#ubuntu-uos-appdev 2015-11-02
* You're now known as ubuntulog2
<Pici> .
#ubuntu-uos-appdev 2015-11-03
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/appdev/ - http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/11/03/%23ubuntu-uos-appdev.html
<kalikiana> o/
 * kalikiana preparing the hangout
<mhall119> kalikiana: you're pretty early
<kalikiana> am I?
<kalikiana> I thought I was late
<kalikiana> oh, haha, I guess it's in 1h
<kalikiana> damn timezones
<kalikiana> well, at least now I'm prepared :-]
<clobrano> It started
<kalikiana> for those who'd like to join: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYcb-0t97d7TlgW2WNWF8jO5A8Wm-Tt7YwOE_GDhBDsStZC22A?hl=en-GB&authuser=0
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Track: App & Scope Development | How do I write an Ubuntu app with QML | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22589/how-do-i-write-an-ubuntu-app-with-qml/
<kalikiana> popey: I can't seem to edit the session
<popey> oh?
<popey> what do you need me to do?
<popey> added hangout url, what's the broadcast url?
<kalikiana> this should be broadcast? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tn1kktSDPvA
<popey> kalikiana, yup, done
<kalikiana> thanks!
<popey> np
<popey> works kalikiana
<omgCATS> this is only QML right? i'm more interested in SDL
<ksantacr> where i can find the slides
<core_apps_police> The slide will be available to download?
<santi_> QUESTION: Will this work across multiple platforms?
<core_apps_police> QUESTION: The slide you used will be available to download?
<kalikiana> popey: maybe you can help me find out how to upload the slides best
<daker> QUESTION: what's max number of actions we can put on both sides ?
<santi_> thank you!
<gard> QUESTION: In the qt designer the ubuntu components are always marked red as in an error? any fix for that?
<daker> QUESTION: what's the stats of RTL support in the SDK rightnow ?
<daker> state*
<kenvandine> maybe the uitk doesn't provide the plugin types file?
<popey> kalikiana, can you share them?
<popey> and then link in the etherpad?
<zsombi> kenvandine: it does
<zsombi> kenvandine: the types fiule must be loaded from teh right chroot, and that may not always work :(
<kenvandine> it doesn't work even with the desktop kit though
<zsombi> daker: UITK components do support RTL, all of them
<zsombi> kenvandine: if you have the UITK installed on your desktop, it does autocomplete
<zsombi> kenvandine: though sometimes it looses them all... QtC has hickups sometimes :)
<zsombi> kalikiana: I have a bug + MR for that actually...
<daker> zsombi: kalikiana thanks!
<kalikiana> popey: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1AdMcE4NI9svchurNgPk2UjBC5mf9VAgc8RoEVGc7cb4/edit
<zsombi> daker: I saw you asked about the amount of ListItem leading/trailing actions
<zsombi> daker: the API does not restrict the count, design recomments 1 in leading and max 3 in trailing
<daker> zsombi: yeah, like if i define 3 on both side do i get 6 width right click ?
<daker> 6 with*
<zsombi> daker: yes
<popey> nice one kalikiana
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Track: App & Scope Development | Music App planning | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22572/music-app-planning/
<ahayzen> popey, vthompson, are we in here now ? :-)
<vthompson> ahayzen: present! :)
<ahayzen> \o/
<popey> hmm
<popey> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYf0bmOAQdxB9fBeG_d0ck8x1-DSfL1XlZ88Gfz7y8BXLJUg3w
<ahayzen> \o/
<popey> that should work for the music app session to join
<vthompson> All who join will accept work items! :)
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/appdev/ - http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/11/03/%23ubuntu-uos-appdev.html
<ahayzen> popey, vthompson, 'lunch' time!
<vthompson> ahayzen: It is actually my lunch time :)
<ahayzen> hah
<vthompson> I would have assume this was your lunch time as well, consider how late you eat dinner :)
<vthompson> *assumed *considering
 * vthompson needs food
<ahayzen> vthompson, haha too true
<popey> :)
<thecoder15> hello everyonre
<thecoder15> one
<popey> hello
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Track: App & Scope Development | Weather App Planning | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22573/weather-app-planning/
 * popey pokes ahayzen vthompson and James_Mulholland with https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYftKecTp-aWiVVWtYn4sHNcx-M503ukZR5t-dXWJQMsMr3ExA?hl=en&authuser=0
<ahayzen> James_Mulholland, popey, vthompson, is it that time again?
<popey> hah! beat ya
<ahayzen> eh
<James_Mulholland> o/
<ahayzen> popey, http://pad.ubuntu.com/uos-1511-weather-app-planning
<vthompson> popey: http://pad.ubuntu.com/uos-1511-weather-app-planning
<ahayzen> popey, vthompson is one of them https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1qJ4wzwHsHGNb7GDVjrarMUj4lyro-dLR2_4Xu1b5vQU/edit#slide=id.g37dfaf379_113
<ahayzen> popey, vthompson, slide23 onwards in that one
<thecoder15> hello
<davidcalle> Invite link for anyone willing to join the hangout https://hangouts.google.com/call/jp2pklq57st7dftxcjxem45ceea
<thecoder15> no it just started i think
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Track: App & Scope Development | Developer documentation healthcheck | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22617/developer-documentation-healthcheck/
<vthompson> \o/ Later guys!
<ahayzen> vthompson, \o/ later o/
<davidcalle> vthompson, ahayzen, has your session finished?
<ahayzen> davidcalle, yup :-) bang on 1900 sorry
<davidcalle> ahayzen, no worries :)
<davidcalle> The doc healthcheck will start in a short moment
<davidcalle> Does anyone want to join the session?
<davidcalle> https://hangouts.google.com/call/jp2pklq57st7dftxcjxem45ceea
<davidcalle> https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/
<davidcalle> http://pad.ubuntu.com/uos-1511-developer-documentation-healthcheck
 * balloons listens in
<dpm> http://v-play.net/
<CheeseBurg> QUESTION: Could you have community tutorials like Digital Ocean has? Ex: https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials
<CheeseBurg> That way its community made but intergrated to the developer site
<balloons> yes, digital ocean is community generated
<balloons> not all of them are great :-)
<ahayzen> QUESTION: If i goto https://developer.ubuntu.com .. it takes me 4-5 clicks to get to http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/apps/qml/current/ ... can that be reduced?
<ahayzen> Apps->QML->API->Stable/Developer
<ahayzen> people always complain about content-hub lacking documentation
<ahayzen> or examples
<ahayzen> yeah the search defo needs improving i usually end up using http://doc.qt.io/qt-5/ if i can't find anything :-/
<ahayzen> dpm, davidcalle, you using elasticsearch across the django models?
 * ahayzen tries to think what else he finds annoying
<ahayzen> I think really, as you have already said, its about tutorials and examples (especially with alot of them currently being hidden/difficult to find)
<namenick> hi
<namenick> hoi
<namenick> how do you know
<balloons> hello
<balloons> give all the items to popey :-)
<ahayzen> #blamepopey
<davidcalle> Done :)
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/appdev/ - http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/11/03/%23ubuntu-uos-appdev.html
<ahayzen> thanks guys dpm davidcalle popey :-)
<popey> that was fun
<dpm> thanks ahayzen :)
<dpm> and we're off for the day, good opening for UOS!
<davidcalle> thanks ahayzen!
<patriot> hey
#ubuntu-uos-appdev 2015-11-04
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/appdev/ - http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/11/04/%23ubuntu-uos-appdev.html
<hayman> hi
<hayman> when the event starts ?
<mikke> ik wil ubuntu op mij tabet kan dat
<Dragos> hello
<Dragos> is this startec
<Dragos> is this started
<Dragos> hi
<Dragos> mhall119:
<mhall119> Dragos: yes?
<Dragos> when this video will start
<Dragos> and in the yesterday video you sad that at 10 i can join canonical or something? how?
<Dragos> mhall119:
<mhall119> Dragos: I said that you had a few years still before joining Canonical
<mhall119> in the past we've hired or contracted with developers who were as young as 16
<Dragos> oh...
<Dragos> but do u contracted with him?
<mhall119> not anymore, he left to attend University
<Dragos> but how do u contracted with him?
<mhall119> it was a work contract
<mhall119> pretty standard
<Dragos> ohh ...
<Dragos> now  undertand
<Dragos> now      i understand
<Dragos> ask the ceo:
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Track: App & Scope Development | Scopes roundtable | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22615/scopes-roundtable/
<Dragos> hi
<kesha> hi
<Dragos> xD
<kesha> :P
<Dragos> my headphones just got broken. lol
<kesha> lol fix them :D
<Dragos> k'
<kesha> ty
<kesha> Qt Purchasing Module Might Come To Qt 5.6
<kesha> Qt Purchasing is a commercial add-on module developed by The Qt Company
<kesha> which implements a cross-platform API for in-app purchases on iOS and
<kesha> Android.
<kesha> Qt Purchasing is a commercial add-on  :O its a comercial plugin mean ??? developers have to buy it ???
<Osgood1> Oooo - exciting!!
<Osgood1> Can't wait to see what's in store for Scopes
<dobey> kesha: why are you asking about qtpurchasing in the scopes session? :)
<dobey> kesha: qtpurchasing is open sourced with qt 5.6 now. it has been a commercial plug-in in the past though, yes.
<davidcalle> Hi everyone, we'll start in two minutes!
<kesha> oh thanks for informing
<Osgood1> davidcalle: ðª
<justCarakas> we hear you
<davidcalle> If you have any questions, please make sure to prepend them with QUESTION:
<marcustomlinson> FYI: JavaScript Scopes session tomorrow: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22616/javascript-scopes-hands-on/
<dobey> who is cooking? :)
<alecu> let's hope marcus has got his voice back for tomorrow's session!
<marcustomlinson> yeah lets hope :P (for everybody's sake)
<marcustomlinson> QUESTION: could you give a brief overview of what filters will be available, and how they will add to the overall user experience?
<marcustomlinson> trust pawel to give it to you straight :)
<marcustomlinson> excellent answer, thanks!
<mvvvv> how the apps you developped this way are platform dependants ? DE dependants ?
<alecu> mvvvv: thanks for your question
<davidcalle> If anyone wants to play with the thumbnailer, there is a tutorial for QML apps https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/apps/qml/tutorials/use-ubuntu-thumbnailer/
<alecu> I'd like to ask the audience to prefix questions for the Hangout with "QUESTION:"
<marcustomlinson> mvvvv: could you rephrase your question? sorry, I'm not sure I understand it.
<mvvvv> ok sorry
<alecu> I'll answer it shortly on the hangout
<marcustomlinson> ok :) alecu understood
<mvvvv> reusability outside unity
<davidcalle> mvvvv, gotcha, thanks :)
<dobey> they are plug-ins for unity8
<dobey> other platforms could use the scopes libraries to provide integration via scopes, but unity8 is the only one that works with these scopes apis now
<gwaka> QUESTION: Is there some plan to provide a fully customizable scope ? A way to aggregate apps, contents, favorites on a scope directly on the phone ?
<marcustomlinson> mvvvv: the unity8 front-end and scopes back-end infrastructure are abstracted such that the back-end can be reused at least on other Linux distros
<marcustomlinson> mvvvv: it is pure C++
<mvvvv> ok thanks
<BrianLinuxing> Interesting answer on Unity 8, any thoughts when there might be a stable Unity 8? Approximately?
<alecu> BrianLinuxing: is that a QUESTION: for the hangout? :-)
<dobey> unity8 is stable now
<BrianLinuxing> Question: any time-scale when there might be a stable Unity 8? Approximately?
<alecu> BrianLinuxing: thanks :-)
<dobey> we've been shipping it on retail products for almost a year now :)
<marcustomlinson> BrianLinuxing: I assume you mean for desktop?
<BrianLinuxing> Sorry alecu, I am reading rather slowly, as I listen :)
<gwaka> ok thanks for the answer
<marcustomlinson> gwaka: you question is an excellent one by the way. We did design with this idea in mind. We would love to provide such an experience
<gwaka> that would be very cool :)
<marcustomlinson> so yeah, its on the todo list :)
<BrianLinuxing> sorry wasn't 100% clear, Question: with Ubuntu phones when is a reasonable timescale for a really stable Unity 8?
<dobey> oh, kyle transformed into a different kyle
<marcustomlinson> hahaha
<dobey> BrianLinuxing: what is "really stable" in that respect? it's pretty stable now, but will continue getting bug fixes, and occasionally some new features when necessary for new scopes features and such, or to fix interaction issues that we run into
<kyrofa> dobey, yeah I got up and running with the streamed video :P
<marcustomlinson> BrianLinuxing: perhaps this session later would be a good place to ask that: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22633/developing-unity-8/
<kyrofa> Distributing a .so feels a little dirty though
<dobey> kyrofa: well, how else would you distribute a go scope?
<marcustomlinson> guys, we are really talking about 2 different things though. gwaka asked for an experience where the user creates an aggregator scope on the fly from the UI
<BrianLinuxing> dobey, good point. I saw a Ubuntu phone the other week for the first time. I was impressed. I liked it. But I got the impression there might be some stability issues, I was curious overall.
<dobey> you could always link statically too
<kyrofa> dobey, I mean the way that aggregator works now you essentially have to commit the .so into version control
<kyrofa> Especially if you're talking about hashing the .so
<davidcalle> marcustomlinson, if it's just filling values into a JSON file, imagining a UI taking care of it is not too far fetched
<gwaka> Yes, the objective is to be able to create the aggregation on the fly,thus not pb of security
<dobey> kyrofa: i think the bigger problem is that they have to run unconfined
<marcustomlinson> davidcalle: correct! But the guys are talking about releasing aggregators to store now. So the topic got a little sidetracked
<davidcalle> marcustomlinson, right, still interesting :)
<dobey> but yes, what gwaka was asking for is what design has been working on
<marcustomlinson> gwaka: :) I think they did understand, they just got sidetracked
<dobey> customization
<gwaka> I saw that :)
<gwaka> but I had my answer anyway
<marcustomlinson> We can do that keywords thing for sure
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Track: App & Scope Development | Community Core Apps QA | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22598/community-core-apps-qa/
<davidcalle> Thanks everyone!
<balloons> hello all
<balloons> hopefully I won't have crickets for this session
<alecu> thanks all!
<balloons> I'll set it up and we'll roll
<ahayzen> new jenkins \o/
<davidcalle> Hey balloons, have a nice session :)
<balloons> indeed
<balloons> ok, video link should be posted
<ahayzen> QUESTION: Will the CI dashboard ever be fixed again?
<ahayzen> QUESTION: In music we mock the mediascanner2 database, however sometimes they make changes to their schemas and this breaks our mocking. Is there the possibility we could have jenkins periodically run a 'sanity' test over trunk, if the CI dashboard isn't going to be working ;-)
<lolzilla> hi all
<lolzilla> is the camera app core?
<ahayzen> balloons, yeah we just wants at least a heads up :-)
<ahayzen> "oh we need to rebuild our mocked db"
<ahayzen> yeah that'd be cool :-)
<lolzilla> QUESTION: witch apps are the core apps? is cammera app core app?
<ahayzen> QUESTION: For the manual testing results page, some of the comments for the tests say "Didn't want to remove SD card", however I don't know if they clicked fail or skip. Firstly could the comments state what the person clicked and secondly would there be a way of changing a fail to a skip if someone had selected fail when they don't have an SD card etc
<ahayzen> lolzilla, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone-coreapps
<ahayzen> balloons, https://ubuntu-community-testing.staging.ubuntu.com/reports/overview
<ahayzen> lolzilla, camera is a 'system' app built by Canonical not the community
<lolzilla> oh thanks balloons, the scroll didn't scroll and i didn't see your message
<lolzilla> sorry balloons
<popey> Note: Canonical is part of the Community :)
<lolzilla> i'm on firefox
<ahayzen> lolzilla, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-system-apps
<lolzilla> usually i'm using chrome
<lolzilla> chrome > firefox
<popey> To be accurate "camera is a system app which is built by some people (who happen to work for canonical)" :D
<popey> *>firefox
<lolzilla> i see, popey
<ahayzen> popey, hehe ;-)
<balloons> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/CoreApps/
<Dragos> QUESTION: is terminal a core app?
<popey> yes
<balloons> ahayzen, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-community-testing/+bug/1509015
<popey> https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/community/core-apps/
<ahayzen> balloons, ah :-)
<Dragos> QUESTION:why terminal is not in ubuntu touch 13.04
<ahayzen> QUESTION: Maybe you should explain when and where to use autopilot vs qmltest vs manual tests
<lolzilla> QUESTION: when will the core apps replace the gnome apps, like gnome termina,  files  etc
<ahayzen> Dragos, from what I understand, its up to the manufacturer which apps they ship, however it is available in the store :-)
<ahayzen> popey, ^^ that's correct right?
<popey> Yes
<popey> Touch 13.04 is somewhat retro
<Dragos> QUESTION: why ubuntu store is not in ubuntu touch 13.04
<lolzilla> QUESTION: what will replace the rest of the gnome apps, like for ex gnome  font viewer? what core app
<popey> Nobody uses 13.04, that's like a phone with loads of cardboard cutouts for apps.
<popey> Dragos, what device?
 * mzanetti rewinds :D
<lolzilla> 13.04??? that's like 5 years old
<lolzilla> upgrade to 16.04
<lolzilla> wb Dragos
<Dragos> QUESTION:WHo can quess my age? im 10
<Dragos> wb?
<ahayzen> QUESTION: Autopilot Vis is awesome, are there any plans to have the ability to click on the component in the UI to show its data rather than expanding the massive tree
<lolzilla> QUESTION: what is your favourite comunity app and why?
<lolzilla> core
<Dragos> QUESTION:how are yo all doing?
<gwaka> QUESTION: I don't have "man" command on my terminal apps, is it me or is it by default ? if so, why ?
<mzanetti> ahayzen, check out gammaray
<Dragos> QUESTION:what is ur email?
<mzanetti> ahayzen, http://www.kdab.com/gammaray/
<ahayzen> mzanetti, wow! interesting
<ahayzen> balloons, look at that ^^
<mzanetti> ahayzen, https://launchpad.net/~gerboland/+archive/ubuntu/unity-mir
<mzanetti> there's a package...
<ahayzen> :-)
<mzanetti> although not built for wily... but might still work... otherwise you can probably push that package to a ppa of yours to rebuild it for wily
<mzanetti> or kindly ask Gerry to rebuild :)
<James_Mulholland> Good choice Nicholas
<lolzilla> dekko it is :D
<James_Mulholland> Not that DanChapman and I are biased ;-)
<lolzilla> good choice :D
<lolzilla> thanks balloons
<DanChapman> \o/ Dekko!
<ahayzen> thanks balloons :-)
<James_Mulholland> thanks balloons!
<balloons> lol, I really really want to run it on my desktop too
<balloons> I'm with mhall119 on this. I'm ready to replace Thunderbird
<balloons> The session talking about Pilot is tomorrow: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22588/user-level-testing-for-ubuntu-phone/
<balloons> and user testing of the phone in general
<balloons> gwaka, I've got to try man now on my device, hah
<mzanetti> balloons, thanks for the session. and once more, great job on the new jenkins stuff
<balloons> silly me didn't even demo it
<balloons> d'oh
<mzanetti> well, you were talking about it
<balloons> yea.. it's easy to blather, but I could have perhaps made it more flashly
<balloons> I didn't even think about it
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Track: App & Scope Development | Dekko (Mail) Planning | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22595/dekko-mail-planning/
<James_Mulholland> Hello!
<DanChapman> o/
<popey> ooh, look at the time
<popey> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYcNmPvww8mjmXjXo0pZOZ2JNjqyr3vrJ5muFU_NI7at-Bzrcw?hl=en&authuser=0
<popey> for those that want to join
<popey> DanChapman, ^ James_Mulholland
<popey> http://pad.ubuntu.com/uos-1511-dekko-mail-planning
<ahayzen> QUESTION: Firstly, Dekko is awesome! I'm still amazed at how it can download my emails over IMAP on a 2G connection :-) However, on startup/loading messages there are UI freezes does this occur on your devices, if so are there plans to eradicate this?
<ahayzen> QUESTION: Sometimes I receive emails (usually on mailing lists) from people who I don't is there an easy way to display the full email address so that I can see the domain? (I expected tapping on the name todo this, as in gmail, but it doesn't)
<CheeseBurg> QUESTION: Can you try Dekko on 15.10?
<ahayzen> QUESTION: Alot of the HTML emails are to wide/small for the device, would it be possible to have pinch to zoom support in the message view ?
<tikatik> *<|:o)
<CheeseBrg> Just learned how to use Xchat
<ahayzen> CheeseBrg, try HexChat ;-)
<ahayzen> its XChat but still maintained
<CheeseBrg> ahayzen, is it easier to use?
<ahayzen> it looks exactly the same, but pre sets up some other security stuff for you
<CheeseBurg> Now using hexchat
<ahayzen> \o/ lol
<CheeseBurg> irc is so complex
<ahayzen> popey, battery critical !
<ahayzen> that dialog comes up and says "Battery Settings..." or "Ok"
<CheeseBurg> popey, When you hit "reply". Hate it when it is after I send it
<davmor2> popey: I would pop up messages on click on reply/create new mail
<ahayzen> davmor2, but if i'm on the train i don't wanna be trying to remember the smtp settings
<popey> +1
<CheeseBurg> popey: Does Dekko automatically set up email accounts like iOS. Basically you give it a gmail and it sets up IMAP/POP and SMTP or whatever
<ahayzen> davmor2, i would rather that happen while i'm also looking up the POP3 settings
<davmor2> I agree account is better
<CheeseBurg> music, dekko, browser = the trinity
<ahayzen> :-)
<ahayzen> popey, don't forget the questions ;-) lol
<ahayzen> CheeseBurg, https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-touch-coreapps-drivers/+archive/ubuntu/daily
<ahayzen> (the coreapps ppa)
<CheeseBurg> thanks guys
<ahayzen> thanks DanChapman, James_Mulholland, popey :-)
<popey> yeah, thanks guys!
<DanChapman> :-D
<ahayzen> popey, do you remember how the other coreapps get built for the PPA? as none of them are building for wily yet?
<ahayzen> popey, is it a switch in jenkins?
<ahayzen> the current situation is quite poor ;-) https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-touch-coreapps-drivers/+archive/ubuntu/daily?field.series_filter=wily
<popey> ahayzen, no, but I have a meeting with francis on friday and will bring it up there ;)
<ahayzen> cool thanks :-)
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/appdev/ - http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/11/04/%23ubuntu-uos-appdev.html
<h4ck3r> is anybody there!
<h4ck3r> ?
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Track: App & Scope Development | Taking advantage of Ubuntu Online Accounts in your application | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22604/taking-advantage-of-ubuntu-online-accounts-in-your-application/
<dbarth> we're about to start
<dobey> QUESTION: Is it possible for click packages to provide plug-ins which require a new C++ back-end to be implemented?
<dobey> mardy: untappd and meetup are examples where there are existing plug-ins
<dbarth> dobey: hey, ok; let's see what mardy says
<dobey> the examples were for the comment where he was talking about plug-ins included in ubuntu, and ones that are not. i wasn't asking about them :)
<dobey> because there's no way to tell the online-accounts-ui to load the QML from the click's plug-in path for example
<dobey> not necessarily signond plug-ins, but if we need to provide some c++ for the QML to use in the ui
<dbarth> dobey: want to hop on the hangout maybe ?
<dobey> i can i guess if i need to, but only a few minutes left and it's the only question :P
<dbarth> nw, we're trying to answer and can follow up later of course
<dobey> yeah, the reminders app looks ok
<DanChapman> thanks guys!
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Track: App & Scope Development | In-App-Purchases for Ubuntu | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22641/in-app-purchases-for-ubuntu/
<dobey> hmm
<alecu> hello
<dobey> no hangout?
<kyrofa> Who's hosting it?
<dobey> not it
<kyrofa> :P
<alecu> here's the hangout link: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYeHL2UvfsamCzH5TQBlZcJALcwE1GDteY_SqvrDCFj_YDVqDg?hl=en&authuser=0
<Wellark> starting in a few minutes. we are having some technical difficultios
<kyrofa> What happened to popeyfan1 and PopeyFan?
<popeyfan2> they became fans of balloons instead
<alecu> here's the youtube link: http://youtu.be/bBj5zkJ7ffs
<kyrofa> :D
<balloons> your nick betrays you
<alecu> popey: do you want to join the hangout?
<balloons> alecu, popey is in the other session
<popey> hmm?
<alecu> balloons: ah, great
<alecu> sorry
<popey> np :)
<balloons> alecu, I can be here to pepper you with question, lol
<alecu> balloons: that would be great, thanks!
 * balloons just realized he's behind live
<balloons> QUESTION: do you have a little demo you can give of how it works?
<balloons> QUESTION: Can you give a brief technical overview of what IAP will look like? I need to add something to my app (the purchasing API), and then how much control and stats will I see in the webstore?
<balloons> QUESTION: Are there limitations for how much I can charge (or a minimum I need to charge)?
<balloons> QUESTION: Will I be able to have multiple IAPs, all at different prices?
<kyrofa> balloons, right now yeah. Minimum is $2.99 (if I remember correctly. He just said during the slides)
<dobey> balloons: that was answered already in the video (there is a minimum currently, same as minimum for app purchases)
<balloons> ack, I assumed as much, I missed a couple mins during the slides
<balloons> seems my last question is answered now as well, given his API demo. I should be able to define many IAP's. I'm mostly curious about how this works on the store side
<dobey> yes, you can have lots of items defined in the store.
<balloons> and it sounds like that answers my store question as well.
<kyrofa> hangouts almost had a heart attack there
<dobey> any more questions?
<balloons> thanks for the session guys!
<alecu> balloons: thanks to you for all the questions :-)
<kyrofa> Thanks guys!
<Wellark> alecu: did you remember to stop the live feed? :)
<alecu> Wellark: I think I didn't :P
<Wellark> alecu: ok. it stopped now
<Wellark> :D
<alecu> Wellark: I had to rejoin the hangout and manually stop it!
<Wellark> :D
<Wellark> "well, we did make it 60 minutes.."
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/appdev/ - http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/11/04/%23ubuntu-uos-appdev.html
<aquarius> alecu, are you still around? I missed the IAP session but I'm watching it now, and I have questions :)
<alecu> aquarius: hi sil! sure, I'm around
<aquarius> alecu, heya, pal :)
<aquarius> alecu, question about one-time IAPs. How can I verify that a purchase was made? Do you give me some sort of signed token that I can save and verify later?
<aquarius> alecu, that is: I don't want to just call IAP.purchaseAThing(theThing) and have it return "true" and then I save "theThing: purchased" in my local database, because someone could just open the Terminal and then edit that database
<aquarius> alecu, but equally I don't want to request https://iap.canonical.com/didIPurchase?thing=aThing&user=userid because then I can only check if I'm online :)
<alecu> aquarius: good point
<alecu> aquarius: I don't think we are handling the offline case just now
<alecu> aquarius: let me find the people working on that
<alecu> Wellark: are you still around? ^
<aquarius> ah. So I call some sort of haveTheyPurchasedThisThing() API and it calls the server, I assume :)
<alecu> aquarius: right: http://doc.qt.io/QtPurchasing/qtpurchasing-gettingstarted-qml.html#restoring-previously-purchased-products
<aquarius> ah, this isn't *quite* about restoring purchases if I uninstalled the app. This is about unlockable features.
<aquarius> Say my file transfer app only allows you to transfer 10MB of files at once, but you can pay Â£1.99 to unlock "unlimited transfers".
<aquarius> How can the app know, without contacting the canonical servers (because it might not be connected to the internet) whether that has been purchased?
<aquarius> if I drop my phone in the bath and then buy another phone then definitely I'd want to restore the purchase, but that's a one-time thing, and might ask for my password; I can't do that every time the app starts up
<alecu> aquarius: that's a good point. And I can understand that it's not solved by storing a flag in a db of the app, because it would be trivial to defeat.
<aquarius> exactly
<alecu> aquarius: we've not implemented any of that yet. We are closely following QtPurchasing, which provides an abstraction on top of our store, and that will allow you to port your QML app to the android and ios stores.
<aquarius> if I ship a good app with IAPs, the first comment on every website about it will be "open the Terminal; type 'echo yes > ~/.local/share/goodapp.sil/unlocked', and now you've got it for free" :)
<alecu> aquarius: but I'm going to take your problem and talk with the QtPurchasing devels upstream
<alecu> aquarius: do you know if any of the other app stores solves this thing?
<aquarius> alecu, yeah. Other app stores solve it by not giving you root on the phone, so you can't edit the phone's data files. :)
<alecu> lol
<aquarius> Note that the use case I talk about is only one use case for IAP; other use cases don't have the same problem. (For example, if I buy 100 coins in a MMORPG, then my coin total is held on the server; the server does not trust the client about this.)
<alecu> aquarius: yes, I know this only applies to apps that have extra content inside the app
<alecu> aquarius: like a game with extra levels
<alecu> it does not apply to apps that talk to a server.
<aquarius> and in the limit case even if you *do* give me a signed token, I can't stop someone actually becoming root and editing the app QML to change "if (purchased)" to "if (true)" :-)
<aquarius> so maybe I just have to live with it -- verify online; if not online, check my own database
<aquarius> anyone who really cares about this sort of thing (Candy Crush, Clash of Clans, whatever) is going to have a server with accounts and track purchases there anyway
<aquarius> alecu, next question: why not invent Ubuntu Coins which cost Â£1.99 for 200, and then let people buy things with Ubuntu Coins? Then the minimum purchase problem goes away.
<alecu> aquarius: I'm asking the server guys for that, that would be a great feature
<aquarius> alecu, perhaps I missed it in the video, but is there a demo of what the purchasing UI looks like? (And whether I can customise it?)
<alecu> aquarius: we've not shown a demo just yet. I guess we should share a video of how it's looking so far
<aquarius> that'd be cool :)
<aquarius> ok, thank you, pal! Looking forward to seeing IAPs arrive.
<alecu> aquarius: the actual purchase flow will be the same as when purchasing an app from the store.
<alecu> aquarius: thanks a lot for your questions. As always, you are keeping us on our toes!
<alecu> aquarius: mind if I add you to the IAP pilot team?
<aquarius> alecu, I think I already am added :)
<aquarius> I'm trying to decide what to do with it.
<alecu> aquarius: we agree that usd 2.99 is too high for many app purchases. So, one thing we are suggesting this is for people that have two versions of the app in the store, a free one and a paid one with the same features, but that's intended for users that want to "contribute" a donation for the devel
<alecu> so the devel could release just one app with IAP instead
<aquarius> yeah
<aquarius> that's what I'm thinking of doing with WifiTransfer
#ubuntu-uos-appdev 2015-11-05
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/appdev/ - http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/11/05/%23ubuntu-uos-appdev.html
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Track: App & Scope Development | App Design Round Table | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22599/app-design-round-table/
 * popey looks around
<DanChapman> o/
<popey> o/
<popey> can you see the doc?
<DanChapman> yeah when James isn't talking :-D
<popey> hmm
<popey> i can make focus
<DanChapman> It's awesome!
<popey> this is amazing!
<aquarius> i missed the beginning part where a link to all this magnificence was provided; where can I get it? :)
<DanChapman> aquarius: https://github.com/halfsail/Ubuntu-UI-Toolkit
<aquarius> cheers DanChapman!
<James_Mulholland> http://2buntu.com/touch/device-art-generator/
<aquarius> My thing: http://kryogenix.org/code/edgeview/edgeview.html
<aquarius> (mine doesn't look nice. But it adds app images to actual photos)
<aquarius> (combining edgeview and the 2buntu device art generator would be cool, I think)
<popey> https://github.com/halfsail/Ubuntu-UI-Toolkit
<aquarius> QUESTION: not sure this is actually a question, but we're pretty starved of design guidelines out here outside the design team. It would be great to see more stuff being discussed publicly, even if it's not quite reached the stage of Formal Written Design Guidelines
<aquarius> hmph, no question answering for me!
<aquarius> popey, ^ :)
<popey> oh, we missed it
<aquarius> never mind :)
<aquarius> it is hardly the first time I have mentioned it ;)
<popey> ask it in James_Mulholland next session :D
<popey> and do so at 4pm exactly
<aquarius> I'm in a meeting at 4 :-(
<James_Mulholland> Hi Aquarius!
<aquarius> but I shall watch the video later
<aquarius> aha, heya James :)
<James_Mulholland> That's a fair point, I'll communicate it up the ladder on your behalf
<aquarius> James_Mulholland, I know the design team are doing tons of work -- ideas, plans, thoughts, mockups, and so on. Having access to some of that would be really helpful, out here in the cold. It doesn't have to be perfect design guideline documentation, because that takes ages to produce and there's nowhere near enough of it...
<aquarius> thank you for the session, James_Mulholland and Kevin (and Alan!)
<James_Mulholland> I would agree it would be nice if we could get things out (and get feedback) prior to nailing them down for 'official design guidelines'
<James_Mulholland> We just need an appropriate channel for doing so. UOS and the like are a good example, but infrequent...
<James_Mulholland> Thanks all!
<aquarius> James_Mulholland, design.ubuntu.com? twitter? googleplus? pastebin? :) Hang out on Telegram, maybe :)
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/appdev/ - http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/11/05/%23ubuntu-uos-appdev.html
<James_Mulholland> Absolutely, I'd lean toward the more informal/ social channels myself. I'll see what our managers think :)
<James_Mulholland> Thanks aquarius!
<popey> pstolowski, you need help? I can setup the hangout and you can start it?
<pstolowski> popey, yes please
<popey> okay, one moment
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Track: App & Scope Development | Introduction to Scopes | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22631/introduction-to-scopes/
<popey> pstolowski, https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYfpFZz4PSJx9Y-MaKpFgVW51czlr98olxne3OUtYUtSTpQ8hg is your hangout link, you're ready to go. Just join that, hit start when you're ready (in 10 mins)
<popey> pstolowski, let me know if you have any issues!
<popey> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22631/introduction-to-scopes/ is setup
<pstolowski> popey, awesome, thanks!
<popey> no problemo!
<popey> any time
<pstolowski> popey, i don't see 'start' anywhere, will it show up when it's time to start?
<pstolowski> scopes intro session about to start in 2 minutes, we're having some difficulties with hangout
<dbarth> we're about to start the HTML5 app session as well; see you there
<popeyfan> which session to pick >_<
<alecu> popey: pstolowski: hangouts tells me "No one is here right now" when I try to use the link above
<popey> one mo
<popey> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/hoaevent/AP36tYeE7jAsRBsbwdjTE8aEE-BKK3JKJsolP7IyQybs1mlxN_ytug?hl=en&authuser=0
<popey> had to re-create the hangout
<popey> my bad
<popeyfan> will we need to refresh the summit page?
<marcustomlinson> crazy good slides
<alecu> indeed :-)
<marcustomlinson> QUESTION: can I develop an aggregator scope and install it directly on my phone for personal use?
<marcustomlinson> cool, thanks!
<marcustomlinson> For those interested in JS bindings, here's a tutorial: https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/scopes/tutorials/developing-scopes-javascript/
<marcustomlinson> and here's the UOS session: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/meeting/22616/javascript-scopes-hands-on/
<marcustomlinson> it is :) But it doesn't look like the phone
<marcustomlinson> pstolowski: its not that bad
<marcustomlinson> pstolowski: can't see the text, but wee see the result of the edit
<marcustomlinson> QUESTION: where do I go to get started
<marcustomlinson> tuts, guides, etc?
<alecu> https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/scopes/
<marcustomlinson> awesome
<marcustomlinson> excellent presentation!
<alecu> yes, it was very detailed.
<marcustomlinson> popey: you still alive?
<popey> ya
<popey> thanks for the nudge
<popey> stopped the feed
<marcustomlinson> :)
<popey> am in another session :)
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/appdev/ - http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/11/05/%23ubuntu-uos-appdev.html
#ubuntu-uos-appdev 2016-11-08
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uos-appdev to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1511/appdev/ - http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2016/11/08/%23ubuntu-uos-appdev.html
<pecEmKbrnAMwzcXb> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EsJLNGVJ7E & https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/15893 & http://i.imgur.com/TmzXvvz.jpg
