#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-10-08
<snap-l> Evening, everyone
<waldo323> good evening
<snap-l> Who all is here for the meeting?
 * waldo323 is
<snap-l> Anyone else?
<waldo323> maybe they went to get something to drink for the meeting?
<snap-l> Uh huh
<snap-l> Well, let's get started.
<snap-l> If you happen to wake up in the middle, feel free to make your presence known
<snap-l> http://loco.ubuntu.com/meetings/ubuntu-michigan/368/detail/
<snap-l> Forgot to put together an agenda, so we'll just wing it
<snap-l> 1) OLF
<snap-l> Thank you to everyone who helped out with the OLF booth
<waldo323> namely raig
<waldo323> craig
<snap-l> It was pretty awesome to have some folks from the Comic Convention drop on by either to get CDs, or to just ask questions
<snap-l> as well as other folks who didn't know about the various locos.
<snap-l> waldo323: You helped out as well
<snap-l> don't be shy. :)
<snap-l> We gave out a lot of discs, and I think people were genuinely happy to talk and learn more about Ubuntu
<waldo323> and there was good interaction between the locos from what I observed
<snap-l> Yeah, it was pretty nice
<snap-l> And the new Distro Watch video podcast interviewed me about the booth
<snap-l> Hopefully I didn't come off like an ass. :)
<waldo323> is there a link for it yet?
<snap-l> Noy yet.
<snap-l> Anywhol, really appreciate those who supported the effort.
<snap-l> I know the number of Michgan folks down at OLF this time around could be counted on two hands, but it was nice to get some involvement.
<snap-l> (And by counted on two hands, I mean without using bindary.)
<snap-l> binary, either
<snap-l> So, Any questions about OLF?
<snap-l> OK, moving on
<snap-l> 12.10 release party planning
<snap-l> Apparently there's a new Ubuntu release coming out
<snap-l> Who knew?
<waldo323> me
<rick_h_droid> party
<snap-l> And, as is customary, it's time to plan out a release party.
<snap-l> IN previous iterations, we've had them at the Liberty Street Brewery
<waldo323> how well does that work for everyone?
<snap-l> I'm OK with it, but usually smoser sets it up.
<snap-l> We tend to get an interesting crowd over there.
<snap-l> Other thought I had was trying for the Royal Oak Brewery.
<snap-l> Only problem is parking
<snap-l> If someone would like to take the ball and plan this out, that would be awesome.
<snap-l> Sat 20th October or 21st Sunday.
<waldo323> i would prefer saturday but may not be able to make it even then :-\
<snap-l> well, I can also post this to the list to see if someone would be interested in spearheading it.
<snap-l> Frankly, I don't have it in me to plan this at the moment.
<waldo323> sending it to the list sounds like a good idea
<snap-l> OK I'll post i to the list to ask if someone will spearhead this.
<snap-l> Any questions?
<snap-l> Not sure if the west side is planning something, or what.
<waldo323> i am guessing you or someone else has access to add it to the list of parties once we know we are having one?
<snap-l> Yeah, definitely.
<snap-l> So, anything else for the meeting?
<waldo323> penguicon had a productive meeting today
<snap-l> Oh yeah?
<waldo323> and will be looking for interested speakers and sponsors soon
<snap-l> Looked like they had two meetings, from the list notes. :)
<waldo323> i think the board meeting was a bit ago and got the notes out today
<waldo323> the planning meeting was held today and we got the minutes out today as well
<waldo323> unless our meeting notes went out twice :)
<snap-l> SO what's with this themed day shit? :)
<waldo323> we have a tentative dates of April 19- 21 2013 in Dearborn
<waldo323> haha I am not quite sure but can let you know when I do have a clue
<waldo323> we are hoping to have more tech this year so please let me know if you have topic ideas, people you'd like to see if possible, perhaps types of events like a release party, workshops, key signing events, bug jams, problem solving sessions etc
<snap-l> yeah, I think we need to partner closer with Penguicon
<waldo323> i would like to find some college level professors with interesting research to come to present
<snap-l> Ahem: Oakland UNiversity, David Garfinkle. :)
<waldo323> so added
<waldo323> do you already have contacts with him?
<waldo323> what could the loco do or be a part of at penguicon that we would like to do or be a part of
<waldo323> for this coming release party what does it take to put it together?
<snap-l> for release partiez, it usually takes just finding a venue and letting them know
<snap-l> and finding out if theyre able to house us.
<waldo323> ah,  would woodward avenue brewery be a good option?
<snap-l> re: garfine, jodee has contacts with him
<snap-l> whereisthat?
<snap-l> (on phone at the moment. :))
<waldo323> 22646 Woodward Avenue Ferndale, MI 48220
<waldo323> (me too)
<snap-l> I've never been there
<snap-l> Anywho, I'll post to the mailing list for getting someone to help spearhead this
<snap-l> Anything else?
<waldo323> not at the moment
<snap-l> If not, then I think we'll put this meeting to bed.
<waldo323> ok
<snap-l> Laterness, everyone. Thanks for the participation!
<waldo323> thank you for hosting
<waldo323> snap-l, have you been to black lotus in clawson?
<brousch> Good morning!
<rick_h_> party
<brousch> Are you going to the LEGO thing this weekend?
<rick_h_> yea, we're going friday after work
<snap-l> goodmoring
<rick_h_> ok, looks like my need to land this branch today fell apart...to the woodshop I go for the day. Have fun all. Thanks columbus!
<snap-l> Niiiice.
<snap-l> Didn't realize Canonical celebrated Columbus day
<rick_h_> the list of federal holidays if you're in the US
<snap-l> Really? That's pretty cool
<rick_h_> yea, basically whatever federal list your country holds to
<rick_h_> snap-l: I'll be down your way later. You working from home or office?
<snap-l> Office, unfortunately.
<rick_h_> doh, oh well
<snap-l> Yeah, if it were a Wednesday or Friday, I'd be here.
<rick_h_> have to hit up the rockler store just down from the CHC caribou so debating on some coffee shop time down there
<snap-l> Just upgraded Picasa to 25gb.
<snap-l> I'm moving some other site photos to it. Getting tired of hosting Gallery2
<brousch> I'm still grandfathered in at a ridiculously low price
<snap-l> $2.50 for me not running Gallery is a nice price to pay.
<snap-l> And I already run Wordpress for the one-off photos
 * snap-l remembers his brief flirtation with posting photos into a PHPBB2 area on my site for caption contests.
<brousch> Google owns me. I gave up on alternatives
<snap-l> http://decafbad.net/category/caption-contest/ <- I should do one of these again.
<rick_h_> bake it sun bake! http://ubuntuone.com/0zjV2ISHq9T68YWMdussh1
<derekv> i'd like a sort of visual dashbord for dev workstations
<derekv> eg local server for project X is started, git statuses, click to get logs/ run common scripts
<derekv> statuses for everything when your working with mutliple projects
<derekv> maybe some sort of generic dashboard app
<derekv> test driven enviroment configuration
<brousch> WTF I got an update for a bug on launchpad filed in 2007, which I confirmed fixed in Ubuntu 8.04 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/monodevelop/+bug/125069
<snap-l> brousch: Gotta love those automated processes.
<derekv> mug is tonight?
<derekv> i'm like 1mi from the farminington library
<derekv> oh today is monday
<snap-l> Yep. It's tomorrow
<derekv> i was thinking it was monday
<derekv> er tuesday
<derekv> goddamn i am tired
<derekv> think i'm going to work another hour then bust out
<snap-l> Just as long as you know Truman is President, you should be OK
<derekv> wait... Truman is Presedent?  Did something happen to Roosevelt??
<snap-l> Bad news, bro.
<jjesse> he's a vampire?
<brousch> I'm having fun with getting Fabric working on Android https://github.com/brousch/fabdroid
<brousch> Will a finally be run even if there's an exit() in the except?
<brousch> For instance, will this sleep if the exception is triggered? http://paste.mitechie.com/show/819/
<brousch> Nevermind, it is
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-10-09
<rick_h_> morning and such
<brousch> yepyep
<snap-l> Morning
<rick_h_> jcastro_: that cabinet looks nice
<jcastro_> thanks
<jcastro_> dang, tripped my first breaker with the new gear, lol
<rick_h_> hah! what were you doing?
<rick_h_> was it a 15A breaker or something?
<jcastro_> plugging in computers
<jcastro_> not sure
<rick_h_> orly, ouch
<jcastro_> so you think I need to get a larger one?
 * jcastro_ goes to investigate
<rick_h_> well you'll find some will be 20A, kitchen and bathroom usually
<rick_h_> I have my computer stuff off of a 20A since things like the printer/server/etc can draw a bunch of boot
<rick_h_> but if you blew a 20A then something's broken. I run my woodworking tools off of a 20A
<jcastro_> it's 15
<jcastro_> and like kitchens and bathroom are 20
<rick_h_> right
<jcastro_> and the heavy stuff is 30
<rick_h_> you want a 20 for your office
<jcastro_> ok so I need a 20 in my office?
<rick_h_> if you've got the server and such
<jcastro_> I do
<jcastro_> oh, also, it says GFCI and has a glowy thing on it
<rick_h_> or else setup that stuff hooked up to a 20 elsewhere in the house.
<jcastro_> no that won't work, it needs to be self contained in this room actually
<jcastro_> heh
<jcastro_> My wife and I are instigating a server/computer de-escalation.
<rick_h_> so yea, ideally I'd have an electician set you up with a 20A outlet in the room there with all the gear. Need to make sure the house wiring is up to the 20A rating, but I'd assume it's the same as in the kitchen/bathroom
<rick_h_> and make sure your outlet is matched so it won't blow
<jcastro_> the outlets are all the same brand as the rest, so I am assuming so. (I will of course have him check)
<rick_h_> right, but gfci can have a rating on them as well
<jcastro_> well, the breaker says gfco
<jcastro_> no gfci plus in here though
<rick_h_> oh, gotcha nvm sorry
<rick_h_> thought you meant it was an gfci outlet
<jcastro_> no, the breaker says GFCI
<jcastro_> maybe it's set up for it but they didn't do the plugs?
<rick_h_> fancy pants electrical box :P
<rick_h_> I'm guessing it's doing double duty at the box?
<jcastro_> either way, I'm not really just replacing the breaker in the box am I
<jcastro_> I need to call a guy?
<rick_h_> well, you want to make sure the wiring is ok for 20A
<rick_h_> 12GA vs 14GA, I'm pretty sure you need 12GA for 20A
 * jcastro_ shutsdown gear for now
<jcastro_> Do I just look in a plug?
<rick_h_> if it's 12GA wiring and the box isn't at max you can just swap out the breaker
<rick_h_> you'd need to pull the plug and check out the wiring coming through the walls
<jcastro_> maybe I can get lucky and just look without ripping the plug out
<rick_h_> well it should pop out iwth a couple of screws
<jcastro_> btw, thanks for telling me to get an impact wrench
<rick_h_> hah
<jcastro_> I put my desk together in 5 min
<jcastro_> do you think a light switch will be wired that way too?
<jcastro_> or should I look in an outlet?
<rick_h_> well, that's what I mean. All the wire on that circuit should be 12GA and I'm not sure if there's an easy way to check or not.
<rick_h_> ask Dave from the woodworking group. he can hook you up.
<jcastro_> oh, you never mailed me his info btw
<jcastro_> need it for the table
<snap-l> ColonelPanic001: http://govsgo.com/
<snap-l> Reminder: MUG tonight
<snap-l> Aludra Filesystem, Fishbowl
<snap-l> And if all goes well, the unveiling of the new MUG Store.
<ColonelPanic001> snap-l: looking
<ColonelPanic001> this looks... nicer
<ColonelPanic001> snap-l wins.
<ColonelPanic001> I'll have to try this out and if it's good, screw dragongoserver
<ColonelPanic001> unless something really sucks on this one. Nice find, thanks for sending it
<snap-l> np
<jcastro_> smoser, you going to mug tonight?
<smoser> jcastro_, no.
<smoser> :-(
<jcastro_> greg, when do you come home next?
<jcastro_> home being AA I mean
<snap-l> jcastro_: Are you coming to MUG?
<jcastro_> no car
<ColonelPanic001> jcastro_ is in MI again? I never get these newsletters.
<rick_h_> ColonelPanic001: you've got to hang in irc more :P
<rick_h_> irc == newsletter
<ColonelPanic001> :\
<ColonelPanic001> I'd say someone should just parse through, and email me the highlights, but I'd ignroe that, too
<rick_h_> we should just wrap the irc backlog and use it for a loco newsletter
<rick_h_> make us seem cool
<ColonelPanic001> just include any ascii art genitals I do, too
<ColonelPanic001> those are definitely highlights.
<snap-l> jcastro_: bah, there's gotta be someway to make this work.
<rick_h_> http://blog.bitbucket.org/2012/10/09/introducing-the-redesigned-bitbucket/ kind of cool. Looks like some nice improvements
<snap-l> Nice. Looking more like github. ;)
<rick_h_> yea
<snap-l> And the power is out.
<rick_h_> doh
<ColonelPanic001> snap-l: new kitten?
<rick_h_> man, ColonelPanic001 is really out of date
<ColonelPanic001> I'M SORRY I KNOW
<rick_h_> :P
<rick_h_> you've not seen the kitten blur photos on G+?
<rick_h_> my wife gets a kick out of them
<ColonelPanic001> we're trading cat pictures now? Have I been missing out on Internets Points?
<ColonelPanic001> anyone know of something like github or bitbucket that's self-hosted (but nice and shiney and featureful like them)?
<rick_h_> redmine is what I setup at morpace before I left
<rick_h_> it's not as nice, but it's there
<brousch> bitbucket offers unlimited free private repos. What more do you need?
<rick_h_> there's some gitolite + front end stuff
<ColonelPanic001> just curious for work
<brousch> Allura
<rick_h_> or just buy github like widox's work
<ColonelPanic001> I think what they liked about our current svn server at work is that it's integrated in with our accounts here
<brousch> Your own private Sourceforge
<ColonelPanic001> figured something self-hosted can be extended that way
<brousch> Supports svn, hg, and git
<rick_h_> http://gitlabhq.com/
<snap-l> You could run trac with git / SVN
<snap-l> ColonelPanic001: I posted a few on G+
<snap-l> JoDee has also published a few.
<ColonelPanic001> heh, thanks
<ColonelPanic001> I should actually look at G+ now and then
<brousch> Allura is legit. They've applied for apache project inclusion
<jcastro_> jrwren, how about you, you going to mug?
<rick_h_> brousch: I'd hardly use that as the measure of legit
<rick_h_> brousch: do you know what's up with their sale? Are they still investing in that at the new company?
<snap-l> rick_h_: Last I heard they are
<snap-l> They're looking to get off the PHP infra
<snap-l> I'd be surprised if they still had the PHP stuff running in 2013
<rick_h_> cool, just curious if word had spread what the new company was thinking
<shakes808> good afternoon all
<snap-l> howdy.
<brousch> rick_h_: I haven't spoken to Dave since just after the announcement
<greg> jcastro_: Christmas! We'll be in Chelsea
<jrwren> jcastro_: i do not go to mug.
<snap-l> That's because jrwren doesn't want to sully his Ann Arbor karma by driving into dirty Oakland County
<snap-l> where we have only a handful of Whole Foods and Trader Joes.
<jrwren> yup.
<snap-l> Pretty sure God will still let hippies into heaven who pass through Oakland COunty.
<snap-l> especially if it's for OSS events.
<snap-l> In fact, I've got God on speed dial right here. Let me ... yup. it's OK. God's really good  about anticipating phone calls.
<brousch> Anything East of Ann Arbor is Detroit. Who wants to go to Detroit?
<snap-l> brousch: You keep out of this
<snap-l> God dammit, AMD: http://www.reddit.com/r/Ubuntu/comments/11743j/ubuntu_developerstesters_please_comment_on_status/
<brousch> Intel FTW
<snap-l> Yeah, because having a flaccid card is better than having driver support.
<brousch> Indeed
<greg-g> jcastro_: et al ( snap-l , brousch , jrwren , rick_h_ , etc etc): our plans for that week are pretty chill, just relaxing.
<greg-g> that week being XMAS, and us being in Chelsea, for the new people I pinged
<greg-g> we'll see about beers one night though, definitely
 * greg-g will keep the channel up to date on developments
<snap-l> greg-g: We expect visits every time you're even remotely over the Michigan border. ;)
<snap-l> Even if you're flying over, have then lower a rope ladder or something.
<snap-l> ;)
<brousch> Xmas and New Years are always crazy for us. We end up having to visit half a dozen places around the state
<greg-g> yeah, chances are low
<greg-g> snap-l: I even feel bad when I'm in Chicago for an hour layover and don't tell nixternal ;)
<snap-l> greg-g: Yeah, but that's nixternal. ;)
<snap-l> He doesn't even hang around here anymore. ;)
<snap-l> We're like family
<snap-l> (with all of the rights, privileges, and crazies that statement brings)
<tony-smlr> Hi Everyone!,  I missed the last meeting but I was wondering if there is going to be a release party?
<snap-l> That's the plan.
<snap-l> I think James Hice was looking into some places
<snap-l> if you have some ideas on locations, post 'em to the list.
<snap-l> Welcome
<waldo323> welcome!
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-10-10
<jrwren> snap-l: you didn't trick me. there is no god.
<rick_h_> morning
<snap-l> jrwren: Heh
<snap-l> Good morning, btw.
<rick_h_> party
<snap-l> rick_h_: I think you just have a bot to say that now. ;)
<rick_h_> party party
<rick_h_> :P
<snap-l> heh
<brousch> Good morning
<snap-l> http://www.w3.org/community/ostatus/
<rick_h_> jrwren: a sword? Come on, we can get something bigger than that out here and mow these bastard doctests away
<rick_h_> jrwren: imagine the fit I had when I ran across this in my feed https://plus.google.com/u/0/104537541227697934010/posts/XEXfBGPdSPi
<brousch> Hehe. I wondered if you saw that
<rick_h_> I had to take my meds again but I survived
<rick_h_> widox: CHC? should I bring the keyboard stuff?
<rick_h_> and derekv you coming to CHC tonight?
<snap-l> rick_h_: Oh c'mon... what's a little doctesting in js going to hurt? ;)
<rick_h_> I <3 Ian, he made web dev in python really happen. but he's on the list "If I ever have a bomb..."
<brousch> Really?
<brousch> Must be a long list
<rick_h_> it is, sorted by rank :P
<widox> rick_h_: yep, planning to be there
<rick_h_> widox: ok, found my keycap puller as well
<widox> rick_h_: awesome
<snap-l> You didn't
<rick_h_> didn't what?
<snap-l> Seriously, butter knife, and you're good
<snap-l> Keycap puller. You have a problem.
<rick_h_> keycap puller is nice. Very ergo
<widox> rick_h_: awesome
<widox> heh, whoops
<rick_h_> see, the man's all excited about a keycap puller
<brousch> How is this not a fetish?
<rick_h_> there aren't online videos of it involving people missing clothing?
 * brousch pulls up an incognito window to check that statement
<rick_h_> http://www.tumblr.com/tagged/mechanical-keyboard?before=1307426437
<rick_h_> so that does include the word fetish, but I think he's mistaken
<brousch> Boom, second hit http://www.destructoid.com/elephant//ul/5292-468x-Gaming_Fetish_by_PortraitGallery.jpg
<brousch> All the naughty bits are covered, so probably SFW
<rick_h_> psh, so that's not a real keyboard. That's a gamer with glowing bits
<snap-l> http://everyjoe.com/files/130/2006/07/angel-kitty-usb-chest-keyboard.jpg
<rick_h_> gaming == fetish...not keyboards
<snap-l> You're welcome
<snap-l> http://everyjoe.com/technology/keyboard-on-the-boobs-130/
<brousch> I am so tempted to get that for rick_h_'s wife
<snap-l> lol
<widox> haha
<rick_h_> jcastro_: http://www.semiww.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=12097
<snap-l> Men of Steel. That sounds like fun
<rick_h_> heh, yea
<rick_h_> guys doing some cool welding/steel stuff
<rick_h_> http://www.semiww.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=12039
<snap-l> nice
<jcastro_> rick_h_: weird
<jcastro_> restarting xchat worked
<rick_h_> jcastro_: strange
<rick_h_> something wanted to change the port for ssl I bet.
<rick_h_> file a bug!
<snap-l> Where would one do that? :)
<rick_h_> add another person to the list... http://thomaslarock.com/2012/10/use-what-works-prefixing-database-tables-with-tbl/
<snap-l> NO NO NO NO NO
<snap-l> God, that's like adding a .txt to a text file in UNIX
<brousch> I do that
<snap-l> brousch: We already have your coordinates.
<snap-l> Just need the materials to make it happen. ;)
<snap-l> Seriously, though, hungarian notation needs to just go the way of the dodo
<snap-l> As a "it was nice when our tools were crude, and our intellects dulled, but now that we have better tools and the FUCKING RENAISSANCE happened, we're good"
<brousch> Calm down d00d
<widox> rick_h_: well, he is an SQL Rockstar...
<_stink_> god
<_stink_> the comments on that table prefix post are something else
<_stink_> the first couple are very lucid and make the points that need to be made
<_stink_> then there's this gem:
<snap-l> This is the kind of shit that we suffered at Chrysler.
<_stink_> "The truth in the matter is that the only thing that really matters is that you code and naming standards are consistent and readable."
<_stink_> really?
<_stink_> then i'll name all strings "dog" + the string value of a counter.
<snap-l> Yeah, 13 character names for tables / columns, with the leader being the data type
<snap-l> intfrblnomglf
<snap-l> Really fucking readable.
<snap-l> and we had MEEETINGS to make them consistent
<_stink_> i love it
<snap-l> Honestly, it was mostly because we had IBM's bullshit UNIX version of DB2
<snap-l> which was like wearing bellbottoms in 2000
<snap-l> Unless you're doing it ironically, you're doing it wrong. ;)
<jrwren> rick_h_: i imagine you rage facing pretty hard when you ran across that g+ doctest.js post
<jrwren> there is no such thing as an SQL rockstar. if SQL was music it would be gregorian chanting.
<rick_h_> I like that
<snap-l> jrwren: Could we at least have the headless monks from Doctor Who?
<snap-l> I'd like to think my SQL has flaming swords or something
<jrwren> sure
<rick_h_> hah, I see someone http://jonathancarter.org/2012/10/10/ltsp-by-the-sea-2012/
<jrwren> i only recognize jam.
<jrwren> not sure I'd recognize ron
<jrwren> well, yes I would, he is not in that pic :)
<rick_h_> yea, meant jam
<snap-l> Yeah, JIm was over at Maine
<snap-l> as was Scott
<jcastro_> anyone know if James Hice is on IRC?
<snap-l> Not at the moment
<jcastro_> but does he irc?
<jcastro_> I guess is the question
<rick_h_> yea, he just hops in from time to time
<rick_h_> waldoxxx (can't recall the rest) is hisnick
<jcastro_> ah right
<snap-l> Yeah
<jcastro_> we have new neighbors
<jcastro_> and they friend James on FB
<snap-l> Are they a part of Penguicon?
<jcastro_> so they might be nerds
<jcastro_> which would be awesome
<jcastro_> not sure
<brousch> What's hisnick?
<jcastro_> dunno
<snap-l> jcastro_: Do you know their names?
<jcastro_> Eric Castle
<jcastro_> forget her name
<snap-l> Not ringing a bell
<rick_h_> that sounds familiar
<jcastro_> http://vim.spf13.com/
<jcastro_> look, insta-rick vim!
<rick_h_> bah, not another one
<Blazeix> anybody know of a service that allows you to follow authors and musicians, and notifies you when they release new material?
<snap-l> Blazeix: I'd like to know.
<snap-l> Outside of stalking folks on Twitter, I have no idea
<Blazeix> i'm at the point where i'm thinking i should learn NLP and parse wikipedia...
<snap-l> Amazon is pathetic for letting me know about new releases.
<Blazeix> but i suspect that road leads to misery
<Blazeix> oh, duh, amazon might be a better datasource >_<
<snap-l> Blazeix: Maybe it's a biz model.
<snap-l> or discogs
<snap-l> but I think Discogs lags
<rick_h_> yea, you'd almost think amazon sohuld have a wishlist author/artist feature
<brousch> Blazeix: Kickstart that shit!
<rick_h_> Blazeix: and then nlp up bookie for the tag suggestions kthx :)
<snap-l> ;)
<Blazeix> i bookmarked a nlp link on bookie. does that count?
<Blazeix> even added a 'nlp' tag!
<brousch> I feel much better now that I have a manifesto to follow http://dot.kde.org/2012/10/08/kde-manifesto
<rick_h_> Blazeix: lol, there should be a few
<rick_h_> https://bmark.us/recent/nlp
<rick_h_> and none are mine doh
<rick_h_> ah, I went for spelled out doh https://bmark.us/recent/natural
<rick_h_> there all better
<rick_h_> ok...so someone let me know why I can't say 'wtf!!!' to this comment in here http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4637339
<rick_h_> the new high res screen..one one version of one laptop...that they *just* released...is what is the base case for the font rendering in the OS?
<brousch> Why are you so caremad about this?
<brousch> Is the fact that Apple makes the best keyboards in the world enticing you back to a Mac?
<rick_h_> because it just strikes me as the perfect apple fanboi response to something "You're using it wrong. Clearly fonts are targeted for retina using macbook users...which is a VERY limited install/sold base"
<rick_h_> ummm, no no no and no
<rick_h_> they make the best trackpads, thinkpad keyboards ftw
<snap-l> rick_h_:  I didn't get that from the post. It is just that Apple choses hinting that errs on the side of "correctness" instead of Ubuntu's hinting
<rick_h_> snap-l: I was referring to the comment
<snap-l> Again, I'm not seeing the problem. Apple has always erred towards print
<snap-l> They finally got the screen that makes sense for the mac: the retina display.
<rick_h_> I guess I need to express my confused rage to the comment in person tonight. I'll try to really emphasize my issue :)
 * snap-l senses that's a euphemism for "hit on the head with a baseball bat"
 * snap-l will bring his "The Mac is not a Typewriter" book.
<rick_h_> hah
<Blazeix> party going on in #coffeehousecoders
<mulka> hello
<snap-l> party?
<Blazeix> party.
<snap-l> I need evidence.
<snap-l> so far, no evindence found
<mulka> party?
<rick_h_> mulka: party
<Blazeix> we probably need an irc bot in here that's triggered by the word 'party'
<greg-g> or, an irc bot that just says party every 2 hours of silence
<Blazeix> wouldn't want to put rick_h_ out of a job :P
<greg-g> Blazeix: I'm just trying to give him more wordworking time!
<rick_h_> hah!
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-10-11
<rick_h_> morning
<brousch> I guess I haven't updated in a while. 750MB of updates waiting
<rick_h_> nice
<brousch> I may get to report a real Python bug
<brousch> subprocess.Popen assumes that you have /bin/sh, but on Android it's at /system/bin/sh
<brousch> So anything using Popen breaks on Android
<brousch> Which includes Fabric
<rick_h_> yea, that's kind of stupid of android
<rick_h_> why I say it's not linux :P
<brousch> Because they moved /bin/sh?
<rick_h_> yea
<brousch> well sys.platform report 'linux-armv71'. That's Linuxy enough for me
<rick_h_> man, so I don't want to hate....but http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-19909106 vs http://news.slashdot.org/story/12/10/10/2113239/in-under-10-hours-google-patches-chrome-to-plug-hole-found-at-its-pwnium-event
<snap-l> rick_h_: Not sure where the hate is
<rick_h_> for greg-g when he gets up http://techcrunch.com/2012/10/11/bicymple/ kind of interesting
<rick_h_> snap-l: well it seems a bit FF bashing. I mean FF pulls the download and freaks out, Chrome just patches 10hrs later and deploys
<brousch> Nobody's going to downgrade
<brousch> They'll just use IE and Chrome until Thursday
<rick_h_> yea, so I'll hold off until I see how long it takes them to get the fix out
<rick_h_> but kind of sad
<brousch> My users started getting FF16 yesterday or the day before. Now it is nagging them about old versions of plugins
<snap-l> rick_h_: It might be serious enough not to have folks using it
<snap-l> the BBC article doesn't go into a lot of detail
<rick_h_> yea, but the chrome bug was a complete ownage bug for the max reward
<rick_h_> so I can't imagine it's a higher level than the chrome one
<snap-l> Well, exposing your history to a website is a privacy bug
<snap-l> and that may be a little more scary to folks. :)
<brousch> http://news.slashdot.org/story/12/10/10/2016218/ubuntu-asks-users-to-pay-what-they-want
<snap-l> Way to be on the case, /.
<brousch> eh?
<snap-l> Actually, that was yesterday. SOrry
<snap-l> thought it was today.
<snap-l> Can I Fund Unity a Negative Amount? (Score:3, Insightful)
<brousch> If it's old news, I missed it the first time
<brousch> Yes!
<rick_h_> yea, it's been taking heat all day
<snap-l> "Can I tell your dad yo pull out next time?"
<rick_h_> even paul ranted against it
<brousch> Paul Bunyan?
<snap-l> rick_h_: paul... ?
<rick_h_> Paul Tagliamonte (sp?)
<snap-l> Wonder what got his goat
<snap-l> Or is this Amazon Lens part 2
<rick_h_> http://blog.pault.ag/post/33337643785/stuff-thats-bothering-me-about-ubuntu-right-now
<snap-l> It has an option for donating to upstream projects
<snap-l> seriously
<rick_h_> well you donate to ubuntu with the desire to see 'better upstream' or something
<snap-l> and if your big hangup is that it's not sending money to Debian, then say "No thanks" and funnel the cash to Debian
<rick_h_> it's not a way to send direct $$ to debian
<snap-l> Gettimg a little tired of "my special geode must be acknowledged at all times" thinking
<rick_h_> yea, I'm a giant 'whatever' to that tbh
<rick_h_> if you want to donate to debian, debian.org ...done
<snap-l> precisely
<brousch> Better coordination with Debian and upstreams
<brousch> OH good, they have Better support for flavours like Kubuntu, Xubuntu, Lubuntu
<snap-l> Yeah, and imagine the shitstorm on "Ubuntu 13.04, now with 2% more Debian interaction"
<brousch> I might actually donate to that
<snap-l> "ONLY 2%? GAHNARFLEFOP FOP FOP FOP"
<brousch> There's no LAunchpad option. Poor rick_h_
<rick_h_> :(
<snap-l> on the same token, I'm wondering how much more of this the community can take
<rick_h_> that's ok, I don't work for "Launchpad" any more. I now work for "Cloud Engineering"
<snap-l> Because it seems every release has some "rage factor"
<brousch> If you want to stay interesting, you gotta keep everyone whipped to a foamy froth. Fox News taught us that.
 * snap-l gives brousch the stink-eye.
<brousch> Ubuntu: The Fox News of Linux Distros
<brousch> I don't really think that, BTW
<brousch> I don't see the donation thing as bad. It's optional
<rick_h_> the donation thing existing before but it was moved to be more up front
<brousch> See, I didn't even know it existed
<rick_h_> I didn't either
<brousch> Where's the 'Put Shuttleworth on the moon" option?
 * dzho isn't sure if that's meant in a good way or a bad way
<dzho> I mean, he's already a space case
<brousch> I like him
<jrwren> donate to ubuntu is foolish. I cannot respect any company that uses donations as a business model. either they are for profit or they aren't.
<rick_h_> yea, but that's the thing. Ubuntu isn't a for-profit company...canonical is
<rick_h_> it's a strange line to straddle
<rick_h_> and http://www.reddit.com/r/sysadmin/comments/119f6m/red_hat_salesman_just_fucked_up/ for the lol of the day
<widox> haha
<widox> I'm always double checking my mute status during calls
<jrwren> ubuntu is a canonical product.
<jrwren> what you just said is like saying Windows isn't a for-profit company... microsoft is.
<snap-l> jrwren: That doesn't follow
<rick_h_> I don't know. We're in ubuntu-us-mi not canonical-us-mi
<jrwren> how does it not follow?
<rick_h_> it's UDS, not canonical dev summit
<snap-l> Ubuntu is an OS that is jointly developed with the community
<jrwren> right, we use a product from canonical.
<jrwren> snap-l: it is? how is it jointly developed with the community?
 * jrwren mind is blown
<rick_h_> debian merged every release?
<snap-l> jrwren: I think Canonical tends to forget. ;)
<jrwren> right, that isn't jointly developed any more than amazon's linux is joinly developed.
<rick_h_> ubuntu app contests and such
<ColonelPanic001> holy crap, if you guys do it at FSB in Lincoln Park, I'm in
<rick_h_> oh come on, that's a bit unfair
<jrwren> app contests are marketing stuff, much like MSFT app conteests
<ColonelPanic001> I usually don't go to this stuff because it's an hour or whatever drive
<ColonelPanic001> but FSB is a semi-regular place for me
<snap-l> ColonelPanic001: FSB?
<rick_h_> ^
<rick_h_> front side bus
<snap-l> Front Street Brewery
<rick_h_> oh
<brousch> The release party should be held at a local Canonical employee's house
<ColonelPanic001> sorry, yeah
<ColonelPanic001> FSB == Fort Street Brewery
<snap-l> Yeah, it's on the mailing list.
<rick_h_> gotcha, I looked it up
<snap-l> Trying to schedule out the release party
<snap-l> Looking for options, and for folks to contact these places to see if they could house is.
<snap-l> s/is/us/
<brousch> snap-l: Is Royal Oak Brewery near your house?
<snap-l> Yeah, it's close.
<snap-l> We hit it frequently.
<brousch> If it's there I might be able to swing the same deal as when I came last time
<snap-l> http://goo.gl/maps/JG3JB
<brousch> Bring my son, he can hang out with my sister, give my wife a day off
<snap-l> Here's where Fort St. is: http://goo.gl/maps/5lC4x
<snap-l> It's about 20 minutes from Royal Oak.
<snap-l> So it wouldn't be completely out of the way.
<snap-l> brousch: Hell, we could carpool if you wanted. :)
<snap-l> I'm just looking for options so folks who know of an awesome place have a voice in this
<ColonelPanic001> Royal Oka Brewery was nice the one time I was there with rick_h_
<snap-l> as opposed to me looking around my neighborhood and picking something. :)
<snap-l> ColonelPanic001: Yeah, we had MI Developers there
<ColonelPanic001> nice
<ColonelPanic001> I remember it as being a little less spacious than FSB, but for this, might not be enough to be worth worrying about
<ColonelPanic001> FSB is more of a "one big room" layout
<snap-l> Yeah, this is one big room with a patio out back
<snap-l> although witht he 50F days we've been having, that might not be a "good thing" (TM)
<widox> ROB would still be more spacious then Liberty Street in Plymouth
<ColonelPanic001> Frozen Beer Slushies for everyone!
<snap-l> widox: Yeah, but we seem to get folks that I never see any other time of the year at Plymouth
<snap-l> like smoser. ;)
<smoser> snap-l, i really wanted to go to mug
<snap-l> smoser: Yeah, we missed you. It was a pretty good talk.
<snap-l> FUSE is pretty neat, and how he intergrated it with PostgreSQL was interesting
<snap-l> But I also know that UDS is around the corner, so that's a busy time for folks.
<brousch> Darn a family thing has popped up on the 20th. So I'm only in for the 21st.
<snap-l> brousch: Nuts.
<brousch> Dangit, now people want to move the family to the 28th, so I have no idea
<snap-l> Well, if more folks can't make it on the 20th, then maybe the 21st is a better option
<brousch> But don't plan around me
<snap-l> OK
<brousch> Even with the family thing on the 20th it gets messy because that means my sister will probably stay in GR until the 21st
<rick_h_> greg-g: :P you're not supposed to use other linux distros, but it's cool if you have a mac/windows machine on the network you want to sync with
<brousch> There are other distros?
<snap-l> I <3 when something is 100x easier than I thought it would be
<snap-l> That little bit of hacking on my python version of due_today that I did last night got me looking again at making it a plugin for todosh
<snap-l> and all that I'd need to change is getting it to read an environment variable and show some help text
<snap-l> https://github.com/ginatrapani/todo.txt-cli/wiki/Creating-and-Installing-Add-ons
<brousch> snap-l: This seems like your kind of thing http://mediagoblin.org/pages/campaign.html
<snap-l> brousch: Yeah, had I not moved to Picasa for photo hosting, I might check it out
<snap-l> I still might
<snap-l> greg-g: Damn you. Getting me to look up constitutionality of the Federal Reserve before lunch. ;)
<snap-l> ^ ref: http://identi.ca/conversation/96468055#notice-97286892
<greg-g> rick_h_: :P
<greg-g> snap-l: hahaha, sorry, pete and I can get into it at times ;)
<jcastro_> you know
<jcastro_> this might sound weird
<jcastro_> but I do miss wool pants
<rick_h_> yes, that sounds strange alright
<jcastro_> I am wearing my comfy wool pants, if I would have stayed in Florida I would not have gotten to enjoy them
<snap-l> jcastro_: You're right
<snap-l> Wool, or fleece?
<jcastro_> wool
<greg-g> I too love wool
<greg-g> I might start wearing a wool bike jersey to commute
<jcastro_> I need to find wherever my wool socks are
<snap-l> greg-g: The fun part about that conversation is it's like debating a religious fundamentalist
<snap-l> ie: constitution as written, and not taking into account the myriad of historic cases that defined the document
<rick_h_> never had wool pants before so guess I don't understand
<snap-l> Last time I had wool pants was a marching band uniform
<snap-l> it was the antithesis of comfort.
<jcastro_> rick_h_, basically, winter indoor pants
<rick_h_> jcastro_: there's no such thing. Indoor it's shorts or bust
<jcastro_> so instead of cranking up the heat I just put them on
<jcastro_> yeah, but now that I have a house I have become an even cheaper bastard
 * rick_h_ was wearing a hoodie with my shorts this morning
<jcastro_> so it's like, pants come on vs. raising the thermostat
<jcastro_> rick_h_, hah, me too
<rick_h_> ok, bought a GSM mifi device. We'll see how well this works out
<rick_h_> man does this seem 100x harder than it should be
<snap-l> rick_h_: Is it compatible with the US Verizon?
<rick_h_> so no, I'll get a prepaid ATT card to test it with before I leave
<snap-l> Ah, so it's AT&T then?
<rick_h_> well it's global. Does all kinds of networks
<rick_h_> but it's GSM and not CDMA
<rick_h_> and not LTE
<greg-g> cool
<snap-l> Unlocked?
<rick_h_> :(
<rick_h_> yea, unlcoked
<snap-l> OK.
<greg-g> jcastro_: dude, I was cheap bastard when I rented, but mostly because I rented cheap places where I paid heat
<jcastro_> I'm just working on becoming a cheaper bastard
<rick_h_> HSPA+/HSPA/UMTS 2100/900MHz, EDGE/GPRS/GSM 1900/1800/900/850 MHz
<jrwren> jcastro_: I too am waering wool trousers. Mine are partly silk lined and very comfy.
<jcastro_> but I am a technologically minded cheap bastard
<rick_h_> jcastro_: yea, says the nest in the corner :P
<jcastro_> so like, LED lightbulbs might be expensive, but I'm more longrun cheap
<jcastro_> rick_h_, yeah, but it does save me money vs. the POS thermostat that was unusable before it
<snap-l> https://ting.com/devices/Sprint-Airave
<jcastro_> which was so hard to use my only recourse was "heat on, heat off" because the thing was designed by morons
<rick_h_> snap-l: I looked at the ting hotspot but only US freq
<jcastro_> also, when we have our house party, I will show you the epic UI of my lawn sprinkler controller
<snap-l> Yeah, Sprint isn't international
<rick_h_> https://ting.com/devices/Huawei-5072 CDMA 800/1900 MHz
<jcastro_> it's basically the stupidest design I've ever seen
<snap-l> Damn CDMA devices.
<rick_h_> jcastro_: hah, my neighbor's control is push button
<rick_h_> it's crazy
<snap-l> jcastro_: Um, unless you have dimmer-heat, aren't most thermostats heat on / heat off?
<snap-l> or do you have some fancy zone control
<jcastro_> snap-l, it's on/off
<jcastro_> but the scheduling is automatic
<jcastro_> ie. you don't need to program it
<snap-l> Yeah, we have a cheapie programmable.
<jcastro_> after a while it knows I like it warm in the morning and cool off during the day
<snap-l> Won a wifi-enabled thermostat, but it's not compatible with our current house
<jcastro_> the cool thing about the nest is actually in the summer
<jcastro_> where it will keep the fan running but the compressor off while it cools
<jcastro_> it can save you something like 30%
<snap-l> That's nice
<jcastro_> and of course, keeping a history of all your usage is nice
<jcastro_> stupid that they don't have an API
<rick_h_> http://www.amazon.com/Honeywell-RTH230B-5-2-Programmable-Thermostat/dp/B000EW5U86/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1349971980&sr=8-4&keywords=honeywell+thermostat
<rick_h_> is what I have
<jcastro_> I am investigating whole-house energy meters so I can measure my usage
<rick_h_> set it 6am, 68deg, then 8am 64, then 5pm, 68, then 8pm 64
<rick_h_> something like that
<jcastro_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtFOXq_iIe4
<jcastro_> I asked DTW to get into this program ^^
<jcastro_> err, DTE
<jcastro_> but it was a "don't call us, we'll call you"
<snap-l> jcastro_: They're heavily invested in the smart appliances program
<snap-l> forgot the acronym
<jcastro_> yeah
<snap-l> It's the privacy-destroying one that people can figure out if you have your refrigerator on too high
<jcastro_> it's just hard to get in on it
<snap-l> I thought it was pretty automatic
<snap-l> ie: get smart meter, and you're there.
<jcastro_> I don't have a smart meter afaict
<snap-l> Yeah, you'd know
<snap-l> If you have to wait 10 seconds to read it, it's a smart meter. ;)
<widox> I don't think they started rolling them out widespread yet; there were concerns from customers
<widox> and, they'll be raising everyones rate for them
<widox> I don't think you as a customer get access to the data though; just whatever DTE gives you via their webapp
<widox> could be wrong though
<snap-l> widox: I think that's one of the biggest concerns
<widox> and, omg, it emits radio frequencies!!!1!
<snap-l> "Mr. widox, you're using way too much electricity for this residence. May we come in?"
<snap-l> (said in a slightly less poilite manner)
<widox> yeah - I mean I dont' see an issue with it. I'm paying for the power, they already know how much I get in total
<snap-l> Once you get away from aggregated numbers, people get weird.
<widox> I'm sure Richard Stallman is behind it because we can't see the source
<snap-l> "I don't mind if the project knows how many downloads it gets this month, but I'll burn your house down if you tell them I downloaded it"
<widox> true, but I don't think it knows what exactly is drawing power. just that a 3pm you used more then at 3am
<snap-l> widox: With the smart meters, it'll know what device draws what power
<snap-l> iirc, it sets up a mini LAN of your appliances.
<snap-l> each knowing how much it's drawing, and reporting that back to DTE
<snap-l> who then can send signals back to those unints
<snap-l> I think it's supposed to be the smart version of AC units in the summer on a separate, controlled circuit
<snap-l> ie: load gets too high, they can be intermittently shut down.
<rick_h_> wooooooo!!!!! http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-announce-list/2012-October/009646.html
<snap-l> Ew, lxml.
<snap-l> Nobody uses XML anymore. ;)
<rick_h_> heh, except breadability
<snap-l> Thanks for visiting our online store recently. We noticed you left some items in your cart and want to make sure you know the
<snap-l> +benefits of buying direct. If you experienced a problem during checkout, we'd like to help.
<snap-l> Shit, I left some books unpurchased at O'Reilly?
<rick_h_> whoops
<snap-l> Not sure why I got that. My cart is clean.
<snap-l> Just found that funny: we noticed you haven't bought something. Is there a problem?
<snap-l> "Normally the resistance between our books and your wallet is 0 ohms, and we noted a fluctuation in that measurement"
<jcastro_> snap-l, yeah but your appliance needs to support that
<jcastro_> which is kind of cool because you can do "dishwasher, turn on at night when it's cheap."
<jrwren> rick_h_: Huawei is evil! don't buy it!
<rick_h_> jrwren: :(
<rick_h_> but it's the best I can come up with looking at things
<jrwren> it will probably crash a lot if it is like other huawei devices.
<rick_h_> seems a common issue with all these things
<rick_h_> I spent a while going through various amazon reviews of various devices
<rick_h_> this one doesn't have a ton, but the other related device was rated pretty well
<brousch> Huaweii devices all have a backdoor for the Chinese govt built in
<rick_h_> yea, I'm sure they can get their free porn more easily than chasing my connection down :P
<rick_h_> I'm seriously cranky that verizon won't unlock any of their devices :(
<rick_h_> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B006FOAV1I/ref=s9_simh_gw_p107_d0_i3?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-3&pf_rd_r=16A96XQ1BA186B3YB6NA&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=470938811&pf_rd_i=507846 has all kinds of issues
<rick_h_> on several sites the hardware is rated as very poor, hot, shuts down/reboots
<rick_h_> http://www.amazon.com/UNLOCKED-HUAWEI-HSDPA-WCDMA-MOBILE/dp/B004SLEX8C/ref=pd_ybh_5 I almost got but shipped from china and a review or two about it not being unlocked in fact
<rick_h_> http://www.amazon.com/Unlocked-ZTE-Mobile-Hotspot-Router/dp/B0084CZRKE/ref=pd_ybh_11 was the other one I considered
<brousch> Oh it's unlocked. It's unlocked right to the Communist overlords
<rick_h_> but the other one is HSPA+
<rick_h_> so should get better speeds if I use it on ATT ever and such
<jrwren> i think i'll upgrade my home server to quetzel
<jrwren> i mean, how much change can there be between now and release?
<rick_h_> not much
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-10-12
<rick_h_> morning
<snap-l> Morning
<brousch> ug
<snap-l> That good, eh?
<brousch> Dealt with an ftp plugin and autocad already this morning
<snap-l> Oh lovely.
<brousch> ftp java plugin
<snap-l> Oh, that's brilliant.
<brousch> Thank you
<brousch> is rick_h_ hanging at the LEGO thing today?
<rick_h_> brousch: yep, going to leave work early and hit open time 4pm
<brousch> If we go, it will be Sunday
<rick_h_> yea, hoping most hit up the weekend. Sat seems sold out
<brousch> So let me know if it's worth the 6 hours of driving
<rick_h_> hah
<rick_h_> the map looks awesome
<rick_h_> and my wife threatened to take my wallet away today
<rick_h_> with lots of reminders that "Christmas is coming soon...coming soon..."
<brousch> Well yeah, you need to buy christmas presents for the kid
<brousch> George has put in a specific request for a Darth Vader minifig
<brousch> I want General Grievous
<rick_h_> we're still in duplo land
<brousch> Good point. Best to hold out.
<snap-l> Yeah, but the graduation ceremony will be one for the ages
<brousch> eh?
<rick_h_> my wife things we're saving for retirement, we're really just saving for the addition to the house for the 'lego room'
<rick_h_> once we grad from duplo to the good stuff
<snap-l> brousch: Graduating from duplo to lego proper.
<brousch> ah
<brousch> The LEGO pole barn
<rick_h_> bwuhahahaha tiling window manager <3 from an ex mac-head http://goo.gl/3bD38
<rick_h_> ouch, two of the top 3 guys in the group heading out. /me looks around to check if something's in the water
<brousch> What group? Heading out to where?
<rick_h_> work
<rick_h_> leaving for other jobs
<brousch> Ah
<rick_h_> been around a long time so ok, but still kind of 'whoa'
<widox> heh. I've had 3 people from my team leave in the past 6 months, and another that moved to a different team
<brousch> Maybe they feel it is in good hands now so they are comfortable leaving
<rick_h_> doesn't it make you look around a bit?
<rick_h_> 'ummm...so what email did you guys get I didn't get?'
<widox> feels more awkward when they are more senior folks
<rick_h_> yea
<rick_h_> Blazeix: http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/opensource/library/os-pythonnltk/index.html for ya
<greg-g> g'morn
<brousch> Afternoon (12:19:03 PM) greg-g: g'morn
<rick_h_> greg-g: is partying
<greg-g> hey, it was 9:19 for me, and yes, I got to sleep in until 8 today
<greg-g> after the 5am wake yesterday, with a 6:49 Caltrain ride, and an 8am webinar I had to give
<greg-g> so, :P
<brousch> huh what the: nixternal 12:51pm via TweetDeck been usingÂ #ubuntuÂ 12.10 &Â #unityÂ now for over a month on my 2nd machine. absolutely enjoying it. kudos to the dev team, good stuff!
<rick_h_> it's gotten better
<brousch> Are the application menus still in the top bar?
<snap-l> brousch: Is there bear shit in the woods?
<brousch> Not by my house
<rick_h_> I hear they're taking over camping porta-pods everywhere
<brousch> Coyote maybe
<Blazeix> rick_h_: neat, thanks
<waldo323> Blazeix, rick_h_ which way/how do you typically back up your phones?
<Blazeix> pretty much everything i have on my phone lives on THE CLOUD
<Blazeix> though i've heard good things about "titanium backup"
<jcastro_> rick_h_: hey
<jcastro_> what console mp3 player is the best?
<jcastro_> I need something headless
 * waldo323 sets the volume=11
<waldo323> are you looking for mpd + cli client?
<jcastro_> I don't need a fancy client/server thing, just a basic console/curses player
<widox> waldo323: the Astro file manager works decently as an easy way to backup apk's
<waldo323> thanks
<waldo323> jcastro_, do you already have vlc installed? it has a headless mode
<waldo323> i think it is cvlc
<jcastro_> looking
<jcastro_> ta
<jcastro_> http://www.tuxarena.com/static/cmus_guide.php
<jcastro_> dude
<jcastro_> this thing is awesome
<jcastro_> rick_h_: this is right up your alley
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-10-13
<rick_h_> jcastro_: yep, used cmus before good stuff
<rick_h_> these days though I just end up in my browser tbh
<rick_h_> or doing bluetooth out of my tablet streaming
<rick_h_> waldo323: I don't really. Everything lives in my google account and anything else is meh
<rick_h_> brousch: so lego thing is cool, not sure it's worth 3hr of drive though
<rick_h_> brousch: it would be cooler for an older kid though
<rick_h_> brousch: https://plus.google.com/photos/112719704219936118281/albums/5798582099473266529?banner=pwa
<brousch> How much Star Wars is there?
<rick_h_> brousch: a little bit. Not a ton of that to play with
<rick_h_> and I didn't go into the ninjago or whatever section
<brousch> He likes the stations where you make cars to race
<brousch> We didn't get to do that for long at legoland
<rick_h_> yea, they had that
<rick_h_> and some remote control cars to run around
<rick_h_> the building stations were cool where they'd do games/contests
<brousch> ONly small buildings?
<rick_h_> 'let's all build a dinosaur'
<rick_h_> small buildings?
<brousch> legoland had frickin huge buildings from lego
<brousch> like 10ft tall
<rick_h_> well they had ones a few feet tall
<rick_h_> yea, don't think we saw anything 10'
<rick_h_> but honestly, we ran through kind of quick. He was too little for a lot of it
<rick_h_> so we spent our time in duplo land sitting on a pile of bricks and playing with animals for most of the time tbh
<brousch> huge duplo pile
<rick_h_> they had an even larger pile of normal bricks for the older kids
<rick_h_> https://plus.google.com/photos/112719704219936118281/albums/5798582099473266529/5798584319673260034?banner=pwa
<rick_h_> that was about 2/3 of it I think
<brousch> geez
<brousch> fill my pockets
<rick_h_> but we got there right at 4:15 and it was crowed, just packed
<rick_h_> people were waiting for my parking spot when we left at 6pm
<rick_h_> $5 to park :/
<rick_h_> but we'll go back in a couple of years when he's older. The statues would be cooler if he knew who they were I guess
<brousch> heh, yeah
<rick_h_> lol http://www.oracle.com/index.html
<brousch> rick_h_: Are you laughing at Oracle OpenWorld, OR make Java the future?
<rick_h_droid> the site was hacked and just said 'hello world' I this morning
<rick_h_droid> http://thehackernews.com/2012/10/oracle-website-saying-hello-world-is-it.html
<snap-l> Food morning
<brousch> hah
<brousch> snap-l: You missed the early morning sane timeslot
<snap-l> ?
<brousch> rick_h_droid: What a crappy article: "ThisÂ afternoonÂ I just got a ping from one of my Friend that Oracle website compromised. Its hard toÂ believeÂ that ORACLE can be compromised ? So lets explore that what going on:"
<rick_h_> yea, sorry first result in searching for oracle website hello world
<rick_h_> I found out via people on twitter going "<3 the redesign oracle"
<brousch> Good. I was afraid you actually read that website
<snap-l> I mean, if you're going to own ORacle's website, do something better with it than "Hello World"
<rick_h_> yea, I wasn't sure it was hacked or more just a deploy went fubar
<rick_h_> was worth a lol :P
<snap-l>  Maybe they couldn't find a video of Larry Ellison eating a bag of dicks on short notice.
<brousch> Oracle Open Conference sounds like a joke too
<tony-smlr> Sunday Morning Linux Review is Live at http://www.youtube.com/user/tbemus?v=nhg4PTmaRZ0
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-10-14
<brousch> I've removed the DVD-ROM from my T420's drive bay and have added a 500GB spinning HD. What's the best way to make it usable?
<brousch> I added a dir to it, chowned it, and symlinked it to Media in my ~
<jjesse-android> mount it ?
<brousch> It is mounted in /media/
<jjesse-android> when i installed Ubuntu 12.04 in mine it had 2 drives
<jjesse-android> so it saw it already
<brousch> There will be times I wan to remove it and use the DVD
<brousch> symlink seems like the least likely to break
<jjesse-android> ah
<jjesse-android> i ot an encasing for mine
<brousch> But I wanted to see what others were doing
<brousch> For your DVD?
<jjesse-android> yes
<jjesse-android> and use it as a removable media
<jjesse-android> sorry that made no sense
<jjesse-android> so i have the enclosure w/ a usb cable for my dbd
<jjesse-android> and leave the other one in ti
<brousch> The drive bay is easy to pull, so I want to swap in the DVD to rip CDs sometimes
<jjesse-android> ah
<jjesse-android> i went the way i went so i can use it in my macbook air which has no dvd/cd
<jjesse-android> and not worry about pulling a hard drive
<brousch> I have an external DVD, but it's a honkin big beast. This little bay is easy to carry in my bag
<jjesse-android> ah i c
<snap-l> Evening
<rick_h_> snap-l: howdy
<snap-l> Hey, how goes?
<rick_h_> not bad, see pm
<snap-l> Good morning
<rick_h_> party
<brousch> No LEGO. They sold out
<rick_h_> brousch: :(
<snap-l> bummer
<jjesse-android> anything fun happening this sunday afternoon?
<gamerchick02> Rathole Radio. and i'll probably be playing some WoW later.
<jjesse-android> sounds fun
<jjesse-home> crazy wind storm just blew through grand rapids
<jjesse-home> 40 mph winds
<rick_h_> hah https://twitter.com/neiltyson/status/257591067833139200
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-10-07
<ColonelPanic001> 'morning
<rick_h_> morn
<ColonelPanic001> that's all I have the {energy,motivation} to type out
<brousch> IT'S GREAT TO BE ALIVE!
<ColonelPanic001> yes, because being alive, I can drink coffee. Which I'm doing. Right now.
<rick_h_> yep, coffee in hand
<brousch> Wait, what? rick_h_ I thought you were a tea man
<rick_h_> brousch: I've become a coffee snob this summer (or at least a latte snob)
<rick_h_> and I do my iced tea after my morning coffee
<brousch> LAtte is where it starts. Then you back out the cream and sugar until you become a real coffee snob drinking it black
<jrwren> and then espresso
<jrwren> mmm... and then your own pour throughs
<jrwren> threws?
<jrwren> wtf is throughs, lol
<rick_h_> through
<rick_h_> heh, pot, grinder, and frother are enough coffee tweaking accessories for now
<ColonelPanic001> I did the same - had a late night or two in a row about a year ago, suddenly overnight I aquired the taste for coffee
<ColonelPanic001> I still drink more tea, but in the morning, once in a while, coffee is fantastic
<brousch> I like my immersion drip system. Small and portable.
<ColonelPanic001> and on weekends at home, I drink a few cups of decaf. I don't keep the "real" stuff at home, try ot keep caffeine intake reasonable
<rick_h_> portable is for a coffee shop drive through :P
<brousch> Need to store it in my desk :P
<rick_h_> but we have a moka pot and take the frother in the camper (just pre-grind)
<ColonelPanic001> I just drink meijer brand decaf. Shudder in disgust, coffee snobs
<ColonelPanic001> <3 Hazelnut
<ColonelPanic001> I aquired the taste for coffee enough to enjoy it, but still drink it rarely enough to not be picky about it.
<ColonelPanic001> I save snobbery for tea and beer
<rick_h_> I can't get coffee at the caribou because I've gotten picky about it. Now at CHC I just get a root beer or something
<rick_h_> hopefully the move to Peets will fix that. The Peets in CA had a great latte
<brousch> At work we have disgusting coffee, so I bring my own. I prefer a French Roast
<ColonelPanic001> rick_h_: what is something you don't really "get into". There must be something you're not particular about. SOMETHING.
<rick_h_> ColonelPanic001: hmmmm...I'll have to think about that. My brain doesn't work well that way.
<brousch> Clothes?
<ColonelPanic001> not that I mind personally. It benefits me because then I can say "vim question? I bet rick_h knows"
<ColonelPanic001> "I sew my own, all the companies use the wrong stitch"
<ColonelPanic001> noob question - what's french roast "mean"? Like, if I just get some Maxwell House french roast, for example. I tried it once, couldn't tell a difference in taste
<rick_h_> brousch: well lately I'm a really big fan of Exofficio clothing. Gotten a ton of their stuff this summer
<ColonelPanic001> SEE?
<rick_h_> hey, best boxer briefs I've ever owned! :P
<ColonelPanic001> <2015-05-23 12:35:00 rick_h_> Hey guys, I started carrying around my own bottle of air. Too much trace amounts of argon in the mainstream stuff.
<rick_h_> I can't think of anything I get where I just go in, grab the cheapest thing on the shelf, and walk out. Not even paper towels or printer paper.
<jrwren> calvin klien?
<brousch> ColonelPanic001: I snorted some hummus out of my nose. Thanks
<rick_h_> my brain just can't help but figure it out
<ColonelPanic001> ;D
<rick_h_> jrwren: never tried.
<ColonelPanic001> Paper towels I use whatever, but toilet paper? Charmin extra soft. My wife made the mistake of extra strong once. ONCE.
<ColonelPanic001> My ass deserves the best, damnit.
<jrwren> they are my fav boxer brief.
<ColonelPanic001> literally, in this case.
<jrwren> and reasonably priced at costco :)
<ColonelPanic001> now I'm looking up Exofficio, damnit.
<brousch> ColonelPanic001: Toilet paper? Are you some kind of hill billy? Where's your bidet?
<ColonelPanic001> comfortable boxer breifs really do make a huge difference in comfort
<ColonelPanic001> brousch: never used one. I'll admit to curiosity, but... I don't know.
<rick_h_> charmin is crap :P cottenele or bust
<brousch> with aloe
<ColonelPanic001> rick_h_: If I try this and my ass disagrees, I shall be annoyed.
<rick_h_> ColonelPanic001: am I ever wrong? :P
<ColonelPanic001> I haven't tried this Exofficio stuff yet. Maybe.
<ColonelPanic001> rick_h_ needs to just start a blog about "stuff I recently decided is the best, with stats about why"
<ColonelPanic001> then I can just save some time and follow it
<rick_h_> hah! no, because then my wife would realize wtf I spend my time on and what I spend money on
<ColonelPanic001> haha
<rick_h_> the one password she can never have is to my amazon account
<ColonelPanic001> .htaccess it and send me a log in
<ColonelPanic001> haha
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> it does suck though. I spent a freaking hour trying to find the right shoes for my son. I mean he's 3...do the shoes fit..good!@
<ColonelPanic001> exactly.
<ColonelPanic001> save me that time
<ColonelPanic001> "just go get this exact model of Widget" "Thanks!"
<rick_h_> but no, I've going "Well, he's got soccer once a week, and so it needs some cleat-like action. And we need one pair he can wear to church, and winter is coming to they should go up a bit to help keep snow/etc out"
<ColonelPanic001> I have a feeling that if I weren't so cheap, I'd do the same thing really
<ColonelPanic001> but my cheapness takes over and I just say "hell with it, this works"
<ColonelPanic001> cheapness and a hatred of being in stores
<rick_h_> yea, the internet saves me usually which helps
<rick_h_> because I can compare reviews in multiple places easily
<ColonelPanic001> yeah, I've been doing that more and more
<ColonelPanic001> still need to find a damn furnace filter. stupid weird size in this house
<rick_h_> "Hmm, no home depot the reviews of this shed are pretty good, but not on amazon. Maybe there's a shipping thing there"
<brousch> Kid will need new shoes in 3 months anyways
<rick_h_>  /no/on
<rick_h_> exactly!
<rick_h_> I want to not care...but...but...my brain hates me
<jrwren> go to stride rite, let kid pick. done.
<rick_h_> let hime pick?!
<rick_h_> we do go there, and he plays with the toys while the decisions are made :P
<ColonelPanic001> haha
<ColonelPanic001> "BUT WHERE IS YOUR STATISTICAL ANALYSIS DONE IN R TO FIND THE BEST OPTIMAL SHOE?"
<brousch> Consumers Rickports
<ColonelPanic001> BLog name, right there
<brousch> I'd subscribe to that
<ColonelPanic001> use that
<ColonelPanic001> please.
<ColonelPanic001> brousch++
<brousch> rick_h_: How the hell did you make that response so fast?
<rick_h_> brousch: quality keyboard :P
<rick_h_> there is power in the clicky
<brousch> But there are links to relevant code too
<rick_h_> and phone notifications help me know when you ask stuff in my posts
<rick_h_> brousch: well, I know the bookie codebase well enough. When people ask questions they'll just about always get examples back in either bookie or charmworld/juju gui code since that stuff is in my head
<rick_h_> I don't bother creating new fresh/clean bin's usually. "Left as an exercise to the reader"
<brousch> I was reading this article, which is a pretty nice intro to core http://stackful-dev.com/discovering-sqlalchemy-core-the-relational-nosql-api-for-python.html
<rick_h_> yea, sqlalchemy is an ORM, but inside there are the tools to write your own ORM. It's crazy cool like that
<rick_h_> "don't like the sqlalchemy ORM, then use the underlying tools to write one you do like"
<brousch> I wonder why gaynor created that project. I thought he was a big django user
<rick_h_> he's working on rackspace/openstack stuff atm. I think they use some tornado
<rick_h_> errr, whatever
<rick_h_> but I mean he worked at quora for a bit and did a bunch of pylons stuff, he's all over the place. pypy all the things
<jcastro> rick_h_: do you know if there's HDMI at the library?
<jcastro> I just realized the input situation wrt. my demo
<rick_h_> jcastro: I don't think so
<rick_h_> jcastro: they've got more ports, but attempts to get at them have met resistence and we've not had the guts to try outselves
<rick_h_> and don't recall hdmi on there
<jcastro> hmm
<jcastro> how about dvi?
<rick_h_> I'd bring a vga-dvi adapter
 * rick_h_ might have one...
<rick_h_> maybe cmaloney (who's not here wtf) can speak up on it.
<brousch> No snapl either
<rick_h_> yea
<rick_h_> man, coffee joulies + contigo ftw. Warm coffee 4+ hrs later
<rick_h_> plus it's fun to freak out the starbucks peeks giving them a mug with joulies in it and they're like "You want to keep this crap in here?"
<greg-g> joulies? I don't want to see rick_h_'s joulies
<rick_h_> :P
<greg-g> ahh, a kickstarter
<rick_h_> yea, I got in after the kickstarter. Got some for my wife but then got another set for me now
<rick_h_> with a really good thermos can get 4-6hrs of drinkable coffee
<greg-g> "they work best with a really well insulated vessel" - no shit, so does nothing
<greg-g> sorry, just making fun of the wording/clarity of the Wikipedia article
<brousch> rick_h_: Wait, you leave a latte in a thermos for 6 hours?
<rick_h_> brousch: almost
<jcastro> where is craig bologna today?
<brousch> That doesn't sound good. That's warm milk
<brousch> You're gonna get the shits from that one day
<rick_h_> brousch: lol, well it's soy. And it does get close to like a warm hot chocolate towards that long
<rick_h_> but it's cool that you can start drinking it sooner and go longer. <3 the joulies
<rick_h_> greg-g: yea, my wife though put them into a bit mug and was like "I don't think they really work"
<rick_h_> because a coffee mug is about the worst thing to keep things warm in
<greg-g>  drink faster
<greg-g> :P
<brousch> I used to get 4.5 hours out of a regular thermos
<rick_h_> I got my wife and I one of these and <3 them http://www.amazon.com/Contigo-AUTOSEAL-Stainless-20-Ounce-Easy-Clean/dp/B009HVH4XO/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1381165603&sr=8-4&keywords=contigo
<brousch> Mine was bigger. Would hold 1 pot of coffee
<greg-g> define "1 pot"
<greg-g> 1 hotel coffee pot is 1 coffee mug, so like 8 oz
<brousch> 4 8-10oz cups
<rick_h_> yea, I've got the 20oz which fits around 15/16oz after adding joulies? well a med starbucks at least
<brousch> so 32oz probably
<rick_h_> yea, that's a bit big for a cup holder type device
<rick_h_> that's like "Let's hold some soup for lunch" material
<brousch> Right. All morning!
<brousch> 1 cup/hr
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> all work day you mean, 8 10oz cups
<brousch> nah, I rarely coffee-up after lunch
<rick_h_> ah, the joys of seeing an email with a merge proposal go by, glance at it, get caremad seeing the diff and fuss about it even though it's already been reviewed and qa'd to be ok.
<rick_h_> now wtf was I doing originally?
<brousch> drinking a cuppa
<cmaloney> Howdt
<cmaloney> howdy, even
<rick_h_> there's the man
<rick_h_> jcastro: ask him about hdmi at MUG ^
<cmaloney> IT's VGA all the way
<cmaloney> i have a RaspPi HDMI to VGA adapter that might work
<cmaloney> But if you have something that you know works that would be preferable
<cmaloney> Just got back from Frankenmuth. :)
<rick_h_> ah, good times? little rainy this weekend :(
<cmaloney> Yeah, it was awesome
<cmaloney> Great times
<brousch> What do you do in Frankenmuth?
<brousch> I've never been there
<greg-g> smoke frankenscense
<brousch> That does not surprise me from Mr. Ann Arbor and San Fran
<greg-g> we don't say "san fran" we say "frisco"
<brousch> Sounds like the state of your brain after smoking Frankincense
<greg-g> I guess you don't smoke frankencense, you just burn it to cover up the smell of what you do smoke
<ColonelPanic001> I look away, go to lunch, come back, and we're talking about this.
<ColonelPanic001> now I have the munchies again
<cmaloney> Heh
<cmaloney> There's plenty of things to do in Frakenmuth
 * greg-g eats PB&J
<cmaloney> shop
<cmaloney> eat
<cmaloney> Laugh at how they're trying to make the down into Disney
<rick_h_> lol "That's not an ipad, this is an ipad!" http://www.theverge.com/2013/10/7/4812630/fox-news-shepard-smith-news-deck
<brousch> 1920x1080 on 55" at arm's length sucks
<rick_h_> ok, so this is pre-retina :P
<brousch> There are a few 50" 4K TVs now, but not touch screen
<cmaloney> Wow, I'd hate to be the news-monkey pinching those news stories.
<jrwren> is there a cmdline tool to zlib compress/decompress a stream? g(un)zip requires a gzip header
<jrwren> python -c 'import sys,zlib;print zlib.decompress(sys.stdin.read())'
<jrwren> :)
<jrwren> imma use gzip anyway
<mathomastech> So, I am working on some idea's to revive the LUG group in my area. It's been inactive for a while. Figured i'd throw out the link to my idea doc. A lot of the idea's are inspired by MUG and CHC. Could definitely use some input/advice etc. Never really done anything like this before.
<mathomastech> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-kmDQvJcUmkn3UIqFHo4ZmHxjOEq9ufCrfOf6MKNeOs/edit?usp=sharing
<brousch> mathomastech: We revived the GRLUG with a weekly social event
<brousch> Started on Saturday, then moved to Wednesday nights
<brousch> Lining up speakers can be hard at first
<brousch> Also, in general, colleges are poor places to meet. The college kids really don't care
<brousch> Coffee houses and quiet pubs are better
<mathomastech> brouch: I've thought about the speakers. Unfortunately I don't really have many connections here. I could probably do some of the easier topics (the ones listed under beginner) but not sure I have the knowledge/experience for the more advanced topics.
<brousch> Yeah, that's why I think a social event is better. Basically just say you'll be hanging out the local coffeehouse and anyone who wants to stop by
<brousch> You make the connections there and can then move into more technical meetings
<brousch> Check with local hackerspaces to see if you could meet there
<brousch> I love meetup.com, but it is expensive: $72/6 months
<brousch> Also Linux types tend to be the most paranoid about being tracked by that kind of service
<greg-g> also, google docs ;)
<brousch> Seriously?
<greg-g> yah
<mathomastech> Looking up hackspaces now. Never really heard of them before, really neat concept
<greg-g> text editing/sharing, we figured that problem out in FLOSS land
<brousch> greg-g: What do you suggest?
<greg-g> a wiki
<cmaloney> Linux can be the refuge of some rather paranoid individuals.
<brousch> That's a lot of infrastructure to maintain to share some text
<greg-g> etherpad
<greg-g> any of the freely hosted ones out there
<greg-g> seriously, etherpad
<greg-g> we use it everywhere inside WMF that needs realtime text collaboration (and it gets archived to a wiki, if need be)
<cmaloney> I'd argue it's easier to not worry about the tools first and just get the word out whatever way you can
<cmaloney> even if that's LinkedIn
<greg-g> what cmaloney said
<cmaloney> All you really need right now is a test for echo
<cmaloney> The tools are secondary to finding out if there's someone else interested.
<cmaloney> Once you have that, you can gauge what your group's paranoia / FLOSS / whatever leanings are
<cmaloney> Some groups may be OK with a Google Doc
<cmaloney> others may want to run Wordpress on a Raspberry Pi in their garage
 * greg-g stops self from trolling
<trevlar> meetup is good because once you create the group it'll probably notify a lot of "related" people that might be interested in it
<trevlar> so you could get a good start from that
<cmaloney> yeah, we've kicked around Meetup
<mathomastech> Good deal. If I go the route of mostly hack nights to begin with, recording tools (GDocs, ether, etc) will be only a minor piece. Probably wouln't need to worry to much about that until technical meetings are established.
<cmaloney> (for MUG)
<cmaloney> greg-g: Oh don't worry. We're pretty sure that Raspberry Pi would be solar-powered. ;)
<brousch> All you really need is a website and a mailing list. Mailing list for discussion, website to give people a single place to look for all of the info
<brousch> PReferably a website with an easy to remember url so you can just tell people
<rick_h_> greg-g: google docs ftw :P
<rick_h_> mathomastech: I'd only do one a month
<rick_h_> mathomastech: and maybe even just start a CHC like thing to get people around and make connections first
<brousch> mathomastech: Is there an existing website or mailing list?
<cmaloney> Something memorable like http://www.mybigblackcock.com/
<mathomastech> rick_h_: http://norlug.org/
<mathomastech> The mailing list is dead though. Can't subscribe or anything
<brousch> Wow. Nicer than most LUG websites
<brousch> heh 2008
<cmaloney> Hello Drupal
<mathomastech> brousch: Yea, it is pretty nice. It hasn't been updated for about 5 years though. I'd have to see about getting control from whoever is hosting it now to revamp and update it a bit.
<mathomastech> rick_h_: I was actually planning on trying to do both, but then decided that a CHC clone can be part of the LUG.
<brousch> With no working mailing list, attempt to contact the webmaster:  Adam Gurno <adam.gurno@gmail.com>
<brousch> I would try to work with the existing folks before starting a new group
<brousch> Introduce yourself. Politely ask about the status of the group and its resources. Mention that you'd like to get it going again
<mathomastech> brousch: Yep. I've joined the still active (5 idlers) #norlug channel and the minnesota chanel and talked to them a bit about reviving it.
<brousch> After meeting in person, they will probably be willing to hand over some control to you
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-10-08
<rick_h_> greg-g: you forgot the details :P
<brousch> Heh. Ruby is taking some blame for the healthcare.gov website debacle, even though it's really just the front page and not the failing part https://github.com/CMSgov/healthcare.gov
<rick_h_> http://r.bmark.us/u/47073e446539c3 ok this one I might get into. I hate the fire alarms in the house
<rick_h_> and since one is in the hallways the idea of it lighting your way in the dark is cool
<rick_h_> oh and morning
<rick_h_> brousch: I'm floored it's ruby tbh
<trevlar> fun fact, healthcare.gov was designed by a royal oak design shop that a friend works at
<trevlar> they didn't do any development though
<rick_h_> ah, very cool
<trevlar> in fact, when I asked him, his exact words were: "we take no responsibility for the development disaster that happened over there"
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> "once it loads it's kinda pretty...but that getting it to load isn't my issue"
<cmaloney> I'd be a little wary of getting an expensive CO detector
<cmaloney> they have a lifespan of 7 years
<cmaloney> That said, you'll probably replace it sooner than that, so I'll just shut up. :)
<rick_h_> hah
<rick_h_> well, I have to admit that I'm dying to see if they can go hte security route
<rick_h_> we looked at getting a security system once and it was killer. The devices were clunky, expensive, and the service was expensive. If I could put one of those in the hall up and down stairs and get phone notificaitons, etc along with fire, co2, and a cool hally night light...kind of killer
<cmaloney> Yeah, that's a plus.
<rick_h_> and I am on my 3rd fire alarm in the hall right now
<cmaloney> amn
<cmaloney> I replaced our CO detector mostly because it was designed to fall off the wall
<cmaloney> so I got a tabletop model
<rick_h_> I had one that hung in the outlet
<rick_h_> big thing
<cmaloney> Yeah, and where we had it hanging was in a traffic path
<cmaloney> so it got knocked off the wall, and broke the clip
<ColonelPanic001> the house I just bought has a simple alarm system in, I should probably get the service again. It's already installed and everything
<jjesse>   i had a conversation w/ a heating and cooling guy who had pretty negative things to say about the Nest.  He recommended a  honeywell system that he said could do more
<jjesse> i never did any research to see if he could back up what he said
 * ColonelPanic001 needs to replace his thermostat
<rick_h_> so everyone I know iwth a nest loves them
<ColonelPanic001> I just can't justify $250. It does look neat, though
<rick_h_> but with out two floors I know I'd have to get two and it'd really only work well if we did dual zone furnace I think
<jjesse> this guy said a lot of times the nest wasn't configured correctly
<cmaloney> jjesse: Was this person selling the Honeywell system?
<jjesse> but i think he was just complaining cause he wasn't getting paid to install them so not quite sure i could back that up
<jjesse> cmaloney, no he wasn't selling them
<cmaloney> jjesse: OK, then there may be something to it
<jjesse> cmaloney, totally agree
<ColonelPanic001> I might just be naive, but paid to install them? I expected it to be "install a lightbulb" easy.
<jjesse> he had 2 options he recommended over the nest
<jjesse> but i don't remember the other one
<cmaloney> ColonelPanic001: Older homes may not have the wiring to support it
<ColonelPanic001> hm. what wiring? Power?
<cmaloney> I won a smart thermostat that I couldn't use because it only supported a certain number of wires
<ColonelPanic001> hm. I have to read up on this later. My house is old. (1950)
<cmaloney> House was built in the 1950s and the wiring is very basic
<cmaloney> I couldn't wire up a Smarthome X10 wall switch because it only had two wires
<cmaloney> http://wiki.xtronics.com/index.php/Thermostat_signals_and_wiring
<ColonelPanic001> bookmarked, thanks. That actually is very useful
<ColonelPanic001> and for what it's worth, I've had this house for maybe two months after nearly 5 years of an apartment. I don't know much about houses. Feel free to enlighten me
<ColonelPanic001> I mean, in general, not just this moment
<ColonelPanic001> for example, I seem to have drastically underestimated thermostats. I assumed all the connection needed to do was AC on/off, and heat on/off
<brousch> rick_h_: I get the impression that the static parts of the website are that ruby project, and the markeplace where the real work is done is elsewhere
<rick_h_> brousch: lol, I love that the 'static' bits are a dynamic language server side
<rick_h_> brousch: but yea, I'd guess as well without looking
<brousch> I think it's actually a ruby static website generator
<jjesse> are we talking about healthcare.org?
<rick_h_> jjesse: yea
<jjesse> oh
<jjesse> i read someplace that like 40 some files were generated or something crazy
<jjesse> per person
<brousch> .gov
<jjesse> yeah whatever :)
<rick_h_> ahhhh, the sweetness of a new battery
<rick_h_> just keeps going and going
<jrwren> why would you want a home alarm?
<jrwren> if someone breaks into my house, they would look around, see not much of value, and leave.
<jrwren> or they would be stupid enough to take things that are not worth much of anything
<brousch> Don't you have a big dog?
<brousch> They are my alarms
<jrwren> i don't. But I agree, that is a better alternative
<brousch> BARK BARK BARK JUST LETTING YOU KNOW SOMEONE WALKING BY IN THE STREET LOOKED AT OUR HOUSE BARK BARK BARK
<rick_h_> jrwren: because I leave across the country or world with a wife and small child.
<rick_h_> jrwren: and my wife freaks out by every house noise and sleeps in the guest room with the dog in her bed to help her get through the night
<jrwren> peace of mind is a reason.
<rick_h_> :)
<brousch> wow
<brousch> Also, you live in Detroit. Don't forget that part
<rick_h_> yea, I wish I could get my rot, I'd feel a lot better then
<rick_h_> the boy is almost old enough but not sure the house is big enough for another pet :/
<jrwren> Clarkston is NOT detroit
<rick_h_> definitely
<rick_h_> but we've had out cars in the driveway broken into twice since we've lived here
<jrwren> you can't even claim detroit closeness unless you near a bus stop.
<rick_h_> and we've got a few strange folks in the neighborhood since property values have gone down 100k
<jrwren> I think Great Lakes Cross is probably the farthest north that a detroit area bus will run
<jrwren> dude, that sucks, but what do they take from your car?
<rick_h_> money, cds, nothing much. We don't leave much in them. The most expensive thing is the car seats really
<rick_h_> but they left those
<jrwren> my wife got a little more cautious when she found out there was a reported sexual assault just down the street. But those are usually people who know people. AFAIK it was not a home invasion. those are very rare.
<rick_h_> yea, unfortunately fear isn't always a rational thing
<brousch> Everything East of Ann Arbor is Detroit. We've been through this discussion before
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> AA is "out west" for me
<ColonelPanic001> God if the northern suburbs are bad enoguh to be Detroit, Downriver must be... I don't even know
<rick_h_> forget there's half a state out there
<ColonelPanic001> There's nothing west of Ann Arbor but politics and fields, I assume
<jjesse> +1 to brousch
<brousch> ColonelPanic001: You forgot Amway
<ColonelPanic001> :\
<brousch> farms, politics, and amway
<ColonelPanic001> So back in 2005-2006 we started WSULUG. Sitting on my desk now is a box of Ubuntu 6.06 install CDs from when they'd send you a free box.
<ColonelPanic001> I have no idea what I'm going to do with them. I'm thinking "art project"
<jjesse> man i need more coffee todayâ¦ just spent way too much time trying to figure out why my test lab couldn't get out to the internet and then realized the server running DNS was turned off :(
<rick_h_> oops
<jjesse> yup
<brousch> ColonelPanic001: I have 2 boxes of CDs from cmaloney
<brousch> Time to make a big fish for next year's artprize
<ColonelPanic001> \o/
<jrwren> brousch thinks NYC is Detroit
<brousch> Come on now. Detroit ends at the lake/river
<jrwren> jjesse: monitoring with notification :p
<jrwren> brousch: thinks alpena is detroit
<brousch> it starts in the thumb pit
<jrwren> anyone ever use python C api to put python in C code?
<jrwren> python-config has nice --cflags and --ldflags to help me, but I still get undefined reference linker errors
<brousch> Hm, remember the ERP I said could kind of run on Linux? Turns out they're using MySQL as the DB
<brousch> DotNET with MySQL
<jrwren> been there, done that.
<jrwren> brousch: ask for the source.
<jrwren> brousch: the mysql connector for .net is GPL.
<jrwren> not LGPL, which means if they are using it they must give you their source.
<jrwren> unless they bought a mysql license
<brousch> Why would I want the source to the mysql_odbc?
<jrwren> GPL.
<jrwren> you link to it, its open source.
<jrwren> you GPL request the ERPs source.
<greg-g> I think brousch is like "man, I don't read source, as long as its free as in beer I'm ok" ;)
<jrwren> what ERP software is it?
<jrwren> on 12.04 anyone filter dhclient message from rsyslog  have a howto?
<brousch> jrwren: https://www.fabsuite.com/en/
<cmaloney> Reminder: MUG meeting tonight
<cmaloney> We'll be having jcastro talk about Steaaaaaam. Machiiiiiiine.
<cmaloney> And Mark Ramm talk about this thing called Juju
<rick_h_> woot, party party
<mathomastech> cmaloney: Will there be a recording of it? I got the firefox os bookmarked, just haven't had a chance to watch this. Would like to see the Steam talk as well.
<cmaloney> There should be. I brought my camera just in case.
<greg-g> I love the interior styles of A-frames: http://cabinporn.com/post/63494078577/a-frame-cabin-built-in-1968-in-the-woods-of
<greg-g> (yes, I'm subscribed to that blog)
<greg-g> yes, SFW
<rick_h_> yea, love the upstairs spaces. Seen some really ingenious storage and such
<greg-g> yeah, it makes you think outside the box, literally, heh
<greg-g> with the angled wall/roof
<cmaloney> ju ju ju jio
<cmaloney> MUG: Does anyone have an extension cord?
<rick_h_> I've got a smallish one, we're not hitting the front of the room
<cmaloney> Hm. Need something for the video camera
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-10-09
<rick_h_> greg-g: you're killing me. Man cool stuff
<rick_h_> http://cabinporn.com/post/60874077271/cabin-on-vestmann-island-iceland-contributed wins imo
<rick_h_> grass on the stone wall!
<brousch> This looks like a fun job http://goo.gl/P0Eycd
<rick_h_> zookeeper runnnnn!
<brousch> But the science!
<brousch> http://nodeos.github.io/
<brousch> I'm really surprised no one did this with Python first
<cmaloney> Good morning
<brousch> An excellent morning now that I can NODE ALL THE THINGS
<cmaloney> http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/
<cmaloney> Didn't realize how few NA teams were verified
<cmaloney> It's less than a dozen teams
<cmaloney> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-michigan/2580-michigan-ubuntu-release-party-ubuntu-1310/ <- Does anyone see this event using the ICS feed?
<brousch> Well they only have 1 per state, right?
<cmaloney> That's North America, not USA
<cmaloney> not sure how other countries handle their teams
<brousch> that isn't on my calendar
<cmaloney> Yeah, it's not on mine either. :(
<brousch> I see the regular months meetings, but not the party
<brousch> So I may get thrown out of Grand Rapids, but I think Atwater is my favorite brewery. I have loved every one of their beers I've tried
<cmaloney> I've been a fan of Bells personally.
<cmaloney> Mostly because Black Note is amazing.
<cmaloney> And Dragon's Milk gives me a splitting headache the next morning
<ColonelPanic001> atwater has some good ones
<ColonelPanic001> I've had some Bells, but not a lot.
<cmaloney> Bells tends to have a lot of Ales
<cmaloney> Though I think that's true of most microbreweries
<jrwren> what is wrong with zookeeper?
<jrwren> omfg, nodeos? are you kidding? how stupid!  :)
<rick_h_> it goes BOOM in juju sometimes. In horrible ways
<jrwren> juju uses zookeeper?
<rick_h_> pyjuju did
<jrwren> ah.
<jrwren> does the go version use raft?
<rick_h_> mongo
<rick_h_> not aware of what raft is
<jrwren> oh, for TAHT
<jrwren> Wolf says he wanted to go to mug last night. I said "me too"
<jcastro> I deployed stuff!
<rick_h_> live demos ftw!
<jcastro> jrwren: pick a day and mramm and I would love to give you guys a presentation
<jrwren> over lunch?
<greg-g> rick_h_: :) yeah, that blog is dangerous. I think I spent a couple nights going back through the entire archive
<cmaloney> dear a-frame. Let's run away toggether you and I.
 * greg-g makes a cover of Meat Loaf's "I'll do anything for love" but written with a cabin as the object of love.
<brousch> I'm thinking about installing ubuntu touch on my asus transformer infinity. I haven't really used it since I got a Nexus 7
<brousch> is anyone running Ubuntu Touch right now?
<cmaloney> I thought mathomastech was trying it out at one time
<widox_> oh, CHC at Starbucks tonight eh?
<rick_h_> yes! /me remembers to write up posts
<rick_h_> gah, what a freaking day
<rick_h_> and CHC website goes boom!
<mathomastech> brousch: Yea, I got it running on my Nexus 7. It's kind of a let down atm. I still have hopes it will become something viable though. Lots of unique, and really great idea's.
<mathomastech> https://github.com/WhiteHouse/fortyfour/issues/3
<widox> rick_h_: you broke it
<rick_h_> ok, put on twitter/G+. Please share like crazy
<widox> rick_h_: hm, that's just a map search for Starbucks, not the specific one we're going to
<rick_h_> bah, it worked for me when I did it in a private browse window
<widox> I see results listing "Starbucks near Detroit, MI" anyway
<rick_h_> bah, well only the truly dedicated will make it!
<rick_h_> cmaloney: waf ^^
<widox> :)
<widox> lmorchard and trevlar --^
<rick_h_> we need to get everyone to set a 'chc' mention in their irc client
<rick_h_> then I can just: chc - hey remember new location tonight!
<rick_h_> it's what we do for work.
<trevlar> thanks :)
<trevlar> good idea
<widox> oh, yeah. I should do that
<widox> my CHC project then
<trevlar> so chc is at the starbucks on woodward at 13, right?
<rick_h_> trevlar: correct
<cmaloney> It hasn't moved more than a mile out, so I'm sure we won't see anyone else show up
<cmaloney> *cough*jsivak*cough*
<rick_h_> lol, it's farther for him. He should just meet me here and we could drive down 7:15ish :P
<cmaloney> heh
<brousch> Damnit. If Shuttleworth can't get his own country doing things right, how will he fix all the others? http://news.slashdot.org/story/13/10/09/1648218/south-african-education-department-bans-free-and-open-source-software
<mathomastech> Wow. Are they trying to fail? I mean, at least Office is in use today, so while a horrible decision in many ways, at least its not completely wasted. Delphi though, I've only ever encountered that in my Programing languages class, where we were going over old, more or less dead languages.
<mathomastech> lmordchard: Just got around to viewing your talk on Firefox OS at the MUG last month. Good content!
<mathomastech> lmorchard: ^
<jrwren> delphi is popular in malware world.
<brousch> really?
<jrwren> yes
<jrwren> it compiles to native code, its high level, has nice libraries which apparently are easy to static link, and the compiler is not C so it obfuscates a bit for reversing engineers
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-10-10
<rick_h_> http://www.tumblr.com/blog/mitechie
<rick_h_> http://mitechie.tumblr.com/
<cmaloney> http://www.wtfpl.net/
<waf> rick_h_: http://developer.chrome.com/extensions/storage.html#property-sync
<jsivak> cmaloney: rick_h_: wait until your kids get old enough to take over your schedule!
<jsivak> well.. maybe cmaloney's cat will..
<rick_h_> jsivak: heh, he's in bed. That's why it's at 8pm
<rick_h_> don't let them stay up so late. It's a school night!
<jsivak> Caitlin had a x-country race + picnic.. didn't get home until 7:00
<rick_h_> perfect, just in time to pack her off to the bath with mom and leave for CHC hah!
<jsivak> so does everyone feel more cultured and 'upper class' now that you're at Starbucks? :P
<rick_h_> no, we wish we had more space
<rick_h_> but I do love the vanilla soy lattes here a lot more
<jsivak> Oh great. 'when' I get back to CHC I'll start getting fatter too.
<rick_h_> it's only for 3weeks
<rick_h_> then we'll be at peets
<rick_h_> (3 more)
<jsivak> ah, cool
<cmaloney> jsivak: I feel like I need to put on skinny jeans and grow a goatee
<cmaloney> that's going to be a problem on several counts.
<rick_h_> widox: https://github.com/mitechie/Bookie/blob/develop/bookie/views/api.py#L48
<rick_h_> widox: https://github.com/mitechie/Bookie/blob/develop/bookie/routes.py#L91
<jsivak> cmaloney: heh
<cmaloney> Good morning
<rick_h_> grumble
<cmaloney> Well, I get to play in the LDAP mines.
<brousch> Did they give you a light helmet and a pick?
<cmaloney> More like a pith helmet, a machete, and God's blessing
<rick_h_> hah
<rick_h_> cmaloney: did you see our podcast mention tweet?
<cmaloney> Yeah, I did
<rick_h_> I'm going to have to start hitting the bottle early today after that one
<cmaloney> the one with the baldness ad?
<rick_h_> yea, just RT'd it
<rick_h_> Erica is cracking up this morning
<cmaloney> heh
<brousch> Awesome
<brousch> What do you think when you see this? #GRBJ40under40!
<cmaloney> Meijer sale gone horribly wrong?
<rick_h_> Great jobs for under 40 yr olds
<rick_h_> was my first pass
<cmaloney> Grand Rapids BJs 40 folks under 40
<rick_h_> BJs?
 * rick_h_ walks slowly away
<cmaloney> BJers
<cmaloney> brousch: standardizing hash tags are stupid
<brousch> Grand Rapids Business Journal
<cmaloney> And the 40 under 40?
<brousch> 40 people under 40 to "watch"
<cmaloney> So this was not your doing?
<brousch> GR BJ meets at the Goei Center, BTW
<brousch> OH hell no
<brousch> I am incapable of taking them seriously
<cmaloney> You know someone over there is snickering their ass off right now
<ColonelPanic001> I am also interested in where to get 40 great BJs for under $40
<ColonelPanic001> I have to pay attention to twitter now
<jcastro> cmaloney, that interview with lifeson is awesome
<jcastro> Tai Shan or whatever
<jcastro> such a horrible song
<cmaloney> I'm surprised Rivendell doesn't get blasted more for being awful
<cmaloney> that's one of the few songs I have to skip
<jcastro> well
<cmaloney> I love Tai Shan though
<jcastro> tbh that entire album just gets the whole gutter
<jcastro> I am not a Tai Shan fan, as I say this as my favorite album too
<cmaloney> It's not one that holds up, unfortunately
<cmaloney> the drum effects sound late-80s
<cmaloney> But it's forgivable
<cmaloney> Rivendell is just dreadful
<jcastro> cinderella man is pretty horrible
<jcastro> looking at my songlist now
<cmaloney> lyrically
<jcastro> oh, rivendell is on fly by night, I thought it was on caress of steel
<cmaloney> Nope
<cmaloney> It's the speedbump to an otherwise great album
<jcastro> a list of underrated songs would be better
<cmaloney> Funny thing is I'd put Test for Echo as one of my least favorite albums
<cmaloney> but yet it has 5-6 awesome songs on it
<cmaloney> but that was the album that I started getting pretty tired of the Presto-Counterparts era.
<greg-g> I'm sure it's making the rounds, which means by now you've both seen it and haven't done anything other than maybe retweet it, but here's something for ya: http://theoatmeal.com/comics/columbus_day
<cmaloney> Yeah that's been making the rounds
<cmaloney> Funny how history can paint two separate pictures of the same events
<greg-g> there's a RATM song about this :)
<cmaloney> Why does this not surprise me
<cmaloney> RATM really annoyed me, though, so I didn't pursue any of their albums
<cmaloney> Funny enough, probably for the same things in Consolidated albums, but I have several of those albums
<mathomastech> I think I just found a bug in Chrome. I have a URL hardcoded in one of my html documents. The URL has an &. So as usual, I replace it with &amp;. That usually works just fine. However, this time Firefox is handling it correctly, but chrome is shifting the & over to the left 1 char, and throwing off the URL. Anyone ever see this before?
<mathomastech> Here is the website I am talking about. Click "Link to Project" on the left side.
<mathomastech> http://mathomaste.ch/Projects/BudgetTemplate.html
<rick_h_> why are you escaping it to &amp;?
<mathomastech> rick_h_: Only way I know of. Is there a better/preferred way?
<rick_h_> just leave it as &
<rick_h_> it's fine
<rick_h_> it's inside of a tag attr
 * rick_h_ is confused
<mathomastech> It's a markdown file. Markdown handles & different
<mathomastech> differently
<rick_h_> ah, well then it's your markdown parsers fault
<mathomastech> Why would it parse it differently for chrome than it would for firefox?
<rick_h_> because they use different rendering engines and such?
<mathomastech> Link to file on github: https://github.com/mathomastech/mathomastech.github.io/blob/master/Projects/BudgetTemplate.markdown
<rick_h_> firefox/chrome aren't diong the markdown conversion or anything. They're just reading the html
<rick_h_> the html says that the link is https://drive.google.com/templates?view=public&amp;authorId=01784685571608047934
<rick_h_> that url means that you have the query string args of
<rick_h_> view=public
<rick_h_> amp;authorId = 0178...
<rick_h_> & is a reserved thing in urls, you can't &amp; inside of one and expect it to work
<mathomastech> So, I am really confused now. I just inspected the HTML, and it doesn't have &amp; in either browser. Of course, I would expect it not to, because the markdown parser should fix it to &. That being said, it's now working on both chrome and firefox, though I didn't change anything.
<mathomastech> Magic perhaps?
<rick_h_> mathomastech: inspect it and then hit "edit as html" in chrome
<rick_h_> mathomastech: the chrome dev tools are 'converting' the &amp; for you
<mathomastech> Oh, I see it now. Hmm. So the parser is not fixing it then, even though it requires &amp; to escape from the built in meaning of &.
<rick_h_> right, you're fighting markdown -> html issues
<rick_h_> jcastro: well deployed 10 at once without bringing down my desktop woot! :)
<mathomastech> I think it was a chrome caching issue though originally. I had played around with the position of the &amp; when I first noticed it, and I think it was still holding onto an old version.
<brousch> rick_h_: You see this? https://pypi.python.org/pypi/csscompressor
<rick_h_> sure
<rick_h_> brousch: but I end up just using the minify tool in sass/etc these days
<waf> ampersands in URLs are always a source of confusion see http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/appendix/notes.html#h-B.2.2
<waf> but basically disregard that, and do what rick_h_ says.
<cmaloney> That's just good advice all-around
<jrwren> i made a career of it
<tony-smlr>  SMLR is Live!  Video: http://www.youtube.com/embed/5H63v787gE8  Audio stream: http://live.smlr.us:8000/streaming
<jrwren> south michigan linux radio?
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-10-11
<rick_h_> hello from camp harding
<rick_h_> called the capmgroud "hey, can I reserve a spot?" and got "well we've got 8 left first come first serve"
<rick_h_> phew, got here in time to pick of the last 3 of 100+ sites :/
<ColonelPanic001> ..
<rick_h_> :::
<ColonelPanic001> 3:
<cmaloney> -.---.----..-.---.----..-.---.----..-.---.----..
<cmaloney> Good morning
<rick_h_> morning
<cmaloney> Good morning
<cmaloney> reminder: Release party this weekend
<cmaloney> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-michigan/2580-michigan-ubuntu-release-party-ubuntu-1310/
<cmaloney> Still not seeing it on the calendar.
<brousch> George and I are going to our first ComicCon on Saturday
<rick_h_> brrrr this morning
<brousch> That's brisk, baby!
<rick_h_> yea
<cmaloney> brousch: good luck
<brousch> It's 1.5 miles from my house
<rick_h_> cool
<cmaloney> btw: The Macomb Gem and Mineral show is this weekend.
<cmaloney> two words: Coprolite City.
<brousch> Is that considered a gem or a mineral?
<cmaloney> It's considered awesome
<brousch> How many do you own?
<cmaloney> None
<cmaloney> I can't bring myself to own any
<brousch> I own 1 that I bought while working at the UM Museum store
<jrwren> where are you camping rick_h_ ?
<rick_h_> jrwren: over in lake orion area, east of it a bit
<rick_h_> they've got a halloween weekend hting with trick or treating and events and it's hard to get a spot so ran out last night to get one of hte last 3 avail
<jrwren> i can't htink of parks east of LO
<rick_h_> so working from here today with the dog until the fam can make it out
<rick_h_> addison oaks
<rick_h_> http://www.destinationoakland.com/parksandtrails/campgrounds/addisonoaks/Pages/default.aspx
<rick_h_> http://www.destinationoakland.com/parksandtrails/mapspublications/Documents/addison-campsite-map.pdf #84
<jrwren> ah, yeah, I know addison oaks
<rick_h_> ah cool. Yea this is our local stomping grounds. 3rd timehere this year
<jrwren> i grew up in Lake Orion (age1-14)
<rick_h_> ah, very cool
<rick_h_> most of my local family is from oxford so I grew up driving through LO to get to oxford
<rick_h_> I remember when there was a dead area a few miles on M-24 between them. Now you can't tell where one ends and the other begins
<jrwren> http://labs.spotify.com/2013/10/10/packaging-in-your-packaging-dh-virtualenv/  thoughts?
<jrwren> oh yeah, I know what you mean. Now it is sprawl all the way up lapeer rd.
<jrwren> I had an alergy specialist in oxford as a kid, so I know the exact dead area you mean.
<rick_h_> so I saw that and saved it to go over later in more detail. It looks like it's just having the debian package setup your virtualenv which is cool and all, but must be using mixed setup then anyway with packages from pypi/packages from system
<rick_h_> so you still end up compiling your py packages on the system, you just skip the step in the instructoins of "before running make install, apt-get install these -dev packages"
<rick_h_> So ok, you can apt-get install my-software-project, and use deb packaging to setup/run make and such? I'm not sure 100%.
<jrwren> i'm not sure either. I'm going to read it now. I haven't read it.
<rick_h_> yea let me know what you think. I think I'm missing some bits of it and need to sit down with it
<jcastro> hey jrwren
<jcastro> you guys have ubuntu server @ work right?
<brousch> I have 10.04 and 12.04 servers
<cmaloney> brousch: We don't count. :)
<brousch> I definitely don't have anything cloud-like
<jrwren> jcastro: yes.
<jrwren> jcastro: driving everything I do off of it. even leaning toward replacing our internal distro with it for all but 1 thing :)
<jrwren> ubuntu-cloudimg + cloudinit&cloudconfig is the best thing in a long time.
<jrwren> puppet is for suckers.
<jrwren> rick_h_: dh-virtualenv appears to do the virtualenv and build, including build dep debs at build time, so you won't need -devel packages at run time. This looks SWEET
<jcastro> https://juju.ubuntu.com/docs/config-manual.html
<jcastro> here you go
<jcastro> poor man's openstack
<jrwren> oooh. taht isn't poor mans openstack. that is power mans provisioning
<rick_h_> jrwren: so that's what I mean. It just does the step "apt-get install python-dev ..." right?
<rick_h_> jrwren: you're still compiling python packages on the server
<jcastro> jrwren, another one is "it's like maas, but works."
<cmaloney> my biiggest concern (and I know what you're going to respond, but hear me out) is if and when Canonical abandons this methodology for "the new  hotness" who will pick up the pieces?
<cmaloney> because it feels like there's not a lot there to keep it going if Canonical bails on it.
<jrwren> rick_h_: no, you compiling hte python packages on teh build server. it packages the virtualenv into the deb.  when you install the deb everything is already built
<jrwren> jcastro: hahaha @ maas but works... becuase it doesn't actually do the physical provisioning :)
<jcastro> cmaloney, this is the new hotness
<jrwren> cmaloney: if that is your biggest concern, you should adopt it immediately.  My biggest concern is that it solves a problem that I don't have :)
<jcastro> brousch, nothing cloud like? Excellent
<jcastro> that's exactly what I need!
<rick_h_> jrwren: ah ok
<jcastro> jrwren, yeah the bummer is that automated provisioning is hard
<jrwren> it CAN be hard.
<jcastro> if you have the right IPMI hardware across the board that works, it's totally easy
<jcastro> but most people do not
<jrwren> right.
<jcastro> like we have different gens of proliants
<jrwren> in our case, we have lots of arbor appliance hardware.
<jcastro> all slightly different
<jrwren> ours customers are usually more network admin, so used to routers and switches and serial consoles, so we favor serial console to IPMI, which makes autoprovision with something like maas even MORE troublesome
<jrwren> routers and switches typically don't behave as dhcp clients :)
<jcastro> nod
<brousch> greg-g cmaloney: What social networking are you freetards using these days?
<jrwren> iMessage all over my iOS devices!
<cmaloney> brousch: Google Plus, mostly
<cmaloney> Waiting for Identi.ca to mature, but finding that I don't give a shit about the long-form diatribes
<cmaloney> that and the interface still needs to bake
<cmaloney> I think greg-g uses Idenit.ca though
<brousch> I thought that went away
<cmaloney> It's no longer using Status.net
<cmaloney> Now it's using pump.io
<cmaloney> Which is interesting, but it's still not 100% baked yet
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-10-12
<rick_h_> I always love when I see new users like this https://bmark.us/lukeasdf1234/recent
<rick_h_> cool! https://wiki.debian.org/FreedomBox/LeavingTheCloud
<widox> rick_h_: "43 years ago" hehe
<cmaloney> btw: Show is on: http://metalinjection.fm
<rick_h_> widox: yea, there's an import issue there I need to figure out. Some format. Some work and some always end up 43yrs ago :)
<cmaloney> http://www.firebox.com/product/6068/iKettle?via=hp&s=2x2&t=feature
<cmaloney> http://www.firebox.com/product/5611/Bluetooth-Gloves?via=related
<rick_h_> ok, so call me tempted http://www.firebox.com/product/4486/Professional-Fit-Fur-Life-Treadmill?via=related
<jame> what 'Show' might that be?
<rick_h_> lol, wtf is this site? http://www.firebox.com/product/2929/Villain-Chair?via=related
<rick_h_> I want one of those for code reviews
<cmaloney> jame: It's a show that I do weekly. I compile over 3 hours of music for Metal Injection
<cmaloney> 3 hours of metal music
<cmaloney> (creative commons licensed metal music)
<cmaloney> rick_h_: One of the other channels posted it
<cmaloney> And yeah,  that seat would go well with your lair.
<cmaloney> http://www.firebox.com/product/2922/Replica-Batmobile?via=related <- Along with this
<brousch> When we left GR ComicCon, the line was literally 1/2 mile long and 2-3 people wide to get into the building
<jame> cmaloney:  ah, good.  I've added it my links...
<cmaloney> jame: Awesome. There's also a podcast that I do at http://openmetalcast.com
<cmaloney> There's 80+ episodes of music. :)
<cmaloney> Tell your friends, and download early and often. ;)
<jame> cmaloney;  some people at my new job may be interested ( or already listening there, for all I know...)
<cmaloney> Hopefully the latter, but feel free to let them know. :)
<cmaloney> also, congrats on a new job!
<jame> Thanks!  (LiquidWeb, in Lansing...)
<tony-smlr> the MDLUG OCT 2013 meeting Live on Youtube http://www.youtube.com/embed/jAxNwHCuoHY
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-10-13
<cmaloney> Afternoon
<rick_h_> party
<jrwren> ugh
<rick_h_> ok
<jrwren> go saints!
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-10-06
<derekv> http://www.bityota.com/ sortof wonder what this is like =/
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/z3aG9E - BitYota - Data Warehouse as a Service
<gamerchick02> five minutes to meeting time?
<gamerchick02> i'm here but i'll be paying more attention to Lewis...
<gamerchick02> i think
<brousch_> cmaloney: I'm here for once!
<gamerchick02> yay brousch_
<jsjgruber-xt> Hi
 * greg-g looks in
<gamerchick02> welcome, greg-g and jsjgruber-xt
<cmaloney> Evening
<cmaloney> Welcome everyone.
<cmaloney> Let's get started
<gamerchick02> hi
<cmaloney> http://loco.ubuntu.com/meetings/ubuntu-us-mi/765/detail/
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/kjtYId - Regular monthly Ubuntu US MI IRC meeting | Ubuntu LoCo Team Portal
<gamerchick02> nothing on the agenda?
<cmaloney> So the agenda is pretty spartan because brousch_ is here. :)
<cmaloney> Not really.
<gamerchick02> k
<cmaloney> We do have a few things to cover though
<cmaloney> Is anyone going to be at Ohio Linuxfest?
<cmaloney> I'm planning on being there but I'm not getting there until Friday afternoon
<gamerchick02> i'm not going i don't think
<cmaloney> WEll, it's at the end of the month. :)
<cmaloney> so if you're going you'll want to make some plans now. :)
<gamerchick02> makes sense
<jsjgruber-xt> can't go
<brousch_> Not I
 * greg-g doesn't count
<cmaloney> WEll apparently I'm going to be representing then. :)
<cmaloney> I'm not sure if there's a meetup happeningat OLF or not
<cmaloney> Anywho, I think there's a new release coming soon (14.10). Anyone played with it yet?
<gamerchick02> unfortunately no
<brousch_> Not I
<greg-g> Does Debian Testing count? :P
<cmaloney> greg-g: Um, no. :)
<cmaloney> Apparently 14.10 releases the Thursday before OLF.
<greg-g> usualy the week of or so, yeah
<cmaloney> I had to look that up. :)
 * greg-g bbiabs
<cmaloney> Anyone feel like organizing a release party?
<cmaloney> Though to be frank there isn't a release party event on the loco directory
<brousch_> Linux Action Show talked about 14.10 and there's basically no new things in it
<brousch_> Sems odd
<cmaloney> http://www.reddit.com/r/Ubuntu/comments/2hsh5w/ubuntu_1410_final_beta_now_available_for_download/
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/P1TLXj - Ubuntu 14.10 Final Beta Now Available for Download. : Ubuntu
<gamerchick02> looks to be just updates and stuff.
<cmaloney> yeah, it's pretty much phone or nothing at this point
<jsjgruber-xt> I haven't seen much new when I've had it booted; I guess development has focused more on the phone project
<cmaloney> or they're more focused on not-Wayland
<gamerchick02> yeah, one of the reasons why i'm not using it right now. *shrug*
<cmaloney> And getting that ready.
<jsjgruber-xt> I don't think they've enabled mir, however, unless you throw some levers to make it happen
<jsjgruber-xt> Still X
<cmaloney> Right, but I think the development focus is on the tablet / phone / Mir.
<jsjgruber-xt> Right
<cmaloney> Frankly I'm worrying that the desktop is pretty much going by the wayside in general
<gamerchick02> me too
<cmaloney> Anywho, unless anyone else has anything I think we can call this meeting done
<gamerchick02> nope. Lewis is awesome tonight
<jsjgruber-xt> nothing here
<cmaloney> OK, thanks everyone for coming out
<gamerchick02> no problem cmaloney.
<gamerchick02> and you'er welcome.
<gamerchick02> *you're. typing fail
<jsjgruber-xt> 'night everyone
<dickweed> dc
<cmaloney> morning
<brousch_> correct!
<cmaloney> Afternoon
<dickweed> still correct!
<cmaloney> har har
<cmaloney> dickweed: your nick is strangely appropriate. ;)
<mrgoodcat> that is the default nick when i log in
<mrgoodcat> i keep forgetting to change it
<mrgoodcat> it's a lingering effect of being immature at WMU
<greg-g> slightly
<cmaloney> Only just. ;)
<cmaloney> rick_h_: GSoC 2015 announced!!!!!! :)
<cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
<bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - Consequence (Eternal mix) by Circle of Dust on Metamorphosis
<mrgoodcat> rick_h_: you going to participate again?
<cmaloney> I hope so
<brousch_> I don't think I will
<brousch_> Kivy org had disappointing results for the most part
<mrgoodcat> rick_h_ had pretty good results afaik. but it was a lot of work too
<brousch_> https://plus.google.com/app/basic/stream/z13rdjryqyn1xlt3522sxpugoz3gujbhh04
<brousch_> Where's that bot?
<mrgoodcat> hang on
<mrgoodcat> ValueError: Unicode strings with encoding declaration are not supported. Please use bytes input or XML fragments without declaration.
<mrgoodcat> the bot is here
<brousch_> ah
<mrgoodcat> just not working on that link apparently
<mrgoodcat> saw that on /r/linux
<mrgoodcat> https://plus.google.com/+LennartPoetteringTheOneAndOnly/posts/J2TZrTvu7vd
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/0Q3o8g - Much of the Open Source community tries to advertise the community as one happyâ¦
<mrgoodcat> there it goes
<mrgoodcat> .read https://plus.google.com/+LennartPoetteringTheOneAndOnly/posts/J2TZrTvu7vd
<mrgoodcat> :<
<bookiebot> http://r.bmark.us/u/c5d801cc402517
<mrgoodcat> oh
<mrgoodcat> just slow
<cmaloney> I'll never understand why folks think its cool to try to kill someone because you don't agree with them
<brousch_> It is the instinctual way to make a problem go away
<mrgoodcat> to be fair, i read the chat log in question and it seemed much more like a hyperbolic joke to me
<mrgoodcat> but thats just me
<mrgoodcat> http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/maemo/maemo.20130215.txt
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/VXJy24 - text/plain
<mrgoodcat> relevant messages at Feb 14 18:22:03
<mrgoodcat> not that i advocate that behavior in any way
<mrgoodcat> but it doesn't seem like a very legitimate attempt to hire a hitman
<cmaloney> Not particuarly.
<cmaloney> Can't tell who the target is from that chat
<cmaloney> Feb 14 15:13:01 <infobot> 'sth is poettering' means it acts invasive, possessive, destructive, and generally in an egocentric exacerbating negative way. ``this cancer is extremely poettering''
<mrgoodcat> it starts here Feb 14 20:03:30 <kerio> DocScrutinizer05: i bet that a helicopter-shaped dent in lennart poettering would do wonders for systemd
<cmaloney> It's also on the maemo list. I can't see them being terribly thrilled with systemd.
<mrgoodcat> lol
<mrgoodcat> overreactions on all sides i think
<cmaloney> Yes
<mrgoodcat> I agree that personal attacks are inappropriate, but he did sort of bring it on himself. The whole kernel debug fiasco didn't do much to help his image. although that was more ken seivers
<cmaloney> I'm not the biggest fan of POSIX either but throwing it out altogether has a lot of hubris.
<mrgoodcat> not sure i understand POSIX enough to even comment on that
<cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
<bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - Illisit by Skinny Puppy on Weapon
<greg-g> wtf http://modernfarmer.com/2014/10/potato-birth-control-never-good-idea/
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/TerQlS - 403 Forbidden
<brousch_> One of the few Apple users came in asking how to remove a virus from her home OSX
<brousch_> It's hard not to cackle with glee
<mrgoodcat> lol
<rick_h_> evening
<rick_h_> cmaloney: I know wtf...it just ended
<rick_h_> GSoC already? I'm not ready to think about it
<mrgoodcat> lol
<cmaloney> Heh. :)
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-10-07
<mrgoodcat> mornin
<wolfger> morning
<cmaloney> Good morning
<brousch> cmaloney: I just won a very long, intense battle in the lower left quadrant http://www.dragongoserver.net/game.php?gid=930042
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/ry7gSE - DGS - Game #930042,125
<mrgoodcat> brousch: just out of curiosity, what sets this apart as a win for you?
<brousch> I will take his lower left structure in 1 turn
<brousch> everything white directly connected to a1
<brousch> But if I had not won the battle, he would have taken all of mine in the same area
<mrgoodcat> up to e4?
<brousch> yes
<brousch> Now look at the loss I would have taken
<brousch> easily half of my stones
<mrgoodcat> you had a much higher risk
<mrgoodcat> all the way up to h10 it looks like to me
<brousch> It is probably the best battle I have actually won so far.
<mrgoodcat> well good job
<brousch> The only person I've beaten in a game is cmaloney ;)
<mrgoodcat> brousch++
<mrgoodcat> lol trust me you'd beat me
<brousch> I have learned a few techniques. I think of them as running and pressure
<brousch> mrgoodcat: I am happy to play against you
<cmaloney> brousch: That's awesome.
<cmaloney> Yeah, brousch is really good at capturing in Go
<mrgoodcat> what is "vacation days left" on dgs?
<brousch> Where do you see that?
<mrgoodcat> http://www.dragongoserver.net/userinfo.php?uid=85245
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/m8B900 - DGS - Dragon Go Server
<brousch> Maybe a way to let other users know you haven't abandoned the game, you're just on vacation?
<cmaloney> Yeah, that allows you to leave for a bit without having the game time-out.
<cmaloney> Geez, Ben has 7 games going at the moment. :)
<brousch> Yeah, but 2 of them have no activity at all, 3 have about 1 move/day
<cmaloney> I just had one time out with ColonelPanic001
<brousch> That slacker
<cmaloney> Totally
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: Have you signed up to DragonGo Server?
<mrgoodcat> yea
<mrgoodcat> dyladan
<cmaloney> Invited.
<cmaloney> http://krebsonsecurity.com/2014/10/bugzilla-zero-day-exposes-zero-day-bugs/
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/MTxp5J - Bugzilla Zero-Day Exposes Zero-Day Bugs â Krebs on Security
<cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
<bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - Dead Waters by Narada
<cmaloney> Evening
<tony-smlr> Good evening cmaloney
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-10-08
<mrgoodcat> date change
<mrgoodcat> I can't tell if it's twisted or sqlalchemy but something is giving me a giant headache
<wolfger> morning
<brousch> mrgoodcat: Um, do those even work together?
<brousch> I recall twisted core working with sqlalchemy recently, but not all of sqlalchemy
<mrgoodcat> not really
<brousch> not all of twisted I mean
<mrgoodcat> its more of a headache than its worth clearly
<brousch> or was it sqlalchemy core?
<mrgoodcat> no i'm using sqlalchemy protocols too
<mrgoodcat> er twisted
<mrgoodcat> gah
<mrgoodcat> forget everything i just said
<brousch> Ah, this is what I'm thinking of https://pypi.python.org/pypi/alchimia
<mrgoodcat> oh cool
<mrgoodcat> yes i am using the sqlalchemy core
<mrgoodcat> i'm going to stop though
<mrgoodcat> i'm going to switch to twisted.enterprise.adbapi while its still early enough to do that
<mrgoodcat> wish twisted supported python3
<ColonelPanic001> DGS is bad about not reminding me of games
<ColonelPanic001> and so I forget
<brousch> I just leave the tab open in my browser and check it regularly
<cmaloney> Good morning
<cmaloney> Yeah, I check my DGS from time to time
<cmaloney> I know brousch is taken his turn likely 24 hours ago
<brousch> I don't tend to go long stretches except at night or when I'm driving
<cmaloney> I do when I'm working. :)
<mrgoodcat> stretches of what? not checking
<brousch> Mobile reminds me, and computer has tab up
<brousch> mrgoodcat: right
<mrgoodcat> wish there was a way to learn go without getting your ass kicked over and over
<wolfger> I don't think learning works like that.
<cmaloney> Learning is pretty much a series of ass-kickings.
<mrgoodcat> lol
<mrgoodcat> i know
<brousch> Oh shoot, I forgot handicap
<mrgoodcat> this is my first game with a person
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: Don't worry. I'm pretty low-level as well
<cmaloney> brousch is going to be the first person in here to hit 1dan
<cmaloney> mark my words
<brousch> So few people are ranked
<cmaloney> Yeah, the ramking system is similar to the chess ranking system
<cmaloney> pretty impenetrable until you hit tournament-range
<mrgoodcat> oh good. at least brouch picked a small board for my first game. cmaloney went full-size
<cmaloney> I went with a 13x13 board
<mrgoodcat> also, i have no idea what to do in either of these games lol
<mrgoodcat> s/full-size/bigger
<cmaloney> I thought you'd played go before?
<mrgoodcat> yea
<mrgoodcat> i have
<mrgoodcat> just not much
<mrgoodcat> and with a computer only
<cmaloney> Well, brousch will teach you the capturing game
<cmaloney> and I'll teach you territory.
<mrgoodcat> oh and some random dudes on the internet. but i don't count them as real people because i never talked to them
<mrgoodcat> and got my ass handed to me
<cmaloney> Yeah, computer opponents are pretty focused
<cmaloney> whereas human opponents can see a broader picture
<cmaloney> ok, head-down. see you on the other side.
<brousch> mrgoodcat: Do you want comments as we go?
<mrgoodcat> i think that would be helpful
<mrgoodcat> but keep in mind that i've only ever played a computer and only a few times so i'm still pretty shaky on terms and stuff like that
<brousch> Don't worry, I make up my own terms since I can never remember the foreign ones
<mrgoodcat> lol
<wolfger> woot
<mrgoodcat> on dgs where do you typically go to see if you have games waiting? I've been going to status but scrolling down is hard
<wolfger> OK, I just made an account on dgs if anybody wants to kick me around. I think I've played Go before. Years ago.
<brousch> I go to Status. What do you have to scroll past?
<brousch> wolfger: name?
<mrgoodcat> there are a bunch of messages
<mrgoodcat> just marked them all as read to make them go away
<mrgoodcat> tournament updates
<mrgoodcat> as if i'm masochistic enough to join a tournament
<brousch> Ah, right
<brousch> Once they're read it's not bad
<brousch> That configuration you used on the left is a good one, but I have no figured out how to use it well yet
<brousch> Good players use it against me
<wolfger> <- name  (brousch)
<mrgoodcat> bottom left?
<brousch> Yes, the stones separated by 1,2 spaces
<brousch> I don't know how to use that though
<mrgoodcat> idk you said to spread out but it seems smart to not spread them too far just in case one can help the other in a pinch
<mrgoodcat> i'm probably thinking about it all wrong but i guess that's how you learn
<brousch> right
<brousch> No, it's a balance
<brousch> I assume finding the right balance takes decades
<mrgoodcat> brousch is a lot faster than cmaloney
<brousch> hah, cmaloney playes 2 moves/day
<brousch> "work" he whines
<brousch> mrgoodcat: Your last move was better than I gave you credit for
<mrgoodcat> the top is now fairly well protected as far as i can see
<brousch> Yeah, that made it much harder to get around the back
<mrgoodcat> that was less of a retreat and more of a guard. like the diagonal pawn configuration in chess. at least in my head. we'll see how it plays you
<mrgoodcat> out*
<brousch> I see that now
<brousch> To get the top of that structure I need a lot of busy work now
<mrgoodcat> we're playing a pretty symmetric game
<brousch> It happens. You get long runs of diagonal and straight sometimes
<brousch> Those early singles sometimes break it up
<mrgoodcat> you said "mobile notifies me". what app do you use for dgs?
<brousch> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=mco.prj.app.bwgofree with https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=mco.prj.srv.bwdgs
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/rEwujE - BW-Go Free - Android Apps on Google Play
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/i0DLf1 - BW-DGS - Android Apps on Google Play
<brousch> Actually i use the paid, but it doesn't matter
<brousch> mrgoodcat: Do you know about "eyes"?
<mrgoodcat> a little
<mrgoodcat> i know if you have 2 eyes in a chain it's essentially uncapturable
<brousch> Not essentially, it is invulnerable
<mrgoodcat> but i'm unclear on what constitutes an eye. can it be only one free space? or if there's multiple spaces is it not an eye?
<brousch> It is a completely enclosed (by all your stones) space
<mrgoodcat> ok. well that clears it up a little
<brousch> You can get away with 1 corner of it not being yours
<mrgoodcat> I think i even understand why it's invulnerable
<brousch> You have space in your upper right corner to make 2 eyes, so it would be very difficult for me to attack it
<mrgoodcat> it would be suicide to play in an eye, but if you had surrounded the entire structure it would be legal because you would capture the whole thing, but if there are 2 eyes there are 2 suicide moves so no way possible to play them both and suicide without capture is illegal
<mrgoodcat> unless i missed something
<brousch> Correct
<brousch> So with 2 eyes, it's impossible to surround them both
<mrgoodcat> can an eye be against a side/corner?
<brousch> In your current structure, g8, h789, j789 could all become eyes. So if I attack I will try to disrupt that
<brousch> yes
<brousch> The good players can look at a structure like yours and determine whether it's possible to capture it even as early as now. I am not that good
<mrgoodcat> i don't feel all that confident in my ability to protect it even if a skilled player would consider it impossible to take
<mrgoodcat> it still depends on me making the right moves
<brousch> Right
<mrgoodcat> or not the wrong ones anyways
<mrgoodcat> for instance on that last one i was unsure if i should have gone at h7 instead, but then you could have captured h5. I don't yet have the skill/experience to determine what is a worthwhile sacrifice
<brousch> I think you made the right move there. I forced you into it
<brousch> It strengthened your structure and you lost no stones
<brousch> This move for you now will take some thought
<mrgoodcat> i'd say you are very unlikely to win this battle
<brousch> I probably wouldn't even try against anyone else ;)
<mrgoodcat> lol
<mrgoodcat> one advantage of playing with a computer is that i don't have to wait for it to make moves
<brousch> I think you've secured it properly now
<brousch> Yes, I can't stop you from making 2 eyes in there. Well done
<mrgoodcat> that was the move i had in mind a while ago but i had to stop you from infiltrating first
<mrgoodcat> and thank you
<mrgoodcat> move 23 was a mistake on my part for sure
<brousch> It took me a while to learn a move like that. My instinct is to protect the outer wall, lik f9
<brousch> But that gives the opponent a chance to get behind
<mrgoodcat> lol i just played f9
<mrgoodcat> i'm unsure if i should be following through on the eyes or leaving the structure as it is
<brousch> F9 was not necessary. It was essentially a no-point space for anyone
<brousch> Unless you are planning to attack me ;)
<wolfger> Well, why would anybody not attack you? ;-)
<brousch> Right, he should be thinking about that now
<brousch> wolfger: Are you going to play?
<wolfger> Hadn't noticed the invites. I assumed I would be notified.
<brousch> No, it doesn't send emails
<brousch> You have to manually check it for everything
<brousch> It's like 20 year old web
<brousch> You have to clock on "status" to see any updates of any kind
<brousch> wolfger goes right for the battle
<cmaloney> It'll notify you but the notifications are buried in the interface somewhere.
<wolfger> brousch: it wasn't a battle until you decided to come at me. :-)
<wolfger> I was peacefully exercising my right to keep and bear arms is all. Didn't infringe on any of your liberties. That was your move.
<wolfger> Ah, found the Android app. Much nicer than the website.
<brousch> Yes
<brousch> 19x19 boards are little cramped depending on your phone size
<mrgoodcat> .echo test
<bookiebot> test
<wolfger> test
<mrgoodcat> bookiebot: where were you on those usc notices?
<mrgoodcat> http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/usn-2371-1/ USN-2371-1: Exuberant Ctags vulnerability
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/eJrv3K - USN-2371-1: Exuberant Ctags vulnerability | Ubuntu
<mrgoodcat> http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/usn-2370-1/ USN-2370-1: APT vulnerability
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/jsWGtr - USN-2370-1: APT vulnerability | Ubuntu
<_stink_> exuberant ctags
<_stink_> hah
<mrgoodcat> brousch: i think you're stronger in this one
<brousch> The power of foam!
<wolfger> foam?
<brousch> That's what I call it when the stones are connected diagonally
<brousch> Has little holes in between like foam
<mrgoodcat> it gives you good defense
<brousch> Right, you always have 2 ways to connect
<brousch> So you go in one part, I connect the other and suddenly have a 3 piece structure with ~6 degrees of freedom
<mrgoodcat> >degrees of freedom
<mrgoodcat> what is this?
<brousch> That's how many ways you can expand your structure. When a stone has 0 degrees of freedom it is dead
<brousch> "surrounded"
<brousch> A stone by itself in the middle of the board has 4 degrees of freedom
<wolfger> ah. I've been seeing it called liberties
<brousch> Could be
<brousch> liberties seems more common
<mrgoodcat> i'm less sure what to do now
<brousch> Hm, I guess I would try to secure that lower left corner
<brousch> My stones will be difficult to attack, but if you can defend the corner you'll have good territory
<brousch> Now i have to decide whether to fight your defense-building or clean out your crud in the upper left
<mrgoodcat> decisions decisions
<mrgoodcat> hope i havent been a boring newbie
<brousch> No, you are challenging, and this game is close
<brousch> Revealing my thoughts makes it harder for me
<_stink_> do we really want brousch's thought to be revealed?
<_stink_> s
<brousch> mrgoodcat: Do you see the key to your success in holding the corner?
<mrgoodcat> yea i do
<mrgoodcat> your center structure is pretty well impenetrable though
<brousch> I'm not sure it's possible. Too many moves out
<mrgoodcat> yea you'd have way to long to defend it
<mrgoodcat> too*
<mrgoodcat> this game is going to be over soon i think
<mrgoodcat> over half the board is locked
<brousch> Right, your hope is to hold that lower left corner and maybe you'll have more territory than I do. Right now is the critical fight for the corner
<brousch> If i can keep your two parts separated, I will win. If you can connect them, you will probably get the corner
<brousch> 2 parts being your c3,4 and 2d,e structures
<mrgoodcat> unfortunately for you, i think i'm advantaged here
<brousch> yes
<mrgoodcat> i'm trying to think of ways for you to stop me connecting them and i'm running short of ideas. you don't have enough time to get around them. My android game tells me when spaces are untakeable based on the number of moves. wish DGS had similar functionality
<brousch> Essentially, I need to beat on you just enough that you cannot form 2 eyes
<mrgoodcat> you may be able to do that. the best you can hope for in this corner is probably a break-even. but that still gives you the majority of the board
<brousch> The thing is, if I prevent you from getting 2 eyes, the rest of the stones are dead
<brousch> I had to play a lot of games before I was convinced of that
<mrgoodcat> but good luck with that. i think i'm still significantly stronger in this corner
<mrgoodcat> if i beat you though it will only be because you were helping me
<mrgoodcat> even if i salvage a close defeat
<mrgoodcat> intense finish though
<mrgoodcat> brousch: you're making an "up" arrow
<mrgoodcat> are those officially eyes?
<brousch> I have 0 complete eyes on the board. For you, 1a is an eye and c1 or c2 is an eye
<brousch> Now I have 1 eye on the right
<brousch> So you have that lower left corner, but it's only 3 pieces of territory
<brousch> Remember that's what counts in scoring
<mrgoodcat> c1,2 is an eye? i was under the impression an eye could only be one space
<brousch> It will be an eye once you fill either of those spaces
<brousch> It's not technically an eye yet, but damn near impossible to attack.
<brousch> I would e1 f2 e3, then c1 and then have you go to sleep so I could take c2
<brousch> mrgoodcat: Are you thinking about the upper left?
<mrgoodcat> yea a little
<mrgoodcat> but it looks pretty impossible atm
<mrgoodcat> i was more thinking about the possiblity of salvaging some territory there
<brousch> You cannot get 2 eyes there, so whatever you play will become my prisoners
<brousch> I always find that hard to accept though
<mrgoodcat> i'm running out of ideas
<mrgoodcat> how do you determine when to end the game?
<brousch> Heh, usually when the other guy tells me "we're done here" and I convince myself he is right
<mrgoodcat> lol well you're the other guy now
<brousch> Technically they want to you to close all the holes, but you can mark stones as dead without that in the end-game
<brousch> The bottom middle/right is pretty loose. We should play that out to see how many spots you can keep there
<mrgoodcat> if its obvious they can't be saved
<mrgoodcat> like the top left
<mrgoodcat> do you count the stones themselves as territory?
<mrgoodcat> or just the spaces?
<brousch> No, you are connected to the 2 eye bottom left, so you could gain some territory
<brousch> just the spaces
<mrgoodcat> no i'm not saying its obvious, i'm saying if it is obvious, they can be marked dead
<mrgoodcat> i was just repeating what you said to show i understood
<brousch> Right, the upper left will be marked as dead at end-game
<brousch> Hm, that's actually a very troublesome move for me
<brousch> I didn't realize how vulnerable my 1 eye lower right is
<mrgoodcat> that was the intended effect :)
<mrgoodcat> not sure if you aren't making a move because i've troubled you or because you have real work to do....
<brousch> I was thinking hard
<brousch> Found the simple solution ;)
<mrgoodcat> darn
<mrgoodcat> now i'm stuck just trying to contain it the best i can
<mrgoodcat> wish i had a notification for when my turn comes
<mrgoodcat> settled for a 5s auto-refresh on the status page
<mrgoodcat> going to have to make a chrome app for this maybe
 * mrgoodcat is one of those impatient ones
<brousch> heh
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: That is not a site that should be reloaded often
<cmaloney> You'll probably overload it.
<mrgoodcat> orly
<mrgoodcat> i'll keep that in mind
<mrgoodcat> switched it to 1min
<cmaloney> Tehre is an email notification you can receive
<cmaloney> and the android client can give you a notification as well
<brousch> mrgoodcat: I mist say this part has not gone as I saw it
<brousch> Very interesting
<mrgoodcat> thanks
<mrgoodcat> i assume thats a good thing anyways...
<mrgoodcat> also thanks cmaloney
<brousch> It's always interesting when an opponent does not think like me
<brousch> Lot's of "oh crap, I didn't even think about that"
<cmaloney> brousch: Yeah, I know the feeling.
<mrgoodcat> brousch: it seems like you were a little too confident in your big fortress in the middle.
<brousch> Yes, too much foam ;)
<mrgoodcat> very interesting late game
<mrgoodcat> developments in a lot of areas
<brousch> Yeah, it kind of bothers me when the good guys go "we're done" when there's still a lot to play. I usually ask them to play it out with me to see what develops
<mrgoodcat> i think this game is over though. i can't get your f1,2 without you connecting it to your 2 eye bottom right. the top right is mine, the top left is yours, the bottom left is mine
<mrgoodcat> now that you actually have 2 real eyes in your middle structure
<mrgoodcat> you also can't stop me from connecting the bottom left and top right structures
<mrgoodcat> in fact i just did
<brousch> But I can make you fill in territory to do so
<brousch> Each time I do that without losing a stone is basically a point
<brousch> A very close game. I will not win by much more than komi
<mrgoodcat> a lot closer than my other online games. they were on bigger boards though
<mrgoodcat> and i didn't have help
<brousch> now we have to mark dead stones
<mrgoodcat> i'd be interested in playing in person. i don't like waiting for online turn based games
<brousch> Yeah, finishing a game like this in 1 day is rare online
<brousch> maybe during tournaments
<cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
<bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - Tres Brujas by The Sword on Warp Riders
<mrgoodcat> what is the color code here?
<mrgoodcat> on the finish
 * cmaloney <3s The Sword - Warp Riders
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: I have a Goban if you want to come over and play some time
<mrgoodcat> i'm not quite sure how this is supposed to work
<cmaloney> 9x9 and 13x13
<mrgoodcat> cmaloney: i'd enjoy that
 * cmaloney doesn't have a big 19x19 board.
<mrgoodcat> brousch: i'm going to assume that white are your territory, black is mine, pink is no-mans-land?
<brousch> I think when white is on a black stone it's marked as dead
<cmaloney> pink is contested iic.
<mrgoodcat> brousch: what am i supposed to do here?
<brousch> I think if white box is on black stone it is dead
<cmaloney> The algorithm considers it dead
<cmaloney> it's up to you to determine if it is dead or not
<cmaloney> though at this point I'd say that anywhere it considers dead is probably legit
<mrgoodcat> so am i determining my dead stones as well as yours?
<mrgoodcat> or just yours (none)
<brousch> I don't think I have any dead
<mrgoodcat> you don't
<mrgoodcat> are my top-left dead?
<brousch> If you know they will die if play continues, they are dead
<brousch> So, yes
<mrgoodcat> i think i did that right
<brousch> mrgoodcat: g2 is the only dead one you missed
<mrgoodcat> oh yea
<mrgoodcat> oops
<mrgoodcat> i meant to click that
<brousch> No problem, it let me select it
<mrgoodcat> so it goes back and forth until there is agreement it seems
<mrgoodcat> so when i clicked done without marking any stones, the game ended
<brousch> that makes sense
<mrgoodcat> want to play another 9x9 or a 13x13 this time?
<brousch> I wonder if it lets you resume play if you can't agree
<mrgoodcat> i dont know
<mrgoodcat> i didn't really look too close at the options at the bottom
<mrgoodcat> each dead stone counts as 2 points?
<brousch> Seems to. I guess technically it's a capture and a territory
<brousch> But if played out it would not be as much territory, so that seems weird
<mrgoodcat> i think it is to prevent someone from trying to fill up your territory before the end game
<mrgoodcat> you are giving them spaces if you can't save your stones
<mrgoodcat> er points
<brousch> So for g1,2, If I played at g1, I would get a point for capture and a point for territory, so it would only come to 2 points for that area instead of the 3 I got
<brousch> Similar in upper left. Played out to a ridiculous level would get my 8pts instead of the 10 I got
<brousch> insteresting
<mrgoodcat> a prisoner is also a point though
<mrgoodcat> oh wait thats what you said
<mrgoodcat> we'll play out the next one until it's done then?
<mrgoodcat> unless someone is just filling in their own territory or the game is clearly lost
<brousch> In this case 3 points would not have made a diference
<brousch> I guess if the game is close enough you'd keep going
<mrgoodcat> similar thing would have happened to my territory too
<brousch> true
<mrgoodcat> not sure what the numbers would have ended up being but my top left had a lot of empty space to fill up
<mrgoodcat> er right
<mrgoodcat> another game?
<brousch> Yeah, won't be as intense though due to end of work day stuff
<mrgoodcat> yea ok
<mrgoodcat> 9 or 13?
<brousch> Up to you
<brousch> 9 goes faster, but 13 becomes a different game
<brousch> Fewer walls to bump into
<mrgoodcat> i think i'd like another 9 to get used to it. you make it or me
<mrgoodcat> ?
<mrgoodcat> woah.... too many settings. you can make it
<brousch> heh, just set the board size and leave the rest
<brousch> invited
<cmaloney> Generally speaking if you don't know what the drop-down does, dont' worry about it.
<mrgoodcat> sorry i had to walk away for a second. i'm going to try to get the android app working
<cmaloney> http://arstechnica.com/security/2014/10/adobes-e-book-reader-sends-your-reading-logs-back-to-adobe-in-plain-text/ <- The sooner Adobe gets out of the content distribution business the happier I'll be
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/UtjKDY - Adobeâs e-book reader sends your reading logs back to Adobeâin plain text [Updated] | Ars Technica
<cmaloney> love their formats, hate their stupid DE.
<cmaloney> (digital editions)
<brousch> mrgoodcat: No problem. I'm handing out master passwords to work big wigs in case I die during my colonoscopy tomorrow
<mrgoodcat> related: please don't die during your colonoscopy tomorrow
<mrgoodcat> then the only person i'll have to play Go with will be cmaloney
<cmaloney> brousch: livestream?
<mrgoodcat> of colonoscopy?
<cmaloney> What else?
<mrgoodcat> D:
<brousch> :p
<mrgoodcat> i have no opening strategy
<brousch> Neither do I
<brousch> I still haven't read a guide on it
<mrgoodcat> lol
<mrgoodcat> how i feel during early game http://hellogiggles.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/04/dog-on-computer.jpg
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/LvZvgc - image/jpeg
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-10-09
<cmaloney> Evening
<cmaloney> Hm, I got here late, and it looks like I'm the only one here.
<cmaloney> feh
<brousch> Eh?
<brousch> Oh, chc night
<cmaloney> yeah
<_stink_> where are you guys holding that these days?
 * greg-g is at the library doing work because, yeah
<cmaloney> _stink_: Bean and Leaf
<cmaloney> Just invited you to our secret clubhouse.
<cmaloney> https://plus.google.com/communities/105711849406316277146
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/rMP9jN - Royal Oak Coffee House Coders - Community - Google+
<_stink_> will i be hazed?
<cmaloney> not unless you bring pie
<cmaloney> otherwise, yeah.
<_stink_> hah
<_stink_> sweet thanks.
<cmaloney> You need to join in order to get our updates
<_stink_> roger
<greg-g> I think this might end up being useful: http://avoidhumans.com/
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/iqUGZf - Avoid Humans
<cmaloney> Song of the day: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlkaxyYDBI8
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/kormTc - Webb Wilder - Tough it Out - YouTube
<mrgoodcat> lol bash was apparently still not fixed
<cmaloney> I don't think it'll be fixed
<cmaloney> not until they remove that functionality.
<cmaloney> It's like fixing SQL Injection
<rick_h_> party
<mrgoodcat> well there was another update today
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: Yeah, and I'm thinking the only way to patch is to not run code from Env. variables.
<mrgoodcat> brousch: im waiting for inspiration
<mrgoodcat> but really i just started poorly
<greg-g> g'morning. 5.5 hours of sleep is not enough for this old man
<brousch> Coloniscopy is do ne. I survides,
<mrgoodcat> yay
<cmaloney> I think the colonoscopy must've hit a nerve or something
<_stink_> they went waaaay up there
<greg-g> tmi
<cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
<bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - One of Fail by Kalmah on 12 Gauge
<greg-g> when the good barista isn't working and you order a macchiato but get a latte looking thing
<brousch> I ended up taking a 3 hour nap afterwards. Just woke up
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-10-10
<cmaloney> Good evening
<brousch> Yes
<rick_h_> party
<cmaloney> Good morning
<_stink_> yo
<brousch> werd
<PhillyMelt02> I have two hopefully quick questions about the upcoming MUG meeting...
<PhillyMelt02> First, do you have to be a MUG member to win the RaspberryPi?
<PhillyMelt02> And second, i RSVP'd on meetup, do I have to do it on the MUG site to be official, or is that good enought?
<brousch> PhillyMelt02: I don't know the answers to your questions, but cmaloney should wake up soon
<PhillyMelt02> Thanks brousch
<cmaloney> HI PhillyMelt02
<cmaloney> I'm on the board of MUG. I believe we're opening it up to all participants, member or no
<cmaloney> PhillyMelt02: And you can RSVP on either site, but you can just show up.
<brousch> I don't think I RSVPed anywhere
<cmaloney> brousch: You RSVPed... with your SOUUUUUULLLLL!
<cmaloney> brousch: I'll add you to the meeting proper so you'll get "credit".
<brousch> credit?
<brousch> MUGbucks?
<PhillyMelt02> Thanks for answering my questions.  I look forward to the meeting.
<cmaloney> PhillyMelt02: Looking forward to seeing you at the meeting.
<cmaloney> BTW: We have a MUG-specific IRC channel if you're interested in idling in there. :)
<cmaloney> #mugorg
<cmaloney> Which you are already.
<cmaloney> That's how much I pay attention. :)
<PhillyMelt02> Yeah, I asked the question a few days ago and didn't get a response.  So I thought I'd try here
<PhillyMelt02> No worries, I noticed you were in both channels too
<brousch> Smarter than the average sammich
<cmaloney> I am sorry. I missed that in the channel
<PhillyMelt02> No worries.  Thanks for the help.
<cmaloney> I guess that show how much I pay attention in that channel. :)
<cmaloney> No problem. :)
<brousch> cmaloney: I expect you to have these ready for MUG http://www.raspberrypi.org/insert-juggling-pun-here/
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/M7VYfL - Insert Juggling Pun Here | Raspberry Pi
<cmaloney> brousch: I have NFC how she made those work
<brousch> RPi magic!
<cmaloney> Right, so is there a pi in each club?
<brousch> Hm, I don't think so
<cmaloney> See, that's the part that I'm not getting
<brousch> I don't get it either
<cmaloney> http://metalinjection.fm
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/rga8L2 - .FM - Your 24/7 Mainline of Streaming Metal Radio - Metal Injection
<cmaloney> OMC is on
<rick_h_> evening
<rick_h_> or morning
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-10-11
<cmaloney> It's Dice so take this with a grain of salt:
<cmaloney> http://news.dice.com/2014/10/09/5-programming-languages-marked-for-death/
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/vA0YDj - 5 Programming Languages Marked for Death - Dice News
<cmaloney> Also: Good morning
<brousch> cmaloney: That's the second thing I've seen marking Ruby for death. Interesting
<brousch> mrgoodcat: Will you be at MUG on Tuesday?
<rick_h_>  evening
<brousch> rick_h_: Back in our timezone?
<rick_h_> brousch: no, I'm here until thurs
<rick_h_> so get to stick 6hr ahead for a bit more
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-10-12
<rick_h_> party
<cmaloney> Good morning
<rick_h_> evening
<brousch> no
<brousch> Made a big pot of chili if anyone's interested
<rick_h_> very cool
<brousch> No. It is hot
<rick_h_> well then never mind, seems I don't need it :P
<brousch> No too spicy. The wife and boy complain if it is
<brousch> I throw some of my habanero death sauce, kung pow chili paste, or jalapenos in my bowl
<jrwren_> i want chilli
<jrwren_> or chili rather
<brousch> come get it
<rick_h_> jrwren_: welcome back
<cmaloney> I got "chickie boat" from Meijer
<cmaloney> so we'll have that for dinner
<cmaloney> along with cole slaw and potato salad.
<cmaloney> picnic-fare.
<cmaloney> Bought a rick_h_-like rake
<cmaloney> http://www.amazon.com/temper-165117700-True-Temper-Inch/dp/B00FDZHSAM/ref=cm_cr_pr_sims_t
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/eO8f8g - Amazon.com : ames true temper 165117700 True Temper, 24 -Inch Clog Free, Poly Leaf Rake : Lawn And Garden Tool Accessories : Patio, Lawn & Garden
<cmaloney> Similar to this one but not quite
<rick_h_> heh cool
<brousch> I have no idea what "chickie boat" is
<brousch> A friend has a billy goat for sale. I want it. http://www.billygoat.com/product-categories/list/leaf-litter-vacuums
<bookiebot> http://goo.gl/VJifpk - Leaf & Litter Vacuums | Billy Goat Industries, Inc.
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-10-05
<cmaloney> Evening
<cmaloney> We'll get started on the meeting in 5 minutes
<cmaloney> http://loco.ubuntu.com/meetings/ubuntu-us-mi/1004/detail/
<cmaloney> anyone in here?
<waldo323> Hi
<cmaloney> lo
<cmaloney> So the first order of business: Ohio Linuxfest was this past weekend.
<cmaloney> Anyone head out there that has returned yet?
<waldo323> I didn't make it out
<cmaloney> Yeah, me either
<_stink_> PRESENT
<cmaloney> So not sure if there was a presence t OLF this year or not
<cmaloney> If anyone was there and has something to say about the event, please feel free to pipe up. :)
<cmaloney> Moving on to the next topic
<cmaloney> Release Party
<cmaloney> Looks like 15.10 will be releasing on the 22nd
<cmaloney> so it's time for a release party
<cmaloney> unfortunately I'm not going to be around that weekend
<cmaloney> so if anyone would like to coordinate a release party, please feel free
<waldo323> Well it wouldn't be a party without you.
<cmaloney> Well, I'm afraid it'll have to be. :)
<waldo323> I think I have tentative plans
<cmaloney> No worries
<cmaloney> post to the list if anyone would like to take the ball and run with it.
<cmaloney> Speaking of taking the ball, let's move on to the next item
<cmaloney> There's an Online Developer Summit from Nov. 3-5th
<cmaloney> http://fridge.ubuntu.com/2015/09/13/ubuntu-online-summit-dates-3-5-november-2015
<cmaloney> More info there.
<cmaloney> Anything else?
<waldo323> Not at the moment
<cmaloney> OK, unless there's something else then I think we're set for now
<cmaloney> now I can go back to Wikipedia to look up facts relating to The Gong Show
<cmaloney> which, apparently, there's a trading card pack for (Available at Sundance Cards and Games)
<cmaloney> Thank you everyone for attending
<cmaloney> (treat yourself to some Gene Gene the Dancing Machine videos)
<cmaloney> morning
<flipsidecreation> good morning
<_stink_> yo
<cmaloney> How's the morning so far?
<flipsidecreation> Good, just got back yesterday from the Ohio Linux Fest https://ohiolinux.org/
<flipsidecreation> good time
<cmaloney> Very cool!
<cmaloney> Sorry I had to miss it
<flipsidecreation> it was the first time I had went
<cmaloney> Ah, that's awesome
<flipsidecreation> yeah, I will submit a talk for next year
<cmaloney> very cool
<cmaloney> How were the talks this year?
<flipsidecreation> good, I mostly did the security track
<cmaloney> Nice
<flipsidecreation> and hung out with the folks from PodNutz
<flipsidecreation> I cohost SMLR.us and I am getting more and more into podcasting / youtube
<flipsidecreation> I am not a great coder so I contribute back to open source via content production
<cmaloney> Ah, neat
<cmaloney> Dammit, TPP is reached.
<mrgoodcat> well congress still has to approve
<mrgoodcat> it will be published in 30 days
<mrgoodcat> then congress gets 90 days to ratify
<mrgoodcat> so all hope is not yet lost
<cmaloney> How's the afternoon?
<cmaloney> or morning in the case of our west-coast friends.
<brousch> Jury duty is done, so life is better
<cmaloney> yay
<greg-g> hey rick_h__ cmaloney etc: remember those Ubuntu case badges we had, DoctorMO (from Massechusettes made them)? I put my remaining stack (about 40 or so) on our work "Free as in Free Table Table" and they disappeared in less than two hours
<cmaloney> I'd believe it
<cmaloney> The puffy ones, or am I thinking of something else?
<cmaloney> also: stickers!
<cmaloney> I'd love to know how "Ambient" got tagged onto Decapitated, Borknagar, and Bolt Thrower
<greg-g> puffy ish, metalic shiny
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-10-06
<cmaloney> morning (for another 7 minutes)
<greg-g> ...and 3 hours
<cmaloney> Not in God's timezone. ;)
<jrwren_> what time is it in Jarusalem?
<jrwren_> or Jerusalem?
<jrwren_> oh, 7pm.
<greg-g> Mecca
 * jrwren_ poors a drink
<cmaloney> God's Timezone is EDT
<cmaloney> says so in the bible.
<cmaloney> (somewhere, I'm sure)
<aleph_one> since I've never been to a MUG event, I've got a question about how it works
<aleph_one> I'm looking into getting an Asus C201 and installing the libreboot port for it
<aleph_one> if I have questions/run into problems, would the MUG meeting be an okay place to ask around? assuming I've done my own research, etc.
<cmaloney> Sure, though we also have a discuss mailing list that may be of service prior to the meeting
<cmaloney> usually we have more presentation-type material than Q&A
<aleph_one> cool
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-10-07
<cmaloney> Evening
<_stink_> yo
<cmaloney> morning
<_stink_> yo
<cmaloney> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-aL2I--TCHM <- brousch
<cmaloney> Man, the NSA really screwed over Safe Harbor
<brousch> cmaloney: Looking into a drumset your wife will let you play at home?
<cmaloney> She's OK with the real set; we just have to get it over here.
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-10-08
<cmaloney> morning
<_stink_> hello
<cmaloney> How's the morning?
<_stink_> not bad
<_stink_> you?
<cmaloney> Having a pretty decent Thursday so far
<rick_h__> party
<cmaloney> rick_h__: How's seattle?
<rick_h__> cmaloney: not really seen it yet
<rick_h__> we're in bellevue a bit east
<rick_h__> but loving the weather
<rick_h__> going to dinner in the space needle tonight
<jrwren> oh that is fun! I've never been up there.
<rick_h__> yea, hopefully get a good view :)
<rick_h__> but excited for the weekend, going to hit up mount rainier
<rick_h__> get the heck out of dodge
<ColonelPanic001> out of dodge. much escape.
<jrwren> such outage
<greg-g> much incident
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-10-09
<KD8NXH-Michigan> Is this the Michigan Linux users group or the Michigan Ubuntu users group?
<_stink_> this is the channel for the ubuntu michigan local community team
<greg-g> we love all flavors and spices of gnu/linux though, mostly
<cmaloney> morning
<jgransden> good morning
<cmaloney> How goes?
<jgransden> it goes. Be better tomorrow
<jgransden> how bout you?
<cmaloney> Getting started on the morning
<cmaloney> little frustrated, but otherwise OK.
<cmaloney> la da da
<jgransden> Frustrated is no way to start the morning
<jgransden> should probably just call it a day and go back to bed....
<cmaloney> Well, the first cup of coffe hasn't kicked in yet
<cmaloney> And I'm listening to Black Metal
<cmaloney> so all is good
<cmaloney>  Woods of Ypres - Adora Vivos
<jgransden> Black Metal always helps
<cmaloney> Well, that one isn't black metal, but it's always welcome. ;)
<jgransden> wow, from windsor. I thought all Blackmetal had to come from norway
<cmaloney> Heh
<jgransden> not bad. listening to the woods 5 on youtube
<cmaloney> It's a hell of an album
<jgransden> i like so far
<cmaloney> https://earache.bandcamp.com/album/woods-5-grey-skies-electric-light
<cmaloney> What's gut-punching is the singer / lyricist / main dude passed away prior to the album release
<cmaloney> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woods_of_Ypres#Death_of_David_Gold_and_breakup
<jgransden> yea, read that. That sucks.
<jgransden> music reminds me of old daylight dies
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-10-11
<cmaloney> Morning
<_stink_> yo
<rick_h__> morning
<cmaloney> How's the afternoon so far?
<_stink_> like 5th time doing printer driver installs under ubuntu... happy it works, but boy is it annoting.
<jrwren> printing sucks. always
<cmaloney> printing is the devil
<brousch> People still print?!
<gamerchick02> printing is necessary but yeah, it does suck
<cmaloney> I feel humanity has failed whenever I have to print something
<cmaloney> http://www.faterpg.com/resources/
<cmaloney> This is quickly becoming my favorite RPG system
<gamerchick02> sometimes that's the best way to get things across. paper never has compatibility problems.
<gamerchick02> that looks cool
<cmaloney> http://www.evilhat.com/home/war-of-ashes/
<cmaloney> Just picked up the book today
<cmaloney> <3
<gamerchick02> i'm still playing pathfinder at lunch at work. it's awesome
<gamerchick02> more mathfinder sometimes, but it exercises my brain
<cmaloney> Yeah, no kidding
<cmaloney> Not a fan of D&D 3.5
<cmaloney> if I'm going to math I'm playing GURPS
<cmaloney> ;)
<gamerchick02> eh, it's what i played a lot on college.
<gamerchick02> lol. i love GURPS tho
<gamerchick02> i should contact Mark and see if he wants to do a game.
<cmaloney> No worries. it's easier to find a D&D 3.5 game than it is to find a GURPS game
<cmaloney> far easier
<gamerchick02> (one of my old professors, he's a huge GURPS geek)
<cmaloney> <3 Fate because you can get the core books for free, and the print books for $30 (Core and ACcelerated)
<cmaloney> and the Sytem Toolkit is cheap
<cmaloney> http://www.evilhat.com/home/fate-core-downloads/
<cmaloney> Ah, this site has the System Toolkit
<cmaloney> http://www.evilhat.com/home/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/Olaf-Vs-The-Orcs.pdf
<gamerchick02> sweet
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-10-10
<brousch_> Damnit. I read 3% more and now I want to cry
<brousch_> It's enough to drive a man to Java
<cmaloney> a-yep
<cmaloney> I'm working (slowly) through the Front End Web Development book from Big Nerd Ranch
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-10-11
<cmaloney> morning
<cmaloney> reminder: MUG meeting tonight
<cmaloney> 6:30pm sharp
<Scary_Guy> oh awesome, I completely forgot.  which might have been a good thing since my car is in the shop :(
<cmaloney> Ugh
<Scary_Guy> died Thursday on I-94 going to Wayne for another meetup
<Scary_Guy> know anyone coming from the east side?
<cmaloney> not sure
<cmaloney> For all I know my car will be in the shop. Taking it in today at 10am
<Scary_Guy> well if anyone wants to swing by Madison Heights on the way I'll go.  Failing that I'm probably not going to make it this month
<Scary_Guy> what's wrong with yours?
<cmaloney> hard shifting
<cmaloney> Think it might be a firmware fix
<Scary_Guy> lol, that would be the best kind of fix
<Scary_Guy> unless it fails in the middle of flashing
<cmaloney> Yeah, that's always a concern
<cmaloney> so I'm sort of playing it by ear.
<Scary_Guy> but easy as you don't really have to swap out any parts
<Scary_Guy> I think mine is a water pump issue
<cmaloney> Ugh
<Scary_Guy> I can't complain too much though.  arguably the best car I've ever had
<cmaloney> which car is this?
<Scary_Guy> almost two years and the only other major issue recently was new front tires
<Scary_Guy> Subaru 2003 Legacy (Canadian)
<Scary_Guy> not as cool as the hearses I used to drive but AWD and the gas mileage is much better
<cmaloney> Ah, the polite model
<Scary_Guy> reduced trunk space is annoying though
<cmaloney> Well, with a hearse you literally could put a few people back there.
<Scary_Guy> and have :)
<Scary_Guy> always fun doing the dream cruise with a bunch of friends in the back
<cmaloney> My parents have a car that we joke is the mafia-edition. It has a trunk that would go for about $1,000 per month in SOMA.
<cmaloney> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_of_Market,_San_Francisco
<Scary_Guy> if I could afford it ever I'd get this: http://www.rosewoodclassiccoach.com/grand-vista-coach/
<cmaloney> wow
<greg-g> My subaru must really be identifying with being a Californian now, it keeps giving me the P420 fault code (catalytic converter)
<rick_h_> greg-g: hah
<rick_h_> greg-g: 60k miles?
<rick_h_> greg-g: seems like each of ours went that path right around then
<greg-g> 130k
<greg-g> 2002
<rick_h_> oh, nice
<greg-g> just paid $800 to replace both cats and both o2 sensors to get it smog'd, but now ~3 weeks later I get the same code (well, minus the o2 sensor ones)
<rick_h_> oh, well that's no good
<rick_h_> ugh, and with inspections/etc :/
<greg-g> yeah, and to sell a car here it needs to be smog'd first
<greg-g> yup
<rick_h_> always hated the 02 sensor. Just a $$ thing to get done for what it is
<rick_h_> well, I mean it's more $$ than you'd think
<greg-g> yeah
<jrwren> yup, but very important sensor for clean burn.
<greg-g> so, going to call the dude and see what's up (glad I bought one of those OBDII bluetooth thingies)
<cmaloney> Sitting at the dealership awaiting a firmware update for the transmission.
<cmaloney> Listerning to CNN try to diagnose Donald Trump
<cmaloney> amidst Donald Trump ads.
<rick_h_> ugh, I send you wishes that your headphones work well
<cmaloney> Heh, I decided to forego the headphones
<cmaloney> starting to regret my life's choices.
<rick_h_> doh
<cmaloney> heh
<cmaloney> It's all good
<cmaloney> honestly I don't understand how anyone can be sympathetic
<cmaloney> (to Trump)
<cmaloney> and sitting here looking at Javascript one more time
<cmaloney> https://stackoverflow.com/jobs/112588/wanted-dangerous-php-developer-network-merchants-llc?offset=3&med=site-ui&ref=jobs-tab&sort=i <- Isn't this pretty much implied? (PHP == Dangerous?)
<cmaloney> oh boy, there's a fucking copper ad on CNN
<greg-g> copper as in the metal?
<cmaloney> yes
<cmaloney> as in apply copper to your aching joints and become superhuman
<cmaloney> as in bullshit
<greg-g> ahhhhhhh, right, day time ads are like that :)
<cmaloney> a-yep
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-10-12
<Scary_Guy> wow, copper?  someone needs to get the FTC to go after them like Head-On
<Scary_Guy> greg-g I got a bluetooth OBDII thing too, two in fact.  I had it with me in the car but didn't know where the port was on the car to use it.  Was going to look at it when I got to where I was going, but where I was going was apparently the side of I-94 westbound
<Scary_Guy> almost made it to the M-12 exit just before the stupid football bridges
<Scary_Guy> anyway I'm hoping it works with the two offerings F-Droid has.  They're generic Chineese and a pretty blue color too (even though it isn't a fashion show, I kind of still like it to look nice)
<Scary_Guy> the other one is for my dad's van
<Scary_Guy> which is a year older than my car
<cmaloney> mornng
<Scary_Guy> hey
<_stink_> yo
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-10-13
<cmaloney> Good morning
<rick_h_> morning
<cmaloney> How's the day so far?
<jrwren> just started.
<jrwren> cmaloney: care evolution in AA is hiring. They seem a pretty cool place.
<cmaloney> thanks. Checking it out.
<cmaloney> Candidates must also have a passionate enthusiasm for the extremely dynamic, rapidly-expanding Health Information Exchange market.
<cmaloney> Hmmm...
<_stink_> boy o boy
<_stink_> doesn't that perfectly describe you??
<cmaloney> Totes
<cmaloney> https://goo.gl/THJyJ9 <- Me right now
<brousch_> There's a place in Holland that makes custom closet systems. They are looking for a decent Django dev.
<cmaloney> I'd need to have a sample of their work. :)
<cmaloney> for research purposes.
<brousch_> cmaloney: Did you see http://pycoders.us4.list-manage.com/track/click?u=9735795484d2e4c204da82a29&id=e7c3db2b2e&e=f62471ce79 ?
<cmaloney> brousch_: Not yet. Looking
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-10-14
<cmaloney> mornin
<brousch_> Syrup
<brousch_> Fucking autocorrect
<cmaloney> I like syrup
<_stink_> mmm
<cmaloney> morning pt 2
<rick_h_> wheee
<cmaloney> how's the morning?
 * rick_h_ is cranky today for some unknown reason
<cmaloney> SOrry to hear that. :(
<jrwren> rick_h_: juju 2.0 release anticlimactic?
<rick_h_> jrwren: not sure
<cmaloney> Thought there's be more to it?
<rick_h_> think I just woke up on the wrong side of the bed today
<cmaloney> That's understandable
<cmaloney> If you want someone to talk to feel free to ping me
 * cmaloney is sitting at SChoolcraft waiting for JoDee's class to finish
<greg-g> Syrup
<cmaloney> it's what's for dinner
<jrwren> its friday friday gotta get down
<greg-g> Oh, she teaches at Schoolcraft too? or now? or?
<greg-g> jrwren: which seat do I take?
<cmaloney> In addition
<cmaloney> Become an adjunct teacher. See the world. Drive to it for no money.
<greg-g> heh, yuuuup
<cmaloney> brb
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-10-15
<cmaloney> morning
<jrwren> grey morning
<cmaloney> yeh, I just finished mowing and pseudo-raking
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-10-16
 * greg-g is in DC
<_stink_> for anything fun?
<cmaloney> Define fun
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-10-09
<cmaloney> Good morning
<brousch> No
<jrwren> Good afternoon
<notlikethesoup> afternoon
<cmaloney> where?
<Scary_Guy> evening?
<cmaloney> maybe
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-10-10
<rick_h> morning
<jrwren> Good morning
<_stink_> yo
<Scary_Guy> hi
<cmaloney> morning
<mrgoodcat> morning
<cmaloney> BTW: MUG tonight
<cmaloney> 6:30pm
<cmaloney> Wolf talking about the internals of git
<mrgoodcat> oh man i want to see that but i have my gma's bday dinner
<cmaloney> Eh, she'll hopefully have another
<greg-g> daaaaammnn
<cmaloney> ;)
<cmaloney> What? Its a self-correctng problem
<mrgoodcat> are you going to record?
<cmaloney> Yeah, we'll be recording
<mrgoodcat> cool
<cmaloney> it's all good. I'm just messing
<mrgoodcat> google always notifies me when mug uploads videos
<cmaloney> We should also be live-streaming in case it gets boring
<mrgoodcat> yea they wont mind if i bring a laptop to dinner
<cmaloney> Eh... old people don't notice those sorts of things
<cmaloney> just tell them you're working on taking healthcare from kids. They'll thank you for it.
<jrwren> cmaloney: is right. is it a multiple of 5 or 10? then she might care. old people stop celebrating birthdays when they turn 30.
<cmaloney> Exactly
<mrgoodcat> cmaloney: i have the rare democrat grandma
<cmaloney> I'm not due for another birthday in at least 4 years
<jrwren> i'm pretty sure cmaloney doesn't even know his age. just knows it is somewehre between 40 and 45... err... and now I realize I've no idea how old cmaloney is. :p
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: Tell her you're working on healthcare.gov then. :)
<mrgoodcat> jrwren: 97 i think?
<jrwren> 97! wow!
<cmaloney> Yeah, I'm 97
<cmaloney> in dog years perhaps
<mrgoodcat> lol
<cmaloney> or I'm a vampire
<cmaloney> in which case I'look good for a vampire
<mrgoodcat> lol
<cmaloney> none of that gaunt thing going
<mrgoodcat> 97 doesn't sound right. but i have no way of checking
<mrgoodcat> i know 90 felt like it was a while ago
<jrwren> paleness: checks out
<mrgoodcat> lol
<cmaloney> Yeah, I'm part ginger so that means part vampire
<jrwren> <3 linux tc... just a few commands to slow a connection down.
<cmaloney> https://www.youtube.com/c/MugOrgPage/live
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-10-11
<mrgoodcat> morning
<rick_h> morning
<mrgoodcat> hows it going?
<cmaloney> Good morning.
<cmaloney> So far it's OK
<jrwren> Good Morning.
<jrwren> ugh... https://github.com/mysql/mysql-connector-j/pull/25  "I confirm the code being submitted is offered under the terms of the OCA, and that I am authorized to contribute it."   so sad
 * rick_h whistles dixie
<cmaloney> Oracle Contributor Agreement?
<rick_h> jrwren: ok, your reply to greg-g gets the award for most disturbing morning tweet
<cmaloney> or Orally Consenting Adults
<rick_h> cmaloney: yea
<cmaloney> rick_h: Which one? The Bernie quote?
<rick_h> cmaloney: yea
 * rick_h goes to the twitter tab to see what his friends are up to and...do what?
<rick_h> takes a few reads to figure out wtf
<cmaloney> heh
<cmaloney> a: Tweetdeck makes Twitter useable, especially with RTs turned off
<cmaloney> b: Yeah...
<cmaloney> I wish Twitter also had a feature where if someone starts with 1/ that it says "Use a fucking blog"
<cmaloney> but that's just wishful thinking
<mrgoodcat> I wonder if any clients batch together threads into a single post with a [read more] anchor
<rick_h> heh, there's your business idea
<rick_h> reverse-cross posting
<cmaloney> Heh
<cmaloney> I know there's storify, but that's not a client
<rick_h> take the threads and a blog engine that you wire to your twitter account and rather than mirring your blog post to twitter, pulls your twitter posts and aggregates them into a blog entry
<mrgoodcat> lol
<mrgoodcat> i meant more for reading other people
<cmaloney> I mean, I've been guilty of it myself
<mrgoodcat> propublica frequently posts 10+ tweet threads. It would be nice to have the 9 after the first hidden by default
<cmaloney> where you start into a tweet-storm
<cmaloney> but I'm also seeing folks start off something like "I'm going to talk a little about X 1/"
<cmaloney> at which point it's premedidated
<mrgoodcat> that's what i'm talking about
<mrgoodcat> and a client would take 1/, 2/, 3/... n/ and batch them into a single view collapsed by default
<jrwren> rick_h: lol. I love politics with greg-g :)
<cmaloney> I'd rather write a bot that sees 1/ and responds with "please write a blog post"
<cmaloney> but mrgoodcat's idea is less confrontational
<rick_h> well now I need a new client?
<rick_h> that seems a bit less optimal
<rick_h> "Oh, you wrote something long...let me open goodcatwitter
<cmaloney> either that or we get out the virtual spankings
<jrwren> turns the story into an image with all the text. posts the image to twitter.
<jrwren> because.. TWITTER!
<cmaloney> That screencapping is to prevent folks from deleting stuff
<cmaloney> but yeah, that's really annoying
<cmaloney> It's the Twitter equivalent of smacking a bad pooch with a newspaper
<notlikethesoup> morning
<greg-g> jrwren: is that his book that people were worried would kill his campaign if he won the primary?
<jrwren> its an article he wrote in 1972
<greg-g> link? I never read it :)
<jrwren> greg-g: http://www.motherjones.com/wp-content/uploads/Man_and_Woman_0.jpg
<greg-g> jrwren: That's a really weird article
<jrwren> greg-g: it was '72. he was young.
<greg-g> he was 31
<greg-g> he's old now, remember :)
<jrwren> old enough to know better :(   young enough to be stupid.
<greg-g> that's been me for the last decade
<greg-g> and will probably be me until I die :)
<greg-g> but it'll change to "old enough to know better, but just stupid"
<cmaloney> That's my epitaph right there
<rick_h> cmaloney: CHC tonight?
<cmaloney> Yep
 * rick_h might try to get down there after the boy's soccer game
<cmaloney> Oh cool!
<_stink_> where are you folks doing CHC these days
<rick_h> it's still bean and leaf in RO right?
 * rick_h figures that's good to make sure of before traveling down
<cmaloney> Yeah, that's where it's at
<cmaloney> https://www.meetup.com/preview/Coffee-House-Coders-Royal-Oak/events/243966101
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-10-12
<cmaloney> Evening
<jrwren> Good Morning Quiet Ubuntu Peeps
<mrgoodcat> sorry i did not make it to chc yesterday. i wanted to but it didn't work out
<mrgoodcat> i'll come next week
<rick_h> morning
<rick_h> cool, missed ya mrgoodcat :)
<cmaloney> Good morning
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: No worries. We'll try again next week. :)
<mrgoodcat> rick_h: hows the recovery going? i seem to remember a post that you are walking in your neighborhood now?
<rick_h> mrgoodcat: it goes, walked to CHC last night. so far about 1 mi is ok and 2 mi is a bit much
<rick_h> mrgoodcat: so keep on plugging away at rehab
<cmaloney> w00t
<mrgoodcat> glad to hear you're showing improvement
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-10-13
<mrgoodcat> morning
<jrwren> Good Morning!
<rick_h> morn
<_stink_> hello
<cmaloney> Good morning
<Scary_Guy> good.... noon
<mrgoodcat> lol my coworker on the google clips: https://dsc.cloud/dyladan/Screen-Shot-2017-10-13-at-3.19.42-PM.png
<jrwren> its rediculous that people are impressed that these things can be done on device.
<jrwren> the compute power on phones is what? 10-20X what was considered a supercomputer 15-20yrs ago, which was capable of doing it then.
<jrwren> The only limiting factor has been the providers.  apple and google wanting us captive and online.
<mrgoodcat> a supercomputer 20 years ago was deciding in real time when to take photos?
<jrwren> no.
<mrgoodcat> and also stitching HDR together
<mrgoodcat> and also doing EIS
<jrwren> a desktop EASILY could.
<jrwren> no idea wtf you are talking about now.
<jrwren> i'm just gonna assume you are buying into thier nonsense.
<mrgoodcat> that is what the camera is doing
<jrwren> smh
<mrgoodcat> go ahead and shake
<mrgoodcat> if its so easy you should undercut them with a competing device
<jrwren> like a poloroid picture over here.
<jrwren> are you serious?
<mrgoodcat> no
<mrgoodcat> obviously
<jrwren> Do you honestly believe the technical solution is the hard part?
<mrgoodcat> the processing power? no. tuning the model training? maybe. the data gathering? definitely.
<cmaloney> I think what jrwren is saying is that Google / Amazon aren't sending their corpus of data to the devices so folks can reverse-engineer what's going on
<cmaloney> and the signals and what-not are getting sent to Google / Amazon so they can process them off-site and tune their algorithms
<cmaloney> What's really interesting about these though is having that sort of compute ina tiny package running on batteries
<cmaloney> That's the part that I'm finding interesting
<mrgoodcat> i think what jrwren is saying is that the product is unimpressive because the theory behind it is well understood
<cmaloney> though again, this is the sort of thing that is the ARM chip's strength
<cmaloney> Not at all
<jrwren> the product is impressive.
<mrgoodcat> jrwren | its rediculous that people are impressed that these things can be done on device.
<jrwren> I'm saying, its late, for artificial reasons and I'm disappointed by our duopoly of apple and google in providing us with things which function offline.
<cmaloney> jrwren: Add Amazon to that list as well
<mrgoodcat> ah
<cmaloney> with Alexa / Echo / Dot
<jrwren> amazon doesn't make phones.
<mrgoodcat> this isn't a phone
<jrwren> but i'll accept adding them to the list of jerks.
<cmaloney> \o/
<jrwren> wtf do you mean it isn't a phone?
<cmaloney> Yeah, this is the camera
<mrgoodcat> its a camera
<jrwren> k, we've been talking about 2 diff things for the last 10min.
<jrwren> nevermind.
<cmaloney> It's the one that doesn't have a button on it for taking photos
<cmaloney> it just finds something "interesting" and takes a snapshot
<mrgoodcat> you just place it in the room and it takes photos when what it can see is deemed interesting
<cmaloney> So in our house it would never take a photo
<mrgoodcat> its all done on device which i presume is to appease privacy advocates
<mrgoodcat> it may also be a performance win though
<cmaloney> while in some houses it would never stop taking photos
<cmaloney> It could also be a combo of sending what it thinks to the mothership and the mothership determining which ones are kept
<cmaloney> eg: two-factor verification of interestingness
<cmaloney> Camera: "I think this is interesting" Google: It's a picture of a toilet brush you idjit
<mrgoodcat> they went out of their way to make it seem like it wasn't sending any photos up to the internet
<cmaloney> Camera: "Is this interesting?" Google: "I didn't know you could do that with a toilet brush".
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: How are the results displayed?
<cmaloney> I think that's a bit rubbish
<cmaloney> Might be that you have to opt-in to send them data
<cmaloney> but I doubt Google is just letting these things sit unattended
<cmaloney> from a developer perspective I'd like to see how they're performing in the field
<cmaloney> and from a Google perspective I'm sure they're interested in the human behavior that would lead you to think that toilet brush goes there.,
<mrgoodcat> cmaloney: i watched the keynote and it definitely seemed like it didn't depend on the network
<jrwren> so... I happend to work on something that does similar things :p
<jrwren> Vivint Ping Camera
<mrgoodcat> I assume most people that buy these are also google photos users though
<mrgoodcat> and will promptly upload all snaps
<mrgoodcat> good or bad
<jrwren> Still, for all of my argument, it may as well be a phone ;)
<mrgoodcat> which are tagged with the camera name
<cmaloney> jrwren: If you want to get _technical_ :-]
<jrwren> cmaloney: but why do that in a channel named #ubuntu.... :)
<mrgoodcat> i must be tired
<mrgoodcat> just had the overpowering urge to respond with "BURN!"
<cmaloney> jrwren: I wouldn't put the words Ubuntu and Phone together inan Ubuntu channel. ;)
<jrwren> bwahahahaha
<jrwren> RIP
<cmaloney> Never underestimate how completely fucked USA telecom is
<jrwren> s/usa//
<cmaloney> Yeah
<jrwren> hahaha and s/telecom/
<jrwren> "Never underestimate how completely fucked"
<cmaloney> and unless you have bags of cash to say "please shut up about telecom regulations and just take our money and leave us alone" it never happns
<cmaloney> I'm sure that's the whole reason AT&T accepted the iPhone. That and Steve Jobs wasn't about to let someone dork with it.
<cmaloney> something something tonerheads
<jrwren> well, remember back then ATT wireless was kind of shit. they were a LONG distance from VZ. Now they are kind of closer and a large part of that is because if iphone.
<jrwren> I'm sure you are right. $$ was involved, but only $$ not $$$ because apple didn't have it before the iphone.
<cmaloney> AT&T didn't have $$ either
<cmaloney> I'm sure they were desperate
<jrwren> right.
<jrwren> interesting how that works when no one has the $ to be a total jerk.
<mrgoodcat> can you imagine what phones would be like today if jobs had rolled over to telecoms about software "enhancements"?
<mrgoodcat> even android is somewhat tempered by the example of the iphone
<jrwren> ugh. it would be worse for sure.
<jrwren> and yet, I feel like it could be so much better.
<mrgoodcat> i mean theres always the possibility that if iphone was never released and android was more successful that more manufacturers would have forked android and built their own ecosystems and we'd have less lock in
<mrgoodcat> but that is a remote possibility i think
<mrgoodcat> but the iphone crushed the market so completely in terms of revenue that only a very small handful of manufacturers can make profitable phones anymore
<jrwren> amazon's failure of firephone shows how difficult it is to fork android and build own ecosystem.
<mrgoodcat> but more companies might have tried
<jrwren> you are dead on right when you say, "in terms of revenue" because android seems to be a race to the bottom.
<mrgoodcat> amazon is the only company that has credibly attempted
<jrwren> yup
<jrwren> well, samsung.
<mrgoodcat> with tizen?
<jrwren> didn't all of samsung, lg, htc have some which weren't google play tied?
<mrgoodcat> i didnt think that was a fork
<jrwren> no, tizen is their own thing. Its my one hope for a 3rd :)
<mrgoodcat> gl with that
<mrgoodcat> my hope for a third is for a company to release something that doesn't look anything like what current phones look like and to be obviously better
<mrgoodcat> the way the iphone was obviously better
<jrwren> that is a new 1st :)
<jrwren> http://osgameclones.com/  cool list
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-10-15
<cmaloney> morning
<rick_h> afternoon
<cmaloney> Howdy
<rick_h> everyone have some fun this weekend?
<cmaloney> Yeah, we went to a few library book sales this weekend
<cmaloney> and wandered downtown for a while
<cmaloney> you?
<rick_h> camping!
<rick_h> getting pics loaded off from this weekend
<cmaloney> W0000000t
<cmaloney> heh
<rick_h> first time we've gotten the trailer out sinceI hurt my knee so woot woot
<rick_h> enough non-rain to balance out the rainy/windy bits
<rick_h> though I could do with less wind on the drive home ugh. that was a rough drive
<cmaloney> Heh
<cmaloney> Yeah, it was pretty rough
<cmaloney> We got caught in a rain storm coming out of Meijher
<cmaloney> Meijer
<cmaloney> I got soaked
<rick_h> I bet
#ubuntu-us-mi 2019-10-07
<cmaloney> morning
<brousch> already?
<cmaloney> Yep
#ubuntu-us-mi 2019-10-08
<cmaloney> Morning
<jrwren> good morning.
<jrwren> What is good?
<cmaloney> ;)
<cmaloney> https://gettogether.community/events/2228/monthly-meeting/
<Scary_Guy> https://hackaday.com/2019/10/07/a-bootable-greeting-for-the-xenomorph-in-your-life/
#ubuntu-us-mi 2019-10-09
<cmaloney> Good morning
