#ubuntu-artwork 2005-07-25
<kafeine> hello
<Nafallo> morning :-)
<kafeine> mm
<kafeine> for the icon breezy thingie
<kafeine> is there a list somewhere with the icons that arent yet done
<kafeine> aaaand where can i see some icons which are already in this to-be set
<kafeine> so i could make them more.. consistent?
<Nafallo> http://andy.fitzsimon.com.au/humility-icons.tar.bz2
<Nafallo> this is what's being worked on for breezy :-)
<kafeine> thank you:)
<Nafallo> no problem :-)
<efbie> I made some new icons (for a few more info see mailing-list) :: http://www.mentalwarp.com/~fred/divers/humility-fred-contrib.zip
<tvoss> Hi all, is there already a package available for the Humility-Icon-Theme
<ogra_> tvoss, yes, i got it locally....
<tvoss> ogra_ can you send by mail to t.voss"at"onlinehome.de
<ogra_> i'll upload it today, jst apt-get it then ;)
<tvoss> ogra_ hoary or breezy?
<ogra_> breezy... but for a icontheme that doesnt matter
<ogra_> they are interchangeable
<Nafallo> http://andy.fitzsimon.com.au/humility-icons.tar.bz2
<Nafallo> or get them there ^ ;-)
<ogra_> Nafallo, thats not a package ;)
<Nafallo> ogra_: depends on your definition of package :-)
<ogra_> mine has a .deb in the end :)
<Nafallo> :-)
<ogra_> (my definition as well as my package ;))
<RQ> ;)
<RQ> it's useless as long as X doesn't work, anyways :D
<RQ> ogra_, what will the name of the package be?
<ogra_> humility-icon-theme ?
<RQ> great :)
<RQ> i hope it will remain like that.
<ogra_> i'm pondering if i should put a gnome- in fromt... 
<RQ> btw are you guys responsible for the colour themes in Ubuntu?
<ogra_> front even
<ogra_> not yet
<RQ> hmm... maybe not... if it works with KDE too.
<RQ> hmm
<ogra_> but the colors will be a responsibility of the art team
<RQ> I have a sugestion - don't keep the name of the package if you change it quite radically
<RQ> for example, i liked the soft brown colours in Warthy much more then those in Hoary
<RQ> so it wasn't very pleasing to find out that I can only have one of these themes at a time.
<RQ> so I'd suggest that you name them distinctively so that the user could have both of them installed
<RQ> (that's for the future, of course)
<tvoss> wrt humility icon theme: An icon for a samba share is missing
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-artwork:ogra] : Ubuntu Artwork Channel | wiki IconGuide up https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IconGuide | breezy icon theme sitting in NEW, install gnome-humility-icon-theme as soon as it hits the archive
<RQ> ogra, so you've added "gnome-"..
<ogra> yep, after talking to our KDE maintainer
<ogra> KDE will need a) repackaging anyway b) wont use them
<RQ> hm
<RQ> i thought there's a common freedesktop format now :|
<ogra> KDE uses other names for the icons, so they all will have to be renamed 
<RQ> weird..
<ogra> RQ, gnome uses gnome-fs-home.svg for example :)
<RQ> ywah
<ogra> nearly all icons have a prefix
<RQ> but as i said - i thought they've agreed on that fd.org standard
<ogra> sure... but if you look at KDE you'll find that it stores setings and theme data in .desktop files which is as wrong as having a gone- prefix on icons... i guess there is still a way to go for both
<ogra> s/gone-/gnome-
<RQ> yeah, well...
<RQ> i wonder what that standard specifies then..
<ogra> i havent read it... i'm only the packaging bitch here :) *shrug*
<Nafallo> ogra: almost entirely true ;-)
<ogra> heh
<Nafallo> ogra: care to review and upload libdc0 btw? it's on universeunmetdeps
<Nafallo> </OT> ;-)
<Nafallo> gothcat: welcome :-)
<gothcat> hi every one :)
* Nafallo introduces his girlfriend: gothcat :-)
<lukacu> hi
<ogra> hey gothcat 
<gothcat> ogra: hi :)
<Nafallo> ogra: she've seen pictures of you ;-)
<ogra> hehe
<ogra> the nice ones i hope :)
<Nafallo> mostly from mataro and udu :-)
<ogra> ah..
<mpathy> hi
<lukacu> hi :)
<kafeine> hello :D
<gothcat> hi!
<kafeine> 
<kafeine> err
<kafeine> that was mm
<kafeine> anyway
<kafeine> anyone with an opinion on the wiki vs. groupware thing which was the main conversation on the mailing list?
<ogra> yes
<Nafallo> yes
<efbie> IMHO the wiki is there and working, we should work with what we have now, and focus on producing artwork rather than discussing for years on a non-issue. If it really become impossible with the wiki, then we could look for an alternative...
<ogra> but since i'm a maintainer and involved in X diffeent ubuntu teams that all do their work n the wiki i'm vers biased
<ogra> very even
<ogra> i agree with jane that we need something better to put the artwork stuff up, but i would perfer to work with this group like with every other in ubuntu
<Nafallo> I don't actually think this team will want to diverge to much from the rest of the community. that will only lead to isolation.
<kafeine> then again, i think that artists in the common case aren't as used to wiki-based work as developers are, for example
<ogra> additionally i know how overworked our administrators are and that nobody wants to be admin of php stuff in the team, so it would have to be on a vserver that is maintained by us
<Nafallo> well, I'm not used to the wiki yet. that doesn't stop me from using it.
<Nafallo> ogra++
<efbie> Nafallo++ :)
<kafeine> hm
<Nafallo> I believe jane's mail told what ogra and I would love to see anyway :-). right ogra?
<ogra> likely :) 
<ogra> since jane is my boss and holds the whip :)
<Nafallo> hehe
<kafeine> :))
<ogra> no, seriously... my opiion is the above, but i know that its technically possible to have a vserver and run our own stuff... so lets see how a voting evolves :)
<kafeine> my stance is that it will be lot more easier to use some tool that is exclusively made for such kind of teamwork and project leading
<Nafallo> kafeine: and that is?
<kafeine> and proper, anyway
<kafeine> mm, phpgroupware or something like it
<kafeine> or, as it was proposed, basecamp
<Nafallo> well, that depends. the wiki would work for projectgoals, calendar, information and those kind of things.
<Nafallo> basecamp wasn't F/OSS
<ogra> i think what we need is a good revision control system to coordinate the collaborative artwork stuff (iconsets etc) and a good presentation platform (gallery, the art.gnome.org software etc) and coordinatig work should be done like in all other areas of ubuntu (IRC, wiki, mailinglist)
<ogra> kafeine, whats the usecase of phpgroupware ? what do you need a calendar for ?
<Nafallo> launchpad has personal calendars now. isn't that enough?
<ogra> i really dont see the need for such stuff... as long as we are communicative
<Nafallo> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Calendar suffice for most things that will need a calendar now.
<Nafallo> plus the ical version ofcourse :-)
<kafeine> my own concern is the visual orientation of this team
<kafeine> only*
<ogra> hmm, but does that need a groupware ?
<kafeine> and the fact that the people who work with the visual arts, are, well, used to visual tools
<Nafallo> and a calendar?
<kafeine> not necesarilly, no
<kafeine> and i certainly havent really said anything about no calendar
<kafeine> but
<ogra> hats the main usecase of phpgroupware, sharig calendars
<ogra> thats even
<kafeine> in those systems, most entries are presented in a much more intuitive way
<kafeine> and show up where you expect them to be
<kafeine> as projects
<kafeine> people who work on projects
<kafeine> etc
<ogra> hmm, depends how you define intuitive...
<Nafallo> well, the wiki have things were you told them to be :-)
<kafeine> i certainly dont define intuitive as located somewhere in a pile of text in a page that looks exactly as the last one
<kafeine> but anyway, that's just me:)
<kafeine> i'll work with anything
<Nafallo> and I love to find things were I left them :-)
<ogra> i will go with the group decision.... :)
<kafeine> same here
<kafeine> mm
<kafeine> anyway, can someone put up a list with all the icons that need to be done
<kafeine> and all the icons that are done already, propositions for icons, etc
<kafeine> and posting some guidelines for the promo materials (posters, flyers, stickers) in near time would be nice, too
<ogra> i think all mime types, all apps and folders wer the desired target
<Nafallo> ogra: all apps in main and restricted I hope you mean?
<ogra> i guess so
<ogra> we'll need at least 16x16, 22x22, 24x24 and 48x48 bitmap versions and scalable svg versions...
<efbie> that's a work of titans
<ogra> and beware, you cant just scale down the svg and make a bitmap of it.... bitmaps need to be redone manually to work out the details
<Nafallo> when was the meeting again?
<ogra> efbie, AndyFitz has already done a lot
<ogra> and yes, its a hell lot of work
<efbie> ogra: yes i know, :) i did a bunch of icons too
<efbie> but retouching pixel by pixel will be a _Huge_ work
<ogra> yep
<efbie> some things can be automated
<ogra> but we want a awesome iconset, dont we ?
<efbie> hehe
<ogra> in my opinion it should impress the world as ubuntu itself does ;)
<efbie> yep
<efbie> it should make mac peope jealous
<ogra> hehe
<kafeine> hard job:D
<ogra> yep
<efbie> but not impossible
<ogra> and its not only icons :)
<kafeine> what a relief:D
<ogra> splash, wallpaper etc
<efbie> the hard thing is to make beautiful artwork that remains "professional"
<efbie> gnome defaults look professional, but isn't that beautiful
<ogra> have you seen what jimmac does ? a quality like that would be the greatest... 
<ogra> he did the gnome default years back... but does also custom sets for ximian/novell
<efbie> yes it's really nice
<ogra> and the custom sets *are* beautiful :)
<kafeine> mm
<kafeine> we need some more info on the various work that is to be done posted on the wiki
<kafeine> cause i have no experience with icon making and i'm all useless right now
<efbie> yep.
<efbie> I would especially like to have artistical guidelines from Andy
<ogra> lets poke him if australia wakes up ;)
<ogra> also keep in mind that sabdfl can overrule everything in ubuntu ;) so if he doesnt like it it might get dropped...
<efbie> yep
<efbie> it scares me a little
<efbie> could we ask him an early review ?
<ogra> (we had a really awful splashscreen short before the hoary release...he made the current one and dropped the ugly one...was a good decision)
<mpathy> oh i am late.. I have a opinion too *gg*
<ogra> efbie, absolutely... he will want it... to see where it goes
<Nafallo> ogra: spatial was a bad though ;-)
<ogra> Nafallo, he knows that ;)
<Nafallo> ogra: good :-)
<Nafallo> well, shower for me and gothcat. bbl
<kafeine> mpathy, freedom of speech is here
<efbie> as i must reinstall my system, do you think that it's a good idea to use breezy ?
<mpathy> kafeine: ..but I first have to read all the lines *g*
<kafeine> efbie, not really
<efbie> ok
<ogra> efbie, probably in a week or two.... X is currently a PITA
<efbie> k
<mpathy> whats with this launchpad? its an ubuntu thing and have some nice tools.. but efbie you are right, its all secondary!
<ogra> mpathy, launchpad is for collaborative: translating, code development bugtracking beyond distro borders and community management... i dont think there is something usable for artwork development (except management stuff probably)
<ogra> its "sourceforge-next-generation" :)
<efbie> what's lacking in the wiki is something to visualize thing
<mpathy> ogra: oh okay.. i looked over it only short time.. my problem with the wiki at ubuntu is, that its relatively unstructured.. 
<ogra> mpathy, its up to us to build a structure below our site....
<mpathy> efbie: right! combined with some sort of upload area!?
<ogra> mpathy, and i think some people of the docteam would disagree about the "unstructured" (i agree with you btw ;) )
<mpathy> ogra: thx ;o) Its only because I want to keep the track, dont lost any information.. as long its all in the mailing list, its okay.. so because of that a central ubuntu-artwork news page would be good.
<efbie> if there is a structure in the wiki it is far from being obvious...
<ogra> heh
<ogra> the docteam is small :)
<ogra> the wiki is big....
<mpathy> Wikipedia is even bigger and it works *gg*
<mpathy> okay thats another thing
<ogra> mpathy, probably there are moin plugins we could get for the news stuff...
<mpathy> ogra: ehmm.. what wiki is the ubuntu wiki?
<ogra> moin
<mpathy> moin moin=
<mpathy> oh okay
<ogra> we had plone and zwiki before,
<mpathy> sad that noone tries some of these nice ruby-based wikis :o)
<ogra> *shudder* ruby *shudder*
<ogra> :)
<mpathy> ogra: hey! watch out ;)
<ogra> hehe
<mpathy> lets guess: you are more the perl-guy, and your editor is emacs.. :)
<ogra> nope
<ogra> i'm the multi guy (C, perl, python (!!) a lot more...) an my editor is vim ;)
<mpathy> good editor choice.. :) ..but i never get good friend with C, perhaps the force isnt with me.. ;)
<ogra> i was forced by ubuntu ;) 
<ogra> didnt touch much C before ....
<mpathy> apropos the force.. did you heard about "utnubu"? ..the empire strikes back *gg*
<ogra> yeah, its a great thing
<ogra> i was waiting for this quite some time already... so nobody cant blame us we wouldnt give back.... 
<ogra> since i think its the job of the debian maintainers to grab our patches themselves...
<mpathy> yes.. hope the padawan doesnt kill his master, like in star wars ;)
<ogra> buit they always meant we'd have to send them every change we make
<ogra> no, it wont... we never can manage this amount of packages....
<ogra> ubuntu has far less maintainers...
<mpathy> no i meant accidentally..
<mpathy> :o)
<ogra> that'd be very bad for us... we cant survive without debian....
<ogra> only if the maintainers would switch over to us...
<mpathy> because of the hype. but right now the most people think about ubuntu as the "desktop debian".. thats okay for me..
<mpathy> many did
<ogra> not for me... :)
<ogra> its a perfect server OS as well...
<ogra> the problem is to get this across to the people
<ogra> since everybody is convinced ubuntu is only a desktop system
<mpathy> should produce a bit more server oriented news! :)
<ogra> yep, we're working on it ;)
<mpathy> like "increased amount of BOFH excuses - fortunes" ;)
<ogra> heh
<mpathy> someone started working on these calendar images?
<efbie> nope
<ogra> not to my knowledge
<plb> what about a metacity theme ;] 
* ogra likes the current one.... but lternatives never hurt ;)
<ogra> +a
<plb> heh
<efbie> clearlooks is really nice, maybe a brown version would fit ?
<mpathy> ll
<mpathy> efbie: yes would be nice.. clearlooks is nice
<mpathy> omg.. e17 is so awesome fast..
<ogra> it took them 6 years to develop it... so this should be the least ....
<mpathy> hope ubuntu will be the first who gets it into his packages ;)
<ogra> sadly he made themself incompatible with the rest of the world, so you'll need to write a lot of apps for it...
<ogra> and it really crappy unstable for now...
<efbie> e17 looks like the future, but now
<ogra> nothing to give to users
<ogra> efbie, e17 looks like a nice proof of concept thingie...but with their development speed you'll see the first stable release in about 5 years
<mpathy> yes its not even a beta.. but its amazing :)
<ogra> sadly they work against freedesktop org... and they are no friends of it...
<ogra> raster (the e17 dev) wrote a lengthy rant against freedesktop, QT and GTK last year....
<efbie> and i thought that linux was all about interoperability....
<ogra> ...not something that brings you many developers in to speed things up :(
<efbie> lol
<ogra> sure, you can run other apps on top... but its an additional ressource hog to have a WM that uses all its own stuff (libs etc)
<mpathy> but they also have some good concepts.. and some not so good.. like most time..
<ogra> nicer would have been if they had put these ideas and the work into gnome or kde to improve these
<mpathy> the other apps feels like they run at same speed..
<efbie> and those next gen things like cairo and luminocity, are these science-fiction, or are they likely to be in gnome before the next duke nukem ? 
<ogra> cairo is already in breezy.. the breezy firefox already renders its fonts with it
<mpathy> luminocity is not so different from the things that work even now on e17.. (as an non-programmers opinion *g*)
<ogra> luminocity will be ready soon... and xgl looks promising
<ogra> i saw demos of all of them at guadec this year
<mpathy> but have a look anyway:
<mpathy> http://livecd.debianitas.net/screenshots/prueba2.mpg
<ogra> and they are all developed by paied people that spend much time on improving them
<ogra> mpathy, i know the e17 movies :)
<mpathy> ogra: but thats new! 1-3 days old from a new live cd with a good working e17
<efbie> mpathy: looks quite nice :)
<ogra> yep, it improved
<mpathy> lot of progress in the last weeks/months..
#ubuntu-artwork 2005-07-26
<mpathy> okay, i am outing me.. i made a e17 theme based on the kreski lines, which will come out in bundle with a window engine from tilman, who displays windows just as they where handdrawn, but in a blink of an eye ;)
<mpathy> watch out for it.. but thats my only other project.. right now I want to do sth. for ubuntu.. ;)
<mpathy> oh.. its midnight.. got to go! see ya
<mpathy> bye
<efbie> bye
<volvoguy> howdy folks.
<efbie> hello !
<volvoguy> what's new in the magical world of ubuntu?
<efbie> the princess has been kidnapped by a monster
<volvoguy> crap. i hate when that happens. i'll go sharpen my sword.
<efbie> :)
<volvoguy> hmm... x-chat doesn't like to talk to Firefox, does it? i have to keep copy/pasting URLs manually. 
<efbie> yep
<volvoguy> oh well.
<volvoguy> so who's working on icons this week?
<efbie> i did my homework
<efbie> but i would like some feedback from andy
<volvoguy> what are you working on specifically? just making bitmaps (png's) out of the SVGs?
<efbie> no, new mime types
<efbie> i posted in the mailing list 
<volvoguy> oh, cool. i noticed a few were missing.
<efbie> a lot are still missing
<volvoguy> i need to go grab your zip file. it won't overwrite anything will it?
<efbie> i am trying some different style for code/text mime types
<efbie> it will overwrite
<efbie> just discards what's in "FS"
<volvoguy> ok. i'll just make a "working" copy of andy's theme for now.
<efbie> wait a minute
<volvoguy> ok. :o)
<volvoguy> efbie: so i can keep names straight, are you Fred? we really need a photo guide with everyone's pic and aliases in it. :o)
<efbie> yes i'm fred :)
<volvoguy> glad to meet you. :)
<volvoguy> i'm apparently Aaron #1. 
<efbie> hehe :) me too, even if meeting on IRC isn't what we can really call a "meeting" :D
<volvoguy> eh, it's better than all email interaction. 
<efbie> I'm uploading my modifications as a separate theme, so it'll be easier to compare :)
<volvoguy> ok. just give me a URL and i'll grab it when it's ready.
<efbie> www.mentalwarp.com/~fred/divers/humility-icons2.zip
<volvoguy> got it.
<volvoguy> are you creating the new icons in gimp or inkscape? 
<efbie> inkscape
<volvoguy> k. just curious. there's only pngs in your zip file.
<efbie> no there should be a "scalable" folder
<efbie> if they aren't in there, they are in the mail
<volvoguy> yeah, i'm sorry . i take that back. "less" didn't tell me everything that was in there.
<volvoguy> ok. i'm going to go peek around and see how they look. :o)
<efbie> :)
<efbie> some icons are quite WIP
<efbie> like the folders
<volvoguy> ok
<efbie> i was just trying alternatives to andy's folders
<efbie> and this is the last version, but i don't like it so much.
<volvoguy> yeah, that's cool. i'd definitely double-check with him on things as major as folders though. 
<efbie> that's why i'm waiting for him :)
<volvoguy> the poor Aussie. i'm always heading to bed just when he's getting ready to work. :)
<efbie> yeah....
<efbie> it's quite the oposite of the world for me
<volvoguy> can i just use a text editor to edit the index.theme file and give it a more meaningful name than humility2?
<efbie> yep
<volvoguy> k. thx.
<efbie> i just did that a minute ago, wasn't too much inspired :D
<efbie> volvoguy: where do you live ?
<volvoguy> efbie: detroit, michigan, usa.
<efbie> ok
<volvoguy> you?
<efbie> Belgium
<volvoguy> cool. i love your chocolate. hehe. ;)
<efbie> i heard detroit is where industrial music was invented is it right ?
<volvoguy> i like your folder and archive icons. a bit more rustic than andrew's. 
<volvoguy> that's what i hear. i don't listen to much industrial though. i'm a guitar player - it puts me out of a job. ;)
<efbie> lol
<volvoguy> have any of you tried foresight linux? i was just over chatting with their art director, as our aesthetics seem to be similar. (only seen from screenshots though, their install disc seems to be broken ATM). 
<efbie> yep, i found andy's icon too "linspire like", but mine are too blurred and massive. It's a sad thing when the point of this theme was to look light
<efbie> didn't even heard about it
<volvoguy> foresight is probably loosely based on fedora, but it uses a new package manager called canary and is mostly used to showcase all the mono/beagle stuff. 
<efbie> ok
<efbie> the screenshots don't tell much
<volvoguy> the thing i like about andy's icons is that they seem to be a good compromise for the ubuntu and kubuntu crowds. we want to do as much sharing as possible.
<efbie> that's a good idea
<efbie> my folders in a kde env would look like a fist in the face :D
<volvoguy> yeah. i'm not sure how that will work for overall themes, (i've only demoed the kubuntu live disc), but hopefully our group will do good enough work that the kubuntu folks will pick some of it up too.
<efbie> yep
<volvoguy> your different mime-type icons look good. i have a few txt, jar and deb files in my home directory that are just blank pieces of paper in andrews theme.
<efbie> thanks
<volvoguy> if you're going to be around, i expect Andrew to pop in in the next few hours. 
<efbie> ok
<volvoguy> and on that note, i'm going to go find some food so i have the energy to stay up chatting later. 
<efbie> it's getting really late here... 
<efbie> so i'll not stay long
<efbie> 15min max
<volvoguy> no problem. do what you can - even ask questions if you have them and i'll tell andrew to look through the chat logs.
<volvoguy> speak of the devil. ;-)
<efbie> :) 
<AndyFitz> hey hey!
<efbie> hi !
<volvoguy> i'll quickly sum up... Andy and efbie need to talk about icons and Aaron needs to go eat dinner. i'll be back in a few. 
<AndyFitz> g'day efbie, how are you
<AndyFitz> ciao aaron
<volvoguy> see ya! 
<efbie> tired, it's 2h30 here :)
<efbie> ++
<AndyFitz> puch,  its 10:20am here
<efbie> it would be difficult to have a greater hour delay :D
<efbie> So, maybe you'll be interested in this : www.mentalwarp.com/~fred/divers/humility-icons2.zip
<AndyFitz> yep  we're opposite sides of the world . sometimes I wish I was an insonmiac
<efbie> luckily i am :)
<efbie> i quickly made a separate theme to check differences
<efbie> but the svg sources are in the mail
<efbie> the folders icons are the fruits of unfinished experiments 
<AndyFitz> eep
<AndyFitz> it sucks that we can't go down this path
<efbie> ?
<AndyFitz> firstly we need to use colours in the palette   ( we can pretty much make any shade / saturation by duplicating the shape and mixing with black white and grey with a semi transparent layer on top
<efbie> ah ok
<efbie> wasn't aware of this :)
<AndyFitz> the brown folders  .  while suave and cool arent going to be able to match the theme.   that brown is too close to the base colour of the desktop background palette 
<AndyFitz> its all good :)
<AndyFitz> heh  mark reviewed the stuff and said that the existing ( shinyish ) icons were too muted and brown 
<efbie> ok
<AndyFitz> Im telling him we arent KDE  but we don't mind adding bling and brightening things up a bit. 
<efbie> yep, the document icons are nicely shiny :)
<AndyFitz> it will be good to have a set that is really bright styled and mature enough to still be usable .    your icon is mature and usable  but lax the  kapow  ( I like it  but id like it in another theme not ubuntu-default 
<AndyFitz> http://andy.fitzsimon.com.au/palettesheet.svg
<AndyFitz> score a copy of that .      it may seem too bright  .  but you can subtly add overlays of grey black or white to tone things
<AndyFitz> it would be nice to keep the hex values in the svg matching those in the palette for future changes and derivatives to be done quickly
<efbie> ok
* efbie is impressed by so much professionalism :)
<efbie> i have a question :
<efbie> there is about 52338 mime-types related to plain text documents
<AndyFitz> we are professionals efbie, this is more serious of a product than a cornflakes box design
<AndyFitz> :-)
<efbie> but, if we want them all (and i want them all)
<efbie> we need to make variations of a "base text-icon"
<efbie> or something like that
<efbie> the current icon with a pen is really nice, but we can't do any variation of it
<AndyFitz> the gnome-fs-regular icon with the grey frame is probably the best to play with
<efbie> ok
<AndyFitz> I'll need to crank out alot more assets to play with then hopefully compositing tasks will be alot easier.  I don't want our graphical assets to restrict what we want to represent so please email me requests
<efbie> ok
<AndyFitz> sweet :)
<efbie> i have another question
<efbie> how much figurative and symbolic do you want the icons to be ?
<AndyFitz> sure thing
<AndyFitz> less symbolic and more figurative is the goal. but we will have to compromise when  objects just don't seem to suit
<efbie> like the gnome-mime-text-x-patch.svg  
<efbie> i took the approach to show the code
<efbie> but maybe it would have been better to draw a patch
<efbie> a bandage or something
<efbie> an "adhesive plaster" (with the help of google) :)
<AndyFitz> sadly puns don't work for other cultures 
<efbie> ok. So the path i choosen is the right one ?
<efbie> (jesus my english is sooo bad at this time of the day)
<AndyFitz> I dig it .  like a log for a log-file.    it just wouldnt work in languages where log means thick wood stick and  computer log means  software record 
<efbie> ok
<efbie> and is writing the extension in the icon a good or bad practice ?
<AndyFitz> very bad
<AndyFitz> in a perfect world file extensions neednt exist .  
<AndyFitz> a good example of this is ..    a html file is sometimes called a htm file
<AndyFitz> but the mimetype is the same
<efbie> ok
<AndyFitz> so having either htm or html in the icon would be wrong for one or the other ( and we are using up the precious whitespace where we could otherwise be  visually describing what a web document is all about :-)
<efbie> :)
<AndyFitz>  I justify it to myself as [ more text = less pretty pictures  ]     [ more pretty pictures = more communicative imagery] 
<efbie> but we still need to find way to differenciate similar things with different extensions.
<AndyFitz> yep ,  slight varations of colour    or get clever with the mime image
<efbie> like currently there was one icon type for .png, .jpg, .gif
<efbie> (my sentences make no sense, i'm aware of it :D )
<efbie> i have a better understanding of the icon guidelines :)
<AndyFitz> like for wave files an midi files this is simple .    use notes for midi  and wave pattern for wave files.     for   jpeg and giff this is also simple.   use only a few pixels for gif suggesting its a raster palette constricted lossy format .  and use gradients for jpeg suggesting its high colour 
<efbie> good ideas
<efbie> tomorrow i'll add that to the wiki
<AndyFitz> for those funky module  music things made on mod trackers we could have lots of little snippets of wave patterns.  for the rom files we could use the gnome-joystick icon  but use similar colour combinations to the nature of the consoles brand we are trying to emulate  ( purple for nintendo   ) blue for sega green for xbox etc
<AndyFitz> that would be awesome, thankyou 
<efbie> what would be nice too, is a list of the icons that needs to be done, icons that are done, and icons in progress that needs reviews
<efbie> in fact it is quite needed
<AndyFitz> very much so
<AndyFitz> we need a really simple way of showing that stuff is done / pending / not done
<AndyFitz> I'll be able to put up a list of stuff.   where we can have 4 states  ,    completed, pixel cleanup needed, not done -composition needed, not done assets needed
<efbie> maybe a "to be reviewed/ reviewed" stage would be nice, so that the pixel cleaning isn't done on bad icons 
<AndyFitz> yes good point
<efbie> can i ask you to make a review of my  mimetypes iconset so that i know what's good, what's bad, etc... ?
<efbie> don't be afraid to be harsh on critique :)
<efbie> ok, time for me to sleep. 
<efbie> see you later ! 
<AndyFitz> okay,  just a few quick points 
<AndyFitz> *we need to use the palette!
<AndyFitz> *text in the text icons isnt a good idea   .not just for i18n  but because  things look cluttered.  and then the mimes become size specific to read the text properly  ( to be realisitc alot of the mimes  won't have pixel versions done because of the sheer amount of stuff we need to get through
<AndyFitz> I did the illustrator icon.  but not the use of the name of the software.  remove that side thing and its rad. /   
<AndyFitz> the font icon is PERFECT! .  just make sure the text in the svg is subset   ( in inkscappe convert object to path )   otherwise machines without bitstream will view it differently 
<AndyFitz> also make the font text and handles a little bigger
<AndyFitz> even ditch the lowercase a ( if we must to make it bigger and viewable at 22x22 )  but I think its a nice touch
<AndyFitz> I've got some styled coffee cup assets for the java bytecode icon.   and id like to work on the jar image to sex-it-up   a little, if you don't mind)   .  id really like you to submitt what we don't use to the openclipar.org gallery
<AndyFitz> the adobe icons arent cool.  we will get kicked in the head for publishing their name/ identity.   lets not risk it and be more symbolic with them
<AndyFitz> thats about it !
<AndyFitz> thanks for your help :D  thank
<AndyFitz> oh wait.  the video icons.  are not to be put in the document icon.  ( videos arent displayed on a paper medium so why put them there ( its all HIG relelvant)
<AndyFitz> rocking work tho !
<AndyFitz> efbie,  I really appreciate your help.  it will be interesting to see your work develop as we continue this project
<AndyFitz> night mate
<AndyFit1> awww  yeaaaa
<Starchild> hello?
<Starchild> anybody home?
<gothcat> hi
<efbie> hi
<efbie> I talked with Andy yesterday, and we updated the iconGuide to be more precise
<kafeine> hi
<kafeine> :)
<kafeine> lemmeseeee
<kafeine> ..
<kafeine> i like it better now, yup :)
<Nafallo> gothcat: don't forget to look ar the page in topic :-)
<gothcat> Nafallo: ?
<Nafallo> gothcat: /topic
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-artwork:ogra] : Ubuntu Artwork Channel | wiki IconGuide up https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IconGuide | breezy icon theme: install gnome-humility-icon-theme
<Nafallo> gothcat thinks the boxes for archives should be closed if the files are not unpacked :-)
<Nafallo> ^ talking about humility
<ogra> heh, cool idea, but if you unpack a archive it gets a folder normally....
<ogra> or a number of files
<Nafallo> yea. I think the point is more like: it's an archive. that should be a closed box.
<Nafallo> the idea I thought she meant could be a breezy+15 goal or something ;-)
<ogra> heh
#ubuntu-artwork 2005-07-27
<AndyFitz> hey hey
<lukacu> hi
<lukacu> question: that list ... of icons to be made and the ones that are finished ... etc.  ... does it exist?
<Nafallo> 18:28 < Nafallo> gothcat thinks the boxes for archives should be closed if the
<Nafallo>                  files are not unpacked :-)
<Nafallo> 18:28 < Nafallo> ^ talking about humility
<Nafallo> 18:30 < ogra> heh, cool idea, but if you unpack a archive it gets a folder
<Nafallo>               normally....
<Nafallo> 18:30 < ogra> or a number of files
<Nafallo> 18:32 < Nafallo> yea. I think the point is more like: it's an archive. that
<Nafallo>                  should be a closed box.
<Nafallo> AndyFitz: ^
<Nafallo> :-)
<AndyFitz> Nafallo 
<AndyFitz> I agree
<AndyFitz> that icon was first made for file roller.  I'll draw a similar but closed box for archive types
<Nafallo> AndyFitz: she smiles happily :-)
<AndyFitz> I always knew it was silly .  just waiting for someone to pull me up on it and make me do the work.  ;-)
<Nafallo> hehe :-)
<AndyFitz> sadly I really have to go ( I'll be away for the weekend )
<AndyFitz> hopefully online later today however
<Nafallo> AndyFitz: same here. I'm just here to get my X fixed again ;-)
<AndyFitz> ciao mate , take care and thanks for pointing it out :)
<Nafallo> AndyFitz: take care to and I'll see you around :-).
<AndyFitz> you to mate :)
<volvoguy> hey folks.
<volvoguy> did i miss Andy or hasn't he been on yet today? (i can never keep track of timezones on the other side of the planet) :)
<Nafallo> 00:56 -!- AndyFitz [~andy@nat-pool-brisbane.redhat.com]  has left
<Nafallo>           #ubuntu-artwork [] 
<ogra> volvoguy, gworldclock is very helpful ;)
<Nafallo> 02:32 now :-)
<volvoguy> :-) thanks. 
<ogra> Nafallo, you need to say where :) 02:29 in germany btw :)
<ogra> hmm, my clock is slow...
<Nafallo> ogra: I did.. here :-)
<ogra> ah, yes, *here* :)
<volvoguy> i just had a great talk with one of the Foresight Linux people. Apparently they're working on a SOAP based system to combine the artwork on gnome-looks.org, kde-looks.org and art.gnome.org. the results could be accessed via the web or a standalone app (like the gnome-art app). 
<Nafallo> hmm, I just tried to tune my irssi time by running ntpdate on the lappy :-P
<volvoguy> i'm in detroit, michigan, usa.
<volvoguy> it would be possible to make our future ubuntu art website part of the global "artwork repository". sounds pretty cool to me.
<ogra> yep, sounds good :)
<Nafallo> yay! that could hopefully kill the phpgroupware idea :-)
<ogra> heh
<ogra> i still have no idea wat for we'd need a groupware...
<ogra> s/wat/what
<Nafallo> same here
<volvoguy> i'm not really sold on the groupware idea yet either.
<volvoguy> i think for our "official" ubuntu artwork, CVS would be fine for keeping track of things.
<Nafallo> wiki+bazaar+art.g.o software would be a good start :-)
<ogra> yep
<ogra> Nafallo, but you have to teach baz to all the artwork guys then :)
<Nafallo> ogra: but not cvs?
<Nafallo> I've never really used either, but I've heard baz rocks! :-)
<volvoguy> we'll have wait and see. i don't think everyone (including myself) knows the full scope of what Ubuntu ultimately wants from us.
<ogra> Nafallo, always give users the tools they need... 
<ogra> volvoguy, just artwork... the best we can get :)
<ogra> so if CVS is required, we'll have CVS ....
<Nafallo> cvs is the most _known_ solution I guess :-)
<ogra> ... which doesnt mean there cant be some bazarr classes to teach the people Nafallo 
<Nafallo> ogra: kewl. start with me then :-).
<volvoguy> ogra: yes - but for ubuntu's purposes, there's really not a huge amount of artwork we need to collaborate on - icons, 6 backgrounds per release, maybe some theme tweaks and/or variations.
<ogra> Nafallo, i'm still learning myself, but i could get us the guy who wrote baz to teac us :)
<ogra> volvoguy, the iconsets are not small
<volvoguy> ogra: is bazzar some kind of versioning system?
<ogra> yep 
<ogra> its the one we develop at canonical
<ogra> and the one launchpad will use
<Nafallo> ogra: lifeless IIRC?
<volvoguy> ogra: no, they're not small, but they're relatively small compared to having hundreds of devs working on a piece of software.
<ogra> Nafallo, lifeless is rather a manager... jblack would be good to teach us
<volvoguy> i've been meaning to ask my Canonical contacts what/if/why/how we could be part of launchpad. 
<Nafallo> ah, oki :-)
<ogra> volvoguy, i dont think mark planned a artwork area for launchpad... thats probably something to be added now
<Nafallo> right now there isn't really a need to be on launchpad IMO. sabdfl might have something else to say about that though ;-)
<Nafallo> for this team that is...
<volvoguy> ogra: i agree. i don't think we were planned in any aspect until recently - that's why it's taking so long to get things done on their end for us.
<volvoguy> so how would launchpad be classified? is it kinda like a project manager?
<ogra> its "sourceforge next generation"
<Nafallo> right now it's bug-tracker, translation area and team management. something like that :-)
<ogra> it will be source management and package builder too in the future
<volvoguy> nice. :)
<ogra> and the target is community collaboration in any way... so artwork might be part of the general plan
<ogra> anyway, GF pokes me... nearly 3am....
<Nafallo> anyway. I have to wake up early tomorrow.
<ogra> time for bed... :)
<ogra> i dont...
<Nafallo> what ogra said ;-)
<ogra> but still 
<Nafallo> We're going to Oslo to spend the weekend with tfheen and Simira :-)
<volvoguy> oh sure... i finally get in here and you all leave me. ;-) just kidding. get some sleep and i'll get some food. we'll catch up later. (remember, this channel is being logged now). 
<ogra> Nafallo, seeing the new flat ?
<ogra> volvoguy, yep... nice to meet you (finally (even if its virtual)) 
<Nafallo> ogra: naah. that's not until 4th august :-)
<ogra> ah... i just saw some pics...
<volvoguy> ogra: thanks. same here! have a good time on your trip. 
<Nafallo> ogra: oh?
<ogra> Nafallo, he posted them... i dont have the links anymore... i guess he'll show it to you ...
<Nafallo> volvoguy: yepp. will see you later :-).
<Nafallo> ogra: hehe, indeed :-).
<Nafallo> anyway. good night guys :-)
<volvoguy> Nafallo: g'night!
<ogra> yep...same goes for me, night
<volvoguy> ogra: g'night. :)
<ogra> :)
<mpathy> hi there
<lukacu> hello
<mpathy> i set up this tool someone suggested.. not that we should use it, but the range of things that you can do there would make sense! would you have a look? ;) http://ubuntu-artwork.seework.com user: demo password: demo
<lukacu> ok
<lukacu> well ... it looks nice ... but what bothers me is the side ad-bar
<ogra> could someone elaborate what for we need this ? 
<ogra> its all already there in the ubuntu wiki... (assuming you read the ML)
<lukacu> ogra: hm ... nope ... just checking it out to see if it fits our needs ... but i agree that wiki is also cool ;)
<mpathy> someone suggested it, i had a look on it. we dont need or want that, because its not open source - but the things they use make sense.. only for visualizing!
<ogra> hmm... its a project tool, right ? 
<lukacu> yup
<mpathy> again: i dont think we should use that. but it helps to visualize what we perhaps need.. :)
<ogra> i think we need to have a project plan, but i do not see the need to modify it every now and then ... :)
<ogra> so a single page with this plan should be enough, or am i wrong ? 
<lukacu> it depends on how well the team is organized and how well they know what they can do in wiki and what not 
<mpathy> okay.. but it should be well structured..
<mpathy> the docteam has structured wiki pages!
<lukacu> yup
<mpathy> but i thought if we get external webspace we could do a little bit more than a wiki..
<mpathy> something where not only we, but also normal ubuntu users have some use of it
<mpathy> like the art.gnome.org
<ogra> art.ubuntu.com :)
<mpathy> right
<mpathy> but not only for us, also for ubuntu user who want to download nice wallpapers, themes, splash screens, grub and bootsplash etc.
<mpathy> or is searching of a tutorial how to set up a new splash screen..
<ogra> yep, and something like gnome-art to integrate directly with the desktop...
<ogra> (i guess KDE finally got something like that too finally)
<mpathy> what do you mean exactly? i dont get it.. perhaps its too early in the morning :)
<ogra> there is a tool the integrates artwork from a weblocation directly with the desktop, for example you want a new wallpaper, you have something verysimilar to the wallpaper selector, but it pulls all data directly from the online source
<lukacu> that is nice...
<ogra> its called gnome-art ...
<ogra> and i saw something like that for KDE too recently...
<mpathy> NICE
<lukacu> but right now we need team organisation infrastructure ...
<mpathy> http://www.miketech.net/gnome-art/
<mpathy> right
<lukacu> it is very nice though
<mpathy> downloaded it and have a look on it.. its in ruby :o)
<ogra> eek, ruby ...
<lukacu> :)
<ogra> that means we wont have it in main ....
<mpathy> ogra: huh?
<mpathy> ogra: because of some python fanatics? ;)
<ogra> we have nobody who wants to remotely maintain ruby stuff... its a PITA....
<lukacu> :)
<mpathy> why?
<ogra> maintainig ruby packages is awful
<mpathy> specify ;)
<ogra> because of the structure of the packages...
<ogra> and because nobody is fond to learn ruby ... we could really needsome ruby oriented MOTUs
<ogra> t maintain this stuff....
<ogra> s/t/to
<mpathy> I am not so good at ruby.. to be a maintainer..
<mpathy> but i hope this summer it will change..
<ogra> drop by in #ubuntu-motu if you feel ready :) ruby is a unloved child in ubuntu.... someone should give it some love :)
<mpathy> for sure!
<ogra> :)
<mpathy> back again
<Mats_> bonjour a tous :)
<lukacu> hello
<olivier> Greetings
<lukacu> hi
<olivier> Just to tell that, few month ago, I made a 2 minute .png for the "ubuntu love days"  : http://yet.another.linux-nerd.com/2005/03/07/41/
<olivier> I won't have time for ubuntu artwork in the near future but I'll try to do some stuff later.
<lukacu> i think that is no problem 
<olivier> Yeah, there's a lot of people willing to help.
<lukacu> yup ... btw nice ubuntu logo variation
<olivier> thx
<lukacu> i think you can come whenever you like ... there will always be something to do ;)
#ubuntu-artwork 2005-07-28
<woodwizzle> anyone seen fyre? http://fyre.navi.cx/ Its not in ubuntu at all, but there is a dpkg for it
<woodwizzle> i've been playing with it, its very cool even though I'm not sure what I'm doing =)
<megabyte405> yeah, it's pretty slick
<GonzO333> Hello?
<lukacu> hello
<GonzO333> Hi.  I'm Gonzo, I live in New Orleans.  I've been emailing with Andy about the Humility Icon theme
<GonzO333> He told me to come here to coordinate work.
<lukacu> :)
<GonzO333> I've been doing icon Clean Ups... Is there a place to submit stuff?  I have the Apps and Devices all ported down to 48, 24, 22, and 16, and am working on Filesystem right now.
<lukacu> nice
<GonzO333> I am hoping (knocks on wood) to take out the remainder of the tarball (in terms of ports) by the end of this week, if the work I've done passes muster.
<GonzO333> And, I have what I've done available on my personal webspace.   I just wanted to know if there's a more "official" place to put all this.
<lukacu> we do not have web space of our own yet ... 
<lukacu> i think so
<lukacu> i think ogra can tell you more ...
<GonzO333> Ok
<GonzO333> Would you like link to current ports tarball?
<lukacu> yup
<GonzO333> http://www.worlord.com/misc/GonzO-Humility.tar.gz
<lukacu> thanks ... and something more:
<GonzO333> I _think_ I'm on the right track.  I'm using them as I port them, and the additions actually make a bigger difference than I thought.  
<GonzO333> OK
<lukacu> i have a link for you
<GonzO333> Awesome.  I lurve links.
<ogra> GonzO333, can you mal me a reminder, i'll care about updating the package next week...
<lukacu> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HumilityIcons
<ogra> GonzO333, ogra@ubuntu.com
<lukacu> Gonz0333: can you update status for the icons?
<GonzO333> On the wiki?
<lukacu> yup ...
<GonzO333> OK.  I'm on that, too.
<lukacu> thx
<GonzO333> I take it "completed" status = Icon and all ports are done, yes?
<lukacu> yes
<GonzO333> OK.  Question:
<lukacu> but they are not all correct
<GonzO333> I see.  So the ones that are essentially copies with different names actually need different icons?  Like the "hard drive" picture is used for Hard Disk, USB hard disk, etc...
<GonzO333> ...those would eventually need separate pictures?
<lukacu> hm ... something like that
<lukacu> GonzO333: no need to update the whole list (it si not even complete) ... just change the status of those you are or will be working on ... and those that are realy done 
<GonzO333> OK.  Is there a latest official package I can d/l?  I don't see "gnome-humility-icon-theme" in the package list anywhere...
<lukacu> hm ... i use this one: http://andy.fitzsimon.com.au/humility-icons.tar.bz2
<lukacu> :)
<GonzO333> Heh.  OK.  That's the one I've been using too.  :-)
<lukacu> i think there is a package in breezy repository ...
<ogra> yep, see topic ;)
<lukacu> but i am not using breezy ... so it is tar.bz2 for me ;)
<ogra> lukacu, the icon theme doesnt depend on anything... you can install it on hoary
<GonzO333> I don't see it in the repository... how strange.  Does the repo differ from the Tar.gz?
<lukacu> i don't see it either ...
<ogra> http://packages.ubuntu.com/breezy/gnome/gnome-humility-icon-theme
<GonzO333> Wow!  I didn't even know that link existed
<GonzO333> packages.ubuntu.com, I mean.
<lukacu> ogra, sorry for silly question but what do i do with this link? ... download the package or something else?
<ogra> download it to your home dir... open a terminal, type: sudo dpkg -i gnome-humility*.deb 
<ogra> and give your password...
<ogra> oh, and make sure the tar.gz/bz2 isnt installed ...
<lukacu> ok ... so remove the previous package and install this one ... no problem
<miketech> Hi
<lukacu> hi
<miketech> ah somebody awake :)
<lukacu> yup ... 23:00 in slovenia :)
<miketech> same in germany :)
#ubuntu-artwork 2005-07-29
<woodwizzle> Hello
<miketech> Hi woodwizzle 
<woodwizzle> Is humility only in breezy?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> http://packages.ubuntu.com/breezy/gnome/gnome-humility-icon-theme
<ogra> download it to your home dir... open a terminal, type: sudo dpkg -i gnome-humility*.deb 
<ogra> and give your password...
<ogra> oh, and make sure the tar.gz/bz2 isnt installed ...
<miketech> is eclipse in the ubuntu repos?
<miketech> (dont have ubuntu installed, but thinking about)
<ogra> its in breezy
<miketech> ah ok thanks
<miketech> is there a list of all packages inbreezy?
<ogra> (wich is unstable and shouldnt be used currently=
<ogra> )
<miketech> yeah i know, thanks
<dwarvenblade> im eating celery
<ogra> packages.ubuntu.com
<dwarvenblade> with peanut butter
<miketech> ah thanks
<dwarvenblade> its good
<dwarvenblade> why is it so good i wonder
<dwarvenblade> why isnt a tomato good with peanut butter
<lukacu> lol
<ogra> *shudder*
<miketech> oh cool ruby is in the ubuntu universe :)
<miketech> dont understand ubuntu. its so great organized
<woodwizzle> fyre isn't in ubuntu :(
<dwarvenblade> when will splashy be perfected?
<ogra> splashy is crap, we wont use it
<woodwizzle> I've been playing with it lately and it kicks ass though
<woodwizzle> whats splashy?
<woodwizzle> is that like usplash?
<dwarvenblade> ok when will there be a splash screen easy to put into ubuntu without bugs?
<ogra> usplash is the one we'll use :)
<dwarvenblade> is it good?
<lukacu> woodwizzle: yeah ... fyre is cool
<dwarvenblade> ive never tried splashy or usplash
<ogra> and its the job of the artwork team to design the animations for it i guess
<ogra> woodwizzle, put it on the UniverseCandidates wikipage, so MOTU gets aware of it
<ogra> (and probably packages it for universe)
<dwarvenblade> should i eat more celery?
<ogra> dwarvenblade, if you leave the tomatoes out :)
<lukacu> :)
<dwarvenblade> ok
<dwarvenblade> im having more
<dwarvenblade> its good
<dwarvenblade> but i wonder if the peanut butter dislikes being spread onto the celery?
<lukacu> um?
<ogra> dwarvenblade, what do you smoke ??
<dwarvenblade> ogra i don't smoke
<ogra> heh
<dwarvenblade> i just lost my mind
<dwarvenblade> i'm trying to find it again but its not in the peanut butter
<ogra> LOL
<dwarvenblade> perhaps it was in the celery
<ogra> grin
<dwarvenblade> I need to travel to the land of celery and discuss this with the celery creatures
<dwarvenblade> ok i discussed it with them they said use more peanut butter
<lukacu> lol ... he is smoking tomatoes
<ogra> go ahead then :)
<dwarvenblade> ok i will use more peanut butter
<dwarvenblade> i found it
<dwarvenblade> my mind was momentarily taken by the beasts of planet peanut
<dwarvenblade> but it has sprouted anew, I found a tiny space capsule vehicle of one of the peanut monsters and they apologised and said I could have my mind back
<ogra> what a journey :)
<dwarvenblade> now they are saying "your mind IS a peanut!"
<dwarvenblade> so I will have to research this
<ogra> google is your friend :)
<dwarvenblade> I thought my brain was bigger than that
<dwarvenblade> they say i must make a wallpaper for ubuntu of a piece of celery with peanut butter on it sitting on a plate overlooking a moon which drops down beneath a celestrial waterfall of stars, each running into each other 
<lukacu> well ... it's 1:25 am here ... time for some sleep ... good night
<dwarvenblade> good night
<dwarvenblade> good morning
<volvoguy_> howdy all. man, IRC is so much easier in Ubuntu than OS X. 
<volvoguy_> what's everybody working on?
<woodwizzle> I just finished my first ubuntu background! =)
<woodwizzle> Isn't there a bounty or something for these? where would be the best place to show it off?
<woodwizzle> what do ya'll think: http://ubuntuforums.org/gallery/showimage.php?i=568&original=1&c=5
<volvoguy> looks good. maybe a hair too much compression though - the logo looks kinda splotchy.
<woodwizzle> hehe, well my desktop is rockin' the png =) I'll recompress it better next time. I think I want to tweak the fractal first.
<volvoguy> i like the fractal. is that what Fyre does? i've never heard of it. 
<woodwizzle> in fact, it might not be the compression thats the problem. Even the original has some aliased edges that I'm having trouble getting rid of
<woodwizzle> yeah, well a certain subset or certain type of fractals I think. I just found it last night and I don't really understand the math behind it, but it has an excellent GUI
<woodwizzle> http://fyre.navi.cx/
<volvoguy> which version of the logo are you using? you can import the svg version of the logo into the gimp.
<woodwizzle> I used the PNG and then scaled it down. I don't think the svg would make a difference unless I was scaling up. I can try it though
<volvoguy> might be worth a try if nothing else works. at least it has a transparent background and can be scaled to your desired size when you import it.
<woodwizzle> the png is alpha transparent too
<volvoguy> yes, but pixels that get antialiased weird when resized. :)
<woodwizzle> true, but I was careful to maintain aspect ratio and to use floating point precesion. That usually helps
<volvoguy> i haven't checked, but it may only be an 8bit png too.
<woodwizzle> now that I look at it, the circles in the logo arn't quite circular anymore. They're a little chipped of the top
<volvoguy> fyre looks cool. based on the quartz composer in OS X Tiger (which is pretty fun to play with).
<woodwizzle> yeah, i've never seen that though. They're site didn't even have screenshots, and I don't really have access to a mac I can install software on
<woodwizzle> s/They're/Their
<woodwizzle> Does Quartz support animation?
<volvoguy> yeah. the quartz composer can be used to do all kinds of stuff. i think you can even make animated screensavers out of it. 
<woodwizzle> wow
<volvoguy> yeah. pretty slick. more aimed at developers though. my photoshop/illustrator trained brain couldn't quite figure everything out.
<woodwizzle> hmmm. what kinda applications would developers use something like that for? (besides of course, screensavers =)
<volvoguy> not sure. it's installed with the developers tools though.
<woodwizzle> fyre has a kinda neat click and drag interface to all the math values so you can really just sit around and play with it even if you don't understand it.
<woodwizzle> I'm starting to get a little bit of a hold on it now
<volvoguy> cool. the fractal you did is really smooth. i'm looking forward to having our own art site to upload stuff. 
<woodwizzle> thanks!
<woodwizzle> do you mean something like art.gnome.org but just for ubuntu? That would be nice!
<volvoguy> i missed the first round of [adult swim] , so i'll be heading to the couch and my iBook shortly. if i can find a decent IRC client i'll make you some screenshots of quartz composer.
<volvoguy> yep. we're just waiting for the hardware.
<volvoguy> it's going to be a repository for community artwork as well as our CVS server for internal artwork development.
<volvoguy> i have my first raid array building on this machine right now and it's really too sluggish to get any real work done anyway. doh!
<volvoguy> btw, has anyone seen Andrew in here lately? i'm starting to think he takes the weekends off. :)
<woodwizzle> sounds awesome. any ETA?
<volvoguy> on the server? well, Canonical told me a week three weeks ago. i think it's Mako's job and he's a pretty busy guy.
<woodwizzle> hehe, very true.
<woodwizzle> Are you gonna use the same codebase as art.gnome.org or kdelook or something totally new?
<volvoguy> interesting you should ask that. i was just talking to one of the art.gnome.org guys the other day and they're getting ready to do a major website update in the next few weeks.
<woodwizzle> didn't they just do a major website upgrade?!
<volvoguy> they're also working on a SOAP backend that would allow the various Linux art sites to kinda act like artwork repositories.
<volvoguy> yeah. i thought so too. i think this may be more of a backend change than a visual one, but i'm not sure.
<volvoguy> i'm hoping to get Ubuntu in on the SOAP stuff. we could then use the website and/or a GUI app to make our art (and those of the other sites involved) available universally.
<woodwizzle> It would be nice if the ubuntu site had that kinda backend, and was able to do something like kdefolks where you can open the change desktop background dialog and instantly download the new backgrounds
<volvoguy> well, there's an app out now called "gnome-art" that scrapes the art.gnome.org data and makes it available in a GUI where you can preview, download and apply different themes/icons/backgrounds.
<volvoguy> i think it's even written in python, so it could fit into ubuntu nicely.
<volvoguy> i have it installed on one of my machines, but i think it's in breezy's universe, so it's not widely known yet.
<volvoguy> ok. i'm a slacker, but my show's on, so i'm taking off. if i can find a decent IRC client for OS X, i'll join in again.
<woodwizzle> stupid router :P
<volvoguy> hehe.
<woodwizzle> I managed to improve my last effort quite a bit I think: http://ubuntuforums.org/gallery/showimage.php?i=569&c=5
<volvoguy> very cool.
<woodwizzle> thanks =)
<woodwizzle> I think I'm done for tonite though.
<woodwizzle> Later
<volvoguy> ok. later!
<miketech> good morning
<lukacu> hello miketech
<mpathy> hi there :)
<ogra> heh
<mpathy> finally I made it :)
<mpathy> PS: i managed to repair this ruby package.. I'll be a great maintainer *villain-laugh* :()
<ogra> :)
<ogra> tell i to #ubuntu-motu :)
<ogra> tieven
<ogra> it even 
<mpathy> ok..
<ogra> grrr
<ogra> i cant type today
<mpathy> no problem.. we dont have to vertieven it ;)
<ogra> heh
#ubuntu-artwork 2005-07-30
<volvoguy> howdy all.
<miketech> hi
<lukacu> hello
<miketech> hi
<lukacu> hi
#ubuntu-artwork 2005-07-31
<volvoguy> hey all. sorry about being a slacker over the weekend. lots of back pain (and therefore pain meds) kept me out most of the weekend.
<volvoguy> i'm just going to lurk for a few before i head to bed. since you guys seem to be the regulars, let me know if there are any bad times for a meeting in the coming week. we're still kinda waiting for our server, but we need to get a little organized on the icons and stuff. *enter lurk mode*
<ogra> volvoguy, look either at the topic of #ubuntu-meeting or at the Calendar wikipage if the time clashes with anything :)
<volvoguy> ogra, will do. :) even if it's busy, we can safely meet here now that it's being logged. 
<ogra> sure... 
<volvoguy> have you seen andrew lately? he's been missing in action for a few days now.
<ogra> just keep in mind that some of us will be in other meetings too :)
<ogra> nope, sadly not, i have some questions too
<volvoguy> oh. true. i didn't think about that kind of schedule conflict. i'll make sure we're all clear.
<volvoguy> ogra, was it you that started the wiki page for icon status? i was just curious (since i can't find andrew) how we're keeping that up to date.
<ogra> no idea, i havent started it...
<volvoguy> ok. i'll wait for andrew's return. 
<ogra> but its good to see the status moving on :)
<volvoguy> yeah, we need to get those icons done, but i haven't heard any status on them from andrew, so i'd hate to be duplicating work that's already done. once we figure out a good way to distribute the work, it shoudl go fast. 
<volvoguy> i think i'm going to head to bed. physical therapy kicked my butt today and i'm exhausted. talk to ya'll later! g'night. 
<mpathy> Hi :)
<mpathy> ogra: how good is the AMD64 thing working with ubuntu?
<ogra> amd64 thing ? 
<mpathy> ogra: i think about buying a new pc
<ogra> amd64 is great, fast and... 
<ogra> 64bit !!
<ogra> i love it
<ogra> but it has some drawbacks....
<mpathy> ogra: i heard about that it isnt so much mature in linux
<ogra> no flash plugin.... realplayer etc
<ogra> you have to live without the closed source stuff as long as the companys dont provide binarys for amd64
<ogra> its stable as ubuntu ;)
<ogra> as stable even
<mpathy> okay.. and will 32bit packages work?
<ogra> nope... only in a chroot 
<mpathy> ogra: but are all packages in ubuntu, even universe and multiverse, in all architectures?
<ogra> nearly
<mpathy> where i can look for the differences?
#ubuntu-artwork 2006-07-24
<Guitarhero> ttf if possible
<Guitarhero> im working in windows till i can buy 100ft of ethernet cable
<Viper550> Where's the topic?
<Viper550> I got some new Splash Screen proposals ready
<Viper550> Hello everyone
<Guitarhero> Hey im lookin for some feedback on a desktop wallpaper i started
<Guitarhero> http://img71.imageshack.us/img71/4830/ubuntulogooi2.png
<Guitarhero> I just dont know what to do with the background, not sure if something complicated would ruin it
<Guitarhero> anyone?
* mhb is sleeping ... and not an artist
<Who_> troy_s: just thought I'd say
<Who_> troy_s: (are you there?)
<Who_> right, I'm off to bed
<kwwii> hi
<mhb> good afternoon
<klepas> moin
<Seveas> troy_s, around?
<troy_s> seveas
<troy_s> for a second
<troy_s> you there?
<troy_s> sup?
<Seveas> I was wondering about usplash
<troy_s> i'm the wrong guy.  frank has been liasing with scott i think
<troy_s> it's scotts baby
<troy_s> it would be nice to get more information though...
<troy_s> Can you post a good question to the list for Frank to wiki and answer?
<Seveas> I can give you the info, I'm just wondering about the art ;)
<troy_s> oh crappers
<troy_s> um...
<troy_s> shoot me the specs and such via email and i'll wiki
<Seveas> ok
<troy_s> great
<troy_s> thanks a mill
<troy_s> that would be very very helpful
<troy_s> especially offsets and such.
<troy_s> you wouldn't happen to know the GDM splash offsets for the icon placement off hand would you?
<Seveas> no
<troy_s> it is very difficult to create art when you are guessing
<troy_s> any idea who might or how hard it would be to find out?
<troy_s> its a code check
<Seveas> well with usplash-ng, artists get to set the offsets etc
<troy_s> next gen?!  LOL
<troy_s> they should call it usplash-nt
<troy_s> lol
<troy_s> awsome
<Seveas> Well, *I* call it -ng but that;s not its real name
<troy_s> so i must bolt to work here, not being trite...
<Seveas> In reality my patches that caused this to happen only caused a version number bump ;)
<troy_s> but if you could A) email me with all of your knowledge
<mhb> I wonder ... will there someday be more colours in usplash?
<troy_s> mhb -- complain to nvidia and ati
<Seveas> mhb, not anytime soon
<troy_s> thats the root of the evil.
<Seveas> troy_s, shall I simply mail ubuntu-art@?
<troy_s> you could do that too... i'll wiki the thing because there aren't too many folks who have really gotten the hang of the paper trail yet...
<troy_s> who_ is very good now.  as is jmak, and weidel...
<troy_s> its coming along :)
<troy_s> see if you can drop a knock on someone who knows the logon splash offsets too
<troy_s> that would help immensely
* troy_s is out.
<Viper550> I just added my contact sheet for the Splash Screen design...
#ubuntu-artwork 2006-07-25
<Who_> hi all
<Who_> can someone help me with some drawing in Inkscape
<Who_> I am trying to draw some liquid...
<Who_> anyone know how to use the 'mask' feature in inkscape?
<Who_> I want to use it like Gimp's mask
<troy_s> who_
<Who_> hi troy_s:
<troy_s> you need to learn layers bor
<troy_s> bro
<troy_s> that was a brutal svg :)
<troy_s> and what mask feature are you trying to use?
<Who_> I got the mask feature ok (in Inkscape)
<Who_> ...tell me more about layers - as I was doing it I kept thinking 'I wonder if layers would mean I could select things more easily'
<Who_> or 'I guess this background stuff should all be on one layer' :P
<Who_> but it didn't seem to happen :P
<Who_> I have been thinking for phrases relating to Blubuntu - I think technical, clean, scientific are some early indicators
<troy_s> are you providing some sort of output for the request?
<Who_> Well, I was going to use the human buttons in website colours....
<Who_> not tonight though, I have been Blubuntuing tonight and now it is very close to bed time
<troy_s> eek
<troy_s> it would be nice to demonstrate some of our professionalism by providing at least a potential starting point in svg
<Who_> oh, yea, I was going to use svg - just the style from the human theme
<Who_> I have been working on the hardest SVG I've ever done tonight
<troy_s> eeke
<troy_s> doesn't sound too proposaly there Who_...
<Who_> it is for Blubuntu - I need to know if I could do a paticular effect
<Who_> troy_s: I sort of can :)
<Who_> troy_s; and I am a bit 'proposaled out' since the lsplashes
<Who_> (don't worry, I will certainly do much more proposing - I just need a quick break :P)
<troy_s> LOL
<Who_> troy_s: using masks you can make some _funky_ gradients in inkscape
<Who_> it has come along so much recently
<Who_> suspiciously close to Xara's release
<Who_> hi Viper
<Viper550> Hello...
<Viper550> I'm trying to take Tropic in a new direction...away from the Green scheme and off to a pure Orange look
<troy_s> Lord.
<troy_s> Viper... think.
<troy_s> Take a week.  Think about it.
<troy_s> Hrm.. version .44 Who_ ?
<Who_> troy_s: yea
<Viper550> I made that decision way before I said that...
<troy_s> what is the font that looks like the ubuntu
<Viper550> ubuntu-title-font
<troy_s> font but plus the tails.
<Who_> ubuntu title
<Viper550> Well, I was close, ubuntu-title
<Who_> troy_s: try applying a linera gradient mask to a radial gradient
<Who_> it is very funky
<Who_> what are you playing with, troy_s
<troy_s> hrm...
<troy_s> i am trying to pound out exactly three VERY loose button variants.
<troy_s> then i am going to post an activism post to the damn list
<troy_s> because having the documentation team ask for help
<troy_s> and have zero replies is just plain
<troy_s> shoddy
<troy_s> how do i make an inverse mask who?
<Who_> what do you mean by inverse?
<Who_> do you want me to do some buttons quickly
<Who_> ?
<troy_s> i would love it if you could...
<Who_> a mask that inverts things?
<troy_s> you and i can stick on three each
<troy_s> VERY loose
<Who_> we'll call them 3 AM buttons :P
<troy_s> and simply state that they are very loose and pick a direction and we will finish em
<troy_s> VERY loose :)
<troy_s> i just got off work
<troy_s> bloody hell.
<troy_s> inverse
<Who_> okay, what do yours look like?
<troy_s> meaning imagine i have a rounded rectangle
<troy_s> mine are rounded rectangle
<troy_s> basically
<troy_s> with a gloss hit on top
<troy_s> and maybe a who hill stripe
<troy_s> with a grad.
<Who_> okay, that's what mine werer going to be like :P - just like the Human buttons
<troy_s> like i said, damn loose...
<troy_s> but then i will try to give three simple directions
<troy_s> yeah
<troy_s> something like that...
<troy_s> try it
<Who_> okay, well, I'll try some other things quickly
<Who_> I'm going to adapt my lozenge
<Viper550> Guess what, I've got a screenshot of the next build of Tropic on the wiki page now.
<Who_> link?
<Viper550> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Tropic
<Viper550> I assumed for a moment that you already knew...but, just in case you forgot
<Who_> Viper550, have you thought about some of the other elements of your theme - remember Mark made it clear that completeness would me a major factor when it came to decifing what would be included
<Viper550> Yes, I have, I'm going to adapt one of my splash screen propositions for the splash screen, and I've got a pretty nice wallpaper ready for it too
<troy_s> Who_, let me remind you on how to do a quick cutout later okie?
* troy_s is playing with his daughter.  Back in a few.
<Who_> troy_s: hold on...you want me to remind you to show me a quick cutout...?
<Who_> to whoever is listening, I'd love an opinion on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Blubuntu/BlubuntuWallpaper
<Who_> the new mercury ones, specifically
<troy_s> yah
<troy_s> i'm here.
<troy_s> who_s
<troy_s> Who_,
<Who_> yea, troy_s
<troy_s> helmet's image is quite good.
<troy_s> your mercury blobs need to evolve a little... the gloss is starting though
<Who_> they took me ages
<troy_s> first, you need to liquify the blobs -- not just circle them
<Who_> I think helmets image is not likely to be a) available in larger sizes and b) free
<troy_s> second, you might want to put a chrome kick across them
<Who_> liquify?
<troy_s> (as a starting point (helmets)
<troy_s> uh... damn...
<troy_s> WE REALLY NEED  A WHITEBOARD APP!!!
<troy_s> is there an opensource whiteboard app????????????
<Who_> they are SVGs at the moment
<Who_> yea, true, we do!
<troy_s> i know, but i can't sketch here.
<troy_s> this blows.
<Who_> there must be a free whiteboard...
<troy_s> no kidding
<Who_> can you deskcribe?
<Who_> oh...you were suggesting I use Helmet's stuff to help me make the mercury blobs look more liquid....ye, great idea :) they are much easier to SVGise than some of the photos I got...
<Who_> though, if all the pictures of mercury I found are correct, mercury does normally end up in round bubbles
<troy_s> phew
<troy_s> got one.
<troy_s> no
<troy_s> i was saying helmet
<troy_s> was a good starting point for something possibly
<Who_> oh, okay
<troy_s> found a whiteboard
<Who_> rendering that in SVG would make me cry
<Who_> okie, link me
<troy_s> http://hem.fyristorg.com/matben/
<troy_s> looking into inkscapes... does it work?
<Who_> inkscape's what?
<troy_s> inkscape has a collaboration mode
<troy_s> but i don't think it is finished
<troy_s> downloading the sourceball.
<troy_s> cvs checkout happening now
<troy_s> this blows
<troy_s> how do you get the inkscape whiteboard working???
<troy_s> Who_,  you there?
<Who_> troy_s: yea, here, but never used inkscape whiteboard....
<Who_> perhpas just use something like
<Who_> http://www.imaginationcubed.com/LaunchPage
<troy_s> well inkscape has inkboard
<troy_s> google for it...
<troy_s> its a plugin
<troy_s> and i am a 64bit dual core
<troy_s> no flash
<Who_> it is 4AM here now - I really need to go to bed
<Who_> can we resume tomorrow
<Who_> I will have to submit those buttons in the morning (I have 1 now, but it is oh, so simple
<troy_s> yep
<troy_s> laf.
<troy_s> morrow... i'll look into inkboard
<Who_> just sent some buttons
<Who_> night
* mode/#ubuntu-artwork [+o troy_s]  by ChanServ
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-artwork:troy_s] : Welcome!  Start @ http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork -=-=- IRC logs @ http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs -=-=- Current tasks for Edgy at http://www.launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-art/+specs
* mode/#ubuntu-artwork [-o troy_s]  by troy_s
<mhb> hi everyone
<Viper550> Hello everyone
<kwwii> howdy Viper550
<Viper550> I was tweaking Tropic just right now, wanna see?
<Viper550> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Tropic
<kwwii> looking better and better
<kwwii> I'm off now...bbl
<Viper550> Hello
<newz2000> there's something anoying me about Ubuntu/Gnome compared to windows...
<newz2000> its within the power of the art-team to affect it.
<kwwii> re
<newz2000> the amount of lost screen real estate lost on gnome/ubuntu compared to windows
<newz2000> Should I make a spec or should I send a msg to the mailing list first?
<kwwii> newz2000: screen real estate lost through what?
<newz2000> slightly larger chrome and tool bars
<kwwii> you mean window deco and tool bar size?
<newz2000> yes. http://people.ubuntu.com/~mnuzum/tmp/window-chrome.png
<kwwii> I think if you look at that pic closely you will see more than losing screen real estate
<kwwii> they use theirs more efficiently
<kwwii> the panel is much smaller and better spaced
<kwwii> while the window corners (the dragable area) is much bigger
<newz2000> they is Windows, right?
<kwwii> yepp
<kwwii> hehe, who "they" is for a kde user is kinda hard to decide, eh?
<kwwii> :-)
<newz2000> yes.
<kwwii> lol
<newz2000> Its been tricky to describe... I bought a new laptop when I came to canonical and lost my old one from my previous employer...
<newz2000> I went down from 1920x1400 to 1280x800.
<kwwii> if you did the same with kde I bet you would get even worse results
<newz2000> So it was quite a change. But still, it feels cluttered and cramped.
<newz2000> I've not used KDE for a while so can't comment much.
<kwwii> believe me, gnome does better in this respect
<kwwii> yeah, I moved from a bigger laptop when working for suse to a smaller one afterwards as well
<newz2000> Oh, you worked for Suse?
<kwwii> and it took me a while to get used to it, I kept changing the panel size/hiding, font size, etc.
<kwwii> I did all the suse graphics for 7 years :-)
<newz2000> That's cool. Why'd you leave?
<kwwii> the decision not to support and develop kde anymore
<newz2000> Ah. When Novel/Ximian took over.
<newz2000> I hadn't heard that Suse officially abandoned KDE. I figured it would happen though.
<kwwii> well, it is pretty much unofficial but it already happened
<kwwii> the thing is this: lots of suse employees wok on it on the side anyway
<newz2000> Do you still work for Suse?
<kwwii> nope, although novell offered me a contract to make their website design I turned it down
<newz2000> oh too bad. They need it.
<kwwii> suse is dead for me
<kwwii> hehe, I made the opensuse site, and I know exactly what kind of shit is involved in it
<kwwii> better to stay out of that mess (although you can earn a lot of money)
<kwwii> the whole team who makes their website is now an external company
<kwwii> they fired them all
<kwwii> and they made their own company
<kwwii> and then novell paid even more to hire that company to do the work
<newz2000> classic
<newz2000> :D
<kwwii> and the same thing almost happened to me, but I decided to take a step away
<newz2000> Not to rub salt in the wound, Are there any other major desktops besides Kubuntu that ship with KDE as the default now?
<kwwii> linspire and xandros are the two "big" ones that come to mind
<kwwii> mandriva of course
<kwwii> and lots of smaller ones
<kwwii> that is the major difference between gnome and kde today, I think
<kwwii> gnome is funded by a few really big companies
<kwwii> and kde is funded by a lot of small companies
<newz2000> Yeah
<kwwii> kde sees that as a strength not a weakness
<newz2000> I wish we could pick the best from both of them.
<newz2000> I'd rather code for KDE and I think it has better eye candy, but I think gnome is more usable.
<kwwii> in the end, to be really honest, what is good for one is often good for the other (at least in the long run)
<newz2000> I just hate glib though.
<kwwii> there really is only one linux desktop
<kwwii> kde and gnome are part of both of them
<kwwii> hehe, "are both part of it"
<kwwii> let's talk about gnome and kde in 50 years and I bet we will all have a good lauch
<kwwii> laugh
<newz2000> yeah
<newz2000> So is the proper protocol to create a spec first or to discuss issues on the ml first?
<newz2000> (back to the chrome thing)
<kwwii> hrm, good question
<kwwii> perhaps make a bug
<kwwii> and then a spec to improve on it
<kwwii> or a wiki page describing the problem
<kwwii> and a spec to iimprove it
<newz2000> Ah. That's probably a good place to start
<newz2000> That sounds like a good plan
<kwwii> I guess the problem is really in the theme makers hands
<kwwii> and perhaps a bit of developement
<newz2000> I wasn't sure about who can fix it... since we're doing new themes I thought it would be good to suggest here.
<kwwii> definitely
<kwwii> things like the window borders are all up to the theme
<kwwii> the panel size setting is up to a developer settings, etc, as is the font size, etc.
<newz2000> Hmm... bummer. Thats where the most space is lost.
<kwwii> yepp, in kde we have the opposite problem
<kwwii> jonathan made the size so small per defualt that on some systems it cuts off the bottom of the icons in the panel :p
<kwwii> he made the spacing 0 I think
<newz2000> No margin for error there
<kwwii> exactly
<kwwii> honestly, I like the kubuntu panel much better than the default kde panel, but it could still be a bit better
<newz2000> I've always felt like there was too much crammed into too little space on the kde panel.
<newz2000> Admittedly its been awhile since I've used it
<kwwii> the shitty arrows showing that an icon is a drawer in kde SUCK
<newz2000> Well, you are the art-team lead for kubuntu
<kwwii> hehe
<kwwii> yeah, but that is something that is being addressed in kde4
<mhb> kwwii: what icon exactly?
<mhb> kwwii: name?
<kwwii> mhb: not an icon, it is an overlay for a drawer
<kwwii> check the kmenu or the System Menu
<kwwii> those little arrows simply suck
<kwwii> I would rather make the icon more rectangular to show that it is a drawer graphically
<kwwii> anyone here know how to install java on ppc?
<newz2000> Good luck with that
<newz2000> did you try java.sun.com?
<mhb> 1~
<mhb> sorry
<kwwii> newz2000: hehe, I wanted to simply install it and keep writing my script
<kwwii> not work for an hour on figuring out how to install it
<newz2000> If you have multiverse you can install java using apt I think.
<kwwii> I have osx with all the stuff installed already...I'll write the script there and assume that those that run it have a working java installed
<kwwii> newz2000: apparently not on ppc
* newz2000 is not surprised
<kwwii> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<kwwii>   sun-java5-jre: Depends: sun-java5-bin (= 1.5.0-06-1) but it is not installable                                               or
<kwwii>                           ia32-sun-java5-bin (= 1.5.0-06-1) but it is not instal                                              lable
<kwwii> E: Broken packages
<kwwii> fscked up
<newz2000> if they have it at java.sun.com you just download, chmod +x java...bin and then ./java...bin
<newz2000> but I don't know if they have it there
<kwwii> too late, I already started editing it on the other machine
<kwwii> it is only a small change, so do not feel so bad
<kwwii> :-)
<kwwii> changing the render engine for the script
<newz2000> My feelings aren't hurt. I rarely use java
<newz2000> Well, I use eclipse a lot, but I rarely write java
<kwwii> I am only calling a class in a bash script, don't worry
<newz2000> xalan by chance?
<newz2000> oops
<newz2000> don't press ctrl+w
<kwwii> batik, acutally
<kwwii> actually
<kwwii> it seems to work, so far
<kwwii> it is nasty work on the console in osx
<kwwii> unless you have a decent setup of course
<kwwii> linux is so much better in that aspect
<kwwii> hehe, so now the script calls every svg in a singular java session
<kwwii> great
<kwwii> erm
<kwwii> this is getting beyond my interest level
<kwwii> hehe
<mhb> :o)
<kwwii> dude, are you good at shell scripting?
<kwwii> I could figure this out tomorrow, with time I guess, but tonight I am too worn out to worry
<kwwii> I will simply let the script run as is and be happy for now
<kwwii> check on the results, tweak the settings, etc
<kwwii> and worry about cpu usage tomorrow
<kwwii> erm, actually it is probably the disk hits that are worse than the cpu usage
<kwwii> read/write stuff loading and unloading
<mhb> :o))
<kwwii> you like seeing an artist fsck up his own script, eh?
<kwwii> :-)
<mhb> yay!
<kwwii> and to watch him dance around in chat like the next idiot on the street
<kwwii> :p
<mhb> it's better to let the anger come out of you :o)
<kwwii> well, other than the fact that it takes 10x as long to make the theme as before, batik is working great
<kwwii> might want to raise that to 100x
#ubuntu-artwork 2006-07-26
<newz2000> AndyFitz: Hi Andy
<AndyFitz> newz2000:  G'day Matthew
<newz2000> I recognize your name... are you involved with Inkscape?
<newz2000> guess I'll have to chat later... time to shut down. Catch you later all.
<troy_s> ping
<Madpilot> pong?
<Madpilot> it seems someone made a t-shirt using my Ubuntu Canada logo: http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e97/lophyte/Shirts/IMG_0176.jpg
<Viper550> Hello...
<troy_s> good work Madpilot!
<Viper550> Excuse me for a moment, what exactly did Madpilot do?
<Madpilot> it seems someone made a t-shirt using my Ubuntu Canada logo: http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e97/lophyte/Shirts/IMG_0176.jpg
<Viper550> Cute!
<Viper550> Anyone want a new build of Tropic?
<troy_s> who lives?
<mhb> hey everyone :o)
<mhb> I'm reading the opinions on digg right now...
<newz2000> Did you see this yet? http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/48
<newz2000> gotta go :-)
<Viper550> Hello everyone!
<Viper550> Hello everyone!
<Viper550> Anyone there?
#ubuntu-artwork 2006-07-27
<troy_s> howdy Madpilot
<Madpilot> hi troy_s
<troy_s> the press is a little ridiculous
<troy_s> as of a good month ago we had splinters of nothingness for a team
<imbrandon> moins fellas
<imbrandon> troy_s: give me a few more minutes for the stagin stuff
<imbrandon> you gonna be arround ?
<troy_s> yeah sure bro
<imbrandon> kk ;)
<imbrandon> lemme finish a few last things up
* imbrandon go's to grab some more coffee
<imbrandon> gonna be a long night but i'm gonna get this rollin TONIGHT if it kills me LOL
<troy_s> don't go too bananas
<imbrandon> hehe
<cbx33> Morning people
<cbx33> who deals with sound themes?
<bersace> nobody knows
<bersace> cbx33: https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-audio-art
* cbx33 is writing a sound theme :p
<cbx33> first looks at some very rough ideas
<cbx33> if anyone is interested, just shout
<Viper550> Hello
<kwwii> re
<kwwii> just updated some color variations on the bubble background ideas on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Kubuntu-Edgy-Ideas
<kwwii> in case anyone is interested
<mhb> good evening :o)
<TwinReverb> anyone using sodipodi? :D
<kwwii> why? inkscape is much better :-)
<TwinReverb> :( i'm just trying to learn how to use a scalable vector art program.  if there's a better one, i don't mind downloading it and trying it
<andreasn> TwinReverb: inkscape.org
<andreasn> TwinReverb: is was forked from sodipodi and is much better
<TwinReverb> thanx
<TwinReverb> why forked from sodipodi?
<kwwii> guess the authors of inkscape wanted to freedom to change things more rapidly/in the way they wanted by forking it
<TwinReverb> bleh
<TwinReverb> well let me ask: the crystalsvg icons, what program was used to make those?  i'm wanting to make an icon in the same sort of style
<andreasn> my guess is Adobe Illustrator, but you should be able to do it in Inkscape as well
<kwwii> TwinReverb: AI was used to make them
<kwwii> note that at that time inskscape was not half the program it is now
<TwinReverb> adobe illustrator?
<TwinReverb> ah
<kwwii> yepp
<TwinReverb> if inkscape is so good, why does it have so many dependencies?
<TwinReverb> i'm on my 2nd set thus far (slackware-current linux)
<kwwii> is the wiki slow as shit, or is it just me?
<TwinReverb> well i would say it's the wiki because the hotel wireless internet also sucks, but since i don't know the URL... :D
<kwwii> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Kubuntu-Edgy-Ideas
<kwwii> mhb: now the newest stuff is on the wiki as well
<kwwii> (although the wiki itself is pretty flaky atm)
#ubuntu-artwork 2006-07-28
<kwwii> re
<Viper550> Hello!
<kwwii> hehe, meeting now...shhhh
<Viper550> where?
<kwwii> sorry for not responding
<Viper550> I uploaded a tarball to the kubuntu-edgy-ideas page containing my new theme
<kwwii> Viper550: could you put the pics on there too, so we can see them without downloading them?
<Viper550> The pic is there
<troy_s> ping
<troy_s> who lives?
<troy_s> greetings _jason
<Viper550> Hello
<Viper550> Hello everyone
<Viper550> Anyone here?
<kwwii> I am
<Viper550> I'm loving that new style that was documented on the wiki, -1 looks awesome!
<newz2000> anyone know a way to find out what fonts you've installed that are not part of a distro?
<mhb> good evening
<kwwii> howdy mr mhb
<mhb> so, what are you up tu?
<mhb> to
<kwwii> not too much
<kwwii> kinda mellowing out tonight
<kwwii> you?
<mhb> me too
<mhb> I'm probably going to do more work at the weekend
<kwwii> yeah,
<kwwii> me too :-)
<mhb> kwwii: I've seen the wallpaper suggestions
<kwwii> what did you think?
<kwwii> the lag is you trying to decide how honest to be :p
<kwwii> lol
<mhb> kwwii: :o)
<mhb> kwwii: I liked more the non-bubbly things
<kwwii> don't worry about hurting my feelings
<kwwii> do you like the flower pic? as wallpaper, I mean?
<mhb> I'll check them all once more :o)
<mhb> well, the flower is nice, but maybe too bright
<mhb> I currently use the "world" background
<kwwii> so perhaps I should do more work on that
<mhb> and I think the bubbles look a bit "unnatural"
<kwwii> it fits much better with the current kde look
<mhb> kwwii: but I think more people should raise their voices
<mhb> kwwii: your decision should not be based solely on my opinions
<mhb> :o)
<kwwii> mhb: I think I will send an email to the list asking for ideas
<kwwii> note that I also discuss all of this with the kubuntu community in general
<mhb> where?
<mhb> that's great
<kwwii> but I want to ask for people to help contribute to the theme
<mhb> OK ... I get it :o)
<kwwii> the artwork community behind kubuntu needs to grow, and I need to sponsor that
<mhb> you work on the bubble theme and I'll try to do some modifications to the "world" bg
<kwwii> sounds cool :-)
<mhb> I agree ... we needmore people like you :o)
<kwwii> I should post the original map svg I found
<kwwii> someone pointed it out to me online
<kwwii> you?
<mhb> I don't remember
<mhb> but I liked it from the beginning
<kwwii> I will post some of the svgs and stuff (also from the kde3 bg, it has the same kinda idea)
<mhb> anyone has experience with running Photoshop under wine?
<mhb> (some lazy "artist" wants me to move his design proposal into CSS, but he offers me only a photoshop file)
<mhb> kwwii: kde3 had a world map as a bg?
<mhb> kwwii: wow ... I never noticed :o)
<kwwii> mhb: yepp, kde3 has a world pic (with alpha trans.)
<kwwii> and a wave at the bottom
<kwwii> kde3.5
<mhb> kwwii: I probably used only Kubuntu with KDE3+ :o)
<kwwii> http://bootsplash.org/earth_wave3.svg
<mhb> oh .o)
<mhb> I've seen only the wave, without the world
<kwwii> http://bootsplash.org/edgy3a.svg
<kwwii> but that is a bad version of the svg
<kwwii> the map slowly started to get fscked up as I worked on it
<mhb> kwwii: how come?
<kwwii> I guess it was the filter (negative multiply) that I used in Adobe Illustrator to make the colored countries transparent
<kwwii> it worked, kinda, in inkscape but it eventually fscked things up
<mhb> (I need to achieve some major goals and then ask for the Kubuntu membership ... I always feel like a plebeian around here :o)
<mhb> kwwii: so that is why some countries look lighter than others?
<kwwii> yepp, in the original AI version they all had different colors, and it was pretty nifty
<kwwii> I should update things
<mhb> I should get Illustrator :o)
<kwwii> to be honest, it still does some things better than any other tool I know
<mhb> kwwii: well, it's not the cheapest tool around, so it should be at least partially worth the money .o)
<kwwii> mhb: the funny thing, is that for a lot of people, who need to make money with it, it is
<kwwii> and everyone in the OS community gives it trouble
<mhb> kwwii: it is not the cheapest tool, definitely :o)
<kwwii> yet, it is still better in some ways, than any free tool available
<mhb> kwwii: I'll be happy when they will offer packages for Ubuntu. :o)
<kwwii> I mean, try to work with a printer
<kwwii> deal with CMYK stuff
<kwwii> and file formats
<kwwii> produce a decent eps in linux
<kwwii> I can understand the problems with proprietary file formats
<kwwii> anyway
<kwwii> eps should not be that hard
<kwwii> ok, the cmyk stuff still sucks
<kwwii> I could write a book about it :p
<mhb> :o)
<mhb> sorry, had a call :o)
<mhb> kwwii: I would be more than happy if they offered packages for Linux/Ubuntu
<mhb> kwwii: because now I'm forced either to use an emulator or to install an operating system I don't own (or like)
<kwwii> mhb: hell, I would even pay for them
<kwwii> honestly
<mhb> kwwii: if graphics earned me enough money I would pay for them, too.
<kwwii> hehe
<kwwii> well, it is what I do for a living
<mhb> kwwii: I know :o)
<kwwii> onscreen graphics, video and foto work
<mhb> kwwii: Canonical pays you?
<kwwii> mhb: I have a contract for 24 hours a week with them, yes
<mhb> kwwii: that's nice :o)
<kwwii> well, it ends in a few months
<kwwii> but the previous one was for 15 hours a week
<kwwii> who knows
<kwwii> I also have a few possibilities in the area, so I am not too worried about work
<mhb> kwwii: about the Adobe Suite stuff ... the thing I dislike is the "vicious circle" that ends at Windows OS
<mhb> kwwii: like what happened to me today -> artist makes a design for a webpage and saves it in .psd -> needs me to work with it -> no software for that on Ubuntu (I guess)
<mhb> kwwii: so I have to "borrow" some Adobe soft for a week and try to run it in wine or in vmware (and I have to "borrow" some XP with it)
<mhb> kwwii: OK, I'll stop whining now :o)
#ubuntu-artwork 2006-07-29
<kwwii> hehe, actually I only use adobe on mac
<kwwii> and to be honest, I used less than legal software before I made money with it
<kwwii> but once I made money with it, I knew I should pay for it
<kwwii> I mean, I am getting something out of it
<kwwii> money
<kwwii> and I do not need to update to the latest version like most people think
<kwwii> to be honest, the printing world is 2-3 versions behind everyone else
<kwwii> anyway, I await the day that I use inkscape and never use AI, someday soon it will happen
<kwwii> I use inkscape more and more
<mhb> that's great
<kwwii> the newest inkscape is pretty cool though
<kwwii> the biggest thing that I hate is not being able to offset a path
<kwwii> I mean, you can do it, but the results suck
<mhb> Illustrator can spit out valid SVGs?
<mhb> that can be viewed in some SVG viewer without errors?
<kwwii> yepp, illustrator can spit out valid svgs
<kwwii> anything that AI can make as SVG, batik can display
<kwwii> since years
<kwwii> I mean, they do expand the SVG set with their stuff
<kwwii> but it does work
<kwwii> and even if it is bullshit, the real features that AI has above any other editor are still there
<mhb> kwwii: if they will hire you as a "community consultant", please tell them about the Linux version :o)
<kwwii> who...Adobe? ...hire me? hehehe, I wish
<kwwii> :p
<mhb> :o)
<kwwii> time for sleep
<kwwii> see you all tomorrow
<mhb> ok
<mhb> goodnight
<kwwii> night
<Viper550> Are there any source SVGs of the new mockups?
<kwwii> Viper550: which ones? the kubuntu ones?
<kwwii> they are all SVGs
<Viper550> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/EdgyProposals/SetSample00
<kwwii> hehe, no idea
<Viper550> And I meant, the actual SVG images, not the contact sheets
<kwwii> guess not
<Viper550> Wondering why?
<kwwii> no idea
<Viper550> I'm going to try and establish a similar look for some of Tropic's artwork, but with a twist
<kwwii> ask the author
<kwwii> I was actually already going to sleep...see you tomorrow
<kwwii> late here
<Viper550> Okay, I live in EST if you wonder
<kwwii> hehe, CET here
<Viper550> night
<kwwii> in a week or so I will be in America though
<kwwii> going home on vacation
<kwwii> ok, night all
<Viper550> I'm going to start a page for actual Kubuntu proposals, not just Ideas like we have now
<mhb> Viper550: is there a reason why?
<mhb> Viper550: ideas kinda equals proposals
<mhb> +-
<Viper550> It wasn't actually under /EdgyProposals
<Viper550> It was actually a brainstorm page of sorts...
<Viper550> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/EdgyProposals/KubuntuProposals
<mhb> well, I think you should leave that to Ken
<Viper550> Hello!
<Gareth^> goodbye!
<Viper550> Hello everyone!
<Viper550> Is anyone here?
<troy_s> yes
<troy_s> sort of
<Viper550> I was looking at that Peace theme just right now
<Viper550> It's a bit different...
<troy_s> ?
<Viper550> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Peace
<fschoep> troy_s: ping
#ubuntu-artwork 2006-07-30
<Viper550> Hello!
<Madpilot> hi Viper550
<Viper550> Got the email about Tropic's release?
<Madpilot> yesterday or the day before, wasn't it?
<Viper550> Yeah, last night EST!
<Madpilot> hmm, I did read it
<Madpilot> sorry, Thursday thru Sunday is the busy middle of my working week, so I tend to hit the "next" button a lot in my email ;)
<Viper550> Like it? Please note, although it doesn't actually say it, the wallpaper actually packaged is slightly dimmer than shown in the screenshot
<Madpilot> OK, Fyre is seriously cool. It uses as much CPU time as it can get it's grubby paws on, though!
<Madpilot> I'm not sure what it's for - aside from "to look kind of cool" - but if someone likes it, they can adopt it and have the SVG too: http://www.warbard.ca/temp/Ubuntu-distorted1.png
<Gareth^> interesting Madpilot - I like the curves and how they look more like people's shoulders (and thus more humane)
<Madpilot> hadn't thought of it that way
<Madpilot> I saw some Fedora-inspired grafitti-like artwork and figured I'd see what the Ubuntu logo looks like with the same treatment
<Madpilot> http://mihmo.livejournal.com/30396.html
<Gareth^> ah yeah, I can see what you mean
<msikma> Arrgh
<msikma> I know that you guys want to keep the wiki cleaned up
<msikma> But seriously, I'm reading through backlogs of the artwork channel and a lot of wikipages I'm trying to look up no longer exist
<msikma> Also, Troy wikified some wallpaper suggestions for people who couldn't wikify them themselves, but mine isn't in there for some reason.
<msikma> Of course there is nobody active on the IRC channel to talk about it...
<msikma> Is there really not _anybody_ else active?
<mhb> hello to all respected art workers :o)
<HiddenWolf> Hey guys. I was wondering if we could see an ubuntu theme with facebrowser for edgy's GDM
<troy_s> kwwii you in?
<viper550> Well, I'm in at least
<troy_s> You are what?
<viper550> What? Never mind...
<troy_s> ?
<troy_s> Never mind?
<viper550> What do you mean by "You are what?"
<troy_s> You said 'you are in'
<troy_s> And I didn't quite understand what you meant.
<viper550> It was in response to "kwwii you in?". I'm just saying that I'm here too!
<troy_s> ahhhh... now I get it.
<HiddenWolf> Can we do something about https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-artwork/+bug/14630
<viper550> Well, my new Tropic GDM screen does have a face list
<troy_s> HiddenWolf, what do you mean?
<HiddenWolf> troy_s, there is an attachement of a theme
<HiddenWolf> troy_s, I for one really miss an ubuntu-themed face browser, which is what my parents are used to.
<troy_s> Yes, but it is unlikely to meet the Edgy development look/feel
<troy_s> Face browser has been brought up before, and if one is acceptable
<troy_s> I am pretty sure frank will include it.
<troy_s> But it will need to meet the Edgy default look
<troy_s> Which means that progress needs to be made on that end.
<HiddenWolf> I guess the guy that made it would be willing to make one if he's provided with feedback
<viper550> Just change the wallpaper
<viper550> In mine...sorry
<HiddenWolf> ;)
<viper550> It's based off this one: http://www.gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=41621
<troy_s> Yes, and bersace is the one who did it, so I am pretty sure it will be easy to get one up once we get the
<troy_s> look for edgy further towards the end of Production
<troy_s> many new faces in here... good to see.
<viper550> Why don't you just use my Tropic GDM?
<troy_s> Because it would be hodge podge and unprofessional.
<troy_s> Your tropic GDM is for tropic
<viper550> Well, with a different Wallpaper!
<troy_s> Well I haven't looked at it too closely, but defining professional is a little more than simply changing a wallpaper.
<troy_s> You have a link?
<viper550> Oh...
<viper550> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Tropic (inside the package is a tarball with it)
<viper550> I even modded it with one of those new Glossy logos we've been using alot
<troy_s> You have very bad screenshots...
<troy_s> A) you should screenshot each of the distinct elements and scale them all to the same size
<troy_s> look at bersace's outline in archives
<troy_s> it is very good.
<viper550> Why? It's not a contact sheet
<troy_s> Because it looks like nothing...
<troy_s> All I can really see is a window border and a scrollbar.
<viper550> So you want a full picture? Kinda like my KDE mockup?
<troy_s> It is about tying together all of the discreet elements... look at bersace's archive template
<viper550> where's that?
<troy_s> it is far superior to what you offer.  Right now, your 'theme' doesn't appear to do much.
<troy_s> probably in the archives section of artwork wiki :)
<viper550> Oh
<viper550> Those reviews of past looks
<troy_s> Right now, you have sixteen different images that all show _no_ continuity
<troy_s> In fact, calling it a theme is rather silly because each image you have right now is completely different.
<viper550> You mean you don't like the older screenshots?
<viper550> It's Called "Visual Release Notes", Evolution!
<troy_s> What does it look like?  What does the GDM look like?  What does the splash look like?  These are all questions that people will want to see.
<troy_s> Well where is your summary?
<troy_s> I am not going to install it to see it.
<troy_s> You need to make it easy for people to see what your look is.
<troy_s> Your screenshot of the GDM in your tarball is flawed as well...
<viper550> Okay, I'm going to do some restructuring, but putting the wallpaper on a 2nd page so it won't stretch out everything
<troy_s> 1) it looks completely unprofessional to simply scribble out the 'ubuntu'
<troy_s> scale it.
<troy_s> 2) it is simply a recolouring of jmak's work...
<troy_s> which is hardly polished.
<viper550> What?
<viper550> Recoloring of Jmac's work? I didn't get that from Jmac!
<troy_s> Sorry....
<troy_s> i meant jmak no?
<viper550> I designeded based off what is seen on the monitor in the Human icon theme
<viper550> I mean designed, sorry
<troy_s> Well you understand what I mean though?
<viper550> Yeah...
<troy_s> If you can't be bothered to take the time to take a good screenshot etc
<troy_s> it looks _very_ sloppy
<troy_s> and the chances of including something that sloppy is about nil.
<troy_s> further, i strongly encourage you to use bersace's archive template to show what the 'look' looks like at a glance
<troy_s> scale all of the images so that you can see a few of them on screen at once, etc.
<troy_s> make them look uniform.
<troy_s> etc
<viper550> Okay, as a placeholder for the new format, I'm currently working on a little temporary redesign, I'll kinda make a montage picture of all the elements...
<troy_s> well you are _always_ redesiging.
<viper550> Or, I'll think about that idea you just said
<viper550> Where can you get that GTK Preview program?
<troy_s> Widget factory
<viper550> No, not that one, the one in the archives, looks nicer!
<troy_s> take your time with it... no need to rush rush rush, the more you redesign, the less design there is.
<viper550> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Archives/4%2e10
<fschoep> troy_s: ping
<fschoep> troy_s: ping
<kwwii> re
#ubuntu-artwork 2007-07-25
<agentk> #ubuntu.hu
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#ubuntu-artwork 2007-07-26
<lapo> hi
<kwwii> lapo: if you check launchpad you'll see that I removed all gtk-* icons
<lapo> kwwii: cool, thanks, I'll check asap
<kwwii> for i in $(ls */*/gtk-*); do rm $i; done
<kwwii> :-)
<lapo> kwwii: you miss some sed love to makefiles then :-)
<kwwii> ouch, I am used to the newer simpler versions
<kwwii> I can do that really quick too
<kwwii> erm, there are no specific files listed in the makefiles, or?
<kwwii> achhhhh
<kwwii> now I see it
<lapo> Check Makefile.am
<kwwii> yeah, in the specific dirs
<kwwii> do you know if there were any gtk-* icons in any other dir than actions?
<kwwii> doesn't appear so
<lapo> no idea, grep is your friend :-)
<kwwii> I guess we can get rid of the 20x20 dirs too then
<kwwii> hrm, 24x24 too
<lapo> yes, that was hackish
<lapo> remember you'll have to chack configure.ac if you remove makefiles
<kwwii> hehe, I had forgotten that too
<kwwii> it should be done now
<lapo> kwwii: if it builds you're probably done
<kwwii> no idea...I'll leave that up to dholbach when he returns
<kwwii> ;-)
* kwwii has way too much to do atm
<lapo> busy with embedded stuff?
<kwwii> the mobile stuff, yeah...and now it seems I get to do ubuntu as well again
<kwwii> unless someone from the community steps up and does something nice
<lapo> if you write something official on the ml and advertize it a bit you'll surelly get a lot of contribution
<lapo> just try to avoid the fiasco as the last time community help was asked :-)
<kwwii> yeah, that is what I am afraid of
<kwwii> troy actually talked to mark and convinced him to put new stuff in for gutsy
<kwwii> but I haven't seen troy around for a long time
<lapo> troy is good at coordinating
<kwwii> I wish he would step up and try and get something done then
<lapo> troy_s: PING
<lapo> well, we'll see
<lapo> kwwii: I only hope to have a judge with an artistic eye for that stuff, dunno if you can get what I mean :-)
<kwwii> oh, I think that mark knows exactly what he wants, it just pisses everyone off that he has the final decision
<kwwii> then again, his nick is sabdfl
<lapo> yeah, no problem with that since I don't think I'll have time to contribute something other then some silly icon :-)
<kwwii> if you work for an agency the client always has the final say
<kwwii> hehe, icon themes are not silly
#ubuntu-artwork 2007-07-27
<troy_s> kwwii: Can you look to pushing that open folder icon from that web-page link (Orro's) and close that bloody bug once and for all?  Thanks friend.
<kwwii> troy_s: hrm, didn't see that bug
<kwwii> troy_s: erm, launchpad being what it is I cannot find that bug - can you give me a pointer?
#ubuntu-artwork 2007-07-28
<BHSPitMonkey> I love you all.
<nixternal> ahh, and we love you too!
<troy_s> freaks.
<coz_> any inkscape expert here? :)
<Linediconsine> HI ! Where I can find the fond of the ubuntu logo ?
<Linediconsine> the font
<Linediconsine> (I need to make a splash screen for the ubuntu media center project so I want to use.. if there is the ufficial font)
<Linediconsine> I found it http://packages.ubuntu.com/dapper/x11/ttf-ubuntu-title
#ubuntu-artwork 2007-07-29
<lapo> hi
#ubuntu-artwork 2008-07-21
<__mikem> actually after looking at the screenshot for SharpChocolate, its starting to grow on me
<__mikem> well how am I supposed to get this theme installed without him?
<xanax`> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/Kith_Intrepid
<xanax`> interesting top of window decoration..
<__mikem> that ones actually not bad
 * xanax` agrees
 * __mikem wishes compiz worked in vmware
 * xanax` uses virtualbox, not vmware.
<__mikem> vmware fusion actually performs much better than virtualbox
<xanax`> you have a mac ?
<__mikem> yes
<xanax`> enabling full 3D support to OS emulators is going to be a long task
<__mikem> I have a feeling its doable with current technology
 * xanax` is longing to test gdm-face-browser once it gets released
<__mikem> zerwas: why did you leave me hanging? :(
<zerwas> __mikem, sorry
<__mikem> its alright
<zerwas> __mikem, did you got it working? :)
<__mikem> I only got as far as adding those two lines to the source
<__mikem> you never told me how to get the theme
<zerwas> nice! almost done now. open system -> administration -> synaptic now.
<__mikem> okay
<zerwas> now the upper left button "reload" (or something like that)
<__mikem> reload was correct sir
<__mikem> okay, now what
<darkmatter> xanax`: the new gdm should go a long way to improving the efficiency of user switching among others. I really like the direction the devs are moving in
<zerwas> __mikem, good. now (according to this page https://launchpad.net/~kwwii/+archive) press "Search", enter "human" and click on "human-theme" to install it. do these steps for "gtk2-engines-murrine" and "ubuntu-artwork" too. Click on "Apply" now. You are done.
<xanax`> the new gdm ? you mean.. gdm 2 or .. ?
<darkmatter> the current recode. it was originally scheduled for 2.22 but was unfinished, and was thus deferred
 * xanax` is searching for new features of the latest version of gdm
<darkmatter> xanax`: it's the version that foresight and fedora use.. I'll grab a link
<darkmatter> xanax`: here ya go, complete with screenies http://www.ogmaciel.com/?p=478
<__mikem> zerwas: well I notice that there is some difference, but I still think you could do more
<xanax`> cool
<zerwas> __mikem, me?
<zerwas> __mikem, do you have it activated?
<__mikem> yes, I am using the newhuman theme right now
<zerwas> __mikem, me needed to use it for a couple of days to begin to like it ...
<__mikem> zerwas: it still doesn't live up to the standards of OSX and vista
<__mikem> its good but just not good enough in my oppinion
<zerwas> __mikem, agree.
<zerwas> __mikem, help cimi, he could really need a helping hand :>
<__mikem> zerwas: I did make some changes to the gelitan theme
<__mikem> but graphic design is not my strong suit
<xanax`> i think i'll have to test this version of gdm first before having a clear opinion.. these screenshots and comments aren't enough for a teaser.. imo
<zerwas> __mikem, i don't think working on gtk theme engines has soo much to do with graphic design. especially when it is known what it could/should look like
<__mikem> it'd be an interesting challange
<xanax`> bbl
<darkmatter> xanax`: if you want to test it you could always run a vm of sulfur (fedora 9) or install it on an extra partition. fedora already uses that version
<pwnguin> where does kwii live?
<zerwas> do you want to hug him?
<pwnguin> well
<zerwas> kwii? http://www.kwiisblog.com/d/
<zerwas> ;-)
<zerwas> oops looks like he is also german
<xanax`> hello
<psyke83> hi
<J-_> Someone might know the answer to my question(s). In gnome-appearance-settings, I go into customize a theme, but GTK themes have a question mark over the theme picture(or preview) and some themes change, and some don't. How can I fix this?
<zerwas> J-_, install the engine?
<kwwii> zerwas: good answer :-)
<kwwii> zerwas: btw, I am not german ;-)
<zerwas> kwwii, :) oh so i was on the wrong blog
<pwnguin> kwwii: nuts
<pwnguin> i was hoping i could send someone over to the one dudes house and help him set up an LP project for his theme
<kwwii> I do speak german though
<kwwii> pwnguin: I am sure that I can help set up an LP project
<pwnguin> kwwii: the kim guy seems anxious about it
<zerwas> kwwii, oh okay, so you moved to germany?
<kwwii> yes, almost 13 years ago
<pwnguin> i suggested on the ML that he set one up so that people like mike can share changes but he seemed to prefer his blog to host it
<kwwii> I guess that makes me germarican
<kwwii> pwnguin: I just caught up on emails today, I'll send Kim an email offering help
<pwnguin> k
<kwwii> I spent most of the day working on a good idea for a generic web browser icon
<pwnguin> uh oh
<pwnguin> why?
<kwwii> it is for our mobile solutions group
<pwnguin> so not firefox
<kwwii> can't really say more than that, contracts and all
<kwwii> but no worries, ubuntu will still have firefox
<kwwii> no iceweasel for us (thank god)
<pwnguin> the other day i came across them threatening branding over whos libnss we linked to
<pwnguin> we now link firefox to their own libnss and friends
<pwnguin> when people say they're a memory hog you can now agree via that point ;)
<kwwii> firefox(mozilla) seems to have very strict rules because of contracts that they have signed
<kwwii> makes things really nasty
<kwwii> apparently if you change *anything* in firefox without having them review it you are not allowed to call it firefox
<pwnguin> that part i know about
<pwnguin> but not the part where calling your changes firefox puts THEM in violation of contracts
<pwnguin> i dont even know how that works
<kwwii> and they apparently have contracts with companies which prevent them from even allowing small/intelligent changes in some cases
<pwnguin> iceweasel begins to sound appealing
<kwwii> I guess it is more the worry of law suits than the actual thing, but when you get as big as them that kind of stuff comes up
<kwwii> the idea of iceweasel is not bad but the name is simply stupid
<kwwii> it is like a 10 year old child thought of it
<pwnguin> worse than "hardy heron"?
<kwwii> lol
<kwwii> I cannot comment on that or it will put my job at risk
<kwwii> :p
<pwnguin> hhaha
<zerwas> hey it will get even better with intrepid ibex
<pwnguin> you could just refer to it as 8.04 in all communications
<kwwii> but then nobody would know what I am talking about :p
<kwwii> maybe I should though
<kwwii> I am not a big fan of the names
<kwwii> although it does offer a good incentive for art direction
<pwnguin> its supposed to be a development code name anyways
<kwwii> I am somewhat worried about always having to use an animal pic
<pwnguin> which we've done once
<pwnguin> in the entire history of code names
<kwwii> sure, but if we do it twice it is almost like saying we are always going to do it
<pwnguin> of course, its also the most wildly successfull background we have ;)
<kwwii> and the ibex pics all remind me of heavy metal / satanism
<kwwii> :p
<pwnguin> excellent
<kwwii> in the end we will probably use something like that again
<pwnguin> more proof we dont need a satanic edition
<zerwas> ha ha... but there is already a satanic ubutu edition
<kwwii> but I would really hesitate to do it three time
<pwnguin> anything that isnt christian is satanic, right? ;)
<kwwii> lol, right
<pwnguin> well, you could always use that concern as motivation this cycle or next to make something else
<kwwii> my biggest problem this cycle is that I go on vacation on Aug2-23 and I have all kinds of stuff to work on first
<kwwii> I've been working on a time zone map for the installer which is not based on funky arrows pointing to cities
<kwwii> but the file is so big that my 10" thinkpad core duo 1.8Ghz with 1GB of RAM simply makes it impossible to work on
<kwwii> I plug into my 23" monitor so I an at least see parts of it closer but I simply need a faster machine
<kwwii> *click* (wait a minute), *click* (wait a minute), repeat
<psyke83> kwwii, using gimp? I feel dirty to say this, but Photoshop would work a lot better with large images due to the caching
<psyke83> AFAIK, the CS2 tryout should work with WINE, you may want to try it
<kwwii> psyke83: nope, with inkscape
<psyke83> ah, k
<kwwii> psyke83: yeah, from what I have heard CS2 works in wine...been a while since I used adobe stuff though
<kwwii> it would probably handle the file better though
<kwwii> it refreshes the screen in a much more efficient method than inkscape (I had a long discussion about that)
<kwwii> it is nice to work at a company with two of the inkscape maintainers :-)
<psyke83> ;)
<kwwii> I've been running Ted's private branch and it has a couple of nifty extras
<kwwii> rgba support for all the dialogue windows
<kwwii> and such
<psyke83> kwwii, are you keeping rgba enabled in the themes for release, by the way?
<kwwii> psyke83: no, i am going to turn it off again
<kwwii> although until now we have not had any complaints
<kwwii> at least none that I am aware of
<kwwii> I am still somewhat worried about being responsible for the packaging
<kwwii> :D
<kwwii> oh well, time for sleep
<kwwii> night all
<zerwas> ye, good night
<psyke83> nite
#ubuntu-artwork 2008-07-22
<cody-somerville> nothlit, people seem to like your mouse :)
<thorwil> nand: hi! just saw the mail. unbelievable
<thorwil> nand: like dealing with drones in a company like ibm ;)
<kwwii> thorwil: ?
<thorwil> kwwii: a very late and not at all helpful reply from the trademark people
<kwwii> thorwil: ouch :-(
<thorwil> kwwii: btw and unrelated, if i get the trademark policy right, the ubuntu women logo would require permission, right?
<_MMA_> Just do it and let them worry about it. Usually if it's a community effort there's no problems.
<kwwii> thorwil: it would require permission if it has a modified ubuntu logo or uses the font for the whole text, yes
<thorwil> ok, ty
<_MMA_> kwwii: If it's community, I would forgo asking. There wouldn't be an issue.
<nand> hey!
<nand> she probably just copy pasted the same thing for the whole stack of email waiting for two months :s
<nand> I just hope we won't have to wait two more months for the reply...
<nand> these guidelines are even not clear :/
<_MMA_> The stuff on paper more (but not entirely) applies to commercial use. What I've said has come strait from the person that makes decisions. Asking won't hurt, but as long as it's "proper" use, it won't be an issue to just go ahead.
<nand> _MMA_: when we launched brainstorm in march, we got a last-minute troubles with trademarks concerning the logo, so that's why we are cautious this time
<thorwil> nand: i actually intend to just do that circle of friends derived trio. started yesterday to make 3d templates
<nand> cool!
<_MMA_> nand: np. Not knowing what it used to look like vs. not I don't know what to say.
<nand> _MMA_: finally it was left untouched
<thorwil> _MMA_: kwwii came to the rescue. what you see now is the original design
<_MMA_> I could see how that would be an issue. Though its silly. :(
<thorwil> _MMA_: welcome in the club! ;)
<nand> indeed :s
<kwwii> yeah, for the community stuff I would just do it
<kwwii> it is not like anyone is going to notice ;-)
#ubuntu-artwork 2008-07-23
<zachL> Hey
<zachL> Anyone around?
<cody-somerville> no
<zachL> That's rude...
<zachL> Someone else around?
<cody-somerville> no
<cody-somerville> :P
<zachL> Damn...
<zachL> Arkansas kid gets no love...
<zachL> Hey Cody... Know where I can change the sound that plays when loading the Ubuntu OS?
<cody-somerville> Yup
<cody-somerville> Are you running Ubuntu, Xubuntu, Kubuntu?
<zachL> Ubuntu Studio
<zachL> I am really looking for the directory... So, I can pull that file and check the run time.
<cody-somerville> You would change it in the login/gdm settings
<zachL> under system-preferences?
<kwwii> zachL: the file that is played is symbolicaly linked to a real file, just change that link
<zachL> gotcha...
<zachL> thanks
<kwwii> or you could use the gconf editor but that is almost like cheating :-)
<zachL> haha
<zachL> Well, who do I talk to about submitting a sound to ubuntu?/
<kwwii> me :-)
<zachL> excellent
<kwwii> my nick at ubuntu dot com
<zachL> e-mail address?
<zachL> just making sure :)
<_MMA_> zachL: A single sound or a whole theme?
<zachL> single sound... intro
<_MMA_> Or at least login/out.
<zachL> login.wav
<_MMA_> Does it fit the current feel?
<_MMA_> Does it work with the logout sound?
<zachL> I can submit both login and logout sounds...
<zachL> as for feel
<zachL> i dunno exactly how you want feel...
<kwwii> zachL: _MMA_ is right, it should be something which fits with the parts we have or replaces all or most of them as need be to make a coherent whole
<kwwii> the end goal is to have a nice sound theme which fits together
<zachL> of course
<zachL> but I do believe this will fit right in... let me do some audio editing and I will send you what i have
<_MMA_> You don't know how you feel music/sound? :)
<zachL> lol
<zachL> i meant
<zachL> feel OS sound
<_MMA_> There's no difference.
<_MMA_> Just as the art should evoke something, so should the sound. There's no difference in the thought that should go into it.
<zachL> MMA: You just have to hear it... I will check and see how well it integrates
<zachL> I understand completely... everything just mix together sounding as if it was a whole
<kwwii> zachL: feel free to send it to the ubuntu-art list as well
<kwwii> or anyone else who can test it
<zachL> alright... i just did not want it to be overlooked that's why i came here
<zachL> thanks for all your helps guys... and I will send those sounds within the next day or two
<zachL> helps haha thanks for the help
<kwwii> can't wait to hear your stuff
<zachL> awesome thanks
<kwwii> _MMA_: btw, which icon theme is -studio-intrepid supposed to use?
<_MMA_> kwwii: I cant remember if I set it.
<_MMA_> Could be some crack or UbuntuStudio.
<kwwii> :-)
<kwwii> here is something neat...rgba in inkscape!
<kwwii> http://sinecera.de/inkscape_rgba.png
<cody-somerville> So, can you guys do some artwork for Xubuntu? :P
<zachL> You asking me?
<zachL> ohh my bad
<zachL> i'll shut up now
<_MMA_> kwwii: Neat
<_MMA_> cody-somerville: If you come up with a particular design direction as to its look-n-feel, maybe.
<_MMA_> :P
<xanax`> hello
<miguelneco> hola
#ubuntu-artwork 2008-07-24
<ZachL> What wav format does an audio file have to be in order to play as login sound?
<ZachL> For Ubuntu..
<thorwil> nand, hi, cool!
<nand> thorwil: hey, yep, finally :)
 * thorwil waves to _MMA_ 
<_MMA_> yo yo.
<thorwil> so how do we feel about surpassing apple? ^^
<_MMA_> hahahahhahah
<thorwil> ah, that's the sign of confidence i want to see!!
<_MMA_> Honestly, not until we get things like Compiz working for everyone will that be a thought.
 * thorwil hopes steve jobs doesn't stumble over that thrown down gauntlet
<_MMA_> We can do better than we do, but it just ailt happening soon.
<_MMA_> *ain't
<_MMA_> Hi Neil.
<pwnguin> well, the zdnet article is mistaken
<pwnguin> apple doesn't look good becuase steve jobs is a good designer
<pwnguin> NeXT isn't exactly pretty
<pwnguin> macs look good because steve jobs knows his user base
<kwwii> mac looks good because they pay a company full of people to make it look good ;-)
<_MMA_> +1
<thorwil> kwwii, yes, but that's not all. otherwise vista would look good, too
<kwwii> lol, no doubt
<DanaG> Here's a skin I used in my XP VM (until the VM broke, and I didn't bother fixing it): http://www.wincustomize.com/zoom.aspx?skinid=5498&libid=1
<DanaG> I used the white-flag version.
<DanaG> New version: http://www.wincustomize.com/skins.aspx?skinid=4221&libid=1
<DanaG> And I use a nice bright orange theme when in Ubuntu.
<DanaG> Yesterday I installed OpenSUSE 11 in a VM... and I found the artwork to be .... not much.  As in, not much of anything -- mostly, it's just plain green.
<DanaG> Not even a logo on the bootsplash, in fact.
 * zerwas mostly agrees
<DanaG> The older versions with the spinny bootsplash were cooler -- and perhaps Ubuntu could do something similar.  I remember seeing a post about it on the mailing list.
<DanaG> dang, can't find the concept.
<DanaG> Oh yeah, and something about colored backgrounds for usplash: watch out for CRTs.  I know when I was using my CRT, I hated if it was bright at 60Hz.
<DanaG> Aah, here's one usplash concept: http://troy-sobotka.blogspot.com/2008/07/startup.html
#ubuntu-artwork 2008-07-25
<pwnguin> heh
<pwnguin> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/Newsplash
<zerwas> heh
<zerwas> MadsRH's idea is by far the coolest
<zerwas> pwnguin, don't you think so too?
<DanaG> where what?  I entered whatever conversation that was, way late.
<zerwas> i would love to make MadsRH idea real if i would know anything about the usplash things
<zerwas> looks like C knowledge is needed :(
<DanaG> can't say I know who MadRH is.
<pwnguin> zerwas: i do know C ;)
<zerwas> pwnguin, do it, do it! :>
<zerwas> with 8.10 i will think of you *every* time i boot my ubuntu :-P
<pwnguin> so which one was madRH?
<pwnguin> oh, that'll be a bit tricky
<pwnguin> afaik, there are some pretty brutal usplash limitations
<DanaG> Oh hey, if you want to see something random, try out any of the SuSE or OpenSUSE (even as far back as 9.3, I think) CDs...
<DanaG> boot it multiple times, and sometimes you'll get penguins.
<DanaG> And hit F8 and you'll get pixels marching around to make the chamelon.
<pwnguin> so what's the feeling on usplash vs splashy?
<zerwas> mh, will splashy substitute usplash with Ubuntu 8.10? (hope so)
<zerwas> pwnguin, i would love to help you with this where i can (like, packaging ore something that does not require coding)
<pwnguin> do you really package without coding?
<zerwas> tried a bit
<zerwas> ;)
<pwnguin> heh, if you really wanna help, collect boot splash videos from various OS's
<zerwas> pwnguin, okay, i have XP, Mac OS X 10.4, OpenSUSE 11 for the beginning. how would that help?
<DanaG> Hmm, opensuse 11 sucks.
<DanaG> Look at earlier ones.
<zerwas> okay, just read that Splashy won't make it before Kernel 2.6.27 :-(
 * DanaG wants fbsplash!
<pwnguin> what?
<pwnguin> i thought splashy was a userspace thing
<DanaG> google it -- it gives nifty console backgrounds.
<pwnguin> i know about fbsplash
<zerwas> pwnguin, i thought so too, but on ubuntuforums.org they say: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=477426&page=24
<DanaG> The countdown thingy on SuSE is nifty.... the circle in grub.
<pwnguin> oh, well if ubuntuforums says its true, then it must be false
<DanaG> heh, penguins.
<DanaG> http://www.pro-linux.de/berichte/jpgs/suse10/suse10-boot.jpg
<zerwas> have to write exam now
<pwnguin> oh
<pwnguin> zerwas: its about mode switching
<pwnguin> in kernel
<zerwas> pwnguin, huh? they are not talking about splashy? you are sure?
<zerwas> go one page backward
<pwnguin> they're talking about seemless mode switching in fedora
<pwnguin> redhat pays the most prolific kernel hacker to bring that kinda stuff into rawhide
<DanaG> Too bad I'll never be able to get native-res framebuffer on my current laptop.
<pwnguin> you know how there's a black screen between switching modes? the idea is to eliminate that
<pwnguin> and go straight from bootsplash to gdm
<pwnguin> DanaG: never?
<DanaG> Well, as long as nvidiafb doesn't get along with nvidia binaries...
<DanaG> Well, once nouveau gets good, then maybe it'll be possible.
<DanaG> My VESA BIOS does not have even any right-aspect-ratio modes... except for 640x400 (which is widescreen).
<DanaG> http://www.falkotimme.com/howtos/perfect_setup_suse9_3/images/15.jpg
<DanaG> that has a nifty spinny thing.
<pwnguin> ive used nouveau several times
<pwnguin> works okay for both my cards
<pwnguin> screenshots are worthless; we're after animations ;)
<DanaG> Anyway, the dots around the chameleon head change color, kinda' like the spinner in Firefox.
<davmor2> morning people.  My blog post about how non-devs can contribute seems to of attracted an artist do I just need to point them here or are there some wiki pages or what?
<davmor2> no probs found the wiki section in the end and passed it on :)
<thorwil> oops: http://www.humanrightsfirst.org/images/hrf/home_brand2.gif
<db92> pst, im looking for ubuntu hardy covers for a dvd case, know of any in existence? :/ ive been looking for a while but i cant find any
<zerwas> pwnguin, did you have a look at the usplash theming thing?
<pwnguin> i browsed the source a bit
<pwnguin> its kinda wierd
<pwnguin> probably because usplash runs at boot, where you might not have the full runtime libraries available
<zerwas> ye that's what i also thought
<pwnguin> basically, there's a bunch of functions in the libusplash
<zerwas> do you think the idea we saw in the wiki is possible?
<pwnguin> well, i think anything is possible
<pwnguin> how much of usplash would be left I can't say
<pwnguin> there's a bit of wierd OO there
<zerwas> hm
<pwnguin> where if your theme object has functions, they override the defaults
<pwnguin> but its all in C
 * _MMA_ is going to look at using Splashy for Studio. Easier to theme.
<pwnguin> you could probably write your own animation functions rather than use the built in bar render
<pwnguin> i read splashy uses XML
<pwnguin> so thats also kinda ~~
<_MMA_> No worse that GDM.
<pwnguin> if they havent thought of your idea, i imagine you're SoL
<zerwas> better than C :-P
<pwnguin> gdm is bad
<_MMA_> It's all relative.
<_MMA_> Anything I can look at and read is fine for me.
<pwnguin> but the layout is fairly restrictive, if i recall
<zerwas> But splashy is no alternative yet because it won't find it's way into intrepid as default
<pwnguin> zerwas: why not?
<_MMA_> zerwas: I can do what I want with Studio. ;)
<_MMA_> Fedora is also looking at Splashy.
<_MMA_> Or writing something from scratch.
<zerwas> pwnguin, hm due to the fact that kernel 2.6.27 won't be in intrepid?
<pwnguin> jesus
<pwnguin> do we have to go through that again?
<pwnguin> why does usplash depend on 2.6.27?
<_MMA_> ?
<_MMA_> s/usplash/splashy ?
<pwnguin> yes
<pwnguin> sorry
<_MMA_> Who says Splashy depends on any kernel? Link?
<pwnguin> _MMA_: check the irclogs for this channel
<pwnguin> from like yesterday
<_MMA_> You know the crackheads in here.
<_MMA_> Last mention of "splashy" I have in here is from April.
<pwnguin> thats why we have irclogs.ubuntu.com ;)
<_MMA_> So... link?
<zerwas> i just read it here: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=477426&page=24
<_MMA_> And it better be from someone with a shred of credibility.
<pwnguin> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/07/25/%23ubuntu-artwork.html
<zerwas> sorry, i was busy making tea
<_MMA_> pwnguin: Ahh... Nice. New modsetting options.
<_MMA_> Cool.
<pwnguin> eventually
<zerwas> i also asked about intrepid+splashy-by-default in #ubuntu+1 and got: "RAOF Does splashy now do the things that it didn't do when we first chose to write usplash? (Such as work on !IA32, not break resume-from-suspend, etc)"
<pwnguin> heh
<pwnguin> now those are valid reasons
<pwnguin> and i kinda wish there was a good way to document these sorts of blockers
<_MMA_> Yep. All valid reasons. But you can bet if RH is paying someone to do it it gonna work out for everyone.
<zerwas> The question is if it will be finished til feature freeze for intrepid
<pwnguin> _MMA_: packagekit is done by a redhat hire...
<_MMA_> zerwas: Who's that question for? If it's not, it's not. Simple. Usplash 'till Splashy is ready. Simple.
<pwnguin> _MMA_: well, if you want to write a boot theme for intrepid it matters
<pwnguin> if you want to write a boot theme for splashy, maybe not
<_MMA_> Ok. I just see it as an odd question. For the general public, sure. It's a bummer. For Ubuntu... oh well. :)
<pwnguin> well, i think you have that backwards
<pwnguin> the general public, who cares
<pwnguin> for the guy writing a theme he wants to see in ubuntu and get recognition for, its important
<_MMA_> Thats the general public.
<_MMA_> There's only 2 people "the guy".
<_MMA_> Mark and Ken.
<pwnguin> what?
<_MMA_> *people who can be..
<pwnguin> maybe I misunderstood something fundamental to the artwork team
<pwnguin> Mark and Ken are Ubuntu and the rest of us can deal?
<_MMA_> As far as the art goes, yes. To a degree. Since they are ultimately the ones who decide what's default.
<pwnguin> cuz if that's how it is, i got other stuff I can do; patch up cellwriter or file some wacom bugs with upstream
<pwnguin> sure, they're the vote on default, but they can't make splashy work by sheer force of will
<pwnguin> anyways, this is coming down to silly semantics
<_MMA_> No. Im saying if its not ready for intrepid, they aren't sweating it.
<_MMA_> Whereas the "general public" will be pissed its not in Intrepid.
<pwnguin> your false dictomy of "general public" versus "ubuntu" needs a third category
<_MMA_> For you it might.
<_MMA_> If something simply isnt ready, nobody who has power to put things in by default is losing sleep.
<zerwas> don't forget that mark just has said how really important the look of ubuntu is and the task is now to even beat apples art
<_MMA_> And whether Spashy is ready for default is the issue. If its not, it's unimportant to Mark and Ken.
<pwnguin> I doubt that; if some genius decides to write an awesome splashy theme, having to veto it because awesome hardware support trumps awesome art will be a tough choice
<_MMA_> hahahaha Don't get me started on that. :P
 * DanaG can't even get native-resolution framebuffer.
<DanaG> How do you tell usplash to use the fake-widescreen theme instead of the 4:3 theme?
<_MMA_> pwnguin: A genius themer can do all they want. If the underlying tech isnt ready, it matters not.
<DanaG> If my framebuffer is 1024x768 stretched to widescreen.... it makes circular things non-circular.
<_MMA_> DanaG: AFAIK it won't support anything but 4:3 atm.
<pwnguin> granted, compiz was pressed into service a bit early
 * _MMA_ agrees.
<DanaG> I know, but there are pre-squished fake-widescreen usplash themes...
<pwnguin> but i thought we had safeguards in place to make sure compiz didn't break things that used to work?
<DanaG> and I just don't know how to force usplash to use them.
<_MMA_> DanaG: Lemmie see if I can find something for you. 1 sec.
<_MMA_> http://www.getdeb.net/app.php?name=usplash-switcher
<DanaG> I've currently set usplash.conf for 1024x853, which is 1024 * (4/3 ) / (16/10)
<_MMA_> It's on GetDeb but the original Usplash creator wrote that tool.
<DanaG> Well, the issue is, it's not a different .so file; it's a different resolution part in the same .so theme.
<_MMA_> DanaG: Searching the art list should also show you the manual commands that the app invokes.
<_MMA_> Well what is the resolution you're trying to use?
<_MMA_> Your FB also has to support it.
<_MMA_> Mine wont do over 1024x768 vga=792
<DanaG> The point is this: native res is widescreen (1440x900), but the highest res VESA mode is 1024x768.... and I can't turn off stretching.
<DanaG> So, I need to force usplash to anti-stretch the thing, so it'll look correct when stretched.
<_MMA_> I dont think that's possible unless you edit the source theme and recompile.
<DanaG> The only true widescreen framebuffer mode I have.... is 640x400.
<_MMA_> There was talk of making usplash-theme-ubuntu-widescreen packages to get around all this crazyness.
<_MMA_> But even that would be a manual thing after install.
<DanaG> Same with my math hack.
<DanaG> Pre-stretch it vertically so it looks correct when stretched horizontally.
 * DanaG hopes ATI 3-series cards will support native-res framebuffer... either through VBE modes, or through radeonfb.
<_MMA_> Later people. Time for the fam.
#ubuntu-artwork 2008-07-26
<pwnguin> lol https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/Dream_Wallpaper?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=wallbio8.jpg
 * DanaG gags
<pwnguin> reminds me of the XP desktop
<pwnguin> i wonder if that was stock art
<DanaG> The only grassy-hill wallpaper I've ever used is "Dark Bliss" from here.
<DanaG> http://www.zeroingin.net/skins/
<DanaG> When in Windows, of course.
<pwnguin> so ive been talking with one of the guys who did some work on the default hardy wallpaper
<pwnguin> i havent followed -artwork for long -- do we know he feels a bit snubbed?
<thorwil> pwnguin: do you mean the original author?
<pwnguin> well, troy
<pwnguin> i donno about ash
<thorwil> oh, him ^^
<pwnguin> ash seemed happy enough to make another one for intrepid
<thorwil> pwnguin: i was under the impression he just had enough of the list
<pwnguin> who?
<thorwil> and apparently also this channel
<thorwil> troy
<pwnguin> you know about when that happend?
<thorwil> can't put a date on it
<pwnguin> im kinda curious what happened and whether he's merely insufferable or justified in it
<thorwil> pwnguin: he makes some valid points, but there's not much point in reiterating them to the same limited audience again and again
<pwnguin> heh
<pwnguin> he seems more willing to blame what happened on shuttleworth and canonical than say a lack of direction or dissent from the original author
<thorwil> not sure about that
<pwnguin> what i mean is, the original forms to the heron had a few "humans" lying about
<thorwil> pwnguin: actually, he lists that wallpaper as the one thing gotten right on his blog
<pwnguin> does he?
<pwnguin> i thought he hated how it went
<thorwil> wasn't happy with the repetition, yes
<pwnguin> repitition?
<pwnguin> bluh
<thorwil> the heron in the background again
<pwnguin> oh, well thats sasuage
<pwnguin> anyways, i know its a bit dangerous to rely on one persons history of the events
<thorwil> pwnguin: http://troy-sobotka.blogspot.com/2008/07/dear-mr-shuttleworth.html
<thorwil> look at "I'd answer that question with a single resounding "YES". It was one decision. It was all about a bird." ...
<thorwil> pwnguin: i think that story is a good example of some problems you get when different people edit some artwork
 * DanaG accidentally detaches Mark Shuttleworth's head.
<DanaG> Oops.  You forgot to group it.
<DanaG> =Ã¾
<pwnguin> ive seen the open letter to shuttleworth
<pwnguin> it's kinda abrasive
<thorwil> good thing voodoo doesn't work (like that)
<pwnguin> which i guess is how some artists work
<thorwil> well, if being all subtle ore even just diplomatic doesn't work ...
<pwnguin> you can scream all you want in space
<pwnguin> and thats where troy seems to have run off to
<thorwil> pwnguin: go tell him ;)
<pwnguin> it wouldn't be diplomatic
<pwnguin> besides, im post #2 on that entry
<pwnguin> and if troy's reading this via logs, i'll add that the letter reads like the worlds worst job application cover letter
<thorwil> he's not applying for a job
<thorwil> but enough (or too much, already) talking about a 3rd party here ;)
<pwnguin> fine fine
<xanax`> hello
<Deep6> guys is this the right place to ask to get a clue on how to make some of the more "advanced" looking themes present on ubuntu-art.org work?
<Deep6> http://www.ubuntu-art.org/content/show.php/imetalV5?content=83660
<Deep6> as an example
<zerwas> bad example ;)
<zerwas> but what do you want to do exactly?
<zerwas> what has been done on your screenshot is simply another gtk- and icon theme and another wallpaper
<zerwas> for the bar at the bottom, take avant-window-navigator
<Deep6> sorry
<Deep6> back
<Deep6> well, is there anything to make the gtk-theme work?
<Deep6> I can't seem to get it to work
<Deep6> I get a ? in the theme manager
<zerwas> then you might not have the correct theme engine installed yet
<Deep6> how do you identify the theme engine?
<kwwii> re
<pwnguin> you know, it would be awesome if the theme applet could set themes on a per install basis
<pwnguin> sorta like how the resolution settings can be set to "this computer only"
<pwnguin> its annoying to switch between the netbook theme on hardy and the new themes on intrepid
#ubuntu-artwork 2008-07-27
<Toma-> Whats the deal with icon themes and using loads of symlinks? Does anyone respect the FDO icon naming specs?
 * thorwil would like to kick shadow.h511
#ubuntu-artwork 2009-07-20
<MT-> that link posted earlier for the background is awesome :D
 * lajjr help
 * lajjr says goodbye Be Safe All.
<FLOZz> hi \o_
<mac_v> kwwii: where is the pixmap for the separators ,VLINE located?
<kwwii> huh?
<mac_v> kwwii: the panel separators and  nautilus one are the same right?
<mac_v> i'm not able to find the image which is used for these separators, all the themes use the same separator image except new wave.
<kwwii> erm, yes I would guess so
<kwwii> so look in new wave
<mac_v> kwwii: i have found the new wave separator , but i want to change the separator for the rest of the themes, universally
<kwwii> I would guess that is in the theme engine
<mac_v> thought you might have some info about the location
<kwwii> or in gnome itself
<kwwii> it might not be a pixmap
<mac_v> oh!
<kwwii> to be honest, I am deep in some other last minute work, sorry
<mac_v> np... thanx anyway
<mac_v> mat_t: hi... are you working on the new gdm design?
<mat_t> mac_v: yes we are
<mac_v> ie for Karmic
<mac_v> mat_t: any link where the discussions are going on or is it in house?
<ruslanr> mac_v: hi
 * mac_v wakes to ruslanr 
<mac_v> waves!
<ruslanr> :)
<mat_t> mac_v: we've really only just started, and we're open to suggestions!
<mat_t> mac_v: I've started drafting a spec here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Karmic/LoginExperience
<mat_t> mac_v: I guess the most interesting part is the bg image. In general, the transition from boot to gdm and then to desktop should be nice and smooth
<mac_v> mat_t: nice... atm the language, keyboard & session are shown separately , they neednt be, as they are rarely used , are you guys planning on moving them all to a complete "options" menu?
<mat_t> mac_v: exactly right
<mac_v> oh... ok... that was my main concern , since right now it looks too much like fedora ! :(
<mat_t> yes, it's early days though :)
<mac_v> :)
<mac_v> mat_t: bug #400383 , not sure if removing the separator is ideal, date and the name will just flow as a single line, a tiny separator is better.dont you think?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 400383 in hundredpapercuts "Panel separator between clock and FUSA is not meaningful" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/400383
<mac_v> or let's use the icons as the default
<mac_v> with no separator
<SiDi> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-art/2009-July/011134.html
 * SiDi feels sad
<ruslanr> :(
<mac__v> SiDi: you should see him on papercuts
<thorwil> SiDi: he's one of my personal heroes, a shining beacon of light, showing us the path through darkness
<ruslanr> the chosen one :)
#ubuntu-artwork 2009-07-21
<FLOZz> Good night !
<FLOZz> hi
<ruslanr> hi
<FLOZz> Hi || Re   _o/
<mac_v> michote: hi... do you know any script that just gives a png output of the svg, i remember you saying something when the attachments got deleted
<mac_v> ?
<michote> mac_v:  I used a nautilus script wich converts svg2png
<mac_v> michote: oh... is it in the repo or any links?
<mac_v> never mind... google is my friend ;p
<michote> mac_v: I didn't remember ;) this is the version i use http://files.getdropbox.com/u/1429945/svg2png
<mac_v> thanx
#ubuntu-artwork 2009-07-22
<FLOZz> hi _o/
<lassegul> whats up guys.
<FLOZz> mmm nothing
<FLOZz> ^^
<lassegul> nice?
<FLOZz> yes and you ?
<lassegul> gloomy weather, but except for that...
<FLOZz> ^^
<lassegul> i really hate how inkscape doesnt warn you if youre about to export to png and overwrite a file you are already using in the project.
<lassegul> you end up with a funny result though: usually a huge png of "source image not available".
<FLOZz> repote a bug to the inkscape team ?
<FLOZz> maybe they will add this
<lassegul> yeah, but they have a _lot_ of bug reports, takes time to look through them all to check for duplicates.
<FLOZz> :/
<mac_v> lassegul: which version of inkscape are you using, ? I get a warning before overwrites
<mac_v> funny thing is , i was looking for a way to turn it off ;p
<lassegul> mac_v: lol. good question, im not on my home computer right now, but im guessing something like a rev of pre 0.47 from middle of june.
<lassegul> should update then :)
<mac_v> ah... works in 0.46
<lassegul> so whats new with ubuntu artwork these days. are there being done any mockups for client side windows gtk decorations?
<mac_v> i guess boot experience is the only thing active right now, everything else is quite
<lassegul> usplash theming?
<lassegul> you havent decided to go for plymouth have you?
<mac_v> grub2 , no plymouth, mat_t is getting things going
<lassegul> cool. i remember saying something like "grub2 will be the ultimate boot loader for the GNU/HURD operating system" the day before ubuntu announced it.
<lassegul> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Karmic/Solitaire  Theres a patch doing the similar things upstream actually.
<lassegul> hold on, ill try to find it.
<lassegul> [#ubuntu-artwork]
<lassegul> awkward Gnome bug 573178 fixes it better.
<ubottu> Gnome bug 573178 in aisleriot "Add Tango style cards to aisleriot" [Enhancement,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=573178
<lassegul> without the ubuntu icon though, but still.
<lassegul> mac_v: so im looking at the Boot site at the wiki, this all looks really cool, but is it technically possiblelikely?
<mac_v> i think so, yes... the boot experience wiki already has links youtube showing the working  prototypes on a Karmic install .. but  mat_t is the better person to answer this
<yharrow_mobile> lassegul: I don't know if its true. but i read on the wiki that usplash may be removed in favor of an immediate x session. If this is the case then I imagine it sholdnt be too dififuclt.
<lassegul> i also see that, and i like it very much. mat_t is the one working on facebrowser now, taking over where macslow left?
<yharrow_mobile> has mat_t posted any reports/screens of his progress online?
<mat_t> yharrow_mobile: lassegul: I haven't taken over form MacSlow, no :)
<mat_t> I'm running the design ans specification work for boot and login
<mat_t> MacSlow will be implementing some of the stuff we design :)
<lassegul> crepy, we were here talking behind your back, and suddenly youve been here all along :P
<mat_t> haha, never talk behind someone's back! ;)
<yharrow_mobile> D:
<yharrow_mobile> :P
<lassegul> especially in a logged channel :)
<mat_t> well... yes
<mat_t> :)
<lassegul> so is troy still around?
<yharrow_mobile> yeah but not like anyone reads the logs...
<yharrow_mobile> i mean do they?
<yharrow_mobile> I dunno. I not spoke with troyin a while. But then again i havent been around lately.
<mat_t> FYI guys, great submissions so far, we're in the process of putting together the final proposals
<mat_t> so it's a last minute call really - we must have the designs ready before the distro sprint, starting 3rd of Aug
<yharrow_mobile> Btw I really am impressed with the boot submissions. I was getting a little discouraged in the open source art process lately.
<yharrow_mobile> But those submissions gave me a spark of hope.
<lassegul> yeah, guys, you do some awesome work now!
<mat_t> ha! Me too :)
<mat_t> We're only just starting spreading the word, so that we can get much more people involved
<yharrow_mobile> took be by surprise. yes thats exactly what im thinking mat_t
<mat_t> see, most designers never used linux, and have no idea what FOSS is
<mat_t> we're here to change it!
<yharrow_mobile> yeah.
<yharrow_mobile> :D
<yharrow_mobile> I get aroundin the art world a bit. And I'm hearing of an increasing number of casual artists who are startng to pick up open source programs like gimp and inkscape as adobe prices skyrocket
<lassegul> id like to see what happened if adobe one day managed to block pirating of their products
<mat_t> ha
<mat_t> exactly
<mat_t> would be great to have a good replacement for Flash, too. ATM that's a bit of a pain
<yharrow_mobile> mat_t: I think that the solution to that is closer than you think. take alook at the specs for the latest version of firefox
<lassegul> hopefully flash on web dies with <video> and HTML5 CSS3
<yharrow_mobile> flash-like functionality will soon be common place within web pages themselves
<mat_t> true
<yharrow_mobile> without the need for external plugins
<yharrow_mobile> flash is a transitory tool imho
<yharrow_mobile> it filleda need
<mat_t> still, Flash is extremely useful for UI mockups, for example
<yharrow_mobile> flash will always remain a great tool for animation
<yharrow_mobile> quick animation
<lassegul> yeah, and we dont have any replacements for that yet, do we?
<yharrow_mobile> I'd have to agree lassegul. Although I do recall hearing of an open source flash like platform several years ago. I think it was called open lazlo
<yharrow_mobile> http://www.openlaszlo.org/
<lassegul> but flash as a UI mockup tool is a minor nuiance, while getting rid of flash on the web is a huge step for FLOSS
<lassegul> dont tell kwwii, but i dont like oxygen very much
<lassegul> oops, ubuntulog rejoined
<yharrow_mobile> xD
<yharrow_mobile> trying to go off the record?
<lassegul> my DDos can only work for 30 secs at a time ;)
<yharrow_mobile> o.o
<yharrow_mobile> lol
<yharrow_mobile> lassegul: many people say that open source art will never succeed because no 2 artists styles are the same.
<yharrow_mobile> and therefore anything produced in that fashion would not be an entirely unified work
<lassegul> and making open source art is a constant struggle to prove them wrong
<yharrow_mobile> well I beleive they are wrong...up to an extent
<yharrow_mobile> if differing individual styles is waht makes open source art fail
<yharrow_mobile> then I say that we just need better and sttricter standards
<yharrow_mobile> rather than allow for individuality in the art itself,
<yharrow_mobile> we should allow for individiuality in developing the standards for that art
<yharrow_mobile> Am I making sense here?
<lassegul> i agree.
<lassegul> i gotta run and get an RSA key generator before help desk closes.
<yharrow_mobile> alright gl. thanks for the chat.
<andreasn_> yharrow_mobile, I would say that is incorrect. I think about 20 individuals (or more) have been involved in the Tango project over the years, and I would say it's close to impossible to say what artist drew what just from looking at stuff
<andreasn_> err...incorrect was the wrong wording
<andreasn_> what I meant is that I disagree :)
<lassegul> icons are one thing, they behave much like software, lots of lines of code - lots of components - lots of icons, have a shared specific goal and youre going to be alright.
<lassegul> wallpapers and themes are different.
<lassegul> you have to have a clear vision, and a few effective people to work it out.
<lassegul> art needs to be "offensive" to some, a piece that everyone likes will end up bland and boring.
<andreasn_> I guess the backgrounds can be offensive, not sure how you could make a widget theme offensive
<lassegul> ;) if anyone, you can do it andreasn_
<andreasn_> maybe making it all bright yellow and red?
<andreasn_> and use a texture with cursing on it
<lassegul> instead of an X for closing the window, you have a swastika.
<lassegul> im sorry, thats not funny.
<andreasn_> ouch, yeah, that would be quite offensive :/
<lassegul> andreasn_: are you doing any work on the 3.0 icon theme?
<andreasn> yes, it's in the one-canvas branch of gnome-icon-theme
<andreasn> we still have some fixes left before it's ready for 2.28 though
<lassegul> it will be ready for 2.28?
<lassegul> im not on a liux computer, do you have a png somewhere online? i want to bask in its sweet high res goodness
<andreasn> lets see, hold on
<andreasn> http://files.getdropbox.com/u/184285/big-size-preview.png
<lassegul> can i have that printer icon?
<lassegul> i want to take it out for dinner, buy it lobster, and propose with a ring in the champagne glass.
<andreasn> :)
<andreasn> it's quite neat, I think it was lapo who drew it
<andreasn> or maybe jimmac
<yharrow_mobile> I beleive that the tango theme is a good example of what could be done when you give specific guidelines. What I'm suggesting is something a little different. Im suggesting allowing for some style or flair in the icons and having multiple artists contribute to what kind of style or flair is used
<yharrow_mobile> Once a set of strict guidelines our developed actualization can begin.
<yharrow_mobile> are *
<yharrow_mobile> rather than having rough guidelines and inputting little bits of advice form multiple artists on each part, as if it was a seperate entity
<yharrow_mobile> I'm by no means attempting to insult anyone. Im just offering up an idea and id love to hear what people think of it
<andreasn> oh, I wasn't insulted, don't worry.
<andreasn> I'm also a bit too much in the middle of something, so I didn't really follow the whole discussion
<yharrow_mobile> no problem. if you get a chance later to look over the convo feel free to reply
<mac_v> yharrow_mobile: i think in short what you mean is:a project needs a good team leader with a set goal?
<mac_v> andreasn: what is that icon ,a paper and a clock, for?
<andreasn> mac_v, for when you're loading a preview or mimetype
<mac_v> andreasn: ah... thought so... nice... is it semi-transparent also? like the previous one
<andreasn> I don't think it is, but that would be easy to fix
<mac_v> i liked that about the previous one... gave it the feel as something in-process...
<mac_v> thorwil: hi... is this for the Karmic wallpapers ? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Karmic/Finding_Your_Inner_Koala , just asking since you had edited the page ...
<thorwil> mac_v: that page is older than our backgrounds section
<thorwil> in some way, it should be there, but it doesn't fit in well
<thorwil> mac_v: cut/copy and move attechments if your are bored ;)
<mac_v> yeah, the date threw me off...  i thought it was the old starting for Karmic
<mac_v> not that bored, though ;p
<thorwil> http://www.theleagueofmoveabletype.com/
#ubuntu-artwork 2009-07-23
<SiDi> Hey guys
<SiDi> I've got a wallpaper proposal : http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/2241/facepalm2ic7copyrl2.jpg
<SiDi> Good colour tones, perfect resolution for.. *ahem* tiny netbooks
<SiDi> And i just had yet another epic failurure
<SiDi> yet another two epic failures..
<mac_v> mat_t: [going green] hehe... i was wondering the same , i think everyone only remembers sabdfl's first interview[pre-jaunty].
<mat_t> mac_v: well, not *everything* sabdfl says turns into reality... Most of it, but not all ;)
<FLOZz> hi _o/
<mat_t> hi FLOZz
<mac_v> mat_t: actually he retracted it , in a later interview... but that didnt make "headlines" ;p
<mac_v> he said new color os only for karmic+1
<mac_v> s/os/is
<mat_t> yes, that's more likely. But still, it won't be green :)
<mac_v> yeah...
<mac_v> mat_t: we have to stay away from using orbs during boot, Win7 uses orbs
<mat_t> mac_v: good point
<mat_t> mac_v: rings are OK though, as it resembles Ubuntu logo
<mac_v> mac_v: yeah, MadsRH's submissions were mostly orbs, but the second one was better , since it didnt have the glow and was more of a ring
<thorwil> kwwii: just saw an edit on Artwork/Incoming/Karmic/Backgrounds/Extra_Photo, with tinypic.com links. away for dinner, though
<thorwil> i hate the wiki surge protection so much
<kwwii> thorwil: cool, I will check it out and fix it in a bit
<thorwil> kwwii: i already reverted
<thorwil> kwwii: i suspect his user might want to use tinypic.com precisely because of the damn surge protection leading to the page loading with some images missing
<thorwil> s/his/this/
<thorwil> kwwii: we need a better solution. if not now, then next cycle. i can't tolerate wiki editing taking 3 or 4 times as long due to surge protection over an extended period of time
<kwwii> very true, perhaps we should bring it up as a bug in launchpad
<thorwil> kwwii: any news on collaborative countdown banners?
<kwwii> thorwil: nope, and I am afraid that the person who could have taken care of it is goign on vacation tomorrow
<kwwii> I sent the info around, maybe I will try to get some other people to buy into it
<thorwil> kwwii: heh, ok
<mac_v> kwwii: could you add ubottu to #ayatana ?
<MDC1> hi! I'd would like some advices from a gtk hacker regarding how to implement toolbar editing in nautilus. The basics is there, but I've got problem with the actions, using singleton widgets versus new instance, when to use create_tool_item and when to use connect proxy for instance - if someone got time for this, please tell...
<thorwil> MDC1: while there could be a gtk hacker hiding here, your chances in this channel are pretty bad
<andreasn> MDC1, check out #gtk+ on irc.gnome.org
<mac_v> MDC1: if you dont get response here soon enough , you could also send a mail to the artwork mailing list,
<MDC1> hmm.. just got a tip from mac_v to look here (from #ayatana, a tip from djsiegel)
<mac_v> marcus, usually someone hangs out here, but its luck , to catch them
<mac_v> MDC1: several are missing today
<MDC1> mac_v, you didn't happen to be one of them?
<MDC1> ok
<mac_v> MDC1: just basic hacking, but not the extent you need
<mac_v> dashua: ^
<MDC1> mac_v, it might do it - wanna give it a try? i'm just getting to learn gtk so anything will probably help me :)
<MDC1> pointing to the right documents could also be helpful
<kwwii> mac_v: I do not think I have the rights to do that
<mac_v> kwwii: oh :(
<mac_v> MDC1: i would really like to help, but i'm not sure how
<mac_v> kwwii: could you help MDC1
<kwwii> MDC1: you'll want to find someone who can help you with gtk+ then
<MDC1> kwwii, yes
<kwwii> MDC1: while I like having you on this channel, I don't think you are going to find the answers you seek here
<kwwii> unless I misunderstood something :)
<MDC1> give it a try?
<MDC1> :-)
<MDC1> as it seems hard to find people having time for this..
<mac_v> kwwii: he is trying to fix bug 386150 , making a toolbar editor
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 386150 in nautilus "Nautilus file browser toolbar is complicated, needs a face-lift" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/386150
<MDC1> i'll describe the problem and see if you could help, couldn't hurt right? :-)
 * SiDi hides before it goes technical
<MDC1> the thing is nautilus now uses a reference for each special widget (search bar, location bar, view chooser etc) in it's window. Now when the toolbar will be editable and I've added the widgets inside an GtkAction I'm not sure if I wan't to keep it this way because of 1) memory - its not necessary to create the widgets if your layout won't use them (small problem) 2) I run in to problem when moving the action around 
<MDC1> and when to use connect_proxy? should it be used also/instead? I've tried looking at the code for Evince and Epiphany and they seems to be using a separate class for the widget...
<MDC1> too techie?
<MDC1> The ViewChooser (creating a new instance of the combo_box, but filling it in the window (probably wrong?) ) can be found at http://www.mejlamej.nu/nautilus-view-chooser-action.c
<FLOZz> bye
<SiDi> Some people in flickr are crazy
<SiDi> http://www.flickr.com/photos/santander/2117912242/in/pool-ubuntu-artwork
<SiDi> Who would use this as a wallpaper ?
<zniavre> :o)
#ubuntu-artwork 2009-07-24
<AnAnt> Hello, will be there any theming for the new GDM ?
<thorwil> kwwii: morning! that Duberman guy who wanted to use tinypic deleted his submissions with a comment of "ok, bye". his attachments are still there. wrote another message, this time via LP, with this text: http://pastebin.com/d7612785c
<kwwii> boah, how stupid can you get
<lassegul> were they any good?
<FLOZz> hi
<thorwil> lassegul: just good enough to write him
<thorwil> kwwii: how dare you apply terms i avoided!! :)
<kwwii> thorwil: hehe
<MDC1> hi guys, you don't happen to know a little bit of g_signaling?
<knome> suppose this is quite a bad channel to ask about that.
<knome> most of us are only artists.
<benjamim> Hy guys, what's up !?
<knome>  
<benjamim> nothing here...
<knome> yep.
#ubuntu-artwork 2009-07-25
<knitt1> good morning :)
<knitt1> i came to inquire about breathe icon set
<knitt1> before the makefile got merged in i did cp -r Breathe /usr/share/icons/ which worked fine
<knitt1> for the makefile i needed another application installed to my system. make complains with dozens of errors but copies some (most of?) the files
<knitt1> still, in themes dialog i only get a question mark besides Breathe
<knitt1> so my question is. what do i do wrong? :D
<FLOZz> Hi _o/
#ubuntu-artwork 2009-07-26
<FLOZz> hi
<mac_v> ckontros: hi... do we want to fix Bug #301035 ?
<ckontros> Hmm... Where the bot?
<mac_v> Bug #301035
<mac_v> oh no bot!
<mac_v> https://bugs.launchpad.net/breathe-icon-set/+bug/301035
<ckontros> nope. I pinged someone about it.
<ckontros> mac_v: I've been watching this also. *We* can't do anything until the technical stuff is in place.
<mac_v> ckontros: then i guess we leave it for now, if we set the bug as "wont fix" , people will miss interpret it
<mac_v> yeah , my thoughts too
<ckontros> mac_v: I updated the status.
<mac_v> ckontros: what does the "Affects me too" actually do?
<ckontros> I dont see that phrase anywhere.
<mac_v> ckontros: "This bug affects me" just below the projects, or it will be > "This bug doesn't affect me"
<SiDi> mac_v: it says you are affected by the bug
<ruslanr> mac_v: maybe it's just adds you to "Also notified" list :)
<SiDi> you can then sort bugs by number of affected people
<mac_v> SiDi: the subscriber knows that , but ideally it should list the number of people affected
<SiDi> it's meant to avoid having dozens of "i have this bug too" comments, but it doesnt work
<ckontros> mac_v: Just lets you add other packages/projects.
<SiDi> For your bug 301035, you should set it to incomplete and state that you first need the technical part to be implemented imo
<mac_v> SiDi: actually breathe doesnt need technical stuff... we are just waiting for the tech stuff
<ckontros> SiDi: It's set appropriately in this case. At least for Breathe.
<mac_v> ^
<SiDi> mac_v: i see
<mac_v> ckontros: just a reminder... our lp> https://launchpad.net/breathe-icon-set , banner needs an update too
<ckontros> It will soon. Waiting on some things to fall in place.
#ubuntu-artwork 2010-07-26
<Cimi_> welcome back ivanka :)
<ivanka> hi Cimi_ !
<ivanka> Cimi_: I am at guadec so not back yet :-)
<Cimi_> ivanka: ahah ok :)
<Cimi> hi otto :)
<doctormo> kwwii: ping
<kwwii> doctormo: hey, sorry I haven't been around lately...I've been ill
<doctormo> kwwii: Oh I how your ok
<kwwii> doctormo: with any luck I eventually will be
<kwwii> doctormo: in the meantime, ivanka or iain can answer any questions or help, etc.
<doctormo> kwwii: We've been thinking about a site for svg pieces of artwork. We got a basic ccHost going quickly and wanted to poke around each person.
<doctormo> http://art.ubuntu-owl.org
<doctormo> But we have to make sure there is a need for it against ubuntu-art.org and spread ubuntu.
<kwwii> doctormo: yeah, I have wanted a special site with that kind of functionality for quite a while
<kwwii> doctormo: but I am not sure what is best, ubuntu-art.org is willing to help as well (I know the guy personaly)
<doctormo> We need a good name for it :-)
<doctormo> Well yes, I tried to talk to them too, but hard to get in touch with.
<doctormo> kwwii: Anyway, get better!
<doctormo> And we'll talk about it later.
<kwwii> doctormo: hehe, indeed they are hard to get in touch with :-(
<kwwii> doctormo: if you want, send me an email and I can see that they get it
<doctormo> kwwii: Sure thing
<doctormo> email sent
<kwwii> cool, thanks
<Cimi> ivanka: are you in london next week?
<ivanka> Cimi: yes, I am - all week :-)
<thorwil> doctormo: only for SVG? the artwork wiki is too hard to use, especially regarding attachments. but a replacement for the incoming section would have to handle raster images as well
<doctormo> thorwil: What section of artworks are raster?
<thorwil> doctormo: well, since backgrounds happen elsewhere, theme screenshots and potentially posters and such are left
<thorwil> doctormo: meanwhile, it looks to me like spread-ubuntu has a problem of isolation, not well known, no ties to ubuntu-artwork
<doctormo> thorwil: Posters should go to spread ubuntu
<doctormo> screenshots should got to hell imo, but maybe some other palce for those.
<doctormo> place*
<thorwil> doctormo: there should be a central (ubuntu) design/artwork site for better visibility of all aspects
<doctormo> thorwil: There should be, but we're talking about many, many use cases and workflows.
<Cimi> ivanka: because I was thinking with otto about which week I could come
<Cimi> I need to know it asap
<Cimi> (we did creat things today, new theme :)) )
<doctormo> thorwil: How would we be able to bind together all the functionality from all the various art websites... or make sense of them enough to have a central website for linking?
<ivanka> Cimi: next week would be great - let's do that!
<thorwil> doctormo: couldn't be done by tying together what's there already, would need to be a fresh start
<doctormo> thorwil: We'd need a full specification of what to make of a fresh start.
<thorwil> doctormo: sure. specifications grow scary, fast , though :)
<doctormo> thorwil: specifications can be trimmed and edited, bit hard to edit machinery once it's setup on the other hand.
<thorwil> doctormo: http://mairin.wordpress.com/2010/02/13/random-idea-for-design-collaboration-tool/#comment-4711
<doctormo> thorwil: hmm, well we got most of that list. Just not versions and editing.
<doctormo> in ccHost
<doctormo> thorwil: Are you more of a python dev like me? Or can you do php?
<thorwil> doctormo: i can do some python and don't to touch php, it's ugly from 20 meters away already :)
<thorwil> dont' *want* to, even
<doctormo> thorwil: I agree with you there, shame cchost is php based.
<thorwil> doctormo: well, if i code, it's currently for my own custom blog, anyway. only after sufficient progress there would i touch something else
#ubuntu-artwork 2010-07-27
<darkmatter> http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/22/new-microsoft-brand-logos-company-tagline-revealed-at-mgx-event/
<Cimi> kwwii: ping
<Cimi> chaotic: ? :)
<chaotic> Cimi: yup
<Cimi> chaotic: read facebook
<chaotic> Cimi: nothing new came through
<chaotic> Cimi: I have spoken to Marianna though
<Cimi> chaotic: maybe it didn't arrive
<Cimi> I asked you for the final mockup of the panel
<Cimi> now I have to go, but i will figure out the remaining bits later this evening
<Cimi> and I will rotate the slider in range as well
<chaotic> Cimi: thanks
<Cimi> so please put the theme as it will be
<Cimi> using 24px height for the panel
<Cimi> I will simply grab the pixmaps from your png and put them in the theme
<Cimi> so be precise :)
<chaotic> Cimi: as I said earlier, I am working on other things at the moment. Please concentrate on the slider, the progress wells, etc. until I get time to finish it off
<Cimi> chaotic: but for me it's too important the panel
<Cimi> it's always visible, more important than a slider
<Cimi> chaotic: is it ok if on friday I will be in the office just till lunch?
<Cimi> they proposed me a flight at 19:05
<Cimi> which means leaving the office 3 hours before
<Cimi> ivanka: too
<ivanka> Cimi: hello - how may I help?
<Cimi> I am planning the trip in london
<Cimi> they proposed me a flight (for return) at 19 on friday 6th
<Cimi> that means I will have to leave the office at 16
<Cimi> so I will "lose" 2 hours of work
<Cimi> if it's ok for you, I will book
<ivanka> cimi: so you don't want to come to the pub with us to celebrate the great things you are going to achieve?!
<Cimi> I would
<Cimi> let's ask canonical to pay one more night ;)
<ivanka> cimi: heh
<chaotic> Cimi: have put a partially updated taskbar up
<Cimi> chaotic: ok ty
<Cimi> will implement later and update the theme (will upload something this night)
<Cimi> chaotic: implemented :)
#ubuntu-artwork 2010-07-28
<blane> Anyone around?
<doctormo> blane: nope
<thorwil> 0.o http://www.zdnetasia.com/i/techguide/2010/RGBA%20desktop%20Fig%20A.jpg
<darkmatter> thorwil: lol. and people wonder why I'm against RGBA support :P
<darkmatter> thorwil: welcome to The Wonderful World of FLOSS. Moderation? never heard of it. +10000000 FOR OVERKILL!!! xD
<thorwil> :)
<vish> heh , if we really wanted to see everything behind the window! close the damn window!
<Cimi> chaotic: ?
<chaotic> Cimi: hi
<Cimi> chaotic: did you see the latest sshot?
<chaotic> Cimi: nope - let me have a look
<Cimi> chaotic: panel is implemented and working :)
<chaotic> Cimi: cool - looks really nice and reflects the menubar nicely
<Cimi> I have also fixed default button colors
<Cimi> and rotated the slider in the scale
<Cimi> I can show you in sshot
<Cimi> chaotic: uploaded, you'll receive it shortly
<chaotic> Cimi: thanks, panel is really working and close to the design - only bit that might need a little thought is the far right - those preview tiles
<thorwil> timezones are awsome. every hour of the day somewhere. not to forget sessions
<bognarandras> hi, i need a little help
<bognarandras> is the canonical aubergine color could be used for the ubuntu logo? or just the ubuntu orange, black and white (sorry for my bad english)
<vish> bognarandras:  Visual Identity Guidelines: http://design.canonical.com/the-toolkit/ubuntu-brand-guidelines/
<bognarandras> vish: yes, i saw that before, and in one of the document there is an image where is the brandmark is on the purple background and the CoF is orange, but in the current gdm theme the CoF id purple. thats why i asking this
<vish> bognarandras: ha! actually the cof is a cut out in the white there , but nice catch ;)
<vish> bognarandras: but, purple is for canonical , orange for Ubuntu
<vish> bognarandras: probably you can file a bug ? or bug kwwii about it ;)
<vish> the gdm that is..
<bognarandras> ah, okay
<bognarandras> thank you
<vish> np.
#ubuntu-artwork 2010-07-29
<bognarandras> hi, just a quick question: which one is correct? http://noob.hu/2010/07/29/ize.png
<thorwil> bognarandras: upper is clearly better. though you should consider using a single font size. it runs wide, but you probably don't need or want to emphasize "ubuntu" that much
<thorwil> bognarandras: oh, and this begs for manual kerning, especially around the "a"s and "Ã¶"s
<thorwil> what's the meaning of  magyar kÃ¶zÃ¶ssÃ©g?
<bognarandras> okay, thanks! magyar kÃ¶zÃ¶ssÃ©g > hungarian community
<thorwil> bognarandras: if you work with inkscape, i can help you with the kerning if you don't know how to do it
<bognarandras> thorwil: yes, i use inkscape, but i think i wait august 8th for the pulic font release, it's not so urgent
<thorwil> yeah, i will have to check 4 designs with the final font, then :)
<thorwil> perhaps a nice logo could be derived from http://wwp.greenwichmeantime.com/time-zone/europe/european-union/hungary/images/hungary-coat-arms.jpg
<bognarandras> yes, it's not a bad idea
<bognarandras> but now, i'm working on the new global jam badges, maybe after that
<bognarandras> i finished yesterday the global jam logo: http://ubuntuone.com/p/B01/
<thorwil> bognarandras: shouldn't the latitude lines bend outwards?
<thorwil> bognarandras: http://www.foopics.com/showfull/c9d5445b900928733411a551384e8d89
<bognarandras> hm, yes, you're right
<bognarandras> thanks
<thorwil> np
<kmrs75> good morning everyone i am new here - i was told that i should stop by and share what i am working on for my local loco
<kmrs75> http://s684.photobucket.com/albums/vv203/techsx2/Chicago%20LoCo/
<thorwil> hello kmrs75
<thorwil> http://s684.photobucket.com/albums/vv203/techsx2/Chicago%20LoCo/?action=view&current=retroloco.png is the strongest piece
<kmrs75> thats the one that most people like
<thorwil> the reflection idea on http://s684.photobucket.com/albums/vv203/techsx2/Chicago%20LoCo/?action=view&current=rect2842.png is cool, but the CoF sun doesn't work
<kmrs75> we own a graphics shop we make - tshirts - decals - store fronts - banners and the loco whats some shirts made up
<knome> i personally like this: http://s684.photobucket.com/albums/vv203/techsx2/Chicago%20LoCo/?action=view&current=chicago-1.png, however it could incorporate the new logo
<thorwil> kmrs75: what kind of input are you looking for exactly?
<kmrs75> lol not too sure - just some people in chicago wanted me to share and sujest i get involed in the art work area and mabey contribute some ideas - not really sure yet
<thorwil> kmrs75: cool. there's not much of a joined effort here. Links to artwork and related discussion (plus the usual IRC nonsense then and now) are more than welcome
<thorwil> regarding chicago and type, i'd look at: http://www.hotelscheap.org/discount-travel-blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/chicago-nightlife.jpg
<thorwil> http://www.dam.brown.edu/people/glin/Chicago_Postcards/chicago.jpg
<thorwil> http://blog.taragana.com/sports/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/chicago-2016-logo1.jpg
<kmrs75> i just got to be able to turn it into a vector - since we use a vinyl cutter it needs a vector file but i can turn all of them into a vector
<thorwil> kmrs75: would you be interested in a t-shirt design proposal from me?
<kmrs75> thorwil: ya im always open to ideas what ya got
#ubuntu-artwork 2010-07-30
<blane> anyone around ?
<blane> anyone around?
<coz_> blane,  I am here
<coz_> not sure what good I can do though :)
<coz_> and I will be leaving soon
<blane> hey coz
<blane> sorry for the late reply
<thorwil> kmrs75: http://www.foopics.com/showfull/20fdb98461a1f98edf17f9e4f55e70be
<thorwil> kmrs75: ping
<thorwil> http://www.davidairey.com/qualities-in-identity-standards/
#ubuntu-artwork 2010-07-31
<kmrs75> thorwil: i like them good work
<thorwil> kmrs75: hi! ty
<thorwil> kmrs75: if you want one for production, i'd need measurements and technical limitations to refine it
<kmrs75> a vector image is all i would need
<kmrs75> svg - eps - pdf
<thorwil> all don in inkscape, so no pronlem there
<kmrs75> thats what we use
<thorwil> kmrs75: what printing technique would you use?
<kmrs75> no printing - vinyl cutting
<kmrs75> we have a vinyl cutter - do you want me to specify how that works
<thorwil> kmrs75: just tell me how thin you can go
<kmrs75> about 1/8th inch
<kmrs75> and in some cases thinner
<thorwil> what's the printing area size?
<kmrs75> if it goes on a shirt 15x15 is the best for most but i its a svg i can resize it very easy
<thorwil> kmrs75: hmm, if i make the rectangle 15 inches wide, a circle (head) of the CoF is just 0.075
<thorwil> lunch time, bbl
<thorwil> back
<kmrs75> ok
<thorwil> guess that means the text would have to much larger (stroke width is at the limit itself), or the CoF has to go
<kmrs75> ya but our work is diffrent - stroke width - we cant use but i can take that and change it to image to path i think and that would work aswell for use
<thorwil> kmrs75: misunderstanding here. i know it has to be all shapes, no stroked paths. what i meant is the stroke width of the font
<kmrs75> for o i thought i were talking about something else
<kmrs75> never mind
<kmrs75> yes i downloaded the image and started to look at it in inkscape and ya the txt would need to be bigger it the buildings smaller - can you take about 4 rows off of each side - that then would mke the image more square and it could go a little taller then
<thorwil> kmrs75: yes will experiment in that direction. meanwhile, what i have is backed up at https://code.launchpad.net/~t-w-/+junk/ubuntu_chicago_art
<kmrs75> i cut off the right side some http://s684.photobucket.com/albums/vv203/techsx2/Chicago%20LoCo/?action=view&current=rect8146.png
<kmrs75> and now the logo is about 1 inch tall
<thorwil> kmrs75: looks like i'm on my way to a solution. but now it's bicycle time! ^^
<thorwil> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5OLP4nbAVA4
<thorwil> i wonder if i should just leave the CoF out: http://www.foopics.com/showfull/46f373256dd7939cbd80c6151e47ffed
<thorwil> (nothing should be thinner than 1/8 inch - impossible with the superscript circle placement)
#ubuntu-artwork 2010-08-01
<jmsthing678> Hello everyone
<thorwil> day of the mailing list membership reminders
<Spironox> any one here
<vish> Spironox: no
<vish> thorwil: hmm? reminders?
<Spironox> hehe sorry to budge in i am noob but got some work done with artworks
<vish> Spironox: not disturbing anything here , we rarely chat here ;)
<Spironox> so what do people do here jsut log and duck
<MDC1> Spironox: i'm just here to look at pretty screenshots of new artwork ;)
<Spironox> where did u find them ...
<Spironox> chow gtg now
<thorwil> vish: the mailing list memberships reminder mails from mailman lists. the way i notice it's the 1st of a month ;)
 * thorwil hits the road
<thorwil> http://thorwil.wordpress.com/2010/08/01/ubuntu-chicago-loco-t-shirt/
<vish> thorwil: the second one is neat!  did making the "ubuntu" same size as chicago loco not work out?
<Equiet> Hi thorwil. I like the idea, but not so much the layout. What about something like http://stelmaria.equiet.operaunite.com/file_sharing/content/chicago_loco_inline-cof.svg ?
<thorwil> vish: it did work, but put emphasis on "ubuntu"
<vish> thorwil: hmm , yeah , then maybe move it away , something like what Equiet has done.. it seems unbalanced right now..
<thorwil> Equiet: it should be suitable for vinyl transfer on t-shirts. the maximal printing area is 15 x 15 inches. parts smaller than 1/8 inch are a problem. that means that text has to be rather large
<Equiet> Ah, t-shirts... That's not my area.
<vish> thorwil: or maybe just drop ubuntu.. we have the logo, "chicago loco" should be sufficient
<thorwil> vish: funny how i thought about dropping the CoF, but not leaving "ubuntu" out :)
<vish> lol! :)
<vish> thorwil: the second one i like more because of what you had done with the logo and the curved edge on the top
<thorwil> vish: initially i tried placing it more in the middle, but then it becomes part of the pictures and will likely be interpreted to be the moon. would need a reflection. tried that, became too busy and kinda silly. so corner placement and the rounded edge to set it apart a bit more--anti-moon-feature :)
<vish> hehe , drawing a reflection for the logo would have been funny ;p
<thorwil> http://s684.photobucket.com/albums/vv203/techsx2/Chicago%20LoCo/
<Equiet> Btw, enlarging "CHICAGO LOCO" by 1 more row works too. http://stelmaria.equiet.operaunite.com/file_sharing/content/chicago_loco_inline-cof-larger.svg
<thorwil> Equiet: you first edit was fine (for another medium), but now you destroy the impression of a reflection
<darkmatter> http://img811.imageshack.us/img811/9527/screenshotom.png
<thorwil> Equiet: the empty cells right below CHICAGO LOCO are unfortunate
<thorwil> darkmatter: what's up with > arrow after "icons"?
<darkmatter> thorwil. that would be a bug with the pathbar methinks. I haven't played around with the back/forward ends of it yet
<thorwil> darkmatter: the lack of distractions makes a detail like that stand out ;)
<darkmatter> i dun like the network icon I ripped. gonna have to make a new one (well, ripped is stron, the theme is gpl :P)
<darkmatter> thorwil: aye
<darkmatter> also need moar better back/forward on the toolbars
<darkmatter> thorwil: hmmm... should I change the "!" on x.png to a red "x"?
<thorwil> darkmatter: what does it mean? my guess for th "!" would be no (write) permissions. "x" is tied to close/delete
<darkmatter> thorwil: the x in the tray as is is for disconnect type stuff. the "!" is mainly on messages. and x.png is a dropbox error message
<thorwil> darkmatter: try replacing the downward arrow with the !, i think it's too much detail for such a tiny thing
<darkmatter> I'm just trying to decide. mute/disconnect/network error all use an "x", so in that context it would make sense, but the x.png is when dropbox syncing fails. so, yeah
<darkmatter> thorwil: good idea. it's also more consistent with the other states
<thorwil> darkmatter: a change to a traffic sign shape (with the down arrow) could be an option. http://www.bridgelock.com/images/Traffic_sign.jpg
<darkmatter> hmmm... that may work. I think there is a tray one for gtk-warning I could edit
<vish> darkmatter:  "!" can mean attention , which is better for a disconnect icon...
<vish> there are already too many "x" in icons.. metacity close , close button , delete icon..
<darkmatter> vish: making two alts atm, then I'll screenie
<darkmatter> vish: thorwil: http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/1100/screenshotrtm.png
<darkmatter> I think I should kill the dash on the traffic sign though (top part of the broken arrow)
<thorwil> darkmatter: the top part of your down-arrow clashes with the traffic sign shape
<thorwil> yeah
<darkmatter> thowil: but anyway. traffic sign or box with "!"?
<thorwil> darkmatter: depends on whether you can make the arrow work in the /\ shape
<darkmatter> I'll revise it in a sec. must make coffee :D
<thorwil> chicago nobuntu edition: http://tinyurl.com/2darnbk
 * darkmatter decides etched monochrome for normal states that turn to fully rendered icons when delivering messages :O
<darkmatter> coz_: ^ or in more detail, etched in neutral monochrom-ish tray items (un-boring monochrome) that turn to "stuck on top (slight shadow border on the underside) fully rendered version when requiring attention. that way it's more distinct than little grey/black/tan blobs ;)
<darkmatter> coz_: and good afternoon to you good sir
<coz_> darkmatter,  :) hey guy how are you today :)
<darkmatter> coz_: goes well if I do say so. just had a huge tstorm that cooled crap off
<coz_> darkmatter,  oh?
<coz_> darkmatter,   thats good
<darkmatter> coz_: and yourself?
<coz_> darkmatter,  I am ok..thanks :)
<darkmatter> good good
<darkmatter> coz_: ya like my panel-tay-crap-thingy icon idea? will take a bit to execute properly, since talking apps vary so much from idle ones, so consistency in style will be tricky
<coz_> darkmatter,  sounds cool :)
<darkmatter> coz_: like, greyscale a stamp for messaging and etch it in. and have it pop up (either flush or slightly above the panel) and fully colorize on a new mail, etc etc. every icon will need its own work, since some items (like system crap) tend not to change state as often, or don't really require many speaking states
<coz_> darkmatter,   for sure... doing as many icons as this may take will be a pain :)
<darkmatter> coz_: well, we have two standard styles. technicolor blobs and monochromatic blobs, and both have the same effect of making one rub their eyes. so I thought "meeting in the middle" might prove to be a decent compromise (plus noone else does it ;))
<coz_> darkmatter,  i agree... so this is somewhat neutral grey?
<darkmatter> coz_: yes. basically the icons will be fully rendered but desaturated and etched in. they'll "surface" from their depressed state and re-saturate for speaking states (messages/errors/etc)
<coz_> cool :)
<darkmatter> I haven't started yet. but did a few quick pencil sketches (I dropped the standard tray for a mono one and was equally confused :P)
<coz_> :)
<coz_> darkmatter,  hey guy... I dont mean to cut this short... I must have ate something that is not agreeing with me :(   I will try to get back in a while... I think I am going to lay down
#ubuntu-artwork 2011-07-25
<darkmatter> coz_: next gdm is looking slick http://people.gnome.org/~halfline/shell-login-with-onscreen-keyboard.ogg
<darkmatter> :D
<coz_> nice
<coz_> darkmatter,  is that you reflected there? :)
<darkmatter> no
<darkmatter> video  off a dev blog
<coz_> ah ok
<darkmatter> i'm better looking ;p
<coz_> :)
<darkmatter> keyboard needs centering thogh
<coz_> yeah i see that
<coz_> be back in a bit ,, have to get to the store
#ubuntu-artwork 2011-07-29
<joaolucas_> Hello everbody!
<joaolucas_> How're you doing?
<joaolucas_> There's anybody here that can help me to contribute to ubuntu artworks?
<coz_> mmm
<coz_> joaolucas_,  well  ,,, not sure if the contest for wallpapers is going on let me check
<coz_> joaolucas_,    http://design.canonical.com/2011/07/get-excited-and-make-things-wallpaper-edition/
<joaolucas_> oh, thx
<joaolucas_> I'm brazilian, sorry for my bad english
<coz_> joaolucas_,  no problem :)
<coz_> joaolucas_,  so far , your english is fine :)
<joaolucas_> Oh, thx heheehhe
#ubuntu-artwork 2011-07-30
<coz_>   brb
#ubuntu-artwork 2013-07-28
<rsc1> hello!
