#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-06-27
<rick_h_> heh, ssd <3
<jjesse-netbook> evening
<rick_h_> party
<rick_h_> ok, next CHC we need to make sure we test Blazeix https://twitter.com/#!/wafuqua/status/85129327397715968
<jjesse-netbook> on my netbook now that ive lost the power charger for my ipad and havent been to a store to buy a new one
<jjesse-netbook> ls
<rick_h_> ouch
<rick_h_> amazon 2nd day?
<jjesse-netbook> or best buy
<jjesse-netbook> but dont want to sell out $20 for a charge
<jjesse-netbook> my wife left it in the hotel and housekeeping there cant find it
<rick_h_> ah, gotcha
<rick_h_> holding out hope it shows?
<jjesse-netbook> its been a week
<jjesse-netbook> so i guess i gotta go to best buy
<jjesse-netbook> or an apple store :(
<jjesse-netbook> looks like amazon, have 4 bucks of gift card
<rick_h_> do you do prime?
<rick_h_> that'll pay for the overnight charge
<jjesse-netbook> i have prime
<jjesse-netbook> hav eit for free through amazon mom
<jjesse-netbook> its the free shipping version not the free streaming of movies
<jjesse-netbook> http://www.amazon.com/gp/mom/signup/info in case no  one knows what amazon mom is
<rick_h_> well they're one and the same aren't they?
<rick_h_> oh, interesting
<jjesse-netbook> no free streaming of movies/videos
<rick_h_> gotcha, yea missed that at first
<jjesse-netbook> if you are doing disposable diapers its the cheapest route
<jjesse-netbook> especially with subscribe and save
<rick_h_> yea, I keep thinking of trying that, but afraid of the schedule
<rick_h_> just end up getting the biggest size as needed
<jjesse-netbook> get an email saying your stuff is going to ship
<jjesse-netbook> and you can change it before
<jjesse-netbook> we did get stuck with a box but wife sold it to a friend
<rick_h_> gotcha, good to know
<jjesse-netbook> if you have prime and dont stream movies you can drop prime and save more money
<snap-l> Is there something special about the iPad charger over just getting an iPhone sync cable?
<snap-l> or is it that AC->USB converter?
<jrwren> brousch: sounds cool, how is the perf?
<brousch> jrwren: it seems good. it's hard to compare objectively since i last used this laptop about 9 months ago with ubuntu 10.04. now i'm running 11.04 after using my faster MBP for 9 months
<brousch> it seems to bog down less while running big jobs
<brousch> is that the hard drive or linux improvements? i don't know
<rick_h_> always say the hardware, so you can order more :)
<snap-l> both
<brousch> for instance, i was copying a few GB of photos over my 802.11n wifi while importing 80,000 photos from another part of the hard disk, and it was still perfectly responsive
<brousch> well this laptop is maxed out on ram, so not much more to order
<snap-l> new lappy
<jjesse> snap-l ipad will only charged connected to an apple laptop
<brousch> i need to sell off 2 or 3 others first ;)
<jjesse> wont charge connected to a non apple device
<brousch> go down to the apple store and plug in
<jjesse> every time i need an charge; 0
<brousch> once a week?
<rick_h_> well they did say you could use the apple store wireless for download updates and such
<jjesse> yeah tahts too much
<rick_h_> why not charging?
<brousch> come on. you live like 10mins away from it
<snap-l> jjesse: You've got to be fucking kidding me
<brousch> hm, does the apple laptop have to be on to charge from it?
<brousch> i have one that won't boot
<snap-l> jjesse: They give you a freaking AC adapter for the iPhone to charge it via the sync cable
<brousch> 3yr old + milk incident
<jjesse> i think it does to be online
<snap-l> jjesse: That makes no sense. iPads work with Windows, no?
<jjesse> yes but don't charge on a non mac hardware
<snap-l> If thats true, then Apple will never sell me an iPad
<jjesse> i plug my laptop into either a linux box or a windows box and no charge
<jjesse> mac and get a charge
<jjesse> no clue why
<jrwren> brousch: any form of wifi is so slow you can ignore it on actually taxing any modern (10yrs) disk.
<brousch> right now i'm regenerating 32k thumbnails and it's slowed a little bit
<jrwren> its just plain false.
<jrwren> i charge my iphone (small ipad) form lots of devices.
<brousch> cpu is at 80% though
<jrwren> but it does require enough power from the usb port. not just any port will do
<jjesse> jrwren that might be but i get a notice  on my ipad that it is not charging
<jjesse> on all my usb ports on my laptop
<jrwren> sounds like a shitty laptop :)
<jjesse> probablly
<jrwren> anyone good with xlinq?
<jrwren> i'm trying to select the link node from rss where the title node starts with something.
<jrwren> xpath to the title node is easy, but how do I get the link node where the title matches?
<jrwren> for the record...  "//channel/item/title[starts-with(.,'SOMETEXT')]/parent::item/link"
<jrwren> xgrep is pretty bad ass.
<gppl> A iPad requires 10 volts of USB power to charge. Most computer usb ports only give 5. It's not your laptop.
<jjesse> does a mac usb port provde more?  seems a buddy of mine charges his w/ his macbook
<gppl> I'm not sure
<gppl> i just remember reading that a few weeks ago
<gppl> according to a quick google search newer macs have higher powered usb ports
<gppl> so yes
<gppl> here's an apple support article about higher power charging: http://support.apple.com/kb/HT4049?viewlocale=en_US
<jrwren> oh wow. that is seriously messed up since USB spec is 5V not 10V
<gppl> i got it messed up
<jjesse> new charge on the way from amazon
<jrwren> https://discussions.apple.com/thread/2504985?start=0&tstart=0    more crazy info
<gppl> Would a iPad charger charge my iPod touch faster then?
<jjesse> i bet it would?
<jcastro> heya vish
<jcastro> oops, wrong channel
<Wolfger> Morning.
<rick_h_> morning
<Wolfger> What, no party?
<rick_h_> nope, no party
<rick_h_> boy is sick, and taking the car to get the winshield replaced thanks to the semi on the way down to here
<brousch> i love vacation!
<rick_h_> yea, truely yay
<brousch> our last vacation, my wife ended up in the hospital for nearly a week due to a cyst
<rick_h_> winner!
<brousch> how bad is your son?
<rick_h_> not too bad, just very cranky, up an hour early at 6am
<brousch> just miserable enough to not want to do anything?
<rick_h_> he wants to do everything, but mad at the world every step of the way
<rick_h_> just miserale enough to not like anything
<brousch> lovely
<rick_h_> yea, like you said, <3 vacation, so full of relaxing and rest and sleeping in...not
<snap-l> Good morning
<brousch> if it makes you feel better, our son has started sleeping in to 6:05AM now. however the dog has decided she prefers 5:45 so she starts barking at that time
<Wolfger> Man, you guys almost make me glad to not take vacation...
<brousch> you get to work in exotic locales. every day is a vacation for you
<Wolfger> Wooo. Exotic Dundee, MI.
<brousch> dundee? that's like visiting australia!
<snap-l> Dundee is a total vacation spot
<Wolfger> If you're an avid hunter and fisher
 * Wolfger is neither
<Wolfger> oh, I guess race fans like to come here too... The hotel is always packed on a race weekend.
<Wolfger> :-p
<snap-l> SO you can get your fill of MIRNFs
<snap-l> Mothers I'd Rather Not ...
<Wolfger> LOL
<snap-l> Huurrah, it's a morning conference call
<snap-l> brousch: I was going to ask if the interview had aired
<brousch> heh, last thursday
<brousch> it went well!
<snap-l> Awesome
<snap-l> I've downloaded it, and will have to hear it at some point. ;)
<snap-l> http://lifehacker.com/5815715/how-to-build-a-hackintosh-mini-for-less-than-600
<snap-l> I love how much effort this is just to get Mac OSX on non-mac hardware
<brousch> heh
<brousch> probably half-working too
<snap-l> Well, it's Lifehacker, so it'll work for about 5 days after the article posts. ;)
<snap-l> Well, this is great. Got a book back from a buyer in worse condition than I sent it.
<snap-l> Hurray.
<brousch> probably swapped your nice book for their crappy one and sent you back the crappy one
<snap-l> yeah, I'm a little pissed
<snap-l> Funny thing was I was having a little seller-regret when selling it
<snap-l> and was half-tempted to not ship it to him
<snap-l> Should have listened to myself
<krondor> power regression in 2.6.38?  interesting article despite the horrible popover ads http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=linux_2638_aspm&num=1
<brousch> fix it!
<Wolfger> snap-l: You should have made some sort of mark in the book to verify he returned the one you sent.
<snap-l> I didn't think that he would be returning it
<Wolfger> "Be prepared" :-)
<snap-l> bah
<brousch> now that you've lost all faith in the honest morals of mankind, you'll think ahead
<Wolfger> something obscure and harmless, like "on page 133 of every book I will turn one sentence into two by inserting an extra period".
<Wolfger> Just do that to every book you sell. They'll never notice it if they're scammers, and it won't ruin the book either.
<Wolfger> snap-l: If you could prove they scammed you, maybe you could flog them... ;-)
<brousch> we could drive out there and demand he rectify the situation ala Big Bang Theory
<brousch> who's our Penny?
<Wolfger> LOL
<Wolfger> *knocknocknock* gamerchick02 *knocknocknock* gamerchick02 *knocknocknock* gamerchick02
<gamerchick02> hello, Wolfger.
<gamerchick02> what's up?
<Wolfger> ^^^
<gamerchick02> i'm listening to Linux Outlaws. :)
<Wolfger> brousch wanted to know who our "Penny" was for retribution purposes.
<Wolfger> I was nominating you.
<gamerchick02> Penny? huh?
<Wolfger> :-/
<gamerchick02> are you talking about Big Bang Theory? I don't watch that show...
<Wolfger> Seriously?
<gamerchick02> yes.
<Wolfger> omgwtfbbq
<gamerchick02> i probably should put them in my netflix queue.
<Wolfger> OK.
<gamerchick02> i've got so many other things to watch though...
<snap-l> JoDee's watched Big Bang Theory
<snap-l> I personally don't have the attention span to handle that show for any length of time
<gamerchick02> well, i do watch the IT Crowd.
<Wolfger> Wow. I didn't think I knew anybody who didn't watch, aside from my friends who don't have a TV in their living room...
<Wolfger> Even my sis-in-law watches BBT, and she's very non-geek.
<Wolfger> This is kinda like that moment growing up where I realized not all my friends believed in Santa Claus.
<gamerchick02> ah. i'm not generally one for US TV comedies. well, since the 80s and early 90s.
<Wolfger> It's just inconceivable
<snap-l> Wolfger: Frankly, it's because I realize I have better things to do about 5 minutes into the show
<Wolfger> blasphemer
<snap-l> I mean, yeah, there's a lot of geek fan-service in there, but it's not enough to keep me watching
<gamerchick02> i might add it to my netflix.
<brousch> Wolfger: wtf. i thought everyone watched that show
<brousch> it probably hits home a bit too hard for snap-l
<snap-l> brousch: I mean, it can be funny, but I really couldn't care less about the characters.
<snap-l> And I've watched every second of the IT Crowd on Netflix
<brousch> i do not watch that show
<snap-l> I find the IT crowd to be much more enjoyable
<brousch> i dub you craig wolowitz
<gamerchick02> gtg
<Wolfger> LOL
<gamerchick02> stupid shit for tonight. i can't stay the fuck away from that goddamned building for shit
<brousch> wow
<Wolfger> wrong channel?
<ColonelPanic001> wat
<ColonelPanic001> I see nothing wrong. I feel that way about work sometimes.
<krondor> has anyone seen the US version of IT Crowd?  I didn't even know it existed, but I expect it's not good.
<krondor> relevant link; http://thetvdb.com/?tab=series&id=81892&lid=7
<snap-l> krondor: Assume any show ported from the UK to the US market is going to be shit
<snap-l> The only notable exceptions being The Office, Who's Line Is It Anyway, and The Missing Link
<snap-l> though some might argue about The Missing Link.
<jjesse> i'm going to request a dmca takedown on each image at the bottom of the page :)
<gamerchick02> sorry, someone thought i had keys to something i don't.
<gamerchick02> i'm not a honcho of OES. just Nile. and why would Nile have OES keys? right?
<snap-l> I am not fluent in the inner workings of the Shriners, I'm afraid.
<gamerchick02> it's ok. sorry for my OT grumping.
<snap-l> you're allowed. :)
<gamerchick02> for some reason, one of our members thinks i have keys to everything. uhm, no.
<snap-l> Most of my grumbling is OT anyway.
<gamerchick02> heh.
<snap-l> bl
<brousch> if everyone quit grumbling we'd have nothing to talk about
<gamerchick02> you are correct, brousch.
#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-06-28
<snap-l> I love that Banshee has problems doing things like... oh... seeking in a track
<rick_h_> http://paperjs.org/about/ snap-l this is what I've been saying that we're waiting for
<snap-l> Yeah, that's awesome
<Milyardo> 99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999pppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
<snap-l> ++
<rick_h_> umm what?
<rick_h_> geeze, I wonder if this internet here is even 1.5mb
 * greg-g returns home from vacation
<greg-g> and holy email batman
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> where did you end up going?
<greg-g> black lake, up north, exit 310 off of I-75, about an hour east of there
<greg-g> no internet nor cell phone (at least sprint, seemed verizon got service)
<brousch> sprint sux
<rick_h_> greg-g: awesome, good trails?
<snap-l> I don't understand why bands license their albums per track on Bandcamp
<rick_h_> per track?! seems strange
<snap-l> This one album has the first track as (C), and the other as BY-NC-SA
<snap-l> That's OK; you all get exposed to my original plan. ;)
<snap-l> muhahahaha
<gppl> I need a quick program to crop a picture.
<snap-l> If you can figure it out, Imagemagick should do the trick
<snap-l> http://www.imagemagick.org/Usage/crop/
<greg-g> rick_h_: actually, no hiking, this was a family thing, carrie's stepdad's 60th
<greg-g> july 11th-15th will be hiking (or something)
<greg-g> and now, bed
<greg-g> zzzzzzzzzzzzzz
<Milyardo> o_O
<Milyardo> Who's pasting stuff in my console
<snap-l> Good morning
<greg-g> hey-o
<_stink_> morning
<Wolfger> paty
<Wolfger> party, even
<brousch> helz yeah. i have the kindle reader on my nook color
<snap-l> God, Musicbrainz makes me batty
<snap-l> http://musicbrainz.org/edit/14708020
<snap-l> Frankly, I just want my CDs ripped
<brousch> oh awesome. all of my droid apps are being shoved onto the nook color now
<Wolfger> Middle image. Pure awesome. http://www.teefury.com/images/articles/1303864045_4069-Nicholas_J_Seluk-9397.jpg
<brousch> ohyeahbaby. i can click an epub in my dropbox and it opens using the nook reader
<brousch> don't even have to copy files over manually any more
<nullspace> hello alls
<snap-l> Howdy
<snap-l> Long time no see
<nullspace> glad to be back
<nullspace> I'm just running on my localmachine so I'm not presistant
<snap-l> 's OK.
<nullspace> restarting after update
<Wolfger> Hey nullspace, welcome back
<_stink_> wb, nullspace
<rick_h__> _stink_: http://goo.gl/iIaFX
<rick_h__> funny too, putting hime to work: http://goo.gl/0RSbx
<_stink_> rick_h__: hah, i like the dad/son Bears shirts
<rick_h__> oh yea, did that for when grandpa came over
<rick_h__> have to work hard to raise the boy right
<_stink_> rick_h__: how did he handle the drive?  you guys do overnight again?
<rick_h__> yea, overnight ftw
<rick_h__> he woke up a couple of times
<rick_h__> mainly when we stopped
<rick_h__> and the last 30min we were getting a strong "all done" signs thrown our way
<rick_h__> so the 11/12hr is right on the limit I think
<snap-l> Man, I'm not happy that Bank of America took away the OFX import
<snap-l> er, export
<rick_h__> oops
<snap-l> "/msg -freenode nickserv NOTE:Exclusive use of Active Statement and WEB Connect downloads should help prevent duplicate transactions from being downloaded. "
<snap-l> NOTE:Exclusive use of Active Statement and WEB Connect downloads should help prevent duplicate transactions from being downloaded.
<snap-l> Except that MoneyDance doesn't support WEBConnect, and every other format is just a damn QIF which doesn't handle dupes
<Wolfger> blargh
<Wolfger> I have to write a Scope Statement.
<Wolfger> I was given a sample. The first section is the Executive Summary. I read it (for the project we are now finishing up) and it confused me and made my head hurt.
<Wolfger> If you are reading a summary of the scope of work for something you're damned near done with (i.e. intimately familiar with) and it confuses you and makes your head hurt.... something's wrong.
<Wolfger> So do I write a similar Executive Summary that uses lots of big managerial words without saying much at all, or to I just write a plain English statement of what the project is about? :-p
<Wolfger> I know which I prefer, and I'm pretty sure that will get a negative reaction.
<_stink_> do it in iambic pentameter?
<Wolfger> Oh, excellent idea!
<Wolfger> Except I hate writing iambic pentameter.
<Wolfger> Do you think they'd notice if I did each section as a limerick or haiku?
 * Wolfger is suddenly excited about writing a Scope of Work statement, and that's just wrong.
<snap-l> I love the interpretation of REST on this project
<snap-l> essentially, it's XML sent via POST
<rick_h__> doesn't that count?
<snap-l> (rolls eyes)
<rick_h__> :P
 * rick_h__ tries to PUT to snap-l's api
<snap-l> pardon me while I contain my excitement
<Wolfger> You're pardoned
<brousch> wow. nautilus is using 800MB of RAM and it's not even open!
<snap-l> Don't use top to figure out memory leaks
<snap-l> nautilus may be using shared resources
<snap-l> That said, I think you have a legit complaint.
<brousch> well something's using a ton of ram, and i don't have anything abnormal open
<snap-l> brousch: Is it going to swap?
<snap-l> and how much is resident?
<brousch> not swapping yet
<snap-l> laptop, or desktop?
<snap-l> and are you using Virtualbox?
<snap-l> also, boxers or briefs?
<brousch> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/101667/Naughty%20Nautilus.png
<brousch> no, it's native install
<brousch> boxers
<snap-l> Hmmm...
<brousch> i don't event remember asking nautilus to do anything intense lately
<brousch> like viewing a folder of 10,000 photos and thumbnails
<snap-l> Can try killing it, and see if it balloons back up
<jrwren> only 10,000? it can't handle that? what a piece of junk.
<snap-l> sudo strace -p [process_id_of_nautilus]
<snap-l> can see what it's doing
<brousch> yeah, that's helpful
<brousch> NOT
<brousch> i killed it
<snap-l> and?
<brousch> it is better now
<snap-l> Wonder what caused it pain
<snap-l> You might want to keep an eye on it
<snap-l> I really wish Wordpress supported PostgreSQL out of the box
<brousch> mysql is just as good as postgres
 * Wolfger cringes
<Wolfger> I guess rick_h__ is not paying attention....
<brousch> trolling's no fun if no one bites
<snap-l> OK, this is a first
<snap-l> completel freezeof my Windows machine
<brousch> snap-l: eh? did you just turn it on for the first time?
<snap-l> Har har
<Wolfger> :-)
<snap-l> no, usually if Windows crashes, it's like a wall coming crumbling down
<snap-l> Really acting weird today
<snap-l> Had one instance where it dropped the tunnel because of no activity
<brousch> google+ will destroy facebook http://www.google.com/+/learnmore/
<snap-l> I love how these things are closed betas
<Wolfger> Heheheh
<brousch> you know you want in
<jjesse> i think they want to try and recreate the scarcity of gmail invites
<Wolfger> I want it to be open beta. WTF is the point of a closed-off social site?
<Wolfger> It'd be more useless that Identica or .... that "Free" version of FB I can't even remember the name of.
<jjesse> diaspora
<Wolfger> yeah
<Wolfger> I mean, those are useless because nobody wants to use them. A closed beta is useless  because nobody *can* use them
<Wolfger> Kinda like Wave...
<krondor> I think the closed beta really killed wave, took way too long for people to know people also on wave
<brousch> ug, wave
<Wolfger> Yep
<brousch> the slowness killed wave
<Wolfger> Obscurity/closed-beta and also a craptacular user interface killed it.
<brousch> and the fact that you had to write your own google app engine-based program to do anything
<Wolfger> pish
<Wolfger> it was fine as a standalone colaborative chat program
<brousch> slower than sucking shit through a straw
<Wolfger> I don't even want to know how you know the speed of that
<brousch> observation
<brousch> you can find anything on the internet
<brousch> haha "eldavojohn writes "If math gives you a raging brainer prepare yourself for MoMath opening next year to 'expose the breadth and the beauty of mathematics' in New York City."
<brousch> raging brainer
<devinheitmueller> Hey guys.  So I am in the process of building a REST/JSON API for a service, and am concerned about API documentation.  Anybody know of any good tools for this sort of thing?
<snap-l> I wonder if there's a way to speed up Ubuntu One using rsync
<devinheitmueller> .... and no, I believe the whole notion that "REST is self-describing" is a load of BS...
<snap-l> devinheitmueller: I totally agree with you there.
<devinheitmueller> I know the API is going to have to be maintained, and I want strict controls to track changes over time and version the API.  This means being able to detect newly added fields and note that documentation is required.
<devinheitmueller> Looking at lots of other publishers of REST APIs, it seems that almost everybody is doing it by hand via a Wiki, and nobody ever actually versions their API since they apparently don't care about backward compatibility.
<brousch> backwards is for shmucks. go boldly forward! don't look back!
<Wolfger> LOL
<devinheitmueller> If this were SOAP, this is the sort of stuff I would be doing with WSDL, but there isn't really an equivalent for REST/JSON.
<devinheitmueller> heh
<snap-l> There's a WADL file
<snap-l> it brings the horrors of SOAP to REST
<devinheitmueller> Yeah, WADL seems like a pretty half-baked solution.
<devinheitmueller> And the W3C basically is giving no backing to WADL since WSDL 2.0 presumably accomplishes the same thing (but has no support for JSON as opposed to XML)
<snap-l> Yeah, we're implementing WADL for our REST which is essentially the same shit as our SOAP interface, just without the SOAP bit
<devinheitmueller> Also, there seems to be a real dearth of tools which actually support WADL, so having a formal interface description is not very useful if there are no tools which can use it.
<devinheitmueller> The SPORE stuff looked not too bad, but again, it's got almost no widespread implementation and it's client side only (unlike WSDL where you can use it for both clients and on the server to validate input requests)
<snap-l> Yeah, I'm not terribly familiar with what's the bet practices for REST
<snap-l> AFAICT, it's the reaction to the strictness of SOAP
<devinheitmueller> It's because SOAP is a b**ch to implement, and all of the implementations for various languages are of spotty quality and inconsistent.
<devinheitmueller> Unfortunately, I can easily say the same thing about XML, where under Perl there are about ten different parsers out there, none of which are available by default with the distro.
<Wolfger> snap-l: What are you saying? REST is to SOAP as Perl is to Java?
<snap-l> No argument here. :)
<snap-l> Wolfger: REST is to SOAP as Ruby is to Java
<devinheitmueller> I'm having similar challenges with JSON schema.  There is only one really solid/complete implementation, and it's written in JavaScript.
<snap-l> If you're looking for consistency, you should be looking at SOAP
<snap-l> frankly, REST / JSON are more cowboy tools
<devinheitmueller> If SOAP::Lite wasn't such crap, and if people didn't need a C compiler to build all the alternatives, I would seriously consider SOAP.
<snap-l> Python's SOAP library is quite nice
<devinheitmueller> Nobody in the real world uses Python.
<devinheitmueller> ;-)
<snap-l> If you really cared about SOAP Implemetations, you'd be using Java. ;)
<snap-l> And yes, I tried using SOAP::Lite. Writing XML by hand was less painful
<snap-l> couldn't figure out what problem it was solving, because it wasn't solving any problem I had.
<devinheitmueller> Well, I don't really care what language the customers use to communicate with my server.  It just needs to not be seriously braindamaged and/or have dozens of dependencies.
<devinheitmueller> Generally speaking though, most of the people who want to talk to my systems are "scripting people" like sysadmins, so Java is not really a common language of choice for that audience.
<snap-l> Just use RPC and get over with it. ;)
<snap-l> Who cares about the baby anyway?
<devinheitmueller> I used SOAP::Lite a few years back.  I did get it to work, but it was slow, carried dozens of CPAN module dependencies, and was a PITA to get the requests properly formatted.  Oh, and no WSDL support.
<snap-l> devinheitmueller: It's not gotten any better since then
<devinheitmueller> Oh, and SOAP::Lite's serializers would "guess" the data types based on the data, so you could end up with malformed requests if sending what is supposed to be a "string" containing "1234".
<brousch> Nobody in the real world uses Perl
<snap-l> Now now, all God's languages gotta get along
<devinheitmueller> I was kind of hoping that because REST is so much simpler, and in theory has more widespread language support that this would make it easier to provide an API that can be consumed by sysadmins.
<snap-l> devinheitmueller: And it is, but it's not self-documenting, nor is it as rigorously defined as SOAP
<Wolfger> snap-l: what about the devil's languages?
<snap-l> Wolfger: they all have the word "Visual" prepended.
<devinheitmueller> I cannot provide a solution that can only be consumed by Windows platforms.
<brousch> Mono
<Wolfger> snap-l: so ASP.Net is one of god's languages? O_o
<snap-l> Wolfger: Don't be daft
<Wolfger> ;-)
<devinheitmueller> In 2011 I would have assumed that it would be relatively easy to find an API mechanism which 1) doesn't have a zillion dependencies, 2) is widely available across a variety of languages, 3) allows some mechanism for versioning and documentation, and 4) allows for data-driven validation of requests/responses.
<snap-l> brousch: Mono is the reformation
<Wolfger> ASP... Python... languages of the snake!
<devinheitmueller> To quote Saul, "Asps, very dangerous..."
<snap-l> devinheitmueller: there's three problems. 1) W 2) W 3) W (and add a C for good measure).
<snap-l> Honestly, the W3C is like the anti-ANSI.
<Wolfger> I never thought it was that bad...
<snap-l> (not that ANSI is a standard I'd want to wish on anyone)
<devinheitmueller> snap-l: note, at no point did I even mention "conforms to standards" in that list.
<Wolfger> then again, I haven't paid attn to W3C since the early 90's
<snap-l> devinheitmueller: Correct, but SOAP got turned into shit by W3C, and REST is not far behind.
<brousch> doesn't everyone use json these days?
<snap-l> brousch: See above on why JSON has trouble
<devinheitmueller> snap-l: Ok, that part I won't disagree with.
<Wolfger> So... Let me get this straight:
<snap-l> devinheitmueller: And yes, it's harder than it should be to send over a string from one server to another and have it still retain stringness
<snap-l> or integer to retain integerness
<Wolfger> There's nothing usable out there, and nobody is doing anything to correct that situation?
<snap-l> Wolfger: Well, there are solutions, but Perl has poor implementations
<snap-l> Soap::Lite being rather egregiously bad
<snap-l> and the other SOAP modules for Perl requiring CPAN-hell and support C code
<devinheitmueller> If the implementation can parse WSDL, it will know exactly what the expected datatypes are.  Using auto-detection of datatypes based on the underlying data is just crappy.
<snap-l> devinheitmueller: And using Perl's auto-detection on top of it.
<snap-l> though Perl should know the difference between a number and a string
<snap-l> likely, under Soap::Lite, everything is a string
<snap-l> which pretty much defeats the whole purpose for SOAP
<Wolfger> well, under Perl, if you use 1234 like it's a number, it's a number, and if you use it like a string, it's a string. If SOAP::Lite has found a way to subvert that, I'm puzzled and impressed.
<Wolfger> or possibly just not understanding the situation
<jrwren> still on soap?
<snap-l> Y'know, sometimes I wish this company had chat rooms
<jjesse> aren't enterprise chat the whole Salesforce CHatter thing?
<jrwren> campfire
<snap-l> instead of watching e-mail threads with one line responses:  "SoapUI" (and the rest of the thread quoted, for good measure, including a 400KB image)
<snap-l> Well, this is cross-company
<snap-l> Campfire might work, but there's the problem of keeping folks using it.
<snap-l> I'd like to teach the world to use a fucking Jabber server.
<Milyardo> ^
<snap-l> (sung to "I'd like to teach the world to sing in perfect harmony"
<Milyardo> don't many XMLRPC libraries implement some sort of refelction in langanges that support it
<Milyardo> I know Apache's java xmlrpc library does
<Milyardo> While reflection is not quite the same a WSDL it could satisfy the need for documentation
<Milyardo> actaully I guess WSDLs are a form of reflection
<devinheitmueller> sorry, went afk.
<greg-g> https://twitter.com/#!/sandyarmstrong/statuses/85784278901854208  [OH on Google+ "I just noticed that your 'Epic Bros' circle looks a lot like my 'Douchebags' circle"]
<devinheitmueller> Wolfger: SOAP requires you to specify the types in the SOAP request, and the SOAP::Lite client guesses what type to specify based on the actual data in the scaler field.
<greg-g> oops, people are actually talking productively in here
<brousch> well we were
<devinheitmueller> Unfortunately, this conversation has only convinced me that this stuff is all indeed royally screwed up and I haven't missed something obvious.
<jrwren> sandy is cool
<brousch> rick_h__ snap-l My PyOhio talk has been accepted. I'm officially on the hook now
<snap-l> Awesomeness!
<binbrain> brousch: whats your talk on?
<brousch> snap-l named it
<brousch> Django and google App engine, Why I'm using Flask and EC2
<binbrain> whatever it is, you should change it last min to "The Power of MySQL w/Python"
<binbrain> ahh, cool
<binbrain> why are you using Flask :)
<brousch> Simple to learn, modular, easy to use on many platforms (private server, EC2, GAE, Dreamhost)
<brousch> I think it's a great framework for learning how to use frameworks
<binbrain> cool
#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-06-29
<snap-l> ANyone encypting their home directory
<snap-l> (and would be willing to present at MUG)
<snap-l> Blazeix: YOu around?
<rick_h__> brousch_: awesome on the talk!
<rick_h__> so anyone have a google+ invite to try out?
<snap-l> Not I
<rick_h__> sssshhhhh
<rick_h__> you guys are quiet today
<brousch> we're working!
<rick_h__> psh
<rick_h__> party party!
<brousch> i get to join you in the presenters' lounge at pyohio
<snap-l> I was up at 6am this morning to go help my father in law
<snap-l> He has parkinsons disease and managed to get stuch
<snap-l> stuck
<brousch> doh
<brousch> did you extricate him?
<snap-l> Well, JoDee's brother managed to do the extrication
<snap-l> but we still drove across town to help
<snap-l> This is not a sustainable proposition
<rick_h__> ruh roh
<snap-l> Yeah, fun fun
<snap-l> so I'm a little tired and cranky
<rick_h__> double ruh roh
<rick_h__> brousch: yea cool, I don't recall if there was a speaker lounge before
<brousch> my grandma paid us a surprise visit last night. i had to hastily construct a ramp for her wheelchair to get her into the house
<rick_h__> but we'll startone
<rick_h__> well, I'll add feel good side: my grandma made us german pancakes for 2nd breakfast with strawberry preserves and whip cream
<rick_h__> yummy
<rick_h__> but I have to start prepping for 11hrs inthe car tonight...ugh
<rick_h__> I'll catch up to snap-l tomorrow
<snap-l> Have a fun ride, eh?
<rick_h__> will tonight
<rick_h__> head back into town in time to catch the holiday weekend
<snap-l> Woo hoo!
<snap-l> Also found out last week that my boss is moving on
<snap-l> and that I get a new boss, who has already sent me a cryptic linkedin request
<snap-l> Hope you enjoy [redacted] project
<snap-l> which means nothing to me at this point
<snap-l> Hey, Unity upgrade
<snap-l> wonder if they fixed anything
<bmcmahon> anyone remember what $? is in bash
<snap-l> Not offhand
<snap-l> Though I think it's the return code of the previous command, if memory serves
<snap-l> root@lister:~# false
<snap-l> root@lister:~# echo $?
<snap-l> 1
<snap-l> root@lister:~# true
<snap-l> root@lister:~# echo $?
<snap-l> 0
<snap-l> Odd, just got an email verification for linkedin on my gmail
<snap-l> which is not tied to linkedin, afaict
<bmcmahon> that does look to be the case
<snap-l> There's some Perl love on O'Reilly's site today
<snap-l> ie: new version of Learning Perl is on sale
<snap-l> (and yes, I picked it up)
<snap-l> Apparently the shortest distance between O'Reilly and my wallet is through their website.
<snap-l> Is This the Right Book for You?
<snap-l> If youâre anything like us, you probably didnât get to browse this book before you
<snap-l> bought it. As we finish up this edition, the bookstore Borders is closing many of its
<snap-l> stores and other booksellers arenât doing much better. You might be reading this book
<snap-l> in a digital form that you downloaded, or as HTML in Safari Books Online. How can
<snap-l> you find out if this book is the one you want to buy if you canât look at it first? How
<snap-l> can we warn you off if you need to buy the book to read this paragraph?
<snap-l> (sorry for the spam, but thought that was rather prescient)
<ColonelPanic001> Welcome (to) The_Machine
<brousch> i just bought Learn Python the Hard Way PDF+ePUB for $1
<Wolfger> Why do you want to do it the hard way?
<brousch> I don't, but I figure for $1 I can support a good cause
<rick_h__> supporting that guy I'm not sure counts as a good cause
<rick_h__> but then again, maybe it does, just don't know
<brousch> any python book is a good cause ;)
<snap-l> Yeah, I'm tempted to send Zed some $$
<snap-l> rick_h__: I totally understand your reservation, though
<brousch> what is the reservation?
<snap-l> Well, he might get bored or pissed off with Python
<snap-l> and essentially raze the community. ;)
<brousch> I guess I know nothing about him
<snap-l> http://zedshaw.com/rants/rails_is_a_ghetto.html
<brousch> ah, that guy
<snap-l> http://techcrunch.com/2008/01/01/zed-shaw-puts-the-smack-down-on-the-rails-community/
<snap-l> Yeah
<Wolfger> Heh. zedshaw link is blocked by work.
<Wolfger> They must be rails fans... :-)
<brousch> hm, i want my $1 back now
<snap-l> brousch: Dude, enjoy the book
<snap-l> don't worry about it
<Wolfger> Facebook has CIA backing? I'd like to see some citations on that...
<snap-l> Wolfger: My tinfoil hat told me so
<snap-l> it said it was on the wikipedias
<brousch> i'm removing my tweet
<snap-l> brousch: Why?
<snap-l> Seriously, don't buy into a cult of personality
<snap-l> good, bad, or indifferent
<brousch> i cannot endorse that kind of person
<Wolfger> I don't disagree with everything he says, but he has a lot of rage about not being able to find a job, and I'm thinking, "I would never hire anybody with an attitude like this, regardless of skills."
<Wolfger> Google offered him a position, and he basically threw it in their faces, and he goes back to whining about not being able to get a job.
<Wolfger> total douche move
<snap-l> Well, he did wake up folks to something that we kind of intuited
<brousch> I don't mind a little justified arrogance, but he puts a bad taste in my mouth
<Wolfger> ^^
<rick_h__> yea, he's a little bit of a controversial member of the community
<rick_h__> but he's a member, and he does things, like that book, and teaches a class around it
<rick_h__> but he's got some parts that are ghetto we just stay away from
<Wolfger> That's like saying brousch is a bit of a troll...  ;-)
<rick_h__> that's why I said I'm mixed on it
<rick_h__> psh, brousch is speaking at PyOhio, he gets an awesomesace+1 sticker
<brousch> I'll still read the book, but I won't pimp it. Unless it's really good.
<rick_h__> yea, I mean pimp the good works
<rick_h__> I'm all for that
<brousch> hah, but my talk at PyOhio is basically trolling!
<rick_h__> he's a bit polorizing
<rick_h__> brousch: all good, the 'beta' schedule is up but not accounced yet
<rick_h__> http://pyohio.org/schedule/
<rick_h__> we don't conflict so bonus
<Wolfger> LOL. "Django and Google App Engine: Why I'm using Flask and Amazon EC2"
<Wolfger> Yeah... total troll
<Wolfger> The PyOhio website makes me feel like I should be wearing red/blue 3D glasses.
<Wolfger> Immediately following brousch (in a different room, though) is the Django web framework primer
<brousch> nice. i'm probably going to tune my talk to beginners
<brousch> more like "Why Flask is better for learning web frameworks"
<brousch> oooh, rick_h__ is in the Barbie Tootle room
<rick_h__> woo!
<Wolfger> Heheh..... 'If a programmer tells you to use vim or emacs, tell them, "No."'
<brousch> is that that annoying round room?
<rick_h__> no, we're not using the round room this year
<Wolfger> 'A programmer will eventually tell you to use Mac OSX or Linux. If the programmer likes fonts and typography, they'll tell you to get a Mac OSX computer. If they like control and have a huge beard, they'll tell you to install Linux.'
<Wolfger> ...my beard is not huge. :-p
<brousch> we need something for friday night for those of us driving a long way
<snap-l> Yeah, we'll need to hook up for dinner or something that evening
<brousch> i'm rooming with another guy from GR
<brousch> have 2 others that might come
<Wolfger> The # is called an octothorpe? I never knew.
<rick_h__> http://warpspire.com/posts/designing-github-mac/ is interesting
<snap-l> Gah, I haven't installed LaTeX on this system yet. :)
<rick_h__> oops
<rick_h__> I don't know I've ever installed that
<rick_h__> oh, well I did try that one gui editor once a long time ago
<snap-l> Death of the SSH key. People should be able to connect to GitHub with their GitHub username and password.
<snap-l> I have mixed feelings about that
<rick_h__> yea, but I understand
<rick_h__> I had the same thing with bookie logins
<rick_h__> "do I figure out how to do oauth to services/etc"
<rick_h__> nope..just good ole, pick a username/password
<brousch> rick_h__ snap-l did you guys reserve rooms for pyohio? we're staying at the red roof inn for $79/night
<rick_h__> no, going to reserve when I get back
<rick_h__> at the blackwell
<rick_h__> snap-l: we heading back after talks on day 2 like last year?
<brousch> it looks like they added lightning talks on saturday too
<rick_h__> yea, we skipped them last year to head home
<rick_h__> I'll try to get bookie onto day 1 lightning talks
<rick_h__> but I've got my talk right up against it, so we'll see
<snap-l> I have created a makefile for my resume
<snap-l> fear me
<rick_h__> lol
<snap-l> rick_h__: I'm planning on heading back on Sunday
<Wolfger> that's just wrong
<_stink_> it's the only way to do it when your resume is in latex.
<_stink_> well
<_stink_> it's a good way.
<snap-l> Yeah
<brousch> why not rst?
<snap-l> because I found a resume template in latex forst?
<_stink_> just curious, b/c i know nuhsink about rst
<_stink_> can one do nice math in rst?
<snap-l> I don't believe so
<snap-l> not like LaTeX, in any event
<rick_h__> http://www.programmerq.net/rsttricks.html#math-and-equations
<rick_h__> :)
<snap-l> or if it does, it'll likely drop to latex
<rick_h__> just include latex
<_stink_> holy blarg
<_stink_> that is nice
<rick_h__> you guys send some caffeine thought my way from CHC
<snap-l> rick_h__: You betcha
<snap-l> I should play "Sex on Wheelz" by My Life With The Thrill Kill Kult on my next conference call
<Wolfger> Hard body Motor City
<snap-l> Love Life!
<Wolfger> snap-l: any particular reason for that song, or just looking for something business-inappropriate?
<snap-l> Was just ripping that disc
<Wolfger> ++
<Wolfger> I also have another album of theirs... Devilbunny I think it was?
<Wolfger> I need to go dig those out now for a good relisten. Though I think the last track from SOW was scratched :-p
<snap-l> Yeah, I only have Sexplosion
<Wolfger> It was the far superior album
<Wolfger> I like most/all of the tracks on that one. The other only had 2 or 3 I really liked.
<Wolfger> seatbelts, helmet laws, perl, java, python sucks, nickleback rules...... Somebody say something!
 * Wolfger is bored
<brousch> ubuntuone has an android files app now. it's starting to look viable for me
<Wolfger> trudging through the last 40 minutes of the work day, without really having anything to do.
<snap-l> I'm on a conference call so I'm not able to snark at my usual level
<brousch> and they let me have more than 100GB of storage
<Wolfger> Oooh. Another Android app to download
<brousch> it can autoupload photos you take
<brousch> nice
<snap-l> That's clever
<brousch> i need a dropbox export so i don't have to re-upload 40GB of data
<Wolfger> Hmm. I only see Ubuntu One Music Store app in AppBrain
<brousch> Wolfger: http://voices.canonical.com/ubuntuone/
<brousch> i got it from the google market
<Wolfger> got it. Thanks
<Wolfger> 8 suicide bombers kill 10 at Kabul hotel
<Wolfger> ...
<gamerchick02> howdy. anyone in here go with jolicloud?
<Wolfger> that's a sad kill ratio for using bombs
<gamerchick02> Wolfger, :(
<Wolfger> gamerchick02: I tried it once. Didn't stick with it long at all
<brousch> gamerchick02: i've tried it
<gamerchick02> i'm thinking of giving it another go on my netbook.
<snap-l> Wolfger: Did they say if th bombers were included in that number?
<brousch> it's not bad. comprable to chromeos
<Wolfger> I wonder if the 8 suicide bombers account for 80% of that death toll....
<snap-l> Jinx!
<Wolfger> doh
<Wolfger> I'm thinking even if all 10 were innocents, they could have gotten far better results with kitchen knives.
<Wolfger> I guess "suicide knifer" just doesn't have the same ring to it
<gamerchick02> no it doesn't, but that'd be pretty spectacular if someone could pull it off.
<Wolfger> In sadder news, the very worst part of health care reform was upheld by the courts: http://www.cnn.com/2011/US/06/29/health.care.appeal/index.html?hpt=hp_t1
<gamerchick02> nice. i'll never be able to afford health care.
<gamerchick02> i guess i'm paying extra taxes.
<gamerchick02> wait!!! i'm not working.
<gamerchick02> so i can't get a job. i can't afford healthcare. i'm FUCKED.
<Wolfger> OK, now I'm confused. The headline says 8 killed 10, the story says 9 killed 9.
<_stink_> if it's the latter, then it's just Heaven's Gate.
<Wolfger> only 6 of the 9 detonated, snipers got the other 3. Two cops and 7 civilians were victims.
<Wolfger> "One of the suicide attackers told us on the phone that they are in the lobby and chasing guests into their rooms by smashing the doors of the rooms,"
<Wolfger> ...
<Wolfger> suicide bomber stops to chat on the phone?
<_stink_> hah
<brousch> shouldn't they be herding guests into a central area to make the most of each bomb?
<brousch> instead of chasing them into rooms?
<ColonelPanic001> they aren't suicide bombers because they think long-term
 * _stink_ alerts FBI about brousch's expertise
<ColonelPanic001> yeah. terrorist
<Wolfger> apparently they 8 who didn't detonate immediately upon entering the lobby went to the roof to launch rockets first
<Wolfger> so... makes slightly more sense. Still not the brightest of terrorists. (thankfully!)
<brousch> rocket? aka set their boots on fire and jumped as far as possible?
<brousch> oh, nice, in ubuntuone i can choose which files to sync where
<snap-l> I think the health care law only went half-way
<snap-l> 1) require everyone to be insured, but 2) require health insurance to be lower cost so you'd be a damn fool not to take advantage of it
<snap-l> Of course, #2 is the harder of the two to mandate
<gamerchick02> OT (well, maybe not): is there a way to block contacts in empathy? has there been bugs resolved? i've been searching on askubuntu as well as bugzilla and launchpad, and nothing seems to be resolved. do the empathy people not bloody care? (i'm getting aim spam now. was msn. >_<)
<gamerchick02> i'm about to change my username. i don't really want to do that because i've had this name for, uhm, longer than 10 years.
<snap-l> There's a blocked contacts list in empathy
<snap-l> but I'd recommend another approach
<brousch> ug, empathy is annoying
<gamerchick02> how do i get to said blocked contacts list?
<gamerchick02> the peeps that keep im-ing me are not contacts.
<gamerchick02> they're people who are just im-ing people.
<gamerchick02> what's your other approach, snap-l?
<snap-l> gamerchick02: not seeing it right now
<snap-l> There's a way in Pidgin to block contactacts that aren't in your list
<snap-l> and I'm not seeing a way to do that in Empathy
<gamerchick02> yeah, i know. douchenozzle didn't im me back when after i installed pidgin and logged in. >_<
<gamerchick02> blocked contacts is only for g-talk/jabber, it looks like.
<snap-l> douchenozzle? :)
<gamerchick02> yessir.
<_stink_> i will henceforth be using that as a term of endearment.
<snap-l> OK, is this just for AIM?
<gamerchick02> aim and msn
<gamerchick02> i ditched my icq account because of the marriage proposals from india.
<snap-l> Frankly, I had to quit using AIM and ICQ because the spam was abominable
<snap-l> never used MSN
<gamerchick02> this is the first aim spam i've had.
<gamerchick02> which is strange. icq was horrible for spam
<gamerchick02> none on gtalk (thank ye gods)
<brousch> i can't believe people still use aim
<gamerchick02> i have a couple of people i chat with over im.
<brousch> you need to visit these people and kick them in the shins until they get a jabber-based account somewhere
<snap-l> Yeah, I basically sent a message to everyone in my IM list for AIM that said "I'll be over here if you want to talk to me", and deleted my account.
<gamerchick02> and with a client like empathy, the whole concept of accounts becomes a moot point, since you can merge contacts together.
<gamerchick02> wow.
<gamerchick02> snap-l, i'd love to do that
<snap-l> There's nothing stopping you
<snap-l> I think AIM supports jabber (or I've heard rumors to that effect)
<gamerchick02> but what's the login for jabber? I'd love to convert my aim over to a jabber account
<gamerchick02> user@aim.com?
<snap-l> Do you have Google Talk?
<gamerchick02> yessir.
<snap-l> Let them figure it out. ;)
<gamerchick02> who doesn't have google talk? really.
 * snap-l is a right bastard sometimes
<snap-l> http://florianjensen.com/2008/01/17/aol-adopting-xmpp-aka-jabber/
<brousch> i turned on chrome's pre-fetching thing and it freaks me out sometimes
<brousch> i type like 2 letters of my destination and it's already rendered
<gamerchick02> eff yeah xmpp and aim connection.
<gamerchick02> this is so much better
<gamerchick02> i've deleted my aim name out of empathy; that should thwart the spammers.
<snap-l> Ideally. :)
<snap-l> http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2011/06/29/these-2-companies-will-never-turn-a-profit.aspx Harsh take on Pandora
<snap-l> but I think warranted
<gamerchick02> well, if i get an android, i *might* pay for pandora
<gamerchick02> not sure though
<gamerchick02> i'd never pay for sirius.
<snap-l> I paid at one point
<snap-l> I still say ubiquitous bandwidth in the car will make Sirius/XM's product worth far less
<gamerchick02> yes.
 * greg-g waves
 * greg-g grumbles at the server restarting and losing my irssi channel list that I hadn't saved yet
<snap-l> heh
<gamerchick02> greg-g sound crappy. :(
<gamerchick02> holy cow. typing #FAIL
<gamerchick02> greg-g, that sounds crappy. there we go
<gamerchick02> let me just babble incoherently and string words together.
#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-06-30
<snap-l> Hey, someone bought myspace
<snap-l> Now it can die in peace
<brousch> greg-g: I am technically a minister of some kind
<greg-g> brousch: awesome, we might be out that way soonish, I'll let you know what happens :)
<brousch> http://www.themonastery.org/
<brousch> anyone can become one
<greg-g> I think I did that in undergrad
<greg-g> does that work in Michigan?
<snap-l> I'd become a minister of the Church of the Subgenius, but I think it's more than $5 now
<brousch> it works in MI last time i checked
<greg-g> cool
<snap-l> http://www.subgenius.com/scatalog/membership.htm
<greg-g> I wasn't sure if you needed anything else on top of it
<snap-l> Oh, UNiversal Life church?
<snap-l> I had a frined that got married by somone who I believe was part of ULC
<snap-l> she worked out if (i kid you not) a rented office space.
<snap-l> strangest wedding I've been to
<greg-g> :)
<brousch> well the idea is anyone should be allowed to marry
<brousch> not just people who can find a "real" minister or judge
<brousch> so even though greg-g worships FSM, I can still marry them
<greg-g> might get a coworker to do it tomorrow in the office :)
<brousch> what's the hurry?
<greg-g> health insurance for the pregnant lady :)
<brousch> ah
<greg-g> ok, time for a walk, back later!
<snap-l> Hmm... Subgenius would take time.
<snap-l> I don't think you can overnight slack.
<brousch> greg-g: http://www.themonastery.org/?destination=wedding-officiants&wide=US&narrow=MI
<snap-l> You could head to Taylor or Hazel Park and get the shotgun special
<snap-l> Rev, Brother Rauk Zenta of Michigan
<snap-l> That's a man that loves titles
<snap-l> http://ministers.themonastery.org/profile/raukzenta69
<snap-l> Holy shit, they've created Myspace as well
<_stink_> greg-g: yeah, anyone who does the Universal Life Church thing is legit in MI
<snap-l> Who needs Google Plus invites?
<greg-g> me!
<greg-g> _stink_: awesome
<greg-g> snap-l: greg.grossmeier@google'sbigemailserver.com
<snap-l> greg-g: Sent
<snap-l> greg-g: Did you receive it?
<greg-g> snap-l: yep! thanks
<greg-g> sorry, was too busy categorizing people :)
<snap-l> Awesome.
<snap-l> Have you posted something? :)
<greg-g> not yet
<jjesse-netbook> evening
<greg-g> oh crap, now carrie isn't going to come to bed, I invited her to google+
<greg-g> jjesse-netbook: want an invite?
<jjesse-netbook> greg-g:  sure would be fun
<jjesse-netbook> is it worth it?
<greg-g> we'll see. it is well designed
<jjesse-netbook> greg-g:  jjesse AT  gmail DOT com
<greg-g> sent
<jjesse-netbook> thanks
<jjesse-netbook> looks pretty cool
<greg-g> yeah, not bad eh?
<jjesse-netbook> so am i supposed to replace facebook with it or what?
<_stink_> greg-g: any invites left?
<snap-l> _stink_: I have some, I think
<snap-l> Eep, maybe not. :(
<_stink_> no worries
<snap-l> god i am an idiot
<snap-l> spent way too long trying to figure out an ssh problem that was easily fixrd by not usi g the wrong file
<snap-l> idiot
<snap-l> ou well
<rick_h_> wheee
<rick_h_> sounds like a fun time
<rick_h_> made it back safe
<rick_h_> now just too wired from 11 hours driving to crash
<rick_h_> ugh
<rick_h_> and no one's up yet
<rick_h_> boooo
<rick_h_> greg-g: ty sir for the invite, only thing is I really want to use with my 'identity' but that's an app account and it doesn't work with apps accounts yet :(
<rick_h_> but dying to try out after listening to TWiG on the way back up north
<rick_h_> there's someone
<rick_h_> wonder if it's just auto join brousch
<rick_h_> jcastro is up doing what?
<jcastro> yo
<rick_h_> dude, wth are you doing?
<jcastro> ?
<rick_h_> with that screenshot on twitter
<rick_h_> at pre-6am
<jcastro> oh
<jcastro> I am in ireland.
<rick_h_> oh riiight, makes a lot more sense
<jcastro> heh
<brousch> heh
<brousch> i'll be back in an hour or so :P
<greg-g> _stink_: email?
<Wolfger> well that didn't take long... Google+ is already blocked by work.
<Wolfger> Morning everybody
<greg-g> hah
<snap-l> what the fuck?
<snap-l> was re decnet
<snap-l> figured thr great firewall of chrusler was probably on the case already
<brousch> morning
<snap-l> howdy
<snap-l> Man, I am tired
<snap-l> Sure that rick_h_ is also tired
<snap-l> My FIL keeps getting stuck because of his parkinsons
<snap-l> so we keep heading over there. Last night was at midnight
<snap-l> and of course I had to start dicking with SSH on the ipHone
<snap-l> and make stupid mistakes
<snap-l> OK, time to make some coffee
<brousch> time for a live-in nurse
<brousch> i guess my 5:30am wake up from the boy isn't so bad
<Wolfger> Mmm... Coffee.
<brousch> an excellent idea
<greg-g> someone give _stink_ an invite, I can't find my invites anymore
<brousch> i have some
<brousch> hm, it won't let me
<brousch> is it restricted to gmail and google apps emails?
<brousch> no, he has gmail
<brousch> i guess i don't have any invites
<Wolfger> Yeah I noticed last night that I could only invite certain people.
<Wolfger> Not sure how that works.
<greg-g> snap-l: / rick_h_ which one of you wants to receive an Ubunut banner for the LoCo team for events? We get one for free from Canonical, but I'm worried about how long it might take to ship and whether I will be at my address when it arrives
<greg-g> heh, make that Ubuntu
<Wolfger> Ubunut!
<Wolfger> We're a bunch of Ubunuts. I like it.
<snap-l> If we're worried about shipping time, then it might be better to ship it to rick_h_. Not sure how long I'll be at this address.
<snap-l> May be longer, may be shorter.
 * greg-g nods
<greg-g> rick_h_: PM me your mailing address, plz :)
<brousch> hah, found the google+ invite loophole
<Wolfger> spill it, man
<Wolfger> This is full of win: http://shirt.woot.com/shirts/pierate-chart
<brousch> i guess you can forward a post to the email
<brousch> so i forwarded a post to _stink_ via email, and he should get some kind of invite
<Wolfger> well, that's only a loophole if doing that actually results in an invite.
 * Wolfger waits and sees
<brousch> yeah, _stink_ will have to report back
<brousch> I have one confirmation that the loophole works
<brousch> sent out a bunch more
<_stink_> brousch: booyah, thanks!
<_stink_> the loophole works
<_stink_> you have outsmarted google
<brousch> hm, i think i saw it on Droidlife
<jjesse> morning
<jjesse> brousch nice to hang out with  you guys again last night
<brousch> yeah, it was good to see you again!
<jjesse> though most of the conversation was over my head, silly coders
<brousch> yeah, mostly programmers there
<brousch> who else uses linux? ;)
<jjesse> basically :)
<Wolfger> Heh
<Wolfger> Programmers showed up to CoffeeHouse *Coders*? Whodathunkit?
<snap-l> Yeah, no kidding
<snap-l> We had a light turnout last night
<snap-l> though everyone there wasn't a regular
<snap-l> Duane, Jim, and Robert Citek
<jjesse> not coffeehouse coders that grlug social
<brousch> Wolfger: Ours is called the Grand Rapids Linux Social
<brousch> we had 10 last night!
<Wolfger> brousch: My bad. Forgot about you west-siders ;-)
<brousch> You east siders often do
<Wolfger> how dare you do something different from us, on the same night? :-p
<snap-l> There's a west side? :)
<snap-l> Actually, there is. WE call it Novi.
<brousch> there's more to michigan than detroit, you ghetto-dwelling auto manufacturuers!
<snap-l> ;)
<Wolfger> sez you!
<snap-l> Yeah, there's Amway
<snap-l> and Van Vander Van Plazas
<brousch> those are the same thing!
<brousch> we should rename GR to VanDeVos village
<snap-l> VanAndel Devos Inc
<brousch> I laugh every time I go in Meijer's and their prescription rack has 3 bins just for Van
<snap-l> Yeah, I remember the photo department had the same problem
<snap-l> usually UV are combined around here
<Wolfger> UVW and XYZ, or UV and WXYZ
<snap-l> Not there, though
<jjesse> people still use film
<jjesse> ?
<snap-l> jjesse: This was in 1989-1993
<snap-l> You know, prehistory
<Wolfger> The Dark Ages
<snap-l> Man, and Google Calendar got an update as well
<snap-l> Seriously, they're trying to pull me in again.
<snap-l> and by again, I mean further.
<brousch> the google loves you
<snap-l> Yes, I'm feeling quite loved.
<brousch> I love FB, the place where people you haven't spoken with in 15 years wish you a Happy Birthday
<snap-l> Heh
<Wolfger> I have a love/hate relationship with old code.
<Wolfger> I hate my old code, but I love the fact that I can look at it and instantly see what I should have done better.
<rick_h_> ugh, dammit for not letting me sleep more
<brousch> you get a "Daddy, I awake"?
<rick_h_> no, wife and boy are gone
<rick_h_> maybe grocery store? I'm not sure
<brousch> they didn't tell me either
<rick_h_> sneaky family, plotting to kill me in my weakened state
<Wolfger> LOL
<brousch> I like the "Daddy, I want to snuggle you" elbox drop at 5:30am
<brousch> elbow
<rick_h_> meh, he needs to stay away to survive
<rick_h_> he didn't sleep through the trip like he was supposed to
<_stink_> :/
<rick_h_> daddy doesn't like driving through mountains with screamy boy in the back
<_stink_> that sucks.
<rick_h_> mom didn't follow the rules either. Maybe they both left to crash in a hotel for safety
<_stink_> hah
<brousch> rules?
<rick_h_> yea, daddy takes one for the team and drives through the night so that the family can sleep and have a normal schedule/day
<rick_h_> if mom and boy don't sleep through the night, but make for a longer, harder, cry filled trip...they break the rules.
<rick_h_> wtf was dad doing driving through the night for then?
<brousch> interesting. i just tagged a photo of myself in snap-l's photo gallery and it reports it as craig maloney tagging me
<_stink_> bug!
<_stink_> rick_h_: did the wife scream too?
<rick_h_> _stink_: hah, no, guess not
<brousch> who is ryan kather?
<rick_h_> krondor
<brousch> ah
<brousch> sure, now he logs in and it's obvious
<rick_h_> lol
<snap-l> Heh
<krondor> anyone have any probs with freenode SSL cert today, or chat.us.freenode.net round robin connection?
<jjesse> is the google notice "there was a problem completing this action" the same as a fail whale on twitter?\
<brousch> jjesse: sometimes i get that when i'm not logged in quite right. a logout and login may fix it
<rick_h_> ok, hangout is cool, that is some smooth web ui
<rick_h_> jjesse: only works with a gmail account
<rick_h_> so you have to be on that vs your google apps account
<krondor> there's a bug in the android app, if you have more then one google account it will only show one.  Hope that's your plus account or you're SOL (like me)
<rick_h_> hmm, maybe because I just added my old gmail just for this it was the latest one and I could add it
<jjesse> i'm logged in with my gmail account, just getting the notice when i try to click on some pages or try to post, wonder if the server is overwhelemd
<greg-g> what was that service Shawn Powers used when his house burned down to raise money?
<greg-g> I got a buddy in Madison who's restaruant burned down today :(
<greg-g> chipin, thanks :)
<Wolfger> Ugh. Corp e-mail... "Outlook Tips: Did you know that you can add a page break to an e-mail message?" .... No. Did you know there's no earthly reason *to* add a page break to an e-mail message?
<greg-g> wtf
<_stink_> hah
<brousch> http://www.flickr.com/photos/brousch/5888401108/sizes/l/in/photostream/
<rick_h_> nice
<brousch> i love this thing
<jrwren> anyone use a default command with ssh?
<jrwren> e.g. I'd like byobu to be launched by default when I ssh to host... unless i tell ssh a command... but I'd really like to config this on my source host.
<jrwren> i guess I can just config it on the target host.
<brousch> greg-g: Married yet?
<_stink_> clearly his first minutes as a married man should be to get on IRC
<brousch> i was hoping
<brousch> if he had a smartphone his pocket would be buzzing
<_stink_> luddite
<krondor> someone called me during my vows, fortunately I had the foresight to let my best man hold the phone making him out to be the ass
<_stink_> haha
<_stink_> awesome
<krondor> I never did find out who the caller was...
<snap-l> I'm sure greg-g will tweet when the deed is done
<greg-g> MARRIED!
<snap-l> WINNING!
<snap-l> Congratulations!
<snap-l> See, I told you he'd post when the deed was done.
<greg-g> :)
<greg-g> alright, home time
 * greg-g goes
<snap-l> https://twitter.com/#!/EclipsePhase/statuses/86542445260701696
<snap-l> greg-g: ^^
<gamerchick02> congrats to greg-g. :)
<_stink_> greg-g: congrats!!
#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-07-01
<rick_h_> mpiccinato: dude
<mpiccinato> rick_h_: dude
<mpiccinato> =D
<snap-l> Just copied Ubuntu Hour / CHC into September
<snap-l> They managed to fix the timezone bug
<rick_h_> morning, man that felt good, first good night's sleep in a while
<mpiccinato> oh yea?
<mpiccinato> Has the little one been sleeping well also?
<rick_h_> yea, house in VA was too hot to sleep
<rick_h_> heh yea he's doing ok
<rick_h_> just first sleep post travel == good
<snap-l> Good morning
<rick_h_> party
<rick_h_> snap-l: should we plan up some lococast?
<snap-l> I'm thinking so, but not sure when.
<rick_h_> 91 for a high, I'll be hiding in the bat cave today. Daylight is overrated
<greg-g> :)
<rick_h_> I'm going to bombard my wife with links to seattle related stuff all day me thinks
<snap-l> rick_h_: I'm going to put a filter on your outbound pipe, so anything that says "Seattle" is replaced with "Grungeville"
<rick_h_> works for me, just also update google maps fot me pls kthx
<rick_h_> ok, laugh of the day "how can I integrate my php pages into the node.js web server?"
<snap-l> rick_h_: Seriously?
<snap-l> Though I'm sure that at some point, someone will implemenet mod_php.js, and the world will come to an end
<snap-l> God will just say "Seriously?" and pull the plug on the universe.
<brousch> so much for doing server maintenance on an official company holiday
<brousch> 3 other people are here
<rick_h_> oops
<rick_h_> boot them!
<snap-l> brousch: Did you send out a memo letting them know that the server was going to be down?
<snap-l> On the plus side, it means you'll have that many less people to inform that "Server's Down"
<brousch> well, it means i have to do it in pieces instead of all in one go
<brousch> i'm actually retiring our ubuntu 6.06 server today
<snap-l> Bah, piecemeal is for pussies.
<brousch> it's been our file server for 5 years
<brousch> virtual machine
<snap-l> Just head up to the floor, yell "FIRE IN THE HOLE", and take the whole server room down
<ColonelPanic001> What snap-l said
<ColonelPanic001> plz
<greg-g> +1
<ColonelPanic001> "Everyone hit save quick"
<snap-l> Seriously, worst part of sysadmin is waiting for everyone to finish what they're doing
<snap-l> that's when you find out that someone opened a document seconds before that requires a hour's worth of concentration to finish
<snap-l> and you just made it much, much worse.
<snap-l> I have a tree service outside pruning and shredding a mulberry tree that's on the property
<snap-l> neighbors at the apartment next door were getting tired of it dropping berries and bird shit on them
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> did you tell them the brids were trained?
<snap-l> I told them that the birds shit on my car too.
<snap-l> We live in Royal Oak. It's not like there aren't trees everywhere
<snap-l> I'm just hoping they don't kill the tree.
<rick_h_> yea, as much as I hate dealing with trees sometimes, I do love using them
<rick_h_> I wish I had a big one in the back yard
<snap-l> Not that I'm a fan of mulberries, since they stain the fuck out of everything
<snap-l> We used to have a few in the back yard, but my uncle / grandma cut them all down
<greg-g> I love mullberries
<snap-l> really pissed my dad off, since he technically owns the house, and they didn't ask.
<rick_h_> oh, they're having it trimmed?
<snap-l> so now we have this wide-open grassland in back
<rick_h_> oh, nvm...didn't read backscroll enough
<snap-l> Heh
<snap-l> I've been documenting their progress on identi.ca / twitter.
<snap-l> http://identi.ca/snapl
<snap-l> I love this:
<snap-l> http://identi.ca/conversation/75046538#notice-77560234
<snap-l> I get crankly when people equate CC with no-cost.
<brousch> married greg-g is in the house? i thought you'd be honeymooning
<snap-l> Every day in AA is a honeymoon.
<_stink_> i need to make a neat image of myself for all these damned social networks.
<_stink_> like rick_h_'s floating head.
<_stink_> all of mine are blank right now.
<_stink_> it's creepy
<rick_h_> heh, I need a new image
<rick_h_> ah crap, forgot my headphones at the coffee sho
<rick_h_> shop
<rick_h_> this is no good
<_stink_> :(
<rick_h_> yea, sitting next to a pair of teenage girls talking about how they're not talking to X and he let her hook up with his roommate Y
<rick_h_> ah!
 * rick_h_ runs
<_stink_> haha
<snap-l> I just took a photo of the tux that I wore for my bro-in-law's wedding
<rick_h_> if I ever have a daughter I'm going to jump off the nearest cliff
<rick_h_> "he's all like I have no morals...and now he wants..."
<snap-l> rick_h_: You've got a son. You'll be hearing how he never understands women
<_stink_> and the only reasonable response from a father is "i don't either"
<rick_h_> you've only got to get one to think you understand...part of the time
<_stink_> haha
<rick_h_> and the best way to do that is to shut up
<snap-l> Hangouts looks really interesting
<snap-l> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q3evAu7WN4Q
<snap-l> Looks like we need to plan out the September Global Jam
<brousch> yeah, i need to start draggin around my webcam so i can participate
<snap-l> http://loco.ubuntu.com/meetings/ubuntu-michigan/79/detail/ <- Added some more agenda items for the next meeting.
<snap-l> started another hangout
<rick_h_> but but but
<snap-l> ssh on thr iphone is awesome
<snap-l> save for typos
<rick_h_> heh
<snap-l> custom keyboard is a bit touchy
<snap-l> but i can irc
<snap-l> and if im patient, i could code on it
<rick_h_> that seems like a LOT of patience
<rick_h_> especially if vim'ing it
<snap-l> Do-able, but not pleasent to do so
<_stink_> yeah, i wrote a webapp for ham radio exam practice from my nokia when i first got it
<_stink_> since i was blown away i could to that from my phone
<_stink_> do
<_stink_> then my thumbs fell off
<rick_h_> anyone ever seen a hosting service that manages/runs your phpbb install?
<rick_h_> like hosted wordpress
<brousch> hm, what forums does sourceforge use?
<brousch> dreamhost has one click install+easy updating phpbb
<snap-l> brousch: SF used phpBB
<snap-l> as a hosted forum
<snap-l> Closest I've seen outside of that is self-hosted with something like Cpanel
<snap-l> or fantastico
<snap-l> (rather)
<snap-l> but that's not managing as much as it's copying over files when a new version hits, and praying that nothing breaks.
<brousch> forums suck
<brousch> use google groups
<snap-l> Forums serve a purpose
<snap-l> one which I'd rather delegate to something like Usenet. ;)
<snap-l> Have any of you seen an instance where multipart/related was used to upload files?
<brousch> related?
<snap-l> Yeah
<snap-l> What we're doing is uploading two separate files (one of XML content, and one of the attachment to be sent to a device)
<snap-l> Seems that multipart/formdata would be more useful for that, but apparently we're using related.
<rick_h_> I think related is partiall 'more correct' and not http specific
<rick_h_> since it's saying that the two files are related in the request vs you can take one, the other, etc
<snap-l> Yeah, unfortunately the tools that we're using don't seem to support it well
<snap-l> (soapui)
<greg-g> brousch: oh no! we're both gone the weekend of the UGJ!
<snap-l> This cannot last.
<snap-l> We need to go back in time and prevent brousch from getting married
<snap-l> or at least, not on the same day.
<snap-l> https://twitter.com/#!/migueldeicaza/statuses/86864028877590528
<ColonelPanic001> I can't "like" snap-l on facebook anymore :\
<snap-l> heh
<brousch_nook> Is this thing on?
<rick_h_droid> yep
<snap-l> still is
<brousch_nook> I love this thing
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> mpiccinato: ping
<mpiccinato> ping
<mpiccinato> whats up
<rick_h_> hey, was afk, you get the bookie stuff figured out?
<rick_h_> tags, etc
<rick_h_> I see you've got a pair of bookmarks, but no tags on them
<mpiccinato> Yea, will start tagging now that I know :)
<rick_h_> gotcha, you can edit a link by going back to the url
<rick_h_> and then hitting the toolbar again
<rick_h_> it'll load your stored data and you can edit/update/delete
<rick_h_> just fyi
<mpiccinato> woot, awesome
<rick_h_> snap-l: holy crap, new podcast episode 125mb
<snap-l> ?
<snap-l> rick_h_: ?
<rick_h_> there's this new node.js podcast
<rick_h_> so decided to check it out
<rick_h_> 125mb file
<snap-l> What the hell
<rick_h_> sorry, 135mb file
<rick_h_> for 90min
<snap-l> someone doesn't know what they're doing
<rick_h_> yea, floored me there
<snap-l> Still, I use VBR and joint-stereo, and don't get that kind of size
<rick_h_> no, I thought ours was kind of big
<snap-l> I think someone is using their music settings for this
<snap-l> 320Kbps, separate stereo, etc.
<rick_h_> ugh, painful to listen to
<snap-l> rick_h_: that good, eh?
<snap-l> _stink_: btw: You asked a while back for a C64?
<snap-l> Unfortunately, nobody I checked with has one available
<_stink_> snap-l: hey, thanks for checking anyway
#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-07-02
<rick_h_> is skype right? greg-g turns 29 tomorrow?
<rick_h_> he's not 30 yet?
<rick_h_> wtf
<greg-g> haha
<greg-g> yep, 29 tomorrow
<rick_h_> man, women are supposed to lie like that, not men
<rick_h_> you know you're turning 34
<rick_h_> just admit it
<rick_h_> "29, for the 5th straight year..."
<greg-g> :)
<snap-l> heh
<Blazeix> snap-l: super-delayed ping response (from tuesday)
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> that's some crazy lag
<snap-l> Blazeix: No worries
<snap-l> Figured it out. Was related to MUG and the front page
<rick_h_> wow, go-daddy sold eh? http://www.kansascity.com/2011/07/01/2988459/go-daddy-an-internet-domain-registrar.html
<greg-g> so, uh, my laptop isn't charging
<snap-l>  Interesting re: the godaddy sale
<snap-l> seems a bit shady
<greg-g> anyone in A2 have a lenovo charger I could borrow for 5 minutes? I need to know if I should order one today to have it by Tuesday
<greg-g> call me, 612-600-7193
<greg-g> powering down for now
<greg-g> rick_h_droid: rick_h_ : It is indeed the charger. We're packing up to head out for the next couple days. Will you be in town Monday night? Would I be able to swing by your place or something then?
<rick_h_droid> I'll be at Craigs place Monday night
<greg-g> ohr right!
<rick_h_droid> can make sure to bring it there
<greg-g> well, then I guess I'll be coming over there on MOnday night :)
<greg-g> snap-l: add me to the "coming late" category ;)
<rick_h_droid> hah
<snap-l> Heh, sure thing
<snap-l> I also have an extra charger if rick_h_ forgets.
<greg-g> rock
<greg-g> thanks guys
<greg-g> alright, time to pack up and head out. I'll call or just show up Monday night
<rick_h_droid> have fun
<rick_h_> phew, reached nap time
<snap-l> yay ssh
<rick_h_> that good?
<snap-l> banana republic
<rick_h_> that bad eh?
<snap-l> nah just not a br shopper
<rick_h_> I'm not either
<rick_h_> we had this discussion over vaca, I'm not a shopper at all
<rick_h_> <3 amazon
<snap-l> more eddie bauer
<rick_h_> REI + Woot takes care of me
<snap-l> heh
<snap-l> just copied a book to dropbox
<rick_h_> do you recall if you did the image in the audio file?
<rick_h_> ok, episode is out
<snap-l> blergh its hot in getr
<snap-l> here
<mpiccinato> rick_h_: yo
<rick_h_droid> yep
<mpiccinato> I am going to send you an invite for Had That Beer, just so you can check it out :)
<rick_h_droid> awesome
<rick_h_droid> rharding@mitechie.com
<mpiccinato> And bookie freaked out on me
<rick_h_droid> how do?
<mpiccinato> Slow internet connection + tagging really quickly = auto close the bookmark plugin
<rick_h_droid> enter will submit and close it maybe?
<mpiccinato> hmm, I will see if I can make it happen a gain :)
<mpiccinato> Also, there should be a loading indicator if it is fetching some data to refill an already bookmarked page
<rick_h_droid> yes, I need to see how to do that without flashing for fast loaders
<rick_h_droid> thanks for the notes
#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-07-03
<rick_h_> mpiccinato: https://github.com/mitechie/Bookie/issues/94 fyi
<mpiccinato> rick_h_: I will submit bugs there from now on :)
<snap-l> Man, I love Chimaira's song Resurrection
<mpiccinato> snap-l: that one is a little heavy for me :)
<rick_h_> welcome to snap-l :)
<snap-l> rick_h_: ?
<snap-l> Oh, the heavy stuff?
<rick_h_droid> heavier side of music
<snap-l> Yeah, I like it loud and crunchy
<brousch> too heavy? unpossible
<brousch> now i must find this song
<snap-l> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzv7O9siFXY
<snap-l> I think the video is shit, though
<brousch> i'm pretty sure i saw nips in that video
<snap-l> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-gHgDC6vXE
<snap-l> This is better
<snap-l> Well, it's what prompted me to post what I posted, anyway.
<brousch> not that there's anything wrong with that
<brousch> sounds good to me
<snap-l> Yeah, I first heard hem on a metal show in cleveland
<snap-l> They had a podcast that was the same as their radio show
<snap-l> was amazing
<snap-l> bbl
<brousch> still my favorite death metal song. my introduction to death metal courtesy beavis and butthead: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYdfsZRURF0
<rick_h_> snap-l: hah, nice edit on the lococast release
<rick_h_> making me out as the critic
<snap-l> rick_h_: Which edit?
<TeamXlink> What would I use if I wanted to use three or more decimal places? (Since a Double only provides 2.)
<snap-l> rick_h_: The mobile app on the iPhone is just a webpage at the moment
<snap-l> so no huddle for me
<snap-l> or at least I can't find out how to make anything work right on the iPhone for G+
<rick_h_83> ah, and crap forgot
<rick_h_83> no, I you're right
<rick_h_83> mobile app 'coming soon '
<snap-l> Yeah, likely when Apple gets a Round Tuit.
<snap-l> Whew, it's a bit warm outside again
<snap-l> Outside thermometer is reading 112F
<rick_h_> yea, just got in from mowing the lawn
<rick_h_> ugh to say the least
<rick_h_> man, google+ is much more full now
<rick_h_> tripling my circle sizes atm
<jjesse> now that my son is up we will be heading out to let him play in the sprinkler again while I wash the car, hopefully to stay cool...
<jjesse> on google+ i'm getting "friended" by people i have no idea who are
<jjesse> makes it interesting figuring circles out
<rick_h_> yea
<rick_h_> well if they friend you that's nothing
<rick_h_> it's just a chance to check them out and see if you do know them
<rick_h_> much like twitter
<rick_h_> I don't follow everyone that follows me
<jjesse> me either
<snap-l> Is Google Sync not working for anyone else?
<aupif> hi there, is anyone here familiar with amazon ec2 instances? I am having trouple running a python script on a linux instance I just started.
<aupif> I am doing some analysis on a 2.15 gig txt file, but after about 6 second of running the python program, the instance kills it.
<aupif> let me know if anyone can give me some insight
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-06-25
<noogenesis> so the best argument for tabs is that it allows for this:  lets say everyone on a project agrees on the basic indentation/style/formatting but disagrees only on how many spaces each indentation level should be
<noogenesis> in theory with tabs its easier to adjust your display of the code
<rick_h_> noogenesis: == derekv?
<noogenesis> yea...
<noogenesis> one sec
<derekv> weird
<derekv> somewhere I have that set as a fallback nick
<derekv> I guess I don't care that deeply about how much its indented.  8 would be way to much
<derekv> I think just about everyone uses 4 anyways... can't remember having worked with 2
<rick_h_> two is popular in ruby, coffeescript/js (ruby-ists) and html
<derekv> I'm not totally groking the arguments against tabs, but I really don't care ... I just want to configure my editor some way and save that in my dotfiles
<derekv> and go back to not thinking about it.
<derekv> But I don't want to be writing files that look like ass when other people open them.
<derekv> It looks like more people fall in the spaces camp
<derekv> here's the thing, i'll use emacs when I can but i'm often forced to use eclipse or xcode
<derekv> and I work with other who don't use the same editor, they will use eclipse or xcode or notepad++ or something,
<rick_h_> so the space thing comes down to looking right everywhere
<rick_h_> pastebin, other editors, terminal
<derekv> and not everyone is really aware of formatting issue ie not really aware of how their own editor works
<rick_h_> if I use 4 spaces, it'll always be 4 space
<derekv> Yea
<rick_h_> tabs just vary all over the place
<rick_h_> and then you get into the mixed tabs/spaces in files and have to deal with that
<rick_h_> in vim I can set it up (and most editors) to just use spaces, replace tabs with spaces, etc
<rick_h_> and never notice it again
<rick_h_> I hit the tab key, and all the editors enter 4 spaces for it, it's become the standard that tabs might have been
<derekv> yea it isn't default though
<derekv> eclipse is horrible
<derekv> and so is xcode
<derekv> the default settings just are all over the place
<rick_h_> yea
<rick_h_> fortunately I dont' tend to mess with devs using default things so I'm lucky that way
<rick_h_> and things like pylint/etc will get angry if you break things
<derekv> yea
<rick_h_> even python will get fussy if you mix tabs/spaces in a file so I don't tend to notice it muych
<derekv> So either I'm just going to find some settings that don't upset anyone for say xcode and emacs that don't cause whitespace wars
<derekv> eg ideally a file formatted in one, opened in the other and processed with a "correct formatting" command should have no changes
<derekv> it'll be spaces
<derekv> or just use this http://uncrustify.sourceforge.net/
<rick_h_> derekv: you're not in #bookie, but looking for opinions from users on favicon support: http://uploads.mitechie.com/favicon_sample.png
<rick_h_> ugh, this prod db migration thing is going to take forever.
<jrwren> AND, tabs aren't really eaiser. a good editor makes it easy either way.  << and >> in vim for example.
<derekv> ugh the thing is I whipped up this thing this week and didn't do much to the default eclipse config
<derekv> its not like really bad, but suddenly i'm annoyed with myself for not fixing that
<derekv> going over 80 chars etc
 * derekv looks 
<derekv> great it mixes tabs and spaces
<derekv> maybe I should fix this
<derekv> trying to decide which is worse
<derekv> its worse to leave it I think
<derekv> i found some of their code and its clean
<jrwren> is it python? python really does not like mixed spaces and tabs
<derekv> no no
<derekv> java
<derekv> its what eclipse does out of the box
<derekv> you know how they say you should be in touch with the people who actually use your software
<derekv> you can imagine the sorts of things that'd happen if the developers had no clue about the actual needs or wants of the people who were using the software, no understanding of the problem domain etc
<derekv> eclipse strikes me as that sort of software
<derekv> which makes it a sort of paradox
<snap-l> http://paste.mitechie.com/raw/ayBZIxIx5wpKRWzrQQk4/ <- They're definitely getting more creative
<snap-l> half-tempted to reply: "Oh yes, which of my vast number of industrial design posts caught your fancy?"
<snap-l> Funny enough, mug.org got the same thing
<snap-l> must be my strong undercurrent of industrial design hidden in my otherwise otherwise inane postings about life as a FLOSSie
<rick_h_> ok, so a little bit funny http://goo.gl/OWY1B
<shakes808> Morning
<rick_h_> party
<brousch> on
<brousch> snap-l: How the heck did you get first comment on that Maddog post?
<rick_h_> snap-l: is crazy like that
<snap-l> That wasn't first comment
<snap-l> it's in descending order.
<brousch> ah
<jrwren> lol
<jrwren> maddog Hall? what is he talking about?
<brousch> http://www.linux-magazine.com/content/view/full/55727
<rick_h_> widox: this mouse is kind of crazy.
<rick_h_> the scrolling haptic is cool, but still funny because it's not a straight pad like it looks like in the pic online
<rick_h_> snap-l: you're killing the bmark.us favicon flow :P get those sites to update!
<widox> rick_h_: oh, because it has a slight curve to it?
<rick_h_> no, it's like two split rectangles with a line in the middle that's like a visible sensor
<rick_h_> so you slide over this little slit in the middle and it detects it as 'scrolling'
<rick_h_> and middle click is to dbl click on that sensor
<widox> ah
<snap-l> rick_h_: Which sites?
<rick_h_> snap-l: all the music ones
<snap-l> Hah, bandcamp? :)
<rick_h_> check out the front page right now
<snap-l> Oh, nice.
<rick_h_> the first 4, and then the next 14 or so after that
<snap-l> sorry, mate.
<snap-l> bandcamp has a favicon, though
<rick_h_> hmm, looking
<rick_h_> ah, but skagos.bandcamp doesn't
<snap-l> I'm seeing one
<rick_h_> bah, http://s2.googleusercontent.com/s2/favicons?domain=bandcamp.com
<rick_h_> google doesn't know about it
<snap-l>     <link rel="shortcut icon" href="http://f0.bcbits.com/z/36/20/3620060950-1.jpg">
<rick_h_> http://bandcamp.com/favicon.ico
<rick_h_> hmm, wonder why they have rel=shortcut
<snap-l> Probably simpler than trying to stuff everyone's favicon into some rewrite rules.
<rick_h_> no, I get the icon bit, but not sure what shortcut is for
<rick_h_> and not sure you can have multiple values for rel
<snap-l> I'm seeing the shortcut being rendered as a favicon under Chrome
<snap-l> Maybe that could be a fallback rendering path?
<rick_h_> not sure, looking.
<rick_h_> in the offical favicon the rel='icon' is supported, but not seeing what supports rel='shortcut' and wonder if that why it fails
<snap-l> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Favicon#Standardisation
<snap-l> The popular rel="shortcut icon" theoretically identifies two relations, shortcut and icon, but shortcut is not registered and is redundant. In 2011 the HTML living standard[15] specified that for historical reasons shortcut is allowed immediately before icon;[16] however shortcut does not itself have a meaning.
<jrwren> snap-l: great comment.
<snap-l> jrwren: Thank you.
<snap-l> I love the "it's time for the Linux Desktop" mindset now that MIcrosoft is making it's own tablet.
<snap-l> It's as if there will be a Holy-Ghost revival of the OEMs as they SEE THE LIGHT!
<snap-l> And not the usual OEM machinations of "it must be a day ending in Y when Microsoft moves the goalposts"
<snap-l> That said, I think it'll be interesting times ahead if one of the majors threatens Linux.
<snap-l> but I'm not holding my breath
<krondor> snap-l:  well MS making a tablet I don't think is the big kick to the OEMs.  I'm actually thinking Apple eating MS lunch kind of opens the floodgate for Linux to an extent
<krondor> people willing to break that lock in maybe.. but yeah next years should be interesting anyway.  Using Win8 metroUI feels bad to me.
<krondor> I'm hardly the target market though, so there's that
<snap-l> Just seems like we're constantly looking something to grab onto in order to open the clamshell lock-in of the desktop
<jrwren> snap-l: actually, i was thinking about canonical's position with respect to 'tablet' why doesn't canonical enter the hardware market?
<brousch> Can I install KDE on the Unity Tablet?
<snap-l> jrwren: I'm not sure
<snap-l> Maybe because they don't have the hardware partners lined up yet
<snap-l> or maybe that's part of the plan
<snap-l> Frankly, I'd be wary of releasing hardware. Hardware is expensive, and depreciates rapidly.
<jrwren> yes, but it also makes $
<jrwren> but then that speaks to canonical's goals as a corporation. They surely must be more than just bug#1
<jrwren> hrm... how does upstart relate to collaboration?  http://www.canonical.com/about-canonical/overview
<jrwren> pretty simple answer afaict, its not a place where canonical wants to play.
<rick_h_> the landscape isn't exactly full of success there
<rick_h_> and there's work there with the TV/android that shows I think canonical is interested in working with existing hardware partners
<jrwren> paramiko or conch?
<rick_h_> paramiko has been superceeded (maybe it's back) from the fabric guys into just 'ssh'
<rick_h_> http://pypi.python.org/pypi/ssh/1.7.14
<rick_h_> he's basically got an approved paramiko fork used in fabric
<rick_h_> and is working on getting full permissions to paramiko since the original dev/etc are done with it
<jrwren> thanks.
<snap-l> There's still releases of paramiko
<snap-l> 2012-05-17
<rick_h_> yea, but I think they've comed from patches from the fabric team
<rick_h_> not 100% sure though
<jrwren> https://github.com/bitprophet/ssh/
<rick_h_> yea, bitprophet is the head fabric guy and was working around/fixing a lot of paramiko bugs
<snap-l> Yeah, the paramiko page is pretty lagged
<rick_h_> https://github.com/robey/paramiko/
<rick_h_> lol, linked from the front page of the paramiko site
<snap-l> Yeah, sar that
<jrwren> i updated http://wiki.python.org/moin/SecureShell to reflect it :)
<rick_h_> https://github.com/paramiko/paramiko
<rick_h_> see the last commit :)
<rick_h_> https://github.com/bitprophet/ssh/commits/master
<rick_h_> anyway, that's the story these days. It's a mess and hopefully the two will merge back into one and rule the world
<jrwren> doesn't seem too bad to me.
<rick_h_> well, it's been forever that paramiko was the game in town, and with bitprophet committing to both, life would be simpler if there was just one package to refer to
<snap-l> That's not pythonic. ;)
<snap-l> You have to have at least two compelling ways to do anything
<jrwren> i like diversity and choice. i love more than one way to do something.
<jrwren> i shall now refer to these differences between pragmatism and pythonicism as the idiocy of the pythonic or just pythonidiot
<jrwren> bsides videos are up https://www.youtube.com/user/BSidesDetroit
<krondor> jrwren: ++ thanks, I wanted to go to that but wasn't able
<rick_h_> when was this? totally missed it happened
<krondor> Weekend of June 1st at the RenCen I believe, twas free to I think
<rick_h_> hmm, just missed it I guess
<snap-l> ttp://arstechnica.com/security/2012/06/securid-crypto-attack-steals-keys/
<snap-l> add appropriate h in there
<snap-l> http://arstechnica.com/security/2012/06/securid-crypto-attack-steals-keys/
<krondor> it's been a rough ride for RSA lately.  Other tokens are impacted too, but it doesn't look like yubikey is impacted w/o pkcs#11
<snap-l> Nice. Moved from And Justice For All to to Frizzle Fry.
<snap-l> earlier today it was Limbomaniacs
<snap-l> Apparently the Squeezebox wants to remind me of college.
<snap-l> (and an elbow-to-the-throat to the first person who says "those were released when I was in middle school / elementary school / before I was born")
<brousch> How about, "I have no idea who that is?"
<snap-l> brousch: Metallica: ...And Justice For All
<snap-l> brousch: Primus: Frizzle Fry (first studio album)
<brousch> Yeah, onbviously I meant the other ones
<brousch> Ah, Primus
<snap-l> brousch: Limbomaniacs: Butt Funkin'
<brousch> If I had my druthers, I'd screw a chimpanzee
<snap-l> (Features Brain, later the drummer from Primus during the Brown era)
<snap-l> songs / videos NSFW
<snap-l> but one of my favorite out-of-print albums
<snap-l> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Guitarists/Buckethead_task_force/Limbomaniacs
<snap-l> Bah, I meant Stinky Grooves.
<krondor> snap-l: alice cooper fan?
<snap-l> krondor: Not a huge fan. I have a greatest hits album
<snap-l> just haven't gotten around to getting the rest.
<snap-l> Have tons of respect, though
<krondor> I watched an insane movie recently with a rant by a girl on how Alice Cooper is responsible for all metal including Punk, was kind of neat.
<snap-l> That's an interesting take on it. :)
<krondor> Movie was called God Bless America (indie film) http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1912398/
<snap-l> Will add to Netflix
<snap-l> I'd probably put Black Sabbath and Led Zeppelin in that category, but Alice Cooper definitely shaped the horror aspects of metal
<snap-l> Rob Zombie has admitted as much
<snap-l> Alice's interview on Metal: A headbanger's journey is pure gold
<krondor> hmm, I'll have to look that up.  I haven't listened to much Alice Cooper but I was thinking maybe I should
<snap-l> He's a Detroit native, and was on Frank Zappa's label fro a time
<snap-l> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alice_Cooper#1960s
<krondor> yeah I knew he was from here, I actually saw him when I was eating lunch in Royal Oak once walking around with Gene Simmons.  That was kind of odd.
<krondor> I have to say I don't particularly like Gene Simmons (not knowing him but seeing him on interviews and junk)
<snap-l> his public persona is that of a smug jackass, but I think underneath it is someone who genuinely would take a bullet for people.
<snap-l> That said, I also think if given an alternative, he'd shove other folks under a bus.
<jrwren> omg, loving my job today. i used this as a reference to write 15 lines of code to implement scp on top of 'ssh' https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~jbardin-deactivatedaccount/paramiko/paramiko_scp/view/head:/paramiko/scp.py
<jrwren> that was fun
<rick_h_> jrwren: :) awesome
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-06-26
<rick_h_> and the apple stereotype lives on http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304458604577488822667325882.html
<rick_h_> but backed by cold hard facts
<snap-l> rick_h_: Hah
<snap-l> Good morning fellow travelers
 * rick_h_ looks to be in his normal location
<rick_h_> but morning!
<rick_h_> :)
<shakes808> Morning
<brousch> I concur
<rick_h_> I'm doubtful
<snap-l> You've moved around the sun, though
<brousch> Good meeting last night. 50 people learing about Coffeescript
<rick_h_> very cool, it go off well then? I know you were nervous about the content/timing?
<brousch> Yeah, one of the guys really came through with a thorough intro
<rick_h_> good stuff
<brousch> 33 features in 33 minutes
<brousch> I like the Pythonic parts of Coffeescript, but the Rubyism disturb me
<brousch> The last thing in a function is what gets returned
<brousch> Conditional and existential assignment
<brousch> unless
<nullspace> morning all
<brousch> Geez http://threatpost.com/en_us/blogs/autocad-worm-stealing-designs-blueprints-062512
<brousch> Hm, autoCAD runs on OSX now. I wonder if this counts as another OSX virus
<nullspace> brousch: they've tested OSX AutoCAD and it's not vulenerable
<brousch> Darn
<brousch> I mean, that's good
<jrwren> anyone ever seen linux not respond to ipv6 neighbor solicitations and thus have link local not work.
<jrwren> the rubyisms in coffeescript are fine. its the javaisms that distrub me.
<rick_h_> ugh, nothing like code reviews to make you feel like a snobby elitist
<snap-l> rick_h_: Only you. I usually feel like I should join the circus.
<rick_h_> I feel like a bit of an ass, but oh well I guess. They told me to lol
<brousch> jrwren: I recognize that the rubyisms make me uncomfortable because I'm not very familiar with them. My gut tells me that they're too much implicit rather than explicit.
<snap-l> rick_h_: I wouldn't feel like an ass
<snap-l> They're asking for your opinion
<snap-l> you give it
<nullspace> jrwren: did you check your routes
<jrwren> yup, routing table looks good, although I have to admit I am not sure what the local routing table is all about. that was actually a surprise.
<nullspace> hmm same subnet?
<tony-smlr> I just started a IRC channel and want to log it,  Do you guys know who logs this channel and how they do it?
<rick_h_> tony-smlr: we're piggy backed off the ubuntu irc stuff: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Bots if I recall correctly
<tony-smlr> Thanks
<tony-smlr> rick_h_ thanks
<nullspace> rick_h_: alright tomorrow night is looking clear
<rick_h_> nullspace: awesome
<nullspace> what fs did you use on the SSD?
<rick_h_> just ext4
 * rick_h_ likes stable FS's that don't risk going boom
 * snap-l is a fan of ext4fs
<snap-l> But I'd like to try btrfs at some point
<brousch> Holy crap, DjangoCon US 2012 is $375 - $425
<snap-l> Yow
<brousch> That's one more conference I'll be watching while I exercise
<nullspace> ha I read that as Dragoncon, and was like why would any of us want to go to that?
<brousch> :P
<snap-l> nullspace: I would love to go to Dragoncon
<snap-l> They have a pretty nice skeptic track
<snap-l> and Spock's Beard played their one year.
<jrwren> its a link local address, so yes same subnet
<rick_h_> brousch: it's what pycon usually runs
<rick_h_> not extreme or anything
<nullspace> snap-l: maybe I'm odd but I have no interest, kinda why I dislike penguicon so muchnow
<snap-l> nullspace: I think you got too close to the sausage-making of Penguicon
<nullspace> it's just too much crazy in one place
<brousch> geezum pete http://docs.django-skel.org/en/latest/index.html
<nullspace> anyone have an idea on how pipe ttyUSB0 output into a log file but still output to gnu screen?
<nullspace> hmm would make more sense to pipe screen output to a log file as screen has the porper baud rate
<greg-g> this is awsome, orbitz is steering mac users to more expensive hotels: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304458604577488822667325882.html
<snap-l> nullspace: http://linux.about.com/library/cmd/blcmdl1_script.htm
<nullspace> http://www.gnu.org/software/screen/manual/screen.html#Logging
<snap-l> That works too
<jrwren> nullspace: tee ?
<nullspace> I was thinking that but I I'm trying to use screen for a serial console
<nullspace> I think the logging feature in screen will do the trick
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-06-27
<snap-l> I just replaced the cartridge for a turntable I got from my bro-in-law
<snap-l> Chalk that up to things I didn't ever think I'd be doing in 2012
<jrwren> hahahaha
<jrwren> got any records?
<rick_h_> http://goo.gl/8Ac8p
<rick_h_> vs
<rick_h_> http://goo.gl/A0fHm
<rick_h_> dammit...when's my plane leave?
<rick_h_> nullspace: snap-l widox Blazeix reminder early edition tonight
<nullspace> what does that mean? it starts at 7?
<rick_h_> ok, so I'm a geek, just set an alarm for the start of the google IO keynote
<rick_h_> nullspace: CHC is early edition last one of hte month and starts at 7pm
<rick_h_> extra hour of hacking goodness at the end of the month
<nullspace> rick_h_: android fanboy
<rick_h_> nullspace: actually, more interested in the non-android news but yea I guess
<rick_h_> there's leaks that the Chrome team has some neat stuff coming..and I am a chrome fanboi
<shakes808> good morning
<rick_h_> morning
<shakes808> rick_h_: This is totally your shirt http://shirt.woot.com/
<rick_h_> I LIKE it!
<rick_h_> ordered!
<nullspace> holy sweet fancy moses, 106 tomorrow?
<nullspace> 106 in the middle of a thunderstorm, really?
<brousch> eh?
<rick_h_> 106? I just saw 94 and that's enough for me to go hug my AC unit and give it a bath today
<brousch> Wow, we only have a high of 97 tomorrow
<nullspace> weather underground is reporting the 106
<nullspace> and it's so cool and pleast now
<rick_h_> yea, deck hacking atm
<brousch> "Hot and humid. Cooler near Lake MI" No? Really? You don't say.
<snap-l> Wow, 104 on wunderground for tomorrow
<snap-l> I don't think I want to come out of the house.
<nullspace> I think I'm staying in the basement
<brousch> I will go out just to experience the free sauna
<rick_h_> lol, so tempted to have this merge proposal message be "unf@#$# the sh!$"
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> good way to go brousch
<shakes808> rick_h_: lol thought you would like that shirt. It isn't "You're doing it wrong!" but close enough lol ;)
<brousch> I almost submitted a talk "You're doing it wrong! But don't let that stop you."
<brousch> Hm, what plugin do I need to view this? http://goo.gl/cwkAY
<rick_h_> http://goo.gl/cwkAY Ã¢ÂÂ this URL has been disabled.
<brousch> Huh, wierd
<brousch> It is a link to one of patents Apple just used against Samsung, on the USPTO.gove site
<brousch> Ah well, I think I found it on another site
<rick_h_> man, my wife is no fun http://paste.mitechie.com/show/710/
<rick_h_> I am impressed she remembers my license plate though
<brousch> What? she is vetoing the Star Wars family?
<rick_h_> appears so
<brousch> You need to get with your son and out vote her
<brousch> Or if she does not comply, make her the Jawa
<brousch> OMG. So Samsung is banned from selling the Galaxy Tab 10 in the US because it is a rectangle with rounded corners
<brousch> http://www.google.com/patents?id=6BsWAAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4#v=onepage&q&f=false
<snap-l> brousch: Yeah, I think I've bought my last Apple products
<snap-l> sorry, but this look and feel bullshit has got to stop
<jrwren> wtf are you... oh... lawsuits.
<snap-l> jrwren: Yeah, I'm late. ;)
<rick_h_> wow, https://github.com/joestelmach/lint.vim
<rick_h_> so most people just run through node, this guy compiles v8 itself
<jrwren> node is v8
<jrwren> err. node is built on v8.
<jrwren> strange that he dicided to go straight to v8 instead of node.
<snap-l> Maybe he's bucking the node hype
<rick_h_> exactly my point :)
<brousch> Hype? What hype?
<rick_h_> especially since node is packaged on most places now vs hand compiling v8, but more power to him. just a little wow
 * snap-l writes down to make the brousch troll script, ehere every word is replaced with "troll"
<snap-l> troll? troll troll?
<snap-l> ;)
<rick_h_> it needs more 'har's
<rick_h_> har? har troll?
<rick_h_> har har!
<snap-l> troll har troll
<rick_h_> there you go, sounds better to me
<nullspace> more lols too
<nullspace> trololololol
<rick_h_> naw, that's what we're for. We supply the lols and brousch  the har trolls
<brousch> Trollbot
<rick_h_> teamwork!
<brousch> Finally, I can replace myself
<snap-l> trolololol? That's Trevor
<nullspace> trevor who?
<brousch> I have been replaced by a tiny shell script
<snap-l> Oh, speaking of replacing, I'm this close to sending the AI tat loves Cat Pictures to a few forwarders
<rick_h_> brousch: naw, it'd require string manipulation, I'd go with perl :P
<snap-l> tjagoda
<snap-l> ^ nullspace
<nullspace> he stil lerks here?
<brousch> OK, real question: Does anyone remember if IPs on the PyOhio wifi are firewalled from each other?
<snap-l> He has in the past, though I haven't seen him in a while.
<snap-l> brousch: I'm not sure. I seem to remember some strangeness, but I may be making shit u
<snap-l> up
<brousch> It was a little strange, and ports blocked, but I don't remember if you could access other things on the same wifi
<brousch> I was thinking of running a Django server on the phone during the talk, and the audience could access it
<snap-l> I think that was the school wifi
<brousch> Right, it is provided by The OSU
<snap-l> They usually give out slips of paper with guest access
<snap-l> I'd bring your own router.
<brousch> Yeah, good idea
<rick_h_> brousch: yea, I'd probably make sure you had a backup plan you were happy with
<snap-l> Even if it isn't, at least you'd have some control over it
<snap-l> brousch: If you want, I can remind myself to bring the MUG router to PyOhio
<brousch> Nah, I have one in my user group kit
<snap-l> ok
<brousch> Calvin does not give us wifi, so I plug it in and make my own there
<snap-l> Yeah, the library wifi is OK, but it's congested
<snap-l> That and WPA2 is much more preferable. ;)
<brousch> heh
<brousch> I don't really worry about that. The 8 people using it are all sitting in the same room
<brousch> I like Vim on my phone because there's no decent pointing device. Makes it much easier to jump around in a file
<rick_h_> rlbtjfchhirrhbcgdfjujjg
<snap-l> Thanks. I needed a new keyword for my Perl program.
<brousch> rick_h_: What's this? Have you moved on from numbers to random characters?
<Blazeix> it's the vim version of the konami code
<rick_h_> bah, just glad it was this channel
<rick_h_> that's the migation from deck to indoors command
<brousch> heh
<rick_h_> your JS WTF of the day: https://pastebin.canonical.com/68988/ (only the top 8 lines)
<rick_h_> thankfully the latest version fixed the bug and that's how I found this issue
<brousch> I have to signin to see that
<brousch> I do not have access to pastebin
<rick_h_> ah right, my bad
<rick_h_> http://paste.mitechie.com/show/711/
<brousch> hm
<jrwren> really getting accustomed to ctrl @ capsloc position
<rick_h_> jrwren: best thing ever
<rick_h_> oh oh oh it begins https://play.google.com/store/devices/details?id=nexus_q
<rick_h_> I just finished porting all my AMZ music to google music last night yay
<rick_h_> bah, stream is choppy for me
<snap-l> ttp://www.pelgranepress.com/Birds/comics/120627-Almost%20Never.png
<nullspace> mmm jelly bean looks slick
<jrwren> i missed it, oh that is new android version?
<nullspace> 4.1
<nullspace> yeps
<rick_h_> yea
 * brousch grumbles about not even having ICS yet
<jrwren> lol
<jrwren> this is why apple is winning.
<rick_h_> winning what? :P
<rick_h_> for google and their revenue stream (apps/adds/data/etc) more units == better
<brousch> I donated $10 today to the guy making a great custom ROM for my phone
<rick_h_> mmm, phone is getting warm with the video
<snap-l> I'm still on 2.3
<rick_h_> chrome as the default browser, nice
<brousch> OMG I think it's working. Virtualenv on Android
<brousch> I feel so 1337. I am forking virtualenv
<Blazeix> according to my clock you forked the repo at 13:37. so that's double 1337.
<brousch> hah, that would be awesome
<Blazeix> or maybe that was your home_dir change. it was close, anyway
<brousch> darn, "source" doesn't work
<brousch> Blazeix: I'm not used to other people seeing my code. That's kind of creepy
<rick_h_> you can never go wrong with muppets! #IO
<greg-g> I just took a few pictures of the 64th largest privately owned yatch in the world (largest in N. America)
<rick_h_> greg-g: pics or didn't happen...oh wait
<Blazeix> brousch: i just followed you on github. maybe that legitimizes the stalking.
<Blazeix> or at least automates it.
<brousch> greg-g: Expect the owner's henchmen to break your camera soon
<brousch> I think this is actually working
<brousch> I had to create an ext2 partition on my SD card to hold the virtualenvs, then make 2 tiny changes to virtualenv.py for it to work
<greg-g> I was kind of worried for a second since I walked around one side to get a better shot and it was qausi roped off, :)
<rick_h_> waldo323_: reminder early CHC tonight
<snap-l> I am creating some evil code.
<snap-l> Parsing a YAML file to get field names and such, but it's making things kind of ugly
<snap-l> database_field_names.append(field.keys()[0])
<snap-l> excel_field_names.append(field.values()[0]['formal_name'])
<brousch> Is your extended pinky at the corner of your mouth?
<snap-l> brousch: No, but hopefully it will net me... One MEEEEELEIION dollars.
<waldo323_> rick_h_, thanks i will likely be late
<rick_h_> waldo323_: np, just reminder
<rick_h_> ok, so dammit why do I not go to IO again?
<rick_h_> I can pay $1500 to be an alpha tester!
<Scott_firebeta> you can also pay $300 to get an apple tv wannabe
<snap-l> rick_h_: Heh
<jjesse> yes but that apple tv wannabe is supposedly built in the USA
<jjesse> so yay for that
<rick_h_> yea, and BT/tie in to the content I actually buy/own
<rick_h_> still steep, but I'm more likely to get that than an apple tv any time soon
<jjesse> also super excited for Jelly Bean even though my phone is still at 2.4 or whatever
 * rick_h_ does the verizon wait...
<nullspace> I'm temped to check out iOS 6 as I'm now a iOS dev for my company
<greg-g> I'm sorry.
<jrwren> yay
<jrwren> congrats.
<jrwren> same company?
<greg-g> I love the creative commons mailing lists:
<greg-g> HELLO,Â THIS IS THE 45TH PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICAARLENEA BALLARD ELECTION NUMBER 2397855491.Â JUST CHECKING IN, NEED SOME ONE TO SPEND THE WORD FOR ME JAJASHABO-ARLENEA BALLARD THANKS!!!
<ColonelPanic001> watch it there. I'm a proud citizen of THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICAARLENEA
<greg-g> :)
<snap-l> Apparently one of the consulting firms I used to work with is on the fritz
<greg-g> heya ColonelPanic001, long time :)
<snap-l> They're sending me mainframe / DB2 and ASP.net jobs
<greg-g> anyone else use google calendar? is it loading for you right now?
<rick_h_> loading here
<snap-l> I wonder if their events bullshit is taking it down
<ColonelPanic001> hi greg-g
<ColonelPanic001> I'm here in the workday,just usually have little to say
<greg-g> snap-l: I am on the west coast, it might be hitting the wrong mirrors :/
<ColonelPanic001> west coast is wrong coats
<ColonelPanic001> west coast is wrong coast
<ColonelPanic001> I have no opinion on the coats there.
<greg-g> burlington
<ColonelPanic001> you would.
 * ColonelPanic001 has no idea what that would imply
<snap-l> It's mostly loading for me, but not fully.
<snap-l> There it does
<ColonelPanic001> just fill in the gaps
<snap-l> (goes, too)
<ColonelPanic001> god, google has to do *everything* for you
<snap-l> INtroducing Google Wipe
<ColonelPanic001> yes
<ColonelPanic001> that's a service I'd use
<rick_h_> FAQ: "Is google wipe compatible with my current 3rd party device case?"
<greg-g> does it have a baby edition?
<ColonelPanic001> about time google took some shit from me
<rick_h_> "Yes, as long as your 3rd party add on is a licensed manufacturer, you'll have no problems using your Google Wipe effeciently"
<snap-l> greg-g: It wipes your whole family.
<ColonelPanic001> jaj
<ColonelPanic001> hah, rather
<ColonelPanic001> sorry, turned spanish for a minute
<rick_h_> well, you can't say they're afraid of redoing the G+ app UI
<rick_h_> just updated it a month ago and updated again
<derekv> got the ssd in finally
<jrwren> yay ssd
<rick_h_> yay
<nullspace> woooooo ssd
<derekv> booooo car accidents
<snap-l> derekv: ARe you in one?
<derekv> not currently
<derekv> I was rear ended
<derekv> on 696
<derekv> about an hour ago
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-06-28
<Blazeix> waldo323: http://mathematicsforstudents.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/problem.jpg?w=593
<derekv> cars about an inch shorter
<derekv> maybe a few
<snap-l> greg-g: http://paste.mitechie.com/show/lrbYgGlCKB0B5FRjzF7Q/
<rick_h_> derekv: http://pyvideo.org/video/529/pyohio-2011--creating-web-apis-that-are-a-joy-to-
<snap-l> greg-g: had a follow-up conversation that mat be promising. :)
<snap-l> may, rather
<rick_h_> ok, so a de-duper script was a crap ton easier to write
<rick_h_> now if it'd just finish running on the live site kthx
<snap-l> ;)
<rick_h_> ok, so took a minute to run, but deduped 600 bookmarks
<rick_h_> combined tags, thanks for the suggestion/idea
<rick_h_> Ordered a nexus 7, derekv's got me all interested in mobile ui's and I've got a phone so need to see the tablet ui.
<rick_h_> snap-l: don't kick me :P
<derekv> haha
<derekv> i don't even have a tablet
<rick_h_> I had to try out an event so setup one for CHC and invited snap-l
<rick_h_> so now I'll get a boot, gotta watch out
<rick_h_> derekv: yea, you got me really thinking a cool two pane webui with left list, readable scrolling content on the right
<derekv> I consider it inevidable I just have fun seeing how long I can put it off
<rick_h_> can do it for the normal desktop view
<derekv> thats why I wondered about setting up views that are themselves components ...
<rick_h_> yea
<rick_h_> in the webui I can have Views compose of other views
<rick_h_> so I'll head down that path and see if I can get something cool and two paned. Keep the tag filter up top and you can filter on toread to just limit the list/scroll through
<derekv> Yea.  obviously not a new idea just need to see how it plays out with android native ... could be good stuff
<rick_h_> anyway, good price point and want to setup a yeti cluster for my JS tests anyway.
<rick_h_> exactly, I'm not sure how deep into Java I can get, ugh I'm not a fan, but if it's what's required might end up that way as the web setup/api stabailized
<rick_h_> one day I'll do something cool on there that'll make it popular and hack on it full time :P
<Blazeix> heh, my friend with the retina macbook got X running: http://andy753421.ath.cx/temp/mbp.png
<derekv> its better using java in the android context then it is in the web context... well thats just my current opinion
<derekv> but I'm not a fan of java either
<rick_h_> hah! yea, there was a mockup of unity on the retina display and the icons on the left were barely clickable
<rick_h_> oh yea, I can't ever see doing the web stuff with it, I could see getting interested in it for android dev though
<rick_h_> but I am a big Web > * person usually, and chrome ootb by default is a big win
<derekv> I wish they hadn't chosen it for android
<derekv> between it and obj-c its a toss up which is worse, pros and cons
<rick_h_> meh, I hear Obj-C has some big warts as well
<rick_h_> but yea, I understand the decision though
<derekv> yes... yes it does
<rick_h_> the webos model is my dream
<rick_h_> and now I guess boot2gecko
<rick_h_> but go look and you're not going to win users/$$ working on that
<rick_h_> not for a long while at least
<derekv> nah
<rick_h_> bah widox forgot to bring out the MS mice, had them in the backpack tonight
<derekv> well who knows right? but i'm not banking on it
<rick_h_> yea, /me goes on dreaming
<derekv> you can see in the android design where they had this idea of an ecosystem of apps and componants
<derekv> like how you have with linux and a package manager
<derekv> perhaps not to that extent
<derekv> but how in reality not many are going to put an app in the store that the user has to also have some other 3rd party things installed
<derekv> idk ... time for bed
<rick_h_> zzzz
<snap-l> Morning
<snap-l> Blazeix: That screenshot is awesome. :)
<snap-l> Subject:
<snap-l> Re: Question:Programming a game grid ...
<snap-l> My 1980s self would have loved to program a game grid, but then would have felt guilty for all of the programs that were derezzed.
<snap-l> http://openmetalcast.com/2012/06/28/open-metalcast-special-episode-club-metal-11/
<shakes808> errrrr morning
<snap-l> morning. :)
<rick_h_> morn
<rick_h_> closed up all the shades, house is on over heat lock down
<nullspace> moring
<jrwren> obj-c is awesome
<rick_h_> heh, I"ve not used it so I'll hold back judgement...but I hear stories :)
<jrwren> its really nice once you settle into it.
<jrwren> i found settling into obj-c more comfortable than settling into python
<jrwren> but I think that is because there are no standards in objc, you just write code and no one cares AFAICT
<jrwren> but in python you should be pythonic so that is much more challenging
<jrwren> but to compare to java its no contest.
<rick_h_> you're failing to convince me lol
<jrwren> i'm not trying.
<widox> rick_h_: oh right! maybe next time
<rick_h_> widox: yea, big duh on my part.
<brousch> I am scumbag open source advocate for a while. Advocates Linux, uses OSX
<brousch> I need 8GB of RAM to work in Eclipse for Android. The MBP is my only 8GB machine. I can't get external monitors working under Linux on the MBP, so I'm stuck in OSX
<snap-l> brousch: Cry me a river.
<brousch> I thought I just did
<jrwren> brousch: you are an open source advocate?
<brousch> I advocate open source, so yes
<rick_h_> https://developers.google.com/live/shows/ahNzfmdvb2dsZS1kZXZlbG9wZXJzcg4LEgVFdmVudBj3gtcCDA/ is kind of cool for web devs though the speakers are a bit patronizing
<jrwren> is that where they are showing shadow dom?
<rick_h_> yea
<jrwren> I couldn't understand what they were doing with shadow dom
<jrwren> I was watching it live yesterday and I just didn't see the point
<rick_h_> I think their <video> tag was a good example
<rick_h_> making google search work better is a big part :)
<rick_h_> but I think the idea of putting work into standard UI components at the dom like this is a good thing
<jrwren> is vagrant kind of like juju, just focused on development boxes?
<rick_h_> http://mozilla.github.com/x-tag/ looks like
<rick_h_> jrwren: I guess, kind of hard to compare something starting/handling machines vs installing/running software packages
<jrwren> Maas then?
<snap-l> btw: Club Metal #11 is out
<jrwren> i should probably just go use each of them, but I don't have the time :(
<rick_h_> no, I think you're ok. You can do 'recipes' of machines/config and such with vagrant so I guess it's not too far off from a juju type thing, but without the additional logic of tying together bits
<rick_h_> right, you dno't vagrant up mysql-dev
<rick_h_> vagrant up mysql-dev and start them sync'ing
<rick_h_> you'd have a recipe for two mysql machines setup to sync and can pass it around
<snap-l> I <3 Python's kawrgs
<snap-l> just took out a bunch of redundant typo-making arguments
<rick_h_> don't go crazy with them
<rick_h_> but yea, darn handy sometimes
<snap-l> rick_h_: I know. With great power comes great responsibility
<snap-l> but I just cut out a bunch of stuff for a SQLAlchemy model
<rick_h_> yea
<snap-l> 29 arguments with an init method to to self.foo = foo is not fun
<rick_h_> right
<snap-l> Thank you for the tip
<rick_h_> np, glad it's helped
<brousch> OK, wow, OSX Lion comes with Python2.5.6, Python2.6.7, and Python2.7.1 pre-installed
<brousch> The 2.5 and 2.6 are actually newer than the newest binary releases you can download from Python.org
<nullspace> wow trying to get an OSX VM setup, what pita
<brousch> Is there even an osX license compatible with running in a VM?
<nullspace> there are a bunch of articles on setting one up
<nullspace> have yet to follow one with any success
<brousch> Are you trying to run a OSX VM on oSX, or one something else?
<brousch> Running it without Apple hardware will awaken Zombie Steve Jobs to hunt you down and eat your soul
<nullspace> I've got a demo crowbar with his name on it
<nullspace> brousch: it's booting, it's alive, it's alive muhahahahaha
<nullspace> no lightening needed
<nullspace> speaking of which I'm not seeing anything on the radar, are these clouds suppose to rapidly coalesce above us?
<snap-l> nullspace: I think they'll be popcorn storms
<snap-l> cold-front hasn't hit us yet
<rick_h_> come on cold-front!
<snap-l> rick_h_: It'll be pretty weak
<snap-l> we're still supposed to hit 90+F tomorrow
<rick_h_> nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
<snap-l> http://www.wunderground.com/US/MI/Royal_Oak.html
<rick_h_> *sigh* http://www.weather.com/weather/5-day/Portland+OR+USOR0275:1:US
<nullspace> and now I have a pinwheel of doom..damn it
<brousch> nullspace: That means it's working normally
<jrwren> OSX runs in a VM on OSX. so inside parallel or vmware
<snap-l> jrwren: eh?
<jrwren> answering brousch's question.
<jrwren> you are allowed to run OSX in a VM as long as it is on OSX on apple hardware
<snap-l> jrwren: Right, I got that. What's this about it running in a VM?
<jrwren> nullspace is trying to do it. can you not read up?
<snap-l> jrwren: OSX runs in a VM on OSX.
<snap-l> The way I initally read it was "OSX runs in a VM on a Mac"
<snap-l> and that didn't compute.
<jrwren> oh! no, i did not mean that.
<nullspace> linux host running virtual box trying run OSX
<jrwren> yeah... don't do that.
<derekv> someones going to portland?
<rick_h_> derekv: I'm trying to talk the wife into moving there
<derekv> I know a couple people there
<rick_h_> something about "re-estabilishing a medical practice isn't easy, and family, and it's far away" keeps getting in the way
<snap-l> That and paying for exterminators to get the hippies out of the hose.
<snap-l> house
<jrwren> don't leave MI.
<jrwren> we need you rick_h_
<jrwren> if you want a better quality of life, just move to AA
<derekv> ortechie
<rick_h_> jrwren: see weather.com link above
<derekv> rick_h_: the video you linked to gave me a good starting point
<rick_h_> derekv: ?
<rick_h_> oh oh right, the api thing
<derekv> yea
<rick_h_> yea, I mean it wasn't an amazing talk, but it got my brain going hard core
<derekv> i'm listening to your questions now =]
<jrwren> rick_h_: ha! yeah... but you also get hte pac nw cloud and rain.
<jrwren> and no seasons.
<jrwren> i like watching hte leaves turn and death of winter and rebirth in spring.
<derekv> i thought it was rainy all the time
<derekv> and humid
<derekv> not so good bike weather
<Blazeix> yeah, i thought portland was known for having terrible weather.
<Blazeix> where terrible = rainy for 7 months
<rick_h_> derekv: it's great for biking! very bike friendly!
<brousch> Weather is not a problem if you don't go outside
<rick_h_> it's listed in something like one of the 5 best biking cities I thought
<jrwren> anyone ever install remOcular?
<derekv> brousch: until we have power outage
<derekv> waiting for that
<derekv> putting my chips are on 3~4pm today
<derekv> 4 days no power.
<derekv> i wonder if I grilled meat and salted the hell out of it how long it'd be good without refrigeration
<rick_h_> http://www.bicycling.com/ride-maps/featured-rides/1-portland-or
<rick_h_> boom!
<derekv> kk
<rick_h_> not even top 5, but #1 for 2012
<krondor> rick_h_:  have you been watching portlandia?  I'm not sure if that show does more to help or hurt a desire to move there.
<jrwren> haha, it helped
<rick_h_> krondor: my wife keeps saying I must watch it
<jrwren> portlandia totally made me want to move to portland
<jrwren> you must watch it.
<krondor> living in a 90's microcosm would be interesting that's for sure :)
<jrwren> portlandia is the best show on teevee
<jrwren> the dream of the 90s is still alive in portland
<rick_h_> yea, that's her line she likes to throw at me
<jrwren> krondor: have you read ... ?
<krondor> haha that skit is gold, so many people like that.
<krondor> I might be a bit guilty there
<rick_h_> lmao, sorry but this is funny https://twitter.com/nadiaoxford/status/218356908371873792
<ColonelPanic001> sssshhh
<ColonelPanic001> let them go
<ColonelPanic001> they'll figure it out too late
<ColonelPanic001> "...and here's your Health Canada card!" "My what?" "Oooooh... you're going to be upset. Maybe you should sit down before I explain"
<snap-l> Yeah, and when they realize Rush _doesn't_ mean Rush Limbaugh, they'll be really pissed.
<ColonelPanic001> haha
<derekv> I misunderstood what I was supposed to be doing ... i'm supposed to design the API for the client , not write up a best practices document
<snap-l> derekv: Oh, lovely.
<derekv> it is actually =]
<derekv> but thats a bigger job
<derekv> the project got created without a gitignore
<derekv> so i have to retroactivly correct that as well
<rick_h_> woot!
<rick_h_> at least you get to do it then
<rick_h_> there you go iOS lovers, have some chrome love
<rick_h_> chrome yummy, this is almost more yummy to me than yesterday
<brousch> eh?
<rick_h_> google IO keynote day 2
<rick_h_> you mean you're not all just glued to your screen for Chrome/Docs/Drive news?
<brousch> Ah geez
<rick_h_> chromebooks in best buy
<rick_h_> now we'll see what the market says
<brousch> You know what's sad? On OSX I actually have a Google-provided Drive client
<rick_h_> yea, they announced iOS Chrome coming today
<rick_h_> all the demos'equipment on stage is apple laptops
<derekv> thats confusing
<rick_h_> how so?
<rick_h_> what's crazy is his "other devices" list in chrome has laptop, desktop, android phone, android tablet, iphone, ipad
<rick_h_> "MOAR TABS!!!"
<derekv> iOS chrome is?
<derekv> chrome vs chromebook is confusing
<derekv> for one
<derekv> java javascript
<derekv> ham hamburger
<rick_h_> heh
<derekv> also because chrome means something else relevent to browsers as well
<brousch> chrome/chromium/chromeos/chromiumos
<derekv> mozilla has a chrome
<derekv> don't forget
<rick_h_> here comes google's cloud
<rick_h_> IaaS offering 'Compute Engine'
<rick_h_> look out ec2
<brousch> Google App Engine?
<rick_h_> no, linux OS
<rick_h_> like ec2
<brousch> I'm sure GAE runs on Linux
<rick_h_> so not PaaS, but IaaS
<rick_h_> right, but think "with root"
<brousch> No one wants that
<rick_h_> heh, some people do
<brousch> Sorry, wandered in troll territory again
<rick_h_> Gdocs with offline editing yay, missed that while heading up here.
<rick_h_> "than...other cloud providers"
<rick_h_> ouch, 770 cores up and running in < 20min
<rick_h_> 770k cores that is
<brousch> Is that all?
<rick_h_> well, for a single app that was running a genome computation
<jrwren> DAMNY!
<brousch> So is this like EC2 or Heroku?
<rick_h_> ec2
<rick_h_> app engine == heroku
<rick_h_> this is like ec2 linode, rackspace type things
<brousch> Hm, yeah, I guess you're right.
<jrwren> native client is SWEET
<rick_h_> yea, NCL is the key to chromebooks
<rick_h_> give it time, they'll start to win users
<brousch> I like chromebook for consuming content
<rick_h_> yea, lots of family could be just fine on one
<brousch> Fast, simple, sturdy
<brousch> PRinting is still the stickiest point, but it's getting better
<rick_h_> yea, and always up to date
<rick_h_> that's underestimated. My wife has 100+ ubuntu updates she's not run yet
<rick_h_> but chrome just updates itself
<brousch> Heh, almost too often. Seems like I reboot the boy's chromebook twice a week for updates
<brousch> Sure, it only takes 15 seconds to reboot, but it's kind of annoying
<rick_h_> big win in my book
<rick_h_> I'm seriously thinking of replacing my wife's laptop with one when her laptop dies
<brousch> He has figured out the new interface, so now he can get videos off of the SD card
<rick_h_> she's got a work laptop for the important work stuff that's IE only anyway
<rick_h_> heh, sweet. Using webrtc and hte camera to do 'kinect'-like interface
<rick_h_> doh, and giving out the chromebox units
<widox> ColonelPanic001: are you going to the apps for detroit thing tonight?
<ColonelPanic001> nein
<widox> ok. saw you posted something on twitter about it
<MaskedDriver> http://www.geek.com/articles/chips/nvidia-loses-order-due-to-poor-linux-support-20120628/
<MaskedDriver> Linux: "Don't mess with us, brah! How's $500 million taste?"
<jrwren> yeah, but thats $500 million us dollars in chinese usd dollars :p
<MaskedDriver> that's $500 million USD
<MaskedDriver> but I don't know the going currency exchange rate right now between the yen and the USD
<MaskedDriver> and have no motivation to find out for you ;)
<derekv> ahhhh wtf "fact table"
<MaskedDriver> fact table?
<rick_h_> heh, someone just got a list of requirements
<jrwren> yen is japanese, not chinese
<jrwren> and i was joking
<MaskedDriver> oh right
<MaskedDriver> lol I'm bad at currency
<MaskedDriver> want me to do your finances for you?
<jrwren> fuk no
<jrwren> i trust no one with my finances
<MaskedDriver> lol
<derekv> rick_h_: yea .... star schema
 * derekv splodes
<rick_h_> heh, cool demo of the updated android emulator. Swiping on an attached device moves the emulator screen
<derekv> rick_h_: why not just debug your app on the attached device then i wonder
<derekv> suppose screen sizes
<rick_h_> because the device was a phone, but emulating a tablet
<derekv> api level
<rick_h_> makes that swipe/two finger gesture a bit easier
<rick_h_> damn, so my phone is saying I've gone thorugh 3GB of data on my phone the last two days. Watching keynotes fml
<greg-g> my buddy found this quote from me, relating to one of our early meetings: "We also don't need to be drunk within 10 minutes, maybe
<greg-g> 30."
<greg-g> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-us-mi/2007-August/000002.html
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> man, 2007?
<greg-g> yeah, crazy
<rick_h_> I remember this conversation I believe
<greg-g> <lie>This is not the place the meeting will be every time, so do
<greg-g> not worry.
<greg-g> </lie>
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-us-mi/2007-August/000006.html
<rick_h_> Hah, I remember that place
 * rick_h_ goes strolling down memory lane
<greg-g> :(
<greg-g> er :)
<greg-g> all smiles here
<nullspace> whooo usbtmc is quite a trip down the kernel rabbit hole
<brousch> On the CD that came with a motherboard, under the Drivers install: Google toolbar, Google Chrome, Norton Internet Security 2011
<derekv> so i'm trying to figure out if there's some reason do do more than ssl + http basic auth on every call
<derekv> for authentication
<derekv> why do things require you to log in, get some sort of tolken
<derekv> maybe the heat is getting to me but it seems silly
<rick_h_> derekv: so you can revoke the token
<rick_h_> without making the user change their password
<greg-g> ugh, comments on backpacking with babies blog posts make me lose faith in parts of humanity
<greg-g> "how about remember some common sense and leave the baby at home!"
<greg-g> :(
<rick_h_> heh
<rick_h_> we thought about it, but I think the idea of being 8hrs from a road in case of emergency generally convinced us to skip it
<greg-g> yeah, definitely not doing major hike, but we at least have to try
<rick_h_> yea, it is more complicated though.
<rick_h_> but yea, you're on the internet, release the trolls!!!!
<derekv> not like api token I meant session_id I think
<derekv> well if I'm writing an app the user has their password stored anyways, i'm trying to think of why not usine http basic auth + ssl
<derekv> other than the server has to store passwords with reversable encryption
<derekv> which I don't prefer but in this case might be ok
<derekv> or, the amazon scheme
<derekv> which is more complex but its still stateless
<derekv> no expiring sessions
<derekv> when you turn the device back on
<derekv> well, actually, the amazon scheme requires the server to know the password anyways
<derekv> too bad client certificates aren't usually an option
<derekv> almost perfect security
<greg-g> rick_h_: just fyi since you like this stuff too, I just bought this http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001AZ5YLE/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00
<rick_h_> 15deg?
<rick_h_> man, you planning some cold nights greg-g ?
<rick_h_> ah nice, two person. You guys are going to get hot in a 15deg bag together me thinks
<greg-g> maybe yeah, but night in cali aren't the warmest: )
<rick_h_> yea, sorry, it's 100deg today so hard to htink about 15deg
<greg-g> hehe, yeah, kinda jealous about that (kinda)
<rick_h_> I'll pass, all the shades drawn, AC blasting
<derekv> consumers energy just really pissed me off
<rick_h_> ruh roh
<derekv> seeing if I can switch
<derekv>  well this is about the least worst time to lose my gas
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-06-29
<snap-l> Whooo-wee. 90f in the en
<snap-l> den
<snap-l> MB Temperature:    +61.0Â°C  (high = +45.0Â°C, crit = +95.0Â°C)
<Blazeix>  cool, jquery 2.0 (in 2013) will drop IE 6/7/8 support
<rick_h_> http://press.oreilly.com/pub/pr/2931 very cool
<rick_h_> and now http://post.oreilly.com/form/oreillynotifications/viewhtml/9z1z5mubn237ojq19na1i2pj5hqsgki8rq0k3hvcbbo?imm_mid=08d215&cmp=em-npa-mailings-drop-box-release-june2012
<greg-g> whoa, nice
<rick_h_> http://teespring.com/pycoders
<rick_h_> man, poor mozilla is feeling a bit like they've missed a chance
<widox> rick_h_: heh, hope that order doesn't take as long as the vim t-shirt did
<widox> that's pretty awesome, sync your books over to dropbox
<rick_h_> widox: heh yea, but gotta support the Python folks
<rick_h_> yea, I like that oreilly has done that. I know I get emails and redownload my book, then resync to my kindle
<rick_h_> kinda cool if updates and such just appear on my machine via dropbox
<rick_h_> and now it's on my phone, soon to have tablet, etc
<widox> rick_h_: you bought a tablet?
<widox> which one
<rick_h_> yea, suckered into that nexus 7
<widox> :D
<rick_h_> price, new os got me
<rick_h_> and my desire to tinker with bookie on mobile
<widox> the specs sounds pretty great for it
<rick_h_> yea, engadget raved on it basically
<rick_h_> seems they're selling at cost/right at in order to sell and get people getting stuff from Play
<rick_h_> and devs handle them, start doing more mobile stuff
<widox> I've been kicking around the idea of getting one
<rick_h_> yea, with derekv doing android stuff with bookie and I want to do some UI updates that'll be two pane, list on left readable on the right
<rick_h_> so this one finally kicked me off the fence
<widox> cool
<rick_h_> tip of the day: try out ctrl-o in the chrome dev tools
<widox> rick_h_: slick!
<rick_h_> yea, missed that was there
<rick_h_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mk-tFn2Ix6g&feature=youtu.be
<snap-l> Yeah, 've used their Dropbox syncing
<rick_h_> pragmatic had it back at last year it looks like
<rick_h_> and oreilly just added it as well
<snap-l> Yeah, couple weeks back
<rick_h_> I need to just stop buying things form amazon when it's on oreilly
<rick_h_> they really have done a good job with that
<snap-l> Yes
<snap-l> yes yes yes
<snap-l> Amazon for the stupid publishers, and the smart publisher sites for the smart ones
<snap-l> (Penguin Books, Harper Collins)
<rick_h_> morning
<rick_h_> ugh, tgif
<rick_h_> and wooo! cooler weather! only 95 today
<rick_h_> geeze, Blazeix the HN comment crowd are cranky over this IE support dropping in jquery 2
<brousch> Eh? What?
<rick_h_> http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4174550
<brousch> Wow
<brousch> Dropping IE8 is bad
<rick_h_> it's years from now
<brousch> Windows XP can only have IE8
<rick_h_> right, and XP is damn near what? 10-11 years old
<brousch> It is supported until 2014
<rick_h_> right when this change goes into effect
<rick_h_> the 1.9 will be supported until 2014/15
<brousch> Hm
<brousch> XP will live forever
<rick_h_> enjoy broken things then
<rick_h_> I can't go pull out OS9 and expect to have safari on it
<rick_h_> the party has to end sometime, thank goodness it's starting
<brousch> It does sound reasonable, but I think the announcement long before the EOL is confusing. I mean, who reads the article?
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> well I think they feel that they have to be very public and let everyone get their crap together
<rick_h_> "this is the plan...this will effect you...you will have to work along side us on this or else your stuff will be broken in IE<8 in a couple of years
<brousch> What kind of web technoogy plans years ahead?
<brousch> Crazy-talk
<rick_h_> jquery, the windows of the web world...and they want to put their XP out to pasture as well and get to 2.0
<shakes808> mroning
<shakes808> morning
<rick_h_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5931rOHdUVA&feature=player_embedded lol
<brousch> rick_h_: Are you and snap-l staying at the Blackwell again for PyOhio?
<shakes808> http://shirt.woot.com/
<rick_h_> brousch: yea, I need to call on that
<brousch> There will be 5 or 6 of us from GRPUG, but we're staying at the Red Roof Inn again
<Blazeix> eh, just use conditional comments to target older versions of IE
<rick_h_> yea, the comments go nuts on that as 'ugly' and 'no conditional comments in ie10' and more work, etc
<rick_h_> I'm meh, but a quick run through the comments suprised me on how much people are against the move
<brousch> They will probably end up with a separate package to support really old browser
<rick_h_> fork it! fork it!
<brousch> fork you!
<brousch> http://rss.slashdot.org/~r/Slashdot/slashdot/~3/ZhoXzDMziGQ/adobe-stops-flash-player-support-for-android
<brousch> As much as I hate flash, it was one of the things Android had that iOS didn't
<brousch> And with Chrome on iOS, Android no longer has that as an advantage either
<rick_h_> heh yea, but all the iOS peeps are finding the issues with it
<rick_h_> "oh, you don't get access to the nitro JS engine, only apple gets that so JS is slower"
<rick_h_> "oh, you can't change iOS to open links in Chrome, so you still end up in safari all day"
<brousch> heh
<brousch> Hm, it seems strange that I have to write my own script to easily install pip for python3.2
<brousch> Am I missing something, or do I need to manually get and install Distribute, then get and install Pip?
<jrwren> rick_h_: your next yrs goals should be to convince folks to discontinue the products and move to git and github.
<jrwren> ... or... compete with git and github head on. competition is good.
<rick_h_> jrwren: :P
<brousch> A launchpad -> github migration tool
<rick_h_> yep, just let me know when github suports bugs against packages in different distributions/versions, upstream bug tracking, package building
<brousch> See, there's still work for you to do even if you do migrate ;)
<snap-l> Howdy
<rick_h_> party
<snap-l> Was head-down geting some automation working
<rick_h_> now that it's automated time to go home for friday?
<snap-l> Nothing more nerve-wracking than a silently-running process.
<rick_h_> heh, you're speaking my day
<rick_h_> INSERT 0 1
<snap-l> did it finish? Did it bomb? Did it order 1 million mojitos?
<rick_h_> "you still goin?!"
<greg-g> snap-l: so you just inserted a whole bunch of println's, right?
<greg-g> "I'm getting ready to call THIS function"
<greg-g> "I just excited THIS function"
<greg-g> excited? exited.
<snap-l> ;)
<snap-l> There's debug logging, but it's still nervous-making
<rick_h_> "ah crap, that comma is out of place" ...starts the run again
<snap-l> rick_h_: Ugh
<snap-l> greg-g: Did you see my pastebin re that band that wanted to be played on OMC?
<snap-l> Unfortunately I don't think anything came of it yet.
<snap-l> http://paste.mitechie.com/raw/ZGm64vbGFP9GmT85R2U4/ <- last mail I sentt to them
<snap-l> Dippy network just blipped
<snap-l> And now to hide in the land of AC
<snap-l> aka the bedroom
<snap-l> Man, my network is really flaky today
<brousch> This Botbrew Python on android thing has turned into quite the hackfest
<brousch> The current pip is broken on certain systems, so I have to install the development pip into the system and into each virtualenv
<rick_h_> brousch: but at least there's an updated pip to get I guess
<brousch> But, the upside is that I can create virtualenvs on Android
<rick_h_> very cool
<rick_h_> I look forward to seeing how far you get with it come next month
<brousch> Yeah, it looks like my forked virtualenv is not longer needed, which is nice
<brousch> Well at this point you should be able to develop in a virtualenv on Android using any pure python module and any module that is in the embedian repo, which is a smaller, ARM-based version of the debian repo
<brousch> Sorry, emdebian repo
<brousch> http://www.emdebian.org/grip/index.html
<brousch> You do need a rooted phone to run BotBrew Basil, and an ext2 partition on your SD card to hold the virtualenvs
<brousch> I definitely need to blog this before I forget it all
<rick_h_> definitely, wiki/readme docs setup
<brousch> And biggidy-bam django running on Android in a virtualenv
<_stink_> crayzay
<greg-g> why not? constant 3g connection (for various definitions of "constant") and more power than many webservers 10 years ago, why not run your homepage off your phone?
<jrwren> too easy to dos
<greg-g> :)
<brousch> greg-g: You can't connect to it over 3g
<brousch> All of the mobile phone services firewall incoming connections
<greg-g> oh, right
<greg-g> well then, screw that
<greg-g> ;)
<greg-g> there was some talk I watch a little bit off that talked about this, I forget who/where but I'm sure it's been talked about a lot. I think he mentioned that, but I apparently forgot
<brousch> My goal is to be able to develop regular Python programs on Android, with all of the niceties like virtualenv
<jrwren> but maybe you'll get ipv6 in the future :)
<brousch> It is perfectly understandable. Image everyone's phone exposed to the unfiltered Internet
<brousch> Imagine
<greg-g> Imagine all the people... living life in peace whoo ooo ooo uuuu
<snap-l> Yeah I don't think we're ready for phones to be on the unfiltered internet
<brousch> I don't put anything except a firewall on the unfiltered internet
<greg-g> I already put Rowan on the unfiltered internet, he brought down half of the west coast
<brousch> Impressive
<greg-g> Google sent him a recruiter email
<greg-g> (actually, I got a Google recruiter email for my python experience, hahahahaha)
<greg-g> (I think it is because I'm listed as a dev for Gwibber, which was really all of like 30 lines of code)
<snap-l> greg-g: THat's more than I've contributed to Gwibber. ;)
<greg-g> most of mine was even copy/paste edit the few lines that need to change
<snap-l> https://code.launchpad.net/~craig-decafbad/gwibber/https-support
<snap-l> (it was rejected)
<jrwren> my linux box is on unfiltered internet right now, with no firewall.
<jrwren> iptables is empty.
<jrwren> am I crazy?
<greg-g> but it also isn't listening on many ports
<brousch> Any other east siders going to PyOhio?
<greg-g> (I don't really get the unfiltered internet scare)
<brousch> That's because you don't run Windows
<snap-l> brousch: Probably, but not sure who
<snap-l> jrwren: No, you worked in academia for too long. ;)
<snap-l> greg-g: The filtered internet is to ensure that you haven't left something open unintentionally
<snap-l> ie: If I lock my gate, the liklihood of someone enterint my house through an opened window in the back yard is reduced
<snap-l> (facing the back yard)
<greg-g> bah :)
<snap-l> bad analogy
<snap-l> but you get the point
<jrwren> i made sure to turn off mysql.
<jrwren> it is listening on a lot.
<jrwren> comcast filters the samba ports for me
<greg-g> heh "for me"
<snap-l> My router is my firewall
<snap-l> checked it with Shields Up!
<greg-g> lol "Without your knowledge or explicit permission, the Windows networking technology which connects your computer to the Internet may be offering some or all of your computer's data to the entire world at this very moment!"
<greg-g> I'm going to say no
<snap-l> greg-g: There's some old info on that page
<jrwren> zomg, all kinds of scary ports.
<jrwren> look at this scary stuff: https://gist.github.com/3020427
<greg-g> apparently I'm stealth for 0-1055 ports
<snap-l> I have 22 open, but I know about that.
<brousch> I always move ssh to some other port, usually 22<natted IP>
<snap-l> I turned off password login, so if you don't have a key, you're not getting in
 * greg-g nods
<snap-l> if I get paranoid, I'll have ssh into a DMZ.
<jrwren> i'm singing dixie chicks about my open ports.
<jrwren> "wide open spaces"
<greg-g> lol
<snap-l> jrwren: Well, when you get owned, you'll at least know how. ;)
<snap-l> God, Skype is a real POS>
<brousch> It used to be awesome, then MS bought it
<snap-l> It installs 100s of 386 libraries
<jrwren> i'll probably firewall some ports.
<jrwren> https://gist.github.com/2929272  some real gems in here
<greg-g> wait, when did audible get bought by amazon?
<greg-g> or was it always?
<rick_h_> greg-g: 3yrs ago maybe?
<rick_h_> greg-g: ok, so 4yrs http://www.zdnet.com/blog/btl/amazoncom-buys-audible-march-into-digital-content-distribution-continues/7818
<greg-g> huh, interesting
<greg-g> I was wondering why I got emails from amazon pointing me to audible :)
<rick_h_> bah apple http://goo.gl/b38DA
<rick_h_> ugh
<derekv> corrrrperations
<greg-g> what the fucking fuckity fuck fuck fuck
<greg-g> stupid ass software patents
<rick_h_> yea, evidently you can patent looking up data in two places
<greg-g> that one got me
<rick_h_> Reuters reports that the decision appears to have been driven by Apple's claim to the patent to search multiple sources, which Apple says is the basis of Siri.
<greg-g> hilarious
<rick_h_> new rule, you can patent something in tech for 12mo /18mo max
<greg-g> "no shit"
<rick_h_> after that, fair game
<rick_h_> so what's funny is that it isn't against the nexus 7 because it's a tablet device and hte tablet doesn't have siri yet
<rick_h_> but guess that's coming on ios6, so they better ship my tablet before ios6 comes out
<brousch> geez
<brousch> You know, I think I might use Evernote for my ebooks instead of Dropbox. In Evernote the whole thing is indexed and searchable
<brousch> rick_h_: Did you order a Nexus 7?
<rick_h_> yea
<brousch> No more Kindle?
<rick_h_> I'll read on the kindle
<rick_h_> I want the tablet for other stuff and to tinker with mobile dev on it
<rick_h_> thinking stuff like watching these youtube google io talks, irc/email and such in post-work hours
<brousch> I love hacking the crap out of my Nook Color
<rick_h_> but mainly my dev itch to play with web dev on different mobile form factors and maybe eventually get off my @#$#@ and try out some android stuff
<rick_h_> yea, why I like this, it's a nexus, all the reviews raving on the hardware, and price point is low enough that if I end up not really digging it, I can sell it without much loss I'd bet
<brousch> Yeah, low cost is nice, and 7" is the perfect size
<derekv> new rule, patent enforcement must show that a method was stolen or copied, not mearly mimicked, emulated or independently conceived
<brousch> New rule: all judges must be able to program
<derekv> a plausible theory of irreparable harm long-term loss of market share and losses of downstream sales will now be put forward by apple against all other existing corporations
<derekv> just think of the billions of dollars apple losses due to the fact that other organizations exist.
<rick_h_> anyone using firefox for android? I can't seem to find a way for the sync to let me pull up tabs off my desktop browser
<derekv> i use it sometimes but i've never hooked it up to syn
<derekv> i should
<derekv> I guess
<derekv> my phone feels really slow
<brousch> i haven't tried tab sync
<rick_h_> it doesn't seem to do it from what i can tell
<brousch> Trying it now. Activating sync
<rick_h_> let me know if you get it to do it
<brousch> I can see desktop tabs on my phone
<rick_h_> where at?
<brousch> Way down at the bottom, tiny link
<brousch> "Show all tabs"
<rick_h_> hmm, is that firefox for firefox beta?
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-06-30
<brousch> Just firefox I think
<brousch> I can't see my phone tabs on the desktop yet
<rick_h_> when I click a new tab I only see "Top sites, bookmarks, history"
<rick_h_> no link about "show all tabs"
<brousch> Now I have "synced tabs" on the phone below addons
<brousch> i don't see bookmarks
<brousch> Oh wait, it's not on a new tab, it's on the front page
<brousch> When I first open FF it has this fancy looking front page thing
<rick_h_> rihgt, about:home
<rick_h_> ok, so part of it was installing firefox vs firefox beta
<rick_h_> and it still sucks if you've got one page up, there's no way to get to the tabs without opening a second tab or going to about:home
<rick_h_> meh, anyway, experiment run, close FF again
<rick_h_> ok, sucked into the kool-aid, google's compute engine stuff looks hot
<rick_h_> they're totally wanting to talk to people that want to run over 1k servers right now
<rick_h_> and not my mesely two
<rick_h_> but man, cool stuff
<rick_h_> jcastro: you have to check out their hadoop mapr demo http://t.co/XL0O6Ofi
<derekv> for zfs with dedup where performance is critical, add 30GB ram for ever 1tb disk space
<derekv> wow
<jrwren> yeah, zfs is cute.
<derekv> another article put it differently, except in certain fringe cases dedup won't make sense for most users
<derekv> so drew's ubunutu, ff is downloading files to /tmp by default
<derekv> i turned on zfs dedup as soon as it was supported ... there wasn't as much information available on the performance implications then
<derekv> i'm saving about 50%
<derekv> but i have a whooooole lot of data i probably don't need to be keeping
<rick_h_> ccccccbgjgvcrhjvehftjfjuvjbdikbgivutrgcvdtik
<_stink_> hi Michael
<rick_h_> ccccccbgjgvcchgckhfhirrjfebrfgtrujgjhinuflbv
<rick_h_> bah
<snap-l> skdjfasdflkhsdfiuweasdkjfad,mnbzdfiewhriasuhfzkdjsfiuasdfasdf to you too.
<snap-l> Good morning
<snap-l> OMG, I just realized PHP is an acronym, much like GNU
<snap-l> PHP Hates Programmers
<jrwren> wow, good one.
<rick_h_> ugh, what a day
<derekv> I have a problem overthinking disk configurations on new installs
<derekv> if I have multiple HDDs to play with
<rick_h_> yea, I've just gone / on one and /data on the other
<rick_h_> worry about it as it comes up
<derekv> I have two 1tb disks already in the box
<derekv> I think i'll just install on one, add software mirror with the other
<derekv> simple
<derekv> I don't think I need a whole 1tb
<rick_h_> sounds like a plan
<derekv> or more than that in any case
<derekv> afk this machine is going down
<rick_h_> ok, really important conversation starting
<jjesse> brousch,  happy birthday hope you celebrated well
<snap-l> hello from Goldfish tea
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-07-01
<rick_h_> snap-l: party
<rick_h_> what's goldfish tea?
<derekv>  
<rick_h_> derekv: you back?
<derekv> I have no clue, how to use irssi
<rick_h_> lol
<derekv> but might as well start
<derekv> did I quit?
<derekv> this doesn't look like my bouncer
<rick_h_> I just saw you connect 01:03 <    derekv>
<derekv> odd
<derekv> how do I get channel list?
<derekv> also i'm in 80x40 or something
<rick_h_>  /list
<rick_h_> but I'd hold off on that lol
<derekv> heh
<derekv> I didn't mean that I meant users in channel
<rick_h_>  /names
<derekv> so I'm not ghosted... i wonder why I quit
<rick_h_> there are plugins to add a nicklist but I hate them because they break copying/pasting wrapped irc lines
<derekv> ouch
<derekv> so i'm in fbsd... new installer took me a few tries .. finally had to let it pick my partition layout for me lol, somehow the other way didn't work
<rick_h_> oh hmm
<derekv> looks like they've updated so the default is to use gpt instead of the weird bsd specific stuff i'm used to
<rick_h_> snap-l: https://github.com/mitechie/Bookie/issues/162#issuecomment-6690121 closer but second bug in there
<derekv> how do you switch joined channels?
<derekv> I can't even find an offline tutorial or cheatsheet
<rick_h_> alt-#
<rick_h_> or alt-a to cycle through
<derekv> or not...  probably I need a config
<derekv> oh esc # works
<derekv> so my kb isn't configured correctly
<rick_h_> snap-l: nvm, all fixed yay
<rick_h_> thanks for the heads up on that snap-l, was actually a few diff layered in there bugs
<snap-l> rick_h_: Awesome. Glad it's fixed. :)
<snap-l> rick_h_: Goldfish Tea is a tea place in Royal Oak
<snap-l> We should head there some time
<snap-l> Good stuff
<derekv> just ran > 8.2mi
<derekv> I had no idea i could do that
<derekv> correction
<derekv> 4.2
 * derekv lies on the cool ground
<derekv> 8.2 would be awesome
<derekv> got 7ish once but it was real slow towards the end... i had been running 5x a week for a couple years at that point
<derekv> ok I see awesome, awesome2 and awesome-viscious?
<derekv> anyone here got ipv6 with their isp yet?
<derekv> wooo nelly, X and firefox
<derekv> slow video tho
<derekv> now with fast video
<rick_h_> everyone survive leap second?
<rick_h_> I sufferred the mysql 100% cpu last night myself
<rick_h_> forgot I had installed it to test bookie against
<snap-l> I think I'm OK. :)
<snap-l> I had a spike a little after 2pm
<rick_h_> heh
<jrwren> whoa, mysql had the java bug.
<jrwren> glad i removed mysql a few days ago :)
<jrwren> my tomcat was pegged, so i killed it.
<derekv> for rsync I can choose --atimes or --file-flags but not both... how do I choose?
<derekv> ahh wrong channel
<derekv> nvm
<derekv> for irssi can you flip themes without exiting?
<derekv> tis /set theme ...
<derekv> if you want a makefile target to run based on the exit condition of some shell command instead of the update time of some files, I think you just put that line first
<derekv> I'm going to try it
<derekv> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/592620/check-if-a-program-exists-from-a-bash-script
<rick_h_> you know what...I freaking hate the number 9. It's the worst dippy number ever
<rick_h_> jrwren: oooh! I think you found it!
<derekv> whats a good terminal emulator
<rick_h_> I'm a fan of urxvt, but I think most people use gnome-terminal
<derekv> I was using urxvt before...
<derekv> xterm at the moment
<derekv> I had a urxvt 'theme' I found, dark green-ish background
<derekv> looked great until some app decided red is a good color for text
<derekv> red on green-ish background made my eyes water
<rick_h_> yea
<derekv> there should have been some sort of universal color theme interface
<rick_h_> derekv: http://paste.mitechie.com/show/718/
<rick_h_> is my setup
<derekv> that works from terminal apps up to gui
<derekv> the application requests a unique color from the interface, maybe sending some tags like "emphasis" or "warning"
<derekv> and the interface returns a color
<derekv> just a c library or something
<derekv> I wish I had a time machine
<derekv> in fact the lazy user could simply set a background and a forground color, and the rest of the colors could be generated with an algorithm and look good 99% of the time
<derekv> in fact its not too late...
<derekv> its just that apps will not all support it
<derekv> but get it into a handful of important ones
<derekv> maybe others will pick it up
<derekv> then you configure different backends... eg read from gtk settings, etc
<derekv> whoa
<derekv> interesting
<derekv> whats the '[NEW] | 1 |' ?
<derekv> rick_h_: do you use bash or zsh?
<derekv> ahhhh hahah that changed my fonts everwherer
<derekv> pretty but too big
<derekv> you have that tinsy monitor
<rick_h_> derekv: zsh
<rick_h_> derekv: sorry, in/out over dinner so not following
<rick_h_> yea, I use lxappearance for gtk apps
<rick_h_> and qtconfig for qt apps
<rick_h_> 7pt font is too big?!
<rick_h_> I think you don't have that font and it went to some default
<rick_h_> I don't know anyone that considered a 7pt font big
<derekv> rick_h_: yea its not 7pt
<derekv> I just pasted what you linked into my .Xdefaults I haven't looked at it ;P (multitasking)
<rick_h_> derekv: heh yea. So change consolas to your normal font you use
<derekv> looking at gnu make $(call ...)
<rick_h_> make sure to \ any spaces in the name
<derekv> oh right consolas
<derekv> i'll just install that its a nice font
<derekv> that and terminus
<rick_h_> consolas and liberation mono are my favs
<rick_h_> but sounds like liberation fonts are going toward the unsupported land
<derekv> where do you get consolas? from 'doze?
<rick_h_> yea, I don't recall. I've got a .fonts I keep in my dotfiles so I grabbed it somewhere at some point
<derekv> nice
<rick_h_> http://uploads.mitechie.com/index.html
<rick_h_> grab the Consolas directory
<rick_h_> you'll have to grab file at a time
<derekv> thanks
<greg-g> apparently https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inconsolata is inspired by conolas but is under a Free/Open license
<derekv> I want to take the output of a command, put it in one variable, and the exit status in another
<derekv> I think
<derekv> I think
<derekv> man my shell scripting sucks
<derekv> all I want to do, is take the exit status, and reverse it
<derekv> ok figured out what I was doing
<snap-l> I use Gnome Terminal, but that's because I am a sheep.
<derekv> its heavy
<derekv> thats the only thing wrong with it
<snap-l> AS opposed to uxrvt which requires hand-crafted configuurations
<snap-l> I'll take heavy if it means I never have to edit a config file. ;)
<derekv> yea
<derekv> i'd like something inbetween
<derekv> I'm going to get this working
<derekv> portable deployment makefile
<derekv> just include appropriate overrides eg ubunutu.deploy.mk or bsd.deploy.mk =]
<derekv> but, i'm not there yet
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-06-24
<jrwren_> smartest thing I did this year was hire out lawn mowing :)
<snap-l> Morning
<snap-l> Had a weird little kernel panic this morning after rebooting from an accidental suspend
<snap-l> wish there were a way to turn suspend off
<rick_h> ugh
<snap-l> Apparently there's a way to turn off the menu items.
<snap-l> If that's the case, then I think I've got a new default. :)
<snap-l> Why oh why did I feel the need to pick up some Skullcandy headphones.
<snap-l> Seriously, I think it's either Koss, Grados, or Shure from here on out.
<rick_h> do it once and never again
<snap-l> I think they'll make good backpack headphones, but that's about it
<snap-l> My Sportapros sound leagues better
<snap-l> Even on clearance at Staples with 15% off, I feel like they're not worth it. :)
<snap-l> packaging is nice. :)
<Blazeix> i have a coworker who swears by http://www.klipsch.com/
<snap-l> I can abide that
<jrwren_> snap-l: Sennheiser
<snap-l> jrwren_: Yes yes, Sennheiser as well
<snap-l> Basically, I'm done with <$50 headphones at Staples
<jrwren_> klipsch for speakers yes(especially big horns), but I know nothing about their headphones. I've never heard them.
<snap-l> and Monster / Dr. Dre can eat dirt as well
<jrwren_> you can get skullcandy for <$50?
<snap-l> jrwren_: On clearance, and in-ear headphones
<jrwren_> ah.
<jrwren_> i'm happy enough with my CX300 in ear which were well under $50 on newegg
<snap-l> Yeah, they're $40 on Amazon
<jrwren_> i must have found a good sale, I think they were closer to $30.
<jrwren_> on an #ubuntu note: I got my beagleboneblack in the mail and didn't realize its a micro hdmi connector, so I didn't get to use it yet
<jrwren_> i'm super excited about the bbb as my new computer.
<snap-l> Ugh
<rick_h> I've got these I've been pretty happy with http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B007TCXI06/ref=wms_ohs_product?ie=UTF8&psc=1
<rick_h> sound pretty good, block out enough sound I can use while mowing
<rick_h> and the mic isn't as nice as my home setup, but decent enough no on gripes when I use it from the coffee shop
<snap-l> rick_h: Ye gods
<snap-l> It's like a sexual device for your earholes.
<jrwren_> lol @ 149 in ears.
<snap-l> I'd bring the Grados in to work, but I think everyone would be able to hear what I'm hearing. :)
<brousch> I nearly crapped myself paying $20 for headphones
<snap-l> brousch: That's a west-side of the state thing. :)
<snap-l> It's perfectly normal
<snap-l> I think they have cheap headphones at the Goodwill
<brousch> I splurged and bought Sony for $20
<snap-l> gah
<snap-l> Sony headphones are hit-and-miss
<snap-l> mostly miss unless you spend $$
<brousch> I did spend $$
<snap-l> >$50
<brousch> OK there, Rockefeller
<snap-l> No wonder you like duckgrind. It's probably the only thing that sounds good in those headphones. ;)
<brousch> That is a distinct possibility
<jrwren_> everyone has different ears.
<jrwren_> I know the ability of my ears to hear, and I feel like I buy appropriate headphones.
<jrwren_> brousch is blessed with ears which cannot hear, so he gets by with poor headphones.
<jrwren_> rick_h has ears which can hear like most humans cannot, and possibly like some bunnies cannot. He needs the really good headphones.
<snap-l> I love it when I buy a "remastered" version of an album I already heave, and on first listen, I can hear everything (ants farting int he studio)
<snap-l> and then I listen to the old version and realize the ant fart was already there, I just wasn't paying attention
<snap-l> And then I get upset because the remaster wasn't the "blown away" that I was hoping it would be.
<rick_h> jrwren_: so it's not always the sound. I bought my current home headphones for the pure reason of comfort
<rick_h> jrwren_: and these earbuds I bought because of confort (really important for in-ear) and the mic on it
<rick_h> basically I bought them specifcally so I could do hangouts for work from coffee shops
<greg-g> so, how 'bout that snowden thing, eh?
<snap-l> ld: library not found for -lboost_system
<snap-l> Bah
<snap-l> https://plus.google.com/117777908934895049975/posts/JG7PtsesmQx
<rick_h> greg-g: heh, /me wants to watch 'catch me if you can' again now
<greg-g> rick_h: I never did, and now I totally want to!
<jrwren_> i was LIVID
<greg-g> it's like "guys. Guys! you *actually* thought he was going to be on that plane to Cuba, the one he was ticketed on that everyone else bought tickets on last minute, including journalists AND god knows what secret service people from god knows which countries?"
<jrwren_> i just hope he continues to stay 1 step ahead.
<jrwren_> i don't know if I can handle another hero going down to the government.
<greg-g> jrwren_: ditto
<greg-g> hard to tell what's going on from what we know, of course
<jrwren_> vim people: https://github.com/dbsr/vimfox
<ColonelPanic001> nice, thanks
<jrwren_> what is the debian/ubuntu difference between /usr/lib and /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/ ?
<snap-l> and lib32 for that matter
<jrwren_> lib32 i understand.
<snap-l> Something tells me it's a transitional directory
<jrwren_> on a 64bit system with 32bit x86 compat, the 32bit libs go to /usr/lib32
<snap-l> (/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/)
<jrwren_> (like wow64 on windows)
<snap-l> http://askubuntu.com/questions/52617/what-is-usr-lib-i386-linux-gnu-for
<jrwren_> which still leave the question when to package target /usr/lib v. /usr/lib/<arch>
<snap-l> Are you arch specific?
<jrwren_> its a .so
<jrwren_> i guess my real question is why is anything in /usr/lib then?
<jrwren_> now I notice that not much really is.
<snap-l> http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/advanced.en.html#multiarch
<jrwren_> i noticed that very few libs are actually in my /usr/lib
<jrwren_> thanks snap-l
<jrwren_> pretty great review: andrewbrookins.com/tech/one-year-later-an-epic-review-of-pycharm-2-7-from-a-vim-users-perspective/
<snap-l> jrwren_: np
<jrwren_> omg look at these numbers! http://jakevdp.github.io/blog/2013/06/15/numba-vs-cython-take-2/  numba is looking SWEET
<greg-g> hilarious: http://paste.mitechie.com/show/972/
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-06-25
<snap-l> greg-g: At least it isn't an infographic.
<snap-l> I always wonder if I'll come up with enough tracks for a show
<snap-l> and invariably I find more than I can fit in one show
<Chat6500> Ayeeeeeeeeeee
<snap-l> Dammit, Blackhawks have the cup
<snap-l> nixternal will be insufferable for a year now. :)
<snap-l> Good morning
<rick_h>  just morning
<brousch> rick_h: If it makes you feel better, I was woken up at 5:45 by dogs afraid of the thunder
<rick_h> sucky
<brousch> We have 2 dogs. One sleeps in a crate and the other sleeps next to it. When thunder starts, the non-crate dog hides in the hallway, leaving the crate dog lonely. She starts yipping and whining until I let her out and sleep downstairs
<snap-l> rick_h: I see you got hit by the TWiT smoke detector. ;)
<rick_h> dude! I pulled chairs across the house checking all of my detectors!
<snap-l> Hahahahhaha. :)
<snap-l> Yea, they mentioned it about 20 minutes in
<rick_h> of course I'm pulling my tablet along with me and keep listening to the podcast as I chase it down
<rick_h> thinking that I can listen as I work...
<rick_h> I'm standing up on a chair checking one for the 3rd time when they mention it
<brousch> I thought you guys didn't listen to twit
<rick_h> I do once in a while. I'm between audio books atm
<rick_h> and figured I'd see what the snowden commentary was
<snap-l> I listen from time to time whenever I'm doing dishes
<snap-l> There's few podcasts that are "OMG, must listen"
<snap-l> http://www.kenandrobintalkaboutstuff.com/ is one of them
<snap-l> mostly because it's got a severe history bent.
<rick_h> yea, it's really my only podcast other than PTI these days. I just do more books than podcasts any more. Doing 2-4 books a month instead
<snap-l> PTI == ?
<rick_h> pardon the interruption (a sportsball show)
<snap-l> Ah, ok
<rick_h> espn show I can't watch since I don't have cable so I podcast it
<snap-l> I listen to security now on occasion
<snap-l> and TWiG from time to time
<rick_h> I can't listen to that. Gibson just seems to go on rambling and I can't get into it at all
<rick_h> ugh
<snap-l> Meh, he makes great background noise.
<rick_h> TWiG needs to be blown up and restarted
<brousch> No Radio Free Python?
<snap-l> Yeah, I don't find myself finishing too many episodes of TWiG
<snap-l> Mostly because the latter half of the show is pretty much fodder for the first part of the next show
<brousch> For non-geek, I listen to Reasonable Doubts
<snap-l> brousch: I'm 1:00 into the latest episode
<snap-l> and I want to quit it now
<brousch> It's entertaining
<snap-l> I'm sure he got clearance for all of the clips on the show. ;)
<brousch> Hm, clips?
<snap-l> The Monty Python clips
<brousch> OH, Radio Free Python
<snap-l> Yeah
<brousch> He is kind of pompous, but knows Python deeply
<snap-l> I find most tech podcasts are a bit wanting if there's not two people on the show
<snap-l> and sometimes panel shows can be too much
<brousch> He usually has interviews
<snap-l> There's only one amateur tech podcast that I listen to all the way through, and that's lococast.net. ;)
<snap-l> Sometimes I listen to it several times just to make sure I got everything
<brousch> If only they would release more often
<brousch> I assume they are working on an 8 hour long mega-show
<brousch> New RSS Reader http://reader.aol.com/
<snap-l> Oh hell no
<brousch> :D
<snap-l> brousch: http://spawnfromdeceit1.bandcamp.com/
<snap-l> Right up your alley.
<brousch> Duck grind?
<snap-l> No
<brousch> That's all i listen to now
<brousch> Duck Grind and Ass Blasters
<snap-l> And they let you have children
<brousch> Indeed
<brousch> As many as I want!
<brousch> snap-l: I am enjoying Spawn of Deceit
<snap-l> brousch: I thought you might.
<brousch> With this standing desk the whole office can see me headbanging
<snap-l> hah. :)
<brousch> snap-l: I think I like Spawn of Deceit's older album even more
<snap-l> brousch: Ah, I'll have to check that one out
<snap-l> I got into checking out a band's recommendations, and fortunately they had a lot of CC-music
<snap-l> Which is why there's a lot of punk and hardcore in this latest episode
<jrwren_> why do people keep dogs in the house when they are so much trouble. I'll never understand it.
<rick_h> because good dogs aren't so much trouble :)
<jrwren_> about the second night some dog yaps and wakes me up. I'd get rid of it.
<jrwren_> By get rid of it, I mean it would no longer be welcome in my house. It can sleep outdoors.
<jrwren_> and if I hear barking, it dies.
<jrwren_> unless it is barking at a person. intruder detection is nice.
<snap-l> I think jrwren_ is a cat person
<jrwren_> the funny thing is, i prefer dogs to cats. I just have no tollerance for yappy dogs.
<snap-l> So don't get a yappy dog
<jrwren_> indeed.
<snap-l> I think yappy dogs are also like misbehaving kids
<snap-l> if they're not destroying something valuable, they get a pass after a while
<snap-l> Well fuck
<snap-l> http://www.forbes.com/sites/jeremygreenfield/2013/06/25/barnes-noble-bows-to-apple-amazon-exits-tablet-business-nook-weighing-bn-down/
<AaronThul> wow
<AaronThul> I wonder how much they lost on the Nook
<rick_h> so their answer is " Nook apps will come pre-loaded on kids-focused Fuhu nabi tablets and also on E FUN Nextbook tablets." w...t...f
<rick_h> weren't the closing up the B&N stores and were going to split the nook as the only 'good' part of their business?
<snap-l> Well, I think part of it was the nook app store sucked balls
<snap-l> So the new tablets couldn't compete with the newer Google offerings
<snap-l> which is why they added Google Play to 'em
<snap-l> Then they dropped the price by a LOT
<greg-g> some days I wish I smoked so I could go out for a cigarette break and walk around
<snap-l> greg-g: Just hang out with the smokers.
<snap-l> Honestly, they're like little informal decision meetings anyway
<greg-g> then I'd end up smoking (or at least smelling like smoke, which is just about as bad, for Carrie/Rowan)
<greg-g> 'tis true
<snap-l> at least that was what happened at Ford
<greg-g> huh
<rick_h> greg-g: I just get up and go for a walk and 'take a break' :P
<snap-l> was 10x more productive meetings
<greg-g> less so here, honestly
<greg-g> alright, going for a walk. I'll get enough second hand smoke from being downtown anyways :)
<greg-g> "contact high" here I come!
<jrwren_> greg-g: just go for a walk. what is the big deal?
<snap-l> Oh wait, this is SF, right?
<snap-l> So they're going out for a "smoke break"
<snap-l> "It's 4:20 somewhere, maaaan"
<snap-l> ;)
<greg-g> jrwren_: mostly, a person who stands there/sits there by themselves not doing anything but sitting/standing looks weird. The cigarette gives you a purpose
<snap-l> greg-g: You could always oogle people.
<snap-l> Gives you a purpose, and a creepy factor as well
<greg-g> no comment
 * greg-g goes
<jrwren_> get a camera, take photo breaks.
<snap-l> AaronThul: BTW: Don't think you can just sneak in here and not say Hello. :)
<snap-l> We've missed you!
<AaronThul> I been hiding out in Canada LOL
<snap-l> So I've heard
<snap-l> Hgoping for a SCOTUS ruling that can help with that
<rick_h> AaronThul: hah, I just made an appt to go to canada to have my car worked on
<snap-l> not holding my breath though
<rick_h> AaronThul: where at?
<AaronThul> Vancouver
<rick_h> cool
<AaronThul> yes its a nice city but sure rains a lot
<AaronThul> hmm where the heck is drivedb.h on Ununtu locate is failing me
<rick_h> AaronThul: http://packages.debian.org/search?searchon=contents&keywords=drivedb.h&mode=path&suite=stable&arch=any
<AaronThul> apthul@mara:/var/log$ ls /usr/share/smartmontools/drivedb.h
<AaronThul> ls: cannot access /usr/share/smartmontools/drivedb.h: No such file or directory
<rick_h> AaronThul: dpkg -l | grep smartmontools ?
<AaronThul> ii  smartmontools                             5.38-3ubuntu3                                   control and monitor storage systems using S.
<AaronThul> maybe my old version does not have a drive db
<rick_h> ah, maybe. what version is it?
<rick_h> http://packages.debian.org/search?searchon=contents&keywords=drivedb.h&mode=path&suite=stable&arch=any yea, not in squeeze (pre wheezy)
<AaronThul> maybe someone has a PPA
<AaronThul> I want to keep an eye on m shinny new SSDs
<brousch> rick_h: Did you break your car already?
<rick_h> brousch: no, but it's a complicated tow behicle. I need to have the hitch reinforced before I can use a WD hitch.
<rick_h> brousch: so for optimal safety going to take it to CA and get it reinforced and balanced out.
<greg-g> you're coming to CA?
<brousch> Why is nothing easy with you?
<rick_h> greg-g: CA Canada :P
<rick_h> brousch: yea, it's a mess. towing is different in EU where they make this thing
<greg-g> I thought it was in prep to come out here to visit me, oh well
<rick_h> so it's odd doing it right here int he US
<AaronThul> wow just learned something about pg_restore I really wish I knew a few days ago
<snap-l> AaronThul: Something happen to your DB?
<AaronThul> yes bad things
<snap-l> Ugh
<snap-l> That's the opposite of good things
<AaronThul> last few days been no fun
<jcastro> hey AaronThul !
<jcastro> long time!
<AaronThul> jcastro: for sure
<AaronThul> I been hiding out in Canada
<jrwren_> how to profile a python daemon?
<snap-l> Profile or just see what it's doing?
<snap-l> if it's the latter, i resort to strace
<snap-l> If it's the former, then I'd check out: http://docs.python.org/2/library/profile.html
<greg-g> ugh, we're getting DOS'd by amazon AWS on our search cluster (making lots of bogus search queries)
<greg-g> by users of AWS, that is
<brousch> Who did you piss off this time?
<greg-g> usually everyone
<snap-l> Take that Wikipedia for [citation needed]
<brousch> If you would just block the controversial posts and allow all of the posts through you wouldn't have these problems
<greg-g> brousch: yep, 'zactly
<brousch> Glad I could help
<snap-l> brousch: DO you happen to have that list of controversial posts in a .csv format?
<brousch> I assume it's part of the Wikimedia API
<greg-g> so, there was this optional, opt-in feature to hide images tagged with nsfw or something. The "community" wouldn't let it go through on the grounds of CENSORSHIP!
<jrwren_> python -m cProfile worked very well. I'm just dumb.
<greg-g> community in scarequotes because like many things, I think it was a vocal minority
<brousch> Who decides what gets the tag?
<snap-l> Exactly. How am I to get my daily fix of NSFW Wikiporn?
<brousch> snap-l: That tag would make it easier to find the wikipr0n
<greg-g> theres plenty of porn on wikimedia commons
<snap-l> who runs wikimedia commons?
<brousch> greg-g does
<snap-l> and how long are the logs kept? :)
<greg-g> we scrub IPs as soon as possible, but we have stats on number of views per media/page
<greg-g> we have probably the best TOS in the industry, *especially* for a top 5 website
<widox> rick_h: that api conference that came up in CHC, http://api-craft.org/
<rick_h> widox: cool, thanks.
<rick_h> curses, right after pyohio
<rick_h> ugh, weekday conference.
<brousch> Weekday are the best. Get a day off work and the boss pays
<brousch> But yeah, d00d, right after PyOhio
<jrwren_> TIL: plotting 5000 points onto a world map with d3js and refreshing every second is SLOW
<brousch> 3 days long?
<widox> the first day is really only a party at night
<jrwren_> TIL: pickle is huge orders of magnitude faster than json. cpickle is a few more orders of magnitude faster than pickle
<rick_h> jrwren_: yea, just no portability to other langs and you can get some strange object behavior on occassion.
<jrwren_> its *really good* for what I'm doing :)
<jrwren_> well, shared memory and real threads would be better, but python fucking sucks, ya know :)
<jrwren_> i considered using *not python*
<rick_h> widox: oh, it's an unconference. Interesting
<jcastro> snap-l: not in #ubuntu-community-team anymore?
<snap-l> jcastro: Nah, I don't hang out in there much
<snap-l> Anything I missed, jcastro ?
<jcastro> no
<jcastro> I was going to whine about metal
<snap-l> Ah
<snap-l> whine away. :)
<jrwren_> jcastro: learn something tomorrow!
<jcastro> heh
<snap-l> jcastro: Picked up Supercollider?
<jcastro> yeah
<snap-l> And?
<jcastro> not very good.
<snap-l> Seems to be the general consensus
<snap-l> Though I remember you hating Endgame as well
<jcastro> ensgame has at least 3 good soongs
<jcastro> thing one .. man, nothing
<jcastro> it's just not good
<jcastro> which makes me sad
<snap-l> Ugh
<snap-l> So they finally shit out a Death Magnetic. ;)
<snap-l> (That's not fair, at lease Death Magnetic had Judas Kiss)
<snap-l> http://www.neilpeart.net/index.php?cID=244
<snap-l> I don't think I could have picked a better muse
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-06-26
<greg-g> yay, replaced keyboard, now I have a p key again!
<greg-g> and ooo, new keyboard feel
<greg-g> new *thinkpad* keyboard feel
<greg-g> very important distinction
<greg-g> now, if I can just find that last screw that I lost
<snap-l> Good morning
<brousch> yes
<brousch> Though my heels hurt today
<snap-l> brousch: Rough night in stripper heels last night?
<brousch> No. My 4th day doing standing desk
<snap-l> Ah. Liking the progress so far?
<brousch> Yeah. My heels are the only issue so far
<brousch> They hurt this morning, now they feel numb
<rick_h> morning
<snap-l> brousch: I think you might be overdoing it
<rick_h> ok, politics aside, this TX thing is crazy
<rick_h> talk about waking up to a crazy twitter stream
<brousch> eh?
<rick_h> really? You didn't see anything about this Texas Senate thing last night?
<snap-l> I don't watch the news.
<brousch> I don't either
<brousch> I see it now
<rick_h> man, it took over my twitter feed
<snap-l> All I'm seeing in the NYT story is why we can't have nice things
<rick_h> I don't either but it came from everywhere last night it seems.
<brousch> I don't read twitter much either
<brousch> snap-l: http://my.firedoglake.com/kitoconnell/2013/06/25/senator-wendy-davis-filibusters-sb5-anti-abortion-bill-in-texas-live/
<rick_h> snap-l: which one is that?
<brousch> That seems good
<snap-l> http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/27/us/politics/texas-abortion-bill.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
<snap-l> And all I know for certain is I'm not a woman, and thereby have 0% authority on this subject. :)
<snap-l> For those of you who might think there is a rounding error, that's 0.00000000000000%
<rick_h> I love that they did my old trick from college coding projects
<rick_h> touching the modified times to force themto be on on time
<snap-l> rick_h: Heh
<rick_h> the fact that they got someone, to go onto the website and change dates is funny
<snap-l> I thought it might have been the 10 hours standing in pink neakers filibustering. ;)
<rick_h> that's crazy
<rick_h> I mean there's a whole bunch of politics/womens rights stuff in there. but the whole thing is just nuts overall
<snap-l> I love how it's a hot button issue for people for whom it has absolutely no bearing whatsoever
<jrwren> brousch: i had the same standing desk transition issues. just power through, no big deal.
<brousch> I will build 2" calluses
<jrwren> stop pacing in place.
<jrwren> focus on good standing posture.
<brousch> I think I'm a heel stander
<brousch> I have to consciously shift my weight forward
<rick_h> my wife is a heel walker, I can't get her to change it much at all
<rick_h> thuds on the wood floors as she thunders around the house...but don't tell her I told you that :)
<brousch> Such lovely blackmail material
<rick_h> hah
<rick_h> "So um...yea that webgl stuff is kinda cool I guess..." http://microsoft-news.com/webgl-spdy3-new-dev-tools-more-confirmed-for-ie11-in-win-8-1/
<rick_h> and time to start using spdy on your servers now with FF/Chrome and soon IE supporting it!
<jrwren> i don't know if i should trust the wii, but it said my balance was off so I try to adjust for that :)
<jrwren> spdy3 ?
<rick_h>  jrwren must be 3rd gen spdy?
<snap-l> Y'know there's just a certain magic to getting a makfile right
<snap-l> but once you do, it's a beautiful thing
<brousch> indeed
<jrwren> http://www.pcworld.com/article/237878/can_you_do_real_work_with_the_30_year_old_ibm_5150_.html
<jrwren> there is no magic to makefile if you know what they do. even the default macros aren't magic. they are beautiful and powerful.
<jrwren> i just wish teh default macros were extensible. C/C++ only is kinda drab.
<snap-l> jrwren: That article on the 5150 is interesting
<snap-l> Wonder if the same could be said for the Atari 800. ;)
<jrwren> VERY different machines. 1/20th the ram in an 800 IIRC
<jrwren> no 80col mode :(
<snap-l> jrwren: There's a terminal program that handles 80 col
<snap-l> and on a monochrome monitor it's mostly usable. ;)
<snap-l> And the 5150 shipped with 16K of RAM
<snap-l> though it tops out at 512K (iirc) and not 64K.
<jrwren> 640k according ot article.
<jrwren> base model may have shipped with 16k, but this model had 640K
<rick_h> ugh, so come Aug I won't be doing python or web dev work :/
<brousch> Sleeping all day?
<rick_h> woot!
<rick_h> Go :/
<brousch> That's used for actual things?
<rick_h> juju :)
<snap-l> rick_h: So is this a good thing?
<rick_h> snap-l: not really...kind of a thought provoking thing
<jrwren> you lucky bastard.
<jrwren> go is awesome.
<jrwren> python and webdev SUCK.
<jrwren> terrible combo.
<jrwren> i was doing a bunch yesterday and it dawned on me how many steps back it is from asp.net
<jrwren> no local cache model FFS! what is this? 1995?
<rick_h> huh? no local cache model?
<jrwren> yes, or rather you have to write your own.
<rick_h> https://pypi.python.org/pypi/dogpile.cache
<jrwren> equiv of asp.net's Cache object
<snap-l> Or god forbid use something like memcache.
<jrwren> memcache has another place.
<rick_h> it's python, it's been done
 * rick_h goes to look at wtf asp.net's cache object is...
<jrwren> yes, that dogpile cache looks SWEET
<snap-l> http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms178597(v=vs.100).aspx
<jrwren> don't bohter it is just a weak dictionary with timed out values.
<rick_h> so wtf...you're angry that you need a dep to get caching in your app?
 * snap-l bites tongue
<jrwren> i'm angry I don't already have the dep.
<brousch> Django should have it all built in!
<snap-l> [insert snarky thing about this isn't PHP]
<jrwren> i'm angry because my environment was/is 5yrs old with 8yr old tech.
<rick_h> caching is an anti-pattern :P
 * rick_h runs away
<jrwren> yes, django SHOULD have that built in, and i'm angry because I'm using cherrypy 2.2
<jrwren> :p
<snap-l> jrwren: What the hell are you on as an environment? CentOS 6?
<jrwren> custom distroo
<jrwren> based on rhel5
<snap-l> Oh FFS
<jrwren> yes, it is a certain hell.
<jrwren> still python26
<snap-l> you can sideload python 2.7
<snap-l> we do that on one of our Ubuntu 10.04 machines
<jrwren> you miss the point :p
<rick_h> jrwren: well, use dogpile. It's another mike bayer product to help replace the old pylons cache layer that basically got abandoned.
<snap-l> No, I get the point. I'm in denial. ;)
<rick_h> and does it a lot better
<jrwren> yes, dogpile looks SWEET
<jrwren> i'm also angry becuase... THREADS! GIL!
<rick_h> for a web app?
<rick_h> or something else?
<brousch> threads are an anti-pattern!
<snap-l> jrwren: Threading is for Java. ;)
<rick_h> jrwren: and you can't easily do it with with multi-process module?
<snap-l> Go green. Go green threads. ;)
<jrwren> because I don't have threads and shmmem i use 2 processes producer/consumer and a file as the non shared mem.
<jrwren> multiprocess MIGHT have worked, i'm unsure.
<jrwren> this hack works, and then after that I was angry because json is slow :)
<jrwren> json is really slow :)
<rick_h> jrwren: using the build is json lib?
<jrwren> yes, built in.
<rick_h> jrwren: what python version are you on?
<jrwren> 2.6
<jrwren> its ok. i'm just bitching.
<jrwren> its just often i feel like i end up with bandaid on bandaid instead of doing the right thing
<rick_h> jrwren: yea, I'm just checking when they pulled in simplejson which was faster because it used some c-extension bits
<jrwren> and often those bandaids are because of python
<jrwren> yes, I have an old simplejson and an old cjson already on there.
<rick_h> well old doesn't help :P
<jrwren> a huge part of the json slowness was solved by moving to cPickle
<rick_h> cool
<rick_h> yea, that'll live in C-land and be quick
<jrwren> i'm just bitching.
<snap-l> jrwren: We're just trying to keep you from pining for the Fjords.
<rick_h> yea, bitching with reason is cool. And if I can kill a couple of reasons for you we all win :)
<jrwren> probably bitching because what really should be done is the entire prod environment upgraded, and that is a big piece of work.
<rick_h> ok, so the asp.net cache is varnish + dogpile
<jrwren> oh, i wasn't even thinking of the varnish side of it.
<jrwren> i could care less about page caching.
<jrwren> really just wanted a cache object.
<snap-l> https://soundcloud.com/mikewolters16/dm-m-podcast-062613
<brousch> Ew. This happens to you East siders? http://www.reddit.com/r/WTF/comments/1h3jst/fish_fly_season_in_michigan/
<snap-l> brousch: Yes, the closer you get to lake st. clair
<snap-l> and yes, they're rather disgusting
<rick_h> yea, down where my in-laws live it's crazy
<rick_h> I guess you can't drive because the roads slick with bug guts
<rick_h> lots of accidents every year
<snap-l> I hadn't  heard of them until I started dating JoDee
<snap-l> and we experienced them first-hand in Macomb
<brousch> That is nasty
<brousch> Why would you live with that?
<jrwren> its only once a year
<jrwren> and most years aren't bad.
<jrwren> its just the 2 yrs of the cycle that is bad.
<rick_h> because it's for about two weeks and you get lake front living the rest of the time
<snap-l> honestly they're the dumbest flies I've ever seen
<snap-l> they just sit on things waiting for death
<brousch> That's like 10% of the good weather months covered in flies
<snap-l> they're the Bill Knapps of the insect world
<snap-l> http://i.imgur.com/2DVKoCJ.jpg
<rick_h> lmao
<snap-l> OK, that's just nasty
<brousch> Just one more reason I'll never move to Detroit
<rick_h> yea, that's the thing that's blocking you lol
<snap-l> Think of it as the east-side's answer to lake-effect snow. :)
<snap-l> http://www.reddit.com/r/WTF/comments/1h3jst/fish_fly_season_in_michigan/caqnt15
<brousch> It's weird, but they get a lot more snow north and south of GR
<brousch> My family in Niles gets way more snow every year
<jrwren> zomg django! https://github.com/SoloTodo/django_bootstrap_registration
<brousch> DJANGOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
<jrwren> jcastro: learn something at fanzoo at 6pm. I'll meet you there, K?
<jcastro> jrwren: I have house guests, can you tell them hi for me though?
<jrwren> bring Jim.
<jrwren> let merideth and jill have girl night :p
<rick_h> hey, he didn't make it out to CHC he can't go to fanzoo :P
<snap-l> Yeah, we get jcastro dibs first.
<jrwren> no you don't.
<jrwren> my meeting is 5miles away. your meeting is 50 miles away
<snap-l> Our meeting has coffee
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-06-27
<jrwren> mine has beer.
<jrwren> anyone know of a window/chunked function in js? i don't see one in underscore or jquery :(
<snap-l> jrwren: WHat are you looking to do?
<rick_h> jrwren: nope
<rick_h> trevlar: http://bommaritollc.com/2013/03/09/generating-ssh-config-from-aws-hosts-using-boto/
<Blazeix> jrwren: don't know of anything, but this is kind of fun: http://vpaste.net/zfsNJ
<trevlar> snap-l: http://raspberrycolocation.com/
<rick_h> Blazeix: http://googledevelopers.blogspot.com/2013/05/an-easier-way-to-save-files-to-google.html
<jrwren> Blazeix: that looks WAY better than the shit I just wrote :)
<jrwren> look at this terd of a comparison: http://paste.mitechie.com/show/973/
<Blazeix> yours might be more memory efficient :)
<jrwren> its possible, if mine worked, it doesn't... yet.
<jrwren> TIL about lodash. very interesting underscore alternative
<Blazeix> huh, cool, never heard of it
<Blazeix> wait, backbone uses lodash?
<jrwren> Blazeix: that works beautifully.
<rick_h> see, CHC > * :P
<jrwren> the story goes: some people wanted to contrib to underscore, their ideas were rejected. an api compatible lodash was created.
<rick_h> well, Blazeix > * :)
<jrwren> CHC is different.
<jrwren> i'm home already, so I guess CHC is more hardcore.
<snap-l> *<:-)
<jrwren> i started at 6pm :p
<jrwren> Blazeix: where did you get that chunked impl? you whip it up?
<Blazeix> yeah
<Blazeix> my excuse is that i'm learning haskell, so my JS is starting to resemble haskell
<Blazeix> so i gave you that implementation, and you gave me knowledge about the existence of lodash. win-win
<jrwren> haskell calls it chunk?
<jrwren> F# calls it window.
<Blazeix> oh, i don't know if there's a haskell implementation. i just mean it's a very functional-ish implementation
<jrwren> indeed.
<jrwren> F# seq.windowed or window. not exactly sure.
<jrwren> i wish javascript had a better continuation passing style
<jrwren> oh, i guess it does, I just need to use it *sigh*
<jrwren> this works great.
<rick_h> woot
<Blazeix> jrwren: what are you using cps for? async stuff?
<rick_h> will look at it with fresh eyes tomorrow but any feedback appreciated. http://uploads.mitechie.com/resume.html Feel free to send an email or something with notes/suggestions. Time for bed.
<rick_h> Blazeix: <3 the pic lol
<Blazeix> haha, yeah, tethering for the win
<Blazeix> james got his arduino thing working with seconds to spare
<rick_h> lol, awesome
<Blazeix> rick_h: quick look over the resume, looks good. i think that first sentence in the summary may have gotten a bit jumbled, though
<Blazeix> "about their craft about the UX" maybe missing the word 'and'
<rick_h> Blazeix: yea, I keep trying to tweak it. It's got a mix of 4 different ideas in it now
<rick_h> hah, yea. brain auto adding things to it.
<snap-l> rick_h: Doesn't say anything about "strong correct opinions" ;)
<rick_h> snap-l: you have to bring me on board for a while to get that. Must experience to believe it :)
<snap-l> On the Maza Server, might want to reword "This project worked on a very tight deadline as it was a required feature for the Ubuntu release.
<rick_h> k
<snap-l> as "Project required rapid turn around to meet deadline for Ubuntu release"
<snap-l> Also, keep your tenses the same
<snap-l> Verbed blah blah blah
<rick_h> snap-l: yea, that's some of the fresh eye stuff to go back through tomorrow. I mix stuff up as I edited this section and that section
<snap-l> lmk if you need some help with it.
<rick_h> will do, thanks!
<snap-l> np
<snap-l> If you really want to feel belittled, my mom was an English teacher, and can lay the grammar smack-down. :)
<Blazeix> you can rehost, adding bright red strikethrough
<rick_h> the dreaded red-ink!
<snap-l> Nah, she'll photo-copy it and mark it with the real thing
<snap-l> Has a more visceral bloody cut feel to it with the real ink. :)
<snap-l> It isn't real editing until someone draws blood
<snap-l> Also, unless you want to be Richard Harding at gig++, you may just want to use Rick Harding
<snap-l> May help with the google juice
<rick_h> yea, I use Richard because it's the formal and what any paperwork will say
<rick_h> it sucks, I have that with work now. email and such is rick.harding, but then I have to make sure all insurance/etc say Richard actually on it
<snap-l> Change your name to Rick Harding legally. That  should be entertaining. :)
<rick_h> hah, named after my great grandfather. Can't go that route
<snap-l> bah
<snap-l> tradition is for the weak. Now if you'll excuse me I must do my evening ritual passed down through several generations. ;)
<snap-l> g'night
<jrwren> Blazeix: just wanted cps to time delay those things which I chunked.
<jrwren> telling d3js to transition ease 300+ objects all at once kills firefox, so I chunk 50 at a time over a time period.
<jrwren> cps to setTimeout and move to next instance (continue)
<rick_h> wow, amazon won't work for me this morning. Site loads but can't login to see orders, tried to buy something and it died at payment.
<brousch> Works for me. Get a real Internets
<brousch> Maybe they cut you off for ordering too much stuff
<rick_h> but but but...my camper needs accessories!
<brousch> Like a bar cutting off a drunk
<rick_h> nooooooooooooo
<brousch> snap-l: , I think it's time to set up that Amazon Intervention we've been talking about
<snap-l> brousch: It's already in motion
<snap-l> From now on the only site rick_h can buy from is buy.com.
<snap-l> And may God have mercy on his soul
<rick_h> test
<brousch> Still blocked
<rick_h> dammit, our 4th of july destinations is having a nice cool spell right now but going to go back up in temps the day we get out there. Curse you mother nature!!!
<snap-l> Heh
<snap-l> jrwren: Hate leads to anger, anger leads to fear, fear leads to late nights coding to make the bad go away. ;)
<widox> rick_h: but really, you can't trust the forcast that far out
<brousch> If you can't trust some of the biggest supercomputers and forecast models in the world, then who can you trust?
<snap-l> I think I figured out how to get LXC containers to bridge to our internal network
<rick_h> woot!
<snap-l> which means I won't have to create new VBox instances just for one-off server instances.
<snap-l> nuts, just realized etckeeper is using bzr by default and not git on my work machine
<rick_h> doh, run away!
<greg-g> Ubuntu changes it
<greg-g> 'cuz, you know
<snap-l> stupid
<greg-g> if you used Debian it'd do the right thing by default ;)
<rick_h> burn!
<snap-l> Oh well. At least I can use bzr-git to pull out some history
<snap-l> Well, that success was short lived
<snap-l> Machine was acting up.
<snap-l> Not sure why.
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-06-28
<brousch> Hm http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1320575205/handibottm-a-smart-digital-power-tool
<snap-l> Good morning
<snap-l> Or some reasonable equivalent
<widox> hey hey
<rick_h> ugh
<rick_h> stupid world
<brousch> Hobo eat your shoes again?
<rick_h> the storm killed my run for ice cream last night since everyone was without power
<rick_h> then this morning it killed my coffee run because of no power at starbucks of kroger
<rick_h> so I'm sans ice cream, sans coffee, and I'm looking for someone's code to review so they can pay for the trouble mother nature has caused me!
 * rick_h goes to look at brousch's github.
<brousch> hah!
<brousch> We didn't get any storms yesterday
<rick_h> <3 this http://sideeffect.kr/popularconvention
<rick_h> wow, the fact that java is 92% within 80 chars floors me
<brousch> Now if only they'd link to the offending projects so you could beat them with the pep8 rubber snake
<rick_h> woot!
<brousch> 5% tabs in python
 * rick_h notes to get a pep8 rubber snake
<rick_h> yea, I bet it's those tab-loving science types messing that up :P or people with default windows editors that use tabs ootb
<jcastro> hey jrwren
<jcastro> how's your Golang and Windows skills?
<_stink_> and this is github code only, where i'd expect people to follow convention better than in many other cases
<_stink_> so i bet these numbers are higher than they should be
<brousch> _stink_: Github is full of a lot of little projects no one cares about, so I'd expect it to be less strict
<_stink_> i'd expect lots of code on github to be written by open source nerds that care about pep8 :P
<brousch> http://mattjibson.com/blog/2013/06/26/go-read-open-source-google-reader-clone/
<snap-l> rick_h: http://www.metalinjection.net/latest-news/maynard-james-keenan-will-auction-off-his-platinum-records-for-chairty
<snap-l> something for Erica to get you for Christmas. :)
<brousch> I'm sitting today due to heel pain. Thinking of trying the ball chair next
<brousch> snap-l: This sounds like your kind of thing http://grand-con.com/
<hackfu-> i found a major bug in facebook
<greg-g> yay, another site outage last night!
<greg-g> for about 40 minutes :(
<hackfu-> it allows me to completely hijack accounts, without needing to interact with the user
<greg-g> I don't think I know you, hackfu-, have you been in this channel much before?
<hackfu-> Not much.
<hackfu-> it took them about 5 days to response, and instafix.
<hackfu-> after I reported it that is.
<greg-g> oh, cool
<hackfu-> http://grosec.wordpress.com/2013/06/28/hijacking-a-facebook-account-with-sms/
<hackfu-> blogpost aboutit
<greg-g> neat
 * greg-g only skimmed
<snap-l> brousch: Wow, Ed Greenwood will be there? That's unreal.
<snap-l> Interesting they also have Tracy and Laura Hickman
<rick_h> snap-l: :)
<rick_h> brousch: 2hr shifts. It's what I do
<rick_h> brousch: I can't make it a full workday so I stand 2hrs, sit 2, back/forth
<rick_h> actually fits with my typical work day workdflow nicely
<brousch> I have to move 3 large boxes, 4 small ones, and a steel plate to set up my standing desk
<rick_h> greg-g: 40min? ouch
<rick_h> brousch: which takes 5min?
<brousch> yes
<brousch> And a stack of boxes in my office
<rick_h> brousch: so a good 5min break every 2hrs seems just the thing :P
<brousch> I'll try that next week
<brousch> I should duct tape the whole thing together
<jrwren> jcastro: my colang and windows skills are non exist :)
<jcastro> dang
<jrwren> why? what up?
<jrwren> I should really get a windows box up somewhere :)
<rick_h> jrwren: juju on windows :)
 * rick_h guesses
<jrwren> I'm not looking for work, well maybe moonlighting.
<jrwren> jcastro: my golang windows skills are superior if you are willing to pay me part time.
<snap-l> brousch: You might have sparked me going to Grand Rapids after all
<snap-l> ArtPrize is going on the same time
<greg-g> rick_h: yeah, late evening deploy by the high profile feature team :(
<greg-g> luckily we have one of our site architects in Australia who got back from lunch to help fix it
<rick_h> ah, nice
<rick_h> you deploy it you stick around for it I always say :P
<greg-g> that's our rule too, but this team is a little.....
<greg-g> cowboy-ish
<rick_h> pull the reins!
<rick_h> ooh, I did spell that right, go me
<brousch> snap-l: FTR, those events are separated by several miles
<snap-l> Yeah, you depoloy, you get to ensure it lands
<snap-l> brousch: That's no biggie.
<snap-l> GR isn't like Columbus or Detroit
<hackfu> I need to get to france
<snap-l> They're actually polite on occasion. ;)
<hackfu> either tomorrow or today
<snap-l> http://www.reddit.com/r/netsec/comments/1h4lgk/hijacking_a_facebook_account_with_sms/
<brousch> right, but you won't be walking from one to the other
<snap-l> brousch: Oh no doubt
<snap-l> It's not Holland. ;)
<snap-l> Actually, Holland isn't walkable outside of the downtown area.
<snap-l> Not in "and get there within reasonable time"
<jrwren> holland is west michigan's royal oak.
<jrwren> you can drive there and walk
<snap-l> Yeah, 90% of it
<jrwren> but walking out of it is not something you do.
<brousch> First weekend of ArtPrize is a mad house downtown
<hackfu> I have submitted a chain of bugs to the Chromium security team, including code execution with full user privilige.
<snap-l> Can't be any worse than Amway opening the secret vaults to air them out. ;)
<snap-l> We mustn't be entertaining enough for long visits.
<snap-l> I <3 German game designers
<snap-l> http://zmangames.com/nouvelles-details.php?id=314 "You must skillfully manage your glass and brick production in order to build the right structures that help you to keep your business flowing. Cut the forest to keep the fires burning in the ovens, spread and remove ponds, pits and forests to supply yourself with the items you need. There are 15 specialists at you side to carry out your orders...
<snap-l> btw: New Club Metal released last night / this morning
<greg-g> enat
<greg-g> s/en/ne/
<snap-l> atne?
<Blazeix> nate.
<snap-l> Wahoo, I won a caption contest on Metal Injection
<snap-l> http://www.metalinjection.net/free-swag/caption-contest/caption-contest-win-a-free-cd-from-our-giveaway-pile
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-06-29
<snap-l> evening
<gamerchick02> howdy i was about to switch to the other computer.
<jrwren> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vboGDSUGCyY
<rick_h> morning
<snap-l> Good morning
<rick_h> snap-l: whatever do you mean :P
<rick_h> snap-l: just because my coffee is half milk doesn't mean anything
<snap-l> Heh. :)
<snap-l> I consider it a gateway drug to the real pure black-tar of good coffee. ;)
<rick_h> loll
<rick_h> well, the big thing the frother does is heat the milk
<rick_h> having lukewarm coffee out of the moka pot the last few days has been :(
<snap-l> We'll have to bring over the Turkish coffee set sometime
<rick_h> and I wasn't sure about just nuking the milk before putting it in the coffee
<rick_h> yea, that's what jodee keeps saying
<snap-l> since our stove goes from 0 to nuclear winter and very little inbetween
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-06-30
<smlr-hangout> SMLR is live Video; http://www.youtube.com/embed/v1uXDbv1I5M Audio: http://live.smlr.us:8000/streaming
<smlr-hangout> SMLR is are also chatting on IRC Freenode server #smlr
<rick_h> ls
<snap-l> Howdy.
<jrwren> http://codepen.io/soulwire/pen/JBhxs
<rick_h> howdy
<rick_h> jrwren: cool
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-06-23
<sydney> afk,goodnight!!
<cmaloney> Good morning
<brousch__> yes
<brousch__> I have literally a van full of old electronics from home to recycle
<rick_h_> morning
<rick_h_> heh, one day I'll empty out the office and do the same thing
<rick_h_> speaking of which anyone want a linksys e3200 or 400N router?
<cmaloney> rick_h_: I might be interested in the e3200
<rick_h_> cmaloney: cool, let me know and I can bring to CHC
<cmaloney> kk
<rick_h_> cmaloney: I think the wrt400N is 'faster' or something but don't recall the details
<rick_h_> or not
<cmaloney> I think the WRT400N doesn't have gigabit
<rick_h_> yea, I guess that one's older
<rick_h_> bigger numbers confused me on a monday, 4 v 3 :P
<cmaloney> heh
<mrgoodcat> hey all
<brousch__> cmaloney: Here's your next router http://news.slashdot.org/story/14/06/22/1310257/eff-to-unveil-open-wireless-router-for-open-wireless-movement
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/khwx2V - EFF To Unveil Open Wireless Router For Open Wireless Movement - Slashdot
<cmaloney> brousch__: I love the idea of open wireless.
<mrgoodcat> http://www.blitzortung.org/Webpages/index.php?lang=en&page_0=30
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/9xkGbL - Blitzortung.org â lightning map USA, Canada â thunderstorms and lightning strikes
<cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
<bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - Destruction and Bliss by Sybreed on God Is an Automaton
 * cmaloney loves the Bandcamp app for the Squeezebox
<cmaloney> allows me to preview any album they have in their catalog
<cmaloney> search is a bit wonky, but it works otherwise.
<trevlar> anybody here use both absolute and relative line numbers in vim? I had it working after waf introduced it to me a while ago but it seemed to have stopped working in one of the recent versions of vim
<cmaloney> I just use absolute line numbers
<cmaloney> Didn't care for relative line numbers
<rick_h_> yea, never can get used to the jump by X and such. One day I'll get it and gain super powers
<cmaloney> Oh totally. I can see the value in it, but I'm already ADD enough that it doesn't help to have something moving along the side of my editor
<trevlar> yeah, I like relative numbers, but having a "0" on the current line is kind of pointless :/
<cmaloney> Well, technically....
<cmaloney> ;)
<cmaloney> I wouldn't be surprised if there was a key-combo in vim that would use line 0 to mean the current line
<cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
<bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - sunderverl by Chris Randall
<cmaloney> New Chris Randall = A+
<jrwren> really?
<jrwren> what kind of music is it?
<jrwren> i just guestimate the relative line numbers and then correct when I'm off :)
<cmaloney> Micronaut-esque.
<cmaloney> I think Chris Randall got tired of the Micronaut moniker. That and there's at least two other folks using it.
<cmaloney> on bandcamp alone.
<cmaloney> Which I think would be the equivalent of naming your band "Aerosmith". ;)
<cmaloney> Because while Micronauts were a popular kids toy, Chris Randall really "owned" it. ;)
<greg-g> cmaloney: "band's campout"?
<cmaloney> greg-g: That's the one
 * greg-g nods
<mrgoodcat> i know you folks don't really care about ruby but you may find this interesting anyways http://lucaguidi.com/2014/06/23/introducing-lotus.html
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/Zt8zYx - Introducing Lotus â Luca Guidi
<brousch__> I have Lotus on floppy disks
<mrgoodcat> you what?
<mrgoodcat> FTL for 4$ today on steam
<brousch__> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lotus_1-2-3
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/uR3B - Lotus 1-2-3 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
<jrwren> i dont' care about ruby, but I am very interested in anything going on in that community.
<mrgoodcat> latest stable release in 2002
<mrgoodcat> thats cutting edge
<jrwren> its a spreadsheet.  did resolver ever get opensourced?
<mrgoodcat> jrwren: they are different lotuses
<mrgoodcat> the one i posted was a recent release
<jrwren> mrgoodcat: i meant 1-2-3 like brousch__ said.
<mrgoodcat> just making sure
<jrwren> resolverone is still for sale, not open source, but maybe freely licensed to an open source project. hrmf
<cmaloney> Just so you can all share in my joy: My cat took her first poop in $newplace.
<jrwren> gross
<cmaloney> I have never been more happy to hear about cat shit in my life.
<rick_h_> cmaloney: lmao
<cmaloney> jrwren: Well, she was pretty scared
<mrgoodcat> scared of the move?
<jrwren> congrats!
<mrgoodcat> my dog didn't even notice when we moved
<mrgoodcat> the couch smelled the same so she was like w/e
<mrgoodcat> i guess we live here now
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: She doesn't like the basement
<brousch__> cmaloney: You need to make sure it smells normal. An off-odor in cat feces can be a sign of stress or illness. Really get up close to it and take a big whiff.
<cmaloney> which is where we'd like to put her litter.
<cmaloney> brousch__: I need an expert opinion.
<cmaloney> Will pm you the address
<brousch__> I don't have cats
<cmaloney> You should get some
<rick_h_> no, don't ever get cats
<brousch__> You need someone familiar with the smell of the pre-move feces to compare the two
<rick_h_> if you want some come take mine
<cmaloney> They're just like kids except they really don't give a damn what you think.
<brousch__> My wife is allergic, so cats are right-out
<rick_h_> just make it a night the wife is away and break a window so I can say they ran away
<cmaloney> rick_h_: That's when you'll find out your cats have been staying up late watching Bruce Lee movies
<cmaloney> and learning Cat-fu
<cmaloney> Crouching kitten, hidden mouse.
<rick_h_> heh, sorry. cats are down the food chain and survive due to their momma only
<mrgoodcat> cats don't learn cat fu. they eat and shit and puke and try to kill you and never love or appreciate anyone
<cmaloney> So in other words the perfect animal. :)
<cmaloney> And I'd argue they do show love and appreciation
<cmaloney> They're just picky
<mrgoodcat> lol
<mrgoodcat> i don't hate cats
<mrgoodcat> they just aren't my first choice
<mrgoodcat> that being said, the cupholder picture on g+ is great
<rick_h_> I just hate cats
<rick_h_> at least dogs can be trained to do things and hunt and such
<cmaloney> rick_h_: So can cats. They just chose not to.
<cmaloney> One theory is that cats are much smarter than dogs. The problem is they can't test this because cat's couldn't care less if you're happy or not with their performance.
<mrgoodcat> fermi approximation cats and dogs are pretty much the same intelligence
<cmaloney> Well, and the thought was that cats domesticated themselves, which explains why they couldn't care less about humans.
<cmaloney> rather than canines being domesticated by humans.
<cmaloney> Which they theorize is why there haven't been many studies done with cats.
<cmaloney> It fits my worldview, ergo it must be true. :)
<mrgoodcat> just like politics :)
<cmaloney> Yep
<mrgoodcat> hurf durf my opinions are correct and you should have them too
<trevlar> speaking of cats, this is probably the best use of my raspberry pi yet
<trevlar> https://s3.amazonaws.com/trevdev/Screen+Shot+2014-06-23+at+4.01.25+PM.png
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/G6qI7G - image/png
<brousch__> trevlar: Catcam?
<rick_h_> cmaloney: early CHC dinner this week?
<trevlar> yep
<cmaloney> rick_h_: Possibly.
<rick_h_> cmaloney: k, let me know
<cmaloney> rick_h_: will do
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-06-24
<cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
<bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - Holy Fallout by Cynic on Kindly Bent to Free Us
<cmaloney> Reminds me of what would happen if Tesseract played more like Kings X.
<greg-g> where would gnome-shell keep it's list of enabled extensions? ie, the things you get from extensions.gnome.org ?
<jrwren> morn
<mrgoodcat> and a good morrow to you
<mrgoodcat> ~/.local/share/gnome-shell/extensions/
<mrgoodcat> greg-g: ^^
<rick_h_> party
<jrwren> super party
 * jrwren tops off everyones drinks.
<mrgoodcat> i'm so tired
<mrgoodcat> had to drop off cousin at 4am airport
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: I think you need to get a family that can bring their own transportation. :)
<rick_h_> I'm going to scream....and then kill something, and then laugh at it.
<rick_h_> cmaloney: congrats, I've got my new NC guy
<brousch__> rick_h_: That's a good way to get rid of extra cats
<rick_h_> the cats aren't from the UK and pissing me off right now with their stupid "it's always been broke like this" replies.
<greg-g> mrgoodcat: yep, thanks, found it last night, forgot to let the channel know
<waf> trevlar: vim's relative and absolute numbering works for me with vim 7.4.335
<waf> kind of funky to enable, since you have to set both "relativenumber" and "number"
<brousch__> rick_h_: That's a valid argument
<greg-g> this is odd, my mouse is acting weird. The laser goes off if I don't use/move it for 2 seconds, have to click a button a few times to get the laser back
<greg-g> well, unplugged/replugged and it seems to work again. #techsupport101
<rick_h_> going to stab something!
<greg-g> :(
<rick_h_> greg-g: :( on mouse issues
<mrgoodcat> cmaloney: heh i probably do
<trevlar> waf: on the same version. yeah it's odd. I have both number and relativenumber but still nothing :/ Even tried it without loading my vimrc in case there was a conflict
<trevlar> waf: oops, nevermind. vi wasn't aliased to vim, which is 7.4.335. so I was running 7.3 each time I opened a file :/ doh
<cmaloney> God I really hate UPS
<cmaloney> managed to fat-finger my address and have spent more than a few frustrated brain cells trying to figure out their site
<brousch__> This makes my pants tight http://shop.oreilly.com/product/0636920032502.do
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/Cf6Yjt - Lightweight Django - O'Reilly Media
<rick_h_> step 1: don't use django. I'd like to credit this book to my awesome family that let me spend the time researching this important topic.
<brousch__> OK, I really did lol at that
<rick_h_> glad I can help :)
<brousch__> FedEx tracking is so awesome https://www.fedex.com/fedextrack/index.html?tracknumbers=559995315057263&cntry_code=us
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/pPhNNs - Track your package or shipment with FedEx Tracking
<brousch__> 3 days in-transit from CA
<rick_h_> it was the weekend :P
<rick_h_> the fact that you've got anything there for sat is amazing
<brousch__> Must be strapped to a damn scooter
<brousch__> I've gotten FedEx deliveries on Saturday even though I don't ask for it
<rick_h_> heh, my laptop has been 'in production' for 4 days :P guess they're pouring plastics into a mold
<cmaloney> rick_h_: congratulations on finding a replacement NC dude. :)
<cmaloney> brousch__: FedEx tracking is next to worthless.
<cmaloney> It used to be fine but apparently they swapped with USPS
<rick_h_> we have to say nice things about ups so my deliveries come out on time today
<cmaloney> Now USPS is better and FedEx can only track a package when it's on your porch.
<rick_h_> hah
<rick_h_> usps can be better. I find it's a roll of the dice if I'm in the good system or the crappy one
<cmaloney> Or worse: their estimates fluctuate between three days from now and three weeks from now
<cmaloney> Yeah, it can be pretty wonky
<cmaloney> I've had tracking numbers that never seemed to work.
<cmaloney> (USPS onces)
<cmaloney> UPS is generally good with the tracking numbers but asking them to do things like change delivery on a package is inscrutable.
<rick_h_> yea, fedex just cost me $5, ups makes me try to convince the sender they need to update it
<rick_h_> instead of letting me do it
<brousch__> I tried to change the destination once. I ended up just havaing it delivered to the distribution center and picking it up. Luckily it's only a 10 minute drive
<mrgoodcat> ups is pretty ok
<mrgoodcat> back in laptop shopping mode. i'm looking at a MBA but I want something that runs linux a little more smoothly. I know we were talking about MBA competitors earlier but anybody got any good suggestions to maybe save me some money and headache?
<greg-g> apparently the Dell XPS dev edition or whatever
<cmaloney> rick_h_ intimated he'd picked up a new laptop
<cmaloney> He's usually not into the "cheap" end of it but he's definitely in the "smooth Linux operation" bit
<mrgoodcat> yea i was looking at the XPS
<mrgoodcat> but $$
<mrgoodcat> i suppose its about the same as the MBA
<mrgoodcat> and linux would be better obviously
<rick_h_> yea, I went with the xps dev edition
<mrgoodcat> happy with it?
<greg-g> he doesn't have it yet
<mrgoodcat> oh
<mrgoodcat> it comes with 12.04 not 14?
<greg-g> sudo do-release-upgrade
<mrgoodcat> i know
<greg-g> or whatever the command is
<greg-g> ;)
<greg-g> OEM are slow
<mrgoodcat> but it seems like i should get the current version if i just bought it
<greg-g> they probably only do LTSes, and then the switch from one to another takes time
<greg-g> it ain't easy at that scale
<rick_h_> mrgoodcat: yea, it's 'in production'
<rick_h_> and the first thing I'll do is plug in the usb stick for 14.04 and go through install
<mrgoodcat> ha i figured
<rick_h_> 180s later be in my nsystem
<rick_h_> usb3 ftw
<mrgoodcat> i'm gonna have more questions when you've used it for a bit
<rick_h_> sure thing
<mrgoodcat> early CHC tomorrow?
<rick_h_> yep
<rick_h_> cmaloney: though we might have to miss if we do dinner, right now I've got a 5pm-5:40pm meeting on the books :/
<mrgoodcat> hmm
<mrgoodcat> well if nobodys going i may as well not go either
<mrgoodcat> let me know what you end up doing
<rick_h_> mrgoodcat: well we'll be there
<rick_h_> just might be late since the plan is to eat first
<rick_h_> and I might be late, working on getting the meeting moved forwards
<mrgoodcat> ah
<mrgoodcat> aren't you the boss?
<mrgoodcat> just be like "hey bitches change of plan"
<greg-g> cuz that's good for morale ;)
<cmaloney> rick_h_: No worries. LMK if there's a change of plans.
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: I'll be there at least. :)
<cmaloney> so no worries there.
<mrgoodcat> ok
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-06-25
<brousch__> Stupid FedEx. They call to tell me my package will be delivered tomorrow and requires a signature, but I won't be home. their online system to reroute the package is "unavailable right now"
<cmaloney> brousch__: welcome
<greg-g> "Lettuce turnip the beet"
<rick_h_> morning
<cmaloney> Good morning
<rick_h_> everyone ready for existing stuff that won't actually get out into the world day?
<rick_h_> although I guess the Q did make it out alive after all http://www.motorola.com/us/accessories-headphones-speakers/Moto-Stream/moto-stream.html
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/bp9J01 - Moto Stream by Motorola - A Google Company
<cmaloney> Yeah, that's exactly what I need. :)
<cmaloney> Now it needs to be about half that much. :)
<mrgoodcat> morning
<cmaloney> Giid nirbubg
<cmaloney> is what I type when my fingers get off-center.
<rick_h_> lol
<cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
<bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - True Hallucination Speak by Cynic on Kindly Bent to Free Us
<cmaloney> qq: What am I missing here: datetime.datetime.strptime("%Y-%m-%d", (datetime.datetime.strftime(datetime.date.today(), "%Y-%m-23")))
<cmaloney> time data '%Y-%m-%d' does not match format '2014-06-23'
<rick_h_> cmaloney: your args are backwards
<rick_h_> datetime.strptime(start_date[0], '%Y-%m-%d')
<rick_h_> is what I have in Bookie
<cmaloney> moron alert.
<cmaloney> Yeah.
<cmaloney> Just looked at the error message more clearly
<cmaloney> tx
<rick_h_> bah, worst coffee shop discussions ever!
<cmaloney> rick_h_: Worse than the ones at Bean and Leaf
<cmaloney> ?
<rick_h_> cmaloney: yes, on one side there's some local political drama and they're trying to figure out who said what to who when and what the fallout is going to be and so on
<rick_h_> on my other side there's a religious discussion about how "it takes a lot of trust to open oneself to the holy ghost and have man get out of god's plan for man"
<rick_h_> and the noise cancelling headphones are helping to dull the drum of the machines, but then frees up the talking to be heard better
<cmaloney> rick_h_: Oh God, that has to be hell.
<rick_h_> time to turn the music up a bit louder
<rick_h_> hearing loss be damn :)
<cmaloney> heh
<cmaloney> Never mix religion and politics unless there's a driving beat
<cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
<bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - Light by KMFDM on Angst
<mrgoodcat> rick_h_: burn jesus into your toast and make a big scene
<jrwren> cmaloney: trick question!  you are missing "from datetime import datetime" so that you can write datetime.date.today()
<jrwren> cmaloney: also: "{:%Y-%m-%d}".format(datetime.now())
<jrwren> oh, parse time, nevermind
<jrwren> cmaloney: can you pip install timelib?
<cmaloney> jrwren: All I want is current month / year with 23 as the date.
<cmaloney> So not sure what that would get me. :)
<jrwren> timelib.parse('two days ago')
<jrwren> done
<jrwren> :p
<rick_h_> lol cheater
<cmaloney> jrwren: Oh that would be awesome.
<jrwren> i winder of "the twentythird" or "the 23rd" would work
 * jrwren tries
<cmaloney> please to be telling me how to do that for the rest of the month. ;)
<jrwren> I love timelib
 * cmaloney pops the popcorn
<jrwren> rest of month: while true; do sleep 1day ; timelib.parse('two days ago')  ; done
<jrwren> yes, I just mixed bash and python. I'm crazy.
<jrwren> cmaloney: so you want the day of the 23rd of the current month, right?
<cmaloney> Yes
<jrwren> _23rd = date(date.today().year, date.today().month, 23)
<cmaloney> jrwren: Ah, that may be a better way to do this without the string step
<jrwren> i like strong types.
<cmaloney> Yeah, me too.
<jrwren> just cuz python doesn't statically bind them, doesn't mean I can't try :)
<cmaloney> Which is why this didn't sit well with me
<rick_h_> bah, guess I won't be signing up after all http://r.bmark.us/u/d05de6655acb32
<cmaloney> That's utter bullshit
<cmaloney> Just hte same though I hope more television stations would broadcast their over-the-air signals online
<cmaloney> and more content providers make their shows available online
<cmaloney> ah well.
<krondor> what a bad decision.  Reading their statement, they basically ignored aero's use of individually assigning antennas one to one to users
<krondor> basically saying even though the stream and reception is one to one it's still a 'public' performance
<rick_h_> yea, but it was 6-3 and not just even party lines BS.
<rick_h_> oh well, feel bad for them, cool idea and cool product
<rick_h_> I know of several happy user
<krondor> well fox donations do span party lines :) joking.. I don't really think it was influenced.
<krondor> I just think it was short sighted.. The dissenting opinion makes more sense to me (obviously biased)
<krondor> there's a part at the end that they don't think this ruling will discourage future technologies
<krondor> I think I can conceive of ways a one to one transmission/reception being considered public performance would discourage innovations
<mrgoodcat> Executives at Fox and CBS had suggested that they might stop broadcasting over the air if they lost.
<mrgoodcat> textbook strongarming
<krondor> mrgoodcat:  of course they did, why not... worst case you bluffed and got called best case it worked.
<krondor> even if broadcast syndication isn't the cash cow it once was, I doubt they'd pull out and let NBC eat their lunch
<krondor> it looks like a big part of the decision was the fact that Aereo owns the warehouse with the antennas.
<krondor> perhaps if they actually leased the antenna space to customers, instead of renting them use it might have changed the picture
<krondor> that seems like a legal nightmare to draft up though
<rick_h_> hah, "I pay rent for 2 square inches of real estate in a building in detroit"
<cmaloney> yeah, I see this as a smackdown of Aero's specific case
<cmaloney> rick_h_: Stranger things have happened.
<cmaloney> I could totally see them running with that
<cmaloney> your subscription is a lease of a dime-shaped area of land and an internet connection
<mrgoodcat> and you pay "rent"
<cmaloney> What's ridiculous though is the machinations that Aero had to do to even get this smackdown
<mrgoodcat> yea lots of money involved
<mrgoodcat> and tons of tiny little antennas
<cmaloney> Honestly the FCC should regard broadcast signals a Public Domain
<cmaloney> And have them try to encrypt their signals.
<cmaloney> I find it pretty pathetic that over the years we've ceeded control of the airwaves and control of the public domain to corporate interests
<cmaloney> and with this decision we've cemented even more control
<cmaloney> http://www.lataco.com/taco/they-live-tribute-art
<cmaloney> ^ appropriate
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/txbDD2 - "They Live" Live in Downtown Los Angeles Â» L.A. TACO | L.A. TACO
<widox> hah, cmaloney that's awesome
<widox> forgot about that movie - worth watching
<mrgoodcat> http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/13pdf/13-132_8l9c.pdf
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/hyLuor - application/pdf
<mrgoodcat> better news from the supreme court
<cmaloney> Yeah, that's something I can get behind. :)
<greg-g> too much SCOTUS today
<rick_h_> greg-g: heh, they have a good marketing dept
<cmaloney> greg-g: Blame them for pinching off all of their decisions once a quarter.
<rick_h_> greg-g: and so much tech going to the highest court shows we don't understand the rules any more
<greg-g> :)
<mrgoodcat> anybody watching Google I/O?
<greg-g> no
<greg-g> I don't watch those kinds of things
<rick_h_> mrgoodcat: yea
<rick_h_> it's my chance to play apple fanboi
<greg-g> whiz bang announcements are just a fun circus, wake me in 2 months to see if anything actually interesting comes of it
<rick_h_> greg-g: +1 this one is really a lot of 'later this summer' and 'later this year'. I seem to recall it being much more 'now' before
<cmaloney> rick_h_: yeah.
 * greg-g nods
<cmaloney> Plus right now it's all ego stroking.
<greg-g> also, I'm a mega cynic lately, so, take what I say in that context
<rick_h_> cmaloney: got meeting moved, 6pm dinner?
<cmaloney> rick_h_: Would love yo
<rick_h_> greg-g: it's ok, we all need our anchor :)
<cmaloney> to
<cmaloney> Man, I'm just Mr. Typo today.
<rick_h_> cmaloney: k, meet there?
<cmaloney> Oh geez, the rube goldberg machine at the beginning is humorous.
<mrgoodcat> rick_h_: anything interesting?
<mrgoodcat> i can't watch at work
<mrgoodcat> well i could. but i'm busy today beyond reason
<jrwren> mrgoodcat: i'm watching.
<jrwren> rick_h_: you play apple fanboi watching IO ?
<rick_h_> jrwren: I act like one by s/apple/google
<jrwren> ah, same here.
<jrwren> i'm not a google fan boi but I am when I watch google IO
<cmaloney> Same here.
<cmaloney> OK, one out of two packages from Amazon delivered.
<mrgoodcat> does that mean nothing interesting so far?
<jrwren> i had to step out for a meeting.
<jrwren> I thought all the L api stuff was interesting.
<rick_h_> I wish they'd just give it a name and stop with the L
<rick_h_> the L stuff is cool, but some of it was stuff that I've had in the motox
<rick_h_> the car stuff will be cool, but not something I'll be able to get my hands on for years
<rick_h_> The chromecast stuff is probably the only thing I'll get/see any time soon
<jrwren> same here.
<jrwren> i missed the entire chromecast part :(
<rick_h_> they've built screening into it. You can replicate your entire device on the tv
<jrwren> YAY!
<rick_h_> showed off using google earth on the phone, and having the display mirroed on the tv
<rick_h_> to show his wife where hawaii was
<rick_h_> err, his daughter
<jrwren> lol.
<rick_h_> so that's cool to be able to just mirror the screen
<rick_h_> without wires
<rick_h_> bye bye dvd cable
<jrwren> ios has had that for 3yrs
<jrwren> i'm glad someone else has it now too
<rick_h_> hopefully that means we can show a movie from my tablet to the tv without an internet connection
<rick_h_> we'll see
<mrgoodcat> its always like that
<mrgoodcat> [insert device] has had this feature for [number] years
<jrwren> mrgoodcat: yeah.
<jrwren> i'm glad we have all this competition
<mrgoodcat> apple and google stay pretty competitive in terms of features
<mrgoodcat> they usually each have a couple things the other doesnt have, but the other always eventually gets it
<rick_h_> I think that what it was is that it's all android. Google's IO didn't have the big picture stuff of the home automation, super chrome coolness, glass/etc stuff. It was basically android and tools for android devs.
<mrgoodcat> you see the new gmail api?
<mrgoodcat> apps will be able to access the contents of your emails...
<cmaloney> That's cool and scary at the same time
<mrgoodcat> i'm sure there will be some cool functionality
<mrgoodcat> and there has to be some protection, like apps won't be able to see the full text or something like that... not really sure
<mrgoodcat> i didn't read much about it
<jrwren> rick_h_: and app engine dev.
<jrwren> it wasn't exciting for the masses, but I thought the dataflow announcement was pretty powerful
<jrwren> wait... chromebook runs android apps now?!?!  that is rather huge
<cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
<bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - Circles Of Defeat by Colosso on Foregone Semblances
<mrgoodcat> http://www.omgchrome.com/vlc-chromecast-support-coming-android-ios-desktop/
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/LwSDIx - 403 Forbidden
<mrgoodcat> this is pretty cool too
<jrwren> yay VLC!
<krondor> i need to look into the google fit and apple healthkit stuff more
<krondor> where's the home automation announcements or was it only the nest works stuff from yesterday?
<rick_h_> krondor: yea, just the stuff from yesterday
<rick_h_> no news on that front
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-06-26
<mrgoodcat> morning
<rick_h_> morn
<brousch__> Toledoa Zoo was pretty nice
<brousch__> Toledo
<mrgoodcat> so butthurt today. have to reinstall windows on stupid salesman's computer because he was reading an internet article that told him to edit his registry
<mrgoodcat> :<
<mrgoodcat> users--
<brousch__> Fire him
<mrgoodcat> haha
<mrgoodcat> if only i had that power
<mrgoodcat> that's why they don't let me fire people
<mrgoodcat> I should take his salary for the time he took out of my day
<cmaloney> Good morning
<mrgoodcat> 12.3 MB/sec ubuntu updates at work :)
<cmaloney> What exactly did the salesperson do?
<mrgoodcat> he was _trying_ to follow this article http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/37920/the-50-best-registry-hacks-that-make-windows-better/
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/riZYT - The 50 Best Registry Hacks that Make Windows Better
<brousch__> wat?! jrwren is a jujube now?
<mrgoodcat> yup
<mrgoodcat> works for rick
<brousch__> I just saw his blog post
<brousch__> rick_h_ is amassing a powerful coding army
<rick_h_> brousch__: awesome, we were thinking of doing that this fall (the zoo)
<rick_h_> mrgoodcat: lol on the reg article
<rick_h_> and bwuhahaha the juju army moves forward
<cmaloney> God, which one did the damage?
<cmaloney> Or is the answer "with great power comes great responsibility"? :)
<jrwren> brousch__: yar. imma rock the juju codes ;]
<cmaloney> Iâll be learning more about Go in my new roll.
<rick_h_> cmaloney: orly?
<cmaloney> ^- I believe Juju uses croissants. ;)
<rick_h_> :P
<cmaloney> (was jrwren blog posting)
<rick_h_> https://github.com/juju/charmstore :)
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/Df0ZGG - juju/charmstore Â· GitHub
<rick_h_> go go go
<cmaloney> "go get github.com/juju/charmstore"
<cmaloney> Oh Go, you're too clever for us all. ;)
<rick_h_> lol
 * cmaloney is going to work on getting rick_h_ to learn Go (ie: baduk oe weiqui) so we can have really confusing conversations.
<mrgoodcat> cmaloney: you mean which regedit did the damage?
<mrgoodcat> i'm inclined to think it was the thought process more than any individual edit
<mrgoodcat> in my somewhat limited experience I really like go
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: Yeah, i was just curious if $salesperson actually took notes or if it was more like doing delicate surgery with a lawn mower and a blender.
<mrgoodcat> haha took notes?
<mrgoodcat> wish i had some more users like that
<mrgoodcat> that would be so nice
<cmaloney> Well, one can dream. :)
<cmaloney> Today the USA realizes there is a USA soccer team and some of us pretend to care. ;)
<greg-g> .. by going to a bar and drinking. Really it's just yet another excuse for us to be drunk beligerent bastards.
<greg-g> your morning cynic here, greg-g, reporting.
<cmaloney> please take your station, corporal cynic greg-g
 * greg-g smacks heals together at attention
<greg-g> heels*
<jrwren> go germany!
<cmaloney> Disband FIFA!
<cmaloney> Sell it off for scrap
<ColonelPanic001> o.o
<ColonelPanic001> I saw the first half of this game at lunch. Most soccer I've ever seen
<cmaloney> ColonelPanic001: Hey, btw: I think you have an invite from me for Dragon Go Server.
<cmaloney> stupid me let the previous game expire. :(
<ColonelPanic001> ah, have to get that set up on the new phone, too
<greg-g> how I'm ending my work day: https://secure.flickr.com/photos/grggrssmr/14329377617/
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/yUy8Up - #zodiacs closing out the work day behind the SBD. | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
<jrwren> greg-g: why music studio?
<cmaloney> greg-g is mixing the hawt new album
<greg-g> :)
<greg-g> I was at a pub/bar/venue
<greg-g> awesome place, actually
<greg-g> good food, good feel/atmosphere
<greg-g> and good live music every day of the week
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-06-27
<devinheitmueller> Anybody have any recommended best practices for Ubuntu partitioning for maximum reliability?  This is for an âapplianceâ where very little ever changes on disk, and I want to minimize the risk of the system not booting due to FS corruption when power cycled.
<devinheitmueller> Back in the days where I rolled my own Linux distros, I would use RO partitions for everything except var, but that doesnât work very well in off-the-shelf Linux distros.
<cmaloney> Hey devinheitmueller
<devinheitmueller> Hey craig!
<cmaloney> Not sure what the best practices are for RO partitions
<cmaloney> iirc root is pretty safe as long as /tmp is not marked RO
<cmaloney> or using tmpfs
<devinheitmueller> I would assume /var could also be problematic because of logs, etc.
<cmaloney> Absolutely
<devinheitmueller> That said, I would love to just have /tmp, /var, /, and then mark root read-only, but I worry that Ubuntu wonât really be equipped to run in such an environment.
<cmaloney>  Well, /home should also be a separate partition
<devinheitmueller> Yeah, but in reality /home will likely never change.
<devinheitmueller> Iâm more worried about Ubuntuâs system processes mucking around with the disk and expecting everything to be mounted RW.
<cmaloney> There's still .cache and such
<devinheitmueller> This thing really screams for something based on LFS or OpenWRT, but I donât really have any say in that at this point.  They wanted to leverage an off-the-shelf Ubuntu system as the base OS for their appliance.
<cmaloney> I thought there was a specification for what partitions could be mounted read only at some point
<cmaloney> but it's escaping my noggin'
<devinheitmueller> Perhaps there is.  I really donât claim to have much expertise in Ubuntu.
<devinheitmueller> Iâm happy to say that it generally âjust worksâ, so I spend much less time nowadays digging under the hood.
<cmaloney> Well, it was some satandard that iirc Ubuntu didn't follow for a while.
<cmaloney> and it wasn't until recently (2010 or so) that it was
<devinheitmueller> Well, thereâs LSB, but yeah many distros donât follow it very tightly.
<cmaloney> of course Google is showing me folks that have hardware or NFS issues. :)
<devinheitmueller> Yeah, I started with something like âUbuntu partitioning avoid corruptionâ and it didnât return quite what I was interested in.  :-)
<cmaloney> Yeah, I'm not sure at this point.
<devinheitmueller> Fair enough.  This is where I consider my resident source of Ubuntu expertise, so figured no harm in asking.
<cmaloney> smoser might know more if he's around
<cmaloney> or you might want to check with ubuntu-arm as that is embedded Ubuntu
<devinheitmueller> Not a bad idea.
<cmaloney> Might at least get you in the general direction
<devinheitmueller> Iâll take a closer look and see what they recommend for Ubuntu Server.  Itâs likely that is tailored more for reliability than convenience.
<cmaloney> yeah, not sure Ubuntu server is going to get you any better answers.
<cmaloney> But worth a shot
<devinheitmueller> yup.
<devinheitmueller> Iâm not suggesting we run Ubuntu server, just that that particular crowd might have a mindset more in line with my goals.
<cmaloney> Oh definitely
<devinheitmueller> (i.e. minimize risk of system not booting, configure to automatically fix issues at boot, FS layout which minimizes boot time, etc)
<devinheitmueller> On the flip side, my Tivo runs Embedded Linux and takes 15-20 minutes to boot, so perhaps I should just adjust my expectations.  :-)
<cmaloney> heh
<cmaloney> Well, that's partly why ext4fs was devised. :)
<devinheitmueller> Of course, file systems continue to improve.
<devinheitmueller> Ted Tso gave a really good talk last year at NYLUG on the state of Linux filesystems.
<jrwren> devinheitmueller: do you have enough disk space to do it all on an ubuntu cloudimg?
<devinheitmueller> In this case itâs a standalone piece of equipment, not internet connected.
<jrwren> that is ok.
<jrwren> you can ship the cloudimg on your standalone piece.
<devinheitmueller> Hmmm....
<devinheitmueller> Maybe.  Admittedly I donât really know much about Ubuntu cloudimgs.  Will have to add that to the list of things to look up.
<jrwren> so you can have root and everything be RO, then untar cloudimg on each boot
<jrwren> its a 200MB system image, nice and tiny.
<jrwren> what is the application?
<devinheitmueller> Itâs a piece of fitness equipment.
<devinheitmueller> Hence the app lets you see stats, watch tv, control the treadmill, etc.
<devinheitmueller> cmaloney: look, itâs that âsmoserâ guy you were talking about:  http://ubuntu-smoser.blogspot.com/2013/02/using-ubuntu-cloud-images-without-cloud.html
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/nHtgrm - smoser's thoughts: Using Ubuntu cloud-images without a cloud
<jrwren> sounds like a fun challenge.
<jrwren> i'd probably do what you are doing and just gut ubuntu
<devinheitmueller> Yeah, itâs your typical embedded Linux appliance where almost nothing ever changes but somebody can yank the power cord at any time.
<devinheitmueller> Always hard finding the right balance - rolling your own micro-distro (or gutting a distro like Ubuntu) gives you ultimate control, but then you have to maintain it and canât rely on the upstream for patches.
<jrwren> i like gutting
<jrwren> because i get all the advantage of the vast packages, and I can reasonably maintain it in the form of a patch
<devinheitmueller> The customer is not as technically astute as you are.  :-)
<jrwren> they shouldn't need to be.
<devinheitmueller> In reality itâs likley they wonât do anything about this.  The only reason I started thinking about it is the dev system I was using had itâs ext4 rootfs lose itâs mind, leaving hundreds of critical items in /lost+found.
<devinheitmueller> Oh, and it didnât boot.  Always nice.
<jrwren> XFS ftw.
<devinheitmueller> XFS feels surprisingly like overkill - itâs an embedded system with a single disk and 300MB of software.  Itâs not a multi-terabyte storage array.
<devinheitmueller> :-)
<devinheitmueller> In other words, I shouldnât have to use XFS to feel confident that my system is going to successfully boot.
<jrwren> um... xfs isnt that different from ext
<jrwren> it has nicer fsck properties
<krondor> you could add ext4 checksums to help combat corruption.  It's a little newer though (in terms of FS timescales) so ymmv I haven't really played with it.
<krondor> https://ext4.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Ext4_Metadata_Checksums
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/tmyAS3 - Ext4 Metadata Checksums - Ext4
<cmaloney> morning
<brousch__> indeed
<smoser> well, above, devinheitmueller is gone now, but i'd probably start with ubuntu core. its what ubuntu core is for.
<smoser> and go from there.
<smoser> the read-only stuff, can be made to work. i have worked on 'overlayroot' which mounts root read-only and writes delta via overlayfs.
<smoser> its functional. i think that probalby sint exactly what he was looking for, but using it will tell you nicely where things fall over (by seeing new files in the overlay location).
<smoser> kirkland wrote a blog post on overlayroot at http://blog.dustinkirkland.com/2012/08/introducing-overlayroot-overlayfs.html
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/AFWu3I - From the Canyon Edge: Introducing overlayroot -- overlayfs + dmcrypt!
<smoser> its built into our images.
<rick_h_> morning and TGIF
<cmaloney> Yeah, no kidding
<jrwren> ut oh, someone posted this GIANT jpg link to reddit -https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/78/30_Doradus%2C_Tarantula_Nebula.jpg
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/BVS6wO - image/jpeg
<jrwren> greg-g's data bill is going to quintuple
<brousch__> It loads so slowly!
<jrwren> cuz its HUGE
<jrwren> and maybe greg-g has it throttled.
<greg-g> jrwren: you think reddit, the 61st popular site by Alexa, will have a traffic impact on us, the 4th popular site?
<brousch__> Is that a dare?
 * brousch__ send it to 4chan
<greg-g> when was that image posted?
<greg-g> http://i.imgur.com/8LXvhEI.png
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/R1RXlG - image/png
<greg-g> that's the past week
<greg-g> actually, that's just css/js, that blip was us deploying a new version
<greg-g> here comes upload.wikimedia.org traffic:
<krondor> reddit punches above its traffic weight due to the burstiness (yes I say that's a word) of top posts
<jrwren> greg-g: my thought was that the file is so large that it would take fewer hits to impact you.
<krondor> though I doubt it would be a problem :)
<greg-g> last week of upload traffic: http://i.imgur.com/3UfqB7E.png
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/YlPCRU - image/png
<jrwren> at the same time, it could easily be served via CDN
<jrwren> do you use a CDN?
<greg-g> jrwren: cache
<greg-g> we are our own cdn
<jrwren> what cache?
<greg-g> varnish boxen
<jrwren> centralized or distributed?
<greg-g> we have 3 caching locations
<greg-g> SF, Virginia, and Amsterdam
<jrwren> i see.
<greg-g> soon Dallas (that'll be a full fledged DC, with caching obviously)
<jrwren> and you don't care about data quantity hitting them?
<greg-g> no, they're caches :)
<jrwren> or you'd not notice?
<greg-g> not that image from reddit
<cmaloney> I love that my CPU fan starts going into overdrive when I load that image.
<greg-g> see the last imgur link from me
<jrwren> still, they have a data rate limit of the aggregate of their interfaces, right?
<jrwren> yes, I see it, its always the same.
<jrwren> nice consistent graph.
<jrwren> so, I get that this reddit link doesn't impact you AT ALL.
<greg-g> here's the last day for upload caches (images): http://i.imgur.com/hkIFpYK.png
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/nOXKPc - image/png
<jrwren> still, I wonder what it would take.
<greg-g> a lot
<greg-g> :)
<jrwren> what is your daily max aggregate cache traffic rate?
<greg-g> I don't think I should publicly say our utilization %
<jrwren> ok
<jrwren> that is probably a good idea.
<greg-g> which is why I didn't include the numbers on the left of the graph ;)
<jrwren> understood.
<greg-g> we are a #4 website afterall, people like to make names for themselves ;)
<bookiebot> closed - importer doesn't handle spaces - https://github.com/bookieio/Bookie/issues/4
<greg-g> heh
<cmaloney> http://theroaring420s.bandcamp.com/album/the-roaring-420s-what-is-psych?t=5
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/VkGCYJ - The Roaring 420s - What Is Psych? | The Roaring 420s
<jrwren> greg-g: I know! and you don't even use DDoS protection!
<greg-g> bookiebot: not all #666s are bookie bugs
<cmaloney> I love some of the band names of stoner bands.
<greg-g> jrwren: nope, we're 100% in house, except for one or two third-party monitoring (in caes our monitors go down, heh)
<cmaloney> I think that's more secure that way
<jrwren> you can do 100% in house ddos proection :p
<jrwren> when I said you don't use it, I didn't mean cloud ddos b.s. like cloudflair, I meant an Arbor Networks mitigation appliance :p
<cmaloney> Since you're not relying on mirrors that might try to change thing son Wikipedia
<greg-g> jrwren: oh, I'm not 100% sure if we don't, but I'm 90% sure we don't have one of those
<cmaloney> jrwren: Come Monday will that be a Juju deployment? :)
<jrwren> cmaloney: nah. juju should probably have that kind of protection too ;]
<cmaloney> hah
<greg-g> jrwren: whenever we have had spikes in traffic for weird reasons (either bad actors or good intention'd people's bots gone crazy) I've never heard of any automatic anything
<greg-g> really, raw traffic won't hurt us, it's intelligent queries to specific things
<rick_h_> anyone want to buy an x230 that you can't use the microphone jack on?
<cmaloney> Has wikipedia ever been ddosed?
<rick_h_> (or the built in mic)
<jrwren> rick_h_: oh no! is that what you tweeted about?
<cmaloney> rick_h_: so it's official then? XPS in da house?
<greg-g> cmaloney: successfully? not that I know of
<krondor> cmaloney:  oh I'm sure, probably like weekly just not hard enough to count
<rick_h_> jrwren: no, I tweeted about juju core $@#!$@$ me over and cauing me pain and agony
<greg-g> cmaloney: we've seen people try
<greg-g> :)
<cmaloney> greg-g: Oh no doubt
<jrwren> ah, poor jujucore. they should have hired me :p
<rick_h_> jrwren: but my new laptop should be here tomorrow which is required because my x230 has sound issues and I can't use it for meeting
<cmaloney> rick_h_: I'd hold out on selling
<cmaloney> Make sure you're 100% good with parting
<rick_h_> cmaloney: it's going to get tough for the wife to see me around with a desktop and 3 laptops
<rick_h_> cmaloney: I've not booted it in a week
<cmaloney> Just put it on the closet for a while
<cmaloney> let it pass
<jrwren> old laptops make good cloud nodes. tell her its part of your home cloud.
<greg-g> so, when I first started, some random dude threatened ddos'ing us on IRC, I mentioned it to our networking lead, her first reaction was laughing and just walking away. From then on I haven't worried ;)
<cmaloney> and then when you don't want to go into the closet to retrieve the x230 then it's time to make peace.
<rick_h_> jrwren: yea, did think about that for a maas controller letting me have 3 nucs to operate
<rick_h_> might still do that if no one's interested
<jrwren> greg-g: understood, still, unless you can handle 300Gbps, I wouldn't get too cocky.
<greg-g> jrwren: no, we can't do 300gbps, that I'll say :)
<jrwren> greg-g: then if the right people wanted to take you down, they could.
<greg-g> jrwren: I mean, you can look up our ASN stuff, too
<greg-g> jrwren: totally
<jrwren> oh yeah!
<krondor> jrwren:  well, they probably have agreements with their providers to help with that mitigation upstream too
<krondor> still that interface will be a delay and no doubt cause downtime with that type of hit
<greg-g> jrwren: to help: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Peering
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/TvEAZr - Peering - Wikimedia Foundation
<cmaloney> This reminds me of the talk that we had at work in 2003 right before the power grid toook a hit that knocked out MI and Ohio. :)
<jrwren> oh man, that is so cool to visit a site adn it says, you are visiting from... "..." and its an ipv6 addy
<cmaloney> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northeast_America_blackout_of_2003
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/1UUPVo - Northeast America blackout of 2003 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
<greg-g> cmaloney: :)
<krondor> cmaloney: cascading failure scenarios are a thing :) ask Blackberry, I think they blamed that for at least 8 of their outages
<jrwren> cmaloney: i remember it well, my dad had just bought 2 quarts of ice cream, and I got to help eat it.
<greg-g> jrwren: ours?
<cmaloney> I remember driving home to Belleville and being unable to call JoDee on the cellphone
<krondor> that reminds me I need to yell at comcast again about ipv6, not that it will help
<greg-g> https://www.peeringdb.com/private/participant_view.php?id=1365 gives you numbers (guest/guest login)
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/jzcSYc - PeeringDB Login
<cmaloney> Though the phone system at work was working
<krondor> i was reasonably impressed how long it took the cell towers to start dying, and in more populated areas they just kept filling the generators so they didn't
<jrwren> greg-g: nah, http://bgp.he.net/AS33668
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/twBRwD - 403 Forbidden
<cmaloney> it's also the time when joDee looked at the phone (which didn't ring because the power was cut), picked it up, and surprised both her and her friend that was calling.
<cmaloney> krondor: yeah, but they were slammed.
<jrwren> greg-g: i was looking up: http://bgp.he.net/AS14907  to see you
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/t5UX4H - 403 Forbidden
<jrwren> huh, i wonder why it says 403. I wonder if they filter based on UA
<brousch__> cmaloney: Don't drag all of Michigan into your little blackout. We were fine over here.
<greg-g> http://bgp.he.net/AS14907
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/t5UX4H - 403 Forbidden
<greg-g> yeah
<krondor> brousch__: i was fine once I drove 30 mins to grand blanc too... mmm delicious AC and gas for my car
<jrwren> lol, yup, curl -A 'Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.1; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/31.0'   and I can hit that page.
<cmaloney> Sad thing is we were waiting for a blackout so we could do some stargazing
<jrwren> whose bot is that?
<cmaloney> that's when we realized the fucking Wayne County fair was happening a few blocks away
<cmaloney> jrwren: mrgoodcat's bot
<cmaloney> so we had floodlights and hte sound of tractor pulls all night
<cmaloney> fuckers.
<jrwren> alright, I'm AFK for at least the day, time for real vacation.
<cmaloney> jrwren: Have fun!
<greg-g> getting real sick of this barking dog next door
<greg-g> too bad I'm on calls all morning and can't go to the coffee shop
<greg-g> or back to that bar... man they had a good rueben
<cmaloney> Mmm, reuben
<brousch__> Reubens would be awesome if they weren't covered in decomposing cabbage
<greg-g> brousch__: I'm german. I love that stuff.
<greg-g> we make our own, actually
<cmaloney> Nothing wrong with decomposing cabbage
<StoneTable> rick_h_: Speedy response to that bug. Thanks! :D
<rick_h_> StoneTable: oh hey, how goes?
<rick_h_> StoneTable: heh, sorry I floated by the FF note at first
<StoneTable> Pretty good, thanks. You?
<StoneTable> No worries!
<rick_h_> party party
<rick_h_> StoneTable: what's got you poking at the GUI?
<rick_h_> doing anything fun?
<StoneTable> Interview prep. Sent my resume in last week, and setting up a time to talk to someone over there.
<rick_h_> oh cool, who you talking to?
<StoneTable> Antonio Rosales
<rick_h_> oh awesome, great guy
<StoneTable> Good to hear. I'm looking forward to that chat.
<rick_h_> cool, let me know if you've got any questions
<StoneTable> And the juju/Charms stuff is pretty slick, so I'm really excited to play with that more. I wish I'd had that 8 or so years ago.
<StoneTable> I sure will, thanks!
<greg-g> cmaloney: wow, a 16EUR/$800 USD cd?
<greg-g> cmaloney: re the stoner rock band you linked before
<cmaloney> greg-g: Eh?
<greg-g> that 420 whatever band's cd was 16 Euros
<cmaloney> If I hit "buy it now" I get 21.24
<cmaloney> 21.66 rather
<cmaloney> Granted I don't think four tracks is 21.66. :)
<greg-g> sorry, it was a bad "OMG, USD is so low compared to EUR" joke
<cmaloney> Yes, yes it was. ;)
<cmaloney> Though I've seen folks post albums that were ridiculous in price.
<cmaloney> like $8 a track or some shit.
<cmaloney> Actually I think the prime offender that I was thinking of lowered his prices on his music after I told him he was... ahem... high. :)
<greg-g> :)
<greg-g> was it also stoner rock?
<greg-g> cmaloney: btw, I'm liking http://juddmadden.bandcamp.com/album/everything-in-waves, it's CC BY-NC, you should use it for OMC
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/Gz89Dh - Judd Madden
<cmaloney> greg-g: It's on my list. :)
<greg-g> it'd be a long episode. He seems to like 8+ minute songs
<cmaloney> Yeah, he doesn't write short songs.
<cmaloney> IIRC it's instrumental
<cmaloney> so perfect for instrumetalcast.
<greg-g> yeppers
<cmaloney> Oh, btw: the person who said that the Aereo case might have an impact on cloud broadcasting for personal use:
<cmaloney> http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2014/06/in-aereos-wake-fox-targets-dishs-tv-streaming-service/
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/BbOJD7 - In Aereoâs wake, Fox targets Dishâs TV streaming service | Ars Technica
<cmaloney> We're going to need some more fires, because there aren't enough to handle the "dying in" load.
<greg-g> bad article, but interesting: http://www.zdnet.com/blog/facebook/facebook-passwords-are-not-case-sensitive-update/3612
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/mk6YT - Facebook passwords are not case sensitive (update) | ZDNet
<greg-g> basically, FB accepts 3 forms of your password:
<greg-g> 1) original password as you typed it (duh)
<greg-g> 2) original password with a capitalized first letter, in case your mobile device does that annoying thing
<greg-g> 3) your password with the case flipped on all letters, in case you have caps lock on
<greg-g> horrible horrible horrible reporting from ZDnet, of course, cuz I still have no idea why they're still around
<gamerchick02> wow yeah i don't know how they've stayed in business either
<gamerchick02> and hello from windows 8 *ducks and covers*
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-06-28
<cmaloney> Evening
<rick_h_> party
<tony-smlr> SMLR Live E129 - Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s23ve_OAnvo - audio: http://live.smlr.us:8000/streaming
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/kLPA6q - SMLR Live Episode 129 - YouTube
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/r4DLeN - application/ogg
<cmaloney> Good morning
<cmaloney> er, afternoon. :)
<sydney> Good afternoon to you too. :D
<havenstance> howdy
<sydney> So... whats everone up to?
<cmaloney> Just getting into the meat of the day. Unpacking and moving some more stuff from $lastplace.
<cmaloney> and my parents place that I moved things in the interim
<havenstance> configuring steam on xubuntu :)
<cmaloney> woo woo
<cmaloney> Also listening to http://metalinjection.fm
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/rga8L2 - .FM - Your 24/7 Mainline of Streaming Metal Radio | Metal Injection
<cmaloney> Having a crisis of faith over reactivating the twitter account.
<cmaloney> Fuck it. Life is short.
<havenstance> cmaloney, DON'T DO IT!!!
<cmaloney> Too late
<havenstance> it might release the zombies
<havenstance> and your responsible now for the zombie apocalypse. *Sigh*
<havenstance> lol
<havenstance> I have got to get out of this Hotel room....
 * havenstance hugs Steam, they actually have Duke Nukem 3D on Linux...
<cmaloney> orly?
<havenstance> the Duke Nukem 3d Megaton Edition, apparently is available for SteamOS/Linux
<havenstance> I'm installing now to see how it actually works. I'd imagine that if DosBox was available for Linux that they could port most of those older dos games in just a few clicks.
<havenstance> Version 1.0.4
<havenstance> â¢	Linux support
<havenstance> I know this is a Linux channel, but I have a windows question. The hotel I am in only allows internet access to  3 devices in the room on their wifi. So the question I have is this, could I connect the Windows to the Intarwebs thru wifi and then use ethernet to share the connection with the rest of my devices with ICS?
<Havenstance> odd error with installing 14.04 lts
<Havenstance> server
<Havenstance> it wrote grub to my USB Key instead of the install directory...
<brousch__> cmaloney is following me on Twitter. Is it a fake?
<Havenstance> brousch__, no he reactivated his twitter this morning
<Havenstance> I told him he was going to start a zombie apocalypse by doing it but he had no mercy for humanity :)
<cmaloney> Must be
<cmaloney> Gah, so much shit.
<brousch__> cmaloney: That's what happens when you eat Taco Bell
<brousch__> Better than one of those organic herbal cleanses
<cmaloney> heh
<Havenstance> :)
<Havenstance> how's everyone been anyway? haven't been on in a while
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-06-29
<cmaloney> Doing OK so far
<rick_h_> evening
<cmaloney> Howdy
<rick_h_> setting up the dell
<rick_h_> makefile engage!
<cmaloney> Heh
<cmaloney> Here's hoping it passes the test.
<rick_h_> ok, on the xps now, have enough installed to move forward
<rick_h_> the screen is nice, the keyboard is better than I thought it would be
<rick_h_> the trackpad needs to die
<rick_h_> oh dammit, I installed 386 vs amd64
<cmaloney> Ugh
<rick_h_> time to download a new iso and reinstall
<cmaloney> woo woo
<greg-g> yay makefiles I guess
 * greg-g is curious what all is in rick_h_'s makefile
<greg-g> if I were a better person, I'd puppetize my laptop and only install/remove packages though puppet
<rick_h_> heh, it's basic. Just a giant pile of apt-get install, pip install, ppa adding, etc
<greg-g> that would get so out of date for me unless I edited and re-ran each time I made a change
<greg-g> for me
<greg-g> oh, I already said that
<rick_h_> yea, it's what I try to do
 * greg-g nods
<rick_h_> I try to add a package to that list and then rerun make install
<rick_h_> most stuff then just no-ops
 * greg-g nods
<greg-g> idempotency
<rick_h_> though to be fair, at this point I've run linux and setup enough systems that there's not a ton of new deps
<rick_h_> morning
<rick_h_>  ~/bin/tmux_split_custom -h
<cmaloney> Good afternoon
<greg-g> yo
<cmaloney> 'sup?
<greg-g> nada mucho
<greg-g> got some chicken from a farm today
<greg-g> (see identi.ca)
<greg-g> now waiting for rowan to go down for a nap
<greg-g> I might.... go for a run
<greg-g> no promises
<greg-g> but crap, now I've put it in a tangible form
<cmaloney> And the universe gives you permission. :)
<greg-g> :)
<greg-g> just heard carrie bring him upstairs, time to go
<cmaloney> Have fun!
<rick_h_> good luck!
<ColonelPanic001> run. ugh.
<ColonelPanic001> the sun is out
<ColonelPanic001> can't be outside like that
<rick_h_> hah
<rick_h_> it is a bit hot today
<rick_h_> hiding in the basement with the laptop
<rick_h_> but just got done with giant grocery trip so accomplishment yay
<ColonelPanic001> yeah, we did that just now, too
<ColonelPanic001> did you go to Meijer?
<rick_h_> yep
<greg-g> it's 90.5 here
<ColonelPanic001> Â¬_Â¬
<rick_h_> we're going camping this short week for the holiday
<rick_h_> so big big trip
<ColonelPanic001> Did you go to Meijer in Southgate?
<rick_h_> greg-g: ouch
<greg-g> only 34% humidity though
<rick_h_> ColonelPanic001: no, auburn hills
<ColonelPanic001> Lame
<rick_h_> I'm a northerner
<rick_h_> picked up michael this leapfrog thing
<ColonelPanic001> if it's over 90F the proper response is to go underground, or lie down and die.
<rick_h_> playing with a kids toy ftw
<ColonelPanic001> thanks, I'm sure I'll enjoy it
<rick_h_> greg-g: got us beat, only 85 here
<ColonelPanic001> it dipped down briefly (down here at least) when it sorta half-rained
<ColonelPanic001> but then jumped right back up
<rick_h_> yea, except with a wall of humidity due to the rain
<ColonelPanic001> the gods hate us
<cmaloney> heh
<ColonelPanic001> "HAHA REMEMBER WHEN THE WEATHER WAS LIKE THIS?"
<ColonelPanic001> "NOW BACK TO SUFFERING
<cmaloney> Yeah, no kidding
<cmaloney> Not sure whether I'd like to be boiling or freezing
<greg-g> http://www.dailymile.com/people/greggrossmeier/entries/29345990
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/6vtzDl - Greg Grossmeier ran: First run since Rowan... | dailymile
<rick_h_> greg-g: woot!
<cmaloney> Feeling a little accomplished. Ran phone cable from the basement upstairs. :)
<cmaloney> greg-g: That's awesome! :)
<greg-g> :)
<greg-g> now let's see if I can keep it up :)
<cmaloney> http://oduinn.com/blog/2014/06/04/farewell-to-tinderbox/
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/r1BnDf - Farewell to Tinderbox, the worldâs 1st? 2nd? Continuous Integration server
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-06-22
<wolfger> my kids have 4 legs.....
<rick_h_> .howdy
<cmaloney> .hello
<rick_h_> heh
<cmaloney> Dammit, Jorge is keynoting OLF
<cmaloney> now there's pressure to go.
<rick_h_> hah
<rick_h_> when is that?
<cmaloney> http://ohiolinux.org/content/jorge-castro-keynote-ohio-linuxfest-2015
<cmaloney> Oct 2-3
<rick_h_> is it usually that late?
<cmaloney> It's usually last week of Sept / First week of Oct
<rick_h_> ah ok
<cmaloney> Though it'll go as late as last week of Oct.
<cmaloney> Yay it's time for election jokes from my mom
<_stink_> block?
<cmaloney> heh
<cmaloney> "Sorry mom, but we can no longer accept your email"
<cscheib> I wish I could block the Internet during election season.
<cmaloney> Yeah, JoDee's getting sick of the NPR coverage.
<cscheib> best part is it's just beginning.
<cmaloney> Yeah, no shit.
<mrgoodcat> that's the cycle right? 2 years of complaining voters followed by 2 years of bullshitting candidates
<cmaloney> ;)
<cmaloney> greg-g: Apparently you got chicken and waffles
<cmaloney> four times. :)
<greg-g> blame andstatus
<greg-g> it's been crashing on me since sunday afternoon
<cmaloney> Oh fun
<cmaloney> Probably because identi.ca went down sunday afternoon
<greg-g> oh? bad timing, or maybe I caused it ;)
<cmaloney> Both
<cmaloney> greg-g gets all the blames.
<wolfger> identi.ca still exists?
<rick_h_> the internet goes on and on my friend
<wolfger> except for Google Reader. :-(
<rick_h_> bah newsblur wfm
<wolfger> Newsblur is what I use now. I still miss reader
<cmaloney> rss2email
<cmaloney> because screw social
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-06-23
<ColonelPanic001> I should do something for rss
<ColonelPanic001> but I'd rather not email flood myself
<rick_h_> write raw xml, that's fnu
<cmaloney> Whew
<cmaloney> Had a brownout this morning. Now everything is back to normal.
<rick_h_> yay
<cmaloney> Yeah, and I don't think we lost anything in the fridge
<cmaloney> so woo woo
<rick_h_> double win!
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-06-24
<cmaloney> http://decafbad.net/2015/06/23/30-day-javascript-learning-challenge:-fin/
<jcastro> power has been flaky here too
<cmaloney> jcastro: I just want to let you know I've booked a hotel room at OLF
<cmaloney> and the only reason we're going is for your keynote.
<jcastro> hah, no pressure!
<cmaloney> Yeah, none at all. ;)
<jcastro> I should book today
<wolfger> when is OLF?
<cmaloney> Oct 2-3
<cmaloney> http://ohiolinux.org/
<greg-g> wait, they're letting jcastro do keynotes now?
<rick_h_> but of course!
<jcastro> crazy
<jrwren> jcastro keynotes in the heart of buckeye country.
<greg-g> HMB while....
<jrwren> if anyone was wondering, naigara falls is still there.
<brousch> jrwren: How wet is it?
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-06-25
<jrwren> brousch: a bit less than it was, but still very wet
<dzho> you'd think all the other great lakes would be empty by now
<_stink_> dzho++
<cmaloney> Good morning
<rick_h_> party
<jrwren> its almost noon.
<cmaloney> Still some morning left in the ol' girl.
<wolfger> it's after lunch, it's afternoon :-p
<greg-g> day's just starting :)
<cmaloney> http://5by5.tv/b2w/226 <- lisen from 36:10 onward
<cmaloney> listen
<wolfger> O_o
<wolfger> why are we listening to this?
<cmaloney> I sent them a note that I'm totally nabbing soundbites from that episode. ;)
<cmaloney> give it a second
<wolfger> they hate you? But that's much later than 36:10, and seemingly completely unrelated
<cmaloney> heh
<cmaloney> it's a different Craig
<wolfger> ok
<ColonelPanic001> impossible
<ColonelPanic001> there is no craig but craig
<cmaloney> heh
<cmaloney> We are all Craig
<ColonelPanic001> I'm not a polycraigist
<ADAG10> You have been spooked by the spoopy speletango man!
<greg-g> His name is Craig Maloney. His name is Craig Maloney.
<ADAG10> Er, wrong channel.
<greg-g> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCi_PIz5ekU
<ColonelPanic001> ..
 * ColonelPanic001 was spooked
<_stink_> that should be /topic'ed
<greg-g> really, his name is meat loaf, but whatever
<ColonelPanic001> cmaloney is not meat loaf
<ColonelPanic001> he is probably made of meat, though
<greg-g> I wouldn't be so quick to judge
<ColonelPanic001> many of my friends are made of meat
<ADAG10> http://www.terrybisson.com/page6/page6.html
<greg-g> and some of my enemies
<Klaudioh> ColonelPanic001: many but not all?
<ColonelPanic001> I said many.
<wolfger> I am Craigicus?
<cmaloney> i'm actually grain fed
<cmaloney> and hops drunk
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-06-26
<dzho> moo
<cmaloney> Good morning
<_stink_> yo
<ColonelPanic001> hi
<cmaloney> howdy
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-06-27
<cmaloney> Good morning
<brousch> Yes
<cmaloney> And it was good.
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-06-28
<cmaloney> Good morning
<_stink_> yo
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-06-27
<mrgoodcat> morning
<cmaloney> Morning
<wolfger> mornign
<Zimdale> morning
<shakes808> morning
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-06-28
<cmaloney> Evening
<_stink_> yo
<jrwren> greg-g: you still live blocks from lagunitas?
<greg-g> jrwren: a mile or so, but yeah
<jrwren> wife is chatting with some dude named Scott Johnson who is about 7mi from there.
<jrwren> small world.
<cmaloney> Morning
<cmaloney> (mostly)
<Scary_Guy> for another 40 seconds at least
<shakes808> afternoon
<cmaloney> How goes?
<Scary_Guy> so'k I guess
<cmaloney> woo woo
<shakes808> would be better on the lake
<shakes808> it is a beautiful day
<shakes808> you?
<Scary_Guy> watched the GoT season finale
<cmaloney> Series finale. ;)
<cmaloney> unless GRR can finish the damn book
<Zimdale> is it series finale?
<Zimdale> I thought they are approved for another season
<Zimdale> and they were just going to pass the book
<cmaloney> I'm messing
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-06-29
<cmaloney> morning
<cmaloney> an, my allergies are taking a toll on me today
<cmaloney> can't stop sneezing
 * greg-g yawns
<shakes808> morning
<rick_h_> evening
<cmaloney> rick_h_: You off again?
<rick_h_> cmaloney: yea, london this week
<cmaloney> Are you back in the States for the 4th?
<rick_h_> yea, I leave tomorrow
<cmaloney> ah, fun times
<rick_h_> so I can head up north camping friday
<cmaloney> heh, awesome
<cmaloney> That's what I figured you were up to
<rick_h_> yea, annual in-laws camping trip
<cmaloney> prime "heading up north" weekend
<cmaloney> Oh, even better.
<rick_h_> the place they're members of have the fireworks and parade and such
<cmaloney> Right
<cmaloney> How is London?
<cmaloney> I hear they're having second Brexit
<rick_h_> they're having something
<rick_h_> lots of drama
<cmaloney> ++
<rick_h_> london's some 90% stay so it's definitely one sided
<brousch> You should spend the 4th in London and taunt every Brit you see
<jrwren> that sounds... foolish.
<cmaloney> That sounds like a fun afternoon
<greg-g> "The Colonexit"?
<ColonelPanic001> ...
<greg-g> heh
<cmaloney> evening
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-06-30
<cmaloney> Someone wants to try to put ads on my website.
<cmaloney> hahahahahahahaha
<brousch> $1,000,000
<brousch> If you're gonna sellout, at least sell out for enough to retire on
<cmaloney> Heh
<shakes808_> $1 Mil isn't enough to retire on, unless you invest it
<cmaloney> So I'm just leaving money on the table
<shakes808_> ask for $1,000,001
<shakes808_> haha
<cmaloney> shakes808_: I'll ask a penny for the first impression
<cmaloney> and then double it
<cmaloney> and each impression it doubles
<shakes808_> HAHA
<brousch> cmaloney is old. He has some money saved for retirement already
<cmaloney> Yeah, and I eagerly await the next market crash
<brousch> I've stirred up some discussion at work and in the Grand Rapids programming Slack this morning
<cmaloney> ?
<brousch> Thought of the morning: If someone on your team has the title of âDevOpsâ, then your team is not actually â_doing_â devops.
<cmaloney> Hah
<cmaloney> No, you're doing ops
<brousch> Who is PyOhioing this year?
<cmaloney> I am
<cmaloney> brousch: are you giving a talk?
<brousch> No, I'm on the fence about going
<brousch> I haven't written any Python in like 2 years
<cmaloney> whhhahaaaaaaattttT?
<cmaloney> this is unacceptable.
<brousch> Well, other than at GiveCamp
<cmaloney> I think you should go
<cmaloney> purely for selfish reasons
<cmaloney> and give a talk
<cmaloney> and repent for your lack of python
<brousch> Talks are all chosen :P
<cmaloney> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1229573443/das-keyboard-5q-the-cloud-connected-keyboard/description
<cmaloney> I don't understand this
<cmaloney> brousch: You're still coming and giving a lightning talk
<cmaloney> as repentance
<brousch> I have nothing to talk about!
<greg-g> "why I haven't done python in 2 years"
<jrwren> "because python is too good, there isn't much churn, there is nothing to hate, so its not interesting"
<jrwren> language/platform dujour OTOH... so much that is bad, so much churn, so much to hate, so very interesting.
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-07-02
<cmaloney> happy birthday greg-g!
<jrwren> greg-g: happy birtday young man.
<greg-g> cmaloney: jrwren :) thanks
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-07-03
<cmaloney> Evening
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-06-26
<rick_h> Morning
<cmaloney> morning
<cmaloney> rick_h: How was the trek to Cedar Point?
<rick_h> cmaloney: it was good. Got the boy on three roller coasters so mission accomplished
<rick_h> cmaloney: but then he wore out around 4pm and melted down on the log flume ride and we got tossed off it
<rick_h> "Sir, I can't make him go on the ride if he doesn't want do"
<rick_h> So it ended with a bang, but everyone agrees it should become an annual trip from now on so woot
<cmaloney> rick_h: I can completely understand his reluctance on the lig flume
<cmaloney> s/lig/log/
<rick_h> well it the downhill looks scarier because of the running water I think
<rick_h> "it's so steep!"
<cmaloney> Nothing but those stupid handrails
<rick_h> but it's not as steep as the other coasters he'd already done
<cmaloney> Yeah, but on those coasters you have the cage and what-not
<rick_h> yea, fair enough
<cmaloney> not "two handrails and the dude behind you"
<rick_h> he was tired, fell asleep in the truck before we got off the little cedar point island section
<rick_h> so I'm going to call it a success even though it ended with a bit of a bang
<cmaloney> cool deal
<cmaloney> which coasters did he go on?
<shakes808> morning
<shakes808> rick_h: that sounds like a good time.  I just asked my son this past week if he wanted to go to cedar point, and he said he was afraid haha.  we'll see.   How old is your boy?  Mine is 11.
<rick_h> shakes808: 7
<rick_h> shakes808: we're doing disney after thanksgiving so we're working on getting him used to some rides before we go there
<cmaloney> Hey, nothing wrong with being afraid of falling. That's just good thinking
<rick_h> shakes808: heh, I was carried onto my first roller coaster around 12 I think? So trying to help him not be like his old man
<cmaloney> rick_h: Space Mountain is scarier than it seems
<rick_h> hah
<cmaloney> it's not that steep, but it gives you the illusion that it's worse than it is
<rick_h> he's 50" so he can go on about half the stuff at cedar point so it was good.
<shakes808> rick_h: HAHA.  I went on the X-Flight at some smaller venue because my grandfather was going on it and called me a puss for not going on it.  I think i was 13ish.
<cmaloney> Yeah, I liked the spinning rides much better
<shakes808> cmaloney: where's the adventure?!
<cmaloney> shakes808: Terra Firma, Earth
<rick_h> cmaloney: yea, I think his favorite was the scrambler where he got to squish mom
<cmaloney> heh
<rick_h> shakes808: well, of course after getting carried on I decided coasters were ok, but upside down was a no go
<rick_h> shakes808: then in high school went with friends and the old peer pressure did me in and now I'll go on anything
<cmaloney> My first coaster was the corkscrew-coaster at Bob-Li
<cmaloney> Bob-lo
<cmaloney> (whatever it's called)
<cmaloney> Then I graduated to the *Streak coaster at BobLo
<cmaloney> (Mean Streak?)
<cmaloney> the one with the lap belt that makes it scarier than any coaster at Cedar point
<cmaloney> as your butt leaves the seat
<shakes808> just being at BobLo was scary.  haha
<cmaloney> Nah, bobLo was awesome
<cmaloney> even if it was trending toward shithole
<shakes808> when i went there it was at its' end of life
<shakes808> i heard they reopened it though and kicked all the bums off the island haha
<shakes808> i want to go back.  supposedly has a nice aquarium
<cmaloney> There's foks living on the island
<cmaloney> I think you're thinking of Belle Isle though
<cmaloney> iirc BobLo is now all private land
<shakes808> hmmm maybe
<shakes808> very well could be :)
<shakes808> http://www.bestbuy.com/site/msi-vr-one-backpack-desktop-intel-core-i7-7820hk-16gb-memory-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1070-512gb-solid-state-drive-black/5853622.p?skuId=5853622
<shakes808> :)
<cmaloney> shakes808: So when you lose your balance playing your VR game you can take out over $3K of computer equipment as well?
<cmaloney> Bargain
<shakes808> cmaloney: HAHA, right!!!!
<shakes808> something non-tech related: https://www.highstreettv.com/squat-magic.html
<shakes808> Shake Weight move over :)
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-06-27
<cmaloney> Good morning
<rick_h> party
<notlikethesoup> morning
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-06-28
<shakes808> morning
<rick_h> wheeee
<cmaloney> morning
<cmaloney> how's the day so far?
<rick_h> mixed, I'm an old man excited by new tires on the truck (at the tire place atm)
<rick_h> but also grrrrr that I can't get my trailer tire off and when I post online asking about it I get treated like a moron that doesn't know wtf a wheel is
<rick_h> Nothing like the interwebs replying "The tire is the black part and the wheel is the middle part usually silver"
<rick_h> and the awesome "I've never had that happen to me in all my years so clearly you must be just dumb and not understand how to left loosy a lugnut"
<cmaloney> Oh that's nice
<cmaloney> Is it stripped or just really tight?
<rick_h> so the thing spins. From what I can tell, the posts that the lugnuts go on has spun free
<cmaloney> Ah, fun
<rick_h> so when you go to move the lugnuts in either direction they just spin round and round
<cmaloney> Is this on the trailer whells?
<cmaloney> wheels or on the truck?
<cmaloney> Bah, I can read.
<cmaloney> Trailer
<rick_h> trailer
<cmaloney> Are they on the ground or is this a spare?
<rick_h> yea, the truck is getting shiny new tires so that's the positive in the day
<rick_h> they're on the ground
<cmaloney> Ugh
<cmaloney> Is it all of the lugnuts / posts or just one?
<cmaloney> "And how do you feel about [lugnuts]"?
<cmaloney> http://decafbad.net/2017/06/28/day-28100-better-endgame/
<rick_h> very cool cmaloney
<cmaloney> rick_h: Thank you. :)
<shakes808> cmaloney: why scheme?
<cmaloney> shakes808: Learning a functional language to break my brain
<cmaloney> so I can better tackle JavaScript without as many prejudices
<cmaloney> and it's fun
<shakes808> haha, gotcha.
<shakes808> going to have your hand at some Node or something?
<cmaloney> Eh, maybe
<cmaloney> probably something more on the front-end next
<cmaloney> https://raw.githubusercontent.com/craigmaloney/scheme_guile_racket/develop/images/pepper_studying.png
<cmaloney> Scheme is kind of my creative procrastination: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/craigmaloney/scheme_guile_racket/develop/images/pepper_exit.png
<brousch> cmaloney: No one does javascript frontends any more. It's all APIs and mobile apps
<cmaloney> brousch: They do full-stack nonsense now
<cmaloney> reacy my acid redux
<cmaloney> for great angluar grunt
<rick_h> lol, I keep thinking of 80's rap whenever someone says PWA
<rick_h> I think I'm turning it into NWA
<cmaloney> likely
<cmaloney> What's PWA?
<rick_h> progressive web apps
<rick_h> https://developers.google.com/web/fundamentals/getting-started/codelabs/your-first-pwapp/
<rick_h> that's the new web 2.0++ hotness
<rick_h> well, recent? guess not "new"
<cmaloney> Why did I suddenly see Keith Emerson stabbing an organ?
<cmaloney> FML
<rick_h> but post "OMG facebook did a native app" but back towards "the web will solve everything!"
<cmaloney> I really really wish folks wouldn't solve Google /Facebook problems at small scale
<brousch> cmaloney: Everyone wants to be web scale
<cmaloney> "Let's download 2GB of shit so our pages load a .05s"
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-06-29
<cmaloney> Really irritated with O'Reilly right now
<Zimdale> Why?
<cmaloney> They're moving their online bookstore behind Safari
<cmaloney> so you can't buy their books direct from them
<cmaloney> Have to go through Amazon / Google Play / etc.
<Zimdale> Ah
<Zimdale> work pays for Safari so it's pretty cool IMO
<cmaloney> Yeah, I think they're banking on folks getting this stuff through work
<cmaloney> Can you download stuff offline?
<Zimdale> dunno
<Zimdale> Haven't really tried
<Zimdale> Been meaning to read a pile of leadership books though
<Zimdale> Just tech/self help books are so damn boring :(
<cmaloney> heh
<cmaloney> They take mental resources to process
<Zimdale> Hey you know Matt P?
<cmaloney> Yeah, I'm sitting across from him
<Zimdale> Ha, I talk to him semi-frequently. Didn't realize that meetup was today :9
<Zimdale> :(
<cmaloney> Yeah, it's today
<cmaloney> And every WEd.
<Zimdale> Really every wednesday?
<cmaloney> Yeah
<Zimdale> Usually get a good spread of people?
<cmaloney> Actually today we've had the largest number of folks in a while
<cmaloney> tonight it was 6 folks
<cmaloney> three first-timers
<Zimdale> lol
<Zimdale> Matt used to work at StockX
<Zimdale> He was one of the early founders IIRC
<Zimdale> Then went on to CTO sift
<Zimdale> o/
<cmaloney> morning
<rick_h> morning
<_stink__> yo
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-06-30
<wolfger> Happy birthday, brousch
<wolfger> and good morning to everybody else
<wolfger> I mean, if anybody is actually here, and not getting an early start on their 4th
<wolfger> or a fifth... not judging...
<cmaloney> morning!
<shakes808> friday!
<mrgoodcat> gotta get down on friday
<cmaloney> https://yerzmyey.bandcamp.com/album/rave-is-illegal
<cmaloney> already there
<notlikethesoup> mrgoodcat: yesterday was thursday
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-07-01
<cmaloney> morning
<_stink__> yo
<jrwren_> soo... was it wrong of me to LOL at the top highlight here https://medium.com/@TheLarkInn/leaving-for-microsoft-4f386c458693 ?
<cmaloney> jrwren_: "When you focus on Developers, your platform succeeds."
<cmaloney> Sounds like a fortune cookie
<jrwren_> cmaloney: "your platform succeeds" in reference to MSFT.
<jrwren_> it sounds delusional to me. But maybe I'm too into apple/google world to know much about MSFT desktop/mobile
<cmaloney> Honestly if MSFT disappeared the only thing that might be affected in my life is I'd have to find another way to do my taxes
<cmaloney> and I'd have little use for VirtualBox
<jrwren_> hrm... yeah, same here. I don't think I use anything by theirs.
<jrwren_> I don't even use windows for gaming anymore.
<jrwren_> wife and I have an XLS spreadsheet we share for budgetting, but that could easily move to anything.
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-07-02
<cmaloney> Happy Birthday greg-g!
#ubuntu-us-mi 2018-06-25
<cmaloney> Good morning
<waldo323> good morning
<rick_h_> party
<cmaloney> How's the day so far?
<waldo323> fairly well.  I was able to get mycroft running on a raspberry pi 3 b using the image you linked
<rick_h_> weather is nice so yay, but forgot to charge the laptop so running power out here booo
<rick_h_> and the pup decided that today was 5am day no matter what.../me wonders if ambien works on dogs
<cmaloney> heh
<cmaloney> Pixel has been getting us up about a half-hour before the alarm
<cmaloney> unfortunately she's also trained me to not try to oversleep because every now and again she manages to connect with her claws and my ass
<cmaloney> nothing like getting clawed on the ass when you're not expecting it
<cmaloney> and no, I don't recommend it
<cmaloney> waldo323: Awesome!
<rick_h_> cmaloney: lol, alarm++
<Scary_Guy> mornin'
<waldo323> oi that wouldn't be acceptable at my house
<cmaloney> waldo323: It's not acceptable in our house either but here we are
<cmaloney> not like I can wrap my ass in tinfoil or give her a stern talking to when she's half-way down the hall
<cmaloney> There have been a few times where she's kept waking us up during the night
<cmaloney> and whenever she does that she usually sleeps during the day when I'm sleep deprived
<cmaloney> the temptation to sneak up behind her with some orchestra cymbals and crash them is overwhelming
<waldo323> automated cat-day-nap restrictor
<waldo323> that way she's pretty tired at night?
<greg-g> The owner of www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com has configured their website improperly. To protect your information from being stolen, Firefox has not connected to this website.
<greg-g> gotta remove the www, lame
#ubuntu-us-mi 2018-06-26
<Scary_Guy> https://github.com/dimitri/el-get/issues/474 comedic gold
<doubledev> Afternoon everyone
<doubledev> anyone know a place that is hiring?
<jrwren> Pillar in Ann Arbor.
<jrwren> Ithaka in Ann Arbor.
<doubledev> jrwren: that is too far of a drive for me. I am in Macomb Township.
<jrwren> move?
<doubledev> thanks for that suggestion though
<doubledev> HAHA!  just bought this house and my wife's job is up this way too. That would be too far of a drive for what she is getting paid.
<doubledev> Can I work remotely at Pillar?
<jrwren> I have no idea.
<jrwren> I don't follow Macomb Co. jobs because I'm not a fan of the suburban wasteland that it is. :p
<doubledev> haha
<jrwren> autobooks is hiring.
<jrwren> but they are looking for Senior level folks with some .net/sql experience.
<jrwren> if you are willing to comute to detroit, there is tons of cool jobs.
<jrwren> Optomi is hiring.
<doubledev> jrwren: thank you.  I will look into them
<cmaloney> Ford is always hiring
<jrwren> helluva commute though.
<cmaloney> yeah
<cmaloney> And I have opinions on Ford's hiring process
<cmaloney> not complementary ones
<doubledev> cmaloney: what was your experience?
<cmaloney> Well, for one position I applied for they put me through a timed reading comprehension test
<cmaloney> and a timed percentages test
<cmaloney> and a timed culture fit test
<cmaloney> the best I could come up with is they wanted someone who was a complete toady who did fractions like a machine and had a photographic memory
<doubledev> are they looking for speedy gonzales for everything
<doubledev> haha
<doubledev> nice
<cmaloney> I hope they can build their little friend someday
<cmaloney> The second was with a contracting house that demanded I send thiem my drivers license (I refused) and then reformatted / rewrote my resume for the job even though it's CC-BY-NC_ND licensed
<cmaloney> so they literally stripped out my license and copyrighted my resume
<cmaloney> we had ... words.
<cmaloney> But the girst was I felt I couldn't trust them to have my best interests at heart
<cmaloney> because they ignored my desires
<jrwren> the drivers license bit is illegal as an EOE, you could report them.
<cmaloney> They claimed it was a Ford requirement, but in the end they didn't need it
<cmaloney> that was before the resume re-write
<cmaloney> What's awesome is my formative years as a computer professional were with Ford
<cmaloney> as a contractor
<cmaloney> So being told (in the first case) that I wasn't even worthy of an interview really stung
<cmaloney> Nevermind that they got 8+ years out of me in one way or another
<cmaloney> 13+ years in the auto industry. Just say no, kids.
<jrwren> I did.
<cmaloney> heh
<cmaloney> I mean, I learned Perl and did some interesting web-based project
<cmaloney> but when they didn't know what to do with you they didn't promote an environment of growth
<cmaloney> and it was easy to get lost in there
<doubledev> So don't go into automotive industry, got it!  ;)
<cmaloney> If you value your soul you'll find something else
<rick_h_> doubledev: what kind of work are you looking for?
<doubledev> haha, i think i sold that a while back ago, but will steer clear of it.  :)
<doubledev> rick_h_: Well, I would like to stick with developing, but I wouldn't be opposed to moving into a support management role or quality team type of work.
<doubledev> or even a deployment team role
<jrwren> devops is all of those.
<doubledev> I don't think devops would be good, just briefly looking at job descriptions and requirements.
<jrwren> i must be only person outside of google who actually likes devops
<doubledev> i am not saying I wouldn't like it, but don't think i am qualified for it
<brousch> I like devops. I get to do all the things
<jrwren> zactly!
<jrwren> none of that - throw-it-over-the-wall-and-point-blame crap.
<jrwren> and none of that - IT won't let us crap either.
<jrwren> OWN IT ALL
<cmaloney> Yep
<greg-g> all of the: 24/7 pager duty :)
<greg-g> (yes, because it makes you make better software!)
<cmaloney> hell yeah
<cmaloney> I don't want to be up at 3am trying to fix shit
<cmaloney> Been there, done that, got the T-shirt
<jrwren> actually it does!
<jrwren> because you stop writing and designing things that can go down.
<jrwren> 24/7 pager duty THAT NEVER GETS USED
<jrwren> because you are finally forced to understand the platform on which you run and write to it... or... you don't, and you get called all the time. your fault.
<jrwren> bonus if you define your own SLA such that it can always wait until morning. :)
<greg-g> yeah... that SLA wouldn't fly here :P
<jrwren> then you can afford to hire 24/7 support people.
<jrwren> hired on 3-4 continents such that all hours of the day are covered by peoples regular working hours.
<jrwren> if you can't do one or the other then something isn't being valued correctly.
<greg-g> indeed :)
<cmaloney> I like the SLA where it gets fixed when I get around to it
#ubuntu-us-mi 2018-06-27
<cmaloney> Good mornin
<rick_h_> wet morning :(
<cmaloney> Yeah it is
<cmaloney> I kind of dig it
<brousch> I'll bet you'll find worms
<rick_h_> ruining my work outside streak
<jrwren> :)
<jrwren> I've been in my basement too long. I really need to do some porch work
<rick_h_> had a guy come out and quote an awning for the top deck
<jrwren> $10,000?
<rick_h_> should ahve told him to just install it while he was here :P
<rick_h_> jrwren: 3k power awning with lights/wind sensor including install
<jrwren> nice!
<rick_h_> yea, just have to talk the wife into it
<rick_h_> tough while they're here working on the bathroom and such lol
<jrwren> I setup a temp sail shade thing for 1 day. it was nice, but I don't want to do the work to make it permanent :)
<rick_h_> yea, I should look at that. I got a couple of tarps for camping with the big poles and such thinking it'd be cool to setup more shade when camping
<rick_h_> I wonder if I could zip-tie the poles to the deck and hang the tarp up for a couple of days to try it out
<cmaloney> Power awning. That sounds like something JoDee would like
<cmaloney> though I like our little falling-apart porch in back
<rick_h_> https://www.marygrove.com/retractable-awnings/
<rick_h_> I didn't want power, but they need to do the roof mount to get it up high enough and can't reach it with a pole to do manual :(
<jrwren> how big is it?
<rick_h_> for my area it's a 12x10
<cmaloney> funnily enough we wondered if anyone did awnings still
<cmaloney> good to see they still do
<rick_h_> just for the upper part of https://photos.app.goo.gl/WzLFHHAGDLZ481EHA
<cmaloney> right
<jrwren> cmaloney: there are still awning infomercials on old-people-tv-channels
<brousch> Are you implying cmaloney should have seen them?
<jrwren> no.
<jrwren> i'm explicitly saying that I have. :)
<brousch> You're not allowed to watch old man channels because that means I could be watching old man channels
<jrwren> well... i really like startrek so sometimes I watch it on H&I
<jrwren> that is an old people channel
<cmaloney> I think this is an old people channel. ;)
<jrwren> its becoming one.
 * rick_h_ waves from one old man to the other old men
<rick_h_> jrwren: every year, closer to that very goal :P
<cmaloney> Senior Discounts?
<jrwren> I was about to say, when was the last time new folks, who may be young, joined here. but now that I think of it, we've had some new chatters.
<jrwren> hopefully we are welcoming and they stick around.
<cmaloney> I passed by a sign for the community center: Senior blah blah, 50+.
<cmaloney> and I'm like "Fuck you, sign"
<jrwren> are you 50 now?
<cmaloney> Not yet
<cmaloney> but I remember thinking that 50+ was a long way off
<cmaloney> and it's not so long-way-off-now
<rick_h_> Yay! I FINALLY got the update to Android Messages so I can do texts on my laptop
<cmaloney> nice!
<rick_h_> google voice transition is now complete and no need for hangouts
<cmaloney> I still use Hangouts
<cmaloney> but yeah, it seems Hangouts are the eldest sibling of the Google Messaging ecosystem
<cmaloney> supposed to be responsible and not change much
<rick_h_> the thing is that I end up with "where did I get that?" and have to check texts, hangouts, email, etc. It'll be good to drop one finally
<cmaloney> but with Google thinking that Hangouts will somehow become Slack for Busines I wonder what will happen to it
<rick_h_> smartass :P
<cmaloney> Heh
<cmaloney> Nothing says Love like sending rick_h_ a message on a platform he's trying to sundown
<cmaloney> my worry is they'll phase out Google Voice and then I'll have to pay for SMS again
<cmaloney> and give out a "real" phone number
<cmaloney> ugh
<jrwren> its a terrible system.
<cmaloney> which?
<jrwren> google's messages systems
<jrwren> hangsouts/meet/hello/gtalk
<jrwren> all separate.
<jrwren> but why should goog care? they don't make money on any of those.
<jrwren> I love teh texts to laptop feature though. Its one of my fav apple features.
<cmaloney> Well, Google had one that I was pretty convinced wouldn't go anywhere
<cmaloney> Duo or Allo. Not sure which
<cmaloney> https://www.androidauthority.com/google-messaging-apps-867843/
<cmaloney> I agree with this article: Hangouts is the best at what it does. That's likely why Google keeps wanting to kill it.
<cmaloney> After reading it I think Duo and Allo should both be tanked
<jrwren> yup
<jrwren> and meet too.
<cmaloney> *eyeroll*
<jrwren> what?
<jrwren> thre's still be hangouts.
<jrwren> hahahaha... I was about to say... imagine if MS made 3 wordprocessors instead of just word.
<jrwren> but then I remember that they did.
<cmaloney> I'm just waiting for Google to screw up Hangouts
<cmaloney> Yeah, Works, Word, and ... something else
<jrwren> there was/is write/wordpad, the one in msworks, and mspublisher and all that was confusing.
<jrwren> hahaha, yup
<cmaloney> Publisher was a purchased program
<cmaloney> but yeah, Wordpad, Word, and Works were confusing little fucks
<cmaloney> Sorry, but Wordpad was most frustrating of all
<cmaloney> since it was a crapshoot betwheen whether Notepad or Wordpad would open any file on the machine
<cmaloney> and the myriad cries of "Wordpad is not an editor"
<jrwren> publisher was confusing for a lot of people too because a lot of folks used WORD to try to do what publisher was meant to do.
<cmaloney> That was the whole reason I taught my mom how to use Publisher instead of Word
<cmaloney> now she uses it for everything
<cmaloney> and I can't get her to stop
<jrwren> ha!
<cmaloney> I tried to get her to use Scribus, but Scribus is not intuitive at the best of times
<jrwren> nope
<cmaloney> I'm just going to sit here and hope that federated protocols take over the world
<cmaloney> and folks will magically start using Libreoffice, Mastodon / ActivityPub, and the like
<cmaloney> and perhaps magical unicorns will descend from fairy-land to sprinkle us with fairy dust
<jrwren> remember in cathedral and bazaar how it was mentioned that some software which isn't widely used may not make sense for open source? I wonder if video chat is one of those.
<jrwren> the bazaar economics don't fit?
<cmaloney> http://i.imgur.com/bnIq54u.png
<jrwren> lol
<cmaloney> I don't think it's economics as much as the protocols / clients are half-baked and unintuitive
<cmaloney> Trying to explain XMPP to someone who just wants to chat is akin to telling someone they need to hum sine-wave patterns to dial a phone
<brousch> Video chat is used a lot now in business
<cmaloney> or tell an operator that you want to call the Jiffy Lube in United States, Michigan, Royal Oak, 13 Mile, Telegraph, 5150 Telegraph, Bob.
<brousch> skype and hangouts here, facetime is popular for consumers
<cmaloney> Yeah
#ubuntu-us-mi 2018-06-28
<waldo323> good morning
<cmaloney> Apparently I have made someone in the UK unhappy enough to send me a firebomb threat
<cmaloney> So that's fun
<cmaloney> Wonder if one of my forks is making someone cross
<rick_h_> cmaloney: ouch, you're just making all kinds of friends
<waldo323> woa did they say why?
<waldo323> sounds like something that could get them in more trouble than they'd expect if they thought they were threatening a fork in the UK
<cmaloney> Apparently I've been "dissing my crew"
<cmaloney> It's rather strangely worded and feels a bit cut-and-paste / random
<rick_h_> you disser
<jrwren> you sure it isn't spam?
<cmaloney> The headers seem to check out
<cmaloney> I tried to send it to abuse@ but it bounced
<cmaloney> so I just sent it to an info address
<cmaloney> But yeah, it looks like it might be spam / compromised
<jrwren> upgraded to bionic last night, finally and now gpg is broken :(
<jrwren> gpg: signing failed: Inappropriate ioctl for device
<cmaloney> nice
<jrwren> just needed a `export GPG_TTY=$(tty)`, but still, that is pretty bad breakage
#ubuntu-us-mi 2018-06-29
<cmaloney> Afternoon
<greg-g> ahoy hoy
#ubuntu-us-mi 2018-06-30
<jrwren> 120.3  F Heat Index
<jrwren> keep cool today folks.
#ubuntu-us-mi 2020-06-22
<cmaloney> morning
<greg-g> ahoy hoy
<rick_h> party
<mrgoodcat> is it morning?
<mrgoodcat> where is cmaloney
<mrgoodcat> rick_h: took delivery on the bike. proud owner of an obnoxious yellow santa cruz tallboy
<rick_h> mrgoodcat:  woot woot
<rick_h> mrgoodcat:  that was earlier than expected?
<rick_h> mrgoodcat:  so when are we riding?
<mrgoodcat> it was about when I expected
<mrgoodcat> i am down to ride any time
<rick_h> oh I thought it was a fall thing
<rick_h> ignore me then
<mrgoodcat> i had to drive to GR to get it
<rick_h> hah, well getting it > *
<rick_h> mrgoodcat:  how far is pontiac lake for you?
<mrgoodcat> most shops were quoting me late fall or even early next year for new bikes, but this shipment apparently was one a shop in GR ordered in like january that had been indefinitely delayed
<rick_h> cool, congrats
<mrgoodcat> the guy called me and told me i could have one but i needed to decide that day
<mrgoodcat> uh.... 30 minutes?
<rick_h> lol, no pressure sales
<mrgoodcat> ya lol
<rick_h> I was going to go hit pontiac lake after work either wed or thurs if you're game
<mrgoodcat> luckily for me I had already put a deposit down on a bike that would have been delivered in the fall, so he was calling to see if i wanted to switch to an R build in order to be able to get it sooner
<mrgoodcat> so it wasn't like a cold call
<rick_h> cool stuff
<mrgoodcat> i'm probably in for that. wed might be wet depending on how much it storms tomorrow
<rick_h> yea, have to play it by ear with the rain for sure
<rick_h> but it also doesn't hold too much water it's so sandy and such
<mrgoodcat> also with my legs. I am in a multi-week stretch of 50+ mile weeks and I need to give myself some rest eventually
<rick_h> mrgoodcat:  meh it's just a 10mi loop :)
<rick_h> but yea, with the rain you'll get a couple of days off easy
<mrgoodcat> so far i've only ridden highland and merril trail on the new bike
<rick_h> cool
<mrgoodcat> highland I only did A and B, not C or D
<rick_h> I've not tried highland in a long time. It kicked my butt so hard I've not gone back
<rick_h> but that was a couple of years ago now I guess
<rick_h> mrgoodcat:  anyway, if you're up for a ride give me a ping. Do you have my number or such?
<mrgoodcat> don't think i do actually
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: it's morning somewhere.
<mrgoodcat> ha
<mrgoodcat> rick_h: either pm me your # or i'll reach out on here when we get closer
<mrgoodcat> off to go ride now actually
 * mrgoodcat tips hat
#ubuntu-us-mi 2020-06-24
<cmaloney> Puzzled: I'm trying to get the ubuntu/focal64 vagrant VirtualBox box to work, but it hangs (even on older versions). I tried generic/ubuntu2004 and *poof* it works.
<cmaloney> WTF?
