#ubuntu-discuss 2012-09-18
<zykotick9> i think "ubuntu-bug <PACKAGE-NAME>" helps no one but canonical...  ubuntu is NOT a community distribution (even if it's had that "rap" for a while), ubuntu volunteers are unpaid canonical employees.
<IdleOne> which is pretty much what any volunteer for any organization is.
<IdleOne> our "payment" is the freedom to use the OS as we please
<zykotick9> IdleOne: i doubt "most" volunteer orgainization take/or accept volunteer submissions for core "intellectual property" (i'm useing IP although i hate that word)
<zykotick9> IdleOne: you are NOT "free" to use ubuntu as you please!  that is wrong.  ubuntu has a ton of non-free software.  sorry i gotta point this out - strongly.
<zykotick9> IdleOne: ubuntu's changing/evolving stand on "free" software is very interesting actually...
<IdleOne> You are free to remove the non-free software
<IdleOne> nobody forces you to use it.
<zykotick9> lol i use it by choice, and it's a personal failing ;)
<IdleOne> I'm not 100% certain but I don't believe that any non-free software is installed default.
<IdleOne> zykotick9: I also use some non-free software by choice :)
<IdleOne> I'm just being devils advocate here
<zykotick9> IdleOne: lol... you must be kidding.  drivers/ubuntuone/many more.
<IdleOne> which drivers?
<IdleOne> I'll give you ubuntuone :)
<zykotick9> do you say ubuntu "comes" with nvidia/ati drivers?
<IdleOne> it doesn't come with those drivers, it does come with the ability to install them.
<zykotick9> IdleOne: nouveau for nvidia is "free"
<IdleOne> the choice is left to the user to install or not.
<zykotick9> nice - my requirement for an OS - is free and NON-FREE!
<zykotick9> ubuntu doesn't meet that standard :(
<IdleOne> I'm not sure I understand exactly what that standard is.
<IdleOne> I do understand that the /Ubuntu Community/ is about more than the OS and what drivers it comes with.
<zykotick9> IdleOne: my "requirement" that my OS, be either to be totally free/libre OR non-free.  debian and gentoo meet my requirement.
<IdleOne> zykotick9: I see. I am happy that there is an alternative out there that meets those standards.
<zykotick9> IdleOne: ubuntu was a very cool experience for me!  especially running an ubuntu-hour for a while, i met a lot of very cool/interesting people because of it.
<IdleOne> My standards for choosing which OS I install is the type of people I am likely to meet while using the OS. Unfortunately in other communities I was unable to find the quality of people (I am happy with) to meet those standards
<zykotick9> IdleOne: the reason i still frequent #ubuntu, is because of a genuine desire to "help" people with gnu/linux.  i'm most familiar with/the best help with DEB based releases, and #ubuntu has a seemingly never ending stream of new-gnu/linux-users
<IdleOne> The community appreciates the help you provide :)
<zykotick9> IdleOne: differnt priorites ;).  i hear ya.
<IdleOne> We may not say it often enough though :/
<zykotick9> IdleOne: no doubt!  "ubuntu has been the best community i have ever been apart of" ;)
<zykotick9> IdleOne: i'm "sad" i feel (and should) outside that community now.
<IdleOne> because you prefer to use debian or gentoo?
<zykotick9> because i use debian.  i actually swithced from gentoo to ubuntu - very happy i did BTW.
<IdleOne> You don't have to use Ubuntu to be part of the community, it helps if you do to get your foot in, but like I said it is more than what OS you use. IMHO it is about a way of thinking, wanting to be a part of something that is bigger.
<zykotick9> IdleOne: it's the "wanting to be a part of something that is bigger" that eventually drove me away from ubuntu
<IdleOne> You don't want to be a part of a larger family? in a sense that what The Ubuntu Community is.
<IdleOne> I like knowing that no matter where I go in the world I can find someone who is a part of Ubuntu and that I would probably be welcomed into their home.
<zykotick9> IdleOne: ubuntu is a family - but a dysfunctional one, with an over-domineering father (aka BDFL)
<zykotick9> that is "cool" about the ubuntu family, it's worldlie-ness ;)
<IdleOne> Show me a family without dysfunction and I'll show you a family with a really big closet
<zykotick9> lol, sorry
<zykotick9> IdleOne: honestly - to sumarize my current feelings about ubuntu.  ubuntu was #1 on distrowatch for years, as a user-friendly-debian.  since unity, now #3.
<IdleOne> I don't agree with all the choices Mark has made but those choices are distro-centric and even if they do affect the Community, sometimes negatively, I don't believe mark ever makes any decision lightly
<zykotick9> sebsebseb is probably smiling that mageia overtook ubuntu.  he's there community-leader or whatever...
<IdleOne> being in 1st place on a download counter does not make it the best or most popular
<zykotick9> agreed.  but ubuntu was #1 for years.
<IdleOne> right, Canonical never pointed to distrowatch to tell the world "Look we are the best!"
<zykotick9> the "change" is telling of ubuntu's popularity.
<IdleOne> btw sebsebseb was active in Ubuntu because he wanted to become "famous" He seeks out the acclaim, that doesn't work in our community. I would go as far as saying that we actively discourage people from trying to be stars.
<IdleOne> When he saw that his positive work wasn't getting him up the ladder, he started being negative.
<IdleOne> This is my personal opinion btw. I am talking as IdleOne and not on behalf of Ubuntu or the Community.
<zykotick9> IdleOne: you can speak to me honestly, i'm not going anywhere with the info ;)  sebsebseb doesn't impress me much (that wasn't really my point).  i was just commenting on a known prior-member, that moved on (i didn't really know any of the history you shared!)
<IdleOne> I'm not concerned about what I say being read by anyone :)
<zykotick9> IdleOne: "This is my personal opinion btw. I am talking as IdleOne and  not on behalf of Ubuntu or the Community.
<zykotick9> isn't required with me!  swear to god (but i'm a non-believer)
<IdleOne> The history we share is what I saw from almost 7 years in this community. I saw him become a positive helper in #ubuntu and go to a very unhappy user who was only negative and almost a troll at the end.
<zykotick9> of ubuntu people, you rang high on the list ;)
<zykotick9> lol - i'm headed in the same direction! lol
<IdleOne> Well, I hope not, it would be a shame to lose someone so helpful.
<zykotick9> i do honestly with people wouldn't use ubuntu.  but it is the group of people i can help the most.  i don't mention my debian use as much as i can, 'cause i really do want to help people...
<zykotick9> s/with/wish/
<IdleOne> zykotick9: i think I ring high because I make a lot of noise :P
<zykotick9> IdleOne: i don't consider you "noise" ;)  that what /ignore is for ;)
<IdleOne> Thanks :)
#ubuntu-discuss 2012-09-19
<teek_> why does 12.04 "user accounts" in "system settings" where as if you actually want to change anything you have to search and seperately run "user settings". Why even have "user accounts" at all, why does "system settings" even exist if you can't use it to set up the system??
<teek_> ever since the move from "management tools" to "system settings" you have a bunch of programs that accomplish pretty much nil.
<k1l> i dont really get the question tbh
<teek_> I forgot the word "have" after 12.04
#ubuntu-discuss 2013-09-20
<ocooel> Freezing on purple splash screen with no ubuntu logo or white and orange dots.
#ubuntu-discuss 2014-09-18
<padolph> Hello
<padolph> I'm looking for info on how best to contact Canonical about library support
<padolph> Should I just file a bug?
#ubuntu-discuss 2014-09-20
<inb4The404Error> Hey
<inb4The404Error> hilight_nick_matches = ON
<inb4The404Error> lol
<inb4The404Error> lol
<inb4The404Error> ads
<inb4The404Error> a
<BlueBaron> Hello guys.
<BlueBaron> I want to ask you, for some opinions on a Linux based OS. So basically, I have an old computer sitting on my room. It has 1GB of RAM , an old Intel Celeron 1.7GHz (Single Core) and ATI Radeon 9250 graphics card. Can you recommend a good os for this piece of shit?
<BlueBaron> It runs Windows XP fairly well, but I thought by using a Linux OS it would operate faster.I had an Ubuntu Studio DVD nearby, so I tried installing that but it was laggy and choppy.
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-09-14
<lotuspsychje> good morning mates
<TJ-> Morning
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: hey there
<lotuspsychje> what you playin with today :p
<TJ-> Well... fixed up the cryptsetup initramfs scripts to use a key-file, filed a bunch of bugs against lightdm, and currently trying to narrow down a regression in kernel bluetooth support  for some devices (since v3.2 ... so a lot to work back over)
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> im testin out new enlightment :p
<TJ-> I might take a look one of these days if I ever get chance. I'm really liking the improvements in KDE for 15.10
<TJ-> Although I got really pissy at it requiring mysqld to be installed to support this Akonadi "search-everything-that-moves-with-thirty-plus-executables-loaded-at-session-start" mess! I kicked that lot off the PC :)
<lotuspsychje> didnt test 15.10 yet
<lotuspsychje> lol
<TJ-> And finally solve the weirdest bug I've ever come across! I have Lubuntu/LXDE and Kubuntu desktops installed. Lubuntu pulls in Abiword. When the Plasma DE loads an instance of Abiword always started, with its Parent's PID = 1 (init). Been bugging me for 3/4 weeks
<TJ-> It turns out abiword installs a DBus service for Telepathy Collaboration. When KDE session starts it launcheds kde-telepathy which somehow causes the abiword executable be launched and loading a blank document. Very annoying!
<lotuspsychje> weird
<lotuspsychje> i had some crashes on enlightment already too lol
<lotuspsychje> after leftmouse opening applications
<TJ-> Bug hunting can be fun; suffering bugs with no explanation can be very frustrating
<TJ-> Especially if you can't easily run the process under control of the debugger
<lotuspsychje> i find launchpad bugging bit confusing
<TJ-> Do you? why is that?
<lotuspsychje> all the info gathering and protocols i dont like very much
<TJ-> I generally use common-sense with that. I usually report bugs directly rather than using ubuntu-bug/apport-bug
<lotuspsychje> right
<lotuspsychje> i like askbuntu solving better :p
<lotuspsychje> simple and more specific
<lotuspsychje> but for rough bugs, launchpad might be better
<lotuspsychje> lol: http://news.softpedia.com/news/tutorial-for-microsoft-to-help-it-kill-linux-491638.shtml
<lotuspsychje> SinisterDoor: welcome
<lotuspsychje> emnz: welcome
<emnz> ah nice
<emnz> thx :)
<lotuspsychje> emnz: ubuntu has grown big these days
<emnz> how do u mean most popular? u mean linux in general?
<lotuspsychje> so most user count worldwide is for ubuntu
<lotuspsychje> no ubuntu
<emnz> most popular linux desktop distro?
<emnz> ok
<lotuspsychje> no
<lotuspsychje> most popular Os from all
<emnz> O.O
<emnz> how can that be, what about android and windows?
<SinisterDoor> lol
<emnz> enlighten me
<emnz> im not up to speed these days xD
<lotuspsychje> emnz: we also have phones now
<SinisterDoor> yeah but they are android
<lotuspsychje> SinisterDoor: no, ubuntu touch phones
<lotuspsychje> !touch
<ubot5> Information about the Ubuntu Touch platform for Phone and Tablet is available here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch . Support and discussion in #ubuntu-touch
<SinisterDoor> -.-
<lotuspsychje> i installed ubuntu touch on my nexus 7 also
<lotuspsychje> running much safer then android
<SinisterDoor> my nexus 6 doesn't support it.
<SinisterDoor> ubuntu abandoned the project
<lotuspsychje> read this guys
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/top-five-reasons-why-ubuntu-is-the-most-used-linux-os-491064.shtml
<emnz> wow hey
<emnz> ** awesome
<emnz> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_systems#cite_ref-NetMarketShare_83-0
<emnz> way to go on desktop still, but wow, so impressed man, im dumping windows for sure
<emnz> cant believe how this has taken off since I last used a linux distro
<lotuspsychje> emnz: yeah it improved alot
<emnz> incredible
<lotuspsychje> emnz: ive installed over more then 50 boxes with 14.04 LTS all work like a charm
<emnz> software center is really legit now, had nothing but crappy free apps years ago
<emnz> flash is solid now, not that we really need it with HTML5 anymore
<TJ-> flash is a permanent can of worms!
<emnz> firefox+all addons working
<lotuspsychje> lol
<emnz> haha shit, must I remove it?
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: with a load of holes in it
<emnz> this unity is fkn great
<carlduke2> hi everyone, is there a channel for ubuntu app developers?
<lotuspsychje> carlduke2: #ubuntu-devel
<lotuspsychje> carlduke2: and #ubuntu-touch for the phones developing
<carlduke2> isn't it for the os dev?
<TJ-> emnz: Adobe stopped developing flash for Linux several years ago; there are some security fixes but rather like Windows it is full of exploit opportunities
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: +1
<emnz> do you guys like unity? seems it doesnt get much love lol
<TJ-> I won't touch it; terrible on decent workstations or any large screen
<lotuspsychje> once you get used it unity its very intuitive for work
<emnz> im really liking it with unity tweak tool/compiz settings manager
<carlduke2> it's not that bad actually ..not very customizable tough ..I switched to KDE and I'll stick with it. It has an impressive collection of apps and utilities (ie KDE Connect - mind blowing)
<lotuspsychje> im a unity fan :p
<emnz> yeah I set window buttons: right in unity tweak but doesnt seem to work :(
<lotuspsychje> with wobbly windows and eyecandy
<TJ-> Unity is small screen device (tablet) interface shoe-horned onto a workstation desktop
<emnz> id like to have the launcher at the top, but seems this is impossible too?
<emnz> TJ-: lol, metro start screen for linux? xD
<TJ-> emnz: I run 6 1920x1200 monitors ... you cannot imagine the pain Unity causes.
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> neo only uses 2 screens...
<emnz> quite the power user hey sheesh haha, i got 2 x 1920x1080 only
<TJ-> I's need an Olympic athelete just to move the mouse cursor back to the application and/or desktop launcher
<lotuspsychje> roflol
<lotuspsychje> follow the wabbit
<TJ-> ;)
<lotuspsychje> so 6 monitors with each 4 worskpaces lol?
<lotuspsychje> alot of work can be done there
<TJ-> no, I actually split them up into 4 X sessions now, to logically separate the different purposes they have
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> if you got a pic somewhere of your desktop layout, show us lol
<TJ-> I have 3 in portrait mode (document references, web pages, etc), 3 in landscape (terminals, ssh sessions, coding).
<TJ-> its around somewhere
<lotuspsychje> very nice
<lotuspsychje> im always curious about linux desktops
<emnz> thats great man, would also like to see
<EriC^^> ditto
<lotuspsychje> lolz
<EriC^^> http://www.criticalcommons.org/Members/ccManager/clips/swordfishtechno3dhackingdrama.mp4/thumbnailImage
<EriC^^> this is lotuspsychje setup
<lotuspsychje> hahaha
<emnz> u guy are amateurs, mine: http://p-fst1.pixstatic.com/5069f24a74c5b64b160007e5._w.540_h.359_s.fit_.jpg
<emnz> jk ;D
<lotuspsychje> wahaha
<emnz> ok so what must I use instead of unity if I want a w7 style launcher?
<lotuspsychje> lubuntu
<lotuspsychje> !lubuntu
<ubot5> lubuntu is Ubuntu with LXDE instead of !GNOME as desktop environment, which makes it extremely lightweight. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu - /join #lubuntu for lubuntu support.
<lordievader> emnz: That is a sweet monitor wall to have :D
<lordievader> Or to want...
<EriC^^> lol emnz
<lotuspsychje> bbl dinner, someone save that atari pic from TJ- for me :p
<emnz> hmm, XFCE looks nice, but I dont want to lose ubuntu, I'm just getting into it again, don't want to lose the software center and all the apps it comes with :/
<emnz> I'd just like ubuntu as it is, but with a different launcher
<emnz> is it a bad idea to install XFCE on ubuntu, always better to get a distro made around it from the start
<lordievader> Lubuntu can use Ubuntu's Software center just fine.
<emnz> ?
<emnz> lordievader: ok cool, but my problem is all the different apps and configuration lubuntu comes with... im a noob at this stuff, the easiness of ubuntu has been great
<emnz> am I making stupid comments here? im sry
<lordievader> emnz: Not at all, but do know that the underlaying system is the same for all Ubuntu flavours.
<carlduke2> if you need a launcher check out docky
<carlduke2> its very cool
<TJ-> hmmm, unexplained ecryptfs mount failure
<emnz> lordievader: yeah I am aware of that. So Xubuntu or Lubuntu won't come with Compiz?
<EriC^^> emnz: nope
<emnz> the selection of included software between regular ubuntu and lubuntu look vastly different
<EriC^^> lubuntu uses openbox
<EriC^^> yeah lubuntu is kind of minimal
<emnz> wish I could just change the unity launcher to make it more like XFCE/LXDE/windows7, I think changing to another version of ubuntu with different apps will put me off
<EriC^^> you can download the apps on lubuntu and xubuntu too
<emnz> yeah but then I'll have to configure them all myself
<EriC^^> nah it's the same thing
<emnz> hmm
<emnz> ugh rain is killing my internet again :(
<emnz> EriC^^: I typed this for you before it dc'd.... :
<emnz> EriC^^: I'm looking at the ubuntu software center - installed apps, seems to be a lot of unity-related stuff, even things like "Keyboard (unity-control-center) - change keyboard settings" and "Network (unity-control-center) - network settings", so all those apps would be gone with xubuntu/lubuntu?
<emnz> again, my apologies for another stupid question lol, getting my head around desktop managers/window managers and how they all work together etc.
<EriC^^> emnz: xubuntu and lubuntu have their own settings manager and keyboard stuff
<EriC^^> xubuntu is more functional than ubuntu, it has more stuff out of the box and is more functional oriented
<EriC^^> ill brb
<lotuspsychje> http://www.fiercecio.com/story/mozilla-quietly-adds-advertisements-firefox/2015-09-11
<lotuspsychje> hmmmz
<lotuspsychje> maybe they learned from w10
<lotuspsychje> ioria: good evening mate
<ioria> lotuspsychje, thanx ... you too
<lotuspsychje> ioria: the idea of this channel is, we always do support in #ubuntu but never actually speak to each other
<lotuspsychje> so here we are :p
<ioria> great.... "human support"
<lotuspsychje> yeah :p
<OerHeks> hi ioria
<ioria> OerHeks, hallo !!!!!
<lotuspsychje> lol
<OerHeks> it is handy to have backtalk, but this channel is originally for 'discussion'
<OerHeks> so this channel is hijacked :-D
<lotuspsychje> well mostly its quality ubuntu discussions anyway
<lotuspsychje> loll
 * lotuspsychje ==h4xxored d1scuss1on==
<lotuspsychje> pauljw: good evening
<ioria> pauljw, welcome
<lotuspsychje> ioria: wich distro are you running mate?
<ioria> lotuspsychje, Ubuntu 14.04.3 LTS \n \l     but i love Lubuntu :)
<lotuspsychje> same here LTS
<pauljw> hi lotuspsychje , thx
<lotuspsychje> ive just tested new enlightment
<lotuspsychje> pretty nice
<pauljw> :)
<lotuspsychje> http://linux.softpedia.com/blog/enlightenment-0-19-10-open-source-desktop-environment-out-now-with-10-bugfixes-491598.shtml
<lotuspsychje> oldskool feeling
<ioria> lotuspsychje, looks nice ...
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: wb eric
<EriC^^> thx
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: did TJ- show his atari link?
<EriC^^> lol no
<lotuspsychje> :p
<ioria> atari ?
<lotuspsychje> ioria: yeah lil joke, he's got 6 monitors running on linux, we all wanted to see
<ioria> wow
<lotuspsychje> yeah thats what we tought also :p
<lotuspsychje> funny :p http://news.softpedia.com/news/tutorial-for-microsoft-to-help-it-kill-linux-491638.shtml
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: It's all YOUR fault!
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: :p
 * lotuspsychje hides
<TJ-> The image is on an external drive, protected by ecryptfs. I mount it every day... today it failed!
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: ouch :p
 * daftykins wonders what he just walked in on
<daftykins> :O
<TJ-> I've just spent an intense debugging session with Ty Hicks on it; the ecryptfs-recover-private tool adds the key to the kernel's @us (user session) keyring. Then its 'mount' command fails, kernel reports unknown key, keyctl lists the key!
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: <TJ-> emnz: I run 6 1920x1200 monitors ... you cannot imagine the pain Unity causes.
<OerHeks> is that drive readonly?
<TJ-> Turns out... I switched from lightdm to sddm (the KDE DM) last night... and SDDM separates the keyrings, causing this!
<TJ-> So, if you see any questions about ecryptfs failing to open, with people on ssh sessions or similar, suspect the incorrect kernel keyring being used by the session
<lotuspsychje> i never liked keyring
<daftykins> TJ-: that's way too deep for me :D
<daftykins> i spy encryption and go "nope nope nope!"
<lotuspsychje> best way to hide data is on usb, under the ground
<lotuspsychje> far away from the fb1
<lotuspsychje> !info deluge
<ubot5> deluge (source: deluge): bittorrent client written in Python/PyGTK. In component universe, is optional. Version 1.3.11-0ubuntu2 (vivid), package size 20 kB, installed size 108 kB
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: got it finally :)  http://imgur.com/V6EBdJt
<lotuspsychje> yessss lets c :p
<ioria> TJ- Oh my ....
<lotuspsychje> holy smokin
<lotuspsychje> those 2 big ones left are also monitors?
<TJ-> all 6 in the corner; 2 X portrait, 3 x landscape, 1 x portrait
<lotuspsychje> like tv's upside down
<lotuspsychje> dang
<lotuspsychje> i bet you can only dream of that EriC^^ :p
<TJ-> the far left of the photo is the reflections from the data cabinets
<OerHeks> small printer on the left side :-D
<lotuspsychje> loool
<lotuspsychje> its like a plotter
<TJ-> A3 printer/scanner inkjet on top of the 21U cabinet; A4 scanner/printer laser under the bench
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: and wich distro running on those screenz?
<TJ-> It's this one I'm using now. Kubuntu
<ioria> TJ-  electric bill ?
<lotuspsychje> lol
<TJ-> All on the laptop in the middle
<lotuspsychje> cool
<TJ-> ioria: All runs on 12V DC
<ioria> TJ- wow....
<daftykins> 12V 0o
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: does those screens work by default on kde or xrandr config?
<TJ-> I have the server cabinet kit on dual UPSs, via 2 x 16-outlet 0U vertical CDUs on the wall
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: I have them custom configured since it is using 3 GPUs. If it auto-configures it has no idea of where each monitor is in the layout
<lotuspsychje> right
<pauljw> TJ-: sweet!
<lotuspsychje> feels like swordfish :p
<ioria> lotuspsychje, the movie ?
<lotuspsychje> yep :p
<lotuspsychje> we just need the girl on her knees now for TJ-
<ioria> lotuspsychje, it's a nice movie ...
<lotuspsychje> yes it is :p
<lotuspsychje> ioria: wich was your first computer ever?
<emnz> hi guys
<lotuspsychje> tandy calculators doesnt count :p
<lotuspsychje> emnz: good evening
<daftykins> moar screens = super hacker </Hollywood>
<ioria> lotuspsychje, pentium3 ... it's still working ...
<lotuspsychje> cool
<TJ-> It's just a way to stay well organised when there's lots of different things going on. Avoids typing commands to remote systems into the wrong window by mistake, for example
<TJ-> My first computer was ZX81... still working :)
<ioria> lotuspsychje, i got it 4 years ago ... it was in a dumpster  ^_^
<lotuspsychje> mine was a super 2000 or something, a kind of electrical mainboard to wire points togheter and make programs
<lotuspsychje> after that comodore 64
<TJ-> the '64 came after the vic 20 didn't it?
<ioria> lotuspsychje, i know it
<lotuspsychje> atari==amiga 500==486
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: yep, never tested vic20 myself
<lotuspsychje> but surely looks the same with cassete deck
<lotuspsychje> 'press play on tape'
<TJ-> I had all the popular home computers back then; writing cross-platform game engines for them
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> me and my brother were fooling around in basic
<emnz> you guys know anything about Cardapio?
<emnz> http://cloud.addictivetips.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/Cardapio.jpg
<lotuspsychje> whats that?
<emnz> an app launcher for unity, but its very outdated :(
<daftykins> looks like someone has glued the xfce menu beside unity
<lotuspsychje> ah
<EriC^^> emnz: there's a start menu for unity in the repos i think
<lotuspsychje> !info classicmenu-indicator | emnz try this
<ubot5> emnz try this: classicmenu-indicator (source: classicmenu-indicator): indicator showing the main menu from Gnome Classic. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.07-0ubuntu1 (vivid), package size 8 kB, installed size 105 kB
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: lol
<emnz> YES!!! omg ty!!
<EriC^^> yeah thats it ^
<emnz> cant I make the unity button show that?
<lotuspsychje> emnz: no, its an indicator
<lotuspsychje> emnz: you can try docky also and autohide left sidebar
<lotuspsychje> !info docky
<ubot5> docky (source: docky): Elegant, powerful, clean dock. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.2.0-2 (vivid), package size 591 kB, installed size 3594 kB
<lotuspsychje> emnz: all depends what you wish for?
<lotuspsychje> emnz: check terminal: apt-cache show indicator for more cool indicators
<ioria> TJ- it was this http://www.imarshall.karoo.net/zx81/zx81pfiles.htm ?
<TJ-> ioria: correct
<ioria> TJ- wow
<lotuspsychje> ioria: never seen such a thing :p
<ioria> lotuspsychje, no, i feel little ....
<TJ-> I ordered it whilst still at school in February 1981... Sinclair had massive orders and it wasn't delivered until June 16th, in the week after I left school and before I started work on the farm :)
<TJ-> We had a massive 4KB RAM!
<lotuspsychje> loool
<emnz> lotuspsychje: ok thanks I've just given them all a look, I'm looking mostly for a menu like XFCE, so I dont have to type every app i want to open (or click Installed - see all)
<TJ-> and you could get a wobbly 16KB "RAM Pack" to plug on the back
<lotuspsychje> and what could you do with that thing?
<TJ-> Loads! It came with a BASIC interpreter but I found that limited so switched to Z80A machine code
<emnz> and if I can edit the menu that would be nice, like how you can edit windows 7 shortcuts in the taskbar
<lotuspsychje> emnz: you can create or lock icons to unity's left bard
<lotuspsychje> bar
<emnz> lotuspsychje: yeah I'm doing that, and I installed unity-folders
<TJ-> There was an expander rather like today's RasPi GPIO expansion, where you could connect analog and digital inputs/ooutputs
<emnz> lotuspsychje: but I'd still like a bigger menu that I can customize, that classicmenu indicator is awesome but I can't edit whats inside it
<TJ-> the neat part was the 'adapters' that plugged onto the GPIO pins were just PCBs inside regular cassette tape boxes, glued shut :)
<daftykins> emnz: or you could just run a different DE that does this properly instead of trying to hack it onto Unity *cough*
<lotuspsychje> wileee: good evening mate
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: weep at what you can do in a few bytes :)  http://www.users.waitrose.com/~thunor/mmcoyzx81/downloads.html
<wileee> evening
<ioria> bay bay
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: lol breakout
<emnz> daftykins: yeah I know I know lol... I've installed lubuntu and xubuntu but still much prefer ubuntu, I'll deal with unity's quirks either way, but trying to tweak it as much as I can
<TJ-> It was more fun than the RasPi for learning to program; you were close to the metal all the time, learned to appreciate how to write code efficiently. We used to count the clock cycles of each instruction to figure out how much we could get done... saving a 'tick' in a loop could add up
<emnz> Is there any way to add an XFCE-style menu to docky?
<lotuspsychje> emnz: not sure
<lotuspsychje> anyways off to sleep
<lotuspsychje> nitenite guys
<pauljw> gnit
<pauljw> bbl
<lotuspsychje> good early morning
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Uh Huh , Look at the day, let us rejoice and be glad in it .
<lotuspsychje> insomnia here :p
<Bashing-om> We keep ya company. I have been known to wake up at OH! Dark :30; and here I am .
<lotuspsychje> lol
<Bashing-om> besides, what are friends for .
<lotuspsychje> !cookie | Bashing-om nice1
<ubot5> Bashing-om nice1: Wow! You're such a great helper, you deserve a cookie!
<Bashing-om> cookies are good .
<lotuspsychje> friendship too :p
<Bashing-om> Aye, the Good things !
<emnz> 3 hours sleep enough for you?
<emnz> lol o.O
<emnz> im going for a long sleep, thank you for the help, goodnight
<lotuspsychje> lol
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-09-15
<jonnymilano> Are people using LTS versions (like I am)?
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<emnz> hello
<emnz> hey guys, I asked this in the main channel but didn't get a response, hope its okay to ask here too?
<emnz> which is more active/well-supported and closest to regular ubuntu: Xubuntu or Ubuntu MATE? I don't need very lightweight. I tried to tweak Unity but have given up, main reason being the launcher. Xubuntu and Ubuntu MATE look very similar to me at the moment.
<emnz> I know this is a very broad question and reliant on taste/preference/opinion, but for a novice user coming from Windows, any comments?
<TJ-> I think both are community supported only
<emnz> yeah I accept that it won't be as well supported as stock ubuntu
<emnz> I'm loving MATE right now, so good
<emnz> but please, if anyone has any comments - I'd love to hear
<daftykins> i found xubuntu lacks some sane defaults for a laptop, was a bit odd to me
<emnz> daftykins: ok cool thanks, any other comments/suggestions?
<daftykins> they're probably all deficient in one way or another :>
<emnz> daftykins: good answer, that I am beginning to learn the hard way xD
<daftykins> i find that it's all well and good having configurability, but when you stray too far from the norms you're just giving yourself a headache to support a lot of the time
<emnz> probably a good idea I continue to use it in a VM, until I'm really comfortable
<emnz> that is the exact issue I'm tackling with, I gave up on unity and its lack of a decent launcher, but I'm starting to think if its not a better idea in my case to just deal with it, and receive the stability of the regular unity ubuntu
<emnz> im far from a sysadmin or a programmer
<emnz> im a windows 7 GUI kiddie
<emnz> what do you use personally? and what skill level are you?
<daftykins> i use Windows :) i use Linux distros for web servers and VMs, but don't believe it's worth playing with Linux much given i do desktop support for folk tied to Windows
<emnz> well thats.... encouraging, LOL
<daftykins> hehe
<daftykins> if i used a Linux desktop i'd not be able to support my clients properly.
<emnz> yeah I understand, one can hope it continues to grow in support i suppose
<daftykins> it's funny how many of them are so obsessed with having damn MS Office really :P
<daftykins> or specifically, Outlook
<daftykins> tried having one person use google mail instead, but nope they couldn't handle it
<daftykins> (not the brightest of clients)
<emnz> haha
<emnz> seen that a lot too
<emnz> and they want their simple password for Everything
<emnz> you have any idea how to keep a Plank dock above the Main panel/taskbar
<daftykins> getting a bit too close to support questions now really
<daftykins> and i'm no use as i don't use desktop
<emnz> ah yes, my mistake
<emnz> ok np
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-09-16
<lotuspsychje> good morning mates
<OerHeks> hi lotus
<lotuspsychje> hi OerHeks
<TJ-> morning
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: morning mate
<OerHeks> hahaha * ubottu has quit (K-Lined)
<TJ-> really? I thought the bots were protected
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon to all
<emnz> hello hello
<lotuspsychje> hi emnz
<daftykins> greets
<lotuspsychje> hello daftykins
<daftykins> oh dear what did ubottu do this morning :O
<lotuspsychje> what did he
<daftykins> < OerHeks> hahaha * ubottu has quit (K-Lined)
<lotuspsychje> ahh
<lotuspsychje> hmm
<lotuspsychje> by who?
<daftykins> no idea
<lotuspsychje> !life
<ubot5> life is something very few people know about in this channel - and anyway, it's probably offtopic, perhaps you want to try #ubuntu-offtopic
<lotuspsychje> its back allright :p
<lotuspsychje> so logs must show someone unbanned
<MonkeyDust> fun hack of the day: add inxi -x -w in .bashrc and get a weather report every time you launch a terminal
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/italy-s-ministry-of-defense-to-drop-microsoft-office-in-favor-of-libreoffice-491850.shtml
<lotuspsychje> alot of countries get interested in open source
<lotuspsychje> !find unity plugin extras
<ubot5> plugin is not a valid distribution: kubuntu-backports, kubuntu-experimental, kubuntu-updates, partner, precise, precise-backports, precise-proposed, stable, testing, trusty, trusty-backports, trusty-proposed, unstable, utopic, utopic-backports, utopic-proposed, vivid, vivid-backports, vivid-proposed, wily, wily-backports, wily-proposed
<lotuspsychje> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-16.04-Unity-Bugs
<lotuspsychje> ok start working guys :p
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> http://www.whizzy.org/2015/09/big-bug-bonanza-16-04-lts/
<lotuspsychje> and the official one: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BigDesktopBugScrub
<lordievader> You know virtio-9p is quite nice.
<lordievader> Good alternative for nfs.
<lordievader> Well kvm + nfs shares I mean.
<lotuspsychje> someone knows howto get a ralink2800pci wifi driver on usb stick to install to an offline box?
<lotuspsychje> doesnt work out of the box
<EriC^^> rt2800pci.ko is in the linux-image-extra package
<EriC^^> /lib/modules/3.19.0-26-generic/kernel/drivers/net/wireless/rt2x00/rt2800pci.ko
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: oh nice
<EriC^^> i guess it should be there though.. dunno why it's not working
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: so howto install properly
<EriC^^> is it loaded? did you try lsmod | grep rt2800 ?
<lotuspsychje> holdon lemme go upstairs
<lordievader> Sneakernet?
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: shows rt2800pci in red/green yep and whole list of others
<EriC^^> ok
<lotuspsychje> now modprobe?
<EriC^^> it should already be loaded
<EriC^^> give it a shot i guess
<EriC^^> sudo modprobe -r rt2800pci then sudo modprobe rt2800pci
<lotuspsychje> network still shows unclaimed
<lotuspsychje> ok holdon
<lotuspsychje> nothing lemme reboot
<EriC^^> try iwlist scan
<lotuspsychje> no wifi showing up
<lotuspsychje> lo and eth1 only
<EriC^^> hmm try ifconfig -a
<EriC^^> is there wlan?
<lotuspsychje> same eth1 and lo
<lotuspsychje> my card is plugged in yes
<EriC^^> try dmesg is there anything there?
<lotuspsychje> and sudo lshw -C network shows unclaimed card
<lotuspsychje> holdon lemme see
<EriC^^> try rfkill list
<lotuspsychje> shows nothing
<lotuspsychje> dmesg: rt200pci enabling device 0001-0003
<EriC^^> is it a usb wifi?
<lotuspsychje> np pci card from linksys
<lotuspsychje> works normally after installing ubuntu with cable
<lotuspsychje> but this time im on an offline box
<lotuspsychje> and dont have my 10m eth cable handy :p
<lotuspsychje> the weird thing
<lotuspsychje> when i edit connections
<lotuspsychje> i see my ssid under WIFI
<EriC^^> maybe it worked with the live usb?
<lotuspsychje> no, but installed right away
<lotuspsychje> should i try live? try?
<EriC^^> yeah but maybe it picked it up or something
<EriC^^> yeah why not
<lotuspsychje> ok ill give it a shot live
<lotuspsychje> nop same
<lotuspsychje> unclaimed
<lotuspsychje> and modprobe does nothing
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: that lib dir doesnt show the driver here
<lotuspsychje> can you send it to me?
<EriC^^> try locate rt2800pci
<EriC^^> try lspci | grep Network maybe there's something online about it
<lotuspsychje> yeah shows now
<EriC^^> paste it here
<lotuspsychje> in the lib and usr/src/...
<EriC^^> i cant send it cause it's for my kernel
<lotuspsychje> cant paste im offline
<daftykins> type? :D
<EriC^^> try to blacklist the rt2800pci and enable rt2860sta
<EriC^^> found this http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1692528
<EriC^^> hmm i can't find that module anywhere
<EriC^^> !find rt2860sta
<ubot5> Found: W:, W:, W:
<lotuspsychje> lspci shows capabilities: access denied
<lotuspsychje> network controller: ralink corp RT2800 802.11n PCI
<EriC^^> lotuspsychje: try lspci -k | grep -A2 Network
<EriC^^> which drivers is it using?
<lotuspsychje> none
<EriC^^> it says drivers none?
<lotuspsychje> shows no driver text
<EriC^^> oh
<EriC^^> try lspci -k | grep -A4 Network
<lotuspsychje> network is unclaimed
<EriC^^> or lspci -v
<lotuspsychje> yeah -v shows same
<lotuspsychje> ralink name
<lotuspsychje> subsystem: linksys device 0067
<lotuspsychje> flags: slow devsel IRQ 18
<lotuspsychje> memory....
<lotuspsychje> capabilities: access denied
<lotuspsychje> no driver text
<EriC^^> this looks promising http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2257359
<EriC^^> reading
<EriC^^> so... got a vacuum cleaner?
<EriC^^> haha:D
<lotuspsychje> loool
<lotuspsychje> i plugged it in good for sure :p
<EriC^^> try lspci -nn | grep Network
<EriC^^> what's the number at the end [xxxx:xxxx]
<lotuspsychje> 1814:0601
<lotuspsychje> good evening Ben64
<Ben64> hi
<daftykins> \o
<Ben64> this channel is quite empty
<daftykins> welcome to the patch of sanity away from the great unwashed
<lotuspsychje> but very active
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: dont think i need firmware, because it worked on internet enabled box
<lotuspsychje> can bios block new pci device maybe?
<lotuspsychje> ah found syslog error
<lotuspsychje> phy0: rt2800_probe_rt: error invalid RT chipset 0xffff rev ffff detected
<lotuspsychje> phy0: rt2x00lib_probe_dev: error failed to allocate device
<EriC^^> try iwconfig
<lotuspsychje> no wireless
<lotuspsychje> ill try back tomorrow EriC^^ tnx for helping
<EriC^^> ok, np
<lotuspsychje> sleep tight mate
<EriC^^> you too
<lotuspsychje> and cheers to all
<lotuspsychje> tnx
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-09-17
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<TJ-> Morning :)
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: morning mate
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: you know solution for this: <lotuspsychje> im having issues to get wifi working on 14.04.3 for an offline box, lshw shows my ralink 2800pci wifi card but somehow doesnt wanna load:  phy0: rt2800_probe_rt: error invalid RT chipset 0xffff rev ffff detected syslog error
<TJ-> Ouch! do we have the PCI ID of the device?
<lotuspsychje> dont have a network cable handy on this box, so cant update neither until the ralink card works
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: network controller: ralink corp RT2800 802.11n PCI
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: how about the Vendor:Product ID?
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: subsystem: linksys device 0067
<lotuspsychje> 1814:0601
<TJ-> ok, lets see what the driver thinks of that
<lotuspsychje> lshw -C network shows unclaimed card, no driver loaded
<lotuspsychje> and module exists here:  /lib/modules/3.19.0-26-generic/kernel/drivers/net/wireless/rt2x00/rt2800pci.ko
<TJ-> So the module claims it: alias:          pci:v00001814d00000601sv*sd*bc*sc*i*
<lotuspsychje> yes
<lotuspsychje> same card worked also on my box fully updated with eth0 cable
<TJ-> drivers/net/wireless/rt2x00/rt2800lib.c:7712:           rt2x00_err(rt2x00dev, "Invalid RT chipset 0x%04x, rev %04x detected\n"
<TJ-> dmesg from boot might reveal a PCI mapping problem. Can you 'pastebinit /var/log/dmesg'
<lotuspsychje> not right now sorry
<lotuspsychje> its upstairs, i can do it later
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: can bios settings block the pci card somehow?
<TJ-> Not usually. PCI devices have the concept of 'mapping' their I/O and memory resources into the CPU address space. They do that via Base Address Registers (BARs). sometimes devices sit behind PCI bridges, which don't create sufficiently large 'windows' for the devices behind them. That can cause some PCI devices not to be able to fully function
<lotuspsychje> well i think dmesg spitted out some pci stuff yesterday
<lotuspsychje> ill paste in later tnx
<lotuspsychje> modprobe rt2800pci also did nothing
<TJ-> One of the many reasons I love Linux is the amount of boot-time config info in the logs, makes diagnosing issues so much easier
<lotuspsychje> true :p
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: can i bridge my laptop == to the offline box with eth cable to get it connected?
<lotuspsychje> both 14.04
<lotuspsychje> got wifi working on laptop
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: the card is not meant to work on that box, just to get it updated
<TJ-> if the interfaces are gigabit, or fast ethernet and support auto MDI-X, you can use a straight patch cable to connect them. Otherwise you'll need a cross-over cable
<lotuspsychje> ok
<lotuspsychje> think ill just go buy a 10m network cable for router==offline box
<lotuspsychje> and buy me a plug n play wifi dongle for ubuntu :p
<lotuspsychje> dont like offline messing
<TJ-> that error message is from the rt2800pci driver, so the device isn't 'looking' like it should, which suggests the resource mapping issue
<lotuspsychje> weird it doesnt get picked up by default
<lotuspsychje> maybe i should report this to devel?
<TJ-> "chipset 0xffff rev ffff" suggests the entire memory area it reads is 11111s
<lotuspsychje> <lotuspsychje> flags: slow devsel IRQ 18
<lotuspsychje> <lotuspsychje> memory....
<lotuspsychje> <lotuspsychje> capabilities: access denied
<TJ-> Need sudo
<lotuspsychje> ok ill try later
<lotuspsychje> we better start fixxing bugs lol
<lotuspsychje>  http://www.whizzy.org/2015/09/big-bug-bonanza-16-04-lts/
<lotuspsychje>  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BigDesktopBugScrub
<TJ-> Funny how that's all Unity related; says a lot :)
<lordievader> The email they sent to the community list exclaimed Unity at the title, lost intrest right there.
<lotuspsychje> really curious how 16.04 will look like in few months :p
<lordievader> I am not sure if I want to know.
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> well they invented unity, i dont think they will loose it now
<lordievader> That is not what I mean. The future of Kubuntu is uncertain, hence I am not sure if I want to know.
<TJ-> I wish there was more clarity on it; I'm avoiding commmiting to jumping in on it because it could be wasted effort
<lotuspsychje> also smart
<TJ-> It's not even clear how many users it has, which doesn't help. The activity on IRC suggests very few.
<lordievader> True, but IRC users isn't a very good metric either.
<TJ-> I know, but it does give an idea of how many people might be prepared to casually contribute
<lordievader> True, true.
<lotuspsychje> morning OerHeks
<OerHeks> morning lotus
<OerHeks> uh oh, .. http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/09/intel-graphics-installer-for-linux-adds-support-for-ubuntu-15-04
<lotuspsychje> offline box is fixxed by cable, tnx EriC^^ and TJ-
<lotuspsychje> corenominal: good afternoon
<EriC^^> lotuspsychje: great
<EriC^^> np
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: ill check later wich module is installed on my desktop upstairs
<EriC^^> cool
<lotuspsychje> isnt there a way to backup all ubuntu drivers to an usb somehow
<lotuspsychje> and install the needed ones from the usb to offline box?
<EriC^^> aptoncd i guess
<EriC^^> but that'll install everything
<EriC^^> *shrug*
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: but default drivers in ubuntu doesnt come in .deb right?
<lordievader> lotuspsychje: You mean copy /lib/modules?
<lotuspsychje> lordievader: would that be the reccomended way?
<lordievader> Meh, not really.
<lordievader> You could mount it over /lib/modules fix your system and remove the mount.
<lotuspsychje> lets say a card needs a specific firmware thats not by default in modules
<lotuspsychje> there should be a way to make an usb stick with all drivers
<lordievader> Ah there should be a linux-firmware package.
<lotuspsychje> !info linux-firmware
<ubot5> linux-firmware (source: linux-firmware): Firmware for Linux kernel drivers. In component main, is optional. Version 1.143.3 (vivid), package size 24170 kB, installed size 84290 kB
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> so lets say i install this package to the offline box, it could load modules from there?
<lordievader> If the modules exist, I guess. This package just installs firmware.
<lotuspsychje> ok
<EriC^^> yeah some drivers are in some debs some in different separate debs
<EriC^^> i guess it depends which drivers you need, you'd need to hunt down the dependencies and stuff and install all the .debs
<lotuspsychje> thats rough
<EriC^^> c'est la via
<lotuspsychje> i saw broadcom driver on the iso by default
<EriC^^> :p
<lotuspsychje> they should have collection of all drivers in there
<lotuspsychje> oh well, maybe ill just buy cheap wifi dongle work out of the box
<lotuspsychje> to avoid situations
<EriC^^> try lspci -k and get the driver it's using i guess
<EriC^^> if you wanna avoid this for this wifi card
<lotuspsychje> ok
<EriC^^> but yeah it seems like a good idea if theres a ubuntu iso or something that has all drivers so it'll work out of the box
<lotuspsychje> i remember back in the old ubuntu versions, i had to add cdrom source to find a wifi driver offline
<lotuspsychje> !info apt-offline
<ubot5> apt-offline (source: apt-offline): offline APT package manager. In component universe, is optional. Version 1.6 (vivid), package size 54 kB, installed size 345 kB
<lotuspsychje> oh nice
<lotuspsychje> laterz :p
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-09-18
<lotuspsychje> good morning mates
<lotuspsychje> im installing 2 boxes with ubuntu that have mint + cinnamon on, the user had many issues with hibernation, system freezes,browser crashes,..
<lotuspsychje> the guy spent 7 hours installing mint + packages on 1 box oO
<lotuspsychje> and counted every hour working on it, she had to pay 300$
<daftykins> :S to whom? or her own time?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Ouch for her ! I feel like she has been "taken" .
<lotuspsychje> yes, he sat there drinking coffee, in her time
<lotuspsychje> wth...
<lotuspsychje> i once installed ubuntu on it for her, and he made a dualboot out of it with mint
<daftykins> who is this joker :D
<lotuspsychje> because she follows a linux class, and he's the teacher addicted to mint, he could overwelm her with that mints better
<lotuspsychje> lol
<Bashing-om> I HopE it is no one we know .
<lotuspsychje> i feel embarrassed for my country lol
<lotuspsychje> i told her not to work with him anymore and pass her 2 laptops to me
<lotuspsychje> im doing both format in 1 hour lol
<lotuspsychje> i wonder why so many users love mint, didnt cinnamon have big issues?
<Bashing-om> ~~
<lotuspsychje> or is it just mint's structure
<lotuspsychje> the desktop felt green and minimal, but under the hood many issues
<daftykins> it was definitely leaky to begin with
<daftykins> i don't really understand why anyone would choose to get something second rate when they can get it at source, but then i suppose that's true in a manner of speaking with Ubuntu -> debian :)
<daftykins> just i found debian never had sane defaults
<lotuspsychje> and not so user friendly at the beginning
<daftykins> ja
<lotuspsychje> lol
<Bashing-om> My intro was slackware, I found ubuntu a breath of fresh air .
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> mine was early redhat
<lotuspsychje> could choose gnome, kde or enlightment
<daftykins> i followed some debian network install guides :>
<lotuspsychje> the guy changed bios mode to IDE instead of AHCI for dualboot w7 + mint wtf
<daftykins> >_<
<daftykins> time for me to clock out, later folks \o
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: nite nite
<OerHeks> LoLz, a mint teacher ..
<OerHeks> oh, i should say sad sad, a mint teacher
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> morning OerHeks
<lotuspsychje> !find generic firmware
<ubot5> firmware is not a valid distribution: kubuntu-backports, kubuntu-experimental, kubuntu-updates, partner, precise, precise-backports, precise-proposed, stable, testing, trusty, trusty-backports, trusty-proposed, unstable, utopic, utopic-backports, utopic-proposed, vivid, vivid-backports, vivid-proposed, wily, wily-backports, wily-proposed
<lotuspsychje> !find generic-firmware
<ubot5> Found: W:, W:, W:
<lordievader> Good morning
<MonkeyDust> my banking account ... using Tor browser ... inside a linux VM guest, with iptables enabled ... inside a linux host with iptabled enabled ... please tell me i'm being paranoid
<lordievader> How many layers of encryption at the tor endpoint?
<MonkeyDust> medium-high security, what does that say
<lordievader> That is not what I am asking. Do you have just an ssl layer from the tor endpoint to the bank website?
<MonkeyDust> not sure, i accepted the default options
<lordievader> Because if you where really paranoid you'd have like a million layers of encryption on your connections to the bank.
<MonkeyDust> thanks, that makes me feel a bit normal again
<lordievader> :P
<MonkeyDust> i was worrying about my mental sanity
<lordievader> Too bad banks usually only support ssl.
<lotuspsychje> morning lordievader
<lordievader> lotuspsychje: Just in time ;)
<MonkeyDust> there's some SSL observe plugin installed
<lotuspsychje> lordievader: whats going on :p
<lordievader> Not much, taking a break from studying for a bit.
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<lotuspsychje> great, i found that ralink module on my own desktop, uses a generic firmware version
<lotuspsychje> im wondering wich packages ubuntu installs on updates that have these generic firmwares in?
<lordievader> You mean reverse dep on linux-firmware?
<lotuspsychje> not sure
<lordievader> lotuspsychje: https://paste.kde.org/pft6t2hf1
<lotuspsychje> so the default module is rt2800pci.ko right
<lotuspsychje> how can i see wich packages hold this generic firmware
<lordievader> lotuspsychje: Search for it with apt-file
<lotuspsychje> updating apt-file
<lotuspsychje> linux-image-extra-3.19.0-28-generic: /lib/modules/3.19.0-28-generic/kernel/drivers/net/wireless/rt2x00/rt2800pci.ko
<lotuspsychje> get a large index of dirs here
<lordievader> So it is in many packages then ;) But it comes with the kernel.
<lotuspsychje> so you think that generic firmware is in the newer kernel and thats why on updated system the wifi card works?
<lotuspsychje> i dont know the exact name of the generic firmware package
<lotuspsychje> shows like this: driver= rt2800pci driverversion= generic firmware and a number
<daftykins> this hntty is a right asshat
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-09-19
<daftykins> tgm4883: this skynet guy =|
<daftykins> not cut out for life
<tgm4883> heh, yea I know
<daftykins> weekend duty ^_^
 * daftykins shakes his head
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> 36 users, its full house in discuss :p
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/it-s-official-there-are-now-over-1-500-linux-games-in-valve-s-steam-library-492144.shtml
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/09/you-can-now-buy-ubuntu-laptops-pc-and-phones-from-snapdeal
<lotuspsychje> lookin neat also
<lotuspsychje> good morning lordievader
<lordievader> Good morning.
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: morning mate
<TJ-> Hiya :)
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: on my updated system my rt2800pci driver showed driverversion= generic firmware and number
<lotuspsychje> so those generic driver versions must be in the updates somehow
<lotuspsychje> the rt2800pci.ko doesnt work by default so it seems
<TJ-> Hmmm
<lotuspsychje> im wondering wich package these generic firmwares are in
<lotuspsychje> i didnt manually installed myself
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: would be interesting to know if we can download these firmware on usb, to install on offline boxes
<lotuspsychje> in the future
<TJ-> dpkg -S $(modinfo -F firmware rt2800pci)
<TJ-> linux-firmware: /lib/firmware/rt2860.bin
<lotuspsychje> !info linux-firmware
<ubot5> linux-firmware (source: linux-firmware): Firmware for Linux kernel drivers. In component main, is optional. Version 1.143.3 (vivid), package size 24170 kB, installed size 84290 kB
<lotuspsychje> would this hold all firmwares for every card then?
<TJ-> All freely distributed firmwares are in linux-firmware
<lotuspsychje> nice one
<lotuspsychje> ive seen that broadcom driver also on default 14.04.3 iso also, but thats another story
<lotuspsychje> so lets say i have an offline box and install linux-firmware off the usb and install on system, it should recognize the rt2800pci
<TJ-> 'recognise' is done by the Linux driver itself. 'be able to use' would require the firmware image
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> ill try that next box with nonworking card
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: tnx for the linux-firmware tip, seems like all firmwares inside that tar
<lotuspsychje> strange it shows as 'optional' and i never installed it
<lordievader> linux-firmware contains all the stuff, you might just want to install a subset.
<lotuspsychje> lordievader: yes ive noticed all brands inside, but was wondering why it got installed on my box
<lotuspsychje> hey hey
<BluesKaj> hey
<Ben64> hey hey hey
<lotuspsychje> channels get more crowdy bit by bit
<BluesKaj> I have too many chats on the go as ikt is :-)
<lotuspsychje> ah right
<lotuspsychje> but your supporting mates you dont forget right :p
<BluesKaj> I try to help if I can, if that's what you mean .
<lotuspsychje> no i just mean to gather here for chitchat under volunteers :p
<lotuspsychje> its nice to discuss news and changes n stuff
<BluesKaj> i did a total clean install od 15.10b eta so guess I forgot to include "discuss" when configuring konversation a couple of weeks ago
<BluesKaj> of 15.10 beta even
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> hows it running so far?
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: your on kubuntu 15.10b then?
<BluesKaj> quite well actually , some crashes with system settings. Plasma 5.4/KDE is still using X  tho , no change to wayland until 16.04 I think
<lordievader> Might not even be 16.04. Too large of a change for an LTS release I'd say.
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: did you read this lol: http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-16.04-Unity-Bugs
<BluesKaj> i read that 16.04 was going begin the transition to wayland, perhaps it was speculation, but tit didn't seem like it was
<lordievader> Hmm, seems a bit daring to me.
<MonkeyDust> when is 15.04 eol?
<MonkeyDust> !15.04
<ubot5> Ubuntu 15.04 (Vivid Vervet) is the current release of Ubuntu. Download at http://releases.ubuntu.com/15.04/ - Read the release notes at http://ubottu.com/y/vivid
<Daekdroom> MonkeyDust, I think it's about 3 months after 15.10 is released
<MonkeyDust> ok, i'm not reinstalling it in my vm
<lotuspsychje> :p
<BluesKaj> OS support lasts 9 months afte release
<lotuspsychje> !release
<ubot5> Ubuntu releases a new version every 6 months. Each version is supported for 9 months to 5 years. More info at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases & http://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeBasedReleases
<BluesKaj> except for LTS
 * lotuspsychje waits unpatient on 16.04 :p
<BluesKaj> impatient  even :-)
<MonkeyDust> silly verbal wit: the patient is impatient
<lotuspsychje> lol
<BluesKaj> and an unpatient is therefore not a patient
 * lotuspsychje feels like a paranoia patient addicted to the w3b
<lotuspsychje> you skared him MonkeyDust
<MonkeyDust> patience... time will tell
<lotuspsychje> :p
<MonkeyDust> tiet veu e paafke
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> ben oui
<lotuspsychje> avec a little grass derin
<lotuspsychje> ioria: good afternoon mate
<lotuspsychje> 38 users! we have a record i think
<pauljw> :)
<ioria> lotuspsychje, good afternoon to all of you !
<pauljw> hi
<lotuspsychje> hey to u2 pauljw
<ioria> official ubuntu-youtube channel ? does it exist ?
<lotuspsychje> hmm not sure?
<ioria> i found only omgubuntu channel
<lotuspsychje> ive recently saw a list of all channels
<lotuspsychje> but cant recall where :p
<ioria> i could be useful .... with a lot of tutorial , and graphic video simulations ... and stuff
<lotuspsychje> yeah would be nice
<lotuspsychje> but not everyone approves the creation of new channels
<lotuspsychje> i once tryed to make ubuntu-ssd
<ioria> oh... i see
<ioria> and ?
<lotuspsychje> and was brutally denied by an 0p
<lotuspsychje> so i made ##linux-ssd
<ioria> ?_?
<lotuspsychje> ioria: because the channel name holds ubuntu, it needs approvement first
<lotuspsychje> ## are non-official channels
<ioria> go it
<ioria> got it
<lotuspsychje> ioria: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/ChannelList
<lotuspsychje> what a list omg :p
<lotuspsychje> lol trivia is dead
<ioria> i'm wondering what it takes to be approved ... being a  billioner hardware manufacturer ? ^_^
<lotuspsychje> lol no i think it matters which 0p is replys at wich time
<lotuspsychje> and find it relevant to create
<ioria> oh... thanks for the info
<lotuspsychje> nop ioria :p
<MonkeyDust> dang, my 15.10 vm finds my NAS, but not my 14.04 shared folders
<MonkeyDust> bridged network
<lotuspsychje> weird
<lotuspsychje> router block?
<MonkeyDust> stupid ubuntu
<MonkeyDust> wish i was in windows
<MonkeyDust> (joke)
<pauljw> heheh
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> MonkeyDust: if your getting too angry try this: http://news.softpedia.com/news/tutorial-for-microsoft-to-help-it-kill-linux-491638.shtml
<lotuspsychje> lolz
<MonkeyDust> no joke: in 2008 or 2009 i wrote as a user comment on a linux blog, that, in post-Ballmer times, Windows would become a "by-product" of MS and that they would focus on hardware and services ... it is now said that Windows 10 will indeed be the last release
<pauljw> i read that as win10 will be a rolling release that never goes away
<MonkeyDust> pauljw  yes, something similar
<lotuspsychje> updates on w10 get forced now, unwanted
<pauljw> now i see where they're maybe building a linux distro too
<MonkeyDust> windows as a service, so to say
<pauljw> yep
<lotuspsychje> the time their developers get smarter, were 10 years later lol
<pauljw> :)
<pauljw> i figure that ms will claim to own linux once they have a distro...  heheh...
<lotuspsychje> haha
<lotuspsychje> bill torvalds
<MonkeyDust> and the enter key will be patented by MS
<pauljw> lol
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> still 75 million users downloaded w10
<lotuspsychje> i will have to convince more dualboot users to loose it :p
<MonkeyDust> i have w10 in vmware, out of curiosity
<lotuspsychje> im curious what netstat does in w10
<lotuspsychje> outgoing spy connections :p
<pauljw> no doubt, i have xp pro in virtualbox with no network connection.  i consider windows to be a virus.  my daughter has a school laptop that i will no allow on my network.
<pauljw> not*
<lotuspsychje> all win version are a security thread
<pauljw> :)
<lotuspsychje> full exploits and mallware
<lotuspsychje> if you scan every pc with malwarebytes you reach easy 300+ malwares
<pauljw> scary isn't it...
<lotuspsychje> and ppl trust their payed antivirus
<lotuspsychje> false feeling of security
<pauljw> they don't know any better, ms is what they were raised on.
<lotuspsychje> true
<lotuspsychje> i once helped a guy with his win pc, because he had so many virusses
<lotuspsychje> the guy bought antivirus2007 online, and payed 60$ for it
<lotuspsychje> but that package was itself a pack with 200 malwares inside lol
<pauljw> yeah, all to commom a practice.  so glad to be an all linux home these days.
<lotuspsychje> same here
<BluesKaj> malware bytes generates a lot of false positives tho
<lotuspsychje> yeah cookies
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: but for a pc that never been cleaned for years, malwarebytes can help
<BluesKaj> yup, I suppose , lotuspsychje ...wife's windows pc is remarkably clear of malware
<OerHeks> a good botnet protects your pc from malware :-D
<lotuspsychje> loool
<lotuspsychje> yeats: welcome
<lotuspsychje> your also doing support at #ubuntu sometimes right yeats?
<OerHeks> old name, been here as far as i remember
<lotuspsychje> cool
<yeats> yep ;-)
<yeats> thanks
<lotuspsychje> yeats: well we have gathered here to chitchat with most active supporters feel free to add to favs
<yeats> thank you - I've been less active recently, but I try to check in at least on the weekends
<lotuspsychje> yeats: not the quantity but quality counts :p
<yeats> :-D
<lotuspsychje> yeats: we always doing support, but never have the chance to talk 2 each other, so here we are
<OerHeks> gossip channel nr 1
<lotuspsychje> hahaha
<OerHeks> no, it can really be handy for volunteers to backtalk
<lotuspsychje> and no girlz, hows that possible
<OerHeks> ehh you think no girls are here, grinn
<lotuspsychje> lol
 * lotuspsychje slaps OerHeks into #ubuntu-women
<lotuspsychje> you are visitor number 39 EriC^^
<EriC^^> yay!
<EriC^^> :D
<lotuspsychje> !peak
<lotuspsychje> hmmm
<EriC^^> did i win anything? :p
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: yes an empty bucket
<EriC^^> lol
<lotuspsychje> you can carry 10 liters water with it
<lotuspsychje> and throw it over OerHeks face
<EriC^^> lo
<EriC^^> lol
<OerHeks> Yes, you get 1 chance .. me 2
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> the ubuntu bucket challenge
<lotuspsychje> but instead of icecubes we let it freeze completly
<EriC^^> lol
<EriC^^> haha
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> ok so far for quality ubuntu discussions
<EriC^^> :D
<lotuspsychje> what will the new guys think...
<lotuspsychje> im out for dinner
<EriC^^> ok see ya
<lotuspsychje> bye
<pauljw> bye
<ioria> bye
<EriC^^> bye
<daftykins> aww i missed the group 'bye' :(
<pauljw> heheh...
<pauljw> bbl dinner time...
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-09-20
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> good sunday to all :p
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon to all
 * ObrienDave waves from Englewood, Colorado, USA
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> \o
<pauljw> fun times in #ubuntu this afternoon....
<daftykins> good ol' skinux, can't be his fault - no sir, not ever!
<wileee> easybcd oh boy
<pauljw> :)
<Bashing-om> Been away from the keyboard for 3 hours, going to be -interesting- getting caught up !
<daftykins> Bashing-om: hey we don't pay you to take 3hr lunches :D
<Bashing-om> Payment is in kind ... However the absence was for a worthy cause .
 * daftykins nods
<Bashing-om> else; all are aware, I am devoted. Just the absence was much longer than anticipated .
<daftykins> yeah don't worry i'm just joking :)
<Bashing-om> daftykins: I did take it as such . Me much too serious. Playing catch up at this time, see what fun I have missed .
<Bashing-om> OK, up to speed, daftykins Has been busy . Cookies !
<pauljw> lol
<daftykins> i have? :D
<daftykins> mm cookies
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-09-19
<OerHeks> i am wondering, Bashing-om, what is his setup, a vps or something ?
<Bashing-om> OerHeks: I had not given a thought . I am working as bare metal install .
<lordievader> Good morning
<ducasse> wb, lordievader :)
<lordievader> Hey ducasse
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<irishman2020> Trying to setup udisks2 (default usb mount tool for ubuntu 14.04) to mount differently than the defaults. Is there anyone who knows of a way to configure it? When I insert a usb, it automounts as the user logged in, but when I login to another user, I cant access the usb drive
<OerHeks> i hope everybody is oke in Mexico, earthquake 8.1
<OerHeks> http://quakeapp.com/m/?s=M&e_id=ssn.1474300800
<OerHeks> oh.. it was a drill ...
<Bashing-om> New kernel out for trusty : 3.13.0-96-generic .
<OerHeks> and for Xenial  4.4.0-38-generic #57
<OerHeks> Thursday a fresh SSL thingy .. some group with that last ssl vulnerability just scanned all valid ip ranges
<nacc> ooh 4.8 kernel in yakkety-proposed :)
<OerHeks> oke, lets buy new hardware
<nacc> :)
<Bashing-om> But, I am quite affectionate to my ole box .. As much as I might desire an 8 core AMD system; I will plod along with old faithful .
<OerHeks> my wealth can buy a fresh ubuntu sticker.
<Bashing-om> Even then ^ Prior arrangements must be made with the domestic engineer ,
<OerHeks> Yes, i'll fly you in, Bashing-om
<Bashing-om> A true friend indeed !
<OerHeks> Actually, from my front door i see the runway of Schiphol, +- 1,5 mile
<OerHeks> so wave when you land!
<OerHeks> https://www.google.nl/maps/dir/52.3524247,4.7109732/Schalkwijk,+Haarlem/@52.3556225,4.6723923,14z/data=!4m8!4m7!1m0!1m5!1m1!1s0x47c5e5ffdf64a965:0xe2adbac949e1eac1!2m2!1d4.6555225!2d52.3580837
<Bashing-om> When I land, then, I just holler at you .
<Bashing-om> Oh, you are in the new part of the city :)
<OerHeks> Bashing-om, i still wonder if that Rneville dude is using vmware,..
<OerHeks> by this > xserver-xorg-video-vmware-lts-vivid
<Bashing-om> OerHeks: He dod affirm was bare metal .. Think he has his head in places best kept clean . Think in his case, when all said and done we want hin back on the trusty X stack .
<OerHeks> dafty kins !
<Bashing-om> daftykins: ! Still SaintLouis'n ?
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-09-20
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> !info linux-image-generic
<ubot5`> linux-image-generic (source: linux-meta): Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version 4.4.0.38.40 (xenial), package size 2 kB, installed size 12 kB
<lotuspsychje> new kernel update
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: trusty also has a new kernel release .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: cool!
<Bashing-om> It's that time. eyes are crossing . G nite
<ducasse> \o
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon to all
<DJones> And Good afternoon to you
<lotuspsychje> hey DJones
<DJones> Hey
<OerHeks> :-)
<lotuspsychje> and hi OerHeks
<OerHeks> hi DJones lotuspsychje
<DJones> Hey OerHeks
<DJones> lotuspsychje: Its amazing how many app's you use in the past that you forget about
<lotuspsychje> DJones: very true, and there tons of them on linux :p
<DJones> I'm the same 99% of my computer use is on Ubuntu, pretty much always find an app to do what I need, just a shame that dev's of open source apps aren't always able to keep up the dev work because of having to have paying jobs
<DJones> Polly as a twitter client is a good example of that
<lotuspsychje> !info polly
<ubot5`> Package polly does not exist in xenial
<DJones> No, it was a ppa
<lotuspsychje> ah
<DJones> But the best twitter client I'd found
<lotuspsychje> im still looking an easy systemd manager gui
<DJones> Anaitine seems to be the best since, twitter clients aren't best supported with Ubuntu
<DJones> Respect to the original developers though, they give others idea's to develop new apps
<lotuspsychje> true
<lotuspsychje> and snappy is really incouraging new apps creation
<DJones> Must admit, I've not looked at snappy much
<lotuspsychje> its worth a look for sure
<lotuspsychje> installed telegram snap out of it myself
<lotuspsychje> bbl swimming time :p
<v3n0m> hey
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-09-21
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<ducasse> \o
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
<lotuspsychje> breakfast time here :p
<lotuspsychje> laterzz
<v3n0m> Okay, I have installed vine and I'm trying to play Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2 on it but it says that unable to locate the starting point.
<ducasse> try #ubuntu, this is not a tech support channel
<ducasse> hmmm... https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/53ri0m/warning_microsoft_signature_pc_program_now/
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<nicomachus> https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/53rq2l/warning_microsoft_signature_pc_program_now/
<nicomachus> wow
<nicomachus> Lenovo laptops with W10 "Signature Edition" are locking out the BIOS and completely preventing any linux installation.
<ducasse> yes, posted that here earlier today. aiui, the bios locks the sata controller to a raid mode that requires custom drivers, with no option to switch it to ahci.
<OerHeks> Europe does not allow that. lets see this progress ..
<ducasse> was just about to say that, i doubt lenovo or others will try this here.
<OerHeks> I think i got the clue, special intel processor with one core that is dedicated
<nicomachus> OerHeks: the US doesn't either. It's called Tying.
<OerHeks> next thing i hope is unlocked iphone capable of running ubuntu-touch :-D
<nicomachus> OerHeks: I still haven't been won over by Ubuntu Touch.
<nicomachus> I don't see the benefit over Android yet.
<OerHeks> lack of new devices is playing part now, besides the community effort on other phones
<OerHeks> no meizu 6, etc
<DJones> OerHeks: Wonder how long it'll be before the troll gets removed
<DJones> I have a short fuse
<OerHeks> Never. unless ubuntu decides to put channelmode +r registered .. but then, still ..
<OerHeks> I know how you feel, you are committed to help someone for free, with the bet honest answer you can find.
<OerHeks> In amerika schiet het ook niet op .. ik bedoel, ze schieten wel veel op.
<OerHeks> oops wrong channel
<baizon> hehe
<DArqueBishop> I don't know what you said, but whatever it was I would probably sadly agree with it.
<OerHeks> We have a political talk about yearly budget, it sounds more like the comming election 2017.
<baizon> amerika and shiet, thats what i did understand :D
<OerHeks> now the masks fall off
<OerHeks> schiet op = hurry up, but literally it says shoot up
<nacc> so hard to tell if that is trolling...
<OerHeks> so many lonely people
<DArqueBishop> I think it's trolling.
<DArqueBishop> Either that or his son is a gigantic asshole.
<DArqueBishop> Yeah, troll.
<OerHeks> pom pom pom
<de-facto> Microsoft aren't forcing Lenovo to block free operating systems http://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/44694.html    http://imgur.com/a/niewu
<de-facto> hmm sad to read that, i always thought Lenovo was supporting Linux, well seems that changed :(
<OerHeks> removing the ssd, format it, and put it back?
<de-facto> ..."In this specific case, Lenovo's firmware defaults to "RAID" mode and doesn't allow you to change that. Since Linux has no support for the hardware when configured this way, you can't install Linux (distribution installers will boot, but won't find any storage device to install the OS to)."...
<OerHeks> oh
<de-facto> the bios wont allow it
<de-facto> good that i dont own such devices
<OerHeks> it will be reversed engineered i guess
<dax> i note that the "Lenovo rep" everyone's talking about is some contractor that answers questions on their forums
<dax> which is not very solid credentials, as things go
<de-facto> i also read that some lenovo devices wont allow you to exchange hardware (such as ssd/hdd/wlan) because they use some sort of signatures. not sure if that still applies, but if so certainly wouldnt be very user friendly
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-09-22
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<OerHeks> Did you sell your bed?
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> ive aten too much lamb yesterday
<lotuspsychje> my stomac is turning around
<OerHeks> food poisoning ..
<OerHeks> drink milk, and it will come out :-P
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> im having a hot coffee, the solution to anything in life
<OerHeks> wait, i should not give medical advise...
<OerHeks> that would be my 2nd best: coffee
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: on holiday we are supposed to eat too much :p
<lotuspsychje> hmmm wait a minute..whats your excuse to be early waken lol
<OerHeks> Drabber was dancing on top of me.
<lotuspsychje> haha
<lotuspsychje> early dog, catches the heks
<OerHeks> Then i remembered a piece of fried chicken in the fridge.
<lotuspsychje> mmmm kentucky fried chicken
 * lotuspsychje wouldnt care if it fights with the lamb
<lotuspsychje> good morning Bashing-om
<Bashing-om> Hey lotuspsychje I did notice your presense . was getting back and catching up . :)
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2016/09/cant-install-linux-microsoft-signature-edition-laptop
<ducasse> \o
<lordievader> Good morning.
<ducasse> wb lordievader, bright-eyed and bushy-tailed? :)
<BluesKaj> HIyas all
<Bashing-om> Aye, good help has arrived . keep is all in-line OerHeks :)
<OerHeks> :-)
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-09-23
<PotatoBoi> hello
<Bashing-om> Welcome to discuss - your option ?
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: ! Pleased ya still with us . Getting ready now to take the big dip back home ?
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: yes sir, today is going home already :p
<Bashing-om> "it's time that all good thing to end " :)
<lotuspsychje> hehe
<lotuspsychje> going home is also nice
<Bashing-om> A fact .. when all said and done .. there is no place like home .
<ducasse> good morning, all
<BluesKaj> Hey all
<ptytty> looking for documentation on dev event firing
<lotus|dell> hi guys
<lotus|dell> im having weird issue on a dell, no wifi but lshw shows chipset & driver
<nacc> lotus|dell: see /topic
<nacc> lotus|dell: you want #ubuntu, i'm guessing?
<lotus|dell> network icon shows only eth, lubuntu 16.04.1
<lotus|dell> nacc: if the discuss friends have no clue i will tnx :p
<nacc> lotus|dell: no, you're offtopic for this channel
<nacc> lotus|dell: it's not a support channel
<lotus|dell> we often discuss issues here, why is now a problem?
<nacc> not ime, but so be it
<DArqueBishop> Not in mine, either.
<lotus|dell> if a user in main has a prob, and we discuss it here its also about support
<lotus|dell> the thin red line
<lotus|dell> howdy BluesKaj
<brushdemon> http://imgur.com/gallery/D9jFUFD
<lotus|dell> http://paste.ubuntu.com/23221085/
<lotus|dell> bbl
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-09-24
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> having trouble connecting freenode
<lotuspsychje> seems like a nasty split
<Bashing-om> with a bit of cleanup afterward .... hummm ...
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: im having a dell 16.04.1 with a broadcom pci wifi that doesnt work, only eth working
<lotuspsychje> lubuntu & ubuntu tested, both wifi not working
<lotuspsychje> but lshw shows wifi chipset & driver loaded
<lotuspsychje> nothing found in syslog
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: got that bcmwl-kernel-source?
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: if tested the firmware-43-installer
<lotuspsychje> no luck there
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: lemme test bcmwl holdon
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: No WIFI skills .. sorry .
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: resuktet in segmentation fault, eth down its also a bc chip
<lotuspsychje> wl driver loaded well on wifi, but no ssid's showing up yet
<ducasse_> morning all
<BluesKaj> Howdy folks
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-09-25
<blackdawn> join #ubuntuforums
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> lubuntu xenial is so nice..
<ducasse> morning, lotuspsychje!
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
<lotuspsychje> installed xenial on rather older dell, working like a charm now
<lotuspsychje> thenh helped me installing wifi
<ducasse> goodie, is this a machine for yourself?
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: no its a dell a friend bought with linux mint on
<lotuspsychje> but mint totaly borked that machine
<lotuspsychje> did you know mint asks for a network unlock password?
<lotuspsychje> never saw that b4
<ducasse> never tried mint, actually, never felt the need to.
<lotuspsychje> me neither :p
<ducasse> thinking of upgrading this laptop to yakkety today, the xubuntu people were looking for people to help run a few tests.
<lotuspsychje> cool
<ducasse> yay unstable release! :)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: how was the vacation?
<lotuspsychje> very nice, alot of swim
<ducasse> back to work tomorrow?
<lotuspsychje> yep :p
<lotuspsychje> but they havent found a 4 kitchen guy yet
<lotuspsychje> means more work for me
<lotuspsychje> and i need to start having time for my business
<ducasse> but they are looking for someone, or...?
<lotuspsychje> well lets say they always looking for ppl
<lotuspsychje> but its rather hard to find someone usefull for kitchen
<ducasse> i see. well, hope for your sake they find someone. is the webshop finished?
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: almost, just the icons need to change to royalty free ones
<lotuspsychje> mollie payments is integraded and has a https connection
<ducasse> good! exciting time for you :)
<lotuspsychje> yeah :p
<ducasse> btw; i bought a das keyboard 4 pro - warmly recommended!
<lotuspsychje> nice!
<ducasse> i had a rezer before, but this is much nicer.
<lotuspsychje> ill keep that in mind for customers :p
<ducasse> it will be interesting to see how well your shop does, really hope it is a success.
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: i know alot of ppl that im helping for years now, im sure it will
<lotuspsychje> some are waiting until the webshop is done, to be able to buy something lol
<ducasse> :)
<ducasse> we had someone in #ubuntu yesterday who had just switched from windows, he/she was so excited they had to be +q'd :)
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: im onto breakfast mate, have a nice day
<ducasse> ok, enjoy!
<lotuspsychje> u2 ; )
<lotuspsychje> laterz all
<lotuspsychje> if you see theNH.. tell him my wifi got fixxed
<lotuspsychje> tnx & bye :p
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-09-18
<Bashing-om> To all a good night o/
<ducasse> good morning
<lordievader> Good morning
<ducasse> hi lordievader, all well?
<lordievader> Yes, doing good here. How are you?
<jink> BRILLIANT, THANKS FOR ASKING.
<jink> Morning, kids. :)
<ducasse> all good here as well.
<ducasse> \o jink
<lordievader> Hey jink
<lordievader> Good to hear :)
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<Bashing-om> We do Monday support :)
<oerheks> Yes. the more experienced trolls :-D
<Bashing-om> Always that 10% - upper and lower .. we take the bad with the good and move on along :)
<brunch> just installed gnome-session-flashback
<brunch> pretty good
<brunch> but I wonder if the update broke gnome-accounts or if it was the session
<daftykins> i think a friend who is trying to hold onto the past uses that :>
<brunch> it's quite alright, there's shortcuts for snapping windows
<leftyfb> I've been using flashback for years
<brunch> what I miss is super-a applicationname
<nacc> too many ridiculous users today
<daftykins> nacc: oh?
<nacc> one got quite pissed off at leftyfb :)
<brunch> alt-f2 is a good application launcher though
<nacc> for havinng installed eclipse from source because someone in #ubuntu told them to and leftyfb telling them that was unsupported
<brunch> if you know the executable name
<leftyfb> ;)
<leftyfb> brunch: I use gnome-do
<brunch> gnome-do?
<brunch> wotsdat
<leftyfb> brunch: it's a launcher I use
<daftykins> all the cool kids clearly stick to packages
<brunch> does that require me to click?
 * brunch grimaces in disgust
<leftyfb> brunch: negative
<leftyfb> super+space -> type: firefox -> hit enter
<brunch> but that's equal to alt-f2 firefox
<brunch> or fir\t
<leftyfb> brunch: only if you know the binary name
<brunch> I actually like gnome3 quite much
<brunch> I just despise mutter
<leftyfb> brunch: yes, but we were talking about gnome-session-flashback
<brunch> ah yes, the multi-desktop is well done
<brunch> just the way I like it
<brunch> alt-tabbing among applications works immediatly
<brunch> metacity gives fantastic performance
<brunch> isn't mate the continuation of this DE?
<oerheks> that firefox 52 story ..
<oerheks> just walked by
<leftyfb> oerheks: you missed the eclipse one. That one was better.
<oerheks> i caused the eclips issue with ubuntu-make ..
<oerheks> yeah, i ruined many servers and desktops..
<leftyfb> jeezus, I thought the eclipse was last month
<oerheks> 5 more days .. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iC_W273I2CU
<leftyfb> wtf
<daftykins> leftyfb: can you ease up on the language in here, please?
<oerheks> It is just a constellation
<daftykins> obfuscated or not
<leftyfb> oh right
<leftyfb> :/
<daftykins> i myself enjoy replacing all religious names with 'Tux' :)
<_Anna_> What's the difference between Oracle's VirtualBox and its ubuntu version?
<nacc> _Anna_: dunno, read the changelog?
<nacc> _Anna_: i assume oracle's is not free
<daftykins> didn't they use some kind of proprietary driver for USB too?
<_Anna_> So it's not completly open source? is that why ubuntu guys made their own version?
<oerheks> take a read https://help.ubuntu.com/community/VirtualBox/Installation
<nacc> _Anna_: it's not their own version
<oerheks> licensing
<nacc> _Anna_: please do some basic research :)
<daftykins> like even a google
<nacc> _Anna_: and i don't mean that rudely, but it feels like you didn't look at what is in both optionns
<oerheks> i would go for KVM, when your guest is linux
<oerheks> much more reliable
<nacc> yep, it's pretty easy to use
<Bashing-om> \o EriC^^  .
<_Anna_> Well, you're wrong. I have searched and I even asked on oracle's chat, but they refused to say.
<nacc> and if you dont need VMs but containers, LXD is really handy
<nacc> _Anna_: oracle refused to tell you what is in their software?
<nacc> _Anna_: so how are we supposed to know?
<oerheks> _Anna_, wrong? ... you claim they don't answer, so you are trolling
<oerheks> :-D
<oerheks>  /ignore
<_Anna_> They refused to accept it as theirs. They say it's a fork.
<_Anna_> I'm talking about the one someone can get from Software Center vs the one from their site.
<nacc> _Anna_: do you understand the Debian Free Software Guidelines?
<nacc> _Anna_: or what a distribution is/does?
<_Anna_> Yes nacc. Do you always treat others like they are stupid?
<nacc> _Anna_: if you understand the above, then I don't understand what you're asking at all
<daftykins> it was definitely accurate in this instance
<nacc> _Anna_: a) Debian repackages the upstream tarball because the raw orig tarball violates DFSG. b) a distribution's published version is by definition a fork, as it's from some point in time in the past.
<nacc> _Anna_: you can see what is in a given srcpkg by `pull-lp-source <pkgname> <version>` if you want
<oerheks> sudo lxc-create -t download -n u1 -- -d ubuntu -r artful -a amd64
<nacc> oerheks: that's old :)
<nacc> oerheks: lxc launch ubuntu-daily:artful
<nacc> oerheks: lxc vs. lxd
<nacc> lxc- are lxc; `lxc ` are lxd
<nacc> oerheks: don't bother learning lxc1 if you don't need to :)
<oerheks> thanks, that is where i got flabbergasted.
<nacc> and you don't need sudo that way :)
<nacc> there are three remotes by defaults (ubuntu: for released versions; ubuntu-daily: for daily builds; and images: for the rest (e.g., debian, fedora)
<oerheks> lxc-destroy -n u1
<nacc> oerheks: :)
<oerheks> Done, sir.
<nacc> oerheks: and you can of course give your containers names (just after the image)
<nacc> oerheks: and there are shortcuts/aliases (e.g., ubuntu:x is the same as ubuntu:xenial)
<oerheks> Yeah, best thing is to do it with stable xenial.
<nacc> oerheks:  we just add lxd building support to `git ubuntu`
<nacc> oerheks: and i use it multiples times a day -- feel free to ask if you get stuck :)
<oerheks> I need a course ... can i somehowe invite you to do that? i will find 10 users or so..
<nacc> heh
<nacc> i think stefan has done talks online
<nacc> (the lxd maintainer)
<nacc> i don't use it heavily enough to justify explainning it -- but i can explain the basics of using it and then it's just ... use it :)
<_Anna_> I don't care if it is considered a fork or not. And I can't read the code. I'm not a developer or something. I'm a user trying to decide which one to install and why! Someone from the ubuntu team took VirtualBox from Oracle, changed something (oracle guys say they don't know what is changed by ubuntu guys) and then put it on Software Center. Take a look. It says "by ubuntu", not "by Oracle". So the question is: What is changed?
<nacc> _Anna_: read the changelog
<nacc> _Anna_: as i said?
<_Anna_> There is no changelog?
<nacc> ...
<nacc> _Anna_: `apt changelog virtualbox`
<nacc> _Anna_: also, none of this is really for this channel
<nacc> _Anna_: i think you wanted #ubuntu
<nacc> _Anna_: and again, I feel like you don't undestand what a distribution is? no one "from the ubuntu team" took virtualbox from oracle. 1) debian is the upstream for ubuntu's packages, not oracle. 2) all distributions (except rolling ones) freeze the versions when they do a release. That's what a distribution *is*.
<oerheks> the difference is clear...
<_Anna_> That command would give me the changes from an older version of the original program to a newer version or the original program. It wouldn't give the changes from the original program to the fork.
<nacc> _Anna_: if you want ubuntu support, use the ubuntu package, if you want oracle's support, use the oracle support
<nacc> _Anna_: *what* original program?
<nacc> _Anna_: if you want to see the differences between the upstream base tarball and the srcpkg, you'll have to read the code.
<_Anna_> original = the one from Oracle's site. oracle's guys insist the one on Software Center is a fork. [for which they know nothing(!) about]. Sorry if I'm not using the correct terminology. I'm saying what I've been told.
<_Anna_> I was only wondering if there are more or less features and of what kind.
<daftykins> sounds a lot like a support query to me
<_Anna_> sounds like a fork that it doesn't have to exist?
<nacc> _Anna_: ENOPARSE, that question doesn't make sense to me
<_Anna_> I don't know what enoparse means.
<nacc> _Anna_: i didn't parse your question.
<daftykins> how is this query not wrapped up already...
<oerheks>  "Error: Not Parsed" (or "Sorry, I didn't understand that.")
<_Anna_> let's wrap it up then, daftykins Is support (and where you get it) the only difference? And if yes, then why the ubuntu version still exists if offers practically zero?
<daftykins> let's rewind a bit, are you asking this because you tried to get help in its' official channel and they denied it citing "it's ubuntu flavoured! ask them!"
<nacc> _Anna_: did you read /topic? this isn't the support channel.
<oerheks> Do you need usb2.0 support/pci pass-through? no, use the open source one..
<_Anna_> No, I'm asking for support! I've tried both, saw no difference, kept the official and it's working fine now. I just don't understand what is the use of the ubuntu version. The default package manager of ubuntu-mate, Software Boutique, offers the official version straight from oracle's site. I think there is no point in Software Center not doing the same.
<nacc> _Anna_: you're asking for support in the non-support channel?
<_Anna_> I'm not* asking for support
<oerheks> LoLz
<oerheks> are you drunk ?
<_Anna_> NOT
<nacc> _Anna_: ok, you claimed to understand the DFSG earlier
<nacc> _Anna_: that is the answer as to why there is an Ubuntu version that is not identical to Oracle's.
<_Anna_> You don't even understand what I'm saying and you call me drunk? wtf! Are you always that stupid AND rude?!
<oerheks> Yes and Yes. Why are you not reading answers given?
<nacc> _Anna_: is your question really why is there an ubuntu version of anything?
<nacc> _Anna_: because that's how it reads right now
<daftykins> _Anna_: 10 minutes without a response, instead you're fighting :( what a shame
<oerheks> let's discuss this :-D
<nacc> they have resorted to PM insntead
 * oerheks waits for the ban
<daftykins> wowzer
<daftykins> i'd just like to highlight my favourite bit: "I've tried both, saw no difference, kept the official and it's working fine now"
<daftykins> 'no difference' ... 'working fine now'
<kenrin> If there is no difference there wouldn't be two versions
<nacc> fwiw, this might end up being a policy violation by mate :)
<nacc> turns out there is a special welcome app in mate that may enable 3rd party repos by default
<nacc> i'm d/l'ing the iso to see
<daftykins> kenrin: you have too much faith in FOSS
<daftykins> nacc: :O scandal
<kenrin> Nah.  I didn't say useful differences,  even a name change is a difference and happens all the time
<daftykins> :>
<daftykins> g'night \o
<pauljw> gnite daftykins
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-09-19
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Bashing-om> \o lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om how are you?
<lotuspsychje> 3 days off here :p
<Bashing-om> I be good . Be a new 16.04 kernel on the street .
<lotuspsychje> !info linux-image-generic xenial
<ubot5> linux-image-generic (source: linux-meta): Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version 4.4.0.96.101 (xenial), package size 2 kB, installed size 13 kB
<lotuspsychje> nice
<lotuspsychje> lets have a look at ubuntu news
<lotuspsychje> with a cold sprite, no coffee had too many salted pizza yesterday
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/ubuntu-and-gnome-devs-team-up-to-ease-your-unity-to-gnome-transition-517744.shtml
<lotuspsychje> morning EriC^^
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
<lotuspsychje> shot caller out on dvd :p
<EriC^^> nice
<Bashing-om> You-uns have fun without me . A pause here for the cause .
<ducasse> morning all
<EriC^^> lotuspsychje: i added a fun shit to the site
<EriC^^> i think maybe usually not have it, and sometimes put it
<EriC^^> http://youtubextras.com/watch?v=e1kP0NdRRJQ
<EriC^^> try adding one of the comments to the top useful list
<BluesKaj> Hi all
<lordievader> o/
<lotuspsychje> aftyernoon guys
<lotuspsychje> oerheks: im struggling with an old via135 tomtom update
<oerheks> oh, on ubuntu?
<lotuspsychje> oerheks: no plugged in my w7 and mydrive connect
<lotuspsychje> oerheks: but whatever i do it doesnt get recognized on system
<oerheks> :-(
<lotuspsychje> oerheks: device detection indictator shows, but mydrive doesnt
<lotuspsychje> bbl mate
<oerheks> I never updated a tomtom.. quick search does not show any info too
<lotuspsychje> oerheks: on ubuntu there's no solution yet right?
<oerheks> not that i know of :-(
<lotuspsychje> garmin worked on w7
<lotuspsychje> but i got a choice of 53 euro latest map or lifetime updates 83
<lotuspsychje> bbl guys movies
<immu> https://blogs.gnome.org/uraeus/2017/09/19/launching-pipewire/
<EriC^^> evening all
<Bashing-om> \o EriC^^
<EriC^^> hey Bashing-om o/
<EriC^^> how is the evening going?
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: Real slow all over for now . Subject to change :D
<oerheks> hi EriC^^, Bashing-om
<oerheks> ubuntu is boring, no issues
<daftykins> one of you could become a supervillain, breaking packages...
<oerheks> wicked
<oerheks> i'd like to break wine :-D
<Bashing-om> I am at "some point" - have not broke my system now in a long time :(
<oerheks> Bashing-om, lets install some desktop on top of unity, and then remove it :-D
<oerheks> har har
<xangua> Install unit
<xangua> Yunit
<oerheks> hey xangua good to read you again
<xangua> Sorry, I was under a rock
<Bashing-om> oerheks: HuH ! I have learned how not to break !
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-09-20
<lotuspsychje> good morning guys
<Bashing-om> exit - stage right \o
<lotuspsychje> welcome peet
<lotuspsychje> welcome japa
<lotuspsychje> here you can discuss freely
<Japa> peet, this one: https://www.cnet.com/g00/products/lenovo-thinkpad-t61p/specs/?i10c.referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.co.in%2F
<peet> thank you lotuspsychije
<lotuspsychje> np ; )
<peet> nice, model japa
<Japa> I guess it was top of the line 10 years ago.
<Japa> Still has a good screen
<Japa> and a front-lit keyboard
<peet> 10y ago whith 1920 screen
<Japa> I'm hoping sticking some linux version on there will be more stable than win10 was
<lotuspsychje> it surely will
<peet> ubuntu is good , change to ssd will be good
<lotuspsychje> lubuntu/xubuntu/mate
<Japa> Can't afford an SSD. If I could, I'd stick it in my desktop anyway
<lotuspsychje> morning EriC^^
<lotuspsychje> watched shot caller last night EriC^^
<peet> Japa, it's still ok but boot up time will be long.
<Japa> I can deal.
<lotuspsychje> !info preload | japa peet
<Japa> decided to go for xubuntu
<ubot5> japa peet: preload (source: preload): adaptive readahead daemon. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.6.4-2 (xenial), package size 34 kB, installed size 135 kB
<lotuspsychje> check this tool to make things even faster on light system
<peet> thank! lotuspsychje , ubot5 i will looking for that tool
<Japa> peet, it took me a while to get used to the DPI of that screen
<Japa> 1080 on a 15 inch screen means small everything
<peet> https://askubuntu.com/questions/472262/adapt-ubuntu-to-a-high-dpi-resolution-screen
<peet> may be that will be help
<Japa> Only if I'm using ubuntu unity, which I refuse to touch with a 10 foot pole
<Japa> seems xfce will have better support in the future, but itsn't there yet.
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: shot caller rocked, seen yesterday
<EriC^^> cool
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: worked further on your page yet?
<EriC^^> i added some stuff yesterday
<EriC^^> http://youtubextras.com
<EriC^^> i think i did the logos and stuff
<lotuspsychje> lets c
<lotuspsychje> cool EriC^^
<EriC^^> https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/910170831132745728/RLID2G2E_400x400.jpg
<ducasse> morning all
<lotuspsychje> nice one
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
<EriC^^> lotuspsychje: http://youtubextras.com/watch?v=Z-IH__81oyY
<EriC^^> i also added a loading gif
<EriC^^> touched up the search bar and stuff
<EriC^^> also try adding a comment to the useful ones
<lotuspsychje> yeah i did
<EriC^^> super mario sound?
<lotuspsychje> oh dont have sound on
<EriC^^> oh
<lotuspsychje> yeah lol
<lotuspsychje> cool find
<EriC^^> xD
<EriC^^> i want to add a discussion chat box now in the left bottom area, if someone is seeing the comments of a page he can chat with other people seeing the comments of the same page and help eachother out
<EriC^^> and logs are saved for others too
<lotuspsychje> lol cool
<EriC^^> did you see the movie mother of jennifer lawrence?
<EriC^^> wondering whether to see it or not
<lotuspsychje> no?
<EriC^^> seems shitty
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> im defenatly will go see your prison movie
<lotuspsychje> hope it hits theaters soon
<ducasse> so, how are you guys today? work today, lotuspsychje?
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: 3 days off, just noticed i have 6 days left at work :p
<ducasse> \o/
<lotuspsychje> gonna b splendid
<lotuspsychje> you doing ok ducasse ?
<ducasse> yep, still not fully awake. going to oslo today, got a doctors appointment.
<lotuspsychje> nothing serious i hope ducasse ?
<ducasse> no, nothing major :)
<lotuspsychje> good :p
<lotuspsychje> far travel to oslo?
<lordievader> Good morning
<ducasse> a little less than an hour.
<ducasse> \o lordievader
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: going by car or train?
<lotuspsychje> lordievader: morning mate :p
<ducasse> car :)
<lordievader> Hey lotuspsychje, ducasse
<lordievader> How are you two doing?
<lotuspsychje> great here
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: did you notice any screen issues on last artful update?
<ducasse> all good :) you?
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: no, but i haven't applied any updates since last night - let me see if there are any
<jink> 'sup, kids?
<lotuspsychje> i had edges gone on irc channel tabs, close/minimize buttons gone on windows and overal sluggishness opening programs from dock
<lotuspsychje> hey jink, morning
<EriC^^> lotuspsychje: what prison movie?
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: the one you showed me trailer of, escape, UK movie?
<EriC^^> lotuspsychje: oh, the maze
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: noticed its Xwayland again and not xorg now
<lotuspsychje> well on my gnome that is
<ducasse> oh, wow - "102 packages can be upgraded." that's only since last night... :)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<EriC^^> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<peet> pang!
<EriC^^> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<EriC^^> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<oerheks> :-)
<EriC^^> :)
<EriC^^> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<oerheks> noobie EriC^^ :-D
<EriC^^> hehe :D
<EriC^^> hey BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<BluesKaj> Hi EriC^^
<oerheks> hi BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hi oerheks
<oerheks> lets have some fun today
<BluesKaj> like?
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<BluesKaj> oops
<EriC^^> hi pauljw :)
<pauljw> morning EriC^^ :)
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<Bashing-om> pauljw: \o . Me just arriving also :)
<pauljw> hey Bashing-om :)
<Bashing-om> pauljw: Seeing what the day brings . kryten has provided a update for a irssi garbage script. Seeing what the changes are all about :)
<pauljw> ah
<Bashing-om> I just do not perl to well !
<daftykins> garbage script you say? does it part you from all help channels? ;D
<pauljw> lol
<pauljw> now that would be a keeper
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Well It can ! Hows your perl'n ? would you like the link ?
<daftykins> ah i don't know any language as it goes
<Bashing-om> daftykins: smartfilter is pretty nifty as default .
<pauljw> i've never been able to master irssi... happy with hexchat
<daftykins> ah it's great for me, left running with screen then i just detach and reattach when i SSH to my Linux server VM
<daftykins> even better since i culled a couple of channels recently, just alt+# to get between channels
<daftykins> in truth i don't really know the commands, i just hand edit ~/.irssi/config to change things :>
<Bashing-om> I messed about just a bit with GUI irc clients, when I installed irssi, I was home !
<pauljw> :)
<daftykins> i wish nickcolor.pl was a bit smarter for colourising nicknames though
<Bashing-om> daftykins: it's code - make it so if ya have that strong of a desire :) ( but it ain't me, Babe - no no no )
<immu> hi BluesKaj ducasse EriC^
 * nacc 's eyes are bleeding from writing manpages.
<daftykins> so it's you!
<nacc> (to be clear, manpages for git-ubuntu, so not helpful to that many yet)
<nacc> but writing in troff is the worst
<pauljw> heheh...
<oerheks> just found some trash ...
<oerheks> https://www.dropbox.com/s/lwdd8gcnkteil4v/yamaha-np-v60.JPG?dl=0
<oerheks> :-D
<oerheks> ..without proper adaper, ofcourse
<daftykins> wooooow!
<daftykins> and yet it's on, batteries?
<oerheks> yes, but i found a working adapter myself, got a lot of that stuff
<daftykins> ooh and i spy a drawer of HDDs :D
<oerheks> ehm, yes, 320's and 500's
<oerheks> 3 and 2
<oerheks> oh, and a fresh unformatted 250, seagate, i want that one to be my master music disc..
<oerheks> usually when i find a pc with the trash, i check on videocard, hdd, and other extentions..
<oerheks> if sata1 then dump else take 127.0.0.1
<daftykins> aww no love for SATA gen 1? :D
<oerheks> if agp then dump else check again
<oerheks> no, most of the time it is a small hdd.. nobody needs that
<oerheks> if lcd = hd-ready then run away
<oerheks> really, i do not understand why people do that..
<daftykins> which bit?
<oerheks> put  a working pc by the trash
<oerheks> or keyboard
<daftykins> mmm, here you have to take them to a proper electronic recycling place
<daftykins> although i keep hearing about people with old PCs who haven't dumped them because they are afraid to pay probably
<daftykins> even though you don't pay
<oerheks> :-D
<oerheks> same here..
<oerheks> but i am happy with this keyboard, maybe it is time to learn to play piano
<oerheks> now i need a proper stand
<daftykins> \o/
<daftykins> ironing board will do ;)
<oerheks> and i need to find a way to connect it to my pc, looking into ubuntu-studio
<oerheks> ironing board, you are a genius
<oerheks> i just finished ironing..
<daftykins> ah it wasn't Drabber's turn?
<oerheks> that is irony :-D
<oerheks> he likes sleeping on fresh laundry, true
<daftykins> :D
<oerheks> ahh, i found the culprit, 1 key broken... super glue!
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-09-21
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> hey nacc early wake?
<lotuspsychje> hi Bashing-om
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: 'lo .
<EriC^^> morning all
<lotuspsychje> hey hey EriC^^
<EriC^^> hey
<EriC^^> lotuspsychje:
<lotuspsychje> waky waky ducasse
<lotuspsychje> the big boys gonna mess with purism now:
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/09/gnome-foundation-gives-backing-purisms-linux-phone
 * ducasse yawns
<ducasse> morning all
<EriC^^> morning ducasse
<ducasse> hi EriC^^, how are you?
<EriC^^> good, you?
<ducasse> all well here :) raining outside, what a surprise...
<lordievader> Good morning
<ducasse> good morning lordievader, wb
<lordievader> Hey ducasse
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<ducasse> quiet morning in the rain, and you?
<ducasse> this is weird, forecast says "mostly sunny" with an image of a raincloud :)
<lordievader> It is rather sunny here, still a bit cold though.
<Bashing-om> Location: Heber Springs, AR ~ Cond: 70Â°F (21Â°C), Clear ~ Atmo: 100%, 3.0 mi (4.8 km), 29.98 in (1015 mb) ~ Wind: 0 mph (0 km/h), N, N/AÂ°F (N/AÂ°C) ~ Time: 1:55
<EriC^^> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<Bashing-om> That's all Folks - good night \o
<lotuspsychje> updating artful
<lotuspsychje> alot of new bugs here hmm
<lotuspsychje> hey TJ-
<ducasse> look! lotus is awake again! ;)
<TJ-> morning
<lotuspsychje> lol
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: how's you doing?
<lotuspsychje> im struggling with that via135 tomtom grr
<TJ-> huh? is that some support you're doing for someone?
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<TJ-> ahhh... I only just connected and only looked at this channel when I saw it highlighted
<lotuspsychje> i give up
<lotuspsychje> time for some artful bugs then
<BluesKaj> Howdy folks
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> hi lotuspsychje
<EriC^^> hi BluesKaj
<lotuspsychje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1718653
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1718653 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Windows buttons gone on specific programs" [Undecided,New]
<BluesKaj> Hi EriC^^
<BluesKaj> managed to reset my laptop up with UEFI and GPT after I had wiped it and ran it with msdos table and legacy mode. I finally found a mature and well thoughy guide to make the switch back happen
<BluesKaj> thought out guide rather
<EriC^^> BluesKaj: nice
<BluesKaj> was tempted to reinstall Windows 7 in a dual boot setup but I deecided not to push my luck :-)
<BluesKaj> don't think I'd use windows 7 much anyway
<lotuspsychje> brb reboot
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: I responded to your bug report
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: added an imgur also
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: that would make sense as other graphics stuff hapening to me also
<lotuspsychje> launching apps sluggish etc
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: I recommend you do what I did for some of those other program packages affected - look at their list of Depends, then link through to each package's Changelog and see what was most recently updated.
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: firstly though see if the package I suggest is Depends: for all the other packages you see problems with
<lotuspsychje> kk
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: I do it via http://packages.ubuntu.com so it is easy to click forward/back through links to Changelogs
<TJ-> I started a raspi dist-upgrade last evening... it's still going!
<BluesKaj> must be a slow cionnection  ;-)
<BluesKaj> btw, Hi TJ-
<TJ-> Hiya BluesKaj
 * TJ- is in-and-out today
<BluesKaj> right TJ-, same here
<EriC^^> lotuspsychje: did you see this movie? http://movienight.ws/the-hatton-garden-job-2017/
<lotuspsychje> no
<EriC^^> bank job based on true story, 7.8 imdb
<TJ-> Ahh, those fools. Went to all that effort and then got caught because of silly mistakes
<EriC^^> hmm imdb is actually 6.5/10 it's a lie on the site
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: lookin nicely
<TJ-> see the news on the BBC: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-35267787 "Hatton Garden raid 'was doomed to fail'"
<lotuspsychje> i love bank movies :p
<oerheks> hello, is there a ubuntu Nambia channel?
<TJ-> is it just me or are your eyes rolling too?
<oerheks> nvme .. fsck .. not sure what was going on
<TJ-> that'd just be the standard kernel messages appearing on the active console during boot
<oerheks> he ignored them, i think, and didn't mention..
<TJ-> anyone get the feeling it's us being tested here!?
<oerheks> Yes, maybe some canonical employee waiting for the 6 hr gong..
<nicomachus> just a little QA
<oerheks> but that keeps us sharp, determin what is going on needs some skills
<TJ-> And it wastes a lot of time
<oerheks> so TJ and Eric will soon have a letter at the doorstep to come in and talk about a job :-D
<TJ-> pfft
<TJ-> My reply would be "stuff it" :)
<TJ-> It's so ironic that in this age of apparent AI-ML everywhere, we still don't have even a basic framework built into the OS to solve these common issues
<TJ-> anyone fancy joining me in a start-up to build such a thing? I'm sure we could get angel investor funding of US$20M or so :)
<oerheks> in my opinion, ubuntu should remain 2 paths, 1 LTS and 1 rolling release..
<nicomachus> TJ-: I thought that was squoo.sh
<TJ-> And no support for rolling release
<TJ-> nicomachus: no, that's supposed to be open and free and off-PC based. I'm suggesting integrated into the init system, how about systemd.ai-fixit  :)
<oerheks> :)
<oerheks> "telnet towel.blinkenlights.nl"
<EriC^^> lol
<TJ-> Definitely winding us up
<immu> EriC^^,
<immu> EriC^^, hi
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-09-22
<ducasse> good morning all
<lordievader> Good morning
<ducasse> hi lordievader - how are you?
<lordievader> Hey ducasse, doing okay here. How are you?
<ducasse> i'm good, thanks. not much on the schedule today..
<EriC^^> morning lordievader ducasse
<ducasse> hi EriC^^ - all well?
<EriC^^> good here, thanks, you?
<lordievader> Hey EriC^^
<ducasse> i'm fine, catching up on news etc while things are quiet
<immu> hi alllll
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<EriC^^> hey BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hi EriC^^
<lordievader> Hey BluesKaj
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<BluesKaj> Hey lordievader, fine thanks and you?
<immu> hey BluesKaj EriC^^ lordievader ducasse :)
<BluesKaj> hi immu
<EriC^^> hey immu
<lordievader> Hey immu
<lordievader> BluesKaj: Doing good here :)
<immu> just had lunch, you all?
<lordievader> Same here ;)
<immu> anything to report comards?
<immu> eh?
<lordievader> Seeing as is stays quiet, I guess the answer is no.
<nacc> lol rhel5.5
<Bashing-om> nacc: Had my interest - up to that point . Not a thing I want to know about/how redhat does what ,
<oerheks> wait.. \0/ weekendsupport .. tin foil helmets on!
<ducasse> "i know this is the wrong place to ask, but i'm in such deep doodoo i don't care" - *plonk*
<oerheks> "i don't want to pay"
<oerheks> cpanel unreachable,... sure
<nacc> yeah, seems like a lot of issues there :)
<oerheks> grinn .. https://cloudfront.debian.net/debian/pool/main/o/openjdk-7/openjdk-7-jdk_7u131-2.6.9-3_arm64.deb
<oerheks> me so good bing-bing
<Bashing-om> oerheks: Bo substitute for knowledge :)
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-09-23
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> installing xenial .3 on a broken trusty box
<lotuspsychje> morning DJones
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: ^^ Things to do on a rainy Saturday morning ?
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: yes, working :p
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: my last 5 days wohoo
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: " my last 5 days " did you win the lottory ? LotusComputers doing that well ?? .
<lotuspsychje> hahaha
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: i mean before my new work :p
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Good I guess, but I sure could hope that forced labor was at an end for you.
<lotuspsychje> it sure will mate
<Bashing-om> and exit - stage right \o
<ducasse> morning all
<ducasse> hi lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> work guys later
<BluesKaj> hiyas all
<EriC^^> what a shitfest
<leftyfb> eh, he's running a project based on a dead project to begin with
<ducasse> why he's not just using kodi (or emby if he wants something closer to plex) is beyond me
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-09-24
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> DJones: seems like he was short minded..
<EriC^^> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<EriC^^> o/
<lotuspsychje> work guys
<ducasse> good morning all
<Ben64> lol
<Ben64> guy came in just to rant
<EriC^^> he's right though, about the channel being dead
<Ben64> i don't think that's accurate
<EriC^^> it's appauling really, spammers spam the channel, it's +r goes from 1900users to 1000
<Ben64> oh
<Ben64> that is low
<EriC^^> they basically won
<EriC^^> how so
<Ben64> no i mean low number
<EriC^^> the channel is +r nobody knew to linux is going to try registering and whatnot, you know how people would join and be like "what is this?" not anymore
<Ben64> will +r go away though
<EriC^^> it's been on for couple months i guess
<ducasse> not that long, maybe a month
<EriC^^> nah i think 2 at least
<Ben64> 92086 lines in #ubuntu August 2017
<EriC^^> i think it's just lazy, like killing the sheep cause of a bad wolf
<Ben64> 232196 lines in August 2016
<Ben64> :(
<EriC^^> or lets put the sheep in a concrete building and call it a day
<EriC^^> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<m4dh4tt4> came in to rant? i came in, asked a Q and spent 10 mins trying to help someone. You then assumed that a JPG i recovered was acquired illegally, ignored both questions on the table and then went afk. Last time i was here I spent like 30 hrs helping peeps and got nothing but greif. Your channels will die if you cant figure out whos being helpful and who needs your canned messages because its disturbing or intruding. I liked being here and
<m4dh4tt4> learnt a ton helping people but just know that pretending this place is full of juveniles is a little overboard especially at 2:00am and youre gunning for the only guy assisting others.
<m4dh4tt4> to clarify im not begging to stay
<m4dh4tt4> just stating facts
<EriC^> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<m4dh4tt4> ive read a ton about spam but havent seen any at all? do you guys mean elsewhere or here
<m4dh4tt4> also registered users is helpful because it ensures you're talking to same person
<ducasse> you obviously weren't here when it happened, mid-august was a huge flood of it
<m4dh4tt4> makes sense haha i come back on to a ton of warnings and no visible spam
<m4dh4tt4> was it a paticular vuln with link spamming or people just decided it was a great place to advertise all of a sudden?
<ducasse> cp links
<Ben64> m4dh4tt4: was a rant dude
<m4dh4tt4> Ben64, i do apologize for barking back
<Ben64> if you have a problem with ops theres #ubuntu-ops
<m4dh4tt4> im merely suggesting a little more lenency/positive encouragement to those with good intentions, do as you wish , its your show, i dont need to #ubuntu-ops ive said what i have to say
<Ben64> but it's not the right forum for that
<m4dh4tt4> as in like, right now
<m4dh4tt4> ?
<Ben64> it's like going to the cashier at a grocery store and yelling at them about what the manager did
<Ben64> they just work there man
<Ben64> they aren't involved with the operations
<m4dh4tt4> its like going to a grocery store, all cashes are open, but the guy on isle 9(you) says go to cash 1 cuz you only have 3 items and thats express,
<m4dh4tt4> its ok though i get it
<m4dh4tt4> youre more into the rules than you are dialogue eh
<m4dh4tt4> or resolution
<Ben64> well i'm not an op
<m4dh4tt4> wait wait
<Ben64> as a guy who hangs out in #ubuntu, it's weird to see someone come in and start complaining about something that happened months? ago
<m4dh4tt4> so ure not an op here and youre still telling me im off topic when theres ZERO other conversation being interrupted, ZERO people asking for help and its purpose is to improve channel relations?
<Ben64> oh so you just like being mad at people
<m4dh4tt4> i LEFT for 2 months and came back, was HELPING and within 3 mins youre making wild accusations/assumptions that my data recovery process on someones computer whom you dont know was illegal?
<Ben64> i made no such accusations
<ducasse> different guy, man, check your logs
<m4dh4tt4> and no, i dont like being mad, thats why i asked you to ban me cuz theres no sense in being in a channel with a person who negates the CORE PURPOSE to boost his ego
<m4dh4tt4> damn
<m4dh4tt4> i yam le fool
<m4dh4tt4> my bad
<m4dh4tt4> i just assumed that since you read the dialogue and tried to belittle the rant that you were same dude
<Ben64> reading through the scrollback it seems you overreacted
<m4dh4tt4> ya i did, apologized
<Ben64> i mean in #ubuntu
<m4dh4tt4> yep
<m4dh4tt4> cant apologize there, begged for a ban lolol
<Ben64> well, i'm confused
<Ben64> back to my graph making...
<Ben64> https://i.imgur.com/JbW3Ntz.png
<Ben64> there we go, freshly graphed graph
<Ben64> number of lines in #ubuntu by month
<ducasse> interesting
<Ben64> yeah i thought so
<EriC^> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<Ben64> should remove that +r i guess
<Ben64> but freenode needs to be better at killing spam
<Ben64> or that spammer just needs to die
<ducasse> the spam flood that triggered the +r seems to have happened around aug 17th, but the numbers have been dropping all year according to this
<EriC^> ducasse: nah it's been semi steady, around 2017 may it went down greatly
<EriC^> that's around the time of the +r , i remember the +r started when my dad was here for a visit, he came in early june
<Ben64> yeah it went really sharp down recently according to that
<Ben64> also, i have 5.6GB of irc logs
<EriC^> but there is a sort of deflection point the start seems odd
<EriC^> around 4th 5th month of 2017
<Ben64> i filtered out the joins and parts and stuff
<Ben64> it's also possible that my computer didn't log everything
<EriC^> !irclogs
<ubot5> Official channel logs can be found at https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ . LoCo channels are now logged there too. Meetingology logs at https://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/
<Ben64> hmm
<EriC^> yup it's way lower
<EriC^> wget -q -O- https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2017/09/06/%23ubuntu.txt | wc -l gives me 974
<EriC^> same for 2016 gives 2140
<Ben64> i get 2090 / 894
<Ben64> pretty close to the official record
<ducasse> i get the feeling this guy is trying to hide something...
<Bashing-om> ducasse: I trust your "feeling" :)
<BluesKaj> maybe he mucked up his grub wih one of those fix your grub apps that break your system
<BluesKaj> I fell into that trap back in the day
<BluesKaj>  /dev/sda0 ?
<ducasse> when asked for reliable info: "maybe i'll just sleep now and fix this tomorrow" - then he's gone
<BluesKaj> yup
<ducasse> grub seemed ok enough, it booted the kernel. i'm thinking his root fs had problems. impossible to say with no other info than "it's failed", though...
<Bashing-om> Nap time for me ! Back - later :P
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-09-16
<Qinglan> Hello everyone.I need some help.
<Qinglan> When I execute "apttitude upgrade" there is an error displayed:insserv: There is a loop between service plymouth and urandom if started.
<Qinglan> I'm a newbie and what should I do now?
<Bashing-om> Qinglan: Support is in the #ubuntu channel :)
<Qinglan> OK,thank you!
<Bashing-om> Qinglan: See you there :D
<Qinglan> Bashing-om: You are there too?
<Bashing-om> Qinglan: Yup :)
<Qinglan> Bashing-om: nice to meet you again:D
<Bashing-om> Qinglan: Still here even after all these years :P
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<Qinglan> Morning
<lotuspsychje> hey Qinglan
<EoflaOE> Hello Bashing-om
<Bashing-om> EoflaOE: :) Still working UWN - Got any comments to offer?
<EoflaOE> Bashing-om: In the Wiki? If so, I haven't seen it
<Bashing-om> EoflaOE: Yup - WIKI is up for review :P
<EoflaOE> Bashing-om: I will see it now.
<Bashing-om> EoflaOE: Great :D
<marcoagpinto> Heya
<lordievader> Good morning
<marcoagpinto> Morning!
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<marcoagpinto> lordievader!
<marcoagpinto> damn... I have been adding words to the GB speller since 5am
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I have no life
<TJ-> Do we have anyone with a Wikipedia account that can correct the pronunciation for Ubuntu that is currently there?  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:En-Ubuntu_pronunciation.oga
<SwedeMike> TJ-: how do you feel it should be pronounced?
<TJ-> SwedeMike: the proper way!
<SwedeMike> TJ-: and what way is that?
<TJ-> Ask Nelson Mandela  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HED4h00xPPA
<SwedeMike> TJ-: what country are you from?
<marcoagpinto> TJ-. "YouBuntu"?
<marcoagpinto> TJ-: "YouBuntu"?
<TJ-> SwedeMike:  what does that matter?
<SwedeMike> TJ-: what part of the pronounciation is it you object to?
<SwedeMike> the intial "o"?
<TJ-> BTW for those newish to Ubuntu, that is the video that was included in the Ubuntu installation images originally
<TJ-> SwedeMike: The wikipedia ogg file only sounds as "bunn" ... I also asked in #ubuntu and SpiritHorse confirmed that ogg file is just wrong
<SwedeMike> TJ-: my question is because depending on native language it makes it easier or harder to pronounce things in the way that it's done in another language.
<TJ-> SwedeMike: the example pronunciation should be correct is my point, which it is not
<SwedeMike> TJ-: correct in what aspect? Hyundai is pronounced widely differently across the world, and they use local pronounciation in their ads wherever they are.
<SwedeMike> if it's hard to say the initial "o" for a US speaker, are we going to endlessly complain about them saying it wrong?
<TJ-> Who's complaining?
<SwedeMike> TJ-: how do you pronounce Linux?
<marcoagpinto> SwedeMike: "L'I'Nux"?
<TJ-> Wikipedia is supposed to be defining the pronunciation, it includes the IPA but the media file is wrong
<marcoagpinto> or "leenux2?
<marcoagpinto> or "leenux2"?
<marcoagpinto> (without the "2")
<TJ-> Linux? the same way Linus does
<SwedeMike> I pronounce it the way Linus does, but trying to change the english speaking world into that pronounciation is just an impossible task.
<SwedeMike> so, I choose better tasks
<SwedeMike> TJ-: there is nothing stopping you from making a media file, create a wikipedia account, and upload it as a correction, and take that fight there.
<SwedeMike> it's all free, it only takes time.
<TJ-> What fight? you're the one creating an argument over this
<SwedeMike> TJ-: guess I just have too much experience with these kinds of name/pronounciation disputes.
<TJ-> There is no dispute. I asked someone else too, the ogg file only says/sounds "bunn" - unless you're hearing it differently that is wrong
<TJ-> in other words, there is no leading 'uh' and no trailing 'too'
<SwedeMike> TJ-: that's not what I am hearing. I am hearing u-bunn-tu
<SwedeMike> it sounds identical under firefox i Ubuntu and Chrome on MacOS. U-bunn-tu
<TJ-> SwedeMike: really? hmmm, SpiritHorse heard the same as me... how long duration is the file you're getting? 0.9 seconds?  I've downloaded it locally and its the same
<lordievader> I am hearing the same thing as SwedeMike
<lordievader> (Gentoo with Chrome)
<TJ-> Thanks! so, there's something wrong either with the download or VLC, and it doesn't just affect me
<SwedeMike> TJ-: md5sum 041d7ab3a14528c01f4810bd855e7786  En-Ubuntu_pronunciation.oga   same in vlc on Ubuntu, U-bunn-tu
<TJ-> SwedeMike: no wonder we had differing views on it!
<SwedeMike> TJ-: indeed!
<TJ-> SwedeMike: right, and I've just tested it on another PC and I hear the same as you
<TJ-> Hmmm, so download glitch for multiple people or something local?
<TJ-> If I upload my local file can you listen to it, see if you hear the problem?
<SwedeMike> TJ-: sure can do
<TJ-> https://iam.tj/projects/ubuntu/En-Ubuntu_pronunciation.oga.ogx
<SwedeMike> TJ-: they have the same contents, only different filenames (yours has an added .ogx). Your file sounds the same for me in vlc.
<SwedeMike> they have same md5sum
<TJ-> SwedeMike: this gets weirder!
<TJ-> I've just listened to that file on another PC and indeed it is correct
<SwedeMike> TJ-: my guess would be some kind of glitch in your driver/software that cuts off the first and last few tenths of seconds of the sound.
<TJ-> seems that way, it's VLC on Rasbian... doing some tests now
<TJ-> Going to try with audacity
<TJ-> helps when trying to install it not to call it audible !
<TJ-> Audacity has it correct... so something major going on with VLC
<lordievader> Are you sure they use the same audio interfaces?
<lordievader> Both direct PA, for example.
<BluesKaj> Hi all
<TJ-> aha! In VLC there's an option for Input/Codecs > Advanced > File Caching (ms) that defaults to 300. if I increase that to 2000 I hear nothing at all, if I reduce it to 100 I hear the 'too' as well but still not the 'Uh'
<pragmaticenigma> !restore-grub
<EoflaOE> Hello everyone
<akemlenovo> Hm, i have some speakers with only one jack, but i have 2 devices (a computer and a tablet-on a stand) that i like to connect to the speaker without having to unplug and replug the cable all the time, do you think i can use some sort of multiplexer so they get connected at the same time? I wonder if i could play both at the same time on the speakers.
<akemlenovo> It's regular analog jack 3.5 mm, but i think i never tried something like that.
<JanC> you could try to find a mixing panel...
<JanC> or maybe there are also devices that can just mix both sources together
<akemlenovo> Yeah, i found this https://tinyurl.com/y3h8yv54 but i wonder if it's mono input.
<akemlenovo> But it looks like it's what's needed, 2 inputs and 1 output, with some volume sliders.
<akemlenovo> I'll see, maybe i'll try, thx JanC.
<JanC> there might be versions without the sliders, but I guess they can be useful, and the price seems fairly low...
<JanC> akemlenovo: the cables they have in one of the images are all stereo
<BluesKaj> if the connector has a small black ring near the tip, then it's stereo
<JanC> analogue 3.5mm stereo jacks have 2 black rings
<TJ-> akemlenovo: a standard 3.5mm stereo 2-to-1 adapter will do that job (mix 2 inputs to one output)
<JanC> like https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8b/Audio-TRS-Mini-Plug.jpg/1280px-Audio-TRS-Mini-Plug.jpg
<akemlenovo> JanC, Good catch.
<BluesKaj> JanC, you're correct, my mistake ...haven't used analog in yrs so my memory fails me sometimes
<akemlenovo> TJ-, I was looking for something like that, but can't find it.
<TJ-> https://www.cablewholesale.com/products/audio-video-products/audio-video/product-phono-y1.php is an example with plenty of photos
<JanC> that's the opposite, it seems?
<TJ-> These are good in both directions, as in, 2 outputs to 1 input. With 1 output to2 inputs the signal gets halved so levels drop
<TJ-> I use these with the digital audio workstation to drive monitor speakers AND headphones. just have to increase volume on the speakers to compensate
<akemlenovo> Yeah, that's the opposite i'm looking for, 2 males, 1 for the laptop and 1 for the tablet and one femelle where i plug the speakers, so i can play music from both devices.
<OerHeks> i used to have logitech with 2 lines in
<akemlenovo> TJ-, Thanks i'll check and try.
<TJ-> akemlenovo: you would combine it with a female in-line to male in-line
<JanC> maybe https://www.cablewholesale.com/products/audio-video-products/audio-video-cables/product-30s1-35260.php
<TJ-> akemlenovo: usually with PCs you have green-capped 3.5mm stereo male-to-male inline cable/connectors ... so those would go from devicse to the splitter. Then a female-to-male cable/connectors from splitter to speakers
<TJ-> Device 1  <------> >--|
<JanC> or https://www.cablewholesale.com/products/audio-video-products/audio-video-cables/product-10a1-01206y.php
<BluesKaj> akemlenovo, here's a method to mix to to mono output in alsamixer https://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-newbie-8/alsa-mono-output-how-to-make-815094/
<TJ->             |-----> >----female-to-male----> Speakers
<TJ-> Device 2  <------> >--|
<JanC> no need for mono?
<BluesKaj> that would be the easiest method, you end up with dual on a stereo bus
<BluesKaj> dual mono
<JanC> output connector is stereo anyway
 * BluesKaj shrugs, ok this is silly
<akemlenovo> Ok...Thanks. BluesKaj no, it's for listening music sometimes so i need stereo on both sources.
<BluesKaj> maybe a bluetooth system might be better for your single speaker
<JanC> bluetooth speakers don't support multiple sources, I think?
<akemlenovo> I think it doesn't / Here it's oldschool speakers with RCA/jack no wireless. And only the tablet support BT anyway. But i'm not a big fan.
<JanC> yeah, BT usually gives delayed sound also
<BluesKaj> oh lord
<akemlenovo> It's an old desktop with no BT. :)
<JanC> which is okay for listening to music, but useless for watching video
<BluesKaj> you get a BT dongle for 20 bucks, i use on on my pc
<BluesKaj> one
<akemlenovo> Yeah i have one for Wifi.
<TJ-> akemlenovo: how about feeding the tablet's audio-out to the PCs audio-in-line and adding the pulseaudio loopback so you can have the incoming audio automatically sent to the output of the PC? that way only the PC needs connecting to the speakers... as long as the PC is powered on and running
<akemlenovo> TJ-, No, the PC is not running all the time. So it's annoying if it's needed to have the PC up to use the tablet.
<TJ-> akemlenovo: OK, so the splitter would be the easiest and cheapest option
<daftykins> oy foolish electricians of my clients removed the VDSL filter from the master telephone socket, bodged in a cheap one and then spliced his phone line in behind it - half the download speeds the past few months and the service drops when you use the landline
<daftykins> nothing worse than such sheer incompetence
<marcoagpinto> :((((((
<marcoagpinto> sorry to hear that
<daftykins> ah it's not my home so it's ok ;)
<daftykins> jsut made it into London for work
<marcoagpinto> :)
<daftykins> oops just too
<marcoagpinto> guys?!
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<marcoagpinto> I am the cola demon!!!!
<daftykins> ruh roh
<marcoagpinto> I want to go to bed soon to wake up at 5am and drink my cola while working on the GB speller
<marcoagpinto> :)
<JimBuntu> hi marcoagpinto
<marcoagpinto> JimBuntu: Hello dear one!
<marcoagpinto> the GB speller! :) better than M$'s
<JimBuntu> I think you only have about 17 minutes if you want to get 8 hours
<marcoagpinto> JimBuntu: most of the times I don't get 8 hours
<marcoagpinto> because when I wake up I can no longer return to bed... too anxious
<JimBuntu> Yeah, I seldom get 8, more like 2-4 hours.
<JimBuntu> What's the GB speller?
<marcoagpinto> The British speller
<marcoagpinto> I am the person resposible for it
<marcoagpinto> the old people vanished in 2006
<JimBuntu> Oh, ok, here I was thinking it couldn't be that obvious, lol
<marcoagpinto> responsible*
<marcoagpinto> I wanted to release an update for Proofing Tool GUI but I only added one feature since the last release so far
<marcoagpinto> all the trouble of compiling for Windows+Linux+update site+sign+sha512
<marcoagpinto> it is not worth the effort
<JimBuntu> ah, I see what you mean, time to script it up and include a little CI/CD
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I had the brilliant idea of creating an include file with functions common to all my projects
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> so that I don't need to copy/paste the functions all the time
<marcoagpinto> so, I only update one file and change the date in the include command
<phillipsjk> akemlenovo, did you consider male-male from the line out of computer 1 to the line in of computer2, then use the soundcard as a mixer?
<phillipsjk> nevermind read more back-scroll
<marcoagpinto> JimBuntu: This is the official page: http://proofingtoolgui.org/
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I have tons of ideas written on paper... I just need time to implement them
<marcoagpinto> written+drawn
<JimBuntu> time to implement is where the problem normally occurs, implement, quality control, document
<marcoagpinto> yes, the user guide sucks :(
<marcoagpinto> I don't explain well how some complex features work
<marcoagpinto> but I have the e-mails where I explained to its users, so I just need to copy/paste from there
<marcoagpinto> the future idea is also to create AU+CA+NZ+ZA spellers based on the GB
<marcoagpinto> so, I have created a feature that allows to remove -ize/-ise and other words from the .dic
<marcoagpinto> only to find out that some verbs in the .dic don't use the -ize/-ise but flags that generate them
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> so, I need to create a script to automatically convert
<marcoagpinto> it is in my TODO list
<marcoagpinto> yesterday I was completely nuts due to the depression and thought like a crazy guy... I wanted to put an end to things so I created a PDF of my thesis to share
<marcoagpinto> but today I am feeling better
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> "here is my s**** thesis"
<marcoagpinto> :)
<JimBuntu> I suspect using flags would be much better
<marcoagpinto> JimBuntu: yes, but there is an "excusion" field to avoid removing words with -ise/-ize that are real words
<marcoagpinto> exclusion*
<marcoagpinto> for example: "resize"
<marcoagpinto> resizes+resizing+resized
<JimBuntu> but is there an easter egg for funny spell-checking?!
<marcoagpinto> if I select to remove all -ize, it won't remove this verb
<marcoagpinto> JimBuntu: What is funny spell-checking?
<JimBuntu> When it swaps out various words for funny versions
<JimBuntu> A lot of mobile spell-check is terrible
<marcoagpinto> ahhhhh
<marcoagpinto> I only add the words... the engine is Hunspell
<marcoagpinto> the Easter Egg was Zuckenberg
<marcoagpinto> but I fixed it many years ago
<marcoagpinto> Zuckerberg*
<JimBuntu> lol
<marcoagpinto> I have a dream... a vision?... I want people to replace several commercial software with open-source on around 2021
<marcoagpinto> 2021 is a special year, just like 2012
<marcoagpinto> with spiritual meaning
<JimBuntu> marcoagpinto, I can only replace 1 item, as I only use 1 item that's commercial/paid
<marcoagpinto> well, "Like Linus Torvalds, I use the "best tool for the job", even if that includes proprietary software."
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I wrote this in the webpage
<lordcirth_> JimBuntu, what item is that?
<marcoagpinto> so, I have tons of commercial software
<JimBuntu> lordcirth_, Studio3T
<marcoagpinto> what happens to me is that I have to use commercial+open-source sometimes... for example: PaintShopPro lacks some features that GIMP has, so I need to use both
<JimBuntu> I used to like Paint Shop Pro, but it's been years
<marcoagpinto> well, I always buy the current version at 1/3 of the price when a new version is about to come out
<marcoagpinto> 2020 is or will be almost out, so they sold 2019 for a lower price
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> the same for Nero
<JimBuntu> smart.
<marcoagpinto> I bought the 2019 one when 2020 is almost out
<JimBuntu> Nero... for burning CD/DVD?
<marcoagpinto> yes
<marcoagpinto> basically to create .iso files
<marcoagpinto> I no longer write physical discs
<marcoagpinto> and to rip songs to .flac format
<JimBuntu> It sounds like Nero does more than it used to, lol
<marcoagpinto> ahhhh.. and I edit video with it too... I forgot
<marcoagpinto> :)
<JimBuntu> WHAT?! It edits video now too? It's been maybe 15 years since I think I used it, if I'm thinking of the right software
<marcoagpinto> yes, it edits video now
<marcoagpinto> very useful to cut parts of video, add background music, etc.
<marcoagpinto> and it exports in 4K too
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> but my machine is too slow for 4K
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhhh... now I can't remember if I saw "4K" in the settings
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> there is the express video mode... just drag'n'drop a video file and select the export format and it is done
<marcoagpinto> :
<marcoagpinto> :)
<JimBuntu> I think what I used for editing was called Premier
<marcoagpinto> in the 1990s I had Pinnacle Studio
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> or was it 2000s?
<JimBuntu> I remember that name, not sure if I really used it. Makes me think it came with DVD R/W drives or something
<JimBuntu> I think a CD R/W purchase is where I got Nero
<marcoagpinto> ahhhh.. my Pinnacle Studio came with an analogic board to capture video
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> then the board go damaged
<marcoagpinto> an horizontal line started appearing when I was capturing VHS tapes
<marcoagpinto> so, I gave up
<JimBuntu> Now you are bringing back memories. ATI Wonder tuners
<marcoagpinto> I used it to convert my recording of the UFO conference into two DVDs
<marcoagpinto> :)
<JimBuntu> Do you use Ubuntu on that machine as well?
<marcoagpinto> what?
<marcoagpinto> I only have VMs in the other laptop
<JimBuntu> ah, ok
<marcoagpinto> because this one doesn't support hardware virtualisation since it is too old
<marcoagpinto> even my course project runs badly here as it takes all RAM :(((((
<marcoagpinto> so, to test it I run it in the other laptop that has 8 GB RAM
<marcoagpinto> I will return at 5am... night all... take care
<Bashing-om> UWN596 is on the streets: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue596 :D
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-09-17
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<tomreyn> good middle of the night!
<lotuspsychje> tnx tomreyn
<tomreyn> ;)
<guiverc> sorry EoflaOE
<EoflaOE> what guiverc?
<guiverc> You'd asked a question of OP (#ubuntu) before I pressed enter, sorry for cutting you off...
<EoflaOE> guiverc: OK.
<guiverc> thanks tomreyn
<tomreyn> guiverc: you'Re welcome, but what for?
<guiverc> i got distracted with other things (#ubuntu), you stepped in & picked up the slack :)
<tomreyn> oh because i'm trying to help gebbione. :)
<tomreyn> they're a bit slow to respond, so that's no surprise
<marcoagpinto> Hello!!!
<marcoagpinto> the demon!
<Mathisen> https://itsfoss.com/richard-stallman-controversy/?fbclid=IwAR3SPS8gf-UE3fHJDF1byyOqtJ5hR4awAophY3Vbn-TchHXvy_zDm-pdhNk
<SwedeMike> seems like a good summary.
<lordievader> Good morning
<marcoagpinto> morning, lordievader
<lordievader> Hey marcoagpinto
<OerHeks> wait, what?
<OerHeks> Richard Stallman resigns from the FSF
<OerHeks> https://lwn.net/Articles/799375/
<ducasse> yep, the wolves were out for blood
<akemlenovo> Just after the conference @ Microsoft, that's a sign! :)
<OerHeks> any toe-nail-eaters who like to take the job?
<OerHeks> best person that comes in my mind is theo de raadt, bsd
<ducasse> that bcould be fuun
<ducasse> *could
<lordievader> <akemlenovo "Just after the conference @ Micr"> I think it was more about the things he said after all that.
<daftykins> just saw a piece on theregister.co.uk explaining all that
<lordievader> https://www.theverge.com/2019/9/17/20870050/richard-stallman-resigns-mit-free-software-foundation-epstein
<BluesKaj> Hi all
<marcoagpinto> BluesKaj: Hello!
<marcoagpinto> hey
<BluesKaj> hey marcoagpinto
<marcoagpinto> hey hey
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<marcoagpinto> I upgraded my WinZip and was creating a backup of my thesis folder
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> ~2 GB
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> 4 GB before compression
<BluesKaj> does it contain images
<marcoagpinto> yes
<marcoagpinto> but I had almost 200? versions of the previous 1000-+page thesis
<BluesKaj> that's a lot of data just the same
<marcoagpinto> since 2013 that I have been working on the old version, until the Professor said it looked like a s*** report
<daftykins> who can afford to burn that many years in education o0
<marcoagpinto> daftykins: I will only pay after the professor approves the thesis
<marcoagpinto> he said that his students don't have classes, they go directly to the exam
<marcoagpinto> but I don't know anymore :(
<marcoagpinto> and the scientific comittee gives the last word...
<marcoagpinto> they are the real power to decide
<lotuspsychje> fresh flamingo news https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=The-32-bit-Ubuntu-20.04-Debs
<TJ-> better to link to the discourse
<lotuspsychje> comes from my rss feeds TJ-
<TJ-> https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/community-process-for-32-bit-compatibility/12598
<TJ-> there was an ubuntu-annouce email about it earlier today
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-09-18
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<akemlenovo_> Morning lotus :)
<lotuspsychje> morning mate
<akemlenovo_> I had a look in my Wifi driver sources, it's pretty obscure with parts of hexa listing and structs etc... :)
<akemlenovo_> Some functions are small, but they have strange names with shortened names variables, they do something strange which feels like it's useless if you don't know the big plan of what's going on.
<akemlenovo_> Little to no comments and lots of pre-defined values that are very non intuitives :X
<akemlenovo_> I guess that if you want to hide a malware or trojan into this, it's an easy task! :P
<akemlenovo_> Object oriented is much more simple to track.
<lordievader> Good morning
<marcoagpinto> hello!!!
<lordievader> Morning marcoagpinto
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<marcoagpinto> well, I am kind of okay, and you?
<marcoagpinto> lordcirth_!
<marcoagpinto> ops
<marcoagpinto> lordievader*
<lordievader> Doing good here
<marcoagpinto> I am working on the GB speller
<lordievader> GB == Great Britain?
<marcoagpinto> yes
<marcoagpinto> so far I have removed 400+ duplicates
<marcoagpinto> :((((
<marcoagpinto> I had added 700 words this month... but with minus 400 it becomes 300 :(
<marcoagpinto> TOTAL_NEW_WORDS = TOTAL_CURRENT_WORDS - TOTAL_PREVIOUS_WORDS
<marcoagpinto> this is how I add the number of new words to the release notes
<lordievader> What do you mean with speller? Like a spell check or something?
<marcoagpinto> yes
<marcoagpinto> https://addons.mozilla.org/addon/british-english-dictionary-2
<lordievader> These kind of things do not already exist?
<marcoagpinto> yes, but I am the maintainer nowadays
<marcoagpinto> the old developers vanished in 2006
<marcoagpinto> Buaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
<marcoagpinto> it is a hard work, but someone has to do it
<marcoagpinto> I have been checking word by word and removing duplicates and merging flags
<marcoagpinto> lordievader: have removed 400 duplicates this month... so far, in all these years, I have removed some 3K :)
<lordievader> Pfff
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<marcoagpinto> hi
<marcoagpinto> :)
<akemlenovo> Hoi :)
<akemlenovo> marcoagpinto, let me guess...you are out of cola? :P
<akemlenovo> https://media.juiceonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/09134445/cocacolagarlicmeme.jpg agaisnt vampires, Transylvania is in Romania IIRC :)
<marcoagpinto> akemlenovo: yes, last night, but this morning I have already bought some
<marcoagpinto> :)
<akemlenovo> You got some stock, good! ;)
<marcoagpinto> so, right now I have drunk 2 cans and now am drinking a big bottle of 2 litres
<BluesKaj> hey marcoagpinto, akemlenovo
<marcoagpinto> BluesKaj!!!
<akemlenovo> Hi BluesKaj .
<BluesKaj> marcoagpinto, i feel badly for your liver and pancreas, all that sugar etc must be torture for them
<lordievader> You forget his teeth
<lordievader> ð
<BluesKaj> hey lordievader, i assumed he doesn't have his own teeth anymore
<lordievader> marcoagpinto: Have your teeth turned to cola already?
<lordievader> ð
<marcoagpinto> lordievader: almost
 * lordievader shivers
<marcoagpinto> it's the price one has to pay for freedom
<OerHeks> Fedora Linux 31 Enters Beta, Says Goodbye to 32-Bit Systems ..
<akemlenovo_> I guess soon 32b will be a thing of the past. But do you think there will be eventually 128b systems at some point?
<pragmaticenigma> I think you mean libraries? I thought they droped 32bit support for systems a long time ago
<akemlenovo_> Or we would stick with 64b for eternity? :)
<lordcirth_> There's a difference between dropping ISOs for 32bit CPUs, and dropping multilib
<lordcirth_> Ubuntu dropped 32bit ISOs a few releases ago, and is phasing out multilib
<pragmaticenigma> lordcirth_: mini.iso is still 32 bit
<OerHeks> https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/community-process-for-32-bit-compatibility/12598
<lordcirth_> No desktop or server ISO, though
<pragmaticenigma> What I'm more concerned with is were will those that wish to conntinue or require the use of 32 bit OSes turn to
<lordcirth_> LXC containers, hopefully.
<lordcirth_> Or similar things.
<pragmaticenigma> what I prefer though is bare metal ... I know eventually the power effeciency of these units will effectively be not cost effective
<akemlenovo_> TJ-, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1831751 There is still a leak, i reported it there - last message, should i report it somewhere else? I tried to have a look at the sources of the dkms you gave me but it's over complicated :P For now i keep it blacklisted and i use a tiny Wifi dongle instead.
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1831751 in linux (Ubuntu) "rtlwifi: aggressive memory leak" [High,Confirmed]
<jeremyb> akemlenovo_: can you patch the source code?  https://git.kernel.org/pub/scm/linux/kernel/git/next/linux-next.git/commit/drivers/net/wireless/realtek/rtlwifi?id=4c3e48794dec7cb568974ba3bf2ab62b9c45ca3e
<TJ-> akemlenovo_: sounds like more poor RTL code doesn't it?
<akemlenovo_> jeremyb, You are fast.
<akemlenovo_> jeremyb, i don't have the same source tree for me it's in /usr/src/rtlwifi-1.0
<akemlenovo_> But i modified it manually, i found the line to change.
<jeremyb> akemlenovo_: Not a kernel problem if you are using Larry Fingers github
<akemlenovo> I see, i didn't know it.
<akemlenovo> I have modified the code however i have an issue is that it does not rebuild the driver:
<akemlenovo> sudo dkms build rtlwifi/1.0
<akemlenovo> Module rtlwifi/1.0 already built for kernel 5.0.0-27-generic/4
<jeremyb> But the problem likely exists in the kernel if that commit exists
<jeremyb> sudo dkms install rtlwifi/1.0 -k $(uname -r)
<akemlenovo> But i've change the code so it should rebuild? also there's no "clean" or whatever like in regular makefiles.
<TJ-> akemlenovo: dkms remove first
<jeremyb> Actually you might have to do> sudo dkms uninstall rtlwifi/1.0 -k $(uname -r)
<jeremyb> TJ-: doesn't dkms remove delete the /usr/src/ directory for it?
<TJ-> jeremyb: never
<TJ-> it just removes the stuff under /var/dkms
<TJ-> sorry, /var/lib/dkms/
<akemlenovo> Yeah it works after a remove, it rebuild now, thanks.
<akemlenovo> No i just read a bit more about the patch and the file it's in, it will change only for debug mode, the file is called debug.c and there is a global "#ifdef CONFIG_RTLWIFI_DEBUG" on the whole file, so i'm not in a debug mode afaik, the leak must be something else.
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-09-19
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<marcoagpinto> Hello
<marcoagpinto> next month's 19.10!!!!!!!!!!
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<marcoagpinto> I can hardly wait
<lordievader> Good morning
<marcoagpinto> lordievader: morning!
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<lordievader> ð
<marcoagpinto> I have been up since 4am working on the GB speller
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> it is a hard job but someone has to do it
<ducasse> good morning
<marcoagpinto> hey hey
<marcoagpinto> :)
<ducasse> \o
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<marcoagpinto> BluesKaj!!! Hello!!!
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<marcoagpinto> it is the cola demon here
<BluesKaj> Hi marcoagpinto, yes I'm aware of that
<akemlenovo> Hey BluesKaj, marcoagpinto.
<marcoagpinto> akemlenovo!!!! :)
<BluesKaj> hi akemlenovo
<marcoagpinto> the weekend is soon and I am becoming stressed already
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> lol
<marcoagpinto> I have been stressed for months, so no big news
<BluesKaj> too much cola !
<marcoagpinto> :)
<pragmaticenigma> I will never understand why people still think you can just willy nilly remove services on boot to speed up a system... 45 seconds... oh noes... I can't wait a whole 45 seconds for my machine to boot, i might like get distracted by a newspaper or go for a walk
<pragmaticenigma>  /sarcasm
<EoflaOE> Hello everyone and marcoagpinto
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE!!!! Hello!
<EoflaOE> Hello! How are you marcoagpinto?
<marcoagpinto> stressed... and you?
<marcoagpinto> :p
<EoflaOE> Doing fine
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: Any news about the GB speller, and others?
<marcoagpinto> yes, I have been adding words since 4am
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> then, I decided to commit the daily changes to GitHub
<marcoagpinto> https://github.com/marcoagpinto/aoo-mozilla-en-dict
<EoflaOE> Nice. I will check the repo.
<marcoagpinto> "7 hours ago"
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhh... 7 hours ago? I can't remember how many it was
<marcoagpinto> :p
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: Nice folder scheme. I hope that all spelling checkers will use yours. If I got time, I will look to improve it.
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> it is already in LibreOffice, so Ubuntu uses it
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> at least if the language pack is installed
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: OK.
<marcoagpinto> https://i.imgur.com/IkgnM0b.png <- the 2018 oldest wordlist is still being viewed massively... people want to know if I am cheating
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> this month statistics
<marcoagpinto> :)
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: Nice. By the way what software did you use to get statistics so I can do the same for my KS project?
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: I don't use software... it appears in the options of the host provider
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I just click "view statistics" or whatever
<marcoagpinto> :)
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: OK, and what host provider?
<marcoagpinto> next to "upload files" or so
<marcoagpinto> dotster
<EoflaOE> Good.
<EoflaOE> Have you seen the new Ubuntu wallpaper?
<marcoagpinto> yes? last week or two weeks ago?
<marcoagpinto> :)
<pizzaiolo> o/
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: Last week approximately.
<marcoagpinto> ahhhhhhhh
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<EoflaOE> And hello pizzaiolo
<marcoagpinto> hello pizzaiolo
<pizzaiolo> marcoagpinto interesting project!
<marcoagpinto> thanks
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: And what are your thoughts about this new wallpaper? I might put the white and black version of the wallpaper on my blog background, because text are gray, but I will have to save it as draft first to see if the text colors would make reading hard or not.
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: could you tell me the url again?
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: https://eofla.wordpress.com/
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: it looks very good, but grey text is hard to see... can't you make the text black?
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: Using the current theme, no. Also, only some premium themes have text color changing feature.
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhhh
<marcoagpinto> sorry to hear that
<marcoagpinto> regarding the English spellers, I only commit them to Gerrit every six months (for each new LibreOffice upgrade), so I will only commit them on 1-NOV for LibreOffice 6.4 to be released in January
<marcoagpinto> they means that people are always outdated, except if they download and install the .oxt manually
<marcoagpinto> it seems that backporting the spellers give too much trouble :(
<marcoagpinto> that is what I was told
<marcoagpinto> they mean=this means*
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: OK. Nice.
<marcoagpinto> what this means is that if you upgrade to LibreOffice 6.4 in January you will have Nov'2019 version :(
<marcoagpinto> 6 months outdated
<marcoagpinto> :((((((((
<marcoagpinto> ops?
<marcoagpinto> wrong calculations?
<marcoagpinto> only 2 months outdated?
<marcoagpinto> Nov, Dec, Jan
<marcoagpinto> my brain is all toasted...
<marcoagpinto> I can't think properly
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: OK. Do you know there are PowerPoint operating systems (a slideshow that represents the design and concept of the OS)?
<marcoagpinto> no
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: They use "Go to next slide after" feature, macros, shapes, images, and everything. In the end, this is just a presentation that runs like an OS.
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhh
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> to my thesis defence, I will have the powerpoint file plus a PDF with them
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> in case the room's Office damages the formating
<marcoagpinto> like it happened in the Military Academy in 2012
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I had a normal powerpoint file (not .x) and it got all damaged
<marcoagpinto> so, at home I printed to PDF and used the PDF
<marcoagpinto> I didn't risk to create a .x
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> but now the slides are 16:9 and I have made some tests and there is a lot of blank space in each page
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: Yes. Sadly, PowerPoint OS's are the lowest priority of mine, because I don't work on them oftenly.
<marcoagpinto> ahhh.. they let me go to the room before the defence.. two or so days before... so I noticed the formating was all damaged
<marcoagpinto> http://proofingtoolgui.org/proofingtoolgui_files/Ciberterrorismo_slides_VersFinal.pdf
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I will place a PDF with the PhD after the defence too
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: I am going to the bathroom and go back and look at the PDF file.
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: oki
<marcoagpinto> I am going to rest a bit soon... just waiting for mum to exit the bathroom
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> she takes two hours in the bathroom :p
<marcoagpinto> lol
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: Well-designed. This design reminds me of old things. However, the content is in Spanish.
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: in Portuguese, you mean
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> but the PhD slides will be in English
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: OK. Thanks for correcting me, though.
<marcoagpinto> Buaaaaaaaaaaaa... the PhD slides look so good... I just wish I finish the course to make them public
<marcoagpinto> :(
<EoflaOE> I hope that you finish everything.
<marcoagpinto> nap time... bbl... take care everyone
<marcoagpinto> :)
<akem__> Bon appetite :)
<EoflaOE> Take care marcoagpinto
<lotuspsychje> anyone ordered lubuntu trolls?
<lordcirth_> lotuspsychje, ?
<lotuspsychje> lordcirth_: dollarwoman repeating xubuntu vs lubuntu polls all day now :p
<lordcirth_> Ah
<EoflaOE> So many trolls these days lotuspsychje.
<lordcirth_> I don't think it's a troll, just flailing.
<lotuspsychje> EoflaOE: sure is
<OerHeks> running ubuntu on a doorstopper?
<lordcirth_> Yup. ESL, little technical knowledge, ancient hardware. Fairly common profile for flailing about.
<OerHeks> so sad if that old machine catches fire..
<EoflaOE> I have my old machine that survived from years, but the hard drive will fail after ~3 years
<pizzaiolo> i'm on my second battery on my xps 13
<pizzaiolo> first one expanded after about 2.5 years
<daftykins> sounds like bad luck
<pizzaiolo> daftykins i think it might be more than that, there's a couple of reported cases
<daftykins> that doesn't make any sense, because there'd be a lot sold versus 'a couple' gone wrong :)
<akemhp> My old Thinkpad hinge broke on the plastic part it's screwed on, they are not so solid in fact...
<akemhp> They look sturdy, but in thoses places where it's very important it's not so good.
<akemhp> Anyway i'll get another one, same model soon i think.
<marcoagpinto> Stairway to heaven!!!! The greatest song in the world!!!
<daftykins> hmm that happened on a client's son's Ideapad, which are definitely cheap versus thinkpads... plastic mounted onto metal
<daftykins> i found a cheap case online and fixed it up, but he seems to have given up on the machine now
<daftykins> very disappointing
<akemhp> daftykins, yeah it sucks, since everything else is working on the machine. Might look for a case, but it's an old machine, and the plastic is not very time proof apparently.
<daftykins> should be pretty cheap, that's the good thing about thinkpads... tonnes of spares around
<akemhp> Yeah, it's about 15 euros.
<JanC> I've had many laptops where a screen hinge broke
<JanC> that didn't happen with laptops from 20-30 years ago, so it's not an impossible engineering problem...
<akemhp> Cheap materials...weak attaches :/
<JanC> it's not necessarily cheap materials, but maybe trying to make laptops lighter & thinner...
<akemhp> Yeah, that too.
<jeremyb> ham fisted owners
<akemhp> THey want it as thin as possible.
<JanC> you know, the "my laptop is 0.5mm thinner & 50g lighter than yours" stuff
<JanC> I'd rather have it 0.5mm thicker & 100g heavier if it would actually survive more than 2 years  :)
<jeremyb> with a built in parachute
<JanC> no need for that; 1990s laptops didn't have that either
<jeremyb> They could at least have a handle on them
<JanC> I've only seen handles on some 1970s & 1980s laptops  :)
<jeremyb> Those big old things
<JanC> but those were suitcase-sized
<jeremyb> spare tires on cars are smaller than what they were
<daftykins> think i'm just gentle with my equipment
<JanC> it's amazing that Xerox sold laptops with ethernet and a GUI OS in the 1970s though...
<JanC> even if they sold them at $1mln or something like that  :-)
<JanC> (I think they sold less than 10)
<TJ-> someone give me a bug to fix! anything has got to be easier than having to read 140 pages on how setup and run a degree-level apprenticeship programme :s
<jeremyb> rtl8812au-dkms with the messed up dkms/Makefile
<TJ-> is that in the archive?
<TJ-> I've got 3 alternatives here :)
<jeremyb> TJ-: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rtl8812au/+bug/1820897
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1820897 in rtl8812au (Ubuntu) "USB wifi adapter module does not work after version update" [Undecided,New]
<jeremyb> Link that fixes both https://launchpadlibrarian.net/330175838/rtl8812au-4.3.8.12175.20140902+dfsg.patch
<TJ-> looks like the offered patch is intended to fix it but the user hasn't come back to confirm it solves the issue.
<TJ-> I don't know why there isn't an autopkgtest for all DKMS to flag/reject poorly written Makefiles
<jeremyb> TJ-: I just used the dkms.conf part of that before it was written, back in 2016 and it fixed the issue
<jeremyb> -MAKE="'make' all"
<jeremyb> +MAKE="'make' all KVER=$kernelver"
<TJ-> That just needs the kernel team poking I think
<jeremyb> The new module without the fix would always have the old kernel listed in the vermagic for the new kernel
<TJ-> well not necessarily, it'd have the *running* kernel. Only changing dkms.conf in that rtl example shouldn't alter that since the Makefile is doing a simple expansion :=  not a conditional :? -- conditional assignment only applies if the variable isn't already defined
<jeremyb> TJ-: I can just report what my results were.  The package as is if I updated a kernel from 4.15.0-35 to 4.15.0-36 the rtl8812au module in /lib/modules/4.15.0-36-generic would have vermagic 4.15.0-35-generic
<TJ-> I realise that, what I'm getting at is that only changing dkms.conf shouldn't "fix" it since that only sets KVER... which in Makefile when it does "KVER  := $(shell uname -r)" (simple assignment) replaces what was set in dms.conf by the running kernel version. dkms.conf change needs the "KVER  ?= $(shell uname -r)" in Makefile which is the conditional assignment (only if KVER wasn't set on the 'make'
<TJ-> command line)
<jeremyb> TJ-: It confuses me as I made dkms packaged prior to Ubuntu 16.04 that worked without a lot of this and it seems to be needed now.
<TJ-> I think it may be due to changes in DKMS' plumbing
<jeremyb> Some major changes
<jeremyb> TJ-: I see you are active in #ubuntu right now, so I will leave for now
<TJ-> I see a couple of patches that might be implicated, 0013 and 0016
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-09-20
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<lordievader> Good morning
<marcoagpinto> Hello!
<EoflaOE> Hello marcoagpinto
<marcoagpinto> hey hey
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<marcoagpinto> I have been working on the GB speller for ~2 hours
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> what's up?
<EoflaOE> Everything is fine marcoagpinto. How about you?
<marcoagpinto> well, right now I am feeling fine and drinking my cola bottle
<marcoagpinto> :)
<EoflaOE> Nice bottle. I have made changes to my blog. Sidebar and site wallpaper
<marcoagpinto> cool
<marcoagpinto> yesterday, when I said that grey font was hard to read, I was referring to the site wallpaper
<marcoagpinto> :)
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: Now, can you read gray text using the new wallpaper?
<marcoagpinto> let me check
<marcoagpinto> Buaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
<marcoagpinto> yes, but the previous wallpaper looked better
<marcoagpinto> there were just the grey issue
<marcoagpinto> were=was*
<EoflaOE> OK.
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<marcoagpinto> BluesKaj: Hello!!!! I was buying cola
<BluesKaj> hi marcoagpinto, of course you were ...
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<fallenour> Snaps are evil, and are breaking ubuntu, #prove me wrong
<lotuspsychje> its the users choice fallenour
<lotuspsychje> if you dont want snaps, dont use them?
<fallenour> I cant choose, thats part of the issue lotuspsychje. The last LXD update for packages is 2.X, snap is 3.X
<lotuspsychje> !latest
<ubot5> Packages in Ubuntu may not be the latest. Ubuntu aims for stability, so "latest" may not be a good idea. Post-release updates are only considered if they are fixes for security vulnerabilities, high impact bug fixes, or unintrusive bug fixes with substantial benefit. See also !backports, !sru, and !ppa.
<fallenour> Id upgrade instantly, melt the sun, freeze the North, whatever it took to make it work, but theres just not a solution it seems for 16.04LTS, and I havent seen one for 18.04LTS either.
<fallenour> I mean latest stable, not latest latest, I rarely if ever install those.
<lotus|i5> or consider moving up a higher ubuntu version
<fallenour> if itll fix it, id move to 19.04
<fallenour> I have images for 18.04 atm
<lotus|i5> non-lts isnt really reccomended for server production
<fallenour> 18.04, or 19.04?
<lotus|i5> 18.04 = lts  19.04 non-lts
<fallenour> Im going to risk upgrading one of my ha primary storage controllers to test
<fallenour> Ill try literally anything
<lotus|i5> upgrading what to what?
<fallenour> ill even try sysadmin cat, which would probably work best. 16.04LTS > 18.04LTS
<fallenour> Im super paranoid about snaps because of all of the issues they cause, as demonstrated here.
<fallenour> ok now this is just... its saying theres no upgrade for 16.04 to 18.04, that just simply cant be right
<fallenour> whats everyones general experience with MaaS > Juju > <systems>
<akemhp> My USB Wifi dongle was google while the computer was not moving, but that i move it around a bit, it's not so good in fact.
<tomreyn> looks like you have an imperfect auto correction which things that google is an inherently good thing there
<tomreyn> *thinKs - apparently i don't have auto correction
<akemhp> :D
<akemhp> I didn't even notice.
<TJ-> I thing when somethink is spult incorectly its moor entraining
<akemhp> And i skipped the "now" too.
<akemhp> Hehe
<TJ-> Anyone got serious with SDN/Openflow and have opinions on hardware?
<tomreyn> i could repeat what i think i suggested last time you asked something that was above my pay grade: /join ##networking. but then you already did, just didn't ask *this* question there.
<tomreyn> i thnk the last network guy who i feel really knows what he does *and* liked SDN was happy with a mix of juniper and arista
<tomreyn> *guy i met / knew
<TJ-> I'm going lowbrow... looking at the NorthBound Zodiak GX all F/OSS and the earlier FX was a kickstarter project that worked in conjunction with a RasPi
<tomreyn> those whose USP is "PRICE INCLUDES FREE SHIPPING!!111"
<tomreyn> looks liek they're sold out?
<tomreyn> i guess you can build those yourself based on pcengines apu2, though
<TJ-> possibly but it isn't urgent; I'm designing a BSc degree level apprenticeship course that has a large networking component and want to make SDN the core and give students real hardware to work with
<tomreyn> where can i register?
<tomreyn> looks like development is complete. https://github.com/NorthboundNetworks/ZodiacGX
<TJ-> for security it's all paper based :D
<TJ-> write your encrypted packets on paper aeroplanes and throw them :p
<tomreyn> ah, too, bad, i don't use paper anymore for ecological reasons. (i only buy ikea shelves).
<TJ-> yes, folks have got their hands on GXs, presumably they're manufactured in batches
<TJ-> more seriously... you've given me an idea. Maybe we can deliver some of the course using remote learning (if students can obtain the hardware themselves or we sell it) - only been thinking in terms of delivering this through employers (like us) who want to train people rapidly and with depth and quality
<tomreyn> webinaaaah!
<tomreyn> it could certainly be nice to offer this to a brader audience, yes.
<tomreyn> *brOader
<TJ-> It could make it more profitable for us for sure and it'd obvisouly scale well - though we'd have to think through how we'd manage demand for personal supervision to keep students on-track and motivated
<tomreyn> i can see how this instantly blows up the size of this project
<TJ-> Well I was already planning on using ATutor/AContent to deliver and manage the courses and that purposed-designed for web delivery. I contributed some patches to those projects a few years ago. I recall relatively recently the retiring Professor appealing for a new maintainer but at the time didn't have a reason to volunteer... shall have to revisit that
<tomreyn> i never heard of those before, but i'm not really into this kind of software. by the looks (web design, urls) atutor must have been developed during php3 times originally.
<tomreyn> it's also full of XSS :-/
<tomreyn> and probably worse
<tomreyn> yes, sqli too
<tomreyn> that'd be a lot of work
<TJ-> yeah .... interia and technical debt. Patches are still flowing in from other devs to fix CVEs though. Probably better to choose Moodle since it has a much more active dev community
<TJ-> Originally I didn't like it due to what it was based around, or language/framework. Cannot recall now what my precise objection was
<tomreyn> moodle had the same issues, and apparently still has to a degree, but it's been under a lot more scrutiny already, due to the larger user base, i agree.
<tomreyn> the other day i read someonthing about a newly done open source web conferencing with a focus on education, which looked good, and also had seemed to have more orginizing features. but i already forgot the name.
<TJ-> I hope it was built around jitsi :)
<tomreyn> i don't really know, but that's what i was thinking of, too
<tomreyn> the new jitsi thing looks great
<tomreyn> hmm i can't seem to find it anymore.
<TJ-> It is... deploying it for a conference room and for remote health/doctor consultations
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-09-21
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<akemhp_> Hey.
<marcoagpinto> [10:29] <marcoagpinto> I spoke with my boss and she "offered" the two weekends left of this month until I go to the doctor
<EoflaOE> Hello marcoagpinto
<marcoagpinto> Hi
<EoflaOE> How are you marcoagpinto?
<marcoagpinto> I am depressed... what else is new?
<marcoagpinto> and you?
<marcoagpinto> :)
<EoflaOE> I am excited to see that I have fixed the chat function so it works properly, like in text-based messages.
<EoflaOE> messaging*
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: I have to study and come back.
<marcoagpinto> oki
<marcoagpinto> :)
<BluesKaj> Howdy folks
<marcoagpinto> BluesKaj! Hello!
<BluesKaj> hi marcoagpinto
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: I am back
<EoflaOE> And hello BluesKaj
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: !!!!
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto!!!
<EoflaOE> How are you?
<marcoagpinto> well, I am here
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I tried to lie down a bit but can't sleep
<marcoagpinto> :)
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: Do you know that I have fixed the chat function taking turns?
<marcoagpinto> the what?
<EoflaOE> The chat program that runs server-side on KS (networked debugger)
<marcoagpinto> :)
<EoflaOE> However, I am releasing it now. After few minutes, you should be able to install the new version.
<marcoagpinto> how?
<marcoagpinto> in Ubuntu?
<marcoagpinto> I have the other laptop in the closet since I should be at work on the weekend
<EoflaOE> If you are going to install it through Ubuntu, install Mono Runtime and the dependencies listed on KS's README.md on GitHub.
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> my VMs are in the other laptop, inside the closet
<EoflaOE> After it, navigate to the directory that has "Kernel Simulator.exe" in it, and run mono "Kernel Simulator.exe".
<marcoagpinto> OerHeks!!!!
<OerHeks> hi marco
<marcoagpinto> Hello
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: The new version is now published.
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> good to know
<EoflaOE> Yes.
<OerHeks> awesome game, popey https://snapcraft.io/bombsquad
<EoflaOE> OerHeks I know it for a very long time
<popey> It is awesome
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: Ubuntu 19.10 beta will be out for a few days. Do you want to try the beta out when it's out?
<marcoagpinto> sorry... I was bathing, then I tried to reply and got disconnected
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: I only use Ubuntu for Proofing Tool GUI (compile + test)
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> and I have a VM just for Tor to use in xhamster
<marcoagpinto> :)
<daftykins> that's... not appropriate
<marcoagpinto> I know
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> it is the truth
<marcoagpinto> sorry for telling you
<daftykins> have a read of the channel topic again
<marcoagpinto> yes
<marcoagpinto> sorry
<marcoagpinto> I am sorry
<lotuspsychje> good evening to all
<marcoagpinto> hello lordievader
<marcoagpinto> lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hi
<EoflaOE> Good evening lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey EoflaOE
<EoflaOE> How are you?
<lotuspsychje> all good on this side of the world
<marcoagpinto> What is ZSTD?
<marcoagpinto> "NEW! Experience better Zipx Compression
<marcoagpinto>     Compress your Zipx files smaller and faster. WinZipâs new compression method for Zipx format is based on ZSTD. That means you can use it to compress and decompress many file types faster, while achieving compression rates better than DEFLATE and DEFLATE64."
<marcoagpinto> I tried v24 and I got the same filesize?
<marcoagpinto> what does Ubuntu use?
<daftykins> nobody uses winzip :D
<marcoagpinto> yes, but "ZSTD"?
<marcoagpinto> :)
<daftykins> uninteresting
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhh
<marcoagpinto> :(
<JanC> ZSTD is more commonly used for compressed filesystems & such
<marcoagpinto> JanC: ohhhhhh... what is the highest compression available?
<JanC> I'm not sure Ubuntu uses ZSTD for .deb packages now (it was proposed some years ago)
<JanC> marcoagpinto: compression like xz will get you better compression, but it's also much slower
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhhhhh...
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> xz?
<marcoagpinto> should I suggest to WinZip developers?
<marcoagpinto> I had a .zipx of my homepage with V23, then installed V24 and compressed and they are identical in size
<tomreyn> https://community.centminmod.com/threads/round-3-compression-comparison-benchmarks-zstd-vs-brotli-vs-pigz-vs-bzip2-vs-xz-etc.17259/
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhh
<marcoagpinto> tomreyn!!!! Let me check!!!!
<tomreyn> i'm not sure how useful those benchmarks are, not really into compression.
<EoflaOE> I have to sleep marcoagpinto. Good night
<marcoagpinto> oki
<marcoagpinto> take care EoflaOE!
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> sleep tight
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhhhh
<marcoagpinto> tomreyn: pxz is the best
<marcoagpinto> below it is the zstd
<marcoagpinto> :(
<tomreyn> for which use case?
<marcoagpinto> the tables were too many, so I looked at the bottom graphic
<marcoagpinto> time vs compression
<OerHeks> i 'd like a fair compression with some recovery features
<marcoagpinto> OerHeks: isn't recovery "codable"?
<marcoagpinto> but the WinZip said that it now uses the ZSTD blah blah and it gets the same filesize?
<marcoagpinto> :(
<OerHeks> sure, but at cost of lower compression level
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhhhhh :(((((((((
<OerHeks> "same filesizes".. i wonder if that is true for all formats.
<OerHeks> video, audio, just code, text, ..
<marcoagpinto> OerHeks: I only tried for my homepage
<marcoagpinto> the .zipx is around 86 MB
<marcoagpinto> I tried creating a new one with V24 and was exactly the same byes
<marcoagpinto> bytes*
<OerHeks> i did some compression for my old homepage too, from 1.7 mb https://www.dropbox.com/s/dw4bsbl16gtzxtd/Moon_Hypersaturated.jpg?dl=0
<OerHeks> to 102 kb, without distortion https://www.dropbox.com/s/7xquh7dk8z1l3vv/Moonn.jpg?dl=0
<marcoagpinto> OerHeks: I too noticed that my cellular makes photos 2MB (or is it 4MB) big, while Iphones make it 200-300 kB?
<tomreyn> you need to take into account all of time, cpu, memory used to compress to a certain compression ratio, and also to decompress. for something like .deb distribution you could possibly accept somewhat higher time, CPU, RAM usage while compressing (centrally, on well equipped servers) while you'd need low resource consumption while decompressing on some (possibly badly equipped) client. 1 GB RAM is already way too much on the decompressing
<tomreyn> end.
<marcoagpinto> maybe they have a better codec?
<marcoagpinto> and if iPhones have an enhanced codec, why doesn't Android uses it too?
<JanC> marcoagpinto: photo file size depends on resolution & quality
<JanC> codec also, but much less so
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhh
<akemhp> Now on linux i don't know why they always came with crazy names like rc.local instead of autoexec or something like that. Or textmode instead of multi-user.target, it's stuff you can't remember easly because it's not obvious.
<akemhp> Like why do we have /etc it could be /config lots of weird linux naming.
<marcoagpinto> JanC: just like photoshop, it reduces MBs long photos into a few kB without noticeable quality loss?
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> there must be a special codec... I just don't know why it is not available to all software?
<daftykins> there is no way iPhones are doing that
<JanC> not if we are talking about converting JPEG to JPEG at the same resolution & quality
<marcoagpinto> how?! why?! a few years ago a supermarket customer took a photo from me and it was very small?
<marcoagpinto> JanC: yes, same resolution and not visible quality loss
<JanC> dude, I have used Photoshop in the past and that's bullshit
<marcoagpinto> the space background in my homepage... it was MB big and Robert used Photoshop to make it 150 kB or so
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I compared both images many years ago and I couldn't see a difference
<daftykins> that's 100% rubbish
<marcoagpinto> how?
<marcoagpinto> :((((((((((
<marcoagpinto> I tried to reduce it myself with PaintShopPro and at 150 kB it looked all damaged
<marcoagpinto> how was he able to make it then?
<daftykins> i don't believe the story being told
<marcoagpinto> daftykins: what part don't you believe?
<marcoagpinto> sorry for the grammar errors :)
<JanC> well, the only possibility is if the original JPEG was pixel-perfect compared to the raw photo
<marcoagpinto> JanC: ahhh... I didn't check pixel by pixel... I just opened both with paintshoppro and toggled between them... no differences
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I didn't see pixel by pixel
<OerHeks> gimp does this pretty good, it gives an example when you drag the compression ratio
<marcoagpinto> OerHeks: ahhhh... GIMP... I have been using it too for some tasks...
<OerHeks> and had some options in a plugin, best for web ( format and ratio), best for publish ..
<marcoagpinto> :)
<tomreyn> maybe there was some 25 MB PDF embedded in the JPEG header
<OerHeks> or use darktable, my favo.. not sure what that can do about compression
<JanC> most likely the resolution was changed
<OerHeks> JanC, on my pic the colour depth changed, iirc
<JanC> if you compare zoomed out they would still look the same
<daftykins> ^ +1
<marcoagpinto> JanC: yes, it is what I did, I didn't zoom... I just toggled between both
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> since I saw no differences, I used his image instead of mine
<marcoagpinto> 150 kB to several MB
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I chose 150 kB
<JanC> sure, that makes sense for that purpose
<JanC> you probably don't want to use that 150kB version for printing an A0 poster though
<marcoagpinto> of course
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I only used it in my site
<OerHeks> fast homepage, rest of the site may take more time
<marcoagpinto> yes... because the other pictures were compressed by me :p
<marcoagpinto> so, they are a lot larger
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I don't know how to compress like Robert
<marcoagpinto> I use both GIMP and PaintShopPro because each one has features that I need... for example, GIMP allows SVG files while PSP 2019 has a bug and doesn't open them...
<marcoagpinto> I reported the bug to Corel and they said "what is the best time to use TeamView with you blah blah"
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> and I replied: "I will wait for PSP 2020"
<marcoagpinto> :p
<daftykins> sounds like they wanted to help show how it's done
<marcoagpinto> well, a double-click or drag'n'drop?
<marcoagpinto> no big magic
<marcoagpinto> just like when PSP 2018 crashed while trying to print a second time?
<marcoagpinto> "we will TeamView blah blah to check"
<marcoagpinto> and I waited for a new version and it fixed the issue
<daftykins> my Dad always liked getting PC magazine coverdiscs back in the day with old PSP versions free
<daftykins> i think sometimes he ordered their software solely because it came with a free mouse too, and boy was it rubbish :D
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhhhhhh
<marcoagpinto> :)))))))))
<marcoagpinto> coverdiscs or coverdisks?
<marcoagpinto> I am from the time of covertapes
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> then disks and then discs
<daftykins> diskettes then discs i suppose really
<marcoagpinto> do you remember the ZX Spectrum days?!
<marcoagpinto> the magazines would later bring tapes
<marcoagpinto> :)
<daftykins> nope, before my time - don't think i'd have had an interest... but i suppose we'll never know
<marcoagpinto> ahhhh... good old days... :)
<marcoagpinto> I coded a bit in Z80 Assembly in those days
<marcoagpinto> BASIC + Assembly
<marcoagpinto> the compression algorithm: 1,1,1,1,1,2 = 1,1,5,2
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> that was the most common one
<marcoagpinto> two equal numbers and the counter
<marcoagpinto> (for images)
 * daftykins prefers to live in the present
<marcoagpinto> daftykins: Wait until I finish my course and I will remake Spectrum games again
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> my old hobby!!!!
<marcoagpinto> remaking spectrum games
<marcoagpinto> I have a dream... a vision... a highly technologic advanced civilization with space travelling :)
<marcoagpinto> I hope to be alive when it happens
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> do you know understand why am I always referring to 512-bit storage in Ubuntu?
<marcoagpinto> I am thinking about the future, when the world will use Petabytes storage
<marcoagpinto> SSD PB storage
<marcoagpinto> do you now*
<marcoagpinto> sorry for the grammar
<daftykins> if i'm 100% honest i've just made the connection that you don't have too deep an understanding of things is all
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhhh
<marcoagpinto> why?
<marcoagpinto> daftykins! :((((((((((((
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-09-22
<tomreyn> ig uess we can just drop the fglrx references off this factoid then, right, OerHeks?
<tomreyn> !ati
<ubot5> Open driver for AMD cards: amdgpu (cards >= GCN1.2 aka GCN 3rd gen), radeon (older cards). Closed drivers: amdgpu-pro (>= GCN1.2) fglrx (older cards, unsupported by AMD in 16.04+). For info on GCN levels, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_AMD_graphics_processing_units . For fglrx info, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BinaryDriverHowto/AMD
<OerHeks> i have no clue what the installer uses, the  xserver-xorg-video-radeon package suggests compatibility
<tomreyn> OerHeks: hmm, my point is about removing references to fglrx off this factoid. i don't see a reference to fglrx in the package description of dependencies of xserver-xorg-video-radeon. what am i getting wrong?
<OerHeks> the card is listed as supported, but the last version was 12.04 that supported this
<tomreyn> i'm not discussing any specific card
<OerHeks> so, me confused too, that he got this far at all
<OerHeks> yes, fglrx, for ati 2-4xxx
<tomreyn> we're having a misunderstanding, i think. i'm suggesting to edit the factoid as this:
<tomreyn> ati is Open source drivers for AMD/ATI graphics cards: amdgpu (cards >= GCN1.2 aka GCN 3rd gen), radeon (older cards). Closed source drivers: amdgpu-pro (>= GCN1.2). For info on GCN levels, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_AMD_graphics_processing_units
<OerHeks> ah oke dropping:  For fglrx info, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BinaryDriverHowto/AMD
<tomreyn> as well as "fglrx (older cards, unsupported by AMD in 16.04+)", yes
<tomreyn> OerHeks: you thnk that's fine?
<OerHeks> yes, that would be correct.
<OerHeks> just checking
<OerHeks> debian says https://wiki.debian.org/AtiHowTo  -- xserver-xorg-video-ati
<tomreyn> those are the 2d X drivers, yes.
<tomreyn> This driver is actually a wrapper that loads one of the 'mach64', 'r128' or 'radeon' sub-drivers depending on the hardware.
<OerHeks> that what happened in the installer, i guess
<tomreyn> i don't know what you're referring to now, maybe i missed some chat in #ubuntu
<OerHeks> he claimed he had an install screen
<OerHeks> so he though the desktop would work
<OerHeks> * after update
<tomreyn> install screen as in he got graphical output when booting the installer?
<OerHeks> yes?
<OerHeks> that is what i make out of it.
<tomreyn> it probably loaded the radeon module or fell back to vesa
<tomreyn> from what i understood, TheSHAD0W is saying that they installed some version of ubuntu on this stone age computer and rebooted and it was fine, then installed updates, and then there were graphics issues.
<tomreyn> (after another reboot, i guess)
<tomreyn> so this could be due to a regression in the latest radeon module. or because it was using vesa until then.
<tomreyn> radeon/4) on bionic lists HD 4250
<tomreyn> I meant to write: The radeon(4) man page on bionic lists HD 4250 (and RS880)
<tomreyn> alias:          pci:v00001002d00009712sv*sd*bc*sc*i*
<tomreyn> ^ modinfo radeon on kernel 5.0 on bionic-hwe
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<marcoagpinto> Heya!
<marcoagpinto> brothers and sisters!!!
<Talikka> what about mothers and grandfathers? happy with ubuntu and which flavour?
<marcoagpinto> what?
<Talikka> I struggle to select between mint or ubuntu something. This year, Ubuntu MATE has had extremely many bugs
<jeremyb> I would doubt the Mint version would be any better
<Talikka> Many doubt but most people I know who have installed Linux to elderly or beginner-level people have selected Linux Mint. At least in Finnish it has much more guides and help available than Ubuntu
<jeremyb> Talikka: I am a moderator on forums.linuxmint.com Mint only has about a dozen devs
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<marcoagpinto> guys?! Is anyone there?!
<marcoagpinto> daftykins: are you still angry at me? :(((((((
<marcoagpinto> BluesKaj!!!! Hello!!!!!!!
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<BluesKaj> hi marcoagpinto
<marcoagpinto> dear beloved brother!
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<BluesKaj> let's not get carried away
<marcoagpinto> ahhhh... right
<marcoagpinto> :)
<BluesKaj> too much cola again eh?
<marcoagpinto> no, I only had 1 litre
<BluesKaj> that's plenty
<marcoagpinto> tomorrow I will buy more
<BluesKaj> no doubt
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto!!!
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE!!!
<marcoagpinto> I did a stupid thing!!!! I sent an e-mail to 200+ people saying my status... and today a Professor phoned me worried
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: Worried about what?
<marcoagpinto> the depression
<marcoagpinto> I guess I can't tell the truth because people get worried
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: I understood.
<marcoagpinto> What is wrong with this sentence?: "I can't put an end to life because I don't know what there is on the other side and my mission on Earth hasn't ended."
<EoflaOE> That means that you keep doing your mission. I don't see the wrong thing
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: ^
<marcoagpinto> yes
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: OK. Are there no cola bottles left?
<marcoagpinto> no.... zero
<marcoagpinto> :(
<EoflaOE> Let me grab a cup of water and come back
<marcoagpinto> oki
<EoflaOE> I am back.
<marcoagpinto> welcome back
<EoflaOE> Thanks
<EoflaOE> Let me see some package updates for Ubuntu 19.10 Eoan.
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<EoflaOE> In my Ubuntu 19.10 VM, only 5 updates were made (gdisk, geoip-database, libgeoip1, libwmf0.2-7-gtk, and libwmf0.2-7)
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I can hardly wiat for 20.04LTS
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> wait*
<EoflaOE> Yes. But it will takeout 32-bit support except select packages
<marcoagpinto> 32-bit should be removed from the planet
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> in the past I created also 32-bit versions of Proofing Tool GUI, but then Ubuntu 18.04 removed support and so did I
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I no longer cared for 32-bit
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: Also, all my future PCs that I will buy will never be 32-bit. And my new Dell Optiplex 7060 which runs 64-bit too.
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<marcoagpinto> Microsoft did a terrible job in releasing laptops with quad-core Atom CPUs and 32-bit Windows
<marcoagpinto> :(
<EoflaOE> I know. Because I saw 32-bit versions of Windows 10 latest versions.
<marcoagpinto> maybe they did it because they had only 2 GB? of RAM and it would use cycles from the SSD drive (virtual memory)
<marcoagpinto> 10.1'' or so laptops
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> with eMMC drives or whatever it is called
<EoflaOE> Might be. Before my purchase of my 64-bit Dell Optiplex, I visited my friend which is my neighbor to find that he has a HI-LIFE notebook. I think it runs 32-bit too. I even saw him playing legacy old 2000s action games like IGI 2.
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhh
<marcoagpinto> sorry... I was reading the lyrics of the YouTube band the professor told me to
<marcoagpinto> The Rasmus - in the shadows
<marcoagpinto> it is so powerufl
<marcoagpinto> powerful*
<marcoagpinto> "I won't give up until I find the cure to this cancer"
<marcoagpinto> something close
<EoflaOE> It's OK.
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: will someday Ubuntu support draging files from a folder to other using the right mouse button and have options, such as COPY/MOVE, just like Windows?
<marcoagpinto> it would increase UX a lot
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: I don't know, but you may have to suggest this idea to GNOME developers so Debian will pick it up and then Ubuntu.
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhhh
<marcoagpinto> :((((((((
<marcoagpinto> so many steps before Ubuntu?
<marcoagpinto> I once installed Debian? Three or four .iso files of 4 GB each?
<marcoagpinto> huge
<EoflaOE> Yes. They also ship netinst.
<EoflaOE> Now, I will take a bath, go to dinner, and go to bed. Goodbye marcoagpinto.
<marcoagpinto> oki
<marcoagpinto> take care
<marcoagpinto> see you tomorrow
<marcoagpinto> tomreyn seems to know a lot about computers!!!
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> more than I will ever know :)
<tomreyn> what makes you think so? because i just configured on to powercycles itself while it was running, hen brought it up and had it kill itself twice?
<tomreyn> what makes you think so? because i just configured one to powercycles itself while it is running, then brought it up twice and had it kill itself twice?
<tomreyn> ^ typo galore
<marcoagpinto> "I've been searching, I've been living, for tomorrows all my life"
<marcoagpinto> :)
<kostkon> marcoagpinto, you are not making any sense (with that) but it's ok
<marcoagpinto> kostkon: It is a song, but it fits me perfectly
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I have been living for the future all over my life
<kostkon> should've guessed
<marcoagpinto> sometimes I look crazy... but I am always planning the future
<marcoagpinto> I write and draw on paper my ideas, so that I can develop software or suggest improvements to other software
<marcoagpinto> the number of pages is increasing and I can't implement all :)
<marcoagpinto> around 20 persons are using my Proofing Tool GUI for dictionaries and such :) ... I was watching the download statistics
<marcoagpinto> I have tons of ideas for its future... I just lack the time to implemtn
<marcoagpinto> implement*
<marcoagpinto> it even supports autocorrect for LibreOffice and OpenOffice
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> very useful
<OerHeks> grinn .. <B|ack0p> i plugged same card to different slot that s why i am having this problem i think
<daftykins> o0
<OerHeks> really, one could smell this comming
 * daftykins sniffs
<OerHeks> did you hear blue?
<daftykins> not today :D
<jeremyb> Must be a check to see if a wifi card is plugged into a wwan slot
<OerHeks> how could one give support and find out about that..
<OerHeks> mentioning it at the end, like it is not important at all
<daftykins> honestly, although i've seen them labelled on laptop boards... i don't know why they'd be any different
<OerHeks> he switched from wifi to wwan, different antenna?
<jeremyb> Thinkpads and Lenovo were bad about only allowing certain wifi cards to be used
<OerHeks> or no antenna at all..
<OerHeks> jeremyb, that could well be, thinkpad t60 iirc
<daftykins> yeah, whitelist and all that
<daftykins> that aside, i wonder if they can't operate in each others slots - for antennae, they typically have spares there with plastic caps on if a machine didn't ship with a WWAN card
<daftykins> ah well, not very important... pretty funny for someone to muck that up
