasvo>         USE_XFS            = N
<lucasvo>         X_MODE_0           = 1024x768
<lucasvo>         SCREEN_01          = startx
<lucasvo> ~
<lucasvo> and X_MODE_0 doesn't work
<ogra> are you even sure this file gets read ? 
<lucasvo> oh what have I done now, I don't even get an IP
<lucasvo> ah not enough IPs on dhcpserver
<lucasvo> ogra: how can I test if it gets read?
<ogra> where did you put it ? 
<lucasvo> /etc/lts.conf
<ogra> hmm, should be ok
<lucasvo> on chroot of ltsp client
<ogra> yup
<lucasvo> root@lama:/home# sudo cat /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf
<ogra> why do you use sudo if you are root ? 
<ogra> use only eithe one
<ogra> *either
<lucasvo> ehm copy and past your commands....
<ogra> so dont use root ;)
<ogra> i do it neither :)
<lucasvo> how can I test if it gets loaded?
<ogra> it gets loaded if its in this place
<lucasvo> ok
<ogra> less /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/lib/ltsp/ltsp_config
<ogra> see the top of this script... 
<ogra> it gets executed on boot
<lucasvo> doesn't work
<lucasvo> I can't move mouse nor I can see bootloader
<lucasvo> ehm I mean login
<ogra> if you move it away you can ? 
<ogra> (with wrong resolution ?)
<lucasvo> ogra: yes
<lucasvo> but it hangs now :(
<ogra> have you looked at /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/doc/ltsp-client/examples/lts.conf ?
<lucasvo> yes
<lucasvo> but  can't use mouse
<ogra> i hae no idea what tha is... nobody reported such an issue yet... but defunately your psmouse module isnt loaded
<lucasvo> yes
<lucasvo> and how can I load it? 
<ogra> and it works fine for me
<ogra> less /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/modules ?
<ogra> there should be mousedev, which pulls in psmouse
<ogra> you can try to add psmouse there additionally
<lucasvo> on server?
<ogra> in the abopve file
<lucasvo> ok
<lucasvo> this work
<lucasvo> s
<Zaheer> im having trouble connecting to a windows xp sp2 admin share from 5.10. nautilis keeps crashing.
<Zaheer> by admin share i mean c$, d$ for those who dont know.
<JaneW> back in 15 mins
<Zaheer> i basically want to map a share from the edubuntu pc to a windows pc.
<spacey_ki> samba?
<mhz> JaneW, can we use http://www.ubuntu.com/include/circle.jpg ? or is it anohter?
<spacey_ki> was also a circle with kids
<Zaheer> spacey_ki: yes
<mhz> spacey_ki, url?
<spacey_ki> http://www.edubuntu.org/
<spacey_ki> its on the front
<mhz> duh!
<mhz> :)
<Zaheer> anybody know how to install the subversion?
<Zaheer> using apt
<Yagisan> Zaheer: sudo aptitude install svn ??
<Yagisan> ogra: did you get my patch ?
<mhz> sudo apt-get install svn
<mhz> or..
<mhz> wget -c http://somewhere
<mhz> tar -xvzpf svn.tar.gz
<mhz> cd svn
<mhz> etc
<Zaheer> so whats mod_dav svn??
<mhz> no idea, I have not used svn in about ayear
<mhz> sorry
<Zaheer> im trying sudo apt-get install svn but it says it cant find the package.
<spacey_ki> Zaheer, mod_dav is webdav
<Yagisan> Zaheer: and universe and multiverse to your apt sources.list
<Zaheer> uh?
<Zaheer> you need to explain... please.
<spacey_ki> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Webdav
<Zaheer> checking now...
<Yagisan> Zaheer: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AddingRepositoriesHowto
<mhz> sudo apt-get install subversion
<mhz> Zaheer, sorry. subversion is the name, not svn
<mhz> just write this on a terminal sudo apt-get install subversion
<Zaheer> thanks
<Zaheer> much appreciated.
<mhz> np
<Zaheer> :)
<JaneW> mhz: I'd say no...
<JaneW> mdz: use the kids one was per our wiki
<JaneW> mdz: I'll send you a high res ver? or do you have it already?
<mhz> nop
<JaneW> mhz: do you agree it's a better pic for this?
<mhz> yes, and nop
<mhz> yes: it about children
<mhz> nop: education involves eveyone, parents, grownups, sisters, brothers, friends, etc
<JaneW> agreed
<JaneW> ideally if we had an age-divers pic that would be great
<JaneW> so far we are focussing on 'young' for this release though
<JaneW> and we have documented that the target age group is 6-18
<mhz> okidoki
<mhz> I buy it :)
<vmarks> hi
<vmarks> any thoughts on using edubuntu as a standalone desktop instead of the whole ltsp?
<JaneW> jsgotangco does that afaik
<vmarks> any performance hit from running the extra processes?
<vmarks> anything else I should be mindful of?
<vmarks> and, because I'm anxious, how close to release candidate?
<JaneW> ogra: will need to answer further sorry
<JaneW> he should be back in amin or 2
<vmarks> excellent
<vmarks> thank you
* JaneW is off
<JaneW> good luck :)
<crimsun> vmarks: the daily cd image for today should be quite close to RC
<vmarks> okay, point me in the right direction?
<vmarks> and: will the daily image when installed do the automatic updates so that after final is released the pre-release would be updated to current anyway?
<Zaheer> everyone have a good weekend and thanks again for the help :)
<jsgotangco> JaneW: wiki spammer :P
<mhz> hmmm, nogroup is equivalente for nobody?
<Yagisan> ogra: get my little patch ?
#edubuntu 2005-10-13
<mhz> moin
<mhz> ogra, breezy-install-i386.iso
<mhz>    675626776  98%   19.89kB/s    0:09:3942
<mhz> we're getting closer to the truth :D
<ogra> phew
<ogra> but it didnt really speed up :/
<mhz> nop
<mhz> it gave some time to make sure I can make DHCP work (by myself), though
<mhz>    687157248 100%   28.27kB/s    6:35:33  (1, 100.0% of 1)
<mhz> cool!
* mhz is connecting USB cdrw, and stuff to burn that so promising edubuntu.iso
<mhz> correction:/me is sent to get the laundry :(
<mhz> re
* mhz BBS
<mhz> re
<mhz> re
<arkanox_> hi mhz 
<Yagisan> ogra: ping
<hyperactivecrond> hey al
<hyperactivecrond> all`
<spacey_ki> moin
<Yagisan> ogra: the patch I sent you is also here http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=17297
<ogra> Yagisan, thanks, i already forwarded it to mdz for inclusion in dapper
<Yagisan> ogra: hey - your here - I hoped for some feedback - I didn't get you eairlier - so I stuck it on bugzilla
<ogra> i wont test it now, to much weird stuff to solve for release now... 
<Yagisan> I'm planning to test out with qemu for non-trivial multi-client-arch support soon
<Yagisan> no worries
<ogra> and it wont get accepted 5 days before release for the current one
<Yagisan> I was expecting dapper for that
<ogra> yup
<ogra> mdz has a bazaar tree for bleeding edge stuff... you might want to branch it :)
<Yagisan> do you get an error about being unable to write to volotile on boot and no non-free kernel modules ?
* Yagisan doesn't know how to use bazzar
<ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~mdz/archives/matt.zimmerman@canonical.com/
<ogra> i dont use nonfree kernel modules, but to my knowledge volatile is bind mounted from the server anyway
<Yagisan> I'll see if I can grab a log
<Yagisan> wait - volotile is bind mounted ?
<ogra> i think so...
<Yagisan> that won't work with multi-client-arches well
<Yagisan> thanks for sending my patch to mdz
<mhz_ed> morning
<mhz_ed> ogra, ping?
<Yagisan> G'day
<ogra> mhz_ed, hi
<mhz_ed> gd, Yagisan 
<mhz_ed> few weeks ago I was talking about edubuntu to one of the guys in Tecnocimiento. All the time our conversation lasted, he thought I was talking about a guy named Edward Ubuntu, leader of an educational project based on Debian :D
<mhz_ed> I couldn't help the laughter when he confessed that
<mhz_ed> he had even googled about edward ubuntu LOL
<mhz_ed> ogra, so, here i am with your iso installed onto this box. My interfaces are eth0 -> web | eth1 -> local net (192.168.0.1 as ip and gw)
<ogra> the install went errorfree ? 
<mhz_ed> is ti just a matter or booting clients now, or there's a service I should restart?
<mhz_ed> YES!!!
<ogra> yay
<mhz_ed> I can't tell you how happy I was at 3:30 AM
<mhz_ed> but I was dead sleepy so I went to bed
<ogra> with this ip stuff you should just restart dhcpd and all should be fine
<mhz_ed> okidoki.
<ogra> sudo /etc/init.d/dhcp3-server restart iirc
<mhz_ed> what I did do, is that at installing time I only configed eth1 and omitted eth0 in order to avoid possible conflicts
<ogra> ah, ok, then it should run already
<mhz_ed> hehe, yes. After more than 30 diff tries, stopin, starting services I can manage well :D
<mhz_ed> me booting thin laptop  now... let's see
<mhz_ed> heheh.. booting
<ogra> great
<ogra> :)
<mhz_ed> let's see once scripts finish if we can work
<mhz_ed> hmmm....
<mhz_ed> * starting RAID..
<mhz_ed> * calculating module dependencies
<mhz_ed> oopppps, a couple of warnings about LTSP
<mhz_ed> Fialure initializing /etc/net...
<ogra> thats normal
<mhz_ed> I see an X, I see an X!!!
<mhz_ed> yahooooooooooooo
<ogra> its caused by read only filesystem
<mhz_ed> username:
<mhz_ed> gooooogle!!
<mhz_ed> what username??
<ogra> the one you configured on install ? 
<ogra> or another one you created afterwards, as you like :)
<mhz_ed> oh, only that one, duh!
<mhz_ed> ogra, so, I could also install a lighter desktop and it all should run smoothly?
<ogra> you lo in to the normal desktop session like you would if you were directly on the server, so all you do there will be reflected by it
<ogra> sure
<ogra> note that we start the default Xsessio... 
* mhz_ed wife's thought I had an accident because of the way I expressed my happines :D
<ogra> you might have to uninstall other sessions... session selection is planned for next release only..
<mhz_ed> no problem. So I could disable GDM and force users to use a preconfiged .xinitrc ??
<ogra> (or create a ~/.xsession file)
<ogra> do that in ~/.xsession... not .xinitrc :)
<ogra> and what you see is not gdm ;) 
<Yagisan> sdm
<ogra> ldm ;)
<Yagisan> close
<Yagisan> ?dm :)
<mhz_ed> educool
<ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/edubuntu/
<ogra> ^^ has a preview and install instructions for the upcoming changes
<mhz_ed> ogra, let me say this: You have been doing a hell of a Job (literally)
<ogra> thanks :)
<mhz_ed> it's pure truth
<ogra> i still need fixes to go in that mdz doesnt allow currently... we're still fighting
<ogra> i.e. PATH is wrong...
<mhz_ed> hence I insist: ."a hell of a job"
<ogra> (no /usr/games... try to run a game)
<mhz_ed> :D
<Yagisan> ogra: I did - no wesnoth :(
<ogra> its there, just the patch is wrong :(
<mhz_ed> no such file
<ogra> s/patch/path
<mhz_ed> :)
<ogra> yes
<ogra> all DMs set it on login, only ldm doesnt... mdz doesnt answer to my change request :(
<mhz_ed> anyways we can "speak in the dark" with him?
<ogra> nah...
<ogra> he just wants the *right* fix for that and thinks it should be done in ssh... i disagree, we have to fight this out ;)
<mhz_ed> what if he suddenly sufferen and accident?
<Yagisan> why does he think it's sshs problem ?
<ogra> then i'd take it over, but it would use its best developer and inventor :)
<mhz_ed> :D
<ogra> because ssh should set the environment on login in his opinoin...
<mhz_ed> oh, by the way... yesterday, my DHCP server setting did not work thruough my dlink router. Today I booted via crossover rj45
<ogra> but all othr DMs set it before attempting to login in X so i think the same behavior is right for ldm and ssh
* mhz_ed is gonna try boot using dlink in the middle
<ogra> i have 4 switches between my client and server... shouldnt be an issue
<Yagisan> I'd agree with you that ldm should set it. It is then consistent with all other DMs. If he disagrees - he should file a bug on the other DMs
<mhz_ed> hmmm, and how do I turned clients off?
<Yagisan> mhz_ed: log out and power button
<mhz_ed> Yagisan, I did that but I get back to ldm
<Yagisan> hold down power button for about 4 seconds
<mhz_ed> hehehehehe
<mhz_ed> oh, you mean "force them done"
<mhz_ed> oh, you mean "force them down
<Yagisan> I'd like shutdown -h as a local app myself
<Yagisan> yeah - force them down
<Yagisan> at the ldm screen your not going to lose data
<Yagisan> just pretend its DOS
<ogra> i'll add a shutdown option to ldm in dapper
<mhz_ed> :( Nope, it won't boot using the dlink in between
<mhz_ed> not even dhcp passes
<ogra> thats very strange
<mhz_ed> yes
<ogra> you dont use the crosslik cable on to the router ? 
<ogra> s/on//
<mhz_ed> nnnnoooop
<mhz_ed> hehehe
<ogra> try it, probably it helps ;)
<ogra> no really, its quite strange
<mhz_ed> but it always worked ok
<mhz_ed> ah, but worked ok with no dhcp server set by then
<mhz_ed> could it be that my eth1 is sharing gw IP
<ogra> oh, yes, you shouldnt run two in one net... except configured as repeating server
<mhz_ed> sahring = using
<mhz_ed> and how can I set 2 ips to same eth1
<ogra> ifconfig eth1:0 xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx
<ogra> and add a route...
<mhz_ed> or is it eth1 = 192.168.0.2 and the router must have 192.168.0.1
<mhz_ed> ?
<ogra> what is the router ? a standalone one ? 
<mhz_ed> router is dLink
<ogra> and has a static ip ? 
<mhz_ed> dunno
<mhz_ed> never touched it
<ogra> i would give it 192.168.0.1 as static ip... 
<mhz_ed> yep, and how?
<ogra> doesnt it have a web interface to configure it ? 
<mhz_ed> want me to google?
<mhz_ed> oh, i think it does
<ogra> i mean, how do you configure to dial in with it ? 
<mhz_ed> it has an Ip I can access and get to a web interface
<mhz_ed> but i ave never dialed in
<ogra> so what does it route then ? 
<mhz_ed> actually, now that you mention it, it's there to let me give other machines web access, only
<mhz_ed> like a HUB
<mhz_ed> ogra, current Motorola IPS Modem IP is 192.168.100.1
* mhz_ed still trying to get dlink ip
<mhz_ed> ogra, few minutes ago you suggested: ifconfig eth1:0 xxx.xxx.xxx.xx
<mhz_ed> aslo: and add a route..
<ogra> yes, if you need two IPs on one interface
<ogra> eth1:0 is an alias for eth1
<mhz_ed> by doing so, I can give eth1: ...1 and eth1:0 ...2 ?  being 1 the gw and 2 the ip?
<ogra> why ? 
<mhz_ed> I need my clients to boot from server and have web acces, right?
<ogra> you need your clients to boot from the server... nothing more or the clients... dont forget, you log in directly on the server
<ogra> s/or/on/
<mhz_ed> duh1!right
<ogra> so if you have eth0->web & eth1->thin client network, you boot the client on eth1's network, lo in via ssh -X on the server and access the web through eth0 directly from there
<ogra> s/lo/log/
<mhz_ed> absolutely right
<ogra> it all happens on the server, eth1 is only for low level stuff to the clients...
<ogra> no routig required....
<mhz_ed> uh, but then I forgot about my wife.
<mhz_ed> she uses MS
<ogra> and is on the eth0 network ? 
* mhz_ed still can't convince her to see the light
<mhz_ed> she used to have static ip 192... and set 192...1 as gw so she go out
<ogra> fine...
<mhz_ed> hmm, I am getting errors from this reps. deb http://cl.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu breezy-backports main restricted universe multiverse
<mhz_ed> deb-src http://cl.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu breezy-backports main restricted universe multiverse
<ogra> heh, breezy-backports ???
<mhz_ed> it was there and I said, why not?
<mhz_ed> I don't want it?
<ogra> from where should they come ? a vaporware archive ? 
<ogra> there is nothing from where you could backport something to breezy yet ;)
<mhz_ed> LOL
* mhz_ed commenting hose lines
* mhz_ed reading alittle
<Yagisan> ogra - well *cough* *cough* I have some breezy-backports :)
<ogra> Yagisan, from which dapper did you get it :p ?
<Yagisan> from my list of "it's to late for breezy" :)
<Yagisan> s/to/too
<Yagisan> includes multi-client-support, action games etc :-P
* mhz_ed BBL
<stockholm> jane_: there?
<mhz_ed> re
<mhz_ed> ogra, E.T. phone home
<mhz_ed> ogra, ping?
<fersfeir> Hi, i try to install edubuntu an get the error http://img281.imageshack.us/img281/1127/initrdtools1xa.png and cat /target/var.....  is http://img44.imageshack.us/img44/7377/bootstraplog0zd.png
<fersfeir> some idea about the error?
<fersfeir> i am using the image http://us.releases.ubuntu.com/releases/edubuntu/5.10/edubuntu-5.10-preview-install-i386.iso
<hno73> crimsun: ping
<hno73> I've put up a test of the new wiki skin at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/
<hno73> anyone want to test?
<hno73> (anyone else around this late on a Saturday? :) )
<fersfeir> well....
<fersfeir> second try
<mhz_ed> hno73, hey, nice to see you, long time.
<hno73> mhz_ed: hey!
<hno73> want to test my new wiki skin? :)
<mhz_ed> of course! been waiting for it
<hno73> how are things?
<mhz_ed> better
<mhz_ed> lot better
<mhz_ed> :)
<hno73> so go to the main wiki, and select the edubuntu skin
<mhz_ed> but still no money, just volunteering
<hno73> good
<hno73> right
* mhz_ed login in
* hno73 crosses his fingers
<mhz_ed> hehehe, I had forgot password :( duh!
#edubuntu 2005-10-14
<hno73> heh
<hno73> Launchpad can send you a new one
<mhz_ed> am i being redirected or something? it is taking loooong to show me the theme
<hno73> hm, works ok here. It's probably not in the cache though
<mhz_ed> hmmmm, nothing diff
<hno73> go to user prefs and select the edubuntu skin
<mhz_ed> are you sure you placed the .py under /MoinMoin/themes ?
<mhz_ed> ahhh, edubuntu
<hno73> yeah, works for me ...
<hno73> it's on the ubuntu wiki not edubuntu
<mhz_ed> I ahd chosen ubuntu-test :)
<hno73> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/
<hno73> ok
<mhz_ed> wow! looks nice..
<mhz_ed> very nice!
<mhz_ed> very very nice!
* mhz_ed starts playing a little to test it
<hno73> thanks. highvoltage did the first design work
<mhz_ed> 1st thing: MoreActions still show same color for both permitted and non-permitted actions, is that intentional?
<hno73> are there any non-permitted actions?
<hno73> I think anyone can do anything in this wiki :)
<mhz_ed> Rename and Delete ?
<hno73> yepp, even that :)
<mhz_ed> I can't access to those options but still see them as normal
<hno73> hm, ok. I'll look at that
<mhz_ed> very cool RC!
<hno73> Yeah, I already like it better than the normal ubuntu skin
<hno73> the tan gets a bit boring after a while
<hno73> there is still a bit of brown here and there ...
<mhz_ed> yes
<mhz_ed> good icons!
<hno73> Like table headings https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupportComponentsMultimediaDigitalCameras
<hno73> gartoon
<hno73> like thedesktop
<mhz_ed> aren't /datas merged yet?
<hno73> no, not yet
<hno73> but that's easy
<mhz_ed> hmmm why not?
<hno73> the edubuntu wiki is small
<hno73> good question really :)
<hno73> we'll do it in the next few days
<mhz_ed> ok
<mhz_ed> hmm, 2nd thing: looooong names get out of proportions
<mhz_ed> but it seems to be a Moin problem
<hno73> then we have to do that skin URL forwarding trick
<hno73> out of proportions?
<mhz_ed> or that. yes
<mhz_ed> yes, it oversizes the width of the header
<hno73> oh, yeah
<mhz_ed> Maybe you could try giving options of "repeating" background
<mhz_ed> or, play some "degrade" (difumination?) of color
<mhz_ed> tricks
<hno73> on the header?
<mhz_ed> yep
<hno73> or just make heading a bit smaller
<hno73> smaller font
<mhz_ed> I had the exact issue on all my firts 3 themes
<mhz_ed> well, that too, but it won't solve the issue, actually. ICanStillThinkOf VeryLargeTitleAsHeadingFroYOurWikiSiteOrPage
<mhz_ed> :)
<mhz_ed> and then .. it will still be oversizeing
<hno73> true
<hno73> but then it's your own fault :)
<mhz_ed> LOL
<mhz_ed> true
<mhz_ed> so far, very cool look&feel
<mhz_ed> it reminds me of SchoolBell red color
<hno73> Cool. 
<mhz_ed> when is this supposed ot be out
<mhz_ed> ?
<hno73> I'll probably have to redo the ubuntu skin now
<hno73> Tuesday perhaps? :)
<mhz_ed> wow, very soon
<mhz_ed> 3rd thing: maybe nothing BUt still have to mention it.
<hno73> yeah, before the launch of edubuntu
<mhz_ed> what's you monitor size?
<hno73> or on the same day
<hno73> 1280x1024
<mhz_ed> mine is 15" at 1024*something, and using a little more than 3/4 of it, The orange search area overlaps the Moreactions menu, just a little enough to cover the drop down area.
<mhz_ed> That is not an issue, but, when i want to click on the down arrow, I do but it does not respond
<hno73> yeah, I think I'll remove Show Changes and leave just Get Info for that purpose
<mhz_ed> so I am forced to click on the MoreActions word. then it responds
<hno73> yepp, known problem
<hno73> I can also trim the orange image a bit
<mhz_ed> maybe placing the options a little more to the right will reduce the size of the orange thing.
<mhz_ed> BTW, what do you call that orange area?
<mhz_ed> :)
<hno73> dunno :)
<hno73> I could shrink the search box a bit (how?, what file is that in?)
<hno73> mhz_ed: thanks for your help. I've got to go
<hno73> I'll be back tomorrow
<mhz_ed> okidoki
<mhz_ed> please
<mhz_ed> have nice day
<hno73> I'm off to sleep!
<hno73> you have a nice day :)
<mhz_ed> hey!!!!!
<mhz_ed> I managed to NetBoot from a Edubuntu box!!!
<mhz_ed> I just added a couple of lines to the /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
<mhz_ed> untar netboot.gz (got it from web)
<mhz_ed> restart dhcp
<mhz_ed> place netboot extracted onto /var/lib/tftpboot/
<mhz_ed> VERY SIMPLE and effective
<mhz_ed> Any one living here today?
* mhz_ed trying to install edubuntu now, via tftp booting :)
<mhz_ed> ogra, ping
<mhz_ed> anyone around?
<mhz_ed> arkan0x, hey
<arkan0x> mhz_ed, hi 
<arkan0x> mhz_ed, pv
<mhz_ed> pv?
<arkan0x> mhz , mauricio hernandez !
<arkan0x> X
<mhz_edu> anybody here?
<mhz_edu> ogra, ping?
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: I'm here
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, cool
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, sensei, I have finally installed edubuntu and also managed to netboot thin laptop in order to install linux from server
<mhz_edu> BUT
<mhz_edu> the laptop boots fine, it asks for keyboard, langiage,etc
<mhz_edu> language, sorry
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: I'm not a teacher :)
<Yagisan> go on
<mhz_edu> when it asks to choose a mirror, I just can't get the web
<mhz_edu> I am using a crossover to connect edubuntu with the laptop
<mhz_edu> and edubuntu can get to the web with no problem, via my eth0
<mhz_edu> my eth1 is for local machines
<Yagisan> but the laptop can't connect right
<mhz_edu> Dhcp is provinding ip via eth1, BTW.
<mhz_edu> right
<mhz_edu> I did a nat
<mhz_edu> so my guess is Nat is not working propoerly or the crossover is not for web?
<Yagisan> ok - it looks like it (edubuntu) is not forwarding the packets
<mhz_edu> yes
<Yagisan> crossovers don't matter
<mhz_edu> how can I check that?
<mhz_edu> cool
<Yagisan> whats the ip for eth0 and eth1 ?
<mhz_edu> eth0 -> 201.215.84.252
* Yagisan sshs into my router to check settings
<mhz_edu> eth1 -> 192.168.0.1
<Yagisan> ok
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, I also have a Dlink router that I was using, without dhcp,  to provide web to local machines via eth1. Since I installed edubuntu, I had to use the crossover because machines did not get ips from dhcp
<Yagisan> when you set up the nat how did you do it ?
<mhz_edu> iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o eth0 -j MASQUERADE
<mhz_edu> echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward
<Yagisan> that looks right to me so far
<Yagisan> did you modprobe iptable_nat ?
<Yagisan> to load the nat module for iptables ?
<mhz_edu> another detail is that my /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf has 192.168.0.1 for both router and domain-name-server
<mhz_edu> hmmm, nop
<mhz_edu> now, I just did
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: is 192.168.0.1 a dns server ? (I changed that to my isp dns servers)
<mhz_edu> nop
<mhz_edu> good point
<Yagisan> if it's not - then the clients are probally timing out on dns
* mhz_edu changing
<Yagisan> does http://66.102.7.147 work ?
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: working ?
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, sorry, I had to get to the toilette :)
<mhz_edu> .oO(almost 03:00 AM here)
<mhz_edu> taht ip is google's
<mhz_edu> that ip is google's
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: I know - I just pinged my home page
<mhz_edu> hehehe
<mhz_edu> it is working!
<Yagisan> if it works like that - but not as http://www.google.com you have a dns problem
<mhz_edu> ok, here's the problem
<mhz_edu> NAT must be off when you boot the laptop and wait for ip, and all.
<mhz_edu> after booting and entering the installation procedure, you can activate NAT in the server
<mhz_edu> but then , in the laptop, you must go back to network autoconfig
<mhz_edu> I was not doing that
<mhz_edu> neither was I modprobing
<mhz_edu> thx for that
<Yagisan> hmm - should work with NAT on
<Yagisan> your welcome
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, now I am happy I finally contribute to Edubuntu docs with my 2 cents about this howto :D
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, probably yes
<mhz_edu> but again, I just couldn't use edubuntu dhcp server via my Dlink to the laptop
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: good spot about my name - the dlink is a bit odd
<mhz_edu> so there must be something else missing on this issue. Something I am not seeing
<Yagisan> this is the same dlink you talked about yesterday with ogra ?
* Yagisan is in Australia
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, sorry for my english so bad. I did not quite get the "good spot"
<mhz_edu> yesp
<mhz_edu> same thing
<Yagisan> you noticed my name is Japanese
<mhz_edu> so you can imagine how long I've been sitting fighting here
<mhz_edu> yes
<mhz_edu> oh, that
<mhz_edu> :)
<mhz_edu> my butt is asking for forgiveness and promises to be kind to me now
<mhz_edu> :D
<Yagisan> :)
<mhz_edu> and my legs can't walk well
<Yagisan> perhaps after you get some rest - you get some inspiration as to why the dlink won't work
<Yagisan> is it a router or a switch ?
<mhz_edu> and my wife is mad because I have spent at least 80 hours on this, the last 5 days
<mhz_edu> it reads: Ethernet Broadband Router
<Yagisan> I just told my wife it was work related
<mhz_edu> LOL
<mhz_edu> actually it is
<Yagisan> (and gave her a pc)
<mhz_edu> 'coz this is the only laptop (the one I am now installing) I have for my Edubuntu presentations
<Yagisan> was the dlink used for ADSL ?
<mhz_edu> was?
<Yagisan> did you used to use / still use the dlink for an adsl connection
<Yagisan> ?
<mhz_edu> I have my ISP Modem (cable) connected to eth0. Eth1 is connected to the Dlink. The laptops  connect to Dlink to get internet access
<mhz_edu> (at least that was the layout)
<Yagisan> OK - just trying to workout how the device worked
<Yagisan> did the dlink do nat ? or dhcp ?
<mhz_edu> .oO(I just can't express how "deliciously pleasant" it is to format this HD in this Fujitsu thin laptop)
* Yagisan has no laptop :'(
<mhz_edu> no idea. I passed Iptalbes commands (the one I showed)
* Yagisan has to pay new baby expenses
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, I had no laptops until I understood I did not need so much of a desktop power, so started buying 2nd hand or refurbished laptops.
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, how old's you baby?
<mhz_edu> this Fujitsu is 500 Mhz celeron, 256 MB ram, and 20 GB HD
<Yagisan> one is 20 months the next one is due November 20
<mhz_edu> and 10.4 inches :D
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, so you've been busy
<mhz_edu> :D
<mhz_edu> congrats!
<mhz_edu> mine is 4 and the other is 10
<Yagisan> :'( not anymore - my wife is threatening in to chop it off !
<mhz_edu> ooooops
<mhz_edu> well, look at the good side of it.
<mhz_edu> you'll be able to afford a laptop in a near future :D
<Yagisan> boys or girls ? I have one girl - and I think the next one is a boy
<Yagisan> Is this your dlink ? http://www.dlink.com/products/?pid=62
* mhz_edu firefoxing
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, boy = 10 and girl =4.  Boy lives with my ex-wife, thou
<Yagisan> hope you can see him (sometimes ex's make it hard)
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, UNBELIEVABLE! yes, that's my router :D
<mhz_edu> not sometimes
<mhz_edu> Always!
* Yagisan used to be a network engineer
<mhz_edu> but as long as you pay constantly.. they get a little -only a little, remember they are ex- smoother
* mhz_edu knows nothing about computers
<mhz_edu> well, a little more than a regular newbie
<mhz_edu> just a freedom of access and technology fanatic
<Yagisan> ok - you will have lots of trouble with the dlink :(
<mhz_edu> boooh
<mhz_edu> at least you may save me 80 more hours trying to make it work
<Yagisan> it's not a regular router/switch - more like a custom nat box
<mhz_edu> that sounded japaneese to me
<Yagisan> a cheap 100MBps switch (about $20au) should do the job for you
<Yagisan> Inet -> cablemodem -> edubuntu -> switch -> pc's
<mhz_edu> hmmm, about U$30?
<Yagisan> more like US$15
<Yagisan> they shouldn't be too expensive
<mhz_edu> cool
<Yagisan> my switch http://www.auspcmarket.com.au/show_product_info.php?input[product_code] =NE-MS4008B&input[category_id] =1114
<Yagisan> cheap, chinese, and within walking distance :)
<mhz_edu> lol
<Yagisan> You'll like the next version of edubuntu
<mhz_edu> why?
<mhz_edu> it includes TFTP booting?
<Yagisan> I've contributed patches that let you have multiple client architectures on your server
<Yagisan> so you can eg have i386 clients on an amd64 server
<mhz_edu> wow! that's perfect for educational envs.
<Yagisan> you need TFTP booting ?
<mhz_edu> ppc, too?
<Yagisan> working on ppc - that's a bit harder
<Yagisan> I need qemu to work for that
<Yagisan> http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=17297
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, well, in any educational environment, in Chile, boxes come and go. Teachers may have boxes at home, so may students.
<mhz_edu> Therefore, giving the chance to install onto their pcs is cool
<Yagisan> initial work /|\
<Yagisan> I use rom-o-matic to build etherboot images with pxe emulation
<mhz_edu> so, having Edubuntu at schools (LTSP) and similar boxes at home, is good. Now even better idea if from the same server you install linux
<mhz_edu> i've heard about rom-o-matic
<mhz_edu> but what if, in my case, I had this thin box, with no chance to boot from Cd nor Floppy
<mhz_edu> I am currently volunteering for a prohject called RecicLab
<Yagisan> none of my netcards have boot roms - so I went to rom-o-matic made zlilo images and put it on a hard disk in the clients
<mhz_edu> here, we provide a computer to a young man on the conditin that he'll learn how to put together all the pieces and also install linux on it
<Yagisan> edited grub to make netbooting default :)
<Yagisan> cool
<mhz_edu> wow! can you use Grub to boot an installation process from HD?
<Yagisan> women too ?
<mhz_edu> yes
<Yagisan> I cheat - I do the most striped down server install on the hdd
<mhz_edu> and these people MUST come accompained by a relative or grownup responsible for him, so tehy both must come to the 7 days sessions
<mhz_edu> otherwise, they do not get the pc home
<mhz_edu> :)
<Yagisan> then I get grub to load rom-o-matic image to load kernel over the network
<mhz_edu> not cheat, u're wise
<mhz_edu> but how d'u do it when the pc has windows?
<mhz_edu> and is a thin client.
<Yagisan> .oO( glad it fit on a 257MB hard disk)
<mhz_edu> I once installed linux from windows using a tool called Grub4NT
<Yagisan> I remove windows - I have Ubuntu hoary cd's for each supported arch
* mhz_edu wanted to remove windows but just couldnt 'coz there was no way to install another OS unless netbooting
<Yagisan> and I keep a CDROM drive that I install just to put ubuntu on - then I take my CDROM out
<mhz_edu> you mean, you install linux from windows onto thin clients and using a CDROM??
<mhz_edu> (external?)
<Yagisan> no - I pull case off - stick in cdrom - install linux (wipeing out windows)
<Yagisan> I then copy rom-o-matic image to hard disk
<Yagisan> edit grub, and have the system boot up
<mhz_edu> ok
<Yagisan> It then runs everything off the edubuntu/ltsp server
<Yagisan> my office
<mhz_edu> have you wikied that way?
<Yagisan> (amd64)----->switch---(i386 box1, i386 box2, etc)
<Yagisan> no - I haven't wikied it
<mhz_edu> could you?
<Yagisan> I will shortly (within a few days) - I need to clearly document it
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, if I gave static ips to clients, would the dlink work friendly with dhcp server?
<Yagisan> the dlink is doing some nating
<Yagisan> it looks like it is dropping the broadcasts which is how dhcp works
<Yagisan> dlink uses that as a primitive firewall
<mhz_edu> :(
<Yagisan> you will most likely need great patience - and if it's like my netcomm it won't ever work
<mhz_edu> how can I acces to its web interface and set it to my needs?
* Yagisan is looking at dlink site
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: which is yours ?http://www.dlink.com/products/support.asp?pid=62&sec=0#quickInstallGuides
<mhz_edu> http://www.dlink.com/products/support.asp?pid=62&pv=16&sec=0
<mhz_edu> hmmm, you're thinking about firmware upgrade?
<Yagisan> nope
<Yagisan> can I ask you a dumb question
<Yagisan> what ports are you plugging the cable in ?
<Yagisan> the 4 on the left ? or the 1 on the right ?
<Yagisan> please humor me - and try only the 4 on the left
<mhz_edu> waht cable? the eth0 is to the Modem, and eth1 to Dlink. You want me to connect the eth1 to the 4th port to the left? left is relative.
<Yagisan> on the back of the dlink
<Yagisan> the are 4 ports close together
<Yagisan> then 1 port and poer
<Yagisan> power
<Yagisan> the 4 ports close together are left (when looking at the back)
<mhz_edu> ok
<Yagisan> edubuntu eth1 to leftmost port, then you can attach 3 clients to the next 3 ports
<Yagisan> don't use the port next to power
<mhz_edu> but i can't right now 'coz eth1 is being used by the crossover
<mhz_edu> LOl
<Yagisan> later then :)
<Yagisan> next - that dlink seems to take 192.168.0.1 by default
<mhz_edu> duh!
<mhz_edu> no wonder why I was having so much trouble
<Yagisan> so - sudo gedit /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
<mhz_edu> and change ips
<Yagisan> change 192.168.0.1 to something else
<mhz_edu> can I use nano instead? :D
<Yagisan> I use 192.168.1.1
<Yagisan> sure
<Yagisan> I use mcedit myself
<mhz_edu> I'd reather use emacs thou
<Yagisan> ok - sudo $EDITOR /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf :-D
<mhz_edu> lol
<mhz_edu> or
<mhz_edu> no sudo
<Yagisan> should use sudo - that file is only editable by root
<mhz_edu> or nohup sudo $EDITOR /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
<mhz_edu> yes, but if I have laready assigned root a password.. i can by pss sudo
<mhz_edu> bypass
<Yagisan> true
<Yagisan> but then you can't copy & paste :)
<mhz_edu> and I use sudo especially when I log in via ssh remotely 
<mhz_edu> root is blocked for ssh
<mhz_edu> ssh login I mean
<Yagisan> then, sudo /etc/init.d/dhcp3-server restart
<Yagisan> and it should all be ok
<mhz_edu> yes
<Yagisan> want to see my dhcpd.conf as an example ?
<mhz_edu> and I could finally see if that was the stupid simple issue of my dhcp server not passing through
<mhz_edu> why not?
<Yagisan> I suggest some tape over that last port if that works
* Yagisan also used to be Technical Support
* Yagisan was also a Systems Administrator
* Yagisan is now an E-Security Consultant
<mhz_edu> BTW, if i remove gdm from init.d, and I am used to login and then startx, will LDM still work fine on clients?
* mhz_edu was a Translator and Interpreter
* mhz_edu was teacher
<Yagisan> I'd leave gdm alone, it doesn't hurt, and any upgrade will put it back
* mhz_edu is now volunteer for 5 FreeAsInFreedom projects
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, but how do I just get rid of it or block it on upgrades?
<Yagisan> the clients don't load gdm
<mhz_edu> I know, they load LDM
<Yagisan> the gdm you are looking at (this is on edubuntu right ?) is the one used to log in locally to the server
<mhz_edu> I have created .xsession and indicated to exec fluxbox. No success, it gets back to login prompt
<mhz_edu> yes, I wanna get rid of GDM, not LDM
<Yagisan> you need gdm on the server
<mhz_edu> my .xsession works perfectly on the server BUT the clients
<Yagisan> you can't use ldm for a local login on the server
<mhz_edu> why need it?
<mhz_edu> I know
<mhz_edu> Login Display Manager
<mhz_edu> LtspDisplay Manager
<Yagisan> where is .xsession ?
<Yagisan> $HOME/.xsession ?
<mhz_edu> then how could i enable Fluxbox or WindowMaker or Enlightenment for Clients
<mhz_edu> ?
<mhz_edu> yes
<mhz_edu> I tried to put it on /etc/X11
<mhz_edu> I tried to put it on /etc/X11/Xsession something
<mhz_edu> but I couldn't figure out
<Yagisan> $HOME/.xsession is the right spot
<mhz_edu> fluxbox runs only on server, so far.
<Yagisan> client changes are usually in /opt/ltsp/$ARCH/etc
<mhz_edu> hmmm
* mhz_edu reading your dhcp
* mhz_edu wow... 5:03 AM here
* mhz_edu is gonna get kicked in the ass :D
<Yagisan> man - you should get some sleep
<Yagisan> it's 6:03 PM here
<mhz_edu> but fujitsu is installing vim-common
<Yagisan> and fujitsu can keep installing while you sleep
<mhz_edu> there was a news here in chile that Australia was looking for chilean workers
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, yes, but it wouldn't be the same :D
<mhz_edu> it needs its daddy
<mhz_edu> is the news right?
<Yagisan> really ? (they wouldn't hire the locals when I was f*cking unemployed for a few years )
* Yagisan stopped watching tv a while ago - no reception
<mhz_edu> i've been unemployed for a year now
<mhz_edu> I get some money from volunteering , ocationally
<Yagisan> It sucks doesn't it.
<mhz_edu> YES!
<Yagisan> I borrowed some money from wife and her parents to start a business
<mhz_edu> but I am very "hyper" and I am always doing something or making things happen
<mhz_edu> e-stuff?
<Yagisan> E-Security (professional hacker, Security Audits)
<Yagisan> It's hard to concentrate on getting customers - and preparing for wife to give birth
<mhz_edu> nice job
<mhz_edu> I imagine
* mhz_edu has been there :)
<Yagisan> all the supporting family is in Japan - it's just me and my wife
<mhz_edu> ...Being a small business ourselves, we understand that many small to medium businesses just can't dedicate the same level of resources to protect their critical IT infrastructure...
<Yagisan> it's a challenging job
<mhz_edu> well put
<Yagisan> I'm not finished my website yet
<mhz_edu> it is challenging, indeed
<Yagisan> I had to do a restore a few days ago
<mhz_edu> what does she do?
<mhz_edu> did?
<Yagisan> and I hope to finish it tonight
<Yagisan> translation
<Yagisan> :)
<Yagisan> also clerical work
<Yagisan> the site shows up for you - not glitches ?
<Yagisan> no
<mhz_edu> this is where I volunteer for (those are all projects I have started and now lead/motivate people to participate on) http://www.tecnocimiento.cl
<mhz_edu> nop
<Yagisan> you are Mauricio ?
<mhz_edu> yes
<Yagisan> cool
<gand> hi all
<Yagisan> Glday gand
<mhz_edu> hey gand 
* Yagisan has many typos today
<gand> I'm trying to connect via FTP, FTP service is checked inservice settings but I can't connect :)
<gand> hi mhz_edu
<Yagisan> ftp to what ?
<gand> my edubuntu server is usex.homelinux.org 
<gand> ftp to my edubuntu server
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, I usually work with a small business, aimed to Web Development (www.esfera.cl) Tecnocimiento is aimed to Education and Free Technology applied to it. One thing Esfera and Tecnocimiento do not do is e-security. Maybe we can get a little creative there, with you.
<gand> http://usex.homelinux.org
<gand> I'm testing some LMS as moodle. dokeos, docebo, plone
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: certainly
<mhz_edu> gand, hmmm, can you access via ssh?
<gand> yes
<Yagisan> gand: did you configure your ftp server ?
<mhz_edu> gand, no IPtables stopping FTP?
<gand> opp no :) how can I configure? is there a gui to do that
<mhz_edu> gand, no idea. I have not used ftp in more than 5 years, sorry
<Yagisan> gand: probably not, what ftp server did you install
* Yagisan uses scp or rsync nowadays
<mhz_edu> mee too
* Yagisan occasionally uses http as well for read only
<gand> the default FTP, I just see that in Service setting FTP service is checked
<gand> Adminstration->ServiceSetting window
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, why not using the menu bar at the righ side?
<Yagisan> gand: that controls tftp (for booting your thin clients)
<mhz_edu> (your site, I meant)
<Yagisan>  mhz_edu: try our research
<Yagisan> gand: you don't have a ftp server installed
<Yagisan> gand: do you need ftp ?
<gand> opps I supposed it was :) well is there a easy way to set up a FTP service tu upload file to my server
<mhz_edu> gand, apt-cahce search ftp server
<gand> yes I need to upload file to my server with ftp or other way, the easy way :)
<mhz_edu> gand, apt-cache search ftp server
<mhz_edu> ok
<mhz_edu> Synaptic
<gand> ok, and FTP configuration?
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: MS IE hated my site - I had to do CSS magic on it
<Yagisan> gand: to upload just use scp eg scp myfile.txt usex.homelinux.org:/home/gand/
<mhz_edu> somewhere in GNOMe, there's a tool called Synaptic
<gand> yes I use synaptic to intall software
<mhz_edu> ok, search for a ftp server
<Yagisan> gand: ok - just a word of warning - ftp is not secure
<mhz_edu> gand, heve you ever edited /etc/apt/source.list?
<gand> well now I try, If I have problems I'll be back here thanks a lot
<Yagisan> gand: are kids going to have access to this machine ?
<gand> yes I edited source list
<gand> yes it will be the lms server for my school
<mhz_edu> ok, so you have uncommented the repositories?
<Yagisan> gand: If so - I strongly recommend not using ftp
<gand> yes mhz_edu
<mhz_edu> gand, FTP is one of the less secure applications/protocol
<mhz_edu> but if you say you need it, Synaptic is your choice to look up
<gand> yes I know, how can I upload file, with SFTP?
<mhz_edu> hmm, I gues very similar to scp
<Yagisan> gand: have you tried scp ?
<gand> I know only FTP and SFTP
<gand> scp?
<Yagisan> gand: you know ssh ?
<mhz_edu> scp the_file user@server:/home/user/
<gand> yes I know ssh
<mhz_edu> SCP is ssh to send files :)
<Yagisan> gand: then scp is a good choice for you
<Yagisan> gand: and it can be quicker the ftp :)
<gand> nice, as now I'm on a macOSX box I just have to know how to work with scp
<mhz_edu> example:    scp the_file gand@server:/home/gand/
<mhz_edu> OSX , afaik, includes ssh
<gand> but I have to connect via ssh before use scp command?
<mhz_edu> and afaik, ssh includes scp
<Yagisan> gand: no
<gand> ok now I try :)
<mhz_edu> gand, that's the beauty of it
<mhz_edu> it opens a "tunnel" for just the time the file takes to get to the other side
<gand> Well ssh to my server is Ok
<mhz_edu> and logsout
<mhz_edu> then scp will be fine too
<Yagisan> gand: I use it to back up all sorts of things :) It works very well
<mhz_edu> indeed
<gand> now I open terminal and $ scp the_file gand@server:/home/gand/
<gand> [10:30]  mhz_edu: OSX , afaik, includes ssh
<mhz_edu> yes
<gand> also to download file?
<mhz_edu> nop
<Yagisan> yes
<gand> ok let me 5 mins to  try it, thanks again
<mhz_edu> 1st... I guess you have replaced the example values, right?
<Yagisan> scp gand@server:/home/gand/the_file ./
<Yagisan> :)
<mhz_edu> gand, to download you use scp from the server to you
<gand> yes mhz
<gand> right to download ssh to server before and the scp, cool :)
<gand> the/then
<mhz_edu> or, Yagisan has a simple way
<mhz_edu> Yagisan scp gand@server:/home/gand/the_file ./
<Yagisan> brb - getting a coffee. mdz_edu: your wife will kill you
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, I am already dead
<mhz_edu> :D
<gand> HI nice it work the first attempt THANKS A LOT
<mhz_edu> np
<mhz_edu> whenever it is possible... we help
<gand> now a complete tutorial on moodle is up to my server :)
<gand> just one more think
<mhz_edu> educool!
<mhz_edu> shoot
<gand> can I use scp + sudo to upload file in folder where I haven ot permission?
<mhz_edu> hmm
<gand> :)
* mhz_edu thinking
<mhz_edu> nop
<mhz_edu> 'coz scp asks for password
<gand> In deep, I'm an OSX user and when I drag a file to copy it in a "closed" folder, a window ask me autentication, I insert user/pw and copy is done
* Yagisan will be back soonish - princess is hungry
<mhz_edu> maybe, there's a setting you can do in the "receiver" so once it accepts a file, it turns the authentification into sudo process
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, LOL
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, hurry, please I have a question
<mhz_edu> :)
<mhz_edu> gand, but I doubt it is possible
<gand> on gnome/Edubuntu as GDM  run as admin user and not as root I've tu use terminal to copy and remove file from root folder
<gand> I wonder if there is a way to cp/rm file from "root owned folder" via gnome
<mhz_edu> yes
<gand> how? :)
<mhz_edu> ina terminal, run $ sudo passwd
<mhz_edu> enter user password
<mhz_edu> and then create root passwprd
<mhz_edu> once created, do: $ su -
<mhz_edu> login as root
<gand> you mean logout from gdm admin and login on gdm as admin?
<mhz_edu> and from the terminal, do for exapmle: $ galeon
<mhz_edu> nop
<mhz_edu> all in same terminal window
<mhz_edu> do it asn u'll see
<gand> well in this way root is enabled, ok
<mhz_edu> basically, you'll call GUI programs from root, and hence, all is permission open
<mhz_edu> did you understand? if not ask me again, no problem
<gand> I understand, with $ su - gdm run as root?
<mhz_edu> hhhmmmm nop
<mhz_edu> $ su -
<mhz_edu> in a  terminal, you will become root. Being root, and calling programs from the terminal, those applications will have no restrictions
<mhz_edu> but if you call a program from Menu, then the applications remains restricted
<mhz_edu> would you like to go step by step?
<gand> the problem now is that I'm on my server via VNC through ssh tunnel, If I log out from my "admin" user, vnc server will close and I'll can't connect later
<mhz_edu> do not log out.
<mhz_edu> follow me..
<mhz_edu> you are "user" on ssh, right?
<gand> so I wonder if, after setting root pw, I can run Gnome to drag/drop/copy/remove "Root folder"
<mhz_edu> yes, if you follow me
<gand> yes and also I've a vnc window open and I can see my gnome screen
<mhz_edu> let's do it together
<gand> ok 
<mhz_edu> in a terminal, you are logged in as user?
<gand> yes ok I'm there
<mhz_edu> ok, type:  sudo passwd
<gand> gand@edubuntu:~$
<mhz_edu> enter gand's password
<mhz_edu> and now enter new Root password
<mhz_edu> (twice)
* Yagisan is back
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, welcome back after ffeding the princess
<mhz_edu> gand, could you set root password?
<Yagisan> agghhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
<gand> It ask me: Enter new UNIX password:
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, what?
<Yagisan> root - did I just see log in as root ????
<mhz_edu> gand, yes, enter the password you want to assign to root
<gand> not my gand pw
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, yes
<gand> new root pw ok
<mhz_edu> gand, nop. Now you are assigning root password
<Yagisan> why not just ssh + sudo su ?
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, dunno. He asks me, so i explain to him
<mhz_edu> gand, now..
<gand> Yagisan I ask mhz how can I use gnome to to drag/drop/copy/remove some "Root ownad folder"
<mhz_edu> type:  su -
* Yagisan is catching up on scrollback
<gand> mhz wait a minute
<mhz_edu> and enter the root password
<mhz_edu> gand, remember we are stillon the same terminal
<gand> ok: passwd: password updated successfully
<gand> ok root@edubuntu:~#
<mhz_edu> perfect
<mhz_edu> now, what file browser do you use in gnome?
<mhz_edu> (to copy and paste)
<Yagisan> gand, mhz_edu: please wait a sec
<mhz_edu> ok
<Yagisan> gand, mhz_edu: what gand wants to do is copy a file, then move it to a root owned directory right ?
<mhz_edu> yes, but GUI like
<Yagisan> ok
<gand> yes gui like
<Yagisan> first scp to a directory you can write too
<Yagisan> next ssh to server
<mhz_edu> and do sudo there?
<Yagisan> then sudo nautilus
<Yagisan> then move to where it should go
<Yagisan> :)
<Yagisan> gui way
<mhz_edu> can you sudo nautilus???
<Yagisan> yes
<mhz_edu> just like that?
<mhz_edu> 'sudo nautilus'
<gand> ok
<Yagisan> should do
<mhz_edu> no other command need?
<Yagisan> not that I can think of
<mhz_edu> it will open nautilus?
<Yagisan> assuming X display is forwarded - yes
<Yagisan> gand: please try it
<mhz_edu> but isn't the syntax 'sudo command something'?
<Yagisan> just sudo command works for most gui apps
<gand> an now how can "delete" root password?
<gand> $ sudo nautilus
<gand> (nautilus:17818): Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display: 
<Yagisan> gand: (nautilus:17818): Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display means we need X11 display forwarding setup
<gand> sorry How can I do that?
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, once I successfully netbooted the client and network was autodetected in the clients side, was there any chance I could have used the PCMCIA CD drive to install everything from CD instead of net??
<mhz_edu> gand, you are root now, right? can you just type nautilus?
<Yagisan> gand:   'sudo passwd -l root' will lock the rook account for you
<gand> ok I'll lock root account
<gand> later
<gand> I type nautilus as root but again (nautilus:17864): Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display:
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: slim chance - depends on the drivers and if the could autodetect it
<Yagisan> catch you later gand
<gand> ok thank
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, I have successfully install Ubuntu 'server' method. Now i would like to show off with an Edubuntu installation, so I can demo it from a laptop (the one I'll be using on presentations).
<mhz_edu> gand, hmm, it seems X11 needs to be set to allow you to do that
<Yagisan> gand: http://www.ssh.com/support/documentation/online/ssh/adminguide/32/X11_Forwarding.html
<gand> I read thank
<mhz_edu> gand, that's what you need
<mhz_edu> Yagisan forwarding gand to read on forwarding X11 :D
<gand> I hope not to re- compile SSH :)
<Yagisan> gand: this might be better http://www.cs.uwaterloo.ca/cscf/howto/ssh/ForwardX11.shtml
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, you need a Moin wiki for your site, especially if you'll have important documentation and news.
<Yagisan> gand: basically ssh -Y your_server_here
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, I understand the driver thing.
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: yes - but that is proof of concept - notice the redirect ?
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, what If I wanted to tell grub to boot from PCMCIA CD ?
<gand> I read: ssh -X <hostname>
<Yagisan> gand:  With versions 3.8 and above, you may need to use the -Y option instead of -X
<mhz_edu> gand, ssh -X gand@server
<gand> ok
<mhz_edu> gand, ssh -Y gand@server
<mhz_edu> :D
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: I don't think it can be done (yet)
<mhz_edu> just like ssh or scp :)
<gand> sorry "ssh -Y gand@edubuntu" or "ssh -Y edubuntu"
<mhz_edu> 1st
<mhz_edu> the same server you used to ssh ok
<gand> ok
<gand> so:
<gand>  1) ssh gand@myserver
<gand> 2) ssh -Y gand@edubuntu
<mhz_edu> nop
<Yagisan> 1) ssh -Y gand@myserver
<mhz_edu> just 2)
<gand> 3) sudo nautilus
<Yagisan> 2), then 3)
<mhz_edu> yes, no 1)
<mhz_edu> :D
<gand> http://pastebin.com/387869
<gand> gand is kandinsky and server is moodle.sky.mi.it
<gand> (nautilus:18057): Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display: 
<mhz_edu> boooh
<mhz_edu> then I have no clue
<Yagisan> try ssh -X instead
<mhz_edu> why not doing this rm.mv or cp via command line
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, in older PowerBooks (ppc), you may not boot any other OS different form Apple's. So , you had a bootloader. You places vmlinuz and initrd.gz onto the HD , booted and inserted a the other OS   CD.
<gand> same error with -X
<Yagisan> gand: you need to edit some ssh configuration files
<Yagisan> gand: http://www.openssh.org/faq.html#2.7
<mhz_edu> gand, for your own sanity, I reccomend you to learn MV, CP and RM  to work from the commnad line. It's faster (lot), simple, and secure
<Yagisan> gand: and if you need a file manager - 'apt-get install mc' on the server for a decent command line file manager
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, I am about falling asleep
<gand> more tools we have, better is :) thanks
<mhz_edu> Yagisan, I am about to be killed, in other words :D
<gand> just sunday 11.30 AM here
<gand> Milan Italy :)
<mhz_edu> hehehe, 06:30
<mhz_edu> am
<mhz_edu> here
<mhz_edu> mamma mia!
<Yagisan> 7:30 pm here
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: Don't die! I see a potential customer :-D
<mhz_edu> lol
<mhz_edu> so, any ideas on how to install edubuntu now that I have a thin linux box
<mhz_edu> ?
<mhz_edu> Grub + ?
<mhz_edu> Grub + initrd.gz + linux file?
<mhz_edu> and that will boot to what? a PCMCIA cd?
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: you have ppc ?
<mhz_edu> I had
<mhz_edu> I have, but needs some parts
<Yagisan> ok - what is your thin linux box ?
<mhz_edu> Fujitsu b2175
<Yagisan> I though you had edubuntu set up ?
<mhz_edu> lifebooh
<mhz_edu> lifebook
<mhz_edu> I have: Celeron 700 Mhz + 128 RAM (desktop) and Fujitsu
<mhz_edu> My wife has another laptop: Compaq M300
<Yagisan> you want to take the fujitsu to demo right ?
<mhz_edu> both laptops boot PXE
<mhz_edu> yes
<mhz_edu> I have already sheduled 9 demos
<Yagisan> so - the fujitsu should be a server ?
<mhz_edu> yes
<mhz_edu> and it has 2 ethX so far
<Yagisan> are there already pc's where you are going ?
<mhz_edu> yes, and no.
<Yagisan> ok - heres what I think you should do
<Yagisan> we should install an edubuntu server on your laptop
<Yagisan> we will adjust the dhcpd.conf for a different range
<Yagisan> eg 192.168.45.0
* mhz_edu following and agreeing
<Yagisan> we will then make several rom-o-matic bootable cd images, and bootable floppy images
<Yagisan> covering the most common net cards
<mhz_edu> ah, for the other pc's you mean?
<mhz_edu> !
<Yagisan> yes
<Yagisan> we plug you laptop in - boot it
<Yagisan> then we boot the other pc's off floppys and cd's for proof of concept
<mhz_edu> and the laptops will provide edubuntu to the other pcs! that's the idea!
<Yagisan> you get on average 15 clients on 100Mbs
<mhz_edu> my demos will/should be 3-5 clients tops
<Yagisan> how much ram does the laptop have ?
<mhz_edu> 256
<mhz_edu> and is 500 MHz "celeron" :(
<mhz_edu> but it has touchscreen!!! :D
<mhz_edu> I also have: 1 USB floppy drive and 1 PCMCIA CD drive
<Yagisan> that should be ok for 1-3 clients (depening on what you load) - can stretch to 5
<Yagisan> depending
<mhz_edu> yes, hence I am trying to test fluxbos and windowmaker
<Yagisan> I'd use icewm myself
<mhz_edu> well, we can include it :)
<Yagisan> (windows users feel more comfatable)
<Yagisan> comfortable 
<mhz_edu> the idea is to show off as much as possible. even KDe :)
<mhz_edu> but Many of the clients I'd be using are 64-128 MB ram average
<mhz_edu> 400-700 MHz
<Yagisan> sorry mhz_edu, 500MHz is not enough for KDE
<Yagisan> the server needs as much RAM as it can get
<mhz_edu> I have used it but you're rght
<Yagisan> all my clients are 64MB
<Yagisan> my server however is 1.5GB
<mhz_edu> wow!
<Yagisan> (all slots full :( )
<mhz_edu> hehehe
* mhz_edu envys you :)
* Yagisan doesn't get an upgrade for 4 years
<mhz_edu> so, you say this laptop can have edubuntu
<Yagisan> yes
<mhz_edu> booting from?
<Yagisan> boot the laptop from the hard disk
<Yagisan> it will be the server
<mhz_edu> yes
<Yagisan> we will use the demo peoples computers as clients
<mhz_edu> but how do i boot it in order to install edubuntu on it?
<mhz_edu> :D
<Yagisan> just a moment
<Yagisan> do you have a 2.5" laptop hard drive adaptor ?
<mhz_edu> nop
<mhz_edu> otherwise I would have used it 80 hours ago :D
<Yagisan> what media does the lifebook boot from
<Yagisan> ?
<mhz_edu> hd and PXE
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: just checking an idea
<mhz_edu> booting Grub to get initrd.gz and then point it to PCMCIA CD would be cool!
<mhz_edu> my internet speed is not "speedy"
<mhz_edu> so from internet it would take 6 hours
<mhz_edu> or more
<Yagisan> be back soon - dinner.
<gand> I get it sorry :
<mhz_edu> ?
<mhz_edu> sorry?
<gand> I just type sudo nautilus on terminal window locally on my server (via vnc) and my gnome now run as root
<gand> if I type sudo nautilus from psx teminal remotely from my ibook i got Gtk warning etc
<gand> psx/osx
<gand> so $ sudo nautilus I can manage root's files and folders cp/rm using gnome :)
<mhz_edu> i'm glad you worked it our
<Yagisan> back again
<Yagisan> mhz_edu: your laptop - are you sue it doesn't boot from cd ?
<Yagisan> s/sue/sure
<mhz> re
* mhz breakfast
<Yagisan> well that was traumatic, princesses nappy failed spectacularly
<Yagisan> mhz: wb
* Yagisan will have nightmares for days now
<Yagisan> lucasvo: lts.conf does work - but not all of it it seems
<Yagisan> lucasvo: I can get MODULE_01 to work - but thats about it at the moment
<lucasvo> Yagisan: what do you mean?
<Yagisan> lucasvo: I mean that I can get the option MODULE_01 to work in lts.conf, but none of the other options I've tried
<lucasvo> Yagisan: that's strange 
<lucasvo> why?
<Yagisan> no idea
<Yagisan> I'll do more testing a bit later
<Yagisan> first I want to get powerpc clients running on and amd64 server
<Yagisan> bye all
<fersfeir> hi, i try to build with jigdo an iso image, but i can't :-(
<fersfeir> --13:37:34--  http://releases.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/p/postgresql-8.0/libpq4_8.0.3-15ubuntu1_i386.deb
<fersfeir>            => `breezy-install-i386.iso.tmpdir/releases.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/p/postgresql-8.0/libpq4_8.0.3-15ubuntu1_i386.deb'
<fersfeir> Reusing existing connection to releases.ubuntu.com:80.
<fersfeir> Peticin HTTP enviada, esperando respuesta... 404 Not Found
<fersfeir> 13:37:34 ERROR 404: Not Found.
<fersfeir> know another mirrot to try?
<fersfeir> well... :'( download a complete iso.... thanks also
<mhz> arkan0x, estoy en almuerzo recien
<mhz> arkan0x, estaras mas rato?
* mhz mhz_almuerzo
<mhz_almuerzo> re
<mhz> arkan0x, ping?
<arkan0x> mhz, ! ping 
<mhz> hey, arkan0x 
<mhz> arkan0x, como esta el toshiba? tiene nombre?
#edubuntu 2005-10-15
<mhz> anyone here that may help me see WHY this DHCP local setting is not working?
<mhz> please :)
<mhz> Tengo: 1 tarro de server con 2 interfaces (eth0 y eth1) + 1 router Dlink (DI-704p) + 1 Modem VTR (
<mhz> Motorola)
<mhz> arkan0x, sorry
<arkan0x> mhz: por pv
<mhz> arkan0x, me lees el PV?
<mhz_edu> hay, alguine aca?
<mhz_edu> anyone here?
<pitux> yes
<pitux> mhz from chile?
<mhz_edu> indeed
<mhz_edu> you?
<mhz_edu> tambien?
<mhz_edu> heheh
<pitux> yes 
<pitux> i have a project call freemath.cl
<pitux> with my friends 
<mhz_edu> hahahah
<mhz_edu> Matematicas Libre?
<pitux> yeah
<pitux> soy el jose
<pitux> ciomo estay mauricio?
<mhz_edu> Maestro, como estas?
<mhz_edu> Ya llevo bastantes testeos de edubuntu
<pitux> super aca entreteniendome un poco por el chat
<pitux> me parece super
<mhz_edu> preparandonos porque queda poco tiem[po y mucho por hacer
<mhz_edu> debo presentar las cubuiertas de los cd antes del jueves
<mhz_edu> revisar la documentacion existente en ingles y afinar algunos detalles sueltos
<pitux> tu estas encargado de eso
<pitux> congratulations
<mhz_edu> eso = CD ?
<mhz_edu> eso = docs ?
<pitux> cd?
<mhz_edu> sip
<pitux> a que taquilla
<mhz_edu> Ha habido bastante discusion sobre ese tema porque no nos darian fondos para envios a paises
<pitux> buuuuu
<pitux> yo en el colegio que estoy trabajando vamos a migrar a ubuntu
<mhz_edu> Afortunadamente, Canonical nos dara algnuas lucas para imprimir CD's y hacer pequnos envios suuuuper restringidos.
<pitux> probe breezy anda muy bien
<pitux> sera no mas
<mhz_edu> pitux, Genial!!
<pitux> te voy a invitar un dia pa que vayay pa lla
<mhz_edu> CD's/ en todo caso, si puedes ayudarnos l lanzamiento de Eubuntu, me seria de muchisimo alivio
<pitux> a que te refieres?
<mhz_edu> pitux, por favor! Feliz de ir
<pitux> nosotros ahora vamos a usar breezy para el proximo ao
<pitux> edubuntu no lo he probado
<pitux> pero no se si tendria sentido porque no vamos a usar LTSP
<mhz_edu> En Chile, y por la colaboracion que he hecho, Canonical me pasara cerca de 150 CD's que deseo entregar en una serie de pqueneos y modestos eventos promocionales de demo
<mhz_edu> ahh
<pitux> las maquinas igual corren de maravillas
<mhz_edu> es casi lo mismo
<mhz_edu> exacto
<mhz_edu> en esos eventos, si pudieras ayudarno seria genial
<pitux> te planteo lo siguiente
<mhz_edu> juega
<pitux> anda a hablarnos de edubuntu
<pitux> a la U
<pitux> te consigo lugar gente etc
<mhz_edu> perfecto! Podriamos ver una fecha cercana al alanzamiento oficial :D
<pitux> lo que pasa es que se viene la semana de la facultad
<mhz_edu> Mail/ Lorna me informo que al parecer no te llegaban mis mails. Te puedo enviar el programa del evento del 18 en Palaya ancha?
<pitux> la semana de la ciencia y a mi ya me pidieron que diera una charla
<pitux> sip
<mhz_edu> charla/ y cuando te acomodaria que fuera ahabvlar de edubuntu entonces, antes?
<pitux> pero es escribeme a este
<pitux> edu.freesoftware at gmail.com
<pitux> esa misma semana
<pitux> se hablara de temas variados
<mhz_edu> tienes un temario?
<pitux> nop
<pitux> yo no lo organizo a mi solo me invitaron a exponer
<pitux> pero voy a ver al organizador el martes
<pitux> y le digo que si puede te haga un espacio
<mhz_edu> seria ideal!
<pitux> si pues
<mhz_edu> y desde cuando a cuando es la semana?
<pitux> es mas menos por ahi por el 24
<pitux> tu vas a iquique?
<mhz_edu> despues del encentro Linux, menos mal
<mhz_edu> me faltan entre 80 y 90 lucas para ir
<mhz_edu> :(
<pitux> yo no voy
<mhz_edu> booh
<pitux> es que de verdad
<pitux> no tengo mayor interes en ir
<mhz_edu> por que?
<mhz_edu> ah, claro  a mi me sirve para dar tarjetas :D
<pitux> las charlas no me llaman mucho la atencion
<mhz_edu> te entiendo
<pitux> y la unica de educacion la va a dar werner que ya la he escuchado demasiado
<mhz_edu> respecto al colegio.. cual es?
<pitux> el francisco de mirand
<mhz_edu> ?
<pitux> miranda
<mhz_edu> ?
<mhz_edu> :)
<pitux> www.franciscodemiranda.cl
<mhz_edu> oooh
<pitux> quisiera tener mas tiempo
<mhz_edu> escoba
<pitux> oye estaba pensando si voy pa valpo
<mhz_edu> yo me doy cuenta que demasiado voluntariado y pocas lucas :D
<mhz_edu> por que? tiempo
<mhz_edu> ?
<pitux> ir a las otras ues a promocionar ML
<mhz_edu> esa era la idea
<pitux> necesitamos reunir gente en ML
<mhz_edu> entonces.. ahora mismo te envio el mail de uno de los encargados.. w8
<pitux> ya pues
<mhz_edu> flash en sitios me deja la escoba si no lo instalo :(
<mhz_edu> toda la gente le da con flash
<pitux> no recibo ningun correo tuyo aun
<mhz_edu> es que se me habia pegado el firefox :(
<pitux> ok
<mhz_edu> enviado ok
<mhz_edu> este es parte del mensaje original del "copyleft" :
<mhz_edu> Por lo de incluir a mas personas no hay problemas, eso si, si vienen
<mhz_edu> de Santiago, se podria costear el pasaje solo para 5, por lo que
<mhz_edu> deben, si es posible, Faxiarme los pasajes o ver otra forma de
<mhz_edu> hacerlo, para esto espero respuesta de uds. Lo que tambien tenia
<mhz_edu> pensado era enviar un mail a educalibre para invitar a toda la
<mhz_edu> comunidad al foro debate, no se si es buena idea.
<mhz_edu> de momento vamos 3 personajes (Victor Moral, Alejandro Vera y yo)
<mhz_edu> pitux, si tu deseas ir, aprovechamos la oferta del pasaje
<mhz_edu> :)
<pitux> que dia es?
<mhz_edu> el martes 18
<pitux> vamos
<mhz_edu> Como ves, el programa se habia terminado de llebnar cuando te avise (porque no te llego mi mail, parece)
<mhz_edu> asiq ue donde si podras opinar es en el "foro".
<pitux> demas
<mhz_edu> de todos modos, durante mi charla la meos, si menciono a Matematicas Libre
<mhz_edu> ls meos = al menos
<pitux> si me gustaria ir a la catolica de valparaiso
<pitux> a hablar con los compaeros de mi carrera alla
<pitux> y contarles lo que es el software libre
<mhz_edu> Te pediria que por favor enviaras un mail al "copyleft" para informarle sobre lo que hacen.
<pitux> no te entiendo
<mhz_edu> Yo por mi lado, manana le enviare un correo informando oficialmente que iriamos 4 (3 desde Santiago)
<mhz_edu> scontarle sobre ML
<pitux> el problema es como contacto a la gente de Valpo 
<pitux> los que estudian matematica
<mhz_edu> en el forward que te envie...no aparece e?
<mhz_edu> te llego el mail?
<pitux> ok
<pitux> kdohas
<mhz_edu> BTW, entiendes de redes?
<pitux> algo
<mhz_edu> kdohash@gmail.com yes, ese
<pitux> igual dile que revise la pag
<mhz_edu> pitux, llevo mas de 16 horaas peleando con una config de DHCP local y no hay caso. Solo me funciona cuando uso el cable cruzado y no el router. entiendo que el router debe estar haciendo DHCOP por su lado, pero no logro entrar a su seteo pues esta configurado por GTD y no tengo acceso
<mhz_edu> obvio
<pitux> mmmmmmm
<pitux> escapa a mis precarios conocimientos
<mhz_edu> heheh
<mhz_edu> ok
<pitux> DHCP para mi se traduce en dhclient
<mhz_edu> a los mio tambien
<mhz_edu> :)
<pitux> y tenemos internet jejejeje
<mhz_edu> Deberia haber mas gente concetada los fines de smean
<mhz_edu> semana
<pitux> es cierto
<mhz_edu> ayer, logre bootear e instalr edubuntu desde el servidor edubuntu hacia un laptop sin CD ni floppy
<mhz_edu> con la ayuda de un Japones que vive en australia, y terminamos cerca de las 06:00 am chilena
<mhz_edu> Claro, como era un caso "especial" aun no habia doc oficial para eso
<pitux> ahhhhhhh
<pitux> yo ya no trasnocho
<pitux> antes lo hacia
<mhz_edu> Zaurus/ sabes de laguien interesado en comprar la Zaurus? Ahora la tengo con rom GPE (X y gnome) o con Opie
<pitux> ahora a mas tardar a las dos me acuesto
<pitux> cuanto?
<mhz_edu> conocidos: 165.000
<pitux> ok
<pitux> me pagaron mi primer sueldo y se me fue mi primer sueldo
<pitux> jejejeje
<pitux> asi que para otro momento
<pitux> tal vez te moleste con un laptop
<mhz_edu> yo no deseo transnochar pero como debo apurarme para cumplir con mis compromios aduiridos (sino pierdo status en esta comunidad y paso a ser un chileno mas irresponsable), debo hacerlo a veces
<mhz_edu> Laptop: en este momento, tengo un Fujitsu, 10.4 pulgadas, 500 Mhz celeron, 256 Ram
<mhz_edu> y touchscreen
<pitux> ya pero mas menos que precio estan teniendo?
<pitux> necesito algo super liviano
<pitux> pa la mochila
<mhz_edu> ese celeron, cerca  de $360.000 y pesa aprox. 1.35 kgs
<mhz_edu> de hecho estoy pensando seriamente en dejarmelo
<mhz_edu> :D
<mhz_edu> pero no deberia
<pitux> jaja
<pitux> yo creo que pal proximo a~no recien me hago de uno
<mhz_edu> np
<mhz_edu> podrias esperar a los del MIT
<pitux> jajaja
<mhz_edu> Finalmente, creo que vienen con ROM
<pitux> es cierto
<mhz_edu> y no HD
<mhz_edu> asi se entienden muchas cosas :)
<mhz_edu> ya me habia sustado
<mhz_edu> yo lo mas barato que podria conseguir, comprando 600 unidades minimo, es U$250
<mhz_edu> pero con casi 1 GHz, 256 Ram, 10 GB, 10.4 pulgadas
<mhz_edu> sin calcular costo de internacion, eso si :(
<pitux> oye ya envie el correo a copyleft
<mhz_edu> genial
<mhz_edu> yo apenas resuelva el cachito de dhcp, lo redacto
<pitux> ok te debo trabajar
<pitux> un gusto hablar contigo
<mhz_edu> okidoki
<mhz_edu> igual pascal!
<pitux> me mandas un correo
<pitux> pa lo de valpo
<mhz_edu> si pues
<mhz_edu> saludos a los vecinillos
<mhz_edu> del ML
<pitux> ok
<jsgotangco> hi JaneW 
<JaneW> hello
<highvoltage> JaneW: hi
<JaneW> hello highvoltage 
<highvoltage> how are you, JaneW?
<JaneW> highvoltage: well thanks and you?
<JaneW> Good weekends?
<JaneW> highvoltage: been using my MP3 player :)
<highvoltage> yes, good weekend.
<highvoltage> i hit a low-point on saturday night though, danced to a britney spears song and avril lavigne.
<highvoltage> Need to get 499MB/716MB of archives.
<highvoltage> wow :)
* jsgotangco stares at highvoltage 
* highvoltage looks back nervously at jsgotangco 
<highvoltage> hi jsgotangco 
<JaneW> highvoltage: aarrgh!
<JaneW> I hope alcohol is to blame ;)
<highvoltage> yes. and the dj was playing good songs before that.
<highvoltage> at least i didn't work this weekend. it's the first weekend this year that i haven't worked. and not the slightest feeling of guilt, very liberating.
<JaneW> highvoltage: good for you!
<highvoltage> :)
<jsgotangco> JaneW, i finally nailed a nice job
<JaneW> jsgotangco: !!!!!
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: congratulations
<JaneW> really?
<JaneW> jsgotangco: awesome news congrats :)))
<jsgotangco> JaneW, i'll be working in Brisbane for quite a while
<JaneW> Oz!?
<jsgotangco> yes
<JaneW> contracting or moving there
<JaneW> with family?
<jsgotangco> oh no not yet
<jsgotangco> i'll be working with an Oz-based mobile content provider
<JaneW> jsgotangco: so you'll need to go without them ? :/
<JaneW> cool, sounds interesting
<jsgotangco> yes
<jsgotangco> the company's name is Gametel
<jsgotangco> i'll be one of the pioneer team members in the aspac region
<jsgotangco> its carrier grade RHEL at work
<JaneW> must be  a relief to have found something
<jsgotangco> its quite exciting
<jsgotangco> carrier grade is something really different
<JaneW> oic
<jsgotangco> they have different terms really
<jsgotangco> MVNO, MVOs stuff like that
<jsgotangco> its a telco thing
* JaneW has no idea what any of that means ;)
<JaneW> I know mvo ;)
<JaneW> Michael Vogt :P
<jsgotangco> JaneW, think mobile ringtones and games
<JaneW> ok, fun
<hno73> highvoltage: thanks for your screenshot. I see there are a few more things I need to tweak.
<hno73> highvoltage: Do you want to set up the static pages to match or shall I?
<jsgotangco> hey hno73 
<hno73> jsgotangco: Hey!  I see you've joined the Accessibility team too. cool :)
<jsgotangco> hno73, yep interested on it really
<hno73> I'll be writing some more specs on that shortly
<jsgotangco> nice count me in
<jsgotangco> i'd love to help out on that area
<hno73> It should tie in with edubuntu in various ways too
<jsgotangco> yes
<jsgotangco> i have particular interest with the blind
<hno73> OK, we'll start making some plans soon
* jsgotangco his brother is blind when he was born
<hno73> That's probably where we'll put in the most effort too, because it's a big challenge
<jsgotangco> but that didn't stop him from being a bigshot ebay seller
<hno73> oh, right
<hno73> :)
<jsgotangco> he's earning more than me really heh
<hno73> well, opportunities are always better to focus on than limitations
<highvoltage> hno73: if you have the time, i'd be very grateful
<hno73> I wonder if we should set up our own mailing list for AT
<hno73> highvoltage: OK, that allows me to be dictatorial about it :)
<hno73> highvoltage: can you send me the page contents?
<hno73> I guess there is some text, etc. to go on those pages
<hno73> and how is the server side going?
<jsgotangco> hno73, i guess when you have the specs out and we have a concrete plan of action
<hno73> jsgotangco: yep, after breezy release we can regroup and brainstorm 
<highvoltage> hno73: you mean the text on this page? http://www.ossn.co.za/edubuntu/4/
<hno73> highvoltage: the download and community pages. Do I just scrape the wiki?
<mhz> hey
<mhz> hno73, ping
<hno73> mhz, pong
<mhz> morning
<mhz> I have another observation about the theme
<hno73> morning. you're up early :)
<hno73> ok
<mhz> yes, Yesterday at 23:40 or so, there was a powercut. I decided to finish my pending issues to be solved no matter what, before 09:00 AM today. Power was restored a couple of hours ago.
<mhz> it is 06:35 now
<hno73> :)
<hno73> so, what did you notice about the theme?
<mhz> theme/ the font for {{{this code}}} is to small
<hno73> OK, do you have suggestions for what it should be?
<mhz> and == Headings == (afaik, those belong to h3) don't seem to be headings
<hno73> what do you mean, not headings?
<mhz> well, yes and nop. I have not touched a moin theme in the last 3-4 months. However, I do rememeber it is a simple opyion (it took me a couple of hours to identify which lines was).
<hno73> mhz, I have a question for you too. Look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyntaxReference
<mhz> Once I solve my DHCP issue and can boot the laptop into Edubuntu installation (from HD), I promise I can dive into my old themes (I commented every line)
<hno73> why do the interwiki icons point to the ubuntu theme, and not edubuntu?
<hno73> where is that path set, I cant find it ...
<hno73> ok, I could try #moin too if I get stuck
<mhz> hehehe, it feels good I was not the only one diggin in the theme codes :D
<mhz> let me see
<hno73> mhz, what do you mean by h3 not being headers? that they should have an underline?
<highvoltage> hno73: sorry, was away. yes, I think we should link to the wiki as much as possible.
<hno73> OK, that's easy then. thanks.
<hno73> Is there progress on the server, or shall I just set one up?
<mhz_edu> re
<mhz_edu> hno73, sorry. IAs I said, i need to solve this stupid issues asap. :D
* mhz_edu lokking SyntaxReference
<mhz_edu> hno73, regarding the H3 headings (which correspond to == heading == in moin), see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Installation/FromKnoppix and you'll understand what I mean
<hno73> um, that page has no ==, just === which is h4
<hno73> So that's a fault of whoever wrote the page I think.
<mhz_edu> hno73, got it! Smileys on this page are actually a Macro, according to what Raw Text shows: = Smileys =
<mhz_edu> [[ShowSmileys] ] 
<mhz_edu> hno73, right. === , sorry.
<mhz_edu> Are  Hx bold ?
<mhz_edu> Smileys/ I had no idea there was a macro for that
<hno73> No, only the page title, h1
<mhz_edu> Hx/ ah, why?
<hno73> why not bold?
<mhz_edu> Smileys/ let me dig a little more ..
<mhz_edu> yes
<hno73> I think it looks good non-bold :) It also has an underline
<mhz_edu> Smileys/ hmmm, my python is still terrible (shame on me) but here's the code if you can get it. http://moinmoin.wikiwikiweb.de/macro/ShowSmileys.py
<mhz_edu> imho, the macro gets the icons from "somewhere" else, not from "your icons" location
<mhz_edu> OR the soluction could be to write that table "manually". I am sure icons will be yours then
<hno73> hm, I don't see the path hard coded anywhere
<mhz_edu> me neither, hence I said "my python is terrible" :D
* mhz_edu thinks he wrote that same table before. he's looking
<hno73> It's strange. Other pages seem to use the correct globe icon for links
<hno73> SyntaxReference uses the old ubuntu one while FromKnoppix uses the nice new gartoon one 
<mhz_edu> yes, hence I am 99% sure the macro gets icosn from somewhere else UNLESS they're cahced which I think it's illogical
<mhz_edu> cahced = cahced
<mhz_edu> cahced = cached :D
<mhz_edu> BTW, this is the theme for Tecnocimiento (i started it a few weeks ago (just coloring  so far, not "code") http://www.tecnocimiento.cl/SyntaxReference
<hno73> ah, that's cool
<hno73> Perhaps SyntaxRef gets cached because it's a macro
<hno73> that's silly
<mhz_edu> nha, too simple yet. I hope I can have time to get into code soon
<hno73> it actually has this link in the code <a href="http://moinmoin.wikiwikiweb.de/"><img src="/htdocs/ubuntu/img/u-www.png" 
<mhz_edu> exactly, that's my point
<hno73> pointing to the wrong png
<hno73> grrr
<mhz_edu> LOL
<mhz_edu> see? we were right
<hno73> I'll have to ask admins to flush the cache at some point
* mhz_edu is happy he finally helped Henrik!!
<hno73> heh
<hno73> Your testing has been very helpful too
<mhz_edu> your welcome
* mhz_edu loves to beta test stuff
<hno73> I'll upload an improved version later, but now I have to do the static page stuff
<mhz_edu> Headings/ then why H3 is not underlined? 
<mhz_edu> i agree
<hno73> I've fixed that now
<mhz_edu> oh, educool
<hno73> a 1px underline
<mhz_edu> better! more in accordance with Hx of thet theme
<mhz_edu> H3 were kind of orphan
<mhz_edu> hno73, Theme general/ what if H1 and H2 were a little less "on your face". Perhaps a little lighter black or "brownish".
<mhz_edu> BTW, will these theme be released under GPL? will it be released on the "moinmoin hall of fame" themes
<hno73> mhz_edu: I'm making them a bit smaller, but I think we will stay away from brown. crisp clean colours for edubuntu
<mhz_edu> ogra, I could successfully netboot and install a "server" option from Edubuntu box to the Fujistlu laptop :D
<hno73> GPL, yes. where should Upload them? I might just make versions without logos first
<mhz_edu> ogra, now, I wanted to install the whole edubuntu package, what should I do?
<hno73> versions with the MM logo would be cool
<mhz_edu> yeah!
<mhz_edu> ThemeMarket should be the place
<hno73> OK, I'll upload both themes soonish
<mhz_edu> hno73, so these theme will not be subject of : "no, you can't modify the theme fonts, lines, colors,etc. Not even turn them around..." stanzas
<mhz_edu> okidoki
<hno73> we should make a high visibility theme too
<hno73> mhz_edu: what do you mean?
<mhz_edu> Oh yes! That's important and thoughtful. Ping me if you need anything else I can help you with.
<mhz_edu> basically, everything regarding edubuntu logo it has some weired understandable but not fully accepted restrictions
<hno73> right, yeah, so we would just remove that and people can do what they want with the theme
<mhz_edu> like you can't turn the logo around, you can't give it a twist, etc
<mhz_edu> exactly :D
<mhz_edu> especially, "people" like mhz :D
<mhz_edu> Instead with the Debian logo, I rememebr I could make it look whatever I felt like
<hno73> hm, ok
<mhz_edu> well, ping me if I can help
<hno73> thanks
* hno73 goes into design mode now to sort out the static pages ...
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> lol
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> jsgotangco, hi there
<jsgotangco> hi
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> jsgotangco, are you also part of ubuntu doc?
<jsgotangco> yes i manage some stuff over there
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> more specifically.. are you part of Wiki ubuntu doc team?
<jsgotangco> no not really
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> oh
<jsgotangco> i clean up wikis whenever i can
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> who can I talk to about it?
<jsgotangco> i mostly focus on the docbook svn
<jsgotangco> mhz_fightin_dhcp, what about?
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> I have noticed docs there are not taking advante of moin potential on "auto organizing", basically.
<jsgotangco> hmmmm
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> advante = advantage
<jsgotangco> you might want to post a comment on that on the ubuntu-doc list
<jsgotangco> im sure robitaille and mdke can pick it up
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> ok, thanks
<jsgotangco> and the moment the ubuntu wiki is being hammered by the italian team
<jsgotangco> heh
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> jsgotangco, and regarding the current edubuntu docs, the only thing I think I can be useful about is translating and editing wiki syntax so docs get more wiki like features.
<jsgotangco> mhz_fightin_dhcp, sure do whatever you can, i'll pick it up soonish (tommorow) i have to finish some more stuff before the release not sure really if edubuntu will get released the same day ogra?
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> but my english is not that powerful as to edit, and my technical knowledge is already covered on the current pages, exept for a couple of how tos I could wiki soon
<ogra> jsgotangco, it has to...
<ogra> jsgotangco, at lest we cant do changes after the archives are locked down... why wait after that...
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> .oO(wise)
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> ogra, once I was successfully installing from netboot onto the client, was there any chance I could specify apt to load PCMCIA cd drive instead of the 2-3 hours from repositories?
<ogra> mhz_fightin_dhcp, dunno... i'm not the installer guy... but i guess you need to have the drivers loaded... probably in expert mode...
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> ok, thx
<ogra> mhz_fightin_dhcp, perobably Kamion knows, but he's even more busy than me 3 days before release
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> ok, I understand
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> ogra, I think these are maybe the last 2 questions before I go out to install edubuntu on a real server (I have the 1st official demo tomorrow for the Tecnocimiento gang): does DHCP only and only depend on /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf ? If so, if DHCP is not working properly, the only config file related to dhcp (not ~/interfaces) is that under /ltsp/?       And 2nd: After creating ~./xsession to exec fluxbox (example) How can I make L
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> DM actually load that instead fo resource consuming GNOME? 
<ogra> it should use it automatically
<ogra> ldm only starts /etc/X11/Xsession from the server...
<ogra> this is a script that should pick up your ~/.xsession or ~/.Xsession
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> ah, perfect, then dhcp/ may be hardware or network config only (relief) and x/ should be easy then.
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> thank you very much!
* mhz_fightin_dhcp gives a cheer from Chile to Oliver!
<ogra> if you didnt touch the /etc/dhcpd.conf file, it should just work...
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> yes
<ogra> so any error you can introduce must be in /etc/ltsp
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> by concer was that if I did touch /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf but then I reversed it to default, /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf should then work
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> by =my 
<ogra> if its exactly the same after you reversed, then yes
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> becasue dhcp under /ltsp is 'authoritative' and then rules over /dhcp3
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> (at least, based on what /init/dhcp explains
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> :)
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> no problem.
<mhz_fightin_dhcp> thx again. (as usual)
<ogra> hno73, around ? 
<ogra> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ThinClientHowto looks a bit like a road construction with the edubuntu css... can we make the dashed border a bit thinner around code blocks ? 
<mhz_vs_ldm> ogra, any installation made with last friday's iso will work ok with release apt-get dist-upgrade?
<mhz_vs_ldm> or we'd better re-install that day?
<ogra> nope... just upgrade
<mhz_vs_ldm> oh! excellent
<hno73> ogra: yep, try now
<hno73> ogra, fixed
<ogra> thanks :)
<mhz_breakfast> re
<mhz> hehehe
<mhz> I am on the Fujitsu, with Edward Ubuntu fully installed!
<ogra> yay
<mhz> hmm, gompris crashes after some time
<mhz> :(
<ogra> do yo have the matching -sounds package installed ? 
<ogra> note that only -en is installed by default currently... i'm just changing it 
<ogra> confusingly the -sounds packages do not only include sounds
<mhz> lol
<mhz> i have not installed anything extra yet, because I am testing default install first
<mhz> but sure I will
<mhz> did the guys from #ltsp found why ldm ignores .xsession
<mhz> ?
<mhz> .oO(it feels good to have 2 edubuntu servers running locally, esp. when one is a laptop)
<mhz> I just need to solve my dhcp issue with the router in between (i know I am using it as switch whereas it should be used as router, instead)
<mhz> bienvenido pitux 
<pitux> hi
<pitux> trasnochaste?
<mhz> pitux: edubuntu is running smoothly on this laptop, as well
<mhz> yeah, pero se corto la luz aca, cerca de las 23:45 y volvio a las 02:40 aprox. So I got ack to business at 06:00
<pitux> ok
<mhz> ack = back
<pitux> thanks. for helpme to practice my basd english
<pitux> bad, sorry
<mhz> no problem
<mhz> lo bueno es que me entiendes y eso es un gran avance
<pitux> yeah jejeje
<mhz> I already sent the email to Valpo. Espero recibir noticias hoy o manana confirmando tu "reembolso" (if you need it)
<mhz> de todos modos, confio en iras, cierto?
<pitux> yes i look the mail
* mhz had forgotten today is holiday here :(
<pitux> jaja 
<pitux> your mind is lost
<mhz> JaneW: pitux is from Universidad de Santiago and he's leading a FLOSS project called Matematicas Libre. I may be giving a talk about Edubuntu there, pretty soon.
<pitux> who is JaneW??
<mhz>  JaneW es la lider a cargo del proyecto Edubuntu
<pitux> oh cool
<mhz> y ogra el encargado de hacer la fusion Ubuntu-Edward Ubuntu :D
<mhz> y hno73, se esta encargando del CSS theme de MoinMoin para edubuntu
<mhz> (que esta quedando re-"gueno")
<pitux> congratulations
<mhz> those names, among other more people also contributing as much as possible
* mhz doing the dishes :(
<mhz> esos son uno de los "contras" cuando es feriado en Chile :( La senora manda!
<pitux> my difficulty is the language
<mhz> pitux: but we'll have our chilean community, of course!
<mhz> and you're more than welcome to help us all
<pitux> i am crazy translating in google
<mhz> lol!!!
<mhz> pitux: solo espera que podamos hacer lanzamiento oficial de edubuntu y nos pondremos con #edubuntu-cl o -es Ya veremos :)
<pitux> ok
<pitux> por ahora estoy ayudando en #ubuntu-es
<pitux> ahi hay una comunidad entrete+
<mhz> eso ya es algo muy bueno
<mhz> hehehe, si
<mhz> A mi me preocupa mas que en Chile, aun seamos muy pocos ayudando internacionalmente (no me refiero solo en ingles)
<mhz> por eso que otra de las cosas que me ha quitado mucho tiempo es la organizacion base del instituto de tecnologia libre
<mhz> pa' que de una vez podamos tener prescencia internacional
<mhz> :D
<pitux> yo ahora quiero hacer un curso de administracion de sistemas
<mhz> donde?
<mhz> dictarlo o asistir?
<pitux> eso es lo que quiero ver, necesito codigo sence para que en el colegio no me pinten monos
<mhz> hehehe, si deseas y puedes esperarte hasta diciembre, Tecnocimiento te lo podria dar
<JaneW> mhz: awesome
<JaneW> ola
<mhz> hola
<pitux> ok
<mhz> or aloha
<pitux> hi
<pitux> y quien dictaria el curso
<mhz> pitux: pero if you can't wait, then I can suggest some institutions
<JaneW> cundo este canal lleg a ser espaol?
<mhz> Victor Moral, Alejandro Vera, y un par de personas mas (entre programadores y administradores)
<pitux> ok
<pitux> esperare
<mhz> JaneW: ehehe, considering that everyone was silent, we decided it was cool :)
<pitux> yeah
<pitux> all are sleeping
<mhz> pitux: you'll meet Victor and Alejandro in Valpo.
<pitux> ok
<pitux> lo que quiero hacer en ese colegio 
<pitux> es migrarlos enteros
<pitux> es decir solo tienen computadores
<mhz> JaneW: we hope once edubuntu gets released, an we fix some minor bugs, we can start a chilean channel :)
<mhz> pitux: and ubuntu or edubuntu?
<pitux> y quiero que el colegio sea un ejemplo de como hacer las cosas bine
<pitux> bien
<JaneW> mhz: cool!
<pitux> lo estoy analizando
<mhz> pitux: en colombia there's a school "gimnasio ..." something. Son 100% Software Libre
<JaneW> mhz: litterally and figuaratively , lol
<mhz> hehehe
<mhz> yesp
<pitux> como te dije las maquinas son relativamente nuevas
<pitux> asi que no se que sentido tendria instalar clientes ligeros
<mhz> y por eso no desean usar LTSP? or is something else?
<mhz> LTSP is also good to minimize administration tasks and risks
<mhz> LTSP te ayuda a simplificar y centralizar tareas, tambien
<mhz> de otro modo, el Admin may get crazy
<mhz> :)
<mhz> obviamente, es tu decision
<pitux> por eso 
<pitux> te invito al colegio
<mhz> si deseas, te podriamos ayudar con el analisis de costo/beneficio y ademas test edubuntu v/s ubuntu solution
<pitux> revisamos
<pitux> y podemos conversar con el rector el asunto de las capacitaciones
<mhz> perfecto.
<pitux> seriamos dos personas las que iriamos
<pitux> a capacitarnos
<mhz> genial!
<mhz> educool!
<mhz> pitux: debo lavar la loza antes de que me sigan alegando :D
<pitux> nos vemos
<pitux> saludos
<pitux> yo tambien debo trabajar
<mhz_doing_dishes> pitux: y gracias por venir al #edubuntu
<mhz_doing_dishes> see ya
<pitux> ;D
<jelkner> ogra: oliver, you here?
<jelkner> anyone here who can answer an installation question?
<ogra> jelkner, yes, i'm here
<jelkner> hi oliver, i'm in the middle (actually early) of an edubuntu install
<jelkner> and i've already encountered a problem i haven't seen before
<jelkner> i'm using today's daily build
<jelkner> i just got to the network configuration screen
<jelkner> i selected eth0
<jelkner> and i see:
<jelkner> The answer to this question has been preseeded
<ogra> yes, known bug, fixed in tomorrows build already
<jelkner> (netcfg/get_ipaddress). If you see this template, you've found a bug
<jelkner> in the installer; please file a report.
<jelkner> ok, another quesiton
<ogra> there is a bug in the installer, it throws this error if you provide a default setting... we ripped out the default ip 
<jelkner> we will not be able to use 192.168.0.x on the client side
<jelkner> 192.168.0.x is already used on the LAN
<ogra> thats ok with the fixed installer...
<jelkner> cool!
<ogra> just use something else and edit /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf to match the network settings....
<jelkner> so i can select 192.168.1.254 as the server address and dhcp will be right?
<ogra> (dont edit /etc/dhcpd.conf !)
<jelkner> ok
<ogra> nope, manual editing of the abpve file is required
<ogra> mdz didnt accept my patch to autogenerate this file
<jelkner> eventually, that will happen automagically, yes? ala K12-LTSP
<ogra> yes
<ogra> any i plan a gui to edit it afterwards too... for dapper
<jelkner> very good
<ogra> we can talk about needed features at UBZ :)
<jelkner> one of the things i hope we can discuss in montreal is the release cycle for edubuntu
<jelkner> we really need a once a year release
<ogra> nope, we cant 
<ogra> we are bound totally to ubuntu... 
<jelkner> i have a proposal
<jelkner> which i hope will satisfy everybody
<ogra> but why not take every second 6 month release
<jelkner> yes, that's what i'm hoping
<ogra> so you got your 1 year release
<jelkner> only we release a few months after dapper
<ogra> but i still have to develop inside ubuntu
<jelkner> so that we have time to fix edubuntu specific things
<ogra> thats not possible
<jelkner> and not change ubuntu, just build on it
<jelkner> why?
<jelkner> it is too rushed now
<ogra> because we have no access to the build infrastructure after the release was made
<ogra> it will be better next release
<jelkner> if we had a fixed platform to build on, we could get the education specific things properly tested before they are released
<jelkner> things like the ap csc meta package i'm hoping for
<ogra> note that this time we started 2 months late and for one month there was no working base to build on
<jelkner> ok, enough of that
<jelkner> but i'm still going to raise it
<jelkner> remember, i'm a volunteer, i can do these things ;-)
<ogra> we simply cant move away from the ubuntu cycle, and i really wouldnt like to
<ogra> imagine this cycle with 3 months more development time... thats nearly the amount i lost...
<ogra> we have a good base now, tomorrows daily should be near the final...
<jelkner> ok, let's just see how it goes
<jelkner> if we can have a really good platform ready by dapper...
<ogra> sure... 
<jelkner> on saturday i got to look at an ltsp based solution aimed at libraries
<jelkner> userful.com
<ogra> it cant degrade from what we have now and the feedback i had so far was quite positive
<jelkner> ???
<ogra> yes, they are proprietary, i know them
<jelkner> but they have what our librarian is asking for
<ogra> multiseat systems ? 
<ogra> ubuntu has this too
<jelkner> local devices
<ogra> err, multiseat systems hve no local devices afaik
<jelkner> oliver, i've just met someone here who is eager to talk edubuntu stuff
<ogra> or do they offer ltsp based solutions ? 
<jelkner> yes
<ogra> ah
<jelkner> that's what they do
<ogra> note that local devices was never a target for this release
<jelkner> it is fedora based it think
<jelkner> i know, i'm not complaining
<jelkner> edubuntu rocks!
<ogra> thanks :=)
<jelkner> i'm just telling you what we need before it is fully ready
<jelkner> local devices are going to be important
<jelkner> as it is now, users can't save data
<ogra> yes, and a right sound implementation
<jelkner> that's a show stopper for our library installation
<jelkner> indeed!
<ogra> that two and a good ldap based user management are my main targets for dapper
<jelkner> ok, i've gotta run
<ogra> bye, thanks for the feedback :)
<jelkner> thank you!
<mhz_edu> arkanox_, recuerda: SL-5500, con GPE o Opie + 2 cunas USB + 2 protectores + 1 funda ---> $165.000
<mhz_edu> arkanox_, para geeks, recuerda: SL-5500, con GPE o Opie + 1 cargador normal + 1 cargador viajero +  2 cunas USB + 2 protectores + 1 funda ---> $165.000
#edubuntu 2005-10-16
<p> hi all!
<p> im looking for MHZ, someoene have seen him?
<crimsun> his client pinged out 1h 48m ago
<p> o thxs
<p> someone have the edubuntu logo on svg, or another vectorial format?
<mhz_edu> re
* mhz_edu had another powercut! bummer!
<p> hi edu!
<p> hola mhx
<p> mhz, sorry
<p> soy Pablo
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, hi
<jsgotangco> hi
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, we should write a book about IT solutions for Educational environments
<jsgotangco> sounds fun
<jsgotangco> you work in an educ institution right?
<mhz_edu> IT Solutions = FLOSS solutions, of course
* jsgotangco haven't been involved with education at all, just interested
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, kind of. I work on a couple of projects aimed to aid educational processes by using ITC
<jsgotangco> i can do some readings on a local setting
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, does not matter.
<mhz_edu> hehe, that is cool
<jsgotangco> but i'll be moving to a new job soonish so i might be busy for a while after the release
<jsgotangco> but i'll still be online
<mhz_edu> I think there are plenty of things to write about based on Edubuntu experiences since released
<mhz_edu> where to?
<jsgotangco> oh i'll be staying for a while in brisbane
<mhz_edu> brisbane?
<jsgotangco> australia
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, any special reason why http://www.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/EdubuntuCookbook has kept /chapters format instead of /ChapterFormat ?
<jsgotangco> errr because i made it so? I just did it and didn't consider CamelCase you want to edit it?
<mhz_edu> 5 years ago I wanted to leave for Australia with my wife. My wife got pregnant and we changed our plans.
<jsgotangco> australia is beautiful
<mhz_edu> may I?
<jsgotangco> mhz_edu, feel free
<mhz_edu> I feel free but we're talking about potential official docs
<jsgotangco> mhz_edu, we're the official edubuntu doc team atm
<jsgotangco> heh
<mhz_edu> and I dont want you to revert changes afterwards
<mhz_edu> :)
<jsgotangco> no i won't revert those i promise
<mhz_edu> lol
<mhz_edu> basically, will that affect your Moin2DocBook parser?
<jsgotangco> well i can fix it again if something gets borked im sure there's not much changes, you're the MoinMaster, I'll ask your expertise when something borks
<jsgotangco> =)
<mhz_edu> australia/ a few night ago, the news said australia was opening their doors to Chilean people who wanted to work there (all positions and jobs), and the rate to get a job for inmigrants was about 20-40 days after arriving, if you had the language.
<mhz_edu> australia/ is that so?
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, lol
<mhz_edu> thanks for the MoinMaster.. never thought that way. I am just a face in the crowd
<jsgotangco> mhz_edu, australia is a big place
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, docing/ so, exactly what kind of documentation do you need? Howtos based on Edubuntu? Edubuntu case of studies? Edubuntu T.O.C ? Edward Ubuntu, the pioneer of education based on Linux system?
<mhz_edu> or is it editing the "cookbook"?
<jsgotangco> mhz_edu, well the Cookbook is basically a manual for setting up Edubuntu
<mhz_edu> yes
<jsgotangco> it should have troubleshooting notes, etc.
<jsgotangco> highvoltage is the one writing the troubleshooting notes
<mhz_edu> eeek, hard work!
<mhz_edu> no wonder he chose that nick
<mhz_edu> :)
<jsgotangco> the aim of the cookbook is to have people with no prior linux experience setup an Edubuntu learning environment
<mhz_edu> I see. so the main work should be focused on the cookbook editing
<jsgotangco> well ideally we'd love to do that, but it doesn't stop us from using content made by other people as long as it has the proper license
<mhz_edu> and the goal is? (date-time-pages??)
<jsgotangco> if people already wrote it, why should we re-write it? let's use the community when they are willing to help out
<mhz_edu> LOL
<jsgotangco> our job would be collecting and massaging that info
<mhz_edu> and then we write a book based on those contents but we get the moeny! :D
<jsgotangco> lol
<jsgotangco> no
<jsgotangco> depends on the license really
<jsgotangco> if we make a book from scratch we have to do it separately
<mhz_edu> okidoki
<mhz_edu> roger that
<mhz_edu> BTW,
<mhz_edu> I managed to boot Edubuntu CD from HD, as I have this thin laptop with PCMCIA Cd drive.
<mhz_edu> The thing is that to my surprise... it did not install edubuntu LTSP stuff!!
<mhz_edu> even after it showed aptitude configuring all the stuff
<mhz_edu> and the famous 50% of LTSP installing
<mhz_edu> However, I do have a full /opt tree but no /etc/ltsp
<jsgotangco> hmmm
<jsgotangco> strange
<mhz_edu> indeed.
<mhz_edu> I even have the games and all
* mhz_edu editing stuff on ubuntu and adding a how to.
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, when will the /data dirs of the ubuntu wikis be merged?
<jsgotangco> hmm i have no idea really
<jsgotangco> henrik has a better idea on that i guess
<jsgotangco> you were talking to him yesterday right?
<jsgotangco> im just going to fix something first
<jsgotangco> brb
* mhz_edu heading the envelope
<JaneW> morning
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: have i sent you version 2 yet?
<highvoltage> mhz_zzZZ: the nick actually came from a linkin park song of the same name ;) - which basically describes me :)
<highvoltage> JaneW: morning!
<JaneW> hello highvoltage 
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: nope
<jsgotangco> JaneW, ping?
<JaneW> jsgotangco: pong
<jsgotangco> i've updated BreezyReleaseNotes and requires proofreading..please look on it when you're free
<JaneW> jsgotangco: will do so in the next 10 mins (thanks)
<JaneW> jsgotangco: to confirm you are talking about https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BreezyReleaseNotes
<JaneW> not EdubuntuReleaseNOtes?
<jsgotangco> ahhh
<jsgotangco> i still haven't received a reply from your email on that =)
<JaneW> jsgotangco: first point 'And every other software you can imagine available' would rather say something like *any* other
<JaneW> jsgotangco: "configuration of Ubuntu 5.10 before reporting bugs" change to: Ubuntu 5.10, and before reporting bugs...
<JaneW> jsgotangco: "Ubuntu is released regulary" spelling/typo of regularly
<jsgotangco> JaneW, can you edit it?
<JaneW> just relised that, sorry being thick!
<JaneW> will do
<JaneW> (although I SUCK at proof reading in the editor window)
<jsgotangco> sorry im a bit tired at the moment i've been digging through that document for a few hours already
<jsgotangco> i'd just love to parse it later
<jsgotangco> heh
<jsgotangco> and chnage the other stuff to edubuntu
<JaneW> doing it, it;s not bad in the editor - no tables YAY! ;)
* ajmitch_ should have made those edits earlier
<highvoltage> JaneW: any feedback from anyone that side on the DNS/apache setup?
<JaneW> no :(
<highvoltage> JaneW: I haven't received feedback from RT or elmo yet.
* JaneW checks again
<JaneW> I take it it wasn't done on friday then?
<JaneW> they are both marked as away atm...
<JaneW> jsgotangco: want your Known issue removed since RC is out and it says to remove before release??
<JaneW> the LVM issue...
<jsgotangco> JaneW, there should be some but devels haven't updated it at all, maybe you can use your whip?
<JaneW> jsgotangco: The Ubuntu 5.10 installer will run and follow the on-screen instructions to start the installation.
<JaneW> do you mean: The Ubuntu 5.10 installer will run. Follow the on-screen instructions to start the installation.
<JaneW> ?
<jsgotangco> ohhhh
<JaneW> must I change it
<jsgotangco> yes please
<JaneW> the first way implies that the installer will follow the instructions automatically?
* jsgotangco brain freeze
<JaneW> np
<jsgotangco> no
<jsgotangco> the installer will run upon pressing enter
<jsgotangco> and the user should follow the on-screen instructions
<JaneW> ok
<JaneW> jsgotangco: what's the funny character here? Table 1 Recommended Minimum Requirements
<JaneW> can I remove it?
<jsgotangco> funny?
<jsgotangco> ahh
<jsgotangco> Table 1 was an artifact from the original docbook source
<JaneW> done
<JaneW> ogra: ping
<highvoltage> wow. seems like there's lots of interest on the k12-ltsp list for an ubuntu with ltsp.
<JaneW> highvoltage: link please
<JaneW> jsgotangco: ok hopefully that's all
<highvoltage> JaneW: link to the list: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/k12osn
<JaneW> ta
<highvoltage> JaneW: you can browse the archives there too (although it's a bit sucky): https://www.redhat.com/archives/k12osn/2005-October/thread.html
<jsgotangco> JaneW, thanks, maybe you can crack the whip on devs to actually look into the document and add "known issues" and whatever needs to be done we're just 2 days from release we really need this
<JaneW> jsgotangco: I tired earlier, didn't get a response will try again now...
<jsgotangco> if we don't get known issues, we'll delete the part and have them suffer bugzilla
<JaneW> nod
<JaneW> please tell me about Moodle?
<JaneW> the latest is that it is NOT part of Edubuntu default install
<jsgotangco> once upon a time there was a moodle...
<jsgotangco> eh?
<JaneW> but can be downloaded from universe right?
<jsgotangco> JaneW, that's why we need those stuff from the email...
<ajmitch_> JaneW: yes :(
<jsgotangco> if its in universe, it shouldn't be in any of our notes
<ajmitch_> entirely my fault
<JaneW> I am trying to answer an e-mail...
<JaneW> ajmitch_: ?
<ajmitch_> JaneW: since I volunteered to try & get moodle's packaging rewritten to try & get it qualified for main
<JaneW>  Moodle  MainInclusionReportMoodle   Needs work (wwwconfig-common)
<ajmitch_> yeah
<JaneW> oic, pity
<ajmitch_> I was trying to remove the wwwconfig-common dependency
<jsgotangco> at least we have schooltool (do we?)
<ajmitch_> database creation & user creation
<ajmitch_> yes, schooltool is in
<ajmitch_> JaneW: I fear that I will owe ogra a few beers for moodle
<JaneW> :/
<JaneW> he needs them...
<ajmitch_> we can pour them into him at UBZ
<JaneW> heh
* JaneW has to go out for an hour or 2
<JaneW> if orga come in please ask about the edubuntu RC and if we are anywhere near having one...
<jsgotangco> ill be out as well but will be back in time for the CC meeting
* ajmitch_ has lost track of what meetings are coming up
<jsgotangco> CC 14UTC
<jsgotangco> ajmitch_, fridge it!
<ajmitch_> 3am my time
<ajmitch_> I think I'll skip that
<ajmitch_> I want to be slightly coherent at work in the morning
<jsgotangco> it'll be fun the forums complaint came up again
<jsgotangco> hehe
<ajmitch_> yay
<ajmitch_> definitely not worth me turning up then :)
<jsgotangco> hehe
<ajmitch_> edubuntu meeting the day after?
* jsgotangco doesn't even visit the forums
<ajmitch_> also at a nasty hour? :)
<jsgotangco> 42u-buntu?
<ajmitch_> ?
<ajmitch_> forgive me, my brain has already switched off for the night
<jsgotangco> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DraftBreezyAnnouncement
<ajmitch_> hm, I thought it was going to be '2u-buntu'
<jsgotangco> im gonna rest  a bit
<jsgotangco> brb
<ajmitch_> ok
<ogra> JaneW, i'll know after my install finished :)
<ogra> morning
<ajmitch_> hi ogra 
<ogra> ajmitch_, anything on the moodle front ? 
<JaneW> ogra: ok thanks
* ogra is working on the known issues...
<ogra> http://www.edubuntu.org/LTSPServerSetup and http://www.edubuntu.org/LTSPClientKeymap are done...
<ogra> and i think thats all we have left :)
<ogra> JaneW, all workarounds (sadly not the fixes) are through ... i fought little battles with mdz :)
<JaneW> sigh
<JaneW> be glad for small victories
<ogra> hey, the CD looks ok, so dont worry :)
<JaneW> yay, well done
<JaneW> does DHCP work?
<JaneW> or at least not break everything else? ;)
<ogra> see the above docs...
<ogra> everything works, but you need to do the last steps manually
<ogra> at east it doesnt break and installs fine... 
<ogra> *least
<ogra> no matter which IP or other setting you use...
<ogra> we should link the two docs from the InstallationNotes page and will be fine i think... (assuming the users read it) 
<ogra> if they dont read it, we'll just have a higher support rate, which is fine too with me... so i get in contact ith our users *g* 
<ogra> (think positive.... where you can)
<JaneW> heh
<mhz_edu> morining
<ogra> hey mhz_edu 
<mhz_edu> ogra, hi there. As you already know, I installed edubuntu on the thin laptop. I saw the 50% screen progress (about 5 minutes :) ) and rebooted ok.
<ogra> mhz_edu, have a look at http://www.edubuntu.org/LTSPServerSetup and http://www.edubuntu.org/LTSPClientKeymap and tell me if you see need for improvement...
<mhz_edu> However, I ended up having no /etc/ltsp
<mhz_edu> but I did have the whole /opt tree
* mhz_edu reading
<ogra> you rebooted when the system told you to ? not before ?
<ogra> i know the progress reporting needs some more love, but i wasnt allowed to make the changes now...
<ogra> and at least you see the CD working until the installer goes on with the install
<mhz_edu> I did everything exactly as I did for the desktop "edubuntu server". The only diff was that as I have no chance to boot from PCMCIA CD drive, I edited GRUB and started from HD to then load PCMCIA CD drive.
<ogra> ouch
<mhz_edu> baad?
<ogra> that cant work... the ltsp builder requires that the CD is mounted under /cdrom
<mhz_edu> hmmmmmmmm
<mhz_edu> no problem, I think I can build a "tweak of original ltsp", right?
<mhz_edu> I mean, how hard can it be ?
<mhz_edu> (please tell me it's piece of strawberry cake
<ogra> sure, but did you walk through the steps between ltsp building and reboot ? 
<mhz_edu> )
<mhz_edu> yes, absolutely 100% sure because I am used to keep notes of everything I do during install process
<ogra> else you'll be missing settings and stuff...
<ogra> ok, then its no prob...
<mhz_edu> so, far, the only thing I have noticed it's missing the is the dhcpd.conf and the /ltsp dir
<ogra> make sure edubuntu-server is installed correctly
<mhz_edu> how do I make sure?
<ogra> sudo apt-get install edubuntu-server
<mhz_edu> lol!
<ogra> it will tell you if its already there :)
<mhz_edu> I thought you were gonna say something more complex than that
<ogra> hey, its ubuntu... no complexity allowed ;)
<mhz_edu> oh, BTW, I still can't find why LDM ignores .xsession ot .Xsession ~/files
<mhz_edu> hehehe
<mhz_edu> ogra, neither complexity nor fixes allowed :D  (ironic joke but couldn't help it, sorry)
<ogra> heh
<mhz_edu> .oO(it's my latin sense of humour)
<ogra> fixes are allowed until a certain date :)
<mhz_edu> oh, good point
<mhz_edu> hhh. actually when this fujitsu boots the screen is "ubuntu'" not "edubuntu" but when GDM  starts (i still do not like GDM or any xDM, I do prefer the login prompt only) this beautiful edubuntu screen shows up
<mhz_edu> JaneW, on Wednesday, I'll have CD covers to show
<mhz_edu> ogra, u were right. it will download it.
<mhz_edu> very weired, very much
<mhz_edu> you say it may have been due to pcmcia cd?
<ogra> due to the grub stuff i think...
<mhz_edu> hhhm, but the grub thing was only to boot the machine. After that, I wiped out the whole HD
<ogra> yes, but you didnt see the edubuntu logo ...
<mhz_edu> so I shold have had a whole new environment
<mhz_edu> hmm, right
<ogra> looks like you installed ubuntu...
<mhz_edu> ubuntu and ALL the games and structure of edubuntu (like the /opt tree)
<ogra> the /opt tree is always there
<mhz_edu> oh
<jsgotangco> mmm?
<jsgotangco> your usplash didnt show edubuntu?
<mhz_edu> yes, now it is installing schooltool
<ogra> /opt/ltsp gets created during the ltsp server install
<jsgotangco> you installed ubuntu :P
<ogra> jsgotangco, funny, eh ? 
<jsgotangco> you downloaded the wrong cd :P
<hno73> JaneW: I think we are on track for the website changeover tomorrow. I have a site up here: which is fairly complete http://www.omma.org.uk/edubuntu/ and I'm working with Znarl on the server config stuff.
<jsgotangco> wow
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, I downloades (actually rsynced) ogra's iso
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, actually, at the login screen, I see Edubuntu
<jsgotangco> ahhh
<mhz_edu> but at the booting screen I see Ubuntu :D
<hno73> JaneW: Znarl says he has some conflicting RT requests regarding this though. What did you request? :)
<ogra> thats from edubuntu-artwork....
<jsgotangco> you probably installed workstation?
<jsgotangco> mhz_edu, that's an old image then
<ogra> even then it should show the edubuntu bootsplash
<mhz_edu> yes, from last friday
<ogra> the same iso installed fine here...
<mhz_edu> jstis the same exact cd i used for the desktop I am using as server
<ogra> i'm just installing over it
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, its the same exact cd i used for the desktop I am using as server
<jsgotangco> the edubuntu bootsplash has been quite a while
<jsgotangco> (weeks)
<mhz_edu> yep, indeed
<mhz_edu> hno73, well done!
<jsgotangco> can you try downloading again? the daily build should work for you
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, I'' donwload from Tecnocimiento (much faster than home connection)
<hno73> mhz_edu: again, it's mostly Johnathan's work
<mhz_edu> hno73, ok
<mhz_edu> highvoltage, well done!
<mhz_edu> :D
<jsgotangco> hno73, is it possible not to have an embossed logo?
<hno73> jsgotangco: yes, would that be prefrable?
<jsgotangco> emboss looks so 90s imo
<hno73> :)
<hno73> Ok, I'll play with it
<mhz_edu> as long as no flash is used :D
<jsgotangco> no flash...that's evil
<jsgotangco> hno73 knows it
<jsgotangco> =)
<mhz_edu> hehe
<mhz_edu> JaneW, tomorrow, I start the 1st training period for Tecnocimiento gang on Edubuntu
<mhz_edu> ogra, I read the wiki. Good.
<ogra> fine :)
<mhz_edu> I'll use some moin syntax to take advantage of some features if you don't mind
<ogra> sure, go ahead :)
<jsgotangco> mhz_edu, you should help out on the ubuntu wiki, that thing is a monster (i barely touch it)
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, I am very interested on it but I wonder how much into Moin special features for docing is the Doc Team aware of
<hno73> jsgotangco: from tomorrow he won't have a choice because the edubuntu wiki will be merged in with the ubuntu one (if all goes to plan)
<mhz_edu> Teh best advatage of wiki, in general, is that it will never become a monster if you keep it under very simple rules
<jsgotangco> the wiki isn't really a docteam focus
<mhz_edu> yes, that's a problem
<mhz_edu> hno73, educoooool!
<jsgotangco> but some active members are more into it than docbook'ing itself
<mhz_edu> hehehe
<JaneW> hno73: hello, I just asked znarl to process Jonathan's request
<jsgotangco> mhz_edu, to be honest i prefer mediawiki
* jsgotangco hides
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, moin2docbook could be the solution
<JaneW> hno73: would be great if the changeover happens tomorrow
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, I imagin
<JaneW> mhz_edu: cool!
<mhz_edu> JaneW, cool? what?
<JaneW> mhz_edu JaneW, tomorrow, I start the 1st training period for Tecnocimiento gang on Edubuntu
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, all wikis are aimed for putting docs into web. Mediawiki is great for many things but it requires double work to make it as flexible as Moin
<mhz_edu> JaneW, ah!
<mhz_edu> Anybody knows the login password for "admin" in schooltool?
<ogra> oh, i wanted to ad a line to the about edubuntu page... thanks for reminding mhz_edu 
<ogra> i think its schooltool
<ogra> jinty could tell, but he's just gone
<jsgotangco> ogra, you still want yelp pages or we ditch what I have?
<jsgotangco> (sorry the other docs ate my time)
<ogra> i think we'll concentrate on the wiki for this release... ill put your about-edubuntu yelp page in the next edubuntu-artwork packge (no need for a separate package for one doc)
<ogra> next tim we should have more people helping with this stuff...
<ogra> *time
* jsgotangco breathes a sigh of relief
<jsgotangco> i owe you a 6 pack
<ogra> you ? me ? i'd rather say is the opposite ;)
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: i think the embossed logo looks better. the plain one looks incredibly plain.
<jsgotangco> i just got a job btw
<ogra> yay
<ogra> congrats
<highvoltage> mhz_edu: thanks :)
<mhz_edu> np
<jsgotangco> ogra, i'll be staying in brisbane for a while
<ogra> oh, just around the corner...
<ogra> what about your family ? 
<jsgotangco> well i'll be staying first then test the waters...
<mhz_edu> highvoltage, anychance we can have a screenshot of plain logo and embedded logo, so other can see the diff with embosed logo?
<jsgotangco> although my contract states i can bring 'em in
<ogra> thats really great news
<ogra> finally you move to a sane TZ :P
<jsgotangco> hahaha
<ogra> :)
<jsgotangco> pretty excited really...at least its a linux-related job (carrier-grade)
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, cooisimo!
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, coolisimo!
<jsgotangco> gracias
<ogra> yay
<mhz_edu> heheh
<hno73> JaneW: And what was Jonathan's request again? It would help if we had a coordinated request for this. My suggestion (and my request to RT) is that we place a single front page on the same server as the wiki, point www.e.o to that and then point wiki.e.o to the ubuntu wiki with the edubuntu skin. That doesn't involve other servers, redirect or net-propagation delays. Thoughs?
<hno73> highvoltage: ^^?
<JaneW> highvoltage: PING
<JaneW> hno73: I agree on all counts. I have asked Jonathan to forward his RT request to me so I can see what he asked for...
<highvoltage> JaneW: PONG, which changeover were you refering to?
<hno73> JaneW: I think it might have involved some other server, which I suspect adds a level of cemplexity we can do without at this stage, now that we just have a single page to host
<highvoltage> hno73: i'm re-sending my request, i'll copy you and JaneW on it
<hno73> highvoltage: resending to RT
<hno73> ?
<hno73> highvoltage: better to send it to me. I'm in dialogue with the admins now
<hno73> Znarl has said he will help me today and tomorrow
<hno73> highvoltage: your request and mine might have conflicting elements
<hno73> causing confusion with the server admins
<JaneW> highvoltage: thanks :)
<hno73> So we should just coordinate them
<JaneW> hno73: agreed
<JaneW> highvoltage: did you get that? please send to Henrik and I, we'll take it forward
<highvoltage> hno73: rt@admin.ubuntu.ocm
<highvoltage> com even
<highvoltage> hno73: ok, you have been copied
<highvoltage> JaneW: ok, that's what i've done.
<mhz_edu> JaneW, hmmm, the edubuntu children photo/ any chances we can get it at a higher resolution, please (not web resolution) :D ?
<ogra> 300dpi :)
<highvoltage> hno73: sorry, i realise now you meant I should send it _just_ to you and JaneW 
<highvoltage> hno73: i think my request didn't go through, because I'm not getting a response back. perhaps it's limited to canonical employees?
<JaneW> highvoltage: thanks, hno73 can discuss any issues and/or conflicts with Karl/James as necessary
<JaneW> mhz_edu: I have one of 294KB
<JaneW> mhz_edu: can I send that to you?
<hno73> highvoltage, JaneW: no worries I'll sort it out with Znarl
<ogra> JaneW, not bigger ? a 300dpi version that has CD cover size would be rather 1-3MB 
<JaneW> mhz_edu: I see I sent it to you on 12 Aug - that's the biggest I have
<hno73> We'll need to take the edubuntu wiki off line for about 15 minutes tomorrow. Any time particularly bad?
<jsgotangco> JaneW, i told you a few days ago, the pdf of the cover ain't gonna cut it for artwork
<jsgotangco> its just too small
<JaneW> jsgotangco: that's was for design not the logo
<mhz_edu> JaneW, hmmm, ok
<mhz_edu> thx
<JaneW> mhz_edu: I can ask silbs... just a sec
<mhz_edu> better :)
<highvoltage> hno73: not that i can think of. for what it's worth, www.edubuntu.org's docroot already redirects to wiki.edubuntu.org, so that at least won't cause disruption.
<mhz_edu> JaneW, and I hopw silbs can send a .jpg, gif, hopefully even a GIMP formtat :D
<mhz_edu> any image but pdf wouldbe great
<jsgotangco> mhz_edu, a tiff will do you wonders
<mhz_edu> yes
<jsgotangco> at least a 300dpi tiff
<JaneW> mhz_edu: the one I sent you is a jpg
<JaneW> mhz_edu: the pdf was just the CD cover design, which was not yet 100% final
<mhz_edu> hno73, if you ask me, the only chances I can edit something is from 08:00 AM to 09:00 AM and from 14:30 to 16:00 or from 22:00 to 00:00. Here's now 11:24
* jsgotangco leaks the pdf then
<jsgotangco> =)
<JaneW> jsgotangco: got a few ppl to edit BreeztReleaseNotes
<mhz_edu> JaneW, yes, the jpg is low resolution for printing, imho
<mhz_edu> at least that particular file
<JaneW> mhz_edu: ok I have pinged sils, waiting for her to repsond
<mhz_edu> cool, however we'll work with what we have, so I dont want to keep people off their duties so close to release :D
<mhz_edu> I'll wait, of course, anyways.
<JaneW> mhz_edu: many thanks, the CDs won;t be printed before the are ready, certainly not in the next week (or 2) so we have a reprieve
<mhz_edu> it is kind of strange feeling. on one side, I do want the release to be out soon. On the other hand, I understand we should release something "ready".
<jsgotangco> mhz_edu, right
<mhz_edu> anyways, maybe we should wiki a site called "the edubuntu unofficial release" :D
<mhz_edu> lol
<mhz_edu> jsgotangco, is this page in accordance to the content? http://www.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallations
<jsgotangco> hrmmm
<jsgotangco> well they declared they have some instlaled i guess
<ogra> hmm, todays daily smells like an RC
<mhz_edu> ogra Rulz!
<jsgotangco> w00t
<ogra> ok, going to test the LTSP part
<JaneW> mhz_edu: silbs does not have a higher res version of the children pic. Sorry
<JaneW> YAYAYYAYAYAYYAYAYYAYAYAY
* JaneW loves the smell of RC
<jsgotangco> err so we're on target in 2 days?
<ogra> yup
<JaneW> jsgotangco: release notes??
<jsgotangco> JaneW, i'll slave on it later
<ogra> somme smaller things like missing css for the firefox homepage and other stuff like this is still pending...
<ogra> but we'lkl be done for release
* jsgotangco removes moodle?
<ogra> oh, yes
<ogra> i still wait for an answer from ajmitch... at least the moodle in universe should be ok... i'll have to care for it the next days if he doesnt manage
<jsgotangco> (its nice to see you back again ogra)
<ogra> thanks :)
<JaneW> ogra: ajmitch says moodle's not done
<JaneW> ogra: he was upset he didn;t finish it
* jsgotangco comments moodle part anyway
<ogra> gah
<JaneW> ogra: was saying he owes you beers etc
<JaneW> pity
<ogra> JaneW, its not te missing change of wwwconfig-common... thats not urgent anymore, but there are security bugs open that need to be closed before release
<ogra> i'll jump on it later tonight
<ogra> lets see when Kamion has time to move the daily to RC... i'm tired of the preview bugreports :) these are sooo old bugs...
<ogra> going to write installation notes we should link from a RC announcement... if anybody likes to prepare such an announcement, i would appreciate it... doesnt need to be detailed...
* mhz_edu is gonna try some dhcp configs and other details
<mhz_edu> .oO(hopefully I endup using this router as a switch, as I used to b4 edubuntu dhcp)
<jsgotangco> well we could use the draft breezy annoucement
<ogra> nothing this big... just something "hello, we are late, but we have a Rc anyway... look "here" for install notes and grab it "here"
<ogra> feature lists etc are for release :)
<jsgotangco> i can try in a few hours (a bit sleepy past 11pm already)
* jsgotangco creates a draft from preview annoucement
<ogra> yup, we'll have to wait for "Kamion spare time" anyway before it gets moved to releases.ubuntu.com
<ogra> he's very busy, seems a late bug in the installer showed up today
<jsgotangco> ickk
<jsgotangco> its ok i live a few hours in the future =) but since we're almost a day away from release, do you think an RC is still applicable?
<ogra> its just for bureocracys sake :) 
<ogra> and for the people that still test the preview instead of a daily... the preview was odd...
<jsgotangco> ok i'll just mention edubuntu-specific stuff then
<jsgotangco> and make it shorter
<ogra> if at all...
<mhz> hmmm
<mhz> no way I can use that router as 'switch', so dhcp only works with a crossover cable :(
<mhz> The strange thing is that I used that router for about 9 months as 'switch' by giving static IP's to machines and use the eth1 (same interface I am using for dhcp) as router.
<jsgotangco> ogra, done EdubuntuReleaseCandidate
<mhz> ok, i am off to train the gang
<ogra> jsgotangco, great, working on http://www.edubuntu.org/InstallNotes
<mhz> jsgotangco: can I translate that into spnish this evening
<mhz> ?
<ogra> mhz, go ahead
<mhz> cool, then.
<mhz> Once I'm back, that'll be one of my evening objectives :D
* vincenzio is ready for the release! thank you all
<mhz> .oO(and I hope I can get enlightened so I can figure out a solution for this "sharing" network local problem) I need to test edubuntu with at least 2 clients and I don't think the Zaurus will be a candidate :)
<ogra> http://www.edubuntu.org/InstallNotes done... if someone wants to hunt for typos....
<stockholm> JaneW: ?
<stockholm> JaneW: i have a project-management question
<stockholm> JaneW: can you recommend some software for project planning?
<ogra> stockholm, planner ? 
<ogra> hi btw :)
<stockholm> ogra: i tried that, it did not rock
<stockholm> hi! (c:
* vincenzio is proofreading the installnotes page.
<stockholm> ogra: i liked ganttproject best so far, as far as the look and feel goes, but it is bugyy
<ogra> nah it doesnt... too early in its development... there is another java based one and i think on the dark side in the KDE world there exists another one... but dont ask for names ;
<ogra> )
<ogra> vincenzio, hey, thanks a lot :)
<stockholm> ogra: ganttproject was reviewed in the lastest c't 
<stockholm> and is java based
<stockholm> it does need non-free runtime libs
<stockholm> ogra: not i look at dotproject (web-based) and a kde app (taskjuggler)
<ogra> ah, yes, that was it.. i read about it in LinuxMagazin
<stockholm> they can not compete with ganttproject in look and feel.
<stockholm> gantproject is exactly what we would need, regarding functionality and stuff.
<stockholm> but like this it is not useable
<ogra> so poke them to free it ;)
<ogra> and make it buil with gjc :)
<stockholm> it is free, but needs the sun java runtime
<ogra> *build
<stockholm> people are on that allready
<ogra> in ubuntu we have blackdown
<stockholm> 6 fulltime people (c:
<stockholm> they fill in the missing bits in classpath and hope to be ready by chistmas
<ogra> ah, sounds nice
<stockholm> then we would have a free java environment, finally
<ogra> freemind would also be cool to have :)
<stockholm> but the app itself is both free and buggy.
<ogra> gjc is already in ubuntu, eclipse is built with it
<stockholm> yes
<ogra> indeed our calsspath isnt better than debians :)
<stockholm> that is in debian, too, i think
<ogra> *classpath
<stockholm> (c:
<stockholm> and JaneW went home already, it seems
<ogra> i think she'll come back... we're waiting for our RC to be populated ...
<stockholm> ah
<stockholm> when will that be done?
<stockholm> say, wasnt the release supposed to be last month?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> thursday or friday will be release date
<ogra> i'm just doing a RC no... pro-forma :)
<ogra> *now
<stockholm> can you build those yourself, remotely?
<stockholm> or are they build automatically every hour?
<ogra> every day...
<ogra> in our infrastructure
<stockholm> yes. we do the same in debian-edu. just event-triggered
<ogra> yes, our event is a cron job ;)
<vincenzio> msg ogra, spelling seems to be all correct on the installnotes page. I think I would mention that the LTSP Thin Client server is not an internet gateway under the default install, and link to what it takes to make that happen under post install. That's just me, though. 
<ogra> vincenzio, http://www.edubuntu.org/LTSPServerSetup has a link at the bottom for NAT setups 
<ogra> i think thats sufficient... but we coul dput the same sentence on the InstallNotes page too
<ogra> if you want it there, feel free to edit the page ;) its a wiki ;)
<th1a> Hi all.
<th1a> I just rebooted my edubuntu desktop for the first time in a while and got the new Edubuntu default desktop.
<th1a> I find the little girl with no nose a bit disturbing.
<ogra> th1a, hmm, it was discusses quite often here until we decided to take this one... did you like the former one better ?
<ogra> th1a, we release in two days, if you try to get a discussion rolling on the mailing list, there is still time to revert it if a majority wants to...
<th1a> ogra:  Sorry I haven't been hanging out on IRC lately.
<th1a> The mailing list has been quiet.
<ogra> poke it ;) 
<th1a> Are there other alternatives?
<th1a> Floating around?
<ogra> i think irc and ML are the only ones to reach the community 
<ogra> i'm totally neutral about the wallpaper...
<th1a> No, I mean alternative wallpapers.
<ogra> art.ubuntu.com has some... or we could revert to the yellow one... we have a meeting scheduled tomorrow, probably try to get it on the agenda (mail the ML) 
<th1a> OK.
<stockholm> JaneW: ?
<flora> is anyone here using edubuntu in an actual school?
<flora> darn
<flora> i'm having a helluva a time getting our Adult Ed administrator to agree to let me turn our ancient Dell lab into an open source lovefest :)
<ogra> jelkner runs it at his school but he's not often around
<mhz> hey
<mhz_installing_3>  anyone here who knows how I can make a set of dreamweaver files become a document ready for print?
<guest2> hi tom and jinty, fancy meeting you here!
<guest2> ogra: oliver, do you have time for a few questions?
<mhz> ahhh
<jinty> ahhh
<jelkner> i'm logged in on the edubuntu machine at my local library
<jelkner> i forgot i was guest ;-)
<ogra> jelkner, very bad time... i have to fight to get a last minute fix in on #ubuntu-devel
<jelkner> ok, talk to you later
<jinty> jelkner: re cando
<jelkner> yes, did you get to talk to dave?
<mhz> anyone knows the schooltool password from edubuntu install?
<jinty> yeah, he is with us in #schooltool
<jinty> mhz: manager:schooltool?
<jelkner> well, let me log out from here and meet you guys on #schooltool
<mhz> ahh, I was using admin/schooltool
<jinty> mhz: np
<mhz> thx
<mhz> ogra: what "girl" is Tom talking about in his email to edubuntu-devel?
<ogra> mhz, the default background image
<mhz> I see no girl
<ogra> look closer :p
<mhz> just a yellow bg with edubuntu on a right down corner
<ogra> the users background doesnt get overwritten on ugrade, check yourself in the background chooser...
<ogra> it should have come with a edubuntu-artwork update from the weekend
<mhz> ok, once i log out I'll be checking on that
<jelkner> has anyone noticed that the edubuntu theme goes away when you select another one, and you can't get it back?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> jelkner, only if you log in twice with the same user there can be a problem... 
<jelkner> ogra: we have two workstations in the mt rainier library setup
<jelkner> one labeled "Juvenile"
<jelkner> the other "Adults"
<ogra> yup
<jelkner> figuring the edubuntu theme was good for the "Juvenile", but not the "Adult"
<jelkner> we changed the theme in Adult
<ogra> i havent had such an issue.. 
<jelkner> but now if I wanted to change it back
<jelkner> I can't
<jelkner> since it was a "custom" theme that disappears from the list
<ogra> but if you log in twice with the same user on the same server, there can be problems with gnome-settings-daemon not starting...
<ajmitch_> morning
<mhz> ogra: 4th install, 1 problem GDM claimed a couple of errors due to fonts or something and refused to start :(
<jelkner> yes, but that is not what i'm talking about here
<mhz> ajmitch_: morning
<ogra> mhz, can you mail me the Xorg log ?
<jelkner> this is simply a matter of the theme not being a choice in the System->Preferences->Themes list
<mhz> sure (I can even wiki it to you)
<ogra> jelkner, oh, you didnt install it from a package ? 
<jelkner> no, i'm talking about the default edubuntu theme
<jelkner> i didn't install anything
<jelkner> i'm talking about the child friendly desktop icons and such
<ogra> and you cant find it  ? 
<ogra> strange
<jelkner> should i report a bug?
<jelkner> check it out, it is not a theme choice
<ogra> iz wont be solved anymore, i'm not allowed to do any changes now...
<jelkner> you're kidding!
<mhz> he's not, sadly
<ogra> the archive is getting locked tonight
<ogra> the first testbuilds for the release are running... i can do some trivial changes tomorrow again... but really only trivials
<ajmitch_> for main, or also universe?
<jelkner> then it sounds like the only viable plan will be to wait until after the release and to begin figuring out how to start using dapper ;-)
<ogra> only main
<ajmitch_> oh good
<jelkner> there are still too many things that need to be done to make the system usable
<jelkner> i guess we could patch things as we are testing and then know better what has to go into dapper
<jelkner> the librarian needs to be able to create a desktop for guests and have that locked down, for example
<jelkner> the public is using the system
<jelkner> i imagine a script that recopied everything in the home directory from /etc/skel would do the trick
<jelkner> but we need some human friendly way for her to make changes to the desktop until she says "yeah, this is what i want" and to give her the abilitiy to save it
<jelkner> but then users off the street should not be able to change that
<jelkner> the whole configuration management issue
<jelkner> edubuntu won't be for real until we have that
<ajmitch_> sabayon is probably going to be useful for that
<jelkner> who is sabayon? sounds like i need to talk with him.
<jelkner> in the mean time, i'll get busy writing all this stuff up on the wiki
<jelkner> so we can talk about it in montreal
<ajmitch_> s/who/what/
<jelkner> ahh
<ajmitch_> Description: system administration tool to manage GNOME desktop settings
* jelkner is googling sabayon
<ajmitch_> uses a gnome session in xnest to configure user profiles
<ogra> sabayon doesnt work throgh ssh...
<ogra> xnest cant be started
<jelkner> but we have to have something like it, then
<ajmitch_> ogra: right
<ajmitch_> ogra: which is why it's something to look at for dapper :)
<jelkner> i just looked at the website, yup, that's what we need
<ajmitch_> and it should use xephyr, rather than xnest
<ogra> its planned as the default config manager for dapper
<ajmitch_> great
* ajmitch_ knew someone would look at it :)
<ogra> there were just to many issues with it to include it now
<jelkner> ok, i'll buy that, but after this release will there be some time to hack together some solutions for the most import user concerns?
<ajmitch_> I know, it's fairly early in its development
<jelkner> i know nobody asked me to do it, but i've gone ahead and setup several edubuntu labs with real folks who have real needs
<jelkner> i figured what better way to have edubuntu work the way people want it to work than to have people use it and tell us what they need
<mhz> ogra: http://www.tecnocimiento.cl/MauricioHernandez/ScrapBook
<mhz> there's the error
<jelkner> i've been telling folks, "just wait until spring, and all will be well!"
<jelkner> but it would be great if they could use the systems between now and then
<jelkner> anyway, would a script that deleted everything from /home/guest and repopulated it be a reasonable way to handle this problem for the present?
<ogra> delete only ~/.gconf
<jelkner> well, she wants files they downloaded to disappear too
<jelkner> does ~/.gconf have all the icon positions, desktop themes, etc?
<jelkner> i'm thinking that the simplest solution for now is to let the user do what they will, as long as logout/login results in a know configuration
<jelkner> s/known/know
<jelkner> ok, i know you have a release to put out, i'll talk to you again after that is over...
<ogra> sorry, was on the phone
<jelkner> (and you've had a chance to celebrate, of course ;-)
<ogra> nope, i have nothing to do right now...
<jelkner> is the release done?
<ogra> my fixes werent and arent accepted currently...
<jelkner> ahh
<mhz>  ogra, this error won't let me even start fluxbox :()
<ogra> this daily wont change much the next two days
<jelkner> is it installable now?
<ogra> mhz, does that happen on the server ? 
<mhz> yeps
<ogra> jelkner, sure, i wouldnt release it without working installer
<mhz> that's the url i pasted for you
<jelkner> great
<mhz> jelkner: what date is the iso you used?
<jelkner> it was 10/10
<jelkner> i burned it yesterday morning
<jelkner> and it didn't work
<jelkner> i've since thrown it out
<ogra> jelkner, i admit there are many rough edges, but its really ok for a first release in such a timeframe... in dapper we'll have lots more time and i hope i wont be alone anymore.. if we can get more people involved it will get much better
<ogra> 10/10 didnt work for you ? 
<ogra> what was the error ? 
<jelkner> i told you yesterday
<jelkner> you said you knew about it
<jelkner> it gave me an error and said something like "if you see this screen..."
<mhz> I have seen that error too
<ogra> but that doesnt mean it didnt work
<ogra> the error was there for 2 months...
<jelkner> i never saw it before
<ogra> and was fixed yesterday
<jelkner> i stopped as soon as i saw it (once you told me it was fixed)
<th1a> jelkner:  I agree that Breezy Edubuntu is a good showing for six months work.
<mhz> jelkner: I just ignored it
<jelkner> anyway, paul wisely suggested we save the working hard drive and install on a new one anyway
<mhz> my 2 boxes run edubuntu smoothly
<jelkner> ogra: please keep in mind that i am *not* trying to be critical
<mhz> and always with the same dhcp message error :D
<ogra> th1a, it had far less than 6 months... say rather 3-4
<jelkner> edubuntu is great!
<ogra> jelkner, i get that ;) 
<mhz> we know
<jelkner> i can use it in my classroom and it works just fine
<ogra> jelkner, dont worry... i'm just quite shocked if you tell me yesterdays iso isnt installable...
<mhz> lol!
<ogra> but if you stopped the install at the beginning i'm not worried :)
<jelkner> i missunderstood you
<mhz> ogra, as a good hacker, he was more concerned about geek stuff than social ones :D
<flora> hey is anyone using edubuntu in an actual classroom?
<jelkner> yes, i am
<jelkner> everyday with more than 70 students
<mhz> me, as soon as I can finish this 4th time install
<flora> jelkner: that is wonderful
<flora> i'm having a helluva time convincing our Adult Ed administrator to let me turn our ancient Dell lab into an open source paradise
<jelkner> flora: and it is working like a charm
<ogra> mhz, yes, currently i have the word E S A E L E R tatooed on my forehead to remind me every time i look into the mirror .... 
<mhz> lol
<ajmitch_> ogra: you need reminded of that?
<ogra> lol
<ogra> not really
<flora> jelkner: what applications do the students/teachers use?
<mhz> ogra: so, the Xorg error? need an upgrade and that's it?
<ogra> ajmitch_, its just for the moments when i manage to forget about it :)
<ajmitch_> ogra: and then you wake up
<ogra> mhz, i'm not really sure
<jelkner> it is a cs lab, so we use python and java developement stuff
<ogra> mhz, what kind of graphics card is this ? 
<jelkner> btw., eclipse got fixed just in time!
<mhz> hmmm, not a clue
<flora> oh a cs lab... that's not the same as "basic office skills"
<jelkner> and firefox, gaim, openoffice, of course
<jelkner> i have several students using blender
<jelkner> and more using the gimp
<ogra> mhz, it seems to think its a trident....
<jelkner> a few using anjuta for learning c++
<ogra> mhz, its very old i guess
<mhz> oh, is that a card?
<mhz> indeed
<ogra> yup
<jelkner> flora: i'm the only teacher
<mhz> I am "selling" the idea of RecicLab, remember? so yea, many pc will be old
<jelkner> flora: the rest of the school still uses M$, i'm afraid
<mhz> jelkner: if you need more teachers, count on me :)
<jelkner> cool! where will you be teaching?
<flora> our Dell lab is sooo old but the teacher and administrator insist on running windows and office XP
<flora> i can't convince them to give the switch a try
<jelkner> yup, i know the situation well
<mhz> flora: don't convince them, force them :D
<jelkner> lol
<flora> good idea!
<flora> most of the users would never know the diff ;)
<jelkner> btw, that is completely true
<mhz> or show them stats and benchmarking
<jelkner> i went to another local library on saturday that is using a gnu/linux thin client service called userful
<jelkner> it is a gnome desktop
<jelkner> configured to be friendly for windoz familiar users
<mhz> wow
<mhz> has XPDE continued development?
<jelkner> the librarian says most users never even realize they were not running windows
<mhz> that was a real XP for many M$ users
<mhz> exactly
<mhz> jelkner: actually... you CAN't run windows, It runs bt itself whenever he feels like it :D
<ogra> mhz, btw,  sudo update-alternatives --config x-session-manager for a global session change works
<mhz> ooohhhh, that was new to me!
<ogra> this way you dont need to fiddle with ~/.xsession
<ogra> (as long as you dont need user specific sessions )
<mhz> and remember that LDM ingnores .xsession?
<ogra> nope, it doesnt
<ogra> ldm has nothing to do whit this
<mhz> i know. i meant 
<mhz> Do you remembr?
<ogra> ldm starts ssh -X <server> /etc/X11/Xsession
<ogra> so the problem must be in Xsession and how it handles the users .xsession...
<mhz> yeah, i tought so, but then locally, all my different tests with .xsession and .Xsession files worked perfectly. Only from clients these did not work
<jelkner> ok, i have an openoffice question...
<jelkner> i'm sitting next to a user who is trying to type a document in spanish
<jelkner> what is the easiest way for him to get spanish characters into his document?
<ogra> mhz, then its an ssh or xauth issue...
<mhz> change keyboard settings from the desktop he's using
<ogra> jelkner, if his admin installs the spanish langpacks first ;)
<mhz> jelkner: I use us keyboards but sometimes I am forced to use spanish characters (i live in Chile). Gnome and Kde manage hat easily
<mhz> hat = that
* jelkner is doing that now..
<ogra> jelkner, beyond that, i can only guess, since i'm only familiar with he compose+char+accent concept we use on german keyboards, no clue how you manage that on us layout :)
<jelkner> mhz: what is the easiest way to do that?
<mhz> hmmm, I am on a thin laptop now.. with only Fluxbox and Wmaker.
<mhz> jelkner: if  remember correctly...
<ogra> jelkner, the easiest is to know the right key combo to get chars that are not on your keyboard... the "other" way is to use gucharmap
<mhz> Preferences, Keyboard layout, Add spanish-iso, OK
#edubuntu 2006-10-09
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<juliux> morning highvoltage 
<juliux> highvoltage, on this page http://edubuntu.org/ThinClientConfig is a bug. the screenshot is wrong. the path should be gksu "gedit /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf" 
<juliux> on a default edubuntu installation is no ksudo
* highvoltage looks
<juliux> and the path is als wrong
<highvoltage> juliux: ah, I see
<highvoltage> I thought I fixed it. strange.
<juliux> the path should be /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf and not /opt/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<juliux> yesterday i only looked at the screenshot so i put my lts.conf in the wrong folder and so the clients didnt boot
<highvoltage> urgh. pips1 and I changed the password and I can't remember it.
<highvoltage> juliux: I have an updated screenshot now, will upload a bit later today when I find pips1
<juliux> good luck
<RichEd> morning highvoltage & others
<highvoltage> mornign RichEd 
* HedgeMage peeks in
<HedgeMage> hi, guys :)
<RichEd> hi HedgeMage :)
<HedgeMage> hey, RichEd, how's it going?
<RichEd> Well thanks HedgeMage and yourself ?
<RichEd> (Last planning over the next few days and some construction action by the end of this week hopefully.)
<HedgeMage> Pretty good... TT is finally potty training :)  Other than that just trying to find time at the computer to wrap up as much handbook stuff as I can
<HedgeMage> Do we have a docbook guru who might be willing to help straighten out some errors with handbook's markup?
<HedgeMage> I only took one quick look, but I am still learning docbook so it didn't seem horribly obvious to me.
<RichEd> ^^ Good. I raised your desire to move in the meeting ... people are aware of the situation and we need to recruit some more willing helpers. We are hoping Will van der leij will take over all docs from a co-ordination and management point.
<RichEd> re: docbook guru - what is required here ? skills ? time ?
<RichEd> HedgeMage: re: docbook guru - what is required here ? skills ? time ?
<HedgeMage> RichEd: We get about a dozen (possibly trivial) docbook errors when trying to process the thing to make a pdf or show it as one document or whatnot... I'm not sure how to fix them off of the top of my head.  If someone who actually knows what they're doing can help, i doubt a fix would take more than a half hour, maybe an hour tops.
<RichEd> HedgeMage: Can you send me an email with the info above and some details as to how this has been experienced or fixed before ? And anyone who helped previously ? I will try to find a resource or willing helper.
<RichEd> And any examples of the problem(s) ... that would help.
<HedgeMage> RichEd: sure thing.
<HedgeMage> probably in the morning, though, I'm about to fall over.
<RichEd> no rush ... also include deadline dates & targets ")_
<HedgeMage> RichEd: I'll post a plea to ubuntu-docteam as well, someone there was very helpful last time.
* HedgeMage nods
<HedgeMage> cool, thanks :D
<HedgeMage> I am so sick of being so strapped for time... I hate doing this job knowing I can't give it 100% :(
<HedgeMage> It *deserves* 100%
<RichEd> hey jono :) you been away for a bit ?
<RichEd> morning ogra
<jono> hey RichEd :)
<jono> RichEd, yeah was on vacation for two weeks
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: I've been there before, I understand. It's not fun :(
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: thanks :)
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: what I can tell you though is that it eventually does pass over :)
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: Thanks for the support :)
<HedgeMage> It's good to know I still have friends here despite being so absent lately.
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: :)
* HedgeMage hugs highvoltage and RichEd 
* RichEd hugs HedgeMage ... avoiding the bits of highvoltage sticking out ...
<HedgeMage> hehe!
<RichEd> ;)
<ogra> cbx33, did you mail claire about not attending UDS ? 
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> and received a reply
<cbx33> y?
<ogra> fine, thanks
<cbx33> ok
<skwashd> hi all
<skwashd> i am trying to use the tftp server which ships with edubuntu to flash some firmware
<skwashd> where do i store the users ?
<highvoltage> hi skwashd 
<skwashd> hey highvoltage 
<highvoltage> what kind of users?
<skwashd> highvoltage: the tftp users
<highvoltage> hmm... I've only used it with root before.
<highvoltage> I didn't even know tftpd has concept of users :)
<skwashd> highvoltage: well i keep on being prompted for user:pass
<ogra> for tftp o_O ?
<skwashd> ogra: yes
<ogra> the tftp protocol doesnt support such stuff
<ogra> seems youre not using tftp there ... tftp is totally dumb and doesnt know about users
<skwashd> ogra: hmmm
<skwashd> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/Sparc
<ogra> but the right place for the file would be /var/lib/tftpboot in any case ... tftpd exports that as /
<skwashd> yeah ... i am using /var/lib/tftpboot/sparc for my files ... to keep them separate
<ogra> then you need to use /sparc/yourimage.bin on the client ...
<skwashd> ogra: yes ... but i am still at the flashing stage
<skwashd> under Getting the installer booted
<ogra> yes
<ogra> thats what i mean 
<ogra> put your firmware into /var/lib/tftpboot/sparc and use flashupdate -s yourserverip -f /sparc/yourimage.bin
<skwashd> i am using  flashupdate -v -s 192.168.111.22 -f /sparc/Sun_System_Firmware-6_1_11-Sun_Fire_T2000.bin
<ogra> right
<skwashd> dave@edubuntu:/var/lib/tftpboot$ ls /var/lib/tftpboot/sparc
<skwashd> boot.img  Sun_System_Firmware-6_1_11-Sun_Fire_T2000.bin
<ogra> http://sunsolve.sun.com/search/advsearch.do?collection=PATCH&type=collections&queryKey5=121359&toDocument=yes
<ogra> doesnt talk about tftp for flashupdate
<ogra>           So, before running the flashupdate utility, you must have already downloaded
<ogra>           the new Sun System Firmware image from the SunSolve site to a local FTP
<ogra>           server accessible by the platform whose firmware you are upgrading.
<skwashd> ogra: sorry for wasting your time
<ogra> just install vsftp and move the .bin file to a users home ... then get it from there with the users name/pw
<ogra> ;)
<skwashd> i failed to notice the lack of a t
<skwashd> and as i need tftp for the net boot i just assumed it was used for the flash
<skwashd> oh wel
<skwashd> time to intsall vsftp
<skwashd> that worked! :)
<skwashd> thanks again
<jsgotangco> ta-da!
<ogra> clap clap
* jsgotangco pigs out on downloading the daily now
<ogra> good idea ! :)
<jsgotangco> heh it seems i downloaded the wrong image
<jsgotangco> gahhh i downloaded knot 3
<ogra> ouch
<cbx33> hehehe
<ogra> thats broken as hell
<ogra> apart from the broken usplash progressbar everything should be release ready now ...
<jsgotangco> i knew it! that's why i though f*ck its ugly
<cbx33> :D:D:D
<cbx33> we did well
<jsgotangco> im so sad i didnt see much
<jsgotangco> cbx33: are you going to mountain view?
<ogra> well, you are back in the right moment for the final tests ;)
<cbx33> :( - no
<cbx33> I can't get the time off work
<jsgotangco> doh!
<ogra> apparently nobody will go for edubuntu ...
<cbx33> man was friday bad
<cbx33> not even pygi?
<ogra> pygi mailed he has exams 
<cbx33> no way.....he was so stoked to go?
<ogra> i wonder why he asked for sponsorhip 
<cbx33> yeh?
<ogra> now we wont have anybody apart from the k12 guys and LaserJock :/
<cbx33> I'm really really sorry ogra
<cbx33> now you're making me feel awful
<RichEd> ogra: we've got some ltsp people as well no ?
<ogra> right
<ogra> but they will be focused on ltsp ... not edubuntu specific stuff
<ogra> enabling the ltsp features we want in edubuntu is the only real edubuntu related task here ...
<cbx33> can I still be assigned specs if I'm not at MV?
<ogra> important for me is to get SCP up to speed and to have more gui tools for edubuntu management (ltsp-manager, willowng)
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> ltsp-manager is a must
<ogra> apart from discussing things like CD size and new edubuntu features
<cbx33> upgrades to SCP and indeed it's inner workings are a must too
<cbx33> ogra: I had an idea for an idea :
<ogra> i worked a bit on it over the weekend ...
<cbx33> was gonna write a spec
<cbx33> ogra: on SCP?
<ogra> ltsp_manager
<cbx33> ah cool
<ogra> SCP should be realease reday, right ? 
<cbx33> what about a way for teachers to plan their lessons......could be integrated in SCP, so that you click a button and on each persons machine it will load what they need for that lesson.....like firefox - pointed to a research resource - oowriter for taking notes.....
<ogra> i dont have to change anything anymore, do i ?
<cbx33> ogra: yes
<cbx33> it's all done
<ogra> ok
<cbx33> could be extended to save their session to...so next lesson they can continue exactly where they left off?
<cbx33> what do you think?
<ogra> i'd like to be SCP independent from schools at some point , classroom/schedule management should rather be done by schooltool (thats why we ship it)
<cbx33> then time isn't wasted at the start of a lesson loading materials
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> but schooltool doesn't do what I just described does it?
<ogra> SCP should turn into a generic lockdown ltsp-session-control panel
<cbx33> sure
<ogra> then add it there :)
<cbx33> i thought schooltool was webbaseD?
<ogra> it is
* jsgotangco waves at RichEd
<cbx33> then we can't really integrate it can we?
<ogra> but nobody keeps you from contributing code ;)
* RichEd waves back across the typhoon storm damage to jsgotangco :)
<cbx33> of course not....but getting a web based package to run programs on a users mahcine and collect information about their current session isn't the best way of doing it is it?
<ogra> why ? launchpad integration is using webbased stuff as well from the desktop
<ogra> why should the webtool collect info ... collect it independently and *send* it to the webtool
<cbx33> i suppose
* cbx33 hasn't ever really looked at schooltool.....
<ogra> indeed you could also write a simple gui tool for it ... but i'd rather like it to be independent from SCP
<cbx33> yes i get that independant part :p
<ogra> (even we could have a plugin that starts it from SCP ;) )
<cbx33> but....it could be seen as session storing for ltsp?
<ogra> but which is not installed in a default SCP 
<cbx33> yes plugin good idea
<cbx33> infact that's how I was goign to implement it
<ogra> right, if you keep it as add on thats fine ...
<cbx33> of course
<ogra> as fine as a timer for internet cafes would be as plugin for example 
<cbx33> yes
<jsgotangco> err pardon me but where is the download link for our beta?
<ogra> or reporting software interaction for billing ... etc etc
<ogra> jsgotangco, /topic ?
<jsgotangco> gaahh
<ogra> :)
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> ogra: cna you think of any other enhancements we can do?
<cbx33> or are you saving that kinda thinking for MV
<cbx33> :p
<highvoltage> urgh. I'm having heavy NFS problems trying to mount a /home
<highvoltage> I keep getting a rpc timed out error no matter what I try
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<cbx33> highvoltage: have you tried mounting it from a nother machine manually?
<cbx33> and do you have an RDNS record? - I believe that affects it IIRC
<highvoltage> cbx33: I can't, there's not another machine to test from
<ogra> highvoltage, you mean you try mounting /home on a client via nfs ?
<ogra> s/client/thin client/
<highvoltage> also, this is not a machine I have with me, it's one of our schools I'm helping over jabber :/
<highvoltage> ogra: yes
<ogra> did it ever work before ? 
<highvoltage> ogra: sorry, I should mention that it's not an edubuntu server
<ogra> or is that something new they try to set up ?
<highvoltage> ogra: yes, it worked
<jsgotangco> hmmm
<jsgotangco> UDS in Mountain View would suck because it doesn't have the cool Edubuntu people
* jsgotangco hides
<highvoltage> it worked fine here, and then we sent the server to them, and when they plugged it into the lab, it wouldn't work.
<highvoltage> works fine in 4 other places where we have the same setup.
<jsgotangco> nyahaha
<ogra> highvoltage, ubuntu ltsp ?
<highvoltage> ogra: kind of. it started as an ubuntu ltsp system
<highvoltage> ogra: it's one of those setups where I run everything locally on the clients
<RichEd> cbx33: sent you an eamail ... please take a look when you get a chance
<RichEd> does anyone have a recommendation for simple & cheap no frills domain name registration site : I've used register.com and networksolutions.com but not sure if they are the cheapest 
<ogra> cheapest != best 
<ogra> networksolutions.com should be ok ... is it for your own domain ?
<RichEd> ogra: 1 is for me and 1 for the community site ... I've used network solutions in the past, but they kept on trying to sell me "value added services" and I don;t need or want a web site and all the stuff they try to flog you. Just the domain name records to be established and maintained.
<highvoltage> RichEd: also depends what the domain ends with. if it's a local domain then http://co.za and http://org.za are good (they are cheap, fast, and reliable)
<RichEd> highvoltage: yep ... I'm a past good friend of the uniforum :)
<RichEd> looking for .org so needs to be international
<highvoltage> heh, ok.
<RichEd> Is org.za still with IS ?
<ogra> RichEd, i'm not talking about "value added services" ;) if you want to change the registration (another admin-c entry or simple address change) at some point, some are good and some are not ;)
<ogra> shouldnt company related sites not be registered by the company ?
<RichEd> ogra: ^^ point taken ...
<ogra> i'd ask znarl or elmo about the community site registration
<RichEd> anyone dealt with: www.namesecure.com before ? good or bad ? they are bare service bones at 50% of network solutions cost
<ulinskie> hello
<ulinskie> where can I find presentations on edubuntu
<bddebian> Heya
<RichEd> hello bddebian 
<bddebian> Hello RichEd
<tomveens> Hello Both!
<bddebian> Hello tomveens
<tomveens> got plans for today?
<bddebian> tomveens: Yeah, work :-(
<nixternal> RichEd and anyone else..i received an email from a gentleman in Wisconson (US) that has been tasked with finding a replacement for Windows for an elementary school system and High School. I am replying to his email, but I wondered if I could CC or BCC anyone so you could provide more info and maybe help this guy out?
<nixternal> he has chosed Ubuntu already, and thinks he burned the CD wrong
<nixternal> s/chosed/chosen
<nixternal> in the email I am letting him know about Edubuntu as well, but I think this email/information would be better sought out and completed by one of you if possible
<pygi> ogra, cbx33 : ping
<pygi> ahm, ok, you're not here probably
<LaserJock> heh
<pygi> LaserJock: what?! :P
<LaserJock> you like pinging people a lot :-)
<pygi> LaserJock: well, considering I'll be here for next 5 minutes, and then I'll be able to come online in a week or so...
<pygi> I'd like to speak with them :P
<pygi> moving, no internet, stuff :)
<pygi> and considering I'll be eaten .... :P
<LaserJock> haha
<pygi> if only you would understand why, then you'd knew there is nothing to laugh about :P
<LaserJock> but a break from internet will be good for you :-)
<pygi> ergh, not really :)
<pygi> really  gotta run now, sorry :)
<cbx33> *bah* I missed him
<cbx33> ping RichEd 
<juliux> ogra, evening, i know that you have a evo t20 thinclient, how good is this thinclient?
#edubuntu 2006-10-10
<nixternal> let me run this by you all, and i am open to any and all comments
<nixternal> i am the team lead for ubuntu chicago, a local team
<nixternal> we have a guy, 16 or 17, in high school who recently got involved in an incident that was deamed hacking by school officials
<nixternal> he is a good kid, and comes from a very good family, he just let curiousity get a hold of him
<nixternal> i am not one to turn my back on anyone, and he has been suspended for 10 days and possibly worse circumstances could come out of this
<nixternal> his parents and attorney recommend that people who have worked along side him send in emails to the principle highlighting his importance and that he isn't this bad person
<nixternal> just so you know..this alleged hack didn't cause any damage
<nixternal> he was an accessory more than anything as well...they realized there was an admin account on their computer with no password..the used that account, grabbed the same file, and simply cracked it
<nixternal> they didn't use the passwords or anything illegally...but like i said earlier, curiosity caused them to get caught and in trouble...how would you go about helping them out besides backing them from a community standpoint
<nixternal> only reason i ask here, is because of the educational environement, and the intelligence that is sitting in here..thanks! sorry for the spam as well ;)
<LaserJock> heh
<nixternal> ya
<nixternal> the school has ousted him and labeled him a hacker...however we know a hacker is a good thing and the school is ignorant to the true definitions of the word...i feel bad for this kid, but at the same time, i told him to leave it well enough alone
<LaserJock> well, hopefully he learned something from it
<HedgeMage> nixternal: Well, the tack I would take is that this transgression is minor one, the result of a young mind not able to exercise itself to more productive ends, and suggest that he be reprimanded *but* pushed toward something more productive (perhaps an OSS project for school credit or something)
<nixternal> im sure he did...kids these days just don't listen worth a crap...i told him the circumstances involved with something like that
<HedgeMage> nixternal: that's probably the best you can do
<nixternal> ya HedgeMage, and the exact way im thinking about taking
<HedgeMage> however, if he's from the Chicago schoools, don't bother, they don't give a damn.
<nixternal> there are about 20 or so of us that are going to be emailing the dean concerning this
<nixternal> hahah
<HedgeMage> I mean, trying can't hurt I guess, but they don't give a damn
<nixternal> i know they don't
<nixternal> i used to work for them as a contractor
<HedgeMage> nixternal: My mom's a teacher south of Chicago... she often gets victims of the chicago school system
<nixternal> that lasted until they sent me to a neighborhood i sure as heck didn't belong
* HedgeMage nods
<nixternal> heh
<nixternal> your mom doesn't work for York High in Elmhurst by chance ;)
<HedgeMage> Nope, Sandridge School in Lynwood
<nixternal> ok, that is south south
* HedgeMage nods
<sbalneav> Evening all
<RichEd> ping nixternal : got the mail ... thanks ... will respond today
<nixternal> RichEd: cool, thanks!
<juliux> morning
<nixternal> morning juliux!
* RichEd -> taking my son to the physio
<cbx33> ajmitch: ping RichEd 
<cbx33> whoops
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<cbx33> I just had a problem upgrading a 64 bit machine dapper to edgy - X refuses to start
<cbx33> it mumbled about not being able to find any fonts.....but apparently that shouldn't cause the issue
<cbx33> any ideas?
<lucasvo> cbx33: are you sure the update finished without problems?
<lucasvo> cbx33: I had a problem, that one installscript was broken and used a wrong update-fonts-dir command.
<lucasvo> gsfonts-x11
<cbx33> no it finished fine
<lucasvo> strange
<cbx33> if I run startx it works fine
<RichEd> hey cbx33 :)
<cbx33> hi RichEd 
<cbx33> gimme 2 ecs to switch machine
<cbx33> then I have a little something fory ou :p
<juliux> ogra, ping
<ogra> juliux, pong
<juliux> ogra, how good is your evo t20 working?
<juliux> better then the rangee one?
<ogra> didnt try yet, gimme a minute
<juliux> ok
<juliux> there are a lot of cheap evo t20 on ebay at the moment
* cbx33 upgraded to edgy last night
<cbx33> mostly ok, apart from losing the ability to run wine
<cbx33> and losing my dual core proc - but I've sorted that one
<cbx33> my dpkg database is screwed
<cbx33> it thinks wine is installed but it's not
<cbx33> and it has no installation candidate
<cbx33> but anyway....I downloaded the deb, but it still didn't run the program that I needed....so I need to compile from source
<cbx33> that worked last time
* ogra_ waves to juliux from a T20
<juliux> ogra_, great
<ogra_> but it uses vesa and is very slow
<juliux> hm
<ogra_> local devices work though :)
<juliux> the rangee thinclient are also working with vesa, and i want something faster
<bimberi> jono: ping
<ogra_> they have identical video hardware iirc
<jono> bimberi, ping
<bimberi> jono: hi. just wondering if this is ok - http://asdfgh.info/ubuntu/toc.html
<juliux> ogra_, that is bad
<jono> bimberi, cool, where did you get the content?
<bimberi> it's not mine, someone was just asking about it in #ubuntu-au, so i sought out an author :)
<bimberi> he wants to print it off but was worried about copyright/licence breach
<ogra> juliux, i'll try to force the cyrix driver, but i dont expect it to work, lets see
<jono> bimberi, who is it?
<bimberi> jono: siccness was the one asking.  I have no idea who owns the site though.
<juliux> ogra, good luck
<bimberi> D-lined ?
<jono> hey
<jono> bimberi, thanks for the call :)
<bimberi> jono: different server. very sneaky :)
<bimberi> jono: np, 'twas nice to have an excuse...
<jono> heh :)
<cbx33> hey jono 
<jono> hey
<jono> http://www.jonobacon.org/?p=779
<cbx33> hehehe oh dear
* bimberi removes the shining armour
<bimberi> ;p
<cbx33> heheh
* cbx33 awards bimberi with the jono cross medal
<jono> heh
<cbx33> jono: we record the first segment of youth lug radio tomorrow
<cbx33> "How would free software affect education"
<jono> cbx33, cool :)
<cbx33> yeh should be good
<cbx33> what do you record in now?
<cbx33> jokosher?
<willvdl> some teachers in Limpopo where very interested in audacity
<cbx33> yeh?
<willvdl> a quick demo to some teachers of what is possible
<willvdl> they loved it. especially when you speed it up and everyone sounds like a hamster
<cbx33> willvdl: you should show them ardour...heheh with the jog/shuffle wheel
<cbx33> speed up and slow down in real time
<willvdl> oh yeah. We recorded the national anthem, popped it onto a CD and played it back all in a matter of minutes
<willvdl> this doesn't sound too fantastic I'm sure but considering where this school was located, it is quite mind-boggling
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> cool
<sbalneav> Morning all
<Amaranth> morning
<Amaranth> west coast?
<cbx33> anyone ever use pascal on linux?
<cbx33> someone wants to show me some code he wrote
<Amaranth> *shudder*
<cbx33> but I can't get the crt library to work
<sbalneav> Pascal?
<sbalneav> Yeesh.
<sbalneav> What's the code about?
<cbx33> nothing major
<cbx33> crappy little calculator
<cbx33> I finished it
<cbx33> it's ok
<sbalneav> Morning ogra!!!
<ogra> hey
<ogra> afternoon :)
<sbalneav> Evening too!
<ogra> heh, only 4pm :)
<ogra> and i'll do a short day today ... my exhaustion pipe is waiting for more wielding ;)
<sbalneav> Things dropping down to a more sane level?
<ogra> yeah
<sbalneav> Hey, that one person on ubuntu-devel, the RDSP thing, he needs to specify acpi=off on the boot, but I can't remember how to specify boot commands on the command line for the live cd.
<ogra> now that the solar thingie is done (plumbing finished yesterday) ... i can finally play with all these new tools for the car ;)
<sbalneav> You got a pointer to that, so I can reply to him?
<ogra> no, but i think you just hit F6
<ogra> and append acpi=off there
<ogra> then hit enter ;)
* ogra spent most of the day trying to find the reason for https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/65003
<ogra> nasty bug ... seems its caused by an asian locale setting 
<ogra> but the guy behind the bug is very intresting, he does exciting ldap7kerberos/AD setups
<ogra> *ldap/kerberos/AD
<sbalneav> Exciting? :)
<ogra> yeah, he offers a ltsp/ldap/kerberos/freebsd setup on a preconfigured iso
<ogra> the host is freebsd ... the clients have a linux chroot
<ogra> sbalneav, do you know if jammcq made his final decision where we'll have BTS now ?
<ogra> sbalneav, also, i added a new default lts.conf and lts-parameters.txt to the ltsp-client package, they get installed in /usr/share/doc/ltsp-client/examples in the chroot
<ogra> i'll try to keep the lts-parameters.txt file up to date
<sbalneav> Cool, I'm working on the manuals.
<sbalneav> I think he's leaning towards San-Fransisco.  The nice thing is with that, we'll go there thursday night, spend Friday and Saturday hacking, then just pile in a car and drive down to Mountain view (2 hour drive) on Sunday.
<sbalneav> So, I think it should be cool.
<ogra> sounds great 
<ogra> but he should make up his mind soon, i need to book my flights :)
<sbalneav> Ping him in #ltsp
<sbalneav> I think he's working on it today.
<sbalneav> brb, reboot required after package update
<sbalneav> Back again
<Petaris> Hi all
<Petaris> ogra: Has there been any progress with the network authentication bits?
<ogra> ajmitch was working on it, i dont think he finished, but ask him in -devel
<ogra> i plan to attack the server side in edgy+1 though
<Petaris> ok
<Petaris> I have issues on and off with the sadms route
<Petaris> I will ask over it -devel but he is rarely there when I am
<ogra> he is in .nz timezone ...
<Petaris> yeah, I know
<Petaris> That is why he is rarely there when I am
<Petaris> I'm also have odd issues with my users home dir mounts
<Petaris> I am using LinNeighborhood for each user, but I am going to try to see if I can use Services for Unix to push an NFS share from the win2k server
<Petaris> that might fix the issue
<lucasvo> can anyone suggest a good ide for pytho & webdevelopment?
<sbalneav> lucasvo: errrm... terminal + vi? :)
<lucasvo> sbalneav: yes, I am currently using this setup, but I don't know if there is anything better
<ogra> if you like vi, use pida
<sbalneav> pida?
<ogra> apt-cache show pida
<Petaris> lucasvo, I use jEdit for all my webdev stuff
<Petaris> http://www.jedit.org/
<sbalneav> cool
<highvoltage> wow, pida is nice
* highvoltage wonders why he hasn't seen it before
<lucasvo> sbalneav: you see, the question was worth asking :)
<Petaris> ogra: to your knowladge has anyone ever tried to authenticat via an nis server running on a win2k server?
<Petaris> the NIS server is supplied with Services for Unix
<sbalneav> lucasvo: Oh, sure, it's worth asking, I was simply telling you what *I* use :)
* sbalneav used to work on Unix before X was widespread.
<sbalneav> I've been a Unix user since 1984
<lucasvo> sbalneav: my first days on unix, it was over an ssh shell...
<lucasvo> so also cli only
<lucasvo> pida looks awesome
<ogra> note that pida wasnt really ready when i tried it out ast the beginning of dapper ... but thats some time ago
<highvoltage> sbalneav: wow
<sbalneav> highvoltage: I told you this story in France, didn't I?
<highvoltage> sbalneav: you gave me a lot of history, but I can't remember that part
<sbalneav> Heck, when I started using the internet, they'd JUST stopped using FTP for mail transfer, as SMTP had just been developed the year before.
<sbalneav> I'm 38 years old, and an internet methusela already.
<highvoltage> sbalneav: I don't think you actually gave me much history about yourself, only from when you started working at legalaid
<sbalneav> Started using unix in High School. :)
<sbalneav> Meh, I'm pretty boring :)
<highvoltage> ftp for mail transfer? lol
<sbalneav> Heck, I still remember UUCP mail and bangpaths
<highvoltage> sbalneav: we still use uucp in tuxlabs :)
<sbalneav> For anyone else interested:
<sbalneav> http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/B/bang-path.html
* highvoltage looks
<sbalneav> You know why ! is called a bang, right?
<sbalneav> on old IBM card punches, coding a ! actually punched out all the holes for the row.  Producing the loudest noise.
<lucasvo> how can I print out an object of a multivaluedict?
<sbalneav> lucasvo: What, they key has a list as a value?
<lucasvo> also wenn ich eifach print request.POST mach chunnt: <MultiValueDict: {'{"params":[2] ,"method":"delete", "id":"1"}':[''] }
<lucasvo> sbalneav: ^- this is the dictionary
<lucasvo> now, I'd like to make something like if(method=="delete") 
<bddebian> Howdy folks
<lucasvo> hi bddebian 
<bddebian> Hello lucasvo
<tomveens> hello
<sbalneav> lucasvo: Well, for dicts, maybe an .iterkeys() and format from that?
<LaserJock> sbalneav: interesting programming history there :-)
<sbalneav> :)
<LaserJock> I think my boss used punch cards early in his academic career
<LaserJock> I got into computers when the 5" floppies were going out of style :/
<LaserJock> RichEd: you still awake?
<cbx33> ping RichEd 
<cbx33> ping ogra dude !
<cbx33> HedgeMage, 
<cbx33> w00t
<cbx33> HedgeMage, I just submitted something to the handbook
<cbx33> did you manage to find the blurb stuff yet?
<cbx33> Amaranth, did I see you're involved with beryl mirrors?
<Amaranth> nope
<Amaranth> i used to make daily snapshot packages
<cbx33> oh np
<cbx33> ahhh
<HedgeMage> cbx33: just got an email from lisa, and I'm editing now and about to send it off :)
<cbx33> nice
<cbx33> check out the SCP docs when you get a sec
<Amaranth> btw, no school for the rest of the week
<Amaranth> yay
<Amaranth> going to spend some time mellowing out today, tomorrow is coding time :)
<cbx33> willow?
<Amaranth> hopefully
<cbx33> w00t
<lucasvo> ogra: can I ask you something about pida?
<lucasvo> ogra: how can I edit the todos?
<cbx33> hey grahamldlw 
<grahamldlw> heyy
<cbx33> it's pete here ;)
<cbx33> so you finally made it
<grahamldlw> i guessed
<grahamldlw> yeh but as soon as i turn this off i gotta do it all over again
<cbx33> yup
<grahamldlw> it's good practive fro the sudo apt-get install etc
<cbx33> but now you know what you gotta go
<cbx33> indeed
<grahamldlw> yep i certainly do and thinking of that i shud have wrote it down lol
<cbx33> well this channel is where all the people who are involved in edubuntu hang out
<grahamldlw> educational unbuntu?
<cbx33> yup
<grahamldlw> can u talk me thru this install thing if i get up the install thing
<grahamldlw> technical termology u see
<cbx33> eh?
<cbx33> install thing?
<grahamldlw> to acctually install it permanently
<cbx33> ahh....
<grahamldlw> i got 7 gb free and regardless of what i delete i cant find anythin more to get rid of
<cbx33> well....what we could do is install it tomorrow so you can see how to do it
<cbx33> heeh
<grahamldlw> i have 30 gigabytes worth of stuff somewhere not doing anything not rele being used?
<cbx33> right
<grahamldlw> umm i get all of it apart from the partition thing
<cbx33> well you gotta find that out first :p
<grahamldlw> might be a key time to wipe all and start again, which i wud be inclined to do if i didnt have such important documents on here, and if i didnt have so much work set each day
<cbx33> well....back them up
<grahamldlw> im gonna stick them on that little hard drive thing i had/mp3 player
<grahamldlw> as soon as i get them i can delete all, i just dont wanna like wipe windows tho
<grahamldlw> or delete somethin i shudent, like last time wen i needed a new pc
<cbx33> ok...
<grahamldlw> it's just reading the disks
<grahamldlw> it has like 3 different types of file system
<cbx33> ok....right
<cbx33> we'll have to talk about this tomorrow
<grahamldlw> ok
<cbx33> I'm not gonna have time to go through it all now
<cbx33> infact it'll make a good section on youth lug radio
<grahamldlw> lol
<grahamldlw> how long u been doin that for?
<grahamldlw> i wasnt even informed
<cbx33> well
<cbx33> it's the first recording session tomorrow
<cbx33> hang on
<grahamldlw> ok?
<cbx33> ian hadaway is coming in
<grahamldlw> how do you know that?
<cbx33> I'm just talking to him
<grahamldlw> ohh
<cbx33> he should be joining
<grahamldlw> ok
<cbx33> grahamldlw, join #youth-lug too
<cbx33> hey Sonofaq 
<Sonofaq> hiya
<cbx33> grahamldlw, is trying to install ubuntu :p
<Sonofaq> lol
<cbx33> Sonofaq, you #youth-lug
<cbx33> join even
<cbx33> :p
<Sonofaq> is there a channel now
<cbx33> well not offocicial yet
<cbx33> but join it
<cbx33> :p
<Sonofaq> cool
<LaserJock> cbx33: sounding a little "cave man" there
<cbx33> LaserJock, who me?
<Sonofaq> hehe
<LaserJock> cbx33: "You.. #youth-lug ... join ... now"
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> or I'll club you with a bat 
<LaserJock> cbx33: "Me... Pete"
<cbx33> :p
<grahamldlw> ubuntu is very confusing :(
<LaserJock> grahamldlw: it is?
<grahamldlw> yep!
<grahamldlw> to me anyway!
<grahamldlw> i've never used nor seen any type of linux/ubuntu, and only just started programming :D
<LaserJock> what part?
<grahamldlw> installing!
<LaserJock> ahyes installing can be fun
<grahamldlw> fun? FUN!!!! it took me an hour to get this irc thing working with help from cbx33
<LaserJock> depending on your hardware, installing can be very quick and painless.... or not :/
<LaserJock> I'm sorry you are having a struggle with it :(
<grahamldlw> for a start i only have 5-6 GB of free space avaliable because i cant find where my windwos portion of the hardrive is eating it
<grahamldlw> secondly, which is a new one, my cpu is almost always running at 100% capacity, whereas b4 i cud have any number of thigns open and it wudent go above 10%
<keltorsori> hello
<keltorsori> anyone out there today?
<tomveens> hello
<keltorsori> i may have found a bug in the Edgy LTSP implementation, need to figure out who to contact
<keltorsori> (edubuntu and xubuntu flavors)
<LaserJock> keltorsori: you can report the bug on Launchpad
<keltorsori> will do
<keltorsori> it's a bug that was reported in the Xubuntu distro last cycle (6.06) and was listed as fixed
<LaserJock> ogra is the one that will look at it
<keltorsori> basically on all machines I'm trying to install Knot 3 or Beta (or even new dailies), install is failing at Build chroot (gets to 50%, grinds away and fails)
<ogra> hmm, beta should work ... 
<keltorsori> any ideas where I could find my logs (if there are any) that might tell me or anyone exactly whats failing?
<keltorsori> just d/l'd it again, tried on 3 different systems (all very recent)
<ogra> file it against ltsp and attach /var/log/installer/syslog (make it world readable first)
<ogra> you can also immediately look on console4 if the error shows up
<ogra> (alt-F4)
<keltorsori> i'll do that now
<ogra> thanks
<cyberhell86> hello i gotta question....
<keltorsori> btw, looks like another person was having the same issue with 6.06.1 ed: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-users/2006-September/000300.html
<keltorsori> although 6.06.1 installs fine for me (just no edgy releases)
<cyberhell86> i gotta question.. i don't wanna risk my Windows.. so i want to install ubuntu on my ipod do u think it's a good idea? because i'm running it from the cd and it's really slow :S
<keltorsori> booting from USB on pc's never a great idea
<ogra> keltorsori, try to use another videomode during install (select with F4 at the Cd bootscreen iirc)
<keltorsori> i'll try that as well (d/l'ing a new iso right now i tossed the other ones)
<cyberhell86> uhmmm.. but i just got a gateway laptop do u think i'm gonna have any problem with the drivers?
<keltorsori> shouldn't, but i'd run the chipset through google and see what's supported
<keltorsori> wireless is always the sticky problem
<ogra> cyberhell86, try it with the liveCD :) its identical to the installed system
<keltorsori> even better idea :)
<ogra> so if your HW works there, it will work as well with the install
<keltorsori> ogra, do you know how the xubuntu guys are integrating LTSP? is it basically the same as edubuntu or are they rolling their own?
<cyberhell86> uhmm.. yes it works... i have the same problem of the wireless... but another problem.. is that i use my cellphone to get on internet.. :S so i don't know if i'm gonna be able to do the same thing with ubuntu
<keltorsori> cyberhell86: some people have been successful with phone as modem
<keltorsori> hold a sec and i'll pull the discussion
<ogra> keltorsori, its both identical ... the installer bit is a part of ltsp not of xubuntu or edubuntu
<keltorsori> cyberhell86: here's file usage http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=75978&highlight=bluetooth
<keltorsori> and dialup: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BluetoothDialup
#edubuntu 2006-10-11
<keltorsori> cyberhell86: also, do you know the exact chipset or model of your integrated wireless (or your Gateway laptop model name/number)?
<cyberhell86> yes... give me a sec.. and i'll give it to you
<cyberhell86> how can i see the model of my wireless :$ sorry for the question.. :(
<keltorsori> just gimme the model name/number of your laptop and we can find out
<cyberhell86> ok.. it's 7330gz
<keltorsori> looks like its a broadcom card
<cyberhell86> yes.. :S
<keltorsori> tried ndiswrapper yet?
<keltorsori> cyberhell86: try this: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=185174&highlight=broadcom
<cyberhell86> not yet.. cuz i read the manual.. but i don't know how to use it..
<keltorsori> cyberhell86: gotta go get some margaritas. good luck. see you later
<cyberhell86> heheh thanks
<cbx33> hey ho
<cbx33> how do I go about getting a channel registered
<keltorsori> ogra, you around?
<keltorsori> anyone else here had problems with ltsp-client-builder
<keltorsori> ?
<keltorsori> ogra
<keltorsori> filed a bug for ltsp-client-builder
<cbx33> booooooooo
* nixternal runs scared
<cbx33> awwww
<nixternal> haha
<nixternal> HedgeMage: im a little slow, breakdown the current svn layout for the handbook?  I want to look over some of the stuff and maybe come up with some additions
* HedgeMage hears her name and looks up
<HedgeMage> nixternal: Each chapter is its own docbook file.  filenames ending in .old are copied from the old cookbook and need to be updated and renamed to the same thing but without the .old at the end
<nixternal> rock on!
<HedgeMage> :)
<HedgeMage> did I remember to set you up with an SVN account yet?  The last couple of weeks are a blur...
<nixternal> now that i know that, i can rock and roll a little bit...working 3 documentation, no make the 4 documentation projects
<nixternal> heh, i don't know if you did or not..didn't receive anything actually
<HedgeMage> let me go check then
<nixternal> no rush..im about to head to bed anyways, thanks though
<HedgeMage> nixternal: see /msg
<RichEd> hi HedgeMage nixternal 
<nixternal> hiya RichEd!
<RichEd> nixternal: did you see my message yesterday about the alleged hacker and my offer of possibly helping with a "supervised / mentored project" ?
<nixternal> no i didn't
<nixternal> i think Ubuntu Chicago helped him out a little bit, as it seems he will just get stuck with a suspension, and could possibly work it off his school background
<RichEd> well give it some thought ... if you think it will help his situation ... either personally or with the authorities
<HedgeMage> hi RichEd 
<nixternal> RichEd: i will definitely pass on your info, as you were actually a person I was looking forward for a response...but HedgeMage also had a good idea and we presented it as well...his acts weren't all that bad, of course he did something stupid being curious..but now the school knows the difference between hacking and cracking
<HedgeMage> RichEd: I basically made the point that because Chicago public schools purposely slow down bright kids and allow them to learn less, he has no outlet and should be redirected to something productive like a FLOSS project
<HedgeMage> RichEd: read /msg when you have a chance ;)
<HedgeMage> wb RichEd-1 
<RichEd-1> :)
<HedgeMage> RichEd: get my /msg before you lost your connection?
<RichEd> nope just the 1st docbook message a few hours back
<HedgeMage> ahh okay, you missed one then
<nixternal> HedgeMage: svn worked...the reason the xml doesn't validate is due to the current structure...i will work up something to show you..i believe there is a meeting today..13:00 my time...so i will work on something to show tomorrow hopefully
<RichEd> got it now :)
<nixternal> g'nite everyone!
<HedgeMage> nixternal: you totally rock
<RichEd> bye nix
* HedgeMage hugs nixternal again
<nixternal> no, Sammy Hagar totally rocks! ;)
<HedgeMage> RichEd: get my resend in /msg ?
<RichEd> hey bimberi :)
<cbx33> ping RichEd 
<RichEd> hi cbx33 
<jsgotangco> howdy
<RichEd> pardner
<bimberi> hey RichEd (3 hours later) and jsgotangco
<cbx33> heh
<jsgotangco> hey RichEd, cbx33
<RichEd> bimberi ... thought you were asleep :) is it already tomorrow where you are ?
<cbx33> i have no...."letter after o key" :(
<cbx33> hrases like hello eole look so stuid
<jsgotangco> wha?
<bimberi> RichEd: nope ... it was just the start of "happy hour" here dinner, bathing kids, putting to bed ... i'm sure you know what it's like
<RichEd> oh cra cbx33 that must be retty athetic and ainful
<cbx33> :(
<RichEd> bimberi :) sure do
<cbx33> sto taking to iss
<cbx33> s/to/the heh
<bimberi> :)
<cbx33> I have 0 s"lao"are keyboards left
* bimberi hands cbx33 a p to copy/paste ;)
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> thanky
<cbx33> pppp
<cbx33> it's back w00t
<jsgotangco> muahahahah it works
<jsgotangco> RichEd: my ultimate edubuntu killer app for PH now works bwahahhaa
<RichEd> well done :)
<RichEd> does it make edubuntu a killer or is it a killer of edubuntu ?
<jsgotangco> wahahaha
<RichEd> send details :)
<jsgotangco> well it does make our project useful
<jsgotangco> yeah i'll just package it this week
<jsgotangco> at least i have something working
<jsgotangco> will send the doc this week promise
<jsgotangco> if this proves to be successful at work, there goes my time for edubuntu/ubuntu :(
<jonathan1> hey jsgotangco and RichEd 
<jonathan1> jsgotangco: I love it when stuff works :)
<jsgotangco> jonathan1: hey dude how's it going?
<jsgotangco> jonathan1: well its basically a code mash up
<RichEd> hello highjonathan :)
<jonathan1> jsgotangco: going well thanks. everytime I just get the hang of workload it gets more though :)
<jsgotangco> same here
<jonathan1> jsgotangco: but it's going better by the week
<RichEd> back in a bit
<jsgotangco> im going to try and run python now in my phone
<jsgotangco> muhahhaa
<jonathan1> in situations like this you grow a lot, I'm very happy to be in the position I'm in. I look at shock at people who say that they are bored. I never have that luxury :)
<jonathan1> wow
<jsgotangco> jonathan1: its very possible ;)
<jsgotangco> wahaha python 2.2.2
<jsgotangco> AWESOME
* RichEd rebooting - biab
<sbalneav> Morning all
<RichEd> hi sbalneav 
<juliux> hi RichEd 
<sbalneav> Morning RichEd
<RichEd> juliux :)
<juliux> RichEd, we made pictures last weekend of the ubuntu/edubuntu booth in dresden;)
<juliux> hi cbx33 
<cbx33> hey
<RichEd> Great juliux : I have a bare bones drupal site set up to play in - kindly by cbx33 : can you mail me the pics and short summary that I can use as a test news story ?
<juliux> RichEd, sure
<cbx33> :D
<cbx33> RichEd: think that YouthLug radio (where we tend to talk only about ubuntu) would be something for the news page - seeing as it's done by kids?
<RichEd> cbx33: of course - we need news for adults & kids from adults & kids
<jsgotangco> talk only about ubuntu?
<jsgotangco> *gasp*
<bddebian> Howdy
<juliux> hi bddebian 
<cyberhell86> hey! do you know how i can make a dial-up connection with ubuntu.... but i mean I want to use my cellphone.... :S
<bddebian> Hello juliux
<jsgotangco> cyberhell86: that's pretty tricky
<cyberhell86> but i have to try cuz that's the only way i can use internet :S i don't have adsl at home :S
<cyberhell86> ok.. then can u tell me where i can get a software.. to play dvds, divx and mp3 on ubuntu?
<ricanelite> Does anyone here know about Wine? or .jnlp files>
<RichEd> cyberhell86: http://easyubuntu.freecontrib.org/
<RichEd> cyberhell86: you can check about cell connections with willvdl when you see him around ... he uses 3G from his notebok.
<RichEd> ricanelite: ask in #ubuntu ... that topic is not educaton specific and more people may be around to help
<cyberhell86> ok! thanks
* RichEd -> out for dinner with visting relatives - back for meeting in 4 hours
<sbalneav> Hmmm, I've posted 2 or 3 emails to the edubuntu-devel list, and they never seem to get through.  Wonder what I'm doing wrong.
<sbalneav> ogra: Hey, I've got a Pentium 4 here with hyperthreading.  In the past, I've always installed a smp kernel, which makes /proc/cpuinfo show two processors.  Now, linux-image-generic seems to be the only installable option.  How does one get an smp kernel?  Write to something in /sys?
<Amaranth> sbalneav: generic is SMP but hyperthreading is disabled by default because it's a security problem
<Amaranth> sbalneav: put ht=on in your grub kernel line and it'll work (i think that's what you put)
<aladds> is it possible to set up an edubuntu login server which all clients log onto without netbooting?
<sbalneav> Amaranth: Thx, but ht is a security problem?!
<sbalneav> aladds: Umm, how do you mean?
<Amaranth> sbalneav: Really only on servers (or other systems where multiple users are logged in at once)
<Amaranth> as far as i know anyway
<sbalneav> huh!
* sbalneav googles
<aladds> well, have each computer run locally, but also allow users to log into their profiles on the server from any computer
<aladds> if that makes sense
<sbalneav> aladds: Are you just looking to share files?  Or do you want the processes to actually RUN on the other server?
<aladds> nah, run processes locally, to reduce server load, but people log into their account on the server from the client
<aladds> does that make sense?
<sbalneav> Probably the best bet would be to set up network authentication via LDAP, and simply share the /home dir out via nfs.
<lucasvo> aladds: that's not the purpose of ltsp. but ldap/nfs or samba are tools allowing this
<aladds> aaaaaaaaaah
<aladds> ok
<sbalneav> That way, anyone can log in on any box, and get their home dir.
<aladds> ldap
<aladds> yeah
<aladds> i didnt know that
<lucasvo> it's great
<aladds> i know windows clients can do it via samba, but i dont want to use windows clients
<lucasvo> aladds: there are some very good openldap tutorials out there
<aladds> :)
<aladds> thanks
<nixternal> hrmm..
<nixternal> HedgeMage: ok, directory structure on the svn could be an issue. are you ok with setting it up like this
<nixternal> root directory
<nixternal> build/ libs/ images/ handbook/
<nixternal> build is an empty directory that would only be filled when HTML and PDF is built via a Makefile
<nixternal> images is for images ;)
<nixternal> libs/ would hold the entity files, xsl templates, and css files
<HedgeMage> nixternal: Yes, go for it.  What we had is made from what was auto-generated from the wiki when we were working there.
<nixternal> handbook/ would be all of hte handbook XML files
<HedgeMage> nixternal: I bow to your expertise in the matter :)
<nixternal> ok..i will hack the structure, setup a Makefile, and then work on a validation script
* HedgeMage smooches nixternal 
<HedgeMage> you totally rock
<nixternal> woohoo!
<nixternal> ;)
<HedgeMage> You have no idea how much you have lowered my stress level this week.
<HedgeMage> Seriously, this has been looming over me for weeks, and I just didn't have time to site down and learn docbook well enough to fix this awful tangle.
<nixternal> hehe, no problem...the validation will come with time, but at least their will be a workable structure
<HedgeMage> :)
<HedgeMage> hi highvoltage 
<highvoltage> Hi HedgeMage
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: do you live somewhere in the desert now?
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: Nope, I'm in Washington State... how come?
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: I don't know, for some reason I had the idea that you moved to some desert, but I couldn't figure out where I got that idea from, so I thought I'd check :)
<HedgeMage> hehe
<HedgeMage> No desert here :)
<highvoltage> :)
<cyberhell86> does somebody has a diulp conexion? 
<cyberhell86> *dial up
* aladds has shitty ADSL, it's about as fast :P
<HedgeMage> cyberhell86: not I, but I've worked with linux and dialup before, so if you need help, let me know :)
<cyberhell86> thanks.. this is my problem... I dont have adsl..so i need to use my cellphone to get online.. 
* HedgeMage nods
<aladds> eek
<HedgeMage> How does the cellphone interface with the computer?
<cyberhell86> so.. i'm trying to creat a dial up.. but i don't know how to do it.. cuz it doesn't even recognize the cellphone modem :S
<cyberhell86> i'm sure it recognize it... because.. the cellphone starts charging.. so that mean that there link is ok.. because.. when i plug it on a pc without the drivers... it doesn't even charge
<HedgeMage> cyberhell86: does it connect by USB?  Serial port? ethernet? give me a clue here...
<cyberhell86> usb
<highvoltage> cyberhell86: which phone
<cyberhell86> motorola v360 it's a gprs one
<highvoltage> cyberhell86: you should be able to do a 'sudo wvdialconf /etc/wvdial.conf'
<highvoltage> then edit /etc/wvdial.conf with the phone numbers, etc.
* HedgeMage bows to highvoltage's superior cellphone experience.
<highvoltage> I've used a V360 many times to connect to the Internet in linux
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: :)
<HedgeMage> cool :)
<cyberhell86> really!!! :D pls pls explain me.. i'm gonna try the 'sudo  wvdialconf /etc/wvdial.conf' now.. to se if it works
<highvoltage> cyberhell86: when you edit wvdial.conf, the phone number should usually be *99#, and the password and username must be equal to ''
<highvoltage> cyberhell86: ok
<cyberhell86> but uhmm.. can i edit it if i'm running the ubuntu with the livecd? :S
<highvoltage> cyberhell86: what's really cool is, the V360 supports EDGE, so if your network supports EDGE, it's about 4 times the speed than usual GPRS :)
<highvoltage> cyberhell86: yes, you can edit it
<highvoltage> cyberhell86: but your changes will be lost when you reboot
<cyberhell86> really.... my network supports edge..  :D i hope it gets faster...
<cyberhell86> ok.. i just wanna be sure.. to be able to make the dial up connection... then i will completely move from windows to ubuntu
<cyberhell86> my other question is the audio problem :S
<HedgeMage> cyberhell86: what problem are you having?
<HedgeMage> no audio at all?
<HedgeMage> (And if soo, what sound card/chipset is involved?)
<cyberhell86> uhmm.. good question... i got a gateway laptop :S 7330 gz :S
<cyberhell86> let me see fot eh audio chip.. give me a sec
<cyberhell86> i'm tryin to make the 'sudo wvdialconf /etc/wvdial.conf' but i get  command not found :S
<cyberhell86> :(
<highvoltage> cyberhell86: I think wvdial might not be on the live cd :/
<cyberhell86> shit! :S
<cyberhell86> ok.. then i'll try to fix it later... then can u tell me how to fix the sound problem.. cuz i don't have any audio at all :s
<cyberhell86> do u think i can instal ubuntun on a 3gb partition/
<cyberhell86> ?
<highvoltage> cyberhell86: yep, 3GB is enough
<HedgeMage> cyberhell86: that is plenty of space
<highvoltage> you won't have much space for data, but it's certainly enough space to play around in.
<cyberhell86> ok.. i'm gonna try.....
<HedgeMage> cyberhell86: as long as you don't have tons of photos or other data
<HedgeMage> yay :)
<cyberhell86> i'll us an external hd for data :D does linux reads fat32?
<HedgeMage> cyberhell86: it can.
<cyberhell86> uff :D ok.... after installing it.. I just need to make the sudo 'wvdialconf /etc/wvdial.conf'? right?
<LaserJock> hmm, are we still on for an edubuntu meeting today?
<nixternal> hiya LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi nixternal 
<nixternal> i just started setting up the Handbook svn...just committed a huge chunk, with the same dir structure we are used to with docs currently
<LaserJock> nixternal: you're doing it in the Doc Team repo?
<nixternal> ? fonts <- i cannot get this bugger to add
<nixternal> no LaserJock, they have their own repo
<nixternal> i don't know the entire situation with the ubuntu svn repo and the edubuntu handbook repo..they were kept seperate either for a reason, or it never got added to our repos
<HedgeMage> We were supposed to start committing stuff from our repo to theirs so eventually more docteam members would have docteam repo commit access...
<HedgeMage> ...but I put off doing that since our docbook was so totally borked it is emarrassing.
<highvoltage> cyberhell86: once you've finished with the wvdialconf, you'll be able to dial up using the 'wvdial' command
<highvoltage> LaserJock: yes, edubuntu meeting is on agaik
<highvoltage> RichEd won't be able to make it, he has sent apologies.
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> I'm not sure if I'll be there for all of it
<LaserJock> my boss and I are making a little video of the lab today
<LaserJock> as we are having a Chemistry Open House
<highvoltage> I think it's basically going to be ogra giving a tech update. I don't think it's going to be a long or even complicated meeting.
<pygi> hello everyone
<cyberhell86> how do i use it? :$ sorry i'm just a beginner :(
<highvoltage> hello mr pygi 
<HedgeMage> hi pygi :)
<LaserJock> we should start a list of "Specs we want to see" soon
<pygi> ergh, /me doesn't like the sound of spec anymore :(
<HedgeMage> cyberhell86: does it connect by USB?
<highvoltage> cyberhell86: no problem. once you've edited wvdial.conf all you need to type is wvdial to dial up. when you're done with the connection, you press ctrl+c and it will hang up again
<LaserJock> HedgeMage: don't worry about borked docbook, nobody will mind too much ;-)
<HedgeMage> oh sorry thought you meant the hd
<HedgeMage> LaserJock: nixternal is unborking it for us :)
<cyberhell86> yes it's an usb one... :D ok thanks
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: most of the new Motorola phones have a standard USB port, that you use to charge the phone, use as a mass storage device, Internet, and for headsets / external speakers :)
<highvoltage> it's quite cool.
<nixternal> sorry
<nixternal> i was responding to my angry blog readers ;)
<nixternal> haha
<HedgeMage> highvhehe
<HedgeMage> grrr
<HedgeMage> sorry, TT is "helping" me type :)
<nixternal> jeesh...everything is going on right now
<nixternal> hahaha..GO TT!!!!
<nixternal> LaserJock: what is your view on the current Handbook and svn thing?  If we move it to Ubuntu docs, you and I are the only ones with current access to the svn server
<nixternal> however, if we keep it where it is currently, then we need to follow the ubuntu doc repo structure, just in case it moves
<nixternal> im making myself all kinds of work ;)
<HedgeMage> hehe
<HedgeMage> nixternal: the hope is to eventually get it into the main doc repo
<HedgeMage> nixternal: the current repo is a stopgap measure
<nixternal> ok..then i need to do some structure tweaking..not much though
<LaserJock> nixternal: I think we need to get it into the doc team repo
* nixternal puts on the brakes
<sbalneav> There a meeting going on in #ubuntu-meeting?
<nixternal> 10 minutes i believe sbalneav
<LaserJock> at least so HedgeMage and pygi can become doc team members :-)
<sbalneav> Coolio
<nixternal> im not even a doc team member
<nixternal> nobody wants me
<pygi> sbalneav, ping? :)
<LaserJock> nixternal: whatever, talk with mdke about that
<nixternal> lol
<sbalneav> pygi: pong
<sbalneav> Saw your mail.
<pygi> sbalneav, you got my mail?
<pygi> oki :'(
<sbalneav> Any change in the situation?
<HedgeMage> LaserJock: I'm already a doc team member, I just don't have SVN access.
<pygi> sbalneav, no, not really :(
<pygi> HedgeMage, you are just edubuntu doc member, same as me :)
<willvdl> evening all
<HedgeMage> pygi: really? then I've lost my mind.
<pygi> hey willvdl 
<HedgeMage> (not surprising, really)
<pygi> sbalneav, I'm very very very very sad :(
<nixternal> edubuntu teams have the cool icons in launchpad i have noticed
<LaserJock> darn, no lunch for me
<sbalneav> pygi: No worries, we can chit chat during the thing via irc. :)
<HedgeMage> pygi, LaserJock: Ahh, I found it... I'm a member of Ubuntu WikiTeam, which is a member of Docteam... not really the same thing
<HedgeMage> lol nixternal 
<highvoltage> evenin' willvdl 
<willvdl> hey!
<nixternal> argh, i have to much computer stuff here...2 keyboards and 2 mice, i tend to get lost
<willvdl> if you were an octopus god, you could probably pull it off
<grahamldlw> hey everyone
<grahamldlw> i fixed my problem about not being able to install linux! i accidentally deleted windows and now it works :D
<pygi> sbalneav, perhaps, but I feel very bad
<pygi> especially 'cause ogra will eat me :(
<rodarvus> there was no advance saying on #edubuntu this time, but we have an Edubuntu meeting in two minutes :)
<highvoltage> hey grahamldlw 
<rodarvus> ogra, RichEd: are you online?] 
<grahamldlw> hi!
<cbx33> hey
<ogra> rodarvus, sure
<willvdl> woot
<rodarvus> hooray!
<grahamldlw> oh pete i fixed my ubuntu problem :D
<cbx33> nice ;)
<cbx33> meeting tonight ?
<grahamldlw> i accidentally deleted windows and now it works :D
<sbalneav> Hey ogra!
<cbx33> grahamldlw: hahah !
<rodarvus> dang, phone call. I'll be right back
<cbx33> for the better...you'd better have made that backup
<grahamldlw> formatted completly and i forget to back up :(
<pygi> cbx33, please  auth yourself, thanks :)
<highvoltage> hey cbx33 
<grahamldlw> 7 yrs of work gone :(
<cbx33> pygi: done
<cbx33> hi highvoltage 
<grahamldlw> it had an UNDO button!!! it lied!
<highvoltage> grahamldlw: one word: backups :)
<cbx33> grahamldlw: well....Idid TELL you to make a backup
<grahamldlw> i know and i was thinking about it, but it was too much effort to get from ubuntu to windows and back
<grahamldlw> least i dont have to make that journey now :D
<ogra> sooo
<grahamldlw> ever..
<cbx33> well.....I guess it made that choice for you
<ogra> lets start i'd say 
<highvoltage> hey ogra 
<cbx33> ogra: sounds good
<highvoltage> yay!
<nixternal> who is buying lunch?
<nixternal> i forgot to eat
* ogra looks for RichEd 
<grahamldlw> i need windows tho, im hoping my restore section thats there will let me do it, but i cant get to it
<cbx33> grahamldlw: if you're interested.....join #ubuntu-meeting....
<HedgeMage> nixternal: /msg?
<cbx33> we're having our weekly meeting
<LaserJock> RichEd: is not going to make it, dinner with in-laws
<ogra> ah, k
<cbx33> argh...I needed to speak to him too
<nixternal> can you /msg me a cheeseburger HedgeMage ;)
<cbx33> hey LaserJock 
<LaserJock> hi cbx33 
<pygi> hello ogra :'(
<HedgeMage> nixternal: Food Transfer Protocol?
<LaserJock> hehe
<nixternal> ooh i like that
<cbx33> FFTP
<cbx33> Fast Food Transfer Protocol
<nixternal> i need to blog that before Mako gets a hold of it ;)
<cbx33> 5Cb/s
<cbx33> 5 Cheese Burgers per second
<ogra> well, not much from the tech side today, i fixed up syslogging, so the thin clients log to the servers logfiles, and extra for highvoltage ....
<HedgeMage> rofl
<ogra> i added the IP to ldm's bottom bar ;)
<cbx33> ogra: here....? - or in #ubuntumeeting :p
<pips1> hey ogra, you are talking in the wrong channel :)
<ogra> yay
<highvoltage> ogra: ooh :)
<grahamldlw> cbx33: i still have my recovery portion of the partition on it, if i can system restore or get to that recovery part, can that undo a formatting?
<ogra> fun, sorry
<highvoltage> hehe
<rodarvus> back
<cbx33> grahamldlw: yes, but you won;t get your data back !
<gnomefreak> ogra: did you ever get around to uploading the screensaver fix on webcollage and the other one (cant think of other one that was reported)
<grahamldlw> damn! i had irreplacable information and pictures on there!, oook just as well i got my back up system sorted on this one now tho, i still need to get windows back on here somehow tho
<cbx33> grahamldlw: well.....it is easier to install windows first then ubuntu
<grahamldlw> i gathered that but i changed the whole of the partitions system file type from ntfs to fat32
<cbx33> you can't convert back
<grahamldlw> cuz it wudent let me resize ntsf
<cbx33> oh
<cbx33> hmmm....
<cbx33> I thought it did convert ntfs ok?
<grahamldlw> thats why it came up with that error again and again
<cbx33> i mean resize
<grahamldlw> no it dosent let u resize
<grahamldlw> only shrink or grow
<grahamldlw> but it says it wont let u resize or move
<cbx33> ah....well you can resize and ntfs partition
<grahamldlw> theres a lil box u can get up which tells u which one can
<cbx33> using a utility called ntfsresize
<grahamldlw> bit late....
<grahamldlw> u wernt on so i did it anyway
<cbx33> but that doesn't come by default cos it is a _little_ risky
<grahamldlw> i told u i needed supervision
<grahamldlw> this is the second time i broke my pc
<cbx33> heheh
<grahamldlw> at least i got 33.5gb of space for ubuntu atm lol
<cbx33> nice
<grahamldlw> im gonna have to get windows back on it soon, any programs and stuff u think i shud get or anythin u think i shud do?
<grahamldlw> considering this is a fresh ubuntu! barely even able to withstand on it's own yet
<grahamldlw> dunno where the with came from but still...
<cbx33> grahamldlw: well.....as I said....you can install windows as the second OS
<cbx33> have you left any space for it?
<grahamldlw> yeh i only took about 10 gb for ubuntu the rest is unassosiacted or however it's spelt
<cbx33> nice
<grahamldlw> but still, what kinda programs and where wud i get them from for ubuntu, and it's also not letting me write stuff in on the terminal asks for a password
<cbx33> ?free? :p
<grahamldlw> but i cant type it in
<cbx33> you shouldbe able to type on a terminal
<cbx33> without having to put apassword in
<grahamldlw> where do i put the password in?
<grahamldlw> no
<grahamldlw> i did that
<grahamldlw> and it asked for a password
<grahamldlw> grahamldlw@grahamldlw-desktop:~$ sudo apt-cache search flash
<grahamldlw> Password:
<cbx33> ahh
<cbx33> when it says password type your password in
<cbx33> it is because you have put sudo in front
<grahamldlw> which means?
<cbx33> for apt-cache you do not need to use sudo
<grahamldlw> i thought i had to?
<grahamldlw> ohhh
<cbx33> that can be run as normal user
<cbx33> do man sudo and read actually what it does
<grahamldlw> isnt it for superuser or somethin tho?
<cbx33> yes
<grahamldlw> what am i? im the only user!
<cbx33> so if you need to run a command as superuser....like install apps using apt-get...you need sudo infront
<cbx33> no there is always a superuser on the system
<cbx33> you never login as it directly 
<cbx33> (well you can but i's not the way ubuntu works)
<cbx33> so you use sudo to ask permission to run the following command as root (superuser)
<grahamldlw> oh and doing it without sudo dosent do anything, it just starts a new blank line
<cbx33> well if you try to run a command that needs superuser access withoutit......it will complain
<cbx33> do...apt-get install nmap
<cbx33> and see it will complain
<cbx33> then do sudo apt-get install nmap
<cbx33> and it will work
<grahamldlw> it asks if im root
<cbx33> indeed...
<grahamldlw> but if u do that cache thing without sudo infront it dosent acctually do anything
<cbx33> so you were trying to run it as a normal user
<cbx33> it should do...
<grahamldlw> it just skips a line and dosent write anything
<cbx33> if it comes up with nothing
<cbx33> it means it found nothing
<cbx33> you want the flash plugins for firefox?
<grahamldlw> it is apt-cache search etc?
<grahamldlw> yeh, and the linux messenger for msn
<cbx33> well...you already have that ...GAIM is the msn messenger
<cbx33> it's in your menu already
<grahamldlw> no not gaim, a different one
<cbx33> to get flash...just goto a site which has flash...like www.adobe.com...I think...and it will ask you to click to install...that works fine ;)
<cbx33> grahamldlw: AMSN?
<grahamldlw> http://amsn.sourceforge.net/
<grahamldlw> yeh
<cbx33> sudo apt-get install amsn
<cbx33> if it fails I'll help you out...I'll know what's wrong
<grahamldlw> grahamldlw@grahamldlw-desktop:~$ sudo apt-get install amsn
<grahamldlw> Password:
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: your user password
<grahamldlw> dosent let me type anything it
<grahamldlw> in*
<grahamldlw> Password:
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: it does
<grahamldlw> Sorry, try again.
<lucasvo> but you don't see it
<grahamldlw> i can type but nothing comes up on the screen
<lucasvo> just type it and press enter
<lucasvo> yes
<grahamldlw> i can type fine before that line comes up
<lucasvo> that's ok
<lucasvo> it is normal that you don't see anything
<grahamldlw> it did it
<lucasvo> (security risk)
<cbx33> yeh...it doesn't echo your password to the screen
<grahamldlw> but didnt acctually find what it was looking for anyway
<grahamldlw> ok
<cbx33> we should put something prominant about that somewhere
<grahamldlw> do i have to type it in everytime?
<cbx33> the numebr of times that question gets asked
<cbx33> not every time
<cbx33> it stores it for a while
<grahamldlw> 15minutes?
<cbx33> not sure
<cbx33> but it forgets it agaoin.....security feature
<grahamldlw> it cant find msn on that cache thing at all
<cbx33> ie if you left your machine...and someone else typed sudo....ARGH...they have admin access
<cbx33> grahamldlw: ok
<cbx33> I can tell you why
<cbx33> you don;t have the universe repos setup
<cbx33> basically....
<grahamldlw> which is?
<cbx33> the software you download is stored int these repos
<grahamldlw> so how do i set them?
<cbx33> ok...goto
<grahamldlw> noooo
<cbx33> Settings
<grahamldlw> ok
<cbx33> no...
<grahamldlw> this is alot harder then i anticipated
<cbx33> what's the third menu atthe top
<grahamldlw> system?
<grahamldlw> then it has preferences, admin etc in system
<cbx33> ok...in one of those...is software sources
<grahamldlw> software properties?
<LaserJock> yep
<grahamldlw> then what do i change?
<grahamldlw> theres alot of community maintained ones unclicked
<cbx33> click then universe one
<cbx33> then ok and try again
<grahamldlw> for which one theres about 3 different universe ones
<cbx33> there is multiverse
<cbx33> and universe
<cbx33> tick em all :p
<cbx33> hehe
<grahamldlw> it's just quickly upgrading current information about them
<cbx33> yes it will do
<grahamldlw> finished
<grahamldlw> now i clicked all them will that list of programs on the add/remove be bigger?
<grahamldlw> and it's currently installing amsn btw
<nixternal> LaserJock: im talking with mdke about the handbook and doc repos and you are no where around ;)
<cbx33> nice
<cbx33> good job grahamldlw 
<grahamldlw> yay! is that list gonna be bigger for programs on add/remove now?
<cbx33> yes
* cbx33 thinkgs grahamldlw is having ubuntu fun :p
<grahamldlw> bk!
<grahamldlw> miss anything? oh i thought i sensed talk about me
<cbx33> hehe
<grahamldlw> haha this msn plays a guitar chord wen someons logs in and i have like 500 contacts so it sounds like a wierd attempt at a song lol
<grahamldlw> i dont get how the file structure of this works tho
<grahamldlw> where to save things and stuff
<cbx33> grahamldlw: ok - I can tell you about that...
<cbx33> but not right now eh :p - in meeting and very tired
<grahamldlw> yeh another time, altho i think im gonna have an awful lot of time to learn how to use this considering i dont have any alternative atm
<cbx33> grahamldlw: as I said today.....that' sthe best way
<grahamldlw> forced into using ubuntu, there was me thinkin i was gonna be eased in, but no complete force!
<cbx33> indeed
<cbx33> best wayt :p
<grahamldlw> and i have a penguin as my display picture
<grahamldlw> lol...
<cbx33> hehehe
<cbx33> I'm off for awhile
<cbx33> see ya later grahamldlw 
<sbalneav> Watch as I seamlessly transition from #ubuntu-meeting to #edubuntu in a stunning display of tabbed-chatting prowess.
<LaserJock> hehe
<nixternal> alrighty, after some conversation with LaserJock and mdke, we can move the handbook over to the Ubuntu Documentation repo
<nixternal> one downfall to this is...
<nixternal> are you ready?
<nixternal> current users will have to submit patches until you can get svn access to it
<nixternal> so..with that said, feelings?  ideas?  comments?  questions which I may or may not be able to answer?  complaints? ;)
<pips1> highvoltage: ping
<ogra> pips1, i think he went to bed
<pips1> oh
<pips1> so EC is considering edubuntu member applications next week?
<pips1> I wonder if I should apply...
<ogra> sure you should :)
<pips1> but who will vote for me?!
<nixternal> i would ;)
<nixternal> but i can't
<pips1> heh
<ogra> make a wikipage that talks about you and lists your contributiuons and apply for the edubuntu-members team
<ogra> pips1, i think there are some people :
<ogra> )
<nixternal> im an ubuntu and kubuntu member seeking edubuntu love ;)
<ogra> nixternal, and ? 
<pips1> well, my wiki page is a big of a disorganised shambles
<pips1> *bit
<ogra> nixternal, why should we deny membership ?
<ogra> pips1, get it in order then, you have one week ;)
<nixternal> i was pokin' some fun
<ogra> and dont forget to put yourself on the agenda
<pips1> ogra: hehe
* pips1 looks for the agenda wiki page
<nixternal> ogra: i think once i do some work around here, i will join your gang ;)
* pips1 found the agenda page
<ogra> nixternal, cool 
<pips1> heh, ogra, you are editing the agenda page... 
<pips1> I got a conflict warning
<ogra> just saving
<ogra> feel free to edit :)
<pips1> r u done now
<pips1> ok
* ogra does the (hopefully) last ltsp upload for edgy ...
<sbalneav> Okay boys'n'girls!
<sbalneav> I'm heading home for the day!
<sbalneav> I'll be on later tonight, see you all then.
<pips1> ogra: at what time do you recon will the next daily build be done? within the hour? or later?
<ogra> its always around 0:00 UTC
<cbx33> ogra, do you want that gdm splash tonight?
<ogra> depending on the load it can take longer (up to 1:00 am)
<ogra> cbx33, the gnome splash ? tomorrow morning would be nice
<cbx33> lisa will do it now then ;)
<ogra> freeze should take place at 15:00 UTC
<ogra> and i need to solve the progressbasr stuff before
<cbx33> right ok
<cbx33> are there anyt other changes
<cbx33> and what image do yo uwant me to grab to install?
<ogra> not from my side yet
<ogra> the lastest install CD indeed
<cbx33> how likely/difficult are changes after freeze tomorrow?
<cbx33> ogra, ok np
<ogra> testing live is also fine, but my highest prio is i386 install
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> I'm getting it now
<ogra> if that one's ok i usually move on via amd64 to ppc ...
<cbx33> there is only an 11 build for edubuntu
<cbx33> is that ok?
<cbx33> not 11.1
<ogra> yep
<pips1> cbx33: as far as I understood, the build that will be available from around 0:00 - 1:00 UTC will be best for our testing efforts...
<cbx33> ah....hmmm ok
<pips1> I mean *after* around 0:00 - 1:00 UTC
<LaserJock> grrr, by computer hates me
<LaserJock> *my
<cbx33> aww....we love you LaserJock 
<pips1> ogra, question: using rysnc and then burning an iso from that and test is ok, no? or should I actually download the "ready-made" iso image that is available from the web page?
<LaserJock> for some reason my internet connection drops
<cbx33> are the nvidia drivers broken in i386?
<ogra> pips1, rsync is fine and saves bandwith
<LaserJock> but when I reboot it's all good
<pips1> ok
* ogra is off for the day
<pips1> cu
<cbx33> nn ogra 
<cbx33> great work my man :p
<pips1> cbx33: highvoltage said he will change that png with transparency, right?
<pips1> did we come to a conclusion about it?
<cbx33> ok sure
<grahamldlw> hey u there?
<grahamldlw> i got aload of .tar.gz files and a .run file and dunno what to do wiv em
<cbx33> hey grahamldlw 
<cbx33> where did you get them and what are you trying to do (tbh if this is non-edubuntu specific you should join #ubuntu)
<grahamldlw> there joined it, but theres 900 somethin users lol
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> I'll be there
<grahamldlw> y does ur name appear in yellow every now and then?
<cbx33> cos I'm saying your name
<cbx33> it's highlighting it for you
<pips1> :)
<pips1> I just started rsyncing... I wonder what I rsyncs to, when the iso image changes half way through the process?!
<cbx33> pips1, heheh
<cbx33> my VM is all ready for tomorrows install ;)
<cbx33> this sux
<cbx33> as I have to goto work...so I'll have limited time to test the latest iso
<cbx33> I'm gonna test current
<pips1> right
<cbx33> hope that's gonna be ok
<pips1> gladly, I can devote some time to testing tomorrow...
<pips1> last testing round we also had jsgotanco to help.. he is surely missed :)
<cbx33> and me
<cbx33> I tested a lot too :0
<pips1> I remember :)
<pips1> you have been a busy bee ever since!
<cbx33> indeed I have ;)
<pips1> I'm amazed by all the effort you (and others) can put in...
<cbx33> well.....that's what happens when you have no real social life...and you're wife is a freelance webdesigner who generally works evenings
<pips1> I haven't been able to do nealy as much... but I try to be there at least at the right time :)
<pips1> *nearly
<cbx33> pips1, you do amazing
<cbx33> I'm looking forward to how this webstuff is all gonna take off
<cbx33> lisa is pretty excited too
<pips1> unfortunately, my wife has a 8-5 job (well, 8-8, sometimes), so she goes to sleep early.. and get's up much earlier than me :-/
<pips1> I'm looking forward to build a great community site too :)
<cbx33> yeh its gonna be excellent
<grahamldlw> see even other ppl are gettin frustrated with this problem of mine lol
<cbx33> yup
<pips1> ?
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> pips1, he's in #ubuntu
<lucasvo> hi pips1 
<pips1> hey lucasvo
<pips1> cbx33: ah, ic
<lucasvo> btw, currently someone working on the webpage?
<cbx33> I didn't see the end of the meeting
<pips1> nope
<lucasvo> change the link: Shipit: Order CDs -> Shipit: Order FREE Cds
<pips1> lucasvo: ah
<pips1> right, hmm. good suggestion
<pips1> lucasvo: you have an account in drupal!
<lucasvo> lucasvo: yes...
<lucasvo> but I don't remember my pw
<pips1> hehe
<pips1> It happens to the best of us ;-)
<lucasvo> I need a place to store pws outside of my brain
<pips1> I really need to get myself a password safe, i.e. a palm or smth
<pips1> yeah
<cbx33> heh
<cbx33> or a newton :p
<lucasvo> my blackberry has this sort of thing but... I don't regulary backup my BB. So if I loose it, I'd be screwed
<cbx33> blimey this VM is fast
<pips1> does the memory of the blackberry get wiped when the battery dies?
<cbx33> I'm half way through LTSP install already
<pips1> wow
<pips1> lucasvo: ?
<lucasvo> pips1: what?
<lucasvo> pips1: no
<lucasvo> pips1: but i already lost one
<pips1> what?!
<lucasvo> and if someone enters the pw 10times wrong, it deletes itself
<pips1> you told me you lost a mobile already
<lucasvo> yes, the blackberry
<pips1> I take it you are someone who looses pocket devices all the time, then, eh ;-)
<lucasvo> and I bought a new one
<lucasvo> pips1: no...
<pips1> hehe
<lucasvo> pips1: I lost one blackberry in my life
<lucasvo> it's hte only pocketdevice I lost
* pips1 pulls lucasvo's leg
<lucasvo> but the problem is, I can't sync my bb with linux so I don't do backups
<pips1> right
<lucasvo> pips1: btw, any news on envol?
<lucasvo> (the french app)
<pips1> yeah, for me, the syncing-to-linux is also high on the wishlist for a pda device...
<pips1> I met the producer at the education conference
<lucasvo> pips1: get yourself one which runs linux
<lucasvo> :)
<pips1> producer "auftraggeber"
<lucasvo> pips1: and what did he say?
<pips1> he only said that at the time, doing a cross platform applicatoin meant doing win and mac...
<lucasvo> :)
<lucasvo> well, I think it shouldn't be that hard to port it to linux
<lucasvo> maybe a team of developers could get access to it under NDA
<lucasvo> and port it 
<pips1> he says that most newer edu cd-rom apps are done in flash, rather than director
<pips1> which is slightly better
<lucasvo> yes
<pips1> still, I can use most recent flash movies (later than flash7), which sucks
<pips1> *can't
<lucasvo> pips1: why?
<lucasvo> with the proprietary flash plugin?
* pips1 checks about:plugins
<pips1> File name: libflashplayer.so
<pips1> Shockwave Flash 7.0 r63
<pips1> hmm
<pips1> I installed that via synaptic, I think
<pips1> is that the proprietary one, or the open source lib?
<grahamldlw> wheres cbx33 gone? he still about?
<cbx33> yeh I'm here
<cbx33> a little busy
<cbx33> going now
<cbx33> tired ;)
<pips1> cbx33: you mentioned earlier that you can install the latest flash player via adobe's web-installer... that didn't use to work for me..?!
<pips1> darn, I just missed him
#edubuntu 2006-10-12
<pips1> lucasvo: are you still here?
<lucasvo> pips1: yes
<lucasvo> pips1: I don't know
<grahamldlw> oh yeh i wanted that too!
<grahamldlw> since ubuntu has now accidentally become my new windows!#
<pips1> grahamldlw: you mean you want the flash-plugin for firefox?
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: overwritten your windows?
<lucasvo> that's always a good reason to learn linux
<pips1> lucasvo: it looks like highvoltage has built the 'Shipit: Order CDs' link into the Drupal theme, so I can't simply change it as an autor...
* pips1 is stumped slightly
<cyberhell86> eyyy pls help me.. :S i don't know what happened.. :S but i was using ubuntu... and now i came back to windows... but my dvd writer doesnt burn dvds anymore :S just cds and dvdrw :S do u have any idea what could have happened? :S I updated the firmware :S but i still have the same problem :(
<pygi> cyberhell86, sudo apt-get install brasero
<pygi> you can burn dvd's with it
<pygi> uh, on windows?!
<grahamldlw> yeh i reformatted my hard drive by accident cuz i tried to change it from ntsf to fat32 when it had stuff (i very very badly needed) on and it just wiped it, but at least ubuntu went on it lol
<cyberhell86> yes.. :S it doesn't even work on windows anymore :S 
<pips1> bizarre
<cyberhell86> maybe the ubuntu change something on the firmware or something :S
<pips1> nah
<LaserJock> I seriously doubt ubuntu did anything
<cyberhell86> uhmm :S
<cyberhell86> what should i do? :(
<grahamldlw> see this is why it's a bad thing that im only a college student, i dont understand all this stuff and the termnology they use
<grahamldlw> it took about 8 ppl from the ubuntu channel to tell me how to install somethin and it still didnt work :D
<pips1> grahamldlw: "they"?
<grahamldlw> yeh pretty much everyone on the ubuntu channel
<pips1> ah
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: I am also a college student... 
<LaserJock> as am I ;-)
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: you'll learn very quickly 
<grahamldlw> this is my second day of using it
<grahamldlw> and soon to be last the moment i get a windows CD
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: hey hey....
<pips1> hehe
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: don't give up that fast
<grahamldlw> ask cbx33 lol im very impatient
<grahamldlw> he shud know, cuz im constantly asking him questions and answers
<grahamldlw> i dont get the whole structure of it
<grahamldlw> and teh fact i reformatted my hardd drive when it had irreplacable information on it annoyed me a tad
<grahamldlw> and the command line interface is annoying, and u need permission to do just about anythin on here
<pips1> what have you been using the command line interface for, so far?
<grahamldlw> finding and installing applications
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: you can use synaptic for that
<pips1> you don't want to use the graphical interfaces for that?
<grahamldlw> i dont even know what that is
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: system -> administration > synaptic
<pips1> grahamldlw: are you using an english language installation?
<pips1> ah, lucasvo beat me to it :)
<grahamldlw> access denied
<grahamldlw> yes
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: why access denied?
<grahamldlw> i dont know i dont use it!!
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: what user are you using?
<pips1> installing software on your system requires your password
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: and did you enter your password?
<grahamldlw> it didnt even get as far as a password screen
<pips1> are you using edubuntu or ubuntu?
<grahamldlw> synapic package manager right? 
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: what user are you using? the one created initially on the setup
<grahamldlw> ubuntu
<grahamldlw> yeh
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: yes
<grahamldlw> ...
<pips1> hmm, you say you don't get as far as a password screen.  rather strange.
<grahamldlw> i just closed the access denied box and re opened it and it opened it but didnt even ask for a password?
<grahamldlw> does it do it wen i acctually try and use a file?
<grahamldlw> ok dosent matter i giv up, it's obviously no benefit to me, im goin back to good old fashioned simple windows
<pips1> grahamldlw: if you enter your "sudo" password, the password get's remembered by the system for a few minutes. during that time, you don't need to re-enter it for other administrative tasks
<grahamldlw> more hassle then it's worth far too complicated, which is surprising considering all i end up doin is writing pseudo code all day and looking at made up operating systems
<grahamldlw> b4 i cud see the benefits of using linux over windows, now i see why i've used windows all my life
<grahamldlw> cheers for ur help anyway
<pips1> you are welcome
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: you are angry because you lost your data not about the OS. try to remember that. It always takes it's time to get used to a new environnment
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: but do as you like
<grahamldlw> nah i dont mind the fact i list my dada
<grahamldlw> data*
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: I needed several tries to really do the switch
<pips1> same here
<grahamldlw> thats ok, i can get over that, it's just i dont like the whole interface of ubuntu
<grahamldlw> and much prefer the simplicity of windows
<lucasvo> well... ubuntu is simple as long as you don't use the command line. (which you don't have to)
<grahamldlw> i dont get the whole structure of the file layouts either
<grahamldlw> which dosent help
<pips1> to be honest, the graphical interface of windows, mac and linux aren't *that* different, in my humble opinion
<grahamldlw> or which files u can do what with
<grahamldlw> if u look at the desktop at a glance they look similar as soon as u start using them there absolutly different
<pips1> the file system structure can be rather incomprehensible at the beginning, I agree
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: can you tell me an example?
<grahamldlw> of what?
<lucasvo> the problems you had with your desktop
<grahamldlw> what do u mean problems?
<pips1> I want to know too
<grahamldlw> i said the desktop is different, it's the structure beyond that which courses the problems
<LaserJock> Windows file structure is rather insane as well
<lucasvo> indeed
<pips1> grahamldlw: we would appreciate a quick listing of stuff you had trouble with
<grahamldlw> i understand windows perfectly compared to this
<grahamldlw> file types
<lucasvo> everything is hidden in C;/Windows
<LaserJock> grahamldlw: well, you gotta give it a little time, you didn't learn Windows file structure overnight :-)
<pips1> what is the trouble with the file types?
<grahamldlw> whereas windows has .exe and the setup files which are easiable identifiable to exactly what u need to do what with, and more often then none requires about 3 clicks to install, linux has .deb .run .tar.gc .tar.bz2 etc etc
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: in linux there is one installer for all apps
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: apt
<pips1> grahamldlw: you should need to bother with all that, once you get to use a graphical installer like synaptic!
<grahamldlw> but it dosent even work, i've had about 8 ppl copy and pasting exactly what i need to write and it dosent work
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: you can use synaptic to install almost every piece of software that is available for ubuntu using it
<grahamldlw> i get the whole sudo apt-get install etc etc
<LaserJock> and you don't have to go grubing around the internet for apps
<LaserJock> Ubuntu is much easier to install software on
<grahamldlw> then what?
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: just start up synaptic and search for the software you want 
<lucasvo> choose it to install, and apply the changes~
<grahamldlw> nah too many words for me
<pips1> you don't have to use the command line (sudo apt-get ...), 'synaptic' is a graphical interface to that...
<grahamldlw> dont have the technical vocabulary for it
<grahamldlw> even on the synap thing it's too complicated
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: to install a package just use the program SYnaptic
<LaserJock> much easier then Windows to install software
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: why?
<grahamldlw> as i said
<pips1> ah, so you *did* use synaptic then?
<grahamldlw> technical termonology
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: what didn't you unerstand?
<grahamldlw> im finally startin to see how microsoft (emphasize) "earn" there money
<grahamldlw> everything on the left side of the screen for a start
<pips1> ?
<LaserJock> dude, you just hit the "search" button and type in what you want
<grahamldlw> nah i dont get it
<pips1> LaserJock: :-)
<grahamldlw> im a devote windows user thata do me
<LaserJock> hehe, well good luck with it.
<grahamldlw> now as soon as i get that disk i gotta try and get ubuntu OFF!
<pips1> well, if you insist on huniting for .exe files to double click on... no one is going to stop you :)
<pips1> *hunting
<grahamldlw> i cant click on anythin
<grahamldlw> nothin works
<grahamldlw> infact the only thing i have on my desktops out of about 20 things now is a picture of me surprise surprise
<grahamldlw> that works i forgot to add in
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: what do you want to do?
<pips1> LOL
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: I guess firefox works?
<grahamldlw> yeh
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: and irc?
<grahamldlw> i dont acctually want to do anything on here, not anymore anywayz
<lucasvo> ok.
<grahamldlw> i've given up with it all now
* pips1 thinks that all grahamldlw uses windows for is to have an empty desktop with only a picture ;-)
<lucasvo> good luck with windows
<pygi> heh, what an attitude :)
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: sleep over it and try it again
<grahamldlw> i wish, i did have a full screen of icons, and no! b4 u asked they wernt all pictures of me, only half of em were!
<grahamldlw> well until it got formatted
<grahamldlw> im not gonna speak an i'll word of microsoft after this, hmmm, i was almost converted into a ubuntu user and now im just totally put off after seeing this, this is why they dont even attempt with training for it, it's just too complicated
<pips1> ok, last question to you, grahamldlw: why did you decided to try ubuntu in the first place?
<grahamldlw> not for teachers students etc
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: first think before talking please...
<grahamldlw> y do i need to think?
<grahamldlw> when the answer is a factual?
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: a kid entirely new to pc without knowing windows will have the same problems to learn either ubuntu or windows
<grahamldlw> and it's because someone gave me a CD who's opinion on computing matters i respect
<grahamldlw> hu told me i shud try it especially for programming
<lucasvo> after half a day you'll know how to use ubuntu
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: maybe you can ask him to help you
<grahamldlw> i used it for 2 days now?
<lucasvo> it's easier to do it locally
<pips1> has that person not given you a preview of it on his machine? or did he not offer to give you help when trying it?
<grahamldlw> nah i dont want help with it i want rid of it now it's just problem after problem
<pygi> bleh
<grahamldlw> no he did show me it and it looked gd, but then again he's probably been using it for yr after yr,amd also he is very smart anyway
* pygi usually just ignores that kind of attitude
<grahamldlw> im glad windows is used at my college anyway, purely because to me, regardless of wether or not i've been brought up on it i can understand why it wud be easier to use
<pygi> grahamldlw, if I summon you a start button, you'll be happy then? :)
<lucasvo> wow, ubuntu mirror has ipv6
<lucasvo> cool
<pips1> grahamldlw: are you using any applications for programming on windows?
<grahamldlw> yeh a couple
<pips1> which ones?
<grahamldlw> cant remember
<pips1> right
<LaserJock> grahamldlw: well, I'm sorry you are having a bad experiece here. I'm sure with some patience and a little help from cbx33 you could have a better time
* pygi giggles :)
<grahamldlw> i formatted my hard drive by accident
* pygi thinks that "format drive" and "accident" don't go together
<LaserJock> grahamldlw: many many people find Ubuntu (and Linux in general) a much easier and better computing experience
* pygi is no one to state that tho :)
<grahamldlw> nah im just gonna get help on programming matters from cbx33
<grahamldlw> ubuntu isnt going to be an issue for much longer
<pygi> grahamldlw, you do understand he _DOES NOT_ use windows, right? :)
<pygi> bleh
<grahamldlw> yes i know that
<grahamldlw> i see him often enuf i shud lol
* pygi ignores from now on :)
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: you know cbx
<grahamldlw> yes
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: ask him
<grahamldlw> he physically gave me the ubuntu disk
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: he'll help you for sure
<LaserJock> grahamldlw: he also told you to back up your data :-)
<grahamldlw> yeh he's gd with that it's just too complicated for me
<grahamldlw> yeh i know but i didnt, i tried to do it thru linux but surprise surprise it didnt work
<pips1> grahamldlw: I don't quite understand why you didn't try to do the backup in your trusted windows environment, though...
<grahamldlw> if you saw how difficult it is to do anything on my pc u'd know why
<pips1> huh?
<grahamldlw> dosent matter
<pips1> is you windows installation buggered or something?
<lucasvo> anyone know how I can destroy a tunnel?
<pips1> sorry, *was*
<lucasvo> ipv6 over 4
<pips1> lucasvo: no clue
<grahamldlw> anyway im going i have college in a few hours, and YAY i get to use windows all day long!
<lucasvo> tunnelbro Link encap:IPv6-in-IPv4  
<lucasvo> grahamldlw: have a good day
<LaserJock> finally
* pygi agrees with laser
<lucasvo> crappy ipv6 routing
<bimberi> well ... that was an interesting time to join
<lucasvo> anyone know squid?
<lucasvo> I need to set it up so it accepts connection from anywhere
<pygi> hey bimberi 
<bimberi> hi pygi
<pips1> bimberi: :)
<pygi> how is you?
<pips1> cu guys
<bimberi> very well thanks pygi, very dry (drought) here though :( . And you?
<bimberi> hi and bye pips1 :)
<pygi> bimberi, quite good and tired :) Busy with moving :)
<bimberi> :)
<pygi> it's 1:20 AM now, so I'm not doing any "moving work" right now tho :)
<pygi> but I'll go in "sleep mode" soon :)
<pygi> night
<bimberi> nn pygi
<HedgeMage> One more thing to cross off of my to-do list -- yay!
<toy42> I've download 6.06.1 edubuntu DVD.  I've installed it in a VMWare container.  It doesn't have LTSP etc as far as I can tell.  Should I have stuck with 6.06 DVD or a 6.06.1 CD that actually had links to them?
<toy42> maybe should I try edgy?  
<toy42> I'm also going to try K12...  just trying to get a demo up and running for my son's small school.
<LaserJock> I'm not really sure
<LaserJock> you could try the Edgy Beta CD
<toy42> thanks...  I'll do that.  I've been using Linux for 11 years, but I need something simple to "sell" ...  as the school won't want to worry about if their next "tech helper" will have skillz.  ;)  
<LaserJock> yep
<toy42> LaserJock: are you using edgy beta?
<LaserJock> yep
<LaserJock> well, it's a little newer then beta exactly as I update it every day
<toy42> cool...  and are you doing LTSP?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> I don't have an LTSP setup
<LaserJock> just workstations
<LaserJock> but the LTSP in Edgy has more features then the Dapper version
<toy42> thx for the info
<sbalneav> Evening all
<LaserJock> hi sbalneav 
<sbalneav> Heya!
<sbalneav> Gettin' geeked for MV?
<LaserJock> sbalneav: well, I'm kinda too busy to think about it much :?
<sbalneav> :)
<LaserJock> how about you?
<sbalneav> Totally geeked.  We did a ton of good things with LTSP, and there's more bling to come.
<sbalneav> altius, citius, fortius, and all that.
<sbalneav> Always fun to reconnect with all my linux buddies.
<sbalneav> Plus:
<LaserJock> hehe
<sbalneav> BEER :)
<LaserJock> well, I'll be happy to see you guys
<LaserJock> although I wish highvoltage and jerome were coming
<sbalneav> True.  However, we'll have fun regardless.
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> I was kinda hoping for more community people
<LaserJock> but it'll be cool to have the "big guns"
<rodarvus> there will be lots of community people
<rodarvus> it just seems that edubuntu people were not interested in showing up :P (ok, just kidding here)
* bimberi wonders if teamspeak (or the like) will be used again
<crimsun> yeah, I was about to say that it seems like UDS/MV will be a huge gathering
<LaserJock> bimberi: I believe so
<LaserJock> well, I'm apparently the only Edubuntu community person going
* rodarvus points at sbalneav
<rodarvus> sbalneav is Edubuntu too! :)
* sbalneav waves
<LaserJock> well, 1 1/2 then
<LaserJock> since he's 1/2 LTSP ;-)
<LaserJock> is there a plan in the works for a teacher conference or something?
<rodarvus> afaik, yes
<rodarvus> but RichEd is the one that can fill in the details
<rodarvus> Im not sure of when, where, or nothing like this
<rodarvus> so please don't quote me on slashdot, osnews or planet ubuntu :P
<bimberi> LaserJock: cool
<LaserJock> rodarvus: haha
* bimberi was a beneficiary of sbalneav sharing his microphone with the world during one of the UDSP sessions :)
<sbalneav> :)
<LaserJock> I heard mutterings about it and RichEd is getting this "Education space" thing going so I imagine it's in the works for some time
<LaserJock> haha
<LaserJock> yes, sbalneav was very good about using the microphone
<LaserJock> the rest of user were like "Get this crap out of my way"
<bimberi> ooh, precious aren't we :)
<LaserJock> well, it's hard to be both live and brodcast at the same time
<LaserJock> like I'd be moving around the room
<LaserJock> and you are talking with people face-to-face
<LaserJock> and then you're like "darn, I forgot the mic"
<LaserJock> then it's like doing IRC
<bimberi> oh yes, that's totally fair
<bimberi> it needs to work locally before it can possibly be of any benefit to those outside
<LaserJock> yeah, Paris was the first experiment
<bimberi> 'it' being the BOF session or whatever
<LaserJock> it'll be better this time
<LaserJock> especially if they can get it to work for everbody
<LaserJock> in Paris the ppc's weren't able to use it
<bimberi> ah
<LaserJock> so that started a trend of some people using it, some people not
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> why are you guys up?
<cbx33> hheeh
<cbx33> this is my normal rising time ;)
<HedgeMage> hi cbx33 
<cbx33> infact I'm a litte late
<cbx33> hey HedgeMage 
<HedgeMage> Emailed lisa that text a little while ago :)
* HedgeMage is finally catching up on her "to do" list
<cbx33> fantastic
<cbx33> what are you still doing here LaserJock :p
<LaserJock> getting ready to go to bed
<LaserJock> trying to figure out why my network is going haywire
<cbx33> what at home now too?
<RichEd> hello all ...
<RichEd> LaserJock: There will be an Ubuntu Education Summit in Q2 next year. Agreed by sabdfl yesterday.
<toosa_> Helo RichEd !
<RichEd> hello toosa_ 
<toosa_> What time in SA now ?
<RichEd> 08:53am Thursday :)
<toosa_> oh .. good morning .. hope a beauty sunshine there :) It is 13:57 Thu here
<pips1> good morning RichEd and all
<RichEd> Sunshine ... clear skies ... looking like a good day so far :)
<RichEd> Hello pips1 ... welcome back
<pips1> great news about the Educatoin Summit!
<RichEd> Sorry I missed you last night ... how was the leave ?
<pips1> we had a great time
<cbx33> Hey RichEd 
<RichEd> hello cbx33
<pips1> morning cbx33
<nixternal> nixternal@MasTequila:~/Work/Ubuntu/Documentation/repos/trunk/edubuntu/handbook/C$ ../../../validate.sh Edubuntu-Handbook.xml
<nixternal> nixternal@MasTequila:~/Work/Ubuntu/Documentation/repos/trunk/edubuntu/handbook/C$ 
<nixternal> that is a good thing
<nixternal> only took 3 or so hours ;)
<nixternal> I have copied over from the "binary redneck" svn to the Ubuntu Documentation svn repo
<HedgeMage> nixternal: what time zone are you, dear?
<nixternal> CST - Chicago
<HedgeMage> nixternal: you rock, btw
<HedgeMage> wow, my home area :)
<nixternal> ya, your mom is on the south south side ;)
<HedgeMage> :)
<nixternal> mdke will work on getting whoever needs svn rights and what not on the Ubuntu Doc server
<nixternal> i am glad i copied over there and did it...i cut the job at hand by half i would say
<RichEd> cbx33: I've got an email from lisa ... thanks ... I must write her the art approach email in the next while. Just catching up with pips1 and filling him in on some things,.
<nixternal> so, if anyone wants to check out the handbook repo from Ubuntu docs... you can read over https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DocumentationTeam/Repository
<nixternal> doh
<nixternal> don't read that
<nixternal> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/Repository
<nixternal> there we go..much better
<HedgeMage> :)
<nixternal> man...if i would have done all of that on binary redneck...oooh your host would have been mad
<nixternal> im sure the server in london was screaming at me tonight
<HedgeMage> nixternal: Probably not, they love me :)
<nixternal> now, i will hack the makefile, and build some html love to look over as well...maybe even do some docbook > pdf lovin' as well
<nixternal> something tells me that when this is finished, it will be "lulu'fied"
* HedgeMage <3 nixternal 
<HedgeMage> nixternal: I have a sudden urge to mail you brownies or something :P
<RichEd> nixternal: just chatting to HedgeMage about lulu and were talking about setting up a meeting for handbook handover and short term future
<nixternal> i have a sudden urge to grab a bottle of water, a bag of habanero dorritos and grab my big comfy bed ;)
<nixternal> im open any time of the day
<nixternal> i know from what i hacked tonight, i see some restructuring in the future, as well as getting people to contribute some meat and potatoes
<RichEd> nixternal: In 22.5 hours time ?
<RichEd> Friday 06:00 UTC that is
<nixternal> that is 1am here
<nixternal> im up at that time
<nixternal> as you can tell
<RichEd> Yep ... you are both online now so I thought it could work.
<HedgeMage> :)
<RichEd> It will be willvdl, riched, nixternal, HedgeMage : I'll send an agenda which you can comment or add to
<HedgeMage> Awesome, thanks :)
<nixternal> roger that...what about sbl<i forget the rest> and his ltsp work as well..he has been documenting i can see
<cbx33> nixternal: 3 hours ????
<nixternal> 3 hours what?
<cbx33> are we using the doc repo now?
<cbx33> to validate the handbook
<nixternal> it validates, so that is good, but yes, the doc repo is fired up
<nixternal> ready for you to grab it
<cbx33> ok I'll ask mdke for an account
<cbx33> that is if you guys think I shoud have one
<nixternal> you guys are already members, so ya, mdke  you got it ;)
<nixternal> mdke should be alive shortly im guessing
<cbx33> ok I'll ask him when I next see him
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> RichEd: excellent.....
<Burgundavia> anybody awake to proofread the UWN?
<cbx33> sure
<cbx33> link me
<HedgeMage> Burgundavia: sure, fire away
<Burgundavia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue17
<Burgundavia> let me do one last edit
<cbx33> ok let me know when ;)
<HedgeMage> tell me when to refresh :)
<Burgundavia> go ahead
<cbx33> w00t
<Burgundavia> you have 8 hours
<cbx33> Burgundavia: want me to pm comments?
<Burgundavia> no, edit it inline
<Burgundavia> it is 1am here and I intend to sleep
<cbx33> yoiu want me to actually edit it?
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> nn Burgundavia 
<cbx33> I'll check and edit....I'll let HedgeMage take a first crack at it....unlessyou want me to go first HedgeMage  :p
<nixternal> alrighty...i shall return in 8 to 10 hours, depending on how i sleep ;)
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> GO GO GO nixternal 
<HedgeMage> cbx33: go ahead and go first, I just got a phone call
<nixternal> g'nite everyone and remember Ubuntu Doc Repos now ;)
<HedgeMage> ttyl nixternal 
<nixternal> hehe
<cbx33> nixternal: thatnks
<nixternal> np
<cbx33> I'll remember now
<HedgeMage> I'm off to grab some sleep... cbx33 do you have Burgundavia covered without me?  I just realized that I have to get up in four hours.
<HedgeMage> cbx33: pokepoke?
<RichEd> morning highvoltage 
* HedgeMage assumes cbx33 isn't noticing her because he's reading the newsletter and goes to bed
<Burgundavia> HedgeMage: I do
<HedgeMage> Burgundavia: see you later, then... goodnight :)
<cbx33> sorry HedgeMage was proofing
<cbx33> I'm editing as we speak
<cbx33> Burgundavia: proofed ;)
<Burgundavia> cbx33: chers
<pygi> hey highvoltage,  Burgundavia 
<Burgundavia> hey highvoltage, pygi
* Burgundavia goes to sleep
<pygi> night Burgundavia :)
<cbx33> nn Burgundavia 
<cbx33> if you want me to do a further prrof later just shout
<pygi> cbx33, pm pls :)
<cbx33> JONO !!!!
<jono> hey
<cbx33> howz it going
<jono> good thanks :)
<jono> you?
<cbx33> yeh going well....recorded a good segemtn for youth lug radio :p
<cbx33> do you guys allways get it in one take ;)
<pips1> ogra: ping
<pips1> ogra: sorry to ask this again (will make a note now): I'm testing the RC CDs.. During install, for my two NICs, I get asked which one I want as the "primary network interface". Is that going to be the outbound internet interface? or is that the LTSP interface?
<ogra> the first question is for the internet facing NIC
<ogra> if you have more than two you will be prompted for the thin client NIC ... else it will just grab the second one
<cbx33> ogra....shall I update the wikito say which version we are testing?
<ogra> cbx33, yes, that would be fine
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> by the way yesterday I tested the 09 version installing and had no problems
<cbx33> am just burnin 12
<cbx33> sorry not 09
<cbx33> 11.1
<ogra> thats great to hear :)
<ogra> but doesnt help with the edubuntu bits :P
<cbx33> will install on my laptop at work so I can actually test LTSP environment
<cbx33> that was the edubuntu iso
<ogra> 11.1 ?
<ogra> i'm not aware i built a .1
<cbx33> ok 11
<ogra> ok :)
<cbx33> I'm all confused....11.1 09 11 12 3904867349856
<cbx33> we should name every one...
<cbx33> I just tested the melissa release
<cbx33> or the lucy release
<ogra> well
<cbx33> ogra: ... I'm still expecting something after the well :p
<pips1> re naming each daily build: LOL
* cbx33 just had the best idea
<cbx33> we should name the release after memebrs of the community
<cbx33> the pips1 release
<cbx33> how do people theme gnome and change the look of the deskbars etc?
<cbx33> like the applications/places/system bar
* cbx33 is thick
<pips1> hurray, edubuntu RC amd64 server installed fine, need to test with clients yet
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> same with 386
<cbx33> just about to test with clients
<lucasvo> I hate disassembling notebooks
<lucasvo> crap
<lucasvo> windows boots, shows a bluescreen for  1/2 second and linux doens't even boot at all
<lucasvo> :(
<pips1> eek
<lucasvo> anoybody got a an old Aiprort card?
<cbx33> pips1: I can test running the amd64 live
<cbx33> can you do ppc?
<lucasvo> they are worth  about 60$
<lucasvo> it's a joke
<lucasvo> apple stopped producing them
<pips1> I'll do ppc live
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> we need multi-arch emulation
<pips1> I'm currently running ltsp-build-client --arch i386, since my clients are i386, so that will take some time
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> I'm just testing the i386 clients
<pips1> huh?
<pips1> what is that about mult-arch? 
<pips1> ohhhh
<cbx33> VERY speedy
<cbx33> so we can create ppc virtual machines
<pips1> are you saying that multi-arch is now supported out-of-box, without any need to run 'sudo rm -rf /opt/ltsp/amd64 && sudo ltsp-build-client --arch i386' ??
<pips1> it's a shame ogra is here just now
<pips1> *isn't
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> no I'm not
<cbx33> w00t /me just realised sound works :)
<cbx33> over LTSP
<cbx33> by default
<cbx33> THAT IS SOO COOL
* pips1 forgot to plugin the active amp
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> hmm....but didn't work for the second user
<pips1> hmm
<cbx33> argh.... :( - not reboot button for ldm
<cbx33> just testing a reboot 
<cbx33> bug....can someone else test....first user to login on a client machine gets sound....
<cbx33> if another user logins in after
<cbx33> they get no sound
<cbx33> if first user logsin again they get sound
<cbx33> pips1: can you confirm that when you get a sec?
* ogra waves from an amd64 test install with i386 ltsp ...
<jsgotangco> cbx33: are you meaning you would like to see a the whole boot process graphical? the you'll have to load the graphics driver from the beginning, and the kernel loaded in memory isn't really big ;)
<ogra> redhats anaconda does that afaik
<ogra> it rins in kdrive
<ogra> *runs
<jsgotangco> it does? hmm..i never thought of that
<jsgotangco> seems to be a waste of userspace no?
<ogra> well, i doubt resuming from suspend/hibernate would work nicely with kdrive
<jsgotangco> i bet
<ogra> so using it in usplash wouldnt work 
<lucasvo> I'd appreciate a styled grub 
<ogra> write one :)
<jsgotangco> ok will have to start testing the recent disc
<jsgotangco> brb
<pips1> hey highvoltage
<pips1> wow, what's that "Edgy Eft Edition" screen calibration screen?!
<pips1> on a thin client
<pips1> hmm. the sound came from the server, rather than the client
<ogra> pips1, did you log in on the server before logging in on the client with that user ?
<pips1> I logged in on the server with the initial user (sysadmin) and I logged in on the client with a test1 user
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> the gstreamer autosink should select the right output plugin 
<pips1> what is the easiest way to share a folder for users on the thin clients?
<ogra> you can set it to esd in gstreamer-properties 
<willvdl> hey all.
<ogra> on the thin clients ??
<willvdl> my 3G gave up the ghost half way through the meeting... :|
<pips1> basically, I got some test files (sound, images, ...) that I want all test user accounts to be able to access
<ogra> you need some kind of network auth and need to set up a nfs/samba/something server in the chroot
<ogra> ah, well, just put them in a public place on the server 
<ogra> you dont need any access to any thin clients for that
<pips1> how do I make a folder public?
<ogra> just use /tmp ... as long as you dont reboot the data should be there
<ogra> apart from that /home dirs are readable 
<cbx33> ogra: ok
<pips1> oh, the home dirs are all readable by all users by default?
<ogra> sure
<pips1> not here
<cbx33> he's not here but yes jsgotancgo that was what I meant
<cbx33> ok ogra found a bug on edubuntu
<cbx33> to do with sound
<ogra> pips1, 
<ogra> ogra@edubuntu:~$ ls /home/testuser/
<ogra> Desktop
<pips1> ah, I copied the whole folder from a usb stick, so the permissions probably got copied along with it (?)
<ogra> hmm, that could be
<ogra> set them readable for eveyone in nautilus or so ...
<cbx33> if I log in on a client machine as a user I get sound.....then logout I get sound ....then login as another user....I won;t get sound....logout no sound....login as the first user again...I get sound
<cbx33> does that mke sense?
<ogra> fuse is *very* secure ... :)
<ogra> cbx33, with tonights iso install ?
<cbx33> yes
<ogra> that was fixed ages ago ...
<ogra> crap
<pips1> looking at the folder's properties, I see that it is in the group 'sysadmin' and others 'none'...
<cbx33> also there was a bug in pessulus
<cbx33> but I have that fixed now
<cbx33> it is being uploaded as we speak
<pips1> ok, I will set others to ...access files
<cbx33> for some reason a module of mine was nt being copied....but it's fixed by seb128
<ogra> yep, saw taht
<cbx33> sorry about the sound issue dude
<pips1> oh, that doesn't work recursively...
<cbx33> also...the progres bar on the client machine ...only goes 20% of the way...and then goes to X....it's not a biggie just an asthetic thing
<cbx33> apart from that things seem good
<cbx33> SCP works great
<cbx33> as far as I can tell
<cbx33> I starte programs kill logins etc
<ogra> can you upload the output of:
<ogra> grep esd /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/sbin/ldm
<ogra> to a pastebin or something
<pips1> how bizarre, clicking on 'apply permissions to enclosed files' only works on the subfolders, but not on any contained files?! 
<ogra> cbx33, you are surely not using tonights iso 
<ogra> the progressbar thing was also fixed a week ago or so
<cbx33> hmm...
* pips1 decides to be more quiet
<cbx33> i downloaded curent...
<cbx33> lemme just check the volume label
<ogra> sounds rather like a failed rsync or something ... i'm definately sure about the progressbar thing 
<cbx33> no i download my isos directly
<cbx33> Release file Date Wed 11 23:16:12 UTC
<cbx33> I never rsync at work, cos I can't
<cbx33> I'm sorry I have to go help teach access....*shudder*
<cbx33> I'll be back so you can instruct me
<pips1> ogra, there doesn't seem to be an easy way with nautilus to set permissions for files in a folder recursively to a certain setting, could that be so?
<ogra> no idea, i never tried it :)
<pips1> right
<pips1> what channel would be best to quickly ask about this? 
<pips1> a gnome specific one?
<cbx33> bbl ogra 
* pips1 carries on with the main task of testing sound on thin clients
<pips1> ack, the sound is only playing on the server :(
<pips1> ???
<cbx33> ok I'm back for a few minutes
<cbx33> pips1: really?
<pips1> yep
<cbx33> ogra: you still want that pastebin?
<ogra> pips1, even with the workaround i gave you ?
<ogra> cbx33, yes
<pips1> workaround?
<cbx33> getting it no
* pips1 backtracks what ogra said before
<pips1> ah
<cbx33> http://pastebin.ca/199251
<P3L|C4N0> greetings
<cbx33> ogra: is that ok?
<ogra> cbx33, hmm, that code is correct
<ogra> i wonder why it works here
<cbx33> well i can assure you only the first user to log onto a client gets sound
<cbx33> and only that user
<ogra> even on my new install from 30min ago it worked fine
<cbx33> they can log on multiple times after that
<cbx33> and get sound
<ogra> and you did never log in with any of these users directly on the server ? 
<cbx33> i did login with one of them
<ogra> there is a bug in the gstreame autosink it seems that sets the defasult sink to alsa forcefully if you log in on the server
<cbx33> hmm...
<cbx33> ok here it is...thw lowdown
<ogra> set them both to esd and try again
<ogra> i think i'll force it to esd if pitti doesnt react on my poking
<cbx33> I log on as pete onto server......Ilogon as john on a client...I get sound...log in as pete on client I don;t get sound.....login as jonh...I get sound....reboot client  machine...and repeat but login as pete first...and he getse sound
<ogra> if that solves it, please file abug 
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> I'll try that
<ogra> did you make the change i asked for ?
<ogra> dont log in on the server
<pips1> ogra: I checked System > Sound Preferences > tab Sound and see that the checkbox for 'Enable software sound mixing (ESD)' is enabled. Is that what you were talking about?
<willvdl> cbx33, why not jsut change your name to Mike?
<cbx33> ARGH !
<cbx33> too many people...
<cbx33> 1) ogra why not login to the server?
<ogra> pips1, please use gstreamer-properties
<pips1> oki
<cbx33> 2) ogra change what to esd? - int that file?
<ogra> cbx33, because of what i explained three times in the last 20mins
<cbx33> 3) because my name is pete not mike
<cbx33> ok ogra sorry dude...I've been in and out of the room
<cbx33> I have to go and help teach access in a few minutes
<cbx33> sorry
<ogra> cbx33, 2) run gstreamer-properties and change the default output sink to esd
<cbx33> I'm going as fast as I can
<cbx33> rihgt...ok
<pips1> oh oh, the keyboard on the thin client defaults to US...
<pips1> I need de_CH
<ogra> sure, it always did
<ogra> you need to set that in lts.conf as usual
<pips1> right, no wonderful automagic there yet :)
<ogra> or in the gnome keaboard props
<ogra> not yet
<ogra> i'll let it default to the servers keymap in the next release
<ogra> even though thats not ideal either
<pips1> so I can set a default for all clients in lts.conf and configure them individually using the gnome keyboard property?
<ogra> you can also set a default for every single client in lts.conf
<pips1> ok
<ogra> we just dont set any global defaults
<ogra> see /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/doc/ltsp-client/examples/
<ogra> it has an example file for that
<cbx33> was gstereamer properties suppsoed to be run as root?
<ogra> no
<cbx33> ok....did I need to reboot my server?
<ogra> just run it from alt-f2
<cbx33> I'll do it anyway to make sure
<ogra> nop
<cbx33> well it didn't affect it
<ogra> it should work immediately
<cbx33> lemme try something
<ogra> log out and in again
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> for just that user or all users?
<ogra> please dont try extra stuff
<ogra> with the user you just changed the setting for
<cbx33> nope didn't work
<cbx33> could not establish connection to sound server
<cbx33> maybe there is still an esd running for something else?
<ogra> so to get what you are doing there ... nobody is logged in to the server now, and you try to log in with a user on the client
<cbx33> yes
<ogra> right ?
<ogra> ok
<cbx33> I rebooted the client...
<ogra> ok
<cbx33> the first person who logs in gest sound from the onwards
<cbx33> but squsequent other users dont
<cbx33> lemme try something
<cbx33> 2 ticks
<cbx33> I must go and help teach after this
<cbx33> then I will be back ogra I'm really sorry I have to run out....I'll bb as soon as I can
<cbx33> yeh first user is sound enabled...any others no go
<cbx33> those settings didn't help
<pips1> ogra I got the lts.conf example, so now I set the value in '/usr/share/edubuntu-artwork/lts.conf' ? or where?
<cbx33> bbl
<ogra> cbx33, please put a  time.sleep(1) between the killall and the esd call in /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/sbin/ldm
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> and reboot the client
<ogra> if that doesnt help, raise the time
<ogra> if it still doesnt work with 5, ping me
<ogra> pips1, /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf is the place
<cbx33> I'll have to try that when I get back
<ogra> sure
<cbx33> brb 40 mins
* pips1 wonders why that didn't show up in his find... anyway.
<pips1> erm, ls /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/ doesn't have a lts.conf ?!
<ogra> after a new install from the iso ?
<ogra> that cant be 
<pips1> new install amd64 and since I have only i386 clients, I ran 'sudo rm -rf /opt/ltsp/amd64 && sudo ltsp-build-client --arch i386'
<ogra> aha
<pips1> was that a mistake?
<pips1> ??
<ogra> you need to run: sudo dpkg-reconfigure -pcritical edubuntu-artwork in this case
<pips1> right
<ogra> that sets the defaults for usplash, lts.conf etc 
<pips1> didn't know that :)
<ogra> no, its not documented yet .,.. my fault
* pips1 makes a note in his personal testing notes
<pips1> hmm. sound still on server, perhaps I need to re-log in with that client
<pips1> ?
<pips1> ah, I forgot... I need to try setting esd in lts.conf :)
<pips1> pardonnez moi
<ogra> no need for that if you ran the reconfigure
<ogra> but you need to reboot the client to read the lts.conf
<pips1> I rebooted, sound still only on server, now I'm looking at the lts.conf file
<pips1> So you say I should add 'SOUND-DAEMON=esd' ?
<pips1> *SOUND_DAEMON
<pips1> ogra: ?
<ogra> no
<pips1> what do you want me to try?
<ogra> dont touch the lts.conf
<pips1> right
<ogra> just if the sound works ?
<pips1> nope
<pips1> sound is still playing on the server
<pips1> any debugging steps I can take?
<ogra> you rebooted the client after the reconfigure ? 
<pips1> yep
<ogra> and your outputsink is set to esd =
<ogra> ?
<pips1> hold it... I only logged the client out and logged in again, I didn't reboot the server
<ogra> you shouldnt reboot the server
<ogra> but the client
<pips1> right
<pips1> where to I see that outputsink ?
<ogra> phew
<ogra> hit alt-f2 
<ogra> type gstreamer-properties into the input field
<ogra> hit enter
<ogra> make sure esd is selected for the audio output
<ogra> then close it again
<ogra> log out and in again
<pips1> got it. it was set to Autodetect, I will now set it to esd
<ogra> ok
<pips1> do I need to log out the client, or should it work immediately? (sound still on server)
<ogra> you need to log out i think
<pips1> oh, silly me, I ran gstreamer-properties on the client instead of on the server... bear with me
<ogra> doesnt matter
<ogra> its counts for the user, not for the hardware
<pips1> oh it doesn't?
<pips1> ack, still only sound on server
<pips1> (I re-logged in)
<pips1> :(
* pips1 notes ogra's conversation in ubuntu-devel
<ogra> hmm, thats weird, but the lts.conf is in place, right ?
<pips1> yes
<ogra> and has a line SOUND=True i suppose
<pips1> lts.conf has only five properties defined, but I guess they are as you set them
<ogra> right 
<ogra> and you rebooted the client with it in place
<pips1> yes
<ogra> and the user has the esdsink selected 
<pips1> how do I know that?
<ogra> and you didnt change *any* other sound related properties
<ogra> <ogra> hit alt-f2 
<ogra> <ogra> type gstreamer-properties into the input field
<ogra> <ogra> hit enter
<ogra> <ogra> make sure esd is selected for the audio output
<ogra> <ogra> then close it again
<ogra> <ogra> log out and in again
<pips1> esd *is* selected for audio output. If i click the test button, the sound plays on the server's speakers. I will now try to reboot the client once more and try sound once more. but sound doesn't seem to work on the client as it should. :-/
<pips1> no go :(
<ogra> you are not logged in on the server as i asked in the beginning, right ?`
<pips1> and, yes, I didn't change any sound settings anywhere else
<pips1> I *am* logged in on the server with the initial user, but I never logged in with any other (test) user
<ogra> ok, but you didnt use that user for testing anywhere
<pips1> do I need to logout the initial user on the server?
<ogra> (the initial one, while you were logged in on the server)
<ogra> if you test with it
<ogra> if you are logged in with the same user on the server, how should the sound be redirected if the system always sees you locally
<pips1> oh, well, yes I think I *did* open a sound file with the initial user on the server, if that's what you are asking
<ogra> no, i'm asking that you dont lkog in twice
<pips1> no, I never logged in twice
<ogra> dont touch the server now ... and do everything ysou do only from the client
<ogra> (and be sure to be logged out on the server)
<pips1> however, since we are really trying to get this clear: I *did boot* the thin client before I had created the additional users (test1 and test2). 
<ogra> i think you rebooted it after the reconfigure of edubuntu-artwork ?
<ogra> else sound cant work
<ogra> as i said, the client only reads the lts.conf at boot
<pips1> yes, I rebooted the client, but I never rebooted the server
<pips1> ok, so I will log out of the server with the initial user (sysadmin) now.
<pips1> just to be sure that I don't accidently mix up what I am doing
<pips1> right
<pips1> I just ran history on the server, to double check what I did on the server
<pips1> hmm, I see 1 cd /opt/ltsp/i386/etc 2 ls 3 sudo dkpg-reconfigure -pcritical edubuntu-artwork 4 ls ...
<pips1> ok, I can confirm 100% that I did all the steps as you told me to try them.
* pips1 logs out of the server
<cbx33> ok ogra I'm here
<cbx33> where are we?
<cbx33> still need me toadd those lines?
<pips1> cbx33: sound is always only on the server for me :(
<ogra> pips1, youre doing something wrong ... sadly i dont know what and have no time to discuss that  further ... i need to get the last package fixes done and the usplash progress is giving me a hard time
<cbx33> sorry ogra - did you confirm it's broken
<pips1> ogra: i see
<ogra> cbx33, waiting for your test
<pips1> ogra: Is there anything else in particular i can test?
* pips1 plugs in a usb stick on the client
<cbx33> ogra: no i meant the progress bar
<pips1> should the usb stick automount on the client?
<ogra> cbx33, i wouldnt put my last minues before the freeze into it if it werent
<cbx33> sorry ogra 
<cbx33> I'm reboot client to test
<pips1> cbx33: I can tell ogra is pressed for time, but maybe you answer me?
* RichEd is back in 20 mins
<cbx33> pips1: I'm not sure about what is wrong
<cbx33> I have to test this...then I have to go help teach something else
<pips1> cbx33: if I plug in a usb stick on the client, should it show up on the client's desktop automatically? 
<ogra> yes
<cbx33> yes
<pips1> hmm, it doesn't
<ogra> if you followed the setps that are decribed in the testing doc
<pips1> oh? I am meant to follow the steps you outlined earlier for the flight3 ... ?!
<pips1> ic
<ogra> the ones i pasted to the meeting yesterday
<cbx33> nope ogra sleep 5 didn't work
* pips1 goes to find meeting log
<cbx33> or time.sleep(5) didn't work
<pips1> heck this is chaotic :) and yesterday's meeting was a particularily fun chaos :)
<ogra> cbx33, and the other ones ?
<cbx33> hang on
<cbx33> just testing
<pips1> ogra I'm sorry i now see I completely missed out on the testing guide (add user to fuse group etc). sorry, I'm now on the ball
<ogra> pips1, but i suspect your prob lies elsewhere ... it seems to me that your lts.conf isnt read at all
<cbx33> also sometimes I get the hdd pop up
<cbx33> some times I dont
<cbx33> on the desktop
<cbx33> trying sleep1 now
<cbx33> nope still no sound
<cbx33> could it be it's not killing it?
<ogra> weird
<ogra> i cant reproduce it 
<pips1> general question, should I upgrade the system, or should I keep a "pure direct cd install" test environment?
<ogra> works fine on two different clients here
<ogra> doesnt matter 
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> there are 3 esd processes running
<cbx33> when I am logged in
<cbx33> is that ok?
<sbalneav> Morning all!
<cbx33> ok ogra some strangeness
<ogra> ?
<cbx33> on the user who sound works....has no personal esd process running
<ogra> there should be *no* esd running *at all*
<cbx33> there are two root owned esd ones running
<cbx33> can I try rebooting the server
<ogra> where do these come from ? 
<cbx33> I don;t know
<ogra> there is nothing that could start an esd process as root
<ogra> (you are talking about the server, right ?)
<cbx33> root : : : /bin/sh -c /usr/bin/esd -terminate -nobeeps -as 1 -spawnfd 20
<Amaranth> unless they've been reparented you can see who started them
<ogra> ok, you somehow managed to start esd as root on the server, indeed that wont work
<Amaranth> i don't know how with ps though
<cbx33> and root : : : /usr/bin/esd -terminate -no beeps -as 1 -spwaenfd 20
<cbx33> ogra: I did nothing
<cbx33> I'm gonnareboot the server to see if that fixes
<ogra> it will
<sbalneav> Morning ogra, did the install last night, things seemed to work well.
* ogra makes a note that users should have at least theree testusers ...
<ogra> sbalneav, seems to me as well :)
<Amaranth> cbx33: ps axjf
<cbx33> rebooting 
<cbx33> give me a tick
<Amaranth> wait, no
<ogra> i did an amd64 install with i386 chroot tofday, worked also fine
<Amaranth> run that, see if it shows who started esd
<ogra> apart from that darn progressbar issue and the new splash screen it should be final
<pips1> ogra: adding the test1 user to the 'fuse' group didn't enable the localdevices on thin client for me :-/ so there most be something strangely wrong with my setup. Did you test a amd64-server i386-client setup yourself?
<cbx33> nice
<ogra> pips1, yes
<pips1> right
<ogra> exactly what you have there
<sbalneav> pips1: Did you log out and log in again?
<pips1> on the positive side, SCP works 
<cbx33> indeed
<cbx33> pessulus will work too sooon
<cbx33> seb128 uploaded the fix 
<pips1> sbalneav: do you mean on the client?
<ogra> sbalneav, i think his lts.conf isnt read for some obscure reason
<pips1> ogra: should i try to reboot the server and re-test? 
<ogra> that shouldnt chqange anything, but try it
<pips1> ok, I will 
<sbalneav> pips1: yes, on the client.  Adding yourself to a group only gets picked up at login time.  Longstanding "feature" of Unix :)
<pips1> sbalneav: yes, I did re-login on the client but the usb stick still isn't automounted... ogra suspects that my lts.conf isn't read and that affects both the localdev and client-sound, I take it
<cbx33> ok ogra now there are no esd processes running at all
<ogra> great
<ogra> thats how it should be
<cbx33> but I still have the same problem
<ogra> cbx33, all users you try with use the esdsink now ?
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> ok here ths deal
<ogra> ?
<cbx33> when I login as me...ie the first account created
<cbx33> it started an esd process
<ogra> if you log in on the server ---
<cbx33> and it seems to randomly start home nautilus windows...
<cbx33> nope on a client
<cbx33> I am logged in on a tty....
<ogra> please
<cbx33> so i could check processes
<ogra> how do you know it started an esd process ?
<cbx33> cos I'm logged in on the servero na tty is that still bad?
<cbx33> and I just tried another user....this is still an issue
<ogra> it started an esd when you logged in from a client to the server *on* the server ?
<ogra> thats impossible 
<cbx33> it started an esd when I logged in fro ma client to the server on the server
<ogra> there is nothing that could do this
<cbx33> dude I just logged in as jom....on the client machine
<ogra> you did play with your sound settings i suppose
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> part from the gstreamer....and this user hasn't had that setting altered yet
<cbx33> like you told me to
<ogra> i told <you '(several times) to please add *all* users to the esdsink+
<cbx33> ok....
<cbx33> I jave now logged in as all users 
<cbx33> and change the gstreamer-properties
<cbx33> acutally you told me to do it for the current user and to log in and out again
<ogra> and dont use the server at all please
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> I'll reboot
<pips1> hurrayy, rebooting the server fixed the sound and localdevices issues :D
<pips1> everything working fine :)
<ogra> cool
<cbx33> tried multiple users?
<pips1> (haven't tested cbx33's problem though)
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> i still dont understand what was the prob though
<jsgotangco> hey all
<pips1> hey jsgotangco
<jsgotangco> yo! what's up?
<pips1> you arrive in the midst of the usual freeze testing fixing frenzy :)
<cbx33> heheh
<jsgotangco> pips1: that's a good thing, i just installed the latest build
<pips1> what arch? amd64 right?
<jsgotangco> yeah
<cbx33> jsgotangco: do you hve an ltsp setup to test ?
<pips1> and *two* clients to test with?
<jsgotangco> i only have 1 amd64 box and 1 i386 laptop
<jsgotangco> we could try vmware since it can pxe
<cbx33> ARGH
<cbx33> ogra....can i login on a tty to update sshkeys?
<cbx33> if not I'll log int and set static and reboot again
<ogra> sure
<jsgotangco> yes you can
<pips1> cbx33 has a wierd issue with sound playing on server for the second client user
<ogra> well, he has a problem with esd starting on the server where it shouldnt rather
<pips1> I also just discovered a wierd sound issue: system sound and sound files in /home play on the client speakers fine, but if I play a sound file from a mounted usb stick on the client, that sound plays on the *server's* speakers 
<cbx33> ok ogra
<cbx33> it is starting esd on the server
<cbx33> on the second login
<cbx33> it starts an esd server
<pips1> ogra: did you ever test playing a sound directly from a client-mounted usb stick?
<ogra> so just find out what "it" is
<ogra> pips1, i'm listening to my music collection through RB on a client from a usbdisk
<pips1> right :)
<pips1> strange that it doesn't work for me
* pips1 tests again
<cbx33> ogra: if you want to just call my machines stupid and be done with it that's fine....I have about 15-45 minutes left here
<cbx33> then I have to go home
<ogra> pips1, what happens ?
<ogra> cbx33, kill the esd on the server 
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> you must have set something that starts esd
<cbx33> dude this is a fresh install....I have done nothing apart from what I told you
<pips1> ok, I might have been confused, sound now plays on the thin client regardless
<cbx33> but that's fine
<cbx33> I can't try testing again till monday
<jsgotangco> ah! the passion! the drama!
<pips1> hehe
<pips1> ROFL
<cbx33> I'm not getting stressy
<pips1> I just love the humour :D
* cbx33 runs to the corner and cries
<cbx33> jsgotangco: and pips1 are being mean
<jsgotangco> cbx33: don't worry, we've all experienced that before ;_
<jsgotangco> ;)
<cbx33> Sir Sir.....they're picking on me
<jsgotangco> you've never seen ogra really pissed ;)
<pips1> you have?
<cbx33> I don;t want to either.....which is why I'm desperately tryin to help fix it....what I was saying was...if my machiens seem to be a funny case.....we can ignore them
<jsgotangco> pips1: sure
<jsgotangco> pips1: ive seen him in his underpants as well
<pips1> he sometimes get's a little confused what he told who in what channel :) but I have never seen him loose his temper
<jsgotangco> so did 50+ people in paris
<pips1> hehe
* pips1 is cracking up ... too little sleep
<pips1> ogra, sbalneav and all you ltsp wizzes, I just wanted to say congrats to the localdev and sound, really cool
<ogra> thanks :)
<sbalneav> NP
<sbalneav> We aim to please :)
<cbx33> I was so impressed when my client booted with sound
<cbx33> then i logged in as a different user and it didn';t work :(
<cbx33> but i think my machines are stupid
<sbalneav> esd is old and cranky.  We will be replacing it with something new, shiny and blingy.
<pips1> ok cbx33, I'll give it a go here too, what do I need to do to reproduce your problem?
<ogra> but still there is no reason why your server should start an esd 
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> login
<cbx33> with one user
<cbx33> on the licnet....
<pips1> ok done
<ogra> pips1, add another user
<cbx33> then log out...and login as a nother user
<cbx33> see what happens
<ogra> log in with it and see if sound works
<pips1> oh, I don't need to actually have two clients logged in at the same time to reproduce the issue?
<cbx33> nope
<cbx33> i don't even have 2 clients
<cbx33> not at the mo
<pips1> ic
<cbx33> I could have on monday
<jsgotangco> try vmware
<cbx33> no sound on vmware
<jsgotangco> i could do cross arch setup later but i dont think thats what you guys need
<ogra> well, and how would you decide if the sound comes out of the client or the server ?
<ogra> (in vmware)
<pips1> heh, no sound for the second client here too
<ogra> i did a cross arch setup and pips1 did one as well
<cbx33> I'm not stupid
<cbx33> w00t
<jsgotangco> cbx33: who said you are?
<ogra> pips1, set the gstreakmer sink
<cbx33> pips1: now load terminal
<ogra> no
<cbx33> and do a ps aux | grep esd
<ogra> please only< set the gstreamer sink and dont touch anything else
<pips1> ack, the system sound didn't play at all, then, if I play a sound file in /home, it plays on the server speakers ?!
<jsgotangco> heh
<pips1> so I seem to be able to confirm cbx33's findings
<ogra> *SIGH*
<pips1> darn, those that mean I *shouldn't* have tried to play that sound file in /home? ogra?
<pips1> ack he's cut off
<cbx33> now we've done it
<pips1> hehe
<pips1> ok, now i set the gestreamer sind to esd
<cbx33> can you just check that erminal for me
<pips1> so I now need to re-login with that second user, right?
<pips1> erm, cbx33, there seems to be a disagreement from ogra as to what the exact steps are to debug this :)
<pips1> wb
<pips1> I'll repost what I said
<pips1> darn, those that mean I *shouldn't* have tried to play that sound file in /home? ogra?
<pips1> ok, now i set the gestreamer sink to esd
<pips1> so I now need to re-login with that second user, right?
<ogra> i wanted a clean environment where the gstreamer autodetection was touched beforew
<ogra> and you should set the properties to esdsink
<pips1> wasn't you mean
<ogra> then log in again
<ogra> there is a known bug with gstreamer i try to hunt down
<pips1> ic
<pips1> ok I re-login now and report..
<cbx33> I wish I understood this whole gstreamer esd thing...I could help instead of hinder then
<pips1> same here
<ogra> esd is your "sounddevice" gstreamer sits above it in the stack ...
<pips1> ok, I set the sink to esd, re-logged in as user test2 and again, I didn't get the system sound. what next?
<ogra> does any esd run on your system ?
<pips1> what ps grep do I need to do?
<pips1> what am I grepping for?
<ogra> esd
<pips1> and I do the ps on the client, right?
<pips1> ack, US keyboard layout... bear with me
<ogra> just set it in gnome
<pips1> I always keep getting confused about the the options for 'ps' on liunx vs. unix... what do I use? 'ps -aux' or 'ps ex' or ?
<ogra> ax
<ogra> should be fine to see it
<pips1> thanks
<pips1> I see two processes /usr/bin/esd -nobeeps
<ogra> try with aux
<ogra> which user owns them
<ogra> ?
<pips1> test2 user
<ogra> thats the user you are logged in with atm ?
<pips1> yes
<ogra> type: env
<ogra> in the terminal
<ogra> and look if ESPEAKER is set
<ogra> like that_
<ogra> ESPEAKER=192.168.0.248:16001
<pips1> ESPEAKER=192.168.0.250:16001
<pips1> :)
<ogra> right
<ogra> ok, lets set a rootpw on the client
<ogra> sudo chroot /opt7ltsp/i386 passwd
<ogra> err
<ogra> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 passwd
<ogra> (will ask for the sudo PW first)
<pips1> sudo pw for test2, right?
<cbx33> ogra: are we getting closer?
<ogra> if thats a sudo user, yes
<cbx33> sorry had to duck out
<pips1> huh? 
<ogra> well, did you make test2 an admin while creting that user ?
<ogra> else he wont be able to sudo
<pips1> I tried the initial user password first and I got "Sorry, try again", then I tried the test2 password and i got the command line.
<ogra> is this user an admin or not ?
<pips1> no
<ogra> so use an admin :)
<pips1> I tried the initial user password, but i must have mistyped it
<ogra> just change the user in the terminal with su 
<ogra> to bewcome the admin user
<ogra> then set the root pw
<cbx33> ogra: don't you have to "unlock" the root account first
<cbx33> or does changing password unlock it?
* pips1 is now rather confused as to what happened regarding the password change on his machine
<pips1> sorry
<ogra> locking means disabling the pw
<pips1> is there a way I can start over again with this password change thing?
<pips1> ogra 
<pips1> give me the steps and I will do them 1:+
<pips1> *1:1
<ogra> pips1, you didnt change anythin if you are not the admin
<ogra> use su
<ogra> to become the admin in your gnome-terminal
* pips1 types 'su' and hits enter
<ogra> no
<ogra> su <adminusernam>
<pips1> so what?
<pips1> ah
<ogra> then give the pw for that user and you become him
<pips1> ok done
<ogra> then: sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 passwd
<ogra> give the sudo pw (of that user) and tape "root" two times or another trivial pw
<ogra> *type
<cbx33> i have to go...I'll be back later
<cbx33> sorry
<pips1> cu cbx33
<ogra> it should quit with "password accepted" or something
<pips1> by "give the sudo pw (of that user)" you mean I need to enter the initial user password in?
<ogra> no
<pips1> which one then?
<ogra> the one of <adminusernam>
<ogra> the *sudo* user
<pips1> isn't the initial user = adminusername, in my case (I named the initial user "sysadmin" btw)
<ogra> then you should be sysadmin atm and use hois pw
<pips1> ok, I entered that password, and strangly, got "sudo: /opt/ltsp/i386/: command not found"
<ogra> err
<pips1> whoami
<pips1> sysadmin
<ogra> chroot ?
* pips1 confused
<pips1> I should type "chroot"?
<ogra> <ogra> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 passwd
<ogra> <ogra> (will ask for the sudo PW first)
<ogra> <pips1> sudo pw for test2, right?
<pips1> ahhh, ok, getting there
<pips1> ok, the password is now changed 
<pips1> what next?
* pips1 listens
<ogra> ctrl-alt-f1 and log in as root
<pips1> erm, to make sure, what do you mean by root? 'root' or 'sysadmin' ?
<ogra> root
<pips1> ok
<ogra> with the password you just set
<pips1> ok done
<ogra> ps ax|grep esd
<cbx333> ok how goes it people
* cbx333 is in car....but couldn't stay away
<pips1> oh, US keyboard, where is the pipe symbol?
<jsgotangco> ahhh 
<cbx333> # pips1
<cbx333> shift #
<pips1> this is a comedy show!
<jsgotangco> you say you're in a car how are you connected? 3G?
<cbx33> GPRS
<jsgotangco> ekkk
<jsgotangco> dude
<cbx33> this is my last free month :(
<jsgotangco> CHILL
<pips1> ogra: that ps returns nothing, so it looks as esd process isn't running
<cbx33> I have to know about this esd issue.....
<jsgotangco> you'll never know about it when you crash your car while surfing the net
<cbx33> yeh....like I'm driving
<cbx33> I'm in the back ;)
<jsgotangco> crazy
<cbx33> I'm just a passenger
<pips1> hehe cbx33 you got jsgotangco there :)
<jsgotangco> well im so used to driving a car, i'm not usually a passenger ;)
<ogra> pips1, no esd running at all on the client ?
<ogra> hmm
<cbx33> heheh
* cbx33 doesn't drive yet
<cbx33> I can drive...just not legally
<ogra> can you lofg out in X and relogin as the user who had sound ?
<ogra> and check if there is an esd process then ?
<pips1> ogra:  correction: I redid the ps... there *are* two eds processes running, owned by root
<cbx33> on machine...there was no esd if they had sound...and an esd if they didn't
<cbx33> pips1: yeh i had that once too
<ogra> pips1, on the client ?
<ogra> that cant be 
<ogra> technically ... 
<pips1> erm, I'm on terminal f1 and as root, did 'ps aux | grep "esd" and I gives me two esd processes running as root
<pips1> on the client
<ogra> can you copy the exact oputput of the px/grep ?
<ogra> i have a meeting now
<cbx33> ogra: I'm sorry I can't test again today
<pips1> well, yes, i need to copy it manually by typing it hold on
<cbx33> I can test monday but not sure that's any good to you
<pips1> root     3487    0.0 0.6    4952   3540 ?    SL 14:02   0:00 /usr/bin/esd -nobeeps -public -tcp
<pips1> root     3533    0.0 0.0    3032    500 ?    Ss 14:02   0:00 /usr/bin/esd -nobeeps -public -tcp
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> ls -al /tmp please
<pips1> ogra, here we go: (not sure if i typed everything 100% correct)
<pips1> total 12
<pips1> drwxrwxrwt  3 root root   140 Oct 12 14:33 .
<pips1> drwxr-xr-x 20 root root  4096 Oct 12 11:01 
<pips1> drwxrwxrwt  2 root root    80 Oct 12 14:32 .X11-unix
<pips1> -r--r--r--  1 root root    11 Oct 12 14:32 .X6-lock
<pips1> srw-------  1 root root     0 Oct 12 14:32 .ltspfs-socket
<pips1> srw-rw----  1 root audio    0 Oct 12 14:02 alsa-dmix-3487-1160661740-878282
<pips1> -rw-------  1 root root    60 Oct 12 14:33 tmp0Gvy0E
* pips1 decides it's time to install xchat on the test server in order to be able to copy-paste rather than laboriously type
<ogra> that wont help you in the client console
<pips1> ah, I didn't realised that
<pips1> can't i use a normal gnome terminal though?
<ogra> on the client ?
<ogra> no
<pips1> oh
<ogra> as you might have noticed there is no X running on your tty1 on the client
<ogra> how should a gnome terminal work there ?
<pips1> but can i use tty7
<pips1> ?
<pips1> *can't 
<ogra> tty7 is your session on the server
<pips1> what is tty1 ?
<pips1> isn't that also a session on the server?
<ogra> obviously not
<pips1> not a gome session, but a terminal session nevertheless?
<ogra> its your client os
<pips1> but the "client os" is running on the server... in the chroot, no?
<ogra> no
<pips1> ah, 
<ogra> its running on the client
<pips1> there is a kernel running in the memory of my thin client?
<ogra> how else shoudl your client work ...
<pips1> right
<pips1> is the thin client running an x server or not?
<pips1> ah no, it isn't. x is running on the server, right
<ogra> no
* pips1 thinks this isn't the ideal time to get a lesson on ltsp from ogra :)
<ogra> no, sorry i'm rather busy following the meeting
<pips1> yeah, I figured
<RichEd> pips1: ping to msg window ... need some quick background please
<LaserJock> RichEd: cool, thanks for the info on the Education Summit
<RichEd> great ... mark is very keen to make it a success ... so it is not a cap in hand request from education ... will be soliciting input on agenda and people to invite soon.
<LaserJock> are you looking for people from all over?
<tideline> Sorry to come in late, where is the conference you all are talking about?
<LaserJock> or targeting a particular country or sector of the educational world?
<LaserJock> probably not set yet, it's down the road yet
<jsgotangco> edu summit?
<tideline> jsgotangco, yes
<RichEd> Yep ... this is one of those threads that perk up interest & rumourz so let me explain !
<jsgotangco> is edubuntucon 2 in the works?
<RichEd> ogra has wanted an education summit for some time. I have also supported that. Mark has agreed that we will host an Ubuntu and Education summit in Q2 2007.
<jsgotangco> that's nice hopefully i can still walk by then, after doing this thing at work
<RichEd> Specs for Edgy+1 will be thrashed out at Mountain View in November, with input from the education community.
<RichEd> Ubuntu and Education summit in Q2 2007 will have a strong *education flavour*. That does not mean it will be non-techncial, but the technical aspects will not dominate the education discussions. 
<jsgotangco> that's nice to know
<RichEd> Technical Development will be discussed at the next UDS ... which will probably be just after the Ubuntu and Education summit in Q2 2007.
* jsgotangco have no idea what to help on there though
<RichEd> This is early news, and things are not set in stone. Please note that lots of input is required from ogra before we cast anything in stone !
<ogra> really ?
<jsgotangco> lol
<ogra> for the edu conf ?
<tideline> is there a tentative location?
<RichEd> nope ... 
<jsgotangco> well like i said, im not from the edu sector, i have no clue at all
* jsgotangco is just good at slacking
* ogra knows everyone will hate him after the edu conference ... i'm the bad guy who has to deny all the stuff for technical reasons
<LaserJock> hehe
<sbalneav> ogra: Hey, quick question!
<RichEd> Just an agreement from sabdfl that we need it and he supports it, and a rough time Q2 2007. So no futher rumours or bunfights please :) We'll probably bounce ideas around in edubuntu meeting to take to MV. After MV the picgture will become cleaerer.
<LaserJock> I was hoping to give ogra moral support for that, but I don't know how many conferences I can get away with work-wise
<sbalneav> I just got a blingy new server here: IBM x3850
<RichEd> *picture
<sbalneav> 2 dual core hyperthreaded xenons.
<sbalneav> 8 gigs of ram
<sbalneav> It only sees 3 :)
<jsgotangco> RichEd: heck just do it over here, i could even provide you television coverage ;)
<sbalneav> mem=xxxxxxxx on the grub boot line?
<ogra> sbalneav, hmm, you probably need the bigiron kernel
<sbalneav> Ohhh
<ogra> but that has no preempt set ... 
<sbalneav> bigiron kernel?
<sbalneav> Do tell
<ogra> which is bad if you want it as ltsp server
<RichEd> jsgotangco: it will need to dovetail into UDS so the location will be the same or close. No significant travel for people doing the two in a row.
<jsgotangco> RichEd: just for consideration, though, we are very well connected in the region ;)
<sbalneav> Nah, it'll be a database server.
<ogra> apt-cache search bigiron
<sbalneav> Danka
<jsgotangco> but then, its like we're the minority here anyways ;)
<ogra> s/a/e/ :)
<RichEd> jsgotangco: we may need to motivate for the philippines for UDS then ... can you offer typhoon & tsunami guarantees ;)
<jsgotangco> tsunami doesn't happen here unfortunately
<cbx33> did we get it sorted?
<jsgotangco> and our typhoons dont happen in Q2, too bad though
<jsgotangco> just good weather and sunshine, which really sucks
<cbx33> I can't believe I got so many comments on this post http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/?p=148
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> I read an article on digg....how to get more comments on your posts
<cbx33> heheh
<jsgotangco> "How we could make our desktop better"
<jsgotangco> cbx33: self promotion in digg is shameful
<sbalneav> Denke? or danke?
<cbx33> I just read digg
<cbx33> I nenver post to it
<cbx33> just thought it was intersteing...this guy said....invite people to comment....so I did and got 14 comments 
<jsgotangco> cbx33: well people are passionate about nice things on stuff most of them have no idea how it works in the backend, unfortunately, if it shounded harsh
<cbx33> i agree with you...hence my point about not knowing enough about it
<cbx33> it was more of a what I would like to see.....in the future
<cbx33> could be years away
<jsgotangco> replacing sysinitv took almost 2 decades
<jsgotangco> ;)
<cbx33> indeed
<jsgotangco> so yeah probably in the future
<jsgotangco> heh
<jsgotangco> by that time, my brain is already wetwired with the latest kernel
<cbx33> heheh
<ogra> sbalneav, danke
<sbalneav> Got it.
<ogra> :)
<cbx33> ogra, did that get sorted ?
<cbx33> the sound?
<nixternal> well well well
<nixternal> hiya jsgotangco!
<jsgotangco> nixternal: hello from the asian netherlands
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> WE GOT SNOW!
<nixternal> you miss that don't ya
<jsgotangco> nope
<jsgotangco> I HATE SNOW
<nixternal> bah..snow is my favorite
<jsgotangco> hmm isnt it too early
<nixternal> umm..just a little
<nixternal> i will upload pics here in a minute
<nixternal> waiting for my updates, and then a reboot
<jsgotangco> i never expected to download something like 300MB of updates from beta, i was only without proper access for a week and 3 days
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> this week has been an update week for sure
<LaserJock> nixternal: I love the planet post
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> i got one guy who is a coder that is insterested in OSS...so i gave him some links, and hope he stops by
<LaserJock> we need more of that
<nixternal> he does C/C++, so right off the bat I grab a future KDE guy ;)
<LaserJock> bah
<nixternal> haha
<nixternal> come back mr. savage
<nixternal> cbx33 looks like my buddy from toronto that just got married
<nixternal> fox news seems to have upgraded their flash crap, as I can't watch videos anymore
<LaserJock> darn
<LaserJock> I never could stand the Fox News website
<LaserJock> I just want the news, darn it
<nixternal> it has gotten much better since they redesigned it this week
<nixternal> or last week
* LaserJock reminds himself to wear the Ubuntu t-shirt today
<nixternal> grrr
<LaserJock> I might go to the LUG meeting tonight
<nixternal> i need an ubuntu t-shirt
<nixternal> i was teh one idiot who bought one from cafepress
<nixternal> now i have just a plain white t-shirt
<nixternal> i don't even think it lasted a month
<LaserJock> hmm, we mdz and jane silber hand delivered mine :p
<nixternal> blah blah blah
<jsgotangco> lol
<pygi> hello all
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: hey you
<LaserJock> jsgotangco!
<LaserJock> you're alive!! ;-)
<jsgotangco> of course
<jsgotangco> with a vengeance
<jsgotangco> and a new phone
<nixternal> haha
<jsgotangco> muhahaha
* pygi dances around 
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: remember the one you saw in paris
<LaserJock> ohhh noooo
<LaserJock> yeah
<jsgotangco> i replaced it with one that can do wlan as well
<pygi> LaserJock, no what? :P
<jsgotangco> and even installed python on it
<nixternal> do you think it is wrong of me to add a 60" plasma to my amazon wishlist?
<LaserJock> yes
<nixternal> darn
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: what? python? wow
<nixternal> how about the entire Ann Coulter collection?
<LaserJock> heh
<LaserJock> Savage ;-)
<nixternal> oh ya, without a doubt
<nixternal> but coulter is hawt
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: I've only had 1 cell phone in my life
<LaserJock> it's the el cheapo one they gave me for free when I signed up
<nixternal> i have had many. and everyone was of the "free" variety
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: well today's cellphones arent even called cellphones now
<nixternal> im waiting for the linux phones to hit the US..then i will go big
<jsgotangco> nokia calls them multimedia computers nowadays
<LaserJock> heh
<jsgotangco> nixternal: i've had 2 of them before
<jsgotangco> they're just phones to me
<LaserJock> if I could pay to do the funs stuff on them then they'd be more appealing
<nixternal> oh ya....well...ummm...well my dog could beat up your dog
<nixternal> ;)
<jsgotangco> sure
<jsgotangco> but can you whip up python code using your phone?
<jsgotangco> then run it with the interpreter?
<jsgotangco> hehe
<nixternal> haha
<nixternal> i can't whip up python code on my computer
<LaserJock> sure you can
<jsgotangco> then do an ssh at the same time while listening to a stream
<LaserJock> ohhhhh
<nixternal> that isn't a cell phone..that is a puter
<jsgotangco> nixternal: nope
<jsgotangco> its my phone
<LaserJock> jerome is my technology idol :-)
<jsgotangco> i even have planet on the rss reader
<LaserJock> yeah, I asked cbx33 the other day if he read my planet post
<LaserJock> he's like "Oh yeah, loaded it on my pocket pc (or something like that) and read it in the car"
<jsgotangco> what? you're blogging now?
<LaserJock> mwuahahaha
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: welcome to www.laserjock.us
<LaserJock> I may not have a cool cell phone
<LaserJock> but darn it, I've got something
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: well cellphones as we know it are on the path to extinction
<jsgotangco> since the new ones are now integreated with wlan
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> I just want to get a decent computer
<LaserJock> I think I'm going to start saving up for one.... when I actually start making any money
<nixternal> LaserJock: did you see that i copied over the handbook to the ubuntu doc repo and it validates now?
<LaserJock> ah cool
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: then imagine now that you can ssh to your home pc using your phone at work, then do your packaging remotely...
<LaserJock> yeah
<nixternal> ya, a pain, but i got it...the pages need some massive restructuring....we are having at meeting tonight at 06:00 UTC if you are around
<LaserJock> its crazy, if I actually used my computer I'd be fine
<LaserJock> but since all I do is development work of various kinds
<LaserJock> I'm getting frustrated at my machines
<LaserJock> my cobbled together desktop is starting to fall apart
<jsgotangco> mine sucks as well
<LaserJock> and even then it's only an Athlon 1800+
<LaserJock> that's my speedy machine :-)
<nixternal> lol, i understand you on that one LaserJock
<nixternal> Sysinfo for 'MasTequila': Linux 2.6.17-10-generic running KDE 3.5.5, CPU: AMDAthlonXP2000+ at 1667 MHz (3338 bogomips), , RAM: 678/1265MB, 114 proc's, 31.50min up
<nixternal> mine isn't any better
<nixternal> this is my fast one as well
<LaserJock> yeah
<nixternal> my other machine is a t-bird 1.4 ghz with 512mb of ram...the rest are under the 1ghz mark
<LaserJock> I tried piecing together 2 machines
<nixternal> my next big purchase will probably be a laptop though
<nixternal> i need a laptop bad...mine is on its last legs...but being a student makes that one tough
<LaserJock> I think my goal will be a nice quiet AMD64 desktop machine that I can have on without my wife saying "Is that a plane?"
<jsgotangco> haha
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> well, my two workhorses are watercooled, and there is only 4 fans total between them...so i hear the humm of the flourescent lights
<LaserJock> yikes
<pips1> ogra: you still around? or are you entirely brain dead from that devel monster irc session?
<jsgotangco> yeah
<jsgotangco> that's like 3+ hours already
<pips1> !seen ogra
<ubotu> ogra is on IRC right now!
<pips1> pfft
<Laser_away> I gotta get to work, bbl
<pips1> bye
<adrian_> I see that edubuntu wants doc writers. http://nixternal.ubuntu-rocks.org/blog/2006.10.12/we-want-you/ Whilst I am no coder I would be happy to help, if I can work out how to :)
<adrian_> It may be worth adding a link in this irc header on how to dl the source docs
<adrian_> and the tumblewweed rolls through town
<adrian_> :)
<jsgotangco> nixternal: attend to your blog customer!
<nixternal> woohoo
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> people actually read that ;)
<pygi> hehe :)
<nixternal> that nixternal is a character i tell you ;)
<nixternal> adrian_: you rock for showing up!
<adrian_> Oh yup, I have it in an rss bookmark ;)
<adrian_> NP
<nixternal> whoa, there went my head ;)
<adrian_> Someone has to run with the flag :)
<nixternal> what are the chances you will be around at say 06:00 UTC?
<jsgotangco> i could have done a similar post with a different artwork though, as american artwork doesn't appeal me much
<nixternal> hehe
<adrian_> I am not certain, I am in the UK and I only have a short while befor kids go to bed but I will try :)
<nixternal> we are going to have a small handbook/doc meeting then, that is 01:00 for me ;( but I will be there...anyways..there is a lot to do,a nd I wish HedgeMage was around, as she has been rocking the whole thing of late
<nixternal> no worry, if you can't, i will at least produce a log for you to view if interested
<nixternal> are you familar at all with svn? docbook? xml?
<adrian_> Or if you want to write a quick howto, that should be sufficient and the log will help thanks.
<adrian_> I will send you a private mail address
<nixternal> thats cool
<jsgotangco> im gonna sleep
<jsgotangco> ciao
<cbx33> ping Amaranth 
<cbx33> nn jsgotangco 
* test1 waves from an edgy edubuntu thin client test install
<pips1> cbx33: note bug 65690 
<pips1> should select the esdsink for LTSP_CLIENTs
<pips1> that's the one that you discovered :)
<cbx33> :D
<cbx33> wel :(
<pygi> cbx33, !!!
<pips1> hehe
<cbx33> at least I wasn't going strange...I really thought I was fro a while
<pygi> cbx33, pm pls
<pips1> I also thought I was going nuts when sound and localdev didn't work at first
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> well the funny thing was it worked first time
<cbx33> hey LaserJock 
<LaserJock> hi cbx33 
<Burgwork> cbx33: you should see what desrt is doing with gdm-replacing-splash-screen
<cbx33> yeh?
<Burgwork> cbx33: basically taking gdm and turning it into the splash screen
<cbx33> ahhh
<Burgwork> the other issue is for us, eliminating the gap between upslash and gdm
<cbx33> nice
<LaserJock> yeah, that wierd start-stop thing always bugs me
<cbx33> yeh....and like the fade out when gksu comes up is great...until it gets to the very last bit and you get a screen flash
<keltorsori> hello
<stgraber> hi
<keltorsori> is ogra around today?
<juliux> !seen ogra 
<ubotu> ogra is on IRC right now!
<keltorsori> i see ogra's on, but on and actually at the computer are two different stories :)
<cbx33> keltorsori, he's pretty busy today
<keltorsori> no problem. just want to check to see if he'd had any ideas about the bug i submitted
<cbx33> hey pygi 
<cbx33> which bug?
<cbx33> link me?
<pygi> cbx33: what bug are you talking about? :P
<pygi> cbx33: and hi :P
<cbx33> sorry pygi not you :p
<pygi> oki :)
<Stephan102> hi there
<Stephan102> need some help pls people!!
<cbx33> shoot Stephan102 
<cbx33> what's the problem
<Stephan102> have an situation witch i know can be solved with a few bucks
<Stephan102> but want to help the people out
<Stephan102> p2 266, 64mb ram 2.1gb hdd
<cbx33> uhhuh
<pygi> me thinks that's under min reqs :-/
<Stephan102> want to install edubuntu so that preschoolers can work on the pc
<cbx33> for server or client or both :p
<cbx33> that's under the specs Stephan102 
<Stephan102> stand alone pc's
<Stephan102> installed xubuntu works like a dream
<Stephan102> also installed edubuntu server/minimal install
<cbx33> right
<cbx33> how fast is xubuntu on it?
<Stephan102> well, very good i think
<cbx33> nice
<Stephan102> have ubuntu 6.06 on laptop cent1.7 1024mb ram basically the same
<cbx33> I think you'll find that it's under specs for edubuntu
<cbx33> bascially the same?
<cbx33> as a p2 266?
<Stephan102> mmm, maybe not but not too bad
<Stephan102> can i install the gnome/kde gui from command line in server installation
<cbx33> hmm...
<cbx33> pygi, is it edubuntu-desktop
<stgraber> yes, aptitude install edubuntu-desktop
<Stephan102> installed that
<Stephan102> how do i start the service
<stgraber> /etc/init.d/gdm start
<stgraber> try that and gdm should start
<pygi> cbx33: yup, it is
<cbx33> yup
<Stephan102> gdm not in init.d directory
<Stephan102> did a xubuntu server install, then apt-get install edubuntu desktop
<Stephan102> sorry edubuntu-desktop
<Stephan102> installed no probs
<stgraber> strange, because gdm is in the depends of edubuntu-desktop, so it should be installed
<stgraber> can you do : dpkg -l | grep gdm
<Stephan102> did sudo apt-get install gdm and is now installing
<Stephan102> wasn't installed it seems
<Stephan102> sorryyy..
<Stephan102> is this all i need to run edubuntu? edubuntu-desktop and gdm?
<stgraber> the problem is that gdm should come with edubuntu-desktop, then I'm not sure you have all of the edubuntu-desktop packages installed
<Stephan102> gdm installing
<Stephan102> will give feedback now
<Stephan102> think it is because of the xubuntu server install
<Stephan102> how can i do a server install with edubuntu cd
<Stephan102> ?
<Stephan102> any of you guys know of a open source application can use for calendar sharing over lan?
<Stephan102> any client program will do, sunbird, outlook etc
* pygi was about to suggest Hula, then he stopped :)
<cbx33> nn all
<Burgwork> pygi: there is nothing wrong with Hula that won't be fixed in the next 2 decades
<pygi> Burgwork: I share the view :)
<Stephan102> if youre using outlook OLfoldersPE seems to work nice, but 5 users for $48
#edubuntu 2006-10-13
* nixternal peeks in
* nixternal peeks in waitng 4 hours for a wiki page to load
<pygi> nixternal: :P
<nixternal> finally
<nixternal> it loads, and my page trail isn't even mine
<nixternal> thanks for listening
<nixternal> ;(
<nixternal> ;) rather
<Javier_Electrico> hello
<bddebian> Howdy
<keltorsori> anyone know anything about running LTSP with only one NIC and a separate DHCP server? went through the wiki on it, but whoever wrote it missed something i'm guessing
<thompa> cool if it works , i need to do same maybe
<thompa> im having big problems with sata drive on everything
<nixternal> http://nixternal.ubuntu-rocks.org/handbook/C/
<nixternal> isn't it about meeting time?
<stgraber> yes, it's :)
<RichEd> indeed it is nixternal : just dropped the snotgobblers at school :)
<nixternal> my eyes are half crossed
<nixternal> hahaha
<nixternal> snotgobblers
<RichEd> we'll keep it brief then :)
<nixternal> yesterday was my snotgobblers 10th bday ;)
<nixternal> well, it ended an hour ago ;)
<RichEd> HedgeMage: you awake stil ?
<RichEd> *still
<HedgeMage> RichEd: Yep, I'm here :)
<nixternal> no RichEd, my eyes are half crossed from docbook hax0ring ;)
<RichEd> willvdl is supposed to be joining us ...
<HedgeMage> Where are we meeting?  Here or #ubuntu-education?
<RichEd> is quiet here so should we just get going here ?
<RichEd> we can then see if will arrives ...
<nixternal> here is fine to me
<RichEd> did you get the agenda email ? I'm just getting my copy
<nixternal> someone just posted recently as well tot he edubuntu-devel list wanting to help out with documentation as well..seems he has experience to boot
<nixternal> i got the email
<RichEd> great :)
<nixternal> well, hacking around tonight in the ubuntu doc repo, i got a very young version to build -> http://nixternal.ubuntu-rocks.org/handbook/C/
<nixternal> the NOT COMPLETEs are .xml files that are empty
<willvdl> Hi RichEd
<RichEd> strange ... I can't find my copy of the mail ... give me a sec
<nixternal> there is willvdl!
<nixternal> http://nixternal.ubuntu-rocks.org/docbook_structure.txt
<RichEd> willvdl: :)
<HedgeMage> hi willvdl 
<nixternal> that is the recommended structure, and about how it should look in docbook as well...just stuff for us to go by
<RichEd> ah got the mail ...
<RichEd> Can we work trhough the points quickly, and then add any others at the end ?
<nixternal> sure
<HedgeMage> cool
<willvdl> Hi Hedgemage, nixternal
<RichEd> * Edubuntu Handbook General
<RichEd>   = currently being looked after by Susan
<RichEd>   => but she would like to hand over and move to dev work
<RichEd>   => we would like to find a replacement and get them up to speed
<nixternal> hiya willvdl
<RichEd> I see from your blog page that you are also calling for volunteer help nixternal ...
<nixternal>  => but she would like to hand over and move to dev work
<nixternal> hacker at heart i see ;)
<RichEd> and HedgeMage you said you may have a possibility
<nixternal> always calling for volunteers RichEd
<RichEd> and nixternal you said there was someone who made an offer
<RichEd> So: 1. what is needed from a resource point of view
<nixternal> actually a couple that want to "help", don't know about "lead"
<RichEd> what sort of time commitment is needed hege?
<HedgeMage> RichEd: Possibility seems to have flaked out on us... I haven't been able to get ahold of him since I talked to you :(
<RichEd> okay ... let's define the job spec and then we have something to send out to ask people about ... we can use the lists as well
<HedgeMage> RichEd: It's pretty high right now (about 15 hours a week, not that I've been able to put in quite that much) but would go down to about 4 hours/week if we had more contributors.
<nixternal> HedgeMage: im trying to lure them in ;)
<HedgeMage> RichEd: this edition we got some contributions from RobinShepard, much from nixternal, and some from one other person... but other than that I've been trying to update everything myself.
<nixternal> i think the next couple of weeks will be hectic...i want to get the structure in place, and merge in the content as we go along
* HedgeMage nods to nixternal 
<RichEd> Okay ... we should try to spread the load and recruit a few people rather than 1.
<RichEd> And skill set ? does the person need to understand it all technically, or will:
<nixternal> i think once we have a solid foundation, it will roll on all four wheels
<RichEd> #1 working on the book make it clear
<RichEd> #2 are there tech people who advise enough to assist ?
<nixternal> technically would rock, but right now, if they know they can provide a paragraph, then bless their hearts, because we can use it
<HedgeMage> RichEd: 90% of handbook can be handled by a moderately experienced user.
<nixternal> #2 i would think so
<willvdl> well, there would be contributers and an editor
<HedgeMage> RichEd: most of it is just sitting down, doing a common task, and taking step-by-step notes.
<nixternal> actually, there will be a couple of editors...and i would say they would have the svn commit access as well
<RichEd> good willvdl structure is nice, and the title of editor may lure some sucker into committing :)
<nixternal> which mdke needs to setup with rt
<HedgeMage> lol RichEd 
<willvdl> We seem to referring specifically to the HAndbook right?
* RichEd will note thte processes from the log, aqd will send minutes ... for comment and completion
<nixternal> right now willvdl, yes
<HedgeMage> willvdl: yes
<HedgeMage> cool thanks RichEd 
<RichEd> willvdl: yes, and more or less as it stands ... no major shakeups in the discussion ... a revised view between MV and Edgy+1 but under the new guidance
<willvdl> okie. I'm thinking of documentation as a whole: ESA, handbook, technical snippits, wiki
<HedgeMage> willvdl: I'll stay on as Editor until someone new is found and brought up to speed, hopefully that will help things go smoothly.
<nixternal> im going to start hammering out the stand-alone section as well, as soon as RC is released...i think we will be fine to start the section with RC, and then edit once final is released as well
<RichEd> willvdl: this is a subset discussion, but your cross cohesion will be important to you
<HedgeMage> nixternal: Yes, that's exactly what we did last time around, and it worked well.
<RichEd> HedgeMage: what about making you sort of executive editor for now, and dropping your responsibilities to an advisory level as we get new blood ?
<nixternal> good...i should have most of that done rather quick then, if Robin doesn't have an issue (sorry, dunno the online nick there)
<HedgeMage> RichEd: That would be great.
<RichEd> then the new person at least knows they have yuo available for advise (but in a 2nd line capacity) ?
<nixternal> and of course HedgeMage, i can help out where i can around here as well...i have a good amount of hourse available since im doing the student thing again at 32 ;)
<HedgeMage> RichEd: that works... and I think it will help with continuity, which is something Handbook has desperately lacked thus far.
* HedgeMage grins at nixternal 
<HedgeMage> nixternal: you rock :D
<RichEd> Okay, we've got an idea of time & roles & structure then ... moving on:
<RichEd> 2. what is needed from a process point of view
<nixternal> yes, i know im a rock ;)
<RichEd> is there a process laid out anywhere ?
<nixternal> ubuntu doc svn accounts for hedgemage at least
<willvdl> i.e. who commits, where, moderation etc?
<RichEd> we've got the svn commit rights ... what else is needed / defined ?
<nixternal> she knows what she is doing with that, so poking mdke to launch an rt request is all that needs to be done there
<RichEd> deadlines per version ... when does the doc come out relative to the release ?
<nixternal> RichEd: we are merging the docs over to ubuntu doc if i am not mistaken?
<RichEd> not sure nixternal : expand on that ?
<willvdl> nixternal, as in doc.ubuntu 
<nixternal> well the ubuntu doc repo has the proven structure and all the necessary tie-ins for translation and rosetta
<HedgeMage> RichEd: The original idea was to release handbook the day before ubuntu release (let everyone pounce on it while waiting) but that's not ever actually happened due to volunteer turnover, etc.  
<nixternal> https://docteam.ubuntu.com i believe https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/Repository
<willvdl> oooh, hadn't even thought of translation
<RichEd> thanks nixternal & HedgeMage 
<RichEd> now how do we work with new versions ... LTS vs Edgy ... does a new version come out for each release, and does the old version doc remain available ?
<nixternal> plus all of the makefiles, and what not are readily available when it comes time for packaging, plus the lulu scripts, all of the preface files, and all licensing is on that server as well
<nixternal> all we have to worry about with the handbook on the doc team server, is the handbook
<nixternal> everything else is in place..that is how i got a test build done so quickly
<willvdl> or indeed anything else we put in there
<nixternal> RichEd: i would think so on the release versions...mostly just updates really
<nixternal> like what we already do for the Desktop Guides, Server Guides, Packaging Guides, and what not
<willvdl> well, docs should always reflect current snapshot
<HedgeMage> RichEd: Yes we try to release a new version with each ubuntu release... most is just updates, though we are trying to slowly introduce some new material to spark some ideas of "oh, I could do this in my classroom" or "oh, I could do this with my kids" etc
<nixternal> and thats the nice thing with the doc team repos as well, they get branched automagically every time...another thing we wouldn't have to worry about
<willvdl> who merges the branches?
<nixternal> mdke
<nixternal> the documentation god
<nixternal> whom i have been spending a lot of time with learning the ins and outs of the system as well
<nixternal> the translation stuff is huge, and would be a nightmare w/o the support or the structure
<willvdl> agreed there
<HedgeMage> wb RichEd 
<RichEd-1> damn adsl reset &%!$#
<nixternal> hehe
<RichEd-1> this was the last I got:
<RichEd-1> willvdl> or indeed anything else we put in there
<nixternal> wow RichEd, you missed quite a few lines
<nixternal> i will pastebin them
<nixternal> !pastebin
<ubotu> pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (you can always find it in the channel topic, among other useful things)
<RichEd-1> can someone repaste to me please or my logs will be incompete
<nixternal> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/26561/
<nixternal> RichEd ^^
<RichEd-1> thanks ... loading it now
<willvdl> basically just that releases are coupled with new versions
<RichEd-1> olkay ... back & up to speed
<RichEd-1> *okay
<RichEd> right moving on then ... next agenda point:
<RichEd> 3. what is the current status
<RichEd> = what needs to be done before handover
<RichEd> = what needs to be done for any deadlines
<RichEd> = when could or should the handover take place
<nixternal> LTSP is coming up for sure, the rest is rather empty yet, with a couple of pages with a paragraph or 2 on them
<RichEd> Can I assume that nixternal and hedge have this under control, and will and I can look at the handover that takes place after the release ?
<nixternal> structure isn't there just yet, as you can see from the test build i provided
<RichEd> Or do you guys need help now from us and tothers ?
<RichEd> *others
<RichEd> where do I see the test build ?
<nixternal> we need help with content, no doubt
<nixternal> http://nixternal.ubuntu-rocks.org/handbook/C/
<RichEd> loading ...
<nixternal> and this is what it should resemble docbook wise -> http://nixternal.ubuntu-rocks.org/docbook_structure.txt
<willvdl> PErhaps we could include in the edubuntu manifesto: though shalt write documentaiton :P
<nixternal> the structure i will get rocking for sure
<nixternal> haha willvdl +1
<HedgeMage> RichEd: It's going to be tight on content and proofing... having another person would help.
<HedgeMage> RichEd: We've just had too much turnover this release.
<nixternal> there has been a lot of turnover all over as well
<RichEd> Well maybe of we made a call at the meeting next week and on the mail lists, asking for volunteers for specific sections, it may be easier to recruit ?
<RichEd> *if
<nixternal> the only place i haven't seen the turnover, and another plus (and im not their paid pimp), the doc team. they have been the same people for over a year now
<RichEd> ubuntu doc or edubuntu doc team ?
<nixternal> ubuntu doc
<HedgeMage> RichEd: Sounds good.  I'll come up with a list of things we need to get done still.
<nixternal> but remember, ubuntu doc == Ubuntu Documentation Project, which is the main documentation team for all the ubuntu projects
<willvdl> I can certainly at this stage help with proofing certain sections
<HedgeMage> willvdl: that would be awesome.
<nixternal> definitely
<willvdl> but need to ramp up on processes, and am a bit technically out of practice
<RichEd> looking at the structure, are the <NOT COMPLETE> gaps all new sections that sid not exist in previous versions, or were they incomplete back then  as well ?
<nixternal> willvdl: are you comfortable with grabbing a section and writing from scratch?
<RichEd> *did
<willvdl> nixternal, depends on the section, not to be evasive
<nixternal> like for instance, under Part I -- Choosing the Right Install Type <- grabbing something like that and taking off with it
<nixternal> no i understand, any help is BIG help
<HedgeMage> RichEd: A combination of both of those, and some that were in the last edition, but are grossly outdated now.
<willvdl> yeah, higher level stuff, nop
<nixternal> willvdl: the higher level stuff will come with time
<nixternal> there are still some i don't even mess with, like ltsp ;)
<HedgeMage> hehe
<nixternal> the stand alone i can rock that out with my eyes shut, since i have done the kubuntu desktop guide from scratch almost
<HedgeMage> We had great help with all the LTSP stuff... it should all be ready for proofing now
<RichEd> ltsp stadard docs are being done by sbanlneav ... we just need to integerate them.
<willvdl> what about pulling in artwork team for pics, graphics, etc?
<nixternal> sblanev or however he goes by has rocked big time on that
<RichEd> It may be a help to him and us to give him some sample sections to compare against so that he gets the style and level right fore asy fit
<nixternal> willvdl: also, https://help.ubuntu.com and http://doc.ubuntu.com are some good places to pick up the style as well, and don't be affraid to grab a line or 2 from one of the existing ubuntu docs either..that only makes your life easier when creating the substance
<HedgeMage> willvdl: Lisa already has our covers done... the only other graphics we'll need are the occassional screenshot, those we can do.
<nixternal> we can always go back later and edit it
<HedgeMage> RichEd: I think sbanlneav is the person who just redid all handbook's ltsp stuff :)
<nixternal> startx --dpi 72
<nixternal> for screenshots
<willvdl> HedgeMage, thinking along the lines of supporting graphics like "this is what a thin-client network looks like"
<RichEd> HedgeMage: is <NOT COMPLETE> not started or started but not complete ?
<HedgeMage> RichEd: if you're talking about the list on the wiki, I'm apparently the only person who's seen fit to update it at all, so consider it unreliable
<nixternal> startx -- -dpi 72
<nixternal> sorry ;)
<HedgeMage> RichEd: I've kind of given up on it
<HedgeMage> RichEd: or were you talking about something else?
<nixternal> then i use imagemagick to take my snapshots using the import utility
<nixternal> RichEd: that is not started
<RichEd> I mean in the build page HedgeMage NIX
<RichEd> is is possible to build a table:
<RichEd> [ section | owner |  status ] 
<nixternal> RichEd: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuHandbook/EdgyTasks
<nixternal> i believe that is what you are referring to
<RichEd> then it is easy to see the gaps, and othwer potential volunteers can see what people are curretnly involved and what degree of commitment
<HedgeMage> nixternal: that's the one I just said is horribly out of date.
<HedgeMage> RichEd: cool
<nixternal> heh
<willvdl> RichEd, what about doing that through launchpad?
<nixternal> maybe work on creating a new one then
<RichEd> I mean one that fits and matches the http://nixternal.ubuntu-rocks.org/handbook/C/ page ?
<RichEd> so a potential helper can browse the handbook build, and see the gap status in the same visit /
<HedgeMage> ahh I hadn't seen that yet :)
<nixternal> i think the wiki would be good for managing it... https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/Projects is something we try to use with the doc team....just for an idea
<nixternal> RichEd: also, the doc team svn repo has the status feature as well, where you can track page status via the server
<RichEd> okay ... we must just make sure that we can call for people to look at the latest build and easily get an idea of where they could help
* HedgeMage nods
<RichEd> so the two links must be in the same "teaser" whatever
<RichEd> I have also just had an idea for a section in the handbook:
<RichEd>   26. Contribute to Ubuntu
<RichEd>     Contributing to Edubuntu
<nixternal> RichEd & HedgeMage -> example of status reporting -> http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/status/dg-report.html
<RichEd> + Conrtibuting to the handbook <- new section
<RichEd> so that all the handbook readers get an idea that they can help with the next one !
<nixternal> that is computated via the tags used in <chapter id="name" status="finished"> under the status
<nixternal> contributing to ubuntu has a new doc being created by the Andreas Lloyd and LaserJock
<willvdl> nixternal, presumably that status report could be even more detailed with a few extra arguments?
<nixternal> we can use that, as it covers everything you could ever imagine
<HedgeMage> RichEd: cool :D
<willvdl> I'm only used to cvs, not svn
<nixternal> willvdl: we script a wiki page to make it more informative yes
<RichEd> adding the author would be nice so that people can see who is doing waht ...
<nixternal> svn co, svn up, svn diff, and svn stat is all you need to know, until you get blessed with svn status, then you can learn commit
<nixternal> and patch -p0 <blah
<HedgeMage> nixternal: What are you doing tomorrow afternoon?
<RichEd> = an idea of workload and also skill level ... as in if XCFg can do a section then so can I ?
<nixternal> helping you HedgeMage ;)
<HedgeMage> hehe
<nixternal> i figured you were going somewhere with that
<HedgeMage> nixternal: If we can plug away hard-core when TT naps for a couple of hours, we should be able to get a lot done.
<nixternal> lol
<RichEd> I'll try to be around as well ...
<HedgeMage> Hey, I'm a mom, that's how I schedule my day :P
<nixternal> maybe tomorrow lets get a wiki page going where eveyrthing can be documented and followed
<nixternal> i will continue working ont he structure as well on the svn
<willvdl> nixternal, your repo on ubuntu-rocks, how does that map to doc.ubuntu?
<HedgeMage> nixternal: that's what I was thinking exactly
<nixternal> it doesn't...i copied and pasted ;)
<RichEd> If you guys can continue with the current version, Will and I can join in tangentially to add resources
<willvdl> ah :)
<nixternal> willvdl: i have svn access, so i can build on the server or locally which is nice..as it allows me to use some custom scripts
<RichEd> Time marches on ... let's chat quickly about:
<RichEd> * Edubuntu Handbook Future
<willvdl> ah, just your snapshot then
<RichEd>   = suggestion being made about printing / lulu.com
<RichEd>   = http://www.lulu.com/
<nixternal> RichEd: definitely LuLu
<RichEd> what do we do if the handbook is not complete ?
<willvdl> lulu is just one option though
<nixternal> i have purchased everyone of our docs from lulu
<nixternal> and so has a lot of other people
<HedgeMage> RichEd: Even if it comes out a couple of weeks late, getting it out in print is important IMHO... I've had LOTS of requests for print handbooks
<willvdl> lulu being not that big in Africa or the east
<RichEd> pre lulu question: Has it been released in an incompelte form before, or have we always managed to get it done.
<RichEd> willvdl: let's stick to getting it a process working for one outlet, and then we can expand :)
<HedgeMage> RichEd: Last release was the first one it was actually completed.
<HedgeMage> RichEd: We didn't release any kind of print because pygi and I felt it wasn't mature enough.
<RichEd> okay ... 'cos we can't lulu an incomplete book :)
<HedgeMage> RichEd: I know :)
<RichEd> And do you think this version will be mature enough ?
<nixternal> i sure hope so
<nixternal> what is our timeline btw?
<RichEd> you tell me ? nixternal & madge ?
<nixternal> edgy release or edgy+1 release?
<HedgeMage> RichEd: I'm a perfectionist, I'll never think it's good enough ;)  That said, I think it will.  It'll look like a young project, but it will be printable or I'll fall asleep at the keyboard trying.
<nixternal> lol
<nixternal> or somewhere in between
<willvdl> what about updates post release? do we sub-version and release for printing?
<RichEd> nixternal: Edgy release for electronic and maybe lulu after a bedding down period ?
<HedgeMage> RichEd: When I suggested on the mailing list that we put off printing until edgy+1 there were several responses on list and I got about 15 or 20 privately begging me not to postpone.
<nixternal> oh wow...we have 15 days to do 2 months worth of work
<nixternal> that was over exagerating
<nixternal> sorry ;)
<RichEd> We *cannot* postpone until Edgy+1 ... and the goal posts will have moved by then as well.
<nixternal> needless to say, it will be tight
<HedgeMage> RichEd: I agree.
<HedgeMage> It'll be tight, and all the help we can get will improve the quality, but I think we can still pull it off :)
<nixternal> OK, so first thing tomorrow, when TT is sleeping :)  hammer out our 15 day or less goal list, and create status and POCs for each chapter, leave open if noone is working it and so on
<RichEd> By edgy+1 the education and ubuntu and edubuntu lines will be blurring: We will be talking to a lot of people using Ubuntu native with Education applications ... and we need to work out how to cope with them as well.
<RichEd> But that is over the horizon, so our focus is now on Edubuntu handbook.
<nixternal> structure, i will hammer out and i will grab a latest build, and work in screenshots for the stand-alone section
<willvdl> especially since LTSP now has a less integrated focus
<nixternal> wow, i have 2 huge doc projects due in 2 weeks ;)
<nixternal> Edubuntu and Ichthux...this will be fun, and I thought the Edgy cycle was tight for Kubuntu and Ubuntu docs
<HedgeMage> hehe nixternal 
<RichEd> ichtux ... are you working with laserjock on that ?
<HedgeMage> RichEd: just as I was about to say, we have a lot to do, I can't think much about edgy+1 now
<RichEd> We seem to have covered most of the stuff needed to get a POA in place ... can I sumarize now so that we finish under the hour ?
<willvdl> goforit
* HedgeMage nods
<HedgeMage> cool, then I can sleep ;)
<RichEd> #1 HedgeMage and nixternal continue working as before for now ...
<RichEd> #2 RichEd summarises this meeting
<nixternal> yar RichEd, sorry for the delay, tech support people hounding me in every channel around
<RichEd> #3 Will becomes Project Manager for the handover process
<RichEd> #4 HedgeMage sends me a list for the outstanding work required now, current target
<RichEd> #5 Richard does eom recruitment via the lists
<RichEd> *some
<nixternal> hehe
<willvdl> *press-gang
<RichEd> exchange some email this weekend / monday & meet again next week, say tue to touch sides ?
<HedgeMage> sounds good
<RichEd> Then we have a structure to work against ?
* willvdl agrees
<HedgeMage> hi pips1
<RichEd> pips1 :)
<pips1> hi
* pips1 is busy configuring the autojoining for #ubuntu-education
<nixternal> works for me
<RichEd> okay ... I'll get the minutes out by the end of my day today.
<RichEd> Thanks all.
<HedgeMage> RichEd: Thanks a lot :)
<willvdl> Thanks.
<willvdl> You folks deserve medals and if the plans turn out right, they won't need to be posthumously awarded :)
<nixternal> hehe
<HedgeMage> lol willvdl 
* HedgeMage grins
* pips1 had no luck with the ppc-live cd at all... and is now rsyncing again and will give it another shot with that
<pips1> on a G5...
<Burgundavia> http://cultivation.sourceforge.net/
* pygi peeks in
<pygi> Burgundavia: o joy, what a game :)
<Burgundavia> I know
<Burgundavia> care to package it?
<Burgundavia> look at the notes
<Burgundavia> it might be thin-client safe
<pygi> Burgundavia: could I do it over the weekend pls? :)
<Burgundavia> sure
<pygi> thanks :)
<pips1> looks fun
<Burgundavia> very much a game for an Educational distro
<Burgundavia> you coudl probably do that same sort of thing with plain cairo and svg
<pygi> quite busy now, extensive testing of libburn on FreeBSD + "preparing" for my "Windows exam" in uni next week :P
<pygi> that is very fun :)
<kihai> Hi there. Does anyone know if WSMON is running with the ltsp version edubuntu has implemented?
<pips1> kihai: ogra will know
<pips1> I don't think he is up yet
<pygi> kihai: can't you use SCP to monitor who is logined to server?
<kihai> pygi: what is scp?
<pygi> kihai: Student Control Panel --> System --> Administration --> Student Control Panel
<kihai> pygi: You're sure that's implemented in Edubuntu 6.06?
<pygi> kihai: oh, Edu 6.06 :) There it has a lot less features, tho do this: sudo apt-get install student-control-panel
<kihai> pygi: Yeah I know! :) I'm waiting eagerly for 6.10 because of the implemented local device access. But I'm running Edubuntu on a productive system with around 500 users, so can't afford experimenting... :)
<pygi> kihai: :)
<kihai> pygi: I'm still hesitating installing student-control-panel as it says in the description it's for ubuntu ltsp. You're sure it runs under edubuntu without ruining some configs?
<pygi> kihai: ergh, Edubuntu is running muecow implementaion of LTSP
<pygi> kihai: ofcourse it works :)
<kihai> pygi: ...because for example you can't install ltsp-manager on Eduntu, although it's in the repos. It'll ruin your edubuntu ltsp config
<pygi> and there is no such thing as "ubuntu ltsp"
<kihai> pygi: I thought ubuntu ltsp refers to ltsp 4.1/4.2
<pygi> kihai: just "muecow"...just install it, it'll work :P
<kihai> pygi: OK, I'll give it a try...
<kihai> pygi: Man, you saved my day!!! No, let's say you saved my month!!! I've been looking for this soooo long to no avail.... You're my hero!!! :) :) :)
<pygi> kihai: :P
<pygi> kihai: glad it works for you :)
<kihai> pygi: Have you already tested Edubuntu 6.10's ltsp implementation and especially the local device access?
<pygi> kihai: ofcourse :)
<pygi> kihai: works very nice
<adrian__> pygi: I looked in yesterday and I would like to help if I can with the documentation. I have very little linux experience and am not a coder so I would be happy to read from a noob perspective. I did chat briefly to nixternal and hedgemage is the person I need to get in touch with for indepth issues. I wonder which svn client do you recommend installin (I am used to tortoise svn on windows)
<pygi> adrian__: you can poke both me & hedgemage if you are interested | talking about Edubuntu Handbook
<adrian__> Kewl :)
<adrian__> Apologies for demoting you :oops:
<pygi> lol, don't worry :)
<pygi> adrian__: try installing RapidSVN
<pygi> should be fine :)
<adrian__> Kewl, thanks
<adrian__> I'll get up to speed soon I hope :)
* pygi likes how things evolved since he first started working on this book, but it's still very very very far from optimal :(
<pygi> Burgundavia: how do I put mouse in dependencies, hehe :)
<adrian__> I can see why, having worked on an opensource portal system, by the time you finish a chapter, a new version is out! hehe
<pygi> adrian__: not that, but the involvment of people is not really well...
<pygi> The Dapper Handbook (Edubuntu Cookbook) was out the same day as Dapper
<pygi> adrian__: will brb, shower
<pygi> you ping if you want me to answer anything or you wanna know something
<pygi> same to kihai if you'r still alive :P
<adrian__> Kewl, I will try to do my noobish best. I have a couple of pc's that I hope to use the book to install the variants and follow the book as verbatim. That will sort out the issues I hope :)
<kihai> pygi: Thanks! I'm just writing down my list of packages I'll need reinstalled in 6.10. Can't wait till it's out. Although I'll then have to migrate some 450 user accounts. *praying that it'll work*
<pygi> kihai: what about "sudo apt-get dist-upgrade" :P
<keltorsori> anyone here had "menu item 'ltsp-client-builder' failed when installing before?
<pips1> pygi: I tried a dist-upgrade from dapper to edgy with beta and ran into trouble. But it might be fixed by now...
<pips1> keltorsori: I haven't
<keltorsori> I was having it with the most recent edubuntu dailies (and beta for that matter), but last week it fixed. Basically the installer would get to the build chroot bit and choke at the above mentioned point. Anyway my point is, whatever the issue is/was, it is still affecting the LTSP install on xubuntu
<pips1> keltorsori: tell ogra (once he is here)
<keltorsori> did, even filed the bug. just being a pest :)
<pips1> hehe
<keltorsori> well, and hoping my three machines aren't the only ones on the planet with this problem
<pips1> right :)
<kihai> I'm don't feel to try to dist-upgrade from 6.06 to 6.10. The system here has to be running from Mo-Fr 8am-5pm daily, so can't afford it crashing during upgrade. Will install 6.10 separately on a second hardrive and if it runs w/o probs, migrate the data from the other disk. Seems safer to me, cause if anything goes wrong, I can just plug in the first disk, reboot, and nothing has changed...
<kihai> Btw: I tried to install the current Beta Install CD, but the cd has defects. Anyone experienced that, too? The live-cd works OK, though.
<pips1> what architecture? amd64? i386? ..?
<pips1> kihai: and at what speed did you burn the cd? I always use 8x and sometimes even as low as 4x, that helps preventing bad cds
<pips1> kihai: you can test the most recent Daily build (13-Oct). This worked for me (amd64 server with i886 clients). http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/cdimage/edubuntu/daily/current/
<kihai> pips1: I burned with max speed. But the live cd already got installed, so no probs...
<ogra> keltorsori, which bug number is that ?
<keltorsori> 65234
<ogra> oh, xubuntu is missing a package apparently
<keltorsori> ahh
<keltorsori> that's useful to know :)
<ogra> i commented on the bug and assigned it to the right people 
<ogra> so it should be solved soon
<keltorsori> awesome, thanks
<keltorsori> funny thing is, up until very recently I was having the same issue with edgy edubuntu as well
<ogra> in edubuntu that was fixed long ago though
<keltorsori> i'm doing an ed install right not, just finishing the clean up
<keltorsori> gotta say i love the work you guys have done on LTSP
<ogra> committer: Oliver Grawert <ogra@ubuntu.com>
<ogra> branch nick: edubuntu.edgy
<ogra> timestamp: Sat 2006-08-19 10:55:54 +0200
<ogra> message:
<ogra>   seeded ltspfs and ltspfsd for ltsp local device support
<ogra> ------------------------------------------------------------
<ogra> there it is :)
<ogra> sorry, not so long ago ...
<ogra> great that you like it :) there is more to come
<keltorsori> i was a committed k12ltsp user (have been for a long time), but with local device support in edgy i'm moving
<ogra> yay
<keltorsori> anyway, thanks
<ogra> we'll have a lot of k12 developers at the mountainview summit next month
<ogra> i hope we can do more together ...
<cbx33> hey ogra 
<ogra> hey
<cbx33> did we find that problem
<ogra> pitti is on it
<cbx33> excellent
<ogra> after that we'll cdheck again
<cbx33> sorry about yesterday
<ogra> i'm pretty sure there are two probs
<cbx33> oh?
<ogra> but i need one solved to check the second one
<cbx33> ahhh i see
<cbx33> well I can check on monday for you
<ogra> oki
<ogra> but install tests are more important ... 
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> i will try to reproduce it here over the weekend
<cbx33> I'll try and get a 386 resize install done today
<cbx33> I have done a clear
<cbx33> hey willvdl 
<willvdl> hey. get that mail?
<cbx33> um...just checking
<willvdl> sorry, sent a 1MB pdf
<cbx33> it's ok
<willvdl> was too lazy to link it somewhere :)
<cbx33> right....I'll take a closer look when I get back from having my blood test
* RichEd is off to a meeting
<lucasvo> wtf?
<lucasvo> lucasvo@hera:~/Desktop$ mv trunk/ /home/lucasvo/Desktop/harmony/
<lucasvo> mv: cannot move `trunk/' to a subdirectory of itself, `/home/lucasvo/Desktop/harmony/trunk'
<lucasvo> lucasvo@hera:~/Desktop$ 
<pips1> bizarre
<lucasvo> indeed
<lucasvo> crappy fs
<pips1> lucasvo: you like swearing ey?
<pips1> :-P
<lucasvo> pips1: well, depends. normally I don't swear but if my rcs manages to mesh up my filesystem and I am unter time-pressure...
<pips1> rcs?
<pips1> ah
<pips1> google define:rcs is your friend :-)
<ogra> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/HowtoWriteLTSP5Plugins is that written in an understandable way ?
<jsgotangco> hi!
<bddebian> Heya
<bddebian> Hi jsgotangco
<jsgotangco> goodnight!
<sbalneav> Morning all!
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<pips1> hi sbalneav
<sbalneav> Hello pips1
<cbx33> Hi RichEd 
<lguerra> pips1, highvoltage, ubuntu-cl please
<pips1> ah!
<lucasvo> which package do I need if I have signal.h, string.h, stidio.h missing?
<juliux> lucasvo, apt-file is your friend;)
<lucasvo> juliux: I don't even know the command :)
<juliux> lucasvo, sudo aptitude install apt-file
<gnomefreak> than you have to update the data base of apt-file
<juliux> apt-file update ;)
<pips1> do we have any spanish speakers in the house that could help us with a little real-time translation in #ubuntu-education? 
<lucasvo> pips1: #edubuntu-ed
<lucasvo> pips1: #edubuntu-es
<pips1> lucasvo: thanks, we just got a translator :)
<lucasvo> pips1: do you happen to have an usb 56k modem supported by linux?
<pips1> lucasvo: no
<intelikey> with what gui apps does edubuntu come ?
<highvoltage> gnome
<highvoltage> in the future there might be an xfce option too
<intelikey> ok.
<intelikey> tanks
<highvoltage> dbdbdbbbdddbdebian
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<highvoltage> hey bddebian 
<bddebian> Heya highvoltage
<HedgeMage> hey, nixternal, you awake?
<nixternal> ya...working on some translation scripts here...i will be free in a few ;)
<HedgeMage> cool :)
<nixternal> translations go so slooooooooooooooooow
<nixternal> is there a current "Chapter" list that you want to go by?  i take it maybe the one you listed in the svn?
<HedgeMage> hehe
<nixternal> i want to start working on a task list / status page
<HedgeMage> The onle in SVN is good except we need to find a place to fit in the Student Control Panel material
<nixternal> is there any current documentation on the "SCP" that i can look at? I am not familiar with it currently
<nixternal> heh...maybe if i look at it on the puter i might understand it
<nixternal> system > admin there it is 
<HedgeMage> hehe
<nixternal> is this a LTSP thing?
<nixternal> there is no help associated with it that i can see from the application
<HedgeMage> nixternal: someone committed a section on it to the handbook stuff for us
<HedgeMage> I know squat about it
<HedgeMage> It came out while I was dealing with the chaos over here
<nixternal> well, looking at it, i would have no idea what it is...to me it looks broke
<sbalneav> Hey HedgeMage
<HedgeMage> nixternal: oh, fun
* HedgeMage sighs
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> ...
<nixternal> System: ...
<HedgeMage> nixternal: for now let's figure out where we'll stick it, then I'll attack it after I've had time to read through it and hopefully play with it
<HedgeMage> hi sbalneav :)
<nixternal> we can do that HedgeMage
<sbalneav> SCP's the Student Control Panel, cbx33 wrote that bit, I beleive.
<sbalneav> Yes, it's primary use is in thin client environments.
<HedgeMage> sbalneav: I think so... my memory fails... those few weeks were a blur.
<sbalneav> I'm still working on the ltsp bits of the doco, although I noticed some blogging about it.  Is the repo changing that I should be svn'ing to ?
<nixternal> sbalneav: the plan is to utilize the already proven infrastructure with the ubuntu documentation project
<nixternal> i uploaded everything to that server and everyting validates and builds even in its current state
<nixternal> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/Repository for more information
<sbalneav> ok
<nixternal> right now, you will need to create patches and send them to me, until they can get svn access setup for you guys
<sbalneav> Hm, that's a PITA
<nixternal> ya, but by switching we saved big time future headaches
<HedgeMage> sbalneav: Yeah, I know it's a pain, but we have needed to get into the main doc repo so we can get translation moving, etc., and they want a history of commits before we can have access... it's rather a nightmare.
<nixternal> im around all of the time anyways ;)
* HedgeMage smiles at nixternal 
<HedgeMage> Yeah, but if you had a life, handbook would be screwed :P
<sbalneav> ok, I'll try to finish up my LTSP stuff this weekend.
<HedgeMage> thanks, sbalneav 
<nixternal> good deal sbalneav...im going to restructure thats it...im not messing with any of thte content ;)
<nixternal> especially with ltsp..i would only mess it up ;0
<nixternal> way to go shift button
<nixternal> oh, i just caught the "if you had a life" joke ;)
<nixternal> well, now i could get a life, as the doc svn repo for the handbook is ready to rock and roll
<HedgeMage> nixternal: Except no one from handbook can commit to it :P
<nixternal> soon young grasshoppa
<nixternal> well, the nice thing about submitting patches..is if they aren't perfect..the person who does submit for you, makes sure they get fixed so they do work ;)
<HedgeMage> :)
<HedgeMage> Yeah, but it kind of defeats the purpose of having SVN if you have to wait for others to commit for you all the time.  It's awfully hard to collaborate that way
<nixternal> EdubuntuHandbook/TaskAndStatus  <-- how is that for a master page to follow with open tasks, tasks in progress, tasks ready for review, and completed tasks?
<nixternal> link wise
<HedgeMage> brb
<nixternal> HedgeMage: poke mdke silly, you shoul dhave no problem getting access ;)
<nixternal> truthfully, i don't think anyone who has committed in the past should
<nixternal> svn is revision control...easy to always turn back (even for my screwups ;)
<HedgeMage> nixternal: I think it's likely to make things worse if I do... every time SVN access for handbook people has come up, we've had at least 3 docteam reps give us different info on what they want us to do... the only consensus was "we don't think you're worthy of SVN access until you've been having patches committed for ages"  That's why the temp repo got set up.
<nixternal> HedgeMage: i know what you mean..i did it for 6 months...maybe laserjock and myself can do some persuasion
<nixternal> who needs or has to have svn commit access?
<HedgeMage> nixternal: Good luck, we've been trying since three months before dapper release.
<HedgeMage> nixternal: At least me and one other person (preferably sbalneav or pygi)
<nixternal> well, i will tell them i won't do translations until they add you..then they are screwed...mdke doesn't want to do the python stuff alone ;)
<HedgeMage> LOL :)
<nixternal> the kubuntu desktop guide has been rolling now for over an hour..and i still have to go through and fix all of the validation errors
<nixternal> it is a good 4 to 6 hour task for each translated document
<HedgeMage> ouch.
<nixternal> 2 to 4 for the abouts and release notes
* HedgeMage nods
<nixternal> is everyone ubuntu/kubuntu/edubuntu/xubuntu members?
<HedgeMage> nixternal: I know pygi and I are, sbalneav what about you?
<pygi> HedgeMage: what I did wrong this time? :)
<nixternal> everything ;)
<sbalneav> HedgeMage: I'm not, as yet, an Ubuntu or Edubuntu member.
<nixternal> pygi: getting you guys svn access
<HedgeMage> pygi: associating with suspicious crowds...  nixternal asked if you're an edubuntu member :P
<sbalneav> Even though I've got software that I've written in main :)
* HedgeMage grins at pygi 
<HedgeMage> sbalneav: so apply silly 
<nixternal> well, i kind of knew pygi was hooked up, as i always see him in the tb meetings
<pygi> HedgeMage: oh, that :) I refuse to confess I'm part of suspicious crowds
<sbalneav> I've got my edubuntu membership being discussed this coming wednesday :)
<nixternal> awesome sbalneav!
<HedgeMage> yay sbalneav :)
<HedgeMage> sbalneav: If I can stay up for the odd timing, I'll come cheer you on :D
<pygi> nixternal: where was I hooked up?
<nixternal> i doubt you will have a problem, unless of course they are tougher than the CC
* HedgeMage hates time zones.
<sbalneav> I'm expecting to be turned down for "political unreliability". :)
<HedgeMage> rofl sbalneav 
<pygi> sbalneav: lol 
<nixternal> as a dev and what pygi
<nixternal> what not rather ;)
<pygi> nixternal: I'm not part of MOTU team
<nixternal> me either..i think that means "MORE" work ;)
<pygi> if that's what you mean
<nixternal> i package and hand them off
<pygi> nah, I doubt I can work more then I currently do
<HedgeMage> lol
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> i hear you there
<pygi> I'm already working beyond my limits, so ...
<pygi> it's other thing that I don't do nothing useful :)
<nixternal> so HedgeMage, how does TaskAndStatus work...the page will display the tasks as well as the current status of it
<nixternal> similar to the edgy tasks page
<nixternal> or we can just continue using that and clean it up
<HedgeMage> nixternal: I'll take a look in one sec, tt needs me
<nixternal> hehe k
<nixternal> im going to create a new page, if we choose it we can use it, or we can c&p over to the existing
<nixternal> that way im productive right now
<nixternal> actually..translations need my assistance..brb
<HedgeMage> nixternal: ummm... wheres TaskAndStatus?
<nixternal> haven't created it yet ;)
<HedgeMage> ahh okay that's why I was totally confused :)
<HedgeMage> As long as it's readable and obvious I'm cool with whichever way we do it :)
<nixternal> hehe...i will hack up a cool page that will be easy to follow, and will even have special color codes and task statuses, plus maybe even a spot where people can "sign-off" that they have reviewed the doc
<nixternal> arlighty...gotta finish up these translations kind of quickly, then i will get something out to start and work with
<HedgeMage> :) cool
<HedgeMage> I'll be more active once TT naps... for now I'm still doing the parenting thing :)
<cbx33> hey HedgeMage 
<HedgeMage> hi cbx33 
<cbx33> howz it going
<HedgeMage> cbx33: Okay, wishing TT would nap so I could get work done :)
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> argh gotta dash
<cbx33> sorry 
<cbx33> bbl
<cbx33> lisa got the blurb
<HedgeMage> cool :)
<cbx33> in fact i think she sent you a mockup
<HedgeMage> I think she emailed me back already... I planned to catch up on email when TT naps
<HedgeMage> heh, yep
<nixternal> HedgeMage: i believe mdke has opened up rt tickets for you and pygi for svn access...if not, it will get done, he was positive on you two (scared of the previous structure, but I talked him away from that due to your made svn skills and you are needed for edubuntu documentation on that box anyways)
<HedgeMage> nixternal: Thanks, very cool
<HedgeMage> And yeah, i know the previous structure was a mess... having like 4 project leads in 2.5 release cycles will do that!  That's why I'm sticking around until a new editor is on board and up to speed :)
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> my dog was just crying like she had to go out
<nixternal> so i go and see what the issue is...well i have hardwood floors, and it seems the cleaning lady forgot to put the rug back in front of the dogs lazy boy chair..so she couldn't jump up into her chair...my dog cannot walk, and refuses to walk on the floors ever since i had the carpet removed
<HedgeMage> lol
<cbx33> hey pygi 
<pygi> hey ho cbx33 :)
<cbx33> howz ity going
<adrian__> Aha! I see all the cookbok team are in, :) Hedge I have offered to help with the cookbook if I can, though it comes from a total noob perspective. pygi, I thought I installed rapidsvn through synaptic, but I cannot seem to find it in a list or a file manager right click. Any suggestions?
<pygi> cbx33: good, what about you?
<cbx33> yeh good
<cbx33> got CS:Source working in my good kernel
<cbx33> and beryl is working too
<cbx33> :D
<pygi> adrian__: run "rapidsvn" in terminal
<cbx33> so I'm really pleased
<adrian__> thnx will try
<HedgeMage> adrian__: that's great to hear :)
<HedgeMage> adrian__: We really can use all the help we can get right now.
<pygi> o joy, this cultivation game build system sucks very much
<HedgeMage> BBIAB, I think TT is finally ready for that nap :)
<adrian__> Kewl, yes the terminal seems to wrk it :) Thx Hedge, I will try my best, as you can tel, the book may need a level of basic info on how to do thing :D
<cbx33> pygi, ???
<pygi> cbx33: Burgundavia asked me to package something, and the build system is the unusable
<cbx33> oh
<cbx33> :(
<cbx33> i can't belive how cool beryl is now
<cbx33> I shall be blogging later ;)
<pygi> lol
<cbx33> *gah*
<pygi> what?! :)
<EmxBA> hi
<EmxBA> pygi: would ubuntu-hr team be able to send some ubuntu 6.10 cds to bosnia when they get released?
<pygi> EmxBA: bleh, I don't think there will be shipit for Edgy
<EmxBA> i know there won't be
<EmxBA> but ubuntu-hr as a loco team automatically gets cds
<pygi> no it doesn't :)
<EmxBA> and there is no ubuntu-bs loco team
<EmxBA> according to some sites, it does ;)
<pygi> lol, some!
<HedgeMage> Yay! He's napping... finally!
<EmxBA> i should laught at you. see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue14#head-1e3555bea7bd06018bbadcf89ed23281e09d78f1 
<EmxBA> citing: "Approved LoCo teams can request 6.10, however, and will be sent out a large bundle of CDs to distribute, as well as distributors that can further spread the Ubuntu message."
<pygi> EmxBA: lol, dude, just you laugh, I don't care at all
<EmxBA> you'll get 6.10 anyway 
<HedgeMage> nixternal: still about?
<Burgwork> pygi: no, there will be shipit for edgy
<Burgwork> it explicitly says that they will continue shipping dapper
* Burgwork grumbles about people failing to read
<pygi> yes, I know that :)
* pygi knew dapper will still be shipped, but not edgy :P
#edubuntu 2006-10-14
<EmxBA> Burgwork: let me confirm it...will *only* loco teams get cds for free or everyone?
<nixternal> ya im here..sorry
<Burgwork> for edgy, just loco teams
<Burgwork> dapper cds will continue to be free
<nixternal> got a phone call right as you said my name...and then i forgot till i seen the yellow highlight
<EmxBA> i know that
<EmxBA> so pygi should send me one cd 'cause my connection is bandwidth-limited. :P
<nixternal> only locos get them for free for edgy *500 count*
<EmxBA> yay that's a lot
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> well, edgy wasn't meant to be the next LTS..edgy is nothign more than the foundation for future releases
<HedgeMage> nixternal: don't be sorry :)  You're allowed to have a life :P
<nixternal> oh now i can have a life ;)
<HedgeMage> nixternal: Only because you promised me SVN access :P
<nixternal> hehe
<pygi> nixternal: not really, that's just a figure of speech :P
<nixternal> im working on the "Edubuntu Handbook Management Control Center" ;)
<nixternal> oooh it will be awesome when it is done..and easy to use, I hope ;)
* HedgeMage grins at nixternal 
<HedgeMage> nixternal: What useful work can I be doing now that won't screw up what you're working on?
<nixternal> anything
<nixternal> im working local here, so your are fine to do whatever
<nixternal> what im working on is just a management system for chapters and what not...hopefully only take me an hour or so to complete
<nixternal> then once that is finished, im sure you will have to hack away at it a little for a clearer perspective
<HedgeMage> nixternal: sounds good :)
<adrian__> Sounds all cool. Can you recommend a reader to read the xml in a readable format. I have looked at the hand book in Kate and OOo but I am only seeing the code version, Yes I can read that but there should be a way to ready it as a normal user?
<nixternal> adrian, that is the way it is
<nixternal> ummm...actually
<nixternal> if you are using ubuntu, you can use Yelp to view what it will look like
<adrian__> Kewl, will take a peek ;) thx
<nixternal> all you do is in a command line 'yelp Edubuntu-Handbook.xml
<nixternal> and it will open it up for you to move about in...the structure isn't there, but you can see what needs what
<Burgwork> anybody who has done nfs-mounted home directories here?
<nixternal> i used to do it
<nixternal> until my nfs system went down and rendered my system(s) useless
<nixternal> imbrandon does them and swears by them..but look at him now on his super tough ibook ;)
<Burgwork> nixternal: how do I deal with permissions?
<Burgwork> who needs to own the /home/foo directories on the server?
<nixternal> foo
<Burgwork> so I need user accounts on the server for each person?
<nixternal> that is how i did it, dunno if there is an easier way of going about it
<Burgwork> right
<nixternal> i followed a howto on the wiki
* pygi recommends at least /home/others/usermame-bla if not /home2/username-nla
<pygi> bla*
<Burgwork> pygi: sorry, I don't understand what you doing
<pygi> ah, ok, nevermind
<Burgwork> oh, ugh
<Burgwork> UIDs much match
<HedgeMage> nixternal: I just finished sifting through the handbook stuff in ubuntu-doc... it looks really good, and is a LOT easier to understand than the auto-generated mess we started out with (and the bigger mess that grew out of it)
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> it will shrink as we go along as well
<nixternal> it will clean itself up
<HedgeMage> Cool :)
<adrian__> OK, still floundering but need sleep. I will follow up again in the morning, its near midnight here. Thx again all :)
<Burgwork> nixternal: did you use nis and ldap on that?
<Burgwork> s/and/or
<nixternal> i seriously cannot remember
<nixternal> actually...if you used ldap, i think that might make the task of usernames much easier to control
<Burgwork> yes, because then I have the clients auth
<Burgwork> ok, setting up ldap sucks
<mhz> moin all
<PupUser-c7f90a> greetings...newbie here looking for wireless help...shows connected, but no IP & of course no inet
<nixternal> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuHandbook/Management
<nixternal> HedgeMage: ^^
<nixternal> that is the idea...lil more work and she will be good...im gonna go get a pizza
<nixternal> bbiab
<Amaranth> "new Parental Controls [...]  for content filtering, apps, and curfews"
<Amaranth> that's for OS X Leopard
<Amaranth> crap
<nixternal> jsjs
<nixternal> doh
<nixternal> ahaha
<Burgwork> Amaranth: can willowng do timebased control?
<Amaranth> no
<Amaranth> it's a good idea though
<Amaranth> Although you would want to block all access to the computer, I would think.
<Amaranth> Not just web access
<Burgwork> yep
<Burgwork> I am saddened that teh SoC project on SafetyBoat went nowhere
<Burgwork> federico at Novell is working on time and access control, amongst other adminy type things
<EmxBA> anyone alive?
<EmxBA> it's 03:02 :/
<keltorsori> alive
<lguerra> RichEd: ping
<samuel> if I do sudo apt-get install edubuntu for the kid's will that just install another desktop session? or will i lost my standard ubuntu?
<HedgeMage> samuel: it will make the edubuntu look the default, but you can change to whatever look you want.  Other than that, it just adds a few educational packages.
<HedgeMage> samuel: the original ubuntu stuff is all still there.
<samuel> thanks
<HedgeMage> np :)
<samuel> I have three kid's and figured they would get use out of it
<HedgeMage> :)
<nixternal> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuHandbook/Management
<nixternal> ;)
<HedgeMage> nixternal: cool :)
<nixternal> something like that will work?
<nixternal> <rr72> nixternal~ did you talk to HedgMage recently?
<nixternal> do you know that guy?
<nixternal> kid i should say
<nixternal> he knows how to get under a fingernail and just dig
<HedgeMage> Yes, I know him.
<HedgeMage> long story.
<HedgeMage> nixternal: you're welcome to tell him I'm usually in here or #ubuntu-offtopic
<nixternal> i rather not
<nixternal> he is in #ubuntu-chicago
<HedgeMage> heh
<HedgeMage> ahh
<nixternal> i can't take anymore of that
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> he lives right up the road actually
<nixternal> the way i like it
<HedgeMage> He's not so bad... you just have to let him know what is and isn't acceptable behavior.
<nixternal> ya, so he knows how to push up to the line...i let him know from day one...i have him on a leash, he knows not to mess with me
<nixternal> i made the boundaries rather tight..he has gotten much better though i must say
* HedgeMage nods
<HedgeMage> He just needs clear boundaries.
<nixternal> heh, forget clear, i painted them for him the first night i dealt with him..i brought in my irssi bofh script and left him on op ;)
<nixternal> he has more ghosts on this server because of all the bans he has been through..but i think the chicago team is starting to mold him into a future hacker actually
<HedgeMage> lol
<HedgeMage> nixternal: bbiab TT calls
<nixternal> hehe k
<HedgeMage> back :)
<nixternal> thanks for the warning
<HedgeMage> :P
<Javier_Electrico> hello
<nixternal> woohoo, translations are done!
<nixternal> not for us yet though ;)
<HedgeMage> hehe :)
<nixternal> does edubuntu have an oem-config as well?
<nixternal> i didn't pay attention on my install earlier
<Burgundavia> nixternal: yes
<nixternal> ok, that is something else that will need to get added to the handbook as well...that also should have been added to edgy docs but wasn't
<nixternal> that is pretty much a feature not many people even know about
<nixternal> im wondering about how we should structure the handbook xml
<nixternal> <parts><chapters>
<nixternal> or just
<nixternal> <chapters><sect>
<Burgundavia> the least amount of xml you produce, the better
<nixternal> well, least amount you mean the last amount of files
<nixternal> either way will be about the same amount of xml
<nixternal> i think it is best to do
<nixternal> Part I: Introduction as 1 xml file.  It coverst "About this Book", "The Ubuntu Philosophy", "Edubuntu", "Choosing The Correct Install Type", "Basic Concepts: Networks & Networking"
<Burgundavia> also consider what is easiest for people when they move sections around
<Burgundavia> personally I hate docbook and would rather nto use it
<nixternal> easiest would be 26 to 30 xml files
<nixternal> docbook rules
<nixternal> 1 xml file for each chapter...easier to get a bunch of people in there and working
<Burgundavia> if you think docbook rules, you are mad
<Burgundavia> it is powerful but very arcane and hard to see
<nixternal> ya, i think if we have 1 xml file for each chapter right now..that will be easiest for people to edit, and then at the end bring them all together into chapters
<nixternal> i want to rename each file, beginning with the part# they will fall in...for instance 'p1-about.xml' , p1-philosophy.xml , p1-edubuntu.xml and so on
<nixternal> they will be easier to seperate and pick out that way for people not up on svn and what not
<nixternal> HedgeMage: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/26713/  <- that is my layout idea
<nixternal> actually, i think the 'partone-partfour'.xml files are not needed...i should i have just done part1 to part4 headings there
* HedgeMage takes a peek
<HedgeMage> nixternal: looks pretty good... is there no way to seperate the LTSP and Standalone parts into pre-install, install, and post-install chunks ?
<nixternal> sure
<nixternal> p2-pre-filename.xml
<nixternal> p2-post-filename.xml
<nixternal> something like that
* HedgeMage nods
<HedgeMage> that would work fine, then I'm sure we can do something with the book itself so it looks nice in print.
<nixternal> when they are called though in the handbook.xml file though, it will be chunked like that
* HedgeMage nods
<HedgeMage> that's what's important, then
<nixternal> ya
<nixternal> seperation in the p1-filename.xml is good...and when called into the handbook.xml it will have the proper layout
<HedgeMage> our docpeople are smart, I just want the seperation for our readers (not that they aren't smart, but the material will be new/foriegn to many of them)
<HedgeMage> nixternal: cool
<nixternal> it will layout similar to the ubuntu or kubuntu desktop guides actually
* HedgeMage hasn't seen them, so she has no clue if that's a good or bad thing :P
<nixternal> hehe
<toel> hai all friend
<toel> im' ronny from indonesia
<dudanogueira> hello there! will the cookbook be translated to others languages?
<pygi> dudanogueira: yes, if people volunteer to do so :)
<dudanogueira> pygi, i would like to help on brazilillian translations, if possible.
<dudanogueira> it will be translated from rosetta?
<pygi> dudanogueira: the edubuntu cookbook won't be translatable from Rosetta
<dudanogueira> i just saw the post on planet.ubuntu.com
<pygi> we are currently working on "Edubuntu Handbook" for edgy and I believe that will be translatable from Rosetta
<dudanogueira> suuuuuuuuuuure, its the hand book, sorry :)
<dudanogueira> great! ill search for it and bring some more voluteers for translating this document. pygi thank you!
<pygi> dudanogueira: you are welcome
<pygi> feel free to ask if you need help with anything
<dudanogueira> had to go now. but ill come back latter
<dudanogueira> ok, thank ya!
<bddebian> Howdy
<pygi> hey ho bddebian :)
<bddebian> Hello pygi
<pygi> how is you?
<bddebian> OK I guess, thanks.  You?
<pygi> extremly tired
<pygi> haven't slept for more then 3 hours every night this week
<Javier_Electrico> hello
<pygi> hey cbx33, Yagisan 
<cbx33> hey pygi 
<Yagisan> G'day pygi 
* Yagisan waves to cbx33
<cbx33> hi Yagisan 
<cbx33> long time no see
<Yagisan> cbx33, exams monday thats why
<cbx33> ahhh
<pygi> Yagisan: oh, my exams Friday .... I think :)
<pygi> will fail them, but whateva :P
<Yagisan> Firday is my last exam
<Yagisan> O_O
<Yagisan> oh dear - can't type english - not enough caffeine
<pygi> Yagisan: :)
<Yagisan> pygi, my kettle broke on friday
<Yagisan> I only got a new one today
<Yagisan> er yseterday lat evening actually
<Yagisan> and it's sunday now
<pygi> oh :P
<Yagisan> so thats 2 days with no coffee
<Yagisan> and 2 very very energetic children
<pygi> :P :P :P
<Yagisan> my brain feels like mush
<pygi> well, as I said above, I haven't slept for more then 3 hours every night this week
<pygi> and that will continue in the future as well
<Yagisan> oh oh , and this was good too
<Yagisan> today ws the 3rd day of above 35 degree tempretures in the city
<pygi> o joy
<Yagisan> being in the boondocks
<pygi> here it's cold :-/
<Yagisan> I'm about 4 degrees hotter
<Yagisan> so it's ~40 outside, and somewhat hotter inside
<Yagisan> and suddenly all 3 pcs started going beep-beep-beep beep-beep-beep beep-beep-beep
<Yagisan> O_O
<pygi> !!!
<pygi> I have 5 heatsinks for that purpose :)
<Yagisan> pygi - it's is a veritable windfarm in here
<Yagisan> and they still all tripped the overheat alarm
<Yagisan> and dropped off the net
<pygi> oh!!!
<Yagisan> argh - I tried to tab complete grep
<pygi> :P
<Yagisan> it had to beep 3 times before I realised :(
<cbx33> sorry
* cbx33 was playing with his delta 1010
<cbx33> got some new leads so I can hook in the effects unit
<cbx33> :)
<cbx33> brb - kernel testing
<cbx33> ping Amaranth 
* nixternal stretches, yawns, wipes his eyes, trips over the dog, and stumbles into the room
<pygi> hey nixternal 
<nixternal> is the whole firefox logo thing that big of a deal?
<nixternal> im sick of seeing the mailing lists flooded with it
<nixternal> hiya pygi, btw ;)
<pygi> nixternal: :)
<keltorsori> any edubuntu wizards here?
<pygi> keltorsori: how may I help you?
<keltorsori> i've got two NICs, my clients are connected to eth1 on the 192.168.0.xxx subnet. eth0 is my net connection with an IP of 192.168.1.10, how in the world can i get my clients online. there was a wiki article on this but i can't for the life of me find it
* pygi thinks that's iptable's task
<pygi> or read this perhaps: http://edubuntu.com/GettingStarted
<keltorsori> really only covers the first nic
* pygi did such implementation at one occasion, he's sure in that
#edubuntu 2006-10-15
<pygi> keltorsori: do the forwarding bits?
<keltorsori> gonna find out in a minute. still trying to find more info
<pygi> I just think you could do iptables forwarding bits, and it should work
<keltorsori> seems like a bit more work than i remember...i'll figure it out hopefully
<keltorsori> ok, i've got the stupids today. anyone able to help me get eth0 up?
<keltorsori> i've got two nics, just did a fresh install
<keltorsori> configured eth1 only during the install
<keltorsori> need to get eth0 up now
<keltorsori> clients are booting off eth1 just fine
<sbalneav> Evening all
<jono> hey sbalneav 
<sbalneav> Hello jono
<nixternal> http://nixternal.ubuntu-rocks.org/handbook/C/
<nixternal> ^^ new handbook layout if you are interested...i am closer to getting what we want i think
<nixternal> a little tweaking and it will be gold
* HedgeMage <3 nixternal 
<nixternal> actually, i may have just fixed the chunk
<nixternal> wo0t
<nixternal> give me one secone to upload the new
<nixternal> now look at it
<nixternal> do you like the last one, or this one better?
<sbalneav> nixternal: That a svn repo?
<nixternal> once we say yay to a layout, im going to copy over all of the current content intot he correct files, upload them to the doc server and the binary server..this way here, they can get worked on there, and i can just copy over to the doc
<nixternal> not yet sbalneav, it is local
<sbalneav> So only HedgeMage can see?  Or can I see somehow?
<nixternal> you can see it
<nixternal> sbalneav: you have been commiting all of the ltsp i assume to the binaryredneck svn server right?
<sbalneav> Yes.
<HedgeMage> nixternal: hang on let me look
<nixternal> ok...that is what i will do then...i will get all of your content into the layout, and get them on both servers, that way there you can just work from them, and i can copy over tot he doc server when needed for the time being as well
<HedgeMage> nixternal: I like how it looks right now
<nixternal> the layout i have has a file for each chapter or <sect1> docbook way
<sbalneav> So I should keep updating to binary redneck?
<nixternal> ok HedgeMage, i figured that was what you wanted
<sbalneav> Or send patches?
<nixternal> sure sbalneav, go ahead for the time being..it is nothing for me to copy over right now
<sbalneav> k
<HedgeMage> nixternal: what's easier for you, the two repo method or the patch method?
<nixternal> that way it doesn't slow you down
<nixternal> two repo for right now, until they are both synched, then we will switch over 100% to the doc svn
<nixternal> this way i will be able to work the doc svn into shape, and not interfere with the work that sbalneav has done
<nixternal> it should only be a day or 2 i am hoping to have them synched
<HedgeMage> okay, cool
* HedgeMage smooches nixternal 
<sbalneav> I've been going through the touch slog of synching up the lts.conf options that Edubuntu implements into the docs.
<sbalneav> s/touch/tough/
* HedgeMage nods
<HedgeMage> you both rock :)
<nixternal> alrighty..time for some more messin' around..the race is over ;)
<HedgeMage> :)
<HedgeMage> nixternal: who won? my dad was supposed to call me.
<nixternal> kasey
<nixternal> every girls favorite racer
<HedgeMage> lol
<nixternal> what are we going to do with the Student Control Panel?  Stick it in Part 4?
<HedgeMage> nixternal: Well, I don't know anything about it? isn't it an ltsp only thing?
<nixternal> actually, i believe it is...so i think it will be fine in part 4 as well
<nixternal> or pt2 post install section
<HedgeMage> if its ltsp only it should go in ltsp post-install
<nixternal> will do
<nixternal> ooh docbook is making me mad right now...it validates perfectly, and as soon as i copy over and tweak the scp portion...it just dies...and the funny thing is, the local xml file validates for proper xml structure...but the entire build divebombs
<nixternal> i was on a roll to have everything complete by tomorrow, but this one little bug is gonna cause me to drink ;)
* HedgeMage hugs nixternal 
<nixternal> don't you hate when the problem at hand is right in front of your face ;)
<pygi> bddebian: hey ho
<bddebian> Hi pygi
<fbtab> greets all
<fbtab> what method is recommended for automated installations? fai?
<fbtab> i tryed seeding, certain things didnt work, tryed ks, other things didnt work..
<pygi> ogra: you have a sec?
<fbtab> i must say, i totally like the themeing behind edubuntu, very nice
<juliux> ogra, ping
<juliux> can i build an extra kernel for the ltsp chroot?
<cbx33> ping Amaranth 
<Amaranth> cbx33: pong
<cbx33> hey dude you in #beryl?
<cbx33> hoping you can help me out
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> my generic nvidia module is broken
<cbx33> as of about 2 days ago....I was using your repos
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<cbx33> Amaranth, any ideas?
<cbx33> I was following this
<cbx33> http://wiki.beryl-project.org/index.php/Install/Ubuntu/Edgy/nVIDIA
<highvoltage> hey cbx33 
<cbx33> does where it says about getting it from the nvidia site
<cbx33> and recompiling on kernel updates
<Amaranth> cbx33: using deb http://amaranth.selfip.com/ edgy lrm
<cbx33> how do you do that....just rerun the script?
<Amaranth> right?
<cbx33> hi highvoltage 
<cbx33> deb http://amaranth.selfip.com edgy lrm
<cbx33> yup
<Amaranth> yeah
<cbx33> the module doesn't load on the generic kernel
<Amaranth> make sure l-r-m-2.6.17-10-generic and nvidia-glx are up-to-date and installed from that repo
<cbx33> 2 secs
<cbx33> ii  linux-restricted-modules-2.6.17-10-386     2.6.17.5-11~amaranth                  Non-free Linux 2.6.17 modules on 386
<cbx33> ii  linux-restricted-modules-2.6.17-10-generic 2.6.17.5-11~amaranth                  Non-free Linux 2.6.17 modules on x86_64 gene
<cbx33> ii  linux-restricted-modules-common            2.6.17.5-11~amaranth                  Non-free Linux 2.6.17 modules helper script
<cbx33> ii  nvidia-glx                                 1.0.9625+2.6.17.5-11~amaranth         NVIDIA binary XFree86 4.x/X.Org driver
<Amaranth> weird
<Amaranth> any errors when you try to load the module with generic?
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> error using install command for module nvidia
<Amaranth> *boggle*
<cbx33> was working before the kernel image update a few days ago
<Amaranth> weird
<Amaranth> oh, .33 breaks things for some people
<Amaranth> i haven't rebooted yet, still using .31
<cbx33> ahhh....
<cbx33> :(
<cbx33> what do you suggest?
<Amaranth> *shrug*
<cbx33> is compiling the driver my self easy?
<Amaranth> I just make packages, I have no idea how any of it works
<Amaranth> compiling the driver probably won't make a difference
<cbx33> sudo sh NVIDIA-Linux-x86-1.0-9625-pkg1.run
<cbx33> ah
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> so I guess I wait then?
<Amaranth> but all you need is your kernel headers, gcc, and the .run file
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> then do I rerun that script everytime they update the kernel?
<Amaranth> then just run that command you pasted and hit enter a couple times
<Amaranth> every time they bump the ABI
<Amaranth> which probably won't happen anymore for edgy unless a security fix requires it
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> if I wanted to....how would I go back to the edgy repos?
<cbx33> for the nvidia and restricted modules stuff?
<Amaranth> *shrug*
<Amaranth> i haven't installed them like that since sarge
<Amaranth> well, since sarge was testing
<cbx33> well i kinda meant....is it possible to stop using your repo?
<cbx33> could I just uninstall the pacakges...disable your repo....apt-get update.....and then reinstall
<Amaranth> oh, yeah
<cbx33> and do we know if .33 is going to get fixed?
<Amaranth> *shrug*
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> thanks Amaranth 
<cbx33> sorry to have troubled you
<Amaranth> someone has to figure out what's broken and report it first
* cbx33 has no clue
<cbx33> hence why I'm thinking of taking a backstep
<cbx33> my dual core is useless at the mo
<cbx33> cos I'm only using 386 :S
<juliux> hi all
<juliux> did somebody knows if it is possible to build an extra kernel for the ltsp chroot
<highvoltage> hey juliux 
<juliux> hi highvoltage 
<highvoltage> juliux: you can build it and place it in /var/lib/tftpboot
<highvoltage> you can then just specifiy the new kernel in teh dhcpd.conf file
<juliux> highvoltage, ah cool, i need a kernel with isa support
<highvoltage> wow, the current ubuntu kernels doesn't have it?
<highvoltage> heh, I suppose very very few people use any isa devices these days.
<crimsun> CONFIG_ISA=y
<crimsun> CONFIG_EISA=y
<highvoltage> juliux: ^^^
<juliux> sorry
<juliux> we have here a surfstation 
<highvoltage> geez, crimsun is really everywhere :)
<juliux> and the kernel boots up but then comes an error etho not found
<highvoltage> juliux: what card is it? it's probably that the kernel module for that card is not available?
<juliux> we testit with one intel an a 3com card booth isa
<juliux> highvoltage, i will post the error message later, we have an ubuntu-de meeting at the moment
* highvoltage > bed
<pygi> HedgeMage: !!!
<HedgeMage> hi pygi 
<nixternal> hi! ;)
<pygi> how is you?!
<HedgeMage> hi nixternal 
<HedgeMage> I'm good, just trying to get family stuff covered so I can work on handbook and on next week's workshop I'm giving
<nixternal> my lord all of my football picks are hurting
<pygi> nixternal: :P
<pygi> I've been trying to sleep lately, no go :P
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> i keep putting my schoolwork off, as getting the handbook functioning has been rather addictive
<pygi> :P
<pygi> I have two exams this week, and I already said I'll fail them =P
<pygi> it won't be good for my uni career :P
<pygi> nice HedgeMage :)
* pygi also has to prepare a presentation for the Hungarian Ubuntu conference
<HedgeMage> heh
<nixternal> ya, i have about 6 presentations to give at the Ubuntu Chicago Conference here in 2 weeks as well
<nixternal> this month has been a busy one...plus I have all of the documentation for Ichthux as well
<pygi> same here, October, 28
<nixternal> ya, oct 28 for chicago meeting as well
<pygi> :P
<nixternal> and then the 29th i have a LUG meeting i have yet organized
<nixternal> i put my name on the officer list, and it seems they voted and elected me the president
<HedgeMage> hehe :)
<nixternal> now, i can't just say no, i don't want to do that
<pygi> :P
<pygi> well, hello mr. president :)
<nixternal> i really don't, but i figured i will give them 6 months to a year and hand it over
<nixternal> ya, i asked if there was a pay raise involved ;)
<nixternal> HedgeMage: you see my email i sent?
<pygi> nixternal: I have some bad things involved with phrase "mr. president" :P
<nixternal> i like my mr. president, it just seems the rest of the world doesn't ;)
<nixternal> he is a persistant little bugger
<HedgeMage> nixternal: nope, haven't checked yet
<HedgeMage> brb tt calls
<nixternal> hehe
<pygi> well, if the folks who present you computer science in uni every day call you mr. president, you'd stop loving it :P
<nixternal> i think HedgeMage should change her nick to TT_Rules_Me
<nixternal> hehe, i hide from them when i am at school
<nixternal> i am labeled "The Ubuntu Guy"
<pygi> oh, this folks haven't got around to part that I use ubuntu or anything related yet :)
<nixternal> they love and hate me at the same time. Their install fests were roughly 10 people...then i joined, brought in Ubuntu, and we have had 3 back to back with more than 100 people, which a majority want Ubuntu installed
<pygi> I have to use Windows in uni :-/
<nixternal> but i have taken over the slackware mentality they (5 of them when I joined) had, and showed them it isn't about Slackware, it isn't about Ubuntu, it is about Linux, and supporting and helping others with their Linux quest
<nixternal> pygi: i would have to as well, but i use LiveCDs now ;)
<pygi> nixternal: well, considering I was almost kicked out when I mentioned linux, I don't wanna play with using liveCD's :P
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> hmm...switching over from the "original" handbook layout to the "new" layout is tricky for 2 files, sect-ltsp-ltsconf.xml and sect-ltsp-theory.xml...i don't know where to merge them in with
<nixternal> i think that sect-ltsp-ltsconf.xml should be part of the p2-client.xml file as it seems the lts.conf is for the workstations
<nixternal> the ltsp-theory could be merged in with p2-intro.xml or create a p2-theory.xml and add one more section to the chapter layout
<pygi> nixternal: hm, right
<nixternal> binaryredneck svn updated with all of the new files, redid the directory structure, and added a README to the root directory....so 'svn up' if you are using HedgeMage's svn ;)
<pygi> I'm afraid of doing any activities right now
<pygi> my hardware seems to be randomly failing :-/
<cbx33> excuse my stupidity here people
<cbx33> how can I find out pacakges that were installed from a certain repo?
<cbx33> nixternal, cool
<nixternal> ok..now i think i can start adding some content ;)
<cbx33> nixternal, where are the images stored now
<cbx33> oh and I see a typo
<nixternal> Installiol?
<nixternal> they are stored in the images/ directory in root ;)
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> Installionl
<nixternal> i fixed that..the one in the handbook.xml file
<nixternal> i noticed it looking at the html that was built
#edubuntu 2007-10-08
<bddebian> Heya
<Gadi> evening, all
<Gadi> has anyone played with audio recording on an edubuntu thin client?
<sbalneav> Evening all
<LaserJock> hi sbalneav
<sbalneav> Hey LaserJock
<kgoetz> hi
<kgoetz> win 22
<RichEd> hi ogra
<ogra> hey hey
<RichEd> how's the dev & testing ? you winning ?
<ogra> waiting for results ... installer is running in my virtual machine but i'm not at the critical point yet
* RichEd holds thumbs ...
<ogra> that build shgould get through fine, but i havent seen it completely yet
<ogra> only the pieces i worked on ...
<RichEd> and with ubuntu ? any showstoppers we are aware of at the moment ?
<ogra> not that i know of
<RichEd> good :)
<ogra> they shoved off a lot from the pacxkages (unused docs, duplicated files etc)
<ogra> that gained *us* about 30M free space
<ogra> i'm still looking what to do with that little gift
<ogra> likely it needs to be filled with langpacks ... we only have english atm on the main CD
<bddebian> Heya
<stgraber> ogra: just tested today edubuntu server, the chroot failed to build (a rename error at the end of the building process), then rebooted and everything worked just fine (booted a thin client worked the first time !!!)
<ogra> stgraber, yeah, i copied the log to /taget ... :P
<stgraber> ogra: the error was about renaming a /var/log/????.log file (sorry didn't take note of the file name)
<ogra> indeed /taget doesnt exist :)
<stgraber> ok, so apart from that everything works fine
<ogra> needed to be /target
<ogra> with that fix all should be fine, will be in the next build
<stgraber> nice, so RC should install and work fine this time :)
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> and we have lots of spare space
<stgraber> yeah I heard of that. You'll be able to put some of the langpacks back in :)
<ogra> i'm thinking about icedtea (free sun java) and two or three languages (es,fr,de)
<mherweg> hi everyone
<juliux> hi mherweg
<sbalneav> Morning all
<juliux> morning sbalneav
<mherweg> q: what are th minimum reqirements for an edubuntu thinclient : 32 or 48 MB RAM ?
<sbalneav> Morning.
<sbalneav> 32's VERY tight, but will work.  It will be very slow. 48 would be better.
<sbalneav> ogra: You around?
<ogra> sure
<mherweg> after a fres install of the 7.10beta version of the swerver i get "client not autorized" (or similar) on the thin client
<sbalneav> You need to do an ltsp-update-sshkeys
<ogra> yeah, thats only solved in the most recen image
<stgraber> mherweg: it's known issue and will be fixed in RC. Do what sbalneav said.
<mherweg> ok, thanks . i'll try
<dtrask> Ok guys...in market for new laptop....ubuntu or edubuntu of course....any recommendations?  Dell?  System76?  Others?
<ogra> macbook fully eqipped :)
<dtrask> actually on a MacBook Pro now  :-)
<dtrask> MacBook very well supported in terms of hardware drivers in Gutsy?
<ogra> well, no idea, but the HW i good :)
<ogra> for me the most critical factor of a laptop is still the keyboard at first ... then the display quality and case stability
<ogra> all three are supposed to be good on macbooks
<LaserJock> ogra: pitti approved my edubuntu-docs upload
<LaserJock> ogra: so barring any bugs I think edubuntu-docs should be done
<ogra> LaserJock, what was that ?
<LaserJock> I added in all the translations
<ogra> how much bigger is it  now ?
<LaserJock> I had to really hack around debian/rules to do the translations
<LaserJock> about 1MB I think
<ogra> ah, k
<ogra> thas fine then
<LaserJock> I removed translations that were less than 10% translated
<LaserJock> ogra: the .deb went from 909K to 1.6M
<ogra> fine
<ogra> we have lots of space on the server CD atm
<ogra> but i still need to be careful with live
<LaserJock> I pngcrushed the screenshots
<davmor2> ogra:  Shouldn't netboot's edubuntu not produce the desktop cd equiv ?
<ogra> davmor2, nope
<ogra> only the edubuntu-desktop install
<ogra> which is identical with the server install desktop wise
<davmor2> Right, but there is no addon-cd for netboot.  So does it tell you anywhere that you need it?  Or how to install it?
<ogra> no
<LaserJock> I would assume we'll have it in the release notes
<ogra> edubuntu-docs has some info though
<ogra> but they are more general
<ogra> yeah, release notes sounds good
<ogra> we'll need to have the metapackages for hardy :)
<ogra> or tasks
<ogra> whatever fits better
<davmor2> Right okay so it's not a bug there is just no docs for it.  No problems.  I was just expecting the equiv to a live cd install :)
<davmor2> so I'll edit it now on the test tracker :)
<ogra> davmor2, invalid was probably to harsh, whishlist sounds better :)
<davmor2> ogra: I thought it was missing all the education packages that's a major flaw :)  Now I know different I have changed it :)
<ogra> the live install gives you what once was edubuntu-desktop
<ogra> well, nearly ...
<ogra> its odd that there are still differences but its a lot better than in feisty at least
<davmor2> so is done to make it fit on a cd still?
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> we needed space on the server CD
<davmor2> Right it's only so I know while testing :)
<ogra> the suqashfs we use on live gives us some extra space so we could keep many edu apps there
<davmor2> cool
<ogra> but users complained when we made -desktop the same everywhere since they didnt get installed what they saw on the live session
<ogra> so we made ubiquity install the live apps as well
<davmor2> ah empathy just crashed :(
<davmor2> I think the big issue is that you expect educational apps with edubuntu :(
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> there is a lot on the panel to be discussed about the future of edubuntu n boston
<LaserJock> :(
<LaserJock> I need to make sure I get my voip setup so I can listen in
<davmor2> cool.
<ogra> davmor2, well, lets see if thats so cool ...
<ogra> might be that edubuntu as you know it now will stop to exist
<ogra> not sure where thats going
<davmor2> that's not so cool :(
<encompass> woah, that aint good
<ogra> that must not be bad :)
<ogra> lets see :)
<ogra> dont judge in advance
<LaserJock> Edubuntu DVD FTW!
<LaserJock> ;-)
<ogra> LaserJock, the question is rather do we need a first CD (and thus DVD)
<ogra> or should edubuntu become a plain addon with g-a-i on steroids
<davmor2> it really would be too :)  Might make it less confusing but then you got to install stuff for a week and a half
<LaserJock> ogra: yes, I think it's a good question
<LaserJock> it'd be a big change
<LaserJock> but it makes sense for us to just maintain the Edubuntu specific stuff
<davmor2> and what about the serverside :(
<LaserJock> ogra: we're shipping 9 translations of the Handbook
<sbalneav> Wow
<ogra> nice !
<LaserJock> they aren't complete translations
<LaserJock> there are a few that are pretty much complete
<ogra> davmor2, server stuff would have to be handled by the server team
<sbalneav> davmor2: About the only thing that makes edubuntu-server is ltsp, and that could easily be added.
<LaserJock> de didn't make it so well
<ogra> davmor2, the main concern with al this is that to much of my worktime goes into the CDs
<ogra> sbalneav, well, we're about to add a moodle default mode ad will have a authserver setup as well
<davmor2> right so it would just be a package instead ?
<ogra> the thing is that the *ubuntu* server cd would have to provide all we need as a task
<LaserJock> but we could easily keep an edubuntu-server metapackage/task though, right?
<sbalneav> Myself, personally, I'd vote for an addon cd that installs the edu apps + ltsp server.  I think it will free up a lot of our time maintaining a lot of stuff that isn't edu related.
<sbalneav> But that's just me. :)
<LaserJock> I agree
<ogra> well, my target in the past ws to ofer an alternative for k12ltsp users
<LaserJock> although it's not a clear win in all ways
<davmor2> sounds like a plan
<ogra> we might loose these
<sbalneav> Well, it still is.
<sbalneav> k12ltsp ships on multiple cds
<sbalneav> so will eubuntu
<ogra> it will be less easy to install
<sbalneav> 1) ubuntu cd + 1 Edubuntu conversion cd.
<ogra> right
<davmor2> ogra: couldn't you just do an app on cd style addon cd?
<LaserJock> perhaps not having to deal with initial installation would help
<ogra> the thing is that i dont see the advantage, it doesnt really matter if i test one or two CDs :)
<sbalneav> Well, we just have to work on the installer part, and make sure it's working flawless.  But it frees us (you, more specifically) from worrying about bootsize cd images, DI stuff, etc.
<ogra> LaserJock, it will shortn the time a bit
<LaserJock> well, if you don't have to deal with udebs and ubiquity/d-installer ;-)
<ogra> which is the fun part :)
<sbalneav> right.
<sbalneav> What, ltsp isn't the fun part? :)
* sbalneav pouts :)
<ogra> dont take al the fun out of my job :)
<ogra> sbalneav, ltsp is the inly thing i usually touch the installer for
<LaserJock> ogra: ok, then write a custom Edubuntu installer
<LaserJock> that provides all kinds of goodies ;-0
<LaserJock> :-) rather
<davmor2> ogra: just work on ubuntu's instead ;)
<sbalneav> We can hash it over in Bawston.
<ogra> i just wrote a gui for ltsp-build-client (the 6th or 7th one ... i do these for relaxing while doing iso test installs :) )
<sbalneav> Oh, nice.
<LaserJock> if we could move to DVDs I think it would be nice to keep us as a full OS
<sbalneav> LaserJock: I got localapps launching with my xrexecd last night.
<LaserJock> interesting
<ogra> well, the target for edubuntu (or rather ubuntu in education) will be to get ready for minucupalities and governments as well ... so we'll start to fcus on mass user maintenance etc
<ogra> *municipalities :)
<sbalneav> "muni" for short
<LaserJock> well, perhaps a spec on just what Edubuntu is and what it's targets are, etc. would be good
<sbalneav> Or m12s :)
<LaserJock> I'd hate for Edubuntu to *just* be meeting Canonical's goals
<ogra> LaserJock, well, its my job to make sure there is some balance
<LaserJock> but I think clearly defining target and purpose would be good
<ogra> but note that cannical invested a *lot* with very little or even no return at all yet
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> I think meeting their business goals (clearly mass contracts/deployments are what makes sense there) is a good thing
<ogra> in any case we'll review the targets and properly define/spec them
<LaserJock> but it should sacrifice giving and educational OS to regular users
<LaserJock> *shouldn't
<ogra> thats on the list for boston
<ogra> right
<LaserJock> ogra: was there ever a decision on whether the Desktop CD is the "recommended" install or not?
<LaserJock> I've missed the last two meetings :(
<ogra> we dont switch
<ogra> the discussion came to late for the chnage
<ogra> printing was already started back when we started discussing it
<ogra> (covers and the like, not the CDs indeed)
<ogra> i wont forget abut the request in boston, dont worry ... but forst we'll need to do some basic decisions there
<ogra> *first
<LaserJock> np, I'm just redoing the ubuntu-cdimage script for the download pages
<sbalneav> Do we have usable cd images to test?
<sbalneav> I could do some testing tonight?
<sbalneav> OK, off to dinner
<LaserJock> ogra: how does this sound for the Desktop CD:
<LaserJock> The desktop CD allows you to try Edubuntu without changing your computer at all, and at your option to install it permanently later. You will need at least 320 MB of RAM to install from this CD. You can install additional educational programs by using the Edubuntu Classroom Server Addon CD
<ogra> sounds fine
<LaserJock> now the Classroom Server section says nothing about the addon cd
<LaserJock> should I mention something like "To install the Edubuntu educational programs use the Classroom Server Addon CD"
<LaserJock> + after installation
<LaserJock> I guess we should make sure they know you use it *after* you install with the Classroom Server CD
<ogra> (sleep 3; echo "GET /edubuntu/daily/current/gutsy-server-i386.list"; sleep 2) |telnet cdimage.ubuntu.com 80 2>/dev/null |grep ltsp|grep 5.0.39 >/dev/null 2>&1 && echo "yes, please download"
<ogra> sbalneav, ^^^ :)
<ogra> LaserJock, "Classroom Server Addon CD requires an edubuntu desktop to be installed on the machine"
<LaserJock> that should be for the addon CD description?
<ogra> thats why i wrote "Classroom Server Addon CD" in the beginning of the sentence :)
<LaserJock> The classroom server add-on $CD contains additional packages that may be
<LaserJock> useful in conjunction with the classroom server $CD. It requires that an $CAPPROJECT
<LaserJock> desktop be installed on the machine.
<LaserJock> ogra: ^^ that work?
<ogra> "contains additional packages that may useful in conjunction with the classroom server" is wrong
<ogra> it doesnt need the server CD
<LaserJock> right
<ogra> it needs an edubuntu-desktop to be installed
<LaserJock> <p>The classroom server add-on $CD contains additional useful packages, including many
<LaserJock> educational programs. It requires that an $CAPPROJECT desktop be installed on the machine.</p>
<LaserJock> how's that?
<ogra> thats fine
<LaserJock> k
<ogra> we should probably mention that it also includes all available langage packs
<LaserJock> ah, right
<LaserJock> so ...including many educational programs and all available language packs.
<LaserJock> ogra: ok, I'm sending it to colin
<ogra> thanks :)
<LaserJock> ogra: ok, well I think I better be off
<LaserJock> I think I should be done for gutsy
<LaserJock> so I can have any chance of working on Hardy ;-)
<ogra> thanks for all the help
<ogra> you did an awesome job for gutsy
<LaserJock> well
<LaserJock> I tried to get done most of what I set out to do
<LaserJock> ogra: thanks for all the help you've provided
<LaserJock> I'll try to make it to this week's meeting
<ogra> not much to tell there apart from crying fo rtesters i guess
#edubuntu 2007-10-09
<trepo> Hi, does anyone know if ebox 2300 clients function flawlessly with Gutsy (both sound and video)?
<trepo> If i recall right there should be some improvement in Gutsy release for this client, but it would be nice if someone had more specific information...
<highvoltage> OMG! LTSP in Gutsy ROCKS!!!!
* RichEd hands highvoltage a clean dry towel ...
<highvoltage> RichEd: hie hie
<RichEd> what's the rock highlight ?
<RichEd> functionality or speed ?
<highvoltage> RichEd: geez, I don't know where to start, it's such a major improvement.. just off the top of my head...
<highvoltage> 1. Boot process is altra-smooth, it's smoother and nicer than booting Ubuntu from a desktop, and it's very fast.
<highvoltage> 2. the new LDM is also, very fast, and it has language and session choosers
<highvoltage> 3. have I mentioned it's fast yet? :)
<highvoltage> haven't done heavy testing yet, but I like the squashfs approach
<highvoltage> LDM gives a few segfaullt errors now and again if I press the power button instead of chooseing the power down option, and authentication is a bit slow, but besides that, it's really slick
<RichEd> cool stuff ... give ogra a hand and a hug
<highvoltage> the meukow LTSP implementation is starting to feel real mature
<highvoltage> RichEd: yep, absolutely, will do
<tsurc> Hi, I've installed a edubuntu gutsy server (vary nice too by the way gents, sterling work!) and I'm about to put it into a live environment for a proper beasting. But before I do I have to soft out filtering. I've installed squid and dansguardian (on the same server. its all working correctly too). now my question is; does any one know of a way to force all browsers to go through dansguardian.
<tsurc> * very, *sort
<stgraber> tsurc: you should find a way to do that by googling for : iptables transparent proxy
<stgraber> it's about redirecting all traffic on port 80 to port 3128 (or 8080)
<tsurc> but how does the iptables differentiate between squid asking for a site and a browser asking for a site. I only have one server to do this on.
<tsurc> not unless I can figure some way of setting up proxies in the firefox prefs and then stopping the users from altering it. But then I'll need to figure out what to do about other forms of access that might still work (like other browsers.. etc)
<stgraber> tsurc: IIRC you can filter using unix UID
<stgraber> tsurc: so you can make the redirection not apply for squid (uid is proxy)
<tsurc> ahhhhh clever, I never knew you could do that :-) I'll go googling now. Thanks
* highvoltage *hugs* ogra
<ogra> hey hey
<highvoltage> ogra: LTSP in gutsy ROCKS!
<ogra> hehe
<ogra> thanks :)
<oshiii-_^> night night
<RichEd> ogra & highvoltage: http://education.zdnet.com/?p=1255 "Latest OpenSUSE a mixed bag for Educators"
* highvoltage reads
<sbalneav> Morning all
<bddebian> Heya
<highvoltage> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hi highvoltage
<RichEd> anestis: hello
<RichEd> i have some time now
<anestis> hi
<anestis> can you arrange meeeting for training?
<RichEd> sure ... was the suggestions in the email okay ?
<anestis> I mean real not virtual
<RichEd> yes ...] 
<RichEd> we need to make sure of the exact date and location so that I can arrange early with a training person from moodle or a trainer
<anestis> 3and 4 of Nov. fits to all of us
<anestis> in Greece
<anestis> Satur and Sunday
<RichEd> it this meeting for training only ?
<anestis> yes
<anestis> 1,5 days
<RichEd> i.e. so we will have 1.5 days ... say 7 hours and 4 hours ?
<anestis> yes
<RichEd> also, there is so much to cover for moodle, we should decide what topics should be covered
<anestis> I'll send you a list with specific questions
<RichEd> it may be a good idea for people to buy the book i recommended (out of the project budget) ... and suggest topics ?
<RichEd> great ...
<anestis> I'll do it  and suggest to rest
<RichEd> thanks ... the book approach is for teaching & learning, and puts the software second
<anestis> also it will be better you to be here
<anestis> they will be
<RichEd> this is much better than learning the tool without a context ...
<RichEd> let me check the dates quickly ...
<RichEd> from 4-9 november I will be in the USA for our annual staff meeting ...
<anestis> Dorota (ACAD) - Kalle (VBU) - Raluca (FCASEC)
<RichEd> is there any other dates which will work for the others ?
<anestis> then 2 and 3 of Nov?
<RichEd> anestis ... we have the developement meeting for one week (end october) and then straight into the company meeting :(
<RichEd> later in novermber ?
<anestis> 18-19 of Nov?
<anestis> sorry 17-18
<RichEd> 17-18 ... you mean ... sat / sun ?
<RichEd> okay ... check with the others and send me an email
<anestis> ok
<RichEd> i will be back on email on thursday ... i travel for 1 day to get to georgia
<anestis> when you return back
<RichEd> monday i am normal at my desk
<anestis> not far from greece
<anestis> if they agree can we book the dates from now?
<anestis> what about moodler?
<anestis> will be able to come these dates?
<RichEd> we will need to confirm the moodle person ...
<RichEd> we will ask #1 moodle themselves, and #2 a moodle certified partner
<anestis> then keep 17-18 of Nov.
<RichEd> I do not expect any problem, but we need to confirm 1st
<anestis> and confrimation on Monday?
<RichEd> there may be some charges, so i will get prices for training ...
<RichEd> and we may need to cover travel, but I will look for a local Greece moodle trainer
<anestis> we will have the opprotunity to discuss when you come
<anestis> about
<anestis> next years calls for projects
<anestis> if u r interested
<RichEd> okay ... if you send me the email, and the others (educonlinux) confirm by monday ... we can hopefully confirm mon/tue with a moodle person
<anestis> great
<RichEd> yes, it is a pity i could not make it to the last meeting ...
<anestis> have a nice trip
<RichEd> there is a lot we can discuss
<RichEd> thanks ...
<anestis> yes
<anestis> bye
<RichEd> chat soon on email
<RichEd> bye
<anestis> ok
<davmor2> what is the min spec for a pc to run edubuntu on please
<davmor2> is it the same as ubuntu?
<davmor2> it's okay I found it :)
<Bauldrick> I'm running Gutsy, but I can no longer stream .avi files from my NAS using samba and mplayer
<amalon_> hi people. is there a way of installing edubuntu using the live cd from the boot menu without loading up edubuntu first. It is unusably slow, and i haven't managed to get the installer to open.
#edubuntu 2007-10-10
* Starting logfile irclogs/edubuntu.log
<oshiii-_^> oshi-
<stgraber> ogra: heh, this compression progressbar just rocks !!! :)
<ogra> heh
<ogra> well, i didnt manage to get the build bar going :/
<ogra> its still the sucky "two step" bar
<stgraber> having the compression one and no more log flood is already a huge improvment
<ogra> yeah, indeed
<ogra> the log is kept though, just not in the main syslog
<stgraber> ok, install done here let's test it
<stgraber> ogra: LTSP seems to work just fine too (testing on VirtualBox, will test on real HW tonight)
<ogra> cool
<ogra> my install is still running ... my system is just to busy for speedy vbox stuff
<tsurc> Just finished off our new shinny, very shiny gutsy edubuntu server + squid + dansguardian + transparent proxying, running off one box... box.
<tsurc> Where can I write the instructions of 3 or 4 lines needed to set it up?
<ogra> create a page on the wiki
<ogra> EdubuntuProxySetup or so
<ogra> we can link it from the edubuntu FAQ or even pull it in the next handbook ;)
<tsurc> I really do love you guys, gutsy rocks and with one iptables line transparent proxying works like an absolute dream
<ogra> :)
<tsurc> I'll be moving the box down to our boarding house later. any problems I'll let you know. If anyone is going to give it a really good beasting its the ids in the boarding house.
<tsurc> ^kids
<tsurc> Oooo lunch time. brb
<Kamping_Kaiser> tsurc, thats a good combo you have there, difference for me is i have a seperate gateway, running dapper :)
<tsurc> yeh in school we have separate boxes. but the boarding house is a special case. We have one server, very limited space and about 15 clients. So it has to be all be rolled onto one server
<Kamping_Kaiser> monitoring the dansguardian logs can be invaluable too
<Kamping_Kaiser> hm... *goes to check his*
<tsurc> my next big hitter will be a vpn from that site so I can remotely admin it. Thats one hell of a win win, esp with "Ofsted"
<Kamping_Kaiser> tsurc, ssh?
<tsurc> check mine every two days :-)
<Kamping_Kaiser> my proxy is at a community group  -when i went there every week i checked then, atm i havent checked for amonth becaues i've been otherwise engaged
<tsurc> yeh, but I've always fancied playing with vpns. For my own academic purposes if nothing else
<Kamping_Kaiser> openvpn is decent
<tsurc> cool I'll check it out..... if I ever get the time.
<Kamping_Kaiser> hm... some interesting searches been done while i've been absent.
* Kamping_Kaiser decides hes going to go bust some people RSN
<tsurc> Right really must go get lunch. I think I'm giving birth to an alien, at least thats what it sound like. Grummble Grummble ;) I'll leave you too your fun
<Kamping_Kaiser> tsurc, have you tried per user logging of sites/dns lookups or filtering per user?
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol
<Kamping_Kaiser> catch you later mate
<tsurc> ident?
<Kamping_Kaiser> on the gateway
<Kamping_Kaiser> eg with dans/squid/iptables
<Kamping_Kaiser> nm, i wont hold you from lunch :)
<tsurc> played with identd squid and dansguardian, never really got it working yet. Laters ;)
<Kamping_Kaiser> later :)
<pips1> no edubuntu meeting today?
<ogra> i'll try to give a short dev status overview or so tonight
<pips1> ok
<ogra> but rich is travelling and i'm busy with the last bits before release
<ogra> so i'll try to keep it as short as i can
<pips1> ic, ok
<pips1> is your info on launchpad more or less up to date? blueprints & bugs ?
<ogra> nope
<pips1> never mind
<pips1> in the meeting logs, I read that you were struggling with a major bug that prevents the proper installation or smth... did you manage to fix it?
<ogra> all RC bugs should be sorted ... specs are not up to date because most of them were simply not properly handled in the beginning
<ogra> i bumped the ones i could to implemented
<pips1> what is the best iso to test? beta? dailies?
<ogra> that was the LTSP progress bar in the installer ... well, its fixed 50% and reverted to the feisty behavior for the other 50%
<ogra> good enough for release
<pips1> ic
<ogra> the current daily is pretty near to what RC will be
<pips1> oki
<ogra> according to stgraber it installs fine ... i just ditched my vbirtualbox test and started on real HW here
<ogra> so i cant confirm yet ... but there shouldnt be anything blocking the install anymore
<pips1> ok, sounds good
<stgraber> it'd be good to test sound and usb devices, I wasn't able to test that on virtualbox
<ogra> right
<pips1> stgraber: righty
<ogra> and for localdev actually important, the auth mechanism changed a bit
<ogra> sound didnt change from feisty, alll breakage here must come from the ubuntu alsa changes
* pips1 starts daily amd64 server iso download
* ogra just installs from a mounted iso image stored on a flashdisk to another flashdisk both plugged into a thin client ... the most silent install i had ever :) no moving parts at all ;)
<pips1> hehe
<ogra> (not very fast though)
<pips1> c't lead article is about flash disks...
* ogra hasnt read c't since years
<pips1> for a mass publication, it's actually really good
<pips1> I mean the articles are well written
* ogra doesnt like dead tree news anymore ...
<ogra> i prefer the heise online ticker
<pips1> and not just cheap copy of marketing blurb
<ogra> c't is nice indeed, they are pretty competent ...
<pips1> yeah, thorough *German* testing ;-D
* pips1 wonders why there are 142 updates available in update-manager all of a sudden
<pips1> stgraber: do you have an edubuntu demo lab setup for feisty? or will you demo with gutsy?
<pips1> at school, i mean
<stgraber> it's half feisty half gutsy current
<stgraber> gutsy chroot but feisty server
<pips1> oh
<stgraber> (to have faster boot and better ldm)
<tsurc> just getting round to writing this wiki article on proxy setup, is there any particular template for edubuntu stuff. I can't see one?
<bddebian> Heya
<sbalneav> Morning all
<highvoltage> morning sbalneav
* Starting logfile irclogs/edubuntu.log
<titanix88> :-D
<SpearOfLugh> hi
<sbalneav> Hello
<LaserJock> are we having a meeting in 45min?
<sbalneav> I'm assuming so.
<JordanC> Sweer
<JordanC> Sweet
<SpearOfLugh> there is a meeting?
<SpearOfLugh> i'm new here, from greece
<sbalneav> Yup, a meeting in #ubuntu-meeting
<sbalneav> In 30+ minutes
<SpearOfLugh> cool... i'm a teacher and i was looking for a good distro for primary schools
<SpearOfLugh> seems edubuntu could do the job
<sbalneav> We like to think so :)
<SpearOfLugh> i wonder if there's greek stuff on it too
<amalon_> ooh theres people around, so i'll ask the q i asked the other day again: is there a way of installing edubuntu using the live cd from the boot menu without loading up edubuntu first. It is unusably slow, and i haven't managed to get the installer to open.
<sbalneav> amalon: What kind of machine do you have?
<LaserJock> amalon: the Classroom Server CD should work just fine
<sbalneav> SpearOfLugh: Well, there will be greek translations, for sure.
<SpearOfLugh> sbalneav i'll see edubuntu in action and if it's good i can help with translations
<amalon> its from my wifes nursery, seems pretty powerful 2.5ish ghz but only bout 200meg of ram, no reason it shouldn't be able to handle the live cd. (I'm downloading the server image now)
<cliebow__> stgraber;you looking to get tcm going?
<cliebow__> i'lkl catch you somewhere along the line...bout to book it for home
<ogra> amalon, minial liveCD reqirements are 256M for feisty and 384M for gutsy so if the machine uses shared graphics memory and only is around 200M it wont be enough
<amalon> ogra: ah ok fair enough
<LaserJock> dang, I thought it was 320MB for gutsy
<amalon> ogra: is the server cd the right one to get, just need a standalone desktop type install
<ogra> LaserJock, it is, colin just picked the next common size
<ogra> LaserJock, actually its even slightly below 300 but he wanted a safety buffer
<ogra> amalon, it has a "install workstation" option
<ogra> but for the edu apps you should also get the addon CD then
<ogra> the server CD has to many extra stuff to fit all the edu things on it
<amalon> ogra: right ok
<ogra> *************** Edubuntu Meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 2 minutes *********************
* amalon switches to canonical mirror and download speed increases from 11kbps to 500 :)
<amalon> ogra: cheers for the help
<ogra> *************** Edubuntu Meeting in #ubuntu-meeting now *********************
<LaserJock> I'm off as well. I gotta get *some* work done today
<LaserJock> ogra, sbalneav: please let me know if you find problems with the docs
<LaserJock> like technical problems
<ogra> will do
<LaserJock> and maybe tonight while the wife is gone I'll wipe her laptop and do a test install ;-)
#edubuntu 2007-10-11
<Netham45> what software does edubuntu come with?
<LaserJock> well, lots
<LaserJock> there's the usual Ubuntu software
<LaserJock> plus LTSP server software
<LaserJock> and on the Addon CD there's quite a bit of educational software
<LaserJock> Netham45: does that help?
<Netham45> yea
<tsurc> ogra: bit ruff and ready but its a start https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuProxy
<ogra> tsurc, great, thanks :)
<tsurc> hopefully we'll have a few more of these installs to do. Part of your schools specialism in maths and computing is to kit some of our feeder primary schools out with thin client networks like ours.
<pips1> ogra: you up?
<pips1> I'm having trouble burning the amd64 server iso ... although the file size is 690 it doesn't seem to fit on a regular 700 cd :-/
<groovedreamer> hello
<ogra> pips1, thats weird
<ogra> its working with i386 here
<ogra> which is 695M
<pips1> yes, quite wierd :-(
<pips1> arg, another prob is that I can't get rsync to work
<pips1>  rsync -av --progress rsync://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/current/gutsy-server-amd64.iso .
<pips1> @ERROR: Unknown module 'edubuntu'
<pips1> rsync error: error starting client-server protocol (code 5) at main.c(1171)
<pips1> I don't get it. Why is it complaining about the "module" edubuntu? It seems to think that the /edubuntu path should be the file to sync??
<groovedreamer> have a question
<groovedreamer> how does wine work?
<groovedreamer> can i run dos programs on ubuntu?
<groovedreamer> i have no idea how wine works
<groovedreamer> is it possible to run exe files ?
<Kamping_Kaiser> wine is "an emulator" (its not, but thats the easy description)
<Kamping_Kaiser> yes, it will run exes
<Kamping_Kaiser> and i suspect it runs some dos stuff
<ogra> pips1, rsync://cdimage.ubuntu.com/cdimage/edubuntu/daily/current/gutsy-server-amd64.iso
<Kamping_Kaiser> dosbox is probably better suited for dos stuff though
<pips1> ogra: thanks!
<pips1> that works
<Kamping_Kaiser> eek. gutsy installers not working :| (its not an edubuntu cd, i just happen to be here)
<groovedreamer> Kamping_Kaiser: i have installed wine how can I run exe file now
<Kamping_Kaiser> dont know. tried double clicking?
* Kamping_Kaiser doesnt use wine, 
<Kamping_Kaiser> theres nothing i need from windowsland
<groovedreamer> ok i understand
<groovedreamer> tried clicking doesnt work
<groovedreamer> hmm
<groovedreamer> maybe dos emulator??
<groovedreamer> i ll try
<groovedreamer> or
<groovedreamer> maybe you know any advanture game going on edubuntu?
<Kamping_Kaiser> tried reading the wine doco?
<groovedreamer> not yet
<groovedreamer> where can i find it.
<groovedreamer> ??
<Kamping_Kaiser> winehq
<Kamping_Kaiser> adventure game?
<groovedreamer> :-)
<groovedreamer> i would like to play some old good games
<groovedreamer> but i dont want to install windoza just for that
<groovedreamer> these are really small ones
<groovedreamer> they
<groovedreamer> adventure
* Kamping_Kaiser shrugs
<Kamping_Kaiser> the main ubuntu channel may be more use
<groovedreamer> #ubuntu?
<Kamping_Kaiser> yeah
<groovedreamer> ok
<groovedreamer> thxc
<sbalneav> Morning all
<Kamping_Kaiser> morning
<pips1> hi sbalneav
<tsurc> well that went well.... not!
<sbalneav> tsurc: Context?
<tsurc> ran an update over lunch time on my gutsy server..... took my network cards out!
<Kamping_Kaiser> LOL!
<Kamping_Kaiser> sorry :|
<tsurc> still it is an odd intel server board
<tsurc> now..... wheres that beta cd? *goes hunting under desk somewhere*
* ogra screams
<ogra> the first install in two days that went half way through ....
* ogra glares at the "no space left on device" message
* ogra goes crying and tries to find some coffee
<Kamping_Kaiser> :(
<tsurc> coffee wont make it better. Cheese on toast will :)
<bddebian> Heya
<Kamping_Kaiser> hi
<tsurc> found it! lets see exactly how long it'll take me to install edubuntu gutsy + squid + dansguardian + transparently proxying on the same box. 3pm now I'll report back soon
<Kamping_Kaiser> tsurc, good luck
<Kamping_Kaiser> gnight all :)
<tsurc> gnight
<tsurc> 40mins in and its started to build the thin client chroot.
<pips1> ogra, I don't know what is wrong with my box, but I can't write any iso's to cd . sigh :-((
<pips1> sorry I'm not much help with testing
<tsurc> typical, half way through an install and.........
<tsurc> answers on a post card please ;)
<tsurc> in the absence of any whitty comebacks. The power failed. :( maybe I'll try again tomorrow
<LaserJock> ogra: I did a fresh install of Edubuntu last night on my laptop
<ogra> went well ?
<LaserJock> install went well
<ogra> i just finished a server install here
<LaserJock> post install behavior was not so great
<ogra> oh ?
<ogra> what was wrong ?
<LaserJock> well, there's the "panel doesn't show up until you click" bug, but that's known I think
<ogra> nvidia bug, yeah
<LaserJock> I don't have nvidia
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> that's a trivial thing though that'll get fixed
<LaserJock> but a show-stopper is that scrollkeeper-update doesn't want me to install packages :(
<ogra> hmm there was just a discussion in the meeting about it and people seemed to agree its nvidia related
<ogra> LaserJock, ouch
<ogra> tell that to seb128 immediately if thats not filed yet
<LaserJock> if anything calls scrollkeeper-update in postinst (which is a lot of packages, btw) then it pegs my CPU and just sits there
<LaserJock> my machine is virtually unusable until I killall scrollkeeper-update
<LaserJock> and I have to do that for every package that calls it :(
<LaserJock> overall my RC experience is not as good as Beta or dist-upgrade from Feisty, which is no fun
<LaserJock> but the install itself was great
<LaserJock> and nothing Edubuntu-specific went wrong that I see
<ogra> thats good :)
<ogra> i had the worst test days ever ...
<ogra> everyx install i made since tuesday made another piece of HW die
<LaserJock> :(
<ogra> well, i had at least one that just finished
<ogra> and one -desktop install in vbox
<LaserJock> mine installed great
<LaserJock> and then I poped in the addon cd
<LaserJock> and installed some more stuff
<ogra> cool
<LaserJock> so is RC as big for testing by users as Beta is?
<ogra> indeed
<LaserJock> in some ways it seems like RC is a bit too late
<ogra> well, we should have scheduled one milestone less
<LaserJock> I was thinking we could have a "Test RC" note on edubuntu.org
<ogra> so beta and RC could have moved one week
<LaserJock> I even had a chance to use gnash last night
<ogra> did it work ?
<LaserJock> of course my wife came home right when I was done with the install
<LaserJock> so I didn't have time to install the usual goodies
<LaserJock> and she wanted to go see Jay Leno's website
<LaserJock> which has a lot of flash
<LaserJock> it was slow, but it worked
<ogra> bad guy
<joebob777as7_> mouse on thin client isn't working what should i check? i tried ps/2 and usb
<sladen> who here has an an _installed_ system
<sladen> and an off-centre usplash progress bar?
<sladen> I would like you to test a fix
<joebob777as7_> that'd be me sladen
<sladen> joebob777as7_: bingo, can you try  http://www.paul.sladen.org/ubuntu/upload/edubuntu-artwork-usplash_0.1.0-52sladen1_i386.deb
<sladen> and follow up to bug  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/edubuntu-artwork/+bug/135319
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 135319 in edubuntu-artwork "Usplash progress bar not centered on the monitor" [Undecided,In progress] 
<joebob777as7_> sladen, i have 64 bit clients...
<joebob777as7_> let me go grab an i386 client
<sladen> joebob777as7_: http://www.paul.sladen.org/ubuntu/upload/edubuntu-artwork-usplash_0.1.0-52sladen1.debdiff  is here if you're able to apt-get the source
<joebob777as7_> so i need to chroot into my i386 and dpkg -i that deb?
<LaserJock> if it's the clients that are messed up
<joebob777as7_> fixed the mouse issue btw
<sladen> joebob777as7_: I have no idea how it'll interact;  I probably wouldn't bother
<sladen> is there somebody here with an installed i386 system who see the off-centre progress bar
<LaserJock> mine's fine
<sladen> LaserJock: okay, you're running at  !=  640x480
<LaserJock> running what?
<joebob777as7_> sladen, looks the same to me
<sladen> joebob777as7_: if you have a chance;cd somewhere  apt-get source edubuntu-artwork ; sudo apt-get build-dep edubuntu-artwork ; wget http://www.paul.sladen.org/ubuntu/upload/edubuntu-artwork-usplash_0.1.0-52sladen1.debdiff ; cd  edubuntu-artwork-0.1.0 ; patch -p1 < ../edubuntu-artwork-usplash_0.1.0-52sladen1.debdiff ; debuild -uc -us ; sudo dpkg -i ../edubuntu-*sladen1*deb ; sudo reboot
<joebob777as7_> lol
<sladen> joebob777as7_: if you've tried to install that in an i386 chroot on an amd64 box, it won't make any difference
<joebob777as7_> sladen, i installed in i386 chroot and booted my x60 tablet still off center
<sladen> anything in a chroot.  will make no difference
<LaserJock> sladen: we do LTSP
<joebob777as7_> oh forgot to rebuild image hold on
<LaserJock> joebob777as7_: are you working on the client?
<joebob777as7_> did it all on the server now rebuilding image
<LaserJock> right, but what is off-center
<LaserJock> the splash on the server or the client?
<joebob777as7_> client
<LaserJock> right
<joebob777as7_> still off center...
<joebob777as7_> no luck sladen ...
<sladen> joebob777as7_: can you get me a screenshot/digital camera shot?
* sladen /win 353
<LaserJock> sladen: do you seriously have that many open?
<sladen> the best way to debug this further might be to alter the .png and check we really are getting a new usplash
<joebob777as7_> i installed the deb now how do i uninstall to get back to how it was?
<sladen> sudo apt-get install edubuntu-artwork=0.1.0-52 edubuntu-artwork-usplash=0.1.0-52
<joebob777as7_> both are sent sladen
<joebob777as7_> anyone know why i keep getting "no whitelisted driver found" when i try to enable compiz?
<sbalneav> joebob777as7_: When you were testing, did you do an ltsp-update-kernels?
<joebob777as7_> nope
<joebob777as7_> so i get to try it again... lol
<joebob777as7_> so i don't need to do an update image i need to do update kernels instead
<joebob777as7_> sladen, trying again
<sladen> joebob777as7_: the initramfs needs to be updated
<joebob777as7_> sladen, works
<joebob777as7_> sorry
<sladen> joebob777as7_: in my humble opinion I don't think the new one was installed in the second shot
<sladen> woo! :)
<sladen> thank you!
<joebob777as7_> no problem
<sladen> joebob777as7_: could you email another photo, so I can attach it to the bug report and feel happy :)
<joebob777as7_> sure
<joebob777as7_> sent
<cberlo> Hi folks.  Anyone come across any issues with thin clients "falling asleep" or going into a power save mode after a while of non-use and not able to "wake" them?
<cberlo> This is with feisty.
<bdmurray> I've been testing the edubuntu daily builds and have a question about the gdm login screen.
<racter> can i change the welcome/login screen for the thin clients?
<racter> ah i found it in the faq :)
#edubuntu 2007-10-12
<LaserJock> bdmurray: still wondering?
<bdmurray> LaserJock: I don't believe so.  Edubuntu is supposed to have hibernate at the gdm login right?
<bdmurray> I checked with Feisty final and it had it.
<LaserJock> hmm, I'm honestly not sure
<LaserJock> is Hibernate the only one missing?
<bdmurray> It is not missing, I just noted that Ubuntu does not have it but Edubuntu does
<LaserJock> hmm, that's interesting
<bdmurray> So I was trying to figure out if they are _supposed_ to be different
<LaserJock> the only thing I know of is that we had difficulties with people in thin clients trying to restart the LTSP server when they wanted to get out of the thin client ;-)
<LaserJock> sbalneav: pingy pingy
<LaserJock> bdmurray: so I would have guessed, if anythng, that Edubuntu would be lacking options, not have more
<bdmurray> As I mentioned before Edubuntu Feisty Final has hibernate, I guess I'll check Ubuntu Feisty Final to see if Ubuntu is missing it for some reason
<LaserJock> bdmurray: well, I'm afraid I'm not much help. I don't remeber hearing any specific decision on that though
<bdmurray> On a related note the Hibernate option does not have an icon which I reported as a bug
<LaserJock> that seems suspicious
<danroj> http://danroj.obolog.com
<shriphani> is the entire KDE-EDU package present on a default edubuntu installation ?
<LaserJock> shriphani: well, no
<shriphani> well at least "Step", "Kstars" and Kalzium ?
<LaserJock> the Addon CD has most of KDE Edu, but I think there are maybe like 2 packages that are in Universe
<LaserJock> those are on the Desktop CD and on the Classroom Server Addon CD
<shriphani> ok so they're there.
<shriphani> I am making a podcast on edubuntu for my lug. was tinkering a bit with teaching aids there.
<LaserJock> cool
* Starting logfile irclogs/edubuntu.log
<wima> hello
<wima> does anyone know how i can have local devices without adding users to the fuse group?
<wima> fiddeling with udev i guess?
<bddebian> Heya
<highvoltage> heya bdbddebian
<multik> hi group
<cberl2> Does anyone know if Sabayon works in Gutsy?
<cberlo> ...or even in Feisty for that matter?
<bluekuja> LaserJock: mail sent ;)
* Netham45 needs to reboot, brb.
#edubuntu 2007-10-13
<simpaulguy> hello everyone?
<Burgundavia> hey simpaulguy
<sbalneav> Evening all
<LaserJock> sbalneav!
<cmonkey> Anyone have any suggestions on how to setup an LTSP server with two NICs, having one connect to the internet, and the other to the LTSP network?
<LaserJock> well, pretty much just install Edubuntu
<cmonkey> I checked the wiki page about it, but it hasnt been edited in nearly two years, and it doesnt seem to work
<cmonkey> Its installed.  I got it working the last time I tried this, but that was a couple releases ago.  Now, there doesn't appear to be a working dhcp server on the LTSP nic
<LaserJock> what release are you using?
<cmonkey> gutsy
<cmonkey> the RC
<cmonkey> i set the ltsp nic to use a static ip that is the same as that set in the dhcpd.conf, and then started dhcpd
<LaserJock> hmm, I think it's supposed to automatically detect and setup 2-nic setups
<cmonkey> hmm, i suppose my problem could be that my 2nd nic was broken during install :p
<cmonkey> i stuck a working one in after rebooting
<cmonkey> ugg, i should have just downloaded the iso instead of doing a net install
<cmonkey> Doh!  reinstalling didn't do the trick
<cmonkey> how do I ensure that dhcpd is running on the correct NIC?
<cmonkey> adding the correct interface to /etc/default/dhcp3-server doesnt appear to do the trick
<LaserJock> hmm, so you have 2 nics one set up for the internet (does that work?) and one set as a static interface for dhcp?
<cmonkey> yep.  the one set up for the internet works, the other one is set to be 192.168.0.1
<LaserJock> cmonkey: did you restart the dhcp server?
<cmonkey> yep
<LaserJock> hmm, it pretty much just worked for me
<LaserJock> you might want to email edubuntu-users mailing list
<LaserJock> given that it's the weekend
<cmonkey> hmm, alright, thanks
<LaserJock> sorry I'm not more help
<cmonkey> its alright
<cmonkey> i suppose i should test it on a single nic, i need to demo it to a tech volunteering group tomorrow
<cmonkey> err, oops, I'm definately doing something very wrong.  doesnt work with a single nic either
<cmonkey> hmm, now I'm actually getting dhcp requests, but the dhcp server isnt doing anything about it...
<cmonkey> nm, got that backward, it was the server sending a dhcp request O.o
<cmonkey> doh! now I feel stupid
<cmonkey> the switch I was using was broken
<mwright1> Hi does anyone know about gutsy and LTSP integration
<cmonkey> this is the blind leading the blind, but ill give it a try.  what do you want to know?
<mwright1> my question is weith xen kernels
<mwright1> the OS is Centos 5 underneath
<mwright1> but we can run ubuntu gut in  xen kernel
<mwright1> so I wan tto know if the ubuntu gyiiiiiiiiiiiii
<Kamping_Kaiser> wow, just read the changes from feisty=> gutsy - LTSP will be a different beast when i get to play with the next version in 7 months!
<bluekuja> heya LaserJock
<bluekuja> LaserJock: mail arrived correctly?
<LaserJock> yep
<bluekuja> perfect
<bluekuja> :)
<Debaser> Hi there... I'm running 64bit edubuntu and get this error when trying to load the ltsp clients: request_module: runaway loop modprobe binfmt-646c
<Debaser> I've read this is cause I'm trying to run ltsp on 32 bit clients...
<User52> hello
<User52> can someone help me?
<User52> i just installed ubuntu
<User52> and
<User52> when i restart my computer
<User52> i login
<User52> in a command prompt type menu
<User52> and
<User52> then
<User52> it doesnt go to ubuntu desktop
<User52> is there a command i need?
<User52> please help
#edubuntu 2007-10-14
<sbalneav> Evening all
<Burgundavia> highvoltage: ping
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: pong
<Burgundavia> highvoltage: do you mind if I steal wholehog from your blog post for me fridge story about Gobuntu and software freedom in the next few days?
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: go for it, you will proabably want to fix grammer/spelling first
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: my Engrish is terrible
<Burgundavia> I can do that
<Burgundavia> thanks
<highvoltage> kewl
<Burgundavia> when did the restricted manager appear?
<Burgundavia> edgy or feisty?
<highvoltage> I think it was feisty, I can't say for sure
<Burgundavia> right
#edubuntu 2008-10-06
<thismamacooks200> ï»¿when I log onto another account's desktop, my music player goes silent. But if I'm running a noisy game, it is still heard. How can I make the music always play?
<zzaza> hi all
<zzaza> I was trying to install edubuntu classroom server to connect some clients as x-terminal, the installation went ok, but i cant configure the clients. i cant find the ltsf.conf file. am using the latest edubuntu.
<nubae> zzaza: u have to create that file
<nubae> it should be here: /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<nubae> and the first line should be [default]
<zzaza> nubae: i didt creat that file, i last tried edubuntu version 7.10 all was striaght forward
<zzaza> i did check in /var/lib/tftpboot  but there was no lts.conf file
<nubae> I know...
<nubae> u have to create it
<nubae> ahhh damn Nick Kendall....
<sbalneav> Morning all
<nubae> hi sbalneav
<highvoltage> morning sbalneav
<nubae> I'm having a problem with pulseaudio...
<nubae> I get a connection refused when it tries to connect to the pulse server
<nubae> ah wait... forget it, just fixed it...
<sbalneav> What was it?>
<nubae> needed echo "default_driver=pulse" in .libao
<nubae> wierd though, thats new for intrepid
<nubae> cause hardy worked fine
<nubae> hi Lns
<Lns> hey nubae
<nubae> after adding something to anacron in cron.hourly, does one need to reload cron?
<Lns> nubae: Not if it works like regular old cron
<Lns> the man page says itself that one of its features is that you don't need to reload it after editing configs
<nubae> its weird, I've got a script that works fine if i execute it, and its in /etc/cron.hourly, but doesnt seem to get exectued
<nubae> by cron
<Lns> nubae: did you chmod +x it ?
<nubae> yep
<Lns> err
<Lns> yeah it would if yo ucan yousefl ;)
<Lns> ick..monday morning fingers
<Lns> nubae: did you reload anacron or no?
<nubae> I did that too, without much success :-)
<nubae> it works if I make an entry with crontab -e, but I thought the point of cron.hourly is u drop the script in there to exectue every hour
<Lns> it is
<nubae> hmmm... then what am I missing
<Lns> nubae: what does the script do?
<nubae> awks users out of passwd, shadow and groups and puts into another file
<Lns> ah
<nubae> ah? u know whats wrong?
<Lns> nubae: have you verified other scripts run in cron.hourly?
<Lns> no, not yet ;)
<nubae> there arent any
<Lns> have you verified crontab has a stanza for cron.hourly runs?
<nubae> and there is no /var/spool/anacron/cron.hourly
<nubae> which I guess answers your question
<Lns> hrmm... /me is an old style cron user
<Lns> where everything is in /etc/crontab
<nubae> well guess Im gonna have to do the same, I just thought this would be neater
<Lns> sure, i mean it should work
<Lns> is it stock anacron in hardy?
<nubae> 17 *    * * *   root    cd / && run-parts --report /etc/cron.hourly --- that should execute anacron
<Lns> oh ok we're talking about different beasts here
<Lns> yep
<nubae> but it doesn!
<Lns> nubae: did you try running "run-parts --report /etc/cron.hourly" manually on a shell, and/or examining logs?
<Lns> (as root)
<nubae> no thats an idea, let me try that
<nubae> yep works
<nubae> sigh... this makes no sense
<Lns> hrm
<Lns> look in your cron logs
<Lns> nubae: FYI AFAIK there's anacron, then cron. they're 2 different things, and both installed by default
<Lns> make sure you're running the right one
<nubae> anacron does cron.hourly, cron.daily, etc as I understand it
<nubae> and cron does /etc/crontab
<nubae> or am I missing something?
<Lns> nubae: anacron uses /etc/anacrontab
<nubae> well doh no wonder... there is no hourly in there :-)
<nubae> how silly is that
<Lns> ;)
<nubae> its supposed to replace cron but has no cron.hourly
<nubae> at least got to the bottom of it, thanks Lns
<Lns> np
<Lns> yeah what's weird is that i have a different line in /etc/crontab for hourly
<nubae> with cd / && in the front?
<Lns> yeah
<nubae> yeah took that out =)
<Lns> and why does both crontab and anacrontab have day/week/month stanzas?
<nubae> it should be one or the other
<nubae> its very confusing
<Lns> yeah...
<nubae> I really thought cron.hourly was run by cron, but its not, its run by anacron and isnt in the anacrontab
<Lns> well it looks like it's supposed to, with "17 *    * * *   root    cd / && run-parts --report /etc/cron.hourly" in crontab
<nubae> yes but without the corresponding line in cron.hourly in anacron, its not being spooled it looks like
<Lns> nubae: looks like it works for me... Oct  6 10:17:01 Fibonacci /USR/SBIN/CRON[15189]: (root) CMD (   cd / && run-parts --report /etc/cron.hourly)
<Lns> I have nothing in cron.hourly though so i haven't tested
<nubae> yeah its annoying cause its working for me too
<Lns> nubae: are you using a sane shell descriptor at the top of your script?
<nubae> yes
<nubae> gtonna test with another script
<Lns> hrm..actually running it manually didn't work for me
<Lns> oh wait
<Lns> hmmmmmmmmm
<Lns> yeah it's not working for me either (running run-parts manually)
<nubae> so crontab pretends to do its job
<Lns> yeah
<Lns> and even reports to syslog
<nubae> cron executes cron.hourly, but then it stops... so I guess cron.hourly triggers anacron?
<nubae> is that possible?
<Lns> not sure
<nubae> because its only hourly not working
<Lns> its just a dir...i can't see how
<nubae> tried with a real simple test... touch itworks.txt
<nubae> nada...
<Lns> yeah me too
<Lns> only if you i wonder why crontab has a different style execution for .hourly
<Lns> taking out the test anacron
<nubae> yeah what does that do, test anacron?
<Lns> tests to see if anacron exists
<Lns> but to me it almost looks like run-parts is broken
<Lns> run-parts --list /etc/cron.hourly/ doesn't result in any scripts being returned, although i do have one in there and it's chmod +x'd
<nubae> well, lets try a daily one... by setting the clock to a minute after or so...
<nubae> no work either
<nubae> ure right run-parts must be broken
<nubae> that means all the scripts that are in there are not being executed
<nubae> lol
<nubae> thats a pretty serious bug
<Lns> well i'd hope others would notice too
<Lns> we could be doing something wrong
<nubae> yeah like what? ever document Ive read and every wiki points to simply putting the script in .hourly or .daily or whatever, + there are scripts in there already and they're not being executed
<Lns> nubae: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=5677105
<nubae> its a mystery
<nubae> that would mean that by default everyones crons are broken
<Lns> i sure would hope that isn't the case
<Lns> thats *buntu, not just edu (i'm using ubuntu)
<nubae> me too
<nubae> so how do we verify that, I guess if a reinstall fixes it, then that is verification
<Lns> guess so.. ?
<nubae> sudo apt-get reinstall cron anacron --- that does not work
<Lns> --reinstall
<nubae> yeah the www doc is wrong
<nubae> nah that doesnt work
<Lns> nubae: apt-get --reinstall install cron anacron
<nubae> yeah I know, I mean that didnt fix the problem
<Lns> ah
<Lns> not sure...very eerie though
<nubae> its run parts thats broken, cause putting into crontab normally works
<Lns> hold on a sec
<nubae> just dont want to put a bug report up, unless I'm absolutely certain :D
<Lns> AH!
<Lns> you have an extension  ( .sh ?) on your script, no?
<Lns> run-parts works when you remove all script extensions
<nubae> no
<nubae> :-)
<nubae> no .sh, I read about that
<Lns> well that fixed it for me =)
<Lns> are you using /bin/sh as your shell in the script?
<Lns> have you 'set -e' in it at the top?
<nubae> wait Ive still got the cd / && missing, let me put it back
<nubae> set -e ?
<Lns> i believe that sets the environment
<nubae> ok, lets see if that does it for me
<nubae> yep :-)
<nubae> thanks
<Lns> shit, that was right at the top of the run-parts manpage too
<nubae> that only took half a day
<Lns>  If  neither  the --lsbsysinit option nor the --regex option is given then the names must consist entirely of upper
<Lns>        and lower case letters, digits, underscores, and hyphens.
<Lns> so the 'set -e' did it for you, eh?
<nubae> yep
<Lns> damn anal cron ;)
<nubae> nowhere was that mentioned
<nubae> think I'll add an entry to my blog about this wonderful cron experience
<Lns> lol..nice
<nubae> god, feel like I was banging my head against a wall
<Lns> cron (moreso run-parts) should REALLY be more forgiving
<Lns> of course i'm sure there's a very good reason for its behavior, I'm just not seeing it
<nubae> I had #!bin/sh there
<nubae> jsut not the env
<nubae> gonna check the other scripts
<Lns> default ones normally have it - that's where i got it from i think
<nubae> well apt has it disabled
<Lns> "set -e" terminates the shell if any command returns a non-zero status
<nubae> check yours... cron.daily/apt
<Lns> yep
<Lns> doesn't have it
<Lns> (commented out)
<nubae> so wtf?
<Lns> not sure..maybe not every script requires it
<nubae> yeah, guess I should just be glad it works now :D
<Lns> yeah but understanding it would be nice too =)
<Lns> SO... regarding https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/269188 - the people in #ubuntu-mozillateam seem to think that getting this patch into the beta Intrepid is even a longshot. Any thoughts, since it affects *buntu LTSP setups on a critical level?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 269188 in firefox "Extreme slowness, "Firefox is already running" error for >3 users launching Firefox in LTSP environment" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<nubae1> Lns: The school I was working at before also mentioned extreme firefox slowness
<Lns> nubae1: I don't doubt it
<Lns> It seems like it would be critical to any Ubuntu LTSP setups with > 3 thin-clients (and nobody at the server feeding it mouse/keyboard entropy for everyone else)
<Lns> I'm just really scared that people aren't even going to look as far as Launchpad when installing *buntu LTSP and will just walk away since Firefox is broken
<Lns> And if it's really THAT hard to get a patch pushed into Hardy (even in -proposed)... what's the use?
<nubae1> I'll add my 2 cents to the bug list and shout a bit ;-)
<sbalneav> Lns: Any reason given?
<Lns> heh...thanks nubae1 it'll be nice to have someone else's whining in there ;)
<Lns> sbalneav: 'fta' in #ubuntu-mozillateam says "we could take it in nspr, but it's a bit late in this cycle.. and we have the de-sonamization still under discussion blocking both nspr and nss"
<Lns> I don't know what "nspr", "nss" or "de-sonamization" means...
<nubae1> hehe
<sbalneav> Nubae: Section on "hardware", talking about hubs, switches, etc...
<sbalneav> You want them converted to sect3's, or maybe a bulletlist.
<sbalneav> Oh, btw, gimme 2 seconds, I'll push up my branch
<Nubae> ok... whatever u think looks best, I set them up as sect3s, but obviously openoffice killed that
<sbalneav> Crumb.  Can I delete a branch on launchpad?
 * sbalneav thinks he'll never get used to LP
 * Lns watches http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VyEl3w7SFK4
<Nubae> heh, I was watching that the other day
<Nubae> I opted for printouts in the end
<Lns> ;)
<Nubae> Lns: does your triage fix the issue totally?
<Lns> Nubae: I don't know, but I'm assuming so. I haven't tested it (I don't know how to build packages/PPA it for use in my environment)
<Lns> That's why i'm learning about MOTU...
<Lns> I know that through all my troubleshooting, it was determined that /dev/random was sucking up all the entropy, especially when creating new user profiles in Firefox, and /dev/urandom would be a better choice since it doesn't block requests when entropy runs out
<Lns> I have a hack-ish patch that would work for testing
<Lns> but not the same patch..it would, however, prove that using /dev/urandom would fix the bug
<sbalneav> \o/
<sbalneav> got it
<sbalneav> Nubae: OK, check out lp:~sbalneav/ltsp/ltsp-docs-sbalneav
<sbalneav> There's a LOT more work needing to be done, I'll work on it tonight, but at least I've got all of it in book form, with all the proper entities.
<sbalneav> OO.o's inserted some weeeiiird characters here and there, I have to hose them
<Lns> Nubae: download http://logicalnetworking.net/other/urandomize.tar.bz2 if you want to test it - you need to compile urandomize.so and then load it so calls to /dev/random get pushed to /dev/urandom instead (see README)
<sbalneav> plus, all of the screencap stuff like ps listings etc. has to be converted back into <screen></screen> entities, so that's left to do
<Nubae> ok, if there is anything I can do, sbalneav, let me know
<Nubae> although I fear I've already done too much ;-p
<sbalneav> sh*t happens, we deal :)
<sbalneav> content's more important, so if content's been added, I'm happy to do whatever reformatting to get it into shape.
<Nubae> does read ok?
<sbalneav> So far, the content's fine with me.  I'm assuming you spell checked it?
<Nubae> yeah, the one good thing about open office :D
<sbalneav> Hmm
<sbalneav> Quanta for KDE looks like a promising docbook editor.
<Nubae> wont mess up formatting? guess I can compare against vi
<sbalneav> I'm installing it now.
<sbalneav> Ah, by the way, for spell checking an XML document, you can use aspell -H check <document>
<sbalneav> and aspell's smart enough to ignore all the XML tags
<Nubae> ah good to know
#edubuntu 2008-10-07
<sbalneav> Evening all
<imperfectionest> good morning
<subp> hi guys can anybody help me with the x11vnc install on a thin-client. Don't seem to work for me
<sbalneav> Morning all
<stgraber> moin sbalneav
#edubuntu 2008-10-08
<UbuntuDrummerBoy> Hello, this thing on?
<UbuntuDrummerBoy> Not sure if I'm using this right.  I have some questions.
<UbuntuDrummerBoy> is this thing on?
<HedgeMage> hello
<UbuntuDrummerBoy> Am I doing this right.....LOL.
<UbuntuDrummerBoy> am I doing this right?
<UbuntuDrummerBoy> /mgs hedgemage how do you address everyone?
<UbuntuDrummerBoy> Ok, I guess no one can see this and must be doing it wrong.  I'll keep looking.
<HedgeMage> ask?
<HedgeMage> asking if you can ask won't get you anywhere.
<HedgeMage> ubuntulog: ^^^
<UbuntuDrummerBoy> I understand you can use Kubuntu as the Edubuntu install by using the ed package now.  I want to setup a single box for my family (12yo and 14yo boys) and wandered if there was content filtering for the Internet w/ the ed package?  If so, what and is there a howto to simply set that up.  And can you do it per user?  Thanks.
<HedgeMage> hi, ubuntulog
<HedgeMage> UbuntuDrummerBoy*
<UbuntuDrummerBoy> Yeah, I see I see I see,
<HedgeMage> UbuntuDrummerBoy: I've only ever done it at the proxy level (i.e. a filter between a school and the internet) not an individual computer.  I know someone who's good with that sort of thing, but his baby was born yesterday, so I don't expect him back for a few days.
<UbuntuDrummerBoy> HedgeMage: so I take it it's not something that just comes w/ the install.  I've done it in Gentoo but thought there was a much easier way to do it in Ubuntu since they had the Ed package.
 * Lns is going to slap Nick Kendall with a large trout
<nubae> me and u both
<Lns> heh
#edubuntu 2008-10-09
<PMantis> I've setup LDAP and NFS /home manually before for full clients of a main server. Does edubuntu offer any automated ways of making this centralized auth happen on "desktop" clients to the server?
<PMantis> Hi Oliver
 * PMantis thinks ogra is on an automated reconnect, but still away from the computer
<jsgotangco> most likely sleeping
<sbalneav> Evening all
<dfgas> ughhh, trying to find some what to limit my kids when they can login and use the computer, any ideas?
<sbalneav> Limit what time they can log in?
<HedgeMage> dfgas: if you remind me tomorrow, I'll check for you... I don't have edubuntu on this machine, and I don't want to wake up my son to check his
<HedgeMage> (assuming no one else has told you by then)
<dfgas> heh, k
<dfgas> i don't see anything on it
<dfgas> i used cron, but it doesn't lockout the auto login
<dfgas> and it doesn't boot him off when it is auto logged in
<HedgeMage> mine doesn't use auto login, he logs in with a password... not sure if that makes a difference
<sbalneav> I think you can install the libpam-time module
<dfgas> yah if they were to login with user and pass it will tell them that they are disabled
<dfgas> yah thats what i am basiclly using
<dfgas> think i want to change the kill user to shutdown
<sbalneav> I think you can just edit /etc/security/time.conf
<sbalneav> Yes, pam_time's installed by default
<sbalneav> man time.conf will tell you the format of the entries you  need
<sbalneav> For instance if you want your son, say kevin, to only be able to log in between 6PM and 10PM:
<dfgas> yah
<sbalneav> login ; * ; !kevin ; MoTuWeThFrSaSu1800-2200
<sbalneav> you'll also have to add pam_time to the /etc/pam/common-session file, I beleive.
<dfgas> hmmm
<sbalneav> G'night all, off to bed.
<cca> Hi, I just installed Ubuntu 8.04, updates to 8.04.1, then inserted the edubuntu add-on CD... it's not asking to open a package manager or anything like that.
<Nubae> can u open it normally?
<cca> I added the CDROM to synaptic... what pseudo package should I install to get all the edubuntu add-ons installed?
<cca> Nubae: Yes, it simpy shows the files.
<cca> Oh, I think I found it: edubuntu-desktop
<jc2it> How do I transfer the 'sent items' from an Outlook PST file to an evolution 'sent items' folder?
<jc2it> oops wrong question
<jc2it>  I have some Neoware Thinclients that I am PXE booting from LTSP + Ubuntu. How do I determine which Via S3 driver to use, for optimum results?
<LaserJock> hi all
<LaserJock> how goes the battle? :-)
<crimsun> "going," I suppose.
<LaserJock> crimsun: how's it going? I've been seeing a number of bug emails from you
<LaserJock> hmmf
<LaserJock> you'll have to forgive me asking you how it's going after you just answered
<LaserJock> I've just gotten through with lab, my brain is a bit fried
<elkan76> hi everybody!
#edubuntu 2008-10-10
<elkan76> i've a doubt, the https://bugs.launchpad.net/debian/+source/screem/+bug/133043 it's an old bug but until now the mantainer of the package doesn't do anything. There is a posibility to replace Screem on the default edubuntu-desktop?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 133043 in screem "Cannot close "About" window" [Low,Confirmed]
<LaserJock> elkan76: replace it with what?
<elkan76> by example bluefish its a similar application
<LaserJock> hmm, I thought bluefish was more advanced
<LaserJock> though it's been a while since I had a look at screem
<elkan76> in my opinion bluefish apears to be complicated but are very similar with screem
<elkan76> thinking in basic html obiously
<LaserJock> well, we can certainly look at switching to bluefish for 9.04
<LaserJock> it's a bit too late for 8.10
<elkan76> yeap
<elkan76> ;)
<LaserJock> screem is on my "hit list" of programs that should be looked at for replacement
<elkan76> ok thanks, i had an edubuntu presentation to finish
<LaserJock> oh, nice
<elkan76> it's on Santiago, Chile on saturday 11
<elkan76> http://openmind2008.freeusm.cl
<crimsun> I've fixed bug 133043.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 133043 in screem "Cannot close "About" window" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/133043
<crimsun> patch attached to said bug.
<crimsun> (builds, installs/upgrades, and works, obviously)
<sbalneav> Evening all
#edubuntu 2008-10-12
<andresmh> we have developed an educational programming environment for kids (scratch.mit.edu) implemented in Squeak. How should we go about asking people to help us package it for Edubuntu?
<nubae> andresmh: talk to MOTU
<andresmh> nubae: what is MOTU?
<andresmh> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
<andresmh> ?
<nubae> masters of the universe... they maintain universe packaging, which is where it would go...
<nubae> yes thats the link
<nubae> there should be some help on packaging there, and u can subscribe to the mailing list and mention the project
<andresmh> i guess we're a step before that, we don't have a .deb package and we want to learn how to go about creating one that, say MOTU, would be happy with
<andresmh> ah
<andresmh> nice
<andresmh> thanks nubae
<nubae> there is even a youtube video
#edubuntu 2009-10-05
<BronzeAu> Howdy.
<BronzeAu> :-D
<BronzeAu> Anyone around?
<alkisg> Hi
<BronzeAu> How the day treating you?
<alkisg> ok...
<BronzeAu> Thats good.
<BronzeAu> I'm just having a look around. I'm new to IRC
<alkisg> Welcome :)
<BronzeAu> Been using Ubuntu for a while now though. Since Breezy. Downloading edubuntu atm. Time for a change.
<BronzeAu> Thanks for you welcome. Is this a very active channel?
<alkisg> Not on weekends... on weekdays there is some noice, but again not much
<BronzeAu> Can you answer a small question for me perhaps?
<alkisg> !ask
<ubottu> Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line, so others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
<BronzeAu> Ok. Like I said. I'm new. Sorry.
<BronzeAu> Is the difference between Ubuntu and Edubuntu just the packaged software that comes with?
<alkisg> In jaunty, edubuntu is a meta-package to easily install some software. In Karmic, it comes as an installation DVD.
<BronzeAu> So. If I'm reading you right. Essentially both packages are the same but the software (apps) are different.
<alkisg> Yes; e.g. you can start with an Ubuntu installation and just install the edubuntu packages.
<BronzeAu> So I could down load Ubuntu, add Edubuntu apps and call it Edubuntu and really there would be no difference.
<alkisg> Yes
<BronzeAu> Ok, cool. Thank you for your help. I'm sure you get much harder questions than that from time to time.
<alkisg> Heh :) Don't worry, feel free to ask anything you want.
<BronzeAu> I'm in Australia. East coast. It's cold and raining. Just become dark. No I cannot see kangaroos out my window. Where are you?
<alkisg> In the other side of the world :)
<alkisg> Greece - it's 11:54 am here
<BronzeAu> Never been to Greece. One day maybe.
<BronzeAu> Beautiful weather I hear. Warm, sunny and generally not to hot.
<BronzeAu> So, for you - Why Edubuntu?
<alkisg> We were planning on coming to Australia for some years, but we had problems with the kids - the school year started 6 months later than us, so they'd loose a year in school...
<BronzeAu> Are you a teacher?
<alkisg> Yes
<BronzeAu> Same.
<BronzeAu> What do you teach?
<alkisg> Computer classes :)
<BronzeAu> He he - I teach HSIE which stands for Human Society and its Environment. Essentially Geography and History among other subjects like Aboriginal Studies, Commerce, Legal Studies & Business Studies.
<BronzeAu> I'm resurecting an old computer with Edubuntu for my classroom. Had Ubuntu on it for years though.
<BronzeAu> In a staff or 56 at our school (Years 7-10) me and one other teacher are the only ones that are computer literate. The school I'm at dosen't even have Computer Studies.
<alkisg> Wow... and do you have a sysadmin employed there? Who takes care of your PCs?
<BronzeAu> We had one. Gone.
<alkisg> Nice :) Good luck!
<BronzeAu> Now we have what is called a TSO. Technical Systems Officer who does software. The other staff member I mentioned does hardware. I run the Moodle.
<BronzeAu> We have just had a laptop roll out of 20,000 computer to all of year 9 across the state so the TSO is for them really.
<BronzeAu> They are all baby notebooks. $700 each with $5200 of software.
<alkisg> In Greece they gave out netbooks to all 12 y.o. students...
<alkisg> ..but they're dual boot with ubuntu and no office, so not much spent on software
<BronzeAu> Since most teachers are computer illiterate (nearly retiring) so I've installed Moodle to ease the burden on the staff face to face tech lessons.
<BronzeAu> I see. Great for Ubuntu but youneed the software.
<BronzeAu> These little notepads have 6.5 hour batt life and are Windows 7. Fully locked and remotely administered via wireless.
<alkisg> How are they administrered? E.g. what do you do if you want to install the new acrobat reader in 20000 laptops?
<BronzeAu> All via the proxy. They are all filtered and no software can be installed by the student whatsoever.
<BronzeAu> http://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,26111035-15306,00.html
<BronzeAu> You can't even get into the bios. Each one has a tracker inserted so they can't be sold. Accurate to 5meters. Pretty cool but very big brother too.
<alkisg> OK, but how is new software installed?
<BronzeAu> It's automatically uploaded / downloaded via the proxy when instructed by the department.
<BronzeAu> By the end of the year they will have issued 65,000 of these things. I have one. It's ok. Can't handle video through the projector. I nearly killed it in its first month.
<alkisg> I'd like to know how that is done technically. I don't know of any way to do that PROPERLY in windows - and using WSUS in 20.000 PCs sounds like a nightmare to me.
<BronzeAu> It has a prompt that comes up just telling you what its doing. You can say ok or cancel.
<alkisg> Sure, I mean the sysadmin-side of the story...
<BronzeAu> If you choose cancel it will just do it automatically on the next reboot.
<BronzeAu> Yeah - do not know and for obvious reasons I guess there keeping it all secret too.
<BronzeAu> Essentially each laptop is like a slave and the proxy is the server. Although students can access the net at home its only via the detmsw proxy and is so filtered as such.
<julienrat> bonjour
<HedgeMage> helo
<HedgeMage> *hello
<julienrat> y a t-il quelqu'un de chez scideralle ?
<LaserJock> morning
<dgroos> Good morning LaserJock
<dgroos> how goes?
<LaserJock> pretty good
<LaserJock> dgroos: how are you doing?
<LaserJock> dgroos: the lab going pretty smoothly?
<dgroos> Well, students coming in any moment and need to finish the demo, "triple bubble map": http://cmap.mpls.k12.mn.us/servlet/SBReadResourceServlet?rid=1GLSQ92NQ-1683NSR-BW&partName=htmltext
<dgroos> and yes indeed, it is :)
<dgroos> I'm trying to get the server cloned so the other classes can get up and running as well.
<dgroos> LaserJock: take it easy.
<LaserJock> highvoltage, stgraber: ping
<highvoltage> LaserJock: pong
<alkisg> dgroos: need any help with the cloning thing?
<dgroos> alkisg: Hi and thanks for asking
<alkisg> Hey... I saw you mails in the list, and thought I'd save you from some suffering, if i can... :)
<dgroos> Thanks--students just came in (I was between class...) I'll get back...
<alkisg> np
<stgraber> alkisg: ping
<alkisg> Hey stgraber
 * alkisg is trying to create nice looking menus for ltsp clients: http://users.sch.gr/alkisg/temp/pxeboot.png
<stgraber> +xprop -root -f ICA_PORT 16c -set ICA_PORT $ISDPORT ica -noshm -isdport $ISDPORT -ivsport $IVSPORT -role $ROLE 2> /dev/zero
<stgraber> +xprop -root -remove ICA_PORT
<stgraber> not sure about that -remove part
<stgraber> why are you seeting ICA_PORT to unset it just afterwards ?
<stgraber> (or I'm missing something about what -remove does)
<alkisg> I'm unsetting it when the client ica dies, don't i?
 * alkisg looks at the source...
<stgraber> oh, that may well be the case ;)
<alkisg> Heh :)
<stgraber> indeed ;)
<stgraber> makes sense suddenly
<alkisg> stgraber: I got many, many ica-crashes with standalone clients.. :(
<alkisg> (not related to the launcher code)
<alkisg> I start projecting my screen on 12 clients, and after 30 seconds, 10 of  them hang!
<stgraber> that's weird, in my case it was mostly ivs crashing but I fixed that a while ago with the auto-restart code
<alkisg> How should I try to debug this?
<stgraber> would be interesting to see if ica is completely dead or half-alive
<alkisg> I think it's defunct
<stgraber> if it's completely dead (no more ica process), then it could be interesting to attach a gdb on it before starting it
<stgraber> if it's half-alive, trying to strace it and attach gdb might help
<dgroos> firedrill...
<alkisg> Ughm, I'll need reading for that, I've done most of my debugging with visual studio and delphi :(
<alkisg> k, ty
<alkisg> dgroos: Heh, get the server out for practice! :)
<stgraber> I'm uploading your changes now, then will give it a try with LTSP-Cluster as I run, just to make sure it still works ;)
<dgroos> alkisg: ah...  can you tell me the chmod command to get the italc to be rwxr-xr-x?
<alkisg> dgroos: http://italc.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php?title=Installation#Setup_authentication_keys
<alkisg> stgraber: it would be better if you did this the other way around!!! :D
<alkisg> dgroos: ah, sorry, you mean the launcher? sudo chmod +x <launcher>
<stgraber> well, looking at the code, I'm pretty confident it'll work :)
<alkisg> Hope so...
<alkisg> stgraber: ah, I forgot to ask about what I told you in the mail: it'd be nice if we also included an "don't use autodetection" flag for italc-launcher (I've done this only for ica-launcher). Should I go ahead an parse /etc/italc/italc.conf from python?
<stgraber> alkisg_bbl: yeah, please do
<alkisg> stgraber: ok, if you didn't upload yet you may want to wait :)
<stgraber> alkisg: it's already uploaded ;)
<alkisg> Uh  :) I'll use http://docs.python.org/library/configparser.html is that ok?
<alkisg> (it's in python2.6-minimal...)
<stgraber> I need it to work starting with pytohn 2.4
<stgraber> *python
<alkisg> Is that there? /me has no clue...
<stgraber> no idea
<stgraber> I'd go with something ugly but compatible like
<alkisg> Yup, I think it is
<alkisg> http://docs.activestate.com/activepython/2.4/python/lib/module-ConfigParser.html
<stgraber> right, but you italc.conf is a shell file (containing shell variables), not ini ?
<alkisg> Sure, but I think that's a subset, isn't it?
<alkisg> I.e. only the default section
<alkisg> I could also parse it 'manually', or even execute it and read the environment variables, but I think the configparser looks more elegant...
<nubae> hi folks...
<nubae> alkisg, whatcha trying to do?
<alkisg> Hi nubae
<alkisg> I sent a small patch for italc to avoid ports in use, and I wanna send another one for it to not autodetect clients
<alkisg> I got it in a one-liner :): no_autodetection=subprocess.Popen(["sh", "-c", ". /etc/italc/italc.conf >/dev/null 2>&1 && echo $NO_AUTODETECTION"], stdout=subprocess.PIPE).communicate()[0].strip().upper() in ["TRUE", "T", "1"]
<nubae> mailing list is getting kinda heated... though I guess I'm partly to blame :-)
<nubae> hehe... nice one
<alkisg> Could someone suggest better names for the conf variables? One for DONT_PUBLISH_TO_AVAHI, and another one for DONT_USE_AVAHI_FOR_AUTODETECTION? :D
<nubae> I've been drowning my brain in DBus and telepathy
 * nubae never realised what an amazingly powerful and approachable framework dbus really was
<nubae> hmmm.... dont publish what?
<nubae> IP I guess u mean
<alkisg> Yeah, don't publish the ica service (=ip) to the avahi daemon
<nubae> u know, u could probably switch off autodection of ips via dbus :p
<alkisg> Ah, I think I got it. (1) ADVERTISE_CLIENT (default true) and (2) AUTODETECT_CLIENTS (default true). stgraber, do you mind if I change the variable name that I sent in the older ica-launcher?
<nubae> this little howto was really awsome: http://arstechnica.com/open-source/news/2007/09/using-the-tomboy-d-bus-interface.ars
<drGspot> has anyone tried to export edubuntu packages to other distros...? ex with woof in puppy..?
<stgraber> alkisg: I guess I can still change it, people didn't get used to it ;)
<alkisg> Nice :)
<nubae> alkisg, how do I write your last name?
<alkisg> Georgopoulos ÎÎµÏÏÎ³ÏÏÎ¿ÏÎ»Î¿Ï
<alkisg> Why?
<nubae> I'm responding to the latest email from Scott Belford... who mentions Vagrant C as being involved with debian edu and somehow edubuntu being a re-marketed copy of it...
<alkisg> Ugh, I didn't read that one yet... :-/
<nubae> u've probably read it... anyway, thought I'd mention the real people behind edubuntu...
<nubae> absolutely crazy... its no wonder people are misinformed
<nubae> hah... gotta love my response... though I'm not gonna let it take any more of my time...
<nubae> he is vagrant's #1 fan apparently... I wonder what specifically caused that...
<alkisg> stgraber: done, and mail sent.
<nubae> well, traffic on the mailing list is a good thing I guess... hopefully more voices are raised...
<sbalneav> Cripes.  Been sick for a week.
<sbalneav> I come back to this sh*t.
<sbalneav> So, I can't figure out.  Is R. Scott Belford mad at me?
<sbalneav> nubae: He's vagrant's #1 fan because vagrant is LTSP's maintainer in Debian.
<sbalneav> I'm vagrant's #1 fan as well, but vagrant works at FreeGeek.  His *job* is partially maintaining their LTSP infrastructure.  He can work on fixing LTSP problems all day.
<CAN-o-SPAM> Looks like a bunch of wasted energy to me
<nubae> heh, it seems he's mad at everyone
<nubae> I just got a personal email from him telling me how he was so dissapointed in me
<nubae> that he thought I was more mature :-)
<nubae> thing about Vagrant is, Scott seems to think he is somehow the main debian-edu developer, and that somehow that makes him the main edubuntu man...
<nubae> I dunno... its confused me now too...
<sbalneav> What I have to laugh about is how QUICKLY everyone seems to think things can "get fixed"
<sbalneav> We've made a concerted effort to get some long standing issues resolved:
<nubae> All I did was try to set the record straight a bit, but I guess maybe I got too personal... I appologize for that
<nubae> right... the minute something doesnt go their way, its time to jump ship
<nubae> and I guess its just this has happened so many times before, we aren't surprised to see it happen anymore
<sbalneav> 1) LaserJock, even though he was MOVING and GETTING A NEW JOB, managed to get the seeds so that edubuntu's a distro again.
<sbalneav> 2) I've spent 3 months working on JUST getting Sabayon into a workable state.
<nubae> there is a slight indifference on our part (those that have been around for a little longer) and perhaps we should try to address that indifference
<sbalneav> Now I'm working on the handbook.
<nubae> right... thats why I thought it right to mention people actually working on edubuntu...
<sbalneav> Well, I think there has to be some realism.  We have no *real* backing from Canonical, other than the naming and hosting of the site.  Theres only a small number of people working on edubuntu, and NONE of us are full time.
<nubae> what I mean is, it looks like the perceived indifference is either intimidating or seems like we are purposely being secretive...
<nubae> yeah... well all this came from Ace 'leaving the community'
<nubae> he wrote me a personal email stating that it was one particular person's fault, though he wouldnt mention who
<dgroos> Hi again
<dgroos> so still working on getting cloned server on the network... and respectin' it.
<dgroos> Took down lots of stuff at the school today--my name was mud.
<dgroos> anyway, I'm working on isolating the problem and can see that the 2 nics are confused, the nic for the wan is spewing out ip addresses.
<dgroos> Can I just go into /etc/network/interfaces and *do something*?
<Ahmuck> dgroos: yes
<Ahmuck> explain your situation
<Ahmuck> this is something i just recently solved myself
<Ahmuck> dgroos: ?
<dgroos> Ahumck:!
<dgroos> how are you?
<dgroos> and, how's your technology treating you?
<dgroos> Well, my 2 nics are backwards, the giga nic is not giving addresses via dhcp which it needs to do to the clients.
<dgroos> Instead, the 100 MB nic is handing them out (which caused things on the network here at the school to go down).
<dgroos> Ahumck:?
<Ahmuck> .
<dgroos> Ahmuck: Hello
<Ahmuck> ok, so you need to switch things around
<Ahmuck>  /etc/network/interfaces
<dgroos> yes indeed
<Ahmuck> and /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
<Ahmuck> so post them pastebin
<Ahmuck> morever, you also need to be aware that your going to have to physically change the wire on the back of the server i suspect
<dgroos> OK  ubuntu.pastbin is it?
<Ahmuck> pastbin.be or whatever you want to use
<dgroos> OK  I'm in this deafening server room right now, am moving cables...
<dgroos> why will I need to change wires?
<Ahmuck> well, i assume that eth0 is incoming, via from the school network and/or internet and eth1 is the thin client side which you have isolated
<dgroos> hmmm... just realized that I can't really do the pastebin thing since I daren't connect this server to the building network yet and risk bringing things down again.  Another way?
<dgroos> The way I've got things set up on my "other server" is eth1 goes to building and eth0 goes to my lan.
<Ahmuck> post it in an e-mail
<Ahmuck> put it on a usb key and then move it and pastebin it
<dgroos> I'll see if it works!
<dgroos> Here's ../interfaces: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/286564/
<Ahmuck> dgroos: so there swaped?
<Ahmuck> they are ?
<dgroos> And here's the dhcpd: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/286566/
<dgroos> Yes, that's the problem.  I've tried a few things but kinda guess and check strategy.
<Ahmuck> so if you swap eth1 and eth0 in the inteface file, did that fix it?
<dgroos> Right, I tried that and when I tried to reboot the network it said: (I've got to do it again to get the error message)
<dgroos> "* Reconfiguring network interfaces...
<dgroos> RTNETLINK answers: No such process
<dgroos> *if-up.d/mountnfs[eth0]: waiting for interface eth1 before doing NFS mounts"
<Ahmuck> yes, mine does the same, however it works
<Ahmuck> does yours?
<dgroos> OK I'll check
<dgroos> Well, the nic that needs to go to the WAN is still giving out ip address, the other nic is not providing them.
<dgroos> The previous results I posted were actually not when I changed the eth0 and eth1 in  /etc/network/interfaces sorry for confusion.
<dgroos> Here are the results when trying to reboot after switching in .../interfaces:
<dgroos> * Reconfiguring network interfaces...
<dgroos> RTNETLINK answers: No such process
<dgroos> SIOCDELRT: No such process
<dgroos> * if-up.d/mountnfs[eth1]: waiting for interface eth0 before doing NFS mounts.
<Ahmuck> swaping interfaces prolly means your going to have to restart dhcpd
<Ahmuck> but, i'm a nubie
<dgroos> OK know how to do that?
<dgroos> I'm game!
<dgroos> sudo /etc/init.d/dhcp3-server restart it is...
<dgroos> Ahmuck: Thanks for working on this networking issue with me.  I've got to head home for the day.  I'll post the question to the list-server on the thread that is steadily growing.
<dgroos> Ahmuck: Have a good evening!
#edubuntu 2009-10-06
<sbalneav> Evening LaserJock
<sbalneav> Thought I'd start a new thread, rather than weigh in on the old one.
<LaserJock> sbalneav: yes, reading it now
<Ahmuck> LaserJock, colab on wiki, using that colab tool that one of the ltsp people pointed out
<Ahmuck> it can be done in real time that way
<sbalneav> Hey Ahmuck
<LaserJock> Ahmuck: gobby?
<Ahmuck> yes, gobby
<Ahmuck> what exactly were you trying to fix in the wiki?
<Ahmuck> brb, printer's borked
 * nubae waves to LaserJock 
<nubae> LaserJock, u remember that list of universe/multiverse apps I put together for possible inclusion once we had an edubuntu dvd again... has that been looked at all? has there been any time to include some of those?
<LaserJock> nubae: I haven't really had much time for that during Karmic
<LaserJock> nubae: because we're doing both LiveFS and text-based installers we're at 3.5GB already with just the regular Edubuntu apps and LTSP
<LaserJock> nubae: but we are building with Universe enabled so it's trivial to add new apps
<nubae> ok, I figured as much, let me know when u do have some time, and how I can help
<LaserJock> nubae: I was hoping we'd get you're list reviewed and included for Lucid
<LaserJock> nubae: I haven't forgotten it by any means
<LaserJock> I was just so worried about getting a workable DVD I didn't want to mess with additional apps right away
<LaserJock> nubae: alkisg was saying that we may be able to get rid of the text-based installer
<nubae> cool... was just a friendly reminder, would be great for lucid as these are the kinds of things that will be visible to the end user... will make it obvious that edubuntu is growing up
<LaserJock> he said that squashfs can detect duplicate files
<nubae> oh
<LaserJock> so a LTSP client chroot would take essentially no space if we include it in the squashfs
<LaserJock> so if we can get a client chroot in there we can save all that space
<LaserJock> making it much more reasonable to fill it with Universe goodies
<nubae> hmm. so u mean load the client chroot on setup?
<LaserJock> essentially the client chroot would exist in the live system
<nubae> ok, nice
<LaserJock> and get copied over as with all the other packages
<LaserJock> there are certainly things we'd have to figure out
<LaserJock> like how to get the client chroot built in the live system to begin with
<LaserJock> and how to remove it if the user is not wanting LTSP
<LaserJock> but right now we're essentially shipping 2 copies of Edubuntu
<LaserJock> one as a live system and another as .debs for the LTSP/text-based installer
<nubae> well, surely just a call to ltsp-build-client from postinst woud do that, no?
<LaserJock> it could be that easy, I'm not sure
<LaserJock> that would work to get the files on I'd think
<nubae> ah I see what u mean so we'd actually save space by loading into the chroot all in one go
<LaserJock> but removing them might be the more difficult part
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> that was my intent
<LaserJock> if we shove everything in the livefs then we don't need all those extra .debs
<LaserJock> and if squashfs detects duplicate files (i.e. the chroot) then we get it for "free"
<nubae> coolio, wel have to get back to sleep, its 5 am here... but keep up the great work, dont get discouraged with these emails...
<LaserJock> nubae: thanks for stopping by and the kind words
<nubae> I worry one day I'll come in here and see key people have packed their bags and left...
<nubae> it wouldn't surprise me with the kind of feedback we get sometimes...
<LaserJock> tbh, I was very close
<nubae> :-/
<LaserJock> I have lots of things to do and I was having a hard time justifying spending time on a project people seemed to think was a failure and irrelevant
<nubae> yeah, just think of those voices as being the serious minority, backed by disinformation unfortunately
<LaserJock> I've made my share of mistakes though and I think some of my management style might not have come across as as welcoming as I want to be
<sbalneav> Well, to be fair, I only saw 2 people saying that :)
<nubae> I think its really important we state somewhere prominent what is being worked on by who...
<LaserJock> yeah, I'm trying to work on some of that
<nubae> right... its just been 2 evangelists...
<sbalneav> Not *evangelists*
<LaserJock> highvoltage and stgraber have really stepped up
<nubae> the same voices from long ago...
<LaserJock> I think the Edubuntu Council is really making some progress
<LaserJock> and we'll be holding elections soon
<LaserJock> 3 new people, fresh blood :-)
<nixternal> Dave Morley is a beast!
<nixternal> he does all of the Kubuntu ISOs too!
<LaserJock> yeah
<nixternal> talk about not having a life! I don't have a life and still can't do that much :)
<LaserJock> nixternal: well, that's because you run Vista for everything
<nixternal> windows 7 now
<LaserJock> nixternal: btw, I have to use Vista for work :(
<nixternal> I am tired of this linux stuff
<nixternal> oh boy, the gov't uses vista?
<LaserJock> yep
<LaserJock> mandatory upgrades have to be done by Dec. 1st
<LaserJock> I got a new computer so mine came with it
<LaserJock> funny AF/Windows story
<LaserJock> I was having problems with IE crashing constantly
<LaserJock> I had the computer help desk people look at it, etc.
<LaserJock> after almost a month somebody said to change my default homepage to *not* be the Air Force portal page
<LaserJock> and after that it stopped crashing
<LaserJock> so the Air Force's default homepage crashers their *forced* web browser
<LaserJock> *crashes
<nixternal> ROFL
<LaserJock> and with that, goodnight
<nixternal> g'nite
<jsgotangco> hey LaserJock
<sbalneav> Morning ja
<sbalneav> jsgotangco:
<sbalneav> phht
<sbalneav> can't type
<LaserJock> hi jsgotangco
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: how's life over there? You get affected by all the weather/natural disasters?
<jsgotangco> hey sbalneav and LaserJock
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: yes we did
<jsgotangco> though not as badly as the rest
<jsgotangco> i just had to contend with knee high flooding ;-)
<LaserJock> yikes
<jsgotangco> and being trapped in a church for 6 hours
<jsgotangco> well its not as bad as the rest
<jsgotangco> it was scary though
<LaserJock> I bet
<LaserJock> so you've got internet though?
<jsgotangco> yep
<jsgotangco> it didn't fade out thank goodness
<LaserJock> crazy
<jsgotangco> people were coordinating via fb and twitter
<jsgotangco> yeah the typhoon had more rain than wind
<LaserJock> something like that where I grew up and *everything* would be taken out
<sbalneav> Wow
<jsgotangco> usually if its wind, the cellular towers get knock out badly
<jsgotangco> but since a lot of the cellular towers were on top of high rise buildings
<jsgotangco> the car mechanics are making a killing at the moment
 * LaserJock imagines jsgotangco in knee high water texting away
<sbalneav> So, privately, I've received about 4 replies to my email on the list.  Very positive.  I.e., "we really like edubuntu and appreciate the work you guys do"
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: my cellphone has TV
<jsgotangco> :)
<jsgotangco> i was watching tv while i was trapped
<jsgotangco> sbalneav: that's good news for sure
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: we are used to seasonal flooding but this one was one in a hundred years
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: crazy, well I hope things get back to normal
<jsgotangco> i doubt if it will get back to normal by years end
<jsgotangco> one thing for sure i'll always get jittery when its going to rain hard
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: how many people died in the philippines?
<jsgotangco> because of the flooding?
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: yeah
<jsgotangco> i believe around 300
<jsgotangco> or more
<LaserJock> :(
<jsgotangco> in 2 weeks we had 3 typhoons
<LaserJock> yeah, crazy
<jsgotangco> ketsana, parma and melor
<jsgotangco> but melor is not bound to hit us
<jsgotangco> but the thing is so huge, it stuck parma up north
<LaserJock> did any of the earthquakes effect you guys?
<jsgotangco> its been there since saturday
<jsgotangco> nope
<LaserJock> sbalneav: that's awesome to hear, we need to keep those rolling
<sbalneav> Well, they've been private emails.  Obviously, people don't want to get involved.  It is nice that people DO seem to appreciate.
<sbalneav> Here's a quote from one:
<sbalneav> I'll keep listening in and contributing where I can, I know there are
<sbalneav> lots of others like me in Education that silently use Edubuntu and are
<sbalneav> thrilled that it's there.
<sbalneav> So, my attitude is, stay the course, keep plugging away to help the "silent" users of Edubuntu :)
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> it helps just knowing they are there
<sbalneav> Yep
<LaserJock> sometimes I wonder to myself if anybody actually uses Edubuntu
<jsgotangco> yeah i still do
<jsgotangco> well my daughter does
<sbalneav> Well, 4 people do anyway
<sbalneav> 5
<LaserJock> so it's nice to hear that people do use it anyway
<jsgotangco> at least you are assured that a kid uses it here at home
<jsgotangco> i haven't bought a new computer for well 4 years so i can't help test on decent hardware
<LaserJock> does it have a DVD drive?
<jsgotangco> yes but spotty
<jsgotangco> lol
<jsgotangco> my only decent machine here is a powerpc hehehe
<jsgotangco> at the moment
<LaserJock> I am still concerned that moving to a DVD release will cause a decent number of people to have problems
<jsgotangco> are you still having an issue with disc size?
<LaserJock> well, not anymore :-)
<LaserJock> we moved to a DVD for Karmic
<LaserJock> the add-on thing just wasn't working all that well for people
<jsgotangco> i haven't been downloading discs lately
<jsgotangco> just been dist upgrading
<LaserJock> it caused a lot of confusion, OEMs didn't like it, and people had a hard time taking Edubuntu serious (i.e. it was removed from distrowatch) when it's billed as an "Add On"
<jsgotangco> but a DVD is painful to download especially in this part of the world
<jsgotangco> well at least torrent it
<alkisg> Hi all! sbalneav: hey man, are you ok? we missed you :)
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: yeah, we're going to try to have good instructions for burning it to a USB stick as well
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: it's going to be a bit harder to get, but I think in the long run it's going to make things a lot easier for people
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: for instance, with the add-on there was no way to do a livecd demo of Edubuntu
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: with the DVD we can do that and have LTSP available for install
<jsgotangco> ah true
<jsgotangco> is the livecd still popular?
<LaserJock> I think so, for demos and for people just wanting to quickly install Edubuntu on their child's machine
<jsgotangco> hmm perhaps, my daughter just got used to it so its the only thing she uses at home
<LaserJock> I think if we also give clear instructions maybe on how to create essentially an addon using AptOnCD or something
<LaserJock> that might help
<jsgotangco> man i have so many things to catch up
 * jsgotangco needs to get a real computer soon
<LaserJock> but the add-on was basically a pool of .debs
<jsgotangco> yes thats what i recall
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: do you get download stats per release?
<Ahmuck> alkisg:
<Ahmuck> someone needs to give dgroos a hand
<alkisg> I tried yesterday, but he had lessons and a fire drill :)
<alkisg> dgroos: whenever you want, just ping me....
<dgroos> Ahmuck: Thanks!
<dgroos> alkisg:  and to you, thanks too!
<dgroos> Lunch time...
<alkisg> dgroos: bon appetite
<dgroos> alkisg: a bagle with cream cheese and hot peppers--my favorite -- ok tmi...
<dgroos> so, I made the changes
<alkisg> Everything ok now?
<dgroos> I mentioned in last email but won't know till after school.
<dgroos> alkisg:  Do you know what I meant that the ports had switched roles?
<dgroos> (back to 2 hand typing...)
<alkisg> You mean the nics?
<alkisg> eth0 <=> eth1?
<dgroos> yes
<dgroos> yes
<alkisg> You can change their names again from the 70-persistent-net-rules file...
<alkisg> sudo gedit /etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistent-net.rules
<dgroos> oh--I didn't know that.  Can I also just change the info under each heading for the section then saving (in /etc/network/interfaces?
<alkisg> Yeah, sure...
<dgroos> I tried that this AM but don't know if it worked, yet
<dgroos> OK!
<alkisg> I hope you *didn't* tell dhcp3-server to listen on a specific interface, did you?
<dgroos> I'm going to do this idea you are giving now, as well, to learn...
<dgroos> How would I have done that?
<alkisg> E.g. dpkg-reconfigure dhcp3-server and tell it on which interfaces it should listen (*don't* do that)
<dgroos> Luckily I didn't even know about that :)-- didn't touch it.
<alkisg> Generally when cloning an ltsp server, you should only need to edit /etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistent-net.rules
<alkisg> Nothing else (assuming dhcp-client on the external nic)
<dgroos> Good to know.  So, instead of trashing and rebooting, I open, make it right, close, reboot?
<alkisg> Right.
<alkisg> And if you deleted that file before the cloning, you have 50% chance for it to work on the first boot with no editing whatsoever
<alkisg> (or if the cards as the same, you can just switch the cables...)
<dgroos> :) and I happened to not win that first toss of the coin!
<alkisg> Yeah I forgot to tell you, in my case the cards were always gigabit, so I just switched the cables...
<dgroos> Cool, thanks!
<alkisg> Yw
<dgroos> I'll be writing this up in my blog as well...
<dgroos> alkisg: how do you make new servers?  As I understand you have a few labs you... supervise? set up? teach in?
<alkisg> I have a set of scripts which automate the setup in about 95% (https://launchpad.net/sch-scripts), and in the future I want to do that 100% with an ubuntu remix
<alkisg> If I do this the way I want, my "custom distro" will have 2 questions:
<alkisg> 1) What are you setting up? (a) server (b) client (c) student pc
<alkisg> and question 2) What's the computer hostname?
<alkisg> I hope that will be all that I have to do to make it work :)
<alkisg> (of course it'll only target greek schools, it can't be a generic solution)
<dgroos> no way!  what would you start with, a golden image, an install disk? something else?
<alkisg> A remix is a customized live cd
<dgroos> (was just googling it :) )
<alkisg> So I start with a live cd, unzip it, install packages and make some settings in that image, then zip it and make a live cd again.
<dgroos> You would have 3 different images for each of your 3 choices listed in question 1?
<alkisg> No, a single image
<alkisg> (DVD or usb stick)
<alkisg> I hope I can have this ready within 1-2 years... :)
<dgroos> This is very cool.  You take big steps.
<alkisg> Of course if I see that it works for us, I'll publish the necessary how-to's for other to do the same...
<dgroos> how much customization would the install disk require?
<alkisg> In my case, a lot
<alkisg> E.g. I want shared users accounts, shared home dirs, italc installed, edu apps, the ability to remotely help any teacher that needs help, automatic upgrades from our ministry etc
<dgroos> Nice
<dgroos> Well, in the mean time I'll try to perfect the make-a-golden-image-of-the-server, clone-it, re-image and fix-/etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistent-net.rules. :)
<alkisg> Simple & effective ;)
<dgroos> But I'm going to share your vision with those who are the leaders of technology in our school district to let them know of the possible possibilities :)
<dgroos> OK--lunch is up.  thanks alkisg and Ahmuck :D
<alkisg> Bye!
<sbeattie> BTW, there was discussion in the meeting a couple of weeks ago about zsync downloads failing when grabbing the edubuntu dvds off of cdimages.
<sbeattie> I've prepared an SRU for zsync for hardy/intrepid/jaunty and it'd be great if people here could test it and report their results to bug 420931
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 420931 in zsync "zsync crashes with SIGSEGV when updating dvds" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/420931
<LaserJock> sbeattie: thanks
#edubuntu 2009-10-07
<Balsaq> youtube videos play slow on my old dell with buntu, was told old ATI video card do not have driver support for buntu, found an nvidia card that fit my system and nvidia says they have the buntu drivers, i am a non tech and a buntu newbie so i have not purchased the vid card yet-please comment
<Balsaq> question:can i newer better vid card with the correct driver support for buntu, spped up online vidoe performance? or is all this controlled my the processor and ram and the vid card simply not involved in the speed of the vid?
<cemoi> hello
<cemoi> can i speak french?
<cemoi> i search a chan fr for edubuntu
<dgroos> Quick question: I did ifconfig and both nics say, "Bcast: and give an ip address range.  does that mean that both nics are broadcasting ip addresses?
<dgroos> that would be a disaster...
<ogra> indeed they broadcast ... every NIC does ... else your tcp/ip protocol wouldnt work
<ogra> it has nothing to do with dhcp broadcasting
<dgroos> (I can breath again)  Thanks ogra!
<ogra> if you are 192.168.1.2 and want to ping 192.168.1.3 then your NIC first sends a request to the boradcast address to find out where 192.168.2.3 is
<ogra> *err
<ogra> 192.168.1.3 :)
<ogra> if you use ping with the -b switch it will use the boradcast address to ping all available ip's in your network
<dgroos> that makes sense though didn't know there were a/b switches--just googled.  That's good to know.
<dgroos> ah... a/b is for cable/tv switches :)  /b /c /d /n /w /x /4 switches are for networks.
<ogra> err, no i meant the commandline option -b for the ping command :)
<dgroos> A perfect example showing that accurate communication isn't trivial!
<LaserJock> is everybody testing Edubuntu Beta?
<sbalneav> I kicked off the download last night
<sbalneav> I'll probably try to install tonight.
<LaserJock> great
<alkisg> Hi sbalneav... do you think I have any chances in implementing the libpam-sshfs module that I told you the other day?
<alkisg> Or will that be too hard, and I shouldn't even bother?
<sbalneav> Well, it's certainly possible.
<sbalneav> Here's the problem
<sbalneav> Past PAM, you've also got NSS worries to contend with
<alkisg> How are those handled? By seperate modules?
<alkisg> I could reuse some existing libpam-something code for that, couldn't I?
<sbalneav> Well.
<sbalneav> (hmm)
<sbalneav> Here's how *I* do it, but it has an inherent problem.
<sbalneav> Create the pam module, collect the userid and password, and then initiate the ssh connection.
<sbalneav> BUT have the ssh remain open, and have it create a control socket (the way we do with ldm in ltsp)
<sbalneav> THEN
<sbalneav> create an nss module that uses the established ssh session's control socket to look up passwd and group info from the server (via the getent command)
<sbalneav> Problems:
<sbalneav> 1) Password expiry.  It's what we face with LDM.  ssh doesn't handle expired passwords in a "graceful" manner.
<sbalneav> i.e. there's no API that a pam module could tie into, you MUST actually parse the stdio stream with ssh, looking for the expired password messages.
<sbalneav> problem is, this is screen scraping.
<alkisg> OK, not a big problem for my needs
<alkisg> e.g. the way ltsp handles it is good enough for me
<sbalneav> 2) nss lookups are going to be very slow.
<alkisg> About that. Do I really need to get all the passwd info from the server? E.g. does ldap also read the whole database, even if there are thousands of users in there?
<sbalneav> However, you may be able to get around that by cacheing.
<alkisg> Or could I get away with only providing that one user locally?
<sbalneav> libnss_ldap does an ldap query for every call that would require info on "human readable" names for files
<sbalneav> Well, here's what I'd do.
<sbalneav> I'd simply have the pam module, upon successful login, to a "getent passwd", and cache the file locally
<sbalneav> then just use libnss_extrafiles to go after that local cache.
<alkisg> Thanks man... ok, I'll try this, I do hope it's doable in some reasonable time.... isn't it? :D
<alkisg> Thanks again :)
<dgroos> alkisg: I used the info you gave yesterday about switching the nics and it worked!
<alkisg> dgroos: Nice!! Put it on the ubuntu wiki if you want
<dgroos> I first had to fix some stuff I'd messed around with before doing it right :)
<dgroos> Great idea--I'll do it.
<dgroos> What name would you give the page? AssigningLabelsToRecalitrantNics?
<dgroos> ;)
<dgroos> And, do I do it at help.ubuntu.com/community  hmmm... any thoughts?
<alkisg> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ServerCloning ?
<alkisg> (assuming that sometime someone will fill more info about it :D)
#edubuntu 2009-10-08
<LaserJock> hmm, looks like I broke the text-based installer
<nubae|work> greets LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi nubae|work
 * nubae|work battles telepathy and dbus...
<nubae|work> good thing is I now understand dbus pretty thoroughly :-) I wasn't really sure what it was till now...
<LaserJock> good
<LaserJock> I don't that I do exactly
<LaserJock> but I'm glad somebody does
<LaserJock> :-)
<nubae|work> heh... well to use telepathy u need to know dbus cause all the methods and signals go through there
<LaserJock> yes, I'm becoming aware of that unfortunately
<nubae|work> I also learnt how collaboration really works... basically its dbus on one machine connected to dbus on another
<LaserJock> Ubuntu's fancy IM integration stuff was causing me problems because of telepathy
<nubae|work> if u think about the possibilities this creates, its awsome
<nubae|work> yeah telepathy is big... but reading the developer's manual helps
<LaserJock> the only issue I seem to have is when I don't really need all that
<LaserJock> just a personal thing
<nubae|work> what do u mean?
<LaserJock> I mean I don't need/want collaboration personally
<LaserJock> and it's becoming more integrated into the OS
<LaserJock> so that it's becoming harder for me to avoid it
<nubae|work> well, u don't have to use it :-) but it sure brings new possibilities to apps
<LaserJock> my problem is I'm starting to have to use it
<nubae|work> ah... right... well yeah can't really avoid telepathy anymore, unless u wanna not use communication at all
<LaserJock> I wanted to use pidgin
<LaserJock> but Ubuntu kept opening Empathy on incoming messages
<LaserJock> whether I had an empathy window open or not
<nubae|work> hmm, really, thats strange...
<LaserJock> because of the dbus calls, etc.
<nubae|work> well, empathy isnt really linked to the calls... it should be using telepathy straight...
<LaserJock> the Ubuntu indicator app picks up the incoming message
<nubae|work> though it wasnt always like that, I guess u're talking about the past
<LaserJock> and starts up mission control
<nubae|work> when empathy had its own libs
<LaserJock> no, I'm talking about how this is being integrated into the OS
<nubae|work> yeah and mission control chooses the connection manager, and then marshall stuff depending on the client in use... but empathy shouldnt kidnap your pidgin messages
<nubae|work> at least doesnt happen for me
<LaserJock> I had assumed that if I closed empathy it would stop "looking" for incoming messages
<nubae|work> definetly
<LaserJock> but that's not the case now in Ubuntu
<nubae|work> hmmm, in Karmic?
<LaserJock> yeah
<nubae|work> I havent looked at karmic yet... in terms of telepathy, but that would be a major regression
<LaserJock> it's a "feature" :-)
<LaserJock> so they patched it so that it now looks to pidgin first if it's open
<LaserJock> which seems like kind of a hacky workaround to me but I don't know
<LaserJock> and gwibber is worse
<LaserJock> because there's no UI to close the client
<nubae|work> well, the problem is that pidgin doesnt use telepathy
<LaserJock> well, it shouldn't *have* to
<nubae|work> and telepathy is now hard coded into the WM like you say
<LaserJock> I think this telepathy stuff is interesting for sure
<nubae|work> well, the fact that everyone has agreed on a standard communications platform, to me says it should :-)
<LaserJock> I just hope that it doesn't get too hard coded for those of us who don't necessarily need it
<LaserJock> but that stander here is XMPP, not telepathy
<nubae|work> well, unless u intend to not use video/audio conferencing, instant messaging, collaboration, SIP, etc etc
<LaserJock> all I want is a Jabber client
<LaserJock> no video/audio, collaboration, SIP, etc.
<LaserJock> Jabber and maybe IRC if they can do it well
<nubae|work> well, telepathy uses XMPP and it is the chosen communications platform for Gnome...
<nubae|work> its just standardisation
<nubae|work> for devs, it makes sense
<nubae|work> the end user can find it annoying I guess
<LaserJock> well, I just want my IM client to work
<LaserJock> and not be autospawning
<nubae|work> yeah thats pretty bad... I'm sure thats not intended
<nubae|work> telepathy should work very independently of empathy
<LaserJock> it's disconcerting to me that apps are automatically opening up when I've closed them
<LaserJock> no, it is intended unfortunatley
<LaserJock> right, I'm not blaming telepathy per se
<nubae|work> well, at least on Jaunty, that behaviour is not there... I can control telepathy independently of empathy
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> it's a karmic feature
<nubae|work> feature... that doesnt sound right
<LaserJock> the issue isn't really telepathy
<nubae|work> who came up with that idea, I wonder
<LaserJock> it's that they're catching incoming messages whether empathy is open or not and starting up the client
<nubae|work> right, but that would mean that empathy is hardcoded to always be on somehow, or, that the dbus bindings launch empathy, which would be very strange
<LaserJock> so I end up having a hard time figuring out which apps are open and which are not
<LaserJock> yeah, the indicator-session applet uses dbus to launch empathy
<nubae|work> I'm gonna install Karmic and take a look
<nubae|work> ah ok, so this indicator-session applet is new for karmic?
<LaserJock> sorta
<nubae|work> or its got the new dbus launching empathy functionality...
<LaserJock> I think it might be around in Jaunty but not as powerful
<nubae|work> gotcha...
<LaserJock> so they told me that the only way (before the fix they just put in) to stop this behavior
<LaserJock> was to disable all the accounts in empathy
<LaserJock> then it would just go to pidgin
<nubae|work> gosh
<LaserJock> I'm pretty confused by the whole thing
<LaserJock> and it seems like the only way to get things "normal" is to use empathy
<LaserJock> which seems kind of "not nice" to me
<LaserJock> I love pidgin and would like to continue using it for the foreseeable future
<nubae|work> well, the problem is there is a lot it can't do due to not using telepathy
<nubae|work> like sharing the desktop, file transfers to gabble, msn, salut accounts
<nubae|work> video/audio conferencing to more than 2 people at the same time
<nubae|work> and from a development point of view, it makes no sense to continue to support pidgin, as nice as it is
<LaserJock> right
<alkisg> It also runs on windows :) Makes collaboration easier for people using multiple platforms :)
<LaserJock> well, somebody would have to write a nice IM client that uses telepathy for me to be interested
<nubae|work> well, telepathy doesn't work on windows
 * alkisg will keep using pidgin for some time...
<nubae|work> though there are efforts to port it
<LaserJock> the other stuff just doesn't excite me
<nubae|work> there are a LOT of telepathy projects being worked on
<nubae|work> who knows, maybe mine will catch your fancy... lol
<LaserJock> so I certainly don't mind telepathy being around, and am generally a fan
<LaserJock> but I'd like to be able to use my choice of IM client without "punishment"
<nubae|work> well, I agree that it shouldnt force u to use one client, and I dont believe that is its intention
<LaserJock> I think it is ;-)
<LaserJock> though not in a mean way
<nubae|work> I know of at least 4-5 chat clients using telepathy
<LaserJock> the guys doing this don't like pidgin
<nubae|work> and they can run concurrently without issues
<alkisg> Maybe pidgin will get a (secondary) telepathy backend in the future..
<LaserJock> and pretty much think it should die
<nubae|work> come on... no conspiracy theories ;-)
<LaserJock> well, it's fairly common knowledge
<LaserJock> I don't blame them
<LaserJock> but still, the bias is there
<nubae|work> that would make the most sense... using telepathy in pidgin
<LaserJock> when I mention a bug they tell me I should just use empathy and forget pidgin
<nubae|work> well, its a telepathy thing... empathy is just a small example of how to use telepathy
<nubae|work> the major work has gone into the comms platform
<nubae|work> heh...
<LaserJock> right, but since telepathy doesn't give me any other advantages
<LaserJock> I'm having to put up with a crappy IM client because of a framework that doesn't gain me anything
<LaserJock> which seems not so fun to me
<alkisg> I see telepathy in the same way that I see the gstreamer library... Sure, it's a good backend, but totem doesn't yet do everything vlc or mplayer do. Same thing with empathy, it doesn't yet do what pidgin does...
<nubae|work> I'd be pretty surprised if there is nothing telepathy can do for u
<LaserJock> nubae|work: I can't think of anything
<nubae|work> do u use vino and vinagre?
<LaserJock> no
<nubae|work> that uses telepathy
<LaserJock> I apt-get remove those
<nubae|work> jokosher?
<LaserJock> I don't want VNC on my machine
<nubae|work> abiword?
<LaserJock> nope
<nubae|work> inkscape?
<LaserJock> nope
<LaserJock> sometimes
<nubae|work> ah...
<nubae|work> there was bound to be one :p
<LaserJock> so how does telepathy help me with inkscape?
<nubae|work> u can share drawings with other users
<LaserJock> I've never wanted to do that
<nubae|work> ok, but the ability is there... and its quite useful in school situations...
<LaserJock> I mean, I understand why many people would
<nubae|work> anyway, surely u can dream up something it would be useful to u for
<LaserJock> I just personally don't need/want it
<LaserJock> so I'm not gaining anything from it
<nubae|work> how about sharing a chem app somehow...
<LaserJock> which makes it harder for me to justify the nasty IM client
<nubae|work> well, that will change soon enough
<LaserJock> I just don't feel the need to share things
<LaserJock> maybe I'm anti-social, I don't know
<LaserJock> I've just not had a need for it
<nubae|work> do u use gtalk?
<LaserJock> Jabber
<LaserJock> not gtalk itself though
<nubae|work> right but more and more telepathy is taking care of gtalk directly
<LaserJock> it's another not-so-useful IM client
<nubae|work> hmm, there I disagree
<nubae|work> I use it a lot, just cause of the gmail integration
<LaserJock> but I don't want it integrated
<nubae|work> but if u dont use gmaiil, ok, I can see it not being that great
<LaserJock> I use gmail
<LaserJock> exclusively
<LaserJock> but that's email, not IM
<nubae|work> hmm, they are so similar... :p
<LaserJock> I don't want things integrated into my email, it's just useless and distracting
<LaserJock> no, they are worlds different
<LaserJock> I talk to almost completely different people between them
<LaserJock> I use email for mass communication
<nubae|work> i bet u there will come a day where email becomes obsolete and there is just instant messaging
<LaserJock> IM for personally conversations
<LaserJock> I suppose
<LaserJock> I'm not a big fan of email
<LaserJock> I wouldn't mind having something better
<nubae|work> its a highly insecure old bothersome protocol
<LaserJock> but I'm not sure how people can make it better
<nubae|work> well, jabber takes care of that in a much better way, imho
<LaserJock> except it's not great at mass communication
<nubae|work> anyhow... I must go... home sweet home...
<LaserJock> and it's real time, which sucks
<nubae|work> hmm, why not...
<nubae|work> doesnt have to be real time
<nubae|work> u can leave messages on the server
<nubae|work> and it can multicast just fine
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> but then it's just email
<LaserJock> with a different transmission protocol
<nubae|work> well no, its a secure protocol
<LaserJock> instead of SMTP you're using XMPP or something
<nubae|work> its better controlled
<nubae|work> right
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> but that's not changing much
<nubae|work> xmpp is far superior to xmtp
<LaserJock> the end user won't notice a difference
<nubae|work> no the end user wont
<nubae|work> which is a good thing
<LaserJock> right
<nubae|work> anyway, have to go... i'll be on later from home...
<nubae|work> laters...
<LaserJock> cya
<Balsaq> registered my nick, reveived email to finish it, followed the instructions, now get message-must log in 1st to register nick?
<alkisg> Balsaq: better ask in #ubuntu-irc
#edubuntu 2009-10-09
<alkisg> Good morning
<Balsaq> hody alkisg!
<Balsaq> how do i personlize my profile so my "whois" thing readsd the way i want it too
<alkisg> Balsaq: better ask this in #ubuntu
<Balsaq> i thought the 2 were essentially the same? and that room is a mad house...but if you wish.
<alkisg> No, this channel is for education specific questions..
<nubae|work> greets alkisg, how's your python app coming along?
<alkisg> Hi nubae!! Which one ? :)
<alkisg> My latest python script was one that supported users importing/exporting, it runs just fine...
<alkisg> The other one about port forwarding NATting etc wasn't an app; I was looking to use existing tools
<alkisg> (so telepathy didn't do what I wanted; I found no existing tools for that)
<BronzeAu> Hey all. Any one here?
<BronzeAu> Have a couple of questions.
<jussi01> no :P
<jussi01> go ahead BronzeAu
<BronzeAu> Bugger. Oh well. :9
<BronzeAu> Mate. I've downloaded Ubuntu from the Jaunty DVD. Updated it and now I want to add the Edubuntu ISO image I have on CD here. How do I do that?
<BronzeAu> Was about 230mb
<BronzeAu> The edubuntu site dosen't really seem to help me download it or give me clear instructions unless I have missed it. Most probably.
<nubae|work> just stick the edubuntu cd in the drive and a dialog should come up asking if u want to install packages
<BronzeAu> It just displays a heap of folders. Do I click on one in particular?
<jussi01> sudo aptitude install edubuntu-desktop should do it no?
<BronzeAu> Both 'install' and 'appinstall' do nothing.
<BronzeAu> I'll try.
<BronzeAu> Its downloading - So I didn't need the CD afterall.
<jussi01> thats what I thought, yeah.
<jussi01> iirc the live CD's dont have packages on them, only an image.
<BronzeAu> Ok. cool. Well it working so fingers crossed. It's taken me two days to get to this point. Phew!!
<nubae|work> right, u need to write the image to CD
<BronzeAu> What image? Nubae. Do you mean me?
<BronzeAu> I have had absolutlely no luck with the ISO's I have downloaded. Three copies and all corrupt in some way. Just amazing. Finally I went down the shops and bought the last Linux Mag and there was a DVD of Jaunty in there.
<BronzeAu> Thank guys. Appreciate the help. ;)
<LaserJock> are we having a meeting?
<alkisg> Do we have anything that relates to an agenta? :)
<sbalneav> Well, I'm in Ubuntu-meeing just in case we do :)
<LaserJock> we've got major issues with the DVD I wanted to discuss
<LaserJock> we don't have much time
<LaserJock> I think we need to nail down Karmic ASAP
<LaserJock> highvoltage, stgraber: ping
<stgraber> LaserJock: pong
<LaserJock> stgraber: meeting time
<alkisg> stgraber: meeting... :)
 * alkisg is sorry to leave in the middle of the meeting, but he has to. Good work LaserJÎ¿ck!
<highvoltage> LaserJock: pong
<highvoltage> LaserJock: is the meeting over?
<LaserJock> highvoltage: still going
<LaserJock> highvoltage: the short version of the DVD problem is that the text-based installer is screwed right now
<highvoltage> LaserJock: ouch, ok
<LaserJock> highvoltage: cjwatson is tracking it down for us as he thinks it might be a bug in the build script
<LaserJock> if that's fixed then things are look rather good actually
<LaserJock> I did a bunch of tests on the Live side
<LaserJock> and it really looks cool
<LaserJock> I'm impressed
<LaserJock> we get the nice work of Ubiquity
<LaserJock> but it still uses Edubuntu 9.10 most places
<LaserJock> the slideshow is still Ubuntu-specific, but I don't think that's a big deal
<dinda> LaserJock: highvoltage:  I've got a meeting next week with other Canonical folks re: Edubuntu and all things Ubuntu Education, anything in particular you folks want asked?
<LaserJock> dinda: heh, lots of things ...
<LaserJock> dinda: is it going to be a live meeting?
<dinda> LaserJock: yes, in person
<LaserJock> I things that come to my mind are:
<LaserJock> 1) Is the community free to just use "Edubuntu", no need for "Ubuntu Educational Edition", or "Ubuntu Education"?
<LaserJock> 2) Is Canonical going to offer paid support for Edubuntu (or even parts of it)?
<LaserJock> 3) What channels can we use to involve Canonical in marketing of Edubuntu?
<LaserJock> right now I'm just not sure where Edubuntu fits in Canonical's plans
<LaserJock> it seems like Canonical still wants to get involved with schools, etc.
<LaserJock> primarily right now as Ubuntu desktops and servers
<LaserJock> but it would seem like Canonical would also benefit from Edubuntu too
<LaserJock> so I'm curious what can Edubuntu do to help Canonical and vice versa
<dinda> LaserJock: agreed, last they told was "edubuntu is not currently aligned in our goals" but not much else
<LaserJock> right
<LaserJock> I mean, one question would be, what does it take for Edubuntu to be "valuable" to Canonical again
<dinda> so I hope to flesh out if they have any plans and if so, try to get some sort of more formal statement
<LaserJock> what measure of success do we need to show?
<dinda> they've really said nothing to the community and the silence has been a bit deafening - imo
<dinda> of course since Laserjock sez "silence means I'm that man" then maybe. . .  :)
<LaserJock> lol
<LaserJock> dinda: mdz asked me to fill out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KarmicKoala/ReleaseManifest
<LaserJock> dinda: so I updated it for Edubuntu, but we still have a ? under the support length
<LaserJock> dinda: I mentioned in my email back to him that we've still not hear on that
<LaserJock> so that's somewhat of a pressing need
<LaserJock> I don't even know how to write my release announcement currently regarding Canonical's support
<dinda> yeah, there's been no talk of formal support yet
<LaserJock> dinda: well, there was no talk of the lack of formal support
<LaserJock> that I'm aware of
<LaserJock> I've never seen a Canonical statement saying they no longer offer support for Edubuntu
<dinda> let me ask real quick
<dinda> they say "not at the moment"
<LaserJock> ... okay
<dinda> but I suspect if a large enough customer came to us, we would definitely not turn them down
<LaserJock> that makes for an interested release announcement ;-)
<dinda> I wonder if the hang up is b/c of the ltsp stuff of the additional edu apps?
<LaserJock> LTSP should be supported
<LaserJock> as it's on the Ubuntu Alternate CD as well
<dinda> ok, will definitely put that topic on the agenda
<LaserJock> my guess would be it's because they don't have a person on the "inside"
<LaserJock> i.e. how can they ensure supportability if there's nobody involved with the project
<LaserJock> I would guess that would be the issue more than the actual packages
<jsgotangco> makes sense
<dinda> jsgotangco: Hello there!  long time no see you :)
<jsgotangco> dinda: i know! But I always see your facebook updates :)
<LaserJock> in any case, I guess for karmic we just don't mention Canonical support availability and move on from there
<dinda> jsgotangco: though I do follow you on FB/twitter/etc
<jsgotangco> hehe
<LaserJock> dinda: the most important thing for me personally is that Canonical has been almost completely silent for a long long time
<dinda> http://education.zdnet.com/?p=3169
<LaserJock> dinda: I don't like the answer "Canonical's not interested" but I appreciate it a lot more than silence
<dinda> LaserJock: agreed
<LaserJock> dinda: right
<LaserJock> dinda: I don't see how Edubuntu can't be involved with this stuff
<LaserJock> but we've gotten nothing
<LaserJock> Edubuntu as a project and community is interested in Ubuntu in Education
<LaserJock> even if that doesn't mean people using the Edubuntu DVD
<LaserJock> although we want that to be a solid offering
<LaserJock> and my feeling is that we're getting side-stepped and kept out of the loop quite a bit
<dinda> LaserJock: I promise I'll do what I can
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: honestly if they are not up to it, they should just drop it altogether
<LaserJock> dinda: well, thanks a ton for your efforts
<jsgotangco> and free up whatever copyright over the name
<LaserJock> right
<LaserJock> but I want to know either way
<jsgotangco> yes
<LaserJock> where do we stand
<LaserJock> what's the game plan moving forward
<LaserJock> what are the boundaries
<jsgotangco> dinda: over here we are arranging an olpc pilot for a school to run fedora/sugar
<jsgotangco> the donor didn't like the idea of getting intel ;-)
<dinda> on a slightly related topic - has anyone been asked to do an Open Week presentation for Edubuntu?
<LaserJock> yep
<LaserJock> stgraber is doing one
<highvoltage> dinda: yes adding to what LaserJock said, I don't think we want to use "Ubuntu Educational edition", etc
<LaserJock> and hopefully some us can also stop by
<dinda> jsgotangco: ugh, yeah and I know morgan c and others in the sugar project are doing some great work to get sugar packaged for ubuntu
<highvoltage> hi jsgotangco, nice to see you around again
<highvoltage> dinda: and you of course too
<jsgotangco> yup, but I must say I'm quite impressed on the fedora 11 remix / sugar spin for a slow machine like the xo
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: hey yeah, ive been on irc but just been quiet, had a hell of a season
<dinda> RH hired Mel Chua from olpc and she's rocking over there
<jsgotangco> yup mel is there
<dinda> jsgotangco: how large is that pilot?
<jsgotangco> not too big we're starting with 50 in an integrated school and 200 in a public school
<jsgotangco> the 50 is interesting because it entails 2 grade levels
<jsgotangco> the 4th graders will be tasked to learn to build content for the 1st graders
<jsgotangco> ;-)
<dinda> Nice!
<LaserJock> I've definitely been feeling that Fedora and openSUSE are progressing much faster than we are
<LaserJock> we seem to not be as agile or innovative
<jsgotangco> its a bigger community
<dinda> OpenSUSE are making some nice progress indeed
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: wow, the 4th graders making content for grade 2's is awesome!
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: it would be an interesting exercise to say the least
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: because the theory is that a 1st grader is only a consumer
<jsgotangco> while an older kind can become a producer
<jsgotangco> more complex concepts are grasped
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: thats why its so important to have an educator in a team
<jsgotangco> to make such teaching concepts
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: when I was that age I so wanted to create content for the grades below me. I did actually and I taught my younger brother a lot of things with it
<jsgotangco> oh man it seems some northern provinces had some massive flooding again from a typhoon :/
#edubuntu 2009-10-10
<LaserJock> hmm, pretty dead around here
#edubuntu 2009-10-11
<Ahmuck> edubuntu or ltsp ready for karamic beta ?
<dgroos> Ahumck: Good evening
<Ahmuck> hi dgroos
<Ahmuck> well, is there good news ?
<dgroos> it was my birthday...
<dgroos> Oh yea :) and...
<dgroos> The fix was simple.
<Ahmuck> i assume that everybody is happy :)
<dgroos> I just had to edit a particular config file, change the eth0 to say eth1 and eth1 to say eth0.
<Ahmuck>  /etc/network/interfaces ?>
<dgroos> Ah... well... I'm just giving up on cloning another server--tried it 4 times and it keeps thinking it's working, but it stops after 1 minute into it and should take 3 hours.
<dgroos> Oh well, there's always tomorrow!
<dgroos> The file is (let me check my blog)
<dgroos> ... /etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistent-net.rules
<dgroos> totally new territory on the server to me.
<dgroos> Today I succeeded in updating CmapServer on a remote server and felt pretty great about that (took me some 6 hours or so).
<dgroos> How's your projects coming along?
<Ahmuck> frantic
<dgroos> ?
<Ahmuck> to many projects
<Ahmuck> just completed the kansas book festival
<dgroos> I've been there--not to the book festival but the too many projects--yea.  And...
<dgroos> I've gotten the marching orders! so I'll have to pick this up perhaps tomorrow.
<Ahmuck> that's alright, age slows one down
<Ahmuck> and then you get to pick and choose
<Ahmuck> :)
<dgroos> 49... and counting :)
<dgroos> G'night
<dgroos> Ahmuck:?
<Ahmuck> dgroos:
<dgroos> Good afternoon--how goes?
<Ahmuck> i'm well
<dgroos> same here
<dgroos> got the clonezilla to do it's job--got the new server cloned this AM
<dgroos> So what has you frantic?  your computer lab?
#edubuntu 2010-10-11
<jadarite> Hello
<jadarite> anyone there?
<mhall119> I am
<highvoltage> mhall119: heh, he just needed a little more patience :)
<micahg> hi stgraber
<stgraber> hi micahg
<micahg> I was wondering, if I want to introduce someone to Edubuntu, am I better giving them the Lucid version or the Maverick version?
<stgraber> Maverick
<micahg> k, thanks
<stgraber> the installer has been improved quite a bit
<micahg> great, I'm trying to get a *very* small school converted
<stgraber> Edubuntu isn't LTS anyway, so you'll have longer support with 10.10
<stgraber> though taking 10.04 will give you LTS support for all packages that are also part of Ubuntu (95% or so of Edubuntu)
<micahg> right, I'm not sure what the upgrade requirements are, probably not an issue
#edubuntu 2010-10-12
<mcsean> Hi all, our teacher just accidentally upgraded our Edubuntu server to 10.04LTS and pulled the plug half-way through the update. Long story short, I now have it to the point where I'm able to put the server and login to the server. Unfortunately, I can't get my clients to boot from the server any more. I have run "ltsp-build-client", "ltsp-update-sshkeys", "ltsp-update-image", and "ltsp-update-kernels" but am still unable to boot a client. The error
<mcsean>  I am receiving on the client is: "PXE-T02: Forbidden directory \n PXE-E3C: TFTP Error - Access violation \n PXE-M0F: Exiting Intel PXE ROM". On the server, I able to see that the client is requesting a DHCP lease and the server is responding...
<mcsean> Sorry, looks like that got truncated... let me start over:
<mcsean> Hi all, our teacher just accidentally upgraded our Edubuntu server to 10.04LTS and pulled the plug half-way through the update. Long story short, I now have it to the point where I'm able to put the server and login to the server.
<mcsean> Unfortunately, I can't get my clients to boot from the server any more. I have run "ltsp-build-client", "ltsp-update-sshkeys", "ltsp-update-image", and "ltsp-update-kernels" but am still unable to boot a client.
<mcsean> The error I am receiving on the client is: PXE-T02: Forbidden directory
<mcsean> PXE-E3C: TFTP Error - Access violation
<mcsean> PXE-M0F: Exiting Intel PXE ROM
<mcsean> On the server, I able to see that the client is requesting a DHCP lease and the server is responding...
<mcsean> with a DHCPACK, but quits after that.
<stgraber> mcsean: tftpd is probably misconfigured
<stgraber> mcsean: hang on a sec while I check something
<stgraber> mcsean: what do you have in /etc/default/tftpd-hpa ?
<mcsean> checking
<stgraber> you sould have http://paste.ubuntu.com/511258/
<stgraber> I know in some cases you get a different TFTP_DIRECTORY and that's causing the issue you describe
<mcsean> ok -- I'll update it. right now, my TFTP_DIRECTORY is set to "/srv/tftp"
<stgraber> if it's the case for you, modify it to look like what I pasted and then do: sudo restart tftpd-hpa
<stgraber> the forbidden directory error should disappear after that
<mcsean> Excellent... one other thing I noticed. While I was waiting for a response here, I chroot'ed into /opt/ltsp/i386 and found that it looks like hardy is still installed there. The client partially booted and then died and kicked me into a busybox shell.
<mcsean> When chroot'ed, "cat /etc/issue" reports "Ubuntu 8.04.2 \n \l". I believe I saw instructions for rebuilding /opt/ltsp as I was searching today. Do I need to rebuild my ltsp client image now?
<stgraber> you'd need to remove /opt/ltsp/i386, run ltsp-build-client, chroot and do your changes, run ltsp-update-image and finally ltsp-update-kernels (just in case)
<stgraber> actually moving i386 is probably a better idea, just in case ;)
<stgraber> you said before you ran ltsp-build-client, did you run it with --purge-chroot ? otherwise it wouldn't rebuild it (as /opt/ltsp/i386 already exists)
<mcsean> No -- didn't know to do that. That makes sense... thankfully Edubuntu has been quite easy to maintain so I have not needed to dig much into all of the ltsp commands...
<mcsean> I've moved the i386 to i386-orig and am ltsp-build-client'ing now. Appears to be working.
<mcsean> In the future, after running an update on the server, what's the best process for updating the client image? Is that documented for 10.04 or is it the same as it was for previous versions?
<mcsean> ...been searching regarding above question. The only thing that I can find is at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/UpdatingChroot, but it says it's specific to 8.04, 8.10, 9.04, and 9.10. Is this procedure also valid for updating the chroot within 10.04?
<stgraber> usually rebuilding is the only supported way for the chroot
<stgraber> dist-upgrading the chroot isn't really supported
<mcsean> stgraber: So, it's done now with the ltsp-build-client. Since I've just built it with the latest packages, do I need to do anything else? Based on what you've said, I shouldn't chroot into the image and do any updates there. I should just attempt to boot my client. Bingo....
<mcsean> Looks like it's working!
<mcsean> stgraber: nice -- it's working again. Thanks for your help!
<highvoltage> stgraber ftw :)
<stgraber> mcsean: you're welcome
<mcsean> One more question for tonight -- does switching to xfce make the clients more responsive?
<mick_laptop> someone might want to change the /topic to - http://www.edubuntu.org/news/10.10-release :)
<mick_laptop> is there any way to have edubuntu start w/ proprietary drivers? (the live cd)
<jadarite> Hello, anyone there?
 * highvoltage 
<highvoltage> (although getting ready to leave for office)
<jadarite> anyone willing to walk me through installation of edubuntu?
<highvoltage> jadarite: I can give you a link to some documentation that's under construction if you'd like to test it from what's there already
<highvoltage> if you get stuck, I should be back at the office in around 30-40 minutes
<jadarite> ok but I already tried sites
<jadarite> I am confused about one thing
<jadarite> at boot up
<jadarite> there are 2 areas
<jadarite> disk priority
<jadarite> and then 1st, 2nd, and 3rd device
<jadarite> do I have to edit both areas?
<jadarite> at disk priority it just hangs
<jadarite> do I have to wait a long time for it to install
<jadarite> or should it instantly show some progress meter?
<highvoltage> I guess that's the partitioning screen you're talking about? does it look almost like this but with more "areas"? http://edubuntu.org/sites/default/files/docimages/050-install-now.png
<jadarite> no
<jadarite> nothing loads
<jadarite> this is from boot of the computer
<jadarite> black screen
<jadarite> I used the universal USB install
<jadarite> program
<jadarite> I selected other at the end of the list
<jadarite> then I just reboot the computer and select correct book device, right?
<highvoltage> jadarite: yep
<highvoltage> jadarite: did you write it to usb using the usb creator tool?
<jadarite> the creator tool is in ubuntu right?
<jadarite> I used a program through windows
<jadarite> I downloaded it
<jadarite> it is something liek USB unversal installer
<jadarite> you load it, select the .iso to write to USB, and then you can check a box to format the USB
<jadarite> I tried both approaches
<jadarite> i read about installing edubuntu by installing ubuntu first.  Is this the only way?  Or can I install edubuntu directly without needing ubuntu installed first?
<jadarite> I don't know what more I can do with the USB,  I have tried every permutation I can think of.
<jadarite> I will see if the DVD approach works later
<highvoltage> jadarite: yes, you can install ubuntu first
<jadarite> but do you have to?
<highvoltage> nope, you don't have to
<jadarite> I am burning a DVD now
<highvoltage> I'm not sure about that USB disk creator program you used though.
<highvoltage> yes I guess DVD is safest bet at this stage
<jadarite> it will take a while because we didn't put the .iso on the hard drive
<jadarite> so it's burning from a USB stick
<jadarite> We think that's why it is slow
<highvoltage> we should find out how and put some documentation up on the site on how to do it from Windows some time
<jadarite> that would be great
<mick_laptop> hi everyone
<mhall119> hellp
<mick_laptop> i was thinking that it would be a cool idea to have an app that helps customized edubuntu cds
<mick_laptop> helps create*
<mhall119> customize them in what way?
<mick_laptop> for instance:
<mick_laptop> 1) include proprietary drivers by default
<mick_laptop> 2) adds other educational apps
<mick_laptop> 3) takes out the ability to install to disk
<mick_laptop> that type of a thing
<mhall119> #1 I think is already an option in the new installer
<mick_laptop> oh?
<mhall119> #2, well what other apps would you want included?
<mick_laptop> #2 i can make a list
<mhall119> mick_laptop: I think so, they added a checkbox to install proprietary stuff
<mhall119> may just be codecs
<mick_laptop> no not to install - i mean the live cd
<mhall119> Jockey usually handles proprietary drivers in an efficient way though
<mhall119> oh, have them running in the live session?
<mick_laptop> mhall119: yes
<mhall119> I think some of the proprietary video drivers are already setup that way
<mhall119> there's a session about Qimo going on now in #ubuntu-classroom
<mhall119> and #ubuntu-classroom-chat
<mick_laptop> that was very interesting
#edubuntu 2010-10-13
<jadarite> I have tried to use a USB to install ubuntu and edubuntu, but when it boots up, it just lists "Syslinux 3.86.......Peter Anvin et al"  and stalls.  I used the universal USB program as instructed.  Can someone help me try to find the solution to getting this installed?  I have been working on this for 2 days.
<jadarite> Can you use "UNetbootin" for edubuntu?  I don't see it listed, so it doesn't look like it
<jadarite> Found the problem.  I have been using an out of date version of the Universal USB Installer program.  Universal-USB-Installer-1.8.0.5.exe works
<jadarite> .3 doesn't
<clinton> Hi, can anybody tell me if there is anybody in the durban or PMB area, who has a copy of the EDUBunut DVD.  Ive been trying to download it for 4 days now and it keeps on dropping after I have downloaded about 700mbs
<highvoltage> â Edubuntu Meeting in about 30 minutes
<alkisg> â ââ
<highvoltage> pity there's no real Edubuntu logo in unicode :)
<highvoltage> â Canonical
<highvoltage> that one is easier :)
<alkisg> I've seen ubuntu written with some pretty unicode characters, maybe mathematical symbols, but I can't find it...
<mhall119> o/
<mhall119> oh wait, in 30 minutes...
 * mhall119 is busy subscribing to the edubuntu uds-n blueprints
<mhall119> heh, in 30 minutes over an hour ago, i fail
 * mhall119 reads the meeting long instead
<highvoltage> heh
<epaphus> hello all. Does edubuntu still ship with LTSP preconfigured and ready to be used?  10.04 ?
<mhall119> doesn't really matter, because you didn't stick around for an answer
<epaphus> back
<mhall119> epaphus: I'm pretty sure it still ships with LTSP
<highvoltage> epaphus: yep, it still ships with ltsp. not automatically configured though, you still have to make at least one extra click during the installation process...
<highvoltage> epaphus: http://edubuntu.org/documentation/10.10/installation-guide has more details
<epaphus> thanks
#edubuntu 2010-10-14
<CruelCoke> Ubuntu for schools?
<CruelCoke> Must be xorgless to thwart gaming
<CruelCoke> =_=
<mcsean> Has anyone discovered how to minimize, auto-hide, or decrease the icon size within the new launcher in Unity within 10.10 netbook edition?
<alkisg> Good morning
<mhall119> so, I think identifying all the games/apps that provide some kind of "lesson plan" concept, and working on some documentation on how to use those for teaching, would be a good idea
<mhall119> also, I definitely want to see Laby included in the ubuntu-edu-* packages
<sebsebseb> HI
<mhall119> hi
<mhall119> highvoltage: what's the state of moodle?
<sebsebseb> mhall119: hi
<mhall119> is that something that can be included in the default install?
<highvoltage> mhall119: debian has made great progress in the last ubuntu release cycle, but unfortunately it wasn't ready in time for maverick
<highvoltage> mhall119: we'll most likely have it soon in natty after the archives open
<mhall119> cool
<highvoltage> mhall119: and quite possibly a backport and at the very least also have it in the Edubuntu stable PPA
<mhall119> also, there were a couple of public sites collecting moodle courses, depending on licenses maybe we could package some of them up for inclusion or installation
<highvoltage> mhall119: as for having it in the default install, it would be nice in an edubuntu-server metapackage, we're having a session for that at UDS
<mhall119> is that the "school server in a box" blueprint that dinda made?
<sebsebseb> highvoltage: In South Africa....  in South Africa....  in South Africa,  for the open week  session you just did :D  ,but made me wonder where you were actsually from
<sebsebseb> highvoltage: taking a guess
<sebsebseb> Germany or something
<sebsebseb> plus you used the euro sign
<mhall119> he's Canadian now, eh?
<highvoltage> mhall119: yes
<mhall119> highvoltage: cool, I'm already subscribed to that one
<highvoltage> sebsebseb: I'm from South Africa :)
<highvoltage> living in Canada at the moment, but I'm not a Canadian :)
<sebsebseb> oh ok
<highvoltage> (or as stgraber pointed out, I'm in Quebec, which is a differents story alltogether)
<stgraber> ;)
<highvoltage> maybe I'll live in Germany next though :)
<mhall119> oh, so you're French then?
<highvoltage> mhall119: oui!
<mhall119> eh?
<sebsebseb> mhall119: the real French  are from France :D
<highvoltage> mhall119: no :)
<stgraber> he's pretending to be
<mhall119> Faux French?
<highvoltage> mhall119: yes, but don't tell the Quebeccers that ;)
<mhall119> is that like being Dutch?
<stgraber> highvoltage: too late, mgariepy is here ;)
<sebsebseb> and ubuntulog :D
<highvoltage> mhall119: well, my first langauge is Afrikaans, which is much closer to Dutch :)
<sebsebseb> who mgariepy ?
<mhall119> so you're French-Canadian-Dutch-African?
<highvoltage> sure why not.
<stgraber> sebsebseb: mgariepy is an actual quebeccer
<mgariepy> french-canadian-wannabe-Dutch-african imo
<mgariepy> i'm a french canadian.
<stgraber> (and currently sitting just next to highvoltage and I)
<highvoltage> :)
<mhall119> is that (french-canadian-wannabe)-dutch-african, or french-canadian-(wannabe-dutch-african)?
 * mhall119 is so confused
<mgariepy> it's (french-canadian-wannabe)-dutch-african, since he doesn't speak french yet.
<highvoltage> French logic is kind of weirds like that
<highvoltage> they write things backwards
<stgraber> (wannabe-french-canadian)-south-african (or -afrikaans)
<mhall119> I'm just going to think of you as Asian and be done with it
<highvoltage> it's not a web site. it's a site web
<highvoltage> they do it with everything.
<highvoltage> and don't get me and stgraber started with taps and doorhandles
<stgraber> (though, the taps and doorhandles issue seems to be quebec-specific, not french related)
<mhall119> highvoltage: you want fun, get a Brit and someone from the southern USA to talk about biscuits
<mhall119> or tea for that matter
<sebsebseb> mhall119: uh what?
<mhall119> british biscuits and USA biscuits are totally different things
<sebsebseb> uhmm USA calls them cookies
<highvoltage> american biscuits is more like rusks, right?
<sebsebseb> here now as well sometimes
<mhall119> no, cookies are sweet pasteries
<mhall119> with chocolate chips in them
<mhall119> you eat them with a glass of milk
<sebsebseb> well there are both ehre, biscuites and cookies :D
<mhall119> we have both here too
 * highvoltage attempts to get back to work and salvage some productivity from this afternoon
<sebsebseb> whats that about tea?
<mhall119> only what you call biscuites we call crackers
<mhall119> sebsebseb: tea should be served in a large glass with lots of ice, and milk is in no way involved
<sebsebseb> tea with ice?
<mhall119> yes
<mhall119> sometimes sugar
<sebsebseb> tea is meant to be hot
<mhall119> sometimes not
<sebsebseb> and it can have milk or sugar in it
<sebsebseb> I mean can have no milk at all, or  milk, and sugar can be in it
<mhall119> hot tea is only consumed when you're sick
<sebsebseb> theres also iced tea which is something else
<mhall119> and I mean really sick, not just feeling a bit sniffly
<sebsebseb> tea and cofee :)
<sebsebseb> tea or coffee
<sebsebseb> and loads of differnet types of tea there are as well
<mhall119> we have iced coffee too, but that's really a yuppie thing
<sebsebseb> yuppie thing?
<mhall119> for starbucks customers
<mhall119> people who drink over-priced coffee because it's trendy
<sebsebseb> oh
<mhall119> come to UDS, I'll expose you to all of our culinary faults
<sebsebseb> well whilst we are on about differences,  Americans are wrong,  British Engish is the correct one :D
<sebsebseb> mhall119: no I won't be going to UDS
<sebsebseb> Florida is all the way over there
<sebsebseb> and going some where else that week anyway
<mhall119> too bad, I'd have bought you a pickled pig's foot
<mhall119> if I'd have, I'd even treat you to some homemade BBQ
<sebsebseb> plus  1.  not a develoepr  2.  don't like Ubuntu that much anymore.  so yeah UDS isn't really for me
<sebsebseb> and yes I know non devs can go as well
<mhall119> non-Ubuntu people can go too
<highvoltage> 14:24 < mhall119> hot tea is only consumed when you're sick
<highvoltage> lol
<mhall119> highvoltage: that's really a matter of taste though, lots of people here still stick with coffee when they're sick
<sebsebseb> mhall119: well Ubuntu for a bit again for me, but only since I am trying out Unity on my desktop
<mhall119> I wish Unity ran better on my EeePC 701
<mhall119> highvoltage: any plans or thoughts on making an Edubuntu Netbook interface for 11.04?
<sebsebseb> it would be great if it didn't crash when opening applications, well I guess the clean install maybe help, since  I  also installed netbook packages/s  when I shoudn't have realy, so that could be to do with it
<sebsebseb> plus started with the RC last Saturday and got all the updates,  so yeah,  not done it again with final
<sebsebseb> just yet
<mhall119> something that'll work well on the Intel ClassMates
<sebsebseb> mhall119: or Edubuntu could use Gnome Shell :)
<mhall119> I'm not sure how all the Gnome-dependent stuff like Sabayon will work with Shell
<sebsebseb> remind me what Sabayon is,  other then that Gentoo based distro
<mhall119> desktop profile editor
<sebsebseb> I remember this was mentioend in open week before, I guess Edubuntu session
<mhall119> lets you customize the desktop for different users
<mhall119> menus, panels, etc
<sebsebseb> the forks/patches will be interesting to see Ubuntu develoeprs working to move over to Gnome Shell :D
<sebsebseb> however I am expecting their may be some excuse, to use the old interface with Gnome 3 under the hood
<mhall119> sebsebseb: yeah, that doesn't sound like a pleasant job
<sebsebseb> and using the old interface won't be good, when basically all the other popular distros are doing shell
<sebsebseb> mhall119: probably won't have Internet access when I am away, well I might,  but if not,  i'll  find out about UDS stuff when getting back ,one of the first things :D
<sebsebseb> mhall119: 2011 should be a rather interesting year for Desktop LInux :)
<sebsebseb> since Gnome 3
<sebsebseb> and also btrfs I guess
<mhall119> I'm not sure what's going to happen with btrfs, ext4 has gone beyond the stop-gap measure it was originally supposed to be
<sebsebseb> stop-gap measure?
<sebsebseb> yeah Ext4 was only meant to be for a bit
<sebsebseb> anyway Ext4 is pretty good really
<sebsebseb> so I was going to try out btrfs in this 10.10 install,  thinking I probably woudn't really get any advantage, since not even sure how to use the snapshots.  However since how my partitions are,  I coudn't just make a /boot and the /   in the space I had,  so went with Ext4,  not worth sorting out my partitions, more properly,  at this time, for btfs I guess, since probably woudn't really notice any advantage.  Plus in Ubuntu it woudn't be
<sebsebseb> properly stable anyway I guess and all that.
<highvoltage> mhall119: we ship with unity, it's quite horrible atm though
#edubuntu 2010-10-15
<galoisfield> does to change d mac addr frm terminal?
<galoisfield> does anyone knows how to change the mac address from terminal?
<rad4christ> Hey guys, cross posting this with #ltsp. I have a ltsp server on 10.10, and Firefox w/ flash installed as local apps. However, when I try to open it, it errors stating FF is already running.
<rad4christ> Any ideas?
#edubuntu 2010-10-16
<Balsaq> if i change my ubuntu to edubuntu...what exactly am i doing? is it just the design of the desktop environment?
<Balsaq> and i realize that i chose the grade level of the kids
<Balsaq> choose*
<LaserJock> hello Edubuntuland
<mhall119> hey, it's LaserJock
<mhall119> where have you been man?
<LaserJock> workin'
<LaserJock> been pretty busy with research
<LaserJock> mhall119: how you been?
<mhall119> good good
<mhall119> going back to school now
<mhall119> getting ready for 6 crazy months of Qimo and Edubuntu hacking
<LaserJock> mhall119: what are you studying?
<highvoltage> hey LaserJock, good to see you here again
<mhall119> LaserJock: Information Technology, a rather boring subject, but I mostly just wanted a 4-year degree
<LaserJock> mhall119: makes sense
<LaserJock> mhall119: I spent my first semester in college as an IT major
<mhall119> learning about Singularity now, the only interesting class I've got this semester
<LaserJock> but then I took General Chemistry and spent the next 11 years dealing with the consequences ;-)
<mhall119> lol
<mhall119> Chem2 kicked my butt
<mhall119> as did Calc2
<mhall119> now I'm just being bored to death by IT Ethics and IT Software Engineering
<LaserJock> highvoltage: hey there, I'm having a lazy saturday and thought I'd drop by
<LaserJock> mhall119: I have the luck/curse of generally never being bored with any class
<LaserJock> it's good for getting a degree out of the way, not so great for trying to focus
<mhall119> luck I'd say
<LaserJock> even now that I made it through the PhD I find so many other things fascinating
<LaserJock> if I could afford it I really would be a career student I think :-)
<LaserJock> learning is much more fun than doing ;-)
<mhall119> Guyver: learning is fun, doing tedious work and regurgitating lines from a book, not so fun
<LaserJock> true
<LaserJock> probably a lot depends on the teachers
<mhall119> yeah, I have one teacher I really like, and another I really hate
<mhall119> the others I'm indifferent to
<mhall119> now I have an interesting subject (Singularity), but I have to make a bunch of boring power point slides talking about it
<mhall119> best class in the world would be a group of geeks in a room with a whiteboard and an endless supply of coffee
<LaserJock> heh
<LaserJock> mhall119: so how's Qimo going?
<mhall119> very well, released version 2 back in April, planning on version 3 and integrating it with Edubuntu 11.04 at UDS
<LaserJock> cool
#edubuntu 2010-10-17
<bencrisford> highvoltage, good afternoon :)
<highvoltage> hey bencrisford, how are you doing?
<bencrisford> highvoltage, I'm doing good thanks :) its great to be back, how are things?
<highvoltage> bencrisford: doing good!
<bencrisford> highvoltage: meetings still wednesday?
<highvoltage> bencrisford: yep! still the usual time.
<bencrisford> highvoltage:  I shall be there
<highvoltage> great!
<highvoltage> good to have you back :)
<bencrisford> highvoltage:  am i right in thinking that the channel topic might need updating? :)
<bencrisford> ill brb, nvidia wants a reboot
<highvoltage> bencrisford: yes :)
* highvoltage changed the topic of #edubuntu to: Edubuntu | http://www.edubuntu.org | wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/Edubuntu | 10.10 is released!, see http://www.edubuntu.org/news/10.10-release | Help out with bugs: http://tinyurl.com/EduBugs | LTSP questions? also try #ltsp
<scythe> hi, where can I get negativelists to import in edubuntu?
* highvoltage changed the topic of #edubuntu to: Edubuntu - http://www.edubuntu.org | Try Edubuntu WebLive! http://edubuntu.org/vmmanager | wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/Edubuntu | 10.10 is released!, see http://www.edubuntu.org/news/10.10-release | Help out with bugs: http://tinyurl.com/EduBugs | LTSP questions? also try #ltsp
#edubuntu 2011-10-10
<stgraber> highvoltage: ping
<stgraber> highvoltage: can you review https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricOcelot/TechnicalOverview?
<highvoltage> stgraber: that looks pretty good
<stgraber> highvoltage: can you or mgariepy take care of the hardware install and USB install tests?
<stgraber> highvoltage: try one install from DVD for i386 and try one install from USB for amd64
<stgraber> that will give me enough code coverage to mark these two as tested
<highvoltage> ok, mgariepy isn't there today but I'll most likely go to the office a bit later and I can kick off some installs while doing other stuff
<stgraber> oh right, forgot that it's an holiday
<stgraber> I'd tell you you can use my netbook + the drive I have on my desk but it doesn't have a cdrom drive and doesn't support amd64
<stgraber> so that'd only work for i386 from USB
<highvoltage> nah it will take all day to install on that machine :)
<stgraber> yeah, that R61 is a lot faster indeed
<stgraber> especially since I turned the second core back on ;)
<salis> any here can help me with aircrack-ng problem ?
#edubuntu 2011-10-11
<TheProf> Hello everyone.  Question:  is it possible that an apt-get update && upgrade can cause the lts.conf file to be ignored?  I've got a new login screen on the thin clients, the default session option is lts.conf is being ignored, and the printers I've specified in lts.conf are not working.  Help? :)
<alkisg> "a new login screen"? meaning?
<TheProf> alkisg, means a new theme
<TheProf> I just tried specifying a different theme in lts.conf, rebuilt the image and rebooted the thin client but it didn't pick up the change.
<alkisg> TheProf: do you have tftpd-hpa as the tftp server?
<TheProf> alkisg, sorry for the delays in responding -- just a busy day at the school here.  I am not sure which version of tftp server. I will try to determine it now
<alkisg> TheProf: grep -i verbose /etc/default/tftpd-hpa
<TheProf> that actually gives no output
<TheProf> weird -- looking into the file gives me 4 lines
<alkisg> Ah sorry
<alkisg> My bad. What's the last line?
<TheProf> tftp_username, directory, address, and optins.
<alkisg> options?
<TheProf> tftp_options='--secure'
<alkisg> ok, change it to: --secure --verbose
<alkisg> Then run: sudo service tftpd-hpa restart
<alkisg> The reboot the client
<alkisg> And finally do: grep lts.conf /var/log/syslog
<alkisg> This will tell you where is the client trying to find lts.conf
<TheProf> OK I'm doing that now.
<TheProf> alkisg, OK I've rebooted the server.  The new login screen still came up.  grepping for lts.conf gives 2 lines:
<TheProf> Oct 11 10:39:39 i7-eduLTSP in.tftpd[15825]: RRQ from 192.168.0.41 filename /ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<TheProf> Oct 11 10:47:32 i7-eduLTSP in.tftpd[16710]: RRQ from 192.168.0.41 filename /ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<TheProf> That's it.
<alkisg> So it looks like it reads the correct lts.conf. Can you pastebin it?
<TheProf> alkisg, sure - the whole syslog or only those two lines?
<TheProf> Or are you talking about lts.conf?
<alkisg> lts.conf
<TheProf> !pastebin
<ubottu> For posting multi-line texts into the channel, please use http://paste.ubuntu.com | To post !screenshots use http://imagebin.org/?page=add | !pastebinit to paste directly from command line | Make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic.
<TheProf> http://paste.ubuntu.com/706149/
<alkisg> TheProf: erm, can you use pastebin instead? The paste.ubuntu.com site has an error and it doesn't allow me to download it as text
<alkisg> pastebin.com
<alkisg> I want to check it for syntax errors
<TheProf> Not a problem at all -- doing so now.
<TheProf> alkisg, http://pastebin.com/YFEGa2M2
<alkisg> syntax error in /tmp/a, line=3
<alkisg> Ah it contains windows newlines
<alkisg> TheProf: so anyway try this: /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/bin/getltscfg -a -c /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<alkisg> Do you get a syntax error?
<TheProf> doing so now
<TheProf> I edit the file with MC
<TheProf> alkisg, no syntax error, it just outputs the uncommented lines.
<alkisg> OK, so your client may be reading lts.conf after all
<alkisg> See if SCREEN_02 works, like I said in #ltsp
<TheProf> OK made the change in lts - going to reboot thin client
<TheProf> alkisg, so once rebooted the thin client has a shell on ctrl-alt-F1
<TheProf> granted I believe it always had one before.  No other difference I noticed.
<alkisg> TheProf: how about alt+ctrl+f2 ?
<TheProf> alkisg, no shell on F2
<alkisg> You put those?
<alkisg> SCREEN_02=shell
<alkisg> SCREEN_07=ldm
<alkisg> ?
<TheProf> yes right under LDM_THEME line
<alkisg> Then it doesn't look like your client is reading lts.conf, strange
<alkisg> Now try this
<TheProf> That's why I am feeling like it is ignoring it somehow.  Question: there is both /tftboot/ltsp/i386 and 64 bit?
<alkisg> Login on the client, and run: ltsp-localapps xterm
<TheProf> amd64 I meant directories.
<alkisg> Usually people only need 1 chroot
<alkisg> Not 2
<alkisg> Let's continue troubleshooting from the local xterm
<TheProf> OK.  Should I log in with the graphical prompt to run the xterm locally?
<alkisg> Yes
<TheProf> OK iu
<TheProf> OK I'll go do that now.
<TheProf> sorry I have to walk to another room to work on the thin clients.
<TheProf> alkisg, I ran the command and it opened an xterm window
<TheProf> where I was able to ls and see my files.
<alkisg> Cool. Now there run: getltscfg -a
<alkisg> And see if you get your lts.conf entries like before
<TheProf> OK so from that prompt run getltscfg -a? Do I need to sudo?
<alkisg> No
<alkisg> (and yes to the first question)
<alkisg> (no to sudo)
<TheProf> OK :)
<TheProf> alkisg, got an error that getltscfg is not installed and I need to install some sort of core utilities
<alkisg> TheProf: is that still the local xterm?
<alkisg> That you run with: ltsp-localapps xterm?
<alkisg> That's very different than plain xterm or gnome-terminal, we don't want those
<TheProf> yes that was in the ltsp-localapps xterm output window. I will go and try again to make sure.
<alkisg> In the local xterm window, you should have getltscfg installed
<alkisg> So you probably ran it in a "normal" , not "local" terminal
<TheProf> alkisg, my apologies.  I had it in the wrong terminal as you surmized
<TheProf> I got the same output as when I ran it locally on the server before.  Interestingly the first line is a commented out one "LDM_THEME="ltsp"
<alkisg> Commented out? can you paste the whole line?
<TheProf> http://pastebin.com/yShrkTmQ
<alkisg> I don't see SCREEN_02 and SCREEN_07 there
<alkisg> And yes, the comment does seem strange
<alkisg> Are you sure you still have SCREEN_02 in your server lts.conf?
<TheProf> alkisg, yes indeed it is there.
<TheProf> do I need to rebuild the image after modifications to lts.conf? I thought that wasn't needed
<alkisg> TheProf: ok, now again on the localxterm, do: cat /etc/lts.conf
<alkisg> No, you don't need to update the image
<TheProf> alkisg, ok i'll go try that now
<alkisg> In that /etc/lts.conf, do you see SCREEN_02?
<alkisg> TheProf: wait
<TheProf> ok
<alkisg> It's better to join irc from the client
<alkisg> So that you don't go back and forth
<alkisg> Here's a webpage for that:
<alkisg> http://webchat.freenode.net
<alkisg> You can join #edubuntu from there
<TheProf> ok - wasn't sure in case i needed to reboot. website is a good solution
<TheProf> going now
<TheProf_client> Hello
<alkisg> It should be easier to pastebin stuff now too :)
<TheProf_client> Indeed! OK So I'm on the client.  Typing into the localapp xterm window "cat /etc/lts.conf" gives
<TheProf_client> just pastebinning it
<TheProf_client> OK stupid question: how do I copy text out of xterm?
<alkisg> Select text in xterm
<alkisg> Go to firefox and press middle click
<TheProf_client> Fancy.
<TheProf_client> http://pastebin.com/UnqLJJ0V
<alkisg> Is this the same lts.conf that you have in your server?
<TheProf_client> alkisg: yes it is.
<alkisg> TheProf_client: so, you don't have SCREEN_02=shell
<alkisg> Please put it
<TheProf_client> wait! it's different
<TheProf_client> That's the difference.
<alkisg> TheProf_client: hmm ok, so now open a normal terminal, not a local one
<alkisg> gnome-terminal
<TheProf_client> I'm doing that right now to compare
<alkisg> And from there, do:
<alkisg> cat /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<alkisg> and
<alkisg> cat /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf
<alkisg> We're talking about 3 different lts.conf
<alkisg> The 2 above, and the 1 you just pastedbin'ed from your client
<alkisg> Which of those are the same?
<TheProf_client> http://pastebin.com/j3UFFuwu
<TheProf_client> that pastebin I just put in is the server's version of lts.conf
<TheProf_client> this previous one http://pastebin.com/UnqLJJ0V is from the thin client ltsp-localapps xterm /etc/lts.conf
<alkisg> OK, now check for the one in cat /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf
<TheProf_client> alkisg: OK checking now. The regular terminal on the server.
<TheProf_client> http://pastebin.com/NUB1z51a
<TheProf_client> that's the /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf -- mostly empty
<alkisg> TheProf_client: when you put SCREEN_02=shell in your lts.conf, did you reboot the client?
<TheProf_client> alkisg: excellent question. I do not recall. I will reboot it now.
<TheProf_client> alkisg: just rebooted a client.  No shell on F2, only F1
<alkisg> TheProf_client: again open a local xterm, and again cat /etc/lts.conf
<alkisg> And see if SCREEN_02=shell is there
<alkisg> ltsp-localapps xterm
<TheProf_client> OK trying this now
<alkisg> (on the newly booted client of course, not the one you're chatting from now)
<TheProf_client> yes :)
<TheProf_client> so I did cat /etc/lts.conf after rebooting and local xterm and yes there is a "screen_02=shell" line
<alkisg> Good, so we now that your clients do read lts.conf
<alkisg> Now, on that newly booted client again, run: getltscfg -a
<alkisg> And see if SCREEN_02 is there too
<TheProf_client> screen_02=shell is there yes
<TheProf_client> weird how that commented out line shows up also.
<alkisg> TheProf_client: and you're sure that alt+ctrl+f2 doesn't work, right?
<TheProf_client> Correct:  crtl+alt+F2 just a blank screen, same as F3 -> F6
<TheProf_client> F1 gives shell, F7 gives graphical
<alkisg> So it seems that getltscfg is having problems parsing your lts.conf
<alkisg> Can you put it somewhere without using copy/paste?
<alkisg> E.g. one way is this:
<alkisg> On your server:
<alkisg> sudo apt-get install pastebinit
<TheProf_client> I think pastebin has a command line interface
<alkisg> pastebinit /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<TheProf_client> ah there we go :)
<TheProf_client> OK
<TheProf_client> sorry just a moment -- alternate user i'm using is not a sudoer
<alkisg> su - otheruser
<TheProf_client> http://paste.ubuntu.com/706222/
<alkisg> Meh the same problem with paste.ubuntu again
<alkisg> Try: pastebinit -b pastebin.com /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<alkisg> Or: pastebinit -b http://pastebin.com /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<alkisg> (not sure if it needs the http part)
<TheProf_client> http://pastebin.com/2pR4mEhf
<alkisg> TheProf_client: indeed it's a problem in getltscfg
<alkisg> Let me pinpoint it...
<TheProf_client> OK
<alkisg> Hehe. It's silly. It has a problem because there's no newline at the end of the file.
<alkisg> TheProf_client: please file a bug report in launchpad about it, and attach your lts.conf
<alkisg> Then go to the last line and press enter so that it's fixed :D
<TheProf_client> alkisg: sweet - I feel so special!
<TheProf_client> So the enter at the end will allow the whole file to be parsed correctly?
<alkisg> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp
<alkisg> Yes, the problem is that now there's a " at the start and it causes a syntax error while evaluating it
<alkisg> If you used vi you wouldn't have the problem :D
<alkisg> (or gedit)
<alkisg> Hmmmm but, I do see SCREEN_02 here
<alkisg> While you didn't
<TheProf_client> I use the built-in MC editor.
<alkisg> Ah it was because you didn't reboot, ok
<alkisg> The mc editor didn't append a newline at the end of the file
<alkisg> And that confused getltscfg
<TheProf_client> if I put 2 enters is that a problem? :) just to make sure :)
<alkisg> Hehe sure
<TheProf_client> :) rebooting client now
<TheProf_client> Look at that! A different login screen!
<alkisg> ...after 4 hours, a single enter did the trick ;)
<TheProf_client> and when I log in it's no longer unity!
<TheProf_client> that alone is worth the 4 hours :)
 * alkisg is trying for 4 hours to get rid of unity in a standalone installation too
 * TheProf_client loves that idea
<alkisg> `gsettings set org.gnome.desktop.session session-name gnome-fallback ` unfortunately doesn't work
<TheProf_client> I'm just rebooting the client attached to the printer to see if that will start working again also.
<TheProf_client> ...and printing works.
<TheProf_client> That enter really is picky!
<alkisg> Meh. It looks like lightdm has the session hardcoded and ignores the user .dmrc and the gnome settings and everything
<alkisg> s/hardcoded/in lightdm.conf/
<TheProf_client> alkisg: Your help was invaluable.  I'm about to deploy 20 computers across several classrooms tomorrow and it would have been a major problem otherwise.
<alkisg> You're welcome
<TheProf_client> I have to get back to other school but my sincere thanks again.  Have a great day
#edubuntu 2011-10-12
<highvoltage> wow I forgot just how slow optical media is
<highvoltage> and there crashes ubiquity :/
<stgraber> highvoltage: how did it crash?
<highvoltage> it just closed after the wifi step, I'm going to run that again and see if I can get some debugging information to include in a bug report. it worked when I ran ubiquity again immediately after.
<highvoltage> stgraber: ah, it seems like mgariepy gave me a dodgy DVD, it crashed while copying files too saying it had trouble reading the disc :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: you really shouldn't trust mgariepy with iso images ;) his image was already corrupted on Friday...
<highvoltage> stgraber: yes! That's why I thought he'd learn his lesson!
<highvoltage> learned. whatever :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: learnt? :)
<mgariepy> hehe
<mgariepy> it was installing fine from a usb disk yesterday,
<mgariepy> not my fault if the blank dvd highvoltage gave me was a crappy one.
<highvoltage> hehe
<mgariepy> and if highvoltage had a real laptop (with a dvd-writer) he could have done it himself :P
<mgariepy> haha
<highvoltage> stgraber: not my fault if quebec is breaking my engrish!
<highvoltage> dvd's are so last decade.
<stgraber> heh ;)
<Braj> hi
<Braj> any 1 is there...
<jbicha> hmm, using the desktop image as starter, I got a 21% headstart on zsyncing Edubuntu
<highvoltage> brunolambert: hi
<highvoltage> oops, actually meant "Braj". but good to see you here too brunolambert :)
<brunolambert> highvoltage: hi
<highvoltage> jbicha: nice
<brunolambert> highvoltage: you "tab" didn't get Braj, as Braj is not here anymore
<highvoltage> yup
<brunolambert> stayed for a good 2 minutes.
<highvoltage> people are too impatient.
<nubae> greets LaserJock its been a long long time
<nubae> how are things going for you
<nubae> u know work and all that
<LaserJock> hi nubae
<LaserJock> not bad
<LaserJock> got a real job :-)
<nubae> yeah so late nights
<LaserJock> quite a few yes
<nubae> litle pay
<nubae> bad food
<LaserJock> but I'm actually using moodle on a daily basis now :-)
<nubae> well u should probably get pretty good pay
<LaserJock> so I guess I got to actually use something I shipped
<LaserJock> well, so-so pay anyway
<nubae> haha!
<LaserJock> nubae: how are you?
<nubae> u see its a good product?
<LaserJock> it's been pretty helpful
<nubae> worthy of being a teachers primary tool
<LaserJock> I don't use it for everything, but the grading and organization has been helpful
<nubae> ]yeah problem is one needs time to learn how to use it
<nubae> like all these things
<LaserJock> yeah
<nubae> well, strangely enough, I just happen to be setting up an Ubuntu LTSP system for a school down here
<nubae> fighting the windozen idiots
<LaserJock> unfortunately most of my time is now spent on Windows
<LaserJock> I'm hoping to set up a small research lab though, and will use Linux for that
<nubae> I walked into the place and they had some systems running ubuntu (off old ltsp), windows machines (win 7) running on 512mb ram and celeron processors
<LaserJock> yikes
<nubae> couple folks had macs
<LaserJock> I'm sorta tied to MS Office unfortunately
<nubae> and they managed to really fuck the network by putting wireless routers all over the school with their own dhcp servers
<LaserJock> hmm, that doesn't sound good
<nubae> u can imagine the mess
<nubae> yeah the first question was, why doesnt the internet or printers work (windows users, who had been dissing and blaming the ubuntu system from the start)
<LaserJock> hah
<nubae> So, not being able to holdback, I explained that perhaps a quick basic lesson in IT would benefit everyone, the IT teacher included
<nubae> actually, I sat him at the front
<LaserJock> yeah?
<nubae> Sooooo.... first, I explained the concept of thin terminals.....
<nubae> ie.... u spend money only on the server, and it, magial that it is, fixes alll computer problems, as long as certain rules are applied
<nubae> I wrote a list of things I knew they'd been doing: ripping out cables, plugging in dhcp routers randomley around the school, trying to install win7 or vista on systems not far off from 486s.... they blamed ubuntu for that one too
<nubae> anwyay long story short
<nubae> because this is surely boring u now
<LaserJock> don't worry about me, I'm just grading
<LaserJock> so I'm just bouncing back and forth
<LaserJock> :-)
<nubae> we started slow, recabling/grimping, got upgradeed LTS ltsp server feeding most terminals other  than die hard macos and win 7 ysers
<nubae> installed a much improved vmware 8 (very good product indeed) within a fat partition on server so kids could use office if they really needed too ( The IT teacher, who is actually a science teacher and never taught IT 'likes' it more... so I delicately came to a cimpromise where he could teach them 50% vmware based office... curiousn to see how the fat clients hold up
<nubae> next I want to show hiim moodle... but leaving that till last
<nubae> any suggestions on where to start?
<LaserJock> I'm not sure
<LaserJock> I like using it for grading and for a place to dump videos/power point slides, etc.
<LaserJock> I try not to over-use it
<LaserJock> there are a lot of nice things like forums and such
<LaserJock> but for now I'm keeping it simple with assignments, resources, and grades
<nubae> well the dude is a bit of a powerpoit junky... that was his main qualm between presenter and it
<nubae> so incorporating some powerpoint showing the power of moodle might be the ticket
<LaserJock> I use powerpoint for one of my classes and just put up the slides after class
<LaserJock> so students can access them anytime
<nubae> and ill show him grading.... as all teachers need that
<nubae> u mean acccess from outside the school?
<LaserJock> yeah, grading can be a little complicated, but once you get it it's really nice
<LaserJock> I suppose they could yeah
<LaserJock> most students are on-campus so I'm not sure if it's just within the campus network or if they can access them outside
<LaserJock> I think they can
<nubae> ohnI know... i used moodle for almost too many things... u know... it was like an old school intranet giving pointers to absolutely eveyrhing
<LaserJock> but in any case, they can get at them and download the .ppt
<nubae> ]think i was the only one who read it
<LaserJock> and then I link to useful Youtube videos, etc.
<nubae> yep... unfortunately, got to get with twitter, identica, etc... oh... if u are in windows and need a fully featured comms agent check digsby
<LaserJock> yeah? I've heard of it but haven't looked at it at all
<nubae> it connect to basicaly all apis
<nubae> its pretty neat
<nubae> I've now stuck to using win 7 on the right. linux on the left in fullscreen vmware
<nubae> works ok
<nubae> best of both worlds.... jsut want some 24 inch monitos
<LaserJock> right now I've got Win 7 on the left and Ubuntu 11.10 in virtualbox on the right  ;-)
<nubae> worst problem is moving files from one system to the other which should NOT be an issue... but samba refuses to play nice
<nubae> ah.. I've got pinguyOS
<LaserJock> ah, I use dropbox for that kind of thing
<nubae> check it out if u get a chance
<nubae> its an awsome OS
<LaserJock> yeah, what's it based on?
<nubae> well, I'm using google tools for it
<nubae> a variety, but mostly ubuntu
<nubae> but its the original touches they gave it
<nubae> self coded system monitor that really kicks ass
<nubae> a properly working conky, on as many sides or top and bottom as u like
<LaserJock> interesting
<nubae> its really ahead of its time
<nubae> ull see when u check it out... the channel is really friendly too and the guys are waty modest... some of them have been involved in major projects
<nubae> waty = way
<LaserJock> I've been looking at Linux Mint Debian Edition, I quite like it
<nubae> ok... I get back to my server... have to install an online ubuntu upgrade from lucid to maverick
<nubae> i can see it giving me probs alkready
<nubae> yeah mint is really cool... but check pinguyos.... that on another level my friend
<LaserJock> k
<highvoltage> omg it's LaserJock
<highvoltage> LaserJock: hi, how are you?
<LaserJock> highvoltage: good, good
<LaserJock> am finally a uni professor
<LaserJock> which means I get to do what I set out to do, but also not a lot of times for fun things
<jbicha> LaserJock: congratulations, that's good news!
<LaserJock> I thought so ;-)
<highvoltage> LaserJock: congratulations! you deserve it.
<LaserJock> well, it took 12 years
<LaserJock> I'm just glad I actually made it
<highvoltage> stgraber: fwiw I can't reproduce my problems from this morning on the current image \o/
<LaserJock> how's the release coming together?
<highvoltage> there were some last-minute problems (aren't there always?) but it's coming together really well.
<highvoltage> stgraber did some good planning so by tomorrow everything will be ready and we can just flip some switches
<LaserJock> awesome
<LaserJock> are many Edubuntu people going to be able to go to UDS?
<highvoltage> we had to drop pessulus, nanny and sabayon because they don't work with all the new gnome stuff anymore
<highvoltage> but other than that this has been an ok release.
<LaserJock> it's too bad, but it makes sense
<LaserJock> it was kind of hard to keep up with sabayon just with normal GNOME 2 releases
<highvoltage> yeah, it's a pity, because I felt with the last release that we got to the point where edubuntu's administration stuff was kind of getting somewhere and we could start focussing on some bigger stuff, like actually work on making edubuntu a great education delivery tool
<highvoltage> but now we have to go back to the drawing board a bit with the admin stuff
<LaserJock> that is really a hard part of open-source in general and 6-month release cycles specifically
<highvoltage> yes, the 6 month release cycle doesn't work.
<highvoltage> at all.
<LaserJock> so much can change underneath you that you end up chasing your tail all the time
<alkisg> "where edubuntu's administration stuff was kind of getting somewhere" ==> the new italc-like tool that also allows for applying settings is getting in a good shape, and it's much more easy to maintain with newer gnome releases or even different DEs
<alkisg> I wonder if we could put it to edubuntu for 12.04
<alkisg> It's i18n (currently english, italian, greek) and it works both with ltsp and non-ltsp installations
<alkisg> We'll publish it in a ppa in a week or so, and it'll be rapidly developed more until april
<nubae> y'all I need a kind of life or death decision to make
<highvoltage> alkisg: we're likely to be ultra-conservative for 12.04, but I'm open to it
<nubae> sorry to but in
<alkisg> Well, people are reporting that italc is crashing at more than 50% of the labs now
<alkisg> I haven't heard epoptes crash yet
<alkisg> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~epoptes/epoptes/trunk/changes
<highvoltage> nubae: no problem, go ahead
<nubae> do continue talking
<alkisg> Epoptes is the i18n version of the older sch-scripts app
<nubae> well... I neeed to select a web amanagement systemn (ie, cpanel, plesk, ispconfig,etc)
<alkisg> highvoltage: how would we put it to universe? if a couple of devs here think it's worth it, that's all?
<nubae> u know these?
<highvoltage> alkisg: yep, as long as the licensing is sound, it can go in. I'd be happy to review it and sponsor it if you'd like
<highvoltage> nubae: I'm someone familiar with them
<highvoltage> nubae: I don't really like any of them much, but if I had to choose I'd go with cpanel
<alkisg> highvoltage: I'd love to. I'll display a quick demo to all of you at the BTS if you want, and if you think it's worthy, you can sponsor it
<alkisg> (gpl3)
<highvoltage> alkisg: yes, that would be awesome
<nubae> I really dont know which would bea  good selection.... its avirtual dedicated server]
<highvoltage> alkisg: well, I think it's a good idea to at least get it into the archive for 12.04, once a few users are using it, it makes a bigger case for its default inclusion
<alkisg> highvoltage: of course, I wouldn't ask for default inclusion, users won't know it so it won't even be translated yet to many languages
<alkisg> (using launchpad for translations, but still...)
<highvoltage> nubae: I have shared hosting that I sell, and I use cpanel, it's easy to learn and a lot of people are used to it already.
<nubae> so hgave complete control, am currenty upgradig from lucid to maverick
<nubae> ok... not tooo many people on this channel, I always used ispconfig for selling hosting and packages
<nubae> ]but indeeed, from what ive read cpanel looks quite fine
<LaserJock> I've only used cpanel
<LaserJock> I liked it fine
<highvoltage> it's horrible for a typical linux guy who just wants a shell
<highvoltage> but for 'normal' users who just want to click around it does a good job.
<LaserJock> for sure
<highvoltage> and for the type of stuff you used shared hosting for usually you wouldn't need much command line anyway
<nubae> just want to make it ckllear thtat its not a conglomorate...thus server,,,, its just me and various freiends, family members, their family mmbers]
<nubae> cpanel will fit is#?>
<highvoltage> nubae: ah, then cpanel might be overkill
<highvoltage> I think cpanel is quite expensive too
<nubae> that was my fear
<highvoltage> nubae: why not use something like lxc or vz and give everyone their own container?
<nubae> no no... no vz
<highvoltage> heh, ok
<mgariepy> nubae, why no vz ?
<mgariepy> out of curiosity
<nubae> u know people these days want to more or less touch what they paid for
<nubae> in terms of cpanel.... can I grijfd down the opions
<highvoltage> nubae: I'm having a hard time understanding you :)
<nubae> ok.... back to point 1....
<nubae> need a user friendly control panel for my clients (man of whom are family related) but not all.... in fact, I want to move away from that
<nubae> man +many
<nubae> man = many
<nubae> uk keyboard and havent set it in win 7
<highvoltage> nubae: why not get something like a hostgatore reseller account? they're cheap and you can make many individual accounts for your friends and family
<highvoltage> *hostgator
<nubae> hostgater would that be a monhtly fee?
<highvoltage> nubae: personally I think you're setting yourself up for pain and suffering if you're going to do something completely custom for family members and friends who are probably not paying you
<highvoltage> nubae: sure, but it's something like $25 a month
<nubae> no wait....
<nubae> I wont do anything custom for family... they understand that these things arent cheap and just want to have a system they can use that wont break  on them
<nubae> from my site, if i can teach it, im happy]
<nubae> an if they can more oir less get their email, perhaps an ocassional user list, u k know
<nubae> that would be success
<alkisg> highvoltage: a packaging/policy question, if you will... epoptes uses reverse connections, i.e. the clients connect to the server and offer it a remote shell so that the server can execute commands on the clients.
<alkisg> The server will publish itself with avahi, and non-ltsp clients will autodetect it during postinst and ask the user if he wants to trust the server permanately.
<alkisg> The client will store the server public key, and on boot, it will ask the server to sign something to verify it's the same server that was selected during the installation.
<alkisg> So, my question is, where do we store the server dns name (or ip) and its public key? In /var or in /etc?
<highvoltage> alkisg: well, things that a user/administrator will want to set should be in /etc. stored data should go under /var
<alkisg> So we'll just generate a non-conffile in /etc/epoptes/config, right?
<highvoltage> alkisg: but I'm not sure where the public key should be stored, personally I've stored it under /var before, might be best to confirm with -motu before I give you some bad advice :)
<alkisg> Will do, thanks :)
<alkisg> Ah, and a last question, so if epoptes manages to get into universe, when will the last import be? At the same time as debianimportfreeze?
<alkisg>  15     February 11th          LTSDebianImportFreeze  - that would give us time to get many (well tested) features in
<LaserJock> alkisg: if it's not coming through Debian I think you would have more time
<alkisg> Very nice, so we'll be able to put a lot of features there... http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/epoptes
<jbicha> if you want epoptes on the DVD, then you'll need to be stabilizing by Feature Freeze
<stgraber> alkisg: FeatureFreeze is the deadline
<stgraber> alkisg: after that you need to have a bug report approved by the release team
<alkisg> Thanks guys, featurefreeze does give us enough time to have plenty of stable features in
<alkisg> We've already been using it for more than a year in 250 schools so stability is no concern
<alkisg> Goodnight all
<highvoltage> 'night al
#edubuntu 2011-10-13
* stgraber changed the topic of #edubuntu to: Edubuntu 11.04 is out! - http://www.edubuntu.org | When asking questions, hang around for a bit, we're not always at our computers :) | Try   WebLive!   http://edubuntu.org/weblive | Help out with bugs: http://tinyurl.com/EduBugs | LTSP questions? also try #ltsp
* stgraber changed the topic of #edubuntu to: Edubuntu 11.10 is out! - http://www.edubuntu.org | When asking questions, hang around for a bit, we're not always at our computers :) | Try   WebLive!   http://edubuntu.org/weblive | Help out with bugs: http://tinyurl.com/EduBugs | LTSP questions? also try #ltsp
<highvoltage> stgraber: hmm, there seems to be a missing image on the release post on edubuntu.org
<highvoltage> stgraber: (btw thanks for posting to there and the list)
<stgraber> highvoltage: could be that one of the squids was out of date, any better now?
<highvoltage> stgraber: yeah the missing image is gone, so it's better
<highvoltage> stgraber: your ping.fm announcement said that edubuntu 11.04 has been released ;)
<stgraber> highvoltage: argh... btw, this text has been in the pad for 3 days now ;) apparently nobody noticed :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: it also failed to post on identi.ca apparently
<stgraber> highvoltage: going to post "Oops, we obviously meant that Edubuntu "11.10" is out :) http://www.edubuntu.org/news/11.10-release #edubuntu #ubuntu" on ping.fm...
<highvoltage> ok
<highvoltage> we'll have to start edubuntu council re-election planning soon
<highvoltage> current board expires in december and we should send out the call for nominations/etc a month before that at the very latest
<stgraber> can we ask the CC to bump the expiry to 2 years after this election?
<stgraber> it's not like the Edubuntu community has a lot of active members, so having two years expiry would make sense
<highvoltage> ah, I thought we already had a 2 year term this time
<highvoltage> (from december 2009 to december 2011)
<stgraber> I don't think mgariepy has been on the EC for two years
<highvoltage> ah, indeed
<highvoltage> I hope there'll be new people willing to take some responsibility
<stgraber> i don't know for you but I didn't really see anyone knew lately or anyone involved on Edubuntu for the last 6 months outside of you, mgariepy and I
<highvoltage> I don't even care whether they've been particularly active technically, as long as their willing to be active on the council
<highvoltage> personally I don't really have enough time to drive edubuntu and I'd be happy to be replaced by someone who does
<avij> is there some other place to download edubuntu than http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/11.10/release/ and the torrents?
<avij> if there are mirrors, they're very well hidden
#edubuntu 2011-10-14
<highvoltage> avij: there are some unofficial ones, but cdimage.ubuntu.com isn't officially mirrored :(
<avij> the reason I asked about the mirrors was that I was trying to download the files via bittorrent, but there was only one (1) seed and the transfer was terribly slow.
<avij> distributing the .isos with bittorrent would be fine, but having more than one initial seeder would be a good idea
<avij> the situation is relatively fine at the moment, though. there are already quite a few seeds.
<avij> if you need seeding for the next releases, feel free to contact me. I might not be on this channel all the time, but /msg will work.
#edubuntu 2011-10-15
<markit> hi, I've a problem with tuxmath. In ltsp (thin) full sreen is slow like hell. Can't find if is possible to setup a global value for it start "windowed" by default, except give a command line parameter
<markit> but for my scripts is easier add an entry in /etc/whatever than "hack" the command
<markit> any tip?
<alkisg> except give a command line parameter => so you found a command line parameter for it?
<alkisg> hehe, --fullscreen
<alkisg> It's not in the man page
<markit> -windowed
<alkisg> markit: to override programs with command line parameters of your choice, here's a method:
<alkisg> put scripts for them in /usr/share/local/bin, e.g.:
<alkisg> /usr/local/bin/tuxmath, with contents:
<alkisg> #!/bin/sh
<alkisg> exec /usr/games/tuxmath --windowed
<alkisg> That works even from the menus
<markit> (btw, never tried, I've tried F10, it makes things better, but of course not ideal with many clients)
<markit> oh, great, I'll try, thanks a lot!
 * alkisg used to hate java but now with android I've changed my mind :D
<alkisg> markit: did it work?
<markit> can't test yet, is a problem I had yesterday at school, and I'm still installing stuff in my new ltsp server
<alkisg> markit: btw, another method is to run xrandr to select a low resulution, then run it full screen, and then again xrandr to restore the original resolution ;)
<markit> other question was "isn't available something like "word art" in libo?"
<alkisg> No idea, but there's cool stuff in openclipart.org
<markit> and it's not, and i don't know how to use inkscape, and in any case seems more difficoult
<markit> openclipart is about clips
<markit> wordart is that you enter a label
<markit> and then make it fancy
<markit> with tons of effects
<markit> or something like that (don't use M$ chains)
<markit> hi dgroos!
<alkisg> Ah sorry I forgot about wordard, it's been years since I've used word
<dgroos> Howdy markit
<markit> are you also testing Epoptes?
<dgroos1> At this very moment!
<markit> 0.2.0?
<markit> "the latest the greatest" :)
<alkisg> markit: there are many online text logo creation sites though
<dgroos1> not sure, whichever one gets automatically installed--how do I tell?
<markit> if it has the "monitor student" option is the last
<markit> unfortunatly the about box is not updated
<alkisg> dpkg -l epoptes
<markit> (that option is near the "assist student"
<dgroos1> alkisg: How hard would it be to put a users full name as an icon label, instead of their username?
<alkisg> dgroos1: it's in the TODO
<dgroos1> :)
<alkisg> We'll also allow for custom display names
<dgroos1> Really is great.  I know my teachers will be happy to use it.
<alkisg> E.g. for someone that doesn't have fixed ip addresses for his ltsp clients, so they are like ltsp123, ltsp124 etc,
<alkisg> so he'll be able to "rename" them to "pc01", "pc02"
<alkisg> That will only be a display name, not a host name, but it should help in those cases
<dgroos1> I assume I start it from a fatclient using remote-apps, just like we worked up for starting sch-scripts?
<dgroos1> That will be very hand--I've still to update the lts.conf lists since all the movements/expansions in our efforts.
<alkisg> dgroos1: I've thought of a better way to do it, when we both have some time we can test it so that it's officially supported in next versions:
<alkisg> You install epoptes-client in the ltsp server, and epoptes in the chroot!
<alkisg> So it actually runs on your fat client
<alkisg> And the other clients connect there; not on the server
<alkisg> That would be configurable with lts.conf
<alkisg> So, e.g., you'd put:
<alkisg> [Default]
<alkisg> EPOPTES_SERVER=ltsp123
<alkisg> [ltsp123]
<alkisg> START_EPOPTES=True
<alkisg> So all clients would then contact ltsp123, where your fat client would be
<alkisg> One downside is that this client needs a fixed dns name or ip address
<alkisg> The good side is that you can broadcast to one class, and another teacher to broadcast to another class, from different machines (from your fat clients), not from the same (the server), doubling the frame rate
<alkisg> (those lts.conf variables are not implemented yet)
<dgroos1> Cool--easy.
<dgroos1> I'll be configuring this for the teachers this weekend and will have some feedback by next week.
<dgroos1> Time to take my son to sell wreaths... :)
<dgroos1> later.
#edubuntu 2011-10-16
<dgroos> alkisg: time to try what you mentioned yesterday, about using the epoptes directly on a fatclient and not via ltsp-remoteapps?
<alkisg> Hi dgroos, hm....
<alkisg> No - we've done some related changes, but we're not finished yet,
<dgroos> I just finished installing epoptes on the other server as well, and thought that it would be good if the 2 teachers at that school only saw their own clients--that was the purpose of this technique (as well as faster performance)?
<alkisg> and I'd like to have them finished so that I could do what you want with a couple of lines
<alkisg> (now it would need e.g. 10 lines in 3 different files)
<alkisg> No, that would be "groupping"
<alkisg> If you see the screenshot in the site, it's actually a mockup
<dgroos> There isn't a big rush from my end so that's fine.
<alkisg> The left pane doesn't exist in epoptes 0.2, it'll be there in 0.4
<alkisg> There, you'll see all the autodetected computers
<alkisg> Then, you'd right click and create a group called "dgroos_class"
<alkisg> You'd drag from the autodetected computers the computers that belong in that class, and that would be saved in your user config file
<dgroos> I see.
<alkisg> The other teacher would do the same, so you'd be seeing only your class
<alkisg> (no more filtering needed)
<dgroos> Nice!
<alkisg> You'll be able to create as many groups as you want, but "autodetected computers" will always be there
<dgroos> How many classrooms are currently using v. .2?
<alkisg> No idea, schools here will probably continue with sch-scripts until 12.04 arrives, where sch-scripts there won't have classroom monitoring anymore
<alkisg> It'll only be a set of scripts like gnome-controlc-center
<alkisg> And they don't care about i18n, and they've already set up their labs, so until then epoptes will mostly be tested by non-greek users
<dgroos> sch-scripts will contain the lab set-up and server maintenance functions for Greek schools in your program?
<alkisg> Yes
<dgroos> When you say 250 schools, is that in your district/region or is it an affiliation of like-minded schools? (could be both of course :))
<alkisg> http://goo.gl/maps/nOoQ
<alkisg> They are schools that decided to adopt "our" solution of sch-scripts/ubuntu/ltsp
<alkisg> Each school can decide by itself what it wants to use, there's no central policy for enforcing specific installations...
<alkisg> Only guidelines are given (that's what the team I'm in does, writes guides etc)
<alkisg> (less that half of the schools show up on the map, that too is voluntary)
<alkisg> *than
<dgroos> Focus is on technology--any component team working on related pedagogy?  (and any way to change that map to english labels :))
<dgroos> Nice and nice.
<alkisg> We have lots of teams that focus on pedagogy, but the technical + pedagogical teams usually don't mix up :)
 * alkisg has been in 3-4 pedagogical teams and 1 technical team so far
<alkisg> any way to change that map to english labels => no, unfortunately each school just writes its name there, it's not maintained by someone
<dgroos> Right, I was referring to the Shulman, technology-pedagogy-content knowledge perspective. http://www.tpck.org/
<dgroos> OK, I guess I just need to learn Greek.  Or brush up on my google-translate skills :)
<alkisg> Hehe in a 350h seminar I'm doing these months they mentioned tpck a couple of weeks ago
<alkisg> dgroos: you're just supposed to glance at some pins there, not read the map :)
<dgroos> I know--always diving in :)  Looking for political boundaries on the map and can guess at some names pretty well but...
<dgroos> bbl
<alkisg> bb
#edubuntu 2012-10-08
<BKZL> Hi there
<BKZL> I have installed 12.04.1 on machine I have clients that they use view sonic lcd but resolutin 1366 x 768 @ 60 Hz. how and where can I reset the resolution on client is some one have same issue
<JoseeAntonioR> hey guys! I'm organizing this OpenWeek, and wanted to know if any of you is willing to do a session about what's edubuntu, how you contribute to the team, and how can people contribute to it, all in the flavors session we'll be having
<JoseeAntonioR> you can find the schedule here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOpenWeek/quantal/Timetable
<JoseeAntonioR> slots are TBD, so if you're willing to, let me know your suggestions
<TheProf> Hello! A very happy thanksgiving to those of you celebrating today.  I have come across a strange problem with my edubuntu 12.04 installation.  Several accounts when they log in, only get a background image. No icons, no toolbars, can't left or right click.
<TheProf> actrl+alt+del brings up a dialog box allowing them to log out.
<TheProf> Entirely deleting and re-creating the account with the same username doesn't fix it!
<alkisg> Does that involve LTSP?
<TheProf> Hello - yes sorry. These are all thin clients.
<alkisg> Try asking in #ltsp, as we have factoids for quick answers there
<TheProf> alkisg: I'm not sure if it is related to the LTSP functionality per se or edubuntu
<alkisg> Go in ltsp and type: !ubuntu-2d
<TheProf> So I thought to start here. I'll head over to ltsp and ask there.
<alkisg> ...it'll tell you what to do :)
<TheProf> alkisg: thank you - I will go do that now.
<Davew_> Am using Edubuntu 12.04 and note that Menu Editor and Profile Manager do not appear to work. Can someone advise me further about it ?
#edubuntu 2012-10-09
<Davew> Hi All, I wish  to find out if there are issues with menu editor / profile manager and any known other way of controlling ltsp client choices
<Davew> Anyone Help ?
<Davew_> I raised a query about menu editor and profile manager in 12.04 not functioning. I am using the server as we speak. Can anybody else
<Davew_> confirm that these applications do not function.
<Davew_> And if so what are you doing to restrict thin client access.
<stgraber> mgariepy: ^
<Davew_> Consider the picture. I have 120 potential clients. I am using webmin to get the users onto the server, and as the students behind me can tell you
<Davew_>  we cannot use the system yet.
<Davew_> I have been using a Centos server  with Samba to allow the Xp clients to access the server. But we all know that to administer this
<Davew_> sucks. So LTSP is the way......if it works. If I should be using another Distro please tell me .....as long as it all works.
<mgariepy> Davew, what issue do you have with edubuntu-menueditor ?
<Davew_> Hi, It doesn't work.
<Davew_> I have used menu editor to create a tar.gz file. Yesterday I was able to import that menu in to profile manager. But when a person of the student group logs on no change has been made to the menu they are looking at.
<Davew_> I havetried using the system to create other tar.gz files but now I find I don't seem able to create those.
<Davew_>  I am following the instructions in the Wiki.
<Davew_>  I will try to be more explicit---
<Davew_>  ------I open menu editor
<mgariepy> which desktop are you using on ltsp ?
<Davew_> -------- I remove the ticks from items I do not wish to show
<mgariepy> gnome-fallback or unity ?
<Davew_> --------I save the menu and append .tar.gz to the filename
<Davew_> ------I open Profile manager and import the menu and assign it to a group all the users are a member of.
<Davew_> -------- I use File and Save again
<Davew_> -------I test the meu by logging in as a student on one of the clients and it makes no difference to what is displayed.
<Davew_> ---------- I shall try this again now.......
<mgariepy> Davew, which desktop are you using on ltsp ?
<mgariepy> stgraber, are the ltsp package ready to be tested ?
<mgariepy> Davew, can you please answer my question ?
<mgariepy> i want to help you but i need you to answer so i can debug what is going on with the configuration.
<stgraber> mgariepy: nope, still in the queue. The queue seems pretty backloged (40 items) mostly because of yesterday being a public holiday in canada/us
<Davew_> Hi , Desktop is Unity
<mgariepy> stgraber, can you poke me when i need to test then ?
<stgraber> mgariepy: sure
<Davew_> When you say tested I am not sure in which context you mean
<mgariepy> Davew, i was talking to stgraber not you ;)
<mgariepy> Davew, can you log into the system and pastebin me the environment you have ?
<Davew_> Apologies in advance
<Davew_> How do i do that /
<mgariepy> you log in to a thin client with a user that should get the menu applied
<mgariepy> then you open a terminal and run this : env |pastebinit
<Davew_> I am I think going to have to do this later. At the moment I have no menu as I have deleted what I had in an attempt
<Davew_> to create a new menu. I was just trying to create a new menu now. If I can do this and then env |pastebinit what should I do then
<mgariepy> Davew, poke me i want to see what's in it ;)
<Davew_> OK  leave it with me I shall do what I can
<fluitfries>  hi, default install of edubuntu on a dell latitude  d430.  wifi hardware was notedetected until 1st boot, then i approved the 3rd party drivers.  however the wifi is not showing any networks and an ifconfig tells me that the interface is called "lxcbr0" which i have never seen before...
<fluitfries> well, i need to install the gnome fallback interface, so maybe i'll try a reinstall and see if that fixes the wifi...
<Davew_> mgariepy: ^
<Davew_> I assume this is a poke ?
<mgariepy> Davew, do you have the url that pastebinit gave you ?
<Davew_> I have probably got a bit of time before you respond.....
<highvoltage> fluitfries: hey there
<highvoltage> fluitfries: lxcbr0 is set up by lxc (it's harmless)
<fluitfries> ok, so if my wifi interface is not showing after install of 3rd party drivers, any ideas?
<highvoltage> fluitfries: it might be worth while to do an lspci to see which wireless card it contains, some wireless chips have some of their own issues
<fluitfries> ok
<highvoltage> fluitfries: quite often there's a question already asked on askubuntu.com for most common wifi problems, I can strongly recommend it.
<Davew_> Just in case it is of any importance  I have been using a templates folder off my homefolder and had been able  to save menus there.
<fluitfries> hey also, can i install gmone fallback via synaptic?
<fluitfries> gnome-fallback
<highvoltage> fluitfries: yep.
<fluitfries> ty!
<highvoltage> fluitfries: you'll just have to select it from the login screen by clickong on the logo in the corner of the login box
<Davew_> I changed this location yesterday and could not seem to save it in this location.
<fluitfries> kk
<Davew_> Anyway I have gone through the proces and created a tester2.tar.gzfile.
<Davew_> I have used this to create a profile and logged in as requested. I have used env > pastebinit  and have the listing on the terminal waiting for you.
<mgariepy> env | pastebinit
<mgariepy> not > ;)
<mgariepy> the "pipe" will send the output to pastebinit that will give you an url
<mgariepy> i need to that this url.
<mgariepy> i need this url**
<Davew_> Sorry the tilde did not work on the terminal keyboard
<mgariepy> it's a pipe "|"
<Davew_> I thinl | is a tilde
<mgariepy> do you have a us keyboard?
<mgariepy> ~ < this is a tild.
<Davew_> Yes it is and yes I would have thought it was US
<mgariepy> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1269398/
<mgariepy> Davew,
<mgariepy> can you copy this line in a terminal and give me the link ?
<Davew_> Have entered line in browser
<Davew_> Anything else to do ?
<mgariepy> the line should be pasted in a terminal like gnome-terminal or xterm
<Davew_> have got xterm and put in line but on return get not found
<mgariepy> do you have pastebinit installed ?
<mgariepy> you can do this by doing : sudo apt-get install pastebinit
<Davew_> It is installed on the server
<mgariepy> did you copied the 1 before the command ?
<mgariepy> the command starts at the e of "env"
<mgariepy> Davew, i'll be back in about an hour.
<Davew_> Have located pipe and URL is http://paste.ubuntu.com/1269437/
<Davew_> Pipe on my keyboard was a shifted ~
<Davew_> I shall stay with this....apologies for delaying you
<fluitfries> is there an official way to remove unity or can i just use apt?  i want to switch to the fallback-gnome
<fluitfries> it seems to already be installed...  perhaps i misunderstood the check-box during installation.
<Davew_> Hi fluitfries I have found Unity not intuitive and you ?
<fluitfries> yes, and too slow.
<Davew_> I am a bit worried that users if using ltsp may have trouble with it. We have all been weaned on microsoft type menus I think
<mgariepy> Davew, i don't usually use unity, i use gnome-fallback on thin clients and it works quite well.
<Davew_> Hi again, yes I was going to go to gnome. Have I given you what you needed ?
<mgariepy> yeah, it seams sort-of ok i was wondering if the XDG_DATA_DIRS and XDG_CONFIG_DIRS were exported.
<mgariepy> and they are.
<Davew_> Anything for me to do ?
<Davew_> Strange thing is that I used menueditor in an earlier version and it seemed to work
<mgariepy> Davew, i guess the problem is caused by unity, can you try whit gnome-fallback ?
<Davew_> This is done by logging off and logging back in with the gnome choice ?
<mgariepy> Davew, yes
<Davew_> Ok I will do this now and return
<Davew_> O.K. Am Using Gnome - will create menu and return
<Davew_> It looks just the same to me , presumably it should be a gnome desktop as well
<highvoltage> So, for the first time in around 2 years, the edubuntu-webcontact queue is down to 0!
<Davew_> URL is http://paste.ubuntu.com/1269657
<mgariepy> Davew, it seams you are still in unity,
<Davew_> I am in the client I have just used but used logged out and then back in using gnome
<Davew_> Sorry will clarify, client is showing radar dish - server is logged in as gnome
<mgariepy> Davew, you see the gnome panel bars on top and bottom of the desktop ?
<mgariepy> Davew, http://www.edubuntu.org/screenshots
<mgariepy> does it look like gnome fallback session ?
<mgariepy> http://www.edubuntu.org/screenshots#Gnome_Fallback_Session
<mgariepy> highvoltage, congrats!
<Davew_> Client has unity bar on left hand side--------Server which I logged in as Gnome has no such bar
<Davew_> Server looks like Gnome fallback which it should be
<mgariepy> ok and is your menu applied correctly ?
<mgariepy> Davew, what modification did you try to do ?
<Davew_> On wwhich machine ?
<mgariepy> the menu modification in gnome
<Davew_> I assigned the menu  I created in menu editor, to the group students and logged in as one of those students. I logged in to the server
<Davew_>  after selecting Gnome before doing this
<Davew_> Could I suggest that you tell me what menu you would like to see and I will attempt to create it for you
<mgariepy> Davew, there is a bug in the game menus, so hiding items from accessory menu should be fine.
<Davew_> OK will be back
<Davew_> I have done what was asked- what do you want me to look for that is accessory related on the unity client sctreen
<mgariepy> is the accessory menu modified when using a gnome fallback session ?
<Davew_> Yes, I have logged in the client on a second machine and Accessory is not shown
<Davew_> This is in Gnome
<Davew_> With no session selection it defaults to Unity - which is not good. Can I make it be ONLY Gnome fall back ?
<mgariepy> add this to lts.conf: LDM_SESSION='gnome-session --session=gnome-fallback'
<Davew_> mgariepy, can I thank you. There are two Gnome options when you log in - should it always be Gnome Classic.
<mgariepy> Davew, should be gnome-classic (no effect)
<Davew_> Thank you again. I need to eat and shall go home now. I would like to do some documentation on Edubuntu LTSP, whom should I contact ?
<mgariepy> Davew, you should poke highvoltage about this.
<Davew_> will do and thank you again.
<mgariepy> Davew, you are welcome
<highvoltage> mgariepy: nice try
<highvoltage> Davew_: I think it will be best subscribing to the edubuntu-devel mailing list on http://lists.ubuntu.com
<Davew_> highvoltage, the offer is there, I would like to help
<highvoltage> Davew_: feel free to send an introduction and explain some of the work you intend to do, and thanks in advance for your work :)
<Davew_> Will comply, thank you.
<highvoltage> great!
<mgariepy> highvoltage, i knew you knew how to do it ;P
<mgariepy> highvoltage, i haven't been too close to all that recently. ;)
<highvoltage> stgraber: what's up with edubuntu-live?
<stgraber> highvoltage: translation update
<highvoltage> ah
#edubuntu 2012-10-11
<Salvo_> hi
<Salvo_> help me!
<Salvo_> I have problem
<Salvo_> Edubuntu
<Davew> mgariepy : ^  need to follow up the LDM_SESSION line you gave me when convenient
<mgariepy> Davew, LDM_SESSION='gnome-session --session=gnome-fallback'
<Davew> Hi to you thanks for coming back
<Davew> I entered the line into/var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<Davew> Is this the correct folder and file, there are three on the system
<Davew> Files that is
<salvo> hi
<mgariepy> Davew, I think it's correct
<salvo> i have problem edubuntu
<Davew> Only difference I can see is that I had a space after the second -- and before session=gnome-fallback
<mgariepy> can you retry with the correct string ?
<Davew> OK will try again - clients are dropping into text mode - will give you full details if I have to come back. Enjoy your day and ta......!
<Davew> # lts.conf, provided by Edubuntu installer # see http://edubuntu.org/documentation for more information  [default]   LDM_THEME=edubuntu   LANG=en_US.UTF-8   LANGUAGE=en_GB.UTF-8   LDM_LANGUAGE=en_GB.UTF-8 #  LDM_SESSION='gnome-session -- session=gnome-fallback'    LDM_SESSION='gnome-session --session=gnome-fallback'
<Davew> Note that earlier line was commented out and I then copied in directly the line you typed here
<Davew> With this line in the lts.conf I get a kernal panic on the thin client
<Davew> This follows the trying to load pxelinux.cfg
<Davew> It says Kernal panic -not syncing: Attempting to kill init line
<Davew> Line which follows this reads
<Davew> Pid: 1, comm:init-ltsp Not tainted 3.2.0-23 - generic #36-ubuntu
<Davew> If I remove the line from  the lts.conf file then clients log in as normal.
<Davew> Shall return
<davew_> mgariepy: ^
<davew_> Davew has returned
<davew_> Could Bug No 812328 have anything to do with the LDM_SESSION problem ?
<mgariepy> davew_, aren't you on 12.04 ?
<mgariepy> davew_, can you try replacing single quote ' by double quotes "
<mgariepy> ?
<mgariepy> try this : LDM_SESSION="gnome-session --session=gnome-fallback"
<davew_> Will do that but am reading this http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.linux.terminal-server.general/29442 is it what is my problem ?
<mgariepy> i have ltsp on 12.04 running here, i'm on a cluster install but the setting is working.
<mgariepy> davew_, this thread is for older version of ubuntu
<davew_> Hi again, yes that works here......many thanks.......am composing my letter of help.....You had a good day today
<mgariepy> davew_, you are welcome again ;) glad we made it work ;)
<davew_> It had me worried. Shall design a menu tonight and implement tomorrow.......Is there a home folder in the gnome fallback do you know ?
<davew_> Yeah Places..........I'm going home......Mant Thanks and much appreciation to all you guys for your knowledge and what you do
<davew_> Must be the pay........and I am joking.
#edubuntu 2012-10-13
<alkisg> highvoltage: about http://edubuntu.org/contact... I think that form shouldn't be used as a means to get support for installation, ltsp problems  etc etc
<alkisg> ...but it should only be there in case someone wants to contact the edubuntu developers personally
<alkisg> In other words, I think we need to put a paragraph on top of that form with links to the other means of support: wiki, IRC, ,mailing lists, forums, bug trackers, questions/answers...
<skaet> stgraber, highvoltage - have set up https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/topic-r-flavor-edubuntu to use to group blueprints of interest to the Edubuntu for R series under,  for tracking purposes.
<stgraber> skaet: thanks!
<skaet> np
#edubuntu 2012-10-14
<pleia2> so, one of the teachers traveling with me in ghana is doing some Edubuntu application to task mapping (ie - Blicken can be used for learning colors and how to use a mouse)
<pleia2> I want to share this once we finish writing it, thoughts on where it should go? a help.ubuntu.com page? or the regular wiki?
<mark29> Hi all.
<PN1> hi, i've uploaded a new media player to Ubuntu Software Center 2 day ago but my status is pending review. anyone knows why is it taking so long to show?
#edubuntu 2015-10-06
<jackkk> hello
#edubuntu 2016-10-10
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxcfs (xenial-proposed/main) [2.0.3-0ubuntu1~ubuntu16.04.1 => 2.0.4-0ubuntu1~ubuntu16.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxd (xenial-proposed/main) [2.0.4-0ubuntu1~ubuntu16.04.1 => 2.0.5-0ubuntu1~ubuntu16.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2017-10-09
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxd (artful-proposed/main) [2.18-0ubuntu3 => 2.18-0ubuntu4] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2017-10-10
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (artful-proposed/main) [17.1-17-g45d361cb-0ubuntu1 => 17.1-18-gd4f70470-0ubuntu1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (xenial-proposed/main) [0.7.9-233-ge586fe35-0ubuntu1~16.04.2 => 17.1-18-gd4f70470-0ubuntu1~16.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (zesty-proposed/main) [0.7.9-233-ge586fe35-0ubuntu1~17.04.2 => 17.1-18-gd4f70470-0ubuntu1~17.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2017-10-13
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxd (artful-proposed/main) [2.18-0ubuntu4 => 2.18-0ubuntu5] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2017-10-15
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxd (artful-proposed/main) [2.18-0ubuntu5 => 2.18-0ubuntu6] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2018-10-09
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: python-click (cosmic-proposed/main) [6.7-5 => 6.7+git20180829-1] (edubuntu, kubuntu, ubuntu-server) (sync)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (cosmic-proposed/main) [18.4-0ubuntu1 => 18.4-5-g6ee8a2c5-0ubuntu1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2018-10-10
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: open-vm-tools (bionic-proposed/main) [2:10.3.0-0ubuntu1~18.04.2 => 2:10.3.0-0ubuntu1~18.04.3] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxd (cosmic-proposed/main) [1:0.3 => 1:0.4] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2018-10-11
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: gnome-flashback (bionic-proposed/universe) [3.28.0-1ubuntu1.2 => 3.28.0-1ubuntu1.3] (edubuntu)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (cosmic-proposed/main) [18.4-5-g6ee8a2c5-0ubuntu1 => 18.4-7-g4652b196-0ubuntu1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: liferea (cosmic-proposed/universe) [1.12.4-1 => 1.12.5-2] (edubuntu) (sync)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: paramiko (cosmic-proposed/main) [2.4.1-0ubuntu2 => 2.4.1-0ubuntu3] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2018-10-12
<alkisg> Heh, this channel still exists? :D
<alkisg> OK bonus then, if anyone wants scratch2, I just made a .deb package for it (it contains adobeair so it can't go to debian/ubuntu): http://ts.sch.gr/repo/pool/main/s/scratch2/scratch2_2.456.0.4-1_all.deb
#edubuntu 2018-10-14
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: gnome-panel (cosmic-proposed/universe) [1:3.30.0-1ubuntu1 => 1:3.30.0-1ubuntu2] (desktop-extra, edubuntu, ubuntu-budgie)
#edubuntu 2019-10-08
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: golang-gopkg-lxc-go-lxc.v2 (eoan-proposed/universe) [0.0~git20181101.0aadfc3-1ubuntu1 => 0.0~git20190625.f4822c6-0ubuntu1] (edubuntu)
#edubuntu 2019-10-09
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: golang-gopkg-lxc-go-lxc.v2 (eoan-proposed/universe) [0.0~git20181101.0aadfc3-1ubuntu1 => 0.0~git20181101.0aadfc3-1ubuntu2] (edubuntu)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: open-vm-tools (eoan-proposed/main) [2:10.3.10-3build1 => 2:10.3.10-3ubuntu1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-desktop, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (eoan-proposed/main) [19.2-36-g059d049c-0ubuntu2 => 19.2-36-g059d049c-0ubuntu3] (core, edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud)
#edubuntu 2019-10-12
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: golang-gocapability-dev (eoan-proposed/universe) [0.0~git20160928.0.e7cb7fa-2ubuntu1 => 0.0+git20180916.d983527-1] (edubuntu) (sync)
