#ubuntu-mobile 2008-03-10
<thoughtfix> Evening
<thoughtfix> Finally got my Q1 Ultra - trying to build myself an image. Let's hope it doesn't error out again
<nrp> nice
<thoughtfix> Hah... People live?
<nrp> indeed
<thoughtfix> So now - to make a build that actually works
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> can somebody of the mobile team please take care of all the bluetooth uploads in the sponsoring queue?
<MutantBC> hello
<MutantBC> have you encounter Couldn't find package moblin-image-create after doing sudo apt-get install moblin-image-creator
<MutantBC> ?
<MutantBC> ??
<MutantBC> ?
<MutantBC> :(
<MutantBC> anyone?
<Mithrandir> dholbach: I'll poke at the bluetooth sponsorship bugs.
<dholbach> Mithrandir: ROCK, thanks
<mjg59> lool: Is there a moblin version of hildon-theme-layout anywhere? I haven't been able to find any patches other than the ones we ship.
<mjg59> And the version we have is a native package :)
<lool> mjg59: I don't know whether they have a moblin one; the most direct way to check is to look at their APT repo
<lool> moblin.org/apt
<lool> mjg59: Sorry, I was afk due to some raim in my living room, *cough*
<mjg59> lool: No problem
<mjg59> lool: Ok, looks like they don't.
<mjg59> lool: I just need my ubuntu-mobile membership activated and I'll push this
<Mithrandir> mjg59: I did that an hour ago.
<mjg59> Mithrandir: Oh, really? Thanks
<mjg59> I'll push now
<Mithrandir> about 9 minutes after you applied, iirc.
<mjg59> Heh
<mjg59> Ok, done
<mjg59> Oh, what's the format for the tagging?
<lool> Good question; I'd say package version is fine
<lool> As we're supposed to use different versionning schemes for different sources
<mjg59> Upstream or ubuntu?
<lool> I'd say Ubuntu
<mjg59> Cool
<davidm> mjg59, Mithrandir beat me by a minute....
<mjg59> davidm: Heh
<mjg59> Hm. bzr is unhappy. ERROR: Tags not supported by BzrBranch5
<mjg59> Even after doing an upgrade
<Mithrandir> davidm: you're getting old.
<lool> mjg59: The remote branch my need an upgrade
<lool> mjg59: I thought LP at switched to bzr 1.0
<davidm> Mithrandir, I resemble that remark ;-)
<Mithrandir> davidm: ;-)
<Mithrandir> davidm: just be happy the alternative is much worse.
<davidm> Mmmmm so true.
<mjg59> Ah, I need to upgrade and push?
<mjg59> Hm. No.
<lool> mjg59: I'd say bzr upgrade lp:...
<lool> But I didn't actually try it out
<lool> lalala
<mjg59> Heh
<mjg59> No, it says that it's already up to date
<lool> mjg59: Also, perhaps we need a special upgrade flag
<mjg59> As in, the most recent format
<lool> --dirstate-tags
<mjg59> Nope, same error
<mjg59> The branch format Bazaar-NG meta directory, format 1 is already at the most recent format.
<lool> I fail to see how one gets tags support with LP
<mjg59> He
<mjg59> I need to head off for 10`minutes or so, back soon
<lool> Ok, i'll try it on my side as well now
<lool> As I hate giving stupid advice like I just did
<lool> 3 minutes since starting upgrade of sftp://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Eubuntu-mobile/hildon-theme-layout-4/ubuntu/
<lool> hmm
<mjg59> lool: Heh
<lool> Oh some progress when you came back
<mjg59> lool: Well, let me know if it looks like it's going to do anything useful :)
<lool> Continue talking, it's progressing each time you write a line
<lool> finished                                                                       
<lool> It finished locally too
<mjg59> Ok, success
<mjg59> Created tag 0.15.8-1ubuntu1.
<mjg59> Except that should be 0.14
<mjg59> Oops
<lool> How does one push tags only?
<mjg59> How does one push tags at all?
<lool> Yeah
<lool>        Tags  are  stored  in  the  branch.  Tags are copied from one branch to
<lool>        another along when you branch, push, pull or merge.
<mjg59> Yeah, except I tried pushing and it said it was on the altest revision
<lool> I wonder whether you need to fool it by having a rev to push
<lool> Or perhaps it complains but it works
<mjg59> Maybe
<lool> Yeah, it works!
<mjg59> Mm?
<lool> mjg59: I upgraded an old checkout and got the 0.14.8-1ubuntu1 tag which one of us pushed
<mjg59> Ah :)
<mjg59> Ok, good enough
<mjg59> Right, all it needs is uploading
<mjg59> I'll get to that later
 * lool tries a fresh branch
<lool> mjg59: 0.14.8-1ubuntu1      167
<lool> 0.15.8-1ubuntu1      167
<lool> mjg59: Now please remove your tag :)
<lool> bzr tag --delete I guess
<lool> mjg59: I had a quick look at your commits, and I don't know whether you followed the discussions / rationale for the changes, but you did things perfectly; thanks!
<smagoun> ChickenCutlass: what was the specific problem you ran into with image creator + the GID from the host?
<ChickenCutlass> smagoun, never found out what the exact problem was -- other than you can not launch the network-admin gui due to a GID error from PolicyKit
<instabin> Hello I would like to learn more about ubuntu mobile. Its it possiable to run on a dell axim x50v
<instabin> Or is there another hardware device that I would need to buy?
<nrp> instabin: x50v has an ARM CPU, so no Ubuntu Mobile.
<instabin> nrp: what could i buy that I would be able to test it?
<nrp> well, you can test it on any x86 computer, but i think most of the development is going into getting it running specifically on McCaslin and Menlow based computers
<nrp> basically, any UMPC with an Intel CPU would do
<nrp> though I imagine you could get it running fine on anything x86
<smagoun> davidm: lool I assume that this week's meeting is still 1700UTC? (10am PDT/1pm EDT for those of us in the states)
<davidm> smagoun, I'm waiting for Mauri to get back to me.  I'm inclined to keep it at 1700UTC but I'll move it if I have to.
<smagoun> davidm: thanks. Please keep us posted
<davidm> I'll be sending out the usual email either later today or tomorrow and I'll put the info at the top.
<osantana_> lool: are you there?
<lool> osantana_: Yes
<lool> osantana_: But I wont see your /query or private messages unless you register with nickserv
<rustyl_> davidm, you listening?
<rustyl_> davidm, i'm not sure if we will be meeting today, but i need to drop in to the lab for a bit (away from my irc client)
<davidm> rustyl_, NP, steve is not here as yet.
<StevenK> rustyl_: I'm here.
 * rustyl_ just returns from the lab
<StevenK> rustyl_: Catching up on e-mail.
<StevenK> rustyl_: So, before this other thing, can I ask why you wanted MIC to pull from the snapshot by default?
<rustyl_> StevenK, that is what we agreed to do at that sprint, it allows all the people that are not really working on hardy to use almost-hardy (instead of gutsy) and still be able to get their work done 
<rustyl_> basically, be able to work on in a stable environment while doing application development
<StevenK> rustyl_: But I'd rather not have a MIC in hardy that pulls from the snapshot
<rustyl_> oh... i don't really care what thing in hardy does... just the latest greatest off the source tree
<rustyl_> i don't think any of our guys are installing mic from hardy
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-03-11
<StevenK> Okay, I'll sort that out with Praj
<StevenK> rustyl_: So when is this call happening?
<rustyl_> StevenK, i don't know
<StevenK> rustyl_: Is Mauri around there?
<rustyl_> let me see
<rustyl_> StevenK, she is not on irc, but she is in the office.... StevenK who was calling the meeting, were you asking for this, what it davidm?
<rustyl_> s/what it/was it/
<StevenK> EPARSE
<StevenK> rustyl_: I thought Mauri was calling the meeting, based on the flurry of e-mail I got this morning.
<rustyl_> StevenK, just talked to Mauri... she basically said... 'Canonical guys are having a hard time getting helix + hw accelerated codecs working, so we were asked to walk them through it'
<rustyl_> StevenK, and all i will say is: first integrate all the graphics components, and only after that should you expect the codecs to work
<rustyl_> but... Calvin can not make this time to walk through any issues you have with integrating the graphics components
<rustyl_> StevenK, do you already have all the 2d/3d/libva all figured out and working?
<rustyl_> or do we need Calvin?
<StevenK> rustyl_: Well, sure, but I'm having a hard time reconciling packages to if they are required for 3d, since Hardy includes the 2d driver already
<rustyl_> i'm not going to be any help getting all the graphics components working... that is all coming from Calvin
<StevenK> rustyl_: Even a mapping of what package is for what bit if you know would be very helpful.
<rustyl_> i don't even know what you guys are being handed.
<StevenK> The 3d driver from ARMS.
<rustyl_> for our gutsy based images, i have three different psb-*.deb packages that i install
<StevenK> Which also includes the 2d driver, too
<rustyl_> so then... the packages are no coming in a form that you can just 'install'?
<rustyl_> because of conflicts in hardy?
<StevenK> Well, I'd rather not install the 2d driver from the package since hardy already provides it
<rustyl_> StevenK, ok, so forgetting about unhappiness with the form of the graphics drivers as they are arriving.... if you just install the packages (as is), then are you seeing issues with helix + hardware accelerated codecs?
<StevenK> rustyl_: If I force everything to be installed, 3d works. I didn't yet have helix in a state where I could test it. Now I do, but I wanted to get the 3d driver sorted out as well
<rustyl_> ok, i was under the impression that you were running into issues getting the codecs to work, but I could never get an answer from anyone on what the problem was
<rustyl_> StevenK, btw... do you have the umc_va_player from ARMS? It's a nice way to verify that your libva + 3d driver is really working without using helix (basically remove another variable from the equation)
<StevenK> rustyl_: No, I don't have that.
<rustyl_> StevenK, look in your home directory on moblin
<rustyl_> it's just a stand command line player that spits out a bunch of debug info and doesn't depend on installed codecs or media infrastructure
<rustyl_> stand along that is
<MutantBC> hi
<MutantBC> have anyone experience  an error when installing the mobile image creator - "Couldn't find package mobile-image-creator"?
<MutantBC> im using ubuntu 7.10 oem version
<StevenK> It's moblin-image-creator
<MutantBC> yes its still the same "Couldn't find package moblin-image-creator
<StevenK> Do you have universe enabled?
<MutantBC> where can i find that?
<MutantBC> how do i check if the universe is enabled?
<StevenK> System->Administration->Software Sources
<MutantBC> ok one moment
<MutantBC> StevenK do I have to reload? coz the downloading is taking awhile even though the internet connection here is fast
<StevenK> MutantBC: You should have to, no.
<MutantBC> StevenK: Ok
<MutantBC> StevenK: Are the packages that to be downloaded are huge?
<StevenK> I don't think they are.
<MutantBC> StevenK: that strange, coz the downloading is slow but the browsing is fast
<StevenK> Perhaps you need to pick a faster mirror
<MutantBC> StevenK: How do I do that?
<MutantBC> StevenK: Can you suggest which mirror is faster?
<StevenK> MutantBC: Change the "Download from" in Software Sources
<MutantBC> StevenK: Ok
<MutantBC> StevenK: but still slow been choosing a lot of mirror sites
<StevenK> MutantBC: You aren't clear on what is slow. 
<MutantBC> StevenK: downloading the packages from the Software Sources is taking too long
<MutantBC> StevenK: I kept swtiching to a better mirror site but still downloading around 600 B/s
<StevenK> MutantBC: Right. The right forum to ask questions about what to do in that case is #ubuntu
<MutantBC> StevenK: I just wanted to download the moblin-image-creator but without updating the Software Sources, I can't do anything
<MutantBC> StevenK: #ubuntu is too crowded, they said its normal to get a slower speed on the mirror servers when updating the packages from the Software Sources
<MutantBC> :(
<MutantBC> StevenK: Can the moblin image create a customize image for a specific device such as 7" similar to eeePC?
<MutantBC> Can the moblin image create a customize image for a specific device such as 7" similar to eeePC?
<nrp> MutantBC: right now it only does mccaslin and menlow stuff, of which the eee is neither
<nrp> you could just install ubuntu server on the eee and install the ubuntu-mobile package
<MutantBC> nrp: so you mean I have to install ubuntu to the eeePC and later install the ubuntu mobile?
<MutantBC> nrp: can I just install the ubuntu mobile?
<MutantBC> nrp: can i just install the ubuntu mobile to the eeePC?
<nrp> itll be infinitely easier for you to just install ubuntu server, and the ubuntu-mobile package
<nrp> if you want to make it difficult and save a little space, you could use debootstrap and make a really basic install to install ubuntu-mobile onto
<nrp> don't expect to get anything usable though. unless you're doing development or are just bored, youre better off going with something else
<dholbach> good morning
<nrp> mornin'
<WcktKlwn> what kind of devices are supported under ubuntu mobile?
<dholbach> see the topic: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/FAQ
<MutantBC> nrp: Ok
<MutantBC> nrp: right now im using VIA VX800 chipset, which i don't think Ubuntu 7.10 is supported on this chipset
<Fenario> KevinTW: ping
<davidm> Don_Johnson, http://linuxdevices.com/news/NS5429881813.html
<bert_> hi, I'm trying to get onto ubuntu mobile (installed the packages) but it doesn't seem to work
<bert_> do I need some kind of alpha image ?
<bert_> anyone ?
<nrp> bert_: what did you install it onto
<bert_> I just took a clean 32-bit ubuntu 7.10
<bert_> and then installed ubuntu-mobile and ubuntu-mobile-dev
<bert_> nrp ???
<nrp> are you using it with Xephyr?
<bert_> nrp: what's Xephyr ?
<nrp> lets you run X inside X
<nrp> theres a guide to using ubuntu-mobile with it somewhere on the ubuntu wiki
<bert_> really
<bert_> I didn't get the information that was on there
<bert_> (I'm not a native-english speaker
<bert_> )
<bert_> I have to go now
<bert_> thx for your help
<GrueMaster> davidm ping
<davidm> Hi GrueMaster 
<GrueMaster> I got a note from Don re USB Client.
<GrueMaster> I just got the source tree this afternoon (everyone was sending me links but no access - doh).
<GrueMaster> What did you need info on?
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-03-12
<dholbach> good morning
<probon1> hi all, i'm trying to make an image, but i keep getting errors that HAL is not configured
<probon1> is there a known bug?
<probon1> this is on hardy
<probon1> using the moblin image creator, mccaslin-lpia platform, ubuntu-mobile target 
<probon1> Setting up hal (0.5.10+git20080301-1ubuntu1) ...
<probon1> polkit-auth: This operation requires the system message bus and ConsoleKit to be running
<lool> probono: Curious
<lool> probono: Could you please file a bug against MIC on launchpad?
<lool> It should work
<dns53> has anyone tried to install ubuntu-mobile hardy on an eeepc?
<probono> lool: i need to experiment more
<probono> lool: using the deb from moblin.org, i don't get this problem
<lool> probono: What MIC are you using?
<probono> is there any way to get full hardware support (as in the Ubuntu live CD) into a moblin image?
<lool> Hmm I'd rather approach your goal the other way around: start from a live CD and add -mobile bits
<probono> lool: at my 1st attempt, i used the one from hardy. now i'm using the one from moblin.org, on gutsy - this works (created a live usb image)
<probono> now when i boot into that, my mouse doesn't work
<lool> You're running the moblin MIC package on gutsy targetting hardy?
<probono> yes, basically
<probono> works w/o errors
<lool> That's known not to work then; the problem is between the system dbus of gutsy and the hardy packages installed in the chroot
<lool> probono: Run hardy on your host
<probono> lool: now i'm getting confused
<probono> using hardy as a host, using hardy's mic did *not* work
<probono> using gutsy as a host, using moblin.org mic, *did* work
<lool> probono: Were you creating hardy based images?
<probono> i'm not sure about that, acutally
<probono> as i said, i'm new to this
<lool> probono: Make sure you wipe your ~/.image-creator and projects between your trials
<lool> probono: That's fine, don't worry
<probono> also, platforms ilke "mccaslin-lpia" are not exactly self-evident
<lool> probono: Oh come on, it means mccalsin on lpia  ;)
<probono> isn't there a platform "pc "?
<probono> that equals the hardware that a ubuntu live cd assumes?
<lool> probono: No, McCaslin is an Intel platform; just like Menlow
<lool> probono: You can try running these kernels, but they might not work
<probono> i have i945 machines, can't that work?
<lool> If you want generic support, you should add generic kernels
<probono> i915 also
<dns53> what platform works with an eeepc, or should i install ubuntu and the meta package?
<lool> Well we're not targetting anything else than mccaslin and menlow ATM
<probono> dns53: welcome to the club :-)
<lool> Not PCs, not EeePC
<probono> dns53: i'm in the same boat
<lool> But you're welcome to try running the software
<probono> dns53: we should start a pc/eeepc target
<probono> lool: yes. it does run, only it doesn't see my mouse (synaptics touchpad)
<dns53> well what are the differences in cpu architecture? 
<probono> which is why i was asking how i can enable full ubuntu standard live cd hardware support
<lool> probono: Ubuntu Mobile is currently aimed at touchscreens
<probono> lool: i understand that, but i'm lacking the hardware
<lool> It's preconfigured for some hardware platforms such as the Q1 Ultra
<probono> would like to get my development started w/o buying prerelease hardware
<lool> probono: At this point, you're "on your own"  :-/  You will have to revisit things like the missing packages or change the Xorg config
<lool> We're not trying to support all hardware in a generic fashion at the moment
<lool> probono: You should be able to run apps in Xephyr though and installing standard Ubuntu packages will simply work
<probono> lool: would it be hard? (i imagine it would basically involve a set of drivers packages)
<lool> probono: If you're large on disk, simply install a regular Ubuntu and add the mobile packages
<dns53> well the ubuntu-mobile works on gutsy when you add the missing package
<probono> dns53: how would i do that? is there a wiki page on that?
<probono> i'd also want my ubuntu to boot directly into mobile, not into gnome
 * probono loves the usb-image-generator though
<probono> come on, q1 is >1000 EUR
<dns53> well just install ubuntu (eeexubuntu in my case) then install ubuntu-mobile, there was a package missing from the dependencies i can't remember what it was m something
<probono> dns53: my actual goal would be to have a live cd/usb
<dns53> sure, but you can atleast get something working the normal ubuntu way. i did test the image-creator but no targets worked
<probono> mccaslin-lpia works, i can see the start screen, just have no mouse
<probono> this is on a i945 machine
<probono> dns53: after i installed ubuntu-mobile, how do i launch it?
<probono> how do i replace gdm with it?
<dns53> it should appear as a desktop entry in gdm, you may need to write your own script to launch it yourself and remove gdm
<probono> ok, thanks
<probono> dns53: does a stock ubuntu live cd work with the eeepc?
<probono> uck (ubuntu customization kit) should allow one to remaster a live cd to include ubuntu-mobile, i guess
<dns53> well you need to do some hacks to get everything working fine, X has a wrong resolution, madwifi needs to be customised. there are some scripts to add these things to a gutsy install
<pat_mcgowan> rustyl_, how do you tell moblin-media to switch between using gstreamer and helix
<rustyl_> pat_mcgowan, moblin-media will use the first media service it finds, and it finds the media service via the *.conf files in /usr/share/media-services/
<pat_mcgowan> rustyl_, thanks for your earlier response
<cwong1> Does anyone out there know anything about how /usr/share/applications/default.list is being created?
<bfiller_> mjg59: trying to debug a problem on custom hardware with custom hotkeys. I'm using setkeycodes scancode keycode to map scancode to keycode. After doing so, still not getting keycode when using xev. Any ideas?
<bfiller_> mjg59: I noticed you have worked on hotkey-setup package and thought that might help..
<mjg59> bfiller_: What keycode are you setting it to?
<bfiller_> mjg59: 97
<mjg59> Hm. Ok, should be safe.
<mjg59> Does evtest show it turning up?
<bfiller_> mjg59: I haven't tried that
<mjg59> That'd be a good thing to try
<bfiller_> mjg59: will do, thanks. 
<bfiller_> mjg59: also, what startup file should I put my "setkeycodes" command such that they are installed always?
<mjg59> Best would be to add to hotkey-setup
<bfiller_> mjg59: that can be used regardless of hardware?
<lool> cwong1: dpkg -S tells me it's shipped by desktop-file-utils: /usr/share/applications/defaults.list
<lool> cwong1: However, it's not checksummed; I'd guess it's updated subsequently when packages are installed; I would suppose update-desktop-database does so
<lool> cwong1: Please don't call it directly in your postinst and postrm though, but leave it to dh_desktop to add the magic
<mjg59> bfiller_: Yeah, as long as there's dmi information from the platform
<mjg59> bfiller_: If not, we'd need to work out something else :)
<cwong1> lool: ping
<lool> cwong1: pong
<lool> cwong1: But do feel free to pack a question along with the ping to allow me to pong with the answer ;)
<cwong1> lool: desktop-file-utils is not in the fset in MIC. Should it be?
<lool> cwong1: I think we should use the fset concept as little as possible and instead rely on what the ubuntu-mobile package pulls for us; isn't it pulled by some other package?
<cwong1> lool: Not that I know of
<cwong1> lool: Also, the file default.list that get install when you do apt-get install  desktop-file-utils doesn't really fit our mobile enviroment
<cwong1> lool: if desktop-file-utils is being pull in by an ubuntu-mobile package, would it be alright for one of our moblin package like home sreen to install it?
<lool> cwong1: What's the problem with it?
<cwong1> s/is/is not/
<cwong1> lool: some of the mime type pointing to wrong app.
<lool> cwong1: Are they pointing to one of the installed apps or an unavailable one?
<cwong1> lool:  for example html is pointing to firefox instead of the midbrowser,   media file pointing to totem instead of moblin media player
<lool> cwong1: Theoritically, this file should be updated after the installation of desktop-file-utils as its postinst calls update-desktop-database
<lool> So the contents of the file should reflect the installed apps and what they declare supporting
<lool> If you see mismatches, I'd first start by fixing the list of installed apps or the .desktop files which have been installed
<lool> If that's not enough, we can look into overrides
<cwong1> lool: so what you are saying is that all packages should do a db_update_desktop during the install, right?
<cwong1> s/db_update/desktop/dh_desktop/
<lool> cwong1: All packages should call dh_desktop during their *build* and this will make them call update-desktop-database after their installation and removal
<lool> cwong1: Well, all "desktop" related packages which ship .desktop files naturally
<lool> You don't need your kernel to call that obviously ;)
<cwong1> lool: if the default.list file is not there, will updaet-desktop-database create one for you?
<lool> cwong1: It should; look at /var/lib/dpkg/info/*.postinst
<lool> Well don't look at that, grep it rather
<cwong1> ok.  Thanks for the info.  I will look into it further.
<lool> grep -l update-desktop-database /var/lib/dpkg/info/*.postinst
<lool> cwong1: These are the snippets inserted by dh_desktop which will cause update-desktop-database -q to be run
<cwong1> lool:  looks like if the file default.list is not there, update-desktop-database -q doesn't create one for you.  Any idea?
<lool> cwong1: The file should be there as it's shipped by desktop-file-utils
<lool> cwong1: dpkg -L desktop-file-utils | grep defaults
<cwong1> lool: Yes if only you have install desktop-file-utils, but as I said before I don't think desktop-file-utils is part of the ubuntu-mobile image.  Correct me if I am wrong.
<cwong1> cwong1: lool:  at least if it is not part of the image being created by moblin's image creator
<cwong1> s/if//
<lool> cwong1: Checking
<cwong1> lool: k
<lool> cwong1: That's probably correct indeed
<lool> I only see ubuntu-desktop pulling it
<lool> cwong1: As a stop gap measure, add it to your fset
<lool> cwong1: The fix is in updating the ubuntu-mobile package
<cwong1> lool: ok. so someone from your side will fix this, right?
<lool> cwong1: Yes; you're welcome to file a bug
<cwong1> lool: ok..  Thanks.
<lool> against ubuntu-meta
<lool> cwong1: Will be fixed by next ubuntu-meta upload (committed in our tree)
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-03-13
<mboman> is it possible to try out UME in a VMware machine?
<dholbach> good morning
<lool> IRC meeting in 3 hours IIUC
<smagoun> lool: davidm: has anyone on your team run into a problem with builds in the last day? One of our nightlies just failed, it looks like debconf-1.5.20 is broken and/or incompatible with MIC.
<lool> smagoun: Did you hear about the libc breakage?
<smagoun> lool: no, please do tell
<dholbach> https://launchpad.net/bugs/201673
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 201673 in glibc "Hardy: "invalid pointer: 0xb7ef4b70" no program will start." [Critical,Fix released] 
<lool> smagoun: libc6 has a critical bug over night which triggerred crashes in many applications
<smagoun> lool: that is unfortunate.
<lool> smagoun: Check your log, if it mentions the broken version, it's likely to have broken your build
<lool> smagoun: It is :)
<smagoun> lool: my log is fairly useless, but rerunning by hand reveals the malloc error during install of debconf, so....looks like I'm in the same boat as everyone else
<lool> smagoun: Upgrade libc6 in your chroot by dpkg-deb-ing on top of i
<lool> it
<lool> dpkg-deb -x libc6_blah.deb /srv/yourchroot
<lool> It should fix the libc, then you can fix the chroot
<lool> I think 2.7-9ubuntu2 is the fixed version
<smagoun> lool: thanks. I'm just going to write off the broken build, it's not critical. This is why I like snapshots. :)
<lool> smagoun: I think it's the first time ever Ubuntu breaks as badly
<lool> I think some blog posts and mails went out to tell people how to fix broken systems
<smagoun> lool: this may the first time ubuntu is broken this badly (and just before beta - who is in charge??), but it's hardly the first time I've been unable to create an image because of a problem in Ubuntu.
<DarkRaven> ..
<ouellettesr> Hello I wonder if someone can help me, I just installed the pakage ubuntu-mobile, but i cannot figure out how to start it
<agoliveira> ouellettesr: A good way to start is read the faq: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/FAQ and everything from above :)
<ouellettesr> agoliveira, i should have expected an answer like that, i guess i should have clarified a bit. I read the faq and i am still a bit confused. do i have to create my own disk image or is there a way of starting it as an app from my current installation
<AtomicPunk> ouellettesr: it has to be an image, I believe it's either Live CD or USB key, or installable CD or USB key
<AtomicPunk> ubuntu-mobile is a whole platform
<lool> smagoun: it might hard*l*y the first time that hardy is borken for debootstrap (SCNR)
<agoliveira> ouellettesr: You can do both. In any case, you can use a device or run it from a chroot. Check out moblin-image-creator.
<lool> smagoun: The reason it's quite grave is that it prevents you from upgrading (or even booting!) to fix it :)
<ouellettesr> ok thanks everyone :)
<lool> mjg59: Hmm did you push the hildon 2.0 updates to hardy or ppa?
<sodarock_laptop2> Is there a meeting going on?
<lool> #startmeeting
<MootBot> Meeting started at 17:00. The chair is lool.
<MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
<praj-laptop> sodarock_laptop2: the meeting got pushed to 10. it should start now
<lool> sodarock_laptop2: There is now :)
<lool> Hi everybody, hope everybody is doing fine
<rustyl_> morning all
<tonyespy> KenKC: like this
<lool> NB: amitk will be 5 minutes late
<agoliveira> Hi all
<lool> I'll chair the meeting this week as David is in another one
<rustyl_> what was the URL for the wiki with the agenda?
<tremolux> 'lo
<lool> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/Meeting/20080313
 * agoliveira proposes that every action today should be given to amitk :)
<lool> We'll start by reviewing last weeks action items
<lool> [topic] patm to to produce boot charts for squashfs vs ext3 for hardy CB by 13 March. [cted]
<amitk> agoliveira: I'm back to thwart your sinister plans
<MootBot> New Topic:  patm to to produce boot charts for squashfs vs ext3 for hardy CB by 13 March. [cted] 
<lool> I fear patm is going to be in the same call as DannyZ 
<lool> err davidm
<lool> sorry DannyZ 
<agoliveira> Damn... 
<lool> patm: Are you around?
<patm> I am 
<lool> Oh cool
<patm> but with no boot chart
<lool> Hmm
<patm> Please carry forward, sorry
<lool> patm: Should put this on someone else's shoulders?
<patm> lool, no I will keep it, but we moved a deliverable to this week, so needs to be later
<lool> [action] patm to to produce boot charts for squashfs vs ext3 for hardy CB by 13 March. [cted] [cted]
<MootBot> ACTION received:  patm to to produce boot charts for squashfs vs ext3 for hardy CB by 13 March. [cted] [cted] 
<lool> [topic] davidm & agoliveira to look at what asac provides and get script written by 13 March that does conversion of .po files to xpi structures. [cted]
<MootBot> New Topic:  davidm & agoliveira to look at what asac provides and get script written by 13 March that does conversion of .po files to xpi structures. [cted] 
<lool> davidm didn't manage to work on this last week; he said he would look over the WE
<lool> agoliveira: I'll let you report directly:
<agoliveira> Same here. Took more time than expected for Asac provide us with the examples we required and I had a very short week last week.
<agoliveira> So, please, push it forward.
<lool> I'm carrying on the action; it should be escalated if no progress is made next week as we're nearing the release of hardy and asac needs these
<lool> [action] davidm & agoliveira to look at what asac provides and get script written by 13 March that does conversion of .po files to xpi structures. [cted] [cted]
<MootBot> ACTION received:  davidm & agoliveira to look at what asac provides and get script written by 13 March that does conversion of .po files to xpi structures. [cted] [cted] 
<lool> [topic] kyleN to prepare a mapping of hildon source packages to gettext domains, and list where the gettext domains are in maemo. [cted]
<MootBot> New Topic:  kyleN to prepare a mapping of hildon source packages to gettext domains, and list where the gettext domains are in maemo. [cted] 
<kyleN> since gettext domains can be set programmatically, there's no absolute way to derive all for a package programmatically. However, I wrote a python tool that gets 90% of the way for an arbitrary/editable set of packages
<kyleN> I have a list of the gettext domains for hildon pkgs
<lool> Cool; is it published somewhere?  Did you manage to output a mini-map?
<kyleN> I have not had a chance to create a deb for it. this is a very busy week for us here...
<lool> kyleN: "I have a list of the gettext domains for hildon pkgs" => which one?  the one telling which gettext domains they use or the one they provide?
<kyleN> lool, i can email it to you if you are interested
<lool> kyleN: Doesn't need to be packaged IMO
<lool> kyleN: I think you should publish it on the wiki as an attachment to langpack research page
<kyleN> the onees they use
<lool> Where we identified this as a prereq
<kyleN> I have not yet done the second half: mapping to upstream
<lool> Ok; shall I carry on with this part only?
<kyleN> yes
<lool> [action] kyleN to attach his python script to list gettext domains in use in hildon modules on the langpack research page
<MootBot> ACTION received:  kyleN to attach his python script to list gettext domains in use in hildon modules on the langpack research page 
<kyleN> python script plus glade file
<kyleN> and helper files
<lool> [action] kyleN to enhance his python script looking into hildon modules to build a map of where the gettext templates are stored
<MootBot> ACTION received:  kyleN to enhance his python script looking into hildon modules to build a map of where the gettext templates are stored 
<lool> [topic] kyleN to look into hildon-help; what's is useful for and whether we should package it for UME
<MootBot> New Topic:  kyleN to look into hildon-help; what's is useful for and whether we should package it for UME 
<lool> kyleN: Tell us all about it!
<kyleN> sorr - haven't had a chance to hit this one yet...
<kyleN> please carry over
<lool> Okay
<lool> [action] kyleN to look into hildon-help; what's is useful for and whether we should package it for UME [cted]
<MootBot> ACTION received:  kyleN to look into hildon-help; what's is useful for and whether we should package it for UME [cted] 
<lool> [topic] lool review progress on Hildon 2.0 updates next week
<MootBot> New Topic:  lool review progress on Hildon 2.0 updates next week 
<lool> So, I'm supposed to be an example here, and *cough*, I only have hildon-control-panel ready but not even pushed to our bzr repo
<lool> I finished pulling the update this afternoon and will push it after the meeting
<bfiller> lool: no progress on my end, too busy with customer release, hopefully I'll have some time next week
<lool> agoliveira missed the action item which was assigned to him when he was away (during last meeting)
<lool> smagoun: did you manage?
<smagoun> lool: no progress on my end, too busy with customer release, hopefully I'll have some time next week
<lool> bspencer: Did Horace manage to do one or two?
<lool> smagoun: You copy-pasted that!
<lool> :)
<smagoun> lool: yes. We have the same boss.
<lool> mjg59: I think you did at least hildon-theme-layout-4 in bzr
<lool> Which is the only one you had to do!  100%!
<bspencer> lool:  I just got in and saw his email.  I haven't tried it out yet.  But he said he had done something
<bspencer> lool: oh, sorry.  I am talking about something else.
<bspencer> lool:  I don't know of his status for porting Hildon 2.0   I'll check 
<lool> bspencer: Please check with him
<lool> It looks like everybody was too busy to do all of it
<lool> I personally took some notes of the steps I followed and will add them to the wiki page
<lool> [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/Hildon2%2e0
<MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/Hildon2%2e0 
<lool> I guess we'll have to carry over
<lool> [action] lool review progress on Hildon 2.0 updates next week [cted]
<MootBot> ACTION received:  lool review progress on Hildon 2.0 updates next week [cted] 
<lool> [topic] sabotage to provide drafts of themes tools guide and implementation options as links on the mailing-list
<MootBot> New Topic:  sabotage to provide drafts of themes tools guide and implementation options as links on the mailing-list 
<lool> Hmm where's sabotage and where's mawhalen?
<lool> Anyone from Intel can comment on this or grab the relevant people?
<bspencer> I'll get sabotage... I don't know about mawhalen.  Let's postpone this agenda item for 20mins
<lool> Yes
<lool> bspencer: Thanks
<lool> [topic] ToddBrandt to turn on moblin-settings-daemon's watching of the gtk theme gconf keys
<MootBot> New Topic:  ToddBrandt to turn on moblin-settings-daemon's watching of the gtk theme gconf keys 
<lool> ToddBrandt: Did you have a change to work on enabling it?
<lool> or ToddBrandtClone perhaps?
<ToddBrandtClone> oh, oy, actually I haven't done that yet
<lool> Hmm ok
<ToddBrandtClone> I'll do that today, sorry
<lool> Bad you
<ToddBrandtClone> yea, I know, the bugs took priority
<lool> Carrying to check about it next week
<kyleN> please note that we are very intested in this as it appears necessary to get gtk theme switching working
<lool> ToddBrandtClone: ack
<lool> [action] ToddBrandt to turn on moblin-settings-daemon's watching of the gtk theme gconf keys [cted]
<MootBot> ACTION received:  ToddBrandt to turn on moblin-settings-daemon's watching of the gtk theme gconf keys [cted] 
<lool> [topic] rustyl (+ lool if necessary) document release process for Moblin modules
<MootBot> New Topic:  rustyl (+ lool if necessary) document release process for Moblin modules 
 * ToddBrandtClone hangs head in shame
<lool> So AFAIK, this happened
<lool> congrats to rustyl_ 
<lool> He managed to do tarball releases of almost all moblin projects I think
<lool> rustyl_: kudos to you!
<rustyl_> k
<lool> rustyl_: I personally had in mind that there would be some kind of process document on moblin.org for module maintainers, but perhaps you have an internal one, to release subsequent tarballs?
<rustyl_> we are working on a presentation
<bfiller> lool: are there plans to incorporate CDBS into debian/rules so we can make patches?
<rustyl_> it just isn't ready yet
<lool> bfiller: Yes; I think we'll discuss this in "(lool) Rebasing on the Moblin released tarballs"
<lool> bfiller: Just after that
<bfiller> lool: thanks
<lool> rustyl_: Ok; well thanks for the efforts; I'm around to help you succeed in defining/documenting the process
<lool> rustyl_: I'd also like to talk to moving to these new tarballs now, but I made this a separate topic
<rustyl_> yea, this needs some discussion
<lool> Moving on to current items for today's meeting
<lool> Hmm I'll flip two because one is easier
<lool> [topic] (lool) Launchpad bugs, ubuntu-mobile subscription, and ume tag
<MootBot> New Topic:  (lool) Launchpad bugs, ubuntu-mobile subscription, and ume tag 
<lool> EVERYBODY (that's you) please add the ume tag to LP bugs which concern UME
<lool> And subscribe the ubuntu-mobile LP team to them
<rustyl_> lool, is there a way to apply a tag to a collection of bugs?
<lool> This is to help everybody keep track of important bugs we have to follow for UME and derived projects
<lool> rustyl_: Excellent question, I think not
<rustyl_> or do you have to go through each and every bug
<rustyl_> darn
<lool> rustyl_: This would seem to suck
<lool> rustyl_: You might be able to set it via email though
 * rustyl_ looks to see if his moblin-media bugs are tagged already
<lool> rustyl_: We have some hacked up python bindings to deal with bug reports though
<lool> rustyl_: Perhaps you can use these to do as you desire?
<lool> rustyl_: "python-launchpad-bugs"
 * sabotage hears his name being taken in vain
<rustyl_> i'll read about it
<lool> rustyl_: But please file a feature request if you can't find the tagging feature you're looking for
<rustyl_> ok
<lool> rustyl_: You'd have to file it against "malone", that's the launchpad bug tracker
<lool> sabotage: Thanks for coming; I'll reopen your topic now then
<lool> So please everybody tag and subscribe!
<lool> And file bugs, don't discuss issues via email or IRC :)
<lool> [topic] sabotage to provide drafts of themes tools guide and implementation options as links on the mailing-list
<MootBot> New Topic:  sabotage to provide drafts of themes tools guide and implementation options as links on the mailing-list 
<lool> sabotage: Tears flows on my face: no themes tools guide this week?
<bspencer> s/don't discuss issues via email or IRC/don't discuss issues JUST via email or IRC
<lool> bspencer: Right
<lool> Mention the bug in your email :)
<sabotage> ok, so I dropped the ball this week, but I've identified the wiki that I will be publishing it in
<lool> sabotage: Do you need any help to publish the guide?
<sabotage> can you make days longer?
<lool> And your thoughts on implementation options?
<lool> sabotage: I can keep you up longer before you're allowed to sleep :)
<sabotage> honestly, I've been completely swamped with another project, so I just need to kick it out for visibility
 * sabotage was up till 1:30am last night as it is
<lool> sabotage: Please try to push this out this week -- even a draft
<sabotage> yep, ball is already rolling
<lool> Cool
<lool> [action] sabotage to provide drafts of themes tools guide and implementation options as links on the mailing-list [cted]
<MootBot> ACTION received:  sabotage to provide drafts of themes tools guide and implementation options as links on the mailing-list [cted] 
<sabotage> is HappyCamp on?
<lool> Resuming on next item to discuss
<lool> [topic] (lool) Rebasing on the Moblin released tarballs
<MootBot> New Topic:  (lool) Rebasing on the Moblin released tarballs 
<bspencer> sodarock
<sabotage> HappyCamp, HappyCamp_ubuntu  need you to read my email and set me up
<lool> So, we have these cool Moblin tarballs
<sabotage> this will get the theme guide moving
<lool> We should move to using them
<lool> rustyl_: I'm not sure I made this clear enough, but one thing which we want to keep is Intel publishing its releases all the way down to the ppa
<rustyl_> lool, i understand
<lool> But the transition frmo the current mode to the mode where we use tarballs needs a little extra efforts
<bspencer> rustyl_: lool:   how does that work again, with ubuntu adding patches on their own?
<lool> It's similar in spirit to the Hildon 2.0 modules transition
<rustyl_> and there is confusion on our end
 * bspencer confesses a bit of confusion :)
<lool> bspencer: The idea is that we put patches in debian/patches; when a new upstream release comes out and you push it to the ppa, you drop the debian/patches which have been merged upstream and port the other ones
<lool> rustyl_: Where is the confusion?
<bspencer> lool:  ok.  I understand.  I missed that patches change
<lool> This will make the Ubuntu/ppa specific changes into separate patches, and easy to rebase on the next release
<rustyl_> lool, If you gave everyone a written test that made them explain exactly what commands/steps you need to do go from "i have a new tarball release" to "i am now calling dput to push to the ppa", i'm afraid most intel people would fail the test
<ToddBrandtClone> Do each of the project owners need to upload their source to the hardy ppa for each release still or has this been streamlined
<lool> rustyl_: Ok, the cool thing is that it's going to be very easy
 * ToddBrandtClone Todd trumps bspencer's confusion
<lool> Once we get it done *once*
<lool> Subsequent updates are going to be easy
<GrueMaster> i fail.
<lool> ToddBrandtClone: We would like project owners to please continue doing so
<ToddBrandtClone> lool: ok, our source repo layout has changed so I guess I have some more questions for rusty
<lool> It's so damn easy that it's basically: dget -x the current ppa source, uupdate with the new tarball, update the packaging and patches, upload
<ToddBrandtClone> rusty_: do we have a HARDY branch now in addition to GASTON?
<rustyl_> ToddBrandt, the packaging for hardy is not in the source repository
<rustyl_> ToddBrandt, that hardy branch is now defunct 
<ToddBrandtClone> rustyl_: yea but we still haev to use the debian tools to create the source package, which require the debian dir, which is no longer in master
<lool> ToddBrandtClone: Exactly, that dir you retrieve from the ppa each time you plan an upload
<lool> ToddBrandtClone: It might have been updated by other folks, for example me
<ToddBrandtClone> ahhh
<ToddBrandtClone> the missing piece, I'm learning, gotcha
<rustyl_> yeap, that's the idea
<lool> If you prefer, instead of "uupdate" you simply "copy over the debian/"; it should end up being the same
<ToddBrandtClone> k, thx
<lool> This is the *target* process
<lool> Before this, we need to add support for debian/patches/ in each package
<lool> mjg59 did it in hildon-theme-layout-4
<ToddBrandtClone> ok, so until then we create the hardy packages like before
<lool>   * Add simple-patchsys from CDBS
<lool>   * Build-depend on CDBS
<lool> That's his changelog entry
<lool> What we did in debian/rules:
<lool> - he added:
<lool> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/simple-patchsys.mk
<rustyl_> we several things on moblin that need to do a new release, so we have some projects to try to run through the new process
<lool> - he changed the dependencies of the targets to apply/unapply the patches:
<lool> build: apply-patches build-stamp
<lool> This means applying the patches is a prereq for the build
<lool> You might have to rename clean: to clean:: as simple-patchsys.mk defines it as well
<lool> This is all it takes to add debian/patches support
 * agoliveira is happy that the word "quilt" didn't make into this conversation so far :)
<lool> The other thing to do is to compare the Ubuntu ppa tree to the moblin release it claims to base on to see which changes were done since this moblin release
<bfiller> lool: do moblin folks take the patches in debian/patches and incorporate them into the source and remove the patches?
<lool> These changes should be converted to debian/patches/*.patch files
<lool> bfiller: The person authoring the patch should take care to send it to moblin folks
<rustyl_> bfiller, i think incorporating existing packages before making a release is a good goal
<lool> Moblin folks are naturally welcome to look from time to time if there would be interesting patches which failed the upstreaming process
<lool> Does anybody has any question on how it will work and what remains to be done?
<rustyl_> it makes a nice way to send a patch.... send an email to the maintainer with moblin devel list cc'ed, and at the same time upload the patch to the ppa
<bfiller> lool: so if I had a patch, I would put the patch in debian/patches, upload to the ppa and also send the patch to moblin?
<lool> Perhaps we should file a bug instead of mailing the maintainer?
<lool> rustyl_: Would that work for you?
<ToddBrandtClone> I vote for mailing the maintainer, that info would be very useful
<lool> bfiller: Perhaps opening a bug is more logical than using email
<lool> ToddBrandtClone: Doesn't the maintainer get an email for new bugs?
<rustyl_> yes, filling a bug is good
<rustyl_> the maintainer will get the mail via launchpad
<davidm>  Can do both but filing a bug is important,  and has been requested by Don Johnson.
<ToddBrandtClone> ok
<davidm> Need tracking
<rustyl_> but we need to cc the devel list for potential discussion on the patch
<lool> rustyl_: I think that's a logical escalation when a bug fix isn't consensual indeed
<lool> (or any change, not necessarily a bug fix)
<lool> Should I document what we just discussed on a wiki page? (how tarball releases work down to the ppa and how patches are added+sent back)?
<davidm> lool, yes please
<ToddBrandtClone> yes
<rustyl_> yes
<cwong1> +1
<lool> [action] lool to document tarball release + ppa upload process and patch addition + submission process
<MootBot> ACTION received:  lool to document tarball release + ppa upload process and patch addition + submission process 
<davidm> Just out of the other meeting, sorry I'm late.
<lool> Ok; last thing to discuss on the topic is who is going to do the work to conver the ppa packages to the layout
<lool> This requires adding support for debian/patches and extracting the current ppa-only changes as patch files
<lool> I propose we split that like the Hildon 2.0 modules
<lool> Does that work for everybody?
<lool> rustyl_: Would you be willing to participate?
<lool> Who from Intel would be willing to take a share?
<lool> Everybody I guess! :)
<rustyl_> lool, if somebody does the first package, then I would be happy to do (or delegate) several of the other packages
<bspencer> mawhalen -- since she's not here.
<lool> rustyl_: deal
<rustyl_> i just need the first package to cookbook from
<rustyl_> and by several, i mean i can find people to do all the rest of the moblin projects
<lool> rustyl_: I'll mail you with the steps I follow for a sample package, you will split the work amongst Intel people for some modules you'll list me and the others we shall do?
<lool> rustyl_: Cool
<lool> [action] lool to send rustyl_ steps to update ppa packages for the new tarball based release process
<MootBot> ACTION received:  lool to send rustyl_ steps to update ppa packages for the new tarball based release process 
<lool> [action] rustyl_ to assign ppa packages updates for the new tarball based release process
<MootBot> ACTION received:  rustyl_ to assign ppa packages updates for the new tarball based release process 
<lool> Does anybody have any question on this?
<rustyl_> yea
<rustyl_> what 'project' to i write launchpad bugs against?
<rustyl_> 'launchpad' doesn't work
<lool> rustyl_: To report the malone bug?
<rustyl_> to report the 'i want to assign a tag to a couple hundred bugs at once' feature request
<lool> rustyl_: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/+filebug select "Project" type "malone" and search
<lool> s/search/choose
<rustyl_> what is malone?
<lool> As I was saying earlier, it's the Launchpad bug tracking subproject
<rustyl_> got it
<lool> rustyl_: https://launchpad.net/projects/?text=launchpad 
<lool> rustyl_: You'll see "Launchpad Bugs"
<rustyl_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/malone/+bug/201874
<lool> It's technical/unix name is "malone"
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 201874 in malone "Need ability to apply tag to a collection of bugs" [Undecided,New] 
<lool> rustyl_: Tada
<bfiller> slightly obscure, I'd say :)
<bfiller> malone, that is
<rustyl_> it keeps thing mysterious
<bfiller> good way to keep people from filing bugs :)
<GrueMaster> Nah, it's perfectly intuitive.
<lool> Let's end the meeting in a mysterious way then!
<agoliveira> rustyl_: Santa Rosa? Diamondville? McAslin?
<agoliveira> :)
<lool> [endmeeting] malone! soyuz!
<lool> #endmeeting
<MootBot> Meeting finished at 17:51.
<rustyl_> i sl8r
<lool> told you it would be mysterious
<lool> Thanks everybody for attending
<amitk> jayc: I have rebased the ume trees on zinc. Looking at your merged ACPI_VIDEO patch next.
<jay> amitk: thanks
<jay> amitk: once that ACPI_VIDEO thing is clear to me I will upload moblin new patches to ume.
<agoliveira> mjg59: When are you arriving in Recife?
<anoikis> hi there
<anoikis> any polish here?
<anoikis> nie macie kurwa co robi chyba
<anoikis> i z zwiazku z tym nic nie robicie
<anoikis> bez sensu:D
<mjg59> lool: just bzr,  haven't uploaded it yet
<mjg59> agoliveira: tomorrow
<agoliveira> mjg59: Nice. I was able to manage go there and I'm leaving tomorrow afternoon. See you there then.
<lool> mjg59: Okely
<lool> Mithrandir: Could you please add me to the ChanServ access list for #ubuntu-mobile?
<Mithrandir> lool: done
<lool> Mithrandir: thanks!
<lool> Mithrandir: Whois markuman BTW?
<Mithrandir> no idea, some guy who registered the channel ages ago and wanted to use it for something laptop-related.
<Mithrandir> I prodded some freenode people to get it transferred to us, but didn't have the time to push it through
<inuka_desk> smagoun, ping..
<smagoun> inuka_desk: what's up?
<inuka_desk> samgoun, you get the 3 drivers from arms right?
<inuka_desk> smagoun, do you get modified libraries of mesa with that ?
<smagoun> inuka_desk: which 3 drivers?
<inuka_desk> sorry 3d  drivers for poulsbo
<smagoun> inuka_desk: I get 3d drivers and a libgl1-mesa-dri-psb from ARMS
<smagoun> that's the only mesa library I get though
<inuka_desk> smagoun, you dont happen to use the mesa src that you get from arms right? (assumming you get an updated mesa src)
<smagoun> inuka_desk: I don't think we've been pulling mesa source
<inuka_desk> smagoun, thanks for the info
<smagoun> inuka_desk: am I supposed to pull mesa source from arms?
<inuka_desk> smagoun, I think so, I will let you know once I know for sure. 
<smagoun> inuka_desk: ok, thanks
<davidm> mjg59, are you calling in?
<mjg59> davidm: Just done so
<inuka_desk> smagoun, FYI you do have to build the mesa src and install the binaries for the 3d poulsbo stuff to work correctly. If not there will be performance issues.
<smagoun> inuka_desk: ok, that's really good to know. Do you have any plans to push the mesa changes to the PPA?
<inuka_desk> smagoun, no not for now anyway
<smagoun> hmm. Ok, I'll take a look at it. Thanks for the info
<inuka_desk> smagoun, np
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-03-14
<dholbach> good morning
<asac> davidm: i read in backlog that you will work a bit on po2xpi over weekend?
<asac> davidm: would be great it have it on monday, because the launchpad export side is ready and we want to start a more or large scale test before they cherry-pick it to production
<davidm> asac, I'm going to have a look at it. See if I can get something working
<asac> great
<davidm> asac, have you tested the mid-browser with the jave plugin?
<asac> jave? java you mean?
<asac> which java plugin is of concern here?
<asac> (we have about 4 in the archive iirc)
<davidm> icedtea
<davidm> Yea Java sorry typo
<davidm> Unless there is one you know to work correctly.
<asac> davidm: works here
<asac> any special usecases/applets you are worried about?
<davidm> Just heard about a possible issue from Intel, so I thought I'd ask if you knew of any issues before I start tracking this down.
<davidm> Nothing to get excited about yet. :-)
<asac> except that its currently not installed automatically if you install the plugin package it works well here.
<asac> it isn't installed by default because we thought we'd go for xulrunner 1.9. its a bit of tedious though. apparently we cannot use xulrunner-1.9 so we basically have two options now:
<asac> special xulrunner 1.9 for mobile
<asac> or providing the complete sdk out of the midbrowser build
<asac> we should file a beta milestone bug about icedtea not getting installed so this will be fixed next week
<davidm> which would you recommend, because we do have to have this working very soon
<asac> yes i know
<asac> i think we should try to get midbrowser provide the sdk
<asac> i will vouch for the code duplication we get here (which was a blocker for moving this to main imo)
<davidm> OK, what are the correct next steps?
<asac> i currently getting latest midbroser from git
<asac> and see if the sdk builds fine
<davidm> asac, thanks
<asac> will let you know in an hour or so
<asac> davidm: which mobile core applications do currently use a gecko rendering engine?
<asac> the home screen, right? anything else?
<davidm> the home screen, yes, the rest, lets ask Mithrandir 
<Mithrandir> just the home screen and midbrowser, I think.
<lool> Perhaps liferea as well
<lool> Yeah, liferea is pulled by ubuntu-mobile and uses xulrunner
<lool> asac: ^
<asac> ok
<asac> if the sdk provided by midbrowser we should be able to use that quite easily
<asac> the -dev package has to conflict the xul one of course to achieve this
<lool> asac: I didn't understand why we can't use xulrunner for midbrowser/icedtea?
<asac> i didn't say that we can't use xulrunner for building icedtea
<asac> problem is that intel is patching xulrunner to get quick fixes for features they need
<asac> i have no strong argument against that given the pressure on this
<asac> anyway ... we cannot use those patches and build firefox on top of it
<lool> asac: Could we merge their patches?
<asac> (trademark issues)
<lool> asac: Otherwise, we could push xulrunner in the ppa
<asac> lool: the patches are far tooo hacky
<asac> lool: maintenance is too hard.
<asac> we don't even have patches ... its all just in the main dev tree
<lool> Well that's not ok
<asac> i tried to hold them back from doing that
<asac> but whatever i said, two weeks later they appear to get pressure from inside intel and just do it
<asac> just blind guessing. 
<lool> I see
<asac> imo its ok to use midbrowser as an sdk
<asac> as long as we get to the point where the patches against midbrowser xulrunner are good enough to be included in the real xulrunner
<asac> but i just don't have the time to redo the fixes in a proper fashion
<asac> s/fixes/hacks/
<asac> lool: you use midbrowser 0.3 from ppa right?
<asac> lool: is the reload toolbar icon smaller than the others
<asac> or is that a regression in latest git?
<asac> lool: davidm: ok, looks like the sdk is properly build - except for the .pc files, which we would need to integrated into the browser/installer directory (if we want to do htis upstream) ... or just ship them from debian/
<asac> so without testing it appears to be an option
<GrueMaster> FYI:  Skye 2.0 with video chat released today.  
<lool> asac: Could you /c
<asac> lool: ?
<asac> i am about to leave
<dholbach> who should I assign bluetooth sponsorings bugs to?
<vignatti> hi guys
<vignatti> I'm facing a strange noise here in my macbook
<vignatti> it's kind a beep which certainly _doesn't_ comes from the speaker
<vignatti> everty time I put a cd in its drive the noise disappears
<vignatti> so I saw in apple forum that whenever some components will be turned off is normal to hear some noise
<vignatti> unfortunately I'm hearing it all the time (when no cd in is the drive)
<vignatti> so I remembered that I recently gutsy updated the kernel version
<vignatti> so, it could be possible that ubuntu is doing something to turn some components off all the time that can be causing that crap noise?
<GrueMaster> vignatti:  This forum is mainly for a special flavor of Ubuntu for mobile internet devices, like the Samsung Q1 Ultra.  You should ask on #ubuntu to see if someone there knows the answer, as you are probably running the desktop edition, not something designed for tablets and small systems.
<vignatti> GrueMaster: okay. Thank you man.
<slytherin> anyone working on updating bluez-* packages? I can take up bluez-gnome.
<rustyl> _
<rustyl_> ls
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-03-15
 * davidm is away: I'm busy
<mboman> Hi
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-03-16
<pwnguin> is the image creater still the best way to test on non lpia devices?
<nrp> was it ever the best way for that?
<pwnguin> from my experiences, no
<pwnguin> so how should i go about this then?
<pwnguin> the wiki page suggests that image builder is the preferred way
<nrp> i've just been installing ubuntu server and the ubuntu-mobile package
<nrp> i couldnt get the image builder to work
<pwnguin> heh
<pwnguin> for advanced uses, see qemu
<virtuald> i take it that UWE isn't anywhere near ready to be used still
<virtuald> UME
<pwnguin> it wasn't very ready for gutsy, im setting up another chroot right now for hardy
<virtuald> ah
<pwnguin> i guess it depends on how you define ready to be used
<virtuald> well, my goal is to keep it outside of the chroot, and use it in my carputer ... i was thinking of creating a set of touchscreen friendly apps
<virtuald> but then i found this :)
<pwnguin> ready to hack on
<pwnguin> maybe not ready to replace your daily activities
<virtuald> meh
<virtuald> no daily activities at this time 
<pwnguin> interesting. im looking at this for my tablte
<virtuald> :)
<pwnguin> tablet
<virtuald> yeah, i originally installed gentoo on it... but that got annoying
<pwnguin> heh
<virtuald> http://www.virtualroadside.com/carputer/pictures.html
<virtuald> its a mini-itx system, with a 7in touchscreen
<virtuald> i've been hacking on xorg all week, fixing the stupid input hotplugging problems with it
<pwnguin> hah
<pwnguin> cardboard box
<virtuald> yeah, that was Rev 0.1
<virtuald> :)
<pwnguin> you should try swapping the stereo head unit for it ;)
<virtuald> yeah, i thought about that
<virtuald> however, then i wouldn't have audio
<pwnguin> no audio on the mobo?
<pwnguin> i see some colored jacks
<pwnguin> what's the software it's using for maps
<virtuald> theres audio, no speakers
<virtuald> it was using roadnav
<virtuald> however, i haven't decided what this iteration is going to use
<pwnguin> debian packages?
<virtuald> no, it was in gentoo
<virtuald> i've installed hardy on it now
<virtuald> roadnav works pretty well though
<virtuald> it has some interface issues though
<pwnguin> someone else said just before you joined that they installed ubuntu-server and ubuntu-mobile
<pwnguin> instead of the chroot approach
<virtuald> yeah, i installed ubuntu-desktop.. then found this, so installed that too :)
<virtuald> despite that they probably wont co-exist
<pwnguin> ah
<pwnguin> i was about to ask about that
<virtuald> the chroot approach makes more sense for a real mobile device
<pwnguin> ?
<virtuald> that has to be flashed or something
<virtuald> er
<pwnguin> for a real device, i think you'd build an image
<virtuald> thats what i meant 
<virtuald> lol
<pwnguin> but the image builder doesn't seem to work quite naturally
<virtuald> but for me... i've got a normal system, it just has a tiny touchscreen, so it makes more sense just to have it installed
<virtuald> the audio player crashes everything however
<virtuald> its pretty sad
<pwnguin> apparently roadnav has .debs
<virtuald> cool
<virtuald> amusingly enough, i was going to hack on that last summer, and create a branch that would be more touchscreen friendly.. but made one commit and then got distracted by school and never got around to it
<pwnguin> open source is a frequent casulty of life
<virtuald> its not a particularly active project either
<virtuald> yeah, it is
<pwnguin> you know
<virtuald> is there a doc somewhere on how to integrate new apps into the hildan thing
<pwnguin> its strange how many projects i find where there's a seperate debian dir
<pwnguin> and no package in debian
<virtuald> *shrugs*
<pwnguin> in a sense, it's a failure of debian to continue absorbing upstream
<virtuald> im still getting used to debs and such... been a gentoo user for quite awhile
<virtuald> yeah, probably lack of maintainers for the obscure packages
<pwnguin> it's quite handy to seperate the build system from the distribution
<pwnguin> well, not quite a lack of maintainers
<pwnguin> sure, stuff gets orphaned, but there are quite a few debian developers
<pwnguin> my rough guess is at least a thousand
<virtuald> hm
<virtuald> lack of attention then perhaps
<virtuald> i mean, theres thousands of packages
<pwnguin> 1049 DDs according to what im reading at the last vote
<virtuald> hm
<pwnguin> i guess debian's actually moved to something akin to MOTU
<virtuald> MOTU?
<pwnguin> "masters of the universe"
<pwnguin> theres two main splits of ubuntu packages
<pwnguin> main and universe (also the closed source versions)
<virtuald> right
<pwnguin> MOTU takes care of universe
<virtuald> ah
<virtuald> makes sense i suppose
<virtuald> there is one nasty catch with roadnav
<virtuald> it doesn't do one-way streets
<virtuald> because of the map data it has doesn't denote them
<pwnguin> heh
<virtuald> and i just moved to boston (tons of one-way tiny streets), so i've been looking into other options
<pwnguin> you can see garmin from my house
<pwnguin> i know tons of people who work for them
<pwnguin> they mostly buy someone elses map software
<virtuald> haha
<virtuald> google earth can do GPS, but that version costs money
<virtuald> so.. then ubuntu-mobile is (essentially) something that can be installed instead of ubuntu-desktop then?
<virtuald> as opposed to just being a set of packages
<pwnguin> looks like it
<virtuald> different kernel too?
<pwnguin> technically, i think they're working on a new arch
<pwnguin> lpia
<virtuald> ah
<pwnguin> but its x86 compatible
<virtuald> k, i saw that somewhere, so i was wondering
<pwnguin> so the idea behind the arch is that they recompile for efficiency
<virtuald> i see
<pwnguin> hrm. apparently the terminal application is installed, but ubuntu-mobile doesn't bring in xterm
<virtuald> well, hopefully the mobile stuff will work out nicely :)
<virtuald> it looks like a great interface on the surface
<virtuald> im out though, nite
<pwnguin> is there any other repo for moblin packages besides the main ubuntu archive?
<pwnguin> i look at the webpage for mobile edition and the screenshots suggest more applications than im seeing currently
<slytherin> Mithrandir: are you planning to update bluez-utils and bluez-gnome to latest version? They contain bug fixes.
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-03-09
<silver_swords> hi all
<silver_swords> does mid work on blackberry bold 9000 ?
<silver_swords> mid = ubuntu mobile
<CoolirisFox> hi all
<CoolirisFox> I've installed ubuntu mobile and now I've lost all gnome settings :(
<CoolirisFox> please  help
<sirderigo> good morning, 
<sirderigo> i have a htc 2125 smartphone, it have a 200 mhz procesor and 64 mb of ram, someone know if it can run ubuntu mobile?
<persia> I suspect it can, but I wouldn't recommend it.  People reporting on the 200MHz nslu2 say it's *really* slow.  Poeple using 416MHz and 64MB ram have reported it being acceptable, but tend to look for custom environments.
<persia> Personally, I think with less than 800MHz and 128MB, you're likely to be unhappy, and you'd want 256MB ram for a decent experience.  Less than 800x600 is hard too, on the display side.
<sirderigo> persia, thanks
<sirderigo> what about openmoko
<ogra> the slug is not only really slow, it requires a special hacked up kernel to even run with the 30M the slug has
<ogra> beyond that an install on it takes more than 8h
<ogra> (but arm discussion should really go to #ubuntu-arm and not take place here)
<CarlFK> I have a touch screen with both usb and serial.  stock ubuntu install, usb works; serial doesn't.  I need to get the serial working, not sure where to start
<CarlFK> I am working with jaunty.
<persia> CarlFK, serial doesn't hotplug: you probably have to force hal to know about the device in some way.
<CarlFK> persia: I figured something like that.  any clue how?
<persia> Unfortunately, no.  The only serial device I use is connected via USB, and I use that USB hotplug event to hotplug it.
<ogra> for serial you likely need to poke around in xorg.conf, specify the driver etc
<ogra> i'm unsure that actually works without disabling hal input completely though
<CarlFK> oh my
<CarlFK> there are a bunch of kiosk machines built with different hardware.  trying to come up with a config that will work on any 
<ogra> you might be able to tell hal to use it with a rather complicated .fdi file that points to the device and sets the parameters
<ogra> have a look at the evtouch initscript and .fdi files 
<ogra> that mechanism might work with serial as well
<CarlFK> oddly enough I don't have xserver-xorg-input-evtouch installed 
<ogra> you shouldnt in jaunty
<ogra> i still didnt manage to fix it yet, so its not in the metapackage atm
<CarlFK> good.  I was hoping that wasn't some sort of fluke
<CarlFK> er
<ogra> the binary is broken, the scripts are fine though
<ogra> (teh driver doesnt pick up movement events atm, the setup is ok)
<CarlFK> lshal gives me 3 entries for it plus everything else - what's the lshal option to give me just the 3?
<CarlFK> udi = '/org/freedesktop/Hal/devices/usb_device_4e7_20_20E33814'   "...._if0"  "..._logicaldev_input"
<CarlFK> I also need to figure out how to <match key="info.udi" contains="_20E33814_if0_logicaldev_input">  that isn't keyed on serial number
<lassegul> Hi. im wondering where go-home-applet gets its icon from, and how can i change it?
<lassegul> im not wondering anymore. found out it uses icon-theme/24x24/places/distributor-logo.png . thx guys!
<juliux> hi
<juliux> is it already possible to use ubuntu at a n800?
<juliux> if yes i am a happy beta tester;)
<juliux> could it be that ubuntu-desktop on ports.ubuntu.com for n8xx is broken atm?
<juliux> i have unmet dependencies there
<persia> juliux, It oughtn't be broken.  What unmetdeps do you find?
<persia> juliux, Also, we tend to focus on ubuntu-mid and ubuntu-netbook-remix here.  If you are looking for general support for arm, #ubuntu-arm is probably a better channel.
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-03-10
<juliux> persia: thxs
<persia> ian_brasil, Did you ever get a chance to update gypsy?
<ian_brasil> persia: not yet...he book is consuming all my spare cycles but i promise to do it as soon as i can..and thanks for the comments and the diff
<persia> ian_brasil, There's a team working to prep all the moblin packages not yet in Ubuntu in a PPA for a drop into karmic later.
<persia> I've pointed out your work on gypsy, and I don't think anyone else is chasing it.
<persia> No worries if you're swamped, but if you don't have time by the end of the month or so, would you mind if someone else took a swing?
<persia> Alternately, if you have time, let me know, and I'll poke those folks to use your package.
<ian_brasil> not at all...let me write to ross/iain and see what the plans are for squeeze
<persia> Sounds good.  Migrating to the new dbus bit is probably required for squeeze, as I think that's a newer D-Bus than jaunty.
<ian_brasil> persia: lets try to get it upstream
<persia> ian_brasil, That sounds like the best plan.  Let me know if you need references or something.
<ian_brasil> thx persia i will
<persia> Good luck with your book.
<ian_brasil> thx persia..it is nearly finished now thank goodness
<lool> Folks I unseeded powernowd from unr as done in the desktop seed; I did not unseed it from mid yet as I don't think the lpia config permits this
<lool> So the same changes were done in lpia
<lool> Dropped from mid seed as well
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-03-11
<Zaraki> hola
<MrGoodkat_> why is it not possible to install mobline2 onto a sd card?
<MrGoodkat_> in the install dialog it just shows the hdd, although the livecd shows the sd card
<Cursor> hi All
<Cursor> Qestion for all of you
<Cursor> McCaslin / Menlow are both ARM platforms right?
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-03-12
<MekApels1n> Right before the release 8.10 there was a beta of ubuntu-mobile as a cd, whatever happened to that one?
<MekApels1n> I used it on my portable and it was real nice with the "new" interface, although the portable not having a touchscreen...
<lassegul> Hi. njpatel I see you are assigned to the bug #275644 . Its my understanding that the bug is fixed but you forgot to package it, correct? If so, it will be included in 1.6.12 i presume. Do you have any clues about when youll release it?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 275644 in netbook-remix "With Intrepid, Quit icons don't allow to turn off the PC anymore" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/275644
<persia> Cursor: No: McCaslin/Menlow are both lpia platforms
<persia> MekApels1n, Perhaps you mean Ubuntu UMPC, which was part of the intrepid release?
<persia> It's been replaced with Ubuntu Netbook Remix for jaunty, as there's only so much space on the image server.
<bspencer_> lool: do you know if UME ships with OpenGL?  (as opposed to OpenGL ES or neither)
<bspencer_> "ships" is perhaps not the right word
<lool> bspencer_: Well we have Mesa?!
<bspencer_> lool, yeah, OK
<bspencer_> I know Mesa implements OpenGL ... I don't know if they have an ES flavor
<lool> bspencer_: I don't know either
<lool> bspencer_: Does this answer your question or?
<lool> bspencer_: and how is it going otherwise?   :-)
<lool> I'll be back in some minutes, it's the bath time for the kid
 * lool dinner &
<spacedog> hi
<spacedog> anyone here?
<spacedog> Dave Mandala sent me
<spacedog> he wants me to help you with some stuff
<spacedog> he said to me: Spacedog, people are having a hard time using desktop user interfaces on net books, mainly because of the low screen resolution, this makes me sad :(
<spacedog> so i said to him cheer up Dave, it's not so bad, simply use the scaling feature of compiz fusion to scale a high resolution desktop to a low resolution screen, with modern antialising technology built into 3d cards it will look smoothe and give netbook users the best of both worlds 
<spacedog> Dave said that's a great idea! oh how he laughed, he sent me here to tell you guys.
<spacedog> hi!
<spacedog> and welcome to the ubuntu mobile forum!
<spacedog> I'm spacedog your freindly ubuntu mobile bot
<spacedog> friendly
<spacedog> my bad spelling is a joke by the creative programmers of ubuntu
<spacedog> get it, it looks kinda like I'm a human pretending to be a bot, but I'm really a bot after all
<spacedog> of the irony
<spacedog> oh the irony
<spacedog> uh huh huh huh, i did it again
<spacedog> well I gotta go, I'll tell dave you all said hi and interacted
<spacedog> byeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
<spacedog> <3
<spacedog> much love
<ian_brasil> ?
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-03-13
<plars> anyone here have a dell mini?
<MekApels1n> persia: thx for the answer...
<spacedog> i downloaded http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/intrepid/release/ubuntu-8.10-umpc-i386.img
<spacedog> it's a worthless peice of shit, coastered 2 cds
<ogra> hmm, i would have helped him if he would have stayed a bit longer ... despite his language
 * ogra shrugs
<plars> ogra: no kidding
<plars> would anyone here happen to have a dell mini running jaunty alphas?
<ogra> i guess there are many people running the normal alpha ... probably not the mobile flavours atm though
<ogra> (i know keybuk in #ubuntu-devel runs his bootspeed tests on a dell mini)
<plars> I'm seeing some odd behaviour with sound recording... it comes out weak and choppy when I try to record sound though either the internal mic or an attached one
<plars> just trying to determine if it's specific to the mini or other netbooks are also seeing this
<lool> plars: You could check your hardware mixers with alsamixer
<lool> Albeit it's probably a bug if you can only use that tool to do so
<plars> lool: ah... I found a good combinations of settings that seems to work, thanks.  Not sure if alsamixer was the only way to do it, but it the defaults were certainly no good
<plars> no, I guess I just got lucky one time... not working again
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-03-14
<KoS> hi =)
<KoS> did somebody install ubuntu-mobile on nokia smartphones ?
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-03-15
<jack__> Hi... I am leading a business development project to implement the an Ubuntu load into a new netbook style product using the i.MX515. David Mandala sent me here.
<jack__> He said to look for lool, ogra, and NCommander
<lool> Hi
<lool> jack__: What is it that you're working on?  (Note that this is a public channel)
<lool> jack__: Usually we have ARM related discussions on #ubuntu-arm, but it's mostly the same people
<lool> jack__: If you're trying to send private messages to people, you need to be registered with freenode "services" otherwise they wont see your messages
<pyronik> is there a way to test ubuntu mobile in a windows environment?
<lool> pyronik: Use a virtual machine
<pyronik> any recommendation
<pyronik> on a specific one, i have never dealt with VM's
<jack__> Sorry about appearing/disappearing. Again, David Mandala sent me here to hook up with lool, ogra, and NCommander about an i.MX515 based project I am leading. I would prefer either email or at least a private IRC location. Can I be emailed at jack@aboutjack.com so we can discuss what we're up to a bit, and I can hand off our starting points so you know where we are headed?
<jack__> Actually, some of my questions may be okay for this IRC group... Such as this one: "How deep is the integration into the graphics subsystem on the i.MX515; especially, how much optimization is there for the OpenGL ES 2.0 and OpenVG1.1 functionality; even more specifically, is this port going to sufficiently hit the GPU core so as to run the Compiz desktop environment?
<jack__> And... is the first gen port for ARM more along the Netbook Remix or Ubuntu Desktop model? ... We just chose the processor and got aligned with Freescale over the past few days; so, I literally know zero at this point about the Ubuntu ARM port.
<jack__> If an ARM-port guy wants to email me, or post some basic info here, I'll be back online and here in about 4-hours.
#ubuntu-mobile 2010-03-15
<dholbach> hi guys
<dholbach> does anybody of you have an idea what's wrong with bug 538718?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 538718 in python-hildondesktop "[FTBFS] python-hildondesktop fails to build in Lucid" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/538718
<dholbach> I don't quite see where the "cannot find -lssl" comes from
<dholbach> is that something that's wrong in python2.6 itself?
 * persia looks
<dholbach> persia: found anything?
<persia> No, but that's because I'm slow
<persia> dholbach: Sorry that took so long : as you noticed, it's a bit confusing :)
<dholbach> adding libssl-dev to the build-deps seems to me to be a workaround
<persia> And not one that is compatible with the code license (see my comment on the bug)
<dholbach> python2.6-dev mentions -lssl in /usr/lib/python2.6/config/Setup.local but it's commented out in /usr/lib/python2.6/config/Setup
<persia> dholbach: Right.  I'm fairly certain it's an issue with one of the hildon libraries.
<persia> The history of hildon is fussy and annoying, and nobody really ever got it working in a distribution so far as I know (although Mer got very very close)
<persia> And nobody in Ubuntu has been paying much attention to hildon for the past 9 months (at least).
<persia> We almost were able to drop a Qt replacement with liquid this cycle, but upstream didn't want a release until post-FF.
<dholbach> I noticed there's 0.1.0 of python-hildondesktop out now
<persia> Could pull a new one, I suppose.
<persia> I'm really not sure anyone would test it much though : none of the folks I've encountered who used it were willing to try to help maintain it except the Mer folk, and their work couldn't be merged because we never figured out how to handle gtk.
<persia> I'm all for just dropping all the ubuntu-specific packages and ubuntu-specific patches from that entire collection, but don't want to do that until we have a replacement stack, just in case someone wants to hack on that stuff.
#ubuntu-mobile 2010-03-16
<xperia> hello to all. i have a small question about a missing package.
<xperia> i have searched to find the package opie but didnt had any luck till yet.
<xperia> does anybody know if opie is available as a package for the arm structure
<xperia> here is a nice build how to by the way that works great
<xperia> http://opie.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/BuildOpie
<xperia> i need it only now for the arm arch 
<persia> xperia: Which package seems to be missing?
<xperia> opie itself http://opie.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/BuildOpie
<xperia> open embedded has this package. angstrom too
<xperia> only ubuntu mobile is missing it
<persia> Which package?
<persia> As far as I can tell, that "opie" is a collection of stuff.
<xperia> persia: http://gitorious.org/opie/opie
<xperia> well it is same like gpe only from my side of view sometime better
<xperia> it can easy be build in less than 30 min with this instruction
<xperia> http://opie.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/BuildOpie
<xperia> i have allready builded it and on open embedded it can be builded it too as the recipes exist
<xperia> it is however missing in ubuntu mobile
<persia> Used to be available.  Let me see if I can figure out why it's gone.
<xperia> persia: ohhh wooow if it could be maked availble especially also for the arm arch this would be awesome.
<xperia> Opie is still developed as you can see on gitorious.
<xperia> opie has a full desktop with full working mail programms, multimedia programms and so on.
<xperia> some screenshots of the the older releases 
<xperia> http://opie.handhelds.org/gallery/main.php
<persia> We try really hard not to make anything available for only one architecture.
<persia> So that people can use the same mobile environment whether they have i386/armel/powerpc handhelds.
<xperia> persia: ohh woow this would be a heavy boost for this quite good gui for mobile devices
<xperia> it is allready used on some mobile pocket pc phones
<xperia> http://i37.tinypic.com/144b90o.jpg
<xperia> http://i37.tinypic.com/24mhqps.jpg
<xperia> http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=Kovsky Linux
<xperia> if opie would be availble for ubuntu-mobile this would be the perfect thing as it would increase the possibility running ubuntu mobile on the newest pocket pc successfull
<xperia> at the moment most of th linux ditro runns on angstrom or oe
<persia> Unfortunately my debtags search is eating my browser.
<xperia> it should be very easy to compile it as described on the step by step build instruction. i have build it more than once successfull. if you have any question just ask.
<persia> My suspicion is that some time in 2004 or 2005 someone stopped maintaining opie in Debian, and it got dropped for lack of further interest.
<xperia> the maintainer told me this too as some deb packages should be availble. but opie is still developed and used. last patch is from
<xperia> Thursday February 04 2010
<xperia> http://gitorious.com/opie/opie
<xperia> i am working on opie too as a hobby coder :-)
<persia> I can't find any good links that indicate when it was or wasn't added or removed from Debian.
<persia> My strongest recommendation would be to work at getting it into Debian.
<persia> This will then also be available in Ubuntu and all other Debian derivatives.
<xperia> so i should try at debian in this case
<persia> xperia: That's my recommendation, just because Debian has maintainers, so there's a better chance of keeping it there.
<persia> Adding stuff to Ubuntu that doesn't get added to Debian is usually a temporary matter except for special stuff highly interesting to some specific Ubuntu flavour.
<xperia> okay i have allready asked at the debian chanell
<persia> OK.  Please feel free to ask more here if you have questions or need help.
<persia> I just think it needs someone to care for it, and just tossing it in the repository is not best.
<xperia> well they have told me to package it but i have no experience with packaging it. if somebody would help me the first time i would do it however
<persia> I could certainly do that, but not right now.  Would you be available around this time tomorrow?
<persia> Err, no, that won't work :/
<persia> So a little later than now tomorrow, or another day or another hour, catch me here.
<xperia> yeah great ! then we see us tomorow some hours later than yet or another day
<xperia> thanks persia :-)
<persia> Happy to help.
<xperia> persia: or to others for some strange reason opie exist in ubuntu
<xperia> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/opie/2.40~dfsg-0ubuntu1
<xperia> it need just to be updated
<persia> xperia: That's a different "opie", isn't it?
 * persia thought that was a smartcard thing
<xperia> well the whole discussion is done on debian-arm
<xperia> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=511582
<ubottu> Debian bug 511582 in opie "packaged opie 2.4, fixing testsuite failures on arm/armel" [Serious,Open]
<xperia> it should be the same package from my point of view
<xperia> maybe it just dont has everything enabled like mp3 players email programms and such as this can be set all optional to be builded
<persia> See, the current "opie" package is a one-time passwod manager.
<persia> You7re talking about a *different* opie.
<xperia> yeah the people at debian told me that too but this is very strange why does they use the same name for this programm
<persia> That happens a lot.
<persia> Most folk don't seem to check carefully before choosing a name.
<persia> Looks like opie the password management system started in 1995, and opie the environment started. in 2001
<xperia> hmmm ha ha ha very strange
<persia> heh.
<xperia> but the very strange thing is that this person develop also the libpam-opie that is used in the palmtop environment too
<xperia> for example opie-server that sync with the palmtop environment
<persia> heh.
<xperia> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=553416
<ubottu> Debian bug 553416 in libpam-opie "libpam-opie: Adding support for pam-auth-update" [Wishlist,Open]
<xperia> the whole packages are 100% related to opie
<xperia> need maybe to cantact him and ask what is the actuall process
<xperia> persia: it looks like really this programms are not related to opie palmtop environment
<persia> I don't think it's related at all, actually.
<xperia> yeah. i can only remember that libpam was used in opie while the compiling. thats why i have thinked they are related to opie palmtop environment especially for syncing purposses
<xperia> thanks for the clarification
<xperia> okay see you all next time. bye !
<persia> NCommander: Hey!
<NCommander> persia: sorry about that
<persia> Are you still using Android?
<NCommander> persia: yes, and still doing some upstream hacking on it
<NCommander> (low level, but I know how to port android to new platforms)
<persia> Is the hack to use the test demo environment to run inside Ubuntu still viable?
<persia> Also, has the issue that it requires the binary-only Java been resolved?
<NCommander> persia: using SIMULATOR mode?
<NCommander> no
<persia> yeah.
<persia> no?
<persia> What happened?
<NCommander> I believe that got ripped out with eclair
<NCommander> it was depricated with android 1.0
<NCommander> And its the wrong way to do it, we should properly expose /dev/binder for the Android userspace
<persia> Can we?
<NCommander> persia: its required to build Android, but it might be fixable to use icetea instead (there are some issues with building older Android releases on Java 6, but I think patches landed with 2.1 to finally fix that, I can poke in android-porting if need be)
<NCommander> persia: I think we have the android bits in the kernel in staging. It should be a matter of flipping them on, and recompiling
<persia> That's all?
<NCommander> persia: well, Android isn't X based
<NCommander> so basically, what we need to bring android up is the following
<NCommander> 1. android ported to x86 (there are two separate projects that do this)
<NCommander> 2. /dev/binder support
<NCommander> 3. chroot environment
<NCommander> 4. Allocate  arange of UIDs for android to use (android assigns each app its own UID for security reasons)
<NCommander> 5. Either trap writes to /dev/graphics/fb0 or use androidvncserver and some voodoo
<persia> Why do we need x86?
<NCommander> persia: dalvik has platform specific bits. Unless you want to run Android in an emulator 
<persia> I'd rather use a VNC server.  What sort of voodoo?
<persia> chroot is easy.
<NCommander> persia: android assumes /dev/graphics/fb0 is going to be there. You'll have to teach it thats its not, and just use VNC instead
<amitk> NCommander: android drivers were removed from the mainline kernel staging
<persia> NCommander: Why use an emulator?  Why not just run on hardware to which it's ported for now, and encourage bugfixing for the rest.
<NCommander> persia: because any android app that uses the NDK would then not run
<NCommander> amitk: ugh, reason?
<amitk> unmaintained by google, no fixes to move them to drivers
<persia> NCommander: Hrm?  I'm confused.  Tell me why I need porting to x86 or an emulator to run on my Netwalker.
<NCommander> amitk: ****, there goes the easy flip switch for binder. How hard would it be to add to our mainline
<NCommander> persia: oh ... ugh
<NCommander> persia: I didn't think about that. I still think netbook == i386 :-/
<persia> Silly.
<NCommander> persia: you'd still want to use android-x86, since it has support for mice and not just touchpads
<persia> There's i386, powerpc, and armel hardware out there mostly.  Some amd64 stuff is coming out recently as well.
<amitk> NCommander: we won't do it (apply a random unmaintained patch with no hope of being mainlined) unless you have a very good reason, as always :)
<NCommander> persia: android isn't 64-bit clean last time I checked unfortunately, so it won't run on amd64 unless you want the pain of porting it
<persia> amitk: Is this an Ubuntu Kernel position?  What if they were pushed mainline?
<NCommander> persia: google made comments saying that they weren't interested in mainlining
<amitk> persia: we had in enabled in staging in Karmic
<amitk> *it
<persia> NCommander: That's fine.  I don7t really care about porting right now.  I can live with just armel for a while.
<persia> amitk: Ah, I understand.
<amitk> persia: NCommander: best write to ubuntu-kernel ML if you want the official version of the story
<amitk> this is the abridged version
<persia> amitk: First I want to find out how big a project the whole thing ends up being :)
<NCommander> amitk: roughly speaking, how large is /dev/binder suppotr?
<NCommander> *support
<amitk> NCommander: dunno, but look at sha id b0a0ccf in git for the commit that removed them
#ubuntu-mobile 2010-03-17
<xperia> persia: hello
#ubuntu-mobile 2010-03-19
<xperia> persia: are you online ?
<persia> I am.  You wanted to talk about packaging?
<xperia> yes exactly. do you have any time now or should we make it other day ?
<persia> I have some time.
<persia> For me, the hardest part of packaging is documenting the authorship and licensing.
<persia> And I recommend doing that first.  It's less frustrating to get stuck there before you do anything else, then after you have a nearly working product.
<xperia> ohh great. i am ready. i have built everything allready on my host so it need only packaging.
<xperia> okay then say me what do i need to have and execute
<persia> For copyright, you'll want to go through *every* file in the source, and document the author, the copyright holder, and the license.
<persia> These days, I tend to use http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep5/ as  a format for that document
<xperia> persia. ihave allready a LICENSE.GPL file inside the sources
<xperia>  The Qtopia Environment is Copyright (C) 2000-2001 Trolltech AS and
<xperia>   other authors as specified in the file headers.
<xperia>  You may use, distribute and copy the Qtopia Environment under the terms
<xperia>  of GNU General Public License version 2, which is displayed below.
<xperia> .....
<persia> Understood.  You need to redocument it, to demonstrate that you've done the review as part of the packaging.
<persia> If everything is truly licensed properly, and all under the same license, this can be very quick and easy.
<xperia> okay then i will now install dep5 and start it
<persia> Most of the time I find a few files that aren't documented properly, and need to go chase the authors to make sure the right license headers may be added, etc.
<persia> Nothing to install.  It's just a text file.
<xperia> exist some full example that i can modify only or do i need to read the whole site
<persia> There are some examples on that page.
<persia> But only that page should be sufficient, including examples.
<xperia> persia: ahh okay i see it now at the end
<xperia> persia: i have it now. http://paste-bin.com/view/f851b18d
<persia> xperia: That was fast :)
<persia> xperia: I'd recommend just listing yourself for debian/* so that you don't need to add file headers to each file.
<persia> Also, You list copyright 2000-2001 : did you maybe mean 2000-2010?
<xperia> it has to go forward :-) used the first example
<persia> OK.  So, how does this build?
<xperia> well it build great.
<xperia> ./configure
<xperia> make
<xperia> works great
<xperia> without any problems
<xperia> maybe  need to specifiy some prefix-install folder now
<persia> Unpack your source.
<persia> make a directory debian/ in the source
<xperia> okay will do
<xperia> okay done
<persia> copy the file you created from the DEP5 guide to debian/copyright
<persia> Copy /usr/share/doc/debhelper/examples/rules.tiny to debian/rules
<persia> echo 7 > debian/compat
<persia> dch --create to start a changelog: add the package name, ${version}-0ppa1 (we'll start with a ppa, and can go from there), target lucid, urgency low, changelog entry "Initial Packaging"
<xperia> is debian/copyright the folder or the file i have now debian/copyright/copyright
<persia> Next create debian/control in a text editor: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-controlfields.html documents the fields and relevant policies.
<persia> debian/copyright should be the text file.
<xperia> persia: what if i have allready a existing big ChangeLog file ? Do i need still to create a new one ?
<persia> Yes.
<persia> Basically you want to separate the changelog for the packaging from the changelog for the software.
<persia> debian/changelog should only contain changes to how it's packaged.
<persia> ./ChangeLog contains the changes to trunk, etc.
<persia> When there's a new release of the software, just add "New upstream version" in debian/changelog.
<persia> But most debian/changelog entries will end up being stuff like "Rebuild against new libfoo", "Adjusted udev rules to match new semantics", "Update to standards-version x.y.z", etc.
<persia> (this is a luxury you will have because of your close relationship with upstream.  If the people writing the software and the people packaging the software are very different, more complex things may apepar in debian/changelog)
<xperia> okay. wotking on creating the change log. with dch --create
<xperia> does this changelog file need to be moved later to the debian folder
<xperia> becouse i am outside of the debian folder all the time
<persia> dch --create will automatically create it in the debian folder
<xperia> Is this here corect writen this way in my console ?
<xperia> PACKAGE opie, (VERSION)1.2.5-0ppa1 UNRELEASED; urgency=low target lucid
<xperia>   * Initial Packaging. (Closes: #XXXXXX)
<xperia>  -- administrator <administrator@localhost>  Fri, 19 Mar 2010 16:05:48 +0100
<persia> Not quite.
<xperia> or do i need
<xperia> opie 1.2.5-0ppa1 urgency=low target=lucid
<persia> You want the parentheses.
<persia> And you can't use the name opie : it's been taken since before your project started.
<persia> So you need to have a different package name.
<xperia> ohh man how should i named it then. it exist allready a package from 2004 but dont know how it is called
<persia> maybe "opi-env" ?
<xperia> good tip. i will use opie-desktop as gnome-desktop or ubuntu-desktop
<persia> That works,.
<xperia> just need to know if i need to remove the Words like PACKAGE and so on
<xperia> is this here needed
<xperia> opie-desktop 1.2.5-0ppa1 urgency=low target=lucid
<persia> You want something like:
<xperia> or this here
<xperia> PACKAGE opie-desktop (VERSION)1.2.5-0ppa1 UNRELEASED; urgency=low target=lucid
<persia> opie-desktop (1.2.5-0ppa1) lucid; urgency=low
<xperia> awesome have done it :-) 
<xperia> cat debian/changelog
<xperia> opie-desktop 1.2.5-0ppa1 lucid; urgency=low
<xperia>   * Initial Packaging. (Closes: #XXXXXX)
<xperia>  -- administrator <administrator@localhost>  Fri, 19 Mar 2010 16:05:48 +0100
<persia> Well, fix your name and email :)
<persia> You need those to match an identity from `gpg --list-secret-keys`
<xperia> okay great ! thanks for the Tip.
<xperia> will change that direct now
<xperia> have change it: http://paste-bin.com/view/305b942d
<xperia> now on to creating this control file
<persia> This is the most manual part after copyright, but if you just follow down the page in the debian policy manual, there's a good chance you'll end up with something mostly right.
<xperia> hmmm this is a litlle more tricky now :-) cant find any examples at first sight
<persia> Aside from Description, it's mostly just key-value entries, in RFC822 format.
<persia> So:
<persia> Source: opie-desktop
<persia> Maintainer: ${name & email from changelog}
<persia> Section: ${pick one}
<xperia> ahh great thanks
<persia> Priority: optional
<persia> ...
<persia> Put a blank line between the source paragraph and any additional paragraphs.
<persia> And read the docs on Description closely: there's a very specific format
<xperia> what should i write for 
<xperia> Architecture
<xperia> the package build great on a i386
<xperia> it should work too on a arm or other arch
<xperia> the main goal is having it for arm
<xperia> but also for i386
<persia> any works
<persia> That will try to compile for each available architecture separatly.
<xperia> okay
<xperia> persia: have done it
<xperia> http://paste-bin.com/view/bc526299
<persia> Almost.
<persia> You need to start with Source:
<persia> Package: belongs inthe second paragraph.
<persia> Both Source: and Package: should be opie-desktop
<persia> That's the name being assigned, not that actual source.
<persia> Version: doesn't belong there
<persia> section, priority, maintainer, homepage belong in the Source: paragraph.
<persia> Architecture & Description belong in the Package: paragraph.
<persia> The order should ideally be that shown on the policy page.
<xperia> hmmm i have study the section 5.3 :-) and it looks like i needed to look at section 5.2
<persia> heh
<xperia> persia: i think i have understand it now. http://paste-bin.com/view/f1d96cc0
<persia> Section, Priority, and Homepage are preferred in the first paragraph instead of the second, if they can go there.
<persia> So delete them from the second paragraph (no need for duplication)
<xperia> oky have done it. the control file should be done now if i am not wrong
<persia> Not quite.
<persia> You'll want to add Build-Depends to the first paragraph, and Depends to the second.
<persia> Depends: is probably just: 
<persia> Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Depends}
<persia> Build-Depends needs to come from you, but should start with "debhelper (>= 7)"
<xperia> ohhhhh that is now a step more heavy
<xperia> can i write the line Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Depends}
<xperia> exact the same way in the control file or do i need to specify exactly what for packages are needed
<persia> For Depends: you can start with the exact same way.
<xperia> okay
<persia> With Build-Depends, you'll need to add all the -dev libraries you need to build.
<xperia> okay i think that should be very easy
<xperia> all the dev-libs that i need are written here http://opie.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/BuildOpie
<persia> Right.
<persia> Add all the required ones and all the optional ones.
<xperia> Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 7), libfreetype6-dev, libjpeg62-dev, libpam0g-dev, libpng12-dev, zlib1g-dev, libasound2-dev, libsysfs-dev, libpcsclite-dev, pkg-config, libbluetooth-dev, libobexftp0-dev, libopenobex1-dev, libpcap-dev, libsqlite3-dev, libxine-dev
<xperia> is that good from thy syntax point of view ?
<persia> Yep.
<persia> So let's see the entire control file, all assembled.
<xperia> okay http://paste-bin.com/view/1d24b0be
<persia> Ideally the order of the various entries should match the order in which they are presented in policy
<persia> Other than that, looks pretty good.
<persia> Oh, and Description needs changing.
<persia> Go read policy about Description again.
<xperia> okay changed the order and look now at Description
<xperia> so what does i need to change in the description field.
<xperia> do i need to encapsle the lines with < >
<xperia> or o i need to make more than one space between the first and the second  Text Phrase ?
<persia> xperia: After Description: you want a single line synopsis.  This should complete the cloze "${PACKAGE} is (a/the) ${SHORT_DESCRIPTION}".
<persia> Below that line you should have at least three lines going into detail about the package, each proceeded by a single space.
<persia> see policy 5.6.13 and 3.4
<xperia> ohh this rules drives me crazy. how about his now ?
<xperia> http://paste-bin.com/view/44d042f9
<persia> Try to keep each line of the description under 70 characters :)
<persia> But that's the last edit for now.
<persia> So, now you're ready to build a source package.
<xperia> ohhhh cant beleve it. need to shorten this lines
<persia> Do you have a release tarball of opie that you unpacked when you started?
<persia> Just description.  Leave build-depends alone for now
<xperia> wait wait need to shorten the description lines
<xperia> okay done.
<xperia> no i have builded from trunk. it is very stable
<xperia> the rlease version is a litlle old and dont has the newest changes
<xperia> i have followed step by step this howto. it is very easy and and works great.
<xperia> http://opie.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/BuildOpie
<persia> Well, that's a little frustrating, because it makes it a bit messy, but we can try to work around that.
<persia> Grab the release tarball anyway.
<xperia> are you sure ? the release is heavy outdated 
<xperia> http://opie.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/Source
<xperia> i have worked only as described on the page with this
<xperia> git clone git://gitorious.org/opie/opie.git
<xperia> if i am not wrong it should exist a snapshot of this git tree as tarball
<persia> Well, we need a tarball.
<persia> So we can make a tarball of the snapshot *or* we can use the old tarball.
<persia> We'll use the snapshot source in either case.
<xperia> let me find it http://gitorious.org/opie/opie
<xperia> http://gitorious.org/opie/opie/archive-tarball/master
<xperia> this should it be
<xperia> http://gitorious.org/opie/opie/trees/master
<xperia> okay i have the .tar.gz
<xperia> should i extaract it or just save it
<persia> Just save it.
<persia> What version is the tar.gz ?
<xperia> the newest 1.2.5 (trunk)
<xperia> it is named opie-opie-master.tar.gz
<persia> OK.
<persia> Rename that to opie-desktop_1.2.5.orig.tar.gz
<xperia> does it need to be copyed to debian/
<persia> Nope.  It needs to be in the directory above the source.
<xperia> okay have done the renaming
<persia> OK.  Now, add a changelog entry
<persia> (just run dch)
<persia> Report that you updated to a git snapshot with today's date and the SHA hash
<xperia> well have done dch but for some reasn i am getting this
<xperia> http://paste-bin.com/view/f1724819
<persia> Somehow debian/changelog got messed up.
<persia> Delete it, and recreate it.
<persia> Oh, I see.
<persia> You missed the () around the version.
<xperia> persia: you are right. the problem was the missings ()
<xperia> okay it works now reporting the change in the changelog
<persia> Excellent.  paste your new modified changelog?
<xperia> need only to add the SHA hash number. is that the SHA Hash number from the gitorious page or should i create a new one ?
<persia> You want the hash from the git tree so others can replicate your work.
<persia> I believe that date + SHA hash identifies a unique state of source.
<xperia> okay have done it
<persia> OK.  So paste the debian/changelog
<xperia> http://paste-bin.com/view/c40a7231
<persia> I usually delete the [NAME] stuff when it's just me, but doesn't matter for now.
<xperia> okay
<persia> Next, run `debuild -S -i -I `
<persia> This *should* build you a source package.
<persia> If it doesn't, we'll hunt down the errors.
<xperia> okay now it is getting interessting :-)
<xperia> debuild: fatal error at line 685:
<xperia> found debian/changelog in directory
<xperia>   /media/usbdisk/LinuXperiaOS/opiehome/opie
<xperia> but there's no debian/rules there!  Are you in the source code tree?
<persia> Did you copy /usr/share/doc/debhelper/examples/rules.tiny to debian/rules ?
<xperia> ohh i have rules.tiny
<xperia> okay it works :-)
<persia> So you have a diff.gz and .dsc?
<xperia> dpkg-source: info: building opie-desktop using existing opie-desktop_1.2.5.orig.tar.gz
<xperia> it is working at this line here at the moment
<persia> That'll take a while.  It's preparing a diff between the git snapshot and the tarball
<xperia> ahhh okay. in my case this will sure go abaout 30 min as i have a slow build host
<xperia> persia: in this case i recomend to meet us in 30 min again here. till then we make a litlle break
<persia> heh
<xperia> :-)
<xperia> this will sure need some 30 min :-)
<xperia> ahh no it proceed :-)
<xperia> ohhh that dont look gooog :-)
<xperia> good
<persia> What happened?
<xperia> have a lot of this lines here 
<xperia> dpkg-source: error: cannot represent change to opie/core/launcher/.obj/x86-linux/moc_qprocess.o: binary file contents changed
<xperia> dpkg-source: error: cannot represent change to opie/core/launcher/.obj/x86-linux/moc_mediumwidget.o: binary file contents changed
<xperia> dpkg-source: error: cannot represent change to opie/core/launcher/.obj/x86-linux/moc_mediadlg.o: binary file contents changed
<xperia> dpkg-source: error: cannot represent change to opie/core/multimedia/opieplayer/modplug/.obj/x86-linux/tables.o: binary file contents changed
<xperia> dpkg-source: error: cannot represent change to opie/core/multimedia/opieplayer/modplug/.obj/x86-linux/memfile.o: binary file contents changed
<xperia> it works still
<persia> No, it doesn't.
<persia> Did you run any build commands in that source before we started?
<xperia> really ? what si wrong
<xperia> well yes :-) wanted to know if it builds
<persia> OK.
<persia> Well, that's the issue.
<persia> SO
<xperia> did not wanted to have some strange surprises
<persia> Make a new directory.
<xperia> okay
<persia> get your snapshot
<persia> copy the entire contents of the debian/ directory we constructed in there.
<persia> Put the orig.tar.gz one level down.
<persia> run `dbuild -S -i -I` again.
<persia> (in the new directory)
<persia> You need the tree *before* it's built.
<xperia> so okay i have created now in /media/usbdisk/opiehome the dir "debian-packager"
<xperia> will now clone the git sources there with git clone git://gitorious.org/opie/opie.git
<xperia> copy the debian folder from previous
<xperia> and look that the snapshot file opie-desktop_1.2.5.orig.tar.gz
<xperia> is located in /media/usbdisk/opiehome
<persia> Right.
<persia> And then build the source package.
<xperia> persia: the thing is that the extracted sources need some symlinking to other files and packages
<xperia> http://opie.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/BuildOpie#head-263fce4b2279b68f6de230fff90c8d725add4c0f
<xperia> how can this be solved so it can be done automagicly
<persia> Do you need these to build, or to run?
<xperia> uic compiler is needed to compile opie
<xperia> and qfvb is needed for runnning
<persia> Then you first need to package the uic compiler.
<persia> And qfvb
<persia> (unless they are already packaged)
<xperia> ahhh dont we have them allready in the package repo. let me see if they exist
<xperia> persia: uic-qt2 dont looks like it is in the repo but it can be find precompiled here
<xperia> http://linuxtogo.org/~mickeyl/tools/
<persia> You need to have it compiled in the repo, not use precompiled sources.
<persia> The same recipe we used for opie-desktop can be used for that.
<xperia> ohhh okay
<persia> Note that this recipe produces buggy packages (but a buggy package can be debugged, and a non-existent package can't be)
<xperia> okay i understand. in this case i will start now to create two dirs for creating the needed packages.
<xperia> need some 20 to 40 minutes
<persia> No worries.  I think you'll end up needing a bunch of time over 2-3 weeks, as a rough estimate.
<xperia> ohhhh nooooo
<persia> ?
<xperia> such long :-)
<persia> Well, making a package takes 20 minutes.
<persia> Then it's buggy.
<persia> So you have to fix the bugs.
<persia> You're proposing to package a compiler, which tends to have odd, hard to track down issues, a virtual framebuffer, which ends up being all sorts of odd to configure and use, *and* a comprehensive integrated suite of applications.
<persia> So I'm expecting you'll run into a lot of issues along the way.
<xperia> mmmmhhhh okay in this case i will look to try first to package the uic compiler and the virtual frambuffer.
<xperia>  have thinked it should be more easy to package opie as it nearly compile for every architecture from the sources in open embedded
<xperia> maybe have to look also how the whole thing with compiling works in open embedded. i know 100% that it fetch allways the newest sources from the git repo and compile it for the different archs. for the arm arch however if i am not wrong they use qemu
<persia> qemu can also be used in Ubuntu.
<persia> I think the difference is that Ubuntu requires everything to be packaged first, whereas OE provides a framework that supports a mix of packaged and unpackaged software.
<xperia> the most easy thing in this case would be to look in open embedded how they compile uic and qtvfb. hmm let me just see it as i have it her on my usbdisk
<xperia> hmmm open embedded has packages that are fully missed in ubuntu-mobile
<xperia> xqt
<xperia> xqt2
<xperia> http://xqt.sourceforge.jp/
<xperia> ohh man that looks like a lot of work :-(
<xperia> persia: i will rethink the whole think with packaging opie for debian. it is way to high for me ! will probably stick with open embedded for the moment
<persia> xperia: OK.  I understand.
<xperia> thanks a lot for your very helpfull time. have learned somevery good stuff about what is needed for packaging.
<persia> No problem.  At least I know it's a mountain of work next time someone asks me about packaging OPIE.
<xperia> okay see you next time persia and a lot of success with ubuntu-mobile !
<xperia> bye.
#ubuntu-mobile 2010-03-21
<wols> hi. got a question about Ubuntu MID and Netbook Remix: according to phoronix, packages for them are compile with special compilerflags to conserve power better. are there special repos for these versions, especially the source packages with those configure options set by default?
<lool> wols: It used to be the "lpia" architecture
<lool> But it got killed in the latest Ubuntu version
