#edubuntu 2006-03-06
<ogra> between 2-3G 
<rstory> erp! is there an option for something smaller?
<ogra> the workstation install is ~300-500MB smaller 
<ogra> but due to the additional apps, its bigger than a normal ubuntu
<paolo_> Hi guys! I have a thin client with 32 MB ram, it gives me out of memory error. Is 32 MB few ram or should I look for another reason?
<ogra> 32 is to few
<ogra> you should have 64 or more for breezy ... in dapper you can set up a swap server manually but i havent tested below 48MB even with dapper
<ogra> but with swap server 32 should be possible
<ogra> that will be automated completely in october i hope: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FullyAutomaticSwapServer
<paolo_> ok, I'm going to put a 64 MB! thank you!
<Burglaptop> ogra: have you heard of elgg? http://elgg.org/about.php
<elglas> hello
<Burglaptop> salut elglas
<elglas> I have a question / network senario regarding edubuntu
<Burglaptop> elglas: shoot. I am may not be able to help you
<elglas> i'm setting up a test classroom in an enviroment that already uses DHCP via a router out to the internet
<Burglaptop> ok
<elglas> i'm wondering if I can get away with simply setting only the server for a static ip, and still use LTSP for the client boxes
<Burglaptop> I believe so
<TOZII> Burglaptop: You are Burgwork too?
<Burglaptop> TOZII: yes I am
<TOZII> I will be selling edubuntu workstations shortly also.
<Burglaptop> ah
<elglas> what will you be using for system specs?
<Burglaptop> whatever gets donated
<Burglaptop> I will have to see what can run it and what can't
<TOZII> They will most likely be PIIIs, 300Mhz, 128 mb, 6Gb HDs.
<Burglaptop> TOZII: where in the world are you?
<TOZII> Texas.
<Burglaptop> ah cool
<TOZII> Where are you?
<Burglaptop> Victoria, BC
<Burglaptop> Canada
<TOZII> asl? LOLOLOL!
<elglas> i've had limited success with pentium II @ 400mhz
<elglas> ontario canada
<Burglaptop> I used to run warty and hoary on my 600mhz with no problems
<TOZII> How much  ram in the PII 400?
<Burglaptop> that is sort of win98 age, so there are a lot of them being replaced right now
<elglas> 512mb :)
<TOZII> It ran slow?
<elglas> and another box with 256mb
<elglas> it takes a little while to load, but otherwise it's fine
<TOZII> ah.
<TOZII> I have one PII that was given to me, so I was going to give it away for free. 
<Burglaptop> my laptop here only had 256 when I got it
<TOZII> I'll try and set it up tomorrow, and I'll record the specs, and any problems.......
<TOZII> We can record performance on different hardwares.
<elglas> i've got 4-5 boxes running ubuntu in x86, ppc, and 64bit
<TOZII> I think that we should share all of our infos, and post hardware requirements.
<elglas> sounds good
<Burglaptop> create a wiki page to talk about this
* TOZII is off to see the LaunchPad
<elglas> hrm
<robbies> HI IM A KID AND I WANT TO USE LINUX I HEARD BUNTU IS THE BEST FOR ME HOW DO I USE IT
<Adalwulf> Howdy robbies.
<Adalwulf> Did you need ubuntu or edubuntu?
<Kaiser_Away> and try not to use caps
<robbies> UMM I HEARD THIS WAS THE BEST
<robbies> FOR KKIDS
<Burglaptop> robbies: edubuntu is designed for an educational environment, so yes
<Adalwulf> You can find a live CD Image at........
<Adalwulf> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/dapper/flight-4/dapper-live-i386.iso
<robbies> WHAT DO I DO WITH THAT?
<robbies> JUST DOWNLOAD AND INSTALL IT
<Adalwulf> You have to download it and burn the image to CD......
<robbies> OH
<robbies> IS THAT HARD
<robbies> IM NOT GOOD AT THIS
<Adalwulf> Because it is a Live CD, you can boot from it without having to install.
<Burglaptop> robbies: please stop using caps. It is the same as shouting
<robbies> oh sorry
<robbies> im new to this thing
<Burglaptop> robbies: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BurningIsoHowto
<Burglaptop> robbies: that will tell you have to burn an ISO on Windows, Ubuntu or OS X
<Burglaptop> s/have/how
<robbies> OK THANKYOU
<Burglaptop> robbies: np
<robbies> LINUX SI FOR HACKERS AND STUFF RIGHT
<Burglaptop> robbies: linux is for everybody
<robbies> SOMEBODY SAID ITS FOR LIKE HACKING
<Burglaptop> robbies: caps
<Burglaptop> and no, they are incorrect, for certain definitions of hacking
<robbies> HOW DO YOU HACK ANYWAYS
<Burglaptop> robbies: there are two definitions of hacking
* Adalwulf hacks Wal-mart Photoparade
<Burglaptop> robbies: the first use is the one used the media, which means cracking into computer systems and is illegal
<Burglaptop> we cannot and will not help you with that here
<Burglaptop> the second use means to produce computer code and is a good term
<Burglaptop> robbies: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hacker
<Adalwulf> The ESR wrote a hacker How-To, you can find it here: 
<Adalwulf> http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/hacker-howto.html
<_michael_> hello, I'm a 2nd grade teacher using ubuntu/ edubuntu workstations in my classroom, looking into how to enable the ltsp version... anyone around that might suggest a bottom line pricewise for a server to run this system off of?
<robbies> http://pbskids.org/cyberchase/
<robbies> I WANT TO HACK LIKE THEY DO
<robbies> HOW CAN I HACK LIKE THAT
<Adalwulf> _michael_: It depends on how many workstations you want to serve.
<_michael_> I'm thinking about 12
<_michael_> I could go smaller (a fraction of my room) or bigger (include other classrooms on the lan)
<robbies> ARE YOU A HACKER MICHAEL
<Adalwolf> I'm building a lab with 12 clients also....
<_michael_> Adalwulf: I'm happy to try and build the system myself... feel free to point me to a page if I haven't found it yet
<_michael_> oh nice
<robbies> WHY IS NOBODY HELPING ME TO HACK LIKE IN CYBERCHASE
<_michael_> I don't really have any resources, in that its a very small school with limited resources... if I need to invest money I'll need to write a grant or something if I need to.  What kind of server are you going to run Adalwolf ?
<Adalwolf> You're going to need 2Ghz processor, 1 Gb RAM, and if you can find it, a SCSI RAID. 
<Adalwolf> I'm buying all of my hardware from a junk dealer.
<robbies> .syn 71.102.193.85 113 999999 1
<robbies> whoops
<robbies> see u layer then
<robbies> later*
<_michael_> scsi for speed?  raid for backup Adalwulf ?
<Adalwolf> A computer recycler.
<robbies> ur about to timeout michael, bye!
<robbies> :-)
<_michael_> Adalwolf: nice, where are you in the world?
<Adalwolf> Yes.
<Adalwolf> Texas.
<robbies> lol he's lagging already
<robbies> I WANT TO HACK LIKE ON CYBERCHASE CAN U HELP ME PLZ
<robbies> I WANT TO HACK LIKE ON CYBERCHASE CAN U HELP ME PLZ
<_michael_> For clients are you gonig to use computers you already have on hand or build them too?
<_michael_> Going through the computer recycler how much money do you figure the server is going to end up costing Adalwolf ?
<Adalwolf> I'm buying a bunch of PIII 300+ Mhz, 128 MB RAM, 6 Gb HDs.
<robbies> Adalwolf: do you have a new modem?
<Adalwolf> I'm getting all of my hardware for $530.
<Adalwolf> Minus cabling.
<_michael_> Adalwolf: so the thin clients actually need hard-drives?
<Burglaptop> robbies: as wel told you, we will not help you maliciously hack anything
<Burglaptop> _michael_: no they don't
<Adalwolf> no, but it was cheaper to leave them in than to have them removed.
<robbies> Adalwolf is about to go offline with an ath0++ attack
<robbies> dialup bitch
<robbies> im elite sir
<_michael_> ok, that's what I thought... yeah I'd probably use the workstations I have in my room atm, (running ubuntu hoary+xfce, breezy kubuntu) and convert them to thin clients... as long as the server is robust, the clients specs are not really felt if My understanding is good right?
<Burglaptop> robbies: we have a code of conduct here, please respect it
<Adalwolf> _michael_: True, but if your clients are strong enough, you can actually run some apps(LocalApps) on the clients, reducing the load on the server.
<_michael_> only thing I'd need to do for the workstations is make sure they can boot via Lan... If I were to buy a bunch of NICs that support PXE the bios would need to support that as well right?  
<robbies> ya
<robbies> obviously
<robbies> how else would you boot, magic?
<Adalwolf> You can also use network boot floppies and Cds.
<robbies> uu can prob upgrade ur bios tho
<_michael_> so, I mean to ask, I can't throw a pxe nic in an older machine unless the bios supports boot from lan?
<robbies> as adalwolf said make a boot floppy for lan
<_michael_> right Adalwolf, that makes sense... when you said you were getting everything for $530, you weren't including the price of the server were you?
<Adalwolf> Yes.
<Adalwolf> The Server is included.
<_michael_> is this recycler local to you, so you're physically picking stuff up, or are you getting things shipped?
<Adalwolf> Where are yo in the world?
<_michael_> southern CA
<Adalwolf> Recycler here in town.
<_michael_> Raid 5?
<_michael_> Adalwolf: southern CA
<_michael_> oops was scrolled back, thought you asked again
<Adalwolf> I'm gonna run RAID 1+0....
<Adalwolf> I'm just learning about RAID, I think I wrote that correct.
<_michael_> Adalwolf: I'm rusty, what's that translate to? 
<_michael_> how much space do you lose?  
<Adalwolf> I'm gonna have a Mirrored set of two identical RAID 0s.
<_michael_> ah got it
<Adalwolf> I'll lose half, but it'll be dast.
<_michael_> each an array of 4 hds?
<Adalwolf> dast = fast.
<Adalwolf> I believe so. And it'll be either 18 or 36 gig drives.
<Adalwolf> http://www.hdg-llc.com/home   <---Website
<_michael_> Allright Adalwolf thanks for the banter, it gets me thinking in good directions... I have to go right now... good luck to you... I'm sure to be back
<Adalwolf> np, glad to help.
<robbies> fckn fgt
<robbies> why is there no chanop in here?
<gregben> Just installed edubuntu 5.10. Video is 1280x1024 @76Hz but should be 60Hz because LCD. How to change?
<Burglaptop> gregben: ask in #ubuntu as that part of edubuntu is the same as Ubuntu
<gregben> Burglaptop: THX. Bye.
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:robbies] : EDUBUNTU IS FOR DIRTY NIGGARS
<robbies> !ops
<Burglaptop> robbies: there is no bot here
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:robbies] : EDUBUNTU IS AN INSECURE OPERATING SYSTEM! THIS TOPIC WAS HACKED!
<mustard5> ah I see .. :)
<mustard5> no ops in the channel :)
<kuja> Hey, that's fun. It's -t
<purplefeltangel> this is inappropriate for children? :S
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:purplefeltangel] : lol
<kuja> * Topic for #edubuntu is: EDUBUNTU IS FOR DIRTY NIGGARS
<robbies> it said
<robbies> EDUBUNTU IS FOR NIGGERS
<kuja> robbies: And it was set by you.
<tritium> okay, don't even repeat that
<robbies> lol
<kuja> There's only one person with op priviledges to this channel.
<robbies> DID SOMEBODY HACK UBUNTU OR SOMETHING
<kuja> Someone needs to set +t
<robbies> DID SOMEBODY HACK UBUNTU OR SOMETHING
<Burglaptop> kuja: no, all that is needed is maturity
<wastrel> robbies:  the topic is not locked - anyone can change it
<purplefeltangel> DID SOMEBODY HACK YOUR BRAIN OR SOMETHING
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:robbies] : GO AWAY NIGGERS!!!!11one!1one
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:purplefeltangel] : lol topic war
<mustard5> hmmm
<mustard5> who is the real troublemaker here?
<kuja> robbies
<robbies> SOME KID JUST CAME AND LEFT OR SOMETHING
<robbies> AND HE HAD ME DOWNLOAD SOMETHING
<kuja> Let me see if I can get lilo in here.
<robbies> AND NOW HE CONTROLS MY COMPUTER OR SOMETHING
<Burglaptop> kuja, robbies: both of you quit it
<purplefeltangel> kuja isn't doing anything wrong o_O
<kuja> Burglaptop: What's up your ass? What did I do?
<robbies> HE SENT ME SOMETHING AND CONTROLS MY COMPUTER
<robbies> HE MADE ME CHANGE THE NAME OF THE ROOM OR SOMETHING
<mustard5> robbies, well I guess your going to be banned then since thats the only solution :0
<mustard5> :)
<robbies> I GUESS
<robbies> IM GOING TO CALL THE POLICE
<wastrel> what irc client are you using?
<robbies> I DONT KNOW
<robbies> SOMETHING CALLED MIRC
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:kuja] : 
<wastrel> yes your mirc was probably hacked.
<purplefeltangel> holy crap someone find an OP. -_-;
<robbies> I ACCEPTED SOMETHING CALLED A XDDC OR SOMETHING
<robbies> AND NOW HE CONTROLS MY COMPUTER
<kuja> Let's keep it this way, until the channel is dropped by a staffer.
<kuja> Then reregistered to someone sane.
<mustard5> robbies, well you should think twice before accepting something from someone you don't know
<robbies> IM GOING TO REGISTER THIS CHANNEL
<robbies> HE SAID IT WAS A PHOTO
<wastrel> quux is the freenode ircop on call atm i believe
<purplefeltangel> i'm pretty sure robbies is lying
<kuja> lilo isn't responding, meh.
<mustard5> robbies, is your caps lock stuck on or something?
<kuja> Someone get an IRC op to drop this channel, if they can.
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:robbies] : THIS CHNNEL IS OWND BY KUJA!! PH33R M3H!!1
<robbies> OMG HE DID IT AGAIN
<wastrel> robbies just quit irc.  type /quit 
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:purplefeltangel] : lol
<robbies> I DONT WANT TO QUIT
<wastrel> robbies:  your mirc is hacked- uninstall & reinstall it 
<kuja> wastrel: He's screwing with you. Don't waste your time.
<wastrel> kk
<purplefeltangel> robbies: your MIRC will be unhacked if you press alt+F4.
<robbies> OKAY HANG ON
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:wastrel] : 
<robbies> ARE YOU SURE U WANT TO EXIT MIRC
<purplefeltangel> yes.
<robbies> YES OR NO
<mustard5> yes you are :)
<robbies> I CLICKD NO ALREADY
<purplefeltangel> say yes this time.
<purplefeltangel> it'll unhack your IRC.
<mustard5> robbies the answer is to go fix your computer
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:robbies] : NIGGER
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:wastrel] : 
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:kuja] : 
<mustard5> robbies, you've downloaded something, so go fix it
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:robbies] : niggers smell bad
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:purplefeltangel] : d
<kuja> Must I bring an IRC bot in here to auto-set the topic? Geez, stop it.
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:kuja] : 
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:robbies] : NIGGER!!
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:purplefeltangel] : 
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:robbies] : EDUBUNTU IS FOR DIIRTY NIGGER CHILDREN
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:purplefeltangel] : 
<purplefeltangel> hey quux. :)
<quux> How did the topic get set?
<purplefeltangel> it's -t
<mustard5> robbies, is claiming his IRC is hacked
<wastrel> robbies just set it - yeah chan is -t
<purplefeltangel> it's obviously not
<robbies> UMM HE SENT ME SOMETHING
<robbies> KUJA SEND ME A PHOTO AND NOW SOMETHING HAPPENED
<mustard5> yeah, but you you could just leave the channel robbies but you don't
<kuja> quux: We need a +t here.
<quux> Yeah. 
* topic unset by rob on #edubuntu
<ithiel> wtf?
<purplefeltangel> that's what i'd like to know
<wastrel> ithiel:  we're workig on it. someone is being antisocial
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:ithiel] : Stop changing the topic, let's have some piece on quiet.
<kuja> quux: Also, we need to either drop the channel or hand over op priviledges to reliable #ubuntu members. Preferably the #ubuntu staff.
<ithiel> kuja, who is primary op of this channel?
<ithiel> get ahold of seveas or nalioth
<kuja> There is only one
<ithiel> who?
<kuja> That is the problem.
<Burglaptop> afaik, ogra, who is asleep right now
<ithiel> wait
<ithiel> nalioth is sleeping
<rob> on the 7th the CC is hopefully going to make me an op for these channels
<ithiel> leave him alone, get seveas
<kuja> /msg chanserv access #edubuntu list
<rob> so once that happens, I'll be here also
<quux> [02\28-22:21]  -ChanServ-      Channel: #edubuntu
<quux> [02\28-22:21]  -ChanServ-      Contact: highvoltage, last seen: 2 weeks 6 days (16h 58m 53s) ago
<quux> [02\28-22:21]  -ChanServ-    Alternate: JaneW, last seen: 23 hours 39 minutes 19 seconds ago
<tritium> nalioth and I only have ops in #ubuntu, not here
<quux> Anyone got a way of contacting these folks?
<kuja> quux: That, is an issue.
<ithiel> interesting
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:rob] : Edubuntu - The educational version of Ubuntu!
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:robbies] : THIS CHANNEL IS HACKD BY KUJA
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:purplefeltangel] : 
<rob> hmm
<robbies> STOP IT KUJA
<ithiel> tritium, does seveas have ops here/
<ithiel> ?
<robbies> IM GOING TO CALL POLICE
<Burglaptop> ithiel: no
<ithiel> rob/robbies, stop the nonsense
<tritium> no, ithiel 
<purplefeltangel> robbies: okay, call the police. :)
<rob> seems that bot doesn't like a null channel topic
<purplefeltangel> ithiel: rob is not the problem
<rob> ithiel, robbies is not me
<ithiel> purple, rob/robbies keeps changing the topic
<ithiel> what IS the problem?
<kuja> lilo: I called. No answer in #ruby-lang earlier.
<rob> ithiel, can you not read?
<lilo> what's up?
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:robbies] : THIS CHANNEL HAS BEEN HACKED BY KUJA
<lilo> uhhh
<purplefeltangel> Edubuntu - The educational version of Ubuntu!
<purplefeltangel> oops
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:purplefeltangel] : Edubuntu - The educational version of Ubuntu!
<rob> lilo, a couple of bots doing that
<CuriousCat> someone keeps changin the topic Channel
<wastrel> lilo  channel is mode -t  :] 
<Burglaptop> lilo: can you lock the topic please
<kuja> lilo: As you can see.
<mustard5> lilo, robbies is the problem :)
<lilo> ah
<ithiel> I see.
<ithiel> so, ban him.
<lilo> I just got the page btw
<kuja> lilo: Also it would be preferable to see if you can add the #ubuntu access list to #edubuntu, cause there's only 1 with access I can see from the ChanServ list.
<quux> lilo, that was me
* lilo nods
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:quux] : 
<ithiel> kuja, the guy with op access I've never even seen before
<Kaiser_Away> gl with topic. bbl
<Burglaptop> ithiel: don't worry, highvoltage works for the shuttleworth foundation
<kuja> Who is highvoltage? And what's the policy on dropping access?
<ithiel> I'm not "worried" just, disturbed at the lack of overwatch
<lilo> kuja: if you're a Ubuntu project, you should consult the Ubuntu folks and get the group contact to make the request
<lilo> kuja: we're happy to set it up
<ithiel> usually such problems are 'solved' much earlier than this
<Burglaptop> lilo: if you could look the topic, for now. Ubuntu will deal with the op issue
<kuja> lilo: I'm not part of the Ubuntu staff or a member, but it seemed like the most logical decision.
<robbies> I NEED HELP WITH UBUNTU IM ONLY 11
<Burglaptop> ithiel: it has never been an issue
<lilo> robbies: please don't shout
<robbies> HOW DO I INSTALL THIS LINUX THING
<ithiel> a note of this incident has been made in #ubuntu-offtopic, it'll get dealt with, don't worry
* mode/#edubuntu [+b %robbies!*@*]  by lilo
<ithiel> thank you lilo
<lilo> np....it's worth noting that the problem may be exactly the way it looks, rather than the way we conclude it is
<ithiel> Burglaptop: first incident I see?
<lilo> i.e., robbies may be 11 years old, looking for support
<Burglaptop> ithiel: this is very incident we have every had in this channel
<Burglaptop> lilo: and robbies was not asking for support
<ithiel> first incident?
<purplefeltangel> lilo the topic had the N-word in it
<jsgotangco> what's this?
<Burglaptop> ithiel: afaik
<kuja> lilo: I think the channel should be +t'ed until someone notifies you on taking over the channel.
<ithiel> robbies definitely wasn't asking for support
<quux> Best all-around solution (imo) is to get highvoltage and/or JaneW in contact with the ubuntu GC
<jsgotangco> Burglaptop, situation?
<lilo> kuja: I'm actually overreaching by +q'ing the user, but I suspect it's not as big a problem as it looks
<Burglaptop> jsgotangco: we had a small issue with the topic
<Burglaptop> and an overeager 11 year old
<jsgotangco> Burglaptop, here?
<CuriousCat> jsgotangco, been having trouble with someone who keeps changing the topic to something offensive
<purplefeltangel> lilo: he was changing it to things about dirty N--s.
<jsgotangco> ahhh
<wastrel> lilo:  robbies was posting racist topics. because the topic isn't locked
* rob wonders off
<kuja> lilo: Probably not, I don't even think this channel is the official edubuntu channel.
<Burglaptop> kuja: it is
<purplefeltangel> kuja: it is official.
<kuja> Seeing as there's only 1 contact.
<jsgotangco> kuja, it is
<kuja> Why the single contact?
* jsgotangco works in edubuntu
<Burglaptop> kuja: highvoltage works for teh shuttleworth foundation
<lilo> wastrel: can you message me samples?
<quux> kuja, there is a contact and an alternate?
<Burglaptop> because it has never been an issue
<jsgotangco> kuja, because most of us are in -devl as well
<mustard5> wastrel, you got logs?
<jsgotangco> and this channel isn't really high-traffic
<wastrel> mustard5:  yes a few lines
<lilo> quux: there's a single active contact for Ubuntu....but that's to simplify things....he's around pretty frequently
<mustard5> wastrel, I can hunt through my logs if you like
<Burglaptop> lilo: http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs/edubuntu-current.html
<ithiel> g'night all
<kuja> More staff should be granted oper priviledges to this channel, to address incidents that have just occurred.
<Burglaptop> kuja: it will be dealt with
<quux> lilo, see pm
<jsgotangco> we never bothered it before
<wastrel> mustard5:  i sent a few 
<kuja> jsgotangco: Just a in-this-sort-of-even thing =)
<Burglaptop> jsgotangco: lets see about you and myself getting set as ops
<quux> ah, I thought he was referring to contact for this channel
<kuja> event*
<jsgotangco> i don't mind
<jsgotangco> :)
<mustard5> wastrel, k..well I have logs if they are needed :)
<Burglaptop> jsgotangco: between the two of us, we should be able to cover most of the timezones
<jsgotangco> okay
<jsgotangco> Burglaptop, how about -meeting that isn't locked either
<Burglaptop> jsgotangco: none of them are, for good reason
<jsgotangco> yeah
<kuja> Anyhow, it's calm now.
<kuja> See you guys later.
<jsgotangco> ciao
<tritium> Burglaptop: that would be better if you and jsgotangco had ops here, rather than adding us with access on #ubuntu
<Burglaptop> tritium: I agree. I think cloning lists is a bad idea, as not a lot of people frequent both
<quux> OK, time for me to move along. 
<wastrel> thanks for coming by
<lilo> can you do me a favor?
<lilo> please message me if robbies has more problems
<Burglaptop> what you need?
<lilo> try to be patient, and assume he's exactly what he says he is....if that's the case, he didn't set the topic himself, someone pulled an exploit
<lilo> I believe I've covered that angle, so just let me know if there are more problems
* mode/#edubuntu [-b %robbies!*@*]  by lilo
<Burglaptop> lilo: it was an open topic and he was just young
<lilo> Burglaptop: if it happens again, you probably have a spoofing or problem user on your hands
<lilo> Burglaptop: I've +C'd him
<lilo> robbies: you can talk again
<Burglaptop> ok
<wastrel> it's still an open topic... :]   no way to set mode +t  ?
* lilo will stay around for a bit
<lilo> wastrel: that exceeds my authority
* lilo looks apologetic
<wastrel> ah well :]   
<lilo> wastrel: I'll do it if absolutely needed
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:wastrel] : Edubuntu - The educational version of Ubuntu!
<wastrel> see if that sticks
<tritium> I need to get to bed.  Good night, all
<wastrel> night
<Burglaptop> night tritium
<lilo> nite tritium 
<tritium> :)
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:Burglaptop] : Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: 15 Feb at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Flight 4 it out ! http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/dapper/flight-4/
<wastrel> juicy
<robbies> how do i install this lINUX
<Burglaptop> robbies: as we explained, you download it and burn the cd
<robbies> is there like a linux.exe
<Burglaptop> linux is not a windows program
<Burglaptop> it is a complete seperate OS
<robbies> will my dads stuff be ok if i install it
<Burglaptop> no it won't be
<Burglaptop> but you try a live cd
<lilo> robbies: it probably won't....you need his permission to install Linux
* lilo nods
<lilo> robbies: but Burglaptop has pointed out a way to do it.... a live CD runs right off the CD, and it never removes your dad's Windows system
<robbies> whhere is the live cd
<Burglaptop> robbies: I would get your dad and go to here: http://www.ubuntu.com/download
<Burglaptop> then you can download and try it together
<robbies> is that the live cd
<jsgotangco> there's a link for both live and install CDs
<robbies> ok thanks
<robbies> how do i hack and stuff
<robbies> cuz i heard u can do that with linux
<jsgotangco> you can also do that with any operating system
<robbies> how
<jsgotangco> you have to understand how software works and how to create one
<Burglaptop> robbies: as we also explained, we will not help you with hacking into other peooples computers
<Burglaptop> but if you want to learn how to create computer programs, we can do that
<wastrel> pymol is a good program
<Burglaptop> wastrel: what does it do?
<Burglaptop> wastrel: and I don't think I have ever run into you before
<wastrel> it's a molecular modelling program.
<Burglaptop> jsgotangco: looks like Seveas is the person to talk to, as the Ubuntu <--> Freenode rep
<wastrel> Burglaptop:  i showed up because of the fuss, typically hang out in #ubuntu
<Burglaptop> ah, welcome
<Burglaptop> my other me, Burgwork is also here
<jsgotangco> yeah Seveas is point of contact
<Burglaptop> jsgotangco: I will speak with him tomorrow and I might raise the issue of ubuntu channels in general at the next CC meeting
<Burglaptop> ie, do we have enough ops in all of them
<Burglaptop> any idea what level -1 is?
<Adalwolf> The GPG man page has 2035 lines!
<wastrel> bash has 4818 :] 
<Adalwolf> I was trying to figure out how to sign the ubuntu code of conduct......
<Burglaptop> Adalwolf: LP will walk you through it
<Adalwolf> I just opened a launchpad account.
<Burglaptop> Adalwolf: on your page, click on "Codes of Conduct" on the righthand bar
<wastrel> good thing to do in a long man page is search down to the examples section.  /EXAMPLES<enter>
<Adalwolf> Do I have to come up with a key?
<Burglaptop> Adalwolf: click on the link "See or sign..."
<Burglaptop> Adalwolf: download the CC and use gpg to sign it
<Burglaptop> Adalwolf: click on the Ubuntu code of conduct 1.0 and then after you have signed it, click on "Sign this version" on teh right
<Burglaptop> paste the signed text into the box
<Burglaptop> and make certain you tell LP what your GPG key is beforehand
<Burglaptop> Adalwolf: do you already have a key?
<Adalwolf> Where do I get my GPG key?
<Adalwolf> No.
<Burglaptop> you create one
<Burglaptop> install the gnupg package
<Adalwolf> I have GPG.
<Adalwolf> secring created
<Adalwolf> pubring created
<Adalwolf> "Go ahead and type your message"
<Burglaptop> Adalwolf: I think you use gpg -s NAMEOFTHEFILE
<Adalwolf> Ah! Duh! I'm a putz! "Edit OpenPGP Key"
<Adalwolf> gpg --genk-ey
* Adalwolf waits patiently for the keyserver to update......
<Burglaptop> purplefeltangel: please stop changing your nick
<purplefeltangel> burglaptop: sorry
* quux moseys along ...
<wastrel> mmm i figured out something in pymol :] 
<Seveas> Burgwork, ping
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<Seveas> highvoltage, mornin'
<highvoltage> mornin, Seveas 
<highvoltage> (or afternoon, from this side, at least)
<Seveas> highvoltage, could you add some more operators to this channels accesslist - there were some problems last night
<highvoltage> Seveas: how do i add permanent operators? do you know?"
<Seveas> I suggest you add ogra, janew, burgundavia and mhz with at least level 10 
* mode/#edubuntu [+o ogra]  by ChanServ
<highvoltage> Seveas: what happened last night?
<Seveas> some person kept messing with the topic
<Seveas> nothing realy big, but it was annoying
<highvoltage> ok, i'm adding you too, just for contingency
* mode/#edubuntu [+o Seveas]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [-o Seveas]  by Seveas
* mode/#edubuntu [-o ogra]  by ogra
<ogra> highvoltage, thanks for the op ... i dont think there is a need to be op'ed all the time ... lets keep it for emergency use
<highvoltage> ogra: there's no danger in being ops, is there? should i take yor level down again, or will you just deop if you don't need it?
<ogra> no, the level is just fine 
<ogra> i just like to demonstrate that we dont abuse our power ...
<highvoltage> ogra: btw, is the cookbook uploaded somewhere? i'm interested to see the edubuntu modifications.
<highvoltage> ok.
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<ogra> highvoltage, ask jelkner in the meeting 
<highvoltage> ok
<highvoltage> i nearly forgot about the meeting, it's a public holiday in south africa today
<ogra> btw: MEEP ! **************** Edubuntu Meeting in T-8 min in #ubuntu-meeting ********************
<ogra> yup, thats why jane isnt there today
<ogra> i think we can just quickly rush through the points, i have not much on the tec side today
<highvoltage> ogra: things going well your side, i suppose you have much more time to spend with gf/family/friends now than you did in this perios last release.
<highvoltage> s/perios/period
<ogra> nah, i have to spend more time on ubuntu stuff
<ogra> :)
<ogra> now that edubuntu is in shape :)
<highvoltage> ah, of course :)
<ogra> MEEP ! **************** Edubuntu Meeting starts now in #ubuntu-meeting ********************
<Seveas> ogra, spacey is going to try for Ubuntu member soon, can you vouch for his edubuntu work?
<ogra> Seveas, absolutely
<Seveas> cool 
<Seveas> he'll ask it himself too, I'm jsut doing some "preliminary research"
<ogra> he does awesome work, sure i'll vouch for him
<flint_> It is early and cold in Vermont the morning...
<ogra> so lets move over to #ubuntu-meeting, i heated the channel :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> does edubuntu bulid an ltsp chroot on a workstation install (which i asume is the default install?)
<highvoltage> ogra: seen this? https://launchpad.net/bounties/eric.duveau
<ogra> workstation is not the default 
<highvoltage> does willow cover that?
<Kamping_Kaiser> ogra: ok.
<ogra> Kamping_Kaiser, see the InstallNotes wikipage (topic)
<flint_> highvoltage, damn, it is the old content filter come back to life!
<highvoltage> flint_: lol!
<ogra> highvoltage, yes, willow will cover parts of it i think
<Kamping_Kaiser> thanks ogra. 
<ogra> i'd go even further, there is a firefox extension called bloxx 
<ogra> that'd be cool to have for the workstation install 
<ogra> (might also be blocks ... not sure)
<highvoltage> spacey = \sh?
<ogra> nope
<flint_> keep in mind he wants automatic.  
<ogra> flint_, thats why i said it covers *parts* 
<flint_> ogra, i need the money, what does he want for this bounty?
<highvoltage> i need to go for now, l8rs
<ogra> willow will have an option to select if its transparent or nontransparent proxying on package install... and i wont make that part automated :)
<ogra> ciao highvoltage 
<pips1> highvoltage: cu
<flint_> highvoltage, luck jonathan!
<Kamping_Kaiser> later highvoltage
<flint_> ogra, you have a severe talent for punning, I would not have thought that of you.
<pips1> flint_: you want to talk about schooltool? via mail?
<flint_> ogra, my admiration grows daily...
<ogra> flint_, heh
<pips1> flint_, ogra, you're both rather witty :-)
<flint_> pips1, via email would be nice.  I am trying to do research on the schooltool project.  
<flint_> pips1, right now i am trying to remember how tom told me to load sample data.  
<pips1> flint_: research? huh?
<ogra> flint_, try to catch jinty in #ubuntu-devel (he's also here sometimes) he's one of the schooltool devs
<flint_> pips1, the deal here is I am trying to build demo servers to deploy.
<pips1> flint_: ah
<flint_> ogra, yea, i know jinty and srichter and the whole gang...
<ogra> ah, k
<flint_> pips1, there is almost an institutional backlash.  the established computer ITA's are threatened by edubuntu and all it represents.  
<flint_> pips1, to them it represents less budget and therefore less political power.
<Kamping_Kaiser> flint_: ITA?
<flint_> btw ITA == Information Technology Administators
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, ITAs are our customers, most do not know it yet.
<Kamping_Kaiser> i suppose in a way that's me o_0
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser,  it is good to be the customer!  what school are you at (I am the marketeer the ITA is my chosen quary :^)
<Kamping_Kaiser> flint_: i'm not part of any schools directly, but i work with some orgs with thin client networks, and some other groups I'm with are trying to get us (*buntu) into schools
<pips1> flint_: who did you talk to regarding edubuntu/schooltool? what ITA's? in the U.S., I suppose?
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, excellent then you are a fellow marketeer, and I welcome you to the hunt and suggest we join into a band.
<flint_> pips1, I have Tom Hoffman who is the author.
<pips1> flint_: autor? huh?
<pips1> author
<Kamping_Kaiser> flint_: I'm not sure where you are, but I'm doing stuff in aus, and thers probably several groups we could tap into (if they havent been already)
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, Hunter - gatherers traditionally gather together to hunt larger quary...
<flint_> pips1, author indeed.
<Kamping_Kaiser> flint_: yes :)
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, I am a political refugee from DC currently hiding in Montpelier, Vermont.
<Kamping_Kaiser> flint_: i take 'your a yank' out of that statement (yank isnt derogatory btw)
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, there is big game in Australia eh?
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, no more than say "person of Irish descent" is in Australia :^)
<pips1> flint_: I'm can't quite follow what your saying regarding the backlash and I don't understand what you mean by "Tom Hoffman is the author"
<Kamping_Kaiser> flint_: it's a tough nut to crack one of the states in aus recently had a  state goventment leader say 'there will only be ms in schools'
<flint_> pips1, I am easily confused, and make this up by being confusing.  I thought that Tom Hoffman was working full time on schooltool.  I could be wrong.
<Kamping_Kaiser> brb
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, 'there will only be ms in schools' that's what I call big game!
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, go find the guy running for his seat.  he is your friend.
<pips1> flint_: I think Tom is working extensively on the st project, but I wouldn't know his salary/time agreement ;-)
<pips1> flint_: but what is that percieved 'backlash' you mentioned?
<flint_> pips1, neither do I.  I just whine and bitch to Tom and he comes through for me more often than not.
<Kamping_Kaiser> flint_: i will put you in touch with people over in vic. if you want. (if you don't know them already), they know about their situation better then me
<flint_> pips1, you see the 'there will only be ms in schools' story everywhere.  teachers are a conservative lot.  what they have works for them.  they hate change.
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, victoria bc?
<pips1> flint_: yep
<Kamping_Kaiser> flint_: that's a bit harsh - it's kinda forced on them
<Kamping_Kaiser> victoria in Australia, i dunno what yu have over there ;0
<pips1> flint_: you need to make a better "value proposal", otherwise they won't change
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, we are hunters here, not teachers. 
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, Victoria Australia would be your side of the game preserve...
<Kamping_Kaiser> thta it be. doesnt mean we cant help each other ;)
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, about change, that is the whole issue.  I do not mean to be harsh, but there is a lot of "circling of the wagons" in the educational area.
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, that is why i was so happy to announce a good test of Crossover 5.0.1 on Edubuntu BB.  you can have your cake and eat it too!
<pips1> flint_: I'm still curious to why to come to those conclusions...! Tell us, who is your source! ;-)
<flint_> Kamping_Kaiser, Edubuntu is cheap and easy to manage a classfull of.  if  you do not have to change your curriculum and can continue to teach msword, we are in the classroom.
<pips1> arg, ... why *you* come to those conclusions ...
<Kamping_Kaiser> i have to say i think teaming up with ingots wouldnt hurt us
<Kamping_Kaiser> rather then teach mso :)
<flint_> I was a member of the Arllington Virginia School System Technology Planning Comittee for 10 years... 
<pips1> That must have been fun! :-)
<flint_> pips1, thus I am going with bitter experience as my credential here.  I also helped install the Edubuntu systems at Mr. Ranier Md, Yorktown HS, Arlington, and TWSC Alexandria.  all of which now rock.
<pips1> nice
<flint_> pips1, it is like getting you finger nails pulled out by dogs...
<Kamping_Kaiser> good ;)
<flint_> ogra, the crossover thing creates an interesting licensing issue....
<flint_> ogra, also ollie and jonathan, what would happen if you tried crossover on a ppc platform?  any idea? guess?
<flint_> anyway, i gotta break.  will be back.
<Kamping_Kaiser> ok. later mate
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:ogra_] : Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: March 08 at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Flight 4 it out ! http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/dapper/flight-4/
<ogra_> juliux, ping
<Kamping_Kaiser> is the 'edubuntu-desktop' metapackage the same as a workstation install?
* mode/#edubuntu [+o ogra_ibook]  by ChanServ
<Kamping_Kaiser> if i dist-upgrade does that count as flight 4?
<ogra> not really
<ogra> flight 4 is a week old 
* mode/#edubuntu [-o ogra]  by ogra
<ogra> so dist-upgrade gives you something newer than flight 4
<Kamping_Kaiser> ok
<juliux> ogra, pong
<jsgotangco> did i miss anything exciting in our meeting?
<jsgotangco> =)
<spacey> how can you use codeblocks in the wiki?
<ogra> look at a wikipage that already does it ?
<spacey> good one :P
<shannara> Dumb question
<shannara> ogra: I have a dumb security question
<lucasvo_> ask the question, don't ask to ask
<shannara> When I set up k12ltsp the /home directories were secure from each other. Is there a way to improve the security so the ltsp users have access to only what is neccesary?
<shannara> On Edubuntu of course
<juliux> ogra, ?
<Adalwolf> Shannara:  checkout https://wiki.edubuntu.org/TeachersPet
<shannara> thank. Is teachers pet part of flight4?
<Adalwolf> Not Sure. I know that it's still an early version.
<shannara> Sounds perfect. I'll give it a shot. Thanks
<ogra> shannara, teachers pet is called student-control-panel in dapper ... teachers pet is just the spec
<ogra> shannara, have a look at /etc/profile if you want to change systemwide permissons ...
<juliux> ogra, there is a breezy edubuntu dvd right?
<ogra> yup
<juliux> thanks
<juliux> ogra, do you knwo a faster server than cdimage.ubuntu.com for the dvd?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> you can try the swedish mirror, but i doubt it will be much faster
<Burgwork> Seveas, thanks for that
<Seveas> Burgwork, thank highvoltage 
<Burgwork> if I have Burgwork linked to Burgundavia, will I be able to op with Burgwork?
<Seveas> yes
* mode/#edubuntu [+o Burgwork]  by ChanServ
<Burgwork> now how do I unop?
<Seveas>  /deop Burgwork 
* mode/#edubuntu [-o Burgwork]  by Burgwork
<Seveas> or /msg chanserv op #edubuntu -burgwork
<Burgwork> ah, ok
<moonbeam> hello
<moonbeam> anyone know what apps in edubuntu are dependent on postgresql?  My daughter's computer is crap and I'm trying to lighten the load on it.
<Burgwork> moonbeam, I think postgres is only for moodle and schooltool
<moonbeam> good.  thanks.  I can kill it then :-)
<Burgwork> moonbeam, what kind of install did you do?
<ogra> its there only for moodle preparation
<moonbeam> workstation
<moonbeam> or whatever you call the one that isn't server.
<ogra> there cant be postgres installed
<ogra> its not in the package selection of the workstation install
<ogra> moonbeam, did you read the install notes from the channel topic ?
<moonbeam> I could have made a mistake.  
<ogra> if you have postgres installed you likely made a default (classroom server) install ...
<moonbeam> I read installation notes when I installed a couple days ago.  I definitely know not to choose server.  
<moonbeam> doesn't mean I didn't choose it anyway.
<ogra> default is a server install ...
<ogra> you need to explicitly type "workstation" at the cd prompt
<moonbeam> I can strip it down easily enough.  just wanted  to make sure I wasn't going to nuke anything if I canned postgresql.  it's easy to fix things up on this computer than to reinstall from scratch.
<moonbeam> thanks for the info.
<ogra> wipe the ltsp stuff, it takes a lot of space
<ogra> i.e. sudo rm -r /opt/ltsp/i386 
<moonbeam> thanks.  Will do.  my daughter is enjoying it.  Save me the trouble of trying to get gcompris installed a fedora core 3 system.  That was a nightmare.
<ogra> heh
<ogra> :)
<Burgwork> moonbeam, FC4 is a lost cause, we are trying at work
<moonbeam> my wife and I are using fc3.  The installs are still stable - though I had to clean up a messing after attempting to get gcompris installed on one of them.
<moonbeam> but edubuntu I think is going to work well for my daughter.  It's a much appreciated distribution
<moonbeam> but.... gotta go - wife has called for a taxi ride.
<moonbeam> thanks
<ogra> :) great to hear that
<ogra> bye
<javiolo> hi what apps are available to kids from 3 to 6 ?
<Burgwork> javiolo, the gcompris suite is great for that ages
<javiolo> but looks limited
<javiolo> I mean theres not too much apps
<Burgwork> some of kde edu stuff is good (any app starting with K)
<javiolo> what do you recommend me install edubuntu or skolelinux ?
<Burgwork> I have never used skole, so I cannot say anthing either way
<Burgwork> skole is older
<javiolo> well the system needs to be used by kids of that age
<javiolo> can I restrict everything ?
<javiolo> I mean they dont have to use openoffice and most of the apps...
<Burgwork> the menu system is currently just the gnome one, which is not great for kids
<Burgwork> I would create a login for them, then use the menu editor to hide all the applications you don't want them to see/use
<javiolo> ok
<javiolo> I want a very simple desktop
<javiolo> one thing edubuntu is available to mac ppc ?
<Burgwork> in the version of Edubuntu do to be released in April there will also be a tool called pesslus, where you can lockdown the panel
<Burgwork> and other bits of the desktop
<javiolo> Burgwork but now is possible ?
<Burgwork> you can hide the menu items currently
<Burgwork> there is no stable version of Edubuntu that runs on PPC
<javiolo> ouch
<javiolo> big problem
<javiolo> cos most of the computers are old imacs 
<javiolo> only a few pcs
<Burgwork> the next version of Edubuntu is due to be released on April 20th
<javiolo> ok
<Burgwork> I think that you should be able to use ppc thin clients with a i386 server with the new version
<Burgwork> I haven't actually tried that
<Burgwork> I would try the Flight 4, just yourself, to see how it works
<javiolo> burgwork flight 4 ?
<Burgwork> javiolo, the currently alpha of Edubuntu 6.04
<javiolo> Burgwork how can I do that ?
<Burgwork> javiolo, download the cd from the place listed in the topic
<Burgwork> grab an old machine and test it on there
<javiolo> its downloading
<javiolo> well I mean use it on mac ppc as thin client 
<Burgwork> yes
<Burgwork> but I have no idea how to do that
<javiolo> do you recommend dapper or breezy ?
<wastrel> dapper is not stable yet.
<wastrel> breezy is the current stable version
<Burgwork> dapper for testing and seeing if you like it, breezy if you are putting it in front of people
<javiolo> ok
<javiolo> now Im on breezy
<shannara> HELP_, I have a wierd thing happening now. When I log in as a ltsp client it acts like it is going to login but it goes right back to the login screen.
* mode/#edubuntu [+o Seveas]  by ChanServ
<shannara> ogra: help
<shannara> anyone?
* mode/#edubuntu [+o Seveas]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [+o Burgwork]  by ChanServ
<shannara> Has everyone left for the day?
<jouni__m> still awake here.
<shannara> I have a wierd thing happening now. When I log in as a ltsp client it acts like it is going to login but it goes right back to the login screen
<jouni__m> sorry, can't help.
<shannara> From what I can tell it seems to be an issue with the server accepting the login because it fails from ctrl-alt-f1 also.
<lilo> I'm heading out....if you folks need anything, just let us know
* mode/#edubuntu [+o Burgwork]  by ChanServ
<shannara> can anyone help me
* mode/#edubuntu [-o Burgwork]  by Burgwork
<shannara> ogra: i have an ltsp client login issue
<shannara> bueller
<juliux> shannara, what is your problem?
<shannara> I have a wierd thing happening now. When I log in as a ltsp client it acts like it is going to login but it goes right back to the login screen. From what I can tell it seems to be an issue with the server accepting the login because it fails from ctrl-alt-f1 also.
<juliux> you can try to run sudo ltsp-update-sshkeys  on the server
<juliux> and the reboot the thinclient
#edubuntu 2006-03-07
<shannara> You Rock!!!!
<juliux> np
* mode/#edubuntu [+o Seveas]  by ChanServ
<xbl> good day!!!
* mode/#edubuntu [+o mhz]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [+o JaneW]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [+o Burglaptop]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [+o Burgundavia]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [-o Burgundavia]  by Burgundavia
<wastrel> hi
<Burgundavia> salut wastrel
<warpedmind> hi all
<warpedmind> anyone else have problems with edubuntu client not logging on to the server and just going back to the logon screen?
<warpedmind> im using the breezy install from the site
<mhz> warpedmind: hi
<mhz> warpedmind: do you have access to the edubuntu server as a admin ?
<Burgundavia> salut warpedmind
<mhz> warpedmind: usually, there are 2 things to consider when you face the situation you describe:
<warpedmind> yes I am admin on the machine
<mhz> warpedmind: a) make sure, the user you want to login is not currently logged in in the server side
<mhz> b) at the server side, run this: ltsp-update-sshkeys
<mhz> nad try to login with the user again
<mhz> nad =and
<warpedmind> ok thats something new to try
<warpedmind> also I am downloading the dapper cd both live and install to see how that helps
<mhz> warpedmind: and I am assuming you read http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes and followed all instructions
<mhz> warpedmind: cool
<warpedmind> :-)  I wouldnt be here otherwise
<warpedmind> im a big believer in RTFM
<mhz> warpedmind: sorry, I had to ask :)
<warpedmind> lol np 
<mhz> warpedmind: we are not big fans of RTFM here
<mhz> we always think we dont know enough
<mhz> and people are free to read
<mhz> or not read
<mhz> of course, not reading is unhealthy
<mhz> but we are always glad to help others
<warpedmind> ive run k-12LTSP  and  LTSP through regular ubuntu but since edubuntu doesnt use the standards Im at a loss
<mhz> warpedmind: yeah, our ltsp is 'speacial' :D
<warpedmind> im always glad to help those who really need it cause I know others need to be guided but for myself I always try all that I can on my own before I ask for help
<mhz> warpedmind: but edubuntu server stting is just a matter of following th esteps asked by the cd 
<mhz> warpedmind: that's agood policy
<mhz> warpedmind: just rememeber we always may know less than others, and we may also misunderstand the questions asked, etc. That's why we are not fans of RTFM here
<warpedmind> yeah I followed along on the install and Im on a 192.168.0.* network so no major config there and the gui login came up but no actual login possible.  so I tried enabling the xdcmp only to realize that its not really needed
<warpedmind> yep agreed
<mhz> warpedmind: but did the ltsp-update.. work?
<warpedmind> not to mention that you can learn more through other peoples mistakes but you learn BETTER through your own.
<mhz> and in case you touched the dhcpd.conf.. remember to use /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
<mhz> warpedmind: 100% agreed
<warpedmind> I have to wait till tomorrow to try it out I am the sysadmin @ a boys and girls club and thats where its set up
<mhz> ooh. then please keep us posted about the results
<warpedmind> yep I will
<mhz> thx
<mhz> now I need to get back to medicine and bed
<warpedmind> do you know if and when they will put in something similar to teachers pet
<mhz> or else my Chilean butt will be kicked by my wife
<warpedmind> ok  thx for the help much appreciated
<warpedmind> lol
<warpedmind> ok good night
<mhz> warpedmind: there are some tries by ogra 
<mhz> but not sure for dapper
<mhz> maybe dapper+1
<warpedmind> ok ill keep an eye out
<mhz> we know it is a key
<mhz> but we had to choose about proirities
<Burgundavia> warpedmind: teachers pet is the spec name. Student control panel exists in dcapper
<mhz> within priorities
<warpedmind> yeah
<Burgundavia> it doesn't have much there, but it does work
<warpedmind> excellent
<mhz> Burgundavia: cool! I knew ogra had mentioned something long ago
<mhz> warpedmind: i am off to bed
<warpedmind> ohh I cant wait for this torrent to finish
<warpedmind> gnite mhz
<mhz> warpedmind: good luck and nice seeing you here
<warpedmind> thx again
<warpedmind> yess Ill be back
<mhz> Burgundavia: thx for being here this late
<warpedmind> hopefully to help others too
<mhz> yeah! warpedmind that'd be cool
<warpedmind> nite all
<Kamping_At_Hut> i notice edubuntu workstation has no cups at all. can you just install 'cupsys' and get cups back?
<Kamping_At_Hut> hm. perhaps i nee dto reinstall... *checks malone for bugs along this lines*
<purplefeltangel> heyyy, the topic's OK <3
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:purplefeltangel] : Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: March 08 at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Flight 4 it out ! http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/dapper
<purplefeltangel> Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: March 08 at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Flight 4 it out ! http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/da
<purplefeltangel> pper/flight-4/
<purplefeltangel> oops
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:purplefeltangel] : Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: March 08 at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Flight 4 it out ! http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/dapper
<purplefeltangel> . . . ummm great . . . i changed the topic to see if you could but now apparently it's too long or something .  . . *COUGH* sorry . . . 
<purplefeltangel> seveas: can you fix the topic
<wastrel> sigh
<purplefeltangel> sorry ^_^;;;;;;;;;;;
<wastrel> purplefeltangel:  you don't need to change the topic to see if you can change the topic
<wastrel> you can just look at the modeflags of the channel
<purplefeltangel> wastrel: how do i do that?
<wastrel> /mode #edubuntu
<Seveas> purplefeltangel, you just changed it 
<purplefeltangel> seveas: yes i did. but it messed something up -- see, the last bit of the URL is missing. :/
<wastrel> purplefeltangel:  a t in the modes indicates that the topic is locked
<Seveas> purplefeltangel, topics can't be onger than that
<purplefeltangel> wastrel: yeah, i just didnt know how to see the modes
<purplefeltangel> seveas; it was like that when i came in here . . . .
* Adalwolf changes topic to "This topic is too long"
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:Seveas] :  Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: March 08 at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Flight 4 it out ! http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/dapper/flight-4/
<purplefeltangel> thanks seveas ^_^; sorry to cause problems
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:Seveas] : Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: March 08 at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Flight 4 it out ! http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/dapper/flight-4/
<Seveas> np
<Seveas> why am I op?
* mode/#edubuntu [+o Seveas]  by ChanServ
<Seveas> argh, auto-op
* mode/#edubuntu [-o Seveas]  by Seveas
<highvoltage> Seveas: i thought i'd set your level up as well, for the times that neither ogra/janew/mhz/myself aren't here
<highvoltage> Seveas: should i set it back down again, or are you fine with it as it is?
<Seveas> you should just unset the auto-op level (/cs level #edubuntu autoop set -1
<Seveas> so noone gets opped automagically
<highvoltage> ok
<highvoltage> Seveas: ok, it's set like that now
* mode/#edubuntu [+o Seveas]  by ChanServ
<Seveas> nope 
<highvoltage> :/
<Seveas> hmm, interesting
<Seveas> chanserv is disagreeing with itself
* mode/#edubuntu [+o Adalwolf]  by ChanServ
<Adalwolf> ?
* mode/#edubuntu [-o Adalwolf]  by Seveas
<Adalwolf> :(
<highvoltage> that's not good
<Adalwolf> Nope.
<highvoltage> Adalwolf: mind trying again?
<Seveas> ah
<Adalwolf> sure.
<Seveas>  /cs level #edubuntu autoop reset
<highvoltage> Seveas: i've set it to 20, think that will help?
<Seveas> yeah, it'll help - my mistake
<Adalwolf> :)
<Seveas> setting it to -1 will cause anyone to be insta-opped
<wastrel> anyone!
<Seveas> reset will turn it off completely
<wastrel> my my
<juliux> highvoltage, i think 20 is only voice, 10 should be op
<Seveas> !lart Seveas 
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<highvoltage> weird. still does it for me. perhaps it's because i have founder level access.
<Seveas> yep
<Seveas>  /cs level #edubuntu autoop reset <-- thatwill turn it off cpompletely
<highvoltage> chanserv doesn't seem to like that
<highvoltage> brb
<ktogias> Hi, Is it possible dist-upgrade from ubuntu to edubuntu after changing the repositories? What changes have to be made?
<Adalwulf> ktogias: is this an ubuntu workstation install to an edubuntu workstation upgrade?
<ktogias> yes
<Adalwulf> If so, I beleive that you only have to install the edubuntu package.
<Adalwulf> The classroom server might be different.
<ktogias> there is no need to change the repos at /etc/apt/sources.list from ubuntu to edubuntu?
<Adalwulf> hang on a sec, let me check my reposies.
* Adalwulf is an edubuntu n00b
<Adalwulf> Only my main restricted is edubuntu, all my others are ubuntu.
<ktogias> it is like deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/edubuntu breezy main restricted  ?
<Adalwulf> lemme check.
<Adalwulf> in my /etc/apt/sources.list , I have "deb http://us.archive.ubuntu.com.ubuntu breezy-updates main restricted universe multiverse"
<Adalwulf> This is odd, I only have three lines in my /etc/apt/source.list, but I have 13 in synaptic.
<ktogias> Adalwulf, paste the remaining two...
<Adalwulf> hang on, edubuntu is on another machine.
<Dupliwulf> deb cdrom:[Edubuntu 5.10 _Breezy Badger_ - Release i386 (20051012)] / breezy main restricted
<Dupliwulf> deb http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu breezy-updates main restricted universe multiverse
<Dupliwulf> deb http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu breezy universe main restricted multiverse
<Dupliwulf> deb http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu breezy-security universe main restricted multiverse
<Dupliwulf> That all folks.
<ktogias> ok. They are the same as in ubuntu... So the only thing nedded is an apt-get install edubuntu-desktop
<ktogias> Thanks a lot
<Adalwulf> np
<mhz> ogra: hi there
<ogra> mhz, hi
<highvoltage> hello ogra and mhz
<mhz> ogra: I apologize I am still "offline" but I believe I should be ok by weekend
<mhz> highvoltage: hi there mon
<mhz> ogra: mark finally said no (well, his assistant)
<mhz> ogra: would you 
<mhz> feel like coming ?
<highvoltage> mhz: ya mon i am fine mon
<mhz> highvoltage: heheheh
<mhz> ogra: ?
<mhz> ogra: basically, we need an Ubuntu Member, lots of experience taking care of packages, contributor to Ubuntu (ideally Edubuntu).
<mhz> ogra: still there?
<Didius> hi
<Didius> ahum
<Didius> anyone?
<jsgotangco> hi
<jsgotangco> but verry verrry busy at the moment
<Didius> seems like anyone is :D
<mhz> Didius: hi
<mhz> I got some lucid couple of minutes, so I can try to help you
<Didius> well i just came to wonder if edubuntu was ready for school use
<Didius> i'm an ICT teacher
<mhz> Didius: cool! just the kind of teacher I need to talk to ;)
<jsgotangco> Didius: if you require a networked computer lab, yes edubuntu is very usable
<mhz> Didius: what are your expectations about edubuntu?
<Didius> well that is the problem. I would love to give the kids an introduction to linux, and i guess edubuntu is perfect for that
<Didius> i have some spare lessons so.
<Didius> but the thing is, what should be told?
<mhz> Didius: oooh, okis
<mhz> Well, Edubuntu is ready for many schools needs
<mhz> it is designed in a way teachers and lab admins have less tasks to set up manually
<jsgotangco> Didius: are you planning for a lab or just a few computers?
<Didius> a lab
<mhz> Didius: you have lots of edu-apps, esp. for young learners
<Didius> but I can't let the kids use edubuntu all the time. I can't let them learn to work with OOo instead of MS office, it's not official
<Didius> is edubuntu really ready to replace MS?
<mhz> Didius: Edubuntu is independant of MS apps
<jsgotangco> what apps do you use?
<mhz> MS apps, afaik, are web browser, office suite
<mhz> Didius: and for such apps, (not edu apps IMHO), linux world can offer alternatives
<jsgotangco> and you can dual boot from windows/linux if you want too
<jsgotangco> if you install a server, and your clients can boot from the network, nothing gets erased on the client machines
<mhz> Didius: edubuntu = LTSP environment + edu-apps (over 60 edu apps) + standard office apps (word processor, spreadsheet, image manipulation, presentations, audio and video, web browsers, etc)
<Didius> I have to teach kids simple programming language (turbo pascal), and the office suite. The office suite must be MS office (that is prescripted by the governement). However to show the student that there exist something different I would like to teach them a bit edubuntu. Which will not take a lot of lessons (just some spare hours). I was actually wondering if I should install edubuntu dual boot..
<Didius> The thing jsgotangco says sounds pretty neat. 
<jsgotangco> you can dual boot but it'll eat up your HD space, but if you have bootable clients, nothing gets erased
<mhz> Didius: indeed, any standard linux distro lets you work nicely via dual boot
<jsgotangco> you just need a beefy server though
<jsgotangco> or just make sure just a few machines get to connect to the server
<Didius> hmm. I'll have to discuss that with the head, but I'm definatlty a fan. Did any of you have experience/teach edubuntu at school?
<mhz> Didius: me
<jsgotangco> nah i'm ashamed to admit that i hvaen't deployed a lab yet although ive been involved with edubuntu since it started
<Didius> involved? in what part?
<mhz> Didius: but demoing, not teaching it yet (I will in April)
<Didius> mhz, what kind of experience?
<Didius> mhz demoing? planning on switching to edubuntu?
<mhz> Didius: about 15 soon-to-become-teachers used Edubuntu for a couple of days... they loved it! esp. the kinder teachers and math teachers
<Didius> what math apps?
<mhz> Didius: they wanted to try edubuntu so they can start showing other teacher about it in April
<Didius> i have dr geo Kig and Kmplot.. that are the best i guess?
<mhz> Math Games, TuxMath, Kbruch, KIG, etc
<Didius> hm
<mhz> Didius: for advanced math learners, xmaxima is the coolest!
<Didius> lets see ;)
<mhz> xmaxima is not default install but takes 5 minutes to install it
<Didius> it is like maple?
<mhz> Didius: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuSoftwareList
* mhz has not seen maple yet
* Yagisan waves G'day to all
<mhz> jsgotangco: in your opinion, why would an admin user have this error: "unable to lookup ubuntu via gethostbyname()"  ?
<Yagisan> dns and/or hosts file is b0rked
<ogra_> nope
<ogra_> he's trying to use sudo while being root ;)
<Yagisan> why would you want to do that ?
<ogra_> because you are used to it ...
* Yagisan only looked at the byname part of error
<ogra_> so if you chroot, you use it too and get this error
<mhz> ogra_: oh, you are there! :D will you answer my questions, please ?
<mhz> Yagisan: not me, a girl in -es ;)
<Yagisan> ah I see - I use a small script to chroot. it uses dchroot so I never have a sudo error
<ogra_> indeed a borked hosts file or dns is also an option :)
<mhz> yup
<Didius> hmm mhz xmaxima is like maple, except maple is more powerfull :p
* Yagisan recently installed folding@home
<mhz> Didius: maybe, but is maple GPLed?
<Didius> nope ..
<Yagisan> it looked like an interesting project. pity it is not opensource though
<mhz> yeah! /me complains too
<mhz> Didius: teaching is not only about how to use tools but also why use one tool over the others ;D
<Didius> :D
<mhz> having said that, If i teach math, yes, I have to teach mapple but will encourage the official use/preference for xmaxima as it is GPLed and I want my students to live in a 'let's share the knowledge world'
<Yagisan> it was funny, I found a "team ubuntu" for folding, currently ranked 686 http://fahstats.com/tsum.php?t=45104 
<mhz> ogra_: please?
<Didius> I'm a fan of the 'free knowledge' idea, but I don't think it works always. Biggest example is wikipedia. I have been active and have concluded it does not work
<Yagisan> it is a shame, gentoo is @ 41. we must catch them :-P
<mhz> Didius: well, it all depends on the objective you have. Wikipedia is just a potential reference, not an enciclopedia
<lucasvo_> anybody has set up sftp?
<lucasvo_> is there a server which doesn't require a systemuser for every sftp user?
<Yagisan> sorry lucasvo_ never setup sftp. Did google help ?
<jsgotangco> hmm sftp is just a subservers of ssh
<jsgotangco> subservice i mean
<Yagisan> so, how "pure" are your systems guys/girls ? All open source or do you run proprietary software as well ?
<Yagisan> my systems run proprietary graphics drivers for those that need it for opengl to work, and I have folding@home running, otherwise open source
<Yagisan> although, wesnoth is slow over ltsp :(
<Didius> ltsp?
<jsgotangco> at the moment, im pure
<jsgotangco> although i did install gstreamer-ugly here hehe
<jsgotangco> so i guess im not so pure after all
<jsgotangco> Didius: linux terminal server project
<mhz> i am pure afaik
<jsgotangco> mhz: no mp3 playback whatsoever
<jsgotangco> hehe
<jsgotangco> :)
<mhz> hehehe
<Yagisan> Didius: ltsp is the linux terminal services project. It is a core part of edubuntu, it allows you to reuse old pcs as thin clients.
<mhz> jsgotangco: i do play ogg too:)
<Yagisan> jsgotangco: well IIRC gstreamer-ugly has source, but they may have patent issues in the USA, Japan (and anywhere else it has been forced as part of a so called "Free Trade Agreement" with the USA) 
<jsgotangco> Yagisan: yeah
<Yagisan> the only things I can't play back are those that need w32codecs
<jsgotangco> i rarely have a use for such
<jsgotangco> i have a disc player to do that
<Didius> have to restart, bye
<Didius> thnx for the info
<jsgotangco> cheers
<Didius> i will keep you guys updated
<Yagisan> a) it's not on my servers arch, b) I don't care for 3rd rate porn in wmv or rmvb format.
<jsgotangco> Thanks to the LTSP, packages in the K12LTSP, Skolelinux, and Edubuntu, we can provide a school or non-profit with an outstanding and easy to use desktop that is customized for education.
<jsgotangco> http://it.sys-con.com/read/173460.htm
<jsgotangco> Trans-pacific Open Source Conference (TPOSSCON) 2006
<Yagisan> yep - or with a bit of effort, it makes a nice business system too :)
<Yagisan> actually, I saw edubuntu getting promoted on /. the other day on one of my rare visits
* mhz needs to get back to bed
<mhz> well, guys nice to see ya all
<mhz> bytes
<Yagisan> mhz so soon ?
<Yagisan> night then
<mhz> Yagisan: I feel like crap
<mhz> Yagisan: no night, it is no teven lucnh time here
<Yagisan> mhz: I hope you feel better soon then. :(
<mhz> thx
<mhz> Yagisan: and try to convince ogra to answer me :D
<Yagisan> so, jsgotangco - would you run folding@home ?
<jsgotangco> what's that?
<jsgotangco> like seti?
<Yagisan> jsgotangco: similar, but the goal is different. It's to study diseases, and hopefully find a cure ( http://folding.stanford.edu/ )
<jsgotangco> hmm ive heard of somthing like this before
<jsgotangco> i can probably run it in one machine that never gets shut down here at home
<Yagisan> jsgotangco: and our ubuntu team wiki is here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FoldingAtHome
<Yagisan> jsgotangco: I run it on all boxes, it doesn't matter if they shutdown or not
<jsgotangco> checking
<Yagisan> jsgotangco: it only runs on idle priority, so no strain on the box
<Yagisan> jsgotangco: I had a box finally send a unit back, so my stats are here http://fah-web.stanford.edu/cgi-bin/main.py?qtype=userpage&username=Yagisan&teamnum=45104
<jsgotangco> is this like team bragging rights thing?
<Yagisan> somewhat :) it's a bit of fun to see who has the most points
<Yagisan> I joined team ubuntu, because it would be nice to see ubuntu as #1
<Yagisan> currently ubuntu is #686, and gentoo is #41
<Yagisan> I suggest installing using the script on the wiki myself
<Yagisan> jsgotangco: so, is it interesting ?
<jsgotangco> yes i'll installi it on my machines later and sign up
<Yagisan> :) cool
* Yagisan kicks server *hard*
<Yagisan> hmm, it seems to have ide issues
<Yagisan> hdc: ide_intr: huh? expected NULL handler on exit
<Yagisan> ^^^ lots of that in my logs - and it won't read my dvd's
* Yagisan seems to have hardware issues on my server. bye all
<julian> Hi :)
<julian> anybody home ? ;)
<julian> I have a q. Is there a major diffrence between ubundu & edubundu ?
<julian> as a desktop adult(!) user, can I install edubundu for my everyday work (I have ubundu right now) ?
<Burgwork> edubuntu is very similar to Ubuntu
<julian> oh thank you :)
<Burgwork> edubuntu includes all the software that Ubuntu includes plus a bunch of educational software
<julian> oh it's great
<Burgwork> so if you have a child, you can install the workstation of edubuntu and both use the same machine
<julian> thank you burgwork
<julian> I'll do. my boy will love it. if he can work with it, I'll install ubuntu in our school lab
<julian> tnx and bye. I'm going to insall it.
<Burgwork> julian, np
<julian> I'm from iran
<Burgwork> cool
<Burgwork> from Canada
<julian> nice. bye and tnx again
<shannara> I am very happy with flight4. LTSP is working great. I had to rebuild the server because running update screws up openoffice and gaim. Everything works except cups. Can anyone help with this? Does anyone know of a fix or an alternate printing management?
#edubuntu 2006-03-08
<shannara> anyone : )
<Burgwork> shannara, sorry, I have no idea. I would suggest the edubuntu mailing list
<shannara> do you have a link for that?
<Burgwork> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel
<shannara> thanks
<Burgwork> shannara, np
<trev0r> ogra_: I haven't had a chance to try booting a thin client yet, but the server runs great
<trev0r> I got internet working.  It does take about 1 minute to load firefox, but once it loads the program runs awesome.  Pages scroll like it was a 3ghz machine
<trev0r> And these are pentium 1 386 (or maybe 366)mhz machines
<trev0r> With 64 mb of ram
<shannara> Has anyone succesfully installed ltsp on Kubuntu flight 4
<Burgundavia> highvoltage: do the freedom toasters have tray or slot load cdrws?
<wastrel> what's a freedom toaster?
<Burgundavia> http://www.freedomtoaster.org/
<wastrel> interesting
<mikebot> if anyone here has used windows, i am looking for a menu editor which would allow me to add my own menu to the panel, and then allow me to add folders to it which expand rightward when highlighted (like the debian folder in ubuntu); if anyone knows of such a tool could they please let me know? thanks
<Adalwulf> The Applications Menu Editor?
<mikebot> Adalwulf, i'm not sure
<mikebot> Adalwulf, like, i want to be able to add my own menu, like the Applications menu
<mikebot> Adalwulf, but not like a drawer, where it just links, but like folders
<Burgundavia> mikebot: all the menus are defined in flat files
<Burgundavia> mikebot: you can create your own and then edit the panle. Not easy
<mikebot> Burgundavia, is there a program which makes it easy?
<Burgundavia> mikebot: not that I know of
<mikebot> Burgundavia, okay, thanks
<mikebot> Burgundavia, do you know if theya re working on one?
<mikebot> Burgundavia, it seems rather useful to me
<Adalwulf> Right click on panel>add to panel> add menu
<Adalwulf> Then.....
<Adalwulf> Right click on menu>Edit Menus
<mikebot> Adalwulf, that's just a new ubuntu menu though
<Burgundavia> hmm, that might work
<mikebot> no, cause you can;t remove Places or System
<mikebot> and any change made to this menu will occur on the other as well
<Burgundavia> you can replace the three menus with one
<mikebot> Burgundavia, yeah, but i'm looking to create my own independent one
<mikebot> Burgundavia, like a folder called projects, then in it are folders titled by years, etc.
<Burgundavia> will need to be manually hacked
<mikebot> heh okay
<Burgundavia> sorry I cannot be of help
<mikebot> Burgundavia, no worries
<mikebot> thanks anyway
<mikebot> night
<Adalwulf> Add main menu doesn't have places or system
<Adalwulf> Never mind, yes it does
<shannara> has anyone got cups working on flight 4?
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: tray loaders
<Burgundavia> highvoltage: do they break?
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: the toasters? sometimes. the tray loaders? none have broken yet (yes, it's a miracle)
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: jason does want to get tray loaders, but they are rare in south africa, i think he's going to import them for the next batch
<Burgundavia> highvoltage: I went looking for them tonight. They are pretty rare in general
<Burgundavia> highvoltage: have you guys considered selling cds right there? does taking money invite theft?
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: at one of our freedomtoasters we have a vending machine that contains cd's, so you pop in a R5 coin, and it will dispense a CD.
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: it's a very secure location, so there hasn't been a case of theft yet, although that idea wouldn't work in all areas
<Burgundavia> I wonder if a Freedom Toaster is even worth it in Canada
<Dupliwolf> Bandwidth is cheap in Canada isn't it?
<jsgotangco> is the system for the toaster free?
<jsgotangco> i mean the software aside from the usual OS and stuff
<corey_> jsgotangco: I believe so
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: yep
<corey_> highvoltage: do you just have an iso we can use? Is the software packaged and in Ubuntu?
<highvoltage> corey_: no, it's not packaged yet. Some local people are working on a new version, i htink it's just about done. i'll go ask jason just now where i can get the latest version and get it to you.
<highvoltage> corey_: so far, it hasn't really been released yet, although it is intended to be free software
<jsgotangco> ahhh
<corey_> highvoltage: I can't do anything with it. But bug a MOTU
<chell> Hi
<chell> I'm a pupil (German school year 9 (4 years to go)), is edubuntu the right flavour of Ubuntu/Linux for me? 
<highvoltage> chell: most probably
<highvoltage> chell: edubuntu comes with the same packages as ubuntu, and you also have the universe available that gives you the entire debian and more.
<juliux> chell, which school? and in hamburg?
<chell> not in Hamburg no
<chell> close though
<juliux> chell, sorry think so because you have a hansenet dsl connection
<chell> So I don't have to enable any repositories etc. when I use edubuntu?
<highvoltage> chell: yes
<chell> That's cool
<chell> because when you choose Ubuntu you have to
<juliux> chell, i make a talk about edubuntu and ubuntu at the 19.3.2006
<juliux> chell, in hamburg
<chell> where?
<juliux> chell, www.hhlug.de
<juliux> chell, but i also can get to your school and can show edubuntu with thinclients there
<juliux> s/get/come
<highvoltage> :)
<chell> My ICT teacher is a windows guy...
<chell> He doesn't like linux
<juliux> chell, no problem
<chell> Is the talk going to be recorded?
<juliux> chell, where is your school?
<chell> Elmshorn
<chell> maybe you know where that is?
<juliux> chell, ah ok that isnt so far away from hamburg only 30min by train
<chell> yes I know
<juliux> chell, if you want i can do in the week of the 20th march a presentation in your school
<chell> well, I am not sure if that's such a good idea
<chell> as I said
<chell> my ICT teacher is also head of the ICT branch
<juliux> chell, it is a chance
<juliux> ;)
<chell> well
<juliux> chell, in my old school are also linux pcs and at the begining there was only windows
<juliux> chell, it is a hard way but why not
<chell> we also have linux on some pcs
<chell> 2 or 3 I believe
<chell> but it is never booted
<juliux> not very good
<chell> no 
<chell> you can try and get into contact with my teacher and ask him if he would let you talk to pupils during "informatik" lessons
<chell> I already had to present linux to them once
<juliux> if you come to the hhlug meeting i will give you a edubuntu dvdbox and some flyers about ubuntu and ubuntu cds so you can distribute them on your school
<chell> when exactly is you talk again?
<juliux> 19.3.2006
<chell> A mate is coming to visit me that day (probably)
<chell> I can ask him
<chell> if he wants to go
<juliux> linux is more then one mate ;)
<chell> I've just sent him an email
<juliux> ok
<juliux> can you give me the e-mail address from your teacher?
<juliux> send it to juliux@ubuntu-de.org
<chell> I'm not sure if I have it
<chell> the one I've got seems old
<chell> but I can give you the school's email adress
<chell> *address
<chell> You can ask for Mr Kracht
<chell> post@kgse.de
<chell> that's the school's address
<juliux> ok thxs
<juliux> i will write an e-mail
<chell> okay
<chell> but you haven't got it from me ;-)
<juliux> okay
<chell> what exactly would you do at the school
<chell> ?
<juliux> i want to show how to use a server with thinclients
<chell> Well, they are "noobs"
<juliux> what edubuntu is
<chell> most of them anyway
<juliux> no problem 
<chell> I think they should know what linux is
<chell> and then edubuntu
<juliux> i am often on fairs and linuxtdays 
<chell> yes
<juliux> so i now how to tell it noobs
<chell> what did you write the school?
<juliux> at the moment nothing
<chell> so what are you planning to write?
<juliux> because i will travel to chemnitzer linuxdays in a few hours
<juliux> i dont exactly know
<juliux> i will write it next week on the cebit
<chell> you're going? I was there last year
<juliux> i do the ubuntu booth on the cebit
<juliux> also a the chemnitzer linuxdays
<juliux> see http://wiki.ubuntuusers.de/Messen/2006/
<chell> how big is the ubuntu booth going to be?
<juliux> 6qm
<juliux> in hall 5 stand F67/8
<chell> would be really great if you could come and talk to pupils during informatik lessons
<juliux> no problem
<juliux> i will try it
<juliux> sorry i have to go
<juliux> cu
<chell> cu
<paolob> Hi guys. I want to change the applications menu for all users, http://ubuntuguide.org/4.10/ says me to do "http://ubuntuguide.org/4.10/", but it doesn't work in breezy. How do I do it? thank you!
<shannara> Can anyone tell me if the is a chat server for dapper
<paolob> Hi guys! How do I modify the gnome menu for all users? thank you!
<jsgotangco> paolob, i think you can do that stuff in gconf
<paolob> jsgotangco, doesn't the nautilus applications-all-users:/// work any more? 
<jsgotangco> i believe its still possible to revert previous gnome/nautilus behaviors in gconf
<moonbeam> hello
<moonbeam> Any known issues with joliet CD as 5.10 ?
<moonbeam> s/as/and
<moonbeam> they mount but directory listings are empty.
<neurogeek> .seen mhz
<Nomad411> Hi all..  I'm looking at setting up a machine for a 10 year-old, and I was wondering if edubuntu comes with tools like net-nany or such things, my buddy is worried about his son vs. the Internet.
<tsurc> just tried edubuntu and got an error on "build LTSP chroot". I'm using the 20060303 image.
<tsurc> alt-f3 gives something to do with ldm has no ???? or if referenced by another name. Any ideas anyone?
<ogra> the iso is oversized ...
<ogra> most likely its broken 
<tsurc> md5sum ok
<ogra> yes
<ogra> but if it overflows the cd builder starts a second iso ... so there might be missing packages
<ogra> which means it cant install 
<tsurc> Memory's sketchy. But i recall reading something, somewhere about burning 7speed. Any one confirm that?
<tsurc> I'll give it a go, and see if it works anyway.
<ogra> just do the CD selftest 
<ogra> if thats fine , the write speed was ok as well 
<ogra> but generally you should write bootable CDs not faster than 8x
<tsurc> you learn something new everyday ;-)
<tsurc> I'll try that monday morn when i get into work
<ogra> in any case the flight4 CD is tested to work ... i cant tell about the dailies ...
<ogra> havent tested since a week ...
<sorush20> hi guys
<sorush20> just wanted to know if there is something like spss in edubuntu? 
* Dupliwolf doesn't know what spss is
<sorush20> its a statistical analysis package
<sorush20> I thought since its to do with eduction edubuntu should have something similar.. but there is pspp, which is underdevelopment.. 
<sorush20> something like Minitab
<Dupliwolf> I'm an edubuntu noob, so I'm not sure if there is one or not, but I've not heard of one.
<Dupliwolf> There is a packages list somewhere, lemme find it.
<sorush20> Dupliwolf: don't worry thanks.. I think the packages and repositories are the same 
<Dupliwolf> Sorry I couldn
<Dupliwolf> t help
<chell> Hi
<chell> I've just installed edubuntu and updated it
<chell> Then I wanted to use that schooltool thing. Which login data do I have to use for that?
<chell> ?
<plastique> chell> I don't anymore but there's a simple guide to do this
<plastique> ..don't know..
<plastique> i still don't know why there's a chance to run it in CLI - it ends with an error in script
<plastique> it have to be run from within a browser
<shannara> ogra: are you on?
#edubuntu 2006-03-09
<juliux> ogra, ping
<juliux> does anybody knows what can i do if i cannt login on a thinclient?
<juliux> only one user works
<ogra> juliux, pong
<xbl> is there an edubuntu live cd?
<Kamping_Kaiser> not afaik.
<ogra> only a dapper version 
<ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/dapper/flight-4/ has it 
<ogra> (but note that it's still under developemnt)
<xbl> what do you mean by dapper?
<xbl> we are using Vector on a classroom of ours... and planning to use edubuntu
<ogra> dapper is the ubuntu version we'll release in april
<ogra> (6.04)
<xbl> also planning to give them live cds...
<ogra> so until then its the development version of ubuntu/edubuntu
<xbl> ahhh ok...
<xbl> so is it faster?
<ogra> heh, yes, it will also be a little faster ... its new ...
<xbl> when can I get info about dapper?
<xbl> can't locate it in the site
<ogra> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/?action=fullsearch&context=180&value=dapper&titlesearch=Titel
<xbl> thank you...
<zakame> evening edubunteros
<jelkner> hi all
<jelkner> we just installed a new edubuntu (dapper flight-4) system in a high school in dc
<jelkner> we can't log in to the clients
<jelkner> everything else seems to be working well
<jelkner> clients are displaying log-in screen
<ogra> known bug 
<jelkner> ogra: hi ogra, what do we do?
<ogra> run sudo ltsp-update-sshkeys on the server
<jelkner> yay!
<jelkner> Thanks for the tip - we wrote it down.
<jelkner> ok, gotta run
<jelkner> another edubuntu lab is born
<ogra> :)
#edubuntu 2006-03-10
* #edubuntu  [freenode-info]  help freenode weed out clonebots, please register your IRC nick and auto-identify: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup
<jp> Hello?
<jp> NO one home here either!
<Burgundavia> jp: nope, nobody home ;)
<Burgundavia> jp: what you need?
<jp> I have installed edubuntu, kubuntu, and ubuntu Breezy on three different partitions, they all freeze up, tell me that xorg is broken, or have a kernel panic (at different times) I installed an old Hoary I have had for a while and it is working fine. any ideas? why the breezy's are screwed up?
<Burgundavia> I would suspect hardware, with that kind of issue
<jp> The computer is a new HP with an AMD semperon 3000+, 512Mb
<Burgundavia> here is what I would do: 1-test your memory with memtest86. It is on the livecd. 2-confirm that your installation media works
<Burgundavia> 3-verify the md5 sums on your isos
<Burgundavia> 4-assuming those are the only three OSes on their, do a pure default install of Ubuntu and see if that works, with a new cd
<jp> md5 sums are all good, and I have several other iso's running off the same HDD, I burn everything at 4x so that it is burned slow
<Burgundavia> breezy might just have an issue with your hardware. Regardless, #ubuntu is a better bet for this kind of help
<jp> I'll try the memtest tho, and I'll try burning a new ISO on the wife's Windoze box
<Burgundavia> I have to run, so good luck
<jp> THX
<Burgundavia> np
<highvoltage> ogra: ping
<highvoltage> anyone remember what i need to do when LDM kicks me out when i log in? i remember having to type ssh-update-keys or something like that, but can't remember exactly what i need to do.
<highvoltage> ah, ltsp-update-sshkeys. d'oh!
<pawsilver> hi there!  I'm using edubuntu on my Compaq nx 5000!  How do i get the blue tooth working?
<pawsilver> My cellphone asks for a password?  What is it?  where would I go to set it on the notebook?
<sharp_> hello
<sharp_> the next  release of ubuntu should be called vomiting vole (possibly 6.10)
<sharp_> hello
<flint> looking for Oliver, ogra...
<flint> admitedly it is late in his day...
<flint> moreover, I think i may have found an interesting audio bug...
<juliux> flint, i think he is in london
<flint> juliux, thanks. 
<flint> Anybody out here got any ubuntu breezy audio chops? 
<juliux> flint, i will test sound on the thinclient in the next week 
<flint> juliux, na, this is on a regular breezy box where the sound just flat stopped.
<juliux> flint, on the thinclient or on the server?
<flint> i think i am the victum of an upgrade.  
<flint> just a regular box.
<juliux> i have no trouble with sound on my breezy box
<flint> the live cd still locates the sound card, loads the module and takes off like a scalded cat.
<flint> the live cd that works is Linux ubuntu 2.6.12-9-386 
<flint> the "upgraded" machine is "2.6.14.2-baseline-4.2baseline"
<flint> the sound card is Multimedia audio controller: Intel Corp. 82801DB/DBL/DBM 
<flint> juliux, there are three subdirectories under /lib/modules.  The latest one ...baseline, has no reference to snd_intel8x0 the next oldest directoy ...2.6.12-8-386 actually contains the files.  Could I jam load them from this other directory?
<juliux> flint, i have only dapper here
<juliux> flint, my breezy is on an other hdd and not in a computer
<flint> juliux, this is more a general question as to how to jam a module in to see if it would work.  or would the better option be to back the kernel?
<juliux> flint, dont ask me i am not a dev
<flint> juliux, no problemmo, neither am i maybe I should go and bother their channel.  thanks!
<juliux> flint, sorry but at the moment i am a little bit confused
#edubuntu 2006-03-11
<shannara> does anyone know the chat address for discussing dapper. Printing doesn'tt work with x86_64
<KRUTOY> Hey
<KRUTOY> It's my first time here, lol
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:robbies] : nigger!
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:robbiez] : FUCK GENTOO!!! NIGGERS ARE DIRTY!!!
<arkan0x> wtf topic?
<arkan0x> ogra, !
<arkan0x> ogra, !!
<arkan0x> jane_, ! the topic !
* mode/#edubuntu [+o ogra]  by ChanServ
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:ogra] :  Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: March 08 at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Flight 4 it out ! http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/dapper/flight-4/
* robbiez was kicked off #edubuntu by ogra (ogra)
<rafael> hello
<rafael> bye
<sophie^> hi just a question, is schooltool required in init? what is its purpose?
<sophie^> is it safe to have it removed?
<clinton> hi
<alejandro> ogra, with a fresh ltsp installation in ubuntu, I have some advices:
<alejandro> install: cannot create regular file `/opt/ltsp/pkg_cache/etc/ssh/ssh_known_hosts': No such file or directory
<alejandro> install: cannot create regular file `/opt/ltsp/data/etc/ssh/ssh_known_hosts': No such file or directory
<alejandro> You need to check the files in ltsp-update-sshkeys.
<ogra> uuh, why do you have this many dirs in /opt/ltsp 
<ogra> (agreed, i'll look into it)
<ogra> but it does no harm as long as you dont have a etc/ssh tree in one of the subdirs :)
<ogra> its just noisy
<alejandro> no, I cleaned /opt/ltsp/i386 and run in a fresh ubuntu dapper, the client script.
<alejandro> anyway nice work, it's awesome.
<alejandro> it's very frustating to try to install a program in a LTSP 4.x environment
<ogra> yes :)
<ogra> but they boot in 29seconds (taken with a stopwatch including the BIOS) ... we'll never reach such speed :)
<ogra> and they have a way smaller memory footprint, with swap server, ltsp 4.1 boots on 20MB
<ogra> (i'd be happy about 32M :) )
<juliux> ogra, i have teste dapper at the weekend with 2 thinclients, and the thinclients have 128MB RAM but it was very slow on the thinclients
<ogra> vesa driver ?
<juliux> yes
<juliux> i think so
<ogra> its the driver 
<juliux> ah
<ogra> not the client
<juliux> so i should test an other driver
<ogra> vesa is 100% unaccelerated :)
<juliux> i run it with the rangee thinclients
<juliux> in chemnitz
<ogra> i didnt find any driver apart from vesa that works with the rangees ...
<ogra> (but i didnt look very close i must admit)
<juliux> if i find time on cebit i will test other driver
<juliux> this was gcompris
<juliux> if i start it x restarts
<ogra> file a bug, i have no such problems here ...
<jinty> hoi ogra, just checking if the new schooltool packages were working for you?
<ogra> not yet
<ogra> some dependency is missing ...
<ogra> i'm about to look at it ...
<jinty> ok, let me know, there may be something I can do...
<alejandro> ogra, then Maecow is slower?
<highvoltage> ogra: hi
<ogra> hey highvoltage 
<highvoltage> i have a weird problem with ldm
<ogra> i wrote the ltsp gui installer for LTSPManager on the weekend :)
<highvoltage> (theme-wise)
<ogra> oh ? 
<highvoltage> o kewl :)
<highvoltage> yes, if i change the background colour to a darkish blue, (or other colour) I get a white stripe on the right side corner of the screen.
<highvoltage> is that white stripe a known bug?
<highvoltage> my theme is available here, fwiw, http://jonathancarter.co.za/files/tuxlab.tar
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> i havent seen that yet 
<ogra> what screensize is that ? 
<ogra> (resolution)
<highvoltage> 1024x768
<ogra> hmm, nope, dont have that here 
<ogra> 1024x786, 800x600, and 1280x800 work here 
<ogra> file a bug if you like, i'll look into it
<highvoltage> strange. perhaps i tweak something elsewhere that broke it :)
<ogra> not really, you would have to tweak the gtk code of the greeter itself
<ogra> size and position of the theme are computed from the screensize 
<highvoltage> ok. i'll take a photo of it tonight and send it through. perhaps it's something that will come up again.
<highvoltage> oh yes, the stripe isn't always white. it's the same colour as the bar at the bottom.
<highvoltage> ogra:  othersiwe, how are things?
<ogra> fine :)
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<jinty> ogra: hmm, I had a look at schooltool, it appears the source package is in the archive, but no debs. and I cannot find a build log anywhere.
<crimsun> jinty: https://launchpad.net/+builds/+build/173652
<ogra_> crimsun, already solved
<ogra_> the next build attempt should work, twisted-web2 wasnt in main until today
<crimsun> ogra_: just answering his question regarding not being able to find a build log
<ogra_> ah
<jinty> crimsun: thanks a lot, nice to be able to find these things in the future
<jinty> orga: schooltool builds will still fail because zope3 is still uninstallable in dapper. it depends on python2.4-pullparser and python2.4-clientform (at least). All of these are in debian.
<ogra> yup
<ogra> afaik doko already requested the sync
<ogra> i'll make sure i dont remember wrong
<jinty> ok, just making sure that schooltool doesn't get lost in the beaurocracy somewhere;)
<ogra> jinty, its one of my killer apps :)
<ogra> dont worry, we wont release without working schooltool :)
<jsgotangco> it would be a travesty
<ogra> yes 
* jinty is just a little paranoid at times:)
<ERic_> hallo, how can i get a standalone edubuntu
<ERic_> ?
<ogra> standalone edubuntu ?
<ogra> do you mean a workstation install ? 
<ogra> http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes 
<ERic_> ty
<highvoltage> ogra: i assume the workstation install won't have compiz running like Ubuntu?
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<ogra> highvoltage, what makes you think ubuntu could have compiz installed ??
<ogra> thats crappy unstable stuff
<ogra> we'll surely not release it in main yet
<highvoltage> ok, good. i read about people using it on dapper, and then i saw some screen shots of compiz on an ubuntu live cd, so i was afraid it's being distributed with ubuntu already *shew*
<ogra> nope, its in universe 
<jsgotangco> its way too unstable and requires everyone to have a beefy card
<ogra> its the future ...
<ogra> but its far from being ready
<jsgotangco> i thought aiglx is better designed?
<highvoltage> yeah, somehow i just got the impression that it's going to be in dapper, so i immeditely though of asking here :)
<highvoltage> sorry, been a long day
<jsgotangco> heh
<jsgotangco> we could have beaten all distros if we have a working xgl+compiz from install
<ogra> no problem :) dont worry, we dont release crappy stuff :)
<highvoltage> cool. so LDM will work much nicer at release?
* highvoltage ducks
<ogra> :P
<jsgotangco> lol
<mezzapazza> hi 
<ogra> i ddint plan big changes on ldm :)
<highvoltage> :)
<highvoltage> hi mezzapazza 
<mezzapazza> does somebody have idea why ltspfsd runs toughly as root on edubuntu?
<ogra> the daemon should, yes
<mezzapazza> uups
<mezzapazza> s/root/nobody 
<ogra> does the ltsp.org wiki show anything ?
<mezzapazza> i followed the document, installed ltspfsd from the package
<mezzapazza> but it runs as nobody, so it doesn't work
<mezzapazza> even if i try to run as root manually, it runs as nobody
<highvoltage> bye, #edubuntu
<mezzapazza> and strace output doesn't show anything interesting
<ogra> sorry, i didnt do much testing with it after we postponed localdevice support to next release
<mezzapazza> do you have an idea how could i force it to run as root?
<ogra> is it intended to run as root ? 
<ogra> i'd ask in #ltsp, sbalneav is the guy you want
<ERic_NL> i there the possibility for a blank password
<ERic_NL> *is there
<mezzapazza> yes, it should run as root, othervise it cannot mount devices
<ogra> sure ... you dont need to be root to use pmount :)
<highvoltage> ogra: i've been thinking about what you said about sessions in LDM
<ogra> yup
<highvoltage> ogra: couldn't you make a symbolic link from the main filesystem and get the information from there?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> we'll have an easy configurable file in the chroot ...
<ogra> thats not the problem ....
<highvoltage> ok, so you'll at least be able to set a default session for all the users?
<ogra> what i want is that you can add *any* PC running sshd in your network to be a server 
<ogra> you cant get this data simply out of the network ...
<highvoltage> oh, that would be fantastic.
<ogra> i can do a default session that gets created during install and just uses the loacl data from the server in the chroot ...
<ogra> bnut beyond that, you will need to add other sessions manually
<highvoltage> other sessions? so a user would still be able to choose?
<ogra> then, yes ...
<ogra> if you have only a default session, there is no need for a chooser :)
<highvoltage> :)
<ogra> the code is already in ldm, its just commented until i can automate it ... 
<ogra> which wont happen in dapper ...
<highvoltage> where can i find the layout for the LDM login screen? i think you said it's a gtk-based layout?
<highvoltage> does it have something to do with /usr/lib/ltsp/greeters/gtk ?
<ogra> its the glade file in this directory ...
<ogra> together with the gtk binary
<jsgotangco> see ya guys, have fun :)
<ERic_NL> have fun
<highvoltage> bye jsgotangco 
<highvoltage> ogra: is there anything particular in edubuntu that requires further testing?
<highvoltage> egh. gcompris just exited by itself, leaving my resolution at 800x600
<ogra> you are the second person reporting that, can you file a bug and assign it to me ? 
<highvoltage> yes
<ogra> thanks
<ogra> :)
* ERic_NL thinks that it takes long to install edubuntu
<highvoltage> it does. then again, if you watch while anything installs it takes too long.
<ogra> it takes pretty exactly 10 min longer than ubuntu :)
<highvoltage> really? wow. when i stared at my computer building the ltsp chroot it felt much longer than that :)
<ogra> (unless you do a install that pulls a lot of language packs from tha web) 
<ogra> highvoltage, from the iso ? 
<highvoltage> ogra: yep
<highvoltage> ogra: how do i assign a bug to you in launchpad? i can't find a link that says so.
<highvoltage> (bug is created, i just need to assign)
<ogra> give me the bugnumber, i'll grab it
<ogra> (if you click on the package name you can edit bug details)
<highvoltage> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gcompris/+bug/33898
<ogra> thanks :)
<highvoltage> my pleasure
<highvoltage> ogra: will ktouch have pre-loaded lesson plans in final release?
<ogra> do we have a package with these ?
<highvoltage> an apt-cache search ktouch suggests that we don't :/
<highvoltage> k12ltsp has some preconfigured lessons, but after feature freeze it's probably too late to repackage that for edubuntu, right?
<ogra> if its only data, i can probably get it in
<ogra> but mind you, we dont have space at all ... it *must* be a small package
<ogra> the CD sits at 694MB  ... the end is at 695 ...
<highvoltage> ok, i'll get a copy of k12-ltsp installed before the end of the week and extract that data. even if we just get a basic lesson, i think it would be an improvement. and i'm sure a basic lesson would come in at <50KB
<highvoltage> geez, that's living on the edge!
<ogra> yep
<highvoltage> what if the average package size increases by 10K by the next release?
<highvoltage> should we keep a room open at the hospital for you then? :P
<ogra> we'll drop more stuff
<ogra> there is still openoffice firefox evolution and gnome we can drop ... 
<ogra> ;)
<highvoltage> :)
<ogra> nad the kernel ... that even solves the problem of kernel selection for smp ;)
<highvoltage> scribus is under the Office and the Graphics menu. is this intended to be so?
<ogra> i think so ...
<ogra> its done upstream ... not my fault :)
<highvoltage> do we really need kino, serpentime, and sound juicer?
<highvoltage> cutting those should save some space.
<ogra> serpentine takes about 200k 
<ogra> sound juicer is essential for copying CDs ...
<ogra> kino would be a candidate with 1.1M, but it has a wide userbase ...
<ogra> and the 1M isnt really saving our butts
<highvoltage> yep
<ogra> dropping the KDE stuff would gain us 50-100M
<ogra> probably more
<highvoltage> we don't really need replacements for all the kde-edu software. there's only a few of them that's really widely used.
<ogra> i agree ...
<highvoltage> ktuberling, kturtle, kanagram, kalzium, khangman, kstars. the rest are more trivial
<ogra> rather some more scientific gnome apps
<highvoltage> kturtle is the nicest turtle program i've seen on linux yet. gcompris kind of gives you a lot of the rest.
<highvoltage> how does ubuntu/edubuntu/kubuntu live together in launchpad? or don't they yet? launchpad only gave me the option to log a bug in ubuntu or baltix
<highvoltage> is it because ubuntu/edubuntu/kubuntu packages are essentially identical?
<ogra> yup
<ogra> baltix is a real derivative, devloped externally
<highvoltage> and they use launchpad? nice.
<ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/LTSPManager/
<ogra> new screenshots ^^^
<highvoltage> ogra: can i connect to my gnome session on another computer, like i would with Xnest and xdmcp?
* highvoltage looks at screenshots (might take a while to download though)
<ogra> you men to a running session ? 
<ogra> *mean
<highvoltage> not necassarily. a new session is fine too.
<ogra> ssh -X user@ip gnome-session
<ogra> should work with any ubuntu since warty
<ogra> (indeed you need to execute that from a running x server)
<ogra> (you could run ldm in xnest and have a "virtual ltsp client"
<ogra> )
<highvoltage> that's very weird
<highvoltage> my remote session runs over my current one
<highvoltage> what i find interesting is, the panel that runs remotely shows my apps running locally in the task list.
<ogra> heh
<ogra> thats clearly a bug
<ogra> similar to this one http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=94049
<highvoltage> ltsp manager looks nice. does it use lts.conf, or do you try to avoid the lts.conf file?
<ogra> it will use lts.conf 
<highvoltage> don't you think we should have an example lts.conf file?
<ogra> yup
<ogra> we have one already
<ogra> but it should reflect the right ltsp ;)
<highvoltage> ok, flight4 didn't have it
<highvoltage> yep :)
<ogra> and probably we should install it in the docs on the server not on the client ;)
<highvoltage> are you putting comments in it, explaining how to use it?
<highvoltage> i have a small one that i've started on so far
<highvoltage> meant for the edubuntu's running in tuxlabs.
<highvoltage> right :)
<ogra> thats what i wanted to have in the edubuntu docs  ... 
<ogra> i thought adding it to your tech/hardware doc ...
<ogra> have a look in /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/doc/ltsp-client/examples/
<highvoltage> heh. if i press alt+f2 it brings me both my remote and local run dialog
<ogra> yes, gnome still has some way to go with that :)
<ogra> but having icons and themes if you are logged in multiple times is already a good start :)
* highvoltage nods head
<ogra> i'm thinking about a kiosk mode on ltsp level for dapper+1 ... 
<ogra> there i'll surely need to fix such stuff
<highvoltage> yep
<highvoltage> the kiosk mode should be a hit
<ogra> yup#
<ogra> especially if you only have to check a checkbox in LTSPManager to get a fully set up internet cafe installation :)
<highvoltage> hehe
<highvoltage> can i send you my sample lts.conf file?
<ogra> hmm ... that could even go further and become a CD install option ... all you need is a minimal setup and install ltsp-server-standalone and firefox on it ...
<ogra> yup
<ogra> you wont need X or a desktop ...
<ogra> the clients just start firefox fullscreen in their X server ... started by a ldm autologin ...
<highvoltage> nice
<ogra> put in the edubuntu CD ... wait 30min, adjust dhcpd.conf, restart dhcpd, bott the clients... done :) 
<ogra> you can do a fully set up internet cafe install in 1h :)
<highvoltage> i recommend 192.168.0.254 to everyone, that way they don't need to edit dhcpd.conf
<highvoltage> do you think we'll keep that recommendation for the edubuntu docs?
<ogra> why not 
<highvoltage> kewl :)
<ogra> its good to keep predictable defaults i think
<ogra> if people are used to it we shouldnt confuse them
<highvoltage> yep, especially for people who don't even know what an IP address is.
<highvoltage> yes, i like keeping it more or less in line with k12ltsp and other similar distro's, if possible.
<ogra> that as well ... its very helpful for people who want to switch distros 
<highvoltage> is it possible to run local apps on the clients yet? or do we need an ssh server running on the clients for that?
<ogra> you'll have to fiddle with xhost etc and will need ip forwarding on the server if you want net access
<highvoltage> net access within the locally running client? ok. i understand.
<ogra> if you'd run firefox locally, the client needs acess to the net :)
<highvoltage> is that documented somewhere, do you think it's likely that it could be made to work automatically in dapper+1?
<highvoltage> yes :)
<highvoltage> luckily ip forwarding is easy to set up these days. and since all the clients get their info from dhcp, specifying name server / gateway is easy.
<ogra> thats quite tricky ...
<ogra> you break security with the xhost stuff ....
<highvoltage> ah.
<ogra> you'll need iptables and set up nat on the server ...
<highvoltage> my smtp server is a bit dodgy. i've uploaded the file here: http://jonathancarter.co.za/files/lts.conf
<ogra> its not as easy as it seems ...
<ogra> you tested the per host settings in lts.conf and it worked ? 
<highvoltage> yes, it worked fine.
<ogra> wow 
<highvoltage> :)
<ogra> i didnt even test it yet 
<ogra> note that X_MOUSE_PROTOCOL and X_MOUSE_DEVICE are only used for serial mice in ubuntu ... 
<ogra> all other pointing devices are detected automatiaclly
<highvoltage> right. i just kept it there so that's its easy to change
<ogra> so /dev/psaux shouldnt be in the examples 
<highvoltage> although, serial mice are so 90's, that example can just as well be dropped, your'e right.
<ogra> i also have a list of supported protocols i wanted to add 
<ogra> noo
<highvoltage> ogra: http://jonathancarter.co.za/files/ipt2
<highvoltage> i got that script off the gentoo wiki
<ogra> i've put quite a lot of effort to get serial mice right for dapper, its a feature 
<ogra> we shouldnt hide it :)
<highvoltage> i want to create a gtk dialog where you can edit what's called LAN and WAN in that script
<highvoltage> so that administrators can easily set up 'internet sharing'
<ogra> yup, makes sense
<highvoltage> default dhcpd should make nameserver and gateway 192.168.0.254 (or whatever server is)
<highvoltage> then the internet connection sharing would be a snap
<ogra> currently its .10 i think ...
<ogra> or .1
<highvoltage> i think it's .1
<highvoltage> JaneW: wb
<ogra> # Modified for LTSP under Ubuntu by Jonathan Carter <jonathan@ubuntu.org>
<ogra> highvoltage, ubuntu.org ?
<highvoltage> oh, right. ubuntu.com.
<ogra> :)
* highvoltage isn't used to having a .com e-mail address
<highvoltage> :)
* ogra has .com .net and .org addresses :)
<ogra> just no .de 
<highvoltage> brb- dinner
<surfdude> lol
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<Burgwork> salut highvoltage 
<highvoltage> Burgwork: salut burgendavia?
<Burgwork> yep
<highvoltage> how are things?
<Burgwork> good
<Burgwork> just starting a project to recycle computers and install Ubuntu on them
<highvoltage> nice. using them as thin clients?
<Burgwork> depends on the age, mostly standalone
<highvoltage> how are you going to do authentication? ldap?
<Burgwork> mostly the computers are going to sold/donated to people and go into their homes
<highvoltage> ah, ok.
<highvoltage> i'm quite excited about edubuntu 6.04. i'm looking forward to its release.
<highvoltage> i do wish that ldm had better theming support, but it at least this time it *has* theme support, so i guess i shouldn't complain that much :)
<ogra> (and it was even ready for breezy, i didnt touch the code through dapper at all)
* highvoltage didn't realise that
<ogra> mdz didnt allow the inclusion ... i was to late in the release cycle
<highvoltage> ogra: how difficult would it be to be able to add a background image, that's stretched to the screen?
<highvoltage> a "wallpaper", in other words.
<ogra> i think LTSPManager will be similar ... should be ready as soon as dapper+1 opens :)
<highvoltage> does dapper+1 have a name yet?
<ogra> i had this before, it eats a lot of bootspeed to render it 
<ogra> nope
<highvoltage> probably not more than a second per thin client?
<ogra> just replace the background.png file with something that fullscreen
<highvoltage> that causes the image to be misplaced, it doesn't fit the screen
<highvoltage> if you change background.png to 1024x768, and open LDM on a 1024x768 screen, the image is more to the top left than it should be
<ogra> hrm
<highvoltage> ogra: have you tried it?
<ogra> not since i changed the image, no
<highvoltage> goodnight, ogra 
<highvoltage> bye Burgwork 
<ogra> night
<salem77> Hello
<ogra> hi
<salem77> I have a question about edubuntu and its filtering software Dansguardian.
<ogra> edubuntu has no particular filtering software ...
<salem77> really?
<ogra> really ...
<salem77> I was told it did
<salem77> Have you heard of Dansguardian?
<ogra> we have packages for dansguardian and squidguard available ...
<salem77> ok
<ogra> but neither is included by default 
<ogra> i'm trying to get willow ready for the october release
<ogra> http://www.digitallumber.com/software/willow/
<ogra> so we'll likely include this then ...
<salem77> My question was reguarding using this as a content filtering for a 30 computer network and whether it would be a viable solution
<ogra> sure
<ogra> currently you only have the choice bretween three apps which are equally good/bad
<salem77> Currently I have all MS 
<ogra> dansguardian and squidguard are pretty similar apps
<ogra> privoxy is a bit easier to handle but less powerfull 
<salem77> So these would allow me to implement a filtering system for the entire network? 
<ogra> yup
<ogra> you just need to force your web traffic through the filter indeed
<salem77> ok sounds like I will consider this. Thanks I am going to read up on these.
<ogra> be sure it will be solved in future releases ... its very high on my todo list ...
<ogra> many people ask for it ...
<Burgwork> ogra, can willow do whitelists?
<ogra> yup
<ogra> white, black and colored ones :)
<salem77> I was just reading up on williow. Sites that are neither "badpages" or "goodpages" are they allowed by default?
<ogra> they will go through the bayesian filter ...
<ogra> (read spam filter)
<ogra> so they dont get in unfiltered ... 
<salem77> ok I am more concerned about blocking. but I don't want to have to add all the allowed pages into "goodpages"
<ogra> thats why willow is so great ...
<ogra> it uses a bayesian filter like a spam filter does ... parses the contents by the spam rules and filters quite intelligent ..
<Burgwork> ogra, so I can have the web browser be only allowed to go a single website? (ie, for a card catalogue for a library)
<ogra> letting it parse one or two bad pages is enough for it to lear
<ogra> *learn
<ogra> Burgwork, should be possible iirc
<ogra> Burgwork, btw, i'm planning a ltsp kiosk mode for dapper +1 ....
<ogra> so you can have a library kiosk out of the box with edubuntu ...
<Burgwork> very cool
<Burgwork> have you looked at sabayon and pessulus?
<ogra> yup
<ogra> but thats something different 
<ogra> i dont want a desktop at all ...
<ogra> a fullscreen running firefox is all you need 
<Burgwork> ah, epiphany has lookdown keys for this
<Burgwork> lockdown
<ogra> yes, but whats not these wont need lockdown ... :)
<ogra> ff fullscreen as session ... and you are done ...
<Burgwork> you can still close FF
<Burgwork> epiphany can prevent that too
<ogra> if its a session this will kill the X server 
<ogra> which in turn will respawn ldm and just start another autologin ... 
<ogra> which brings you back to ff
<Burgwork> GVPL does something similar, but the closing and restarting takes a while
<Burgwork> why not just prevent it entirely?
<ogra> yup, indeed
<ogra> because that requires hacks ...
<Burgwork> hence why you would use epiphany for this
<ogra> ask diziet why we dont have a 50K patch to firefox anbymore in dapper ;)
<Burgwork> hmm?
<ogra> epiphany will require gnome 
<Burgwork> true
<ogra> which i dont want ... 
<ogra> as i said, no desktop at all ... not even installed ...
<Burgwork> ah
<ogra> you'll end up with a 300-500MB system on disk that can serve a whole library ... 
<ogra> runnig without desktop will also gain you a lot lower memory consumption 
<ogra> i think you could use a standard discount PC as server for 20 clients here 
<Burgwork> if you just run epiphany, you pull in the entire gnome stack?
<ogra> yop
<Burgwork> be nice if we could create a epiphany-kiosk binary package
<salem77> What is the difference between the *domain.txt and *url.txt files? 
<ERic_NL> ?me is Newbie
<ERic_NL> i have a problem installing amsn.deb
<ERic_NL> i tried it with the sudo dpkg -i package_file.deb
<Burgwork> and what happened?
<ERic_NL> paste gave failure 2 back
* ERic_NL is newbie
<ERic_NL> isnt there a pakage manager or something with wich i easily can install
<Burgwork> you are best asking in #ubuntu
<Burgwork> that part of edubuntu is the same in ubuntu
<tsurc> does anyone know what the best way would be to try out LDA on Edubuntu::dapper?
<ogra> use ltspfs ltspfsd and lbus and the scripts from ltsp.org
<ogra> we have ltspfs and ltspfsd in dapper, but thats a slightly outdated cvs snapshot
<tsurc> following the instructions from http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtspFS ?
<ogra> yup
<tsurc> thanks
<ogra> i know the devs both use breezy for development ... even if they do their stuff more universal it should work on ubuntu
<mezzapazza> does somebody know what "No matches found, authority file "-" not written" on ltspfs should mean?
<ogra> nope
<mezzapazza> omg.. going crazy
<ogra> if sbalneav doesnt know, nobody will ;) he wrote ltspfs
<ogra> try to catch him 
<mezzapazza> he might be sleeping :)
<ogra> unlikely...
<ogra> he's on US time
<tsurc> Just throwing something in from the back of my mind. Does anyone know if nic bonding on an edubuntu server will help with speed improvements/availability?
<tsurc> has anyone tried this?
<ogra> unlikely its worth the hassle you have with routing ....
<ogra> unless you have switches that support bonding
<ogra> buying a gigabit card and having a switch with one gigabit port for the server is easier :)
<ogra> and not really *this* expensive nowadays
<tsurc> got a 24port10/100 with 2 GBIC the 2 GBIC
<lucasvo_> except you get all the H/W donated
<tsurc> can be configured to do this
<ogra> ah, thats something else ...
<ogra> i once set up a bonding system between two linux machines and it was hell ... 
<ogra> in the end we switched to load balancing via ospf and left the HW layer alone :)
<tsurc> ospf ?
<ogra> but with a supported switch it should work 
<ogra> a routing protocol
<ogra> Open Shortest Path First
<tsurc> kinda makes sense
<ogra> bt as well complicated to set up ...
<ogra> if you have a switch supporting bonding, i'd just try it out 
<tsurc> what would you recommend to balance out booting from 4 ltsp servers all running the same "hardware-addressed" dhcpd.conf.
<ogra> hmm, i never tried that ... 
<ogra> we have a guy in #ltsp who did some stuff with openssi balancing
<ogra> look for neuralis
<tsurc> we rely on the fact that the one with the most load replies to dhcp requests slower........ Yeh right, not always the case.
<tsurc> really need some pretty way of balancing the servers. Like ONE dhcpd server, alternating tftp servers.
<ogra> you will have to script that ...
<tsurc> ye ha.... really looking forward to learning how to do that..... (**bashes head against wall!**)
<tsurc> oh well learning curve just got steeper. the only way is up and all that
<ogra> you start with a pretty complicated setup, what do you expect :)
<tsurc> a little experience with linux....... then i get a job in a school with this. Oooooo fun ;-)
<tsurc> using deb' sarge at the min, but really crave sound and lda. If i get it working i get a pay rise woo hoo
<ogra> sound is working fine in dapper 
<ogra> afaik pere plans to backport these packages to sarge 
<lucasvo_> tsurc: I am installing an ldap server as well for my openxchange, it is quite difficult
<ogra> lucasvo_, he wants load balancing, a high availability solution *and* ldap :)
<lucasvo_> eine eierlegendewollmilchsau
* lucasvo_ too
<ogra> yup
<lucasvo_> and I want a fix ip ;)
<ogra> pay for it ;)
<tsurc> see ya all tomorrow, thanks for your help, everyone. i'll let you know if i get bonding going. wish me luck
<lucasvo_> cu
#edubuntu 2006-03-12
<netdur> hey, what age of students edubuntu traget?
<Burgwork> netdur, elementary is the current sweet spot
<woolbeo> Anyone gotten local apps to work with  ltsp on dapper/breezey?
<netdur> Burgwork: thanks... I have a two questions about edubuntu
<Burgwork> netdur, shoot
<netdur> I may LEGALY pre-configure edubuntu to match local needs AND still call it edubuntu MOROCCAN EDITION?
<Burgwork> hmm, that falls under trademark
<Burgwork> I would email trademark@ubuntu.com
<netdur> I'm planing to email them
<netdur> :)
<netdur> I mean info@canonical.com
<netdur> now no needs for second question
<woolbeo> How do you disable bootsplash for ltsp clients?
<ogra> netdur, what exactly would you need ? probably we can just include it in edubuntu 
<netdur> ogra, can I email you?
<ogra> sure
<netdur> :)
<ogra> ogra@ubuntu.com 
<ogra> but dont expect answer today, its late here, i'll go to bed soon
<netdur> okay wont email you today
<ogra> email whenever you want, just dont expect me to answer immediately today ;)
<netdur> it's okay :)
<JaneW> argh where's netdur gone?
<JaneW> nm...
* JaneW checks timestamps and goes back to e-mails
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<spacey> ogra: ping
<spacey> JaneW: ping
<highvoltage> hi spacey 
<spacey> hi
<spacey> :)
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<JaneW> spacey: pong
<spacey> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HermanBos
<spacey> i'll be running for ubuntu member today :p
<JaneW> spacey: cool :)
<spacey> i hope its enough :P
<JaneW> good luck!
<JaneW> I am sure ogra will vouch for you...
<highvoltage> yes, good luck!
<spacey> thanks
<ogra> JaneW, sure i will :)
<JaneW> ogra: :)
<jsgotangco> ogra, what is happening to \sh?
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: did something happen to him?
<ogra> he has a new job... no idea what happened in the last 4 weeks ...
<jsgotangco> im reading planet
* ogra looks
<highvoltage> hmmm.. why does canonical need 'recent MS Windows experience' for a senior support engineer?
* highvoltage wonders where this original jobspec is posted
<highvoltage> ogra: how gar is \sh from you?
<ogra> about 70km
<jsgotangco> highvoltage, for migration stuff
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: ah, ok. of course.
<jsgotangco> i could actually apply but i dont think i have enough credentials
<ogra> highvoltage, http://www.ubuntu.com/employment
<jsgotangco> im already senior here locally, but for canonical i would only be classified as junior i'd say
<MyISPsuX> morning :)
<MyISPsuX> Is anyone in this room?
<ogra> nope :)
<MyISPsuX> good I hate socializing
<ogra> hehe
<MyISPsuX> :) I have some questions about this distro
<MyISPsuX> I am of course tired of windows again
<MyISPsuX> and am putting ubuntu in my desktop and laptop both
<MyISPsuX> I seen edubunto and thought it would be awesome for my kids
<ogra> yeah :)
<MyISPsuX> I would like most for them to run a live cd, but they want to use tehir firefox books and other small things like that...
<MyISPsuX> Is the best option a USB frive?
<MyISPsuX> drive*
<MyISPsuX> or can it be configured that only one or two directories are writable?
<MyISPsuX> They have great skills at locking stuff up and damaging OS's
<MyISPsuX> any suggestions?
<ogra> the new liveCd has a presisten home option with which you can keep your personal data on a usb stick 
<MyISPsuX> perfect!
<highvoltage> kewl :)
<ogra> but it wont come out before april
<MyISPsuX> thank you sooooo much!
<MyISPsuX> ohhhh :(
<MyISPsuX> damn
<MyISPsuX> lol
<MyISPsuX> They can wait :D
<highvoltage> well, even the older live cd will automount the usb stick, so they could manually drag/save files there.
<ogra> we had no live CD last release ... sorry for that
<highvoltage> oh, right /me was thinking about ubuntu live
<ogra> highvoltage, yes, but that'd be a ubuntu live
<ogra> :)
<MyISPsuX> Well even if I put in an old 10GB hard drive, they could use that with a live?
<MyISPsuX> am I looking at live cd's the wrong way?
<ogra> sure
<MyISPsuX> would it be best to partition 1/2 the drive and leave the second partition writable?
<ogra> the liveCd does everything the normal installed system does as well 
<MyISPsuX> so there is some functionality
<ogra> so if you plug in any removable device, it will get mounted as on the installed version
<MyISPsuX> yes but the shortcut to it would be on the desktop of the live cd even after a reboot?
<ogra> that *could* work, i actually never tried 
<MyISPsuX> I mean once everything is installed, could you make all folders read only?
<MyISPsuX> then they have a single writable folder?
<MyISPsuX> it really needs to be bombproof, they even click popups
<ogra> you can put your children in a separate group that has only write access to one folder, yes
<MyISPsuX> ok, are there many apps that the kids would enjoy on the ISO already?
<ogra> the april release will ship with pessulus, which is a tool to lock down the desktop
* Yagisan waves hello
<ogra> hi Yagisan 
<MyISPsuX> Is there a news or info release on the April release?
<ogra> MyISPsuX, on the ubuntu CD ? not really
<MyISPsuX> edubuntu ?
<MyISPsuX> I already have ubuntu for myself
<ogra> we didnt change much this release .... so the applists yoou can find on www.edubuntu.org still apply
<MyISPsuX> I am just looking for a non-MS option for the kids computer
<MyISPsuX> this is the targetted audience correct?
<ogra> mainly gcompris the tux4kids apps and kdeedu are for the kids ...
<ogra> thats what we ship as our killer apps :)
<ogra> (apart from ltsp which is our server side )
<MyISPsuX> ok I'll be back in a bit with a few more questions gonna keep reading about it
<MyISPsuX> thanks
<ogra> if you want to use edubuntu, please see the EdubuntuInstallNotes on the wiki
<ogra> (since you likely dont want a ltsp server at home :) )
<Yagisan> heh
* highvoltage has two ltsp servers at home :)
<Yagisan> that must make me odd wanting ltsp at home
<highvoltage> Yagisan: i think you are normal. don't listen to ogra :)
<ogra> hehe
* ogra has 4 ltsp servers at home :P
<highvoltage> ogra: you win
<highvoltage> when local apps become better, i want to have a thin client on my TV running mythtv or something similar
<Yagisan> does it count if they are also in vmware or xen ?
<ogra> thats easily done 
<highvoltage> Yagisan: no, i don't think so
<highvoltage> ogra: really? do i install it in chroot and then ssh -X to the local machine?
<ogra> why ssh -X ?
<ogra> if you have it in the chroot, it already runs 
<highvoltage> ogra: i don't know. first thing that popped in my head. i think that's how you do local apps with k12ltsp
<highvoltage> ogra: how would i do it then?
<ogra> its not really ltsp anymore ... but the same way you did it when you apt-get installed ubuntu-desktop in your chroot ...
<ogra> did you say that worked fine ? 
<highvoltage> yep, although i had to break/fix a bunch of other stuff to make it work fine.
<ogra> its just netbooting a client with nfs mounted root :)
<highvoltage> but yes, i could install a full fat client system in the chroot and boot from that
<ogra> you will likely have to tweak the ltsp-client initscript ... but that should be it
<highvoltage> yes, but i want a standard ubuntu ltsp, capable of running local apps!
<highvoltage> reason: just because that would be ultra-cool.
<ogra> thats something for dapper+1 or +2 :)
<highvoltage> yeah, i know :)
<Yagisan> heh - folding@home highvoltage. You can join teamubuntu :)
<ogra> (rather +2, since we'll have to deal with local devices first)
<highvoltage> when edubuntu has local devices, local apps, and nicer LDM themes, no educational distro will be able to compete anymore. mhuhahahahaha
<ogra> hehe
<ogra> dont forget ltsp kiosk mode out of the box :)
<MyISPsuX> ltsp?
<highvoltage> ant that, of course
<highvoltage> MyISPsuX: Linux Terminal Server Project
<highvoltage> MyISPsuX: it allowes you to run diskless thin clients from your edubuntu server
<MyISPsuX> sweet!
<MyISPsuX> hard on the router?
<MyISPsuX> high bandwidth?
<ogra> you can run it fine on a 100Mbit network
<MyISPsuX> So I can steal all the kids' hard drives and give them a measly 3Gb on the server and they boot from LAN ?
<MyISPsuX> that would give me 2TB!!!
<ogra> yup
<MyISPsuX> where is the FAQ on LTSP?
<ogra> heh
<ogra> we are the faq currently ... at least for edubuntu specific sutff :) 
<MyISPsuX> ohh one of those lol
<highvoltage> MyISPsuX: you might need to spend quite a bit of money on controllers to add that much hard disks to your pc 
<ogra> some docs are on wiki.edubuntu.org
<MyISPsuX> LTSP is not on ubuntu?
<MyISPsuX> only ed?
<ogra> its in ubuntu as well
<highvoltage> you can apt-get install it on ubuntu
<ogra> +but edubuntu preinstalls it 
<MyISPsuX> ok
<highvoltage> or fint it in synaptic
<Yagisan> it's in ubuntu. It needs manual set up though
<ogra> and edubuntu does 99% of the setup for you
<MyISPsuX> edubuntu is not a kid's release then?
<MyISPsuX> it is a full fledged server?
<ogra> edubuntu default is a classroom server
<MyISPsuX> I see
<ogra> edubuntu workstation is for home use without the server bits
<MyISPsuX> aimed at institutions
<ogra> the default install, yes ... for home use you can take workstation as install option
<ogra> (as i said, see the EdubuntuInstallNotes wikipage, it explains the variants)
<MyISPsuX> there is one ISO release though correct? I am not downloading the wrong file right? 5.10
<ogra> http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/
<MyISPsuX> which half of April. The first half or the second? ;)
<ogra> thats the current stable release
<highvoltage> MyISPsuX: if this is just for testing, or for your own use, and you feel adventurous, you might also want to try the preview version of the next version (6.04)
<MyISPsuX> ok that is what I am getting :)
<ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/dapper/flight-4/
<MyISPsuX> thank you highvoltage
<ogra> thats the latest milesone snapshot of the dev release
<MyISPsuX> didn't see it was open :)
<MyISPsuX> is it CSV?
<highvoltage> comma seperatet values? :)
<ogra> nope, thats a iso snapshot you can install :)
<MyISPsuX> ok :D
<ogra> the development happens either on the source packages or in bazaar archives in ubuntu/edubuntu/kubuntu
<MyISPsuX> ok, I will avoid the areas lol
<ogra> hee
<ogra> heh
<MyISPsuX> you are running nix now?
<ogra> nix ?
<MyISPsuX> ubuntu?
<JaneW> spacey: is the CC now?
<ogra> i run several edubuntu and ubuntu installs here ...
<ogra> JaneW, just done
<MyISPsuX> what IRC client do you use?
<spacey> JaneW: yup
<JaneW> is that schedule also rotating now?
<ogra> xchat
<MyISPsuX> just so i know what to search for in a few minutes
<highvoltage> MyISPsuX: irssi
<JaneW> Ugh sorry, I thought it was still 8:00UTC
<MyISPsuX> it's burning the ISO now
<spacey> maybe someone here can cheer for me? :P
<JaneW> I mean 20:00UTC
<MyISPsuX> are there DVD burning utilities included?
<MyISPsuX> not authoring but burning like for data?
* mode/#edubuntu [+o ogra]  by ChanServ
<ogra> whoops
* mode/#edubuntu [-o ogra]  by ogra
<highvoltage> ogra: are you running /win 11
<highvoltage> sorry, i'm bad at multitasking
<highvoltage> ogra: are you running edubuntu on your ibook?
<iGotNoTime> XP froze again :):):)
<ogra> highvoltage, on the test partition, yes
<iGotNoTime> I logged back in to tell you that I appreciate the advice and answers this morning
<iGotNoTime> >>>> is  <MyISPSux>
<ogra> iGotNoTime, youre welcome :)
<iGotNoTime> ohhh one more question...
<iGotNoTime> I have about 1.6 TB of Windows partitioned media files
<iGotNoTime> can it read my partition?
<iGotNoTime> will I have write access or read only?
<ogra> depends on the format 
<iGotNoTime> NTSF
<ogra> ntfs isnt safe to write to iirc (no windows around to confirm that)
<ogra> but reading will work in any case
<iGotNoTime> right
<iGotNoTime> this is how I have so much space, everytime I install Linux I have to buy a bog drive to keep from losing my files while shuffling files and partitioning lol
<iGotNoTime> big drive***
<ogra> heh
<iGotNoTime> the last question when the computer froze was about dvd burning utility being included
<iGotNoTime> is there?
<ogra> sure
<Yagisan> write works, but I'm not sure how well at the moment
<iGotNoTime> cool
<Yagisan> have a backup ?
<ogra> the file manager has dvd writing capabilitys on its own ... and you have about 10 additional CD writing apps you can coose if that doesnt suffice
<iGotNoTime> do any support Lightscribe yet?
<iGotNoTime> I know now it is demanding LOL
<iGotNoTime> no big deal if not
<Yagisan> I haven't tested write for a while, but it seemed ok when I last tried with w2k. But that was a longtime ago
<highvoltage> gtg, bye!
<iGotNoTime> bye :)
<iGotNoTime> I know you guys are more apt for edubunto than ubuntu, but in reality they have same engine correct. I mean just different software packaged with it?
<iGotNoTime> one is not...m... say more powerful than the other?
<ogra> nope
<iGotNoTime> ok then
<ogra> we include the edu apps and tweaked the installer to set up the ltsp server for you... but the base is the same
<iGotNoTime> no problem :)
<iGotNoTime> I choose this one then :D:D
<ogra> heh :)
<ogra> good choice 
<ogra> (not that i'm biased)
<iGotNoTime> hehe
<iGotNoTime> small community in here right now. When I need tech support I will goto #ubuntu and tell them that is what I run :D
<ogra> hehe
<ogra> but with specific probs, just come here 
<iGotNoTime> kk burning image now :)
<iGotNoTime> crimsun are you new here?
<crimsun> iGotNoTime: no
<iGotNoTime> I am
<crimsun> welcome
<iGotNoTime> haha
<iGotNoTime> I was just being obnoxious :P
<iGotNoTime> I am done
<ogra> JaneW, hey, grab your pompoms and your miniskirt and cheer up for spacey 
<spacey> :>
<jsgotangco> err pompoms would do
<ogra> heh
<ogra> jsgotangco, thats only half the fun :)
<iGotNoTime> So ogra are you one of the developers?
<ogra> yup
<iGotNoTime> It's nice to see someone so eager about their work :)
<iGotNoTime> Can I ask why there is no profit involved?
<iGotNoTime> I mean even the most humble distros have a for profit enterprise version
<ogra> because we have a rich guy paying for all this :)
<iGotNoTime> haha
<iGotNoTime> good heart
<iGotNoTime> not for me but for the kids that will benefit from it
<ogra> but apart from this the aim of canonical (the company behind ubuntu/kubuntu/edubuntu) is to earn money with support and customization
<iGotNoTime> so you are looking to do custom in house installs in elementary schools for example?
<ogra> nah
<ogra> offering customization of the distro for specific use and get paied for it 
<iGotNoTime> you compiling custom versions for organizations then
<iGotNoTime> ahhh
<iGotNoTime> ok
<ogra> i.e. you might have read about goobuntu 
<Yagisan> of course. I like that idea too ;) (well, support anyway. One day I should ask what escallation rates are)
<ogra> the ubuntu version google uses for theor desktops
<Yagisan> yes, it doesn't offically exist - so it must be widely deployed
<ogra> if they had needed it, the could have bought the customization of the iso from us...
<ogra> Yagisan, they use it internally only
<Yagisan> yep. Thought so.
<Yagisan> ogra: you're escallation rates. They are cheaper right ?
<ogra> iGotNoTime, to be honest distros like suse or redhat dont earn their money through the enterprise licenses ... they earn from the support they sell around these licenses
<iGotNoTime> I didn't know that Suse did too, but I JUST learned that about Redhat yesterday
<ogra> so we just offer the support without having a separate proprietary product
<iGotNoTime> I thought it was from shares of the books that include their disc
<iGotNoTime> I was very wrong when I seen subscription rates to support forums
<iGotNoTime> at least one of the Official Forums
<ogra> the public forums are normally free in all distros ...
<ogra> the specific support for customers isnt run through forums ...
<iGotNoTime> hmmmm
<iGotNoTime> I assumed the support service was to the forum
<iGotNoTime> wrong again :)
<ogra> at least not the paied one 
<Yagisan> no. That is for freebies.
<iGotNoTime> Edubuntu has a GUI for searching and finding apps to install or do I have to use a command line?
<ogra> synaptic is installed for searching and installing apps
<iGotNoTime> Like Xandros and Mepis....
<iGotNoTime> nevermind
<iGotNoTime> good
<iGotNoTime> you guys have all bases covered!
<ogra> additionally you have an easier tool directly in the main menu
<iGotNoTime> burning my last lightscribe label now :P
<ogra> :)
<Yagisan> Night all
<ogra> ciao Yagisan 
<iGotNoTime> Hopefully see you all soon, running the install now :)
<iGotNoTime> wish me luck
<JaneW> sorry guys I had to do the school run...
<spacey> JaneW: i'm ubuntu member now \o/
<JaneW> spacey: w00t. well done :)))
<JaneW> you didn;t even need my pom-poms ;)
<spacey> :)
<spacey> hehe
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<iGotNoTime> ogra you have a moment?
* highvoltage has one, if that counts
<iGotNoTime> good enough :P
<highvoltage> :)
<iGotNoTime> I installed and rebooted
<iGotNoTime> everything started normally
<iGotNoTime> then black screen 
<iGotNoTime> but had sound effects
<iGotNoTime> I did the diagnostic safe start
<iGotNoTime> same result
<iGotNoTime> I reinstalled
<iGotNoTime> same thing
<iGotNoTime> 3 hours now
<iGotNoTime> finally I figure out that it does not support dual video cards LOL
<highvoltage> when does it show a black screen? when the login manager comes up? or before that?
<iGotNoTime> Grub uses one card but Edubuntu uses another
<iGotNoTime> yes for anything that reads Edubuntu
<iGotNoTime> anything prior to the initialization is on the other card though
<iGotNoTime> amusing waste of time
<iGotNoTime> I laughed when I figured it out
<ogra> Grub takes whats defined in your BIOS iirc :)
<iGotNoTime> feeling very dumb for the second install now :D
<highvoltage> ok. is it sorter out now?
<iGotNoTime> it's ok Edubuntu uses the better MSI card :)
<ogra> heh :)
<iGotNoTime> yes excellent choice I am happy so far :)
<highvoltage> s/sorter/sorted
<iGotNoTime> looks very good default
<ogra> great to hear that :)
<iGotNoTime> filing me away?
<iGotNoTime> :D
<iGotNoTime> anyway just wanted to tell you guys thanks again for all the help and questions you answered
<ogra> highvoltage, i found the bug the sshkey copying ... 
<ogra> will be solved before flight5
<highvoltage> kewl :)
<highvoltage> was it because ssh wasn't started at install time?
<ogra> yup
<ogra> mdz used ssh-keyscan for creating the keys on the client ...
<highvoltage> ah. how do you fix it, by temporarily starting ssh while installing?
<ogra> but ssh-keyscan asks the ssh server 
<ogra> which cant respond if its not running :)
<ogra> just grepping the key names from /etc/ssh/sshd_config, and cat >> them into /opt/ltsp/powerpc/etc/ssh/ssh_known_hosts
<ogra> the only tricky bit is to get the ip into the key ... i need to cat them twoce and replace hostname with ip
<ogra> *twice
<highvoltage> ok
<iGotNoTime> Ok two simple questions shoudl have me set until tonight....
<iGotNoTime> first what is ubuntu based on? The engine itself
<highvoltage> engine?
<highvoltage> that would probably be the linux kernel.
<iGotNoTime> I mean for downloading programs what distro should I download for?
<highvoltage> Ubuntu.
<ogra> just use synaptic :)
<highvoltage> most programs should be available in the ubuntu universe.
<iGotNoTime> ok then :)
<iGotNoTime> I am not one to compile :P
<ogra> if you eanble all software sources you get access to ~17000 software packages
<iGotNoTime> last question for you guys...
<highvoltage> that's a good thing, ubuntu isn't built for compiling your own stuff all over the place.
<iGotNoTime> I have 6 drives in my case plugged in and identified in bios
<highvoltage> synaptic is your friend :)
<iGotNoTime> but only one seems mounted
<highvoltage> what do you see in /media?
<iGotNoTime> I do not want to change the file structure quite yet as they are full
<iGotNoTime> that was my question I will check there
<iGotNoTime> 2 cdroms 3 USB
<iGotNoTime> 1 is USB
<iGotNoTime> the  others I assume is the flash media reader
<iGotNoTime> I have one optical but no HDD are listed
<highvoltage> you can also type cat /proc/partitions from a terminal window to see which partitions are detected on your disks
<iGotNoTime> in filesystem/dev/ I see them I think
<ogra> iGotNoTime, ubuntu doesnt just mount drives by default ... you might have confidential data on anouther partition ...
<iGotNoTime> but there is a red X
<iGotNoTime> understandable :)
<ogra> it mounts all removable media automagically
<iGotNoTime> so is that a terminal command?
<iGotNoTime> to mount I mean
<ogra> but harddisks are untouched and its up to you to include them 
<ogra> add them to fstab
<iGotNoTime> I better just go find some documentation :D
<ogra> http://doc.ubuntu.com/
<iGotNoTime> thank you :)
<highvoltage> afair, if you double-click on a mount point in /media, it mounts that volume automatically
<ogra> for the system underneath you can apply all docs from theer to edubuntu as well
<iGotNoTime> system underneath?
<ogra> underneath the desktop :)
<iGotNoTime> the problem is the drive are not listed in media either
<iGotNoTime> ok
<ogra> http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/desktopguide/C/ch04s02.html
<ogra> just list them there ;)
<iGotNoTime> exact page I am on :)
<iGotNoTime> ok that is what you guys explained
<iGotNoTime> what I mean is there is only 2 valid drives in the Media location
<iGotNoTime> the other three are showing as blank (I assume it is for my media cards)
<ogra> the installer creates the media directory 
<ogra> as i said, it wont touch random devices :)
<ogra> so look which partitions are there and create directorys for them in /media
<ogra> then add mountpoints as described to fstab
<iGotNoTime> ok I misunderstood you, I am sorry :D
<iGotNoTime> gotcha now :)
<ogra> :)
<iGotNoTime> ok it says there is no way to use root, yet to edit the fstab you have to be logged in as root. What did I miss?
<iGotNoTime> only SUDO
<iGotNoTime> can't even edit with NANO
<highvoltage> you don't need to login as root
<highvoltage> sudo works, try it
<highvoltage> $sudo vi /etc/fstab
<highvoltage> or $sudo nano /etc/fstab
<iGotNoTime> vi is what i was missing then
<highvoltage> "sudo command" has the same effect as "command" with root
<highvoltage> it will ask you for a password, this is your own password.
<iGotNoTime> this command line thing is tough for me, that is why I look for GUI distros
<iGotNoTime> thank you for the explanation
<highvoltage> you could use gui too
<highvoltage> sorry, i tend to explain command line because that's what i'm used to
<iGotNoTime> if I could enable SUDO full time for my account?
<highvoltage> you could also press ctrl+f2, then type:
<highvoltage> gksudo "gedit /etc/fstab"
<highvoltage> that will give you a graphical editor
<iGotNoTime> very very cool
<iGotNoTime> can all commands automatically be started that way in a config file while I am learning yet?
<highvoltage> what do you mean?
<iGotNoTime> so that when I click any file to open, it automatically will open the file all SUDOed up
<highvoltage> there are ways to do that, but i wouldn't recomend it.
<iGotNoTime> you know so that I get to reinstall every week after messing it up, that'll learn me quick
<iGotNoTime> LOL
<highvoltage> you can badly mangle your system accidentally.
<highvoltage> while learning, that might be more like a few times a day, if you're sudo-root permanently
<iGotNoTime> haha
<highvoltage> you can type 'man sudoers' at the command line for help on configuring sudo
<highvoltage> but i suggest you keep it like it is.
<highvoltage> you don't want to learn bad habbits, do you?
<highvoltage> it's best to learn the right way from the beginning.
<iGotNoTime> yes I agree
<iGotNoTime> I want Linux long term this time
<iGotNoTime> I have never run it more than 10 months at a time yet
<highvoltage> it's best to make a gradual change. it took me quite a while to move over.
<highvoltage> i dual booted for more than a year
<iGotNoTime> yes that dual boot option is nice, I can keep Dreamweaver until Nvu is up to par with what I like :)
<highvoltage> Dreamweaver? Nvu? those are very old-fasioned.
<highvoltage> I prefer vim myself :)
<highvoltage> quanta is quite nice too.
<iGotNoTime> both linux?
<iGotNoTime> See I have alot of reading to do :D:D
<highvoltage> vim and quanta is on linux yes.
<highvoltage> quanta is in universe
<iGotNoTime> open source or commercial?
<highvoltage> open source
<highvoltage> open source and commercial aren't mutually exclusive concepts, either ;)
<iGotNoTime> right
<iGotNoTime> but for the most part
<iGotNoTime> :)
<iGotNoTime> ok I added this drive to the fstab, rebooted (don't know if that was needed) and then went to the location I specified in fstab in Media and it is not showing. I checked the fstab to make sure it saved properly and it is there. Is there a second step to mounting?
<highvoltage> what's the line you added to fstab?
<highvoltage> brb
<iGotNoTime> /dev/hdg1	/media/HDD	auto	rw,user,noauto	0	0
<iGotNoTime> no rush I know you all have work to do too :)
<ogra> iGotNoTime, btw: alt-f2, then enter: gksudo "gedit /etc/fstab/" and hit enter
<ogra> that saves you from the commandline ;)
<iGotNoTime> yes he told me and that is what i did :)
<iGotNoTime> just as fast as terminal though I think
<highvoltage> iGotNoTime: does /media/HDD exist as a directory?
<iGotNoTime> no I can not add anything in there
<iGotNoTime> I thought by 'mounting' it would create
<ogra> oh, sorry, didnt see that ... just came back from dinner :)
<iGotNoTime> I right click in that directory but no create option at all
<iGotNoTime> am I making you guys angry?
<ogra> sure, you need sudo priveleges ...
<highvoltage> iGotNoTime: you'll need sudo to add it in /media
<ogra> nah
<ogra> why should you make us angry =
<ogra> ?
<highvoltage> iGotNoTime: not at all :) sorry, busy with other things too
<iGotNoTime> If it is the same as ubuntu I can ask in the bigger channel :)
<iGotNoTime> then no babysitting  lol
<highvoltage> iGotNoTime: i'm fine with here too, i'm sure ogra is too :)
<iGotNoTime> ok :)
<ogra> i fear this time you wont get around using the commandline to create the directory in media :)
<ogra> sudo mkdir /media/dir_name_you_want
<iGotNoTime> kk
<highvoltage> how about alt+f2, gksudo "mkdir /media/HDD" ? :)
<ogra> sure
<ogra> but if you get an error you wont see it ;)
<highvoltage> red hat used to have a root nautilus browser (don't know if they still do). i'm glad ubuntu didn't go that way.
<ogra> yeah, running file managers as root is evil evil evil ...
<iGotNoTime> ok haha
<iGotNoTime> the directory is now there
<iGotNoTime> but empty
<iGotNoTime> do I need to log out or reboot?
<ogra> look if it shows up in the computer location in the filemanager
<highvoltage> iGotNoTime: you will probably need to do a sudo mount /media/HDD now
<ogra> (it will if everything is right ... i.e. fstab entry is right and directory is there)
<highvoltage> iGotNoTime: a reboot isn't necassary
<iGotNoTime> invalid permissions to view contents it says
<ogra> how did your fstab line look ? 
<iGotNoTime> you have to mount with SUDO too?
<ogra> can you paste it here ? 
<iGotNoTime> fsttab doesn't do that?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> it does that with the right options
<ogra> thats why i'm asking for the line
<iGotNoTime> /dev/hdg1	/media/HDD	auto	rw,user,noauto	0	0
<ogra> that should do it ...
<iGotNoTime> I copied the line form the USB drive
<ogra> ls -l /media
<ogra> ah, moment
<ogra> /dev/hdg1 /media/HDD ntfs umask=0222,user,noauto 0 0
<ogra> try that one ...
<iGotNoTime> damn I was wayyyyy off
<ogra> yours is fine 
<ogra> i'm just not sure if auto is able to detect ntfs 
<ogra> and the umask is needed for the permission issue
<iGotNoTime> ok
<iGotNoTime> so umask is in the options tab?
<ogra> yes
<iGotNoTime> well now the icon changed from the yellow folder for HDD to one with a red X
<ogra> you didnt make the change while it was mounted i hope 
<ogra> else: sudo umount /dev/hdg1 
<ogra> and then check again
<iGotNoTime> probably so
<iGotNoTime> will try again
<iGotNoTime> no I didn't mount
<iGotNoTime> did not
<iGotNoTime> did now
<highvoltage> goodnight, #edubunty
<highvoltage> s/#edubunty/#edubuntu
<iGotNoTime> the red X is gone
<ogra> doubleclick it
<iGotNoTime> folder is empty yet, but I clicked Disks Manager
<iGotNoTime> can you mount from there?
<iGotNoTime> or only partition?
<ogra> you can try ... i actually never used it :)
<iGotNoTime> I am sorry
<iGotNoTime> it worked!
<iGotNoTime> My mistake
<iGotNoTime> I was saying the folder /media/HDD was empty
<iGotNoTime> i didn't look in the computer
<ogra> yup
<iGotNoTime> all files :D
<iGotNoTime> I learned how to mount!
<iGotNoTime> I need to go mount the other 5 before I forget how
<ogra> and there should be an icon on your desktop
<iGotNoTime> There is!!!!
<ogra> you can unmount it by right clicking :)
<iGotNoTime> thank you thank you thank you
<iGotNoTime> brb :D
<iGotNoTime> Wow I am pretty embarassed seeing that I am the only noob in here asking questions all day long. :)
<iGotNoTime> At the top right of my desktop it says there are 69 updates available, are these automatic?
<ogra> click the icon ;)
<iGotNoTime> yes all are safe though?
<iGotNoTime> not beta?
<ogra> you used the release CD ?
<ogra> or the flight4 CD ?
<iGotNoTime> downloaded ISO
<iGotNoTime> 5.10
<ogra> yup, then its fine 
<iGotNoTime> ok :)
<ogra> if you had used flight4 i'd have told you to check each package and its changes first :)
<ogra> the 69 updates in the stable system are security fixes  ....
<iGotNoTime> just changed to 73 :P
<iGotNoTime> I am mor confident now :)
<iGotNoTime> ogra do you by chance remember the name/s of the Nvu comparable software that voltage mentioned?
<ogra> nope, but the channel is logged :) http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs/
<iGotNoTime> good because I hadn't started logging until an hour ago :) 
<iGotNoTime> lucky :P
<iGotNoTime> I am cheap so all AMD :(
#edubuntu 2007-03-05
<kejava> Hi, is the most recent version of Edubuntu using LTSP 5 (Muekow) ?
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> kejava: basically
<LaserJock> kejava: you might ask #ltsp for sure
<kejava> how are the lts.conf parameters working for you, if at all?  i just tested an LTSP-5 install.  looks like not many of the lts.conf parameters work normally anymore.
<LaserJock> I think it's supposed to be mostly automatic
<kejava> yeah, that's what I've found.  the install doesn't even include a default lts.conf file.
<kejava> i need it for some odd, old setups.
<kejava> LaserJock, i'm coming from LTSP-4.2.  how is LTSP-5 working for you so far?
<LaserJock> I don't use LTSP so I don't have an answer
<kejava> oh yeah, sorry.  guess you don't have to use ltsp to use edubuntu ;-)
<LaserJock> :-)
<LaserJock> I haven't had an occasion to set up an LTSP server yet
<LaserJock> though I'd like to at the uni
<kejava> it's not too tough.  i'm testing out LTSP-5 with two laptops and a cross over cable.  so far LTSP-5 looks very nice.  i just have to get the sound server working and local devices.
<Neronious> hello, i am trying to install edubuntu 6.10 on a fairly old laptop and it will not do the "building LTSP chroot..." is it possable to fix by going to 6.06? or am i just using a too old computer, or can i live without the LTSP? but dosnt that mean i cant use apt-get?
<LaserJock> LTSP doesn't have anything to do with apt-get
<Neronious> musta read something wrong. meh o well but when it says there an error and i skip it will it come back to haunt me in some way? or even let me finish the installation?
<LaserJock> I think it'll let you continue
<Neronious> thank you
* TeePOG greets everyone
* Starting logfile irclogs/edubuntu.log
<stgraber> morning
<cbx33> hello everybody
<cbx33> <hi doctor cbx33>
<jsgotangco> hmm?
<cbx33> soirry
<cbx33> simpsons quote
<jsgotangco> ahh
<cliebow_> anyone have suggestions for errant sony laptop in which 2.6.20.9 wont load beyond recognit\ion of "scsi" memory stick..from another kernel seen as usb device..cant use modprobe.d/blacklist to exclude a module
<bddebian> Heya
<cbx33> ping ogra
<sbalneav> Morning all
<bddebian> Heya sbalneav
<LaserJock> hi Scotty
<sbalneav> Hey bddebian & LaserJock
<Petaris> Hi all
<Petaris> anyone know what if any fix there is for the new US DST rules going into effect on Sunday?
<Petaris> Do I just have to manually change the time on the server?
<chin1> can you setup edubuntu to send snmp statisctics about the client to the server?
<sbalneav> Petaris: No, if you've been doing your updates, it will just work
<LaserJock> Petaris: I believe updates have been sent out to 6.06 and 6.10
<sbalneav> timezone files have been updated for some time.
<Petaris> LaserJock: is there a way to see which version I am running?
<Petaris> i think it is 6.06 but I can't remember
<Petaris> sbalneav: I don't remember seeing an update for it but I might have missed it in the list
<LaserJock> I think the package is something like tzdata
<Petaris> ok
<Petaris> I will look
<sbalneav> yup, tzdata
<Petaris> sbalneav: I can't find the tzdata package in synaptic
<sbalneav> dpkg -l | grep tzdata
<sbalneav> you've already got it
<Petaris> sbalneav: I did another test I found and its right anyway
<Petaris> zdump -v /etc/localtime | grep 2007
<Petaris> Thanks gusy
<Petaris> er, guys
* Starting logfile irclogs/edubuntu.log
<cbx33> cliebow, there must be a hidden secret option we havn't found yet
* LaserJock whips out his "Hacker Spells, Potions, and Incantations" book
<cliebow> Yessir...
<zch> hi
<zch> ogra: what is the current state of ltsp-manager?
#edubuntu 2007-03-06
<yotux> what can I do to help edubuntu?  Seems that the wiki has alot missing documentation
<LaserJock> yotux: what kinds of things are you interested in, in general?
<yotux> LaserJock:  I like working with wireless networks and helping other find solutions that work for them with open source.
<yotux> What I feel the need to do is give back to the community that allows me to use software that is stable and meeting my needs
<LaserJock> that's cool
<yotux> I have join a loco team
<LaserJock> well, we always need testing, advocacy, and support
<yotux> At the current time I am attending college for Computer Science.  Thus term I am learning java
<LaserJock> yotux: have you tried out the Herd 5 Edubuntu release?
<yotux> Not yet I was thinking about it
<LaserJock> that really would be helpful
<yotux> I did some testing and using of kubuntu and found a small bug
<yotux> I have a launch pad account
<LaserJock> it's harder for Edubuntu to get testers I think
<yotux> For me I need a mix of a system that is some what stable to make my gf happy
<yotux> could I test herd five via vmware server?
<LaserJock> yes
<yotux> For me I have bounced between distro a little bit
<yotux> like slackware a little
<LaserJock> obviously some of the hardware testing won't work right
<LaserJock> but vmware is perfectly fine for software testing
<yotux> ok
<yotux> I am upgrading edubuntu to edgy right now
<yotux> for me my system is laid out with 4 partitions.  they are /, /home, /usr/local/ ,and /ent -- for music and what not
<yotux> so I have the room to store and keep things separate.
<LaserJock> ok
<yotux> Strange to ask, but what is testing of herd five
<yotux> is that just using it an seeing what doesn't work?
<LaserJock> basically yes
<yotux> I would like to learn how to package but the packaging manual scares me to a degree
<LaserJock> which packaging manual?
<yotux> I have been a newbie user to long
<yotux> The one for ubuntu.  I think I printed it from Ubutnu Documentation something or another
<yotux> link https://help.ubuntu.com/
<yotux> where can I find a herd 5 release?
<LaserJock> cdimages.ubuntu.com
<yotux> thanks
<yotux> after the upgrade I will install vmware and start playing with fiesty :)
<kenthomson> Hello!
<ajmitch> hi
<kenthomson> I want to know the complete process of setting up a LTSP-ed lab, with one server, and 10-thin-clients. I don't know much about hardware/linux. But i love ubuntu enough, and am ambitious/enthusiastic enough to go about this project alone. Can some of you tell me the keywords/websites/other-useful things, that i will have to research to accomplish this project? And the main things required? And is it really complex?
<kenthomson> Anyone...?
<TeePOG> kenthomson: that's not a simple answer
<TeePOG> and most ppl here aren't even at work yet, their PCs are just idling online
<TeePOG> but stick around
<LaserJock> kenthomson: do you have any hardware already?
<kenthomson> LaserJock, alteast some is awake sorry for the dealy
<kenthomson> LaserJock, none at all
<kenthomson> LaserJock, i am going to purchase all of that
<kenthomson> *-someone in the first reply
<kenthomson> Helooo...Helooooo....Anybody-there......?--(echo)--..---((echo))---...----(((echo)))----......-----(((((echo)))))-----.......
<TeePOG> one thing you should not skimp on, is your network switches ... make a massive difference
<kenthomson> TeePOG, go one i am listening
<kenthomson> *on
<TeePOG> well, not much more to tell ... your thin clients can be commodity hardware, pII or so
<kenthomson> right
<TeePOG> harddrives not necessary
<TeePOG> a server with 2GB of RAM and a P4-level CPU can handle ~30clients
<TeePOG> LaserJock: correct me if i'm wrong
<kenthomson> TeePOG, may i have a web-source/keywords/list-of-important things to consider while i go about researching for this project? maybe web-sites/google-keywords, anything? What brand hardware is supported by OS community? Intel/AMD, nvidia/ATi, soundcard, netwrok_switched/ D_link/pthers. Anything
<kenthomson> TeePOG, i don't think he is here
<TeePOG> kenthomson: these are many of the developers of edubuntu ... meaning that they are actually at work on this thing, right now
<TeePOG> haste will bvring you nowhere, but there's no better place for help than here
<kenthomson> TeePOG, i shall wait, but is there anything you gottu say, in-terms of resources?
<TeePOG> i'm looking atm ... i'm not using ltsp on ubuntu, i've got a fat-client lab, so i need to check for these things myself
<kenthomson> TeePOG, i can wait
<TeePOG> http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/articles/linux_terminal_server
<kenthomson> TeePOG, i studied that case-study long back and that is what inspired me to go about this!
<TeePOG> indeed
<TeePOG> ... what more do you need?
<TeePOG> http://www.edubuntu.org/GettingStarted
<TeePOG> http://www.mail-archive.com/edubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com/msg00114.html
<TeePOG> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/LTSPFatClients
<LaserJock> well, I think TeePOG is right
<LaserJock> making sure you have good network connections is important
<LaserJock> because you are going to have a lot of traffic
<TeePOG> i mean, we can't really offer more help until you have more specific questions, ie. busy with the installation..
<LaserJock> thin clients can be pretty much anything that is network-bootable (PXE or etherboot)
<TeePOG> i will add a couple things though
<kenthomson> LaserJock, ok
<TeePOG> 1. make sure your network cabling is done professionally
<TeePOG> or you WILL have weird issues with clients not connecting / disconnecting
<kenthomson> LaserJock, i want to support 10 thin clients, could you tell me the hardware configuration for the server.?
<kenthomson> TeePOG, ok
<LaserJock> kenthomson: that sort of depends on what you want to run on the clients
<TeePOG> 2. if you want video playback on the clients, make sure you have a gigabit ethernet NIC on the server, a full-duplex gigabit-ethernet switch, and 100mbit on the clients ... that way, each client has the full 100mbit to/from the server
<kenthomson> LaserJock, the thin clients are going to be mainly used to tutor extremely young kids <15years. They will run things like basic_word_processing, simple-games, drawing apps, nothing ever hardware intensive
<TeePOG> that case study link i pasted, actually has a pretty good spec listing already kenthomson
<kenthomson> TeePOG, i know, i know
<LaserJock> kenthomson: I think you'll want something around 1GB of RAM
<kenthomson> LaserJock, go on...
<LaserJock> probably at least a 2GHz processor
<TeePOG> indeed ... i find the core 2 duos handle very well
<LaserJock> and a gigabit ethernet network
<kenthomson> LaserJock, and what for the thin-clients?
<TeePOG> half a TB or disk should give you enough disk space for scalability
<LaserJock> something > 533MHz
<LaserJock> doesn't need a lot of RAM
<kenthomson> LaserJock, i am looking for figures
<TeePOG> i find 64MB RAM is more than enough
<TeePOG> pII-level CPU ~300MHz or more
<LaserJock> kenthomson: and just make sure the thin clients are network-bootable
<kenthomson> LaserJock, i would like to repeat a few things i said above, in-case you missed; I want to know the complete process of setting up a LTSP-ed lab, with one server, and 10-thin-clients. I don't know much about hardware/linux. But i love ubuntu enough, and am ambitious/enthusiastic enough to go about this project alone. Can some of you tell me the keywords/websites/other-useful things, that i will have to research to accomplish this project? And the m
<kenthomson> ain things required? And is it really complex?  may i have a web-source/keywords/list-of-important things to consider while i go about researching for this project? maybe web-sites/google-keywords, anything? What brand hardware is supported by OS community? Intel/AMD, nvidia/ATi, soundcard, netwrok_switched/ D_link/pthers. Anything...?
<TeePOG> http://doc.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/handbook/C/ltsp-hw.html
<TeePOG> 1. your 3d-acceleration won't work, so don't bother about which graphics
<kenthomson> TeePOG, thanks! you have been really kind
<LaserJock> kenthomson: we gave you hardware requirements
<kenthomson> LaserJock, right!
<LaserJock> kenthomson: now you just need to install Edubuntu :-)
<TeePOG> 2. sound might or might not work, so disregard sound ... anyway, most soundcards these days are the AC'976 chipset anyway
<kenthomson> LaserJock, and ofcourse purchase all that, i will have to look for motherboards/thier-chipsets, netwrok swtiches, a lot before you say that...
<kenthomson> anything i should particularly avoid?
<kenthomson> TeePOG, you have my full attention go on..
<TeePOG> not much else to say kenthomson
<LaserJock> kenthomson: you really should test it out before buying all that
<LaserJock> kenthomson: you can try it on two machines
<kenthomson> LaserJock, as in...? I am going to assemble all this.
<TeePOG> LCD screens tend to be misdetected, so be prepared to do some xorg.conf hacking
<kenthomson> TeePOG, ok
<TeePOG> or use CRTs
<LaserJock> kenthomson: install Edubuntu on a machine to act as the server
<LaserJock> kenthomson: then run a crossover cable to some other machine
<kenthomson> LaserJock, ok so a simple client-server 1:1 first?
<LaserJock> it can play the thin client
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> you are talking about a lot of money for a server and 10 clients + networking
<LaserJock> you should test it out first to make sure you know what you're doing
<kenthomson> LaserJock, right!
<TeePOG> any machine these days will be able to be a thin client
<kenthomson> LaserJock, TeePOG, any other advice before i tap into the promises that google holds?
<LaserJock> at the Paris summit we used a laptop for the server
<LaserJock> and just ran a ethernet cable to a thin client
<LaserJock> was really easy and cool
<TeePOG> erm kenthomson... it's kind of assumed that you google before you ask on IRC... so, no. have fun and ask here if there's anything else
<LaserJock> kenthomson: make sure to read the Edubuntu documentation and perhaps get on the edubuntu-users mailing list
<kenthomson> LaserJock, TeePOG so long! Its been enlightening. I have got a week's time to do all the research and hardware purchasing and i need a lab ready in 15 days, hope i can make it to the deadline. But you see, i am largely uninformed about LTSP, always used fat-clients. Lets hope everything goes OK.
<TeePOG> indeed
<LaserJock> good luk
<TeePOG> good luck
<kenthomson> Thank you!
<TeePOG> dang
<TeePOG> bbl, ciao
<cbx33> ping ogra
<cbx33> question about GSoC
<steven43126> Im trying to get tftpd working for pxelinux boot, i can't seem to get access to any files in the directory? im starting tftpd from inetd with options -p -s /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386
<steven43126> im out of ideas on how to get this working, using a tftp client i can connect, but get requets just time out?
<ogra> cbx33, pong
<ogra> steven43126, if you had used the ltsp-server-standalone package it would have set that up for you
<ogra> steven43126, the line should be: tftp           dgram   udp     wait    root  /usr/sbin/in.tftpd /usr/sbin/in.tft
<ogra> pd -s /var/lib/tftpboot
<cliebow_> ogra: any way to ignore  a memory stick booting 2.6.20? hangs loading of os..
<steven43126> orga, it was but i changed to see if i could solve my problems
<cliebow_> ogra: any way to ignore  a memory stick when booting 2.6.20? hangs loading of os..
<ogra> no idea, unplug it ?
<cliebow_> it is integral.
<cliebow_> shows asd a usb device from 2.6.17
<steven43126> cliebow_, ernel options to disable usb ?
<cliebow_> so modprobe.d/blacklist wont heklp
<ogra> right, try the bios, even though it might not help ...
<cliebow_> nothing in the bios 8~(
<cliebow_> feisty works ok with 2.6.17 but
<ogra> first of all file a bug ... either on kernel or on udev ...
<cliebow_> k
<ogra> either is responsible
<cliebow_> ill try thaat again
<ogra> steven43126, so what exactly did you do until now ? you installed the ltsp-server-standalone package and ran ltsp-build-client ?
<cliebow_> steven43126, what is your filename statement?
<steven43126> lol nevermind, i figured out the problem
<steven43126> No network card! for some reason ubuntu has suddenly stopped finding the ethernet adapter (running under vmware) Boy do i feel stupid
<ogra> ouch :)
<steven43126> tftp client looks like it connects but reading the docs it does not actually connect untill you issue a get DOH!
<ogra> right ... it works like ftp
<jsgotangco> hello
<steven43126> it's deceptice in tftp client if you trype status it shows you connected: 192.168.0.200, but it's not it's just where it will connect to when a get is issued lol
<cbx33> ogra: can i pm you?
<ogra> sure
<sbalneav> Morning all
<a5benwillis> morning
<cbx33> ogra got two secs for a really easy question
<cbx33> hey sbalneav
<cbx33> maybe you know.... :)
<cbx33> it's not c   just C
<cbx33> if I define an array
<cbx33> like this static GOptionEntry *entries
<cbx33> and then i want to use it
<cbx33> entries[]  = {5,6,7}
<cbx33> like that
<cbx33> it doesn't work
<cbx33> but I can do
<cbx33> static int test
<cbx33> and then
<cbx33> test = 5
<cbx33> so how do i do it with an array
<cbx33> i don't want to create a new array like this.... static GOptionEntry entries[]  = {3,4,5}
<cbx33> which does work...
<cbx33> but I can't do it that way
<sbalneav> Well, you can't use the original define as a *entries, because that's just a pointer to a GOptionEntry type.
<sbalneav> So, no storage has been allocated to the bits you'll want to store.
<cbx33> right
<cbx33> that makes sense
<sbalneav> So, you'll have to say static GO... entries[]  = { blah }
<cbx33> i can't do that
<sbalneav> Because you need a pointer to it?
<cbx33> can't i do like new array
<cbx33> well basically the definition of the variable is in theclass header
<cbx33> and I need to use that pointer
<cbx33> if i create a new instance it won't be availble to ther other members in the class
<sbalneav> GOptionEntry *newptr
<sbalneav> newptr = entry
<sbalneav> <mangle newptr>
<sbalneav> Is entry your global array?
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> entries is
<cbx33> :p
<sbalneav> Ah, so you're wanting to assign a new set of values to entry?
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> :D:D:D
<cbx33> though the {3,3,3} type notation
<cbx33> basically reinitialising it
<sbalneav> entry[0]  = 3
<cbx33> but
<sbalneav> entry[1]  = 3... etc.
<cbx33> I have a large struct to do
<sbalneav> so, do this:
<sbalneav> for (i = 0; i < len; i++)
<sbalneav> whoops, hold on
<cbx33> heh
<cbx33> ok
<sbalneav> GO... newthing = { foo, foo, foo }
<sbalneav> for (i = 0; i < len(newthing); i++) { entry[i]  = newthing[i] ; }
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> ok
<sbalneav> You can only use the {....} notation on initialization
<sbalneav> Once you're past that, you gotta access by subscript.
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> well
<cbx33> i just did
<cbx33> static GO entries[]  = { structure }
<cbx33> and when compiling it says warning unused variable entries
<sbalneav> Hmmm, well, remember I only know C, maybe they extended that with c++
<sbalneav> in C you can't do that. :)
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> but I'm trying a didfferent way
<cbx33> doing it in the intialisation
<cbx33> like you said
<cbx33> and it's saying entries is an unused variable
<cbx33> just pasting bining
<sbalneav> You should see the pastebot WE got.
<cbx33> http://pastebin.ca/383627
<cbx33> yeh?
<sbalneav> pop over to #ltsp for a sec
<cliebow> ok
<bddebian> Heya
<cbx33> sbalneav:
<cbx33> undefined reference to `phimage::tilesize`
<cbx33> when they are defined above
<cliebow> feisty..2.6.20.9 prism2.5 wireless comes up as wiired card..any quick fix?
<cbx33> w00t c++ is getting easier
<cbx33> hi LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi cbx33
<cbx33> hey Burgwork
<cbx33> sorry
<cbx33> READ THE NICK _ READ THE NICK
<cbx33> I keep forgetting that
#edubuntu 2007-03-07
<Ken3191> Hello I am new to Edubuntu and to IRC I got the CD from Cannonical Vr 6.06.1 LTS I have tried to install it as a stand alone workstation. I checked the integrity of the CD but I get an error message [!!]  Load installer components from CD - there was a problem reading data from CD please make sure it is in the drive. If retrying doesn't work check the integirty of the CD-Rom. Failed to copy...
<Ken3191> ...files from CD-Rom can anybody make a suggestion? the integrity test showed the cd to be correct?
<kgoetz> did the cd pass the error integrity check or not? i'm not sure from waht you said
<Ken3191> yes it did pass sorry but i was not clear
<kgoetz> how old is this system?
<Ken3191> pentium 4 2.66ghz 512 cache 512 ddr ram
<Ken3191> 16 x cd drive
<kgoetz> oh, new.
<Ken3191> :)
<kgoetz> hmm..... do you have a newer cd drive?
<Ken3191> now computer given to a charity I run for homeless kids
<Ken3191> no but I can look at getting one
<kgoetz> i'm thinking a 32/52 speed if you have one about, doesnt need to be new
<kgoetz> but i *suspect* the problem is hte drive
<Ken3191> hte drive?
<kgoetz> the cdrom drive
<bimberi> Ken3191: a typo, not some wierd acronym :)
<Ken3191> ok as I said I am new
<bimberi> Ken3191: welcome :)
<kgoetz> oh, i see. sorry :$
<Ken3191> if I loaded the iso to a 2 gig usb drive can it be told to load edubuntu from that?
<kgoetz> um. i'm not sure. i think there are ways
<bimberi> Ken3191: yes you can, hang on I'll get the link..
<Ken3191> great
<bimberi> Ken3191: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/FromUSBStick
<Ken3191> thanks very much a great help I appreciate all your help
<bimberi> Ken3191: yw :)
<cbx33> hey LaserJock
<nixternal> hiya cbx33
<cbx33> hi nixternal
<nixternal> is Feisty out yet? I can't take no more :)  LaserJock is working me into the ground
<nixternal> I CAN'T take NO more == I can take more, darn double negatives
<LaserJock> hi cbx33
<LaserJock> what?!
<cbx33> heheh
<nixternal> why is it that every Python book I get isn't for newbs? I keep buying the wrong ones, have the Programming PYthon 3e (twice the size of my Bible) and Python in a Nutshell.
<nixternal> oh ya, this looks like the wrong channel
<nixternal> disregard that
<LaserJock> nixternal: no worries, we pretty much have a /ignore nixternal
<nixternal> figures
<nixternal> well at least I know you don't have me ignored ;p
<cbx33> nixternal, I have an excellent python book
<cbx33> assumes a little programming knowledge but not much
* nixternal has programming knowledge, but not much
<nixternal> hahahaha
<cbx33> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Beginning-Python-Programmer-P-C-Norton/dp/0764596543/ref=pd_ka_2/202-5180218-8451838?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1173247134&sr=8-2
* cbx33 needs a good c++ book now
<nixternal> heh, I got a great C++ book, text book for my college courses
<LaserJock> hmm, usually read the books but get nowhere
<nixternal> mine is a newb c++ book
<LaserJock> except there was one Python book for Computational Sciences that was good
<LaserJock> actually had practical stuff
<cbx33> http://www.pastebin.ca/384632 - 3 days of me coding in c++
<nixternal> alrighty, just bought that book, thanks for the pointer
<nixternal> gl lovin' I see
<cbx33> well it will be
<cbx33> notice there is actually glnothing at the moment
* cbx33 thinks it's sad that he get's up at 5:30 to code in c++
<nixternal> lol
<LaserJock> it'd probably be 7:00 if it was Python, eh?
* highvoltage stumbles into the channel
* HedgeMage peeks in
<HedgeMage> hi, all
<LaserJock> HedgeMage!
<LaserJock> highvoltage!
<highvoltage> hi HedgeMage and other edubuntero's (and edubuntorita's)
<HedgeMage> hi LaserJock
<HedgeMage> hi highvoltage
<cbx33> hey HedgeMage highvoltage
<cbx33> h+h
<cbx33> hehe
<highvoltage> hey hey hey!!!
<cbx33> c++ is looking up ;)
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<HedgeMage> hi cbx33
<cbx33> file loader function completed
<HedgeMage> how've you all been?
<cbx33> that's all external functions I believe
<edubuntugirl> FANTASTIC!
<cbx33> now just the c++ guts
<LaserJock> busy!
* highvoltage is in johannesburg, and not used to the dry weather
<highvoltage> Saturday night I had lots and lots of ideas for edubuntu. I hate myself for not writing them down, I can't remember any of it :-(
<HedgeMage> aww
* cbx33 pokes highvoltage 
<highvoltage> ouch
<nixternal> got that Python book, and the Qt4 for C++ design book by Bruce Perens
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> that book touchs on gtk
<cbx33> and loads of other cool stuff
<nixternal> there is a new Qt4 book coming out in April, I should preorder it now
<nixternal> that Python book was cheap actually
<nixternal> I think like $13USD
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> really good quality
<cbx33> well
* cbx33 loved it
<cbx33> though I havn't had time to finish it
<nixternal> I got a free book from amazon a couple of months ago, I have been meaning to sell it as I don't have any use for it
<nixternal> Security+ Guide to Windows Network Security
<nixternal> lol
<nixternal> it was like $100 book when I got it, but I think it has dropped in price big time
<highvoltage> ah, fiction.
<nixternal> haha
<nixternal> 49.00 on amazon
<nixternal> I can put it for 40, it has a rippled spine, it will be gone in a few days
<highvoltage> cool. how does that work, do they collect it from you, or do you have to drop it off somewhere?
<nixternal> alrighty, on amazon for sale :)
<nixternal> for standard shipping they will give me like $3.50
<nixternal> I will goto the post office and do a media mail post for about that same price
<highvoltage> ah
<highvoltage> do you send it directly to the buyer then?
<nixternal> yes
<fheiss> Hi.. I'm downloading 6.10 for my wife's 4th grade classroom right now -- it looks great.  I'm wondering what the system reqs are.  The classroom computers only have 64MB RAM.
<fheiss> and I think the HDDs are 6GB
* bimberi sees fheiss' unanswered question and suspects he'll be in for a shock :|
* ogra quickly gets some coffee, meeting in 10min
<cbx33> meeting
<cbx33> whoops i said it in the wrong channel
* highvoltage will be attending via phone
* ogra doesnt hear highvoltage 
<highvoltage> hehe
<ogra> highvoltage, say something, we're listening
<highvoltage> *testing* *testing* <feedback> whooom </feedback>
<ogra> eek
<ogra> my ears
* highvoltage turns down the volume and steps back from the mike
* ogra takes a break
<bddebian> Heya
<highvoltage> ogra
#edubuntu 2007-03-08
<cbx33> ping burgundavia pm
<Burgundavia> got it
<cbx33> Burgundavia, are you identified?
<Burgundavia> nope
<Burgundavia> hmm
<LaserJock> hi cbx33
<cbx33> hey Las
<cbx33> erJock
<Burgundavia> hey LaserJock
<LaserJock> how's it going Corey?
<Burgundavia> work is crazy busy
<Burgundavia> and I get to rip out all the Ubuntu I have installed
<Burgundavia> because it is not "maintainable"
<Burgundavia> my kingdom for ltsp
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> poor Burgundavia
<Burgundavia> apparently "we are going to use DiscoverStation and NetworkPersonalizer internally"
<Burgundavia> right
<Burgundavia> oh, and userful is hiring
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> well, Canonical is making everybody use Feisty internally I think
<LaserJock> although maybe not quite yet
<Burgundavia> really? they are running prerelease on a product system?
<Burgundavia> I can see running it once it is stable
<LaserJock> I think they might force it at Beta
<LaserJock> I saw Mark telling the LP guys to get prepared
<LaserJock> as a way of getting bugs worked out I guess
<Burgundavia> right
<Burgundavia> seems sane for some, but others not so much
<Burgundavia> I am fairly conservative when it comes to product machines
<Burgundavia> production machines, rather
<Burgundavia> the whole office runs dapper for this very reason
<LaserJock> I don't have any dapper or edgy machines anymore
<LaserJock> only Feisty
<LaserJock> although it's a pain for SRUs
<Burgundavia> having the dapper machines at work has been a good wakeup call
<Burgundavia> otherwise I would have no dapper machiens either
<cbx33> ping ogra can I force a screen resoultion for computers
<cbx33> I want to force 1024x768 on ALL machines
<cbx33> I know they can handle it
<SewenSins> hello everybody
<SewenSins> i have a small question: Why cant i use beryl effects on a terminal even if the client has a nvidia gfx-card like the server
<SewenSins> or how should one configure st like this?
<SewenSins> i actually know of both cards that they each on its own ...are capable of displaying the nice effects but over tzhe network as running ltsp it doesnt function
<SewenSins> okay... that will be it for now...i ll idle a bit an wait for someone to private click me and maybe make a fine suggestion :) lookin 4ward
<cliebow> anyone know if feisty will still go on ppc?
<rockprincess> howdy friends!
<edubuntugirl> hello rockprincess!!!
<rockprincess> hello edubuntugirl ;)
<highvoltage> howzit going?
<rockprincess> i'm cool :) edubuntu and the thinclients are running smoothly :) i can't ask for more i guess :D
<rockprincess> hmmm can i install schooltool on kubuntu edgy as well?
<bddebian> Heya
<rockprincess> howdy bddebian ;)
<bddebian> Good morning your highness! :-)
<rockprincess> hehe ;)
<highvoltage> rockprincess: yep. apt-get install schooltool :)
<rockprincess> thank you, highvoltage ;)
<jsgotangco> hey highvoltage
<jsgotangco> how's it going
<highvoltage> going great, and you jsgotangco?
<highvoltage> working on government stuff at the moment, quite challenging
<jsgotangco> not bad just past midnight here and just listening to some nerdcore music
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fow7iUaKrq4
* highvoltage opens
<cbx33> jsgotangco, don't suppose you know who's looking after GSoC this year?
<jsgotangco> cbx33: no idea yet, besides, projects are still submitting for inclusion. Probably doko will handle it again, or another guy like RichEd
<jsgotangco> do you want to mentor?
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> and I have a student
<jsgotangco> cbx33: well if the selection mechanism would be the same again, the student has to propose it then the mentors will have to vote for it
<cbx33> so basically he needs to come up ith a project?
<cbx33> how do I become a mentor?
<jsgotangco> cbx33: yes the project is supposed to be the student's, not exactly yours ;-)
<cbx33> of course not ;)
<jsgotangco> but he'll be fighting out with like 200+ applications or probably even more
<cbx33> yikes
<cbx33> but for edubuntu
<cbx33> likely to be better chance right?
<jsgotangco> yeah
<jsgotangco> edubuntu can probably allocate 2 specific projects
<jsgotangco> cbx33: looking at the student proposals alone can be a funny experience
<cbx33> so if I wanted to be a mentor....
<cbx33> who would i talk to doko?
<jsgotangco> just wait for the announcement, i have no idea who will be handling it or if ubuntu will even join SoC this year
<cbx33> ok
<jsgotangco> ubuntu probably will anyways
<cbx33> i think they may not
<cbx33> deadline is getting pretty close apparently
<jsgotangco> because bazaar is already discussing it on the ML
<cbx33> oh
<jsgotangco> mentoring organization applications started only 4 days ago
<jsgotangco> We are currently accepting applications from open source organizations. The list of selected organizations will be show here on March 14th.
<jsgotangco> oh well goodnight anyways
<jsgotangco> ciao
<ogra_> cbx33, doko and Keybuk are doing SoC this time round
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> thanks ogra
<cbx33> ogra_, while you're here
<cbx33> anyway to force screen res for LTSP clients?
<ogra_> i'm not :)
<cbx33> doh
<ogra_> look up X_HORZSYNC and X_VERTREFRESH
<cbx33> thakns
<ogra_> in the ltsp-client docs
<cliebow> anyone knoew if feisty will install on ppc..and build a chroot..or is it orphaned at edgy
<Laser_away> cliebow: what do you mean?
<cliebow> Laser_away: i know intentions are to give up onsupporting ppc..will there be feisty for ppc or is that a dead end?
<cliebow> ltsp/muekow in pasrticular
<LaserJock> cliebow_: it's not unsupported, just community supported
<LaserJock> cliebow_: there will be Feisty ppc .isos as far as I know
* student screams loudly
<student> I need help
<mrwizard14> my menu bar is no longer showing up
<mrwizard14> and I need it for my school assignment
* mrwizard14 screams for help
<mrwizard14> our school computers are broken
<mrwizard14> and I need to get my document in
<mrwizard14> or i fail
<LaserJock> mrwizard14: you are using Edubuntu?
<mrwizard14> yes
<LaserJock> do you have a panel at all?
<mrwizard14> nope
<LaserJock> hit Alt-F2
<LaserJock> and type gnome-panel
<mrwizard14> it gives a wierd message
<mrwizard14> and fails
<mrwizard14> the panel is the top menu bar, right?
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> is there a bottom one?
<mrwizard14> yes
<mrwizard14> it says it's already running
<mrwizard14> but i can
<LaserJock> ok
<mrwizard14> *cant see it
<LaserJock> can you right click on the bottom panel
<mrwizard14> yes
<LaserJock> is there a "New Panel" option?
<mrwizard14> yes
<LaserJock> hit that
<LaserJock> where does the new panel show up?
<mrwizard14> ok
<mrwizard14> the top
<mrwizard14> but it's empty
<LaserJock> ok
<LaserJock> now right click on the top panel and hit "Add to Panel"
<mrwizard14> ok
<LaserJock> down at the bottom there should be a "Menu Bar" item
<mrwizard14> ok
<mrwizard14> drag it in?
<LaserJock> just click on it
<mrwizard14> ok
<mrwizard14> the panels huge, though
<LaserJock> and hit the "Add" button down at the bottom
<LaserJock> ok, so right click on the panel and hit "Properties"
<mrwizard14> ok
<LaserJock> you can adjust the size in there
<mrwizard14> what is it normally at?
<LaserJock> hmm, I have mine at 24
<LaserJock> although that's fairly small
<mrwizard14> it's the same as the others
<LaserJock> I think the default is somewhere between 24-32
<mrwizard14> thx
* mrwizard14 thanks LaserJock
<LaserJock> I'm not sure why you panel got deleted in the first place
<mrwizard14> someone was messing around with IM
<mrwizard14> and didn't wanna get caught
<mrwizard14> it's a school comp
<LaserJock> hmm
<mrwizard14> i found it out when they freeaked out
<mrwizard14> they're windows people
<mrwizard14> I am not a windows dude
<LaserJock> mrwizard14: you might want to mention to the comp admin too look into pessulus or sabayon :-)
<mrwizard14> huh?
<mrwizard14> I'm used to unix
<mrwizard14> from inside Mac OS X
<mrwizard14> the terminal thingie
<LaserJock> pessulus and sabayon are for locking down the computers
<mrwizard14> i c
<LaserJock> so people don't mess with stuff too much
<mrwizard14> the teachers would get pretty pissed
<mrwizard14> i c
<mrwizard14> can i lock to panel?
<LaserJock> well, you can lock items to the panel
<LaserJock> but you can't really lock the panel itself without using one of these tools
<mrwizard14> i c
<mrwizard14> so do i google that?
<mrwizard14> I'm a unix/linux n00b
<mrwizard14> a 12 year old
<mrwizard14> so how do i run programs that i download using http?
<LaserJock> mrwizard14: yeah, you can google those if you want
<LaserJock> mrwizard14: well, generally you shouldn't need to
<LaserJock> the Ubuntu software repositories have most everything you'll need
<mrwizard14> but I am trying to dun DeSMuMe on OS X
<mrwizard14> and it's a Unix app
<LaserJock> mrwizard14: you want it in Edubuntu or OS X?
<mrwizard14> OS X
<LaserJock> looks like it is only a Windows app to me
<mrwizard14> it is unix
<mrwizard14> i checked
<LaserJock> mrwizard14: "DeSmuME is also known as YopYop DS is written in C++ for Microsoft Windows" and the download give a .exe
<mrwizard14> http://forums.emuscene.com/viewtopic.php?t=3156
<mrwizard14> Hi all,
<mrwizard14> Desmume is a linux DS emulator. It is currently not perfect, and there is no many games that run correctly but, it's a real technical performance.
<mrwizard14> quote
<mrwizard14> there's a french tutorial
<mrwizard14> but it needs translating
<LaserJock> hehe, they need to work on URLs
<LaserJock> http://www.desmume.com is for windows and http://www.desmume.org is apparently for Linux
<mrwizard14> wow
<mrwizard14> lol
* mrwizard14 splits a gut laughinh
<mrwizard14> *laguing
<mrwizard14> *laughing
<LaserJock> mrwizard14: well, this is very offtopic for this channel, but in general it looks like you can follow that translated version
<mrwizard14> try the DCC chat
<mrwizard14> cuz it is off-topic
<LaserJock> just follow the directions on the forum thread you gave me
<mrwizard14> but those are for intel, and I'm powerPC
<mrwizard14> it's actually a serious difference
<cliebow_> LaserJock:thank you...crawling back to my hole again..
<LaserJock> heh
#edubuntu 2007-03-09
<crazy_bus> where can I find more information on feisty fawn edubuntu.  I remember reading that it had xfce as well as gnome.  Do you choose when you install.  Or do you install gnome and them xfce from the second cd
<Laser_away> crazy_bus: I'm not really sure. I think it's afterward
<juliux> morning
<juliux> !seen RichEd
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen riched - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<mips> what do you call it when you use one pc to serve multiple users with extra keyboards & monitors attached ?
<cliebow_> like multihead?
<mips> yes. one pc serves say two-three users
<mips> but they have their own login names etc
<mips> Multiseat is what it is called http://cs.senecac.on.ca/~ctyler/ruby/
<mgallagh> is it recommendable to install the edubunt packages on top of feisty?
<mgallagh> *edubuntu
<bddebian> Heya
<sbalneav> Morning all
<juliux> morning sbalneav
* bdoin dodo
<ijwyn> a friend recently switched to linux and installed edubuntu, but I'm not familiar with it myself (I'm on Mandriva)...
<ijwyn> I wanted to send him an rpm package, but it's telling him the archive type is unsupported, is this final or is there a way for him to install urpmi?
<LaserJock> ijwyn: is it just 1 rpm?
<LaserJock> ijwyn: and is it an app that might be in Edubuntu repositories?
<ijwyn> it's just 1 and no it wouldn't be
<ijwyn> but it's platform independent, so it should install fine if he can get the rpm to work
<ijwyn> (hopefully, lol)
<LaserJock> ijwyn: he can install alien and convert it to a .deb
<LaserJock> ijwyn: that would be the easiest way
<ijwyn> hmm, he's pretty new to all this though so not sure if he'd know how to do that, lol
<ijwyn> is there a French channel for edubuntu BTW? I'm talking him through the process to get on here, but he doesn't speak English, heh
<LaserJock> I don't think we have a french one
<LaserJock> ijwyn: if you give me the name of the rpm I'll give you the exact lines
<ijwyn> ok, hang on
<ijwyn> xldtn-3.0.0-1.i386.rpm
<LaserJock> ijwyn: this should work in a terminal:
<LaserJock> sudo apt-get install alien
<LaserJock> sudo alien -d xldtn-3.0.0-1.i386.rpm
<LaserJock> sudo dpkg -i xldtn_3.0.0-1_i386.rpm
<LaserJock> I'm not sure *exactly* what the .deb name will be but I think that's right
<ijwyn> ok cool, I'll give him the instructions, thanks :-)
<ijwyn> d'abord tu ouvres un terminal -- tu sais faire ?
<ijwyn> ack
<ijwyn> wrong window, lol
<ijwyn> sorry
<LaserJock> I figured
<ijwyn> heheh
<ijwyn> he's getting chmod errors, probably need to change the permissions on the file... I have to shamefully admit though that I always do that through my file manager so I don't remember the shell command :-o
#edubuntu 2007-03-10
<cliebow_> ijwyn, you mean  chmod? chown?
<ijwyn> yeah, chmod
<lns> Hey all
<lns> Does anyone have any information on getting flash/java plugins working on an edubuntu xeon (x86-64) server for x86 thin clients?
<lns> Am I missing something easy or do i have to jump through hoops to get it to work under 64-bit?
<LaserJock> hmm, I'd check the Ubuntu forums
<LaserJock> becuase I think you can get a 32bit Firefox that flash works in
<lns> Yeah I read a bit about that
<lns> you have to use some sort of wrapper
<lns> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=160318&highlight=java+firefox+64
<lns> actually this might be a (really hairy) solution: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FirefoxAMD64FlashJava
<ijwyn> ok thanks for the help guys, I think we've more or less figured things out :-)
<ijwyn> I'm outta here
<pirast> could anyone please apply the debdiff in bug 90814?
<pirast> where's ubugtu?
<pirast> oh mh
<pirast> wrong channel
<pirast> sorry :)
<cliebow> mouse action is miserable in ppc..any way to speed er up
<cliebow_> fixed itself on update !!
<sesja> hello
<sesja> anybody there
<sesja> ?
<LaserJock> somebody I'm sure
<LaserJock> sesja: what's up?
<sesja> i am going to do something
<sesja> to get know system
<sesja> what are the goals of open source systems?
<sesja> :-)
<sesja> ?
<sesja> emotion mark?
<LaserJock> well, that's a very general question
<LaserJock> many people have many different goals with open source softare
<LaserJock> generally it's about freedom
<sesja> oh if it is true i like it at once
<sesja> but
<sesja> but?
<sesja> i would like to know how can I use effectively the system
<sesja> where should i start?
<LaserJock> well, you can start by installing Edubuntu :-)
<sesja> then what?
<LaserJock> start playing around
<LaserJock> you're free to pretty much do whatever you want
<LaserJock> Edubuntu has access to lots and lots of open source software
<sesja> sounds like advertisement
<LaserJock> hm?
<LaserJock> how do you mean?
<sesja> you know
<sesja> there is windows
<sesja> and other distributions of open source
<sesja> why edubuntu
<LaserJock> oh
<LaserJock> well, Edubuntu is primarily designed for kids and schools
<LaserJock> Ubuntu (the parent project of Edubuntu) is more general
<sesja> are u kid or student?
<LaserJock> well, I'm a PhD student
<LaserJock> 25 years old
<sesja> oh
<sesja> i don't know what PhD means
<LaserJock> Doctorate of Philosophy
<sesja> wow !!
<LaserJock> the highest level of university traning in the US
<sesja> that's cool
<sesja> you are great
<LaserJock> heh
<sesja> i think
<LaserJock> not exactly
<LaserJock> I've just been in school a long time
<sesja> so
<sesja> you are philosophy student
<LaserJock> not exactly
<LaserJock> a PhD is a general term
<LaserJock> from back in the day when philosophy meant more than what it means now
<LaserJock> I'm a Physical Chemistry student
<sesja> :-)
<sesja> so you learn about Everything ?
<LaserJock> heh, I wish I could
<sesja> so do I
<sesja> is using Edubuntu part of your philosophy?
<LaserJock> how do you mean?
<sesja> when you said about freedom I thought about some deeper meaning
<LaserJock> ah
<LaserJock> well, I think I'm still working on it
<LaserJock> some people certainly apply the freedom philosophy outside of software
<LaserJock> I do work with a group of scientists working on "open source" science
<sesja> i would like to do so
<sesja> and liking is all I have
<LaserJock> you might be interested in http://www.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/philosophy
<sesja> it says about freedom electronically at least
<LaserJock> yes
<sesja> i tried to work on mandrake and had great problem to install any software not included in packages
<LaserJock> ah
<sesja> what do u think?
<LaserJock> that can happen
<LaserJock> Ubuntu has several tools to avoid that
<sesja> you talk about Ubuntu but we are on Edubuntu channel
<LaserJock> they are essentially the same
<LaserJock> Edubuntu is just a educational variant of Ubuntu
<sesja> does it have the same possibilities?
<LaserJock> it has access to the same software repositories
<sesja> is it full answer?
<LaserJock> yes, it has the same possibilities
<sesja> thank u
<sesja> :-)
<sesja> can I turn off this graphical marks?
<sesja> these
<sesja> do u use them>
<sesja> ?
<sesja> ok
<sesja> freedom software
<LaserJock> which graphical marks?
<sesja> :-)
<sesja> that one
<LaserJock> oh, yes. I use them a fair amount
<sesja> I think Edubuntu is quite fast
<sesja> is that so?
<sesja> many questions
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> it kind of depends on what you are comparing the speed to
<LaserJock> I find it prety fast
<LaserJock> *pretty
<sesja> :-)
<sesja> how many questions left?
<LaserJock> heh
<sesja> are u kind of scientist?
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> I work with lasers
<sesja> really?
<sesja> these in CD ROMS?
<LaserJock> hehe, no
<sesja> jedi knights?
<LaserJock> my research doesn't have anything to do with computers
<sesja> so this is kind of "hobby" ?
<LaserJock> we investigate molecules with the lasers
<sesja> wow
<sesja> u crash them
<sesja> ?
<sesja> no
<LaserJock> kind of
<sesja> uhm
<LaserJock> we shoot them with the laser and watch how the respond
<sesja> poor molecules
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> but yeah, Ubuntu/Edubuntu are kind of a big hobby
<sesja> ok
<sesja> what do use them for?
<LaserJock> Ubuntu?
<sesja> yes
<LaserJock> I run it on my computers
<LaserJock> and I help maintain the software so other people can benefit
<sesja> maintain?
<sesja> do you keep it? make it accessible ?
<sesja> or work on projects?
<LaserJock> well, Ubuntu is made up of thousands of different pieces of software
<LaserJock> from thousands of different software authors
<LaserJock> and we have to make sure it all works together and is as bug free as we can make it
<sesja> i understand
<sesja> how did u get the knowledge about computers?
<sesja> not in school as i see
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> just using it
<LaserJock> and reading
<LaserJock> and eventually by just hleping out
<LaserJock> *helping
<sesja> helping learns teacher?
<sesja> other helping
<LaserJock> well, mostly helping maintain packages
<LaserJock> and writing documentation
<sesja> wow
<LaserJock> and teaching people how to do that
<LaserJock> and writing some software
<LaserJock> stuff like that
<sesja> :-)
<LaserJock> I just help where I can
<sesja> like gaim?
<sesja> ;-)
<LaserJock> I haven't worked on gaim, yet
<sesja> you should
<sesja> there is one option missing
<sesja> have always been using linux system?
<sesja> you
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> I've been using it for about 5 years
<sesja> what was before?
<sesja> BigBang
<LaserJock> what was before what?
<sesja> I don't know if I should ask this question
<sesja> did u use windows?
<LaserJock> oh sure
<LaserJock> still use it sometimes
<LaserJock> although I use OS X a lot more
<LaserJock> as I have an iMac at work
<sesja> what systems have you installed on your machine?
<sesja> i have windows xp media center
<sesja> running edubuntu live cd
<sesja> i like linux systems more
<LaserJock> well, at home my machines dual-boot Windows XP and Ubuntu
<sesja> uhm
<LaserJock> at work just Ubuntu and OS X
<sesja> i thing it is good solution
<LaserJock> I do too
<sesja> i would like to install EduBuntu could help me with that?
<sesja> you
<sesja> or send me where can I learn about that
<sesja> i am talking about dual-boot
<LaserJock> on the same hard drive? or do you have a second hard drive?
<sesja> should I have second?
<LaserJock> it's easier
<sesja> I know
<LaserJock> the problem is you need to resize the Windows partition to allow room for Edubuntu
<sesja> I know that too
<sesja> what i don't know is:
<sesja> is it safe to repartition on hard drive with system on it
<sesja> is it good to have 2 systems on one hard drive
<sesja> and
<sesja> how much space should I reserve for Edubuntu
<sesja> :-)
<sesja> send me to google if u wish
<LaserJock> well, I use Partition Magic for Windows to make the space
<sesja> I used it and thing it's the best
<LaserJock> and I'd make at least 10GB of space to Edubuntu if you have space
<sesja> i have
<LaserJock> how much free space do you have on there now?
<sesja> i waited for this questio
<sesja> n
<sesja> i think there is about 180 GB
<sesja> can I check it in Edubuntu?
<sesja> or where can I check it
<sesja> I don't know basic information about my equipment
<sesja> until it is necessary
<LaserJock> you probably can check it in Ubuntu
<LaserJock> if you go System->Administration->Partition Editor (or something like that)
<sesja> here is said I have 153.38 GiB
<sesja> i thought there is only "round" number
<LaserJock> it says that is fre space?
<LaserJock> *free
<LaserJock> or total space
<sesja> total
<sesja> unused 136 GiB
<sesja> :-)
<LaserJock> well, 180GB doesn't really mean 180GB
<sesja> is it connected with this...
<sesja> multiplier?
<LaserJock> well, I'd give Edubuntu whatever you what realy
<LaserJock> if you plan on putting a lot of stuff on there (music, files, etc.) then you might want to do 20+GB
<LaserJock> the minimum is around 2GB
<LaserJock> but you'll definately want some space to play around
<sesja> :-)
<sesja> can I change the size of partition after intallation?
<sesja> installing
<sesja> can I put some more space for Ubuntu if i need to after installing?
<LaserJock> hmm, well I wouldn't recommend it
<LaserJock> but it's possible
<sesja> ok
<sesja> why not?
<LaserJock> it would involve resizing partitions with stuff on them
<LaserJock> which is always a tad risky
<sesja> i thought so
<LaserJock> so you want to do it as little as possible
<sesja> no it is not true
<LaserJock> resizing the Windows partition probably wouldn't be too bad
<sesja> i thought to divide hard drive in two
<LaserJock> that' be more than enough
<sesja> so
<sesja> how much is enough?
<LaserJock> if you divid it in half
<LaserJock> you'd have lots room
<LaserJock> it's always to have more :-)
<LaserJock> always good
<sesja> remember that when I add I deduct too
<sesja> in this case
<sesja> that's why i ask
<sesja> am asking
<sesja> is there partition magic for linux?
<sesja> i know that it is commercial program in windows
<sesja> and I can't get it lately
<sesja> or GNOME resiser would do?
<sesja> if I am tiring to much just say
<LaserJock> well, the installer has a partitioner
<sesja> it is rare to hear answer other than RTFM when talking about linux systems
<sesja> installer?
<LaserJock> the Ubuntu
<LaserJock> installer
<sesja> Edubuntu
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> well
<sesja> it will destroy my Windows
<sesja> or not?
<LaserJock> that wouldn't be good
<LaserJock> well, it *could*
<LaserJock> that's why we recommend you backup
<sesja> backup?
<LaserJock> but the Desktop installer should be able to resize
<sesja> should I go paranoid
<LaserJock> backup important stuff from your Windows install
<LaserJock> hehe
<sesja> ok
<LaserJock> well, we have to cover ourselves
<sesja> IMPORTANT STUFF that won't be much
<LaserJock> we can't tell you it's fine if there is a chance it could have problems
<sesja> I can only tell that when I used Partition Magic it worked well
<LaserJock> yeah, that's what I used
<sesja> is installer partitioning as good as it?
<LaserJock> well, that's hard to say
<LaserJock> I've not had problems with either
<LaserJock> but I'd personally trust Partition Magic more
<sesja> ok
<sesja> hmm
<sesja> I have great problems with decisions
<LaserJock> :-)
<LaserJock> well, I'd recommend backing up things that you want back *if* Windows happened to get killed
<LaserJock> and then play around
<sesja> I like the expression
<sesja> play around
<sesja> where should I look for to get know what can I do using the system
<LaserJock> well, it's sort of hard to say
<sesja> aGain
<LaserJock> look for software for things that you are interested in
<sesja> ok
<LaserJock> like I look for science software
<sesja> are there any *start* places?
<sesja> for software for example
<LaserJock> well, get it installed, check out the programs that are installed
<sesja> uhm
<LaserJock> then go to "Add/Remove Applications"
<LaserJock> and look for some interesting stuff
<sesja> step by step :-)
<sesja> have I to install it?
<sesja> ??
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> it's in the menu
<sesja> i remember that there was also choice how much memory to give for swap and others
<sesja> how to define it?
<sesja> LaserJock:
<sesja> is there no manual for correct installation ?
<sesja> for lames
<sesja> :-)
<sesja> or you are the one?
<sesja> sorry
<LaserJock> well, it should be fairly straightforward
<LaserJock> how much RAM do you have?
<LaserJock> you can have it automatically set up the partitions, by the way
<sesja> aha
<sesja> it is good
<sesja>  1 G i thing
<sesja> *k
<sesja> where can I check all information about my computer
<sesja> in Ubuntu
<sesja> I have enough RAM to run LIVE CD that is sure
<sesja> wait
<sesja> maybe in filesystem?
<sesja> no
<sesja> you know I am the kid who get computer from mummy and I don't know nothing about it
<sesja> :-)
<sesja> i think 512 or 1 G
<sesja> are you working now on something?
<LaserJock> sorry
<sesja> for what?
<LaserJock> I think 512MB of RAM would be fine
<LaserJock> I was away for a while
<sesja> there is enough
<sesja> no problem
<sesja> is LaserJock your hacking nick? ;-)
<sesja> hmm
<sesja> i tried to listen to internet radio
<sesja> it doesn't work here
<LaserJock> I guess it's my hacking nick
<LaserJock> it's what I go by on IRC and I use it a fair amount
<sesja> why can't linux use windows applications ?
<sesja> or *specifications* ?
<nixternal> 2 totally different OS's (kernels) for one
<nixternal> you can run some Windows apps with Wine though
<sesja> I thing it is not very good idea
<nixternal> what's that?
<sesja> Wine
<sesja> it is emulator
<nixternal> depends on if you are talking drinking wine or the win32 app wrapper
<sesja> oh
<sesja> that was funny
<nixternal> wine is not an emulator, that's at least what they want you to think
<sesja> i ran wine and windows apps worked very bad or didn't worked at all
<nixternal> well, if you could all of those Windows app makers to start writing free software ports for Linux, then everyone will be happy. Until then the MS monopoly rides on :)
<nixternal> I have only messed with wine to play online poker. hehe
<sesja> :-)
<nixternal> now they have Java clients, so I don't need Wine anymore
<sesja> i tried to run Quake III Arena on mandrake
<sesja> the result was horrible
<sesja> are the others on the channel bots?
<nixternal> I run Q3A on my laptop with an integrated Intel graphics card, and w/o Wine
<sesja> ooo
<sesja> nixternal: is there linux version of it?
<sesja> of Q
<nixternal> haha
<sesja> :-)
<nixternal> sesja: I was actually going to link you to the page
<nixternal> but it seems it has been hacked by a turkish hacker
<nixternal> http://gaming.gwos.org/
<nixternal> lol, they show you how to get it working
<sesja> totem couldn't play fd0
<sesja> great link
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> there are Q3 howtos out there for Linux
<nixternal> the one I wanted to link you to I think is the best
<sesja> you are laughing at me
<sesja> straight me up instead of that
<nixternal> you copy the baseq3 to /usr/games/quake3/ and then you you run this q3 updater bin and it will allow you to run Q3 natively
<sesja> I ran the game but it worked EXTREMELY slow
<sesja> natively you say
<nixternal> yes
<nixternal> I run it and my system isn't fast at all
<nixternal> you don't have to run Q3 in Wine
<sesja> and other games
<sesja> what slows applications when using Wine
<sesja> translating?
<nixternal> I really don't know
<sesja> great radio have I caught here in Ubuntu
<sesja> where are the visual art for music played?
<sesja> are there any in system?
<sesja> i loved mandrake ones
<sesja> 3 or 4 at the same time
<nixternal> when it comes to GNOME, I couldn't tell ya
<sesja> hmm
<sesja> there was a program for mp3
<sesja> what was its name
<sesja> wait
<sesja> downloading package information
<sesja> where is the information about packages available?
<nixternal> what information are you interested in?
<nixternal> from the cammand line, you can always type      apt-cache show packagename
<nixternal> that will provide you with some info
<sesja> next turkish hackers trick ? ;-)
<nixternal> haha, I wish that site would come back up though, they have great gaming tutorials on there for Ubuntu
<sesja> W: Unable to locate package packagename
<sesja> E: No packages found
<sesja> aha
<sesja> i should put the name of package right?
<nixternal> well replace package name with the name of the application you are looking for
<nixternal> I am sorry
<sesja> i want list of all of them
<nixternal> yes, you are correct
<sesja> not at all
<sesja> i want to know what is there
<sesja> 1 in system
<sesja> 2 on cdrom
<sesja> 3 maybe on net
<sesja> this is information i am looking for
<nixternal> ahh, good question
<sesja> is there an answer?
<sesja> list of packages available
<sesja> there was something like that in mandrake
<nixternal> for that you might get a better answer in #ubuntu or the like
<nixternal> there is always http://packages.ubuntu.com
<nixternal> but nothing tells you if it is on the cdrom or not
<nixternal> it will either be in main, universe, multivers, or restricted
<sesja> STRANGE
<sesja> i can't even have the information what package could be installed from CD ROM?
<sesja> universe
<sesja> I thought u were kidding
<sesja> i have intel pentium which architecture is it?
<sesja> amd no
<sesja> i386 or power pc?
<sesja> i386 i guess
<sesja> let us try
<LaserJock> i386
<LaserJock> ppc is for macs
<sesja> thx
<sesja> Same version is available in a software channel
<sesja> You are recommended to install the software from the channel instead.
<sesja> what does it mean?
<sesja> i tried to install new package and run it
<sesja> and that is what i got
<sesja> what is software channel?
<sesja> wow I saw the ? mark in menu :-)
<LaserJock> a software channel is a different component of the Ubuntu repositories
<LaserJock> like Main and Universe
<sesja> Application->Add Remove
<sesja> where can I find software dedicated to Ubuntu?
<stgraber> once you have a activated all repositories (software sources), launch synaptic, there will be a lot of software you can install
<sesja> downloading packace information
<sesja> thx
<stgraber> all Ubuntu packages will be there, you can also add some customs sources to have more packages
<stgraber> gtg
<sesja> how can I run program (package)
<sesja> I don't know where it is
<sesja> can I check path for package (executable) ?
<sesja> ok i got it
<bimberi> sesja: gui programs should be added to the menu.  Otherwise you can do 'dpkg -L <package> | grep bin' to get an idea of what executable(s) are installed by the package
<sesja> what compilators are there built in system?
<sesja> what is ICT?
<mpytasz> information and communication technology
<sesja> mpytasz: jeste z Polski?
<mpytasz> tak wyszo, ale to chyba anglojzyczny kana...
<sesja> na to wyglda
<sesja> what is thin-client then?
<sesja> misterious language
<mpytasz> :) a client with limited abilities of data processing
<mpytasz> sesja, RU translating some database rejated stuff?
<mpytasz> related
<sesja> no just reading edubuntu cookbook
<mpytasz> ah, i see
<sesja> how can I have access to data of windows (ntfs partition) from Ubuntu
<sesja> is it possible?
<mpytasz> don't know about ubuntu, I'm using gentoo, usually uoy can just mount them, the best way is through fuse and ntfs3g
<bimberi> !ntfs
<ubotu> To view your Windows/Mac partitions see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/AutomaticallyMountPartitions . For write access see !ntfs-3g or !fuse
<bimberi> sesja: ^^^^
<sesja> bimberi: what?
<sesja> why this stabile system hangs sometimes?
<sesja> why oh why oh why oh why
<sesja> tell me why oh why
<sesja> fuck
<sesja> i missed last session
<sesja> what was the progs to access windows partition?
<sesja> were
<sesja> Generate Fractals - Xaos is a fractal generator with a whole host of extra features for teaching pupils about fractal patterns.
<sesja> from
<sesja> http://www.edubuntu.org/UsingEdubuntu
<sesja> where is the prog
<sesja> i love edubuntu
<sesja> what extension have executables?
<sesja> do
<sesja> oh yeah
<sesja> XaoS
<rockprincess> howdy friends!
<rockprincess> check this out: http://www.monzy.com/intro/killdashnine_lyrics.html
<rockprincess> or this: http://www.monzy.com/intro/drama_lyrics.html (even better)
<rockprincess> hilarious!
<Laser_away> cbx33: hi
<cbx33> hey Laser_away
#edubuntu 2007-03-11
<cliebow> any bright ideas what to use for nxclient on ubuntu/ppc
<cliebow> Seveas:any clue/
<jamie_> just updated to fiesty had ltsp install run ltsp-build-client and get this message
<jamie_> Adding `diversion of /etc/mtab to /etc/mtab.real by ltsp-client'
<jamie_> `/opt/ltsp/i386/etc/apt/sources.list' -> `/opt/ltsp/i386/etc/apt/sources.list.old'
<jamie_> ln: creating symbolic link `/dev/fd' to `/proc/self/fd': File exists
<jamie_> error: LTSP client installation ended abnormally
<jamie_> any on help me get past this please
<rockprincess> hello friends ;)
* Starting logfile irclogs/edubuntu.log
<cbx33> ping ogra
<ajmitch> morning cbx33
<cbx33> hi ajmitch
<cbx33> i finished my first c++ project yesterday ;)
<ajmitch> well done :)
* ajmitch spent several hours in a car yesterday :)
<cbx33> :(
<ajmitch> all for a good cause
<cbx33> :D
<jamie_> Im testing feisty and it appears they have changed the way the /dev file systems works. Getting this error message on install of ltsp anyone help?
<jamie_> Adding `diversion of /etc/mtab to /etc/mtab.real by ltsp-client'
<jamie_> `/opt/ltsp/i386/etc/apt/sources.list' -> `/opt/ltsp/i386/etc/apt/sources.list.old'
<jamie_> ln: creating symbolic link `/dev/fd' to `/proc/self/fd': File exists
<jamie_> error: LTSP client installation ended abnormally
#edubuntu 2008-03-03
<lobaman> i need to press double ~ to show that character.
<lobaman> i mean to show Â¨~Â¨  i need to press double.
<lobaman> and also double quote.
<lobaman> and i cant type apostrophe.
<lobaman> edubuntu does it. is there a way to make this disable.
<crusader_> hello can someone please help me with LTSP installation on edubuntu 7.10?
<lobaman> how to make my keyboard normal as before?
<lobaman> cause i need to press Â¨ twice. to show Â¨ character.
<lobaman> and also i can do this. Ã¤ <== double quote + a  and i dont like it.
<lobaman> and these Ã« <== double quote + e ... i want to disable it.
<lobaman> anyone alive?
<lobaman> ok i have problem in keyboard.
<lobaman> i have to press twice ` to show the character.
<lobaman> also the double quote Â¨
<lobaman> i dont want this feature
<lobaman> i can do this Ã¤ .... <== doublequote + a
<lobaman> i dont want this. it slow me to type.
<Amaranth> compose key stuck on?
<Amaranth> oops, too late
<johnny_> uggh..
<johnny_> so.. what to do about moving ubuntu to another drive..
<johnny_> trying to figure out the whole uuid thing
<johnny_> used to normal designators
<johnny_> i'm trying to use blkid but it doesn't to work
<kgoetz> johnny_: replace the uuid with a proper identifyer
<johnny> kgoetz, found it.. vol_id
<vi390> where can I disable XDMCP
<Kamping_Kaiser> vi390, its disabled by default
<MegaIRC> hi everybody
<MegaIRC> is there somebody than can help me in a project
<MegaIRC> ?
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: did you get my email to pitti regarding squeak?
<foefieslide> small issue
<foefieslide> installed edubuntu 7.10 - works great
<foefieslide> hooked up via terminal no problemo
<foefieslide> but i have 40 amd terminals that pxe boot, run through initial stuff, shows the edubuntu screen and then just before log in
<foefieslide> it gets stuck...so the cursor simply flicker all the time
<foefieslide> i checked the chipset is GeodeLX
<foefieslide> i added XSERVEr = VESA to the /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf
<foefieslide> ran ltsp-update-image
<foefieslide> but the problem persist
<foefieslide> any advise
<johnny> there have been various video problems with thos geodes.. i don't know what what the ultimately issue is tho
<johnny> try asking in #ltsp
<foefieslide> johnny tx Qfunk's patches worked very well
<nhaines> Hi everyone!  I'm curious about the best way to try out Edubuntu Hardy Alpha 5.  Is it to install Ubuntu Hardy and use the Edubuntu add-on CD?
<johnny> nhaines, i don't know the mechanics for sure, but that sounds right
<nhaines> Oh well, it's not a Desktop CD, but adding the CD as a repo source and doing 'sudo apt-get install edubuntu-desktop' can't be too hard.  ;)
<nhaines> Thanks!
<nixternal> ogra: you around?
<subsume> I am attempting to follow https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPFatClients
<subsume> but I am not understanding how to make the client machines link up to this
#edubuntu 2008-03-04
<johnny_> ugghz..
<johnny_> how do you get around single user mode asking for a root password for maintenence?
<johnny_> considering i don't recall setting one..
<kgoetz> it should only ask if theres one set
<kgoetz> well, tahts how it used to work
<johnny_> hmm.. maybe it happened before i got here
<johnny_> aha..
<johnny_> hmm.. bad x driver.. it's using up 100% cpu..
<johnny_> switched video cards.. and now it doesn't wanna start up :(
<johnny_> really tho.. i just wanna disable x from starting..
<kgoetz> johnny_: use update-rc.d
<stgraber> ogra: ping (Edubuntu Add-on testcases)
<stgraber> ogra_cmpc: ^^
<stgraber> ogra_cmpc: ping
<ogra_cmpc> hey
<ogra_cmpc> hmm, test cases
<stgraber> I'm working on the testcases list for alpha-6, beta, rc and final
<ogra_cmpc> i only actually see two ...
<stgraber> we currently have g-a-i and WinFOSS for the add-on
<ogra_cmpc> install the edubuntu-desktop paqckage from g-a-i with or without network
<ogra_cmpc> checking that a reboot notification shows up might mqake sense
<ogra_cmpc> the latest -artwork package has that so people log in newly at least
<ogra_cmpc> beyond that i see no special cases
<stgraber> ok, so just an "Install Edubuntu desktop" testcase with link to a wikipage with the compolete testcase
<stgraber> we don't have any Windows stuff on it right ?
<ogra_cmpc> we have
<ogra_cmpc> and riched wanted to keep it
<ogra_cmpc> but i dont have *any* win around here
<ogra_cmpc> not even a CD beyond w98
<stgraber> :)
<stgraber> do we have the old WinFOSS or some newer stuff on the CD ?
<ogra_cmpc> i edont think anyone maintains it
<ogra_cmpc> so its still the same old versions
<stgraber> I know that other CDs now have some kind of Wubi+WinFOSS stuff (haven't checked that myself though)
<ogra_cmpc> imho we could drop it
<ogra_cmpc> but rich was clear that he wants to keep it
<ogra_cmpc> (and we have enough space to aste atm)
<stgraber> ok, I'll download one of the CD and see what we have there as I need to link the testcase to the right wikipage
 * stgraber is off for a break
<stgraber> ogra_cmpc: still around ?
<stgraber> ogra: ^^
<stgraber> I know I'm asking always the same question, but we will only have the Addon CD and will drop *all* of the others right ?
<stgraber> so Edubuntu desktop will also disappear and we won't even have a LiveCD for demo purpose ?
<ogra> i cant say yes to the latter yet
<ogra> rich wants a demo CD
<ogra> i dont think i can do that technically easy
<stgraber> well, we will come back to the space problem then ...
<ogra> since we'll break on size here
<ogra> we wont, it simply wont fit
<ogra> edubuntu-desktop depends on ubuntu-desktop
<ogra> that means we'll add up to the ubuntu CD *in any case*
<ogra> and since that will be as close to the edge as possible there is no romm for even adding a wallpaper
<stgraber> ok, that's what I thought (having an Edubuntu demo CD with no educational software doesn't make any sense), thanks for the answer
<ogra> but there was no final word yet
<ogra> i just can point out the technical limitation here
<stgraber> so I'll drop Edubuntu desktop from the tracker, I still can add it back afterwards
<ogra> probably rich says we can go with 800M media since its a demo only version and people have to care themselves or so
<ogra> right
<stgraber> ogra: heno sent you and Richard a mail about WinFOSS
<ogra> no point in testing oversized crap anyway
<stgraber> basically WinFOSS isn't maintained anymore
<ogra> yes, just saw it
<ogra> i'm fine with dropping it
<pablo7> just installed gutsy to my secondary hard drive this morning.
<pablo7> was wondering if someone could help me configure /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf manually.
<some_dude> I got some dhcpd.conf issues keeping me from doing anetwork boot
<Kamping_Kaiser> some_dude, orly?
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: sorry if you already answered the other day, but did you get my emails to pitti?
<ogra_cmpc> yes, saw them
<ogra_cmpc> we only touched the topic for two sentences on the weekend
<LaserJock> k
<LaserJock> well I haven't heard anything from the squeak maintainer for some time
<LaserJock> I'm afraid if Ubuntu Archive doesn't take the packages as-is they won't make it
<ogra_cmpc> right
<LaserJock> I can do native -> non-native changes
<ogra_cmpc> well, he wanted some smaller changes that look feasable
<LaserJock> although by now I've completely destroyed upstreams packaging :-)
<ogra_cmpc> like copying the licenses around etc
<LaserJock> yeah
<ogra_cmpc> thats no biggie
<LaserJock> the real problem is with the squeak package
<LaserJock> which makes the others pointless
<ogra_cmpc> i'm not near my mail atm ... grmbl
<LaserJock> I can't do much about GPL violations :-)
<ogra_cmpc> i dont see where that violation should suddenly come from
<LaserJock> it's not sudden I can't imagine
<LaserJock> but Ubuntu Archive seems to look a lot more carefully than in the old days
<ogra_cmpc> well, it was good enough for elmo
<ogra_cmpc> with the old package
<LaserJock> there's some PDFs
<ogra_cmpc> elmo looked very careful and deeply
<LaserJock> also some stuff that looks to be perhaps binary, but no source
<ogra_cmpc> and firest even rejected it
<ogra_cmpc> sabdfl pushed it in
<LaserJock> well
<LaserJock> we're claiming that it's GPL
<LaserJock> which I'm not so sure we should
<ogra_cmpc> hmm
<LaserJock> but there's *3* different files for the copyright/license and it's difficult to know which one is right
<ogra_cmpc> one oly applies to fonts iirc
<LaserJock> I'm told that the actual squeak VM is GPL, but squeak images, etc. are the squeak/apple license
<ogra_cmpc> right
<ogra_cmpc> thats what i was told as well
<LaserJock> but there's also a whole other directory that's got various plugins, etc.
<ogra_cmpc> and i think thats also outlined on teh squeak site
<LaserJock> and I think a lot of them have individual README files
<ogra_cmpc> sigh
<LaserJock> yeah
<ogra_cmpc> i'm way to hogged with classmate else i'd jump on it :(
<LaserJock> this idea of syncing with the squeak guys was nice in theory
<ogra_cmpc> hrm, yeah
<LaserJock> but I've spent hours and hours already redoing their packaging
<LaserJock> I've got about 60KB of debdiffs already
<LaserJock> and that's just the little packaging stuff
<ogra_cmpc> phew
<ogra_cmpc> how about just improving our current package
<ogra_cmpc> and adding teh new stuff
<LaserJock> well, I do like their packages
<ogra_cmpc> that wont need to go past u-a
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> I can take their stuff, and rename the packages so that it fits
<ogra_cmpc> and make it appear like an update to our
<ogra_cmpc> s
<LaserJock> arrgg, I gotta run and teach
<ogra_cmpc> ciao
<LaserJock> yes, since the actual squeak stuff is upstream
<LaserJock> and not from those guys specifically
<ogra_cmpc> right
<LaserJock> I'll give it some thought and see how easy it'd be
<ogra_cmpc> i dont think we'll have a meeting tomorrow btw
<LaserJock> k
<ogra_cmpc> i have an immovable appointment
<LaserJock> I probably won't have time :/
<ogra_cmpc> qand rich vqanished
<ogra_cmpc> no idea whats up with him
<krsnendu> I am trying to install smbldap as a pdc on Hardy. Anyone know any tricks? It doesn't seem to work out of the box.
<krsnendu> I used the latest version of smbldap installer
#edubuntu 2008-03-05
<theunixgeek> I'm getting a "hal-storage-removable-mount-all-options refused uid 1000" error upon trying to mount my flash drive. What should I do to fix this?
<achandrashekar> Hey all..I have more interesting findings about the setup of djcp failover and ldap setup. Specifically as it addresses boot process
<achandrashekar> if i bring up the second ltsp server before the first, at which time the second has a ldap client connected to the ldap server first it  hngs.
<krsnendu>                                                                                                                                                  bnhghq ,ml
<krsnendu> sorry that was my baby
<stgraber> ogra__: Edubuntu Add-on amd64/i386 <-- Is that name good for you ?
<ogra__> Edubuntu (Ubuntu educational Add-on CD) amd64/i386
<ogra__> something like that
<ogra__> rich wants the new name exposed
<stgraber> ok, I'll see if that name isn't tool long for the tracker UI :)
<ogra__> so we can flip it around in intrepid to be "Ubuntu educational addon CD (edubuntu)"
<ogra__> well, esle just call it add-on :)
<ogra__> *else
<stgraber> I need to keep "Edubuntu" at the beginning for the tracker though (otherwise it wouldn't be in the menu)
<stgraber> trying with Edubuntu (Ubuntu educational Add-on)
<ogra__> then do as you suggested :)
<stgraber> keeping "Upgrade Edubuntu" as it is though as it's about upgrading the old Edubuntu and not the new Ubuntu educational thing :)
<ogra__> right
<jvanrooyen> Hi im busy changing my lts.conf file in edubuntu gutsy for the clients to use 1024x786 resolutions? Did the changes but it stays the same
<jvanrooyen> I also ran ltsp-update-image after changing
<jvanrooyen> Still shows the lower resolution
<jvanrooyen> Can anyone help on this one?
<coolio> can anyone tell me why the login authentication take so long
<coolio> infact sometimes it does not recognise the user
<ogra_cmpc> network saturation ?
<coolio> ogca: i have 40 terminals on networ, 1ghz between server and switch, terminals 100mb/s
<ogra_cmpc> whats the HW specs of that server
<ogra_cmpc> for 40 clients you will need at least 5.5G
<ogra_cmpc> if the machine is low on ram or has slow disks and is under heavy load, it can happen that sshd times out
<ogra_cmpc> generally you can look up login issues in /var/log/auth.log ... if you see the attempts in there its not the network ...
<ogra_cmpc> if you get to the point where the liogin manager goes away and you see a black screen with mouse pointer, thats already gnome-session, so probs with that will be logged in ~/.xsession-errors
<ogra_cmpc> generally saying "its slow" is like a bugreport that says "doesnt work ",,, you need to give a bit more details
<coolio> i am checking the log
<ogra_cmpc> whats the HW specs ? does the server have enough ram ?
<ogra_cmpc> and if so, do you use a kernel that can handle it
<coolio> 2 x cpu , 8gb memory
<ogra_cmpc> and the free command reports all 8gig ?
<stgraber> ogra: Have you done the seed/package deps change to install italc with LTSP (in place of tcm) ?
<ogra_cmpc> stgraber, after alpha is out
<ogra_cmpc> i didnt want to trigger new builds for it
<ogra_cmpc> so tonight or tomorrow
<ogra_cmpc> i'm also not sure yet if i want italc-master installed by default or if i just add it to the ship seed
<ogra_cmpc> -client will go into edubuntu-desktop
<ogra_cmpc> adding it to -server doesnt seem right either
<stgraber> ogra_cmpc: I'd make both optional as it'll open two extra ports and one shouldn't do that when directly connected to the internet
<ogra_cmpc> hmm
<ogra_cmpc> i'd like the client by default actually
<stgraber> why ?
<ogra_cmpc> so the teacher doesnt have to run around and install it everywhere
<stgraber> it'll have anyway
<stgraber> as he'll need to install his key on all computers
<ogra_cmpc> hrm
<ogra_cmpc> i thought about adding a gconf check to the .desktop file
<ogra_cmpc> so you could switch it on/off via a gconf key
<stgraber> the teacher needs to copy the public key from his computer to all of the others, so manual intervention (or scripted intervention) is needed in all cases
<ogra_cmpc> right, we need a good gui for that in 1.0.7 ;)
<ogra_cmpc> or 2.0 or whatever he will call the next version :)
<ogra_cmpc> anyway ... i'd like to have it there by default, it doesnt need to start though ...
<ogra_cmpc> is ica-launcher upstream ?
<stgraber> no
<stgraber> it's the LTSP hack
<ogra_cmpc> ah, cool
<ogra_cmpc> that could check for a gconf key
<stgraber> italc-launcher is the part generating the config file
<ogra_cmpc> or the kde equivalent :)
 * ogra_cmpc wonders what the kde equivalent for gconf might be
<stgraber> .kde ? not sure of what kind of API they have for it
<alumno10> hi all!
<alumno10> how can i umount usb drive in clients, with commands
<alumno10> ?
<alumno10> hi vistakiller
<vistakiller> hi
<alumno10> ogra_cmpc, do you remember that i had sis7019 sound hardware, which is not longer supported by kernel, since 2.6.14 or so, then i found an usb sound adapter, i want to now if this could be a solution?
<alumno10> the specific model is USBG-SV5
<alumno10> *(usb sound adapter model)
<alumno10> *the obsolete sis7019 sound hardware is on the clients
<even> hi there, anyone uses LTSP here ?
<alumno10> i do
<even> alumno10: which interface you uses
<even> ?
<alumno10> X
<even> hm?
<even> xfce ?
<alumno10> icewm
<even> hm
<alumno10> its pretty light, and loads instantly, the server is 512mbram 1200mhz amd , and clients are 200mhz ebox
<alumno10> (11 clients)
<even> hm 1 got a 8 xeon 1.6 with 6G of ram, i need support how many thins i can
<even> i'll lunch
<alumno10> ok,,,
<ogra_cmpc> even, you need aboout 128M per running session on the server plus 256M for the server to operate
<ogra_cmpc> so 1.5G give you 10 clients
<pygi> ogra, have a sec?
<ogra_cmpc> grmbl
<ogra_cmpc> bad day for freenode today it seems
<LaserJock> started last night for me
<LaserJock> lot's of netsplits
<ogra_cmpc> yep
<ogra_cmpc> there was an operator msg some hours ago
<ogra_cmpc> but that said they belive the DoS is done
<ogra_cmpc> doesnt look like though
<ogra_cmpc> pygi, still alive ?
<pygi> ogra_cmpc, yup
<pygi> just wanted to ask is there any edu-related app we would need? :)
<ogra_cmpc> hey
<pygi> hey ^_^
<ogra_cmpc> not at that state of the release
<pygi> oh, I know that! But I was thinking to write one as part of SoC
<ogra_cmpc> we have plenty of CD space though
<LaserJock> we should have a nice app-review at UDS
<LaserJock> get an early start on Hardy+1
<ogra_cmpc> yeah
 * LaserJock wants a really good chemistry teaching tool :-)
<pygi> oh well, no Edubuntu soc then :)
<ogra_cmpc> ubuntu educational SoC probably ;)
<LaserJock> heh
<pygi> ok, ok, that :P
<LaserJock> is Ubuntu a mentoring organization again this year?
<pygi> but with what kind of game/app/tool? :)
<pygi> LaserJock, as always :p
<ogra_cmpc> edubuntu as a brand will become only one piece of ubuntu in education
<pygi> ye, ye, I know
<ogra_cmpc> and i must say compared to the classromm cd + addon in gutsy, alternate + addon feels a lot cleaner
<LaserJock> pygi: I kinda wondered if we'd really get anything after the last couple years
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: indeed
 * ogra_cmpc spent most of the last days with install tests and it looks way more professional as it is now
<LaserJock> actually, what about that app-review engine/app that we spec'd out in Sevilla?
<ogra_cmpc> not as much piecemeal feeling anymore
<LaserJock> awesome
<LaserJock> would the app-review thing make a decent SoC project?
<ogra_cmpc> hmm
<ogra_cmpc> likely
<ogra_cmpc> but we should talk to the QA team
<LaserJock> it's not something one of us is likely to have time for in the near future :-)
<ogra_cmpc> they probably plan something alike in a bigger view
<LaserJock> PackageStorm :-)
<ogra_cmpc> stgraber, do you know if something like an appreview web tool for user feedback is on the QA team todo list ?
<ogra_cmpc> sounds somewhat like it would fall into the QA area
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> although as spec'd it would be a bit more
<ogra_cmpc> right
<LaserJock> but yeah, QA's seems to be doing that kind of stuff
<LaserJock> anyway, I think that'd probably make a good SoC
<ogra_cmpc> yeah
<LaserJock> I tend to think having SoC people write entirely new apps for Edubuntu is kind of a waste
<LaserJock> we don't do a lot of app development to start with ;-)
<LaserJock> other than maybe if somebody wanted to do some sort of LTSP project
<pygi> LaserJock, you mean as in good proposals?
<LaserJock> pygi: yeah
 * pygi doesnt even have an idea what that is
<pygi> LaserJock, what kind of user feedback app are you hunting for?
<ogra_cmpc> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuApplicationReview
<pygi> or in other words, where do I see the specs/
<pygi> ?
<ogra_cmpc> the spec is "something similar to the wine appdb" with the scope of the spec above focusing on ubuntu arcvive as backbone
<mario_> ergh
<mario_> damn connection
<stgraber> ogra_cmpc: define app review ?
<ogra_cmpc> stgraber, see the spec page above
<stgraber> ogra_cmpc: mvo asked for some kind of improved packages.ubuntu.com where users could vote for their favourite packages and vote for them
<ogra_cmpc> something similar to the wine appdb page
<ogra_cmpc> right if we get that sortable by category and we could have an edu section that would be perfect
<ogra_cmpc> what we thought of was actually a bit more
<ogra_cmpc> like a screenshot per app etc
<ogra_cmpc> and a review system that allows commenting
<stgraber> well, the idea of mvo was to use the code we did for http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com and use it for packages
<ogra_cmpc> right
<stgraber> so it'd be the same as brainstorm.u.c except that we would have all the packages in the DB
<stgraber> and use apt's category or something similar for sorting
<ogra_cmpc> the brainstorm release actually remineded me of the old spec :)
<pygi> stgraber, isnt that just an addition to brainstorm.u.c code then?
<ogra_cmpc> or rather of the fact that this belongs in QA
<pygi> (if that's open source?)
<stgraber> we'll have an Ubuntu QA and Ubuntu Brainstorm session at FOSSCamp
<stgraber> pygi: brainstorm.ubuntu.com (open source) is one of the Ubuntu QA modules for Drupal
<stgraber> pygi: it's in fact the same website as iso.qa.ubuntu.com and qa.ubuntu.com
<ogra_cmpc> great, i'll attend (i think ... not sure i'm planned for fosscamp this time)
<stgraber> Nicolas and myself will only be at FOSSCamp no UDS for me this time :)
<ogra_cmpc> oh :(
<stgraber> well, I have exams the same week as UDS :(
<ogra_cmpc> prague is so nice, you should consider adding one or two vacation days, its cheap there
<ogra_cmpc> gah
<stgraber> yes ... bad timing :)
<ogra_cmpc> will be a strange uds ... the first time since sydney without jim and scott ...
<ogra_cmpc> in boston we had at least scottie
<mrunagi> NOT IF THE FUCKING SHOULD LISTEN
<mrunagi> OR IF THEY ARE GOD DAMN RIGHT!
<mrunagi> FUCK THE GOD DAMN OPS!
<mrunagi> EVERY ONE OF THEM!
<mrunagi> I HOPE YOU ALL FUCKING DIE GOD DAMN LOSERS!
 * ogra doesnt want to die ,,,
<alumno10> hi all
<alumno10> hey, edubuntu feisty, uses ltsp5 right?
<alumno10> and according to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.22/+bug/187879
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 187879 in linux-source-2.6.22 "ac97_codec module and symbols missing, some OSS modules can't load [undefined symbol ac97_probe_codec]" [Undecided,Won't fix]
<alumno10> sis7019 might work ?
 * ogra wont attend the meeting tonight ... see you all tomorrow ...
<stgraber> hmm, ok ... see you
<alumno10> bye ogra
<ogra> stgraber, rich will run a short one though
<stgraber> k
<alumno10> hey, edubuntu feisty, uses ltsp5 right?
<alumno10> and feisty has sis7019 support too right??
<alumno10> analfabeta
<analfabeta> hi
<alumno10> hola
<elisboa> all
<RichEd> == edubuntu meeting == in #ubuntu-meeting in 5 mins ==
<RichEd> who's here for the meeting ?
<RichEd> ogra is not available tonight
<RichEd> hi LaserJock
<RichEd> ogra is not here for the meeting tonight :( so no tech
<RichEd> and i have a small crisis at home i am dealing with
<RichEd> did you or stgraber or anyone else have any major pressing issues ?
<LaserJock> I don't think so
<LaserJock> squeak isn't going all that well
<LaserJock> but I'm trying to figure out a way to get it to work
<RichEd> i really need to attend to my issue at home ... so if anyone pops up, let them know we're not holding any formal discussion tonight
<LaserJock> RichEd: oh, Google Summer of Code is starting up again. We might want to give some thought to any useful projects
<LaserJock> will do
<RichEd> could you run it then ?
<LaserJock> run what?
<dcsquare> is edubuntu a version of ubuntu with the educational apps added? Or the difference is bigger?
<RichEd> thanks ... pop in to the channel, raise the topic and see as a sidebar if anyone is around for comment or discussion
<RichEd> i'll check logs from my window tomorrow for any follow up
<LaserJock> RichEd: don't worry, we got your back ;-)
<RichEd> thanks mate
<RichEd> appraciated
<LaserJock> dcsquare: somewhat bigger
<LaserJock> dcsquare: a heavy target use case for Edubuntu is classroom LTSP servers
<LaserJock> Edubuntu has been going through some changes recently
<LaserJock> where LTSP itself has moved to the Ubuntu Alternate CD
<LaserJock> and now we'll ship an Ubuntu Education Addon CD that has the educational apps and misc goodies
<LaserJock> for 8.04
<dcsquare> I really like the games for my 4 year old, but I want to be able to use the computer as a "normal" computer too
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> that's no problem
<dcsquare> for the moment i have ubuntu installed, and I tried edubuntu from the desktop cd
<LaserJock> what version of Ubuntu do you have installed?
<dcsquare> 7.10
<LaserJock> k
<LaserJock> what you might want to do is grab the Edubuntu Classroom Server Addon CD
 * stgraber waves
<dcsquare> I didn't see any major differences, but I thought I should ask first
<LaserJock> in your Ubuntu install you can pop that CD in and it'll give you some option for installing the edu apps
<LaserJock> without messing up your Ubuntu install
<dcsquare> cool :)
<LaserJock> and it has more stuff than the Desktop CD has
<dcsquare> so I can make my daughter happy and keep my amp and eclipse :)
<LaserJock> my guess is that gcompris and tuxpaint would be real good apps
<LaserJock> yep
<dcsquare> thank you very much
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> another thing you can do
<LaserJock> if you don't want to download the whole CD
<LaserJock> is there are some metapackages that start with edubuntu-addon-
<dcsquare> I don't mind downloading the CD
<LaserJock> edubuntu-addon-young might be appropriate
<LaserJock> ok, that's cool
<dcsquare> I'm on a decent connection
<LaserJock> let's you play around more
<dcsquare> thank you for your time
<LaserJock> no problem
#edubuntu 2008-03-06
<slashdotfx> anyone had any luck to make ltspfs mount unpartitioned usb stick?
<elisboa> slashdotfx: you mean pendrives that have the mbr formatted, instead of a partition?
<elisboa> such as some mp3 players?
<slashdotfx> elisboa, yes exactly
<elisboa> slashdotfx: do you have the detection script with you righ now?
<elisboa> I can check it out
<elisboa> if it's a shell script, it won't be hard to fix
<slashdotfx> yes, it's a shellscript
<elisboa> slashdotfx: can you send me?
<elisboa> or paste via web somewhere?
<slashdotfx> ok, hold on
<slashdotfx> via ltspfs.pastebin.com ok?
<elisboa> ok :)
<slashdotfx> uh, should we looking at udev instead of the shellscript?
<slashdotfx> according to this document https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebugLocalDev
<elisboa> if it's with udev, I don't know
<elisboa> but I will look at the script first, and try to find what is lacking
<elisboa> is the script available somewhere?
<elisboa> it says it doesn't work with unpartitioned disks
<elisboa> it's a bug
<elisboa> and is fixable
<slashdotfx> I'm a bit confused which script should be modified
<elisboa> can i have the script?
<slashdotfx> there are
<elisboa> slashdotfx: I have made a probing script, sometime
<elisboa> ago
<slashdotfx> ltspfsmounter
<elisboa> and it predicted unpartitioned disks as well
<elisboa> ` it reads data from sysfs
<elisboa> slashdotfx: do you want to see it?
<slashdotfx> yes please
<slashdotfx> maybe I can merge it down into my box
<elisboa> slashdotfx: have it: pub.ueberalles.net/probe.sh
<elisboa> slashdotfx: my script has a problem; it checks if the device is listed on fstab; if it is not, it isn't listed
<elisboa> actually, it shouldn't need fstab after all
<elisboa> it fetches the device mount path from ther, instead of define a bsae rootdir and complete it with device's name
<elisboa> s/ther/there/
<elisboa> but it's not hard to understand it's engine, i ugess
<elisboa> maybe you can use it for you
<slashdotfx> ok, I'm digesting here
<elisboa> bonapetit
<slashdotfx> your script should be installed under ltsp chroot right?
<krsnendu> looking for help with choppy flash videos on thin clients. I have LDM_DIRECTX set but still choppy. I'm using Hardy.
<krsnendu> In Feisty the choppiness went away with LDM_DIRECTX.
<slashdotfx> according to this thread
<slashdotfx> http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?thread_name=200802141431.34615.cjr%40tridentgarages.co.uk&forum_name=ltsp-discuss
<slashdotfx> I need to modify udev rules
<slashdotfx> elisboa, does your script executed manually?
<slashdotfx> it works, after modifying udev rules
<slashdotfx> ACTION=="add", SUBSYSTEM=="block", KERNEL=="sd[a-z]", RUN+="add_fstab_entry %k auto"
<slashdotfx> adding that to /etc/udev/rules.d/88-ltsp.rules
<elisboa> slashdotfx: yes, it executes manually
<elisboa> it only probes devices
<elisboa> slashdotfx: sorry for the delay; i was moving fro mcollege to home
<elisboa> slashdotfx: tell me, did it help to fix the bug?
<slashdotfx> ic, no problem
<slashdotfx> well I need to test it further
<elisboa> I am at home, ubuntu here
<elisboa> I can help you if you want
<elisboa> help to test, I mean
<slashdotfx> since I'm test by deleting my own pendrive partition, and mkdosfs it without partition
<elisboa> slashdotfx: you can use mkfs.vfat too
<elisboa> or mkfs.vfat -F32 if it's bigger than 2 GB
<slashdotfx> well now the pendrive is mounted, even without partition
<elisboa> yeaaaaah!
<slashdotfx> elisboa, I'll report back to the channel asap after I got some real user bringing their mp3 players
<slashdotfx> thank you very much for your help
<elisboa> slashdotfx: can I see how did you modified your 88-ltsp.rules?
<slashdotfx> ok, its in here http://ltspfs.pastebin.com/m1176d890
<elisboa> slashdotfx: I don't want to be preachy, but... Wouldn't it be interesting to use a rule for removable cd writers as well? They usually are named /dev/scd*
<elisboa> slashdotfx: I've made this alteration: http://ltspfs.pastebin.com/m51409197
<elisboa> I don't have a removable CD writer here, but I have it at work
<elisboa> if you want, I can test it there
<elisboa> it's 00:00 now where I am. Brazil, -03:00
<elisboa> I usually get to owrk at 10:00
<elisboa> or 13:00 GMT
<elisboa> oops, 01:00 PM GMT
<slashdotfx> ic, I don't have removable cd writer here either, but it doesn't hurt to test it right
<elisboa> yes
<elisboa> if the line doesn't present any syntax error, it will be good for now :)
<elisboa> so, I can test it at work and see if it works
<slashdotfx> yes, excellent
<elisboa> I know it's somehow hard to imagine that a thin client would have an external cd-drive, but if this lines gives us this feature, then there will be no excuses for this feature not to be present
<elisboa> sorry if my english is seems ; i am not a native speakerbad
<slashdotfx> no, your english is great
<slashdotfx> I'm indonesian, english is not my native language too, but as long as we understand each other, its ok
<elisboa> good :)
<elisboa> I had a little problem with the keyboard, haha
<slashdotfx> oops, now I'm seeing double mount point
<coolio> i have a weird problem, the server goes really slow when then its nor directly connected to the internet, any thoughts
<stgraber> dns resolution problems probably
<johnny_> hmm.. is gnome-cups-manager still needed these days?
<johnny_> evil thing pegs my cpu to 100% every once in awhile, causes music to skip
<stgraber> johnny_: nope, it's replaced by system-config-printer
<Muhammad_Saad> Hello, I have a question. Does a standalone Edubuntu workstation installation also contain the kernel headers? I will need them to compile the driver for my modem? I want to make everything ready before I install Edubuntu.
<johnny_> thanks stgraber :)
<johnny_> it wasn't autoremoved when i upgraded tho
<johnny_> bbiab
<Muhammad_Saad> Does anyone know about my question?
<Muhammad_Saad> If I have to download the kernel headers separately, which packages should I download?
<cooli1> just started installing gutsy I chose raid 1 and now want delete, what to do from here
<bdgraue> where can i get an hardy alpha5/6 cd-iso?
<bdgraue> i can only find an current dvd-image
<ogra_cmpc> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/hardy/alpha-5/
<ogra_cmpc> you need the ubuntu desktop or alternate cd for it
<ogra_cmpc> alternate has the ltsp bits in case you are after that
<ogra_cmpc> (which can be found at http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/hardy/alpha-5/)
<bdgraue> ogra_cmpc: i am looking for the edubuntu thin client installation, i have an 400MHz AMD-K6 with 192 MB RAM and will install an edubuntu, i think a normal edubuntu installation is to big for the old machine.
<ogra_> bdgraue, thin clients need a server
<ogra_> they boot off the network
<bdgraue> i thought i can use my kubuntu desktop as server
<ogra_> that spec would indeed make a godd TC
<ogra_> well, then just install ltsp on your kubuntu desktop :)
<ogra_> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPQuickInstall
<ogra_> no need for the iso
<ogra_> (at least with a decent DSL line)
<bdgraue> i have to learn, how to configure the thin client
<bdgraue> i'll try and learn :)
<ogra_> it configures itself
<ogra_> during boot it detects all HW related stuff it needs and sets up everything
<ogra_> the client is only used as a display and input/output device ... the actual session runs on the server so all that would be there to configure would be tweaks of the X server setup for special mouse or keyboard setups ...
<ogra_> there are some things to change in your desktop setup if you use kde though (i.e. redirect the desktop sound output)
<bdgraue> i will read all i can get and try it, thanks for your help ogra_
<bdgraue> if i have more questions, i'll aks :)
<bdgraue> ask
<ogra_> if you have questions, dont hesitate to come back and ask :)
<bdgraue> i have a lot of questions, but all for a later state
<bdgraue> one step after the other :)
<bdgraue> (i think my english isn't the best)
<cberl1> Hi folks.  got a little issue with an edubuntu server not authenticating clients (X11 connection rejected because of wrong authentication).  I know I've seen this issue discussed in the mailing list for edubuntu-users, but I can't seem to find the solution.  Any thoughts?
<cberl1> I can't ssh to the server and forward my connection, either.  Does this help at all??
<cberl1> Hey, anyone know what scp-client is?  I seem to be missing it on my Edubuntu LTSP server...
<cberl1> Okay, found out what it is.  any idea if it may be the cause of my users not being able to authenticate and get a session on my LTSp server?
<bdgraue> * Starting DHCP server dhcpd3             [fail]  <-- and i have no idea why, i thought it would be simple to set up an ltsp-server and only start the 'client-pc' via lan :(
<bdgraue> is it easier with hardy alpha then with gutsy?
<Muhammad_Saad> Hello, I want to know if the edubuntu cd comes along with the kernel development headers. I need them to compile my modem driver.
<Muhammad_Saad> In the directory /pool/main/l/linux-source-2.6.22 on the CD I see some packages starting with linux-headers-x.y.z.deb. Are these what I need?
<Muhammad_Saad> Does anyone here know?
<Paladine> anyone know if Alistair Crust frequents this channel (see http://www.ubuntu.com/products/casestudies/Skegness )
<LaserJock> bah
 * LaserJock stabs bugzilla.gnome.org
<ogra_> Paladine, he writes to the edubuntu-users ML from time to time ...
<johnny> ogra_ hi..
<johnny> i got federico to do autotools magic for me.. and now sabayon is actually going to generate proper desktop file with X-GNOME-Bugzilla-Version
<johnny> so bug reports will be filed more correctly
<Paladine> ogra_, thanks, was hoping maybe he came in here, he has invited me to his school to tour his labs, would have been nice to have a "face to face" in the irc sense first :)
<ogra_> right
<ogra_> if he is/was here, i'm not aware of his nick
<Neon_lights> um...hello? xD
<LaserJock> hello
<Neon_lights> Hiya. :] I had a couple questions about Edubuntu.
<Neon_lights> and I'm prolly gonna sound like an idiot, but oh well. I always do. Heheh. ^^; But anyway, I'm in Vegas, and my mom knows quite a few people on the county's school board
<Neon_lights> And we were reading the paper today, and they're revamping their computer systems and stuff
<LaserJock> cool
<LaserJock> I'm in Reno ;-)
<Neon_lights> Cool. I envy you, Reno is a lot more awesome then Vegas. =P
<LaserJock> heh
<Neon_lights> So anyway, we were thinking we'd send a couple emails out and ask if it's possible if they'd use Linux instead. =]
<Neon_lights> And I guess I'm just wondering if ya know of any schools in the country that already use it that I could maybe use as a reference or something?
<LaserJock> boy, I'm not sure of the specifics off the top of my head
<LaserJock> but there's schools in Maine and Indiana
<LaserJock> perhaps some in California too
<LaserJock> I'd send an email to the edubuntu-users mailing list or look through some of the archives even
<Neon_lights> Hm, okay
<LaserJock> but yeah, there are a number of schools around that are using it successfully
<Neon_lights> Cool. :D Thanks.
<Neon_lights> Maybe we'll add a couple more to that number
#edubuntu 2008-03-07
<donspaulding> anyone at the keyboard in here?
<donspaulding> guess not atm, later!
<jamey> Can anyone recommend a good supplier for complete thin clients systems in the UK?
<RichEd> jamey: pop into #lstp and ask sbalneav when he surfaces in around 5 hours (US time)
<RichEd> or jammcq
<jamey> RichEd: thanks a lot
<RichEd> their life & careers are based on LTSP and edubuntu uses the core LTSP
<jamey> great, they will surely know then
<RichEd> jammcq is in fact a dealer / supplier ... us based ... but could surely recommend a local fit for you
<prampatan> hai
<prampatan> can you help me to install my laptop wide screen 1280x800 mode
<Diskdoc> Anyone around? I'm trying to debug a problem with my Edubuntu-terminals
<Diskdoc> USB sticks not mounting.. I followed this guide: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebugLocalDev
<ogra_cmpc> whats the prob?
<ogra_cmpc> gutsy ?
<Diskdoc> Yes, Gutsy. ..and arrived at the last step (4). Running the ssh-command in a console on a terminal (set up by means of the lts.conf on the server) I got errors of "permissions denied"
<ogra_cmpc> Diskdoc, edit /usr/bin/ltspfsmounter on the server, remove the line that sets DISPLAY
<ogra_cmpc> its a known bug
<Diskdoc> I tried ltsp-update-sshkeys but that didn't help..
<Diskdoc> Thanks! I'll try
<Diskdoc> Hmm..seems that file doesn't exist on the server!
<ogra_cmpc> look in sbin, i might have the path wrong
<Diskdoc> Found it.. I should have used locate instead of asking you :) Tireeedd.. Afternoon here in Finland and I'm just off (official) work for a weekend of more work organizing a youth-event
<Diskdoc> Alright..rebooting to test
<Diskdoc> Hmm..still won't mount my USB-stick. I'll check the SSH-step again
<Diskdoc> No..Step 4 of the guide is still giving me Permission denied-errors
<Diskdoc> I didn't remove "env['DISPLAY'] = 'localhost:10.0'" though..just put a # in front
<ogra_cmpc> froget about the console :)
<ogra_cmpc> just log in and plug in a key
<ogra_cmpc> it should work
<Diskdoc> That's what I did.. <:'-o
<ogra_cmpc> did you tweak your lts.conf in any way ?
<ogra_cmpc> (beyond giving you a console)
<Diskdoc> No really.. I have  SCREEN_02 = "shell" and  SCREEN_07 = "startx" for this terminal
<Diskdoc> I'll run off and check using another, just in case
<ogra_cmpc> Diskdoc, drop startx
<ogra_cmpc> XDMCP doesnt support local devices
<ogra_cmpc> (use ldm instead)
<ogra_cmpc> so: SCREEN_02 = "shell" and  SCREEN_07 = "ldm"
<ogra_cmpc> then try again
<Diskdoc> Oops..I knew that, I just forgot! :-P
<ogra_cmpc> :)
<Diskdoc> Tried plugging my USB-stick into a terminal upstairs in our lab.. It worked! However, right-clicking on the device icons on the deskop there were no option to unmount/eject in the menus
<ogra_cmpc> no need for that
<ogra_cmpc> just yank it out
<ogra_cmpc> ltspfs only acually mounts the device during read or write operations, the resto of the time its unmounted transparetly
<Diskdoc> Oh! Interesting
<ogra_cmpc> so just dont pull it out if you see a progressbar :)
<ogra_cmpc> the rest of the time its safe
<Diskdoc> Well, then everything's just peachy :) Thanks for the help
<Diskdoc> !
<ogra_cmpc> (it un mounts two seconds after the last read or write operation)
<Diskdoc> Next project before I get a break is to get openSUSE running on the laptop we use for the projector.. I've put a lot of time trying to get the Broadcom wireless device working in Ubuntu.. I've done it before on other laptops using both bcm43xx and ndiswrapper but for some reason this doesn't want to..
<ogra_cmpc> di you try with the retricted-manager gui tool ?
<ogra_cmpc> i'm using bcm43xx since some releases with no probs
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: I'm going to try to do a dfsg repack of squeak's .orig.tar.gz
<Kggk> http://exiousos.com/EDU.html web-based Edubuntu :P
#edubuntu 2008-03-08
<biabia__> I have a pc, it connects to my wireless network with 64bit wep in windows, but not in edubuntu. i followed the command line setup but dhclient wlan0 doesnt set the ip (yes i tried the gui, also with no luck)
<biabia__> any ideas
<biabia__> also, it connects fine to my neighbors unsecured networks although the signal strength is low so speeds arent so great
<serdar> hi guys
<biabia__> hi serdar
<biabia__> im a little late, and i must admit my attention isnt strictly devoted to this one channel
<johnny> ogra_cmpc, is there a reason that ltsp-build-cli
<johnny> oops
<allerbest> Hi!
<allerbest> Is this the right channel for n00bs who are not getting LTSP to run like the want? ;->
<stgraber> allerbest: this one of #ltsp
<allerbest> stgraber: thanks
#edubuntu 2008-03-09
<calimer> wow Hirato didn't know you hung out in here, haha
<calimer> my brother is actually in #inquisition if you ever wanted to meet him
<Hirato> no noe expects the spanish inquisition >.<
<Hirato> well mike, I don't, I just joiend quicker than you :)
<calimer> yeah I'm slow
<calimer> I forgot already what I was supposed to talk to LaserJock about
<LaserJock> ?
<calimer> oh yeah I'm supposed to ask you about Dtrak
<calimer> oh and sandbox lite is going to be out soon
<calimer> which meets the "free" criteria
<Hirato> as in speech >.<
<LaserJock> what do you want to ask about?
<calimer> some guy named Dtrak
<calimer> the guy from http://www.linuxgamingworld.com recommended I talk to him about SB and said you'd know who he was
<LaserJock> hmm, interesting
<calimer> ut oh...
<calimer> haha
<LaserJock> I don't remember anybody by that nick specifically
<calimer> I guess he works in maine in a school
<LaserJock> I wonder if it's David Trask or Matt Oquist
<LaserJock> I think Matt's in Maine
<calimer> here is the exact quote
<calimer> "Dtrak works for a school up there in Maine and he can do projects"
<LaserJock> probably Matt then
<calimer> cool, does he still stop in?
<hirat1> meh
<LaserJock> calimer: yeah, he's moquist
<calimer> not sure what that means
<LaserJock> that's his nick in here
<calimer> oh duh, sorry it is late here, haha
<LaserJock> np
<calimer> and trying to figure out everything he said to me
<calimer> learning about lugs and locos as well
<calimer> and btw LaserJock we released a new version :)
<LaserJock> very good
<calimer> I can't wait to get you guys Lite
<calimer> I wonder if we could get it into ubuntu too, I would go crazy!!
<calimer> I had no idea all these linux communities even existed
<calimer> certainly things have come along way since my first days of redhat 8.0 and mandrake 9, haha
<Hirato> we're currently working on some multilingual stuff, so if ou know anyone who can help out i  translating, it would be very much appreciated
<calimer> oh yeah I gotta e-mail my italian friend
<calimer> him and his band did some of the heavy metal music in LMS :)
<calimer> btw H my brother heads back on Monday so should hopefully have lite on the SVN then :)
<calimer> I just want to make sure it is cleaned out before I put it on
<Hirato> just a blooming shame I can't delete .svn directories with -rm -rf
<Hirato> also calimer, I might be uploading symlinks soon, so be prepared for a migraine :)
<calimer> why do you think it will be a migraine?
<calimer> and what are symlinks?
<Hirato> fat32/ntfs = no support for symlinks
<calimer> what are they for though?
<Hirato> um.. as it sys, links, used to minimise on file sizes, and make directory navigation easir
<calimer> I don't understand yet why that would bother me
<Hirato> windows systems haveno support for them
<calimer> and...
<calimer> I don't care that much about windows, only on it until I get LMS out the door :)
<calimer> stupid engine tools :\
<Hirato> then you'll be joining me in running code blocks under wine :D
<Hirato> and of course theming wine and complaining on how slow it is :D
<calimer> yeah hopefully :)
<Hirato> so calimer, do you think we should include linux and windows exutables in the same package?
<calimer> why wouldn't we?
<calimer> and yes, I think we should :)
<Hirato> I thought you liked your current arrangement of windows systems.zip and posix systems.zip
<Hirato> heh heh :)
<calimer> it is windows system exe and multi zip
<calimer> and I would love it to just be the zip but well ya know....
<Hirato> meh... just don't include the damn .o's >.<
<calimer> :D
<Hirato> I think taht's why the linux zip is a whole 12 MB bigger
<calimer> what directory are you looking at?
<Hirato> I'll go download it
 * Hirato sulks as it doesn't run under wine :(
<Hirato> oh well, that means I don't get to test the windows bin :)
<Hirato> while we're here, let's ask the experts :)
<calimer> about what?
<Hirato> would executign a binary fix it's permissions
<calimer> the compling the mac binary on nix ? :)
<Hirato> taht too :)
<Hirato> though, won't we need the carbon headers for that
<Hirato> or quartz, or whatever the OSX theme is called
<calimer> oh the libraries, yeah prob
<Hirato> and probably apple's screwed up version of GCC too
<Hirato> http://www.cubeengine.com/forum.php4?action=display_thread&thread_id=1688 <-- as you can see by that, cube 2's performance on some macs have become quite questionable
<Hirato> so how's GCompris and all that stuff coming along :)
<LaserJock> gcompris seems good
<LaserJock> did some testing
<LaserJock> I might need to pull in a newer version before hardy is finalized
<calimer> what does gcompris do?
 * Hirato is using the alpha :)
<Hirato> it's at alpha 5 at the moment right?
<calimer> my nix HD is so in the stoneage, haha
<calimer> with my mandrake 10.1 and all
<Hirato> they chanegd their name to mandriva :)
<calimer> yeah the version I have is the one right before they did that I believe
<calimer> they merged with another distro, I forgot which one
<calimer> I have really wanted to try ubuntu
<calimer> especially xubuntu
<calimer> I think I would die if I saw sandbox in the list of games to install
<Hirato> in happiness or urge of suicide
<calimer> shock/happiness
<Hirato> not a good think at all, who's gonna do all the PR and package the releases >.<
<calimer> and screw up the files
<Hirato> well yeah, that too
<Hirato> we can just dos2unix them to fix it :P
<calimer> haha
<calimer> I have a map i want to make soon
<calimer> there is a story I've wanted to write for a long time and I want to map out the area
<calimer> I gotta find my old maps of it
<Kamping_Kaiser> hm. does edubuntu really still ship i386 kernels not 486?
<Kamping_Kaiser> nixternal, you around? (iirc your an edu-doc person?)
<nixternal> ya, what's up?
<nixternal> I am working on my 100-a-day :)
<nixternal> holy smokes, 03:00, time flies when you are having fun
<Kamping_Kaiser> 100? 100 whats?
<nixternal> 100 bugs a day
<Kamping_Kaiser> oh. wow.
<nixternal> 90 of those are usually duplicates or 3+ years old
<Kamping_Kaiser> still wow.
<nixternal> what's up with the docs?
<Kamping_Kaiser> nixternal, if i do up some patches, if i'm not sure about a change should i do it in a seperate patch, or you can selectively apply stuff?
<Kamping_Kaiser> s/stuff/a patch
<nixternal> do it in a separate patch
<Kamping_Kaiser> will do. thanks for that
<Kamping_Kaiser> if your heading to sleep, sleep well ;)
<nixternal> ya, I think I will in a few minutes...I wasn't paying attention to time at all
<Nubae> hey, has alpha6 totally migrated to gvfs now?
<Nick_M_> Anyone have any thoughts on a web-based Edubuntu?
<subsume> Could someone please clear up some confusing for me regarding https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPFatClients ?
<subsume> I've got some directions setting up an LTSP fat client but I need some small clarification. Could someone please help?
<subsume> I know I can load an operating system in the /opt folder of the host machine. But I am not understanding how client machines read from this.
<stgraber> basically they load the kernel and initrd from the network (using PXE and a DHCP server)
<stgraber> then they run the kernel which loads the initrd which contains the tools required to network mount the harddisk
<stgraber> the harddisk is either exported using NFS (Ubuntu Feisty for example) or NBD (>=Gutsy)
<stgraber> then it's mounted and used as main harddisk, the changes between this remote HDD and the running system are stored in RAM, so everything is lost after reboot
<subsume> NFS mounted disk
<subsume> Ok I think I see the step where this happens
<subsume> actually... no. I don't.
<subsume> stgraber: let's assume I've taken all the instructed steps on the server machine... what needs to be set up on a client machine?
<subsume> should I just set them up like normal thin-clients
<subsume> (edubuntu installer) ?
<stgraber> those will be configured the same way as normal thin clients
<subsume> edubuntu installer?
<subsume> ?
<stgraber> the only difference is that what they get from the server is a complete system instead of a minimal system
<stgraber> no, you should just have to update the BIOS to network boot
<subsume> stgraber: ah-HA.
<stgraber> or if you are running old hardware, to either add a PXE ROM to their network cards or use a boot floppy to perform PXE boot
<stgraber> then they'll get their IP and PXE config from the DHCP server, will then contact the edubuntu server using TFTP, get the kernel and initrd and boot
<stgraber> (yes, it's easy once you have been running that kind of setup for months/years :))
<subsume> jee that clears things up
<subsume> wow. that's grand!
<subsume> stgraber: Have you seen that doc I linked to? Is RAM and processing power in this case are functions of the client machine. yes?
<subsume> PXE ROM if they can't netboot... hmm.
<subsume> Never heard of that.
<subsume> If I connect my fat clients via network cables instead of wifi will they be faster??
<stgraber> subsume: sure and you can't PXE boot using wifi (or only with some weird piece of hardware on unprotected networks)
<stgraber> ogra_: ping
<pygi> stgraber, I'd say ogra sleeps at this time of night? :p
<stgraber> well, I don't and I'm in the same timezone as he's :)
<stgraber> so I thought that maybe it'd be my lucky day
#edubuntu 2009-03-02
<nothingman> hi, all
<nothingman> I installed the alternate disk as an ltsp server, but when I log in on the server (haven't installed the addon disc yet) I get a black screen with the arrow cursor
<anom1> hi.
<anom1> just wondering if I'm missing any Edubuntu downloads, because after installing the whole 8.10 Addon CDROM (I believe), I only see about 10+ new programs, mostly in the Education menu (gnome).
 * anom1 dreams of seeing Mark Shuttleworth in person one day...
<itstegg> will the edubuntu addon install over xubuntu ?
 * anom1 wishes there are many apps for various subjects - Physics, Chemistry, Geography, History (general), Biology, etc...
<Ahmuck-Jr> Nubae is there a place on the apps site where one can create a section called "wanted apps"
<Ahmuck-Jr> something a person could describe the educational app they are looking for and describe how it should perform?
<anom1> Ahmuck-Jr: Thank you. Will take a look.
<Ahmuck-Jr> anom1: i don't think there is a place yet
<anom1> but what do you guys think about edubuntu?  or are you guys in here just to chat or something?
 * anom1 just wants to start a conversation and listen to people talk.
<gfarbal2> Hi! Anybody can help me setting up local devices support in a LTSP server? I'm using 2.6.24-23 kernel, I've fuse module insmoded, my user is in fuse group, and my thin device recognizes my USB stick but... Gnome icon's... doesn't appear :-( Any idea? Thank you!
<Ahmuck-Jr> LaserJock: could we get a place on the website for applications ideas?
<ogra> Ahmuck-Jr, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/edubuntu-application-review feel free to implement the spec :)
<LaserJock> actually, we have Brainstorm
<LaserJock> I sent out an email about it
 * LaserJock wonders if people ever read his emails sometimes :-)
<ogra> well, brainstorm isnt really a replacement for an app overview DB
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> but I sent out an email saying we can use it as an interim solution
<LaserJock> since I'm guessing the full app review DB is gonna take somet time to implement
<Ahmuck-Jr> need to put it in the topic me thinks
<Ahmuck-Jr> after the question came up here, i envisoined a place where someone could fill out the title, the app idea, and the details needed to make the app function
<Ahmuck-Jr> then it would be a wait and see to find out if there was someone that would implement the app
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> the spec that ogra linked to has a lot of great ideas
<Ahmuck-Jr> is that brainstorm ?
<LaserJock> not so much
<ogra> no
<Ahmuck-Jr> coders do well at coding, but not so well at what apps teachers need to teach
<LaserJock> Brainstorm let's you create an idea and talk about it
<ogra> its the spec we worked out at the seville UDS for presenting and voting for apps
<Ahmuck-Jr> so let them specify what apps they are looking for and then if a dev want's to try it, let them try it
<ogra> but nobody ever implemented it
<Ahmuck-Jr> or someone wants to pay for a gpled development
<LaserJock> I still say though that the problem is not primarily finding things to work on, but rather finding resources to do so
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> not enough devs in edubuntu land was always the prob
<LaserJock> however, if we can be more efficient at doing that, then that's a good idea
<Ahmuck-Jr> it doesn't need to be edubuntu devs
<LaserJock> right
<Ahmuck-Jr> but the seed could be planted at edubuntu
 * ogra didnt say edubuntu devs 
<ogra> i said in edubuntu land :)
<Ahmuck-Jr> so if dev a is looking for something to polish thier resume, they could pick up an edu app at edubuntu
<ogra> (which includes ubuntu devs or anyone else who is willing)
<ogra> there are millions of demanding users and teachers but only a handfull of devs at all
<ogra> in the three years i did edubuntu the best i could get were people willing to help but only with documentation
<ogra> and i doubt that changed much
<LaserJock> mostly the best is to get people who are alread devs interested in Education from what I've seen
<ogra> yes
<ogra> its the only way
<LaserJock> that's how ogra and I got into it
<Ahmuck-Jr> or pay for dev
<ogra> that doesnt generate more devs magically
<ogra> but feel free to try it and put up a bounty :)
<alkisg> Lns: man sqlite => .sqliterc may be a way to automatically insert group "places" entries in firefox, I think you were looking for something like that...
<Lns> alkisg: wow, thanks, i'll look into that!
<Lns> alkisg: do you have any docs on .sqliterc syntax/usage?
<alkisg> Lns, they're standard .commands
<alkisg> E.g. put this in .sqliterc:
<alkisg> .output /tmp/sqlite.out
<alkisg> .databases
<alkisg> .output stdout
<alkisg> Then if you run sqlite and just .quit, you'll see a /tmp/sqlite.out file with your databases
<Lns> hrm
<alkisg> You may also include a file with sql statements (like, select * from moz_places)
 * Lns isn't familiar with .commands - is that all standard sql syntax?
<Lns> ah
<alkisg> Lns, run sqlite and then type .help
<Lns> wow this could provide some pretty useful functionality
<alkisg> Lns, ah, sorry: .sqliterc isn't executed when firefox starts, I thought it would be... :(
<Lns> :(
<alkisg> So I guess triggers would be an alternative...
<Lns> yea
<highvoltage> hey Lns
<Lns> hey highvoltage, what's the good word
<highvoltage> sorry Lns I only know bad words :p
<Lns> =p
 * Lns is probably going to toss ArchLinux on his eeepc 701.. heard it can boot in 14sec.
<Ahmuck-Jr> k, i'm back
<Svenstaro> Does anybody here have experience with a network of about 50 thin clients and what kind of server to use in order to cope with the loadÃ
<LaserJock> that seems like quite a lot on a single server
<Svenstaro> That's why I'm asking :/
<LaserJock> stgraber or Lns might have an idea though
<Svenstaro> I'm considering fat clients at this point.
<Svenstaro> I have 8 cores which I believe can handle at most 20 multimedia clients.
<Svenstaro> Would you even use LTSP/Edubuntu when using fat clients? From my understanding for fat clients I simply have to serve a bootable kernel on a TFTPd.
<LaserJock> yeah, you can do LTSP with fat clients
#edubuntu 2009-03-03
<LaserJock> I'd talk to #ltsp though perhaps
<Lns> Svenstaro: what are the most commonly used apps in the network?  What are your server specs?
<Svenstaro> Depending on the lesson, the clients will do research on the web, watch youtube videos, watch educational videos, compile Lazarus applications, create documents in openoffice.
<Svenstaro> Server specs are roughly 2x2.6ghz xeon (gives me 8 cores), 16GB RAM, 750GB*3 in Raid1, 1Gbit*2 NICs.
<Lns> Svenstaro: you should have no issues with that i think
<Lns> the only thing i'd watch out for is the streaming video, which is hard to deal with when lots of people are doing it at the same time
<Lns> might want to use localapps for that portion, otherwise you're way over spec (imho).
<Svenstaro> Lns, what would you use for 50 clients to match the demands that I have listed earlier?
<Lns> Svenstaro: I'd also look into Ethernet bonding (check out http://www.howtoforge.com/network_bonding_ubuntu_6.10 ) to handle the network load
<Svenstaro> Lns, I was planning on doing that.
<Lns> you should be fine.
<Lns> I can't say what i'd use, but I can tell you that for 35 clients, i'm using a 2x dualcore xeon 1.6GHz system w/8GB RAM, and it works fine.
<Lns> the only time it chokes is when people are doing things graphically intensive like huge flash enabled websites (usually proprietary software related)
<Lns> What are your client specs?
<Ahmuck-Jr> mine chokes when printing
<Ahmuck-Jr> the server doesn't, but every client does
<Svenstaro> Lns, depends, there are two generations for the most part, those using 1.6ghz amd athlons and those using 1.2ghz p4s
<Lns> Svenstaro: how much ram? that's the biggest factor
<Lns> Ahmuck-Jr: are you doing local printing or network?
<Svenstaro> Lns, 512mb mostly, up to 1GB
<Lns> Svenstaro: oh that's more than enough =)
<Lns> you shouldn't have an issue
<Svenstaro> Oh sounds nice then, thanks :)
<Lns> make sure your ethernet from the server is performing at 1Gb/sec though
<Lns> (at least)
<Ahmuck-Jr> Lns: i'm using hplip (current) and printing from the client to a printer hooked to the server
<Ahmuck-Jr> oddly it wasn't doing it this afternoon
<Ahmuck-Jr> but i just did an update as well.  i'll have to do some more trouble shooting this evening.  i'm not sure if it happens when someone clicks on the notificaiton dialog
<Ahmuck-Jr> the notificaiton dialoge is a bit of a problem.  if the nurse prints out "John Doe's Sickness Progress Report" as a title, hplip spams it to every client.  as a result, everybody knows John Doe is sick
<Ahmuck-Jr> with something
<sbalneav> Ahmuck-Jr: This the notification icon, or the cups notification icon?
<sbalneav> If it's the cups one, you can just stop that from starting up by rmoving it from th global session.
<LaserJock> sbalneav: hi
<nigro> hola
<sbalneav> Morning all
<brettd> Hi there
<LaserJock> morning Edu people
<stgraber> moin LaserJock
<sbalneav> LaserJock: Hey heyh
<sbalneav> When's our bug day?  I made some headway on the Sabayon bug last night. :)
<LaserJock> oh yeah
<LaserJock> how far?
<LaserJock> I'm lurking in the Desktop Team meeting right now
<LaserJock> I'm going to poke them about sabayon
<LaserJock> since officially Sabayon is a Desktop Team package as well
<highvoltage> cool
 * LaserJock bows to op-highvoltage
<highvoltage> heh, oops
<highvoltage> LaserJock: you forgot to bear me gifts!
<LaserJock> well, that was kind of a dead end
<LaserJock> sbalneav: how did last Friday go?
<sbalneav> Good
<sbalneav> Got a bit closer to sorting it out
<sbalneav> I'll be working again on it tonight
<LaserJock> do you have any specific patches?
<sbalneav> Not yet.
<sbalneav> Bunch of tweaks I've done
<sbalneav> Are you around tonight?
<LaserJock> yeah, I should mostly be around
<sbalneav> OK
<LaserJock> I've got to teach lab this afternoon so might be afk early evening for you
<sbalneav> I'll ping you
<LaserJock> I'm just sick of these "OMG, I can't believe Ubuntu has left this for this long!!!!!"
<sbalneav> The issue is, of course, it's broken upstream
<LaserJock> sbalneav: it does keep the bug count down
<LaserJock> you pretty much know any new bug report is a dup ;-)
<Lns> 'morning, folks
<highvoltage> 'morning Lns
<highvoltage> what's the good word? :)
<Lns> hmmmmm....
 * Lns thinks
<Lns> Rain.
<highvoltage> nice.
<Lns> ha
<Lns> Our area needs it bad, and we got it last night..thunder, hail and all
<LaserJock> Lns: dude, it's even raining *here*!
<Lns> LaserJock: !!! wow. Hopefully you've built some sand caves! ;)
<highvoltage> today was the first time in a while that it hasn't rained here. but if it comes back I'll send some your way
<LaserJock> I try to stay on high ground
<Lns> highvoltage: thanks, just use the machines China used during the olympics ;)
<highvoltage> heh. I always imagined LaserJock's area to be a very desert-like place with very little rain
<LaserJock> yep
<highvoltage> Lns: oh, I'll just send them via IRC.
<Lns> haha
<highvoltage> I just do my IRC rain dance and whala!
<LaserJock> DDC SEND Rain
<highvoltage> \o\ \o/ /o/
<LaserJock> or is that DCC
<LaserJock> I never use it so I never remember
<highvoltage> Direct Client Copy
<Lns> hahaha
<Lns> what's new with edubuntu??
<highvoltage> I think LaserJock and sbalneav talked to the desktop team about sabyon
<highvoltage> but I haven't been able to follow
<Lns> yeah i've seen a few bug report chatters
<LaserJock> initially I just got "patches welcome" from seb128
<LaserJock> but ember just asked if I had a particular bug # in mind
<LaserJock> highvoltage: you feeling up to do some edubuntu.org page cleaning for Jaunty?
<LaserJock> I've got a piece of paper here where I went through all the edubuntu.org content and made some notes on what needs to get updated/renamed/deleted
<highvoltage> LaserJock: *very*
<LaserJock> I don't think I've got time to actually do the changes
<highvoltage> LaserJock: (really)
<LaserJock> but I can throw up my notes somewhere so we have a TODO list
<highvoltage> LaserJock: can you put that paper up somewhere?
<highvoltage> that would be cool
<LaserJock> yep
<highvoltage> even if you send me a jpg of that paper it would be cool
<LaserJock> the basic problems look to me like 1)version specific pages with generic names and 2) redundant pages
<LaserJock> we had/have 3 different download pages, 2 home pages, and like 2 FAQs
<highvoltage> LaserJock: in the spirit of community involvement I'll log bugs for all of the changes and post it to the list, then people who want to help with it that already have editing rights can get involved
<highvoltage> 2 home pages?
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> an old home and a new home
<LaserJock> the problem is when you make a new node as a draft, work, then change the URL alias to the new page
<LaserJock> you're then left with the old node
<highvoltage> ah
<LaserJock> I was thinking that we should use some sort of naming scheme using the version
<LaserJock> we have release pages for the current releases, but it's not always clear what release they belong to
<LaserJock> and I'd like to have more supporting documentation (application lists, Errata perhaps, etc.) for *each* release
<highvoltage> good idea
<highvoltage> LaserJock: oh, are these the notes you're pasting now?
<LaserJock> so pehaps we should do something like <release number>: <page>
<LaserJock> no, these are my general thoughts
<LaserJock> I just have really quick thoughts to write down
<LaserJock> I'll throw up a wiki page
<highvoltage> ok thanks
<LaserJock> I *really* wish we could get rid of most of our wiki.ubuntu.com pages
<LaserJock> there's just so much old cruft and organization that it's really unhelpful
<highvoltage> what we could do is put a deletion banner on all of the ones that we think should be deleted
<highvoltage> and just redirect them all to a "This page has been deleted" page with the reasons and links to the better pages
<LaserJock> I think we have something ~ 200 wiki pages
<highvoltage> *gulp* @ https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Home?action=fullsearch&context=180&value=Edubuntu&titlesearch=Titles
<LaserJock> we have more "organization" (LP teams, wiki pages, etc.) than most derivatives
<LaserJock> but by far the fewest people working and the fewest packages to manage
<highvoltage> heh, how ironic
<highvoltage> wow, getting to some of the weird stuff like "EdubuntuAmbassador"
<highvoltage> nearly forgot about that
<highvoltage> oosh, and it has my name on it. one of RichEd's old ideas
<highvoltage> hmm, there's a few wiki pages that may have some value for the website at some point
<highvoltage> like https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/Community/Photos
<highvoltage> wow, meeting records. been a while since we had those
<highvoltage> LaserJock: yes, 280 Wiki pages!
<LaserJock> is there some way we can archive a bunch of stuff and start over?
<LaserJock> I mean seriously, how is this going to help people
<highvoltage> LaserJock: just skimming over, at leas half the current pages can be deleted forever without doing any harm
<highvoltage> ok maybe not half
<highvoltage> but a good amount
<LaserJock> well, I wouldn't mind a decent pruning
<LaserJock> if you do a google search for external sites that don't reference the page
<LaserJock> and an intra-wiki search and nothing comes up I think we should be able to delete without fear
<highvoltage> I think it's still a good idea to let them redirect somewhere. probably the edubuntu main page on the wiki, at least
<LaserJock> I guess
<LaserJock> it still clutters namespace
<highvoltage> although they'll still... yes... spam the namespace
<LaserJock> but at least it's mostly out of the way
<LaserJock> if they're just internal team pages I don't see why we should feel the need to keep them
<highvoltage> last when I talked to the docteam on this (was about 3 years ago probably) they weren't keen at all on deleting wiki pages
<LaserJock> yeah
<highvoltage> but I guess we should come up with a list and take it up with them
<LaserJock> but that was mostly before the doc.ubuntu.com/wiki.ubuntu.com split
<highvoltage> ah, true.
<LaserJock> I don't think the Doc Team cares about wiki.ubuntu.com anymore
<LaserJock> it's up to the relevant team to care
<LaserJock> so bottom line:
<LaserJock> * if it's something an outside person would use to get help it should go either on help.ubuntu.com or edubuntu.org
<LaserJock> * if it's content internal to the team we should be fairly free to remove/change whatever we need
<highvoltage> ok. can you put that up with the website todo too please?
<LaserJock> at some point we're shooting ourselves in the foot in order to cater to people who shouldn't be looking at the pages anyway ;-)
<highvoltage> LaserJock: oh wow, the wiki allows page deletion without admin intervention now
<highvoltage> LaserJock: that makes things a *lot* easier
<highvoltage> the ubuntu cookbook stuff is tricky
<highvoltage> some iterations of it has a few chapters that might be good
<LaserJock> highvoltage: is that cookbook stuff on wiki.ubuntu.com?
<highvoltage> LaserJock: hmm, I see some of the cookbook stuff has been moved to help.ubuntu.com
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> was just going to mention that
<highvoltage> LaserJock: do you think we still need those links in the wiki?
<LaserJock> right now I just want like 5 pages on the wiki :-)
<highvoltage> I don't think you can get it that small
<highvoltage> I think we certainly want to keep historical meeting minutes
<LaserJock> meetings, LP teams/organization, how to get involved, roadmap, TODO
<highvoltage> and specifications
<LaserJock> sure, I wasn't counting those
<highvoltage> ok
<LaserJock> beyond just archival pages
<LaserJock> archives are good and we need to keep them for sure
<LaserJock> but people landing at wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu are going to think we're a massive army :-)
<highvoltage> oh dear
<highvoltage> LaserJock: do we have a next meeting scheduled btw?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/Website btw
<LaserJock> what I'd *like* to do is to reflect the StrategyDocument in the wiki structure
<LaserJock> somehow
<highvoltage> thanks
<LaserJock> highvoltage: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CategoryEdubuntuCleanup
<LaserJock> perhaps we should make some more use of ^^
<highvoltage> kubuntu has put their theme in a bzr branch
<LaserJock> yep
<highvoltage> it's ubuntish but has *much* less bugs than our current theme
<LaserJock> mhm
<highvoltage> I'll try to get that right before the jaunty release as well
<LaserJock> can we take that and tweak the colors?
<highvoltage> yes
<LaserJock> btw
<LaserJock> I see a CategoryEducation (which seems empty) but no CategoryEdubuntu
<LaserJock> so perhaps a good first step is to go through the existing wiki
<highvoltage> hmm, good point
<LaserJock> and dump pages into one of the 3 categories: cleanup, education (for RichEds type stuff and general education), and edubuntu (our actual working stuff)
<highvoltage> that sounds good
<LaserJock> then that's our declared set of "Edubuntu" wiki pages
<LaserJock> anything outside of that is "unofficial"
<LaserJock> once everything is in one of those 3 categories we can start weeding
<LaserJock> highvoltage: there's also CategoryEducationCleanup
<LaserJock> so we have a Cleanup category for each of Edubuntu and Education
<LaserJock> highvoltage: ok, so we basically don't have an easy way to know what pages are Edubuntu/Education specs
<highvoltage> LaserJock: yeah I guess that will just take some manua lthought
<LaserJock> highvoltage: well, google helped me out
<LaserJock> highvoltage: something's odd with moin
<LaserJock> highvoltage: when I go to the CategorySpec page it doesn't list any pages
<LaserJock> but when I got to specfici specs they have CateogrySpec on them
<LaserJock> there must be some threshold beyond which the category page no longer shows you the pages in that category
<highvoltage> LaserJock: ah. LaserJock I have to go now, will catch up tomorrow
<LaserJock> highvoltage: ok, let's keep it rolling ;-)
<highvoltage> LaserJock: totally!
<sbalneav> LaserJock: Still around?
<LaserJock> sbalneav: yeah
<sbalneav> Package question.
<sbalneav> I'm running hardy here at work, and I need to upgrade cups to the one in Intrepid (1.3.9)
<sbalneav> can I just download the .debs, and install them?
<LaserJock> you can try
<LaserJock> but cups has a lot of .debs to it
<sbalneav> ok
<LaserJock> it could take you a while to get the complete set
<LaserJock> you could backport the source package though
<LaserJock> sbalneav: what were you're magical sabayon output log lines?
<sbalneav> Crumb, don't have 'em here at work.
<LaserJock> k, I might have an IRC log of it
<sbalneav> how would I backport?  Move the "debian" dir from 1.3.7 to a 1.3.9 dir?
<sbalneav> and patch?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> grab the intrepid source package off of LP
<LaserJock> unpack it with dpkg-source -x *.dsc
<LaserJock> go into the source dir and run debuild
<sbalneav> ahhh
<sbalneav> ok
<sbalneav> I could do that
<sbalneav> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cupsys
<sbalneav> Don't see the intrepid one.
<sbalneav> I'm stupid.
<sbalneav> What am I missing?
<LaserJock> hmm, must have changed names or something
<LaserJock> right
<LaserJock> sbalneav: it's https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cups
<LaserJock> highvoltage: turns out a number of pages were using CategoryEdubuntu but there was no category page, I fixed that
#edubuntu 2009-03-04
<elias> does ltsp-build-client delete my old ltsp dir or update it, when one is there already?
<ogra> neither
<ogra> it exists and tells you to take care of it
<ogra> mv it out of the way
<ogra> *exits
<elias> is it a problem, to have a intrepid ltsp client env but hardy on the server?
<ogra> some things might not work
<elias> like?
<ogra> no idea, i doubt anyone tested something like that
<ogra> localapps definately wont
<ogra> usually the client and server nev are tied very closely together, newer clients need features that only newer servers provide
<ogra> thats why we dont even attemt to test it
<ogra> its a matter of luck if it works or is stable
<elias> ok
<elias> do you know, is there a solution for the problem everybody is having with gnome, which does eventually leave some apps running after logout?
<ogra> afaik thats fixed in intrepids gnome
<ogra> or at least improved
<elias> so no extra packages needed there anymore to do the job
<elias> this is the major annoyance I am having with my LTSP env
<elias> The only reason I receive support calls - to kill users processes, so their gnome env comes up in full again.
<elias> forgot for a moment, that you are not so much involved in ltsp anymore, but still your word certainly counts in the community. What I got to say is, that Thin Clients are not so much on vouge anymore. With things like the eee box, a diskless FAT client setup would make much more sense.
<elias> Do you know of any attempts to develop in this direction?
<ogra> nubae has a hack of ltsp to use it as fat clients ...
<elias> This could really be a breakthrough for Linux.
<ogra> google for "nubae fat clients"
<elias> this should really be, where edubuntu is going!!! LDAP enabled diskless FAT clients.
<elias> nubae's setup does not seem to make use of LDAP
 * ogra isnt a fan of ladp 
<ogra> *ldap
<elias> what else could be used as an authentication service?
<elias> I'd favour something more simple also
<ogra> rsync ...
<ogra> have a wrapper around passwd that automatically rsyncs passwd and groups to the clients via ssh
<ogra> in case of a change
<ogra> up to 200 users that works just fine
<ogra> beyond that something like ldap actually makes sense
<elias> does nubae's setup do that?
<ogra> no idea, i never used it
<ogra> i know it changes the setup in many weird ways though ... like fiddling with sudoers and the like
<elias> if all clients are fat and root is writeable, rsync should not be needed anyways, right?
<elias> Nubae: you here?
<elias> ogra: any idea, which time nubae usually is around?
<ogra> european business hours... no idea why he isnt here atm
<elias> can I get ltsp-update-image not to overwrite my current image? I have people working on the clients right now.
<elias> Don't want to interrupt or corrupt their work
<ogra> you wont
<ogra> as long as nbd-server keeps the filehandle open the old image will be served to existing connections from the servers ram
<elias> ok
<ogra> the new image will only be used for new connecions
<elias> but it seems the old image has been deleted already
<elias> i only see i386.img.tmp
<ogra> its still in ram
<elias> alright
<ogra> and is still serverd to existing connections
<elias> tnx
<elias> I'll try to catch up with nubae later
<elias> cu
<LaserJock> morning everybody
<LaserJock> sbalneav: were you around last night?
<sbalneav> LaserJock: yeah, didn't get too much done, but was poking at it :)
<anom1> LaserJock: morning.
<LaserJock> sbalneav: ok
<LaserJock> anom1: hi
<LaserJock> highvoltage: ping
<highvoltage> LaserJock: pongy
<LaserJock> highvoltage: wiki wiki
<highvoltage> wild wild west
<LaserJock> so I created the CategoryEdubuntu yesterday
<highvoltage> yeah I saw your message this morning
<highvoltage> (or last night for you)
<LaserJock> so I think if we were to go through specs and make sure they were tagged CategorySpec Category{Edubuntu,Education}
<LaserJock> we could then query that and get a list of our specs fairly easily
<LaserJock> which is something I think we might want to do
<LaserJock> there are a number of specs that haven't been implemented
<LaserJock> and it's a shame to have that specification work just wasted
<highvoltage> yeah
<LaserJock> highvoltage: so you got any time today to work on some cleanup?
<highvoltage> LaserJock: I'm tired and have other worth that I need to do
<highvoltage> LaserJock: so doing the wiki stuff will be the perfect work avoidence excuse
<highvoltage> LaserJock: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/BrandingAndNaming still seems a bit overengineered for me
<highvoltage> http://www.ubuntu.com/education says that Ubuntu "is License Free"
<highvoltage> I guess that will make work easier for packagers :)
<LaserJock> good greif
<LaserJock> *grief even
<highvoltage> it also says "All Ubuntu software is released under GPL, which means it is effectively licence free as opposed to free licence. "
<LaserJock> what the heck
<highvoltage> that's like double-wrong
<LaserJock> to say the least
<LaserJock> highvoltage: I've alerted newz2000
<highvoltage> LaserJock: do you know anything about https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Jaunty/New%20Firefox%20Icon%20For%20Edubuntu ?
<highvoltage> sheesh, our wiki space is like a big bunch of tangled cables :)
<Ahmuck-Jr> stgraber:
<LaserJock> highvoltage: I don't and I don't care for their firefox icon
<highvoltage> LaserJock: where did it come from, or is it just completely random?
<LaserJock> just random
<LaserJock> just make sure it's not in our category space
<LaserJock> it's in the artwork namespace so it shouldn't bother
<highvoltage> LaserJock: so if somehting is in cleanup does it mean that it's up for deletion?
<LaserJock> hmm
<highvoltage> or does it mean that it might also have to be merged with another document or just need some review?
<LaserJock> I think all of that
<LaserJock> if it's something other than it just needs to be updates (since basically the whole wiki needs that)
<LaserJock> highvoltage: so what are you currently working on? tagging pages?
<highvoltage> LaserJock: looking at them and deleting currently
<highvoltage> LaserJock: I'm just jumping in so that I can get familiar with all of it, there's more junk in there than I thought
<highvoltage> LaserJock: there was a time when the edubuntu wiki and the ubuntu wiki were completely seperate
<highvoltage> I can see why there's so many little quick pages
<LaserJock> highvoltage: ok, I'm going through specs and tagging them with Edubuntu/Education categories
<highvoltage> LaserJock: would you like me to do tagging first? or are you fine with doing that for now?
<LaserJock> I'm fine with it
<LaserJock> I just didn't want to overlap
<Ahmuck-Jr> firefox, hp print monitor and copy function or highlighting function causes the client taskbars and menubars to flash and disappaear
<Ahmuck-Jr> in ltsp
<highvoltage> so that's when you're using the printers web interface?
<highvoltage> LaserJock: there's actually quite a bit of nice content hidden in the wiki that should just move to the website
<LaserJock> highvoltage: yep
<highvoltage> LaserJock: is it right that the strategy document is only in categoryeducation and not edubuntu as well?
<LaserJock> oh, hmm
<LaserJock> I thought it should be categoryedubuntu only
<highvoltage> yeah. I thought at the very least both but I agree that it's really an edubuntu thing
<LaserJock> do you think we need an Edgy release announcement wiki page? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdgyAnnouncementEdubuntu
<stgraber> Ahmuck-Jr: ?
<Ahmuck-Jr> stgraber: hp monitor minimizes to the taskbar and then the taskbar disappears unless the mouse over the menu bar it comes back
<BZH> pls ppl dont help kids with trying to hack the edubuntu in their skool
<BZH> :D
<LaserJock> BZH: what do you mean?
<BZH> LaserJock well in my mom's skool they have edubntu
<BZH> and its locked you cant open redtube and stuff
<BZH> but they found out that they can use Xchat and #edubuntu
<BZH> and remove all the bans :D
<LaserJock> I doubt anybody here knowingly did that
<BZH> yeah :)
<BZH> they use ctrl+alt+backspace
<BZH> i have blocked that
<BZH> :D
<BZH> but they are kids they can found out more stuff :D
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> but I'm not sure what we're supposed to do about that
<BZH> :D
<BZH> its ok
<BZH> :D
<BZH> i am not blaming anybody
<BZH> but this kids :)
<Ahmuck-Jr> our lab just went through a full test
<Ahmuck-Jr> and it worked sorta
#edubuntu 2009-03-05
<LaserJock> hi jerome
<jsgotangco> hey LaserJock how's things
<LaserJock> doing OK
<jsgotangco> coolies
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: how's it going over your way?
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: not bad, business has been pretty busy and its eating up a lot of my time, I mostly do stuff for Sugarlabs now
<LaserJock> oh really?
<jsgotangco> yes we're doing something in my community that involves sugar
<jsgotangco> sort of an experiment
<LaserJock> cool
<jsgotangco> yeah we're doing it after school ends this month
<jsgotangco> then results are sent back to sugarlabs
<Ahmuck> hi.  i've got a situtation where one parent wants restriction for certian things on the inet, whereas the ohter doesnt'
<Ahmuck> any suggestions?
<sbalneav> Morning all
<LaserJock> morning Edubuntu land
#edubuntu 2009-03-06
<nothingman> hey, all
<nothingman> having trouble getting students logged onto the thin clients
<nothingman> tried ltsp-update-sshkeys; ltsp-update-image, but no luch
<nothingman> *luck*
<nothingman> this is an amd64 laptop serving i386 laptops
<aboucher> anyone use the edubuntu server
<gfarbal2> aboucher: Yes. We are using edubuntu server: Why?
 * anom2 is listening to the crickets in the background.
<anom2> hello from singapore ... most schools use windows PCs ...
<LaserJock> morning Edubuntu people
<Lns> hey LaserJock
 * Lns knows what the good word is already
<Lns> ...FRIDAY
<LaserJock> ugg, already
<LaserJock> there really aren't enough hours in a day or days in a week
<Lns> LaserJock: ;)
<Lns> Time is just time... how we divide it up is irrelevant
<LaserJock> I beg to differ ;-)
<LaserJock> it depends on how the boss divides it up ;-)
<LaserJock> Lns: have you tried Jaunty out at all?
<Lns> LaserJock: no i haven't.. i barely have tried intrepid (had it on my eee, but uninstalled in favor of arch)
<LaserJock> k
<Lns> I might upgrade my own network to intrepid, but not jaunty (need it to work ;p )
<LaserJock> well, that's sort of the problem
<LaserJock> we need people to test Jaunty to make sure it will work
<Lns> LaserJock: I will be glad to help more out when i have some more $$ for a test environment
<Lns> still trying to keep afloat =)
<LaserJock> a machine with a VM would be sufficient I think for a lot of stuff
<Lns> LaserJock: Yes - but when it's on the same network as my production, it's hard to separate dhcp broadcast, etc.
<Lns> I guess i wouldn't have to use LTSP on it
<alkisg> Well, I'm updating my personal laptop + part-time ltsp server to jaunty, wish me luck... :P :D
<Lns> alkisg: good luck! =)
<Lns> LaserJock: re: dividing time: the "boss" is concerned about time management too.. Maybe you should work with him to make things more productive so you aren't spinning your wheels
<alkisg> I'm still pondering if I should use ext4 for the os partition, or if this could somehow destroy my /home partition in case of a grave bug...
<Lns> alkisg: backup?
<alkisg> 200Gb? Nah... too boring :P
<Lns> Lns: not to say you're spinning your wheels, but everyone could use some fine tuning ;)
<Lns> alkisg: =p well then, go for it! godspeed!
<alkisg> OK, if I don't come back it'll be because my laptop would be thrown out of the window :)
<Lns> lol
<airjump> hello
<Lns> alkisg: went well, eh?
<alkisg> Heh... almost... lost my panels
<alkisg> OK `gconftool-2 --recursive-unset /apps/panel && killall gnome-panel` saved the day
<Lns> there ya go
<alkisg> stgraber, I upgraded to jaunty, do I need to put your ppa to sources.list to have the latest ltsp version, and also edubuntu-italc-devel for the latest italc?
<LaserJock> alkisg: I think it's better if you can test without PPA
<alkisg> LaserJock: sure, I upgraded to jaunty just for testing, but I wonder if he updates the ltsp packages frequently, or if he'll update them later on... :)
<LaserJock> alkisg: fairly frequently
<alkisg> OK then, it saves me the trouble of adding the keys :D
<alkisg> Ty!
#edubuntu 2009-03-07
<stgraber> LaserJock: I'll at least do the testing part for edubuntu
<LaserJock> stgraber: thanks, hopefully more people will step up as well for that
<LaserJock> I'd hate for Jaunty to not get release just on account of that
<stgraber> LaserJock: nah, it'll get released :) I'll just nag slangasek enough to get it released.
<LaserJock> stgraber: heh, yeah
<LaserJock> stgraber: how's LTSP lookin'?
<stgraber> LaserJock: very good, a few glitches with local devices to fix, will do that next week at work
<stgraber> LaserJock: I got a new background for ldm from ubuntu-art, really looks great
<LaserJock> great
<stgraber> http://www.stgraber.org/download/ldm_16-9.jpg
<LaserJock> stgraber: that's awesome!
 * anom2 is singing a horrible off-key tune.
<zeronimo> This colombian LAWYER firm stole edubuntu's logo
<zeronimo> http://www.forumabogadosyconsultores.com/home.htm
<LaserJock> zeronimo: sure looks like
<LaserJock> it
<HedgeMage> :o
#edubuntu 2009-03-08
<vauge> hello
<LaserJock> hi
<vauge> have a quick question about edubuntu
<vauge> I did a 8.10 normal install with all updates... then ran apt-get install edubuntu-desktop
<vauge> there is no session login for edubuntu, should there be?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> Edubuntu just gives you educational apps on top of Ubuntu
<vauge> ok. there is now a kde selection, but it gives errors when attempting to login using it
<LaserJock> hmm, odd
<LaserJock> did you install edubuntu-desktop or edubuntu-desktop-kde?
<vauge> just edubuntu-desktop
<LaserJock> I wouldn't have thought that the KDE Edu components would have gotten you a KDE session
<LaserJock> don't worry about the KDE session then
<vauge> kk :)
<LaserJock> it apparently is just because we install KDE Edu parts
<LaserJock> it's no the full KDE desktop
<LaserJock> which is why it gave errors
<vauge> that makes sense
<LaserJock> vauge: thanks for bringing that up though, we should look into that, I can imagine it would be a bit confusing
<vauge> it feels to work ok in gnome, but the session selection confused me a bit.
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> it's made for Gnome
<LaserJock> even though there are some KDE Edu apps
<LaserJock> they should still work fine in Gnome
<vauge> all good. I use Amarok (don't tell anyone)
 * LaserJock promises not to ;-)
<vauge> heh, dansguardian... I can't seem to find it again in the wiki, but is there something unique about edubuntu and dan's?
<LaserJock> no, if it worked with Ubuntu it should work with Edubuntu
<vauge> awesome - thank you
<LaserJock> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Servers/DansGuardian perhaps?
<vauge> got that one, was about to roll with it. But found another on edubuntu specific wiki
<vauge> can't seem to find it again
<vauge> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuProxy
<LaserJock> weird, I don't know why that page is there
<vauge> LaserJock, thank you much for your time
<LaserJock> vauge: no problem, thanks for dropping by
 * anom1 has deployed a Rover to try to find water (and life) in this channel.
<rxKaffee> hi guys
<rxKaffee> anyone know of some applications/games that would be age-appropriate for a 2yo?
<rxKaffee> he loves to get at my keyboard, but it seems always when I do not need any extra keys pressed! lol
<rxKaffee> so I figured I'd setup a secondary box for my son to play on while I'm working at my desktop
<merriam> rxKaffee: Tux Paint
<merriam> sudo apt-get install tuxpaint
<merriam> and other packages under "junior"
<rxKaffee> merriam: I think anything requiring much mouse, or any mouse with clicking, is a bit too advanced at this point
<merriam> Yes, it's difficult, but it may be worth a try.
<rxKaffee> maybe I can find one of those old ball-mice that used to be popular, trackball or whatever
<merriam> You can get a new trackball.  They're still popular.  I'm using one.
<rxKaffee> merriam: the ones with the stationary base, and the big ball sticking up out of the top?
<merriam> Small ones are popular anyway, from Logitech.  You can still get new big ones too.
<rxKaffee> well I'll be darn, I haven't seen any of those in years
<merriam> http://cil614.files.wordpress.com/2007/11/kensington_trackball.jpg
<rxKaffee> nifty
<rxKaffee> looks fairly simple to take apart too
<merriam> a bit smaller and optical, still available new:  http://www.ebuyer.com/product/143730  Kensington Orbit Optical Trackball - USB/PS2  Â£17.46inc vat
<rxKaffee> hmm, seems to be a UK-only model number
<rxKaffee> a very similar one(by the same name) is avail here though
<rxKaffee> wonder why they'd have e seperate model number for europe
<merriam> yes, and the larger one, on amazon, U.S.  Amazon.com: Kensington Orbit Optical Trackball Mouse 64327: Electronics
<merriam> http://www.amazon.com/Kensington-Orbit-Optical-Trackball-64327/dp/B00006W2QD/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1236541914&sr=8-1
<merriam> Amazon.com: Kensington Expert Mouse Optical USB Trackball for PC or Mac 64325: Electronics
<merriam> http://www.amazon.com/Kensington-Expert-Mouse-Optical-Trackball/dp/B00009KH63/ref=pd_bbs_2?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1236541914&sr=8-2
<rxKaffee> merriam: any idea the size of the clickbuttons on that orbit? I'm thinking just slightly larger than a standard mouse's?
<merriam> I don't know the two-button ones, but there are scale cues in the pictures on that amazon page.
<merriam> http://www.amazon.com/gp/customer-media/product-gallery/B00006W2QD/ref=cm_ciu_pdp_images_0?ie=UTF8&index=0
<merriam> I have the big square one, and about 4 of the Logitech ones with the red thumb ball -- that's what I use.
<merriam> TrackMan Wheel -- less suitable for a toddler, but more generally useful
<rxKaffee> wheeeew! that expertmouse is a pricey buggar!
<rxKaffee> well, not so much the one you linked me on amazon, but some of the other expermouse models that I'm seeing around, almust a hundred bucks
<merriam> Yes, and it uses a lot of space too.  The Orbit will do.
<rxKaffee> I'm guessing kensington make pretty good quality components eh?
<rxKaffee> 'cause its gonna see a bit of abuse lol
<merriam> The one I have wasn't built as well as I expected.  It hasn't broken, but it hasn't had much testing.
<merriam> It's mechanical.  The optical type is generally worth the money.
<merriam> I think Kensington stuff used to be sturdy and reliable, but maybe not any more.
<rxKaffee> I was kinda hopeing to find a mechanical actually... I suspect he'll pop the ball off and realise playing with the light is more fun than using it to control the PC lol
<merriam> Optical is more robust, and the old type is very annoying when it slips.
<merriam> Until recently Kensington made a nice black usb keyboard with a standard layout, but I've worn out 3 of them.
<merriam>  I'm back to a clicky IBM that says 1985 on the bottom.
<merriam> The light on the Logitechs is invisble -- IR.  I have a Marble too.  I don't know about the others.
<merriam> In my experience all the designs with central balls are very inefficient for general use.
<rxKaffee> I looked at a couple of the logitech marbles, but they didn't really strike me as particularly toddler friendly for some indescribable reason
<rxKaffee> I'm with ya on likeing those IBM clickers, with the modular cord design
<merriam> Yes, the Marble is a bit small, and you can easily press buttons on it by mistake.
<merriam> It's not so much that I like buckling springs.  Sometimes I want a quieter keyboard.  It's mainly that it still works perfectly.
<rxKaffee> I like 'em cause of the positive-engagement of the keys
<rxKaffee> which to me, makes the noise tolerable
<rxKaffee> however, I've recently "upgraded" to an ergonomic keyboard
<rxKaffee> microsoft natural ergonomic 4000
<rxKaffee> I'd venture to say that next to Xenix, its the second best product MS has ever made lol
<rxKaffee> its got the nice positive feel to the keys like an IBM, a more managable noise level, and some cool "extra" buttons that come in handy sometime
<rxKaffee> haven't had it long enough though to know if it'll stand to the test of time
#edubuntu 2010-03-08
<thunsucker> how much install space does edubuntu take up on top of ubuntu?
<alkisg> Yey! I found that update-binfmts is what's keeping $CHROOT/proc from unmounting.
 * alkisg looks deeper...
<alkisg> ...and here's the problematic call:
<alkisg> Entering chroot /opt/ltsp/i386, type 'exit' to exit.
<alkisg> root@alkis:/# apt-get install --reinstall wine wine1.2
<alkisg> ÎÎ½Î¬Î³Î½ÏÏÎ· ÎÎ¹ÏÏÏÎ½ Î Î±ÎºÎ­ÏÏÎ½... ÎÎ»Î¿ÎºÎ»Î·ÏÏÎ¸Î·ÎºÎµ
<alkisg> ÎÎ±ÏÎ±ÏÎºÎµÏÎ® ÎÎ­Î½Î´ÏÎ¿Ï ÎÎ¾Î±ÏÏÎ®ÏÎµÏÎ½
<alkisg> ÎÎ½Î¬Î³Î½ÏÏÎ· ÏÎµÏÎ¹Î³ÏÎ±ÏÎ®Ï ÏÎ·Ï ÏÏÎ­ÏÎ¿ÏÏÎ±Ï ÎºÎ±ÏÎ¬ÏÏÎ±ÏÎ·... ÎÎ»Î¿ÎºÎ»Î·ÏÏÎ¸Î·ÎºÎµ
<alkisg> Sorry, "copy" didn't work :-/
<alkisg>        if (system ('/bin/mount', '-t', 'binfmt_misc',
<alkisg>                     '-o', 'nodev,noexec,nosuid', 'binfmt_misc', $procdir)) {
<norbpi> hi. i have an issue with ubuntu 9.10 (Koala Karmac) and edubuntu.
<norbpi> the login screen does not show a edubuntu session, although edubuntu is installed.
<norbpi> anybody there reading this?
<AndyGraybeal> hey guys, i'm trying to lockdown my desktop.  i want it so no one can make folders or files on the desktop.  i wrote about my issue in a pastie http://www.pastie.org/859546
<AndyGraybeal> i followed some instructions here: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1399423  sudo chattr +i .. and it worked great on the current folders in the Desktop... but i'm confused about permissions.
<alkisg> AndyGraybeal: you can just disable /apps/nautilus/preferences/show_desktop from gconf-editor, and make it mandatory, if you want...
<alkisg> This way no icons will ever be shown on the desktop, even if the users create files and folders there
<AndyGraybeal> oh well, we use the desktop icons that are currently there.  i don't want them to add more or delete or modify the current icons (folders)
<AndyGraybeal> alkisg: but thank you
<alkisg> AndyGraybeal: ah, I see. An easy way to do this is to just set XDG_DESKTOP_DIR to the admins/teacher's dir for all users.
<alkisg> This way the admin/teacher will be able to insert whatever he wants, and the users/students will be unable to add content there.
<AndyGraybeal> okay thank you, i will think about this.
<alkisg> > currently if i take write permission off of the Desktop folder, they cannot add or change files inside the first set of subdirectories under the Desktop.  In every folder after that they can add or change files/folders fine. this absolutely makes no sense to me.
<alkisg> ==> After reading this, I'm not sure about what you want.
<AndyGraybeal> okay i'm sorry.
<AndyGraybeal> let me explain further
<alkisg> Better write it as a set of requirements
<AndyGraybeal> i'm confused.
<alkisg> Will they be able to add new files to the folders?
<alkisg> Will they be able to add new folders to the folders?
<AndyGraybeal> yes yes
<AndyGraybeal> but not on the Desktop
<alkisg> So why are you saying that "this absolutely makes no sense to me"? Isn't that what you want?
<alkisg> Or are you just looking for an explanation?
<sbalneav> Morning all
<AndyGraybeal> oh i'm looking for an explanation
<alkisg> Hi sbalneav
<AndyGraybeal> it isn't working like i understand it to work.
<alkisg> AndyGraybeal: ok, here's what happening:
<alkisg> If a file has +w for someone, he can edit it
<alkisg> But the "delete" action isn't a file action. That file needs to be deleted from the parent directory
<alkisg> So, to delete a file, one needs +w to the parent directory.
<alkisg> Does that make sense?
<AndyGraybeal> yes, that is what is happening - and i didn't realize that.
<AndyGraybeal> thank you for explaining that.
<alkisg> np
<AndyGraybeal> so just go along with me here...
<AndyGraybeal> yea, nevemrind - i'm getting so confused.
<AndyGraybeal> it's alright - i need to practice more.
<alkisg> Heh, as you wish
<alkisg> But it'll be easier if you *define* what you want
<AndyGraybeal> when yuo say define, can you explain?
<alkisg> define == describe your problem better
<alkisg> Say exactly what you want
<AndyGraybeal> okay
<AndyGraybeal> i want people to not be able to add or modify the desktop folders.  i want them to be able to add and modify the things inside those folders.
<AndyGraybeal> does that make sense?
<alkisg> Sure.
<alkisg> So what don't you like from your current solution?
<alkisg> (chattr +i or different owner or whatever?)
<sbalneav> Just out of curiosity, why do you not want them to add folders?  I can see not wanting them to remove stuff that's there, but why shouldn't they add their own?
<Ahmuck> sym link
<AndyGraybeal> sbalneav: because we have two shared logons... between like 20 people.  if they can add whatever they want, it becomes a cluttered mess (this is how it has always been).
<sbalneav> How many terminals do you have?
<Ahmuck> sbalneav: for a cohesive desktop across the classroom
<Ahmuck> desktop control
<Ahmuck> multiple users using the same login
<AndyGraybeal> sbalneav: currently only two (and just so you understand this is ubuntu with ltsp, in a business environment, but i can swear they are much like children)
<sbalneav> Well, for starters, 1 person, 1 login.
<AndyGraybeal> sbalneav: i understand, i'm not there yet :(
<sbalneav> trying to have several people log in on the same login is very VERY bad mojo
<AndyGraybeal> i still havent' gotten the single-sign-on configure.d
<AndyGraybeal> sbalneav: i understand that entirely.
<sbalneav> if someone does something wrong, you've got no way to tell who did it.
<AndyGraybeal> sbalneav: understood.
<Ahmuck> sbalneav: it's not practical to create logins for classroom instruction when you don't know whos' going to show up
<sbalneav> Ahmuck: You know who all your students are, yes?
<Ahmuck> no
<sbalneav> No?
<AndyGraybeal> sbalneav: i plan on having everyone with a login, but right now i can't scale it -- until i have a single-sign-on configured.. kerb, ldap, etc.  (i'm still learning and very slow at this)
<Ahmuck> we offer community classes and never know who's going to show, so we have standard logins such as class 01, class 02, etc.
<sbalneav> Ahmuck: When I worked at the University, I had to create 8-10 thousand logins every year
<AndyGraybeal> alkisg: thank you for your help.  i will work with this more.
<sbalneav> but I knew who all the students where.
<Ahmuck> anywho, i'd concentrate on AndyGraybeal problem
<sbalneav> I am
<alkisg> AndyGraybeal: you're welcome, there are many solutions for this, try to find the one that suits you better.
<alkisg> I'd go for "chown Desktop/dir"
<sbalneav> And I'm suggesting: he's got only 20 people, why not just create 20 logins?
<AndyGraybeal> alkisg: okay thank you
<AndyGraybeal> sbalneav: cause those can get out of hand very fast!  i need scalable answer first, single-sign-on.....
<sbalneav> I'm confused, you said you've only got 20 people.
<AndyGraybeal> well, it's 70, and we're planning on implementing several services for them to use.
<AndyGraybeal> only 20 mainly use the machines though.
<sbalneav> I manage, currently, 250 id's and 185 machines.
<AndyGraybeal> i was hoping to go with kerb/ldap solution in the future and then give everyone username/password
<AndyGraybeal> sbalneav: i'm sure your very good at it.
<sbalneav> Right, but you can start with that NOW, and then just migrate to ldap later.
<AndyGraybeal> they need to use the machiens today.. it taks me to to learn such things.
<AndyGraybeal> i'm sorry, i'm not as skilled as others.
<AndyGraybeal> i need time to learn this kerb/ldap
<AndyGraybeal> and dns
<AndyGraybeal> i'm actually using FreeIPA on fedora for now.
<AndyGraybeal> but i haven't finished with it yet.
<AndyGraybeal> nevermind, i'll get along.
<sbalneav> But my point it, you're going to complicate things to make a shared login solution, and spend time dealing with that, which you're going to undo later
<AndyGraybeal> nevermind.
<sbalneav> whereas right now, you can just create 20 logins, then migrate them to ldap when you're done.
<AndyGraybeal> i understand what your saying.
<sbalneav> OK
<sbalneav> Just trying to save you some effort
<AndyGraybeal> okay i didn't undrestand that last part.
<AndyGraybeal> i was afraid of migrating because that seems to be complicated also.
<AndyGraybeal> okay, i will think this through again.
 * Ahmuck looks at FreeIPA
<AndyGraybeal> wish sabayon worked in ubntu 8.10 :)
<sbalneav> Sabayon works in 9.04 and 9.10
<sbalneav> with the packages from my ppa
<AndyGraybeal> i'm afraid to upgrade for now -- i want to move to 10.04 when it's out.
<AndyGraybeal> start from fresh install.
<Ahmuck> AndyGraybeal: creating logins for 70 people now and having seperate user directories will still allow you migration later
<AndyGraybeal> Ahmuck: alright then, maybe you sbalneav have convinced me.
<Ahmuck> i've done the upgrade.  if you have a seperate /home directory from / you can even do a fresh install without affecting your users
<sbalneav> afk for a bit
<AndyGraybeal> Ahmuck: if the people have shared folders, where do you put those in your setup ?
<Ahmuck> the biggest part is understanding the migration path, and also understanding the time limits you have in reguards to that migration path
<Ahmuck> this is something i struggled with myself.  currently i'm have shared folders located under /home
<AndyGraybeal> so like /home/shared ?
<Ahmuck> remember that /home would need to be on a seperate partition, so when your doing your drive setup, you would plan for this
<AndyGraybeal> Ahmuck: thank you for the guidance.
<Ahmuck> actually, i've got several.  for example, /home/students /home/community, etc.
<AndyGraybeal> aah nice Ahmuck ... that's good to know several shares under /home.
<Ahmuck>  /home/journalism, etc.
<Ahmuck> then i assign individuals to those folders based upon thier requirements
<AndyGraybeal> do you use ACL package?
<Ahmuck> this is managed with group permissions
<Ahmuck> hrm, i don't think so.  i'm in a similar situation as yourself.  I'm still on the learning curve, and my time is limited so I do what's necessary to get the job done, and move on
<Ahmuck> :)
<AndyGraybeal> okay, yea i don't want to learn ACL
<AndyGraybeal> i'm fine (for the most part) with unix perms.
<AndyGraybeal> thank you for talking
<AndyGraybeal> i think things will be better when sabayon is available for me (in march after th 10.04 release)
<alkisg> That's May :)
<AndyGraybeal> may
<AndyGraybeal> thanks
<Ahmuck> u can still move foward, and learn what you need to before then
<Ahmuck> but, yes, i wouldn't be afraid to create permanant users if they are indeed permant and you've got a sepearte partition for your /home directory
<Ahmuck> my problem is that my users are temporie, and creating permannt users for one time use is impractical
<Ahmuck> which means i have to clean up after class
<alkisg> Why don't you clean up with a logon script?
<Ahmuck> time required to learn how to write a logon script, time to implement ...
<Ahmuck> speaking of time, gtg ...
<Ahmuck> ah, actually i know why i'm here.  gdm broke on the last update.  i need to "reset" gdm
<Ahmuck> is there a file or directory i can rm to do this?
<sbalneav> Ahmuck: Is it actually running?
<Ahmuck> i've got a background and then a brown box in the center ... i can ps -ax it to see
<Ahmuck> let me check
<Ahmuck> yes, it appears to be running ... gdm-simple-greeter
<Ahmuck> no icons on the bottom of the screen however for logout, etc.
<sbalneav> hm
<sbalneav> Well, if it were me...
<highvoltage> howdy
<sbalneav> I'd switch to a text console
<alkisg> hi high :)
<Ahmuck> users can start an xsession from text console?
<sbalneav> do an apt-get purge gdm
<Ahmuck> looks like upon reboot, i've got an accessablity icon
<sbalneav> and an apt-get install gdm
<Ahmuck> ah yes, *smack* why didn't i think of that :(
<sbalneav> how much does apt-get purge gdm want to delete... one sec lemme see...
<sbalneav> Hmmm
<sbalneav> does want to pull a few other packages with it...
<sbalneav> ummm
<sbalneav> try this:
<sbalneav> apt-get install --reinstall gdm
<Ahmuck> found it
<Ahmuck> broken packages ... gdm-guest-session, sabayon, ubuntu-desktop, & indicator session
<Ahmuck> er, indicator-session
<sbalneav> ah, so apt-get -f install may fix you up
<Ahmuck> does sabayon or ltsp use a different gdm?  ie, it's talking about gdm and gdm-2.2.0
<sbalneav> Not as far as I know...
<sbalneav> Lemme check what sabayon depends on...
<alkisg> Ahmuck: if you removed gdm, you also removed ubuntu-desktop, so you'd better reinstall it.
<sbalneav> Nope, just depends on gdm
<sbalneav> No verno's for that.
<sbalneav> and AFAIK, ltsp doesn't depend on gdm at all
<highvoltage> how are things alkisg?
<alkisg> highvoltage: fine - I'm just getting tired trying to solve some fat client problems :)
 * alkisg needs to have an application for easy fat client installation + a manual in time for lucid..
<highvoltage> alkisg: it will be interesting to see what it does in production.
<alkisg> I think fat clients need a little more automation than thin clients... E.g. with SSH_FOLLOW_SYMLINKS=false, to get a shared folder on the client, you need EXTRA_MOUNTS, which isn't obvious...
<alkisg> In my (greek only :-/) app I've included such automations, but it would be nice to see them as a prepackaged solution at a later edubuntu version...
 * alkisg will work on properly packaging whatever scripts he uses for his local solutions in the future
<sbalneav> Ahmuck: Get yourself sorted out?
<Ahmuck> sorry, had to step out and take care of something
<Ahmuck> can return to it in about 10 min
<Ahmuck> ok ... back to the gdm
<Ahmuck> hrm, no fixie
<Ahmuck> any other ideas?
<X-Raimo> hi all. I have server with sound card, it works as LTSP Server. Currently, when client plays music it plays from server's speakers. And my ltsp-clients with their sound cards need to play music via their own sound cards.
<Ahmuck> so any other ideas on how to fix gdm?
#edubuntu 2010-03-09
<Lns> Ahmuck: what's wrong with it?
<Ahmuck> hi alkisg
<alkisg> Hello
<Ahmuck> that time over there i suppose
<alkisg> 7 am :)
<proshnokorta> hi all
<alkisg> Hi
<proshnokorta> i have 4 old PCs with no cd or usb drive, so i need to install edubuntu over network
<proshnokorta> in red hat i used diskboot.img or boot.iso to initiate the boot process, then choose the nfs install method
<proshnokorta> what to do here?
<alkisg> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LiveCDNetboot#line-75
<alkisg> There's a script there that lets you netboot
<proshnokorta> i can't use the script because the place where i'm installing doesn't have internet access
<proshnokorta> from what i understand, after setting up and running the pxe server
<proshnokorta> when i start the PCs, they should automatically start as if using the live cd/dvd?
<alkisg> Yes, but if you don't have internet access, you can't install nfs server
<alkisg> So you can't use that.
<proshnokorta> gahh...so there's no way then..
<alkisg> proshnokorta: well, you can use that script on an existing installation
<alkisg> proshnokorta: are you planning to go on those 4 PC with a laptop, and netboot them off of your laptop?
<alkisg> Does that laptop have ubuntu/edubuntu on it?
<alkisg> If so, just run the script on your main system when you have internet
<proshnokorta> its downloading presently, i can put it up
<proshnokorta> so i run the script on the laptop and it installs tftp and nfs etc...then i connect to the PCs and they should automagically start installation?
<alkisg> That *would* be the case if you had internet there
<alkisg> Now you'll need 1-2 more steps
<proshnokorta> yes..
<alkisg> See the script for details... you'll need to remove the "apt-get --yes --auto-remove purge nfs-kernel-server" etc
 * alkisg guesses that it might even work without modifications, as the packages will be in cache so it won't have to fetch them over the net
<alkisg> Try it locally, run it once while connected, and then while disconnected from the internet.
<proshnokorta> yes, will test with my home pc...but with my net speed here, can only do so tomo...will tell you how it goes..
<proshnokorta> thank you!
<alkisg> np
<proshnokorta> ciao
<highvoltage> hi everyone
<mgariepy> morning all
<kmahl> yo people, i got one assignment and i don't know exacty how to solve it, i searched on google, but i think that probably one of you guys could solve it?
<kmahl> Write a script using your favorite editor. The script should display the path to your homedirectory and the terminal type that you are using. Additionally it shows all the services started up in runlevel 3 on your system. (hint: use HOME, TERM and ls /etc/rc3.d/S*)
<mhall119|work> kmahl: open a terminal, and run "echo $HOME" and "echo $TERM"
<mhall119|work> you'll see what the assignment is wanting
<kmahl> is xTERM the answer?
<mhall119|work> what did "echo $TERM" print out?
<kmahl> only xTERM
<mhall119|work> then that's the answer
<mhall119|work> it's different for different people
<kmahl> what does it mean that it shows all the service started up in runlevel 3 on my system?
<mhall119|work> okay, do you understand runlevels?
<kmahl> i can search it
<mhall119|work> yeah, you'll want to learn what runlevels are
<mhall119|work> then the hint about "ls /e/tc/rc3.d/S*" will make sense
<kmahl> yeah i think i got it now, thanks
<mhall119|work> you're welcome
<Ahmuck> hrm, btw, are there *nix exercises out there for people to try at an educational level?
<mhall119|work> you might ask in #ubuntu-learning
<Ahmuck> http://itbhu.ac.in/codefest/
<sbalneav> Morning all
<joerg_> morning sbalneav
<mhall119|work> [VOTE] Edubuntu Council to assume responsibility for edubuntu-dev, just passed
<alkisg> Ugh, passed?
<mhall119|work> yeah
<mhall119|work> it was put up to a vote in #ubuntu-meeting
<mhall119|work> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-devel/2010-February/003323.html
<alkisg> Damn, where were we? :D
<mhall119|work> I dunno, I was there
<alkisg> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/03/09/%23ubuntu-meeting.html
<mhall119|work> well I wasn't talking...
<mhall119|work> but I was still there
<alkisg> Final  result is 5 for, 0 against. 0 abstained. Total: 5
<alkisg> So why did you say "passed"?
<alkisg> So as of now, edubuntu council has assumed responsibility of edubuntu-dev... nice!
<mhall119|work> passed == approved in US-en
<ogra> yeah, its something different in greek :P
<ogra> congrats !
 * mhall119|work forgets sometimes that he's in international channels
<ogra> mhall119|work, (i was joking on alkisg's cost)
<alkisg> ah, sorry, I thought "passed == left for another time"
<alkisg> like in, "want some candy?" "no, I'll pass..." :P
<mhall119|work> no, that would be "passed on" or "passed over"
<mhall119|work> English is a stupid language
<ogra> passed in the right context even points to dead or unconcious ;)
<alkisg> Bah, fortunately code is much less obscure than spoken languages :D
<mhall119|work> passed (on|over|out|away)
<mhall119|work> alkisg: except Perl
<alkisg> Heh, you're right on that one ;)
<mmartin12517> Hello, I am trying to get some information about the EDU version of Ubuntu
<mmartin12517> I need to know if there is an application or program that will allow teachers to view and/or control user workstations
<mmartin12517> Hello?
<mmartin12517> This is the Support chat room for Ubuntu EDUCATIONAL version correct?
<alkisg> mmartin12517: you can try italc
<alkisg> Is that an LTSP setup, or a regular setup?
<mmartin12517> We have not setup anything just yet we are collecting data before we make the change
<alkisg> http://italc.sourceforge.net/
<mmartin12517> Have you set up any labs in a school?
<alkisg> Lots of them
<mmartin12517> Great! I am trying to determine if moving to OS systems would be more beneficial to our students
<alkisg> Mine were satisfied... but it always depends on what the needs are, what resources you have etc
<mmartin12517> we have had a windows lab for as long as anyone can remember, with budget cuts we need to find an alternative or lay off more teachers
<mmartin12517> we have roughly 300 workstations
<alkisg> specs?
<alkisg> (ram/cpu?)
<mmartin12517> we use networked printers and the manufacturer supports Linux
<mmartin12517> the systems are AMD Semp 2.10GHz with 3GB RAM
<mmartin12517> however the Operating systems are substantially more than the computers cost
<mmartin12517> even with an educational license
<alkisg> With Linux it's also easier to maintain lots of pcs
<mmartin12517> That is one of the major switching points we have been considering
<alkisg> It was a nightmare to install programs and remove viruses etc with windows, but now with linux clusterssh enables me to install programs to all pcs simultaneously
<mmartin12517> Yes, we have been using Putty for some of our tasks but we are restricted on many of the Windows machines due to permissions from the district
<mmartin12517> what software would you recommend to install on the systems with Ubuntu?
<mmartin12517> well thank you for your time, I will do more digging and will get back if I have anymore questions
<Ahmuck> ouch, let a good one get away :/
<Ahmuck> alkisg: ur not on ltsp anymore?
<alkisg> ?
<alkisg> What do you mean?
<Ahmuck> <quote> clusterssh enables me to install programs to all pcs simultaneously
<alkisg> Ahmuck: I'm in charge of several labs, so I've been looking at many different solutions
<Ahmuck> ah.  i'm interested in your progress
<alkisg> I've settled for thin + fat clients
<Ahmuck> no "cloning" with centralized user/storage?
<alkisg> No, it's not worth it
<alkisg> Also it's easier to use student netbooks this way
<alkisg> They just press f12 => boot from network, and they're working as fat clients
<alkisg> With their documents on the server etc
<Ahmuck> that's neat
<Ahmuck> and they don't have to worry about thier netbook windows install :)
<alkisg> Yup
<Ahmuck> so r u using nubaes fat client setup?
<alkisg> Half of them are not working or have a virus or don't have the edu apps...
<alkisg> No, I'm using the "official" fat client plugin
<Ahmuck> there's an official fat client plugin?
<alkisg> Yes
<Ahmuck> sudo aptitude install fat-client?
<alkisg> Here's a small wiki page I wrote about it: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/FatClients
<Ahmuck> no need to set each the mac address of each client it appears
<alkisg> mac? what for?
<alkisg> Only if you want to separate thin/fat clients
<alkisg> Or you could use a menu...
<alkisg> Goodnight all
#edubuntu 2010-03-10
<Ahmuck> i've been thinking, i changed the ip address of the server as well as the hostname.  is gdm tied in with the hostname?
<alkisg> crimsun, thanks for teeworlds ;)
<alkisg> Damn evolution doesn't run on fat clients, with SSH_FOLLOW_SYMLINKS=false...
 * alkisg tries with =True...
<highvoltage> hey mgariepy
<mgariepy> hey
<mgariepy> how you doing ?
<highvoltage> doing good thanks and you?
<highvoltage> alkisg: hey there. have you installed ltsp on lucid recently? it seems to hang when it's busy doing "Setting up ldm-server..." here
<alkisg> highvoltage: switch to another vt, and run: sudo service openbsd-inetd restart
<alkisg> I've reported that, but noone has looked into it yet...
<alkisg> (erm, I _think_ i've reported that... bah, Alzheimer)
<highvoltage> alkisg: heh, ok
<alkisg> highvoltage: how would you like the permissions for fat clients?
<alkisg> I.e. like on normal desktops, admins can mount anything etc, or with "LOCALDEV_DENY_FLOPPIES" etc?
<alkisg> (policykit vs lts.conf directives...)
<alkisg> (I mean about mounting devices)
<highvoltage> good question, I think it probably makes sense making it work like a typical fat client (so policykit then), but I don't have particularly strong feelings about it
<alkisg> Yeah, that's how I feel too.. I've been trying to make consolekit/policykit cooperate for that past 2 days ;)
<alkisg> OK, thanks
<Ahmuck> whew, fixed my problem
<stgraber> alkisg: I just did some quick debugging, my guess is that moving openbsd-inetd to a Pre-Depends should fix the issue
<alkisg> stgraber: nice! Btw, could you update your ppa with the latest trunk? That "quoted clientid" in udhcp is causing problems for some people..
<stgraber> alkisg: ok, I'm quickly going to upload a fixed 2.1 in Lucid to fix that inetd issue, then I'll do a new snapshot
<alkisg> (i.e. the dhcp server always sends the same id for all)
<stgraber> alkisg: do you have a bug number for the inetd issue ?
<alkisg> Goodies
<alkisg> let me check...
<alkisg> stgraber: I don't see it, so I might not have reported it...
<mhall119|work> highvoltage: stgraber: could either of you point me to some good documentation on using seeds and germinate to make Qimo ISOs?
<mhall119|work> I'd like to start doing this properly
<highvoltage> mhall119|work: afaik the best documentation is available from the wiki: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SeedManagement and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Germinate
<mhall119|work> ok, already found both of those
<mhall119|work> is there somewhere I can get the seed files used by Edubuntu and Xubuntu?
<highvoltage> mhall119|work: although if you want to build a cd from scratch for qimo I think this would be way better: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LiveCDCustomizationFromScratch
<highvoltage> mhall119|work: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/edubuntu.lucid
<mhall119|work> oh, interesting, thanks highvoltage
<highvoltage> you're welcome
<mhall119|work> not sure if I want to go from scratch or not
<mhall119|work> but I'll give it a try and see how it works out
<mhall119|work> ubuntu-standard is what it common among all  the *buntus?
<stgraber> alkisg: uploaded
<alkisg> Thanks!
<highvoltage> where does /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0 come from?
<stgraber> highvoltage: syslinux is installed in the chroot, pxelinux.0 is copied in /boot in the chroot, then copied to /var/lib/tftpboot by ltsp-update-kernels
<highvoltage> ah thanks stgraber
<highvoltage> for the ltsp livecd, would we prefer mounting the squashfs and extracting it from there or installing syslinux?
<stgraber> mounting the squashfs as we'll need to extract the kernel and initrd anyway
<stgraber> (the initrd in LTSP is different from the one on the livecd, so we need to extract it from the chroot)
<highvoltage> ah right I forgot that they were different
<sbalneav> Morning all
<highvoltage> morning scottesaurus
<stgraber> hey sbalneav
<highvoltage> it would've been so nice if pxelinux could've been quiten down
<highvoltage> the rest of the boot process is so nice these days
<ogra> send a patch to intel :)
<highvoltage> ogra: :)
<highvoltage> ogra: I might be wrong but it seems like most of the noise is generated after intel's stuff
<highvoltage> (from the pxelinux.0 binary)
<sbalneav> I've never understood the obsession with making boot silent.  It makes it 10x as hard to help people debug problems ("Go here! Turn this on! Now this!  And turn this off!  Now whats it say?"), and the boot's over with so fast... who CARES what it looks like booting?
<sbalneav> </grump?
<sbalneav> >
<highvoltage> sbalneav: useful information is good, repetitive useless information that is always the same whether things are working or not may actually make things harder to troubleshoot since it makes the actual error messages harder to spot
<jussi01> highvoltage: got a sec?
<highvoltage> jussi01: yep
 * jussi01 pms
<sbalneav> highvoltage: sure. all this silencing doesn't spit out errors at all, it just completely silences everything.
<ogra> sbalneav, windows and mac users are scaaaared by white text on black screens ... all these errprs messages that pass by
<ogra> *error
<sbalneav> Yeah, so, let 'em use Mac or Windows.
<sbalneav> We're supposed to be different, remember?
<ogra> if its white on black it *must* be errors
<highvoltage> sbalneav: yes indeed, silencing error messages isn't a great idea
<sbalneav> Or is that Linuxs' only goal these days: to be like windows/mac?
<ogra> sbalneav, lucid spits out errors if they appear
<highvoltage> in the one company I worked for, I didn't want to miss an irc meeting during a work meeting
<ogra> plymouth chnaged a lot of things
<highvoltage> so I irc'd during the meeting
<highvoltage> my one manager walked passed and saw irssi and said "wow, look how committed Jonathan is, he even codes during meetings"
<sbalneav> heh
 * ogra wouldnt mind bootmessages though ... even on his normal lappie ... you dont notice them anyway if you boot in 8sec
 * alkisg just sees a "(C) .... ess esc to skip disk check" and a blue bar with plymouth
<alkisg> Isn't that supposed to actually show messages when one puts "NONquiet splash"?
<ogra> yeah, still buggy
<ogra> err NONquiet ?
<ogra> what should that be ?
<alkisg> you know, not define quiet at all :D
<alkisg> At least it doesn't crash when one presses enter since 2 weeks ...
<ogra> ah, i thought you literally put NON there
<alkisg> There's something really wrong with their tty switching
<ogra> plymouth is the biggest crap ... but if you dont want console messages its the only way to go
<HedgeMage> Greetings, all.
<ogra> (you need a graphical way for asking for the password on encrypted filesystems and a graphical way for fsck progress)
<ogra> i think these two are the only reason why we still have plymouth ... else we'd just go with a black screen if quiet is set
<ogra> splashes dont really make sense if you only see them for 1/2 second
<alkisg> I got lots and lots of complains about thin clients not being able to boot because of plymouth :-/
<ogra> are you sure its plymouth ?
<alkisg> If they remove plymouth from init-bottom, it works...
<alkisg> ...and half of them also work by just removing "quiet splash"
<ogra> that doesbnt really say it must be plymouth :)
<ogra> the framebuffer handling in the kernel changed a lot too
<ogra> especually the vt switching code :)
<alkisg> OK, but from the user prespective, plymouth is the guilty one, as it worked before :D
<alkisg> I just hope it'll work in most of the cases when the final lucid is out
<ogra> as long as you (make the users) file bugs
<highvoltage> stgraber: my short-term memory seems to be failing me, what did Lamont say about the squashfs image?
<stgraber> that he'd look at the bug
<stgraber> but that hasn't happened yet ...
<stgraber> highvoltage: can you poke him ? I've done enough nagging recently and don't want to end up in his ignore list ;)
<stgraber> bug 531546
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 531546 in livecd-rootfs "Have a LTSP chroot built and placed on the Edubuntu DVD" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/531546
<joerg> hey boys and girls :)
<stgraber> hi joerg
<highvoltage> hey joerg!
<highvoltage> stgraber: yes, will do!
<stgraber> highvoltage: thanks
<joerg> highvoltage, saw a report on TV about south africa :) very nice over there ^^
<highvoltage> joerg: depends where. it has good and bad places :)
<joerg> hmm, at the southern coast
<joerg> where they that old railway along the coast
<joerg> +run
<stgraber> Edubuntu meeting in 13 minutes !
<highvoltage> joerg: ah yes I was down there this weekend for a wedding
<highvoltage> Edubuntu Meeting about to start in #ubuntu-meeting
<Ahmuck> meeting over?
<stgraber> yep
<Ahmuck> so, what do i need to back up.  lts.conf, interfaces & ...
<mad_willsy> \join #ltsp
#edubuntu 2010-03-11
<alkisg> Good morning. I can't get evolution to work with fat clients, it needs to create a lock in ~/.evolution and sshfs doesn't support that.
<alkisg> I wonder if an NFS _option_ would be accepted upstream...
<g4tsu> Hi
<g4tsu> I've got a problem with LTSP and disabling ssh
<g4tsu> I've add this line in lts.conf without success : LDM_DIRECTX=True
<alkisg> g4tsu: what do you mean "disabling ssh" ?
<g4tsu> when you connect the thinclient to the ltsp server
<g4tsu> you make a ssh tunnel
<g4tsu> (apologies for my bad english)
<g4tsu> I search how to disable ssh
<ogra> you cant
<g4tsu> I find that I have to add a line in lts.conf
<ogra> the tunnel is always there
<g4tsu> really ?
<ogra> LDM_DIRECTX just disabled the heavy transport of graphics through the tunnel
<ogra> *disables
<alkisg> g4tsu: how are the users going to login if you disable ssh?
<g4tsu> ok but when I add this line, It seems to be that the graphics support continue to through the tunnel
<g4tsu> ssh -Y -t -S /var/run/ldm_socket_5030_192.168.1.68 -l adminsu 192.168.1.68  XDG_DATA_DIRS=/tmp/ltsp-localapps-adminsu-diDRKu/:/usr/local/share/:/usr/share/ LTSP_CLIENT=192.168.1.102 LTSP_CLIENT_HOSTNAME=ltsp102 LC_ALL=fr_FR.UTF-8 LANGUAGE=fr_FR.UTF-8 LANG=fr_FR.UTF-8 DISPLAY=192.168.1.102:7  PULSE_SERVER=tcp:192.168.1.102:4713 ESPEAKER=192.168.1.102:16001 /etc/X11/Xsession default < /dev/null > /dev/null ; /usr/sbin/ltspfsmounter all cleanup
<g4tsu> I've got this line
<g4tsu> So it's seems that Xsession use the ssh tunnel
<ogra> DISPLAY=192.168.1.102:7
<ogra> it doesnt
<g4tsu> ah ok
<ogra> else DISPLAY would point to localhost
<g4tsu> ok great
<ogra> sshd sets up a local proxy for X on the server
<ogra> if you use X forwarding through the tunnel
<g4tsu> thanks for help me see things clearly
<ogra> :)
<dgroos> Good Morning Edubunteros :)
<dgroos> Edubuntistas?
<Ahmuck> hi dgroos
<dgroos> Ahmuck: how are you?
<Ahmuck> heh, rebuilding my ltsp server
<dgroos> It's always so satisfying to do that, feels like one is getting so much done, using so much computing power, and one only need type in a little command... and wait.
<Ahmuck> heh
<Ahmuck> ubuntu has a problem with the forcedeth driver, as a result i usually have to search for a couple of hours how to fix it every time
<Ahmuck> the real problem is this problem has existed since hardy or prior, and keeps getting marked "won't fix"
<Ahmuck> in part because nobody can decide who should fix it
<dgroos> Well, I'd have to search for a couple hours to find out what a forcedeth driver is...
<Ahmuck> heh
<Ahmuck> it's the driver for nvidia chipsets on the mobo, the driver that drives the nic
<Ahmuck> the software behind it reads the nic wrong or the nvidia has implented it incorrectly, and upon every reboot it increases the number of the eth by 1
<Ahmuck> so you end up with 300+ eth in 70-persistant-net-rules
<Ahmuck> ie, eth300
<Ahmuck> making it impossible to set a static ip address for that interface
<dgroos> that sounds like one would want to rip out ones (that is ones computer's) innards.
<dgroos> and get a new one.
<Ahmuck> or put a new nic in a pci slot
<dgroos> :)
<Ahmuck> you can get the nic set, by using some hacks, but the problem is that the mac address still changes upon every reboot making outside access via ports impossible
<Ahmuck> er, some port implementation ... if your tunneling for vpn, etc.
<Ahmuck> as i understand it
<Ahmuck> anywho, it's a mess, and i would have expected it to have been fixed already by karamic considering how long it's been in the system
<Ahmuck> since gutsy
<Ahmuck> at least
<dgroos> I remember someone commenting here one day that they had a really high number for there eth port and when alkisg asked, I think this person's comment was something like, 'long story'.  Now I know...
<dgroos> real long story.
<Ahmuck> heh
<Ahmuck> it happens on boards where the bios allows you to set your own nic
<Ahmuck> which is a really neat idea, cause it makes irc banning near impossible :)
<dgroos> irc banning?  disallowing someone from participating in an irc channel?
<Ahmuck> yes
<dgroos> This page http://www.wikihow.com/wikiHow:IRC-Bans seems to make it sound like banning is a valuable thing?  Not allowing someone to virtually sabotage a community?  I'm missing something...
<Ahmuck> dictorial ops
<Ahmuck> who get up on the wrong side of the bed that day
<dgroos> Ahhh...
<dgroos> True I've never seen the need for it with my limited experience here on #edubuntu, but I can theoretically imagine a situation where it might be needed.  There are some cats that are even stranger than I 'out there'...
<Ahmuck> democracy and free speech is a double edge sword.  kings and plebs.  even kings can get out of order, look at history and see the revolutions that have happened
<dgroos> you're telling me.
<dgroos> I see it often enough in educational leadership...
<dgroos> not evil, just misguided.
<Ahmuck> i agree
<dgroos> do you get dilbert cartoons where you are?
<Ahmuck> nope :(
<Ahmuck> i don't recall the last time i read a newspaper ...
<dgroos> I understand that!  When you get a chance... http://www.dilbert.com/
<sbalneav> Morning all
<alkisg> Hi Scotty
<alkisg> sbalneav: have you ever used pam environment variables? I can't get pam to read my env vars..
<sbalneav> Hmmmm, No, but....
<sbalneav> http://freshmeat.net/projects/pam_envfeed
<alkisg> That'd be perfect, but I don't think we want it as an ltsp dependency... :-/
<sbalneav> there is a "pam_env" module.... I think lemme look
<alkisg> Yes, I was trying to use that
<sbalneav> What's it doing/not doing?
<alkisg> But I could only make it read static variables  from /etc/security/pam_env.conf
<sbalneav> You want something dynamic
<alkisg> So I couldn't make it set CKCON_X11_DISPLAY=$DISPLAY
<alkisg> (i.e. read DISPLAY or some other environment variable)
<sbalneav> yeah, pam_env won't do that, that's why you'd want pam_envfeed.
<alkisg> I think that "pam environment" is a special, system-wide environment... I'd like a per-session environment
<sbalneav> Want me to package it?
<alkisg> Nah...
<sbalneav> if we need it, then we need it.
<alkisg> If it comes to that, I'll just use a python function instead
<alkisg> i.e. call OpenSessionWithParameters to properly notify consolekit
<alkisg> I've just committed a workaround that ...works, but not a proper one
<alkisg> If we won't find any better way in the next weeks, then I'll just replace `su user` with a python function
<alkisg> (i was trying to avoid it because not all distros are using consolekit, so I preferred environment variables + su)
<sbalneav> Well, pam_envfeed could be useful to us for other things.
<sbalneav> If we package it, and make it useful for debian, and potentially other distros, it might become a standard we could rely on.
<alkisg> That's true... /me shrugs
<sbalneav> Well, tell you what.  I'll package it, and we can look at it post-lucid.
<alkisg> highvoltage, mgariepy, you might want to try the latest commit in ldm-trunk, it makes the fat client sessions CK/PK aware (so device mounting works)
<alkisg> sbalneav: sounds good to me
<alkisg> Ah, we probably need to disable LOCALDEV for fat clients, too
<mgariepy> nice alkisg thanks, i won't be able to test this today though.
<alkisg> np
<highvoltage> alkisg: cool!
<alkisg> There's also http://manpages.ubuntu.com/pam_exec - maybe that could be used instead...
<sbalneav> Not sure if it will preserve the enviornment... We could try..
<alkisg> I'm only interested in modifying the pam environment temporarily
<alkisg> Not the process environment...
<alkisg> I.e. pam must "see" CKCON_X11_DISPLAY in its "pam environment" in order for `su` to work correctly, but we don't need that variable in the session environment
<alkisg> (I hope I'm making sense...)
<sbalneav> yeah, makes sense.
<alkisg> highvoltage: can you send me your newusers script, to try to make it a little faster?
<alkisg> e.g. we could use pam_mkhomedir to make the home dirs for only the users that actually log in...
<highvoltage> alkisg: yep
<highvoltage> alkisg: ok this is sttill one with a bashism:
<highvoltage> for user in {1..255}; do echo "ltsp$user:ltsp$user:200$user:1000:LTSP Guest:/home/ltsp$user:/bin/sh" >> /tmp/userlist newusers /tmp/userlist
<highvoltage> done
<alkisg> ok, ty
<highvoltage> ok that doesn't paste well
<highvoltage> but you get it
<nubae> highvoltage: hi there, is there a list of uncompleted taskss before release?
<nubae> some place...
<nubae> public preferably :-)
<highvoltage> nubae: our meeting notes usually contain to-do items, otherwise it's in tickets in LP
<highvoltage> nubae: the website work is listed out there quite well, besides that we basically have some artwork issues left and getting the liveltsp and ltsp-installer in
<highvoltage> nubae: oh and the squashfs required for that
<nubae> ok, can I get started on something? whats most urgent?
<nubae> I've been away for quite a while and want to show that I still care :-) heh
<nubae> can I see the to do items?
<nubae> I'd also like to run something by you, get your ok...
<nubae> I would like to link linux-for-education.org to edubuntu.org
<nubae> just a link
<nubae> for extra help
<nubae> the lforE site has a ubuntu specific part, so we could redirect users to there
<nubae> especially the howto jazz up you ubuntu instalation, etc.
<highvoltage> nubae: I think the best would be to get an edubuntu iso, boot from it (even if in a virtualmachine) and find/fix bugs
<highvoltage> nubae: I think at this stage in the release cycle that's quitee critical and we can definitely do more of that right now
<highvoltage> nubae: not sure how good your packaging is, when we get the new logos from canonical there will be quite some artwork work to be done
<Ahmuck> new edubuntu logos?
<alkisg> Would anyone care (or mind) for also allowing a local partition (identified by LOCAL_HOME=volume-name) to be mounted as /home for fat clients? It shouldn't need more than 10 lines...
<alkisg> ...anyway, i'll leave that post-lucid
<joerg> hi folks
#edubuntu 2010-03-12
<__Techie__> might i have rushed into the networking configuration too fast?
<joerg> _Techie_, maybe
<mgariepy> morning all
<highvoltage> morning mgariepy
<mgariepy> highvoltage you won't see any snow when you arrive i think the winter is over now :(
<highvoltage> mgariepy: pity. on the other hand... I'll have double-summer :)
<mgariepy> highvoltage, yeah indeed, i just hope we will have a great summer.
<highvoltage> mgariepy: hopefully renewing a work permit isn't so much effort
<highvoltage> monday they sent me a message saying they want proof that I worked everywhere I say I did, so I had to hunt a bunch of people down so that they could write and sign letters saying so and post it to the embassy
<highvoltage> hopefully that will have been the last stuff they want from me
<mgariepy> i hope so too. or you'll finish by having 2 winters ;)
<highvoltage> mgariepy: I'll probably be coming back this side in September and be back that side by January. It's a bit hard to plan and make everything work at this stage :)
<mgariepy> hehe i understand :)
<alkisg> nubae: have you seen the " [moodle-packaging] Time to Orphan?" mail in the ML ?
<alkisg> Maybe you'd be interested to help there? I think you're using moodle, no?
<Ahmuck> edubuntu on a stick?
<Ahmuck> or edubuntu in windows - aka pubuntu
<Ahmuck> ?
<nubae> alkisg: yes
<nubae> can u give me a link that is a beginning point for the problem?
<alkisg> I've only got the mail, I don't know anything else about it
<nubae> ok, there isnt a tentative plan with a calendar as to when things should be done?
<nubae> ie... organisatiion?
<alkisg> No idea
<alkisg> As I understood it, they're looking for a maintainer
<nubae> WEll the entire moodle on a stick thing is a complex one...
<nubae> before that... we need gears working well with moodle to synch between local setups and a server
<nubae> Martin Langhoff of olpc fame is working on that, as its one of the bsic tenants for Sugar and the one laptop per children
<nubae> but, he's one man, and the people that have come and cone to help out with the gears integration have shown that this is not s easy as it might sound. Everyone goes in a different direction when trying to set i tup.
<nubae> I believe the best way is to do something with gears that is quite general and wll allow any of our edubuntu apps to run offlne
<nubae> that would be one hell of an advancement
<nubae> and a necessary one since lets face it, eedubuntu is most interesting in environments where there is no reguar internet access.
<nubae> Now.... back to something practical on my part... I need to learn how to do the official packaging dance, can someone point me to the best docs to follow... thanks?
<alkisg> I guess you should reply to the ML for that
<alkisg> The maintainer said that it's time for him to resign, so you should reply to him and tell him that you're interested (if indeed you are) and ask for whatever directions...
<alkisg> See the ML archives for the actual mail
<nubae> umm... intrested in what?
<nubae> resigning from what?
<nubae> sorry for the dense questions, but its not clear to me
<alkisg> There's a man who's packaging moodle
<alkisg> He doesn't want to do that anymore
<alkisg> So we won't have moodle packages for debian/ubuntu, unless someone else wants to do this job
<alkisg> I don't use moodle, but I thought you did, and you were asking yesterday about any edubuntu-related work, that's why I mentioned it..
<alkisg> And that's all I know about it - for whatever more you'd need to ask him...
<nubae> I am using moodle yes
<nubae> link to specifiic email if u have it...
<nubae> oh.... alkisg is gone:-(
#edubuntu 2010-03-13
<joerg__> hi
<Emerling> hi
<Emerling> hola
<joerg> hi
<Emerling> alguien aqui,,,somebody here
<Emerling> i need help
<Emerling> necesito ayuda
<joerg> are ou bleeding?
<Emerling> thnks
<joerg> shall I call the police or an ambulance? :D
<Emerling> i use ubuntu 9.10 and i download edubuntu .iso image
<joerg> just tell us what kind of help you need ^^
<Emerling> :P
<joerg> yes....lot's of people do that
<Emerling> i install edubntu desktp
<Emerling> andothersoftware educative
<Emerling> but y need slpash theme edubuntu
<Emerling> i use usplash
<Emerling> usplash no have edubuntu .so files
<Emerling> debia. edu .os and anothers
<Emerling> but i restar mi pc and see ubuntu splash no edubuntu splash
<Emerling> im sorry my english is basic
<Emerling> you can help me?
<Emerling> the splshy software n download  have errors
<Emerling> :(
<Ahmuck-Sr> still working on getting my nics working properly, however, got another issue
<Ahmuck-Sr> when i re-upped the server, i did not back up user profiles.  can i just create the same profile and access to the directory and files will work.  or are they tied to a user id number with the username?
#edubuntu 2010-03-14
<joerg> hi
<joerg> hey hey
#edubuntu 2011-03-07
<nothingman> hi, all
<highvoltage> hi nothingman
<nothingman> hi, highvoltage!
<nothingman> what's happening?
<highvoltage> nothingman: shew, lots of snow!
<nothingman> haha, here too!
<nothingman> I'm in CNY
<nothingman> my brother called me from his gf's parents in Brazil via MagicJack
<nothingman> lucky brat
<nothingman> where are you?
<highvoltage> quebec, canada
<nothingman> that's practically next door
<highvoltage> where is CNY?
#edubuntu 2011-03-08
<mgariepy> good morning everyone
<doctormo> It's funny
<doctormo> #edubuntu causes empathy to disconnect from irc
<HedgeMage> weird
<highvoltage> doctormo: got my PM's?
<doctormo> highvoltage: Ah yes, I see them. will send you updates after today's edits.
<doctormo> I'd like to make it look better... had to scrap a few iterations.
<highvoltage> doctormo: ok, great. no pressure :)
<Roasted_> good afternoon
<mhall119> hi
<mhall119> :)
<Roasted_> been a long time, mhall119
<Roasted_> mhall119, have you used the edubuntu package?
<mhall119> some, i've been collaborating with them
<Roasted_> what exactly does edubuntu contain and aim for, in terms of grade levels
<mhall119> or, at least, I'm supposed to be collaborating with them, lately I've been doing a whole lot of nothing :(
<Roasted_> is it something that can be for any grade level?
<mhall119> Roasted_: one second, I'll get the list
<Roasted_> nice. thanks.
<mhall119> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/AppGuide is from 10.10
<mhall119> there have been a few additions for 11.04
<Roasted_> I was asked if we could integrate ubuntu into our windows environment, so I'm trying to do that now.
<Roasted_> I was just trying to find somebody else out there who may be in the position I'm in, but has already done it.
<Roasted_> I have no problem being the guinea pig but a little re-assurance from another user would be nice. :P
<Roasted_> so by installing edubuntu, I get ALL of this?
<mhall119> http://www.revolutionlinux.com/ is a canadian company that has done several school installs
<Roasted_> because I'm starting off with a few systems at the HS level, but if Edubuntu is geared for k-5... etc.
<mhall119> a couple of the Edubuntu devs work there
<Roasted_> nice
<mhall119> highvoltage: ^^
<mhall119> stgraber: ^^
<Roasted_> I really hope this takes off.
<Roasted_> It would be so great to see an open source OS in the classroom.
<mhall119> edubuntu covers the entire US public school spectrum
<mgariepy> hey
<mhall119> hi mgariepy
<Roasted_> in particular I'm curious if anybody has integrated ubuntu to a windows domain and how its faired for them
<Roasted_> I got a few ubuntu systems on the domain but I'm just still sketchy on the whole idea since its a MS domain and all
<mhall119> Roasted_: there's also http://www.partimus.org/ out of California
<Roasted_> oh wow. thin clients...
<mhall119> Roasted_: you want to use active directory for authentication or something like that?
<Roasted_> we have some thin clients that bombed. HARD.
<Roasted_> I wonder if these would be any different
<mhall119> LTSP lets you use older second-hand computers as cheap thin clients
<Roasted_> well we're using AD right now. The idea isn't to tip the scale and re-vamp the entire system. The idea is to add a few linux boxes and see what happens.
<Roasted_> LTSP... what's the full name for that?
<mhall119> Linux Terminal Server Project
<mgariepy> Roasted_, I work for revolution linux and we have integrated in windows enviroment
<mhall119> it comes on the Edubuntu DVD
<Roasted_> mgariepy, how do you add your systems to a windows domain?
<mgariepy> We do desktop/laptop management and ltsp-cluster as well
<Roasted_> do you use likewise open by chance?
<mgariepy> we have been using likewise-open with lucid yes
<Roasted_> nice, nice.
<mhall119> Roasted_: check out http://edubuntu.org/weblive to try out a live system righ tnow
<Roasted_> glad to know I made a wise move then, lol... that's what I'm toying with now. version 6 I believe on 10.04.2
<Roasted_> mgariepy, how familiar are you with ncomputing?
<highvoltage> hey Roasted_
<Roasted_> whats up highvoltage
<highvoltage> things are good and you?
<mgariepy> Roasted_, not familiar with that
<Roasted_> ah not too bad. updating a windows image and doing a little light reading here.
<highvoltage> I've used ncomputing before. It's ok for smaller setups but it doesn't scale
<Roasted_> yeah
<Roasted_> we have ncomputing at the moment...
<Roasted_> we have one massive server trying to host a lab of 30 systems.
<highvoltage> if you want to use it in larger setups you need to manage those systems, and might as well switch to usual desktops anyway
<Roasted_> we're rebooting the server daily for it to operate with the thin clients successfully.
<Roasted_> I'm far more curious about what info I can get about ubuntu in the classroom in general, but I hadnt thought about linux thin clients.
<highvoltage> ouch, so you're using that ncomputing unit that basically sends all the video over the network? that's like networking murder :)
<Roasted_> we have it isolated on its own gigabit switch. but yeah, its rough.
<Roasted_> utilizing old computers as thin clients isn't a very attractive option for classrooms, in my opinion, as we want there to be a power saving factor there too and using old hardware doesnt translate to power savings.
<Roasted_> however, using old computers would be nice anyway, as we have those one-or-two systems in the back of each classroom for various tasks.
<highvoltage> personally I'm not a big fan of the old computers idea
<highvoltage> I've done it in more than 200 schools before and you end up spending more money replacing old hardware all the time
<Roasted_> I'm not either, but at the same token, I hate to throw out hardware that *IS* currently working.
<Roasted_> we tend to treat classroom computers as a gift.
<Roasted_> if it dies, it's gone.
<Roasted_> but while we have it, here, use it.
<highvoltage> newer computers have the benefit (at least on LTSP) that you can run some applications locally, it greatly improves end-user and networking performance
<Roasted_> I see a screenshot here of an EEE thin client. what's that lil box cost?
<highvoltage> but I guess many computers that are "old" these days are ones that I would probably consider fairly recent :)
<highvoltage> my thin client at work is a EEE. I don't know what it cost us but it works great
<highvoltage> mgariepy: do you know what this machine cost?
<mgariepy> Roasted_, i think it around 200$ but i can't promise anything
<highvoltage> (it's this one, btw http://event.asus.com/eeetop/)
<Roasted_> highvoltage, do you know what kind of ratio you can work with with these units to the server?
<Roasted_> like can 1 quad core/16gb server manage a lab of 30 eee boxes?
<Roasted_> or am I stretching it far too thin?
<highvoltage> Roasted_: well, the great thing about them is that they have enough cpu power and ram to run apps locally, so you can reduce cpu load and networking requirements quite a lot
<Roasted_> highvoltage, does the end user see an ubuntu desktop?
<highvoltage> Roasted_: they should be fine with that server, if it was me I'd probably add another gigabit network card and bond them just maximise network traffic to the desktops
<doctormo> highvoltage: OK I have a preview
<highvoltage> Roasted_: yep, they do indeed. if they install via edubuntu they'll get an edubuntu desktop, which is very similar
<highvoltage> Roasted_: here are some screenshots: http://edubuntu.org/screenshots
<highvoltage> Roasted_: the reason why I prefer LTSP way over things like ncomputing is that you can grow it with LTSP Cluster
<highvoltage> Roasted_: so when the school decides to expand the lab or put some workstations into classrooms, then you can also add more servers and split the load of the clients accross the servers
<Roasted_> highvoltage, well I think our server is actually two quad cores, 32gb ram, and 4 gigabit network cards... and it struggles with ncomputing for 30 seats...
<Roasted_> however we're in an older building. I think we're on cat5 (non e) but I don't thin kthe ncomputing boxes have a 1000 uplink anyway. Ithink they're limited by 100 as is.
<mgariepy> Roasted_, i assure you with LTSP-cluster this server would be idle.
<Roasted_> lol
<Roasted_> what does LTSP stand for
<highvoltage> Roasted_: wow, yeah that machine will be fine then :)
<highvoltage> Roasted_: Linux Terminal Server Project
<mgariepy> Linux Terminal Server Project
<Roasted_> you guys sure are giving me a lot to think about here.
<mgariepy> you are typing too fase highvoltage
<mgariepy> s/fase/fast
<Roasted_> no offense but this would certainly have to be small scale for us to heavily consider it. I'm thinking about a good test area... perhaps a bench of 8 systems in a library.
<Roasted_> would a dual core/3gb RAM desktop handle 8 systems?
<Roasted_> well, 7
<highvoltage> Roasted_: oh, I forgot to tell you, there's also LTSP live on edubuntu, it allows you to boot from a live USB disk and try out LTSP on a server
<Roasted_> also - what host OS do you use for LTSP? Ubuntu desktop? Ubuntu server?
<Roasted_> CentOS or something else?
<highvoltage> Roasted_: it will be a bit slower than a full installation, but it will give you an idea of what it's capable of already
<mgariepy> Roasted_, we use ubuntu server, with desktop packages
<highvoltage> I doubt there's anyone in here that wouldn't say Ubuntu :)
<Roasted_> Is LTSP only compatible with certain thin client boxes? Or can you utilize most thin client boxes for use with LTSP?
<mgariepy> Roasted_, usualy if you can run linux on the client it will work with LTSP
<Roasted_> yeah. that's the only thing I'm not sur eof.
<Roasted_> we have a microsoft thinpoint server or something like that now.
<Roasted_> err, multipoint
<Roasted_> it's a decent HP desktop with 7 boxes connected to it locally through HP thin clients.
<highvoltage> Roasted_: technically, anything that will work with ubuntu should work. you probably want to stick with intel architecture (like i686 and amd64) and also intel chipsets. intel graphics/sound/etc is well supported. nvidia and ati are getting a *lot* better, but there may be some regressions as their drivers are under heavy development
<Roasted_> yeah. I hear ya there.
<Roasted_> So, let's say I want to get started. How would I do this? Install Ubuntu 10.04.2 64 bit (desktop edition okay I hope?) and then what?
<highvoltage> Roasted_: if you're just getting started, I would recommend that you do it with Edubuntu 11.04 amd64 instead
<Roasted_> hold that thought...
<Roasted_> Edubuntu = LTSP?
<highvoltage> Roasted_: sorry, I meant 10.10
<Roasted_> Do I need Edubuntu to use LTSP?
<highvoltage> Roasted_: nope, it just makes it super-easy to install
<Roasted_> I see. I see...
<Roasted_> Is it in the software center or a deb package?
<highvoltage> Roasted_: it has a modified installer that includes LTSP, so you don't have to do any command-line stuff to get it running
<doctormo> highvoltage: http://divajutta.com/doctormo/art/edu/perspective.png
<Roasted_> whaaaat
<highvoltage> Roasted_: edubuntu is an iso image that you can download: http://edubuntu.org/download
<Roasted_> How does Edubuntu differ from whats in software center vs iso?
<doctormo> LTSP == Long Term Sock Protector?
<doctormo> Roasted_: All distros based around Ubuntu have a different set of default packages on the iso.
<doctormo> Lots of them make sure to upload new and interesting packages also
<Roasted_> So Edubuntu.iso would be smarter than Ubuntu.iso + Edubuntu package?
<doctormo> But that means Ubuntu classic gets access to Edubuntu packages.
<Roasted_> Or am I totally lost...
<highvoltage> Roasted_: it has the same software center, and shares the same archives, it just has other defaults and other default packages installed. you can install an ubuntu machine too, it's fine, but you'll have to install LTSP manually. if you're already comfortable with that then feel free :)
<Roasted_> Well I AM a terminal junkie, but if there's an easier way, I'm all for it.
<Roasted_> I'm very curious if some of our spare ncomputing boxes can handle LTSP...
<highvoltage> Roasted_: I think the easier option is good for just getting started and getting the concepts and how it works and where things happen. if you want to do a more specific installation and want to do more things manually, it will then be easier once you've done it the easy way
<Roasted_> I agree.
<Roasted_> Looks like I'll have a fun little project tomorrow.
<highvoltage> Roasted_: if those ncomputing boxes are anything like the ones I've seen before, then they're pretty much useless. do you have a link to the ones you've bought?
<Roasted_> Where within Edubuntu would I install LTSP? I'm just trying to think about how I go about it once I'm in.
<Roasted_> highvoltage, let me google for one quick.
<highvoltage> doctormo: I have it open and will look a bit closer, thanks :)
<Roasted_> highvoltage, we have a few of these laying around. http://www.ncomputing.com/products-lseries
<highvoltage> Roasted_: yeah those units won't work, LTSP needs thin clients with local CPUs
<Roasted_> gotcha.
<Roasted_> either way, if its cheaper than a new lab the bossman might like it
<Roasted_> but gotta start small scale. I'm curious if our hp boxes would work.
<Roasted_> I think they have a small chip inside but I'm not positive.
<mgariepy> waht hp thin client do you have ?
<Roasted_> why does this look so flipping awesome to me. suddenly my job is exciting again.
<highvoltage> indeed, a bit of experimentation with different technologies cost very little and can save you quite a lot down the line
<Roasted_> I'm not sure... I'm a few miles away in another school at the moment. :(
<mgariepy> hp-5745 works really great
<highvoltage> Roasted_: yeah they have an integrated chip, but it's some custom embedded system on a chip thingy, nothing that can run Linux, unfortunately
<Roasted_> :(
<Roasted_> either way
<Roasted_> if its cheaper than a new lab, it may be easier to integrate
<Roasted_> what kind of limitations do these boxes have? Like if we get the EEE boxes as pictured, can they run gimp? flash? etc locally?
<highvoltage> Roasted_: I do that pretty much every day on my eeetop
<mgariepy> Roasted_, usually we run gimp on the server and firefox and flash on the thin client
<Roasted_> mgariepy, really? is it easy to specify which does what?
<highvoltage> well, I use Chrome on my thin client :) (but a lot of other users here use firefox)
<doctormo> highvoltage: Remembered to put in sky, update in a second
<highvoltage> Roasted_: ltsp has a configuration file where you can specify what clients should run on their own cpu. the rest runs on the server
<Roasted_> highvoltage, and that trickles to EVERYBODY?
<mgariepy> yeah, it mostly depend on the software present on your ltsp chroot and a configuration variable for LTSP
<Roasted_> like if I say on the server, run this this and this locally, it auto-pushes everything not in the list to the server?
<Roasted_> I'm trying to dig up those EEE thin clients in the picture. I'm having a hardt ime finding it, as ASUS just links me to Revo Linux which doesn't have any specs on that box itself (price, spec, etc) Where else can I find it?
<mgariepy> Roasted_, you can also run locally an application on a client that supports it and not on another client that doesn't have enough ram.
<highvoltage> newegg has the new model, it's more than $200 though: http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883220039&Tpk=eee%20top
<highvoltage> mgariepy: I think that $200 was for the second hand ones we had in storage
<Roasted_> uh..
<highvoltage> ah, or unless it's just the ebox: http://www.newegg.ca/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&DEPA=0&Order=BESTMATCH&Description=eee+box&x=0&y=0
<Roasted_> thats not a thin client box
<Roasted_> ahh
<Roasted_> more like it :P
<Roasted_> still a bit larger than I thought it was compared to the picture.
<highvoltage> I was talking about the eeetop because that's the one I have on my desk
<Roasted_> is that the model you have highvoltage ?
<mgariepy> the 200 is for OEM system wihtout hdd and stuff..
<highvoltage> but the eeebox and eeetop has pretty much the same hardware (except for the touchscreen)
<highvoltage> mgariepy: ah, cool. I didn't realise you can buy it like that
<Roasted_> heres a gizmo http://www.google.com/products/catalog?hl=en&safe=active&noj=1&q=eee+box&biw=1280&bih=661&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=2738412403065697596&sa=X&ei=HIR2TdjvHML88Ab3ncHzCA&ved=0CHIQ8wIwBQ#
<Roasted_> we have monitors, mice, keyboards, etc.
<Roasted_> I'm talking just the BOX itself.
<Roasted_> and if it needs hdd/ram/whatever. I'm seeing some with,s ome without.
<highvoltage> yeah you probably just want to drop the hdd
<Roasted_> ram would help tho I would assume
<Roasted_> looks like netbook spec... 1gb ram 1.6ghz atom
<Roasted_> CDW has them in stock, which is a vendor we use a lot. nice nice...
<Roasted_> highvoltage, do you think theres NO way for me to use the ncomputing box as a test? I'd like to set up a 1 to 1 (ubuntu desktop as server and one thin client box) to at least show the boss if possible.
<Roasted_> then we could utilize the "real" gear (if he goes for it) with EEE box's or whatever.
<highvoltage> Roasted_: yep, more ram would be useful for local apps, and is usually cheaper to add up-front
<highvoltage> Roasted_: it's impossible for the ncomputing machines to boot a linux kernel, since they don't have a CPU and RAM, it's like trying to install Linux on a VCR.
<Roasted_> lol
<Roasted_> I tried, right?
<highvoltage> :)
<Roasted_> man, you guys gave me a ton to look over
<Roasted_> I appreciate your help highvoltage + mgariepy
<mhall119> I'm sure somewhere someone has a VCR running Debian
<Roasted_> I definitely want to look into this more. I just wish our in-house gear was up to par to use to test. school districts are getting hairy with spending now, especially experimental spending. :(
<highvoltage> you're welcome, the idea with edubuntu is to make it easier to do stuff and get the information, but we've still got a long way to go to make it completely brain dead. we'll get there one day :)
<Roasted_> dumb question tho
<mgariepy> you are welcome Roasted_
<Roasted_> ultimately in a windows environment, by adding the edubuntu server to the domain via likewise open, that thereby makes all of the thin client end users able to authenticate to the domain accordingly, right?
<highvoltage> Roasted_: I *think* you might have to add one or two lines to the ssh configuration file, but other than that it might just work out of the box
<mgariepy> Roasted_, once likewise-open is configured correctly, and the machine has joined the domain everybody should be able to authenticate yes
<Roasted_> good deal.
<highvoltage> Roasted_: I vaguely remember adding something to the config file so that users wouldn't have to type out their domain
<Roasted_> oh I don't care if they have to type out the domain
<Roasted_> they have to do it anyway for webmail at home
<Roasted_> it's not like it would be hard to make them aware to do it here
<Roasted_> with that said, I need to finish up a few tickets while this windows install gets done with its bajillion windows updates
<highvoltage> Roasted_: ah ok
<Roasted_> I greatly appreciate the help guys
<Roasted_> gave me a TON to think about and research
<mhall119> good luck Roasted_
<Roasted_> mucho thanks everyone
<Roasted_> whoa. does edubuntu come with italc?
<Roasted_> (I'm back btw)
<Roasted_> Secondly, I'm an idiot. Instead of worrying about testing in a small test environment with thin client boxes we don't have, I could CERTAINLY use some older desktops sitting around as my test-bed for this exact purpose
<Roasted_> and with that, I need to go. but anyway, thanks.
#edubuntu 2011-03-09
<Roasted> what's up fellas
<mhall119> welcome back Roasted
<Roasted> I'm here, I'm here
<Roasted> installing Edubuntu on my test rig here at home
<mhall119> they pay you for that?
<Roasted> sucker takes a bit longer than ubuntu, but its 2.4gb in size
<Roasted> ha, of course not
<Roasted> but I'm curious...
<mhall119> yeah, game files are big
<Roasted> I'm anxious to try it out at work
<Roasted> I have some old rigs I can use as thin clients instead
<Roasted> for testing
<Roasted> I have to wonder though... if the edubuntu box is acting as a dhcp server, I wonder how it would act with another dhcp server on the network
<Roasted> or if theres a way to make edubuntu use our regular dhcp server, yet somehow still get the pxe boot to the linux image
<mhall119> I don't think so, pxe used dhcp/bootp as far as I know
<mhall119> so unless your dhcp server is serving up linux images, you'll need to use the one with LTSP
<Roasted> if thin clients are going to use edubuntu, fine, I just dont want our "regular" clients (non thin clients) to pull IP addresses from the wrong server
<mhall119> it'd probably be easiest to segregate your networks
<Roasted> I'm not sure how that's possible, if our users on the thin clients are going to authenticate ot he domain, get internet access, get network storag,e etc.
<Roasted> they'll cross SOMEWHERE
<roasted_> anybody here?
<Ahmuck> yes
<roasted_> I fired up edubuntu but I can't seem to find wher LTSP is. I thought it was included.
<roasted_> I installed the two objects I found in software center when I searched for LTSP
<roasted_> One being "thin client manager"
<Ahmuck> live?
<roasted_> I opened it but I'm stuck on what to do now. I'm trying to set up a very small test environment.
<roasted_> No, I have a full blown ISO install from Edubuntu 10 10
<Ahmuck> so u've installed it
<roasted_> yup
<roasted_> Just trying to get my feet wet here so I can test it at work.
<Ahmuck> there is an installation option during setup iirc (it's been a year since i used edubuntu) where you need to select LTSP
<roasted_> I did.
<roasted_> I saw that.
<roasted_> But now that I'm up and running I'm not sure what to do.
<roasted_> Is it uh.. already done???
<Ahmuck> ah, so u need the ltsp primer
<Ahmuck> have you connected a thin or fat client to your server?
<roasted_> hm, okay. any idea on how I can get going with that?
<roasted_> No.
<roasted_> I have a laptop here with a regular windows install on it. I was curious if I could use it to PXE boot as my guinea pig for tonight?
<roasted_> I'm just trying to get my feet wet otnight. Tomorrow I'll have more hardware to work with at work.
<Ahmuck> yes, u can, do you have pxe boot on the laptop?
<roasted_> Sure do.
<roasted_> do you work for rev linux?
<Ahmuck> u can also simulate in a vbox
<Ahmuck> revolution linux?
<roasted_> yeah
<Ahmuck> i am the revolution.  no i don't work for rev linux
<Ahmuck> :)
<roasted_> lol
<roasted_> good deal
<roasted_> well how do I get started from here?
<roasted_> and what is a primer?
<Ahmuck> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=LTSPv5onUbuntu.pdf
<Ahmuck> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/
<Ahmuck> i'm a non reader of sorts.
<Ahmuck> i have a problem with lines in pages, however reading does get a person a lot further than random questions.  so, i assume you have a switch or router on your ltsp server?
<roasted_> I have a switch
<roasted_> 8 port 10 100
<Ahmuck> er, between the server and your laptop
<roasted_> yes
<Ahmuck> kk, so set to boot via pxe first and make an effort to get a connection
<roasted_> didnt find an IP
<roasted_> dhcp3 is up though
<roasted_> switch has nothing in it but the laptop + server
<roasted_> no router
<Ahmuck> iirc, you should be able to connect directly and eliminate the switch on a single machine
<Ahmuck> provided you don't need a crossover cable
<roasted_> wait
<roasted_> im stupid
<roasted_> im so stupid
<roasted_> so very stupid
<roasted_> hm
<roasted_> it looks like it gets one and it sticks at TFTP
<roasted_> then exits
<roasted_> I've seen this before with PXE boot imaging...
<Ahmuck> do you have another machine to test with?
<roasted_> uh
<Ahmuck> client side
<roasted_> I have a netbook
<roasted_> sec
<roasted_> same thing
<roasted_> I changed the network interface file tho
<roasted_> thats probably it, sec
<roasted_> bingo
<roasted_> its loading ubuntu now
<roasted_> Im in
<roasted_> now what? lol...
<roasted_> this can't be this easy that I just install edubuntu and connect a few pcs/clients to it
<Ahmuck> yes, it's that easy
<roasted_> no
<Ahmuck> create users
<roasted_> I'm calling BS
<roasted_> linux is hard, come on now.
<roasted_> Ahmuck, here's a question for ya
<Ahmuck> well, u'll have to manage resources, fat or thin clients, etc.
<roasted_> I'm a little concerned how this will work networking wise
<Ahmuck> ?
<Ahmuck> why?
<roasted_> because of it acting as a DHCP server and we already have a DHCP server at work.
<Ahmuck> change the ip range
<roasted_> on the edubuntu box itself?
<Ahmuck> so if your ip range at work is 192.168.1.1
<roasted_> we're on 10.52 at work
<Ahmuck> then make sure your ip range of the ltps dhcp server is on a different subnet
<roasted_> hm
<roasted_> so if its on a different subnet the dhcp services wont clash?
<roasted_> from edubuntu vs main dhcp
<Ahmuck> i assume you are the sysadmin at work or have sysadmin privelages
<roasted_> I am a technician.
<roasted_> I'm not the network admin.
<roasted_> I do desktop support with a hair of server work.
<Ahmuck> run it by your network admin
<Ahmuck> explain fully what you want to do
<Ahmuck> and buy him a cup of coffee
<Ahmuck> :)
<roasted_> or a beer
<roasted_> :P
<roasted_> but was I right tho
<roasted_> if we're on a different subnet, we'd be all right?
<roasted_> with multiple dhcp servers
<Ahmuck> i've run multiple dhcp servers, yes
<Ahmuck> ur going to need permission from your network admin anyway
<roasted_> now... at work we currently have an ncomputing setup. it has 4 gigabit network cards
<Ahmuck> so it's better if he understands what your doing
<roasted_> and that ncomputing lab runs on 192.168
<roasted_> even tho the main network is 10.52
<roasted_> oh yeah, he and I work close anyway
<Ahmuck> so "if" you break something he can take a handy pair of side cutters and cut the wire so to speak
<Ahmuck> exactly
<roasted_> here's my question tho
<roasted_> and thi smay be a stupid one
<roasted_> but I'm asking it
<roasted_> if the edubuntu lab runs on 192.168
<roasted_> yet our main network is 10.52
<roasted_> how does the 192 lab get external access?
<Ahmuck> gateway
<Ahmuck> i assume your speaking of internet
<roasted_> so I just have to edit the config file for the gateway and dns, etc.
<roasted_> yes
<roasted_> and file servers
<roasted_> would they be able to get to our file servers in the 10.52 range
<Ahmuck> ur ISP normally runs at the 10.10.x.x range, and serves 192.168.x.x address to you.
<Ahmuck> it wouldn't be any different here
<roasted_> yeah, I just want to make sure if we use the 192 range on edubuntu labs that they can hit our file servers
<roasted_> the file servers being 10.52
<Ahmuck> cept mine.  mine tends to run address in the 192.168.x.x range and sometimes i'll punch in an address on my network and start getting private routers of other people that should be behind a proper network.  it's weird how my ISP works
<roasted_> so if Im not on a domain, I need to create local users on the server itself
<Ahmuck> linux doesn't really use domains, but you do have that option
<Ahmuck> domains is a windows thing
<Ahmuck> iirc
<roasted_> I'd be adding ubuntu to the domain
<roasted_> via likewise open
<roasted_> its a project I was working on when I stumbled across LTSP
<roasted_> I was able to authenticate with domain users, etc, so I have a feeling if I add the main edubuntu server to the domain, Im hoping it'll authenticate downward to the thin client boxes accordingly
<roasted_> so that way students can come in, log in as THEMSELVES, and dot heir thing
<roasted_> do their*
<Ahmuck> u have gigabyte networking?
<roasted_> we do, but we have cat5 :(
<roasted_> we have gig switches and gear tho
<Ahmuck> are you talking authenticating to AD
<roasted_> yes
<Ahmuck> i'd read up
<roasted_> on what
<Ahmuck> i've never authenticated linux boxes on AD
<roasted_> oh
<roasted_> I'm not worried about that
<roasted_> likewise open is recommended by canonical
<Ahmuck> so i don't know how it works.  i know of people that have
<roasted_> and its worked great for me so far
 * Ahmuck searches on likewise open
<roasted_> I'm just ASSUMING that in this case since thin client users would be working from the edubuntu server, that if the edubuntu server is on the domain... it would authenticate them accordingly to Win AD
<Ahmuck> nice
<Ahmuck> looks like things have moved along quite well
<roasted_> I have to edit a concfig file
<roasted_> /etc/nsswitch
<roasted_> other than that, I install likewise open 6 and its good tog o
<roasted_> the version in software center is 5.4, which requires FAR more tweaking to work. 6 is more streamlined.
<Ahmuck> so are you planning on using network storage on another windows server?
<roasted_> yes
<Ahmuck> what do you hope to gain by using ltsp?
<Ahmuck> why use ltsp?
<roasted_> remember that ncomputing lab I spoke about?
<roasted_> it sucks
<roasted_> absolutely sucks
<roasted_> the district is trying to scale back spending costs hardcore, so my boss said "what if we add ubuntu to a few systems and see how it goes?"
<roasted_> I got ubuntu on a few systems and it works with AD. I have more testing to do, but Im more confident about using it on end systems than I originally was.
<roasted_> As a result, I got crossed up with LTSP and got a little curious.
<roasted_> It made me think of our ncomputing lab, whcih is used for general research and openoffice. Other than that it does nothing else.
<roasted_> We have to reboot it nearly twice a day for it to work.
<roasted_> It just sucks. So I thought, well what if we can incorporate LTSP there to replace ncomputing boxes
<roasted_> etc
<Ahmuck> well, when i had my ltsp server i didn't reboot unless i wanted to
<roasted_> so I have 2 ideas going on here. Adding Ubuntu (or even Edubuntu) onto ACTUAL laptops/desktops, and LTSP with thin clients
<roasted_> for labs
<Ahmuck> i ran a community lab as a test for a little bit
<Ahmuck> for about a year
<roasted_> is there a way to reboot LTSP without rebooting the system?
<Ahmuck> that'd be a question for a more experienced user
<Ahmuck> er, admin of ltsp
<roasted_> well
<roasted_> I'm the one in the department who messes with linux the most
<roasted_> I've used it for years
<roasted_> so even tho Im a desktop tech, this might get something dumped on my head as my boss wants met o start doing server stuff more
<roasted_> I've used linux file servers and whatnot for a long time. In fact, I'm more at home with linux in general than I am with windows
<roasted_> so that's why this project has my name all over it
<roasted_> I'm just curious if LTSP has a service associated with it, so I can just /etc/init.d/ltsp restart or something.
<Ahmuck> hrm, i don't recall if i still have ltsp running on this box or not
<roasted_> how manys ystems did you have on LTSP at that lab
<roasted_> that you ran
<Ahmuck> 8
<Ahmuck> if you mean clients
<roasted_> did you run LTSP on a regular desktop?
<roasted_> yes
<roasted_> the server that is
<roasted_> was the server a regular desktop?
<roasted_> cause I'm trying to gauge if LTSP would do a better job handling 30 clients than ncomputing does
<Ahmuck> it was a gaming system with raided drives
<Ahmuck> i'd planned to get server, but bank screwed financing up, and so i gave it up after two weeks, put in on a gaming system i had, souped up, and never got around to ordering the server
<roasted_> did it dot he job?
<Ahmuck> yes
<Ahmuck> i had some client problems, and PR problems as well.  when people heard "linux" they didn't show up often
<roasted_> I changed my IP range in /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf, but when I PXE boot its still pulling the old IP
<roasted_> where else should I change?
<Ahmuck> i don't recall.  i don't have a ltsp system running anymore to check
<Ahmuck> heh, so i took the server to a LUG meeting, and connected it up to the switch, without realizing i'd connected the ltsp side.  so it was serving IP addresses, and the router was trying to serve as well and it took two of us about 8 minutes to figure out i'd connected to the wrong nic
<roasted_> lol
<roasted_> nice
<roasted_> hm
<roasted_> I wonder why this pxe is pulling the old range
<Ahmuck> gtg, sorry
<Ahmuck> have work to complete this evening
<roasted_> thanks for the help bro
<roasted_> much appreciated
<roasted_> ping highvoltage
<roasted_> I thought italc was part of edubuntu?
<alkisg> Yes, it is
<roasted_> what? where is it?
<alkisg> It should be preinstalled. If not, apt-get install italc-master
<roasted_> whats crazy is I can see the benefit of LTSP in a home environment........
<roasted_> flippin great
<roasted_> I get the same error with italc as I got before on ubuntu when I tried it a few months ago
<roasted_> no italc service running blah blah blah
<alkisg> That problem is easily solved... what I don't like about italc is that it crashes very, very frequently
<roasted_> how can I solve it
<alkisg> Open a terminal and run: ica-launcher & italc-launcher
<roasted_> same error
<alkisg> Put the output to pastebin
<roasted_> btw, is it not advised to run LTSP with the same username on each box?
<alkisg> Or here if it's just 1-2 lines
<alkisg> Yes, it's not
<roasted_> it comes back with [1] 3389 and goes back to terminal.
<roasted_> then it tries to start and errors
<roasted_> hm that may be a problem
<roasted_> as we have a guest account for users to access with
<alkisg> You can have different guest accounts for each station
<roasted_> this will be on a domain
<roasted_> our ubuntu setup that is
<alkisg> Firefox, gnome etc etc don't like the same user to be logged on multiple times
<alkisg> It's not related to LTSP, it's a more general problem
<roasted_> I see
<roasted_> I think we have the same problem on our ncomputing lab
<roasted_> ah well
<roasted_> well italc is still failing but its 1230
<roasted_> screw it :P
<alkisg> The same is true for windows, it's not adviced to logon everywhere with the same user
<alkisg> You need different directories for the logged on users
<roasted_> yeah, we just have a generic domain account that we use for training days at work with the teachers
<roasted_> that was just a thought
<roasted_> anxious to get a real test environment set up tomorrow with LTSP
<roasted_> seems to be real solid
<alkisg> What are your client specs? cpu/ram?
<roasted_> well I dont have any thin client boxes. I'll probably be using some old towers at work. I know we have a few compaqs laying around with a 1.8ghz Pentium 4 proc with 512mb ram.
<roasted_> my test server will be a dual core box with 2gb of ram. This will be just a bench test in the tech room.
<alkisg> I'd use fat clients with that, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/FatClients
<roasted_> Our production server (if this takes off hardcore) is beefy. two quad cores, 32gb ram, and 4 gigabit network cards.
<roasted_> why would you use fat clients?
<alkisg> A full screen HD video needs half a gigabit bandwidth
<roasted_> these compaqs have 10/100 cards
<roasted_> bottlenecked @ 100 meg then
<alkisg> A classic divx video, 50 mbps bandwidth
<alkisg> 3D acceleration doesn't work well over the network
<roasted_> how do I throttle to use fat client or thin client
<alkisg> Etc, there are some drawbacks that made me decide, "if a client is good enough to run ubuntu from a usb stick, use it as a fat client, else, if it's too old, as a thin client'
<roasted_> can I make these adjustments on the fly?
<roasted_> can I set a lab to be fat clients and if its slow, switch them to thin clients?
<alkisg> Sure
<roasted_> wheres that done at?
<alkisg> They also switch automatically, i.e. if you boot a 256 ram client, it'll automatically boot as thin
<alkisg> LTSP_FATCLIENT=false in lts.conf
<alkisg> Read the docs. Just keep that link above in mind, so if thin clients don't behave very good for you, you can also test fat clients.
<roasted_> so anything above 256 defaults to fat?
<alkisg> FAT_RAM_THRESHOLD is the lts.conf directive for that
<alkisg> You can define it yourself
<roasted_> good deal
<roasted_> wheres lts.conf at
<roasted_> (I powered off my ltsp box)
<alkisg> http://manpages.ubuntu.com/lts.conf
<roasted_> I meant like
<roasted_> /etc/lts.conf
<roasted_> or what
<alkisg> /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<roasted_> thanks
<roasted_> appreciate it
<roasted_> with that said, its bedtime
<roasted_> have a good one!
<roasted_> thanks again for your time
<alkisg> You're welcome
<highvoltage> roasted_: pong
<mgariepy> good morning everyone
<mgariepy> hey highvoltage finally got inside ?
<doctormo> hey highvoltage and everyone
<highvoltage> mgariepy: yep, eventually
<highvoltage> doctormo: hey there, did you see the feedback I left you on the artwork channel yesterday?
<Roasted> whats up fellas
<Roasted> test drive of edubuntu is on the way.
<doctormo> highvoltage: The first batch, which I quickly modified the image for. did you see the next update?
<highvoltage> nope
<highvoltage> doctormo: oooh!
<highvoltage> doctormo: can I put that into the daily builds so long?
<highvoltage> doctormo: I like that you slanted that blue gradient a bit, it looks better considering the position of the sun, the stars closer to the bottom should probably be slightly dimmer though
<highvoltage> (and maybe the sun should be slightly lower again so that it looks more like a sunrise, not 100% sure)
<doctormo> highvoltage: easy to fix. Best hold off on the daily build until the graphic is more done.
<highvoltage> doctormo: ok
<Roasted> hey guys. I found some asus thin client boxes for 232 online. 1gb ram, 1.6ghz atom, no hdd from what I can tell. Are there any other companies that make comparable ones in the same price range of cheaper? Just trying to find some alternatives to compare here, even though I AM kind of an ASUS fanboy.
<mgariepy> Roasted, i got the info, those thin client a more like 275$ then 200$ with the ram.
<Roasted> mgariepy, the ASUS ones I was looking at?
<Roasted> http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?edc=2159457&cm_mmc=ShoppingFeeds-_-GoogleBase-_-Desktop%20Computers-_-2159457_ASUS%20Eee%20Box%20EB1007%20-%20Atom%20D410%201.66%20GHz_ASU-EB1007-B0200
<Roasted> in fact that has a hdd
<Roasted> I thought it didnt
<Ahmuck> Roasted: u can build ur own fairly cheap
<Roasted> Ahmuck, hm, never thought about that.
<Roasted> if the cost savings are there to warrant it, I'd definitely be game for that. Did you have anything in particular in mind for doing it? Or were you talking going on newegg and getting a slew of cheap towers, cheap mobos, etc?
<Ahmuck> http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100008345%204027&IsNodeId=1&name=%2475%20-%20%24100
<Ahmuck> 77.00
<highvoltage> Ahmuck: NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
<Ahmuck> highvoltage: ?
<Roasted> uh oh
<highvoltage> Ahmuck: those have Via Unichrome cards on board! No one should ever buy them. EVER!
<Ahmuck> ah
<highvoltage> Ahmuck: if pure evil would exist, that would be it!
<Roasted> the work of the devil
<Roasted> are those video cards?
<highvoltage> yep
<Roasted> highvoltage, are there any alternatives in the 200 or less range that compare to the ASUS EEE Box? 1.6ghz atom and 1gb RAM is what I'm aiming for with my research here.
<highvoltage> the problem is that no one ever finished writing drivers for those cards
<highvoltage> so you have very poor 2D performance and basically non-existant 3D capabilities
<highvoltage> (as in, you can't even run compiz or play a youtube video with them)
<Roasted> gag
<Roasted> any others you recommend looking at?
<Ahmuck> Roasted: tell me which Asus box and i might be able to get you a discount
<Roasted> http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.aspx?edc=2159457&cm_mmc=ShoppingFeeds-_-GoogleBase-_-Desktop%20Computers-_-2159457_ASUS%20Eee%20Box%20EB1007%20-%20Atom%20D410%201.66%20GHz_ASU-EB1007-B0200
<Ahmuck> ya, sorry, i misread the brand
<Roasted> I'm an ASUS fanboy so I dig that unit, I'm just trying to look for other alternatives
<Roasted> its funny that the NComputing boxes we got were 224, and the ASUS ones I posted above are 233.
<Roasted> yet the ASUS is clearly better from a spec point of view
 * Ahmuck sells aopen/acer
<Roasted> well, I'm open to all brands.
<Roasted> is there anything in aopen/acer thats int he price range?
<Roasted> 200 bones or so, 1gb ram, 1.6ghz atom?
<Ahmuck> looking
<Roasted> thanks bro
<Roasted> appreciate it
<Ahmuck> so far nothing
<Roasted> yeah I have a feeling that ASUS is quite a steal at that price
<Roasted> especially since its the same we paid for the L300';s from NComputing anyway
<Ahmuck> might try newegg and see what you can patch togather
<Roasted> yeah newegg kinda failed on me
<Roasted> wasnt able to find much
<Ahmuck> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16856119035
<Ahmuck> highvoltage:
<highvoltage> Ahmuck: that looks very nice, all it needs is cpu and ram!
<Roasted> highvoltage, what say you? should I bite it and go the asus route?
<highvoltage> Roasted: I don't know, I don't usually trust something until I've had a unit on my desk and I've seen it working with my own two eyes :)
<highvoltage> Roasted: usually it's best to just get one for testing and if it doesn't work satisfactory, return it
<Roasted> highvoltage, that's the plan. I'm just curious if there's a better-bang-for-the-buck, even from a testing standpoint, than this ASUS I'm eyeing up
<Roasted> since I know so little about thin client boxes I wasn't sure if there was something else I was missing, like another manufacturer that offers a better deal, etc.
<Roasted> all right... Edubuntu server is on the domain, however my thin client test subjects cannot log in to a domain account. MAJOR problem for us... any ideas on what it could be?
<Roasted> lol. wait. I need two back slashes it looks like
<Roasted> DOMAIN\\user_name
<doctormo> highvoltage: ping
<doctormo> highvoltage: There is an updated version for you to review, I'm happier now with how the leaf and the middle ground
<doctormo> they are more in line with the same art style
<highvoltage> doctormo: love the bug :)
<highvoltage> doctormo: yes it's much more rounded now
<doctormo> highvoltage: Yep, working on adding some subtle filling to the foreground to complete it.
<doctormo> Hopefully we'll have this done today...
<doctormo> then you can package?
<highvoltage> doctormo: yep, great
<doctormo> highvoltage: OK, after some wrangling with the artwork team (peer review) that draft 4 done.
<Ahmuck> may i preview the art?
<Ahmuck> somewhere?
<Ahmuck> heh, cpu and ram ... ug
<doctormo> Ahmuck: http://divajutta.com/doctormo/art/edu/perspective.png
<highvoltage> doctormo: yeah the ground does look better like that
<doctormo> Ahmuck: did you see the picture?
<highvoltage> doctormo: what's the license for this wallpaper?
<doctormo> highvoltage: It's CC-BY-SA, unless that's a problem
<highvoltage> doctormo: cc-by-sa would probably ideal since we already have it in the copyright file :)
<highvoltage> doctormo: great :)
<Ahmuck-Sr> yes, seen it just now
<doctormo> Ahmuck-Sr: What are your thoughts?
<Roasted> hey fellas. anyone around? I don't seem to have sound on my clients :(
<doctormo> Roasted: Do your clients have sound cards and are the devices supported by drivers?
<Roasted> doctormo, they should... I tried booting to the edubuntu livedvd but they only have cd drives :(
<Roasted> I'm nearly positive they support sound tho. I thought I had Ubuntu on one at my desk a few months back.
<Roasted> But I'll do an install tomorrow when I have the rest of my gear to see.
<Roasted> Is sound technically supported out of box with LTSP?
<doctormo> Roasted: You should keep an Ubuntu livecd handy
<alkisg> Roasted: you can netboot the edubuntu live dvd easily
<alkisg> Sound is supported out of the box, yes
<Roasted> doctormo, I normally do, but I dont have all of my stuff with me. Some of it is at my desk in another building 3-4 miles away.
<Roasted> I wonder whats up with sound on those systems then... hmm...
<doctormo> Roasted: where are you based in the world (curious)
<Roasted> PA USA
<doctormo> Roasted: ah the Paine state.
<doctormo> Have you checked if the sound is muted?
<Roasted> yep
<Roasted> its not :(
<doctormo> And there are speakers plugged in, turned on, power up?
<Roasted> yep
<Roasted> got headphones here
<Roasted> Ill do some more testing
<Roasted> I may have goofed something after all
<Roasted> besides, the only music I have on me is mp3. I normally carry a flash drive with a OGG track so ubuntu can play it from livecd
<Roasted> I do have a question though.
<alkisg> You can test sound with gstreamer-properties
<Roasted> if I want to add a desktop for use with 5 systems here in the library for a little pod of useable systems... the desktop would be acting as a dhcp server.
<Roasted> I'm a little concerned about handing out addresses to regular clients with having a 2nd dhcp server on the network
<Roasted> how can I remedy this?
<alkisg> Didn't get the idea, why 2 dhcp servers?
<doctormo> Roasted: you need to configure your primary dhcp server really.
<doctormo> 2 dhcp servers are a pain and unless you know what you're doing, best avoided.
<doctormo> Your desktop/edubuntu server doesn't have to be the dhcp machine, it just needs to point to it in the config.
<doctormo> I presume LTSP uses PXE booting?
<Roasted> yes
<alkisg> Yup
<Roasted> I see
<Roasted> so if I just edit the config file to point to our main DHCP server...
<Roasted> and disable DHCP3 on the LTSP box...
<Roasted> I'm golden?
<doctormo> Roasted: you need to edit the configuration on your DHCP server, add in the PXE settings.
<doctormo> and disable DHCP3 on the LTSP box.
<Roasted> so I need to go to my windows DHCP server for this...
<doctormo> Roasted: Oh it's a windows dhcp server? shut it down and replace it ;-)
<Roasted> I can't go that far man
<Roasted> It's here and it's not moving.
<Roasted> for now anyway :P
<alkisg> Either that: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPWindowsDHCP
<alkisg> Or that: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ProxyDHCP
<doctormo> In a lab here in Boston, we shut down the dhcp windows box and replaced it with a dedicated server.
<Roasted> well we have a dedicated server here
<Roasted> file, print, and dhcp
<Roasted> it just happens to be windows
<Roasted> regardless, can it work?
<Roasted> Windows Server + DHCP + LTSP with no DHCP
<doctormo> Harder to help you with unfortunately and I have a heavy bias against Microsoft so you'll have to pick over my hatred.
<Roasted> you and I share similar feelings my friend
<Roasted> but I'm a believer in baby steps
<doctormo> I can't see why it shouldn't work, if you know how to change windows dhcp, I don't though.
<Roasted> so to rip out an existing server just doesnt make sense to me. yet.
 * alkisg posted 2 solutions above, salutes for now
<Roasted> reading over them now
<Roasted> I was just hoping for a quick "no problem, it's possible" answer so I can stop panicing :P
<doctormo> Roasted: Well, not rip... so much. You could 'transfer the network configuration to the LTSP server' and temporally mothball the windows dhcp service.
<Roasted> but again
<Roasted> its currently working
<Roasted> large changes aren't on the table as of now
<alkisg> Roasted: "no problem, it's possible" and with 2 different methods
<doctormo> Well, that's great, but you have two dhcp servers running... there will be problems.
<Roasted> alkisg, thanks :P
<alkisg> np
<Roasted> doctormo, oh no no, I dont currently have 2 dhcp servers running.
<Roasted> doctormo, well I do but theyre secluded
<Roasted> Im only testing LTSP. its not in the labs yet. so Ive kept it secluded on my own little LAN
<doctormo> Roasted: Ah right-o; Don't panic! and if anyone asks, changing dhcp services to other machines is something you do ever day as part of breathing.
<doctormo> But I do this sort of thing because I'm a cheeky bastard who can make sure to copy the dhcp configuration over.
<Roasted> it just so happens theres a lab of 9 systems here in the library that are suffering. BADLY.
<doctormo> I'm sure you have a much more delicate situation.
<Roasted> theyre running XP yet they absolutely suck
<Roasted> I just did a speed test with my laptop acting as an LTSP server.
<Roasted> it is significantly faster with LTSP than XP locally
<Roasted> so I might rig up these 9 to work from a standard desktop system and see how they fair
<Roasted> then thats when I was like, ahh, network integration, crap... IP ranges/DHCP services/ehh
<doctormo> Roasted: If you ever set up a wafer thin client instead of a paper thin client system... or maybe a meaty sync system as I have done before.
<doctormo> Let me know.
<doctormo> 9 computers isn't hard to manage as thick systems with a bunch of good scripts.
<Roasted> yeah
<Roasted> like I said
<Roasted> baby steps :P
<Roasted> these 2 links aren't making much sense to me...
<Roasted> I have to uninstall LTSP????????
<Roasted> yeah I'm lost on this one
<Roasted> and the 2nd link doesnt have too much information
<alkisg> Roasted: quick explanation
<alkisg> 1st link: you change 2 settings in your windows dhcp serfver
<alkisg> Either that, or the 2nd link:
<alkisg> you uninstall the dhcp server from your *ubuntu box
<alkisg> Not ltsp. You uninstall dhcp.
<alkisg> (dhcp is part of ltsp-server-standalone, but you don't uninstall the whole ltsp package, you still keep the ltsp-server package)
<Roasted> ahh
<Roasted> gotcha
<Roasted> is that it?
<alkisg> Yup, just follow the (baby :)) steps on the wiki page
<alkisg> For the 2nd link you need dnsmasq, it acts as a proxy (==helper) dhcp server
<alkisg> Sending the boot filename but not IP leases
<Roasted> so wait
<Roasted> if I just uninstall DHCP + server-standalone
<Roasted> that's it
<Roasted> that'll do the trick then
<Roasted> ??
<alkisg> No, you also need the dnsmasq steps that are mentioned on that page
<alkisg> Follow the whole page, not just the first paragraph
<Roasted> well when you said yup I was like wait
<Roasted> no
<Roasted> lol
<Roasted> Ill save these links and check them out later tonight
<Roasted> I gotta get outa here though
<Roasted> mucho appreciated alkisg and doctormo
<Roasted> have a good one!
<doctormo> Roasted: Are you in contact with the PA loco team?
<roasted_> doctormo, whats up
<roasted_> not sure what PA loco team is
<doctormo> roasted_: http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/pennsylvania
<roasted_> what is it, just an in person pow-wow to talk about LTSP?
<doctormo> roasted_: No, a local group involved in and working on Ubuntu
<doctormo> Including Edubuntu
<roasted_> I see
<roasted_> I havent heard of it
<doctormo> It's like the local branch, where the'll be events and people to ask questions.
<roasted_> is there a mailing list with it or something?
<doctormo> They'll normally be less specific than asking LTSP questions here, but you'll still have fun IMO
<doctormo> roasted_: The website link above shows you the website, irc channel and everything else.
<roasted_> good deal
<roasted_> thanks
#edubuntu 2011-03-10
<roasted_> Hey fellas. Is there a way to customize the login screen of Edubuntu clients?
<roasted_> on LTSP
<doctormo> roasted_: Sure, what would you like to do?
<highvoltage> good morning
<mhall119> good morning
<mgariepy> good morning everyone
<Ahmuck-Sr> doctormo: wouldn't roasted just be able to subnet the dhcp3 server on the ltsp box and be golden?
<Ahmuck-Sr> http://www.opennms.org/ - i'm curious, could this be used for thin/fat client monitoring?
<doctormo> Ahmuck-Sr: Yes, but dhcp is a funny old thing.
 * Ahmuck-Sr really should get his CIS degree
<Roasted> whats up fellas
<Ahmuck-Sr> hi roasted
<mgariepy> Hello Roasted
<Roasted> hey guys
<Roasted> trying to do that dhcp swap now
<highvoltage> so is anyone feeling like fixing some edubuntu bugs today?
 * highvoltage got one patch for nanny so far at least
<Roasted> so... little lost here.
<Roasted> if I'm adding LTSP and using a Windows DHCP environment, do I need the MAC of EACH machine that will be using LTSP, or just the MAC of the LTSP server?
<alkisg> Ah today is the bug day?
<alkisg> highvoltage: any specific requests?
<alkisg> Or we can just pick one we prefer?
<alkisg> Roasted: do you mind if you send the boot filename to all of your clients, ltsp or not?
<alkisg> If not, then you don't need any mac
<Roasted> is this just to limit which systems can pxe boot to LTSP?
<alkisg> Yup
<Roasted> like if I DONT do this, and I PXE boot all 500 systems in the building then they'll all probe the LTSP box?
<alkisg> So if you don't have a specific reason to limit them, just leave it for everyone
<alkisg> Yup
<Roasted> well, I don't want to limit it now, because if we set it up it may be nice to walk into any lab and fire one up for demonstration purposes to my boss.
<highvoltage> alkisg: good question
<alkisg> Right, so don't specify any macs now
<Roasted> I was surprised. In my bench test yesterday I ran 10 systems off of my laptop.
<Roasted> core 2 duo, 4gb ram
<highvoltage> alkisg: best would be if you could scratch your own itches
<Roasted> granted I maxed out my ram at nearly 3.8gb, but each system had gimp, open office, and firefox running with web browsing.
<Roasted> the proc was relatively calm too, with only occasional spikes.
<highvoltage> alkisg: otherwise you could browse our buglist and find something that looks interesting...
<highvoltage> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/~edubuntu-bugs/+packagebugs
<alkisg> Ty, I'll have a look
<Roasted> If I do this with the LTSP Box on the main network, we'll be on a 10.52 IP scheme instead of 192.168. As a result, I would need to change my static IP of the LTSP box. No problem, I can do that. My concern is I tried this yesterday and I wasn't able to PXE boot when I changed my static IP. Do I have to change a PXE entry anywhere to correspond with my new static IP?
<highvoltage> cool :)
<highvoltage> Roasted: you'll have to edit dhcpd.conf in /etc/ltsp (if you installed ltsp-server-standalone) or /etc/dhcp (if you didn't)
<alkisg> Roasted: your dhcp configuration in your windows server
<Roasted> highvoltage, I won't be runnign DHCP on the LTSP box, I'll be removing it here shortly. As a result, I would be editing /etc/dhcp, right?
<alkisg> And probably restart the windows dhcp service
<highvoltage> you might also have to edit a few other files based on your configuration (wherever you had IPs listed) and at least /etc/hosts
<Roasted> highvoltage, what would I need to edit in hosts? just the IP?
<highvoltage> Roasted: ah, then you don't need to be editing the dhcp file on the server
<Roasted> what
<Roasted> really
<Roasted> this ubuntu doc says I need to
<Roasted> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPWindowsDHCP
<Roasted> by adding those 3 entries to the DHCP service
<highvoltage> that doc says to remove the dhcp server
<Roasted> on LTSP
<Roasted> then a few lines lower it says login to your windows server and load the DHCP config screen
<Roasted> then add those 3 entries
<highvoltage> yes, that's on the windows dhcp server
<Roasted> right
<Roasted> oh wait
<Roasted> wait
<Roasted> wait
<Roasted> <highvoltage> Roasted: ah, then you don't need to be editing the dhcp file on the server - you menat the LTSP server....
<highvoltage> if you use a windows dhcp server then you don't have to configure the dhcp server on your ubuntu machine
<Roasted> I thought you meant the windows server...
<Roasted> my apologies
<alkisg> Hmm that page isn't very good. Uninstalling dhcp3-server will make ltsp-server get uninstalled when apt-get --auto-remove is next used.
<Roasted> someone here linked me to it yesterday
<Roasted> *shrug*
<alkisg> That was me
<Roasted> :P
<Roasted> I thought so
<alkisg> But the page still isn't good :)
<Roasted> lol
<Roasted> that's reassuring
<Roasted> shall I follow thorugh with it?
<alkisg> See the other page I linked you to, with the proxy dhcp, and *only* follow the steps to uninstall dhcp from there
<Roasted> that one looks like its more of a headache
<alkisg> See the *only* part above
<alkisg> It's just 3 lines
<Roasted> the "only" part?
<Roasted> install dnsmasq, config dnsmasq, create a dnsmasq config file, adjust pxelinux.cfg/default....
<alkisg> *only* follow the steps to uninstall dhcp from there
<Roasted> I think I like the other link more :P
<Roasted> oh
<alkisg> Not the dnsmasq, not pxelinux, not not not
<Roasted> so I use both guides?
<Roasted> just different parts of eahc?
<alkisg> Erm ok
<alkisg> I thought I'd save me some time
<alkisg> This takes longer
<alkisg> Here let me get you the 3 lines
<alkisg> sudo apt-get install ltsp-server  # This may update ltsp-server instead
<alkisg> sudo apt-get install ltsp-server  # So do it twice to be certain
<alkisg> sudo apt-get --yes --auto-remove purge ltsp-server-standalone
<alkisg> Those 3 lines remove the dhcp3-server part of the ltsp installation
<Roasted> okay
<Roasted> but I'd still be adding those 3 entries to the windows DHCP server, right
<alkisg> Right
<Roasted> gotcha
<Roasted> so these 3 lines, the 3 entries to windows dhcp, and aside from changing my LTSP server IP to something within the proper scope, we're done then
<alkisg> When you change your IP you also need to change your /etc/hosts, unless you change it from network manager
<Roasted> naw I'm using interface file
<Roasted> I didnt change it in /etc/hosts yesterday. I wonder if thats why I wasnt able to PXE boot.
<alkisg> Hmm no scratch that
<alkisg> The default installation doesn't contain the server IP in /etc/hosts
<Roasted> yeah I just did nano on it and didnt see...
<Roasted> wonder why I was failing to pxe boot then
<alkisg> With which dhcp serveR?
<alkisg> The ubuntu one?
<Roasted> yes
<Roasted> I changed my IP on it
<Roasted> and I wasnt able to PXE boot from there
<alkisg> You needed to change /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf then
<Roasted> oh
<alkisg> And restart dhcp
<Roasted> what am I changing, just the subnet range?
<Roasted> subnet 192.168.0.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 {
<Roasted>     range 192.168.0.20 192.168.0.250;
<Roasted> I'd just change the range to 10.52.0.1 (start of windows dhcp scope) to 10.52.1.254 (end of windows dhcp scope) right?
<alkisg> You won't be needing this, you'll be using the windows server
<Roasted> I understand. I'm just trying to understand what I did wrong yesterday.
<alkisg> Then yes, you would just change the subnet
<Roasted> good deal
<Roasted> I'm going to test it now :P
<Roasted> just for sake of learning
<alkisg> But, beware, your windows clients will get an IP from that
<alkisg> So they won't have internet access etc etc
<Roasted> oh no, I'm on a secluded LAN with this setup
<alkisg> OK
<Roasted> here we go...
<Roasted> hahaha. bingo.
<Roasted> you're the man alkisg
<Roasted> if you ever come to PA, drinks are on me
<Roasted> alright, time to get this windows thing rolling and see how we do
<alkisg> Good luck :)
<Roasted> dumb question tho. even if I have 64 bit edubuntu installed, Im booting 32b images right
<alkisg> It depends on if you put `--arch i386` as a parameter to ltsp-build-client
<Roasted> what's LTSP's default behavior?
<alkisg> ls -l /opt/ltsp/images
<alkisg> If you see i386, you got i386
<alkisg> If you see amd64... you know
<Roasted> gotcha. we're on 386. good deal.
<alkisg> The default behavior is chroot arch == server arch
<Roasted> hows that make sense...
<Roasted> Im on 64 bit...
<Roasted> on the server
<alkisg> Are you sure?
<Roasted> x86_64 is listed under uname -a
<Roasted> is that 64?
<alkisg> Yes
<Roasted> I mean it addresses 3.9gb of ram
<Roasted> so
<Roasted> I wonder how I got 386 for the clients yet 64 on the server
<alkisg> 32bit also addresses 4gb ram
<alkisg> With -pae extensions, on by default
<Roasted> oh
<Roasted> but if uname -a says Im on 64 bit...
<alkisg> So maybe you did put --arch i386 in your ltsp-build-client after all
<Roasted> I didn't even know that existed until you told me just now.
<Roasted> So I'm doubtful that I did.
<alkisg> How did you install LTSP?
<Roasted> I just wanted to make sure we were using 32b images since our hardware is older hardware.
<Roasted> Edubuntu 10.10 64 bit DVD
<Roasted> hit the checkbox for LTSP
<Roasted> ran through the installer
<Roasted> I have a 2nd box here with Edubuntu that I installed from the same DVD. I wonder what that says
<alkisg> Hmm maybe it has a 32bit chroot, I haven't done that as we're using localized chroots here
<alkisg> highvoltage would know :)
<Roasted> to be honest it makes sense to me to use 64b server, 32b clients
<Roasted> since people would be utilizing older hardware for thin clients in some cases
 * highvoltage emerges
<Roasted> he awakens!
<alkisg> highvoltage: on edubuntu 64 bit, the chroot installed is 32 bit?
<highvoltage> ah, yes. on edubuntu we always do 32bit ltsp chroots from the installer (64bit won't work on many thin clients, such as anything Atom based, and there's very rarely benefit with 64bit on clients)
<highvoltage> Roasted: ^^^
<Roasted> nice
<Roasted> thanks :)
<highvoltage> if you use ltsp-build-client after installation, then it will use your current architecture as default, but for the edubuntu installer it made sense to always go for 32bit
<Roasted> off topic question
<Roasted> is there a way to edit the login screen
<highvoltage> yes
<highvoltage> the LDM themes are in /usr/share/ldm/themes in the thin client chroot
<highvoltage> you can add a new one there and specify it in lts.conf
<Roasted> okay. I thought so. I replaced bg.png and put in a different image, also named bg.png, but it didnt take, so it confused me a little bit
<alkisg> Did you run ltsp-update-image?
<Roasted> probably not
<Roasted> as root?
<alkisg> With sudo, yes
<Roasted> Error: chroot /opt/ltsp/amd64 doesn't exist.
<Roasted> hmm
<highvoltage> Roasted: yeah, the way you did it will be a bit risky because your changes will be over-written again if you install updates
<Roasted> well, I did it on my laptop, which is just a test-drive machine
<Roasted> I got my other box fired up here for real testing
<highvoltage> Roasted: you might want to add a "-a i386" to let it know that it should update the i386 chroto and not a 64bit one
<alkisg> Roasted: since you have a different chroot arch than the server arch, you always need to add --arch i386
<Roasted> I see
<Roasted> looks like its owrking
<Roasted> creating 4.0 file system
<Roasted> highvoltage, is there an official guide somewhere to changing the theme properly?
<highvoltage> Roasted: nope
<highvoltage> Roasted: but I'll answer any questions about it if you write us one :)
<Roasted> well if you tell me how to do it, I'll make a guide for it. :P
<alkisg> Don't forget to put your findings to the windows dhcp page as well :P :D
<highvoltage> Roasted: I just have to look into a few other things too now but we can go through it a bit later
<Roasted> sounds good
<Roasted> seems as if I have tanked something badly
<Roasted> my login screen is all gray, no images whatsoever, and wont log any users in
<Roasted> thankfully its my laptop install which... doenst matter
<Roasted> still curious on what happened tho. it worked until I ran that command. lol...
<highvoltage> that command builds the new squashfs image based on the changes you have made
<Roasted> the only change I made was the background image
<Roasted> maybe it doesnt like it
<Roasted> but theres also a button here, all white with a red X in the center, as if that didnt fly either
<Roasted> ah well, I wont be bothered by that for now.
<Roasted> is there by chance a way to revert it back to normal without reinstalling edubuntu?
<alkisg> Put the old background image?
<alkisg> And re-run ltsp-update-image/
<Roasted> didnt work
<alkisg> Then you must have changed something else too
<alkisg> If you don't remember what, you can rebuild the chroot
<alkisg> I.e. sudo rm -rf /opt/ltsp && sudo ltsp-build-client --arch i386
<alkisg> (will take some time)
<Roasted> is there a forum for LTSP so I can ask questions there instead of bugging you guys?
<mgariepy> #ltsp
<mgariepy> but most ppl here are in there too :)
<Roasted> thanks :)
<highvoltage> well, what would be faster is:
<highvoltage> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 apt-get --reinstall install ldm-themes
<highvoltage> and then ltsp-update-image
<Roasted> already done :P
<Roasted> Im working on another issue at the moment
<Roasted> I just asked it in LTSP if you're curious at taking a gander. it has me stumped.
<doctormo> highvoltage: Have you had any thoughts about draft4? If you have no more concerns, then we can announce and release?
<highvoltage> doctormo: nothing that jumps out at me yet, it's already in today's daily build :)
<doctormo> Fantastic, although I haven't produced all the sizes and aspects that might be required.
<doctormo> highvoltage: I had to do some editing to get it to fit widescreen, please review
<highvoltage> doctormo: except for some changes in the hills I couldn't see any other changes, but it looks good
<doctormo> highvoltage: It's 1MB, just so a quick refresh
<doctormo> You should see the version with the pink guides
<doctormo> That show what each screen resolution would see
<highvoltage> ok, I see the pink lines
<highvoltage> I think it looks good
<doctormo> highvoltage: How do you ship it? just ship the widescreen version and set it to crop?
<Roasted> why would my users time out when trying to log in? all I did was add windows dhcp to the mix.
<doctormo> Roasted: If the windows dhcp isn't giving correct info and the machines are not online... that would be an issue.
<doctormo> I forget if ltsp does seconard network connections
<Roasted> doctormo, I would *assume* that by them coming to the login screen that it would have the proper info.
<Roasted> let me do a direct cat5 line from my server to a laptop and see if it does the same thing
<Roasted> one second
<Roasted> crap. I cant. I dont have dhcp on it.
<highvoltage> doctormo: currently, it's just stretched over whatever screen you have
<highvoltage> Roasted: heh, if you took a second to think about that you'd realise that before plugging it in. take it easy :)
<highvoltage> Roasted: I haven't configured a windows DHCP server yet, but what is the information you put in there? (I thought it was in scrollback but I couldn't find it)
<Roasted> highvoltage, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPWindowsDHCP
<Roasted> theres 3 lines of info that was put in
<Roasted> I did not put it in, the network admin here did. He showed me how it works though, as we already have several other "rules" in place since we have VOIP here, and our VOIP phones require similar entries to be made.
<Roasted> highvoltage, it took him a matter of 20 seconds to do it.
<highvoltage> Roasted: what did he use for the IP address?
<Roasted> of the LTSP box?
<Roasted> highvoltage, ^
<Roasted> highvoltage, I'm still doing small scale testing. I just grabbed a DHCP IP and had him use that for the entry.
<highvoltage> Roasted: no, on the Windows DHCP server
<Roasted> we're working now
<highvoltage> ok
<Roasted> so technically my LTSP box is on DHCP.
<Roasted> but the box Im running it on isnt one Ill actually use in the classrooms.
<Roasted> when I do Ill certainly static it
<Roasted> highvoltage, my problem was when I changed the IP I had no idea I had to run the sshkeys command to update them or whatever.
<Roasted> that fixed my login hanging problem though.
<Roasted> highvoltage, aside from changing the IP and needing to run that command, is there any other instances where running the sshkeys command and image update command would be useful?
<doctormo> highvoltage: How much space do you have for the desktop wallpaper and is it packaged?
<stgraber> doctormo: 1.8GB give or take
<stgraber> that's how much we have left on the dvd
<doctormo> I could make an entire gallery of moving desktop backgrounds with that ;-)
<highvoltage> doctormo: I thought that your moving backgrounds are svg and take up very little space :)
<highvoltage> doctormo: it's in the edubuntu-artwork package
<doctormo> highvoltage: Ah those aren't moving, they're just evolving.
<doctormo> So the image @ 2560x1600 is ~1MB, that takes care of the biggest resolutions.
<doctormo> And it's at widescreen and I've checked that full screen should take.
<doctormo> We'll need to set it to not stretch
<doctormo> highvoltage: Testing says it should be set to "Zoom" in the xml configuration.
<highvoltage> doctormo: ok, I'll update it
#edubuntu 2011-03-11
<UBuxuBU> and 8.9 quake has rocked the coast of japan!
<UBuxuBU> if anyone here lives in hawaii please seek high ground the psunami will hit hawaii in less than 90 minutes
<mgariepy> good morning everyone
<Roasted_> I followed this link to edit my login screen - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EdubuntuFAQ - and ran the 3 sudo commands (the cp -r, rm, and ln -s listed there). It says above it, you can modify the artwork. Which artwork am I modifying? Like which directory? Can I just drag/drop images in it and will they auto apply as the background to the login screen?
<Roasted_> What's the command to run to "update" LTSP to use my new theme?
<Roasted_> of course alkisg would join the second after I asked a question :P
<alkisg> :D
<Roasted_> if I may...
<Roasted_> What's the command to run to "update" LTSP to use my new theme?
<alkisg> ltsp-update-image?
<Roasted_> ah that's it?
<Roasted_> I thought it was something else
<Roasted_> I'm somehow hanging at TFTP at the PXE boot menu and it times out now
<Roasted_> oh boy
<Roasted_> it worked prior to me trying to change my theme
<alkisg> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/Troubleshooting/TFTP
<Roasted_> alkisg, I have a ? for tftpd-hpa
<Roasted_> not really sure why this file decided to tank for no reason...
<Roasted_> little scary
<Roasted_> buuut then again my IP changed. that's probably why
<Roasted_> alkisg, what was the massive command that redoes EVERYTHING over again? I'm at the gray screen AGAIN with trying to customize the login screen and I'd like to run that command again. IT was really lengthy but worked if I recall.
<alkisg> Roasted_: there are logs for the channels, both for #edubuntu and for #ltsp
<alkisg> It was ltsp-build-client
<Roasted_> alkisg, I'm not sure where logs are saved, and since I am in IRC on 3 different operating systems I have no clue where to sift through them.
<Roasted_> my apologies
<alkisg> On the web
<Roasted_> oh
<alkisg> For ltsp: http://www.nubae.com/logs/
<Roasted_> I had no idea of that
<alkisg> For edubuntu: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/
<Roasted_> Is there by chance a half decent bit of documentation about changing hte login screen?
<Roasted_> I followed the edubuntu section 4 times and each time it failed.
<alkisg> I don't know, I never looked for that docs. What do you want to change, just the png background?
<alkisg> Or something more?
<Roasted_> just the png background.
<alkisg> Then an easy way is to replace the current one
<alkisg> And just do it again if ltsp is ever updated (don't think so)
<Roasted_> I was told I have to run update-image after I change them out.
<alkisg> Right
<Roasted_> and each time I do it comes back with an all gray background
<Roasted_> am I supposed to run those 3 commands in the edubuntu FAQ
<alkisg> Can you post the png you use somewhere?
<alkisg> E.g. to imagebin?
<Roasted_> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EdubuntuFAQ
<Roasted_> halfway down I ran those 3 commands
<Roasted_> are htey unnecessary?
<Roasted_> alkisg, I can, let me dig it out of my email
<alkisg> The "correct" (tm) way is to make your own theme
<alkisg> The easy way is to change the existing one
<alkisg> Since the correct way failed for you, I suggest the easy one
<alkisg> So no, they're not necessary
<Roasted_> okay, let me try without those commands and see what happens
<Roasted_> man
<Roasted_> another gray screen
<Roasted_> is it even POSSIBLE to change this
<mauro__> hi there
<mauro__> Problem change background with csh script:csh script dosen't work on crontab (i mean the programs run but in the end I can't se the gnome bacground change)
#edubuntu 2011-03-12
<highvoltage> good afternoon
 * Ahmuck waves
#edubuntu 2011-03-13
<mustardseed> hello, i have recently installed ubuntu 10.10 on a rather old machine; attached a brand new USB 802.11 n dongle which was a pain to install and have recognized by the system; issue is, the machine is really slow; am new to ubuntu, only tried fedora before, was not impressed with its management of usb and wifi either; many thanks for your help
<alkisg> For generic ubuntu questions, try #ubuntu, this channel is specific to the edubuntu flavor
#edubuntu 2012-03-05
<alkisg> stgraber: UIFe for epoptes: https://bugs.launchpad.net/epoptes/+bug/946861
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 946861 in Epoptes "[UIFe] show real name menu entry" [Undecided,New]
<alkisg> Thank you!
<highvoltage> good morning
<stgraber> alkisg: go ahead with the upload/sync for epoptes
<alkisg> stgraber: ty, doing so...
<MrChrisDruif> Does anyone have a link to the current meeting minutes?
#edubuntu 2012-03-06
<cog> If my wifi works with Ubuntu will it work with Edubuntu?
<alkisg> Yes
<cog> y thank u ^_^
#edubuntu 2012-03-07
<alkisg> stgraber: all OK with the upstart job except for the shutdown part, it just completely hangs now for some reason
<stgraber> hmm, that's weird. I'll have a look.
<alkisg> stgraber: what's "stop lstp-client-core" supposed to do? it doesn't do anything
<alkisg> Also, how did you manage to have the ltsp-daily recipe build without running autogen.sh? It fails for me... :-/
<alkisg> https://code.launchpad.net/~alkisg/+recipe/alkisg
<alkisg> And finally I think it'd be very nice if you continued maintaining the ltsp packaging in https://code.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk.daily-packaging - so that we can easily use it to invoke daily builds
<stgraber> yeah, it's been on my todo for a while :)
<stgraber> alkisg: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk.daily-packaging/view/head:/debian/rules calls autogen
<highvoltage> stgraber: http://www.engadget.com/2012/03/07/yitoa-m9704-9-7-inch-ics-tablet-hands-on/
#edubuntu 2012-03-08
<alkisg> highvoltage: can we also have an ldm-lubuntu-theme? Or is it too late for that?
<highvoltage> alkisg: sounds possible
<alkisg> highvoltage: installing ltsp-client over existing installations is now possible, so I believe more people will start using lubuntu chroots (they're lightweight)
<alkisg> So since this is an lts release, it'd be nice for it to have its own theme
<highvoltage> alkisg: ok. I can't make a promise but I'll try
<alkisg> Nice, thank you
#edubuntu 2012-03-09
<alkisg> stgraber: you didn't include nbd-disconnect in the packaging
<cog_> Welcome to #edubuntu.
<cog_> Hi.  May I get assistance in installing Mathematica on a 11.10 Edubuntu computer freshly installed?
<highvoltage> cog_: can't gaurantee that we'll have all the answers, but ask away!
<cog_> How do I get my DVD mounted?  I have tried mount /dev/cdrom ;-;
<highvoltage> it should automount when you insert it
<highvoltage> check under the /media directory
<highvoltage> it usually uses the media name so it might be under /media/cdrom or something like /media/methematica
<cog_> No meth, no CD, I get nothing in /media ;-;
<highvoltage> you could try this perhaps:
<highvoltage> mkdir /mnt/cdrom
<highvoltage> mount /dev/sr0 /mnt/cdrom
<highvoltage> (it will warn that the media is read-only, but that's ok)
<cog_> "no media found" or something like that ;-;
<highvoltage> you could type "cat /proc/partitions"
<highvoltage> perhaps your cd device is called something else
<highvoltage> (or not dected)
<highvoltage> *detected
<cog_> you must specify the fily system type ;-;
<cog_> *e
<highvoltage> I think it's usually iso9660
<cog_> My computer keeps spinning the DVD somehow...
<highvoltage> but if it doesn't detect that automatically then there might be something wrong with the disc or it's using a filesystem that your system doesn't understand
<cog_> Oh ._.
<alkisg> stgraber: do you want to reuse the squashfs image of the edubuntu live CD to netboot thin/fat clients? Should I try to propose a quick solution for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/950945 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 950945 in ltsp (Ubuntu) "package ltsp-client-core (not installed) failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/share/ltsp/ltsp-common-functions', which is also in package ltsp-server 5.3.2-0ubuntu3" [Low,Confirmed]
<stgraber> alkisg: as we dropped the check from the preinst, we might as well fix this one, yes
<alkisg> stgraber: one quick way would be to have the same file installed twice, with a different name
<alkisg> common-client-functions, common-server-functions
<alkisg> (done from the packaging)
<alkisg> And have all the client files source the first one, and the server files source the second one
<stgraber> alkisg: is the file absolutely identical at the moment? (same md5)
<alkisg> stgraber: it's a single file
<alkisg> The packaging copies the same file to the ltsp-server and ltsp-client-core package, with the same name
<stgraber> ok, so I guess the dpkg magic allowing for identical files to be shipped by two packages is limited to multiarch :(
<alkisg> Ah, didn't know about that
<alkisg> Another way would be to have an ltsp-common package, but I don't think it makes sense to have that for 1 file
<alkisg> We may just adjust the packaging to install it with a different name
<stgraber> might be worth checking with vagrant but having two common files sounds like the easiest though requires upstream changes or ugly postinst hack (having ltsp-common-functions.<package-name> with a symlink called ltsp-common-functions)
<alkisg> OK, let's wait a few hours, vagrantc will probably show up, so that we reach a common decision
<alkisg> I haven't checked the edubuntu dvd since 11.10, but it would be nice to be able to boot fat clients _and_ lower the DVD contents at the same time ;)
<alkisg> And it would be fast too, as most of the squashfs image that's needed to netboot the clients would be cached by booting the live dvd itself
<alkisg> stgraber:
<alkisg> root@alkis:/# dpkg-query -W ltsp-client-core
<alkisg> ltsp-client-core	5.3.4+bzr2134-0ubuntu1~ppa2
<alkisg> root@alkis:/# dpkg -S /usr/share/ltsp/nbd-disconnect
<alkisg> dpkg-query: no path found matching pattern /usr/share/ltsp/nbd-disconnect.
<stgraber> doh, wrong path, I think it's in usr/bin ...
<alkisg> Oh
<stgraber> can you confirm it's in usr/bin? if it's, then I'll just change the path and upload to Ubuntu
<alkisg> Indeed
<alkisg> /usr/sbin/nbd-disconnect
<stgraber> right, fixed in the packaging
<stgraber> anything else before I upload 5.3.5? I guess we can fix the ltsp-client-core one for 5.3.6 as it'll likely need some thinking?
<alkisg> Could you include the last ltsp-update-kernels commit too? Is it easy for you?
<alkisg> I'm using that frequently, I'd like to test it as well
<alkisg> (I have chroots that are not available when I run ltsp-update-kernels, and I won't want the  kernels deleted)
<alkisg> *don't
<cog_> I want Superkey functionality like when I used Ubuntu 12.04 :)
<stgraber> alkisg: commit 2135?
<alkisg> yes
<cog_> How do you get that?
<alkisg> I guess we can fix the ltsp-client-core one for 5.3.6 as it'll likely need some thinking? ==> you mean ltsp-common-functions? Yeah sure, let's leave something for 5.3.6 :)
<stgraber> yeah
<cog_> Thank you alkisg :)
<cog_> Anyways, I want to mount a DVD in wine, any leads?
#edubuntu 2013-03-05
<highvoltage>  /join #kubuntu-devel
<highvoltage> (oops)
<njin> hallo, there's a dev chan for edubuntu ?
<stgraber> nope, we use this one
<njin> ok, thanks stgraber, I suggest to Giovanni Tornatore this channel, so he can ask here for betters explanations of the bug he encounter testing Edubuntu.
<weljor> stgraber
<weljor> hello!
<stgraber> weljor: hey
<weljor> I have installed Edubuntu amd64 on virtualbox. The backports is enabled! is correct
<stgraber> backports have been enabled by default on all Ubuntu flavours for the past 2-3 releases. The source is enabled but the system won't install backported packages unless you specifically ask for it (by specifying the version you want)
<weljor> stgraber: thanks!
<weljor> stgraber: another question>  On the session gnome-fallback with automatic log in, is appeared the bar of launched of unity. With log out this bar has disappeared! this is a bug?
<weljor> stgraber: another question>  On the session gnome-fallback with automatic log in, is appeared the bar of launched of unity. With log out this bar has disappeared! this is a bug?
<highvoltage> weljor: you get a unity panel on the gnome session?
<highvoltage> (it does sound like a bug)
<weljor> highvoltage: appeared the bar of the unity with the down bar!
<weljor> highvoltage: with log out and log in this bug is not found!
<weljor> highvoltage: if it persists, I report this bug  of gnome-session-fallback!
<highvoltage> weljor: ok, I'll check it out after a sync too
<highvoltage> weljor: and btw welcome to edubuntu :)
<weljor> highvoltage: thanks!
<weljor> highvoltage: good evening :)
#edubuntu 2013-03-06
<zajactom> hi everone :-)
#edubuntu 2013-03-07
<highvoltage> mhall119: sheesh, the new g+ banners are tough to work with
<mhall119> highvoltage: I know
<mhall119> highvoltage: I was going to ask if you had a vector image for the crown
<mhall119> that would make it easier
<highvoltage> mhall119: it's in that wallpaper in the edubuntu-wallpapers package
<highvoltage> (it's a svg)
<mhall119> cool, I did a quick and dirty crop last night, but I'm not happy with it
<highvoltage> I just did a new one too, but I'm not happy with it
<highvoltage> it didn't come out quite as I'd hoped, and Google compresses it a lot more than my upload and it ends up looking really crappy
<highvoltage> I'll probably end up doing something completely different in the end
#edubuntu 2013-03-08
<micahg> can I get an edubuntu dev's ACK here: Bug #1152768
<ubottu> bug 1152768 in bluefish (Ubuntu) "FFe: Sync bluefish 2.2.4-1 (universe) from Debian experimental (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1152768
#edubuntu 2013-03-09
<highvoltage> micahg: acknowledged
<weljor> highvoltage: Hello!
<highvoltage> hello weljor
<weljor> highvoltage: On  raring live usb persistent(dayli build), with update command, the packages is not updated. The system asks advancement of version! Is correct?
<highvoltage> weljor: hmm, could you post a screenshot perhaps?
#edubuntu 2013-03-10
<micahg> highvoltage: thanks
<Ned_Flanders> hi can anyone help me?
#edubuntu 2014-03-03
<sebsebseb> hi
#edubuntu 2014-03-05
<Bernhard_L> My son has birthday and I spent him a new pc with ubuntu 12.04 LTS.
<Bernhard_L> But we are not able to cope with the dash menu-bar.
<Bernhard_L> Cannaot see the installed applications.
<Bernhard_L> I tried menu-editor but no additional menu shows up.
#edubuntu 2016-03-08
<gQuigs> is their a bug about the edubuntu image not building?
<gQuigs> (it hasn't been built for all of february -http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/dvd/current/)
<pleia2> gQuigs: this channel is not very active, might try asking on list
<gQuigs> pleia2: the list isn't very active either.. but I'll try there next
<gQuigs> thanks
<highvoltage> gQuigs: at the last ubuntu beta release we discussed not releasing any more edubuntu images and that might just happen
<gQuigs> highvoltage: guess that does make some sense... (I usually just pull the edubuntu meta package for the target audience anyway)
<gQuigs> highvoltage: thanks for letting me know..  can I read that discussion somewhere?
<highvoltage> gQuigs: it was a combination of #ubuntu-release and IRL discussion, I can't remember the exact dates for #ubuntu-release but it wasn't a big discussion
<gQuigs> oh ok, ty
#edubuntu 2017-03-06
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (xenial-proposed/main) [0.7.9-0ubuntu1~16.04.2 => 0.7.9-48-g1c795b9-0ubuntu1~16.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (yakkety-proposed/main) [0.7.9-0ubuntu1~16.10.1 => 0.7.9-48-g1c795b9-0ubuntu1~16.10.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2017-03-12
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: gnome-shell (yakkety-proposed/universe) [3.20.4-0ubuntu2 => 3.20.4-0ubuntu3] (desktop-extra, edubuntu, mozilla, ubuntugnome)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: gnome-shell (xenial-proposed/universe) [3.18.5-0ubuntu0.2 => 3.18.5-0ubuntu0.3] (desktop-extra, edubuntu, mozilla, ubuntugnome)
#edubuntu 2019-03-05
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: open-vm-tools (bionic-proposed/main) [2:10.3.0-0ubuntu1~18.04.3 => 2:10.3.5-7~ubuntu0.18.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: open-vm-tools (cosmic-proposed/main) [2:10.3.0-0ubuntu3 => 2:10.3.5-7~ubuntu0.18.10.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2020-03-07
<elements> are the download links broken? is there a mirror?
