#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-19
<MartijnVdS> Arrrr!
<AlanBell> morning all
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: Morning. It be International Talk Like a Pirate Day. Arrr! :)
<AlanBell> Ahoy!
<TheOpenSourcerer> Arr Harr!
<TheOpenSourcerer> Just been trying to grope my wife before she heads off to work. But she was not impressed.
<AlanBell> http://www.pirateparty.org.uk/press/releases/2011/sep/18/Pirate-Party-German-Scores-Historic-Win/ germany is prepared for boarding
<jpds> AlanBell: Considering the amount of music they were blastly out, I'm not surprised.
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<oimon> "pirate" is a poor choice of name for a party IMO
<danfish> Avast ye scurvy dogs <- (good morning in piratese)
<brobostigon> morning danfish
<danfish> o/
<brobostigon> o/
<danfish> my arduino/zoneminder on ubuntu fox repelling system will be constructed tomorrow :)
<MartijnVdS> so.. apt-get purge firefox then?
<GreenDance> Morning All
<kirrus> g'morning
<GreenDance> you know the ubuntu-restricted-extras package, is it illegal to bundle that into an ubuntu-respin?
<AlanBell> depending on jurisdictions, and whether you pay the patent royalties each time you distribute it, maybe
<GreenDance> @ AlanBell : I can't remember which ubuntu-respin it is, but one of them include it in the default-install
<AlanBell> linux mint for a start
<GreenDance> can't they get sued?
<AlanBell> I think they are taking the strategy of having no assets and not being worth suing
<AlanBell> but I don't pay much attention to mint
<oimon> linux mint offer 2 downloads: 1 for non USA/Japan/Magazines and dsitributors, and one for the rest of us without silly software patent laws
<oimon> "A version which fits on a CD, without multimedia support and extra applications. For magazines, companies and distributors in the USA, Japan and countries where the legislation allows patents to apply to software and distribution of restricted technologies may require the acquisition of 3rd party licenses."
<AlanBell> yeah, so magazines and distributors don't want to accidentally be liable for royalties
<GreenDance> @ AlanBell : would a loop-hole not be, on the desktop to have a link which if activated installs the extras?
<diplo> Morning all
<AlanBell> GreenDance: or a checkbox in the installer, which there is.
<GreenDance> is that a legal loop-hole?
<AlanBell> ask a lawyer
<GreenDance> their expensive, lol
<danfish> MartijnVdS: if only it were that simple!
<oimon> GreenDance: is your question hypothetical or is there a more detailed scenario which would help your question?
<AlanBell> Canonical are clearly comfortable with it
<AlanBell> and I know their lawyer
<GreenDance> oimon, it's hypothetical
<GreenDance> @ AlanBell : Canonical are comfortable with what...?
<daubers> Morning :)
<GreenDance> Morning daubers
<GreenDance> :)
<GreenDance> what did you mean AlanBell ?
<oimon> can anyone recommend good cable tidy that i can buy over the net? i've been tasked with getting some
<oimon> i think there's probably a better word pair than "cable tidy"
<AlanBell> GreenDance: they are comfortable with the legality of the checkbox on the installer
<GreenDance> :)
<JamesTait> Morning all!
<czajkowski> https://twitter.com/#!/RonanKirby/status/115710418034503680
<czajkowski> job is based in the UK
<oimon> does anyone actually know what jboss is?
<directhex> oimon, a crappy java application server
<directhex> for Enterprise(tm) java server apps
<popey> Someone has just handed me an HP Touchpad to play with
<popey> How do you tell it about proxies.
<popey> oh god its painful to work via a proxy
<Laney> woe is the life of a proxy user
<Laney> pretty sure banshee/tomboy will regress in oneiric due to the proxy settings moving to gsettings
<MartijnVdS> and chrom(e|ium)
<Laney> don't think firefox supports the system settings either
<MartijnVdS> Banshee is regressing anyway because it crashes during apt-get upgrade(!)
<Laney> bug?
<davmor2> morning all
<davmor2> MooDoo: you online yet?
<biomorph> Hi all...   I am having problems that file volumes are being set in error because the filesystem and database file sizes are different.
<biomorph> Should bscan fix this for me?  It doesn't seem to update the database.
<biomorph> OK - it looks like I need to do update volume from bconsole, but I can't find which argument to pass to the command.
<biomorph> Grrrr....   Sorry all.  Wrong channel.
<kirrus> Very quiet here today. Busy monday?
<popey> Shh!
<kirrus> <whisper> exams? </whisper> :P
<Aquix> http://www.talklikeapirate.com/
<Aquix> Nevaaarrrg
<The_Fred> Hello
<oimon> lots of freshers on campus today. 80s fashion is getting more extreme
<biomorph> OK - I've got a really dumb question.  I want to start script "b" from script "a" and then continue running script "a"
<biomorph> In script a I have a line "/pathto/b &"
<biomorph> But script a goes into zombie state and never exits.
<biomorph> I've also tried "nohup /pathto/b &" same result.
<oimon>  why do yuo have the "&" ?
<biomorph> oimon: to put it in the background.  I want script b to continue running after a has exited.
<oimon> ah, i misundertood your original statment
<czajkowski> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1257/detail/ drinks on thursday if anyone is about
<biomorph> Sorry - I'm not being as clear as I could be.  Really feel I'm missing a basic concept of unix here that I should know.
<AlanBell> I am pretty useless with bash stuff, does the output need to be piped to /dev/null to stop it waiting for a return value or something maybe?
<hamitron> biomorph, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nohup#Overcoming_hanging
<biomorph> AlanBell: hamitron:  Thanks guys, I think it is to do with piping stuff.
<davmor2> MooDoo: prod
<davmor2> czajkowski: prod just cause I don't want you feeling left out
<AlanBell> isn't it sweet how much davmor2 is missing MooDoo
 * czajkowski pours a bucket of ice cold water over davmor2 
<davmor2> AlanBell: I only want to congratulate him properly
<biomorph> ok "sh /pathto/b &" seems to work fine.  I'm just embarrassed I've never done it before.
<czajkowski> http://www.theranktank.com/ funky
<oimon> the spotify play limit doesn't get reset each month :(
<oimon> listen to a song five times and that's it.
<kirrus> Thought it did.. is it 31 days after you last listened to something? Not that I'd know, I started paying ages ago
<oimon> kirrus: play count definitely hasn't been reset, although my hours have.
<oimon> my behaviour is usually: listen to album 5-10 times on spotify, then buy
<kirrus> oimon: could well be a bug. Worth emailing them?
<oimon> "Once a track has been played five times, it will become unavailable -- not until the end of the month, but until you pay to subscribe."
<oimon> isn't there another spotify competitor coming online ?
<kirrus> Haven't heard of one. Amazon/apple/ubuntu are all doing the 'let-you-stream-your-music-for-a-fee' model thing
<oimon> http://venturebeat.com/2011/09/14/mog-free-streaming-music-spotify/
<oimon> arggh US only :(
<popey> I'd ask them on irc
<popey> #spotify
<oimon> i'm pretty sure it's a feature.
<oimon> anyway, i discovered grooveshark now :)
<MartijnVdS> ARGH
<MartijnVdS> why does Banshee _hang_ every time after I do an apt-get upgrade
<shauno> maybe they're trying to copy itunes, and that's the closest they could come to having to accept the tims eula *every* single time it updates
<MartijnVdS> :)
<MartijnVdS> but it even hangs if I don't upgrade anything Mono or Banshee-related
<Laney> where's your bug report?
<Laney> also, #banshee @ gimpnet
<MartijnVdS> Laney: I'm trying to find a way to reproduce it more reliably (than 50%-ish of the time)
<MartijnVdS> Laney: I've started it from a terminal with --debug now, for a stack trace
<Laney> sweet
<MartijnVdS> though I wonder why apport isn't picking up on it
<MartijnVdS> (probably because it doesn't really "crash" as such, but goes into "400% CPU" mode
<issyl0> popey, AlanBell: I won't be coming to tomorrow night's thing, sorry.
 * issyl0 has decided (probably unwisely) to go to the college freshers thing instead.  :-/
<issyl0> Oh well.  Put myself in social situations and hopefully not feel *too* much like a fish out of water...
<MartijnVdS> Practice makes perfect, issyl0
<issyl0> MartijnVdS: Heh.  :-)
 * issyl0 carries on with an English essay.
<brobostigon> meeting in 3/4 of an hour, #ubuntu-uk-meeting
<AlanBell> a very good point :)
<brobostigon> :)
<feisar> hi peeps, is it possible to spin down a usb or firewire attached hd after a set time?
<AlanBell> evening all
<Pendulum> hiya AlanBell
<AlanBell> team meeting in #ubuntu-uk-meeting when everyone is ready with beer/wine/coffee/tea
 * popey tickles Daviey with bug 854189
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 854189 in xorg (Ubuntu) "nvidia binary driver gives black screen" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854189
<brobostigon> good night everyone, sleep well.
<exobuzz> wow. testing oneiric is stressful. unity is so broken currently, (im awqare of the fixing coming up), its almost unusable. ouch
<popey> not so bad here
<directhex> i assume unity is broken
<directhex> before or after release
<exobuzz> minimise a window :)
<exobuzz> switching windows/minimizing/maximising and it gets intoa mess its a known uissue. patch for X and patch for unity. coming hopefully anymoment now before i lose my mind
<popey> hah exobuzz
<popey> i minimised the irc window
<popey> hence the delay in replying
<exobuzz> it's just being kind to olympic ironers
<exobuzz> ps. see my facebook spam
<exobuzz> hehe
<popey> âº
<directhex> i think the reason the system tray was disabled in natty isn't the "design choice" nonsense, but because it totally doesn't work properly
 * bigcalm looks forward to not embracing Unity on his workstation :)
<directhex> if you enable the systray, then notification area icons aren't clickable (you can click the rightmost one, then the open menu follows your mouse into the icons to the left, but UX--)
<exobuzz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/848237 plus other issues are current
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 848237 in unity (Ubuntu Oneiric) "minimizing application creates an invisible window" [High,Confirmed]
<exobuzz> fix is "around the corner"
<gord> directhex, you think wrong
<anto9us> Hello
<directhex> gord: wake me when window decorations gain magical icons in the top-right, as we were told to expect
<exobuzz> haha
<exobuzz> yeh where are they
<exobuzz> the big reason for everything heh
<exobuzz> well. since i was on ubuntu i upgraded to try. ill report some bugs, then ill seeya all on kde or so
<exobuzz> unless ubuntu gets brilliant and works and gives me a big tech snog of functionality
<gord> the ubuntu community is so negative lately =\
<exobuzz> i mean unity
<exobuzz> gord, that blog post reagrding release times and payment from ex ubuntu guy summed up the issues for me
<directhex> exobuzz: scott's post?
<exobuzz> i forgot the link now
<exobuzz> but it made sense
<exobuzz> i hope 11.10 unity 2d will be usable on the joggler. else ill have to hack something else on like fallback + netbook remix gui
<exobuzz> no middle click on touchscreens by default
<directhex> oh, netbook remix
<directhex> how i miss netbook remix
<exobuzz> hell, right click from long touch is still broken on natty.. still. i give up.. they only have to downgrade mousetweaks from the gnome 3 version
<directhex> i would totally use the old netbook-launcher on gnome2, rather than unity
<exobuzz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/mousetweaks/+bug/762806
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 762806 in mousetweaks (Ubuntu Natty) "[regression] shipped mousetweaks (3.0) does not work with shipped control-center (2.32), needs downgrade" [High,Triaged]
<directhex> note: kubuntu netbook isn't far from being that
<exobuzz> directhex, yeh
<exobuzz> i should try that
<directhex> the kubuntu netbook remix plasma desktop is very much like UNR used to be
<directhex> very very buggy, but the UX is better
<exobuzz> bbl. going to have a wine
<directhex> final New Vegas DLC is out today \o/ o// \\o
<buzz_> if anyone is interested, i packaged up latest sidplay-fp code for ubuntu https://launchpad.net/~jools/+archive/ppa/+index?field.series_filter=
<buzz_> that url is longer than it needed to be
<buzz_> no sidplay.ini gets copied anywhere. so you need to grab that and tweak it if you want from the svn repo. i should stick that in /usr/share/docs - was a quick job
<buzz_> (it also installs alongside sidplay2 in ubuntu)
<buzz_> but the ini are incompatible probably
<buzz_> </c64 related spam>
#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-20
<doad> hi room is there someone here that can help me with my wired internet connection
<doad> hi room is there someone here that can help me with my wired internet connection
<AlanBell> morning all
<MartijnVdS> Is anyone else seeing this:
<MartijnVdS> W: GPG error: http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com oneiric Release: The following signatures were invalid: BADSIG 40976EAF437D05B5 Ubuntu Archive Automatic Signing Key <ftpmaster@ubuntu.com>
<jpds> MartijnVdS: Yes, being worked on.
<MartijnVdS> OK
<MartijnVdS> so it's not on my end
<TheOpenSourcerer> MartijnVdS: Me too :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Someone broke their key?
<jpds> TheOpenSourcerer: No.
<MartijnVdS> "disk full"?
<MartijnVdS> "No space left on device.", sorry
<daubers> Morning
<MartijnVdS> \o daubers
<DJones> Morning all
<smittix> o/
<oimon> :( ubuntu one seems to always be flaky for me
<bigcalm> Morning peeps :)
<DJones> Morning bigcalm, hows the holiday going
<Pernig> morning
<bigcalm> DJones: back in the office today
<bigcalm> So, short
<DJones> Boo, Hiss :)
<bigcalm> That about sums it up, yes ;)
<JamesTait> Good morning, everyone!
<oimon> anyone know how to fix u1 issues? #ubuntuone are all asleep
<oimon> client is not receiving new files ,and status is http://pastebin.com/mLGr5dDQ
<diplo> I had similair issues of that before oimon, fix was a lot of cli commands, but this was first release sort of time
<diplo> Couldn't get it to sync
<diplo> think i had to install ubuntuone-client-tools
 * oimon installs
<diplo> I'm guessing you have them, as you have used u1sdtool -s ?
<diplo> This has been a while, I'm trying to refresh myself what the issue was :/
<oimon> diplo: guess what?
<diplo> --rescan-from-scratch=VOLUME_ID
<diplo> Working now ?
<diplo> http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/lucid/man1/u1sdtool.1.html
<oimon> after installing that package,
<diplo> heh \o/
<oimon> -d folllowed by a -c works
<diplo> I know i had to install that before, but couldn't remember what i did with it
<diplo> Maybe mine was the same :)
<oimon> gonna check what's inside that package
<oimon> maybe i had an old version of u1sdtool
<oimon> diplo: thanks for fixing my problem :)
<diplo> Well didn't fix it, but pointed you in the general direction :)
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<ikonia> Can any of the Dr Who geeks explain to me why Amy's daughter was part Time Lord ?
<MartijnVdS> because she was conceived in the TARDIS
<ikonia> is that the real explained reason ?
<MartijnVdS> yes
<ikonia> wow
<oimon> it's about as good as you will get
<ikonia> thank you for explaining the randomness
<oimon> also, it's probably why the doctor can now keep on regenerating
<MartijnVdS> ikonia: they used different words.. something about "spending their honeymoon in the tardis"
<ikonia> keep on regenerating ?
<oimon> cos she gave her future regenerations to him
<daubers> oimon: Though they have made a couple of references to "No more regenerations"
<ikonia> MartijnVdS: I know what your saying though
<ikonia> oimon: he should have been able to regenerate for $X ammount of time before anyway
<MartijnVdS> daubers: those were in the old series
<daubers> MartijnVdS: In this series it was said a few times
<MartijnVdS> yes but no hard limit was given
<oimon> originally there were a fixed number, but since RTD all rules got rewritten (grrr)
<MartijnVdS> oimon: the number used to be _12_, current Doctor is 11
<daubers> MartijnVdS: When he nearly died earlier in the series the tardis told him "No regenerations available"
<MartijnVdS> daubers: because he was poisoned.
<oimon> TARDIS probably needed a reboot
<oimon> i think that happened too
<MartijnVdS> oimon: What, you think it runs TARDOWS? Not TARDOS X? :)
<oimon> i gave up watching dr who for the whole of the catherine tate series
<daubers> MartijnVdS: If it ran TARDOS X, then you could easily change user passwords to gain root privs now
<MartijnVdS> oimon: the new Doctor is good. Moffat++
<oimon> there seem to have been a lot of quirky episodes lately
<diplo> Not to many spoilers peeps, just about to start watching series 1 :P
<dogmatic69> is it safe to say ubuntu x.04 is always LTS
<oimon> MartijnVdS: i'm back in the game when RTD left
<dogmatic69> and x.10 is not LTS
<daubers> Also, seen this http://osxdaily.com/2011/09/19/change-password-mac-os-x-10-7-lion-without-knowing-current-password/ ? Made me giggle
<daubers> !LTS
<lubotu3> LTS means Long Term Support. LTS versions of Ubuntu will be supported for 3 years on the desktop, and 5 years on the server. The current LTS version of Ubuntu is !Lucid (Lucid Lynx 10.04)
<oimon> !release
<lubotu3> Ubuntu releases a new version every 6 months. Each version is supported for 18 months to 5 years. More info at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases & http://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeBasedReleases
<dutchie> dogmatic69: only if x is even
<dogmatic69> ah
<dogmatic69> thanks
<popey> Mor/27
<popey> bah!
<oimon> lol
<popey> Morning btw :D
<MartijnVdS> hi popey
<drussell> dogmatic69: i.e. LTS release every 2 years, 2008, 2010 next one 2012 ;o)
<drussell> dogmatic69: and xx.04
<dogmatic69> sup popey
<davmor2> morning all
 * czajkowski kicks davmor2 get back to work you
 * davmor2 passes the message back to czajkowski with knobs on :P
 * dogmatic69 got his motorcycle license yesterday :D
<brobostigon> :)
<dogmatic69> someone here was giving me some info about getting it
<dogmatic69> 1st time.. mod 1 + 2 on the same day
<BigRedS> whoop!
<BigRedS> I've a CB500 I'm about to try to sell... :)
<dogmatic69> replacing it with... ?
<BigRedS> Oh, I've already got an ST1100 and a CX500 as well
<dogmatic69> hehe
<BigRedS> I'm not sure which one replaced the CB, but I use the ST and the CX isn't worth enough to justify selling it
<dogmatic69> rode a GS500 for my test, they are pretty cool
<dogmatic69> though it would be crap, but no
<BigRedS> Ah yeah, were you riding a 125 beforehand?
<dogmatic69> nope, direct access
<dogmatic69> could not stand to ride a 125 for two years
<diplo> dogmatic69: Can I ask how much it cost you ?
<diplo> Want to take mine, was riding for 5-10 years then stopped, took my CBT 3 times but never got round to taking my test
<diplo> Had a few bikes without a license ( not something I'm proud of ) but want to get a license now I'm single
<BigRedS> dogmatic69: hm? No I mean on l-plates. Either way, you're only restricted to 33bhp for two years, which is approximately a modern 250, or a restricted 500
<dogmatic69> BigRedS: not on a direct access
<dogmatic69> you do the test on a 500 and can ride a busa the same day (if you pass)
<BigRedS> no, but there's no way to pass a test and remain restricted to a 125
<BigRedS> you're either DAS and can ride whatever, or non-das and restricted to 33bhp
<dogmatic69> ye
<dogmatic69> if you do the test on a 125 you are restricted for 2 years
<dogmatic69> diplo: it cost me +- Â£700 from nothing to DA
<diplo> What I don't understand is why I have to take a theory when I have been driving for nearly 20 years!
<dogmatic69> that is theory, CBT, 1 day DA training, mod 1, mod 2
<BigRedS> yeah, it's just you saying "could not stand to ride a 125 for two years" when I asked whether you rode a 125 previously
<BigRedS> which confused me
<dogmatic69> ive been riding for years so 1 day training was good, you could need 4 or 5 at 150 pd
<diplo> Hmm, Â£700 :( - May see if I can spread mine out :/
<BigRedS> anyway, I suspect it really doesn't matter :)
<dogmatic69> diplo: ye you dont have to pay at once, i just did cos i wanted it all booked an stuff. was just over 1 month from start to end
<czajkowski> AlanBell: can you bring a live cd with you on thursday PRETTY PLEASE
<dogmatic69> BigRedS: ah, ye i had a bike in South Africa, here I had not ridden till the CBT / DA training
<AlanBell> czajkowski: what version?
<dogmatic69> and I got a RVF 400 in the garage so DA was the only way
<diplo> Where abouts in UK are you dogmatic69 ?
<dogmatic69> bham
<dogmatic69> the school i went to is REALLY good
<diplo> All my mates who ride passed when I should have taken my test :)
<dogmatic69> ^ bike school...
<dogmatic69> hehe
<diplo> So don't know anyone to recommend somewhere locally
<diplo> Will pop into local bike shop
<dogmatic69> where are you?
<diplo> Near Bath ( Bristol )
<diplo> Placed called Trowbridge
<diplo> Never sure how well people no the southwest, basically 10 miles outside of bath
<czajkowski> AlanBell: Natty would be safest please
<dogmatic69> ah ok, never been there so would be no help at recommending a place. I found these guys on google
<dogmatic69> i used http://www.rmtnet.co.uk/index.html could even call them and ask for advice
<diplo> I've only found one bloke so far from Google that I see around a lot, http://www.ablemotorcycletraining.co.uk/
<diplo> But it's not a all in one place
<diplo> Why do all these companies have such bad websites :)
<AlanBell> czajkowski: no problem
<diplo> Ta for link
<dogmatic69> diplo: the guys i pasted are a one stop shop, from cbt -> expert track
<czajkowski> AlanBell: thanks
<diplo> Bookmarked ta, will chat locally and see what people say and if no help with ask if they can give any assistance.
<czajkowski> so who's coming for drinks on thursday in london for the happy hour ?
<czajkowski> eh ?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Not me.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Am out for a curry with the Digital Dogs. An un-networking group.
<davmor2> czajkowski: technically lucid would be the safest :P
<directhex> hardy!
<czajkowski> davmor2: nah natty is grand
<czajkowski> oneiric dont see eye to eye daily so not using that as work machine
<TheOpenSourcerer> Maverick FTW!
 * diplo is still on Maverick
<oimon> surprised to see that nvidia users don't see the ubuntu splash when booting natty :S
<czajkowski> TheOpenSourcerer: so did you have hear attacks at the weekend
<TheOpenSourcerer> nah - was always going to be a walkover ;-)
<gord> oimon, yeah they do, its just not a pretty splash
<oimon> gord: oh. my machine shows black screen until login prompt
<oimon> nouveau and nvidia drivers
<czajkowski> TheOpenSourcerer: heh ok
<bigcalm> Something odd happening with my cable connection - nothing new but annoying
<bigcalm> Yep, everything is struggling to connect
<Aquix> you get reasonable ping?
<bigcalm> Packet loss
<bigcalm> Lots of it
<bigcalm> http://paste.ubuntu.com/693729/
<bastubis> ack, nothing syncs on oneiric!
<Aquix> bigcalm oh, any technical news on your isp's website? packet loss is no good
<bigcalm> Aquix: funny thing is, can't get to the status site :)
<Aquix> lol,
<Aquix> what isp? I can check..
<bigcalm> Finally loaded, no issues reported for my region
<Aquix> I would call them. It's strange, my isp had tech worries tonight 1-4 am. maybe a server software update or something :)
<bigcalm> Experience shows that phoning VM is a waste of time
<bigcalm> Tis a bit better now
<Aquix> yeah, depends who answers on the other end. my isp have a twitter account, that helps loads. Also one time I called the tech section I was called a noob for using ubuntu and not Fedora :)
<ali1234> typical fedora user
<AlanBell> Aquix: I dream of having an ISP where that happens!"
<Aquix> yeah, I just call fedora red hats training girl,  that gets them raging :)
<oimon> Aquix: what's the name of the iSP?
<Aquix> it's norwegian.
<Aquix> whois me
<oimon> ah, was hoping they were UK
<Aquix> must be some good isp's in uk?
<dogmatic69> bt has been good for me
<oimon> i guess. you get what you pay for. and, since i'm out of the house most of the day and don't download much, i use a cheap and nasty isp instead
 * popey hugs Virgin Media
 * oimon has burned that VM bridge
 * dogmatic69 wants this ISP http://i.imgur.com/Ikvnu.png
<kirrus> Virgin media's support has been atrocious in the past. They work fine when it's all working, but hope you never get a problem :(
<oimon> kirrus: +10
<BigRedS> Surely how well the support works when everything's all working is mostly moot?
<oimon> exactly
<popey> yup
<popey> works fine for me :D
<popey> oooh, reminds me, I should upgrade my modem
<oimon> and if they aren't interested in fixing your problem then find another
 * hamitron likes demon internet
<kirrus> BE's support seems fairly proficient, from when I've had to call them. They even accepted traceroute information... ;)
<oimon> VM's performance tends to be geographical
<popey> yup
<popey> luckily I'm in a decently cabled area
<oimon> dogmatic69: http://www.speedtest.net/result/1492537440.png
<dogmatic69> :O
<oimon> i think speedtest only use 100Mbit servers to test
<dogmatic69> is that at work or home?
<Aquix> I play isp's up agains each other. Call a competetor and order internet there and they will ofcource do all the paperwork, then you get a call from your existing isp asking why you want to leave, and boom you have top speed for the same price.
<oimon> work. where i spend most of my time
 * hamitron thumps oimon for having such good internet
<oimon> it's actually 1Gb but speedtset can't keep up
<hamitron> my line is having a good day today
<hamitron> got nearly 1mbit
<hamitron> :)
<Aquix> oimon  I'm jealous. you feel the need to constantly download things?
<oimon> not at all ..except linux ISOs
<oimon> and distro mirrors
<Aquix> ofcource. need those distros
<hamitron> "having fast internet reduces downloads, due to never wanting to queue things"
<hamitron> reckon there is a case for that?
<Aquix> yup
<Aquix> I had an old crappy pc with a 37 Gb disk for many months of 2006. It changed my habits alright.
<hamitron> http://www.speedtest.net/result/1492546113.png
<hamitron> I like the ping ;/
<dogmatic69> unlucky...
<hamitron> tbh, it is good
<dogmatic69> "slower than 82% of UK..."
<dogmatic69> ...
<hamitron> not really
<hamitron> most my friends with higher bandwidth, have a slower latency
<dogmatic69> i will be happy when my local apt-get upgrade is the same as my servers...
<Aquix> hamitron  see my tip on playing the isp 1/2 a page up :)
<Aquix> it works
<hamitron> Aquix, how would play ISP help me?
<hamitron> playing*
<Aquix> <Aquix> I play isp's up agains each other. Call a competetor and order internet there and they will ofcource do all the paperwork, then you get a call from your existing isp asking why you want to leave, and boom you have top speed for the same price.
<hamitron> I pay for upto 8 mbit
<hamitron> just the adsl max service
<hamitron> but so long as it stays stable, I don't care really
<popey> i switched from NTL Cable to ADSL and got 2Mb, then they 'upgraded' me to ADSL Max which dropped me to about 700K/s in each direction
<popey> so i went back to cable
<popey> \o/ 30Mb/3Mb
<Aquix> I get as much as the line can take now, so I get different speeds all the time.
<hamitron> I will switch to something better, if it moves into my area ofc
<hamitron> :)
<hamitron> same aquix
<oimon> i wonder if there's geeks out there for whom the major factor when choosing a house is the distance from the exchange?
<Aquix> ah, ok, then no cap to play really
<gord> you wonder? its the first thing i check
<oimon> :D
<hamitron> I have considered moving
<hamitron> haha
<Aquix> same here
<popey> yeah, i checked before we bought our place
<popey> but I spotted the NTL box on the outside of the house so knew they had it
<dogmatic69> mine (at work) is http://www.speedtest.net/result/1492555038.png
<oimon> when you have kids it gets substituted for good schools..just saying
<Aquix> I can live on easter island if I got good internet
<popey> heh, we didnt move for school
<hamitron> tbh, so long as you get 512k, it is ok and then can take other things into account
<popey> got my wife a job there so she can take them every day :D
<oimon> \o/ win-win.
<oimon> my dad was a teacher at my school. i got lifts every day
<hamitron> I dunno if I'd benefit from greater bandwidth tbh, with all these download caps in place
<hamitron> do you guys hit the caps often?
<popey> nope
<hamitron> I get 60Gb a month
<hamitron> :/
<popey> i have no idea how much I have
<Aquix> Thats nothing. I have unlimited.
<DJones> Mine is unlimited as well
<Aquix> don't really need speed when you have a cap.
<hamitron> what bugs me, I now have no tv, so it is Satalite or Streaming
<hamitron> and 60Gb is not good for streaming
<hamitron> even if I had the bandwidth
<dogmatic69> hamitron: bt is 100% uncapped
<dogmatic69> hit close to 100 gigs monthly with no complaints from them
<hamitron> how much per month?
<kirrus> BT are worse than VM. They've really stuffed my account up, twice, seriously.
<dogmatic69> Â£20 with phone and free calls
<hamitron> :-o
<hamitron> I pay Â£25 for just internet
<hamitron> :/
<popey> http://shop.virginmedia.com/help/traffic-management/traffic-management-policy.html
<dogmatic69> my moms been with them for 2 or 3 years and it just works
<popey> 10000MB between 10AM and 3PM apparently
<hamitron> Â£45 per month line rental with 500 mins of calls
<dogmatic69> in 1.5 years its been down once, and that was the middle of the night
<popey> mmmm 50Mb
<dogmatic69> hamitron: the bt i got is ~ 20mbit
<oimon> when my router loses ppp connection, i wonder, is it my router or more likely the ISP equipment?
<hamitron> dogmatic69, ADSL2?
<oimon> happens 1x per week and i need to reboot router
<dogmatic69> hamitron: o.o
<hamitron> when I priced stuff up last time, the 8mbit service cost more than the 20mbit
<hamitron> and I don't get the 20mbit
<hamitron> :/
<dogmatic69> think its called 'Unlimited Broadband and Calls'
<dogmatic69> http://www.productsandservices.bt.com/consumerProducts/displayTopic.do?topicId=25633
<DJones> I pay Â£10/month for up to 20mbit, averages about 10mbit, no caps, but thats part of a bundle having Sky tv
<popey> veryveryverylongurl.bt.com
<dogmatic69> say 28 there, but told them we going some other place and they dropped the price
<Aquix> can I ask where abouts this is hamitron ?
<hamitron> East Yorkshire
<hamitron> tbh, I don't think that call package is good value
<hamitron> and I didn't organise that
<hamitron> ;/
 * daubers thinks they're all charlatans in their own way
<Aquix> daubers is very right.
<hamitron> I was cross when i was told 5 weeks after having signed up to it, for a 2 year contract
<Aquix> hamitron yeah, shop around.
<daubers> tbh, the sooner some crazy rich person puts a stalactite in orbit that I can hitch all my net traffic through for free the better
 * Hippychick pokes her head in
<hamitron> aquix, locked into contract now
 * popey tickles Hippychick 
<hamitron> stupid women getting taken in by telephone sales calls
<hamitron> :/
 * Hippychick laughs
<daubers> hamitron: Sell them something back \o/
<hamitron> so now I gotta put up with it
<Aquix> hamitron well, internet is a man thing, let her know that
<hamitron> yeh
<hamitron> I organise the internet
<hamitron> ;)
<Aquix> she does the rest :)
<Aquix> lol
<oimon> beta 2 out on 22nd?
<hamitron> tbh, phone line is my area
<hamitron> but I was away when the salesman rung
<hamitron> :/
<hamitron> *sighs* /o\
 * MartijnVdS saw the fibre company digging around the corner this morning
<oimon> hamitron: you have 14 days to change your mind thou
<hamitron> I was only told 5 weeks after
<daubers> MartijnVdS: So you'll have no power when you get home :)
<hamitron> :/
<MartijnVdS> daubers: ssh to home works fine, strangely :)
<Aquix> hamitron  call then up and sound pissed. and say, what is this? I thought this was 2011.
<hamitron> tbh, I cba
<MartijnVdS> daubers: but I'm expecting a "We want to come in and install fibre" letter any day now
<hamitron> :D
<hamitron> Aquix, my main worry is the long contract... in case another provider moves into my exchange
<Aquix> calculate how much the fee for exiting is compared to what you want.
<hamitron> well, there is nothing I want atm
<hamitron> ;)
<oimon> i dont' want to pay for a phone line :(
<hamitron> BT were rude and decided to automatically put us in bold in the yellow pages
<hamitron> that cost a fair bit too
<hamitron> I got 6 months refund on that
<oimon> any extra business as a result?
<hamitron> no
<hamitron> we don't get any business from the yellow pages tbh
<oimon> does it still exist in paper format?
<Aquix> sure
<hamitron> technically, yes
<hamitron> but it is kinda crap
<Aquix> prabably have to order it tho.. loads of oldies that wants it
<hamitron> you don't get put under the business sections unless you pay for it
<oimon> i get phone directory and other such stuff put on my doormat instead of straight in the recycle bin
<oimon> phone book is rather thinner noawadays
<hamitron> online phone directory should be banned imo
<oimon> facebook?
<Aquix> ban phone directory?
<hamitron> Aquix, just online
<popey> Aquix: ignore hamitron, he wants us to all go back to the stone age :D
<hamitron> due to how some companies use the data provided by BT, we often get phone calls at 3am from people in pain
<hamitron> :/
<oimon> i have to write a document before 4pm :( i've been putting it off for a week :(
<Aquix> public is publis, don't see the distinction
<hamitron> popey, you try getting phone calls at 3am
<hamitron> ;/
<hamitron> we are clearly under "dental equipment" in the business directory.... and when someone searches online for "dentist", we show up :/
<oimon> i sometimes get weird calls at 3am and they always sound like foreign skype users
<Aquix> hmm, that is a different matter.
<oimon> or mental people
<Aquix> floss weekly people calling?
<Aquix> :p
<hamitron> this isn't mental, just computer data organisation failure
<hamitron> :/
<hamitron> we've started to just shout abuse at them tbh
<hamitron> morons with tooth ache never listen
<oimon> what would be nice is a caller whitelist between 10pm-9am
<popey> hah
<hamitron> it would
<oimon> aloow from whitelist, deny from all,
<Aquix> I have been asking for a controlable mobile firewall for years.
<oimon> asterisk would prob do it
<popey> can you not ask them where they got your number?
<popey> and then get that site changed?
<hamitron> popey, google
<hamitron> popey, lots of sites with phone numbers, get the data from bt.... bt have the correct information
<hamitron> popey, but sadly, a lot of these sites put all "dental" companies under "dentist"
<hamitron> :/
<Aquix> funny, the two biggest newspapers in my town is ba.no and bt.no  :)
<hamitron> normally we'd just put answer phone on, but had to be on call for members of the family lately
<hamitron> so when getting woken up at 3am, I am kinda ratty ;/
<Aquix> yup, a mobile phone firewall should have been made in 1996,
<hamitron> but this is what the new "modern" way is like, lots of information at your finger tips
<hamitron> just a shame a lot of it is not right
<hamitron> :/
<Aquix> don't mix computers and mobile phones. phone tech is crap feature wise.
<hamitron> well, this is computers
<hamitron> not mobiles
<Aquix> crap computers.
<hamitron> online business searches
<hamitron> don't use them
<hamitron> ;)
<oimon> it comes down to people at the end of the day
<hamitron> especially if you live near me and have toothache at night
<hamitron> oimon, indeed
<Aquix> people make tech
<oimon> check this out. i asked for a bracket to be installed, and this is what they did. http://ubuntuone.com/5GKHfnkhyeNYwBqCNF74JB
<hamitron> :|
<oimon> it's also upside down
<oimon> it was a brand new wall
<hamitron> was gonna ask if you held the camera upside down
<hamitron> ;)
<Aquix> yellow plugs are too short. they should have used re ones, they are longer
 * Aquix electrician
<oimon> luckily the monitor will hide it. i have more work to do but will prob do it myself and face the consequences
<oimon> it sucks when you work with people who (1) can't do their job properly or (2) don't care
<hamitron> who installed that?
<hamitron> like wtf
<hamitron> haha
 * Hippychick falls under catagory 2 at the moment...
<oimon> a maintenance guy ..it's his actual job to do this
<oimon> public sector fail
<oimon> it's just not funny
<oimon> the IT support is just as bad, and they want to centralise our teams into their faildom
<hamitron> I dunno if to smile or cry
<hamitron> :/
<oimon> or turn into hulk
<oimon> i used to be happy care-free :D
<oimon> although popey won't believe that
<hamitron> I rant too often, and I am sure it is not good for me
<oimon> he thinks i'm a sourpuss
<Aquix> they didn't ever fill the holes, you get plaster on tube for that, If I drill a hole wrong, you might not notice.
<oimon> Aquix: surely they could pull out the rawl plugs and replace them? why re-drill?
<popey> hahah
<Hippychick> wooo refund pn internet \o/
<hamitron> I'd have moved the bracket to the right, to hide the crap hole ;)
<Aquix> oimon sometimes the plugs are hard to get out. I don't blame them for that, only for leaving their job looking like crap
<oimon> and upside down vesa bracket :(
<oimon> i should have mounted the monitor upside down and done some xrandr :)
<oimon> until it falls on a students head...:-\
<hamitron> oimon, added bonus
<hamitron> ;)
<shauno> heh, gossip from the smoking area .. chap explaining how he set up this you-buntu 10 thing as a media box for his telly.  says he has no idea what he's doing, but you can just copy & paste all the commands off the internet
<oimon> probably increase their grades
<shauno> not entirely sure if this is a good thing or not
<Aquix> oimon slowly get the screws out and turn it. but if the screw turns and turns when remounting, it's no good.
<oimon> it's good, he's evangelising with the zeal of a new believer
<diplo> heh always a good thing shauno
<diplo> yeah better put by oimon
<diplo> :)
<shauno> was tempted to get them to try mythbuntu, but they think I'm normal, so I try to keep up the illusion
<hamitron> oimon, is this why public sector buildings have to be re-built so often? they drill loads of holes in it, weakening the structure? ;/
<diplo> XBMC tbh is a much nicer interface if you don't want live telly
<hamitron> oh noes
<hamitron> I'm late
<oimon> hamitron: dude, they dismantled a concrete ramp outside our building - took 2 years. they replaced it with another one
<diplo> Didn't say you are a user ?
<hamitron> bbl o/
<hamitron> oimon, hahahhah
 * hamitron gone
 * oimon gets back to his work
<Aquix> sometimes I wish the internet could go down for some days so I could read some books..
<shauno> you should try my isp then :)
<Aquix> lol..
<shauno> my little 3g dongle sees more use at home than anywhere else :/
<diplo> Read in bed Aquix ? I probably read 2-3 chapters a night
<Aquix> isn't 3g super expensive?
<Aquix> diplo I try but I only get 2 sentences done
 * Aquix zzzzzzz :)
<diplo> Like my ex wife, she would start reading and drop off on the first page
<shauno> mine's actually not too bad.  on the dongle, I pay 20eur for 20Gb
<oimon> i read on the train
<shauno> it's on the phone that the exact same data gets charged in pounds of flesh
<diplo> I probably spend an hour reading before I drop off
<oimon> compelled to do something for 30 mins each way
<Aquix> yeah, I live to close to work.
<Aquix> and I bicycle
<diplo> audio books?
<Aquix> nah, I'm happy with soundtracks and daydreaming :)
<czajkowski> brand new install
<czajkowski> of Ubuntu
<czajkowski> what are the 2 commands to install all the extra bit s
<czajkowski> like codec
<czajkowski> all the things turned off by default
<oimon> apt-get install ubuntu-restricted-extras
<czajkowski> oimon: cheers
<oimon> second command is "cowsay hooray"
<diplo> :D
<oimon> i hope cowsay is in the default install
<diplo> Not in Maverick
<davmor2> czajkowski: did you select to install codecs duringthe install if so no need :P
<popey> yes need
<popey> that tickbox doesn't install the same stuff
<czajkowski> davmor2: not me someone in the office
<davmor2> popey: you sure I'm pretty sure that is what evan said it installed I could be wrong
<popey> i looked at the source a while ago, it installs ubuntu-restricted-addons not ubuntu-restricted-extras
<popey> there's a slight difference in what you get from those two meta packages
<davmor2> popey: ah okay
<oimon> ubuntu-restricted-extras in lucid doesn't contain libdvdcss2 though (for encrypted dvds)
<oimon> !info ubuntu-restricted-addons
<lubotu3> ubuntu-restricted-addons (source: ubuntu-restricted-addons): Commonly used restricted packages for Ubuntu. In component multiverse, is optional. Version 7 (natty), package size 2 kB, installed size 36 kB
<oimon> !info ubuntu-restricted-addons lucid
<lubotu3> Package ubuntu-restricted-addons does not exist in lucid
<gord> oimon, you need mediabuntu for that don't you?
<gord> or have to run some script or something?
<oimon> yeah, it's from medibuntu..i pity the poor users who don't have this knowledge though
<oimon> i installed restr-xtras and then went on holiday, thinking i had dvd support
<oimon> had to tether my phone to download the other bits before watching a dvd
<Aquix> restrictes is in every 10 things to do blabla  blog piece
<oimon> Aquix: yes, but unless it has changed in natty, it doesn't include encrypted dvd support
<Aquix> I use mint 11, I wouldn't know
<oimon> wow, first time using MS Office ribbon..dislike. Did someone say LibreOffice is going the same way?
<AlanBell> no, don't think it is
<AlanBell> personally I think DVD playback on a computer is a pretty niche use-case
<BigRedS> oimon: I found I _much_ preferred it over the old interface within a few hours' use
<oimon> BigRedS: i probably won't be using it that long. openoffice is fine except for rare cases when a word doc has been inhertied through the years
<BigRedS> there's been discussion about 'modernising' OOo's interface for _years_, mostly stalled by Sun wanting to keep StarOffice consistent I gather. I don't think LO's got much appetite for any more UI changes than polishing given all teh under-the-hood fixing to do :)
<oimon> AlanBell: i would expect a lot of laptop users in particular watch dvds on their laptop
<BigRedS> Ah, that's good to hear :) When I was using it, trying to use OOo in an MS Office envrionment was a daft idea
<BigRedS> now, I just don't use office suites :)
<AlanBell> oimon: well it is a nice trick for amusing the kids on holiday, but really I don't sit and watch films on my laptop
<oimon> imagine you are a student or live in a shared house, or live with parents. suddenly the requirement would go up (esp. if you don't believe in torrenting/pirating films)
<AlanBell> yeah, but that is maybe 5 years of your four score and ten
<AlanBell> not saying that nobody does it, just doesn't seem like a very important thing for a computer to do
<AlanBell> http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Design/Whiteboards
<daftykins> DVD playback remaining on a laptop is pretty niche i'd agree, but i would say there is a growing use-case for (perhaps travelling only) families to have a playback device with multiple headphone outputs and possibly multiple screens
<daftykins> also, hi
<AlanBell> yeah, got a dual screen dual disk DVD player for the car
<daftykins> ooh
<daftykins> interesting
<AlanBell> and nice loud DVD player/amp for the telly
<Hippychick> ive got 2 headphone sockets on my laptop
<daftykins> Hippychick: yeah i've started to hear about many having that
<AlanBell> the thing we have for the car has headphone sockets for each side of the base unit and a socket on each monitor, and you can plug both monitors into one side of the base unit
<AlanBell> it would drive 4 monitors if we had them
<daftykins> what interface does it provide for those displays?
<AlanBell> dunno, looks like svideo I think
<AlanBell> it provides power over the link so I never felt inclined to plug it into anything expensive to see what it does
<oimon> now i'm a dad and my son likes to watch bagpuss and button moon. the laptop is more portable for that kind of stuff
<oimon> ripping takes forever and a lot of disk space
<oimon> so DVDs are more useful
<AlanBell> yeah, my kids watch DVDs on the telly and kick me out to my office to chat to people on IRC
<Laney> I quite often use it to watch dvds in bed or while travelling
 * popey pictures Laney in bed with a dvd
<Laney> you need to picture teddies
<Laney> and a hot water bottle
<Laney> possibly incense and a nightdress
<bigcalm> Oh my
<Laney> dear god travelling to the US is a pain
<daubers> Laney: That's because the US doesn't believe the rest of the world exists, so they shouldn't need to let you in if you can't prove that you really do exist
<daubers> Laney: Also, take tea
<Laney> that and there are surprisingly no convenient flights
<Laney> I'm taking my bag of clocks as hand luggage
<MartijnVdS> Laney: analog ticky clocks I hope?
<Laney> they go well with my beard
<czajkowski> ;d/c
 * MartijnVdS hands czajkowski a fresh keyboard
<Laney> yay, all booked!
<Laney> popey: you going?
<czajkowski> stupid tiny mac
<MartijnVdS> BOOM
 * MartijnVdS has a Banshee crash.. this time with a stacktrace
<MartijnVdS> I tend to get lots of dbus/gconf errors.. and this seems to be one
<popey> Laney: going where?
<Laney> orlando
<popey> no
<popey> â¹
<popey> home time \o/ ttfn
<Laney> :'(
<directhex> i'm going to go meet wifey at the station. it's rainy and horrible
<Daviey> Laney: urgh, you are going?
<Daviey> wow, they let anyone go these days :)
<Laney> just the tea boy
<Daviey> oh good. There wasn't enough tea last time.
<czajkowski> bring your own tea bags
<czajkowski> gord: has learnt his lesson and I'm not there to supply em
 * Laney is going to resist the trays of cakes this time
<Laney> this is the place that had the huge apples isn't it?
<Aquix> yeah, we eat apples for breakfast
<czajkowski> me I eat bacon and waffles and syrup
<czajkowski> in some form or an another
<Aquix> or luch, if they are in a nice pie
<czajkowski> followed by some mountain dew
<Aquix> and colombian coffee
<Aquix> mmmmhmmm
<Aquix> we also have big balls
<Laney> O_O
<daftykins> mmm mountain dew
<MartijnVdS> hmmm Bawls
 * bigcalm pops out for milk so he can say mmm tea
<geekMePlease> How should you set up E367 -modem for Wicd, when you have no default network-manager in 11.10?
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Matthew Garrett] UEFI secure booting - http://mjg59.livejournal.com/138973.html
<Lcawte> hmm, where to advertise this wikimedia developers meetup outside of teh wikimedia lists...
<hamitron> wikimedia?
<zleap> lug lists
<zleap> fossevents
<Azelphur> bit late, but woo asdfmovie 4 is out :D
<Azelphur> hilariously funny things are hilariously funny \o/
<czajkowski> ok oneiric you have about 1 more chance to behave or tis natty again
<czajkowski> slow and stalling for no reason is beginging to get on my you know whattis
#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-21
<shauno> heh, classic.  Just got an email from one of my vps providers, telling me my host has gone over it's bandwidth allowance.
<shauno> which sounded wrong because it's just a failover MX.  it sees very little traffic at all
<shauno> their web portal says it's at "41.8 TB of 500 GB Used / -44409274698 KB Free".  I call shenanigans.
<Azelphur> haha
<PalaPad> wb everyone ;)
 * dogmatic69 survived 
<dogmatic69> every time i create a vm virtual box dies creating the space for a fixed drive :/
<PalaPad> Bad blocks on the drive maybe?
<PalaPad> Oooo am at barking already only a few stops to go
<dogmatic69> Paladine: its a newish drive, how can i check?
<dogmatic69> been at 0% for 15 minutes now
<PalaPad> Run e2fsck or something
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps!
<dogmatic69> o/
<PalaPad> Nearly at fenchrurch
<dogmatic69> you cant do a disk check on a disk that is mounted?
<dogmatic69> my pc has one HDD only
<bigcalm> dogmatic69: tell it to force a check on next boot
<dogmatic69> bigcalm: i reboot when the power trips :/
<JamesTait> Morning all!
<dogmatic69> tired virtual machine manager and it created the 8gig drive in < 1 second
<dogmatic69> virtual box ftl
<dogmatic69> unity 2D crashes on my vm
<jpds> shauno: Looks like 'apt-get install vnstat' time.
<Daviey> wow, Radio 4 is a little colourful today.
<popey> Morning all!
<bigcalm> Hola
<czajkowski> aloha
<gord> Konnichiwa
<popey> YES!
<MartijnVdS> popey: Yes?
<bigcalm> TSB
<popey> Yes.
 * czajkowski pokes gord 
<czajkowski> I need someone to replace my lack of davmor2 and MooDoo
<AlanBell> ããä¸ç¾½ï¼
<gord> oh, i'm no replacement for them, far to nice
<diplo> Morning all
<bigcalm> They are far too nice?
<popey> O_O
<MartijnVdS> à² _à² 
<czajkowski> gord: true
<czajkowski> gord: who else do you suggest
<gord> czajkowski, i do not trust this Daviey fellow
<czajkowski> gord: ya know you make a truely valid point, however I need to be nice to Daviey he has a package for me I need from him in the coming weeks.
<ProfPourEtudiant> hi
<AlanBell> hi
<czajkowski> gord: then I cant pick on AlanBell as he is the leader
<czajkowski> gord: cant pick on popey as he knows all
<czajkowski> gord: so it has to be you till Davmor2 comes in
<czajkowski> otherwise I'll scare others if I pick on them
<bigcalm> Heh
<bigcalm> Poor gord
 * AlanBell has immunity \o/
<czajkowski> <--------- my logic works wonders
 * bigcalm eyes czajkowski 
<bigcalm> AlanBell: read that as James Bond villain saying "Diplomatic immunity"
<AlanBell> bigcalm: that was exactly how I said it :)
<bigcalm> Nice one :D
<AlanBell> actually Die Hard I think, the SA chap
<bigcalm> Oh sod, yes
<bigcalm> I feel silly now
<TheOpenSourcerer> Thanks bigcalm
<bigcalm> TheOpenSourcerer: no patches?
<TheOpenSourcerer> It's fine.
<bigcalm> Good show :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> It will probably be moving home in the next couple of months so will have to go down :-(
<bigcalm> If you had it on a UPS you could move it bit by bit towards its new home
<harry_> hey , anyone here who can tell me how to keep window always on top in linux using script??
 * bigcalm wants to make a joke about Windows and market share, but shall refrain
<bigcalm> Sorry, I don't know :)
<harry_> okay thanks..
<oimon> anyone see that blog post on planet about UEFI secure boot?
<bigcalm> Seen links to it all over twitter and G+. Not got around to reading it
<oimon> could stop you installing your own OS
<bigcalm> Yes, so I hear
<AlanBell> it looks nasty to me
<TheOpenSourcerer> I wouldn't worry - it will almost certainly be hacked and broken before it's even released.
<bigcalm> Would it be a case for the monopolies commission?
<AlanBell> it will end up like region coded DVD players, you will have to send your laptop off somewhere to be chipped before it will boot linux
<TheOpenSourcerer> "Windows" and "security" crop up a great deal in the same articles. I'll just say: https://twitter.com/#!/opensourcerer/status/116441785110233088
<oimon> TheOpenSourcerer: is that an internet facing server?
 * bigcalm steps back
<TheOpenSourcerer> oimon: No.
<oimon> ok..otherwise i would have asked for IP address ;)
<TheOpenSourcerer> I wouldn't tell you anyway :P
<AlanBell> 10.0.0.1 I think :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> nah,
<oimon> i've had servers go over 1000 days before
<TheOpenSourcerer> 2
<AlanBell> 64 bytes from 10.0.0.2: icmp_req=1 ttl=62 time=45.8 ms
 * oimon thinks of privilege escalation bugs in the kernel over the last 571 days
<oimon> unless you have ksplice of course
<TheOpenSourcerer> bah - of course. it is accessible via AlanBell's network... Hmm, better do an nmap sweep of his house.
<AlanBell> yikes!
<bigcalm> Something is changing â¬ into Â¤ in emails I'm sending via PHP, but I can't work out what.
<pancro> bigcalm: looks like your encoding may be wrong, maybe you're sending our ISO-8859-1 encoding headers instead of ISO-8859-15 (where Â¤ is replaced by â¬), better off using UTF-8 anyway
<pancro> s/sending our/sending out/
<ikonia> other than Scan and Ebuyer what's a reasonable online UK etailer that people trust ?
<bigcalm> pancro: it's using UTF-8
<bigcalm> ikonia: dabs.co.uk
<bigcalm> Or .com, I forget
<ikonia> ahh, I forgot dabs
<ikonia> I thought they had gone under for some reason
<bigcalm> BT bought them
<ikonia> totally forgot about them
<ikonia> thank you
<bigcalm> Amazon are good for bits as well
<ikonia> I was pondering that, but they are mostly "market place" stores that I've had bad experiences with market store on amazon
<ikonia> if it doesn't come from amazon it's self I'm cautious now
<pancro> bigcalm: just wondering because of the fact that Â¤ was replaced by â¬ in newer 8-bit codepages... just wondering if it's UTF-8 through and thourgh or if there's a link in the chain still working with 8 bit characters. do other UTF-8 characters show up ok?
<bigcalm> I've only had one semi-bad experience with a market place seller. YMMV
<ikonia> I've had some good ones too, but the risks and issues dealing with the bad ones put me of
<ikonia> off
<bigcalm> Fair enough
<ikonia> who are the reputable SSD brands at the moment, I'm assuming OCZ are still a core player
<ikonia> my hard disk just died so I'm tryin to get a replacment, and scan have have SSD's on "pre order" for about 3 months,
<bigcalm> ikonia: I have an OCZ and would buy again (if I had the money)
<davmor2> morning all
<bigcalm> Hi davmor2. You need to apologise to gord for your late arrival
<oimon> ikonia: insight
<ikonia> oimon: that's a name I've not heard before
<davmor2> bigcalm: why this is the time I arrive :P
<davmor2> gord: ^ what's he on?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Nice. AlanBell 's house is only exposing two entry points.
<davmor2> TheOpenSourcerer: front door and back door ;)
<davmor2> bigcalm: what you on about dude?
<bigcalm> davmor2: czajkowski needed somebody to pick on and you weren't here
<davmor2> czajkowski: prod, don't annoy gord, you'll upset him you big bully :P
 * davmor2 passes gord a cup of tea there you go chap calm down and have a brew
<togster> Morning all
 * czajkowski kicks davmor2 well get your arse on earlier then 
<czajkowski> davmor2: let me tell you about my fun week shall I
<davmor2> czajkowski: No you need to let it stew and boil over for when I get on
<czajkowski> davmor2: I lack patience how do you not know this by now
<davmor2> czajkowski: I do know it but I figure it would annoy you all the more :P
<oimon> http://primaxstudio.com/stuff/scale_of_universe/
<oimon> ^^ cool way to spend 3 minutes
<j0nr> anyone know how to strip all UserTextFrames out of mp3 files using eyeD3?
 * czajkowski hands davmor2 a cuppa tea 
 * davmor2 looks at czajkowski blankly tea............you gave me tea.............and you think I don't know you :P
 * czajkowski gives davmor2 a digestive bickie to dunk 
<czajkowski> now shrup ya pup
 * davmor2 goes down stairs pours away the tea and makes a coffee to dunk the bickie in
<bigcalm> Anybody know who KiltedUberGeek is on twitter?
<czajkowski> davmor2: don't say I was never nice
<czajkowski> you all saw that he poured the tea I made for him
<davmor2> czajkowski: I don't drink tea you should know that by now :P
<czajkowski> pff drink tea all english men do
<bigcalm> And some Irish ladies
<czajkowski> me I love my tea
<czajkowski> need _tea to function
<dogmatic69> how can i force kill some process? got a VBox something or an other running at 98% and making my cpu +- 95'C
<dogmatic69> cant do it from htop with sigkill etc
<TheOpenSourcerer> sudo kill -9 pid
<dogmatic69> tried killall
<dogmatic69> says no pid found, but htop says its pid 677
<bigcalm> I </3 VM :(
<dogmatic69> ye...
<popey> uhoh
<TheOpenSourcerer> ps aux | grep something relevant should give you the right pid
<dogmatic69> 1000       439 97.3  0.0      0     0 ?        Zl   08:56 200:40 [VBoxSVC] <defunct>
<TheOpenSourcerer> so it's 439 then
<dogmatic69> sudo killall -9 439
<dogmatic69> 439: no process found
<TheOpenSourcerer> How come your uid isn't your username?
<popey> uhm
<AlanBell> killall does process name
<popey> dont do killall pid
<popey> do kill -9 pid
<AlanBell> kill does process number
<TheOpenSourcerer> sudo kill -9 pid
<popey> or killall name
<TheOpenSourcerer> not killall
<popey> or sudo service vboxsvc stop
<dogmatic69> killall name does nothing, kill -9 pid has no error, still running
<gord> guys its restarting
<gord> you can't kill it because the process already died and restarted
<gord> thus it got a new pid
<gord> you need to kill whatever is restarting it
<dogmatic69> popey to the rescue \o/
<popey> :D
<dogmatic69> oh no
<dogmatic69> its going...
<dogmatic69> in htop the pid is always 677
<dogmatic69> the pxu grep still says 439
<oimon> dogmatic69:  ps -ef | pastebinit
<popey> ps aux | pastebinit
<popey> :D
<oimon> aux sux dude
<dogmatic69> http://pastebin.com/n0Sg3yr7
<oimon> ps -ef give you the parent pid too
<bigcalm> !ping
<lubotu3> another contentless ping... sigh...
<dogmatic69> TheOpenSourcerer: in htop it shows my username, not 1000
<oimon> i bet your username is > 8 characters
<dogmatic69> dogmatic69
<dogmatic69> :)
<oimon> yeah, that's a feature of ps
<davmor2> czajkowski: yeap but then you should love guinness too and do you?
<MartijnVdS> oimon: "feature"
<MartijnVdS> oimon: it's documented, but hard to find
<czajkowski> davmor2: eh no
<davmor2> czajkowski: so you're not really Irish then :P
<czajkowski> nope half
<MartijnVdS> czajkowski: only the accent? :)
<czajkowski> yes my accent does make me rather unique in work here
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: I was thinking more only the attitude :D
<czajkowski> davmor2: I kick your ass
<davmor2> see
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: I'll just imagine a badly dubbed Japanese film
<czajkowski> MartijnVdS: oi
<czajkowski> fecker
<davmor2> czajkowski: swearing in Irish is still swearing madame
<MartijnVdS> czajkowski: you know the kind I mean then? :)
<czajkowski> MartijnVdS: coming for drinks tomorrow ?
<MartijnVdS> czajkowski: no, I'm on the wrong side of the North Sea
<dogmatic69> :/
<dogmatic69> still running, tried apt-get remove
<dogmatic69> just says its still running, stop it first :S
<oimon> dogmatic69: apt-get remove won't kill the process in memory. what does lsof -p 439 show
<dogmatic69> nothing
<oimon> i'm surprised kill -9 439 isn't slapping it
<czajkowski> ~/win 23
<czajkowski> hmm not impresssed with the new two and a half men :/
<AlanBell> not satisfied with just one?
<dogmatic69> oimon: is there like a -vv option?
<czajkowski> oh yes I'll be talking at a UK flossie event
<czajkowski> on Ubuntu and Ubuntu Women this year
<czajkowski> time to be on my best behaviour BBC are here to record
<czajkowski> and I'm on a massive MAC :/
<dogmatic69> i broke down and rebooted the pc
<selinuxium> Hi all    o/
<oimon> i wonder how much apple pay the BBC to feature their logo on screen every 60 seconds during an episode of spooks?
<czajkowski> and worse they need to use my HTC phone
<MartijnVdS> oimon: is that even allowed? Ads in BBC programs?
<oimon> it is constant
<gord> i wonder how much they paid czajkowski to use a mac whilst filming!
<gord> i smell corruption
<czajkowski> gord: look a new dell has been bought
<czajkowski> I've been asking where to put it
<czajkowski> hence me getting live cd off AlanBell tomorrow
<gord> i don't mind ;) macs are great too
<oimon> spooks already got a soft telling-off in 2005 but it is worse than ever
<MartijnVdS> Apple must pay more than the fine ;)
<selinuxium> czajkowski, Well done in the rugger!  :)
<czajkowski> selinuxium: why thank you
<oimon> product placement rules are very weak
<czajkowski> selinuxium: coming for beers tomorrow
<selinuxium> czajkowski, sadly I am still working from home until next week... Leg is getting much better though...
<czajkowski> great to hear it
<selinuxium> Don't think my American football career will be back on though... :)
<czajkowski> awww *hugs* selinuxium
<oimon> i've complained to ofcom about spooks
<czajkowski> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-14858056 it's over this
<JGJones> Maybe this is old news by now but was just told briefly that devices coming with Windows 8 would have a means to prevent any form of dual booting with other type of OS such as linux?
<TheOpenSourcerer> JGJones have a look back up there ^^^
<TheOpenSourcerer> (10:35:42) oimon: anyone see that blog post on planet about UEFI secure boot?
<oimon> yep
<oimon> http://slashdot.org/submission/1794130/How-MS-may-stop-you-from-installing-your-own-OS
<oimon> deserves front page prominence
<JGJones> The good old days of DVD player's that you get chipped is back!
 * popey pokes Seeker` with the top of http://www.hantslug.org.uk/wiki/HugoRandomBenchmark
<JGJones> Ah well...if they try that with Windows 8 server, it won't be very successful, as windows doesn't have as large a dominance on servers compared to desktops
<oimon> it's very likely we could see locked down hardware similar to locked down mobiles
<JGJones> oimon - possibly, but now HTC and Samsung have changed their tune and allowing for bootloaders to be unlocked on their newest devices etc.
<oimon> JGJones but what if this is driven by MS who have history of trying to enforce their desktop monopoly through OEMs?
<gord> good luck selling machines in china if you need real versions of windows on them
<JGJones> oimon, it's possible they could drive this for desktops, but what about servers? Linux does have a healthy share there and OEM will not want to lose sales on that
<JGJones> as for mobiles - good luck to them, MS have a tiny % (around 2% perhaps)
<oimon> it's easier to buy servers without MS preinstalled
<oimon> so MS don't really have that strangehold - server vendors would include a bios option to turn off secure boot
<oimon> i doubt you will get the same opotion on your laptop
<Seeker`> popey: YOU RAT!
<JGJones> aye...the desktops is the tricky area...but I'm hoping that EU might not allow it to happen
<JGJones> ie machines must allow the option to turn off otherwise it's potentially an abuse for monopoly?
<czajkowski> /win/win 1
<czajkowski> grrrrrr
<czajkowski> hate this ***** keyboard
<MartijnVdS> czajkowski: I think the word you're looking for is "poo"
<Seeker`> popey: I'm gonna have to buy a better cpu now :(
<czajkowski> MartijnVdS: insert word as apropiate
<czajkowski> :)
<MartijnVdS> czajkowski: oh you mean "lovely"?
<czajkowski> it's the mac and it's tiny wee keyboard
<MartijnVdS> So my first guess was close.. "poo", "wee" ....
<MartijnVdS> *back to work*
<popey> Seeker`: surprised yours at 4GHz is not as fast as a 3.4GHz one
<gord> i want 4ghz :(
<Seeker`> popey: depends on the integer maths stuff  I guess. If they shaved 1 clock off the time it takes to get an integer result back...
<AlanBell> TheOpenSourcerer: we need a faster server
<TheOpenSourcerer> huh?
<AlanBell> http://www.hantslug.org.uk/wiki/HugoRandomBenchmark
<AlanBell> bit surprised the 980ex isn't top
<AlanBell> I guess it has more cores, but isn't quite as screaming fast
<TheOpenSourcerer> When did you run that?
<AlanBell> when we were commissioning it
<TheOpenSourcerer> Ah OK - so no load to speak of
<popey> my desktop was idle too
<popey> other than ubuntu desktop running
<TheOpenSourcerer> I was just doing some time trials using netcat between servers
<popey> and 'watch -d "grep MHz /proc/cpuinfo"'
<TheOpenSourcerer> nc is approx 33% faster than scp.
<popey> saw most cores at 1600MHz, one at 3400MHz
<popey> I thought it was supposed to turbo up to 3.8GHz
<popey> I AM DISSAPOINT
<JGJones> why can't OEM's implement an unique OS UEFI startup? To work on it, all OS must have their source opened up? #wishfulthinking #damnitjoethisisn'ttwitter
<AlanBell> one thing I found odd was that sometimes it was faster running in a VM guest than running in the host
 * oimon squeezed into the top 10
<Seeker`> I was top for quite a long time
 * gord starts looking on amazon for liquid nitrogen cooling
<TheOpenSourcerer> real	0m6.268s My desktop
<TheOpenSourcerer> My home server real	1m0.566s ;-)
<popey> hehe
<popey> I'd love to find something slower than the one at the bottom of the list
<TheOpenSourcerer> It's a *downclocked* VIA C7
<TheOpenSourcerer> popey: run it on your nanode ;-)
 * BigRedS swears at innodb a lot
<gord> my phone thinks i am somewhere in the mid atlantic atm, its clock is sooo broken
<popey> haha TheOpenSourcerer
<AlanBell> should get a raspberry pi on the list
<czajkowski> AlanBell: the flossie people are having me speak at their 2 day conf  in May
<czajkowski> cheer for the intor to Paula
<AlanBell> I know :)
<czajkowski> *intro
<AlanBell> it might be in Queen Mary University London
<czajkowski> I'm sure I'll find it by then
<czajkowski> got the link to the even if spo can you pm it to me
<czajkowski> I got it yesterday
<popey> its odd that there's almost no AMD CPUs on the benchmark paid
<popey> *page
<oimon> maybe people only bother to update when they are in the top 10
<oimon> the non top ten entries being previous high rankers
<oimon> or novelty entries
<popey> i have put loads in there
<oimon> AlanBell: what's happening maybe at queen mary?
<popey> not just when at top
<oimon> popey you're a bit special though
<popey> thanks! :D
<selinuxium> Been playing with Minus... 10GB free online storage and you get an extra gig by inviting others... :) http://min.us/rKuVgho    (well, you have to try...)
<popey> a) is it cross platform?
<popey> b) does it work behind proxies?
<andylockran> what alternative cli print commands are there to lp ?
<andylockran> i.e. - what does cups use to send the test page to the printer?
<MartijnVdS> andylockran: it just opens a pipe to itself I guess
<MartijnVdS> andylockran: /var/run/cups/cups.sock looks useful for that? maybe?
<andylockran> MartijnVdS: I've got to get an old jaunty server printing to a Zebra
<MartijnVdS> cupsPrintFiles() in libcups
<andylockran> had to create a custom ppd and it works fine on lucid and natty
<andylockran> lp is printing blanks
<andylockran> well, when asked to print a pdf
<andylockran> whereas the test page is printed fine
<MartijnVdS> andylockran: test page could be plain .ps
<andylockran> wahey!
<andylockran> thanks MartijnVdS that's sorted it :p
<oimon> i'm not sure if minus.com actually keep your data private
<andylockran> MartijnVdS: awesome - thanks for your help :)
<selinuxium> popey, it is multi-platform. Unsure about proxy as I haven't tried..
<s-fox> Hello.
<brobostigon> is it possible to put a foursquare widget on my website? by some method?
<s-fox> brobostigon,  http://aboutfoursquare.com/highlight-your-foursquare-venue-on-your-companys-website-or-facebook-page-with-placewidget/ ?
<brobostigon> thank you s-fox :)
<diplo> Anyone use fail2ban on there servers ?
<brobostigon> yes.
<diplo> Just wondering if its worth the effort to setup, just seeing lots of attempts at ssh
<diplo> I've got key based auth on so not getting in any time soon
<Laney> wasn't much effort ime
<diplo> But just thought it would be worth banning them trying
<brobostigon> Laney: what is the alternate, in your mind?
<Laney> alternate to what? fail2ban?
<Laney> denyhosts? using a different port for ssh
<brobostigon> yes
<diplo> yeah, was debating moving ports as well
<diplo> My router sucks though
<diplo> Can open new ports but can't forward to different ones :/
<oimon> fail2ban is easy and useful
<popey> diplo: i just moved ssh to another port
<Laney> limiting the IPs that can connect
<Laney> various
<diplo> I did debate about that as well popey, may just do it tonight instead
<diplo> Skys T&C's say not to use a non Sky router
<diplo> But may just do it anyhoo
<gord> just means you can't get support from them without using their router
<diplo> Friend had lots of speed issues using different routers
<gord> me too, but that was mostly because sky are kinda crap
<bigcalm> I replaced my parents' sky adsl router with a netgear one. Works just fine
<diplo> Friends dropped from 8mb down to 4mb ish with 2 different routers, one being a draytek 2820
<popey> reminds me, must reboot mu superhub and enable modem only mode
<popey> Seeker`: oi
<popey> Seeker`: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-scribes can you add AlanBell as an admin of that group?
<popey> Seeker`: given he maintains meetingology, the bot people are now using
<Seeker`> popey: able to reactivate your membership?
<popey> I'm not a member
<popey> i tried to join but its pending
<popey> and only you and ausimage can fix that
<Seeker`> ah
<Seeker`> hmm
<popey> and he is awol
<popey> AIUI
<Seeker`> I can't change people to administrators
<popey> bah
<popey> why not, you're an admin
<Seeker`> only people I can change admin status on is me and ausimage
<popey> yeah, AlanBell isnt in the team
<popey> he tried to join but nobody approved him
<Seeker`> he is now
<popey> ah, so he is
<AlanBell> o/
<Seeker`> maybe only the owner of the group can create new admins?
<Laney> only the owner of a team can make people admins
<Laney> SNAP
<AlanBell> should I move the code in there or something?
<Seeker`> is there a process for marking people as long term missing and take control of it?
<popey> yeah
<popey> contact them, see if they can do it out of courtesy
<popey> if they dont respond or tell you to go away, contact lp admins
<popey> in #launchpad
<Seeker`> tried contacting ausimage?
<popey> I have not
<geekMePlease> How can you set up network manager only handle mobile-broadband?
<popey> would you like to, as you're admin?
<Seeker`> sure
<geekMePlease> * I use Wicd for my other connections
<popey> why do you use wicd?
<geekMePlease> popey: Yes
<geekMePlease> popey: Because, I want to set on and off particular devices and connections
<geekMePlease> popey: In network manager, you can set only all connections off or all connection on.
<popey> define "connections"?
<popey> thanks Seeker`
<popey> geekMePlease: i can switch off wired, and switch off wifi individually
<geekMePlease> popey: I have many wifi -connections
<popey> you have more than one wifi device?
<geekMePlease> popey: Yes, I am a radio-amatour
<oimon> wow facebook just changed.
<geekMePlease> popey: Is it possible to set up network-manager only handle mobile-broadband?
<popey> i dont know
<popey> i mean, yes
<popey> you can, but I dont know how that affects wicd because I dont use wicd
<geekMePlease> popey: I do not understand how network-manager works. Is there any file for its settings?
<Seeker`> AlanBell: You should have been CC'd on the email I sent
<Seeker`> AlanBell: If he doesn't respond, give me a poke after what you feel is an appropriate amount of time and I'll go speak to the guys in #launchpad
<popey> thanks Seeker` !
<AlanBell> thanks Seeker`
<Seeker`> AlanBell: you now have full access (and +F) in -scribes too
<MartijnVdS> hmm
<AlanBell> thanks
<diplo> Guys any advice here
<diplo> ssh-keygen -t rsa
<diplo> creates a pub key as expected
<diplo> I copy that to authorized_keys
<diplo> Not working, when I look at other keys I have put there when I arrow down over them it skips to next one each time
<diplo> On the new one it lets me arrow down each line
<diplo> Any thoughts...
<diplo> Copy and paste from one to another breaking something ?
<MartijnVdS> diplo: the keys are one very long line
<MartijnVdS> well
<MartijnVdS> one key per line
<MartijnVdS> your editor might be wrapping it strangely
 * MartijnVdS prefers ssh-copy-id these days
<MartijnVdS> that does it for me
<diplo> I was thinking that after typing that
<diplo> I keep meaning to try that
<diplo> Maybe tomorrows job, just edited the file now
<diplo> See if that works
<diplo> Thanks MartijnVdS
<MartijnVdS> GGAAHH
 * MartijnVdS shouts at Banshee
<MartijnVdS> Method "Set" with signature "s(ii)" on interface "org.gnome.GConf.Database" doesn't exist
<MartijnVdS> (yes I have a bug number, but it's private)
<diplo> yeah it was that, but deo will try ssh-copy-id tomorrow
<diplo> has that been round a while ?
<diplo> off home
<diplo> cya later all
<bigcalm> !ping
<lubotu3> another contentless ping... sigh...
<MartijnVdS> !pong
<lubotu3> pong is an old atari game. It's fun!
<bigcalm> !ding
<lubotu3> dong
<MartijnVdS> !poo
<JDmaX> hi ubuntu fans
<daubers_> lo
 * daubers is cold
<PalaPad> Evening
<majdekalel> how can i configure cgi-bin folder in ubuntu ??? im using apache2 ??????
<PalaPad> In the httpd conf
<majdekalel> is there any libraries i have to install to use cgi ?
<majdekalel> or just configure cgi-bin folder ?
<PalaPad> Or if you are using virtual hosts you can define them explicitly in the config files
<PalaPad> I don't think you need any extra modules for cgi-bin but I have never used it so you should check
<Lcawte> hmm, where is my java installed @ :/
<hamitron> somewhere in /
<hamitron> ;)
<bigcalm> opt?
<Lcawte> Nope, but I got it...
<Lcawte> umm, right, why won't my permissions stay the same..
<Lcawte> I try to give a file +x  but it keeps getting removed..
<davmor2> czajkowski: prod
<czajkowski> davmor2: oi oi
<MartijnVdS> So, anyone here on oneiric? :)
 * BigRedS is
<czajkowski> me
<MartijnVdS> On amd64?
<BigRedS> yeah
<BigRedS> well, not right now, the PC's off, but I can turn it on if you're after a test of something
<MartijnVdS> Does flash have sound for you? While playing sound using some other app (music from banshee, video from totem, etc.)
<BigRedS> Oooh, I'll give it a go, hang on
<MartijnVdS> I can play multiple sounds at a time, as long as none of those is Flash
<BigRedS> Oh man, you've just made me remember why I hardly ever turn this on :)
<BigRedS> but, yeah, rhythmbox and iplayer can both make noise at the same time
<MartijnVdS> hmmm
<MartijnVdS> BigRedS: latest oneiric?
<BigRedS> ah no, just updating
<BigRedS> I think it's about a week old
<MartijnVdS> hmm
<MartijnVdS> because libasound2-plugins:i386 is broken for me, and I think that provides Pulseaudio integration
<BigRedS> yeah, even updated I can do it
<MartijnVdS> BigRedS: hmm.. do you have the ia32libs package installed?
<MartijnVdS> ia32-libs, sorry
<BigRedS> oh, wait. I've a 686 kernel
<BigRedS> hm, that wasn't the plan
<MartijnVdS> that would explain :)
<BigRedS> haha, yeah
<N8> Hello?
<AlanBell> hello
<Guest84263> Hi, I'm looking for help installing ubuntu for my system
<AlanBell> great, how far have you got with it?
<Guest84263> I have already burned the disk, and I swapped my hard drive out for a blank one. I am in the stage of installing it right now
<Guest84263> By the way, thank you very much for helping me
<AlanBell> ok, shout if you have any questions as the install goes along
<Guest84263> I'm at one of those points right now
<Guest84263> I have started the install, and when the ubuntu logo with the 5 dots was on there for 10 minutes, It gives me this screen with 3 errors on it
<AlanBell> 10 minutes sounds a bit long to get to the start of the installer
<Guest84263> I don't know, but the first 2 times, I restarted because the num-lock key was not responding after 5 min.
<AlanBell> what machine is it?
<Guest84263> Kinda one I built out of legacy components. :/  Runs great on windows, though
<AlanBell> processor? graphics?
<AlanBell> ram
<Guest84263> old socket 7, 950 mhz. Um, Intel Coppermine, graphics card (old) .5 gig. sdram (also old)
<AlanBell> well that explains the 10 minutes :)
<Guest84263> yeah. I tweaked up windows so it would run smooth, so I kinda forgot how old it was
<AlanBell> that is a pentium 3 right?
<Guest84263> what do you mean?
<AlanBell> the coppermine chip
<Guest84263> yes. I have several others on my desk Lol.
<Guest84263> 950 Mhz. socket 7
<Guest84263> You there?
<AlanBell> yeah
<Guest84263> Do you want me to tell you what the error messages are?
<AlanBell> I think that might technically be below the hardware requirements, I was just checking them
<AlanBell> however it should work
<AlanBell> slowly
<AlanBell> what are the errors then?
<AlanBell> even if it does work I think you would enjoy Ubuntu a lot more on a more modern machine, even an Atom motherboard with intel graphics or something would be fine
<AlanBell> and there is a good chance the old graphics card is not supported now
<Guest84263> I know, but I can't afford that kind of stuff. Lol And I'm more into the code, and windows is very buggy sometimes
<Guest84263> So I have to make do with what I have
<AlanBell> try freecycle
<TheOpenSourcerer> I installed Ubuntu 10.10 on an old 500Mhz PIII laptop (256M RAM) at the weekend over the network (PXE boot)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Worked OK.
<AlanBell> interesting to know
<Pernig> i ran an Ubuntu live CD on a 800Mhz Pentium 3
<Guest84263> Yeah, windows will even work on a 300 mhz. computer with 256 meg. Ram
<TheOpenSourcerer> The chap bought me two pints for doing it! Yay free beer! :-D
<Guest84263> So I bet that ubuntu should run on my old clunker, right?
<Pernig> Guest: have you considered any of the versions with lighter desktop environments?
<AlanBell> Guest84263: windows 7?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Probably Guest84263 although it's a bit hard to tell but you should get some error messages or something rather than just 10 minutes of dots...
<Guest84263> I could not boot from usb, so I had to burn a disc, and I just got the newest.
<Guest84263> HOW DO YOU CHANGE YOUR NICKNAME??
<AlanBell>  /nick nameyouwant
<TheOpenSourcerer> It might be worth trying the "alternate" cd. It uses a text based installer.
<Pernig> i recommend Lubuntu
<AlanBell> but you can't have a nick that someone else has
<AlanBell> ni natesky9
<AlanBell> hi even
<natesky9> Yes. I hate being faceless
<Pernig> haha
<natesky9> ok, I had it run for 10 minutes, and it seemed like it was reading the disc, then it does this wierd thing where it fills top-left corner with random letter
<natesky9> first it was Q, now it is U
<natesky9> says busybox, and operates just like MS-DOS
<natesky9> ~And for the record, I currently can not try another os at the moment. I am out of discs, and it will not load from flash drive
<natesky9> Hello?
<AlanBell> try typing "exit"
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: if it's busybox, that probably means it can't find the root fs
<MartijnVdS> which tends to be BadÂ®
<AlanBell> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=879993
<natesky9> whoa! tried that, it said that it could not find the directory of like, 15 files
<natesky9> so what do  do if it keeps bringing me to busybox when I try installing it from the cd?
<geekMePlease> Is this: iwconfig wlan0 key off, the right way to disable one of your wifis?
<geekMePlease> * it does not seem to have any effect
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: no, it only disables encryption
<AlanBell> natesky9: well you can try the boot options in the forums post I linked to, or upgrade the hardware a bit
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: What is the right way?
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: permanent
<natesky9> when do I hit F6 to bring up grub?
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: do you want to completely disable it? or just disable it for the current boot?
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: Completely, I have two cards
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: pull one out ;)
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: Not possible now.
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: does the laptop have a wifi on/off switch?
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: No
<MartijnVdS> rfkill - tool for enabling and disabling wireless devices
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: you want to look at that tool
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: apt-cache show rfkill
<natesky9> when it boots, where do I hit F6 to bring up the GRUB?
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: Thank you! Need to google a bit about its parameters.
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: "rfkill" is what the function you want is called :)
<natesky9> Hello?
<natesky9> Can someone help me?
<natesky9> Hello?
<natesky9> Can someone help me?
<Pernig> natesky9: what's up?
<Myrtti> he left
<Pernig> oh aye
<natesky9> Hello, is anybody there?
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: Network-manager takes the rfkill block out if I use it.
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: I put rfkill block $IP-Wlan0 to startup-scripts
<geekMePlease> How can you configure which devices Network-manager use?
<natesky9> Hello?
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: lol, http://askubuntu.com/questions/3677/disable-wireless-on-startup
<AlanBell> well that was a big crash I just had
<AlanBell> natesky9: hi
<AlanBell> natesky9: so when you see the keyboard and person symbol, hit space and you should get to a menu
<AlanBell> not entirely sure you can set the options you want there
<AlanBell> I tried it in a virtual machine and ended up running myself out of memory and ended up rebooting my laptop
<natesky9> Oh, Had to reboot. Mine froze after 10 minutes
<natesky9> Is there a way we can chat w/o seeing everything else?
<AlanBell> no, unless you want to pay my consultancy rates :)
<natesky9> You there?
<AlanBell> there are lots of people here, and I am in 56 other channels with many parallel conversations in progress
<natesky9> Oh, ok
<natesky9> Trying to reboot my computer to boot on cd, but it keeps doing network boot even though I have it on last priority
<natesky9> I got the menu up, what should I go to?  (never would have figured this out)
<AlanBell> space, then enter to select english, then f6 to get the other options menu
<AlanBell> check the acpi=off and noapic options and press escape to get out of that menu
<AlanBell> then type in the rest of the line the forum post was on about
<AlanBell> all_generic_ide pci=nomsi
<AlanBell> so you add that bit ^^ to the end of the line of boot options
<AlanBell> and hit return to boot I think
<AlanBell> and wait and hope, and if it doesn't work, get a new computer :)
<natesky9> or more likele, make one. Lol
<natesky9> *likely
<natesky9> Well, right now I think it's froze, I have to wait for it
<natesky9> well, it's reading the disk right now, I'm not sure if it's working.
<gord> http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=11075 that is kind of an expensive but to reproduce
<Azelphur> indeed
<popey> haha
<natesky9> how do I keep it from booting up in UNDI?
<natesky9> never mind, I got it up in the menu
<natesky9> Hey Alen, you there?
<bigcalm> And, relax
<samm> HazRPG: Hey man. Is Facebook on Pidgin not working for you?
<samm> HazRPG: Since today I'm getting the error message "Not Authorized" and I can't use XMPP :(
<Pernig> samm: i am connected to Facebook chat via xmpp right now
<samm> Pernig: Hmmm I wonder what my problem is then
<samm> I have been poked by several people over a year ago, is it time to respond yet?
<Pernig> well i am using kopete so i guess it rules out the service having changed
<samm> Arghhh I hate this stupid "Not Authorized" message
<samm> I want to chat
<Pernig> it would be interesting to know if any other pidgin users can get on
<samm> Pernig: I've fixed it
<samm> Pernig: The solution was to log out of Facebook, and type my username in instead of my email address
<Pernig> cool
<samm> Pernig: I asked HazRPG because I know he uses FB on Pidgin
#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-22
<AlanBell> morning all
<TheOpenSourcerer> Meauning.
<daubers> Morning
<AlanBell> morning
<diplo> Morning all
<AlanBell> !info dbr
<lubotu3> Package dbr does not exist in natty
<Myrtti> Azelphur: plz fix your client
<hoover> good morning all
<Azelphur> Myrtti: it's not my client, it's my connection to freenode
<Azelphur> there's a node between me and freenode that keeps dropping/rejecting packets
<Azelphur> causing excess floods/disconnect/etc -.-
 * Azelphur wanders off back to sleep, hopefully it'll stop doing that.
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: Sleepwandering? :)_
<danfish> ahoy hoy! Happy hour this evening in Pimlico :)
* AlanBell changed the topic of #ubuntu-uk to: Welcome to #ubuntu-uk! http://ubuntu-uk.org | This channel is publicly archived http://irclogs.ubuntu.com | Mailing List http://tinyurl.com/uukml | Support Guidelines http://tinyurl.com/uuksupport | Meeting 20th October 21:00 UK time #ubuntu-uk-meeting | PUB!! Tonight!! http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1257/detail/
<AlanBell> oops
<popey> morning all
<MartijnVdS> howdy popey
<bigcalm> Morning peeps :)
<bigcalm> A company has added me on g+. Do I report them or not? Does g+ allow companies?
<popey> depends if you like the company :D
<popey> some companies are allowed
<MartijnVdS> if they pay Google enough money...
<JamesTai1> Morning all! :)
<bigcalm> Reid Electrical
<bigcalm> Electrical Wholesaler in Lincolnshire
<bigcalm> I can see tonytiger in its circles
<diplo> lol bigcalm I've just been talking to them
<diplo> They are one of my customers
<diplo> Well my companies customers
<bigcalm> `.`
<diplo> She only signed up to G+ yesterday
 * bigcalm tuts
<diplo> Hmm she seems to have gone through my circles and added nearly everyone
<diplo> Not a good move
<bigcalm> No
<diplo> M ight get herself kicked off
<popey> I'd have a word
<diplo> Think I will, not sure she gets it :)
<diplo> Don't know her that well, just a customer I chat to once a month or so
<BigRedS> Oh, the London happy hour is tonight, isn't it?
<bigcalm> Apparently
<BigRedS> By chance I've ended up being dispatched to London tonight, *and* I happen to be wearing a ubuntu t-shirt
<BigRedS> I suppose I need to go drinking
<popey> \o/
 * popey can't go
<MartijnVdS> popey: Banned from the city?
<bigcalm> HEh
<popey> hah, I have an appointment
<TheOpenSourcerer> bigcalm: I just got added by Reid too. I have no interest in them at the moment, but I have no issue of they want to follow me. I do not feel compelled to follow back.
 * TheOpenSourcerer is out for beer and curry tonight.
<bigcalm> I rarely follow people who follow me. I raised the issue as I wasn't sure if companies were allowed to do this
<dogmatic69> block + report spam
<TheOpenSourcerer> I'm sure I read something a while back that Google were going to do something slightly different for companies.
<AlanBell> yeah, I think it is best to be a well behaved company and wait until google tells us how to do it properly
<AlanBell> I think those who jump the gun and use personal profiles will regret it somehow
<bigcalm> I'm giving this one the benefit of the doubt as diplo says it's a new/confused user
<diplo> Going to phone her shortly, not sure what to say :) but will call her about her ways
<diplo> She's added people like Jono etc who are all State side :)
<AlanBell> yeah, they don't annoy me, I just think they will regret it
<oimon> this is sort of funny http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/space/8780657/Nasa-satellite-the-size-of-bus-could-land-almost-anywhere.html
<oimon> unless it hits you
<bigcalm> My my, Andy Piper is a chatty fellow :)
<diplo> I've emailed her guys, so hope that stops her :)
<diplo> I'd apologise but not sure it's my fault or is it... :/
<bigcalm> Heh
<bigcalm> What did you tell her about g+
<bigcalm> ?
<andylockran> howdy
<diplo> I said it's your decision, but you are likely to get banned/deleted if you do it as mos tof the people on my circles are technical they will just report you, plus most are not UK based, well a fair few
<diplo> No reply yet :) Or call
<diplo> Not the best person at calling/writng emails about stuff like this :P
<Myrtti> argh, I want more toast, but if I eat more, I'll be scolded for scoffing the whole bag
<Myrtti> and it's raining outside :-(
<diplo> The reply, "Woops sorry! I didnât know they were people you knew as I donât really know how to use it "
<diplo> I'll maybe send another explaining in's and out's
<diplo> :)
<daubers> Myrtti: I like rain :(
<Myrtti> daubers: so do I, when I'm indoors and I don't have to walk to the shop to get more toast
<daubers> Myrtti: Why do you buy toast? Why not just get bread and a toaster?
<Myrtti> ah, this same old problem
<Myrtti> in Finnish the bread you put in the toaster, the square fluffy white bread is called "toaster bread"
<Myrtti> so there, s/toast/bread/
<kirrus> Myrtti: you get that a lot? Also, this is what umbrellas are for :D
<Myrtti> ok, I'm getting more annoyed than this conversation warrants for, time to go brew more tea and hang out some laundry
<popey> \o/ cultural diversity
<bigcalm> Buying bread suitable for toasting in Japan was a laugh
<bigcalm> Found a packet of 7 slices
<dwatkins> "French Toast" always confuses me.
<MartijnVdS> surely that would be something like "pain grillÃ©"
<popey> is french toast the one where you butter it first?
<popey> oh, no, eggy bread
<MartijnVdS> http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wentelteefje
<dogmatic69> popey: how did you do the irc < - > mc stuff?
<popey> a script
<popey> tztk-server.pl
<popey> join #ubuntu-uk-minecraft and you'll see it in action
<dogmatic69> im there now and again
<dogmatic69> its awesome
<popey> oh :D
<popey> its fun given there's 3 servers doing it
<dogmatic69> hehe
<AlanBell> google adsense adverts will be getting a G+ +1 button
<popey> yeah
<popey> I LIKE THIS ADVERT!
<popey> (please give me some revenue)
<dogmatic69> cos everyone loves ads...
<AlanBell> which is the first move in getting company profiles on G+, they will be linked to addsense accounts
<AlanBell> and then they will get a bit enforcy with people setting up company names on personal profiles
<AlanBell> the entirely predictable strategy is emerging
<MartijnVdS> Still no sign of Apps accounts though :(
<popey> are you 'allowed' multiple G+ accounts?
<popey> I have loads of Google profiles, at least 6.
<popey> if i sign into G+ on all of them it'll be a mess to manage
<andylockran> popey: yeah
<andylockran> you can 'switch account'
<popey> i already do that
<popey> but i dont want to have multiple G+ accounts
<andylockran> it'd be good to have the 'join account' option like 'join contacts' in Android.
<popey> i already have ~900 people who are 'following' me on G+
<popey> haha, only just noticed the animation when you delete a circle in G+
<bigcalm> Ah, stars around a word in g+ makes it *bold*, like irc
<bigcalm> Well, some irc client will make that bold
<popey> yeah, annoyingly _underscores_ make it italics
<popey> not underlined
<bigcalm> Silly that
<oimon> i like how they updated a grammatically poor message with another similarly bad one :"This site is down for maintenance. We are will be restoring service shortly. Thank you for your patience.The Linux Foundation"
<oimon> moorfields eye hospital using open source patient record system \o/
<popey> yay
<diplo> Can I ask some advice guys on a setup
<diplo> We are a development company
<diplo> But we also look after customers sites/servers / software installs / updates etc
<diplo> I want to to make more secure
<diplo> They basically have very simple passwords on all sites, a lot of the passwords are teh same
<diplo> So thoughts are to go key based, disable root access remotely
<diplo> Issue is, we have 17 staff, and 80+ customer sites, anyone of the 17 staff could need to access any of the sites.. simplest way of sorting the key based set up that anyone can think of?
<dogmatic69> anyone for a new HDD... http://www.langtoninfo.co.uk/showitem.aspx?isbn=0842024015444
<diplo> And if we disable root access remotely do you think having a hard root password on different sites but using the same is an issue, I'd rather have different pass's but boss is worried about having 80+ root passwords to deal with
<oimon> sudo ?
<diplo> Old versions of CentOs/SCO mainly, so Cent could have sudo set up, don't think they want to do though
<diplo> They want it simple
<popey> diplo: have a gateway box that people ssh to, and ssh only allowed from there
<oimon> booking my car for a service and there's a question "Some cars require a fully synthetic or long life oil, does your car need this?"
<oimon> how would i know?
<DJones> oimon: My reply would be, "You're the mechanic/garage, does it?"
<diplo> popey: I suggested that to the boss man, only thing is he wants people to ssh from there own users
<diplo> So that is back to my Q about easy way of managing lots of keys between users I gues
<diplo> Some googling is needed i guess
<popey> oimon: performance cars sometimes do
<oimon> popey: cheers. that is all i need :)
<diplo> I used to use fully synthetic in my car, it really should be down to the garage to put what you need in the car, there are recommended oils
<diplo> Thing with fully synthetic is that it's alot thinner
<diplo> So if you have any loose seals you will defo know about it as you will get oil leaking :)
<Nour_al_imen> Hi
<Nour_al_imen> I need help please !
<kirrus> Hi Nour_al_imen
<kirrus> !ask | Nour_al_imen
<lubotu3> Nour_al_imen: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
<bigcalm> !ask | Nour_al_imen
<bigcalm> Heh
<Nour_al_imen> ok sorry
<Nour_al_imen> I m conducting a study
<Nour_al_imen> on open source
<davmor2> morning all
<Nour_al_imen> and how to spread it
<dogmatic69> make something good, it will spread like wild fire
<Nour_al_imen> and I'm looking for studies relaying this subject
<Nour_al_imen> ping bigcalm
<Nour_al_imen> I want to search rather for govermental plicies
<Nour_al_imen> policies
<Nour_al_imen> I want to act in my organisation
<Nour_al_imen> to change these policies
<Nour_al_imen> in order to spread open source
<kirrus> Nour_al_imen: I'm not sure there are any studies like that. You can find studies on people using opensource, like the french
<Nour_al_imen> I found some as for example the candian University moving to ubuntu
<Nour_al_imen> the army in france moving to ubnutu
<Nour_al_imen> see ?
<Nour_al_imen> And also schools in india
<Nour_al_imen> etc
<kirrus> Nour_al_imen: your best bet will probably be to just google it
<oimon> simon phipps gave a talk at oggcamp about it,
<oimon> and mentioned some good organisations to contact
<Nour_al_imen> good ! a link please !
<popey> i dont think Simons talk was recorded
<popey> or if it was, the recording was lost
<oimon> :(
<Nour_al_imen> But right now in UK is there some moves to spread OSS ?
<Nour_al_imen> thanks oimon
<Nour_al_imen> I mean actions or plans ?
<oimon> Nour_al_imen: take a look at simon's website anyway. http://www.webmink.net/ he is a sensible version of RMS
<Nour_al_imen> ok
<Nour_al_imen> thx
<Nour_al_imen> All right I think I'll contact him
<czajkowski> I'm on a windows machine and it feels rather odd, however really nice dell Vostro desktop!
<oimon> the process is difficult because the government promises to consider open source, but the consultants are entrenched in the MS/Oracle/ way and don't recommend other stuff
<Nour_al_imen> yes same for my country but we'r struggling for our causses
<Nour_al_imen> All right I think I'll contact him
<Nour_al_imen> Anyone has other organisations to contact ?
<oimon> http://opensource.org/
<oimon> EFF
<oimon> fsf
<Nour_al_imen> what do you mean by FSF
<oimon> free software foundation
<diplo> http://www.fsf.org/
<Nour_al_imen> Ok thx
<Nour_al_imen> I wrote to simmon
<Nour_al_imen> hope he will answer me
<oimon> lots of information is out there, you just need to read it :)
<davmor2> MooDoo: you online yet?  man anyone would think he'd had the baby ;)
<diplo> Hes posted to G+
 * czajkowski stabs MooDoo welcome back 
 * czajkowski kicks davmor2 shrup ya pup
<davmor2> diplo: I know but he's got a computer at Home I'm sure :)
<davmor2> czajkowski: Don't make me come over there and turn the firehose on you young lady
<czajkowski> :p
<oimon> the probability of making a typing error increases sharply when you know the delete key isn't working :-\
<DJones> directhex: Just saw your comments about insurance on twitter, the same happened to me AA quoted Â£800 underwritten with LIverpool Victoria, went direct to LV & got it for Â£300
<directhex> why do i pay so much for insurance :(
<DJones> Do you have a woman as a named driver on the policy?
<directhex> not anymore!
 * oimon does
<DJones> Thats why
<oimon> insurance costs so much because of fraud
<directhex> kicking the wife off the policy saved a bunch of money
<oimon> it has gone up about 40% in the last 2 yrs
<DJones> Mine is cheaper with my wife as a named driver despite her having about 18 years less driving experience than me
<directhex> oimon, wasn't there some change in the law to stop no-win-no-fee fraud claims?
<diplo> DJones: I just got quotes without my ex wife on there, and @ current Â£480, now Â£250, so not sure that's still current
<DJones> Wierd, mine goes down by about Â£30 when I add her
<diplo> Well, mine is due in 2 weeks. Phoning around tomorrow / web
<oimon> the system sucks
<diplo> See what I can find, but so far it seems cheaper
<diplo> Going to also phone my current provider and say why are you Â£200 dearer than everyone else when I have been with you X years
<oimon> i asked mine
<DJones> I used comparethemaverikmeerkat for mine, saved me Â£500 a year
<directhex> i didn't use them
<oimon> there's been an across-the-board increase
<directhex> i find their "use us and we'll find you the cheapest qu^W^Wa meerkat plushie!" condescneding
<oimon> "the main factors fuelling the record hike in premiums are the rising cost of personal injury claims and fraud"
<diplo> Saved enough to pay mine in full this year I hope, so save me Â£40-50 a month + the charge to pay by DD
<directhex> fraudulent meerkats
<Myrtti> Ill have to postpone my plans for driving school
<oimon> i was sad to discover that the fat opera bloke one was the cheapest, to my wife's amusement
<directhex> diplo, on the credit card, along with the rest of my spiralling debt
<Myrtti> was quite a bitter moment when I made the decision
<diplo> heh, that's the second choice.. just took out a new one with 15months 0%
<oimon> i don't care if the iggy pop company costs 1p, i won't use them
<DJones> I refused to go on the fat opera blokes website, the adverts are just too annoying, even with a mute button
<directhex> bloody hell, credit card is looking dire :/
<popey> sell your kidneys?
<popey> maybe not both
<directhex> time for part-time work
<DJones> Sell car...No need for insurance then
<diplo> Just paid mine off \o/ Checked my elec bill and was Â£450+ in credit
<Laney> indeed, /me doesn't drive
 * oimon will have a job opening soon for a linux geek
<diplo> oimon: If you were not so far away I'd jump at a chance of a new job
<oimon> especially one where you play with linux all day :)
 * popey notes canonical have sysadmin position open
<diplo> tbh I fairly much do that already, albeit my main role is a web dev I spend most of my time fixing linux related issues
<popey> https://tbe.taleo.net/NA3/ats/careers/requisition.jsp?org=CANONICAL&cws=1&rid=357
<oimon> canonical seem to ask for the earth: sysadmin + network admin  + dba
<oimon> any idea on salaries?
<MartijnVdS> oimon: iÂ²
<diplo> Dont you have to do all that sort of stuff at yours oimon ?
<oimon> yes except for the cisco stuff
<diplo> As per my old company, again even though I'm a web dev now it's anything with a socket on it :)
<oimon> we add vmware to that list too :)
<MartijnVdS> great, virtual sockets
<oimon> so , about the canonical salaries?
<MartijnVdS> oimon: iÂ²
<oimon> -1
<popey> oimon: ask JamesTai1
<oimon> the job description looks quite good actually
<diplo> yeah defo, was thinking the same
<popey> people tell me canonical pay quite well
<popey> but I dont know any numbers
<ging> i know all the numbers
<Laney> i only know up to 1000 :(
<ging> i know up to quadrillion
<Laney> took me a long time to memorise all of those too
<ging> think how i feel?
<gord> pretty sure canonical is just trying to hire all of #ubuntu-uk. we'll get there one day
<diplo> Think I am to unsure of myself to apply for jobs like that though :)
<Laney> needs moar ubuntu engineering jobs
<czajkowski> gord: pretty sure they're not  <RANT>
<popey> well, everyone who isn't is free to join https://launchpad.net/~not-canonical  :D
 * czajkowski hugs popey 
<czajkowski> back to using putty
<czajkowski> feels odd
<czajkowski> also all my buttons are opnm the wrong side of the screen
<diplo> heh it's odd isn't it
<czajkowski> libre office installs but wont launch
<diplo> Running win7 and 2 ubuntu machines all side by side, gets quite confusing
<bigcalm> Anybody using sharethis.com know if it's possible to add more than just text to outgoing emails?
<directhex> i have a snow shovel!
<diplo> http://www.parrot.com/uk/products/hands-free-car-kits/parrot-asteroid
<diplo> Sourcecode of files on there page
<diplo> good work
<bigcalm> Why has a Linkedin invite appeared on the mailing list?
<oimon> it's a shame the canonical jobs don't tell u more about the hours per week or more detailed job desc
<tonytiger> oimon: hours per week are whatever the magic spaceman demands of you!
<bigcalm> Heh
<daubers> tonytiger: He's the urban spaceman?
<oimon> once while i was working the 4th weekend in a row for my slave driver CEO, he mentioned i was looking rather thin.
<oimon> i don't think he made the connection even after i spelled it out
<popey> \o/ diplo
<popey> er
<popey> \o/ directhex
<directhex> i'm waiting for the full-size house shovel now.
<popey> bigcalm: which mailing list?
<directhex> ooh, maybe that's a way to earn some extra cash. shovelling snow.
<oimon> brown snow
<popey> got it bigcalm, went to my spam folder
<bigcalm> popey: ubuntu-uk
<daubers> directhex: My father in law has a snow plough attachment for his lawn mower
<daubers> He's used it twice since he moved back to the UK 30 odd years ago
<bigcalm> daubers: does he go by the name of Mr. Plow?
<directhex> snow!
<bigcalm> Where?
<directhex> plow!
<daubers> So...much.... innuendo..... must.... refrain
 * popey replies
<diplo> I really want to get a shovel and a sled for the boys this winter
<czajkowski> 13:29 < popey> well, everyone who isn't is free to join https://launchpad.net/~not-canonical  :D
<czajkowski> 13:29 < popey> well, everyone who isn't is free to join https://launchpad.net/~not-canonical  :D
<czajkowski> 13:29 < popey> well, everyone who isn't is free to join https://launchpad.net/~not-canonical  :D
<czajkowski> 13:29 < popey> well, everyone who isn't is free to join https://launchpad.net/~not-canonical  :D
<czajkowski> :29 < popey> well, everyone who isn't is free to join https://launchpad.net/~not-canonical  :D
 * popey pokes czajkowski 
<czajkowski> 13:29 < popey> well, everyone who isn't is free to join https://launchpad.net/~not-canonical  :D
<popey> oh dear
 * oimon shoots za-tab
<czajkowski> sorry
<daubers> czajkowski: Putty problems?
<czajkowski> so not used to putty
<czajkowski> sorry folks
<popey> :D
<czajkowski> thank feck was not worse!
<popey> mplayer goats.avi
<popey> "oops"
<davmor2> popey: you were going for mplayer menwhostareatgoats.avi right ;)
<oimon> i'm amazed that VM got the fewest complaints for their bb+phone
<oimon> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-15018161
<windmill> hello, I've just installed 11.10 beta1, is aptitude not installed by default?
<oimon> nope
<windmill> hmm why?
<diplo> Hasn't been since 10.04 ?
<windmill> :) last version i used
<diplo> heh
<oimon> apt-get is there still
<davmor2> windmill: because why do you need 6 ways to install a package
<windmill> true
<diplo> Used to still be able to apt-get aptitude, not sure if that is still the case
<oimon> sure
<oimon> apt-get install aptitude
<diplo> davmor2: I did prefer some of the output of aptitude, ie when you did a search it told you wat was installed
<diplo> But I don't miss it that much that I have ever reinstalled it
<oimon> sometimes i use it to install the recommended packages too
<oimon> i wonder what software centre does? bare bones (apt-get) or rec'd packages (aptitude)
<davmor2> oimon: What it's told to do ;)
<windmill> I don't suppose any of you knowledgeable chaps know how to configure a Finger Sensing Pad, hw: 13.2.1, sw: 1.0.0-K, buttons: 4 to do edge scrolling?
<windmill> not sure why it says 4 buttons
<windmill> dmesg says : input: FSPPS/2 Sentelic FingerSensingPad as /devices/platform/i8042/serio2/input/input10
<windmill> I was hoping it would be better supported in linux3
<oimon> i didn't know that the russian "simples" meerkat is working on porting android to touchpad http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IVkj_vdY6s&feature=player_embedded
<Laney> MartijnVdS: I got your Banshee hang today, and managed to get some debugging output
<Laney> next time you get it (make sure you've started banshee with --redirect-log; the .desktop file does this for you), run killall -SIGQUIT banshee and then look in ~/.config/banshee-1/log
<Laney> you should get some tasty debugging output
<MartijnVdS> Laney: okay
<MartijnVdS> Laney: The dbus/gconf thing looks scary :|
<Laney> I think it's maybe related to gconf
<Laney> going away during an upgrade?
<Laney> http://paste.debian.net/131555/
<MartijnVdS> It shuold be back after the upgrade, I think
<Laney> yes, but banshee may handle the interregnum incorrectly
<MartijnVdS> Laney: I'll have a look tonight
<Laney> pip pip
<tonytiger> windmill: also worth noting that apt-get now has most of the useful functionality from aptitude backported to it
<MartijnVdS> tonytiger: it even has more -- aptitude + multiarch is a bit brokenish
<tonytiger> sure
<MartijnVdS> while apt-get + multiarch works fine
<windmill> wow tonytiger, when you typed my nick the xchat logo jumped out from the left of the screen did a little dance and went back!!  that's cool
<tonytiger> windmill: wow
 * popey rejects someone from https://launchpad.net/~not-canonical
<gord> i didn't want to be part of your dumb group for jerks anyway!
<Laney> erm wow, this is one of the more fun reboots I've done lately
<Laney> no touchpad + no wireless
<Laney> :(
<daubers> oimon: re: VM complaints, i'd be interested to know what each of those companies classify as a "complaint"
<Laney> non-free drivers to the rescue!
<oimon> daubers: after reading the article i think the TT complaints were due to billing errors
<ali1234> oh wow, those fake AV calls were from an actual microsoft partner, not just some random company?
 * popey declines another person from not-canonical
<oimon> lol
<diplo> Wish you hadn't mentioned it in here ?
<diplo> :D
<oimon> what's the benefits of the club?
<popey> people wont mistake you for a canonical employee
<oimon> check out the neckbeards on these fellas http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2037285/Amish-men-jailed-orange-triangle-row-refusing-display-safety-signs-buggies.html
<oimon> they would be right at home using linux if they didn't spurn all technology
<popey> reminds me of a mitchell & webb sketch
<popey> http://www.ukskeptics.com/forum/showthread.php/2501-David-mitchell-quot-Heaven-and-Earth-quot?s=f8f57fe260c63bdaef625cff342d47cf&p=38424&viewfull=1#post38424
<popey> should take you to comment 7
<bigcalm> How do you want death to appear in here?
<bigcalm> Oops :)
<bigcalm> w/w
<oimon> the strange thing is that in the 1800s , the Amish way was the height of technology
<oimon> it was new fashioned once
<oimon> i also don't understand those who insist on quoting the 1611 king james bible to sound more authoritative either
<oimon> reading a bit more about the amish, i think some of them actually already exist in the open source community. especially when i read how RMS (used to) read his email
<Gizmo_the_Great> hi. Anyone hear know who to add Radio 1 and Capital FM radio channels to Banshee?
<Gizmo_the_Great> anyone here, rather!
<Gizmo_the_Great> and 'know how', rather!
<Gizmo_the_Great> In fact, lets start again! Anyone here know how to add Radio 1 and Capital FM radio channels to Banshee?
<Laney> Public service announcement: Dear #ubuntu-uk, Killing D-Bus is not a fun experience. Love, Iain.
<oimon> Gizmo_the_Great: if you can add an internet stream, then add http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/listen/live/r1.asx
<oimon> Gizmo_the_Great: add "internet radio" plugin, then right click it to add a stream
<davmor2> gord: don't forget the tea
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: hey man. For Capital FM, I tried pasting the live URL that loads when listening online via their website (which does play in Firefox) into Banshee but that didn't work. Tried the same with the link you just sent for Radio 1. That didn't play either
<oimon> just did radio 1 on my own pC
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: oh rigt - Iwill try adding plugin
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: really. Must be something with m laptop config perhaps
<oimon> after adding plugin then "Radio" appears on the left hand side in the list
<shauno> anyone know how to define what router address radvd advertises?
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: I already have Radio in left hand pane? I using the 2.2 version of Banshee
<oimon> Gizmo_the_Great: it works for me to right click and add station
<shauno> (or alternatively, how to stop linux assigning every interface a link-local address)
<oimon> then paste that url i gave and adding a name and genre
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: have done so. No audio
<oimon> what happens when you click "now playing"
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: just says "Connecting....Idle" in a loop
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: just the Banshee logo
<oimon> mine lokos like this http://ubuntuone.com/1wsUoxGRjhv9VHG9NTUmBr
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: interesting. Earlier, when I tried to add Capital FM, the 'Now Playing' screen did show a similar screen, but there was nothing playing. Now, with the Radio 1 'now playing', it says Banshee
<oimon> restart banshee :P
<Gizmo_the_Great> So with both I hear nothing (but if I play YouTube etc I do hear sound)
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: good idea!
<oimon> ensure no banshee processes are showing in the process list too
<oimon> banshee has a tendency to suck^H^H^H^Hfreeze sometimes
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: nope - no joy. I will keep fiddling and see if I can work it out. As long as I wasn't missing the obvious I not too worried. Will be something up with my sound config probably
<oimon> i'm not running 2.2 yet though
<Gizmo_the_Great> i hva enever used it before. Downloaded and installed for first time today
<Gizmo_the_Great> you using 2.1?
<xr1> If you using ubuntu 11.10 beta 1 and beta 2 do you need to upgrade to it, on would beta 1 just receive updates as normal?
<oimon> 2.01
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: sory - I am using that too.
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: my mistake
<oimon> if you think it's banshee related, i think there's a #banshee irc channel on irc.gnome.org
<Gizmo_the_Great> i using Ubuntu 10.04 - you using 11.04?
<oimon> 10.04 here
<oimon> do your mp3s play ok?
<Gizmo_the_Great> Oh well.
<Gizmo_the_Great> not tried yet..
<oimon> banshee has it's own volume control
<oimon> top right of banshee window
<Gizmo_the_Great> already checked that.
<Azelphur> what was my last disconnect message? :p
<bigcalm> Excess Flood
<Azelphur> fun, I really need to switch away from pidgin, it's just totally unusable as an IRC client and they refuse to fix it :(
<ali1234> Azelphur: don't try to join 800 channels all at once
<Azelphur> I don't, I'm in 15 or so and I have ZNC set up to severely rate limit channel joining
<Azelphur> I get random excess floods, long after I've connected, while I'm not even touching pidgin, apparently it's a known bug
<MartijnVdS> Laney: SIGQUIT doesn't seem to kill banshee
<Laney> it's not supposed to
<Gizmo_the_Great> Azelphur: just use chatzilla
<Laney> it makes it write debugging info to the log
<MartijnVdS> it does dump a LOAD of stuff in the log
<Azelphur> Gizmo_the_Great: god no lol
<Gizmo_the_Great> Azelphur: why not? I like it :-)
<Laney> do you see gconf warnings in there just before it crashes?
<Azelphur> Gizmo_the_Great: because it lacks in features compared to pretty much every other dedicated IRC client :p
<MartijnVdS> Laney: yes
<MartijnVdS> [Warn  18:09:21.538] Could no read GConf key plugins.soundmenu.show_notifications - GLib.GException: Er kan geen contact worden gemaakt met de co
<MartijnVdS> [Warn  18:09:21.567] Could no read GConf key sources.MusicLibrarySource-Library.status_format - GLib.GException: Er kan geen contact worden gemaa
<MartijnVdS> Laney: log attached to bug
<Gizmo_the_Great> Azelphur: i don't use IRC for that much which is prob why I like it. Out of curiostiy, what features do you need from IRC that Chatzilla doesn't have - I only ask in case I am missing something cool!
<Laney> MartijnVdS: can i have the bug number?
<MartijnVdS> Laney: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/banshee/+bug/854845
<lubotu3> Error: ubuntu bug 854845 not found
<Laney> ty
<Laney> YOU LIE, I SEE IT RIGHT HERE
<Azelphur> Gizmo_the_Great: I seem to remember you having to give ChatZilla really strange irc:// urls to make it connect, I remember being told it didn't have SSL support the one time I did try it, I'm pretty sure it won't have a plugin interface (and certainly not a multilanguage one, like XChat), there's probably a number of commands it doesn't support, too.
<Gizmo_the_Great> Azelphur: fair points. SSL very valid
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: ** (Banshee:17485): CRITICAL **: bp_set_volume: assertion `GST_IS_ELEMENT(player->volume)' failed
<Gizmo_the_Great> oimon: me thinks i has a problem somewhere
<windmill> If I was a new user of ubuntu how would I start "system settings" (gnome-control-center)?
<windmill> or is the philosophy that I shouldn't need to?
<NET||abuse> hi ubuntu folks, been hunting around for jobs the last week, and london options have started coming up, whats' the best rentals site for london, not finding the "canonical" site for this stuff
<NET||abuse> i'm seeing rightmove  and zoopla
<windmill> moving from?
<bigcalm> Anybody fancy explaining this mysql SUM() weirdness? http://paste.ubuntu.com/695197/
<NET||abuse> windmill: would be coming from dublin
<windmill> heh, stay in dublin, it's nicer :)
<AlanBell> evening all
 * AlanBell is in the pub
<sladen> yo all.  Can I proactively request forgiveness for not showing up to this Happy Hour, even though I'm around the corner in Millbank at the moment?
<sladen> AlanBell: please Sire?
<AlanBell> just this once :)
<sladen> (pre-existing Sauna invitiation from my Finnish ex-housemate who's just moved to London)
<AlanBell> clothed or nekkid?
<sladen> I do hope proper unclothed nekkid sauna.  Sauna with clothes on sort of defeats the point and is a bit useless for actually getting you clean
<sladen> you just end up caked in sweat under the clothes
<bigcalm> sladen: wave to czajkowski http://twitter.com/czajkowski/statuses/116926439290445824
<sladen> bigcalm: can't see her.  (I have spotted people from this height before)
<bigcalm> She may have walked on
<sladen> lots of pin-pricks working around far below
<sladen> what's the latency since that was posted?
<bigcalm> 18:26
<sladen> bigcalm: target acquired
<sladen> bigcalm: target intercepted
<AlanBell> lol
 * popey wishes he was in the pub
 * Laney will be v. soon
 * jpds returns from .de pub.
<Laney> was hast du getrunken?
<Laney> ich mag weizenbiere
<MartijnVdS> Weizen <3
<jpds> Laney: Ein Weizenbier.
<MartijnVdS> jpds: nein, viele Weizenbier\e :)
<jpds> MartijnVdS: Nein.
<MartijnVdS> :'(
<windmill> is anyone running 11.10 yet?
<MartijnVdS> \o
<windmill> Am I supposed to report bugs?
<MartijnVdS> yes
<MartijnVdS> well
<MartijnVdS> you're not _supposed_ to do anything, of course, if you don't want to
<MartijnVdS> but it helps in getting a bug-free release out if you file bugs
<MartijnVdS> so it's more of a guilt trip thing :P
<windmill> cool, well it is reproducible at least on this machine
<MartijnVdS> that helps a lot
<MartijnVdS> Does a "Report this bug" dialog pop up?
<MartijnVdS> If it doesn't, you can use "ubuntu-bug name_of_program_here" in a terminal
<windmill> it does
<windmill> all it is is open the home folder from the launch and then maximise
<MartijnVdS> windmill: what happens?
<MartijnVdS> because that works fine for me
<windmill> crashes
<windmill> lemme try it from a terminal
<MartijnVdS> then something should pop up, telling you it crashed
<windmill> mm the bug reporter isn't popping up now
<JDmaX> ubuntu one does it work?
<czajkowski> sladen: *hugs*
<czajkowski> great turn out for the happy hour from both community and canonical
<Adriannom> anyone?
<zleap> hi
<Adriannom> hi
<zleap> how can i help
<Adriannom> got a wrt54gl running backfire with an unknown password.  i'd like to reset the password, tftp a new image, or some other way of unbricking it.  i've followed instructions for both the former and i've having no luck.  tftp just doesn't start, and pressing the restart button when the DMZ light comes on (or when the linksys first broadcasts) makes both power and dmz lights flash, but any attempt to communicate with it r
<Adriannom> esults in destination host unreachable.  any ideas?
<zleap> what is the default Ip address
<Adriannom> 192.168.1.1
<zleap> as resetting it could take it back to a default
<zleap> hmm, i had one that used 10.0.0.1
<zleap> but the internal address range was change able
<Adriannom> i'll double check, but everyone says it's 192.168.1.1
<zleap> worth trying
<Adriannom> and i can connect on that when i boot it
<Adriannom> boot normally that is
<zleap> ah
<zleap> so you need to get into change settings
<Adriannom> yeah
<zleap> i am not really sure aht backfire is
<zleap> what
<Adriannom> it's a version of openwrt
<Adriannom> well, the latest version in fact
<zleap> ok
<zleap> i am not sure then
<Adriannom> thanks anyway
<zleap> np
<Adriannom> anyone else know anything i could try?#
<zleap> if you are on the mailing list you could ask there
<zleap> chat later
<AlanBell> evening all
<AlanBell> pun was fun
<StevenR> lo
<AlanBell> pub even!
<StevenR> "pun" ?
<StevenR> ah
<AlanBell> puns are good too
<StevenR> ubuntu-related pubbing?
<AlanBell> Happy Hour \O/
<AlanBell> in /topic
 * AlanBell is suitably tiddly
<AlanBell> and a bit peckish
<Azelphur> is there an app that allows you to keep statistics on what your using your computer for? (Probably by active window, or something)
<Azelphur> would be pretty cool to get statistics on it :P
<Laney> rescuetime did that, don't know if it still exists
<Laney> also non-free, don't know if that matters to you
<Azelphur> beer or speech?
<Laney> speech
<Azelphur> for Ubuntu?
<Laney> yeah they have a linux client
<Azelphur> would never think someone would make a small quirky app like that for Linux that wouldn't be open source lol
<Azelphur> I might use it, I might just write something, decisions :P
<Laney> productivity is big bucks
<Azelphur> hehe
<AlanBell> hi
<Azelphur> been trying to find a module that adds bug tracking capabilities to drupal 7 for months now :(
<Azelphur> there's plenty of them for drupal 6, but it's like nobody has bothered to port any of them D:
#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-23
<sladen> hope you all made it home okay
<knightwise> morning
<knightwise> anyone up ?
<knightwise> help ?
<Myrtti> sure
<AlanBell> morning
<harry_> Anyone with the knowledege of InstallJammer??
<MartijnVdS> never heard of it
<MartijnVdS> I'd just use Wx or Qt if I wanted a cross-platform GUI
<harry_> Okay
<MartijnVdS> harry_: according to their website, development was discontinued last month
<harry_> ya i got a mail from damon(Admin)..
<harry_> but as such i need certain anwsers as such i mail to damon about my qerry but as such i did not receive any reply yet..
<DJones> Morning all
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Jono Bacon] Represent - http://www.jonobacon.org/2011/09/23/represent/
<daubers> Morning
<diplo> Morning
<MartijnVdS> \o
 * MartijnVdS discovers a new cool scp feature
<MartijnVdS> scp host1:file host2:
<MartijnVdS> and
<MartijnVdS> scp -3 host1:file host2:
<diplo> Wat does the -3 do then ?
<MartijnVdS> (first one copies from host1 to host2, second one does the same, but uses the host you're running scp on as a "middle man")
<MartijnVdS> (in case of firewalls between host1 and host2)
<diplo> :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> lol - how do I remove an iptables rule? I can't see it when I do iptables -L but it is there...
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: iptables -D <number>
<MartijnVdS> uhr
<MartijnVdS> iptables -D chain_name number
<TheOpenSourcerer> I don't know the number
<MartijnVdS> start counting from 1 in each chain (table)
<MartijnVdS> iptables -L shows them in order
<MartijnVdS> top one is 1
<TheOpenSourcerer> I was testing a redirect.
<TheOpenSourcerer> iptables -t nat -A PREROUTING -p tcp -d 10.0.0.2 -i eth1 -j DNAT --to 10.0.0.16
<TheOpenSourcerer> iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o eth1 -j MASQUERADE
<TheOpenSourcerer> Which works.
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: also, replaceing the -A with -D should work
<TheOpenSourcerer> This should be the only rules on that box
<TheOpenSourcerer> But why can't I list them?
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: you can flush all rules using -F
<MartijnVdS> ah
<MartijnVdS> because they're in -t nat
<MartijnVdS> "iptables -L -t nat" should show them
<TheOpenSourcerer> Ahh
<TheOpenSourcerer> Cool.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Thanks MartijnVdS
<TheOpenSourcerer> -F did what I wanted.
<TheOpenSourcerer> And my redirect worked. Just fyi, what's the difference between -A and -D
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: -Add and -Delete
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yeah - sorry I was being lazy ;-)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Am reading some stuff online.
<popey> Morning
<TheOpenSourcerer> lo popey
<bigcalm> Morning peoples
<JamesTai1> Happy Friday, everyone!
<popey> Yes!
 * TheOpenSourcerer had rather a lot of chinese last night.
<czajkowski> aloha
<TheOpenSourcerer> All you can eat for Â£13.95
<bigcalm> I wonder why emails from the Wolverhampton Civic are so full of broken images. All ways have been as well
<TheOpenSourcerer> We had ~6 starters each, crispy duck and pancakes, curry.
<bigcalm> Right, it's about time you Ubuntu boffins help me fix my shutdown/reboot problem :)
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: just press the button ;)
<bigcalm> Issuing a shutdown, sleep or hibernate will reboot the system. It no longer powers off
<MartijnVdS> cool :)
<bigcalm> Annoying
<MartijnVdS> did you update the BIOS recently?
<bigcalm> I have to wait for POST and then hold down the power button
<bigcalm> Nope
<MartijnVdS> Maybe there's an update available?
<bigcalm> No reason for it to change its behaviour
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: no new kernel version? Ubuntu version?
<TheOpenSourcerer> We have an aberrant server running natty (not my choice). It appears to have gone "overloaded" again. But now I cannot get in via ssh anymore... I blame AlanBell personally. 10.04 is a good, solid server platform.
<bigcalm> MartijnVdS: Ubuntu version has stayed the same at 11.04, though the kernel has most probably been updated
<brobostigon> good morning everyone,
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: i have no idea, sorry
<bigcalm> :'(
<bigcalm> Right, must be time to ditch Ubuntu then!
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: because that's the ONLY solution if I don't know something
<MartijnVdS> à² _à² 
<bigcalm> Hehe
<MartijnVdS> (â¯Â°â¡Â°ï¼â¯ï¸µ â»ââ»
<TheOpenSourcerer> hey brobostigon How's it going?
<bigcalm> Unicode win!
<brobostigon> TheOpenSourcerer: not bad, alittle tired, didnt sleep proerly, and my eczema is alittle dodgy. how about you?
<TheOpenSourcerer> I'm good thanks. Still rather full up from last night's digital dogging session.
<brobostigon> :)
<czajkowski> TheOpenSourcerer: yes I did ask where the lord was only to be told you were dogging, I wasn't surprised really :p
<TheOpenSourcerer> :-D
<popey> guy at work told me there's hp touchpads in carphone warehouse bracknell
<bigcalm> Do people really want HP touchpads now that they are available? I thought it was all about getting one when nobody else could.
<diplo> bigcalm: I'd say it was all about the price point more than anything else
<bigcalm> diplo: you could be right
<diplo> I'd really like one at that price
 * popey tickles TheOpenSourcerer 
<TheOpenSourcerer> tee hee
 * TheOpenSourcerer is waiting for an email from his friend at HP
<davmor2> morning all
<AlanBell> TheOpenSourcerer: I blame Daviey
<TheOpenSourcerer> Fair enough
<davmor2> AlanBell: You're wrong it's always czajkowski fault honest I went through this with TheOpenSourcerer before ;)
<diplo> Is it still issues with cron TheOpenSourcerer / AlanBell ?
<diplo> Remember from a week or so ago ?
<TheOpenSourcerer> diplo: Dunno this time. Can't get in :-(
<TheOpenSourcerer> Same server though yes.
<diplo> No console access ?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Ha
<TheOpenSourcerer> I wish.
<diplo> :p
<diplo> I miss that so much from my new job
<diplo> I bought a brilliant digital KVM from dell at last place
<czajkowski> davmor2: oi
<davmor2> czajkowski: but you break systems all the time so it must be your fault somewhere down the line Honest ;)
<davmor2> czajkowski: morning by the way
<czajkowski> I kiiiiillll you davmor2
<davmor2> czajkowski: aaaaahhhhh thanks I didn't know you cared :P
<Myrtti> weekly friendly reminder of "memento mori": get a life insurance, kids!
<czajkowski> hmmm
<czajkowski> really likeing how simple BAlsamiq is
<czajkowski> but wondering is the pencil project better
<AlanBell> so is the compaq integrated lights out thing a good way to get on to an unresponsive server and see what is happening?
<czajkowski> Balsamiq has a nice video showing how easy it to use
<AlanBell> pencil is easy too
<czajkowski> yeah
<czajkowski> then there is mocking bird
<czajkowski> need to find one that's nice
<czajkowski> the mac one we have here is very easy
<czajkowski> but not on a mac
<AlanBell> pencil is GPL which is more convenient if you want to share the design work with others
<czajkowski> true
<diplo> Guys back on my ssh setup i was talking about yesterday
<diplo> I am creating a user to store a authorized_key file and a .ssh/config file
<diplo> I want to use that one user to add peoples pub keys to that authorized keys file and config
<diplo> And then be able to push that authorized key folder to 80+ machines
<diplo> and the config to 20 ish users
<diplo> Anyone know of a proper way, or am I going to have to do some scripting ?
<sjk> Hm, why do you need that initial user?
<diplo> I just want a centralised place to create the auth file and to have a script
<sjk> diplo, will you just need to push them all once?
<diplo> That was what i was thinking yeah
<diplo> Adding new customers/ removing users who have left company etc
<czajkowski> AlanBell: installed pencil shall play with it and see
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Matthew Garrett] UEFI secure booting (part 2) - http://mjg59.livejournal.com/139232.html
<shauno> hm.  my box of tricks seems to be woefully underequipped to reshape 3mill steel plate :(  I need new toys
<DJones> Sheesh, damm good job all our calls are recorded, after signing up for a Â£100K system, they've come back & said that the part that links in with our accounts system isn't included
<DJones> Thats despite me talking to them and telling them how the old system worked & how it was automatically linked in to the accounts system
<diplo> DJones: We had lods of that at our last place, I reckon part my manager part sales man
<DJones> Just listening to the conversation with their demo people "most of our clients use the same systems as you, we already do that for them", director has just told them that if the system isn't capeable of doing it, we're cancelling & going with their competitor which was a very similar system
<diplo> :D
<diplo> what are you integrating ?
<DJones> diplo: Sorry, was just on the phone with them, the new system is a travel industry system, details of clients, booking, payments etc, it has to link with sage accounts
<diplo> Oooh fun
<diplo> We are just about to integrate Sage into our system, new and old
<diplo> No one is really looking forward to it
<DJones> Its shouldn't be that hard, sage is actually quite easy to import into if you've got the add on module for 3rd party integration
<diplo> yeah I think we just applied for the developer pack
<shauno> http://www.flickr.com/photos/shaunoneil/6175563198   a very productive day off :D
<diplo> oh dear shauno :)
<Monotoko> hey guys...I'm trying to create a global LAN...in that I want people to be able to connect to my server (authenticated, there will be about 100 users) and then go where they need to. I want to add another TLD inside the network, for example www.main.dev takes a user to the main page...could OpenVPN do this?
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Matthew Garrett] Supporting UEFI secure boot on Linux: the details - http://mjg59.livejournal.com/139356.html
<shauno> Monotoko: I want to say yes, but that's not going to be all openvpn, but a combination of tricks
<MartijnVdS> Hm
<MartijnVdS> I think this bug needs some more attention
<MartijnVdS> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/flashplugin-nonfree/+bug/840826
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 840826 in flashplugin-nonfree (Ubuntu) "Firefox (flash) mute pulseaudio and do not appear in sound app list" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<MartijnVdS> or we'll get LOADS of "flash sound is broken" bugs/complaints after release
<ks07> Hey guys, I'm trying to mount a filesystem with sshfs, but I'm getting permission denied on /dev/fuse - The permissions are fine, and my user is part of the fuse group. Any suggestions?
<ks07> (This is in an OpenVZ container)
<MartijnVdS> ks07: did log out + back in after adding the user to the fuse group?
<MartijnVdS> also.. ewww openvz :) that messes with lots of things, probably mounting as well
<ks07> MartijnVdS, yes, I'm definitely in the groups
<MartijnVdS> ks07: then fuse and openvz aren't compatible
<ks07> They are, but I'm beginning to suspect the host has disabled such feature
<ks07> Guess I'm waiting for support response (out of office hours, fun!)
<Monotoko> shauno, would you mind pointing me to some tricks? :)
<shauno> Monotoko: hosting .dev is going to mean running a nameserver inside the vpn that thinks it's authorative for that root.  then when openvpn pushes nameservers to the clients, they want to point to that
<esteeven>  Hello. I am trying to boot 11.04 from CD but my video is "garbled" - lots of multi-coloured lines. The card is a ATI Technologies Inc RV710 [Radeon HD 4350]. I hear the "desktop ready" sound but there's nothing I can do. I can't even open another VT
<MartijnVdS> Laney: I get similar DBus errors on my unity STDERR
<MartijnVdS> Laney: WARN  2011-09-23 19:43:33 glib <unknown>:0 Failed to fetch view type at /org/ayatana/bamf/application0x7f41c400f400: Method "ViewType" with signature "" on interface "org.ayatana.bamf.view" doesn't exist
<diplo> evening all
<diplo> How well does natty/Oneric play with intel chipsets ?
<MartijnVdS> works fine here
<diplo> Thinking about upgrading this lappy
<bigcalm> Natty works well on my dell
<diplo> May just go straight to Oneric
<bigcalm> Check the supported hardware list
<diplo> Trying to find chipset now
<MartijnVdS> if it works now, it'll work in Oneiric
<MartijnVdS> unless it's REALLY old hardware
<MartijnVdS> as in "from the server rack on Noah's ark"
<zleap> hello
<jacobw> hey zleap
<zleap> hi
<diplo> Sorry MartijnVdS, its a Dell D820, so old but not ark
<diplo> i965 i think
<MartijnVdS> should be fine then
<diplo> http://releases.ubuntu.com//oneiric/ - URL for 64bit not working, where do we report broken links
<shauno> seems to work here?
<diplo> lol does for me now as well
<zleap> when is 11.10 released ?
<diplo> Tried it in two browsers, now works :/
<shauno> it's down for oct 13th, but it's never set in stone until it happens (they've had to delay it a couple of times)
<shauno> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricReleaseSchedule
<zleap> ok
<AlanBell> shauno: the party is on the 13th no matter what happens!
<shauno> if it comes to the worst, you can cry into your beer together :)
<zleap> thanks alan
<zleap> hi kellyh
 * AlanBell fails to install Beta 2 in virtualbox :(
<zleap> is synaptic being removed from11.10
<MartijnVdS> only from the default install, I think
<zleap> ok thanks
<Myrtti> oooo errrr
<Myrtti> cheap entertainment, just ate and now the room spins around me
<sammmm> HazRPG: I have no internet 'til the 10th :'(
<sammmm> No Battlefield 3 beta for me :'(
<HazRPG> sammmm: gutted
<sammmm> HazRPG: What I have feels worse than dial up :(
<HazRPG> heh
<HazRPG> unlucky
<sammmm> OMG I managed to gather enough bandwidths to connect to Steam
<HazRPG> esp since the internet today, uses more bandwidth for most sites...
<sammmm> But I'll probably just go into offline mode
<sammmm> HazRPG: Yeah, stupid backwards web development ><
<sammmm> Facebook is too bandwidth heavy for me to use :(
<sammmm> HazRPG: Oh yay I'm getting internet on the 6th. I only have to wait 2 horrible weeks
<HazRPG> sammmm: btw, servers/games/etc don't use as much bandwidth as you may think... remember it just strings of text that get passed back n forth... it's the updates and patches that you need to worry about
<sammmm> HazRPG: Hmmm I might try some CoD4 then
<sammmm> HazRPG: The Wi-Fi is so flaky because it's about a mile away too :(
<sammmm> HazRPG: Does IRC use much bandwidths?
<HazRPG> sammmm: almost non really
<HazRPG> sammmm: again, just text
<sammmm> HazRPG: What about Steam?
<HazRPG> most stuff will just be text being passed back n forth
<HazRPG> unless its sending images and what not, it won't take up much
<HazRPG> however encryption can sometimes take up more... but gotta remember, most games worked perfectly fine back in dialup days
<HazRPG> I've played WoW fine on dialup before too
<sammmm> HazRPG: This is worse than dialup
<HazRPG> however patching WoW on dialup is not fun
<sammmm> HazRPG: Games just won't load up on Steam :(
<HazRPG> sammmm: dialup is anything that's less then 56k dude
<HazRPG> I remember being on dialup and getting only 14.6k
<HazRPG> (if I was lucky!)
<sammmm> HazRPG: Steam won't launch my games because I don't have enough internet :(
<sammmm> HazRPG: I think I'm on 14.6k :(
<KrimZon> it should work without any internet
<gord> heh no, steam doesn't really work without internet very well, even in "offline" mode
<gord> but hey, its a drm platform, its what we all bought in to, trying not to get anymore steam games now because of annoyances like that
<KrimZon> Ahh... I remember assurances years ago that it would still work offline. But if it doesn't I should start avoiding steam too.
<KrimZon> sleepy time
<sammm> Not having any internet is so shit
<AlanBell> interesting twist to the thread on the mailing list
<hamitron> sammm, indeed, you wouldn't get to talk to us.... ;)
<sammm> hamitron: I have enough internet to talk to you, but not do anything else
<hamitron> oh? :/
<hamitron> I sort of feel your pain
<hamitron> :)
<hamitron> but I've started to just not care. and enjoy what is available
<sammm> hamitron: I'm on dial up 14.2k
<sammm> hamitron: But I can't get the battlefield 3 beta or play any online games :(
<hamitron> yeh :/
<sammm> Or watch porn
<hamitron> need 56k to game properly on most half recent games
<hamitron> well, games from 10 years ago
<hamitron> :/
<sammm> hamitron: The Battlefield 3 beta begins on the 29th but I won't get internet 'til the 6th :(
<sammm> Sooooooooooo gay
<hamitron> I don't download any games, takes too long
<sammm> I might phone them up and tell them that I need it sooner so I can play Battlefield 3
<sammm> hamitron: But it's not just any old game
<sammm> It's Battlefield fucking three!!!!!!
<sammm> Biggest game in the last 6 years or so
<hamitron> yeh, but it will be huge
<hamitron> ;/
<hamitron> I just got F1 2011 on DVD off ebay
<sammm> Biggest game since UT2004, CS:S and BF2
<hamitron> as it was download only in the UK
<hamitron> :/
<sammm> hamitron: Why don't you download games?
<sammm> Steam is great for that
 * hamitron checks connection
<hamitron> 0.4mbit
<hamitron> ;/
<hamitron> so it would take ages, slow down my internet....
<hamitron> plus I like a physical game copy
<hamitron> plus steam have bullied me once before
<shauno> hamitron: http://www.flickr.com/photos/shaunoneil/6175563198   how's that for physical copies :)
<hamitron> omg man
<hamitron> respect
<hamitron> ;D
<hamitron> my first PC did have a 4 speed cdrom and sound card though
<hamitron> ;/
<hamitron> got over 300 pc games on optical media
<shauno> most things I have from the last decade or so all live piled on one harddrive :/  but my amiga .. just piles of junk
<shauno> it's been in bits for about a year tho.  took today to sit down 'n put it all back together.  and ended up sat on ebay buying more junk for it
<hamitron> shauno, I know I am a little stuck in the past, but I like to think I've moved onto things that are nearly as functional as modern stuff
<hamitron> :)
<hamitron> most are win95 onwards
<shauno> I don't have much from that era
<hamitron> before then I was all NES and SNES
<hamitron> :/
<shauno> I pretty much skipped win32 completely.  moved to linux on my dekstop in 96, and have a good 10 year gap in my gaming starting right there
<hamitron> yeh, I bet
<hamitron> :)
<hamitron> any game pre-win95 I have got since win98
<hamitron> most are 2nd hand
<hamitron> not even played most of them tbh, just wanted some of the classics
<hamitron> :)
<shauno> do they stil have 'sold out' there?
<hamitron> I like cerial boxes, for the old games
<hamitron> ;)
<hamitron> in very nice condition, with full instructions
<hamitron> :/
<gord> big boxes gave them a reason to fill them with stuff
<hamitron> yeh
<hamitron> and bigger is better
<hamitron> ;/
<gord> well not really, i mean i got rid of my boxes years ago because geez they take up too much space
<hamitron> it also gives me a reason for hoarding, when collecting such things
<gord> for what is essentially just cardboard and empty space
<hamitron> :)
<hamitron> true
<hamitron> but I like to see them
<hamitron> :/
<shauno> all my big boxes got left behind when I left the UK
<hamitron> just so nice to stack a load of originals on a desk, and look at them
<shauno> they look great on a shelf, but become worse than useless when you have restless feet
<hamitron> I sadly don't have enough wall space for that many shelves
<hamitron> :/
<gord> my little megadrive collection is bad enough, thinking about getting rid of the boxes for those and just having carts. but they are so pretty...
 * hamitron votes "yes" to the question "should gord keep his boxes"
<hamitron> since I started with my NES, I just kept everything as a kid
<hamitron> :/
<hamitron> never buy anything on a new release, to save myself money to spend on more stuff
<hamitron> (and yes I have a mess here)
<shauno> megadrive boxes aren't so bad; they're just like fat dvd cases
<hamitron> megadrive and megacd are things I am playing with the idea of getting
<hamitron> :)
<shauno> never had a megacd
<gord> well they are the same size vertically as a dvd case, but 2/3 times as wide, which just eats up space on shelves
<shauno> wanted a cd32, but by time saving that much money became realistic, chicks & beer showed up
<gord> you don't need to get a megacd, there is only one game worth playing on it anyway
<gord> well no a few japanese imports
<hamitron> shauno, no dedication to geekism ;)
<gord> but you won't find those for cheep
<hamitron> gord, it just looks cool
<hamitron> the one that mounts underneath
<hamitron> I am also a fan of optical media
<shauno> megadrive was pretty decent tho.  that's still one of my favourite controllers
<gord> no, what looks cool is a sonic the hedgehog 3 cart, plugged in to a sonic and knuckles cart, plugged in to a game genie cart, plugged in to a 32x, plugged in to a mega drive
<hamitron> haha
<hamitron> brb, gotta go put bike away
 * hamitron not been home long
 * hamitron gone
<sammm> I have over 100 PC games on digital
 * AlanBell prefers analog PC games
<sammm> Now that I don't have an internet connection, I can get round to playing a couple of these SP games that I bought on Steam but never played lol
<shauno> it boggles my mind that people do that.  I know a load of people that haven't played half of what they bought on steam
<sammm> shauno: I'm one of those people :(
<sammm> shauno: I've stopped doing it now
<sammm> shauno: Stupid Steam sales made me think I was getting a bargain when I couldn't play them all
<sammm> shauno: I once had a friend with 700 games on Steam but he played like 5 hours a week LOL
<gord> i'v got like 120 something, some of them i have barely played on steam, but they are mostly games i have played years ago and wanted to rekindle the magic a bit
 * sammm is watching Lara Croft in a diving suit
<sammm> FFS why do Tomb Raider puzzles have to be so difficutl?
#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-24
<sammm> OMG I get so much motion sickness from staring at Lara Crofts arse. :(
<sammm> I can't play this game without feeling queezy. :(
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Jono Bacon] Unity Lenses and Books - http://www.jonobacon.org/2011/09/24/unity-lenses-and-books/
<togster> iostat
<jacobw> morning
<AlanBell> morning all
<czajkowski> aloha
<czajkowski> AlanBell: word of warning on the cask
<czajkowski> the seats are heated
<czajkowski> dear gods it gets hot in there
<MartijnVdS> eww?
<AlanBell> the bench seats you mean?
<czajkowski> yeah
<czajkowski> and they get pipping hot
<czajkowski> place wasn't nearly as full as thursday night
 * AlanBell is cool as a cucumber
<czajkowski> arrived at 6:30 we had a table booked for about 8 of us
<czajkowski> had a lot of the passion fruit beer
<czajkowski> and dear gods their burgers are to die for
<AlanBell> what was the occasion?
<czajkowski> jon was meeting up with some ex mates in RH, 2 now work in canonical on kernel team, few more came from google, and then there was me
<czajkowski> right frenchies v kiwis
<popey> is there an easy way to tell if you're on unity 3d or 2d in 11.10?
<czajkowski> hmmm
<czajkowski> without logging out I'm not sure
<czajkowski> sorry
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Laura Czajkowski] Annoy bug reports - http://www.lczajkowski.com/2011/09/24/annoy-bug-reports/
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Laura Czajkowski] Why I love to meet more Ubuntu People - http://www.lczajkowski.com/2011/09/24/why-i-love-to-meet-more-ubuntu-people/
<AlanBell> popey: if the launcher is black it is 2d, if it is dark aubergine it is 3d
<popey> is there a way to programmatically tell though?
<popey> like a particular process running?
<AlanBell> dunno
<AlanBell> if onboard can type in the dash, it is 2d
<popey> heh
<AlanBell> if orca says every application is called "button" then it is 2d
<AlanBell> if orca says nothing then it is 3d
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<AlanBell> the cern result looks pretty solid to me, just been going over some of the figures :)
<swat_> unity 2d is pretty sweet on my netbook
<AlanBell> ooooooh someone fixed the button button bug
<jacobw> the cern result is.. suprising
<MartijnVdS> negative mass.
<AlanBell> I think they measured the distance wrong
<AlanBell> but I can't see where
<czajkowski> AlanBell: thanks for the CDs the other night, brought them to work and 2 of the lads took some
<AlanBell> gah, half arsed fix to Bug #851694
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 851694 in unity-2d (Ubuntu) "application icons in apps lens are all called "button"" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/851694
<AlanBell> MartijnVdS: that is almost plausible!
<AlanBell> I think they have established that the square of the mass of a neutrino can't be zero, therefore they have mass
<AlanBell> could be negative though
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Laura Czajkowski] Why the CC - http://www.lczajkowski.com/2011/09/24/why-the-cc/
<AI__> anyone free here?
<MartijnVdS> !ask
<lubotu3> Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
<AI__> for a non ubuntu related question just life advice
<AlanBell> IRC is traditionally the place to ask questions of people who have a life :)
<popey> I won the lottery!
<popey> properly
<popey> 5.20GBP!
<bigcalm> Nice one
 * popey promises this wont change his life
<bigcalm> AlanBell: have or haven't?
<AI__> Is the concorde expected to fly for the Olympics?
<AlanBell> no
<windmill> rather good this oneiric, looking pretty slick already
<danfish> chicken!
<danfish> !chicken
<jacobw> yes?
<bigcalm> Bok bok
<danfish> chicken? is it you?
<danfish> hope everyone is enjoying this rather fine weather
<penguin42> fine weather? Where?
<bigcalm> Overcast here
<StevenR> grey here
<danfish> ah - my bad - SW Londinium
<AlanBell> chickens \o/
<jacobw> overcast here :(
<bigcalm> Banana!
<jacobw> +=rama
* AlanBell changed the topic of #ubuntu-uk to: Welcome to #ubuntu-uk! http://ubuntu-uk.org | This channel is publicly archived http://irclogs.ubuntu.com | Mailing List http://tinyurl.com/uukml | Support Guidelines http://tinyurl.com/uuksupport | Meeting 20th October 21:00 UK time #ubuntu-uk-meeting | chickens \o/
 * StevenR wonders what all this talk of chickens is
<danfish> AlanBell: with your new found appraisal of the neutrino/faster then light debate, which came first? the chicken or the egg?
<danfish> StevenR: AlanBell has ported ubuntu to run in a chicken's brain ;)
<bigcalm> Heh
<AlanBell> danfish: the answer is still neither the chicken or the egg
<danfish> the unity interface now is beak/peck enabled
<AlanBell> you need to get a henhouse and run first or they will be eaten by a fox
<danfish> AlanBell: true - quantum entanglement precludes either option in the chicken/egg debate, but the real answer - dinosaur
<AlanBell> yup, they are dinosaurs
<AlanBell> tasty little dinosaurs
<bigcalm> QIXL tonight \o/
<jacobw> :D
<MartijnVdS> Doctor Who tonight \o/
<bigcalm> Only 2 eps left
<bigcalm> And no companions?
<MartijnVdS> Apparently the guy from last year is coming back this episode
<MartijnVdS> the not-funny one
<bigcalm> Who?
<MartijnVdS> the one from that episode with the tardis on the rood
<MartijnVdS> roof
<MartijnVdS> James Corden
<bigcalm> Oh no
<MartijnVdS> exactly.
<bigcalm> Do not want
<MartijnVdS> I hope it's just for one episode
<bigcalm> It will be the death of the show if it isn't
<MartijnVdS> I much prefer Amy ;)
<bigcalm> Doesn't everybody?
<bigcalm> It weirds me out somehow that sheis 24
<MartijnVdS> why?
<bigcalm> Dunno, just does
<gord> pfft, i said that about catherine tate, apprently everyone loves terrible people in dr who
<MartijnVdS> gord: Catherine Tate WAS horrible
<MartijnVdS> (at least in Dr Who, don't know her other things)
<gord> dr who is the thing she is least terrible in
<gord> so that should give you some idea
<MartijnVdS> *shudder*
 * bigcalm nods
<gord> but yeah, the co-star of "lesbian  vampire killers" apprently being in dr who now, does not make me want to catch up. stopped watching it a year or two ago
<MartijnVdS> gord: only in two episodes
<MartijnVdS> gord: with any luck he'll be dying in this one too
<bigcalm> \o
<bigcalm> \o/
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: just watch the trailer :)
<bigcalm> Na, I avoid all teasers
<bigcalm> Including the 'next time' bits at the end of the show
<MartijnVdS> Ooh, F1 Quali
<MartijnVdS> in a few minutes
<bigcalm> That might be worth watching
<sammm> HazRPG: Having no internet is the worst thing to ever happen to my life :'(
<MartijnVdS> sammm: that bad, really?
<HazRPG> sammm: Hmm, sounds like you need another hobby then ^_^
<HazRPG> I can live quite happily without internet for weeks/months
<HazRPG> however, when I do get back on... I tend to spend most of the time trying to catch up on what I missed :P
<MartijnVdS> as long as I get my email
<sammm> No online gaming, no porn, no Wikipedia, no news, no free TV/films/music, no talking to anybody, etc
<sammm> MartijnVdS: Yes, for the reasons I've just specified
<sammm> HazRPG: Wi-Fi hacking maybe?
<sammm> HazRPG: Lucky you
<HazRPG> MartijnVdS: Yeah I agree, e-mail is probably the thing I check the most - sadly a lot of people don't though :(
<HazRPG> MartijnVdS: I know a lot of people that don't see the importance in having an e-mail address, especially since the recent boom of social networking
<MartijnVdS> yeah that's weird :)
 * MartijnVdS remebers having a Fidonet email address
<MartijnVdS> I have to say most of my email is notifications
<MartijnVdS> "Package on its way"
<MartijnVdS> "Bug has been commented on"
<MartijnVdS> etc.
<shauno> mine's about the same, but I'd still rather not do without it
<MartijnVdS> People at work need to learn how to use it though
<shauno> automated cruft, more lists than is sensible, and maybe 4 people that still use it as a form of communication
<MartijnVdS> (especially writing understandable emails..)
<shauno> quoting is my big gripe for work emails.  quote etoo much, and I've no idea what you're talking about.  quote too little, and I still have no idea
<MartijnVdS> At work people just "MS-Quote"
<MartijnVdS> i.e. don't remove anything, write new content above
<MartijnVdS> *hate*
<MartijnVdS> Also subjects like "Question"
<MartijnVdS> GAH
<shauno> that's pretty much the default for Notes too. Drives me nuts, because my preferred style is to reply inline
<MartijnVdS> I've given up
<MartijnVdS> people actually mailed me telling me they didn't understand proper quoting
<AlanBell> shauno: harder to edit in a collapsed section too
<AlanBell> I like to reply inline if appropriate and trim the stuff I don't want
<AlanBell> or just reply without history
<MartijnVdS> I want gmail's interface for "normal" IMAP servers
<MartijnVdS> so I can use it for work mail :)
<jacobw> I usually reply without history, they know what they mailed about :|
<MartijnVdS> because in gmail works great
<MartijnVdS> +it
<AlanBell> back when I was teaching people how to use email I told them that reply with history is only for when you are adding a new person to the cc list and you want to give them context
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: I get mail like that sometimes, it's even worse :)
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: "Please fix this issue with the software" <thread of 20 emails describing/finding the bug, in reverse order>
<jacobw> People leave their brains at the login screen and anything different from the default behaviour is worrying for them.
<AlanBell> fundamentally, email is rubbish
<jacobw> IRC ftw :D
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: Invent somethign better :)
<jacobw> MartijnVdS: I think that's how we got Wave..
<MartijnVdS> jacobw: even fewer people understood how that works
<MartijnVdS> I've done collaborative Google Docs things
<MartijnVdS> that works
<MartijnVdS> but that's not good for (say) helpdesk queries
<AlanBell> there are many many helpdesk applications
<AlanBell> because everyone who has ever worked on one and can code a bit has written one
<AlanBell> even those who can't code a bit
<MartijnVdS> sure, but Google Docs/collaborative document editing isn't the best help desk interface :)
<MartijnVdS> We use RT at work
<MartijnVdS> for internal stuff
<MartijnVdS> no idea what's used for customer-to-helpdesk stuff
<jacobw> I suggested using a request tracker at work and was told to set up a sharepoint site :|
<MartijnVdS> jacobw: ...
<MartijnVdS> Where I work everyone uses it
<MartijnVdS> except the people who need it most (the unix sysadmins)
<jacobw> RT?
<MartijnVdS> yeah
<MartijnVdS> F1 \o/
<MartijnVdS> ooh! tomorrow - http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b015d4qz
<penguin42> Freeview ch 11 'pick tv' seems to be showing the original 1st futurama series
<penguin42> which given this cold is about the right type of tv
<AlanBell> Laney: MooDoo: other Notts peeps: how does Thursday 3rd November grab you for a Nottingham Happy Hour?
<Laney> UDS
<AlanBell> excellent point!
<Laney> :-)
<AlanBell> Thursday 10th?
<Laney> yeah, could work
<Laney> want to email nlug to gauge interest?
<AlanBell> that would be great
<gord> oops, i clicked on a thing in banshee, time to crash!
<MartijnVdS> gord: you didn't apt-get upgrade while it was running did you?
<MartijnVdS> gord: because that triggers 400% CPU crashiness for Laney and me
<Laney> i don't think it's that reliable
<gord> no, banshee is just crap
<gord> and they removed the u1 store from rb so i have to use it
<Laney> ho boy, I hope trolling applications never stops being fun
<gord> and it crashed again
<gord> okay i give up, i won't buy music, that was obviously what i did wrong
<MartijnVdS> Doctortime!
<czajkowski> aloha
<czajkowski> gord: why do you persist in using banshee, it results in a rant on here on how broken it is
<MartijnVdS> if only he filed bugs..
<zleap> hi all
<jacobw> hi
<zleap> how are u
<jacobw> eating ravioli and reading about snort
<jacobw> that's my rock and roll saturday evening :|
 * AlanBell updates http://ubuntu-uk.org/happy-hour/
<Laney> 10/10 â 10/11 ?
 * AlanBell updates again
<Laney> wowzers, a peterborough one
<Laney> and another nottingham? you spoil me
<Laney> the crown is about 3 minutes from my house
<AlanBell> well they are all places that have been proposed
<AlanBell> and I jumbled the order a bit
<AlanBell> not random
<AlanBell> I was thinking of drawing a rude picture with the path, but I managed to restrain myself from that
<Laney> the Debian swirl yeah?
<AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/happyhour.pdf
<AlanBell> that is the poster I stuck on the Fridge in Canonical
<Laney> close
<AlanBell> would like one over in Northern Ireland really
<AlanBell> dunno if we have anyone in Belfast
<czajkowski> hmmm
<czajkowski> only folks I know in NI are on the -ie team
<czajkowski> sladen: good to see you if only briefly the other evening
<zleap> anyone up in or near cullompton, devon
<ball> What version of the Linux kernel impacted power management/battery life?
<ali1234> 2.6.*
<ball> Thanks, that'll explain his battery issue.
<Monotoko> ....
<AlanBell> ,,,,
<bigcalm> ...---...
<reaper4334> anyone set up a custom plymouth boot splash? I tried following the guide linked to on the ubuntu wiki but it didn't work :(
<sammm> Heyyyyy guyz
<sammm> I just met my house mate
<penguin42> is that unusual?
<sammm> He might even become my favourite house mate
<sammm> I think I have a house mate for competitive PC gaming, a house mate for drinking and a house mate for musicing. :)
<sammm> And I have 2 for smoking
<sammm> But one of them smokes better than the other
<sammm> Can I boost Wi-Fi signal range by taping the atenna as high up on the wall as possible?
<sammm1> Well I've blutacked my Wi-Fi adaptor as high up the wall as possible
<sammm1> I don't think it's made much difference :(
<ball> Yay!  BluTak!
<sammm1> LOL it fell down the first time
<sammm1> Actually, my connection seems almost better than dialup ATM :)
<sammm1> I just downloaded a photograph of a fit ginger 15 year old girl.
<sammm> Damn, it fell down again
<sammm> But I've just applied three times as much blu-tak and pushed it down extra hard
<sammm> So I doubt it'll fall down this time :)
#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-25
<sammm> Weirdly enough, I get a better signal with my 5 inch antenna than I do my 9 inch one
<sammm> I have enough bandwidth to do some online gaming now :D
<sammm> It's still not all that great, but it's bearable :)
<sammm> And I can browse the web not too badly too
<sammm> And I can stream 480p Youtube :D
<shauno> think I'm finally done wrangling ip6tables for the evening
 * czajkowski does a little dance! 
<danfish> czajkowski: an Irish jig no less ;)
<czajkowski> danfish: can you blame me with that score :D
<danfish> true.....but it was Russia
<czajkowski> we're topping the pool
<czajkowski> beat AU
<danfish> mind you, if rugby goes the way of football, the Ruskies will have bought up every team in the UK ;)
<czajkowski> shrup!
<danfish> czajkowski: where does that put you for the knock out stages?
<czajkowski> pretty good way
<czajkowski> however we got the pasta folks next weekend
<czajkowski> Potatoes V Pasta
<danfish> hah
<danfish> gnocchi - the best of both
<czajkowski> Scotland V Argentina now
<MartijnVdS> Don't gnoccit 'til you try it!
 * danfish groans
 * danfish received some infrared sensors from China off ebay - no datasheet included :-(
<MartijnVdS> danfish: aren't IR sensors very simple things anyway?
<danfish> MartijnVdS: fairly simple, but some info re required voltage, whether they need pull-up resistors etc would be nice
<czajkowski> danfish: roll on 2015 eh
<czajkowski> might even seen some advertising for the oval shaped ball in the UK!
<danfish> I see Ireland's cunning plan of losing all their warmup games is working!
<AlanBell> morning all
<czajkowski> danfish: indeed!
<czajkowski> we'll take a loss to England to thrash and wipe the smugness of Au
<czajkowski> AlanBell: aloha
<AlanBell> hi
<czajkowski> AlanBell: so what are you up to this bright and sunny day eh
<czajkowski> seemingly a heat wave next week
<ging> how can you have a heatwave now?
<czajkowski> I dunno
<czajkowski> ask the weather man
<ging> i don't trust him
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Laura Czajkowski] Rugby Rantings and Ravings pays off on iphone app - http://www.lczajkowski.com/2011/09/25/rugby-rantings-and-ravings-pays-off-on-iphone-app/
<brobostigon> good morning everyone,
<MartijnVdS> \o brobostigon
<brobostigon> o/ MartijnVdS
<pr0ph3t> hi all, does anyone have issues with the new ubuntuone frontend? It doesn't get past installation at the moment. I'm using Ubuntu 11.10 64bit
<MartijnVdS> pr0ph3t: past installation?
<MartijnVdS> It works fine for me
<MartijnVdS> it doesn't do any installation?
<pr0ph3t> MartijnVdS, not it starts the installation, asks me for a pass and then crashes
<pr0ph3t> it used to work, but then it stopped showing the account tab so I decided to remove it and reinstall it, something must haave gone wrong in the process
<pr0ph3t> I managed to start it now but it says "The information could not be retrieved. Maybe your internet connection is down?" on the Account TAB, any ideas why?
<MartijnVdS> strange.. I didn't need to install extra stuff
<wayneandleanne> anbody know how to setup up pidgin for irc chat?
<wayneandleanne> *anybody
<penguin42> well, I'm here on pidgin on irc
<wayneandleanne> penguin42: what settings did/are you using?
<penguin42> wayneandleanne: Click on the Buddy list window, go to the menu bar Accounts->Manage Accounts and then add
<penguin42> wayneandleanne: Then just select irc instead of aim or whatever
<wayneandleanne> which server should i choose?
<penguin42> well, what irc channels do you want to connect to - these?
<wayneandleanne> this one
<penguin42> wayneandleanne: Pick one from http://freenode.net/irc_servers.shtml
<penguin42> wayneandleanne: Not the ones in italic
<wayneandleanne> done, thanks, but why not the italic ones/
<wayneandleanne> ?
<penguin42> according to that page those aren't happy at the moment
<wayneandleanne> penguin42: thanks for the help
<penguin42> no problem
<wayneandleanne1> did it work??
<wayneandleanne1> anybody know the command to switch nick's?
<bigcalm> It is /nick wibble
<wayneandleanne> bigcalm: Thanks
<bigcalm> You're welcome
<zleap> hello
<zleap> how do i reinstall grub using a live cd as i installed windows on the first hdd and i think the ubuntu install is still intact on hard disk 2
<zleap> hello
<penguin42> I think you can run grub-install
<zleap> ok thanks
<zleap> so to install on hda1 i type grub-install /dev/hda1
<zleap> hmm
<penguin42> zleap: What's your partitioning like?
<zleap> as in
<zleap> i have 2 hard disks
<penguin42> ok, and what's on each, what partitions?
<zleap> first one is now windows,  the 2nd did have 10.04 on it,  its still there I think as i installed windows on first hard disk
<penguin42> zleap: OK, and what do your partitions look like - one partition on each or do you have a separate /boot ?
<zleap> i was going to just re-install but thought i would have a go to see if i can ge tit to boot before i do that
<zleap> i think ther eis a separate /boot on the 2nd hard disk
<zleap> i guess the bootloader used to be on the fist hard disk, as that had linux on too (two installs)
<penguin42> ok, you need to check, is it /dev/hdb or /dev/sdb ?
<penguin42> zleap: Either way can you pastebin the output of   cat /proc/partitions
<zleap> sda i think has windows
<zleap> http://pastebin.com/XHcDYB62
<penguin42> ok, there is no separate /boot
<zleap> ok
<penguin42> zleap: OK, try this as root,    mount /dev/sdb2 /mnt      then    chroot /mnt      - does that look like your ubuntu install?
<zleap> is it easier to just install normally
<zleap> they are mounted anyway from the live cd
<penguin42> well lets see if that pair of commands works - it'll only take a moment to try
<penguin42> ok, great - now chroot into it
<zleap> ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ chroot /media chroot: cannot change root directory to /media: Operation not permitted ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ sudo chroot /media chroot: failed to run command `/bin/bash': No such file or directory
<penguin42> sudo ....
<zleap> i di d
<penguin42> ok, what do you see if you ls /media ?
<zleap> ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ chroot /media chroot: cannot change root directory to /media: Operation not permitted ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ sudo chroot /media chroot: failed to run command `/bin/bash': No such file or directory
<penguin42> ok, what do you see if you ls /media ?
<zleap>  
<zleap>  failed to run command `/bin/bash': No such file or directory
<penguin42> no, don't do the chroot for a minute - what do you see inside /media ?
<zleap> ia m sure there is a gui tool for this
<penguin42> ok, you're best reinstalling
<zleap> ok np
<zleap> it was worth a try anyway, thanks
<pr0ph3t> re all, just wondering if you people use banshee? Because on my side here it keeps hanging, but I thought maybe that's just me?
<sammm> FFS my internet can't even stream 360p Youtube :(
<gord> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Nintendo-Wiimote-Nunchuk-MotionPlus-silicon/dp/B003QKQF4Q/ - erm.
<bigcalm> Haha
<bigcalm> That is a special one indeed
<gord> its the embassador edition
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Tony] Jorgenson Album Designer on Ubuntu - http://tonywhitmore.co.uk/blog/2011/09/25/jorgenson-album-designer-on-ubuntu/
<MartijnVdS> http://theyfightcrime.org/
<exobuzz> oneiric beta2 is testing my patience - ever since the last batch of unity fixes (including xorg fix), compiz is being really unstable http://pastebin.com/L4xCYdEx guess i need to post a backtrace..
<gord> rather more useful yeah
<exobuzz> <3 weeks till oneiric release date. doesnt seem much time to fix all the issues. I hope (but doubt) ubuntu would release it later but fully polished, rather than something that feels "incomplete"
<exobuzz> < 3 not a heart ;-)
<exobuzz> just feels like a lot is incomplete/missing and 3 weeks isnt long. lots of popular apps miss integration with unity, making them unusable. broken accessibility with mousetweaks. stability of unity/compiz. missing usability things like having to install ubuntu tweaks to be able to change fonts/font sizes.
<ali1234> exobuzz: i'm still waiting for issues in natty to be fixed. if they haven't been fixed in 5 months i doubt they'll be fixed in 3 weeks
<exobuzz> ali1234, mousetweaks is broken still in natty :-)
<ali1234> of course it is
<ali1234> i don't think a single user visible unity bug in natty has been fixed
<ali1234> how much does commercial ubuntu support cost?
<ali1234> $105
<StevenR> popey: ping?
<AlanBell> exobuzz: what is the mousetweaks bug?
<gord> huh
<gord> i just upgraded ubuntu and firefox lost all my search engines apart from ask.com
<gord> *puts on conspiracy hat*
<pr0ph3t> hi all, banshee keeps crashing in 11.10, is it just me or is that the norm?
<gord> ah good, its an old bug that happens with some localised package problems
<pr0ph3t> gord is that referred to my question?
<gord> nope
<pr0ph3t> right
<ali1234> AlanBell: it's a touchscreen related bug
<ali1234> long left click to right click doesn't work in natty
<ali1234> not actually ts related but that is where it has the biggest impact
<AlanBell> works in Oneiric
<AlanBell> in unity2d at least
<AlanBell> and in unity 3d
<AlanBell> the filling the mouse cursor up with orange bit doesn't work very well for me, but that could easily be graphics card dependent and I am running it in a VM
<exobuzz> AlanBell, simulate right click doesnt work for me on oneiric. it doesnt work on natty, but thats likely another issue.
<exobuzz> it didnt work for me in oneiric
<AlanBell> worked for me just now
<AlanBell> are you on a touchscreen?
<exobuzz> and it's still broken on natty .. which was an easy fix that no-one cares to sort out :)
<exobuzz> nope.
<AlanBell> I was just using a mouse in a VM
<exobuzz> ill try it again when i reboot, but i switched it on and it didnt do anything just now
<exobuzz> thats one issue of many of course :)
<AlanBell> of course
<exobuzz> gord, a new firefox was just pushed out with the fix for the search engines
<exobuzz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/858683
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 858683 in Ubuntu Mozilla PPA Bugs "Lost Search engines on upgrade" [Undecided,New]
<exobuzz> i like unity panel not to hide. i just opened thunderbird, and right now my thunderbird is underneath the panel, and a gap to the right of the window :/
<exobuzz> can someone tell me how users with single click touchscreens are supposed to do the middle mouse click on unity btw ;-) emulation for right mouse, but unity decided middle mouse to launch "another" copy
<exobuzz> also if i missed something regarding font sizes. is there plans for a font config app, or users have to install ubuntu tweak to play with fonts?
<exobuzz> i think ill do xubuntu (xfce) for the next joggler release. should be easier to use i guess on the small screen.
<ali1234> unity doesn't support touchscreens
<exobuzz> i might try kde with plasma netbook interface also
<ali1234> kde has a touchscreen interface now
<ali1234> it has sliding panels and stuff
<ali1234> like the android thing
<ali1234> except you can slide it down twice
<ali1234> which pretty much says everything about kde
<exobuzz> thats different from the netbook one? what's it called ?
<exobuzz> http://community.kde.org/Plasma/Active ?
<ali1234> yeah
<ali1234> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GAFfjscVyg
<exobuzz> thanks. must try that!
<exobuzz> looks pretty decent
<AlanBell> interesting point about middle click
<AlanBell> that isn't an option in the hover click/dwell click stuff either
<exobuzz> no. you cant simulate a middle click
<ali1234> unity has loads of problems like this
<AlanBell> that is a gnome issue to be fair
<exobuzz> perhaps ubuntu should integrate easystroke type stuff.
<ali1234> not really. gnome doesn't use middle click for an extremely important function
<AlanBell> unity's issue that it uses middle clicks
<exobuzz> click hold to move, maybe double click to launch another and single click to focus current running
<exobuzz> the click and hold to move conflicts a bit with the right mouse emulation stuff too.
<ali1234> unity still has no way to go directly to the instance of the app on the current workspace
<exobuzz> you have to get the timing just right heh
<AlanBell> yeah, double click instead of single click would be more intuitive and would be simulatable
<ali1234> expose is useless when it brings up 10 terminal windows and you can't read any of the text in any of them, because it is too small
<AlanBell> ali1234: alt-`
<ali1234> does nothing?
<exobuzz> ali1234, linus didn't like gnome3 with the clicking to bring up previous terminal instead of loading another
<exobuzz> (gnome 3 shell)
<ali1234> well gnome3 is pretty bad too
<ali1234> i dont mind the expose feature
<AlanBell> ali1234: if one terminal is focussed then alt+` should do like alt-tab does, but only within that application
<ali1234> but pulling in everything from all workspaces is just silly
<exobuzz> http://www.techdrivein.com/2011/08/linus-switches-to-xfce-calls-gnome-3.html
<exobuzz> im guessing linus wouldn't like unity too
<ali1234> AlanBell: it doesn't
<ali1234> AlanBell: besides what use is that? it still doesn't tell me which terminal is the one on the current workspace?
<ali1234> there is pretty much no reason to use workspaces because if you try, you will just get pulled all over the place when you switch between apps
<ali1234> and you never know which workspace anything is on, or which workspace you are currently on
<AlanBell> hmm, yeah, it does include them across different workspaces
<ali1234> i just work around it by carefully arranging all windows so i can see a bit of all of them
<ali1234> and ignore the launcher for app switching
<ali1234> this is a trick i learned on windows 3.1
<ali1234> i thought we would have moved beyond that nonsense
<ali1234> also bamf still fails to match loads of programs
<ali1234> so i constantly have a "?" icon for "everything else that we couldn't match"
<ali1234> sometimes it misidentifies things to. i've clicked on the folder and got an xterm before
<ali1234> and then wonder why it isn't loading a folder, since i didn't have any open
<AlanBell> I am finding it a lot less crashy today
<AlanBell> several times I have booted to a desktop and nothing crashed
<ali1234> i can't use oneiric
<ali1234> i need my computer to keep running for at least several days
<ali1234> +1 tends to break really bad if you wait a week between updates
<Azelphur> anyone know a decent mobo I can buy for a media center/mythtv?
<Azelphur> I want lots of PCI and SATA for plugging in DVB and HDDs :)
<ali1234> no
<ali1234> use usb for dvb
<Azelphur> :o
<Azelphur> but then you can't get the entire mux, only a single channel
<ali1234> wrong
<ali1234> dvb mux = 27mbit
<Azelphur> ok then USB it is \o/
<Azelphur> mobo with lots of SATA? :D
<ali1234> well doesn't that asus board have like 6 sata?
<Azelphur> the one we use for bitcoin mining?
<ali1234> yeah
<ali1234> just use one of those
<ali1234> or two
<ali1234> or all of them
<ali1234> make them all run mythbackend
<ali1234> that's exactly what i do, except i only have 1
<ali1234> plug in a usb tuner to each one
<Azelphur> I want frontend too though
<Azelphur> and a bit of gaming
<ali1234> so use one for that
<Azelphur> I want it to be quite beefy, as I say the P4 3ghz with 1GB of ram is just not cutting it
<ali1234> you still have 7 left for backends
<ali1234> those boards have onboard nvidia graphics right? use that
<exobuzz> Azelphur, p67/h67/z68 come with a minimum of 6xsata some with more
<exobuzz> you want mini-itx or microatx or ?
<Azelphur> ali1234: for a bit of gaming?
<Azelphur> nah, full size
<ali1234> sure why not, it is nvidia
<Azelphur> I want it to run dolphin
<Azelphur> and stuff like that
<ali1234> if you want it to be quiet you are not going to get better graphics than onboard nvidia
<exobuzz> Azelphur, crossfire/sli etc and those things or just one beefy gfx card ?
<Azelphur> exobuzz: one budget gfx card :)
<exobuzz> i have a ~Â£100 mb http://www.asrock.com/mb/overview.asp?Model=Z68%20Pro3
<exobuzz> socket 1155
<ali1234> i think those boards were like Â£28 or something
<Azelphur> that looks ok, thinking I should go for AMD though rather than intel
<Azelphur> because they tend to be cheaper, lower power, aiming at budget too
<exobuzz> ali1234, sandy bridge onboard intel gfx is quicker than intel ion last i checked though
<exobuzz> nvidia ion even
<ali1234> but it still sucks even compared to nvidia integrated
<Azelphur> need decent drivers so gotta be nvidia :P
<exobuzz> ali1234, which integrated ?
<ali1234> ion is a mobile gpu
<exobuzz> intel drivers are decent on linux, just no opengl 3.0 etc which is a shame
 * Lcawte still wants nvidia-96 to be updated ^.^
<exobuzz> ali1234, which integrated gfx are you referring to. an example
<ali1234> dunno. trying to find out what this board has
<exobuzz> im running on sandy bridge now (intel hd 3000 or whatever), but of course i can add an nvidia card if i need at some point. not really gaming at the moment
<exobuzz> (or at least not on games that require something better)
<ali1234> ok this board has a Geforce 7025
<ali1234> not sure if i believe that actually
<exobuzz> ali1234, the intel graphics hd 3000 will be quicker than that old thing
<ali1234> quicker for what though?
<exobuzz> everything
<exobuzz> http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/3332/benchmarks.png
<exobuzz> you can see from there roughly where it sits
<ali1234> i could do if i knew what nvidia 320M was
<exobuzz> http://www.anandtech.com/show/4083/the-sandy-bridge-review-intel-core-i7-2600k-i5-2500k-core-i3-2100-tested/11
<gibletparade> Hi
<gibletparade> Anyone know of an IRC client that actually times out connecting to a server and tries another?
<gibletparade> Trying to get onto ustream IRC but Xchat just sits there waiting on a dead server
<StevenR> irssi ?
<AlanBell> I never managed to get onto ustream irc
<AlanBell> every so often I watch the jono thing, and spend the entire show trying to get connected because the web interface is horrible
<gibletparade> I usually can but I think I must have got lucky with server loads
<gibletparade> yes the web interface, with flash ads, flash video and flash ads and chat client and flash ads, is just too much for this webbook
<gibletparade> ... so I watch video on my phone and (usually) IRC
<gibletparade> Will try irssi, thanks StevenR
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-17
<ali1234> to do it i must #define XLIB_ILLEGAL_ACCESS
<ali1234> YEAH
<ali1234> pepper flash on google chrome: fixed
<Azelphur> is it just me or does BT infinity have a lot better penetration than I think it does
<knightwise> hey everyone :)
<knightwise> hey TheOpenSourcerer
<TheOpenSourcerer> meauning
<knightwise> hey bootlkhtg
<knightwise> how are you doing today $
<christel> morning
<hoover_> morning all
<knightwise> hey hoover_
<Monotoko> mornin' all! :)
<hoover> mornin Monotoko, knightwise
<mattt> morning all
<diplo> Morning all
<JamesTait> Hello, world! :)
<world> Hi JamesTait
<JamesTait> daubers: :-P
<christel> JamesTait, daubers \o/
<JamesTait> christel: \o/
<hoover> Has anyone had success connecting to an exchange 2010 server using fetchmail and IMAPS with GSSAPI / kerberos?
<hoover> our local support are pulling their collective hair out over this
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<hoover> morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning hoover
<mungojerry> my hp touchpad tablet got smashed :(
<brobostigon> :(
<mungojerry> it's the glass screen, so maybe i can revive it. the lcd is OK
<popey> oops
<popey> how'd that happen?
<mungojerry> http://ubuntuone.com/3JEOUrmks9U1IA04qKGCFU
<popey> Oops-ID: OOPS-1569a612c39544928565b52d69b70b81
<popey> refresh worked
<popey> odd
<YaManicKill> that was the same for me, popey
<YaManicKill> maybe it hadn't finished uploading when we first looked at it?
<YaManicKill> that's not *too* bad a crack...I've seen much worse
<mungojerry> wife had an accident, put in on the bed while charging, must have slipped off the bed, then a bowl fell on it
<mungojerry> i can read stuff ok
<mungojerry> but it makes me sad to use it
<YaManicKill> yeah
<popey> is it under warranty?
<mungojerry> warranty won't fix accidental damage
<popey> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/New-Digitizer-Touch-Screen-Glass-Front-Panel-Lens-Replacement-for-HP-Touchpad-/310405990459?pt=Other_Tablet_eReader_Accessories&hash=item4845a3883b
<davmor2> Morning all
<popey> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Touch-Screen-Digitizer-Tactil-Ecran-Pantalla-Replacement-Repair-for-HP-TouchPad-/200777086042?pt=UK_Replacement_Parts_Tools&hash=item2ebf3f345a
<popey> loads of them
<mungojerry> yeah, the first link is what i'm buying
<mungojerry> however the process is tricky since it uses adhesive
<mungojerry> and getting the shards off is fiddly work
<mungojerry> even opeining the case can cause damage (thanks HP)
<popey> house insurance?
<mungojerry> meh, i'll just fix it
<livingdaylight> Just discovered a cool Android app: WeTap: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.mdc.wetap Just emailed them to request to make this a global project
<mungojerry> hmm my mouse pointer is moving under the menus instead of over them ..weird
<davmor2> popey: thanks for the bug on cancel app install
<popey> np
<daubers> Asterisk question for people, can anyone recommend an ISDN card for both ISDN2e and ISDN30e?
<davmor2> daubers: have you had a look on the Asterisk site for hardware recommendations?
<daubers> davmor2: Yeah, funnily enough they recommend the digium stuff at $Lots
<directhex> My petition for the DWP to sell 51.0.0.0/8 was published. Sign! http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/38744
<daubers> directhex: done!
<diplo> I need to enable local-infile on my 12.04 machine
<diplo> for mysql *
<diplo> I've read I need to add local-infile=1 to [mysql] & [mysqld]
<diplo> It works sometimes but fails others... anyone got any ideas ?
<czajkowski> AlanBell: you about
<czajkowski> BigRedS: ello...
<davmor2> czajkowski: PROD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Hello
<czajkowski> herro
<awilkins> Is it just me or is it virtually impossible to get gawk to read tab-separated files properly?
<awilkins> The manual lies blatantly about --traditional -Ft being the arguments for tabs
<awilkins> Doesn't work
<Laney> isn't it something like -F $'\t'
<Laney> and set OFS if you want to output with tabs too
<awilkins> Doesn't work for me... scoured the forums, stackoverflow, etc
<awilkins> Don't know if it's a peculiarity of gawk vs mawk (the default awk for Ubuntu)
 * awilkins considers it might be join at fault
<awilkins> Hmm, may be user error
<awilkins> Aha
<awilkins> Am joining files
<awilkins> Join is not outputting tabs unless you tell it to. I am dufus.
<TheOpenSourcerer> directhex: Duly signed too.
<TheOpenSourcerer> If anyone needs some moar amo for their boss to consider FOSS: http://www.amadeus.com/blog/17/09/open-for-business/ well written white paper by Amadeus.
<davmor2> TheOpenSourcerer: I don't believe you he died ages ago I've seen the film ;)
 * pinky- sings Amadeus Amadeus, oh oh oh Amadeus Come and rock me Amadeus
<popey> directhex, you should petition xerox to give up their 13.0.0.0/8 too :) (good luck with that)
<directhex> popey, xerox don't answer to me. the government does :p
<popey> heh
<popey> their 13. addresses are hard wired all over the place
<popey> wouldn't be surprised if DWP did same
<davmor2> directhex: you should stop partitioning for legacy ip infrastructure and start partitioning for everyone to move to ipv6 though surely :D
<davmor2> petitioning even
<davmor2> I was close it sounded right in my head anyway
<AlanBell> but DWP should take the cash
<directhex> davmor2, i'm a realist
<directhex> AlanBell, exactly
<directhex> davmor2, the government has a "useless" asset, why not sell it?
<davmor2> directhex: Hence the :D
<directhex> popey, i had a NAS box once hardcoded to 1.1.1.1 by default @_@
<popey> as pointed out in another irc channel, maybe they should wait 5 years, do the migration in that time, and sell when they could get 5bn for it
<directhex> popey, they should at least acknowledge the asset
<directhex> popey, if not sell it now. i.e. say "yes, we have this, yes we know it has value, we dispute how easy it'd be to change to 10.0.0.0/8"
<popey> ooh, hp have 15 and 16
<davmor2> popey: don't mit or something like that have a couple too
<popey> yeah
<directhex> i'm sure HP need 32 million IPs
<daubers> or we could transfer all public facing IP's to ipv6 already!
<popey> i expect scandanavian countries to do that before we do
<daubers> if I was BT I would have said FTTC only works with ipv6
<davmor2> you would think that big UNIs would have enough geeks to update to ipv6 if they haven't already and sell the ipv4 address space on
<shauno> I'd be very surprised to see anyone ditch their v4 allocations in the process
<directhex> daubers, major ISPs won't start IPv6 migration for more than a decade. double-NAT will be the norm to deal with ISP-level exhaustion
<daubers> hooray latency
<daubers> I've been mightly tempted to jump ISP's recently to avoid double-NAT
<xnox> directhex: yes HP needs 32 million IPs, they have just launched public cloud computing offering using those IPs.
<directhex> xnox, better use case than DWP's 16 million..,
<xnox> directhex: well, they were not doing anything with them up until a 1-2 years ago. They didn't have public cloud perspectives then.
<xnox> directhex: africa should sell it's IPv4 and become rich.... then they will need more IPv4s and they will buy them back twice the price. dejavu?!
<xnox> =(
<xnox> I think fostering IPv4 market is a bad idea
<xnox> IPs should not cost anything.
<directhex> xnox, i want ipv4 to become prohibitively expensive. it's the only thing that will drive v6 migration
<directhex> note: i want this to happen after i get a couple if private /25's or /26's for work
<directhex> :p
 * xnox giggles
<AlanBell> the bad situation would be if IPv4 is for "servers" and ipv6 is for "consumers"
<directhex> AlanBell, the reverse will happen first
<AlanBell> well putting servers on IPV6 means that not everyone can get to them
<directhex> bridge all the things!
<AlanBell> an ISP could turn on IPV6 for consumer connections (no idea why phones don't do this already)
<directhex> AlanBell, i think big ISPs lack v6-capable core routers
<directhex> AlanBell, i.e. no HW acceleration o v6, so couldn't cope with current load if s/v4/v6/
<daubers> AlanBell: some ISP's are already IPv6-ing all the things
<ali1234> if i have a static IPv4, can't I use 6to4 or something?
<davmor2> ali1234: that's just tunneling you can do that now without the need for a static ipv4
<ali1234> "This memo specifies an optional interim mechanism for IPv6 sites to    communicate with each other over the IPv4 network without explicit    tunnel setup"
<davmor2> ali1234: oh interesting
<livingdaylight> Microsoft trumped Amazon, eBay and other tech giants with its more than $1 billion purchase of the majority of AOL Inc's patent trove. http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/09/us-aol-microsoft-idUSBRE83809X20120409
<popey> livingdaylight, april...
<davmor2> popey: is it not US dating so 04 september
<livingdaylight> popey: either, way, its bad news. They're back to their old bullying ways
<popey> Mon Apr 9, 2012 4:43pm EDT
<popey> from the article :)
<livingdaylight> yea, I@m slow catching up on the news, I guess :)
<ali1234> so what patents did they get?
<davmor2> popey: ah /me goes back to sleep
<ali1234> year first is almost always y/m/d btw
<davmor2> ali1234: Yeah but Americans hate standards the rest of the world use ;)
<ali1234> the american standard is m/d/y though
<ali1234> not y/d/m
<davmor2> ali1234: but the rest of the world use d/m/y that was kinda my point :D
<ali1234> not really
<ali1234> the only internationally recognized standard is y/m/d
<ali1234> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_8601
<davmor2> ali1234: it was a joke chill out
<mungojerry> all we know is that days are never in the middle
<mungojerry> in sensible countries
<shauno> you can't just pick on the yanks, belize use m/d/y too
<davmor2> shauno: you can't belize everything you read, sorry could resist
<hoover> cheers all
<ali1234> any idea where i might get "uclibc-crosstools-gcc-4.2.3-3_LFS.tar.bz2"
 * AlanBell wonders whether to take the tube or a boris bike
<czajkowski> AlanBell: from where to where
<einonm> ali1234: I assume google doesn't provide?
<ali1234> no
<TheOpenSourcerer> ali1234: CLFS?
<TheOpenSourcerer> That sounds lile a Cross-Linux From Scratch Project
<einonm> you can build your own version using crosstool-ng
<ali1234> own version isn't good enough
<ali1234> i need the exact version
<einonm> crosstool-ng should be able to build an exact version of what you want, surely?
<ali1234> how will i know if it is the same or not, if i don't have the original?
<einonm> As far as the toolchain name will tell you - configure it for uclibc, gcc-4.2.3-3, and the target.  Why do you need an exact version?
<einonm> ...or, after a quick google, you could try irc.linuxfromscratch.org #cross-lfs ?
<AlanBell> czajkowski: canary wharf to waterloo
<czajkowski> tube
<czajkowski> jubilee straight in
<AlanBell> sure, but bike is more interesting
<Laney> yeah, bike it
<Laney> cyclestreets.net
<ali1234> einonm: i need the exact version because i need to build a module for a kernel binary
<einonm> Ah, and this is a kernel binary that you didn't build yourself? If it's just a module, can you not build it natively?
<ali1234> not without a toolchain
<ali1234> and since it's an in-kernel module I have to rebuild the whole kernel
<ali1234> the resulting kernel binary needs to be binary identical though, so that i don't have to reflash
<einonm> ERm, isn't that impossible? An 'in kernel module' is no longer a module. And any resulting binary won't be identical, by definition
<ali1234> in-tree
<einonm> ali1234: I'm thinking this isn't the correct channel for your questions. Are you trying to hack something, which is why you can't re-flash?
<ali1234> always
<einonm> protected bootloader?
<ali1234> no
<ali1234> not that it matters
<einonm> It would matter for my next suggestion - go to the LFS website and build from scratch. It'll be easier to create your own toolchain and kernel to get the job done
<ali1234> you nuts?
<ali1234> i have the full GPL source release
<ali1234> it comes with a full build system
<ali1234> all you have to do is type "make image"
<ali1234> after supplying the necessary toolchain
<einonm> great. Just use toolchain-ng to get a toolchain built then.
<einonm> (toolchain-ng.org)
<ali1234> not to mention that if i do that i'll need to reflash the kernel and root filesystem with the new ones i just built, which is incredibly annoying
<ali1234> building the toolchain is out of the question because i don't have the source of it either
<einonm> If you can access the bootloader, you should be able to run from an nfs or disk mounted kernel & root
<ali1234> why?
<ali1234> why woudld that be a good idea?
<einonm> crosstool-ng gives you the toolchain souce
<ali1234> no it doesn't
<einonm> it's a good idea, as it's less annoying
<einonm> ali1234: Ok, I'm done here. Maybe you want to read the docs at crosstool-ng.org to perhaps see where you're getting muddled there
<ali1234> i think you are the one getting muddled. i don't see how i can compile a toolchain without the source of it!
<ali1234> there is absolutely no guarantee that the referenced toolchain download does not contain custom patches added by the vendor
<ali1234> as a result there is no way i can ever know if the resulting toolchain is actually the same or not
<ali1234> this is unacceptable
<einonm> You build everything using the same toolchain, so you don't need to compare it with your unknown binary toolchain
<ali1234> not possible
<ali1234> the kernel requires proprietary binaries
<ali1234> they will only work with the exact kernel revision, compiled by the exact toolchain version, and nothing else
<einonm> sorry, I don't offer support for proprietary code.
<ali1234> so basically you've just been wasting my time for the past half an hour?
<ali1234> it's a good thing i actually know what i'm doing :)
<ali1234> you'll note i never asked how to build my own toolchain, or rebuild the vendor kernel
<einonm> My mistake, you didn't mention proprietary binaries at the beginning, and I assumed by 'full GPL source release' you had the full source. Best of luck in your search.
<czajkowski> ali1234: people have only been trying to help you today, there is no need to be so short with them
 * popey spies mgdm mentioned in http headers
<popey> $ curl -I http://local.stv.tv/edinburgh/190640-scottish-defence-league-told-they-cannot-hold-rally-in-edinburgh/ | grep Team
<popey> X-Team-BE: @weejames, @mgdm, @skippychalmers, @calummackenzie, @automatical
<popey> :)
<popey> I will take the opportunity to rant at mgdm for the demented auto-starting video in the corner of the pages on stv.tv
<mgdm> Oh, not again
<mgdm> popey: heh, you're the first person to notice that :-) Though I do wonder why!
<popey> :D
<popey> friend of mine wondered why when he pastes an stv url to a story, like the one above, the bot in the irc channel always gets the wrong headline
<popey> so i used curl -I to look at the headers and saw that
<popey> made me chuckle
<mgdm> :D
<mgdm> that is a bit weird, though
<taras> :o
<mgdm> I suspect the bot is maybe latching on to a random <h1>
<taras> it was me asking why the bot was returning the wrong title
<mgdm> the HTML uses <article> entries for the lists, which then each have their own <h1>
<mgdm> o/ taras
<taras> also wondering why it autoplays a video *every time I want to read a news story*, but that's another matter :)
<MartijnVdS> because you haven't uninstalled flash? ;)
<MartijnVdS> or set it to "click to play"
<mgdm> it woudl actually not matter if you did
<MartijnVdS> mgdm: it's <video> ?
<brobostigon> whats the keyboard shortcut to bring back gnome-terminal's menu bar.?
<MartijnVdS> F10?
<MartijnVdS> Alt+F10?
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: :) thank you, worked.
<mgdm> MartijnVdS: it detects one or t'other
<MartijnVdS> can't you make <video> click to play as well?
<MartijnVdS> using some kind of extension
<b1ackcr0w> arrrggg! late! Watchin c4 talking about Poundland being lying bastards
<b1ackcr0w> Not to mention...
<b1ackcr0w> they don't sell...
<b1ackcr0w> BUM WHITE!
<b1ackcr0w> Bum White! Buy a tube, and take it home for FREE!
<davmor2> b1ackcr0w: you know this is a family channel right
<b1ackcr0w> I'm so sorry. I thought I was in the Linux Outlaws channel
<b1ackcr0w> major ooooops
<b1ackcr0w> FWIW - I did get a colleague to install 12.04 on all his home machines this week...
<popey> :)
 * zleap is now on 12.04
<zleap> well lubuntu but being able to create a new doc from right click is great
<zleap> is there a way to make top not refresh so fast so i can actually follow the line across to see which pid to kill
<zleap> ok man top reveals top -d
<zleap> can then specify pid
<zleap> within the k option once running
<AlanBell> directhex: http://blog.jgc.org/2012/09/the-uk-has-entire-unused-ipv4-8-that-is.html new comments (including one calling you a cretin!)
<Azelphur> ali1234 / popey latest news from pirate http://pastebin.com/DVNsx7xz if your interested xD
<Azelphur> that stuff at the bottom seems real dodgy
<BigRedS> Gotta say I agree with the idea of waiting until there's an actual market for it
<popey> ho ho ho
<AlanBell> BigRedS: well there will be a window of opportunity for selling IPv4 space I guess
<AlanBell> at some point in the future it will be worthless as everyone will be on IPv6 (even if that is 20+ years it will one day happen)
<ali1234> Azelphur: please, he's obviously stalling, just like the whole thing was obviously dodgy months ago
<Azelphur> hehe, perhaps
<ali1234> and on the IP address note, i fail to see why deploying a firewall is a bad thing?
<ali1234> just because you can't ping an address doesn't mean it is not in use
<ali1234> if you could reach those machines you'd all be crying about how government IT is terrible and can't do security properly
<AlanBell> there was a question about whether any of them were in use, it would appear that they are, which is fine
<AlanBell> bet they are not using all of the class A though
<ali1234> no, almost certainly not
<AlanBell> they could presumably just sell class B blocks
<AlanBell> bit like the wireless spectrum auctions
<ali1234> it does look rather like the whole block is unroutable
<AlanBell> what do you mean by that?
<ali1234> well, try a traceroute
<ali1234> it will only go a couple of hops
<ali1234> that means that it's not simply firewalled
<ali1234> your ISP literally doesn't know where to send packets for those addresses
<ali1234> which means the machines are likely not connected to the internet at all
<ali1234> or if they are, they are behind nat
<AlanBell> I see
<ali1234> i notice the MOD has one as well
<AlanBell> so, they can see out via nat, as if they were on 10.0.0.0/8 but their nat router is somewhere outside of 51
<ali1234> i'm sure hey could just share it
<AlanBell> if they did nothing and sold the whole thing then they wouldn't be able to see sites using the new addresses (probably)
<AlanBell> actually they use multiple levels of nasty proxys so it might well be workable
<ali1234> continuing to use the addresses and also selling them is not workable
<ali1234> unless they are only used on machines which are not connected to the internet at all
<AlanBell> it is a bad idea, but it is workable
<ali1234> in whch case they can use whatever IPs they want on those
<ali1234> no, it isn't workable
<AlanBell> I had a customer that picked a random address range for their internal machines, they had no idea that 10 and 192.168 were special
<ali1234> it might work, in some circumstances, but it is not workable, because it will fail in unpredictable and unexpected ways in others
<AlanBell> but they used a proxy server and the proxy server was configured to cope with it
<AlanBell> so they could see sites using their internal addresses and the proxy would look outwards for the site
<AlanBell> but yeah, that is daft and wrong
<popey> http://blog.modernmechanix.com/gain-weight-stop-being-skinny-and-tired/  saw that and thought of mungojerry
<AlanBell> heh, nice. None of the images on it are particularly plump though
<ali1234> hmm actually
<ali1234> they aren't unroutable
<ali1234> just that nothing after the firewall returns traces
<ali1234> so it's plausible that they are all in use in a way that would make it very difficult indeed to change
<Azelphur> Is 802.11n faster than USB2?
<Azelphur> (ie, should I get a USB 3 adapter)
<Azelphur> seems like usb 2 is 480mbits, so I'm guessing not :P
<Seeker`> 'USB3 adapter'?
<Azelphur> Seeker`: wifi usb adapters, was thinking if usb 2 would bottleneck 802.11n
<Seeker`> ah
<Seeker`> have seen routers claiming ridiculous speeds for wireless n
<Azelphur> more than 480? o.O
<Seeker`> never managed to reach those speeds over a PCI card :P
<Azelphur> ah apparently 802.11n caps out at 600mbits
<Seeker`> yup
<Azelphur> fun
<AlanBell> not going to happen
<YaManicKill> ac supports >1Gb
<YaManicKill> but if we are talking about bottlenecking...
<YaManicKill> I saw a gigabit ethernet usb 2.0 adapter
<YaManicKill> kinda pointless :-P
 * bittin is gonna book a december trip to the UK 
<Laney> awesome
<Laney> don't just stay in London though!
<bittin> Laney, hmm okay :p
<bittin> only going for 4days to London, might go longer in 2012 :p
<Laney> boo
<brobostigon> good night everyone, sleep well.
<Laney> there's so much more than london
<bittin> when my friend moved there and i have somewhere to stay
<bittin> Laney, yeah might explore that later
<bittin> will go longer in 2013 and might even move there
 * bigcalm looks about the mad house
<bigcalm> Whose going to the happy hour this weekend in Farnham?
<pinky-> I prefer Alton
<bigcalm> I'm practising my drinking right now
<AlanBell> Alton is good too
<pinky-> as went to school at Eggars once apon a time
<bittin> damn i get money tommorow, this month for some reason
<Laney> mmm money
<pinky-> the mother of my two sons, her first name was Jackie, used to be a landlady of a pub in Alton, but I forget the name of the pub
<pinky-> I'll ask tomorrow
<popey> http://www.gizchina.com/2012/09/17/5-things-we-know-about-the-oppo-find-5/
<popey> i want that running ubuntu
<YaManicKill> ubuntu phone? or ubuntu for android?
<popey> personally, I'd rather have an Ubuntu Phone, but U4A if you're buying :)
<YaManicKill> heh
<bittin> ah need to pay via credit card on Norwegian so i have to wait until tommorow
<YaManicKill> I actually really like the idea of U4A
<popey> you are not alone
<YaManicKill> especially when you start thinking about the padfone
<AlanBell> the manufacturers should like it too, not sure why it has been so quiet
<YaManicKill> padfone with tablet dock + laptop dock + desktop dock + U4A ... with tegra 3 processor, and 4G...
<YaManicKill> for people that don't game, and don't do video/photo editing on a large scale...it'd be all they would need
<AlanBell> more people play games on phones than on computers
<AlanBell> probably
<YaManicKill> ha
<YaManicKill> oh, I just pressed "j" on google reader...and look what appeared
<YaManicKill> http://androidcommunity.com/asus-padfone-2-benchmark-leaks-with-quad-core-in-tow-20120917/
<popey> i have a wii and xbox360 and pc, and i play games on iphone and ipad _daily_
<YaManicKill> that was quite handy ;-)
<popey> I suspect I am not alone in this
<YaManicKill> yeah
<YaManicKill> I don't game on my computer much anymore tbh...
<YaManicKill> I'm not massively bothered about higher and higher resolutions
<bigcalm> Hayley has become hooked on solitaire on my iPad. I think I've lost this one, better start looking for a new lady
<ahayzen> Evening guys.....got Uni internet working :).... i remember an option to stop disks spinning down does tht still exist somewhere on Ubuntu? Thanks Andy
<pinky-> I like Alton because there's a lot of parsley there
<AlanBell> ahayzen: yes, hdparm options can do that
<ahayzen> thought it was in default...did it get removed in GNOME settings reshuffle?
<AlanBell> sudo hdparm -S 2 /dev/sda might do it
<AlanBell> nothing to do with gnome
<ahayzen> ...the reason i want to stop spin down is i've got a Hybrid drive SSD+HDD so stopping spin down will stop the HDD from spinning down ..correct?
<AlanBell> oh, you want it to stop spinning down
<ahayzen> yh
<AlanBell> err in that case a bigger number :)
<AlanBell> 2 is 10 seconds I think
<AlanBell> personally with that drive I would let it sort itself out
<ahayzen> basically when u leave the lappy or a bit it spins down the HDD...but adds more wear when it has to spin up i would rather use more power...what do you think?
<ahayzen> *for a bit
<AlanBell> I would let it just get on with things
<ahayzen> ok think i'll leave it as it is for now then :)
<ahayzen> it is the System76 panp9 best laptop ever so far :)....none of tht rubbish u get on windows laptops ;)
<ahayzen> AlanBell, anyway, Thanks for your prompt and useful response as usual :)
<AlanBell> so did you import it?
<ahayzen> yep
<AlanBell> no Â£ on shift 3 then?
<ahayzen> like ~$100 delivery charge.... then + 20%tax
<ahayzen> well they have a UK keyboard option now :)
<AlanBell> interesting
<ahayzen> just gave the UPS man a cheque to pay for the tax
<bigcalm> Sleeeeeeeeep
<ahayzen> AlanBell, 'International UK Keyboard Layout - Including Pound, Euro, and Alt GR keys ( + $33.00 )'
<AlanBell> so it is
<ahayzen> and the ship u the US keyboard in the box which is a nice touch as u have paid for it effectively
<AlanBell> very nice
<ahayzen> *they ship....getting used to new keyboard lol
<bittin> 2-5th Dec, bittin goes to UK and prolly going there sometime Feb/March 2013 aswell
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-18
<Kavi_> Hi
<Kavi_> How to use symmetric multiprocessing in ubuntu
<Thanapal> What is Symmetric multiProcessing in ubuntu
<ali1234> it just works
<Kavi_> How to configure SMP(Symmetric MultiProcessing) in ubuntu
<Thanapal> How to configure SMP(Symmetric MultiProcessing) in ubuntu
<Azelphur> Kavi_: / Thanapal please drop the clones, and don't spam.
<popey> morning
<Azelphur> morning :)
<daubers> o/
<christel> morning lovelies
<hoover> morning all
<JamesTait> Happy Tuesday, folks! :-D
 * AlanBell observes directhex's petition on slashdot
<czajkowski> aloha
<AlanBell> morning czajkowski
<czajkowski> howdy
<christel> lauraaaa
<czajkowski> ello christel how's you?
<christel> not at all bad! thyself lovely one? :)
<czajkowski> not bad
 * AlanBell wonders if Laura is coming out to play in Farnham on Saturday
<czajkowski> nope fraid not
<czajkowski> sorry
<christel> :(
<Azelphur> I just been watching some of the TV License inspector videos on youtube, it's astounding the amount of harassment they get away with lol
<mungojerry> Azelphur, do their vans really work?
<Azelphur> mungojerry: nah that's a load of crap from what I hear
<Azelphur> it's more the punching people in the face I'm worried about :P
<popey> they dont have vans these days
<popey> haven't had for years
<mungojerry> apprently a tv which receives a OTA signal can be detecetd with a listening device
<Azelphur> popey: yea, they have "handheld devices" ;)
<popey> some do, most don't
<mungojerry> so they just knock on doors onf those people who don't have licences?
<popey> basically
<popey> they go through the database and send people round
<daubers> mungojerry: That used to work with old CRT based TV's, was something to do with the coils
<Azelphur> mungojerry: and they are usually really rude and often abusive while doing so, from what I see on youtube
<mungojerry> i have a CRT
<daubers> You just have to remember that they have no legal right to enter your property without a warrent
<mungojerry> but i also have licence
<mungojerry> why don't they get the JWs to check , since they knock at my house twice a day on the weekend
<Azelphur> daubers: indeed
<Azelphur> swear warning, but this is the worst video I found of the inspectors coming knocking: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZENQpDgUms
<daubers> Azelphur: I got the police to escort one tv licence man out of the student halls because he just walked in to peoples flats
<Azelphur> daubers: nice
<popey> you're basing your opinion of TVL on one visit from a guy who was videoed by a neighbour back in 2005?
<Azelphur> popey: I've actually watched like 20 videos, as I say that was the worst of em
<Azelphur> there's lots of more recent ones I've seen where they are really rude and basically say that if you don't answer my questions and let me search your property I'll be back with a warrant
<Azelphur> and lots where they outright lie about the laws to try and force a license on you, too
<daubers> Yeah, the TV licence people are run by a private company these days. Wouldn't be surprised if they got paid by the number of people they foist a licence onto
<Azelphur> daubers: I've read they get Â£20 commission per sale
<Azelphur> daubers: I've read other stuff too like picking on disabled people and stuff, not nice, as I say dunno how they get away with this lol
<Azelphur> it's like large scale super harassment
<hoover> morning folks
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<popey> i do wonder how many of those people videoing the TVL people actually do have a telly and use it to watch live TV
 * daubers has a telly but doesn't watch live TV!
<Azelphur> popey: who knows, myself I actually legitimately just don't watch it, where I live now we have a license, I could watch it if I wanted, I just don't. Everything I consume is online
<daubers> "But you have an aerial on the side of your house" "But there's no cable connected to it" "Does that matter sir?"
<Azelphur> lol
<daubers> stupid TV licence people
<popey> none of my aerials are connected to anything
<popey> 3 on the side of the house
<popey> and a dish :)
<Azelphur> daubers: yea, there was one that said that he had a TV because he has a satellite dish in the videos I found
<daubers> I have 2 and a dish :) Replacing the tallest one with a weather station when I can get hold of a long enough ladder
<Azelphur> some of the newer videos are absolutely hilarious though, apparently they've been instructed to run away if your filming them
<Azelphur> results in hilarity such as this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qxev8L27Lo :p
<daubers> Hah! So all I need do now is open the door to them with a camera and they'll stop bothering me?
<popey> i recorded some pikeys who came to tarmac my mums drive
<Azelphur> daubers: apparently
<Azelphur> popey: nice :p
<Azelphur> "Oh no, a tripod! *runs*"
<popey> wonder what he uses to record constantly
<Azelphur> Indeed, seems like a nice setup to have
<Azelphur> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWjAFykk1MQ&t=0m47s she looks so mad xD
<Azelphur> the face she pulls when she sees the phone lol
<kirrus> czajkowski: Please stop trying to steal BigRedS ;)
<kirrus> We like him quite a lot :)
<n1md4> ....and have need for him at the pub!
<czajkowski> well pub is always a good reason
 * hoover agrees with czajkowski 
<hoover> Dang, there goes my focus ;-)
<Azelphur> 11am and already yearning for the pub :P
 * mattt shakes his head
<davmor2> Morning all
<mungojerry> Azelphur, just watched those videos
<Azelphur> hehe
<mungojerry> how rude
<Azelphur> indeed
<Azelphur> mungojerry: I don't think I linked one with a bunch of threats in it
<davmor2> czajkowski: PROD!!!!!!!!!!!!! morning :)
<mungojerry> i have a no cold callers sign. anyone who wants to visit needs an appointment
<mungojerry> i like the man with a fear of tripods though
<Azelphur> hehe indeed
<Azelphur> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GmXU65p7AQ is a good one for lies and threats everywhere
<popey> http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/ostrich-pillow/ostrich-pillow
<popey> awesome
<Azelphur> popey: I'm sure I've seen stuff like that before
<Laney> what a load of crap he talks
<Laney> his house is a soverign nation hahaha
<Azelphur> Laney: xD
<Azelphur> Laney: the inspector is talking an equal amount of crap though :p
<Laney> yeah nobody knows what they're going on about
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> it's illegal not to have a TV License, true stories.
<mungojerry> are they in the employ of the govt, or subcontracted?
<mungojerry> why haven't BBC watchdog done a piece on this :P
<Azelphur> mungojerry: they are a private company and have no more rights than a salesman
<mungojerry> s/govt/bbc
<Azelphur> mungojerry: why would BBC watchdog attack themselves? XD
<Azelphur> that'd be pointless
<mungojerry> exactly
<Azelphur> hehe
<popey> pretty sure watchdog have done something on this
<Azelphur> mungojerry: I also saw a video of an investigator going through some guys computer which was a little worrying :p
<davmor2> Azelphur: because they would have to to remain unbias, like when sky news and the sun and news of the world had to report on the phone tapping incident
<Azelphur> popey: that would be interesting to see just for the whole self-policingness of it all
<Azelphur> davmor2: haha
<popey> not self policing
<popey> bbc != tvl
<Azelphur> tvl are hired and paid for by BBC though
<mungojerry> i've switched computer and i still get freezes in my desktop UI while installing packages from USC :S
<davmor2> mungojerry: how do you mean freezes?
<davmor2> mungojerry: is it something you can record and put in a bug please
<mungojerry> mouse doesn't move , windows don't open
<mungojerry> davmor2, i'm using cinnamon, so i'll prob need to boot into unity to get better bug support
<davmor2> mungojerry: in unity it might not happen
<mungojerry> that's true too
<davmor2> mungojerry: it could be a bug in cinnamon that is causing it, in which case we are unlikely to fix it unless it is definitely our code causing the issue
<mungojerry> of course :)
<mungojerry> in which case, i'd also probably try gnome shell to see if it does it there too
<mungojerry> the likelihood of the problem being cinnamon is probably quite high :(
<davmor2> mungojerry: were you installing more than one app in a single session?  there was a huge memory leak I discovered in precise that has been partially addressed in quantal
<mungojerry> i was, yes, however i only just opened the USC app
<mungojerry> surely it couldn't bring the machine to it's knees so quickly?
<mungojerry> i'll try apt-get next time and see if it's just because of i/o
<mungojerry> (i guess it might be)
<davmor2> mungojerry: how much memory does the box have and what type of processor, gfx shouldn't matter as it uses gtk so should display happily in 2d and 3d
<mungojerry> davmor2, 4GB ram, core i5 processor
<mungojerry> when i get some time later i'll try in a different DE
 * daubers turns on the heating
<davmor2> mungojerry: Oh man I'm on amd quad here 4 gig never seen an issue my laptop is an i3 and that works faster than the amd :D
<KungFuPanda> Hi guys, any1 meet this problem ? my system crashed everytime when I first time try to start window 64bit xp image under virtrual box? the whole system freezed, I have to hold the power button to restart, after that I can start the xp then, very annoying.
<hoover> KungFuPanda: A colleague is having similar issues with Virtualbox and a centos 6 64bit guest
<KungFuPanda> great, so I am not alone, did he find any solutions ?
<hoover> no, not yet I'm afraid, I think his system crashes repeatedly so his case is even worse than yours ;-)
<KungFuPanda> damn linux, so easy to crash. :P
<hoover> I run an xp guest (32bit) on a 64bit centos host without any problems though (sp3)
<hoover> have you tried a 32 bit xp?
<KungFuPanda> not yet, maybe I should try that,
 * mungojerry boggles at the community app showdown results
<KungFuPanda> it is not make any sense at all, it only crash on first  time of the  day, after that, no matter how many times I restart the system, it always works fine then, only the first time of the day. :p
<ali1234> why is everyone shocked at the app showdown results?
<ali1234> you know only about 400 people even voted on it?
<ali1234> also, why surprised that an app that returns one of the liked but irritatingly removed features of nautilus would win?
<ali1234> this is what's great about open source. idiot developers can take stuff out, and the users can just put it back in
<mungojerry> it's a pretty ugly implementation
<mungojerry> how do you vote on it? i don't think i saw that
<mungojerry> tbh there were too many apps to choose from , so any app that was receommended on reddit/forum would have won
<ali1234> i'm just curious what you expected to win
<ali1234> if you look at the full results, the winder got 3x the votes of anything else
<ali1234> *winner
<mungojerry> cuttlefish looked interesting, and lightread is a v good app
<ali1234> the problem with lightread and fogger is nobody actually needs that stuff
<ali1234> lightread is just a limited RSS reader - we've got hundreds of those
<ali1234> and fogger only exists to work around problems with unity's design
<ali1234> and cuttlefish is an app to make it easier to change settings, so no surprise that came third
<mungojerry> ali1234, no, where's the hundreds of decent rss readers?
<ali1234> i never said any of them were decent
<mungojerry> liferea is prety much the main one, and it's slow
<ali1234> lightread has not improved things at all
<mungojerry> lightread is decent
<mungojerry> if you use google reader
<ali1234> yeah. google reader is completely terrible in every way
<mungojerry> i use it every day, where liferea was misbehaving and didn't show certain feeds
<MartijnVdS> except it's not
<ali1234> lightread being tied to it is basically an automatic fail
<mungojerry> i think you're in a bad mood. lightread is v good
<ali1234> google reader hides things by design
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: it does?
<ali1234> you have no control over how many posts it show from each feed
<ali1234> it just shows the first 10
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: it shows all unread ones.
<ali1234> and stuff mysteriously dissappears after you have read it
<MartijnVdS> that's good
<ali1234> MartijnVdS: that is categorically untrue
<ali1234> it shows all the nread ones if the feed has 10 or less items
<ali1234> otherwise it just shows the first 10 unread items
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: I always use the "All unread items" view.
<MartijnVdS> works fine for me..
<ali1234> again, that only shows the first 10 unread items from each of your feeds
<MartijnVdS> I read it often enough to not hit the problems you're describing
<ali1234> for example, if you have a feed which gets about 30 posts per day
<ali1234> such as the BBC one
<ali1234> or slashdot
<MartijnVdS> I don't read those.
<ali1234> or pretty much any news blog really
<mungojerry> try lightread then
<MartijnVdS> Busiest feed I read is ars technica
<ali1234> i have tried it
<MartijnVdS> and they post throughout the day, so I keep up..
<ali1234> i tried it after the showdown ended and the apps were all released
<ali1234> and this is what happened
<ali1234> all i'm doing is telling you the results of my trial
<ali1234> basically lightread is unusable for these feeds
<MartijnVdS> and I'm telling you that "doesn't work for you" doesn't mean "doesn't work for anyone"
<ali1234> liferea works perfectly however
<ali1234> !wfm
<lubotu3> Common Sense: Just because you can, does not mean you should (and especially recommend to others). Think before you do. "Works for me" does not mean it is ok. The latest version of everything is not always useful if you aim for stability. Please see http://geekosophical.net/random/worksforme/
<mungojerry> ali1234, load lightread and change "max read items" to 50
<mungojerry> click refresh, and it will show 50 items in the feed (unread ones)
<ali1234> i only just noticed that lightread has google ads plastered all over it
<mungojerry> where?
<ali1234> maybe it's in the feed actually
<mungojerry> do the change i just mentioned and it will fix your problem
<mungojerry> of the max messages
<ali1234> yeah it is
<ali1234> max read items?
<ali1234> ok i set it to 50. now  can't close the settings window because the dialog is messed up
<ali1234> http://ubuntuone.com/6nMz2gwmuhBP6gHvrLkR1o
<ali1234> got to love these html5 apps
<ali1234> so in summary this app has a confusing interface that doesn't match the rest of the desktop, is tied to a google account, and doesn't show all of feeds
<ali1234> but you know what is even better than using a stand alone rss redaer? just using firefox live bookmarks
<ali1234> doesn't suffer from any of these problems, doesn't need you to keep yet another app open all the time...
<bigcalm> Good afternoon peeps :)
<hoover> hey biggie
<bigcalm> Hiya hoover
<christel> hiya tinycalm
<bigcalm> Hey, it's not my fault. It's just cold today
 * bigcalm hugs christel :)
<ali1234> hmm actually cuttlefish is genuinely innovative
<davmor2> christel: hello
<bigcalm> Hi davmor2
<davmor2> bigcalm: hello
<davmor2> bigcalm: you just got on or did we not say hello earlier
<bigcalm> davmor2: Have an early start and long drive on Thursday, might need reminding of that at the LUG tomorrow
<bigcalm> davmor2: just popped on
<bigcalm> I am somewhat over worked right now
<davmor2> bigcalm: does that mean you won't be at the coworking space?
<bigcalm> davmor2: that is quite correct. I did warn you last time :)
<davmor2> bigcalm: you probably did me remembering on the other hand is something completely different :D
<bigcalm> Heh
<christel> heya davmor2 :D
<hoover> cheers all
<davmor2> hoover: what for :D
 * SuperEngineer is now known as "back from sanity break in Dartmouth" & was never known as SuperEngineer|Away] ;)
<popey> welcome back SuperEngineer
<SuperEngineer> o? thanks
<SuperEngineer> ;)
<SuperEngineer> took me surprise - nice to be back
<SuperEngineer> *me by
<SuperEngineer> now I've stopped nom nom boiling over & cleaned up the mess - I'll try that again... thanks popey, much appreciated
<mgdm> can anyone recommend a USB wireless adapter? (It's ultimately for a Windows box so compatibility with Ubuntu sadly isn't a huge concern right now...)
<Flashtek> mgdm: tp-link stuff generally wors well ime
<zleap> hi feisar
<zleap> hi Flashtek
<mgdm> Flashtek: ta
<davmor2> mgdm: ditto on the tplink
<Flashtek> sensibly priced also
<mgdm> very much so, thanks!
<feisar> zleap hi
<zleap> hi
<popey> mgdm, yes!
<popey> mgdm, http://www.amazon.co.uk/Technologies-802-11N-150Mbps-Wireless-Compatible/dp/B0035FVL4G/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1347997589&sr=8-2
<popey> i have a few of them
<mgdm> popey: you really are a font of all kinds of useful info, thanks :)
<mgdm> and that looks cool, ta
<einonm> Watch out with those though - I've got a similar Edimax nano USB wifi dongle - I think because the antenna is so small, the thing isn't very good at picking up weak wifi.
 * bigcalm rumbles in
<mgdm> I have the Edimax one, it came with my RPi
<mgdm> but I've not had occasion to test it yet
<dwatkins> I have the Edimax, there's a neat automated install script linked from here for Debians: http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=6256
<einonm> Wow. That's a huge script, isn't it?
<dwatkins> yeah, works well though
<dwatkins> run it before connecting the device, as my Pi failed to boot with it connected
<einonm> I think the 8188 driver is a bit new, it probably isn't well supported on a pi kernel yet
<einonm> I ended up using a trusty ralink2800 dongle on mine - I think it's one of the longest supported drivers in the kernel.
<popey> I've had no issues with that LM device
<einonm> cool - the price is certainly good
<ali1234> libxrender-dev and libxrender-dev:i386 can't be installed at the same time
<ali1234> hmm. fullscreenhack tends to crash these opengl games that insist on drawing over all available monitors
<ali1234> i don't understand how these games consistently fail to provide any kind of usable screen resolution setting
<ali1234> this one has a resolution setting and the options are "50% - 100%"
<ali1234> and changing it makes absolutely no difference at all
<brobostigon> nos da everyone sleep well,
<davmor2> bigcalm: lo
<bigcalm> Evenin mukka
<brobostigon> nos da bigcalm
<bigcalm> Night brobostigon
<davmor2> bigcalm: you still at work too or are you just being social
<bigcalm> davmor2: still at work, but trying to be social of sorts at the same time
<mgdm> at work this late? :(
<davmor2> bigcalm: hahahaha
<davmor2> mgdm: Yes too much too do
<bigcalm> mgdm: I do this regularly. One of the dangers of working from home
<bigcalm> That said, I often stayed at the office until 9/10pm
<bigcalm> I live to work
<bigcalm> But hopefully it means that I can take Thursday to Sunday off work and not worry about it
<mgdm> well, if you get it back then fair enough
<bigcalm> Get it back?
<mgdm> as in, the time you put in now is time you can then take later
<davmor2> mgdm: one of the dangers of fix period releases when there is loads to do at the end
<mgdm> sure - but I'm not a believer in letting things get to the point where you're doing work at 11pm
<bigcalm> mgdm: I don't get the time back. I'm working in my own time for free. I am an idiot
<mgdm> You are
<mgdm> you are being taken advantage of
<davmor2> mgdm: this is more of a one off,  we had a few things go wrong today and now it's catch up time
<bigcalm> Tricky when it's a 2 person company. Pretty much the only way to keep the job
<mgdm> davmor2: well, fair enough
<mgdm> bigcalm: I've worked for a 3-person company, and i would still not do that without compensation
<mgdm> if you're not getting something in return, you are selling yourself short
<davmor2> mgdm: but it gets more chaotic as the Ubuntu release goes on
<czajkowski> files more bugs
<czajkowski> no where near popey level
<czajkowski> but getting there
<davmor2> czajkowski: no your not
<davmor2> czajkowski: you are a rank amateur at bug reporting
<davmor2> which reminds me I still have 2 I need to report
<czajkowski> :/
<mgdm> davmor2: well there's a problem in the release structure, then, that needs resolved
<bigcalm> davmor2: yes, fix it now
<popey> sadly stuff landed late
<popey> as often happens
<davmor2> mgdm: no there is a bunch of stuff that our team can't do till just before beta 2 and then the retest happens just before release so it kinda sucks to be me sometimes :) not the end of the world though it doesn't always happen :)
<mgdm> if it often happens, it sounds like a problem; if not, then well, fair enough
<czajkowski> where as with me I do my work during the day and my ububntu work in the evening,somtimes during the day I'll find a bug and report it and in theevening I get the odd poke for LP work
<bigcalm> I had the choice of working or watching Downton Abbey with Hayley...
<mgdm> oh, well, when you put it like that...
<davmor2> czajkowski: Today I broke USC on precise and quantal guess what I spent most of the day doing :D
<czajkowski> oh today I also lost my desktop and had a mini panic attack and had to pke popey
<czajkowski> flip side is every thursday @6pm UTC+1 atm will be 5pm UTC in a few weeks I've a CC meeting
<czajkowski> but then other days I dont run away at 6
<czajkowski> s there is a bit of give and take
<bigcalm> Timezones are a bugger
<davmor2> bigcalm: even more so when the rest of the world don't use ours
<bigcalm> Yep, everybody should use GMT and be awake at the same time
 * bigcalm nods
<davmor2> bigcalm: indeed it's only fair we gave the world everything(TM)
<davmor2> czajkowski: how dare you be so sidest, what's wrong with rightfield?
<popey> i have found episode 1 of the young ones on a vhs tape
<davmor2> popey: wow you had worse taste than I remember.......oh wait no I've seen your shirts......you have better taste than I remember :D
<davmor2> popey: the young ones was cool but my god has it dated
<popey> yeah
<popey> actually it's a bit chucklyworthy, but I've seen it so many times
<popey> this was recorded off UK Gold
<popey> and part way through the programme they have mistakenly played the continuity announcement
<popey> remember how we used to record programmes on VHS by the exact start time and end time
<popey> davmor2, usc should remember my username/password :(
<ahayzen> popey, omg i remember setting up the VHS when i was like 5 lol :)
<popey> :)
<ahayzen> popey, betamax ftw!
<davmor2> popey: you keep saying that and it shouldn't :D it should in quantal now remember your username once you have a stored key,  Ie activated recommendations or installed a previous purchase
<davmor2> popey: the unified sso client was meant to happen but precise fixes took up a lot of our time unfortunately, so that might be 13.04 if we are lucky, you'll still have to use your 2f though
<popey> :(
<popey> makes the whole 'one click buy' a bit of a lie :)
<popey> none of the games have appeared in the launcher
<ali1234> dustforce appears in gnome panel menu
<ali1234> none of the others are even in my USC yet
<popey> that one hasn't finished installing for me yet
<ali1234> yeah it took ages for me too
<popey> shatter and space pirates are installed for me, but no icon
<ali1234> still "not found" for both here
<ali1234> i left USC running for about 4 hours now
<davmor2> popey: I think is it really hit an miss there are some changes in unity that broke it
<ali1234> can i firce it to update the sources in a way that i can see what it is doing?
<davmor2> ali1234: sudo /usr/share/software-center/update-software-center-agent
<davmor2> ali1234: it does it automatically on restart though
<ali1234> yeah, well, apparently it doesn't work
<davmor2> ali1234: it does you just got in early it does keep retriggering
<ali1234> ok that command exited with no output after about 2 seconds, almost as if it did absolutely nothing at all
<popey> shatter is a bit funky
<popey> and works well on my i7
<ali1234> "funky"?
<davmor2> ali1234: I'm taking it that you have gone back to the HIB and clicked on the next button right?
<ali1234> next button?
<directhex> waiting for USC publication of HiB6 games
<ali1234> what next button?
<davmor2> ali1234: so you clicked on the install button for the first app did you click on the next apps button?
<ali1234> you mean the "download for ubuntu" button?
<directhex> ali1234, right
<davmor2> ali1234: yeap
<ali1234> yeah, i clicked on it, then software centre loaded up and said "not found". then i waited 4 hours, closed software center, then clicked the "download for ubuntu" button again, and it still says "not found"
<popey> i just pressed back in usc then clicked the game
<popey> they're now listed on the front page
<popey> it knows you bought them
<popey> but obviously did that 4 hours after you
<ali1234> yeah, i got the emails about the tokens
<ali1234> when i first did this, the SPAZ was not even on that page yet
<davmor2> ali1234: if you see the apps on the what's new section you should just be able to install them
<ali1234> yeah i see them on the front page
<ali1234> so why doesn't the button work?
<popey> yeah, spaz wasnt there for me earlier, but I only just clicked to install them
<ali1234> There isnât a software package called âspacepiratesandzombiesâ in your current software sources.
<popey> busy working before :)
<ali1234> aaaaah
<popey> ooh, dustforce is now in my launcher
<popey> doesn't look like it installed the others
<ali1234> it's because it needs to be searching for "spacepiratesandzombies:i386" and "shatter:i386"
<popey> ahhhhh
<ali1234> however, dustforce is just dustforce, so the link works
<ali1234> i reported this bug ... several months ago
<davmor2> ali1234: it should matter USC should pick up on that grrrrr
<ali1234> yeah... it doesn't
<davmor2> ali1234: that'll be why the button doesn't work then
<ali1234> there's packages in the universe which are broken in the same way
<ali1234> for example eagle cad
<ali1234> which has only i386 version
<ali1234> let me find the bug...
<ali1234> bug 999301
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 999301 in software-center (Ubuntu) "package "eagle" not found in software center on x86_64 install" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/999301
<directhex> i see one game in USC - Dustforce
<davmor2> ali1234: these should all be multiarch so there should be a 64bit package that basically points at the i386 one I wonder if that didn't build hmmmmm
<ali1234> this is the exact same bug. eagle can be found if you search, but not if some other app kicks off software center
<ali1234> yeah, eagle has no 64 bit wrapper package
<davmor2> popey: are you on i386 or amd64?
<davmor2> popey: if the answer is 64bit then the reason is the apps are multiarch I've already filed a bug, and unity and USC are currently trying to figure out who's code needs to handle it iirc
<popey> yes amd64
<popey> nice one
<ali1234> btw, is dustforce supposed to run in a tiny window with huge black borders?
<davmor2> popey: it took me ages to figure out why some did and some didn't, it didn't help it was the same apps on both i386 and amd 64
<bigcalm> Sleep now
<directhex> i on;y really care about rochard working, btw :p
<directhex> that's the only one i have any reputation staked on
<ali1234> yeah?
<popey> haha
<popey> dustforce runs with a small border on my 1366x768 laptop
<ali1234> dustforce is basically super meat boy with sloppy unresponsive controls :(
<popey> runs really well
<popey> hah
<ali1234> and bad level design
<popey> i dont think i have played smb properly
<ali1234> maybe i'm just doing it wrong
<popey> i have it here somewhere
<ali1234> it was in 5 as the bonus i think
<popey> a hyes
<ali1234> my favourite game out of any of them yet
<popey> i have kinda ocd downloaded all of them and stuffed them in U1
<ali1234> i've installed them all from USC
<ali1234> but only played about half
<popey> for some i even downloaded osx and win versions too
<popey> yeah, i haven't got around to playing them all
<directhex> i've actually liked the mono-based games. they've been good. this is convenient for a narative i want to spread :p
<ali1234> i've spent more time trying to fix them, than actually playing them though
<ali1234> whic are mono except for bastion?
<popey> i haven't had a single issue playing any of them
<popey> the new unity ones
<ali1234> bastion was Ok but the narrator gimmick started getting annoying after about 2/3 of the game
<directhex> ali1234,  spacechem; atom zombie smasher; bastion; rochard
<ali1234> spacechem bored me to tears :(
<directhex> i like spacechem, but it's crazy hard
<ali1234> really?
<ali1234> i didn't find it challenging... just repetitive and annoying
<directhex> it's the first "programming puzzle" game i've enjoyed. y'know, the "guide the robot by programing his path" type puzzles, like microsoft tinker
<ali1234> i think it's the difficulty curve... it's too shallow
<ali1234> can i skip directly to the hard stuff?
<directhex> there's a lot of tutorial to it
<ali1234> yeah really
<directhex> did you get far enough to build composite reactors?
<directhex> i.e. pipe one reactor into another
<ali1234> no
<ali1234> i dont think so anyway
<directhex> yeah, i'd say that's where it starts to really open out. that and the boss stages
<ali1234> i guess i'll persevere then :)
<ali1234> i tried the android games actually on android too
<directhex> one level sees you assembling a nuclear missile
<ali1234> touch screen gaming is kind of fail
<directhex> i.e. fuel and fissile warhead
<directhex> your input is... water
<ali1234> world of goo is perfect example... you can't see what your doing because your finger blocks your view
<ali1234> it makes the game about 100 times harder
<directhex> ali1234, we agree for once! :o
<ali1234> however: there was one GREAT game: osmos
<ali1234> because you tap on the opposite side of where you want to go
<directhex> not big on osmos. can't get into it
<ali1234> so this problem is averted
<ali1234> it is a kind of slow paced game but they used the touch screen mechanic well
<ali1234> i actually prefer it on android to PC
<ali1234> it's a perfect game to just pass time while you're waiting for a train or something
<directhex> wake me when there's a humble bundle for wp7 ;)
<hamitron> you got wp7?
<directhex> hamitron, http://apebox.org/wordpress/rants/407/
<directhex> anyway, wake me when another hib6 game hits the ubuntu software centre
<directhex> man, i basically hate being awake
<directhex> but [place a lot of permitted waking conditions
<hamitron> I like wp7 tbh
<ali1234> how do i make grep ignore device nodes?
<ali1234> trying to grep firmware source and it keeps hanging on target/fs/dev/random etc
<ali1234> ah, -D skip
<popey> directhex, have you bought the bundle?
<directhex> popey, bien sur!
<popey> script curling your usc page, and check for updates
<popey> notify-osd yourself a ping when it changes :)
<directhex> or "go to bed, then wake up tomorrow"?
<popey> pffffffft
<popey> "slacker"
 * popey goes to bed
<ali1234> that's a pretty good idea
<ball> I'm starting to think I might try Ubuntu again.
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-19
<directhex> a sample composite reactor i forgot i uploaded (think it was for a steam badge or something) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BuMu4Mp9EFc&feature=g-upl
<directhex> turn a mix of carbon dioxide and hydrogen sulfide into carbon and sulphuric acid
<christel> MORNING
<Azelphur> morning
<christel> :D
<christel> how art thou?
<Azelphur> art thou goodeth, how is thee?
<christel> :D very very well!
<christel> still not quite sure why i got up so early
<Azelphur> don't worry, at least you havn't gone full crazy nocturnal like me
<christel> haha bless
<Azelphur> I went to sleep at 2pm yesterday and woke up at 11pm lol
<christel> "oops" :P
<Azelphur> indeed xD
<Azelphur> I found the 50-99% off electronics section at Amazon though
<Azelphur> kid in a candy store \o/
<christel> ooooh nicely played :D
<Azelphur> indeed \o/
<mattt> morning morning morning morning
<MartijnVdS> http://www.talklikeapirate.com/
<pinky-> friggin' in the riggin'
<MartijnVdS> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-9my0tsutw !
<pinky-> Monkey Island heh.. If I said I've played them all will it show my age?
<pinky-> they're not pirates, they're just slackers!
<MartijnVdS> pinky-: â« A pirate I was meant to be ;)
<pinky-> MartijnVdS â« Trim the sails and roam the sea!
<pinky-> Less singing, more sailing.
<MartijnVdS> "We'll fight you in the harbour, we'll battle you on land. But when you meet singing pirates, they'll be more than you can stand!"
<pinky-> When we defeat our wicked foe, his ship he will be bailing!
<pinky-> The battle will be long, but our courage we will prove! No time for song! We've got to move!
<pinky-> MartijnVdS, I was hoping next for the kraken verse:)
<pinky-> â« If ye try ta fight us... you will get a nasty whackinÂ´! If ya disrespect our singingÂ´... we will feed ya to a kraken!
<aliveli> i need help
<Azelphur> ?ask | ali
<Azelphur> !ask | aliveli
<lubotu3> aliveli: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) See also !patience
<aliveli> forgot password ubuntu
<Azelphur> !password | aliveli
<lubotu3> aliveli: Forgot your password? See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LostPassword What's the root password? See !sudo. Don't see *** in password prompts? That's normal. Sudo doesn't ask for your password? It remembers you for several minutes. Please use strong passwords, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/StrongPasswords
<aliveli> grub not loading
<aliveli> shift key not working
<Azelphur> are you using left shift or right shift
<Azelphur> I think it only does it if you hold left shift, not right
<aliveli> "hold" i didnt try it
<Azelphur> yea, hold
<aliveli> ok thank
<andylockran> hey guys - just jumped back on my precise bx (first time for a while) and in unity the sidebar and window borders are missing
<andylockran> any idea how to reset them/what could have caused that?
<AlanBell> morning
 * AlanBell reboots and finds an old style vertical battery indicator
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: I rebooted and got ugly fonts
<JamesTait> Good morning all! :)
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<bittin^work> eyo booked some tickets to UK for 2-5th December, but i started wondering a thing would a EU ID Card be okay as a passport or do i need a real one norweigian made me confused :(
<tsimpson> I think you should be fine for EU <-> EU travel with any state-issued photographic ID
<bittin^work> tsimpson, thats what i thinked aswell
<christel> bittin^work: no, you need a passport as the UK is not part of the "schengen(sp?) agreement"
<bittin^work> christel, hm okay
 * Laney wonders just how bug today's xkcd is
<bigcalm> How bug it is?
<Laney> yes, I typoed, well done
<christel> basically the "free travel area" is all the EU states apart from the UK and ireland + iceland, lichtenstein, switzerland and norway
<bittin^work> ah well think there is plenty of time to get a new passport before December
<bigcalm> Laney: you might not have, it's early and I'm easily confused
<christel> bittin^work: where are you from? :)
<bittin^work> christel, Sweden
<christel> oh yes, i remember that now
<xnox> christel: i thought norway was part of it.....
<christel> yeah i suspect you've got plenty of time, at least its pretty quick back home (norway)
<christel> xnox: yes it is -- i meant all the EU states (apart from uk + ireland) PLUS those four countries
<christel> i probably worded it rather awkwardly
<xnox> ah I see.
<christel> (insufficient caffeine intake)
<MartijnVdS> christel: substitute with sugar!
<christel> hehe
<MartijnVdS> christel: how was the candy? :)
<christel> i havent tried it yet! I am saving it so i can taste it with the alans!
<bittin^work> will get a passport for living on the streets of UK for 4days o:
<christel> bittin^work: that sounds rather cold!
<bittin^work> needs to fix some stuff before going there 2013
<czajkowski> Laney: coming to ireland to meet mr.xkcd :D
<Laney> heh
<czajkowski> sinc ewhen is unity --reset no longer used
<Laney> that's quite a trip
<czajkowski> Laney: it;s a very short flight
<christel> bittin^work: coming over here to live or to holiday (in 2013 i mean)
<czajkowski> he'll be in Limerick the weekend of the 6/7 oct
<bittin^work> christel, holiday my friend is moving there in 2013 but i booked to early tickets :(
<bittin^work> so now i got 4 days of randomness in UK and nowhere to stay aswell :<
<xnox> Laney: There are instructions on how to load all of the today's xkcd http://www.explainxkcd.com/wiki/index.php?title=1110
<christel> oops!
<bittin^work> but well guess i can sort that out :p
<christel> i live in the middle of the countryside, but you're welcome to the spare room for a few days
<bittin^work> still 3months left to December
<Laney> xnox: yeah
<Laney> I thought about writing a script to scrape it all
<Laney> didn't get as far as going into the source though
<christel> true! it is a while to go :)
<bigcalm> Watching the page load in firebug shows how the images are gathered. Tis big with lots of 404s
<MartijnVdS> the xkcd is HUGE
<Laney> I went up and down the big black mountain thing, then left for a while
<Laney> and then when it started going down I decided to do something useful ;-)
<MartijnVdS> there's a whole underground world... and a Saturn V somewhere :)
<popey> http://i.imgur.com/GDJPL.png xkcd spoiler :)
<popey> (for those of us with better things to do) :D
<bigcalm> Hehe
<bigcalm> At least I took the time to look at the source and pick at the JS. There's no escaping my job
<bittin^work> popey, :D
<AlanBell> thanks popey for giving me my morning back
<popey> amazon sell replacement mice btw
 * Laney is considering getting a trackball
<Laney> anyone use one?
<popey> i thought bigcalm did
<bigcalm> Not me
<bigcalm> I did when I had an Archimedes back in the early 90s though
<SuperMatt> am I supposed to not have any luck with webapps in quantal right now?
<AlanBell> Laney: I used one for a while, quite liked it, meant I didn't have to tidy my desk enough for a mouse patch :)
<Laney> AlanBell: "a while" implies you stopped?
<AlanBell> yeah, but not for any good reason really
<directhex> Laney, i have a cow orker with one
<directhex> crap for FPSes ;)
<AlanBell> davmor2: is software centre your thing?
<Laney> well I'd keep a normal mouse for gaming
<Laney> not that I can do any of that before I get my upgrade anyway though
<directhex> mice for gaming? pfft. real men use BRAIN-SCANNING HEADSETS
<directhex> http://www.ocztechnology.com/nia-game-controller.html
<bigcalm> Goodness
<daubers> directhex: Now the advertisers KNOW YOUR THOUGHTS!!!!
<daubers> Now they KNOW they need to sell you those meds!!!
<MartijnVdS> and those.. enlargements..
<directhex> yes, i could certainly do with enlarging my photos
<christel> oh my!
<MartijnVdS> I got to shoot with a 70-200 2.8L last weekend
<MartijnVdS> (<local press photog> "Hey, want to try this one?" <me> "Sure..")
<directhex> and you swung it around and said "hey, is that kate middleton? watch *this*"
<MartijnVdS> directhex: .. no
<bigcalm> Aww
<MartijnVdS> directhex: I was here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/treenaks/sets/72157631547106604/
<directhex> then you phoned up the french tabloids and said "hey, guess what?"
<popey> HELLO SAILOR! http://www.flickr.com/photos/treenaks/7991194306/in/set-72157631547106604/
<bigcalm> LOL
<MartijnVdS> popey: actually, that band had an "italian" theme :)
<directhex> they look fabulous
<popey> http://www.flickr.com/photos/treenaks/7991177696/in/set-72157631547106604/ dude on the right looks like he's kinda scared of what will happen when he crashes his cymbals
<directhex> especially with those red sashes
<bigcalm> MartijnVdS: what ISO were you using for this?
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: 1600ish
<directhex> 115200
<MartijnVdS> directhex: 28k8
<bigcalm> Impressive quality for a high ISO
<popey> RANDOMIZE USR 1331
<popey> s/Z/S
<popey> +/
<bigcalm> MartijnVdS: what's the F range of the lens?
<davmor2> AlanBell: no I just break software-center
<bigcalm> Morning davmor2
<bigcalm> davmor2: joining us tonight?
<AlanBell> davmor2: where should people be sent who have a query about paid for apps?
<AlanBell> specifically people who turn up in #ubuntu who have paid for something and want to re-download it or paid for it and didn't get it etc.
<davmor2> AlanBell: on the email there is a link that leads to FAQs and an rt system, on the whole you can just reinstall it though
<AlanBell> on what email?
<directhex> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Pay
<AlanBell> thanks directhex
<davmor2> AlanBell: the email receipt for the purchase
<davmor2> directhex: thanks for that
<directhex> mighty hex to the rescue
<daubers> As much as I hate Gtk, I actually quite like working in Gtk
<directhex> i like gtk. but my secret shame is i like <TABLE> :p
<directhex> and i lurve monodevelop's gui designer. changed my life, it did!
<daubers> I haven't used monodevelop for a few years, I assume it's improved somewhat muchly?
<popey> reminds me badgerports was giving me 403 the other day
<directhex> i just like the integration between gui design and code design. especially the circular nature - i.e. drawing my own widgets with code, then immediately being able to drag and drop those custom widgets into other widgets or windows (or other projects entirely)
<directhex> popey, oh?
<Laney> tea with rice milk is a curious thing
<directhex> popey, maybe webhost downtime. it's real bargain basement hosting
<popey> i may have disabled it now
<popey> no, okay now
<daubers> When I have a spare weekend I'll have to sit down with c# again. Not touched it for _ages_
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: The lens I borrowed was the 70-200mm f/2.8 (L)
<bigcalm> MartijnVdS: and it does f/2.8 at 200mm?
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: I don't think it does
<MartijnVdS> oh wait
<MartijnVdS> apparently it DOES
<bigcalm> I would be surprised. I am surprised :)
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: it's an L lens.. :)
<bigcalm> L stands for Ludicrously expensive
<MartijnVdS> it does :)
<davmor2> directhex: you named your first born sudo drop tables didn't you :D
<shauno> I'm always surprised how much gried I get for having an apostrophe in my surname.  even working for an irish company, that's very poorly supported
<shauno> er, *grief
<davmor2> shauno: no it's the global system of hate for people with names out of the norm ;)  Not to make you feel paranoid or anything :D
<shauno> my biggest trick is that MIS assigned me an email address which also features same apostrophe. which is completely within the rfc
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-personal-names :)
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: My passport name != what people call me, and my family name consists of 3 words.. support for this outside .nl is not very common
<xnox> MartijnVdS: I am considering to make my middle name IRC nickname and be done with it.
<MartijnVdS> I just go for the "one field" solution that page suggests
<Seeker`> arrrrrrrr?
<AlanBell> happy talk like a pirate day to you too
<christel> why do pirates take ages to learn the alphabet?
<bigcalm> christel: I don't know, why do pirates take ages to learn the alphabet?
<pinky-> they can't get passed the c?
<christel> pinky-: close! they spend years at C! <3
<davmor2> christel: and can only say R
<popey> directhex, torchlight is in USC now
<popey> well, its listed
<Dave2> its listed what?
<davmor2> popey: it's in
<popey> yeah, installing
<davmor2> popey, ali1234: we should of lost the amd64 issue too
 * popey farts an apostrophe at Dave2 
 * Dave2 hands it back to popey.
<davmor2> popey: don't play it, it lures you in and then the hours disappear
<popey> heh
<Dave2> Shatter didn't show up when I tried it last night
<popey> wfm
<ali1234> Dave2: yeah that was the amd64 issue
<ali1234> seems to work now
<davmor2> ali1234: Yeap SPAZ still needs the fix and then I think they are all done
<davmor2> ali1234: it was the multiarch causing the headache
<ali1234> yes, i know
<ali1234> i want to know when you're going to fix it in USC
<davmor2> ali1234: it's not a USC issue as such
<ali1234> it shouldn't be necessary to add duplicate packages to make multiarch work; the whole point of it is to remove duplicate packages
<ali1234> and synaptic does not have this problem, nor any other package manager
<ali1234> therefore, it is a USC issue
<czajkowski> ali1234: I'm going to go with davmor2 probably knows more about the USC than most people in here
<ali1234> so what?
<ali1234> this is clearly an open and shut case
<ali1234> further more, i have presented a clear and logical argument which supports my position
<ali1234> and all davmor2 has given is a vague "it's not our problem"
<davmor2> ali1234: I didn't say it wasn't our problem, I said it was USC at fault, the issue is deeper than that and there are about 6 issues in total so it will take a while :P
<czajkowski> *sigh*
<czajkowski> ali1234: perhaps talking to others in the team in USC channel might be more appropiate than giving out to davmor2 who is only giving you the information
<czajkowski>   #software-center
<BigRedS> Hm. Apparently I'm going to a gllug drink up tomorrow. Is anyone else?
<czajkowski> narp
<czajkowski> was tempted
<czajkowski> but I think if I get a whiff off a drink I'll fall over in a heap
<BigRedS> ah, not ideal
<ali1234> torchlight detects my screen resolution as 2x-158095012
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: it's not?!?!
<ali1234> on second run it runs in window mode
<ali1234> i can select the correct resolution from the settings
<ali1234> hit apply... now the game resized but the window didn't, and i can access the menu buttons any more as they are outside the visible area
<BigRedS> Anyone got any recomendations of server builders? Like DNUK, Broadberry etc.?
<mgdm> I've used DNUK in the past, they were good
<popey> BigRedS, I used TMC for the lug.org.uk one
<popey> ali1234, dustforce doesn't like my dual-screen with different resolutions either
<BigRedS> popey: ta!
<BigRedS> mgdm: yeah, we're gathering prices, already got DNUK's
<BigRedS> popey: do you have a website URL for them?
<BigRedS> oh, tmc-uk.com looks right
<popey> thats them
<popey> ali1234, torchlight set my resolution to 720x400
<popey> second time okay
<popey> but i set it to full screen 1080p and it goes big, windowed, doesn't look like it can do full screen
<davmor2> popey: it should but apparently fails to,  so the devs are being informed :(
<davmor2> popey: what makes it more amusing is the fullscreen button doesn't seem to do anything :D
<popey> yeah
<popey> QA - We've heard of it!
 * popey redeems steam keys
<popey> I see a Laney !
<Laney> why does my webcam hardly ever refresh?
<popey> dunno, but its funny
<czajkowski> anyone looking for a SA role, we have 2 going, one based in London, and one based remotely if interested dm me
<directhex> popey, hurrah, 2/3 there with USC publications
<bigcalm> Is it time for steak yet?
<czajkowski> oh made a yummy sauce last night, butter, flour, large heaped spoon of caramelised onions, drop of cream and a large drop of brandy
<directhex> dear USC, is it really that hard to cache credentials?
<czajkowski> over some potatoes :) bit lush for tatties but was all I could eat
<AlanBell> is there any way in top to show the full command line of a process?
<AlanBell> I have "python" chewing up 98% CPU but I don't know what it is exactly
<christel> -c or did i dream that?
<AlanBell> \o/
<AlanBell> ok, next question, why is juju doing stuff!
<christel> because it wants to? :o
<christel> how helpful am i? :P
<MartijnVdS> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MCQ7VLoY7bQ
<MartijnVdS> </relevant_music>
<bigcalm> Anybody else having spotify connection trouble right now?
<pinky-> MartijnVdS, good track selection!
<bigcalm> That was a fun track
<bigcalm> My goodness, I appear to be in agreement with Pete Cannon
<davmor2> bigcalm: don't ever let him here you say that ;)
<bigcalm> davmor2: I did check the channel list before saying it :P
<davmor2> directhex: Yes
<davmor2> directhex: it is however being worked on in Quantal possibly completed in 13.04
<bigcalm> 9mins to 6pm then 4 days off!
 * bigcalm wibbles with excitement
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: eww
<mattt> bigcalm: woot!
<bigcalm> I'm glad somebody appreciates my wibbling
<mattt> bigcalm: i'm here for you
<bigcalm> o/
<christel> i want four days off!
<brobostigon> woop
 * brobostigon gets christel a pint of haymaker.
<christel> \o/
<brobostigon> \o/
<popey> directhex, rochard is in
<directhex> popey, hax!
 * popey install0rz
<directhex> t'is huge
<directhex> I BLAME MONO
<davmor2> directhex: Don't you blame MONO, that's what we all do :)
 * bigcalm heads off to the LUG
<directhex> it'd only be 1.4 meg if they'd used Qt
<directhex> it must be true, i read it on phoronix
<davmor2> bigcalm: I'm not making it
<bigcalm> davmor2: boo
<bigcalm> Try not to have too stressful an evening then
<bigcalm> *zoink*
<directhex> rochard. slow on intel, but so is drawing an opengl cube
<popey> ok, thats a fun game
<popey> i played for a bit seemed to work fine on my i7 laptop
<popey> bit sluggish in places, but playable
<Monotoko> hmmm, can my ISP see what I download via WinSCP?
<Monotoko> (if I use SSH)
<davmor2> popey: have you tried torchlight yet?
<popey> Monotoko, no
<popey> davmor2, not yet
<Monotoko> popey, good... I'm a university student and I don't particularly want them snooping through my private directories I need to download :P
<AlanBell> Monotoko: ssh protects the data in transit from snooping on as it passes, it does nothing to protect it at each end
<czajkowski> popey: an you see a bumble bee icon for your power icon ?
<popey> czajkowski, power icon is busted again, it'll be fixed
<davmor2> czajkowski: yeap new theme
<Monotoko> AlanBell, that's all I need... it's nothing super top secret, just have a few songs in there and don't want to be questioned as to where I got them (because I can't remember myself these days... a lot of them came from CD)
<davmor2> popey: everytime there is a theme update it breaks I'm sure of it :D
<popey> Monotoko, ecryptfs is good for that :)
 * popey gets back to testing new unity
<popey> the other unity
<Monotoko> the game engine?
 * AlanBell zsyncs the desktop iso for another test in virtualbox
<AlanBell> suspect sound is still broken :(
<popey> no, the desktop
<popey> new one is coming out tomorrow
<czajkowski> sund is fine
<czajkowski> *sound
<AlanBell> czajkowski: in virtualbox? without changing the output device?
<czajkowski> nope in a desktop
<czajkowski> not changed any settings did updates there worked fine
<AlanBell> sure, that is fine
<AlanBell> but if you want to test it in virtualbox it boots silent, no drums
<czajkowski> oh right
<AlanBell> which means blind users have have to start by messing with the pulse audio settings with sighted assistance
<AlanBell> and in fact all users need to go messing in obscure settings, not really an a11y bug as such
<AlanBell> anyhow, my download is done, lets see what happens . . .
<popey> AlanBell, bug number?
<AlanBell> no drums :(
<AlanBell> bug 1016969
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 1016969 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "daily live cd boots silent in virtualbox" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1016969
<AlanBell> hmm, can't seem to get to the indicators with the keyboard either
<popey> interesting
<popey> the LFE audio devices..
<popey> do you have those on your host? is the virtualbox driver passing audio devices through now?
<AlanBell> bother. No keyboard accessible indicator means it is game over without assistance
<xnox> AlanBell: F10 + Left-arrow doesn't work?
<popey> ALT+F10 on an empty desktop gets me the first indicator
<AlanBell> xnox: not for me in virtualbox at the ubiquity screen
<popey> ah
<AlanBell> popey: me too, on an actual desktop
<AlanBell> I don't have the LFE devices on my quantal host
<AlanBell> or a connector dropdown
<xnox> popey: ubiquity-dm != compiz
<AlanBell> I should do an updated screenshot as the pulse setup has changed
<AlanBell> equally nonfunctional, but has changed now
<AlanBell> xnox: so, what package do I file a bug against for the non-keyboard accessible indicators?
<xnox> AlanBell: if you never clicked "Try Ubuntu" or booted via "F6 + Install Ubuntu" it's ubiquity package
<xnox> AlanBell: please also add "ubiquity-dm" tag
<xnox> AlanBell: as ubiquity fakes it's own desktop session, it's not gnome-panel and it's not compiz/unity
<AlanBell> ok, will do
<xnox> AlanBell: it's actually A full screen wallpaper picture with a GtkMenu bar on the top =)
<AlanBell> I am about to go through the install on real hardware (and the monitor switched off)
<AlanBell> heh
<SuperEngineer> AlanBell: bet you're not brave enough to tty the install with the computer switched off!  ;D
<SuperEngineer> *try
<AlanBell> :) /me waits for the drums
<Monotoko> AlanBell, which buntu is this?
<Monotoko> I installed a copy of 12.04.1 on my laptop the other day and it was muted until I unmuted it
<AlanBell> regular gnome desktop live CD, I don't test the others
<AlanBell> yeah, that is a problem a lot of people have seen
<Monotoko> ahhh okay
<AlanBell> not always that easy to reproduce, some hardware boots muted some doesn't
<Monotoko> any bug I can add my hardware to?
<Monotoko> might narrow it down a bit
<AlanBell> bug 914841
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 914841 in alsa-utils (Ubuntu Precise) "Some systems initially muted (on first boot only)" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/914841
<Monotoko> ahhh it's fixed :D
<AlanBell> wonder if the 12.04.1 CD image got the fix
<AlanBell> anyhow, would be interesting if a live quantal cd boots silent on your hardware
<Monotoko> AlanBell, I shall let you know tomorrow if you like?
<AlanBell> great
<AlanBell> popey: https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/60120_10152098880340321_1361019164_n.jpg
<popey> niiiice
<Monotoko> AlanBell, do you like cats? http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-2YGEgnrgO2s/T4rICqmFNjI/AAAAAAAABRE/xC1h6RbMWJI/s1600/Cat-Rack-082.jpg
<AlanBell> yeah, I like cats, but I couldn't eat a whole one
<Monotoko> heh :P
 * AlanBell copies quantal to USB for the 4th time today
<AlanBell> and fails to install it again. ubiquity is crashy today :(
<xnox> AlanBell: it shouldn't. Traceback?
<xnox> AlanBell: please boot with `maybe-ubiquity debug-ubiquity` (At boot -> Esc -> Enter -> F6 -> Esc -> type 'maybe-ubiquity debug-ubiquity' -> Enter) =/
<AlanBell> ok, only seems to crash on my desktop, in a VM it works
<AlanBell> and I just did a media check on the USB
<AlanBell> xnox: ok, where did it put the traceback?
<xnox> AlanBell: /var/log/syslog or /var/log/installer/*
<xnox> /var/log/installer/debug or /var/log/install/dm depending on what crashes
<AlanBell> oh, there it is :(
<AlanBell> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1215638/
<Monotoko> that looks fun
<Monotoko> :)
<AlanBell> ah, it does crash in the VM as well
<AlanBell> ubiquity+orca=kaboom :(
<xnox> hmm... that looks very bad. Please file a bug with that paste.
<AlanBell> bug 1053112
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 1053112 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "ubiquity crashes when orca is running" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1053112
<AlanBell> someone want to reproduce that? don't need to install anything, just boot from todays CD and press Ctrl+S at the drums and try to get to page 2 of ubiquity
<xnox> AlanBell: are you Ubuntu Member and are you in Bug-squad? E.g. can you set bugs to confirmed and prioritise and add tags?
<xnox> AlanBell: well I did do full screen-reader install with imaes from 2012-09-17 timestamp.
<AlanBell> yes, no, not if they are my bugs, no, yes
<xnox> well done =)
<xnox> AlanBell: you should apply for ubuntu bug squad membership.
<xnox> AlanBell: it's "light weight" application process https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad
 * AlanBell applies
<popey> yay, join the club
<xnox> AlanBell: confirmed with fresh image.
<AlanBell> great
<czajkowski> have folks seen http://blog.launchpad.net/general/privacy-for-blueprints-enabled-for-beta-testers
<popey> AlanBell, remember these :) http://www.ijtdirect.co.uk/?sct=elonexone
<popey> 20 quid now :)
<AlanBell> overpriced
<popey> :)
<mgdm> hehe
<popey> directhex, seen Unity coming to Wii U?
<mgdm> ...?
<popey> Unity 3D the game engine
<popey> (shhh, written in mono)
<AlanBell> the Elonex One-T was almost good, that was the super light mips thing
<directhex> popey, makes sense, it already runs on ps3 and 360
<popey> ah, didnt know it did PS3 too
<directhex> http://unity3d.com/unity/publishing/
<ali1234> anyone can set bugs to confirmed and add tags, just no set priority afaik
<AlanBell> indeed, but you shouldn't confirm your own
<ali1234> so i played torchlight for a bit. slightly buggy. the main character's head disappears if you wear a hat
<ali1234> this does not affect gameplay though
<ali1234> i also got one "The minimum corner of the box must be less than or equal to maximum corner"
<ali1234> that's usually caused by division by zero in vector math
<ali1234> can also happen sometimes if an object "falls out" of the world and you don't stop it from falling past MAX_FLOAT
<ali1234> oh, rochard is up... "physics based puzzle platformer"
<ali1234> i always get suspicious of anything that claims to be "physics based" as it usually means "we were too lazy to think of a good game mechanic"
<AlanBell> friend of mine works in QA on games, they were doing a racing game and there were holes in the invisible walls, to find them all one of the developers decided to just fill the track with water and see where it leaked out
<ali1234> wat
<mgdm> o_O
<ali1234> game engine had a whole fluid sim that they weren't even using?
<AlanBell> no, they put the model in something else and let it run overnight
<ali1234> oh
<ali1234> fair enough
<mgdm> the last engine I did any work on would just crash if the level wasn't airtight
<mgdm> That might well have been UT about 10 years ago, i can't remember
<ali1234> depends on what kind of scene manager you're using
<ali1234> racing games do not work well with typical indoor-FPS scene manager that most engines have
<AlanBell> ali1234: how is your awesome race game coming on?
<ali1234> i have not done anything on it for weeks
<ali1234> i had to finish that website project, and since then i've just been playing tekkit and trying to add ipv6 support on my router
<popey> ali1234, is that game something you'd sell in USC?
<ali1234> sure, absolutely
<popey> cool, look forward to it
<directhex> mgdm, UT engine has a filled universe by default, no? so leakage isn't an issue
<hamitron> ali1234, what sort of racing game?
<mgdm> directhex: must've been a quake derivative, then - I knew one had a filled universe you carved out of, and the other you had to be careful to seal
<mgdm> directhex: it was over 10 years since I cared :)
<directhex> mgdm, quake engine needed sealing. BSP-based things. half-life and so on
<ali1234> hamitron: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9cMW6pFyiM
<directhex> if in doubt, GIANT CUBOID AROUND ALL THE THINGS
<mgdm> directhex: that'll be it :)
<hamitron> wipeout / death race?
<mgdm> directhex: I find myself in an odd position. I am quite interested in how 3D games are put together, but almost not at all in playing them
<directhex> mgdm, you and 300 other linux game engine developers ;)
<hamitron> looks like could be fun anyway
<hamitron> :)
<mgdm> directhex: :D
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-20
<lanboy> anybody home?
<AlanBell> morning
<ball> What's a sensible VNC server to use with Xubuntu?
 * AlanBell is on a boat
<ball> I wish I were on a boat.
<pinky-> Pirate Ship?
<AlanBell> pirate thames clipper
<ball> That was yesterday ;-)
<ball> Thames Barge wouldn't be bad
<pinky-> ships name is The Sea Cucumber
<ball> ...or a Severn Trow
<ball> ...or a Norfolk Wherry
<ball> That's about the right size I think.
<pinky-> LeChuck's pirate ship was called the Death Starfish
<ball> hello popey
<diplo> Morning all
<ball> mornin'
<popey> morning
<ball> I find myself back in the *buntu fold.
<popey> welcome back :)
<ball> Heh... thanks.
<ball> I installed Xubuntu this morning and just got the ssh server and VNC installed
<ball> (and joe and irssi)
<ball> I like it.
<ball> ...it seems to like my computer so far too.
<pinky-> I keep getting PIRATING ERROR #256: X does not mark the spot.
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<pinky-> good morning
<brobostigon> good morning pinky-
<JamesTait> Good morning all! :-D
<Azelphur> In a few years, this is going to be my desk. http://www.tnnewspress.com/images/Multi-Monitor-Control-Room-Console-10.jpg
<pinky-> amd eyefinity to the MAX
<Azelphur> indeed
<pinky-> Azelphur, in the future you might need this mouse.. http://gizmodo.com/5944847/who-can-actually-use-this-nfc-mouse
<Azelphur> pinky-: pfft, this one http://i.i.com.com/cnwk.1d/i/tim/2012/06/14/Logitech_G600_MMO_Gaming_Mouse_highres.jpg
<pinky-> omg
<Azelphur> :)
<diplo> Azelphur: I thought that was shopped until I googled it :P
<Azelphur> diplo: haha, what's the deal with it?
<Azelphur> I've only seen the picture :P
<diplo> How many buttons?!?!!? :)
<Azelphur> oh, the mouse
<Azelphur> yea that's a Logitech mouse
<Azelphur> diplo: they make keyboards and gamepads too of similar ridiculousness, I actually own them
<pinky-> both sides of mouse the same?
<Azelphur> http://www.centrale3d.com/IMG/Image/news_01_09/logitech_gseries.jpg
<Azelphur> I have both keyboards and the wireless version of that headset
<diplo> Yeah got a gamepad ( very old ) N51 or something but still only used limited amount of buttons
<pinky-> plug me in
<Azelphur> I had a N51
<Azelphur> I dropped a soldering iron on it :(
<davmor2> popey: is this on quantal?
<pinky-> Landmark in quantum computing http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=veDS0D8lEoM
<popey> what?
<davmor2> popey: irssi_proxy told me about a USC issue in guest mode
<popey> ah, in #software-center
<davmor2> popey: I didn't look at the channel I just saw your nick :D
<popey> <popey> davmor2, as guest I can't see reviews because USC thinks I am offline
<popey> <popey> related to bug 911706 I guess
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 911706 in software-center (Ubuntu) "USC relies on NM to be online, can't force online if not using NM" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/911706
<diplo> Mines in my loft I think Azelphur, don't game much anymore :/
<davmor2> popey: okay ta
<Azelphur> hehe
 * popey wonders where bigcalm is
<popey> he's coming round for tea and biscuits later
<Azelphur> sounds deliciously British
<davmor2> popey: Hide the chocolate ones or he won't leave ;)
<davmor2> czajkowski: if you see this, oil of cloves or a tube of anbesol for your tooth
<davmor2> popey: this picture is so scary even the glass is behind you is cracking ;) http://wolk.vandestreek.net/~martijn/lolpopey.jpg
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: and he keeps stealing your focus
<popey> wow, i posted that url in a canonical irc channel just now
<popey> which davmor2 isnt in
<popey> spooky
<davmor2> popey: you only think I'm not there muhahahahahaahahahahahahah
<MartijnVdS> popey: that image has been viewed _160_ times in the last 10 minutes...
<popey> !
<MartijnVdS> and only a few times before that
<davmor2> popey: it got posted on #tdtrs
<popey> wat
<davmor2> popey: blame mogger87
 * MartijnVdS resizes the image to NOT be 1.7MB
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: no it needs that level of detail other wise is doesn't steal your focus
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: it's still 1200x800
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: instead of 3000x2000ish
<popey> davmor2, i still dont understand how it got out of canonical irc
<MartijnVdS> (8 * 3.14 = 25.12 -- 8 pi = christmas!)
<AlanBell> speaking of popey pictures I am reminded of this release party picture http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/popey.jpg and the fact that we are just over a month away from the next release party
<davmor2> popey: just cause you said about it on can irc doesn't mean it hasn't been posted in here before now or on someones blog and now it's on twitter thanks to dick_turpin and so on
<popey> no but it seems massive coincidence that I post it out of the blue in #dx and suddenly it's had 160 views in the last 10 mins
<popey> you mean it wasn't posted in #tdtrs recently?
<popey> ah, blame neil!
<davmor2> popey: 11:32 in tdtrs
<Azelphur> obligatory http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fa/718smiley.png :p
<popey> all is clear now
<MartijnVdS> it's on twitter and g+ as well 8-)
<davmor2> popey: on the lightdm page click on the power button what colour it is?
<popey> davmor2, kinda dark colour like normal theme
<davmor2> popey: also do you get the blue highlight around the password box on lightdm
<popey> no
<popey> just updating though
<davmor2> popey: mine is looking more like the gnome3 black
 * popey gets lunch
<hamitron> you guys striping down ubuntu?
<davmor2> hamitron: nope just breaking it, it's what I do :)
<AlanBell> it is gord that steals focus the most though, not popey
<popey> hamitron, hmm?
<dutchie> is anyone good at grub rescue prompts?
<dutchie> (yes, i've tried booting a live usb, but that doesn't seem to work either. blinking cursor, but i hear the log in sound play)
<AlanBell> why are you at a grub rescue prompt?
<dutchie> i don't know :(
<dutchie> the updater told me to reboot, so i did, and now i have a grub rescue prompt
<dutchie> (hooray for quantal)
<diplo> popey had that dutchie a week ago or so from memory
<popey> i did
<popey> dutchie, is it a dualboot machine?
<dutchie> yes
<popey> poke cjwatson about it in #ubuntu-desktop
<popey> :(
<Laney> devel
<popey> he may want to know about it
<popey> or there
<popey> #ubuntu-devel
<dutchie> done
<Laney> http://open.spotify.com/track/4aAODvWYkmJaqosWFN28dl tune du jour
 * popey listens
<BigRedS> I do wish spotify URLs were more parseable
<BigRedS> more human parseable, even
<davmor2> popey: the launcher becomes a mess about app 20
<popey> BigRedS, then you wouldn't click then
<popey> *them
<popey> davmor2, depends on resolution doesn't it?
<popey> and size of launcher icons
<davmor2> popey: default size 1366x768, and 1440x900 iirc still starts getting ugly
<popey> heh
<AlanBell> 2048x1152 ftw
<MartijnVdS> 640x480
<AlanBell> the resolution of champions
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: well, there's 320x240x8bit
<MartijnVdS> VGA "Mode X"
<popey> Hercules FTW 720x348!
<AlanBell> yay
<AlanBell> that is a very wide aspect ratio isn't it
<AlanBell> if they were square pixels, which they were not
<directhex> i wish projectors did laptop screen resolutions
<directhex> 2012, and most of them are still 1024x768
<AlanBell> the ones at UDS are 1280x800
<popey> they do hdmi too
<directhex> been looking at a new office projector... may need to budget it next year :/
<bittin^work> IT Crowd fucking rules, why did i not started watching it years ago
<dogmatic69> too bad there is only a couple episodes
<mattt> bittin^work: i never watch it, but i saw the irish guy hanging about our office the other week
<mattt> they were filming a new film in the parking lot
<bittin^work> yeah i heard my friend was talking about a movie aswell
<MartijnVdS> !family | bittin^work
<MartijnVdS> hmm
<MartijnVdS> bot forgot about family-friendliness of channel?
<AlanBell> http://www.ubottu.com/factoids.cgi?search=family not a trigger word
<AlanBell> oh, while I remember
<AlanBell> !paidapps | davmor2
<lubotu3> davmor2: Information about purchasing applications from the Ubuntu Software Centre including refunds, reinstalls and license keys can be found at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Pay
<hamitron> license keys? :/
<AlanBell> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Pay/FAQs/License_Key sure
<hamitron> ubuntu has really developed into something commercially available since I showed a lot of interest
<hamitron> :)
<davmor2> hamitron: yeah don't forget some of the apps we have are ports from windows, so in windows they have keys and that transfers to linux
<hamitron> viable I mean
<hamitron> well, it is good imo
<AlanBell> kind of, but it all seems very individual focussed to me
<AlanBell> dunno whether USC is now integrated with Landscape at all
<hamitron> what is USC?
<AlanBell> Ubuntu Software Centre
<hamitron> oh ofc
 * hamitron feels dumb
<AlanBell> heh :)
<pinky-> Brain is not here at the moment
 * popey is negotiating for saturday evening beer
<AlanBell> I don't know if you can purchase stuffs from USC in bulk and deploy from there to your landscape managed fleet of computers
<popey> unlikely
<AlanBell> do you know if the Zentyal purchase is leading to interesting new work being done?
<AlanBell> or partnership
<AlanBell> actually re-reading it that just looks like a support arrangement
<davmor2> AlanBell: I'm not aware of any landscape integration or bulk installs as such, but also I don't think it has ever come up either.
<jussi> o/
<jussi> I am here btw...
<jussi> :D
<AlanBell> here on Saturday too jussi?
<davmor2> jussi: no you aren't you are there not here, I'm here and you aren't, so you must be there
<jussi> AlanBell: no, leave friday night about 6
<jussi> davmor2: shaddup :P
 * jussi throws eggs at davmor2
<davmor2> jussi: they are missing me cause you are not here :P
<jussi> davmor2: Im at a place with lots of cool old cars... :P
<jussi> "here"
<jussi> :D
<davmor2> jussi: old cars you must be in the UK then and possibly near the NEC
<jussi> Heritage Motor Center :D
<jussi> (AUtomotive linux summit)
<hamitron> slackpkg upgrade-all
<hamitron> wrong window ><
<jussi> lol
<ali1234> t-mobile has this customer forum and if you create an account with "+" in the email it filters it out and replaces it with a space
<ali1234> good job developers. replace a valid character with an invalid one.
<ali1234> i sent an email to their support from the + address
<Azelphur> ali1234: I got red up with trying to use the gmail + trick because so many sites bug out
<Azelphur> I went for plan B and enabled catch all on @azelphur.com, then just use domain@azelphur.com
<ali1234> yeah the amusing thing here is it actually accepted the email, but then changed it before saving it to the database
<Azelphur> lol
<ali1234> so now they think my email is an invalid email that will never succeed in delivery
<ali1234> hopefully it fills there server logs with crap and crashes their server
<ali1234> i'm going to subscribe to as many topics as possible
 * hamitron makes note not to do stuff to annoy ali1234
<ali1234> Azelphur: microsoft added "+" aliases the live/hotmail recently, so maybe it will become more common
<Azelphur> probably not :P
<davmor2> hamitron: You Slacker you :D
<zleap> ali1234, i thought this is why we had RFC standards for things,  so we avoid errors in addresses
<bigcalm[mob]> Hi peeps :)
<davmor2> bigcalm[mob]: lo muppet boy what this about being down Sowfffff again
<bigcalm[mob]> Davmor2: this time it's for fun. Keeping away from London
<davmor2> bigcalm[mob]: Ah that is acceptable then but don't do it again :P
<ali1234> cool, they fixed the email thing
<diplo> that was quick :)
<pinky-> wow! check this rock out the Curiosity Mars Rover has found http://gizmodo.com/5944952/mars-rover-to-study-pyramid-rock-of-unknown-origin
<AlanBell> then it will move on to the curiously black monolith
<brobostigon> lol
<AlanBell> wake me up when they find the stone ring marked with heiroglyphs
<davmor2> AlanBell: I found the plastic version of the ring was in my box of cocopops :D
<bigcalm_laptop> Hi kids :)
<bigcalm_laptop> AlanBell, popey: it has been commented that 8pm is a bit of a late start for the drinkings on Saturday. Shall we revise this time?
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: 9pm?
 * bigcalm_laptop kippers davmor2 
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: yeah, you join us at 9pm
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: All I did was revise the time
<bigcalm_laptop> Why not make it the Renascence Period?
<bigcalm_laptop> !ping
<lubotu3> another contentless ping... sigh...
 * jacobw2 welcomes lubotu3 
<bigcalm_laptop> Can I go to sleep now please?
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: NO!!!!!!
<bigcalm_laptop> I can haz wifi!
<mgdm> \o/
<bigcalm_laptop> Visiting friends is sometimes hit and miss as to whether they will offer you a cup of wifi
<bigcalm_laptop> This fried rocks :)
<bigcalm_laptop> Right, time to start those porn torrents
<AlanBell> bigcalm_laptop: sure, we can get there earlier
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: Are you hungry or something considering you just fried rocks
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: you are a confused lad
<bigcalm_laptop> AlanBell: my host was concerned that 8pm wouldn't leave much time for getting drunk :)
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: read your comment from 20:53
<bigcalm_laptop> Oh, typos strike again
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: though I stand by my statement that you're a confused lad ;)
<bigcalm_laptop> This _friend_ rocks :)
<bigcalm_laptop> Very good cook
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: I resemble that comment
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: glad you agree :D
<bigcalm_laptop> I resemble a comet
<bigcalm_laptop> This red wine is nice. Should try and remember the label and buy some myself
<popey> bigcalm_laptop, cameraphones were made for a reason
<bigcalm_laptop> I suddenly realise that I'm quite spoiled at home http://www.speedtest.net/result/2192179811.png
<MartijnVdS> argh
<MartijnVdS> Every time I click on the bottom of a window that's at the bottom of my screen, it half-maximizes as if I had dragged it to the top right corner
<bigcalm_laptop> popey: a point well made. Though the bottle is in another room and I am comfy
<popey> i have a friend whose girlfriend has OCD, she takes a photo of the front door every day on the way to work because she obsesses she didn tlock it
<bigcalm_laptop> o.O
<bigcalm_laptop> Poor lady
<bigcalm_laptop> Admitidly I did go back and check that I had locked the door this morning
<bigcalm_laptop> Admittedly
<pinky-> bigcalm_laptop, this is my BT results http://www.speedtest.net/result/2192183954.png
<popey> skipton..
 * popey makes notes in his.. uh.. database
 * mgdm drove through somewhere called Skipton the other day
<pinky-> I'm more near Scarborough
<mattt> http://www.speedtest.net/result/2192188093.png
<mgdm> perhaps not the same one, though
<bigcalm_laptop> mattt: that's what I get at home
<bigcalm_laptop> Same ISP
<MartijnVdS> http://www.speedtest.net/result/2192190362.png -- still waiting for fibre :(
<mattt> MartijnVdS: that's perfectly good
<mattt> unless you pirate all day long
<mattt> bigcalm_laptop: yeah, virgin is great, but we had a wicked 1+ day outage last weekend
<AlanBell> http://www.speedtest.net/result/2192192795.png better in the office
<MartijnVdS> mattt: I'm supposed to get 100/100 (or even 1000/1000!) fibre, but apparently it's hard to get from ground level to the 7th
<mattt> MartijnVdS: 8|
<MartijnVdS> mattt: fibre has sticking out of the ground for more than a year now :(
<pinky-> AlanBell, that's great! upload speeds
<mattt> AlanBell: coventry?
<mattt> MartijnVdS: ah man, what a tease
<mattt> MartijnVdS: can't move down to ground floor?  :D
<MartijnVdS> mattt: nah, there's nothing there except the entrance :)
<MartijnVdS> mattt: can't afford a house.. twice as expensive as my flat :)
<AlanBell> mattt: nope, Farnham
<AlanBell> fibre to the cabinet. Apparently I should be getting a much faster download speed than I actually get
<AlanBell> wonder if it is faster plugged directly into the router . . .
<mattt> MartijnVdS: where are you again?
<MartijnVdS> mattt: Netherlands, Alphen aan den Rijn
<mattt> MartijnVdS: middle of nowhere, surely property is cheaper there :)
<mattt> (kidding)
<MartijnVdS> mattt: nah that's Groningen :)
<MartijnVdS> (really, I can get a farm with lots of land out there for the same I get a 3-bedroom flat here)
<mattt> MartijnVdS: is the coast there nice?
<MartijnVdS> mattt: it tends to be, yes.. but it's VERY busy in summer
<mattt> MartijnVdS: so what keeps you in alphen aan den rijn?
<MartijnVdS> mattt: Family, friends, inertia
<MartijnVdS> the fact that the cities around it are even more expensive :)
<AlanBell> http://www.speedtest.net/result/2192207951.png
<AlanBell> looks like my wifi is a bit of a bottleneck
<mattt> AlanBell: woah
<pinky-> faster then 97% of UK!
<AlanBell> yup
<mattt> those are impressive speeds for home
<AlanBell> hmm, no window decoration and unity --reset is now deprecated
<AlanBell> who broke it??
<mattt> MartijnVdS: do you work from home ?
<MartijnVdS> mattt: no.. well.. sometimes
<MartijnVdS> wow.. I thought popey posted a lot on G+
<mattt> MartijnVdS: easy to find work where you're at?
<MartijnVdS> But NASA posts more.
<MartijnVdS> mattt: As a computer programmer, there's always work :) But I've had my current job for 7 years now :)
<mattt> MartijnVdS: like furniture!
<AlanBell> czajkowski: did your unity drop window decorations earlier?
<czajkowski> AlanBell: yup
<czajkowski> AlanBell: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/1053288
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 1053288 in unity (Ubuntu) "Broken UI and no window management" [Critical,Confirmed]
<popey> have you updated to unity 6.6.6.6.6?
<MartijnVdS> the unity of the beast?
<czajkowski> popey: slept most of the day and dentist so not done any updates
<AlanBell> unity 6.6.0
<AlanBell> thanks czajkowski, reading that now
<czajkowski> popey: how do I find out what version I'm running
<popey> apt-cache policy unity
<popey> pastebinit
<AlanBell> I did unity --version
<AlanBell> same result though, 6.6.0
<popey> apt-cache policy is more handy because it shows where you got it from
<AlanBell> yeah, that is more detailed
<czajkowski> popey: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1217594/
<AlanBell> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1217595/
<popey> czajkowski, you need to a) make sure you have -proposed enabled in software sources, and b) do an update
<czajkowski> popey: tis ticked
<czajkowski> doing update now
<czajkowski> popey: also wondering should some of these be ticked http://twitpic.com/awocqw/full
<popey> no
<popey> updates tab only
<czajkowski> popey: why the difference in http://twitpic.com/awod0c/full
<czajkowski> 128 V 131
<MartijnVdS> czajkowski: the counter takes a while to update sometimes
<popey> 128+3 = 131
<MartijnVdS> czajkowski: if you click 'Update' (not upgrade!) in the update-notifier app it should sync up
<MartijnVdS> oh
<MartijnVdS> and what popey says :)
<czajkowski> popey: 131-3 = 128
<popey> look at the text
<MartijnVdS> czajkowski: 128 + 3 newly installed = 131
<popey> it says 128 and 3 new which makes 131
<czajkowski> ba I am special today
<czajkowski> sorry
<popey> :)
<popey> np :)
<popey> interesting that you ran apt
 * czajkowski has to have her tooth YOINKED out in hospital :s
<popey> even though update manager already open and ready to go :)
<MartijnVdS> Zzz o'clock.
<popey> nn MartijnVdS
<czajkowski> it's growing down crooked into my jaw :(
<MartijnVdS> czajkowski: :( good luck!
<bigcalm_laptop> czajkowski: have them replace it with a cybernetic implant
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm_laptop: The czajkowskinator?
<AlanBell> czajkowski: that looks like a decorated window!
<AlanBell> you have title bars and scroll bars and everything
<popey> get you!
<Laney> argh
<czajkowski> AlanBell: you missed my fun morning of removing things
<Laney> what are you doing advising people to enable -proposed?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
<AlanBell> chortle
<czajkowski> Laney: hello sunshine!
<Laney> oh hello!
<Laney> I just had to turn an old peep show off because it was too cringeworthy
<czajkowski> Laney: now what's wrong with -proposed
<bigcalm_laptop> 7% battery life remaining, maybe I should plug in
<Laney> in the development release it's not supposed to be used by people
<Laney> it's how you accidently get half of your system removed
<Laney> or your cat ends up being shaved, things like that
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm_laptop: spotify:track:2g2GhWq7Bm6NoTjvBSr3jp ;)
<Laney> the whole reason unity and friends are uploaded there is because they are supposed to be kept in sync
<Laney> so the whole stack is built in proposed and then copied to release when it's ready to be used by human beans
<MartijnVdS> and ccsm STILL breaks :)
<AlanBell> ccsm does *not* break
<AlanBell> ccsm enables breakage in other things
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: when I start ccsm, it resets a bunch of settings, and I can't make changes I make with it stick
<popey> Laney, they _are_ in sync, and after we can disable -proposed again
<popey> (are they not)?
<Laney> I don't know
 * AlanBell observes he is fully updated from proposed and still broken
<Laney> something else there might not be though.
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: dconf-editor lets me edit those settings (sloppy focus, autoraise delay, Alt instead of Super to move windows)
<popey> fair point
<MartijnVdS> Laney: -proposed is not always disabled when upgrading to a dev release though
<AlanBell> MartijnVdS: yeah, reloading the compiz plugin stack can still be a bit fragile, but unity does allow you to sneeze in the same room as it these days, way way better than it was
<MartijnVdS> Laney: if you had it enabled in a non-dev release
<Laney> correct
<AlanBell> which is why I had proposed ticked I think
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: I can't configure it anymore. That's not better than it was :)
<Laney> I have a fix to Launchpad to make it not harmful to have it enabled
<MartijnVdS> Laney: pinning?
<Laney> but it depends on another bug fix elsewhere
<Laney> kind of
<MartijnVdS> anyway.. reall sleep time now :)
<czajkowski> Laney: if you break lp you'll feel my wrath!
<Laney> but the review and landing process is so thorough that breaking LP isn't possible :-)
<czajkowski> Laney: if you break it I will be cranky
<czajkowski> :)
<Laney> it's only soyuz, what could possibly go wrong?
 * popey cynisism meter and my sarcasmatron have both spontaneously exploded
<czajkowski> Laney: see now you just jinxeed yourself!
<bigcalm_laptop> \o/
<Laney> ruh roh
<czajkowski> pretty sure colin has some magic vodoo with LP it doesnt dare break when he does stuff
<Laney> he's definitely broken stuff
<bigcalm_laptop> I think this wine has broken my head
<Laney> mmm wine
<bigcalm_laptop> I can continue to code quite well while drinking beer (ale), but wine does something to mess with my thinking bits
<popey> brain jelly
<bigcalm_laptop> Haha, yus
 * AlanBell wonders how to get performance out of wireless
<AlanBell> actually kind of getting to like having no window decorations at all
<Laney> join me on xmonad :-)
<AlanBell> alt-drag to a window edge does the grid maximise thing, alt-middle resizes
<bigcalm_laptop> That reminds me of some older window managers
<AlanBell> resize by clicking in the window itself rather than on the ridiculously thin border or on the shadow outside the window
<christel> bigcalm_laptop: why did you call me a fried earlier? :(
<Laney> http://ubuntuone.com/55409bBNu3Z8ySCQ6REcDd
<christel> i thought i was your FRIEND not your fried :(
<christel> (thank you for calling me a good cook though)
<bigcalm_laptop> Hehe
<bigcalm_laptop> Sorrrrweeee
 * bigcalm_laptop tickles christel
<christel> MEEP
<bigcalm_laptop> Oo, a road runner
<christel> i was just telling AlanBell that i didn't quite succeed in killing you earlier!
<AlanBell> we will try harder on Saturday
<popey> Laney, is that gnome-fallback?
<Laney> part of it
<Laney> combined with xmonad
<Laney> (instead of metacity)
<popey> awwww channel 53 is me :D
<christel> AlanBell: excellent! did we move the start time forward btw
<christel> because 8 is like so late
<christel> it'd mean i'd end up staying home to watch dr who instead, drinking wine... and then i'd never arrive
<christel> (because i'd get tipsy and then i wouldn't be able to decide which shoes to wear)
 * bigcalm_laptop likes to breath. Spinach likes to stop me from doing so
 * AlanBell can't imagine christel getting tipsy
<christel> AlanBell: oh good!
<christel> :D
<bigcalm_laptop> This is why most men have 2 pairs of shoes
<AlanBell> yeah, we can start at 7 or whenever
<christel> how about 2!
<bigcalm_laptop> LOL
<christel> maybe not too, i'd fall asleep by 8
<AlanBell> you can start at 2, sure
<christel> 7 is my favourite number so that kinda works
<popey> Twelvety is my favourite number
<christel> popey: :D
<bigcalm_laptop> Now I'm hearing that in the voice of Len Goodman :S
<christel> twelvetyseven?
<christel> (lines and lines and lines and lines)
<bigcalm_laptop> What?
 * AlanBell has quite a lot of shoes, need to do a cull
<AlanBell> 5 pairs including wellies
 * Laney gets a beetroot soup out for lunch tomorrow
<bigcalm_laptop> 1 pair of every day walking shoes - a friend called developer shoes
<bigcalm_laptop> 1 pair of walking boots
<bigcalm_laptop> 1 pair of "good" shoes to go with my suit
<bigcalm_laptop> Oh no, I'm on the slipper slope
<AlanBell> oh, slippers and sandals
<AlanBell> forgot those
<bigcalm_laptop> And for me
<christel> slippery sandals!
<christel> i'd like to see you both in heels on saturday please
<bigcalm_laptop> I might struggle to get into anybody's heels
<christel> :o
<bigcalm_laptop> I have weird feet
<Laney> ,
 * Laney has tiny feet
<Laney> size 6
<christel> awwww babyfeet
<christel> how sweet
<AlanBell> size 10 or 11 for me
<bigcalm_laptop> Big socks
<christel> :o
<mgdm> You know what they say about big socks
<mgdm> big feet
<bigcalm_laptop> That's the one
<christel> see you say big socks and my mind instantly conjurs up an image of AlanBell wearing knee-high socks
<bigcalm_laptop> Oh my
<mgdm> I am glad I don't have your mind
<pinky-> big feet, big hands
<christel> and then it goes "whirrr whirrr" and suddenly he's wearing leiderhosen(sp?)
<christel> and one of those funny hats with a feather in
<bigcalm_laptop> I think that would suit AlanBell
<christel> unless someone gives me a better mental image STAT i am sure he will start dancing and yodeling too
<bigcalm_laptop> AlanBell: please to be yodelling on Saturday evening
<mgdm> will he have a big horn?
<christel> !
<christel> yes
<mgdm> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alphorn
<bigcalm_laptop> !ohmy | mgdm
<lubotu3> mgdm: Please remember that all Ubuntu IRC channels share the same attitude of providing friendly and polite interaction with all users of all ages and cultures. Basically, this means no foul language and no abuse towards others.
<mgdm> bigcalm_laptop: see aove
<christel> it is very long
<mgdm> above
<AlanBell> :O
<AlanBell> the hills are alive
<mgdm> apparently you get some that start small and get bigger
<christel> mgdm: YES! i totally have mental imagery involving funnily curved horns :D
<mgdm> Bill Bailey has one
<christel> :o
<christel> i like bill bailey, he is funny
<Seeker`> eeeeeeeeeeeeevening
<christel> hello Seeker` <3
<mgdm> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybighdGqHpk
<Seeker`> hallo!
<bigcalm_laptop> I should bring in the bottle of wine before our glasses become dry
<mgdm> evening Seeker`
<Seeker`> o/
<bigcalm_laptop> mgdm: I wanted to go and see him perform that set live. But the cost was prohibitive
<mgdm> I did see him do that, twice
<christel> how greedy of you
<mgdm> in two places!
<christel> oh thats ok then
<bigcalm_laptop> Very greedy
<christel> seeing how you didnt see it twice at the same time
<christel> i thought maybe you had both your eyes open
<bigcalm_laptop> Surely you see everything twice?
<bigcalm_laptop> Ah, are there any Cyclops in here?
<christel> SSSH!
<mgdm> TELNET!
<mgdm> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwaxWoJPUC0
<bigcalm_laptop> Night peeps
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-21
<AlanBell> morning all
<mattt> morning AlanBell
<christel> morning lovelies
<czajkowski> popey: have you tried to shut down your 12.10 machine
<popey> morning
<popey> i just shut one down
<czajkowski> popey: did it actually shut down
<czajkowski> mine goes back to the login screen
<czajkowski> so I've to hard shut it down
<czajkowski> :/
<popey> define "hard shut it down"?
<czajkowski> power button
<popey> there's a shutdown option in the login screen
<czajkowski> hold it down
<popey> erk
 * czajkowski goes to file another bug :/
<popey> I have seen this on my machine
<czajkowski> not sure if against unity
<popey> its nothing to do with unity
<czajkowski> what do I file it against?
<popey> not sure
<popey> lightdm maybe
<czajkowski> cheers
<czajkowski> bug filed
<AlanBell> I will be almost sad when the window decorations return to Quantal
<czajkowski> lol
<czajkowski> bugger nautilus has just crashed
<czajkowski> no idea why
<czajkowski> helpful
<AlanBell> second breakfast later \o/ http://www.hobbitsecondbreakfast.com/
<j0nr> morning folks
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: no Dutch candy fest with christel and the other alans?
<MartijnVdS> (not that christel is an alan, of course...)
<AlanBell> not even an Alana
<MartijnVdS> or Alanis
<czajkowski> I only remembered last night when I'm at UDS it's not euro :/
<MartijnVdS> Stubborn Danes.
<lovejoy56> hello anyone
<lovejoy56> just testing this chat 1st time here...anybody here ?
<MartijnVdS> no, nobody is here
<MartijnVdS> we're all just figments of your imagination ;)
<lovejoy56> Lol tanx
<lovejoy56> new to this
<lovejoy56> so is this chat open to the whole internet, those who have it that is ?
<pinky-> irc is very addictive - Beware!
<lovejoy56> thanx pinky
<lovejoy56> does it get very busy
<AlanBell> pinky-: it is indeed, it sucks you in. Once I had a job, friends, family, a house a car, some chickens and then I discovered IRC
<pinky-> :D
<lovejoy56> Lol, really that good eh ! when are the busy times ?
<MartijnVdS> depends really
<AlanBell> it is always busy in #ubuntu, and busyish during UK awake times here
<lovejoy56> so its world wide then or just uk ?
<pinky-> lovejoy56, yes this channel is publicly logged, so becareful what you type
<AlanBell> for fairly insomniac definitions of awake times
<lovejoy56> pinky, what does publicly logged mean pls ?
<AlanBell> !1984
<lubotu3> Official channel logs can be found at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ . LoCo channels are now logged there too; for older LoCo channel logs, see http://logs.ubuntu-eu.org/freenode/
<AlanBell> I think the old logs are gone
<lovejoy56> so what is "public logging ?
<MartijnVdS> it means that everything on the channel is put on that web page for everyone to see
<pinky-> lovejoy56, a bot in here posts to a website
<christel> MartijnVdS: i sometimes ponder changing my name to alan
<lovejoy56> ah right I see, tanx
<christel> i'm thinking "Alan Fake" to go with four letter surname theme
<MartijnVdS> christel: wouldn't that confuse people though
<christel> i like confusing people!
<christel> we shall have a candy fest soon!
<MartijnVdS> \o/
<diplo> Free candy?
<pinky-> lovejoy56, for example http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/09/09/%23ubuntu-uk.html
<xnox> christel: surely Alan Flake is better
<lovejoy56> do we know which website text is published on ?
<MartijnVdS> xnox: that's not 4 letters long, like the other alans
<AlanBell> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/
<christel> diplo: oh MartijnVdS sent us a KILO of dutch delights
<AlanBell> or http://ubuntu-uk.org/todays-chatter/
<diplo> !!!!!!!!
<lovejoy56> ok tanx ppl
<diplo> I've probably just bought a kilo of sweets for my sons bday next week for party bags :)
<MartijnVdS> diplo: not pepernoten and kruidnoten probably ;)
 * diplo has no idea what they are so no :)
<christel> diplo: party bags \o/
<christel> i am so having party bags at my next birthday party
<christel> (i am so having a birthday party for my next birthday)
<diplo> Taking a group of children Ten pin bowling :)
<christel> :D
<czajkowski> ricecrispy cakes!!
<czajkowski> all parties must have them!
<lovejoy56> does anyone know what happens to icons in the launch bar of linux when the bar is full pls ?
<MartijnVdS> lovejoy56: on the left side you mean? You can scroll through them with the mouse wheel I think
<lovejoy56> yes and ok tanx but i dont use a mouse with laptop
<MartijnVdS> lovejoy56: the right side of a trackpad is also a "scroll area"
<MartijnVdS> lovejoy56: or sometimes 2 fingers at the same time = scrolling
<lovejoy56> sorry but whats a trackpad ? I only installed yesterday
<MartijnVdS> lovejoy56: that's the "mouse" bit on a laptop -- the thing you move your finger on to move the pointer
<popey> you can also use the keyboard
<lovejoy56> thanks Martin lol I call it touch pad sorry
<popey> ALT+F1, then use the up/down arrows to navigate the launchpad
<popey> s/launchpad/launcher/
<lovejoy56> oh really thats very useful thank you
<popey> anyone here got an nvidia or ati machine running 12.04 with unity on multi-monitor?
<MartijnVdS> popey: I had one, but it crashed a lot, so now I have intel.
<popey> nvm :)
<lovejoy56> is this site only UK ?
<AlanBell> lovejoy56: this channel is focussed on the UK but we have people here from all over the place
<lovejoy56> ok tanx
<AlanBell> there are many other channels for different places
<lovejoy56> how are they accessed
<pinky-> lovejoy56, to join for example #ubuntu type /join #ubuntu
<AlanBell> you can find out more here: http://loco.ubuntu.com
<lovejoy56> thanx
<pinky-> lovejoy56, another good tip for irc is quick spelling peeps names by typing first letter or two of nick then hit the "tab-key" to auto complete
<AlanBell> anyone else in London today?
<lovejoy56> pinky-, thanx
<pinky-> you can also keep hitting "tab-key" to cycle through names if alot start with same letters
<lovejoy56> anyone in liverpool ?
<lovejoy56> pinky-,  tanx again
<pinky-> I'm across the land from you in Teesside
<lovejoy56> pinky-, oh ok....is it cold there ? its freezing here
<pinky-> hehe I've not even openeed the curtain yets.. I have no idea:)
<lovejoy56> pinky-, lol does this chat give out your email addy ?
<pinky-> no. but you can set a hide function with nickserv.. brb
<lovejoy56> pinky-,  yeah i gotta go to....need to explore this linux system properly. bye for now
<pinky-> ok I'll tll you later as I need to find it.. I'm new on this server too
<pinky-> oops too late
<pinky-> I need to tell him when returns /msg nickserv set hidemail on
<pinky-> just found it again
<JamesTait> Oh, happy Friday, everyone! :-D
<pinky-> Friday has come around quickly again
<pinky-> well it has to me
<pinky-> I'm sat here today waiting for a home delivery from ASDA
<pinky-> fun fun fun
<JamesTait> pinky-: I was saying the same to one of the mums at school this morning.  Last week was a grueller, this week has flown by.
<bigcalm_laptop> Hi kids :)
<pinky-> lo bigcalm
<popey> yo
<dwatkins> This week has definitely flown past for me, partly because I've been working late most days.
 * bigcalm_laptop looks at the world through bleary eyes
 * dwatkins hands bigcalm_laptop a nice big mug of tea and a biscuit
<bigcalm_laptop> Yay
<pinky-> bigcalm, I always drink water before I sleep when I drink alcohol and helps me a lot with hangovers in morning
<pinky-> otherwise I suffer
 * bigcalm_laptop updates his nick highlight list
<pinky-> lovejoy56, welcome back.. type /msg nickserv set hidemail on
<pinky-> it will hide your mail addy on a /whois
 * popey pokes davmor2 
<popey> The following packages have unmet dependencies.
<popey>  shatter:i386 : Depends: shatter-bin:i386 but it is not installed
<popey>  spacepiratesandzombies:i386 : Depends: spacepiratesandzombies-bin:i386 but it is not installed
<lovejoy56> pinky-,  hi, i wondered what nickserv was tanx
<pinky-> type /msg nickerv help
<pinky-> for all commands
<pinky-> nickserv*
<pinky-> sorry for typo
<lovejoy56> pinky-,  it wont work for me
<pinky-> ? /msg nickserv help
<pinky-> without the ??
<lovejoy56> ? /msg nickserv help
<pinky-> /msg nickserv help
<lovejoy56> pinky-,  nah not workin for me
<pinky-> :)
<pinky-> oh
<pinky-> umm I'm not in xchat and unsure of your settings, is there any notices in your server window?
<bigcalm_laptop> For more than a week my laptop has said that there are no packages that need upgrading. I think it's lying, but how do I get it tow work?
<Laney> which mirror?
<bigcalm_laptop> Laney: esat.net - chosen by the choose the best mirror for me thingy
 * bigcalm_laptop tries another one
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+archivemirrors
<Laney> that's a good link to check on mirrors
<Laney> unknown for that one though :(
<bigcalm_laptop> it's just chosen as29550.net, lets see if it helps
 * bigcalm_laptop hogs all of christel's bandwidth
<bigcalm_laptop> 82 updates, 151.9mb to download :D
<bigcalm_laptop> Laney: ta
<bigcalm_laptop> That's odd. The system has started asking me for my password to do updates. Maybe it's adding/removing as well as updating today
<popey> it always asks for new packages
<popey> probably new kernel
<MartijnVdS> it needs to learn how to remove old/unused kernels
<MartijnVdS> I had to remove ~20 old kernels the other day
<popey> write a blueprint for UDS :)
<popey> it should remove kernels where its not been booted to for more than a certain number of days
<popey> and where we still have two known good kernels
<czajkowski> one of todays irksome bugs -https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gedit/+bug/1047431
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 1047431 in gedit (Ubuntu) "gedit crashed with signal 5 in _XReply()" [Medium,Confirmed]
<brobostigon> good morning everyone,
<christel> I HAVE A CAT
<christel> i have never seen it before
<christel> but it is in my garden
<christel> this makes it mine, right?
<pinky-> haha
<bigcalm_laptop> Finders keepers
<christel> :D
<brobostigon> well, tht could argued christel
<Laney> feed it, then it'll always come back
<Laney> someone nicked one of our cats when I was a kid by doing that :(
<Laney> they used to feed him, then when they moved they took him with them
<brobostigon> :(
<bigcalm_laptop> :(
<pinky-> don't give cats milk as they are not lactose tolerant
<pinky-> I have cats and all are house cats and never go out.. even if doors are wide open they stay in, my eldest is 15 years old.
<bigcalm_laptop> Reboot time!
 * popey wonders where his cats are
<popey> one of the neighbours cats keeps coming in to get our cats food
<brobostigon> gps tagging, and a camera, :)
<popey> the neighbours dont feed it, and basically kick it out all the time
<popey> so he comes round ours
<popey> i have been in the lounge with both our cats and heard the cat flap go.. both of our cats look at me going "huh?"
<bigcalm_laptop> :D
<pinky-> I have a soft spot for them and keep getting more from Cats Protection
<bigcalm_laptop> popey: your cats are lovely
<popey> pinky-, you turning into an old cat lady like you see on telly?
<pinky-> maybe I'm infected with gonzii toxic plasma??
<pinky-> but yeah:)
<popey> heh
 * popey uses xmltv to download a list of programmes now showing in Hungary
<pinky-> gondii*
<bigcalm_laptop> popey: is your electricity bill quite high?
<pinky-> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toxoplasmosis
<popey> dunno really
<bigcalm_laptop> Yay indifference
<popey> wifey deals with that
<Laney> I got my new DD amount today for the 'lectrics
<Laney> Â£33, seems a lot for just me
<popey> used compare the meerkat to switch to another provider
<Laney> Martin Lewis is my god
<popey> i hate that guy
<popey> i dont know why, he just bugs me
<directhex> moo
<diplo> Laney: that's what my bill is ish, for me mainly and with the kids a few days a week
<diplo> And similar for gas
<Laney> I suppose I just phone up in a few months with readings and get it changed
<diplo> I dropped mine by about Â£15/20 a month last year, so the ex was the cause of my electric bill :)
<Laney> heh
<Laney> I had to register to pay council tax for the first time too this week
<Laney> :( being old is crap :(
<bigcalm_laptop> Laney: welcome to life :)
<Laney> I don't feel very welcome!
 * bigcalm_laptop gives Laney a biscuit
<Laney> yay
<diplo> Got your 25% discount for living on your own Laney ?
<Laney> yeah
<pinky-> lovejoy56, I've sent you a private message, do you see another chat window?
<Laney> the bill already knew everything, even the exact date I moved in
<Laney> but I never told them any information...
<diplo> Tin foil hat!
<Laney> sus pish us
<brobostigon> lol
<pinky-> I posted him some freenode nickserv help webpages and told him about unaffiliated vhosts, not sure if he see it..
 * mattt is happy it's friday
<TheOpenSourcerer> MartijnVdS: I have this bash command in a script in ~/bin http://www.tolaris.com/2012/07/19/removing-old-kernels-from-ubuntu/
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: ooh, shiny.. thanks!
<davmor2> Morning all
<bigcalm_laptop> Hiya davmor2
<bigcalm_laptop> Why am I working?
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: Hey from down sowffff
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: you're south of me today?
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: because you have no idea how to have a holiday?
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: correct
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: I missed the "to you" D'oh I said it in my head you should just of read it in like what I did ;)
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: oh no, that would mean that we were a couple if I am meant to know what you are saying
 * bigcalm_laptop feels very disturbed
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm_laptop: as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror, and were suddenly silenced?
<bigcalm_laptop> MartijnVdS: I don't think that I am that one with the force sadly
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm_laptop: several hundreds of voices, tops? :)
<bigcalm_laptop> heh
<bigcalm_laptop> MartijnVdS: there is something about your user means irc away proxy emails to me arrive blank
<bigcalm_laptop> Please insert sensible grammar where sensible
<MartijnVdS> parse error.
<bigcalm_laptop> I agree, but it's not my script and I'm too lazy
<bigcalm_laptop> Could be that it doesn't like the ipv6 host :)
<MartijnVdS> mwuahaha :)
<davmor2> popey: this is what I mean about the launcher http://ubuntuone.com/2xw4FPwmUBbc25GaAPdwYS
<popey> lol
<popey> thats hilarious
<davmor2> popey: another 100 or so to go too and I've removed all the ones I'd installed the day before
<czajkowski> davmor2: wow
<davmor2> czajkowski: and you think you have issues pfffffff
<bigcalm_laptop> christel has left the room yet her laptop is not locked. Oh if only I were a devious person
 * bigcalm_laptop continues to do his own work
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: you think that devious.........
<bigcalm_laptop> Anybody here got a windows machine that they wouldn't mind me RDPing into to check some work on InternetExplorer?
<davmor2> christel: How could you say that on a public channel, you should be ashamed of yourself :D
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: I have one but it's 7 basic so I don't think it does rdp, and I'm not sure how I would enable it through the firewalls either
<bigcalm_laptop> Ta anyway
<bigcalm_laptop> I'm seeing if I can get IE installed on wine somehow
<bigcalm_laptop> Play On Linux doesn't seem to be in the USC though
<bigcalm_laptop> Odd
<davmor2> bigcalm: there is IE4linux I think
<bigcalm_laptop> Indeed, quite old though
<TheOpenSourcerer> hmm, reboot time. Time for a constitutional and moar coffee then. bbl
<bigcalm_laptop> TMI
<bigcalm_laptop> We don't need to know about your coffee habbits
<bigcalm_laptop> habits
<pinky-> first ground frost of the year is due tonight
<pinky-> things are turning cold
<mattt> ooh, new grizzly bear album
<mattt> pinky-: yeah, despite us having basically no summer, i'm still sad when i leave work and see it's getting darker earlier and earlier
<pinky-> yup
<bigcalm_laptop> Tum te tum
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: what are you Tum te Tuming at it sounds ominous and evil what ever it is
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: it's boredom
<davmor2> christel: slap bigcalm_repeatedly a) to stop him working on holiday and b)just cause he deserves it, saying he is bored
<davmor2> christel: slap bigcalm_laptop  repeatedly a) to stop him working on holiday and b)just cause he deserves it, saying he is bored
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: she disappeared some time ago now
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: Yeah but she'll be back
<SuperMatt> http://www.l4d.com/blog/post.php?id=8913 <- middle of next month for the steam linux client!
<bigcalm_laptop> And which games will be available for it?
<SuperMatt> l4d2
<bigcalm_laptop> Wishing I had left my windows server on at home. Just so that I can see a site rendered in IE as it would be natively. IE in wine just isn't good enough
<bigcalm_laptop> AlanBell: are you alive?
<bigcalm_laptop> Is the Slug and Lettuce the best choice for Saturday's happy hour? There have been mutterings from more than one person that there are better places for food and drink.
<AlanBell> bigcalm_laptop: I am aliveish
<AlanBell> bigcalm_laptop: we don't have to stay there, it is just a place to start from
<AlanBell> but it has been widely advertised as the starting point so I am inclined to stay there to 9PM (the end of the defined hour) then move on
<AlanBell> tickle anyone who mutters
<bigcalm_laptop> Even though we've revised the arrival time to 7pm?
<AlanBell> bigcalm_laptop: I haven't updated that everywhere (mailing list/G+/Facebook/Twitter) etc
<AlanBell> just people we know are coming are arriving at 7ish
<zleap> AlanBell, will we be able to get some 12.10 cd's from you after release please ?
<AlanBell> sure
<zleap> cool, i have an SAE here all ready (well probably needs stamps) as I was going to get some more 12.04 but didn't in the end
<bigcalm_laptop> AlanBell: fair enough
<AlanBell> zleap: feel free to send it now and write 12.10 on it and I will hold it and post when I get them
<zleap> ok
<zleap> i will wait till i get paid at the end of the month then do it probbaly,   when is it out something like 16th October ?>
<AlanBell> czajkowski: presume loco CDs are happening again? or is it DVDs now?
<czajkowski> not sure
<czajkowski> waiting to hear
<AlanBell> zleap: it is out on the 18th of october, CDs normally get distributed a week or two later, but there is no CD sized image this time
<zleap> yeah i read about that dvd only or iso image for flash drives
<AlanBell> dunno if they are just going to ship DVDs in the normal card wallets or something else, or nothing
<zleap> as long as the package has dvd on it, they should be fine, that way people know its a dvd
<zleap> http://www.zdnet.com/five-ways-to-skip-windows-8-7000001753/
<zleap> this could be good for Linux desktops
<AlanBell> it used to be the case that people had CD drives that would not read DVDs but I doubt anyone has such a thing on a computer that has any hope of running Ubuntu
<zleap> yeah
 * zleap has neither
<AlanBell> more to the point, there is a slight cost premium for burning DVDs so the loco distribution cost will go up a bit, but on the other hand we don't have kubuntu any more (didn't for 12.04 either)
<zleap> thats ok
<zleap> i am guessing there is a lot more on the dvd then
<AlanBell> they could end up shipping USB keys even, which would be cool
<AlanBell> no, it is an 800MB image
<zleap> are they not more expensive usb keys,  the one in the ubuntu shop seems expensive
<popey> cheap 1GB USB keys?
<AlanBell> dunno what the bulk purchase price of a 1GB key is compared to DVD
 * czajkowski has no disc drive
<zleap> i can get 50 dvds for about 4.99
<AlanBell> and the cost of putting the data on USB vs pressing it to DVD
<popey> http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/bulk-1gb-usb-flash-drives.html
<czajkowski> I'd say just sit and wait folks:) speculation won't get the 12.10 image t you any sooner :)
<AlanBell> indeed
<zleap> my computer group stars soon, 3rd october and runs initially for 4 weeks,  so that works out great with regard to getting copies of 12.10
 * zleap will wait and see what happens
<davmor2> popey: getting there http://ubuntuone.com/1f3Nz8fc0rDBt8uyHy5d3R
<theopensourcerer> Savaloy & Chips. A Perfect Lunchtime snack :-D
<popey> theopensourcerer, we're off to the dodgsons for tea tonight :D
<theopensourcerer> Ah yes, Katie mentioned that the other day.
<popey> looking forward to it, got babysitter booked! (my mum) :D
<theopensourcerer> handy.
<theopensourcerer> In the not too distant future my eldest will be able to do that for us - saving 30-40 quid every time we want to go out.
<theopensourcerer> He now has his own key and we leave him from time to time.
<popey> scary :)
<theopensourcerer> 12
 * popey has 6 more years to wait for that
<theopensourcerer> My youngest, Monty, and Tom Dodgson are good mates. he came for a sleepover last week for Monty's 8th Bday
<hamitron> 30 quid? :\
<popey> yeah, few hours of babysitting clocks up
<theopensourcerer> Â£6 / hr is a pretty good rate round here.
<theopensourcerer> And it gets rounded [up] to the nearest integer
<hamitron> should be 10-20 imo
<hamitron> ;/
<mattt> for babysitting?  (aka watching tv)
<mattt> i don't think so
<theopensourcerer> 4hrs, after midnight - nah...
<hamitron> ah, pubs don't open that late here
<hamitron> was thinking more 7 till 11
<theopensourcerer> Se we go out at 19:30 and get back at 00:30 - that's 5 hrs.
<theopensourcerer> And not unusual.
<hamitron> I wonder if many give discount, if you have a games console
<mattt> theopensourcerer: your raving days are over, it seems
<theopensourcerer> mattt: Only when I am out with my wife ;-)
<mattt> theopensourcerer: :P
<theopensourcerer> Mostly we have separate social lives.
<mattt> hamitron: i give discount if there's super fast broadband
<theopensourcerer> Cheaper ;-)
<hamitron> mattt, exactly :D
<popey> daviey / Laney, whats the best way to track progress of packages through proposed, updates etc? is there a website or is it just "subscribe to release-changes list"?
<bigcalm_laptop> This Farnham food festival any good?
<klpkt> I can't access the internet on my computer! I've tried turning wireless off, turning airplane mode on, restarting my computer and my wireless network several times, but it hasn't worked!
<klpkt> Can anyone help me?
<popey> airplane mode?
<popey> didnt know we had one of those
<Daviey> popey: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/pending-sru.html ?
<popey> daviey, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=
<popey> unity and unity2d unapproved, who do I poke?
<Daviey> popey: ~ubuntu-sru
 * popey checks
<Daviey> popey: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Publishing
<popey> ta
<Daviey> slangasek is away this week
<popey> ta
<klpkt> does anyone know how to fix my problem?
<popey> klpkt, are you using ubuntu?
<christel> theopensourcerer: are you joining us for beer tomorrow? :)
<klpkt> Not right now, now I'm using another computer with Windows
<theopensourcerer> christel: Unlikely I think. My eldest son has several "mates" around for a birthday sleepover and I think my better half would rather I was in to help and keep order...
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: You have you laptop at a food festival man you need help and lots of it, christel slap bigcalm_laptop round some more will you please
<popey> klpkt, i mean the computer with the problem
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: no, I'm on a sofa right now. Looking at things that are happening and the food festival is one of them
<klpkt> Yes
<popey> klpkt, we don't have an airplane mode which makes me think you're using something else
<bigcalm_laptop> Android has one
<bigcalm_laptop> Turns all radio devices off
<davmor2> popey: yes there is
<klpkt> I have Ubuntu 12.04, and in System Settings > Network, there is one to the top right.
<davmor2> popey: look under gnome control center â networking
<christel> there's a food festival?!
<popey> blimey, sorry
<popey> I had never seen that
<christel> theopensourcerer: aw shame! i miss you(!)
<popey> klpkt, what type of machine is it?
<klpkt> A Samsung something.
<klpkt> I don't know how to check anything more than that...
<davmor2> klpkt: open system settings â software sources  the last tab say additional drivers is anything listed there?
<klpkt> no
<klpkt> it says 'No proprietary drivers are in use on this system'
<davmor2> klpkt: when you installed it did you connect it to the internet via wifi or a cable?
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: does a wired connection work?
<klpkt> davmor2: I connected via wifi
<klpkt> bigcalm_laptop: I don't have one, so I can't try...
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: davmor2 showed me this when I had a wifi problem recently: rfkill block wifi; rfkill unblock wifi
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: you could try running that from the CLI
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: beat me to the next line
<bigcalm_laptop> Sorry :)
<klpkt> It didn't work...
<brobostigon> where in android 4.1, does android store the apk's of the apps you install from the market?
<klpkt> I have noticed earlier that the animation for the searching stops, and restart at times; is this normal?
<davmor2> klpkt: do you see any access points listed?
<klpkt> Yes, I see the one that I want to connect to, I choose to connect to it, but it just can't connect.
<davmor2> klpkt: did you install with the text base installer or the live cd?
<klpkt> A copy of the live cd, that my friend gave me.
<davmor2> klpkt: just to check what do you see  with cat /etc/network/interfaces
<klpkt> If you mean what's inside the file, auto lo [\n] iface lo inet loopback
<klpkt> Or, I don't see the [\n], it was just to indicate a line break.
<davmor2> popey: any other ideas?
<davmor2> popey: okay rubbish bin and desktop switcher are now off the launcher all together and the dash icon is almost horizontal :D
<klpkt> I don't know if it's relevant, but I have multi-boot with Windows, and I can access the network with that...
<popey> davmor2, screenshot!
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: in ubuntu, can you tell it to forget the connection and start from fresh?
<popey> klpkt, what does "lspci | grep -i net" say?
<klpkt> bigcalm_laptop: I did, but it still doesn't work.
<klpkt> popey: it lists Network controller: [...] and Ethernet controller: [...]
<davmor2> popey: http://ubuntuone.com/7OMqeqTQiP8eLrBjHp6vmg
<popey> klpkt, yeah, need more detail than that
<davmor2> klpkt: use paste.ubuntu.com and put all the terminal info into that window using copy and paste and then paste the url for paste.ubuntu.com
 * AlanBell points davmor2 at 14:20 < klpkt> I can't access the internet on my computer!
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: tricky when he can't connect it to the internet
<klpkt> I don't have web access... That's the whole problem...
<davmor2> AlanBell: oh ah
<davmor2> D'oh
<AlanBell> anyhow, klpkt the bits in [...] are the interesting bits :)
<klpkt> popey: Network controller: Intel Corporation Centrino Advanced-N 6235 (rev 24); Ethernet controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8111/8168B PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet controller (rev 06)
<popey> interesting
<davmor2> klpkt: did you try bigcalm_laptop's suggestion of forgetting the network and try connecting again fresh?
<klpkt> Yeah, it didn't work...
<bigcalm_laptop> What did it do though?
<popey> klpkt, can you "sudo apt-get install pastebinit"  and then "dmesg | pastebinit" and give us the url
<bigcalm_laptop> Did it ask for a password?
<bigcalm_laptop> popey: lack of internet connection would say he can't
<davmor2> klpkt: did you disconnect or remove it completely?
<klpkt> bigcalm_laptop:It forgot it, I reconnected it, typing in my password again, and then it was back to start.
<bigcalm_laptop> Good, so it got as far as the password prompt
<klpkt> davmor2: I chose forget in the system settings > network
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: is there any chance that you've entered the password incorrectly? What happens when you put in a password you know is wrong?
<klpkt> bigcalm_laptop: I've written the password a lot of times, so it is highly improbable that I entered it incorrectly, but it does just the same when I put in a wrong password, except it after a while comes with another password prompt.
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: so we now know that it is actually talking to the router
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: do you have admin access to the router?
<AlanBell> klpkt: can you turn off security on the router temporarily, just to see if that helps
<klpkt> bigcalm_laptop: I don't know
<klpkt> AlanBell: I don't know how to do that
<bigcalm_laptop> I see
<AlanBell> I have heard of problems with cards that won't do all types of authentication
<klpkt> I feel so stupid...
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: no need to feel that :)
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: do you know what the router make/model is?
<AlanBell> so on the working computer in the browser go to http://192.168.1.1 or perhaps http://192.168.1.254 or perhaps something written on the back or bottom of the router
<klpkt> bigcalm_laptop: I think it's ZyXEL P2812
<AlanBell> http://www.default-password.info/zyxel/
<klpkt> AlanBell: The adresses you gave me don't work, there is nothing written on the back of the router, and my router wasn't in your site.
<klpkt> ,
<AlanBell> ok, you are using windows right? can you get to a command prompt and type "route print"
<AlanBell> somewhere in that it will tell you the IP address of your default gateway
<klpkt> Okay, I have logged into the router, what now?
<bigcalm_laptop> 10.0.0.138 is my guess
<klpkt> That was correct.
<bigcalm_laptop> :)
<AlanBell> yay, now look for wireless settings, and somewhere there will be something like WEP/WPA/None
<AlanBell> change it to none or off
<AlanBell> might be called wireless security
<klpkt> I think I might have lost connection
<klpkt> Nope, I didn't...
<bigcalm_laptop> Welcome back
<klpkt> For some reason, I was disconnected for a little while
<AlanBell> :) yeah, it will do that
<AlanBell> ok, so is security off now and does Ubuntu connect to it?
<klpkt> The Windows machine recognizes that it has no security, but Ubuntu thinks that it still has a security, and won't connect.
<bigcalm_laptop> Tell ubuntu to forget the connection and start again
<klpkt> The only network it finds is the one with security.
<klpkt> Or did you mean restart of the computer?
<bigcalm_laptop> No, just the wifi connection
<klpkt> Okay, it only finds the old network with security code
<bigcalm_laptop> But surely it shouldn't if you have disabled security in the router?
<AlanBell> I would try a restart of the computer
<AlanBell> kick the wifi card into really rescanning properly
<klpkt> Why do I get disconnected all of a sudden?
<pinky-> klpkt, maybe because you've joined irc via a webpage, it's much better to connect here with exchat in ubuntu or mirc in windows
<klpkt> How do I get those?
<brobostigon> sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get install xchat
<pinky-> exchat is already included in newer ubuntu and mirc is a free download from here http://www.mirc.com/get.html
<brobostigon> pinky-: xchat, ?
<pinky-> are xchat and exchat different?
<brobostigon> the latter doesnt exist, as far as i know.
<davmor2> pinky-: xchat isn't include by default in Ubuntu
<brobostigon> !info exchat
<lubotu3> Package exchat does not exist in precise
<brobostigon> !info xchat
<lubotu3> xchat (source: xchat): IRC client for X similar to AmIRC. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.8.8-3ubuntu12 (precise), package size 345 kB, installed size 869 kB
<pinky-> it's just when I see people quit here they mostly quit with an exchat quit message
<davmor2> pinky-: the default install contains empathy which although it can do irc isn't recommended for any period of time
<pinky-> ok I'll remember
<popey> apt://xchat
<popey> :)
<davmor2> pinky-: yes that is a play on words ex parrot exchat
 * brobostigon points out, exchat doesnt exist.
<pinky-> ok understood now
<pinky-> my bad
<klpkt> Are anyone still here to help me?
<pinky-> they've all gone looking for ex-chat
<brobostigon> lol.
<klpkt> For some reason I can't connect to the channel from mirc
<pinky-> klpkt, first of all go through all the options and enter a nick, alt-nick and identd blah..
<pinky-> klpkt, in options you goto Servers and click on Freenode then select a server from the list and click connect. Once you have joined you type /join #ubuntu-uk
<klpkt> Yeah, but now the room seems empty.
<pinky-> you are either on a wrong server, or a split server, or you have typed the channel name incorrect
<pinky-> oh yeah just checked out my freash install of ubuntu 12.04 32bit and yup no xchat as default
<pinky-> I shall always remember now
<pinky-> I can't think what made me think it was there??
<pinky-> I thought I saw it
<pinky2> xchat:)
<brobostigon> screen + irssi + bitlbee, :)
<Krafty_> Hello
<bigcalm_laptop> Dave2: are you alive?
<Krafty_> Is anyone available to help with an issue I am having on ubuntu 12.04?
<bigcalm_laptop> !ask | Krafty_
<lubotu3> Krafty_: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) See also !patience
<Dave2> bigcalm_laptop: NO
<bigcalm_laptop> Dave2: good, you won't mind me talking at you in private message then
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: Man that is a new low talking to dead people
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: I find that they are less likely to answer back
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: but where is the fun in that?
<Krafty_> I am trying to use a logitech M570 mouse on ubuntu 12.04, whenever i restart the computer it does not recognize the mouse, then when switch usb ports, it SOMETIMES works but is extremely laggy and slow. The mouse works fine on another windows 7 computer, so i know the mouse is not the issue. this mouse used to work with ubuntu 12.04.
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: I like a quiet life :)
<Krafty_> No possible answers?
<Krafty_> alright then, thank you for the time
<czajkowski> Krafty_: have you  reported a bug about this ?
<Krafty_> this is already a reported bug
<Krafty_> but none of the fixes have worked so far
<czajkowski> have you left that as a comment on the bug ?
<Krafty_> I have not, I figured I would ask around first
<Krafty_> Then post on the website if I got a fix that worked
<AlanBell> is it a wireless mouse with flat batteries?
<Krafty_> flat?
<AlanBell> my mouse does strange things when the battery gets low
<Krafty_> oh no, the batteries are brand new
<AlanBell> in that case I am out of ideas :)
<Krafty_> lol
<theopensourcerer> exit
<theopensourcerer> gah
<AlanBell>  /kick theopensourcerer
<theopensourcerer> ouch
<theopensourcerer> Thanks AlanBell
<AlanBell> :)
<theopensourcerer> Been looking at Webservices code for the last hour...
<theopensourcerer> time to leave... Have a nice weekend everyone.
<klpkt> I (still) can't access the internet on my Ubuntu computer... Can anyone help?
<brobostigon> klpkt: can you ping out?
<klpkt> What is that?
<brobostigon> klpkt: it is a network dignostic tool.
<brobostigon> diagnostic*
<klpkt> How do I do that?
<brobostigon> klpkt: open a terminal window, type the following "ping google.com" and be ready with ctrl+c, otherwise it will just run forever.
<klpkt> It says unknown host
<bigcalm_laptop> brobostigon: klpkt cannot make a connection to their wifi router
<brobostigon> klpkt: ok, thats expected from what bigcalm_laptop just said. ok, have you checked you wifi device is recognised, and it showing a device for it, in /dev. ?
<klpkt> How do I check it?
<brobostigon> klpkt: ok two commands for terminal again. do you see it in the output of lspci and lsusb.
<bigcalm_laptop> brobostigon: the wifi access point is visible in klpkt's list, but connecting doesn't get past entering the password
<brobostigon> bigcalm_laptop: wep or wpa?
<bigcalm_laptop> That I don't know
<brobostigon> quite importent,as in one, wpa_supplicant is used, in the other, nothing else but iwconfig needed.
<klpkt_> The key is (I think) WPA-PSK2 or something.
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: network manager should be able to detect the encryption type, but if the wifi router is not offering the information, you might have to manually set it in ubuntu
<brobostigon> klpkt: have you also checked, as to if, your router limits the ip's it gives out, only to certain mac addr's. ?
<klpkt_> How do I check that?
<klpkt_> Also, why do you speak in terms I don't understand?
<brobostigon> klpkt: it will be in the admin interface of your router, i coant tell you ,every one is different.
<brobostigon> klpkt_: sorry, my apologies, i need to adapt my engineering terms, into something more commonly understood.
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt_: we get people of all technical levels in here. Rather than sound patronising, it is best to start off at a higher level and adjust when needed :)
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt_: please don't take it personally :)
<klpkt_> Well, the router has a MAC address filter, but it's disabled.
<brobostigon> ok, thats that ruled out. then.
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt_: how many other wireless devices are using that router?
<klpkt_> Well, there's this computer, three more, the Ubuntu computer, my Wii and Android, and I think that's it.
<bigcalm_laptop> Aha, you have an android device!
<bigcalm_laptop> If you set your android device as a wifi hot spot, can you connect the ubuntu machine to it?
<bigcalm_laptop> We just want to make sure that the wifi chip in the machine works in ubuntu
<klpkt> bigcalm_laptop: I think it said that it wouldn't be able to connect any wifi if it was a hotspot.
<klpkt> but i'll try
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: that does't matter :)
<bigcalm_laptop> We just want to see your ubuntu machine connect to _anything_ with wifi. Doesn't matter if a 'net connection is available beyond that or not
<klpkt> That wasn't me, that was a clone profile that was created because I apparently logged on before I was logged off...
<bigcalm_laptop> :)
<klpkt> Well, the same thing happens if I try and connect to the hotspot; the exact same thing, in fact, even to the point where it asks for password again.
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: Looks to be an issue with the wifi device in your ubuntu machine. I would say that the next step would be to get a network cable and plug the machine directly into the wifi router.
<klpkt> bigcalm_laptop: Again, how do I do that?
<jabulmer12> Afternoon
<brobostigon> it might be worth looking through syslog and dmesg, to see if there are any obvious things going wrong.
<klpkt> What should I look for?
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: just before you try to connect to wifi, put this into a terminal: sudo tail -f /var/log/syslog
<bigcalm_laptop> Sorry I can't help any more right now. Time to go out.
<bigcalm_laptop> klpkt: good luck!
<brobostigon> klpkt: things related to our wifi device, wpa_supplicant or network-manager. or iwconfig or ifconfig, or dhcp.
<klpkt> It seems like it gets connected, then gets an IP, but can't find a IPv6 router.
<brobostigon> ah.
<brobostigon> minute,
<brobostigon> !ipv6
<lubotu3> For an introduction to IPv6 and information on tunneling IPv6 through IPv4 connections, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IPv6 | To disable IPv6 see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WebBrowsingSlowIPv6IPv4
<brobostigon> klpkt: ok, that fairly normal, but shouldnt stop it from working.
<brobostigon> klpkt: have you checked your dns.?
<klpkt> brobostigon: How do I do that?
<klpkt> I should Ctrl+C that phrase so I don't have to type it in....
<brobostigon> klpkt: open the network manager control panel, and see what dns server it is using.
<klpkt> Where is that?
<brobostigon> klpkt: do you see network managers applet, in your top right hand corner, near your clock?
<klpkt> The one where I can open the Settings/Shut Down etc.?
<brobostigon> klpkt: next to it, it will look like an earial.
<brobostigon> klpkt: or a signal strength meter.
<klpkt> Oh that, yeah, I see it.
<brobostigon> klpkt: if you right click, you should have a settings option.
<klpkt> brobostigon: Well, that is a problem, because for some reason I can't right click those icons...
<brobostigon> klpkt: very weird.
<MartijnVdS> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hangar_One_(Mountain_View,_California)
<brobostigon> klpkt: left click that applet insted, you should get the same result, it should popup.
<MartijnVdS> wrong window :)|
<brobostigon> :)
<klpkt> brobostigon: Okay, there is no Settings...
<brobostigon> klpkt: ok, go into your apps menu, and open systems settings,
<klpkt> brobostigon: and then?
<brobostigon> klpkt: there should be in that program, a netowkr config option.
<klpkt> brobostigon: There is a Network, at least.
<brobostigon> klpkt: ok, go into that option.
<klpkt> brobostigon: It doesn't say anything about DNS.
<brobostigon> klpkt: go into options.
<klpkt> brobostigon: What then?
<brobostigon> klpkt: what tabs, at the top of that window do you see?
<brobostigon> that should have popped up.
<klpkt> Wireless, IPv4 Settings, IPv6 Settings, Wireless Security.
<brobostigon> klpkt: ok, if you go into ipv4.
<klpkt> brobostigon: Now there is a locked and empty box that says DNS servers
<brobostigon> klpkt: ok unlock it, it will ask for your password, then change those two dns entries to 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4
<klpkt> Which Method option should I choose?
<brobostigon> you will need to use the unlock, to be able to change those options, so unlock it first, then add those two dns entries, with what i said above.
<klpkt> brobostigon: No, the box is locked because I have Method Automatic, and there are several other options for it.
<brobostigon> klpkt: ok, try this, "gksudo gedit /etc/resolv.conf" than add "nameserver 8.8.8.8" and save it, then ping out, like we tried earlier.
<klpkt> brobostigon: the file says not to edit by hand.
<brobostigon> klpkt: ignore it,
<klpkt> brobostigon: should I ignore it?
<klpkt> brobostigon: It still says unknown host.
<brobostigon> klpkt: i am out of ideas now.
<klpkt> brobostigon: This problem is really bad; so far you're the fifth person or something who have tried to help me...
<brobostigon> klpkt: wow.
<brobostigon> klpkt: do you have a difefrent wifi adaptor, you can try?
<klpkt> brobostigon: By giving myself a custom IPv4 address, it finally worked! After almost 4 hours of trying to make it work!
<brobostigon> klpkt: weird. that means dhcp isnt working properly.
<klpkt> brobostigon: But now, the DNS lookup fails.
<brobostigon> klpkt: use the dns addr's, i mentioned above.
<klpkt> brobostigon: Those are the ones that I use; 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4, separated by commas as the prompt tells me to.
<brobostigon> weird.
<klpkt> brobostigon: So now I'm connected to the network, but I can't access the network.
<brobostigon> klpkt: i really dont know, to be honest, i am out of ideas.
<brobostigon> brb
<davmor2> popey: is it wrong to have to scroll for 10 seconds or so from the bottom of the launcher to the actual bottom of the list :D
<popey> yes
<popey> you can go direct to it though cant you?
<popey> klpkt, you may have more luck in our official support channel, #ubuntu
<popey>  /join #ubuntu
<popey> ^ type that
<davmor2> popey: 190 of 229 and then over to the pdfs :D
<davmor2> popey: infact with the bottom launcher that you can see, at the top of the page you still can't see the last launcher icon :D
<Azelphur> !status
<Azelphur> whoops, wrong window
<SuperEngineer> Don't Panic! there's a moral in that... & this: http://superengr.wordpress.com/2012/09/21/dont-panic/
<SuperEngineer> [& hi-di-hi folks]
<MartijnVdS> \o SuperEngineer
<MartijnVdS> Weekend -> SuperEngineer IRC quality time? ;)
<SuperEngineer> yup ;)
<SuperEngineer> [been away on "sanity break" & since then catching up on all stuff I need to do]
<SuperEngineer> Dartmouth in sunshine = good for brain!
<MartijnVdS> I'm going to try that in May.. ish
<MartijnVdS> that general area anyway
<SuperEngineer> nice - let me guess.... Teignmouth
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: land's end/Minack theatre
<SuperEngineer> cool!
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: going to see this singer sing again: http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL65507731C2EBA66A
 * SuperEngineer never made it to land's end - no spaceship landing strip so not good for me
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: it does have the entrance to the underwater tunnel to the other side of the ocean though
<SuperEngineer> ;)
<SuperEngineer> MartijnVdS: which of those listed would be best 1st listen?
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: It was Me
<SuperEngineer> MartijnVdS: you are Narina Pallot? nah!
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: I'm not Nerina, I just like her singing :)
<SuperEngineer> :D
<SuperEngineer> MartijnVdS: she's quite impressive
<hamitron> SuperEngineer, still talking about the singing or.....?
<SuperEngineer> If I see 1 more site quoting "to repair or recover grub from a live cd, first open a terminal" I am gonna scream!#
<hamitron> why?
<hamitron> :/
<SuperEngineer> the live cd doesn't wanna letme do that!
<hamitron> choose a proper livecd
<MartijnVdS> ctrl+alt+F1
<MartijnVdS> there's your terminal :)
<SuperEngineer> try one... open dash - wait for a complete refesh... no terminal
<SuperEngineer> precisely! but all these sites are copying/pasting wrong info - grrrrrrrr
<hamitron> so why won't it let you open a terminal?
<hamitron> :/
 * hamitron is confuselled
 * SuperEngineer awaits hamitron to finish loading up live cd on a netbook to find out
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: alt+f2 gnome-terminal?
<SuperEngineer> hamitron: the "recommended" method does not work
<Darael> SuperEngineer: If thou needest access to the instructions for copy-pasting, I suggest screen (or tmux) and use of, eg, elinks.  Lets one do it all from a TTY.
<SuperEngineer> MartijnVdS: you know that, I know that - but pity the poor whatsits who rely soley on web-info
<Monotoko> http://i.imgur.com/iExg7.png
<Monotoko> :D
<SuperEngineer> Monotoko: at last - a sensible read :D
<MartijnVdS> à² _à² 
<hamitron> :))
<SuperEngineer> Darael: & I thought *I* was the only instellar travellar here.... whoops, I am - just checked landing records... you were born on this planet - fraud!
<zleap> i thought 3 state was high, low and floating
<hamitron> 1 0 and -1?
<hamitron> although tri-state gates are 0, 1 and Z
 * SuperEngineer cheated - let gparted do its work & then use boot-repair cd [1st use in anger & wow, job done]
 * SuperEngineer recommends boot-repair
<hamitron> I should upgrade to grub sometime
<jason88usuk> ok so whats xchat about
<zleap> jason88usuk, its a irc chat client
<jason88usuk> irc?
<zleap> internet relay chat
<zleap> which you're on now
<jason88usuk> Oh, this is all new to me. is everyone here logged in through linux?
<zleap> i am
<zleap> lubuntu 12.04
<jason88usuk> so are the different rooms or just one
<zleap> lots of different rooms
<zleap> how did you get in here ?
<zleap> i am gessing via webchat.freenode.net or some web based interface
<jason88usuk> I went to the software centre and downloaded xchat and BAM im here
<zleap> ah
<zleap> ah ok
<zleap> yeah i am guessing as the main support channels are here,  its set up to bring users here automatically for help etc
<jason88usuk> only ever used web site chats so thought id give this a bash
<jason88usuk> are you a helper then or just another one of us
<zleap> well there are loads of channels on freenode
<zleap> i am just a user
<jason88usuk> how do you add channels
<zleap> http://freenode.net/faq.shtml
<zleap> usually you do /join #channel name
<jason88usuk> found a quicker way.... right click ''freenode'' then go to channels... has lists :) so how come your on this channel
<zleap> ubuntu-uk is the main ubuntu channel
<zleap> i am on #lubuntu too as well as a few others
<jason88usuk> is this place for normal chat or is it all about linux
<zleap> well mainly ubuntu chat
<zleap> there is #lubuntu-offtopic
<zleap> depends really on the channel owners and how the feel about general chat,
<jason88usuk> :( its hard to find a chat site nower days.....
<brobostigon> here, we can be very general, beer and food and curry, and loads more, gets talked about.
<zleap> just remember its a family channel so we can have minors here,   i think that is a general rule
<brobostigon> within certain limits of course.
<zleap> yeah
<jason88usuk> oops seem to have broken the channels tab
<jason88usuk> sorry about that
<zleap> hmm,  well hang around here on a regular basis and you will be more confident with what goes on
<brobostigon> yes.
 * SuperEngineer congratulates jason88usuk on saying oops & not ehat SuperEngineer would have said ;)
<brobostigon> lol
<SuperEngineer> *what
<brobostigon> **** **** , that ie.
<zleap> lol
<jason88usuk> lol ok has i walked in on something
<SuperEngineer> well, **** ** actually ;)
<brobostigon> lol
<zleap> jason88usuk, naa, i think what he is saying is that he would have said something that would need censoring
<jason88usuk> bad typo I ment have
<brobostigon> hence the *
<SuperEngineer> zleap:  jason88usuk exactly that
<zleap> ah
<zleap> where he go ?
<SuperEngineer> e.g. you should have heard me this morning when some random bod caused me to nearly kill my netbook.... that *would* have been censored
<zleap> lol
<zleap> i hope we didn't scare jason88usuk off
<SuperEngineer> perhaps he/she was a troll - if so, trolls are definitely changing for the better
<Seeker`> o/
<zleap> naa, sound like he was pretty genuine, just may have a few connection issues
 * SuperEngineer thinks too late to cook - time for a good 'ol fish finger sandwich... with open sauce on it ;)
<zleap> oh fish finger, i mis read that first time
<zleap> gentoo sauce,  make it your self :D
<SuperEngineer> shame on you zleap
<zleap> lol
<zleap> finger sandwich
<zleap> lol
<brobostigon> new QI, bbc2, 7mins.
<SuperEngineer> thanks brobostigon
<brobostigon> :)
<ali1234> acos cli needs a password. password is in the executable string table. wtf
<mattt> wewwwwt
<SuperEngineer> see you later folks [was up early, eyelids now turning to lead], time for bed said Zebeddee [boing!]
<brobostigon> nos da, sleep well everyone.
<ali1234> hmmm what's this? ubuntu is going to use grub2 on secure uefi systems after all?
<r007> someone know about program like that, for linux http://static.commentcamarche.net/en.kioskea.net/faq/images/8Q2jkGo3yUKrAVte-s-.png
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-22
<hamitron> general voice commands?
<r007> no
<r007> *dont know
<r007> you can control on your pc with clapping your hand
<hamitron> just having a look
<hamitron> I'm not the right person to "just know" this
<hamitron> you can control the video player totem with a plugin
<r007> what do you mean?
<hamitron> dunno exactly
<hamitron> I assume you want to control more than just a media player?
<r007> what is dunno?
<r007> i want to run a command in when i clap my hands
<hamitron> I'd try the voice recognition stuff personally
<hamitron> that may work
<r007> i can record a "clap" sound?
<hamitron> maybe
<ali1234> i expect it would work
<ali1234> only one way t find out though
<r007> how i can do it?
<ali1234> gnome-voice-control
<ali1234> !gnome-voice-control
<lubotu3> ali1234: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<ali1234> ~gnome-voice-control
<ali1234> !info gnome-voice-control
<lubotu3> Package gnome-voice-control does not exist in precise
<ali1234> i dunno, maybe we don't have any software for that
<hamitron> according to tomshardware, it is built in
<hamitron> in 12.04
<r007> i'm on 12.04 with unity
<hamitron> CMU sphinx?
<Azelphur> ali1234: you awake and happen to know things about RFID/NFC?
<ali1234> i know something about it
<Azelphur> fun :)
<Azelphur> so, I'm trying to get my phone to act as my capital one credit card
<Azelphur> my phone can read it, and the data seems to be in exactly the same format as a mag stripe, so there's no query/response security as far as I can see
<ali1234> so?
<Azelphur> my question is, do you know if it's possible for the phone to pretend to be an rfid tag like the card?
<Azelphur> I seem to be getting mixed messages from the internets about this
<ali1234> depends on phone
<Azelphur> galaxy s3 :
<Azelphur> :p
<ali1234> NFC is a superset of RFID
<Azelphur> I see
<Azelphur> so anything RFID can do, NFC can do too?
<ali1234> but on a mobile phone you wont have any access to drivers
<ali1234> contactless payment cards are not NFC though
<ali1234> or rather, they are a super set of NFC
<Azelphur> o.O
<Azelphur> well, my phone seems to be able to read all the data no problem
<ali1234> except for the ones that are not anything at all to do with NFC
<ali1234> how do you know it's all the data?
<Azelphur> ali1234: I don't for 100%, but it sends out a full magstripe data packet
<Azelphur> so I don't think there would be a need for any more data, and it makes sense that they'd use the existing spec
<ali1234> NFC is a two way protocol
<Azelphur> it is, but I don't think it's used here in any secure way
<Azelphur> you just probe the card, and get this reply http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_stripe_card#Financial_cards
<Azelphur> so unless there is any additional packets (why?, all the required data is provided) then it should just be as simple as that
<ali1234> account number, name, PVK?
<Azelphur> yup
<Azelphur> I read all that data off my card using my phone
<ali1234> all that stuff is written on the card
<ali1234> i mean literally written on the face of the card
<Azelphur> yep
<Azelphur> it's all you need though, it's the same thing they use in magnetic stripe payments
<ali1234> yeah
<ali1234> it's probably enough
<Azelphur> indeed
<ali1234> they limit those transactions
<Azelphur> yea, Â£20 iirc
<ali1234> so maybe
<Azelphur> Â£20 limit for NFC, but I still think it'd be cool to be one of the first in the country to go by a mcdonalds with my phone :P
<ali1234> you;re far from the first
<Azelphur> one of the first :(
<ali1234> i know people who've tried to do it
<ali1234> an failed
<Azelphur> hehe
<ali1234> turns out, it's really fiddly and annoying
<ali1234> with the official software, you have to enter a PIN on the device
<Azelphur> yea
<ali1234> then you get like 10 seconds to swipe
<Azelphur> \o/
<Azelphur> ali1234: I've heard that the pin can be optional, it's not a hardware requirement
<ali1234> probably
<ali1234> so you can probably do this, i guess
<Azelphur> yay \o/
<Azelphur> now I just have to keep trying to figure out how, haha
<ali1234> get the barclays or whatever app for NFC payments, and reverse engineer it
<Azelphur> that's already been done
<Azelphur> it depends on a funky orange sim card, as it uses hardware in the sim card instead of the phones built in nfc
<Azelphur> just to be assholes and not let anyone else use it, yay vendor locking.
<ali1234> http://www.ccsinsight.com/blog/orange-quick-tap-gets-off-to-a-slow-start
<ali1234> yeah. you don't need the sim card to decompile the code though
<ali1234> then just examine the APIs it uses
<ali1234> all you need to do is find a rom which contains it and rip it out and then load it up in IDA or whatever
<Azelphur> hehe
<ali1234> heh, that blog over a year old
<Azelphur> google wallet does it too, and might be a bit better to inspect instead
<Azelphur> since it's less fragmented
<ali1234> only NFC phone i have is symbian
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> the other uglyhack idea I had was to buy a tiny NFC chip and just put it inside my phones case
<Azelphur> and clone my card onto it
<ali1234> oh, and NFC doesn't work because i downgraded it to the PR1.0, because later version get terrible battery life
<Azelphur> lol
<ali1234> yeah that idea has already been done
<Azelphur> indeed :P
<ali1234> some bank got tired of waiting for NF phones, so they just sent out stickers that you stick on your phone. it's just a mini credit card
<ali1234> you could just put your credit card... inside the phone
<Azelphur> I tried that but it didn't fit :(
<ali1234> i'll have to see if i can blag some real NFC phone and some of the test cards
<Azelphur> sounds fun
<ali1234> maybe i can hack together a reader with arduino
<ali1234> any idea what frequency they use?
<Azelphur> none at all xD
<ali1234> http://www.nxp.com/products/interface_and_connectivity/nfc_devices/series/PN532.html
<Azelphur> hehe
<ali1234> package type: SOT618
<ali1234> well, that blows
<Azelphur> :<
<ali1234> http://www.adafruit.com/products/364
<Azelphur> they want your money :P
<ali1234> it's a little bit pricey
<ali1234> but it's only like Â£30
<Azelphur> hehe
<ali1234> the layout is kind of uneccessarily large
<ali1234> i'd like to get a breakout like that with bluetooth and NFC
<ali1234> i'm pretty sure they come in one chip these days
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> I'mma have to go to sleep for now anyway, will stab more at this tomorrow :D
<Azelphur> nn and ty :)
<ali1234> hmmmmmm... BFL is the next bitcoin scandal?
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: smaller! https://www.sparkfun.com/products/9875
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: also, modern phones have NFC, mine can read parts of Oyster cards (all of it if I had the secret keys)
<Wobbo> EOG has a bug. PNG's working fine, but JPG's have problems. http://wobbo.nl/ubuntu/
<ali1234> are these jpegs ok: http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Test/xhtml-print/20050519/tests/A_2_1-BF-01.htm
<Wobbo> Only the last one works.
<Wobbo> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Test/xhtml-print/20050519/tests/jpeg444.jpg
<ali1234> odd. are you using 12.10?
<ali1234> beta?
<Wobbo> Nope
<ali1234> can you upload the broken jpeg, to rule out corrupted downloads?
<ali1234> imagebin.org will do
<Wobbo> The problem is only when i with EOG. Firefox/Chrome/Opera are fine.
<ali1234> corruption always looks the same if you open the file again?
<Wobbo> All jpeg are broken if i whats it whit EOG.
<Wobbo> All the 3000 files. LoL
<ali1234> so if you close the file and open it again, is the corruption the same, or does it move around?
<Wobbo> If i open it whit GIMP there are no problems.
<Wobbo> In Nautilus all the images look greet.
<ali1234> it looks like memory corruption
<ali1234> is your system fully updated?
<Wobbo> yes
<Wobbo> and its new
<ali1234> has it always done this or did it start recently?
<ali1234> there is a update got eog which i don't have. installing it, then i will retest
<Wobbo> recently
<Wobbo> More than 1 or 2 months.
<Wobbo> Another reason kan we my screen: http://wobbo.nl/ubuntu/Schermafdruk-01.jpg
<ali1234> ah
<ali1234> i bet it is a video driver problem then
<ali1234> 3 monitors... ati by any chance?
<Wobbo> Yep
<ali1234> every ati card i've ever used has had graphical corruption like that
<Wobbo> For example wine: WoW works ok.
<ali1234> usually it affects the whole picture in my experience
<Wobbo> mmm...
<ali1234> well i updates and eog still works fine
<Wobbo> What is the best alternative EOG?
<Wobbo> Thanks for your time!
<ali1234> i suggest testing with the alternative driver for your card
<ali1234> also test without the screen rotated
<ali1234> then report a bug with all these results
<Wobbo> Thanks!
<pinky-> Good Morning All
 * pinky- suspects alcohol poisoning for the channel quietness
<mattt> morning morning
<pinky-> moring
<mattt> the house is coooold this morning
<mattt> pinky-: how you?
<pinky-> I left the heating on all night and woke up in a swaet
<pinky-> sweat
<pinky-> but I'm doing good.. you?
<pinky-> I'm looking forward today towards the F1
<mattt> i'm probably going to drive into london
<mattt> maybe watch a movie
<mattt> where's the F1 today?
<pinky-> cool
<pinky-> Singapoor
<mattt> oooh
<pinky-> pore
<mattt> my wife is from singapore
<mattt> she'll want to see that
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<pinky-> lucky you!
<pinky-> good morning brobostigon
<mattt> pinky-: i'll tape it now so she can see :)
<mattt> morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> good morning pinky- and mattt
<pinky-> mattt, atm its only playing on the BBC Red Button but it plays later today on BBC1
<bigcalm[mob]> Hi peeps :)
<pinky-> Good Morning bigcalm[mob]
<bigcalm[mob]> Jello
<pinky-> nicotine and caffine time here
<brobostigon> :)
<brobostigon> agreed pinky-
<mattt> sorry guys, this is a smoke free channel
<popey> morning
<pinky-> ok I won't mention again, poit taken
<pinky-> point*
<pinky-> sorry
<mattt> pinky-: nono
<mattt> i just meant, no smoking in here :P
<brobostigon> any ideas, where i can find england crime statistics.?
<pinky-> I'm so used to chatting on Efnet where nothing is off-topic, I must try harder on Freenode
<mattt> pinky-: i don't think people mind if you chat about smoking
<mattt> but i think swearing and some things are off limit
<mattt> since we have younger people come in and out for help
<mattt> brobostigon: i remember looking at some sites in the past, but can't remember URLs :-/
<brobostigon> mattt: ok, thanks.
<bigcalm[mob]> ! Ohmy
<lubotu3> Please remember that all Ubuntu IRC channels share the same attitude of providing friendly and polite interaction with all users of all ages and cultures. Basically, this means no foul language and no abuse towards others.
<bigcalm[mob]> Talking about having a fag is fine I'd say :)
<mattt> me too
<mattt> BUT NO SMOKING IN THE CHANNEL ITSELF
<mattt> :)
<bigcalm[mob]>  Hah. How would you tell?
<mattt> anyone use irccloud.com?
<mattt> and if so, do you have an invite to spare?  :)
<bigcalm[mob]> What would that be then?
<mattt> bigcalm[mob]: a persistent browser-based irc 'client'
<bigcalm[mob]> I see
<mattt> it's developed by some of the original last.fm guys
<mattt> and looks really nice
<pinky-> I came to Freenode for backtrack and ended up staying here, just thought I'd mention so peeps knew
<pinky-> just saying
<bigcalm[mob]> Right, time to visit the south coast. Toodles
<pinky-> I really like this UK channel
<pinky-> o/ bye for now
<mattt> pinky-: backtrack?
<pinky-> yeah penetration testing distro
<jacobw> morning
<pinky-> they have a channel here #backtrack-linux
<ali1234> brobostigon: office of national statistics
<ali1234> http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/taxonomy/index.html?nscl=Crime+and+Justice
<brobostigon> ali1234: thank you.
<pinky-> also on Efnet I used to idle and help out at time in #egghelp and there is a sister channel here with all the same users from Efnet so I styaed for that also
<pinky-> lot's of peeps in there I already know
<pinky-> so things don't seem so strange
<ali1234> egghelp? like "how long does it take to boil an egg?"
<pinky-> hehe
<pinky-> now people know why I got the ex-chat thingy wrong yesterday;)
<pinky-> but I learnt so all is good
<jacobw> XChat/
<pinky-> hehe
<pinky-> ok I'm going to idle now, bbl
<jacobw> i'm idling off a hangover this morning :0
<jacobw> uh :0 â :)
<czajkowski> davmor2: ello
<czajkowski> davmor2: who does one poke re https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-center/+bug/1054460
<christel> morning pretties
<lubotu3> Error: Could not gather data from Ubuntu for bug #1054460 (https://launchpad.net/bugs/1054460). The error has been logged
<MartijnVdS> \o christel
<brobostigon> morning christel
<christel> \o/ morning <3<3
<brobostigon> :)
<dwatkins> mornin
<MartijnVdS> \o
<dwatkins> o/ MartijnVdS
<czajkowski> elfy: ello
<elfy> hi czajkowski :)
<elfy> morning everyone else
<czajkowski> elfy: so where are you based again ?
<dwatkins> My most difficult decision right now is whether to buy yet another hard disk. I feel quite lucky in this regard.
<elfy> czajkowski: between southampton and bournemouth
<czajkowski> again my geography of UK isn't so great, everthing north of London is The North
<czajkowski> ahh down south
<pinky-> dwatkins, for RAID?
<czajkowski> I at leasat have been to southhampton
<elfy> yep :)
<dwatkins> pinky-: no, although I do manually mirror stuff
<czajkowski> and spent a week down in Dorset
<elfy> I try not to czajkowski ...
<czajkowski> soo pretty down there and very laid back
<czajkowski> and they do like their clotted cream !
<dwatkins> I have a couple external USB-attached disks, and am running out of space - I either buy yet another 3 TB disk, or start again and build a little server.
<elfy> czajkowski: yea I remember you say - I like Dorset - yes it is laid back down here - downside where I am is there's not much work ...
<czajkowski> :/
<elfy> I like anyone's clotted cream ;)
<czajkowski> less good
<czajkowski> not a lover of cream at all
<elfy> yep - but such is life
<czajkowski> except oddly enough in a sponge cake but fresh cream not clotted
<elfy> oh - I'm a lover of anything that's got some fat in it :p
<czajkowski> elfy: are you currently working?
<elfy> nope
<czajkowski> been there for a long time
<elfy> got some fingers in pies though
<elfy> since June
<czajkowski> ah good to hear
<czajkowski> yeah tok me a good few months as well
<elfy> if I wanted to work in what they delightfully call the 'care industry' I could get 5 jobs tomorrow
<christel> mmmpie.
<elfy> always pie christel
<elfy> or pasties
<christel> always!
<christel> i had a beautiful rump steak and stilton pie at sweeney & todd's i reading last night
<christel> it was scrumptious
<elfy> sounds lovely :)
<czajkowski> nods I know of someone who's trained to work in a lab but hasnt gotten a job sinc eshe gradeduated 2 years ago and is now working in a old folks home doing care work.
<czajkowski> but as she said a jobs a job and least she's earning
<elfy> yep
<elfy> I'm not sure that the little old dears would take kindly to a 6'4" 16 stone bloke :)
<czajkowski> probably well
<AlanBell> what do you want to do?
<elfy> lol
<christel> 6'4 you said? i'll take one
<elfy> ha ha ha
<elfy> AlanBell: I'm looking for work as a wireman - there are some locally turned up within the last couple of days - so that's good
<czajkowski> elfy: what's a wireman?
<elfy> wiring harnesses - that sort of thing  - did my training with BAe
<czajkowski> ahh
<davmor2> czajkowski jamesw has already directed it to the team but it won't be looked at till Monday
<czajkowski> davmor2: thanks
<pinky-> w00t F1 is starting on BBC1HD, back in 3 hours.
<SuperEngineer> was already there waiting pinky-
<pinky-> I was watching Practise sessons on the Red Button before
 * SuperEngineer sets Pidgin status to "watching F1"
<pinky-> Practice*
<pinky-> noun
<MartijnVdS> Ooh f1
<MartijnVdS> why didn't you say so :)
<SuperEngineer> F1: teams forced being used to a set of tyres supplied by vendor saying this what you will use today; teams being forced to used fuel developed by an outside body with no choice; main objects liable to crash at any momemt soon; controlled by a super rich oligarch....
<SuperEngineer> hmmm... Formula Windows?
<SuperEngineer> the difference between F1 & Windows.... humans [and commentators like EJ]
<jacobw> Does Paul Thurott still exist?
<SuperEngineer> jacobw: the man from Del Google, he say yes
<SuperEngineer> and this years Darwin award goes to... http://tinyurl.com/d5mg6kj [from BBC US news]
<jacobw> can't be a darwin award :( he's still able to reproduce
<jacobw> given a few assumptions
<SuperEngineer> jacobw: ;D
 * popey wonders if gord is in far away lands
 * SuperEngineer shouts "gord" out of window.... nope - he's not in Gloucestershire
<SuperEngineer> [but some bloke saying he created all things told me to stop speaking cockney]
<bootlknvf> AlanBell and Anyone else out there ..., Hi there, Just some quick news ... we've set-up a monthly local Ubuntu user LUG meeting in our area. Mr Shuttleworth and others have expessed an interest in attending. I was wondering how best to use the oppourtunity ??
<AlanBell> cool
<AlanBell> are you in the IOM?
<bootlknvf> Yes , How did you guess ?? http://www.openstreetmap.org/?minlon=-4.48287391662598&minlat=54.1477584838867&maxlon=-4.48278045654297&maxlat=54.1478652954102
<bootlknvf> Where no. 13 ...
<popey> excellent
<popey> bootlknvf, ask him if he'll do a talk?
<bootlknvf> I'm expecting people with beards !
<Knightwise> hey everyone
<bootlknvf> poepey, OK..
<bootlknvf> **popey
<popey> hi Knightwise
<Knightwise> hey popey :)
<Knightwise> who ever said osx was easy should try making a bootable usb drive for ubuntu :)
<bootlknvf> Hi did a talk for the local TV station , so I don't seev why not ... it's on archive if you want me to find it ??
<bootlknvf> Found it .... http://www.manx.net/tv/mt-tv/isle-of-man-news-archive-search?query=shuttleworth
 * bootlknvf drinks his cuppa ...
 * popey verifies some SRUs
<pinky-> http://yro.slashdot.org/story/12/09/22/1319216/ubuntu-will-now-have-amazon-ads-pre-installed?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Slashdot%2Fslashdot+%28Slashdot%29
<bootlknvf> Here is a collection of aggregsted links from dozens of chat rooms for your pleasure (from the last month) http://goo.gl/NqFwJ
<AlanBell> do you know (or are you) https://twitter.com/isleofmandan
<bootlknvf> AlanBell, Yes, I just spoke with him ... Do you ??
<AlanBell> only on twitter and mailing lists and such
<bootlknvf> Oh Ok .. Well we are meeting up every 3rd saturday of the month ... not sure how to prepare    ... and everything ??
<AlanBell> Well I would suggest making sure there is internet and power and tea and coffee and biscuits or cake
<AlanBell> and line up someone to talk about something, or some general topic each month
<bootlknvf> AlanBell, Power - check . Tea - check. Coffee - check, Biscuits - Will buy some, Cake - Will buy some [ Kipling ?? ] , Internet - Noncheck  ... we have internet but only through CAT5 cable until someone knows how to sort out the Mess of a Legacy setup we have at the moment
<AlanBell> you can ask people to bring cake and stuff too
<popey> bootlknvf, when is the meeting?
<bootlknvf> AlanBell, The first talking topic will be "How to get the Isle of Man Linux User Group on the Net " as only 2/3 people will be attending .. we have a project to use contemporary websites to establish the group...
<bootlknvf> popey .. its 3rd saturday of every month .
<popey> are you aware of lug.org.uk?
<popey> they/we can host a website for you.. like iom.lug.org.uk, and a mailing list if you need it
<AlanBell> yup, do that
<popey> http://iom.lug.org.uk/ looks like you already have one :)
<bootlknvf> We've already done that ..
<bootlknvf> We need to change the website though..
<bootlknvf> Next meeting 20th October 2012 ..
<AlanBell> just before the Quantal release
<AlanBell> what is the venue?
<popey> bootlknvf, i can fix that for you :D
<bootlknvf> popey , Is    " lug.im "  abit too silly or should we consider it ???
<popey> i dont think it matters
<popey> people obsess far too much about things like domain names
<popey> when in fact what really matters is having the meetings and making them successful
<bootlknvf> AlanBell, Check      14 : 19pm above
<AlanBell> yeah, that is a grid ref, what kind of place is it?
<bootlknvf> It's an office
<bootlknvf> With a big board room for chats & coffee etc.
<Azelphur> for anyone curious about the security on the wireless credit cards, it's bad xD
<AlanBell> http://goo.gl/maps/8Tllp this one
<Azelphur> I was looking into it last night with the goal of using my phone in place of my card, I found that my phone can easily read my card, and here's an example packet (with scrambled numbers of course) http://pastebin.com/FAD5j6bG
<Azelphur> things that are scary, that.
<bootlknvf> AlanBell, Sorry I could only find the map ref thingy .. No picturesw really .. wait let me try flickr ..
<AlanBell> bootlknvf: Nadine house?
<bootlknvf> AlanBell, Yep
<AlanBell> very nice location :)
<bootlknvf> Thank-you , I used to live there actually .. 4 six years. until I moved out.
<bootlknvf> AlanBell, Just curious but how did you find out it was Nadine House ?? Did it say straight away .. or did you do some digging ????
<AlanBell> http://goo.gl/maps/8Tllp says on the front of it
<bootlknvf> Ahh yes .. excellent I forgot about streetview  .. yes the meeting will be on the 1st floor behind the flagpole ..
<AlanBell> great, maybe do some posters/flyers for libraries/colleges http://spreadubuntu.org/
<bootlknvf> At some point I'm going to suggest to the group about putting a webcam on the bottom-end of trhe flagpole to get people to use it as a premium webcam service .. as some people as absolutely obsessed about the IOM for some reason .. this is to generate income for the group .
<bootlknvf> ....but it's abit of a long shot
<AlanBell> I like this webcam http://www.pier39.com/SeaLion/sea_lion_webcam.htm
<bootlknvf> AFAs poster etc .. we're doing that in the new year .. keeping it low key until then.
<bootlknvf> opening...
<bootlknvf> mmm. I am the walrus ... very John Lennon .. :O)
<bootlknvf> but yes excatly the same thingy-ma-jig  ..
<AlanBell> also avoid doing silly things that make it an all boys club. If you start expecting people with beards that will be a self-fulfilling prophecy
<AlanBell> not that there is anything wrong with beards
<AlanBell> just not a very inclusive entry requirement
<bootlknvf> Ok .. I was just kidding really.
<christel> ho ho ho
<AlanBell> yeah I know
<bootlknvf> Wow I can zoom in on Golden gate bridge ....
<AlanBell> christel: you wouldn't make a good father christmas
<brobostigon> lol
<christel> :(
<Azelphur> so yea, it seems hardware wise that the new wave of android phones has the capability to just scan an RFID card and instantly clone it, just waiting on firmware patches to enable the end user access to this lol
<Azelphur> quite cool for my prospect of wanting to pay using my phone instead of my credit card, quite uncool security wise xD
<bootlknvf> christel, Why not be one of jis elves ??
<bootlknvf> **his
<pinky-> Azelphur, yeah I read about NFC hacks the other day too. Through NFC it was possible to upload a malicious file to the device, which allowed us to gain code execution on the device and subsequently get full control over the device using a second vulnerability for privilege escalation
<bootlknvf> AlanBell, It would be nice to get a big banner and all stand outside on a sunny day sometime ... Do you think Mark has a spare Ubuntu banner  (or anyone) knocking about that we could use ??
<popey> bootlknvf, many loco teams have had banners made pretty cheap
<Azelphur> pinky-: it's even worse than that, I'm reasonably sure at this point that the hardware allows you to clone a credit card, for example
<popey> some have asked companies to sponsor the printing of it
<bootlknvf> Ok, popey ..  I'll keep it in mind.
<pinky-> Azelphur, buy one before they get banned;)
<Azelphur> I already have a S3 and Nexus 7 both with NFC haha
<Azelphur> pinky-: did you see my example showing the data you can lift off a card?
<pinky-> Azelphur, no I must of missed that
<Azelphur> pinky-: http://pastebin.com/FAD5j6bG
<Azelphur> that's what I get off my card (with scrambled numbers)
<pinky-> http://thenextweb.com/google/2012/09/19/security-researchers-hack-android-via-nfc-samsung-galaxy-s-iii/
<pinky-> ok looking now
<bootlknvf> Ok bye for now .. everyone ..
<Azelphur> pinky-: it's also interesting as you can tell if someone has a restricted credit card
<Azelphur> like you can see if they are restricted to goods and services only (no cash), cash only, atm only, etc
<Azelphur> but that's all the info you need to go shopping on amazon, for example
 * SuperEngineer passes Azelphur's details to fraud commssion
<Azelphur> todo: get rfid blocking wallet
<Azelphur> haha
<pinky-> Azelphur, did you edit the PAN number?
<Azelphur> SuperEngineer: I only found all this because I want to pay (legitimately) with my phone, using my own card, that's still my only goal, I have no desire to start carding xD
<Azelphur> pinky-: yea, I scrambled all the numbers for obvious reasons
<pinky-> ok makes sense now
<Azelphur> and the dates
<Azelphur> and the discretionary data
<pinky-> very interesting and I hope it's patched soon
<Azelphur> it's impossible to "patch"
<Azelphur> they'd have to recall all rfid cards.
<pinky-> hardcore
<pinky-> bad news
<Azelphur> also, this whole "you can't run into any issues it's restricted to Â£20 for NFC payments" thing is obviously a bit of bull
<Azelphur> since the Â£20 limit is implemented by the merchant, not the card/issuer
<pinky-> yeah in old days it was same with Â£50 guarentee cards, you could write a couple of cheques at once and they accepted no problem
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> but yea, once this card emulation patch gets done I should be able to use my phone as a credit card, yay.
<Azelphur> can't wait to freak out mcdonalds employees by doing it xD
<pinky-> hahaha
<Azelphur> pinky-: the other hilarious idea I had (which I could do now) get a tiny NFC chip, hide it inside the end of the sleeve of my coat, then touch the reader with my palm and announce that I'm going to "pay using the force"
<brobostigon> lol
<Azelphur> xD
<Ricey> hi guys, i'm running 12.10 and just noticed my mouse wheel has reversed direction! anyone else seen this?
<popey> i haven't
<Ricey> odd behaviour, it was after this afternoons' updates
<Ricey> but they were just unity stuff
<Ricey> so...how to swap it back.....
<Ricey> ah, that's what it is
<Ricey> 'natural scrolling' on/off switch in ubuntu tweak!
<Ricey> phew, thought i'd broken it :P
<AlanBell> bootlknvf: there is a tablecloth, I think Daviey still has it
<bootlknvf> AlanBell, OK cool .. cant see Daviey on the system ?
<bootlknvf> AlanBell, Any word onhow to get in touch with Daviey ??
<bootlknvf> ** on how
<bootlknvf> ... Oh I see him now .. Ok
<bootlknvf> Daviey, Hi there Mr AlanBell says you might have an Ubuntu tablecloth for our LUG that is meeting next month ..
<bootlknvf> I was wondering if we could get a photo of the users outside in the sun so that we can update the homepage ??
<bootlknvf> I'm happy to return the tablecloth and give you any charges for the service ...
<bootlknvf> some much for the Daviey, then.
<AlanBell> bootlknvf: people idle here, it is the weekend
<bootlknvf> AlanBell,  Oh right OK .. an email [PM] would be of help
<penguin42> anyone seeing 'PCDATA invalid Char value 27' on android mobile G+ page?
<Ricey> mine's ok
<Ricey> on HTC Sensation
<hamitron> F1 2012 has arrived :D
<penguin42> Ricey: Hmm
<Ricey> penguin42: which browser you using?
<penguin42> Ricey: standard android browser (on cyanogen 7)
<Ricey> penguin42: mines good on android browser and chrome
 * AlanBell wonders when window borders will return to quantal
<penguin42> Ricey: https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-kp0_w9ua44c/UF3ddXSGHVI/AAAAAAAACoM/h0HZ5Ml9mSE/w497-h373/SAM_0808_v1.JPG
<Ricey> penguin42: cyanogenmod 9
<Ricey> penguin42: just try changing everything after <url>/app/plus/x/...     to <url>/app/plus/mp
<Ricey> penguin42: that's where my url points
<penguin42> Ricey: Is that the difference between the basic mobile interface and the better one?
<Ricey> penguin42: not sure
<Ricey> :/
<penguin42> oh doing that's made it really unhappy!
<mattt> wuzzzzzzup
<Ricey> penguin42: oh dear
<penguin42> Ricey: Well, that's actually a bit of a problem - I can't go to any google page on it now, it displays a large white box over the rest of the google page for no apparent reason - I suspect because it thinks it's in a larger format display?
<Ricey> penguin42: try clearing the browser cache (system menu > apps) and maybe try a different browser too (dolphin, opera)
<Ricey> penguin42: it might be a screen size issue too???
<Ricey> penguin42: not sure
<penguin42> ah, the clear cache wroked
<Ricey> yay
<penguin42> for the problem caused by the /mp - still get the char 27
<Ricey> try a different browser, cm7 is a little old now ;)
<penguin42> Ricey: Interest, so I tried switching to the non basic-mobile view, and it's fine, and having switched to the non-basic view there doesn't seem to be a way of switching back
<Ricey> penguin42: ah, didn't try the basic mode, let's see if i can find it...
<penguin42> and actually the non-basic mode is ok; I just prefer the web interface version to the app
<mattt> lots of tweets about this amazon shopping stuff in 12.10
<Ricey> penguin42: no, i can't find an option for basic mode on my browsers, i guess it's recognising my setup and leaving it out
<Ricey> penguin42: if i set it to /x manually it re-directs to /mp
<penguin42> Ricey: I suspect they've been trying to kill it off - and broke it
<Ricey> penguin42: prolly !!
<Ricey> penguin42, have you tried the full app?
<penguin42> Ricey: The G+ app - yes, I hate it - it was fine until a few months ago, but now it'll only show 2 posts at a time on my phone, however small the posts
<Ricey> penguin42: it's not to everyones taste or phone, that's true
<penguin42> Ricey: And doesn't show any comments by default
<penguin42> Ricey: I liked the old one
<Ricey> penguin42: yeah, i don't use g+ much on android
<pinky-> on Reuters they just posted a new news story about Apple seeking Samsung sales banned in the U.S. and another $707 million more in damages
 * pinky- thinks about Karma
<Ricey> problem #6,873 (random number!) how on earth do i get my ps3 eye webcam audio working - there's a bug but it's not fixed :(
<MartijnVdS> Ricey: on the ps3? Or on Ubuntu?
<MartijnVdS> Ricey: what's the bug #?
<Ricey> MartijnVdS: on ubuntu, and it's just a random saying!
<Ricey> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/886449
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 886449 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "[USB-Audio - USB Camera-B4.04.27.1 (playstation eye), recording] Pulseaudio fails to detect card" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Ricey> it seems to be an alsa/kernel issue
<Ricey> according to the bug
<MartijnVdS> not much to do then, except wait..
<Ricey> indeed! and buy a cheap second mic!
<Ricey> $ amixer -c1
<Ricey> amixer: Mixer hw:1 load error: Invalid argument
<Ricey> oh well, worth a try
<pinky-> for every event that occurs, there will follow another event whose existence was caused by the first
<pinky-> that's Karma
<Ricey> indeed
<Ricey> so me plugging in my ps3 eye in will cause the alsa devs to fix it ;)
<pinky-> that's just called getting lucky!
<Ricey> lol
<Ricey> i could always try connecting my spare bluetooth phone earpiece and mic???
<MartijnVdS> sure
<Ricey> oh and a usb bluetooth dongle ;)
<MartijnVdS> that should work fine
<Ricey> where's that charger gone......
<Ricey> wow, can't believe i found it that quick!
<bigcalm[mob]_> Any extras for the happy hour tonight?
<Pendulum> bigcalm[mob]_: sorry, it's a bit far for me ;)
<bigcalm[mob]_> Aww, some day maybe :)
<bigcalm[mob]> Dave highlight?
<bigcalm[mob]> It doesn't feel right calling you Dave on irc.
<bigcalm[mob]> Where are the other drinkers? We need more than 3
<AlanBell> I am on the way
<AlanBell> the night is young
<mattt> partaaay
<pinky-> lol they glued an iphone5 to the ground:) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRlOM3y4yG4
<bigcalm[mob]_> Free WiFi in the slug and lettuce is handy, but rather disconnecty
<bigcalm[mob]_> I shall attempt to be sociable
<mgdm> If I'm booting from USB on a somewhat elderly (Athlon 2700) machine, how long should I expect the purple screen with the 3 icons at the bottom to be there?
<tombrough> ouch how much memory you got?
<mgdm> I can't remember, actually
<mgdm> I just need the machine up and on the network to get files off
<tombrough> If its to rescue stuff off an ageing machine that wont boot I would use a dedicated "rescue" distro, ubuntu live may be a bit to heavy for it to cope with.
<mgdm> and As I start to burn the CD, it starts to boot!
<mgdm> (it has 2 working USB ports, I need 3 for the flash drive, keyboard and mouse...)
<BigRedS> if you're rescuing stuff on an ageing machine it's normally best to take the disk out and plug it into something younger anyway
<mgdm> Yes, I'd love to, but I can't
<BigRedS> yeah, I suppose that was pretty obvious by the fact that you hadn't :)
<mgdm> it should be mandatory for USB keyboards to have more USB ports on them
<ali1234> yes, it's very handy
<BigRedS> my USB keyboard has a PS/2 socket on it, which I find endearingly quaint
<mgdm> heh
<pinky-> my Asus mobo has 12 x usb 2.0 ports and 2 x 3.0 usb ports, guess I'm lucky and don't need to ever worry about such things:/
 * mgdm finds a blank CD and burns Ubuntu to that, and uses the Flash drive on another computer :/
<mgdm> I'm back home and doing the yearly IT service :)
<jacobw> that's always fun
<SuperEngineer> dr who time boys & girls :)
<mgdm> new Win7 computer in and running, old XP computer being backed up before being retired, dead laptop getting a new drive + Ubuntu, dead netbook to get a new power switch...
<pinky-> quite a list, lots of hours..
<mgdm> it's all family stuff. Not chargeable :-)
<jacobw> SuperEngineer: i can't watch it, insensitive clod
<mgdm> I don't mind
<SuperEngineer> hee hee
<mgdm> The 12.04 installer is pretty slick, I have to say
<pinky-> lol they mentioned Twitter on DrWho:)
<mgdm> I wonder has he adapted Rose's phone to tweet as well as make calls across the universe
<mgdm> 'omg getting chased by Daleks AGAIN lol'
<mgdm> wait, that'd be Facebook
<Monotoko> wow
<Monotoko> I love Synergy
<mgdm> it's awesome
<Monotoko> I can control both my Windows laptop and my Linux desktop :D
<mgdm> when I used to have a Macbook Pro with 2 monitors and a Windows desktop at work, I could control both
<mgdm> which confused the non-techies :)
<BigRedS> haha, yeah, that's one bit of software that's I never stopped regarding as pure magic
<Monotoko> hahahah, it is pure magic o: took me a while to get it going though
<Monotoko> bloody university internet
<mgdm> Synergy is magic, yes, but Shazam is witchcraft
<mgdm> I know exactly how it works, and I could probably implement it myself, but the mere fact that it works quite that well is incredible
<ali1234> which one?
<mgdm> ali1234: which which?
<ali1234> synergy or shazam?
<mgdm> Shazam
<BigRedS> yeah, I've a vague understanding of how Synergy works, but the number of edge-cases there must be in getting it working on X, OSX *and* Windows amazes me. It must be even worse than doing something that's supposed to be possible cross-platform
<Monotoko> hmmm, my mouse won't select my mIRC stuff for some reason :P
<Monotoko> apart from that
<Monotoko> no problems :D
<mgdm> it's telling you shouldn't use mIRC
<mgdm> come to irssi, it is calling ;-)
<Monotoko> hahahah clearly :) I also can't get the sidebar on Ubuntu because it just goes straight back to Windows
<Monotoko> super key works though :D
<ali1234> i would plug my synergy fork which supports bluetooth and automatic discovery of services (ie roaming between multiple setups) but the svn server sees to have gone down
<mgdm> ali1234: tres shiny
<ali1234> linux only though, becuase i have no idea how to write bluetooth code for windows or mac
<Monotoko> Windows bluetooth code is horrible :P
<mgdm> I suspect the Windows case at least requires sacrifice of small furry cute animals
<Monotoko> indeed
<penguin42> ali1234: Have you seen 'mango-lassi' ?
<mgdm> given that the last time I looked (a while ago) there were about 3 different BT stacks for Windows
<ali1234> "This domain name expired on 08/21/2012 and is pending renewal or deletion."
<ali1234> penguin42: no what is it?
<penguin42> ali1234: It's an alternative to synergy, works with mDNS stuff - never managed to get it to work (haven't tried it for a while though)
<ali1234> synergy works with mDNS...
<penguin42> ali1234: But it doesn't advertise a service does it?
<ali1234> no
<ali1234> unless you use bluetooth :)
<penguin42> I think m.l does
<penguin42> (not sure about bt)
<Monotoko> hmmm, does anyone know how I can get sound across?
<Monotoko> from my desktop to my laptop so I can route it through the stereo
<ali1234> Monotoko: you have to use pulseaudio network abstraction
<Monotoko> ali1234, that sounds complex... does it work cross platform?
<ali1234> i have no idea how it works but it is supposed to be possible
<ali1234> yes pulseaudio allegedly works on windows
<Monotoko> hmm, this could be a fun night :P
<mgdm> I do not use Unity
<mgdm> how do I get it to show me all the installed applications?
<mgdm> the search isn't working
<ali1234> top right there's a menu
<BigRedS> dpkg -l
<ali1234> it's like a drop down thing with a triangle
<ali1234> top right of the dash that is
<mgdm> BigRedS: no, not that :)
<ali1234> you click onthe bookshelf looking thing at the bottom
<ali1234> then filter results
<ali1234> then select all
<ali1234> then "see 100 more results" next to "installed"
<mgdm> where's 'select all'?
<ali1234> next to "type"
<penguin42> I'm kind of surprised those 'bookshelf looking thing' and other icons aren't any more descriptive, didn't seem to do a tooltip
<ali1234> they've probably redesigned it all since last i used it
<mgdm> I don't get a 'type' or whatever
<mgdm> I just get 'filter results', which does hee haw
<mgdm> and it can't find 'terminal', though last boot it did
<ali1234> give up on unity
<ali1234> oh, you can alt-f1 or ctrl-f1 or something, and get a "run" dialog
<jacobw> what do you use now ali1234 ?
<ali1234> then just put in gnome-terminal
<ali1234> jacobw: gnome-panel
<mgdm> it's only running in a live env for the duration of getting all this stuff off
<ali1234> i learned a huge amount about unity by doing the semi-automated tests
<mgdm> hitting enter doesn't work \o/
<BigRedS> "run" is at alt-f2
<mgdm> I have the Run thing, and have typed gnome-terminal
<ali1234> it has loads of pointless features that yu would never know even existed without a full walkthrough tutorial
<BigRedS> it's a lot like the start button thing
<BigRedS> is that the dash?
<mgdm> yes
<BigRedS> but would software-centre get you a list of installed apps?
<mgdm> OK, my objective is that I want a terminal
<mgdm> quick-style
<ali1234> right click on desktop, "create shortcut", -> "gnome-terminal"
<BigRedS> ctrl-alt-t
<mgdm> but it won't let me have one
<ali1234> oh wait, they removed that too
<ali1234> ctrl-alt-f1, there is your terminal :)
<BigRedS> install guake?
<penguin42> I think if you can create a .desktop file in your Desktop it still does it
<jacobw> does guake even work with unity
<ali1234> oh, oh: ctrl-alt-f1, login, DISPLAY=:0 gnome-terminal, ctrl-alt-f7
<mgdm> BigRedS: ctrl-alt-t worked. You get this week's "obscure shortcut" award
 * mgdm sods off for some dinner, and will continue thrashing this later
<ali1234> ctrl-alt-t works in gnome-panel too, so that's cool
<BigRedS> haha, yeah, it's a ubuntuism, though
<jacobw> it doesn't work in kubuntu even
<ali1234> KDE can probanly do it using plasma workspaces
<BigRedS> nor does anything, though, so that's okay :)
<ali1234> plasma can do anything, except for make a usable desktop
<jacobw> the keyboard shortcut, not guake
<penguin42> you can hotkey pretty much anything in kde; although since I've got a terminal icon on my panel I don't really need to
<ali1234> oh, yeah, i'm pretty sure the keyboard shortcut is actually a gnome thing
<jacobw> i like plasma
<BigRedS> I'm pretty sure it predates unity
<ali1234> they are roughly the same age
<ali1234> gnome shell too
<ali1234> they all started development around the same time
<BigRedS> I just meant the ctrl-alt-f1 shortcut
<BigRedS> er, ctrl-alt-t
<ali1234> oh.
<ali1234> that again?
<BigRedS> hm?
<BigRedS> ah, never mind
<jacobw> i think plasma development started around 2006, perhaps 2007 as part of kde4
<ali1234> and unity started out as UNE in 2008
<jacobw> i'd forgotten about UNE
<ali1234> yeah
<jacobw> i didn't know the code from UNE was used for unity
<ali1234> i think everyone can agree that unity is an improvement over UNE at least
<ali1234> the unity code has been rewritten many time while it's been called unity
<BigRedS> haha, yeah
<ali1234> i doubt there's any UNE code still in it; i also doubt there is much unity 1.0 code still in it
<ali1234> they've also totally from scratch rewritten compiz in a different language
<ali1234> and then there's unity2d as well
<jacobw> different language?
<ali1234> yeah, compiz 0.8 is C, compiz 0.9 is C++
<Azelphur> how long after a show is aired does it come on at iplayer?
<penguin42> thought it's pretty instant these days - and if it's still on you can rewind to the start on the life
<Azelphur> penguin42: it doesn't seem to want to let me watch the new doctor who :(
<Azelphur> it redirects me to the lottery when I click it :S
<Azelphur> http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/search?q=doctor%20who
<Azelphur> ah there we go, it caught up now
<Azelphur> \o/
<Azelphur> oh nope, it just got confused, uncaught up again
<penguin42> Azelphur: Your problem here is that you're in the wrong time, if only you had a way to move to the right one
<Azelphur> o.O
<lanboy1> anyone know how to get flash 11.2 working so it doesnt smurf youtube?
<ali1234> yes
<ali1234> 1. log out of unity and log in to unity2d or gnome classic
<ali1234> 2. open youtube
<ali1234> 3. right click flash player and select settings
<ali1234> 4. disable hardware acceleration
<lanboy1> tried that but doesnt work :(
<ali1234> then you didn't do it properly
<lanboy1> its something to do with ATI drivers isnt it
<lanboy1> so i heard
<ali1234> no
<ali1234> it is a bug in flash player
<lanboy1> i'm in gnome classic all the time
<lanboy1> gonna try it again now
<ali1234> if you are using gnome-classic and compiz you need to disable compiz
<ali1234> otherwise you can't click on the box to disable hardware acceleration
<ali1234> see bug 865672
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 865672 in adobe-flashplugin (Ubuntu) ""Adobe Flash Player Settings" dialog does not respond to mouse clicks" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/865672
<lanboy1> ohhhhh
<lanboy1> yeah i'm running compiz
<ali1234> by the way, this bug is a regression in compiz 0.9 and doesn't happen with compiz 0.8
<ali1234> also another workaround is to use google chrome
<ali1234> googlehas the flash source; they've fixed this bug
<ali1234> but their version of flash plugin only works with chrome, and maybe chromium if you hack it
<penguin42> that's an old old bug
<ali1234> yes, it sure is
<ali1234> almost a year
<ali1234> also it keeps going away and coming back
<ali1234> much like all compiz bugs
<lanboy1> lol i'm running 11.04
<lanboy1> i will update when i get a job
<lanboy1> gonna get an ssd
<ali1234> it's almost as if the developers have no way of knowing which patch fixed which bug, because their version control system is completely useless
<penguin42> ali1234: I don't think it's that, I think it's not so much that a particular patch makes it come/go, it's just something that happens in some configs and not in others and you tweak something apparently unreleated and it reappears
<lanboy1> i'm gonna sound dumb here, but how do i stop compiz
<ali1234> penguin42: i never change compiz settings
<ali1234> lanboy1: open a shell and type in "metacity --replace"
<ali1234> you can also log out and log in to unity2d
<ali1234> or gnome-fallback
<penguin42> ali1234: I don't mean settings, I mean interactions with lots of different bits of the desktop
<ali1234> fallback should have no compositing
<ali1234> penguin42: it's actually caused by compiz stacking bugs. even the lead develop of compiz admits this is a mess and that he's caused many regressions while trying to fix things
<ali1234> see eg bug 736877
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 736877 in compiz (Ubuntu) "Add a test case for stacking order issues" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/736877
<lanboy1> doesnt save when i uncheck hardware acceleration
<ali1234> well, it should do
<lanboy1> only works when i start firefox with sudo command
<ali1234> sounds like you've got stale root-owned configuration files
<lanboy1> yeah i had some problems with stuff being locked to root before
<ali1234> cd ~; find -user root
<lanboy1> ok its listed some files
<lanboy1> some of which are flash :/
<lanboy1> so if i change the permissions it should be ok right?
<ali1234> yeah
<ali1234> to avoid this happening, don't use sudo -s, and don't run gui programs with sudo, use gksudo. and only do it when absolutely necessary. i have never needed to run firefox as root.
<mgdm> *shudder*
<BigRedS> firefox as root? What?
<BigRedS> though I have come across this idea that sudo is somehow a harmless alternative to making yourself root
<jacobw> sudo is making yourself root :|
<_2E0BXQ> it stands for pseudo-root
<_2E0BXQ> also su i.e. super-user, do
<jacobw> i didn't know that, i thought it was mean to be su-do-this-thing
 * BigRedS smiles at a proud history of ambiguous etymology in *nix
<lanboy1> genius
<lanboy1> it works
<BigRedS> jacobw: to be fair it's not quite making yourself root - you *can* configure sudo such that you probably can't break anything too badly by restricting you to doing something not all that dangerous like ifup
<BigRedS> but almost everybody doesn't
<penguin42> and of course since su isn't just for root - you can *substitute user* to any user
<jacobw> you can whitelist commands
 * _2E0BXQ pets the fact he just logs in as root, and doesn't bother with having a normal user account >.>
<jacobw> meh
<brobostigon> QI XL :) BBC2
<BigRedS> penguin42: no! 'switch user'! :)
<jacobw> nobody uses that
<Daviey> bootlknvf: Hey, I don't think I still have the table cloth.
<balor> czajkowski, and *that* was the worst Dr Who
<bootlknvf> Daviey, Yeah, thought as much ... thank-you for getting back in touch with me . Good luck.
<popey> Daviey, who does?
<Monotoko> how do I choose another session at login with just a keyboard?
<Monotoko> (Ubuntu 12.04)
<mrdigital> ctrl + alt +(one of the F - keys)
<Monotoko> I mean at the login screen... like, desktops
<Monotoko> I have Unity and XFCE
<popey> tab then space
<Monotoko> thank you! :)
<popey> np
<popey> ali1234, why is raspbmc so painful to setup, they don't have an image you can just blat onto an SD card?
<Seeker`> Azelphur: Was it you I was talking to about benchmarks for phones?
<Azelphur> Seeker`: yes
<Seeker`> Azelphur: http://www.glbenchmark.com/result.jsp?benchmark=glpro25&advanced-filter=false&orderby=448&base=device&screen-group=true&screen-group-value=1&os=0&os=1&os=2&os=3&os=4&version=latest&certified_only=1&brand=all&gpu=all&screen=4&screen=3&screen=2&screen=1&screen=0
<Azelphur> wow the xiamo is top?
<Azelphur> impressive, isn't that a budget phone from korea?
<Seeker`> Azelphur: http://goo.gl/S71jJ
<ali1234> popey: i know right.
<Seeker`> Its a china-only phone. Don't think it is particularly budget
<Azelphur> Seeker`: fun, I remember reading about it, the MIUI phone
<ali1234> popey: in fact you can download the kernel image and rootfs tarball and just make the sd card yourself quite easily
<jacobw> MIUI is just a ROM
<popey> this bruhaha passed me by
<Azelphur> jacobw: they have a phone to go with it now
<popey> just finding deleted posts and reading via aggregators http://raspberrycenter.de/aggregator/categories/2
<jacobw> Oh, cool :)
<Seeker`> Azelphur: so, yeah, iphone is quite a bit better than the galaxy S 3 :)
<ali1234> popey: i've picked through the raspbmc source code and i my opinion they are violating the GPL. their "source code" is just a script which runs debootstrap and makes a tarball from the raspbian mirrors
<Azelphur> Seeker`: at graphics, not at cpu, screen, nfc, bluetooth, universal connectivity, openness, app availability, camera, ...
<popey> right
<Azelphur> :p
<ali1234> xbian source code is offline so i can't say anything about that however i suspect they have built their rootfs tarball by hand, so there is no such script for them to release
<ali1234> but either way, both of them are violating the GPL
<Seeker`> Azelphur: meh, bigger screen isn't always better, nfc is still as useful as it was when I first tried it 7 years ago, how is the blutooth better, 'universal connectivity'?
 * popey notes "build quality" and "design" aren't on Azelphurs list
<Azelphur> popey: *shrug*, those things are heavily subject to opinion so I tend to avoid them
<ali1234> but the really funny part is that no code created by raspbmc is even released under the GPL
<Azelphur> Seeker`: I've actually been playing with NFC on my phone since yesterday, great fun
<popey> not suprised
<ali1234> they use their own weird non-commercial license (which is therefore not GPL compatible)
<Azelphur> bluetooth, android has a bunch of profiles that iphone doesn't according to gsmarena
<popey> Azelphur, all that list is subject to opinion
<Azelphur> universal connectivity, we have proper microUSB ports, usb otg, etc, you don't.
<popey> Azelphur, I have no need for nfc or bluetooth, and the app availability is awesome on ios
<Seeker`> Azelphur: just about everything on that list is subjective, apart from the lack of nfc
<popey> i dont need micro usb on my phone
<Azelphur> popey: everything about anything is only relative to use case
<popey> mini and micro usb are crap connectors anyway
<Azelphur> that doesn't change the fact that overall, the galaxy s3 has a much larger feature set, which overall makes it better.
<Azelphur> if you don't use those features, that's fine :)
<ali1234> that's right. nokia small connector is the one true power source
<popey> :)
<popey> i was looking for one of them the other day :(
 * Azelphur would rather pay less for more features, than more for less
<Azelphur> :p
<popey> ended up binning the phone, should have stripped it
<Seeker`> Azelphur: the only extra feature you listed was nfc...
<ali1234> lol, binning a phone for lack of a charger that costs Â£3?
<Azelphur> Seeker`: and extra bluetooth profiles, and thousands more apps, I can go on :)
<popey> I was in "clear out" mode
<ali1234> anyway, mobile phone wars lol
<popey> indeed
<Azelphur> hehe :p
<popey> pointless
<ali1234> nobody is ever going to change their opinion so it's pointless to argue
<Azelphur> I don't bother to argue now, I just chant facts
<Azelphur> xD
<Seeker`> Azelphur: how many of those apps do anything different to the other several thousand?
<popey> meh
<popey> bored of this
<Azelphur> Seeker`: no statistics available on that :)
<Seeker`> Azelphur: what have you been using nfc on your phone for?
<pinky-> App Store has growing population of never-downloaded "zombie apps" 2/3rds have never ever been downloaded
<Azelphur> beaming between my tablet and phone, and I'm also playing around with NFC payments
<Azelphur> I'm trying to hack NFC payments to work before it's officially released in this country lol
 * Azelphur likes to have nice things early
<pinky-> iOS App Store*
 * Seeker` got hold of a nokia NFC phone in 2005 through uni, had to do a project with it. Hasn't seen it really in use anywhere else.
<Azelphur> Seeker`: most places accept wireless cards now
<Azelphur> I know my local mcdonalds does, and I think my local tescos does too
<Azelphur> and the phone talks the same protocol, so should work if I can get past the region locking :)
<Azelphur> was also interesting to see what data was actually stored on my card
<pinky-> The reality is there are only a couple of thousand apps that really make some kind of downloads. This is based on Appleâs closed system â itâs tough to discover those kinds of apps. You donât have proper search, so the only way to discover new apps is through the top listing.
<pinky-> The top 25 tend to be the same companies who spend millions of dollars to get to the top of those lists.
<ali1234> the top "apps" are all cheezy games
<Azelphur> pinky-: on apple you mean?
<pinky-> yes
<Azelphur> hehe
<pinky-> Did you know that the App Store has 1,899 flashlight apps?
<Seeker`> pinky-: there are at least 1000 results on google play for android devices
<Azelphur> lol
<Seeker`> furthermore there are at least 1000 free flashlight aps
<Seeker`> and at least 1000 paid flashlight apps
<Darael> The latter is frankly the more worrying.
<pinky-> this is dated 21st Sept. http://gigaom.com/mobile/ioss-lead-over-android-in-app-monetization-is-shrinking/
<pinky-> it'll be interesting to see what happens in the next five years.
<ali1234> google will become the biggest player in smartphones
<ali1234> microsoft will switch to entirely cloud based services company
<ali1234> apple will continue doing exactly what they've always done
<pinky-> I'd laugh like crazy if Samsung patented some new technology which meant Apple couldn't copy and ended up going out of "fashion"
<ali1234> linux will not become popular on the desktop
<ali1234> everything else will probably have faded away to be replaced by different companies with different products
<ali1234> ok 5 years is probably too short time frame
<ali1234> try 10 years for all that stuff
<Seeker`> pinky-: there will always be something that apple have a patent on too
<Seeker`> plus the fact that apple are one of the biggest customers of the other half of samsung
<pinky-> Seeker`, yeah it reminds me of the U.S. company Monster Cables
<Seeker`> ?
<pinky-> make thier money through sueing
<Seeker`> heh, Apple don't make their money through suing
<pinky-> ok I was too abstract
<pinky-> and a little sleepy
<pinky-> I need to hit the hay, good night all
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-23
<christel> rawr
<Seeker`> o/
<Darael> Mid-night uuk denizens! Run!
<AlanBell> evening all
<Dave2> morning
<Seeker`> Dave2: you have to be different!
 * Seeker` wonders if Dave2 still prints out every leet o'clock
<Azelphur> :p
<Dave2> Seeker`, no :(
<Seeker`> :( :(
<Dave2> after I realized I'd spent several hours of my life doing it
<Seeker`> haha
<bootlknvf> Mornin' everyone !
<AlanBell> morning all
<christel> GOOOOOD MORNING
<MartijnVdS> \o christel
<christel> maaaartijn :D
<MartijnVdS> time for tea!
<popey> morning
<MartijnVdS> howdy popeyman
<jacobw> morning ubunteros
 * Laney wonders why the archers is entering his brain
<Laney> OFF
<pinky-> Laney, because you watched DrWho yesterday and got a brainwash?:)
<pinky-> archers was mentioned yesterday in the Dr Who episode and I just wondered if it was your subconscious?
<popey> Not impressed with this series of Dr Who :(
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<SuperEngineer> o/ brobostigon
<jacobw> Laney: check out this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XeIEovjOVdI
<brobostigon> o/ SuperEngineer
<mattt> archers?  that weird show they play on bbc radio?
<pinky-> to be honest I stopped watching Dr Who regular back in 1987 when Sylvester McCoy became the Dr.
<christel> RAWR
<brobostigon> RAWR
<christel> :D
<christel> Oooh dr who
<brobostigon> yes.
<brobostigon> last night,
<christel> i forgot about dr who amongst the happy houring with AlanBell and bigcalm and Dave2 last night
<christel> i should watch it now!
<brobostigon> :)
<pinky-> Though I will say the last two Doctors have been a lot less "Pantomime" and I do now at times watch the odd episode. It's been better since
<pinky-> David Tennant
<popey> hmm, where can I buy bento flakes round here
<Laney> bonito
<Laney> ?
<popey> duh, yeah
<Laney> local chinese supermarket does them here
<Laney> well s/chinese/asian/?
<popey> i dont think we have any of those close by
 * popey rummages..
<popey> but not in iOS6 maps.. AMIRITE!?
<AlanBell> popey: in Aldershot near the station
<popey> ooh
<pinky-> When I live in Alton and then later Bordon, my local DHSS was in Aldershot:)
<pinky-> near the station
<popey> Seyma Food Centre?
<popey> http://goo.gl/maps/p40qr
<AlanBell> yeah
<popey> thanks
<AlanBell> dunno if they have that specifically
<Laney> give them a tinkle
<AlanBell> the corner shop over the road from there does nice biltong (was no biltong in the seyma shop)
 * popey is doing that
<popey> no, they dont
 * gord got a new ipad3 for Â£350, good deal
<gord> its not as good as everyone makes it out to be..
<popey> gord, are you in foreign?
<gord> yup
<jacobw> in foreign?
<popey> abroad
<gord> spending two weeks in seoul, half way done. gonna go hike a mountain tomorrow!
 * jacobw shakes head
<popey> what made you choose seoul?
<popey> also, get back here and fix unity! :)
<jacobw> he's looking for seoul mate
<gord> i didn't know much about korea and wanted to know more :) really interesting history
<jacobw> (really sorry)
<gord> went to the DMZ yesterday and stood in north korea
 * SuperEngineer hums "Paint It Black"...
<jacobw> how was it gord ?
<gord> fantastic
<gord> https://picasaweb.google.com/112811220238447511854/DMZAndJMATour?authuser=0&feat=directlink have photos
<popey> cool
<popey> i see Sascha Pallenberg is in Seoul too, is there a conf on?
<gord> iruno? i'm certainly not here for anything
<popey> gord, you played nikki and the robots yet?
<gord> nup, looks cool
<popey> it is, very, lots of community levels and an editor
<popey> pay what you want too
<Laney> what's the difference between that and the Free version?
<popey> the pay version gets you the levels they designed
<Laney> ah
<Laney> there's a package but I haven't built it yet to see what you get
 * Laney svn co svn+ssh://svn.debian.org/svn/pkg-games/packages/trunk/nikki
<popey> when you pay you get a 'key' which lets you download the extra content
<popey> which works really nicely inside the app, it's a very well designed app
<popey> e.g. when you go full screen it just works (as it should) unlike most of the humble bundle on linux this time around
<pinky-> wow I just found another new word in a new news story, Headline reads, "World Record One Petabit per Second Fiber Transmission over 50-km."
<pinky-> well new word to me anyweays
<pinky-> anyways*
<pinky-> A petabit is one thousand terabits and a terabit is one trillion binary digit s, or 1,000,000,000,000 (that is, 10 12 ) bits. My mind has gone BLANK.
<MartijnVdS> F1 time almost
<pinky-> MartijnVdS, yeah 5 mins
<SuperEngineer> anyway of doing a ban on the troll?
<SuperEngineer> *any way
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: troll? Where?
<SuperEngineer> is now known as [various inflamatory names]
<MartijnVdS> ah him
<MartijnVdS> he who changes names every few hours
<SuperEngineer> that be the one
<pinky-> F1 is about to start, need coffee!
<SuperEngineer> vrooom vrooom....
<Laney> yes, you definitely need caffeine to survive F1
 * SuperEngineer switches status to "Watching F1" [& sends pity in Laney's direction]
 * Laney is going to go out :P
<Laney> after test installing nikki
<SuperEngineer> Laney: if you're lucky you'll end up in a pub with F1 on 80" widescreen
<SuperEngineer> ;)
 * MartijnVdS likes his 46" :)
<pinky-> I bet Eddie Jordan's jeans look even more strange on 46"
<MartijnVdS> Eddie rocks :)
<SuperEngineer_> just seen that somehow I'm on here as me & me_ ... wtf????
<MartijnVdS> You, yourself and you?
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: 2 clients, or a disconnect of some kind :)
<SuperEngineer_> suspects netbook disconnect - forget it was even on -whoops
<SuperEngineer_> time to log off both & stop this Dr. Who impersonation
<SuperEngineer> You are now identified for SuperEngineer.  -that's what I wanted, thanks Freenode...
<MartijnVdS> \o SuperEngineer
<SuperEngineer> ...next time please tell me - hey, you left the netbook on! Thankyou
<SuperEngineer> o?
<MartijnVdS> :)
<MartijnVdS> \o = \o/ but with only 1 arm in the air :)
<penguin42> the other one is busy....
<MartijnVdS> penguin42: yeah, Eddie Jordan on TV.....
<SuperEngineer> o? was to check if my arm still worked after becoming a split personality - dodgy stuff this time warping ;)
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: easier than space warping..
<SuperEngineer> [plus I was distracted by salute to th2the prof"
<SuperEngineer> *"the prof"
<MartijnVdS> they had a feature about him yesterday
 * SuperEngineer nearly has all molecules back in one body - non quantomly speaking
<SuperEngineer> - it would spoil the race but it would be oh so nice to have a tribute random safety car lap
<MartijnVdS> safety car RACE
<MartijnVdS> \o/ HD TV
<penguin42> HD safety car - or smoke?
<SuperEngineer> wot - no smoke?
 * SuperEngineer looks a tobacco ... mmmm
<MartijnVdS> à² _à² 
<SuperEngineer> verb - to smoke - to act like a tyre on a Ferrari with no traction control
<SuperEngineer> [or a Top Gear presenter]
 * SuperEngineer doubts that these F1 cars carry a Boot Repair CD... SuperEngineers do
 * SuperEngineer smiles smugly
<pinky-> silver Rizla ftw
<SuperEngineer> Dinosaurs on a spaceship?  I await "Tiny Vroom Vrooms on a Tardis" episode ;)
<SuperEngineer> In case it adds to anyones enjoyment of the race: live race on TV, live timings from F1.com, pit lane radio [livish] from BBC formula1 site.  F1 heaven.
<brobostigon> i have the timings from the bbc f1 site.
<pinky-> yup and ad-free heaven
<brobostigon> the almost ncurses terminal, view.
<brobostigon> pinky-: yup :)
<pinky-> 28 seconds total pit time is a long pit, Singapore pit stops dramatically change positions
<pinky-> But Singapore have a 100% record for saftey car so I guess that will always bring the cars all back together at times.
 * pinky- waits for the Saftey Car
<SuperEngineer> pinky-: if a certain 2 drivers keep driving the same way your wish will soon be granted
<einonm> I've just read a rather interesting blog post from Mr Shuttleworth, regarding Amazon search results.
<pinky-> SuperEngineer, yup or a drivers investigation of a curiously close wall
<einonm> One line caught my eye in particular - "we have root". Can anyone shed some light on what he means? I assume it's not what I think it is.
<penguin42> URL?
<SuperEngineer> einonm: I think you can safely assume it wasn't root beer
 * SuperEngineer also awaits URL
<einonm> http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/1182#comments
<SuperEngineer> cheers
<penguin42> einonm: Yes, that's a 'we can already do everything to your machine, so don't worry that we're doing something else'
<popey> indeed
<popey> you already trust ubuntu developers with root access to your machine, every time you use software centre / apt / synaptic / dpkg
<einonm> Ok, fair enough. Not the most media friendly way of putting it though!
<einonm> I've only just started using ubuntu in anger, that sort of comment doesn't really endear me to the platform.
<SuperEngineer> popey: isn't there a slight difference there? as in "I know I handed over control -temporarily-" ?
<popey> its just an example
<popey> there's plenty of other things which run as root on your machine
<SuperEngineer> indeed
<SuperEngineer> ...and to give it another advert - including the Ubuntu Boot Repair utility - thanks ye gads it does!
<SuperEngineer> [it does what you know it does - & it does it when you've been recovering with gparted & your eyes are tired]
<einonm> popey: true, but I trust the average developer more than someone who talks about what is essentially dropping adware onto my computer
<brobostigon> thats the pub visit out of the window. rain, :(
<SuperEngineer> I notice nobody picks up the next comment "In summary â please donât feed the trolls". well said, Mr. S.
<popey> einonm, same people
 * SuperEngineer hands brobostigon a virtual brolly
<brobostigon> :)
 * brobostigon thanks SuperEngineer 
<einonm> popey: that's a bit of a sweeping statement! Not all (not even the majority?) of the software on ubuntu is written by Ubuntu developers, to whom I think you're referring
<popey> you misunderstood my point
<popey> the people who made the shopping lens are the same people who also have root on your box
 * SuperEngineer hands einomm a pair of virtual safety goggles, fireproof oversuit, magic shield & running shoes.. & good luck!
<SuperEngineer> ;)
<penguin42> popey: I just asked for a pointer to how the anonymisation is done; I pointed out that while you do indeed have root at least we can see the source to the packages we get
<einonm> popey: Ah, ok. But I guess you're giving root to anyone who has written any of the code that then runs.
<popey> its not a useful point that he's made
<einonm> popey: Maybe not useful to ubuntu, but I could argue that it's useful to someone deciding which distro to use!
<popey> you know of a distro where there are no developers which have root on your machine?
<SuperEngineer> ooo, me sir, me sir, me sir; I do!!
<einonm> popey: not unless I put one together myself after reading all the code?
<popey> exactly
<SuperEngineer> [it's called the mains plug]
<einonm> but that arrangement is based on trust - and I think I'm basically saying that comments like that erode the trust
<einonm> As I'm not fluent with lenses yet - you can just remove them, right?
<penguin42> gah for some reason my comment has been by flagged by the Akismet spam detector - heck knows why, I wonder how the moderation system works
<SuperEngineer> pinky-: your wish just came true
<pinky-> safe ty!
<SuperEngineer> einomm - it is, I hope, still a -circle- of trust, not just trusting one bod - *that* is the thing that must be defended & *proved* in such a scenario, & seems to have been forgotten by an interviewee
 * SuperEngineer slaps wrist for suggesting some people are kindling their own trust with pound coins
<SuperEngineer> & if anybody got that meaning - slap my other wrist for not being obscure enough ;)
<MartijnVdS> </safety-car>
<pinky-> umm
<MartijnVdS> <safety-car>
<SuperEngineer> ...this is the one that has a professor in thepassenger seat
<SuperEngineer> now would be a good time for the nedical car to a memorial lap of honour
<SuperEngineer> *to do a
<einonm> SuperEngineer: As long as the source code is there, I'm not too worried!
 * einonm takes the foil hat off now.
<MartijnVdS> heh https://twitter.com/sarcasticapple/status/249556622228213760
<balor> Anyone have a working Samsung ML 2168 printer?
<StevenR> balor: iirc, Samsung provide drivers for their printers...somewhere
<StevenR> I've made them work in the past
<SuperEngineer> MartijnVdS: http://www.apostrophe.org.uk/ ...I was one of the founder's ;)
<balor> StevenR, kinda.
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: one of the founder's what?
<SuperEngineer> correct
<balor> StevenR, I don't quite get whether I should be using splix or some binary from Sammy
<MartijnVdS> à² _à²  @ SuperEngineer
<StevenR> balor: splix?
<MartijnVdS> won't plugging in the printer start an automatic download though?
<MartijnVdS> I've seen that happen with Epson drivers
<balor> StevenR, Apparently an implementation of SPL (Samsung PRinter Language) for CUPS
<balor> MartijnVdS, This printer seems to be too new for the available packages.  But the newer PPD doesn't work, so there must be some binary magic going on somewhere.
<SuperEngineer> sometime's, the way peoles's's use apostroph'es in the wrong the p'lace can be annoying
<MartijnVdS> balor: this is why I buy printers that list "Postscript" or "PCL" as a supported protocol/language ;)
<SuperEngineer> sometimes it's just a mis'take
<balor> MartijnVdS, I should've done that.  Normally I don't buy anything that isn't on the linux printers database....time to return this
<penguin42> balor: Which one is it?
<StevenR> balor: I think Samsung provide drivers
<penguin42> Sammy are normally pretty good about Linux support - I've had two that just worked
<MartijnVdS> Did anyone notice the Ubuntu release manager in yesterday's Doctor Who? :)
<balor> penguin42, ML-2168
<penguin42> balor: And what happens - is it recognised at all?
<balor> StevenR, They seem to provide a 42Mb tar.gz that puts binaries all over the place
<balor> penguin42, It's recognised, configured as a 2150, by default, but does nothing.  If I change the driver to something incorrect, it prints an error - bad driver - message
<balor> It looks as if the 216* series is quite new
<penguin42> balor: Can you submit a bug for it
<SuperEngineer> MartijnVdS: surely you mean "in next week's" Dr. Who... whoops - darn this time travel!
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: nah yesterday's
<MartijnVdS> more proof that Canonical = UNIT
<SuperEngineer> :D
<penguin42> balor: Looks even the ml-2150 is listed as untested on the splix site
<SuperEngineer> ...but the mitilia aren't in Canonical HQ yet. [hang on - I'll have a quick look see.]
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: no secret basements?
 * SuperEngineer jumps forward a little teensy weensy bit
<SuperEngineer>   - Damn.... very soon now!]
<SuperEngineer> & the place is full of little cubes, not dinosaurs!
<MartijnVdS> next week is going to be sad :(
<penguin42> SuperEngineer: You could try reselling them on amazon
<SuperEngineer> end of pretty lady & less than pretty man?
<SuperEngineer> MartijnVdS: I did... three decades from now .... everyone said they were boring... didn't do anything. no sale
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: but come Christmas, new pretty lady!
<SuperEngineer> MartijnVdS: I did... three decades from now .... everyone said they were boring... didn't do anything. no sale;(
<MartijnVdS> penguin42: they'll show up in the dash anyway
<SuperEngineer> ;(
<SuperEngineer> hmmm Senna has become a decorator?  "Senna brushed the wall just now" according to commentator
<SuperEngineer> he's not very good - nice blue colour walls but obviously keeps missing large bits
<SuperEngineer> 1st person to come up with a Dr. Who, Formula 1 & Amazon combined sensible comment gets a Darwin award
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: Brazilian GP, TARDIS materializes on track?
<MartijnVdS> that's Formula 1 in the Amazon + Doctor Who
<SuperEngineer> StevenR: you came close with "I think Samsung provide drivers" but no Amazon comment.. you're saved
 * SuperEngineer ignores MartijnVdS comment... obviously trying too hard  :D
<SuperEngineer> ...but in view of the lack of other contenders......
<Azelphur> barclay/google are trolling me, I tried to use pingit but they block me because I have a rooted phone, now that I've tried to use it they keep showing me adverts for it even though they won't let me use it :@
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: stop rooting your phone :)
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: xD
<Azelphur> it's funny because there's no real bonus to security anyway
<MartijnVdS> I've only unlocked my bootloader
<MartijnVdS> not rooted
<Azelphur> hehe, I need root :)
<SuperEngineer> Azelphur: stop trying to reply or feed them... danger will; robinson, Danger
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: coin mining eh
<Azelphur> SuperEngineer: xD
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: titanium backup / datasync / clocking / rom manager are a few reasons I use root :)
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: My data syncs with Google.. I don't need over/underclocking
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: I use stock ROM
<MartijnVdS> so.. meh :
<MartijnVdS> :)
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: you can auto sync app data with google?
<Azelphur> eg save games?
<MartijnVdS> games? on a phone?
<Azelphur> and a tablet
<MartijnVdS> some preferences are saved to google
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> not at all similar to datasync
<MartijnVdS> I don't have games.. other than Wordfeud which stores everything server-side
<Azelphur> :P
<SuperEngineer> did anyone else spot the major guff at the end of the F1 race commentary?
<penguin42> http://spectrum.ieee.org/robotics/industrial-robots/rethink-robotics-baxter-robot-factory-worker   nice robot  (running Linux apparently)
<SuperEngineer> "as the safety cars and fireworks explode above the track"
<SuperEngineer> good on ya Sid - RIP
<Azelphur> have we passed the point of no return for changes in 12.10 yet?
<penguin42> Azelphur: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QuantalQuetzal/ReleaseSchedule
<Azelphur> fun
<penguin42> Azelphur: So there are some freezes not for another week or two
<Azelphur> desktopinfrastructurefreeze, I assume that means we're stuck with the whole privacy leaking amazon thing now?
<penguin42> Azelphur: Looks like it, you can remove the package that does it
<Azelphur> yea, leaking privacy by default isn't my cup of tea though.
<popey> *sigh*
<penguin42> Azelphur: I agree
<Azelphur> popey: figured you'd have an alternate opinion, lets hear it :)
<penguin42> popey: But security doesn't seem to be on the agenda in any of the design, things like the default guest session (and not having a GUI way to disable it) are the same type of lack of thought
<popey> Nope. Been talked about over and over for the last 8 hours
<penguin42> apologies, that was intended for Azelphur:
<Azelphur> scrolled up a bit and perused over what you said :)
<Azelphur> I agree trusting the developers is one thing
<Azelphur> sending all my searches, unencrypted, to an advertiser, is a totally different one.
<popey> you're wrong
<popey> they aren't
<popey> but lets not let facts get in the way of a good mis-informed rant eh?
<Azelphur> according to the bug report I read that they are unencrypted *shrug*
<penguin42> Azelphur: It's anonymised somehow - it doesn't apparently go straight to Amazon
<popey> has 12.10 been released yet?
<Azelphur> popey: no, but the freeze is in place
<popey> so?
<Azelphur> so it's not going to change?
<popey> it can
 * Azelphur shrugs
<Azelphur> fair enough, I shall wait and see
<Azelphur> they have to send the search query to amazon eventually though, even if it is anonymous it's still not good.
<popey> not every search query
<Azelphur> how does it decide which to send and which not to send?
<penguin42> Azelphur: Agreed, although it's unlikely to reveal much in the query if you can't tell where it's from, but it is possible
<popey> if you search from the files lens, or applications lens it wont
<penguin42> Azelphur: Do you have the bug number for the unencrypted bug?
<popey> or many other lenses
<Azelphur> penguin42: sure it is, I've installed Ubuntu on machines owned by doctors that have patient records on their machines, leaking the file names would be totally illegal.
<popey> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-lens-shopping
<Azelphur> ah
<Azelphur> but the default, press the super button search still searches amazon?
<penguin42> Azelphur: Yes, agreed, although searching for JohnSmith but not knowing where it came from wouldn't let you know much; although JohnSmithSyphalisTestResults.odt might :-)
<Azelphur> penguin42: indeed, a lot of confidential stuff can be in a file name :)
<Azelphur> rofl
<Azelphur> "No obvious way to restrict shopping suggestions from displaying adult products"
 * Azelphur facepalms
<penguin42> Azelphur: What seems to be needed is a makeitsecure package that stops things like that, and guest logins and everything else like it
<popey> what's wrong with guest account?
<penguin42> popey: It's got more holes than a piece of swiss cheese
<popey> examples?
<popey> got bugs for example
<Azelphur> penguin42: stuff that sends any data to an advertising company needs to be opt-in by default :)
<Azelphur> is the simple crux of the matter xD
<penguin42> popey: No specifics, but it gives your machine all the classic holes that you can only normally do when logged in; any kernel or X bug can be triggered from it, which is something you tend not to be able to do from an unlogged in terminal
<Azelphur> physical access is always game over anyway
<Azelphur> tbh
<penguin42> Azelphur: Not if done properly
<Azelphur> penguin42: yes it is *picks up laptop and drops it out of a window*
<penguin42> Azelphur: That's why it's kingston locked to the desk
<Azelphur> xD
<penguin42> popey: The trivial (very very old school one), since Guest can do full screen windows is that it should be trivial to make a mock lightdm screen and ask for a password
<popey> probably wouldn't need to mock lightdm but actually _run_ lightdm :)
<penguin42> popey: Nod (we did something similar back in the terminal days at college on 1st Unix box we used :-)
<popey> yeah, me too
<popey> VT52 terminals connected to a Pr1me computer running Pr1mos
<penguin42> popey: The problem really is that there is very little chance of you exposing a bug at the login screen (unless you're SGI)
<penguin42> popey: Actually, a specific one - at the 'Remote desktop' registration login on 12.10 should you be able to get a terminal; it's just a Guest account, but it seems to be trying to stop doing things like that
<SuperEngineer> penguin42: Azelphur SuperEngineerSanityTestResults.odt you *would* want to see ;)
<Azelphur> :P
<penguin42> SuperEngineer: It's a very short file isn't it?
<SuperEngineer> penguin42: :D
<SuperEngineer> penguin42: shortest file on t'internet .. it says -bof-"not"-eof-.
<SuperEngineer> ...you should read the file from my own planet though.... much more detail ;)
<penguin42> SuperEngineer: Mostly not ?
<SuperEngineer> yup!
<penguin42> interesting, as a guest user I seem to be able to add an arbitrary new wired connection to network manager, visible to the real user
<penguin42> with an arbitrary MAC!
<penguin42> ahem!
<AlanBell> is that really bad?
<penguin42> AlanBell: It is if the mac address you pick is of something else on the network
<AlanBell> sounds mildly annoying
<penguin42> AlanBell: Would you expect a user logged into a guest account to be able to take down your whole network?
<SuperEngineer> hmm... DNT article ends "They [certain big companies] have said they will stop serving targeted ads but will still collect and store and monetize data."
<SuperEngineer> it's knock me over with a feather time... I'd never have guessed ;)
<SuperEngineer> so when your search data is sent to amazon on a totally free op sys...  perhaps we should consider the overall context?
<popey> they're on the network, surely someone could plug any random device into the same LAN port and effect the same issue penguin42
<penguin42> popey: I'm thinking of somewhere like a library or a school where the boxes/cabling ports might be physically secured
<popey> I would imagine such places wouldn't have a default install with guest enabled then
<penguin42> popey: It's a shame it's not made easy to disable
<popey> pfft, one file to edit _is_ easy
<popey> I would imagine a school/library have many other files they edit/deploy
<popey> I'd be more bothered if it _wasn't_ something easily editable in /etc
<popey> i.e. hard wired
<penguin42> sigh, people shouldn't need to go and hack about in config files to make their machine secure
<SuperEngineer> re my last: [as in, so far, all I've given Canonical is a pat on the back - so who was paying for my totally free op sys?]
<SuperEngineer> ...I'd rather the soft route than the criminal route provided by others
 * SuperEngineer has: said his bit, would prefer total privacy, can obtain it if needed, is a realist.... & shuts mouth
<pinky-> SuperEngineer, To live in reality is to understand you are connected to everything.
<penguin42> popey: I've logged that one as bug 1055068
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 1055068 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "Guest user can use arbitrary MAC addresses" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1055068
<popey> thanks penguin42
<SuperEngineer> pinky-: to live in my reality is to realise everything is connected to me
<SuperEngineer> ...phew, back to normal again
<SuperEngineer> [just realised just how philosophical that was]... sounds like a case of paranoia
<SuperEngineer> ok - who said that! I know you're watcin
<SuperEngineer> *watchin
<penguin42> popey: I'd be interested to know what is used to restirct /tmp and /proc from guest users, it's interesting
<SuperEngineer> The only normal pooter not known to the outside world has no in or out ports, is in a room more secure than fort knox and has no owner
<penguin42> Azelphur: At least searching for gimp doesn't bring up anything too unsurprising
<Azelphur> penguin42: xD
<popey> penguin42, yeah, it's quite cunning
<oimon1> afternoon, anyone had problems creating mp3s on rhythmbox in 12.04?
<oimon1> canont change settings for mp3.
<penguin42> popey: It could do with protecting /sys as well though, although I suspect that's a kernel issue
<oimon1> bug 945987
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 945987 in rhythmbox (Ubuntu) "No Settings are available in "Preferred format", only preset defaults are used" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/945987
<oimon1> i can't get my head around this :(
<oimon1> nobody else rip CDs anymore?
<balor> oimon1: use sound-juicer?  It's the default CD ripping app in Gnome
<oimon1> balor: sound juicer , rhymbox has the same problem. cannot change mp3 setings
<oimon1> /change/define
<balor> oimon1: It's in the preferences of sound-juicer
<oimon1> not for me,
<oimon1> are you on 12.04?
<balor> oimon1: No. Fedora 17 :)  Do you have the gstreamer mp3 plugin installed?
<oimon1> yes
<oimon1> they've broken something, i even downloaded the supposed fixed version and it's still broke :(
<brobostigon> suggestions, a calendar and contacts server, that will interface with android. ?
<oimon1> brobostigon: owncloud?
<brobostigon> oimon1: let me look, thank you.
<BigRedS> caldav?
<balor> brobostigon, I use zarafra
<brobostigon> balor: and BigRedS thank for those also.
<popey> oimon, leave a comment on the bug?
<popey> oimon, settings is greyed out for me, but I dunno if thats because i have no cdrom drive
<popey> Laney, set it verification done
<oimon1> popey: i'm not actually sure what the rhythmbox update should do
<popey> me either, will look into it once kids in bed
<oimon1> thx
<brobostigon> any suggestions that are in the ubuntu repos?
<popey> owncloud is super easy to setup
<brobostigon> it seems to have the calendaring, yes.
<brobostigon> popey: i will look again.
<mattt> brobostigon: exchange?
 * mattt lols
<brobostigon> haha
<penguin42> hehe stuff pops up in odd places; I'm reading a paper on brain imaging (slice and dice a brain, get your RNA expression from different bits) and it describes all the wacky bits of technology and stuff and then has 'sample locations were mapped from histology data into MR space using Inkscape'
<popey> heh
<BigRedS> Anyone know of a way of changing the number of workspaces in Quantal?
<Azelphur> BigRedS: can you not install compizconfig-settings-manager and do it from there?
<BigRedS> Azelphur: not that I can find. it used to be 'desktop size' or something, but I can't find anything related there
<Azelphur> if you've got ccsm, it should be in general options > desktop size
<BigRedS> Azelphur: Ta!
<BigRedS> That's hilariously hard to find
<BigRedS> I searched for 'Desktop' 'Size' and 'Desktop Size' and didn't get that
<Azelphur> :P
<brobostigon> why would ping result in the error, connect: Invalid argument
<brobostigon>  ?
<brobostigon> when the dns addr is correct.
<penguin42> not specifying the length or interface?
<penguin42> and it's definitely not a broadcast address?
<brobostigon> said device, only has one interface i am pingging from, my vps.
<penguin42> what type of vps is it ?
<brobostigon> debian.
<penguin42> but is it a kvm guest or something wackier?
<brobostigon> xen, and my dns is with gandi.
<penguin42> brobostigon: Odd
<brobostigon> penguin42: agreed.
<penguin42> brobostigon: Only type of thing I can think of would be something like a corrupt /etc/protocols or the like
<brobostigon> penguin42: let me pastebin it.
<brobostigon> penguin42: http://paste.debian.net/192285/
<penguin42> brobostigon: Looks normal - in particular the icmp line
<penguin42> anyway, got to go
<brobostigon> ok, thank penguin42
<brobostigon> thank you*
<zleap> ah hi tombrough
<Azelphur> Hmm, trying to debug my printer printing blank pages, it might be out of ink, but Ubuntu says "Marker levels are not reported for this printer", not sure if it's broken or just old or just needs new ink, xD
<Azelphur> It's a HP Deskjet F4180
<mgdm> I would get new ing
<mgdm> ink
<Azelphur> righto
<Azelphur> lol, just restarted the printer and it shows a big "E" in the LED and is flashing black and color ink symbols, that's fairly conclusive :)
<Azelphur> anyone know a good cheap place I might get ink for it, somewhere with next day delivery preferably? :)
<popey> i refilled my printer with ink just today
<popey> I'd never done the ink refill thing before, turned out eay
<popey> *easy
<Azelphur> haha, I have a feeling I'd be terrible at something like that and get ink everywhere
<Azelphur> I very rarely print too, this was a second hand printer and I've had about 2 years use out of it before it's ran out of ink, lol
<popey> http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0002ZOJTQ/ref=oh_details_o00_s02_i00
<Azelphur> cool
<popey> well, turns out wifey wanted to print a photo all big - A4
<popey> I said "we're out of ink", she wanted it printing NOW
<Azelphur> haha
<popey> So I dug that pack out, which I just looked in my orders for on amazon, turns out I bought it in August 2011, and never used it
<popey> that's how little ink I use
<popey> I expect to get it out again in another year
<Azelphur> fun
<popey> but honestly it was pretty easy
<popey> peel off the label, inject the ink, job done
<Azelphur> out of stock now though XD
<popey> only got a tiny bit on the desk :)
<Azelphur> hehe
<popey> maybe another one thats similar
<Azelphur> *shrug*
<popey> do you need colour?
<Azelphur> yea, and I have a feeling it will be more complex with my cartridges as it's one cartridge for all colors
<popey> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Just-Refill-Colour-Universal-Starter/dp/B0002ZOJUA/ref=sr_1_2?s=officeproduct&ie=UTF8&qid=1348436482&sr=1-2
<popey> in stock
<popey> same as mine
<popey> I had to do magenta, cyan and yellow
<Azelphur> cool
<popey> you get a bit of paper in the pack which has diagrams of every single printer cartidge
<Azelphur> not much cheaper than the cartridges though and I need to get it going, I got people waiting for me to ship stuff, and I can't print the shipping labels xD
<popey> with little arrows telling you where to inject, and how
<popey> it's actually really easy, and you know me, i hate doing manual stuff
<popey> oh it is cheaper
<Azelphur> yea
<popey> i only used a tiny bit of ink
<popey> like 3ml per colour
<Azelphur> oh good point, you get multiple goes out of it
<popey> yeah, loads
<popey> anyway, thats what i did today :)
<Azelphur> hehe :)
<popey> and my printer didn't explode \o/
<Azelphur> popey: http://image.made-in-china.com/2f0j00VCoEupbsbLqM/Ink-Cartridge-22-28-57-817-for-HP-.jpg
<Azelphur> reckon it will work with this though?
<Azelphur> because it's 3 inks in one cartridge, might not be so simple *shrug*
<popey> yeah, looks like mine
<Azelphur> my printer takes HP Ink 22 and HP Ink 21 if that's in your manual
<popey> whats the exact model number?
 * popey looks
<Azelphur> the printer itself is a HP Deskjet F4180
<popey> odd, hp 21 and 22 not listed
<Azelphur> https://www.dropbox.com/s/iydndc3vzb16dhe/2012-09-23%2022.44.49.jpg
<popey> but 20, 26, 29 and loads of others are
<Azelphur> It is quite an old printer, I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't work
<popey> under those labels are holes
<popey> you can peel them off safely
<popey> they re-stick
<Azelphur> suppose I'll peel a label off (nothing to loose xD)
<popey> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jdLVwRGkOM
<popey> refill hp 22 ^^
<popey> "very easy to refill"
<popey> :)
<popey> i think the 21 and 22 are the starter ones you get with the printer
<popey> low capacity
<Azelphur> probably
<Azelphur> also, this label is so not easy to get off xD
<popey> yeah
<popey> so your printer probably takes 20 and 26 or some other pair of numbers
<popey> which are the retail ones you can actually buy
<Azelphur> hmm, the color one has 5 fill ports o.O
<popey> ok, its 57 and 58 yours takes
<popey> yes, so does mine
<popey> watch that video
<popey> shows you
 * Azelphur is watching
<popey> right, 57 and 58 are listed on this thing
<Azelphur> seems simple enough
<Azelphur> will give it a go :)
<popey> i even found a nice little box to keep them in
 * popey is scanning in the leaflet
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> lol at Â£8.99 for next day shipping
<popey> http://popey.com/~alan/refill.jpg
<popey> some supermarkets have a refill station
<Azelphur> cool
<popey> you walk in and pay a couple of quid and some nutter does it for you
<popey> easy, no mess :)
<Azelphur> nice, doubt I have anything like that here though, I live in middle-of-nowhereville
<popey> no big supermarkets nearby? margate?
<Azelphur> we've got a tesco metro
<popey> ah
<Azelphur> we have a computer shop, me and my brother jokingly call it the come back on friday shop
<popey> tbh I used to think people who refilled printer cartidges were nut-jobs :)
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> there's only one guy who knows anything, and he works there on fridays, the rest of the people just tell you to come back on friday
<Azelphur> xD
<Azelphur> popey: btw, I already have ink all over my hands somehow
<Azelphur> xD
<popey> haha
<Azelphur> ordered that refill kit anyway, hopefully will get me back up and running again
<popey> cool
<Azelphur> :)
<popey> have you seen the continuous refill systems people make?
<popey> now _they_ are for nutters
<Azelphur> yea, I have haha
<Azelphur> indeed
<Danno_> is there an on screen keyboard on Lubuntu or do i need a 3rd party program for this?
<popey> i dont think lubuntu has a specific one
<popey> you could try onboard
<popey> maliit is another
<popey> and there's one I forget the name of.. one mo...
<popey> florence!
<Danno_> awesome, i was going a bit mad there. spent ages setting up my tablet only to discover i have no on-screen keyboard :-/
<popey> :)
<popey> have fun
 * popey goes to bed
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-16
<popey> http://aem1k.com/world/  nice
<ali1234> wat
<ali1234> impressive...
<olutayo> register adedayo1
<moodoo> morning all
<MartijnVdS> \o moodoo
<MartijnVdS> moodoo: where'd your captial M and D go?
<jussi> Ã¶/
<popey> morning!
<moodoo> MartijnVdS: ?
<MooDoo> i get ya
<MooDoo> MartijnVdS: better? ;)
<MartijnVdS> \o/
<MooDoo> MartijnVdS: if that's all you have to worry about on a monday, I wish I was in your shoes ;)
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<MooDoo> morning
<brobostigon> morning MooDoo
<jussi> hehe, I was watching an ultrabook review (sony viao pro 11) and it was saying "if you are looking for security components such as finger print reader and tpm chip, it has neither" - there I was thinking that was a good feature  :D
<MartijnVdS> Vaio, plastic.
<MartijnVdS> vaios come apart very easily from normal use
<popey> thats always been teh case
<popey> same for toshibas
<nigelb> hey, at least you don't get a shock randomly.
 * nigelb looks at macbooks.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Morning all
<MartijnVdS> \o TheOpenSourcerer
<jussi> anyone want to point me in the direction of a better option for an 11 inch ultrabook? (and if you say macbook air Ill shoot you :P :P )
<TheOpenSourcerer> Thing 2 sick after a weekend of football, hockey & partying.  Not bad for a 9 yr old...
<nigelb> jussi: did you already consider the carbon?
<jussi> nigelb: does it come in 11 inches?
<nigelb> Ah.
<popey> 11 inch is tiny!
<nigelb> I...err...nevermind.
<TheOpenSourcerer> fnar fnar..
<czajkowski> aloha
<jussi> popey: I currently use a 12" and love it. Its a great size when you are on the move
<jussi> Morning czajkowski
<jussi> (i have a latitude e4200,  geeting a bit long in the tooth now (3 years old), almost time for a new one)
<popey> I was going to suggest the dell xps 13 or the x1 carbon
<popey> both 13 though
<popey> and both have decent resolutions unlike most of the 11" devices
<jussi> popey: maybe, but the viao has 1920x1080, which is quite acceptable imho. that plus SSD, i7 and a few other things makes it look like an excellent offering. As people have mentioned, I worry about build quality...
<jussi> price of course is "sony like", but still, similar to similar offerings
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<AlanBell> morning all
<bigcalm> !rat
<bigcalm> Aww
<bigcalm> Pfft. My manipulation of lubotu3 is being limited
<jussi> bigcalm: you need more info for a factoid like that
<jussi> I can add it, but a link, some more info on its signifigance to the loco etc would be good
<bigcalm> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/2320-real-ale-train/ Ubuntu UK
<bigcalm> Ta :)
<bigcalm> jussi: it'll change from one year to the next
<jussi> bigcalm: so, compose something that reads nice and Ill add itr
<SuperMatt> another real ale train?
<SuperMatt> blimey!
<SuperMatt> oh, has anyone discussed the launch party yet?
<bigcalm> That's a point. We can celebrate Software Freedom Day while we're on the train ;)
<bigcalm> jussi: is that a better factoid?
<jussi> yep
<AlanBell> SuperMatt: I got as far as looking up the release date, which is October 17th
<jussi> [11:26:55] <jussi> !rat-#ubuntu-uk is <reply>The Real Ale Train. A yearly Ubuntu UK loco event to celebrate friends, trains and ale. 21st September 2013, Hampshire, UK: http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/2320-real-ale-train/
<jussi> [11:27:10] <ubottu> I'll remember that, jussi
<jussi> should sync across in about an hour
<jussi> !rat
<lubotu3> The Real Ale Train. A yearly Ubuntu UK loco event to celebrate friends, trains and ale. 21st September 2013, Hampshire, UK: http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/2320-real-ale-train/
<jussi> bit quicker than I thought :)
<bigcalm> jussi: grand. As long as we keep doing it each year, we'll need to update it now and then
<jussi> bigcalm: just make a new request each year. and remember the little bits I added (like the -#ubuntu-uk and the <reply> )
<bigcalm> Oh
<bigcalm> I see
 * bigcalm sets a calendar entry :D
<jussi> the -#ubuntu-uk part makes it specific to this channel
<bigcalm> But everybody should know about it!
<bigcalm> :P
<jussi> hehe
<SuperMatt> AlanBell: shall we discuss possible venues?
<SuperMatt> I think it should be a pub of sorts
<SuperMatt> preferably with beer
<bigcalm> Are there many pubs without beerage?
<SuperMatt> there are trendy wine bars
<bigcalm> That reminds me. Need to buy a ton of miniatures for Hayley to sneak onto the train. It's either that or we just buy them all from the train and deprive other non ale types
<bigcalm> SuperMatt: ah, ones that used to be banks?
<SuperMatt> http://www.gordonswinebar.com
<SuperMatt> like that
<SuperMatt> which is a very pleasant place to drink, despite being mega crowded 100% of the time
<bigcalm> Is "Thank you both." a legitimate use of English? It sounds weird when I type it
<jussi> hrrrm... is "bi-weekly"  twice a week or  once every 2 weeks ?
<SuperMatt> it's fine
<SuperMatt> I think bi weekly is twice a week
<bigcalm> jussi: twice a week. Fortnightly is every 2 weeks
<SuperMatt> because you're bisecting the week
<bigcalm> jussi: think of bi-annual : twice a year
<jussi> heh
<gordonjcp> aww, just missed a screengrab of my plane tracker with three planes in a row leaving Edinburgh showing different shades of yellow to indicate their position on the climbout
<SuperMatt> bigcalm: I don't think many people remember that
<bigcalm> AlanBell et al: shall we keep the RAT to October each year?
<gordonjcp> the BA and the Virgrim are turning south for Heathrow but the United Airlines is heading straight out, off across the pond ;-)
<SuperMatt> easiest way to remember what bi-weekly means: we already have a word for every two weeks, it's a fortnight
<bigcalm> Oops
<bigcalm> September even
<bigcalm> Which means planning in Julyish I think
<SuperMatt> ugg, using google to define it didn't help. Google says biweekly means both
<bigcalm> Just trying to work out when to make the calendar entry for
<bigcalm> Added it to 1st July, that'll do for now
<DJones> Hmmh, wind, rain, standing water on the roads, I think its time to get new tyres on the car before the weatehr gets any worse
<AlanBell> SuperMatt: yeah, venue suggestions welcome :)
<SuperMatt> well, I suggested the golden hinde/thames-side inn last time, that exhausts my knowledge of southbank locales
<AlanBell> bigcalm: october is good, but we don't have to keep it there exactly
<bigcalm> AlanBell: indeed. I've added a calendar entry for 1st July with the title "Organise RAT". So we can discuss it each time. Just hope people will want to keep doing it :)
<popey> July feels quite late
<bigcalm> April?
<JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Monday and happy International Day for the Preservation of the Ozone Layer! :-D
<jussi> bigcalm: why wouldnt people want to go on a train and drink alcohol? sounds perfect!
<bigcalm> JamesTait: have you got your head in the clouds?
<JamesTait> Ba-dum, tsch!
<bigcalm> joke.popey.com
<JamesTait> http://instantrimshot.com/
 * bigcalm is covered in graphite powered
<bigcalm> It comes out of the bottle more quickly than expected
<bigcalm> Just hope it was worth it and actually fixed the bathroom latch
<AlanBell> bigcalm: best time to organise it is when they announce the dates for the next year
<bigcalm> AlanBell: when is that?
<AlanBell> when they get round to it I think, I see that in 2009 the dates for 2010 went out to their mailing list in November
<AlanBell> generally around the end of the year they sort out the dates for the following year
<AlanBell> and sometimes they add additional dates during the year
<bigcalm> Oh, a mailing list you say?!
<AlanBell> http://www.watercressline.co.uk/product.php/10/real-ale-train-r-a-t
<AlanBell> sign up for newsletter, bottom right
 * bigcalm signs up for one more spam
<AlanBell> they don't appear to have done a specific "RAT DATES !!11!!" email for a few years
<bigcalm> "...you will receive our regular Watercress Line enewsletter with all of our latest news and events." I can't help but read that as E_newsletter
<MartijnVdS> errno = ENEWSLETTER
<mungbean> what does this mean?
<mungbean> "I send you the correct part # since i didn't have bundle to look at , I think I missed the this card is 8ports
<mungbean> from oracle support
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: Inglish?
<mungbean> i think they are sending either me a part or a part number.
<davmor2> Morning all
<bigcalm> Morning davmor2
<popey> http://jolla.com/media/documents/130916_press_release.pdf interesting
<popey> https://twitter.com/JollaHQ/status/379531060549132289/photo/1
<dwatkins> popey: I managed to finally install Ubuntu on my MacBook Pro, even got it running on a MicroSD card, too :D
<dwatkins> (with noatime, of course)
<popey> heh
<dwatkins> I have one of these adapters: http://theniftyminidrive.com/
<popey> and you have the OS on it?
<dwatkins> yeah, on a 64 GB MicroSD card in it
<popey> hah
<popey> surely thats megaslow?
<popey> and how do you boot from it?
<dwatkins> it was rather tricky for various reasons (creating a read/write USB image) and booting isn't so easy - had to create a 1 GB FAT32 partition with an EFI executable at the start of the MicroSD card with rEFIt in it to allow it to boot.
<dwatkins> it runs fine, surprisingly
<dwatkins> I'll do a write-up on my blog and let you know full details, links etc.
<dwatkins> here are my notes thus far with a couple links: http://hastebin.com/raw/paquqesepo
<dwatkins> I imagine if I upgraded to 13.10, the wireless driver would work without the need for the PPA.
<dwatkins> 13.04, I mean, probably best not to use the beta just yet on a Mac.
<neuro> does the trackpad work "properly"? i.e. two-finger scroll, pinch, etc
<neuro> (and in other news, morning all)
<mgdm> neuro: I tried my magic trackpad on Precise. Those things did work, but the gestures weren't recognised anywhere near so well
<neuro> like three finger swipe, etc
<mgdm> neuro: so you had to be a bit mechanical when using them. Might be better now, it's config rather than code
<mgdm> yeah, that did work, but you had to be 'precise' (arf)
<neuro> ho ho
<dwatkins> neuro: not yet, I have a few links to read which discuss pinching etc.
<neuro> shame
<dwatkins> also it seems to occasionally act as if I'd tapped somewhere else in a text field, not sure what I'm doing wrong there.
<neuro> would be nice if apple could spend a fraction of resource to do some drivers
<dwatkins> still, considering how long it's taken me to get this far, I was happy ;)
<neuro> but i guess they have other priorities ;)
<mungbean> any twiki users in here? need to add myself to the admin group via the CLI
<mungbean> since the admin login is not working
<Monotoko> anyone know of a web-based IRC client I can install on my server?
<mungbean> what do you mean?
<mungbean> web-based surely means not installed?
<mgdm> it'll need to run somewhere
<dwatkins> a webpage which provides an IRC client, so the HTML/PHP source is located on the server, I assume.
<neuro> freenode use http://www.qwebirc.org/
<Monotoko> mungbean: I mean for other people to use, from my Debian server
<Monotoko> I will obviously have to install it on the server
<davmor2> Monotoko: there is one on JUJU that is used in the ubuntu-on-air page not sure what it is called now was subway I think
<mungbean> ok, an web gateway for irc
<mungbean> like mibbit
<neuro> davmor2: ubuntu on air uses qwebirc as well
<neuro> yeah and there's mibbit as well
<Monotoko> yeah that kind of thing
<davmor2> Monotoko: ah ignore my suggestion then
<Monotoko> neuro: can I install mibbit or do I have to go through their servers?
<neuro> good point, no idea
<MartijnVdS> popey: Have you managed to get an 1.8" disk converter yet?
<mgdm> Monotoko: I'm pretty sure mibbit is a hosted service
<davmor2> https://jujucharms.com/fullscreen/search/?series=precise&text=irc&type=approved
<Dave2> CGI:IRC is the typical one
<Dave2> I'm sure there are other alternatives intended for people to host themselves, but I can't htink what
<DJones> Monotoko: I wonder whether asking #freenode about the web gateway they use might be an idea, if its open source, they may be able to point you towards something
<dwatkins> Unfortunately, CGI:IRC is often slow to update.
<DJones> Monotoko: Just looking the freenode web gateway is qwebirc
<Dave2> We use qwebirc, but I believe that's more aimed at networks running their own instance
<Dave2> I could be wrong
<diddledan> mornming
<diddledan> isnow
<dwatkins> I've always wondered about setting up ajaxterm, although I don't know what ports it needs open (and therefore whether it would be pointless if the reason to use cgi:irc is because ports for IRC and ssh are blocked)
<dwatkins> If I ever do get ajaxterm setup, I'll probably do it on my Raspberry Pi in a DMZ protected network to minimise the possibility of problems arising from a breach.
<diddledan> dwatkins: afaik ajaxterm works entirely over http
<dwatkins> diddledan: aha, that's good to know, thanks
<dwatkins> I cheated by putting my ssh port elsewhere, but that's another story
<popey> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ZTE-Open-powered-by-Firefox-OS-3G-unlocked-smartphone-orange-eBay-exclusive-/171123860758 back on sale
<diddledan> poo that's cheap
<diddledan> see what I did there instead of swearing? :-p
<popey> http://taras.net/first-impressions-of-the-zte-open-and-firefox-os
<MartijnVdS> it's also Nexus One-generation hardware, I guess?
 * dwatkins ponders how to embed an image or webpage from a server with a dynamic internal IP address without any control of the DHCP server
<dwatkins> so far I'm just loading a 1x1 pixel image from a system I do have access to, and manually checking the Apache log, but I'm sure there's an easier way
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: you could have it GET a simple CGI script and have that execute whatever you want
<gordonjcp> dwatkins: so you don't know the addres of the internal server, necessarily?
<dwatkins> gordonjcp: indeed, it's on wifi and renews its IP address periodically, so when I want to check the munin graph for temperature, I have to find out its IP address
<dwatkins> perhaps I can get it to register its hostname if I install Samba and join the domain from it, though
<diddledan> dwatkins: try it's-hostname.local
<popey> bah
<popey> 21879 root      20   0  179m  41m 1352 R  99.0  0.5 848:13.33 hp-setup
<diddledan> if it's got avahi then that'll work
<popey> wondered why my laptop was slow today
<Dave2> you didn't need that cPU core anyway
<popey> chromium using another one
<popey> kswapd the third
<popey> KiB Mem:   8056628 total,  6949820 used,  1106808 free,   139884 buffers
<dwatkins> diddledan: sadly it doesn't seem to have registered that, but perhaps if I set its domainname correctly, it might
<popey> KiB Swap:  8267772 total,  3433852 used,  4833920 free,  1461972 cached
<popey> â¹
<diddledan> 3.5 GiB used?
<diddledan> that's a heckofa swap usage
<popey> i imagine this could be worse
<popey> if I had a real disk and not ssd
<gordonjcp> dwatkins: does it put its hostname on the DHCP server?
<gordonjcp> dwatkins: or, slightly evil, can you give it a static IP address as an alias?
<TREllis> 6
<diddledan> 3
<TREllis> 2
<diddledan> 8
<popey> ah, facebook was eating a core
<MartijnVdS> always facebook
<dwatkins> gordonjcp: I'm not sure how to check it's sending its hostname to the server, although I might be able to find out from its dhclient logs, I guess
<dwatkins> gordonjcp: bingo! As Apache just told me: It works! :D thanks
<MartijnVdS> *\o/*\
<gordonjcp> dwatkins: simplest way would be to ping its hostname I guess
<dwatkins> gordonjcp: yeah, I just opened a browser to raspberrypi.corp.companyname.com and got the "It works!" page, so that'll do me for now.
<gordonjcp> dwatkins: cool
<mungbean> is there a twitter feed that just tells you the free amazon UK appstore app for the day?
<neuro> mv file1 file2 newdir/ = good
<neuro> mv file1 file2 = bad
<neuro> that's 30 minutes down the toilet
<diddledan> ouch
<diddledan> I hope you had backups of file2
<popey> \o/ backups
<ali1234> what is backups?
<diddledan> ali1234: backups is what you do to stop chinese workers jumping to their doom at an apple/foxconn factory
<diddledan> ali1234: (a safety net)
<neuro> diddledan: i only created file2 30 minutes prior, so rsnapshot's 4 hour rotation hadn't caught it yet
<diddledan> oh dear
<diddledan> poor chinese worker
<diddledan> see, neuro you killed a chinaman
<neuro> i know what i did, so it's pretty straightforward to reconstruct
<neuro> right, right
<popey> i wish i still had all the pascal programs I wrote in 1993
<popey> wish I'd backed those up
<diddledan> popey: I have loads of various bits and pieces that I've lost over the years
<neuro> i'm pretty sure a php script to pull blog metadata related to specific franchisees based on a command line parameter had a deliterious effect on the mental health of a chinese electronics worker
<diddledan> usually through thinking I've got it backed up elsewhere than the backup I'm overwriting
<popey> I went to a pub once and a guy came up to me, he'd been at school with me. Said he found some tapes in the loft, they were spectrum tapes.
<popey> One of them had a game on I'd written in ~1984
<diddledan> \o/
<neuro> popey: i still have all my turbo pascal and think pascal stuff from college / uni (93-94) on floppies somewhere
<mgdm> Turbo Pascal was awesome
<popey> Also! I want all the code I did at college
<mgdm> it fit on a floppy, too
<popey> InfoBasic on Vax
<popey> nope, infobasic was on Pr1meOS
<neuro> man, what cheapskate college did you go to? :)
<MartijnVdS> I have my very first GW-BASIC programs from the early 90s (late 80s?) somewhere tool
<MartijnVdS> too
 * neuro did C at college on an IBM RS/6000
<popey> used to love the Pr1me
<neuro> pascal on IBM P/S2s
<mgdm> the first Pascal I did was n an archimedes
<diddledan> thanks for making me feel young again :-p (well, younger than you lot, anywho)
<neuro> a3000?
<neuro> diddledan: get off my lawn
<MartijnVdS> I just found my 1993-era history notes.. all made in WordPerfect 5.1
<diddledan> lol
<popey> I got my pascal compiler (and taught myself) from a shareware catalog
<mgdm> neuro: A310
<popey> on a 5.25" floppy in the post
<neuro> wp5.1 \o/
<neuro> mgdm: ooh posh
<popey> wonder what text editor I used
<MartijnVdS> neuro: converting those files to something modern was HARD
<diddledan> I used wordstar for most everything when I was on dos
<mgdm> neuro: actually, a bit of both
<MartijnVdS> diddledan: ah, you're a joe user then ?:P
<diddledan> MartijnVdS: you'd think so, but I'm converted to nano now
<MartijnVdS> diddledan: *shudder*
<neuro> that's just as bad
<neuro> give me vim or give me death
<diddledan> I can do vi in small doses for simple edits
 * MartijnVdS gives neuro emacs
<diddledan> but anything complex I get lost
 * neuro dies
<popey> this was in DOS
<popey> I may have just used some shareware editor
<popey> I miss the days of having a A5 size catalog come through the post
<MartijnVdS> popey: MS-DOS 5.0's built-in "edit.com"
<popey> this was way before 5.0 i think
 * neuro used whatever fancy editor came with dos 5.x
<MartijnVdS> which was a thin wrapper around the qbasic executable
<neuro> that's the one
<neuro> although turbo pascal's IDE was epic
 * mgdm prints out the dpkg database and mails it to popey 
<popey> hah
<MartijnVdS> and before that.. some IBM editor my dad used to use
<neuro> on the RS/6000, /me just used vi
<MartijnVdS> and, looking back on it, he might have used it because it reminded him of the one at work (where he wrote COBOL)
<neuro> god, yeah, i did cobol on that RS/6000 too
<MartijnVdS> you.. COBOLed it together?
<neuro> ba dum tsh
<popey> oh, 1988 I got my epson pc
<neuro> posh git
<popey> well
<popey> i chopped in a 464 for it
<popey> 350 quid
<popey> bought from a liquidated company
 * neuro was still rocking a speccy+ back then
<popey> never ended up paying them, they never invoiced me (yay)
<neuro> 350 quid when i was 14 would still have been a smegload
<neuro> lol
<popey> came with an Epson LQ-550 printer
<popey> which was pretty awesome
<neuro> actually, i'm trying to remember when i got my spectrum +3
<popey> I started writing a "timeline of my life" doc, because otherwise I forget
 * bigcalm ponders buying a Nexus 4
<neuro> oh, spec+3 was summer '87
<neuro> and i got mine that xmas
<neuro> so in 1988 i must have been rocking the +3
<bigcalm> I put Android 4.3 back on my Galaxy Nexus and gave it to my dad
<popey> October 1987, First issue of ACE magazine
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: wait a month, get a N5
<popey> I remember drooling over that mag
<neuro> yeah, i bought a few copies
<popey> screenshots of R-Type
<bigcalm> MartijnVdS: it'll only be for testing Ubuntu Touch stuff
<popey> s/testing/writing/
<bigcalm> MartijnVdS: I'm happy with my SGS3 and don't want to have a new every day phone
<bigcalm> popey: erm, yeah, that one :)
<MartijnVdS> popey: We had a Panasonic KX-P1080i (1080i!)
<bigcalm> I think my Dad was quite pleased to go from my old Nexus One with CM7.2 to a Galaxy Nexus with Android 4.3
<diddledan> MartijnVdS: I think I had one of those
<MartijnVdS> https://panasonic.ca/PCS/OperatingInstructions/KXP1080i.pdf
<MartijnVdS> the number of times I read that!
<MartijnVdS> And as a 10-year old I didn't understand the bit pattern stuff :|
<diddledan> yup that's the one we had
<diddledan> I've never read the manual tho
<MartijnVdS> diddledan: I was mistified by the "bit image" parts
<MartijnVdS> (I was just learning English, AND programming, at the same time..)
<diddledan> I was thinking about reading that and then realised it's 111 pages long, so I closed the browser
<neuro> oh good, my kimsufi box in canada has fallen over
<neuro> there goes my tertiary nameserver, some websites and my parents' imap mailboxes
<diddledan> \o/
<neuro> and it's back up
<neuro> let's see if it was actually down
<neuro> uptime 7 minutes
<neuro> oh good
<diddledan> sounds like they killed it
<neuro> yep
<neuro> smeg all in the logs
<neuro> it wasn't a panic
 * neuro hugs pingdom, at least that worked as expected
<diddledan> go and moan at their ticketing system :-p
<neuro> cba
<diddledan> hopefully you've not got any corruption
<neuro> nah. looks ok
<diddledan> sounds like they just pulled the plug which isn't healthy
<neuro> nice clean startup
<MartijnVdS> Anyone interested in old computers, http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01hlkcq
<MartijnVdS> in 20 minutes on BBC Four
<MartijnVdS> doesn't get much older than that
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: seen it before, it has been on before.
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: yeah, but maybe some other people haven't :)
 * MartijnVdS looks at popey 
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: yep, :)
<diddledan> don't you hate when a client tells you they've done what you told them to do and then you get them to send you a file which they're supposed to have updated but when you inspect it you find they didn't do what you told them to do?!
<ali1234> diddledan: no, i don't care because i bill hourly, it's more money for me when they do that
<diddledan> lol
<zleap> ali1234, :)
<diddledan> the thing is we're supposed to have finished this project but they keep complaining "it doesn't look the same as on the test site"
<ali1234> yeah i'd just send the screenshots at that point
<zleap> i need to start charging for stuff,  can't afford to buy a new printer atm,  and costs are mounting printing resources etc
<MartijnVdS> zleap: but, if you can't afford a printer, you can't print invoices, and you can't get paid
<MartijnVdS> zleap: so you're already beyond the help event horizon
<zleap> this isn;t for business etc,  i can claim more expenses, as a volunteer
<bigcalm> mgdm: ping
<mgdm> bigcalm: pong
<bigcalm> mgdm: having an un-fun time with php sessions, I think. AJAX on a site makes a call that takes several seconds to complete. During that time, the website won't process any more requests from the users' web browser.
<dwatkins> diddledan: I find that numbered bullet points help in those situations
<bigcalm> mgdm: what's weird is that this is the case in dev and production envs, both running Ubuntu 12.04. But it's not the case in test which is running Debian 6
<bigcalm> mgdm: is it something that you've had to deal with in the past? I'm trying to get multiple requests processed at the same time but really at a loss
<bigcalm> I wonder if it's something to do with session.save_path
<mgdm> bigcalm: that really is odd
<mgdm> bigcalm: where are you storing your sessions?
<bigcalm> mgdm: my boss set up the test server. He has this weird habbit of symlinking the cli and apache php.ini files
<mgdm> that's not a good idea, but shouldn't really cause a proble
<bigcalm> mgdm: dev and prod both say "/var/lib/php5". test says "no value"
<mgdm> OK, so built-in thing then
<bigcalm> Wondering if this is a PHP or Apache problem
<mgdm> bigcalm: http://thwartedefforts.org/2006/11/11/race-conditions-with-ajax-and-php-sessions/
<bigcalm> :O
<diddledan> bigcalm: are you using zend framework 1?
<bigcalm> diddledan: no, Symfony2
<diddledan> I just noted you were having issues with sessions and we've come up against an issue with zend framework 1 and php5.4 causing complete breakage that zend won't fix because framework 1 is obsolete
<diddledan> thankyou zend for not providing an upgrade path
<diddledan> >.<
<bigcalm> I'm guessing that zf1 is to zf2 as sf1 is to sf2
<bigcalm> _completely_ different
<diddledan> yup
<diddledan> it wouldn't be so bad if they were going to maintain zf1 for the forseeable with regards to security holes, but they've just completely dropped it
<diddledan> they gave about 9 months notice that zf1 would disappear entirely with a message such as "rewrite your entire application to zf2 because we don't care about zf1" - so instead we're rewriting our application in ruby-on-rails
<bigcalm> This must be the 1st time I've used a 3 way compare in Meld :)
<diddledan> zo/
<diddledan> erm.. is that a swan impression on my part?
<bigcalm> How does one run 'php -i' but with the apache php.ini from the CLI?
<bigcalm> Heh
<mgdm> bigcalm: php --help will tell you
<bigcalm> I could just run it in a web browser and copy/paste
<bigcalm> PitA though
<diddledan> bigcalm: -c
<diddledan> -c /etc/php5/apache2/php.ini
<bigcalm> diddledan: aha, that's it, ta
<diddledan> or simular
<Azelphur> Does anyone know of a MPX compatible WM?
<Azelphur> doesn't have to have anything fancy at all, short of being happy with MPX.
<diddledan> Azelphur: wiki says mpwm
<Azelphur> fun :)
<bigcalm> mgdm: I'm going to propose a change to the project so that issuing a command puts the job into the background (we use a queue for everything any way) and then make occasional ajax calls to check in on the progress of the job
<mgdm> that works
<bigcalm> It also means that I can display something like "4 of 22 items updated" rather than one success or fail message at the end
 * bigcalm celebrates with King's Ginger
<popey> oof http://blog.novatech.co.uk/post/2421/important-store-announcement/
<bigcalm> popey: who?
<popey> you don't know novatech?
<mgdm> I've heard the name, but nothing beyond that
<AlanBell> they sell laptops without operating systems
<AlanBell> we bought one, online I haven't been to the store
<bigcalm> I see
<mungbean> haven't heard much about novacut for a while
<mungbean> maybe after i stopped reading omg
<popey> the guy who works on it now has a job
<popey> so has less time to work on it
<popey> he works at System76
<mungbean> ah
<popey> i guess novatech only have places down south
<mungbean> gabe newell at linuxcon http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gzn6E2m3otg#t=86
<mungbean> reiterates that "linux is the future of gaming"
<directhex> he's not a great speaker
<popey> just what I was thinking
<popey> so, steambox next week then?
<bigcalm> Portal 3, HL 3?
<bigcalm> I'd settle for Portal 2 on linux for now
<AlanBell> anyone want to have a play with my latest project? http://exceptionalemails.com
<AlanBell> #join #juju
<AlanBell> gosh, this IRC thing, when will I learn how it works
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-17
<diddledan> :-p
<AlanBell> morning all
<MartijnVdS> \o
 * AlanBell sees that someone has been using exceptionalemails.com \o/
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: Could you add a (useful) <title>? My IRC robot on another network doesn't like title-less pages ;)
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: (it works fine, but it says "[ No title. ]")
<MartijnVdS> hmm.. it HAS a title
<MartijnVdS> seems like I have to "educate" my bot
<TheOpenSourcerer> typo in the FAQ AlanBell "you will only get alerts you have asket for. "
<AlanBell> MartijnVdS: erm, yeah, looks fine to me, but let me know if something is wrong with it
<AlanBell> TheOpenSourcerer: fixed
<TheOpenSourcerer> Although have to say "asket" sounds quite a nice word...
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: nah apparently $bot is confused by HTML5
<TheOpenSourcerer> AlanBell: Should link to github here I think: "The code for the site is available on GitHub under the AGPL3 licence"...
<AlanBell> linked it now
<TheOpenSourcerer> No mention of Libertus Solutions anywhere? Deliberate?
<AlanBell> erm, that was in the footer
<TheOpenSourcerer> The sign up box would look nicer if there was a bit of padding.
<AlanBell> where the +1 button was for a bit, until I deleted that . . . and everything else in the footer
<TheOpenSourcerer> lol
<TheOpenSourcerer> And the login box
<TheOpenSourcerer> So the inputs and labels line up with the headings
<AlanBell> yeah, I will look up the bootstrapish way to do that
<AlanBell> padding fixed, I was missing the panel-body div
<TheOpenSourcerer> :-D
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<MooDoo> morning morning
<SuperMatt> morning
<mungbean> the irc dawn chorus
<DJones> Should that be the IRC yawn chorus :)
 * TheOpenSourcerer thinks of Bagpuss
<mungbean> i wasn't until i got married that i realised i do a massive wookiee yawn when i wake up each day
<JamesTait> Good morning all, happy US Constitution Day! :-D
<MooDoo> morning james
<DJones> JamesTait: I read that as Constipation day, I wondered if it was Will Smith's new film
<JamesTait> I don't think there's be anything happy about that, DJones. ;)
<DJones> Heh
<dutchie> morning
<mungbean> 1991 â The first version of the Linux kernel (0.01) is released to the Internet.
<mungbean> 17 september according to wikipedia
<MooDoo> DJones: i wouldn't watch it, it's sh** :)
<mungbean> MooDoo: its quite slow moving
<MooDoo> mungbean: he just needs to get a move on and push it out.
<mungbean> this is where the fact i learned off reddit helps
<mungbean> probably more of a pub chat though
<DJones> Anyway, Its a new movie, It hasn't come out yet
<DJones> And on that note, I'll leave that conversation behind
<DJones> mungbean: Went down and picked that puppy up on Saturday
<mungbean> DJones: cool. is it still a puppy?
<DJones> Yep This was his first meeting with our dog this morning http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=vkEkgtIjgN0
<popey> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MITS-ALTAIR-8800-Rare-Museum-Condition-Computer-Intel-C8080A-CPU-S-223399-/151104111148?
<popey> zoiks
<bigcalm> popey: tempted?
<bigcalm> I bet Ron from Wolves LUG would love it
<AlanBell> "but does it run Ubuntu?" "Imagine a beowulf cluster of . ." etc. etc.
<popey> no, i was tempted by something else they had for sale
<bigcalm> AlanBell: it's weird that the Beowulf comment is still used
<MooDoo> bigcalm: why wierd?  just coz it's a old term?
<bigcalm> MooDoo: just surprised that it's still used. Only relevant to those of us who knew of it in the late 90s / early 2000s
<popey> it's a meme, memes often outlive their useful life
<bigcalm> Best thing since sliced bread?
<AlanBell> bigcalm: it is a bit of an "I am old in internet years" kind of phrase
<popey> I am 12 and what is this.
<bigcalm> AlanBell: yus
<mungbean> have they stopped doing those stupid memes on slashdot yet?
<AlanBell> first post!!11!
<mungbean> in soviet russia/beowulf/etc
<bigcalm> I wouldn't know. Haven't looked at /. since the early 2000s :)
<mungbean> i realised i've stopped reading stuff that i used to read
<mungbean> and haven't replaced it with anything else
<bigcalm> Don't read the comments!
<dwatkins> never read the comments
<AlanBell> wonder if http://exceptionalemails.com could withstand a slashdotting. I suspect it probably could.
<MartijnVdS> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Microsoft-Windows-3-1-Operating-System-5-1-4-Disk-Package-NIB-Never-opened-/151084863909?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item232d5c11a5 -- about the same price as Windows 8 Retail 8-)
<bigcalm> AlanBell: shameless plug :)
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: I've already sent it to a few people who might find it useful :)
<dwatkins> MartijnVdS: and the same functionality? ;)
<AlanBell> bigcalm: yup ;)
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: Windows 3.1, so yes
<bigcalm> I do hope nobody brings a laptop to the RAT. Phones are expected. Not sure about tablets though
<AlanBell> wonder if popey will bring a battery powered remotely operateable webcam
 * bigcalm expects popey to be pimping Ubuntu Touch ;)
<TheOpenSourcerer> popey: is *always* pimping something ;-)
<popey> AlanBell: haha maybe
<popey> will AlanBell have a device I can tether to?
<AlanBell> popey: sure
<brobostigon> good morning everyone,
 * TheOpenSourcerer will be in Italy and expecting to see some posts on twitter/G+
<popey> not sure how we could get images out of the camera to the web though
<bigcalm> There will be plenty of photos :)
<popey> i have a crontab which wgets from my webcam at home
<popey> if you had a fixed IP or dynamic dns hostname on your phone we could do the same
<bigcalm> That could be arranged
<AlanBell> the camera does ddns, however I think the phone might get a nat IP address
<bigcalm> Yep
<bigcalm> Would need to relay it to another host I think
<popey> hm
<popey> unless your phone does upnp â»
<AlanBell> well I don't think the network does it's bit of upnp
<Monotoko> anyone want to help me with some terrible perl code that any perl programmer would probably murder me for?
<popey> bigcalm loves perl
 * bigcalm hisses at popey
<Monotoko> bigcalm will probably kill me then
<Monotoko> :P
<Monotoko> basically this works when I don't send the email, when I add the sendmail line it fails saying no recepiants: http://pastebin.com/F0maJWZ4
<AlanBell> popey: my ssh client on the phone can do port forwarding, so I can probably forward a port from the camera to one of my servers
<Monotoko> even though I know there's a value in Emails[1]
<bigcalm> Monotoko: I haven't used perl in anger for a very long time. Somebody else will be of better help I'm sure
<Monotoko> bigcalm: no worries :p I understand the anger
<Monotoko> I daren't go to #perl to ask because they will just slaughter me for the shoddy code :(
 * popey points Monotoko at MartijnVdS â»
<popey> He's a Perlvert.
<bigcalm> Some channels are more polite than others. Never go to #perl on efnet
<bigcalm> Or on dalnet
<Monotoko> ohh lord I hate dalnet...
<Monotoko> ahhh #perl was actually helpful \o/
<SuperMatt> /o\
<MartijnVdS> hmmm? :)
<MartijnVdS> I'd try #london.pm on irc.perl.org for Perl questions
<mungbean> wow, gta5 gameplay looks slick
<dvrr> Hiiiiii
<mungbean> http://www.theguardian.com/technology/video/2013/sep/17/gta-v-first-heist-playthrough-video
<dvrr> MooDoo
<diddledan_> dvrr, moodoo to yoo too :-p
<diddledan_> (I know MooDoo is a person, I'm just being facetious)
<mungbean> poor MooDoo , his screen must be lighting up like a chrimstas tree
<diddledan_> :-)
<dvrr> i have problem vnc server   configuration please help me
<dvrr> popey
<dvrr> failed to load session gnome classic vnc cerver
<MooDoo> sorry can't see so bright....
<mungbean> holidays are coming...
<popey> dvrr: ?
<mungbean> MooDoo is having a near death experience
<MooDoo> glad i'm on hols in a few weeks.
<AlanBell> !rat this weekend \o/
<lubotu3> AlanBell: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<mungbean> me too, but i'm not glad that summer has ended
<AlanBell> !rat | this weekend \o/
<lubotu3> this weekend \o/: The Real Ale Train. A yearly Ubuntu UK loco event to celebrate friends, trains and ale. 21st September 2013, Hampshire, UK: http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/2320-real-ale-train/
<mungbean> what sort of train?
<MooDoo> I might have to plan for this event next year
<MooDoo> steam train
<AlanBell> mungbean: a choo choo train
<mungbean> woo
<popey> choo choo indeed
<mungbean> waiting for the day i have a house big enough to buy a hornby set
<dvrr> popey:failed to load session gnome classic vnc cerver
<davmor2> Morning all
<MooDoo> morning davmor2
<mungbean> is there another way to read yahoo groups that doesn't invole their hideously slow interface?
<mungbean> worst thing ever
<popey> Nearly noodles time!
<MartijnVdS> His Noodliness?
<davmor2> MooDoo: how's life, how's photography?
<MooDoo> davmor2: good, it's going ok, got a few shoots lined up, but really need to thinking about career changes, so it's a little on the back burner
<popey> \o/ career changes
<popey> nearly 2 years since I logged into a SAP system \o/
<MooDoo> still want to work in the same sorta thing support/team leader but 7 years is a long time :d
<popey> indeed!
<mungbean> scary that i'm not even half way through my career yet
<popey> I did SAP for uhm... 14 years
<popey> 1997-2011
<MooDoo> i've been working with computers for 25 years :S
<MooDoo> make that 22
 * popey checks
<MooDoo> popey: you'll remember these, I first did a YTS with IBM :)
<popey> \o/ 23
<MooDoo> lol :)
<mungbean> when i was at school i aclways thought i'd work for IBM
<MooDoo> we are around the same age popey :)
<popey> yeah
<mungbean> who wears glasses?
<MooDoo> me
<mungbean> my eyesight seems ok still
<popey> nope
<popey> not had eyes checked for a couple of years
<mungbean> evxcept for dizzy spells, probably unrelated
<brobostigon> any opinions on how effective or lack thereof, automatic screen brightness adjustment has on battery life?
<mungbean> brobostigon: it certainly eats faster than permanently low, but thats stating the obvious
<mungbean> but is noticeable
<MartijnVdS> Auto brightness is a LOT better than always-full though
<MartijnVdS> or always-middle
<brobostigon> mungbean: quite.
<popey> i am not so sure
<mungbean> i use it for convenience
<popey> when i see the computer dim i nudge the mouse to wake it, instinctively
<popey> so making it worse â»
<MooDoo> i always use full brightness, then again I don't really use my laptop unplugged
<mungbean> also, the lowest brightness on auto brightness, is not as dim as manual lowest brightness
<brobostigon> i havent used it, but my gf asked me about it last night, and i thought, i may aswell ask.
<mungbean> oh woops i was talking about phones
<mungbean> my laptop one doesn't seem to work
<MooDoo> I always seem to login then have to up the brightness
<brobostigon> ok, thank you everyone,
<mungbean> i had to move the bongo.ogg file recently so disable the greeting bongos :(
<mungbean> bug is on launchpad - cannot disable it
<popey> can't recall last time I heard it
<popey> surely you can uninstall the sound theme?
<mungbean> maybe. it's a shared machine and the bongoes would end up at full volume since the mute setting wasn't remembered for the lightdm page
<popey> ubuntu-sounds is the package
<mungbean> the doctors surgery won't vaccinate my son because the sessions are only in the afternoon when he has pre-school
<mungbean> nice
<dvrr> popey:
<popey> dvrr: ?
<dvrr> i have small problem
<popey> mungbean: can't you take him out of pre-school for the vacc?
<mungbean> its gonna be his first week
<mungbean> so rather disruptive
<popey> my son had a hospital appointment on his first week
<mungbean> the vaccination is an oral spray , and is rather expensive. so i suspect their inflexibility will keep costs down
<mungbean> in the short term of course
<directhex> my son had all vaccinations to date in his own home, carried out by a team of 3
<mungbean> wow
<mungbean> that doesn't sound like the UK
<directhex> all it cost us was a few vials of human blood
<TheOpenSourcerer> Our kids' vaccinations were all done at the local GP surgery... 5mins walk from our house.
<TheOpenSourcerer> And paid for by the NHS
<mungbean> http://metro.co.uk/2013/09/15/not-funny-creepy-clown-lingers-on-streets-of-northampton-in-middle-of-the-night-4012455/
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: hahaha :)
<mungbean> tesco are releasing an android tablet.
<MartijnVdS> so they can target ads better?
<mungbean> tie in with blinkbox etc
<mungbean> predicted price is Â£99
<TheOpenSourcerer> My 9 yr old has just gathered enough dough to buy a Nexus 7...
 * TheOpenSourcerer slightly envious as I have an original Galaxy Tab 10.1
<mungbean> my mrs has a galaxy tab (1 or 2, unsure), and v nice indeed
<mungbean> except for the oily patch on teh screen
<popey> sophie saved up for an ipod touch
<popey> we got her an iphone 4 in the end, as a friend was getting rid of it
<TheOpenSourcerer> Monty wanted 16G and moar screen that the Nexus 4...
<popey> yeah, i nearly convinced sophie to have a nexus 4
<mungbean> looking at websites for linka modelling, it's like entering an archive.org timewarp
<mungbean> i forgot web pages used to look like this
<TheOpenSourcerer> mungbean:  http://www.lingscars.com/
<mungbean> ow ow ow
<TheOpenSourcerer> lol
<MartijnVdS> ling-scars?
<diddledan_> TheOpenSourcerer: full-stop/period. that is all.
<diddledan_> in other words: you're an evil evil person
<TheOpenSourcerer> That is a very popular website amazingly.
<diddledan_> I suppose the question must arise as to why you would frequent such a site?
<MartijnVdS> diddledan_: for the music
<MartijnVdS> (of course)
<TheOpenSourcerer> To geta good deal on car leasing presumably
<TheOpenSourcerer> OMG - Just seen some of popey's music choices.. Hmmm. Boney M.
<MooDoo> lol
<TheOpenSourcerer> http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BUXa4QMCUAAzk7z.png:large
<popey> I scrolled down to hide some of it
<TheOpenSourcerer> ha
<popey> note the A's aren't there
<TheOpenSourcerer> Abba?
<popey> ya
<MartijnVdS> popey: A*Teens?
<popey> ya
<TheOpenSourcerer> That's OK - I was a paid up fan club member
<popey> i fail
<popey> hahah
<TheOpenSourcerer> Had posters and everything
<popey> I am impressed. MTP works better on my nexus 4 running ubuntu than it ever did under android!
<MartijnVdS> Aqua?
<popey> no
<MartijnVdS> Ace of Base?
<popey> â»
<MartijnVdS> popey: Boney M. is still on there though.
 * MooDoo can't say anything having just puchased the latest 80's albumn :)
<popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6119347/
<TheOpenSourcerer> Jackson 5 (eeeww)
<MartijnVdS> MooDoo: http://open.spotify.com/user/martijnvds/playlist/4sXUFBP520n3SC2o8bg0TF  -- "So 80s it hurts"
<TheOpenSourcerer> Where is Flock of Seagulls?
<diddledan_> I just bought yesterday a compilation of "100 80's classics"
<MartijnVdS> so, you want to be hurt by the 80s? :)
<davmor2> diddledan: had that ages ago :D
<TheOpenSourcerer> Surprised there was no "5 Star" on popey's list either.
 * davmor2 remembers he is a virgin user so has a free premium spotify account and logs in to listen to MartijnVdS so 80's it hurts playlist
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: hah, my ISP pays for premium spotify as well :)
<popey> davmor2: virgin users have free spotify?!
<popey> why am I paying!
<MartijnVdS> http://store.virginmedia.com/bundles/spotify.html
<MartijnVdS> ?
<MartijnVdS> https://support.spotify.com/uk/problems/#!/article/How-do-I-activate-my-Virgin-subscription ?
<popey> poffft
<popey> 3 months free?
<popey> oh, virgin _mobile_
<davmor2> popey: I just got via email so clicked on the link :D
<popey> yeah, just found the mail, 3 months only
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: does it hurt yet? :)
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: no I know tracks that aren't on it and they play in my head all the time, this is quite soothing ;)
<dwatkins> wow, it really is difficult to explain IRC to people used to only using direct messaging
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: there's also a 90s list
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: "it's like big group texts", is "Whatsapp" known there?
<dwatkins> MartijnVdS: I mean the way that we use it here and in my last job to talk about stuff without everyone necessarily having to read everything
<dwatkins> e.g. hilighting when you're having a conversation with one person, MartijnVdS
<diddledan_> dwatkins, I always liked the term "multiplayer notepad"
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: ah, yeah that can confuse people
<dwatkins> they seem to think it's disruptive, that you'll constantly have to read the channel and put up with it alerting you to new messages
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: weird
<diddledan_> I tend to not take much notice of things in IRC
<MartijnVdS> diddledan_: unless we mention you
<dwatkins> MartijnVdS: exactly, especially as I use IRC here and in various other places all the time ;)
<diddledan_> I might occasionally look as in just now
<dwatkins> diddledan_:  me neither, unless I'm bored or on the phone ;)
<dwatkins> ...or want to rant...
<mungbean> irc = chat room ?
<MartijnVdS> but..G+ is for rants
<davmor2> diddledan: I'm pretty sure we should all be offended by the fact that you pay little attention to us ;)
<diddledan_> IRC = text-mode google hangouts
<diddledan_> lol
<dwatkins> mungbean: I mean the concept of having an internal IRC server within a company and having rooms for certain subjects, be they "sales" vs "engineering" or specific applications, products etc.
<dwatkins> they get the idea of a chat room, just not how it can be useful for work
<dwatkins> I spent 10 years at a company which uses IRC internally to great effect within the support and engineering departments
<dwatkins> (granted, sales rarely turned up there)
<MartijnVdS> sales want lync here
<MartijnVdS> weird MS people
<MartijnVdS> MS-using people*
<davmor2> dwatkins: just tell them, it's the voices in their head on the screen ;)
<dwatkins> I was really hesitant to use MSN for anything work-related, but I assume Lync has the option of you installing an internal chat server
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: it does, integrates with AD and exchange and everything
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: closed protocol though
<dwatkins> davmor2: yeah, sometimes quite literally - I've supported people before for products I barely know, by talking to someone on IRC to get enough info at the time the customer called
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: (well, SIP-ish, but not quite)
<mungbean> sales/marketing/numpties tend to ask for product name instead of describing the problem
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: yeah, exactly
<mungbean> "we want sharepoint". no you dont
<MartijnVdS> "But the MS salesman told me I did"
<Seeker`> irony? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-24127999
<MooDoo> oh dear
<popey> any regex people about?
<popey> in a bash script I need to pluck a string out from a line..
<popey> e.g. return LocalStorage.openDatabaseSync("karmaMachine", "1.0", "StorageDatabase", 1000000);
<popey> I need to get the name of the database (in this case karmaMachine)..
<dutchie> \("(\w+)"
<dutchie> sed -e 's/\("(\w+)"/\1'
<dutchie> or possibly: sed -e 's/return LocalStorage.openDatabaseSync\("(\w+)"/\1'
<dutchie> oh and put a closing / on
<popey> heh
<popey> is this version 0.1?
<popey> â»
<dutchie> :P
<popey> can't seem to correct that
<dutchie> how about:
<dutchie> grep 'return LocalStorage.openDatabaseSync' | sed -e 's/\("(\w+)"/\1/'
<dutchie> oh the backslashes are the wrong way round
<dutchie> grep 'return LocalStorage.openDatabaseSync' | sed -e 's/("\(\w+\)"/\1/'
<popey> no, it returns the whole line
<popey>  /opt/click.ubuntu.com/com.ubuntu.developer.brianrobles204.karma-machine/current/KarmaMachine.qml:             return LocalStorage.openDatabaseSync("karmaMachine", "1.0", "StorageDatabase", 1000000);
<popey> like that
<dutchie> ah apparently sed REs are very limited
<dutchie> grep 'return LocalStorage.openDatabaseSync' | sed -e 's/("\([a-zA-Z])"/\1/'
<dutchie> grep 'return LocalStorage.openDatabaseSync' | sed -e 's/("\([a-zA-Z]\)"/\1/'
<popey> same
<popey> nvm. thanks. I'll play
<dutchie> sorry i couldn't help more
<dutchie> you could just try using perl instead of sed
<SuperMatt> popey: that code club thing seems awesome
<popey> it is
<SuperMatt> I wish I could have attended something like that when I was younger
<bigcalm> You could do so as an adult and help
<SuperMatt> true true
<SuperMatt> though I'm not sure I'm actually near any schools at the mo
<SuperMatt> turns out I am
<SuperMatt> though I am employed full time, so I wouldn't be able to get to any of those schools before 6.30
<bigcalm> Meep, how is it now 5pm?
<shauno> popey: I'd just be lazy and tokenize it instead, grep return /tmp/popeything | awk -F "\"" '{print $2}'
<popey> SuperMatt: I have organised with my employer to take time out of my day to do it
<SuperMatt> I've just looked, there's a couple of schools near where I work that are looking for someone
<popey> there is also #codeclub â»
<SuperMatt> but man, finishing work at 3 and having to make that time up again, that'd be hard
<ali1234> regex
<SuperMatt> I <3 regex
<popey> shauno: yeah, awk seems to win
<ali1234> just write a python script instead
<ali1234> foo.split(',')[2].strip('"')
<davmor2> bigcalm: well time, for this instance,  is this linear thing that we mark to allow it progress, it steadily ticks away and if you don't watch it, it disappears quick than when you do watch it........
<AlanBell> just had a call from Mercedes about the next service on the car, so we chatted about that, then he asked if I worked for Canonical as I put my Ubuntu.com email address on file :)
<AlanBell> turns out he was really excited about the Ubuntu Edge phone concept and wants that to be a reality with the saphire screen
<bigcalm> Nice
<davmor2> AlanBell: Nice
<AlanBell> !info goaccess
<lubotu3> goaccess (source: goaccess): log analyzer and interactive viewer for the Apache Webserver. In component universe, is extra. Version 1:0.5-1 (quantal), package size 42 kB, installed size 136 kB
<AlanBell> ^^ that is excellent
<popey> well this is odd.
<popey> i have a script running on the phone doing an ls of a file
<popey> it says no such file or directory
<popey> but if I adb shell into the phone and copy/paste the same ls line it is found
<popey> make no sense
<AlanBell> overlay fs?
<AlanBell> one of them is seeing the underlay
<popey> hm
<popey> no,its the home directory
<popey>  /dev/mmcblk0p23 on /home type ext4 (rw,relatime,data=ordered)
<AlanBell> not permissions and not a particularly freaky filename?
<popey> Im root in the script and root in adb shell
<popey> and if I adb shell, I can just copy/paste the echo'ed line out and it works
<popey> there is a space in the directory name
<popey> thats what's doing it
<popey> I escaped it in the script though
<popey> ls: cannot access /home/phablet/.local/share/Qt\ Project/QtQmlViewer: No such file or directory
<popey> yet..
<popey> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# ls /home/phablet/.local/share/Qt\ Project/QtQmlViewer
<popey> BeruBookSettings.db  QML                  ubuntu-tasks.db
<popey> CNotesDatabase.db    memories-storage.db
<popey> fixed by judicious use of quotes
<ali1234> popey: escaping is different inside scripts
<ali1234> eg: al@al-desktop:~$ ls does\ not\ exist
<ali1234> ls: cannot access does not exist: No such file or directory
<ali1234> notice you don't see the escapes on the second line
<GentileBen> MartijnVdS, are you watching the game?
<brobostigon> that was weird, jimmy nail was just singing with sting on jools holland.
<shauno> jimmy nail?  the crocodile shoes dude?  haven't seen that name for eons
<diddledan> who's so hardcore they use awesome (http://awesome.naquadah.org/) or xmonad (http://xmonad.org/)?
<diddledan> (I'm thinking about it)
<ali1234> nope.
<ali1234> deliberately using arcane/complicated tools doesn't make you "hardcore", sorry
<diddledan> they're only arcane/complicated from a mouse-first perspective
<diddledan> maybe that should read mouse-only?
<ali1234> arcane, "understood only by a few"
<diddledan> see even if I were to use a mouse I still feel I'd benefit from some of the stuff they provide
<ali1234> they both literally fit that definition
<diddledan> this looks amazing: http://awesome.naquadah.org/images/6mon.medium.png :-p
<diddledan> I need moar monitors
<shauno> doesn't using 6 monitors prove that your window manager isn't effective?
<diddledan> erm, I'm not sure how you come to that conclusion - moar monitors means more simultaneously visible - a window manager generically hides stuff when there's no more room
<ali1234> yes
<diddledan> being able to see things isn't a drawback
<ali1234> more likely it proves you don't know how to use your window manager
<ali1234> which is quite likely to happen when you use something that is designed to be as complicated as possible
<shauno> I just figure if you find neck strain preferable to window switching, then window switching is presenting far too high a barrier
<ali1234> right. you can only really see detail in an area the size of your outstretched hand anyway
<ali1234> if you have 6 monitors like that all you've done is paid a massive amount of money for what is as useful as 5 flashing lights to indicate activity in a window you;re not looking at
<Azelphur> ali1234: while it's true, even with someone who is accustomed to serious multitasking like me, I can only concentrate on two, maybe 3, simultaniously, what multimonitor does allow you to do is to "time share" more effectively
<Azelphur> for example, I can quite easily keep up with the chatter on 30 or so channels if I want, because doing so involves no clicking or interaction with the computer whatsoever
<Azelphur> the moral being, no it's not simultaneous, it's just that having that much data on the screen allows you to task switch so fast that it might as well be
<diddledan> thankyou Azelphur that explains better than I managed
<Azelphur> diddledan: hehe, I'm a quad monitor user :)
<Azelphur> get asked that sorta stuff a lot
<diddledan> I'm a quad-monitor wannabe :-p
<Azelphur> diddledan: if you decide to be a quad-monitor doabee, check out the ebay 2560x1440 korean monitors
<Azelphur> they are cheap as hell, use the same decent panels as the apple monitors do, and are generally awesome, and cost hardly anything.
<diddledan> the closest I've got is two laptops and two monitors on my desktop using synergy+
<Azelphur> tis how I started :)
<shauno> I have three at work, and it feels great to leave them there :/
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-18
 * ball fires up Ubuntu, experimentally.
<ball> Will it fit on a 16G USB flash drive?
<ball> Why are there two tiny keyboards in the top, right corner of my screen?
<MooDoo> morning all
<MartijnVdS> \o
<brobostigon> good morning everyone,
<MartijnVdS> \o
<brobostigon> morning MartijnVdS
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<dogmatic69> hey bigcalm o/
<dogmatic69> you live in Telford?
<bigcalm> Hi dogmatic69
<bigcalm> dogmatic69: near it, yes
<dogmatic69> ah, I just moved here :D TF2
<Laney> oh TF2
<Laney> what a great game
<bigcalm> dogmatic69: cor, welcome to the region. I'm next to Newport, TF10
<bigcalm> dogmatic69: Donnington Wood?
<bigcalm> Oh, actually, TF2 is quite a large area: Donnington, Trench, Wrockwardine, Oakengates, Snedshill, Priorslee
<dogmatic69> walking distance to the donnington base
<bigcalm> Not to forget Ketley Bank
<dogmatic69> I think officially donnington
<bigcalm> And Muxton
<dogmatic69> much nicer than old area, wolverhampton...
<bigcalm> dogmatic69: you lived in Wolves and never attended the LUG?
<bigcalm> Shame on you
<JamesTait> dogmatic69, don't let davmor2 hear you say that. ;)
<bigcalm> JamesTait: but Wolves is a grey dump. He'll agree with that ;)
<bigcalm> dogmatic69: LUG night tonight if you fancy going (The Moon Under Water)
 * JamesTait refrains from commenting. :-P
<dogmatic69> bit far now :D
<JamesTait> Actually, what I will say is that whenever I've had cause to visit Wolverhampton I've always been made to feel welcome and had a very enjoyable time.
<bigcalm> dogmatic69: it's better than the Shopshire LUG ;) I make the trip
<bigcalm> JamesTait: the people are lovely, the place is grey
<dogmatic69> JamesTait: I was in Willenhall, car insurance went from Â£300 to Â£1200... fantastic area
<bigcalm> Wow
<JamesTait> Ouch!
<dogmatic69> Same for my motorbike, not as high change though
<dogmatic69> just updated to telford and they now owe me \o/
<bigcalm> Hehe
<bigcalm> Nice
<JamesTait> Oh, and happy Water Monitoring Day! :)
 * MartijnVdS is off to monitor his water
<MartijnVdS> brb
<davmor2> Morning all
<MartijnVdS>  \o
<davmor2> JamesTait: Man now I got to go hunt through backlogs
<JamesTait> davmor2, you're welcome. ;)
<JamesTait> davmor2, 10:20 < dogmatic69> much nicer than old area, wolverhampton...
<davmor2> dogmatic69: I'm gonna hunt you down and force you to listen to justin beiber
 * bigcalm returns from the Doctors'. What fun have I missed?
<popey> NONE WHATSOEVER
<bigcalm> So it would seem
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: None, if the Doctor set the time circuits correctly
<dogmatic69> davmor2: cant be as bad as living in Wolvs :D
<davmor2> dogmatic69: haha harsh dude, where did you live when you were here?
<dogmatic69> willenhall
<davmor2> dogmatic69: well that's under walsall so that doesn't count :P
<DJones> This seems like a nicely spec'd machine http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/09/system-76-new-leopard-extreme-pc
<diplo> Guys, I want to remove qtcreator, best way ? apt-get remove qtcreator is passing back unmet dependencies. I thought I'd post here and google as well now
<diplo> Hi all btw
<popey> apt-get autoremove qtcreator
<diplo> hah, google helped at the same time, thanks popey :)
<diplo> Hmm, had to do a apt-get -f <rtn> ad then apt-get autoremove
<diplo> Seems to be working now
<bigcalm> I'm tempted to do the same on my desktop. It's messed up updates a little
<diplo> yeah same here, hmm doing an update/upgrade after is trying to reinstall now
<diplo> purge after ?
<diplo> actually no it's just not removed all the plugins etc
<bigcalm> Maybe it's because we're not using 13.10 yeat?
<diplo> maybe
<kvarley-work> Ubuntu Server 12.10 - Having problems with getting Image Magick to convert a SVG to a PNG through PHP
<bigcalm> yeat?
<bigcalm> Nice word
<kvarley-work> Results in "Fatal error: Uncaught exception 'ImagickException' with message 'no decode delegate for this image format"
<diplo> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/9586048/imagemagick-no-decode-delegate
<MartijnVdS> http://www.slideshare.net/reed2001/culture-1798664
<diplo> Work on the CLI kvarley-work ?
<kvarley-work> diplo: I specifically need the PHP Imagick class to work. It's for a project that requires rendering of SVGs to PNGs
<MartijnVdS> kvarley-work: can you put the code you're using up somewhere? There's probably some syntax error in an argument?
<jpds_> kvarley-work: But have you checked that imagemagick works on the command line itself?
<diplo> yeah that's what I was getting at, maybe imagemgick hasn't been compiled with that option ?
<diplo> http://www.euperia.com/development/php/php-imagick-imagickexception-no-decode-delegate-for-postscript-or-pdf-files/1051
<diplo> ah sorry wrong link
<diplo> :)
 * czajkowski stabs davmor2 
 * davmor2 cattle prods czajkowski 
<czajkowski> davmor2: howdy doody
<davmor2> czajkowski: how's life chick
<czajkowski> davmor2: you know, not bad now not bad at all.  I do have an odly behaving hen just back from Berlin and heading to Ireland next week for our company EMEA kick off so fun times
<czajkowski> counting down the days till I get a pug
<davmor2> czajkowski: you have one now it stops the water going down the sink :D
<czajkowski> eh no
<czajkowski> smart ass
<bigcalm> czajkowski: If Jon is ill, are you still coming on the RAT this Saturday?
<czajkowski> bigcalm: I'd doubt it I'm pretty much running on low atm and already had suggested he give my ticket to one of his mates
<popey> awwww
<czajkowski> davmor2: I've a very broody hen who is not laying and is sittin on the others eggs daily and not eating so we're having some fun with her atm
<bigcalm> christel: are you joining us this Saturday?
<SuperMatt> soo.... has anyone managed to get the citrix ica client working in saucy 64bit??
<SuperMatt> huh, installing the 32bit version worked
<MartijnVdS> \o/
<MartijnVdS> whoa
<MartijnVdS> security-announce overload
<mgdm> has a comedy exploit come out?
<MartijnVdS> mgdm: They seem to be related
<MartijnVdS> "X could be tricked into bypassing polkit authorizations.
<MartijnVdS> where "X" = package name
<mgdm> ah
<mungbean> was working next to this building today http://i.imgur.com/5KW9qOh.jpg
<mungbean> wife recognised it at once. pop quiz - which programme is it from?
<SuperMatt> I want to say poirot
<mungbean> you are correct
<SuperMatt> win!
<mungbean> bit of a fire the other week though
<DJones> woot BBM for android to arrive on 21/9/13, perfect timing, the only person with a blackberry I know has just scrapped it and gotten a Galaxy S3 because the Blackberry was so bad, another app I can safely ignore
<popey> hah
<directhex> blackberry have been *so bad* at reacting to market trends in time to come out on top
<directhex> it's crazy
<DJones> Probably the only way to improve blackberry would be to opensource the software & let developers work on it rather than keep it locked up in a safe where nobody cares
<directhex> DJones, doubtful. you can't just toss source over the wall & expect a community to form
<ali1234> yeah, just look at symbian
<ali1234> they tried that - it didn't work
<DJones> I can't see it improving as it stands, so something off the wall might just make a bit of an improvement
<mgdm> they closed it off again, IIRC
<ali1234> they closed it a few months before the microsoft deal that killed it entirely
<mgdm> ahh, yes
<mungbean> watching "under the dome", full of MS product placement
<mungbean> even the credits say "sponsored in part by MS"
<popey> time flies
<popey> a year ago felix baumgardener jumped to earth
<mungbean> bumgardener?
 * popey is avoiding telly by watching ted talks
<mungbean> also, http://sobadsogood.com/2013/05/30/30-unique-and-compelling-photos-from-our-past/
<popey> Predictable outcome for CyanogenMod
<diddledan> popey:?
<popey> they have 7M USD venture capital
<popey> setup Cyanogen Inc
<diddledan> interesting
<popey> more competition in the mobile space
<diddledan> so they're actually positioning to compete against google now?
<popey> looks that way, but spun that they're not
<ali1234> they're no more competing against google than samsung or htc are
<ali1234> in fact until such time as they start selling hardware, significantly less
<popey> they say they have a hardware partner
<popey> probably oppo
<ali1234> urgh... how do i send ctrl-alt-f1 to a vm?
<ali1234> with virtualbox
<ali1234> ah... right ctrl f1
 * AlanBell nods
<AlanBell> host key doesn't have to be right ctrl, but it normally is
<ali1234> anyone know how to get the log from upstart user session init?
<ali1234> setting the xsession manager to "/bin/sh -c 'init --user --verbose 1>>/tmp/out 2>>/tmp/err'" does not work :(
<ali1234> maybe if i write a small c program that reopens stdout/stderr and then execs it
<ali1234> the more i look at this upstart code the more appealing systemd seems :(
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-19
<ali1234> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6126167
<ali1234> why does this come up with the error "need to be root"?
<ali1234> ah the argument isn't getting passed
<JamesTait> ali1234, is there no log in ~/.cache/upstart that you can use?
<ali1234> no
<ali1234> those are the job logs, not the log from upstart itself
<ali1234> which logs things like "this job didn't stop when i told it"
<JamesTait> Right.
<ali1234> but it's ok, i got my shim working now
<ali1234> the first argument is supposed to be the process name
<ali1234> so it ignored the "--user"
<ali1234> now it works and i can see what it is doing
<MooDoo> morning
<popey> morning
<MartijnVdS> \
<MartijnVdS> \o
<MartijnVdS> Arrrr!
<MartijnVdS> It be Talk Like a Pirate Day!
<popey> No.
<MartijnVdS> popey: yes, it is
<TheOpenSourcerer> http://www.talklikeapirate.com/
<TheOpenSourcerer> Arrr Harrr
<TheOpenSourcerer> Me harties
<SuperMatt> be that this day already?
<popey> Oh I don't doubt it is that day for some.
<SuperMatt> the cycles of the earth be hasty
<TheOpenSourcerer> The weevils in the ships biscuits be tasty
<TheOpenSourcerer> (See what I did there?)
<SuperMatt> how appropriate, you fight like a cow
<SuperMatt> that's how pirates speak, right?
<TheOpenSourcerer> I was hoping we'd get a piratey limerick going...
<SuperMatt> oh
<SuperMatt> I didn't notice
<SuperMatt> so sorry
<TheOpenSourcerer> the cycles of the earth be hasty,
<TheOpenSourcerer> The weevils in the ships biscuits be tasty,
<SuperMatt> let grog fill me liver
<TheOpenSourcerer> Probably culmiating in "Matey"
<TheOpenSourcerer> That Black Beard makes me shiver.
<SuperMatt> I don't think this is going anywhere, matey
<TheOpenSourcerer> lol
<popey> Freaks
<TheOpenSourcerer> https://twitter.com/utterben/status/380584382966157312/photo/1
<SuperMatt> things that bug me: websites which have really large SIGN UP HERE buttons, and exceptionally tiny text, hidden out of view, saying "already have an account, sign in here"
<SuperMatt> just give me two buttons. LOG IN and SIGN UP
<SuperMatt> it's not difficult
<MartijnVdS> Just remember I have an account. Cookies exist
<MartijnVdS> stop logging me out all the time!
<SuperMatt> cookies expire
<MartijnVdS> SuperMatt: you can make them not expire though
<MartijnVdS> SuperMatt: or only in 2038
<SuperMatt> sure sure
<SuperMatt> but I don't mine my cookies expiring
<MartijnVdS> SuperMatt: and then refresh the end date for every request made
<MartijnVdS> your sentence a word
<SuperMatt> mind
<JamesTait> Arrr! Aast, me 'earties! 'appy Talk Like a Pirate Day! Arrr! :-D
<Myrtti> I wish the keepass extension for Firefox were as good as one for Chrom(ium/e) is
<AlanBell> SuperMatt: what do you think of the setup on http://exceptionalemails.com
<mungbean> things that bug me: popovers on websites that turn the entire page black. especialyl on my tablet/mobile when try to scroll around to find the X it doesn't appear or is unselectable on a phone
<mungbean> adblock doesn't seem to kill these
<mungbean> usually they are facebook related
<brobostigon> good morning everyone,
<SuperMatt> AlanBell: perfect!
<AlanBell> \o/
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<brobostigon> morning bigcalm
<bigcalm> Myrtti: didn't know that there were such extensions. Which one are you using with Chromium?
<bigcalm> Hi brobostigon
<Myrtti> bigcalm: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/chromeipass/ompiailgknfdndiefoaoiligalphfdae
<bigcalm> Chromepass, thanks :)
<mungbean> can anyone good with adblock tell me a filter to remove the facebook social plugin from, say, refugeeks.com
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: set the "EasyPrivacy" filter
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: https://easylist.adblockplus.org/en/
<mungbean> MartijnVdS: does esaylist include it?
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: the EasyPrivacy list should block tracking stuff like Facebook plugins
<mungbean> ah ok, thanks i'll try this
<mungbean> hmm..doesn't seem to
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: http://www.squirrelconspiracy.net/abp/facebook-privacy-list.html ?
<mungbean> will try...
<mungbean> almost ..:(
<mungbean> still get the popover, but blank page
<mungbean> surprised nobody else struggles with this on mobile browsing
<mungbean> on refugeks for example you scroll the scre to find the X button and the window moves with you, making it entirely unusable
<MartijnVdS> oh it's one of those modal "please like thise site" popovers?
<mungbean> yes
<MartijnVdS> I avoid sites like that as much as possible. But it seems to be a new trend.
<mungbean> you don't know before you click
<popey> the orange website doesn't work at all in chromium for me
<popey> one reason why I left them
<popey> they have a popup which greys the entire window but you can't see the popup
<mungbean> popey: chromium on mobile?
<popey> chromium on ubuntu
<mungbean> i hate the popovers with a passion
<mungbean> i just hit back when i see them.
<mungbean> i complained to a site owner once who said it only appears once a week, and i replied that if readers can't see the site they will never revisit
<bigcalm> Myrtti: seems that the version of the http plugin for keepass2 is not compatible with the version of keepass2 from the USC. Did you do anything magic to get it all working for you?
<Myrtti> yeah I probably have but I can't remember for the life of me what
<bigcalm> Could you send me your copy of the plugin file?
<bigcalm> +please :)
<Myrtti> dll magic
<Myrtti> I think
<Myrtti> https://github.com/pfn/keepasshttp/issues/124 http://askubuntu.com/questions/130627/how-to-integrate-keypass-and-chrome-chromium-using-chromipass
<bigcalm> Thanks :)
<mungbean> MartijnVdS: that popup seems to be a wordpress thing
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: it's a plugin lots of people use then
<mungbean> some elements belong to the site , and some to facebook, so there's no way to globally kill them :(
<AlanBell> so, release party things :)
<AlanBell> I was thinking that one of the London pubs that serves horse might be fun http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/horse-meat-burgers-prove-a-big-favourite-at-london-pubs-8533800.html
<AlanBell> (why the long face?)
<Myrtti> I just bought horse mince last week. Second cheapest the store had, and had low fat content. I called it a bargain. Mixed the fried mince with the cheapest mince they sold (80% pork 20% beef mix) and froze part. Didn't fancy doing burgers with it tho
<Myrtti> I wonder if I should have
<mungbean> i never buy cheap mince
<mungbean> i'd rather buy cheap steak and slow cook it
<TheOpenSourcerer> This morning my laptop display and hdmi attached monitor have both gone totally dead. Doing nothing in particular, just reading a web page. If I then do Fn+F4 it turns on the monitors again, but they come back mirrored at 1024x768.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Am on 13.04 - anyone got any ideas/suggestions as to where the bug is/what to report it under? Up until today this has never happened before as far as I can recall.
<TheOpenSourcerer> lappy is a Samsung with Intel integrated graphics.
<mgdm> I had a thing with a dodgy HDMI cable/Displayport adapter combo that meant the displayport link went down and wouldn't return without an X restart
<mgdm> something similar perhaps? On mine, it haemorrhaged errors into dmesg
<TheOpenSourcerer> Nope nothing untoward in dmesg - only reported boot up to about 5secs
<mgdm> hmmm
<TheOpenSourcerer> Sep 19 10:40:12 hrun NetworkManager[1217]: <warn> nl_recvmsgs() error: (-33) Dump inconsistency detected, interrupted
<TheOpenSourcerer> Only interesting thing in syslog
<marcushaslam> hi
<popey> TheOpenSourcerer: anything in /var/log/Xorg.0.log ?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Nope.
<TheOpenSourcerer> I just rebooted my lappy.
<mgdm> is there still a /var/log/Xorg.0.log.old or something?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Recalled when I first turned it on this morning the login screen never showed. I loged in by typing my password but the actual login page wasn't visible at all.
<mgdm> I'm sure it used to keep the previous one
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yep - have looked in all the old X logs nothing bad.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Will see if it happens again today after a restart. Maybe lightdm was a bit confused...
<popey> all up to date?
<davmor2> Morning all
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yes.
<Laney> man
<Laney> today is a cold day
<MooDoo> Laney: love this time of year :)
<Laney> it wasn't gradual enough >:(
<MooDoo> it's lovely, :D
<daftykins> haha it was definitely like someone flicked a switch from summer to winter
<Myrtti> as long as the water in the outdoor bathtub is warm enough, it's summer
<directhex> i could use a coat with some insulation
<MartijnVdS> wetsuit
<bigcalm> Myrtti: have you and dsample got a hot tub in the uk?
<Myrtti> bigcalm: no, but I'm dreaming of a holiday somewhere with a hottub
<bigcalm> :)
<Myrtti> and I'm not even in UK. And have no idea when I will be.
<Myrtti> nor have any idea will I have time for a holiday.
<bigcalm> I'm sorry :(
<Myrtti> might end up taking unpaid leave if I end up getting the job
<Myrtti> don't be, it would be a happy occasion and a happy reason to not get paid
<daftykins> that good a job eh?
<daftykins> i'm looking into getting back on the horse at the mo
<Myrtti> daftykins: well I'm exhausted at being unemployed, but I also recognise my need of having some proper time off. This summer has been exhausting.
<Myrtti> mind draining. emotional sponge. black hole. energy leak.
<daftykins> exhausted at being unemployed? i don't follow
<Myrtti> trying to figure out what I actually want to do and applying for jobs and waiting for the results of applications and job interviews
<daftykins> ah right
<daftykins> i only just started browsing
<Myrtti> also, being unemployed means relatives and family expect me to have nothing else to do
<funkyHat> Yeah. Unemployment can be very draining
<Myrtti> or that I don't have any plans for my life or my time
<daftykins> i just want some proper routine back
<daftykins> plus i haven't got the motivation to make something of self employment
<TheOpenSourcerer> This is rather cool if proven... "Scientists find life coming to Earth from space " http://www.sheffield.ac.uk/news/nr/scientists-find-life-coming-to-earth-from-space-1.309972
<ali1234> i don't buy it
<ali1234> they sent a balloon up really high and whe it came down it had some bacteria on it
<ali1234> "must have come from space. there is no other possible explanation."
<TheOpenSourcerer> Not quite - they said it was "clean" ;-)
<TheOpenSourcerer> I do realise it needs more "proof" and testing but it's a very interesting theory. Would really upset the creationists :-D
<ali1234> yeah, i don't believe it
<ali1234> do it again about 100 times and i might believe it
<AlanBell> http://journalofcosmology.com/JOC22/milton_diatom.pdf the paper has a few more details, but yeah, needs repeating lots of times
<Laney> argh
<Laney> I really need to find out how to turn "Mega Bass" on my crappy stero downstairs off
<Laney> when it's on all I get upstairs in the office is a really irritating buzzing
<Laney> can't do it without the remote though, and that's lost
<nayla_> Hi Guys
<daftykins> hi
<nayla_> Someone can help me to install Ubuntu 12.04 LTS
<daftykins> sure
<nayla_> I am confusing for partation
<daftykins> is this desktop?
<nayla_> laptop - Lenovo x60
<daftykins> or server
<nayla_> RAM - 2GB
<nayla_> i want unbutu desktop
<nayla_> yes. ubuntu desktop
<daftykins> ok, are you running the installer now and at the partitioning stage?
<nayla_> not yet. I am reading first.
<nayla_> i already install ubuntu using entire HD
<daftykins> ok. will Ubuntu be the only OS on that laptop?
<daftykins> ah right, but you want it done differently?
<nayla_> yes.
<nayla_> I feel it is better right?
<nayla_> I am just beginner for this Linux OS :)
<nayla_> my laptop HD size is 250 GB
<nayla_> RAM - 2GB
<daftykins> i'd definitely prefer to have the /home partition separate to the / (root)
<nayla_> I want to install Ubuntu for PHP development.
<nayla_> ok.
<nayla_> First partition is "/"
<nayla_> May I know size?
<daftykins> i would probably do: 150MB /boot ext4, 20GB / ext4, 4GB swap, then the rest /home ext4
<nayla_> Is 20 GB is enough for "/" ?
<daftykins> it depends if you're going to install much software
<daftykins> the clean install size will probably be ~4GB tops
<nayla_> i will install MySQL DB
<daftykins> so that'd be a lot spare
<daftykins> mmm, depends where the database(s) will live then i guess, and if they'll be very big
<daftykins> no harm in going up to 40 or 50GB
<nayla_> Like this can change the DB location?
<nayla_> ok. I understand.
<daftykins> i don't see why not
<nayla_> mostly i will install
<nayla_> - Apache2
<nayla_> - PHP
<nayla_> - Mysql
<nayla_> so, you recommand 50GB right?
<daftykins> none of those will really take much space, but yeah i think it'd be a fine choice
<nayla_> Hi @Dafty,
<nayla_> Only 4 partitions?
<nayla_> anything else?
<daftykins> nope that'd be plenty
<nayla_> Thank you so much. i will follow your guide :)
<daftykins> no problem :)
<nayla_> By the way, Ubuntu 13.xx is good?
<nayla_> I feel slower than 12.04
<nayla_> May I know your review?
<daftykins> 13.04 will only be supported until January, 12.04.3 will be supported longer so might be more appropriate for your development work
<nayla_> one more thing.
<nayla_> I have the other problem that i don't know is "Backup & Restore"
<nayla_> in Window, can do easily.
<nayla_> In Ubuntu, I am reading and still didn't get this feature.
<nayla_> Which program you use for this? Thanks.
<Myrtti> deja-dup
<Myrtti> afaik it's already installed by default
<nayla_> I see.
<nayla_> It is working well?
<nayla_> by the way. Thanks
<nayla_> I need to test more for this Deja-dup
<nayla_> @Myrtti. Thanks
<nayla_> Thanks for your help all. I will reinstall ubuntu OS again :)
<daftykins> enjoy
<twager> I have been given a Sanfransisco phone which I have upgraded to cyanogenmod..Wonder if it is possible to chang the os to Ubuntu ?
<Myrtti> so that would be ZTE Blade then? I don't think that's on the list of phones that there's an Ubuntu image for
<twager> Myrtti, It is a ZTE...Where do I find a list of images ?
<Myrtti> well basically AFAIK it needs to be a Nexus: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install
<twager> Thanks..Just googled the ubuntu android page and looks like I am asking too much :-(
<daubers> Evening
<daftykins> hi daubers *tips hat*
<daubers> How goes things?
<daftykins> mmm not bad here ty, i am currently enjoying GTA V
<daftykins> and yourself?
<daubers> Good :) Relaxing in Amsterdam before flying home tomorrow
<daftykins> :o
<daftykins> fancy times!
<daftykins> jetsetting eh? ;)
<Myrtti> popey: I don't know if you've gotten the email but I got an email from Nabee Socks today which has a -15% promo code and a promise of a -30% if you write them a review
<daubers> daftykins: :p Work stuff really. Just added a couple of days for a cheap holiday on the end
<daftykins> sounds good!
<daftykins> daubers: more fun storage systems?
<daubers> daftykins: Indeed
<daubers> daftykins: and trade shows
<daftykins> :o
<daubers> back to real life next week
<daubers> never fun
<daftykins> aww
<popey> evening all
<popey> Myrtti: i have not!
<brobostigon> evenning popey
<Myrtti> popey: apparently they're still out on some if not all sizes of the bolo design, but maybe they get new designs and new shipment of the old ones before the offer code runs out
<Myrtti> chiching, you've got mail
<popey> thanks Myrtti !
<hd5770> need more speace!!
<popey> Delete stuff!
 * hd5770 tryingggg
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/pft49khdhn9aleo/IMG_20130919_221342.jpg
<daftykins> GTA V screenie
<popey> think i might wait for pc gta v
<daftykins> it looks very impressive on xbox360
<daftykins> i wouldn't hesitate to recommend it even for current gen
 * mgdm hasn't played GTA since 2
<mgdm> I loved that game
<daftykins> apart from the fact that they finished the iOS companion app before the Android one =|
<daftykins> Android one still isn't out!
<daftykins> mgdm: didn't fancy 3D?
<mgdm> you need an app for it?
<mgdm> daftykins: never had anything it'd run on
<daftykins> not need no, but it does complement it
<daftykins> ah
<daftykins> it's on tablets and everything now @_@ (3)
<daftykins> but 3 is very limited, it'd be grating to go back to
<popey> i still go back and play GTA on xbox.. played it last week for a bit
<popey> was happy to dig out my xbox crystal
<daftykins> yeah but you can't do half as many things
<Myrtti> whee
<Myrtti> I'm getting two new pairs for free \o/
<popey> Myrtti: how'd you wangle that!?
<popey> did you write an awesome review?
<Myrtti> I mentioned In it that my argyle ones Had some trouble, that it's not a user fault (since I've washed them per instructions)...
<Myrtti> and included some photos with an educated guess of the cause
<Myrtti> they'll discuss the problem with their manufacturer
<Myrtti> my review was awesome anyway
<Myrtti> :-P
<popey> heh
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-20
<MooDoo> morning all
<Myrtti> mÃ¶h
<MooDoo> Myrtti: that good eh!
<Myrtti> SWEEEEEEEET
<Myrtti> BETTER NOW
<Myrtti> I GOT A JOB
<Myrtti> aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
<MooDoo> Myrtti: CONGRATS!!! what you doing?
<Myrtti> developer community management
<MooDoo> fantastic :) well done!
<Myrtti> I'm having a total meltdown here
<Myrtti> aw man
<Myrtti> aaaahhhhhhhhhh....
<MooDoo> Myrtti: meltdown in a good way I do hope :)
<Myrtti> crying, and laughing, and running around my apartment
<MooDoo> do the dance of jot :)
<MooDoo> *joy
<Myrtti> I'll do that in the shower :-D
<MooDoo> Myrtti: are you employed at the moment?
<Myrtti> haven't been for more or less two years
<MooDoo> by choice or circumstances?
<MooDoo> sorry i'm being nosey :)
<Myrtti> Nokia meltdown that trickled down to subcontractors
<popey> \o/
<MooDoo> fab :)
<MooDoo> moring popey
<popey> Myrtti: congratulations!
<popey> Yo!
<Myrtti> but a bit of both, I had a time I wasn't sure what I actually want to do in my life and and then I've had family issues, parents kicking the bucket etc
<popey> haha
<popey> love that phrase
<Myrtti> well my dad nearly literally did that, ultimately dying of alcoholism
<MooDoo> Myrtti: well I'm stoked for you, when you start?
<Myrtti> unofficially now, officially start of the month. I do the hours in and get to keep them as holiday
<DJones> Congratulations Myrtti Good lick with the new job
<DJones> s/luck/lick/
<MooDoo> Myrtti: well that's brilliant news :D
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<lardman> morning
<lardman> Anyone have any success using BaseMosaic in xorg.conf? I have two nVidia cards driving 3 monitors and am currently using xinerama, but it seems to have become more broken (dragging and dropping for example) as time goes by
<Myrtti> things are looking up, despite the school being ultimately owned by a town council, they don't use MS Outlook.
<Myrtti> school/college
<Myrtti> just gets better and better
<MooDoo> Myrtti: will you get that smile of your face please ;)
<Myrtti> I'm sure an Alan or D Jones kicks me out if I become too annoying, and I don't blame them at all
<directhex> lotus notes isn't better!
<Myrtti> I even approve
<hoover> morning all
<popey> went to a meeting at the kids school last night where they explained it's been sold
<popey> Lots of tense parents asking questions
<mungbean> how can a school be sold?
<bigcalm> mungbean: private school?
<mungbean> popey: ?
<mungbean> state school or other?
<popey> independent school
<bigcalm> Sounds better than private
<popey> the owner / head has sold it to a company
<popey> which has investors who want to invest in schools
<mungbean> invest in, or fleece?
<popey> invest in
<popey> improve buildings, add value then sell of course in ~5-7 years time
<mungbean> so more for real estate than league tables?
<popey> no, they want to add facilities that the school doesn't have
<popey> e.g. sports building, pool, newer buildings
<mungbean> real estate + assets
<mungbean> could be good thing
<popey> yeah, they seem like a good bunch
<mungbean> i understand wary parents
<popey> first question "will the fees go up?"
<bigcalm> 2nd question "will teacher's pay go up?"
<popey> hah, nobody asked that!
<popey> nobody asked about staff retention
<bigcalm> popey: not even you?
<mungbean> private schools are expensive but compared to what you get vs similar cost in a nursery...!
<mungbean> nursery is a ripoff
<directhex> Â£39 a day for ours
<mungbean> oof
<MooDoo> wow that's expensive.
<MooDoo> my number two starts pre nursery next year.
<popey> both of our kids went to the nursery at the school where they go, so they have grown up with the same kids
<mungbean> my eldest starts at school nursery next week
<mungbean> afternoons only
<MooDoo> nice, my son just started reception class, but it will be nice when he's older when his sis starts at same school
<popey> Sam got onto the School Council this week â»
<popey> Gets to take issues from class to the management team and tell them what the kids want â»
<directhex> nursery costs more for babies than toddlers
<MooDoo> popey: taking after his father in leadership roles eh ;)
<popey> yeah
<MooDoo> nice
<mungbean> see this unfortunate pic of farage? http://i.imgur.com/TNEVo7s.jpg
<popey> haha
<MooDoo> snigger
<bigcalm> :D
<bigcalm> So...
<popey> CHOO CHOO!
<bigcalm> Anything exciting happening this weekend?
<AlanBell> :)
<bigcalm> I see that popey is using predictive text
<MooDoo> real ale train day?
<bigcalm> !rat
<lubotu3> The Real Ale Train. A yearly Ubuntu UK loco event to celebrate friends, trains and ale. 21st September 2013, Hampshire, UK: http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/2320-real-ale-train/
<popey> shall I bring CaH?
<bigcalm> I damn well hope it's yearly :)
<bigcalm> popey: you shall
<popey> k
<bigcalm> I have no idea how it works, but sounds fun
<bigcalm> I managed to find a hip flask at argos yesterday afternoon
<popey> you're taking booze to a train full of booze?
<bigcalm> Sadly it came as part of a "best man" set with cufflinks
<bigcalm> popey: for Hayley
<bigcalm> If you recall, they ran out of miniatures
<popey> ah
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<bigcalm> Will still buy diet coke or something
<bigcalm> AlanBell: Hayley wants to know if you'll be brining your hat
<AlanBell> I certainly will :)
<hoover> Hey biggie
<popey> saw this and thought of ali1234 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CE5mhct5L0Y#t=82
<diddledan> popey: that'snuts
<davmor2> Morning all
<MooDoo> morning davmor2
<davmor2> MooDoo: me owld mucka, how's life treatin' ya
<MooDoo> davmor2: alreet youth, getting last minute bits for the kids party on sunday, and no thinking of upgrading my laptop to saucy!
<MooDoo> now thnking
<popey> i thought you ran fedora?
<MooDoo> popey: only in a VM, ran ubuntu for yonks
<davmor2> MooDoo: I think you need to go back to bed if you are no thnking ;)
<MooDoo> davmor2: yeah tell me about it....i blame the kids...fancy having their party on the same day lol ;)
<davmor2> popey: MooDoo is like Vader, there good left in him yet :D
<MooDoo> davmor2: popey there is lots of good in me, although i am still dual booting it with windows 8.......
 * MooDoo ducks and runs
<davmor2> and theres the darkside
<MooDoo> davmor2: sowweeeee
<MooDoo> popey: I grew up and stopped changing my os as much as my pants as you once put it ;)
<davmor2> MooDoo: Windows 8 though dude, have you had a proper play with it?  man it's aweful, windows 7 was so much better in so many ways
<MooDoo> davmor2: the only thing i don't like is metro, the interface sucks, but 8.1 is coming out soon, which gives you the ability to boot to desktop and gives you a semi start button back.  What I don't like is the metro interface on windows 2012 server.....WTF?
<diddledan> what's the state of play with 3d support on nvidia optimus these days?
<diddledan> that question is somewhat related
<diddledan> windows 8 - I'm thinking of running it to get decent gfx performance and running ubuntu in a vm
<davmor2> MooDoo: how the hell is that supposed to work
<MooDoo> diddledan: i dual boot mine, ubuntu for most stuff and windows for the photoshop I use
<diddledan> yeah, and it's photoshop that I want the decent gfx performance for
<MooDoo> davmor2: the thought was that you remote desktop to the server with a tablet.
<MooDoo> diddledan: I dual boot, it's easier :D
<davmor2> MooDoo: did you try dark room?
<diddledan> it would be ok if nvidia optimus worked enough that vmware could do 3d acceleration
<MooDoo> davmor2: yeah it's fine does work for lots of things, but it's clunky, not as refined as lightroom.
<davmor2> MooDoo: Ugg, you seem to of mistakenly added the word "the thought" in that sentence :D
<davmor2> words even
<MooDoo> davmor2: as soon as my workflow doesn't need photoshop or lightroom i'll ditch windows, although I may speak to Tony Whitmore as he doesn't use windows
<diddledan> see, without windows I'd have been stuffed because I've been given a psd design and told "make that into a website"
<diddledan> I would hate to see what it looked like in the gimp
<MooDoo> diddledan: do you use photoshop CC?
<diddledan> MooDoo yeah
<MooDoo> diddledan: then you'll be able to knock out a site using it in no time what with that new feature added :
<MooDoo> generator?
<diddledan> ooh, I've not tried that yet
<davmor2> MooDoo: doesn't he use this http://www.corel.com/corel/product/index.jsp?pid=prod4670071&cid=catalog20038&segid=6000006&storeKey=us&languageCode=en  was bibble pro iirc
<MooDoo> davmor2: how are you doing?  geting close to release time and all that
<AlanBell> anyone have an opinion on the pub suggestion?
<MooDoo> davmor2: oooooo not heard about that
<Laney> come to me local
<AlanBell> http://www.lordnelsonsouthwark.com/
<Laney> abbey street, nottingham
<diddledan> pub sounds like a good idea. let me grab my coat. see you in 10?
<diddledan> :-p
<davmor2> MooDoo: you're welcome :)
<MooDoo> Laney: johnson arms?
<Laney> correct
<MooDoo> Laney: not that far from me, I'm on castle boulevard
<Laney> \o/
<Laney> get down there
<Laney> east midlands release party
<Laney> (attendees: 2)
<MooDoo> Laney: when?
<MooDoo> at release day?
<Laney> guess so
<Laney> not sure I'll actually be around then though, need to check
<diddledan> when is release day?
<Laney> !saucy
<MooDoo> oct 17th
<lubotu3> Ubuntu 13.10 (Saucy Salamander) will be the 19th release of Ubuntu. Announcement: http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/1252 - Discussion and support in #ubuntu+1
<Laney> wtf
<Laney> !releaseschedule
<MooDoo> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SaucySalamander/ReleaseSchedule
 * AlanBell goes to fix
<diddledan> four weeks yesterday?
<diddledan> did I count right? :-p
<diplo> I'm in Nottingham on tuesday :(
<Laney> it's always on a thursday, so it's a good start
<diddledan> I'd be able to make a release party if it was the 19th cos that'ld be saturdsday
<Laney> diplo: don't sad face at that
<Laney> where?
<diplo> It means meetings though!
<directhex> optimus is partially implemented in nvidia-glx now
<directhex> partially
<directhex> the preferred route remains using third party tools like "optirun"
<Laney> laghex
<diplo> Office is based in Colwick but I stay in city centre
<diddledan> thanks directhex
<directhex> hm?
<diplo> The ramadan i think it's called now, used to Holiday Inn
<directhex> ramada
<diplo> heh yeah
<directhex> same company as travelodge
<diplo> ah, to be honest the hotel was nice before ( nice meaning adequate ) and it's the same staff pretty much just a new sign :)
<Laney> quite near the malt cross
<Laney> go there
 * directhex moos. moo!
<diplo> OK, i don't remember most names of pubs but I've visited a fair few
 * diplo googles
<diplo> yeah think I've been there, but may go there Tuesday night
<Laney> dragon is good
<Laney> and if you walk up the hill a little bit the hand and heard and the organ grinder are both top notch
<diplo> I've been to the salutation before :)
<Laney> haha
<Laney> you old rocker
<Laney> we had our rocksoc socials there every week back in the undergrad days
<diplo> And one up Goldsmith St ( bit of a uni pub a swell )
<diplo> I was actually dragged into salutation after visiting a pub opposite and up a bit which was a complete dive
<Laney> yes yes yes I know the one
<Laney> g... something
<Laney> no, chambers
<Laney> I've been there once and the advice I got from my friend as we were entering was "if someone starts on you, just run"
<diplo> heh was just googling it, I'd tend to agree.. we lasted about 20 mins and said umm nope. Most people went home but I got dragged on for another few pints
<madmouser1> hi all, any idea how I can add ICA protocol to the UCCS / Remote login sessions for Ubuntu ? Would like to log into a hosted desktop from the login screen
<mungbean> how can i measure torque i am delivering to a nut? special torque wrench? i need 5nm torque
<popey> I used a torque wrench
<mungbean> are they Â£Â£?
<mungbean> ooh http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/cht423-angular-torque-gauge
<mgdm> Not too bad
<popey> can't remember, last time I used one was ~1991
<mungbean> my roof bars need to be tightened to 5nm but i don't know what that feels like
<popey> heh mine was way more retro than that
<mgdm> 5nm is off-scale low for a lot of torque wrenches, I guess
<mgdm> it's not a lot
<popey> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:1980_c1980_Torque_wrench,_140ft-lbs_19.36m-kg,_nominally_14-20in,_.5in_socket_drive,_Craftsman_44641_WF,_Sears_dtl.jpg
<mgdm> it's a force of 0.5kg at the end of a bar 1m long
<mgdm> (or 1kg on a 0.5m bar :)
<mungbean> i'll ask a cyclist
<mungbean> he might have a torque key
<czajkowski> For those in the land of Ediburgh we've just created http://www.meetup.com/MongoDB-Edinburgh
<davmor2> czajkowski: is Ediburgh a bit like Edinburgh?
<MooDoo> davmor2: you're gonna get a slap
<davmor2> MooDoo: Not my fault, I didn't spell it wrong :D
<sdfghjhgffd> hi
<sdfghjhgffd> how do i run gui utility that does the keyboard configuration from the terminal?
<sdfghjhgffd> i'm using ubuntu as guest os in vagrant
<sdfghjhgffd> thus i don't have access to all the menus
<sdfghjhgffd> to any of the menus, actually
<diddledan> sdfghjhgffd: if you mean how do you change the keyboard layout in the terminal/console then run `sudo dpkg-reconfigure console-data`. if you really do want to configure the X keyboard then I don't know how to do that without the gui
<sdfghjhgffd> i do want do configure the x keyboard
<sdfghjhgffd> and i have access to the gui, actually
<sdfghjhgffd> it's just that i run a ssh session with -Y flag
<sdfghjhgffd> so i can run any x11 app given that i know the command
<sdfghjhgffd> eg i know what to type in console to invoke that
<diddledan> in that case then I believe your keyboard is set locally
<sdfghjhgffd> i afraid it's not
<diddledan> it _should_ use whatever your client os is using
<sdfghjhgffd> hmm
<diddledan> the X server is running on your local pc so the remote doesn't interpret the keypresses at all
<sdfghjhgffd> i guess it's running on the remote actually
<sdfghjhgffd> oh wait i think i've confused x11 definitions 'server' and 'client'
<diddledan> X11 is very confusing with terms like client and server
<sdfghjhgffd> nonetheless, the problem i want to solve eventually is that i have somehow misconfigured my keyboard in x11 with sudo dpkg-reconfigure keyboard-configuration
<sdfghjhgffd> and i can't fathom how to configure that back
<AlanBell> afternoon all
<MooDoo> AlanBell: hello
<AlanBell> the Saucy Release party is arranged :)
<diddledan> you should be able to re-run dpkg-reconfigure keyboard-configuration
<diddledan> AlanBell: \o/
<sdfghjhgffd> of course, i did that many times
<AlanBell> Canonical will be shout a round of drinks and some snacks too :)
<sdfghjhgffd> still doesn't help
<sdfghjhgffd> i don't have any ubuntu to access other than that i am connecting to
<sdfghjhgffd> but when i had and wanted to know how to run certain app from the menu
<AlanBell> sdfghjhgffd: can you get to the menus with the keyboard?
<sdfghjhgffd> i would drag and drop corresponding icon to gedit
<sdfghjhgffd> and it will display a config file of sorts, including command i was looking for
<sdfghjhgffd> AlanBell: i'm ssh -Y 'ing to ubuntu
<sdfghjhgffd> so the answer is no
<nayla> Hello, I am nayla
<AlanBell> ah, so you are not running the desktop, you are remoting apps to another X
<AlanBell> hello nayla
<nayla> hello
<sdfghjhgffd> yeah, that's what i am doing
<nayla> yesterday i ask about ubuntu partion and one of the member reply
<nayla> so i will do his recommand way
<nayla> but i saw two things before i do partition.
<nayla> Primary and Logical
<nayla> Which one i need to choose.
<nayla> Now I am in installation mode.
<nayla> yesterday one of member reply.
<AlanBell> sdfghjhgffd: can you run gnome-control-center ?
<nayla> Hello
<nayla> I am Nayla
<sdfghjhgffd> AlanBell: tanks
<nayla> Now I am doing ubuntu installation.
<nayla> My laptop is Lenovo x60
<AlanBell> nayla: are you setting up dual booting with another operating system?
<nayla> no
<nayla> i will format entire disk
<nayla> RAM - 2GB
<nayla> HD - 250 GB
<daftykins> heya
<nayla> CPU - 1.83 GHz (COre 2 Duo)
<AlanBell> nayla: ok, in that case when you install it, just go for the automatic options, let it worry about partitioning itself
<nayla> Thanks for your suggestion. But I feel choosing partitation way is faster.
<nayla> yesterday one member recommand
<daftykins> we had a discussion on partitioning yesterday i believe, he's going to do some development work so may benefit from a separate home
<daftykins> (at the least)
<nayla> Oh ya
<nayla> Hi AlanBell, Thanks for your suggestion. yesterday the one i mee is <daftykins>
<AlanBell> ok, you can do that too, personally I never bother, but you can if you like
<nayla> Thanks
<nayla> Hi <diftykins>
<AlanBell> !tab
<lubotu3> You can use your <tab> key for autocompletion of nicknames in IRC, as well as for completion of filenames and programs on the command line.
<nayla> Now i am in installating
<nayla> i saw Primary and Logical when i do partition.
<nayla> Which one i need to choose.
<daftykins> the /boot we spoke of will be primary
<daftykins> then all the rest, /, swap and /home will be logical
<nayla> today home connection has problem :)
<nayla> hello
<nayla> May I know  which one i need to choose between logical and primary
<nayla> 150MB /boot ext4
<nayla> 20 GB / ext4 4  GB swap then the rest /home ext4
<daftykins> the /boot we spoke of will be primary, then all the rest, /, swap and /home will be logical
<daftykins> nayla: sorry didn't notice you disconnected
<nayla> daftykins: thanks. i will do now :)
<mungbean> anyone used davmail behind exchange server?
<nayla> Hello. I saw the following message when i start ubuntu 12.04 LTS
<nayla> "kvm: disabled by bios"
<nayla> May i know what is this?
<popey> kvm is a driver to allow you to do virtualisation on the cpu
<popey> it is an informational message that it's disabled
<nayla> this message means my laptop has a problem or not?
<popey> nope
<nayla> currently i turn-on VT. but still the same message showing
<daftykins> yeah, different virtualisation technologies
<daftykins> nothing to worry about
<nayla> I see. Thanks
<ali1234> what is a "linux depot" on steam?
<bashrc> maybe it's like distrowatch
<directhex> ali1234, depots are collections of files on steam's servers. a depot can be marked with a specific OS, or no marking
<directhex> ali1234, when you install the game on a given platform, steam will download the contents of one or more relevant depots, and merge them locally to form the game's install directory tree
<SuperMatt> that's pretty swish
<ali1234> i see
<directhex> here's an example - note the OS-specific depots (with executables) and the shared depot (levels, etc) - http://steamdb.info/app/225140/#section_depots
<ali1234> yeah so when I added FTL just now it showed a confusing screen with checkboxes for FTL and FTL: Linux Depot
<ali1234> but looking at this: http://steamdb.info/search/?a=app&q=FTL - it looks like the "Linux Depot" is in a separate product for some reason
<directhex> odd, you should never see depots mentioned in the steam ui
<ali1234> yeah, figures
<directhex> http://steamdb.info/app/212680/#section_depots suggests ftl's depots are a bit of a mess anyway
<directhex> looks like the linux depot was accidentally marked as an app, by assigning it metadata (depots are basically apps with blank state)
<directhex> compare to the osx ftl depot: http://steamdb.info/app/212682/
<diddledan> oh joy, look at slashdot making itself sound like it's super important and clever: http://linux.slashdot.org/story/13/09/19/0227238/linus-torvalds-admits-hes-been-asked-to-insert-backdoor-into-linux
<SuperMatt> slashdot always tries that
<SuperMatt> always fails
<diddledan> to me it sounds like linus was making a joke. to slashdot it's OMGZORS END OF HUMANITY
<diddledan> now on an unrelated topic - is anyone else having trouble with google+ right now?
<AlanBell> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/2555-saucy-salamander-release-party/
<AlanBell> what are locally integrated menus?
<popey> AlanBell: you don't remember them?
<popey> menus that came down from a button in the top left of a window
<ali1234> they never actually existed right?
<ali1234> which is probably why nobody remembers them
<ali1234> gnome has that now btw
<ali1234> except they are at the top right
<ali1234> well, they're usually in the top right
<ali1234> it's part of CSD so the app can basically do anything it wants
<popey> it existed
<popey> and was in a ppa
<popey> http://www.webupd8.org/2012/03/locally-integrated-menus-delayed-for.html
<popey> looks like the ppa was removed
<ocean22> hi guys, is there any way i can install pdfedit on ubuntu 13.04 62bit.tx
<popey> given it was only a tech demo
<ali1234> wasn't it basically canned because compiz didn't want to support CSD and the only other way was with a bunch of nasty dbus hacks (like what indicators use, except even worse)
<ali1234> and app menu too of course
<ali1234> i suppose we'll probably see it around the same time as mir
<ali1234> that's assuming anyone even still uses ubuntu by then
<popey> ah, the "nobody uses ubuntu" meme
<ali1234> sorry, i meant to put "unity" :)
<AlanBell> popey: yeah, but I didn't think they were being released in 13.10 ;)
<Myrtti> what version of libssl will be in 13.10?
<AlanBell> http://www.techrepublic.com/blog/linux-and-open-source/fact-sheet-ubuntu-1310-saucy-salamander/
<AlanBell> !info libssl saucy
<lubotu3> Package libssl does not exist in saucy
<Myrtti> ah right, the old one will be in too
<AlanBell> !info libssl-dev saucy
<lubotu3> libssl-dev (source: openssl): SSL development libraries, header files and documentation. In component main, is optional. Version 1.0.1e-3ubuntu1 (saucy), package size 1376 kB, installed size 4844 kB
<Myrtti> if it weren't available, spotify wouldn't work :-(
<bigcalm> Not long now
<popey> hmm, spotify is broken
<popey> Assertion 's' failed at pulse/stream.c:2525, function pa_stream_get_timing_info(). Aborting.
<popey> worked fine yesterday
<davmor2> popey: it hates you, hate it back works for me :)
<popey> some tracks work
<mungbean> what governs suspend and resume on ubuntu? mineis misbehaving after years of working fine
<mungbean> i did a large dist upgrade and the disk space ran out, might be related
<popey> have you cleared space and continued the upgrade?
<popey> sudo dpkg --configure -a
<mungbean> yes, couple of weeks ago
<mungbean> all is well
<mungbean> tried the 3.8 and 3.2 kernel too
<mungbean> resume works ok but opens desktop without lock screen :S
<mungbean> wireless takes longer to come back
<mungbean> High quality global journalism requires investment. Please share this article with others using the link below, do not cut & paste the article. See our Ts&Cs and Copyright Policy for more detail. Email ftsales.support@ft.com to buy additional rights. http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/a50a96e6-2131-11e3-8aff-00144feab7de.html#ixzz2fSmUdNt2
<mungbean> Stephen Elop is to receive an â¬18.8m pay-off to move from Nokia to Microsoft, or about â¬1m for every â¬1bn of market value lost under his leadership of the Finnish mobile phone group.
<mungbean> woops
<popey> hah, i block that crap
<popey> you pay for ft?
<mungbean> no
<popey> i get a paywall
<mungbean> its the free to view first para
<mungbean> but you can answer a question to read it. maybe via goog
<popey> yeah, it was on bbc earlier
<popey> with a snipe from finnish minisers
<mungbean> shameful situation
<popey> and completely predictable
<mungbean> :(
<bigcalm> T9?
<mungbean> wow what a terrible page http://dmitry.gr/index.php?r=05.Projects&proj=15&proj=15.%20Transcend%20WiFiSD
<mungbean> try selecting text for readability..nope
<mungbean> wifey is out tonight
<mungbean> wish i could play gta5. but i have no ps3/xbox. or gta5.
<DJones> Blackberry shares suspended on the stock market http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24182038 Thats never a good sign
<mungbean> been a long time coming
<mungbean> new one-off episode of IT crowd next friday
<DJones> I'm glad I'm not an IT worker in LOndon call Paul LOvell, getting your name mentioned on El Reg can't be good for your future
<mungbean> is hurt locker film any good?
<mungbean> just starting now
<mungbean> DJones: there's a pic of him too
<mungbean> and i used to walk my dog there
<DJones> Not seen the pic
<mungbean> unfair to name him if the incident is still only alleged
<DJones> Very true
<DJones> I like way El Reg asked Do you know him, do you know who he works for
<mungbean> i was reading hte metro version
<mungbean> he could commit suicide for such global exposure
<mungbean> and if he's innocent...
<popey> what are we talking about?
<popey> oh, i see
<diddledan> I'm failing to see it
<diddledan> aparently, according to a member of staff: the apple store in basingstoke opened at 8am. they'd sold out of iphone 5s at approximately 8am
<zleap> http://www.forbes.com/sites/rajsabhlok/2013/09/20/microsoft-kill-shots-how-ibmlinux-deals-the-latest-blow-to-redmond-empire/#%21
<zleap> IBM investing 1 billion in to Linux
<popey> someone from IBM emailed me about that today
<shauno> it's kinda funny.  msft went from being enemy #1 to being pretty much nobody, without the battle we all waited for ever happening.  they simply rarely cross my thoughts anymore
<diddledan> lmao, just found the paul lovell article
<diddledan> "You can carry a sword thatâs less than two and a half feet long, so you could walk about with a short broadsword, and you can also have anything that doesnât remote detonate, so a grenade launcherâs fine too."
<diddledan> gotta love seattle
<zleap> popey, cool, sounds good eh
<zleap> what we need now is some investment in training
<diddledan> does ibm say what kind of stuff they'll be investing the 1bn towards?
<diddledan> I'm assuming open or libre office will receive a large amount
<diddledan> either cash or via development time
<zleap> i got the impression it was for the server side of things mainly
<diddledan> maybe improvements to samba then
<popey> I'll find out soon.
<DJones> Wonder if IBM would think about getting into the mobile (ubuntu) phone market :)
<AlanBell> $32M could do it :)
<bigcalm> Guys guys guys!
<popey> hmm?
<bigcalm> When shall we three meet once more?
<AlanBell> tomorrow \o/
<bigcalm> I don't really remember when we met up last time
<popey> the pub next to the station
<popey> the nice burgers
<AlanBell> the Mulbury
<bigcalm> Burgers at the pub station thingy?
<bigcalm> Yus
<AlanBell> we could do that again
<bigcalm> Eating before beering is a good thing
<popey> what time?
<bigcalm> 4/5?
<bigcalm> When's the train?
<bigcalm> 19:20
<AlanBell> that is the train in Alton though
<AlanBell> I believe the one you missed last time was the 17:56 ;)
<bigcalm> :P
<bigcalm> 18:26 -> 18:39
<bigcalm> or
<bigcalm> 18:56 -> 19:10
<bigcalm> Better to aim for the 1st one
<bigcalm> Get good seats
<AlanBell> ah, maybe it was the 18:39 you missed
<bigcalm> This time we'll not queue for tickets and just board the train
<bigcalm> So, working backwards
<bigcalm> 4/5?
<bigcalm> I should check what time I can book into the hotel
<bigcalm> s/book/check/
<AlanBell> yeah, something like that
 * bigcalm googles for farnham swingers hotel
<bigcalm> Haha, 1st result
<bigcalm> 3pm, so we'll be around from then
<bigcalm> You guys have my mobile number, right?
<bigcalm> Well, I guess email will work just as well
<bigcalm> Time for bed. Bloody long drive for me in the morning
<AlanBell> bigcalm: get ticket, then go to pub :)
<diddledan> does anybody have any insider knowledge on the likelihood of google releasing a new phone anytime soon?
<diddledan> aah rumours say octember
<linuxliam> i  keep experincing random wireless disconnections no idea why as i've replaced the router
<ali1234> because wireless is rubbish
<diddledan> wired is where it's at!
<diddledan> preferably with string
<ali1234> that mark shuttleworth beer ad looks really weird...
<diddledan> o_O
<ali1234> like they've shrunk his face
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-21
<brobostigon> good morning everyone,
<AlanBell> morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning AlanBell
<gordonjcp> morning
<brobostigon> morning gordonjcp
<gordonjcp> brobostigon: morning
<Laney> guten morgen
<Laney> HMM
<brobostigon> guten morgen Laney, wie geht es dir den?
<Laney> now where's that spare giffgaff sim
<Laney> AH, es geht mir prima, danke!
<brobostigon> gut zu horen.
<Laney> spÃ¤ter werde ich klettern gehen
<Laney> und danach zu einem(?) bierfest
<brobostigon> bier, ja bitte, :D
<Laney> ah found it
<Laney> strangely in the most logical place for it to be
<brobostigon> :)
<czajkowski> Laney: what in a phone :)
<Laney> on my "shelf of important things"
<Laney> i never actually got round to switching to gg
<czajkowski> how crowded is that shelf
<czajkowski> where are you off to?
<Laney> nowhere
<Laney> got a new phone to try ubuntu on
<Laney> wanted a sim for it
<czajkowski> Laney: nice what kinda phone?
<Laney> nexus 4
<Laney> doesn't seem as slidy as my s3 tbh
<Laney> don't know what everyone moans about
<czajkowski> people moan fact :)
<popey> Morning all
<mungbean> morn
<mungbean> does nexus4 have removable battery laney?
<czajkowski> popey: ello
<brobostigon> mungbean: no.
<mungbean> :(
<Laney> mungbean: no cover but i think you can take the back off and get it out
<mungbean> glued down?
<Laney> torx
<mungbean> u want a GG referral link? http://giffgaff.com/orders/affiliate/oimon
<Laney> already got one
<mungbean> i speak to friends who seem to think that paying Â£25+ per month without a new phone is ok
 * popey makes cottage pie for lunch
<AlanBell> popey: does that work (slowly, but might work) http://rat.libertus.co.uk/
<popey> AlanBell: waiting...
<popey> yes, slowly
<AlanBell> cool, that is camera to phone hotspot wifi, over ssh over GPRS to my house, and served up again
<AlanBell> the GPRS is the slow bit
<popey> heh
<popey> so I'll bring the camera and battery?
<AlanBell> just the battery or lead will do, this camera is set up to join my phone hotspot
<popey> ok
<popey> its full and on charge
<popey> could probably run your phone and the camera
<Dave2> What time are people meeting up in Farnham?
<Dave2> popey, AlanBell see above, etc
<AlanBell> Dave2: o/
<AlanBell> Dave2: between 4 and 5 I think
<AlanBell> meeting at the mulbury
<Dave2> Hrm. Any idea which end of that spectrum I should aim for?
<Dave2> That's quite a wide window
<Dave2> 16:25 should be easy enough
 * popey trims neckbeard
<AlanBell> popey: where did you get the USB/camera lead?
<popey> no idea
<popey> I think it's one I had kicking around for something else
<popey> but I can't recall what
<popey> maybe a USB hard disk
<bigcalm> hello fron a service station on the m40
<popey> hello bigcalm
<popey> it's a double-head usb one
<bigcalm> ello
<popey> which makes me think it was for a 3.5" hard disk enclosure
<Dave2> Actually, the train that gets in at 15:55 has been cancelled, so it's either 16:25 or 16:55
<Dave2> or stupidlyearly
<Dave2> I guess that's me decided for!
<bigcalm> I joined because Dave2 pinged my email. looks like things are in hand
<bigcalm> time for lunch. see you peeps later
<Dave2> er, except grammatically correct
<Dave2> Looks like my last train home hasn't been cancelled, which is good.
<penguin42> Dave2: Yet
<Dave2> Quite
<Dave2> Well, there are 2 I should be able to catch after the RAT gets back
<Dave2> Hopefully they're not both cancelled/there's not a delay somewhere
<czajkowski> hmm lots of road closures today
<Trippse> Hi all :)
<mungbean> i've found someone on facebook who wants to buy random non-working tech junk in my house :D
<mungbean> time to go digging in the loft for more
<bashrc> nice
<mungbean> somebody selling a virgin tivo , are they any use without a virgin line?
<popey> nope
<popey> nope
<popey> you need a subscription
<mungbean> lame
<mungbean> my son just got 1over par on a 3 hole course on the wii. feel i need to up my game
<bashrc> you must be so proud
<mungbean> nervous
<mungbean> he's only 3, and about to overtake me
 * popey installs new games on ouya
<mungbean> which ones? ouya special one?
<popey> Another World, Deep Dungeon of Doom, Sector Strike and Radiant
<popey> well I would play.. it's doing a system update
 * popey wonders what magic will happen with this one
<mungbean> is it pretty much same as the amiga versin?
<mungbean> orf another world?
<popey> dunno yet
<Dave2> My phone's telling me that there are no trains
<Dave2> The web site is telling me otherwise
<Dave2> I'll trust the web site
<popey> well that didn't last
<popey> Sophie is now playing Ouya
<bashrc> http://www.extremeta.com/linus-torvalds-said-linuxcon-kernel-developer-panel
<Myrtti> â¥ dsample â¥
<Myrtti> ahem
<popey> :D
<Myrtti> it's so fast â¥
<popey> What did you get?
<Myrtti> and no, I've not tested it with anything else than my irssi.
<popey> haha
<popey> what else is there!?
<nigelb> tested what?
<nigelb> the utf-8 character?
<Myrtti> well I do have a script that currently has a sqlite database about 180M big at the moment behind it
<Myrtti> and about 30 channels, some quite big
<nigelb> oooh.
<Myrtti> so the comparison between what a Viglen can do, and what a VM on one of those HP microservers can do is eyewatering
<Myrtti> usually joining all the channels takes about five minutes during which I can't even change the irssi window
<Dave2|phone> I am on a train
<Myrtti> now all the channels seemed to join instantaneously, and I could equally fast change windows
<Dave2|phone> the fitst of many
<Dave2|phone> first
<Myrtti> dsample knows better what he's done with the server. I'm just a happy client/user whatever
<Myrtti> Dave2|phone: choochoo!
<Dave2|phone> this is a crappy FGW to north camp
<Dave2|phone> then I'll get a crappy south west trains to fatback
<Dave2|phone> er
<Dave2|phone> Farnham
<mungbean> solved by suspend/resume problem ...was a red herring. gnome-screensaver had mysteriously been uninstalled \o/
<Dave2|phone> people slowly ambling up to the train makes me worry it's the wrong one
<Dave2|phone> .
<Dave2|phone> train has no driver
<Dave2|phone> oh good the train's moving
<mungbean> my box.net account is now 100GB \o/
<bigcalm> Hello from Farnham!
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: hello from Alphen :)
<bigcalm> MartijnVdS: the cereal?
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: https://www.google.nl/maps/preview#!q=alphen+aan+den+rijn&data=!4m10!1m9!4m8!1m3!1d43524!2d4.674101!3d52.1311648!3m2!1i1334!2i853!4f13.1
<bigcalm> AlanBell: popey: what's happening? When are people going to the pub?
<bigcalm> Dave2: when are you due?
<dsample> popey, all I did was get KVM set up and create some Raring VMs. I'm now trying to work out how to get Chef working to practice with
<AlanBell> bigcalm here now
<AlanBell> http://rat.libertus.co.uk
<bigcalm> AlanBell: great. We're getting changed. Hope to be walking over soon
<bigcalm> AlanBell: we're on our way
<SuperEngineer> boo!
 * SuperEngineer is enjoying a full weekend off :)
<SuperEngineer> thought I'd take the chance to do a full disk backup so wnt a bought a 1TB disk for external caddy
<SuperEngineer> *went &
<SuperEngineer> ...hope clonzilla's latest Raring based version will cope ok
<AlanBell> look who is here!
 * SuperEngineer sticks hand in air & waves
<SuperEngineer> o/
<SuperEngineer> weee! F! time :)
<Myrtti> choochoo
<SuperEngineer> clonezilla iso downloaded - cd burnt - fingers crossed - bfn
 * penguin42 wonders what's in http://www.samsung.com/latin_en/consumer/monitor-peripherals-printer/memory-storage/external-drives/SE-208BW/PRWS-spec
<penguin42> hmm, definitely linux
<penguin42> looks like a storlink sl2312 ?
<celesteh> hello, I'm trying to pair a bluetooth audio device with my ubuntu laptop and it says it's paired, but it seems to not be making sound. I'm on ubuntu studio 13.04. Any suggestions of how to troubleshoot would be welcome
<celesteh_> aplay -l does not list it, but it says it's paired
<penguin42> celesteh_: what about  cat /proc/asound/cards
<Monotoko2> Well, I just set off a security alert at the airport
<penguin42> lots of curly cables connected to lots of black boxes left in a laptop bag?
<penguin42> (ooh a laptop...)
<Monotoko2> client emailed for urgent help with his servers, got approval from my boss for time and a half, called and told them who I was and that I needed access to their servers
<Monotoko2> it wasn't until I was logged in that I realised I'd misdialed the number
<penguin42> ok - and this set of a security alert how?
<Monotoko2> I called them back to explain, they instantly shut me out and told me they have to follow security procedures for a breach at this point
<penguin42> oops
<Monotoko2> aye, think I may have got someone fired
<penguin42> double oops
<Monotoko2> just wondering, I assume the law can't be used against me here? Since it was authorised access...even if it was to the wrong system
<penguin42> hang on - so you called some random number that you didn't actually know and they gave you login details for their servers? What auth did they ask for from you?
<Monotoko2> they asked for my name and my company name... which I gave them, they said they would be right back and put me on hold, came back 5 minutes later telling me they've made me an admin account that can use sudo
<penguin42> does your company name support them as well?
<Monotoko2> at this point I'm thinking "this client never used to have an IT department..." and nope
<penguin42> haha yeh that's bizarre
<Monotoko2> I refused to give them my home address when they asked, told them they can come to my workplace on Monday and we can discuss it, they threatened to use the law against me
<Monotoko2> which is why I'm a bit worried >.>
<ali1234> that's awesome
<ali1234> you should definitely sell your story to every newspaper you can find
<Monotoko2> honestly tempted, but I will see if they come on Monday first
<ali1234> i'd contact a lawyer if i were you
<shauno> not sure I'd actually worry about it.  there's no malintent there, which is what a court would look for.  you've just got someone who's trying to shift/share blame because its put them in a very embarassing (/negligent) position
<ali1234> because even though you have done nothing wrong, there is every chance that someone will try to shift the blame and start using words like "terrorist"
<ali1234> at which point you can disappear
<ali1234> so at least your lawyer will know to ... you know, make sure that hasn't happened
<Monotoko2> yeah that's what I'm worried about... if it was anything but an airport, I wouldn't worry so much
<shauno> I certainly wouldn't push it if I were them, because all it'd do is make a huge lapse on their part, public record.  I'd be trying to hush it out of existence asap
<Monotoko2> I mean I called them to tell them the moment I ls'd the root directory and realised I wasn't on the server I wanted...and they likely have the logs to prove that I ls'd and that's all
<ali1234> it depends if someone decides to make an example or not
<ali1234> the facts don't matter at all
<shauno> ie, make you feel guilty about it so you don't feel inclined to open your mouth.  but don't try to prove you guilty because it'd force you to open your mouth
<ali1234> get a lawyer
<AlanBell> choo choo
<ali1234> the law doesn't matter either
<Monotoko2> I can't afford a lawyer .-. I will speak to management on Monday, tell them what happened and ask what they would do
<Monotoko2> if they agree that I need a lawyer at this point, they'll hopefully get one for me
<directhex> ali1234, that "FTL - Linux Depot" bug you had yesterday? you'll be delighted to know it happens on windows too
<ali1234> nice
<ali1234> rocketbirds is broken too. on linux it installs nothing at all
<directhex> that's pretty common
<ali1234> it's the only one that did it out of 50 linux games i now have
<directhex> there's couple of beta branches, but they're passworded
<ali1234> gamepad doesn't work in rochard
<ali1234> capsized has a joystick remapping screen that doesn't work
<ali1234> if you map "walk left" to dpad left and "switch weapon" to left trigger pushing dpad left makes you walk left (like you told it) and also switch weapon constantly (which is the default)
<ali1234> snapshot is another "error: missing executable"
<ali1234> i just want to play a game :(
<ali1234> is there a website somewhere that tracks which steam games actually work?
<directhex> ali1234, steamdb.info/linux
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-22
<tronfo> hello?
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<gordonjcp> morning
<MartijnVdS> \o gordonjcp
<MartijnVdS> and bigcalm
 * MartijnVdS just finished the main storyline in GTA V
<gordonjcp> MartijnVdS: jeez, how long did it take?
<MartijnVdS> gordonjcp: 30ish hours of gaming
<MartijnVdS> gordonjcp: 5 days IRL
<gordonjcp> heh
<ali1234> when i play gta i just do taxi missions
<MartijnVdS> the most boring part of the game
<ali1234> because the storyline is always terrible and annoying
<SuperEngineer> yay! backups all done - all 10 partitions [desktop & netbook both done]... & all successful
<SuperEngineer> ....morning peeps ;)
<penguin42> 10 partitions?
<SuperEngineer> yup
<SuperEngineer> desktop = 2 op systems, plus various storage - netbook 2 op systems
<SuperEngineer> [always have a 'spare' system on a machine in case of problem with one
<penguin42> ah I don't think I'd back up the operating systems
<SuperEngineer> penguin42: on desktop it's a WinXP I use for purposes
<penguin42> ah
<SuperEngineer> ...just seems easier to restore from backup and add bootloader after restore if it should fail
<penguin42> yeh let me correct what I said; I don't think I'd back up a Linux install
<SuperEngineer> now what else was it I needed to do this weekend...?
<SuperEngineer> whoops - that was it... pay that damn parking fine
 * SuperEngineer sobs
 * penguin42 always likes drivers who reduce his tax bill
 * SuperEngineer gives up trying to find polite reply to that & bites his tongue instead!
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<SuperEngineer> 0/ brobostigon
<brobostigon> afternoonings SuperEngineer
<ali1234> i wonder if Monotoko was arrested yet?
<penguin42> the only way we'll know if is if we don't see him again
<SuperEngineer> what did M do?
<penguin42> SuperEngineer: Misdial the number of a customer when phoning to ask them for a login to a server he needed to fix
<penguin42> SuperEngineer: The number he dialled gave him an ID anyway and turned out to be an airport or something
<SuperEngineer> whoops!! [& lol] :D
<penguin42> exactly
<penguin42> how did it get back upto ~20c again?
<Myrtti> they're actually telling here that we might get the first snow this week
<Myrtti> I'm not entirely convinced
<popey> yay!
<popey> I *love* snow
<marxjohnson> popey: Have you used your snow shovel yet?
<popey> My fscking snow shovel?
<popey> Yes.
<marxjohnson> :)
<daubers> Afternoon
<popey> Pip pip
<daubers> How do?
<popey> great
<popey> filing bugs on a sunday like you do
<penguin42> sunday is bug day - any fun ones?
<popey> mostly predictable
<popey> bug 1228876
<popey> bug 1228877
<lubotu3> bug 1228876 in unity-lens-video (Ubuntu) "Hard to determine video title from thumbnail" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1228876
<lubotu3> bug 1228877 in unity-lens-video (Ubuntu) "Thumbnails look terribly low quality in video lens." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1228877
<popey> bug 1228879
<lubotu3> bug 1228879 in unity-lens-video (Ubuntu) "Curve in video thumbnails worsens image quality" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1228879
<popey> bug 1228880
<lubotu3> bug 1228880 in unity-lens-video (Ubuntu) "Can't open video from lens. " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1228880
<penguin42> still should keep someone busy to fix it
<popey> bug 1228837
<lubotu3> bug 1228837 in messaging-app "Keyboard collapses into one line making typing impossible" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1228837
<popey> yeah
<popey> that one is annoying
<popey> especially when trying to text your wife
<penguin42> popey: hmm your bug doesn't say when it happens - is it random?
<popey> penguin42: which?
<penguin42> the keyboard collaps
<popey> seems random
<penguin42> yeh makes it tricky
<penguin42> popey: Do you have any way of capturing the state of a misbehaving app?
<popey> good question
<popey> i know i can "adb shell" in and poke around while it's running
<penguin42> some way of dumping the qt layout state - not sure of the details
<popey> dunno if I can capture much, maybe force it to dump out memory or use gdb to attach
<popey> pass
<penguin42> yeh that's probably a little low level for that
<penguin42> popey: I'd look for any correlation with the size/shape of the text you're replying to
<bigcalm> Cooiee
<popey> boo
<bigcalm> eek
<mungbean> foo
<David-A> uk = united kingdom, no?
<MartijnVdS> That, or Ukraine ;)
<mungbean> da
<mungbean> can't remember the last time i watched a film in one sitting
<mungbean> just finished hurt locker over 3 nights
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: little kids?
<mungbean> yeah
<mungbean> went on imdb to check reviews and everyone had given it either 1 or 10
<shauno> do people actually say cooiee?  all these years I thought my nanna was just a little nuts.  awesome!
<David-A> mungbean: I liked Hurt locker. Have you seen the documentary "journalists in war"? (or what's it called in english)
<mungbean> havent seen that David-A
<David-A> mungbean: it was about journalists that had got syndroms or lost friends when reporting from wars. I found it strong and I made associations to Hurt locker
<mungbean> really want to get this kit now http://www.airfix.com/shop/military-vehicles/148-scale-military-vehicles/a06301-british-forces-wmik-land-rover-snatch-land-rover-148/
<MartijnVdS> http://thecodelesscode.com/case/111
<AlanBell> Daviey: any luck with the phone?
<Daviey> AlanBell: yeah, it was on te RAT train.  Picked it up today.
<Daviey> \o/
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-15
<mapps> hi all
<mapps> ;]
<daftykins> hallo
<mapps> what to watch
<mapps> hms
<Myrtti> honourable woman has been my reply for the week
<SuperMatt> morning all
<SuperMatt> I'm thinking we should be able to find a pub in London with "utopic", "utopia" or "unicorn" in the name for the next release party
<SuperMatt> http://www.geronimo-inns.co.uk/london-the-lion-unicorn
<SuperMatt> like this maybe
<SuperMatt> http://www.viewlondon.co.uk/pubsandbars/the-unicorn-info-54649.html
<SuperMatt> or this
<foobarry_> 7th consecutive day off work :(
<foobarry_> this has ruined my good record..
<directhex> wife is signed off sick for 6 weeks
<SuperMatt> foobarry: under the weather?
<foobarry> SuperMatt: just a tad. sickness, bronchitis, fever, now the devasting effects of high dose penicillin on my digestion
<foobarry> i've had better weeks :(
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy International Dot Day! :-D
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<foobarry> nophones4u
<foobarry> whats the process for getting a vodafone-locked phone unlocked?
<davmor2> foobarry: ring vodafone
<foobarry> do they charge Â£20?
<davmor2> foobarry: no idea on the whole they just give you a code or send a message and done.
<foobarry> vodafone moto g is Â£90
<foobarry> other ones are 130
<foobarry> davmor2: vodafone charge Â£20
<foobarry> there's some spyware ridden way to do it too
<DJones> foobarry: Could try phones4u, I guess they may be selling stock off cheaply
<DJones> I think the last vodafone phone I needed unlocking, I just took it to a local market stall & paid about a fiver
<foobarry> firms under administration don't tend to make those sort of decisions AFAIK. they were previously profitable business
<foobarry> so might get bought out and continue as before
<DJones> Thats true, although I'm not sure who would think about buying them, can't see the operators buying them if they're trying to get more inhouse business, and neither carphonewarehouse because all the phones4u shops are probably sited next door to a carphonewarehouse store, dixons group & carphonewarehouse are merging so thats the major electrical retailer tied up, external party would be unlikely given they haven't got long term deals with the ...
<DJones> ... operators, only place I could see that may be interested would be one of the major supermarkets (Tesco etc) looking to expand on their own phone services
<awilkins> I thought they should just say "right then, we'll just sell phones"
<awilkins> But it underscores that their business model isn't selling phones, it's selling contracts and insurance
<awilkins> But I'd love a major retailer that just sold unlocked phones for sensible competitive prices
<DJones> Just read, phones4u are cancelling any iphone 6 pre-orders
<mapps> hi all
<mapps> why DJones ?
<DJones> Presumably having gone into administration & not having agreements with operators, they can't sell any contracts
<mapps> ah
<mapps> didnt know that
<DJones> mapps: Only been anounced this morning
<MooDoo> howdy all
<mapps> hey MooDoo
<mapps> im not sure about the iphone 6..cant decide which id get
<mapps> the watch..yea not interested at all
<popey> I promised myself that my iPhone 4S would be my last iPhone.
<popey> when we announced the phone I said my next phone would be an Ubuntu one.
<mapps> i dislike having these 2 year contracts too
<popey> thats oldschool
<popey> buy device outright
<mapps> sed -e "s/SNOWFLAKE/$username/" /etc/openvpn/client.conf.template >$TMPDIR/client.ovpn
<mapps> whats that sed -e s/SNOWFLAKE do?
<mapps> ah i see
<SuperMatt> sed is the best
<SuperMatt> as is awk
<SuperMatt> learn both
<mapps> :)
<SuperMatt> but if I'm hotest "sed -e 's/<searchterm>/<replaceterm>/g' -i <file>" is the most common thing you'll use in sed
<SuperMatt> and in awk, you'll probably want to use "awk '{print $2'}" which would print the second word of each line
<SuperMatt> oops, that was wrong
<SuperMatt> awk '{print $2}'
<SuperMatt> you'd use that if you just needed to second column out of a certain output
<SuperMatt> for instance
<SuperMatt> you can replace the 2 with anything
<SuperMatt> those are some of my most commonly used sed and awk commands
<mapps> i always think sed/awk are confusing
<mapps> :D
<SuperMatt> they're not when you know what they're doing and how they're doing it
<SuperMatt> but then sometimes you just think "well I really only need this so I'll commit it to memory"
<popey> yeah, those two things are the only thing I ever do with sed/awk â»
<foobarry> why did phone operators cancel their arrangements with phone4u?
<foobarry> did they conspire together?
<popey> they didnt all at the same time
<directhex> ultimately because they felt they could make more money without phones4u than with
<ikonia> popey: did a user follow up with you about the ubuntu package submission process ?
<popey> ikonia: he pm'ed me after that conversation with you, then went offline before I could reply
<popey> i have an answer for him, but he didnt stick around unfortunately
<directhex> afternoon ikonia
<foobarry> i want to buy a phone off contract,canty think of anyone besdies amazon atm
<mapps> i did pre order the iphone6 with ee..but not really sure if i want it
<mapps> ebuyer sell off contract phones iirc
<foobarry> any high st?
<foobarry> tesco do, but locked to tesco
<mapps> hmmm cant think of any
<Azelphur> foobarry: if you want cheap and cheerful, the Y300 from Carphone warehouse is quite cool
<Azelphur> you can get them for Â£40 new, and they are a reasonably nippy dual core android device
<mapps> annoying about my contract..got unlimited eu minutes and texts but no damn data
<foobarry> i'm gettinga moto
<mapps> so i have to get a new sim:(
<Azelphur> I know a few people who have the Y300s now, they are good :)
<Azelphur> http://www.gsmarena.com/huawei_ascend_y300-5386.php specs,  http://www.carphonewarehouse.com/buy/huawei-y300-o2pyu-upgra (seems I got the price a tad wrong, but still an awesome deal)
<directhex> y300 is garbage IME
<directhex> the huawei OS is garbage. as is cyanogen on it
<foobarry> wow carphone warhouse dont even sell motorola
<Azelphur> directhex: my friend uses it with CM on it with no issues, as his daily driver
<directhex> Azelphur: traded mine in at CEX (worth more as a trade-in than a refund) within a week of getting it. it was that awful.
 * Azelphur shrugs
<Azelphur> what was wrong with it specifically?
<directhex> with CM, or the stock OS?
<Azelphur> either really
<Azelphur> stock I suppose, my mum runs stock and doesn't have issues either
<popey> wow, low res
<brobostigon> we have a y300 here also, running CM11, biggest issue is so little ram.
<directhex> extremely unresponsive, repeatedly struggled to connect to 3G or wifi. all the usual issues of android on an underpowered device, really
<foobarry> how much rams
<directhex> experience says you can get a lumia 5xx for the same money as an ascent y300, and only one of those is fit for purpose
<brobostigon> foobarry: 407mb.
<foobarry> oof
<Azelphur> directhex: never heard of those issues, heck my friend uses it as his main internet connection through tethering, has no landline, plays games like Minecraft while tethering through it.
<foobarry> apps take 1 mins  to load on my htc now \o/
<foobarry> something horrific has happened. maybe uber slow storage, or lots of bad blocks
<directhex> i would never recommend a y300 to anyone, having owned one. whereas the lumia that replaced it is smoother & faster than my nexus 4
<directhex> fewer apps than android, and reddit runs like garbage. that's the hate list for the lumia 520
<directhex> oh, the y300 battery was garbage too
<Azelphur> strange, as I say I've been passing them out like candy to family and friends and nobody has ever reported any major Y300 issues back to me
<Azelphur> I disagree with it being underpowered too, a decent dual core is fine for Android
<Azelphur> Maybe you had a faulty unit, as I say, it works fine for all the people I've provided with it, both heavy and light users.
<directhex> your friends & family have a poor frame of reference. see also: kia always gets better customer satisfaction ratings than mercedes, since the kia driver's previous car was a j-reg rust bucket
<Azelphur> directhex: the guy who tethered actually had a Nexus 4 before the Y300, dropped his N4 and smashed the screen, is so happy with the Y300 he hasn't even bothered to order a replacement screen for his N4 in months now
<Azelphur> and I end up using my mums Y300 from time to time, coming from a Nexus 5, again I see no issues with it
<directhex> the one thing the y300 was excellent at was being purple
<Azelphur> ...the Y300 is black, are we talking about the same phone?
<directhex> http://images.carphonewarehouse.com/is/image/cpw/mobiles/large/HUAWEI-Y300_PURPLE_2?wid=232&hei=348
<Azelphur> haha, never seen the purple variant before
<directhex> i wanted to like it. who wouldn't like a sub-Â£80 smartphone with android != 2.x?
<directhex> who wouldn't like a *purple* sub-Â£80 smartphone with android != 2.x?
<Azelphur> directhex: as I say, maybe you had a faulty unit, I know at least 4 people with that phone, none of them have reported the issues you're mentioning
<Azelphur> (that is, 4 people I recommended get that phone, and they subsequently got it)
<brobostigon> i find generally it works well, but anything that needs ram, it just slows, like the FB app.
<Azelphur> brobostigon: I know one of the guys I recommended is a heavy social networking user, just asked him how the fb app works for him :)
<brobostigon> and?
<Azelphur> no answer yet
<brobostigon> ok,
<directhex> maybe the unit i had was defective. it's possible, though i'm dubious, given the speed behaviour is exactly the same as the "needs moar ghz" behaviour that android has had since 1.x
<directhex> but that doesn't mean i won't strongly recommend a lumia 500 series, which costs the same, to anyone asking
<Azelphur> directhex: yea I know Android plays up on low power devices (anything single core can gtfo)
<Azelphur> but, a dual core 1.2 is ample
<popey> 13:56:17 < Azelphur> no answer yet
<popey> "lol"
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> probably busy/sleeping
<directhex> once it's finsihed rebooting, he'll be able to reply!
<directhex> :D
<Azelphur> ;)
<Azelphur> found a video on youtube, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZ0SIG0kZCY&t=2m30s
<Azelphur> doesn't seem overly sluggish, admittedly not perfect but then what do you expect from a budget device, it seems to perk up once all the content is loaded.
<Azelphur> just noticed in the related videos, it can run Real Racing 3, that's insane... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9K8hE1KNtnQ&t=2m20s
<Azelphur> I would not have expected real racing 3 on that device, at all
<directhex> that's not "overly sluggish" to you? ._.
<Azelphur> directhex: nope, a little jitter on scrolling while loading the initial content is not overly sluggish
<directhex> anyway, now you mention it, the charge cable was certainly defective (pins were screwed up), so could the phone also have had dubious QA & been defective
 * Azelphur shrugs
<directhex> Azelphur: okay, here is what i'm comparing to. note, this device has a cpu 16% slower than the y300. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8aaYL6ifaU#t=461
<popey> welp, its official https://mojang.com/2014/09/yes-were-being-bought-by-microsoft/
<Azelphur> directhex: yea, it's smoother for facebook, but of course how fast the facebook app works is a terrible metric :)
<directhex> it's the one you picked!
<Azelphur> popey: inb4 xbox exclusive
<Azelphur> directhex: no, brobostigon mentioned it.
<brobostigon> because the FB app is incredibly slow, even on my nexus7,
<brobostigon> for example.
<Azelphur> ^ is why it's a terrible metric
<brobostigon> its ram and cpu heavy, and sucks battery power also, its fail.
<Azelphur> indeed
<directhex> my point, lost in all this, is windows phone is *incredibly* smooth, as far as UX goes, on any spec. even the slowest, weakest, single-core-est device they ever shipped. if i were looking for a low-spec phone, i know from experience that windows phone does a superb job of making low-spec usable, and that android cannot make that same spec as smooth
<Azelphur> brobostigon: it'd be interesting to see how the FB app on the Y300 compared to the N7 for example :)
<Azelphur> directhex: indeed, but at the same time you sacrifice a lot of functionality for that smoothness
<brobostigon>  compared in which ways, we have both devices.
<Azelphur> brobostigon: I mean, speed wise
<foobarry> directhex: have you also tried unbuntu on phones?
<Azelphur> comparing FB app on Android to FB app on WP is silly
<Azelphur> but comparing FB app on Y300 vs N7, gives you an idea how well the budget phone performs compared to a high end device
<brobostigon> having over double the ram in my nexus7, to that of the y300, makes a big difference.
<Azelphur> I see
<ikonia> afternoon directhex
<ikonia> </delay>
<ikonia> popey: thanks for trying
<popey> np
<directhex> foobarry: no, i haven't used ubuntu phone
<bomper> ello room
<bomper> new to irc
<bomper> any good xchat tuts around?
<bomper> oh well cya!
<ikonia> ....ok
<christel> ikonia! i can't believ eyou still haven't taken me out for beer! i've been in the west country for like SIX MONTHS now!
<christel> and i haven't made a single friend :(
<christel> SO SADS
<ikonia> christel: lets make it so, I've had to be "away" for a while due to an ill family member
<ikonia> but I got back last week so lets make it happen
<christel> oh no, i am sorry to hear that! i hope they have recovered
 * christel hugs
<christel> yes! let's make it so :)
<ikonia> number one
<christel> \o/
<popey> christel: you moved!?
<directhex> ikonia: i don't think we've ever had a beer either. you should beer more.
<christel> popey: ack yes, i spent six months being so poorly last winter (developed a shedload of allergies that caused asthma and an unbelievable winter of lung issues) so we decided to head to the west country to be closer to the grandparents :)
<Myrtti> boom https://mojang.com/2014/09/yes-were-being-bought-by-microsoft/
<directhex> 2 point 5 billion
<ikonia> directhex: I'll try to fix that
<ikonia> directhex: my beer in take in the last 24 months has been low, I'll try to fix
<christel> popey: it is very strange, i am surrounded by cows. they moo at me :)
<popey> haha
<christel> (actually, sometimes they STARE at me and I get all nervous)
<popey> when I worked in wales i had to find the B&B which was in the middle of nowhere. I phoned them and they said "Where are you?" I said "I dunno, I'm on a hill and I can see lots of sheep" - "You must be nearby then!"
<davmor2> christel: do you often ask them if you have moo'd today
<christel> https://scontent-a-fra.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/10464252_10152572476895937_6807350504372811915_n.jpg?oh=cf66e70f74f1814d18ca268fb6010046&oe=54C98F45 is what i see when i look out of my bedroom window in the morning
<davmor2> directhex: it's not like anyone plays minecraft right, or like it sold rights to lego or anything
<directhex> microsoft owns a very popular pile of cross-platform java
<christel> popey: lol
<directhex> probably the only reason java gets installed on desktop pcs in 2014
<ikonia> virtual kvm's
<ikonia> popular reason to get frustrated with java
<popey> http://pastebin.com/n1qTeikM notch posted his reasons
<directhex> how popular is "popular" though? 17 million people own minecraft for pc
<popey> So it'll come to Windows phone now.
<popey> which it never did previously.
<popey> That'll get Microsoft some young eyeballs
<davmor2> popey: no it won't not unless the don't ship it on android anymore
<popey> It will.
<popey> Windows phones are in shops, and when mums and dads buy phones for little jonny and jane one major question is "does it run minecraft"
<popey> if no then goodbye phone.
<jpds> Not "does it run ubuntu phone?" ?
<popey> is that a new game?
<directhex> "Portal was first released as part of The Orange Box for Microsoft Windows and Xbox 360 on October 9, 2007, and for the PlayStation 3 on December 11, 2007. The Windows version of the game is also available for download separately through Valve's content delivery system Steam and was released as a standalone retail product on April 9, 2008" - portal was part of a variety pack when it shipped, not a standalone game
<ikonia> is it good ?
<directhex> gah, ECHAN
<ikonia> portal, such a good game,
<ikonia> I'm sad there isn't a new one
<Myrtti> I'd love to play it but I get sick
<ikonia> portal makes you feel sick ?
<Myrtti> yup.
<ikonia> or ubuntu phone
<Myrtti> falling from heights
<ikonia> it's quite all over the place when you bonce through a hole
<Myrtti> yup
<Myrtti> I can just about play Assassin's Creed
<Myrtti> even that is a bit difficult
<Myrtti> I can't imagine how bad it were if it was 3D
<diddledan> morning
<diddledan> srs? I got disconnected for over 30 mintues and now I'm back on the net again my remote ssh connection that was running before the d/c is _still responding_
<diddledan> that's one heck of a resiliancy
<diddledan> http://img.memerial.net/memerial.net/2199/can-reveal-hidden-laser-traps.jpg
<davmor2> diddledan: how often in your life do you walk into a laser trap?  I would suggest if it is more than 0 you need to change your job :P
<diddledan> I don't know, because I don't smoke!
<davmor2> diddledan: besides sure vaps would be better for that too I've seen the amount of vapour those things give off :)
<diddledan> lol
<diddledan> so you want to be a pentester: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dj0OoWyf9yA
<diddledan> (where I got that image off)
<diddledan> one thing they mention is that their clients have insisted in the past to know what tools they're gonna use and what IP they're coming from. I've had the reverse where a pentester has complained that we blocked them
<davmor2> diddledan: and then you got fired for giving them access without the proper authorisation ;)
<awilkins> We had that... pentesters who asked for the admin password
<awilkins> Couldn't decide if they were just being meta or not
 * awilkins 7.4Mdoge/s
<diddledan> awilkins: it might be a clever social engineering attack
<daftykins> it's all about the flash drive sprinkling at the entrance
<awilkins> I don't want a flash drive after someone has sprinkled on it
<diddledan> that sounds like a bonding experience
<diddledan> mass flash drive sprinkling
<daftykins> you guys are ruining the family friendly ambiance :(
<diddledan> oops
<diddledan> to be honest, I wasn't aware we had our own ambulance
<diddledan> do we get enough random muggings to require our own?
<diddledan> did anyone else notice that there was an ubuntu global jam over the weekend? 'cos it was pretty quiet you'd be forgiven for missing it entirely! o_O
<daftykins> i don't have a clue of any events
<diddledan> or is it next weekend?
<daftykins> there were fireworks Saturday night, no idea what for
<diddledan> \o/ for firewerks
<daftykins> i couldn't see them mind, the buildings between me and the town seafront are too tall
<daftykins> i could just make out the clouds lit by their light
<diddledan> maybe there was actually an invasion and that was gunfire?
<daftykins> ;)
<daftykins> that explains why everyone looked different today
<daftykins> perhaps i'm the only one left
<diddledan> you know what us northerners are like about invading people of late!
<diddledan> heck even the northern northerners want rid of the association. come friday they might be going it alone
<diddledan> that is until we invade them again
<diddledan> I think that's the plan - let them vote for independance and then invade and rule with an iron fist
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> you best buy your northern eggs whilst you can, sir
<awilkins> "In breaking news, it has been revealed that ISIS stands for Independent Scotland Is Subjugated"
<awilkins> "Oops, sorry, that's next months bulletin"
<awilkins> "This months says 'Independent Scotland Is Satanic'  "
<awilkins> "Cabinet source were reported as saying that the intelligence services had 'had a bit of a mix-up when Googling something' "
<awilkins> "David Cameron pledged immediately to take action to prevent the heathen Scot from becoming an undue influence on the youth of NuBrit"
<daftykins> really can't stand politics on IRC
 * DJones points awilkins to #ubuntu-uk-politics
<awilkins> That was satire!
<awilkins> :P
<Myrtti> I can happily ignore most politics on IRC
<Myrtti> it's social issue commentary that rails me
<daftykins> social what now?
<diddledan> daftykins: yes, that's the one
<diddledan> discussing social whatnow should be a T&C (either for or against, just mentioned so we know which)
<Myrtti> immigration 'criticism', ethnic minority 'discussions', misogynism. And this wasn't an invite to start discussing them, because I just get my blood pressure soaring
<daftykins> Myrtti: you could always try being on topic yourself ;)
<diddledan> Myrtti: so how about those current affairs, eh?
<diddledan> they're somewhat "current" IMO
<diddledan> and we all know how affairs end up
<daftykins> so glad this person email'd me with their NAS' serial number
<daftykins> means i am requesting my rebate of Â£35 from Lenovo :D
<diddledan> lol
 * DJones notes not to use daftykins as an IT supplier, he doesn't even record serial numbers of hardware he installs :)
<daftykins> DJones: i didn't expect to end up in hospital unable to ride there again.
<daftykins> and my memory's gone wonky.
<DJones> Hah, wait till you mine and the theopensourceer's age, memory is one of those things kinds have, but you can't remember having kids, so even they can't remeber for you :)
<DJones> s/kinds/kids/
<daftykins> it was more faceplanting the road at 20mph that affected my memory, forget age ;)
<DJones> Mine is the opposite, I've not faceplanted the road, but I have got older
<ujjain> do people here prefer glossy or matte screens?
<daftykins> my laptop has a glossy one and there are definitely times when it frustrates me
<daftykins> i could swap it out for ~Â£50 but i don't care enough to do so :)
<ujjain> it frustrates me a lot, 27Â¨ 2560x1440 monitor
<daftykins> is this the one you are selling?
<ujjain> yeah, how do you sell iá¸¿ sellnig a monitor?
<daftykins> no idea, i'm not in your country, whichever it may be
 * brobostigon prefers a matte display, like on his kindle.
<mapps> hmmm
<mapps> ./build-dh is taking ages this time
<popey> ujjain: you mentioned it here the other day
<popey> I have no idea whether my laptop is matte or gloss
<ujjain> ah right yeah, true :)
<ujjain> my monitor is just too glossy
<popey> anyone know of a browser extension which shows the http content type for a file when I download it?
<davmor2> popey: wget x | grep x ;)
<popey> yay, chrome dev tools to the rescue
<davmor2> popey: f12 in firefox 2 possibly
<davmor2> s/2/too
<diddledan> popey: you could have done it the haxx0r way with curl :-p
<diddledan> curl -I http://bar.bar/black/sheep
<ali1234> popey: can you see your reflection in the screen?
<ali1234> (when it is turned off)
<davmor2> ali1234: I can see my reflection when it's on
<ali1234> even if you display a fully white screen?
<davmor2> ali1234: well then I can't see anything just full stop ;)
<popey> ali1234: no
<popey> diddledan: nope, authed website
<diddledan> aww
<ali1234> popey: it's matte then
<popey> dont think I've ever owned a glossy one then
<popey> why do people like them?
<ali1234> because they are shiny
<diddledan> mmm, shiny
 * diddledan petpet
<ali1234> also easier to clean fingerprints off them
<ali1234> you want a glossy screen on a tablet or phone for that reason
<ali1234> like the nexus 7, that's a glossy screen
<popey> https://imgur.com/qTJ7Wb5
<diddledan> popey: is that what microsoft plans for minecraft?
<MartijnVdS> diddledan: nah, they'll replace the square tiles on the Win8 home screen with cubes
<MartijnVdS> minecraft cubes
<ujjain> 200 pound for a dp2710 2560x1440 korean monitor seems fine right? I found a buyer.
<popey> its 204 new on ebay, free postage, so yeah.
<ujjain> when I bought it, I had to pay 40/50 pound to some guys btw
<ujjain> I dont know their nmame in English
<ujjain> like border control
<popey> VAT
<MartijnVdS> import duties + VAT
<MartijnVdS> In .nl, we pay those too, + a â¬20 "service fee" to the postal company...
<ujjain> Yeah exactly!
<ujjain> well, in 45min buhyer should be here, I hate the glossy thing. IÂ´ll get a normal one from Amazon, just full-hd, around 110 pound.
<ujjain> I am hungry, today I bought chinese but found out at home they didnt include rice, appearently its normal in the UK to sell rice seperately
<MartijnVdS> ujjain: Dell U2913WM
<MartijnVdS> ujjain: It's the best screen I've ever used
<ujjain> thanks, but IÂ´m kind of trying to save and I donÂ´t spend much time behind my PC anymore, so simple should really suffice.
<MartijnVdS> it's the same price as a normal screen
<ujjain> itÂ´s 385 euro.
<ujjain> http://uk.camelcamelcamel.com/IIYAMA-ProLite-E2483HS1-inch-Monitor/product/B00FABG2DI?active=price_amazon&context=home_tracked_deals this was 110pound, seems fine enough for me
<popey> \o/ camelcamelcamel
<popey> wow, that's wiiiiiide
<daubers> Evening
<popey> yo
<popey> happy birthday for the birthday you had recently
<daubers> thanks mr popey
<daubers> not a very nice birthday though :(
<popey> oh?
<daubers> Split up wth the missus recently, so first birthday living on my own
<popey> eek!
<popey> didnt know that, sorry to hear
<daubers> Such is life
<daubers> Onwards and upwards and such like
<daubers> How goes life at Canonical?
<popey> busy
<daubers> Good busy?
<popey> yeah
<popey> fun busy
<daubers> Good :)
<mapps> living on your own can be fun
<daubers> It has its moments. I shall be muchly happy when my sofa arrives and I can get rid of this horrid futon
<mapps> :)
<popey> oh god yeah, futons suck
<daubers> They're fun for a few days, then they're horrid
<daubers> After nearly 3 months of this, I'm done with it
<diddledan> youtube keeps advertising "relish broadband" at me - has anyone heard of it evar?
<diddledan> hint. relish.net
<diddledan> looks like it's london only?
<mapps> gah
<diddledan> donno why they think I'm a londoner
<mapps> why does this script work for the first client and then give me errors
<mapps> arghhhh
<mapps> :(
<diddledan> who fancies a challenge? http://space.io9.com/cryptography-embedded-in-stargate-universe-is-a-lesson-1634445198
<diddledan> why does iplayer think I'm not in the uk?!
<shauno_> just caught myself sat here wondering what scotland's ccTLD would be.  I think that means it's bedtime.
<diddledan> I've got headache. that's really rare. I hope that doesn't mean I'm coming down with smth
<diddledan> my parents have been really unwell over the weekend so maybe I'm catching what they got
<diddledan> or maybe I'm just hungry
<diddledan> anywho, brb. installing updates
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-16
<diddledan> and I'm back
<daftykins> :(
<daftykins> for reference btw channel, any events in my life i share are not for reproducing elsewhere in other channels.
<diddledan> :-(
<daftykins> there's far too much drama on this network at times
<diddledan> I'm not sure my memory is good enough to be able to spill about folk in here :-p
<daftykins> hehe
<diddledan> if it were I'm sure I'd at least get the names wrong
<daftykins> it wasn't particularly here in this case
<daftykins> sadly the -ops thought it was ok to share in my recent past
<diddledan> grr
<daftykins> then someone PM'd me to discuss... and reproduced that to them
<daftykins> without warning
<ali1234> you know this channel is logged right?
<diddledan> this looks freaky: http://store.steampowered.com/app/246070/?snr=1_237_151__103
<daftykins> ali1234: yep
<daftykins> ali1234: are you referring to my discussion now, or assuming they got the info via another means?
<daftykins> 'cause it's not, for the latter
<ali1234> just saying, anyone can grep the logs if they feel like causing trouble
<daftykins> so you meant the first option? :)
<ali1234> both
<SuperMatt> popey: how do you think canonical staff would respond to travelling to north london for a release party at a pub with Unicorn in its name?
<DJones> Morning all
<knightwise> morning !
<davmor2> Morning all
<Myrtti> I urgently need someone to tell me I shouldn't put a bid on a Fiskars Fuse Die cutting and letterpress machine
<Myrtti> my rationality is rapidly dwindling
<davmor2> Myrtti: put in a bid but really, really low and don't bid on it again, that way you either get a massive bargain or you get out bid,  just don't look at it again till the auction is over
<Myrtti> ah, it actually looks like it's cheaper in Amazon than getting it cheap from US, even when eBay tries to tell me there's no extra cost involved
<Myrtti> ah, misread. nevermind.
<Myrtti> so Amazon it would be
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Working Parents Day! :-D
<brobostigon> morning JamesTait
<JamesTait> brobostigon, o/
<awilkins> Tomorrow ; Malfunctioning Parents Day
<popey> SuperMatt: well, probably, however a large chunk of the company will not be around.
 * popey wonders if czajkowski is at the library https://www.reddit.com/r/funny/comments/2gipwn/somebody_left_their_dog_in_the_library_i_feel/
<czajkowski> popey: LOL
<czajkowski> Bash isn't buding from the floor passed out from todays 2 mile walk uphill
<popey> MartijnV1S: is this near you? if so, please go there, buy all of it and send it to me. https://plus.google.com/u/0/116565300061740734711/posts/dKQoVDCLZV4
<davmor2> JamesTait: is that not an oxymoron
<JamesTait> davmor2, who are you calling a moron? :-P
<diddledan> moron alert: morning everyone
<davmor2> diddledan: man that's harsh calling yourself a moron as you enter a room ;)
<davmor2> JamesTait: You obviously :p
<diddledan> well we all know it
<diddledan> :-p
<JamesTait> Can you feel the love?
 * diddledan refrains from comment
<SuperMatt> I can feel the love
<SuperMatt> but that's because you put my hands in your pants
<diddledan> and that's why I refrained
<czajkowski> JamesTait: http://youtu.be/aF4CWCXirZ8
<diddledan> czajkowski: you realise that's akin to japanese animated pr0n for lions?
<czajkowski> only in your twisted noggin tis disney
<diddledan> :-p
<diddledan> czajkowski: sshh, don't tell anyone, because it might diminish my manliness, but Disney rocks!
<Laney> Disnep
<czajkowski> Laney: ello there you coming to oggcamp?
<Laney> As a kid I read the 'y' in their logo as a 'p'
<Laney> stuck with me
<Laney> sup czajkowski, dunno, when/where?
<Laney> ooooh posh
<Laney> but no probably not
<czajkowski> 4/5 october oxford
 * davmor2 tip-toes up behind czajkowski and shouts BOO!
<diddledan> eek, that even scared me
<czajkowski> davmor2: ello sunshine
<davmor2> diddledan: why are you at czajkowski 's?
<popey> Turns out pot noodles can be greatly improved via the addition of sriracha
<awilkins> So can eggy bread with salad
 * awilkins has just acquired a bottle of Sriracha from an Asian food shop for much less cash than the prices on Amazon
<awilkins> I like that the small bottle is a pound of sauce.
<diddledan> I fixed a bug and I like it
 * diddledan sings
<MartijnV1S> popey: I don't know where that is
<diddledan> o_O
<dutchie> czajkowski: i'm going to oggcamp!
<popey> yay
<dutchie> :)
<dutchie> *and* i get a free floor to sleep on from my postgrad friends
<davmor2> I'm not :(  I wanted to this year too being as the Mother in law was holding us back this year.  Then the council decided it would be a good time to gut our property and re do the kitchen, bathroom, toilet, plumbing and electrics :(
<Laney> at once?
<davmor2> Laney: over 4 weeks
<Laney> extreme
<davmor2> Laney: indeed one team follows another
<NET||abuse> hi guys, been looking for an app i used some time ago, Giver, but i don't see a 14.04 or recent version?
<NET||abuse> any alternate projects worth looking into for similar functionality?
<dutchie> what functionality is that? "Giver" is not the easiest name to do a web search for
<popey> it lets you share files over a network easily
<popey> was a novell hackfest project iirc
<dutchie> ah i think i remember it now actually
<popey> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CP3uxPsOUms
<dutchie> i tend to just use scp/rsync
<popey> i think this services a different need
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<bigcalm> Is there a good application that I can install so that I can then right click on a file and encrypt it with GPG for a specified public key?
<awilkins> You can add a script to the scripts folder to do this, no?
<awilkins> ~/.local/share/nautilus/scripts
<awilkins> Shell script, use   "$@" for parameter, boom
<popey> directhex: do you know of a way to unpack a xap file?
<directhex> un... unzip?
<popey> nope
<popey> i think it's encrypted
<popey> rot13 or something â»
<popey> looks like they're DRM signed.
<MarkDude> popey, you have a goto guide or two for setting up Plex? Its on my todo list :)
<daftykins> XBMC!
<bigcalm> Kodi?
<bigcalm> (mentioned a bit in recent uupc)
 * bigcalm dog walks
<daftykins> it's a terrible name
<daftykins> and it's only Kodi to me once that version goes final (:
 * MarkDude is not so much of a fan with most things with X in it
<MarkDude> KNOW its its a great project, but its failed me with a record that NOTHING else comes close to :(
<MarkDude> Almost as much as Windows does
<daftykins> well that makes no sense.
<MarkDude> If I have old hardware, Puppy Linux tends to be more stable
 * MarkDude is a part of groups that install XFCE, its just not going in my house :)
<MarkDude> Nothing wrong with it. Just not my cup of tea
<daftykins> i can't really follow your conversation, you flitted on each and every line
<MarkDude> Looking for Plex brilliance from popey or others
<MarkDude> Using Ubuntu
 * MarkDude has some really strong opinions on XFCE, realized a while ago- that I should keep that to myself
<MarkDude> My not wanting to use it is based upon setting up classrooms, people, computers- and having it fail- ONLY when folks cant fix it. Or dying in way it cant be fixed from elsewhere
<popey> yo
<MarkDude> FOSS is about choice. /me is part of another project, most of which know I have been using Ubuntu (instead of my Distro)
<popey> yeah, i put a chromecast in the lounge, and installed plex media server on my home server.
<popey> I eneded up paying for the phone app to control it.
<MarkDude> it just work (trademarked)
<popey> there's a guide I followed
<MarkDude> Yep - and paying for phoneapp makes sense
<popey> the plex server runs on my home server full of content
<popey> it does indeed Just Work â¢
 * MarkDude actually bought iMovie, so I could just make movies
<MarkDude> Ty popey - you saved me hella time
<MarkDude> And no insult meant to XCFE, its an awesome project that does great stuff :)
<popey> lemme see if i can find the guide
<popey> i think you mean XBMC â»
<MarkDude> Cool- if not- send itmy way
<MarkDude> no- /me says bad things about XFCE
<MarkDude> XMBC - not quite the volume of not-likey-ness
<MarkDude> \IMO
<popey> http://allaboutchromecast.com/how-to-use-plex-media-server-to-stream-local-media-to-chromecast-from-your-pc/ boom
<popey> i think thats the one
<MarkDude> Perfect- Chromecast is on this months todo list :)
<popey> hehe
<popey> i have 3 now
<popey> i can't buy one of anything
<MarkDude> True. Im needing 2 more already
<MarkDude> popey, you are using regular computer? Im not sure current Pi is quick enough?
<Myrtti> plex + chromecast = â¥
<Myrtti> we've got the plex server on our nas
 * MarkDude is in process of new installs, and shifting machines. Will be nice to have media in one place, as opposed to maybe 20 places- lol
 * MarkDude needs to go see a man about a dog....
<MarkDude> :D
<diddledan> Myrtti: is that a synology?
<Myrtti> Netgear ReadyNAS
<diddledan> we're using a synology at work. they're ok, but I don't really like the "desktop" style of web interface
<daftykins> they're pretty functional though
<daftykins> but yeah, a 'lite' edition would be welcome
<directhex> i discovered how bad windows 8 is last night
<directhex> you can't add a NAS to your music or video libraries, for use by the default video/music apps.
<directhex> unless the NAS runs Windows Home Server
<daftykins> lol
<daftykins> people actually use libraries? o0
<directhex> you can't display metadata of files that aren't in a library ^_^
<daftykins> properties?
<diddledan> can someone tell me what's unique about this? https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/pep-pretty-easy-privacy
<diddledan> besides completely reinventing the wheel I mean
<diddledan> why should I use that over something like gpg?
<diddledan> the first proper trailer for "the hunger games: mockingjay part1" is out: http://www.imdb.com/video/imdb/vi616541977/
<diddledan> it looks sweet
<diddledan> \o/ for teen fiction
<mapps> hmm
<diddledan> hmm
<mapps> just wondering what to do
<davmor2> mapps: you still on pain killers etc?
<mapps> no
<mapps> i started watching cold in july
<mapps> but just cba
<mapps> stupid hayfevers making me sneeze loads
<mapps> #
<MartijnV1S> http://www.commitstrip.com/en/2014/09/16/le-commitstrip-test/
 * dutchie feels sorry for the guy on ml who is currently being buried under dozens of lines of grep/sed/awk that he does not appear to even slightly understand
<dutchie> turning into a code golf competition
<diddledan> dutchie: yeah I saw that
<daftykins> ml?
<dutchie> mailing list
<dutchie> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/2014-September/037891.html
<daftykins> ty sir
<daftykins> wow, that's nasty
<daftykins> i'd hate to have a machine compromised
<christel> it sucks big time
<daftykins> yarr? not necessarily knowing the source would probably be really aggravating
<daftykins> in fact this is a good wake up call to remind me to do some backup :D
<christel> tell me about it ... we're in the midst of forensics on the eight compromised freenode boxes
<christel> with absolutely NO clue as to the ingress point
<daftykins> :/
<daftykins> that was definitely a nasty one
<daftykins> you'd think that people wouldn't target well intentioned projects
<popey> people are dicks
<daftykins> it'd be like trying to trash the computers of charities
<mapps>   8 compromised freenode boxes? how did they fiund out and what were they doiing on the compromised machines
<daftykins> alterned binaries iirc
<daftykins> *altered
<mapps> oh
<mapps> any idea to do what tho
<daftykins> it was in an announcement
<daftykins> christel would know :)
<mapps> thanks
<daftykins> tbh i didn't even care enough to change my nickserv password XD
<christel> well, we're not quite sure what they were doing ... from what we can tell they've been there for a while
<mapps> oh
<mapps> so not running servers or mining or what not
<christel> daftykins: the machine on which services live wasn't actually compromised so we're semi-confident that the nickserv database is "safe" -- but we're concerned that they may have been sniffing irc traffic (for some time)
<daftykins> christel: oh that's handy news, thanks. would a SASL auth user have been alright?
<christel> they've been fairly good at tidying up after themselves, disabling things like etckeeper which would have notified us of their presence had we realised sooner
<popey> worrying if they'd been sniffing traffic
<christel> but in brief they planted a kernel module which uses netfilter to register a hook and observe tcp packets looking for a magic value
<christel> popey: yeah, that is the bit we fear
<mapps> i see
<mapps> etckeeper hm il have to google..never heard of ythat
<mapps> :)
<christel> added a usermode binary which removes specific files and a usermode companion to the kernel module which was handily saved to the system as /bin/dh -- presumably so as to make us assume it was the debhelper
<popey> ugh
<christel> they also left behind the shell script that installed the files ... but beyond this they have been clearing things up rather well, logs are tidy, etc.
<daftykins> :S
<christel> the annoying thing is that there are no common anomalities between the servers to point at a single software package or misconfiguration
<christel> (bar the ircd, but two of the affected boxes were non-ircd boxes)
<christel> commonalities*
<christel> so we're currently at the trying to work out whether we're looking at exploitable software flaw in a standard build component, exploitable software flaw in the ircd stack, malicious staff member, malicious sponsor or compromised management channel -- not the loveliest place to be atm :)
<daftykins> christel: erk, pointed fingers everywhere huh?
<christel> not so much pointed fingers as trying to be real cold and clinical about the fact that we might not have mitigated the attack vector, whatever it may turn out to be :/
<christel> but hey, hopefully we'll figure it out, right now it is making us all grey at a rapid phase :/
<christel> pace*
<christel> goodness
<christel> (see, it has completely broken me!)
<daftykins> heh dw, i know that feeling
<daftykins> it's been an odd couple of weeks for me
<daftykins> so the server count is down at the moment - and not worth setting up replacements because they could be attacked in the same way? :/
<christel> well, we have no reason to think they would -- we're slowly re-adding but making sure we've got decent images of * for further forensics before we reimage
<christel> :)
<daftykins> ah-har
<diddledan> wow, I turn my back for 5 seconds and y'all start talking till the cows come home
<diddledan> 56 messages missed!
<daftykins> :D
<diddledan> yey for maplins
<diddledan> I just ordered some dohickies
<diddledan> (where do and hickie refer to UHF tv-antenna cable)
<diddledan> I'm gonna re-wire my hdhomerun
<daftykins> but nothing of worth comes over broadcast, sir
<diddledan> true
<diddledan> netflix is where it's at
<diddledan> or not-so-kosher-winky-winky-nudgie-nudgie-downloaded-content
<diddledan> oh my, I mentioned winky in a family friendly channel :-p
<daftykins> since i have a reputation i hope you have one too ;)
 * directhex moos. moo!
<diddledan> moomoo
<shauno> dan?  a reputation?  noooo
<diddledan> :-p
<diddledan> morning, shauno
<shauno> howdy
<diddledan> damn, my UGT actually managed to mesh with real timezones
<shauno> how so?
<diddledan> it really is morning
<shauno> no it's not?
<diddledan> tis too
<diddledan> 00:10 <-- 10 minutes into morning
<shauno> morning has a very strict definition.  it's the period between shaun waking up, and finishing his second cup of coffee
<daftykins> :D
<diddledan> isn't that G
<diddledan> Grumpy Irishman Time?
<daftykins> i need to be to bed, i have to wake up in 8hrs to go to some appointment about my broken bones
<diddledan> aka GIT
<shauno> oi, I ain't irish
<diddledan> don't tell the natives that
<shauno> almost related but not at all.  someone here has apparently decided that the irish equivalent of BST is 'naturally' IST.  So far as to add IST to our product
<shauno> which is greatly confusing India, who actually use IST
<diddledan> they'll lynch you before dawn - morning in GIT time
<diddledan> lmao
<diddledan> only an irishlander
<shauno> I find the proper designations even funny.  'western european time'.  and 'western european summertime'.  so WET and WEST.  which pretty much sums up the situation.
<diddledan> oh dear
<diddledan> that's funny!
<daftykins> can't believe it's hitting 23 deg tomorrow
<dogmatic69> anyone know of 'digital pen' type things that work on ubuntu?
<diddledan> dogmatic69: the wacom stuff usually works IIRC
<diddledan> dogmatic69: I don't know about other vendors tho
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-17
<Myrtti> morning
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<popey> Morning!
<brobostigon> morning popey
<LuvDH8trz> LO
<LuvDH8trz> Is there anyone who can help me with a really stupid question?
<LuvDH8trz> Pleeeeeease!
<LuvDH8trz> :-)
<brobostigon> well, we dont know if we can help, if we dont know the question.
<izdubar> +1
<LuvDH8trz> OK - I have a Ubuntu install on HD that is playing up, not letting me log in.
<LuvDH8trz> I think its because I have run out of disk space.
<LuvDH8trz> What I want to do is boot up off USB
<LuvDH8trz> And delete some files on the HD
<popey> you could boot to recovery mode and delete files
<LuvDH8trz> But it wonât let me delete it is only giving me read access to my old drive
<popey> hold down shift during boot
<LuvDH8trz> Oh.. IC
<popey> and then choose recovery from the grub boot menu
<popey> http://s-jenkins.ubuntu-ci:8080/job/calculator-app-click/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/out/com.ubuntu.calculator_1.3.329_all.click
<popey> oops
<popey> http://askubuntu.com/questions/117950/how-do-i-change-file-system-in-recovery-mode-to-read-write-mode
<LuvDH8trz> OH.. I try that thanks
<popey> that link
<popey> "mount -o remount,rw" is the magic to make the disk read/write
<LuvDH8trz> Holding down shift didnât seem to do anythingâ¦
<popey> you need to hold down shift to get the grub menu immediately after your bios splash stuff
<LuvDH8trz> Ubuntu 14.04 BTW
<LuvDH8trz> Oh, I get the grub menu anyway as it is a Dual boot
<LuvDH8trz> Yay! Iâm in!
<LuvDH8trz> Thank you fellow citizens!
<LuvDH8trz> It would appear that doesnât appear to have 0 bytes available. Heh.
<LuvDH8trz> It would appear that Ubuntu doesnât appear to like having 0 bytes available. Heh. (Was what I meant to say).
<LuvDH8trz> Or type even.
<popey> heh
<popey> czajkowski: https://imgur.com/gallery/WgIfSYW
<LuvDH8trz> Ok Thanks :-)
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Country Music Day! :-D
<shauno> well, that explains my morning so far
<popey> Yeee haw!
<JamesTait> I thought happy country music was an oxymoron, tbh.
<davmor2> JamesTait: that is more of an oxymoron than happy parents at work day ;)
<JamesTait> davmor2, https://soundcloud.com/pops-busby/im-my-own-grandpa
<czajkowski> popey: so cute
<davmor2> JamesTait: it's not happy, it's confusing there is a difference :P
<JamesTait> davmor2, are you smiling, though?
<davmor2> JamesTait: no :P  However
<davmor2> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRGaoxBTA_0
<davmor2> JamesTait: I love how his brain works it's weird
<JamesTait> davmor2, OK, you win. ;)
<MarkDude>  I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do.
<MarkDude> And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down' -Bob Newhart
<MarkDude> :D
<JamesTait> Heheh. :)
 * MarkDude likes some country - and that joke :)
<davmor2> I love the line in blues brothers, "So what kinda music do you listen to here", "Oh we have both kinds, Country and Western"
<MarkDude> +1
<foobarry> has iphone not had swype style keyboards until now?
<foobarry> thats the impression i'm getting fromheadlines about swype on ios8. but surely cannot be true
<popey> correct
<popey> there was the iOS keyboard, and that was it.
<foobarry> wow, and that had no swype style input?
<foobarry> amazing
<popey> correct
<popey> i usually turn that off
<popey> (on android)
<foobarry> because its too awesome?
<popey> because i find it a hinderance
<foobarry> have you tried the 5 colour keybarod thing
<popey> no
<foobarry> cna't find a link now. they were taling on bbcclick about it
<davmor2> foobarry: man what happened to yout typing skills dude ;)
<foobarry> http://fivetiles.com/
<foobarry> eating lunch davmor2
<foobarry> laptop at 90 degrees to lkuncgh
<diddledan> haha: http://blog.lumension.com/9388/doom-playing-canon-printer-raises-security-concerns-about-iot/?omhide=true
<directhex> diddledan: 16-bit crypto key!
<diddledan> "that awesome time I was sued for two billion dollars": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSWqx8goqSY
<diddledan> funny
<popey> he's trying to get the twitpic archive
<popey> before they shutdown on 25 sept
<popey> but apparently the owner of twitpic isn't co-operating
<foobarry> so twitpic owner upset about twitter not buying them out, takes ball home?
<davmor2> foobarry: try using sywpe as a dyslexic and you'll realise how unusable it is
<foobarry> my missis actually prefers it
<foobarry> i haven't asked her about the success rate when trying to swype proberly instead of probably
<foobarry> about to hit buy on my 2nd ever android after 5+ years with the htc desire
<davmor2> foobarry: I need to see the letters to be able to put together the words.
<mapps> hi all
<whaletales> I've missed that twitpic is shutting down, better check what I have on there!
<shauno> you don't have 3 different backups of your cat photos?
<davmor2> shauno: please if it's cats there are at least 10 back ups or you are not doing right :P
<shauno> surely at that point it's cheaper to just keep spare cats offsite
<foobarry> my laptop has the corner chipped ever so slightly.
<foobarry> if my wrist touches that point, while laptop is charging i get zapped a bit
<foobarry> if i touche with my finger i don't
<foobarry> whats that all about
<foobarry> veins?
<davmor2> foobarry: proving you are weird?
<shauno> it's probably not a zap, it's just the tingle you get from a feedback loop.  like you can feel the hum but without the shock?
<shauno> in which case soft/sensitive skin will notice it a whole lot more than, eg, fingers
<shauno> the other variation I find is that if you touch it, nada - but if you brush a finger as lightly as you can, you notice it
<foobarry> it feels like it has shards of metal
<foobarry> but its df. only when charigng
<foobarry> my phone has a little vibration feeling but this one is painful a bit
<foobarry> finally ordered the "old" moto g
<Laney> I need a milk dispenser for my home office
<Laney> wonder if such a thing exists
<popey> a refridgerated thing?
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> holds a pint or so
<Laney> I always let tea go cold because I don't want to get up and go all the way downstairs in the middle of doing stuff
<awilkins> A large syringe may do
<awilkins> Keeps exposure to a minimum
<awilkins> So less opportunities for spoilage
<popey> so http://www.amazon.co.uk/Insulated-Hot-Cold-Beverage-Dispenser/dp/B003BIPERM + http://www.amazon.co.uk/Unbreakable-Vacuum-Jug-Stainless-Steel/dp/B003BINCPS ?
<awilkins> Especially if you use sterilised milk
<Laney> yeah maybe one of those jugs
<popey> steal one at the next ubuntu event ã
<Laney> ^o)
<awilkins> http://shop.funraniumlabs.com/products/655ml-fmj-stein-of-science.html
<awilkins> Not a sealed container
<awilkins> But good at keeping things cold
<Laney> my word
<awilkins> You can get a 0.5L dewar for Â£200 here : http://www.coleparmer.co.uk/Product/Stainless_Steel_Ln2_Dewar_0_5l_8/UY-03774-08?referred_id=3482&gclid=Cj0KEQjw4uSgBRDZveXz9M-E1aoBEiQA2RMP6rIxt7f5V_lcoeibfOQKug9exC2iN2Zz4NJ3FwNkQtIaAjIG8P8HAQ
<awilkins> Hmm, so depending on shipping the stein would seem to be a bargain
<davmor2> who remembers touche turtle and dum dum
<DJones> o/
<DJones> The name anyway
<davmor2> cartoon equivalent of the lone ranger :)
<davmor2> crossed with zorro
<foobarry> douche turtle?
<daftykins> evening all o/
<popey> http://www.theguardian.com/media/2014/sep/18/bbc-danger-mouse-revival-alexander-armstrong
<popey> yay
<daftykins> \o/
<popey> thanks Laney, now my amazon looks like this https://imgur.com/J5TcPdV â»
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-18
<diplo> Morning all
<DJones> Morning
 * DJones wonders if anybody north of the border has considered setting up #ubuntu-sco in anticipation of a yes vote for Scottish independance
<Laney> popey: nice jugs
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Respect Day! :-D
<JamesTait> Respect to the people responsible for adding the snooze feature to the alarm on Ubuntu Touch! :-P
<Laney> JamesTait: I think it'd be better for me if I knew that I couldn't snooze ...
<Laney> So my only options are: get up now, turn it off and oversleep, or wake up enough to set a new alarm (which will hopefully wake me up enough to get up)
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<JamesTait> Laney, me too, really.
<diddledan> morning folks
<JamesTait> Morning brobostigon, diddledan. :)
<brobostigon> morning JamesTait and diddledan
<mapps> well
<mapps> isnt that great
<mapps> we paid 3200 pounds rent and deposit..my friend phones up at 8am ranting at them drunk
<mapps> and theyve cancelled the rental agreement
<mapps> phoned up saying its nothing to do with me and waiting a call back ..hopefully we can rent it without him
<Laney> drunk at 8am?
<mapps> yep
<mapps> he's a fool
<mapps> just spoke to the guy and looks like we can rent it witohut him
<mapps> gonna cost us more each but reallllly need this place
<foobarry> drunk friends are a liability
<Laney> it's okay at the right time
<foobarry> "wine: Install Mono 2.8 or greater for Windows to run .NET 4.0 applications.
<foobarry> "
<foobarry> trying to run .exe under wine. does that mean install mono for windows under wine?
<directhex> foobarry: that's what it means
<directhex> note: no promises it actually works
<directhex> second note: there's a wine-mono package or something, nothing to do with the mono team, but it contains windows mono
<foobarry> this is one of those timesi wish windows had a live cd
<popey> snapshot your .wine directory, do it, then put it back?
<foobarry> with mono windows or .net 4 though/
<foobarry> wow. mon is 100mb
<foobarry> meh, didn't work
<foobarry> trying winetricks
<popey> http://xda-devcon.com/schedule/ yay!
 * popey is first on, on sunday
<foobarry> anyone 35+ remember this version? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9m7tPikH0UA
<davmor2> foobarry: ;)
<foobarry> i remember they appeared on pebble mill at one
<davmor2> just got posted this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YK7-YTRuFgk
<popey> lolz
<daftykins> temp ban o'clock :)
<Hashed> Hi all.  How do I go about getting a password reset?  I have tried #freenode but no one is responding?
<daftykins> for nickserv? message nickserv
<Hashed> for freenode ideally :)
<daftykins> Hashed: nickserv is freenode's bot. i'm asking what password you want to reset.
<Hashed> my freenode password for this account
<Hashed> i cant use sendpass as im not admin
<daftykins> *facepalm*
<foobarry> didnt they advise everyone to change paaswd for freenode?/
<daftykins> yes but as christel kindly shared it was unlikely the db got touched after all
<foobarry> ah
<daftykins> that user was nowhere near coherent enough to understand what he was after though
<foobarry> dont think i'm using ssl tho
<daftykins> and asking for network support in here is just plain annoying
<daftykins> SASL auth would be more important than SSL i think
<foobarry> i should check that
<daftykins> or i think i heard you can use certificate/key auth of some kind instead of password
<foobarry> ooh
<daftykins> i set up SASL auth with irssi here without too much hassle :)
<daftykins> it has its' limitations though, i see i got disconnected overnight and renamed to daftykin1
<daftykins> so when i renamed myself, i got prompted for my password
<daftykins> i could either send it in plaintext or restart my server connection to re-do SASL auth, which is a tad imperfect
<foobarry> o rregister daftykin1?
<daftykins> well due to the disconnect, i don't think my client would've re-auth'd y'see
<daftykins> if i registered -1, i'd have been prompted to auth as that user - and so probably renamed to guest####
<foobarry> hmnn]
<mapps> well
<mapps> that wasnt fun
<daftykins> ?
<mapps> gotta pay Â£3882 again by tuesday
<mapps> the landlord isnt happy with my friend being on the lease anymore
<mapps> after he phoned up rude and agressive this morning..so its now me and a mate..but the deposi and rent was paid from my mates account..refunding it to him even tho we all paid it
<mapps> right hassle
<mapps> means my rent goes up ~300 quid..bills and everything too ;/
<Laney> try to find someone else
<Laney> what does this mate have to say?
<mapps> he sent an email to paul from bray properties and ccd us all in and said he didnt understand the problem
<mapps> didnt apologise or say sorry..massive idiot
<mapps> but yea means my rent goes up to 800..and even the internet 83 quid for lousy 8mbit ;/
<mapps> between 3..well better than 2 heh
<foobarry> with friends like these...
<mapps> bit annoying..if id paid from ny account wouldnt have to pay again
<mapps> but as he paid and no longer involved they refund him..he owes me and i have to pay them again
<christel> surely your friend will pay you back your part of it?
<mapps> urgh
<mapps> yea
<mapps> but
<mapps> ive still gotta pay 3882 between 2 of us by tuesday
<mapps> he wont get the refund for 2-3 days..and my payment will take 2-3 days to get to them so gotta pay today/tomorow
<christel> :/
<mapps> yea bit annoying
<daftykins> what an odd advertising campaign
<daftykins> but free headphones!
<daftykins> http://sennheiser-urbanite.com/en-GB/#locations
<shauno> if I go to sleep, will scotland still be here in the morning?  such a strange situation
<daftykins> i'm amazed at all the americans following it
<shauno> I'm not.  they highly romanticise their various homelands
<diddledan> shauno: I'm worried about that, too. I'm scared what the world will be like in the morning if I leave it to it's own devices
<daftykins> g'night guys
<diddledan> I'm hoping that the watched results never boil
<shauno> I'm just hoping for level heads.  because with the polls being split that evenly, it's pretty much a given that half a country will feel alienated in the morning
<diddledan> Northern Ireland mk 2
<shauno> anyway.  I should sleep.  I have to get the lady to cut some of my hairs after work tomorrow, so I'd prefer to have my wits about me
<diddledan> the turnout is crazy high
<diddledan> nowai
<diddledan> you're actually going to de-hippify?
<shauno> I'd expect no less.  this might very well be the most important vote any of them ever cast.  and it's close enough that they really do matter, clichÃ© or not
<shauno> oh dude that was years ago.  it just needs regular taming to stop it exploding into a mad-scientist stage now.  my hair doesn't believe in gravity.
<shauno> it seems to behave for a month or so.  and then it explodes into the demon stepchild of stephen fry & einstein
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-19
<diddledan> first result in
<diddledan> yes: 46%; no: 54%
<skellat> Out of what portion reporting?
<diddledan> turnout?
<skellat> What percent of voting territory
<diddledan> donno. it's 1 ward out of 32
<skellat> That works
<skellat> Still way early
<diddledan> but they're all differently sized so you can't say that's 1/32 of the electorate
<diddledan> they're suggesting the final result will be known by three to four hours time
<popey> \o/ Jabber
<MattJ> Jabber \o/
<MattJ> It's too late to do that to me
<MattJ> or early
<popey> hehe
<diddledan> second result in
<diddledan> waiting on the % calc but it's a hefty no
<diddledan> yes: 33%; no: 67%
<popey> quite a difference
<diddledan> they're saying the constituency was pretty much guaranteed to vote no ahead of time
<diddledan> with 2 declared, it's yes: 42%; no: 58%
<diddledan> another 30 to go
<diddledan> I gotta get some sleep - nn
<vetman> anybody alive?
<DJones> Oops, First person to but iphone 6 in Perth dropped it on tv http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/131043-first-person-to-buy-iphone-6-drops-it-on-camera-d-oh-video
<SuperMatt> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/2898-ubuntu-utopic-unicorn-release-party/ BOOM
<foobarry> surprised at the oracle news. everybody knows you can't hurd catz
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<ujjain> what is o2 priority?
<ujjain> a members-only area with discounts for o2 users?
<diplo> pretty muc ujjain
<Myrtti> yup
<diplo> much*
<ujjain> can somebody log in and see if the nexus 7 32gb is on promotion?
<diplo> Can stick an O2 sim card in your phone, install the app and then go back to your original and it still works
<brobostigon> irssi crashed last night, and totally died, amazing.
<foobarry> i get that semi regularly
<brobostigon> maybe its a script i have installed?
<foobarry> why do i get u1 notifications (u1 will be shutting down) when i removed it all?
<Myrtti> yeah I don't get that either
<awilkins> I think I moved all the U1 music out into my main music collection anyway
<awilkins> Hell, at least it wasn't U2 music  ;-D
<foobarry> how much is a new ihpone off-contract?
<brobostigon> something like Â£500 maybe more.
<foobarry> wow.
<foobarry> if only poor people knew about the other phones you can buy
<brobostigon> apple make insane amounts of profit per device.
<foobarry> hence beats
<JamesTait> foobarry, http://askubuntu.com/questions/484328/how-do-i-stop-ubuntu-one-from-telling-me-its-file-service-will-be-shutting-down might help.
<brobostigon> foobarry: people do know about other options, and i am sure most people understand, that most I-devices are meaningless fashion statements, and not always much else.
<foobarry> JamesTait: thanks. beginning to think i did the package removal at home and not at work
<JamesTait> foobarry, `sudo apt-get autoremove --purge python-ubuntuone-storageprotocol` appears to be the magical command.
<Laney> can't we do an update that stops those messages?
<Laney> AFAIK u1 is gone gone gone by now
<foobarry> yep, i did a remove at home only
<JamesTait> It is, but IIRC the U1 client isn't in Trusty at all.
<JamesTait> I don't know enough about packaging, really, but maybe we could do a "Dummy transitional package" that just removes all the code?
 * JamesTait realises what day it is.
 * JamesTait checks.
<awilkins> Friday 19th?
<JamesTait> Yaaarrrr!
<foobarry> let's all laugh at scotland day?
<awilkins> It not be International Talk Like a Pirate day, Jimlad?
<JamesTait> Yaaarrr, ye be right there, awilkins. :)
<JamesTait> Yo ho ho, 'n' shiver me timbers! 'appy Friday 'n' 'appy Talk Like a Pirate Day!  Yaaarrr! :-D
 * davmor2 makes JamesTait walk the plank
<JamesTait> davmor2, surely ye mean launchpad?
<davmor2> JamesTait: yaaarrrrr! Walk the Launchpad it'll take longer and be more painful
<foobarry> did i answer this correctly? http://i.imgur.com/tg79jZc.png
<popey> hah, they're bastards when they do that
<popey> tick tick tick, ooh! no!
<foobarry> still not sure if its correct
<foobarry> was unsolicited named spam. not sure if i got scanned at a show or something
<Myrtti> bah.
<Myrtti> our tp-link had decided to just silently disable 5GHz wlan.
<Myrtti> silly technology
<davmor2> JamesTait: As you wish......that's talking like a pirate right?
<davmor2> Myrtti: stick dd-wrt on it or open-wrt
<JamesTait> davmor2, don't pirates talk about warez and torrents and things?
<davmor2> JamesTait: Inconceivable
<davmor2> JamesTait: I thought most of them spoke Somali
<foobarry> o365 is worse than useless. cannot even bulk select more than about 10 emails at once
<foobarry> and when you scroll down, the screen doesn't refresh the email list
<popey> ( Í¡Â°â­ÍÊâ®Í¡Â° )
 * popey â¥ Unicode
<foobarry> i can't use o666 on my phone either
<foobarry> because it requires admin privs to run the activesync. (zimbra server did not require this for activesync)
<foobarry> hence an incompetent user or sysadmin can wipe the entire device
<awilkins> o365 requires ActiveSync?
<awilkins> Blurrrgh
<foobarry> yesh
<awilkins> I shun ActiveSync because our sysadmin requires the power to nuke my phone from orbit and control my camera usage
<foobarry> oh, i tried imap and my phones data plan got used up in a day
<awilkins> Even if they don't use it, they get get stuffed
<awilkins> For the "convenience" of people being able to pester me via email on my phone, it seems overkill
<foobarry> i checked the helpdesk tickets
<foobarry> students have wiped their phone by mistake
<awilkins> I liked my N900 because it had an ActiveSync connector that ignored such commands from the server
<foobarry> the whole thing
<awilkins> Then ICT got wise to this and refused to let me use it
<DJones> AlanBell: This might be of interest to you & TheOpenSourcerer (along with danfish if he was here) http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/09/19/open_source_nhs/
<foobarry> Motorola Moto G..." has been dispatched
<foobarry> \o/
<Myrtti> new or old?
<foobarry> old was better choice for me
<foobarry> prefer the screen size and the price
<foobarry> and is a trusted model
<foobarry> if the new one had 4g is would be tempted
<ujjain> 	 http://www.novatech.co.uk/products/components/harddrives-internal/solidstate/120gbto200gb/ssdsc2cw120a310.html
<ujjain> cheap!
<awilkins> Yeah, flash storage is getting cheaper... I think that's stock that's going out of fashion
<awilkins> I have one of the 180GB ones in an enclosure and it's very nice
<foobarry> what's the rules about registering an official channel in freenode?
<popey> Dave2: ^
<foobarry> hmm i think you have to be a subreddit moderator
<foobarry> for a #reddit-blah chan
<Myrtti> foobarry: http://freenode.net/policy.shtml#channelownership
<Myrtti> or do it in snoonet
<foobarry> Myrtti: snoonet is a different irc network?
<Myrtti> yup
<christel> yeah, it's where reddit officially moved to when they decided they didn't like us! :)
<foobarry> oh i didn't know that
<foobarry> stuff that.
<foobarry> ircnet+freenode is enough for me
<foobarry> i lost ops on my ## chan and there's a lurker who never goes away
<foobarry> so i can't regain ops
<salmantino> hello you all
<davmor2> salmantino: hello
<davmor2> christel: how could they not like you :)
<salmantino> One possible cliente told me that he is thinking that one of their employees is giving industry secrets using a chat
<salmantino> I was thing using whireshark for captring traffic
<salmantino> but I will need to manage big cap files
<salmantino> I wonder if someone knows a tool to captura only chat traffic
<foobarry> what sort of chat
<salmantino> he told me that saw an explorer windows with de skype logo
<salmantino> so I think that probably is de webskype
<salmantino> but of couser is not 100% sure
<awilkins> Skype is encrypted
<awilkins> Even if you can cap his streams, it just proves he had a big chat
<salmantino> installing something in his computer is not possible?
<foobarry> yes
<foobarry> a keylogged
<salmantino> or a man in the middle in the network?
<foobarry> a keylogger
<awilkins> Man in the middle will only work for things like XMPP over SSL
<foobarry> physical device to sit between kayboard and pc
<MattJ> XMPP \o/
<foobarry> but u will need highest approval for that kind of activity
<davmor2> salmantino: just stick a video camera behind them
<awilkins> foobarry, Keylogger isn't useful if he's cutting and pasting industry secrets
<christel> how very ethical of the employer
 * awilkins has an employer that feeds all our VoIP calls through a SIGINT program
<foobarry> https://www.keelog.com/
<davmor2> keylogger isn't useful if he talks about it on skype
<foobarry> yes it is
<foobarry> ah "talks"
<foobarry> voice call or typing?
<awilkins> Keylogger doesn't help for cut & paste
<salmantino> I thing that is typing
<awilkins> All you'd cap is "ctrl-C"  ... "ctrl-V"
<salmantino> and sending files .... probably
<foobarry> see the link, they have everything u need
<awilkins> Something that periodically caps screenshots may be useful
<foobarry> they do that too
<awilkins> Like that VideoGhost thing
<foobarry> skype chats are saved on the pc
<foobarry> are u sure they deleted them?
<salmantino> I write down VideoGhost, because probably it permit to know what is the way used
<foobarry> do check his skype chat logs though
<salmantino> a skype client is not used. I think that probably is the webskype used for hotmail (outlook)
<salmantino> http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows/outlook/use-skype-in-outlook
<salmantino> this is the skype client that I think that could be used
<directhex> is anyone interested in buying my old gaming pc, minus graphics card, at a knock-down price?
<popey> possibly
<popey> wot is it?
<nickkkkkk_> hi anybody here to help?
<nickkkkkk_> im getting an error saying couldnt open input file, no such file or directory
<nickkkkkk_> how do i fix this ?
<nickkkkkk_> it wont let me scalpel the file
<BigRedS> what is "it"; what file is it trying to open? I think we' need some context in order to be useful
<foobarry> so i received Â£25 premium bond "winnings"
<foobarry> except its not me but the dead guy who used to live here
<foobarry> need to phone them up
<foobarry> family might like to cash in Â£500+
<Azelphur> lmfao that was hilarious
<Azelphur> I just tried to get on a national express coach with an email ticket, I put it on my watch because I like showing off my gadgetry, the ticket number was clearly displayed but the driver was saying he couldn't see it so I pulled it up on my phone
<Azelphur> he then told me "You've committed forgery by doing that, you've copied your ticket"
<Azelphur> I'm like uhh...it's an email...if I open it on my laptop and my tablet does that mean I have 4 tickets?
<Azelphur> he said yes, then went quiet for a minute, then told me to "Just get on" hahaha
<Azelphur> you wouldn't pirate a coach ticket, I guess.
<diplo> I don't know, I know of people who try it with train tickets
<Azelphur> diplo, and it'd never work because they are supposed to check the ticket number
<diplo> It's the barcode on the back for getting out at stations
<awilkins> Magstripe
<awilkins> Never researched them but probably really simple to forge
<Azelphur> ah
<diplo> Supposedly the train one is the hardest hes tried
<Azelphur> yea probably
<awilkins> Even Oysters were very easy to forge last time I looked
<diplo> He bought a writer off ebay and has cloned / created lots of things
<diplo> But the train ones he can't decode
<Azelphur> diplo, the national express ones should be impossible, they give you a unique ref and the driver is supposed to check it
<awilkins> That was when they were using Mifare 1k though
<Azelphur> although on this occasion he wasn't doing his job properly
<awilkins> Mifare 1k uses weak-tea encryption
<Azelphur> all he should need is the ticket number, which I had displayed front and center :)
<diplo> He earns lots of money, so really saving money isn't the thing he just likes to try these things
<diplo> inquisitive mind I guess
<diplo> I for one wouldn't have the patience :D
<awilkins> I used to work for a firm doing smartcards for loyalty cards, bus tickets, etc
<Azelphur> diplo, I'm planning on doing the oysters one day
<awilkins> And Mifare 1k were pretty weak even in those days (Pentium 4 era)
<Azelphur> it'd be nice to have my phone emulate it
<awilkins> I imagine throwing a decent GPU at them they'd break in a few minutes
<awilkins> They have piddly tiny storage areas too ; we used to do things like use 6-bit integers packed on arbitrary bit boundaries to try and cram as many fields into the card as possible
 * awilkins wrote VB6 code to pack n-bit structs on arbitrary boundaries and then hash them for a checksum and feels both proud and dirty
<foobarry> nothing quite as annoying as a bluebottle in the room who won't fly out of the window
<awilkins> Wikipedia says : Oyster was Mifare 1k Classic until Dec 2009 (very hackable)
<awilkins> Now they are MIFARE DESFire EV1 : No idea how hackable
<awilkins> ASsume they use Triple DES encryption which isn't awesome
<davmor2> foobarry: swap the bluebottle for a wasp
<foobarry> heh
<awilkins> In something of a misnomer, MIFARE DESFire EV1 supports AES128
<diddledan> morning
<awilkins> Erm
 * awilkins gestures at the clock
<foobarry> thunder
<foobarry> tv style
<foobarry> yup, storm's a coming
<Azelphur> foobarry, where you at? :)
<Azelphur> hmm, I just turned on the air con in this coach, the aircon appears to be citrus flavoured.
<Azelphur> ...weird
<foobarry> n london
<Azelphur> foobarry, cool, so I'm gonna get rained on :P
 * Azelphur is on the coach at Canterbury, headed to London Victoria
<foobarry> it was doing it in the bight too
<foobarry> s/n/b
<foobarry> meh
<Azelphur> fun
<diplo> We had awesome storms last night
<diplo> Started about 7pm finished 4am ish
<diplo> Thunder / lightning and lots of localised flooding :)
<diplo> Friends dads house got struck by lightning
<Azelphur> nothing eventful in the thanet area storm related :<
<Azelphur> dam :o
<Azelphur> I am so tempted to load the ticket up on my laptop and tablet
<Azelphur> and do some kind of 4-device balancing act as I walk off the coach with the ticket loaded on all 4 devices
<Azelphur> but the practicality of doing that while carrying 2 bags would be prohibitive :<
<foobarry> how do extract folders from a tar that are called Keep!23
<foobarry> Keep!24, etc
<foobarry> have resorted to gui
<foobarry> tar xvfz all.tar.gz Keep\!* doesn't work
<foobarry> "tar: use --wildcards to enable pattern matching,"
<foobarry> ah
<foobarry> nope
<diddledan> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2014/09/netflix-linux-html5-nss-change-request
<dubfej> hi. my monitor has a shadow in the shape of a triangle at the bottom of the monitor. it's not there at bootup, it appears at some point after the desktop loads. sometimes half of the screen "shadows up" as well. any ideas what it could be? the shadows seem to come and go as they please
<directhex> is anyone interested in buying my old gaming pc, minus graphics card, at a knock-down price?
<foobarry> nah, don't do desktops any more
<popey> 13:28:34 < popey> possibly
<popey> 13:28:41 < popey> wot is it?
<awilkins> popey, Ooh, Netflix Native
<awilkins> popey, I presume this will use squillions fewer CPU cycles
<davmor2> awilkins: or squillions more
<dutchie> or possibly the same amount!
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-20
<foobarry> meh
<foobarry> gloomy weather
<foobarry> my phone is out for delivery so when i see lost guy in the street i keep thinking its him
<shauno> if you see him, it's probably not the delivery guy.  they're trained by ninjas to sneak up and slip a 'sorry we missed you' note without you ever spotting them
<foobarry> the first 3 links in the bbc "most read" today are from 2013 and 2012 :S
<foobarry> http://imgur.com/a/eV8H7 work in progress
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<dutchie> hi brobostigon
<brobostigon> hi dutchie
<penguin421> better, I think
<penguin421> hmm, not yet
<penguin42> right
<directhex> apparently nobody's in the market for a used desktop pc.
<penguin42> the problem is new ones aren't that pricey; what spec?
<foobarry> argh my sim isn't micro. scissors to the rescue
<daftykins> directhex: trying to get rid? :)
<daftykins> foobarry: i hope it's not an iPhone 6 you just got :P
<foobarry> nope... moto
<daftykins> ah-har
<foobarry> i can get 6 moto for 1 ihpone
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> nice model btw, those tiles look fiddly
<foobarry> :D
<foobarry> ta
<foobarry> tiles were actually moulded as one block
<foobarry> the main issue is a decent paint job
<daftykins> ah i see, so it is to be a model of a rundown building
<foobarry> yes
<foobarry> diorama will have other stuff in it too
<foobarry> maybe creeping vines and a tank
<directhex> daftykins, yes.
<directhex> penguin42, i7 920, 12G DDR3, 240GB SSD, 1TB SSHD
<daftykins> foobarry: :D i look forward to updates
<foobarry> :P
<penguin42> directhex: Decent spec - how much were you asking for it?
<directhex> penguin42, depends on whether i can find someone who'll take it with no GPU (i'd like to put it in my wife's PC, since she already has the same one, for SLI)
<daftykins> lol SLI
<daftykins> :)
<daftykins> directhex: do you have anything up online about it? i have a friend in England who may know someone
<directhex> daftykins, not yet
<penguin42> directhex: cex do seem to buy desktops, but I bet they don't pay much
<popey> i wonder if directhex has me on ignore
<penguin42> directhex: I guess that's probably what - ~400 ?
<popey> i responded twice
<directhex> popey, bah, i need an IRC bouncer :/
<daftykins> popey also needs to highlight people ;)
<popey> i replied _immediately_ afterwards
<popey> anyone who asks a question then walks away from the screen needs to re-evaluate their IRC use :Ã¾
<popey> by "immediately" I mean "10 mins" â»
<penguin42> popey: Depends on the channel; I know some channels with ~2 hour latency; it might be a challenge to wait that long
<daftykins> hah, sadly that doesn't apply to channels i'm in :(
<directhex> "don't irc if you have a toddler"?
<popey> true dat
<penguin42> my irc clients have this thing called a scrollbar - great invention
<daftykins> hehe
<daftykins> penguin42: cheeky chappy ;)
<directhex> right, back from the park, toddler in bed
<directhex> popey, please repeat your original response to my "pc for sale" query
<popey> lolz
<popey> 18:01:00 < popey> 13:28:34 < popey> possibly
<popey> 18:01:00 < popey> 13:28:41 < popey> wot is it?
 * popey wanders off ã
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> i look forward to the conclusion of this transaction in Q1'15
<shauno> an optimist, I see
<daftykins> :)
<directhex> lian-li PC-B25B; zalman power supply (at least 650W, i'd have to look it up); Gigabyte GA-EX58-UD5 motherboard; Intel Core i7 920, 6x2GB DDR3; LG BD-ROM/DVDRW drive; Kingston HyperX 240GB SSD; Seagate 1TB SSHD
<popey> how much were you looking for?
<directhex> 3-400? i dunno. low hassle is worth a big discount. what does ebay say for the parts? hm...
<directhex> looks like an easy Â£150 for the cpu+mobo+some ram, few extra quid for the second 6gb, Â£30 for the case, Â£75 for the ssd, Â£50 for the sshd, Â£40 for the power supply, Â£25 for the optical drive
<directhex> oh, and there's a windows vista home basic oem license on the back. and i'll toss in windows 7 pro upgrade and windows 8 pro upgrade licenses
<directhex> Â£300 for the above (please note no GPU) seems fair to me
<directhex> since you could strip & ebay it and turn a profit
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/nqansosdlr83eea/IMG_20140920_144436.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> new free desk \o/
<directhex> so much room for activities!
<foobarry> hmmm wish i was in new look with the missis just now. she ordered an item, turns out the wrong one when she went to collect it, they wouldn't refund her, only give a store credit :@
<foobarry> thats not legal
<foobarry> said the product she ordered wasnt in stock anymore either
<daftykins> directhex: and none to do! \o/
<ali1234> omg wtf
<ali1234> the video overlay key colour used by mplayer conflicts with the green font on nvidia's forums
<ali1234> so if you have a video playing in the background when you visit it looks like you've got weird font corruption
<zmoylan-pi> they're hoping this will make you buy a new video card? :-)
<directhex> ali1234, who still uses colour key overlay for video playback? ._.
<zmoylan-pi> hardware decoding for dvds?
<ali1234> directhex: actually turns out it was from flash
<ali1234> not mplayer
<ali1234> specifically youtube
<shauno> that doesn't sound right.  flash is a bastion of good behaviour and modern design
<daftykins> http://www.twitch.tv/oculus Carmack talking dev
<penguin42> There was an Oculus in CEX today - I was almost tempted
<popey> yeah, i saw one in cex a few weeks back
<tripleclones> hi all, I'm having some weird issues with a iwl3945 card on a thinkpad t60 running 14.04 - seems to only connect when it wants :(
<daftykins> mmm, pretty old that one
<daftykins> i think i've heard of there being two main drivers available and sometimes the other is the better
<tripleclones> I have tried iwl-legacy as well
<popey> â¹ intel wifi
<tripleclones> yeah
<popey> used to be the benchmark. has gone down hill over the years
<tripleclones> this is a old device, was running 12.04 fine, I've read some people have similar issues on jessy and mint 17
<daftykins> may as well carry on with 12.04.5 for another 2 years
<tripleclones> thats what I was thinking
<tripleclones> its a family laptop - the way it gets treated 2 years is wishful thinking ;)
<daftykins> hahaha
<daftykins> oh dear
<daftykins> tripleclones: oddly i have the same card in an old sony ultraportable that's working just fine under xubuntu 14.04.1
<tripleclones> um
<popey> i have the same in my toshiba i think, not had a problem
<daftykins> tripleclones: was it an upgrade?
<popey> daftykins: you watching this carmack thing?
<daftykins> popey: yes sir
<tripleclones> daftykins: yes
<daftykins> i'm no developer, but it's interesting :)
<daftykins> tripleclones: hmm, wouldn't hurt to try a live session if you haven't
<tripleclones> daftykins: if I'm going to reinstall fresh are you thinking it might be worth trying a fresh trusty first?
<tripleclones> daftykins: I haven't - thats a good idea
<daftykins> yeah sure, are you using unity though?
<tripleclones> daftykins: yes it works fine for my family
<tripleclones> it was easier moving to unity then it would have been teaching them to use windows 8 ;)
<daftykins> hehe
<daftykins> i just think for older hardware that xubuntu is a really nice setup
<penguin42> mate is nice
<tripleclones> problem is the main desktop family use for games (well minecraft) is unity - I like to keeps things consistent
<daftykins> not sure how the desktop environment influences minecraft's use?
<daftykins> maybe i'm being slow
<tripleclones> it doesn't sorry
<tripleclones> I just cant be bothered to change both and teach wife and kids
<tripleclones> (mainly wife)
<daftykins> :D fair enough
<popey> is xfce still being maintained?
<daftykins> pass!
<tripleclones> popey: what channel is the carmack thing on?
<daftykins> tripleclones: http://www.twitch.tv/oculus
<daftykins> aaand it's done
<tripleclones> ah I thought it was a documentary or such like
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-21
<map> thm
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<MartijnVdS> \o
<brobostigon> morning MartijnVdS
<OERIAS> Wave of Mutilation- Pixies
<Myrtti> morning
<OERIAS> Good Morning Myrtti
<map> hi all
<daftykins> afty
<map> i might have bee=n a bit optimistic :( been having to take stuff out of my cases
<map> sucks
<daftykins> what!
<daftykins> map: is the trip off? :(
<map> noo
<map> just mean i packed too much
<map> lol
<daftykins> oooh :)
<diddledan> arnie is looking old
<map> what u watching]
<diddledan> just been looking at the trailer for "sabotage"
<map>  b ah seen 8it
<map> was ok
<SuperEngineer> woah, that was close!  got back from working *just in time* to watch F1 on neeb... worried that expecting F1, I tuned into Somgsa of Praise!  no prob...2 mins early :)
<daftykins> XD
<map> =]
<map> wasnt the f1 at like 1?
<SuperEngineer> sssh! I was working... no spoilers [pretty please]
<map> ah
<penguin42> must be better, you can cut out all the boring laps
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> i resisted commenting ;D
<DJones> SuperEngineer: I can confirm that Jim Clark didn't win todays race
<DJones> Sorry for that spoiler
<map> lol
 * daftykins wonders who that is
<map> google eliminates the need to ask questions;p
<daftykins> and also eliminates the ability to have a conversation
<DJones> daftykins: daftykins Just because he was Scottish and they nearly voted for independance, no need to ignore one of the greatest racing drivers :)
 * DJones removes a duplicate daftykins 
<penguin42> popey: I see you've got to behave yourself on Saturday evening so you can give a talk on Sunday :-)
<SuperEngineer> DJones: you seem to be right re Jim Clark.  He's nowhere on the leaderboard right now!
<DJones> SuperEngineer: Just tell whoever is in first to keep looking over their shoulder
<SuperEngineer> :D
<daftykins> through some kind of time travel telephone? :)
<SuperEngineer> well, Dr. Who replay is on later... I could send that very request! [in my world that is possible, my world is nice ;) ]
<SuperEngineer> all applications to join my planet are welcome... though seldom accepted
<daftykins> i must avoid, as Dr. Who airings don't fit for me
<SuperEngineer> daftykins ...try a different size?
<map> hmm the strain on tonight..yay
<popey> penguin42: lolz â»
<popey> penguin42: you will come and say hello won't you?
<penguin42> popey: Yep, I probably won't be there on the Friday but will on the Saturday and probably Sunday
<popey> awesome
<SuperEngineer> re oggcamp - I've just tempted a colleague to cover for me... if colleague accepts... any local accomodation left?
<SuperEngineer> [Saturday night - 1 night]
<SuperEngineer> hmm.. there goes that plan
<SuperEngineer> 1 oggcamp.org = 504 gateway timeout ;(
<SuperEngineer> 2 it's only 40 miles from home... this is frustrating... come *on* colleague - phone back!
<popey> thanks
<SuperEngineer> [if he doesn't phone in next 15 minutes - his name will become public!]
<popey> http://uselessd.darknedgy.net/ lolz
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-14
<mapps> yello
<mapps> moved all my stuff to my mates till i move on tuesday and one of my suitcases te zips come off the teeth
<mapps> :<
<mapps> yay time for fear the walking dead
<knightwise> moenin f
<knightwise> i mean .. good morning
<zmoylan-pi> you mean good moaning
<leecowdrey_> ð
<davmor2> Morning all
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy Eat a Hoagie Day! ð
 * zmoylan-pi has to look up what a hoagie is 
 * bashrc_ does not know what a Hoagie is
<JamesTait> https://www.daysoftheyear.com/days/eat-a-hoagie-day/
<zmoylan-pi> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submarine_sandwich#Hoagie
<bashrc_> ah
 * zmoylan-pi has some ham and chicken slices that need to go into a sandwich soon so that's lunch taken care of
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<JamesTait> zmoylan-pi, that's the spirit! ð
<JamesTait> brobostigon, ð
<brobostigon> hi JamesTait
<brobostigon> :)
<davmor2> JamesTait: this seems oddly appropriate https://vimeo.com/86120207
<JamesTait> davmor2, I was expecting https://youtu.be/ZcJjMnHoIBI
<davmor2> JamesTait: yeah but come on they are yellow submarines
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<dutchie> hi bigcalm
<bigcalm> o/
<davmor2> morning bigcalm how's life
<bigcalm> davmor2: feeling cool despite the temp. gauge saying 21.5C
<bigcalm> davmor2: how's yourself?
<davmor2> bigcalm: good thanks :)
<davmor2> bigcalm: man the tiger that is brave
<davmor2> bigcalm: I wouldn't take your laptop
<bigcalm> ?
<bigcalm> davmor2: was that intended for me?
<davmor2> bigcalm: see the mailing list
<bigcalm> Ah, I don't have that email account on this machine in the office. I'll pop onto gmail.com
<bigcalm> davmor2: which ML?
<davmor2> bigcalm: wolves
<bigcalm> Oh!
<bigcalm> I hadn't even noticed the change of venue :)
<bigcalm> Noted about the laptop
<bigcalm> I did find it odd that sparks spoke of a canal
<davmor2> bigcalm: the angel and tiger are known for the shoplifter to off load stuff as there isn't a big police presences but they might of cleaned up their acts a bit
<mapps> just had such a nice calzone:D
<foobarry> hungry. stuck in a meeting
<mapps> ;D
<mapps> montys is goo
<mapps> d
<mapps> ham, cheese, extra cheese , pepperoni
<mapps> just gotta run 1000000km to burn it off;p
 * bigcalm tucks in to a disappointing mug shot
<diplo> I also have a drawer full of mugshots
<diplo> But made a wrap this morning when making kids lunches
<bigcalm> directhex: have you managed to get Evoland working in Linux?
 * popey has a peanut butter sarnie
<popey> nom
<diplo> yuck popey, even hate making them for the boys :/
<popey> mmmm peanut butter and banana is delicious
<Azelphur> these...these are so shiny. http://gaming.logitech.com/en-us/product/g933-7-1-surround-sound-gaming-headset
<Azelphur> definitely getting them as soon as they come out :P
<czajkowski> popey: crunchy or smooth ?
<popey> I prefer crunchy
<foobarry> http://forum.xda-developers.com/moto-g/development/ubuntu-touch-utopic-ubuntu-touch-falcon-t2820359
<foobarry> need an app to read all pages of a xda thread and summarise the pertinent parts that are not subsequently redacted or corrected
<popey> there is a forum app on ubuntu phone :)
<popey> not sure it can do the intelligent bit
<czajkowski> popey: it's the best
<popey> http://www.dabs.com/products/intel-compute-stick-atom-z3735f-1-33ghz-2gb-hdmi-windows-8-1-BBD0.html  they have them on discount
<popey> the windows versions, but they're more powerful
<foobarry> hp microservers are still cheap
<foobarry> http://www.ebuyer.com/722189-hp-proliant-gen8-g1610t-4gb-ram-microserver-819185-421
<foobarry> thought they had gone pricey, but nice and cheap again
<foobarry> Â£115
 * popey is boycotting them
<foobarry> over bios updates?
<popey> ya
<foobarry> have you told them? they might think you are just really happy with your current one :D
<popey> hah
<popey> well, I do still have my first generation N36L
<popey> which I am very happy with
<popey> that is cheap tho
<foobarry> how soon after purcahse are they withdrawing support for bios?
<foobarry> i haven't been able to find out yet as hp site is so awfl
<popey> when warranty runs out
<foobarry> 2013.10.01 (A)
<foobarry> 15 Nov 2013
<foobarry> last bios upgrade
<foobarry> EU warranty is 2 yrs?
<davmor2> foobarry: popey: http://www.serversplus.com/servers/tower_servers/hp_tower_servers
<davmor2> foobarry: Top one reads a similar spec Â£5 cheaper with next day deleivery :)
<popey> still not buying it
<foobarry> does the gen7 servers do ilom out of the box?
<foobarry> or you need a separate card?
<directhex> bigcalm: i have, historically, managed to do so
<bigcalm> directhex: humf. Just a black window for me. Maybe I'll give in and play it on Windows instead
<directhex> the black window happens on 64-bit distros
<bigcalm> Don't think I want to move back to 32bit ;)
<directhex> it's something like needing to bundle your own 32-bit chrome into the game dir
<directhex> otherwise it tries to use 32-bit flash on distro chrome
<bigcalm> I see
<directhex> https://steamcommunity.com/app/233470/discussions/0/617329150698258331/?insideModal=1
<bigcalm> Not very out of the boxish, but manageable I guess.
<bigcalm> Thanks :)
<foobarry> so i can pay my speeding fine online but i have to send my photocard off? WHYYY?
<popey> blimey, that compute stick disappeared
<zmoylan-pi> because some one wants the post office to survive
<zmoylan-pi> i didn't see no compute stick >_>
<zmoylan-pi> <_<
<foobarry> Under the new system, drivers will be able to view their up-to-date licence information online and generate a check code to share details with other organisations, while penalty points will only be recorded electronically.
<foobarry> As of June 8, new penalty points (endorsements) will only be recorded electronically, and will not be printed or written on either photocard licences or paper driving licences.
<foobarry> insanity
<zmoylan-pi> in ireland you have to bring your licence to get the points marked on it i think.  nice fines if you don't bring it
<popey> i went on holiday, got a code, didn't get asked for it by hertz
<foobarry> i have to send mine off
<popey> in-laws were insistent that I take my paper counterpart with me
<foobarry> for someone to do nothing to it
<popey> which I also wasn't asked for
<popey> yeah, told them I've shredded it
<zmoylan-pi> i do remember seeing someone who got a final notice for some service for 0p.  and demanded immediate payment.  the reminders didn't stop till they sent a cheque for 0p
<foobarry> zmoylan-pi: they should have sent cash
<zmoylan-pi> they tried sending letters explaining that they were sending no cash but the computer didn't recognise that...
<celesteh> Hello, I have a thinkpad, running ubuntu with a smallish SSD drive in it. I want a bigger drive. Apparently, there are two hard drive slots in this computer, one is SSD-only and harder to reach. Is there a way to find out which one I'm using via software?
<celesteh> alternately, any suggestions on who does good work on laptops in london?
<foobarry> not sure i understand the question. which thinkpad is it celesteh ?
<foobarry> ah, i understand the quesiton
<foobarry> someone in here might own the same own
<foobarry> model
<celesteh> x220
<foobarry> popey has one i think
<celesteh> lshw is showing the Disk as SCSI instead of attached to the sata
<foobarry> does dmidecode also work?
<foobarry> works like lshw
<diplo> celesteh: Pretty sure sata disks show as scsi anyway
<popey> my laptop is an x220 yes
<popey> i have 2 SSds in it
<popey> one 9mm and one msata
<popey> technically you should use a 7mm ssd in an x220, but a 9mm fits at a push :)
<popey> celesteh: the x220 does take 'regular' sata disks
<celesteh> I bought mine with a ssd in it. This is probably not an msata?
<zmoylan-pi> will it not show what's listed in the bios?
<bigcalm> smart might tell you what's installed?
<celesteh> I have a vague hope that I could pop a second hard drive in the more accessible slot
<popey> only msata
<popey> there's no other bay on the x220
<celesteh> I looked at this web page and it gave me hope of just adding a drive rather than replacing: http://www.storagereview.com/lenovo_thinkpad_x220_upgrade_guide
<celesteh> It sugests there is a less accessible spot for ssd drives, under the part below the keyboard
<popey> the msata port?
<popey> the last photo on the page shows it
<celesteh> yes.
<popey> http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0085J17UA
<celesteh> Is my drive likely to be in that spot? Is it possible to put an SSD drive in the more accessible spot for hard drives?
<popey> thats the device i have in mine
<popey> no
<popey> your drive is more likely to be in the side slot
<celesteh> ok, cheers
<popey> open disk utility and you can see what model of drive you have there
<popey> that will be a dead giveaway
<celesteh> NTEL SSDSA2BW160G3L (4PC1LE04)
<celesteh> Intel
<celesteh> Google is revealing they had a nasty firmware bug in 2008
<zmoylan-pi> i hope people who bought devices then are able to upgrade to get rid of it
<celesteh> google image searches for this show that it's in a normal size drive enclosure, so that is a giveaway
<celesteh> ok, thanks all
<foobarry> using apache, or otherwise, can i secure an API to only allow GET commands rather than PUT ones?
<foobarry> hmm maybe Limit and LimitExcept might do it
<foobarry> aussie PM changed 5 times in six years :-|
<zmoylan-pi> maybe they should vote one in who doesn't need nappies? :-)
<foobarry> how can i block videos posted my my facebook friend but see their written stuff?
<foobarry> used to be easy
<zmoylan-pi> if it were easy facebook would have to change it :-P
<JamesTait> Correct, foobarry: Limit and LimitExcept are what you want.
<JamesTait> Late response, I know, but I was on the school run.
<diddledan> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/science/space/11856221/Humans-may-accidentally-send-aliens-a-computer-virus.html
<zmoylan-pi> windows vista? :-)
<foobarry> JamesTait: somebody else suggested http://httpd.apache.org/docs/trunk/mod/mod_allowmethods.html
<davmor2> JamesTait: Liar I've seen schools and not one of them ran anywhere
<JamesTait> foobarry, interesting. I note that module is "experimental". I wonder if the intention is for it to replace Limit and LimitExcept at some point.
 * foobarry sticks with limit
<JamesTait> davmor2, you just haven't been watching the right schools. ð
<davmor2> JamesTait: that or you just lie :P
<JamesTait> As if!
<zmoylan-pi> may i be struck down b<CONNECTION LOST>
<davmor2> hahaha
<diddledan> the konami code works on microsoft's homepage right now
<popey> diddledan: and dabs
<foobarry> wow twitter is totally down
<diddledan> oh?
<diddledan> I'm getting tweets appeaing in tweetdeck
<foobarry> twitter.com is shagged
<diddledan> ooh
<diddledan> it is, too
<diddledan> "something is 'technically' wrong"
<diddledan> it's only "technically" wrong tho, nothing really important
<foobarry> http://imgur.com/atPeN3h
<daftykins> well that's what's wrong see, it doesn't have its' second clamp!
<diddledan> yeah
 * diddledan snips
<daftykins> flags at half mast at the moment over here it seems, the Queen's local rep the Lieutenant Governer died
<diddledan> oh I thought you were being family unfriendly
<daftykins> i'm a good lad!
<mapps> hi all:D
<mapps> sorted my electric and water for new place..yay, not yay i have to make sure i stay up on 17th 1.15 somene comes round to inspect the electric lol like what
<mapps> someone lived there till today
<mapps> 27th someone comes rounnd 10a to connect the water
<mapps> had to go these places in person with my passport, rental contract etc..so annoying in the uk signup online..done
<daftykins> 0o
<daftykins> just got my first monthly security update on the Nexus 4 from Google
<daftykins> 7MB update
<diddledan> when does M arrive?
<daftykins> no idea
<daftykins> newer versions don't really do anything for me, so i've lost interest for the most part :)
<mapps> oh and i had to go to the gib bank again..absoute joke 4months ago i signed up..emaile told its here soon..email no reply..go in today an told my acs open then told 'nope the copy of your passport wasnt clear enough' so why didn't someone email/phone? or even tell me when i emailed them
<daftykins> Google don't even care that trying to video call with skype causes the Nexus 4 to go blank and cease functioning
<diddledan> ouch
<daftykins> mapps: nasty
<diddledan> wonder whether that's an endemic android thing or skype doing something funky
<mapps> then i ask to change address as i move on thursday and i'm told il need to write a letter, had my rental contract with me luckily so the girl photocopies it and writes my address and says to sign -- she writes the address of the estate agents
<mapps> seriously what's wrong here lol
<daftykins> diddledan: well if you go back to pre-4.3 on the Nexus 4 like a mate did, it works fine
 * brobostigon has heard marshmellow will arive on either the 28th or 29th.
<brobostigon> my bet is the 28th.
<brobostigon> anyhow, on my nexus 4, the only chance of marshmellow/droid-v.6, is CM.
<brobostigon> i doubt google will be making a version for the nexus 4.
<daftykins> i think i already read it's still getting it, but i've wondered when the chop will come
<brobostigon> wow, ok.
<daftykins> i might be remembering wrong
<brobostigon> i was going to say, thats new news to me.
<Myrtti> I just got yet another update on my Nexus 5
<Myrtti> with a ... um July kernel
<daftykins> probably the security update i just did
<daftykins> should've bumped your build from ending in M to ending in I i think it was
<daftykins> ah no the other way around of course
<daftykins> way2alphabet dafty
<Myrtti> mine was a bit bigger tho
<Myrtti> than 7MB
<diddledan> I've not had mine yet
<Myrtti> but you've got 4 and I've got 5
<diddledan> just prodded the check-now button and it still says I'm up -to-date with a build ending in I on an N6
<diddledan> https://letsencrypt.org/2015/09/14/our-first-cert.html
<diddledan> \o/
<daftykins> you've got a 6? :o
<daftykins> slow waves :)
<diddledan> :-p
<shauno> harrow
<diddledan> hans brix?
<daftykins> hey sir
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/cu6ny33lb0mmznm/IMG-20150914-WA0013.jpeg?dl=0
<daftykins> cold tonight
<shauno> that's not cold, that's shorts.
<diddledan> and a fluffy thing
<daftykins> not cold for me ;)
<mapps> hm cant find router user/pass
<mapps> Axtel ZNID 24xx on this u-mee thing
<diddledan> mapps: root/root
<mapps> seems decent enough, i signed up today - 3months free no connection 50mbit/ohone/tv ...tv uses internet and still gets sk 1 hd..sky sports etc i think off some south spain satellite and then relayed?
<mapps> booo didnt work..tried user/user admin/admin
<mapps> admin/pass
<daftykins> sounds naughty
<daftykins> what are you trying to do? port forward?
<mapps> yea it does to me too daftykins but look yourself, proper company u-mee.com i think somehow it's legal as they get it from south spain satellites not uk
<mapps> nah just poke around
<mapps> like if you look at http://www.theskydoctor.com everyone living in south spain from work uses this
<mapps> and gets ALL the channels espn..bt.sky apparently off greek satellites relayed through the net to them at home..how is this legal?!
<mapps> tried t find out more but couldnt find much online
<mapps> anyone use anything similar?
<shauno> nope, law-abiding citizen here :)
<daftykins> not fussed about having TV service at all
<mapps> heh
<shauno> I'm annoyed at my isp atm.  I've had the same ip address since I moved in here.
<shauno> went on vacation for a week, and it changed while I was gone.
<shauno> it's like they did it on purpose.
<daftykins> :/
<brobostigon> i think i could survive with iplayer and syfy :)
<daftykins> Murphy's law right there
<brobostigon> with just*
<mapps> heh
<mapps> havent checked iplayer for a while
<mapps> watched first dates on 4od earlier , so funny:D
<brobostigon> bbc2, bbc4 and syfy, what more do you need. i think the funniest prog i have watched recently was mock the week.
<mapps> would i lie to you is good
<mapps> assuming it's stillon
<brobostigon> i agree. it is yes.
<shauno> hm, I read that as "assuming it's stilton" and was quite confused
<brobostigon> not stilton?
<brobostigon> sorry, i didnt read it properly.
<mapps> oops silly me not putting a space in
<daftykins> shauno: me too!
<diddledan> me three
<diddledan> "I'm not saying that a blood sacrifice is guaranteed to fix sendmail. I'm just saying it's worth a shot."
<mapps> ;]
<shauno> josh always used to recommend sacrificing chickens.  can't say it's gone wrong yet
<diddledan> yeah but he runs freebsd.
<shauno> still, bbq chicken pizza is certainly a cornerstone of my mail stack
<diddledan> speaking of which, what exactly are pretzels?
<diddledan> ofc nobody in here knows of whom we speak :-p
<shauno> you ever get those snacks that are like a really skinny, salty breadstick?
<shauno> if you tie a knot in one, you get a pretzel :)
<diddledan> lol
<shauno> my phone keeps telling me to upgrade off the ios beta.  every single time I unlock it.  which is all very well, but it's not an OTA upgrade.
<shauno> grrr.
<diddledan> oops
<daftykins> :D
<mapps> heh
<mapps> what version of ios
<daftykins> smells like a 9 preview
<mapps> ive never ha a pretzel;]
<daftykins> https://imgur.com/gallery/RdvdmoH
<daftykins> d'aww
<diddledan> yey kitties
<shauno> hm.  according to itunes, my phone hasn't been backed up since ww1
<zmoylan-pi> maybe it means iraq war ii
<shauno> nah, it says 1910
<zmoylan-pi> ah irak war 0
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-15
<mapps> hah wrong date on phone or machine?
<shauno> nah, they're both right
<shauno> I just seem to attract all the really silly bugs.  I found one they told me simply wasn't possible, until I showed them how to replicate it in two clicks
<shauno> (and nothing particularly silly either.  just view->fullscreen instead of using the green button in the corner)
<mapps> crazy how people bet on e-sports now live
<mapps> people bet on CS matches
<daftykins> https://imgur.com/gallery/4UJj0 - pretty creepy
<daftykins> people that died climbing Everest and are still there
<zmoylan-pi> maybe it's set to the bermuda triangle time zone :-P
<zmoylan-pi> and they're still looking for the camera of guys who died there pre 50s as it may show they made it to top before hillary
<shauno> I'm not sure it should matter if they did
<zmoylan-pi> they did it with a lot less equipment so it would be a harder feat
<shauno> for fatal versions of "did it"
<zmoylan-pi> wouldn't be the first to be remembered that way
<shauno> I think surviving should be a pretty solid cornerstone of any record
<zmoylan-pi> if scott had lived we probably wouldn't remember his efforts
<shauno> that austrian chap who jumped out the crazy high balloon wouldn't be much of a 'feat' if he'd bounced
<zmoylan-pi> shackleton had turned back a few years earlier just 90 miles short of the pole knowing if they had continued they'd have died
<zmoylan-pi> and the austrian was just copying the guy who did it in 50s-60s
<shauno> well yeah, faster/higher/stronger is how most of out records work, bar 'firsts'
<zmoylan-pi> and the austrians record won't last as long as the first guys
<mapps> https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xft1/v/t1.0-9/11822845_1044550198922500_2308435408354424670_n.jpg?oh=8790af22da740c11fc10b1ab9b4054ce&oe=566254BD
<diddledan> ok, so I've acquired a series of files and I can't figure out how they fit together to form a coherent rar archive for expansion
<diddledan> there's definitely rar data in there so I'm sure they're a multipart rarchive
<diddledan> but the filenames are.. weird
<diddledan> http://paste.ubuntu.com/12413924/ shows the names
<shauno> hah.
<m0nkey_> diddledan, did you encrypt your pr0n collection and having trouble opening it now?
<diddledan> picking -0.1 and running `file` on it says that particular file is from a multipart rarchive
<diddledan> or rather file reports it's rar and running `unrar v .....` says it's part of a multipart
<shauno> I think I'd try two things.  first, md5 the lot of them and make sure you don't have a buttload of duplicates
<diddledan> how do I find dupes?
<shauno> second, look at the sizes.  if they're all the same size with one smaller, it's likely all one archive.  if they're mostly the same size but several smaller, you've got more than one archive
<shauno> something like md5sum * | sort | uniq -c -w 32
<shauno> which will get uniq to count duplicates, but only consider the first 32 chars
<shauno> (mostly because those filenames look like something's been trying to prevent filename collision, repeatedly.  I can't think of any other sane reason for that mess)
<shauno> otherwise I'd just start trying to extract them all, and watch for the one that actually makes some progress, until it complains it can't find the next part.  and then try to guess which one fits what it's looking for :)
<diddledan> ok, out of all those files there are 20 dupes
<diddledan> all on ?.0
<diddledan> these are the dupes: http://paste.ubuntu.com/12414068/
<shauno> just to be clear, if you ran md5sum into uniq, you're not left with a list of dupes - you're left with a list of what's unique (the -c tells you how many copies of each uniq file you have)
<diddledan> yes
<diddledan> all the other lines started with 1 whereas the md5sum of those listed in the second paste says 20
<shauno> gotcha
<shauno> hm, that's still not making much sense :)
<shauno> and the sizes?  usually for a multipart you'd find them all the same size but the last file
<shauno> wondering if, eg, -0 is one archive, -1 is another, etc.  or if these are all parts of one puzzle
<diddledan> yeah most of them are 50000000
<diddledan> but there's several that aren't
<shauno> is it like, 217182-0.72
<shauno> one of the ones which isn't?  (the highest-numbered in the -0 ?)
<diddledan> there's no consistency
<diddledan> here's ls -l http://paste.ubuntu.com/12414170/
<diddledan> oh that .r00 was a test by me
<diddledan> not part of the files I recieved
<diddledan> (it's the last one in the list)
<shauno> that's pretty messed up  lol
<shauno> some are larger than 50M too?  that's the last thing I would have expected
<diddledan> the -0.2.0 reports as a matroska
<diddledan> that's one of the ones larger than 50M
<diddledan> but it's only 100M so I wouldn't expect it to be complete
<shauno> welp.  have fun with that :D  I think I have to sleep
<mapps> welp im tired
<mapps> this izombie isnt too ba
<diddledan> yawn
 * zmoylan-pi puts on the coffee
<diddledan> good plan
<dogmatic69> anyone seen something like this?
<dogmatic69> kernel:[595988.048006] Code: 8d 44 24 20 4c 89 4c 24 48 c7 44 24 08 10 00 00 00 48 89 44 24 18 e8 5a ff ff ff 48 83 c4 58 c3 90 89 f0 b9 40 00 00 00 99 f7 f9 <31> d2 eb 0b 48 ff c2 48 83 7c d7 f8 00 75 36 39 c2 7c f1 40 f6
<dogmatic69> just had that in the terminal, "message from syslog"
<kbingham> dogmatic69: try typing dmesg to see what the rest of the message was
<dogmatic69> kbingham:  good call, this is it http://pastebin.com/2xPZf5a5
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Tuesday, and happy International Dot Day! ð
<dogmatic69> .
<zmoylan-pi> :
 * Myrtti says a little prayer for dogmatic69's Java
<dogmatic69> :/
<dogmatic69> only java I can think that is running is jenkins
<dogmatic69> its a dev box
<davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiVMmAk45oY
<JamesTait> davmor2, you deserve to suffer for that one.
<davmor2> JamesTait: But timmy mallets glasses are awesome right
<foobarry> does anyone know of any good templates/designes for tutorials/howtos involving screenshots?
<JamesTait> davmor2, "aw-some" - as in "aw man, I can't believe he wore those!"
<foobarry> ubuntu manual aint bad
<JamesTait> foobarry, that sounds like the kind of thing popey might know about.
<davmor2> JamesTait: if it helps I remember all these songs they are in my head forever, I'm suffering enough :D
<foobarry> building the ubuntu manual is such a beast
<foobarry> need to destroy your system in order to make it
<bashrc> how so?
<foobarry> removing texlive and then running their script to get a consistent setup
<foobarry> but i already use texlive and don't wanna break it
<popey> yeah
<popey> do it in a chroot
<foobarry> ah, good thinking batman
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<SuperMatt> http://devopsreactions.tumblr.com/post/129135838537/getting-out-of-on-call-rotation
<Seeker> popey: what did you go with for a terminal font?
<jpds> Seeker: terminus here
<popey> Seeker: still choosing
<jpds> popey: Try terminus
<Seeker> source code pro :P
<SuperMatt> there's quite a lot of concensus that the ubuntu font is one of the best terminal fonts around
<brobostigon> lol, manhole covers made it onto daily politics.
<popey> currently using ubuntu mono 11
<zmoylan-pi> let me guess corbyn will ban manhole covers if he's elected? :-)
<brobostigon> zmoylan-pi: apparently, in a interview he said, he used to like taking pictures of historical one.
<dutchie> popey: i'm using input mono
<zmoylan-pi> he'll be the pinup of what manhole cover for quite a while so :-)
<brobostigon> pinup for the collective of manhole cover nerds and anthusiasts.
<zmoylan-pi> reserve your copy before they sell out!!
<brobostigon> lolz.
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
 * brobostigon pushes bigcalm into a tardis.
<davmor2> brobostigon: but it is always morning on the t'interwebz
<brobostigon> i see, ok.
<zmoylan-pi> could be for the use of the word good... :-)
<davmor2> brobostigon: same as it is always beer o'clock somewhere in the world
<brobostigon> davmor2: yes, especially on a thursday evening at quiz night at my local pub.
<zmoylan-pi> or any time you donated blood in ireland till a few years back...
<Myrtti> https://instagram.com/p/7p5nl-oE2D/ â¥
<shauno> just ordered that screen like 5, 10 minutes ago :)
<brobostigon> anyone got a good slow cooked pork recipe?
<foobarry> my wife does it with apple juice and carrots
<foobarry> in a slow cooker.
<foobarry> and can do it with cider instead
<brobostigon> i would do it in the oven, dont have a slow cooker.
<brobostigon> and i wouldnt do it with cider/apples either, they dont cooperate with me.
<brobostigon> my logic would tell me, make a soy/ginger/garlic marinade, 150c 2ish hours, covered.
<davmor2> brobostigon: http://www.bbcgoodfood.com/recipes/1977644/spiced-slowroast-pork
<davmor2> brobostigon: the BBC have 4-5 slow cooked pork ideas
<brobostigon> ty davmor2 :)
<brobostigon> just trying to think up new recipes to do for my gf, i have ran out of ideas and things i can cook.
<bashrc> cheese on toast
<zmoylan-pi> beans on toast, spaghetti on toast... anything that can be slid under the door? :-)
<brobostigon> lolz.
<brobostigon> last hting i made for her was chilli chiecken with odon noodles.
<zmoylan-pi> hopefully pressed chicken to fit under the door... :-P
<brobostigon> whats this door obsession?
<zmoylan-pi> knock knock
<brobostigon> RAWR
<MooDoo> afternoon
 * zmoylan-pi drops pin in the silence...
<zmoylan-pi> *KLANG*
<brobostigon> thats one big pin.
<brobostigon> hi MooDoo
<shauno> well, today's win in the war against tourism; our new busses have screens that tell you which stop is next.  it seems they're all showing the stops for route 9.
<davmor2> zmoylan-pi: but you never remember the silence
<zmoylan-pi> we have those in ireland on the buses too, announcements are in english and irish just to confuse the tourists
<shauno> we don't have announcements yet, just a screen.  which is a shame, it'd be nice to finally find out how to pronounce my address
<zmoylan-pi> the buses also provide wifi but you have to sign in to use it.  it requires 2 names and wants to know your gender for some reason...
<daftykins> :S
<zmoylan-pi> thankfully tescomobile is so cheap to use atm that i just use that instead
<_itz> the Rail Ale Train on Sat .. does that travel from Alton and return to the same location?
<zmoylan-pi> returns to alton http://www.watercressline.co.uk/product.php/10/real-ale-train-r-a-t
<_itz> ah thanks
<zmoylan-pi> 'The RAT departs ALTON station 7.20pm, returning to Alton approx 10.30pm'
<diddledan> yawn
<shauno> how did you get on with your clusterf..iles?
<diddledan> rm -rf
<diddledan> :-p[
 * zmoylan-pi made nice backup of most important files to usb drive and secondary backup to be sure to be sure...
<shauno> wise choice I think :)
<shauno> I can't picture you using usb drives zmoylan-pi.  they don't make an rs232 equivalent?
<zmoylan-pi> with important files in veracrypt secure file with my most complex password yet
<zmoylan-pi> i seem to remember some sod was really close to making them work in dos :-)
<diddledan> Dancer1?
<diddledan> random: when did emoticons get renamed to emoji and "stickers"?
<zmoylan-pi> when some one wanted to rebrand them and make money from them
<diddledan> I have no cola!!!
<diddledan> I'm resorting to coffee
<zmoylan-pi> corporate dibs on something that was taken for granted till then
<shauno> you couldn't be more wrong if you tried :)
 * diddledan sits cross-legged in front of shauno 's chair waiting for grandpa to tell the story
<shauno> heh
<shauno> it's simples.  they escaped from japan as western handset-makers desperately tried to squeeze into a market they never fit into
<diddledan> that's because the westerners are twice as big as the japs :-p
<zmoylan-pi> japanese phone companies brought them in for their networks.  sounds like trying to sell something to people to me.
<shauno> and since we managed to shimmy them into unicode, they've actually gone from being platform-dependant to almost-standard
<zmoylan-pi> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emoji#Early_emoji_encoding
<zmoylan-pi> mind, dublin bus uses chinese symbol for disabled accessible buses on bus stop signs as it's a unicode symbol that looks like wheelchair symbol
<diddledan> wiy
<diddledan> wily*
<diddledan> when we welease wily?
<diddledan> wewease Bwian
<leecowdrey_> grrrr
<diddledan> https://twitter.com/EmrgencyKittens/status/643928627265077248/photo/1
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-16
<mapp> morning all
 * zmoylan-pi looks at watch... what time do you call this? :-)
<mapp> just home from work:P
<MooDoo> morning all
<mapps> narcos is so good
<mapps> almost finished e4
<davmor2> Morning all
<MooDoo> morning davmor2
<davmor2> MooDoo: I got "forget you" stuck in my head this morning
<foobarry> replaces it with "fix you"
<MooDoo> :)
<davmor2> foobarry: no that's the developers job I tend to "break you"
<knightwise> hey peeps
<davmor2> morning knightwise
<davmor2> morning czajkowski
<czajkowski> davmor2: howdy
<knightwise> hey davmor2 czajkowski
 * knightwise remembers he needs to update his ubuntu phone
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Guacamole Day! ð
<davmor2> JamesTait: http://holysmokesbatman.com/tracks/holy-guacamole.html
<JamesTait> davmor2, it doesn't need to be holy. Just good, fresh guacamole will do.
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<bashrc> morning
<MooDoo> morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning MooDoo
<selinuxium> Hi all, Having a problam with an init.d script for an acient peice of odbc layer the work system uses. If I trigger the start command outside of scritp it works fine... But if I use the service to start it... Not so... Any ideas?
<selinuxium> http://paste.ubuntu.com/12426680/
<davmor2> JamesTait: Hang your head in shame, Yesterday was the 20th anniversary of the initial release of hackers and you gave us happy dot day ;)
<daftykins> :D
<JamesTait> davmor2, yeah, but "Happy Dot Day" is a bit less verbose than "Happy 20th Anniversary of the Release of the Movie Hackers".
<davmor2> JamesTait: Happy Movie Hackers Day
<JamesTait> I don't hack movies.
<daftykins> Crash & Burn
<leecowdrey_>  IMHO must admit most films/TV programmes are not worth the "hack"
<Azelphur> Whelp this is gonna hurt my wallet, in one hour I'm going to buy 4 4k 40" monitors.
<Azelphur> $2,123 >.<
<daftykins> D:
<daftykins> i hope they're IPS for that low
<mapps> what the hell is going on
<Azelphur> daftykins: www.ebay.co.uk/itm/191682277542
<Azelphur> got a deal out of him since I'm buying 4
<popey> oooh
<Myrtti> Mr. Robot
<popey> + VAT
<mapps> bray properties,agents for apartment we were in for a year sent an email saying we need to get electric and water reconnected else we get Â£100 admin fee 85Â£ harge..WE'VE MOVED OUT..who leaves eectric and water connected when they've moved
<Azelphur> popey: yea if customs nabs me I'll probably have an extra ~Â£300 to pay :<
<popey> I doubt my laptop can even drive that display :)
<popey> let alone 2
<mapps> so they can 'clean' ...you have to get it cutoff to get connected elsewhere
<mapps> argh
<Azelphur> popey: putting 3 on my main PC (GTX 980) and one for the gf to use
<popey> you're generous :)
<Azelphur> amusingly Â£350 for a 40" TV is actually a very good price, and it's all round better than any TV I'm gonna buy anyway for her use case
<popey> 40" is huge for a desktop monitor tho
<Azelphur> popey: well, it's going in the office and we'll hook her xbox up to it and she can watch TV on it and stuff, want her to have something to do while she's here and I'm working :)
<popey> nice
<popey> great for that!
<Azelphur> Indeed, and hook my laptop up to it too (GTX 970M) I imagine it could probably just about drive some 4k gaming
<bashrc> a 40" monitor?
<Azelphur> bashrc: 4 of them :P
<bashrc> that would be great for flight simulators
<Azelphur> hehe
<popey> yeah!
<daftykins> doesn't really answer my questions that ebay page, ah well
<Azelphur> daftykins: maybe https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o553bTyFElQ will?
<Azelphur> (Tek Syndicate \o/)
<daftykins> eh, effort :)
<Azelphur> hehe
<Myrtti> my XPS 13 9333 really hates the 3.19.0-29 kernel, it seems
<Myrtti> or something that's happened in the past few days updates
<daftykins> seen tonnes of folk have issues with -29, over in #ubuntu
<daftykins> seems one to be avoided :>
<popey> Azelphur: that was an interesting video, pretty amazing display for the price
<Azelphur> popey: indeed, I'm hyped :)
<popey> heh
<popey> i keep looking at my desk and thinking "I wonder if I could fit one on here"
<Myrtti> I've rebooted twice today because laptop has just died
<Myrtti> and returning from suspend, wifi is turned off
<Azelphur> popey: haha
<daftykins> i just caved and watched the vid too XD
<daftykins> i'm fortunate though, i own no equipment that'd drive that res :P
<popey> yeah, me either
<awilkins> Another sinkhole in the Mancunian Way
<awilkins> I drove over that bit on Sunday
<diddledan> awilkins: yey
<diddledan> awilkins: bumpy bumpy
<diddledan> is it a full-on sinkhole or more a pothole?
<diddledan> :-p
<awilkins> http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/mancunian-way-hole-more-misery-10061622
<awilkins> That photo is the original hole though
<diddledan> oh wow, it really is a full-on sinkhole!
<diddledan> that's amazeballs
<awilkins> If you look at the Google Streetview pictures, they were taken the month before it opened up
<awilkins> You can see the cracks forming in the road
<shauno> so google broke manchester?
<mapps> what is going on with my internet;[
<davmor2> mapps: wibble
<mapps> its super bad today
<mapps> slow and oing down loads
<davmor2> mapps: wibble
<davmor2> mapps: without knowing the network you are on/the issues you are having it's kinda hard to judge
<shauno> uff.  nothing more annoying than a server that doesn't finish shutting down
<zmoylan-pi> shutting down a windows system to run for a bus only for it to say installing updates? :-)
<shauno> nah, ubuntu saying it's stopping kvm and then ... ?
<zmoylan-pi> copying files on windows and it stops at 99% for eternity
<daftykins> you'd have to be quite the idiot with Windows to not know how to control updates :)
<zmoylan-pi> well with w10 consumer version the choice is made for you
<daftykins> not quite, still get prompted when you want to restart
<daftykins> so another bit of FUD spreading there Mr. zmoylan-pi :P
<zmoylan-pi> deciding when to restart makes all the difference :-)
<daftykins> yep invalidates your above claim
<daftykins> but prior versions still had far greater control
<daftykins> of course we haven't even touched on dependency hell and package messes the likes of #ubuntu get themselves into :D
<zmoylan-pi> prior version had better controls.  but most people left if on auto and found their systems brought down w10 update even if they never planned to install it
<daftykins> but i can be reasonable there, accepting it's mostly new users fiddling with PPAs
<zmoylan-pi> but after managing the dll hell of windows dependency hell on linux is a picnic :-D
<daftykins> yeah see that claim is currently wordly very dangerously online, articles try to make out like it's doing it regardless - but actually if you read through the article carefully like i did, you see that the person did still run through the wizard and sign up to get the update
<zmoylan-pi> i didn't
<daftykins> which again is just clickbait
<daftykins> now here's a real concern we can all get behind...
<daftykins> can't believe i saw mince pies in the supermarket!
<foobarry> is it possible to copy wii dvds? my skyward sword occasionally fails to read
<foobarry> wnat to save it before more damage occurs
<davmor2> foobarry: if it will read you can surely just dd the /dev/sr0
<daftykins> i thought they inverted the disc read, from outside to in?
<daftykins> if it's already started playing up you're probably knackered
<foobarry> there's some scratches
<zmoylan-pi> and i've seen the selection boxes appear in supermarkets too but it is now 100 days to christmas i think
<daftykins> :(
<zmoylan-pi> so once halloween/guy fawkes* is over the crimbo carols will be blasted at you 24x7 *delete as applicable
<foobarry> Wii discs are not exactly DVDs. Nintendo uses a special format that is based on the DVD specifications called RVL-006, most PC DVD drives cannot read this format.
<foobarry> quote from interwebs
<foobarry> n addition to this the original Wii discs usually have a BCA mark on the inner ring of each disc, e.g. a bar code. This BCA mark cannot be reproduced by a DVD writer and the Wii appears to read out this bar code. If the code is not present on the disc, the Wii won't accept the inserted media.
<zmoylan-pi> most... so some can?
<daftykins> well i mean you're not going to be able to copy a Wii game disc regardless without modifying your console :)
<davmor2> foobarry: http://www.ubuntugeek.com/wii-backup-fusion-simply-to-use-backup-solution-for-your-wii-games.html you can look into this I guess
<ali1234> willcooke: i just read your blog post and wiki page about the "big bug scrub"
<ali1234> i think abusing the "opinion" status to mark low priority bugs is going to rub people the wrong way
<willcooke> ali1234, where am I abusing it?
<ali1234> "As part of the big bug clear up for 16.04 this bug is being marked as  Opinion.  While this bug is affecting you, and potentially others, we do  not consider it a priority for work and so it won't get fixed by us."
<ali1234> you acknowledge that it is a bug which affects someone, but then mark it opinion anyway
<willcooke> ali1234, good call, let me fix that
<ali1234> i mean there's a whole "importance" field for that, it seems like a better fit to me
<diddledan> evenin
<popey> pip pip
 * brobostigon just found a jem, metallica's black album.
<ali1234> brobostigon: it's the trning point where they went from being good to being terrible
<ali1234> many consider it their last good album, and many consider it the first bad one
<brobostigon> i agree, i think its their best.
<ali1234> it's certainly their most popular and well known
<brobostigon> that as well.
<brobostigon> for example. my opinion is, piper at the gates of dawn, is pink floyds best work, but by no means is it their most popular nor most well known.
<willcooke> ali1234, fixed, or at least made more accurate
<ali1234> willcooke: better, thanks
<willcooke> ali1234, thanks for the feedback
<popey> hey willcooke bug 1118648 is probably a dupe of that one you and I saw in London
<lubotu3> Error: Launchpad bug 1118648 could not be found
 * popey marks dupe
<popey> of a bug I also filed :)
 * brobostigon is also on his first week of not having any tobacco, and just using his nicotine vaporiser on orders of his gf.
<popey> robo-fags ftw
<brobostigon> that they are, yes.
<diddledan> the world is craycray: http://www.standwithahmed.com/
<daftykins> well, 'murica specially ;)
<brobostigon> so they have odd rules in the US as to?
<popey> existing
<brobostigon> ah,
<mapps> hi
<daftykins> lo
<mapps> gibraltar is so backwards
<mapps>  moving out so we cutoff electric and water estate agents say they want it recomected else we get a fine
<mapps> they want it connected for 'cleaning'
<mapps> when you move out you ALWAYS get utilities cut off so its not in your name..no?
<ali1234> you don't get it dosconnected, you just inform the electric company you are moving out and ask for a final bill
<daftykins> just take values and call with final personally
<mapps> well
<mapps> when i moved in i had to get it 'connected'
<mapps> and pai Â£60 for electric an Â£30 for water
<mapps> and im moving tomorrow right and i took the previous tenants forms for disconnection and i had to pay again to be reconnected
<mapps> thats how they do it here it seems
<ali1234> one time i lived in a rented flat with a pre pay gas meter
<ali1234> when we moved in the landlord gave us the card
<ali1234> few days later the gas man came and read the meter, which it turned out had like Â£100 of debt on it
<ali1234> told us to "just pay it" and we'd get a refund when the account was switched over to our name
<ali1234> luckily i didn't believe a word of it
<ali1234> 6 months later they switched it over, no refund
<mapps> and the girl moved out monday..form said cutoff date 14th september (monday) my start date 17Th, i handed our forms in to disconnect our old place on 17th - and they say we were meant to leave it connected, surely this is utter garbage -- look at what i said..i had to pay to be connected when we moved in and i had to pay for the new place
<ali1234> but luckily i had refused to put any money on the thing after we found out how much debt their was, so they only owed us like Â£10
<ali1234> did have to go 6 months without gas though
<mapps> what a pain
<ali1234> we got a camping stove
<mapps> people always lie and scam
<ali1234> it was actually cheaper to buy the cans of gas than to put money on the meter
<mapps> but seriously see the above when we moved here we paid to get elec/water connected after prev tenant moved..and again i had to pay for new apartment
<shauno> we had an odd one when they figured out I'd been paying upstairs' electricity, and he'd been paying mine
<mapps> so why would we leave it on when we moved?
<mapps> ll
<ali1234> well you're in gib so the law probably doesn't apply to them, or they think it doesn't
<mapps> lol
<ali1234> hence they do whatever they can get away with
<mapps> how was that shauno
<mapps> yep
<ali1234> i had another landlord pull a funny trick
<shauno> the leccy co's 'solution' was to charge me everything I should have paid in 18 months, but promised me I'd get what I paid against the wrong account back later
<ali1234> actually now i think about it, it was the same landlord
<ali1234> the house was advertised at a weekly rent "plus 1 month deposit"
<ali1234> and the way he calculated the monthly deposit was to wait not, it was monthly rent plus 1 month deposit
<ali1234> oh i don't remember what it was exactly but it boiled down to taking the monthly rent, dividing by 4 to get the weekly rent, multiplying by 52 to get yearly rent, and then dividing by 12 to get the deposit.
<ali1234> which is of course about 8% more
<mapps> lol
<mapps> so many peope up to little tricks
<ali1234> i didn't let him get away with that either
<ali1234> he also wanted 12 months of post dated cheques
<mapps> thing is with this case with my estate agent, if i had t pay fees to get connected when i move in, why are they shocked i got it disconnecte? AND the girl moving out got it cutoff an i got it connected and paid again?
<mapps> so it's the normal thing ? if they made me get it connected when i moved in here..and its not like im the first person there...loads lived there before..same with new place getting that connected
<ali1234> there is no "normal"
<mapps> gah sick of gibraltar being so useless
<popey> when i moved out of rented accomodation you just note the numbers on the meter and tell the company.
<ali1234> if you were in the UK there's people you can complain to about this kind of stuff
<popey> mind you, that was wales
<ali1234> i always had to produce final bills to get my deposit back
<shauno> the impression I get of most the med, is that if you're not bribing someone, you're doing it wrong.  and will continue to do it wrong, even if you follow instructions
<ali1234> one time it took me nearly a year to get a final bill from the water company because of a dispute, which once again i did not let them get away with
<ali1234> i think i've told that story before though so i won't bore everyone
<mapps> yea everything is slow here
<mapps> tediously slow
<mapps> parcel from the uk of mine sat at the post office in 'clearing' for a week
<mapps> absolute nonsense its obviously been scanned etc when it left the uk
<mapps> my bank account where it's taken 5 months and still haven't got it..but they said it's all sorted now...we shall see
<shauno> I almost feel sorry for the water company.  they would have had no idea what they were getting into, when they tried to argue technicalities with ali1234 ;)
<daftykins> i'd be wary about putting anything in an account that good :D
<daftykins> shauno: :D
<daftykins> ali1234: aww i haven't heard that one i don't think :D
<ali1234> they said they read my meter, but couldn't tell me where my meter actually was
<zmoylan-pi> does water meter use rfid?
<daftykins> ooh that's a sneaky one
<ali1234> and they said i used about 10x as much water as a normal family would, when i lived alone
<ali1234> zmoylan-pi: this was about 10 years ago, so maybe. they did claim that the meter was inside the property, in a location that didn't actually exist
<ali1234> they were like "our records show the meter is under the stairs" when it was a flat
<zmoylan-pi> doesn't mean there weren't stairs or remains of stairs if house had been converted to flats
<ali1234> sure, but that's not my problem :)
<zmoylan-pi> my brother used to run drains unblocking business.  the amount of times he found people had concreted over access points...
<ali1234> i had the ground floor too
<mapps> daftykins id be wary getting my wages into this jok gib bank..everyone else gets paid..im stil waiting 'oh sorry we have a backlog' lol
<ali1234> i scoured the whole place inside and out and could not find a meter
<zmoylan-pi> they can be in odd places that people don't think to look.  but landlord should have been able to tell you
<daftykins> :>
<ali1234> yeah he didn't know anything about a meter either
<ali1234> i don't think i have ever lived in a house with a water meter
<zmoylan-pi> then ask a neighbour.  seeing were there's are might have helped
<zmoylan-pi> *their's
<ali1234> the eople in the upstairs flat also claimed to not have a meter
<daftykins> sounds like a water co trying to make a quick few bob from a lack of dispute
<zmoylan-pi> sounds like it
<daftykins> i've got fixed rates here based on my properties TRP value, i've heard some people that convert to meters end up paying more
<ali1234> nah... probably just a computer snafu
<daftykins> i pay about Â£105 a quarter
<shauno> I'm meant to be getting a meter, I think.  but I've had no mail about it, and I'm not inclined to phone them and ask if they want money
<zmoylan-pi> they try not to warn you in ireland when in case the protesters appear
<mapps> having a meter works out better for single occpants i think?
<ali1234> probably, when it works properly
<shauno> well, we're transitioning from not paying charges at all, to meters.  so there really is no 'better'
<Azelphur> Hmm, I'm trying to update Ubuntu 15.04 server edition running inside libvirt, it's hanging at "Found memtest86+ image: /memtest86.bin" during the update. Any ideas?
<ali1234> that's the grub install script
<ali1234> it's probably looking for a physical disk partition
<Azelphur> indeed
<ali1234> so just skip it
<Azelphur> how?
<ali1234> no idea
<Azelphur> just kill the grub processes?
<Azelphur> I think I'll give that a go, hopefully it'll continue the upgrade and I can always fix grub if it breaks.
<ali1234> so i've got a question about libvirt actually
<daftykins> server non-LTS! for shame :)
<ali1234> i need to build and run a 2.6.12.6 kernel on a headless server which is on the other end of the internet
<ali1234> i need to do that because i need the ext3 48 bit patch set to access a weird filesystem image which is 1TB
<mapps> cor narcos is so good
<mapps> 2 eps left.il have finished it tonight
<ali1234> i don't want to install that kernel natively for obvious reasons
<mapps> :D
<ali1234> so what's the best way to set up a VM with that kernel when i only have ssh access?
<Azelphur> ali1234: virt-manager is really easy, it can connect to a remote server over SSH and provides a piss-easy graphical way to control libvirt, I use it.
<ali1234> interesting, i'll check it out
<mapps> i recommend narcos to everyone, decent show..and i watch loads of tv;p
 * daftykins noticed :D
<zmoylan-pi> and some one seems to be flogging the idea of 8k tvs today
<diddledan> \o/
<diddledan> moar pixies!
<zmoylan-pi> you can spot every hair sticking out of newsreaders nose
<Azelphur> so going back to my original issue, any ideas folks? https://dpaste.de/3mky it's just hanging.
<Azelphur> completely unusable apt :(
<Azelphur> aha, workaround, GRUB_DISABLE_OS_PROBER=true in /etc/default/grub :)
<daftykins> must be something it was seeing that it didn't like?
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-17
<Azelphur> daftykins: virtual machine in libvirt with no other OS / partitions, it's stupid :P
<daftykins> ah
<daftykins> funky
<daftykins> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Icy-Box-IB-254U3-Enclosure-interface/dp/B00GYLDDCG/
<daftykins> i'm gonna get me one o' these to throw a lappy HDD in and make it my xbox one extra storage :>
<Azelphur> sounds fun
<Azelphur> daftykins: amusingly, I have piles of 3.5 inch enclosures laying about, I keep giving them away
<daftykins> with UASP? ;)
<zmoylan-pi> so you're giving homes to the homes of 3.5" devices... :-)
<Azelphur> daftykins: dunno
<daftykins> seems to be a pretty newish thing
<daftykins> not often present
<Azelphur> zmoylan-pi: indeed, I buy drives in enclosures because it's cheaper, then pull them out of the enclosures
<Azelphur> I've had 5 of them now
<daftykins> i did just remember i have my old array of 6 x 1TB doing nothing, but the idea of slapping two in an external 2 bay RAID thing for USB 3 would be noisy
<Azelphur> I have a 4x5TB array :)
<daftykins> eh i have main storage too, but i'm more thinking of what can be attached to the xbox one
<daftykins> since sadly you can't swap out the internal without encountering the wrath of breaking terms of service
<daftykins> they've just geared up to releasing a new 'elite' model like the 360 had, which comes with a 1TB SSHD =|
<daftykins> Azelphur: speaking of, presumably you meant you/your gf have an xbox one to pop on one of those 4K displays from earlier?
<daftykins> i hadn't even read anything about whether they properly upscale to it yet
<Azelphur> daftykins: xbox 360 actually, gf is considering getting an xbox one :)
<Azelphur> daftykins: the main appeal of it for that however is being a monitor, means lower latency for games while TVs generally have much higher latency
<daftykins> i think that'll be invalidated by the fact its' input lag and latency is based on being fed a 4K image
<daftykins> giving it a 360 will mean it'll output 1080p tops, so the inbuilt will be responsible for the upscaling
<daftykins> could end up... interesting :D
<Azelphur> daftykins: surely it'd be lower for a 1080p image
<daftykins> hmm?
<Azelphur> surely the latency would be lower for a 1080i (actually xbox is 1080i) image...
<daftykins> the xbox 360's scaler chip outputs the 1080p regardless
<Azelphur> daftykins: yea, but the latency on the monitor is gonna be lower than that of a tv.
<Azelphur> which is the point I'm making
<daftykins> i've got no data on that :D
<Azelphur> TVs have so high latency they generally don't even list it
<Azelphur> it's bad, some TVs (like the Seiki) is like 200ms+
<daftykins> i don't think that's true across the board
<ali1234> HDMI has no latency so the size of the picture isn't directly related to latency
<Azelphur> probably not but I challenge you to find a TV with its input latency listed in its spec
<zmoylan-pi> with all the numbers they throw around with new tvs i never hear latency mentioned
<daftykins> it is when the TV's built-in hardware has to scale it \o/
<ali1234> yes
<daftykins> zmoylan-pi: newp more of a gamer thing still
<zmoylan-pi> thank goodness for gamers driving down the prices of new tech :-)
<ali1234> although if it is just doubling every pixel, that in theory could be done with no latency
<daftykins> but it never is since they add a tonne of image magic
<ali1234> in TVs yeah
<diddledan> \o/ magic!
<ali1234> not so much in monitors
<daftykins> woohoo!
<diddledan> TVs are awesome for ruining a movie's picture
<daftykins> speaking of magic, i must make my words disappear from your very eyes!
<daftykins> g'night all :D
<diddledan> :-o
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<diddledan> but I just woke up!
<ali1234> i should make a gadget to measure display latency
<ali1234> i bet loads of gamers would buy it
<daftykins> www.displaylag.com might be of interest, heard it mentioned somewhere recently
<ali1234> and i bet proper ones are expensive
<diddledan> gamers seem to obsess over 10ms vs 5ms
<ali1234> i reckon i could do it on an arduino
<diddledan> 100ms is equivalent to "instant" in human scales
<ali1234> no it isn't lol
<Azelphur> diddledan: indeed that's bad >.<
<zmoylan-pi> just put some static on a screen and you will see how sharp or blurred it is.
<Azelphur> diddledan: try playing a piano on 100ms
<Azelphur> I have, it's like being under the damned speech jammer
<ali1234> it's more like 25ms +/- 10ms
<diddledan> google have measured it - they claim that if an effect occurs within 100ms of an action then people perceive it as instantaneous
<zmoylan-pi> i used to play a game on a stop watch at school. start and stop as fast as possible.  i could easily to 7ms but after a few hours of playing spectrum games could occasionly get down to 3ms
<ali1234> diddledan: for a single event, sure
<ali1234> example given by azelphur of playing the piano is a good one. it's ver different when you're also dealing with delayed past events while entering new ones
<zmoylan-pi> of course this was in the day of joystick wagglers so very fast alternate keys was important
<ali1234> and playing a game is more like playing the piano than "waiting for a website to do something" (which is i assume what google were testing)
 * diddledan waggles his joystick
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: your fault!
<zmoylan-pi> i blame daley thompsons decatholon
<diddledan> yeah webpage load was the thing google were measuring
<ali1234> i was actually playing a video game the other day and got hit by this. had to click comething N times, but the game was lagging and the "click" sound effect actually being delayed made it almost impossible to click the right number of times
<zmoylan-pi> probably loading the click from hard drive...
<diddledan> it needs to save to disc on every click :-p
<diddledan> realtime world-saves ftw
<ali1234> pretty much, it was a bloated minecraft world
<diddledan> hah
<ali1234> java garbage collector sucks
<diddledan> minecraft is terrible for efficient working
<ali1234> "let's never free anything until we hit the memory limit"
<ali1234> i should make a website to demonstrate this effect
<diddledan> one such example is the requirement to load an entire chunk off the server even though you can't see it all
<ali1234> "click the button 10 times" ... "you failed"
<diddledan> loaded just-in-case
<zmoylan-pi> they could learn about optimisation from 8bit games :-)
<ali1234> diddledan: chunks aren't that big though... the bigger problem is java doesn't immediately free them when minecraft unloads them
<diddledan> yeah those 8bit programmers were true geniuses
<diddledan> cartridges forced strange methods of optimisation so I read
<zmoylan-pi> big blocks of memory are slow to unload when memory is completely full
<zmoylan-pi> there's a great video on the game elite and how they squashed all the game into a tiny amount of memory that is worth watching
<diddledan> I never have understood delayed garbage collectors on-top of the system memory allocator
<zmoylan-pi> draw the screen while loading the game then throw out that code and never overwrite those sections that are the ship
<diddledan> I get the point of delayed garbage collection by the system but to add it on-top of another memory allocator seems.. weird
<ali1234> the logic is that some operating systems have really bad allocators, so you should write one that's a tiny bit better than the absolute worst, and then force everyone to use it
<diddledan> and that's why openssl is such a pig
<ali1234> and firefox too
<ali1234> openssl actually has a good reason, it needs to know for sure that freed memory is securely wiped
<ali1234> oh and also Gtk+ has one of these things in it
<diddledan> they took that requirement as carte blanche to reimplement everything themselves tho
<zmoylan-pi> just because a language is bad doesn't mean you can't get coders who can't make it run efficently. it's just they cost a lot more
<ali1234> it's not actually about the language... java has at least four different garbage collectors and i'm pretty sure on of them is "just directly use malloc and free"
<ali1234> Gtk+ also has this as a debug option
<ali1234> but it can cause programs to behave differently
<ali1234> so you can't really use them in production
<zmoylan-pi> true but it does seem like they picked the best way to slow down a system :-)
<ali1234> ah the crazy allocator is in glib of course, not Gtk+
<diddledan> catching-up on the last few episodes of "humans" - it's a really compelling story
<diddledan> just starting ep6
<diddledan> nearly time for morning coffee methinks
<mapps> hello
<diddledan> morning
<mapps> 1 ep of izombie then bed
<mapps> gotta be up at midday
<mapps> picking up apartment keys at 12;30 water person coming t 1 ugh
<mapps> got loads to move too its a right hassle
<mapps> only diddledan up
<mapps> no zmoylan-pi lurking?
<mapps> :)
<diddledan> they're lightweights
<mapps> https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/10296795_896313610394830_6540979153331699150_n.jpg?oh=5d77a32ea83c917bf15c9c6781219185&oe=5665A9BD
<mapps> lol
<mapps> how can someone who's a mum look and dress like that
<mapps> just looks cheap and nasty
<mapps> everytime i reactivate facebook i wonder if i should have
<diddledan> stupid americans - re the teenager who took a clock to school, a police person told media: "we attempted to question the juvenile about what it was and he would simply only tell us that it was a clock" <-- turns out it was a clock
<mapps> lol
<mapps> who reported it
<diddledan> who'd have thunk a teenager telling the truth
<diddledan> a teacher called the cops on him
<diddledan> he has also been suspended for three days despite being proven to not be a muslim terrorist
<diddledan> criminal prosecution has not been ruled out
<mapps> because they saw him with a clock what like he was walking around with it?
<diddledan> he made it at home and took it to school to show his engineering teacher. a different teacher saw it and called the cops
<mapps> ah
<mapps> what a fool the teacher was
<diddledan> yeah but even so the authorities are prosecuting the kid even though it was a false alarm, and he also gets three days suspension from school because meh
<mapps> prosecuting him fr what
<mapps> must be some reason
<diddledan> there's a campaign site here https://www.standwithahmed.com/
<diddledan> as far as I can tell they're prosecuting because cockmakers should be made examples of to deter future would-be clockakers
<diddledan> basically no reason whatsoever
<mapps> ah is that what that hashtag meant
<MartijnV1S> ooooooh! http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p030s5bx
<diddledan> ooh
<diddledan> that looks good
<MooDoo> morning all
<leecowdrey_> Indeed it's a morning to you all too
<foobarry> that clock story is bringing out the worst side of americans
<foobarry> all the comments as usual are polarised
<MartijnVdS> they have a different side? :P
<diddledan> teehee: https://twitter.com/WillMcAvoyACN/status/644260578156871680
<zmoylan-pi> i wonder if the teacher will be prosecuted for wasting police time
<diddledan> hah
<diddledan> last I heard they're still prosecuting the kid
<zmoylan-pi> no all charges were dropped last i heard
<zmoylan-pi> the police said they did the right thing responding as they did and said it was a cool clock
<bashrc_> I think that story shows that the "national security" mindsets turns adults into idiots who are either unwilling or unable to exercise critical judgement
<zmoylan-pi> i remember when some smart add phoned in a bomb scare during my schools leaving cert exams.  they hoped to be able to look at a few books when the classes were evacuated.  all that happened was a gardai came in and checked the classes out
<zmoylan-pi> *smart ass
<foobarry> this could have been resolved if english teachers knew more about science
<foobarry> or the headteacher actually spoke to the engineering teacher!
<zmoylan-pi> i think the teacher that he brought the clock in to show advised him to hide it which suggests he thought some of the other teachers wouldn't understand or were idiots
<jpds> zmoylan-pi: Possibly both
<MartijnVdS> Willful ignorance.
<zmoylan-pi> considering what they pay teachers can we expect any better?
<foobarry> pay is not related to ability
<jpds> What foobarry said
<zmoylan-pi> pay does decide the level of applicants to a large degree
<foobarry> living in texas does not immediately imply you are an inbred numpty
<foobarry> teaching is a vocation too
<foobarry> and pay is static across the board largely
<zmoylan-pi> imply no, hint yes
<diddledan> my sister is a teacher
<diddledan> so poo to you
<diddledan> she's awesome!
<zmoylan-pi> i've had great teachers and i've had teachers who were there just to punch a clock
<diddledan> my brother-in-law however is a business psychologist which means he's the enemy :-p
<jpds> zmoylan-pi: Puch a WHAT?
<Myrtti> and I've got a friend teaching science that genuinely thought that microwaving water made it bad
<diddledan> Myrtti: oh dear
<zmoylan-pi> they were there just to do the hours and get a pay cheque
<zmoylan-pi> and a teacher can be fantastic in one area and a complete idiot in another
<diddledan> there was a video I saw a couple days ago which had a teenage girl from an english speaking country that isn't the UK moaning about a language barrier when talking to someone in the UK
<diddledan> she also moaned about how the UK being closer to the sun must be the explanation as to why something is many pounds
<diddledan> (pounds as in cost - the english person responded to her quizzing the cost of something and she was bemused that he replied a weight)
<jpds> diddledan: "A pound of your flesh", very Shakespearian.
<diddledan> jpds: I bite my thumb at thee
<Myrtti> lol
<zmoylan-pi> i fart in your general direction
<diddledan> lol
<Myrtti> you all smell of elderberries
<diddledan> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAy4zULKFDU
<diddledan> Myrtti: beat me
<diddledan> hmm, it's 10:00 and I'm already hungry
 * zmoylan-pi passes diddledan the bag of peanuts
<diddledan> meh
<zmoylan-pi> covered in chocolate
<diddledan> meh
<zmoylan-pi> or dry roasted
<diddledan> now if they were raisens covered in chocolate..!
<zmoylan-pi> i'd banish you to the pits of hell for ruining good chocolate
<zmoylan-pi> :-)
<diplo> Whats the benefit of either creating a new Volume Group or Extending an existing one with logical volumes
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<diplo> I'm not sureon best practice ?
<diplo> I take it that adding to an existing volume group I can extend other pv's into that VG group where as if I create a new one only new PV's can be extended
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Thursday, and happy Apple Dumpling Day! ð
 * JamesTait is stubbornly refusing to turn on the heater.
<diplo> JamesTait: I'm the same! I was actually cold last night.. but stubborness won out
<diplo> :)
<JamesTait> Same here, but I'm going to grab an extra jumper!
<diplo> 2 months to go for heating yet!
<diddledan> I've still got a window open :-p
<zmoylan-pi> i have windows open and fan running at night [Dublin, DUB, Ireland] Condition: Mostly Cloudy | Temp: 12C/54F/285K/513R | Humidity: 82% | Wind Speed 8mph/13kmph
<diddledan> I like the fresh air this time of year when I'm in bed - it reminds me of a period where I felt content despite being in the throws of deep depression (the weather reminds me of being in an adolescent psyc unit)
<diddledan> I'm weird, what can I say :-p
<zmoylan-pi> you fit right in here :-)
<diddledan> teehee
<czajkowski> anyone looking for a new role https://careers.stackoverflow.com/jobs/98046/full-stack-python-javascript-engineer-for-seenitio
<Laney> just found a half eaten packet of pork scratchings downstairs
<Laney> BONUS
 * Laney chomps
<MooDoo> RESULT
<davmor2> SADDO's
<zmoylan-pi> before their expiry date? double bonus
<zmoylan-pi> :-)
<Laney> still crunchy
<popey> mmmm fried fat
<popey> http://drool.popey.com/
<zmoylan-pi> nothing worse than soggy pork scratchings
<popey> _nothing_ on earth
<mapps> get my apartment keys in 20mins:D
<mapps> squash anyone! hah
 * diddledan sits on mapps
<mapps> just hpe there's some unsecure wifi i can steal until my internet is connected
<diddledan> howsat for squish?
<mapps> there's places below me with it.. two cafes the gym and mcdonalds but no way they'd reach me (10th floor)
<diddledan> ouch
<diddledan> 10 floors is a long way up
<mapps> indeed
<diddledan> hopefully you've got a lift?
<zmoylan-pi> pringles can antennae?
<mapps> yep
<mapps> i should hope so for 1200 a month;p
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: bonus is you get to eat the pringles first
<diddledan> mm nummy
<zmoylan-pi> nom nom, salt & vinegar pringles
<mapps> im off a week in november and december, might go to berlin november but december cant decide where would be nice around then
<davmor2> JamesTait: I can't find an apple dumping song or a macdondalds apple pie volcano gif, so I'll go for this as it mentions Opples https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrIqSlt9PXg
<zmoylan-pi> i haven't had a mcdonalds apple pie in decades... tempted...
<mapps> sheesh nor have i
<foobarry> mmm
<mapps> im eating out a lot..too much junk food
<foobarry> deep fried apple pie
<mapps> ate twice at the rubbish casino the other day heh
<zmoylan-pi> ate at the casino... that sounds like a gamble... :-)
<mapps> yea it's woeful
<mapps> burger bacon and cheese
<mapps> cold bacon cold cheese..yum
<mapps> but after 1am it's the only place..the kebab shops close midnight..1 stand in the square but 1am closed to
<mapps> *too
<zmoylan-pi> kebab shops that close at midnight... don't they understand that's the only time they sell kebabs?!
<mapps> :)
<zmoylan-pi> is there no site for gibraltar that lists all the takeouts in your area and times they're open?
<diddledan> sorry, but I feel this hasn't been posted recently enough: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StTqXEQ2l-Y
<zmoylan-pi> sees your video and raises you https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojydNb3Lrrs
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<diddledan> bigcalm: he's not big, and he's not calm :-p
<bigcalm> Small yet perfectly formed
<diddledan> except that growth on your neck
<diddledan> oh that's your head :-p
<davmor2> diddledan, zmoylan-pi: I see you videos and I raise you https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tC5eMgePakk
<bigcalm> diddledan: you're being rather rude for somebody I don't personally know. Please try not to be
<diddledan> sorry, I come across that way I guess
<diddledan> I promise I absolutely never ever mean offence with any of my utterances, even if I appear to the contrary
<diddledan> davmor2: dang that's trumpy!
<davmor2> diddledan: trumpy is this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4ixAfJ1LuI
<mapps> sleep time
<mapps> moved most my stuff in:D
<mapps> back at old place to get some more sleep :)
<diddledan> when did I disappear?
<diddledan> apparently I just reconnected. random.
<popey> you haven't yet
<popey> i see no disconnect
<diddledan> yeah that'll be my local-to-znc connection that died then
<diddledan> bouncy bouncy czajkowski
<diddledan> OMG!!! http://www.gog.com/game/starship_titanic
<davmor2> diddledan: did you get my trupy is this video link?
<davmor2> diddledan: also late addition to the Morning head songs today with Read all about it
<diddledan> yup I dead
<diddledan> did**
<diddledan> lol @ speelign
<Azelphur> Long shot, but copy and paste doesn't work between X screens, does anyone have a solution better than https://dpaste.de/6sRO ?
<mapps> gah still tired
<mapps> ;[
 * daftykins throws a funnel and a tall red bull at mapps 
<shauno> or just go back to bed :)
 * zmoylan-pi throws box of smarties with all the best e numbers for hyper activity at mapps 
<mapps> gotta go gym morrisons etc move last bits over
<diddledan_> morissons in gibraltar?
<mapps> why do all the morons put Gibraltar as where they live when they live in La Linea, clearly a big diff
<mapps> yea
<mapps> la linea is known as the a hole of spain
<mapps> it's like a bombs hit it--nothing like i imagined spain to be - had only been majorca not mainland spain before
<mapps> some days the shelves are empty diddledan as it all comes from uk
<diddledan_> yeesh
<diddledan_> that's sucky
<mapps> ya like they cant have deliveries on weekends
<mapps> sometimes like there will be no freh meat basically..even freh juice low...umm cooked meats etc
<daftykins> that's basically how our local supermarket chain has been getting :P
<daftykins> they sold their local warehouse so now everything is at the mercy of the seas for freight
<diddledan_> daftykins: I guess it's an island thing
<daftykins> :D
<zmoylan-pi> it's a trick question gibraltar is a penninsula... :-P
<diddledan_> o_O
<diddledan_> I never knew
<daftykins> mapps: i bet you can walk around that thing in half an hour :P
<shauno> what, the morissons?
<diddledan_> lol
<diddledan_> morning shauno
<shauno> o/
<daftykins> wow that graveyard and Church is right next to the runway
<daftykins> in Gibraltar
<Azelphur> getting this error in wine,  "err:winediag:schan_imp_init Failed to load libgnutls, secure connections will not be available." but I've installed libgnutls >.> any ideas?
<diddledan_> Azelphur: 64 vs 32bit?
<Azelphur> installed all the i386 packages I could find, too
<diddledan_> with the :i386 notation for dual-stack or the legacy method packages?
<diddledan_> (or similar)
<diddledan_> I forget but it might just be :386
<Azelphur> I just grabbed every libgnutls and libgnutls:i386 package I can find
<diddledan_> hmm
<diddledan_> that should do it :-/
<daftykins> ldd shed any light?
<ali1234> wow... so QNAP NAS units appear to have a nasty bug that completely corrupts your filesystem
<ali1234> they used the EXT3 48 bit extents patch
<diddledan_> \o/
<ali1234> it wwrites the block number as a u32 then a u16
<daftykins> :S
<daftykins> got your kernel compiled then? :)
<ali1234> u16 being the high bits
<ali1234> but for some reason this qnap doesn't write that u16, possibly because it is always zero
<ali1234> so then the high 16 bits of the block number get effectively randomized
<diddledan_> so it didn't zero them it just left a random pointer dangling when handing off to the disk?!
<ali1234> exactly yes
<diddledan_> that's nuts
<ali1234> and it only happens when there's more than four extents for a file
<ali1234> extents = what you would call fragments
<ali1234> so it only happens when your 1TB disk gets really full of important files
<daftykins> how many bay unit and what RAID config?
<ali1234> it only has 1 disk in it
<ali1234> i don't know exactly which unit, but an old one
<diddledan_> so you're only going to hit the bug when you've got loads of data that you cannot lose
<ali1234> diddledan yeah :(
<ali1234> luckily it's an easy fix... just zero those bits
<ali1234> well i hope that works anyway
<diddledan_> fingers crossed
<ali1234> basically ext4 didn't exist when this thing was made
<daftykins> i've always gone Synology but always seen those QNAPs around
<daftykins> i take it it's an abandoned unit support wise?
<ali1234> it has a 2.6.12.6 kernel with the ext3 48 bit patch set, which is like ext4 alpha version before it was even called ext4
<diddledan_> so they were trying to allow their units to cope with larger filesystems than default ext3 allowed?
<ali1234> yeah
<ali1234> and larger files too
<daftykins> sounds like the kind of thing that should've been labelled beta
<popey> i recently bought a netgear nas
<popey> seems okay
<ali1234> well this QNAP seemed okay for like however many years...
<ali1234> there's file on it from 2005
<popey> :(
<daftykins> how do the Netgears handle the OS? the lower end 2-bay Synologys, you put them on the network with the disks in then the software gets loaded from your PC onto the disks
<daftykins> so there's not so much built in storage for the OS portion
<diddledan_> I know the single-drive netgears that come with the drive embedded put the OS on a linux mdraid-1 parition pair with the rest of the disk partitioned for the owner to use
<daftykins> partition pair on single bay? 0o
<daftykins> so they RAID-mirror in two partitions on a single physical disk?
<diddledan_> yup
<daftykins> that's horrible
<Azelphur> daftykins: ldd?
<popey> my netgear came with no disks
<daftykins> Azelphur: don't worry, just the comment of someone who doesn't have a clue i think
<popey> so i assume there's some onboard flash storage
<Azelphur> lol
<daftykins> popey: ah so it had the full web admin etc?
<popey> yes
<popey> quite natty
<daftykins> the synologys just have enough to accept the OS to get thrown at it once disks are in, pretty novel
<diddledan_> daftykins: it might be PXE-style boot-up where there is ONLY enough code to fire up the network and transfer a file and run that in-memory
<diddledan_> PXE boot-roms are usually in the order of a couple hundred KB
<daftykins> sounds about right
<daftykins> enough to grab a lease then sit and wait
<popey> the web admin thing on the netgear is quite nice
<popey> and it can pretend to be an apple time machine target
<popey> which is handy
<daftykins> pretty sure they all can now
<daftykins> seems you can even make ones that don't do it, by just mounting a disk then creating the appropriate image file
<daftykins> ooh that reminds me, i was checking a clients backup when i saw that it'd given up since _May_
<daftykins> nice work Time Machine
<zmoylan-pi> did it not raise a stink when it stopped working or were those warnings ignored by user?
<mapps> ;]
<mapps> done most my boring chores today
<zmoylan-pi> wax on, wax off
<mapps> 1 case and washbasket full of stuff to take to new place
<daftykins> :)
<mapps> then unpack some stuff i guess
<mapps> laptop last;D wont hve net there
<daftykins> i think i'll be coming through Malaga in October, still a fair distance to Gib there though
<zmoylan-pi> unless you use ryanair... :-)
<mapps> ya
<mapps> 1hr30 away daftykins
<mapps> 1hr if you go like a loony
<mapps> we had no choice that time i got our flight to prague wrong LOL
<mapps> I' flying out of Malaga to Berlin in November :)
<daftykins> well i don't have a license so...
<zmoylan-pi> drive even crazier :-P
<daftykins> haha
<mapps> can get a taxi to Gib for 75 euros
<mapps> best rate ive found
<mapps> mate from casino told me of some company who do gib - malaga 75 euros
<mapps> normally its around 125-150 been quote
<mapps> d
<daftykins> ouch!
<daftykins> would be pretty sweet to see the rock
<daftykins> you hiked it yet? :D
<mapps> where you going?
<daftykins> boss' flat east of Malaga
<mapps> aha
<daftykins> Marina del Este
<mapps> well
<mapps> you could get a bus from Malaga to Gib for like 6 euros?
<mapps> and see gib for a day
<mapps> you'll be near Puerto Banus then which the british chavs love
<mapps> i have 0 interest in going there, it's full of thickos fake tan, kilos of makeup, payin Â£200 for bottles of vodka
<mapps> blowing a weeks shop wages in a bar
<mapps> i just wish i owned ne of these bars;)
<mapps> Sotogrande is meant to be VERY nice though, nice area not full of tacky bars/restaurants aimed at brits
<mapps> Puerto Banus is just Magaluf but more expensive, honestly dont see how anyone not a moron can care for it, rubbish british style bars like 'lineers'
<daftykins> i'm not one for those kinds of scenes at all :)
<daftykins> i'm only content coming so far south since it's winter ;D
<ali1234> hmm. i patched debugfs to ignore the top 16 bits of any 48 bit block number - they should always be zero on a 1Tb drive anyway - and all files are now readable
<diddledan_> nice
<diddledan_> well done!
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: that's some scary stuff
<diddledan_> that kind of fix, along with figuring out the problem, are both way beyond my skillset :-)
<diddledan_> daftykins: you running win10? you want to reclaim space used by windows itself (about 3GB)? http://blogs.technet.com/b/mniehaus/archive/2015/09/16/windows-10-reducing-the-disk-footprint.aspx
<daftykins> hrmm
<daftykins> there's something that makes me feel greatly hesitant about the use of compression :)
<diddledan_> heh
<popey> i know that feeling, but it's odd really, given we use compression all day transparently for many critical things
<diddledan_> you can use `compact.exe /compactos:query` to check whether your system already has the setting enabled or not
<popey> I remember the day Windows 95 came out. I had a Toshiba CS 2100 running Windows 3.11 with a compressed drive. Took an _age_ to upgrade to Win95
<popey> I left it at work chugging away and went home.
<ali1234> i saw a windows server recently that had compression turned on when the drive ran out of space
<ali1234> it took about 30 minutes to boot up
<shauno> doublespace isn't dead?
<ali1234> ntfs has compression built in
<popey> Thinking about it, that toshiba was the first laptop I had which had a nipple
<popey> kinda wish I got into Linux back then
<shauno> I may never understand your fascination with nipples
<popey> accuracy and lack of finger movement
<shauno> and you didn't miss much.  I moved to linux instead of 95.  they were some dark, dark years.  I didn't find a video card with X drivers until early 2000s
<diddledan_> lol
<diddledan_> that's impressive
<shauno> it really wasn't :/  I had a tseng labs card, which was meant to work with the et4000 drivers, but never did.  so I could get 640x480 with the vesa drivers, and nothing else
<popey> Very first time I'd heard of Linux was when I worked at a college and one of the students mentioned it to me.
<popey> I was like "pfffft whatever"
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<popey> word
<bigcalm> Up
<diddledan_> I remember quizzing the IT guy at the college I attended about their CLI interface and whether it was this new linux thing and he replied: no it's a real netware
<intrbiz> bigcalm: morning
<diddledan_> as if linux was supposed to be a knockoff netware clone
<bigcalm> intrbiz: still on for Saturday?
<intrbiz> bigcalm: yup
<bigcalm> Yay
<diddledan_> choochoo?
<bigcalm> Hayley won't be joining us :(
<popey> choo choo indeed!
<intrbiz> bigcalm: are we meeting anywhere before hand/
<diddledan_> have fun :-)
<intrbiz> bigcalm: ah :(
<bigcalm> intrbiz: Some of us will be at The Mulberry in Farnham around 5/5.30 ish
<intrbiz> okies
<bigcalm> Food and a pint before choo choo
<popey> pre-pint pint
<intrbiz> yeh
<bigcalm> intrbiz: I thought you were meeting us at Alton?
<bigcalm> Will be grand if you do join us :)
<diddledan_> anywho, I'm knackered. gonna go get some shuteye
<intrbiz> bigcalm: should be in farnham, if not then alton
<daftykins> such alien places to me, you mainlanders speak of
<intrbiz> bigcalm: just gotta sort the timings out
<daftykins> there's only a dry bit and a wet bit down 'ere :D
<bigcalm> intrbiz: got a moment for some fun with ansible?
<intrbiz> bigcalm: sure
<bigcalm> Yay
<bigcalm> In a roll I have http://paste.ubuntu.com/12441053/
<intrbiz> yeh
<bigcalm> In a Vagrantfile I have http://paste.ubuntu.com/12441057/
<bigcalm> But it's failing with
<bigcalm> fatal: [mvp] => with_dict expects a dict
<bigcalm> Obviously I'm doing something wrong with databases in my extra_vars, but I'm not sure what
<intrbiz> bigcalm: try with_items rather than with_dict
<bigcalm> Okay
<bigcalm> fatal: [mvp] => One or more undefined variables: 'dict object' has no attribute 'value'
<bigcalm> Should I now move to using item.name instead of item.value.name ?
<intrbiz> bigcalm: omit the '.value'
<intrbiz> bigcalm: eg: item.name
<intrbiz> bigcalm: item.host
<intrbiz> bigcalm: brb
<bigcalm> http://paste.ubuntu.com/12441116/
<bigcalm> K
<bigcalm> Ah, possibly missing a module
<intrbiz> bigcalm: you'll need a pre-req task along the lines of: apt-get name=python-mysqldb state=installed
<bigcalm> Ah
<intrbiz> bigcalm: not 100% sure what the python-mysql driver package name is on ubunut
<intrbiz> ubuntu*
<bigcalm> I couldn't work out if the python module was needed on the host or the guest
<bigcalm> Yeah, it's sudo apt-get install python-mysqldb
<bigcalm> Woop!
<bigcalm> intrbiz: thanks :)
<intrbiz> bigcalm: working?
<bigcalm> intrbiz: like a charm
<intrbiz> bigcalm: coolio, ansible execute the tasks locally on the target host, so you need the python drivers etc installed on the target for some of the modules
<bigcalm> I'm enjoying converting this project from bash to ansible provisioning
<bigcalm> intrbiz: makes sense
<intrbiz> mmm maisel's weisse is sehr gut
<intrbiz> bigcalm: I assume you'll be at revolution next week?
<Azelphur> popey: was it you who had a fancy home monitoring setup so you could see the power consumption of each plug socket? curious how it's done
<popey> not me
<Azelphur> dam
<Azelphur> would be cool to monitor the usage of each individual plug socket :)
<bigcalm> intrbiz: the 3 of us will be, aye. Hayley will be all alone in the office
<bigcalm> intrbiz: are you coming up for it?
<bigcalm> intrbiz: and for the Rebellion the night before?
<intrbiz> bigcalm: won't be at rebellion sadly, will be on a train somewhere
<intrbiz> bigcalm: will be at revolution on the friday
<bigcalm> Fair enough
<intrbiz> bigcalm: I was planning on WFH on the 24th, but we've got a company party that afternoon, with free drinks
<bigcalm> Doh!
<bigcalm> Your train journey is going to be fun :P
<intrbiz> yeh :(
<intrbiz> gonna try and not drink too much
<intrbiz> hmm, decisions, decision, sould I do: PostgreSQL con -> ogg camp -> SuseCon all back to back
<bigcalm> Nutta :D
<bigcalm> Hayley and I will be spending some of our time in the Ship and Mitre drinking strong Belgian beers over the Oggcamp weekend
<intrbiz> bigcalm: we went to a Belgian resteraunt for lunch t'other day, 50 bottles + several taps on their menu, had some nice wit beer
<bigcalm> :)
<bigcalm> Any thoughts as to why this might start happening? http://paste.ubuntu.com/12441563/
<intrbiz> bigcalm: sorry :(, not used Vagrant
<bigcalm> Okay
<intrbiz> bigcalm: docs for vargrant share do state: 'Vagrant Share requires an account with HashiCorp's Atlas to be used'
<bigcalm> I don't know what that means
<bigcalm> I'm running an old version of vagrant, yay me
<intrbiz> bigcalm: https://atlas.hashicorp.com/
<bigcalm> intrbiz: I was running an old version of vagrant
<intrbiz> bigcalm: ah
<bigcalm> I don't dev from my laptop as much as I used to
<intrbiz> bigcalm: ah, desktop?
<intrbiz> bigcalm: I use my aging T410 for everything now
<bigcalm> intrbiz: desktop at home and desktop at work
<bigcalm> Which sometimes bites me in the arse if I forget to check something in
<intrbiz> bigcalm: hehe
<intrbiz> bigcalm: I've recently realised how few posessions I actually need
<bigcalm> When that happens, and I'm at home, I get Adam to turn on my workstation and then SSH in over the vpn
<bigcalm> intrbiz: becoming a nomad?
<intrbiz> bigcalm: feels like it, yeh
<intrbiz> bigcalm: just roam from hotel to hotel. Sadly london hotels are all to variable
<intrbiz> bigcalm: and roam from pub to pub
<intrbiz> maybe that should be crawl
<bigcalm> ;
<bigcalm> )
<intrbiz> bigcalm: I do miss being able to go to Symphony Hall however
<bigcalm> It's getting expensive there
<intrbiz> bigcalm: at SH?
<bigcalm> SH in the ICC?
<intrbiz> bigcalm: yeh
<bigcalm> Maybe it's just the shows that we want to go and see
<bigcalm> Surely you have greater options down in Londinium?
<intrbiz> bigcalm: SH is a far better venue for Classical than anything in London
<intrbiz> bigcalm: it's rather ironic
<dutchie> haha you wouldn't believe that if you listen to my dad
<bigcalm> Crikey
<intrbiz> dutchie: yeh?
<dutchie> intrbiz: he's principal trumpet in the cbso, always complaining about how things are going downhill
<bigcalm> cb?
<intrbiz> dutchie: cool, its ashame that Andris left
<dutchie> yeah, he was really good
<intrbiz> a shame*
<dutchie> bigcalm: city of birmingham symphony orchestra
<bigcalm> dutchie: ta, I guessed the so ;)
<bigcalm> cobso sounds better :P
<intrbiz> bigcalm: :(
<bigcalm> Anyway, time for a snooze
<bigcalm> See you kids at the weekend :)
<intrbiz> bigcalm: cya saturday
<dutchie> see you then too!
<intrbiz> dutchie: are you RATing?
<dutchie> yup
<dutchie> hmm, i should find my ticket for that
<intrbiz> dutchie: cool, see you too
<mapps> back soon moving laptop so no net
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-18
<ball> Is it fair to describe python as a package that is shipped with the operating system. It's not part of Linux, right?
<Azelphur> correct, Python is not part of Linux
<ball> Thanks. I thought that was the case but wanted to check with Linux people before I clicked the [reply] button.
<MooDoo> morning all
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<MooDoo> phew thought i was the only nutter up this early :D
<zmoylan-pi> i thought it was just me and my singing potatos...
<MooDoo> lol
<shauno> singing potatos?
<zmoylan-pi> red dwarf reference
<zmoylan-pi> bonus, irish government has announced spending â¬1m on encouraging irish people to eat more potatos so we may well soon have singing potatos :-)
<czajkowski> bigcalm: can you edit the RAT info and add Where: The Mulberry  5:30pm there?
<czajkowski> please
<czajkowski> zmoylan-pi: POTATOES!
<czajkowski> zmoylan-pi: although popey has a unique way of saying that word!
<knightwise> Peh-taatoohs
<zmoylan-pi> spuds
<bashrc_> teapots
<MooDoo> bang tidy!
<czajkowski> TEA++
<bashrc_> mornington crescent!
<czajkowski> hmm I have edit power
<czajkowski> done :)
<czajkowski> on the LTP
<zmoylan-pi> now you can smite your enemies >:-)
<czajkowski> smite
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<zmoylan-pi> a good smite goes a long way :-)
<popey> POH-TAY-TOES!
<SuperMatt> boil 'em mash 'em stick 'em in a stew
<SuperMatt> ð
<bigcalm> Birdseye potato waffles, they're waffley versatile
<zmoylan-pi> for mash get smash
<czajkowski> http://thepioneerwoman.com/cooking/crash-hot-potatoes/  nice new way to do them
<SuperMatt> ð  - there's a sweet potato emoji, but no regular potato
<Myrtti> I should have some breakfast
<MooDoo> Mines ordered and on it's way at 9:45 :D
<zmoylan-pi> somewhere out there there's a bowl of weetabix with my name on it...
<MooDoo> I've got BACON!!!! coming
<SuperMatt> I've had my crunchy nut, but it has done nothing to cure my slither of a hangover
<knightwise> Spotify discover playlist + mpsYoutube :) = Free music
<czajkowski> popey: new way for you to try out the tatties!
<czajkowski> I had beans on toast today
<czajkowski> nyomy
<zmoylan-pi> too warm for toast... but winter is coming...
<SuperMatt> now I want cheese and beans on toast
<davmor2> MooDoo: you can go off people you know
<davmor2> Morning all
<SuperMatt> stupid canteen wouldn't accomodate that though
<bigcalm> czajkowski: I would edit the loco page for the RAT, but somebody else has already done it
<czajkowski> bigcalm: moi :)
<czajkowski> I have edit rights
<czajkowski> which I didn't know till I  logged in
<MooDoo> davmor2: nah ;)
<czajkowski> beans on toast with some bacon perhaps the next time, golden crispy bacon
<davmor2> Last fires will rise, behind those eyes, black house will rock, Blind boys don't liiiiiiiiiiieeeeeee ah G tom mac
<bigcalm> czajkowski: righteo :)
<zmoylan-pi> that's why you get the micro microwave to cook the beans on the sly.... http://gizmodo.com/5283559/beanzawave-usb-powered-beans-microwave-is-what-usb-was-created-for
<MooDoo> davmor2: lost boys sound track?
<davmor2> MooDoo: I already added people are strange and for some reason I woke up with this in my head this morning, I think it is telling me I need to watch the lost boys :)
<MooDoo> go for it...
<ali1234> so that's why they created USB3
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Friday, and happy Respect Day! ð
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<MooDoo> howdy both
<brobostigon> morning MooDoo
<popey> bigcalm: do you use telegram?
<bigcalm> popey: I don't. What is it? Should I use it?
<popey> yes
<bigcalm> Very yes
<popey> http://desktop.telegram.org/ and also app on phone
<popey> job done
<bigcalm> Free forever and no ads - what's the catch?
<popey> you'll keep getting messages from me
<bigcalm> Sounds dodgy
<Myrtti> I'm somewhat tempted by Telegram, but it's so handy to have my chat history in gmail archive where I can easily search it
<shauno> I don't really see the value proposition of Telegram.  Poorly implemented crypto with a very limited userbase
<Myrtti> https://instagram.com/p/6imd5goE6W/ vs https://youtu.be/5c6zb2ITAbM
<popey> network effect, same as any chat system
<popey> Myrtti: one of the linked videos from that one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_AtP7au_Q9w
<popey> so cute
<bigcalm> I appear to have automatic contacts, odd
<diplo> What a small world, sat in a local food place eating lunch and a guy over heard our *nixy type conversation
<diplo> Turns out he's Richard Morrel from Redhat, lives close by :)
<diplo> Went from an hour lunch to 2 and bit learning lots of stuff
<bigcalm> Nice
<Azelphur> Hmm, I just spotted the Intel Compute Stick up for Â£79.99 on Amazon, For anyone that doesn't know, Windows 8 version: Â£79.99 32GB Storage 2GB RAM, Linux version: Â£79.99 8GB storage 2GB RAM. Are there any similar devices that don't penalise you for wanting to use Linux? XD
<Azelphur> sorry, Linux version is 1GB RAM
<popey> dabs had them on sale recently too - the windows one
<popey> the windows one was more expensive, but they've dropped the price
<directhex> this typically happens when a product launches with multiple OSes
<directhex> the windows version ends up getting discounts, the linux one stays at original RRP
<Azelphur> popey, yea but I don't wanna use it with Windows, and it sounds like it doesn't support Ubuntu too well if you wanna do it manually
<Azelphur> directhex, and the Windows one is vastly higher spec
<popey> yeah, this is not news
<Azelphur> I wouldn't wanna run Kodi in 8GB, I've done it before and it runs out of space for the image caches :(
<awilkins> It used to be the Linux one was better
<awilkins> Netbooks had better stats for the Linux models because they didn't have to eat the cost of an OEM license for Windows
<Azelphur> indeed, should be the way
<directhex> windows is basically free for sufficiently low-spec devices
<directhex> but
<Azelphur> tbh I'd be ok even if it was equal specs and same price, but vastly less specs just make it unworkable for me as I say
<directhex> the bundled crapware - antivirus trials etc - cost negative money. the oem gets paid to include them
<Azelphur> so was curious if anyone knew of anything similar, 8GB just simply isn't enough to run Kodi in
<directhex> so on bottom-spec devices, windows costs negative money compared to linux
<awilkins> Bundleware also effectively reduces the spec of your device by consuming resources
<popey> normals don't know that
<awilkins> Can you buy the Windows one and nuke it, or is SecureBoot enabled and locked?
<Azelphur> awilkins: you can, but I stopped reading after "Contact realtek and ask them for the wireless drivers"
<popey> That's two separate things.
<awilkins> (is that a problem? do we still have permission *tugs forelock* from MS to install Linux on things?)
<popey> I don't believe secureboot is an issue for it
<popey> the wireless drivers aren't in trunk, are they, that's why
<awilkins> Urrgh, I hate that
<awilkins> My days of using Gentoo and building bleeding edge kernels to support TV capture hardware are done
<diddledan_> awilkins: you've never lived until you've compiled several kernels for Gentoo :-)
<shauno> all my tv capture needs are handled by stock ethernet drivers now ;)
<zmoylan-1i> but at least you felt you got value for spending a few extra bob on the cpu then :-)
<diddledan_> Gentoo is fun :-p
<davmor2> diddledan: LFS
<popey> Pfft, Core Linux
<diddledan_> davmor2: I tried that
<zmoylan-pi> 1
<diddledan_> I didn't get as far as X11
<diddledan_> sooo slow
<shauno> I tried LFS too.  I was quite happy I had my distro down to ~40Mb.  but updates were cruel&unusual
<zmoylan-pi> but at 40mb you could email yourself the updates for install... :-)
<davmor2> at 40Mb the email would probably be bigger
<shauno> moving them wasn't the problem.  it was keeping track of upstream
<popey> yeah, i was subscribing to freshmeat updates at one point
<popey> updating packages left and right
<popey> then i tried to build mozilla web browser and ran out of disk space
<popey> on a poor little dell piii 500Mhz
<shauno> yeah.  seamonkey was roughly as big as .. everything else combined.
<shauno> I even tried building OOo once.  once.
<popey> yeah, same
<popey> that was daft :)
<davmor2> popey: Bigron gave up on using Gentoo one summer when his cpu over heated
<zmoylan-pi> it just loaded and played laugh.mp3 when you tried? :-)
<popey> dependencies
<popey> I was using Core which had no package manager
<davmor2> He was installing OOo
<popey> everything was wget, ./configure, rinse repeat, eventually make, make install
<shauno> building OOo during summer?!
<shauno> that's a job you save for when you want the computer to contribute to your heating costs.
<shauno> I think my biggest stand-out memory from LFS, was the whole bootstrap process for gcc.  I don't think I ever got my head around that
<shauno> something like .. you built a bit of gcc, then used that to build the rest, then used that to build the whole lot again, and then used that to build glibc
<dutchie> iirc there's a "check that the bootstrapped compiler gives the same output as the hosting one" step in there too
<shauno> the "terminator 2" build process
<shauno> it really did feel like the hhgtg approach to flying though.  that the whole process wouldn't actually work if you understood it.
<awilkins> Yeah, you built your toolchain.. then build the basic libs with it
<awilkins> Then built your toolchain again to make sure it was optimized
<awilkins> Or summat
<Azelphur> popey: http://home.azelphur.com/speedtest-results/output.html holy cow look at 2015-09-17
<zmoylan-pi> upgrade iphone iwatch day?
<shauno> yesterday
<shauno> ah, yeah.  I haven't looked at the numbers for a while.  didn't realise 17 was yesterday
<shauno> hah, no, it was the 16th.  about 6pm.  I'll shut up now.
<Azelphur> Also I just realised something, when my new monitors arrive it will be a momentous day, finally after all these years I will officially stop whining about terrible multiple X screen support, as I won't be using it
<zmoylan-pi> braille? :-)
<Azelphur> nah, going to one GPU
<popey> one very large gpu
<Azelphur> 980, so yea
<Azelphur> Question for someone knowledgable, I know ofcom did a lot of stuff regarding ISPs and download speeds, baring in mind my ISP has admitted to me that my speeds are poor due to overselling, and I am building up evidence which clearly shows really poor connectivity during peak times, is there something ofcom can do about it?
<Azelphur> eg I'm on a 70mbit line and BTs speed tester says acceptable line speed is 40mbit, my connection was <40mbit (average more like 10mbit) for 4 hours, this kinda thing is common
<daftykins> Azelphur: ask them :D
<StevenR_> Azelphur: what are you actually paying for?
<shauno> ooh, so that's A Thing now; https://www.microbit.co.uk/
<popey> microbit is late, I bought a codebug which is similar
<MooDoo> evening all
<daftykins> hallo
<popey> yo yo
<Azelphur> StevenR_: up to 72mbit
<StevenR_> Azelphur: what's the max that you can get to?
<Azelphur> 72
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-19
<popey> i should look at my graph again somtime, just left it running
<zmoylan-pi> but at this time of night there's little contention so the speeds will fly
<Azelphur> popey: do you want my updated script? it's so much better
<Azelphur> if you have Python on your router it should work
<popey> its ddwrt
<Azelphur> I think you have opkg on there and can install Python?
<popey> I wont have a chance to for a while, I'll ping you when I have some time to, thanks
<Azelphur> sure :)
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<knightwise> good morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning knightwise
<knightwise> how are you doing bro
<brobostigon> hangover central, had abit of a long night out with my gf. and you?
<knightwise> Had a long work week. Catching up on some stuff in the home office , rearranging some screens and updating my xps
<knightwise> been neglecting it a little bit lately
<brobostigon> oh dear, :( . anit of a rstful weekend required it sound slike.
<knightwise> wont be getting that anytime soon . got some lectures to prep for the coming month
<brobostigon> :(
<knightwise> its ok :) all part of running your own business
<brobostigon> :)
<foobarry> man, beating scervo on skyward sword, that was tough
<neuro> moo
<zmoylan-pi> *bark*
<neuro> moving irssi proxy from local VM to AWS VM for the win
<neuro> and fixing mac irc client also for the win
<neuro> so how is everyone this fine saturday afternoon?
<zmoylan-pi> quiet
<isleofmandan> Any broadcom wireless experts around? We've got a clean install of 15.04 but no wifi, and another ubuntu machine nearby that has internet access. We have a USB stick.... ;)
<MartijnVdS> isleofmandan: easiest would be a USB ethernet dongle to install packages ;)
<MartijnVdS> isleofmandan: anyway, install this: http://packages.ubuntu.com/vivid/admin/broadcom-sta-dkms
<isleofmandan> Thanks.. Just hooked up a phone with USB tethering
<MartijnVdS> (download, dpkg -i, download dependencies, dpkg -i, repeat until done)
<MartijnVdS> oh then it's easier
<MartijnVdS> just install broadcom-sta-dkms
<isleofmandan> I need a 4G phone.. lol
<MartijnVdS> they have 4G on the isle? :P
<isleofmandan> They do. My phone doesn't :)
<neuro> they have electricity and running water too!!
<isleofmandan> cheeky
<neuro> i was being sarky at martijn, not you ;)
<isleofmandan> Boo.  "Bad return status for module build..."  What's that all about then?
<isleofmandan> doing the old 'sudo apt-get dist-upgrade' on a 3G phone is sloooow :)
<brobostigon> i have some good news, i just asked my gf what she would say if i were to ask her to be my wife, and she said, "it would be amazing to be your wife and to be yours someday". :)
<isleofmandan> Thanks for the help folks. We're getting kicked out of CodeClub now.  He'll have to struggle by on his own!
<isleofmandan> congrats brobostigon. When is some day? ;)
<brobostigon> ty, :). it means sometime undetermined time in the future.
<brobostigon> some undetermined time*
<isleofmandan> :)
<brobostigon> :)
<isleofmandan> Saved at the final hour. He has wi-fi :)     If any of you are at OggCamp in Liverpool next month, I owe you a beer.
<isleofmandan> Cheers.
<shauno> finally, doctor who :)
<penguin42> we've got some swifts or swallows on a field near here; they're *way* too fast to focus on though - how the heck do you tell what they are
<zleap> look at the wings,
<ali1234> catch it in a big net
<zleap> i think you can tell by the wing shape or something, try a bird ID guide it may have a siloette of each so you can tell
<penguin42> will have to try getting the speed on his camera really really fast
<penguin42> so far my only way of getting any pictures of them is to focus on one point in the field and take a rapid succession of images and hope that one or two of them have the bird in
<foobarry> has anyone tried converting ogg->mp3 ?
<foobarry> wonder what the quality reduction is like?
<foobarry> in the past i converted half my collection to ogg until i realised it wasn' the future
<foobarry> never had the resolve to get the CDs out of the boxes and re rip
<shauno> I'd think it depends how anal you were about the original rips.  eg, if you've done them all at 320, then ogg-320 to mp3-256 probably isn't going to hurt enough to worry about
<shauno> (unless you've been blessed with golden ears, and require audio equipment made from unicorn tears and pixie farts)
<shauno> if you've already done them at some approximation of "normal", then normal minus loss = subar.  but if they're already overkill, overkill minus loss = normal  (in the vaguest possible terms)
<shauno> otherwise, just try it on something that you think you'd notice the difference on, and "suck it and see"
<shauno> er, *sub-par
<penguin42> shauno: Well you've got to connect the pixie farts on the amp end, and the unicorn tears to the speakers
<shauno> it's more just a generic disclaimer, because there's "always one", and he'll want your blood for even uttering "transcode"
<foobarry> ogg didn't do bitrates as i remember
<foobarry> not the same way as mp3
<foobarry> i mean, the program had "level 6" etc
<foobarry> a bit like some other encoiding apps
<shauno> yeah, but they're pretty direct parallels.  q4 is 128, q8 is 256, q9 is 320
<foobarry> btw whats a good ripping app for linux?
 * penguin42 uses k3b
<foobarry> rhythmbox and other g* ones suck
<foobarry> they broke some time ago
<shauno> I'll deferr on that one.  I still do everything with brutally ugly bash scripts
<foobarry> paranoia?
<shauno> or worse.  I've been known to use php5-cli where sane people would call for python :D
<foobarry> q6? 192?
<shauno> bingo
<foobarry> wonder if i can go from 192 ogg to 192 mp3 without crying
<foobarry> flicking channels. not sure i've ever seen a nick cage film
 * penguin42 has watched Con Air and hmm one or two others
 * penguin42 generally doesn't like him that much
<foobarry> nope
<foobarry> seems lame
<foobarry> right, bed time. nighty
<penguin42> nn
 * foobarry spots a story about eejit who ate 35 biagra
<foobarry> v*
<daftykins> ooh-err
 * penguin42 heard about that, how exactly did he end up taking 35
<daftykins> i sense that doesn't end with a comical 'mood' lasting days
<shauno> ugh, this flirc dongle is .. naughty words.
<daftykins> ah i see folk acquire those things in #kodi i think
<shauno> I didn't realise it just pretends it's a keyboard
<shauno> would really, really prefer something that just uses lirc
<daftykins> ah i was thinking it was the CEC thing
<shauno> argh.  pulling hair out trying to figure out how to get the harmony remote working with flirc
<daftykins> nothing on the Kodi forums?
<shauno> yes.  pages and pages of conflicting nonsense
<daftykins> ah par for the course then :D
<shauno> it keeps saying to just search harmony for 'kodi' as a built-in profile
<shauno> except harmony requires a brand and a model, so you can't search for a single word
<daftykins> manufacturer Flirc apparently
<daftykins> i take it that's not listed?
<shauno> searching for kodi as both model & brand gave me an MCE profile, which doesn't work with flirc because the rc6 protocl adds huge, huge delays
<shauno> I tried the profile that comes up if you search for flirc as both mffr & model, but you then can't program it into the flirc dongle
<shauno> because it sets up play/pause/prev/next as media keys which I can't disable, so they go to itunes instead of flirc's app
<shauno> right now it's like .. everything.  all at once, everything is conspiring against me.  divided, they're just silly issues.  together, they'll beat me
<daftykins> i feel a bit like that lately, i think everything electrical in my house has some issue or another
<shauno> I'm not sure why I'm even bothering, since I have to replace the flirc thing to eventually achieve what I want anyway
<shauno> I want to send some buttons on the remote to a background process, so having it act as a keyboard works against me
<penguin42> what keys on the keyboard does it work as ?
<penguin42> shauno: You can probably also watch the events from that specific input device separately as well
<shauno> the keys are configurable in the flirc app
<penguin42> well I mean what does the device send if it acts as a HID device
<shauno> so like, you press Enter in the app, and then press a button on the remote.  and then every time you press that button, it sends Enter
<shauno> hm.  and the skin I've been using for years has gone full-metal-idiot too.  gah
<shauno> so simple enough story.  I'm trying to move from xbmc ... 11? I think on my 1st-gen appletv, to kodi on the pi
<shauno> *only* because the appletv just doesn't have the horsepower, so I've been transcoding everything into its native format for years
<shauno> so most the reason everything feels exceptionally frustrating, is that it's all things I've already had working for years
<shauno> like right now, I'm stuck in a dialogue box where I can't seem to navigate to the 'ok' button
<shauno> just going round and round in circles wanting 11 back
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-20
<daftykins> :(
<daftykins> i think if you didn't want more than openelec could provide, life could be simple :)
<shauno> well, I'm trying to use osmc at the moment
<shauno> so .. similar.  except I can actually access the filesystem without rebuilding the whole thing
<daftykins> oh dear
<daftykins> haha i had a PM from one of the people in the community/devs for that, because i called their community incompetent
<shauno> (I tried openelec, trying to remaster their rootfs was pure pain)
<daftykins> reason being, they tailor the thing for Pis - yet none of their IRC channel even know about the memory divider
<shauno> well you're just a big mean meanie.
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> was just a bit concerning that i was able to point out the problem to a couple of people, when i don't even own one
<shauno> mostly I'm just finding the same problem as the rest of opensource
<shauno> "stop trying to fix it, it already works"
<daftykins> but you must geek, so it can work _better_!
<shauno> this isn't better.  this really isn't better  lol
<shauno> I'm trying to figure out how to port the skin I was using on 11, because it was near-perfect.  but they've kept on fiddling, and now it's a disaster
<shauno> there's a lot to be said for figuring out when to say no
<daftykins> ooh-err, i think skins are an exercise in pain
<daftykins> i don't even stray from confluence
<shauno> most the skins seem to be obsessed with seeing how many more flashy lights they can fit in
<shauno> I had a really old build of refocus where I just had links down the side for movies/tv shows/weather.  and that's it
<shauno> now it's all like .. we found some spare space to add another flashy!  needs more, needs more!
<daftykins> ah so quite close to the stock ATV one?
<shauno> more like the windows metro look, if you took away the tiles behind the text
<daftykins> ah-har
<shauno> but now each button has borders, which adds nothing.  and each button now tries to do 4 things, when it only needed to do one
<shauno> I mean, when I press 'tv shows'.  I want to see my tv shows.  that should be really obvious.  I don't need a submenu.
 * daftykins fires up Kodi
<shauno> they have added a 'feature' to customize the buttons, but to me that's just admitting that they've replaced "works" with "can be massaged into working"
<daftykins> that does sound quite annoying
<daftykins> oh dear i've just gotten a 'drive timeout detected' on my RAID :(
<daftykins> port 11, hmm
<shauno> that also sounds quite annoying :p
<daftykins> drive removed O_O
<penguin42> how many disks have you got?
<daftykins> 12 port controller, ports 7-12 are populated with my newest array atm
<daftykins> 1-6 is the old which don't get powered on
<daftykins> are the old disks, i should say
<shauno> "all of them".  when you're on a far-flung island, it's performant to cache the internet.  the entire internet.
<daftykins> :D
<penguin42> yeech I hate the 'performant' word
<daftykins> and the best part, Kodi carried on updating the library as if nothing happened
<shauno> reminds me, the gen8 hp microserver .. anyone tried running the OS off the sd card?
<daftykins> there we go, replugged the power to the disk whilst live and she's rebuilding now
<daftykins> "oh noes! our sibling was gone for mere minutes!"
<daftykins> <3 hardware RAID :)
 * penguin42 got sent a job ad for a C++ programmer in Cambridge doing something involving Yocto, Perl/Python and Postcipt/PDF/PCL - so it sounds like someones trying to build a Yocto based printer - I'm not interested but can forward to anyone who is
<daftykins> ah this "Mr. Robot" is really fun so far :) episode 1
<shauno> aha, got my optical out working :)
<shauno> and yeha, I liked ep1.  but ..
<daftykins> slid from there huh?
<shauno> I dunno.  everyone else seems to like it
<daftykins> there we go, ep 1 down
<czajkowski> aloha
<leecowdrey_> Ah the RAT survivors
<zmoylan-pi> those that minded the step...
<czajkowski> zmoylan-pi: lol
<czajkowski> I was driving I've to fly in a few hours on a 11 hr flight
<czajkowski> https://plus.google.com/u/0/+LauraCzajkowski/posts/3jbCYWG8S43  community social day out
<zmoylan-pi> you must by now have the biggest collection of duty free...
<czajkowski> I
<czajkowski> m past duty free excitement
<zmoylan-pi> you could build a log cabin of toblerones...
<czajkowski> <--- gone
<knightwise> morning
<knightwise> popey: I am in need of a little convergence demo video of ubuntu (where you can switch from touch to desktop mode) do you have anyplace I might find a decent one ?
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<Myrtti> mmm cracked corn toblerone
<leecowdrey_> Knightwise there are some on YouTube
<knightwise> leecowdrey_: found some .. mostly demos by engineers or developers .. no "commercial video's " that i can quickly use in a presentation
<leecowdrey_> Yeah sorry, don't know about commercial ones as thought was still work in progress for 2016 as the phones out on the market (not ports) don't yet support MHL
<popey> knightwise: no commerical ones yet because it's not stable enough
<knightwise> popey: not even concept ones ?
<popey> no
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
 * penguin42 yawns
<popey> yo
<penguin42> hey popey
<bigcalm> Word
<zmoylan-pi> hammer time...
<MooDoo> evening all
<daftykins> \o
<popey> yo
<zmoylan-pi> all the rail passengers survived the rat then?
<dutchie> apparently
<zmoylan-pi> and did anyone slip the receipt from a tattoo parlor into the back pocket of anyone? :-D
<shauno> I wonder if there's a term for that?  'rat train', like 'pin number'
<daftykins> hmm
<daftykins> seems like the kinda thing that should
<shauno> that's what I'm thinking.  if spoonerisms have a term, this surely should
<shauno> closest I can find is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAS_syndrome
<shauno> but that seems quite difficult to use in a sentence.
<shauno> (and I'm quite impressed I found that much.  further proof that googling stuff is the primary skillset in my job)
<daftykins> wow
<daftykins> haha yeah i'm amazed you found that
<zmoylan-pi> wouldn't rat train be wrong as the t in rat is train?
<daftykins> nah that's the point, it's redundant repetition on the tail end of acronyms
<foobarry> hmm, my lid doesn't suspend the laptop anymore
<shauno> right, "real ale train train"
 * zmoylan-pi leaves these common redundancies... http://grammar.about.com/od/words/a/redundancies.htm
<popey> I never call it RAT, it's always known as the Beer Train round these parts
<foobarry> firefox doesn't reflow text on android :(
 * Laney screams
<Laney> took me 9 attempts to type my passphrase just now
<Laney> emphasis on the phrase
<foobarry> Alongtimeagoinagalaxyfarfaraway
<daftykins> Laney: into what?
<Laney> pinentry dialog
<Laney> was sighing an email
<daftykins> signing?
 * daftykins blinks
<Laney> yes very good
<Laney> if I just type it slower it'll probably take less time overall
<shauno> well now we can see why the passphrase was a struggle ;)
<daftykins> XD
<Laney> right
<Laney> goodbye!
<shauno> I keep getting this at work.  everytime they make us change our passwords, by time it's muscle-memory it's time to change it again
<shauno> so I feel like an idiot every single time I sit down
<daftykins> such policy can only be harmful
<daftykins> forces folk to pick less complex things i reckon
<shauno> or entices them to write them down
<popey> which is a good thing
<daftykins> wat
<popey> writing down passwords is a good idea
<popey> it means you can have very long complex passwords and not worry about forgetting them
<daftykins> not if they're left in front of the keyboard by users :D
<popey> I didn't say that :)
<popey> I write mine down. I tend not to stick it to the screen
<daftykins> no but i think that's more the scenario we were angling at
<shauno> I actually have a bunch on a small whiteboard by my desk
<shauno> a practice I'll quit as soon as they actually fix SSO
<zmoylan-pi> or one of your neighbours gets a drone... ;-)
<shauno> heh, I mean at work.  they won't need a drone :)
<zmoylan-pi> i have my passwords written down bottom to top split across 2 pieces of paper.  so if you find one...
<zmoylan-pi> and if you can a glimpse it's gibberish
<zmoylan-pi> i would use ogham but there's not enough characters :-)
<shauno> oh I don't bother complicating it at all.  if you want to go do my performance appraisals for me, feel free.  they're all low-value cruft else they'd be using SSO
<neuro> EVENIN ALL
<foobarry> i wonder if password crack dicts have klingon dicts
<foobarry> bah, my lid closed suspend script worked once only :(
<zmoylan-pi> it's just a list of words added to their already big lists so yeah...
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-19
<davmor2> Morning all you cyberhippies
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<popey> hello
<brobostigon> hello
<davmor2> Hello, is it me your looking for?
<brobostigon> i was looking for my cuppa, but remeber i forgot it in the kitchen. lol.
<brobostigon> remebered*
<davmor2> things ain't cooking in my kitchen, strange affliction what can this be
<diddledan> morning
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<popey> word
<diddledan> davmor2: my hair is short atm, so I'm less hippylike for the foreseeable :-p
<zmoylan-pi> job interviews... making geeks get haircuts since forever...
<diddledan> lmao
<diddledan> I got some work from it though :-)
<zmoylan-pi> so a small sacrifice traded for some geek cred... :-P
<diddledan> why is every security blog talking about covering your webcam because the fbi dude does it, right now?
<popey> because mark zuckerberg does it?
<zmoylan-pi> because i've been covering my webcams and phone cams with tape for years and he's just copying me...
<diddledan> I prefer to let whoever hacks me to see me in the nude. that'll make them mentally-scarred for life
<davmor2> diddledan: you deal in cyber and freedom you are a cyberhippie no matter what length your hair is :)
<zmoylan-pi> it does seem interesting that no manufacturers offer a laptop/tablet/phone with physical switches for microphones/cams
<popey> diddledan: he saw you do it?
<diddledan> davmor2: awesomesauce
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: probably because they're schills for the government :-p
 * diddledan buffs-up his tin-foil
<davmor2> zmoylan-pi: you fool thats so the nsa and gchq can monitor you ;)
<zmoylan-pi> it's also an admission of defeat if the fbi and mark zuckerburg cover their cams.  if they can't be on a secure network then who can...
<diddledan> tin-foil needs to be as shiny as possible. the more shiny, the better they are at blocking the mindrays
<davmor2> oh hang on knock at the door..........mmmmffmffmfmfmfmfffffmf......run the men in black are real
<diddledan> the men in black wear red
<zmoylan-pi> should be easy to kill so... :-P
<zmoylan-pi> even near misses....
<diddledan> how not to answer a probing question into national security from a US general: http://www.vocativ.com/357132/the-cyber-is-so-big-donald-trump-on-web-security/
<davmor2> diddledan: he really shouldn't be allowed to talk
<zmoylan-pi> take away the pong paddles too, they're beyond him...
<diddledan> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_m5AlsQqcs
<diddledan> wat: https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/worlds-smallest-working-mame-cabinet/
<diddledan> that's small
<zmoylan-pi> so you can put it on a keyring...
<diddledan> lol
<foobarry> has anyone watched citizenfour? is it worth watching vs new snowden film?
<zmoylan-pi> i really liked citizen 4, haven't seen new snowden film yet... probably a fingerprint check at local cinema to help speed up rounding up the dangerous intellectuals... :-)
<foobarry> not sure i'd want to see such a film at cinema
<foobarry> 10+ quid for a documentary style thing
<zmoylan-pi> i'll get it on dvd from bargain bin in a few months like per usual
<diddledan> they'll be running facial recog and bluetooth, wifi, and cellular snooping
<diddledan> I might acquire it somehow
<diddledan> I might even pay for it
<diddledan> :-p
<diddledan> apparently there's been announcements that it's all lies
<zmoylan-pi> which means it's all true
<diddledan> yup
<zmoylan-pi> it's not true unless the nsa/cia accuse it of lies
<diddledan> there have been claims that he washed out of the military rather than the film's claim that he broke his legs
<zmoylan-pi> they just want a chance to break his legs again
<diddledan> they have said he wasn't a consultant but merely a techy
<zmoylan-pi> a techy on a zero hours contract probably so independent contractor or consultant... :-)
<zmoylan-pi> it's a pain when your plans for cheap labour turn around and bite you...
<zmoylan-pi> and also worrying that such a low techie could access such data
<diddledan> and he stole 1.5 million documents (the number he has said they worked-out based on the knowledge that his bosses asked him to download 1.5 million documents for official use)
<zmoylan-pi> imagine if he had of had a second floppy disk... :-P
<diddledan> lmao
<zmoylan-pi> thank goodness the guy who unblocked the bogs didn't go rogue... with his keys he could have accessed way more data by the sound of it... :-P
<Azelphur> I'm starting to get tempted to build a headless Windows machine and use Steam in house streaming, anyone else doing/done this? :)
<diplo> Good start to the day, get called back to school for my youngest as he is projectile vomitted, get him home and he's fine... now playing and running around with my sisters dog... now have to look after him for 48 hours instead of school :/
<popey> awww
<diplo> If anything goes into his tomach that he hasn't digested or he coughs badly, he vommits :/ happens rarely, he's not ill.. just happens, but each time we need to keep him out for 48 hours
<diplo> yet if we want to take him out for a day on holiday out of school all hell breaks loose because he needs to catch up. I understand if he was ill, but docs agree with us, the school don't
<Seeker`> diplo: "Hi, <kid's> school? Yeah, he projectile vomited this morning, we'd better keep him at home for 48 hours". *go off on holiday for a day*
<diplo> Seeker`: The ex has used that already, I just don't get the arguement :)
<diplo> I've tried discussing it with the head, didn't get anywhere, she's steadfast because 'goverment says' and nothing else
<popey> Seeker`: I am outraged you'd suggest teaching a child such activites!
<diplo> :P
<zmoylan-pi> if they allow one little change to the rules written down and it goes wrong then it's all on them... they're not going to risk their job for that
<zmoylan-pi> all it would take is some other kids parents complaining that their little timmy got sick when your sprog was banished for 48 hours...
<zmoylan-pi> *wasn't
<Seeker`> Yarr, it be international talk like a pirate day
<diddledan> be that as it may
<foobarry> need some perl help again guys :S
<foobarry> how can i check if an array contains a matching name
<foobarry> e.g. if ingredient is not included in a list of allergic ingredients
<diddledan> foobarry: try something like if (exists $hash{$key}) {}
<diddledan> or if you mean value rather than name then it'll be different to that
<diddledan> that checks if the key exists in the hash
<foobarry> exists argument is not a HASH or ARRAY element or a subroutine
<diddledan> if you want a value existance try if ("value" ~~ @array) {}
<diddledan> you can use that last one for the first case too, @keys = keys @array; if ("somekey" ~~ @array) {}
<foobarry> amazing
<foobarry> thanks
<foobarry>  ("value" ~~ @array) {}
<foobarry> worked
<diddledan> err, keys @array should be keys %hash
<diddledan> google foo ftw  :-p
<diddledan> you can combine the last thing I wrote above to : if ("somekey" ~~ keys %hash) {}
<diddledan> the multitude of sigils in perl confuse me
<foobarry> perl is like someone else's handwriting
<foobarry> i hate fixing it
<diddledan> $scalar, %hash, $hash{$key} (scalar value of the element in the hash associated with key), @array, $array[5] (scalar value of the 5th element of @array)....
<diddledan> I think it could be described as too powerful
<Seeker`> Perl is great, as long as you never want to read it
<diddledan> the problem is no matter how good you are at coding, you'll forget something you wrote and you'll therefore have to read it to figure out what it does. and as above that means perl is no-longer great
<foobarry> thanks diddledan
<Azelphur> Ah, the fun of ebay best offer. I see a machine up for local collection at Â£800 with "Reasonable offers will be accepted" offer him Â£250, he tells me if I can build him something like it for Â£250 he'll buy it off me, so I find all the parts on eBay and drop him a PC Part Picker link to a better build for Â£287.50 :D
<Azelphur> It's one hell of a bizarre build too, old AMD AM3 with 8GB RAM, RX 290...and an AX1200i :S
<ali1234> but its AMD
<ali1234> lets see the part picker link?
<ali1234> if you want a rubbish old AMD AM3 system i have one i could sell you
<diddledan> AM3+ is the current socket, isn't it?
<ali1234> AM3+ isn't the same as AM3
<ali1234> i think AM3+ is the newest one, but its also really old
<ali1234> they released it shortly after i got an AM3 system... which would have been about 2008
<Azelphur> ali1234: http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/ZqN34C
<Azelphur> ali1234: I'm mostly just stalking for really good deals, I wouldn't mind something with a decent CPU/Board/RAM/Case to drop a GPU into and use as a headless windows steam server
<foobarry> Azelphur: do you care about power usage?
<foobarry> pick up an R710 for peanuts from companies throwing out 3yr old kit
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
<benxyzzy> I just installed flash from the adobe website APT here: https://get.adobe.com/flashplayer/ . How do I reverse this? The install didn't solve the problem and I want to go back to how I was before. Apparently I already had flash-installer installed
<benxyzzy> *flashplugin-installer
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy,  yeah shoudn't need to get directly from adobe
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy,  but I think that would just put it in a flash folder in home
<SebthreeBQM10HD> yes ther's sudo restriced extras that gives you there one
<SebthreeBQM10HD> pluss theres pepper flash as wel
<benxyzzy> It was an APT link that opened in Ubuntu Software (I think). I had to enter my sudo password to let it do it
<benxyzzy> APT asked to add another software source, which I guess was adobe's
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy,  i don't know i just joined here, so an apt link from where?
<benxyzzy> The dropdown in https://get.adobe.com/flashplayer/
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy,  sudo apt-get install ubuntu-restricted-extras should give you flash, mp3 avi etc
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy, if you have issues with teh default adobe flash, there's also pepper flash thingey as an alternative
<SebthreeBQM10HD> that wil use chromes flash, but in firefox
<benxyzzy> At this point I just want to undo what I may have already done - I started with flashplugin-installer installed, and (probably) installed flash from adobe using their software source. Maybe I should look at the apt history
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy, I think it puts it into a hidden folder in home
<SebthreeBQM10HD> if you install directly from adobe
<SebthreeBQM10HD> so finding and deleting that would revert it I guess
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy, or it puts in a system folder hmm
<Azelphur> foobarry: interesting, could I put a GPU in that? why does it use so much power?
<benxyzzy> it opened some link in apt, which asked to add another software source. So I didn't install from tarball or anything - it should have gone from their repos via apt
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy, yeah it woud downad from adobe etc
<SebthreeBQM10HD> a tar.gaz or bin or something
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and install
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy, same with the restricted extras command really
<SebthreeBQM10HD> whats wrong with flash anyway ?
<benxyzzy> The last version of linux flash from adobe is very old - deprecated. It says so on the download link itself. I only installed it to try and get 4od working
<foobarry> Azelphur: heh there was a thread on reddit today
<foobarry> https://www.reddit.com/r/homelab/comments/5312cq/i_put_a_dedicated_gpu_in_my_r710_and_it_works/
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy, indeed it's old, but
<foobarry> or just buy/make a cable rather than hard wiring it!
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy,  I read a nice article on omgubuntu like last week or something, how adobe will support flash on linux again
<foobarry> rack mount servers seem to draw power for fans and are noisy
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy, although not with major new features it seems, but security stability updates etc sure
<Azelphur> foobarry: noise would be a concern
<foobarry> yeah, best to run in a cold garage
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy, thre's pepper flash or whatever it's called as an alternative to  that adobe flash
<foobarry> worth keeping an eye out if you have mates getting rid of company kit
<Azelphur> foobarry: except that I don't have a garage
<foobarry> they are great servers
<Azelphur> I have an underground car parking space, 100 meters away...underground? :(
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy, chrome has a built in flash, so it's really that, but that can now work with FIrefox etc so
<Azelphur> and I live in a 2 bed apartment
<SebthreeBQM10HD> benxyzzy, and that should work beter than the old adboe flash now even
<SebthreeBQM10HD> !flash
<lubotu3`> To install Flash see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedFormats/Flash - See also  !Restricted and !Gnash
<SebthreeBQM10HD> !pepperflash
<shedu> !Pondering Jamie Maslin - Iranian Rappers and Persian Porn- A Hitchhiker's Adventures in the New Iran (epub).rar
<lubotu3`> shedu: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<shedu> !Pondering Jamie Maslin - Iranian Rappers and Persian Porn- A Hitchhiker's Adventures in the New Iran (epub).rar
<lubotu3`> shedu: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<zmoylan-pi> someone was in the wrong channel...
<SebthreeBQM10HD> grr netsplit
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-20
<daftykins> \o
<daftykins> i'm in Houston, Texas... it was 34 deg C before
<daftykins> i got out of the car and my specs steamed up - i mean wat
<mapps> 34c
<mapps> wow
<mapps> sick
<daftykins> that's night time too
<daftykins> day time was 'feels like 45c'
<mapps> wows]
<mapps> dont think ive ever experienced that hot
<daftykins> i'd rather not XD
<knightwi1e> morning
<davmor2> Morning all
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<davmor2> brobostigon: morning dude
<brobostigon> morning davmor2
<JamesTait> Good morning all!  Happy Tuesday, and happy IT Professionals' Day! ð
<diddledan> JamesTait: good day for everyone in here :-p
<JamesTait> Indeed, diddledan. âº  I don't always choose randomly. ð
<diddledan> \o/
<davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtWTUt2RZh0
<arsen_> It's IT Professionals day? :o
 * arsen_ starts acting professional
<popey> foobarry: you used modaco.. i just got notification from https://haveibeenpwned.com/
<popey> that they have been hacked
<foobarry> oh thanks
<foobarry> turns on notifications on the pwned site
<popey> wise
<diddledan> I've just done that, too
<zmoylan-pi> shouldn't the internet have a reverse betteridge law for urls? :-)
<foobarry> think i changed my password in february by coincidence
<diddledan> https://github.com/bartobri/no-more-secrets
<diddledan> that is totes amazeballs
<zmoylan-pi> there were a few dos based viruses that did similar effects iirc
<diddledan> lol
<zmoylan-pi> it was a simpler time...
<diddledan> how many screensavers were made of the matrix effect?!
<diddledan> (I used to have one!)
<zmoylan-pi> they're kinda the equivalent of text editors, everyone has a project to do one...
<zmoylan-pi> then you just go feck it and choose vim...
<diddledan> that's a big backlash from making your own
<sebsebseb> hey look no other name
<sebsebseb> ,but wh'y's that??
<popey> wat?
<DJones> sebsebseb: Can you ask your question in English, Doesn't make any sense
<sebsebseb> DJones: it should to some here :)
<sebsebseb> why don't I have my other name ?
<DJones> sebsebseb: Check your client
<sebsebseb> DJones: no that's not the right answer :d
<sebsebseb> I know exactly why
<DJones> And no, your question didn't make any sense at all
<sebsebseb> DJones: probably since you haven't seen me or enough with the other name, a uhm m tablet name
<DJones> "sebErm, yes I have
<DJones> sebsebseb: Yes I have
<sebsebseb> why am I not using that name, that's my question
<sebsebseb> and no it's not since certain people here apparntly loved it h eh
<DJones> You probably need to ask in #freenode as #ubuntu-uk has no control over your nick, its either a freenode issue or a user issue
<sebsebseb> DJones: no it's not that
<sebsebseb> DJones: quite simpally since not using the tablet that's the answer :d
<sebsebseb> certain people uhmm  weren't so keen on the tablet name
<sebsebseb> using a lap top right now so not that name
<sebsebseb> just my old boring name for lap tops
<popey> sebsebseb: updated your tablet to OTA-13?
<sebsebseb> popey: not just yet,  but will later :)
<sebsebseb> being able to copy and paste between  native apps and libertine will be useful at times :)
<popey> yeah
<popey> so I'll bite, why aren't you sebsebsebbqm10tabletlongname?
<sebsebseb> popey:  since as menioned above :d,  it was to do with accounts really. and passwords, why I  had a name like that as well, differnet device diffenrt name, what's my uhmm password for htis account uhmm....  and a bit of fun as well.  why not have a differnet name on the tablet or for now ?
<sebsebseb> but using lap top right now
<sebsebseb> so on the standard old name
<popey> :)
<sebsebseb> popey: I remember a guy who used to have three similar names in IRC, to do with the distro, but then it started looking like he had names on old releases to, since how those names were done, but no it was actsaully each computer with Mageia
<popey> probbaly idleone, he registered loads of nicks of release names
<DJones> sebsebseb: No worries, I understand your first comments now, apologies for the  misunderstanding
<sebsebseb> popey: no one of the former Mageia contributers, ( who sadly has died as well)  it was a Magiea channel as well.
<sebsebseb> DJones: it's ok, no problem :)
<DJones> sebsebseb: I misunderstood, so just wanted to apologise
<popey> yeah, it's getting to the point where we're all getting older, and some of the people we worked with are dying off
<DJones> What are we going to do when Linus passes away ?
<sebsebseb> popey: yeah he got ill etc lung cancer,  shame, since he had such plans etc as well
<sebsebseb> get to come across some awesome people of various types in open source really :)
<sebsebseb> DJones: or even Richard Stallman? but wow 60 and still travlling the world, doing his two hour long talks
<DJones> sebsebseb: 60's nothing, I'd just class that as middle age now
<sebsebseb> DJones: some people die before 60 as well hmm :(
<DJones> sebsebseb: I think age bands have jumped about 20 years though, my parents about to hit 80 and heading to Australia
<sebsebseb> yes for some reason we livev longer now in general
<sebsebseb> well in developed counteries
<popey> yeah, my nan hit 100 this year
<sebsebseb> even though the world generally is much more polluted now hmm
<DJones> Quite true
<sebsebseb> but that guy was only 50's which is ashame
<davmor2> popey: did you request the telemessage from the Queen?
<popey> we got one
<popey> and one from Ian & Duncan Smith
<sebsebseb>  was going to maybe meet him once, but didn't happen
<popey> which she scoffed at
<sebsebseb> anyway
<davmor2> popey: hahaha
<sebsebseb> davmor2: popey uh what's this
<davmor2> popey: but liked the one from the Queen right :)
<popey> yeah
<popey> sebsebseb: when you are 100 you get a letter from the queen and a letter from the home secretary
<sebsebseb> oh
<sebsebseb> oh didn't know that
<sebsebseb> popey: so what's in the loco pack? apparnatly getting one of those for the event :)
<sebsebseb> that's good
<sebsebseb> popey: I mean like how much of things...
<popey> not sure, I think it's listed on the wiki
<sebsebseb> popey: yeah probably on a page I was on before, anyway should be good, thanks to the community team for accepting :)
<sebsebseb> popey: apparantly there's an issue with usb sticks though, but can make own
<popey> np
<sebsebseb> popey: I  know with Ubuntu touch you don't say to the public to just go and buy it etc,  but do you think showing convergence for example, could be interesting.  or using it even to say  project  some open movies onto the projecter
<popey> Demoing convergence is a neat thing to do, especially if you can show convergent apps across multiple platforms.
<sebsebseb> popey: multiple platfors as in ? with android as well or what do you mean?
<sebsebseb> the idea is to show Linux in a few or so forms, plus have some creative commons thing in the event ot make it more interesting to people
<sebsebseb> popey: I think the event needs spreading on Facebook better than it has been so far,  it's mentioned in certian other places as well though,  and the venue itself will have people coming there all day anyway, but hmm
<ali1234> are there any really good converged apps yet? by which i mean apps where the desktop and phone interfaces look completely different, not just all three pages of the phone UI shown side by side
<ali1234> also, any real converged productivity apps?
<zmoylan-pi> i've been using mobile since 94 when i got my first psion... then i just wanted some simple apps like text editor, spreadsheet and flat file database to have mobile data.  it's now 2016 and i'm seriously thinking i should just spring for an ancient psion as it did mobile so well and nothing new seems to match it's flexability
<knightwi1e> how do you mean flexibility
<zmoylan-pi> i could usually put any data i wanted in a presentable readable form that could be worked on desktop or mobile in those 3 apps.  when i started using the psion language opl to automate stuff as well
<diddledan> https://9to5mac.com/2016/09/20/apple-3-5mm-to-lighting-adapter-teardown/
<foobarry> sigh another evening on xdadevelopers
<foobarry> putting nougat on my touchpad
<foobarry> deciphering forum posts
<awilkins> Which version of Debian does Xenial correspond to roughly?
<awilkins> Aha, stretch
<awilkins> Ta
<diddledan> awilkins: glad I helped
<Safiyyah> i need help setting up my scanner there is something wrong. Please note that is worked before on xubuntu14.04 and has now refused to work on 16.04, the printer i working (its a brother all in one)
<safiyyah_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/23208703/
<Safiyyah> the command sane-find-scanner returns an error please see above link
<daftykins> yay at Natwest adding Android Pay support - and by extension, Guernsey Natwest too \o/
<zmoylan-pi> now those criminal gangs can move away from cloning devices on atms and target wireless payment systems in peoples pockets...
<daftykins> \o/
<daftykins> it's all good, they have off buttons ;D
<daftykins> http://imgur.com/a/t3V0f
<daftykins> couple of snaps from my travels
<daftykins> got to see the baseball team i follow play at home \o/
<zmoylan-pi> and the new antennae gate will be that you have to hold the phone a certain way to block the signal... wearing your plate armour full faraday cage gauntlets of course...
<daftykins> nah just turning NFC off - plus it can't be used if you don't wake your device / unlock it with some transactions apparently
<zmoylan-pi> i see rfid blocking wallets for sale everywhere these days
<daftykins> oh i'm sure you can ebay tinfoil hats too :)
<zmoylan-pi> lead foil... till i can source a depleted uranium foil variant... :-P
<daftykins> i jest, i do refuse contactless cards from my bank - at least it doesn't have the logo but someone said it might still work anyway
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-21
<ali1234> you can find out pretty easily by installing any of the free android NFC/RFID readers
<ali1234> they won't read anything interesting from the card but they will react to it
<zmoylan-pi> some of the oyster cards are broken and can be manipulated
<zmoylan-pi> last i read
<ali1234> NFC is just an extension of the smartcard idea. they are all different inside
<ali1234> it's just a serial interface to a microcontroller basically
<zmoylan-pi> and as more systems move to this shiny new technology the criminals will find it worth their while to see if they can prise money out of it for themselves
<ali1234> yes, but jokes on them because i dont have any money
<daftykins> not really sure there's any value to saying that when that's been how the world works forever ;)
<zmoylan-pi> yes but bad banks will let them put you in debt as they take from an overdraft they arrange and you'll be reponsible for it till you can prove it wasn't you
<daftykins> i know about that, had to argue with some friends who work for a bank, they were all acting like Barclays would be angelic and admit their fault immediately if their contactless tech got compromised, it was quite sad really
<zmoylan-pi> now imagine you're a non technical person who has to be first person to try and deal with that...
<daftykins> they wouldn't be using it
<zmoylan-pi> chilly tonight...
<daftykins> still in the 30s celsius here in Houston :<
<daftykins> back later!
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<JamesTait> Good morning all!  Happy Wednesday, and happy International Day of Peace! ð  â®
<zmoylan-pi> hmmmm peas....
<popey> Give peas a chance!
<popey> my kids had a plate years ago with that on
<popey> they both still hate them
<zmoylan-pi> teaching toddlers irony before they can read... how... british... :-P
<foobarry> if you had a message to write on a motorway bridge, what would it be?
<zmoylan-pi> good morning lemmings! :-) an oldie but a goldie
<foobarry> https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/53ri0m/warning_microsoft_signature_pc_program_now/
<zmoylan-pi> no linux for you evil hackers
<foobarry> lenovo blocking linux installs on recent ultrabooks
<popey> yeah :(
<zmoylan-pi> it's like lenovo want to get out of the pc market
<foobarry> loads of their servers are arriving broken
<foobarry> i mean bad mobo, bad ram, bad other bits
<foobarry> and their other bits reguarlly hose the machine when firmware is updated
<foobarry> utter crap
<zmoylan-pi> you just can't get the slave labour anymore...
<foobarry> never had this with dell
<foobarry> still our company spend millinos with them
<davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmtYs_k8WOE think this covers it
<foobarry> In March 2012, the music website Last.fm was hacked and 43 million user accounts were exposed. Whilst Last.fm knew of an incident back in 2012, the scale of the hack was not known until the data was released publicly in September 2016. The breach included 37 million unique email addresses, usernames and passwords stored as unsalted MD5 hashes.
<foobarry> doh
<zmoylan-pi> so people who were using those passwords on other services can now sue?
<popey> foobarry: you got that mail too huh? :)
<foobarry> didn't realise i had lastfm
<foobarry> my wife got an email from myspace because somebody signed up with her email address by mistake
<zmoylan-pi> i think the admins in myspace are just lonely... :-P
<diddledan> apparently: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2016/09/cant-install-linux-microsoft-signature-edition-laptop
<diddledan> wat: http://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2016/9/20/12986234/biggest-sd-card-1-terabyte-sandisk
<davmor2> diddledan: when you getting one of them?
<diddledan> when I've managed to sell my soul
<diddledan> it seems my soul doesn't have a very good price
<diddledan> the market is slow I guess
<davmor2> diddledan: you might need to include your family and friends ;)
<Azelphur> I felt the need to record this momentus achievement by my ISP: https://n.Ç£.cc/s/8yG8Inu2bnNvaGg
<diddledan> haha
<diddledan> that's awesome
<Azelphur> diddledan: also was it you who said I seem to have bad luck with 2nd hand goods?
<diddledan> possibly
<diddledan> I bemoan daftykins touch on hard disks too
<diddledan> I swear daftykins is a curse
<davmor2> damn it why didn't I know about this earlier http://www.svr.co.uk/NewsItem.aspx?a=722
<Azelphur> diddledan: meet my new Â£80 sound system, complete with builtin mouse nest: https://n.Ç¢.cc/s/Ln0aACS6RBbWYFE
<diddledan> oh wow
<davmor2> Azelphur: well you need to be able to put your mouse somewhere
<Azelphur> Indeed
<davmor2> Azelphur: I don't know they go out of their way to help you and all you do is complain ;)
<Azelphur> lmao
<popey> "new" Â£80 sounds system
<Azelphur> indeed
<Azelphur> popey: good condition, tested working!
<diddledan> squeeks occasionally
<diddledan> google are announcing new hardware on the 4th: http://venturebeat.com/2016/09/19/google-teases-october-4-smartphone-event/
<crogers> Hey everyone.
<crogers> Was trying to show how cool Ubuntu is, and like all operating systems, it seems to fail everytime you try to show it off. :)
<crogers> In this case, the sticking point was the search in Nautillus.
<crogers> FIle name search works just fine, but any other criterea... well it's gone... completely absent.
<crogers> anyone else notice that?
<popey> no. never use nautilus for searching
<crogers> And what gives? I could have sworn it used to work.
<foobarry> i use synapse for searching
<diddledan> I don't search
<popey> i use the dash usually
<diddledan> although I kinda miss the google desktop search service which would tie-in your local system with the google website search
<crogers> I need the file browser to do it. In my case, I process a lot of product photos in GIMP, and other image eding software.
<crogers> *editing
<davmor2> I use locate/dash/find
<crogers> so being able to search for file-name+ date is essential, and having all results selectable to drag into the editor is something that saves a lot of time.
<popey> sounds useful
<crogers> Yes, except it doesn't work. :)
<crogers> File name search works fine.
<crogers> But everything else is broken.
<crogers> Possibly I should complain to the nautillus people. :)
<popey> perhaps :)
<crogers> Cool.
<crogers> I tried synapse, but had to install an indexer for it to discover all the files I need.
<foobarry> hmm
<diddledan> I prefer just moaning to my friends rather than anyone who can change anything. it makes me sound clever to my peers when in fact I'm a moron (and no this isn't directed at you, it really is what I like doing)
<crogers> And I tend to gravitate away from programs that have a lot of obscure things you have to do to make them work properly.
<foobarry> it uses zeitgeist daemon i presuime
<diddledan> I'm British, therefore I make a pasttime of moaning
<crogers> I only complain for two reasons:
<crogers> To see if it's affecting others, and collect information on the problem
<foobarry> 3) it makes you fell better
<foobarry> feel*
<foobarry> s/you/one
<crogers> Meh, not really.
<crogers> Well, not me.
<diddledan> the royal "one" as-in the royal "pee"
<diddledan> err, wee
<crogers> lol
<crogers> Gnome-do seems to have the same issue, where you need a seperate program to tell it where to index.
<crogers> But anyway, this is basic functionality for a file browser.
<crogers> It *should* be included in nautillus.
<foobarry> why?
<davmor2> midnight commander
<crogers> And it looks like there's a little... wiggly stub where someone was planning to grow it.
<foobarry> i use synapse, locate and the find command
<crogers> foobarry, "why"? Why should a file browser be able to search for files based on date? I don't really think that needs an answer. ;)
<crogers> That there are other solutions isn't really the point.
<crogers> THough I appreciate the suggestions as potential work-arounds.
<foobarry> have you ever run the find command?
<foobarry> it takes a long time
<crogers> Every other file browser for Linux is capable of adding date search criteria.
<crogers> And the default in Ubuntu isn't...
<crogers> foobarry, from what I just said I was doing does that seem like a good solution?
<foobarry> pantheon-files doesn't do it
<crogers> Thunar does.
<foobarry> thunar also does renaming en masse
<foobarry> its good like it
<foobarry> but its not every file manager
<crogers> Fine *most* of them do.
<davmor2> foobarry: find find stuff though :P
<crogers> Okay, this should be considered a patch for nautilus: http://elementaryos.stackexchange.com/questions/101/graphical-interfaces-to-search-for-files
<davmor2> foobarry: thats why I like locate :)
<crogers> For Ubuntu
<crogers> Until Nautilus decides to grow a proper search function, it should hand it off to gnome-search-tool
<davmor2> crogers: there is a nice search tool in the new nautilus in 16.10 that does most of the searches you would need
<davmor2> crogers: it may even be in the older version you add a search term but can then filter on date and file types with the drop down arrow
<crogers> davmor2, hmm, is there a developer repo where I can get it?
<crogers> can't seem to find it, my google-fo isn't yielding anything useful.
<davmor2> no idea
<crogers> Seems like something they should have updated for 16.04
<diddledan> davmor2: you spelt chocolate wrong. locate sounds weird
<crogers> too
<davmor2> crogers: no they shouldn't of, the version that would of been supported for 16.04 was ugly so it was reverted to stop it breaking stuff
<crogers> Hehehe
<crogers> They really changed that much?
<crogers> LTS isn't what it used to be. :)
<davmor2> crogers: it is a steady process some of the new features weren't fully implemented in the 16.04 version so it would randomly break on you every now and then, we don't control the gnome project their lts don't marry up with our releases
<crogers> Gotcha
<crogers> Well both of you do excelelnt work.
<crogers> *excellent
<davmor2> crogers: hence removing the new nautilus and adding the older more functional one :)
<crogers> I always forget it can be worse. :)
<crogers> I'll go complain at the gnome people then. ;P
<crogers> Or is it not even worth it?
<diddledan> "at" :-p
<crogers> Is the only answer to upgrade at this point?
<diddledan> in related news, yakkety is frozen now
<crogers> Well, everyone complains "at" to begin with.
<crogers> You generally need to get to know people in the various projcts in order to successfully complain to. :)
<davmor2> crogers: 16.10 is currently using nautilus 3.20.3 which from here you can see https://wiki.gnome.org/Apps/Nautilus/Roadmap Search UI
<crogers> Thanks davmor2
<crogers> It's good to have a reason to upgrade.
<crogers> that's a pretty compelling one, in my case.
<diddledan> haha: https://twitter.com/bdsams/status/778593440997179392
<diddledan> (Allo launched today apparently)
<diddledan> I still can't get it - it still says I'm "registered"
<diddledan> follow-up to the lenovo raided laptops not working with loonicks link I posted earlier: http://www.techrepublic.com/article/lenovo-denies-deliberately-blocking-linux-on-windows-10-pcs/
<directhex> diddledan: i haven't had any follow-up internally yet.
<directhex> diddledan: but i hate that a) people are incapable of applying hanlon's razor when their preconceptions are involved, and b) people take what random support grunts say as gospel, as if they weren't just making shit up 24/7
<diddledan> I always attribute to incompetence :-p
<diddledan> is this going to ruin the movies much? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taken_(2016_TV_series)
<davmor2> diddledan: nah they did that themselves 1 was good 2 was okay 3 was meh 4 would be bad and so on ;)
<diddledan> plan9 on windas:https://twitter.com/notlaforge/status/778633972368584704
<Triumphpedroe> pedroe
<foobarry> all ready to go nougat and androidfilehost with the files i need is offline :(
<popey> foobarry: on hudl!? :)
<foobarry> hp touchpad \o/
<foobarry> the old tank
<foobarry> watching 'halt and catch fire'
<foobarry> series1
<ahotenus> hi can i ask a question pls
<zmoylan-pi> ask away. if someone is about they may have time to answer
<ahotenus> okay so this is problem
<ahotenus> my son does not help me with computer anymore, he is says i am old enough to learn how to use computer
<ahotenus> and he install the x chat and says, use the x chat if your computer is problem
<ahotenus> and now i am have problem
<popey> O_O
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-22
<m0nkey_> I just upgraded to macOS Sierra on my MBA, just asked Siri what it's favourite animal is, it replied "Domo-Kun! Domo-Kun! Domo-Kun!"
<mapps> hi
<sebsebseb> hi
<sebsebseb> hi
<diplo> Morning all
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<denny> n
<diddledan> m00
<davmor2> diddledan: oh you so funny
<diddledan> "you so funny, you blow my mind"
<davmor2> hey mickey, hey mickey
<diddledan> cake
<diddledan> I can has cake
<diddledan> who gonna get the new shiny on octember 4th from teh googs?
<diddledan> (no doubt they'll have a delay between announcement and ship, though :-()
<davmor2> diddledan: I don't care
<diddledan> davmor2: fair enough. I can understand that.
<davmor2> diddledan: oh not for the fact it's google just cause I'm happy with my hudl2 it does what I need it to, and if I had a google phone it would be whatever one my contract enabled me to have.  Hence not caring :)
<diddledan> shame tesco got-out-of the market
<diddledan> this is all well and good, except that it gives your phone a growth: https://igg.me/at/asapxconnect/x/4039834
<zmoylan-pi> better a funny growth than a burning sensation? :-P
<diddledan> it's also encouraging promiscuity between android and ios
<zmoylan-pi> better than those dumphone oddballs... :-P
<diddledan> I wonder if it's compatible with the new iPhone's lack of headphone hole?
<zmoylan-pi> sitting in the corner wantonly using their phone while the smartphone users have to charge it 2-3 times... :-)
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: we don't talk about morons
<zmoylan-pi> says it uses lightning on apple
<diddledan> yah, but if you've got that insertion in your hole how do you connect your headphones?!
<zmoylan-pi> you just won't be able to listen to music AND charge your device unless you use wireless headphones or extra charging/audio cable dongle
<diddledan> I kinda think it's solving a non-problem
<diddledan> and making new problems in the process
<zmoylan-pi> besides if your an iphone user you don't care about others and inflict your terrible taste in music on those around you by sodcasting
<diddledan> sodcasting, eh?
<zmoylan-pi> http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Sodcasting
<diddledan> yoohoo! http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-37447016
<zmoylan-pi> at least their brandname is back in the headlines...
<zmoylan-pi> when's the last time that happened?
<diddledan> 1998?
<zmoylan-pi> bit of a blip earlier this year when they were sold but it was more of a 'wow, they're still going?' blip
<diddledan> daftykins: mr robot season 2 is finished - go binge
<Azelphur> Anyone have any opinions on this build? http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/VwfHWX steam / kodi machine :)
<ali1234> you dont need a 500W power supply for that
<Azelphur> ali1234: TDP is 327W, puts it right in the middle of a 500W PSU so optimal power consumption, that is also the cheapest >327W Gold SFX supply I could find
<Azelphur> Gold SFX supplies are hard to find :<
<diddledan> wat https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2016/09/european-copyright-ruling-ushers-new-dark-era-hyperlinks
<zmoylan-pi> it's easy the only copies allowed henceforth will be if you deliver document to monastry to knock out a copy on vellum in 20 or so years...
<zmoylan-pi> fingers crossed google just drops the companies who want this from their search results like they did before until they scream to be reincluded
<ali1234> so basically if you have a blog with adverts and you link to torrents of copyright material you can now be held liable for that? boo hoo
<zmoylan-pi> is a magnetlink a link
<diddledan> err. no. if you link to an article on one website that happens to be a plagiarised article then you are held liable for not knowing that it was a copy
<diddledan> there's an example put forth: "For example, a post calling out a plagiarized news article might link to the original article and to the plagiarized one, so that readers can compare and judge for themselves. According to this judgment, the author of that post could themselves be liable for copyright infringement for linking to the plagiarized article"
<ali1234> except no
<ali1234> because they could clearly quote sections of both articles and it would be considered fair use
<zmoylan-pi> but you might include a link to sources
<ali1234> yes
<diddledan> nope. not allowed to quote now by the rules also by the European Commission
<ali1234> these blog posts always do this thing where they say "this judgement means ..." and then give a hypothetical example
<ali1234> that isn't how the law works
<diddledan> any hyperlink that includes or is next-to text from the target without permission from that target is illegal
 * zmoylan-pi pokes irc server with a stick...
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-23
<diplo> Morning all
<davmor2> Morning all
<awilkins> popey, that "Box" thing... spectacularly dumb question, possibly. But how do you get the network cable in?
<popey> awilkins: no clue, will tell you once it arrives :)
<awilkins> Â£60 isn't bad for the bundle though
<awilkins> Looking at the photo with it's top off there's room by the power cable to feed in a cable I think
<awilkins> The next-gen 1TB My Passport drive (this is based on the previous generation... probably a good way to clear old stock...) is Â£57 at my local computronic retailer.
<awilkins> So Â£60 for the drive in a niche case, power adapter, and microSD card is pretty good.
<popey> yeah, that's what got me interested
<popey> I have a spare pi I can chuck into it, and having played with nextcloud, I know that's something i want on it
<awilkins> Shame they're not going to sell the case driveless :-)
<popey> it looks 3d-printable
<awilkins> Yeah, it ought to be...
<popey> I mean, someone could make a derivative design
<popey> it's only two parts
<popey> with a couple of magnets and screw threads
<foobarry> epic day yesterday. got to visit force india f1 team HQ at silverstone
<popey> I'd be happy to measure mine so someone could design it
<popey> wow
<popey> bet that was fun
<foobarry> behind the scenes tour of workshops and simulator etc
<foobarry> childhood dream realised
<popey> my father in law would love that
<popey> he's well into F1
<popey> how did you arrange that?
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<JamesTait> Good morning all!  Happy Friday, and happy Hug A Vegetarian Day! ð
<zmoylan-pi> and use the opportunity to slip some beef jerky in their pocket? :-P
<foobarry> popey: we are a customer of Univa who make the HPC scheduler software. they sponsor force india and have a sepcial partnership with them. so a kind of exclusive perk really
<foobarry> got hands on with a car and played with steering wheel etc
<davmor2> JamesTait: I love vegetarians they make the best meat, beef, lamb, chicken, turkey. I'd say pork and goat too but they are both omnivores
<davmor2> :D
<davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Mvs5lWx2uQ
<popey> foobarry: buttons galore?
<foobarry> even have a mario kart mushroom button
<foobarry> to overtake
<foobarry> steering wheel costs Â£40k alone. looked quite low tech in a way as it is designed but tactile and visual clarity , not brushed aluminim and tiny leds
<popey> it's amazing how much money they get to spend on making super fast toys
<foobarry> the simulator was like imax cinema
<foobarry> wasn't turned on though
<davmor2> popey: and just think what they do with that tech, they go and put it in lorries and then eventually it trickles down to cars
<Laney> arse
<Laney> missed my appointment to donate blood
<foobarry> leave it in a jar outside?
<Laney> i'll just go to QMC and do a direct person to person donation
<popey> I used to love giving blood. Free biscuits and tea!
<Laney> they have those tuc cheese biscuits
<Laney> yuuuuuuummmmmmmmmmmmyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
<davmor2> Laney: you know you can buy them they have them in stores and everything ;)
 * zmoylan-pi wonders if the amount of blood donated in ireland dropped when they stopped offering a pint of guinness
<foobarry> maybe yes but the quality have have improved
<zmoylan-pi> i dunno, problably blood offered now has less iron...
<zmoylan-pi> easier to ship when you can pick it up with a magnet :-)
<awilkins> The dark colour in Guinness isn't iron afaik
<awilkins> It's burned malt
<foobarry> marmite
<awilkins> All beer has traces of Marmite
<foobarry> first venture into sainsburys since the meal deal fiasco ends in the most disappointing lunch in ages
<foobarry> they changed supplier. afwul tasteless munge
<foobarry> nougat is bootlooping on my touchpad :(
<diddledan> gotta love a good nuggit
<foobarry> ah this could be the low battery problem
<foobarry> bootloops on low batt
<foobarry> nobody in the office has a real charger
<foobarry> :(
<awilkins> Bah, Steam on Linux listed 2 VR apps as working
<awilkins> Plugged in Vive. Steam asks me if I want to install VR. Get all excited. Doesn't work.
<diddledan> grr
<awilkins> IKEv1 VPN on Ubuntu - *arrrrrrrrrrrrgggggggghhhhhh*
<awilkins> Ubuntu deprecates OpenSwan and moves to StrongSwan. Hooray. More security, better VPN client. ONLY... i) their NetworkManager GUI has been broken on Xenial for 5 months
<awilkins> ii) It doesn't support IKEv1 *on purpose* even though the daemon supports it, because "IKEv1 isn't very secure" or words to that effect.
<awilkins> I applaud the attention to detail in improving security
<awilkins> I lament the impossibility of connecting to my work VPN without writing a huge config file and disabling or fighting with NetworkManager.
<awilkins> (or option 3 - use ike-qtgui / ShrewSoft VPN Client which is at least easy to set up, even if it fights with NetworkManager if you let it)
<piotrbujakowski> Hi.
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<diddledan> https://youtu.be/TsE-Dqok5mY <-- my dad looks far too much like Kenny Everett
<zmoylan-pi>  /me is afraid to click on the link in case it's a cupid stunt...
<diddledan> I don't know what a cupid stunt is so I guess it's not one of those
<zmoylan-pi> don't worry it's all in the best possible taste... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O881zyKgBBw
<diddledan> :-)
<zmoylan-pi> and if not... we can round them all up, put them in a field, and bomb the... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xGMWZJlA0QA
<foobarry> finally nougat running!
<foobarry> and...its pretty much same old android
<zmoylan-pi> then why upgrade?
<foobarry> i had an old tablet needing a refresh
<foobarry> speed is quite good
<foobarry> but no discernable features
<diddledan> foobarry: you can split screen multiple apps - in portrait mode one app above the other and in landscape mode side-by-side
<diddledan> foobarry: to do that you hold-down the square icon on the right of the home button
<diddledan> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/4l51HGG1/Screenshot_20160923-215702.png
<diddledan> like that
<zmoylan-pi> well... this is why i have at least 2 devices on me at all times... :-)
<zmoylan-pi> so i could be accessing data on one device while working on a document on the other...
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-24
<mapps> hi
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls
<foobarry> chromium no longer supported for chromecasting :\
<noob> hi noob here
<bittin> hi
<noob> hey can you recommend any channel for noobs?
<bittin> #ubuntu
<noob> how do i join it ? i mean command
<bittin>  /join
<bittin> without the space
<bittin>  /join #ubuntu
<noob> thanks
<bittin> np
<noob>  hey, it not working
<noob> its not working
<m0nkey_> netsplit?
<penguin42> possibly
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-25
<kram_> red dwarf back?!?!
<directhex> kram_: on Dave. so YMMV as to quality
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<directhex> is it?
 * brobostigon points at the clock on his computr, 08:42am.
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
<SebthreeBQM10HD> ikonia, ping
<ikonia> yes ?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> ikonia, pm?
<ikonia> ok
<ikonia> if it's needed
<SebthreeBQM10HD> well sort of
<SebthreeBQM10HD> ikonia, actually pm me since on tablet it's not as easy
<ikonia> ok,
<SuperEngineer> ....& so they pm'd and lived happily efter after [until the pm ended and the am started]
<popey> bow chicka wow wow
<zmoylan-pi> and there was much reconnecting...
<SebthreeBQM10HD> SuperEngineer, yes we pm'd untill it was over,  it just finnished
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey, why haven't I got an actsual email by the way yet from Canonical to do with the pack ?
<SuperEngineer> SebthreeBQM10HD: what? you didn't recieve the secret address posted here while you were away?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> SuperEngineer, uhmm a secret address for what?
<SuperEngineer> well, if you persist in doing "it" until "it" was over...
<SuperEngineer> a secret address for your email
<SebthreeBQM10HD> SuperEngineer, you were the one commenting about us pm 'ing h e h
<SuperEngineer> ;-)
<SebthreeBQM10HD> SuperEngineer, as for a secret address,  I don't remember putting one into the form for  event freebies, so Canonical will need my secret address then :D
<popey> SebthreeBQM10HD: dunno, will ask tomorrow when I am at work
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey, right ok good :)
<diddledan> something is wonky with my ubuntu install. shortly after bootup it loses it's ipv4 address but retains ipv6. Telling network manager to reconnect the interface regains the ipv4 and the network connection then stays up until I reboot
<diddledan> lol, Microsoft have a cute penguin in the Skype for Linux about box: https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/lmYvb66S/the%20skype%20linux%20about%20box
<zmoylan-pi> trying to reclaim the oppositions icon...
 * penguin42 is sure he's seen that penguin somewhere before
<zmoylan-pi> don't they all look the same?
<penguin42> not to penguins
<zmoylan-pi> well... you would say that... :-P
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
<directhex> zmoylan-pi: i hate to point it out, but the creator of tux works for microsoft, so "reclaim"?
<directhex> also, yes, that skype about box penguin is my everything
<zmoylan-pi> a lot of linux/foss developers have/currently worked for ms... their work doesn't automatically belong to ms because of that
<ali1234> tux shows up in some weird places
<zmoylan-pi> i got a penguin pez dispenser for a mate who uses linux at work in a mostly ms shop.  he loves it
<zmoylan-pi> bonus is he's vegetarian and it's one of the few sweets that is kosher with that...
<ali1234> http://i.imgur.com/kqPwtss.png
<ali1234> that's clearly the larry ewing tux
<zmoylan-pi> i have a dog toy squeaky penguin that i use for pub meetups.  always flushes out the linux heads.
<diddledan> http://m.xkcd.com/1737/
<zmoylan-pi> a lot of people throw out computers when they get infected... i know a lot of unix users who got their hardware that way...
<shivers> hey! I know that nick from another channel zmoylan-pi :)
<shivers> Didn't know you could be found here too
<zmoylan-pi> i hang out in a few channels on a couple of irc servers
<shivers> Apparently so. Well so do I when it comes to it
<shivers> I am configuring a new IRC client so I've found a few new channels to visit, hence my stopping by here
<shivers> Also, I installed Ubuntu on a new box I built this weekend
<popey> welcome to the madhouse
<shivers> Thanks, I think
<zmoylan-pi> oooh quassel.... haven't used that on in ages...
<shivers> Yup. New to me
<zmoylan-pi> i used it when i had mac, windows and linux at same time as the client worked on all 3
<shivers> I planned on using what I know, weechat and tmux or screen
<shivers> Mmm. I have all 3 of those OS's running right now
<zmoylan-pi> so there was no mental gymnastics when swapping os for a task
<shivers> Windows for gaming, mac for mobility, and now Ubuntu
<zmoylan-pi> meanwhile my pi keeps on pi....ing
<shivers> heh
<zmoylan-pi> though my lowest client isn't the pi but my nokia dumbphone with a java irc client on it for mobile use
<shivers> Gosh. That's old skool
<zmoylan-pi> when i tried irc on an android phone i could run down the battery a lot by using irc for an hour or two.  the nokia lasts days in irc if i leave it...
<zmoylan-pi> and it doubles as a +1 bludgeon weapon in a zombie apocalypse...
<shivers> that's always handy
<zmoylan-pi> or skynet sending terminators so it's a twofer :-P
<shivers> Not sure a Nokia is the preferred weapon against a Terminator, but I'm willing to let you test it
<zmoylan-pi> or assembling ikea furniture that needs a panel pin banged in... :-D
<zmoylan-pi> drop nokia in sock, beat the bejezus out of a terminator.  easy peasy :-)
<shivers> Sounds like you have it all planned.
<shivers> So... to be slightly on-topic. Is there anything I need to know about Ubuntu? I haven't used linux at all in a couple years now. Started with slack in early 90s tho and has used *nixes a lot over the years
<shivers> I am brushing up on apt commands, but besides that I'm not sure what I need to know
<zmoylan-pi> ubuntu is still a great distro.  if you don't like the unity desktop try xubuntu which is more win2000 windows classic themed, on a ancient system try lubuntu as it uses less resources for shiny whizz bang effects
<zmoylan-pi> other that that it just works
<shivers> I am not all that fuzzed about the looks of a desktop environment as long as I get hold of a decent terminal client
<zmoylan-pi> as long as you don't try and install it on a lenovo system running windows signature edition... :-P
<shivers> hehe
<shivers> That stirred up twitter for sure
<zmoylan-pi> well, it's linux, if you don't like a terminal client there'll be another one along in a minute
<shivers> Mmm. True enough
<shivers> I installed 16.04 LTS on this one. Didn't research the best flavour in advance, but this looks decent
<zmoylan-pi> there's been some hullaballoo over systemd but it seems to have died down a bit
<shivers> Yeah. I followed that at a distance. Lots of chatter about systemd in archlinux circles. That was the last linux OS I used.
<shivers> A definite departure from the BSD roots
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-18
<MooDoo> howdy all
<SuperMatt> morning
<SuperMatt> Guess who installed Ubuntu on all his boxes this weekend?
<SuperMatt> With 17.10 going full Gnome, I feel like the project is right back on track
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: I love aardvark, especially the dash to dock down the left.
<SuperMatt> Indeed
<SuperMatt> A couple of tweaks are needed for myself - I turn on the top left hotcorner, because I'm so used to it
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: lol I turn that off as it gets annoying when i accidently move my mouse up there, can still use the windows key for the same result
<SuperMatt> Ah, well I've been deliberately using a top left hot corner since before gnome shell was even released
<MooDoo> nice :D still a great feature, think people will like ubuntu more now
<genva> genva
<genva> hello
<diplo> Morning all
<sproctor> join #perl6
<sproctor> join #perl6
<SuperMatt> /
<SuperMatt> you dropped that
<sproctor> Yeah. Doh.
<sproctor> Cheers.
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<SuperMatt> monring
<brobostigon> morning
<zmoylan-pi> shhhhhh! it's monday out there!!
 * brobostigon hides
<diplo> Anyone here use Dell servers and there OMSA software ?
<diddledan> is this safe for work? "Linux 4.14 Gets A Driver For PWM-Controlled Vibrators"
<zmoylan-pi> one piece of second hand equipment even linux users wouldn't touch... :-P
<diddledan> I donno, zmoylan-pi, some of us a dirty ol gets
<diddledan> are*
<DJones> Dammit, get new job selling licenced drugs (Via a pharmancy), 1st thing I have to know is abiout selling them via "reefers"
<DJones> To me a "reefer" is cannibas smoke", so seems very odd
<daftykins> o0
<zmoylan-pi> are they paying you in cash under the counter? :-)
<daftykins> disguised in prescription bags
<diddledan> http://nerdist.com/nerdist-presents-thor-ragnarok-1980s-trailer/
<diddledan> and, the EFF have left the W3C: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2017/09/open-letter-w3c-director-ceo-team-and-membership
<zmoylan-pi> saw that, not good...
<daftykins> diddledan: mum and dad are fighting
 * diddledan puts on his headphones and rocks silently listening to heavy metal
 * zmoylan-pi pushes the chocolate hobnobs towards diddledan 
<daftykins> such favouritism :(
<zmoylan-pi> daftykins of course gets the chocolate mikados...
 * brobostigon is happy with his penderyn and chocolate, :)
<daftykins> penderyn?
<zmoylan-pi> tis a welsh whiskey
<brobostigon> :D
<zmoylan-pi> kinda like japanese vodka... :-P
 * brobostigon spanks zmoylan-pi for suggesting that.
<brobostigon> :(
<daftykins> d'aww
<brobostigon> penderyn is the drink of kings.
<zmoylan-pi> in 60s japanese copies of international brands were a joke... but japanese keep trying and by 00s they win international competitions...
<brobostigon> quite.
 * brobostigon likes perfectly warming sake, :D
 * brobostigon shares his penderyn with zmoylan-pi, "hope'Hope"
 * zmoylan-pi doesn't drink...
 * brobostigon wonders what zmoylan-pi drinks for pleasure?
<zmoylan-pi> tea....
<zmoylan-pi> hot tea on a cold day...
<brobostigon> what is your poison? a pan galactic gargle blaster !!
<zmoylan-pi> i like a club lemon on a hot day... or club rock shandy...
<zmoylan-pi> or sometimes red lemonade...
<brobostigon> so no being hit by a piece of lemon rapped roun a large gold brick?
<zmoylan-pi> that would be the red lemonade... like sand paper on your tongue...
<brobostigon> :)
<diddledan> 2008 vs today on the appstore: https://twitter.com/reneritchie/status/909900368745725953
<diddledan> people were still using AIM in 2008?! :-o
<zmoylan-pi> says the person in irc...
<daftykins> i just see a tonne of junk...
<diddledan> IRC is the future
<zmoylan-pi> pick up the average persons phone... that's what you see... kinda the new browser toolbar....
<zmoylan-pi> filled with games/apps of the week from last few months...
<diddledan> is it time to upgrade to the aaaardvaaaark yet?
<diddledan> amorous aardvard?
<diddledan> k
<diddledan> I can't remember what the adjective is
<diddledan> atrophic aardvark?
<daftykins> depends if you think you're 'aard enough
<daftykins> ;D
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-19
<diplo> Morning all
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<diddledan> your site hates you sleeping https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/psxo6vX6/
<zmoylan-pi> it's the modern version of a watched kettle...
<diddledan> ow. my shoulder/neck has gone stiff
<diddledan> I haven't got any heat rub
<diddledan> it's the time of year for daddy longlegs
<daftykins> diddledan: are those things related? :D
<diddledan> lol
<diddledan> this looks interesting "Her Story" on GOG.com: https://go.bwlh.at/2xv37bA
<daftykins> that went to github for a corebird-snap ?
<diddledan> bah
<diddledan> go.bwlh.at/2jHYXYE
<diddledan> the copy button didn't work
<ali1234> hey guys i've got a weird question
 * daftykins gets comfy
<ali1234> you know this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bgmx_OJP8qo
<ali1234> how would you describe what it does in one word?
<ali1234> "extrusion" doesn't really capture it
<daftykins> damn that's the first word that came to mind
<daftykins> i'm puzzled, as it does to me and by the first definition online
<ali1234> i'm looking for a word that specifically gets across the kind of doughy/plastic nature of the material
<daftykins> that would seem separate to the process, to me o0
<ali1234> yeah
<ali1234> but i mean, you can extrude metal
<ali1234> but it isn't satifying to watch in the same way, know what i mean?
<daftykins> mmm
<ali1234> here's another one http://s3files.core77.com/blog/images/2014/12/0pastamaking2.gif
<daftykins> so that's how they do it
<diddledan> this is a fun one: https://gitlab.com/gnachman/iterm2/issues/6050
<daftykins> passwords O_O
<ali1234> expected extrusion gif, got a DNS leak :(
<ali1234> is iTerm a mac thing?
<diddledan> yes
<ali1234> iTerm2 - a third party replacement?
<diddledan> no, iTerm is the forerunner of iTerm 2
<diddledan> both are third party
<daftykins> uTerm, weallTerm
<diddledan> iTerm, uTerm, we all term for iced term?
<daftykins> extrusion tax: https://media.giphy.com/media/KHFV8UJSzZzQk/giphy.gif
<daftykins> aaaah such satisfaction
<diddledan> why does it spiral though?!
<ali1234> cos the holes are angled i guess
<diddledan> example of apple's new iphone camera effect "stage lighting": https://cdn.macrumors.com/article-new/2017/09/portrait-lighting-techcrunch-800x520-1-800x520.jpg?retina
<daftykins> maybe when you're not paying the bills
<diddledan> bills ftl
<daftykins> they're about to come for quarter end here, too :(
<diddledan> I vote to veto all bills
<daftykins> yes, Danny DeVito
<diddledan> well if he's willing to pay, I guess that would be fine
<daftykins> *nod*
<diddledan> oh america! https://twitter.com/CNBCnow/status/910230655727960065
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-20
<diplo> Morning all
<MooDoo> howdy all
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<MooDoo> howdy brobostigon how are you on this fine day?
<brobostigon> hi MooDoo, not bad and you?
<MooDoo> yes ok thanks :D just figured out some 4gl code which was doing my head in  :)
<brobostigon> :)
<foobarry> now all my printouts come with an extra page "save pdf to evernote"
<daftykins> they're murdering trees :(
<MooDoo> huh?
<daftykins> what foobarry said, some addon pointing to evernote wasting paper
<MooDoo> ah right :)
<foobarry> https://imgur.com/a/ocKJx had to use windows for expenses form. can't click sign out or cancel
<foobarry> its just stuck there
<foobarry> and its a VDI
<MooDoo> windows is driving me insane at the moment.
<daftykins> in what way?
<MooDoo> machine hangs, inability to restart [last time i restarted the machine it took 45 mins, ok ok so it's insider build but wow i'm starting to loathe windows
<daftykins> that's definitely akin to running 17.10 or 18.04 and moaning :)
<daftykins> neither are normal setups really
<daftykins> ah and the castle cannon sounds mid-day
<MooDoo> I'm using 17.10 and it's really good at the moment, not had a single problem with it ;d
<MooDoo> :)
<daftykins> that's why i said the next, since that's had some time ;)
<MooDoo> I may look stupid, but not ready for 18:04, normally upgrade a month before release as it's generally quite good by then....
<diddledan> http://bit.ly/2eKOFpa
<diddledan> daftykins: kitten-porn: https://twitter.com/bonebonebot/status/910496627932254214
<MooDoo> it's laughable they will remove encryption
<zmoylan-pi> they're clueless eejits who have no idea what it's for
<diddledan> also: http://www.politico.eu/article/theresa-may-tech-firms-must-remove-extremist-content-within-two-hours/
<zmoylan-pi> but these days i just don't store my data in the cloud... too many unknowns as to who can access it
<zmoylan-pi> but cheques still need 3 working days to clear?
 * SuperMatt sighs
<zmoylan-pi> they simply don't understand the sheer amount of data that needs to be processed...
<daftykins> diddledan: i'd hate to see the injuries trying to put an outfit on my cat
<diddledan> how much video is posted onto youtube per minute these days?
<zmoylan-pi> i was listening to bbc podcast on chinese firewall... 2m people employed in making it work...
<SuperMatt> I don't care about the removal of extremist content, my issue is the fact that there will be so many false positives caught in the crossfire with no easy means to challenge them.
<zmoylan-pi> lots of people false reporting stuff they disagree with, knowing it will be taken down under stupid law with no repurcussion
<SuperMatt> Not to mention it's targetting a symptom of extremism, rather than the cause
<diddledan> SuperMatt: exactly. the tweet I got that link from says rougly "T.May wants censorship by algorithm"
<zmoylan-pi> https://act.openmedia.org/FiveEyesSaveEncryption
<SuperMatt> If I type cat in to google photos, google does a great job of finding cats. The thing is though, it doesn't matter if there are false positives
<zmoylan-pi> whoops wrong channel, sorry
<diddledan> you just have to look at the problem LGBTQIA+ videos on youtube being demonetised just for mentioning the word "lesbian" in the title
<SuperMatt> that's sucky
<daftykins> D:
<daftykins> how rude
<diddledan> when challenged a youtube rep said "we have no idea why they're demonetised. it's not a corporate decision" (paraphrase)
<zmoylan-pi> were there's a system there are feckers who will game that system for malice and profit
<SuperMatt> !swearing
<lubotu3> Please avoid any language that may be considered offensive, including acronyms and obfuscation of such - also see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Guidelines || The main channels are English only, for other languages, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/ChannelList
<diddledan> flippers?
<zmoylan-pi> which is why i used the word fecker... so polite even a priest in ireland would say it...
<diddledan> frak
<SuperMatt> you're right!
<SuperMatt> I misread it, and I'm sorry
<zmoylan-pi> np
<diddledan> haha
<zmoylan-pi> it also has a nice guttural pronounciation you can get behind...
<m0nkey_> I never, ever, EVER want to work on legacy perl and php code EVER AGAIN!
<DJones> Hmmh, the moment when you realise that your new job involves selling drugs in bulk and you have to spend 2 days researching exporting reefers........
<DJones> Quite why the sale of controlled drugs would be done via what is called "reefers" is beyond me
<DJones> Just seems a very wierd coincidence
 * DJones waits for dr danfish
<diplo> I have to work with legacy perl and sometimes php4 code at times :(
<DJones> In a way, I'm glad I stopped programming when COBOL went out of fashion, if not I'd be working for a bank writing security patches for 30 year old code
<DJones> All I can remember about it now is "Identification division"
<DJones> !new S A Stephenson - [Convergence 01] - Rogue (epub).rar
<lubotu3> DJones: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<DJones> Grr
<diplo> hah DJones
<diddledan> DJones: was that meant for <insert warez channel here>?
<diddledan> (am I showing my age by referring to warez?)
<DJones> Heh
<daftykins> diddledan: not at all!
<daftykins> well ok maybe a bit
<MooDoo> evening all
<daftykins> \o
<diddledan> do the winkelvoss twins refer to their bits as their winkelvoss?
<daftykins> it's when they need to take a tinkle that things get confusing
<diddledan> and if it was small, it'ld be dinkle
<diddledan> apparently the iphone OMG-X, which isn't available, is going to be not available..!? https://www.macrumors.com/2017/09/20/iphone-x-production-further-delays/
<MooDoo> who cares it's apple, I know loads of people that's downloaded iOS 11 and it's bricked their phone...ooops
<daftykins> and reviewers of the new watch have found they can't connect to LTE services ;D
<diddledan> \o/ doorstop!
<diddledan> I read that the LTE issue is actually a long-standing watch problem that nobody noticed until LTE came along
<daftykins> o rry
<diddledan> here ya go: https://www.imore.com/how-your-apple-watch-connects-wi-fi-networks-when-away-your-iphone
<daftykins> thank ye
<daftykins> i've not heard the term 'interstitial login' before
<daftykins> only 'captive portal'
<diddledan> interstitial is an advertising/marketing term
<diddledan> https://twitter.com/shatterfront/status/816065700577972224
<daftykins> XD
<diddledan> where's mount.msdos or mount.fat?!
<diddledan> dosfstools is installed
<diddledan> apt-file says no package is available to provide it
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-21
<SuperMatt> a
<SuperMatt> oops
<SuperMatt> morning though
<MooDoo> howdy all
<SuperMatt> Didn't get facebook job :(
<SuperMatt> need a little more systems knowledge
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: awww that sucks, and what systems?
<SuperMatt> As is, what system calls are called when starting a process
<MooDoo> yeah that sounds a bit in depth
<SuperMatt> yeah
<SuperMatt> though my coding was fine, apparently
<MooDoo> are you going to try again?
<SuperMatt> One day
<MooDoo> cool
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<MooDoo> morning brobostigon :D]
<brobostigon> morning MooDoo :)
<foobarry> what system calls *are* called when starting a process?
 * SuperMatt shrugs
<SuperMatt> essentially, they want kernel level knowledge
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: time for some reading then :D
<SuperMatt> indeed
<MooDoo> I'm thinking about LPIC-1
<foobarry> https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=zGYC5Y-FIOUC&pg=PA15&lpg=PA15&dq=what+system+calls+are+called+when+starting+a+process&source=bl&ots=lcZ6nYWZOQ&sig=V4bDE_xLu_Y-1AdA2-T7UhdszZM&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjMjOvm5LXWAhWCA8AKHZFADqo4ChDoAQg8MAQ#v=onepage&q=what%20system%20calls%20are%20called%20when%20starting%20a%20process&f=false
<foobarry> really annoying issue with slack
<foobarry> somehow it grabs the clipbaord and hogs it
<zmoylan-pi> using slack? :-P
<foobarry> 9/10 i'm pasting an old clip
<diddledan> really interesting: https://medium.com/starts-with-a-bang/the-greatest-cosmic-puzzle-astronomers-find-stars-that-appear-older-than-the-universe-71bee462c6be
<zmoylan-pi> is there a less bloggy link?
<diddledan> I can shortlink it if you want a link that looks different
<Oli> I want to make a big wall-mounted "keyboard" for the house. Ideally a white dry-erase surface with a grid of buttons. Then I can draw out keys and map those to actions via an Ubuntu server. But does anybody know if this mythical wipe-clean whiteboard-keboard thing exists? Or do I have to make this from scratch?
<Oli> Everything I search for pushes me towards a smart board (without a projector) or a touchscreen overlay... But they're both pretty expensive options for an application where I need âat mostâ 30 buttons.
<diplo> I have no idea whether you can use something, but sounds like the laser projection virtual keyboard ?
<diplo> I'veen one on amazon, don't know if it works with linux though
<Oli> Yeah sort of. That just seems very complicated. All I need is a matrix of large membrane buttons with something I can draw on on the surface.
<Oli> Just doesn't appear to be something that exists.
<Oli> I'm almost considering pulling a DDR mat apart.
<Oli> That's the sort of scale I'm almost talking about
<diplo> I was about to say, sounds like something you'd have to make yourself if not
<diplo> Rip a keyboard apart and map the keys you want to use and stick a cover over them
<diplo> Get one of the clear membrane covers for keyboards
<Oli> Yeah. It's just a shame there aren't enough people as weird as me to justify mass production of these.
<diplo> I guess that's why most people use smart boards in schools etc
<zmoylan-pi> i think dnd now has software that'll project, might be an alternate starting point for similar features...
<daftykins> HSBC want a 90 minute appointment to create an account, hrmm
<zmoylan-pi> ring your own donuts and coffee? :-)
<zmoylan-pi> *bring
<daftykins> cor, i'm hoping for a free coffee at least!
<zmoylan-pi> you'll get a free calendar like everyone else... with the heros of hsbc on it... in their skivies...
<daftykins> ooh that might be a bit too fancy for HSBC Offshore, down here on the rock
<daftykins> maybe a free branded biro which lasts a sentence or three of writing
<zmoylan-pi> if you had opened the deluxe business account you'd get a red stapler... :-)
<daftykins> woohoo \o/
<zmoylan-pi> well that might help a few peopkle here in ireland... http://www.rte.ie/news/2017/0921/906622-government-outlaw-zero-hours-contracts/
<daftykins> diddledan: https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-41v6n3Vaf5s/UeRN_XJ0keI/AAAAAAAAN2Y/YxIHhddGiaw/s1600/css.gif
<popey> https://imgur.com/gallery/a6vhvzp
<popey> need
<MooDoo> popey: I'm closer :p
<popey> haha :)
<daftykins> O_O
<diddledan> wow
<diddledan> I love finding old sites: "Rewrote the page in valid html 4.01 strict."
<diddledan> nobody cares about being "valid html" anymore
<diddledan> either it works or it doesn't
<diddledan> it's even got those w3c checkmark icons to say "I really did validate it, honest, guv"
<diddledan> e.g. http://www.w3.org/Icons/valid-html401
<daftykins> as long as the mobile version makes you cringe and head to a desktop browser to get anything done, everything is normal!
<zmoylan-pi>  does it have an undercontruction gif? :-)
<diddledan> google chrome is refusing to open stackexchange sites
<zmoylan-pi> is that a bug or a feature?
<diddledan> I'm not sure
<MooDoo> diddledan: url?
<diddledan> https://stackoverflow.com
<MooDoo> works fine for me!
<MooDoo> well the site loads
<diddledan> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/8cHQYGds/
<daftykins> yip fine here
<MooDoo> diddledan: that one didn't
<diddledan> other https sites are loading fine so it isn't a misconfiguration of proxy
<daftykins> diddledan: ah they saw you coming
<diddledan> o_O
<diddledan> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/LUJK5pML/
<diddledan> weird
<daftykins> are you running some convoluted setup from your many racks to help confuse your DNS setup and so on?
<diddledan> I don't _think_ so
<diddledan> if I curl direct to an IP from DNS resolution I get SSL correctly starting
<diddledan> e.g. stackoverflow.com.	197	IN	A	151.101.1.69
<diddledan> I curl that IP and get a result that no hostnames in the certificate match the IP (because it expects me to be asking for a hostname, not IP)
<diddledan> curl: (51) SSL: no alternative certificate subject name matches target host name '151.101.1.69'
<diddledan> that's fine AFAICT
<diddledan> openssl s_client can connect
<diddledan> for some reason curl and chrome are failing
<diddledan> firefox also can't get there
<diddledan> AHA
<diddledan> forgot about that
<diddledan> I fix
<diddledan> turns out I had two default routes at the same priority - one for my real gateway and one from a stupid usb gsm dongle
<daftykins> o0
<daftykins> surely it's a bit faster than GSM :D
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-22
<MooDoo> morning all
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<SuperMatt> good morning
<brobostigon> morning
<popey> Good morning. TFIF
<brobostigon> morning popey
<MooDoo> popey: howdy, and yes indeed...
 * diddledan looks at clock..
<diddledan> too early ! :-p
<MooDoo> diddledan: i was here at 5:30 :D
<MooDoo> AM!
<diddledan> gah
<diddledan> that's silly-o'clock
<MooDoo> diddledan: means I get to go home at 1:15 :D
<diddledan> nice
<MooDoo> diddledan: not really, got to pull up some tree stumps in the garden later lol
<diddledan> dang. and after being awake at silly-o'clock, too!
<MooDoo> yeah :D  ah well
<diddledan> you're gonna be knackerd
<MooDoo> diddledan: already am pmsl, it'll be worth it any way
<MooDoo> get to put a manshed in their places :D
<diddledan> grr man
<diddledan> man beer
<diddledan> beer grr
<MooDoo> going to be my computer room
<diddledan> awesome
<diddledan> I'd have one, but I'm not sure you can put a shed up in a block of flats
<diddledan> maybe I should put a conservatory on my non-ground-floor flat
<MooDoo> diddledan: even the wife gave me permission to do it lol
<diddledan> do it quick before she changes her mind
<MooDoo> heh
<zmoylan-pi> you could put a wendy house up in a flat... :-)
<zmoylan-pi> but give it a cool web 2.0 name like a privacy pod... :-P
<diddledan> 160 Terror Bits Per SECOND: https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/09/22/microsoft_and_facebooks_transatlantic_cable_completed/
<zmoylan-pi> that's a lot of cat videos...
<MooDoo> wow uber license in london not being re-issued :S
<diplo> I just read that too, going to be a big kick off about that for sure
<MooDoo> diplo: yeah especially if the appeal fails
<zmoylan-pi> seemingly while the appeal is pending they can continue...
<MooDoo> yeah but it's still a worriying 21 days for 40,000 uber drivers in london
<diplo> Yup, I can't see it being stopped really... would be a huge uproar. I guess that Uber will agree to some changes
<diplo> A few of my friends work in London and they hate london taxis, not just for price.. only use uber now
<MooDoo> guess we'll see over the next few weeks
<diplo> I forgot they also have lyft and things, so maybe it won't be so bad
<foobarry> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PivpCKEiQOQ hitler uses docker
<diddledan> foobarry: gotta admit, he has a point
 * diddledan drops this one and runs: https://youtu.be/HNMq8XS4LhE
 * zmoylan-pi rings rspca and tells them about diddledan...
<diddledan> :-p
 * diddledan hums the music
<diddledan> that's an earworm
 * diddledan puts spotify on to try to drown out those evil sheep
<diddledan> I wonder why my PC just hung hard: https://paste.ubuntu.com/25592609/
<diddledan> that's the last log messages before it died
<diplo> Hung the whole PC or just the DE ?
<diplo> I liked unity, but compiz was/is a beast imo
<diddledan> this time it was the whole PC - I've had others in the past where I could REISUB it
<diplo> Only time I get hard crash is failing hardware really
<diddledan> same behaviour in both cases tho
<diddledan> hmm
<diddledan> it's fairly new system
<diddledan> the oldest thing in there is a GTX960
<diplo> I had a brand new server, live for 2 weeks and afailed memory module
<diplo> hah that was the issue at my home PC, the gfx card dieing
<diddledan> is the GFX dead or just poorly driven by nouveau though!?!
<diplo> Ah, could be nouvea, always used nvidia stuff myself, mine was the card itself dieing
<SuperEngineer>  Use of this channel implies acceptance of the terms at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/TermsOfService .... as one Uber driver said to the other.
<diddledan> hmm?
<diddledan> awesome! http://pandaprecision.net/en/minimz/
<m0nkey_> I just sent some guy back to the land of Linux
<m0nkey_> It clearly wasn't working out in BSD land
<diddledan> m0nkey_: but .. FREEDUMZ
<diddledan> you'll be telling people to use Microsoft next
<diddledan> stallman would be turning in his grave
<diddledan> that, of course, requires stallman to be deaded
<diddledan> so, who's up for a murder party?
 * diddledan lights some pitchforks
<daftykins> m0nkey_: is that a bit like getting a really bad parents evening?
<m0nkey_> nah
<m0nkey_> guy even said it himself that he's more comfortable in linux
<m0nkey_> anyway
<m0nkey_> time to go home
<m0nkey_> cya folks
<daftykins> hehe i popped into my Dad's workplace this evening for a laugh, quick glance at his PC - "updates were last installed September 2015"
<diddledan> ouch
<daftykins> and that was true for the whole domain XD
<diddledan> farp
<diddledan> that's a serious neglect
<daftykins> ikr
<daftykins> and they have a whole support company XD
<diddledan> you mean they're paying for nonpatch-tuesdays?
<daftykins> yep! well they have this Windows small business server 2011 which is apparently server 2008 R2 + exchange 2011, (EOL 2020) someone hasn't remoted in and authorised the updates from the last 2 years
<diddledan> "we're inundated with constantly applying MS updates. What can you do to help us?" <-- "well Mr business, pay us a lot of money and we'll make sure you never see another patch again. in fact we'll never apply any patches at all!"
<daftykins> 8D
<daftykins> "now if you excuse me, i have a call waiting from Mr. Equifax"
<diddledan> HAH!
<diddledan> equifax keep fumbling the ball they dropped
<diddledan> they still haven't managed to actually pick it up again yet
<daftykins> :D it's really quite poor, yet none of us are really that surprised by a huge company failing so hard
<daftykins> i made a joke to the CSO today at the local HSBC branch when i opened an account, as i had to give my permission to do a credit check which apparently involved Equifax and someone else
<diddledan> "you know that company who lost all your details? yeah, want us to give them some more to lose?"
<diddledan> I can't believe they set up a separate domain that looks phishy as heck for everyone to check into. Not only that, but they tweet the WRONG DAMN DOMAIN sending people to the actually phishy site not just the one that looks phishy
<daftykins> *nod*
<daftykins> shows they can't even pick up the phone to another department
<diddledan> I wonder if anyone has thought of an ape-based porn a la "Kinky Kong"
<daftykins> rule 34
<diddledan> :-p
<diddledan> really must read that
<m0nkey_> Want.. https://twitter.com/NetgateUSA/status/911276781705056257
<daftykins> nothing like being an early adopter ;)
<zmoylan-pi> or as we call them masochists... :-P
<daftykins> :D
<diddledan> mysogenists?
<daftykins> haha i had an email from one of the guys with access to my clients Spain apartment, i'd asked him to arrange reconfiguring the ISP fibre router to bridge mode so our own router could be used, i got a reply that they were very hot and on reboot "the ISP router wifi is back" which means it has reset itself o0 not very good signs
 * zmoylan-pi remembers the film best defense from 80s which dealth with this very problem... :-)
<zmoylan-pi> who ever thought to put dudley moore and eddie murphy in a comedy was bonkers...
<diddledan> wonderwoman is out on download midnight monday morning
<zmoylan-pi> midnight monday morning... so i need the tardis to arrive at that time? :-)
<diddledan> yup
<daftykins> i managed to miss Valerian at the cinema, but i best make a special effort for the new Blade Runner
<diddledan> https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/pioneers-third-challenge/
<diddledan> love tht
<diddledan> that*
<diddledan> now how do I convince them I'm 15?
<daftykins> a question that in so many other circumstances would put you behind bars
<daftykins> :P
<zmoylan-pi> dust off your skateboard... wear baseball cap and jeans incorrectly... :-)
<daftykins> "greetings fellow kids, i too enjoy $cool_band"
<daftykins> diddledan: http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/facebook/000/018/666/fellowkids.jpg
<diddledan> I was just googling for that
<daftykins> aww $music_band
<daftykins> ;D
<daftykins> i had 'steve buscemi young'
<diddledan> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7lNBMGmGF0
<daftykins> wow that's brief
<diddledan> yeah, that's what my friend said
<diddledan> "friend"
<diddledan> I just had this advertised at me on variety.com: https://tpc.googlesyndication.com/simgad/533845224675914945
<diddledan> I really cannot even
<zmoylan-pi> you browse without adblockers?!
<daftykins> AND he has a mac ;_;
<daftykins> we might have to promote not-shauno within the late night group
<daftykins> oh that was amusing, the CSO in HSBC today told me that they're only now tearing themselves apart from HSBC up there in England, took their time!
<diddledan> apparently startrek discovery is gonna be good: http://www.radiotimes.com/news/tv/2017-09-20/the-first-reviews-for-star-trek-discovery-are-in-and-they-may-surprise-some-people/
<daftykins> i dunno, some 'murican pals shared that they're apparently going to explore themes on the current political climate over there within the eps
 * zmoylan-pi finishes watching an episode of b5
<daftykins> cor
<daftykins> on a 3310? ;)
<zmoylan-pi> i'm tempted if i do get one to convert a few tv shows to it's video format... probably just porridge, yes minister, blackadder, cheers as they were shot to be watch on titchy tv...
 * zmoylan-pi puts on episode of red dwarf... :-)
<daftykins> is it Quarantine?
<daftykins> Jeff Buckley - Dream Brother
<daftykins> aaaah.
<zmoylan-pi> smeeeeee heeeeeee
<diddledan> http://bloody-disgusting.com/news/3460132/linda-hamilton-back-sarah-connor-terminator-6/
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-23
<diddledan> from popey in the ubuntu podcast telegram: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/netvalve-internet/x/4511879#/
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<MooDoo> howdy all
<zmoylan-pi> and what has you online at 5 on a saturday... you're supposed to be out having fun
<MooDoo> zmoylan-pi: just got in from my daughters birthday party, so chilling for a bit lol
<zmoylan-pi> now you have to find a spot till the sugar rush wears off... :-)
<MooDoo> yeah she's watching tv so she's fine :D
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: pot, meet kettle
<zmoylan-pi> no smart appliances here needing to be introduced diddledan :-)
<daftykins> :D
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-24
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<zmoylan-pi> space balls.... 30 years old...
<brobostigon> zmoylan-pi: good film, :)
