#ubuntu-touch 2012-06-04
<cnd> Jonii, dandrader is working on a bunch of new features for Unity for Ubuntu 12.10
<cnd> you can follow the raw development if you want
<cnd> and ask questions on the multi-touch-dev@lists.launchpad.net mailing list
<cnd> dandrader, bregma: howdy
<bregma> yous is back
<cnd> yeah
<bregma> how went the sprint?
<cnd> it was alright
<cnd> half of us were in lex half in london
<cnd> that was kinda a pain
<bregma> excellent
<cnd> but oh well
<bregma> this is the future of collaboration, I suspect
<cnd> I'm quite sore from helping my sister move in and put ikea furniture together though
<bregma> allen key strain?
<cnd> that and many others :)
<dandrader> assembling ikea furniture is fun
<cnd> anyway, how was things last week?
<cnd> anything notable?
 * cnd hasn't gotten through email yet
<bregma> it wwas quiet
<dandrader> cnd, big merge proposal waiting for your opinion :) -> https://code.launchpad.net/~dandrader/nux/geis/+merge/108239
<cnd> dandrader, cool!
<cnd> I'll take a look today
<bregma> last Monday was a holiday everywhere in the universe except Canada and the UK, nobody seemed able to get motivated after that
<cnd> it also wasn't a holiday in lexington :(
<bregma> swap days!
<cnd> heh
<bregma> I guess it's that New England work ethic at play
<cnd> so about the big issue: I don't have any news yet, still waiting on answers from legal
 * cnd is trying to be discreet about it on this channel
<bregma> some good news is I SRUd a libgrip crasher
<cnd> yay
<bregma> it took me two days of intense debugging to track it down, it was a one-line fix
<bregma> I find GTK challenging in a bad way
<cnd> heh
<cnd> it sounds like there are a lot of hidden issues in gtk that only a gtk developer would know about
<bregma> only some subset of gtk developer, no one can know all of the hidden issues
<bregma> I'm hoping the legal issue can be resolved in a way that avoids us having to change code
<cnd> me too
<cnd> I've made it clear that some changes will balloon the effort from a little inconvenience to a couple weeks of one FTE depending on how much change is needed
<bregma> yes
<dandrader> cnd,  what's FTE?
<cnd> full time engineer
<cnd> it's an abstract way of saying how much work would be required
<dandrader> yeah, like "man hours"
<xerent> dandrader: engineers are not men. we are supermen. ;)
<dandrader> specially a full-time one :)
<dandrader> If a geis client specifies just one gesture class per subscription it will never get a gesture with more than one gesture class, right?
<dandrader> cnd, ^
<cnd> dandrader, bregma may know the full answer
<cnd> I'm not sure
<cnd> but I think you're correct
<cnd> because grail won't specify a gesture type that wasn't in the subscription
<bregma> dandrader, you are correct
<dandrader> ok
<Jonii> t
<Jonii> h
<Jonii> j
<Jonii> v
<Jonii> t
<Jonii> sorry
<doug> is it possible to hook the touch stuff up to a random TUIO stream to get multitouch working?
<cnd> doug, does tuio report data as uinput devices through the kernel?
<cnd> or does it provide an X driver?
<doug> cnd: neither, currently.  i've just got a UDP stream of TUIO events...
<cnd> doug, then you would either have to build a utouch-frame backend for TUIO
<cnd> or you would have to create a TUIO xserver input module
<cnd> or send the events through the kernel using uinput
<doug> hm, which is the easier route there?
<cnd> doug, probably uinput
<cnd> doug, I thought some people were already looking into that
<cnd> but I don't know who
<cnd> doug, you can look at the source of utouch-evemu to get an idea of how uinput works
<cnd> it's a pretty straight forward interface
<doug> cnd++
<doug> thanks
<cnd> doug, np :)
<doug> this would seem to be it: http://lii-enac.fr/cgi-bin/gitweb.cgi?p=linux-input/tuiototouch.git
<cnd> doug, sounds right
<cnd> bregma, please take a look at bug 986886 to comment on what changes are expected and to figure out if there really is a bug we need to fix there
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 986886 in utouch-geis "GEIS returns invalid arguments" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/986886
<cnd> bregma, also, the libgrip dailies are FTBFS: https://code.launchpad.net/~utouch-team/+recipe/libgrip-daily
<bregma> yes, it looks like there is a problem in the PPA causing libgrip to not find any dependencies -- weird, right?
<cnd> bregma, it looked to me like a patch wasn't applying
<cnd> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/106513591/buildlog.txt.gz
<cnd> perhaps it's a stale patch in the packaging that needs to be removed?
<bregma> yeah, that log looks suspicious -  it usually fails much earlier with a dependncy "... not going to be installed" error
<bregma> keep in mind it also builds cleanly in local pbuidlers and in Ubuntu buildds
<bregma> I guess the daily is trying to apply the packaging patch but the fix is already upstreamed in source
<bregma> I suppose the solution is to release a new version of grip
<bregma> sounds like a task for tomorrow
<cnd> yeah, I think that sounds right
#ubuntu-touch 2012-06-05
<WebVisitor-8> hi all!
<WebVisitor-8> anyone active?
<cnd> morning
<cnd> bregma, does your squad have new objectives yet?
<cnd> or are you still in a holding pattern?
<bregma> no, we have a couple of tasks assigned, both blocked at the moment
<bregma> 'sokay, it's still a holiday in the UK
<cnd> heh
<cnd> bregma, should we continue with utouch standups?
<bregma> I think for the next little while (at least) it;s a good idea, until Thomas reorganized things
<bregma> I think tvoss is on vacation this week?
<bregma> I see Peter Hutterer has some evemu changes proposed, I guess he will need someone to merge them, too?
<cnd> ok
<cnd> bregma, can you please comment on bug 986886
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 986886 in utouch-geis "GEIS returns invalid arguments" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/986886
<bregma> right, I was in the middle of that last night when the internet was cut off
<bregma> damn kids and their torrents
<cnd> heh
<bregma> (not my kids, other people's kids)
<cnd> bregma, I thought you had cellular internet?
<bregma> yes, and service kits the skids at about 15:00 when all the high school kids get home and go online
<bregma> I guess it must be WoW or something
<dandrader> :)
<bregma> or hundreds of lolcat views all at once
<cnd> bregma, everyone in your area also uses cellular internet?
<cnd> I hadn't really thought of that
<cnd> that you are saturating a cell tower :)
<dandrader> cnd, any plans on releasing the latest-and-greatest utouch-geis in Quantal? Or is it there already?
<cnd> dandrader, I asked bregma about it last week
<cnd> he didn't have any short-term plans, but there wasn't a need for it at the time either
<cnd> I think we could cut a release any time, tbh
<cnd> there are multiple fixes queued up anyway
<dandrader> nux would need it so it can access that new construction_finished property
<bregma> well then, I guess it's about time for an upstream release
<dandrader> I hope those compilation issues nux seems to have in Quantal get fixed soon
<bregma> I believe they're boost-related
<cnd> bregma, if you're busy I can make the geis release
<cnd> otherwise, please cut one
<bregma> OK, I'll do it
<cnd> cool
<dandrader> thanks!
<cnd> bregma, remember to upload to quantal-proposed if you do so before alpha 1 freeze is lifted :)
<bregma> wow, it's alpha freeze already?  I wasn;t paying attention
<cnd> yeah
<cnd> :)
<cnd> bregma, jaytaoko is having problems upgrading because of the binary package name change to libutouch-grail5
<cnd> I'm wondering if we're missing something in debian/control
<bregma> dunno, I'll investigate
<cnd> bregma, I think we shouldn't have the Replaces: and Conflicts: fields
<bregma> it's an ABI-transition problem
<cnd> because the old libutouch-grail1 can be installed side-by-side with libutouch-grail5
<cnd> while the transition occurs
<bregma> yep, needs to be fixed before the 2.2.10 release, that's for sure
<cnd> bregma, if that resolution sounds right to you, I'll fix it up
<cnd> the only other thing I can think of is a transitional package, but I don't think that's the right fit here
<bregma> simple is best
<bregma> if Jay can wait until tomorrow morning I'll have the 2.2.10 release tested and out so it will at least be available in our PPA
<cnd> bregma, yeah, he said that's not a problem
<cnd> there are other issues with nux and quantal that have to be sorted out first
<cnd> ok, I need to get some lunch, bbiab
<cnd> ok, it should be fixed now
#ubuntu-touch 2012-06-06
<cnd> morning
<cnd> bregma, dandrader: standups
<dandrader> morning
<cnd> I'm still trying to fix a few X bugs
<cnd> there's a geis bug that RAOF filed yesterday too
<cnd> where devices don't seem to get registered when they are added
<cnd> I'll take a look at that
<cnd> otherwise, I'll be doing more researchy stuff
<dandrader> Continuing work on a patch for the unity compiz plugin to make it work with the upcoming nux version that has gestures support (essencially to deal with geis v2 rules). Also updating related tests
<bregma> utouch-geis 2.2.10 just went out (in quantal-proposed)
<cnd> yay
<dandrader> cnd, "RAOF"?
<cnd> dandrader, RAOF == Chris Halse Rogers
<cnd> he's on the desktop team, mostly doing X work
<lilstevie> cnd: did you end up getting your transformer tf101s set up?
<cnd> lilstevie, I got mine working :)
<lilstevie> :)
<bregma> the libgrip release is in the works, pending paperwork and quality time with my armel pbuilder
<dandrader> ah, I thought it was yet another acronym :)
<lilstevie> cnd: glad to hear it, how are you finding the touch, is it alright or is it bugging out a little bit
<cnd> looks like the grail soname package fix worked
<cnd> lilstevie, seems to work alright for me
<cnd> bregma, you saw that your libgrip fix wasn't the full resolution to bug 997630?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 997630 in utouch-geis (Ubuntu Precise) "evince and eog broken on remote sessions (X, NX, x2go and VNC)" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/997630
<lilstevie> cnd: ok glad to hear it, been struggling with the mx223 for the tf101 and tf201 with bad noise ratios
<cnd> bregma, I guess that's a geis bug, not libgrip
<bregma> yes, it's potentially a problem with geis, which is why it remains an open bug in precise
<bregma> the root of the problem is it queries the X server for its xinput version on every instance startup, and that means a long synchronous round trip over the network, which takes time
<bregma> libgrip starts several instances
<bregma> I need to do some better analysis of where the delay lies
<bregma> and if it can be avoided
<bregma> bug #1001365 also introduces a segfault in the regression test suite, the cure for which may require an ABI change
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1001365 in utouch-geis (Ubuntu) "Geis delivers events from gestures that no longer exist" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1001365
<bregma> this will potentially cause the same segfault at runtime, so it needs some loving care
<cnd> hmm
<cnd> bregma, make sure to update the bugs, especially 997630, so the users know what's up
#ubuntu-touch 2012-06-07
<maba> Hey all! I have an Acer T231H (supported by hid-multitouch), which supports 2 simultaneous touches. I have Ubuntu 12.04, and added the utouch daily ppa. Fully upgraded my system as well. The thing is, with mtview I can "draw" with my two fingers and it works, both points are recognized. But I can't get any gestures to work! What I really would like is for ginn to work, but when running it just states: "error subscribing to gesture
<maba> Thanks in advance!
<maba> Hey all! I have an Acer T231H (supported by hid-multitouch), which supports 2 simultaneous touches. I have Ubuntu 12.04, and added the utouch daily ppa. Fully upgraded my system as well. The thing is, with mtview I can "draw" with my two fingers and it works, both points are recognized. But I can't get any gestures to work! What I really would like is for ginn to work, but when running it just states: "error subscribing to gesture
<maba> Thanks in advance!
<maba> Anyone? :)
<dandrader> hi maba
<maba> hi there
 * dandrader reads maba's question...
<dandrader> well, I have no experience with ginn... what do you wanna do exactly?
<dandrader> if I'm not mistaken ginn is being deprecated
<maba> Ok, the reason why I wanted to use ginn was because I would like the gestures to be turned into regular keypress-combos
<maba> to map pinch to ctrl+-/ctrl++ for example (for zoom)
<dandrader> hmmm...
<maba> could this be done with geis instead?
<dandrader> cnd would know better about the current state and plans for ginn, but he's not online at the moment. You could send an e-mail to https://launchpad.net/~multi-touch-dev
<dandrader> maba, of course
<dandrader> but you would have to modify your application to use the geis library
<maba> I don't want to do that :)
<maba> reason being I want to use multitouch through and RDP-session
<maba> through an*
 * bregma slurps some cold joe
<cnd> good morning
<cnd> I'm still working on a few bugs
<cnd> I hope to get a chance to look into why utouch isn't recognizing new devices when they are plugged in
<cnd> dandrader, bregma: standups :)
<dandrader> bug fixing the patch that makes unity use the new nux with gestures support.  Quite a bit of work as that implies shifting from amotic gesture rules to regular gesture rules (accept/reject semantics + multiple simultaneous gestures) in unity and unity cannot use the gestures acceptance and delivery logic from nux because it handles CompWindows instead of nux::InputAreas (such as nux::BaseWindow).
<bregma> um, I guess I'll get that libgrip release out today
<dandrader> cnd, maybe geis have to update the existing subscriptions to include the new device?
<cnd> hmm... maybe?
<bregma> as far as I know that should be being done and there's a test case for that
<cnd> I assume the subscriptions are on all devices of a given class
<cnd> dandrader, do you know if that's how the unity code is written?
<dandrader> unity just says it wants gestures of class X with that many touches
<cnd> dandrader, from any device?
<dandrader> no device specified
<bregma> is the unity code using GEISv1 still?  It's possible the device events are not being propagated properly through GEISv1, I don;t remember writing a test case for that
<dandrader> bregma, yes
<bregma> well, if Unity isn;t subscribing to a list of devices it shouldn't matter, but writing a test case should verify that
<dandrader>   status = geis_subscribe(instance,
<dandrader>                           GEIS_ALL_INPUT_DEVICES,
<dandrader>                           s_gestures,
<dandrader>                           &gesture_funcs,
<dandrader>                           this);
<dandrader> snippet from current unity code
<bregma> right, so theoretically it shouldn't matter, the subscriptions should just get updated
<dandrader> ah, and I won't be around tomorrow. taking a swap day
<cnd> dandrader, any fun plans you can share?
<cnd> I've got one unallocated swap day I should probably use
<dandrader> cnd, sure. going to BÃºzios for a long weekend this evening. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arma%C3%A7%C3%A3o_dos_B%C3%BAzios
<cnd> ooooh.... looks nice :)
<dandrader> it's around 3 hours by bus from Rio
<cnd> I'm looking forward to having a full weekend to myself
<cnd> I've had only one of those in the past two months
<dandrader> how come?
<cnd> uds, lexington sprint last week
<cnd> I had one weekend all to myself over the past 7 wekends
<cnd> every other weekend I was traveling or elsewhere
<dandrader> busy man :)
<cnd> I'm glad I don't have any plans for anything until the end of the month
<cnd> and that is a vacation really
<dandrader> hmm... think I found a bug in geis/grail
<dandrader> I perform a tap with 4 fingers
<dandrader> geis first send on 4 possible combinations of 3-touches gestures (with construction finished 0)
<dandrader> if I start reject them right away (keeping only the last 3-touches gesture sent)
<dandrader> geis seems to never send the 4 touches gesture
<dandrader> gotta investigate that better, make a test case, etc. but now I gotta go
<dandrader> have a nice weekend
<cnd> bregma, looks like it is a geisv2 vs giesv1 bug, where plugging in a new device doesn't subscribe it automatically
<cnd> geisview sees events after the device comes online
<cnd> but unity doesn't
<cnd> geistest shows the device being added
<cnd> but no events come from it
<bregma> hmm
<bregma> can't remember how I implemented GEISv1, but if it's iterating over known devices when a subscription is created for ALL_DEVICES then it should actually just just create a subscription without device filters
<cnd> I'm creating a test case for it now
<bregma> always a good start
<cnd> bregma, do you know what's up with the geis tests on jenkins?
<cnd> I also notice a lot of failing tests here locally
<bregma> I don't know about jenkins, but for me all tests pass eccept the accept-gesture test
<bregma> that test fails because it tries to dereference deleted objects
<bregma> I was working on a fix, but now I'm up to my eyeballs trying to figure out Unity code and it;s going to make my head asplode
<cnd> eww
<bregma> it's not bad code, there's just a lot of it, and it just keeps comin'
<bregma> anyway, time to drive my kids to soccer
#ubuntu-touch 2012-06-08
<cnd> good morning
<cnd> I'm going to be looking at the geis1 subscription bug and making a new xorg-gtest release
<cnd> then doing other research
<cnd> bregma, looks like you're the only other person around today
<bregma> I guess
<bregma> I never did get that libgrip release done, I'll try to show horn it in today
<bregma> *shoehorn*
<cnd> bregma, I just sent out a merge proposal for bug 1009270
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1009270 in utouch-geis (Ubuntu) "Unity fails to use multitouch gestures if magic touchpad is connected after Unity has launched" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1009270
<bregma> K
#ubuntu-touch 2013-06-03
<mhall119> Dummies_freelanc: sorry for the delay, yes you can use qtquick for desktop apps too
<dholbach> good morning
<akronhod> Hi, I inserted a SIM in Galaxy Nexus with latest (147) Ubuntu touch image, but    phoning possible
<akronhod> phoning not possible, any ideas?
<akronhod> it is not asking for SIM PIN
<sil2100> didrocks: before I depart to the tax-enforcers - I see that otto failed the Apps AP tests because of "packages: ERROR"
<sil2100> didrocks: what does that mean?
<didrocks> sil2100: did you try to look at the artefacts? I'm interested to see if the messages are clear enough for figuring it out :)
<didrocks> sil2100: btw, once you are back, mind looking at bug #1186225? (see the rationale, explanation and what's need to be reverted in both branches)
<ubot5> bug 1186225 in Canonical Upstream To Distro "Needless package build in case both control and changelog changed" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1186225
<sil2100> didrocks: will check and will look further - for now the logs just make fun of me, as the main console output said: "E: A run step failed. Check summary.log for details", while summary.log says only: "packages: ERROR" ;p
<didrocks> sil2100: right, tell me once you start looking at the artefacts :)
<didrocks> (I think we should change packages: ERROR as "packages setup: ERROR")
<didrocks> so if I were you, I would check the "logs" directory in the artefacts ;)
<sil2100> didrocks: yes yes, I see it - it's actually all nicely 'put in place', and it's rather intuitive that when there is a packages ERROR, I would look at the otto-setup.log
<sil2100> Nice ;)
<didrocks> sil2100: got it! :-)
<didrocks> sil2100: so it seems the ppa was in a middle of publishing
<didrocks> and apt-get update failed to catch it
<didrocks> sil2100: I just added a retry 3 times, separated by 10s
<didrocks> that should do it ;)
<didrocks> (in case of apt-get update fails)
<didrocks> sil2100: I'll rerun it, but nice to have your feedback!
<sil2100> Good idea, since there are a few cases where it could fail for no real reason
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> packages setup: makes more sense to you?
<sil2100> Yes, more informative indeed!
<didrocks> sil2100: why did you relaunch unity head?
<didrocks> sil2100: it was just in manual publishing, isn't it?
<didrocks> or is it my chrome with cache which is tricking me?
 * didrocks ctrl + R
<didrocks> oh right, thanks jenkins cache :/
<didrocks> sil2100: forget about it ;)
<didrocks> sil2100: oh btw, if you look at the job, you will see that you have labels with the stack/series/ppa
<davmor2> ogra_: I cheated I part chopped the crespo against galaxy nexus :)  no more build worries :)
<ogra_> cool !
<davmor2> ogra_: I got feed up of it not building and when I finally forced it to it not working :( so now I be a happy bunny :)
<davmor2> popey, ogra_: is it me or does the twitter feed not move on the galaxy nexus?  I'm scrolling up nothing scrolling down nothing
 * ogra_ has no idea 
<nik90> mhall119: ping
<nik90> mhall119: When you have time, can you test my MP https://code.launchpad.net/~nik90/ubuntu-clock-app/change-timer-logic/+merge/166982
<nik90> mhall119: We can then get that merged and I can then focus on the visual UI layout change.
<sil2100> sergiusens, rsalveti: hi! Are we ok for the QA (autopilot) and unity stacks switch to saucy? Were you able to release the final raring image last week?
<didrocks> sil2100: btw, it seems that unity head depends on indicator raring stack, I think it should be now indicator head stack, isn't it?
<didrocks> sil2100: also, the hud stack (basically all rdepends stacks) should be built on saucy as a consequence
<didrocks> (btw, we're going to plug hud with otto, don't relaunch a stack without telling us ;))
<sil2100> Ok ;)
<Nick___> Hi!
<Oranger> Mirv: ping
<Oranger> Mirv: Do you have some time ? I need some help on a Qt5 cmake module ^^'
<Mirv> Oranger: pong.. I haven't used the cmake much myself (mostly qmake all the way), although I know it's used and preferred by many of the developers
<Mirv> maybe fire away with questions and let's see if anyone can answer them?
<Oranger> Mirv: I asked to didrocks ( mhall119  said he is a pro in cmake ) and he told me to see with you :p
<Oranger> But ok :)
<Mirv> ;)
<Mirv> hmm, maybe from some of the packages we'd see who has used cmake a lot together with Qt5, not only one or another
<Oranger> Mirv: Thank you anyway :) I can't ask it here because it is a very specific problem so I'll try figure it out alone ;)
<Oranger> Mirv: Yes, I did some researchs, a lot of packages use cmake with Qt5, all with the same file (FindQt5.cmake) but it seem to don't work for me
<Mirv> Oranger: I could continue with the list of potential persons to ping with Saviq, from looking at the dee-qt code history. I bookmarked that code branch at one point since it's an example of using cmake to build both against Qt4 and Qt5
<Oranger> Mirv: Ok, thank you :)
<Saviq> Oranger, I'll keep an eye on the channel
<Oranger> Saviq: Wow, you are fast :)
<mpt> rsalveti, hi, are you familiar with how carriers communicate timezone + time + date to a phone when it's on automatic time setting?
<john-mcaleely> folks. Have just phablet-flashed a nexus 10, but failing to get past demo user login screen as anything but guest
<john-mcaleely> suggested lower case names as passwords don't seem to work
<mzanetti> john-mcaleely: I think it changed to "password" now
<john-mcaleely> mzanetti: yup - that works thanks :-)
<[SLB]> would installing ubuntu touch also wipe a possibly custom recovery from the phone?
<Saviq> [SLB], we're using a tweaked ClockworkMod recovery AFAIK, but it shouldn't be a requirement
<Saviq> sergiusens, can you comment ^?
<[SLB]> thanks Saviq
<sergiusens> [SLB]: only if you use phablet-flash -b
<[SLB]> ah okay
<[SLB]> and is the current image actually usable or still the demo one?
<sergiusens> sil2100: define unity stack if you mean something different that http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~cupstream2distro-maintainers/cupstream2distro-config/trunk/view/head:/stacks/head/unity.cfg
<Saviq> [SLB], some of us are using it as main phones, so it's possible
<sil2100> sergiusens: yes, I mean this + qa, hud and all other unity dependencies
<nik90> jounih: The ubuntuShape and app theme capabilities sdk support are still being worked on. This essentially means that the visual design implementation can only be started after a few weeks.
<Saviq> [SLB], there's of course a lot of features still missing
<sergiusens> sil2100: oh.. ok, so we shouldn't call all that unity stack or rename the stack in cupstream2distro ;-)
<sergiusens> sil2100: anyhow... we have a discussion regarding that today... so I'll get back to you soon
<didrocks> it's not called unity stack, it's the unity stack + all dependent stacks (which has other names: qa, hud, indicatorsâ¦)
<sil2100> Yes, I meant, the idea is to switch the unity stack to saucy, but to do this also qa, hud and other stacks need to be switched as well
<sil2100> I didn't say they're all called 'unity stack'
<[SLB]> thanks Saviq, nice
<ogra_> rsalveti, are you able to boot with the latest grouper kernel
 * ogra_ goes mad, i cant get the flipped container boot on grouper and there is no reason why it wouldnt
<ogra_> (root is mounted fine, it seems to fail after run-init)
<sergiusens> ogra_: the latest kernel without or with the flip?
<ogra_> with
<sergiusens> ogra_: I can give it a quick go either way
<ogra_> recovery with the same kernel works fine
<ogra_> i can debug /init down to it executing run-init
<ogra_> i asssume i even properly end up in the rootfs
<ogra_> but upstart doesnt move on
<ogra_> maguro works flawless btw
<ogra_> (apart from https://code.launchpad.net/~ogra/session-manager/fix-oom_adj/+merge/166975)
<jounih> nik90: ok let me speak to kaleo about the ETA for those. Is there anything we can start with now?
<nik90> jounih: I can try to match the placement of elements like the text to match the designs but otherwise not much.
<nik90> jounih: The background gradient, ubuntuShape etc all require the sdk to provide support
<asac> sergiusens: where is your test suite?
<asac> sergiusens: https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Au6idq7TkpUUdGR3c1NUM2RnYkNBYjVMTkMxVjFqb2c#gid=0 can you fill out the phonedations row there: https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Au6idq7TkpUUdGR3c1NUM2RnYkNBYjVMTkMxVjFqb2c#gid=0
<sergiusens> asac: is this for tomorrow?
<asac> sergiusens: no
<asac> :)
<asac> not sure what tomorrow is
<asac> we have wednesday a call about saucy upgrade
<mpt> Tuesday
<asac> afaik
<asac> mpt: :-P
<sergiusens> asac: I'm not sure either... asked and got no reply
 * mpt ducks
 * asac hunts down the duck :)
<asac> sergiusens: this spreadsheet is about saying where your test suite is
<asac> and how to run it
<asac> and where it shoujld be run
<asac> daily
<sergiusens> asac: well... I have no test suite yet... at least no formal one
<sergiusens> asac: I'll create one
<asac> sergiusens: mfrey told me phonedatils has a test suite
<asac> that you run regularly
<asac> locally
<asac> thats what i am looking for
<sergiusens> asac: he's probably talking about the manual ones? Or are you talking about the autopilot ones?
<asac> sergiusens: he said u do manual tests, but also run scripts etc. that are automatically testing stuff
<sergiusens> asac: yeah, the autopilot ones then
<asac> sergiusens: do you also run those locally ?
<asac> if so, then yes... those are the ones :)
<asac> sergiusens: guess i need a list of autopilot packages that you run
<asac> sergiusens: check out the spreadsheet
<sergiusens> asac: I am
<asac> something similar: one url, one set of commmands that will run everything, report true or false and produce logs
<asac> ok let me know if thats impossible :)
<sergiusens> asac: anyways, with this new org, I'd like to get rid of those and do more lower level ones
<sergiusens> asac: impossible today... but I can do something that aggregates all
<asac> sergiusens: I woul dlike to get what exists for now, but delegate responsibility of what is rewally in ther eto the phonedations team
<sergiusens> asac: ack
<asac> i guess you can just provide a branch that has two simeple scripts:
<asac> ./list-test-suites
<asac> ./run-test-suite TESTSUITE OUTFILE.log && echo success
<asac> then you can firest run your autopilot stuff
<asac> and later just run whatever you find is better
<mfisch> mhall119: sforshee is working on powerd, but ChickenCutlass's team will eventually take over
<mhall119> thanks mfisch
<mhall119> sforshee: ChickenCutlass: https://bugs.launchpad.net/powerd/+bug/1186469
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1186469 in powerd "segfault on nexus 7" [Undecided,New]
<mhall119> because of this, you can't suspend the screen on a Nexus 7 in build >=145
 * ogra_ sighs
<penk> mhall119: hi! is the touch application entry still using .desktop file?
<ogra_> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<ogra_>  ubuntu-touch : Depends: demo-assets-video but it is not installable
<ogra_> GRR !
<sergiusens> ogra_: how did that make it there?
<ogra_> i synced the seeds
<ogra_> as well as all scripts etc
<ogra_> so that wer are on par between raring and saucy
<sergiusens> ogra_: I was creating a bp to sync all this stuff :-)
<ogra_> i had to binary copy the new demo-assets in the PPA but they should be there
<sergiusens> ogra_: as in do it in the right order
<ogra_> well, your only seed change regarding the demos wha the one that drops demo-assets and adds the -video|-music|-.... ones
<mhall119> penk: yes
<ogra_> python-gi is in the archive ... so there is no reason why it wouldnt be installable
<sergiusens> ogra_: regarding the demos yes
<ogra_> right
<ogra_> i didnt merge anything that looked like it could break us
<sergiusens> ogra_: ack... let me fix demo assets for you
<ogra_> and i dont get why that package isnt found ..
<sergiusens> ogra_: python-gi?
<ogra_> sergiusens, you added a dep on that
<rsalveti> sergiusens: don't you have the ppa sync script already?
<rsalveti> we might want to sync the packages again
<rsalveti> ogra_: only difference with nexus 7 is that we're now using the packaged kernel
<rsalveti> but if should work, as it works fine with the current raring image
<rsalveti> sil2100: as sergiusens said, guess we'll talk a bit more about the transition plan at our daily (in 35 mins)
<mpt> awe_, hi, how much do you know about timezone + time + date communication between phones and carriers?
<rsalveti> mpt: hey
<ogra_> rsalveti, well, i can see it getting to run-init and then it hard reboots
<mpt> ah, hi rsalveti :-)
<rsalveti> mpt: the carrier can send time + date + timezone offset to the phone
<rsalveti> mpt: but it's not the timezone itself, it just says utc -<number>
<sergiusens> rsalveti: add your ideas here https://blueprints.launchpad.net/touch-preview-images/+spec/foundations-1305-saucy-migration
<mpt> interesting
<mpt> rsalveti, does it ever send timestamp + timezone, as opposed to just timestamp?
<rsalveti> mpt: I can get the date
<mpt> rsalveti, sorry, I meant the other way around
<rsalveti> mpt:  * "data" is const char * pointing to NITZ time string
<rsalveti>  * in the form "yy/mm/dd,hh:mm:ss(+/-)tz,dt"
<ogra_> ARGH
<mpt> rsalveti, does the carrier ever send *just* the timestamp and not the time zone
<ogra_> demo-assets-video has an "s" in the end ...
<ogra_> silly me
<rsalveti> guess sergiusens had the same issue
<sergiusens> ogra_: yes I did!
<sergiusens> but the branch was up to date
<rsalveti> mpt: well, it sends both (but sometimes it can indeed just send the date/time)
<rsalveti> let me check what I'm getting here, one sec
<sil2100> rsalveti, sergiusens: ok, so give me a sign once you guys have all talked out, until that I'll be waiting with the transition for a green light from you guy
<sil2100> *guys
<mpt> rsalveti, the reason I'm asking was that in <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeAndDate#Phone> I assumed that it never sent the time zone, so you had to set that yourself first
<sergiusens> sil2100: I'm mostly sure it's ok, but let's do this in sync
<mpt> rsalveti, but if you often but not always get the time zone, then the time zone setting should be positioned after the automatic/manual setting
 * ogra_ would appreciate if someone with a nexus4 could test the flipped container images
<ChickenCutlass> ogra_, I can.  URL?
<ogra_> ChickenCutlass, http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch/daily-preinstalled/current/
<ogra_> install with adb, first the armel zip, then the armhf one ...
<ogra_> to get a shell you need https://code.launchpad.net/~ogra/session-manager/fix-oom_adj/+merge/166975
<ogra_> (adb should work all the time though, at least it does on maguro)
<ChickenCutlass> ogra_, so which files do I need exactly?
<ogra_> well, what arch is n4 ... mako ?
<ChickenCutlass> yes
<ogra_> you need the armel zip for mako and the armhf zip with the rootfs
<ogra_> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch/daily-preinstalled/current/saucy-preinstalled-touch-armel+mako.zip
<ogra_> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch/daily-preinstalled/current/saucy-preinstalled-touch-armhf.zip
<ogra_> these two
<ogra_> (identical with raring installs)
<ChickenCutlass> ok
<ChickenCutlass> ogra_, how about bootimage?
<ChickenCutlass> not needed
<ogra_> inside the armel zip
<ChickenCutlass> ok
<ogra_> (like the tarball is inside the rootfs zip)
<ogra_> that will all get cleaned up
<rsalveti> mpt: right, let me dig a big more
<mpt> ok
<davmor2> ogra_: do you see text in the ubuntu-terminal-app?
<ogra_> i have never seen the terminal app in action
<ogra_> only on screenshots
<davmor2> ogra_: ah okay :)
<davmor2> mhall119: do you see text in the ubuntu-terminal-app?
<rsalveti> davmor2: I can't see what I'm typing
<davmor2> rsalveti: ah thanks I see it flash but then it goes black again :)  but I'm glad it's not just me :)
<davmor2> alias for 3gup and 3gdown created though woohoo
<rsalveti> right
<mhall119> davmor2: increase the font size to 14 in the settings tab
<davmor2> mhall119: oh okay
<davmor2> mhall119: Yay thanks
<davmor2> mhall119: and how do you trigger esc for vim?
<mhall119> davmor2: in the toolbar there's a "Panels" button
<mhall119> one of the panels (ctrl I think) has an esc button
<davmor2> mhall119: ah nice thanks, I had the control button just not the ecs thanks
<mpt> rsalveti, any luck?
<rsalveti> mpt: comparing now with the logic in android
<rsalveti> I got 13/06/03,14:29:11-12,00 here
<mpt> "-12,00"?
<rsalveti> -12 is -3
<rsalveti> divide by 4
<rsalveti> because of weird timezones, such as the one in venezuela
<mpt> Time zones are in 15-minute increments?
<rsalveti> and the time I got was local time, so with the timezone offset applied already
<rsalveti> mpt: yup
<rsalveti> ricmm: would be nice to check yours, you'd need to add -d to your /etc/init/ofono.conf and reboot
<rsalveti> then look for UNSOL_NITZ_TIME_RECEIVED in your /var/log/syslog
<mpt> rsalveti, but you say that string sometimes doesn't include the timezone.
<davmor2> rsalveti: apparently upping the font size does display the text which is useful to have :)
<ricmm> rsalveti: gimme 5
<rsalveti> mpt: at least when I was checking that wasn't always necessarily true, that's why I'm now checking how android deals with this
<mhall119> davmor2: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-terminal-app/+bug/1187015
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1187015 in Ubuntu Terminal App "Set default font size to 14" [Undecided,New]
<rsalveti> cool
<rsalveti> mpt: so in android there are 2 options, automatic time and automatic time zone
<rsalveti> they split it in 2 different options
<mpt> hmm
<mpt> You might want both on if they're both right
<rsalveti> right
<mpt> You might want neither on if they're messed up
<mpt> When would you want automatic time and manual time zone?
<rsalveti> ok, it seems they try to grab the country code from the sim
<rsalveti> and then create the right timezone entry based on country code + tz offset
<mpt> International roaming?
<rsalveti> right, the country code the sim is registered
<mpt> Several countries have multiple time zones...
<Durbinator> afternoon
<davmor2> mhall119: do you have any issues with the twiiter web app?  currently I can't scroll down my time line, however it works fine for facebook.
<davmor2> twitter even
<mhall119> davmor2: I don't really use twitter
<davmor2> mhall119: I was just testing how dogfoodable it was for me before I took my sim out of my S3 and dropped it into the galaxy nexus :)
<pmcgowan> sergiusens, where is the build number on the phone now?
<mhall119> zsombi: ping
<zsombi> mhall119: pong
<mhall119> zsombi: do you have time for a hangout to discuss responsive layouts?
<sergiusens> pmcgowan: same location
<zsombi> mhall119: oh, completely forgot about it!!!, sorry, will join soon!!!
<pmcgowan> sergiusens, remind me!
<sergiusens> pmcgowan: /system/ubuntu_stamp
<pmcgowan> ty
<ZDmitry> mhall119, ping
<mhall119> ZDmitry: pong
<ZDmitry> mhall119, which font size do you want to set as default?
<mhall119> 14 seems to be the magic number, that or higher seems to fix it
<ZDmitry> mhall119, but is it comfortable size? Not small?
<mhall119> ZDmitry: it's larger than the default I get on the Nexus 7, it's a good size for me
<folf> Hi all. Just installed ubuntu touch on my galaxy nexus. I'm sure theres a page somewhere that will inform me how to delete the place-holder data and install the develepment apps, but thought I'd ask here for more update information
<ZDmitry> mhall119, sorry. That was mistake. It would better to set bigger font size from beginning. Then let 14 be default.
<folf> Hmm, case in point: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/ReleaseNotes says that Ubuntu touch is based on 12.10 ?
<mhall119> folf: updated it to say 13.04, thanks for spotting that
<mhall119> folf: as far as I am aware, the process for removing place-holder data hasn't changed
<ZDmitry> mhall119, anyway, this will be quick fix for the bug. Problem is still in konsole qml plugin. But I'll fix it only on the next week.
<mhall119> thanks ZDmitry
<ZDmitry> np
<mhall119> ZDmitry: oh, I spoke with the upstream KDE developer managing konsole, he's looking at your plugin branch and will try and help us get your changes integrated into their brances
<ZDmitry> mhall119, good
<folf> mhall119: then I just need to figure out where that information is :-)
<mhall119> folf: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/ReleaseNotes#Sample_content ?
<folf> mhall119: yeah, I just tried to look there. The first part doesn't seem to work for me, but then again there are no contacts. So maybe that doesn't apply anymore?
<mhall119> folf: could me
<pmcgowan> folf, we took all the sample apps and contacts and messages out
<pmcgowan> only videos remain
<folf> pmcgowan: OK, thanks. So I guess that could be taken away from the release notes page mhall119
<cease> NIGGER
<cease> BITCH
<ogra_> !ops
<ubot5> Help! Channel emergency! (ONLY use this trigger in emergencies) - oubiwann, corp186, popey,  k1l,  Corey, wgrant, idleone, and ogra.
<cease> nIGGER
<cease> CUNT
<cease> !OPS
<ubot5> Help! Channel emergency! (ONLY use this trigger in emergencies) - oubiwann, corp186, popey,  k1l,  Corey, wgrant, idleone, and ogra.
<cease> !OPS
<cease> !OPS
<cease> !OPS
<cease> !OPS
<cease> !OPS
<cease> !OPS
<cease> !OPS
<cease> !OPS
<cease> !OPS
<cease> !OPS
<cease> !OPS
<ogra_> gee, why am i an op ...
<Oranger> ogra_: Nice command
<ogra_> heh
 * ogra_ doesnt even remotely know the runes too kick or ban people ...  once i have looked them up the troll is gone :P
<Oranger> yes, but you can ban the troll... forever \o/
<ogra_> heh
<Oranger> and the peace will be back in the Ubuntu Touch world
<DarkEra> sad to see some people just don't have a life :(
<folf> mhall119: The instruction "Run manage-address-books.py delete " from this page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/ReleaseNotes#Sample_content does not make sense to me. Perhaps I'm missing something obvious
<ogra> folf, whats the confusing bit ?
<ogra> you execute the command "manage-address-books.py delete" which clears the address book
<davmor2> mhall119: is there a way to switch out apps in launcher? ie is there a config file for it somewhere?
<ZDmitry> mhall119, fix done: https://code.launchpad.net/~hiroshidi/ubuntu-terminal-app/font-size-fix/+merge/167087
<davmor2> hey guys now I have an up-to-date ish build of ubuntu-touch I have to say well done it rocks :)
<davmor2> apart from twitter
<Saviq> davmor2, it's in applications.js file from qml-phone-shell package atm
<davmor2> Saviq: ah cool thanks
<Saviq> davmor2, we're working towards having it proper in conf atm
<davmor2> Saviq: I will hold off then and try it when it lands
<folf> ogra: the confusing bit is that I can't seem to locate "manage-address-books.py"
<Saviq> davmor2, well, depends on how pressing it is for you, it's still at least two weeks away ;)
<ogra> folf, oh, it might be poutdated, the demo users were removed in the most recent images
<ogra> -p
<davmor2> Saviq: not pressing at all I only wanted to drop a couple and add the terminal app, neither of which were ergent
<davmor2> urgent even
<rsalveti> mpt: so, it's kind of ugly, it gets the time + timezone offset (if it's available), and together with the carrier ID + country code, it tries to match and find the correct timezone the user is in
<rsalveti> that's why it works
<rsalveti> mpt: and that's why you have both options, to set automatic time & date and also to automatically set the timezone
<rsalveti> and it always uses ntp if it's available (if there's a data connection), as that's probably more correct
<rsalveti> mpt: so don't know if you want to allow auto timezone as well in the ui
<rsalveti> from the link you gave it gives the impression that it'll only set the time and date, and not necessarily the timezone
<rsalveti> as I might want to manually select a timezone
<rsalveti> sorry, you do have timezone specifics below
<folf> rsalveti: is this (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/ReleaseNotes#Timezone) what you are looking for??
<rsalveti> folf: no, looking for the new ui design to cover such features
<rsalveti> but thanks :-)
<rsalveti> mpt: so, for time we don't necessarily need an active data connection, as it can get that value from the carrier (same for timezone)
<rsalveti> so it'd only need a data connection in case there's no modem at all (e.g tablet)
<folf> So to whoever cares: in the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/ReleaseNotes#Adding_Content pages it says to look at  /usr/share/demo-assets/contacts-data/data.csv but that's not present on my phone.
<sergiusens> folf: apt-get install demo-asstest-contacts
<sergiusens> err demo-assets-contacts
<sergiusens> folf: feel free to update the wiki
<folf> sergiusens: thanks
<folf> sergiusens: (and I wasn't aware that I could do that; the "login" button had eluded me)
<asac> end of day :)
<asac> almost
<asac> whats news on knocking out the saucy switch over?
<ogra> lucky you
<asac> is container flip landing, yes or no?
<ogra> asac, we will only be able to tell ionce the apps work or dont work
<ogra> that will need some time
<asac> ok so we dont do this before switch
<asac> sounds good
<ogra> we will switch the jenkins builds to saucy and roughly stablize them
<asac> nice
<ogra> in parallel cdimage will build the flipped images
<asac> what do we define as "stablized enough"?
<asac> ack++
<ogra> and we will research whats working and what not within the next two weeks on these flipped images
<asac> swounds good. we don't block the switch over, but keep ability to flip over open\
<asac> comes with some additional overhead to allow us to do that, but seems we figured out how
<ogra> dunno what we define as "stablilized enough" ... i guess thats still open for definition :)
 * ogra cries .. grouper is treating me mean today :(
<asac> right. i think the right angle is to find an answer is to think about "what is the inner ring of image stakeholders and what would block them"
<asac> ogra: grouper == N4?
<ogra> 7
<ogra> the flipped container image works absolutely flawless on maguro (gnex)
<asac> ok. that one i won't kill without dual install ... it has my preferred pinball game on it :)
<ogra> but not at all on grouper
<ogra> it commits suicide when it should run run-init and switch to the rootfs
<ogra> and i dont know why
<asac> what kind of suicide? silence death? or crying out loud?
<ogra> reboot
<asac> seems you found the reboot feature :_)
<asac> hehe
<ogra> thats one of these crappy android "features"
<ogra> yeah
<asac> thats the CIA feature i am sure
<asac> ogra: how do you plan to debug?
<asac> just curious
<ogra> well, currently i add a lot of stuff to /usr/share/initramfs-tools/init ... that writes to a file on disk
<ogra> to get me all info about the environment
<tassadar_> what about /proc/last_kmsg (assuming ubuntu kernel has ram console enabled)?
<davmor2> asac: reboot is easy first it lands on your left foot you chip it over to your right and then boot it again right?
<ogra> but it doesnt reveal enough ... so  tomorrow i'll build a new kernel with USB-serial enabled (which means killing adb)
<asac> davmor2: yeah. actually with good applciation lifecycle model and snappy boottime, a reboot shouldnt be that bad
<asac> user just sees slight screen black disruption and then bang... the device is back exactly where it was before :)
<ogra> [    6.597432] The USB cable is connected
<ogra> [    6.597510] elan-ktf3k 1-0010: Update power source to 1
<ogra> [    7.006120] Kernel panic - not syncing: Attempted to kill init!
<ogra> not really revealing much more than i know
<asac> i know that GPU driver folks have a full OS and they also optimize the "reboot GPU in case there are troubles we don't undersatnd" case :) ... so maybe its valid in the future on full devices too :)
<ogra> well, usually you just use a serial console in such cases
<tassadar_> ogra: hm, yeah, didn't really expect much more, it has to reboot if init crashes :/
<asac> tassadar_: it could restart init :)
<ogra> tassadar_, pfft it doesnt on my desktop
<ogra> the point is that it isnt clear which init crashes :)
<asac> ogra: rename our init?
<ogra> we run one in the initrd ... and one on disk
<asac> to real-init?
<ogra> and then ?
<asac> then hope that the message tells you which init crashed?
<ogra> do you think the kernel will tell me "hey your freaky named init crashed"
<ogra> it will print exactly the same :)
<ogra> its a hardcoded msg
<tassadar_> ogra: what does it do on desktop? fall back to some "shell"? Oo
<ogra> just telling you that the init currently in use died
<ogra> you dont know which one is currently in use though
<ogra> tassadar_, depends when exactly the crash happens, but yeah
<tassadar_> that seems a bit odd, I didn't think kernel has something like that built-in
<ogra> there is no ubuntu without initrd ;)
<ogra> no need for that in the kernel
<tassadar_> well kernel does this if process with PID 1 crashes, there is nowhere else to go
<ogra> right
<tassadar_> (or, can't be found)
<ogra> it would do that for /init .inside the initrd
<ogra> but doesnt do that for /sbin/init of the rootfs
<ogra> tassadar_, what massively bothers me that the same thing just works on a galaxy nexus but doesnt on the nexus7
<ogra> same rootfs and initrd
<tassadar_> maybe something wrong with kernel config? you'll need to get the log out anyway thouhg
<tassadar_> I saw some info echos in ubuntu's init script, where does that go?
<igorazevedo> hi guys, can ubuntu touch apps be made using vala?
<ogra> tassadar_, /dev/console ...
<slangasek> ogra, sergiusens: hey, so is there any work yet to make phablet-tools work with the saucy images on cdimage.u.c?  It seems http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch/daily-preinstalled/current/ doesn't have the full set of files that phablet-flash looks for
<sergiusens> slangasek: I have a bluepring for that one... will land tomorrow if everything gets approved
<ogra> slangasek, no, these saucy images arent really enduser friendly yet
<ogra> slangasek, there are still to many issues with the flipped container images (which these are) ... tomorrow we will start to build jenkins saucy images in parallel so endusers have something while we all fix the flipped images
<slangasek> ogra: so the move to cdimage is still blocking on the container flip?
<ogra> slangasek, i dont have the time to re-implement non flipped images in parallell and at the same time work on the flipped ones
<slangasek> ogra: ok, so what are the remaining issues with the flipped images?
<ogra> jenkins seemed like a good compromise for a two week thing
<slangasek> two weeks is a really long time
<slangasek> how can we help you get the container flip done sooner?
<ogra> slangasek, well, currently i can get the nexus7 to run run-init on the bindmount
<ogra> generally the platform api likely needs to learn about how to even run apps in the new model
<ogra> i can start apps but end with a white screen
<ogra> then we need to make sure device access across the containers works
<ogra> so that rild and friends are still able to work
<ogra> (rild is the bit caring for calls and completely closed)
<ogra> slangasek, if you want you can install the cdimage image on a gnex ... manually
<ogra> just not with phablet-flash
<slangasek> ogra: so, what would the manual process be?
<slangasek> ogra: first use phablet-flash to install the current raring image, then manually flash the bits from cdimage?
<ogra> slangasek, well, you only need the raring bootstrapping ... if you have the partitions and recovery you are good
<ogra> download the armhf.zip file ... download the armel+$yourdevice.zip file
<slangasek> ogra: ok - I guess my question was, is there anything else I need from jenkins for saucy support, or can I just use whatever phablet-flash has given me so far, then overlay the two images
<ogra> boot the device into recovery
<ogra> adb push /path/to/armel.zip /sdcard/autodeploy.zip && adb reboot recovery
<ogra> once it rebooted, remove the battery (it triesd to boot into something nonexistent here ... )
<ogra> then repeat the adb dance with the armhf
<ogra> on nexy boot you end up with a black screen and adb access
<slangasek> ok
<ogra> apply that change in /usr/bin/ubuntu-session https://code.launchpad.net/~ogra/session-manager/fix-oom_adj/+merge/166975
<ogra> and on next boot you get the phone shell
<ogra> (i would have uploaded that to saucy to fix it ... but i think we should first discuss the name ... i didtn really want to call it ubuntu-session)
<ogra> slangasek, oh, well, the jenkins sucy images will just come out under ubuntu-touch-preview and phablet-flash will re-grow the -l (latest) argument if i understood sergiusens right
<sergiusens> ogra: ubuntu-session wasn't supposed to go into saucy
<ogra> well, we will have to start our session bits somehow
<ogra> and nobody works on the upstart porting yet
<ogra> so why not have it in saucy
<ogra> (but probably as ubuntu-touch-session)
<sergiusens> ogra: ack... do we have an item to move most of this to upstart?
<sergiusens> ogra: I'm thinking we will have to have the PX env var picked up from somewhere sitll
<ogra> not really, i have it on my whiteboard on the wall and wanted to attack it once the containers work on all devices
<ogra> right
<ogra> we will just use the user session support from upstart
<ogra> and have the PX stuff in the phone shell job i guess
<simonleb> im asking when will be relased the day usable beta
<ogra> rsalveti, FYI, the old kernel shows the same issue
<ogra> i wonder if we miss anything that makes upstart work
<rsalveti> ogra: well, good and bad then =\
<krabador> ogra, what about calls/sms on porting ?
<ogra> yeah
<stgraber> ogra: what's broken with kernel/upstart?
<ogra> stgraber, well, my init dies on the nexus7
<ogra> with the flipped container
<ogra> works fine on the gnex
<ogra> i'm slowly running out of ideas ... i see the mounts are fine but right after or at run-init i get the "kernel panic... attempting to kill init" and a reboot
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> i could try the quantal nexus7 desktop kernel ...  havent tried that one yet
<stgraber> ogra: just a thought, from the initramfs, try running: init --user
<ogra> i cant usi it interactively
<stgraber> hopefully that'll let you see where upstart fails to start without actually running it as PID1
<ogra> i dont think it even comes up
<rsalveti> ogra: tries the desktop kernel, maybe we're missing a config or such
<ogra> yeah, thats what i suspect
<ogra> i havent heard from other devices yet though
<ogra> i dont know if it isnt probably just working because it is a maguro, who knows
<stgraber> I can try on mako
<ogra> that would be helpfu;l
<ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch/daily-preinstalled/current/
<ogra> grab the armel+mako.zip  and the armhf.zip at the bottom
<rsalveti> ogra: can't we get some sort of usb-serial with grouper?
<ogra> flash the armel one first, then the armhf one
<rsalveti> so we can try grabbing the trace log
<rsalveti> mako should probably just work
<ogra> rsalveti, yes, thats for tomorrow if i still didnt get anywhere
<ogra> rsalveti, thats what i thought about grouper as well :P
<rsalveti> well, but we got it to work with mako already
<rsalveti> nobody tried grouper before :-)
<ogra> err
<ogra> Linux version 3.1.10-g06b7e9c (ubuntu@ps-android-precise-server-amd64-smp-2) (gcc version 4.6.x-google 20120106 (prerelease) (GCC) ) #1 SMP PREEMPT Thu Apr 18 08:36:34 UTC 2013
 * ogra scratches head
<ogra> thats from the desktop bootimg ...
<ogra> oh, hehe
<ogra> extrachted the wrong one
<ogra> rsalveti, hmm, ok, the raring desktop kernel seems to go further, but not much
<ogra> hmm, same issue
<ogra> it just blanks the screen during initramfs
<stgraber> ogra: flashed the new rootfs + armel+mako zip and then fastboot flash the bootimg-mako. My phone boots properly and the Android container is running.
<ogra> phew
<ogra> so its grouper
<stgraber> ogra: only problem I see is that I can't start the shell from the phablet user but that's another issue
<stgraber> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5730295/ if someone cares
<ogra> stgraber, https://code.launchpad.net/~ogra/session-manager/fix-oom_adj/+merge/166975
<ogra> do that change and you get the shell on boot
<ogra> (at least you should, it might be that i'm missing a device for mako in the lxc upstart job)
<stgraber> ogra: root@android:/ # initctl list | grep ubuntu-ses
<stgraber> ubuntu-session start/running, process 1280
<stgraber> but no shell
<ogra> did you apply the fix above ?
<stgraber> yep
<ogra> oh
<ogra> is surfaceflinger running ?
<stgraber> yep
<ogra> hmm, then it is likely device permissions
<stgraber> ogra: yeah, it's. chmod 666 on /dev/fb0 and /dev/kgsl-3d0 did the trick
<ogra> fb0 shouldnt be necessary
<ogra> i'll add it to the lxc job though
<stgraber> ogra: yeah, not sure about fb0, I just did that one too as I remember seeing it on some strace a few days ago. I'm pretty sure we need kgsl-3d0 though and it was 600 root:root
 * ogra would love to just ignore grouper ... but then i know that most of our devs have it 
<ogra> stgraber, could you try without fb0 ?
<stgraber> sure, 1sec
<stgraber> ogra: confirmed, only kgsl is needed
<ogra> aweesome, will add it to the upstart job then
<ogra> i guess in the end we will ship a gigantic udev rule for all these possible device :P
<stgraber> are there any other kind of udev rules? :)
<morphis> ogra: so the android lxc container is already alive in the saucy images?
<stgraber> for some definition of alive, yes ;)
<morphis> :)
<morphis> but still no udev on ubuntu site?
<ogra> there should be udev
<morphis> ok
<ogra> feel free to grab the image if you have a mako or maguro
<morphis> so you create a symlink between the /dev on android site and the one on ubuntu site to share for example /dev/sockets?
<morphis> ogra: will do
<stgraber> ogra: nope, it's still disabled here (/etc/init/udev.override)
<morphis> maguro only here
<ogra> stgraber, ah, we need to drop that
<stgraber> morphis: nope, you just let both ueventd and udev create the same devices each in its own namespace
<ogra> right
<stgraber> morphis: as long as the type/major/minor match between the two /dev, you'll have access to the same device
<ogra> you need to know how either side calls them to get the permissions in sync though
<stgraber> so no need to do symlinks/bind-mounts or other tricks for those we have uevents for, we only need to manually create those that do not emit uevents (if any)
<morphis> stgraber: yes, I mean for example /dev/socket/rild which is created not by ueventd but by android init
<ogra> i guess that and getting the platform-api fixed will be our big challenge with the flip
<rsalveti> morphis: that will need to be done separately I'd guess
<morphis> as this is needed for example for ofono to talk with rild
<rsalveti> but yeah, we're not linking the paths there yet
<morphis> rsalveti: ok
<stgraber> morphis: right, any manual mknod done in android will need to be replicated in Ubuntu, either through our own init scripts or through bind-mount of a whole directory if easier
<morphis> atm I can only think of /dev/sockets which is needed
<rsalveti> yeah, I believe so
<morphis> maybe access to the propertyservice would be nice
<stgraber> in my tests last week I noticed some stuff trying to access /dev/alog, so I had that directory bind-mounted too. Not sure we actually need it though
<stgraber> (might be handy to have adbd fetch the logs I guess)
<ogra> the lxc paxckage ships a udev rule already
<ogra> for /dev/alog
<stgraber> ah cool, so we just need to make udev work then ;)
<ogra> i wanted to move the other chmods from the upstart job too
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> that comes from the ubuntu-session package as well
<stgraber> anyway, I'm out for a while now, very late lunch break here, ttyl
<ogra> i guess getting that into the archive should be our first step
<ogra> yeah, i'll end my day soon
 * ogra re-flashes his grouper from scratch
<rsalveti> morphis: you said there's a socket for property as well
<morphis> yes
<rsalveti> morphis: we might want to hook that into hybris in some way
<morphis> /dev/socket/propertyservice afaik
<rsalveti> cool
<morphis> rsalveti: yes, Stskeeps and me already had this idea too
<morphis> but it is ro
<rsalveti> oh, right
<morphis> for rw we need th share memory area too
<rsalveti> would help at least to probe the variables there
<morphis> which we only get afaik if we're started by the android init daemon
<morphis> yes
<morphis> but for example for setting the usb mode it would be nice to have a setprop utility even in the glibc environment
<rsalveti> indeed
<ogra> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# lxc-info -n android
<ogra> state:   RUNNING
<ogra> pid:       464
<ogra> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# ls /proc/464/root/dev/socket/
<ogra> adbd  installd	property_service  rild	rild-debug
<ogra> ...
<ogra> that should be easy to script
<rsalveti> right, we'd only need to bind mount the socket dir there
<morphis> yes
<ogra> morphis, 90% of the getprop bits can be done with echo in sysfs
<rsalveti> morphis: we need to think more about the property system as well, might make sense to hook that up in upstart itself somehow
<morphis> ogra: yes, but it would be easier to have it once scripted on the android site
<rsalveti> or provide it via scrips or such for others to use
<morphis> ogra: as every device has it's own set of id's to set for the various gadget modes
<ogra> for now we cant even enter the container
<morphis> ok, thats more important :)
<ogra> i mean you can chroot into the /proc node ... but that doesnt really get you a full set
<morphis> rsalveti: for the first we need the ro only in libhybris so be sure we provide all needed properties to the libs we're accessing
<ogra> and lxc-console kind of expects a getty
<morphis> as atm it's only using /system/default.prop
<morphis> ogra: yeah, getting getty into android :)
<ogra> busybox would do
<morphis> yes
<ogra> i guess thats the better way ... since it can also provide all other missing commands in case we find any
<rsalveti> morphis: right
<morphis> rsalveti: I already have some code for this lurking around somewhere
<cri> hi
<cri> ubuntu touch in p3100 function 3g is call phone?
<rsalveti> morphis: cool, can give it a shot later as well
<rsalveti> ogra: I do have terminal with nexus 4 (using uart)
<Dubstar_04> how can i control the icon size of a ListItem.Subtitled?
<rsalveti> ogra: but didn't investigate how that's actually called
<ogra> rsalveti,  wrt getty you mean ?
<rsalveti> ogra: yeah
<ogra> well, i want lxc-console to work
<ogra> so you can actually chroot
<Dubstar_04> Any QML guys in?
<cri> ubuntu touch functionin the samsung tab2 p3100?
 * snwh is away: Away
 * snwh is back (gone 00:00:01)
<ogra> !devices |cri
<ubot5> cri: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<ogra> cri, see the wikipage
<cri>  Cellular Radio
<cri> 	
<cri> Being worked on by Ubuntu devs.
<cri> -.-
<simond> is the keyboard a know problem on the galaxy nexus
<balloons> mhall119, I want nice syntax highlighting for qtcreator for python.. I added the syntax file, but it doesn't seem to give me highlighting :-(
<mhall119> I get some basic highlighting already, wat file did you add?
<balloons> autopilot
<mhall119> "I  added the syntax file
<mhall119> "
<ogra> rsalveti, [    5.485081] Warning: unable to open an initial console. .... hmm, i wonder if thats my issue with grouper
<mhall119> was the file I was asking about
<balloons> ahh, http://qihome.org/qiliang/2012/01/09/more-syntax-highlight-files-for-qt-creator/
<ogra> it doesnt fail there though
<ogra> only later in run-init
<mhall119> ogra: what grouper issue are you referring to?
<rsalveti> ogra: hm, wonder how it works with the desktop version
<ogra> mhall119, grouper being the only arch not working in the new world order
<balloons> mhall119, open a *.py file.. it should prompt you and ask if you want to get a syntax highlighter for it
<ogra> mhall119, i.e. after the container flip
<ogra> rsalveti, it uses fbcon there .... but the desktop kernel didnt work either here
<mhall119> balloons: doesn't prompt me, and I don't recall it ever doing that, but maybe it did a long time ago
<balloons> mhall119, you have highlighting?
<rsalveti> ogra: that's weird
<ogra> yup
<balloons> it's under options;text editor;generic highlighter
<mhall119> balloons: yup
<ogra> rsalveti, and i tried all i could ...  i'll try a kernel with usb serial tomorrow
<ogra> but even that will only tell me the same
<balloons> mhall119, kk.. it just hate sm
<mhall119> balloons: ah, highlighting is provided by Kate, maybe I had installed a python syntax on that a long, long time ago
<ogra> for some reason upstart doesnt get along with that arch
<rsalveti> ogra: well, you might be able to get more from your kernel there
<rsalveti> ogra: would be nice to grab the kernel trace at least
<ogra> well, i have the oops here
<ogra> but that wont help much i guess
<ogra> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5730485/ is dmesg if anyone is intrested
<ogra> (most of it at least)
<Dubstar_04> mhall119: do you know if its possible to control the icon size on a ListItem.Subtitled?
<mhall119> Dubstar_04: yes, it is, let me find you an example
<Dubstar_04> great. I have made my own delegate that replicates the ubuntu.components but its a waste really if i can use the standard components
<mhall119> Dubstar_04: http://mhall119.com/2013/04/building-an-ubuntu-sdk-app-rev-3/ scroll down to the "Visual Tweaks" header
<ogra> sergiusens, http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch-preview/raring/monthly-05/ for you with flowers :)
<ogra> pmcgowan_, ^^^
<pmcgowan_> w00t
<sergiusens> ogra: could care less, I'm on saucy ;-)
<sergiusens> lol
<sergiusens> thanks :-d
<pmcgowan_> thats so last week
<ogra> haha
<Dubstar_04> mhall: thanks for the link, it doesnt seem to work for me. I am trying to display non-square images from movie posters if i use  __iconHeight: units.gu(10)
<Dubstar_04>     __iconWidth: units.gu(5), it still shows a square image or scales the images based on the amount of text in the subtitle
<ogra> yeah, saucy is today, but you can even live in the future .... http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch/daily-preinstalled/current/has the flipped container images :)
<kgunn> ogra rock on
<mhall119> Dubstar_04: ah, it might be because the image is being put into an UbuntuShape, which might always be squared
<ogra> kgunn, not working on nexus7 though, i hope you guys dont rely on exactly that arch
<Dubstar_04> mhall119: so in this case its best to use a custom delegate?
<kgunn> ogra no worries...we got a variety of devices on team
<ogra> good
<ogra> nexus4 is missing a fix i just uploaded ... galaxy nexus works but you need https://code.launchpad.net/~ogra/session-manager/fix-oom_adj/+merge/166975 to make the phone shlle come up
<ogra> *shell
<mhall119> Dubstar_04: might be, yeah
<Dubstar_04> mhall119: this is the result: https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-6Xlm-UCCJBw/Uaz4M4RVurI/AAAAAAAAHbw/aalMH2Qg_QE/w681-h551-no/Screenshot+from+2013-06-03+21%253A09%253A17.png
<Dubstar_04> heres the code: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5730527/
<mhall119> Dubstar_04: that first one looks like it has different height and width
<Dubstar_04> mhall119: the icon dimensions seem to be based on the amount of text in the subtitle
<morphis> narf, rsalveti: I was wrong, /dev/socket/property_service is w only and not r
<rsalveti> morphis: oh
<rsalveti> morphis: let me look at the init code
<morphis> rsalveti: https://code.google.com/p/android-source-browsing/source/browse/libc/bionic/system_properties.c?spec=svn.platform--bionic.0d787c1fa18c6a1f29ef9840e28a68cf077be1de&repo=platform--bionic&r=0d787c1fa18c6a1f29ef9840e28a68cf077be1de#257
<rsalveti> part of bionic? wtf
<morphis> yes
<morphis> thats the client site
<morphis> rsalveti: service site is here: https://android.googlesource.com/platform/system/core/+/master/init/property_service.c
<rsalveti> cool
<slangasek> ogra: ok, so I followed your instructions and on mako, I have ubuntu-session running but I still have a black screen; any hints?
<kenvandine> mhall119, thank you sooooo much for getting canonical-auth in the ppa... it's working great on my n7 :)
<mhall119> kenvandine: thanks aquarius too, there was very little I had to do
<slangasek> ogra: as for /proc/$$/oom_adj not being writable, there's a rather suspicious disconnect between the pids shown in 'ps' output, and the directories I find under /proc
<kenvandine> mhall119, i had started a QML UI for that and was going to just snag the .js files aquarius had for it
<kenvandine> but never finished it up
<kenvandine> now i never will... since we have something that works :)
<mhall119> kenvandine: it was a good use-case for shipping a native-looking HTML5 aqpp
<kenvandine> indeed
<kenvandine> and it does look native
<mhall119> with the css applied, yeah, and we'll see more of that in the future
<Dubstar_04> mhall119: This is the custom delegate: https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-vM5HRKv0ips/Uaz9gCACHAI/AAAAAAAAHcE/anmYpwNFef8/w441-h551-no/Screenshot+from+2013-06-03+21%253A32%253A38.png
<mhall119> Dubstar_04: looks much better that way
<Dubstar_04> mhall119: its a shame the ubuntu.components aren't more flexible
<mhall119> Dubstar_04: we're working on that, feel free to file bugs against ubuntu-ui-toolkit on Launchpad when you run into walls like this
<morphis> rsalveti: https://github.com/morphis/libhybris/commit/d52cb4ea040b8ba4b735fcb164958b52d7edadb0
<Dubstar_04> mhall119: bug filed.
<morphis> rsalveti: that is what I wrote some time ago
<rsalveti> let me check
<mhall119> kenvandine: the new powerd makes the power button responsive, but it still doesn't look like it completely turns of the LCD's backlight
<mhall119> it has a very faint, but noticable amount of glow
<rsalveti> morphis: that's nice
<morphis> just cleaned it up but did not tested it yet
<kenvandine> that isn't related to my fix :)
<mhall119> kenvandine: is it a known issue?
<rsalveti> we'd just need something to get the properties
<kenvandine> my fix just kept it from crashing if it didn't have a proximity sensor
<kenvandine> no idea
<mhall119> ok, thanks just the same
<kenvandine> mhall119, hmmm... mine seems to be cycling
<kenvandine> like the display is off
<rsalveti> morphis: looks good, can give that a try later today
<kenvandine> and every few seconds it gets a little brighter
<kenvandine> then darker again
<kenvandine> not sure if that is new behavior or not
<mhall119> it's new for me
<kenvandine> yet another bug :)
<mhall119> though I recall it happening when I used an older version of powerd from bzr
<mhall119> I assumed it was related
<mhall119> but now I'm thinking otherwise
<mhall119> I wonder if it's the new grouper Android bits
<mhall119> because it didn't happen on image build <=140
<kenvandine> perhaps
<kenvandine> i guess file a bug for that
<kenvandine> now that i've seen it... it's rather annoying :)
<mhall119> kenvandine: any idea how I can get some useful information to add to the bug?
<kenvandine> mhall119, nope... sorry
<kenvandine> i don't know much about powerd
<mhall119> ok, I'll file it and then maybe someone will tell me what extra info to gather
<kenvandine> just the fix for the crash was pretty obvious once i started bisecting it
<mhall119> kenvandine: can you attach your branch to https://bugs.launchpad.net/powerd/+bug/1186469
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1186469 in powerd "segfault on nexus 7" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<mhall119> I've updated it to Fix Committed already
<kenvandine> mhall119, oh... there was another bug filed
<kenvandine> mhall119, bug 1186706
<ubot5> bug 1186706 in touch-preview-images "Cannot suspend by pressed power button" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1186706
<kenvandine> i duped your's
<mhall119> oh?  Launchapd is usually good about telling me when I'm filing a duplicate
<kenvandine> different project
<mhall119> ChickenCutlass: https://bugs.launchpad.net/powerd/+bug/1187135 is my current problem
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1187135 in powerd "Screen doesn't fully turn off on Nexus 7" [Undecided,New]
<kenvandine> and your's was first
<mhall119> kenvandine: ^^ if you want to mark yourself as affected
<kenvandine> but i had referrenced that one in my branch
<kenvandine> sure
<slangasek> stgraber: which device have you been doing testing on wrt the container flip?
<stgraber> slangasek: nexus4 (mako)
<slangasek> stgraber: ok.  and it's working for you?  You get video out?
<stgraber> slangasek: ogra is having kernel/initrd problems with the nexus7
<slangasek> cat /home/phablet/.ubuntu-session/logs/maliit-server.log
<slangasek> WARNING: Cant find EGLConfig, returning null config
<slangasek> CRITICAL: loading  "libmaliit-keyboard-plugin.so"
<stgraber> slangasek: no, there's one small problem with it at the moment.
<stgraber> slangasek: chmod 666 /dev/kgsl-3d0
<stgraber> slangasek: restart ubuntu-session
<slangasek> ah
<slangasek> right, that's the thing you mentioned earlier
<stgraber> ogra fixed that in the archive an hour or so ago, so that's going to be in the next image
<slangasek> ok, cool
<slangasek> sweet, there it is
<slangasek> thank s:)
<rickspencer3> does it seem like it is taking ever longer to enable "developer mode"?
<stgraber> slangasek: note that at the moment it's not possible to start any app, but at least getting the shell running should make it easier for the right people to debug that
<mhall119> rickspencer3: I think it's installing more developer tools than it used to
<mhall119> used to be it justed installed openssh, I think
<slangasek> stgraber: I also don't see any wireless networks in the UI... makes it more difficult than anticipated to apt-get debugging tools on ;)
<stgraber> slangasek: ah yeah, that part is broken too, just use ifupdown
<slangasek> I don't want to use ifupdown to configure my wpa wifi ;)
 * slangasek implements apt-adb instead, because of course that's simpler
<slangasek> ;)
<stgraber> slangasek: actually, maybe it's just a matter of starting network-manager
<slangasek> hmm, any idea why that didn't auto-start?
<slangasek> still no network list, though
<rsalveti> I believe it might be started
<slangasek> it wasn't here
<rsalveti> but I know android has some specifics for wlan drivers and such
<stgraber> slangasek: well, udev is currently blacklisted, so I expect some other bits to be broken as a result of that
<rsalveti> weird
<rsalveti> oh, right
<slangasek> oh
<rsalveti> we need to remove that
<slangasek> what problems can I expect if I unblacklist udev?
<slangasek> because I would expect that to be a fairly important prereq for container flip
<rsalveti> but that would break the traditional image (without container flip)
<slangasek> right
<stgraber> starting it manually kills my adb connection. Haven't tried booting the phone with it enabled though, maybe that works
 * stgraber tries
<slangasek> heh, didn't just kill my connection here, it rebooted my device
<stgraber> stuck in a reboot loop here...
<slangasek> yep
<stgraber> right, so time to re-create the file from recovery :)
<slangasek> maybe I shouldn't have removed the .override for testing :D
<mhall119> what happened in builds 148 and 149?
<stgraber> slangasek: just do "echo manual > /data/ubuntu/etc/init/udev.override" over adb with the phone booted in recovery
<slangasek> stgraber: sure
<mhall119> sergiusens: are the terminal and file manager going to make it into raring images before we switch to saucy?
<rsalveti> mhall119: I don't think we started such builds
<slangasek> ....if I manage to get it out of the reboot loop
<rsalveti> sergiusens: should we include that?
<sergiusens> mhall119: they could ... they shouldn't from what we are supposed to be focusing on
<sergiusens> rsalveti: I guess so
<stgraber> slangasek: right, so spawning udevd itself isn't the problem, I suspect it's the following udevadm trigger that breaks the world
<rsalveti> would be useful for 3g data
<stgraber> slangasek: trying now with udevtrigger disabled
<rsalveti> sergiusens: did we land the fix nexus 7 related powerd fix?
<rsalveti> actually, did we find what was the issue there?
<stgraber> slangasek: right, booting with udev enabled, udevadm disabled, then running "udevadm trigger --action=add --subsystem-match=net" and finally starting network-manager gives me a working list of network
<mhall119> rsalveti: the segfaulting bug is fixed in lp:powerd
<rsalveti> don't know if mfisch knows as well
<rsalveti> mhall119: awesome
<rsalveti> sergiusens: let's do a release of that as well
<rsalveti> guess you're already taking care of that
<sergiusens> rsalveti: it's released (powerd)
<mfisch> I didnt know we had a segfault
<sergiusens> build 151 will have it
<rsalveti> sergiusens: great
<sergiusens> rsalveti: it was sensors related
<mhall119> mfisch: I pinged you about it over the weekend
<slangasek> stgraber: and, any idea what bit is causing the poweroff?
<stgraber> slangasek: nope, I'm assuming one of our udev rule is somehow causing a system crash, would have to go subsystem by subsystem until we find which
<slangasek> I was wondering if tailing the udev log over adb while running the trigger would tell us anything useful
<mhall119> sergiusens: rsalveti: 2 our of 3 reboots on my nexus 7, apps won't display and the OSK won't come up
<mhall119> what can I do to trace the problem down to file a bug?
<rsalveti> mhall119: the osk one is quite old actually
<rsalveti> the apps might be new
<mhall119> rsalveti: well they seem to go together
<mhall119> if I don't have OSK, I won't see the apps either
<rsalveti> ricmm might be able to help you on that
<rsalveti> ricmm: you got a 7 as well, right?
<mhall119> I get a white screen, and if I start to swipe-from-left to switch it'll suddenly show me the app's content for a few seconds, then it goes black
<mfisch> mhall119: sorry about that, I've been spending a lot of time outdoors on weekends
<rsalveti> it might be platform-api/ubuntu-session related
<mfisch> mhall119: officially I'm working on something else, but I'll help when I can
<mhall119> when I switch back to the apps lens, the running app thumbnail for it disappears
<mhall119> mfisch: kenvandine fixed the segfaulting
<mfisch> cool
<ricmm> rsalveti: reading
<mhall119> ricmm: let me know what I can do to track down the cause
<mfisch> sforshee: ^^^^ - there was a segfault and kenvandine fixed it, FYI
<slangasek> stgraber: last events before reboot (from udevadm monitor -e): http://paste.ubuntu.com/5730840/
<mhall119> ricmm: I'm currently in a boot that is experiencing this, so if there's something I can try I will
<mfisch> mhall119: lol, that wasn't my code ;)
 * mfisch eyeballs the sensor guys suspiciously
<ricmm> I'm the sensors guy
<stgraber> slangasek: odd, subsystem-match=firmware doesn't cause the reboot here
<mfisch> ricmm: ;)
<slangasek> stgraber: right, second attempt comes up with something completely different
<ricmm> ken hid the segfault and now im pushing something into the platform api to guard non existant sensors better
<stgraber> slangasek: I'm going through /sys/class trying to figure which one
<slangasek> stgraber: ok
<mfisch> ricmm: thats probably a better fix. was the fault platform specific?
<slangasek> stgraber: seems like a better approach
<ricmm> mfisch: the problem is the untested return of the proximity sensor getter
<ricmm> but the other helper functions would benefit from a guard in the platform API
<ricmm> if the client forgets to check the pointer
<mfisch> ricmm: got it. sforshee is out today and part of tomorrow IIRC, but I'll bring him up to speed when he's back
<mfisch> ricmm: I can do a review for you if needed
<stgraber> slangasek: confirmed that if I go through all of them I get the crash, now running a for loop which tries each and wait 5s, let's see where it reboots
<ricmm> mhall119: do you know of other people experiencing this issue?
<stgraber> slangasek: I'm affraid we've got some kind of race...
<jono> bfiller, hey
<jono> are you familiar with a bug where recieving a call has no audio?
<bfiller> jono: wassup
<jono> the call connects but I can't hear the other person
<stgraber> slangasek: "for dir in *; do echo $dir; udevadm trigger --subsystem-match=$dir; sleep 5; done" worked fine here
<bfiller> jono: haven't seen that one. have seen the one where you don't hear the ringtone but see the notification and can't answer a call
<stgraber> slangasek: "for dir in *; do echo $dir; udevadm trigger --subsystem-match=$dir; done" makes my phone reboot (when done after boot, doing it after the delayed one is fine apparently)
<jono> bfiller, I get the tone but when I answer, nothing
<bfiller> jono: which hardware?
<jono> bfiller, happened three times today for me
<jono> bfiller, Galaxy Nexus
<bfiller> jono: can the person on the other end hear you?
<jono> bfiller, not sure
<jono> will test with skype
<jono> one sec
<pmcgowan_> bfiller, I used to get that but not for some time, actually may be a nexus specific one
<bfiller> pmcgowan_: haven't had the one happen to me yet
<pmcgowan_> bfiller, back when I had a nexus the wrong numbers used to go that way
<pmcgowan_> cant recall it on the nexus 4
<jono> bfiller, just tested now via skype and it worked
<jono> odd
<pmcgowan_> jono, was the phone sleeping when the calls came in
<jono> pmcgowan_, yep, screen was off
<rsalveti> jono: mind changing the parameters for ofono in your /etc/init/ofono.conf?
<rsalveti> exec ofonod --noplugin=atmodem, to exec ofonod -d --noplugin=atmodem
<rsalveti> so we can have debug
<pmcgowan_> bfiller, evolution not automatically picking up my backup, probably need to kick it to know that addressbook exists
<jono> rsalveti, one sec, grabbing my USB cord
<rsalveti> then use it a bit more, and once you reach the problem, please save your /var/log/syslog somewhere
<bfiller> pmcgowan_: you copied the stuff back into .local/share/evolution?
<rsalveti> sergiusens: happroved https://code.launchpad.net/~saviq/unity/phablet.raring-backport-726/+merge/167085
<jono> rsalveti, I can't seem to edit text in my shell
<jono> in either nano or vi
<rsalveti> jono: weird, using it via adb?
<jono> rsalveti,
<rsalveti> vi should work
<jono> yeah
<jono> trying in regular terminal and not terminator
<rsalveti> mind trying via ssh?
<jono> might a weird VT mode
<rsalveti> yeah
<rsalveti> adb sets up some console stuff
<jono> rsalveti, yeah doesnt work
<jono> rsalveti, neither vi nor nano let me save the file
<jono> but no perm denied
<rsalveti> jono: weird, works fine here
<rsalveti> ssh should work better
<jono> rsalveti, just so I am clear, I am doing this:
<jono> adb root
<jono> adb shell
<jono> ubuntu_chroot shell
<jono> nano /etc/init/ofono.conf
<rsalveti> right, nano doesn't work as expected
<rsalveti> but vi does
<jono> rsalveti, how do I enter INSERT mode in vi?
<jono> pressing 'i' doesnt work
<rsalveti> jono: try insert
<jono> rsalveti, no luck
<rsalveti> jono: weird, try using vi via ssh (or just install vim, it should behave better)
<stgraber> jono: sed -i 's/ofonod/ofonod -d/' /etc/init/ofono.conf
<rsalveti> that as well
<jono> stgraber, wise :-)
<rsalveti> but check with vim as well
<jono> rsalveti, ok changed with sed
<rsalveti> wonder if that would work
<rsalveti> it works fine here
<jono> do I restart the service?
<rsalveti> jono: better restarting the phone
<stgraber> you won't be able to restart the service from adb as you're not in the right pid namespace, you could from ssh or just reboot the phone
<rsalveti> and the app might not necessarily work after restarting ofono
<coder543> if you've got ssh access, you should be able to mount a remote directory (in this case, on the phone) on your laptop/desktop via Nautilus over ssh protocol, targeting the phone. Then just edit it with gedit/something else. Right? Just an idea. Maybe it wouldn't work.
<jono> rsalveti, stgraber ok rebooting the device
<jono> rsalveti, now what do I do when the bug occurs?
<jono> is there a log somewhere?
<rsalveti> jono: save your /var/log/syslog somewhere, and email it to me
<jono> rsalveti, ok
<jono> hopefully I will see the bug occur again soon
<rsalveti> cool, that should tell what ofono is doing, and if it's indeed setting up the audio route correctly
<ricmm> rsalveti: I dont get why grouper would fail to register started apps
<ricmm> mm
<rsalveti> ricmm: no idea either
<rsalveti> ricmm: but it happens quite often actually
<ricmm> happens every time for me
<mhall119> ricmm: I haven't heard of anybody else with this problem, no
<rsalveti> ricmm: even better :-)
<ricmm> maybe only mhall119 has flashed grouper with 147 :)
<rsalveti> :-)
<rsalveti> what was the issue with powerd that was nexus 7 specific?
 * rsalveti branches trunk
<ricmm> nonexistant proximity sensor
<ricmm> no guards for it
<rsalveti> oh, ok
<rsalveti> so not related at all
<ricmm> no
<slangasek> stgraber: gah :/
<slangasek> stgraber: how about a bisect, running the for loop for only half the directories?
<mhall119> ricmm: it's been doing it to me for a while
<stgraber> slangasek: testing
<mhall119> since before 140 at least
<stgraber> slangasek: making some progress, down to just a few possible subsystems
<ricmm> mhall119: thats a long while
<stgraber> slangasek: down to 2
<slangasek> stgraber: which two?
<stgraber> slangasek: udc and video4linux
<slangasek> hmm, what's udc?
<mhall119> yeah, I would always tell myself "I need to file a bug about this, but first let me reboot until my tablet is usable again", then 5 minutes later "Sweet, it's working again, time to go on Reddit" and bug filing never happens :(
<stgraber> slangasek: hmm, actually, the issue is video4linux
<stgraber> slangasek: it's just that apparently depending on what you trigger before it, it doesn't make the phone reboot
<stgraber> slangasek: if you just do a clean boot, start udev and do "udevadm trigger --subsystem-match=video4linux" you'll get the reboot
<mhall119> speaking of N7 stuff not working, is there any work being done to get the camera and audio to work?
<rsalveti> mhall119: camera not sure, audio it seems to be missing a default mixer config
<rsalveti> diwic was looking into it
<mhall119> oh is that all?  I thought it was going to be some driver thing
<abonilla> Hi, did anyone manage to get the software in a HTC Desire?
<mhall119> !devices | abonilla
<ubot5> abonilla: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<mhall119> if it's on that list, somebody is going something with it, if it's not, then you get to be first :)
<stgraber> slangasek: removing 60-persistent-v4l.rules appears to prevent the reboot
<abonilla> mhall119: the instructions are there but not clear. ie. does not say which image/files.
<stgraber> slangasek: which is weird considering that all it does is create a bunch of symlinks
<slangasek> stgraber: that's not all it does, it also calls v4l_id
<slangasek> stgraber: /lib/udev/v4l_id /dev/video39 > triggered an instant reboot here
<stgraber> slangasek: ok, so it's some kind of kernel/hardware bug then which triggers the reboot when accessing some properties
<slangasek> stgraber: seems so.  can you file a bug on the kernel for this?
<slangasek> hmm, and it is indeed not 100% reproducible... this time, v4l_id succeeds on all the nodes
<stgraber> slangasek: yep, I'll file a bug, sadly can't provide a whole bunch of debug info
<rsalveti> stgraber: slangasek: is that mako specific?
<rsalveti> or can you also reproduce with maguro/grouper/manta?
<stgraber> rsalveti: can't boot grouper at this point, so hard to tell
<stgraber> and I don't have grouper or manta
<rsalveti> right, ok
<rsalveti> but it's probably mako specific
<slangasek> it probably is, yes
<stgraber> so that's odd, basically opening the file after starting udev + udevtrigger causes the reboot. Doing so without udev is fine
<slangasek> I could check grouper later, but that requires getting it past the non-booting point where others have already gotten stuck
<slangasek> so, how should we work around this?  the rootfs is device-independent, right?
<ricmm> I got a grouper on which I'm testing some stuff right now
<ricmm> rsalveti: what do you need to try?
<slangasek> if there's a generic ubuntu-touch package, we could put a dpkg-divert in place on the .rules to keep them from being run; that will affect all devices, but that's probably an ok stopgap if it lets us get to the point of turning udev on
<slangasek> ricmm: step 1) run udev
<mhall119> abonilla: did you go to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices/bravo ?
<mhall119> it has a link to an XDA forum thread that has the images
<stgraber> slangasek: bug 1187189
<ubot5> bug 1187189 in linux-mako (Ubuntu) "Kernel crash and reboot when accessing video device" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1187189
<slangasek> stgraber: great, thanks
<ricmm> slangasek: no step2? :)
<slangasek> ricmm: step 2) run 'udevadm trigger'
<slangasek> ricmm: (with the full set of Ubuntu udev rules - and in particular, /lib/udev/rules.d/60-persistent-v4l.rules)
<abonilla> mhall119: I did but mentions to download an Desire image and the site has many different images... I'll see..
<mhall119> abonilla: oh, then you'll need to get clarification from the XDA developer working on it
<abonilla> mhall119: is Ubuntu Touch aka "Ubuntu Phone"?
<slangasek> stgraber: so, I've enabled udevtrigger now after diverting the v4l rules; it no longer crashes, but I also no longer get any GUI
<stgraber> slangasek: I wonder if the udevadmtrigger is maybe resetting some permissions that ogra hardcoded in his scripts
<slangasek> stgraber: possibly.  Any idea which scripts?
<stgraber> slangasek: try: chmod 666 /dev/pvrsrvkm /dev/tiler /dev/binder /dev/ion /dev/kgsl-3d0
<stgraber> slangasek: from /etc/init/lxc-android-config.conf
<slangasek> ok... as soon as the device comes back up again (what's taking it so long?) I will
<mhall119> abonilla: it's the software for phone and tablet, yes
<slangasek> stgraber: well, heh; trying to stop and restart the lxc container also caused a phone reboot, this time with the v4l rules diverted
<stgraber> slangasek: yeah, I noticed that before, I assumed that some device didn't like seeing its firmware loaded twice or something along those lines
<abonilla> OK, HTC Desire. FAIL.
#ubuntu-touch 2013-06-04
<compuspital> hello everyone
<compuspital> I have a few questions about touch, I finally got a tablet with Ubuntu Touch
<compuspital> I was wandering how do I go about updating it?
<unioah1> what do you want to update? the file system?
<unioah1> There isn't a apt-get in it. So I guess you have to download a new one every time.
<bensocket> hi
<bensocket> could anybody tell wat kind of tablet i can put on ubuntu touch ? not including nexas 10  thanks
<unioah1> One you can get kernel and Andriod source.
<bensocket> ok
<bensocket> ok?
<compuspital> I was just curious about updating the software from quantal to raring.
<mhall119> compuspital: phablet-flash will get you the raring image
<mhall119> but you might loose what's in /home/phablet coming from quantal
<mhall119> but once you're on the latest images, phablet-flash preserves /home/phablet/
<compuspital> okay even if i'm not running a nexus?
<mhall119> no, sorry, phablet-flash only works for nexus devices
<compuspital> Hello Guys I just got my first Nexus 7 by exchanging the old device I had Galaxy Tab2 I will run nothing but Ubuntu on my devices
<spammer> niggers
<Mirv> compuspital: nexus7 is excellent for running Ubuntu :)
<zsombi> good morning
<compuspital> is it running on mir yet?
<compuspital> thank you Mirv for the advice
<Mirv> mir usage is still opt-in, not by default yet
<dholbach> good morning
<oSoMoN> didrocks: hey, when you have a moment, could you please have a second look at https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/webbrowser-app/i18n-pot-target/+merge/164937 ? I believe Iâve addressed all the comments.
<didrocks> oSoMoN: not sure today, deploying otto + everything on saucy, mind if it's only tomorrow maybe?
<oSoMoN> didrocks: sure, no urgency
<didrocks> oSoMoN: thanks! will have a lookg :)
<didrocks> loog*
<didrocks> look*
<oSoMoN> thanks :)
<didrocks> and take coffeeâ¦
<didrocks> :p
<oSoMoN> too much coffee might deteriorate your typing instead of improving itâ¦
<didrocks> that's a possibility, indeed :)
<user82> popey, have you tested 3g data yet?
<asac> sforshee: hey ... todays phablet-flashed image doesnt have a snappy on/off experience anymore?
<asac> did it never land?
<seb128> rsalveti, still there?
<dholbach> user82, as far as I know is popey on holidays
<user82> ok thanks dholbach
<diplo> Yep, cruising along a canal at the moment I believe. Has been posting pics from there, not sure if it's from ubuntu phone though
<diplo> Anyone know of an example of a touch app using oauth ? Wanted to try my first app, was going to try interfacing with goodreads.com
<simosays> hi all
<simosays> would anyone know details about ubuntu touch builds?
<simosays> I am trying to port touch for samsung tab 2, but having some issues when ubuntu should startup
<simosays> if i install raring it will start boot cycle, saucy runs without any booting and starts ubuntuappmanager but no any visible screen
<dholbach> sergiusens, rsalveti: so the gerrit instance has been talked about quite a bit - and I checked in RT and there seems to be no request for an instance in there (asking because of https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-1305-touch-porting)
<dholbach> do you remember where this was being discussed in the past?
<harisha> Hello All, I have a query on window management in Ubuntu Touch
<harisha> Basically I need to switch between 2 QML windows, In Ubuntu Desktop there is utility called "wmctrl", is there equivalent library or commands available on ubuntu touch?
<om26er> is there a way to turn on the device screen somehow without pressing the power button ?
<om26er> sergiusens, ^
<sil2100> oSoMoN: ping!
<oSoMoN> sil2100: pong
<sil2100> oSoMoN: so, it seems that we have 3 new AP test failures for webbrowser nowadays
<sil2100> oSoMoN: could you take a look if these are real failures?
<sil2100> oSoMoN: thanks!
<penk> mhall119: ping
<asac> ogra: is there a unity-desktop image for ARM still? e.g. do we rely on X for anything on ARM?
<ogra> asac, sure, the panda desktop image
<asac> do we want to keep that working?
<asac> or break it?
<ogra> we need to QA the apps so they work once convergence happens
<asac> ok. is that the only device we have X drivers for>?
<ogra> we want to hkeep it until we can test desktop on converged arm
<asac> seb128: ^^
<ogra> we have drivers for the nexus7
<seb128> asac, yes?
<asac> ogra: do we have enginereing contacts to get new drivers?
<ogra> but that would mean two kernels for the same device
<asac> seb128: this is about a potential blocker to remember for the X update
<ogra> asac, no upfdate
<asac> ogra: never?
<ogra> asac, we cant upgrade PVR
<seb128> asac, that's already sorted out, we will have an xserver with the video abi break reverted for the panda
<ogra> and it was agreed that we wont upgrad X this cycle
<asac> sure... i am not very bullish on the future of panda :)
<seb128> asac, that package will not get new features and stuff but it's good enough for what we need
<asac> seb128: ok. can we include that in testing?
<ogra> for armhf that is
<seb128> asac, sure
<asac> seb128: ok. please add it to a "pre-sign off blueprint" or whatever :)
<asac> thanks
<seb128> asac, I'm adding it to my list
<seb128> yw
<asac> seb128: can you remember nexus7 too?
<asac> i think thats more worthwhile to look at than panda to be honest
<asac> :)
<seb128> I though we stopped desktop images for the nexus?
<seb128> ogra, ^
<ogra> so why the heck can i not write to /proc/self/oom_adj even though my roofs is the first OS and not in a container
 * ogra doesnt get that
<asac> kernel doesnt have that feature? apparmore doesnt like you?
<ogra> asac, i'm not sure Qa has actually tests running, but i know there are automated tests for panda
<seb128> asac, I think the problem with the nexus is that the kernel for ubuntu-touch and desktop are incompatible, so if we want a working traditional desktop there we need an extra kernel flavor
<ogra> *has actually nexus7 tests running
<asac> seb128: we want a convergence target
<ogra> asac, right, what seb128 said
<asac> panda is a very bad one :)
<seb128> asac, right, that's not going to have old xorg stack though, it's going to have Mir+xorg-mir
<ogra> a) mgmt *strongly* insisted that we need to make use of the pandas
<asac> seems N7 wouldnt work anyway
<ogra> b) nexus7 needs an extra kernel flavour with hacks to make input devices work
<ogra> and c) it might need extra work to port the QA tests from panda to n7
<ogra> keeping panda is the path of least resistance
<asac> seb128: do we ahve anything that could be used for mir+xorg?
<seb128> asac, we should be able to test on the nexus7, since we have drivers for that, when we get a working Mir+xorg-mir
<seb128> asac, but mir-xorg-mir is not there yet
 * ogra thinks mir+xorg is rather for 14.04
<om26er> How can I change the auto screen turn off timeout ?
<ogra> there was a way to inhibit powerd
<ogra> ask mfisch
<om26er> mfisch, hey! ^
<ogra> (probably powerd has a --help option ...)
<netcurli> https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone/msg02051.html
<om26er> netcurli, thanks
<ogra> root@android:/ # su - phablet
<ogra> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ echo -10 >/proc/self/oom_adj
<ogra> -su: echo: write error: Permission denied
<ogra> stgraber, ^^^ any idea why i see this outside of the container ?
<asac> ogra: remember 14.04 is our convergence release :)
<ogra> yes
 * asac not convinced that panda is a convergence candidate target
<asac> feels we can kill it :)
<ogra> it isnt at all
<asac> needs more inpt
<asac> input
<ogra> we need to test the X apps
<asac> ogra: ok. well you said we needed it for convergence story
<ogra> and we wont have XMir in 13.10
<ogra> we need to make sure the *apps* themselves work
<ogra> no matter under which display system they run
<asac> Feels like that "make sure the apps work" needs to be redone on xmir anyway
<ogra> after we have convergence we can kill the native X stuff
<asac> so not sure how much we shouild invest to make them work now
<ogra> you want to be sure LibO works
<asac> let me do more talking :)
<ogra> i.e. there are no bugs in it
<ogra> and panda is the only setup we can test that with atm
<asac> ogra: the majority of stuff is already tested on x86 i think... what is left is the aprt that depends on the stuff that is going to be replaced anyway
<asac> thats my current feeling... but well :)
<ogra> as soon as we have XMir we can do the testing with that
<asac> for one it seem sto be very cost freiendly to keep panda working
<asac> as seb128 said :)
<asac> so its not a real thing to action on
<ogra> we will kill panda with the 14.04 circle, thats definitely planned
<ogra> until then we need to make sure there are no arch specific bugs  in appss
<ogra> and i.e. LibO is a typical candidate for arch specific breakage ... as firefox  or TB are
<ogra> (or chromium ... )
<asac> ogra: lib0?
<asac> whats that?
<ogra> LibreOffice
 * ogra sighs 
<asac> ogra: dont be sad
<ogra> i bet the not starting of apps in the flipped container is somehow realted to not being able to write to /proc
<ogra> asac, well, i cant really find the issue with the apps not starting in the flipped images
<asac> you have an strace?
<ogra> well, i cant strace the android container (since i cant access it)
<asac> guess that might reveal something
<asac> thought you want to start the apps in the ubuntu container
<asac> o rrather on ubuntu system
<asac> ogra: any idea if chicken is out today?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> he didnt say he would be
<asac> hmmm
<asac> guess i will drag someone else into the management meeting then :)
<pmcgowan> asac, its 8am here, folks usually start 8:30 or 9
<om26er> Saviq, Hey! How can I force the qml-phone-shell to not restart itself on kill ?
<Saviq> om26er, edit /etc/device-services
<Kaleo_> ricmm: do you have an API that tells the app that it's about to quit?
<pmcgowan> sergiusens, hey
<simosays> hi all, would you have any suggestion where to find reason why screen is blank but ubuntuappmanager and surfaceflinger are running?
<simosays> logcat does not give any "big" faults, just skipping libc.so and error opening trace file
<ogra> slangasek, i saw your discussion in the #distro backlog, i'd be happy for any suggestion how to do the rootfs mounting differently (as long as the result is identical to what we have now)
<ogra> slangasek, nothing in the current flipped images is set in stone ...
<ogra> asac, http://paste.ubuntu.com/5732441/ thats an strace from running a qml app from cmdline ... i dont really see anything in there (except that it waits forever to get a surface in the end)
<asac> ogra: do i have that app also on the current phablet image?
<asac> e.g. can i run that in ubuntu_chroot?
<asac> hmm
<asac> ogra: any idea what the problem is if i get " adb root -> insufficient privileges"?
<asac> err "insufficient permissions for device"
<ogra> adb kill-server && sudo adb start-server
<ogra> try that
<asac> still same :/
<asac> odd
<asac> i cannot even do shell anymore
<seb128> asac, adb root
<seb128> ups
<seb128> sorry I misread ;-)
<pmcgowan> asac, try to unplug and replug
<pmcgowan> seems adb gets confused sometimes
<ogra> if you are not on saucy, make sure to have the latest android-tools-adb package from the ppa
<asac> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5732477/
<ogra> it ships the proper udev rules
<asac> ok let me unplug, kill, plug, start
<ogra> asac,
<ogra> no, it should have been "sudo adb start-server"
<asac> really?
<ogra> and stop advertising these illegal downloads :P
<asac> i dont think i needed that last time
<pmcgowan> you should not need that
<asac> ogra: :)
<pmcgowan> should not need to restart at all
<ogra> you shouldnt if you have the udev rules
<pmcgowan> right
<asac> ok let me check
<ogra> if you use adb from the archive it doesnt have them in pre-saucy
<asac> guess didnt do that here
<asac> i have saucy
<ogra> ah, that should ship the rules
<asac> i have rules, maybe it didnt pick it up
<ogra> hmm, we should ship override files for all ttyX.conf jobs
<ogra> asac, oh, and btw: qmlscene --desktop_file_hint=/usr/share/applications/ubuntu-calculator-app.desktop /usr/share/ubuntu-calculator-app/ubuntu-calculator-app.qml
<ogra> thats trhe command i ran
<ogra> (prefixed with strace indeed)
<asac> ok the device adb was busted
<asac> needed to reboot device :/
<asac> not sure if you have seen that before
<ogra> if i would i wouldnt care :)
<ogra> we dont use the android adbd in the flipped container
<asac> ogra: so which user do we run stuff under in phablet?
<ogra> we have our own ... and that works stable
<asac> phablet?
<ogra> su - phablet
<ogra> and then run the above
<ogra> that should start the app "minimized" and you shoould be able to tap it to fullscreen
<ogra> here i get a black screen then it starts
<RedPandaFox> Anyone had any luck getting touch running on a HTC Sensation?
<ogra> RedPandaFox, check trhe devices wikipage
<ogra> !devices
<ubot5> You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<stgraber> ogra: if I'm reading the kernel code correctly, you're not allowed to set oom_score_adj (new name for oom_adj) to a value lower than that of your parent (which becomes your minimum value at fork time)
<stgraber> ogra: that's unless you're root or have CAP_SYS_RESOURCE
<ogra> stgraber, my parent is upstart
<ogra> hmm, which is using 0
<stgraber> ogra: right, which has the standard score of 0, so you can't go any lower than that
<RedPandaFox> ogra, yeah I have seen that. I was just thinking someone may have had some experience. I hoped someone had expanded on a build by LaidbackNikez on XDA
<ogra> stgraber, thanks, didnt know that
<asac> ogra: so in the trace you gave me the /dev/alog/ ERRORS are probably one symptom
<asac> i dont see the same errors here
<ogra> so we might grant the phablet user CAP_SYS_RESOURCE
<stgraber> yeah, init doesn't need a special score as it'd mean anyone can do rather bad rescoring. The kernel will never attempt to oom kill pid 1 anyway
<ogra> *need to
<stgraber> ogra: that or have a privileged (setuid) tool that sets the score. You really want to talk with the security team about this.
<ogra> asac, /dev/alog is fine here
<asac> ogra: your trace shows issues
<asac> can you post the URL again?
<stgraber> ogra: I have a feeling that CAP_SYS_RESOURCE may be bad enough that you might just as well run the shell as root if you do that...
<ogra> asac, http://paste.ubuntu.com/5732441/
<asac> open("/dev/alog/main", O_WRONLY)        = -1 EACCES (Permission denied)
<asac> open("/dev/alog/main", O_WRONLY|O_LARGEFILE) = -1 EACCES (Permission denied)
<asac> open("/dev/alog/radio", O_WRONLY|O_LARGEFILE) = -1 EACCES (Permission denied)
<asac> open("/dev/alog/events", O_WRONLY|O_LARGEFILE) = -1 EACCES (Permission denied)
<asac> open("/dev/alog/system", O_WRONLY|O_LARGEFILE) = -1 EACCES (Permission denied)
<asac> ...
<ogra> oh
<asac> here i get:
<asac> open("/dev/alog/main", O_WRONLY)        = 4
<asac> open("/dev/alog/main", O_WRONLY|O_LARGEFILE) = 5
<asac> open("/dev/alog/radio", O_WRONLY|O_LARGEFILE) = 6
<asac> open("/dev/alog/events", O_WRONLY|O_LARGEFILE) = 7
<asac> open("/dev/alog/system", O_WRONLY|O_LARGEFILE) = 8
<ogra> let me fix the udev rule ...
<asac> also:
<asac> open("/sys/kernel/debug/tracing/trace_marker", O_WRONLY|O_LARGEFILE) = -1 EACCES (Permission denied)
<ogra>  /dev/alog is a link, i forgot to adjust the permissions of the target
<asac> but guess isnt critical
<asac> i think thats fine
<asac> that file is not found locally here, so no prob
<ogra> asac, but as i suspected, no change
<asac> post a new one :)
<stgraber> ogra: hmm, actually CAP_SYS_RESOURCE isn't as bad as I thought it'd be, though some bits are still a bit scary (man 7 capabilities and look for CAP_SYS_RESOURCE)
<ogra> on the ubuntu side i'm pretty sure all is fine
<ogra> asac, i'll leave that to the platform-api specialists :) ricmm will take a look today i thinnk
<asac> ok
<ogra> thanks for the /dev/alog hint though
<ogra> sigh, lxc-info could really be clever enough to not have me always type in the name of the only running container
 * ogra glares at libhybris ...
<ogra> now *that's* a version number
<mzanetti> mardy: ping
<mardy> mzanetti: pong
<tzitzu> hello  boys
<tzitzu> after install ubuntu touch  on samsung G nexus ..
<tzitzu> all okay exept network conection gsm and sms
<tzitzu>  there something more i have to do?
<mzanetti> mardy: hey. I've heard you're the oauth guy
<mzanetti> mardy: I had a bit of a play with it yesterday and thinking how to enable the callback mechanism for native apps
<mardy> mzanetti: any ideas are welcome! At the moment we use a QtWebKit window and check when the URL changes to the one that we need
<mzanetti> mardy: yeah... that would have been my approach too. basically creating a OAuthWebView component that disables any browsing capabilities except the login form and block any redirect except the expected one
<mzanetti> mardy: could be something like special://authenticated?oauth_token=ab123456&oauth_verifier=876543abc
<mzanetti> mardy: do you have something already?
<mzanetti> mardy: otherwise I would hack together something tonight for evaluating
<mardy> mzanetti: mmm... is there something wrong with the current approach?
<mzanetti> mardy: what's the current approach?
<mzanetti> mardy: oh... you already have that QtWebkit window in place... I thought so far that's only idea too
<mzanetti> mardy: where can I find id?
<awe_> mzanetti, did you create a bug for the 3g problem you ran into yesterday?
<mzanetti> awe_: yes
<mardy> mzanetti: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~online-accounts/signon-ui/trunk/files/head:/src/browser-process/
<mardy> mzanetti: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~online-accounts/signon-ui/trunk/view/head:/src/browser-process/browser-process.cpp#L117
<mzanetti> mardy: oh... thats a separate binary. how does the communication work?
<mardy> mzanetti: when the current URL changes to the callback url (modulo the query/fragment), we know that it's finished
<mzanetti> mardy: you still need to pass the token back to the app, no?
<mardy> mzanetti: D-Bus: http://developer.ubuntu.com/resources/technologies/online-accounts/
<mzanetti> mardy: wouldn't it be better if this was in-process?
<mzanetti> mardy: you'd get rid of the D-Bus stuff + it would be only one app and the user couln't break the flow by closing one of the windows
<mardy> mzanetti: not all apps have UI
<mzanetti> mardy: thats true... but in case of a phone-app
<mzanetti> which is probably the biggest use case of OAuth anyways
<mardy> mzanetti: indeed, but think of the resource consumption
<mzanetti> mardy: I think 2 binaries loading up a QQmlEngine consume quite a lot more than one
<mardy> mzanetti: here it might be slightly slower because of D-Bus, but once the authentication is done, all the processes exit
<mzanetti> mardy: well, the WebView can be deleted too even if its in-process
<mardy> mzanetti: right
<mardy> mzanetti: I need to leave now, can we continue tomorrow?
<mzanetti> mardy: sure
<mardy> mzanetti: ping me tomorrow please, or I might forget
<mzanetti> mardy: ok... I'll explore the in-process thing tonight.. should be only few lines of code anyways
<mzanetti> (for a first test)
<mzanetti> awe_: found it or should I dig it out for you?
<awe_> got it
<awe_> thanks
<ogra> sergiusens, so what do we do with ubuntu-session ... i definitely need a good bunch of changes for the flipped container
<ogra> while you want to keep the old one for your saucy images
<asac> sergiusens: rsalveti: there?
<ogra> (it is my last blocker to get the flipped images auto-boot into the session)
<ogra> asac, ricardo did his last upload at 13:00 our time
<ogra> let him sleep :)
<mfisch> ogra: what do you want to inhibit?
<ogra> mfisch, i dont, om26er wanted, but i think he got his answer from your ML post
<mfisch> great thanks
<slangasek> ogra: well, my expectation was that "flipping the container" would lead to the system using a standard Ubuntu initramfs + root filesystem layout
<ogra> slangasek, it cant
<ogra> well, technically it could ... but that would end up in tears
<sergiusens> ogra: I would say rebrand and fork
<ogra> slangasek, i initially through about moving / ouot of the subdir, but that would mean that you end up with all the dirs in /data under /
<om26er> mfisch, yeah I found a way to inhibit but now it seems the screen won't turn off even I set the timeout back to the old value
<ogra> slangasek, so my only option when keeping it in the subdir is to mount /data temporary in the initrd and then bind mount /data/ubuntu to /root before run-init
<ogra> slangasek, thats all in the initramfs-tools-ubuntu-touch package if you want to take a look .... thats surely not the final code :)
<ogra> slangasek, also we need /data, /system and /vendor  mounted in both OSes at the same time ... the latter two are always mounted ro though
<slangasek> ogra: but AIUI the Ubuntu OS is still on the data partition, which is just wrong; it should be on the system partition, and it should really be the *root* of the system partition
<ogra> that would break android
<om26er> mfisch, and the problem is that device is in the QA lab so I don't have physical access to it, hence the display have been on for more than an hour now
<ogra> (and we would have size issues)
<slangasek> we're not trying to run Android
<ogra> we have to
<mfisch> om26er: its been on over 1 hour?
<ogra> android uses hardcoded devoice/partition paths everywhere ... if we would put soemthing else than androids /system into that partition it would break
<ogra> additionally /system is usually the smallest partition
<ogra> yu dont want to use that for a full ubuntu rootfs (especially not with convergence where you grow big)
<pmcgowan> om26er, mfisch what device are you talking about?
<om26er> mfisch, not an hour without touching since I have been running tests there as well, though it has been on for 15 minutes now. my timout value is 30sec now
<om26er> pmcgowan, its a galaxy nexus in the Lab
<ogra> slangasek, oh, and did i  mention that the partition table is usually hardcoded in the factory signed bootloader
<mfisch> om26er: did you restart the service or phone after switching it back?
<pmcgowan> om26er, I thought you might be hitting the powerd bug but thats not on nexus
<om26er> mfisch, yes, quite a few times
<mfisch> om26er: okay, please file a bug and attach /var/log/upstart/powerd.log, you'll need sudo to read the file
<om26er> mfisch, sure, thanks
<mfisch> ping me with the bug number and I'll give it a look, although I dont have a gnex or any device right now actually
<ricmm> Kaleo_: no, you expect one?
<ogra> slangasek, in any case i added the missing remaining udev rules, with the latest lxc-android-config package your devices and permissions should be created fine
<sergiusens> sil2100: actually, _salem did a complete rewrite of telepathy-ofono so it would be probably wise to keep calling it with the 2 but change the trunk or put it into a new project
<pmcgowan> mfisch, are you aware of the bug with powerd crashing on tablets without sensors
<pmcgowan> mfisch, just eaves dropping your conversation
<sil2100> hmm
<mfisch> pmcgowan: I think a fix was released for it yesterday
<om26er> mfisch, bug 1187407, though I don't see many lines in the logs there.
<ubot5> bug 1187407 in powerd "Screen does not auto-turn off even the timeout set to 30 secs" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1187407
<pmcgowan> mfisch, in saucy, just building for raring
<pmcgowan> this sounds quite similar
<sil2100> didrocks: ^ not sure what to do in this case then, since if we would really want to use the name telepathy-ofono, we could bump the major version and release it as a rewrite
<sil2100> didrocks: but sergiusens has a point if that's a complete rewrite
<pmcgowan> mfisch, that log is odd, its not finding the new sensors interface
<didrocks> sergiusens: is telepathy-ofono will continue to be developped?
<didrocks> or is it dead? (the version 1)
<pmcgowan> om26er, was that system reflashed or updated?
<sil2100> I guess it's dead?
<sergiusens> didrocks: we won't use it anymore, it's python based
<sil2100> sergiusens, _salem: ^ ?
<sil2100> I wonder if anyone else besides us used it
<didrocks> sergiusens: but we are not upstream for it? so taking the same name will be seen as a takeover, right?
<om26er> pmcgowan, reflashed, I am not sure. I did update powerd from 0.9 to 0.11 when I first gained access to the device
<didrocks> (version 1)
<pmcgowan> om26er, its missing a new version of the platform stuff, I wonder if the deps are wrong
<_salem> sil2100, It's probably dead.
<om26er> pmcgowan, there are still updates pending including the platform-api there so we might in the end need to reflash
<pmcgowan> om26er, yes its out of sync
<sergiusens> sil2100: didrocks https://code.launchpad.net/~sergiusens/dbus-cpp/daily/+merge/167293
<_salem> sil2100, well, I am almost sure we are the only ones using it, as we wrote it from scratch.
<slangasek> ogra: udev rules> hurrah :)
<sil2100> sergiusens: erm
<sil2100> sergiusens: https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/dbus-cpp/packaging_review/+merge/167286
<didrocks> sergiusens: thanks! sil2100 is doing the review I guess for dbus-cpp :)
<slangasek> ogra: do you know how big our current Ubuntu image is (unpacked)?
<ogra> (and an ugly hack that removes the .override file until ubuntu-session is in saucy)
<sil2100> sergiusens: it seems we duplicated work ;)
<sergiusens> didrocks: sil2100 ack, had it left over from last night.... forgot to push ;-)
<ogra> root@android:/ # du -hcs /data/ubuntu
<ogra> 1.3G	/data/ubuntu
<ogra> slangasek, ^^^
<slangasek> ogra: hmm, yuck
<sergiusens> sil2100: didrocks I'll delete the MR
<slangasek> ogra: ok, that definitely doesn't fit on my system partition on the N4... .grrr
<sil2100> sergiusens: sorry about that! Could have checked first for your branch ;)
<slangasek> this is all so inelegant :/
<ogra> heh
<pmcgowan> sergiusens, did you need to fix the powerd depends?
<ogra> well, we have to obey to android
<sergiusens> sil2100: it wasn't pushed
<slangasek> ogra: yes, but I want to obey it as little as possible ;)
<didrocks> sil2100: sergiusens: _salem: if we are the only ones, I would say let's move t-ofono2 -> t-ofono
<ogra> so much hardcoded stuff we cant easily change
<sergiusens> pmcgowan: I don't follow
<ogra> it would be trivial with a separate disk/partition
<sergiusens> didrocks: agree... just wanted to make sure he was aware as he pushes to it ;-)
<pmcgowan> sergiusens, om26er has a test system with this issue https://launchpadlibrarian.net/141642659/powerd.log
<ogra> but we cant easily change the part table
<pmcgowan> not sure how thats possible
<slangasek> ogra: we could change an awful lot of android, we're only using stripped-down pieces of android that we build ourselves; it's just a question of how much maintenance burden we can/should take on there
<slangasek> the partition table, though, we can't reliably change indeed
<didrocks> sil2100: you should move the t-ofono first branch, creating a new series and so on :)
<sergiusens> pmcgowan: I did not change that... I did add a Recommends for ofono, but that would land in saucy only
<ogra> slangasek, the problem is to not make awe cry ... binary vendor daemons like rild like to use the same hardcoding ... if you just differ a bit in the wrong place nothing will work
<_salem> didrocks, sergiusens sil2100 +1 on moving tp-ofono2 -> tp-ofono
<sil2100> didrocks, sergiusens: if we have a definite decision, I will do that then
<pmcgowan> sergiusens, does it have a dep on the platform api?
<sergiusens> pmcgowan: yes, or it wouldn't build
<pmcgowan> build deps different than deps no, but it seems to
<sergiusens> _salem: it's going to daily release though
<slangasek> ogra: making the android bits see the "standard" android layout is obviously necessary, but there's lots of ways to do that with bind mounts etc.  I'm less worried about that problem
<sergiusens> pmcgowan: shlibs:Depends in deps
<pmcgowan> not sure then how he got that
<om26er> pmcgowan, i generally download the iso from cdimage and flash it, so for the case of the device in the QA lab, will phablet-flash -b download and install everything without the need to touch the device ?
<sergiusens> pmcgowan: might be using an old platform api
<stgraber> slangasek: I'm starting to wonder whether we shouldn't use the "data" partition as just a storage space on which to dump ext4 partition files and just loop mount that stuff from initrd. That way, the system partition would be Android, the data partition would be everything else with one partition file for Android-data, one partition file for Ubuntu-rootfs and one partition file for Ubuntu-data
<sil2100> _salem: ACK, thanks!
<sergiusens> om26er: yes, phablet-flash
<pmcgowan> om26er, yes, and generally you dont need the -b
<ogra> slangasek, right, the question is how much do we care about porters and how big do we want to make their effort
<ogra> we could indeed hack up a lot of stuff (mainly the harcoded init.rc files you can find in /var/lib/lxc/android/rootfs/ but also fstab etc)
<slangasek> ogra: well, no, I don't think that's the primary question; we want to enable porting, but the design should not be driven based on community porting requirements :/
<ogra> well, it plays a role we cant ignore
<ogra> not saying it should be driven by it
<ogra> but we need to take it into account
<sergiusens> ogra: how does doing that block porters?
<slangasek> sergiusens: if the android side has to carry a bunch of Ubuntu patches, that's more work the porters have to merge into their trees
<ogra> sergiusens, i didnt say it blocks them but the more changes we add to the android side, the harder doing a port will get
<mhall119> penk: very late pong
<penk> mhall119: haha, cool
<penk> mhall119: I uploaded package to ppa https://launchpad.net/~penk/+archive/touch
<mhall119> I saw
<penk> but it doesn't build armhf..not sure if it's my problem
<mhall119> is the packaging also in your git repo?
<slangasek> sergiusens, ogra: however, I don't think our model for porting should be based on the idea of using arbitrary unmodified android trees
<sergiusens> slangasek: we already have plenty of pathes on the android side
<slangasek> yep
<ogra> the current container flip works without and extra changes on the android side (we should drop uchroot though) but that  causes a bunch of warts in the implementation
<mhall119> penk: most PPA's won't build armhf, we don't have enough resources to enable it for everyone
<penk> mhall119: I have debian/ directory in my git repo, but it's not using Ubuntu.Components
<mhall119> but I can upload it to a PPA that does
<sergiusens> slangasek: and our android trees are becoming less android as we move on
<mhall119> penk: that's okay, as long as it runs on Ubuntu
<penk> mhall119: that would be appreciated!
<slangasek> stgraber: so I think it's important to have data vs. OS on separate partitions so that we can have the OS read-only (for both the Android and Ubuntu bits)
<mhall119> penk: did you write it or just port it?
<slangasek> stgraber: I don't see why you would want Android vs. Ubuntu data separate, though?  Or are you using "data" to mean something other than "user mutable data"?
<penk> mhall119: I wrote it
<mhall119> penk: that's pretty cool
<stgraber> slangasek: so currently android expects to have a partition it can mount in /data, I very much doubt it needs to have access to the userdata we have on the Ubuntu side, so unless we can easily patch Android to stop mounting /data, I'd prefer having a very small partition file used for that
<mhall119> penk: if you want to collaborate, I'm sure the webbrowser-app developers would welcome it
<ogra> slangasek, we cant have /data separate
<ogra> it needs to be writable mounted from both OSses
<penk> mhall119: that sounds cool, I was trying to see how far pure QML app goes without using other C++ models
<stgraber> ogra: do both sides actually need to read and write to /data? What kind of persistent data is Android still writing for us?
<sergiusens> stgraber: the android property system writes stuff to /data ... some firmware wants to create sockets on data as well... not sure about the ubuntu side though
<ogra> yeah
<sergiusens> stgraber: we can easily get rid of the android property system
<sergiusens> but the latter not so much
<awe_> sergiusens, not if rild uses it
<Guest34070> hello, i'm french user of ubuntu. I have a Nexus 7 with Android but I like install Ubuntu touch, is it read just for podcastinf for example ? Sorry for my english...
<ogra> not sure about the ubuntu side either ... but given that /data is our biggest partition we definitely want /home to live in it
<Guest34070> podcasting*
<sergiusens> awe_: oh, but I mean, we can change the location to where it writes... not get rid of the property system itself
<awe_> ack
<ogra> awe_, rild runs on the android side
<penk> mhall119: I'll pack a Chinese handwriting plugin for maliit next, but I'm sure it's not high priority on your list :P
<stgraber> sergiusens: right, so we need to have /data writable in Android, that's fine, I didn't say we wouldn't do that. I just said we wouldn't pass it the data partition itself but a very small partition file instead.
<ogra> we surely will keep the property system there :)
<ogra> no worries :)
<awe_> ogra, so does the property system
<awe_> ;D
<mfisch> pmcgowan & om26er: looks like its dying due to the sensor stuff missing?
<mfisch> I dont know where that was fixed or in what rev
<sergiusens> stgraber: sounds good to me
<pmcgowan> mfisch, which should not be possible, I think om26er just needs to update or flash
<mfisch> pmcgowan: ok
<mfisch> pmcgowan: also I'm not sure if chicken ever published it for saucy (powerd I mean)
<om26er> pmcgowan, mfisch I just updated, i think things should be fine now
<sergiusens> mfisch: yes, it's part of daily release now and saucy is the focus
<sergiusens> mfisch: sforshee which means no more release commits for powerd and trunk is always released btw
<mfisch> sergiusens: what do you mean by release commits?
<mfisch> you mean that every commit is a release now?
<sergiusens> mfisch: debian/changelog is autogenerated
<sergiusens> mfisch: there's a daily build that grabs trunk and publishes that with whatever was commited into trunk durning the day
<mfisch> sergiusens: ok, I'll be sure to let seth know
<Kaleo_> ricmm: yes
<ogra> ricmm, did you see my ping in the backlog ? ... http://paste.ubuntu.com/5732441/ has an strace trying to run the calculator app on a flipped container
<ogra> probably the specialist sees something on first sight :)
<stgraber> sergiusens, slangasek, ogra: http://pad.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch-fs-structure
<stgraber> did I forget any storage need on there?
<ogra> stgraber, heh, your physical partitions looks a lot different from what i have on the gnex (and my galays S2 looks different again)
<stgraber> ogra: yeah, though I believe boot, recovery, system, cache and data are usually a safe bet, no?
<ogra> i wonder if we can ever reliably find a common denominator beyong /data /system and /vendor
<ogra> yeah, boot and recovery too
<stgraber> cache should be safe too as it's what's used for OS updates on Android I believe
<Guest34070> doesn't people have an idea ? Ubuntu touch read the podcast ?
<Guest34070> please
<mhall119> penk: got it compiled and running on my Nexus 7, pretty slick
<mhall119> the controls are a bit small though, and hard to hit accurately with my monkey fingers
<penk> mhall119: ah, because I haven't tested it on actual devices though, set about 40px for a button :-P
<mhall119> penk: using grid units on Ubuntu Touch will help it scale properly
<jesterfraud> ugh, I should know this, I feel. Maguro, mako or manta for the Galaxy Nexus?
<penk> mhall119: that's on my TODO list, also I brought Ubuntu Components to Mac OSX, hope that helps my testing furtherâ¦ # penkia.blogspot.com/2013/06/bringing-ubuntu-components-to-mac-osx.html
<mhall119> well....that seemed simple enough
<rsalveti> stgraber: ogra: sergiusens: I believe it's fine to assume we're changing the android side for it not to mount /data
<rsalveti> so we can have that as a normal dir inside the android container
<ogra> and use /data as a bare rootfs partition ?
<rsalveti> yes
<ogra> hmm, ok
<stgraber> nope, we can't do that
<rsalveti> stgraber: why not?
<stgraber> we need the rootfs to be read-only
<stgraber> so if we use /data directly for the rootfs, then we can't store user data
<ogra> which gets us back to ugly slow squashfs loop mounted files ?
<rsalveti> right, if we don't have any other partition
<rsalveti> slangasek: remember /system can be quite small for some devices as well, so it's not an ideal target for the android based phones
<rsalveti> we can change when doing a real product, but for now we should deal with such restrictions differently
<stgraber> another reason to use loop-mounted partitions (when we don't have a custom partition table) is that it's the only way to effectively avoid the user killing their system by filling one of the user writable directories
<asac> when is pin support for sim landing?
<asac> ChickenCutlass: ?
<slangasek> rsalveti: well, I'm concerned about the design being constrained by existing devices and leading us to suboptimal layouts that won't translate at all over to products
<rsalveti> stgraber: right, seems to be the only sane way
<ChickenCutlass> asac, need to schedule that
<stgraber> tbh, I really think it'd be much much simpler if we could agree on what number and size of partitoins we would like to have, then fake that using loop-mounted files on the existing devices
<asac> ChickenCutlass: what do we need?
<stgraber> when we get our own hardware, we can simply move that to physical partitions and be done with it
<ChickenCutlass> asac, hold on -- in a standup
<rsalveti> stgraber: right
<asac> ChickenCutlass: ok... see what we can schedule there
<awe_> asac, it's on the list of stuff to do, but 3g was deemed the holy grail
<asac> awe_: not complaining, just wonder on our schedule and if there are dependencies on UI etc.
<asac> that we need to align
<ChickenCutlass> asac, certainly depends on the systems UI.  Which we have  none
<awe_> it also requires UI work, which although we have design specs ( which haven't been reviewed )
<ChickenCutlass> asac, settings UI
<ogra> we have the design afaik
<ogra> just no implementation at all yet
<asac> awe_: this month have PIN support on our side maybe?
<asac> :)
<awe_> ogra, we have a design for the greeter, it hasn't been reviewed
<awe_> because I've been flat out on 3g
<ogra> awe_, well, i would expect the PIN code to live in the settings too
<awe_> so...first task is for some of us working on ofono to review the design
<stgraber> slangasek, rsalveti, sergiusens, ogra: that's unless one of you knows of a very good reason why we shouldn't do bind-mounted partitions for our current devices, but I've been (ab)using loop devices for years without any significant problems and it's my understanding that Android also uses them heavily already.
<awe_> ogra, i believe the design covers settings as well
<ogra> ah
<stgraber> slangasek, rsalveti, sergiusens, ogra: one concern is potential data corruption, though I can't see how this would be any worse than what we currently have (/data partition mounted read-write and mounted at a few different places)
<rsalveti> stgraber: I'm fine with it, seems to be the only way to use /data with separated pieces in ro and rw
<ogra> stgraber, well, i would like to know if there is any resource or power impact using loop mounted files
<ogra> beyond that i dont see a reason against it
<awe_> ogra, maybe not..  anyways, asac we need to do some work on the scheduling now that the dogfood deathrace is over
<asac> nice
<awe_> ogra, re: settings in the doc
<asac> yeah... maybe we can even schedule it with cli
<asac> and decouple UI stuff
<asac> like we did for other stuff
<ogra> awe_, well, i saw mpt posting a design doc for the settings, i assume it has PIN handling
<awe_> asac, maybe... it might be a bit harder to de-couple
<slangasek> stgraber: do we need to worry about taking a performance hit somewhere for loop mounting?  That seems worth checking with the kernel team before we commit
<ogra> probably not covered in the SIM doc
<stgraber> ogra: there will be a performance impact that may lead to power consumption impact as a write will go through the VFS layer twice, fragmentation would also usually be a problem, though probably less so on flash devices
<ogra> yeah, thats what i thought
<ogra> would be intresting how big of a difference it makes
<stgraber> an alternative would be to use LVM which would let us avoid that extra layer
<ogra> losing 1h battery due to it wouldnt be acceptable ... 10min would i guess
<stgraber> cking: ^ (power/performance impact of using a loop mounted ext4 on ext4 partition vs physical partition)
<asac> ChickenCutlass: should be scheduled in the telephony section of the cross check slide deck
<asac> the current prediction doesnt include it
<penk> mhall119: code committed here, btw https://code.launchpad.net/~penk/slatekit-shell/trunk
<asac> currently called out items: "Converge network manager and ofono in archive (CO)
<asac> First cut of mobile indicator (CO)
<asac> Hook networking stack to first pass of indicator
<asac> "
<asac> probably could be more specific
<cking> stgraber, off the top of my head, no idea, I can put that on my list of things to analyse
<asac> actually it hsould go into connoectivity i guess
<cking> stgraber, the risks of data loss I probably higher when something bad (like power loss) occurs though
<sgtkwol> quick question, If I install apps on phone (not desktop), how do I open them? no icons for terminal, file manager, etc
<pmcgowan> sgtkwol, use the search to find them on the app lens
<stgraber> slangasek: so, another option, do you see any problem in using LVM on the phones?
<asac> stgraber: LVM is not very well supported in many kernels that we currently will face on existing phones (too old)
<ogra> yeah
<asac> i think lvm really just landed in 3.9
 * ogra would go with loop  mounted squashfs images if we can prove it doesnt eat to much performance
<asac> but we have 3.0 3.4 etc. kernels still breathing everywhere
<stgraber> asac: are we talking about the same LVM? LVM2 has been around since at least the early 2.6 kernel and LVM itself for way longer.
<sgtkwol> pmcgowan, thanks, got it, woot
<asac> stgraber: fully supported on ARM?
<xnox> stgraber: but was it ported/enabled in android kernels, is the question...
<pmcgowan> sgtkwol, ah good
<xnox> asac: it works great on ARM, but have no idea about android kernels though.
<asac> stgraber: just repeat what i have in the back of my mind as a reason
<asac> xnox: since 2.6?
<asac> or now?
<asac> :)
<xnox> asac: lvm2 is 12 years old.
<xnox> asac: so somewhere in 2.6.x yes.
<stgraber> xnox: well, it sure works on my nexus4
<xnox> stgraber: ack.
<stgraber> anyway, I'd prefer loop mounted images personally, was just thinking of other options to lower the overhead
<asac> stgraber: whats your usecase? just curious
<stgraber> if we can't go with LVM, then there's no need to actually do much performance/power analysis since we don't have a choice anyway
<stgraber> asac: we need more partitions than are physicailly available on the phones
<stgraber> asac: and as we can't change the partitioning, we're left with two options 1) loop mount partition files or 2) LVM
<stgraber> 2) should have a lower overhead than 1), but 1) is easier to debug and certainly confirmed to work on Android kernels as that's what they use for some apps
<asac> stgraber: what do you need the partitions for?
<cking> stgraber, I'm currently measuring loopback vs non-loopback to see if there is any significant difference
<asac> i hope there is :)
<asac> otherwise we should just move away from even dealing with partitioning :)
<stgraber> asac: the Ubuntu rootfs needs to be read-only, the Android system needs to be read-only, the Android data needs to be read-write, the Ubuntu config needs to be read-write and the Ubuntu userdata needs to be read-write.
<stgraber> asac: all that stored on the same physical partiton
<stgraber> hmm, actually wrong, Android system is a separate partition (though under used sadly)
<stgraber> asac: http://pad.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch-fs-structure
<asac> chmod :)
<asac> lol
<asac> oh that pad is good
<ogra> and ubuntu userdata and android data need to be the same and accessible from both OSes
<asac> have been trying to find it for a bit
<stgraber> oh, and we don't want someone to be able to fill one partition and kill the phone ;)
<asac> when will that be promoted to a wiki/mail? :)
<stgraber> when we all agree on it and implement it? :)
<asac> ok ... when is the decision deadline?
<ogra> is there one ?
<ogra> we need to have a proper setup by rellease
<stgraber> I don't think there's one, but as long as we haven't sorted out that mess, I can't really prepare the image based updates which is starting to annoy me a little
<asac> slangasek: ChickenCutlass: how much time do you need to get alignment on the partition layout?
<asac> stgraber: i dont want that to happen :)
<asac> that you cant prepare that
<ChickenCutlass> asac, I didn't know there was a partition problem
<asac> i dont think there is a problem
<asac> just someone needs to say "GO"
<asac> :)
<asac> and of course take a look if there is something that will shoot ourselves in the foot badly
<stgraber> so we should really have that stuff figured out and any change done ASAP, so that ideally the first really usable images with the container flip are based on what we consider our final layout
<ogra> asac, ChickenCutlass, there isnt a partition problem, there is a "we dont have any design for the flipped container" problem
<stgraber> then we can just tell people to use the saucy images and base their stuff on that
<asac> stgraber: are there open points in the proposal for which people had concerns?
<ogra> the images we have now are a prototype, far from a proper final implementation
<asac> we are talking about nailing the parittionm layout
<stgraber> asac: so I think we want to hear back from cking on performance/power impact, not that we really have a choice in the end. Then we need to figure out how many of those "partitions" (file) we need, what they'll contain, where they'll be mounted and how big they'll be
<cking> stgraber, let's see what I can turn around in the next hour or so
<ChickenCutlass> asac, we are not blocked by this -- also we can not change partition layout on existing phones.
<stgraber> cking: cool, thanks for looking into this so quickly!
<asac> seems we can by adding .img files :)
<asac> ChickenCutlass: well. then someone should write up the truth and then make the call
<ogra> ChickenCutlass, we wont, we will use loop mounted files
<ogra> or PVm
<ogra> err
<ogra> LVM
<ChickenCutlass> not using LVM on a phone
<ogra> dont telll me
<asac> still we need to decide what partitions we want and see how we can realize that on legacy phones
<ogra> i didnt bring it up :)
<ogra> just the messenger
<ogra> asac, there is no such thing as choice
<asac> i know what choices are doable
<ogra> we need /data writable mounted on both OSes ... we need /system readable on both OSes and the same goes for /vendor
<asac> there is choice by bringining in .img files etc.
<ogra> everything else is optional
<asac> thats choice you realize :)
<ogra> well, a very limited chouce
<asac> ChickenCutlass: slangasek: please make a call stgraber can land image updates this month
<ogra> *choice
<asac> :)
<sil2100> kenvandine: one more once you have a free moment: https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/location-service/packaging_review/+merge/167327
<sil2100> oSoMoN: ping!
<sil2100> oSoMoN: any progress on those AP issues? Got any ideas on those random ones?
<ogra> stgraber, hmm, can i somehow get rid of lxcbr0 ?
<stgraber> ogra: yep, disable lxc-net or change USE_LXC_BRIDGE in /etc/default/lxc-net
<stgraber> ogra: do you actually get lxcbr0 on your hardware? on mako we don't appear to have bridge support in the kernel, so it never shows up
<ogra> on maguro with my very latest image (udev working and all) i get it, yes
<ogra> i'll ship an override file with the android package
<oSoMoN> sil2100: yes, I submitted 2 MRs that I hope will fix the issues, but the CI jenkins refuses to cooperate, the builds timed out, so I re-launched them
<sil2100> oSoMoN: thanks! Excellent, too bad jenkins makes problems...
<mhall119> Kaleo_: ping
<surgemcgee> What is the command to hide the auto generated comments?
<slangasek> ChickenCutlass: so, why do you say that we can't change partition layout on existing phones - at least for the 4 devices we support?  Has someone tested and found that this isn't possible?
<surgemcgee> Nevermid, is in the options. I swear, that is sometimes not there :0
<mhall119> surgemcgee: ?
<surgemcgee> Uhhh, it is in the options i guess... Sorry
<spazm> hi niggers
<spazm> BITCH
<spazm> FAGS
<Kaleo_> mhall119: pong
<mhall119> Kaleo_: hey, I want to start a project for collecting reusable 3rd party components/widgets, but I'm not sure of the best way to go about doing that
<mhall119> for example, do I put them all in one big package, or multiple smaller ones?  Do I make a new QML namespace for it, and how do I do that?
<Kaleo_> mhall119: it's started already: https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/d/1xGmQd1qRMFIHIupybpzFmIZHRGUmRhSJanX62ElG5EA/edit
<Kaleo_> mhall119: on his note, I need to eat something
<mhall119> oh perfect! thanks Kaleo_
<Kaleo_> this*
<seb128> Kaleo_, hey, enjoy your meal
<Kaleo_> thx
<seb128> Kaleo_, since I see you around, did you ever have a chance to look at my small "keyboard navigation doesn't skip enabled = false elements in grids"? should I report a bug about that?
<Kaleo_> seb128: I did not
<Kaleo_> seb128: please do if it's not already in qt bugs
<seb128> Kaleo_, ok, my small testcase is there: http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/grid.qml
<seb128> Kaleo_, I will check for upstream bugs
<seb128> Kaleo_, thanks
<xnox> where is the code for qml-phone-shell
<didrocks> ricmm: hey, mind a small review: https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/platform-api/fix-archs/+merge/167354?
<xnox> i think it's a
<xnox> lp:unity/phablet.
<greyback> xnox: correct
<AmEv> Anyone here able to troubleshoot a blank screen?
<didrocks> sergiusens: rsalveti: do you mind having a look to ensure that https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/platform-api/fix-archs/+merge/167354? is merged before 00 UTC? otherwise, it will block all stacks for tomorrow daily releasing (we can skip it by hand, but that will introduce a daily)
<didrocks> I'll log off now, but still looking at the current build status in jenkins
<xnox> Are raring phablet touch images build using "trunk" branches or "raring/13.04" branches? For example: lp:hud or lp:hud/13.04
<didrocks> xnox: trunk
<xnox> didrocks: thanks.
<didrocks> apart from those having /phablet
<didrocks> (because they aren't compatible with desktop)
<AmEv> Hmmm... Looks like the Tegra 2 Transformer and Toshiba Thrive are suffering the exact same black screen problem....
<xnox> didrocks: gotcha.
<AmEv> Wonder if the blank screen thing is a regression of Tegra 2 devices?
<AmEv> The dev had it working at one point, but then people have been reporting black screens since.
<ChickenCutlass> slangasek, I beleive the bootloader expects certain partition layouts. I think things get borked if you change them.  rsalveti can probably say more about this.
<sergiuse1s> ChickenCutlass: bootloader has partition information written to it... which is consequently why some of the images are breaking with fastboot -w
<ChickenCutlass> right
<slangasek> sergiusens: and would that have an impact if we were only changing the system+data partitions?
<slangasek> sergiusens: also, which bootloader to be exact?  (on which device?)
<sergiusens> slangasek: so bfiller has an older bootimage and his partition information differs from mine (the userdata one at least)
 * sergiusens looks at the flood
<sergiusens> slangasek: I still need to compile the differences since I have a bug open for it, so I'll keep you in the loop... it's right up next after getting saucy in place
<slangasek> sergiusens: so, if I change the system/userdata partitions on these devices, am I going to brick them?
<sergiusens> slangasek: no, but if you use fastboot you might... although they never get really bricked
<cking> stgraber, ext4 on loopback on Nexus4 results: http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~cking/pm-arm/nexus4/ext4-vs-ext4-loop-on-ext4/ext4-vs-ext4-loopback.ods
<cking> asac, ^^
<cking> so there is noticeable I/O performance hit and some extra current drawn too, random writes are improved on loopback, but that's it really
<didrocks> rsalveti: hey!
<didrocks> rsalveti: I don't understand your need fixing
<rsalveti> didrocks: hey
<rsalveti> didrocks: well, build the package :-)
<rsalveti> it'll fail as all can't be multi-arch same
<rsalveti> for the transitional packages
<didrocks> oh, arch: all and multiarch
<didrocks> rsalveti: ok, removing them :)
<didrocks> I'm removing the pre-depends as well as it's for multiarch
<rsalveti> didrocks: ok
<rsalveti> didrocks: let me know once done
<didrocks> rsalveti: yeah, firing up a pbuilder meanwhile :)
<didrocks> typical one line change where nothing wrong can happen :p
<pmcgowan_> rsalveti, could our dtmf issue be related to inband vs out of band?
<pmcgowan_> rsalveti, but you said you did finally get through
<didrocks> rsalveti: ok, pushed. pbuilder gave its green card :)
<rsalveti> pmcgowan_: yeah, worked fine when I used the brazilian number
<rsalveti> didrocks: thanks
<didrocks> thanks to you for the remark :)
<pmcgowan__> ChickenCutlass_, ping
<ChickenCutlass_> pmcgowan__: Hi
<pmcgowan__> ChickenCutlass_, the activity timeout kicks in during calls
<ChickenCutlass_> pmcgowan__: Right. It should
<pmcgowan__> which is ok to dim the screen but not the welcome screen
<pmcgowan__> or is that intended
<ChickenCutlass_> pmcgowan__: Intended
<pmcgowan__> hmmm
<ChickenCutlass_> pmcgowan__: That is what my phone does
<stgraber> ogra, sergiusens, slangasek, rsalveti, asac: I forwarded you an e-mail from cking wrt performance and power impact of using loop mounted images
<rsalveti> didrocks: happroved
<didrocks> rsalveti: thanks ;)
 * didrocks continues on the hud, and then, we should be fine
<rsalveti> hm, 6% is quite a bit
<ogra> stgraber, yup, just read it .... i would have liked to see the same tests on a gnx
<ogra> *gnex
<stgraber> in short, we're seeing a 6% power increase and at least 10% impact on reads, though there are pretty big variations across tests which make me think there may be something else going on
<ogra> i would expect them to be even worse there
<stgraber> ogra: apparently a lot more people have nexus4 (company provided or otherwise) than gnex, apparently the gnex isn't as easy to get as th4 nexus4
<ogra> and the gnex is the class of device we target
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> i know :)
<rsalveti> we got a few folks with gnex as well
<sergiusens> stgraber: if you provide instructions to setup I can run
 * rsalveti gone, getting some proper sleep
<stgraber> sergiusens: you'd have to ask cking for that, he's run those tests
<stgraber> anyway, we were talking with slangasek a bit earlier and were wondering if the following would be possible:
<stgraber> Go with two different supported setups:
<stgraber> 1) For devices that support it or devices that are prepared at the factory for Ubuntu phone. Have a rather large system partition (2GB) and reduce the size of userdata a little
<stgraber> 2) For those devices that can't even deal with a partition resize (even without re-order), have a system.img and data.img files in the userdata partition and loop mount that
<stgraber> That'd leave us with the same setup in both cases, only different being real vs virtual partitions. system would contain the Ubuntu rootfs and the Android rootfs (under /var/lib/lxc/android/rootfs) built from the superposition of two .tar.xz
<stgraber> data would be a writable partition, containing all user writable folders with bind mounts from there to paths on the filesystem that need to be writable
<_salem> bfiller, https://code.launchpad.net/~tiagosh/phone-app/phone-app-delete-confirmation/+merge/167376
<bfiller> _salem: nice, I'll try once jenks builds it
<_salem> bfiller, ok, cool
<_salem> bfiller, ouch, forgot to add i18n to some strings, I will have to update it.
<mhall119> ogra: my N7 has been unplugged all day, the screen doesn't stay turned off, and I've been using it off and on at full brightness
<mhall119> but it still says my battery is at 100%
<mhall119> now, either we've done some magical optimizations, or it's lying to me
<mzanetti> mhall119: hey, are you aware of an app that uses qca or even oauth?
<mzanetti> mhall119: and your tablet is lying :P
<mhall119> what is qca?
<mhall119> mzanetti: the Facebook and Friends apps use OnlineAccounts, which uses oauth
<mhall119> I don't know of any apps that do oauth themselves
<mhall119> they should usually make an OnlineAccounts provider if then need it
<mhall119> that way other apps can use it too
<mzanetti> mhall119: ah right... that would be enough. I'm curious because the qoauth lib we ship on the device seems to be Qt4 compatible only. same for qca
<mhall119> if anybody asked me, I'd tell them to do oauth with a UOA provider
<mhall119> in fact, I've had on my to-do-some-day list to write one for Reddit
<mzanetti> mhall119: can you point me to some docs or the code please?
<mhall119> mzanetti: http://developer.ubuntu.com/resources/technologies/online-accounts/
<mhall119> http://developer.ubuntu.com/resources/technologies/online-accounts/for-service-developers/
<mhall119> and http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/ubuntu-12.10/python/AccountPlugin-1.0.html for API docs
<mzanetti> mhall119: awesome :) thanks a lot. I've actually seen that site before. but the screenshots looked so desktop-ish so I missed the info :D
<mhall119> mzanetti: as far as I know the API hasn't changed
<mterry> What's the easiest way to get something built for armhf for testing purposes?  I don't want to throw something at the phablet ppa until I test it
<mhall119> mterry: do you have a device?
<mterry> mhall119, oh I suppose I could build there...
<mterry> hm
<bfiller> mterry: pbuilder chroot for armhf and then push deb to device
<mterry> bfiller, that works fine these days?
<bfiller> mterry: yup
<mterry> nice
<AskUbuntu> How can I create a custom session to use Unity Next and the Core Apps in 13.04? | http://askubuntu.com/q/304092
<jackcy75> do i have to install saucy instead of raring to compile a phone zip and use the current saucy daily image zip? I had an already working i9300 kernel zip that meanwhile does not work anymore, even when i compile it again...
<slangasek> stgraber: any thoughts on this one? :) http://paste.ubuntu.com/5733851/
<slangasek> the kernel has this to say:
<slangasek> Jan  1 17:02:59 ubuntu-phablet kernel: [    2.893300] Alternate GPT is invalid,
<slangasek> using primary GPT.
<slangasek> Jan  1 17:02:59 ubuntu-phablet kernel: [    2.893941]  mmcblk0: p1 p2 p3 p4 p5 p
<slangasek> 6 p7 p8 p9 p10 p11 p12 p13 p14 p15 p16 p17 p18 p19 p20 p21 p22 p23 p24 p25
<stgraber> slangasek: no idea, I guess that's part of the whole mess that partition tables on mobile devices appears to be
<slangasek> well
<slangasek> the kernel thinks the GPT is ok, but parted rejects it
<slangasek> stgraber: so 'gdisk' is able to work with the partitions; guess it's a parted bug
<beidl> screwing with partition tables on mobile devices is a baaad idea. for example, the galaxy nexus has specific partitions for radio, the spl and xloader. i'm not sure if at some point the device expects certain code (like xloader) to be at a certain position on the nand
<beidl> older devices that used mtd for accessing the nand could be "repartitioned" at boot time by providing bootargs to the kernel, telling the mtd subsystem at which address/position which partition starts and where it ends. that was the safest bet we had for repartitioning *back in the days*
<beidl> actually.... the CM team got MTD running on the galaxy S1 when they released CM9 for it, but I'm not actually sure how they accomplished it. I'm taking a look at their update.zip right now. but the downside is: mtd only allows yaffs2 as a filesystem, no ext4.
<beidl> anybody got my info on MTD? my ISP is playing games with me...
<jono> anyone know why I am getting this:
<jono> jono@forge:~$ adb devices
<jono> List of devices attached
<jono> ????????????	no permissions
<beidl> sudo adb devices
<jono> beidl, makes no difference
<k1l_> db needs more rights
<jono> it normally works
<beidl> sudo adb kill-server && adb shell
<beidl> jono: maybe that works
<mhall119> jono: I had this once before, I had to sudo adb kill-server; sudo adb start-server
<netcurli> what device? do you have a udev rule for it?
<mhall119> or something like that
<k1l_> yep, if sudo doesnt help, kill the adb server and start again
<jono> jono@forge:~$ sudo adb kill-server
<jono> jono@forge:~$ adb root
<jono> * daemon not running. starting it now on port 5037 *
<jono> * daemon started successfully *
<jono> error: insufficient permissions for device
<k1l_> jono: ./adb kill-server ./adb start-server ./adb devices
<jono> k1l_, fixed, thanks!
<slangasek> beidl: so I realize there may be low-level code that assumes locations of the hardware drivers in particular places, which may thus fail to pay appropriate attention to partition tables and such; but the only partitions I'm manipulating here are the system, cache, and userdata partitions, which the bootloader definitely shouldn't be worrying about
<slangasek> stgraber, ogra: fyi, I've adjusted the system, cache, and userdata partitions on the N4 and it still boots to recovery, at least.  Still working on getting the main boot bootable again
<mhall119> mzanetti: my battery reads 95% now, so maybe it wasn't lying earlier
<beidl> slangasek: yes, of course, but I'm not exactly sure how manipulating non-standard partition tables using standard tools would work. just out of curiosity, how did you repartition your N4 for example?
<slangasek> beidl: the hard way <tm>
<mhall119> with a magnetized needle and a steady hand?
<slangasek> merely as a proof of concept; if we think this is actually what we should do, we'll need to make it much more user-friendly than what I did (port gdisk onto the machine; use it to adjust the partition table; reboot to recovery; port mkfs.ext4 onto the machine and use it to make filesystems; reboot to recovery again; adb push autodeploy.zip)
<mzanetti> mhall119: hmm... that'd be quite cool :D
<mzanetti> mhall119: which image?
<mhall119> mzanetti: 147
<mhall119> maybe I just wasn't using it as much as I thought I was
<mhall119> or had it plugged into USB more than I thought I did
 * mhall119 is thrilled to see the terminal and file manager apps in image 152
<mhall119> \o/
<rickspencer3> rsalveti, et al
<rickspencer3> I just used my cellular data
<rickspencer3> worked like a charm
<rickspencer3> my only regret is letting Network Manager name the connection id
<rickspencer3> I should have named it "a" instead of "T-Mobile connection 1"
<pmcgowan__> rickspencer3, I found some problems with string parsing of long connection names, especially those with a & like AT&T
<rickspencer3> hehe
<rickspencer3> pmcgowan__, mine worked, was just a hassle to type into the terminal app ;)
<beidl> rickspencer3: I created aliases in .bashrc for turning 3g on and off, saves some time ;)
<rickspencer3> hi beidl, nice idea
<mhall119> pmcgowan__: you wouldn't have that problem on Verizon
<mhall119> mostly because you'd be stuck with CDMA
<AskUbuntu> Ubuntu touch install failure (galaxy nexus) | http://askubuntu.com/q/304129
<slangasek> hmmm, nearly there; except the Ubuntu rootfs is mounting by-partlabel and I seem not to have created those properly
<beidl> btw, I've got a GNex specific idea: u-boot has been ported to the GNex some time ago. the neat thing about it: it works when you raw-flash it using fastboot to the boot partition. and it reads the actual kernel from the filesystem
<pmcgowan__> mhall119, exactly, and why I have two phones still
<slangasek> ogra: so I think android-tools-adbd should be fixed to exec /bin/sh, not /system/bin/sh
<slangasek> ogra: any objections if I upload this?
<stgraber> slangasek: actually, can we have it call /bin/bash? dash is annoying for interactive shells
<slangasek> ogra: ah - actually, it seems the adbd source will do this if we define ADB_HOST, but I'm not sure if that's the right thing to do in this context; do you know?
<slangasek> stgraber: I agree, but that's why you call 'exec bash' after connecting :-)
<slangasek> stgraber: i.e., it's inconvenient but I don't think we should rely on /bin/bash here
<stgraber> actually, having it use the shell of the user it's running under would probably make sense (and give us bash)
<slangasek> stgraber: I'm not volunteering to write that at the moment, I'm just trying to get an adbd that will let me get into the system given that my /system is failing to mount
<stgraber> slangasek: should be a pretty simple change, I can take a quick look at it
<stgraber> slangasek: test build worked, doing a test build on armhf so I can test on an actual device
<slangasek> ok
<slangasek> stgraber: do *you* know whether we should be setting ADB_HOST=1?
<stgraber> slangasek: no idea, looks like that'd change adbd's behaviour quite a bit, judging by the number of ifdef
 * slangasek nods
<stgraber> my change, if it works, basically calls getpwuid(getuid()) and if that returns something reasonable, use ->pw_shell as the shell. If not, fallback to the hardcoded value.
<slangasek> hmm, has the current daily image actually been tested to work on the N4?  It seems udev is enabled now
<slangasek> but the v4l rules are still in place
 * stgraber wishes his pandaboard would have faster I/O, usb2 is slow...
<stgraber> slangasek: haven't tested today's, I just apt-get dist-upgrade my nexus4
<stgraber> slangasek: looks like my change worked, got a working bash shell even with an empty /system
<slangasek> \o/
<stgraber> slangasek: want the binary or are you fine to wait for this to hit the archive?
<slangasek> stgraber: archive is fine
<slangasek> I already hacked something here for myself; but now I'm not even booting all the way to adbd for some reason
<stgraber> uploaded
<h01ger> another stupid user question: how to quit an app?
<greyback_> h01ger: in the Dash, go to Apps lens. Long press on a running application preview, you'll get a close button then.
<h01ger> ah. nice. thanks.
<h01ger> and how to add my location? i can enter the city but it doesnt take enter or anything..
<greyback_> h01ger: that I don't know actually, sorry.
<h01ger> np
<h01ger> is there a reliable way to get to the dash + the app lens?
<slangasek> stgraber: success; now have the N4 booted with a 2GB system partition and the container-flipped setup (though Ubuntu is still on /data/ubuntu because I haven't tried to modify the initramfs yet to do useful things with Ubuntu-on-system)
<slangasek> wow, syslog is scary-verbose on here
<slangasek> hmmm, because kgsl is failing to find firmware
<h01ger> greyback_, add location needs network to work :)
<greyback_> h01ger: ah, really? Good to know
<h01ger> yup. successfully added two cities now
<mhall119> fginther: your packaging for the nemo folderlistmodel works fine for me locally, but jenkins didn't like it
<mhall119> fginther: if it's a jenkins error, I'm happy to approve your branch
<mhall119> otherwise I'll wait on an update for it
<rickspencer3> can anyone suggest a way that I can try to figure out what is making my phone run hot?
<slangasek> stgraber: hmm. what version of qml-phone-shell do you have?  when all is said and done here, with 1.74, qml-phone-shell is segfaulting for me on the daily container-flipped image
<slangasek> which actually seems to be a much older qml-phone-shell than what's in raring
<rickspencer3> hrm ... looking at top, qml-phone-shell is constantly using 30% - 40% of a CPU core right now
<slangasek> rickspencer3: seems rather high unless it's actively displaying something... but I can't compare at the moment
<rickspencer3> slangasek, just the terminal app
<slangasek> hmm
<rickspencer3> I wouldn't think it would take that much CPU to ruu top
<slangasek> I guess you could adb in and close the terminal, and compare
<slangasek> not to run top - but maybe to /display/ top :)
<slangasek> (obviously if it is, that's a problem that needs fixing)
<rickspencer3> slangasek, yah
<rickspencer3> I thought that's what you mean
<rickspencer3> t
<rickspencer3> ug, phone just became unresponsive
<stgraber> slangasek: 1.74
<rickspencer3> screw it, I may as well update
<slangasek> stgraber: ok; so the problem probably lies somewhere else
<rickspencer3> o/ stgraber :)
<stgraber> slangasek: is kgsl still complaining?
<slangasek> stgraber: I guess an update gives you something different than a fresh install :/
<stgraber> hey rickspencer3
<slangasek> stgraber: no, once I made /lib/firmware a symlink to /system/etc/firmware, kgsl was happy
<stgraber> slangasek: is "test_sf" working?
<slangasek> it's dying after sending some ioctls to /dev/binder
<slangasek> maybe the lxc container isn't up
<slangasek> hmm, no, it is
<stgraber> do you see surfaceflinger running?
<slangasek> stgraber: yeah, test_sf works
<slangasek> so SF is working
<stgraber> ok, good
<stgraber> try test_egl and test_glesv2 next
<slangasek> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:/$ test_egl
<slangasek> __pthread_gettid -2
<slangasek> stop
<slangasek> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:/$ echo $?
<slangasek> 1
<slangasek> test_glesv2 works though
<stgraber> did you test that as root or as the phablet user?
<slangasek> phablet
<slangasek> I'm not sure if it's worth debugging this then, given that the saucy ppa still has a month-old version of qml-phone-shell :/
<slangasek> I'll wait and see what tomorrow's build brings
<stgraber> what version do you have (of the shell)?
<slangasek> 1.754
<slangasek> 1.74
#ubuntu-touch 2013-06-05
<stgraber> slangasek: ok. I'll also reflash mine tomorrow, currently I apparently managed to mess up my partitions or the system in a way that I end up with a read-only data partition, so can't do a whole lot at the moment
<slangasek> ok
<slangasek> so at a minimum, I've proved that the N4 bootloader doesn't mind if you resize the system+userdata partitions
<slangasek> and with the raring image, booting to the shell worked fine... so this current problem is some new glitch with the container flip
<mhall119> just phablet-flashed to 152, and man is it so nice having a terminal there by default!
<mhall119> sergiusens: when is powerd 0.12 going to be in the device images?
<mhall119> glad I still had a package built in /home/phablet
<coder543> Hey everyone. I'm excited about the upcoming Ubuntu Touch project, but I had begun to think about various challenges. First and foremost, is there going to be an API for simple second screen support? On iOS, this is useful for Keynote and MLB.tv, among other things. Having this from the beginning would be necessary if it is ever to be supported by developers.
<coder543> The other thing was memory management. It would be unique and rather advantageous if we could use something like "kill -STOP <procid>" whenever a task gets backgrounded and hasn't requested backgrounding, and then when we run low on memory, we could save that app's memory to disk in a swap-like fashion. The user would get a continuous experience regardless of how much memory their device has, even if the app would take a moment 
<coder543> Just some thoughts.
<coder543> The channel doesn't seem as active right now as it is at other times of day though.
<mhall119> yeah, it's way late in Europe, and pretty late in the US
<coder543> unfortunately. Should I submit these ideas as bugs, maybe? I don't know.
<mhall119> coder543: better to write it up in detail on the wiki first, as a full spec
<mhall119> as for memory management, we already suspend app processes when they lose focus
<mhall119> and there's work for allowing select forms of background execution
<coder543> Ok, I figured that app execution would be being paused by now most likely. The last time I used the developer preview was a few months ago, but saving and restoring from disk in low memory situations is something not done by iOS or Android at this point I'm fairly certain and could be nice, if anyone ever has time to do that. Second screen support (or the lack thereof) is something I see as a rather serious blunder in Android. O
<coder543> else ever happens. Android 4.2 finally introduced support for the second screen though, I think... but yeah.
<coder543> I'm excited, regardless.
<mhall119> the kernel should swap out inactive process memory to disk if it needs more
<fginther> mhall119, it looks to be a packaging bug, I think the source format is goofed for an inline package.  I'll update and try again
<mhall119> fginther: hmm, I've seen inline packages with that source format
<mhall119> fginther: though we can probably just apply the patches to the branch  instead of carrying patch files
<fginther> mhall119, that's what I'm attempt and converting to native
<fginther> should have a update pushed in a minute or two
<mhall119> cool
<mhall119> if there's anything you need me for, just let me know
<fginther> mhall119, \o/ now it passes
<mhall119> yay!
<Riussi_> http://summit.devaamo.fi/2013/program/
<samuraibsd> Having some trouble flashing the image to my Nexus 4
<samuraibsd> I followed all the steps, but the recovery it flashed over my CWM gives an error when I try to use autodeploy.zip
<samuraibsd> Are my messages actually visible?
<samuraibsd> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<dholbach> good morning
<samuraibsd> dholbach: Can you see this?
<dholbach> samuraibsd, that you just asked me if I could see your message? :)
<samuraibsd> Yes.  Thank god, someone alive.
<samuraibsd> You wouldn't know anything about the flash process would you?
<dholbach> Not much. What are you after?
<samuraibsd> Trying to install it on my Nexus 4 and while I got the auto deploy zip onto the internal storage, it gave me an error, and now I can't seem to mount my /sdcard from the recovery
<dholbach> What was the error message?
<samuraibsd> E: Bad
<samuraibsd> And now, when I try to do anything to /sdcard, it gives me E: Unable to mount /usb-otg
<samuraibsd> Can't adb push the manual image either, since for some reason it won't mount
<samuraibsd> With no OS on the device, I can't do it from inside Android either
<samuraibsd> Since booting just immediately turns off the device
<samuraibsd> I don't even get a boot animation, just the Google splash and the noff
<samuraibsd> then off*
<dholbach> I never heard of this issue before.
<dholbach> Let me see if I can find anything.
<samuraibsd> Neither have I
<samuraibsd> And apparently neither has Google, I've been searching for hours
<dholbach> I couldn't find any trace of that "error message" in the phablet-flash code
<samuraibsd> I don't remember exactly what it said, but I remember E: and bad
<samuraibsd> my plan was to play around but then...this
<samuraibsd> And now phablet-flash won't work either, so I can't even have it do that
<samuraibsd> Tells me I have an unsupported device
<dholbach> Sorry, it looks like I'm of no help. Maybe you just wait in the channel a bit more until more of Europe wakes up. You might also want to send a message to ubuntu-phone@lists.launchpad.net
<dholbach> Just so you're all covered and somebody can help you out with this.
<samuraibsd> Eh, worst case scenario I just stay up for the rest of the night and figure it out on my own...but yeah, I didn't know about the launchpad list, that's good to know.
<dholbach> All the best!
<samuraibsd> Ah, figured it out...though now it seems Ubuntu won't boot
<samuraibsd> Step in the right direction
<samuraibsd> Interesting...CM 10.1 boots
<batman_> Hi
<batman_> can i install ubuntu touch on htc sensation
<AskUbuntu> ubuntu on nexus 10 shutdown/suspend | http://askubuntu.com/q/304276
<mzanetti> we need fitbit integration with the infographics :D
<ogra> slangasek, thanks for the session fixes, there is https://code.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/session-manager-touch/trunk as upstream branch fyi
<ogra> slangasek, in the adbd build ADB_HOST is already set in the makefile .... and we will also throw away that patch in favour of lool's proper upstream merge in debian once i finally managed to test it
<purwoy> test
<folf> Hi: Has anyone gotten the catchpodder podcast agent to work on a phone? (I'm running ubuntu touch on a samsung galaxy nexus).
<netcurli> folf: as I am waiting for the download in the background feature, development for catchpodder is currently on halt
<netcurli> but if you want to run the current version, I can help you
<ogra> Saviq, if you make such changes, can you let me know so i can update the saucy seeds and packages in the archive accordingly ?
<Saviq> ogra, you mean the s/qml-phone-shell/unity8/?
<ogra> Saviq, right, for saucy we currently build two images ... one via jenkins and the other on cdimage
<ogra> they use different seeds and session managers
<ogra> once the container flip is done we'll drop the jenkins build
<Saviq> ogra, oh, didn't know that
<ogra> no worries :)
<Saviq> ogra, anyway, would definitely let more people know before merging that
<ogra> ok
<ogra> include me then :)
<Saviq> ogra, will do
<ogra> thanks :)
<folf> netcurli: I just want to try out the current version :-) so some advice on how to set it up would be nice
<netcurli> so at the moment, you will need to grab this plugin code https://code.launchpad.net/~djfun/catchpodder/filedownload
<netcurli> and compile and install it on the device
<samuraibsd> So just installed this guy on my N4 and got it to boot.  Seems like it'll be pretty legit once it's actually ready for release.  I dig it.
<ogra> :)
<netcurli> and then you should be able to run the qml app from trunk
<folf> netcurli: is starting it from the phone supported? I mean, can it be added to the list of installed apps?
<netcurli> I have not added any packaging yet, it is possible, but you need to place the .desktop file in the correct directory (/usr/share/applications ?!) yourself
<folf> netcurli: ok thanks :-)
<asac> kgunn: do you feel you own the "primary phone unlock experience with SIM-PIN/PUK" or is it jasons team?
<davmor2> hey guys I noticed an issue on the nexus 7 last night.   if you set an alarm leave the clock app open, and then let the device sleep every 10 seconds or so there is a burst of light from it  I'm assuming it is a bad thing for that to be happening but I have no idea what is doing it or where or what to file it against any clues?
<davmor2> you however won't see it during the day so I'm assuming it isn't that bright in reality but you certainly notice it at night :)
<nik90> davmor2: what do you mean by burst of light? The whole screen? Do you have any screenshots for better clarification?
<sil2100> didrocks: https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/qtvideo-node/fix_ftbfs_with_new_libhybris/+merge/167509
<davmor2> nik90: yeap whole screen lights up for a split second and then is dark again
<nik90> davmor2: that's wierd
<nik90> davmor2: is this only with the clock app?
<nik90> davmor2: for bug related to clock app, you can report them at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-clock-app/+filebug
<davmor2> nik90: no idea it is the first time that the tablet had been useful enough to take to bed and use in place of my Xoom.  It may be the tablet as a whole doing it rather than the clock app I was just highlighting what I did for reproduction :)
<nik90> davmor2: :)
<mardy> mzanetti: hi! Do you want to resume our OAuth chat?
<mzanetti> mardy: hey, sure
<mzanetti> mardy: so... yesterday I failed because I realized that qca2 seems to build and link with Qt5 but then crashes in init()
<mardy> mzanetti: so, I've been giving it some more though, and probably understood that we have different goals in mind
<mardy> mzanetti: qhat is qca2?
<mardy> *what
<mzanetti> mardy: Qt's openssl implementation
<mzanetti> mardy: qoauth is build on top of that for example
<mardy> mzanetti: OK
<mardy> mzanetti: so, there is nothing preventing apps from dealing with OAuth themselves
<mardy> mzanetti: but what UOA (Ubuntu Online Accounts) provides is a bit different
<mzanetti> mardy: yeah... for some things I think it really makes sense to integrate into the UOA. But not for everything I think
<mardy> mzanetti: we don't handle just OAuth, but all authentication methods
<mzanetti> mardy: yeah... I understood that too when looking at the architecture pics of UOA
<mzanetti> mardy: but think about this use cases:
<mardy> mzanetti: we add support for multiple OAuth accounts for the same provider, which is something very difficult to do for an app handling OAuth itself
<mzanetti> mardy: a) I have an app that lets me find car2go's. I can create bookings if I'm oauth authenticated. But that doesn't give me any contacts or anything that would make sense showing up in all accounts. Its just that one app that needs to authenticate itself
<mzanetti> b) same goes for a fitbit app wanted to create. However, as I realized that it would be ubercool to have the fitbit stats directly in the infographics, I think that's actually use case for UOA
<mardy> mzanetti: yes, for (a) the benefit of using UOA is not much
<mardy> mzanetti: that is generally the case with app using a single account, for a well known provider
<mzanetti> mardy: yep
<mzanetti> mardy: anyways, exactly for this use case I came up with the in-process WebView to do the auth
<mardy> mzanetti: UOA is mostly useful for apps like Empathy, Shotwell, Evolution, which support many accounts/services, and of different types
<mzanetti> mardy: yep I understood that
<mzanetti> mardy: is the UOA team still the right one to talk about a in-app OAuth API or should I rather go to the SDK guys with that?
<mardy> mzanetti: but even for simpler apps, I think that now we have a QML API which is infinitely simple (despite the complex architecture it hides): http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~online-accounts/accounts-qml-module/trunk/view/head:/examples/simple-view.qml
<mardy> mzanetti: good quesion, I don't know :-)
<mardy> mzanetti: however, I wonder if it's worth it
<mardy> mzanetti: as you said yourself, it's not difficult for a developer to setup a QtWebKit view and perform the oauth in there
<mardy> mzanetti: and that's more portable than using a component we provide
<mardy> mzanetti: so, I'm not sure there's much point for someone to use our API
<mzanetti> mardy: yeah... ok... the more I think about it, the more it seems a SDK thing (making libqoauth work on the phone etc)
<didrocks> sil2100: maybe try with upstream for this fix? they can maybe look at the other ones as well
<sil2100> didrocks: which fix?
<cri> galaxy tab2 p3100 enable 3g and call phone?
<ogra> cri, talk to the person doing the port ... he/she should be noted on the wikipage for the device
<cri> ogra, tanks
<cking> stgraber, did you get my email with the ext4 comparisons?
<mhall119> Ubuntu Touch Clinic Hour starts now
<mhall119> Dr. Pope isn't in, so it's just me today
<jussi> ooh
<mhall119> if you have any questions, go ahead and ask 'em
<jussi> so how the heck do I install anything?  the install icons don't work. (main screen at the bottom)
<mhall119> yeah, that's not working yet, it's going to be part of Unity 8
<mhall119> for now you need to apt-get from the terminal
<jussi> oh, right. well that explains it.
<mhall119> but, the good new is, there's a terminal installed by default now!
<jussi> :)
<mhall119> you can search the Apps lens by tapping the "Search" on the top panel while in the Apps lens
<blaroche> are there any build docs for indidual apps like phone-app?
<blaroche> i wanted to start hacking on it and maybe others... see if i can fix a bug or two .. or more
<blaroche> just started looking at it last night, and was hoping to get time this weekend to really dig in
<mhall119> blaroche: they should all have something
<mhall119> it looks like the gallery-app just uses qmake .pro files
<mhall119> and they should all have inline ./debian/ packaging too
<blaroche> mhall119: i think i just have to spend time at it.  work out the cmake dependencies
<mhall119> if you have the bzr-builddeb package installed, you can just cd into the bzr branch directory and run "bzr builddeb -- -us -uc" to get a binary package
<mhall119> build dependencies should all be listed in ./debian/control on the Build-Depends line
<blaroche> mhall119: thank you.  i think that will get me going :)
<mhall119> blaroche: good luck, you can always come back with more questions anytime
<blaroche> mhall119: thanks, i will
 * h01ger just thought the weather app was broken, as it showed "sunny" for each day until june 10th in hamburg ;-) i was reliefed to see clouds+rain on the 11th 8-)
<mhall119> h01ger: sounds like a bug in hamburg
<h01ger> definitly. but tagged "worksforme" too
<mhall119> we can be a pessimistic bunch through can't we?  I almost files a bug yesterday because my battery wasn't draining as fast as I expected it to :)
<h01ger> :)
<m-b-o> h01ger:  I've double checked and looked out the window: sun is actually shining in HH :)
<om26er> Hey! How do I check my build number ?
<brejoc> hi there, are clinic hours still taking place?
<mhall119> om26er: good questions, I've wondered that myself
<mhall119> om26er: usually I just check the highest number in ~/Downloads/phablet-flash
<mhall119> brejoc: yes
<mhall119> for the next 20 minutes
<mhall119> popey and I do this every Wednesday
<mhall119> of course, you can ask questions any time in here
<om26er> mhall119, that's different for me as I have a few  devices connected to the same machine, so I am not sure which one of them is updated and which is not
<mhall119> but we've set this hour as a committed time for helping folks
<brejoc> nice. i've already asked that on the mailing list ([Ubuntu-phone] push to device messaging). Is there already a push notification system planned or is this something we'd have to initiate?
<mhall119> brejoc: there's been a push notification system discussed, but I don't think it's being planned yet
<mhall119> aquarius and I discussed how it might be done as part of Ubuntu One
<brejoc> mhall119: cool. will there be plans publicly available to participate in the discussion?
<mhall119> brejoc: I'm sure there will be
<mhall119> possibly at the next UDS
<mhall119> which I believe will be around August
<brejoc> mhall119: thanks!
<mhall119> no problem
<stgraber> cking: I did, thanks! I forwarded it to the rest of the people involved in yesterday's discussion.
<cking> stgraber, cool, if it needs revisiting with different tests, let me know I will see what we can do, but I'm tight on time nowadays
<stgraber> cking: it currently looks like we'll be using loop mounted images for devices where we can't grow/shrink the system and userdata partition to match what we need
<stgraber> cking: so hopefully use physical partitions on the devices we support ourselves and use loop-mounted partitions on the others (unless whoever is doing the community port figures out how to resize the partitions safely on their device, then they can do it too)
<h01ger> m-b-o, yeah its strange. and whats even more strange: since 5 days basically.
<ogra> cking, revisiting with different device would help a lot
<brejoc> one more question. i've been porting (no work at all) and testing saltstack, a remote admin tool, to ubuntu touch. salt has to be started via upstart. has anything to be done to make this work with the new container concept - especially in "touch mode"?
<cking> stgraber, ok, well, I didn't account for any tweaks on mount options or the vm to ensure we flush data more periodically to ensure data loss is minimised
<ogra> cking, the device category we target is like a third of the n4
<stgraber> cking: if you have a galaxy nexus, test results on it would be great. Otherwise I think sergiusens said he could do those measurements if you can provide him with instructions
<ogra> (read: we target the galaxy nexus class (dual core 1.2GHz/512M ram) by default
<cking> ogra, third in sense of what? CPU cycles, memory, etc?
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> might even be only 900MHz ... i'm not 100% sure
<ogra> but definitely a lot lower than the n4
<ogra> i guess that will have some impact on the results
<cking> stgraber, if he's got a 6.5 digit precision multimeter, then it's repeatable
<bobweaver> ping jstill no way to daul boot the n4 ?
<bobweaver> woops
<ogra> bobweaver, nope, and it will get more and more unlikely
<bobweaver> still no way to boot the n4 ?  *
<bobweaver> ogra,  why is that ?
<ogra> (dual booting that is ... booting alone should work since ages :) )
<ogra> bobweaver, because we move away from android more and more
<ogra> the flipped images already use an ubuntu initrd and require a certain setup that will likely break with dual boot hacks
<ogra> and see above
<ogra> there are even plans to re-partition the devices
<bobweaver> that is a good idea but for us people irl  we can not afford to loose money with missed text messages and what not
<ogra> (though i think we cznt really do that)
<ogra> *can't
<ogra> you shouldnt lose text messages at all if you use the stable image
<cking> ogra, I'll email sergiusens a guide on how to rig up the test
<ogra> cking, awesome, thanks !
<bobweaver> ogra,  I figured out why "Ubuntu Touch could not stream movies over the net" with qtmultimedia
<sergiusens> cking: I can get a hold of electronics... not ASAP, but I can
<bobweaver> has nothing to do with gstreamer as I was told in the past
<AskUbuntu> Phones that support Ubuntu Touch? | http://askubuntu.com/q/304399
<ogra> !devices | AskUbuntu
<ubot5> AskUbuntu: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<bobweaver> it is that my movies where not in intervals of 500 so they would not play not that I did that, they play fine and dandy. (qt 5.1beta)
<ogra> officially supported are only the nexus devices ...
<ogra> bobweaver, cool
<sergiusens> ogra: I see Nexus S4 :-P Might be confused with Samsung's S4 (or I am out of sync and these are Nexus indeed)
<ogra> heh
 * ogra has no clue about non google nexuses 
<bobweaver> ogra,  Example of text that I missed http://paste.ubuntu.com/5735859/    I lost about 300 usd because of it
<brejoc> #doublepost  -- one more question. i've been porting (no work at all) and testing saltstack, a remote admin tool, to ubuntu touch. salt has to be started via upstart. has anything to be done to make this work with the new container concept - especially in "touch mode"?
<ogra> bobweaver, thats what you get using a device clearly marked for development and dogfooding in financially critical production context
<ogra> bobweaver, seriously, if you hevily rely on SMS to make money, dont use ubuntu touch yet
<ogra> brejoc, does it require anything on the android side ?
<ogra> if it can run on i.e. ubuntu-desktop it wont make any difference wether the container is flippped or not
<bobweaver> ogra,  yeah lesson learned but I guess that all these people that are saying that everything works great in all there blogs and there posts on g+ made me feel a little saver maybe they are to blame and my stupidity
<bobweaver> IDK what dogfooding is
<ogra> eating your own dogfood ...  -> using your own unstable software to find its issues
<ogra> (emphasis on "unstable" :) )
<bobweaver> I see thanks ogra
<ogra> it surely works great regarding the expectations ...
<ogra> but i wouldnt 100% rely on it
<ogra> since bugs are expected
<brejoc> ogra: no, just plain ubuntu
<bobweaver> yeah I have it on my m7 but not on my n4 any more
<ogra> brejoc, then the container flip shouldnt have any influence
<bobweaver> n7 *
<ogra> yeah, thats what i would od as well
<ogra> (if my n7 coould boot the flipped container images :P )
<didrocks> sil2100: it seems you missed https://launchpadlibrarian.net/141698927/buildlog_ubuntu-saucy-i386.unity-scope-gdrive_0.9daily13.06.05-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<didrocks> sil2100: and https://launchpadlibrarian.net/141693500/buildlog_ubuntu-saucy-armhf.dee_1.2.5ubuntu1daily13.06.05-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz :(
<brejoc> ogra: good to know, thanks. one thing i still don't get is the method that has been chosen to determine which daemons are running in touch and desktop mode. is there a document available with more insight?
<didrocks> I'm relaunching the second
<ogra> brejoc, no, we dont have anything like that yet, i guess thats a matter of convergence which is a 14.04 task
<ogra> brejoc, i think upstart offers a way to find whats running though ... i guess we will make use of that
<ogra> but thats really up fro discussion still, converged setups are not in focus for 13.10
<brejoc> okay. thank you very much!
<didrocks> davidcalle: still around?
<ubuntero> I will present a lecture on Ubuntu and Ubuntu Touch tonight and would like to show Ubuntu Touch with core-apps. There is a way to put the core-apps in Ubuntu touch menu?
<blaroche> ubuntero: i use http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~popey/+junk/phablet-flash-wrapper/view/head:/add_apps.sh
<blaroche> line 56
<ubuntero> blaroche, thanks
<blaroche> thank popey :)
<davidcalle> didrocks, sure
<didrocks> davidcalle: unity-scope-gdrive failed https://launchpadlibrarian.net/141698927/buildlog_ubuntu-saucy-i386.unity-scope-gdrive_0.9daily13.06.05-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<didrocks> davidcalle: do you mind giving it a look (and poking sil2100__ once he's back)
<didrocks> sil2100__: I've fixed the second one by a rebuild
<mhall119> ubuntero: line 56 on that is really all you need
<mhall119> that will let you expand the Installed Apps section
<davidcalle> didrocks, a segfaulting test? For me? Thanks! :p
<didrocks> davidcalle: yw! ;)
 * bobweaver has just added Ubuntusdk toolkit to qt5.1 android lets see if it works on android 
<bobweaver> ahh stupid gio things are getting in the way
<didrocks> sil2100__: btw, you didn't remove the shopping lens from the config :/
 * bobweaver dont care aout icons 
<mhall119> bobweaver: the Ubuntu.Components have been built on MacOSX, so I'm sure they'll work on Android too
<bobweaver> jhodapp,  ping
<bobweaver> jhodapp,  I was able to get streaming happening on qt5.1 qtmultimedia
<bobweaver> jhodapp,  I am uploading a video atm will post when done
<jhodapp> bobweaver, hey
<jhodapp> bobweaver, does it have its own set of streaming sources?
<bobweaver> not sure what you mean by that
<bobweaver> it was a bug in android and not qt or anything like that
<bobweaver> videos have to be in intervals of 500
<jhodapp> bobweaver, well what do you mean by streaming then?
<bobweaver> my souce is from my myth tv backend here on my lan
<bobweaver> before it would not play  my videos
<bobweaver> remember
<jhodapp> bobweaver, ok, it's using gstreamer underneath?
<bobweaver> IDK Or IDTS
<bobweaver> let me look at log
<jhodapp> bobweaver, join #ubuntu-media
<cking> sergiusens, ogra, benchmarking notes posted
<sergiusens> cking: thanks
<ogra> cking, yay
<AskUbuntu> Asus Vivotab Smart ME400C | http://askubuntu.com/q/304400
<h01ger> it seems neither phablet-flash -d grouper -b nor phablet-flash -b seems to work on a nexus7. both get stuck in the bootloader, trying to write to /sdcard/
 * h01ger used an outdated version of phablet-flash
<MacSlow> Saviq, backend is correctly exported now and working... but something with snap-decisions is broken... looking into it
<ogra> cking, oh, you actually tested with only one loop mounted img ... great (the actual implementation would have like 4 loop mounts, i wonder if the impact would be worse)
<cking> ogra, i expect so, pressure on vm will be higher I guess
<ogra> yeah
<cking> ogra, i suspect that there will be far more dirty pages flying around which is always bad.
<ogra> yup ...
 * ogra thinks we should just keep what we have atm ... probably with some changes and improvements but just use the existing partitions
<cking> ogra, I admit my tests were naive, but they give one an idea of the impact at best case
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> and i expect it to be a lot worse it multiple images on a galaxy nexus
<bobweaver> ogra,  do you if there is a way to run x11 on android that is not vnc
<bobweaver> like how the n7 images where
<ogra> nope, i dont think there is one
<ogra> the n7 images didnt use any android
<bobweaver> ogra,  I see thanks
<bobweaver> ogra,  btw your awesome !!!!
<ogra> with the flipped container it might be possible to get xfbdev up though
<ogra> but without any GLES support ... i doubt that would help much
<ogra> heh, thanks :)
<Saviq> MacSlow, cool
<rickspencer3> awe_, rsalveti, et al .. have I mentioned how much I enjoy having cellular data now?
<ChickenCutlass> rickspencer3, is it working ok for you?
<rickspencer3> ChickenCutlass, yeah, I just followed rsalveti's directions in his blog
<rickspencer3> worked fine
<ChickenCutlass> rickspencer3, excellent.
<rickspencer3> looking forward to having the indicator support and all, of course
<ChickenCutlass> me too
<bobweaver> ogra,  why no gles support ?
<bobweaver> E/libEGL  (27730): eglDestroySurface:383 error 300d (EGL_BAD_SURFACE)
<ogra> bobweaver, because xfbdev directly attaches to fb0 and thats it
<ogra> it might not even work without kernel changes
<ogra> (since we dont have any framebuffer console enabled etc)
<ogra> we should see Mir on the images soon though, that should make everything better :)
<ogra> (and once XMir exists you will even be able to run X apps)
<awe_> rickspencer3, thanks!  glad you like it!
<rickspencer3> :)
<rsalveti> rickspencer3: awesome
<rsalveti> first step, more to come
<rsalveti> it'll only get better ;-)
<rickspencer3> :)
<rickspencer3> rsalveti, I understand that copying the network configuration file over and using the terminal to up/down the network connection are hacks for now
<rickspencer3> but, the data actually working seems like the foundation
<rsalveti> rickspencer3: yeah :-) we're happy we're able to communicate with the modem properly, and setting up the connection
<rsalveti> now we just need to hook that up properly with the higher stacks
<rickspencer3> rsalveti, will you be able to reuse NM code for writing out the configuration file?
 * rickspencer3 presumes that someone will have to write a new GUI
<awe_> rickspencer3, that work is underway
<rsalveti> rickspencer3: yeah, cyphermox_ is working on getting that more kind of automatic
<awe_> the idea is that NM will talk to ofono and get the config information directly
<rsalveti> crap, another net split
<rsalveti> so in theory all you'll need to do is setting up 'I want data call' :-)
<rsalveti> and in case your sim card doesn't offer you the right apn settings, you can then manually create the config
<rickspencer3> rsalveti, sounds cool
<rickspencer3> meantime, looks like the container flip and move to 100% saucy are both going well too
<rsalveti> rickspencer3: yup, lot of progress on both
<minhasse> hi
<minhasse> hello, i have a problem trying install the unbuntu touch
<minhasse> failed to copy 'Descargas/raring-preinstalled-phablet-armhf.zip' to '/sdcard/autodeploy.zip': Permission denied
<minhasse> someone can help meÂ¿?
<stgraber> slangasek: tried today's build yet? I'm downloading it now so just wondering whether it'll boot or not :)
<slangasek> stgraber: I have not
<slangasek> stgraber: ubuntu-touch or ubuntu-touch-preview?
<stgraber> slangasek: I'm grabbing ubuntu-touch
<slangasek> stgraber: yep - I haven't tried it at all yet; certainly, the previous build didn't work so hot for me
<slangasek> ogra: which is the last ubuntu-touch image that works for you?
<cjwatson> What's the recovery path like if I try ubuntu-touch and it explodes?
<stgraber> slangasek: yeah, I suspect we may still have some problems related to video4linux
<stgraber> cjwatson: boot to recovery, adb push the touch-preview .zip, reboot to recovery to have it flash
<slangasek> ogra: btw, where's the best place to work around bug #1187189?  I think we probably need to apply a divert in some common ubuntu-touch package, since we don't have per-device images
<ubot5> bug 1187189 in linux-mako (Ubuntu) "Kernel crash and reboot when accessing video device" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1187189
<cjwatson> ok, so not too terrible
<stgraber> cjwatson: worst case is 2 run through recovery (once for each .zip) and a fastboot flash of the boot partition
<stgraber> cjwatson: but yeah, we don't touch the recovery partition, so you can't really brick the device, worst case is really just restoring the boot partition and reset the data partition (which the .zip + recovery do)
<AskUbuntu> problem trying install unbuntu touch | http://askubuntu.com/q/304439
<ogra> slangasek, funny, i dont see it on maguro
<slangasek> ogra: sure, it's hardware-specific
<slangasek> or kernel-specific
<slangasek> but the rules are in the hardware-independent udev package, which means we need to apply a workaround to the rootfs
<ogra> slangasek, i would put is into lxc-android-config ... if you dont have android containers you probably want the device and its full function
<slangasek> ok
<slangasek> to be honest, I don't think it's related to the Android container, but I don't really care - we just need somewhere to put a dpkg diversion temporarily until the kernel bug can be fixed
<ogra> udev should really have a way to just put a rules file in place with lower sequence number that says "ignore" or so
<slangasek> hmm, maybe it does
<ogra> well, android vs x86 native images
<slangasek> stgraber: ^^ can you think of anything?
<stgraber> ogra: did you change something wrt how the partitions are mounted? I seem to always end up with a read-only data partition after boot now which prevents the lxc container from starting
<stgraber> (that's after manually removing the udev v4l rule file, otherwise the device won't even boot)
<seb128> mardy, hey
<mfisch> ChickenCutlass: we listen for IncomingMessage to turn the screen on, but what about ImmediateMessage?
<mfisch> ChickenCutlass: The docs mention a "Class 0 SMS", not sure what that is though
<slangasek> rsalveti: hi, so I see you've marked "investigate ueventd vs. udev" as "Done" - what's the result of that investigation?
<rsalveti> slangasek: our investigation was more to know if it'd be possible to have udev and uevent running at the same time
<rsalveti> as we were more worried that uevent could be broken because of it
<rsalveti> which is not the case
<rsalveti> so I marked it as done
<slangasek> right
<slangasek> ogra still has concerns about double-loading of firmware
<slangasek> are you saying that's not an issue?
<rsalveti> which firmware specifically?
<slangasek> I don't know
<rsalveti> the way android loads the firmware is not as standard as we have
<rsalveti> it's mostly part of init scripts and such
<slangasek> fwiw, my experience was that ueventd was *not* managing to load the firmware for me, because udev was too quick and had the modules loaded before the android container ever started
<rsalveti> I'm only concerned with the wifi drivers, but that's broken anyway
<slangasek> which is why I suggested udev should read /system/firmware and /vendor/firmware directly (and pitti has already uploaded this change)
<rsalveti> right
<slangasek> we may have to guarantee that /system and /vendor are mounted before we start udev, to ensure the drivers get their firmware
<rsalveti> hm, right
<rsalveti> that might complicate things around, but yeah, don't see an easier way
<slangasek> rsalveti: I'm merely calling this out as a reminder - I believe *currently* these are mounted from the initramfs before we ever start upstart, so no problem.  We just have to take care to guarantee this in the future if we do change the partitioning
<rsalveti> right, ok
<rickspencer3> anyone else noticing QtCreator spawning little windows for now discernable reason?
<rickspencer3> bzoltan1, ^ ?
<bzoltan1> rickspencer3:  It is a known issue for few weeks already... it is a present from upstream
<rickspencer3> it's pretty annoying
<bzoltan1> rickspencer3:  it is
<ogra> slangasek, /system and /vendor are now handled by mountall
<ogra> slangasek, should be sufficient for udev
<slangasek> ogra: no, handled by mountall is much too late for udev.
<bzoltan1> rickspencer3:  it will go away with newer Qt
<ogra> slangasek, oh, really ? i thought the rootfs mountall starts later
<ogra> err
<ogra> s/mountall/udev/
<bzoltan1> rickspencer3: the workaround is to delete ~/.config/QtProject and never click on the "Develop" tab.
<ogra> oh, yeah
 * ogra sees it starts on virtual-filesystems
<rickspencer3> bzoltan1, ok, I'll try that
<ogra> slangasek, thats bad, we might need to apply an override file that makes it wait until the container is up
<slangasek> ogra: the standard ordering is that /mountall/ relies on /udev/ to probe the disks for it and make them available so that mountall can mount them... so if udev in turn needs mountall to mount /system and /vendor for firmware, you've got a race
<ogra> so that we are sure android has done its duty
<slangasek> ogra: no, there's nothing that should wait for the container; we just need to early-mount /system and /vendor from the initramfs
<bzoltan1> rickspencer3:  I hope it helps. This issue came with the Qt 5.0.2 and known to exist in the upstream distributed releases too
<ogra> slangasek, then we might end up with double loading the firmware
<slangasek> ogra: please discuss that with rsalveti :)
<ogra> android will definitely force load it once we bring up the container
<ogra> i have no idea if thats bad or not ... but if there are any options handed to the fw we definitely want them to come from android, not from ubuntu
<rsalveti> I don't see that waiting android to load as an issue
<bzoltan1> rickspencer3: I have checked that either with the 2.8 QtC it is gone as with the Qt 5.1 it is resolved too.  So the problem is solved, we just need to reach with our roadmap the 2.8 QtC or the 5.1 Qt ... July-August
<ogra> (i know the broadcom fw needs the right parameters applied when loading it ... i guess there are others as well)
<rsalveti> yup, android usually gets a quite custom init script for most of the things
<rsalveti> that's why I'd prefer not touching it unless it's really needed
<ogra> rsalveti, well, if  the already laoded fw blocks loading it again and udev already loaded it with wrong args, we're screwed
<rsalveti> and wait cyphermox_ to understand all the issues with the wifi drivers
<rsalveti> yup, that's why for now I'd not make udev to load them
<ogra> so i would prefer if we could make sure that android has it in its hands
<slangasek> ah
<rsalveti> yup, at least for now
<rsalveti> until we can understand things a bit better
<slangasek> ok, so if we are delegating the firmware loading to android anyway
<slangasek> then we can probably revert this udev change (yay)
<ogra> and if slangasek/stgraber actually find a way for v4l to suppress udev we might want to use the same thing for all devices we know ship with fw
<slangasek> and just make udev start later
<ogra> well, we want udev to apply the android rules if the container comes up
<slangasek> what do you mean, "the android rules"?
<ogra> there are already quite a few links and permission changes i ship in lxc-android-config
<slangasek> /lib/udev/rules.d/65-android.rules ?
<ogra> and i expect that to grow a lot
<ogra> yeah
<slangasek> udev will apply those whether the container is running or not
<slangasek> and ueventd will of course create them initially with the right perms, not relying on udev for this
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> k
<ogra> then it should be no issue
<ogra> the point is that only loading the driver will get you a kernel event for some of them
<ogra> so udev actually should be up before the container since thats what loads them
<ogra> i guess we're good then
<slangasek> how do we know when the container is done "starting"?
<ogra> not sure if lxc-init blocks ...
<slangasek> "udev actually should be up before the container" - hmm?
<ogra> i was kind of assumeing that (if you look at the upstart job)
<slangasek> that's exactly the opposite of making sure ueventd loads the firmware
<ogra> you want udev to be up to catch the uevents
<slangasek> lxc-init has no way to block
<ogra> hmm, k
<slangasek> why do you want udev to catch the events?  you said you want them handled by ueventd
<ogra> then we might have to add a parker in init.rc
<ogra> s/parker/marker
<ogra> sigh, my typing
<ogra> slangasek, i want udev to create the links once devices show up
<slangasek> ogra: udev always creates links for *all* devices; see the udevtrigger job
<ogra> i'm not sure it catches the uevents if they were processed by ueventd already ... do they stay in the queue ?
<ogra> yes, udev isnt my concern, the kernels queue is
<ogra> if ueventd processed the event, does it still stay in the queue ?
<slangasek> it's not a queue... udevtrigger forces "coldplug" reprocessing of all hardware events
<ogra> ah
<slangasek> it walks the hardware tree and forces re-emitting of events for everything
 * ogra always thought the kernel had an even queue 
<ogra> ok
<slangasek> it does, but that's not what's used for udevtrigger
<ogra> then there are no issues i suppose
<slangasek> right, the only issue is properly deferring the udev startup until ueventd is done
<slangasek> and I don't know how you represent that
<ogra> well, if udevtrigger re-processes everyhting we could just call that
<ogra> regardless when udevd is started
<ogra> like ... call it from the lxc upstart job
<slangasek> how does that help us avoid races between udev and ueventd for loading the firmware?
<ogra> it doesnt
<slangasek> but that's the problem we need to solve
<slangasek> we need to not start udev until ueventd is done with its firmware loading; anything else will be a race
<slangasek> well
<ogra> the question is if thats true :) we operate on assumptions :)
<slangasek> udev won't *see* the firmware, so it won't get double-loaded... but it *will* nack the firmware requests
<slangasek> (I've seen this here, that's what led me to symlinking things around for /lib/firmware)
<ogra> if a driver doesnt care if it gets loaded the firmware twice it wouldnt be an issue
<ogra> we would only need to make sure android is last in the game
<ogra> so the right options are applied
<slangasek> it's not double-loading that's the problem
<slangasek> it's udev giving a nack before ueventd has a chance to ack
<ogra> if drivers block that we cant
<slangasek> there's no way to make sure android is "last in the game"
<ogra> if drivers dont block, we just need to make sure udev is done and then start lxc
<slangasek> the ordering is totally non-deterministic
<ogra> well, we have a way to know when udevtrigger is done
<slangasek> er, again, that's the opposite of what we were talking about above - why are you wanting to run udev *first* before lxc again?  just because we know when udevtrigger ends?
<adeola> hello all
<ogra> slangasek, i want to be sure that android applies the firmware config
<ogra> if the drivers dont care about it being loaded twice udev can do waht it wants as long as we can start android late enough to override it by loading it again
<slangasek> ogra: once we revert the udev patch, ueventd will be the only thing that sees the firmware, so there will be *no double-loading*
<ogra> except for devices that have something in linux-firmware
<slangasek> so the only thing we have to care about is making sure that udev is *not* nacking firmware requests that are supposed to go to ueventd
<slangasek> ogra: linux-firmware isn't installed in the image
<ogra> doesnt it come with the kertnel package ?
<ogra> which i assume we will install at some point
<slangasek> the kernel package isn't installed in the image ;)
<ogra> even though we dont atm
<slangasek> I don't see why we would install it
<ogra> well, will it stay that way ?
<ogra> ok
<slangasek> given that we have separate hardware packs
<slangasek> and the kernels have all drivers built in
<ogra> right
<ogra> well, not all
<rsalveti> slangasek: where is the nack code?
<rsalveti> and why is that happening? lack of files that udev can't find?
<slangasek> if we *do* need modules at some point, we probably still don't want to install full kernel package on the rootfs
<ogra> there are some modules listed in init.rc ... they are just not loaded on boot
<slangasek> rsalveti: systemd-udev has an internal 'firmware' handler that will send a nack if it can't find the file, yes
<ogra> rsalveti, can we make sure /lib/modules from the package ends up on the android side in the right place ?
<rsalveti> ogra: we could, but why?
<ogra> well, for potential modules that only get loaded on demand
<ogra> by init.rc
<slangasek> well, it can't be in the device-independent rootfs
<ogra> right
<slangasek> because we won't have the same kernel package everywhere
<ogra> we install the kernel package during android creation
<slangasek> so we'll have to be creative there
<didrocks> sil2100: any progress on the gdrive scope btw? :)
<ogra> so we should be able to copy the modules over
<rsalveti> why not bind mounting /lib/modules?
<rsalveti> as the kernel is the same anyway
<ogra> rsalveti, because we dont have anything in /lib/modules
<ogra> we dont actually install the kernel package
<slangasek> yes, that comes from the kernel package, the kernel packages are not device-independent, so they're not on the rootfs
<ogra> but we do it at android build tome
<ogra> *time
<ogra> so adding a simple cp -a is what i suggest
<rsalveti> right, we're not installing that package
<rsalveti> that's the first issue
<ogra> thats not an issue if android ships the modules (if there are any)
<rsalveti> right, I can make sure that happens
<rsalveti> then we need a post inst in the kernel package itself to copy the modules over
<rsalveti> but looks dirty
<slangasek> cp -a from where to where?
<bfiller> sergiusens, ogra : what is the recommended way for a package to install a file in the user's home dir? i.e. maliit wants to drop a conf file in ~/.config/maliit.org/server.conf
<slangasek> it's not clear to me what "android creation" is - you mean the container extraction / setup?
<rsalveti> slangasek: android image creation
<ogra> bfiller, hmm, sounds like a good question for a desktop guy ... seb128 ^^^
<bfiller> assuming line 41 in this diff is not the right way: https://code.launchpad.net/~thomas-moenicke/phablet-extras/maliit-plugins_wordribbon/+merge/165590
<seb128> ogra, bfiller: we don't
<ogra> slangasek, the creation of the content of /system
<ogra> seb128, we dont, but we could add a session service that does it
<rsalveti> but we might have issues if we don't build /system at the same time we build our boot.imgs
<seb128> ogra, bfiller: the user directory might be encrypted, not mounted (on nfs), etc
<seb128> ogra, right, that's out of packaging though
<mhall119> bfiller: why doesn't maliit create it on-demand when the user needs it?
<mhall119> that's usually the right way to do it
<seb128> bfiller, ogra: either teach the software to look for a default in /etc before the user dir or teach the software to create the file on first run
<mhall119> if it exists use it, otherwise create it with some defaults
<bfiller> seb128, mhall119 : makes sense, thanks
<slangasek> ogra: ok - so it would be /lib/modules -> /system/lib/modules or such?
<rsalveti> yup
<slangasek> ok, sounds fine
<bfiller> seb128: what about dropping something into /etc/skel? thought those got copied into user's home dir on user creation
<rsalveti> ugly but would allow us to have a single rootfs
<ogra> like we update the xdg dir names etc in a gnome session
<ogra> rsalveti, we dont build boot imgs anymore in the flipped world
<ogra> we only build initrds on the android side
<rsalveti> ogra: our own bootimgs
<seb128> bfiller, they do, but that's hackish and that let users upgrading out
<rsalveti> as that's when we choose the kernel to be used
<stgraber> bfiller: bad idea as that'd only work for any user created after the package is installed not for any existing user
<ogra> (or at least thats all we need to)
<ogra> rsalveti, boot.img creation is in live-build in the flipped container setup
<seb128> bfiller, what's the issue with making the code look into /etc if there is no user config?
<ogra> geez ... freenode stop splitting ...!
<seb128> bfiller, that's more robust and cleaner
<rsalveti> ogra: so we need to make sure /system gets all the modules from the same kernel we use when we create our own boot.img
<bfiller> seb128: no issue, just slightly more work in the code. but sounds like it's the proper way so that's what we'll do
<seb128> bfiller, thanks
<slangasek> ogra: bearing in mind that if I get my way, the system partition won't be /system anymore ;)
<ogra> rsalveti,, hmm
<ogra> slangasek, it will always be ... in android ... no matter what you shove underneath it
<ogra> and we will always need that dir in ubuntu
<mhall119> ogra: rsalveti: I'm going to be filing some bugs about nexus 7 functionality, do we have device-specific tags on Launchpad ?
<ogra> under /system ...
<rsalveti> mhall119: not yet
<ogra> not necessarily a partition indeed
<rickspencer3> oh geez
<mhall119> rsalveti: would you prefer common name od code name? "nexus7" or "grouper"?
<rsalveti> mhall119: grouper
<ogra> ++
<mhall119> will do, thanks
 * rsalveti needs go grab some food
<rsalveti> *to
<ogra> to go ? :)
<rsalveti> :-)
<slangasek> ogra: right.  But if we're putting Ubuntu on the system partition already, we may just blat the hardware-specific bits onto the same filesystem in their separate directories, and there wouldn't be any 'cp -a' involved anymore - just a couple of symlinks
<ogra> sure
<ogra> i'm still not convinced it is a good idea to touch the partitioning though
<ogra> buut loop mounting doesnt seem to be the solution either
<ogra> (waiting for gnex test results though ... but i expect them to be much worse ... gnex is essentially a panda and i know how badly live images suck on pandas)
<ogra> (though that involves a squashfs additionally)
<stgraber> yeah, at least in our case it'd be ext4 partition file on ext4 partition which should be pretty different from squashfs partition file on vfat
<stgraber> we'd be skipping the compression part of squashfs at the very least
<LokiScarlet> Hi. Nexus 4, raring, installed using zips in CWM. Where do I go in the UI for settings and shiz?
<ogra> stgraber, right, but i'm still not convinced
<stgraber> ogra: well, the thing is, we don't have many choices there. We need separate storage so we can deal with updates and have the system read-only. So we either resize the existing partitions to accomodate that or we need to use loop mounts.
<ogra> LokiScarlet, only from the top panel atm ... the settings UI is designed but not done yet
<stgraber> both solutions have their own problems, but we'll need to pick one of the two for each piece of hardware we have
<LokiScarlet> Thanks.
<ogra> stgraber, well, i'm strongly against changing partitions
<ogra> users wont be able to revert to android
<stgraber> and the sooner we do that the better, because it's going to need a bit of work and it's currently preventing some work from being done (image based upgrades)
<ogra> and as long as we dont have a factory device we shouldnt touch it
<ogra> stgraber, on devices where we cant touch the part table at all we will have to use loop anyway
<stgraber> well, that's not true, they'd be able to restore Android just fine, they'd just end up loosing around 1GB of their userdata partition (or a bit more depending on device)
<ogra> no matter what
<ogra> so i guess thats the one thing we need to implement now
<stgraber> I don't see why Android would refuse to boot if its system partition is twice the usual size
<ogra> fastboot will fall over
<ogra> when flashing
<ogra> has nothing to do with booting
<ogra> the img files have the excat partition size inside
<ogra> *exact
<ogra> so the user would have to change the partitioning back to the original setup ...
<stgraber> ah, yeah, that's a bit annoying then. We'd have to provide a binary in Ubuntu to restore the partition table and reboot into fastboot
<ogra> which is quite an advanced task
<ogra> since it differs by device
<stgraber> slangasek: ^
<ogra> and even by device model
<ogra> i think we should go with the same setup everywhere and not have two
<slangasek> hmm, and I suppose fastboot would be the preferred method for restorting android, wouldn't it
<ogra> only if we ship factory images we should touch partitioning
<ogra> slangasek, depends on the device
<stgraber> slangasek: yep, that's what Google provides in their factory images...
<stgraber> slangasek: so based on what ogra's saying, trying a restore would essentially brick the phone (or fail if you're lucky)
<slangasek> ok.  So, *if* we repartition, we need to have provisions for rolling this back
<ogra> right
<slangasek> ogra: oh, but wait; you don't fastboot restore the userdata partition
<ogra> i would keep the partitoning option for factory only
<slangasek> which is the only partition that's becoming smaller
<ogra> and not have two ways for the non factory setups
<slangasek> so you should be able to fastboot an undersized image onto the expanded system partition with no problems
<ogra> yeah, userdata might just be formatted
<slangasek> it just wouldn't be resize2fs'ed to use the full partition
<slangasek> so I think this is not actually a problem either
<slangasek> though I can do some more real-world testing if you like
<ogra> so you wouldnt change /system but /data then
<stgraber> we're currently growing /system and shrinking /data
<stgraber> so as long as fastboot allows flashing to a bigger partition, we're fine
<ogra> well, just leave /system alone as is
<LokiScarlet> ... That reminds me, I actually tried formatting the user data... Had to reinstall so I went for Raring after that number
<stgraber> nope, we can't do that without creating new partitions and we certainly don't want to do that
<ogra> let it be what it is ... shrink /data and grab 2-4 G for /
<LokiScarlet> I don't like being this lola person ^_^
<slangasek> LokiScarlet: "lola person"?
<ogra> stgraber, why not ?
<ogra> slangasek, lola chang is in the demo contacts :)
<slangasek> ogra: ah
<LokiScarlet> slangasek: Whoever has these contacts and messages when you install touch
<ogra> LokiScarlet, see the release notes wikipage
<slangasek> ogra: I don't think leaving the system partition empty and stealing all 2GB from the userdata partition is safer
<ogra> it has instructions how to get rid of that
<LokiScarlet> Thaaaaaaank youuuuuuuuuuuuu
<ogra> slangasek, i didnt say empty
<ogra> slangasek, leave it be what it is
<ogra> androids /system
<ogra> that way fastboot wont have issues for flashing to it
<stgraber> ogra: well, we'd waste whatever space is already allocated to system and we'd risk causing bigger changes to the partition table which may cause problems with the bootloaders/android
<slangasek> ogra: mmm.  possible.  Still, I think we can make better use of the available space, without exposing users to any risk.
<Uto> hi there
<slangasek> I think the resize is safe
<ogra> what "available space" ?
<ogra> my /system on maguro is 600M
<slangasek> ogra: the system + userdata partitions
<ogra> there is not much wasted space here
<Uto> someone can tell me why I stuck at blackscreen please?
<slangasek> the "available space" on the disk that is allocated for the OS + data
<Uto> http://pastebin.com/qtSgvUs5
<kenvandine> popey, can you add plonk to the collections meta package?
<stgraber> ogra: right, and around a GB on nexus4, that's not negligible on a 8GB device, so re-using it to make a bigger system partition is definitely worth it
<slangasek> right - these aren't huge disks
<slangasek> I think we do care about not letting 600M, or 1GB, go to waste
<stgraber> ogra: what slangasek is doing is grow /system from 600MB to 2GB and shrink userdata by 1200MB to make this possible. Partition numbers don't change, only the start/end offsets do
<ogra> well, but that means 80% of our porters wont be able to use that setup, all users that just try ubuntu will have to be handled special with a rollback mechanism etc
<stgraber> which is a far smaller change to the table than shrinking + adding partitions
<slangasek> ogra: the need for this special rollback mechanism is unproven
 * ogra would prefer if we went with loop for the public images and do the partition dance only on factory
<slangasek> as I said, I expect fastboot to have no problems blatting an undersized image onto a partition
<stgraber> slangasek: well, it's quite likely that people won't like loosing 1.2GB of usable storage just because they tried Ubuntu
<ogra> instead of having to implemet two ways right now
<slangasek> ogra: that would mean a completely different and untested boot layout for the factory
<ogra> slangasek, we can test it on the n4 i supppose
<ogra> i just wouldnt ship two setups
<slangasek> stgraber: sure; in that case we can factor in the partition resizing rollback
<slangasek> I guess we would want to stash the original partition geometry in the recovery partition or something?
<ogra> or in the cache one
<stgraber> cache is between system and userdata on the nexus4 so probably not the best place to store that data on (as it's likely to be re-formated in the resizing process)
 * ogra still doesnt like that we have to implement two completely different things ...
<stgraber> ogra, slangasek: anyway, let me update yesterday's pad with what I think are the next steps so we can hopefully move forward with that stuff
<slangasek> ogra: well, I think we can minimize the differences... use loop devices on the generic ports, use raw partitions on the supported devices... that at least gives us alignment on the initramfs
<ogra> slangasek, we need to do two different builds ...  will have to handle different bugs etc etc ... and it costs extra time we are getting short of
<ogra> once we have a vendor we can dedicate someone to implement the partitioning stuff and extra builds etc ... havving support for both in the initrd already might make sense though
<ogra> (i assume factory builds wouldnt come from cdimage anyway)
<slangasek> ogra: I am frankly more concerned about the many potential bugs resulting from the current differences between the touch rootfs and the standard ubuntu rootfs.  mountall is still not working right, and I'm not enthusiastic about trying to make all this work right with the current model
<ogra> to me it seems like we're splitting effort where we need all hands on deck already
<ogra> slangasek, mountalll works as defined in the blueprint (adding an override for fsck in fstab for /dev/root so /lib/init/fstab doesnt kick in) ... plymouthj is our issue
<ogra> system. data and vemdor are alll automounted by mountall in the latest flipped image
<slangasek> ogra: no, mountall is not working correctly here
<ogra> i didnt see any complaints from it in the logs either ...
<ogra> slangasek, whats wrong then ?
<slangasek> that's because mountall doesn't log anywhere useful by default
<ogra> ah, i would have expected something in either dmesg, syslog or the upstart job log
<slangasek> by default, mountall logs everything to plymouth ;P
<ogra> heh
<slangasek> but if you edit /etc/init/mountall.conf to run with --verbose, and disable 'console output', you'll get some interesting stuff in /var/log/upstart/mountall.log
 * ogra will try 
<ogra> i assume it doesnt like to have / on a bindmount
<stgraber> ogra, slangasek: bottom of http://pad.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch-fs-structure
<ogra> but either of the above discussed stuff will fix that
<slangasek> mountall: root filesystem isn't mounted
<slangasek> so it's possible that's not hurting anything
<slangasek> but it doesn't make me comfortable
<slangasek> as for fixing that ... having the system partition be an Ubuntu rootfs would fix it
<ogra> yeah, thats surely the bind mount
<slangasek> stgraber: hmm, what about the pad?
<stgraber> slangasek: yeah, the loop mount should fix that as /dev/loop0 will be the rootfs, so as / will be backed by a block device, mountall should be happy
<slangasek> well
<stgraber> slangasek: I added a "proposed implementation" section, detailing what I think we should do at the moment to support both setups and what are the changes for all the bits I can think of
<slangasek> right
<slangasek> so I don't think it makes sense to move to *just* the loop mount configuration, given the performance penalty
 * ogra just got some kebab on his lap ... 
<ogra> back in a few ...
<slangasek> I think this is all worth doing only if we're preferentially implementing/supporting the native partition approach
<stgraber> slangasek: sure, we should support both, though I think my updated proposal should limit the performance issue by quite a bit as only the base system will be loop mounted and will be read-only so should cache pretty well
<stgraber> everything else is bind-mounts straight from the data partition (that we'll have to mount --move to /data so we don't end up with the same mess we have at the moment)
<slangasek> ah, did cking say we're ok for read-only performance?
<rsalveti> stgraber: slangasek: ogra: also, remember we can't rely on fastboot necessarily
<rsalveti> we're also supporting phones that are not fastboot compatible
<rsalveti> and changing partition might break the proprietary method to flash the devices
<rsalveti> if they are not creating the partition table and formating the filesystem properly when flashing the device
<slangasek> rsalveti: we're only proposing to change partitions on our "supported" devices, and only if we can demonstrate that it works: so mako maguro grouper $otheroneiforgot
<rsalveti> so it's quite scary to change partitions
<slangasek> rsalveti: and for products I assume we have control over the partition table from the factory
<rsalveti> right, but how shold we apply to the rest of the other devices?
<rsalveti> people doing ports?
<slangasek> rsalveti: that's the loop mount fallback
<rsalveti> hm, so we'd need to support both
<rsalveti> stgraber: is there any file system that we could put at /data that would reduce the side effect of loop mount files?
<slangasek> yes - hopefully with minimized differences between the support requirements for the two...
<rsalveti> that sounds painful
<stgraber> slangasek: no, he didn't say that, however his biggest concern with the loop mount idea was data corruption which should be reduced by not having writeable loop mounted partitions. The read speed results are rather odd to be honest with mostly good speeds except for a couple of runs that had awful speed.
<ogra> rsalveti, ++
<rsalveti> and the problem is that we'd only test the option we're using
<stgraber> slangasek: also, read speeds of > 500MB/s on a mobile device suggests it was reading from cache (that or we have 6Gbps access to the flash which sounds surprising)
<ogra> especially since it's an eMMC
<rsalveti> yup
<ogra> getting more than 30M/s would be surprising
<rsalveti> yeah
<slangasek> rsalveti: so to my mind, we're going to end up supporting two options no matter what once there are phones shipping - because I don't see us wanting production devices to have the OS on the userdata partition
<slangasek> rsalveti: do you agree?
<ogra> and the loop mount is apparently bad at reading ...
<ogra> not at writing
<ogra> so redonly wont change anything i suppose
<stgraber> rsalveti: I personally would expect the overhead to be minimal if we only have the read-only system partition loop mounted from userdata and that it's written in one big continuous file (no fragmentation)
<rsalveti> slangasek: right, but who and how we're going to test without the repartitioning option?
<stgraber> ogra: well, that's the part I'm not sure of, would have to talk to cking but his measurements are way higher than what we should be getting on flash
<ogra> definitely
<cking> stgraber, i guess we need to test I/O patterns that are not getting cached with something more exhaustive, like bonnie++
<slangasek> rsalveti: well, my point is that if we're going to have two different layouts anyway by the time we get to the product stage, it's better to get our "preferred" layout as close as possible to production now, not wait until later; and to minimize the differences between what we're supporting
<stgraber> ogra: they are in MB/s so that kind of speed suggests he was testing the cache, not the actual partition, so therefore those measurements are meaningless. The write ones look reasonable and the few slow read ones look reasonable too. I just think that any > 100MB/s was from cache and so should be discardded.
<slangasek> rsalveti: as for who would do the validation of the loopback option, if it exists for community ports, shouldn't that be a community validation?
<stgraber> cking: right, that or flush the cache between the tests? (echo 3 > /proc/sys/vm/drop_caches IIRC)
<ogra> cking, dd woth cache disabled should do as well
<ogra> *with
<stgraber> cking: anyway, I was mostly interested in the power and write impact myself, so those measures I believe were correct and look reasonable to me
<rsalveti> slangasek: right, but I just want to avoid people having issues with the ports just because we don't test or validate if we're breaking that option
<ogra> slangasek, first someone needs to do the implementation ... and create these special images etc
<rsalveti> that's why I'd prefer if we could use a common solution at least initially
<ogra> and we'd have the community getting totally different bugs
<cking> stgraber, yep, I was more concerned with the overhead in terms of power, but we can repeat the tests with larger file I/O and different tests if required, it's not a big deal to re-measure
<stgraber> rsalveti: so the only change would be mounting /dev/mmcblk0pX instead of /dev/loopX, if we have any other code difference between the two setups it's because we badly implemented it
<rsalveti> stgraber: right
<slangasek> ogra, rsalveti: I'm confident we can minimize the bug surface with a proper design.  But I think ogra's last comment is my cue to stop discussing it now, and go off and try to implement something sane ;)
<stgraber> oh, unless we want to have mountall mount the data partition instead of the initrd, in which case we'd indeed have a pretty different booth path
<ogra> stgraber, as i said above ... we need different images, different install methods and users will have different bugs we cant reproduce easily
<rsalveti> slangasek: right, as long we do the implementation and review it properly, I'm fine
<rsalveti> and if we would need the loop solution anyway, I'd go and implement that first
<ogra> ++
<rsalveti> and it seems easier
<slangasek> ogra: oh, coming back around to ueventd vs. udev, I'm not sure we converged on a solution yet
 * ogra would go with loop only as i said in the beginning
<slangasek> I think we still want ueventd to go first
<stgraber> well, Steve's is actually easier as long as you aren't scared of using gfdisk on a phone ;)
<ogra> so make udev start on started lxc-android-config
<stgraber> (which I tend to be with pieces of hardware where I can't pull the disk and fix the partition table by hand)
<slangasek> ogra: that doesn't delay it long enough
<ogra> slangasek, i know it isnt 100% reliable ...
<slangasek> we need it to start after ueventd is *done*
<slangasek> it's not even 50% reliable
<rsalveti> slangasek: would that solve the nack problem?
<rsalveti> or udev would still nack firmware requests?
<ogra> we can implement something in init.rc that sets a parker once init.rc is done
<rsalveti> later on
<ogra> thats the only idea i have
<ogra> s/parker/marker/
<slangasek> rsalveti: TTBOMK, the firmware requests will not get handled again by udev
<ogra> but that will only tell you when androids init is finished
<stgraber> slangasek: want me to quickly implement the loop mount setup, then you can use that but dd my system.img to your system partition and look at what needs changing to have it working for you too?
<slangasek> stgraber: sure, go for it
<stgraber> rsalveti: btw, any hope of patching Android's init not to mount partitions? it's creating quite a bit of a mess on my device with it trying to mount everything. I'd much rather have Ubuntu mount the partitions and LXC bind-mount them before starting the container.
<ogra> stgraber, that will be hard to do since we would have to inject device specific fstabs into the ubuntu root
<rsalveti> stgraber: do you want to remove all the mount requests?
<rsalveti> right
<ogra> you could just drop fstab from android
<ogra> to prevent it mounting
<slangasek> ogra: doesn't the container already fail to mount anything due to permissions?
<stgraber> slangasek: nope, we don't have apparmor, so it's unfortunately allowed to do whatever it wants at the moment
<ogra> it usually just calls "mount /$mountpoint" in eth init scripts
<slangasek> stgraber: ah
<ogra> slangasek, it mounts its partitions just fine
<ogra> and i sanitized that bit a lot over the last days
<rsalveti> stgraber: only partition I see there we could not make android mount is /data
<stgraber> ogra: for a definition of "just fine" that currently makes my / become read-only and the kernel complaining quite a bit (data corruption)
<rsalveti> stgraber: there are device specifics and also /system, /modem, /cache and such
<ogra> stgraber, on todays flipped image from cdimage ?
<stgraber> ogra: yep, that image gets me a read-only root and no container running
<ogra> on maguro ?
<rsalveti> that's weird
<ogra> (i have no mako to test)
<rsalveti> our fstab should be mounting /data with ro
<rsalveti> ops, rw
<stgraber> rsalveti: right. So at the very least we want to prevent it from mounting /data, /system and /cache. The rest I don't really care about
<stgraber> ogra: mako
<ogra> it definitely works for a few people i spoke to today
<stgraber> ogra: I don't have maguro here
<rsalveti> stgraber: why not mounting /system and /cache?
<rsalveti> we're not using such partitions anyway
<ogra> stgraber, note that todays image has a bug that requires you to boot twice after the first install
<stgraber> rsalveti: we use /cache for our updates, so we need it on the Ubuntu side and /system will be the Ubuntu rootfs or will be unused so we don't want it mounted
<rsalveti> rootfs under /system?
<ogra> heh
<rsalveti> we can't unless we redo the partition
<ogra> thats what they plan
<rsalveti> right, let's just do the loop mount solution under /data for now
<rsalveti> what is the problem with that?
 * ogra is laughing his butt off ... seeing rsalveti as shocked as i was in the beginning
<ogra> rsalveti, performance
<rsalveti> are we increasing the size of /cache as well?
<ogra> but i'm fully in the loop camp as well here
<ogra> i think repartitioning isnt a good idea
<rsalveti> right, +1
<rsalveti> we should go with steps, first have the loop based solution working, and then we can try to repartition with some devices
<ogra> ++
<rsalveti> and have both solutions as supported by our install && upgrade methods
<ogra> i was even suggesting to keep the repartitioning only for factory
<stgraber> so, my expectation is that the Ubuntu rootfs will contain /var/lib/lxc/android/rootfs which will contain what's currently in the Android initrd AS WELL AS /var/lib/lxc/android/rootfs/system/ which is what we currently have in the Android system partition
<stgraber> those won't come from the generic rootfs tarball but from a separate tarball which is stacked on the first
 * ogra got that by now ... after two days of discussion
<stgraber> so we don't need to mount /system in the container as it's already there
<rsalveti> right, but we could
<ogra> we need to have full read access to /system from ubuntu
<stgraber> we'll mount a tmpfs to /cache as we don't need persistence in there and we actually need the real cache partition for our updates in Ubuntu
<ogra> as well as the included /vendor
<stgraber> and we'll bind-mount a sub-directory of the real /data as Android's /data
<ogra> and links didnt work when i tested here
<ogra> they need to be real bind mounts
<ogra> 9at least soft links didnt)
<stgraber> ogra: that didn't work because Android was mounting the partitions
<ogra> no
<stgraber> ogra: if we mount the partition in Ubuntu and bind-mount them within the container, it'll work
<ogra> we mount the partitions way before android
<rsalveti> what is the problem with having android image flashed under /system?
<stgraber> ogra: as they'll be visible under /var/lib/lxc/android/rootfs as standard mount points
<ogra> mountall does
<rsalveti> as that would be way easier for people doing ports
<ogra> rsalveti, we might lose a few 100M
<stgraber> ogra: then Android mounted it again creating a huge mess, yeah, that's what I'm trying to fix
<rsalveti> ogra: why?
<ogra> thats the cobncern i heard from slangasek at least
<ogra> tsimpson, because /system isnt 100% full ?
<ogra> no idea
<ogra> err
<ogra> sorry tsimpson that was for rsalveti
<rsalveti> right, but we don't care about /system
<rsalveti> unless we're doing the partitions again
<ogra> stgraber, androids mounts shouldnt even be vsible to you
<ogra> i dont get that here
<ogra> stgraber, are you soure you completekly wiped /data before trying todays image ?
<ogra> none of that should happen
<stgraber> ogra: the problem is that you're not allowed to mount the same block device twice. The kernel apparently is very confused when that's done in a container and let you do it anyway, which means /dev/mmcblkX is mounted twice in two different namespaces and read-write in both, which means very likely data corruption and similar mess
<rsalveti> my solution would be having android flashed under /system (at least for now, and supporting that as an option for later), removing /cache and /userdata from android fstab, and doing the ubuntu rootfs with loop mount files under /data
<ogra> stgraber, except /data nothing is mounted rw anywhere
 * ogra wonders if stgraber really tested the right image ... i have no complaints at all anywhere 
<ogra> i can imagine to see data corruptiion if both would write to the same place in /data, but that cant happen at all
<stgraber> ogra: right, and when Android attempts to mount /data in the container that fails, the kernel remounts it read-only and as my / comes from /data, my / becomes readonly
<ogra> huh ?
<ogra>  /data is definitely mounted fine here in both OSes
<rsalveti> stgraber: that we can easily remove
<stgraber> ogra: yes, and that's a bug, that shouldn't be possible and is very very bad
<rsalveti> but android would need a /data which is rw
<ogra> and since android will never write to /data/ubuntu nor will ubuntu write to a toplevel dir in /data we should be totally safe
<rsalveti> either a directory, mount loop as well or partition
<rsalveti> remember we have blobs writing stuff under /data
<stgraber> ogra: ext doesn't support being mounted more than once at any given time, if you do that, you're going to eventually mess with the journal or have both try to write the same block at some point
<ogra> from the ubuntu side ?
<ogra> stgraber, right, so the loop mount will fix that for /data ... i still dont see an issue for /system
<ogra> since thate readonly everywheer
<ogra> *thats
<ogra> (and i still dont get whats wrong with your image ... )
<stgraber> ogra: well, in slangasek's case, the system partition won't quite contain an Android system, so letting Android mount that sounds like a bad idea. It's much simpler to simply have the tree under /var/lib/lxc/android/rootfs/ already contain the system directory. That way, no need to mount it, it's perfectly readable from Ubuntu and everyone is happy
<rsalveti> stgraber: so if we remove /system, /data and /cache from the android specific fstab, how should we mount them from the ubuntu side? we'd need to have hw specifics even if we want to boot with the loop mount option (which we don't care about /system)
<stgraber> rsalveti: so /system would be part of the Ubuntu rootfs partition, no need to mount that one then. /data is already mounted from the initrd so we'll have the logic there. Only missing one is /cache which we may also mount from the initrd if easier.
<stgraber> I have a feeling slangasek will disagree with me there, but I think we should mount all the partitions from the initrd and only have mountall deal with the bind-mounts
<rsalveti> stgraber: in the loop mount case /system is not going to be used, right?
<slangasek> ogra: I have several concerns here: - inefficient use of available (limited) disk space; - OS on read-write filesystem (even if there's a loop-mounted ro image) increasing risk of corruption, etc; - the filesystem heirarchy is very different from standard Ubuntu, increasing the risk of touch-specific bugs in the foundations layer
<stgraber> rsalveti: correct. We won't touch it and won't mount it (so we'll waste it but at least we'll be consistent with the non-loop setup)
<rsalveti> stgraber: so the device specific boot.img would need the device specific fstab to be consumed there, and mounted during boot
<ogra> slangasek, i agree about /data .... i dont get the /system bit and would expect android to actually have picked the /system size carefullt already
<stgraber> rsalveti: right, my though is that we should only be mounting physical partitions from the initrd as the bootimg is already hardware specific, so it doesn't hurt hardcoding them in there
<rsalveti> otherwise there's no easy way to know where the partitions are
<stgraber> *thought
<rsalveti> right
<ogra> slangasek, as i suggested way up ... just shrink /data and split it in two ...
<rsalveti> the size of /system would only work for android, most of the times
<ogra> we wouldnt even need to touch the anroid fstab
<ogra> yeah
<rsalveti> stgraber: so I'd agree to move fstab from android to our boot.img, and have that mounted during boot
<rsalveti> that wouldn't cause us any issue
<ogra> touching /system seems really unneeded
<slangasek> stgraber: actually, I don't disagree with you; I hadn't made up my mind about whether the initramfs or mountall should be responsible for mounting, but certainly for the loop-mount case, the initramfs is gonna have to have some smarts
<ogra> rsalveti, except that we use totally different mount oprions most likely
<ogra> *options
<rsalveti> ogra: that's true
<slangasek> ogra: android has picked the /system size carefully for android, not for Ubuntu, and we aren't installing a full android on it.  And again, I think resizing system is safer than splitting userdata.
<stgraber> slangasek: ok. I think we should have the initrd always mount all the partitions we need, in both setups. As we unfortunately don't have a reliable way of figuring out what partition is what on all devices (labels are great but unfortunately they aren't identical on all devices...)
<ogra> slangasek, does it ? i think loop mounting is supported ootb
<slangasek> ogra: loop-mounting a root filesystem is supported in initramfs-tools?
<slangasek> this idea scares me :)
<ogra> i think so, yes
<rsalveti> stgraber: android ships a device specific fstab per device, as they don't have a rule for label, so there's not much we can do I'd guess
<ogra> there is mountall code in the local script for it
<ogra> err
<stgraber> rsalveti: right
<ogra> mountooor
<ogra> bah
<ogra> mountroot
<Uto> please can you have a look on this?
<Uto> http://pastebin.com/uQt3v7Gh
<ogra> stgraber, even the labels differ
<stgraber> ogra: isn't that what I just said? :)
<ogra> stgraber, well, i didnt see your sentence above :) ... was correcting my typos
<rsalveti> stgraber: so we only need to remove /system, /data and /cache from android's fstab, the rest can still be mounted by android, right?
<ogra> you can easily find them by looking at the mountpoints in fstab
<ogra> oh, definitely
<ogra> each device has device specific mounts you dont want to rip out
<stgraber> rsalveti: yep, I expect the rest to be safe as we won't mount them in Ubuntu
<ogra> maguro has a habndfulll of things under /mnt
<ogra> for example
<rsalveti> stgraber: ok
<rsalveti> changed the pad to state that
 * stgraber is almost done generating his new system.img file
<stgraber> ogra: is there a tool I can use to convert saucy-preinstalled-touch-armel+mako.zip into its filesystem representation (equivalent of /system)?
<stgraber> ogra: or do I need to parse updater-script myself and apply all the changes by hand (would be a bit annoying)
<rsalveti> stgraber: would probably be better to use the system.img file
<ogra> unzip it :)
<ogra> right, that contains the img
<rsalveti> stgraber: that should already have all the modifications done by the updater-script
<stgraber> rsalveti: sure, I would if I had it :)
<ogra> and that you can just loop moont
<rsalveti> stgraber: you can grab from jenkins I guess, let me check
<ogra> stgraber, pull it from cdimage
<ogra> ubuntu-touch-preview has it
<rsalveti> true
<stgraber> ogra: ah, ok, will do that then. Wasn't sure it'd be identical to the .zip
<ogra> (vs ubuntu-touch which is the flipped img)
<rsalveti> guess that's used with phablet-flash -b
<ogra> yeah
<rsalveti> indeed
<rsalveti> stgraber: then just consume from the img
<stgraber> yep, doing that now, much much simpler ;)
<stgraber> I'll have to talk with ogra about producing shiny .tar.xz for all those bits, but the current .tar.gz and .img are easy enough to convert (unpack + repack)
<sergiusens> stgraber: it is... it should be identical
<sergiusens> rsalveti: look at my MR! :-)
<sergiusens> rsalveti: I want to rebuild saucy ;-)
<stgraber> stgraber@castiana:~/Desktop/phablet/fs/tmp$ sudo mount -o loop -t ext4 raring-preinstalled-system-armel+mako.img android/
<stgraber> mount: wrong fs type, bad option, bad superblock on /dev/loop1,
<stgraber> ogra: ^ you lied! ;)
<rsalveti> sergiusens: sure, sorry, long discussion about repartitioning the device and such :-)
<stgraber> ogra: is there some kind of padding I need to skip?
<rsalveti> hm, I think you need a step before that
<ogra> stgraber, hmm, you probably need simg2img from android-tools-fsutils
<rsalveti> yeah
<rsalveti> exactly
<sergiusens> rsalveti: yeah I am following... didn't want to add a 5th nagger
<stgraber> much better, thanks
<rsalveti> sergiusens: your new mountall.override is the same from the one from the previous mountall package, right?
<sergiusens> rsalveti: yeah... pulled it from maguro/raring tbh :-)
<rsalveti> sergiusens: don't you need to install the file?
<ogra> heh
<ogra> details
<rsalveti> or are we copying all overrides already?
<rsalveti> branching to see
<sergiusens> rsalveti: look at the install rule
<rsalveti> good
<rsalveti> sergiusens: happroved
<sergiusens> rsalveti: great, image #2 will have everything but NM... unless we just do a bin copy for now
<ogra> might not help
<rsalveti> sergiusens: depends on cyphermox_
<ogra> saucys NM is newer
<rsalveti> we might need to bump the version
<rsalveti> yeah
<ogra> slangasek, stgraber FYI my mountall log http://paste.ubuntu.com/5736624/
<ogra> (and there are no complaints anywhere else in other logs i can find)
<ogra> i did actually put quite some effort into reworking and testing that yesterday
<slangasek> ogra: really?  so you get no warning about root not being mounted?
<ogra> nope
<slangasek> ogra: perhaps I need to pull a new version of the image
<slangasek> (will do that shortly)
<ogra> wipe /data i'm not sure the zip does clear up everything
<ogra> and you will be booting to a black screen on first boot (already fixed for the next image, just waiting for unity8 to land for a respin)
<ogra> second boot is fine then
<slangasek> ok
<ogra> thats on maguro though
<ogra> not sure if mako will behave differently
<ogra> (according to stgraber it does)
<sergiusens> ogra: slangasek the zips don't touch /data in a damaging way
<slangasek> sergiusens: I'd be more concerned about wrong stale data left behind in /data that needs to be purged
<ogra> sergiusens, it doesnt wipe /data/ubuntu ?
 * ogra didnt check the code yet 
<slangasek> ogra: so as of the last update I applied (yesterdays, I think?) mako is not booting to the UI at all for me
<ogra> i thought i saw a "mv ubuntu_tmp_unpack ubuntu"
<sergiusens> ogra: slangasek stuff saved in /data/ubuntu is limited to ofono, /home/phablet, /etc/NetworkManager/system-connections
<ogra> slangasek, yeah, thats fixed
<ogra> slangasek, that was the oom bit
<sergiusens> ogra: yeah and if i succeeds it replaces the prev /data/ubuntu
<ogra> which teared down ubuntu-session
<slangasek> ogra: no, I fixed the oom bit locally
<slangasek> qml-phone-shell was segfaulting for me
<ogra> ah, you also had udev issues
<ogra> these should be fixed too
<ogra> so you get the right device permissions for the graphics stuff
<stgraber> alright, I'm done with all my changes now, let's see if I can get my phone to boot that stuff
<slangasek> ogra: no, the device permissions were correct
<slangasek> I had the version of the image that already included those udev fixes
<slangasek> and that was the image that *didn't* work for me
<stgraber> I basicaylly have one system.img file containing the rootfs, an unpacked copy of the Android initrd in /var/lib/lxc/android/rootfs, an unpacked copy of the Android system partition in /var/lib/lxc/android/rootfs/system, I removed the LXC pre-start script, removed the 60*v4l* udev rule, added an LXC fstab to mount the cache and data partition in Android, disabled those in the Android fstab and updated the initrd to do the loop mount and then
<slangasek> the one *before* those changes is the one I was able to get booting to shell after adjusting the dev perms
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> i would love to have a mako i can play with ... damned
<slangasek> ogra: well... since you don't currently, let me boot the latest image and see what I can see
<ogra> yeah
<slangasek> grr, what is this stupid 'download mode' the n4 keeps putting itself in when I boot it while connected over USB?
<stgraber> slangasek: it's annoying, isn't it. You need to press the two buttons right after the phone vibrates. If you do it before, you get that download mode stuff.
<stgraber> slangasek: (I just gave up and unplug my nexus4 before rebooting into the bootloader ;))
 * ogra thought you always get the DL mode when only pressing vol dn
<ogra> at least it is like that on most android devices i have here
<sergiusens> ogra: fyi I linked your lp:~phablet-team/session-manager-touch/trunk branch to trunk
<ogra> thanks
<ogra> i kind of got desparately lost in LPs UI yesterday when trying that
<stgraber> ogra: mako seems a bit special in that regard. If you hold all 3 buttons you get into DL mode. So you need to press the on button for 2s, then press up+down to get to the menu
<ogra> intresting
<stgraber> pushing 2GB over adb is slow... Looking forward to having our own upgrader and being able to push .tar.xz instead ;)
<ogra> that wont make the USB connection faster
<stgraber> no, but will make the file to push smaller
<ogra> heh, yeah
<ogra> why didnt you produce a tar.xz ?
<ogra> pushing it uncompressed seems like a waste
<ogra> (or at least a gz, not sure recovery ships xz support)
<stgraber> I could have, but I was lazy and so just created the 2GB large system.img directly on my laptop
<stgraber> anyway, finished now, 7MB/s isn't too bad I guess
<stgraber> alright, all flash now, let's see what happens
<stgraber> stgraber@castiana:~$ adb shell
<stgraber> root@ubuntu-phablet:/#
<stgraber> first time around!
<ogra> is the shell up ?
<ogra> does rild work ?
<stgraber> hmm, / is read/write, that wasn't expected. I guess mountall tried to be clever there and remounted it
 * ogra never doubted that you can get ubuntu to boot ... 
<sergiusens> ogra: https://code.launchpad.net/~sergiusens/session-manager-touch/unity8/+merge/167622
<stgraber> ogra: well, I'm surprised I managed not to mess up my changes to the initrd ;) that's a loop-mounted boot + a bunch of bind-mounts
<sergiusens> I guess it's useless, but it was incorrect :-)
<ogra> sergiusens, oh ! thanks
<ogra> definitely
<ogra> i thought i had grepped ... seems i didnt
<ogra> stgraber, well, you only see if the bind mounts worked once you see the shell and rild working
<ogra> (admittedly my image only got one of that done yet either)
<ogra> getting the design implemented isnt the issue ... making sure android gets along with it is
<awe_> ogra, rild *isn't* android, it's a proprietary blob that android uses
<awe_> ;D
<sergiusens> ogra: unity8 built btw
<ogra> sergiusens, \o/
<ogra> awe_, nah its a proprietary blob designed to make developers commit suicide as i understood it
<slangasek> [    6.839829] kgsl kgsl-3d0: |_load_firmware| request_firmware(a300_pm4.fw) failed: -2
<slangasek> ogra: ^^ so that's about what I was expecting to see; kgsl asks for the firmware and udev doesn't have it.
<ogra> as it shouldnt
<ogra> hmm
<slangasek> but before even when I addressed that problem, I was still getting segfaults from qml-phone-shell
<ogra> thats from dmesg right ?
<slangasek> yes
<ogra> so how do you know its udev ?
<slangasek> because when I adjusted the system so that udev could see the firmware, the error went away? :)
<ogra> heh
<slangasek> stgraber: +1 on adb shell -> /bin/bash :-)
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> +100 for that
<stgraber> slangasek: do you know what would trigger a remount of / read/write at boot? My fstab is empty yet it's still happening.
<slangasek> ogra: also, there's systemd-udev stuff earlier in the log
<ogra> i urgently need to find some time to test lool's adbd package
<slangasek> stgraber: mountall may have some internal handling of that
<stgraber> slangasek: know of any way to prevent it from doing that?
<ogra> stgraber, edit /lib/init/fstab
<ogra> add ro to the /dev/root line
<ogra> it gets processed if there is no entry in /etc/fstab for the mount
<slangasek> or, add an equivalent line to /etc/fstab, which would shadow /lib/init/fstab
<ogra> yeah
<stgraber> ok, trying that now
<stgraber> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# touch /a
<stgraber> touch: cannot touch '/a': Read-only file system
<stgraber> much better, thanks
<Bzero> hi someone speak spanish
<stgraber> oh, small LXC bug, if the container config dir is read-only, the container won't start... poked hallyn about that one, should be easy to fix
<CPCookieIRC> Hello
<CPCookieIRC> Having just a tiny problem compiling Ubuntu Touch, anyone around?
<Bzero> someone now install ububtu touch in galaxy s4
<Bzero> ???
<CPCookieIRC> ./home/cpcookieman/UbuntuPhone/out/host/linux-x86/framework/signapk.jar', needed by `/home/cpcookieman/UbuntuPhone/out/target/product/toro/obj/APPS/BIP_intermediates/BIP.apk'.  Stop.
<Bzero> anyone know if you can touch can install ubuntu on galaxy s4???
<Rowter> hello
<CPCookieIRC> Hello rowter
<hallyn> stgraber: where do you want the fix most urgently?
<Rowter> anyone here have use kyvi with ubuntu and pqlabs multitouch g6?
<Rowter> http://multi-touch-screen.com/product_g4.html sorry. anyone had use this overlay on ubuntu?
<stgraber> hallyn: saucy
<hallyn> stgraber: ok.
<Rowter> I made it work but it  seems like detecting it like a mouse, it does not work well, any ideas?
<CPCookieIRC> I obviously need this BIP.apk file, Jean-Baptiste Queru is saying that it's part of the LTE network stack.
<folf> Bzero: have a look here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<folf> Bzero: it's not listed right now, so probably not.
<CPCookieIRC> Bzero: Maybe check xda-developers.com and see if it's unofficially supported.
<stgraber> rsalveti: so it looks like that even with fstab.mako updated to have system, cache and data commented, Android still tries to mount them and causes a bit of a mess with the data partition
<stgraber> rsalveti: I'm going to try and create fake mount entries in the mount namespace, see if that fixes that
<Bzero> ok thanks if it will tell you
<rsalveti> stgraber: that's unexpected, as the only way to get the partition id is via fstab
<ogra> slangasek, so if you add an override file for udev and ubuntu-session-touch, you should be able to work around the issue by manually starting them
<ogra> that should definitely be late enough for the container ueventd to be done
<CPCookieIRC> Maybe it's just not commented well enough.
<CPCookieIRC> Throw in some more ######## maybe some // // // // /* */
<CPCookieIRC> </sarcasm>
<rsalveti> stgraber: look with grep if you can find any other file pointing out to /data
<rsalveti> not data, but the partition name itself
<ogra> !devices | Bzero
<ubot5> Bzero: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<ogra> Bzero, if it is not on the device wikipage you might need to try to port it yourself
<ogra> hmm, where is the bot ?
<DarkEra> gone with the net split?
<Bzero> yes will try
<ogra> its not a netsplit ... its DADAism
<ogra> throwing out lines in the wrong order and all :)
<CPCookieIRC> Bzero, that's not going to be easy. What carrier is your S4?
<slangasek> ogra: actually, what I've done is forced lxc-android-config to run on 'starting udev', and added a 20 second delay to lxc-android-config at the end; but the firmware is still not getting loaded, I think it's because the kernel driver only asks for it on device access
<ogra> hmm, yeah,, that might actually be the difference between mako and maguro ... omap4 has a userspace tool that loads it
<slangasek> ogra: ah - no, the 'sleep 20' isn't working, udev is starting way too early
<ogra> (which gets run in android )
<slangasek> [    2.447581] systemd-udevd[159]: starting version 204
<ogra> ah
<ogra> well, i'd start with manual
<ogra> to see if it changes it at all
<slangasek> sure, I'll see what that gives me
<Bzero> not carrier is stock from lta
<ogra> do you get a black screen or does the google logo stay ?
<ogra> if you get a black screen that means surfaceflinger came up ... which in turn means the device was actually accessed
<slangasek> ogra: google logo
<ogra> ah, yeah
<slangasek> hmm
<slangasek> oh hah
<slangasek> ignore my noises
 * ogra tries to ... but i'm to curious what it was 
<hallyn> stgraber: fix pushed to saucy
<slangasek> ogra: well, the container wasn't running; because I had udev 'manual', but the container was still 'start on starting udev'
<ogra> haha
<ogra> k
<slangasek> # cat ~phablet/.ubuntu-touch-session/logs/qml-phone-shell.log
<slangasek> Cant find EGLConfig, returning null config
<slangasek> that's new
<ogra> are /system and /vendor mounted properly ?
<slangasek> yes
<slangasek> well
<slangasek> in the rootfs yes
<slangasek> and in the container, I'm not sure - is the container using namespacing?
<LokiScarlet> Sooooo apparently if I remove the 'phablet' user on a phone... It breaks the OS
<LokiScarlet> Probably using an auto-login
<slangasek> LokiScarlet: yes - so don't do that ;)
<ogra> slangasek, you can look in /proc ... use "lxc-info -n android" then look in /proc/$pid/root
<slangasek> ogra: right; so I'm not sure what "properly" mounted looks like
<slangasek> ogra: but I do have, e.g:
<slangasek> 69 49 179:21 /vendor /data/ubuntu/vendor ro,relatime shared:18 - ext4 /dev/block/platform/msm_sdcc.1/by-name/system ro,data=ordered
<ogra> well, there is no content if there is no partition
<LokiScarlet> slangasek: Any better solution to set my own user settings then? :3
<ogra> if ls /proc/$pid/root/system and /proc/$pid/root/vendor return ccontent they should be fine
<LokiScarlet> inb4 "wait til the final release", that's just no fun~
<ogra> why do you care about the user ID ? its not exposed anywhere
<slangasek> LokiScarlet: the phablet account is the user that runs the shell UI; this is hardcoded, and I wouldn't advise trying to change this
<ogra> if you need an additional cmdline user, just create one (not sure for what you would want that though)
<stgraber> hallyn: thanks!
<ogra> slangasek, so to get the android logs you can use /system/bin/logcat -d under ubuntu ... have a look if you can see anything obvious there
<LokiScarlet> I'm... Trying to blank the user data and then set stuff in the phone UI.
<slangasek> /system/bin/lolcat, got it
<ogra> hehe
<ogra> LokiScarlet, just follow the release notes for clearing the data
<LokiScarlet> The obvious "format user data in CWM" idea.... Well, we all know what that does. :3
<ogra> (see chsannel topic)
<LokiScarlet> MUTTER FI-- I swear this stuff didn't show up before. >.< I must be going insane
<LokiScarlet> Wait a minute...
<LokiScarlet> >implying going
 * LokiScarlet tilts head ninety degrees and smiles stupidly
<beidl> LokiScarlet: >no greentext in here
<slangasek> ogra: ok - finally got it to manually boot to the shell.  Now let's see if I can do that a second time, and maybe even make it work automatically.
<ogra> yay !!!!
<ogra> ha, and i found why powerd doesnt autostart
 * ogra tries a fix
<ogra> i wonder why sutdown takes so long
<ogra> yippie
<ogra> finally got powerd autostarting
<slangasek> ok, somehow udevtrigger is failing to run
<ogra> do you call it like that ?
<ogra> isnt it udevadm trigger nowadays
<slangasek> the udevtrigger job is failing to run.
<ogra> ha
<ogra> err
<ogra> ah
<ogra> boah, thats irritating ...
<slangasek> so I can do 'udevadm trigger --action=add && service ubuntu-touch-session restart'
<ogra> i am kind of used to not have an eternal command history in the shell
<slangasek> ok, how do I *configure* the wifi?
<ogra> you cant with the in archive NM
<slangasek> phooey
<ogra> install the NM and the two libnm packages from the phablet PPA
<slangasek> shouldn't those already be the ones installed on this image?
<jcastro> out of curiosity is there a performance or power saving benefit to switching around from android/chroot to ubuntu/lxc?
<ogra> then you can just use phablet-network-setup from the host or use the UI
<slangasek> jcastro: not directly AFAICS
<ogra> slangasek, the saucy in-archive NM is newer
<slangasek> ogra: ah
<ogra> cyphermox_, is working on merging the patches from the PPA one in
<ogra> then we should have everything in the archive we need
<ogra> pulse will also need love
<slangasek> well, anyway - I have the sequencing working now with the sleep kludge, but udevtrigger fails to start for $reasons
<slangasek> ah, the fact that I have to restart ubuntu-touch-session is also a sequencing bug
<ogra> well, the eternal sleep doesnt sound good
<slangasek> I wonder what that should be waiting for
<slangasek> yeah, we don't want to do it that way
<ogra> on started lxc-android-config
<ogra> i'd say
<ogra> (i thought i actually added that to the job)
<slangasek> no, it already has that and that's too early
<ogra> hmm
<slangasek> I have to *re*start it after udevadm trigger
<ogra> bah
<ogra> *sniff*
<ogra> g_dbus_connection_real_closed: Remote peer vanished with error: Underlying GIOStream returned 0 bytes on an async read (g-io-error-quark, 0). Exiting
<ogra> powerd doesnt stay alive
<ogra> but starting it manually doesnt die
 * ogra doesnt get that 
<ogra> mfisch, does powerd only connect after a while to dbus, and not on startup ?
<ChickenCutlass> ogra, you do need the system bus to be up
<ogra> it seems to run for a while after boot but then dies with the above error
<ogra> so why isnt that reflected in the upstart job then ?
 * ogra adds a "start on started dbus" to it 
<ChickenCutlass> ogra, dbus support was just added.  It's a bug
<ogra> ah, k
<ogra> i dont understand why it doesnt crash the same way in unflipped raring though
<ogra> they shouldnt differ in that regard
<mfisch> dbus support has been there for 2-3 weeks now
<mfisch> it should work fine
<ogra> well, it doesnt in saucy
<sergiusens> ogra: it does in my saucy :-)
<ogra> i did see the same issue in the unflipped image
<sergiusens> :-p
<ogra> then it doesnt with archive packages ... no idea
<sergiusens> ogra: ah, without dbus you mean... I can check and validate
<sergiusens> ogra: but I guess no one fell into the issue of no dbus
<ogra> ha !
<ogra> so "start on started dbus" definitely fixes it
<sergiusens> ogra: I do recall launching powerd when I had the _broken_ mountall
<ogra> my screen just tirned off right after boot
<mfisch> ogra: so do we need to modify the upstart job?
<ogra> mfisch, yeah
<ogra> it currently starts on mounted /run
<mfisch> start on started dbus?
<ogra> thats really really early
<ogra> yup
<mfisch> okay, I have no device to test on so I will take your word
<ogra> ask sergiusens with an unflipped image if it works for him
<ogra> that should cover both setups we have atm
<mfisch> ogra: here's the mp: https://code.launchpad.net/~mfisch/powerd/startondbus/+merge/167632
<mfisch> lets wait on sergiusens
<LokiScarlet> beidl: Gonna be hard to do, I've got my shell text set to green
<mfisch> sforshee: ping
 * LokiScarlet rimshot
<sforshee> mfisch, pong
<mfisch> sforshee: we need to modify upstart to wait until dbus is up
<mfisch> sfeole: MP is above, but dont approve until we hear from sergiusens
<beidl> LokiScarlet: well played
<sforshee> mfisch, upstart?
<ogra> the job, not init :)
<mfisch> sfeole: hah yeah
<sforshee> that's what I was guessing
<sergiusens> ack
<ogra> dont tell jodh that you want to make upstart depend on dbus being up *grin*
<LokiScarlet> beidl beidl beidl, if nothing's in my way, beidl beidl beidl, with your mind I will play. (Sorry, your name's just that interesting.)
<beidl> LokiScarlet: I'm assuming you already guessed what my nick name really means
<sforshee> mfisch, give me a minute to test then I'll approve the mp
<LokiScarlet> Not a clue.
<LokiScarlet> :3
<LokiScarlet> Why, does beidl mean something cool?
<mfisch> sforshee: we need to wait on sergiusens too
<mfisch> he has a "flipped" image
<sforshee> mfisch, okay. Is he already testing?
<sergiusens> I am unflipped
<beidl> LokiScarlet, well, lets put it that way, it's all about the D
 * mfisch isnt sure what flipped means but hopefully someone tries it
<LokiScarlet> So it means you're a dick? Cause I can prove you wrong and dethroned on that one if you give me some time
 * LokiScarlet is teh bakas
<ogra> mfisch, booting into ubuntu, running android in lxc .... thats what i have here (and what is our actually planned image setup)
<ogra> sergio has the old image model, just on saucy packages
<ogra> (flipped the containers)
<mfisch> ogra: ah, thanks for explaining
<beidl> LokiScarlet, hmm... interesting
<sforshee> mfisch, well the change works in the flipped model at least
<sforshee> I guess sergiusens can approve when he's done testing
<mfisch> sforshee: ok
<folf> When flashing  a newer build with phablet-flash, does it always remove the coreapps installed from the ppa's? Or is this supposed to change?
<pmcgowan> sergiusens, folf asks a good question
<ryukafalz> So I've been wondering... will Ubuntu Touch use the standard web device APIs being worked on at the W3C and such?
<ryukafalz> things like media capture and screen rotation, for instance
<manoelramon> I need to compile ubuntu touch under x86.. how do I get the source code instead pre-defined images for ARM ?
<ogra> pmcgowan, folf, that will start working once we have image based upgrades ... (alternatively the flipped container will allow you to use apt)
<sergiusens> pmcgowan: folf I guess always until we have click packages
<sergiusens> ogra: well, final solution is click packages installing in user data locations
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> which will work with image based upgrades :)
<folf> ogra, OK. It's not a big issue, but I'd expect a lot of people doing the adb to install openssh, then add ppa's, then install apps :-)
<ogra> but the flipped container should enable you to just upgrade through apt like on your desktop
<ogra> until the image based upgrades/click package combo is there
<ogra> i expect that you wont need to reflash anymore once we have the container flip fully implemented
<manoelramon> Sergio, how do I get the souce code ? need to compile for x86 !
<ogra> (until image based upgrades do it automatically at least)
<sergiusens> ogra: we still need to solve platform-api and hybris... it's the only reason we are not promoting apt-get
<sergiusens> manoelramon: hey, got your email... loaded question :-)
<ogra> sergiusens, we have the toolchain, its a matter of someone having time to package them :)
<sergiusens> manoelramon: everythng is here http://phablet.ubuntu.com/gitweb
<ogra> i hope that we have that in place when the flip goes active
<sergiusens> manoelramon: just look for the phablet-10.1 branches and cherry pick
<sergiusens> ogra: +1
<manoelramon> sergio: but there after to fetch the code I have only a project called ubuntu
<manoelramon> and on this ubuntu dir I have only assets and xchroot
<manoelramon> no code!!!
<sergiusens> manoelramon: how are you doing the clone?
<ogra> manoelramon, follow the porting wikipage, that should get you all trees
<sergiusens> ogra: he's trying x86... it's a different repo ;-)
<sergiusens> ogra: as in repo sync manifest
<ogra> sergiusens, well, he needs the phablet repo, no ?
<ogra> plus an x86 tree he needs to add himself
<sergiusens> ogra: yeah... that's why I said loaded question, not sure :-)
<asac> rsalveti: lunch doesnt work with our android stuff?
<asac> actually ... wonder what java i need :)
<ogra> so first step: phablet-dev-bootstrap
<asac> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Building
<asac> java is not mentioned there
<ogra> asac, 1.6
<rsalveti> we removed the java dependency
<ogra> opjdk is fine
<asac> java SE? or openjdk is also ok?
<asac> ok
<ogra> *open
<sergiusens> asac: lunch works... openjdk should be fine... still need to get rid of some bits
 * asac uninstalls jdk 7 :)
<rsalveti> sergiusens: didn't we remove it all?
<ogra> iirc you can have them in parallel
<rsalveti> yeah, just use openjdk
<ogra> (6 and 7)
<sergiusens> rsalveti: forgot about bouncycastle
<manoelramon_> sergio I used the follwing "repo init -u git://phablet.ubuntu.com/CyanogenMod/android.git -b phablet-10.1"
<rsalveti> sergiusens: ok
<sergiusens> manoelramon: and repo sync for that didn't work?
<asac> sergiusens: so we dont have bouncy?
<asac> does it mean i need oracle for now?
<sergiusens> asac: it's in, but we might not need it at all
<manoelramon_> sergiousens: yes.. worked however I have only a new project called "ubuntu" with two folders inside... but no source code.
<asac> i did the bootstrap i think ... i basically gave mea  checkout of the android code
<sergiusens> asac: nope, openjdk is fine... the oracle java thing is mostly for apk and android services
<asac> kk
<rsalveti> manoelramon: repo sync should have copied all your sources files
<rsalveti> manoelramon: did it take long to run?
<sergiusens> manoelramon: rinse and repeat, just in case you got a broken connection
<sergiusens> manoelramon_: which x86 sources are you using btw?
<asac> where is the livehelper config for our phablet rootfs?
<asac> live-build  :)
<AskUbuntu> What are the supported devices for ubunu Phone? | http://askubuntu.com/q/304550
<manoelramon_> I should compile for medfield intel x86 based
<manoelramon_> let me run the repo sync again
<sergiusens> asac: ah, got scared there for a second :-P had no idea what livehelper was :-)
<sergiusens> asac: https://code.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/touch-preview-images/ubuntu-build-phablet-saucy
<sergiusens> asac: as the name implies, that's for saucy
<sergiusens> asac: with no container flip
<rsalveti> asac: we also got it upstream
<asac> yeah, its the old name ... when i still hacked on it it was named like that
<rsalveti> for the image ogra is working on
<sergiusens> asac: the other one is in liverootfs branch iirc the name
<folf> sergiusens, ogra, pmcgowan BTW I found this: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~popey/+junk/phablet-flash-wrapper/view/head:/add_apps.sh
<folf> Quite useful...
 * asac tries to go deep in to his memory to remember how this live-buidl thing worked
<pmcgowan> folf, indeed good ole popey
<rsalveti> manoelramon_: just saw your email, so try grabbing the sources again, it should work and get you the needed files
<rsalveti> you might need to modify them to make it x86 compatible
<asac> ok so live-build has certainly evolved a bit :)
<rsalveti> manoelramon_: do you have a standard android build tree for x86 that's based on android 4.2?
<rsalveti> might be easier to change that instead of trying to build from our sources atm
<rsalveti> as I know cyanogenmod doesn't yet support x866
<sergiusens> rsalveti: I'm trying to figure out which way the porting is being done
<sergiusens> to an x86 tree or from one
<rsalveti> might be easier to grab a working android build from intel and reduce it like we did
<cyphermox_> rsalveti: sergiusens: I'm pretty much ready to push NM to distro for saucy, but you'd still need to run logind on the touch image, and that breaks the UI currently...
<sergiusens> rsalveti: well that was my stance
<ogra> asac, for the cdimage side you want livecd-rootfs
<rsalveti> cyphermox_: what breaks?
<ogra> if you want to roll the flipped image that is
<manoelramon_> ok I am fetching the code again.... yes, I do have... I am wondering put the code under my env and compile using our compiler here.... I have all android source code JB including kernel.. that's why I do not wanna port using CM
<rsalveti> manoelramon_: right, might be easier
<cyphermox_> well you can't actually establish a wifi connection from the UI, you can click it but NM won't be able to authenticate the dbus calls or something
<ogra> cyphermox_,
<ogra> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# ps ax|grep logind
<ogra>   532 ?        Ss     0:00 /lib/systemd/systemd-logind
<rsalveti> manoelramon_: http://phablet.ubuntu.com/gitweb?p=CyanogenMod/android_build.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/phablet-10.1
<ogra> i have no issues here
<cyphermox_> ogra: yes, logind is running, that's fine
<rsalveti> these are the most important changes we did to reduce the build
<ogra> (uding the new world order though)
<ogra> *using
<cyphermox_> I have logind running here too
<manoelramon_> rsalveti: the "ubuntu" project is the folder that should contain all code for touch rgith ?
<rsalveti> manoelramon_: basically to remove everything dalvik and app related from android
<cyphermox_> but NM relies on that to authenticate the calls, and AIUI it wasn't available in the display server ?
<rsalveti> and get a tiny version that is console only (plus a few services, such as surface flinger)
<manoelramon_> rsalveti: yes, I saw in the manifest.
<sergiusens> manoelramon_: the changes are all over the place
<rsalveti> manoelramon_: no, that's just the compat layer which makes it easier to talk with the ubuntu side
<sergiusens> manoelramon_: basically if there's a phablet-10.1 branch in the repo in the tree it has changes
<rsalveti> you'd also need a ubuntu x86 based image
<rsalveti> which we can generate using live-build
<rsalveti> but that would be the second step
<rsalveti> first step would be getting a minimal image that is able to boot in your device
<rsalveti> then trying to get hybris to work, and see if the test cases would work there
<manoelramon_> rsalveti: that's the question.. the x86 image in on your webgit also ?
<rsalveti> I noticed a few intel folks contributing to hybris, so I'd expect it to work for x86 as well
<sergiusens> manoelramon_: no, it's not
<rsalveti> that's created from the ubuntu archive
<rsalveti> via live-build
<manoelramon_> I do not think I will need to port all commits you have done because you fixed bunch of problems I will not have... just wondering how to get the code/image and put over my kernel...
<rsalveti> manoelramon_: right, that's why I'd start based on this branch (you can just take the changes, not necessarily all commits), and try to get a minimal image to work first
<rsalveti> meanwhile we can produce an ubuntu rootfs via live-build which you can use
<rsalveti> sergiusens: we should have everything in the ppa to produce a x86 based image
<rsalveti> using raring would probably be a better idea for now
<manoelramon_> rsalveti: I already did all changes in the kernel.. I am only need the x86 sources... I could compile to medfield and push back to you.
<rsalveti> right, kernel changes should be minimal
<rsalveti> the ones under build are the most critical to generate a minimal image
<ogra> and you will have to find an x86 tree yourself to add it
<ogra> on phablet.ubuntu.com there is none
<sergiusens> rsalveti: saucy is solid
<rsalveti> sergiusens: lol
<rsalveti> sergiusens: can't even have a stable saucy in my desktop
<rsalveti> ogra: right, but would be nice if we could support that as well
<rsalveti> would just need to check the changes done per repo, which is really painful
<rsalveti> and would need a device as well
<ogra> rsalveti, well, sure, i would have worked on it but there is always something with high prio on my desk since i joined the same team you work in ... i knew that would happen, i so did !
<ogra> :)
<manoelramon_> rsalveti
<asac> repo sync doesnt work?
<manoelramon_> rsalveti: my devices boots :)
<asac> fatal: Not a git repository (or any parent up to mount point /home)
<asac> Stopping at filesystem boundary (GIT_DISCOVERY_ACROSS_FILESYSTEM not set).
<asac> Traceback (most recent call last):
 * ogra votes for renaming phonedations into canonical-workaholics
<rsalveti> ogra: right
<rsalveti> lol
 * rsalveti blames asac 
<rsalveti> lol
<ogra> "hello, my name is oliver and i am a workaholic ... i am dry since two weeks now .... "
<mhall119> 0.01 days without a relapse
<ogra> yeah, its definitely all asacs fault
<asac> i take that as a compliment :P
<ogra> :)
<asac> still repo sync doesnt work here :)
<asac> but its totally possible that its me
<rsalveti> well, as long we don't kill any developer til we release the project we're good lol
<rsalveti> asac: hm, let me start fresh to see
<asac> wait its here for sure
<rsalveti> sergiusens: why are we still building raring based images automatically?
<ogra> so that my sync script doesnt feel lonely
<rsalveti> repo sync working fine here
<mhall119> don't let the machines get lonely, that's when they'll turn on us
<rsalveti> manoelramon_: with a minimal image? (aka no dalvik)
<manoelramon_> rsalveti: not yet :) ... but if boot today, when you will give me the other sources :) ?
<rsalveti> manoelramon_: actually it's just a rootfs, let me try here
<manoelramon_> rsalveti: no problem :) but if you give me the code I reply you with compiled for medfield processor ... I swear :)
<sergiusens> rsalveti: lol
<rsalveti> manoelramon_: would i386 work fine for medfield ?
<sergiusens> rsalveti: tough news for you, but I think ofono is only bulding for amrhf
<rsalveti> sergiusens: true, have that in my todo
<asac> in live-build ... --bootstrap-qemu-arch is used for what?
<sergiusens> rsalveti: most apps and components only link to platform-api if it is arh armhf
<rsalveti> asac: to build it with qemu
<manoelramon_> theoretically yes
<rsalveti> sergiusens: that's being fixed as we're pushign things to the archive
<rsalveti> manoelramon_: awesome
<rsalveti> I'm running live-build to see what happens here, but we might indeed have missing packages
<manoelramon_> I hope dude :)
<rsalveti> which we're fixing anyway
<manoelramon> Thank you so much Ricardo!!!
<rsalveti> sergiusens:
<rsalveti> E: Unable to locate package libandroid-audiosystem-asound2
<rsalveti> E: Unable to locate package powerd
<rsalveti> so fixing the android audiosystem unblocks ofono
<rsalveti> now powerd is a different issue
<rsalveti> shouldn't be armhf specific
<stgraber> rsalveti: we'll really need to teach Android not to touch /data, /cache and /system at all...
<sergiusens> rsalveti: yup... but libandroid-audiosystem-asound2 always has... not that it's right or wrong
<stgraber> I just noticed that it's trying to remount them ro on shutdown or something
<stgraber> which means remounting /data read-only but that's our data partition so that's not that great...
<rsalveti> stgraber: right, that we can fix
<rsalveti> but it can only mount with fstab
<stgraber> granted you're not supposed to stop the android container, but still...
<rsalveti> after it's mounted it can try to remount, which we can fix from the android side
<stgraber> rsalveti: yep, apparently it's respecting the fstab, still failing to start but I'm trying to track that one down now
<rsalveti> stgraber: ok
<asac> refs/heads/phablet-10.1
<asac> what is that based on?
<asac> android-4.1.2_r2 ?
<rsalveti> yup
<rsalveti> actually it's a bit newer than that, but not the latest 4.2.2 tag
<asac> refs/tags/android-4.2.2_r1 ? you pull those prebuilts in
<asac> ok
<asac> i see
<asac> so that was misleading then
<asac> i will use that
<asac> to replace our binoic
<asac> so guess would be good to know exactly :)
<asac> let me see our gitweb
<asac> hard to say
<rsalveti> asac: replace our bionic?
<rsalveti> why?
<asac> seems we didnt push any very recent tags to our phablet
<asac> rsalveti: because it has hackery that is a bit annoying atm :)
<asac> sincos
<rsalveti> nops, we didn't touch that since jan or such
<asac> ok i see
<rsalveti> asac: we welcome patches
<asac> hehe
<ogra> ++
<asac> rsalveti: so do we know where this is based off?
<asac> cm-10.1
<rsalveti> CM10.1 M1 I think
<rsalveti> let me check
<rsalveti> there's a cm tag
<asac> but what that is is harrd to figure for me
<asac> yeah its cm-10.1
<asac> but i what android is that based on?
<rsalveti> sure, but there are a bunch of tags
<rsalveti> :-)
<asac> oh i see a merge
<asac> its 4.2.2_r1
<asac> http://phablet.ubuntu.com/gitweb?p=CyanogenMod/android_bionic.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/cm-10.1
<asac> pretty high on top there
<rsalveti> right
<asac> ok let me try that
<rsalveti> and why are you looking into that?
<rsalveti> any feature we're missing?
<rsalveti> yeah, it's based on CM10.1 M1
<asac> hmm. those cm guys didnt push the tag
<asac> let me find the commit
<rsalveti> manoelramon: where can I find the intel android tree?
<rsalveti> or is that already upstream?
<stgraber> rsalveti: so, my current problem is that the container kinda starts, /system/bin/mediaserver is spawned, stays there for a few seconds and then the container dies
<stgraber> rsalveti: rings a bell?
<rsalveti> stgraber: hm, no
<rsalveti> stgraber: no logs?
<rsalveti> logcat would be useful there
<jono> pmcgowan, hey
<jono> pmcgowan, any idea who is working on the infographics work?
<stgraber> rsalveti: how do I turn /dev/alog/main into something readable?
<rsalveti> hm, would need to investigate
<rsalveti> let me check
<RobbyF> will the email client support exchange?
<rsalveti> stgraber: just a simple cat would already be useful
<rsalveti> stgraber: try running logcat manually
<rsalveti> it should be static linked I'd guess
<rsalveti> if not you can probably build it easily
<rsalveti> http://phablet.ubuntu.com/gitweb?p=CyanogenMod/android_system_core.git;a=tree;f=logcat;h=9cd412866c535d84bd1b106ad4fa32e3a438f1b5;hb=refs/heads/phablet-10.1
<ogra> stgraber, /system/bin/logcat
<ogra> it is definitely static
<rsalveti> yeah, if you have it mounted it'd just work
<ogra> :)
<asac> rsalveti: you are android-audiosystem guru? what is so armel specific there?
<rsalveti> asac: that's what I'm checking now
<rsalveti> this is old code from motorola
<asac> intersting :)
<ogra> well /var/lib/lxc/android/rootfs/system/bin/logcat (can we add some more subdirs) then
<asac> is it important for primary user experience?
<asac> e.g. booting, showing stuff on screen etc.?
<rsalveti> asac: well, just no sound
<asac> kk
<asac> no crashes?
<rsalveti> nops
<stgraber> ogra: not static
<ogra> oh
<stgraber> /var/lib/lxc/android/rootfs/system/bin/logcat: ELF 32-bit LSB shared object, ARM, version 1 (SYSV), dynamically linked (uses shared libs), stripped
<asac> rsalveti: what is it doing? talking to... alsa?
<asac> :)
<manoelramon> https://01.org/android-ia/documentation/faq
<rsalveti> asac: other way around
<rsalveti> asac: for pulse to talk to audioflinger
 * asac turns upside down
<rsalveti> manoelramon: thanks
<asac> ok. doesnt sound very armel specific
<ogra> stgraber, link system to / then ... LD_PRELOAD should give you all you need
<rsalveti> asac: no, just stupid build system
<ogra> (it points to /system/lib)
<rsalveti> as we got some .S files there
<asac> yeah
<asac> have you tried sedding everythign :)?
<stgraber> ogra: read-only, remember? :)
<rsalveti> asac: I'm fixing it
<ogra> stgraber, well ... remount rw ... then set the link
<rsalveti> stgraber: chroot
<asac> good
<rsalveti> and then run it from the android container
<rsalveti> shouldn't explode :-)
<ogra> you dont have /dev
<ogra> need to bind mount it
<rsalveti> haha
<sergiusens> manoelramon: I have may have access to some intel devices from the Cordoba site... I'll get your tree's and see what happens
<ogra> hmm, there is still something fishy with powerd
 * ogra tries to move it later 
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> is there any reason why we dont have ubuntu-session start powerd ?
<stgraber> rsalveti, ogra: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5737111/
<rsalveti> well, powerd is a system service
<asac> ogra: my understanding is that powerd is something deeper entrenched in the OS than a session...
<ogra> asac, well, it needs bits from the container and dbus
<asac> dbus is started in the gnome-session?
<ogra> stgraber, same issue slangasek has
<asac> otherwise i dont know what ubuntu-session is :)
<rsalveti> stgraber:
<rsalveti> D/overlay ( 1001): initoverlay:: opening the device:: /dev/graphics/fb2
<rsalveti> E/overlay ( 1001): cannot open framebuffer(2)
<asac> (and you can ignore me)
<ogra> asac, the session bus, not the system bus
<rsalveti> then egl fails, which causes surfaceflinger to crash
<ogra> asac, https://code.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/session-manager-touch/trunk
<rsalveti> but still, it should go on and print more messages
<asac> do we use androids busybox?
<rsalveti> is that all you get?
<asac> err the busybox of CM
<asac> (android doesnt have that)
<ogra> i dont think so
<rsalveti> asac: http://phablet.ubuntu.com/gitweb?p=CyanogenMod/android_external_busybox.git;a=summary
<ogra> oh, we do ?
<asac> so we use that?
<asac> hmm
<ogra> but with nothing enabled i guess
<asac> what is the official android replace called?
<ogra> /bin/sh: 0: Can't open /proc/self/fd/9
<ogra> ** (process:489): DEBUG: owner id: 1
<ogra> ** (process:489): DEBUG: Activity Timeout is 30 seconds
<ogra> woah
<asac> ah its toolbox
<asac> right
<asac> thats what its called
<ogra> (powerd log)
<stgraber> slangasek: apparently I'm hitting the same bug as you had (lxc container not starting), what's the problem?
<ogra> stgraber, his container was starting, his  session wasnt ...
<ogra> race between udev and the container start
<stgraber> ok, my container isn't starting at all and I've got udev in Ubuntu disabled
<rsalveti> stgraber: is that all you got from logcat?
<stgraber> well, it starts for a minute and dies. The only process I see init spawn is /system/bin/mediaserver
<stgraber> rsalveti: yep
<rsalveti> stgraber: can you check if you have /dev/graphics/fb2 inside your android container?
<rsalveti> hm, that error also happens here
 * ogra guesses only while the container is running
<ogra> i guess fb2 is HDMI
<stgraber> rsalveti: I'll try but as I said the container dies pretty quickly, so I'll have to do some clever tricks to pull the data before it goes away
<rsalveti> W/SurfaceFlinger( 1001): no suitable EGLConfig found, trying without EGL_FRAMEBUFFER_TARGET_ANDROID
<ogra> or however that special plug adapter thing is called
<rsalveti> so surface flinger fails completely here
<asac> do we have lots of arm specific stuff in powerd?
<rsalveti> which could mean issues with udevd or it couldn't see the vendor stuff
<rsalveti> stgraber: are you using our own system.img file?
<rsalveti> or did you build it your own?
<stgraber> rsalveti: nope, used the one from ubuntu-touch-preview
<ogra> unpacked from ours
<ogra> did you tar it and forgot --numeric-owner or some such ?
<rsalveti> W/Adreno200-EGL( 1001): <eglGetConfigs:400>: EGL_NOT_INITIALIZED
<rsalveti> now why would the driver fail
<ogra> because /vendor isnt set up
<rsalveti> E/Adreno200-GSL( 1001): <ioctl_kgsl_driver_entry:269>: open(/dev/kgsl-3d0) failed: errno 2. No such file or directory
<rsalveti> there you go
<stgraber> ogra: mix of root and gid 2000, that looks vaguely reasonable
<stgraber> rsalveti: well, yeah, as part of my problems I don't even see ueventd starting, so I'd expect /dev to be pretty much empty
<ogra> ah, no /dev
<stgraber> as I said, I only see a single process being spawned in the container and that's "/system/bin/mediaserver"
<stgraber> no ueventd that I can see
<rsalveti> the rest might fail
<rsalveti> or init fails completely
<ogra> yeah, so talk to jhodapp, we cant help :P
<rsalveti> due lack of udev
<rsalveti> ueventd
<ogra> mediaserver is his area
<ogra> :P
<ogra> did you modify init.rc somehow ?
<stgraber> ogra: nope, only changes I did comment cache, system and data in fstab.mako and removed adbd (just in case)
<ogra> no need for that
<ogra> in fact i would leave it there, that way you can easily switch between ubuntu and container
<ogra> (by setting the adbd upstart job to manual)
<ogra> adbd wont start if its loopback port is already taken
<ogra> stgraber, do you have  nodev.nosuid options set on /data by chance ?
<stgraber> ogra: nope
<|QuaD|> hello! quick question for you. I am setting up ubuntu touch on my nexus 7 for fun. How are upgrades handled? is it done throuhg normal apt? or do i have to reflash an image everytime
<ogra> you currently have to reflash
<ogra> since there are bits in the android layer that arent packaged but require updates on package upgrades
<ogra> phablet-flash is clever enough to keep your userdata intact though
<|QuaD|> ogra: thanks! do we have an eta of when something like nexus 7 will be autoupdateable?
<ogra> apt updates will work once the images have the flipped container model in use and the two bits that we use inside android are packaged
<|QuaD|> cool
<ogra> on the former there is active cross team work going on
<ogra> so it should be in place *soon*
<ogra> the latter will have to wait until someone has time to actually do the packaging
<|QuaD|> and once that build comes out, i just have to run phablet-flash, it will upgrade and then be upgradeable?
<asac> remember that apt updates are really just an intermediate state
<asac> we are actually shooting for system updates
<asac> (for end user experience at least)
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, bfiller http://theravingrick.blogspot.com/2013/06/the-social-phone.html
<slangasek> stgraber: mmm, the issue I had was because I had changed the lxc-android-container job to start on 'starting udev' and had set the udev job to manual
<stgraber> slangasek: yeah, my issue appears unrelated as I already had udev disabled to check that wasn't the problem. Not sure exactly what's going on, but I guess it was to be expected that some bits would fail when moving to a read-only root
<mfisch> sergiusens: can you approve the upstart job change for powerd?  https://code.launchpad.net/~mfisch/powerd/startondbus/+merge/167632
<slangasek> ogra: is there a master bzr branch for lxc-android-config?  (it's not in debian/control)
#ubuntu-touch 2013-06-06
<n-iCe> hello guys
<n-iCe> is ubuntu for mako finished?
<[|HuGO|]> when the operating system will be ready?
<mhall119> when it's ready
<solstag> hi everyone; a recent changelog mentions preliminary GPRS working, but I couldn't figure out how to activate it, since there's nothing on the UI; should I manually install and run something like wvdial?
<mhall119> solstag: you have to use the terminal to activate it currently, the UI isn't there yet
<mhall119> http://theravingrick.blogspot.ro/2013/06/dog-fooding-success-sort-of.html
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, nice!
<solstag> mhall119: Hm right, I was imagining that would be the case, but can nmcli alone be used to configure a new connection? I couldn't figure out how.
<mhall119> solstag: I think so, but I don't have a phone
<mhall119> rickspencer3 got it working somehow
<rickspencer3> wuh? huh?
<rickspencer3> solstag, I just followed rsalveti's instructions
<mhall119> solstag is trying to get 3g working
<rickspencer3> mhall119, yeah, I got the back scroll
<rickspencer3> don't know what to say, the instructions "just worked" for me
<solstag> rickspencer3: hey, cool, but where are those instructions?
<rickspencer3> oh
<rickspencer3> well, let me get those for you
<rickspencer3> give me a moment to track them down
<solstag> =D
<rickspencer3> solstag, https://plus.google.com/100264483712374857174/posts/3o1tjYo9Ghx
<rickspencer3> there is a GUI coming, but for now, it's pretty old school
<solstag> rickspencer3: awesome, thanks, this makes sense it's probably gonna work, I'll just take the time to update the image first ;) thanks guys! (mhall119)
<rickspencer3> solstag, bon chance, and have fun :)
<rickspencer3> it's way easier to use the phone if the terminal is installed
<solstag> merci
<rickspencer3> I think it may be in today's image by default
<solstag> yeah I was just thinking that haha
<solstag> it seems to be by the changelog
<rickspencer3> nice
<rickspencer3> solstag, after you get cellular data working, you may want to set up facebook and twitter integration:
<rickspencer3> http://theravingrick.blogspot.com/2013/06/the-social-phone.html
<mhall119> rickspencer3: yeah, terminal landed by default starting in image 152
<rickspencer3> oops, dinner time
<rickspencer3> night all
<fdfdfd> hi
<fdfdfd> anyone herre
<Lipi> I can't install Ubuntu Touch Image to my Nexus 4. No response after "< waiting for device >" is shown in command line.
<Lipi> Anybody help me?
<Namidairo_> usb debugging on?
<Namidairo_> installed yer adb drivers?
<Namidairo_> etc.
<Lipi> Flashing recovery to /home/lipi/Downloads/phablet-flash/153/raring-preinstalled-recovery-armel+mako.img < waiting for device >
<snwh> try using sudo
<Lipi> I have already used this command 'sudo phablet-flash -d mako -b'.
<RAOF> Lipi: The first question would be âdoes "adb shell"â connect to the device?
<Lipi> Absolutely. So my phone is in bootloader state now.
<Lipi> But, In bootloader state,  'adb devices' command cannot see my phone.
<mhall119> Lipi: sudo adb kill-server; sudo adb start-server
<mhall119> then try adb devices again
<snwh> Lipi, in bootloader state the command is fastboot devices
<Lipi> Oh, got it. Thanks.
<Lipi> Let me check 'fastboot devices'.
<Lipi> Oh, Downloading is working now... Thanks mhall119, snwh, Namidairo, snwh, RAOF.
<apalala> I broke a new Nexus 10 like this, but I can't get pass the login screen
<Namidairo_> pretty hard to brick a nexus device
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> is something badly bad with touch-preview images on the Nexus 7 currently? Most applications don't launch (just get a white screen) and the OSK doesn't come up either...
<ogra> Laney, which one did you download ?
<ogra> (from where)
<Laney> I just phablet-flashed to 154
<ogra> hm
<ogra> i wonder if sergio broke the raring builds, better roll back to the last milestone then
<ogra> there is a monthly-05 one
<Laney> ogra: alright, I'll try that
<Laney> 12.4MB/s... â¥ cdimage
<ogra> wow, if i remove the fstab and issue a reboot, the system shuts down
<ogra> as soon as i put the fstab back it reboots as requested
<ogra> intresting behavior
<swordfish> Hello everyone! I'm trying to merge changes made by  popey to the trunk branch in the launchpad... how can I do it? Do I need to merge locally and then commit the changes to trunk?
<ogra> do you have permission to push to that branch ? else push to your own branch, go to the launchpad UI for it and propose it for merging
<swordfish> ogra, sorry i missed your message... I have the permission the project is mine: https://launchpad.net/minesweeper-touch
<ogra> well, then commit locally and do a bzr push to the branch
<swordfish> Ok... Now i try...
<Laney> ah yes, monthly seems to be better
<swordfish> ogra, It gives me an error message... Starting from the I branch the trunk from the launchpad (just to be sure its correct) i merge the branch on my local copy (bzr branch and so on) but when i commit the changes (again locally) it tells me bzr: ERROR: Selected-file commit of merges is not supported yet: files Alan Pope 2013-05-31 add packaging, debian, minesweeper.desktop, minesweeper.png
<ogra> how do you try to commit ?
<swordfish> I use the commit command in QtCreator as always done, is it correct?
<ogra> hmm, should be
<ogra> better wait for someone from the sdk team though, i never used it
<swordfish> i made a try... Using bzr status it tells me: pending merge tips: (use -v to see all merge revisions)  Alan Pope 2013-05-31 add packaging
<swordfish> Ok... Thank you anyway... I will try this -v option to see how it works and I will wait...
<swordfish> ogra,  Done!... it was only necessary a --pull in the merge command!...
<ogra> ah, cool
<MonkeyDust> any idea when the ubuntu will be available in europe?
<MonkeyDust> any idea when the ubuntu phone will be available in europe?
<ogra> sigh, i dont get it
<ogra> starting ofono manually gets it working fine
<ogra> starting it automatically doesnt
<Dummies_freelanc> ogra: morning
<ogra> morning
<Mirv> hmm on saucy adb shell now goes directly to chroot? how do I pass on normal android commands now?
<ogra> Mirv, which saucy image is that ?
<ogra> (where did you get it from)
<Mirv> ogra: old one, dist-upgraded
<ogra> ah, you might not want to do that
<Mirv> out of general curiosity: "why?", but yes I should probably try a fresher rootfs
<ogra> that will get you the flipped container
<ogra> but only half of it
<ogra> serguiens is already working on an unflipped image that phablet-flash will install, until the flipped image is ready
<Mirv> ok :) and I guess I need to go the manual route for updating since phablet-flash doesn't recognize the device since the adb commands don't work..
<Mirv> I mean, getprop etc
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> does the rest work ?
<ogra> if so:
<Mirv> ogra: ubuntu side "works", lost GUI though, but I can ssh in
<ogra> ah, well, i doubt you will get it working easily
<ogra> better re-flash with the last raring milestone
<Mirv> I'd want to test saucy precisely, but is it currently slightly harder than it was two-three weeks ago?
<ogra> Mirv, we are flipping the container model (meaning we rework the whole plumbing layer)
<ogra> in the archive ...
<ogra> serguiens works on an unflipped image that just has updated packages
<ogra> as interim
<Mirv> ok, then I better wait before I ask others to test new packages on saucy devices as well ;)
<Mirv> good information anyway, thanks, waiting for sergiusens' temporary solution to arrive
<ogra> i'm just regenerating a flipped image ... many things already work there :)
<ogra> no network, no calls and no sound yet though
<Mirv> it was quite fine for testing GUI with a network forwarded over USB
<Mirv> nice that flipped works as well
<Mirv> is there a blog post already explaining the whole flipping thing to the masses? :)
<ogra> not yet
<ogra> i'll write one once the image is actually a bit more usable
<Mirv> yeah, maybe best after it can be shown that it works
<Mirv> right
<ogra> i.e. waiting on a fix from ricmm ... to not get a white screen if you start apps
<ogra> and NM
<ogra> once these two are there i'll blog :)
<elkng> will that new ubuntu-mobile support those hundreds of thouthands apps on the market ?
<elkng> or with it you got better alternative, FOSS software ?
<elkng> all those GTK and QT driven programms will work in it ?
<ogra> no
<ogra> ubuntu touch currently only supports QML, C++ and HTML5 apps
<ogra> no Gtk, no X11 based apps
<ogra> (and no android apps for now)
<[SLB]> if i'm not mistaken, in the manual installation, the website talks about 2 steps,
<[SLB]> first step deploys an armel-<device> image
<[SLB]> and second step deploys the phablet-armhf image
<[SLB]> in the images repository though i see more than 2 kind of images per device, plus generic images
<[SLB]> armel-<device>, boot-armel+<device>, phablet-armhf, recovery-armel-<device> and system-armel-<device>
<[SLB]> are the other images optional beyond the 2 steps described above?
<asac> bfiller: hey
<asac> bfiller: i cant find monthly agile plan of high level goals in your apps doc
<asac> from oakland
<asac> maybe we can randomly spread the apps across the month from june to september? :)
<asac> maybe there are intermediate steps for each app? like a "feature complete release"
<asac> good news/bad news from the saucy migration front?
<ogra> asac, ofono runs if i start it manually
<ogra> but i seem to have either upstart or dbus issues with auto starting
<ogra> still debugging
<asac> ogra: everything else is great?
<ogra> no
<asac> lol
<ogra> we still need NM, pulse and the platform api fixed
<asac> you gave me the impression that thats the case :)
<asac> ok, but everyting being worked on? or is there anything not covered at all?
<seb128> Kaleo, hey, what's the best channel to ask about qt question and about ubuntu-sdk questions?
<ogra> asac, well, the pulse merge i'm not sure about ... cyphermox works on NM, i'm looking into ofono and ricmm has a fix for the platform api but i'm not sure we can upload it since it might break the unflipped images
<ogra> having two incompatible images is a huge pain in the butt
<ogra> especially if it comes to packages that are in both and need completely different patching
<asac> its a challenge
<asac> :)
<asac> good challenge
<ogra> it means to add two hackish patches now and having a lot of extra work later to clean up that mess
<ogra> instead of doing it right right now
<ogra> but thats how that concept works ..
<asac> yes
<asac> thats the idea
<ogra> such a waste
<asac> i thougth i explained the overall cost assessment
<asac> and that its a net win
<asac> :)
<ogra> especially in the light that what we do now for flipped might totally not work anymore after steve and stephane moved everything to their wird partitioning ideas
<ogra> so we have to do everyhthing three times in the end
<ogra> in three different ways
<asac> sounds good
<asac> :P
<asac> its a bit painful
<asac> because... it was not thought of before
<ogra> i understand your idea ... i just dont think we'll be done by oct this way
<asac> maybe. but then it doesnt help if you are done, but the rest of our army of engineers isnt on saucy :)
<ogra> heh
<ogra> well, currently our "army" is split into three parts ... one part working still on raring fixes, one part working on unflipped saucy and one on flipped ... and the work of the latter might have to be re-done completely from scratch due to the re-partitioning plans
<ogra> the majority of people works on saucy
<ogra> thats not the issue anymore
<ogra> i slowly suspect that the flipped image is ready before the unflipped though
 * ogra shakes his fist at upstart 
<ogra> Do what i want, damend !!
<MacSlow> Saviq, these are the warnings/errors I get from run_on_device http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5738800
<Saviq> MacSlow, yeah, that means that for some reason dbus didn't start
<Saviq> MacSlow, and dies all the time, too
<Saviq> MacSlow, feels like a something-got-broken-on-the-device issue
<Saviq> MacSlow, did you try flashing recently?
<MacSlow> Saviq, I tried that two days ago, but it always failed... didn't bother much and kept on working on the backend-integration
<MacSlow> Saviq, since it boots normally still, I assumed nothing got broken
<Saviq> MacSlow, do you have branches for me?
<Saviq> MacSlow, let's just make sure you're not fighting with something that's not your issue
<MacSlow> Saviq, yeah... the one from the email yesterday...
<[SLB]> how many images do i need to get from this link for manual installation? http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch-preview/daily-preinstalled/current/ the guide talks about 2 steps, considering only raring-preinstalled-armel+<device>.zip and raring-preinstalled-phablet-armhf.zip
<MacSlow> Saviq, lp:~macslow/unity/phablet-integrate-notification-backend
<Saviq> MacSlow, yup, gimme a moment
<MacSlow> Saviq, sure... thanks
<mhall119> Calendar team meeting starting in #ubuntu-touch-meeting
<MacSlow> Saviq, btw.. the problem I've here with flashing to the latest image is that the device_flashdaily script just opens up a new terminal-window briefly and that's closed within a second again... can't make out any error/warning being printed in that window
<MacSlow> not sure what's wrong there
<Saviq> MacSlow, device_flashdaily?
<MacSlow> Saviq, that's the script which is called by QtCreator
<Saviq> MacSlow, phablet-flash is the command to use
<Saviq> MacSlow, it might be out of sync
<Saviq> MacSlow, I just got into a meeting, your branch will have to wait
<MacSlow> Saviq, ok
<MacSlow> Saviq, I'll look into this flashing-issue
<MacSlow> rsalveti, hey there... you got an idea what to look into if "phablet-flash" reports "Latest build detection not supported... bailing"
<MacSlow> rsalveti, should I just manually state which build I want to have installed?
<Saviq> MacSlow, you're on raring still?
<Saviq> MacSlow, ppa:phablet-team/tools
<MacSlow> Saviq, yes... wanted to wait with updating to saucy until I've the backend-integration sorted out/merged
<Saviq> MacSlow, get the PPA
<Saviq> MacSlow, it's got updated phablet-* scripts
<ogra> stgraber, hey, so after you made bash work with adbd ... couldnt you also make it use more than 80x24 ?
<ogra> :)
<pmcgowan> awe_, why is the group id set to android_input? curious
<ogra> the group handling will be reworked completely
<stgraber> ogra: had to keep it at least vaguely painful ;)
<ogra> stgraber, heh, i cant remember when i typed "reset" that often in the past
<pmcgowan> ogra, so by the time I know it wont matter
<ogra> pmcgowan, yeah, it might be gone in favour of a shim that just mimics the groups for executing processes
<ogra> there is a bug open for that which i cant find atm
<ogra> GRRR
 * ogra shakes his fist against upstart for the tenth time today
<ogra> it *never* does what i think it does
<ogra> and reboots are sooooo slow
<ogra> we should just call "sync, umount, poweroff" instead of doing a full shutdown
 * ogra wants a "start on what-i-think" upstart bridge !
<awe_> pmcgowan, otp
<mfisch> ogra: that dbus thing you found with powerd is causing problems, so thanks for finding it
<mfisch> ogra: having it the old way was cauing problems i mean
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> you might also want:
<ogra> stop on runlevel [06]
<ogra> to kill it on shutdown
<mhall119> kalikiana: u1db-qt packages are still failing to build, even on a PPA with physical ARM hardware
<dobey> how did you get a PPA that only builds on physical arm hardware?
<kalikiana> mhall119, same segfault in qmlplugindump?
<sil2100> Hi guys
<sil2100> renato__: ping
<sil2100> Since I have a question regarding address-book-service
<mhall119> kalikiana: looks like it
<kalikiana> mhall119, I wonder is this the only package where that happens?
<kalikiana> anything with a c++ plugin must be running qmlplugindump
<MacSlow> Saviq, I think it works... been calling and texting myself on the Nexus... the new notifications show up
<Saviq> MacSlow, awesome!
<MacSlow> Saviq, just no idea why the all the python-examples still dont't work ("gtk+ missing defined displays")
<Saviq> not sure
<sil2100> bfiller: hi
<bfiller> sil2100: hi
<mhall119> kalikiana: it's the only package in that PPA currently failing at all: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-sdk-team/+archive/ppa/+packages
<sil2100> bfiller: I know it's probably more of a question to renato__, but I wanted to talk about the naming of the address-book-service project
<sil2100> bfiller: since there's lp:address-book-service, but the source package name inside is called galera-contact-service
<bfiller> sil2100: sure, what's the issue?
<sil2100> bfiller: I think we need to decide on one of those and rename the other
<sil2100> bfiller: it's just the 'source package name' so it doesn't matter to other applications
<sil2100> But generally the branch and lp-project name should be the same as the source package name
<sil2100> bfiller: what do you think? Which name fits better?
<kalikiana> mhall119, that is not the qmlplugindump segfault, though. this is docs and that'S why x86 also fails. this should work again once the fixed ui-toolkit-doc is there - it's already fixed in trunk
<bfiller> sil2100: makes sense, think we should use address-book-service for both
<bfiller> renato__: ^^^
<kalikiana> mhall119, I talked about it with fginther see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1187006
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1187006 in ubuntu-ui-toolkit (Ubuntu) "No HTML in ubuntu-ui-toolkit-doc" [Undecided,New]
<FunkyPenguin> is there a known issue with apt on build 154?
<kalikiana> mhall119, 0.1.46daily13.05.31ubuntu.unity.nextbzr527raring0 is behind r533 which has the fix
<FunkyPenguin> im trying to install openssh on a newly flashed nexus4 and all i get is http://slexy.org/view/s21JDhUWb5
<kenvandine> FunkyPenguin, looks like you aren't on the network
<ogra> slangasek, init: Error while reading from descriptor: Bad file descriptor
<ogra> slangasek, thats the line that got me suspicious ... and in the detailed log it actually prints the "cannot open /proc/self/fd/9" line before each job when doing a detailed log
<ogra> i wonder if our kernel is missing anything here
<ogra> SIGNALFD is set though ...
<ogra> i dont know of any other kernel option upstart needs
<rsalveti> pmcgowan: there are all sorts of permission issues with the android stuff
<rsalveti> so we had to add the phablet user into a bunch of android specific groups
<rsalveti> we're planning on cleaning that up soon
<FunkyPenguin> kenvandine: ah, that could be it. is there wpa2 enterprise support for wifi?
<pmcgowan>  rsalvetithanks was mainlu just curious
<Kaleo> seb128: 15:23 < seb128> Kaleo, hey, what's the best channel to ask about qt question and about ubuntu-sdk questions?
<Kaleo> seb128: #ubuntu-app-dev
<seb128> Kaleo, thanks
<Kaleo> seb128: #ubuntu-app-devel
<Kaleo> sorry
<seb128> Kaleo, I'm alon... thanks
<MacSlow> Saviq, sadly a bit blurry... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQMIf1cOyHc
<kenvandine> FunkyPenguin, no idea :)
<didrocks> ricmm rsalveti: nitpick in the platform-api: android/include/private/application/ui/clipboard.h is not listed as GPL (should it be LGPL?)
<[SLB]> i have installed the 2 zip files with twrp on my nexus 4, but after the boot process it just stays black. cleared cache and dalvik already. any other thing i should do?
<FunkyPenguin> hmm, wireless connection seems to be a bit on the "flakey" side
<rsalveti> didrocks: hm, should be lgpl
<didrocks> rsalveti: mind changing that?
<didrocks> rsalveti: not a blocker, continuing looking at it for pre-MIRing
<didrocks> (not a blocker as long as it's going to be fixed ;))
<rsalveti> didrocks: let me change
<ogra> slangasek, yeah, it would be an additional rules file that has a list of devices at the top and just "goto_end" for all of them
<ogra> i dont really like the idea of diversions :)
<ogra> but i guess it will do as interim
<slangasek> ogra: as I said, the 'goto_end' only works within a *single* udev rules file
<slangasek> it doesn't let you skip rules from a *different* udev rules file, which is where we have the problem curretnly
<ogra> oh, indeed
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> udev should just grow an upstartish .override mechanism :P
<rsalveti> didrocks: https://code.launchpad.net/~rsalveti/platform-api/fixing_clipboard_h_license/+merge/167795
<rsalveti> ricmm: mind reviewing https://code.launchpad.net/~ricmm/platform-api/refactor-headers-new-cleanup/+merge/165467 ?
<didrocks> rsalveti: approved
<rsalveti> ricmm: sorry, wrong link
<rsalveti> ricmm: https://code.launchpad.net/~rsalveti/android-audiosystem/enabling-build-i386/+merge/167671
<rsalveti> didrocks: thanks
<didrocks> yw ;)
<kingivvi> Hey any idea where I can get some info on instalation of ubuntu on tablets other than nexus. well i have a digix sophix 8 i have baked some roms on phones but im kinda new at this.
<ogra> there is a porting guide, see the channel topic
<ogra> and there is the devices wikipage ...
<ogra> !devices | kingivvi
<ubot5> kingivvi: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<kingivvi> oh nice thanks for the info
<slangasek> ogra: so, I can have lxc-android-config divert both firmware.rules and persistent_v4l.rules right now, and that fixes mako immediately; or I can spend some time hacking to understand why *upstart* is breaking with udevtrigger in a wedged state, which will take me another day or two to sort out, but then we don't have to disable persistent_v4l.rules unnecessarily.  What do you think we should do here?
<kingivvi> i got the thing to learn python 3 on android has no real solutions i found so far for that.
<ogra> slangasek, go for it
<ogra> (teh diversion)
<ogra> i think the upstart issue is actually serious
<slangasek> yes, I'll look at that either way
<slangasek> the question was just whether we care about an expedient fix for mako
<ogra> e do, but not right now i'd say
<ogra> *we
<slangasek> eh, but you just told me to go for it ;)
<ogra> well, i read fix as "proper fix"
<slangasek> ah no, I said "expedient fix"
<ogra> i dont conside a diversion proper :)
<slangasek> that's the opposite of a proper fix ;)
<ogra> oh, k
<ogra> yes, add the diversion now so we have a quick fix
<Laney> so it seems nemo-keyboard isn't installed by default (at least in touch-preview) but it should be
<Laney> otherwise you get no OSK ... pretty bad
<ogra> getting mako and grouper to work is essential to get the rest of the team to work with the flipped images
<ogra> i have an idea about grouper but need to test that later tonight
<ogra> (not all plymouth upstart jobs are set to manual, i suspect a remaining one still tries to start plymouth , tegra is always behaving bad with that)
<didrocks> rsalveti: ok, the code looks good, for NEW and main for platform-api in its current state
<didrocks> rsalveti: one more than nitpick: debian/copyright as a pattern of android/hybris/test_*
<didrocks> it doesn't match android/hybris/test.cpp :p
<ogra> nitpicker :P
<didrocks> ogra: seb128 found that one TBH, I didn't :p
<didrocks> clearly a release blocker :p
<ogra> definitely !
<seb128> calling me picky?
<didrocks> seb128: never ever!
<ogra> better than calling you nitty :)
<didrocks> ahah
<seb128> what else would you expect from germans?
<ogra> yeah :)
<ogra> crazy people ... these germans
<Laney> so how are the default packages for the raring images installed? it doesn't appear to be the germinate metapackage
<davmor2> I love the weather app on the phone much kudos to whoever wrote it
<silbs> ogra, rsalveti: I am doing https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install#Flashing_the_device but having dependency issues. I heard one of you may be able to help :)
<silbs> phablet-tools : Depends: python-configobj but it is not installable
<silbs>                  Depends: python-requests but it is not installable
<silbs> android-tools-adb and android-tools-fastboot went through fine
<ogra> silbs, what release is that ? raring or saucy
<silbs> ogra: actually, I am still quantal.  Is that the issue?
<ogra> did you enable the PPA ?
<silbs> ogra: yes, w/ add-apt-repository
<ogra> oh, indeed you did, quantal needs it for phablet-tools
<ogra> hmm
<Orii> hey are updates happening yet for touch or is it still on the same version as originally released
<Orii> ?
<ogra> Orii, there are daily buids
<ogra> *builds
<ogra> phablet-flash automatically gets you the latest
<Orii> oh sweet :)
<rsalveti> silbs: let me check, but we might not have the latest for quantal
<Orii> how are things coming along? i mean i love android.....but ubuntu touch is just epic
<ogra> silbs, hmm, i see no reason why python-configobj wouldnt be found
<ogra> it is in the normal archive
<rsalveti> hm, it's indeed published for quantal here
<ogra> same goes for python-requests
<ogra> both should even be in main
<rsalveti> let me try to install it in a chroot
<ogra> thats very weird
<ogra> silbs, you didnt by chance play with your software-sources and disabled main ? :)
<rsalveti> ogra: silbs: hm, installed just fine in a clean quantal chroot + ppa
<silbs> ogra: I can safely say that I haven't disabled main ;)
<silbs> rsalveti: that's weird
<ogra> yeah
<ricmm> rsalveti: reviewing
<ogra> silbs, is there any proxy in line between you and the archive ?
<rsalveti> brb
<silbs> ogra: shouldn't be. I'm in London office, on our own wired network
<ogra> both are pretty standard packages and there doesnt seem to be any versioned dependency
<silbs> everything else is up to date as well
<ogra> so there is technically no reason you shouldnt be able to install them
<silbs> must be something about my system.  I have installed test kernels in the past, but am now on the latest released one.  But maybe something during that period got messed up
<ricmm> rsalveti: did you write these atomic funcs?
<ogra> i cant find any updates for either of these packages, they must be the standard ones that were recent at release time
<ogra> so yeah, smells a bit like there is something wonky with your sources.list (or sources.list.d files)
<ogra> silbs, does an apt-get update on cmdline show any issues ?
<silbs> ogra: nope
<ogra> vrey strange
<ogra> *very too
<silbs> ogra, rsalveti: I've got to move on to something else now - will try again later or tomorrow.  Thanks for help anyway
<ogra> let me know how it goes ...
<kdub> rsalveti, what did you mean by 'now we need to implement support for mir' in hybris (sorry to jump channels)
<mhall119> ogra: rsalveti: could she be having a conflict with someone else installed that is preventing those packages from being installable/
<mhall119> ?
<mhall119> s/someone/something/
<ogra> mhall119, probably from another PPA or some such
<ogra> iirc the cloud stuff uses python-requests
<ogra> and i know she demos that at times :)
<roman2861_> Who develops Weather app?
<mhall119> community devs
<davmor2> mhall119: I repeat my earlier comment it rocks, it is the best app for weather :)
<davmor2> mhall119: and I haven't been able to break it either ;)
<mhall119> +1 :)
<rsalveti> silbs: too bad it didn't work, hopefully should work better later :-)
<rsalveti> ricmm: they are from android upstream
<roman2861_> mhall119, I did some changes in the Weather app and proposed for merging. Can you review my changes and accept or decline it?
<rsalveti> ricmm: libcutils is already from android, I just took the remaining x86 functions and added there
<rsalveti> so it could build
<rsalveti> kdub: if you check hybris, there's a way now to properly hook up a different native window scheme
<rsalveti> mostly related with egl
<rsalveti> and they also got the port for wayland in place
<rsalveti> so we might need to do some work there, but I might be wrong
<rsalveti> don't yet know what is required by mir
<kdub> rsalveti, we sit right on top of the hals
<kdub> so no new hooking up needed in there :)
<mhall119> Calculator app team meeting in #ubuntu-touch-meeting
<rsalveti> kdub: then we're good
<sil2100> renato__: ping
<sil2100> renato__: https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/address-book-service/packaging_review/+merge/167812
<olli> pmcgowan, ChickenCutlass, jono, rickspencer3, everybody, are you guys just using your regular SIM or did you get a pay as you go SIM for testing/dogfooding
<ChickenCutlass> olli, pay as you go
<olli> ChickenCutlass, any specific recommendation
<ChickenCutlass> olli, just an att one
<olli> ok
<olli> I am just lost in the phone pricing maze
<pmcgowan> olli, others have used there own sim, but since I am on verizon got a second att sim
<olli> pmcgowan, I have separation anxiety... feel like I want to hold on to my sim/phone for a while ;)
<olli> thx guys
<mhall119> nik90: ping
<nik90> mhall119: hi
<mhall119> nik90: hey, would you be available to join a G+ hangout at 1500 UTC on Monday?
<mhall119> to discuss the alarm backend API with someone from the SDK team?
<nik90> mhall119: yeah I can make it
<mhall119> awesome, thanks
<mhall119> looks like we're going to get that ball rolling
<nik90> mhall119: will you send the g+ hangout invite by email?
<nik90> yes..I am glad that is happening since Alarm is the most requested feature
<nik90> will help the dog fooding a lot
<mhall119> nik90: yeah, I'll send it to your gmail
<nik90> ok
<mhall119> nik90: invite sent
<nik90> got it.
<dhacker29> I have ran phablet-dev-bootstrap -c to update and make sure I have the latest hybris and such but I can't seem to get a working build for the last month for the motorola razr.  Now with the migration to saucy not sure what is needed.  The android base builds with no issues but I never even get to where I have adb access
<slangasek> ogra, stgraber: lxc-android-config uploaded with udev diversions; next build should boot OOTB on mako
<jono> olli, I am using my normal SIM
<dhacker29> So it seems phablet-dev-bootstrap wasn't updating hybris I ran bzr pull and it updated to 132?
<folf> jono, olli what was the question? When I started out I realized the PIN code on the SIM needs to be disabled for it to work. Doesn't really say anywhere. (sorry if this was not the question, just joined)
<ogra> slangasek, yay
<slangasek> ogra: so is anyone working on the problem of every app coming up as a white canvas?
<ogra> slangasek, yes and there is a fix already but still in testing on the unflipped image
<ogra> ricmm worked it out
<olli> folf, I was just curious if there is a good pay as you go provider
<olli> less in technical terms, more with regards to plan & pricing
<folf> olli OK :-)
<slangasek> ogra: ok, cool
<slangasek> ogra: so, it's not specific to the container flip, whatever it is?
<ogra> nm is in progress as well ... only pulse is missing now
<ogra> it is a hack that looks up the child PID and connects it with the parebnt PID from the different namespaces that broke (as i understood)
<ogra> in the flipped world we dont need that
<slangasek> ogra: now, which detailed log did you see the /proc/self/fd/9 in?
<ogra> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5738679/
<slangasek> ogra: ok, but what log is that?
<slangasek> you just created a test job to dump the environment?
<genii> Interesting. Sounds sort of how "screen" command works
<ogra> slangasek, http://paste.ubuntu.com/5738665/ a debugging job
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> well, xnox  actually did :)
<ogra> (though it isnt exactly the job i used, there were a few more "on start" entries for ofono etc
<ogra> )
<ogra> i dont have it anymore
<slangasek> ogra: aha - specific to the upstart file bridge, it looks like
<slangasek> er, maybe
<ogra> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5738646/
<ogra> that is a dmesg with "Bad file descriptor" lines
<ogra> i suppose you have them on mako too
<ogra> (/var/log/dmesg to be precise)
<slangasek> yeah, that part I had
<slangasek> ogra: what sets up /dev/socket?
<ogra> the lxc-android-config upstart job ...  it is a dir full of links into the container
<ogra> the sockets we need to talk to rild (for GSM, 3G and SMS)
<olli> Saviq, can somebody from the UI team have a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/touch-preview-images/+bug/1183065
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1183065 in touch-preview-images "Occassional severe battery drain" [High,New]
<slangasek> ogra: ah, ok
<ogra> slangasek, my suspicion wrt the file bridge is that it simply doesnt get along with the situation
<ogra> i dropped that stuff for now
<ogra> (though it would have been nice if it worked)
<slangasek> dropped which stuff?
<ogra> awe_ is working on fixing ofonod to wait for the socket instead
<ogra> what i tried to do was to add a "on file FILE=/dev/socket/rild" line to the ofono upstart job
<awe_> ogra, I have to head out and run an errand, but will be working on this as soon as I return
<ogra> to make sure it doesnt try to start beforre the link is freshly created
<ogra> awe_, no hurry :)
<awe_> k
<ogra> we have other blockers that will take time
<slangasek> ogra: that seems to still be here
<ogra> yeah, havent uploaded the revert yet
<slangasek> (/etc/init/ofono.override)
<ogra> start on started dbus alone isnt reliable but definitely a lot more reliable
<ogra> only fails every 5th boot or so
<ogra> while using the file bridge only works every 5th
<slangasek> hmm, ok
<ogra> i dont really get why it gets more racy with the file bridge though
<ogra> sadly the timing is essential for ofono ... needs to be up after dbus and the socket but before the session
<mhall119> RSS Reader team meeting starting now in #ubuntu-touch-meeting
<ogra> (since telepathy-ofono expects it to be there)
<Saviq> olli, we'll have a look
<ogra> ah, my download finally finished
 * ogra finally gets to test todays image
<mhall119> kenvandine: when will uoa-create support Google accounts?
<olli> Saviq, thx
<olli> doesn't have to be tonight
<olli> at least not if it's you looking
<olli> if you know what I mean
<kenvandine> mhall119, do we have anything in the image that can use a google account yet?
<kenvandine> if we do... i could probably make that work
<mhall119> not yet, but soon the calendar will be able to import ical, and I'm hoping there's a Google API to get the private ical URL
<Saviq> olli, yeah, it feels tricky to reproduce, so it will definitely not be tonight
<ogra> bah, no keyboard :(
<renato__> sil2100, address-book-service is not too generic and can cause conflicts?
<kenvandine> renato__, nope... there is no package with that name
<kenvandine> and that is the project/source name already
<renato__> kenvandine, ok
<kenvandine> cool
<sil2100> renato__: not sure, there is no package like that in our universe, right?
<kenvandine> there isn't
<kenvandine> i checked
<davmor2> mhall119: Yay I broked it, just keep adding cities to the weather app on the galaxy nexus it gets slower and slower then fails to add another city and then finally keels over :)
<sil2100> renato__: as long as there is no package like that, I think it's fine to call it that way
<sil2100> renato__: also, the LP project name is anyway like that ;)
<kenvandine> and the source package name
<kenvandine> which has to be unique :)
<renato__> sil2100, I add some comments to the MR
<mhall119> davmor2: ouch, how many did you have to add to do that?
<davmor2> mhall119: 3 had it slow down 6 killed it
<mhall119> davmor2: I have a meeting with them in a minute, did you file a bug?
<mhall119> Weather team meeting starting now in #ubuntu-touch-meeting
<rsalveti> slangasek: the white screen when opening applications issue should be fixed soon
<rsalveti> once we get platform-api and qtubuntu in
<davmor2> mhall119: not yet will do in a minute
<rsalveti> waiting on the daily release stuff now
<mhall119> rsalveti: what is platform-api?
<rsalveti> mhall119: where we device our application lifecycle api
<rsalveti> *define
<mhall119> ok
<rsalveti> which is used by our shell
<slangasek> rsalveti: excellent :)
<mhall119> rsalveti: are we going to get an implementation of http://qt-project.org/wiki/Qt-Platform-Abstraction ?
<rsalveti> mhall119: not sure, ricmm or loicm would know better
<davmor2> mhall119: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-weather-app/+bug/1188332  didn't want to disrupt the meeting :)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1188332 in Ubuntu Weather App "Add 3 cities to the app on a galaxy nexus and you slow it down add 6 and it fails to load that last and kills the app" [Undecided,New]
<mhall119> thanks davmor2
<loicm> mhall119: we already have one in the QtUbuntu project, without it we wouldn't get any Qt app running on the phone/tablet ;)
<sil2100> renato__: thanks! Will check tomorrow
<renato__> sil2100, kenvandine https://code.launchpad.net/~renatofilho/address-book-service/rename/+merge/167827
<mhall119> loicm: will that allow us to use Qt.openUrlExternally and have it open the right app according to MimeType's in the app's .desktop file?
<kenvandine> i really hope so :)
<kenvandine> it'll make friends-app much more useful :)
<kenvandine> annoying to see all these cool links folks share and no be able to follow them :)
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, the bottom bar in the friends app, when i click refresh or top, i expect some type of visual feedback that it's clicked, but none. This WAD?
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, for now
<kenvandine> refresh isn't async, so no callback when it is done
<kenvandine> i want to make that async
<davmor2> kenvandine: make it so, cause twitter is like a static page on the phone really annoying :)  Friends makes life worth living again ;)
<bcurtiswx> well, all i'm looking for is a visual feedback with onclick:
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, indeed.. and that will happen
<bcurtiswx> :)
<kenvandine> i've considered making the refresh icon change briefly
<kenvandine> but that is just a pacifier :)
<kenvandine> i want it to really be async
<kenvandine> and show when it is complete
<kenvandine> which is backend work
<bcurtiswx> bfiller, is there any work being done with an empathy-style app for touch ? or any integration with sms ?
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, the app itself is what mobile devices are all about, i can't wait to see how far it goes
<renato__> kenvandine, do you have time to review it: https://code.launchpad.net/~renatofilho/address-book-service/rename/+merge/167827
<renato__> kenvandine, I have merged sill2100 work on my branch to make the things fater
<reindeernix> Has anyone tried to make plain Python work with Ubuntu's Qt Quick implementation? Just asking out of  morbid interest ;)
<reindeernix> So it works on a device I meant
<kenvandine> renato__, sure
<bfiller> bcurtiswx: the phone-app will evolve over time to support multi protocols like empathy
<kenvandine> bfiller, cool, so messaging will be in one place
<bfiller> as it uses telepathy as back end so won't be so hard
<kenvandine> the way it should be
<bfiller> yeah, that's the plan
<bcurtiswx> bfiller, sounds great. The two things I do on my mobile devices are SMS/Chat and Social networking
<bcurtiswx> so i'm really looking forward to those
<kenvandine> hopefully we'll be able to have proper foursquare support real soon... if location stuff works on the device :)
<bfiller> bcurtiswx: so sms is already supported in phone app. no chat yet. but someone from community was working on a whatsapp app
 * davmor2 shakes his fist at utouch on nexus7 
<bcurtiswx> davmor2, haha, it's fun isn't it
<bcurtiswx> bfiller, as long as it's in the plans i'm happy.
<kenvandine> i wonder what's going to happen with google talk since they are dropping xmpp
<AskUbuntu> Ubuntu touch preview nmcli connection for 3G data throws an error | http://askubuntu.com/q/304950
<davmor2> bcurtiswx: um no, it's frustrating cause now it's usable on the galaxy nexus and I want to use it on my tab too :'(
<bcurtiswx> i think the telepathy folks know about it, not sure what their plan is though
<bcurtiswx> i'm having trouble with a bit on the nexus 7, biggie being sound and video, but i know it's being worked on..
<loicm> mhall119, kenvandine: ok got it, our QPA plugin doesn't implement QPlatformServices (openUrl, openDocument and desktopEnvironment), this is why openUrlExternally always returns false for now, I guess we'll need to add support for it
<mhall119> loicm: yeah, and we'll need to make sure that it behaves properly with apparmour rules
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, oh is that why links aren't working on friends-app
<davmor2> bcurtiswx: oh no my big is go to the apps scope click on search and click on t for terminal it opens the app under it
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, yes...
<Atrix> excuse me
<Atrix> I'm considering getting a new phone that runs Ubuntu Touch
<kenvandine> loicm, i would be very happy if that was implemented :)
<Atrix> But I can't get an answer on whether it runs applications from the repos
<kenvandine> what applications?
<kenvandine> it runs the applications designed for ubuntu touch
<kenvandine> but not anything for ubuntu
<Atrix> Short answer: No.
<Atrix> I was hoping it could run stuff straight out of some armel repo.
<Atrix> Guess I'll stay with webtop for now, until it rots away
<kenvandine> the selection of apps is really growing fast
<jcastro> the cli stuff seems to work fine for me
<kenvandine> sure
<mhall119> RSS Reader team meeting in #ubuntu-touch-meeting
<loicm> mhall119: I guess that (popping up the browser with a specific URL, popping up the mail client with a mail address, etc) would require support from the platform api, not sure if it's in there yet, ricmm?
<freeflying> anyone has ubuntu-touch installed onto laptop :)
<mhall119> loicm: yeah, the QPlatformService should do it
<mhall119> loicm: ricmm: I was wondering if KDE might already have an XDG-compliant implementation
<Atrix> Even if the apps are growing fast, still,
<Atrix> it can't compete with a chrooted ubuntu on top of android.
<Atrix> not in that field, anyway; vnc keyboard sucks.
<bcurtiswx> hmm my friends app isn't updating any more
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, it refreshes every 15m
<bcurtiswx> it refreshed now, i was going on 30 mins before. you're just messing with me now
<ogra> hmm, i wonder what happens if i re-enable plymouth on maguro
 * ogra is brave and tries
 * genii keeps the fire extinguisher handy
<ogra> heh
<ogra> well, nothing happens :)
<ogra> behaves like before
<ogra> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# tail /var/log/upstart/plymouth.log
<ogra> plymouthd: ply-terminal.c:611: ply_terminal_open: Assertion `terminal != ((void *)0)' failed.
<ogra> plymouthd: ply-terminal.c:611: ply_terminal_open: Assertion `terminal != ((void *)0)' failed.
<ogra> haha
<ogra> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# tail /var/log/upstart/plymouth-stop.log
<ogra> /bin/sh: 0: Can't open /proc/self/fd/9
<ogra> slangasek, ^^^
<ogra> plymouth-stop doesnt have a manual override ... thats where the message comes from apparently
<mhall119> Doc Viewer meeting starting now in #ubuntu-touch-meeting
<slangasek> ogra: hmm, I have no idea what self/fd/9 is actually supposed to be
<ogra> googling got me to an old Keybuk fixed bug where it is explained that init talks to the job through it
<slangasek> ogra: link?
<ogra> https://bugs.launchpad.net/upstart/+bug/619269
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 619269 in upstart (Ubuntu) "init: "script" stanza leaks file descriptor to child process" [Undecided,New]
<ogra> from the script stanza
<slangasek> hmm
<ogra> likely not related, but it explains at least where it could come from
<ogra> so, i noticed that all processes depending on started dbus seems to come up racy (or sometimes not at all)
<ogra> powerd, ofono ...
<ogra> (havent looked at bluetooth and logind yet)
<slangasek> current upstart does use fd 9 for the script
<ogra> i wonder if thats also an upstart or rather a dbus issue
<slangasek> but I don't understand the error, because it's *succeeding* in reading the script.
<ogra> oh
<ogra> "Unknown username "whoopsie" in message bus configuration file"
<ogra> heh
<ogra> erm
<ogra> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# ps ax|grep /sbin/init
<ogra>     1 ?        Ss     0:04 /sbin/init
<ogra>  1110 ?        Ss     0:00 /sbin/init
<ogra> slangasek, ^^
<ogra> fun
<slangasek> erm?
 * ogra guesses we should remove uchroot from androids init.rc 
<slangasek> oh
<ogra> :P
<slangasek> yes ;)
<ogra> luckily we have /var/lib/lxc/android/override/ for this
 * ogra copies the init.rc from the rootfs and removes uchroot 
 * ogra reboots 
<slangasek> that also explains why I was seeing 'startup events' emitted by upstart 12 seconds after boot, then
<ogra> yeah, only one /sbin/init
<slangasek> 'startup' events
<ogra> looks like even ofono is happier
<ogra> i wonder if the file bridge would now work
 * ogra tries
<slangasek> which lines did you have to change to get rid of uchroot?  no matches on 'uchroot' in my copy of init.rc here
<ChickenCutlass> ogra, oops should have told you about that
<slangasek> ah, 'ubuntu_chroot'
<ogra> ChickenCutlass, i knew about it but totally forgot
<slangasek> ogra: so, not having two copies of upstart running... fixed the udevtrigger.  I wonder if the adbd I was connected to was actually the *inner* one?
<ogra> the prompt should tell you
<slangasek> well, regardless, I'm able to properly sequence ueventd vs. udev now
<slangasek> how would the prompt tell me?  it would look like the same ubuntu system in both cases, no?
<ogra> and its easily checked with ps ... androids utput looks totally different
<slangasek> not in android - in the inner upstart.
<ogra> not since we use bash
<ogra> ah
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> that would indeed look the same
<slangasek> anyway, I've changed lxc-android-config back to 'and starting udev', and everything starts up correctly here... still using a sleep to enforce it though
<slangasek> let's see if removing the dpkg-divert is also ok
<ogra> well, the v4l thing is still there
<slangasek> that's the one I'm removing
<slangasek> whoops, spontaneous reboot again
<mhall119> File Manager meeting starting now in #ubuntu-touch-meeting
<ogra> wow, so adding the file stuff to ofono now makes ofono do nothing at all (i dont even get a log) and powerd completely crashes on startup
 * ogra likes the new lockscreen
<ogra> the two inits also explain why every other reboot did get stuck
<ogra> OH
<ogra> NM works !!
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> well ...
<ogra> kind of
<ogra> it shows all networks after a manual iwlist scan
<ogra> and i can set the checks ... but dont get the key prompt
<slangasek> so I'm not sure if the upstart-file-bridge is starting early enough to guaranteeably catch the /dev/socket/rild creation
<slangasek> upstart-file-bridge is currently 'start on mounted', which seems rather strange as that will catch the first mount only
<slangasek> so the sequence is startup -> mountall -> first (virtual mount) == mounted -> upstart-file-bridge started
<ogra> well, lxc-adnroid-config  doesnt really start early
<slangasek> and lxc-android-config, which creates the link, starts on cgroup-lite, which waits for mounted MOUNTPOINT=/sys/fs/cgroup... which may or may not mean that it starts before upstart-file-bridge
<slangasek> since 'start on mounted' blocks the return of any /individual/ mounted event, but mounted events are processed in parallel by mountall
<ogra> oh
<ogra> so adding "and started file" might help
<ogra> but might also make the boot longer
<user82> hi. when is the 3g data gui config planned? i heard it might even be ready by next week?
<slangasek> ogra: 'and started file' - adding that where?
<ogra> lxc-android-config
<mhall119> rsalveti: when will the new platform_api and qtubuntu be in a device image?  This white screen bug is annoying the heck out of me
<ogra> sigh, i should rename it to just be "android" ... typing it is such an effort
<slangasek> ogra: yes, 'start on started upstart-file-bridge and started cgroup-lite' seems ok
<slangasek> I'm still trying to figure out why u-f-bridge has the rules that it does
<slangasek> though that's probably irrelevant here
<rsalveti> mhall119: once the daily stuff lands
<ogra> well, while that line above works, adding the file stanza back to ofono blocks ubuntu-touch-session
<rsalveti> mhall119: probably tomorrow
<ogra> which is really weird
<mhall119> rsalveti: is there any work-around for now?
<mhall119> I've just been rebooting until I get a session where it doesn't happen
<rsalveti> mhall119: we got the mrs
<rsalveti> you'd need to build lp:platform-api
<rsalveti> and https://code.launchpad.net/~ricmm/qtubuntu/remote-pid-cross-container/+merge/167640
<ogra> cyphermox, logind is running as a system service
<cyphermox> ogra: NM with the patches synced doesn't work on the saucy images
<cyphermox> yeah
<ogra> doesnt it also need a session part ?
<slangasek> doesn't want need a session part?
<slangasek> logind?
 * ogra isnt really up to date on the lennartOS stuff
<cyphermox> root       494     1  0 20:32 ?        00:00:00 /lib/systemd/systemd-logind
<mhall119> thanks rsalveti, I'll give it a shot
<ogra> slangasek, yeah
<slangasek> no, logind *is* a system service
<slangasek> however, currently the shell is not registered with logind
<slangasek> AFAIK
<ogra> slangasek,  cyphermox has NM ready, but it refuses access for the phablet user
<cyphermox> that won't help the UI for sure
<ogra> yeah
<cyphermox> however I should still be able to run nmcli from the phablet suer
<cyphermox> *user
<slangasek> /etc/init/ubuntu-touch-session.conf doesn't register with logind at all... normally this is handled by PAM, I believe
<ogra> well, adbd isnt registered with logind either i guess
<cyphermox> before, I had issues with doing this inside adb shell; it looked like it was failing to identify the seat
<cyphermox> right
<ogra> which means your shell is unprivileged
<mfisch> ChickenCutlass: ping
<ChickenCutlass> mfisch, hey
<cyphermox> I was trying from ssh beofre as well, but tbh I didn't try again with ssh yet
<ogra> ssh registers with pam
<mfisch> ChickenCutlass: I wanted to give you an update on that setting for screen timeout. We can't listen for the setting change because the changes don't propigate on the system bus. ted says that is coming soon
<ogra> which should give you all you need
<ChickenCutlass> mfisch, ok got it
<cyphermox> nope
<cyphermox> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5739987/
<slangasek> ssh will give you a session for logind, though it won't have an associated seat
<cyphermox> this is failing at the policykit level btw..
<slangasek> what are the authorization rules?
<slangasek> local logged in user?
<cyphermox> but we have a good enough policy in place already, afaict things should work
<slangasek> or something else?
<cyphermox> actually, hold on a second, something is wrong with the policy I think
<kenvandine> bfiller, i've added some feedback to the user that a photo is being uploaded https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/share-app/feedback/+merge/167847
 * ogra wonders if that loud POP sound the maguro makes on reboots was there before
<cyphermox> meh, it souldn't change much
<pmcgowan> ogra, I bet not
 * mhall119 is gonna fill up his N7's storage with build depends
<pmcgowan> ogra, thats the audio codec getting turned on? ask ChickenCutlass about that one
<ChickenCutlass> lol
<ogra> yeah, i guess
<ChickenCutlass> pmcgowan, been down that road
<ogra> theoretically we should just ship a proper UCM profile
<slangasek> cyphermox: which dbus call is this?
<ogra> which sets the levels right and wouldnt cause a popping anymore
<ogra> but since all that stuff is handled from android i dont think we want that
<cyphermox> slangasek: well, it's for the action org.freedesktop.NetworkManager.network-control
<mhall119> rsalveti: which do I need first, qtubuntu or platform_api?
<slangasek> cyphermox: hmm
<cyphermox> nmcli con down id "whatever"
<cyphermox> would be the same for trying to bring up a connection too
<rsalveti> mhall119: platform-api
<mhall119> thanks
<rsalveti> mhall119: hm, but that would require a change in the android side as well
<mhall119> oh
<mhall119> so not as simple as bzr branch, bzr builddeb, dpkg -i?
<rsalveti> but I believe today's image should have it already
<mhall119> you mean I have to be *patient*? :(
<rsalveti> mhall119: if you're using the latest, give that a shot
<rsalveti> otherwise you'd need to flash the system image at least
<rsalveti> from today's image
<mhall119> oh, I think I'm on 153...
<slangasek> cyphermox: and the policy for that seems to say that even users who aren't on the active seat should be able to run that command?
<rsalveti> mhall119: 154 is the latest
<cyphermox> there is no specific policy for this anywhere, even on desktop
<slangasek> cyphermox: I'm trying to interpret the policykit file, which does seem to say both inactive and active users are allowed to use this action
<mhall119> ok, I'll phablet-flash to that this evening
<mhall119> assuming 155 with the new stuff doesn't get built before I do
<cyphermox> slangasek: I can only agree
<cyphermox> it's not necessarily anything to do with the seats and stuff, but there is definitely something wrong along the authorization chain
<slangasek> cyphermox: I've actually just confirmed here, it is related to logind
<cyphermox> ah
<slangasek> cyphermox: if I adb in and run 'sudo -u phablet nmcli con', I get no connections shown
<cyphermox> err
<mhall119> well, platform_api packages all built okay
<slangasek> cyphermox: if I edit /etc/pam.d/sudo to call pam_systemd, I see the connection list
<cyphermox> interesting.
<slangasek> cyphermox: so I think this is expected behavior; it's not expected that user processes would not have an associated logind session
<AskUbuntu> I want to create my own Ubuntu Phone Preinstalled touch image | http://askubuntu.com/q/305008
<slangasek> we need to fix that, somehow, to get a PAM session associated with the shell - I'm not sure if that was already on the agenda?  ChickenCutlass?
<ChickenCutlass> slangasek, not that I know of.  We can add it
<slangasek> cyphermox: can you confirm that 'echo session optional pam_systemd.so >> /etc/pam.d/sudo' fixes the other nmcli calls for you under adb?
<cyphermox> slangasek: I get the same issue from ssh though
<ChickenCutlass> slangasek, how do we do that?
<ogra> slangasek, Mir will require lightdm as i understand
<cyphermox> slangasek: I should have to sudo to run the commands though
<ogra> so we should get that for free
<slangasek> ChickenCutlass: well, good question.  it might have to wait for lightdm integration, yes.
<ogra> until then having a hack wold be okk i guess
<slangasek> cyphermox: well, as I have no network on my mako currently ;), I can't ssh in to confirm this
<cyphermox> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5740027/
<slangasek> ogra: hacking in pam is not cheap or easy.  If we're expecting to be moving to lightdm, we might want to see if we can get that sooner rather than later
<cyphermox> I understand
<cyphermox> that's with your change to sudo
<mhall119> qtubuntu compiled too
<mhall119> bzr builddeb is my favorite thing ever
<ogra> slangasek, well, that depends on the Mir team i guess
<cyphermox> slangasek: also, sshd includes common-session, which has pam-systemd
<slangasek> cyphermox: yes, for ssh I would have expected this to already work
<slangasek> cyphermox: what does 'loginctl' show?
<cyphermox> nah
<cyphermox> just a second
<cyphermox> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5740035/
<mhall119> well....that didn't work
<mhall119> guess it's phablet-flashing time
<slangasek> cyphermox: seems consistent with what I have here
<slangasek> cyphermox: ok; so adding pam_systemd to sudo lets me call 'nmcli con' where before I couldn't, but I can confirm that it doesn't let me call 'nm cli con down id foo'.
<slangasek> nmcli
<cyphermox> right
<cyphermox> the current policy should let you do that as well
<slangasek> yes
<slangasek> I think we may have to kick this over to a policykit expert
<slangasek> we should be calling pam_systemd for the user session... but if calling pam_systemd is insufficient, I'm not sure if that's a policykit bug or what
<cyphermox> if only I could get it to log more, it would already be easier
<reindeernix> will ubuntu Ubuntu.Components support Python one day? Just asking if anyone have heard anything ;)
<reindeernix> That would be really neat
<combsbj> is it possible to install the touch screen interface packages on an x86 vm to use over a remote desktop protocol from tablet?
<mhall119> combsbj: what "touch screen interface packages" are you referring to?
<mhall119> reindeernix: you can probably use them with python already if you have a qt5 library for python
<reindeernix> mhall119, there is a qt5 library for Python? o:
<mhall119> reindeernix: I don't know, the last time I looked there was only qt4 bindings
<mhall119> maybe pyside has qt5 now
<reindeernix> mhall119, there hasn't been an update to PySide for a while but Riverbanking that creates PyQt is making it compatible with Qt5 :) Just wanted to know if there was talk about making Python ingrained into it like JavaScript is now.
<reindeernix> mhall119, Well thanks anyway :)
<reindeernix> Found a snapshot for PyQt5 which is nice :]
<mhall119> kenvandine: does friends-app integrate with the messaging menu yet?
<mhall119> reindeernix: javascript comes from QML, I don't think there are plans to support other languages inside QML itself
<reindeernix> mhall119, okay ;_;
<reindeernix> Well thanks :D
<mhall119> no problem
<cyphermox> slangasek: perhaps this is relevant anyway: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5740136/
<slangasek> cyphermox: the 'Error getting login monitor: -2' part, maybe?
<cyphermox> yeah
<slangasek> cyphermox: I don't see that same error on my desktop
<cyphermox> err, scratch that, the same thing happens when I kill polkit on m ydesktop and start it again
<slangasek> oh, really?
<slangasek> on mine, I get all the same output except for that
<cyphermox> ah
<slangasek> I don't know how much the monitor aspect matters, really; but that definitely does work on my saucy desktop
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> I was under the impression that was when polkit actually syncs with logind, otherwise it comes up on PolkitBackendLocalAuthority
<cyphermox> but I may well just be misundrstanding this
<cyphermox> anyway, enough of this for now -- I'll need to ask someone who knows polkit well
<mhall119> rsalveti: installed those packages on build 154, rebooted, seems fine now
<mhall119> thanks!
<rsalveti> mhall119: awesome
<rsalveti> glad it worked
<ogra> slangasek, just FYI using the file event does exactly nothing in ofono ... i even have console log set and dont get any log
<cyphermox> rsalveti: afaik the updated NM doesn't break the touch image worse than it currently is for saucy, ie. you get a wifi connection list and stuff, so I'd be tempted to upload that to distro now
<rsalveti> cyphermox: sounds good
<ogra> cyphermox, oh, i guess bluetooth might also become another fun area with the container flip
<cyphermox> indeed, it will be the same kind of fun
<cyphermox> ogra: I suspect the first issue with bluetooth is that the kernel doesn't have hcismd, again
<ogra> well, the big issue is that we dont handle the dveices at all on the ubuntu side
<cyphermox> right, but still
<cyphermox> I bet the kernel is missing that specific config
<cyphermox> rsalveti: where can I look at the current kernel config for saucy ubuntu-touch?
<rsalveti> cyphermox: http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git?p=ubuntu/ubuntu-saucy.git;a=summary
<rsalveti> depends on the branch
<ogra> cyphermox, zcat /proc/config.gz
<rsalveti> http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git?p=ubuntu/ubuntu-saucy.git;a=blob;f=debian.grouper/config/config.common.ubuntu;h=989f9745bc8543a258ad5b2bcc377378901a2bf8;hb=5a2654fb75b13a8df63f4b6a70b938fc6127273e
<rsalveti> grouper, for example
<ogra> or zgrep
<cyphermox> err
<cyphermox> that's weird, according to uname I'd be running a 3.0.0 kernel
<cyphermox> also, config.gz confirms my suspicion
<cyphermox> oh wait
<cyphermox> perhaps this is actually wrong on this device, I'm not on the mako
<rsalveti> haha
<cyphermox> hmm
<cyphermox> rsalveti: so yeah, afaict, missing a kernel bit, but I'm not sure why I have 3.0.0 when apparently the saucy tree is for 3.9.0
<ogra> cyphermox, because we use the android kernels (or the kernel team does and packages them)
<cyphermox> ogra: ok...
<ogra> there should be the respective branches on k.u.c
<ogra> and we have packages and source packages indeed, you can just apt-get source and cross build etc
<cyphermox> ogra: it's fine I'll just ask on #ubuntu-kernel to add that option
<ogra> yeah
<cyphermox> ogra: so that's done, that Å going to be needed to even get hci0 on the devices
<cyphermox> with the exception of grouper which still uses brcm-patchram
<omdaf> hello
<reindeernix> mjallo
#ubuntu-touch 2013-06-07
<dagekb> Hello...
<dagekb> Where can I find LG Nexus 4, Android 4.2.2? :)
<dagekb> When I flashed Ubuntu Touch, it deleted my backup (from CWM)... It have never done this before...
<dagekb> ... the backup was my Android 4.2.2, so now it is gone...
<dagekb> Found it... :)
<dagekb> I was hoping I could try out (and develop) for Ubuntu Touch at the same time I could use Android 4.2. But no?
<guest_33200482> nexus 7 and ubuntu touch on it: can i make calls?
<mhall119> guest1__: make calls on a Nexus 7?
<dragonkeeper> Anyone interested in developing ubuntu touch for i9505 ?
<k03ll> mhall119: yep, i was that guest__ finding out if i can make calls on a nexus 7 with ubuntu touch
<k03ll> dragonkeeper: i9505 seems to be a samsung device?
<dragonkeeper> Yes samsung galaxy s4 i9505 jfltexx
<mhall119> k03ll: the nexus 7 is a tablet, not a phone....
<mhall119> I suppose you could use VoIP
<dragonkeeper> We have twrp , cwm recoverys and cm10.1 already . So as i understand it ubuntu-touch shouldnt be so hard to port over if someone has experience doing it
<k03ll> mhall119: 7" isnt big enough, and voip is more than an all time alternative.
<mhall119> dragonkeeper: if I had an S4 and was any good at porting, I'd be all over it :)
<mhall119> k03ll: I'm make a joke about holding a N7 up to your ear to talk, but I think my brother's Galaxy Note 2 is almost as big
<k03ll> the nexus 4 is ubuntus flagship, much cheaper than a s4 and very affordable. i like the new image from ubuntu / canonical
<dragonkeeper> Never dev'd for android roms so im here lol, not really a ubuntu fan but it seems to be the closest thing to getting a decent linux system running
<k03ll> mhall119: of course, i would use a headset or somthng similiar. im not going to use it as a heavy phone user. just to make some calls and answer incomings
<mhall119> dragonkeeper: have you read the porting guide?
<mhall119> k03ll: I suppose all it would need is somebody writing a voip client for Ubuntu Touch
<mhall119> oh, and audio working on the Nexus 7
<dragonkeeper> Just one thing i want to know as your talking about calls, can ubuntu make use of another line. I.e im in a call with 1 person and another person calls me on same number and it appears on screen so i can put 1 on hokd talk to other or merge calls
<mhall119> dragonkeeper: that I don't know
<mhall119> and I don't have a phone to test it with
<dragonkeeper> :[
<mhall119> I know, I make that face whenever I see someone doing something cool with their Ubuntu Phone
<dragonkeeper> So as i understand it, this uses arm packages from ubuntu repo ? Therefore there must be IR drivers for phones ?
<dragonkeeper> I have this s4 and a motorola atrix 4g i want it on
<mhall119> dragonkeeper: for the ubuntu side, yes, it uses arm packages from the repos
<mhall119> but the kernel and drivers that come from Android, I'm not sure about
<dragonkeeper> So if i got a android kernel with , say ,, nfc support  . Then i could use nfc with ubuntu side
<mhall119> well no, you'd need both sides to know what's going on
<mhall119> you might expose a device in the kernel with the Android support
<mhall119> but unless there's something on the Ubuntu side that knows what to do with that device..
<rh> hi
<rh> has anyone tried to install ubuntu touch on an acer iconia a200?
<rh> is it even compatible?
<rh> anyone willing to help with a question?
<rh> anyone willing to help with a question?
<rh> is ubuntu touch compatible with the acer iconia a200?
<rh> hi
<rh> help?
<rh> question?
<rh> is there any assistance in this room?
<duflu> rh: I don't know if anyone has tried it yet. Likely won't work. All development for ubuntu-touch is being done on Nexus/Galaxy devices
<rh> that's unfortunate...
<rh> thanks
<daniel3> I installed Ubuntu Touch on my Nexus 7, and nothing even opens, none of the apps. :\
<dholbach> good morning
<c__chp> __
<c__chp> anyony there
<FunkyPenguin> is there a way of bringing wifi up from adb? using the ui doesn't work for both the secured and unsecured APs here
<ttoine> hey
<ttoine> I would like to flash my phone and test again ubuntu touch
<ttoine> does it manage sim security now ? or I still need to unlock my sim card before ?
 * leemeng0x61 anybody?
<AskUbuntu> Ubuntu touch install from recovery on nexus 7 3g | http://askubuntu.com/q/305183
<ogra> that person should just follow the manual install instructions
<daniel3> Too glitchy to even be usable :\
<seb128> oSoMoN, mzanetti: hey, I'm doing a packaging review of notes-app before it lands in Ubuntu and I've a small issue
<seb128> oSoMoN, mzanetti:
<seb128> src/NotesApp/Plugins/cachingprovider.cpp: LGPL (v3)
<seb128> src/NotesApp/Plugins/cachingprovider.h: LGPL (v3)
<seb128> the project is under GPL for everything else
<seb128> is that wanted to use the LGPL for those 2 sources?
<seb128> we either need to change them to be GPL or to add a COPYING.LGPL to the source and list them correctly under debian/copyright
<seb128> oh, Components/RemovableBG.qml Components/CollapsedNoteDecorations.qml and Components/CollapsedNote.qml as well
<oSoMoN> seb128: weâd need confirmation from Ugo who wrote the code, but Iâm pretty sure itâs just a copy/paste leftover, this is entirely original code written in-house
<oSoMoN> seb128: unfortunately Ugo isnât working today, heâll be back on Monday
<seb128> oSoMoN, ok, no problem, that can wait monday
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<didrocks> thanks :)
<seb128> oSoMoN, do you want a bug report about that or should I just ping you guys again on monday?
<oSoMoN> seb128: please ping Ugo on Monday
<seb128> oSoMoN, ok
<seb128> oSoMoN, same issue in camera-app with DeviceOrientation.qml ... is that Ugo as well?
<asac> bfiller: are you guys doing webapps too?
 * ogra grumbles about grouper
<cking> where do I file bugs against qml-phone-shell?
<nj_> i need some help...i tried the steps given on galaxy nexus 7...all the steps were completed successfully...but i din get ubtuntu touch after rebooting
<oSoMoN> seb128: according to bzr annotate, yes
<nj_> what could be the possible issue/
<nj_> ?
<nj_> any help?
<seb128> oSoMoN, mediaplayer has the same issue, files are from renato on this one though
<kalikiana> cking, going by the precedent probably here https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/1163273
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1163273 in Unity "[qml-phone-shell] wrong app is shown when an app deployed from QtC" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> oSoMoN,
<seb128> ./tests/unittest/thumbnailtest.cpp: LGPL (v3)
<seb128> ./src/qml/sdk/sliderUtils.js: LGPL (v3)
<seb128> ./src/qml/sdk/mathUtils.js: LGPL (v3)
<cking> Kakadu, thanks
<cking> oops
<cking> kalikiana, thanks
<nj_> i need some help...i tried the steps given for galaxy nexus 7...but i din get ubtuntu touch after rebooting..what could be the issue?
<oSoMoN> seb128: I believe renato should be online very soon, feel free to bug him about it
<seb128> k
<nj_> okay..
<nj_> hey,,i am not sure about this...but this could be a lame question as well....still...after pushing the images into device do i also have to install them through install zip from sdcard option?
<nj_> hey,,i am not sure about this...but this could be a lame question as well....still...after pushing the images into device do i also have to install them through install zip from sdcard option?
<nj_> hellooo
<eax> Hey there - is there an ETA on tethering and 3G/LTE?
<lilu> hello, i'm looking for a tablet model with external USB device support that is capable of running Ubuntu. could anyone give me some hint please?
<xqee> hello
<xqee> can  i put ubuntu on jay-book 9905 ?
<adc> Hi! I got stuck when trying to install the developer preview on my Nexus 4, using the install instructions from the wiki. I'm running Debian Jessie, and added the 'raring' repo to my sources.list. After enabling USB debugging, the device showed up in 'sudo adb devices'. I went ahead and executed 'sudo phablet-flash -b'. The files were downloaded just fine, and 'raring-preinstalled-{recovery,system,boot}-armel+mako.img' were flashed without warnings
<didrocks> oSoMoN: FYI http://paste.ubuntu.com/5741741/, you can see what you can work on to get your components better :)
<didrocks> oSoMoN: basically the apps have license issues as seb mentionned, so I'll keep this stack frozen for now
<didrocks> (to avoid spamming the archive with packages we can't NEW)
<adc> My issue was resolved by restarting the adb server with 'adb kill-server', and pushing the stock rom to the device.
<oSoMoN> didrocks: would you mind sharing this paste with a wider audience (i.e. send an e-mail) so that all maintainers are aware of what they need to address?
<didrocks> oSoMoN: as soon as Unity and touch migrates to the release pocket, I'm doing that
<didrocks> oSoMoN: it's already written TBH :p
<Moviuro_> Hi all! Where do i get the file to flash on my phone? :)
<k1l> Moviuro_: the topic mentions a wiki overview page, where you find install instructions for supported and community supported devices
<jaywink> does ubuntu touch already support pin unlocking or should I remove the pin question from my sim? Planning on going dogfooding mode today :)
<Moviuro_> Thanks k1l
<ogra> jaywink, no PIN support yet ... it is being worked on though
<jaywink> ogra, thnx
<ogra> oh you silly silly grouper
<tassadar_> ogra: it's still giving you hard time? :/
<ogra> tassadar_, yeah, trynig to find the one option that makes it boot
<tassadar_> heh
<didrocks> mterry: @pocketsphinx: yeah, the work was duplicated
<didrocks> sil2100: see my comment about multiverse on julius, if you can discuss about it with tedg :)
<tedg> didrocks, ?  Julius, we're not using it anymore?
<didrocks> tedg: aren't you? why are you recommending it then? ;)
<tedg> didrocks, bug?
<tedg> :-)
<rickspencer3> cyphermox, have you seen that this bug is assigned to you?
<rickspencer3> https://bugs.launchpad.net/touch-preview-images/+bug/1183065
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1183065 in touch-preview-images "Occassional severe battery drain" [High,New]
<rickspencer3> it's making my phone unusable outside the house
<rickspencer3> which, you know, for a mobile phone, is kinda a deal breaker :)
<didrocks> tedg: we don't do bug I heard? :p
<tedg> didrocks, Yeah, I don't think we need that.  The sphinx voxforge stuff should be enough.
<didrocks> tedg: ok, let me prep a branch
<tedg> Double checking with pete-woods ^
<didrocks> tedg: I had to remove temporarly the upstart job for unity-panel-service btw
<tedg> didrocks, Hmm, why?
<didrocks> tedg: I dropped a note to get that back
<didrocks> tedg: I noticed some troubles when I exited my session
<didrocks> unity went back through the panel service
<didrocks> (there was also a segfault, but that was bamf)
<didrocks> tedg: so no worry, it needs more testing, just needed to release :)
<ogra> didrocks, the touch images (all of them, even on cdimage) build with --no-install-recommends
<ogra> so i guess it just didnt show up that tthere is a stale recommends
<didrocks> ogra: interesting :)
<didrocks> ok
<ogra> yeah, fixing that bit will be another horrid transition :)
<tedg> didrocks, Hmm, interesting.  Did you enable it?  It should be basically off until we update gnome-session.
<tedg> Which we should do :-)
<didrocks> tedg: not for unity-panel-service
<tedg> didrocks, But it was "start on started unity" so it should only start when the unity upstart job starts.
<tedg> Hmm, perhaps even if it blocks it records the start.
<didrocks> tedg: yeah, I just noticed this behavior, but I'll retest properly
<tedg> Anyway, yes.  That's fine.  Happy things are out :-)
<didrocks> me as well :)
<tedg> We can refine more now.
<didrocks> thanks!
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> tedg: https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/hud/remove-julius-caesar/+merge/168078
<didrocks> sil2100: FYI ^
<ogra> the romans will hate you !
<sil2100> didrocks: ACK
<didrocks> ogra: :)
 * tedg wonders why LP is taking so long on the diff
<ogra> it is roman too ?
 * tedg thought it was Russian, Soyuz, right?
<pete-woods> didrocks: tedg is absolutely correct, we no-longer need to package julius, we managed to switch over to using sphinx for voice recognition
<cyphermox> rickspencer3: I have seen it, jason told me yesterday
<rickspencer3> cyphermox, do you know what the cause is? any ideas?
<cyphermox> not really. it could be the background scanning, but it seems to me like you should be seeing the same kind of battery drain on a laptop as well if it was the case
<asac> ogra: how is container flip going? whats your risk assessment and predicted landing time as of now?
<ogra> asac, mako and maguro should boot out of the box now, i wasted the whole day on grouper trying to find the kernel options that break it (massively time consuming and not done yet) ...
<ogra> beyond this, the hybris/appmanager/platform-api issues seem to be harder to resolve than expected
<asac> ogra: nice!! those kernel options, what were those about?
<asac> can you write a shell script that tests that those options are available?
<asac> runtime shell script
<ogra> asac, well, the kernel goes into an endless reboot loop atm, init dies
<ogra> with no further info ...
<asac> ic
<ogra> but i can boot an nexus7 desktop kernel (which then fails on all the other userspace bits since it misses the needed optionns for touch)
<asac> ogra: what options did you find missing so far?
<ogra> well, we changed a lot for the desktop kernel ... the diff between the configs is 800 lines (with cruft though ... actually changed lines should be around 200 or so)
<ogra> i'm sure its a combo of only a few options, but finding the right one is hard and eats time
<ogra> (and the n7 doesnt charge in recovery, so it dies every few hours and i need to re-charge)
<ogra> i will have grouper working after the weekend
<ogra> for manta i havent seen any tests at alll yet
<ogra> on maguro i have the ofono/rild stack working since yesterday ... but it is still a bit racy
<ogra> sound/pulse will still need love
<ogra> nob ody touched that yet
<jcastro> will phablet-flash at some point just switch me over to saucy or do I need to do manual things?
<ogra> it will just switch you over
<ogra> one way or the other
<asac> is this channel logged?
<rickspencer3> asac, yes
<asac> cool. found it
<rickspencer3> asac, http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/06/07/%23ubuntu-touch.txt
<rickspencer3> ^ I've created a singularity
<BobbyEsco> hello
<BobbyEsco> anybody home?
<ogra> most of us ...
<ogra> ... except the ones that arent
<asac> rickspencer3: you see this battery bug? bug 1183065 ?
<ubot5> bug 1183065 in touch-preview-images "Occassional severe battery drain" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1183065
<asac> rickspencer3: can you attach a syslog after seeing this symptoms to the bug?
<rickspencer3> asac, sure
<rickspencer3> I'll need to do it in a few hours since my phone is flat out of batteries now ;)
<BobbyEsco_> so whats the status for ubuntu touch for android??
<ogra> what is ubuntu touch for android ?
<BobbyEsco_> ubuntu os on android
<rickspencer3> BobbyEsco_, hi, we call that Ubuntu for Android
<rickspencer3> or affectionately, U4A
<ogra> well, that has no touch in it :)
<BobbyEsco_> ooh ok, thanks for the correction
<ogra> (not only in the name )
<rickspencer3> BobbyEsco_, unlike Ubuntu Touch, U4A requires deep partnership with the phone manufacturer
<asac> rickspencer3: you know its funny ... my galaxy nexus is here on wifi on my table now in its 4th or 5th day :)
<rickspencer3> BobbyEsco_, and as ogra points out, you'll get a standard Ubuntu desktop running from your phone
<asac> i am close to vouch for not adding any features if i get 3-4 days and can browse and can receive phone calls :)
<rickspencer3> I think it's 12.04 LTS running Unity 2d iirc
<ogra> asac, you are not roaming around
<asac> this device never lasts longer than a day with android
<asac> with same usage profile
<asac> ogra: probably, but i am comparing same use case with android :)
<ogra> well, we dont really run much yet
<asac> well. to be fair it doesnt have a SIM ... just wifi checking a few times a day what the battery is and using the shell a bit
<asac> right.
<ogra> start a few apps that also make use of sensors etc
<ogra> android runs a ton of that stuff in bg
<asac> hence i said: i vouch to see if we can somehow add nothing that will bring us donw
<asac> :)
<ogra> haha
<ogra> we surely could ... but i guess that wouldnt really give good usability
<asac> i dont want to see so much dirt that we loose 2 more days :)
<ogra> i guess we'll use one at least
<ogra> s/use/lose/
<rickspencer3> asac, cyphermox is there a way I can just tell the phone to never use the configured wireless and just stay on my cellular data?
<rickspencer3> and in that way, not have the nm go crazy and drain my battery?
<asac> rickspencer3: that feature exists in a few forms
<asac> rickspencer3: hammer: you can just remove the wifi module (if we dont build it in the kernel)
<rickspencer3> that sounds rather drastic
<cyphermox> rickspencer3: I think you can just disable wifi : nmcli nm wifi off
<asac> also ... if we use NM there is this setting you know from indicator to disable/enable wireless
<rickspencer3> ah
<asac> yeah... thats the cli :)
<rickspencer3> turning off wifi sounds correct
<asac> nice
<ttoine> hi
<rickspencer3> asac, I don't think we have a setting in the indicator to turn wifi off yet
<ttoine> is ubuntu touch managing sim card security now ?
<cyphermox> I'm still very doubtful it's actually NM doing things wrong... I reflashed the raring image just now on mako to dig into it
<rickspencer3> though, it wouldn't be the furst time I as surprised if we did
<jcollado> Hello. I've just installed the touch image in a nexus7 and wanted to use the terminal to run some example autopilot tests
<cyphermox> rickspencer3: renato has a code branch that does this
<asac> rickspencer3: right. hence my vague statement. didnt know it was encoded in our cli. so thats great answer
<jcollado> but I don't get any virtual keyboard and if I plug a USB keyboard it doesn't work either.
<cyphermox> but the wifi driver is broken and won't allow you to turn wifi back on
<rickspencer3> oh
<rickspencer3> cyphermox, can I turn wifi back on from the terminal?
<asac> cyphermox: do you have a feeling why we see bug 1183065 ?
<ubot5> bug 1183065 in touch-preview-images "Occassional severe battery drain" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1183065
<asac> is that scanning going wield?
<cyphermox> which is also what steers me to say that the battery drain is also likely driver related
<jcollado> I think the terminal window isn't getting the focus because the square looks empty instead of full. Any advice to troubleshoot this?
<cyphermox> rickspencer3: no... when the device gets turned off there's some firmware loading issue or something that prevents the device coming back to ready to be used
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> so I won't do that :)
<cyphermox> sorry :(
<rickspencer3> cyphermox, it might be good to mention a couple of these things in the bug report so folks know it is being addressed
<awe_> ttoine, no support for SIM PIN/PUK yet
<asac> cyphermox: i think android always rmmods wifi drivers
<asac> cyphermox: if they disable wifi
<asac> so most likely the normal disable code path is not tested
<asac> we try software disable, right?
<asac> if so ... definitely worth trying unload on disable
<awe_> asac, cyphermox, we should look at the Android WifiManager and see how it's done
<asac> i really think they are aggressive
<asac> and rmmod it
<asac> i think it was at some point even in the compatibility spec
<asac> that you ned to have wifi module as a module :)
<awe_> I'm not sure the module is removed
<asac> awe_: in android?
<beidl> they surely did rmmod the wifi module on older phones (found this on my 3 year old HTC Desire) in Android
<cyphermox> awe_: it's going to be hard to rmmod a module when it's builtin...
<asac> beidl: i really believe it was even the default code path
<cyphermox> asac: ^
<asac> cyphermox: but its probably our decision to build that in?
<cyphermox> that said, when you nmcli nm enable false ; nmcli nm enable true, the device comes back
<cyphermox> asac: no
<cyphermox> it's always a builtin afaik
<asac> cyphermox: we use the upstream defconfig?
<ttoine> awe_, thanks. so I have to unlock my sim in android before flashing, true ?
<awe_> by default the drivers are builtin
<asac> cyphermox: thats mako?
<cyphermox> rickspencer3: ^ feel free to turn off wifi as I mentioned earlier, if you can live with 3G being off temporarily as you bring wifi back up
<cyphermox> asac: yeah, mako
<cyphermox> so it looks like a missing netlink event or something
<awe_> ttoine, correct
<rickspencer3> cyphermox, ok, that sounds like a good work around
<rickspencer3> I'll try it later today and update the bug report with the work around if it works
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> I'll add the details o nthe bug
<awe_> cyphermox, does the bug exist, or are you in the process of creating it?
<cyphermox> well, a bug for power management w.r.t wifi does exist
<awe_> yes, but I think that's associated with scanning
<cyphermox> awe_: also, confirming the issue is with the indicator for listing wifi scan results..
<cyphermox> right
<awe_> is there a bug that says "powering off wifi is broke"?
<cyphermox> it's associated by scanning because the driver is brain dead
<cyphermox> I don't know
<cyphermox> renato_: ^ ?
<awe_> cyphermox, you have to remember the driver was written specifically for Android, not a generic Linux distro
<cyphermox> awe_: how hard can it be to write a driver that just works?
<awe_> and thus there are assumptions about what userspace does that effect how the driver works
<cyphermox> it's not like there are many different ways to speak to those devices... it's either nl80211 or wext
<awe_> cyphermox, it's not a question of how hard, it's a question of what platform it was targeted to
<cyphermox> it's not using a different way to deal with this, it's just half-baked
<awe_> we also have to figure what to do about the driver-specific wpa_supplicant code too
<cyphermox> it's just incomplete because it's all they ever needed, they only added the bare minimum to make it do stuff
<awe_> correct, the drivers were built to certify Android devices
<cyphermox> I know
<awe_> that's why we've seen issues with CRDA, et al.
<cyphermox> it's just annoying anyway to run into all these issues that should have been fixed years ago already
<awe_> why should they have been fixed?
<rickspencer3> they are not issues
<rickspencer3> it sounds like, it's just unnecessary functionality for what the driver was written for ;)
<awe_> correct
<ttoine> awe_, thanks
<awe_> ttoine, np
<mhall119> nik90: btw, I had to move the alarm api meeting to Tuesday, can you still attend?
<cyphermox> rickspencer3: I brought up the issues to jasoncwarner, perhaps someone else can look into the driver while I focus on NM and wpasupplicant?
<cyphermox> I'm trying to finish writing the patch to let NM know about ofono connections and autoconnect 3G when possible
<cyphermox> (at the same time)
<vthompson> names
<asac> awe_: so
<asac> 15:49 < bhoj> 15:47:20> asac, that was the approach at some point of time for
<asac>               sure. The code is still there in
<asac>               hardware/libhardware_legacy/wifi/wifi.c
<asac> he also said that its not like that by default anymore though
<asac> so just FYI
<awe_> asac, thanks... I kinda figured that out by the presence of "legacy" in  the directory name
<xnox> using ListItem.ValueSelector how to set the "default" value?
<asac> awe_: ah... wasnt sure you found the code
<asac> so nevermind
<awe_> asac, k thanks
<MASTER260> Hey, just wondering if anyone's been working on porting Ubuntu for tablets over to Android-86.
<MASTER260> *Android-x86.
<slangasek> ogra: can you turn up the upstart log priority?  (booting with --debug, or calling 'initctl log-priority debug' early in boot)
<ogra> me ?
<MASTER260> So... does anyone know?
<ogra> slangasek, you can just update the cmdline with abootimg
<ogra> abootimg -u /dev/disk/by-partlabel/boot -c "cmdline=--debug"
<ogra> something like that
<slangasek> ogra: sorry, I was apparently reading some rather stale scrollback here from yesterday wrt file events... I was suggesting you do that in order to debug why the file event wasn't doing anything for you
<slangasek> ogra: but maybe you've moved on from that :)
<ogra> ah, well, i tried to get grouper going today ... since 90% of the team have that platform ...
<ogra> so that we get more testing and dev help ....
<ogra> but had to stop for getting the charging code into the initrd now
<MASTER260> So... I guess no one knows...
<ogra> MASTER260, there is no support for x86 yet ... someone would have to get x86 support into the android tree on phablet.ubuntu.com first
<ogra> pathes will be gratefully accepted ;)
<MASTER260> Is anyone working on that?
<ogra> no
<ogra> at least not that i'm aware
<MASTER260> Oh.
<mhall119> ogra: correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't our x86 plan to use Mir and Unity 8 on top of the standard Ubuntu kernel and drivers, and not using Android?
<ogra> mhall119, not sure that would work on an x86 phone ...
<ogra> for tablets it probabbly would
<ogra> -b
<ogra> but if we have to have x86 android for phones i dont see any issues to also pull in tablet stuff there
<ogra> (and get better HW support)
<mhall119> for Android HW anyway
<ogra> right
<ogra> it is definitely "wanted" but nobody has time for working on it ... to get it fast someone from the community would have to step in
<rickspencer3> cyphermox, I'm ready to repro that bug and get the syslog
<rickspencer3> do I just repro it, and then grab the syslog, or do I need to enable logging or anything first?
<rickspencer3> maybe I can just adb pull what is already there?
<cyphermox> rickspencer3: It would be better if you enabled debugging in NM
<cyphermox> let me get the command line
<rickspencer3> ok
 * rickspencer3 cancels upload of current syslog
<cyphermox> sudo python /usr/lib/NetworkManager/debug-helper.py --nm debug --domains=core,wifi
<rickspencer3> cyphermox, ack
<rickspencer3> may take me a while to get to it
<cyphermox> you'll need python-dbus on the phone for that, it seems to be missing here at least
<cyphermox> sure
<rickspencer3> oh
<cyphermox> I'll fix that with my next upload
<rickspencer3> that's annoying :)
<rickspencer3> cyphermox, can I enable the debugging via ubuntu_chroot shell?
<sergiusens> rickspencer3: debugging nm and ofono? If it is, look at my comment here https://plus.google.com/100264483712374857174/posts/3o1tjYo9Ghx (sorry just joined so may not be related)
<rickspencer3> hi sergiusens
<rickspencer3> I'm trying to get a syslog for cyphermox to help track down that power eating bug
<sergiusens> rickspencer3: so what are you enabling debugging for?
<rickspencer3> sergiusens, because cyphermox asked me too
<rickspencer3> :)
<sergiusens> rickspencer3: it's generally just going into the upstart job and setting the debugging flag
<sergiusens> rickspencer3: in /etc/init/ofono.conf add a -d to the ofono cmd
<sergiusens> rickspencer3: in  /etc/init/network-manager.conf add a  --log-level=DEBUG
<sergiusens> rickspencer3: your syslog will be happily logging lots there
<rickspencer3> so make it exec ofonod -d --noplugin=atmodem
<rickspencer3> ?
<awe_> sergiusens, you never answered my question yesertday about the cause of the roaming bug
<awe_> did you create a bug for it?
<sergiusens> awe_: yeah, I shared it with you yesterday and you said thanks :-)
<awe_> cyphermox, no CDMA support in touch, nor is it currently planned
<sergiusens> awe_: I was just fetching it for rickspencer3 .... but #1188404
<sergiusens> bug #1188404
<sergiusens> argh
<sergiusens> https://bugs.launchpad.net/touch-preview-images/+bug/1188404
 * sergiusens wonders where the bot is
<nik90> mhall119: i can still attend.
<sergiusens> rickspencer3: yes to your question above
<mhall119> nik90: aweseme
<mhall119> nik90: I won't be around, I'm hoping popey will be there though
<awe_> sergiusens, I thought you said you discovered the root cause?
<awe_> sergiusens, also what *happens* when you enabled roaming?
<nik90> mhall119: oh you wont be there
<rickspencer3> sergiusens, so, er, pico doesn't let me actually save the file :/
<mhall119> nik90: unfortunately no, I'm off that day, but i don't want to delay it any further
<nik90> mhall119: okay. But you should definitely sometime come to the design meetings on thursday :)
<sergiusens> rickspencer3: oh, are you root?
<rickspencer3> yeah
<rickspencer3> I'm using ubuntu_chroot shell
<sergiusens> awe_: when I enabled roaming, cpu usage of ofono tends to 0
<rickspencer3> adb root
<rickspencer3> adb shell
<rickspencer3> ubuntu_chroot shell
<rickspencer3> root@ubuntu-phablet:/etc/init#
<awe_> sergiusens, ah ok.  I didn't quite understand your wording
<rickspencer3> sergiusens, is there a better way to edit files on the phone?
<cyphermox> awe_: I know, I was telling them to have fun playing with the code if they want to make it work
<awe_> so sergiusens, more importantly... did data work?
<sergiusens> rickspencer3: I use vi...
<awe_> cyphermox, k
<sergiusens> awe_: ahh... I'm fearful to try, but I'll give it a shot
<awe_> well you did try
<sergiusens> rickspencer3: I just vi and ssh in... should work... I did all this yesterday with the ubuntu-terminal-app
<awe_> I mean you enabled & attached, right?
<awe_> if you get a super expensive cell phone bill, expense it
<sergiusens> awe_: let me give you some output :-)
<awe_> we need to testing roaming at some point, and I bet the bill will be cheaper than an airplane flight
<awe_> ( besides, we really don't use much data... so try and ping, and then bring it down )
<sergiusens> I'm attached... NetworkReg says I'm roaming, adding to the bug
<sergiusens> rickspencer3: you can edit the file on your desktop and adb push it to the phone too
<rickspencer3> sergiusens, that;s a good idea
<rickspencer3> I want to figure out how to do with with vi though
<rickspencer3> I have a hate/hate relationship with vi
<rickspencer3> meh, I'll just pull and push it ;)
<sergiusens> rickspencer3: ah... yeah, you either love it or hate it
<awe_> I hate vi, but learned some basic skillz with it along time ago
<rickspencer3> honestly wish I thought of pulling and pushing before
<awe_> at one point ( back in the day ) it was the only editor guaranteed to be on a machine
<awe_> ( hmm, sounds familiar )
<sergiusens> rickspencer3: if it weren't root things you wanted to do, you could also just sftp from nautilus and do it with a bling :-)
<sergiusens> awe_: roaming works https://bugs.launchpad.net/touch-preview-images/+bug/1188404/comments/3
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1188404 in touch-preview-images "ofono between 30% and 40% CPU usage when roaming" [Critical,In progress]
<sergiusens> awe_: just need to solve the thing when roaming isn't allowed :-)
<awe_> sergiusens, ack
<awe_> I'm looking at it now
<rickspencer3> hmmm
 * rickspencer3 goes to repro bug
<jcastro> hey guys, is audio from the browser supposed to work?
<jcastro> I tried html5.grooveshark.com with hopes of having a music player; the entire site works great other than no audio
<ChickenCutlass> jcastro, not yet.  It will soon
<jcastro> ah excellent.
<jcastro> The grooveshark html5 client is pretty sharp.
<kenvandine> how usable is saucy on the nexus7 now?  would i regret switching to it today?
<kenvandine> i really need the new webcred stack on it :)
<bcurtiswx> is friends built on saucy?
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, of course :)
<kenvandine> ogra, ^^
<bcurtiswx> do i need to phablet-flash frequently still, or no?
<kenvandine> i do daily
<kenvandine> not sure how important that is
<kenvandine> it's just part of my morning ritual :)
<bcurtiswx> mine always gives me a not enough data warning, but if i -b it works
<kenvandine> it's nice now that our settings don't get lost
<bcurtiswx> but i think -b removes my settings, right?
<kenvandine> yeah, remove the zip files
<kenvandine> i think so
<kenvandine> i never do that
<bcurtiswx> what zip files do i remove ?
<sergiusens> -b bootstraps
<sergiusens> and wipes
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, which zip files would I remove ?
<kenvandine> i only did it when i switched from quantal to raring
<kenvandine> the raring ones just keep getting overwritten
<kenvandine> but the quantal ones were lingering
<kenvandine> cyphermox, i hear you switched to saucy... how did that work for you?
<rickspencer3> sergiusens, cyphermox https://launchpadlibrarian.net/141892521/syslog
<cyphermox> pretty good? any specific question in mind?
<bcurtiswx> should we expect any major differences at this point?
<sergiusens> bcurtiswx: well the shell has evolved quite a bit
<bcurtiswx> neat
<kenvandine> cyphermox, i need to test the webcred stack
<kenvandine> which has landed in saucy
<kenvandine> i don't want to rebuild it all for raring :)
<kenvandine> cyphermox, how do you flash saucy?  manually push the zip files and do it in recovery?
 * sergiusens shuts down as no more battery power
<sergiusens> kenvandine: you want saucy flipped or saucy unflipped?
<kenvandine> unflipped
<kenvandine> safest path :)
<bcurtiswx> what does that even mean?
<sergiusens> kenvandine: let me send and email
<kenvandine> sergiusens, thanks
<mhall119> Music app team meeting starting soon in #ubuntu-touch-meeting
<balloons> nik90, ping
<nik90> balloons: pong
<balloons> nik90, hey :-) So i'm flooding the projects with bug reports to help squash the autopilot testing needs.. And it's clock's turn ;-) Did we get a shortlist of features that need tested?
<balloons> ahh no I'm pre-empting we'll be talking about in 30 mins in the meeting :-p
<nik90> balloons: hehe
<balloons> nik90, we'll talk then
<balloons> haha
<nik90> balloons: just about to ask
<nik90> balloons: yeah
<balloons> my head is spinning today
<balloons> sry mate
<nik90> no worries
<slangasek> ogra: so, you may be interested to know that with upstart 1.8-0ubuntu4 (not in the latest daily yet), if you boot with --write-state-file, 'telinit u' will spit out a snapshot of upstart's state to /var/log/upstart/upstart.state
<slangasek> ... though if I happen to do this while there's a nested init running under ubuntu_chroot, I get a kernel panic
<slangasek> ... and it seems to only take effect on the second 'telinit u' (raising a bug about this)
<slangasek> xnox: ^^ have you played much with --write-state-file?
<penk_> what's the best way to keep display on?
<xnox> slangasek: only briefly. It did work in simple system init with/without session inits.
 * slangasek nods
<slangasek> ogra: it seems the fix for disabling ubuntu_chroot hasn't landed in the dailies; does that have to wait for us to be building the android bits in LP?
<slangasek> fun, sensorservice has gotten itself in a busy loop polling/reading the wrong fd
<slangasek> ChickenCutlass, ogra: how could I report a bug on sensorservice for this?
<ChickenCutlass> slangasek, that's a great question
<slangasek> :-)
<slangasek> hmm, completely reproducible, too... killed it off, it respawned with the same behavior
<mhall119> Clock app team meeting starting now in #ubuntu-touch-meeting
<cyphermox> rsalveti: you aware of current suspend issues with raring?
<cyphermox> there are these entries is rickspencer3's logs:
<cyphermox> Jun  7 11:34:01 ubuntu-phablet kernel: [ 1165.839462] power_suspend_late return -11
<cyphermox> Jun  7 11:34:01 ubuntu-phablet kernel: [ 1165.839493] dpm_run_callback(): power_suspend_late+0x0/0x68 returns -11
<cyphermox> Jun  7 11:34:01 ubuntu-phablet kernel: [ 1165.839493] PM: Device power.0 failed to suspend noirq: error -11
<cyphermox> could definitely explain the power drain if the device keeps trying to suspend and come back
<awe_> cyphermox, rsalveti is off today
<cyphermox> oh
<awe_> cyphermox, these should probably go to the attention of sforshee
<cyphermox> yeah
<awe_> ( aka powerd upstream )
<awe_> ;D
<cyphermox> bah
<cyphermox> it's not conclusively screaming "wifi" at me though
<sforshee> we need to figure out what device power.0 is
<sforshee> which device does this happen on?
<cyphermox> sforshee: mako
<cyphermox> full log at https://launchpadlibrarian.net/141892521/syslog
<sforshee> darn, I don't have the mako kernel locally. I'll have to clone it.
<AskUbuntu> Ubuntu Touch on SII phone | http://askubuntu.com/q/305394
<rtg_> sforshee, mako is a branch in ubuntu-saucy
<sforshee> rtg_, okay. Actually I don't even have saucy locally since I haven't been doing kernel work recently :-P
<rtg_> sforshee, so, you've turned into a kernel slacker ?
<sforshee> guess so
<sforshee> powerd now owns me
<Djdomrep> hi guys
<sforshee> cyphermox, awe_: [  178.372104] active wake lock smd_sns_dsps, time left 198
<sforshee> something like this is in the log each time that happens
<sforshee> arch/arm/mach-msm/smd_pkt.c:    "smd_sns_dsps"
<awe_> SMD Packet Driver
<awe_> provides a binary SMD non-muxed packet port interface
<sforshee> awe_, is this the comm interface between the modem and app cpus?
<awe_> no idea
<cyphermox> could also be bluetooth on the mako
<awe_> I talk to RILD
<cyphermox> but I don't see why it would muck around so much with nothing paired and all
<awe_> references to the modem in the source, so doubt it's BT
<sforshee> it's in the core msm architecture code
<cyphermox> just sayin', SMD is used for bluetooth too :)
<sforshee> so I doubt it's bluetooth
<cyphermox> alright
<cyphermox> sforshee: do you think this could be a cause for battery drain?
<awe_> well if it's preventing suspend from happening, yea
<sforshee> cyphermox, I'd have to look more closely. If this is just occasional then no, but if it happens consistently then yes
<awe_> cyphermox, was 3g data enabled?
<awe_> was/is
<cyphermox> awe_: no idea
<cyphermox> this is rickspencer3's log
<cyphermox> my guess is yes :)
<sforshee> cyphermox, awe_: It only happens occasionally, so I don't think it's to blame
<sforshee> I suspect this sends messages over the shared memory interface between the ARM cores in the SoC, and that it takes a wake lock when a new message arrives until it is read
<cyphermox> ok
<sforshee> I take that back
<sforshee> at one point in the log that lock looks like it's held for a very long time
<cyphermox> mmkay
<rickspencer3> awe_, I put the steps I followed with the log in the bug report
<cyphermox> just trying to figure out what might cause battery drain from those logs, if suspend might be one cause, and whether there's anything wireless related there
<awe_> thanks rickspencer3
<sforshee> cyphermox, awe_: so there's a suspend at 788.752601 but not another one until 1061.360628
<sforshee> okay, so that wake lock isn't to blame for that
<sforshee> userspace has suspend disabled
<sforshee> so maybe the phone was being used
<cyphermox> yeah
<sforshee> so between 1090.730962 and 1223.482984 userspace has autosuspend enabled with the kernel, but the device is constantly waking up and going back to sleep
<sforshee> it never stays suspended for more than a few seconds
<sforshee> cyphermox, awe_: ^
<rickspencer3> sforshee, could that be because I kept turning it back on?
<rickspencer3> I had it in my hand the whole time
<rickspencer3> and I was running top
<sforshee> rickspencer3, no because then powerd would have disabled autosuspend
<rickspencer3> I kept checking to see if I was getting the bug
<rickspencer3> sforshee, fwiw, it's pretty simple to reproduce, but it requires going outside ;)
<rickspencer3> or I guess you just kill your wireless
<cyphermox> heh
<cyphermox> wireless is useful...
<cyphermox> I've been removing the connection file
<sforshee> oh you know what, it's probably just that the timer the kernel uses stops ticking during suspend
<sforshee> so suspends appear to take no time at all
<balloons> nik90, I don't think I can assign a milestone to the autopilot bugs for clock app
<balloons> give me a few mins and they will all be up though.. I'm sure you noticed the tag needs-autopilot-test
<balloons> nik90, or if you want to simply add them all yourself that works :-)
<nik90> balloons: I already started reporting the bugs :P
<balloons> I'll let you be then :-)
<nik90> hehe
<balloons> ty niel
<balloons> err.. tab complete.. ty nik90
<niel> haha
<mhall119> lol
<niel> ;)
<mhall119> no love for niel
<balloons> nope..
 * balloons revokes his ty to niel 
<niel> pings for days
 * balloons hands niel an "I'm sorry" cookie. It has red frosting
<niel> hehe
 * niel stuff it in his face
 * nik90 is rofl
 * niel then eats ice cream
<sforshee> that smd_sns_dsps does occur a lot more often than I'd like to see it, so we should figure out what's causing it
<sforshee> maybe something to do with sensors
<cyphermox> sforshee: see anything in the logs that would say something's amiss with wifi? I can't see anything wrong
<sforshee> cyphermox, not obviously, but since it's a fullmac device (I assume) most of the stuff is happening inside the hw
<sforshee> so we really don't have visibility into what might be going on there
<cyphermox> sforshee: looking for something meaningful in powertop now
<sforshee> cyphermox, I have to go pick up my kids, but I'll be back in about 30 minutes
<cyphermox> sforshee: sure
<cyphermox> I actually found something interesting
<cyphermox> 26.3% ( 64.0)   [wcnss_wlan] <interrupt>
<awe_> cyphermox, so...just thinking, we know powering off wifi doesn't work right now, correct?
<awe_> so it's always on?
<awe_> if so, that's going to kill the battery
<awe_> my maguro eats battery like no tomorrow if wifi is enabled
<awe_> ( stock android )
<cyphermox> wifi can be disabled
<cyphermox> it's just not being disabled in the way the driver expects it to be
<awe_> can it be powered off?
<nik90> balloons: done.https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-clock-app/+milestone/coreapps-13.10-month-3
<mhall119> Terminal app team meeting starting now in #ubuntu-touch-meeting
<awe_> I thought that was the bug we were talking about with renato?
<cyphermox> awe_: I think ifconfig wlan0 down is possibly enough
<balloons> nik90, awesome. I'm excitied to see all the core apps running with autopilot :-
<nik90> balloons: me too. No more regressions
<awe_> cyphermox, have you confirmed?
<awe_> I know that's the way it's supposed to work, but hey... this is an Android driver
<cyphermox> awe_: it's not the easiest thing to confirm when you need to be plugged in because yo ucan't use wifi
<awe_> not sure I understand
<cyphermox> using adb is skewing powertop results
<cyphermox> looks like bringing the device down is "fixing" it, so perhaps there's something to fix in NM
<cyphermox> I need to do it a couple of times to make sure
<awe_> ok
<slangasek> stgraber, ogra: so if we did have udev handling all the firmware events for us... we would want /dev bind-mounted into the android container, right?
<slangasek> assuming, for the moment, that udev could be made to do a reasonable job of this in place of ueventd
<stgraber> slangasek: so the reason why we don't usually do that is because of the console and pts devices which we typically want to be per-container, but as Android isn't spawning getty anyway and we can always mount a tmpfs on /dev/pts, I think that's doable
<slangasek> stgraber: so what makes the pts devices per-container?  looking here, both instances of /dev/pts have near-identical contents
<slangasek> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5743129/
<slangasek> (not sure why one has /dev/pts/0 and the other has /dev/pts/1?)
<slangasek> do these ptses actually exist in different namespaces?
<slangasek> ptys, I mean
<stgraber> slangasek: actually, I was wrong, we don't need a tmpfs. We just need /dev/pts to exist, which will be the case anyway. LXC mounts a new devpts instance on it at container startup time.
<slangasek> ok
<slangasek> stgraber: so if I want to bind mount /dev for a test, where should I do that?
<stgraber> slangasek: easiest way would be to add "mount -o bind,ro /dev $LXC_ROOTFS_PATH/dev" to /var/lib/lxc/android/pre-start.sh in place of the "mkdir -p $LXC_ROOTFS_PATH/dev/pts"
<slangasek> ok
<slangasek> let's see how badly this blows up! :)
<Jamper91> Hi
<Jamper91> i have a problem, installing Ubuntu Touch, after i wirte the command phablet-flash -b, and download all things the console say " device detected as maguro..... download set to .... THE DEVIES NEEDS TO BE UNLOCKED FOR THE FOLLOWINg TO WORK" after that, the console say: waiting for devices
<stgraber> slangasek: my hope is that mounting read-only will avoid any dammage to the Ubuntu side, however I'm not sure whether that won't also prevent writing to the actual entries. If that's the case, you'll have to drop the ,ro
<slangasek> stgraber: 'ro' shouldn't prevent writing to the devices, that's controlled by 'nodev'
<stgraber> slangasek: indeed and those that aren't devices are sockets so aren't affected by ro either. LXC may be unhappy though as it'll likely fail to setup console and the ttyX devices but I'd probably have to see the error to figure out how to workaround it.
<slangasek> ok
<sforshee> ricmm, am I right to assume that on_new_proximity_event() in powerd will not run on the glib main loop?
<slangasek> stgraber: strange; with a bind mount, /proc/$(pidof /init)/root/dev is almost completely empty... something else seems to be overmounting it?
<stgraber> slangasek: it very well could be that android is mounting a devtmpfs
<stgraber> slangasek: look at  /proc/$(pidof /init)/root/proc/mounts
<slangasek> cat: /proc/485/root/proc/mounts: No such file or directory
<stgraber> cat /proc/485/mountinfo then, that should work
<slangasek> yeah... was looking at that, but it's hard to read :)
<slangasek> 60 59 0:5 / /dev rw,relatime shared:2 - devtmpfs udev rw,size=956896k,nr_inodes=156914,mode=755
<slangasek> 39 60 0:25 / /dev rw,nosuid,relatime shared:10 - tmpfs tmpfs rw,mode=755
<stgraber> sadly we don't have a 3.8+ kernel on the phone yet, otherwise we could just use lxc-attach, that'd make things much easier to debug ;)
<slangasek> remind me what those columns mean?
<slangasek> first column is the mount "id", second column is the mount id of the parent?
<stgraber> mount_id, parent_id, major_minor
 * slangasek nods
<stgraber> so that shows a tmpfs being mounted on top of the bind mount
<slangasek> right
<stgraber> I'm assuming that's hardcoded somewhere in Android's init as I don't remember seeing that or proc or sys in the fstab
<slangasek> yes, it doesn't seem to be in init.rc
<slangasek> stgraber: so there's a way to make the container be unable to mount, right?
<slangasek> stgraber: strings /var/lib/lxc/android/rootfs/init doesn't mention udev or devtmpfs, so I wonder where this could be hard-coded
<ninjastick> Hola :)
<ninjastick> I was wondering if a Desire HD is capable of running the Ubuntu for phones? Everything I find mentions dualcore phones
<stgraber> slangasek: we could prevent the mount if we had apparmor. Short of that, the only other way we can do that is by dropping cap_sys_admin but that'll likely result in a lot of other things failing.4~
<ninjastick> Does anyone know where to find a list of compatible devices?
<slangasek> ninjastick: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<ninjastick> slangasek: Ah, thanks alot! I can see the Desire HD isn't on there...
<ninjastick> Since the normal HTC Desire is on there, the DHD must be capable of running it aswell...
<slangasek> ninjastick: each device requires porting, device names tell you virtually nothing about what kernel drivers are needed.  So someone would need to prepare an image for this specific device - but there's nothing about Ubuntu Touch that requires a dual-core, so there's no reason I know of that it wouldn't run on your device
<ninjastick> I'm aware that it needs porting, I was looking at it spec-wise :) Most of the things I look at just mention the supah-doopah powers of Ubuntu Touch and dual-core devices, so I had an idea that it was made for dual-cores. And the HTC Desire appears to be a lot more popular than the HTC Desire HD was, so.. Well.. I might aswell just start looking for a new phone :P
<ninjastick> Anyway, thanks alot for the help ^^
<ninjastick> Cheers!
#ubuntu-touch 2013-06-08
<Random_> Hello everyone
<Random_> Is there anywhere or anyone that has the knowledge to install the Raring Dailys onto the HTC One X
<Random_> I have followed the instruct that was used to flash/install the original dev img, now that the Dailys are coming from Raring not Quantal I believe the CM10 image does not support the new preinstall
<johnjohn101> will a galaxy tab be a good platform for testing ubuntu tablet stuff?
<slangasek> Random_: CM doesn't have anything to do with supporting Ubuntu Touch; generally, you're installing Ubuntu Touch /over/ any CM that's present on the device.  The process is the same whether for quantal or for raring, but I don't personally know anything about installing on the HTC One X (and whether there's a raring-compatible hardware pack for the 1X)
<Esigolo> I Just need the raring-preinstalled-recovery-armel+mako.zip to flash the nexus 4 right
<Esigolo> i just ti be sure
<Esigolo> ?
<slangasek> Esigolo: please see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install for instructions on how to flash
<knrubar> hi.  Does anyone know how I can import or sync contacts with the latest release?  It does not appear that the  `manage-address-books.py create` method is available anymore.
<john___> hi
<john___> how to install
<slangasek> stgraber: ok, I'm at an impasse with bind mounting of /dev.  I can't just bind mount directly to /dev, because it gets overmounted with a new tmpfs and /init doesn't have a 'umount' command; I've tried mounting it to a different path and letting /init move the mount, but it doesn't do it and then /init hangs.
<slangasek> stgraber: ah, partly because /var/lib/lxc/android/rootfs/fstab.mako references links that aren't created anywhere
 * snwh is away: Away
<slangasek> stgraber: ok, worked through the fstab.mako problem, and /dev still fails to get re-bind-mounted because /init doesn't understand how to pass MS_BIND to mount().
<slangasek> stgraber: so I'm officially giving up for now
<Nimble> Hashcode: are you still doing development for ubuntu touch on the droid 3?
<Hashcode> Nimble: it's not my highest priority since it's 512MB RAM
<Hashcode> :/
<Nimble> alright, just curious.
<Hashcode> Not a death knell per say.. but not focusing on it since the performance just isn't there yet.
<Nimble> hm.
<Nimble> well the UI wont start at all. I can still get into the phone with adb but running "qml-phone-shell" gets a segfault
<Nimble> know where I can start looking to fix this? I  think last time updating the qt packages worked
<Hashcode> Yeah actually we have a current issue
<Hashcode> it's the android layer
<Nimble> oh, ok
<Hashcode> there's been a few changes in raring/saucy
<Nimble> when did the changes occur?
<Hashcode> I need to redo the builds from scratch and sort of see where it's failing
<Hashcode> it's probably been broken for a good month I think
<genii> Hashcode: I broke my droid3 ... does it work well on 4, or possibly photon q?
<Nimble> I got raring to work about 2 weeks or so ago
<genii> ( thinking which next phone to get)
<Nimble> but that was only because I had the network set up already and I could update the packages
<Hashcode> Nimble: I would have appreciated some kind of pull request :/
<Hashcode> genii: honestly, i'm at a loss to recommend a replacement keyboard phone atm.
<Hashcode> genii: i have the D4
<Hashcode> genii: it's fine, but over a year and a half old almost
<Nimble> a pull request?
<Hashcode> Nimble: as in let us know what you did to get it working.
<genii> Hashcode: Ah, OK. Thanks :)
<Nimble> oh
<Hashcode> So that I don't spend 8 hours rebuilding it from scratch duplicating
<Hashcode> genii: i was hoping to see some kind of 720p keyboard phone come out.. but it hasn't happened yet.
<Nimble> if you can help me set up the wireless network on it I could see if it will work
<Nimble> or you can try adding the qt5 edgers ppa
<Hashcode> Oh
<Hashcode> You mean you ran the update on the phone
<Nimble> yep
<Hashcode> not a new build.
<Nimble> oh no
<Nimble> I have no idea how to do builds on my own
<Nimble> lol
<Hashcode> yeah, I'm debugging a brand new build.
<Hashcode> As the latest changes break
<Nimble> hm.
<Nimble> my memory is hazy now if I installed from the new build or if it was an old build I had installed already
<Shubham> hello
<Shubham> ubuntu touch is still in developer preview stage? because I saw a video showing the working version of ubuntu touch
<Nimble> you can install it and use it on supported devices but you may not find it useable as a daily driver yet
<knrubar> hi.  Does anyone know how I can import or sync contacts with the latest release?  It does not appear that the  `manage-address-books.py create` method is available anymore.
<leemeng0x61> ç¹è²
<ogra> slangasek, uuh, no, we dont want the container to see any of the hosts dev, thats one of the main reasons to use lxc :) the container has nothing in it that would make use of the hosts dev entries, but  the host needs access to some of the devices of the container. what we have now is fine, just need to find all the devices we need to add to the udev rule to get permissions and naming right
<roman2861> Guys, who can review a Weather Core App and merge into thme main branch?
<roman2861> *the
<Guest20530> hi i have an atab tablet with the followin spec http://www.microdirect.co.uk/Home/Product/56655
<Guest20530> can i install ubuntu touch
<Guest20530> hello anyone
<Guest20530> can anyone answer my question
<jaywink> !devices
<ubot5> You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<jaywink> Guest20530,
<Guest20530> yes i checked but because it is similar to the samsung 10.1 i was wondering if i coul install it
<Guest20530> i guess the answer is to wait for a generic image
<roman2861> ballons, are you here?
<roman2861> *balloons
<Guest20530> is there an ubuntu touch generi img for tablet
<roman2861> Guys, Ubuntu weather app devs! Are you here?
<nuovodna> morning to all, i'd like to know if i can upgrade from raring build to saucy one without wiping the configurations (data/installed app)
<ogra> phablet-flash will handle keeping your userdata once it defaults to saucy ....
<ogra> i dont think it can preserve your installed apps yet
<nuovodna> ogra: thanks
<nuovodna> i will wait for saucy image
<almaidinajad> hii everybody before i try to install the latest version of ubuntu touch on HTC One X I need to know if there is some other build
<KillerTheLord> Does Ubuntu touch allow sharing of phone's 3g connection to PC using tethering?
<KillerTheLord> Does Ubuntu touch allow sharing of phone's 3g connection to PC using tethering?
<ogra> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<ogra>  ubuntu-touch : Depends: ubuntu-qtlocation-plugin but it is not going to be installed
<ogra> E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages.
<ogra> bah, who broke the saucy builds
<Um3ggh1U> anyone using ubuntu  13.04 desktop with a touch screen?
<IdleOne> Um3ggh1U: fair warning, this is the weekend and answers may take time. :)
<Um3ggh1U> thanks IdleOne :)
<IdleOne> also, just ask your real question and if someone knows they will try to help.
<Um3ggh1U> ok, i have a problem with 13.04  desktop fresh install and touchscreens, after 1 or 2 clicks the system stops to recognize clicks, someone experienced the same problem?
<ricmm> sforshee: right, calling thread context comes from somewhere else
<ricmm> you can set a context for the cb if desired
<AskUbuntu> Are Ubuntu Phone apps compatible across different devices? And if yes, how? | http://askubuntu.com/q/305702
<rickman> hey Guys! someone outthere to help me out?
<UbuPhillup> rickman: ask
<rickman> got a HTC desire s. wanna put ubuntu touch on it. im in recovery and just flashed phablet saga 10.1 andt quantal-preinstalled-phablet-armhf. unfortunately the device reboot in recovery but not into ubuntu. whats wrong?
<rickman> ive downloaded the phablet saga and the preinstalled phablet armhf and put it on the desire`s sd card. then boot into recovery. did a full wipe. then installet the phablet-saga 10.1. next step was installing quantal-preinstalled-phablet-armhf. then a reebot. and now it reboots in recovery everytime but does not boot ubuntu
<AskUbuntu> Symphony FT45 mobile PC suite for ubuntu 12.04LTS | http://askubuntu.com/q/305740
<slangasek> ogra: I don't agree that what we have right now is fine; we still don't have udev vs. ueventd sorted out reliably, and I'm very concerned about the implications of this
<Tercero> i have ubuntu touch on a nexus 7 running the newest daily build.  how do i install the terminal app
<RobbyF> does netflix work on the browser? I doubt it but figured it's worth asking.
<ldiqual> hey guys!
<ldiqual> just a quick question that Google couldn't answer for me
<ldiqual> is it possible to dualboot android & ubuntu touch on Nexus 4 at the moment?
#ubuntu-touch 2013-06-09
<transpARent> +x
<bitethecoin> Hello. I just flashed my Nexus 4 with Ubuntu Touch. I can not seem to find a way to add contacts. Is there any easy way to do this?
<bobweaver> How can I do this in QML  :)  http://pastebin.com/T7VATsiQ
<bobweaver> Foo would be any thing like a child of a abstract button or a opacityShape
<simon_> hi there ubuntu lovers. i was wondering if someone could kindly answer a question for me about the ubuntu phone??
<Nimble> he never asked his question...
<leemeng0x61> hi there ubuntu lovers. i was wondering if someone could kindly answer a question for me about the  carif
<leemeng0x61> ...
<carif> is that a typo?
<leemeng0x61> carif, ...
<carif> leemeng0x61, I probably can't answer your question, but pose it and perhaps someone can
<leemeng0x61> carif, It's not my question, it's simon_'s, and the question line is just my misoperation of mid-wheel.
<SHUBH> hello
<SHUBH> is anyone there ?
<chrispy> hi all
<chrispy> anyone now how the development is going for ubuntu for htc one x?
<Lipi> I downloaded ubuntu touch image file which is built by me. But, my Nexus 4 is not working. Is there anybody did build and downloaded it sucessfully?
<Lipi> After download is done and reboot, my Nexus 4 is gone to charging mode.
<AskUbuntu> WxWidgets in Ubuntu Touch? | http://askubuntu.com/q/305942
<leemeng0x61> how to get the touch code
<leemeng0x61> Could someone give the cmd
<AskUbuntu> How to create a dialog and set title and text dynamically | http://askubuntu.com/q/306007
<razor1101> Can I run python and Perl scripts on ubuntu touch?
<razor1101> Is porting the Rom to htc mobiles any easy
<transpARent> how can I open the terminal windows?
<transpARent> window*
<b0bben> hey all
<b0bben> looking for docs on qt location, not the easiest to find
<b0bben> so I thought: hey, the weather app uses GPS, i'll just check that code out
<b0bben> but can't find it among the projects @ https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-touch-preview
<b0bben> anyone knows where the code repo for that is?
<b0bben> or where i can find the qt location docs
<AskUbuntu> Ubuntu Touch availability on Windows tablet | http://askubuntu.com/q/306072
<almaidinajad> anyone coul help me with the porting for the HTC One X?
<mhall119> b0bben: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-weather-app
<wac_> hey
<wac_> anyone around?
<wac_> i heard there was a touch image that does not have all the preview data like pictures and contacts is ths true?
<wac_> if so where can I find the image?
<wac_> back...did anyone answer!? lol
<OrrinFox> Hey there
<Oranger> hey
<OrrinFox> Got a nexus  7 a while ago, thinking of geting ubuntu on it for testing. Sure would love to see this become a standard OS someday.
<OrrinFox> Its funny looking through some of the comments on iloveubuntu.net, they talk about normal users not wanting the terminal app, Im actually waiting for the app. The terminal is kind of a standard for me on any linux distro.
<OrrinFox> anyone got any progress updates about it?
<mhall119> OrrinFox: the terminal app is part of the daily device images now
<mhall119> go to the apps lens, tap the "Search" at the top and type "t", that's usually enough to show it
<mhall119> though in fairness to the comments, you're probably not "normal" when it comes to general consumer electronics users
<mhall119> :)
<OrrinFox> eh, maybe youre right xD
<OrrinFox> anyone work on porting python to it? if not i might see if I cant work something up
<mhall119> python already runs on it
<mhall119> we're just trying not to use too much of it, since it's not really designed with memory and power optimization in mind
<Oranger> hey mhall119 :) Just to warn you, I still have some problems with CMake and Poppler, so it could take more time to finish it...
<OrrinFox> Ah, yeah true true :P
<OrrinFox> Anyone work with flashing this with something like TWRP?
<OrrinFox> thats what my current recovery is, I dont have stock recovery. Im sure I could get the stock recovery on though..
<OrrinFox> hm.. think i found something online.. lets see how it goes.
<linuxCool> hello i have samsung galaxy ace2 can i install ubuntu touch on my device?
<linuxCool> exxoooo
<Oranger> linuxCool: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices :)
<linuxCool> Oranger: i now for this web ! I ask if it is possible for install on my device!
<Oranger> linuxCool: If you can't find your device then I think not
<Oranger> linuxCool: But try to search on google, maybe you'll find something
<linuxCool> Oranger: yes 10x
 * snwh is back (gone 38:58:00)
<chiestchedap> anyone has download link for sprint toroplus???? im lloking looking looking but cant find:( only link i found is offline
#ubuntu-touch 2014-06-02
<mgw> What options are there for testing Ubuntu Touch on Verizon?
<wilee-nilee> mgw, On verizon? I doubt they will support that ask them. I have them a a carrier, what you want to know is the phone usable
<wilee-nilee> as*
<mgw> wilee-nilee: I mean, what cdma phones have some sort of touch support?
<mgw> It seems the official releases do not support cdma
<wilee-nilee> mgw, Ah, had not known of this.
<lotuspsychje> soundcloud and shorts apps crashing on my nexus7 ubuntu-touch
<lotuspsychje> youtune opens, but never plays any sound
<xtr-stuff> hello
<popey> hi
<xtr-stuff> I'm currently trying to port ubuntu touch to the HTC One m7ul using the aosp sources and I'm kinda stuck
<popey> might be a good idea to post to the mailing list
<popey> it's quiet here right now, and most of the porting experts aren't around for another 6-8 hours
<popey> https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone/maillist.html
<xtr-stuff> Good to know
<xtr-stuff> will do thanks
<popey> np
<north> rsalveti: Hi. Is the rilmodem implemented as plugin ?
<MHB> hi , can any one tell me how to get ubuntu touch on my sensation xl ?! plz
<popey> !devices | MHB
<ubot5> MHB: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<popey> MHB: if it's not on ^^ that list, then someone needs to port it
<MHB> <popey> it on Work in progress list ...
<popey> best to contact the person listed (if there is one)
<MHB> the person listed said that he stoped to do it , cause the fund out >!
<MHB> ok can u help me to do it my self ?! what i need to start >!
<popey> see the porting guide linked in the /topic
<frecel> Happy monday!
<frecel> Can someone try to run terminal? I didn't work for me on r59 and it still doesn't on r60
<popey> frecel: terminal runs, but there's a known bug in the toolkit
<popey> frecel: open settings (takes a while) then set the font to 12
<popey> bug 1322527 is the one
<ubot5> bug 1322527 in Ubuntu Terminal App "Terminal app shows no text in #44 on mako" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1322527
<frecel> as in system settings or settings in terminal?
<frecel> because when I try to run terminal I just see a white screen for half a second and then I'm back to home
<popey> oh, thats different
<arlekin> hello there
<arlekin> is it possible to install image not exactly specified for device ?
<arlekin> anyone here ?
<popey> arlekin: hi
<popey> arlekin: what device?
<arlekin> either galaxy young or galaxy mini
<arlekin> hi btw
<arlekin> i really wanna try ubuntu touch but these devices seems to be not supported yet
<arlekin> and i wonder if that is really that big of a difference
<popey> yeah, you need to get someone to port to those devices
<popey> I wouldn't try and run an image for another device on one
<arlekin> well... shit :/
<arlekin> thanks anyway, i guess i just need to be patient
<seb128> does anyone know where/how the default font is set on ubuntu touch?
<frecel> popey: can't sleep
<popey> hah
<popey> Thanks for the update! â»
<frecel> popey: that terminal app keeps me awake
<frecel> I looked around and there are no logs
<popey> yeah, its a toolkit bug
<popey> just tap settings, wait, slide font to 12, go back
<popey> it should work fine
<ogra_> UITK insomnia !
<popey> but unfortunately you have to do that each time
<frecel> emmm... it wont even let me go to settings
<ogra_> eventually it lest you
<frecel> I really think we are getting a different bug
<frecel> I just see a white screen for half a second and then I'm back to home screen
<popey> yes, thats different
<popey> and nothing in /home/phablet/.cache/upstart ?
<frecel> nothing
<frecel> I guess it doesn't even run long enough to log anything
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy Rocky Road Day! :-D
<popey> hmm
<popey> frecel: "dmesg -T" ?
<popey> frecel: or try uninstalling and reinstalling it maybe?
<frecel> popey: tried uninstalling and installing twice it did nothing
<popey> hmmm
<popey> anything in /var/log?
<frecel> nothing that looks useful
<Mirv> didrocks: hey! we're not finding a trace that hud 14.04+14.04.20140528-0ubuntu1 would have been copied from sru-staging to archives. was it something you could check? ie it never went to any of the queues after publishing on Thursday (https://ci-train.ubuntu.com/job/landing-009-2-publish/23/)
<Mirv> sil2100: ^
<didrocks> Mirv: I guess you are talking about: ubuntu-unity/sru-staging        Release trusty  Proposed        trusty  hud     14.04+14.04.20140528-0ubuntu1   13.10.1+14.04.20140425-0ubuntu1 robru
<Mirv> didrocks: yes, that one
<didrocks> I think it got kicked out by the filter, I thought we decided to not use ubuntu-unity/sru-staging anymore?
<didrocks> (at least, it prooves that the filter is working :))
<Mirv> "yay" \o/ :)
<Mirv> maybe sil2100 could then answer that one, especially if it's something discussed last week
<didrocks> I can whitelist the ppa if we are continuing to use the ppa for side-tracking SRUs
<didrocks> but I think that shouldn't be needed anymore as we don't free up the silo until the publication is done
<didrocks> so, keep me posted
<Mirv> ok, let's wait a bit for sil to be back. thanks!
<didrocks> yw
<sil2100> huh?
<sil2100> One moment
<Mirv> sil2100: no hurry :) read #ci-eng first and then this, I'm just tracking that lost hud
<sil2100> Mirv: so, don't worry about that one - we did a republish last week, I'll look into what's happening after lunch
<Mirv> sil2100: yes, I think this is the republishing in question now :)
<ogra_> Saviq, bug 1325580 for you (or mterry)
<ubot5> bug 1325580 in unity8 (Ubuntu) "after split greeter landing unity8 and the greeter consume a lot more memor" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1325580
<ogra_> oops
 * ogra_ fixed typo 
<ogra_> bug 1325580
<ogra_> Saviq, and here the debdiff for my pending upload http://paste.ubuntu.com/7572826/
<Saviq> ogra_, +1
<ogra_> great, uploading
<ogra_> Saviq, ARGH !
<Saviq> ogra_, ?
<ogra_> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<ogra_>  dbus-test-runner : Depends: gvfs-backends but it is not going to be installed
<ogra_> E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages.
<ogra_> FTBFS
<Wellark> boiko: https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-network/+bug/1295762
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1295762 in unity-notifications "snap decision timeout needs to be determined by the requesting app" [Undecided,In progress]
<Wellark> boiko: that unity-notifications MP is now going in
<Saviq> ogra_, :|
<ogra_> so i guess now we know why it has that dbus-x11 dep :/
<Wellark> I've already updated indicator-network dialogs to define that timeout to be std::limits<std::int32_t>::max()
<Wellark> same should be done with the incoming call snap decisions at least
<Saviq> ogra_, well, sure, but it should be B-D, not D
<ogra_> Saviq, right
<boiko> Wellark: nice! thanks
<Wellark> boiko: not sure what other "do-not-expire" snap decisions we might have
<Saviq> ogra_, if it's only for the dbus-test-runner, I mean
<ogra_> right
<Wellark> boiko: btw, is it a feature that the incoming ringtone plays only once or so?
<boiko> Wellark: from the telephony's point of view, I think it is calls and USSD/MMI dialogs
<boiko> Wellark: you mean for calls or messages?
<Wellark> calls
<boiko> Wellark: nope, it should repeat
<Wellark> I placed a phone call which I let ring over 1min to test that the snap decision change did not alter the default behavioir
<Wellark> and noticed that the incoming call tone stopped playing after a while
<Wellark> boiko: wanna bug?
<Wellark> or will you file it yourself?
<Wellark> boiko: yes, indeed. the USSD/MMI dialogs should not expire ever. as they are not even available from messaging after you close them
<boiko> Wellark: let me flash the latest and try it here
<Wellark> boiko: sure.
<ogra_> Saviq, hmm, not really sure thats related though
<Wellark> boiko: btw, should the phone vibrate also when there is an incoming call?
 * ogra_ wonders why/how that could build on friday ... 
<boiko> Wellark: at some point it should, but it is not implemented yet
<Saviq> ogra_, indeed
<ogra_> i dont see any gvfs change either
<ogra_> o gvfs-backends
<ogra_> *or
<ogra_> there is pittis dbus upload though
<ogra_> but that has not migrated yet
<Wellark> ogra_: btw, about that indicator-network crash during smoke testing
<Wellark> managed to get an actual backtrace today
<Wellark> (we should figure out what's wrong with errors.ubuntu.com...)
<Wellark> so, the crash actually happens when the -autopilot packages are installed
<Wellark> and ofono-phonesim-autostart package gets configured
<ogra_> Wellark, bdmurray is working on errors.u.c
<Wellark> ok. I have some findings for him
<ogra_> that will get fixed soon
<ogra_> file bugs (against apport i guess)
<ogra_> and tell him or assign him
<Wellark> so, pulling in wrong version of libstdc++-dbg ?
<Wellark> I'm not sure if it's an apport issue or what
<Wellark> I just know what I did manually to get the backtrace :)
<Wellark> ogra_: but, anyway. so the crash is actually happening inside dbus-cpp thread that listens for messages from dbus-daemon
<Wellark> I'm alerted tvoss, but this might be a tricky one to figure out
<kenvandine> cjwatson, is there a way to get stdout/stderr logged for click hooks when they are run from pkcon or the updater?
<cjwatson> kenvandine: I think they already are somewhere
<cjwatson> kenvandine: should be in the unity-scope-click logs
<kenvandine> what about when using pkcon?
<cjwatson> oh, directly?
<cjwatson> um, not sure
<kenvandine> at least that's the case i know mine are failing with :)
<cjwatson> I thought that was all just passed straight through
<kenvandine> cjwatson, i not sure if it's a problem when updating normally, but when using pkcon to test clicks, the content-hub hook isn't updating the settings
<kenvandine> but...
<kenvandine> if i run click hook run-user
<kenvandine> it does
<cjwatson> oh, G_SPAWN_STDOUT_TO_DEV_NULL for click install in pk-plugin-click
<ogra_> Saviq, so it seemss teher eis a known issue with dbus-test-runner ... not our fault then, but that makes it impossible to build against the archive (-proposed) currently
<cjwatson> but not stderr - are you sure you've tried sending stuff to stderr
<cjwatson> ?
<kenvandine> error should be going to stderr
<kenvandine> i can confirm
<cjwatson> stderr is accumulated in pk-plugin-click and should be spat out in any installation failure
<Saviq> ogra_, ok, so FTBFS is explained, but the dbus-x11 dep should still just be B-D, right?
<ogra_> Saviq, i doubt that ...
<ogra_> it wouldnt fix the FTBFS to add such a B-D
<kenvandine> cjwatson, no way to override that to get stdout for testing?
 * kenvandine would rather avoid a rebuild to debug this :)
<cjwatson> kenvandine: one thing that's worth a try is to kill packagekitd and run (IIRC, possibly minor variations) "/usr/lib/packagekit/packagekitd -vv" as root in a separate terminal
<ogra_> (unless it still fails later in the build ... )
<cjwatson> kenvandine: and then run pkcon against that
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> thx
<cjwatson> I think that should give more detail
<cjwatson> certainly what I used when I was writing pk-plugin-click in the first place
<Saviq> ogra_, but the "known dbus-test-runner issue" would only explain the FTBFS, right? not the broken test results?
<cjwatson> kenvandine: in extremis you can then strace -f packagekitd and search through the trace for things
<ogra_> Saviq, right ... dbus-x11 is AP ... dbus-test-runner is the FTBFS
<cjwatson> since click will be a child process of that
<ogra_> Saviq, and dbus-test-runner cant migrate until libsmbclient is fixed ... thats our issue atm
<Saviq> ogra_, kk
<ogra_> Saviq, if silos come back soon we could build in there i guess and somehow massage it through ... otherwise we have to wait or fix libsmbclient
<Saviq> ogra_, 'stood
<ogra_> i shouldnt have said "murphys monday" earlier ... seems that was a self fulfilling prophecy somehow :P
<boiko> Wellark: just confirmed here, the ringtone is not repeating itself, would you mind opening a bug for that?
<dpm> thanks boiko for the updated dialer, messaging and addressbook uploads, now translations are working fine :)
<boiko> dpm: nice! :D
<boiko> dpm: did they make it to the image?
<dpm> boiko, yes, I can see them all translated on #60
<danielbeck_> hello rsalveti. The ubuntu touch emualtor (x86) does not work on my machine. The screen stays black. dpm suggested that I ask you about it.
<boiko> dpm: is that the one being used in the expo?
<ogra_> danielbeck_, except that rsalveti is on vacation this week ...
<danielbeck_> I posted the log when starting the ubuntu touch emulator here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/7573163/ .
<popey> dpm: slight fail with reminders
<danielbeck_> ah, ok ogra_ . Thanks :-)
<popey> alan@deep-thought:~$ phablet-test-run -v reminders
<popey> sh: 1: /usr/bin/python: not found
<kenvandine> cjwatson, do click installs from the scope and updates from settings all use the packagekit backend?
<popey> dpm: cowboy fixed it, but when i run it with python3 it finds no tests...
<cjwatson> kenvandine: yes
 * popey fiddles
<dpm> popey, cool, thanks. Would you mind filing a bug for us to fix it later?
<popey> yeah, there's a few bugs here
<popey> its a mess
<dpm> actually, yes, I remember having issues with python3 and mentioning it in a MP
<kenvandine> cjwatson, thx
<popey> dpm: yeah, there's missing dependencies here too
<Wellark> boiko: so, which component is actually playing the tone?
<Wellark> dialer-app ?
<boiko> Wellark: telephony-service
<Wellark> boiko: ok.
<boiko> Wellark: thanks
<Wellark> boiko: btw, is telephony-service also the thing that displays the UCCS messages coming from the cellular network?
<Wellark> or is it USSC?
<boiko> Wellark: you mean USSD? yes, it is telephony-service
<Wellark> boiko: sorry for the crappy desccription, but I think you can figure out what the bug is all about :)
<Wellark> https://bugs.launchpad.net/telephony-service/+bug/1325605
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1325605 in telephony-service "ringtone is not looped" [Undecided,New]
<boiko> Wellark: the summary says it all, thanks :)
<Wellark> boiko: so, just wondering.. I receive USSD message each time I activate mobile broadband on my prepaid card
<Wellark> which basically contains current balance information
<oSoMoN> didrocks, hey, I have debian packaging changes in a webbrowser-app branch, do you think you could review them (or point me to someone who can)?
<boiko> Wellark: interesting
<Wellark> and there is nothing I could do to "act" on it
<Wellark> but still the snap decision shows two buttons
<Wellark> "Cancel" and "OK" or something
<didrocks> oSoMoN: you should just ping on #ubuntu-ci-eng, the guys making reviews should be around there
<boiko> Wellark: that's a bug we have on snap decision itself: it is either two buttons or no buttons at all :)
<oSoMoN> didrocks, ok, thanks!
<didrocks> yw
<Wellark> boiko: ok.. let's fix it then :)
<Wellark> it's highly confusing
<boiko> Wellark: yep, tiago tried to get rid of the second button, but he didn't manage to
<kenvandine> cjwatson, so where should stderr be sent?
<cjwatson> the packagekitd stderr I think
<cjwatson> if not then strace
<kenvandine> i see it in strace
<Chipaca> I just got a kernel panic inside the emulator -- is this something i should report?
<ogra_> Chipaca, yes, but not expect it to be fixed before next week ... ricardo is on vac.
<Chipaca> ogra_: i just lost the output because i kneejerked 'reset' when the crash left me with a fubar'ed tty
<Chipaca> ogra_: if it happens again, i'll bugreport :)
<ogra_> :)
<kenvandine> cjwatson, ok... i think i've gotten to the bottom of it, gsettings when run with packagekit :/
<kenvandine> 12694 write(2, "\n(process:12691): dconf-WARNING **: failed to commit changes to dconf: Cannot autolaunch D-Bus without X11 $DISPLAY\n", 116) = 116
<cjwatson> ah right
<cjwatson> I thought there were approaches for dealing with that
<cjwatson> maybe just run within dbus-launch or whatever it is?
<kenvandine> not sure what's making it use dbus-launch
<cjwatson> nothing right now
<cjwatson> I'm suggesting dbus-launch as a fix
<kenvandine> oh, you mean force it in my hook?
<cjwatson> so that it doesn't have to use the autolaunch stuff
<cjwatson> yes
<kenvandine> can i put that in my .hook file?
<kenvandine> like will it take more than just a single string to an executable?
<cjwatson> I forget how dbus-launch works
<kenvandine> me too :)
<cjwatson> I think it's basically just an adverb though
<kenvandine> but... i more wondering if i need a wrapper to put in the hook
<kenvandine> or if i can just modify the Exec line
<cjwatson> I suspect the latter but I'm sure it's fairly easy either way
<cjwatson> you might need a wrapper if you want to check whether dbus is already present first
<kenvandine> ok, i'll play with it
<cjwatson> or you could take the self-exec approach
<frecel> I just realized something. On touch the home button is on the bottom of the launcher and on desktop it's on the top, is there reason for that difference?
<bfiller> anyone seeing this issue with latest image r60? https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity8/+bug/1325627
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1325627 in Unity 8 "ringtone doesn't play after accepting first call from lock screen" [Critical,New]
<frecel> bfiller: I only have one phone, if you call me I could check :D
<pmcgowan> cjwatson, is it correct behavior that when preinstalled apps are updated the phone ends up with two separate copies?
<anpok> frecel: hm I believe with ofono-phonesim or ofono-scripts calling 119 and hanging up will make ofono simulate a call
<frecel> anpok: doesnt work
<frecel> unless it's not runnign
<Chipaca> what does âunable to start: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.Spawn.PermissionsInvalid: The permission of the setuid helper is not correctâ mean, in the logs of an upstart service?
<cjwatson> pmcgowan: yes; it's not possible to remove the preinstalled version since it's on the read-only FS
<cjwatson> pmcgowan: and this way it makes it easy to revert to the factory version
<pmcgowan> cjwatson, I see thanks
<Chipaca> there seems to be a bit of a memory leak in unity8, at least in the x86/devel thing
<Chipaca> with me doing nothing it's gone from ~20% of 1g to ~40% in ~10 minutes
 * Chipaca kills it as it reaches 50%
<Chipaca> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity8/+bug/1325660
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1325660 in Unity 8 "memory leak in first boot animation" [Undecided,New]
<slangasek> anyone know what this error message is about?
<slangasek> ~/ubuntu-emulator/test1/.device: no such file or directory
<slangasek> this was an instance I created before upgrading ubuntu-emulator
<slangasek> did the interfaces change incompatibly?
<pmcgowan> elopio, did you set up the dashboard testing when we did the qt 5.2 transition?
<Bel_P> I am having an issue where when my grouper device reboots into recovery to install, it does not find the .zip it appears to be looking for.
<Bel_P> The recovery appears to be checking for autodeploy.zip , which it does not find.
<dobey> Bel_P: grouper is no longer supported
<Bel_P> Even on the stable channel?
<dobey> well, ubuntu-device-flash --channel stable should work, but it's just a last release, not actually supported. there will never be any updates for it. and it doesn't work very well.
<Bel_P> I see. Thanks for the info dobey. What was the reason for the deprecation?
<dobey> the hardware
<dobey> because it's a tegra
<Bel_P> Oh - so the same reason that the Xoom was never supported.
<ogra_> well, the hardware per-se would be fine if there were supportable drivers
<Bel_P> Thanks for the info. Maybe I will try again if I replace the grouper.
<Chipaca> there seems to be breakage in the archive making some packages i need for dev be uninstallable on arm (or at least on the phone)
<Chipaca> in particular i can't install libubuntuoneauth-2.0-dev
<ogra_> Chipaca, yes, it is being worked on
<ogra_> oh
<ogra_> thats a new one
<ogra_> probably not related then
<Chipaca> boils down to qt5
<Chipaca> it needs libqt5gui5, and installing that would remove libqt5gui5-gles and ubuntu-touch
<Chipaca> maybe libqt5gui5-gles should provide libqt5gui5?
<ogra_> Mirv, ^^ ?
<ogra_> Chipaca, i think it is more likely that libqt5gui5-gles hasnt been rebuilt after a change in libqt5gui5
<Chipaca> ogra_: ok :)
<ogra_> Mirv and rsalveti usually handle that ...
<ogra_> but ricardo is off this week
<Chipaca> I keep on thinking i should've taken this week off :)
<ogra_> haha
 * ogra_ wouldnt mind striking this day off his mind as well ... not necessarily the whole week though
<ogra_> there is hope :)
<Chipaca> you say that, but the delta between where i'm developing and what's on a released image just keeps growing :(
<slangasek> Chipaca: that seems like something we should be able to fix quickly for you.  But why do you need libqt5gui5-gles on the phone?  The ABI between this and libqt5gui5 is identical on arm, and libqt5gui5 is the one we should still be installing on the phone AIUI
<ogra_> slangasek, i wonder if we should even build the -gles packages on arm at all
<ogra_> doesnt seem necessary
<slangasek> yes, we should transition arm to be the same as x86.
<ogra_> that wont work since we need both on x86
<slangasek> that's not what I said
<ogra_> (both graphical backends)
<ogra_> oh. you mean simgle source package ?
<ogra_> *single
<slangasek> no, I'm saying that what we're doing on x86 is what we should *also* be doing on arm, including using the -gles variants for the touch builds
<ogra_> ah
<slangasek> but we haven't made that change *yet*, so -gles should not be pulled in on arm
<ogra_> well, as i understood Qt5.3 is supposed to be able to do runtime selection
<ogra_> so that whole mess could be dropped then
<slangasek> ogra_: right, that remains to be proven
<ogra_> haha, yeah
<Chipaca> slangasek: *i* don't need libqt5gui5-gles on the phone :)
<Chipaca> slangasek: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/7575571/
<ogra_> Chipaca, the emulator needs it
 * Chipaca kills the emulator with fire and ^C
<slangasek> Chipaca: are you on a phone, or are you on the i386 emulator image?
<Chipaca> slangasek: x86 emulator
<slangasek> oh
<slangasek> see, you didn't say that ;)
<slangasek> ok, so libubuntuoneauth-2.0-dev probably needs updating to depend on qtbase5-dev | qtbase5-gles-dev
<ogra_> yippieee !!!!
<ogra_> FINALLY !!!!!
<Chipaca> ogra_: ...?
<ogra_> so this were 11h to get a single broken dep removed from the image
<Chipaca> :)
<ogra_> and the *only* piece of infrastructure that didnt cause any issues in the process was actually system-image ... everything else caused hour long issue resolutions ...
 * ogra_ takes a deep (very deep) bow in front of stgraber 
<Tassadar> hmm, is he here?
<Tassadar> stgraber: ping!
<ogra_> AP tests ... silos ... FTBFS due to wiggly proposed deps ... then the image build ... and even the isotracker page to trigger the image build ...
<stgraber> Tassadar: sort of, I'm on IRC but dealing with quite a few other problems at the moment :)
<Tassadar> stgraber: I just wanna make sure you seen this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-system-image/+bug/1286542/comments/7 (it's about s-i-server and that wrong delta with same file as other delta that happened when you were on a vacation)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1286542 in Ubuntu system image "keyring DuplicateDestinationError when updating from custom s-i server" [High,Fix committed]
<stgraber> Tassadar: oh, crap, that makes sense indeed. Hmm, so the problem is that there's no sane way to know whether we still have broken files on the fs (inverted source/destination).
<Tassadar> I was hoping that the wrong code was so long ago that you can remove that workaround now. Well, it's something you'll have to keep in mind then, because it is gonna happen next time you'll need to revert to an older image
<Tassadar> (if it's only over one version, like 1 -> 2 -> 1again)
<stgraber> ok, let's check if we have any file dating before 2013-10-03 on disk
<stgraber> the two oldest files on disk date of the 3rd of October so I think it's safe to drop. Worst case scenario, the diff will just be re-generated so that'd just waste a bit of cpu and disk space instead of producing invalid index
<Tassadar> cool
<stgraber> Tassadar: compatibility code dropped and branch updated on the production server
<Tassadar> k, I disabled it on mine when I found out about it
<adnap> Is Ubuntu for the Nexus 7 more limited than desktop Ubunutu? Could I change my window manager, for example?
<Chipaca> adnap: no
<Chipaca> adnap: to both your questions
<frecel> Just found the best bluetooth bug :D
<frecel> popey: what project should I report bluetooth bugs to
<frecel> ?
<popey> frecel: what kind of bug?
<Shiggity> rsalveti, hello...
<ogra_> Shiggity, he is out this week
<frecel> popey:  I connected my bluetooth handsfree set from my car and the connection to the headset drops when I make a phonecall and it reconects as soon as the call stops
<Shiggity> ogra_, ah
<Shiggity> ogra*
<frecel> popey: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bluetooth-touch is that the right one?
<Shiggity> ogra_, any progress on the UT port for the Nexus 5?
<ogra_> i doubt that
<Shiggity> :\
<Tassadar> it's gonna start showing correct battery % in status bar once the patches in gerrit are merged
<Tassadar> ^^
<popey> frecel: not sure, cyphermox would know better
<popey> frecel: gonna re-submit your app? â»
<frecel> yes, I forgot about that
<frecel> framework 14.04-dev1 security policy 1.2 right?
<popey> ubuntu-sdk-14.04-dev1 & 1.1
<slangasek> Chipaca: ubuntuone-credentials uploaded, should be coinstallable with touch once that lands in utopic
<Chipaca> slangasek: thanks
#ubuntu-touch 2014-06-03
<Etienne_> hi!
<Etienne_> i need help for flashing my nexus 4 with ubuntu touch 14.10
<Etienne_> i'm bootloader mode
<Etienne_> and i do this
<Etienne_> ubuntu-device-flash --channel=devel --bootstrap 2014/06/02 22:26:39 Expecting the device to be in the bootloader... waiting 2014/06/02 22:27:08 Device is |mako| 2014/06/02 22:27:09 Flashing version 50 from devel channel and server https://system-image.ubuntu.com to device mako 2014/06/02 22:27:09 ubuntu-touch/utopic is a channel alias to devel /home/etienne/.cache/ubuntuimages/ubuntu-touch/devel/mako/version-50.tar.xz /home/et
<Etienne_> 2014/06/02 22:27:17 Can't flash recovery image
<Mirv> Chipaca: almost forgot this highlight, but libqtgui5-gles should not be installed for anyone normally, it's ricardo's work to enable emulator working on x86
<Mirv> so it's also x86-only package
<dholbach> good morning
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2014/06/samsung-first-tizen-phone-unveiled
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Chimborazo Day! :-D
<diwic> JamesTait, am I supposed to know what that is? :-) Sounds like a sausage.
<diwic> JamesTait, Choritzo with extra spices = Chimborazo?
<JamesTait> It's a mountain, apparenty.
<diwic> okay
<diwic> In this company, you learn something new every day!
<JamesTait> Mission accomplished!
<MJK_> hi, how do i get the calendar app
<popey> MJK_: its pre-installed
<MJK_> where?  i have the Thunderbird email,
<popey> lets rewind.
<popey> You're using the desktop?
<popey> This channel is for support and discussion of Ubuntu on devices like phones and tablets
<popey> #ubuntu is the channel for desktop support
<oSoMoN> sil2100, hey, have you had a chance to take a look at the packaging changes in https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/webbrowser-app/official-api/+merge/221436 ?
<lotuspsychje> is there a way to set homepage on webbrowser-app?
<sil2100> oSoMoN: looking now inbetween, sorry about that ;) Traincon is killing us
<oSoMoN> sil2100, thanks (and good luck with that traincon0 situation)
<janimo> Saviq, ogra_ anything else besides --desktop_file_hint needed to run a qml app from the phablet user shell? I get a coredump
<Saviq> janimo, any message on console?
<janimo> QUbuntu: Could not create application instance
<janimo> Aborted (core dumped)
<janimo> qmlscene  --desktop_file_hint=$(pwd)/railroad.desktop main.qml
<janimo> IIRC it used to work months ago
<janimo> anything in the shell environment that I should check for? DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS=unix:abstract=/tmp/dbus-r7BwXDhWxz
<janimo> but that socket does not seem to exist in /tmp FWIW
<janimo> Saviq, work on mako/trusty will try again on the other device.
<janimo> Saviq, which is utopic and a 3rd party phone
<Saviq> janimo, that looks like you got rejected, you sure you're passing the correct .desktop path?
<Saviq> janimo, and that you're in a proper phablet env?
<Saviq> janimo, either ssh or sudo -u phablet -i ?
<janimo> Saviq, I did the same thing on both devices. Used the recent phablet-shell
<janimo> which logs in as the proper user
<Saviq> janimo, well, yeah, you need proper DBUS, otherwise OSK won't work and other weird things might happen
<janimo> Saviq, same call on both devices, works on mako/trusty
 * janimo wonders why the DBUS var points to a nonexistent socket
 * janimo upgrades mako to utopic
<mdeslaur> as a developer, how do I see feedback people have left for my app? once it's installed on my phone, it no longer shows up in the app scope, and there doesn't seem to be a place to see feedback in the myapps interface...
<ahayzen> mdeslaur, can you not press'n'hold your app from where you launch it to show the reviews?
<seb128> mdeslaur, in the app scope you should still have the icon (that's how you start it no?)
<seb128> mdeslaur, but what ahayzen said, hold the click in the lens should give you the details
<seb128> mdeslaur, that's also how you uninstall
<mdeslaur> oh, wow!
<mdeslaur> I didn't realize I could press and hold an app icon
 * mdeslaur needs an instruction manual
<seb128> you can close running apps the same way
<mdeslaur> oh, that's where people can add a review...I was wondering that too
<mdeslaur> ahayzen, seb128: thanks!
<seb128> yw!
<ahayzen> mdeslaur, no problem
<Wellark> sil2100: just FYI, if we go with the "big revert" there is no reason to revert the indicator-network packages.
<Wellark> the MP's that landed with the split greeter were general in nature
<sil2100> Wellark: we know, but actually cherry picking what to revert and what not proves additional risks
<sil2100> But most probably we won't revert
<Wellark> ok.
<Wellark> good.
<ogra_> Wellark, if we would revert, we would revert the whole landing to be sure to get back to original state though
<ogra_> at least that was the plan
<ogra_> (silo 19 is prepared for the rollback ... but we'll hopefully not need it)
<Wellark> ogra_: so we would lost all the changes to each of the packages between now and the split greeter landing?
<ogra_> in the future unrelated landings should simply go separate
<ogra_> Wellark, whatever landed with split-greeter
<ogra_> (there shoulldnt be anything landed afterwards since we are in TRAINCON-0)
<ogra_> Wellark, the issue here is that we cant really predict interdependencies of breakage so the whole thing would have to be rolled back ... the only proper way to avoid that in the future is to not do such landings in one big chunk if they are not 100% related
<ogra_> it smells like we wont need to roll back ... but we will only know for sure after we have seen the AP results in the lab
<Wellark> ogra_: well, this landed after split greeter. the code change is not super critical, but that landing introduced releasing of latest translations which we need for the expo image: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~indicator-applet-developers/indicator-network/trunk.14.10/revision/341
<ogra_> Wellark, oh, who landed that ?
<Wellark> the translations are super  critical
<ogra_> TRAINCON-0 shouldnt have let anything in
<ogra_> sil2100, do you know ?
<Wellark> traincon-0 does not mean we can't land anything
<Wellark> from the email from tomorrow or so
<Wellark> "As a reminder, this means that landings
<Wellark> which are considered as risky or introduce larger features will require
<Wellark> QA sign-off before release into the archive. We want all landings to be
<Wellark> triple checked so that we don't end up making the situation even worse."
<sil2100> I landed that
<Wellark> this is exactly such landing
<sil2100> ogra_, Wellark: traincon-0 means we can land isolated bugfixes, but hm, I guess I didn't consider that indicator-network was in the greeter landing
<sil2100> My bad
<ogra_> well, next time ...
<Wellark> does not introduce large features, but does provide the critical translations
<sil2100> Anyway, will make sure not to forget that next time, now I might have dodged a bullet
<ogra_> what we learned is definitely that we dont allow unrelated landings in a feature landign anymore
<Wellark> well, the translations are needed anyway.
<ogra_> splig greeter should have been a lot smaller
<sil2100> Saviq, ogra_: should I reconfigure 020 and release it?
<ogra_> all the other packages should have landed separately
<ogra_> sil2100, i'm fine with it ... lets wait for a word from Saviq
<Wellark> well, the indicator-network landing as part of split greeter was not totally unrelated, as it fixed exporting the indicator properly to the greeter
<Wellark> which was not a problem when the greeter was part of unity8
<Saviq> ogra_, sil2100, there's bugs... but it definitely is better with that silo than without it
<Saviq> ogra_, sil2100, so let's land it and flesh out the kinks as we go
<ogra_> ++
<ogra_> sil2100, push dat booton ... !
<sil2100> ogra_: pushin bootonz!
<sil2100> (there are more than one to push though)
<ogra_> heh, right
<sil2100> ogra_, Saviq: published! It's in flight now
 * ogra_ noticed the mail
<janimo> Saviq, updated mako to r62 from utopic-proposed and qmlscene aborts there as well now
<janimo> ogra_, do you know anything about running qmlscene from the command line changed recently?
<Saviq> janimo, I'll have a look in a moment
<Saviq> janimo, hmm it works fine here :|
<Saviq> qmlscene --desktop_file_hint=/usr/share/applications/webbrowser-app.desktop test.qml
<Saviq> janimo, I just ran â and all's fine, both over ssh and phablet-shell
<janimo> Saviq, which release?
<ogra_> janimo, stop finding bugs !
<Saviq> janimo, mako, 52
<Saviq> 62!
<janimo> ok
<ogra_> there is no reason it shouldnt work in any image though
<Saviq> janimo, can you check ~/.cache/upstart/unity8.log
<janimo> Sarvatt, ok the line you provided works for me too
<Saviq> if it reports something when your app gets rejected
<janimo> Saviq, hmm could be my apps desktop file then
<janimo> not matching framework or something
<janimo> since it ran on trusty
<ogra_> is that even parsed/used ?
<Saviq> janimo, try a random .desktop file
<Saviq> ogra_, not *really*
 * ogra_ always thought it isnt
<ogra_> right
<Saviq> janimo, of the installed ones
<janimo> Saviq, yes, worked with the webbrosr desktip from above
<ogra_> only if inside a click package it will be used
<Saviq> janimo, ok cool, let me know if you find some weird new req for the .desktop file
<janimo> ogra_, Saviq I installed a click and tried running it with its own desktop file
<janimo> that did not work
<janimo> it works when launched from the scopes btw
<janimo> Saviq, so the path of the desktop file matters.
<janimo> Saviq, I thought I can provide the dekstop from the local dir of the click
<Saviq> janimo, as long as you pass the full path, it should
<Saviq> janimo, if it doesn't, it's a bug with us
<janimo> not even the path, the name of the file matters.
<janimo> whic is a copy of webbrowser-app.desktop
<janimo> and it does not work with the copy only when usin gthe original name
<janimo> Saviq, ogra_ which package should I file this bug?
<janimo> against
<Saviq> janimo, unity8 to start with
<Saviq> janimo, we'll reassign as needed
<janimo> Saviq, ok
<janimo> Saviq, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity8/+bug/1325984
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1325984 in unity8 (Ubuntu) "Running qmlscene from the command line crashes" [Undecided,New]
<janimo> Saviq, it is not the custom location the problem. As the last paragrpash in the bugreport states it is the name of the desktop file that matters
<Saviq> janimo, orly, even that bad
<janimo> Saviq, so both files named webbroser under ~ work. If named railroad (and possibly others, they don;t)
<Saviq> janimo, I think I know what's happening
<janimo> maybe there's a list of preregistered app names
<Saviq> oh no
<Saviq> I don't
<Saviq> janimo, in any case, good bug, we'll fix
<janimo> Saviq, ok, added comment mentioning it worked on trusty
<bdmurray> Wellark: what did you do to get a backtrace?
<ogra_> bugging doko :)
<bdmurray> ogra_: what does that mean?
<ogra_> seems there were some discrepancies between gdb libstdc++ etc ...
<ogra_> i dont know details but i saw the conversation and Wellark roughly told me about it on friday too
<ogra_> popey, hmm, i just got a calendar update here ... am i supposed to have flowting icons on top of the view
<ogra_> i have the "today" and "new appointment" icons floating vertically centered on the right side
<ogra_> only in the month view though
<popey> ogra_: desktop or device?
<ogra_> ah, no ... agenda has it too
<ogra_> popey, device indeed
<popey> hm
<ogra_> mako on last promoted
<popey> oh
<popey> yes, known sdk bug
<popey> fixed in proposed
<ogra_> oh
<ogra_> and now it hangs
<popey> also fixed
<ogra_> ok
<dano> I just wanted to know if there are any phones coming shipped with Ubuntu Phone this year? I'm interested into the OS but there are not much information in the web..
<ogra_> dano, yes thats the plan
<dano> Awesome! where can i found further information  ?
<ogra_> dano, try googling for "meizu and bq ubuntu phones" i guess
<dano> thank you so much, i will look it up :)
<ogra_> if you want to run it today you can use it on a Nexus 4
<Jesse___> hi folks! I'm trying to install the dual boot on my nexus4 but the dualboot.sh enters in loop on line 148, saying that the file has size 0kb and the command was not found. I noticed that it creates a "recover-mako-6.0.4.3.img" with 0kb. Any hints?
<Wellark> bdmurray: I had to install libstdc++6-4.9-dbg instead of 4.8
<Wellark> even though the lib is combiled with 4.8
<om26er> trying to ssh into the phone, it says 'Permission denied (publickey).' doesn't ask me any password/authentication
<om26er> I am doing:
<om26er> adb forward tcp:8888 tcp:22; ssh phablet@localhost -p 8888
<cwayne> om26er: why not just use phablet-shell
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> juts use the latest phablet-tools and phablet-shell from that
<ogra_> om26er, and there is no PW auth allowed anymore ... security team didnt like that
<om26er> cwayne, never knew that existed, trying that now
<ogra_> (phablet-shell creates a key and copies it in place for you )
<bdmurray> Wellark: and you've spoken to doko about it?
<Wellark> bdmurray: well, installing 4.9-dbg removes 4.8-dbg so it seems to be correct
<Wellark> didn't talk with him explicitly about this
<Wellark> but it seems 4.8 vs. 4.9 is a bit messy atm
<Wellark> bdmurray: how does apport determine which version of libstdc++6-*-dbg packages to pull in when retracing?
<Wellark> because the retrace with apport-cli on the phone failed because of missing symbols
<bdmurray> Wellark: it uses package versions from Dependencies in the apport crash file
<Wellark> bdmurray: yeah, but how does apport decide which libstdc++ -dbg package to pull in?
<Wellark> like her
<Wellark> https://errors.ubuntu.com/oops/32136aa4-e9aa-11e3-82de-fa163e22e467
<Wellark> Dependencies only says
<lotuspsychje> you guys saw this article yet? http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2014/06/samsung-first-tizen-phone-unveiled
<Wellark> libstdc++6 4.9.0-5ubuntu2
<bdmurray> Wellark: so it should use 4.9.0-5ubuntu2
<ogra_> lotuspsychje, tsates like chicken^W^W^Wlooks like android
<Wellark> there is no libstdc++6-dbg package
<lotuspsychje> ogra_: lolz
<lotuspsychje> ogra_: you think that tizen security is as bad as android?
<ogra_> dunno, never looked into tizen
<ogra_> i assume it will be better
<Wellark> bdmurray: the -dbg packages for gcc originated packages are a bit different
<ogra_> android drags legacy along
<Wellark> they are built from the gcc source tree directly and are part of the normal archive, not ddebs
<Wellark> so there is no 1:1 correspondence
<lotuspsychje> ogra_: ill stick to good ol ubuntu-touch :p
<bdmurray> Wellark: ah, I'd have to look at the apport code more closely then
<lotuspsychje> ogra_: by the way, the keyboard is hard to get on kiwi and freenode irc app from my nexus7, maybe bacause its only 7"?
<ogra_> lotuspsychje, nope, i think there are still webapp-container bugs with sites that use certain javascript
<ogra_> i was planning to look into that but didnt find time yet
<lotuspsychje> ogra_: ah ok, so it will get better tnx
<ogra_> the freenode app behaves better
<lotuspsychje> kk
<ogra_> its just butt-ugly
<lotuspsychje> ogra_: i find kiwi on minimal theme also nice
<lotuspsychje> but cant find a way to tab:username yet
<ogra_> yeah
<Wellark> bdmurray: ok, thanks! :)
<lotuspsychje> that would be handy
<bdmurray> Wellark: specifically sandboxutils.py and apport-retrace
<ogra_> definitely ...
<ogra_> like the terminal does on double-tap
<lotuspsychje> ogra_: oh, so it could work from irssi tab:username?
<lotuspsychje> but that will requier unlocked device to install irssi from terminal :p
<lotuspsychje> you know what would be nice, an app to lock/unlock the device to writable or not
<lotuspsychje> so one could install terminal apps and re-lock it afterwards
<jdstrand> popey: the .pki denial is bug #1260048
<ubot5> bug 1260048 in Oxide "oxide should use an application specific location for pki/nss files" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1260048
<jdstrand> popey: the media-hub denial is slightly odd. feel like I don't have the complete denial. can you file a bug?
<mterry> ted, I'm looking at a url-dispatcher .crash file, but it doesn't have a CoreDump file, what's that about?
<ted> mterry, What's the type? A crash or a recoverable error?
<mterry> tedg, oh!  not used to those, recoverable
<tedg> mterry, Ah, okay. Probably someone sent a bad URL?
<mterry> tedg, how do I tell what the error message is?
<tedg> mterry, DuplicateSignature
<mterry> tedg, yup upstart-app-launch-invalid-appid
<tedg> mterry, That tells errors how to bucket the error
<tedg> Hmm, that one is me blaming me for the error :-)
<tedg> It's UAL blaming URLDispatcher for sending a bad AppID.
<mterry> tedg, the AppId file is "dialer-app"
<tedg> Nobody would ever use that on a phone!
<ogra_> mterry, hmm, just seeing you bug comment, you dont plan to reintroduce dbus-x11 into the image i hope ...
<mterry> tedg, does that mean we called url-dispatcher with just "dialer-app" as an arg instead of "application:///dialer-app.desktop" or something?
<mterry> ogra_, I do!
<ogra_> please dont
<mterry> ogra_, explain
<ogra_> or confirm with foundations that we ship a bunch of X11 stuff
<ogra_> they (namely xnox) invested quite some time to get rid of it
<ogra_> additionally we found that oit breaks the lab tests
<tedg> mterry, Hmm, no, it should have already stripped it at that point. (the URL stuff)
<ogra_> this is why we are still in traincon-0 and might still need to roll back the whole thing
<mterry> ogra_, the breakage of lab tests (the important issue in my mind) is fixed in silo 20 by properly not running Xsession.d files
<ogra_> mterry, that was fixed this morning in dbus ... nontheless please confirm with foundations before re-introducing deps that were considered bad by them
<mterry> ogra_, as for libx11-6 being pulled in, I agree it's a pain.  But dbus-launch is the correct piece of technology needed in this use case...
<ogra_> we use upstart to start dbus everywhere on the phone
<mterry> ogra_, it was fixed poorly this morning.  In a way that will cause other bad issues
<mterry> ogra_, right, but we critically can't do so in the greeter session
<ogra_> mterry, you mean the dbus upload ?
<mterry> ogra_, not dbus upload, but the "start dbus" fix
<ogra_> that was admittedly a hack, dbus was changed today to not run Xsession scripts when there is already a session dbus
<mterry> ogra_, I'm happy to split the dbus-x11 package
<ogra_> but it was also confirmed to not work with split greeter
<ogra_> if gdbus gets called before a dbus is up you will end up with one spawned by dbus-launch ... with totally different options than the one we use atm
<mterry> ogra_, I don't think that helps?  lightdm-session is the one running Xsession.d and it won't have dbus already around by that time
<ogra_> *ones
<ogra_> anyway, again ... i was asked by foundations to make sure that dep goes away again asap
<mterry> ogra_, which dep?  the dbus-x11?
<ogra_> yes
<mterry> ogra_, any objections to a package split?
<ogra_> cant you use upstart ?
<ogra_> not from me, probably from pitti though
<ogra_> we discussed that this morning too
<mterry> ogra_, no because all sorts of upstart jobs fire on 'started dbus' that we don't want in the greeter session
<ogra_> ah
<mterry> ogra_, which is a problem created by the 'start dbus' fix
<mterry> ogra_, dbus-launch uses symbols from X (support for linking them better)
<ogra_> well, can you just directly exec dbus-daemon from the wrapper ?
<ogra_> just grab the necessary lines out of /usr/share/upstart/sessions/dbus.conf and inject the dbus address into your upstart session then
<mterry> ogra_, could do, yeah
 * mterry works on it
<ogra_> awesome :)
<mterry> ogra_, wait...  which deps are the issue now?
<mterry> ogra_, looks like libx11-6 is all over the Touch image already
<ogra_> foundations tries to solve that
<mterry> ogra_, you're saying they are in the middle of solving it and don't want me to make it worse or something else?
<ogra_> we need to get to a rootfs that fits into 1.5G
<ogra_> they have been working on that this cycle
<ogra_> they just recently put a lot of work into getting dus-x11 off the image
<mterry> ogra_, ok, so I just shouldn't make it worse by depending on it unnecessarily.  OK...  Can do
<mterry> ogra_, gotcha
<mterry> ogra_, (although libx11-6 is really all over the place -- they can't really remove it from all those?!)
<ogra_> mterry, on a sidenote ... thanks a lot for that brakage (no irony intended) ... it made us find a massive flaw in the test infra nobody had never thoguth about
<mterry> ogra_, I wonder what they hated about dbus-x11
<mterry> ogra_, heh
<ogra_> (dbus-x11 gets installed with one test and never removed ... then all kinds of wrid things happen where stray dbus daemons get spawned, AP connects to it and cant talk to apps)
<ogra_> well, one target is to get rid of X11 (if possible) dbus-x11 is one package depending on it
<mterry> ogra_, I get wanting to get rid of X11, but dbus-x11 only deps on libx11-6, and considering the list of other packages that do, dbus-x11 is pretty useful to be a first target for that
<mterry> ogra_, I realize you are just the messenger
<mterry> cjwatson, ogra_ is telling me you folks went through some effort to get rid of dbus-x11 on the touch image?  Out of curiousity, why is it so bad?
<mterry> tedg, anything useful I can get you for that url-dispatcher issue?
<tedg> mterry, Can you recreate it or was it just a once off?
<mterry> tedg, it was happening often for me, let me retry
<cjwatson> mterry: not something I was involved with; my guess would be xnox if that was us
<cjwatson> mterry: but I would indeed have thought that dbus-x11 was not exactly pressing as far as image reduction goes
<matrpoc> Hi all, I am trying to install asterisk on Ubuntu Touch. SIP clients work fine. I now need to configure GSM modem to work with Asterisk. I am stuck there.
<matrpoc> My question is - is there a tty modem in Ubuntu Touch that I can connect serially and send AT commands?
<daker> Mirv: hi
<daker> any chance you can help package this https://github.com/qtproject/qtwebsockets ?
<mterry> tedg, it's 100% for me here
<mterry> tedg, not sure how I got in this state.  But I'm here, and it's over reboots too
<mterry> oh, maybe I'm using the wrong url
<tedg> mterry, So when you click on dialer app in the launcher it happens?
<tedg> BTW, not Click, but touch
<tedg> Well, that's overloaded too.
<mterry> tedg, hahah!
<mterry> tedg, *somehow* I uninstalled dialer-app
 * mterry has no idea how, better reflash in case I did something insane
<tedg> mterry, Wait, don't leak the secret tablet plans ;-)
<mterry> tedg, so I guess I want to file a bug that url-dispatcher doesn't apt-get install dialer-app for me when this happens  ;)
<tedg> Heh, I haven't "Won't Fix"'d a bug for a while ;-)
<darkecchi> lg touch l7 serves to ubuntu
<darkecchi> lg  l7 serves to ubuntu touch
<darkecchi> lg  l7 serves to ubuntu touch
<darkecchi> alguien que hable espaÃ±ol nececito saber si ubunto touch sirve en un LG L7
<janimo> ricmm, hi, do you know if there's a sensors test app for Ubuntu Touch? I see /usr/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/qt5/examples/sensors/sensor_explorer/sensor_explorer.qml but that is part of Qt and relies on modules not in touch
<janimo> ricmm, qml test app that is, I have ran the ubuntu_direct command line tests
<ricmm> janimo: yes, test_android_sensors_api
<ricmm> from the libplatform-api-hybris1-test package, or something like that
<ricmm> although the actualpackage will changei n a couple of days, due to an API bump
#ubuntu-touch 2014-06-04
<Mirv> daker: sure. I'd begin with taking the packaging of some ~simple Qt module packaging like qtserialport, the upstream release tarball and continuing from there. but it's best to sync up with #debian-qt-kde on irc.debian.org since we like to sync directly from Debian and they might already have plans for websockets
<Mirv> no such project yet though it seems http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-kde/qt/qtwebsockets.git;a=summary (compare to eg http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-kde/qt/qtserialport.git;a=summary )
<Mirv> daker: if you're familiar with Gobby app, gobby.debian.org has Teams -> KDE -> Qt5 too which mentions qtwebsockets as "Not yet packaged"
<raju2925> hey, where can i find ubuntu touch hadia for xperia neo v ?
<raju2925> *haida
<lotuspsychje> !devices | raju2925
<raju2925> current link doesnt work
<ubot5> raju2925: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<raju2925> but this link doesn't works
<raju2925> http://ubuntuone.com/63faPZw1DBOaakebOeXmCj
<raju2925> from here " https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices/haida "
<lotuspsychje> raju2925: not all devices are fully supported yet,
<lotuspsychje> raju2925: maybe try the XDA forum to see your device
<raju2925> oh,
<lotuspsychje> raju2925: if you cant find any working projects there, you might have to wait
<raju2925> ok, thanks man
<lotuspsychje> raju2925: best working devices for now, are the nexus7
<lotuspsychje> raju2925: later this year oem phones will come with ubuntu-touch
<raju2925> wow, thats good to know
<raju2925> :)
<lotuspsychje> raju2925: follow the news on omgubuntu, and you will know latest
<raju2925> thanks
<dholbach> good morning
<JamesTai1> Good morning all; happy Hug Your Cat Day! :-D
<wilee-nilee> JamesTai1, He gets that and a whole lotta love every day.
<JamesTait> :)
<oSoMoN> Mirv, hey, I have a branch that should fix the test crashes (as well as running the app) for webbrowser-app on Qt 5.3, but I canât test it on my device because installing the landing-005 PPA breaks unity, would you mind adding it to the silo? https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/webbrowser-app/qt53-workaround-QTBUG-39255/+merge/220985
<Mirv> oSoMoN: hey! I can add, but you can also test about ~right now since unity8 armhf finished 20 minutes ago so it should be available. anyway, uploading too.
<Mirv> oSoMoN: the landing PPA is nice and great but it obviously needs rebuilds every time something in there is landed
<oSoMoN> Mirv, ah, excellent, Iâll test it then
<Mirv> oSoMoN: btw I managed to build qtdeclarative snapshot against otherwise 5.3.0, and there is no change in these it seems. I'll report it soon upstream.
<oSoMoN> Mirv, well there is https://bugreports.qt-project.org/browse/QTBUG-39289, itâs assigned and itâs been successfully reproduced, but there doesnât appear to be any progress on it
<Mirv> oSoMoN: yeah, that's what I intended to comment upon
<Mirv> oSoMoN: doh, no complete success though https://launchpadlibrarian.net/176918383/buildlog_ubuntu-utopic-armhf.webbrowser-app_0.23%2B14.10.20140528%2Bworkaround-0ubuntu1%2Bworkaround~test1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<oSoMoN> darn
<oSoMoN> ah, I think I know what it is
<oSoMoN> give me a moment and Iâll push a new revision to the branch
<Mirv> sure!
<oSoMoN> Mirv, ok, pushed a new revision, you can rebuild
<Faizan> hi
<oSoMoN> Mirv, I can confirm that with my branch webbrowser-app runs fine on Qt 5.3, the only issue Iâm seeing is the progress bar embedded in the address bar thatâs not correctly rendered (it uses a shader)
<oSoMoN> Mirv, I just filed bug #1326322, in case you want to track it as well
<ubot5> bug 1326322 in webbrowser-app "Progress bar shader fails to render with Qt 5.3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1326322
 * Mirv builds
<ricmm> ogra_: todays image should be all fixed and ready to go?
<ogra_> nope ... the UAL merge was messed up
<ricmm> shit
<ricmm> thats heartbreaking
<ricmm> but the greeter fixes landed?
<ogra_> not all of them
<ogra_> workarounds landed ...
<ricmm> ok my question is
<ogra_> mterry did proper fixes sitting in silo 20
<ricmm> is ubuntu-touch-session stable now?
<ricmm> as I need to touch it
<ogra_> ricmm, looks like it is being touched in silo 20
<ogra_> i think Saviq is just trying to land it though
<Saviq> ogra_, ricmm, need to wait for silo 18 to conclude first ;|
<ogra_> whats 18 ? UAL ?
<Mirv> UAL, yes
<daker> Mirv: i see thanks!
<mdibaiee> Hi, I'm trying to triple boot UTouch on my Nexus 4. I have done this before with saucy, but I can't with utopic because utopic doesn't have these files:
<mdibaiee> utopic-preinstalled-touch-armel+mako.zip and utopic-preinstalled-touch-armhf.zip
<mdibaiee> I now I can dual boot from android, but I want to triple boot Firefox OS UTouch and Android
<nhaines> mdibaiee: try MultiROM Manager.  It should automate that for you.
<mdibaiee> I'm using MultiROM, the problem is, as said, there are no .zip files here: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch/daily-preinstalled/current/
<mdibaiee> I need utopic-preinstalled-touch-armel+mako.zip and utopic-preinstalled-touch-armhf.zip, these files exist in saucy channel ( + where's trusty? )
<nhaines> mdibaiee: I simply used MultiROM to actually install Ubuntu for me.  There was nothing manual for me to do, and I didn't need to worry about specific zip files either.
<mdibaiee> nhaines: MultiROM downloaded it for you?
<nhaines> Yup.
<nhaines> Right on the install/update page it's there.  I think it's Firefox I'd have to hunt down files for.
<mdibaiee> I guess my MultiROM is old, I don't have that choice, lemme see ...
<nhaines> I'm using MultiROM v24.  But I'm also using MultiROM Manager in Android.  I guess I should be very clear.  :)
<Mirv> daker: you're welcome :)
<mdibaiee> Oh, I'm using v16, really.
<nik90_> rsalveti: ping
<ogra_> nik90_, he's out this week
<nik90_> ogra_: oh.
<nik90_> thnx for the info
<nectarys_> I'm trying to abitye myself with the linux environment (am a developper). what kind of distribution do you advice me to abitye myself with, please?
<ogra_> nectarys_, what answer do you expect asking that question in an ubuntu channel
<ogra_> :)
<nectarys_> ogra_, maybe Debian, Ubuntu or Arch-Linux ? Ubuntu is not commercial version so I thought its followers are maybe more informed than me about this
<ogra_> well, why would i recommend anything else to you than what i use ?
<ogra_> ... or what i develop for ...
<ogra_> asking such a question in a distro channel will only get you recommendations of that specific distro
<lotuspsychje> ogra_: he wants to develope web/mobile/desktop applications
<lotuspsychje> nectarys_: maybe you can help the ubuntu-touch team?
<nectarys_> lotuspsychje, on what ?
<lotuspsychje> nectarys_: on developing ubuntu-touch more
<nectarys_> lotuspsychje, why not :D
<lotuspsychje> in my opinion the coolest Os for tablet/phone
<lotuspsychje> thanks to the dev guys here :p
<nectarys_> lotuspsychje, thanks for your suggestion :))
<unas> hi guys , can somebody tell me if can i install ubuntu touch on my Huawei P6 ?
<lotuspsychje> !devices | unas
<ubot5> unas: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<lotuspsychje> unas: also check the XDA forums for your device
<Mirv> rsalveti: did you get to test https://code.launchpad.net/~afrantzis/qtubuntu/fix-1321189/+merge/220613 on device + Qt 5.2? it'd be nice to get it landed.
<ogra_> Mirv, he is off this week
<Mirv> oh...
<Mirv> he has a nice pingfest backlog when he comes back
<Mirv> well of course that could be landed in the silo too
<Mirv> I'll do that
<Tassadar> ooh, clock app has the new header already
<popey> Tassadar: and calendar and music â»
<john96> Hi. I'm trying to install ubuntu touch dual boot on my nexus 4. i am following this official tutorial: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/DualBootInstallation .
<john96> I am getting this error on "Installing the Ubuntu Installer app in Android" : ./dualboot.sh: line 148: curl: command not found
<john96> Downloaded file has size: 0
<john96> does anyone have any ideas?
<Tassadar> sudo apt-get install curl
<john96> Tassadar: thanks. It seems to be working now :)
<john96> Regarding ubuntu touch, would any of you say that it is complete enough to completely move over to for personal usage?
<tsdgeos> oSoMoN: the patch for the blackness doesn't fix it for you? or haven't tried?
<oSoMoN> tsdgeos, I havenât tried
<tsdgeos> oSoMoN: ok
<tsdgeos> was scared you had and it failed
<oSoMoN> tsdgeos, my device is back to Qt 5.2 for other tasks, canât test right now
<gatox> hi, i need to launch an app in the phone, calling it with: upstart-app-launch app_identifier_version [ARGUMENTS]..... the app starts, but for some reason the arguments i pass to the app are dismissed and i cannot read them from the app..... any ideas?? do i need to modify the .desktop file or something?
<gatox> i did it... if it is of any use to anyone, i just modified the desktop file to be: Exec=@EXEC@ %u so i can send a url to that process
<dbarth> popey: ping?
<popey> dbarth: pong
<dbarth> popey: do you have a ref. to your magic script that downloads / stats all apps?
<dbarth> i'm looking for all 13.10 webapps
<dbarth> hi btw
<dbarth> ;)
<popey> ooh
<popey> you want any app that's in the store with a framework of 13.10?
<dbarth> yes sir
<dbarth> hopefully just a handful left
<dbarth> but i'd rather test a bit more before we land qtwebkit 5.2
<popey> let me see
<mdeslaur> where do I look at/file bugs for the touch camera app?
<popey> mdeslaur: lp:camera-app
<mdeslaur> popey: is that a core app? would be nice if it was listed on this page with the others: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone-coreapps/
<popey> no, it's a "system app"
<mdeslaur> oh! thanks
<pmcgowan> mdeslaur, long story
<pmcgowan> ;(
<mdeslaur> hehe
<popey> dbarth: there's plenty of apps in the store using 13.10 framework
<popey> dbarth: 167
<dbarth> popey: ok
<dbarth> popey: and how many of those use ubuntu-webapp as a template?
<popey> hmm, that's harder for me to figure out, lemme poke more
<popey> when do you need this info?
<dbarth> popey: i can do the greps if you have that script to download all
<popey> i do, but it's a faff to setup... is it easier if I give you a folder of clicks?
<dbarth> popey: a folder of clicks, perfect
<popey> ok, one mo
<dbarth> popey: nw
<popey> dbarth: http://people.canonical.com/~alan/clicks/2014-06-04-100001/
<dbarth> popey: thanks!
<jdstrand> jhodapp: hi! do you use gsettings in media-hub-server?
<jdstrand> jhodapp: fyi (bug #1326433)
<ubot5> bug 1326433 in media-hub (Ubuntu) "media-hub-server apparmor denial to gsettings" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1326433
<jhodapp> jdstrand, I don't use gsettings
<jdstrand> interesting. something in the stack is. I wonder what
<jhodapp> jdstrand, yeah that's odd
<Laney> ogra_: want to take care of https://code.launchpad.net/~ted/ubuntu-seeds/pay-service/+merge/221158 ?
<ogra_> Laney, well, probably not today anymore as we have other critical landings, but yeah, i can
<Laney> ta
<shadeslayer> out of curiousity, what's the status of WebRTC on Oxide + the ubuntu default browser
<MATPOC> Hi, I can't find serial access to GSM modem on Ubuntu Touch on Nexus 5 (latest build). I am loosing my mind already. Could someone help?
<MATPOC> does seriall access to modem exist on ubuntu touch at all?
<daker> MATPOC: UT uses ofono
<daker> MATPOC: check /usr/share/ofono/scripts/ in your phone
<rickspencer3> popey, could we take a few phones, and install images from the last promoted to now, and set them up with some apps running to get a sense of which image introduced the memory usage issues you are seeing?
<rickspencer3> would something like that work?
<WladimirKowtun> Good afternoon
<WladimirKowtun> I have doubts about the compatibility of my phone and Ubuntu Touch
<WladimirKowtun> I can ask about it here?
<WladimirKowtun> I have a Zte V791
<WladimirKowtun> and I just found this: wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install
<WladimirKowtun> Will it work for my phone?
<dobey> !devices
<ubot5> You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<popey> rickspencer3: I'm imagine so. I run a script on mine (see the webbrowser bug) which lets me see the memory climbing.
<rickspencer3> popey, cking suggested a useful sounding tool as well
<popey> rickspencer3: we also talked about it briefly on the landing call. We could run long tests over the weekend, when we have fewer landings
<popey> that way we don't adversely impact the working week
<rickspencer3> popey, yeah,t hat's been mentioned before
<rickspencer3> but this sounds more like a specific debugging exercise
<rickspencer3> there is a known issue, question is how to track it down
<popey> the music one has been around a while, the webbrowser one I only recently noticed
<popey> there's quite a few images between 50 (devel) and 64 (devel-proposed) so we'd need to carefully pick which ones we test with
<rickspencer3> popey, I guess it would be "bisections" :)
<popey> I have heard of this voodoo â»
<rickspencer3> a binary search can go pretty fast, or so I hear from the comp. sci. students
<popey> rickspencer3: who would own this? QA / CI?
<rickspencer3> in the meantime, I can't figure out how to stop mediascanner-service on my desktop
 * rickspencer3 shakes fist
<rickspencer3> popey, I guess the dev teams, really
<popey> $ stop mediascanner
<popey> mediascanner stop/waiting
<rickspencer3> popey, does that work for you?
<popey> yes
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> weird
<rickspencer3> ah
<popey> $ stop mediascanner-2.0
<popey> mediascanner-2.0 stop/waiting
<popey> there two â»
<rickspencer3> stop mediascanner-2.0
<rickspencer3> tab completion ftw
<ahayzen> hah
<ahayzen> don't plug in a large external device with mediascanner running lol
<rickspencer3> ahayzen, I didn't!
<rickspencer3> I just upgraded to utopic
<rickspencer3> I assume it was looking through my 40 gigs of music :)
<rickspencer3> well,35 gigs of music, and 5 gigs of noise
<ahayzen> rickspencer3, yeah it won't like that...i had to leave my machine for 5 minutes
<WladimirKowtun> Guys please forgive the noob I am, my phone is not in the supported devices list, if I follow the general instructions for installing Ubuntu Touch is there a hope for it works? or I just shouldnt try it?
<rickspencer3> WladimirKowtun, if there is no port for it, there is no hope, sorry
<popey> well there is *some* hope
<popey> the hope that someone else will port it
<WladimirKowtun> Thanks a lot for the info
<jhodapp> ahayzen, ping
<ahayzen> jhodapp, pong
<jhodapp> ahayzen, how do I run the music-app autopilot tests?
<ahayzen> jhodapp, which version trunk?
<jhodapp> ahayzen, sure
<ahayzen> jhodapp, on device || desktop?
<jhodapp> device
<ahayzen> jhodapp, i usually do something like this http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/7589880/
<jhodapp> ahayzen, cool, that's great...thanks
<ahayzen> jhodapp, let me know if it doesn't work
<jhodapp> k thanks
<darkhunts> hi everyone. as far as i know Ubuntu touch doens't support HTC ONE m7. is there any schedule for being supported?
<jhodapp> ahayzen, still around?
<ahayzen> jhodapp, o/
<jhodapp> ahayzen, can you try out this landing ppa and make sure music-app still functions as you expect?
<ahayzen> jhodapp, yeah which one?
<jhodapp> https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/landing-018
<ahayzen> :)
<ahayzen> jhodapp, what has changed in it?
<jhodapp> ahayzen, I updated the EndOfMedia case in qtubuntu-media so that a QMediaPlaylist set to loop actually loops
<jhodapp> ahayzen, the trouble is, I had to come up with a fix that made sure music-app and mediaplayer-app were still happy
<ahayzen> jhodapp, is this what will become the background playlist?
<jhodapp> ahayzen, no
<ahayzen> jhodapp, what does QMediaPlaylist do then? ... oh is that the c++ playlist in the MediaPlayer which we can't access in QML?
<jhodapp> ahayzen, correct
<ahayzen> :)
<ahayzen> jhodapp, cool i'll check it out in a bit :)
<jhodapp> ahayzen, sounds good, and thanks...just let me know if there's any regressions that you can tell...focus on EndOfMedia, next/previous track, etc
<ahayzen> jhodapp, will do
<ahayzen> jhodapp, haven't spotted/heard any issues yet, note i'm running our mediascanner2 branch not trunk at the moment though...i'll swap over to double check in a bit
<jhodapp> ahayzen, ok cool, thanks
<ahayzen> jhodapp, and haven't spotted anything in the version trunk yet \o/
<jhodapp> ahayzen, perfect!
<jhodapp> ahayzen, I'll publish that fix in the morning then
#ubuntu-touch 2014-06-05
<cpyarger> I figure I should ask here as there may be more up to date information, But has anyone had any luck with getting cell service with the "toro" phone
<naveen> Hi! I'm an Ubuntu app developer. Can some one tell me why don't I have a home screen with app icons in my Ubuntu Emulator?  This is how it looks like: http://askubuntu.com/questions/476184/installed-apps-are-not-shown-in-ubuntu-apps-scope  Thanks!
<naveen> Hello?? Is anyone there...?
<cpyarger> I have no clue, But the room seems dead, I have yet to get any response to my query as well
<kostkon> naveen, bug 1308210
<ubot5> bug 1308210 in unity-scopes-shell "Empty apps scopes on the emulator" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1308210
<naveen> x( OMG! I've no way to test my app ;(
<naveen> Thanks a lot anyway guys! :)
<lotuspsychje> samsung with tizen video: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2014/06/tizen-smartphone-samsung-z-video-demo
<lotuspsychje> maybe something usefull to steal from :p
<JoshStrobl> so I'm having an issue with a webapp I created for Outlook.com. When I try to start it (after installing the click package on the phone), it slides to the left immediately, shows a white screen for a couple of seconds, then shuts down.
<JoshStrobl> it's using ubuntu-sdk-14.04-dev1 framework on ubuntu-touch/utopic channel
<JoshStrobl> I ran the click package tests locally and the only part it had an issue with was the framework, but it coughed up an error no matter what framework I used.
<JoshStrobl> I checked /home/phablet/.cache/[my package] and there was no logs (just a thumbnail folder). checked /home/phablet/.local/share and there was no package folder name
<JoshStrobl> *package folder
<JoshStrobl> For webapps, what is the syntax in --webappUrlPatterns for defining multiple URLs / patterns?
<xenos1984> hi all, i have a problem with ubuntu touch on my nexus 7. i installed the latest trusty image, but often it just hangs a few seconds after showing me the unity screen (the screen freezes, it does not react to anything but switching the display on and off). i changed to a writable image and updated all packages, but now it boots into a black screen (login via adb shell is possible). i also tried utopic, but that did not boot at all and hung up in the
<xenos1984> bootloader.
<lotuspsychje> xenos1984: did you install channel=devel
<xenos1984> lotuspsychje: yes, but that one did not boot at all, so i used channel=trusty (or stable, i think they are the same right now?)
<lotuspsychje> xenos its reccomended you install channel=devel and leave your device locked
<lotuspsychje> not the trusty one
<lotuspsychje> devel will get you updates
<lotuspsychje> and fix things in future
<lotuspsychje> you dont need to update from terminal this way
<xenos1984> lotuspsychje: ok, thanks, so i'll try that once again and see whether i can make it boot... last time it just stopped in the bootloader
<lotuspsychje> xenos1984: did you unlock your device?
<xenos1984> lotuspsychje: yes, i used ubuntu touch before for several months and just updated recently
<lotuspsychje> and installed with adb reboot bootloader
<xenos1984> it worked before
<xenos1984> yes
<xenos1984> got to go now, but i will come back later, install channel=devel and see what happens
<xenos1984> thanks lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> xenos1984: np :p
<lotuspsychje> this will get you better working nexus
<dholbach> good morning
<JoshStrobl> So I've published applications to the Windows Phone store and it has taken 3 days. Published 3 web apps and it took less than a couple hours.
 * JoshStrobl is impressed.
<brendand> JoshStrobl, M$ don't have a popey
<JoshStrobl> brendand: That is true. We need to make sure it always remains that way! :P
<north> Hi. I am trying to understand the ofono-architecture portrayed in doc/ofono-paper.txt, So, as far as I have understood, core-daemon talks to Modem, drivers are bridge between modem and host, atoms are higher level api which talk to apps. What is the role of plugins ? rsalveti ?
<north> awafaa: ?
<awafaa> Sorry north I'm not the right person for that. Maybe ogra_ can advise, if you repeat the question?
<north> sorry awafaa
<awafaa> Not a problem north, hopefully you get what you're looking for
<abeato> north, plugins serve different functions
<abeato> for instance, there is one per type of modem
<abeato> one for bluetooth and one for each bluetooth profile
<abeato> one for provisioning
<abeato> and so on
<abeato> there is a standard interface for initializing them, and then each plugin is used in a different way
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy World Environment Day! :-D
<north> abeato: like call-forwarding, call-initiation, etc ?
<abeato> north, no, those are atoms
<abeato> which are modem functionalities
<north> so plugins also belong to high level api of ofono to serve apps rather than talking to the modem or to be precise rilmodem ?
<abeato> most plugins are specific initialization for modem vendors: zte, huawei...
<north> still not clear actually :p
<abeato> rilmodem is a modem driver, used by the ril plugin, for instance
<abeato> atmodem is another driver
<abeato> used by many modem plugins, like zte, sierra...
<north> but rilmodem is supposed to talk to the ril (rild plus ril driver) on the whole, ain't it ?
<abeato> right
<north> I might have a look at ril plugin
<north> so plugins reside in gril ?
<mardy> mpt: hi! Can you please have a look at this? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts/+bug/1262876
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1262876 in Online Accounts setup for Ubuntu Touch "Cannot renew access" [High,Confirmed]
<abeato> no, in plugins/
<north> sorry yea. I texted wrong
<abeato> gril is a low-level communication layer to connect to rild
<mardy> mpt: IIRC, the plan was to use a snap decision, but I can't find the message (and button labels) for it
<north> you mean the socket functionality ? abeato ?
<abeato> yes
<north> so usually, Ubuntu touch devs would constantly change ril under plugins/ directory for talking to the ril_binary
<north> ?
<abeato> north, most of the functionality is in drivers/rilmodem/
<abeato> ril plugin is a file for doing some initialization stuff
<abeato> like associating a given atom (say, call-forwarding) to the driver that is needed by that atom (rilmodem driver for call-forwarding)
<north> core daemon is meant to be the modem abstraction, which rilmodem is taking care of right ?
<north> So core daemon loads ril plugin, ril plugin initializes rilmodem, rilmodem abstracts ril messages and ril plugin inturn talks to atoms to get the work done. Correct ?
<north> here ril messages are the ril_messages from ril_binary
<abeato> yeah, only thing is that ril plugin makes sure that atoms are attached to the rilmodem driver for a ril type modem, more than talking to atoms
<north> yea, so ril plugin is the center point for all atom functionalities
<north> ?
<abeato> right, it creates the atoms for the ril modem type (only those atoms supported by ril type)
<north> With libhybris and this rilmodem ubuntu-touch could be supporting any phone out there, "theoretically" :p
<north> Infact same is the case with Sailfish OS and Nemo :p
<abeato> north, no direct connection with libhybris: rilmodem driver talks to rild using a socket
<north> Yea, I know. I should've put like this. libhybris for HAL and rilmodem for radio :p
<abeato> and yes, any android phone should have telephony using rilmodem, but it depends on the modifications the vendor has made to telephony layer/rild
<abeato> right
<north> btw, libqmi could have been directly used to leverage the modems which talk qmi protocol ? abeato ?
<abeato> north, probably, but we preferred to keep the rild abstraction layer, as we will also support non qualcomm modems
<north> yea that makes sense
<north> and will rilmodem depends on any other functionality in the ofono package ?
<north> btw, am I bugging too much ?
<abeato> no, but I am curious on why are you interested :)
<abeato> well, rilmodem is a driver that is part of the ofonod binary
<north> 1) because I am working on RIL stuff and modem, as a part of my research. 2) I would wanna contribute back to rilmodem :)
<abeato> so it is a fully integrated part of ofono
<abeato> north, great, good to know
<north> So far I could get hold of reference-ril from the AOSP sources
<north> Samsung provides few reference ril's but for old devices, which people woudn't be interested in these days.
<north> Actually I want to dwell deep into RIL stuff, but so far I could manage only till reference-ril of ofcourse ofono-ril
<abeato> north, from the point of view of rilmodem, what it needs is that vendor's rild implements http://androidxref.com/4.4.2_r1/xref/hardware/ril/include/telephony/ril.h
<north> while ofono also provides at ril, I am not quite interested in the AT stuff... :p
<abeato> that's what is abstracted by rild
<north> so rilmodem directly depends on ril.h calls ?
<abeato> ril.h defined the parcels that are interchanged with rild via the socket
<north> but thats for AT modems,
<north> you don't know if thats what is really what happens with the OEM ril right ? though there might be similarities
<north> ?
<abeato> most OEM rils talk to the modem using AT commands
<abeato> if that's what you are asking...
<north> not exactly
<north> I mean the one ril.h in /hardware/ril/ril.h is for AT modems, but the ril.h for OEM_provided ril could be different.
<north> Also, with Qualcomm's chips being the almost ubiquitous, they speak different language than AT :p
<north> say for example, qmi, mbim
<abeato> OEMs do modify definitions in ril.h, but they start with the AOSP one
<north> but surely, not many modems speak AT these days, and I feel AT support would be extint soon
<abeato> I wouldn't bet on that :)
<abeato> but anyway that is irrelevant from the rilmodem perspective, as it uses the ril.h interface
<north> Yes, yes
<north> and it works almost all the times
<north> :D
<north> So Ubuntu-touch OS uses bluez or deos it depend on ofono ?
<abeato> bluez
<north> And the ril changes a at snail  rate so you rilmodem doesn't have to worry to keep with the new features added to AOSP ril prototype
<Bhush> on Ubuntu-touch : for multimedia, why use the Stagefright (MediaCodec) interface and and not the OMX interface directly ?
<lotuspsychje> hey nice work on the outlook app guys!
<lotuspsychje> just tested it and works nicely
<popey> lotuspsychje: community contributed I believe.
<lotuspsychje> i saw some users talk about this morning in chat
<lotuspsychje> popey: did you see omg ubuntu link on samsung tizen?
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2014/06/tizen-smartphone-samsung-z-video-demo
<dpm> hi Wellark, what's the status of the n-i landing with translations? Is this still blocked on TRAINCON-0?
<charles> nik90, ping
<nik90> charles: pong
<charles> nik90, about the "high CPU load in indicator-datetime" bug
<charles> I'm thinking that I will test with older versions of clock-app and calendar-app as you suggested
<charles> since I want to get to the bottom of the high CPU in datetime
<nik90> charles: ok
<charles> which revisions of those two apps should I test with s.t. I can have better odds  of reproducing the problem?
<nik90> charles: let me check..1 min
<charles> nik90, ack
<nik90> charles: I think rev 280 in the calendar app should do.
<nik90> charles: for the clock app, it doesn't matter since we haven't isolated the environment yet.
<nik90> charles: but can you push this work item as a second priority? Can we first get the alarm platform API MP of your in first?
<charles> nik90, ok. so I'll try r280 for calendar-app and trunk for clock-app; does that sound right to you?
<nik90> charles: yeah those revs sound about right.
<charles> nik90, hw alarms are MPing today
<nik90> charles: oh..great!
<charles> there's always "one more thing..." and in this case it's that /dev/alarm's permissions need to change s.t. platform-api's clients don't need any special permissions to use hw alarms
<charles> nik90, tvoss is handling that
<charles> but wrt indicator-datetime's  piece of the puzzle, that code will be MPed today
<nik90> charles: I thought tvoss's MP was already in the phone. The last piece we were waiting on was the d-t MP of yours.
<charles> nik90, yes tvoss' platform-api code's already been merged
<charles> nik90, there's still a permissions problem with /dev/alarm
<nik90> charles: ah ok
<charles> for example right now if you run the platform-api test app "test_hardware_alarms_api"
<charles> you get an error message
<charles> "UbuntuHardwareAlarm::UbuntuHardwareAlarm(): Error creating /dev/alarm-based implementation with: Could not open /dev/alarm: Permission denied
<charles>   Error creating handle to hardware alarms."
<charles> nik90: I don't think this is a blocker, I'm just telling you to keep you in the loop
<nik90> charles: ok. Do you have an ETA on the whole thing landing on the phone?
<mpt> mardy, hi, the reporter said â(I am on the desktop)â. Are you sure they didnât report it against ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts by mistake?
<charles> nik90, at a guess, perhaps Monday? Depends on how long it takes things to go from MP to silo to landed
<mardy> mpt: no, the guy is running ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts on the desktop
<mardy> mpt: in any case, this is something we currently don't have on the phone, and needs to be done
<nik90> charles: thnx
<mpt> mardy, okay. So does this need to be treated differently from when an app first asks for access to an account?
<mpt> mardy, or has the service revoked your access for every app, and itâs just this appâs bad luck that it encountered the problem first?
<mardy> mpt: so, this can happen depending on the service provider's mood
<mardy> mpt: but the typical case is that the access token has expired, and in order to get a new one the provider wants the user to login again (and maybe re-confirm that he trusts the app)
<mpt> mardy, sure. But does this apply to every app on the phone, or just the first one you use after that happens?
<mardy> mpt: in some cases it may be that all we want is the user to login (and therefore, this app has just been unlucky, as you said), but it can also be app-specific
<mardy> mpt: it can happen at later time, for every app
<mardy> mpt: I think that with facebook we'd see this prompt only once, because it never revokes the rights to apps, but for Google every app would hit this case
<mardy> mpt: maybe (and hopefully) at different times
<mpt> mardy, when you say âall we want is the user to loginâ, do you mean thatâs what the service (e.g. Twitter) wants?
<mardy> mpt: yes, we actually don't have any clue of what will happen, we just know that the service wants to present the user with a webpage
<mardy> mpt: might be a login screen, might be a confirmation that he trust the app, or both (one after the other)
<mpt> mardy, okay. So why donât we just bring up the sheet embedding that page immediately?
<cwayne> dpm: ping
<dpm> hey cwayne
<cwayne> dpm: can we preseed a location to the weather app?
<dpm> cwayne, I think so, they should be stored in the app's sqlite database
<dpm> IIRC
<north> bye abeato, thanks for the information today, I'll be bugging you more in coming days :p
<abeato> north, yw, bye
<dpm> cwayne, we've been talking with alecu about the fix to show translated app names in the apps scope. I think he's just reached to you too
<dpm> so afaik, loading offline translations from the .desktop files has been implemented, but for some reason it does not work
<dpm> then providing online translations via the software store API is still in the works
<dpm> so the suggestion was to upload Simplified Chinese translations as if they were English ones, and these would be the ones shown in the app scope
<dpm> alecu,  correct so far? ^^
<dpm> cwayne, alecu, I'm a bit concerned about this, as it would mean _everyone_ would see the Simplified Chinese names and descriptions. I think this is a change that shouldn't affect the regular images
<alecu> dpm: they will see that for a few apps in the store, yes
<alecu> dpm: but not for every app
<cwayne> well, what if we just make some chinese webapps and upload them to the store
<dpm> alecu, but that's for all the core apps, which are the ones installed by default on all devices
<alecu> dpm: ah, I'm talking about the "available apps" from the store
<alecu> cwayne: +1 to making some chinese webapps
<dpm> alecu, ah, I was talking about "My Apps": clock, camera, etc. These are the most visible ones, as they're at the top in the scope
<alecu> dpm: right; and we want the "title" of the app to be translated, right?
<alecu> dpm: I think it might be ok if the "description" was in english... that's shown when the user "long presses" on the app icon.
<alecu> dpm: but I agree that we want the title shown under the icon to be in chinese
<dpm> alecu, yes, the app name, but it seems that that's not yet loading the translations from the .desktop files. I mentioned it on the e-mail to dobey, but I should probably file a bug for it.
<alecu> dpm: please. I was looking at the issue with the webservice and translation of apps available to be installed, but I agree that the one you mentioned on the email is much more urgent.
<alecu> dpm, cwayne: I think I understand this better now. I'll work on fixing the title issue that dpm mentions
<lool> popey: heya!  did you have any other clue about the memory issues you mentioned?  like, is it with certain apps, does it occur even when not using the phone and letting it idle?
<popey> lool: I am trying to reproduce it, but difficult when i have to flash my phone all the time.
<dpm> alecu, ah, in fact I filed a bug about it already a few days ago: bug 1325626
<ubot5> bug 1325626 in unity-scope-click (Ubuntu) "Inline translations from .desktop files are not loaded" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1325626
<tedg> cjwatson, It seems like the click-desktop hook is generating the desktop files in ~/.local  I thought it was deprecated?
<cjwatson> tedg: Oh, it's a missing upstart-app-launch adjustment
<cjwatson> Exec: [ -e /usr/share/click/hooks/upstart-app-launch-desktop.hook ] || click desktophook
<creature> So I've asked this a few times here, and never got an answer. Can I configure Ubuntu's swipe gestures? 3-finger swipe, 4-finger type, and so on?
<tedg> cjwatson, Ah, okay. Do you want me to patch that?
<tedg> cjwatson, Proposed an MR to add it: https://code.launchpad.net/~ted/click/desktop-hook-ual/+merge/222223
<tedg> Oh, alecu made one too.
<tedg> cjwatson, You'll have to choose who you love more.
<tedg> No pressure.
<alecu> tedg: yours look more complete :-)
<pstolowski> :)
<lool> cant start the clock app anymore
<lool> after switching images, it just wont start
<lool> seems to generate an abort / crash file, and some logs are output in the upstart dir:
<lool> (process:7078): GLib-GIO-ERROR **: No GSettings schemas are installed on the sys
<popey> ooh, fails to start here too
<lool> popey: ah thanks, I was trying for an hour to delete local files to see what was preventing the start, but it seems it's everyone
<lool> good
<ogra_> lool, yes, we're fighting these kind of issues since yesterday
<popey> ogra_: is this an upstart thing?
<lool> ogra_: is this generalized across specific apps?
<ogra_> (and others like that since monday)
<lool> cause other apps like music do start
<ogra_> popey, this specific one is missing XDG_DATA_DIR ... split greeter thing
<lool> aha
<ogra_> there is a fix in a silo ... but we need to wait for test results on the recent image first before we can land
<ogra_> http://ci.ubuntu.com/smokeng/utopic/touch/mako/68:20140605.2:20140530/8424/
<ogra_> will still take a while
<ogra_> we're not even half way through
<tedg> How is the thumbnailer supposed to work? I see a dbus service, but no entires in the apparmor easyprof profile.
<tedg> Not sure how an app is supposed to talk to it.
 * tedg looks for the changelog to find victims
<oSoMoN> sil2100, robru: hey, can we publish the landing request at line 33 ?
<robru> oSoMoN, hmmmm well we're in traincon 0...
<oSoMoN> damnit
<sil2100> oSoMoN: om26er is around though!
<robru> oSoMoN, with a QA ack it can go in. ping om26er or toykeeper
<sil2100> oSoMoN: just ask him to take a quick look :)
<sil2100> oSoMoN: he was on -ci-eng at least
<oSoMoN> the status of the spreadsheet doesnât mention weâre in traincon0
<oSoMoN> it should be updated
<mterry> stgraber, what was that pam module you mentioned that could let us specify alternate passwd/shadow locations?
<stgraber> mterry: libnss-extrausers
<ogra_> heh, i just updated my TODO to look into nss-extrausers today
<stgraber> mterry: nothing should be needed on the pam side, pam_unix will query nss for passwd, group and shadow entries, nss will look at both files and return the first match
<lool> current build number: 67
<lool> => still no working clock; sigh
<lool> pmcgowan: ^ you said you were on 67?  I guess I need to go down to 66 to get working clock
<pmcgowan> lool, wfm on 67
<cjwatson> tedg: Sorry for the delay; I had an internet event.  If you can resubmit that I'll try to merge it ASAP
<cjwatson> tedg: I assume this is actually breaking something rather than just being annoying?
<cjwatson> Oh, I see the bug
<ogra_> stgraber, mterry slangasek asked me to open a bug against adduser so it learns to deal with nss-extrausers
<ogra_> stgraber, mterry bug 1323732
<ubot5> bug 1323732 in adduser (Ubuntu) "adduser should support managing additional password/shadow/group files from libnss-extrausers" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1323732
<ogra_> once that is fixed i think we can include it
<ogra_> (and think about proper setup procedures, we'll need to adjust the image build since we do the user creation there)
<tedg> cjwatson, resubmitted
<ogra_> Jun 5 16:41:07 ubuntu-phablet kernel: [ 339.346711] type=1400 audit(1401986467.040:179): apparmor="DENIED" operation="mknod" parent=1223 profile="com.ubuntu.calendar_calendar_0.4.296" name="/home/phablet/autopilot/fakeenv/tmpyqoyhzy8/.config/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/theme.ini.TJ3916" pid=3916 comm="qmlscene" requested_mask="c" denied_mask="c" fsuid=32011 ouid=32011
<ogra_> tedg, does that tell you anything ?
<ogra_> i see that a lot in the log of the failed calendar app tests
<ogra_> (before the gesettings error kicks in)
<ogra_> oh
<ogra_> and also
<ogra_> Could not create thumbnailer: Unknown error when checking cache access: Is a directory
<ogra_> i assume that could also be realted to the gallery issue
<ogra_> (not sure why calendar uses a thumbnailer)
<tedg> ogra_, I think there is some sort of permissions error, I'm curious if stuff is trying extra directories because of the lack of environment variables.
<tedg> So it's hitting directories it can't access.
<tedg> At least, that's the theory I'm trying right now :-)
<ogra_> right, we need mterry's landing
<tedg> ogra_, Yup, that's it. I set them by hand after rebooting and the gallery works at least.
<tedg> Let me try others
<ogra_> try the calendar AP test
<ogra_> and clock doesnt seem to start at all
<tedg> Let me set up AP, but gallery and clock and calender all seem to work.
<ogra_> great
<tedg> We should really be more robust to that value not getting set.
<ogra_> ++
<tedg> ogra_, Are the calendar AP tests not in the archive?
<dobey> alecu, dpm-afk: found the problem in bug #1325626 now back to my vacation :)
 * tedg is feeling stupid
<ubot5> bug 1325626 in Ubuntu Calculator App "Inline translations from .desktop files are not loaded" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1325626
<ogra_> tedg, pphablet-test-run ...
<ogra_> tedg, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Testing
<tedg> Wow, I haven't used the cool tools before.
<tedg> This is a lot better.
<tedg> ogra_, Hmm, no, still getting denials on trying to write the ini file.
<ogra_> :(
<tedg> Kaleo, Do you know why apps would be trying to write to ~/.config/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/theme.ini ?
<tedg> Or I guess, make a temp file next to it. I assume that's to write.
<ogra_> tedg, oh, check /var/crash ...
<ogra_> looking at http://ci.ubuntu.com/smokeng/utopic/touch/mako/68:20140605.2:20140530/8424/calendar_app/... it seems there is an url-dispatcher crash
<tedg> ogra_, That's actually a different bug that we added recoverable errors to track down, so I'm excited to see that one :-)
<tedg> It shouldn't be the issue here though.
<ogra_> k
<tedg> alecu, silo 10 has the click fix in it for uninstall
<alecu> dobey: thanks for finding that, now stop working and enjoy!
<dobey> alecu: not working right now, but am not really "enjoying" having a broken washing machine, and trying to debug it, either :-/
<alecu> dobey: that's why on vacations you are supposed to go *out* :-)
<jdstrand> tedg: fyi, the thumbnailer dbus access is in the audio policy group
<jdstrand> (as of 1.1.18)
<tedg> jdstrand, Ah, I didn't find that but found the issue was in the XDG_DATA_DIRS variable.
<tedg> jdstrand, Thanks!
<jdstrand> np
<popey> bug 1326513
<ubot5> bug 1326513 in unity8 (Ubuntu) "Applications are orphaned when unity8 crashes" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1326513
#ubuntu-touch 2014-06-06
<mardy> mpt: good question; I guess it depends on whether the requesting application window is currently on the foreground or not
<mardy> mpt: the authentication window might be triggered by some background processes, such as contact synchronization
<mardy> mpt: so at least in those cases I don't think that we should pop it up out of blue
<Kaleo> tedg, hmmm, writing is unexpected unless maybe they set the theme but even then that should not write
<Kaleo> tedg, I see the code that would trigger that; ogra_ you there?
<ogra_> yep
<Kaleo> ogra_, you're the one that raised the theme.ini issue?
<ogra_> well, it doesnt seem to happen anymore with a proper XDG_DATA_DIR set
<ogra_> we had the error in the lab smoke tests ...
<Kaleo> ogra_, right
<Kaleo> ogra_, so it does write
<ogra_> seems like, yes
<Kaleo> ogra_, but if you give a writable path it does not fail?
<ogra_> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/utopic-touch-mako-smoke-daily/250/consoleFull
<ogra_> search for .ini
<ogra_> right
<ogra_> it doesnt fail ... though this error comes from autopilot
<ogra_> name="/home/phablet/autopilot/fakeenv/tmpthzwqdgz/.config/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/theme.ini.TJ2716"
<ogra_> not sure if you can blame the app here
<Kaleo> ogra_, all good then
<Kaleo> ogra_, not *all* good :)
<Kaleo> ogra_, the toolkit tries to write in a location that apparmor has not allowed
<ogra_> yep
<Kaleo> ogra_, which does not really break anything
<Kaleo> ogra_, but still
<ogra_> well, it broke a lot of smoketests yesterday
<ogra_> http://ci.ubuntu.com/smokeng/utopic/touch/mako/68:20140605.2:20140530/8424/
<Kaleo> oh really? how come only now?
<Kaleo> this write has been there for over 1 year
<ogra_> split greeter switched us away from processing Xsession.d scripts ...
<ogra_> which made us end up without XDG_DATA_DIR set
<Kaleo> I see
<Kaleo> but you fixed that?
<ogra_> it sets that itself now
<Kaleo> when you said: "<ogra_> well, it doesnt seem to happen anymore with a proper XDG_DATA_DIR set" did you mean that you set the XDG_DATA_DIR in the lab now?
<Kaleo> or that's just a possible solution not implemented yet?
<ogra_> all fine ... but indeed in a world with readonly home or full homedir your apps might not be able to start anymore if this is also used in real life
<ogra_> the greeter sets XDG_DATA_DIR when starting sessions
<Kaleo> hmmmm
<Kaleo> so, hmmm
<Kaleo> XDG_DATA_DIR needs to be set so that we can read from the readonly home I suppose
<ogra_> (the Xsession.d script code was copy/pasted into the session start scripts)
<Kaleo> and the app shouldn't totally fail if it's readonly
<Kaleo> interesting
<Kaleo> ok
<Kaleo> any action needed then?
<Kaleo> urgent action at least?
<ogra_> no, we're all fine since the var is set again
<Kaleo> right
<Kaleo> ok
<ogra_> long term it would be good to test apps with readonly home though
<Kaleo> I was convinced jamie and the sec team had a least of all policy violations
<Kaleo> in a bug somewhere
<ogra_> i.e. if your home is full your session still needs to be able to start and you need to be able to make an emergency call
<Kaleo> ogra_, yeah I don't think app breaks if home is not readable
<Kaleo> apps break*
<ogra_> i heard some reports from people using that image who could npot start the clock-apÃ¼p anymore
<Kaleo> that's possible that a couple of apps do funny things
<ogra_> right
<ogra_> we need to make sure dialer is not among them
<Kaleo> that should be detected by the sanity checks in qtcreator and at click upload time
<Kaleo> I guess
<Kaleo> right
<Kaleo> ogra_, worth checking then, or asking bfiller to add an automated test of some sort?
<Kaleo> (dialer and unity8)
<Kaleo> can't believe I wrote 'least' instead of 'list' earlier
<ogra_> i have another bug open about readonly home ... which will result in a readonly home test ... i'll make sure that unity8 and dialer are the apps that get tested in that
<Kaleo> cool
<Kaleo> for future reference, toolkit related issues go to zsombi :)
<ogra_> yeah, i didnt ping you :)
<Kaleo> tedg,  for future reference, toolkit related issues go to zsombi :)
<Kaleo> ;)
<ogra_> i would have gone to bzoltan though ... just because i'm used to it ;)
<Kaleo> ogra_, that works too
<janimo> ogra_, hi, is SWAP going to be there for RTM ?
<ogra_> janimo, i hope not
<janimo> ogra_, who's in charge of that?
<ogra_> probably rsalveti, tvoss and me
<ogra_> we need to test the lifecycle stuff without it and need to know it doesnt regress etc
<Saviq> popey, you're making me cry ;P *please* apport-cli .crash files before uploading anywhere
<popey> sorry dude
<Saviq> otherwise it's missing details :)
<popey> will do now
<popey> Your computer does not have enough free memory to automatically analyze the problem and send a report to the developers.
<Saviq> popey, hum there's no core there anyway
<popey> well that was useful
<Saviq> popey, yeah, core collection failed (OOM)
<Saviq> so that's not gonna help
<Saviq> popey, the message is also misleading... your computer *did* not have enough memory at the time of the crash
<Saviq> popey, so there's nothing we can get out of it now
<popey> â¹
<popey> anything i can do at the time when/if it happens again?
<Saviq> pray you have enough memory for the dump to be processed...
<popey> hah
<Saviq> i.e. don't run 15 apps! ;)
<popey> can we put a popup on the phone that says "Don't open apps, our phone isn't designed for that!" ? :Ã¾
<Saviq> ')
<Saviq> it's *designed* for that
<Saviq> it's just not implemented yet ;)
<popey> haha!
<popey> shitcanonicalsays dot tumblr dot come
<popey> -e
<mpt> mardy, hmm, thatâs an interesting problem. Do you have any other ideas for when/how it should be presented?
<mpt> mardy, perhaps it could be something flagged on the relevant app? A contact syncing problem gives the Contacts app a launcher badge, a calendar syncing problem gives the Calendar app a launcher badge, and s on.
<mpt> *so on
<Mirv> didrocks: heya. sil2100 is away today, and we have no knowledge on how to restore the spreadsheet functional after jenkins was down for a few hours earlier today (out of disk space again). could you help?
<didrocks> Mirv: hum? what do you need exactly? the spreadsheet should just sync up and pick from there
<didrocks> Mirv: or did you change any urls?
<Mirv> didrocks: no url:s, just downtime. more like about debugging what's wrong, I don't really know why eg refreshSilos gives an error (empty JSON)
<didrocks> Mirv: nothing should be needed then. Can you access the backend json files, aren't they empty?
<Mirv> didrocks: no I don't know/remember what/where are backend json files..
<didrocks> Mirv: they are http://people.canonical.com/~platform/citrain/
<didrocks> you should try to check with json files are empty
<Mirv> there's one empty for some reason
<didrocks> Mirv: maybe start from this?
<Mirv> trying to look at 008
<anjan> hello
<anjan> i have built a intel core i3 3220 with gigabyte dg61 mobo and 4gb ram. whenever, i tried to install ubuntu 14.04 lts amd64, i got an error message "invalid or corrupt kernel image"
<anjan> pl. hel
<anjan> pl. help
<Mirv> didrocks: I can't seem to figure out how to kick jenkins to write something on top of that 0 length landing-008 file, since all operations fail on that
<mardy> mpt: it doesn't sound very easy. Though, if you design it like that, I'm sure we'd find a way to implement it
<didrocks> Mirv: I guess the short way of fixing this is to remove the config file, maybe add a try: except: in the code otherwise
<mardy> mpt: just to make sure I understood the high level plan: we wouldn't pop up any windows, but signal the user (probably via the launcher) that an application needs his attention; then, when he clicks on the "thing", the authentication window will be presented; is this correct?
<mpt> mardy, thatâs not a high-level plan, itâs just one possibility I thought of :)
<mpt> but yes
<Mirv> didrocks: how'd I remove the file? should I have ccess to the ~platform account?
<popey> anjan: i think you probably want #ubuntu for tech support.
<didrocks> Mirv: landing-008, right?
<Mirv> didrocks: yes
<didrocks> Mirv: deleted
<didrocks> hum, actually
<didrocks> that's not enough
<didrocks> it will be synced back from the backend
<didrocks> Mirv: you need to check with webops to do that in the backend
<didrocks> Mirv: or run a jenkins job to do it
<Mirv> ok, I'll go there. thanks for your help!
<didrocks> Mirv: yw ;)
<Mirv> problem solved, restored one more id from prepare silo logs and now all seems good again
<didrocks> excellent!
<seb128> do we have an api to query the device type?
<seb128> type being phone/tablet/desktop
<seb128> that's for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1258211
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1258211 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) ""About this phone" makes no sense on other devices" [Low,Triaged]
<seb128> the design says it should be "about this phone" on a phone and be "device" otherwise
<oSoMoN> Mirv, hey, can I get a silo for line 18 ?
<ogra_> MacSlow, hey ... so i enabled the spinner on my flo ... is it really wanted to have it that tiny ? on the flo screen it looks quite lost (about 1cm only)
<MacSlow> ogra_, it's not that large... it's size is GU-based
<MacSlow> I've two screencasts (one on n4, one on n10) for comparision if you want...
<ogra_> which would the flo (N7) get ?
<ogra_> i assume we currently ship the N4 version by default ?
<MacSlow> ogra_, here you go www.youtube.com/watch?v=iieDMszha9Q
<Mirv> oSoMoN: done
<oSoMoN> Mirv, thanks!
<ogra_> MacSlow, on the phone it actually looks reasonable ... on the tablet i find it way to small
<MacSlow> ogra_, since I don't have access to a n7, I can't tell
<MacSlow> ogra_, the question is, is the GU used (read from a file, since $GRID_UNIT_PX isn't set up that early in the boot-process) on the N7 correct?
<MacSlow> ogra_, I mean the value stored in the filesystem of the n7 image
<ogra_> it is set up by ubuntu-touch-session ... whihc runs after u-s-c when either the greeter or unity8 start
<ogra_> so yeah, i guess only after you started
<MacSlow> ogra_, I've written a decicated function for the spinner-binary to load the grid-unit value from the file it is stored in
<ogra_> s/set up/exported into the env/
<ogra_> MacSlow, hmm, not a good idea, that file will move into the andrid container soon ... better make it configurable so we can adjust it then
<ogra_> (all HW related config and data is supposed to move out of the rootfs)
<MacSlow> ogra_, I'm a gfx-guy... weeks back, pulling it from the fs was the only option available to me to get hold of the GU-value
<ogra_> yeah, it still iss ... and will probably still be by RTM ... but the file location will change
<MacSlow> ogra_, plans change constantly... but I wanted to get the project forward instead of just sitting there
<ogra_> i wonder if we could somehow inject it into the env on early boot
<MacSlow> ogra_, besides all that needs to be alter is the, way the GU is supplied... everything else - since it's GU-based - does not have t obe touched and works today
<ogra_> you are not the only one using the file directly ... sadly ...
<MacSlow> ogra_, again I don't follow the boot-process planning/development very closely
<ogra_> well, the other graphical bits only run after upstart started a session ... in which case the GU value gets into the upstart global environment
<ogra_> they dont need to read the file
<MacSlow> ogra_, I was not happy with having to pull in the libandroid-properties dependency for the spinner-binary
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> oh, you read it from android ?
<MacSlow> ogra_, this is one of those sweet spots where idealism hits reality :)
<ogra_> well, you should not need it ... what do you read with it exactly ?
<ogra_> we should make that availablle to you in the environment instead
<MacSlow> ogra_, yeah I had to use a specific android/hybris-related property call to obtain it
<ogra_> the GU ?
<ogra_> i thought you read it from the file
<ogra_> (especially since we dont set a GU property at all ... what you get might be an unused android value if you read it from there)
<ogra_> MacSlow, we should look into that before RTM, i'd like to provide you a way where you dont need android deps ...
<MacSlow> ogra_, see lines 34-92 here bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-system-compositor-team/unity-system-compositor/trunk/view/head:/spinner/eglspinner.c
<ogra_> ah, just for the device name ... we'll solve that once the file moves into the container ... but i think it would be even more elegant if an early upstart job could just set a global var for you
<MacSlow> ogra_, I am not familiar with upstart... I've to trust what people - more familiar with the boot-process - tell me.
<MacSlow> ogra_, when I wrote the spinner, using libhybris to read that property was the suggested way to go... so I did.
<ogra_> bug 1327172
<ubot5> bug 1327172 in ubuntu-touch-session (Ubuntu) "GRID_UNIT_PX value should be exported into the system environment early on boot" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1327172
<MacSlow> ogra_, what could be - in the case of the n7 - that it fails to find the correct value via libhybris and just falls back to the default value of 10, which might be too small for the n7
<MacSlow> ogra_, can you quickly check the value of $GRID_UNIT_PX or a fully booted N7 for comparision?
<ogra_> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ echo $GRID_UNIT_PX
<ogra_> 18
<MacSlow> ogra_, how much smaller is the spinner on the n7 compared to the n10... roughly?
<ogra_> it is as big as on the phone in your video
<ogra_> just with a 7" screen around it
<MacSlow> ogra_, well... that's sounds about right then
<ogra_> (doesnt seen to be scaled up)
<ogra_> compared to the flahing animation it looks very tiny :)
<ogra_> *flashing
<ogra_> (though this will get re-work as well i was told)
<MacSlow> ogra_, true... the spinning logo during the device-flashing is "too big" if I recall Design
<ogra_> (flashing as in applying an update ... not as in *blink* :) )
<ogra_> ah, k
<MacSlow> ogra_, but such things you've to discuss with Design and not me :)
<ogra_> well, as long as they are consistent :)
<MacSlow> +1
<ogra_> i'll let you know when the above bug is fixed, then you can dro the android dep
<ogra_> and just use getenv ;)
<MacSlow> ogra_, although I've to admit, that Design's focus is on the most likely UI an end-user will see... which is Dash, Scopes etc... and not device flashing :)
<ogra_> enduser see the flashing animation on every update
<ogra_> well, system image update ...
<MacSlow> ogra_, ok... if that's available at some point, the needed change will be tiny I guess
<om26er> who works on powerd these days ?
<ogra_> jdstrand, the mir socket moved to /var/run ... we have a security test failure due to that, i think you need to update something
<ogra_> (the apparmor-easyprof-ubuntu test seems to check for /tmp/mir_socket)
<om26er> bug 1327180
<ubot5> bug 1327180 in powerd (Ubuntu) "Screen brightness resets on boot" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1327180
<asac> anyone saw the problem where the shell stops responding to input? e.g. no swipe, no start of apps etc.?
<asac> i had that yestetrday again, thought it was a crash, but this never resurrected even after waiting over 1h
<ogra_> asac, did you check via adb if apport was running or some such ?
<asac> ogra_: i was out in the park and needed to take pictures, o i couldnt do adb :)
<asac> ogra_: but it was over 1h
<asac> so i dont think its apport
<asac> it was just a hang
<ogra_> yeah, doesnt sound like
<asac> from my pov
<asac> think it was even 2h
<asac> i waited for this thing to recover/restart
<ogra_> we had issues before where gestures didnt work
<ogra_> but taps and the like still did
 * asac upgrades to 71
<asac> so this choppy sound when on a phone call, thats going to be fixed with pulse droid?
<asac> isnt that a buffering problem that could be fixed quickly without having to wait for that?
<jdstrand> ogra_: ack
<Guest25032> jjust listening iin first
<Guest25032> quit
<ogra_> asac, you would have to ask rsalveti (he worked on that) ... but he is out til monday ...
<Guest25032> does ubuntu SDK actually work properly with 14.04LTS?
<ogra_> it should, yes
<Guest25032> Hmmm... must be doing somehting wrong then.
<Guest25032> I was quite happy with Qt5 under 12.04LTS. Upgraded to 14.04LTS which gave me *heaps* more battery life (magic).
<Guest25032> Then got SDK iso Qtcreator, but toolchain doesnt autodetect. No Run or Debg avail for examples, etc.
<Guest25032> Have gcc 4 x64 installed, entire OS is pretty much as new.
<Guest25032> Cant find any other hints on what's missing / needs to be dropped in first.
<Guest25032> Any hints?
<Guest25032> (must be lunchtime - is quiet here)
<asac> tedg: good morning
<asac> tedg: let me know what you need to nail down the annoying gmail bug i have (think dbarth believes that its your url-dispatcher causing this)
<Guest25032> .
<asac> whats this SDK iso Qtcreator?
<asac> bzoltan: ^^
<asac> are we releasing a qtcreator optimized image now?
<asac> 13:58 < Guest25032> Then got SDK iso Qtcreator, but toolchain doesnt autodetect. No Run or Debg avail for examples, etc.
<asac> thats the context
<ogra_> asac, bzoltan is off today ...
<asac> ogra_: is mfrey off today? u remember?
 * asac remembers something, but might be a mix up
<ogra_> asac, yes
<mterry> seb128, do you have an ubuntu online week session for client-1410-unity8-desktop-iso ?
<seb128> mterry, no, but dholbach suggested we should have one
<mterry> seb128, so did kgunn  :)
<seb128> great
<mterry> seb128, I'm happy to help lead it / attend it
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<seb128> I need to get it on the schedule, I'm going to have a look to that in a bit
<ogra_> mterry, seemy my language settings were not picked up by the greeter wehn i upgraded from 64 to 71 today
<mterry> ogra_, ooh, interesting
<mterry> ogra_, we have code to support that
<ogra_> the session was fine but the greeter showed AM/PM time
<mterry> ogra_, we set LC_ALL to whatever is in your AccountsService FormatsLocale or some such
<ogra_> after switching the language settings to US ... rebooting, setting it back to german ... all was fine
<mterry> ogra_, maybe there's something else I have to do
<mterry> ogra_, oh odd
<mterry> ogra_, so it was only an upgrade issue?
<ogra_> it didnt pick it up on upgrade it seems
<mterry> ...  why on earth would that happen...
<ogra_> which was old greeter -> new greeter ... essentially
<mterry> AS values are kept
<ogra_> (FYI i just promoted image 71 ... so avengers now have the new greeter)
<mterry> I could *imagine* some bug around the lightdm HOME becoming persistent, but that shouldn't matter
<mterry> ogra_, oh yay
<dbarth> asac. tedg: on that issue, i have a patch that solves the problem, just inside webapp-container
<dbarth> asac. tedg: but now i'm fighting with some regressions in other webapps; still needs a bit more polishing
<tedg> dbarth, Sorry, I think I'm missing some context :-)
<tedg> dbarth, What's the issue?
<asac> tedg: read my ping earlier today. that was about bug:
<asac> tedg: https://bugs.launchpad.net/webapps-core/+bug/1324848
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1324848 in The Webapps-core project "[Gmail] can't switch to another account" [High,Confirmed]
<asac> tedg: you said you cant repro
<asac> check the dupe bug screenshot... thats 100%
<dbarth> tedg: an internal navigation request, that slips out, and which url-dispatcher can't handle
<dbarth> even if it's a valid http url
<dbarth> asac: the main issue is in webapp-container, and now fixed (modulo the regressions right now)
<dbarth> tedg: but you may want to add a test case for that type of URL, cause they seemed legit to me
<asac> yeah please add tests
<asac> dbarth: ok thanks. thougth maybe ted could make a cleaner fix is what the bug suggested
<asac> but if you feel its clearly webapp-container, thats cool too for me :)
<asac> please update bug and update tasks
<dbarth> asac: it's really down to how webapps manages popups
<dbarth> asac: which is still a bit of black art on the phone
<tedg> asac, So it's 100% repoducable when the DB gets in an errored state. The issue is getting it there.
<dbarth> (cause we don't really have popups there)
<tedg> It seems that a few of the integration tests are showing the recoverable error, so I plan on investigating it there.
<asac> tedg: ok dont know about your level, but if i use my gmail webapp it ALWAYS happens :)
<asac> you sy i have a local DB that causes this?
<tedg> asac, There's a URL dispatcher cache db. If you delete ~/.cache/url-dispatcher/urls-1.db and relogin it'll repair itself.
<tedg> Which is good/bad :-)
<asac> dbarth: tedg: anyway, dont need to be directly involved. if you need anyuthing let me know, otherwise, just update the bug with what you two agree
<asac> :)
<asac> tedg: so you say removing that file migh tworkaround?
<asac> thats cool. guess i will leave it in that state though so i can validate that your fix recovers this :)
<tedg> asac, Yeah, it'll rebuild itself on login.
<asac> tedg: what does that entry in the db do? precache IP resolution?
<asac> or which apps etc. to use?
<asac> guess the latter
<tedg> asac, which app, yeah
<asac> so we dont need to parse .desktop etc. all the time. ic
<asac> and to save user choice if we ever allow suers to choose which handler to use
<asac> ok got it :)
<tedg> We don't have the user choice feature yet, after RTM :-)
<tedg> dbarth, asac, just FYI, here's a test that reported that error: http://ci.ubuntu.com/smokeng/utopic/touch/mako/70:20140606:20140530/8429/calendar_app/
<asac> tedg: nice
<asac> tedg: not so nice that we ignore community app tests failing
<asac> and think its the app
<asac> popey: ^
<asac> :)
<asac> not sure if you can fix it. think helping us to move to same landing process with backout etc. as other apps it would help. plus one consolidated effort with bill and qa folks to get everything to green
<tedg> In this case I don't think it's reported as a failure.
<tedg> It's just an extra artifact in the test run.
<asac> tedg: are you affiliated with the indicators?
<asac> :)
<asac> tedg: the messaging indicator always seems to show blue even though all is cleared out
<asac> and then when i try to navigate there its not blue anymore
<asac> this feels new in 71
<asac> oh
<asac> its always blue on the greeter :)
<ogra_> your lightdm has a message ;)
<asac> ogra_: something i cannot read/see anywhere?
<ogra_> (thatrs a mterry thing ... and he is off today ... )
<asac> what could that be?
<asac> "CAPS LOCK ON" :)
<ogra_> you should not get messages for lightdm
<ogra_> lol
<tedg> It's probably not updating the accounts service data.
<ogra_> the user message queue should be routed through afaik
<tedg> I have a work item to look into that, but we're waiting on some updated designs.
<pmcgowan> there are two states, one in the greeter and one in the shell
<pmcgowan> known bug
<ogra_> right, there are four or five bugs open like that
<tedg> They should be coming today or early next week, then we can fix messaging menu in the greeter.
 * pmcgowan boots 71 :)
<mhall119> woohoo a new promoted image!
<popey> â»
<popey> knew you'd like that
<doflaherty> I haven't been able to start calendar-app on mako in a while - is there a known issue with this?
<ogra_> starts fine here
<doflaherty> it seems to get added to "Recent apps" but all I get is a white screen
<Tassadar> I get when I update apps which are open at the time
<Tassadar> like open clock -> update clock app from system settings -> clock app works fine -> close clock -> open clock
<Tassadar> and it won't open
<Tassadar> reboot fixes it though
<ogra_> Tassadar, thats definitely worth a bug (if there isnt one already)
<Tassadar> okay, which launchpad project does that belong to
<Tassadar> ?
<Tassadar> something click related, I guess
<Tassadar> probably related to bug #1232130
<ubot5> bug 1232130 in ubuntu-touch-meta (Ubuntu) "Uninstalling an app doesn't stop it" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1232130
<doflaherty> neither uninstalling/reinstalling nor rebooting seems to fix it
<ogra_> doflaherty, what image version is that ?
<doflaherty> I'm running the latest, r71, but I've had the problem for a while
<ogra_> weird, did you try uninstalling and reinstalling that app ?
<ogra_> perhaps that helps ...
<ogra_> also do you run devel-peoposed or devel ?
<ogra_> *proposed
<doflaherty> devel
<ogra_> proposed had some seriously broken images recently (like the last ten or so) ...
<doflaherty> tried uninstalling/reinstalling
<ogra_> didnt help ?
<doflaherty> nope
<ogra_> very stramge
<ogra_> *strange even
<doflaherty> it's the only one I'm having this issue with - all the other core apps seem to work
<asac> ogra_: so what was this with the YOUTUBE celebration i saw earlier?
<asac> ogra_: is that already in 71?
<ogra_> yep
<ogra_> go to m.youtube.com
<asac> for me youtube still stops when screen is off (well, first time it didnt stop, but guess its a bug)
<ogra_> you can now play videos
<asac> i can play videos, yes
<ogra_> no, thats expectede
<ogra_> right, you couldnt before
<ogra_> it would just reload the page
<asac> i know. didnt know what now improved :)
<ogra_> it plays :)
<asac> hmm... ok so became more reliable
<ogra_> no fullscreen yet and integrating the browser with media-hub seems to be very hard
<asac> ok thanks
<asac> ogra_: i dont even see a full screen button
<ogra_> and without media-hub stopping is expected
<ogra_> there is none yet
<asac> is that sure
<asac> err
<ogra_> "no fullscreen yet" :)
<asac> sure :)
<asac> ogra_: how dowes the website figure if there is a fullscreen button to be displayed?
<asac> is there a capability exported?
<asac> dbarth: ?
<ogra_> dunno ...
<ogra_> chrisccoulson, or dbarth should knwo though
<asac> righty
<asac> guess they might be gone already
<chrisccoulson> ogra_, asac, bug 1326852
<ubot5> bug 1326852 in Oxide 1.0 "missing controls on toolbar of youtube videos" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1326852
<asac> chrisccoulson: are you doing the media-hub integration?
<ogra_> chrisccoulson, uuh, why would you want play/pause
<asac> lol
<ogra_> the UI is way to small
<asac> i want voice control and mental instruction transfer technology :)
 * ogra_ just taps the screen 
<lotuspsychje> i tested dailymotion on ubuntu-touch on my n7 and works nicely
<ogra_> great
<lotuspsychje> also youtube webversion works and mobile version doesnt wanna play
<asac> chrisccoulson: when do you think will the code land?
<asac> in image?
<ogra_> which code ?
<asac> ogra_: that is fixed committed for the controls
<asac> see the bug
<ogra_> there is no fix
<asac> 17:52 < ubot5> bug 1326852 in Oxide 1.0 "missing controls on toolbar of youtube videos" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1326852
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1326852 in Oxide 1.0 "missing controls on toolbar of youtube videos" [Critical,Fix committed]
<dbarth> asac: not sure myself
<dbarth> about FS
<ogra_> it just refers to the code that landed today
<asac> ogra_: that bug status feels there is a fix released and a fix committed
<ogra_> hmm
<asac> i dont understand
<asac> the titlee says "missing controls" the status is fix released and fix committed :P
<asac> I assume we will get this whenever 1.0.2 gets released into our image
<dbarth> it's released on oxide trunk afaict
<ogra_> hmm, i see some scaling code looking at the branch
<ogra_> but nothing that talks about fullscreen
<dbarth> not in the image
<dbarth> the FS code itself has been in oxide for a while
<ogra_> ah
<asac> is it a split greeter regression that the notification to accept an alarm is hidden behind the greeter?
<asac> or is that old?
<ogra_> asac, new and tracked
<chrisccoulson> asac, soon ;) (for the image)
<chrisccoulson> just doing some other things atm
<asac> chrisccoulson: like fixing media-hub?
<asac> err oxide to use media-hub :P
<chrisccoulson> asac, bug 1249387 ;)
<ubot5> bug 1249387 in oxide-qt (Ubuntu Utopic) "hook Oxide into Ubuntu platform API for media-hub" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1249387
<asac> chrisccoulson: that is indeed the "other things" you referred to?
<asac> go go go
<asac> must be super trivial for you nowadays :P
<chrisccoulson> hah :)
<asac> so guess on wednesday i will have nice background playback :P
<ogra_> asac, huh, what ? wednesday ? why waste a workday !
<asac> ogra_: dunno. wanted to allow chrisccoulson to claim it was very hard and struggled till the end, but in reality he already has the code ready and takes 2 days off :)
<ogra_> haha
<ogra_> yeah, it might take 4 weeks til he can land it, who knows how the images look on monday
<jdstrand> I'm currently on r50 on devel. I see that r71 was promoted (yay!). will push notifications eventually tell me that I can update?
<robotfuel> tedg: ping, I've run in to this bug a lot last night with the monkey runner we are using to stress test the phone, are you someone who can triage the bug? or do you know who to ask? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/url-dispatcher/+bug/1327033
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1327033 in url-dispatcher (Ubuntu) "url-dispatcher-update-sqlite-fileupdate-error" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<tedg> robotfuel, First, it's not a crash, it's a recoverable error. The Monkey Runner should probably distinguish that.
<tedg> robotfuel, We added that error to track down another bug that's happening occasionally
<tedg> robotfuel, Let me find the bug.
<robotfuel> tedg: I am just looking for crash files, now I can have it look for more closely.
<tedg> robotfuel, https://bugs.launchpad.net/webapps-core/+bug/1324848
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1324848 in The Webapps-core project "[Gmail] can't switch to another account" [High,Confirmed]
<robotfuel> for *that
<tedg> robotfuel, They have a "ProblemType" field in them that describes what they are.
<robotfuel> tedg: okay have it skip those in my /etc/apport/crashdb.conf, thanks for the tip.
<tedg> robotfuel, Please still upload them though, just don't stop the runner based on them.
<robotfuel> tedg: oh we upload the results and then restart the test.
<robotfuel> tedg: it happens automatically...
<tedg> robotfuel, I thought the test went until something crashed?
<robotfuel> tedg: it goes until a crash file shows up. I can make look at the problem type as you say though. it's better to let the test continue to run on a recoverable error.
<xenos1984> hi all, i have a problem with ubuntu touch on a nexus 7. i used it already some months ago and it worked more or less with trusty. recently i updated to the newest trusty build and it was just hanging a bit after the unity desktop appeared. in this irc channel i got the advice to switch to the devel channel instead, and to do a full bootstrap. now i did that and installed the devel version (utopic i guess). however, now it does not
<xenos1984> boot at all and just hangs in the bootloader. recovery also does not boot and the device does not show up on adb devices. any ideas what could be wrong? the device was connected all the time during flashing. what should i do now to flash a new image?
<fishscene> Nexus 7 2003 edition?
<xenos1984> fishscene: yes
<fishscene> I had the older Nexus 7 model and sometimes it would get stuck. When that happened, I unplugged it, popped the back cover off and disconnected the battery. Waited a few seconds, then plugged everything back in and it would work properly for flashing
<fishscene> I'm not sure if that would help you, but it's worth a shot.
<xenos1984> fishscene: hm... i see, i guess i will try that (unless i find a different solution without some hardware manipulation)
<xenos1984> so what would happen if this works? does it boot into recovery again, or show up on adb devices?
<fishscene> It might show up in adb devices. Honestly, I don't recall what I did next as I haven't flashed mine since December. But I do remember mine wouldn't fully reboot/shutdown even when I told it to and it was in a similar state you are describing.
<fishscene> I would just try the normal full flash
<xenos1984> ah, i see - thanks, i'll give it a try (maybe after some further researching)
<fishscene> NP mate
<ahayzen> which project do i mark bugs with the infographics against? libusermetrics or unity8 or something else?
<xenos1984> fishscene: by the way, i got the nexus working again (even though not with ubuntu yet), at least it does not hang in the bootloader anymore - i just had to reinstall the recovery with fastboot flash recovery
<fishscene> ah. Excellent
<popey> ahayzen: unity8, Saviq will soon re-assign it ã
<popey> (j/k)
<ahayzen> popey, ah i put as libusermetrics lol.... shall i put both as it is todo with translations?
<ahayzen> popey, it'll probably get seen to quicker if i assign to unity8 as well ;) hehe
<popey> not sure who owns libusermetrics
<ahayzen> popey, https://bugs.launchpad.net/libusermetrics/+bug/1327419
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1327419 in libusermetrics "Infographic's language not updated until the metric value is changed" [Undecided,New]
<popey> ta
<Saviq> ahayzen, bear in mind the infographics system is completely reworked in https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/libusermetrics/file-based-infographics/+merge/214020 which will land soon
<Saviq> ahayzen, that isn't to say that this bug won't exist there (probably will, even more so, actually)
<ahayzen> Saviq, ah i see ... so where would you say this bug should go? https://bugs.launchpad.net/libusermetrics/+bug/1327419
<Saviq> ahayzen, I think it's fine there
<ahayzen> Saviq, cool :)
<cwayne> Saviq: is there any doc detailing the infographics rework?
 * cwayne is just curious as to what's changed, and what file-based-infographics means :)
<Saviq> cwayne, effectively data sources will write files, visualizers will read those and output SVGs
<cwayne> Saviq: so we'll support different visualizations? or still just the circles
<Saviq> cwayne, oh no, different ones
<Saviq> cwayne, and click-installable
<cwayne> oooh
<cwayne> fancy
 * cwayne is excited
<Saviq> cwayne, and they'll be able to aggregate data from different sources
<cwayne> Saviq: cool!
<cwayne> that sounds awesome
<popey> cwayne: uploaded a new set of "all the clicks" to people.canonical.com/
<popey> ~alan/clicks
<cwayne> awesome :)
#ubuntu-touch 2014-06-07
<JoshStrobl> Yo popey, when did you land the Youtube app?
<JoshStrobl> Just noticed it today, search for it a couple days back and there wasnt one :D
<JoshStrobl> ah, noticed that the videos now work as a result of image 71 being promoted. awesomeness. http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/touch-image-stats/70.changes
<xenos1984> hi everyone, does anyone have experience with (manually) installing multirom (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2011403) for building a dual-boot system with ubuntu touch and other linux flavors?
<Guest77830> hello
<Guest77830> any one help me to port ubuntu touch
<Guest77830> hello
<Ozziemoto> Hello is there any way to install this on windows.
<lotuspsychje> Ozziemoto: you mean as emulator?
<lotuspsychje> Ozziemoto: or install ubuntu-touch on windows phone device?
<mihailo> can i wrote here if i need help with installing touch on ''other'' device? :-)
<ogra_> popey, tried ubuntu-app-stop ?
<popey> DOH!
<ogra_> :)
<xenos1984> Tassadar: hey, would you mind helping me with some issue i have with (manually) installing multirom on a nexus 7? i flashed the multirom twrp recovery, but when i try to flash the multirom zip from recovery / install, it says "failed to unpack boot img"... any idea what could be wrong?
<Tassadar> what did you have flashed previously? like, android, some custom ROM or somethin else?
<xenos1984> in fact, ubuntu touch from the ubuntu installer tools
<Tassadar> multirom needs android as the primary ROM (the one which is installed on the device by default and will be there even if you'd remove multirom)
<Tassadar> ubuntu touch can only be installed as secondary ROM
<xenos1984> oh, i see, i guess then it won't work the way i planned... thanks for the clarification
<Tassadar> xenos1984: do you have adb installed? can you access the device via adb while it is in recovery?
<xenos1984> Tassadar: yes
<Tassadar> a log from the recovery after the failed installation might be useful, it should in theory work even with ubuntu now that I think about it
<Tassadar> okay, can you go to recovery, try to install the zip, and after it fails, do 'adb pull /tmp/recovery.log' on computer?
<Tassadar> and put that log on some pastebin or whatever
<xenos1984> oh, good, sure, i will do that
<xenos1984> Tassadar: http://pastebin.com/VQjHPw64
<Tassadar> that's weird, it fails to extract the boot.img completely Oo
<xenos1984> hm... i guess that should not happen... let me check the size of the zip, maybe it is corrupted
<Tassadar> can you make a backup of boot partition (just the boot, it's pretty small) and send it to me?
<Tassadar> it will be in /sdcard/TWRP/BACKUPS/*serial number*/boot.emmc.win
<xenos1984> ok, let me try
<Tassadar> */sdcard/TWRP/BACKUPS/*serial number*/*backup name*/boot.emmc.win
<xenos1984> so... that gives me some 8MB file, how should i send it to you?
<Tassadar> yeah, via dropbox or some other file sharing thingy
<xenos1984> ok, good
<Tassadar> (file sending via irc is kinda slow)
<xenos1984> Tassadar: this should work: http://88.196.237.131/boot.emmc.win
<xenos1984> so the boot.img is extracted from the boot partition? maybe it is corrupted, in fact i had some issues booting ubuntu lately... maybe i need to flash it again
<Tassadar> yeah...it seems to be too big
<Tassadar> it has 6.72MB kernel + 2.45MB ramdisk
<Tassadar> which is more than 8MB (the size of boot partition)
<Tassadar> did you modify the kernel?
<xenos1984> hm... i see...
<Tassadar> oh, did you flash multirom's kernel already?
<xenos1984> i used the standard ubuntu installer
<xenos1984> and then tried to flash multiboot
<xenos1984> it's possible that i also accidentally flashed the multirom kernel
<Tassadar> yeah...ubuntu won't work with it, because it is android kernel
<Tassadar> and since the ubuntu kernel isn't patched with kexec, it won't support all multirom's features
<Tassadar> so I think I'm gonna have to go back to "having ubuntu touch as primary ROM is not supported", sorry :/
<xenos1984> ah, i see... so which features would be missing?
<Tassadar> the patch is needed to boot other kernels
<Tassadar> so all the systems would have the same kernel, the one from ubuntu
<Tassadar> and android ROMs won't work with it
<xenos1984> ah... ok, i see, too bad... i was hoping to get archlinux running somehow, but it seems that this is not so easy with (or even without) multiboot and ubuntu as primary...
<xenos1984> i guess then i have to find some other solution, but anyway, thanks for your help!
<popey> ogra_: seen this? https://github.com/kulve/tegra-ubuntu
<popey> ubuntu tv revivied ã
<ogra_> haha
<gregor3005> hi, i get a hint to ubuntu-touch seconds before in the main #ubuntu channel. i read the official page first but beside i have a important question. is it possible to install eclipse on ubuntu-touch and develope java application on a tablet :-) ?
<popey> gregor3005: we don't ship java by default on ubuntu for devices
<gregor3005> popey: how can i imagine ubuntu-touch? will it be a fully ubuntu on a tablet, with the full shell so i can compile any software that i need when have the source?
<popey> gregor3005: not quite, apps will need to be ported to run on mir
<gregor3005> popey: the nexus 10 device looks good for that + i found also cyanogenmod for it
<popey> and they may need to be tweaked for a touch UI
<popey> rather than a keyboard / mouse
<gregor3005> popey: i will also attach a keyboard, developing with a touch-keyboard sound horrible :-)
<gregor3005> popey: the idea why i want to do this. i have a good old laptop which i use very often but the battery holds only 25 minuten (in good cases). yesterday i looked for a new device but they are very expensive. then i thought for my needs a tablet would be enough but i need to develop sometimes when i'm around
<gregor3005> popey: worst alternative case will be a macbook but i love linux. so spend 900â¬ for a macbook and install linux on this sound not like a good idea :-D
<ankoh> oups wrong button sry for notice :D
<lotuspsychje> popey: nice work on the youtube app :p
<popey> hah
<lotuspsychje> i have to enable web version because mobile version doesnt work
<lotuspsychje> but its the same with youtube on webbrowser-app
<popey> yeah. i just threw the webapp together when i saw that yt worked on device now
<lotuspsychje> dailymotion worked also nice on my n7
<popey> oh nice
<lotuspsychje> so with the youtube and outlook app, it starts to get complete on touch :p
<popey> getting there
<popey> daker / jdstrand fyi bug 1327573
<ubot5> bug 1327573 in qtwebkit-opensource-src (Ubuntu) "QtWebProcess crash on #73 flo running baboom" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1327573
<daker> popey: is it related to the app ?
<popey> i get an apparmor crash when running it
<popey> sorry, apparmor denial, and a qt crash
<popey> dunno if it's a problem with the webapp profile, or apparmor or the app
<popey> just filing it and letting you know â»
<popey> uhoh
<daker> ok
<daker> i'll update the app to use the new webapp-container
<popey> also. [Sat Jun  7 16:01:23 2014] type=1400 audit(1402156885.059:681): apparmor="DENIED" operation="mkdir" parent=1253 profile="com.ubuntu.developer.daker.x-type_x-type_0.4" name=2F686F6D652F706861626C65742F2E6C6F63616C2F73686172652F51742050726F6A6563742F pid=16032 comm="qmlscene" requested_mask="c" denied_mask="c" fsuid=32011 ouid=32011
<popey> and steel story
<daker> hm :(
<daker> popey: where can i find the list of frameworks ?
<popey> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Click/Frameworks
<daker> popey: WARNING:root:Ignoring missing framework "ubuntu-sdk-14.04-html"
<jdstrand> popey: fyi- $ aa-decode 2F686F6D652F706861626C65742F2E6C6F63616C2F73686172652F51742050726F6A6563742F
<jdstrand> Decoded: /home/phablet/.local/share/Qt Project/
<jdstrand> popey: something is not setting the qml applicationName correctly and so it is using the default shared directory, .local/share/Qt Project
<jdstrand> (which isn't allowed)
<jdstrand> daker: the framework definitions are stored in /usr/share/click/frameworks
<jdstrand> daker: note that your development box and the device may have different installed frameworks
<daker> jdstrand: i see
<popey> jdstrand: cunning!
<daker> popey: i have submitted two updates
<popey> kk
<popey> will review in a bit, in the middle of running every single app on my phone :D
<daker> baboom & steel story
<daker> ok
<popey> have run have run 240 so far, another 70 or so to go
<popey> only 6 crashers so far
<cwayne> popey: hey, im having trouble launching 'shorts', have you seen that at all?
<popey> cwayne: no
<ogra_> bah, battery time is really gotten bad
<cwayne> hm, i wonder if its just the mae image
<ogra_> cwayne, what are you basing on ?
<cwayne> 58
<ogra_> anything before 70 was trash
<popey> 71 is *awesome*
<popey> IMHO
<ogra_> trouble started with 59 ... iirc
<cwayne> but split greeter breaks n7 in landscape
<cwayne> yeah, 58 was last one before split greeter ogra_
<cwayne> i wish i could use 71, but no dice
<ogra_> popey, i had the network indicator crash multiple times today ... and battery life degraded a lot
<ogra_> and while testing a bunch of new games for packaging i nearly burned my fingers ...
<popey> I have had no crashes today
<ogra_> i went shopping and when i returned the indicator was gone
<ogra_> took three reboots to get it back
<popey> one thing I have noticed is that it hangs onto far away access points more, in recent images
<ogra_> and with the new tech. design it also removes your wlan settings in the settings app now :(
<popey> even on a clean boot it chooses the one at the other end of the house, not the one next to me
<popey> wat!
<ogra_> it feeds the info int the app nowadays
<ogra_> so if it crashes ... no info
<ogra_> and thus no settings
 * ogra_ tried out a bunch of wbgl games today ... all flickery :(
<ogra_> *webgl
<popey> i tested every single app in the store today â»
<popey> only 7 bugs filed
<daker> popey: do you know why i can't uninstall some apps ?
<daker> they only have an "open" button and no sign of a comment form
<popey> daker: rm /home/phablet/.local/share/applications/*.desktop
<popey> then reboot
<popey> (on the device)
<ahayzen> popey, will people running on the devel branch have to run that to 'fix' the issue or is it just an issue that was introduced when running devel-proposed?
<popey> only people who went through the broken ones
<popey> if you went 50->71 you're okay
<daker> popey: ok
<ahayzen> popey, ah cool just wanted to check ;)
#ubuntu-touch 2014-06-08
<popey> jdstrand: might wanna check blabble on qt5.3 - for me I saw splash screen but not the gane
<popey> oh, actually qmlscene crach
<popey> bug 1327667
<ubot5> bug 1327667 in qtchooser (Ubuntu) "blabble + qt5.3 on flo #73 crash" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1327667
<IanWizard-Cloud> Do we know when the Aquarius image will be coming along?
<lotuspsychje> IanWizard-Cloud: did you hear something about it maybe?
<IanWizard-Cloud> lotuspsychje: I did not.  I've not been following Ubuntu touch much beyond what omgubuntu tells me.
<lotuspsychje> IanWizard-Cloud: same here, following omgubuntu's news last we hear is this fall meizu and aquarius rlease right?
<lotuspsychje> IanWizard-Cloud: im sure ubuntu-touch will change real fast after they release :p
<IanWizard-Cloud> But now my phone's on it's way out, and I'm likely to get the Aquarius E5 to replace it.  Because, honestly, I'd rather have Ubu on slightly outdate hardware, than have to deal with android any longer.
<lotuspsychje> IanWizard-Cloud: what device you testing right now?
<lotuspsychje> same idea here mate
<lotuspsychje> using nexus7 2013 wifi myself right now
<lotuspsychje> with ubuntu-touch
<IanWizard-Cloud> lotuspsychje: none.  I've yet to actually use it.  I was on the Evo LTE, but it (like many devices), only ever got one build, which didn't even work.
<lotuspsychje> for now, nexus devices work best i think
<lotuspsychje> i hear some guys can run on nexus5 also
<lotuspsychje> im curious about new nexus8 comming up aswell
<IanWizard-Cloud> Yeah, I saw somewhere that it's running rather well on the N5
<lotuspsychje> me too lost android once and for good
<lotuspsychje> i hate its security
<lotuspsychje> rather have touch dev on it until final release
<IanWizard-Cloud> But I'll probably end up getting the BQ and just sitting with CM on it until an ubu image comes along.
<IanWizard-Cloud> I choose to not get into building anything anymore.
<lotuspsychje> you want oem device working right away so?
<IanWizard-Cloud> I know a lot of guys who are really deep in android, but I chose to stop and spend my time other ways.
<lotuspsychje> agree on that one
<lotuspsychje> android is bad
<IanWizard-Cloud> I rather hate that it's build system has spread so much.
<IanWizard-Cloud> I hear it's good, but it seems like a mess to me, last I dealt with it.
<lotuspsychje> hp and system76 comming with desktop/laptops oem also
<lotuspsychje> ubuntu is spreading worldwide :p
<lotuspsychje> but channel=devel working nicely already on my n7
<IanWizard-Cloud> see, if I get a tablet, I'm going to have a full desktop on it.
<IanWizard-Cloud> Either it's a phone... or a computer.
<lotuspsychje> with ubuntu?
<IanWizard-Cloud> lotuspsychje: yeah.
<pinPoint> is ubuntu touch active currently?
<pinPoint> for nexus 5
<lotuspsychje> i hear users running touch on nexus5 yes
<lotuspsychje> !devices
<ubot5> You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<pinPoint> i see, sound not working well
<lotuspsychje> i have nexus7 and works pretty nicely
<pinPoint> man ubuntu has just dropped it all
<pinPoint> edge is gone too?
<lotuspsychje> edge phone didnt have users enough to pay
<lotuspsychje> so they dropped the project and repayed everyone
<pinPoint> darn!
<lotuspsychje> but later this year 2 ubuntu phones comming up
<lotuspsychje> aquarius and meizu
<pinPoint> details anywhere on the web?
<lotuspsychje> sure
<lotuspsychje> follow the news on OMGubuntu
<lotuspsychje> XDA forums are nice aswell to see devices
<raj> nice to see there's a channel for this!
<lotuspsychje> !devices
<ubot5> You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<lotuspsychje> look at the list for your device
<raj> ya, I saw the thin list
<lotuspsychje> kk
<raj> my phone is unfortunately not on there
<lotuspsychje> wich phone is that?
<raj> my phone--> https://www.google.com/shopping/product/12781061263377246853?sourceid=chrome-psyapi2&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8&q=galaxy+s+relay+4g&sa=X&ei=TRCUU4N2y-WwBMyogZgP&ved=0CN8EELkk
<lotuspsychje> raj: maybe try the >XDA forum to check if your device is listed
<raj> listed where?
<lotuspsychje> XDA forum
<raj> yes, obviously, where in though?
<lotuspsychje> not sure, search samsung thread maybe
<raj> In general, yes, XDA does talk about my device
<raj> http://forum.xda-developers.com/galaxy-s-relay-4g
<didrod> bonjour
<lotuspsychje> bonjour
<lotuspsychje> cava
<didrod> salut lotuspsychje oui plutÃ´t pas mal
<didrod> et toi ?
<lotuspsychje> sa marche merci
<didrod> je me demandais si je trouverais des franÃ§ais ici ^
<didrod> sa tombe plutÃ´t bien du coup
<lotuspsychje> ta un probleme avec touch?
<didrod> lotuspsychje, je voudrais mettre ubuntu touch sur un xperia x10i
<lotuspsychje> !devices | didrod
<ubot5> didrod: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<didrod> y a moyen de rÃ©cuperer les bin dans un zip que j'ai trouvÃ© sur le web
<raj> this is #ubuntu-touch, not #ubuntu-touche
<lotuspsychje> regarde la liste si ton device et la
<didrod> mais j'ai du mal Ã  comprendre comment "build" un ubuntu touch pour mon smartphone
<didrod> non il n'y est pas dÃ©jÃ  chercher
<lotuspsychje> pour maintenant seulement les nexus marche bien avec ubuntutouch
<lotuspsychje> mais plus tard l'annee 2 telephone avec touch vont etre vendu
<lotuspsychje> aquarius et meizu
<didrod> le meizu et
<didrod> ouais j'ai lu Ã§a
<didrod> mais j'aime bien bidouiller un peu
<didrod> c'est du tout cuit et sa serait presque tentant mais trop simple
<lotuspsychje> essayer le forum XDA peut-etre
<didrod> :p
<didrod> lotuspsychje, tu serais pas comment m'expliquer un peu plus clairement comment build ubuntu pour mon smartphone ?
<lotuspsychje> non je suis pas tres specialiste pour sa
<lotuspsychje> jai installer ubuntu-touch sur mon nexus7
<lotuspsychje> avec channel=devel
<lotuspsychje> et sa marche plus tot bien
<didrod> hummm... ok dommage
<lotuspsychje> mais pour xperia, sa va etre difficile
<lotuspsychje> pour linstant
<lotuspsychje> quand ubuntu-touch devient stabile, peut etre sa marchera
<didrod> humm pourtant ca avait l'air d'Ãªtre simple
<lotuspsychje> pour les nexus oui
<lotuspsychje> cest plus tot facile pour installer
 * IanWizard-Cloud feels so mono-lingual right now...
<lotuspsychje> IanWizard-Cloud: lol :p
<didrod> si j'ai compris les grandes lignes, il faut possÃ¨der ubuntu dÃ©jÃ  sur son pc, installer une flopper de soft tools et possÃ¨der les binaire de fonctionnement du matos du tel
<didrod> rÃ©cupÃ©rable dans une rom
<didrod> le seul rÃ©el soucis sa serait la ram qui est de 384mo
<lotuspsychje> essayer lubuntu alors
<lotuspsychje> cest leger
<didrod> lubuntu en version touch ?
<lotuspsychje> non pour ton pc
<lotuspsychje> ou cest le ram de xperia?
<didrod> la ram du xperia
<lotuspsychje> ah kk
<lotuspsychje> regarde sur la forum XDA
<lotuspsychje> si xperia sa marche
<lotuspsychje> ou youtube xperia ubuntu-touch
<didrod> y a le xperia x10 mini et mini pro
<didrod> qui est installable
<lotuspsychje> okay
<lotuspsychje> essaye toujour :p
<didrod> dommage que la page portable soit qu'en anglais
<didrod> la barriÃ¨re de la langue m'empeche de comprendre comment faire exactement
<didrod> portage*
<lotuspsychje> tradui en google
<lotuspsychje> bon je vais dejeuner
<lotuspsychje> a plus tard
<lotuspsychje> ; )
<didrod> +
<danielbeck> hello! I would like to test an application with the ubuntu touch emulator. I would like to install and start the application from the command line, since the ubuntu touch emulator does not work well for me (the screen stays black)
<danielbeck> I copied the click file and installed it with pkcon.
<danielbeck> Now would like to start the application.
<danielbeck> I wanted to ask how to do it.
<danielbeck> (The application itself is listed  as installed with the ID com.ubuntu.developer.danielbeck.greenmahjong	 when I type "click list"
<Tom321> hello can someone compile an qt app for ubuntu touch for me ?
<daker> popey: do you remember who was facing the "http://cookies" bug ?
<daker> and if there is bug report for it ?
<daker> bug 1327761
<ubot5> bug 1327761 in qtcreator-plugin-ubuntu "Creating a webapp using the default template always launche http://cookies" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1327761
<Elleo> mhall119: sorry, I'm not going to be able to make it to the gamedev slot on tuesday as I have an evening class I have to leave for around that time; but I'll try and leave ken with a video of some cool stuff he can demo if he likes
<mhall119> Elleo: we can reschedule it if that would mean you can attend with ken
<Elleo> mhall119: if it wouldn't put anyone out, that'd be good
<Elleo> mhall119: I'm free anytime from 3pm UTC onwards on wednesday, bit busy thursday evening but could probably just about squeeze in some time between 3pm and 5pm
<mhall119> Elleo: moved it to 1600 UTC on wednesday then
<Elleo> mhall119: awesome, thanks
<mhall119> np
<andytt> hi, someone use apple magic trackpad on ubuntu gnome? My cursor freeze whenever i use three or more fingers touch
<lotuspsychje> andytt: this is a question for #ubuntu
<andytt> oops, i m sorry..
<dejanmne> hello people
<dejanmne> is someone here
<krabador> dejanmne, the better thing is to ask directly, then if someone knows or wants
<dejanmne> ok,sry
<dejanmne> i want to ask About Alcatel Ot 995 hd is there version for install
<dejanmne> and how to install
<wilee-nilee> dejanmne, The links in the header lead to supported devices as of now I believe.
<dejanmne> Alcatel One Touch 995 cocktail WIP WIP WIP ~fonix232
<wilee-nilee> dejanmne, yeah look it up in the links, I doubt officially supported though.
<wilee-nilee> does not mean you can't try and maybe get it going, Touch is still quite rough is all.
<wilee-nilee> not a beginners paradise
<dejanmne> ok.tnx for help
<dejanmne> i will wait for all stable
<cpyarger> Has anyone gotten cellular radio working on toro/tuna
<cpyarger> if not, Where would I start looking learn to fix it myself?
<krabador> cpyarger, you must run in debug mode
<krabador> and send debug files, at ofono devs
<cpyarger> I have done almost no device development, What file should i change to start in debug mode.
<cpyarger> krabador, Who is an ofono dev i should talk to?
<cpyarger> krabador,  My debug file for ofono is at http://paste.ubuntu.com/7615398/
<krabador> cpyarger, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Avengers
<krabador> cpyarger, great, i think that if you send it to ofono devs, they can tell you something abount
<krabador> about
<krabador> rsalveti, are you here?
<cpyarger> krabador, Thanks
<krabador> nope
<krabador> :D
<cpyarger> Probably a stupid question, But are there any good reasons not to use apt to upgrade the system?
#ubuntu-touch 2015-06-01
<zombienerd> Hello all, has anyone figured out a workaround yet for tethering on Mako?
<zombienerd> I'm also having an issue where my alarms are going off 8 hours late :)
<zombienerd> Quiet bunch :)
<TheTacoSloberer> hello!
<TheTacoSloberer> I had a question for anyone here
<TheTacoSloberer> is anyone here?
<zombienerd> Anyone around?
<zombienerd> Has anyone figured out a workaround yet for tethering on Mako?
<zombienerd> I'm also having an issue where my alarms are going off 8 hours late :)
<sturmflut2> Good morning
<dholbach> good morning
<sturmflut2> dholbach: morning!
<dholbach> hi sturmflut2
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, good morning! have you seen my comments on https://code.launchpad.net/~uriboni/webbrowser-app/find-in-page/+merge/258225 ?
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: not yet, was focusing on the auth
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: will look soon
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy Say Something Nice Day! ð
<davidcalle> sil2100, ping
<sil2100> davidcalle: pong
<sil2100> o/
<davidcalle> sil2100, hey :) Is there a list somewhere of what's special in the new ubuntu-touch/*/ubuntu-developer channel?
<davidcalle> (If it's been announced, I've missed it)
<sil2100> davidcalle: hey! Yeah, let me fetch the link
<sil2100> davidcalle: https://developer.ubuntu.com/start/ubuntu-for-devices/image-channels/
<davidcalle> sil2100, I've looked there, but I don't see any more info than "Channel with a developer-oriented custom tarball, including extra payload useful for app-developers"
<davidcalle> I'm wondering what the "extra payload" is
<sil2100> davidcalle: aah, sorry, mis-read your question ;)
<sil2100> davidcalle: so, it doesn't seem to be written down anywhere, the best person to ask would be john-mcaleely
<davidcalle> sil2100, ok, thanks :)
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: pushed changes you requested to the find in page MR
<dadexix86> Hello everybody! just a quick question. I received a call from a number that was not in my contact list and now I want to add it, but I cannot find a way to do it. How do I do it?
<dadexix86> bq device, r22
<dadexix86> found it! I always forget to click the icons when I try to do stuff -.-
<popey> heh
<john-mcaleely> davidcalle, I don't think you missed an announcement. I'm just chasing what happened there
<john-mcaleely> davidcalle, but broadly it's just some pre-installed apps from the store that developers might use - logviewer, for example
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, thanks
<davidcalle> john-mcaleely, oh right, makes sense, thanks! I'm about to boot the devel-proposed image with it on mako (*try* to boot :) )
<zyga> bzoltan: hey, I have a question about the 14.04-based UITK
<zyga> bzoltan: who's doing that work, I've started to work on that too and I'd like to cooperate
<zyga> bzoltan: or at least learn the approach, I've started with a debian package that targets /opt/zyga/ based on current qt packages from wily
<bzoltan> zyga:  we are working on this topic just right now
<bzoltan> zyga:  we have reached to the point that we have the latest UITK release built for 14.04  and it is fully functional on 14.04. Now we need to figure out about the packaging ...
<zyga> bzoltan: how can I help"
<zyga> bzoltan: how can I test it?
<zyga> bzoltan: (and you did much better than I did :)
<MiW> im loving my Aquaris E4.5 and Ubuntu touch
<MiW> do you know how refreshing it is to find a consumer product that ships with sudo, openssh. user has root?
<MiW> this never happens in 2010s
<sturmflut2> MiW: :)
<MiW> im suprised there is no git package yet but this and lots of other bins have built on the phone no problems
<MiW> nmap works...
<MiW> was doing pcap on the 3g interfaces and sending raw pcap over ssh...
<MiW> its just about the best mobile OS i have ever used.
<MiW> does anyone know about getting X to work? i totally broke mir when i enabled the 1
<MiW> ubuntu-desktop-mir package
<MiW> xmir package installed
<Walex2> MiW: what do you mean with "getting X to work"? I am not sure you got the message :-)
<MiW> haha
<MiW> I want to display things that talk X on my phone
<MiW> the nested xmir should allow this?
<bzoltan> zyga:  so the idea is that we pull the upstream Qt, patch it with the feedback, pim and UITK modules. Then we clone the qtbase debian infrastructure, fix the .install and create a monstre package of it.
<bzoltan> zyga:  I am going to finish the script to do the prototype and share it with you soon.
<sturmflut2> Is it 4 PM already?
<jgdx> no 3pm
<svij> depends on your timezone.
<jgdx> what?
<svij> if its 3 or 4pm :P
<jgdx> a sophist eh?
<svij> sometimes. :)
<zyga> bzoltan: thanks, I can improve and test it
<zyga> bzoltan: I have time to work on this during this week so please use me if you can
<sturmflut2> jgdx: I never noticed that we are in the same timezone
<sturmflut2> Hurra!
<jgdx> this changes everything
<jgdx> :P
 * svij waits another 1,5h
<sturmflut2> Haha
<bzoltan> zyga: fantastic! Thank you
<brunch875> I'm starting to wonder if it was a good idea to strip all the buttons from the phone
<brunch875> some function keys could be really handy
 * sturmflut2 is going home to listen to the secret internet communication from a well-known Lunix distributor
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: is it normal that CI fails on the find in page MR because it can not find oxide 1.8 ?
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, yes, oxide 1.8 hasnât been released yet
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: so new APIs that i am adding for basic auth should go in 1.8 still or 1.9 ?
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, 1.9
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, 1.8 has been branched, itâs only accepting bug fixes now until it is released (in about 3 weeks from now)
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: got it. thanks for the clarification
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, I commented on https://code.launchpad.net/~uriboni/webbrowser-app/find-in-page/+merge/258225
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: fixed
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, thanks, can you revert revision 1014 ?
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: done
<oSoMoN> thx
<pitti> awe: hey Tony, how are you?
<pitti> awe: would you mind commenting on bug 1459983? this seems quite unexpected to me
<ubot5> bug 1459983 in ofono (Ubuntu) "latest version obfuscates data in test scripts" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1459983
<awe> pitti, !@#%
<pitti> awe: bless you :)
<awe> yea, that's my fault...
<awe> I did this because I got tired of warning end-users to remove private data from list-modems output when working on bugs
<awe> there's a new command-line arg ( -p, --priv ) which will output the properties un-obfuscated
<pitti> awe: right, but that's not compatible with upstream/other distros
<awe> understood, but I chose to err on the side of the end-user, not upstream
<pitti> awe: I'm moving away the dbusmock tests from verifying these properties, but it was still strange as these are mostly for testing
<awe> pitti, list-modem gets used quite a bit for bug work
<pitti> awe: isn't that something the apport hook should take care of? (obfuscation, I mean)
<awe> maybe, except apport gets rarely used for bugs on the phone
<awe> pitti, I can change it ( ie. reverse the meaning of -p ) if you think this really was a bad idea on my part
<awe> again, I was looking at this from the point of the end-user/customer, not upstream and/or test scripts that use also use these scripts
<pitti> awe: well, your call; I'm mostly concerned as this breaks existing behaviour, and such obfuscation should rather go into some "ofono-bug-info" script
<jgdx> couldn't dbusmock use dbus?
<pitti> awe: I at least wanted to quicly discuss it and udnerstand why it was done
<pitti> awe: fine for me if you close it as wontfix/opinion, but there was no justification in the changelog, so I wanted to ask :)
<awe> pitti, np; let me give it some thought...  so I assume we have a bunch of tests failing now?
<pitti> awe: so far python-dbusmock (fixed in trunk, as above); I don't know of others, the ofono upload didn't trigger a lot of them
<awe> pitti, I'm going to revert the change... ( and invert the meaning of -p/--priv )
<pitti> awe: okay, thanks!
<pitti> Laney: ^ FYI (as we talked about it last week)
<SturmFlut> popey, dholbach: Ping
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: issues fixed in keyboard navigation branch. please see notes
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, thanks, will do a second pass soon
<dholbach> SturmFlut, pong
<popey> SturmFlut: yo
<SturmFlut> dholbach: I think it solved itself, sorry
<popey> \o/
<SturmFlut> popey: ^^
<dholbach> ok, no worries :)
<svij> 2minutes leftâ¦ *wait*
<SturmFlut> \o/
<SturmFlut> #ItFinallyIs4pmInBritain
<dkessel> i hope you guys will post everything on g+ or write it here :)
<ogra_> yeah, the brits ... always behind the times :P
<SturmFlut> dkessel: I already posted the most important things
<SturmFlut> "The next #ubuntuphone codenames after krillin, vegeta and arale will be monkey, akira and chibiusa."
<SturmFlut> Totally true
<dkessel> sure :)
<dkessel> i want release dates, which device(s) will feature convergence, and where to get it :)
<ogra_> dkessel, 16.04 is the release date for convergence
<dkessel> ogra_: fine, but on which device(s) will it be possible?
<ogra_> (anything before that will be some kind of preview)
<ogra_> i doubt you will see it on any of the devices being sold currently
<svij> E5 is now official
<SturmFlut> Okay, the bq E5 is official
<svij> SturmFlut: youre slow
<svij> :P
<ogra_> lol
<dkessel> :D
<SturmFlut> svij: You and your VDSL
<svij> SturmFlut: :D
<dobey> is vdsl fast?
<SturmFlut> dobey: Compared to pigeons, yes
<ogra_> dobey, fastest you can get over here
<dobey> oh
<svij> 100mbit/s yes.
<ogra_> 50MBit ...
<SturmFlut> E5 sale on tuesday morning
<ogra_> some providers offer "up to" 100
<SturmFlut> No flash sale
<dobey> so not that fast :)
<ogra_> no, not fast, but the fastest you can get :)
<rpadovani> I'm not able to join the hangout because it says it's ful :/
<SturmFlut> rpadovani: Oh crap
<ogra_> popey, ^^^
<SturmFlut> Convergent device later in the year
<svij> from bq
<ogra_> riht
<ogra_> +g
<SturmFlut> "Meizu is on a similar path"
<dkessel> hmm
<ogra_> dkessel, that will be the device to get the actual convergence then
<dkessel> ogra_: i guess i will wait for that then.
<ogra_> (being powerfulk enough and all)
<SturmFlut> MX4 for 299.99 â¬ in Europe, third week of june
<svij> E5 for 199,99â¬
<popey> ogra_: nothing to do with me
<ogra_> ah, k
<rpadovani> I cannot believe I can't follow the hangout. It's annoying
<ogra_> i thought you were the hangout master there :)
<popey> nope.
<popey> I know less than most
<SturmFlut> The Convergence device a "brand new, high-end model" that bq will also launch on Android
<popey> ooh
<dkessel> where do i have to put my money for that? ;)
 * ogra_ opens his wallet
<ogra_> put it here :)
<nik90> wow cant believe all ubuntu phone insiders will get a Meizu MX4 device!
<SturmFlut> They don't have any news on a device for the US market
<SturmFlut> The decision to release an E5 Ubuntu Edition was only made a few weeks after the E4.5 was sold
<mpt> jgdx, abeato: Hi, is there anywhere I can find a definition of what a âcontextâ is?
<SturmFlut> The MX4 will be sold online and internationally, directly from Meizu
<SturmFlut> But there are only a few hundred "invites" a day
<ogra_> or ebay shops :P
<Laney> pitti: thanks!
<abeato> mpt, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GPRS_core_network#PDP_context
<SturmFlut> Jono Bacon asks about customer feedback to the "Scopes story"
<nik90> the meizu website will show a interactive origami wall slide...which will include a couple 100 invites randomly per day...you click on slides which give info about the UT..and on random slides that you click you will be invited to buy the device
<SturmFlut> "Scopes navigation can be confusing, needs work"
<mpt> abeato, yikwa
<mpt> Yikes, even
<mpt> I think jgdx was using the word in a different sense from that article
<abeato> mpt, I would define it as a tunnel so you can reach a data network on top of cellular radio
<SturmFlut> Insiders will get their MX4 phones "soon", might ship next week
<abeato> mpt, does that make sense?
<jgdx> mpt, sorry, I meant the configuration, sorry
<jgdx> doubly sorry
<mpt> abeato, so at any time, do you have one context for Internet, one context for MMS, and possibly one context for LTE?
<mpt> A context is the thing you communicate to an APN with?
<mpt> jgdx, ah, ok
<abeato> mpt, the APN identifies the type (from the operator pov) of context you want to create
<abeato> mpt, these context can be just for internet, just for mms, or for both things at the same time
<abeato> mpt, and yes, for VoLTE too
<abeato> (voice over LTE)
<mpt> Oh, so *that*âs why LTE sometimes has its own APN settings
<mpt> I was wondering why it was ever separate from Internet
<seb128> mpt, hey, is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/telephony-service/+bug/1384274 right? (silent mode should silent dialer keypad sounds right?)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1384274 in telephony-service (Ubuntu) "silent mode doesn't silence keyboard or dialpad" [High,In progress]
<abeato> LTE is special because it is an all-data technology
<SturmFlut> I asked if Canonical is working on more "big" native apps like Telegram. Answer: they are focusing on scopes for their partners, and try to build frameworks which makes it easy for companies like WhatsApp and DropBox to port their stuff
<mpt> seb128, yep
<seb128> mpt, thanks
<SturmFlut> They are not working on anything big like Telegram themselves
<abeato> you need an APN even to register, that's the LTE APN... but usually you do not really need to care about configuring it, the modem is able to handle that
<mpt> seb128, I still think our audio APIs should be of the form PlaySoundEvenInSilentMode() and PlaySoundExceptInSilentMode() â¦ That would force developers to think about when their sound is appropriate :-)
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> do we have a design/details of what silent mode should impact or not?
<SturmFlut> Canonical will not provide their own services like with Ubuntu One before, they rely on third parties to make their services available on Ubuntu frameworks
<mpt> seb128, I made a brief definition in <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Sound#silent-mode>
<seb128> mpt, thanks
<SturmFlut> There will not be official support for Android Apps on Ubuntu
<popey> SturmFlut: interesting
<SturmFlut> "We have three operators who are working with us" -> I know about China Mobile, but who are the others?
<SturmFlut> Oh, they can't tell us :/
<SturmFlut> They had "several thousand" people participating in developer programs in China
<SturmFlut> There is only one app store for the whole world, but operators and manufacturers can add their own content to the infrastructure, and apps can be restricted to certain regions
<SturmFlut> @bqreaders just tweeted that the E5 will NOT go on sale on tuesday <- Slight confusion
<svij> tuesday next week :)
<SturmFlut> svij: Audio quality was bad at that moment
<svij> SturmFlut: yep
<SturmFlut> "Scope tagging" will be introduced: The developer can add keywords to a scope, then an Aggregator scope will aggregate from all scopes which match its own keywords
<SturmFlut> Comes with the next OTA
<SturmFlut> I think all the OTA-4 changes are already public, right?
<svij> SturmFlut: think so
<SturmFlut> OTAs are planned to be monthly
<SturmFlut> Performance and power management improvements will keep coming
<SturmFlut> The Calendar App and Dekko apparently get some UI love, mostly to prepare them for Convergence
<popey> True! :D
<SturmFlut> The "Welcome" screen gets updated to make it easier for users from other platforms
<SturmFlut> Scopes get more personalisation features
<SturmFlut> Setting up online accounts will get easier
<SturmFlut> Lots of work on calendar and contact syncing
<SturmFlut> Keyboards are being improved, adding your own keyboard layout will be easier
<SturmFlut> Better media handling, playlists are supposed to work across apps and scopes, music controls in the indicators
<SturmFlut> Better streaming in the webbrowser
<SturmFlut> Scopes in general will get a lot of love: Post comments/share content/flag content on social media from within scopes
<SturmFlut> Inline playing of video and audio
<SturmFlut> Better search functions everywhere, e.g. limit search results to a specific range in the "NearBy" scope
<SturmFlut> More customisation, e.g. the order of items in the "Today" scopes
<SturmFlut> Users will be able to just set up their own Aggregator scopes
<SturmFlut> (will this list ever end?) ;)
<nik90> ;)
<BOHverkill> who knows ;)
<popey> hah
<SturmFlut> WiFi Hotspot in the next OTA
<popey> oooh!
<svij> yay
<SturmFlut> The Camera app will get much more features, e.g. filters (if I got it right, bad audio)
<svij> SturmFlut: you got it right
<SturmFlut> A new OTA roughly at the end of every month
<SturmFlut> "I believe FM radio is being worked on"
<SturmFlut> Okay, since the Hangout was full they'll apparently do another one
<dholbach> rpadovani, ^
<SturmFlut> Hangout over :)
<SturmFlut> dholbach, rpadovani: At least that's what I understood at the end
<SturmFlut> rpadovani: You got mail
<faenil> is there a way to install the development packages all at once on device?
<faenil> a way which is not flashing/switching to the development-focused image
<popey> faenil: not really, you need to flash to a dev channel
<faenil> popey: mmm alright...thanks
<jcastro> anyone know how the bq E5 will fare on US data networks?
<svij> jcastro: afaik only 2G like the E4.5
<nik90> jcastro: I doubt it will
<cwayne> jcastro, same as e4.5
<jcastro> dang, can't catch a break, I guess I'll wait for the mx4
<elopio> tedg: I'm getting Name "com.canonical.URLDispatcher" does not exist on vivid
<elopio> http://paste.ubuntu.com/11500028/
<elopio> desktop
<elopio> does that give you any idea of what I'm missing?
<tedg> elopio, URL dispatcher?
<tedg> âº
<tedg> elopio, Is it running?
<faenil> popey: that means moving to the unstable image though, right? the only one with dev image is devel-proposed
<faenil> or is it possible to get it on rc-proposed as well?
<elopio> tedg: I have it installed, 0.1+15.04.20150123-0ubuntu1
<elopio> It's not running. How do I start it?
<tedg> elopio, initctl start url-dispatcher
<tedg> elopio, but it should start with Unity
<faenil> (not the only one, but rc-proposed doesn't seem to have a dev channel)
<elopio> tedg: ok, thanks. Now it's running, no idea why it wasn't before.
<elopio> now I'm getting BadURL. I have webbrowser installed.
<elopio> the .urldispatcher seems ok.
<tedg> elopio, Haven't yet landed it, but try the command in the shell script at the bottom: https://code.launchpad.net/~ted/url-dispatcher/dump-tool/+merge/259270
<SturmFlut> popey, dholbach: This is all great news! My dad complained about his bq yesterday and about every issue he has is on the list of things which are already in OTA-4 or will be fixed :)
<popey> happy days
<elopio> tedg: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11500180/
<elopio> tedg: scratch that. It works now.
 * tedg fixed it remotely ;-)
<elopio> tedg: now can you fix this? http://paste.ubuntu.com/11500250/
<elopio> I'm putting an .urldispatcher in ~config
<elopio> but it's not on the db.
<dholbach> SturmFlut, NICE :-D
<tedg> elopio, initctl start url-dispatcher-update-user
<SturmFlut> rpadovani: Keep us updated if they ask anything on your Hangout that has not already been answered
<elopio> tedg: that doesn't seem to get it started. It's left stop/waiting
<tedg> elopio, It's a one-shot thing. Did it put the entry into the DB?
<elopio> tedg: no, it didn't.
<tedg> elopio, Hmm, check it's log?
<elopio> maybe it is traveling through the atlantic.
 * tedg curses the sea, like all pirates before him
<elopio> tedg: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11500372/
<Walex2> with a BQ, UT 14.10(22) I just realized that the pull-down menu displaying messages and allowing settings changes is not subject to the screen locker. Is this a known catastrophic bug?
<tedg> elopio, G_MESSAGES_DEBUG=all /usr/lib/*/url-dispatcher/update-directory "~/.config/url-dispatcher/urls/*.url-dispatcher"
<popey> Walex2: no, it's a setting you can change
<elopio> tedg: it says is up-to-date
<elopio> oh, wait, does it need a dash?
<ice9> I'm trying to sync existing working dir but I'm getting the error here https://gist.github.com/anonymous/841405014ccc2ef62993
<elopio> I'm sorry, my bad.
<popey> Walex2: system settings -> Security & privacy -> Lock phone -> When locked...
<Walex2> oops good. Strange default though.
<Walex2> popey: thanks
<popey> np
<ice9> is the Ubuntu Touch fully functioning now and stable?
<nik90> ice9: well I have been using the BQ E4.5 as my daily phone for the past 3-4 weeks now..had a couple of Unity8 crashes..but overall really liking the experience
<ice9> nik90: is it very responsive OS?
<nik90> ice9: app launch times definitely need to be improved..scrolling is a bit slow (not laggy)..overall seems good
<nik90> ice9: I believe the scrolling is a bit slow because the scrolling doesn't take into the phone resolution but is being worked on
<elopio> tedg: still not working, but I'm done for today. I'll be back :)
<nik90> so it scrolls the same amount of pixels on all devices
<tedg> elopio, Heh, okay.
 * elopio heard that as a joyful "okay"
<peat-psuwit> Where should I report a bug about i18n? I can't read Thai character.
<nik90> peat-psuwit: not sure, but if you report it against a standard project like unity8, I am sure they will redirect it to the correct project.
<nik90> peat-psuwit: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Avengers should help you
<peat-psuwit> nik90: Thanks.
<nik90> yw
<peat-psuwit> awe: Could you have a look at this? https://github.com/rilmodem/ofono/pull/188
<SturmFlut> jhodapp: Ping
<howefield_afk> [3~
<jhodapp> SturmFlut, pong
<SturmFlut> jhodapp: If you have the time, would you have a look at http://sturmflut.github.io/ubuntu/bq/2015/05/31/hacking-the-bq-part-3-supported-media-plugins-and-codecs/ and tell me if it looks complete? Haven't got much experience with gstreamer
<SturmFlut> jhodapp: Especially the codec list at the end
<jhodapp> SturmFlut, sure thing, are you interested in pointing out the supported hardware video codecs?
<SturmFlut> jhodapp: No, just all the codecs that this phone currently supports on OTA-3.5. It's just a reference, for the next guy who asks about a strange codec (like me with OPUS)
<jhodapp> SturmFlut, alright...if you ever become interested look at the file: /system/etc/media_codecs.xml
 * SturmFlut looks
<SturmFlut> jhodapp: Ooohhh
<SturmFlut> You know what I like the most?
<SturmFlut> "decoder-lies-about-number-of-channels"
<jhodapp> SturmFlut, yeah, quirks of the hardware decoder
<SturmFlut> The quirk, a developer's best friend
<SturmFlut> jhodapp: Hmmm, so if I get this right e.g. FLAC could be decoded in hardware on the bq, but the "androidmedia" gstreamer plugin doesn't expose it, so it is decoded by the software "flac" plugin?
<jhodapp> SturmFlut, correct, we don't use hardware decoders for audio at the moment
<SturmFlut> jhodapp: Interesting, hardware audio decoding will probably save quite some power when implemented?
<jhodapp> SturmFlut, depends on the codec, but honestly not a whole lot anymore
<jhodapp> SturmFlut, with software decoding, Ubuntu Touch already has better playback times than Android (last time I checked our test figures at least)
<SturmFlut> jhodapp: Glad I finally understood this
<jhodapp> SturmFlut, yeah, come join #ubuntu-media and #ubuntu-touch-music for more discussion specific to media topics
<lotuspsychje> here we go :p
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/06/first-ubuntu-phone-with-convergence-is-being-made-by-bq
<popey> :)
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/06/meizu-mx4-ubuntu-phone-europe-release-date
<lotuspsychje> lookin good for touch
<OerHeks> Sad they didn't mention the lack of a sdcard slot
<SturmFlut> OerHeks: Yes, 16GB without an SD slot is a bit small
<SturmFlut> OerHeks: Apparently only ~12 GB are truly available at the end
<OerHeks> Yes that makes me change back to the BQ, or wait for the next one.
<SturmFlut> Theoretically there is a 32GB version, which would be enough for me, my Nexus 5 has 32 GB too
<SturmFlut> (Did I mention that the Nexus 5 is a horrible device?)
<dobey> eh, they're all too big devices :)
<BOHverkill> dobey: yes that is also my problem ;)
<BOHverkill> my e4.5 has the right size
<brunch875> Okay okay I've thought about this.
<brunch875> The ubuntu phone is going to converge with the desktop and be able to run google chrome.
<brunch875> And google chrome is able to run android applications via ARC Welder.
<brunch875> So ubuntu touch will sooner or later run android applications.
<brunch875> Checkmate?
<dobey> brunch875: not exactly
<SturmFlut> brunch875: Would be nice if Google finally decides what their actual strategy is, instead of building multiple ecosystems and then make the one emulate the other
<brunch875> brrrrrrr
<SturmFlut> ARC will never be able to run every Android App in the store, right?
<brunch875> I have no idea. I  thought it was capable of running anything
<brunch875> website states it doesn't support all Google Play Services <-yet->
<SturmFlut> AFAIK it isn't. Any major app ships native code extensions because the Android JVM is still too limited/slow. The developer has to actively ship those extensions for x86, because ARC doesn't emulate ARM instructions.
<faenil> mmm I get a "no space left on device" while installing unity8's builddeps on device :(
<brunch875> "compile once run anywhere" huh
<SturmFlut> brunch875: "compile once run anywhere" is a lie 50% of the time
<SturmFlut> brunch875: It only works if your app stays within the limits of the runtime environment all the time, which is unrealistic
<brunch875> I can't agree more with you... but it still irks me :p
<brunch875> ironically the whole Qt thing has gone way farther on the multiplataform achievement
<brunch875> when I found out about PyQt it made me drop my jaw
<brunch875> anyone tried it with utouch?
<SturmFlut> No, I am fine with C/C++.
<dobey> faenil: if you want to build unity8 on a device, you should probably create a chroot under ~/vivid-chroot or something to build in and install all the deps under
<faenil> dobey: yeah I was just discussing that mzanetti, thanks..
<faenil> I didn't know the / partition is so limited in size
<faenil> discussing that with*
<SturmFlut> What's the proper name for the new Ubuntu platform nowadays? "Ubuntu Phone" doesn't tell the full story, we're moving away from "Ubuntu Touch", just "Ubuntu" doesn't cut it because you can't distinguish between the "old" and the "new" Ubuntu...
 * SturmFlut has been wondering for a while
<mzanetti> SturmFlut, it's just Ubuntu
<i_n_g_o_> hello.
<i_n_g_o_>  i red about an update to 15.04 for ubuntu-touch. afaik it was released some while ago. i don't get it in the updater. how would i get the update anyway?
<mzanetti> i_n_g_o_, no, not released yet
<brunch875> I had no idea it was released
<i_n_g_o_> oh
<i_n_g_o_> that explains... ;)
<SturmFlut> mzanetti: But isn't it two quite different things? The "old" Ubuntu is package-based, has X11 and doesn't run on phones. The "new" Ubuntu is image-based, has Mir and runs on any device.
<i_n_g_o_> is there a way to get it pre-release?
<brunch875> call it uTouch; it's apple-friendly and double-kinky
<SturmFlut> brunch875: Heh
<SturmFlut> Didn't somebody tell us to stop putting an "u" in front of things
<brunch875> I'll keep on referring to it as "desktop ubuntu", so people _know_ it's the real deal which can run everything
<mzanetti> i_n_g_o_, this might help: http://askubuntu.com/questions/602035/how-do-i-use-ubuntu-device-flash-with-the-bq-aquaris-e4-5
<brunch875> it's easy to assume it's not ubuntu but "ubuntu mobile" what's running on the phone
<i_n_g_o_> mzanetti: thx
<mzanetti> i_n_g_o_, I haven't ever done it on production though. be careful
<mzanetti> production devices
<SturmFlut> i_n_g_o_: If you can wait for a bit longer, OTA-4 will probably released next week and is based on 15.04 anyways
<i_n_g_o_> @SturmFlut ah. ok. good to know. then i might wait.
<dobey> SturmFlut: no, there is only "ubuntu"
<i_n_g_o_> i have some issues with the current version, hoping they resolve with the next update...
<brunch875> someone on the mailing list posted a link to the changelog
<SturmFlut> dobey: In my experience that confuses people a lot. They don't understand that these are different systems, they don't understand that there are different app stores, they start using apt-get on the phone and think they can run any desktop app on the phone etc.
<brunch875> SturmFlut: But it will ultimately be that way, right? Aside from arm/x86
<SturmFlut> i_n_g_o_: https://insights.ubuntu.com/2015/05/29/phone-updates-may
<SturmFlut> brunch875: At some point in the future, yes.
<dobey> SturmFlut: they aren't different systems
<i_n_g_o_> SturmFlut: thx
<brunch875> huh my phone display doesn't power off automatically AT ALL
<brunch875> I don't mind this 'feature' since it's not possible to activate this behaviour from settings :p
<i_n_g_o_> the updates sound great! can't wait :)
<SturmFlut> brunch875: You can activate it
<SturmFlut> brunch875: System Settings -> Battery -> Lock when idle -> Never
<brunch875> yeah, but I mean turning off the display to black
<SturmFlut> Any idea on how to implement a videochat app? Probably would need support from the Media Hub I guess?
<SturmFlut> Oh, WebRTC actually works with Oxide
<faenil> dobey: should I create the chroot with click command? or standard schroot? click seems to only create it inside the default folder
#ubuntu-touch 2015-06-02
<zombienerd> Good evening folks (or whatever greeting is appropriate for your time zone)
<zombienerd> Anybody awake?
<bbxtr> Hola Hombres
<bbxtr> Anyone using the UT as a daily driver on Nexus 5? How's the battery life?
<zombienerd> I'm on Nexus 4, battery life is excellent.  Can't speak to the N5
<dholbach> good morning
<seb128> hey dholbach
<dholbach> salut seb128
<AmiSing> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ubuntu-Linux-Phone-BQ-Aquaris-E4-5-Ubuntu-Edition-/321769682517 Â£125.00
<AmiSing> leaves.
<sturmflut2> The sheer existance of bug 1460945 is already just awesome
<ubot5> bug 1460945 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "System Settings Updates/Storage pages consume 700mA or more even there is no network/io activity" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1460945
<mcphail> Must agree. That bug report is brilliant
<mcphail> Does anyone else find occasions where a small flick to scroll the browser is translated into a fast scroll to top/bottom of page? Am I accidently triggering a gesture or is there a bug in the sensor/flicking code? On krillin/rtm
<sturmflut2> Apparently Meizu made an announcement two hours ago, http://c.youku.com/meizu0602, does anybody know what it's about? Google Translate output is more than confusing :/
<sturmflut2> It's just a new Android device, isn't it
<popey> its probably their m2 note
<ogra_> uh, pink
<sturmflut2> Oooh, they're working on desktop mode for the web browser app
<sturmflut2> Such convergence
<sturmflut2> bq announced the E5: https://twitter.com/bqreaders/status/605661883937497088
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Leave the Office Earlier Day! ð
<popey> tempted
 * popey leaves the office
<sturmflut2> ...that escalated quickly
<sturmflut2> JamesTait: I'm happy you didn't go with "Rocky Road Day", they don't sell Rocky Road over here
<k1l_> hihi, popey
<JamesTait> sturmflut2, I don't consider it a coincidence that the two are on the same day. ð
<sturmflut2> JamesTait: Noooo, that would sound like a conspiracy theory, and there is no such thing as a conspiracy
<sturmflut2> ...except for the fact that Elvis is still alive on that secret island
<popey> Uh-huh-huh
<popey> awww, the popey elvis pic is gone from 10:08 < JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Leave the Office Earlier Day! ï¿½
<popey> er
<popey> mispaste
<popey> awww, the popey elvis pic is gone from http://blamepopey.com/  (is what I meant to say)
 * JamesTait wonders why his morning greeting was on popey's clipboard.
<popey> me too!
 * sturmflut2 hopes that we will get something like Syncthing on the phone
<sturmflut2> But I don't see how that would work with the current App Lifecycle
 * mcphail wishes we had Ubuntu One on the phone. Killing that was a major mistake
<popey> syncthing works on the phone
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/BQ-Aquaris-E5-HD-Ubuntu-Edition-Official-Announced-483034.shtml
<popey> it could sync only in foreground
<popey> would you really want your battery killed by syncthing constantly polling for changes?
<popey> syncthing as a plugin for the file manager might be interesting
<popey> so it only syncs while you have file manager open
<mcphail> When Ubuntu One was killed, there was a promise it was going to be open-sourced and released. Did that ever happen? It would be a great addition to the phone
<popey> mcphail: no, not yet. Ping beuno
<popey> it's on his to-do list somewhere
<lotuspsychje> i dont like things in the cloud too much
<lotuspsychje> you never know whats happening with your data out there
<ogra_> lotuspsychje, if you control the cloud yourself ?
<lotuspsychje> ogra_: 24/7 things always hold a security risk
 * ogra_ plans to actually have a lot of apps in the store in the future where you can use a one-click-install snappy cloud service for your phone app ... 
<mcphail> popey: it is good to know it hasn't been (completely) forgotten
<popey> This is why I like Syncthing so much
<popey> free software, and control over which machines sync to which
<popey> and no cloud needed
<lotuspsychje> popey: yeah local sync is nice
<dadexix86> are there plans somewhere for an app that allows us to remotely control the music player on an Ubuntu machine?
<mcphail> popey: haven't used it. Does it have shell integration on the desktop, so you can right-click a folder and selct to share. That was U1's best feature
<popey> not yet
<popey> well, maybe
<popey> I just run it as a daemon and it has a web ui to control it
<ogra_> dadexix86, depends on the music player you use ... there is a vlc remote and a kodi remote already
<popey> i think there's an indicator for it too
<dadexix86> ogra_, the default one, which is rhythmbox since some releases. never heard of kodi, is it in the repo?
<popey> kodi == xbmc
<davidcalle> ogra_, hello, by any chance do you know who owns (or where code lives for) the new special developer image? I'm trying to list what's special with it.
<popey> it has "Ogras Inside" (*Intel Tune*)
<davidcalle> popey, I can already see the logo, spinning at boot
<popey> https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-q__Dh_47Efc/AAAAAAAAAAI/AAAAAAAAApw/5pv_-vwA0Kc/s120-c/photo.jpg
<popey> make it so!
<davidcalle> :)
<ogra_> davidcalle, no, i didnt know there is such an image
<ogra_> is that mzanetti's baby perhaps ?
<mzanetti> ?
<ogra_> mzanetti, a "new special developer image"
 * ogra_ never heard of that
<mzanetti> me neither :D
<ogra_> heh
<davidcalle> Heh, it has been recently documented at https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/start/ubuntu-for-devices/image-channels/ (ubuntu-touch/*/ubuntu-developer)
<mzanetti> ogra_, I went with a "special developer app store" instead
<ogra_> mzanetti, i know, i thought you might have an image with it included or some such
<davidcalle> As far as I can see, it ships with Cordova mobile spec webapp, logviewer, terrarium (qml live prototyper), and the UI toolkit gallery, that's nice :)
<ogra_> davidcalle, hmm, i dont think there is this "developer-oriented custom tarball" yet
<ogra_> not sure whose idea that is/was
<davidcalle> ogra_, I'm running it :)
<ogra_> sil2100, ^^^ any idea ?
<sil2100> There is one ;)
<sil2100> john-mcaleely: is the maintainer of it, at least he's the one usually taking care of it
<sil2100> I myself don't really know what's in that custom, but I've been told it has some goodies from the store pre-installed for developers - an we have teh channels
<davidcalle> Yeah, I've asked him, he knows about it and knows it ships some dev oriented apps, but I'm still looking for a full list of changes
<sil2100> hm, a list like that would be nice indeed
<sil2100> Let me check where it pulls the tarballs from
<ogra_> well, find whoever creates that tarball then :)
<mzanetti> ogra_, I haven't. But I'm in discussion with this guy to set that up at some point: http://ubports.com/
<sil2100> uuuh
<john-mcaleely> davidcalle, so, the delta list is maintained by AlexKaluzhny. I don't think he's on this channel often
<davidcalle> john-mcaleely, thanks!
<sil2100> john-mcaleely: I think we'll have to do some corrections with this channel
<john-mcaleely> oh yes?
<john-mcaleely> and have you published the vegeta build of it yet?
<sil2100> john-mcaleely: hm, oh, need to check if I did that or not indeed
<sil2100> Anyway, we're missing the rc-proposed/ubuntu-developer channel
<sil2100> But actually, I wonder
<sil2100> The ubuntu-developer has a strange setting, did you have any specific requirements for this channel?
<john-mcaleely> well, did we ever have 14.09-ubunut-developer?
<john-mcaleely> I think it was 'born' at rc level (which might be a bug)
<Genera_> hello together
<john-mcaleely> the 'special' requirement is that it is almost the same as the bq-aquaris stable/rc channels
<john-mcaleely> just a differeent custom, which cwayne ensures is only slightly different
<john-mcaleely> so, I don't think it is really special sil2100
<john-mcaleely> and it might be 'nice' or 'clearer' if there was an rc-proposed version
<john-mcaleely> sil2100, ^
<Genera_> is there already something known about a little fix for music apps so they dont stop if the phone gets locked or appswitch?
<popey> davidcalle: I propose this as our new loading image http://people.canonical.com/~alan/ogra_loading.gif
<ogra_> LOL !
<popey> :)
<Genera_> Pls dont
<popey> heh
<popey> Genera_: if the apps use media-hub they should work
 * lotuspsychje hides behind a stone
<Genera_> Im a bit sad about the fact that the touch isnt a full unity gui
<van> hello everyboy, i just bought the aquaris E4.5 and I hve some problem with it :(
<lotuspsychje> Genera_: what are you missing
<Genera_> well than cutespotify doesnt do that
<ogra_> thats a bug +
<popey> Genera_: cutespotify is known
<popey> poke Elleo :)
<van> Do you know how to send sms to group of contact?
<Genera_> i am used to write my programms once and just use the unity form factors to scale to devices
<davidcalle> popey, :D
<van> I search on Internet and I cn't find any soluce to send messages to a group of contact
<Genera_> have to continue work bb
<sil2100> john-mcaleely: I'll think about it, as currently it's implemented as an automatic channel that fetches the rootfs and device from rc/bq-aquaris.en and appends its own custom... I think we should have everything streamlined and make it a manual channel as all the rest and have an rc-proposed one that's automatic (as with all the rest)
<john-mcaleely> sil2100, sure. how it's constructed is mostly an impact to you!
<ogra_> sil2100, if you have a manual channel it means someone needs to QA it
<ogra_> (since onl custom is replaced i'd just go with an automated one and document that parts fo custom might potentially be broken due to no QA)
<sil2100> ogra_: right now it's anyway wrong
<sil2100> ogra_: since rc is auto-generated while rc should always be a manual channel that passes QA
<sil2100> So at least now it will be consistent ;)
<van> is there somebody who know about sending sms to contact group in utouch?
<mcphail> van: do you mean send the same SMS to multiple contacts at one time, or something cleverer than that?
<popey> indeed, you can specify multiple contacts
<popey> just type the first, tap on it, type the next, tap on it etc
<popey> or press the head and shoulders in the top right, select a contact, press again, select contact etc
<van> cleverer, I would like to send messages to fixed group like if I want to send a message to party-friend I just have to create a group named party-friend
<popey> ok. i dont think we support that yet
<popey> you may want to file a bug to track that issue
<ogra_> i guess that would be a contacts app feature
<popey> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/messaging-app/+filebug?no_redirect
<popey> hmm
<popey> i guess both
<van> and do you know a good tuto to learn programming with QT adapt to ubuntu touch
<van> ?
<popey> http://developer.ubuntu.com/ is our main site for documentation
<van> Because I would like to help improving apps and I already know some programming languages
<popey> let us know if there's something missing
<popey> we have a channel for developers - #ubuntu-app-devel
<beuno> mcphail, am working on it currently
<mcphail> beuno: U1? Excellent!
<chrisccoulson> Kaleo, you around?
<czajkowski> Greetings
<popey> o/
<ogra_> yo
<popey> czajkowski: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1245878
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1245878 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "Cannot connect to open network with captive portal" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<czajkowski> popey: so another thing that may have come up but when you  connect when roaming you see R
<czajkowski> which is normal on the little triang;e , but when you connect to data a E pops up
<popey> uh-huh
<czajkowski> why E - all that means to me is Edge
<popey> yes, it is
<popey> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_Data_Rates_for_GSM_Evolution = edge
<czajkowski> ogra_: spinning head of you at 3am is an odd way to wake up
<popey> hah
<ogra_> LOL
<ogra_> czajkowski, so you are in the US ?
<czajkowski> popey: ah ok, just dont see the E on my android
<czajkowski> ogra_: aye
<ogra_> there edge or 2G is the only stuff you can get with that phone
<czajkowski> for 11 days and using my ubuntu phone mostly over here for most things except work
<ogra_> (frequency limitation)
<czajkowski> ack
<popey> your android phone probably shows H ?
<popey> actually, Android L doesn't show letters IIRC
<popey> just a bar thing
<czajkowski> ogra_: biggest pita this trip is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1245878
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1245878 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "Cannot connect to open network with captive portal" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<czajkowski> as I've to connect to many wifi networks
<czajkowski> popey: aye
<ogra_> ouch, yeah, thats bad
<popey> yeah, annoys me too in pubs here
<ogra_> long standing bug we miss UI for
<popey> pmcgowan: ^ that bug is annoying, been annoying for years on the desktop, more problematic on mobile
<czajkowski> ogra_: please do the magic head spin on that eh :)
<pmcgowan> popey, hats a captive portal
<pmcgowan> whats
<popey> pmcgowan: like hotel wifi where you have to sign in
<ogra_> czajkowski, well, if popey had done that head correctly it would snap every 90Â° :) i'm working on snappy now
<popey> pmcgowan: or just tap a "Ok" button. Anything that prevents you getting on the "real" internet.
<pmcgowan> ah
<pmcgowan> popey, patches accepted :)
<czajkowski> it was fun watching all the enginners play with it yesterday
<ogra_> pmcgowan, the main bug we have open dfor that one is talking about "enterprise wlan" i think
<popey> pmcgowan: ok, noted. :)
<czajkowski> like little kids anything but deal with the work we had to prep for today for a change of pace
<popey> thats something else entirely
<ogra_> you mean enterprise?
<mcphail> most of these portals redirect your browser to a web page, though. I have never had any problems signing in
<czajkowski> mcphail: none are popping open though when I've been clicking on networks to join
<popey> thats a separate issue though I think
<popey> if I understand you
<mcphail> czajkowski: if you click to join the network, then navigate to any webpage in the browser, you'll prob be redirected to a sign-in page?
<czajkowski> mcphail: sure but on android which is where I ws comparing it to , android in most cases pops up the browser to log you in
<popey> right
<popey> yes, thats the known issue
<czajkowski> mcphail: new users to ubuntu phones would expect that
<czajkowski> popey: aye
<popey> sure
<popey> it's never worked in linux
<mcphail> aah - I hate that in Android! Constant nagging about "open networks are available" :)
<popey> elementary os recently added the feature
<popey> no, not that one mcphail
<popey> ater you connect
<popey> *after
<czajkowski> mcphail: no!
<popey> the phone goes looking for a 1x1 pixel at apple.com or google.com
<popey> and if it gets something else, it knows it's behind hotel wifi, and pops up the browser
<popey> thats the bit missing, we've debated adding it in ubuntu many times
<mcphail> popey: yes - it is part of it: you get a network symbol with a question mark for the captive portals
<popey> but for some reason it was always rejected - on one occasion for privacy reasons
<popey> right
<mcphail> I'm so used to the Ubuntu (desktop) way of doing things I find the android way annoying
<popey> heh
<czajkowski> mcphail: fair enough but if you're roaming and you're relying on connecting to many wifi networks
<czajkowski> it's frustrating as hell
<czajkowski> especially when you're used to the android way of doing things
<mcphail> czajkowski: trust me - I'm doing this all the time :)
<czajkowski> mcphail: trust me, I travel a lot!
<popey> It's not a competition :)
<mcphail> heh
<czajkowski> popey: if it was I'd win :)
<czajkowski> just saying
<czajkowski> hmm 24hr ihop in my hotel. I'm in dire need of bacon and a cup of weak tea
<mcphail> The biggest frustration with the captive portals is the browser doesn't remember the login details
<popey> yeah
<mcphail> I have about 200 hotel wifi business cards in my bag
<mcphail> ...and never the right one for my current hotel
<pywy> Hi all
<popey> hi
<pywy> I am looking forward to buy an ubuntu phone Aquaris e5
<popey> me too :)
<pywy>  ;)
<pywy> i've heard there is no mail app to do imaps/smtps
<pywy> is that right ?or just a rumor ?
 * ogra_ guesses DanChapman takes patches for dekko to support IMAPS :)
<pywy> oh, ok, not in bulk version then, requires patches
<pywy> thats quite bad news
<ogra_> oh, wait
 * ogra_ actually notices he uses IMAPS with dekko ... 
<ogra_> it doesnt support GPG ...
<kenvandine> mandel, did you see my comment the other day about silo 9?  that's still targetting the vivid overlay, which yes we want it there... but trunk is now wily so we don't want to merge your branch with trunk to land for vivid
<kenvandine> there is a bit of a delta already there
<ogra_> but SSL/TLS via port 465 and 993 work fine
<mcphail> pywy: dekko isn't a default app, but is the email app everyone actually uses :)
<kenvandine> mandel, so what we want is a rebuild targetting the 15.04 branch
<ogra_> pywy, ^^^
<pywy> thanks for the precision mcphail
<pywy> so it works with an app called dekko, easily installable
<ogra_> right
<mcphail> pywy: and DanChapman is always around if you have problems. The beauty of this device is the direct contact with the devs
<pywy> that's better ! thanx ogra_
<popey> mcphail: +1
<Cyrius_> hello there !
<Cyrius_> I'm trying to install Touch on my Nexus 4
<lotuspsychje> !devices | Cyrius_
<ubot5> Cyrius_: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<Cyrius_> but I'm kind of stuck with a problem
<Cyrius_> when plugged, my device is always displayed as offline by any adb command
<mcphail> Cyrius_: is your screen unlocked?
<popey> well
<Cyrius_> @mcphail yeah
<mcphail> Cyrius_: (or do you mean you haven't installed yet?)
<popey> is it currently running android?
<Cyrius_> it is
<Cyrius_> 4.4.4 if I'm not mistaken
<popey> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install you following that guide?
<popey> (enabled developer mode, got a working USB cable etc) :)
<mcphail> Cyrius_: dev mode enabled?
<Cyrius_> I am following that guide, dev mod enabled (I'v been devellopping android app on it with Android Studio for a few months)
 * mcphail thinks android studio uses adb internally...
<Cyrius_> indeed
<lotuspsychje> Cyrius_: have you installed the android tools on ubuntu?
<popey> Cyrius_: what version of ubuntu you using?
<Cyrius_> I was able to run adb commands through Android Studio before
<sturmflut2> ogra_: Can you check what the "Computex Intel" snappy package does?
<popey> i think it's just a demo
<lotuspsychje> Cyrius_: did you install the android tools for ubuntu?
<ogra_> sturmflut2, ask in #snappy ...
<sturmflut2> popey: Sure, but I want to know what it demoes ;)
<ogra_> (not my package, i thinnk that comes live from the intel booth at computex)
<sturmflut2> ogra_: Ooooh, I never realised that there is #snappy
<popey> download it and have a look :)
<lotuspsychje> Cyrius_: check if you installed, from the link popey provided
 * DanChapman is late to the dekko conversation and seems all questions were resolved (*scurries back off to his hole*)
<popey> heh
<lotuspsychje> Cyrius_: talk here instead of query
<Cyrius_> I'm just lost with IRC
<lotuspsychje> Cyrius_: what does adb devices show you?
<Cyrius_> my device, but offline
<lotuspsychje> Cyrius_: ubuntu version?
<Cyrius_> and no "Authorization box" appears on my mobile
<Cyrius_> 14.04 LTS
<lotuspsychje> Cyrius_: and you installed phablet tools correctly..hmm
<Cyrius_> yeah I'm quite lost
<Joran> potentially android studio used it's own packaged version of adb which is more up to date?
<Cyrius_> Android Studio still gets to display this Authorization Box on my device
<Joran> I would do the following...
<Cyrius_> I don't think so
<lotuspsychje> Cyrius_: did you enable developr mode and usb debugging too?
<Cyrius_> both
<Joran> Install the latest android sdk, copy the binaries to ~/bin, ensure ~/bin is in your path and then do adb devices step again
<Joran> earlier versions of adb don't play well with later versions of android because of the whole authorisation step
<dobey> faenil: https://askubuntu.com/questions/620740/recommended-way-to-install-regularcli-deb-packages-on-ubuntu-phone/623311#623311
<faenil> dobey: thanks, I'm going debootstrap atm
<dobey> faenil: ok, though debootstrap doesn't know about the vivid overlay ppa i don't think. using the pre-built image tarball gets you a chroot with all the default phone .debs installed i think, and the correct sources.list
<faenil> dobey: I added it manually...ok though, thanks for the hint :)
<seb128> kenvandine, mandel, what was the status of that settings silo for vivid which made click updates not listed? do we have fix? should we clean the silo?
<faenil> dobey: so vivid-preinstalled is currently rc-proposed with overlay ppa?
<ogra_> no
<ogra_> rc-proposed is v ivid + overlay
<dobey> the preinstalled tarball doesn't have the overlay?
<ogra_> http://system-image.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/bq-aquaris.en/krillin/ this is vivid+overlay
<dobey> that is an image built for installing on krillin, yes
<ogra_> two levels up there is neizu.en
<ogra_> *meizu.en
<ogra_> same thing
<dobey> yes
<dobey> but we're not talking about images to flash to devices
<ogra_> well, we dont have a proper chroot tarball for vivid + overlay
<dobey> we're talking about the vivid-preinstalled tarball, for creating a chroot
<ogra_> unless you want to use the full rootfs tarball, but i wouldnt recommend that
<ogra_> use the ubuntu-core one and add the ppa to sources.list
<faenil> I'm using debootstrap, then modified schroot.conf, added overlay ppa, upgraded packages, but now I have to add users as well otherwise schroot says that it can't cd to home and it doesn't execute the commands
<ogra_> thats the only actual clean way
<faenil> ogra_: ok, good, that's what I'm doing
<dobey> deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/ci-train-ppa-service/stable-phone-overlay/ubuntu vivid main
<dobey> that's in the vivid-preinstalled tarball
<dobey> so it is vivid+overlay
<ogra_> oh, main only ?
<dobey> well PPAs only have main
<ogra_> ah, right
<dobey> so i was right all along :)
<faenil> dobey wins
 * faenil raises dobey's arm
 * ogra_ applauds
<Cyrius_> Joran: thank you Joran
<Cyrius_> that was it
<Joran> You're welcome cyrius_
<mandel> kenvandine, I missed the comment, I'll take care, no problem
<mandel> seb128, no idea, I have not looked at that silo
<kenvandine> mandel, cool
<seb128> mandel, kenvandine, hum? I though you said you were able to reproduce the issue and were working on fixing it... was that somebody else?
<kenvandine> mandel, you had said you would look at it
<kenvandine> mandel, but that was like your first day back from vacation :)
<mandel> seb128, kenvandine and did look, then went to holidays, got drag to location service fires and I have nt looked at it since
<seb128> oh, ok
<mandel> sorry, this weeks seems to be easy, I'll take a look
<seb128> mandel, no worry, thanks, I was mostly wondering if we should keep that silo and try to fix it or clean it and try again later for those changes, so we can land other bugfixes
<mandel> seb128, leave it as it is, I'll work on it tonight
<seb128> mandel, thanks
<Cyrius_> Hum... I'm flashing my device with Ubuntu, and I'm getting this question :
<Cyrius_>  ROM may flash stock recovery on boot. Fix ? (this cannot be undone).
<Cyrius_> What should I answer :| ?
<zombienerd> what handset is it?
<Cyrius_> it's a nexus 4
<zombienerd> Same one I use.  I don't remember seeing that question myself, but if I had, I would have said Yes.  Then again, I don't ever plan on going back to android.
<Cyrius_> me neither. Let's answer yes then :)
<zombienerd> I just read a thread that seems that it is a common message with custom roms, and it doesn't hurt to say yes.
<zombienerd> http://androidforums.com/threads/rom-may-flash-stock-recovery-on-boot.751107/
<Cyrius_> it boots.
<zombienerd> I've gotta get back to work.  Best of luck to you!
<Cyrius_> thank you :) !
<elopio> tedg: ok, I'm back :)
 * tedg runs!
<elopio> tedg: and I'm with zsombi :)
<tedg> zombies!
<tedg> ;-)
<torontoyes> Has anyone run into any issue with porting to Samsung galaxy note 3 n900t?
<elopio> tedg: I've put the protocol thing in ~/.config/url-dispatcher/urls/test.url-dispatcher
<elopio> I ran the update things you told me yesterday, and it's still not in the database.
<elopio> I see no logs related to url-dispatcher in ~/.cache/upstart
<tedg> elopio, Can you run the command with the G_MESSAGES_DEBUG=all ?
<tedg> elopio, Same command that is in the upstart job
<elopio> tedg: oh wait, wait. Now it got it.
<elopio> I did G_MESSAGES_DEBUG=all /usr/lib/*/url-dispatcher/up^Cte-directory "/home/phablet/.config/url-dispatcher/urls/test.url-dispatcher"
<elopio> G_MESSAGES_DEBUG=all /usr/lib/*/url-dispatcher/update-directory "/home/phablet/.config/url-dispatcher/urls/test.url-dispatcher"
<tedg> elopio, Did it say anything?
<elopio> tedg: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11522532/
<elopio> the processing message was what I didn't get before, when I tried with the *.url-dispatcher
<tedg> elopio, Is it in the DB?
<elopio> tedg: it is now, yes.
<elopio> for some reason, doing it with initctl doesn't work either. But we can live with this for now.
<torontoyes> elopio, are there any inherent problems with porting ubuntu-touch to Samsung Note 3's ?
<tedg> elopio, That is probably a bug. I'm guessing it doesn't work with the "*", probably just needs the dir name.
<elopio> torontoyes: no idea.
<elopio> tedg: yes, I'll report a bug for that, but write the code using update-directory for now.
<elopio> thanks.
<elopio> well, I'm not yet ready, I still need to check that the test app receives the URI parameters :)
<peat-psuwit> What should I do to find out how parts of the system use power?
<OerHeks> oh nice, BQ 5 is comming to us http://news.softpedia.com/news/BQ-Aquaris-E5-HD-Ubuntu-Edition-Official-Announced-483034.shtml
<ybon> I can't remember how to do a screenshot. I'm trying volume + and volume - and right button, but this switch the screen off (I'm on Nexus 4), any hint? :)
<popey> ybon: just vol+ and vol-
<OerHeks> On the BQ Aquarius Ubuntu Phone you have to press the volume up and down key simultaneously.
<ybon> ah, thanks popey :)
<ybon> popey: the press need to be quick though, I tested it before but I was keeping it pressed for too long, and then this was switching off the volume totally
<popey> odd
<popey> i dont see that here
<ybon> I can reproduce it ;)
<popey> heh
<popey> actually, on my bq, screenshotting is completely broken
<ybon> each time someone write bq I read bbq, which change a bit the meaning
<popey> heh
<popey> actually, volume buttons completely broken here
<nik90> ybon, popey: screenshotting seems to work fine on my bq...holding the buttons for a long time doesn't break it for me either
<popey> mine is running a bleeding edge image
<popey> my retail bq is fine
<nik90> ogra_: I like the new app loading animation...let's make it default
<ogra_> haha
<nuclearbob> when trying to use lsusb on a bq device as a specific user, I keep getting "Couldn't open device, some information will be missing"
<nuclearbob> I think I need an acl adjustment somewhere, but I'm not sure where, since that user is in the adb and plugdev groups, among others
<brunch875> Has anyone read this article? http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/06/first-ubuntu-phone-with-convergence-is-being-made-by-bq
<brunch875> what does it mean 'with convergence'?
<brunch875> It kind of implies the current E4.5 won't have convergence
<dobey> brunch875: it means "a device built to be used with a keyboard/screen/mouse dock" i would presume
<dobey> brunch875: the e4.5's cpu/ram/storage isn't really fitting to that task.
<brunch875> Ah, so more hardware-beefy
<brunch875> what'you say, dobey... will we be playing counter strike on it after all? :P :P :P
<brunch875> hahaha
<dobey> i doubt it
<dobey> you would have to convince valve to support ARM
<brunch875> I'm surprised BQ is actually investing in ubuntu this much
<brunch875> first the E5
<brunch875> now this
<brunch875> those are really good news
<zombienerd> Has anyone seen/found a workaround to the Mako tethering bug yet?
<nik90> zombienerd: what tethering bbug?
<zombienerd> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbus-property-service/+bug/1427697
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1427697 in dbus-property-service (Ubuntu) "Malformed /etc/NetworkManager/system-connections/tethering on mako" [High,Confirmed]
<zombienerd> Cannot tether on my Mako.  Up to date devel channel.
<nik90> ah
<zombienerd> Never gets an IP address
<mcphail> I suspect "convergence" will be backported to the e4.5. It is a surprisingly capable device
<brunch875> I am expecting that! It's the main reason I got this device!
<dobey> mcphail: it is a low end device.
<dobey> mcphail: i don't think it provides all the necessary hardware capabilities
<mcphail> dobey: kernel may be an issue, but the device _is_ very capable
<brunch875> are you sure of that? I've installed ubuntu on dead-end machines and it ran 'fine'
<mcphail> dobey: I doubt convergence will be supported or recommended for the 4.5, but suspect I will run fine for me
<mcphail> *it
<ahoneybun> mhall119: with 4-6 TextFields, how would you switch between them?
<ahoneybun> *you*
<Nikeron> hi all
<Nikeron> hey guys, ubuntu touch are support linux apps now or not?
<Nikeron> guys?
<dobey> ubuntu is a version of linux yes; i'm not sure what you're asking though. you can't install or run arbitrary apps on your phone the same way you can on your PC though
<mcphail> I've been doing some tests, and it appears apps can run "forever" in the background if they don't spawn a GUI
<mcphail> I suspect that is a bug
<pmcgowan> bfiller, do you have your rcs phase 1 and 2 proposal somewhere
<pmcgowan> is that in trello?
<mariogrip> Hello awe. sorry, I have been gone for a while due to exam in school (+ new job)... any idea one this? http://paste.ubuntu.com/11529976/
<awe> mariogrip, off the top of my head, no idea.  I'm actually in the middle of some heavy NM debug.  Do you have a git branch for your code?
<awe> Also, as I explained before, I've personally done little with the OEM_HOOK mechanism
<awe> so I would have to go figure out how it works myself before being able to answer your questions
<awe> My guess is that you haven't properly initialized the rilp, which the parcel the g_ril_send uses to construct the message it sends
<mariogrip> awe: I will push the updates i did to a fork soon, i will try to initialize the rilp in a different method than i tried
<awe> ok
<awe> it's just easier for me and/or abeato to help you if we can see the code
<mariogrip> awe: i found this is tha's something we can use https://github.com/nemomobile-packages/ofono/commit/d00df4db747135e55002d7336c47833d5238cf85 but what i understand of it it's an dbus interface
<ahoneybun> mariogrip: any luck with ofono?
<awe> unfortunately, the nemomobile codebase and ours has diverged
<mariogrip> ofono is not the easiest task i have done... xP a big learning curve for me
<ahoneybun> thank you for all the work so far mariogrip :)
<awe> mariogrip, for an example of how to use OEM_HOOK_RAW, see ril_query_pin_retries() in drivers/rilmodem/sim.c
<mariogrip> ahoneybun: going slow, but i'm leaning a lot :D
<ahoneybun> mariogrip: will this be on the official port system when it all works?
<ahoneybun> so we don't have to dirty install it
<mariogrip> ahoneybun: I'm working on a system server but it isn't my priory yet, but it's coming :D
<awe> ahoneybun, it'd have to be proposed as a pull-request to our ofono git tree, accepted/merged, and landed in the overlay PPA in order for it to appear in an official image
<ahoneybun> awesomeness
<ahoneybun> but it is possible awe? like the N5 one?
<awe> I haven't seen any ofono changes for the N5
<ahoneybun> I;m saying as an example
<ahoneybun> it is on the official system as a official port
<mariogrip> awe: i think ahoneybun is talking about the port in general, like a system-image server
<DonkeyHotei> the only "official" ports are the N4, the bq aquaris, and the meizu
<ahoneybun> yea
<awe> so... we're talking about a specific package.   If a port requires changes to a package, then those changes need to make their way into the archive, or in the case of our current stable images, the vivid overlay PPA
<awe> otherwise, you need to make the image writable, and install a modified package... which can cause update breakage
<ahoneybun> so ubuntu-device-flash works
<awe> right, and OTA can be applied
<awe> again, when a port requires changes to core Ubuntu packages, the best possible solution is to work with the right developers to land those changes in the PPA/archive
<mariogrip> awe: the device specific tarball can modify the core packages, so you can example put an ofono package that will replace the existing one
<awe> mariogrip, the core packages are on a read-only filesystem, so that's not quite true
<awe> especially if you want to be able to use the OTA updates
<awe> of course, if you don't care about updates, yea.. you could probably do that, but not advisable
<mariogrip> yeah, i'm talking about an ota server for the port i'm working on (oneplus one), the device specific tarball there can edit the core system when updating/installing
<awe> sure, again that can be made to work...but again long term, that will break OTAs, unless your building your own root filesystem updates
<awe> but that's beyond my scope of expertise
<awe> again, your best bet for long term ofono support is to get the changes into the official package
<awe> peat-psuit has been working with us on enabling an LG/Qualcomm based device for instance
<mariogrip> yeah
<awe> see https://github.com/rilmodem/ofono/pull/188
<awe> for an example
<awe> we designed the rilmodem code with device quirking in mind
<awe> this is one of the areas we differ from the nemomobile fork
<awe> we also wanted to ensure that we had unit testing of the parcel building/parsing code, so we re-factored the code to allow this
<mariogrip> that's cool
#ubuntu-touch 2015-06-03
<zombienerd> Hello all, anyone around?
<mariogrip> awe: now i get this "received=Q and expected=QOEMHOOK", i'm using parcel_w_string
<mariogrip> parcel_w_string(rilp, "QOEMHOOK");
<bbxtr> Hola Hombres
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/Mark-Shuttleworth-Introduces-Snappy-Ubuntu-Core-at-Internet-of-Things-World-2015-483125.shtml
<zombienerd>  /join #xubuntu
<zombienerd> of course parsing is wrong. lol.
<dholbach> good morning
<Spike_> HI
<Spike_> I wondered if I could get a dual boot on a BQ Aquaris 5 Ubuntu touch / Android
<Spike_> If it is possible it's definetely going to be my next smartphone
<ogra_> it wont be sold like that, no ... but the saystem is all open :)
<ogra_> *system
<Spike_> Well i knw that it's not goign to be sold this way however I visited BQ's website this morning
<ogra_> (someone could surely make it work with multirom or some such... with some passion and knowledge)
<Spike_>  and I saw the Aquaris E5 ++ with 1080p screen
<Spike_>  that was kinda affordable
<ogra_> that wont be sold with ubuntu
<ogra_> only the 720p version
<Spike_> yes
<Spike_>  that's why i wondered if I could get a dual boot working on such a device
<Spike_> I mean the only tutorial i coul dfind on ubuntu
<Spike_>  was how to replace
<Spike_> android by ubunut
<Spike_>  ubuntu
<Spike_> I used to have a dual boot on my old galaxy nexus
<Spike_>  android / Ubuntu
<Spike_> it was not very efficient so i got rid of my ubuntu part
<Spike_> but the perspective of getting a dual boot on a BQ could worth a try
<ogra_> there are nexus4, 7 and nexus5 support in multiboot, talk to Tassadar (once he is around) he made them work i think
<ogra_> but you wont easily get that with a non supported device since you would have to do a full port first
<fummy> hi, is the battery life on nexus 5 still aweful?
<Spike__> Ok thanks
<Spike__> sorry got disconnected
<JamesTait> Good morning, folks! Happy Repeat Day, and happy Repeat Day! ð
<pitti> ogra_: lxc-android-config has ./etc/init/ureadahead.override with "manual" -- I'm confused, didn't you say we want/need ureadahead for bootspeed?
<ogra_> pitti, yes, look deeper :)
<ogra_> there are more ureadahead jobs ...
<ogra_> we dont have a rootfs setup like the original ureadahead expects ... ureadahead-touch re-orders the scan to take the specific mounts setup into account
<pitti> ogra_: aaah! thanks, I missed that
<ogra_> (the -touch variant also starts a lot earlier since we do the mounting in initrd)
<seb128> kenvandine, mandel, hey, I've an issue with some updates on bq/vivid, one app is listed for upgrade (umetronome 1.5), I can upgrade it and it lists "no upgrade available" but the update comes back every time I reopen the updates screen
<mandel> seb128, cound that be because it targets a diff framework? I know ken did some work on that so that we did filter the contents
<ogra_> pitti, since i got you here  :) ... do youi know if there are any plans to have support for bootchart like io-graphs (cpu/disk) in the systemd equivalent ? i find the systemd charts rather useless without that info
<seb128> mandel, different framework than?
<seb128> mandel, it's the same one that was listed on bq/rtm and failed to upgrade because it was requiring sdb 15.04 which was not available, but that's available on vivid
<mandel> seb128, I know some apps targeted the framework in vivid when we were in trusty and that caused problems
<seb128> sdb->sdk
<seb128> right
<seb128> but that device is on the vivid channel now
<seb128> and the upgrade seems to happen fine
<seb128> 1.5 is installed
<ogra_> frameworks are backwards compatible (at least on paper)
<ogra_> it shouldnt block the download/installation
<pitti> ogra_: I don't understand -- what's missing on http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/tmp/bootchart-20150603-1115.svg ?
<pitti> ogra_: these have more info than the ones from our "bootchart" package..
<ogra_> pitti, oooh !
<ogra_> how do i get that ?
<pitti> ogra_: oh, were you perhaps looking at systemd-analyze plot?
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> thats with the init= modification, i see
<pitti> ogra_: init=/lib/systemd/systemd-bootchart (see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BootCharting)
 * ogra_ hugs pitti 
<pitti> ogra_: ah, yes; analyze plot only knows the timestamps, there is no additional probing
<ogra_> (your Xorg is slow :P )
<pitti> ogra_: i. e. analyze plot is always available and has no overhead; bootchart is on request and has the usual probing overhead/slowdown
<seb128> ogra_, the update installs fine, and it's installed, but it keeps being listed in the update panel still despite being uptodate
<pitti> ogra_: nah, I just had to type my password into lightdm, and mistyped once..
<ogra_> seb128, ah, then i misunderstood ... still though, the framework shouldnt be the issue, is your disk full ?
<seb128> ogra_, no it's not, there is like 1.5G
<seb128> the install looks fine
<ogra_> weird
<ogra_> anything in logs ?
<seb128> unsure how u-d-m determine there is an update
<seb128> the log looks like it finds an update and install it
<seb128> no error I can see
<seb128> ogra_, mandel, in fact that click is installed twice
<ogra_> aha !
<seb128>         "_directory": "/opt/click.ubuntu.com/.click/users/phablet/com.ubuntu.developer.monichols.umetronome",
<seb128>         "framework": "ubuntu-sdk-14.10-dev2",
<seb128>         "_directory": "/opt/click.ubuntu.com/.click/users/phablet/umetronome.otter",
<seb128>         "framework": "ubuntu-sdk-15.04",
<seb128>  
<seb128> so I guess it finds the first one
<ogra_> namespace change ...
<seb128> and try to update
<ogra_> beuno, ^^^^
<pitti> ogra_: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/tmp/bootchart-20150603-1119.svg <- with autologin (but compiz is still slow, we know that :)
<ogra_> not to bad !
<pitti> ogra_: but I suppose the QEMU video driver isn't the fastest either :)
<ogra_> heh, yeah
<seb128> pitti, 7s to loaded desktop? it's quite good :-)
<pitti> seb128: well, cheating -- there's no I/O as it's a cached QEMU image
<pitti> that's why CPU utilization is perfect
<seb128> k
<pitti> i. e. it tells us that we at least don't spend time with useless waiting
<ogra_> yeah
<pitti> I haven't done a bootchart on my laptop for a while, I ought to do that
<nhaines> What's the process for approving Ubuntu Store updates for the phone these days?
<nhaines> I just updated tutanota-webapp.nhaines, which passed all tests.  And I think the last time I had a minor update it sat around for a few days.  I basically dropped the custom user agent string and added "content_exchange" to the policy groups.
<mandel> seb128, that is not in our area of expertise ;)
<seb128> mandel, I guess that's one for beuno?
<mandel> seb128, yes, or for the click people
<mandel> seb128, we just download and make calls
<seb128> right
<nhaines> Huh, looks like it sailed right through this time.  Well, thanks.  :)
<mcphail> Is there a way to configure the fron page of the Ubuntu Store to only feature apps/scopes which are available in your language?
<davidcalle> mcphail, not yet
<mcphail> davidcalle: ok, thanks. Do you know if that feature is planned?
<davidcalle> mcphail, it would make sense to have it IMHO, but I don't know if it's on the roadmap. thostr_ ? ^
<mcphail> It would be good, particualryl as you can't even cut/paste the text to put through Google Translate to see what the current "Highlight of the week" is/does
<thostr_> davidcalle: mcphail: we don't have this on our roadmap, but from scope side this should be easy/quickly to do if we support that on the store side
<mcphail> thostr_: I hope the Chinese Meizu phone is a roaring success, but don't anticipate a lot of the Chinese scopes will be interesting/relevant to me without translation. As such, I hope I can screen them out
<popey> same for comments / reviews
<davidcalle> On the bright side, the store API seems to be ready on that front (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppStore/Interfaces/ClickPackageIndex#Localisation)
<mcphail> That's good to know
 * mcphail makes a mental note to include gettext support in anything he writes for the store
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/Canonical-Working-to-Add-Whatsapp-and-Dropbox-as-Services-and-Not-Apps-483172.shtml
<popey> we are!?
<faenil> lol
<brunch875> hillarious article
<brunch875> whatsapp service straight into the OS
<nik90> brunch875: why is that bad? It won't be installed by default, but the user can choose to install dropbox as a service.
<nik90> brunch875: I have seen imgur services which when installed doesnt show up as an application, but only when using content-hub as a destination to share images
<brunch875> I think we're not using the same definition of service
<lotuspsychje> whatsapp for androis is very unsecure, i wonder how that will turnout from touch?
<nik90> lotuspsychje: insecure as in others can read messages while it is being sent?
<faenil> aren't they using textsecure protocol nowadays?
<lotuspsychje> nik90: yeah many security flaws in whatsapp for android
<faenil> libaxoctl, whatever
<lotuspsychje> nik90: lucky we have telegram now
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, there are two minor conflicts when merging your keyboard navigation branch into the latest trunk, can you please resolve them?
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: i will be on that shortly
<oSoMoN> thx
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: merged
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, thanks
<brunch875> the OTA4 looks so promising I want to jump into the devel channel
<mcphail> brunch875: so what's sopping you :) - easy enough to go back...
<brunch875> arggh, I'm just scared I might brick it big time
<lotuspsychje> im on devel-proposed with nexus7 and i just love it
<jgdx> brunch875, how would you brick it?
 * popey notes latest gets 3 more points on html5test.com over current
<mcphail> brunch875: all flashing carries risks, but for androidy-type things there is usually a solution to reflash through recovery
<mcphail> brunch875: and changing channels isn't that much different to an OTA :)
<jgdx> I wonder what the actual risk is, given the amount of devices and the amount of flashings between the participants in this channel
<brunch875> It's more or less a phobia... my first smartphone was a windows6.5; I continued with windows7 and that device bricked itself with a normal update
<brunch875> and I couldn't get to talk to it via USB or anything
<brunch875> hardbricked
<brunch875> but what the hell... this thing is much better done
<jgdx> brunch875, bq?
<brunch875> besides, it should help the developers debug, shouldn't it?
<brunch875> nah, it was an HTC mozart I think
<jgdx> nopf, your current device
<brunch875> yeah, BQ
<mcphail> brunch875: yes - if it hard-bricks, the devs here will buy you a new one. I'll make that promise on their behalf :)
<jgdx> i'll chip in
<brunch875> :D
<jgdx> $10 is what 10%?
 * mcphail would like to point out he is not a dev and will not be contributing to the new phone
<popey> changing channel is _way_ less intrusive than flashing android
<brunch875> fine fine, you convinced me!
<brunch875> which channel should I get then, devel proposed?
<popey> or wait a week and get it when all the other people do :)
<popey> ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/bq-aquaris.en is the channel I have mine on
<mcphail> brunch875: do you like the bq-specific apps/scopes?
<brunch875> euuuh, I don't really use them
<brunch875> in fact, I don't even think I know which ones they are :p
<brunch875> the only scope I really use is the news one
<brunch875> I'll copy popee
<mcphail> brunch875: I suppose the benefits of the channels with "bq" in the name is you get the HERE maps and GPS database
<brunch875> unfortunalely the GPS doesn't work...
<beuno> ogra_, seb128, mandel, what what?
<seb128> beuno, updates list some click that needs to be updated even if it's uptodate
<seb128> beuno,         "_directory": "/opt/click.ubuntu.com/.click/users/phablet/com.ubuntu.developer.monichols.umetronome",
<seb128>          "framework": "ubuntu-sdk-14.10-dev2",
<seb128>          "_directory": "/opt/click.ubuntu.com/.click/users/phablet/umetronome.otter",
<seb128>          "framework": "ubuntu-sdk-15.04",
<seb128> beuno, seems like that's installed under different names and confuses things
<beuno> seb128, different names are different apps for the systems
<beuno> so the developer re-uploaded under a new namespace
<seb128> beuno, well, not sure what's going on but I've a "umetronome 1.5" update listed every time I open the panel, and installing it works fine
<seb128> that version is installed but it keeps wanting to "upgrade" to it
<seb128> so I guess the update panel gets confused by the rename and think the old name has an update when it doesn't or something
<beuno> seb128, so that piece of json comes from the client, no the server
<beuno> there is no rename as such, the device would see and update them separately
<beuno> it's all namespace-based
<beuno> if there's 2 different strings, it's 2 different apps
<beuno> so something else is confused
<beuno> the call to the server doesn't tell if there's something new
<beuno> you tell it what apps you have, and it tells you what the latest versions are
<seb128> beuno, k, I guess it's a bug in the updates panel backend and needs debugging there
<seb128> beuno, I'm going to try to have a look
<brunch875> 2015/06/03 14:02:43 Rebooting into recovery to flash
<brunch875> Failed to enter Recovery
<brunch875> brunch@Long:~$
<brunch875> well damn
 * brunch875 crosses fingers and waits for de ubuntu logo to finish spinning on his phone
<beuno> seb128, I can't think of what would trigger it, sorry  :(
<ogra_> if you havent installed an unlocked recovery that message is normal
<seb128> beuno, no worry
<brunch875> splash screens make me nervous :P I always hit ESC when booting my computer
<brunch875> I guess the average human is afraid of screen outputs
<brunch875> Aaaand the phone made it alive! Wooo! There's no doubt the ubuntu team made the flashing tool amazing
<brunch875> Cheers guys!
<popey> \o/
<jgdx> i just found that I am physically unable to write "TRANSLATORS" by using shift to make capital letters
<jgdx> or, err.. it could be a bug in keyboard driver
<seb128> jgdx, what's the issue?
<jgdx> seb128, I press SHIFT then "T" "R" and then "A" and I get "TAR" back
<seb128> is that on a desktop?
<seb128> or osk on a device?
<jgdx> dell xps 13
<seb128> weird
<seb128> in what editor?
<seb128> how does that work, you are supposed to get letter entered in real time
<jgdx> gnome-terminal, gedit
<seb128> what happens when you hit R?
<seb128> does it input a R?
<jgdx> I think T and R are down simultaneously at some point
<seb128> does that go back and change it when you enter the third char?
<seb128> hum?
<seb128> you press shift
<seb128> then hit T and relase the key
<jgdx> no
<seb128> then hit R and release the key
<seb128> no?
<popey> Pilot error :)
<seb128> I don't understand what you are doing :-/
<jgdx> it was originally meant as a joke on myself
<jgdx> so no wonder :P
<seb128> lol
<dholbach> hum... I can't add a PIN for my phone (to enable developer mode) - I'm on devel-proposed
<dholbach> anyone else having the same problem?
<seb128> dholbach, PIN != developer mode
<ogra_> uh, devel-proposed ? thats quite brave
<seb128> dholbach, the developer mode has to do with password, that can be pincode or passphrase
<dholbach> seb128, what am I supposed to do with your reply? :)
<ogra_> (zero QA ... not planned to go onto phones etc)
<dholbach> seb128, I can't add a pincode (step 1) to enable developer mode (step 2) :)
<seb128> dholbach, well, try to change the unlock mode rather than the PIN
<seb128> dholbach, PIN is a SIM card thing
<dholbach> sorry, in the german translation it says PIN
<seb128> dholbach, go to settings about -> dev mode, select the bottom item to change auth mode
<seb128> can you select passphrase?
<seb128> what is not working when you select a pin?
<ogra_> yeah, in german it somehow is "PIN" and "SIM-PIN"
<dholbach> yes, but when I try to set the password, it says "security mode can't be enabled"
<ogra_> not sure why :P
<dholbach> or whatever the English equivalent is
<dholbach> same as with the pincode
<seb128> mterry, ^ do you have any idea about that?
<nik90> ogra_: so I should be testing stuff on which channel exactly? devel ?
 * ogra_ would just say "its wily, who cares" but i guess a few people would disagree
<seb128> dholbach, seems like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1460017
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1459730 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1460017 passcode set on device, developer mode->lock security" disagrees" [Low,Incomplete]
<dholbach> ah ok
<seb128> dholbach, is that the first boot after install? try to reboot
<ogra_> nik90, one fo the rc-proposed ones
<dholbach> no, not first boot
<seb128> dholbach, weird :-/ maybe try to reboot anyway...
<nik90> ogra_: ack.
<seb128> ogra_, yeah, I disagree, wily is trunk and where most of the bugfixes land, we have a stack of improvements and fixes that are not in the vivid overlay
<dholbach> seb128, I just rebooted, but I'll try to again
<seb128> dholbach, sorry, dunno then :-/
<mterry> seb128, dholbach: huh, reading
<ogra_> seb128, and wily is planned to break heavily soon
<seb128> ogra_, well, we need somewhere to land fixes
<seb128> unsure where that is
<ogra_> seb128, i wouldnt even test against any of tehse images, i have no idea who made such insane requirements
<ogra_> seb128, imho it should be somewhere else ... or snappy development for phones needs to be somewhere else
<ogra_> either way the two wont go well together i guess ... until snappy is stabilized
<seb128> ogra_, yeah, just saying that atm we don't have any place where to do phone work
<ogra_> vivid+overlay ...
<seb128> ogra_, we have fixes landing in vcs trunk, but that's mapped to no usable serie
<seb128> ogra_, haha, good one
<ogra_> probably we should have vivid+overlay+overlay ;)
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> well maybe it's better after ota4
<seb128> but atm with things frozen it sucks
<mterry> seb128, dholbach: not sure why that would happen specifically, seems like wizard fails to set password, but it's really weird that a reboot fixes it
<dholbach> mterry, let me see if a reboot fixes it over here
<dupingping> How can i get ubuntu touch source?
<seb128> mterry, dholbach's case seems different, it's not after first boot for him
<mterry> seb128, dholbach: ah
<dupingping> It's very urgent.
<seb128> mterry, but it's the same error
<dupingping> How can i get Ubuntu Touch source?
<dupingping> It's close source?
<seb128> dupingping, sources are in launchpad
<dupingping> or open source?
<dupingping> seb128, oh, sir. let me try.
<seb128> dupingping, http://code.launchpad.net/<source> for <source> you are interested in
<seb128> dupingping, e.g https://code.launchpad.net/telephony-service to pick a random component
<dupingping> it shows me something.
<nik90> ogra_: what's the difference between ubuntu-touch/rc/ubuntu-developer and ubuntu-touch/rc/ubuntu ?
<dupingping> But I could not choose anyone.
<nik90> ogra_: nvr mind I see the following statement "Channel with a developer-oriented custom tarball, including extra payload useful for app-developers"
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, thereâs one autopilot test thatâs broken in the keyboard-navigation branch, Iâve commented on the MR
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: weird, they all worked when i tried them. looking
<elopio> Elleo: do you have a guide of how to add layouts to the keyboard?
<Elleo> elopio: not really, I started writing one; but it's rather incomplete and I'm currently in the process of completely changing the way layouts are created (making them *much* simpler, and possible to be distributed as click packages)
<Elleo> elopio: so its probably best to wait until the new layout mechanism lands before embarking on the creation of any new layouts
<Elleo> elopio: as the new ones are basically just simple json files that are incredibly easy to create, instead of whole custom QML layouts as the current ones are
<elopio> Elleo: ok. I want to write a simple one for Esperanto, so when you have something ready, let me know and I'll beta test it :)
<Elleo> elopio: okay, cool :)
<elopio> Elleo: what I saw was a lot of duplication, for the normal, email and url mode.
<Elleo> elopio: the old mechanism was nasty in a whole number of ways, which is why I'm glad to be replacing it ;)
<elopio> ok, thank you.
<elopio> I'll wait.
<Elleo> elopio: http://mikeasoft.com/~mike/keyboard_layout.json <-- this is basically all you have to do now to create all the layouts (it's using escaped unicode in that example, but it should work with unicode chars directly embedded in the json too)
<Elleo> email/url are still fully defined layouts, so there's still potentially some duplication there, but overall its much simpler
<elopio> Elleo: cool, +1.
<elopio> yes, I see {"shifted": ["Q", "1"], "default": ["q", "1"]}, three times.
<elopio> might be nice to define a section that applies to all the modes.
<elopio> but that's just a detail, this is a huge improvement already.
<popey> Elleo: do you have an ETA on when that will be done?
<Elleo> elopio: yeah, that'd need some co-ordination with the skeyer team though, as these json files are also used to provide spatial information for much better auto-correct
<elopio> oh, nice.
<Elleo> popey: I have stuff that roughly works for a couple of layouts (with bugs) now, there's probably another few weeks of work in it, but I have some other content-hub stuff to do this sprint, so probably won't be finished for another sprint or two
<popey> ok
<Mirv> Elleo: there's an old spreadsheet request about "prototype of integration with libskeyer". can it be removed or do you + bfiller want eg a wily or dual landing silo for it for testing?
<Elleo> Mirv: as far as I'm concerned it probably isn't needed (we can create a new silo when all this is actually ready); bfiller ^?
<bfiller> Elleo: it's fine to free it
<Mirv> Elleo: bfiller: thanks, cleaning up
<elopio> ping boiko: I'm trying to make a test with UriHandler. I'm looking at your code here and trying to understand how it works:
<elopio> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/messaging-app/trunk/view/head:/src/qml/messaging-app.qml#L153
<elopio> boiko: when you launch the application with message:///test, then that will be passed to the qml in uris?
<boiko> elopio: when launching with URIs, it will be handle by the C++ code
<elopio> boiko: but that's because you are calling application.parseArgument? or it will never hit this code?
<boiko> elopio: that line is for when the app is already running and an URI is passed to the app via url-dispatcher
<elopio> interesting.
<boiko> elopio: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/messaging-app/trunk/view/head:/src/messagingapplication.cpp#L84
<jgdx> kenvandine, could you take a look at what I added to the punch list?
<jgdx> I think we'd best warn in that case as well
<kenvandine> agreed
<kenvandine> it's inline with what we decided for the other case
<kenvandine> so good
<nik90> popey: quick question, I flashed ubuntu-touch/rc/ubuntu-developer and it doesn't seem to have the ubuntu-sdk-15.04 framework..Isn't this the channel from which OTA-4 will be cut?
<nik90> or do I need to be on ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/ubuntu-developer to get it?
<popey> hm, I honestly don't know.
<popey> I don't think it's going to come from that channel though
<popey> more likely from a -proposed one
<nik90> I will flash the rc-proposed one and check now
<popey> sil2100: will know where the image comes from for ota4
<sil2100> nik90: the image will be taken from ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/*
<sil2100> nik90: it will only be copied to the rc channel once preliminary tests pass
<nik90> sil2100: what is the purpose of the ubuntu-touch/rc/* channel for a beta tester/user
<ogra_> it is the "stable" channel
<sil2100> Not really stable ;)
<nik90> ogra_: well there is ubuntu-touch/stable/ubuntu for that ;)
<sil2100> The rc channel is like the preliminary place for stable images
<nik90> sil2100: ah ok..I understand
<sil2100> So, the idea of the rc channel currently is - the stable channel in theory gets updates once per month, while RC can get those more often, we copy images there once QA is done with testing
<ogra_> nik90, ubuntu-touch/stable/ubuntu is a community channel ... different images
<sil2100> But we only copy images from the rc channel to stable once we have an OTA planned and the device manufacturers are happy with the images
<sil2100> (at least until we still ask manufacturers for feedback before release)
<nik90> ack.
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, I found a few more functional issues on the keyboard navigation branch, commented there
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: ok, caught up with basic auth, i will try to address them all before the end of today or first thing tomororw
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, thanks
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, unrelated, but there are conflicts when merging https://code.launchpad.net/~uriboni/webbrowser-app/merge-url-functions/+merge/257641 into trunk, when you have a moment can you resolve them?
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: wow, that's an old one
<oSoMoN> yeah, it had fallen off my radar, letâs try to merge it with the next landing
<elopio> tedg: I now can launch the application with url-dispatcher. But if the application is already opened, and I call url-dispatcher on it, it's closed.
<elopio> should that scenario be supported with what you told me to do?
<brunch875> DAMNIT! This wifi is terrible! Is tethering implemented yet?
<tedg> elopio, Is it focused? And then you're sending a new URL to it?
<elopio> yes, and yes.
<kenvandine> brunch875, it is real close
<kenvandine> wifi hotspot that is
<kenvandine> i think usb tethering already works... if you know the magic to enable it :)
<dupingping> mlt, hi
<elopio> tedg: yes, and yes. (forgot the ping)
<tedg> elopio, So that could be a shell bug, we just in that case ask for it to be focused. Not sure what they do with an app that is focused that focuses again.
<elopio> tedg: let me try unfocused.
<dobey> why is adb so fidgety on devel-proposed?
<ogra_> dobey, because devel proposed isnt for using it ?
<ogra_> thats wily
<ogra_> (probably adb knows that :) )
<dobey> ogra_: right, and i am trying to test stuff for landing in wily. but i don't see why adb would be affected and my phablet-shell session would keep getting disconnected
<ogra_> yeah, i dont know either ... i really dont get how we can say on one hand "wily isnt for phones" and also plan to break it to a point where it will be unbootable for a while and at the same time ask people to test there
<dobey> ogra_: well, i guess we can't really break it to the point it's unbootable, since proposed migration blocks on a boot test for things that are shipped on the phone images?
<ogra_> we will have to
<ogra_> else we wont be able to switch to snappy
<dobey> anyway, we aren't at that point yet
<ogra_> at some point we will need to replace the initrd
<dobey> so i don't see why adb is having issues *now*
<ogra_> i dont either
<ogra_> what device is that
<dobey> mako
<ogra_> well, i dont think anything changed in adb since several months
<dobey> right, and the android bits are the same as in vivid/rtm images, no?
<ogra_> in facct adb hasnt even been rebuilt in wily
<dobey> oh
<ogra_> the android package has though ... but only for dropping the remaining dead code of grouper
<dobey> hmmm
<ogra_> (and it hardcodes its own toolchain, so shouldnt be binary different to vivid)
<ogra_> dobey, if it would be really flaky i would expect plars to scream and shout though ... could it be your host ?
<dobey> ogra_: i guess it could be, but i've only just started having these issues the past couple of days (granted, i haven't actually done any testing on the device for a while, and was on vacation last week)
<plars> dobey: ubuntu-touch/devel-proposed/ubuntu seems to be booting on mako ok for the most part
<dobey> plars: yeah, it boots and works mostly fine for me. i'm only having a problem with adb being flaky while i'm trying to use phablet-shell
<plars> 214 at least got that far, but we did have some test failures it looks like. As for the boottest process, that only runs on krillin
<dobey> or maybe it's not adb that's flaky, but sshd?
<plars> ah
<plars> dobey: for smoke runs, we do things over adb. I have problems with ssh a lot to phones here lately when trying to mess with adt-run and boottest though
<plars> lots of adt-run failures with 255, which means some command it was running over ssh died because of ssh I believe
<dobey> oh
<dobey> so i guess you are seeing the same issue :)
<plars> for smoke runs though ssh doesn't get used
<taiebot> Love the new header animation on shorts-reboot. Is it a design decision ? In other word will it be used in other apps?
<brunch875> kenvandine: I'm glad you guys almost have the wifi tethering done. Keep up the good work!
<brunch875> usb tethering refused to work on my old android for some reason
<brunch875> ubuntu has great potential
<xdfh> Hi! Here https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/start/ubuntu-for-devices/devices/ it was mentioned that there is a community edition of ubuntu touch for nexus 7 (2012), but here : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices there is no link for install, is it possible to install ubuntu on 2012 revision of nexus 7 ?
<Eks> Hi everyone, how can I fix my gps ?? When I try to use maps a message says geolocation failed
<Eks> Is there no way to make Ubuntu works?
<dobey> ogra_: ah, so. apparently the usb 2.x header in my pc case is acting up now. :(
<dobey> xdfh: no, there is no image build for it any more
<xdfh> what's a pity!:(
<dobey> xdfh: the first link says "may be" (not that there is, only that it's a possibility that someone might build one)
<dobey> xdfh: unfortunately, it's a tegra device, so the hardware is not really usable with the current aosp and ubuntu versions as i understand it
<xdfh> isn't a cyanogen mode based on aosp? it works on 2012 nexus
<dobey> i don't know what the cm build for the 2012 n7 is comprised of
<dobey> maybe the xda-dev forum has more info about that
<xdfh> CyanogenMod 12.0, ROM for the Nexus 7  Contributors ThÃ¶my ROM OS Version: 5.0.x Lollipop ROM Kernel: Linux 3.1.x Based On: AOSP
<mcphail> Ha - just created the world's least friendly app for Ubuntu - a syncthing client which runs in the background
<mcphail> Works well but needs command-line configuration
<mcphail> Proof, however, that complex apps can run in the background without special permissions
<taiebot> eks: which device?
<dobey> taiebot: eks left :)
<taiebot> dobey: thanks for letting me know
<ahoneybun> http://www.androidpolice.com/2015/06/03/huawei-announces-the-ascend-p8-lite-for-the-us-slick-5-design-dual-sim-and-a-snapdragon-615-for-250-unlocked/
<ahoneybun> we should try to port to this'
<ahoneybun> 250 unlocked in the US
<ahoneybun> dual sim
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/You-Can-Now-Install-and-Test-Unity-8-and-Mir-in-Any-Supported-Ubuntu-OS-483206.shtml
<taiebot> ahoneybun. my next phone will be supported by ubuntu, Sim free and powerfull :-D. I do think patience is a virtue.
<dobey> ahoneybun: i think it's 'blue' that also makes dual sim phones for us market, if you want a moderate dual sim phone
<ahoneybun> BLU
<ahoneybun> yea they do and unlocked as well.
<taiebot> ahoneybun unlock means sim free no?
<ahoneybun> no?
<ahoneybun> my phone is unlocked and it has a SIM
<ahoneybun> unlock means no contact unless you sign on
<ahoneybun> e
<ahoneybun> I jump between Cricket and Ting
<ahoneybun> no contact to say with one or the other
<zombienerd> locked/unlocked refers to the network provider.
<zombienerd> A locked phone can only be used on one network, generally the one who sold the phone
<dobey> ahoneybun: "sim free" means "sim unlocked"
<ahoneybun> hell even Verizon has SIM cards
<ahoneybun> oh?
<taiebot> ahoneybun ok we are on the same page i though you were saying unlock boot loader
<ahoneybun> no no
<dobey> verizon doesn't have sim cards
<ahoneybun> 4G SIM cards
<zombienerd> My last three verizon phones had simds
<zombienerd> sims*
<zombienerd> Motorola Droid 2 Global, Motorola Droid 4, and Samsung Galaxy Stratosphere 2
<dobey> had sims, or had sim slots?
<zombienerd> Sims.
<ahoneybun> HTC One M7 needed a 4G SIM card to use the their 4G network
<zombienerd> I still have my old Verizon sim cards from before I switched to AT&T
<taiebot> i like the new meizu m2 which can do either two sim card or one sim + an Sd card
 * ahoneybun is with Cricket (AT&T)
<dobey> oh, maybe they are moving into the modern age now then
<dobey> well, aside from the fact that it's still a total ripoff
<ahoneybun> true
<zombienerd> I just wish they'd squash the tethering bug for Mako already.. I need to tether.
<dobey> hmm, oxide and QtNetwork are using different ssl certificate stores?
<brunch875> Telegram is running very very very very slowly. Is there any folder I can delete to "reset" it?
<brunch875> /home/phablet/.cache/com.ubuntu.telegram/ <---- I deleted this folder and now telegram goes torpedo-fast
<lotuspsychje> no auto cache cleaning inside?
<brunch875> I would get rid of cache altogether... it seems to do more harm than good
<brunch875> I noticed no difference after deleting that folder other than the speed enhancement
<lotuspsychje> i do the same on firefox, cache buffer 0
<nvidiaw> what do you have to type to get windows on the phone?
<lotuspsychje> nvidiaw: on wich phone
<nvidiaw> bq e4.5
<lotuspsychje> nvidiaw: why do you want windows on an ubuntu phone?
<nvidiaw> i like windows :D
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> nvidiaw: i think you better join in ##windows then
<nvidiaw> :)) probably
<lotuspsychje> nvidiaw: you dont like ubuntu touch?
<nvidiaw> i love it
<lotuspsychje> nvidiaw: you wanna dualboot touch and windows then?
<nvidiaw> ah.. no... i just want windows
<nvidiaw> windowed mode
<nvidiaw> never mind :P
<dobey> you want to use your phone like a normal pc you mean?
<dobey> the e4.5 does not have that feature, and it is not ready yet. the first phone with convergence support will be out later this year
<nvidiaw> i know, i just want to play with the windowed mode
<dobey> so short answer is "wait patiently" :)
<nvidiaw> waiting :D
<brunch875> will anything break if I wipe the .cache folder?
<dobey> brunch875: if it does, it's a bug
 * brunch875 goes at it
<nvidiaw> it think i found it :D hehe gsettings list-keys com.canonical.Unity8
<brunch875> well, almost everything is reloading now as if I just installed it
<nvidiaw> and there is usage-mode - probably windowed
<brunch875> but some apps seem to be running faster
<brunch875> (which makes the uu game more difficult!)
<cm-t> staying at  lvl 84 for a week ! (uu)
 * brunch875 is at 186
<cm-t> wow
<brunch875> we gotta nag the author to add high-scores
<brunch875> online highscores
<brunch875> I wonder if there's a level limit
<brunch875> for me the sticks are now larger than the horizontal space
 * brunch875 is off to sleep
<nvidiaw> gsettings set com.canonical.Unity8 usage-mode Windowed
<nvidiaw> works :D windows on the phone
<mariogrip> nvidiaw: also you can use the openstore to download an app called TweakGeek, that has a settin for window mode
<mariogrip> https://open.uappexplorer.com/app/tweakgeek.mzanetti
<nvidiaw> uuuuuuuuu nice! thanks!
<mariogrip> nvidiaw: if i remember correctly you might need to run 15.04 (rc_ to use window mode, but you can give it a try.
<mariogrip> (rc (or better) channel)
<nvidiaw> q
<yaya> hello sir
<yaya> are you there?
<yaya> i need htc desire bravo rom for ubuntu manufacture by nikoz but how i download   http://downloads.nikez.nu/ wapsite not working
<OerHeks> yaya, that post from nikoz was 2013, and points originally to http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch-preview/daily-preinstalled/current/quantal-preinstalled-phablet-armhf.zip i think
#ubuntu-touch 2015-06-04
<yaya> hello
<zombienerd> I'm still looking for a workaround to get tethering to work on Mako devel-channel.  If anyone has any info, it would be greatly appreciated.
<OerHeks> E5 will be available for purchase on about June 12, across the entire European Union .... nine euros less than the Android version.
<nhaines> That's not too shabby.  :D
<OerHeks> http://www.zdnet.com/article/a-new-day-a-new-ubuntu-smartphone/
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/06/vision-mobile-developer-census-win-ubuntu-phone
<lotuspsychje> thats1 for you devs :p
<dholbach> good morning
<mpt> dholbach, good morning, is anything on <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bluetooth/TODO> remotely relevant any more, or can I delete the page?
<larsu> given that the linked bugs were fixed 7 years ago, I'd say it's safe to delete
<dholbach> yeah, looks like it
<zyga> bzoltan, Mirv: hi, what is the status of the UITK runtime for 14.04, I read the announcement and I'd like to give it a try
<raj> can someone tell me what building this is? https://i.imgur.com/6Otbv9I.png
<popey> That's the walkie talkie
<popey> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2786723/London-skyscraper-Walkie-Talkie-melted-cars-reflecting-sunlight-fitted-shading.html
<popey> :)
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Hug Your Cat Day! ð
<dkessel> setting PIN or password security fails on my nexus 7 after a clean re-flash. I cannot switch to developer mode because of this...
<Mirv> JamesTait: I wish, not at home :(
<nhaines> dkessel: what image are you running?
<dkessel> vivid-devel-proposed 214
<dkessel> nhaines: ^
<JamesTait> Mirv, when you get home is fine. ð
<Mirv> only when the sprint is done!
<Mirv> that's luckily tomorrow though
<nhaines> dkessel: this also fails in my upgraded r214, as well as in wily.
<nhaines> Bug time!  :)
<dkessel> shall I or will you? I am unsure about the package
<nhaines> Ooh, I don't know which package either.
<nhaines> I'm late getting to bed.  If you file the bug, I'll +1 it and confirm it.
<dkessel> ok nhaines
<dkessel> popey: can you helping me finding the right package to file this bug against? we cannot set password or pin security on touch vivid r214 and wily
<popey> someone mentioned this yesterday iirc
<popey> ah it was dholbach
<nhaines> dkessel: thanks a ton.  I'll stick around a few minutes and keep an eye out.  Just let me know the bug number.  :)
<popey> dholbach: did you get it fixed?
<dholbach> popey, no
<dholbach> mterry and seb128 mentioned a bug to me
<larsu> switched my nexus4 to systemd and now it doesn't boot anymore. goes to black after the google logo, but seems to be on. no adb. also no pitti. anyone got an idea how I could debug it?
<dholbach> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1460017 maybe?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1459730 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1460017 passcode set on device, developer mode->lock security" disagrees" [Low,Incomplete]
<nhaines> dholbach: that's the one!
<nhaines> dkessel: ^^
<nhaines> dholbach: also important: how do I actually clear the passcode?
<dholbach> I don't know - I rebooted, then had to type in the pincode in the passcode-dialog - it was all very confusing
<dkessel> dholbach: except i cannot set a password/code under "Security & Privacy" -> "Lock phone" -> "Lock security", either...
<nhaines> Hm.
<dholbach> try rebooting and see if it's set then
<dkessel> k
<nhaines> Rebooting now.
<dholbach> good luck
 * dholbach runs some errands
<nhaines> Same.
<ogra_> just use the passwd command ?
<nhaines> wait.
<nhaines> Suddenly this says Ubuntu 15.10.  Which is weird.
<popey> uhoh
<popey> you're on devel-proposed?
<ogra_> whats weird about that
<popey> You don't want that
<ogra_> popey, he said so above :)
<nhaines> I am.
<nhaines> But *yesterday* it was vivid.
<popey> Working as designed then.
<popey> unlikely.
<ogra_> i'm not sure you can use the terminal without pin/password ... but if you can, the passwd command would do
<ogra_> (to set a pin)
<popey> haha, my krillin has been on for 4 days, still 70% charge
<ogra_> popey, yeah, and next time you charge it it only survives 30h
<ogra_> for me its been on and off recently :(
<popey> odd
<popey> ah, new mvm update, mine won't last long now
<dkessel> ogra_: so i would just type the PIN as the password for passwd?
<ogra_> sometimes it doesnt discharge at all, sometimes it doesnt survive 2 days
<nhaines> Yay, password removed.
<ogra_> dkessel, yes, thats what the backend does ... your prob will be that there is more to it
<ogra_> if anything needs to know about pin vs password, thats set in a debus service somewhere
<ogra_> *dbus
<larsu> deebus
<ogra_> lol
<dkessel> dkessel: ok, so now it is working after using passwd
<dkessel> still, it wourld not be working out of the box with r214 :p
<larsu> larsu: I think dkessel is talking to himself
<nhaines> larsu: that's not so strange.  But if he answers back, start to back away slowly.
<dkessel> lol
<larsu> haha
<dkessel> larsu: oops. thats the problem with identical first names with d holbach :)
<larsu> one of you change it. Quick!
<nhaines> popey: devel/ubuntu on Nexus 7 only has two images.
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: that failing test in the keyboard navigation branch is really odd. i am trying to run back the changes one commit at a time to see what is causing it, as i have exhausted all other options
<Mirv> oSoMoN: how's the current webbrowser-app private headers usage status in wily, I haven't followed for a while?
<oSoMoN> Mirv, still in use for the DirectionalDragArea component, but thereâs been progress on this front, the unity8 team has been working on refactoring it with the goal to move it to the UITK
<Mirv> oSoMoN: thanks checking since I'm finally approaching some sort of success with qt 5.5 beta
<Mirv> so I'll rebuild webbrowser too
<Mirv> I'm pretty interested if anything works or not... and if stuff works I'll go through the currently filed 5.5 bugs again and confirm them
<Mirv> Elleo: hey, could we land the bug #1437182 to wily?
<ubot5> bug 1437182 in maliit-framework (Ubuntu) "maliit-framework fails to build against Qt 5.5" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1437182
<Mirv> so that I could more easily test Qt 5.5 in PPA
<Elleo> Mirv: yeah, that patch has actually been accepted upstream now; so might be worth syncing the package from upstream? rsalveti has been maintaining that package most recently, so probably best to get his view on it
<Mirv> Elleo: oh, that's excellent! I'm not sure how available rsalveti is though atm for extra work.
<Mirv> Elleo: would you be ok running whatever tests you run on a maliit-framework  if I uploaded an update with the 014 patch?
<Mirv> (to a silo)
<Elleo> Mirv: sure
<ahoneybun> mhall119: does your N4 randomly vibrate ?
<Mirv> Elleo: https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-031/ is now ready for testing on wily. when you have time for it, just ping me afterwards if testing is ok and I can publish it.
<Elleo> Mirv: okay, will do :)
<kenvandine> jgdx, great to see that you finished the todo list for the APN editor!
<kenvandine> jgdx, but we don't want to land it yet until the NetworkManager, nuntium and ofono fixes are ready right?
<kenvandine> jgdx, any idea what's up with those ap failures?  some of them are from cellular and phone, and the security panel tests that failed are from the sim pin code, which borrows from cellular
<jgdx> kenvandine, no, it would make for a sweet but nonfunctional ui
<jgdx> kenvandine, not yet
<kenvandine> the previous revision passed though
<jgdx> kenvandine, you know if the tasks you mentioned are tracked?
<kenvandine> so maybe flaky :(
<kenvandine> not sure
<kenvandine> they are on the punch list :)
<kenvandine> not sure about bugs
<jgdx> kenvandine, that kinda flakyness smells like dbus
<kenvandine> it can be stinky
<jgdx> I'll take a look at the cleanup, maybe there's something we're doing wrong
<kenvandine> jgdx, cool
<kenvandine> jgdx, i'm reviewing your branch now
<jgdx> kenvandine, you okay with leaving the debug info in until we're go for landing?
<kenvandine> jgdx, you should update the MP description and commit message though
<jgdx> *debug code
<kenvandine> yes... i  just won't approve it yet
<jgdx> thanks
<kenvandine> i'll comment on other things i find though
<rbnmaia> hello guys
<jgdx> kenvandine, right, there's some unintuitive code handling ConnMan while resetting the APN configuration. I've made comments, but in case it is not clear: If cellular data is ON we can't reset, so we turn it OFF. After a reset is complete, we restore the cellular data setting.
<jgdx> ResetContexts is sync in libqofono for this to work
<jgdx> kenvandine, also, 100% pass rate on silo 33 on a krillin
<kenvandine> jgdx, cool!
<seb128> kenvandine, jgdx, can you review https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/visible-file-exists/+merge/261096 ? trying to land that to wily to unblock the snappy desktop image build (u-s-s currently depends on system-image-dbus and s-i conflicts with snappy so apt bails out)
<seb128> kenvandine, jgdx, https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/battery-rendering-glitches/+merge/260991 should be trivial if you want to ack that as well while you are at reviewing ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, will do
<kenvandine> seb128, the visible-file-exists branch looks good but i haven't tested it... i assume you did?
<seb128> kenvandine, yes
<kenvandine> ok, i'll trust you instead of waiting for debs :)
<kenvandine> it looks safe
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<seb128> it's also wily only ;-)
<seb128> I'm going to silo test before landing anyway
<kenvandine> approved
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, want to review the other 1 liner as well?
<seb128> or I can keep that for another latter landing
<kenvandine> the brightness one?
<kenvandine> i did already :)
<seb128> kenvandine, no, the battery graph one
<seb128> oh, you did :-)
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<kenvandine> np
<brunch875> Is there a way to uninstall scopes?
<brunch875> The reddit scope doesn't load anything...
<dobey> brunch875: find it in the store, and you can uninstall the package from its preview there
<cwayne1> reddit scope isnt actually installed on the device though
<cwayne1> its a remote scope
<mariogrip> abeato and awe, i'm still struggling with ofono... awe, I got the OEM_HOOK_RAW to send with correct parcel, but it require a oem command but of what i understand it does not seem like android is sending an command id. I'm just wondering if you can take a look at this and maybe make some sense out of why radio start is UNAVAILABLE. this is what RIL.java is
<mariogrip> requesting before it turns on radio http://paste.ubuntu.com/11569119/ I cannot see any reason for radio state to be UNAVAILABLE, so i'm kinda lost... full android log: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11569215/ full ofono log: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11569264/
<awe> mariogrip, this is a GSM phone, correct?
<awe> mariogrip, so basically you're issue is you still can't get the phone to come online properly, correct?
<awe> it might be worth filing an ofono bug, just as a convient place to put the RIL logs for both Android and ofono
<awe> mariogrip, do you have the capability to build a CM image for the phone?  It appears the Android traces you're providing are just radio logcat output
<awe> which are a bit hard to follow for the sake of tracing RIL requests/replies
<mariogrip> awe: I can build CM for the phone
<mariogrip> yeah, they are logcat output
<mariogrip> with rild set to debug
<awe> you'll get a better RIL trace by enabling the tracing in libril.cpp
<awe> it'll show request, replies, and parameters for each
<awe> brb
<nico_rikken> Just a small question: Does the BQ (old or new) come with an unlockeable bootloader, so I can flash my own (free/libre) firmware?
<peat-psuwit> Can Ubuntu touch play video from URL?
<dobey> peat-psuwit: the media player just plays URLs, for local files it uses video:/// URLs i think.
<peat-psuwit> dobey: How? Browser?
<dobey> i'm not sure i understand what you're asking
<dobey> jhodapp: ^^ maybe you can provide better answers here? :)
<peat-psuwit> Ex: Play this URL in Ubuntu touch http://live.thairath.co.th/trtv2/playlist.m3u8
<kenvandine> bfiller, Elleo:  for handling "all" types, we really only want source apps to register as providing "all" right?  we shouldn't have share and import handlers registering as "all"?
<jhodapp> peat-psuwit, that's Apple's HTTP Live Streaming and not supported yet
<jhodapp> peat-psuwit, there's gstreamer plugins for it, but it's not been tested on a UT device yet
<kenvandine> bfiller, Elleo: although registering as an import handler for "all" would be nice for handling the download of unknown types
<jhodapp> peat-psuwit, it's not difficult to support, just not yet
<peat-psuwit> jhodapp: Oh, Ok then. How about progressive one? ex: http://download.blender.org/peach/bigbuckbunny_movies/big_buck_bunny_720p_h264.mov
<Elleo> kenvandine: wouldn't destination apps need to be able to register as all for when legacy apps are saving things?
<kenvandine> actually the other way around
<kenvandine> no... hmm
<jhodapp> peat-psuwit, what do you mean...that specific video file doesn't play?
<kenvandine> Elleo, opening a file saved by a legacy app would be looking for a source for "all"
<kenvandine> not a dest
<kenvandine> but it could be interesting handling all for dest, it could be used for downloading unknown types
<kenvandine> and... possibly the whole idea of piping content through a middle app
<peat-psuwit> jhodapp: It seems like the whole file have to be downloaded first. Can't it be streamed?
<jhodapp> peat-psuwit, should be able to be streamed...you're trying with mediaplayer-app?
<kenvandine> Elleo, so maybe dest and source but not share
<peat-psuwit> jhodapp: I pasted the URL in browser, expecting it to be opened in media player. But the "Open file" appeared and only "Gallery" is available.
<peat-psuwit> jhodapp: After pressing that, the entry appear in "Files" indicator.
<jhodapp> peat-psuwit, yeah I doubt that would work since the browser currently has no notion of media except for its internal software-based pipeline...this should be able to act more like you'd expect with media-hub integration (in the works now)
<jhodapp> peat-psuwit, but check with the web browser guys as we might at least be able to get it to bring up mediaplayer-app
<peat-psuwit> jhodapp: filling a bug?
<jhodapp> peat-psuwit, yeah that'd be a start
<peat-psuwit> jhodapp: Ok.
<peat-psuwit> jhodapp: BTW, doesn't browser use GStreamer?
<jhodapp> peat-psuwit, no, it has it's own GStreamer equivalent and ffmpeg-based codecs
<studio_> hi
<nico_rikken> So my retry: Just a small question: Does the BQ (old or new) come with an unlockeable bootloader, so I can flash my own (free/libre) firmware?
<studio_> sturmflut was searching for a dlna-player for ubuntu touch. what about "xupnpd"? if the media-player can handle m3u xupnpd should work as a dlna-client.
<dobey> media-player doesn't need to handle m3u playlists to have a dlna client
<dobey> someone just needs to write a dlna client app that passes the video urls to media player
<studio_> dobey, that is, what xupnpd made, a simple m3u
<dobey> i don't know what xupnpd is, but the ending 'd' implies it is not a client, but a server
<studio_> you can use xupnpd also as "server", but i am using it for to grab external links (iptv).
<studio_> http://xupnpd.org/t/
<peat-psuwit> jhodapp: I think I know why that video URL doesn't play. That server doesn't set Content-Type properly. just tested another URL and that plays smoothly in browser.
<jhodapp> peat-psuwit, ah good to know, same happens in the browser on Ubuntu desktop so sounds like it's not a bug in the browser after all
<studio_> dobey, is the media-player now able to play external audio or video streams, if yes, on what version?
<studio_> i mean via m3u
<dobey> why do you need m3u?
<dobey> playlist != stream
<studio_> for iptv and internet radio
<studio_> also for "internal" tv and radio from my sat receivers, they also offer m3u for casting video and audio streams
<dobey> ok, that is not dlna
<dobey> if you mean m3u, say m3u. dlna is something else.
<studio_> no
<studio_> m3u is just the playlist
<studio_> what the dlna client can handle
<dobey> yes, an m3u is a playlist
<dobey> it has nothing to do with dlna itself
<studio_> so, how to stream, for exp. from an dlna-server, what is offering m3u-playlists or an dlna-client, what is offering m3u-urls for a single program?
<popey> studio_: port an existing app or write a new one
<studio_> popey, please, have a look at xupnpd, i am using it since years.
<popey> thats a media server, not client
<studio_> it is a client
<studio_> also
<studio_> you can simple configure the lua's
<popey> I'm not particularly interested in that. I use mediatomb and xbmc/kodi
<studio_> and it is much better than djmount
<studio_> kodi on ubuntu touch would be nice !!!
<studio_> popey, how did you run kodi on ubuntu touch?
<popey> i haven't
<studio_> so, therefore i made an offer for an working dlna-client under arm
<popey> you're porting one?
<studio_> not me, but coolstream, raspberry and openwrt made that
<dobey> the app itself could parse the m3u and then pass the URLs along to media-hub.
<dobey> you just need to write an app to do it
<brunch875> it seems like the meizu's locked so it cannot be flashed
<brunch875> that's something terrible
<studio_> dobey, i don't understand, i thought m3u is a new feature?
<dobey> brunch875: all retail phones come with locked boot loaders
<dobey> studio_: m3u is a simple file format. it's a plain text file with a list of URLs
<studio_> dobey, yes, i know.
<dobey> m3u support might eventually get added to media-hub or media-player, but there is nothing preventing your app from doing the parsing of such a file, and then passing the resulting media URLs on to media-hub
<studio_> so what kind or url's in the new feature are supported, only "local files"?
<studio_> or=of
<brunch875> I don't know much about it, but as I can see on the mailing list ubuntu-device-flash fails on the meizu whereas I succeeded on my BQ
<dobey> i don't know what you mean by "in the new feature"
<dobey> afaik, http/https urls will play fine in media-hub
<dobey> brunch875: i guess you used the alternate recovery image to do that?
<popey> brunch875: the person on the list didn't buy an ubuntu one though
<brunch875> oooh!
<studio_> exp.: http://linuxg.net/the-ubuntu-touch-ota-4-update-will-bring-important-new-features/
<popey> brunch875: so not so terrible, and no more terrible than every other phone
<brunch875> dobey: I yesterday changed to the RC channel to enjoy dem' updates
 * brunch875 is off for dinner
<dobey> studio_: well if m3u is supported then try it out
<studio_> dobey, i was reading, that one person, who tested an m3u, told, that his browser opened the stream. i thing this is not correct, normally a media-player should be opened ...
<dobey> i don't know how that person tested the m3u
<dobey> you should probably ask that one person rather than asking arbitrarily obscure questions in here
<studio_> that person was on the original channel for the bq E4.5
<studio_> therefore i asked, on what channel is m3u working
<dobey> if that person was usilng the stable channel, then that person obviously doesn't have m3u support
<dobey> it would be on the rc-proposed channel i would guess
<studio_> ok
<dobey> at least if it "will be in ota 4" then that means it will be in the update that switches to vivid, which would currently be the rc-proposed channel afaik
<popey> studio_: just tried an m3u8 file and it didn't work
<popey> tried http://jblive.videocdn.scaleengine.net/jb-live/play/jblive.stream/playlist.m3u8
<popey> browser prompted to "open with" but had nothing that could open those files
<studio_> popey, i don't know if "m3u8" is supported by ubuntu touch. a normal m3u should work, does it?
<dobey> m3u8 doesn't work
<popey> give me an example m3u
<studio_> wait
<popey> found one http://twit.am/listen.m3u
<dobey> hmm, di.fm seems to not have an m3u link that is obvious any more. all their channels seem to want to play in-browser
<studio_> make a "ondalatina.m3u" with "#EXTM3U
<studio_> #EXTINF:0,lautfm - ondalatina
<studio_> http://stream.laut.fm:80/ondalatina"
<popey> no, it doesn't work
<popey> launches music app which cannot handle those files
<dobey> the # lines are irrelevant
<dobey> popey: i guess music-app can't play streams yet?
<popey> correct
<popey> it only plays local music
<studio_> ok
<studio_> so icecast is also not working
<popey> yup
<studio_> ok, seem it needs to have more time, i know, i am too much impatient ... :(
<jimcornette> Hello there I have a simple question about qt5 in 12.04.  I have a autobuilder network and when I try to  build apps against it I am running into big issues with the ppa that is for 12.04. I have added the ppa but when I go to build it c an not pull in things like libqt5qml5 and many others
<jimcornette> so all the packages fail.  So is there another repo ?  or do I have to backport qt5 in full?  If this is the case is there a command to get all source code for qt5 ?  apt-get source <all of qt5>  then I guess I will have to build that on my autobuilder and push to repo so that I can  build my apps
<jimcornette> the ppa that I am talking about is ubuntu-sdk-team/ppa
<dobey> jimcornette: i'm not quite sure what you're trying to do, but 12.04 is not a supported phone target
<jimcornette> dobey,  So I have a autobuilder (sbuild,schroots,databases ect) these are on cronjobs but when it try's to build any qt5 application that is in the autobuilder network It fails because it can not get any of the qt5 libs.  so just wondering if I have to backport all of it.
<dobey> jimcornette: yes. https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qtbase-opensource-src does not show precise as having qt5
<jimcornette> cool and thanks. !!
#ubuntu-touch 2015-06-05
<lotuspsychje> http://linux.softpedia.com/blog/Ubuntu-Phone-s-Music-Scope-Gives-You-Access-to-Over-30-Million-Songs-from-7digital-483367.shtml
<OerHeks> nice, 3 minute songs ? that would take me 171,232876712 years to listen
<lotuspsychje> lol
<liuxg_> why cannot I define a property in "Column" inãQML?
<liuxg_> PickerPanel is not defined, what is the module for it in Ubuntu phone?
<dholbach> good morning
<pragomer> hello. wanted to ask for an advice what ubuntu phone to buy for first.. in a few weeks there will be (in hope so for europe) above the bq 4.5 the bq hd5 and the meizu phone.. trying to choose between the last two phones. what I thought.. meizu will have the better hardware.. bq is in europe (better for reclamations and garanty)... normally I would prefer an european vendor.. but the meizu is (at this time I need a new phone) the be
<pragomer> tter hardware.
<pragomer> could you give me some advice.. perhaps information I did not think on until now
<popey> pragomer: the bq devices have sd slots and two sim slots if that's important to you
<popey> the meizu doesn't have multiple sim slots or an sd slot
<pragomer> ok.. this is also a point to BQ... what do YOU own? :-)
<pragomer> tried the 4.5 ?
<pragomer> is it ok?
<popey> i have the bq e4.5 and a meizu mx4
<popey> I dont have the e5 hd yet
 * RAOF really liked the e4.5 form factor, and is sad it went through the wash.
<JamesTait> Good morning, people! Happy Friday, and happy World Environment Day! ð
<pragomer> oh.. you have the mx4.. I think you bought it with android and flashed it with ubuntu-touch? do you feel a strong performance advantage to the 4.5 ?
<popey> pragomer: the mx4 is quite a bit more performant than the e4.5
<popey> more RAM too
<pragomer> mm... my direction goes to bq I think... unfortunatly I am without any phone at the moment.. could I expect the BQ HD5 to be bought in the next 2-3 weeks?
<popey> I understand the E5 HD goes on sale next week.
<pragomer> oh.. thats cool.. think I will take the E5 than
<pragomer> thank you.. helped me with my decision
<popey> no problem
<brunch875> I noticed an issue with the 'swipe from bottom' to display tabs on the browser
<brunch875> if the phone is on landscape mode, it won't work
<ogra_> brunch875, how would it ... the "bottom" edge is occupied by a system gesture in that case
<brunch875> well... by using the new 'side' edge
<ogra_> she3ll rotation will fix that once it landed
<ogra_> *shell
<brunch875> neat :D
<ogra_> but as long as the system gesture is sticky the browser cant occupy that egde
<ogra_> (with shell rotation the input rotates as well)
<brunch875> it's good to hear that
<popey> ogra_: i have a 14.04 server and have added the sdk team ppa and upgraded, adb isn't seeing my nexus 7
<popey> ogra_: is there some magic I need to do on 14.04 to make adb work correctly?
<popey> it shows in dmesg
<popey> and adb devices shows it on another machine, so i know the tablet and cable are good
<popey> android-tools-adb is 4.2.2+git20130218-3ubuntu36 from sdk ppa
<popey> which is a bit older than the one on my 15.10 desktop
<mandel> ogra_,  crazy question, but do you know what happened with Ubuntu-engineering mainling list, I got unsubscribed
<popey> there's a new list
<popey> ues
<popey> poke msm if you weren't moved over
<mandel> popey, ok, thx! I probably missed the email since I read maiing lists every two/three days
<mandel> too much email
<popey> :)
<abique> Hi, I just got this touch screen from dell, and I wonder if anyone could recommend a software to try the touchscreen with gestures?
<ogra_> mandel, what popey said ... new teams ...
<mandel> ogra_, yep, makes sense
<mandel> moving moving moving ja
<ogra_> popey, you really dont want to run your converged desktop off an SD card even if it claims "30 times faster than a snail" :)
<popey> heh
<popey> well, desktop on the phone, data on the card
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> i hope we will get some real SSD in the converged phone ... even if its only 64G or some such
<ogra_> heck, even 32G and SD slot would be fine :)
<mcphail> On the subject of SD cards, can we get default read/write permission to a directory on the sd card for apps please?
<ogra_> not without someone implementing a proper SD crad service in the framework
<ogra_> which we currently do not have
<mcphail> ogra_: we don't really need an sdcard service, just a default inclusion of /media/*/*/appname.user/
<ogra_> we do ... so you cant just fiddle with apparmor to break security :P
 * mcphail is busted
<ogra_> also app separation is close to impossible to do securely on a vfat system
<ogra_> until these points are solved i doubt there will be SD support for confined apps
<mcphail> :(
<ogra_> all "workarounds" you could do currenly would only expose security bugs that would be closed immediately
<ogra_> (so these workarounds wouldnt get you very far)
<mcphail> ext4 for the sdcard would be a good thing, though
<ogra_> mcphail, except that they wont work in your moms win XP desktop :)
 * mcphail wonders how many windows-only households have an Ubuntu phone...?
<ogra_> mcphail, long term hopefully many
<mcphail> is the MTP interface filesystem-agnostic?
<ogra_> yes
<ogra_> pmcgowan, when will we get the proper initramfs on the arale ? it is still not in the image
<mcphail> so it seems daft to stick to a broken filesystem for the tiny percentage of users who are (a) windows only and (b) only willing to write to the SD card when it has been removed from the phone
<Elleo> sil2100: are the any commit logs for wily images? trying to track down a regression in recent images, so would be handy to know what landed when
<ogra_> mcphail, sure, someone needs to implement support for managing filesystemm permissions
<ogra_> (before we could support extX)
<mcphail> fair enough. The added advantage is we could store our huge video files
<ogra_> yes, but i guess it is a man-month of preparation work needed to implement it
<mcphail> abandoning vfat might also remove a spectre of MS patent trolls
<ogra_> it will definitely not be abandoned
<ogra_> it will stay the default ... but  optionally support for ext2 or 4 should be added
<mcphail> that would be a pity. Seems rather regressive
<ogra_> mass compatible :)
<pmcgowan> ogra_, sorry whats the issue? I was not aware
<dadexix86> I personally would like to have something a bit more secure than FAT as a default and give FAT as an optional choice, not the other way around.
<popey> should have an encrypted file formatted as ext4 inside :)(
<ogra_> pmcgowan, there is an ubuntu-touch-generic-initrd in the overlay PPA since 4 weeks waiting for inclusion into a device tarball ... allowing full access to the arale diskspace (the same initrd is used on krillin and vegeta already but despite me asking a million times it still isnt in arale)
<brunch875> I thought krillin was a coincidence but vegeta wiped all doubts
<ogra_> pmcgowan, sil2100 said last week in a landing meeting he would poke you abut it ...
<pmcgowan> ogra_, ok let me follow up, cant find a bug on it
<ogra_> there isnt a bug ...
<pmcgowan> ogra_, so I should see a package in the PPA?
<ogra_> (would have to be against the device tarball build scripts)
<ogra_> pmcgowan,  initramfs-tools-ubuntu-touch - 0.94vivid5
<pmcgowan> of course ok
<ogra_> i think arale is still at vivi1 or vivid2
<pmcgowan> ogra_, apt-cache tells me its the latest one
<matv1> about the telegram app. I have over the last few weeks been seeing the app just not syncing (on the bq). Its happened plenty of times. I no there are newer mssgs because i see them on another client.
<matv1> but the app does not freeze or chrash (which is what the current critical bugs are about)
<matv1> Am I missing a LP bug ?
<popey> matv1: maybe ask in #ubuntu-telegram ?
<popey> karni is lead dev
<matv1> ah didnt hear there was a seperate irc fr that. sorry
<ogra_> pmcgowan, apt doesnt tell you anything about the device tarball
<pmcgowan> ogra_, was surprised to see the package at all
<ogra_> well, on devices where we have full initrd access (nexus) it is useful ... and thus it is seed
<matv1> popey regarding that change: has the purpose of this channel changed? I do now recall something or some questionaire pass by on the mailinglist but I not sure if anything came of it
<ogra_> on arale, vegeta and krillin it isnt used ... but its only a few bytes
<ogra_> pmcgowan,
<ogra_> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ cat /proc/partitions |grep p16
<ogra_>  179       16   27586048 mmcblk0p16
<ogra_> vs
<ogra_> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ df -h /home
<ogra_> Filesystem                       Size  Used Avail Use% Mounted on
<ogra_> /dev/disk/by-partlabel/userdata   12G  4,5G  6,4G  42% /home
<ogra_> pmcgowan, as long as these numbers dont match we still use the old initrd (partition is 27G here, but userdata does only fill 12G)
<pmcgowan> ogra_, thats bad
<ogra_> right
<ogra_> which is why i brought it up ;)
<pmcgowan> k will file a bug and pester till done
<ogra_> thanks :)
<popey> matv1: nope. :)
<pmcgowan> ogra_, although I recall something about not shipping on the larger disks, will also check
<ogra_> pmcgowan, we use mmcblk0p16 for userdata on arale ... the fs isnt expanded to the full disk size (which the initrd does)
<pmcgowan> ogra_, yeah but I think we aonly sell on 16GB devices
<ogra_> if we didnt want to use all of the partition, then fine ... (though i wonder why)
<ogra_> pmcgowan, sure, and we install with 8G fs
<ogra_> (same image everywhere ... that initrd cares for the size differences (and is used on vegeta)
<pmcgowan> ogra_, so I am confused, we are gettign 12GB of user data
<matv1> popey: cool.
<ogra_> pmcgowan, *i* am ... not sure if the factory images do ... afaik we use the same 8G size everywhere and only expand on first boot
<sil2100> Elleo: sadly no... the infra for those will only be back next week :(
<Elleo> sil2100: damn, is there any other way to figure out what went into a specific image?
<popey> is there a way to do phablet-config network on a freshly flashed device in a "lab" environment where the host has no wifi?
<popey> like copying the network file to /etc/NetworkManager/system-connections ? (which needs root)
<seb128> jgdx, kenvandine, just a fyi, we should block the settings visual refresh on the sdk incoming list "templates"
<seb128> so please nobody start changing the lists/UI ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, ok, thanks
<seb128> yw
<ogra_> ubuntu
<seb128> ogra_, stop typing your password in IRC ;-)
<ogra_> damn, hos did you guess it was the password !
<ogra_> *how
<seb128> lol
<jgdx> all i see is ******
<ogra_> phew
 * ogra_ keeps it then ... 
<cwayne> hunter2
<kenvandine> Elleo, can you give this a review when you have a chance https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/content-hub/url-dispatcher-tests/+merge/261126
<Elleo> kenvandine: sure thing
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> the 15.04 branch doesn't have CI setup, so no builds of that yet
<kenvandine> working on getting that setup
<kenvandine> but we can at least get it in trunk
<Elleo> okay, cool
<Elleo> Mirv: I did some testing of the maliit-framework package, there's some tests that fail but they seem to have been introduced by some other change in image 213 which causes the visibility/keyboard height not to be reported, besides that everything seems fine
<jgdx> *grumble* when âadb rebootâ is the last element in bash history, but you expect âphablet-shellâ
<Elleo> heh
<kenvandine> jgdx, oh i've done that before :)
<jgdx> :)
<Mirv> Elleo: thanks!
<Elleo> Mirv: no problem :)
<mpt> patriciadavila, bug 1379381
<ubot5> bug 1379381 in Ubuntu UX "[Dash] shows splash screen with "Scopes" when starting up the phone" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1379381
<patriciadavila> mpt: thanks
<Elleo> kenvandine: do the autopkg tests get run as part of a CI run at the moment?
<dobey> Elleo: yes and no, depending on what you mean exactly :)
<Elleo> dobey: ken's just added some new autopkg tests as part of this MR: https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/content-hub/url-dispatcher-tests/+merge/261126 I'm wondering if they've already been executed as part of the CI run on that, or if I should check them manually myself
<dobey> Elleo: no, CI doesn't run them at that point. they will be run during migration of the package, though
<Elleo> okay, I'll see about trying to run them myself before approving the MR then
<dobey> that test looks a bit scary to me though
<Elleo> oh?
<dobey> it's starting Xvfb on a static display address for one
<Elleo> is there a better way of handling that? ^ kenvandine?
<dobey> well dbus itself doesn't require X, and i don't think the other commands being used do either
<dobey> would probably be better if each test was pulled out to individual tests, and they were run using dbus-test-runner or similar
<dobey> this level of integration testing could probably also be run during the build of the package as well
<Elleo> okay, thanks; I'll pass that along to kenvandine when he's around :)
<kenvandine> Elleo, those need to be run when installed
<kenvandine> specifically the testability peers packages
<kenvandine> i had to do the Xvfb stuff to get it working, i followed pitti's blog post
<kenvandine> static display number probably isn't great, but it seems ok and i trust pitti :)
<kenvandine> i copied that from his :)
<Elleo> kenvandine: okay, I'm happy to defer to pitti's docs on it; how do you feel about adding an extra test to ensure file:// urls are rejected?
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> good idea
<kenvandine> Elleo, http://packaging.ubuntu.com/html/auto-pkg-test.html
<kenvandine> has some instructions on running the tests
<kenvandine> Elleo, although i found it easier to build the source package, then use that for adt-run
<kenvandine> dt-run --source build-area/content-hub_0.0+15.10.20150603-0ubuntu1.dsc --shell-fail --- qemu  ~/adt-vivid-amd64-cloud.img
<kenvandine> that's what i did to run it
<Elleo> kenvandine: okay, thanks
<kenvandine> Elleo, i added the test to reject files, just running it once before pushing :)
<kenvandine> will take 30 minutes or so
<kenvandine> maybe 15
<Elleo> kenvandine: okay :)
<kenvandine> adt-run will build the packages then run them installed in qemu
<Elleo> okay, cool
<dobey> kenvandine: why do they need to be run when installed? i presume the content-hub-test-share isn't an installed thing?
<kenvandine> dobey, it is
<kenvandine> it's part of the content-hub-testability package
<kenvandine> and it expects it to be handled by the service
<kenvandine> they provide automated response to transfer requests
<dobey> kenvandine: i would refactor these tests to be individual tests and run with dbus-test-runner, and also during build, if it were me; afaict, they should be run both during build, and against the installed packages.
<kenvandine> dobey, and this is really integration testing, so works better this way
<dobey> kenvandine: do those content-hub-test-foo things require a DISPLAY?
<kenvandine> they don't
<dobey> then i would get rid of the X dependency there
<kenvandine> but it was giving me problems
<kenvandine> and then i found pitti's blog post solving a similar issue
<kenvandine> and just stole his code :)
<kenvandine> they use upstart-app-launch under the covers
<kenvandine> so quite a few pieces of the platform getting exercised
<dobey> ugh
<kenvandine> that's how we handle launching apps on the phone :)
<kenvandine> the hub service uses it, not just for launching but it attempts to change focus, etc
<kenvandine> Elleo, pushed
<Elleo> kenvandine: okay, will start testing now, not sure if I'll get finished before I have to go out though
<kenvandine> ok
#ubuntu-touch 2015-06-06
<llindner> Hello guys... I just installed ubuntu touch on my nexus 7 (2013). It all went well, but now as I want to download the document viewer from the app store there comes a big disappointment: i need a ubuntu one account? seriously?
<llindner> is there any chance to skip that? otherwise cm+f-droid would be the right choice for me
<llindner> ok, now I entered completely fake data like i.dont.want.a.ubuntu.one.account@ubuntu.com and it seems to work ... which makes me even more wondering why is it neccessary
<muka> llindner: try this https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-touch-coreapps-drivers/+archive/ubuntu/daily
<melbaubuntu> heey guys, question: Are there alot of bugs for the HTC on m8?
<melbaubuntu> with ubuntu i mean
<melbaubuntu> heey guys, question: Are there alot of bugs for the HTC on m8?
<robin-hero> hi all
<robin-hero> devel-proposed channel doesn't work for me in the emulator. Any idea?
<bunty_> hi guys, i have a nexus 7 and ubuntu touch installed on it. but it doesn't have a gstreamer available. I tried downloading but it then there is no gcc compiler. while downlaoding it says no space available. please help me I want to use gstreamer to stream one live video.
<Walex> bunty_: as the Ubuntu Touch site shows you need a development environment to build packages for it. Phones and tables are not necessarily big enough.
<bunty_> Walex: ok. But gstreamer is a inbuild facility i guess
<bunty_> Walex: it's include in ubuntu image pack. but unfortunately I am ubanble to run that application on my tablet
<Walex> bunty_: the gstreamer library is used by Ubuntu Touch, probably the 'gstreamer' application too.
<Walex> is available.
<bunty_> yes but when I am trying to run it is not supporting
<Walex> bunty_: I am not sure what you mean with "run that application on my tablet"
<bunty_> I mean running gstreamer on tablet
<bunty_> do you know how to run gstreamer on ubuntu touch?
<bunty_> please help
<Walex> bunty_: today almost all the people I have been trying to help have been asking bad questions.
<Walex> bunty_: which exact command did you run and what happened that made you thing that "it doesn't work"
<bunty_> Walex: sorry for that but I am not good at it and ubuntu touch is totally new for me
<bunty_> gst-launch1.0
<Walex> and what happens when you type "gst-launch1.0" in the shell prompt in Ubuntu Touch?
<Walex> bunty_: BTW in general terms Ubuntu Touch is the same as Ubuntu except that it does not use X-Windows, so either you use Touch apps, or you use command line ones.
<Walex> but 'gst-launch1.0' is not an X app.
<Walex> and it is called 'gst-launch-1.0
<bunty_> yes you are right
<Walex> and it is in package 'gstreamer1.0-tools'
<bunty_> Walex: I have one RTSP stream which I am playing on ubuntu 12.04 and I am getting it perfectly fine. so I am using same command here.
<bunty_> Walex: gst-launch-0.10 rtspsrc connection-speed=100000 latency=0 buffer-mode=none location=rtsp://192.168.7.207:8554/stream ! rtph264depay ! ffdec_h264 ! ffmpegcolorspace ! deinterlace mode=interlaced ! fpsdisplaysink sync=false -v
<Walex> bunty_: so all you need is to get the package 'gstreamer1.0-tools' installed.
<bunty_> Walex: I am trying to install it but it says "failed to write (No space left on device)"
<Walex> bunty_: you need to add it to the image...
<bunty_> Walex: Hi, please find image on following link. http://ibin.co/24KBu0mDKLV9 this i got on executing command: df -h, why only 2GB available on root?
<bunty_> Hi, I have a nexus tabet and I have installed ubuntu on it. please find image on following link. http://ibin.co/24KBu0mDKLV9 this i got on executing command: df -h, why only 2GB available on root?
<bunty_> it is 16 GB nexus 7 2013 wifi
<bunty_> how to reinstall ubuntu touch on nexus 7?
<brunch875> is there a noob-friendly command to make a chroot in the ubuntu touch?
#ubuntu-touch 2015-06-07
<eikon81g> !surface
<eikon81g> Does anyone know off hand if Ubuntu touch will run on a Surface?
<mariogrip> eikon81g: Do you know if the Surface run on a x64 or a ARM CPU?
<mariogrip> if x64 you probably can install ubuntu desktop.
<eikon81g> Nah, it's ARM
<eikon81g> this is the first one..
<eikon81g> The RT build of windows on it is pretty locked down. You literally have to run a jailbreak script each time you boot it to run unsigned code..
<eikon81g> Dirty little trick.\
<mariogrip> i guess you will run into an issue sinc ubuntu uses android as the "base"
<mariogrip> since*
<mariogrip> https://developer.ubuntu.com/static/devportal_uploaded/136981fa-6287-49d3-9874-06f40b2e4eb7-cms_page_media/380/ubuntu_touch_architecture.png
<DonkeyHotei> desktop runs on the surface pro
<eikon81g> ty mariogrip
<mariogrip> np
<ubuntu64bit> any input about ubuntu phone?
<eikon81g> there are a few companies that have released handsets with ubuntu touch
<eikon81g> I read something about it.. they said it sold out in like an hour I think..
<eikon81g> I'd check the forums to run it on a device you have already..
<eikon81g> check the topic
<ubuntu64bit> i saw on youtube and ubuntu sight and was reading that problems with slow and lag is something up with maybe bottleneck like in von neumann architecture
<eikon81g> It looked promising.. I wanted to run it on a nexus I have laying around.. I haven't gotten around to it..
<ubuntu64bit> agreed eikon81g:
<ubuntu64bit> i wanted one US don't sell only european union
<eikon81g> yea, porting it onto a device may be the way to go for now
<eikon81g> not to mention if it is buggy then you are stuck with a device that only runs utouch
<ubuntu64bit> not unless you have backup to port original OS
<eikon81g> yea, I'm saying if you have a device that has native ubuntu touch you are stuck with it..
<ubuntu64bit> oh yeah i see.
<DonkeyHotei> porting to existing devices is strictly unsupported though
<mariogrip> not really, you can flash android on the bq ubuntu phone
<eikon81g> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Porting
<eikon81g> ah see there ya go, then it begs to question why buy it if you are going to just run android anyway..
<mariogrip> i don't think ppl will do that, but you said "I'm saying if you have a device that has native ubuntu touch you are stuck with it.." but you're not stuck with it
<eikon81g> right on, it's good to know that you could still flash it to android if you need/wanted to.. I was unaware
<ubuntu64bit> sorry i got to go but i think the phone can be excellent is they get whatever causing the lag or bottleneck just saying
<mariogrip> I'm running ubuntu touch on my oneplus one and it's not laggy at all...
<mariogrip> he left... xP
<eikon81g> lool
<eikon81g> you tried..
<mariogrip> yeah :P
<eikon81g> does it have service on it?
<eikon81g> the 4g decent?
<mariogrip> It underdeveopment so cell is still missing
<mariogrip> https://forums.oneplus.net/threads/wip-ubuntu-touch-for-oneplus-one.266170/
<eikon81g> ahh, just wondering.. I think I'd miss the play store too much to run it
<eikon81g> that's what's holding me back on the nexus
<mariogrip> I use the bq as my primary phone, and I am only missing a google music
<mariogrip> the bq ubuntu phone btw
<mariogrip> also, it's a completely "new" OS so i expect some missing apps.
<eikon81g> right. I have no doubt it will be competitive in the near future.. I will have to run it to get a feel for it.. Do you get a "Ubuntu Software Center" on the touch distribution?
<mariogrip> no, there is an own app store for Touch that uses click packages (not deb as on desktop). but as I understand the desktop version will switch to click in a later release (next year i guess) (and probably run the same store). btw you can run apt-get on it, but it's not recommended since it a read only system.
<mariogrip> try it with multirom then you don't need to replace/remove android :D
<mariogrip> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.tassadar.multirommgr
<eikon81g> cool ty
<mariogrip> np
 * eikon81g is away: I'm busy
<JMS_touch> Is there anyway to adjust Ubuntuinstaller.apk to enable Krillin dual boot? I appreciate dr0id is a little taboo, I really need wifi calling in the intereim in one location
<muka> can someone tell me what 'rmnet_usb0' interface is for? to get it just type sudo ifconfig.
<tathhu> Anyone running UT on Nexus 7 '13 / LTE?
<side> hello everyone
<side> anyone here
<side> :/
<tathhu> ^^
<side> hey tathhu i need some help on porting ubuntu touch to s4
<tathhu> I can't help you :(
<tathhu> Don't know about that stuff
<side> no idea on how porting ubuntu touch ?
<tathhu> Nope
<tathhu> I don't even know if there's something like Jolla has with its Sailfish-porting-things
<tathhu> Something to get you started
<side> there was one developer who was building s4 ubuntu touch but he smashed his device and the development stopped
<Z3> Hi ! When will be working "docking mode" in Ubuntu Touch?
<Z3> and will it work on a Nexus 4?
<Z3> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/06/first-ubuntu-phone-with-convergence-is-being-made-by-bq
<hardik_> hi
<studio_> hi
<studio_> did someone here tried the new gpg on facebook? if yes, is there a how to for ubuntu touch?
<studio_> is someone here?
<tathhu> Yes
<tathhu> And no, I don't know.
<studio_> ok
<studio_> another question, is this fixed: http://askubuntu.com/questions/341355/why-doesnt-ubuntu-touch-support-multiple-users or still in progress ?
<bqphone> good day
<bqphone> is there a way to do a selected printscreen or capture on ubuntu phone?
<bqphone> i know that with clicking +-volume button you take a printscreen
<bqphone> but is there a way to select the part you want to take printscreen of?
<tathhu> can you edit pics in gallery?
<tathhu> yeah, go to gallery, select pic and then select that icon next to menu
<bqphone> well that works also :) thanks tathhu
<muka> I need some help. I'm trying to set some rules in my iptables to forward data from 'usb0' to <not sure>. what interface should I use for cellular data?
<muka> is it p2p0? but it's not active. but I still get internet conn.
<peat-psuwit> muka: type "ifconfig" to see which interface has ip address
<muka> peat-psuwit, there is only two interfaces, wlan0 and rmnet_usb0, but the only option that I can see would be rmnet_usb0. I already tried that and it's not working. It seems that there must me another option. Must be hidden.
<muka> looks that rmnet_usb0 is not a cellular data interface.
#ubuntu-touch 2016-06-06
<whitemale> Hello :) - i have a Aquaris M10 (HD) (not FHD) with ubuntu touch installed on it. i would like to install Android on it, and i am a little confused about how this is done, in the wiki its says that there are a Recovery image and a Reinstalling gudide, the Reinstalling guide does not have any files for "bq Aquaris M10 (HD nor FHD)", please help :)
<whitemale> or is the recovery image just the recovery image of ubuntu touch? is there a android for aquaris m10?
<ahoneybun> mariogrip: how do I see what works on that devel_rc-proposed channel?
<whitemale> how do i install android 5.1 on aquaris m10 hd firmware 1.3.0 with ubuntu touch installed on it?
<ahoneybun> mm nhaines or popey "ubuntu-device-flash query --device=flo --channel=ubuntu-touch/stable/ubuntu --list-images" reports that OTA-11 is up for flo but https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/ReleaseNotes/OTA-11 says it is not
<ahoneybun> not sure if I should edit
<ahoneybun> or can anyway lol
<oftc_ftw> hi all. i'm trying to install Ubuntu Dual Boot on my Nexus 4. It seemed to work so far, but when I click "Reboot to Ubuntu" the phone is stuck at the Google logo until I reset it. Of course, then it reboots back into Android. Any ideas?
<oftc_ftw> I've got to admit that I use OmniRom instead of CM and TWRP instead of ClockwordMod. Could that lead to such issues?
<popey> Possibly.
<popey> We generally don't support any kind of dual boot.
<oftc_ftw> ok sorry, i thought maybe someone had similar issues before.
<popey> oftc_ftw: we just don't ever test those scenarios really
<oftc_ftw> popey: i understand, it would just be really convenient to have this kind of setup right now. never mind then.
<brunch875> I wanted to try that too just for the sake of it, but I've always been concerned android would patch some drivers or something and break the system.
<jgdx> jibel, hey, how is bug 1588630 affecting USS? Anything I can do?
<ubot5> bug 1588630 in Canonical System Image ""External display" still in English " [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1588630
<jibel> jgdx, it's just a translation issue. I added a task to track which component is affected otherwise it's just umbrella projects
<jgdx> jibel, okay
<mike00> hi all, I want to report some bug at the screen asking for the pin. where can I report it?
<ogra_> see channel topic
<mike00> bug filing?
<mike00> what shall I choose?
<ogra_> just follow the link
 * saavento says Hi!
<mike00> which area should I choose? I'm not English so I don't understand exactly all the categories...
<ogra_> the area you think is affected by your bug indeed
<ogra_> (what exactly is your issue with the pin)
<mike00> if the background image is white or with light colour you can see very well words: the lock screen image is a bit darken, the pic image should be like that one.
<mike00> pin+
<mike00> *
<ogra_> mike00, the lockscreen is lightdm iirc
<ogra_> or unity8 ... just pick one of them
<dobey> it's unity8 i think
<ogra_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity8/+filebug?no_redirect
<ogra_> try that link
<mike00> but I want to report the pin image not the lockscreen one
<mike00> the image lock screen is perfect now
<ogra_> what do you mean by "pin image" then ?
<dobey> it's the same thing
<mike00> the background image of the screen asking for the pin
<mike00> it's the same image of the lock screen but not darkened
<ogra_> hmm, here it is the same brightness level ... the image i swipe to the side is the same as the next one that shows the number pad
<dobey> it's the same thing. unity8 is what manages the lock screen
<dobey> ogra_: i think the complaint is a transparency issue, not hardware brightness
 * ogra_ doesnt see any brightness difference
<ogra_> dobey, yes, respectively a picture brghtness issue ... but i dont see any difference in brightness ... trying to grasp what the issue is
<dobey> ogra_: well you aren't looking at mike00's screen :)
<mike00> yes, could be a transparency issues
<ogra_> true, might depend on the wallpaper you use
<dobey> or hardware
<ogra_> mike00, well, thats definitely unity8 ... so just follow the link i pasted above
<dobey> and image
<ogra_> (even if that would be wrong, people will move it to the right bucket later)
<mike00> my image as a white zone in the top left corner, under some words...
<mike00> and I can't see the words very well...
<ogra_> right, and the font is plain white with no shadows under the chars
<ogra_> (usually a light drop shadow would fix this)
<mike00> in the lock screen is better than in the screen asking for the pin...
<dobey> *sigh*
<ogra_> just file it against unity8
<ogra_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity8/+filebug?no_redirect
<mike00> thanks
<mike00> and is correct that I can close the screen asking for the PIN just swiping to left or to right?
<dobey> i don't think so, no
<mike00> ok thanks.
<dobey> mike00: are you asking about the main pin unlock for the system, or you are asking about SIM unlock pin?
<mike00> the SIM one
<dobey> ok, i am not sure if that is part of unity8 or not
<dobey> and i don't have a locked sim, so i don't know how it works exactly
<mike00> ok, so the bug i asked for before goes under unity8 or not?
<mike00> last question (I hope): can I attach more than 1 file in a bug report on LP?
<ogra_> as many as you want
<dobey> yes; if it doesn't belong to unity8, the devs will move it to the right place
<mike00> thanks, but how can I attach more than 1 file?
<dobey> attach a file; then attach another one
<mike00> I'm sorry but I can't: I select a file and it works, but for the second when I select it, the pc deselect the file I choose before...
<ogra_> if you click the "add attachement or patch" link it doesnt allow you to add a file ?
<mike00> yes but only one file
<ogra_> sure
<dobey> right
<dobey> you have to attach one file, then attach another one
<dobey> i didn't say select. and even if multi-select worked, you'd still have to ctrl+click or shift+click to select multiple files in the chooser; but multi-select doesn't work
<mike00> I click ok on the first file, then I click to attach another file and I select the second file and press ok. but then I see only a file under the attachments...
<dobey> *sigh*
<mike00> should I create a whole image with the two inside it?
<dobey> ok, i obviously can't see what you are doing exactly, but you must be doing something wrong if the attachments aren't showing up. lp certainly supports multiple attachments
<mike00> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity8/+bug/1589533 it's ok this bug report?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1589533 in unity8 (Ubuntu) "background image of the screen asking for the PIN is to bright" [Undecided,New]
<dobey> yes that's unity8
<mike00> ok thanks
<grasstype> hello. What would I need to do to get the normal manpages installed in the CLI?
<grasstype> so I can do man ls, or man less, etc
<grasstype> oh please xchat, don't crash again
<ogra_> use a chroot or a libertine container and install the respective packages
<grasstype> ogra_, sorry, I meant in a chroot
<grasstype> I got one set up, and I can already use basic commands
<grasstype> but the default ones don't have manpages for some reason
<grasstype> so I can't get anything for "man ls", for example
<grasstype> the stuff I've installed myself works find, ie "man man" or "man gpp"
<grasstype> fine*
<ogra_> well, install the manpages, man-db and probably manpages-dev packages in your chroot then
<grasstype> ogra_, xchat doesn't seem to like my keyboard. I couldn't pres the back key.. oh well. "manpages" and "manpages-dev" both installed. Still doesn't give me "man ls"
<ogra_> grasstype, what about man-db ?
<ogra_> (that carries the actual "man" binary)
<grasstype> yeah, man is installed
<JanC> grasstype: did you install coreutils inside the chroot?
<grasstype> coreutils? don't think so
<grasstype> says its already at newest version
<ogra_> well, theoretically man-db should pull in everything it needs via deps
<ogra_> Depends: groff-base (>= 1.18.1.1-15), bsdmainutils, debconf (>= 1.2.0) | debconf-2.0, libc6 (>= 2.14), libgdbm3 (>= 1.8.3), libpipeline1 (>= 1.3.0), zlib1g (>= 1:1.1.4)
<ogra_> thats the deps list
<grasstype> is there a way to see if that's setup correctly? I Don't see why it wouldn't be, but idk wtf I'm doin, so worth a shot
<grasstype> hmm, just tried apt-get install --reinstall man-db , didn't change anything
<grasstype> alright, put it up on askubuntu , so I guess I'll see where it goes
<grasstype> this whole experience has been so educational!
<dobey> huh
<dobey> grasstype: how did you create the chroot exactly?
<grasstype> dobey, a guide online, let me see if I can remember
<dobey> 'man ls' certainly works here
<grasstype> IIRC I used the chroot command, I did something with wget and "vivid-preinstalled-touch-armgh.tar.gz"
<dobey> you did https://askubuntu.com/questions/620740/recommended-way-to-install-regularcli-deb-packages-on-ubuntu-phone/623311#623311 ?
<grasstype> I didn't because I did it without a hose computer
<grasstype> so no ppa, phablet-tools, or libertine stuff
<dobey> the instructions in my answer there don't require a host computer
<grasstype> oh sorry, just read the top post. Yeah, looks like I used the top one
<dobey> grasstype: do you have the file /usr/share/man/man1/ls.1.gz inside your chroot?
<grasstype> I evenin man1, there is no ls.1.gz
<grasstype> nope
<dobey> well then that's why "man ls" isn't working
<dobey> so why are the files missing for you
<grasstype> sweet
<grasstype> I now know where it would be :) now.... why would it be missing
<dobey> do 'apt-get install --reinstall coreutils' in the chroot, then try man ls again
<mike00> hi there. if I have to report a bug for the phone call incoming on which package should report?
<grasstype> sweet, there it is
<grasstype> dobey, your'e my hero
<mike00> The bug is: when you receive a call you can close the notifications swiping and than the phone continue to ring but you can't do nothing
<mike00> Or is it reported yet? I searched but I didn't find nothing...
<merpnderp> Is Canonical still pushing hard to get into the mobile phone business? And is the Meizu Pro 5 the only phone available in the US (if it comes back into stock)?
<grasstype> merpnderp, looks like on both counts
<merpnderp> grasstype: "on"?
<merpnderp> You mean no?
<grasstype> but last I chcked, the Meizu still isn't fully compatible with the us market, supports different channels for the LTE spectrum
<grasstype> I meant "it", not sure how that happened
<grasstype> oh, "looks like it on both counts"*
<merpnderp> grasstype: okay thanks. Just want an Ubuntu phone that doesn't come with android.
<grasstype> when I talked to ting about it, they said they can only guarantee 2g speeds, needs channels 2,4,or 12 I think, when they supported 1,3,7
<merpnderp> Well that's a bummer
<grasstype> same here. I ended up buying the m10 (what I'm not now) just because I couldn't get the phone that I could guarantee works
<grasstype> on*
<grasstype> google has been annoying me a lot more in the last few years, and apple, while OK, isn't someone I want ot hitch myself to
<dobey> merpnderp: nexus 5 with ubuntu works (mostly) great
<grasstype> I didn't see that the nexus 5 was supported... though they were avoiding that one
<grasstype> anything not work on that?
<dobey> the builds are from ubports.com
<grasstype> oh... bluetooth it looks like... well that means no keyboard... eh
<dobey> it's not "officially" supported like the nexus 4 or retail devices
<dobey> eh, connecting a bt keyboard to my phone is way down on my list of things i need bluetooth for
<dobey> if you want something that's a bit better supported than that, now, then a nexus4 is probably the next best option in the US
<grasstype> I'm just waiting for an officially-supported preloaded one. Was really really close to buyign the meizu pro
<grasstype> would have that instead of the m10, and still question my deciison sometimes
<dobey> i'm waiting for a phone that's not the size of an oversized handbag
<grasstype> lol, there is that too
<grasstype> just got a really cheap iphone 4s from a coworker, it fits a single hand pretty well
<dobey> even the z5 compact is no longer actually compact
<grasstype> it's funny how phones keep getting bigger... wonder if it's just going to be huge phones for awhile now
<dobey> appears so
<grasstype> maybe once we get holographic floating interfaces like the movies of the late 90's...
<dobey> until we all get corneal implants anyway
<grasstype> lol. Future is google glass?
<dobey> future is google probably buys a competitor to monsanto, and then we end up with "google grass"
<dobey> and then they abandon the project 3 years later
<grasstype> that could turn into a good thing, if google grass ever open sources their grass code
<grasstype> gpl3 designer grass genetics
<grasstype> on a brighter side, The Martian is now on HBO
<grasstype> damn I love that movie
<grasstype> and, whoever did www.linuxjourney.com did a great job
<dobey> mariogrip: hey, btw, what happened to upgrading the recovery? :)
<mariogrip> dobey: coming later, bt and 5.1 is more important atm
<dobey> mariogrip: hmm, seems adb and ssh don't work on 5.1?
<mariogrip> dobey: oh? I need to look into that, im using an open adb so that's might be why im getting adb
<mariogrip> dobey: thanks for letting me know?
<mariogrip> mhall119: forgot me?
<ogra_> dobey, the manpages are actually wiped from the touch tarballs on purpose (together with all other documentation) ... so indeed grasstype can only find manpages for newly installed packages in the chroot
<dobey> mariogrip: yeah, i can't seem to connect over adb or ssh after switching to that channel
<dobey> ogra_: huh?
<ogra_> (since he used the phone rootfs as input for his chroot)
<dobey> ogra_: i'm pretty sure we don't delete files that are included in packages which are on the image
<ogra_> dobey, i'm pretty sure i wrote the code for this ;)
<ogra_> no, i lied, i only copied it from aciang :P
<ogra_> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/livecd-rootfs/trunk/view/head:/live-build/ubuntu-touch/hooks/99-remove-documentation.chroot
<ogra_> (originally from some OEM team build tool)
<dobey> *shrug*
<dobey> that's awful
<ogra_> there is no need for any commandline documentation on a phone
<ogra_> and it saves plenty of megabytes
<ogra_> people should perhaps rather use the ubuntu-base tarballs if they want a fully functional ubuntu chroot
<dobey> yeah, no need for documentation, especially when we have a terminal app that we support, and allows people to use the command line
<ogra_> dobey, well, maguro wouldnt have been possible with leaving the docs there (well, it would, but people would have ended up with not much space for data)
<ogra_> thats a few 100 MB uncompressed
<dobey> well, we never supported maguro with 15.04 :)
<dobey> not sure what all exactly gets deleted there, but it seems like there are better things to delete, or better ways to solve explicit docs issues
<ogra_> not really
<ogra_> you could hire 50 people to split all documentation out of the packages and maintain a gigantic diff from debian though
<ogra_> but then i guess if we hired 50 people we'd have something better to do for them ;)
<dobey> well, i doubt /usr/share/man is where all those magical megabytes came from
<dobey> anyway, whatever
<dobey> switching to the 5.1 channel was not a great idea on this phone yet
<ogra_> did you test aethercast yet ?
<dobey> no, i don't have anything to test it with
<dobey> mariogrip: do you get lots of screen tearing on 5.1 too?
<dobey> wtf. why is system-image-cli --switch apparently hanged when i run it from the terminal app?
<dobey> mariogrip: hmm, wifi doesn't seem to work for me either. it acts like it's connected, turning the AP name green in the indicator, but the main icon never changes, and route never changes :-/
<dobey> but my dhcp server thinks its connected apparently.
<dobey> so weird
<mariogrip> mhall119: sorry, my laptop ran our of power.
<dobey> mariogrip: also, does your nexus 5 only show a max of 50% battery on 5.1?
<mariogrip> went from 5% to 0% in 30 seconds
<mariogrip> dobey: wifi issues? it works fine for me. screen tearing i know about that. battery levels is unstable still
<dobey> hmm
<mariogrip> uploading an "more stable" version now
<dobey> mariogrip: tip on the battery level; if it maxes out at 50%, it's probably the same issue that originally existed a couple years ago on nexus5 with 4.4, where there are two battery devices, and so indicator was showing exactly half of what it should be
<mariogrip> dobey: oh, thanks for the tip :)
<dobey> mariogrip: it seems like that might be the same issue, since after flashing the 5.1 image, my battery went from pretty high, down to like 34% despite being plugged in
<dobey> yep. pretty sure that is it
<dobey> flashed back to normal rc-proposed for now
<dobey> hopefully this unity8 cpu eating bug gets fixed soon
<mariogrip> yeah
<mariogrip> dobey: did you get wifi working?
<dobey> mariogrip: not on 5.1. i just flashed back to the 4.4 based rc-proposed
<mariogrip> dobey: oh, ok. do you have wpa password on your wifi?
<dobey> mariogrip: yes
<mariogrip> I tried connecting to a password connected and i get this, wpa_supplicant[830]: wlan0: Authentication with [mac address] timed out. might be the same as you get.
<dobey> maybe, i didn't dig too deep
<_morphis> mariogrip: good work to get WiDi working on more devices
<mariogrip> _morphis: thanks :)
<_morphis> mariogrip: you will need https://code-review.phablet.ubuntu.com/#/c/446/ in your tree even if its already Android 5.x
<_morphis> mariogrip: and also the latest from https://git.launchpad.net/~libhybris-maintainers/libhybris/+git/libhybris/log/
<_morphis> mariogrip: once you have that you're either lucky and things are performing well or somebody has to go deep and sort out existing performance issues
<mariogrip> _morphis: oh ok, i'll do some more testing when i get my mircosoft device
<_morphis> mariogrip: so does the video streaming work?
<mariogrip> _morphis: I have no way of testing it, so i don't know
<_morphis> you have
<_morphis> mariogrip: install aethercast-tests
<_morphis> and install aethercast-tools
<_morphis> first one will install aethercast-integration-tests
<_morphis> which will run https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/aethercast/trunk/view/head:/tests/mcs/integration_tests/test_stream_performance.cpp
<_morphis> that will basically run the video encoding pipeline for 10 seconds an gives you some numbers how fast it is
<_morphis> mariogrip: the other package installs mirscreencast_to_stream
<dobey> _morphis: 0.1.0+git20151016+6d424c9-0ubuntu10~overlay1 should be new enough libhybris right? it's what's in the archive and shipped in ota11
<_morphis> which is a small utility using the same pipeline to stream over any network
<mhall119> mariogrip: no worries, I figured it was that :)
<_morphis> run it with: mirscreencast_to_stream -r <remote ip> -p <pick one>
<_morphis> mariogrip: before you start mirscreencast_to_stream run $ vlc -vvvv rtp://@:5000 --network-caching=250 on your PC
<_morphis> and make sure you pick port 5000 on both sides
<_morphis> that will give you the stream output in VLC
<_morphis> if you have both devices on the same network
<_morphis> dobey: should be
<mhall119> _morphis: does aethercast need the microsoft widi dongle, or will it work with any* miracast compatible display
<_morphis> dobey: yeah, 0.1.0+git20151016+6d424c9-0ubuntu9 brought the media-codec-canges
<mhall119> * I know "any" is optimistic even in the best of times
<_morphis> mhall119: technically it will work with any miracast device
<_morphis> mhall119: but you know "any" is always unrealistic
<_morphis> mhall119: so file a bug for any not working one
<_morphis> mhall119: and don't expect all to perform equally
<dobey> _morphis: ok, just wanted to clarify so we don't send mariogrip on a wild goose chase trying to patch in a libhybris that's different from what's already in the image, and sufficient for this :)
<_morphis> the M$ is already the fastest on the market
<_morphis> dobey: yeah
<mariogrip> _morphis: thank, i'll give it a try
<_morphis> mariogrip: ping me or drop me a mail if you have any problems
<PaulFraOSAA> Updating to OTA11 now is it any good?
<PaulFraOSAA> Too bad the AltGr problem will not be fixed untill OTA12 :(
<MiguelC> hi guys, someone have info about port ubuntu for a HTC A9 ???
<marklyford> anyone got any tips of second hand smart phones that work well with ubuntu touch ?
<troyready> marklyford: I think the Nexus 4 is the default response for that
<marklyford> thanks
<marklyford> ill look into getting one :)
<troyready> marklyford: it really is a great phone. More beautiful than the Nexus's to follow it IMHO, but hampered by its smaller screen and lack of LTE
<marklyford> thanks @troyready
<mterry> kenvandine, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1589711
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1589711 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) ""Display language" panel is oddly unique" [Undecided,New]
#ubuntu-touch 2016-06-07
<yvette> I am trying to install Ubunto14 for the SimpliLearn Tutorial using Hadoop.  WHen installing it says that my computer does not have sufficient space - but my hard drive is not full at all!
<dobey> troyready: the nexus 4 hardware can do LTE. but you need to flash on specific radio firmware to do it. nexus 5 is better hardware though, but not as well supported as nexus 4, at the moment
<Dilawar> hi
<Dilawar> i want to install ubuntu touch on windows 8.1 tab can i?
<effbiai> is it possible to install ubuntu on the meizu pro 5 android version, or do i have to wait for the pro 5 ubuntu version?
<oftc_ftw> hello all! these days, is there any way for an app to run in background? or what is the proper solution to allow audio recording while the screen is turned off?
<tinkerer_> Hi all. I just had a quick question. From the point of view of an application, what folders are read/writable on an Ubuntu phone? I'm aware of the application's own personal folder in "~/.local/". Are there any others?
<davmor2> effbiai: mostly the android version is locked down quite tight so not sure
<davmor2> oftc_ftw: use media-hub although I'm not sure about recording
<davmor2> tinkerer_: those are the main folders that the application can write to, you can however you can import export to it using content hub
<ogra_> davmor2, did you notice yet that apps vanish from the spread on the pro5 after a few hours ? i usually have a fixed set of apps open, after a few hours when i want to switch back to a particular app that i definitely didnt close i notice it is gone from the spread
<ogra_> popey, ^^^ same question to you
<davmor2> ogra_: no but I don't leave apps open all day, I assume it could be ooming them but that would be a huge guess
<ogra_> davmor2, apps that get OOMed still keep their spread screenshot araound usually
<davmor2> ogra_: yeah I say it would be a huge guess
<ogra_> they simply restart when you switch to them again
<ogra_> (but i cant switch back, since the screenshot is gone)
<ogra_> another thing is that qxide seems to freak out after you had a webapp or the browser open for some time on an ad-heavy page ... i end up with a black page that only leaves the ad's around, reloading doesnt change that, i have to restart the app or the browser
<popey> not seen that
<ogra_> *oxide
<popey> is it only a few that disappear?
<popey> like, not all of them
<tinkerer_> Ogra, I've had the same issue with these full page ads or whatever they are.
<ogra_> popey, yeah, i usually have my G+  app and dekko open all the time ... during the day i suddenly notice that one of them is gone
<ogra_> these are two i tend to never close
<ogra_> it used to be that when an app crashed the spread did half open, i wonder if that "feature" is simply gone so i dont notice app crashes that visible anymore
<tinkerer_> davmor2: Is there a way to use content hub ...er, migration with applications you can't control? For example, I've been tinkering with syncthing hoping to automatically back up my ~/Pictures directory.
<ogra_> tinkerer_, content hub only hands content to another app that can handle whatever you want to do with the data
<brunch875> Yes!!! I got another person to use telegram!
<MCMic> brunch875: Thatâs not a good thing
<brunch875> ...is it not?
<MCMic> brunch875: I prefer free software and open protocols
<davmor2> MCMic: telegram is freer than whatsapp and there is no full open equivalent so it is as good as it gets for now
<MCMic> XMPP?
<davmor2> MCMic: which is basically glorified IRC and you would never get People to use, Freesoftware users maybe but not general public
<MCMic> lol
<MCMic> davmor2: Whatsapp and Facebook are both XMPP as far as I recall
<brunch875> Heck, I had to disable facebook-purple to chat over pidgin since they closed their XMPP interfaces
<brunch875> disable = download
<Mikaela> not anyhow AFAIK
<Mikaela> *anymore
<brunch875> whatsapp is the only thing which seems impossible for me to get running
<MCMic> People can use any protocol if the software is there
<brunch875> tell that to whatsapp, hunting down whatsapp+ users
<MCMic> ubuntu touch still got no xmpp client :-/
<ogra_> contribute one ;)
<MCMic> (and no ical/idav support, basically forcing users to go to google, pretty ironic for an android alternative)
<brunch875> huh? can't you just sync via google calendar? that's what I do
<brunch875> and it works flawlessly
<MCMic> lol, exactly what I said brunch875, it works with google only
<MCMic> Maybe I was not clear, english not being my mothertongue
<ogra_> well, the source is open ... feel free to send patches ;)
<brunch875> I added one event on evolution calendar and it synced with phone + added alarm there too
<ogra_> (though i think specifically caldav/cardav is being worked on atm)
<davmor2> MCMic: it's coming just lower down the priority list as more people use google services.
<effbiai> davmor2: roger that. do you know if the hardware is exactly the same?
<davmor2> effbiai: no idea we can only assume it is
<MCMic> ogra_: Itâs one thing to send patches to fix small things in a big software which is overall good, but here I feel like everything is going in the wrong direction and I donât have the resources to change this. So I wait to see if itâs worth it before investing time in a project
<effbiai> davmor2: guess i should wait for the ubuntu version to get back in stock then :)
<ogra_> not sure what you mean by wrong direction ... if you send patches they wont be refused for sure
<ogra_> so it is in your hands to steer the direction too
<MCMic> The saddest thing Iâve seen is there is an app on the store which is a web version of pidgin running on some distant server -_-
<ogra_> whats wrong with that ? seems it helps someones purpose, else he wouldnt have uploaded it
<MCMic> ogra_: Maybe, not sure. If project leaders have a vision of what the OS should be/do incompatible with what I want itâs helpless.
<ogra_> (and after all a webapp is still a lot safer than the browser)
<ogra_> well, the vision is stated pretty clear since the beginning ... one OS that runs on all platforms, thats the main objective
<MCMic> ogra_: Everything is wrong with that. Packaging webapp makes little sense to me, using webapp for privacy sensitive things like IM is dangerous, being forced to use this webserver and not my own is a problem, and pidgin is a native ubuntu app, why canât it run on my phone directly?
<ogra_> OTOH there are vendors that sell products with the OS ... and these ask for features that canonical implements with higher prio than some random "nice thing" that we would all want ...
<MCMic> ogra_: Iâm mainly using ubuntu touch because itâs the only linux based thing easy to buy on a phone, and seemed a bit freeer than android.
<ogra_> --- but that doesnt mean that this feature wouldnt be allowerd in if you sent the code for example ,... it only means that reasources are put where the money comes in
<brunch875> There's a limit to how much work canonical can do in a period of time
<ogra_> exactly
<brunch875> I'm pretty impressed of the progress
<MCMic> I know this, my problem is where the priority is put
<MCMic> Like support google first and standard after
<MCMic> And Telegram first and XMPP later
<ogra_> MCMic, a webapp runs in its own sandbox, it can not access any system resources or files
<brunch875> I think it's a great idea, knowing how google is so tied to android and the userbase is guaranteed
<MCMic> ogra_: I prefer my IM app accessing things that a foreign server accessing my IM password and conversations
<brunch875> any android device has hangouts installed by default
<ogra_> while a browser has a cookie DB, has the browsing history and whatnot
<MCMic> brunch875: yay, letâs do the same errors as everyone else
<ogra_> so indeed it uis safer to have a webapp that also enforces https use than using the remote page in in a browser ...
<MCMic> ogra_: but with the browser I chose which website I visit
<MCMic> ogra_: So I can run the webapp on a server I trust
<ogra_> so if you are a user that uses that pidgin remote service often ...
<MCMic> And not the one the packager trust
<ogra_> would you pick the browser or a webapp
<MCMic> I donât want to use a webapp for IM on my phone, unless itâs running on my own server, and event then it makes little sense compared to a native app
<ogra_> but somebody does
<ogra_> and he felt safer with a webapp ... or simply likes to have a separate icon for it
<ogra_> so why shouldnt he upload it to the store
<MCMic> but packaging this crap is encouraging people to be reckless with their data
<MCMic> And people could install this just thinking itâs pidgin, thatâs what I thought at first
<ogra_> well, not telling you it s a webapp is indeed not nice of that person ... you can give him/her feedback via a review in the store ;)
<MCMic> I did this at some point for a few apps but there are so many package with this error
<ogra_> (and others will see your bad ranking and comments when installing it)
<brunch875> hmmm truly there should be a way to flag webapps as such
 * ogra_ doesnt think it is an error
<MCMic> most packages are webapps or native UI for a web service and do not say it
<ogra_> and thats not the case on android or IOS ?
<MCMic> I installed a lot of translator app thinking they would work, none of them do, they need internet access and do not say it.
<ogra_> the cloud rules all mobile OSes nowadays ... i doubt you can easily get away without it for 90% of the mobile apps out there
<MCMic> ogra_: not on fdroid that I was using with cyanogen before changing phone
<MCMic> ogra_: the point of uTouch is to do better than android
<ogra_> where is that written ?
<MCMic> -_-
<brunch875> I thought the point of utouch was convergence
<MCMic> Whatâs the point if it has all the same problems?
<ogra_> (i think we definitely do better than android everywhere already and we all want to be better ... but there is no such objective written down anywehere)
<ogra_> it doesnt
<MCMic> brunch875: I heard I would not get convergence because e4.5 is too old, so thatâs not the point for me
<brunch875> e4.5 has been labelled as prototype since its release
<MCMic> Well until now, I can do far less things and I feel far less free with ubuntu touch than with cyanogenmod&fdroid
<ogra_> ubuntus design is already so much different that it explicitly cant have the same security probs that android has
<MCMic> brunch875: Itâs the only ubuntu touch device I could find which was small and not too expensive
<ogra_> no app is able to read your addfressbook without you knowing ... or your browser histroy ... or your GPS data for the last hours or whatnot
<MCMic> ogra_: this is completely useless if it keeps sending data to servers anywhere for anything
<ogra_> what data ?
<MCMic> ogra_: things I want to translate
<ogra_> it only has access to its own data
<MCMic> ogra_: places I visit as GPS does not work online
<ogra_> so there is no way to relate your search to ... say ... a user account
<MCMic> ogra_: my messages if I use pidgin webapp
<ogra_> and if you use pidgin native your messages do go through a server ?
<MCMic> ogra_: through the server I chose
<MCMic> ogra_: which I can run if I want too
<MCMic> if you donât see the difference, you got a problem
<davmor2> MCMic: can you name a single phone platform that meets your very specific needs?
<ogra_> so dont chose that webapp then ... write a native pidgin client
<ogra_> nobody will stop you doing that
<MCMic> Itâs like Â«I donât want other people to come in my houseÂ» -> Â«But your mom is coming into you house, itâs the same thing!Â»
<ogra_> and nobody will reject patches if you want to improve the platform itself
<MCMic> ogra_: I wonât write all apps I need, that would take forever
<ogra_> so find someone else
<brunch875> does android have a pidgin app?
<MCMic> davmor2: all of them no, but as I said I was better of with cyanogen&fdroid. At least I had contact sync, GPS, email client and ttrss client working.
<MCMic> brunch875: android has Â«ConversationÂ» which is a good XMPP client. But there are many other xmpp clients on android
 * ogra_ has GPS, an email client and syncs his contact with the former android contact DB he was using 
<brunch875> But aren't those third parties? :S I think you're asking pears to the apple tree.
<MCMic> ogra_: I did not find any GPS in ubuntu touch working offline. When I need a GPS, Iâm usually lost far from cities, I donât have internet
<ogra_> the point is that complaining wont get you anywhere if a feature isnt implemented
<MCMic> ogra_: Itâs just reading Â«yay I converted someone to TelegramÂ» which made me react
<ogra_> i think there is an experimental branch of uNav that has offline apping
<MCMic> brunch875: Yes, but the OS could help this to happen
<brunch875> true, but the OS is very busy
<MCMic> brunch875: it seems to me ubuntu touch really push people to use webapps
<ogra_> yes, converting people from whatsapp to telegram is a good thing, dont you think ?
<davmor2> MCMic: unav is doing offline gps now but that is a new feature that I think is still to land, you have to remember that the apps are growing up around the platform as both grow
<MCMic> ogra_: Not that much, itâs pretty much the same thing
<ogra_> in your view
<ogra_> not in mine or brunch875's
<MCMic> ogra_: Whatâs the difference?
<brunch875> the major difference is you can't develop a whatsapp client
<brunch875> because whatsapp doesn't want that
<ogra_> MCMic, that telegram is opensource friendly for example ...
<ogra_> unlike whatsapp they open their API to develoÃpers
<ogra_> and dont start sueing people that write a free client ... or lock down userse that use an open alternative
<MCMic> ogra_: really, where are the sources of the server?
<ogra_> did i say server anywhere above ?
<ogra_> i said they are friendly to OSS devs and that deserves support
<MCMic> You said opensource friendly
<ogra_> yes
<MCMic> lol
<brunch875> that's opensource friendly, isn't it?
<MCMic> That deserves support
<MCMic> Yeah guys you are not doing opensource but you are our friends so thatâs ok
<ogra_> nonsense
<MCMic> Ok so if tomorrow whatsapp have an API they suddenly are really good guys?
<brunch875> well, they'd be better than now
<brunch875> but it sounds unlikely since they've always hunted down third parties like whatsapp+
<MCMic> ogra_: and telegram could close the API at any moment by the way
<ogra_> if they start to react to bug reports and give diownstream devs support ? yes, sure, they wouldnt be the "good guys" but 2better guys" and the world would be a better place ;)
<MCMic> brunch875: Itâs business decision, just like telegram chose to open the API is business, whatsapp could change business strategy tomorrow
<ogra_> and you think that anywheer in the SW world there are still things that arent based on business decisions ?
<ogra_> (apart from the 23877245 calculator apps that people wrote in their spare time at home)
<MCMic> Anyway, I need to go, but I find it very sad free software enthusiast waste their time advertizing for non-free closed services.
<ogra_> MCMic, start a free servisce or give us an app that uses one and we'kll happily praise it
<brunch875> You misunderstood me :s
<ogra_> MCMic, telegram is currently the best we have ... come up with something better and we'll pick yours ;)
<MCMic> ogra_: So you really donât care about free software, you just want good software
<brunch875> I said telegram in the context of "register by phone number" app like whatsapp, wechat, line, viber...
<ogra_> then i would probably work for another company
<davmor2> MCMic: Please Stop. We understand your point of view, but we also live in a world with 7billion other people who don't share it, we have to provide a platform that caters to all needs, which is hard enough to start with, so we start with as many of the common needs as we can, the 2 most requested things are whatsapp and google sync, we have google sync for most things and next on our agenda is own cloud for the
<davmor2> same things which is the next most requested thing for sync.  We can't provide it all at once or nobody would ever have a device. it is a growing platform.
<MCMic> davmor2: Itâs just on PC there are systems for guys like me but on phones there is nothing so we end up on ubuntu touch and are disappointed. Iâd be happy if there was smaller distributions more focused on freedom and open protocols bud sadly thereâs not much.
<MCMic> For me the problem is also it seems not possible to write a ubuntu app which add account types in the systems like the google accounts appears
<ogra_> you can send patches as i said before
<ogra_> the code is our there ...
<ogra_> the point is that there is only a handful of phone developers ... they can only do so much ...
<ogra_> fi you want to move the project in another direction, send code that does
<ogra_> (so we are back at the start :) )
<MCMic> ogra_: Yeah, but the OS could have a generic account system and a google account app. This way people could have implemented owncould sync in the same way and uninstall google stuff easily
<ogra_> not under the security constraints we have ...
<MCMic> Instead, there is google sync inside the system it seems, and no easy way other than patching the core system to add new type of accounts
<ogra_> snappy will fix that though
 * ogra_ hasnt said that all day ... was about time :)
<brunch875> it's all coming, MCMic. Give it time!
<MCMic> weâll seeâ¦
<MCMic> Gotta go, bye
<brunch875> bye bye!
<davmor2> MCMic: actually it is a generic backend that just has google accounts currently and work is underway to add own cloud as we say it is still a young platform that is a work in progress every release adds more features
 * ogra_ hears the echo of davmor2's words in the empty room
 * brunch875 integrates the words as welcome information
<nhaines> So my Nexus 7 is deleting my libertine container after every reboot and I want it to stop!
<nhaines> I'm going to install ubuntu-pd r207 right now, and then actually I'm going to go to sleep, but if there are any files or logs or anything I can look at so I can file a bug when I wake up, I'll be happy!
<brunch875> I remember back in the day when people sent you a message on gtalk and were offline, you'd get an email instead
<brunch875> that would cover notifications for me using the python app hangups :|
<brunch875> If someone knows how to hack around this, please let me know
<ogra_> you mean yu want an app excluded from suspending when in background ?
<Acou_Bass> utouch tweak tool can do that
<ogra_> there is a gconf key for that you can set ... the prob is that it will prevent the whole device from sleeping
<Acou_Bass> but doesnt really help the notifications for that :P
<ogra_> Acou_Bass, works fine with my kiwi-irc client webapp from the store (that is how i use it on the tablet)
<Acou_Bass> what, it gives you notifications?
<ogra_> (i would never do that on the phone though ... )
<ogra_> it has builtin notifications .. so even in BG it makes a "plopp2 sound if you get a ping, yes
<Acou_Bass> ahh cool, but you have to flick the switch to stop it suspending in background
<ogra_> indeed it isnt hooked up to the notification system
<Acou_Bass> so it makes a sound but not a bubble?
<ogra_> well, i use gconftool fro the terminal, but yes
<ogra_> right
<Acou_Bass> still decent
<ogra_> yeah, fine for the tablet at least
<Acou_Bass> it bothers me slightly that webapps are more capable of doing notifications than 'real' apps... but i suppose ill have to wait for that to go better :P
<ogra_> not really helpful if you have the phone in your pocket :)
<ogra_> (you wont really hear it)
<Acou_Bass> XD eah
<brunch875> (10:51:39) ogra_: gsettings set com.canonical.qtmir lifecycle-exempt-appids [com.ubuntu.music,com.ubuntu.developer.ogra.kiwi-irc]
<brunch875> yeaha, very handy
<ogra_> brunch875, yeah, thats it
<ogra_> but really, i'd consider twice using that on a phone
<ogra_> definitely eats your battery
<brunch875> yeah, it's why I'm not really using it
<nhaines> ogra_: you know what really eats my tablet's battery?
<ogra_> using it ?
<nhaines> Keeping the screen on while I redownload all the packages to build a libertine container!
<ogra_> well, i create my libertine containers via ssh ... :P
<nhaines> ogra_: so do I, on the phone in-terminal.  :P
<nhaines> Although I should probably look into just using SSH.
<nhaines> But I'd rather look into why the tablet keeps deleting the container.
<ogra_> yeah, mine doesnt get deleted
<nhaines> Every boot, it's like nothing ever happened.
<ogra_> and the container is really gone from the filesystem ? or just from the json config ?
 * ogra_ bets the config file just gets reset
<nhaines> Everything.  The ContainerConfig.js, the actual chroot... all of it.
<nhaines> Which made me angry because I can just back up the config file and restore it at least.  ;)
<ogra_> all of it sounds nasty
<nhaines> It's sub-optimal for sure.
<nhaines> Okay, time for that "sleep" I talked about!
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Ah, I think I just noticed you are having issues with Libertine containers?
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: And, I just noticed you are going to sleep too.  Please ping me when you and I are around so I can understand what issues you are hitting.
<mardy> dobey: hi! Just to catch up, what's the situation like? Are you working on your own branch, or are you expecting me to make some changes on mines?
<dobey> mardy: i have a branch based off your signon-plugin-part-2 branch, but it still needs some work i think, and i was thinking it should be split up into smaller changes too, so i started working on another based off the clear-token branch, but i'm still pretty confused about how everything is supposed to work, and kind of tired of being confused all the time
<mardy> dobey: ok, please let me know if I can help somehow
<mardy> dobey: I'll try to get the changes to other components (signond, ussoa) landed meanwhile, so that testing will be easier
<dobey> mardy: you don't happen to be in montreal this week do you?
<mardy> dobey: not AFAIK :-D
<dobey> me either
<BlackJohnny> hi guys! I am developing a clementine remote for ubuntu phone and I have a weird behavior about the tcp connection while the phone is locked.
<BlackJohnny> The communication stops while the phone is locked and resumes after the phone gets unlocked. The issue is that after getting unlocked I get all the communication that was not received while the phone was locked
<BlackJohnny> and that is very strange
<BlackJohnny> I expected a disconnect ...
<dobey> BlackJohnny: apps are paused while not in foreground, or while screen is locked if in foreground
<dobey> BlackJohnny: cf "application lifecycle"
<BlackJohnny> dobey, I understand that but shouldn't the server give time out after a while? Somehow i get the filing that the buffer is on the ubuntu-touch side and not the server side
<BlackJohnny> feeling
<BlackJohnny> :)
<dobey> BlackJohnny: i don't know enough details about what you are doing exactly to answer that
<dobey> anyway, must go eat
<ogra_> oSoMoN, yo ... i'm trying to build a webapp-container snap template ... everytime i try to run the app i get:
<ogra_> ogra@styx:~/Devel/packages/snaps/webapp-template$ gitter-im
<ogra_> "file:///build/webbrowser-app-DlRf4x/webbrowser-app-0.23+16.04.20160526/src/app/webcontainer/webapp-container.qml:-1 File not found\n"
<ogra_> oSoMoN, do you know any way to find make that more verbose so i can find out what file it actually looks for ?
<ogra_> -find
<oSoMoN> ogra_, maybe setting QML_IMPORT_TRACE to 1 ?
<ogra_> thanks !
<ogra_> will tyr
<ogra_> try
<ogra_> hmpf
<ogra_> QQmlImportDatabase::addImportPath: "/build/webbrowser-app-DlRf4x/webbrowser-app-0.23+16.04.20160526/obj-x86_64-linux-gnu/src
<ogra_> so where does that import path come from
<oSoMoN> ogra_, probably from https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/webbrowser-app/trunk/view/head:/src/app/config.h.in#L43
<ogra_> well, but why is it in the binary ... snapcraft just pulls the deb from the archive ... i set import paths in a wrapper script
<ogra_> i would assume the build sets it correctly at build time
<NwS> Heya guys, anyone got the Meizu Pro 5?
<popey> NwS: i do
<brunch875> popey's collecting them all
<NwS> popey, any feedback? :P
<popey> its nice :)
<NwS> I guess you also got the tablet? :P
<NwS> If you did which one would you recommend?
 * ogra_ alwys has feedback if he taps an icon ... 
<ogra_> *buzzing* feedback :)
<ogra_> NwS, what do you mean by "which one" ?
<NwS> Tablet or the smartphone
<ogra_> ah
<ogra_> heh
<popey> NwS: i do also have the tablet
<NwS> I want to finally get my first ubuntu device :P
<NwS> Thought so xD
<ogra_> if you want to make phone calls the tablet isnt really helpful :)
<NwS> meh phone calls who cares :P
<ogra_> if you want to occasionally use the thing as laptop replacement, the tablet is for you
<ogra_> and if you dont care about calls
<NwS> Because some reviewers were not that kind with the tablet
<ogra_> the phone is great and all ... but convergence means you need a monitor
<NwS> If the Pro 5 is way better I would get that one
<ogra_> i guess tech-data wise it is a lot better
<ogra_> in the end it really depends on your usecase
<NwS> I just want to start playing with the OS
 * ogra_ gets along fine with using the tablet as laptop replacement ... but i know the limitations and adjust my expectations accordingly
<NwS> But I don't like laggy stuff..
<ogra_> the pro5 is definitely the best device we have today ... HW wise
<ogra_> but the tablet is definitely better for general development
<NwS> Hmm okie tyvm for the info xD
<NwS> Andddddd fml
<NwS> Pro 5 is sold out? -.-"
<svij> that makes the decision easier to which device you want to buy ;)
<popey> Indeed
<popey> I hear more devices are coming
<ogra_> popey, what ? you mean we wont be an exclusive club anymore ?!?
<popey> ogra_: we will, the more devices are not pro 5's
<ogra_> ah
<dobey> there's always more devices
<mhall119> oSoMoN: webbrowser-app hides tab/location bar when I scroll on desktop, is that an intentional change?
<oSoMoN> mhall119, does your desktop have a touch screen?
<mhall119> nope
<mhall119> why would that matter?
<mhall119> it only does it for some pages too
<mhall119> it does it on github.com but not launchpad.net
<mhall119> it does it on reddit and twitter, but not facebook or G+
<oSoMoN> mhall119, could it be https://bugs.launchpad.net/oxide/+bug/1560432 ?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1560432 in Oxide 1.15 "LocationBarController seems to be responding to wheel gestures" [Critical,Fix released]
<mhall119> ah,could be, I'm 2-finger scrolling but it's probably the same event
<mhall119> I have 0.23+16.04.20160526-0ubuntu1 installed
<aua> I want to file a bug against OpenSSL.  None of the "projects" presented in the Ubuntu Touch Core Apps bug tracker seem a good fit.  Any recommendations?
<pmcgowan> aua, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openssl
<aua> pmc: I mean ubuntu touch's current OpenSSL 1.0.1f+.  I don't have a Ubuntu desktop, but are they the same version?
<pmcgowan> aua, yes same version
<dobey> aua: there is no ubuntu touch. there is only ubuntu. the package archive is the package archive, so file bugs against the packages
<aua> Thank you, both!  Will use the above mentioned link.
<dobey> core apps is some of the apps on the phone/tablet images, many of which aren't packaged in the ubuntu archive, but are click packages in the store
<dobey> the bug filing page linked in the topic of this channel has a list of where things should be filed for most of the higher level bits
<dobey> 10%/hr battery loss :(
<teve> I've had 1%/2mins battery loss twice recently with rc-propoced. but no idea what causes that drainage.
<dobey> what device?
<teve> e5
<dobey> probably the same unity8 issue
<JanC> hm, I've had my e4.5 battery drained very fast a couple of times in the past (not recently)
<JanC> not sure if it was a coincidence, but it always started when the battery was < 50% already
<JanC> usually somewhere in the 45-50% range
<oftc_ftw> davmor2: well, the description reads "A simple and lightweight media playback service." so I'm not so sure about recording either.
<aua> Policy question: Ubuntu Touch is based on 15.04, which was EOS 2016-02-04 <URL:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu_(operating_system)#Releases>.  How are security bugs handled in 15.04 today?  An example:  15.04 has OpenSSL 1.0.1f+, 15.10 has OpenSSL 1.0.2d+.  That is Is UT team working on their own or is their still support by Ubuntu security folks?
<aua> Sent too fast.
<jdstrand> we are supporting it
<dobey> that
<jdstrand> https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/stable-phone-overlay/+packages?field.name_filter=openssl&field.status_filter=published&field.series_filter=
<dobey> and you can't really simply rely on the upstream version number for what security fixes are in openssl (or other packages)
<jdstrand> you'll notice it got an update on May 12th (the overlay)
<dobey> since fixes tend to be backported rather than shipping new versions
<jdstrand> yes. especially with openssl
<jdstrand> also see 'How will support for Ubuntu Touch be provided?' in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/FAQ#Official_Support
<aua> Yes, I know. about the version number.  I'm simply concerned UT OpenSSL still ships with EXPORT grade ciphers enabled.  That makes it a target for future attacks.  Will open a bug soon, but I wonder if there will be any response, because 1.0.1f+ is not officially supported anymore.  The situation is a bit opaque.  I'll go on with a bug report anyway.  But ...
<aua> $openssl ciphers EXP -v
<aua> will give you output on UT terminal.
<aua> OTA11
<aua> Thanks, will read that.
<jdstrand> aua: note that the wiki states the Touch images are moving to 16.04 base midyear. That is probably a couple/few months later than that, but people are working on it
<jdstrand> aua: in other words, in a few months touch images wil have 16.04's openssl
<dobey> jdstrand: i don't think all devices will get moved to 16.04 though
<jdstrand> uh
<jdstrand> that is not what we agreed to
<jdstrand> we can't support arbitrary numbers of overlays. we can barely support the one :)
 * jdstrand notes he confirmed this with pmcgowan not too long ago
<aua> Is that a current statement or from like six months ago?  I've last heard there's still a lot to do before the switch.
<jdstrand> aua: I think august would be the earliest and probably optimistic
<aua> Oh, OK.  Thanks!
<dobey> jdstrand: i guess some more clarification needs to be made then. :-/
<jdstrand> will get clarification
<dobey> i hope whomever is working on getting xenial booting, gets it working soon
 * popey looks at popeym10 
<coucouf> hi, I have a bug with Nexus5 flashed from UBPorts, where Â«Â open with appÂ Â» doesnât works from file manager
<coucouf> is it somehow known, where should I look for more infoÂ ?
<dobey> it's probably the same issue that seems to prevent sharing photos and such
<coucouf> (I know itâs not an official port but Iâm surprised something like that doesnât work, which hardly looks device specific at first sight)
<dobey> something very odd with apparmor
<dobey> seems to affects nexus5 and one plus one
<coucouf> hmm, ok thanks
<dobey> not sure if others are affected, but i presume officially supported phones aren't
<dobey> no idea why it only is an issue on these devices, either :-/
<coucouf> any place to look for logsÂ ?
<dobey> ~/.cache/upstart/
<dobey> should be a log for the filemanager app in there
<dobey> and maybe something in /var/log/syslog
<coucouf> yes I can see the logs in .cache
<coucouf> one of the last is "ubuntumirclient: Got invalid serialized mime data. Ignoring it."
<dobey> yeah, that's harmless and not the issue
<coucouf> dbus.log says "Failed to charge items, aborting"
<dobey> what kind of file are you trying to open anyway?
<dobey> and what exactly doesn't work?
<coucouf> that was a .flac music
<coucouf> getting the same with .jpg
<coucouf> most unnoying is for images / documents because thereâs no way to browse them from the gallery / documents app
<coucouf> other unrelated question, is there really no human way to import a vcs contacts listÂ ?
<coucouf> *vcf
<dobey> syncevolution can import it. i don't know if there's UI for it or not
<coucouf> Iâve seen some doc on it, it needs to be apt-get which doesnât just-work
<coucouf> hints welcome
<dobey> i just did it by making a new address book in evolution on my PC, importing the VCF there, and then taking the contacts.db file and sticking it on the phone in place of the empty one
<coucouf> sounds wicked enough to work :)
<dobey> worked fine two years ago when i did it. should work fine now :)
<coucouf> in fact moving the files from Download for example to Pictures / Documents makes them visible from gallery / documents app
<dobey> yes
<dobey> anyway, gotta run
<dobey> later
<coucouf> dobey: import worked :-)
<aidentech> Does the software center in Ubuntu Touch include proprietary software?
<JanC> aidentech: yes, licenses are indicated
<aidentech> Ok, I was just curious.
<nhaines> ChrisTownsend: thanks for offering to help!  I have a Nexus 7 I'm happy to reflash or make any changes to.
#ubuntu-touch 2016-06-08
<talonz> anyone know if the meizu pro 5 wil be restocked ?
<OerHeks> talonz, hit 'buy now' and you will get a redirect http://www.meizu.com/en/products/pro5ubuntu/summary.html
<talonz> to joybuy which is out of stock
<talonz> guess ill be patient and wait for the next reup
<Sockman> Hi
<Sockman> Anyone there?
<teve> is there some workaround for facebook messages? m.facebook.com wants to install messanger and it's not possible to view messages anymore.
<Mikaela> teve: Have you tried https://messenger.com/ ?
<Mikaela> I have understood that it might also want to install Messenger app, but I understood that is only with "supported platforms" and I imagine Ubuntu Touch doesn't belong to those yet.
<teve> seems that https://messenger.com/ wont work with mobile UA, it suggest to go google play store.
<lars_> Is Nexus 4 : ubuntu-touch/stable/bq-aquaris.en - mako: #23 the best version for nexus 4? Does it support usb-otg and 4G network and other important things?
<Acou_Bass> teve: i manage to use the facebook mobile app to read messages just fine, just click the little X in the top rigth corner to get rid of the banner
<Acou_Bass> plus there is a messenger app in the store BUT it is basically the desktop site and so has absolutely crap mobile UI
<teve> for me that little X is no longer visible :(
<teve> I was able to bypass that banner about one week.
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Hi!  Could you give me a brief synopsis of what you are experiencing wrt Libertine?
 * ogra_ guesses he expects that a container survives a reboot :) 
<ogra_> seems his containers are completely wiped from disk after rebooting the tablet
<nhaines> ogra_: indeed!
<ChrisTownsend> ogra_: That should not happen at all.  They are stored in ~/.cache/libertine-container/
<nhaines> I agree.  :)
<ogra_> i know :)
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: So, the container is all created and you verify this by looking in ~/.cache/libertine-container/$container_id/rootfs and it is valid?
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Then you reboot your N7 and after it restarts, it's gone?
<nhaines> ChrisTownsend: yes, although *lately* I've been verifying it by running Firefox, say.
<nhaines> That is a precise description of what I'm seeing.
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Are you naming the container 'puritine' and do you have the libertine-demo package installed?
<nhaines> I am naming the container 'puritine' and since I am running ubuntu-pd, yess, it seems I do have libertine-demo installed.  1.0.4+15.04.20160519-0ubuntu1
<nhaines> Although it looks like r208 is calling my name now.  :)
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Ah, I know what the issue is.  There is a puritine-click Upstart job that looks to see if the real Puritine click package is installed.  If it is not, it will check if the paths for the 'puritine' container id are there and if so, it will remove it.
<nhaines> It would be understating it to say that I found this behavior ideal.  :)
<nhaines> Or overstating it, I suppose.
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: I would suggest you name the container something else and install the Libertine Scope from the Store to launch X apps.
<nhaines> Although it's good to know I'm not *completely* crazy.
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Heh, well, I never thought of the use case where someone basically set up everything like Puritine, but didn't actually install the real Puritine click.
<nhaines> ChrisTownsend: then I have some icons in my app scope that do nothing.
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: You can uninstall the libertine-demo package as well.
<nhaines> Then I made my tablet read/write and broke system updates.
<nhaines> What's the target for ubuntu and ubuntu-pd merging?  OTA-13?
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Ugh, I see.  ubuntu and ubuntu-pd will be merging soon meaning in the OTA-12 timeframe.  I have an active silo for doing just that and need to coordinate w/ some others, but it's currently in the works as we sepak.
<nhaines> ChrisTownsend: that is at least some comfort.  :)
<nhaines> I'd rather just have the puritine click package around to install, because it took about a week to figure out how to manually recreate it.
<nhaines> Then I turned my tablet off to charge it so it'd have a full battery for my presentation, and couldn't demonstrate legacy apps.
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: *I* really have no issue making it available, but the only place I have it is in a private area.  Let me make sure I could make it available publicly and if I can, where to host it.
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: I'm really sorry about this.  A use case I didn't think of:-(
<nhaines> ChrisTownsend: it's okay.  As it turns out, I thought an update had broken something, and in any case, I'd just grabbed a SlimPort adapter from Amazon Prime, so everyone seeing the tablet for the first time in two months was astonished at the instant transition from touch to traditional mode and were amazed.
<nhaines> Which is fine for the presentation, but I've probably wasted two weeks of my own time trying to refine how to build a puritine container that matched what the system expected.  :)
<nhaines> Thanks for the answer, thanks for the timeframe for the merge, and thanks for looking into making the puritine click available!
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Well, I'll see what I can do for you.  I hate you wasted so much of your own time, but on the bright side, you certainly understand libertine/puritine quite well now:)
<nhaines> Well that's for sure!  :)
<nhaines> I have half a mind to write user documentation.  Just half, though.  :)
<nhaines> Why is there an upstart job to remove the container if the click package isn't installed, btw?
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: The whole puritine click thingy is quite hacky, so the reason for the Upstart job is to create links in the places libertine expects the rootfs to be since the real rootfs is in the place where clicks are installed, ie, /opt/blah.  And then if the Puritine click is uninstalled, we want those links to be removed since we don't want libertine stuff to see a broken rootfs.
<nhaines> Oh, that makes sense.
<nhaines> I guess the solution would be to test for links.  :)
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: I should have made the job look to see it was a link before removing it instead of just seeing if it's there at all.
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Exactly!
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: But that job is going away any ways, so the point is moot now.
<nhaines> ChrisTownsend: well, you were probably more focused on making puritine/libertine less hacky, which is the better long-term solution.  :)
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Indeed!
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: I guess another workaround is to create a 'dummy' com.ubuntu.puritine click package that does nothing, but is there to trick the Upstart job.  And then create the puritine stuff like you have been doing.
<nhaines> That's something I could probably manage.
<nhaines> It doesn't help that this coincided with the month my ISP decided to implement bandwidth quotas and throttling, so that each new initialization took like 2 hours each.
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Oh gawd....
<nhaines> So I can't pretend I didn't lose a couple days of billable hours, but at least knowing what was going on makes me much less grumpy about it.
 * ChrisTownsend Feels even more guilty
<nhaines> (Yeah, it was a week or two before I figured out what was going on with the ISP, since it rained the day it started and that sometimes causes problems for a day or two.)
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: I have a dummy package as well.  I would just need figure out how to get it to you.
<nhaines> ChrisTownsend: if email (my nick @ubuntu.com) doesn't work, I can poke my OwnCloud setup.
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Ok, give me a bit.  And I'll try to email it to you.  It's small.
<nhaines> Thanks!  In that case, no rush, because I'm up too late once again.
 * nhaines feels accomplished.
<nhaines> Now I just have to make a lot of noise about the Day scope not being available and I'll practically have all my Ubuntu Touch complaints solved.  :)
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Can't help you with that last one:)
<nhaines> ChrisTownsend: I'll probably just harrass mhall119 to send it to me as a stopgap.  :)
<ChrisTownsend> :)
<nhaines> ChrisTownsend: any ETA as to the ubuntu-pd merge showing up in rc-proposed?  I only mean on the scale of "next week" versus "more like 3 weeks".
<nhaines> I guess I should probably look at the freeze dates.
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: ASAP really.  It's a matter of getting the current libertine silo to pass automated tests (some issue that is not libertine related), then pass the QA muster, and finally coordinate the release to deprecate the ubuntu-pocket-desktop metapackage.
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: And maybe some other step that I'm not aware of;-)
<nhaines> Hmm, well, that doesn't sound too hard.  ;)
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Heh, we'll see.
<nhaines> ChrisTownsend: well, I really appreciate you taking a moment to help figure out what was going on.
<nhaines> I guess the main cause of my troubles was that I don't want to be in here asking stupid questions while you're all trying to work, and documentation for self-training is very, very rare.
<nhaines> So I just need to ask for help a little more often.
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Sure, you're very welcome.  I sent the dummy package already, so hopefully you have received it.
<nhaines> ChrisTownsend: there it is!  Thanks!  If I can make some time to work on user documentation, this will really simplify things.
<nhaines> As usual, just in time for the system to change so I have to rewrite stuff.  But such is life.  ;)
<nhaines> And hey, at least it's not all changing as fast as snapd.  ;)
<ChrisTownsend> nhaines: Ok, great!  lol, that is so true!
<Acou_Bass> nhaines: i had that issue with puritine container being wiped on reboot too - i assumed it was because it was a manual install too hmm
<Acou_Bass> this was on n4 though not 7
<nhaines> Acou_Bass: I'm American, so I just naturally assumed it was something someone else had done wrong.  ;)
<Acou_Bass> hehe
<Acou_Bass> i just assumed it was expected behaviour for what is essentially an unsupported testbed software
<nhaines> I assumed it was a bug, but the kind of thing one deals with when testing unreleased software.
<popey> bugs? us!?
<popey> nowai.jpg
 * Acou_Bass looks at popey suspiciously
<Acou_Bass> to be fair, i havent found that many bugs in using utouch as my daily, and those i have found were alreaday reported and marked as being worked on
<nhaines> It does all seem to work deceptively well.  :)
<Acou_Bass> yeah it all works fairly well, just a few small niggles that arent really 'bugs' but are annoying, like my confusion as to how webapps can do notifications just fine but native apps seem to struggle XD
<Acou_Bass> that being said, the telegram app is pretty well-intergrated, its just a shame i dont actually use telegram :D
<ahoneybun> mm
<ahoneybun> ubuntu-device-flash query --download-only --device=flo --channel=ubuntu-touch/stable/ubuntu
<ahoneybun> this tells me a query is needed but it is there
<ahoneybun> I also tried the --download-only in front of the query as well with the same error
<ogra_> ahoneybun, iirc you need one of the three commands ... --list-image --list-channels or --show-image
<ahoneybun> mm so I need touch
<ahoneybun> yep
<ahoneybun> thanks ogra_
<dobey> Acou_Bass: what webapps do notifications?
<dobey> none i know of do
<ogra_> gmail does iirc
<dobey> no. there's a system daemon that polls google; the webapp doesn't do anything there
<ogra_> ah
<dobey> same with twitter
<mhall119> nhaines: missing the Today scope?
<dobey> mardy: is there no way to get the qml account plug-in loaded under X to test it?
<Monosoftman> Hey guys, i got some problems installing ubuntu touch on my nexus 2012 wifi, it keeps saying that it cant find the device grouper. Any advice?
<dobey> grouper isn't supported
<Monosoftman> my life
<Monosoftman> Is there a way to get around it or is it just tough luck?
<raph_ael> Monosoftman: better get a supported device or a nexus 4 like I have
<dobey> no, the hardware isn't up to it. heck, it's incredibly slow on android
<Monosoftman> damn. Is the OS any good?
<dobey> ubuntu? of course it is :)
<mardy> dobey: there is, I just run "system-settings online-accounts" and it works
<Monosoftman> It was my first time using it when i tried to install touch on the nexus 7. Really loving it so far. Wish i could install it on my S7
<Monosoftman> S6*
<ogra_> Monosoftman, was that a rhetorical question ?
<ogra_> (asking if an os is good in the main IRC channel of that os ... :) )
<dobey> mardy: but you can't actually add any accounts, because there's no mir to open a trusted session on top of the system-settings app with
<Monosoftman> @ogra not at all. im a total newb. And hey for all that i know it could be unstable as **** :P
<ogra_> well, there are devices on sale with it ...
<Monosoftman> Yea im thinking about getting some. but im currently getting an internship pay, so i dont have alot of cash to throw around.
<mardy> dobey: mir is not required, but let me double check, I haven't been trying that in weeks
<ogra_> Monosoftman, i didnt mean you should buy one ... that was just referring to your stability concerns ... "good enought to be sold" is the current stability level
<EdwardMorbius>  hello. does ubuntu clock snap from the store work for you guys on the desktop? it doesnt start on my system
<mardy> dobey: it works, the plugin gets opened in another window
<dobey> mardy: well, what i want to do is load the plug-in from my source tree's builddir, not from the installed system.
<dobey> mardy: eh? it certainly didn't work the last time i tried to do it
<ogra_> Monosoftman, probably not good enugh for your computer illiterate mom/sister/grandpa yet though
<mardy> dobey: ok, one thing at a time; if you run "system-settings online-accounts" and then go to add an account, does it work?
<dobey> ogra_: of course not, with no snapchat/tinder/whatsapp/etc
<mardy> dobey: here it works both with OAuth-based accounts and with U1
<dobey> 2016-06-08 10:09:06,383 - WARNING - RequestAccess failed: QDBusError("com.ubuntu.OnlineAccountsUi.InvalidApplication", "Invalid client application")
<dobey> mardy: no it doesn't work
<mardy> dobey: I wonder if I did some tricks on my system to get it to work long ago...
<mardy> dobey: can you paste the full output?
<dobey> mardy: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/17117985/
<dobey> mardy: but the "invalid client app" is what i get when i try to click on any of the plug-ins in the add account page
<mardy> dobey: weird; can you also run this on another terminal window: OAU_LOGGING_LEVEL=2 OAU_DAEMON_TIMEOUT=9999 online-accounts-service
<dobey> mardy: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/17118094/
<mardy> service.cpp 42 requestAccess Got request: QMap(("application", QVariant(QString, "system-settings"))("pid", QVariant(uint, 5631))("provider", QVariant(QString, "windows-live"))("windowId", QVariant(qulonglong, 75497485)))
<mardy> utils.cpp 49 apparmorProfileOfPeer App ID: "unconfined"
<mardy> dobey: I'm getting this ^
<dobey> ok
<mardy> dobey: maybe there is some apparmor-related package which you need to install?
<dobey> i doubt it.
<dobey> but maybe because this is running in a container?
<mardy> dobey: might be, I'm running in VirtualBox
<mardy> jdstrand: do you know? ^
<dobey> mardy: well, that aside, how can i run the online-accounts-ui with an env var set to get extra debug info from my plug-in?
<dobey> seems like running online-accounts-service with it doesn't quite do the job
<dobey> although, maybe it is working, and with the new plug-in stuff just isn't getting logged as much
<dobey> though i guess not
<mardy> dobey: it does log, I just used to add U1_DEBUG=1 when working on U1, and that was doing the trick
<dobey> weird
<dobey> doesn't seem to be doing so here
<mardy> dobey: that's to be added to the online-accounts-service line I gave you above
<dobey> mardy: where do the logs from the signon plug-in end up?
<mardy> dobey: syslog, if you have run echo "LoggingLevel=2" > ~/.config/signond.conf
<oftc_ftw> hi! how can i remove the usb authorization for usb debugging? i only get an "unauthorized" device from "adb devices" but i'm sure i clicked "allow" when the message popped up on my phone. so now i'd like to try again but it seems there is no way to revoke the authorization.
<oftc_ftw> or is there anything else i could do? already tried the adb kill-server, start-server part
<jdstrand> mardy: all that should be needed for that (assuming I understand what is going on correctly) is libapparmor, which should be installed by default. running in a VM would not be a problem. running in a container is probably the problem
<jdstrand> if the app in the container is talking to dbus outside of the container, dbus asking for the security label of the process in the container could get that error I would think
<jdstrand> if this is just an idle question, hopefully that helps, if you need this to work, probably should ping ty hicks next week (he is on holiday now). if this is something that must happen today, we can maybe have jj ohansen take a look
<oftc_ftw> If there is no way to revoke them in the menus, maybe there is one from the command line?
<dobey> oftc_ftw: rm /data/misc/adb/adb_keys
<ondra> oftc_ftw all authorised keys are stored in that key file
<ondra> oftc_ftw so if you need to de-authorise just one device, then $ nano /data/misc/adb/adb_keys
<ondra> oftc_ftw and remove just particular key
<dobey> mardy: hmm, not seeing any
<dobey> hmm, seems like signond isn't starting
<dobey> and google plug-in wont' load
<dobey> joy
<oftc_ftw> dobey, ondra, i removed it but the pop up message doesn't show
<oftc_ftw> meh
<ondra> oftc_ftw unplug -> plug still nothing?
<dobey> oftc_ftw: screen has to be unlocked too. also, you do have android-tools-adb 5.1... on the pc, right?
<oftc_ftw> ondra: just tried again, nothing
<ondra> oftc_ftw and you have dev mode enabled and tried to adb shell from your computer?
<ondra> oftc_ftw and /data/misc/adb/ has no files?
<oftc_ftw> dobey: Version: 5.5.1r36+git20160322-0ubuntu3
<oftc_ftw> ondra: yeah, it says "error: device unauthorized. Please check..."
<oftc_ftw> ondra: there was a file, i removed it
<dobey> ok, weird
<oftc_ftw> i could reboot the phone maybe?
<oftc_ftw> it worked heh
<oftc_ftw> thanks a lot!
<oftc_ftw> dobey ondra ^
<peat-psuwit> Does anyone notice that Instagram scope has stopped working?
<ondra> oftc_ftw dobey should not really need reboot, but hey if it worked :)
<oftc_ftw> yeah, that's what i thought :P
<dobey> ondra: probably just needed to restart the adb service on the phone, which reboot of course does
<pmcgowan> pmcm10,
<matv1> peat-psuwit http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2016/06/instagram-kills-ubuntu-phones-instagram-photos-scope
<dobey> oh awesome. a web page i can't scroll
<dobey> thank omgubuntu
<peat-psuwit> matv1: Thank you. That's sad.
<matv1> dobey hence the omg
<peat-psuwit> dobey: I'm not sure what do you mean. I can scroll on Instagram mobile site just fine.
<matv1> hang on dobey how is it you cant scroll that? you using webrowser-app?
<matv1> right!
<dobey> matv1: no, chromium. when i opened it, there was a full screen partially transparent black element on the page; i got rid of that, and the page wasn't scrollable
<dobey> then i tweaked some of the privacy badger items over to red, and it reloaded and was scrollable
<matv1> dobey ah. i think i have my chromium pretty much outofthebox. I didnt have any trouble. may i ask specifically which settings cause that?
<dobey> matv1: not sure. maybe ad blocker i guess
<matv1> oh yes. that will do probably do it
<meizupro5> hi guys
<meizupro5> anyone else have issues with the pro5 being detected by windows 10
<meizupro5> anyone able to assist
<oftc_ftw> hello. where can i find information if and how my app can run in the background or record audio over something like the media-hub? i need to know and can't find anything.
<jhodapp> oftc_ftw, come join #ubuntu-media and we can discuss some more
<matv1> mardy ping
<taiebot> Hey people. Was wondering if the time was right to re-do an ubuntu-edge campain in partnership with either BQ or Meizu. Software and hardware are coming nicely together now but i feel it's the user base who needs to grow now. Having a crowdfunding campaign as successful as the last one (even if i did not get my phone) would be quite good for the project. I have seen that meizu was doing an indiegogo campaign for a speaker why not for a co
<taiebot> mm wonder if design had a look at those early concept would quite like navigating through scopes like this bottom bar. http://design.canonical.com/wp-content/uploads/D005.jpg
<nhaines> mhall119: I can download the Today scope, but I can't download the Day scope.
<mhall119> what is the Day scope?
<taiebot> mhall119: it 's the big calendar icon in the today scope
<mhall119> oh, that
<dobey> i thought that was part of the today scope
<mhall119> so did I
<nhaines> It is not.  :)
<taiebot> dobey: Never saw it on my nexus 4 :'(
<nhaines> *Why* continues to elude me, but I'll leave such minutiae up to the developers.  :)
<dobey> that seems excessive
<nhaines> It made it very difficult to get screenshots for my book (after a few days I had to leave it out.)
<taiebot> it's like missing a piece of a puzzle.
<dobey> weird
<dobey> com.canonical.scopes.day_day
<dobey> it is indeed not in the store
<taiebot> dobey: From my understanding it is not provided on the nexus image
<dobey> taiebot: very few things are provided on the plain ubuntu image, when compared to the retail phones
<dobey> today scope isn't provided either
<pmcgowan> nhaines, fwiw I have asked that Day scope go to the store
<nhaines> pmcgowan: thanks1
<taiebot1> pmcgowan: Any news on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ofono/+bug/1323837. I am still affected by it when i go abroad. (I missed it's two years Bday ;-))
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1323837 in unity8 (Ubuntu) "[phone] Sim toolkit is not available on UT" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<nhaines> Aww, I ran "pkcon install-local --allow-untrusted com.ubuntu.puritine_0.1.armhf.click", but after a reboot, my container was still gone.
#ubuntu-touch 2016-06-09
<OerHeks> just a silly thought nhaines: is this any different than your command? pkcon install-local com.ubuntu.puritine_0.1.armhf.click\?noauth\=1
<nhaines> OerHeks: yes in that it's not what I type.
<nhaines> I don't know whether the effect of the commands would turn out differently.
<OerHeks> your unsigned container should survive a boot .. should that be possible?
<nhaines> The click package is a dummy package.  It survives a reboot.
<nhaines> The problem is that there's a puritine-click Upstart job that destroys the libertine container if it finds one, unless there's a purtine click package installed.
<nhaines> Except with less "unless" than I prefer.
<ahoneybun> mm a clean install of the OTA11 for the N7 told be to long swipe for the Today Scope but it was not installed
<nhaines> I feel like I should buy Homeworld.
<ahoneybun> mm?
<nhaines> Oops, mean that for -offtopic.  :)
<ahoneybun> feels better with a clean install
<alexspassworld> im in here now
<alexspassworld> ive locked myself out of my phablet illogically
<alexspassworld> no this is definitely what im paying my money for
<alexspassworld> what do you guys use your phablets for anyway
<alexspassworld> weather displacements
<k1l> http://askubuntu.com/a/609944/31260  this should work on the tablet too
<alexspassworld> shud  do ye wot if i run in to any trouble
<alexspassworld> u was n the other chan and now ur in here i guess u did help tho1#
<alexspassworld> im in fastboot mode watch me fly
<alexspassworld> im guessing you can do custom boot roms for these things with all software preloaded
<alexspassworld> anybody need a dollar
<alexspassworld> ?
<alexspassworld> i have a microsd card and requisite cable to hand...
<alexspassworld> countdown timers at the ready
<alexspassworld> officially its stuck in fastboot mode
<alexspassworld> k1l: cant seem to getup the recovery menu as mentioned in the faq
<alexspassworld> worst faq ever
<alexspassworld> so do you guys do custom roms like they do on androids nowadays
<alexspassworld> k1l: didn't work!!!
<alexspassworld> shame no physical keyboard4
<alexspassworld> ill be back
<alexspassworld> laters
<dobey> that was weird
<nhaines> ChrisTownsend: hey, looks like everything's working now.  :D
<mcphail> popey: did you ever get scummvm working?
<popey> mcphail: not looked at it recently
<popey> i got it to launch, play audio, but not take user input. And it didn't scale the screen properly.
<peat-psuwit> On my device, unity8 process seems to consume more memory when the screen is rotated. Does it happen on other device?
<mcphail> popey: hokay. Might have a look at it next week
<popey> sweet!
<popey> let me know if you need any help
<mcphail> no doubt I will ;)
<owaishanif786> hi
<marklyford> looking forward to getting my first ubuntu phone coming that i brought on ebay just now :) I tried converting an old HTC desire i had lying around but gave up :)
<teve> latest rc-propoced (vegetahd) broke terminal app osk :/
<ogra_> works fine on turbo (pro5)
<teve> hmm, it's broken for all apps. keyboard flashes and buttons disappear.
<davmor2> popey: did you do a scummvm snap too?
<popey> no, davidcalle did I think
<davmor2> awesome
<oftc_ftw> hey all. i know it's probably an old topic, but i only read about it just now: what does it mean that Canonical wants to "integrate these services within the system rather than with dedicated apps" (e.g. WhatsApp and Dropbox). Will Ubuntu touch force me to use it and won't I be able to uninstall proprietary software on a Linux distribution? Are there any more accurate plans on this?
<popey> thats not what that means
<oftc_ftw> I mean, I'm going to need WhatsApp at some point, but I don't want it to be part of the OS. I need to be able to "contain" this software, disallow the synchronizing of contacts for example.
<popey> it means "not having to go and find and launch each and every app individually to access the data within"
<oftc_ftw> popey: what does it mean then?
<popey> I'm typing :)
<oftc_ftw> sry :)
<popey> it means that the data will be presented aggregated, so you could have one app or scope which has aggregated all your data, no matter where it lives
<popey> so a messaging app which pulls data from multiple messaging platforms
<popey> it doesn't mean non-optional baking in all these services you don't like
<Acou_Bass> so, using your example, we wont need to download a 'whatsapp app' we just need to tap the 'messaging scope' and itll all be there, similar to how rigt now we tap the 'videos scope' and see content from youtube/vimeo etc
<popey> that kind thing, yeah
<popey> that's the goal
<Acou_Bass> multi-platform messaging app is the 'killer app' for me... i really hope we get one at some point
<Acou_Bass> XD
<oftc_ftw> i see, that's a relief. but i find it hard to imagine that this is going to work too well for me. it's going to be difficult handling different services then, like maybe i want to sync my contacts to Telegram, but don't want to sync them to WhatsApp. I know, that's maybe a strange approach, but i do treat different apps differently.
<Acou_Bass> its the reason i stuck with my n900 for so long, and is the reason i stuck with sailfishOS for a while before jumping to ubuntu
<oftc_ftw> i only started using whatsapp since they integrated the encryption protocol. but i rather still don't trust them with my contacts...
<ogra_> you are already able to select which service can access which data, it will just become more fine grained
<davmor2> oftc_ftw: nope that is fine each app would have to ask for permission to access your contacts have a look at dekko as an example of how that works
<ogra_> (i.e. currently only the messaging and phone apps can access the addressbook at all i belive)
<oftc_ftw> yeah, but if all services are in one app, will i be able to disallow single services?
<oftc_ftw> *distinct
<ogra_> like you already are ...
<oftc_ftw> i am?
<ogra_> install an app that dies video conferencing ..
<ogra_> it will ask you if you want to allow mic access ... then it asks you if you want to allow camera access ...
<ogra_> a "whatsapp" (i doubt that will ever happen), would then also ask foraccess to the global addressbook
<Acou_Bass> i think his point is, if all these mesaging services are all in a singular app
<oftc_ftw> you got it wrong, it's the other way around. i want the app to ask me "allow whatsapp to read contacts" and "allow telegram to read contacts".
<Acou_Bass> then that permission would be asked for the entire app, not individual accounts in said app
<ogra_> by default all apps have to ask you on first access if you permit them to use a resource
<Acou_Bass> (or would it?)
<ogra_> and you can manage that in the system settings
<oftc_ftw> Acou_Bass: you're right
<Acou_Bass> so, his workflow of allowing eg. telegram and whatsapp to have seperate permissions within the same app
<Acou_Bass> would that work? XD
<ogra_> oftc_ftw, other way around ? nope, it is exactly that
<ogra_> if you open your hypotethical whatsapp foor the first time it tries to access the addressbook ... and has to ask you
<oftc_ftw> ogra_: but there is no whatsapp
<oftc_ftw> there is only one app, handling all the services
<ogra_> if you once permitted that access a scope that aggregates whatsapp data can make use of it though
<Acou_Bass> ahhhh see, so theres a seperate 'whatsapp scope' thatll aggregate in the overall 'messaging scope', but that doesnt help the app, only the scope P
<ogra_> sure, even then there will be a permission request
<ogra_> Acou_Bass, that is how the aggregation scopes work today, yes
<Acou_Bass> the point is, if we get a 'messaging app *not a scope*', with all these protocols in it at once
<Acou_Bass> the app itself will ask for permission, not the protocols, yes?
<ogra_> you have single scopes or apps that provide the aggregation data
<ogra_> have a look at the settings of your today scope
<Acou_Bass> yeah i know that
<ogra_> you can en/disable the different aggregation services
<oftc_ftw> let me check that out
<popey> of course this is somewhat academic with no whatsapp on the phone :)
<Acou_Bass> the scope aggregation is awesome, BUT, im not sure how it helps with a singular app with multiple protocols
<Acou_Bass> unless the app will be an 'aggregator' too
<ogra_> indeed :)
<Acou_Bass> like... lets say we call it rockdove, to play on pidgin... we install rockdove, it asks for addressbook permissions... would that then give addressbook permissions to ALL the protocols in the app? or would the 'whatsapp protocol' plugin have to request seperately
<ogra_> and if theer would ever be a whatsapp, i doubt it would be integrated like that but rather a standalone app
<ogra_> (note that this is all completely hypothetical ... today only two apps can access the addessbook)
<Acou_Bass> XD yeah this is true
<Acou_Bass> suppose we wont know until we have the thing in place
<ogra_> right ... but it wont be much different to the other security services we have
<ogra_> i think thats a safe assumption
<Acou_Bass> i mean i personally have no problem with all the protocols handling addressbook, if i didnt want those protocols handling my data i wouldnt install them in the first place
<Acou_Bass> but its an interesting topic :D
<oftc_ftw> ogra_: i just installed the today scope to check it out. you meant the settings like "enable location data" and "display results from telegram"?
<Acou_Bass> the today scope can display results from loads of different scopes
<Acou_Bass> like news, weather, messages/telegram/phone calls etc
<Acou_Bass> presumably at some point the 'messaging' scope would be able to display messages from your whatsapp app or whatever
<ogra_> oftc_ftw, the latter ... in the official today scope there are like 20 sources you can turn on/off
<ogra_> (i think the one you can install from the store is more limited and likely misses all the other collection scopes)
<Acou_Bass> is there like, a standard for making scopes able to plug into aggregators? ive noticed some news scopes dont actually aggregate into the news scopes?
<ogra_> there surely is
 * ogra_ never wrote a scope 
<Acou_Bass> hehe
<oftc_ftw> ogra_: i couldn't find any other today scope i think
<ogra_> i know
<ogra_> thats why i said that :)
<oftc_ftw> so, what is the latest status on this topic anyway? it's been over a year and i couldn't find any news regarding whatsapp. did i miss it? or is it just not going to happen any time soon.
<ogra_> ask facebook
<ogra_> they dont allow third party apps ... so they are the only ones that could write and provide one
<oftc_ftw> well, that's actually the only thing i found. some dude got banned from whatsapp for asking. :D
<ogra_> right
<s`> is silent mode working for you?
<ogra_> very quietly
<oftc_ftw> yeah, but if Canonical is asking, maybe they'd at least give a real answer.
<ogra_> (most of the time)
<s`> it's turned on, but i can still hear sounds from skype for web
<ogra_> oftc_ftw, then the answer is "send $$$$$$$"
<oftc_ftw> you think they need it?
<ogra_> well, it costs developer time
<oftc_ftw> sure, but i guess Canonical is happy to "donate" developer time
<oftc_ftw> never mind though, i just thought there might be some follow-up news as there was no official result from those "talks with big services"
<ogra_> well, after canonical paid, canonical devs are probably also allowed to work on it
<ogra_> first of all they want you to pay for permissions ... and possibly sign an #NDA
<ogra_> i highly doubt that will ever hapen though ...
<ogra_> either they do it or it wont happen at all
<ogra_> it isnt like canonical swims in spare money
<oftc_ftw> ok, i see. maybe i'll have to convince people to ditch whatsapp after all.
<ogra_> telegram is not a bad alternative
<mcphail> s`: the volume control doesn't work for everything
<ogra_> i think silent mode excludes media playback ...
<ogra_> ... and webapps all use the madie role when playing sound
<oftc_ftw> ogra_: it's the worst. they don't have mandatory encryption and make it extremely hard to use the encryption at all.
<ogra_> well, they are very supportive to devs and dont ask for money to use their (open) API
<oftc_ftw> ogra_: signal is not better, they force you to use goole push services. wtf?
<ogra_> i know they iintegrated sevel fixes into their protocol annd server on request of the canonical telegram maintainer before ... and they also happily implemented ubuntu notification support on their side
<ogra_> *several
<oftc_ftw> ogra_: i'm not saying they're bad people! i'm just saying that there approach to security is rather foolish.
<oftc_ftw> *their
<ogra_> not sure you will find any other IM provider being that open to OSS devs
<ogra_> and you think owhatsapp is any better with that ?
<oftc_ftw> ogra_: well, at least they enforce encryption for both, chats and calls. i didn't talk about the stuff they do with the meta data. of course, i'd rather use telegram if it would works like whatsapp.
<ogra_> (there is a signal client in the store btw)
<oftc_ftw> there is? but it doesn't work for phone calls, does it?
<oftc_ftw> oops, got to go. lectures starting in 3 minutes. bbl
<oftc_ftw> anyway, are they using some sort of push services? i'm wondering because it's hard to even use signal without the google services on android.
<oftc_ftw> there is an unofficial webapi client though
<ogra_> oftc_ftw, https://github.com/janimo/textsecure-qml/wiki/Installation
<peat-psuwit> On my device, unity8 process seems to consume more memory when the screen is rotated. Does it happen on other device?
<tim241> anyone? is it possible to build ubuntu touch with only 22 GB free?
<tim241> on my ubuntu PC
<dobey> mardy: ping
<mardy> dobey: pong
<dobey> mardy: hey. so i am apparently able to log in, and errors are being propagated back up to the UI with my branch, but i can't seem to get the credentials to be stored in the db, or attached to the account object in the qml. i don't really understand how that is supposed to work exactly, without cheating and doing everything in the library itself.
<mardy> dobey: you mean that the Signon::Identity is not getting created on the DB, or that the token is not getting stored?
<dobey> mardy: i guess both. when i create an account, and then poke the signon-secrets.db with sqlite, the tables are still empty
<mardy> dobey: and you are sure that you are calling Identity::store()?
<dobey> mardy: was your code not doing that?
<mardy> dobey: yes it was, but I understood that you were restarting from scratch?
<mardy> dobey: can I see your branch?
 * mardy brb
<dobey> mardy: i mean, you were calling the previously existing hack in libu1 right, not storing the credentials yourself?
<dobey> mardy: https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntuone-credentials/signon-plugin-part2/+merge/296716
<tim241> anyone? is it possible to build ubuntu touch with only 22 GB free? otr not please answer
<dobey> mardy: i'm trying to get rid of that hack
<dobey> tim241: no idea, but i'd expect not as phablet-dev-bootstrap i think pulls down at least that much data in the tree
<dobey> assuming you're talking about building the kernel for some device and porting to a new one
<tim241> hmm ok
<tim241> or is it possible to create everything on my network drive from 2 terabyte?
<dobey> should be possible, but i don't know how well it will work
<tim241> ok
<tim241> it will prbably be a little bit slower to build everything
<mardy> dobey: the identity was stored in Keyring::storeToken(), like before
<mardy> dobey: I thought about removing that, but the only solutions which I could think of are either by adding new public APIs or by making the account plugin talk directly to signond
<dobey> mardy: well how does it work for oauth? the Main.qml in any of the oauth plug-ins is obviously not talking directly to signond
<mardy> dobey: they use the OAuth component, which does
<mardy> dobey: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~online-accounts/ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts/trunk/view/head:/plugins/module/OAuth.qml
<mardy> dobey: and this is my evil branch (requires a new accounts-qml-module, so you can't test it yet): http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mardy/ubuntuone-credentials/account-creation-plugin/view/head:/online-accounts-provider/NewAccount.qml
<dobey> mardy: oh hmm. so i guess we need to do the same in u1?
<oftc_ftw> ogra_: thanks for the link but reading through the issues reminded me of why signal/textsecure wont work for me: this moxie guy is such a bad person and it hurts me seeing him turning down fully working pull request from nice people offering nice solutions without even a single comment. and as if that weren't enough, he blocks commenting for everyone that doesn't agree 100% with him.
<s`> mcphail: dang lol
<dobey> mardy: btw, the account plug-in doesn't get loaded for existing accounts does it (ie, when i go into accounts list, and tap on an existing account and see the "Remove" button)?
<mardy> dobey: no, that functionality got lost some time ago, and no one has been asking to get it back
<dobey> mardy: ok. there's still some cruft in u1 for that which i could probably get rid of too, to simplify things
<mardy> dobey: yep
<dobey> mardy: why does this need a newer accounts-qml-module?
<dobey> oh, i see the OAuthMain.qml still has the options cruft too
<mardy> dobey: it needs a new accounts-qml-module because the existing one doesn't allow the client to specify the auth method/mechanism to use (it takes them from the .provider or .service file)
<mardy> dobey: and in that branch I've added the account creation functionality as a separate mechanism of the signon plugin
<dobey> oh
<dobey> not sure we need to do that
<mardy> dobey: it was to bypass the lib entirely
<mardy> dobey: not needed, but otherwise I think we need to add new APIs to the lib (or keep the hack with storing the token in the secret)
<dobey> why would we need new APIs?
<mardy> dobey: because we probably don't want an account to be created everytime a client calls SsoService::login (it the account is not there yet)
<dobey> mardy: i don't see why that would require new API
<mardy> dobey: to be honest, I don't recall the exact details now, but I think that the question I couldn't answer was "how to have the account created by the account plugin, and not by another client"
<mardy> dobey: well, indeed checking the QCoreApplication name would be a solution too, but still hacky
<mardy> dobey: in the case of the account plugin we want to create an account, if one is not found, while for other clients we want to emit the credentialsNotFound signal
<mardy> dobey: so that the client will invoke the account creation via the OnlineAccounts.Client API, like you are doing already now
<dobey> mardy: maybe i just don't undersatnd, but doesn't online-accounts-service (or -ui) create the account and set that object on the plug-in?
<mardy> dobey: it creates just the account object, in memory. The account is not stored on disk, and its credentials (Signon::Identity object) is not created at all
<mardy> dobey: the OAuth module uses a Credentials object (which wraps Signon::Identity) to create the identity
<mardy> dobey: https://developer.ubuntu.com/api/apps/qml/sdk-15.04.4/Ubuntu.OnlineAccounts.Credentials/
<dobey> oh right, and that has always been our problem. that online-accounts is designed primarily around the needs of the oauth plug-in, and overengineered for anything else
<mardy> dobey: not much, look at my class or at the owncloud plugin, it's not that horrible: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mardy/account-plugins/owncloud-1570986/view/head:/qml/owncloud/NewAccount.qml
<dobey> mardy: but that's just using username/password, and using displayName to store the host name for the server.
<mhall119> oSoMoN: did the webbrowser-app get it's own cursor theme?
<mardy> dobey: yes, but my branch for the U1 plugin is not doing much more; it's just calling the authenticate() method, just like the OAuth plugins
<dobey> but it has to reimplement all of what's in the lib
<oSoMoN> mhall119, cursor theme? not that I know of, why do you ask?
<mhall119> oSoMoN: the loading spinner is new, and pretty
<oSoMoN> mhall119, thatâs on desktop?
<oSoMoN> under unity8
<oSoMoN> ?
<mhall119> no, Unity 7
<mhall119> maybe it's a Qt thing?
<davenull> What's the square wireless icon seen in this screenshot: https://unsee.cc/muribato/ ?
<dobey> mardy: and we still need to use the lib for pay-ui anyway
<davenull> Or what does it refer to?
<dobey> davenull: probably ad-hoc networks
<mardy> dobey: in the short term yes, but I understood that you were considering ditching it in a far future
<davenull> dobey: Makes sense.  Thanks!
<dobey> mardy: i'd rather avoid having to duplicate code, and i don't see how to not use the lib without duplicating code
<dobey> davenull: it's not a 'square' exactly. it's supposed to look like a PC monitor i think, to indicate it's ad-hoc
<mardy> dobey: I see your point, but the duplication (of functionality, not of code) is minimal, the signon plugin doesn't grow a lot with the register functionality added
<dobey> mardy: i'm not talking about registraion, that's irrelevant. pay-ui doesn't handle registration
<mardy> dobey: right, we could remove it from the lib once the plugin doesn't need it
<davenull> dobey: Yeah, but it's more square than the triangle icon. ;-)
<dobey> mardy: i'm talking about login(), the UI bits for it, and propagation of errors from the signon plug-in up to the UI
<mardy> dobey: I don't see duplication there, login() is becoming just a tiny wrapper
<dobey> and findToken()
<mardy> dobey: no duplication there either, strictly speaking. Just wrapping, and that's the price we have to pay if we want to keep the API stable
<dobey> mardy: of course it's wrapping. that's how you get rid of duplication, by wrapping things
<dobey> and exposing the wrapper as API in a shared library
<dobey> plus we need the Token() object to remain public API for signing things
<mardy> dobey: yes... so what is there that you don't like? Or did I read a complaint which was not there? :-)
<dobey> i don't like duplicating code
<mardy> dobey: uh, I don't follow you; you just wrote that we are not duplicating code
<dobey> mardy: no, what i said was that getting rid of the library would require duplicating code
<dobey> in fact, we are currently duplicating some of the UI code in pay-ui, due to the way things are in ubuntuone-credentials; but i'd like to fix that in the future
<mardy> dobey: well, if that's the case, we can make a version-2 of the lib, with just that code that would otherwise be duplicated
<dobey> mardy: right. plan would be to break abi at some point, but want to get the current major things taken care of before doing that.
<dobey> anyway, need to get lunch. later
<patrice_> any know how I can mount ubuntu touch root file system onto my ubuntu desktop via usb?
<ogra_> you cant
<ogra_> it is only exported via MTP ... and that is limited to directories under your home
<ogra_> you can enable ssh and mount the system via sshfs, that lets you browse the whole filesystem
<walmdach> Any way to install iperf client on phone?  $dpkg --search iperf   return dpkg-query: No path found matching pattern *iperf*
<dobey> you shouldn't use dpkg/apt to install things on the phone anyway. only in a chroot or libertine container
<dobey> walmdach: https://askubuntu.com/questions/620740/recommended-way-to-install-regularcli-deb-packages-on-ubuntu-phone/623311#623311
<walmdach> dobey: Will have to read up on libertine.
<walmdach> dobey: and chroot
<s`> libertine wasnt usable for me
<s`> i click on the container but nothing happens lol
<s`> i think i'll try to destroy and create it again
<ChrisTownsend> s`: What do you mean you "click on the container and it doesn't work"?  You mean click the container name in the Libertine GUI>
<ChrisTownsend> ?
<s`> yea
<ChrisTownsend> s`: Ok, until recently, there wasn't a default action when tapping/clicking the container name.  You need to slide the container name to the left to get the actions.  But what you need to do is install some packages.  Then install the Libertine Scope from the Store to surface and launch apps.
<s`> ChrisTownsend: i think i created a container and installed firefox (just for testing)
<s`> but i went out for dinner and forgot it was installing things via ssh lol
<s`> so it may be corrupted
<s`> idk
<ChrisTownsend> s`: Ok, so then you need the Libertine Scope.  The GUI is only for managing the containers, not launching X apps.
<ChrisTownsend> s`: Sure, it's possible the container wasn't fully created either:)
<s`> ChrisTownsend: ok thanks, i'll look for the scope, so the best way in that case would be destroy and create it again?
<ChrisTownsend> s`: Yeah, I would start over given the state of the container is unknown.
<s`> ChrisTownsend: just installed the scope and well, firefox started, it's very slow though lol
<ChrisTownsend> s`: Ok, cool.  On an N4?
<s`> meizu pro 5
<s`> well not that slow, took a few secs
<s`> at the beginning was a black screen
<s`> then it slowly rendered
<ChrisTownsend> s`: Yeah, it takes a bit to spin it all up.  And it's software rendered, so it's not going to be blazing fast.
<s`> anyways, it's completely unusable from the device right?
<s`> i mean, you can use libertibe apps only with mouse and keyboard and external screen right?
<ChrisTownsend> s`: Well, I don't think the X apps are very useful in phone mode.  They are a bit better in a tablet w/ a larger screen.  But the best experience the keyboard/mouse and external monitor.
<ChrisTownsend> s`: But nothing stops you from using the X apps in phone mode, except, well, your patience:)
<s`> ChrisTownsend: ok, but if i click on the url bar, the keyboard doesnt even appear
<dobey> yes, that's known and being worked on
<ChrisTownsend> s`: Oh, right, that.  We are working on it right now:)
<dobey> they are legacy apps for a reason
<s`> very nice
<s`> thanks for working on it
<s`> anyways, yeah firefox's really slow
<s`> :D
<ChrisTownsend> s`: Sure, you're welcome.
<dobey> firefox isn't exactly a speed demon, even with hardware accel on an i7 :)
<s`> dobey: ikr :D
<s`> ChrisTownsend, dobey sorry for this stupid question... i got into the libertine scope right after installing it from the store
<s`> but where do i access it from normally?
<s`> i cant find it
<ChrisTownsend> s': There is the little Up arrow in the bottom of the Scopes.  Slide that up to Manage scopes. Then look for "XApps"
<ChrisTownsend> s` ^^^^
<ChrisTownsend> (backtick is throwing me off:)
<s`> aaah now i got it
<s`> i had this device for a while now and i didnt know how to activate scopes LOL
<s`> i was installing them from the store
<s`> but didnt know how to activate them
<s`> :D
<ChrisTownsend> Col
<ChrisTownsend> Cool even
<s`> ok now i have activated legacy apps and xapps
<s`> scopes
<s`> what's the difference? i can see firefox in both of them
<dobey> you can favorite it
<dobey> you have two different versions of libertine scope installed i guess
<s`> uhm
<s`> could have i installed it from apt?
<s`> dobey: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Libertine
<s`> i run few days ago commands listed here
<dobey> s`: what device are ou on?
<s`> meizu pro 5
<dobey> that is old, i don't think you need to change / to rw and install anything
<s`> ah lol
<s`> i executed all those commands
<s`> ahahah
<s`> so... is it safe to purge those packages?
<dobey> well, libertine-scope should be fine to purge
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: ^^ is that wiki page still relevant at all?
<dobey> also the comment about confinement for terminal app is a bit odd, since it's unconfined
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Well, it's mostly relevant.  Need to remove the libertine-scope from that list and suggest using the Store for it.
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: terminal-app is confined in some respect.
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: ah, i guess -pd image is still a bit different than non-pd images?
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Yes, today.  We are merging the two very soon.
<dobey> yeah. thought that was already done :)
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: *something* when using terminal app redirects /tmp to /run/user/32100/tmp.blah and xserver does not like /tmp to be somewhere else.  And it being a chroot, xserver fails to install when using terminal-app.
<s`> guys am i crazy to use pro5 as main device?
<s`> i mean, it's actually my main device :\
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: oh, weird
<dobey> s`: i don't know what you're asking. i've been using ubuntu only on a phone for over 2 years
<ChrisTownsend> s`: Personally, as a main device, I would probably leave it ro only and take stable updates.  But yeah, using Ubuntu on the phone works fine for my uses.
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: It is weird.
<s`> well it looks stable enough
<dobey> heck, i didn't even have working GPS for 2 years, and still don't have bluetooth
<s`> personally i'd need only support for audio/video calls
<s`> dobey: same
<s`> this is my first LTE capable device
<s`> lol
<s`> ok, i'll try to purge that deb
<s`> let's see what happens
<dobey> oh, i've had LTE working the whole time :)
<dobey> i use a nexus 5
<s`> cool
<dobey> oh, and terrible battery life on a device that' not been officially supported :)
<s`> legacy apps scope disappeared
<s`> so, LXC is supported right? any plan to support docker too? :D
<merpnderp> Is there an RDP client for ubuntu-touch, like rdesktop?
<OerHeks> no rdp or vnc .. yet https://uappexplorer.com/apps?q=rdp&sort=relevance
<s`> i wonder if you could install it inside a container, merpnderp have u tried?
<merpnderp> s` no, don't have an ubuntu phone.
<merpnderp> But if I could RDP into windows, I'd order All Teh Ubuntu Phonez!
<s`> merpnderp: it should be possible to install it in a container, but then you would probably need a bluetooth mouse and keyboard
<merpnderp> s` You're saying install RDP in a container? Like a virtual ARM windows install?
<s`> merpnderp: in ubuntu touch you can create container (chroot or lxc based) where you can install x11-apps
<merpnderp> s` oh wow. That would be perfect. Googling around I don't see that anyone has done that yet.
<s`> merpnderp: u can have an idea looking at this page i think https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Libertine
<s`> but it needs to be updated
<s`> because that was before libertine was officialy released i think
<s`> someone corrects me if im wrong
<s`> it says "Libertine is not currently available as a click package because it's a developer preview and not yet ready for general consumption."
<s`> but now it is available actually
<merpnderp> I'm not very familiar with ubuntu touch, but couldn't I just open a terminal in it and install from there?
<s`> yeah, you can do that for term-based packages
<s`> but they cant spawn an x11 session
<s`> i think
<bregma> merpnderp, nope, you need to set up a libertine container and install from there
<s`> dont really know how it works
<bregma> you can not install a deb package on Touch withut probably breaking your system
<s`> yeah if you would to display x11 windows you will need to install them inside a container
<dobey> merpnderp, s`: no, you shouldn't install additional packages into the base image
<merpnderp> bregma: I'm confused because the videos show plugging in a HDMI cable and using the phone in desktop mode.
<bregma> merpnderp, that has nothing to do with debs
<merpnderp> oh, I see
<s`> dobey: oh really? i installed the erlang virtual machine on my system :D
<bregma> s`, it's  up to you if you want to risk breaking yuor system
<dobey> s`: yes, you will break your system if you do. phones aren't PCs, even with convergence
<bregma> we do not recommend it
<s`> i see thanks
<dobey> s`: see https://askubuntu.com/questions/620740/recommended-way-to-install-regularcli-deb-packages-on-ubuntu-phone/623311#623311
<s`> thank you
<s`> ok so i just install them inside a chroot
<s`> dobey: how exactly that can break my system? just curious
<bregma> s`, that will work
<dobey> s`: in a chroot is fine. rw / and installing there is not
<s`> yeah i got that, but i mean, why
<bregma> what dobey said
<s`> what could happen?
<dobey> s`: / is only 2 GB, so it will fill up very quickly if you start screwing with apt
<dobey> s`: and when you install image updates, stuff can get uninstalled, but space remain consumed and such
<dobey> there's a reason / is shipped read-only
<s`> dobey: oh actually i compiled it from the sources under /userdata :P
<s`> but i think i tried to use apt first
<s`> lol
<s`> oh dobey that happened to me
<s`> like on the very first day
<s`> i tried to mount bind a directory
<s`> but when i rebooted the device the fstab resetted
<s`> and i couldnt find my apps anymore
<s`> so i had to manually delete the old files and reinstall from store
<dobey> no idea what you did there
<s`> ahaha no problem i figured it out :D
<s`> thanks for the tips
<s`> dobey: is systemd completely ported to ubuntu touch now?
<dobey> no
<dobey> and you got that backwards
<s`> oh well, im happy with that
<s`> i mean, i dont really want systemd
<s`> :\
<dobey> well you'll get it soon enough
<dobey> and part of it is already there anyway
<s`> yeah i saw
<dobey> not sure why it matters
<s`> dont want to start a flame :D
<s`> ahah
<Muldy> yay just resurected a nexus4 with a broken screen 8)
<merpnderp> Does ubuntu-touch have some way of hooking up to mozilla's push notification server? Or does Ubuntu have one devs can use?
<merpnderp> I guess that must already be working since twitter and facebook notifications are added.
<dobey> merpnderp: twitter/fb/google notifications are not push. they're polled. ubuntu does have a push notifications API and server that can be used, but it requires server side integration for things like google/fb/twitter/etc
<dobey> telegram has ubuntu push support
<merpnderp> dobey: is anyone besides telegram using the push API?
<merpnderp> Because for messaging, push is a must.
<dobey> merpnderp: system update notifications are via push
<merpnderp> I never saw which browser comes default. Firefox?
<dobey> no, a browsesr based on cromium content api that is designed for ubuntu phones
<merpnderp> dobey: so the Ubuntu JS engine is also V8?
<merpnderp> I mean for Ubuntu Touch for the UI....although I guess this is all in the dev docs. I'll have to look through them after work.
<ShaneQful> Hey just got the OTA update, any idea when the browser will be updated saw the unerlying engine has been updated in the repo, any idea when that'll reach the tablet ?
<ShaneQful> Sites are started to block usage because the chrome version in the useragent is so old :(
#ubuntu-touch 2016-06-10
<aki> Hi
<JustinHitla> is that the only channel ?
<matv1> JustinHitla the only channel for what?
<JustinHitla> for android there are #android, #android-root, #android-dev are there other channels for ubuntu phones ?
<mcphail> JustinHitla: you can use #ubuntu-app-devel for development
<JustinHitla> is app development on Ubuntu commercially successful ? or one better off developing apps for android or even iphone ?
<popey> JustinHitla: there's not a tremendous number of ubuntu phones out there, so being financially successfull selling apps on it might be tricky right now
<JustinHitla> what was  the boost for android back in 2008 what made it so successful ? can't ubuntu do the same ?
<popey> what, find a company with billions of dollars to sink into it?
<JustinHitla> also why ubuntu is so late ?
<JustinHitla> its 2-3 years since they started ?
<popey> small team, lots to do
<popey> turns out this stuff is hard :)
<JustinHitla> so are they now struggling or its smooth sailing ?
<mardy> Elleo: hi! I just filed bug 1591149; how should I proceed? should I start looking for suitable texts, or who is in charge of deciding what goes there?
<ubot5> bug 1591149 in ubuntu-keyboard (Ubuntu) "Find more modern text for Italian word prediction" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1591149
<Elleo> mardy: yeah, can be a mix of texts, as long as they're all under a suitable license (public domain, CC0, CC-BY, CC-BY-SA, or similar)
<Elleo> mardy: ideally try not to make it much larger than the existing text though, as until we allow keyboard layouts as optional clicks we're a bit space constrained on the image
<Elleo> mardy: then just either send me the text file or submit a branch and we'll get it updated
<mardy> Elleo: excellent! I think I'll submit a branch, so more people can review it if needed
<Elleo> mardy: okay, cool
<mardy> Elleo: CC-BY-NC-SA is not OK, is it?
<Elleo> mardy: nope, think we probably end up under potential commerical circumstances
<mardy> Elleo: right, better play safe
<labeeb> can i install ubuntu touch on my huawei honor holly u-19?
<labeeb> can i install ubuntu touch on my huawei honor holly u-19?
<dobey> !devices | labeeb
<ubot5> labeeb: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<labeeb> but i dont see my device there. so it means its impossible? I suppose there must be some kind of method to do it
<dobey> labeeb: if it's not listed there, then it means you have to port to that device
<labeeb> can you please direct me to specific instructions or methods on ubuntu website?
<dobey> see the topic
<matv1> so this new phone.. has it been given a codename?
#ubuntu-touch 2016-06-11
<opatel99> Has there been any progress on porting UTouch to the Nexus 6P?
<aunali1> greetings
<opatel99> aunali1: Welcome
<aunali1> exit
<android429> should I make a backup even if i dont want to come back to previous android version or dont want my apps or data?
<android429> while in custom recovery before flashing custom rom
<android429> should I make a backup even if i dont want to come back to previous android version or dont want my apps or data?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
<SebthreeBQM10HD> anyone about?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and any way to open up a tar gz file
<SebthreeBQM10HD> extract some images even get  them open
<SebthreeBQM10HD> using the tablet
<Dorry> Hiya - Im on a Nexus 4 and Im trying to install updates to Ubuntu Touch (it says Version 31). But when I try the download bar fades and disappears. Have I updated correctly ?
<Dorry> & how do I get onto the tesing image from the terminal ?
<Dorry> *testing
<Dorry> no-one around .
#ubuntu-touch 2016-06-12
<madhu> Hi I want to port xiaomi redmi1s
<madhu> which is the sure method to flash?
<madhu> online build or manujally download all and flash it?
<madhu> hello
#ubuntu-touch 2017-06-05
<bqphone> morning
<bqphone> well after the new changes, should i do anything to get updates from ubports? need to flash their update version?
<hpagseddy> Hi?
<hpagseddy> Is this channel dead?
<peat-psuwit> Does anyone know where is the repository for initramfs-tools-ubuntu-touch?
<anpok_> https://code.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/ubuntu/vivid/initramfs-tools-ubuntu-touch/support-adb-lollipop
<anpok_> looks like the most recent one
#ubuntu-touch 2017-06-06
<damon_> hello there
<damon_> i have couple of questions regarding ubuntu touch
<damon_> if anyone is there
<Michael_> hi everybody
<Michael_> is this the right place for ubuntu phone ?
<Michael_> I am trying to install the ubuntu phone on samsung note 2 ...any idea if that is working or not ?
<oerheks> Michael_, join #ubports to see if there is a port available/in progress, i think not atm
#ubuntu-touch 2017-06-07
<MCMic> Does owncloud-sync from open store works for nextcloud?
<MCMic> Or is there an other easy way to sync a folder on ubuntu touch?
<MCMic> (Can syncevolution sync files?)
<Calisto> Hi
<Calisto> I have a ubuntu phone any knows if the project ends or exist any fork?
<Calisto> fork?
<k1l> #ubports is the way to go
#ubuntu-touch 2017-06-10
<eks> hi all, I read few weeks ago (probabbly 2 months) that Ubuntu decided stop updating Ubuntu touch. I am still using it in my daily day too and I would not like to to change it. Do you know if any linux developer is going to carry on with Ubuntu touch?
<ogra_> eks, look for "ubports"
<eks> thanks
<dbx2> hey eks, there are developpers still working on project for ubuntu touch. For example, if you are interrested in call blocking program, you can look at http://f-call-dev.blogspot.ch/ :)
<dbx2> they still work on their application. So Ubuntu touch is nto dead for them :)
<blabs> Hey this is my first day with my lg nexus 4 that I armoured with ubuntu touch :)
<dbx2> congrat blabs. Let us know more if any issue or flaw, or everything is working well?
