#ayatana 2009-07-20
<ara> good morning all :)
<mac_v> MacSlow: mpt: kwwii: https://launchpad.net/bugs/387626 , "wireless notification icon is wrong signal strength" not sure if notify-osd is causing this... maybe this just needs a better icon?
<MacSlow> mac_v, that's certainly an issue of the apps using the notification system
<MacSlow> mac_v, btw... since this is on UNR, which I never worked on directly myself... I can not even do a wild guess which app might be mixing up icons there
<MacSlow> could be a icon-theme issue
<mac_v> MacSlow: This is the same behaviour in laptops too... i dont think previously wireless connection showed signal strength in notifications[as far as i can remember], any particular reason why those icons were created?
<MacSlow> the icon "encodes" the signal-reception strength at connection-establishment-time
<MacSlow> that's how they are meant to be used
<MacSlow> there are different icon-sets within the Human icon-time for different types of wireless networks
<SiDi> mac_v: maybe NetworkManager is meant to use the appropriate icons and doesnt
<MacSlow> that would be my guess too
<SiDi> sounds obvious now, didnt tell you the other day cause my brain was under a disk check
<mac_v> i understand that , but that functionality doesnt exist as of now in nm
<SiDi> report it as a bug, set the milestone to karmic, and we'll see :) 
<mac_v> kwwii: so maybe a new icon?
<SiDi> i think they have the time to do it, it's an easy fix imo
<SiDi> mac_v: there are ~12 wireless icons, why a new icon ? :|
<mac_v> ;p , its just fun making them ;p
<SiDi> either nm codes the thing as it's meant to, and everyone is happy and there are fluffy kittens and bunnies dancing together in the meadow, or there is a bug
<SiDi> mac_v: let me know when you retargeted 387626 to network manager please :p
<mpt> mmmmm, delicious kittens
<mac_v> SiDi: done, i just have to search if there are any upstream bugs, but i guess this only affects ubuntu 
<mac_v> mpt: speaking of delicious kittens > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKTsWjbjQ8E
<SiDi> mac_v: yes of course its an ubuntu-only bug
<SiDi> mac_v: nice vid
<mac_v> !!! i added the nomination for network manager and notify-osd also got nominated !
<mac_v> SiDi: i thought you like cats , didnt realize this is how you prefered them ;p
<SiDi> mac_v: i'm gonna let my cat know about your petting habbits, she'll raise an army and take care of cooking yourself to your own convenience
<mac_v> SiDi: that video reminds me of kwwii's blog about veg guests 
<mac_v> mpt: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Ayatana/UpdateIssues#Hassle-Free%20In-Session%20Updates , your thoughts?
<kwwii> man, someone actually reads my blog? amazing
<mac_v> kwwii: ;p dont get too exited ... just that one  , since i have veg relatives
<mpt> mac_v, did you write this? This is nice work
<mac_v> mpt: yeah.. oh i forgot to sign it
<kwwii> ;)
<mpt> mac_v, I have a mockup quite like <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Ayatana/UpdateIssues?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=UM-SS.png> sitting on my desk waiting for me to finish :-)
<mac_v> thanx
<SiDi> kwwii: indeed :p
<mpt> except mine has a scrawled note "missing total size for download"
<SiDi> (i read the planet actually)
<mac_v> :) 
<mpt> mac_v, the total size on your mockups needs a better place too, it looks a bit lost
<mpt> Maybe as the first sentence of the secondary text
<mpt> "31 MB will need to be downloaded. If you don't want to install the updates now, ..."
<mpt> which could then sometimes be "The updates have already been downloaded. If you don't want to install them now, ..."
<mac_v> mpt: surely , it can use some of the UX teams touch and polish , 
<mac_v> mpt: but we have to be careful not to use too many words
<mpt> sure, there's a balance between minimizing words and minimizing visual elements
<mac_v> also offering the user to *not* install , should be also minimized 
<mpt> mac_v, sorry, not sure what you mean
<mpt> Do you mean downplaying the option to not install updates?
<mac_v> mpt: when we keep presenting with: " If you don't want to install the updates now..." it is offering a choice not to
<MacSlow> uff -> http://macslow.net/clips/notify-osd-with-all-new-rendering.ogv
<mpt> true
<mac_v> we need to not offer such choices, rather "Is can also be installed later from" is not ideal
<mac_v> it is^
<mac_v>  rather "It is can also be installed later from" is ideal!
<mpt> MacSlow, nice work
<SiDi> MacSlow: will you work on blur only around the mouse region now ? :P
<mpt> mac_v, I don't understand either of those :-/
<MacSlow> mpt, the blur-cache has been the nastiest thing sofar in notify-osd to do (especially considering the code-refactoring needed)
<mac_v> mpt: just a sec...
 * MacSlow looks for a sharp, hard and pointy object to throw at SiDi 
<SiDi> a kitten ?
<SiDi> MacSlow: anyway, congratulations :)
<mpt> mac_v, neither "Is can" and "It is can" are not phrases that happen in English. My best guess is "It can" for both, but you're trying to distinguish between the two, so...
<SiDi> It is can ? :/
 * mpt mangles his own first sentence
<mac_v> mpt: i was in the midst of something... so messed up the line... i'll explain in a sec
<MacSlow> SiDi, since when are kitten hard, sharp or pointy?
<MacSlow> kittens are living fur-balls
<SiDi> MacSlow: when they're angry, their claws can be sharp and pointy ! 
<MacSlow> SiDi, but overall they are all fuzzy and soft
<SiDi> i dont mind, i like kittens :P
<kallepersson> MacSlow: very, very nice.
<mac_v> mpt: when you are offering something and you want it to be chosen, the other options also needs to reinforce the choice you want the user to choose. here for example , you want the user to install, so all options need to positive reinforce only the "Install" , so the words should not say "if you dont want to install" 
<MacSlow> kallepersson, hey there... thanks
<mpt> mac_v, ah, so you mean "If you want to install them later" would be better than "If you don't want to install them now"
<mac_v> mpt: rather "You can install later" is the ideal choice of words
<mac_v> yeah
<mpt> fair enough
<mpt> The problem then becomes, how do you say "If you want to install them later, choose 'Update Manager' ... no, not now, silly, do that when you actually want to install them"
<mpt> The current text does that with "later" at the end of the sentence, but if we said "If you want to install them later", we'd be using the word "later" twice in the same short sentence.
<mac_v> mpt: thats why i had worded it "You can also install them later"
<mpt> ahhhhh
<mpt> "You can also install them later by choosing ..."
<mpt> neat
<mac_v> yeah
 * mpt tries to think of a shorter synonym for "Alternatively"
<mpt> "Or" is shorter, but is weird as the first word of a paragraph
<mac_v> or/instead are negative words , Alternatively is positive 
<mac_v> mpt: "You can also choose to install them later, by selecting..."
<SiDi> Otherwise is slightly shorter
<mac_v> SiDi: otherwise is also negative
<SiDi> mac_v: you're negativ
<mac_v> ;p
 * MacSlow -> lunch
<hyperair> does anyone here use a dual head display?
<hyperair> notify-osd's notifications disappeared =\
<hyperair> something about not being able to find a panel
<hyperair> for some reason, gdk_window_get_type_hint (win) where win is the panel returns GDK_WINDOW_TYPE_HINT_NORMAL rather than GDK_WINDOW_TYPE_HINT_DOCK. commenting out that line seems to make notify-osd detect my panel correctly again.
 * hyperair scratches his head
<hyperair> MacSlow: ping
<MacSlow> hyperair, sorry not time atm... still busy with release-work
<hyperair> MacSlow: okay, i'll ping another time
<tedg> I'm really disliking the Liferea notification messages.  They're basically "<title> has <number> new / updated titles".
<tedg> I'm thinking something like "<title> has <number> updates" should be enough.
<mrooney> tedg: sounds like a paper cut :)
<tedg> mrooney: Heh.  Yeah.  I changed the text to be just "updates" not sure if I like it not yet...
<tedg> Change is in my PPA (though not built yet) for those that want to try it: https://launchpad.net/~ted/+archive/ppa
<djsiegel> bratsche you there?
<bratsche> djsiegel, I am.
<djsiegel> bratsche can a gtk slider (what is the widget name) start at 1, then go to 5, 10, 15, etc?
<bratsche> Yeah.
<djsiegel> ok, cool
<djsiegel> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/59589
<bratsche> GtkAdjustment's step_increment I think.
<djsiegel> but you can have [1, 5, 10...]
<djsiegel> I know you can change the increment
<djsiegel> but I wasn't sure if you could slip an increment of 4 in there...
<bratsche> Oh wait, I missed the "start at 1" part and then go 5,10,15..
<djsiegel> yes
<djsiegel> that's the question
<bratsche> I'm not sure about that.
<djsiegel> I bet you could special case the 0 case
<bratsche> Yeah.
<djsiegel> (value == 0 ? 1 : value)
<djsiegel> or (value ? value : 1) in C I guess
<djsiegel> hehe
<bratsche> But don't actually set the adjustment's value to 1, or then when you increment it'll go to 6.  Just watch its value_changed event or whatever and do the correct thing on 0.
<bratsche> djsiegel, The <alt> thing would still display underlines for menuitems once a menu is already popped up right?  You shouldn't need to hold alt for that should you?
<djsiegel> bratsche: I think it's more reasonable to keep _ in menus
<djsiegel> but I think we could make the case for getting rid of those, too
<djsiegel> I am not sure how they are used, 1 sec
<djsiegel> yes, I see
<bratsche> djsiegel, Well, once a menu is popped up you don't need to hit <alt> for those accelerators to work.
<djsiegel> bratsche, yes, it makes sense to leave them if they don't require alt
<djsiegel> but they are such a blemish on buttons, less so in menus
<bratsche> Oh I see.
<bratsche> Yeah.
<ryanprior> I'm not sure what you're talking about precisely, but I've got a menu suggestion
<djsiegel> ryanprior: let's hear it
<ryanprior> right now we see lots of menu items like "Open <Ctrl+O>"
<ryanprior> I think it would be neat it if said Open, then had a right-justified lozenge showing "ctrl" and an O key
<ryanprior> readably, but graphically
<ryanprior> I don't know whether that's easy to do with GTK
<ryanprior> but if it's not too hard to put icons inside a menu item, it would be a neat touch
<bratsche> It sounds like it would require more space allocated to the menuitems.
<bratsche> But maybe not.
<ryanprior> The little icons wouldn't have to be any bigger than an X-height
<bratsche> They have to be two pixels higher than 'C'
<bratsche> Or 'l'
<bratsche> Not sure which is taller.
<ryanprior> I always thought X was tallest
<bratsche> But is the lozenge going around the full text or just "Ctrl"?
<ryanprior> I'll whip up a mock-up
<bratsche> Cool, thanks.
<ryanprior> http://ryanprior.com/menu-mockup.png
<bratsche> Hmm, nice.
 * bratsche takes a peek at some code
<bratsche> ryanprior, we could maybe style that up in the theme engine without modifying any code.
<bratsche> Or at least, without modifying any code in gtk+ itself.
<ryanprior> I like non-intrusive edits ;-)
 * SiDi doesnt think it's so hard to do in gtk itself, so maybe some changes in libgtk could do it :/
<SiDi> like, i think at the moment it builds a hbox with your content, extended, on the left, and a label, the Ctrl+Foo, on the right
<SiDi> we could change the label to some gtk-accel-Foo stock image (of course it requires to add those images to the stock gtk ones :p)
<SiDi> or auto-generate them (but thats slower :/)
<bratsche> No need to change libgtk itself probably, just style the GtkLabel.
<bratsche> SiDi, probably just render with Cairo.
<ryanprior> Yeah, it would be coolest if you could do it with styles and not generate an image at all
<SiDi> ah, yeh.. :P
<bratsche> Because you want the colors to be stylable too, and if you ship images then you're stuck.
<SiDi> yeh thats true
 * SiDi goes back to bed xD
<bratsche> And images increase the size of the installer ISO, and it doesn't have much space to devote to this sort of thing.
<bratsche> kwwii, around still?
<bratsche> Probably not.. pretty late there.
<SiDi> midnight, bratsche :)
<kwwii> bratsche: yepp
<bratsche> Oh hey dude
<kwwii> hey man
<bratsche> kwwii: Check out ryanprior's mockup.. http://ryanprior.com/menu-mockup.png
<kwwii> with a bit of visual magic that could be cool
<kwwii> pretty simple now
<bratsche> kwwii: What theme engine are we using right now?  If I have time I wouldn't mind trying to hack this up sometime.
<kwwii> but better than a lot of other stuff I have recently seen
<kwwii> murrine
<kwwii> but I get the feeling that the new theme will be something completely different
<bratsche> kwwii: Do we have a standard place we can start collecting different theming ideas?
<kwwii> it has taken to long to get this far, we will probably change quite a bit, which will mean writing our own theme enginge
<kwwii> engine
<kwwii> if you ask me, that is
<bratsche> Yeah, I think writing our own engine would make a lot of sense once we know exactly what we want to do.
<kwwii> the http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming is the place for collecting that kind of stuff
<kwwii> but if we want to push for it, we could expand that
<kwwii> I am trying to think of a way to invite all of the wallpaper submitters on the flickr page to other projects
<kwwii> I have now publicly admitted that I know nothing of flickr yet I pay them money :p
<kwwii> bratsche: doing this unr work has been interesting
<kwwii> there is a need for a theme which is really flexible and themeable to the nth degree
<kwwii> ie presenting a buttload of drawing options 
<bratsche> kwwii: Have you played around with the css theme engine for gtk much?  Do you think it's pretty flexible?  I'm interested in trying to integrate it directly into gtk3.0 (and totally replace gtkrc stuff with it) if there is time.
<bratsche> But that's going to be a lot of work, and it's beginning to seem like there is not a lot of time for this kind of work.
<ryanprior> I really like the idea of the CSS theme engine.
<ryanprior> I'm working on one for Ecere.
<bratsche> It's not very useful in its current form, because it blows away gtkrc settings and it prevents us from doing another theme engine on top of it (which might do animation stuff possibly)
<bratsche> So for CSS to be useful we really need to replace gtkrc with it.
<kwwii> bratsche: well, I know it needs a lot of work ;) It really is the best idea out there but you would have to decide for yourself how much work it would be to get it to do what it is supposed to do. I know they would love the help, but including it would be much less work than getting it to do what it should
<kwwii> well, the current stuff imports the CSS and makes gtkrc out of it, afaik
<bratsche> Well, internally yeah..
<kwwii> I know that intel would love it if you helped :p
<bratsche> But your gtkrc is what tells gtk to load that engine.  And basically whatever else is in your gtkrc might get blown away by stuff in the CSS files.
<bratsche> kwwii, need to convince David and Mark that it's worth investing time in.
<kwwii> hehe, no doubt
<SiDi> bratsche: that'd be a CSS3 engine, then ? :)
<bratsche> Uh, hell if I know.
<bratsche> I don't know the difference between different versions of css.
<kwwii> I wonder what upper management will say about working on a project which Intel has essentially paid for until now and still keeps behind closed hands
<bratsche> kwwii, do they?
<bratsche> Rob wrote the gtk css engine before he went to work for Intel.
<bratsche> I'm not really sure what the relationship is between the gtk css engine and the css fu that he's done for nbtk or whatever it's called.
<kwwii> dude, I could explain the situation but then I would lose my job
<bratsche> eek
<kwwii> this is an open irc channel, my friend
<bratsche> I have to finish morphing window stuff soon anyway, and I'm just beginning it.  Maybe once that's done I can think about this kind of stuff more.
#ayatana 2009-07-21
<mac_v> beuno: hi... this bug's milestone needs to be changed https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/file-roller/+bug/15495
<mac_v> its marked incomplete and is in the first milestone
<beuno> mac_v, right, maybe...  milestone 8?
<mac_v> beuno: maybe even later,10. since it is suggested, it needs user testing
<beuno> 9?  :)
<djsiegel> I don't think you need to move the bug
<mac_v> sure... :)
<djsiegel> leave it in its milestone, it was just missed
<djsiegel> the 10 milestones are more of a guideline for the design team's involvement
<mac_v> djsiegel: beuno also... the context menu is now changed in Karmic to "Compress"
<djsiegel> ideally, all paper cuts could get random-access attention
<djsiegel> mac_v: are you serious?
<mac_v> yeah
<djsiegel> it got changed
<djsiegel> wow
<djsiegel> awesome
<djsiegel> ivanka will be psyched
<djsiegel> ok I need to sleep
<djsiegel> night buys
<djsiegel> guys*
<mac_v> hi... any channel ops around?
<mac_v> beuno: ^
<MacSlow> hyperair, I've just pushed your wnck fix to notify-osd trunk (https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/notify-osd/+bug/401809/comments/1). Thanks!
<MacSlow> hyperair, but in the rush I forgot to add you to the Contributor: section in the file-header
<hyperair> MacSlow: ah you did eh, thanks. =)
<hyperair> MacSlow: take your time for that
<MacSlow> hyperair, just fixing that now
<hyperair> ah
<hyperair> cool =)
<MacSlow> hyperair, what's your email?
<MacSlow> address
<MacSlow> I mean
<hyperair> hyperair, gmail
<MacSlow> .com?!
<hyperair> yes
<hyperair> hyperair@gmail.com
<hyperair> MacSlow: are you going to be releasing soon, or shall i bring the patch forward to ubuntu's notify-osd package?
<MacSlow> hyperair, I just did a tarball-release of notify-osd yesterday and only today pushed your patch
<MacSlow> unlucky timing
<MacSlow> hyperair, but the next tarball release is due in about two weeks, so your patch will certainly be in karmic
<hyperair> oh okay then. good to hear. =)
<MacSlow> hyperair, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~notify-osd-developers/notify-osd/main/revision/350
<hyperair> thanks. =)
 * MacSlow -> lunch
<MacSlow> DBO, ping
<DBO> MacSlow, pong
<MacSlow> DBO, hey there
<MacSlow> DBO, was my first patch any good?
<DBO> to be honest I have not had time to review it
<DBO> been working on canonical stuff like a mad man
<MacSlow> DBO, no worries... just wondering
<MacSlow> it's not work-related anyway
<MacSlow> just some minor spit-and-polish for Docky
<DBO> yeah, there is always spit polishing to do =)
<DanRabbit1> DBO: ping-a-ling
<veritos> Is it planned to attempt to push the new notification system upstream?
<beuno> veritos, where is upstream?
<veritos> beuno, libnotify maintainers or whoever dealt with the old balloon-style messages
<beuno> veritos, this is a whole new system from scratch
<tedg> beuno: Apparently you offended him :)
<beuno> of course
<beuno> he wanted to fight
<tedg> He was totally unwilling once he realized you're from Argentina.  Everyone knows they raise amazing IRC battlers there :)
<ryanprior> some folks love to rail on any Ubuntu project about their upstream policies
<ryanprior> even when they aren't exactly sure what that means in a given scenario
#ayatana 2009-07-22
<bcurtiswx> hey, anyone here?
<bcurtiswx> http://aurora.gmu.edu/~bcurtis/files/out-1.ogv
<bcurtiswx> see how the notify bubble goes blurry.. i have desktop effects off
<ryanprior> bcurtiswx: that is strange. Mine doesn't do that. Any idea what makes it reproducible?
<bcurtiswx> ryanprior: appears only to be if desktop effects are turned off, karmic fully updated
<bcurtiswx> someone in -bugs said it may be with some blur-cache that was changed in todays updates
<bcurtiswx> doesn't appear (right now) to be intel chip specific
<ryanprior> I'm on fully-updated no-desktop-effects Jaunty
<ryanprior> and I don't see it
<ryanprior> so I suppose it's only a karmic thing
<bcurtiswx> yeah, im on a karmic install
<mac_v> bcurtiswx:  MacSlow implemented a new blur effect , recently for karmic
<bcurtiswx> so i wonder if thats supposed to shutoff when effects are not enabled, but isn't quite doing that
<mac_v> maybe he hasnt tested it without desktop effects..
<mac_v> bcurtiswx:  <MacSlow> uff -> http://macslow.net/clips/notify-osd-with-all-new-rendering.ogv
<mac_v> not sure if it is still active
<mac_v> the link ^
<bcurtiswx> it is
<bcurtiswx> mac_v, thx
<mac_v> MacSlow: Hi... you might wanna check this out> <bcurtiswx> http://aurora.gmu.edu/~bcurtis/files/out-1.ogv
<mac_v> [07:18] <bcurtiswx> see how the notify bubble goes blurry.. i have desktop effects off
<MacSlow> mac_v, that has already been filed
<mac_v> oh... ok
<MacSlow> that's a regressino from the blur-cache on the non-composite case, which I did not yet have to to work on
 * MacSlow -> lunch
<mccann> Hey MacSlow 
<MacSlow> hey mccann 
<mccann> MacSlow: didn't you have some clutter icon grid widget where dragging icons around bumped others out of the way?  I thought I remembered you showing one of those...
<MacSlow> mccann, no... I never wrote something like that
<MacSlow> mccann, you might mix that up with lowfat and my first gdm-face-browser concepts
<mccann> ah maybe
<mccann> MacSlow: are you aware of any code that does this sort of thing?
<MacSlow> mccann, hm... I think to remember something like that in the clutter sources in the box2d module (or a test-case for it)
<SiDi> MacSlow: configure.in:56: warning: macro `AM_PATH_GTK_2_0' not found in library  any idea what this is ? lp:notify-osd trunk on jaunty amd64
<MacSlow> SiDi, missing automake headers for gtk+?
<MacSlow> libgtk2.0-dev
<MacSlow> or so
<SiDi> MacSlow: thanks, you were right :)
<SiDi> i completely forgot i cleaned all my dev packages two days ago
<tedg> SiDi: You can do "apt-get build-dep notify-osd" and that should get all the build dependencies.
<SiDi> tedg: too late, i installed them all :D
<tedg> MacSlow: See, you answered an autotools question, you're becoming an expert! ;)
<MacSlow> tedg, "auch ein blindes Huhn findet mal ein Korn"
<MacSlow> tedg, I don't know how that saying goes in English I'm afraid
<tedg> MacSlow: Heh, I'll just assume it is "I love autotools" ;)
<MacSlow> pathetic try tedg :)
<tedg> MacSlow: I think that Google translate has "Mirco has a good sense of smell" :)
<mac_v> MacSlow: "even a blind chicken finds a grain at times" nice one... :)
#ayatana 2009-07-23
<hap> hi guys
<hap> can anyone tell me how easy/difficult it would be to intercept all notifications, and send them to myself in another way, like email, twitt them through an account etc ?
<mac_v> beuno: hi, free?
<mac_v> beuno: Bug 387834 is fixed , need to set the milestone
<MacSlow> hap, do you want to intercept (swallow) them or just get a copy of them?
<MacSlow> hap, of  the top of my head I'd say write you own notification daemon
 * SiDi waves at mac_v  and MacSlow 
<MacSlow> hey SiDi 
<mac_v> SiDi: heya..
<MacSlow> hap, if you take a look at notify-osd/src/stack.c that would get you started to see what's going on (you'll need to bother with DBus... that much of a warning I can give you)
<SiDi> MacSlow: you use dbus with the glib, right ?
<MacSlow> yes
<SiDi> try libdbus then :d
<MacSlow> upw
<MacSlow> s
<hap> MacSlow: yeah I thought i d need to play with dbus
<hap> i ll prototype something with python i think
<hap> MacSlow: I want to get a copy of them, so you still have the normal way of displaying the notifications
<hap> but you also have a copy in your mails, etc.
 * MacSlow -> lunch
<SiDi> MacSlow|lunch: can i consider it annoying if the latest notify-osd uses 175 MB Ram ?
<SiDi> is it enough to consider the possibility of a _little_ memory leak ? :D
<SiDi> I mean, it even beats firefox...
<MacSlow|lunch> yes, there are mem-leaks
<mac_v> MacSlow: hi,.do you work in the london office or from home? just asking since, it seems most of the london staff are out/not logged in
<MacSlow> mac_v, I work from home (not London or England)
<mac_v> MacSlow: ah...:) is it some holiday in london office? when do we expect them back?
<MacSlow> no clue
<mac_v> :(
<MacSlow> maybe they have some fire-alarm testing again or so
<MacSlow> that happens in the millbank tower from time to time
<mac_v> 0.o 
<SiDi> mac_v: how the hell do you know london office people are offline ? Oo
<ivanka> I'm here
 * SiDi waves at ivanka then
 * ivanka waves back as SiDi
 * mac_v waves at ivanka
<mac_v> SiDi: i noticed mpt,David, missing ,
<mac_v> and kwwii's bot always around ;p
<SiDi> mac_v: you're scary
<SiDi> Remind me to never tell you where i live and who i work for :D
<mac_v> ;p
<tedg> mac_v: They're missing, and you'll never find the bodies! <laugh type="evil" />  ;)
<mac_v> SiDi: ah... i noticed just because i couldnt catch David Seigel, there are a couple of papaercuts with fix released today, but havent been assigned milestones...
<SiDi> mac_v: assigning them afterwards is cheating :)
<mac_v> tedg: 0.o 
<SiDi> tedg: did you plan any "dinner" with some new exotic meat in the coming days ?
<mac_v> SiDi: i had them confirmed and they have been fixed... David hadnt noticed them
<mac_v> SiDi: you thought i was scary... [what about tedg]
<tedg> SiDi: I only ever serve chicken.  No one's ever mentioned anything....
<SiDi> tedg: a ~80kg chicken with an human shape, maybe ?
<SiDi> 'tedg's food : chicken from human beings'
<tedg> Heh, I can't talk about it anymore.  "They" are watching. ;)
<SiDi> yeh, and mac_v is being too curious
<mac_v> SiDi: tedg says> Well, Clarice - have the lambs stopped screaming? 
<SiDi> mac_v: you're invited to the next dinner. We'll ask you to come 10 hours before the other guests, though, because it takes time to cook hu.... err, because.
<mac_v> silence of the lambs... ;p
<SiDi> tedg: by the way, did libindicate and indicator-applet get separated in the end ?
<tedg> SiDi: No, they haven't yet.  They will.
<SiDi> any chance for it to be done one week before feature freeze ? :) i wanna try to get indicator-applet-xfce running, and to write an indicate plugin for claws
<tedg> SiDi: kenvandine didn't harass me enough about it :)
<mac_v> tedg: any chance of FUSA bug 291278 fixed for Karmic?
<mac_v> damn no bot!
<mac_v> tedg: are you a channel OP? could you add ubottu for this channel?
<tedg> mac_v: Well considering we'll be dropping the applet for karmic, all the bugs will be fixed! :)
<mac_v> tedg: 0.0 , i thought you were reworking FUSA? [ https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/dx-karmic-fusa]
<tedg> mac_v: I can try.  That rotation is tricky to do.  But it should be easier in the new code.
<tedg> mac_v: I am, but for a variety of reasons its a new code base.
<mac_v> \o/
<tedg> The old-GDM and the new-GDM are very different beasts.
<mac_v> yeah... new-GDM messed up my Karmic :(
<mac_v> install
<tedg> Yeah, I finally got mine stable.  But, it wasn't as easy as I would have liked.
<SiDi> new gdm almost made 3 xubuntu devs suicide :P
<SiDi> We had a liveCD shipping the whole gnome-session and booting on gnome instead of xfce
 * ivanka waves at mac_v
<mac_v> :)
 * mac_v hates the gdm , looks too much like fedora :( , waiting for mat_t to fix it
<tedg> mac_v: No theming in the new GDM. :(  You can set GTK themes and the such, but more than that you have to build stuff.
<mac_v> yeah
 * mac_v too lazy to do so much work ;p
 * mac_v  misses the graphical config tool
<MacSlow> with the new gdm "theming" (at least for the graphical greeter) right now mean "write a new custom greeter from scratch" 
<MacSlow> at least this is now "easily" possible
<tedg> Heh, "easily" :)
<kenvandine> getting a little crazy with the use of the word easliy there :)
<MacSlow> it's all documented... in source-code "hooray"
<mac_v> worse is more than half the gdm schemas dont appear in gconf
<tedg> mac_v: GConf? Why would you need that?  They have a random variable setting function without listing all the variables.
<mac_v> tedg: basically i was trying to get timed login to work , /etc/gdm/custom.conf now only allows auto login , but not timed... so i was looking through schemas, since someone had said it could be set via gconf , but :(
<tedg> mac_v: The problem is that it's also hard to get to that version of gconf because it runs under the gdm user.  So it's a pretty hard gconf key to set.
<tedg> mac_v: There is a DBus interface to set values on the DBus system bus.  But it doesn't list the values you can set.
<mac_v> tedg: aw! i read the first part of the line about dbus and lit up, the ending was sad :(
<tedg> Classic Shakespearian tragedy.  Gets exciting, but everyone dies in the end :) 
<mat_t> tedg: MacSlow: I'm putting together some designs for the gdm now
<MacSlow> mat_t, code or visuals?
<mat_t> tedg: MacSlow: we'll see what sabdfl thinks of them, if he's +1, we'll have to think how to crack it
<mat_t> MacSlow: visuals
<MacSlow> mat_t, sorry... mixed up up with mac_v
<mat_t> :)
 * mat_t doesn't know C *that* well yet
 * tedg is going to buy mat_t a "Programming in C" book for his birthday.
 * MacSlow already bleeds to death
<MacSlow> a full day for https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~macslow/notify-osd/abstract-notification-object/+merge/9194 is beyond me
<tedg> It's always the stupid stuff that takes the longest.
<tedg> I'm not sure is that it's because we always underestimate things we don't want to do, or what.
<MacSlow> tedg, by tomorrow I also should have my refactoring diagram for notify-osd ready and have you folks look over it to see what you think (also comparing it to the status quo)
<tedg> MacSlow: sweet!
<MacSlow> tedg, and I don't have an idea yet how to "enlong" running timeout (e.g. added text for a notification extends a bubbles timeout-period)
<tedg> MacSlow: I'd say double the default period.  But, if something comes in really late, it gets queued instead of appended.
<tedg> So, like there's a cut off for display that is earlier than timeout.
<tedg> Though, it seems that, if there is nothing else in the queue, it could be longer.  We're not DoSing other apps in that case.
<tedg> MacSlow: What do you think?
<MacSlow> according to the table with the durations in the spec the 15000 ms max. duration is the DOS-protection
<tedg> Yeah, but we don't want an append coming in 99.9% of the way through and disappearing.  Then the user couldn't read it.
<MacSlow> tedg, hm... I'd call it tough luck
<tedg> We could just append "HAHA, you loose" at the end also ;)
 * tedg is really curious how translators would translate that
<DanRabbit> mav_v: ping
<DanRabbit> mac_v: ^^
<mac_v> DanRabbit: pong :)
<DanRabbit> So you're not getting XDG folders in the places menu?
<mac_v> MacSlow: the specs were written a long while ago, since we are now appending the text to existing bubbles , the specs need to be altered , we need set the time limit to something after the last append
<mac_v> DanRabbit: nope...
<mac_v> only the home shows
<DanRabbit> Tell me, do you bookmarks all show up in a line in the places menu, or do they have their own submenu?
<mac_v> DanRabbit: all in the places menu, no submenu
<DanRabbit> that's what I thought
<DanRabbit> it's something wrong with that code
<DanRabbit> because in the submenu, everything shows up
<MacSlow> mac_v, there are timing specifications for extending on-screen time after append (also depending on amount of text added)
<MacSlow> mac_v, these are just not implemented yet
<mac_v> oh... ok
<DanRabbit> I don't know how to fix that :D
<DanRabbit> Also, where did you hear that for sure Humanity was in Karmic?
<mac_v> DanRabbit: thats something that needs to be looked into..
<mac_v> DanRabbit: kwwii was asking for testing humanity, he said most probably
<DanRabbit> ooo
<DanRabbit> :D
<DanRabbit> that's exciting.
<mac_v> DanRabbit: there are no xdg for public and templates
<DanRabbit> I saw that email as well
<DanRabbit> I'll do them today about lunch time
<mac_v> DanRabbit: the icons are really nice, smooooooth feel
<DanRabbit> (it's currently 8:30)
<DanRabbit> Thankyou :D
<DanRabbit> The only thing I'm really not happy with, is that I don't have every icon in every size.
<DanRabbit> But that's only busy work. It's getting done.
<mac_v> DanRabbit: i wonder why you chose to use, white for shutdown
<DanRabbit> Well, I haven't fixed the symlink yet, but I want the shutdown icon to be the one used in FUSA
<DanRabbit> And I'm sure I'd be happy with a big blazing red icon staring at me from the corner of my desktop all day...
<DanRabbit> but, if that's something a number of people are requesting, I can make one.
<mac_v> you dont have to go all out flashy red, the shade you have used for gtk-delete are the nice
<mac_v> DanRabbit: in fusa you mean the door?
<DanRabbit> yea
<DanRabbit> but, I'm actually running out the door.
<DanRabbit> will you be on in a couple hours?
<DanRabbit> I'll be working on it then, and you can help me out :D
<mac_v> yeah... just ping me...
<SiDi> MacSlow: btw i began working on the xfconf patch but i erased it yesterday when updating a branch >.>
<MacSlow> bzr and lp are daunting if you don't know them
<MacSlow> although they are so much nicer than git and bugzilla
<SiDi> i do know them, i just forgot i hadn't pushed my changes when i updated the branch to get the latest notify-osd release's code
<MacSlow> gee... #kubuntu is an odd place
<MacSlow> time to call it a day
<djsiegel1> DanRabbit: ping
<djsiegel1> bratsche: have you thought any more about _ under button accelerator keys? Have you talked to anyone about it?
<mac_v> djsiegel1: hi... today's update in Karmic have fixed certain papercut bugs
<mac_v> djsiegel1: https://bugs.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/388105  , https://bugs.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/387550 both are almost the same , but it was fixed in today's Karmic update.[2 birds one stone ;p]
<MDC1> hi! I know this isn't exactly the right place, but I'd need some advices from a gtk hacker regarding how to implement toolbar editing in nautilus. The basics is there, but I've got problem with the actions (using singleton widgets versus new instance) - if someone got time for this, please tell...
<mac_v> MDC1: #ubuntu-artwork is a better place , to find gtk experts
<MDC1> mac_v, thanks
<DanRabbit> djsiegel:pong
<bratsche> djsiegel: No, not yet.  I was hoping to read whatever you and/or mpt has to write about it before I talk to any upstream people about it.
<djsiegel> bratsche: working on the bug as we speak
<bratsche> Sweet.
<mac_v> DanRabbit: the xdg folders work! its the panel's fault
<DanRabbit> hehe
<mac_v> even in the places main menu
<mac_v> just had to restart the panel!
<DanRabbit> oh, lol!
<mac_v> DanRabbit: BTW , i was playing around with the icons, why do they all have execute privileges ?
<DanRabbit> I made a boo boo one time
<DanRabbit> and I gave everything in my home directory read/write/execute
<mac_v> i think you need to correct that asap.
<DanRabbit> no problem, I'm just no hotshot at the terminal
<DanRabbit> is there a quick command to change then so I can read/write/but no execute?
<mac_v> DanRabbit: i think even the gui from properties should work
<mac_v> DanRabbit: uncheck the execute option and select apply to enclosed files
<DanRabbit> okay
<mac_v> DanRabbit: i have made a few edits,to the shutdown icon ... do you wanna have a look? its a little bit less red than the gtk-delete ,since you were concerned of the icon color in FUSA
<DanRabbit> love to see it
<mac_v> DanRabbit: less red> http://files.getdropbox.com/u/1325768/system-shutdown.svg , faint hint of red[maybe you can say it is pink!]> http://files.getdropbox.com/u/1325768/system-shutdown%20%28copy%29.svg
<DanRabbit> hmm...
<DanRabbit> needs some polishing, but I get what you're going for
<DanRabbit> I'll give it a spin right after I fix this battery for david
<DanRabbit> apparently mark doesn't like it :D
<mac_v> DanRabbit: i was about to say that!
<mac_v> the battery colors are odd , they seem out of the color palate 
<DanRabbit> Well, I know i need to make it flat instead of glossy
<DanRabbit> but David says mark doesn't want it blue or green at all
<mac_v> i think you could use the grey from the present shutdown icon
<DanRabbit> http://www.elementary-project.com/abuse/battery_full.png
<mac_v> looks nice, but how does it work on a dark panel?
<DanRabbit> hehe, that's just what I was talking to david about
<DanRabbit> (12:33:16 PM) DanRabbit: I don't want to lose contrast
<DanRabbit> (12:33:26 PM) David Siegel: right, keep going on this thread, looks promising
<DanRabbit> (12:33:28 PM) DanRabbit: god knows what color the panel is going to be
<DanRabbit> (12:33:35 PM) David Siegel: dude
<DanRabbit> (12:33:39 PM) David Siegel: how many times do I have to say it
<DanRabbit> (12:33:51 PM) David Siegel: we are designing ubuntu for how it comes by default
<DanRabbit> (12:33:51 PM) DanRabbit: Well, you ship themes with dark panels.
<DanRabbit> (12:33:59 PM) DanRabbit: I just really want to make sure it works for everything
<DanRabbit> (12:34:33 PM) David Siegel: 99% of users keep it that way
<DanRabbit> (12:34:33 PM) David Siegel: yeah, most users will never discover thoses
<DanRabbit> (12:34:33 PM) David Siegel: we can cross that bridge when we get to it
<DanRabbit> (12:34:33 PM) David Siegel: chances are, icons that work for light and dark will look amazing on neither
<djsiegel> bratsche: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/403691 can you add any info you need here, and hook the bug up to the right projects? I can add more info
<mac_v> DanRabbit: hehe!
<djsiegel> :)
<mac_v> DanRabbit: you could use light grey , with dark border , i believe that will allow it to be visible in dark and light panels... do you have the present svg, i could fiddle with it a bit
<DanRabbit> let me finish with the series and then I'll push it to bzr
<mac_v> ok...
<bratsche> djsiegel: I'll check it out now, thanks.
<bratsche> djsiegel: I think people will argue that it makes the problem of discovery more of a problem.
<bratsche> I think I like the idea, but I don't know exactly why.
<mac_v> DanRabbit: your battery icon in different backgrounds> http://files.getdropbox.com/u/1325768/Screenshot-1.png
<DanRabbit> white and black aren't bad it's just the in-between isn't it..
<mac_v> i think it works well in all backgrounds, maybe only the empty portion needs a bit of a thicker border
<mac_v> check the empty portion in the dark
<mac_v> it looks thinner
<DanRabbit> true
<DanRabbit> I was trying to make it look like glass
<mac_v> DanRabbit: how about adding a white border with blur around the battery? it will not be seen in the white background , but it will allow the icon display in dark panels
<DanRabbit> that's a good idea
<DanRabbit> how's gnome handling blur these days?
<DanRabbit> I remember way back when I started elementary I had to cut out all the blur because it wouldn't render
<mac_v> DanRabbit: i did that for breathe icons, seems to work well
<DanRabbit> okay betteries are pushed
<DanRabbit> :D
<DanRabbit> better batteries > betteries
<mac_v> DanRabbit: link to your ppa?
<DanRabbit> I don't have a PPA
<DanRabbit> just bzr
<DanRabbit> https://code.launchpad.net/~elementaryicons/humanity/Humanity
<DanRabbit> http://www.elementary-project.com/abuse/exit.png
<DanRabbit> mac_V: ^^
<DanRabbit> djsiegel: batteries are pushed to bzr
<mac_v> DanRabbit: nice exit icon :)
<DanRabbit> yea?
<mac_v> DanRabbit: just the white part needs to be better pixel aligned , 
<DanRabbit> agreed
<DanRabbit> I don't really like the red, though
<DanRabbit> it's abrasive
<mac_v> DanRabbit: i think you can use the white itself. since the battery is white, this wont look odd
<mac_v> else the exit would have been the only grey scale icon
<mac_v> on the panel
<DanRabbit> I guess that's a good point.
<DanRabbit> mac_v: do you feel the wifi icon looks bad/
<DanRabbit> ?
<DanRabbit> I don't understand the war against blue
<mac_v> DanRabbit: i'm biased about them ;p , but what is it about the color?
<DanRabbit> blue and orange are complimentary colors. They make a great team. Just look at the firefox logo.
<DanRabbit> yea. I don't get why I keep getting told to remove every last speck of blue from Humanity
<mac_v> DanRabbit: my view is that icons are too thin... 
<mac_v> DanRabbit: do they want that in grey too?
<DanRabbit> yes
<GreySim> If I were to pick a color for the wifi thing, it would be green. Not sure why. Or different colors at different strengths. Green at full or near full, then yellow, then orange or red. Probably orange since red might be a bit severe for something as tame as low wireless signal, unless it was NO signal.
<DanRabbit> David is really pushing me to try and grey everything out
<DanRabbit> but that's going to create a lot of inconsistency in the panel, I think.
<DanRabbit> third party applications aren't going to adhere to that
<DanRabbit> and it makes the icon look weird in other places
<mac_v> GreySim: http://files.getdropbox.com/u/1325768/nm-signal-100.png
<mac_v> DanRabbit: ^
<DanRabbit> I see
<mac_v> green wifi
<DanRabbit> it looks squished
<DanRabbit> but, yea I had it green at first
<DanRabbit> but I thought blue was more consistent with the volume applet
<GreySim> If people are really pushing anti-blue, I would go green. Just because it's Human doesn't mean everything HAS to be orange. That's the major thing I don't like about GNOME Colors. The color theme is TOO prevalent.
<DanRabbit> I'm being told no green either
<DanRabbit> analogous color scheme only
<DanRabbit> Greysim: I agree that gnome-colors is TOO orange
<DanRabbit> it's white noise.
<mac_v> DanRabbit: this was for the notify-osd , hence the edges are not clear > http://files.getdropbox.com/u/1325768/notification-network-wireless-full.png
<mac_v> the edges are supposed to blend in the black
<mac_v> DanRabbit: battery mod on a dark background> http://files.getdropbox.com/u/1325768/gpm-primary-060.png
<DanRabbit> mac_v: http://www.elementary-project.com/abuse/Screenshot.png
<DanRabbit> It's hard to tell with a small shot, but I'll trust you :D
<mac_v> DanRabbit: you had only done the icon in 24 px , hence the small shot... compare this from my previous screenshot , you can see the empty part a bit clearer.
<DanRabbit> I'll throw in some blur
<mac_v> \o/
<mac_v> DanRabbit: i kept the same border as the glass, changed it to white,duplicated the rest , used only blur= 1
<DanRabbit> cool
<DanRabbit> let me finish my taco real fast :D
<bratsche> Yum.
<DanRabbit> Hmm...
<DanRabbit> I'm getting the opposite result as you for some reason...
<DanRabbit> :D
<DanRabbit> nvm
<DanRabbit> it's just the grey that's not doing so hot
<DanRabbit> black looks way better
<DanRabbit> okay, pushed new battery
<mac_v> DanRabbit: looks nice, this should work on all panels
<DanRabbit> cool
<mac_v> DanRabbit: did you test the icons out? you were concerned about the blur
<DanRabbit> Yea, I tested them out.
<DanRabbit> It looks kind of funny on a grey backgrounf
<DanRabbit> but no worse than it already did
<DanRabbit> background*
<mccann> heya bratsche 
<djsiegel> DanRabbit: battery is looking fantastic
<DanRabbit> thankyou
<bratsche> mccann: Hey dude!
<bratsche> How's it going?
<mccann> bratsche: great.  so i saw a demo of some of the client side decorations stuff today
<mccann> looks nice
<mccann> how's that going btw?
<bratsche> mccann: Some other higher-priority stuff came up at work right now, so I'm afraid my focus is shifting for the moment.  I'm hoping to get back to work on it soon though.
<mccann> aw bummer.  is there a bug open for it?
<bratsche> Yeah.. hang on a sec and I'll get it for you
<bratsche_> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=587475
<bratsche> mccann: One thing that very little thought has been put into yet is some kind of API or ideas for how you could put other widgets in that area if you wanted to.
<bratsche> I don't have specific use case ideas for that though, which is probably why no thought has been put into it. :)
<mccann> right
<bratsche> It's awesome that people are interested in it though.  I was kind of afraid initially that people would be very opposed to the idea.
<mccann> ideally we'd get it in for 2.28
<mccann> but there's still a bunch of work to do it seems
<mccann> like the opacity mask thingy
<mccann> opaque regions rather
<bratsche> Yeah, rgba stuff is kind of a big blocker.  Plus Firefox is kind of a blocker for it being useful in any distro yet.
<mccann> and actually having a theme that can take advantage of this stuff
<bratsche> Firefox totally explodes in a fiery blaze right now if you enable rgba windows.
<mccann> haha
<bratsche> And the content view is not correctly sized when the client-side-decorations stuff is enabled.
<mccann> does epiphany work?
<bratsche> I imagine both bugs are pretty easy to fix if you find someone who knows Firefox code somewhat.
<bratsche> Epiphany -kind of- works.
<bratsche> With rgba enabled Epiphany works, but scrollbars and push buttons and things like that are invisible. :)
<mccann> would it be useful to write up a "where are we and what do we need to do" summary?
<bratsche> Yeah, probably.
<mccann> and get krh and mclasen to comment?
<mccann> might be good to send it to ddl
<mccann> so our theme and art guys can start thinking about it too
<bratsche> I think on my local branch I have the cursor fu committed, but I never pushed it to git.g.o because I was waiting for mclasen to comment on it.
<mccann> basically just let people know this is the future
<mccann> and maybe someone else can step up and help out too
<bratsche> I talked to David Reveman about the opaque region stuff and he seemed to think for some reason that compiz would not suffer a huge performance penalty for most hardware people are using.  I don't really know what to think, but I figure at some point we could just start a branch and fix up issues like Firefox and deal with the opaque region stuff when we can.
<mccann> interesting.  owen and krh were pretty sure it would perform badly
<bratsche> Yeah, I don't have experience with that level of stuff but my instinct tells me that owen and krh tend to know what they're talking about. ;)
<mccann> yup
<bratsche> I also want more experience with that level stuff though, so I'm hoping to get back to work on this stuff soon and get to work on that.
<djsiegel> bratsche, DanRabbit doesn't see indicator-applet in his panel
<djsiegel> bratsche: how does he make it show/
<bratsche> Damn, where is ted when you actually need him? :)
<DanRabbit> lol djsiegel: I didn't even realize that was the wrong channel either
<bratsche> Just right-click the panel and click "add" or whatever, and find Indicator Applet.
<DanRabbit> It's there
<DanRabbit> but, there's no icons
<DanRabbit> how do I populate it
<hyperair> start gwibber
<hyperair> or pidgin
<hyperair> or evolution
<hyperair> those are the tree apps i know of which use the indicator applet, in any case.
<hyperair> oh i think empathy works too.
<DanRabbit> okay
<DanRabbit> brb
<DanRabbit> Does this only work in Karmic?
<djsiegel> bratsche: could the accelerator underline change be made a theme-level decision, and not enforced throughout gtk? I imagine it would be easier to get it in that way
<djsiegel> DanRabbit: no, I am on jaunty
<bratsche> djsiegel: Maybe it can be made a style property on GtkWidget, yes.
<djsiegel> bratsche I am surprised there's no way to turn it off
<DanRabbit> ah, found it
<djsiegel> could there already be a gconf key?
<bratsche> djsiegel: Well the other thing is that we have to monitor the key presses (not really sure how that works with just the <alt> key yet since I don't think that generates a button-press-event).. and then route that to all the widgets in your currently focused window.
<djsiegel> yikes
<bratsche> Err.. I meant key-press-event.
<djsiegel> bratsche: is this not a paper cut?
<djsiegel> it would be a fantastic interface improvement for us to make
<djsiegel> but if it's not easy to patch...
<bratsche> djsiegel: And no, there couldn't be a gconf key for it because gtk+ doesn't depend upon gconf.
<djsiegel> ah,ok
<bratsche> I'm not sure how easy it is yet.  Might be easy, or might not be. :)
<bratsche> I still think we need a convincing argument for why it's a great UI improvement.. the fact that it can perhaps be toggled on/off by the theme maybe makes that less critical, but I still think there should be a good rationale to present the gtk+ maintainers.
<bratsche> Oh sweet, I just noticed that I got a new Bugzilla point today. :)
<bratsche> I crave these things.  They're like vitamins.
<bratsche> Except the higher you get, the harder it is to get more so I'm feeling malnourished. :)
<djsiegel> bratsche all I can think of is conducting user testing to show that people don't know what the underlines are, and think the interface looks better without them
<bratsche> The interface definitely does look better without them.
<bratsche> I wish we could fade them in when you hit alt, rather than just showing them.. but that's not really doable yet.
<djsiegel> bratsche: can you just ping a Gtk maintainer with the suggestion, "they look terrible, most people have no idea what they do, and users who use them would not be affected
<djsiegel> the maintainer might go "yep, that's all I need"
<djsiegel> if they say "I need more" we can give more
<bratsche> Let's ask mccann since he hangs out in our channel and is interested in usability. :)
<djsiegel> mccann!
<mccann> hey djsiegel 
<mccann> ask me what?
<djsiegel> mccann: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/403691
<mccann> yeah ebassi is working on that upstream
<bratsche> Oh really?  Wow.
<djsiegel> mccann: can you point me to a bug report?
<mccann> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=588554
<djsiegel> oh I love you
<djsiegel> omg
<djsiegel> made my day
<mccann> yeah we want this
<djsiegel> glad we are on the same page
<bratsche> Very nice.
<mccann> wouldn't hurt to ping him on irc to express your love 
<mccann> :)
<djsiegel> I will do that
<mccann> send him my love
<bratsche> heh
<djsiegel> wow
<djsiegel> I didn't think of it, but it actually makes accelerators more discoverable
<mccann> yeah
<mccann> it can
<djsiegel> that's amazing
<mccann> we also have more design freedom 
<mccann> we can even use color if necessary
<DanRabbit> djsiegel: done
<SiDi> Yet i'm pretty sure there will be one or two reports mentionning the sudden disparition of accelerators in karmic ;)
<mccann> or weight maybe
<djsiegel> SiDi: and there will be millions of users who think "ubuntu looks better, but I'm not sure what they changed"
<mccann> the underline is not great for a few reasons.  consider the "i"
<SiDi> djsiegel: indeed ;)
<bratsche> Oh wow, this bug is really new.
<bratsche> Nice.
<DanRabbit> djsiegel: I have to take off to work now, but the indicator applet is pushed
<djsiegel> DanRabbit: awesome work, man
<DanRabbit> thanks
<DanRabbit> it needs polish
<djsiegel> will peep the icons in a bit
<DanRabbit> I'll fix it when I get home
<djsiegel> this ghost effect you have with the battery is remarkable
<DanRabbit> :D
<djsiegel> it's very light and systemic
<djsiegel> feels like a piece of the environment
<DanRabbit> I'm glad
<djsiegel> ephemeral like pure information
<djsiegel> like the notificaiton bubbles
 * bratsche => away, bbiab
<DanRabbit> alright peace out
<djsiegel> peace
<mccann> djsiegel: you did that nautilus redesign post right?
<djsiegel> mccann: well, I made the post and discussed the changes, MDC1 (I think) made the patch
<djsiegel> MDC1: are you Marcus Carlson?
<mccann> I think you were too conservative :)  though I'm guessing most of the feedback you got was in the other direction
<djsiegel> but stop calling it a resdesign!
<djsiegel> mccann: it is not a redesign, just changes to settings
<mccann> well it needs more
<djsiegel> I was seeing what we could do without coding
<djsiegel> yeah
<mccann> i talked to cosimo about it a bit
<djsiegel> I didn't want it to go too far because I would rather have it land as is, then go further and not ship it
<djsiegel> mccann: what did he have to say?
<mccann> we should  make a wiki page on live.gnome.org to put some ideas
<djsiegel> I didn't realize I missed a discussion at GCDS
<mccann> firstly put up some relevant art
<mccann> sorta like mpt did with the system settings page
<mccann> http://live.gnome.org/SystemSettings
<mccann> one goal of a redesign should be to make the file-chooser and nautilus look and behave consistently
<mccann> not necessarily the same but consistent
<djsiegel> mccann: nice, GNOME Do is in a user story :)
<djsiegel> mccann: yes
<mccann> so that might be a nice thing for someone to start on
<djsiegel> mccann: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=139119&action=view
<djsiegel> (removing arrow from main-menu applet)
#ayatana 2009-07-24
<bratsche> djsiegel: What's the status of "Cannot rename by clicking on a file"?
<bratsche> Can we close it since it seems it has no future in upstream?
<djsiegel> bratsche: what do you mean, it has no future?
<djsiegel> bratsche: are you still interested in working on it?
<bratsche> Two Nautilus maintainers have made it very clear that it would not be accepted upstream.
<djsiegel> I am confident we can do it and make everyone love it, then users will demand it of upstream
<djsiegel> bratsche: won't they won't accept is Windows's flawed implementation
<djsiegel> which is not what we would implement
<bratsche> I'm not that convinced it's a great idea after I thought about it more, but maybe I just have the shitty Windows implementation burned into my memory.
<djsiegel> I think that's the case
<djsiegel> After using linux for 2 years, I still try to click to rename
<djsiegel> I see users try it all the time
<bratsche> I guess one reason I'm not excited by it is that when I stop and think about how often I actually want to rename a file, it's so unbelievably infrequent that I can't imagine ever wanting this feature.
<djsiegel> well, it's not 1 in a billion
<djsiegel> I won't try to convince you to work on it against your interest
<djsiegel> it's fine if you don't want to do it
<djsiegel> even if each user only ever tries it one
<djsiegel> once
<djsiegel> or 1 in 10 users every try it once
<bratsche> Well, I would like to find out what your ideas are on it at least. :)
<djsiegel> it would be worth it to make it not seem broken
<bratsche> I need to finish up the icon dimming.. I'm not quite sure how to test that yet.
<bratsche> I'll pop into #nautilus tomorrow and ask for help with that. :)
<djsiegel> My idea is that upstream has not tried a good implementation, so they aren't aware that there is a right way to do it, and many wrong ways
<djsiegel> the most powerful argument is that *every other desktop OS* does this
<djsiegel> and users coming from those other environments are trying to rename files and failing
<bratsche> The thing I'm most curious about is why users are always trying to rename files.
<djsiegel> I think that Nautilus developers like the idea of resisting a bad change, even if everyone else "jumps off that cliff"
<djsiegel> but I think they are picking the wrong battle
<djsiegel> users rename files to organize their stuff
<djsiegel> they are often sent files with names that don't make sense to them
<djsiegel> tpsreport_20080912.odt -> September TPS Report.odt
<djsiegel> many users do things like photo organization with nautilus
<bratsche> Okay, I'll trust that this is true then.  I don't mind working on the patch then.
<djsiegel> which involves created folders, and often time renaming them
<bratsche> We'll have to talk about how Windows' implementation sucks and how ours won't. :)
<djsiegel> yes, we should test side-by-size
<djsiegel> side*
<bratsche> But I'm going to go out biking now.  The weather is unusually great today for Dallas and I don't want to miss it. :)
<djsiegel> the bottom line is, people do rename files, and their main expectation for how to do so is by clicking once, then again
<djsiegel> saying "users don't rename files" is just not true
<djsiegel> and their expectations cannot be wrong
<bratsche> Okay, fair enough.  I know for a certainty that I am not the average user, and I have done no user testing on this so I will trust you.
<djsiegel> if they expect to be able to rename files a certain way, they should be able to
<djsiegel> not allowing them to rename files this way is tantamount to changing paste to ctrl-g or something
<djsiegel> they might discover right-click -> paste
<djsiegel> but they know ctrl-v
<djsiegel> I haven't done the user testing either, I don't think this case merits it but if it would help convince upstream maybe we can do it
<djsiegel> alejandra and I designed a user testing script for the community to run today
<djsiegel> I tested archive files on 6 users yesterday: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/archive-behavior-research/+spec/informal-user-test-1
<bratsche> We can develop a patch for it after we talk about how it should be different.  If it's different enough in the right way then maybe upstream will just be convinced by it.  If not then perhaps user testing will convince them.
<djsiegel> with that info, we designed a user test that the community is going to help us carry out on a lot of users
<djsiegel> bratsche and we could do a PPA and user test it, gather feedback, iterate
<bratsche> Cool.
<bratsche> Okay, I'm going biking now. :)
<bratsche> ttyl or tomorrow.
<djsiegel> then we could do a widescale user test, and if 100/100 people say +1 to click to rename, what will it look like if upstream still says "no"?
<djsiegel> ok, bye bratsche
<bratsche> Crap, it's starting to rain.  No wonder the weather seems so nice now.
<djsiegel> DanRabbit1: it's a little hard to tell that it's a battery
<djsiegel> maybe draw a little lightening bolt on it while it's discharging?
<djsiegel> just so it doesn't look like an abstract geometrical figure
<djsiegel> and it looks more like a real world object
<dashua_> DanRabbit1,  http://www.ubuntu-pics.de/bild/19723/screenshot_5_l62vra.png Humanity based theme (light version) :)
<djsiegel> looking good, dashua_
<MDC1> djsiegel, yep it's me (MDC1 = Marcus Carlson)
<mac_v> MDC1: any luck?
<mac_v> DanRabbit1: notification-display-brightness-off is 1px higher than the rest of the icons
<mac_v> DanRabbit1: that would cause an icon jerk, when brightness is being turned off
<MDC1> mac_v, with getting help? - No :-) But i've been doing some hacking anyway, a little bit hackish but it seems to work. Just have to do the location bar action and then the toolbar is customizable. Then I'll fix the rest of the stuff (reset toolbar, expand the locationbar, saving gconf values, etc)
<MDC1> mac_v, maybe I should ask the same question here as I asked djsiegel to get a second opinion;
<MDC1> the user has edited the toolbar to not include location bar (or search bar - same thing) and then hits ctrl + l or going via menu - should there be 1) a popup 2) a new temporary toolbar created and location bar added and removed when hitting enter 3) try to push the location bar into the existing toolbar
<MDC1> djsiegel said go with 1 - but I'm not sure about that. I think I'd go with 2 - what do you think?
<mac_v> MDC1: cant it be done like in firefox? when user adds the toolbar , it just shows up [is this what you mean by pop-up?]
<mac_v> check/uncheck
<mac_v> in firefox, the view section has several selection options, user can check or uncheck the toolbars, this would be the easiest user-friendly way
<MDC1> mac_v, not sure what you mean. The popup would allow you to enter the location for the path you'd like to go to
<mac_v> MDC1: ^
<MDC1> ah. now this is all customizble - user can add toolbars, remove buttons etc etc
<MDC1> just like in epiphany
<DanRabbit1> mac_v: whoops! thanks for noticing :D
<mac_v> MDC1: so is firefox, the options allow the user to place the menu items anywhere, ie: user can place the location bar in the title bar
<mac_v> MDC1: location bar can behave like a button, which can be added to the main toolbar
<MDC1> mac_v, then I'm not sure what you been by check/unchec
<MDC1> yes, in my toolbar editor that's exactly as it behaves right now
<MDC1> but the problem is when a user has removed the location bar from all the toolbars and still hits the ctrl + L or F3 button
<mac_v> MDC1: then i think option 2 would be best
<mac_v> pop-up is not nice
<hyperair> title bar? isn't that the window decoration?
<MDC1> mac_v, agree :-)
<mac_v> hyperair: he is trying to reduce the main toolbar and location bar
<hyperair> hmm
<hyperair> i basically shoved my bookmarks toolbar onto the end of my menubar
<MDC1> hyperair, not adding something to the title bar, i think mac_v means the menu bar in ff
<hyperair> i don't think the location bar looks nice there
<hyperair> i'd rather have a long location bar on the same line as my search box
<hyperair> but the bookmarks go there pretty nicely
<mac_v> oops i just noticed that, yeah, s/title/menu toolbar
<mac_v> hyperair: this is for nautilus
<hyperair> oh
<hyperair> for nautilus eh..
<MDC1> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=42834
<hyperair> hmmm
<hyperair> it's too many things to fit onto *one* toolbar, imo
<hyperair> can't exactly join it =\
<mac_v> hyperair: each user can have just what he wants
<mac_v> :)
<hyperair> and sticking anything on the same level as the menubar is going to make it grown in height.
<hyperair> which looks ugly
<mac_v> without titles
<hyperair> titles?
<mac_v> ielabels!
<hyperair> ??
<mac_v> ie;: labels , damn!
<MDC1> no, we won't add buttons to either the title bar nor the menu bar.. 
 * mac_v always has typo's when multi-tasking! :(
<hyperair> what the hell are ie labels?
<MDC1> have to get to work, see ya later
<mac_v> user can have just the icon displayed without the labels
<hyperair> that's customized in gnome preferences
<mac_v> MDC1: just a sec
<hyperair> my icons are already missing their labels in the toolbars
<mac_v> MDC1: so from what i understand, how you have done the toolbar editor is: user can choose how many toolbars to display and also choose which buttons to show, and where the buttons are placed?
<MDC1> mac_v, correct! :-)
<mac_v> MDC1: \o/ nice, wonderful
<MDC1> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=138852&action=view
<MDC1> screenshot 
<hyperair> that looks like gnome-settings-daemon has crashed.
<hyperair> heheh
<MDC1> yep.. some problem with nomachine..
<mac_v> hyperair: hehe my thoughts too
<MDC1> just crashes imeditaly
<MDC1> got to go, bye!
<mac_v> bye
<hyperair> i think that looks neat
<hyperair> kinda like firefox's one
<mac_v> hyperair: yeah
<MDC1> actually it's more like epiphanys
<hyperair> hmm
<MDC1> bye (really now)
<hyperair> never seen that one
<hyperair> hahah bye
 * MacSlow -> lunch
<mac_v> djsiegel1: several bugs regarding volume applet have been fixed in Karmic 
<djsiegel1> mac_v: awesome!
<djsiegel1> I saw the paper cut for opening and closing the applet window
<mac_v> djsiegel1: also 1 for the vertical applet, and 1 for lesser volume controls
<djsiegel1> mac_v: ah, so, there's a simplified volume controller, and the applet slider is now vertical?
<djsiegel1> For some reason I cannot boot the Karmic daily live isos.
<djsiegel1> I get "BusyBox no live filesystem found"
<mac_v> djsiegel1: try the alpha3
<mac_v> rather than dailies
<djsiegel1> mac_v: if you notice that a paper cut is fixed in karmic, please mark it fix committed
<mac_v> djsiegel1: i marked as fix released :(
<djsiegel1> it isn't released
<mac_v> oh... ok
<djsiegel1> which did you mark?
<djsiegel1> I just marked the applet window zoom
<mac_v> there are 2 more volume related , I'll find them
<djsiegel1> cool
<tedg> djsiegel1: For distro bugs typically they're fix release when they're in the distro, not when it releases.
<tedg> djsiegel1: Otherwise you'll have to do 100 modifications when Karmic ships :)
<djsiegel1> tedg: yes but those modifications are so gratifying!
<djsiegel1> tedg: and there really should be a "mark fix committed -> fix released" big green button in launchpad
<djsiegel1> beuno: ^
<tedg> djsiegel1: There will be with series, but I don't think that's implemented yet.
<djsiegel1> cool
<beuno> interesting
<beuno> we should have a special action that does that
<tedg> beuno: Perhaps kinda like the iPhone, where you can do actions on bugs, but then you can also throw them into a "sheet view" and do operations on groups of them quickly.  The iPhone usually has an "edit" button on most lists for this type of thing.
<beuno> tedg, yes, we have a "bug bag" feature drafted out
<ryanprior> Yay for alliteration.
<tedg> beuno: As long as I can call it a "shit sack" ;)
<bratsche> djsiegel1: I'm going to email you some screenshots from Win7 today.  Related to the <alt> thing kind of.
<beuno> tedg, I'll make sure you can edit the name  :)
<djsiegel1> bratsche cool
<mac_v> djsiegel1: done
<ryanprior> a "dung dumpster"
<mac_v> "shit pile" ;p
<djsiegel1> tedg: can you take pidgin's status icons and use them in FUSA?
<tedg> djsiegel1: We use what ever the theme sets them as.
<tedg> djsiegel1: So, really, that's a kwwii question :)
<tedg> djsiegel1: Though, it would be confusing if Empathy (the default IM client) and the status menu had different icons.  I'm unsure if Emapthy is using the theme's icons or not.
<tedg> djsiegel1: There's a bug to add them to the standard, but we're still waiting on the maintainers there.
<djsiegel1> tedg: cool, thanks for the indo
<djsiegel1> info*
<mac_v> DanRabbit: hi... another thing i noticed> the trash icon> http://files.getdropbox.com/u/1325768/Screenshot.png . it has no padding if placed on the top panel it touches the edge[i realize it's not the default], but it seems bigger than the rest of the icons on the panel.
<DanRabbit> mac_v: do you think you can file a bug for me? I'll not remember otherwise
<mac_v> ok...
<MDC1> i've got a tiny problem with g_signalling - any ninjas around?
<MDC1> I declare my signal like this; (ignoring some stuff) G_STRUCT_OFFSET (NautilusZoomActionClass, zoom_to_level) .... g_cclosure_marshal_VOID__INT, G_TYPE_NONE,1, G_TYPE_INT);
<MDC1> .h: void (* zoom_to_level)	(NZA *action, NZL zoom_level) and then emitting with g_signal_emit (action, sig, 0, level); (level = NautilusZoomLevel (an enum))
<MDC1> result: segfault with IA__g_type_check_instance
<MDC1> the other signals I use (no parameters) is working just fine..
<SiDi> Why dont you ask in gimp.net's gtk or c or nautilus channels ? They'll be more likely to know
<MDC1> SiDi, will do
#ayatana 2009-07-26
<mac_v> DanRabbit: hi... you just removed the evolution icon ;)
<DanRabbit> haha, yea. I never did make an evolution icon. So, now it's upstream :D
<DanRabbit> I don't use evolution. I hate it. :(
<mac_v> making another one? if so a firefox in your style would be nice as well
<mac_v> i dont use it either ... only thunderbird
<DanRabbit> Hmm... Possibly on the firefox. I don't use Firefox either though...
<mac_v> 0.0
<DanRabbit> Midori is about a BILLION times faster
<DanRabbit> So, I can deal with the feature regression while they catch up.
<mac_v> never tried it... does it have extensions?
<DanRabbit> Yea, but not a whole ton.
<DanRabbit> It needs some developer lovin'
<mac_v> oh.. maybe i'll try it sometime... getting tired of firefox and memory leak!
<mac_v> DanRabbit: the 16px folders? i didnt confirm the bug ,since i hadnt discussed with you
<DanRabbit> Yea, I curse at Firefox and it's obesity
<DanRabbit> fat slow cow
<DanRabbit> mac_v: Do you know anybody will a knowledge of OpenGL that would want to hack on WebKit
<DanRabbit> with*
<mac_v> DanRabbit:  nope...  but i think the slideshow team must know about it
<mac_v> ubuiquity slideshow
<DanRabbit> hmm..
<DanRabbit> Because WebKit now has support for 3d transforms, but It needs a hookup to work in WebKit GTK
<DanRabbit> anyways, off to bed. 2AM is late/early enough for me :D
<_ke> hello
<mac_v> SiDi: hi... the karmic notify-osd messes up the human icons , its all pixelated , is it know already?
<SiDi> mac_v: im not the maintainer :D
<SiDi> and i dont have human :P
<SiDi> you should catch macslow or check on lp for notifyosd questions
<mac_v> SiDi: oh... you are not ?...;p
<mac_v> but you mess around a lot
<mac_v> so i thought you might have some info...
<SiDi> i do mess around but i'm out dated
<SiDi> working on another app for now, i'll work on notify-osd in august
#ayatana 2010-07-26
<jcastro> klattimer: ok see if you can assign the ibus bug to "canonical desktop team"
<jcastro> it should
<oLoyoli> My date-time indicator says it's Saturday still...
<klattimer> I'm assuming that it would be a really obvious link
<klattimer> I can't see it at all :/
<jcastro> klattimer: there should be a yellow ! next to your name  in the assignee column
<jcastro> at the top of the bug
<klattimer> yeah
<klattimer> I see that
<klattimer> ... not so obvious
<jcastro> welcome to launchpad!
<klattimer> it says, select a team of which you're a member of
<klattimer> with a search box
<jcastro> "canonical desktop team" in there
<klattimer> if I search canonical desktop team, nothing comes up
<jcastro> sigh, same problem I have
<klattimer> :(
<jcastro> ok fixed
<jcastro> so basically after you do each one this is to say "ok ken your turn to put it in the distro"
<klattimer> k
<jcastro> ok while those are out of the way, the dx team is having a call right now and will find what bugs to give you
<jcastro> klattimer: are you familiar with how merges and merge proposals work in launchpad?
<klattimer> nope
<jcastro> ok
<jcastro> https://help.launchpad.net/Code/Review
<jcastro> klattimer: you can snag the code like so
<jcastro> bzr branch lp:notify-osd
<jcastro> and just familiarize yourself with it while I hunt down some workflow docs for you
<klattimer> k
<klattimer> well I've used bzr a few times
<klattimer> so that's all good
<klattimer> merge requests not sure of so familiarising myself
<jcastro> https://help.launchpad.net/Code
<jcastro> that's the start
<jcastro> it will be easier to do it that way because the dx team works all in launchpad, so they'll be able to review your changes and commit directory to the upstream project
<jcastro> klattimer: examples: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/notify-osd
<jcastro> klattimer: unless assigned otherwise here's the buglist https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/notify-osd/+bugs
<jcastro> hi njpatel
<njpatel> jcastro, hey dude
<jcastro> njpatel: klattimer is reading up on bzr, lp, and notify-osd
<jcastro> he's basically here to polish it off
<njpatel> ah nice, hey klattimer
<jcastro> njpatel: but he needs bugs assigned to him
<njpatel> Right, I think davidbarth  mentioned it this morning
<jcastro> njpatel: also I'm asking him to read up on merge proposals, etc.
<jcastro> if he's going to be doing all this dx work then he might as well do it the way you guys do it
<njpatel> jcastro, awesome
<njpatel> What, badly? ;)
<jcastro> heh
<njpatel> Cool, I'm awaiting a call from david to do some triaging anyway, so I'll make sure to do go through the notify-osd ones too
<MacSlow> jcastro, regarding n-osd... you can point klattimer towards me, should any technical questions arise
<klattimer> hey ho MacSlow
<klattimer> :)
<MacSlow> klattimer, small is the world :)
<jcastro> also, mpt pointed to this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotifyOSD#duration
<jcastro> and these: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotifyOSD#position
<jcastro> do you guys know if there are bugs open for these features?
<jcastro> and can we confirm which parts of those are implemented?
<MacSlow> jcastro, yup... but I don't know htem by heart (by number) :)
<jcastro> MacSlow: as long as you know how to assign them to him. :D
<MacSlow> jcastro, :)
<MacSlow> klattimer, jcastro: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotifyOSD#position regarding that position... this gconf-key selecting the position-option is not implemented
<MacSlow> klattimer, jcastro: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotifyOSD#duration is very tricky/involved... to get it all done
<jcastro> is the position gconf key as important as the duration ones?
<MacSlow> jcastro, I'd say (and I think mpt would so too) that timing is more important
<MacSlow> jcastro, klattimer: but that I'd check with mpt first before proceeding... just to be sure
<MacSlow> jcastro, klattimer: the whole gconf-position option is certainly easier to implement
<jcastro> yeah but it's not really user visible
 * jcastro thinks that gconfable options are probably not a good use of resources
<MacSlow> jcastro, the general problem with gconf-options is getting an equal amount of testing for each code-path behind each option and get any potential side-effects covered testing-wise
<MacSlow> hm... does the above sentence make sense to you? :)
<jcastro> it does
<jcastro> which is why I think bugfixing and duration makes more sense
<MacSlow> that's my view too
<klattimer> until there's a UI to configure notifications, adding gconf keys ends up being in the hands of the distribution... of which I'm only aware of one shipping notify-osd for notifications (unless something's changed) so unless ubuntu is going to vary between spins then there really is little point doing a gconf key for position
<davidbarth> klattimer: hi, yeah; i'm doing tons of bug reshuffling and milestoning right now
<klattimer> davidbarth: cool
<davidbarth> klattimer: there are couple of mem leaks in n-osd first, then some patches waiting to be reviewed and integrated, and then some multi-monitor issues (if not fixed by the former) to merge in
<davidbarth> klattimer: and when you get bored, a request to try and improve the test suite to support unattended tests
<klattimer> k
<davidbarth> we have some xvfb-based framework in dbusmenu, and i'd love to see if you have ideas to use that i n-osd as well
<davidbarth> klattimer: once i've assigned the bugs, can you take a look and give me some estimates
<klattimer> k
<davidbarth> the goal being to do a fair but reasonable investment in doing the necessary cleanups
<davidbarth> but not block you for too long on that, because there are other app. indicators bugs that should be fixable once the design is refined (keyboard in particular)
<jcastro> davidbarth: he's just finished ibus, do you have any opther app indicator bugs in mind?
<sense> jcastro: I've asked before, but hplip works now?
<sense> If that has problems still he could take a look at that.
<jcastro> sense: we decided that it's best to wait for upstream Qt to implement KSNI
<sense> ok
<davidbarth> jcastro: the keyboard one, but that'll require that some validation from mpt; i think we came up with a good approach last week, but i'd prefer him to finish commenting on that in the bug reports he's on
<klattimer> davidbarth: any word on those bugs?
<klattimer> I'm going to head out to lunch in a bit and would like some new stuff to get my teeth into this afternoon
<klattimer> mpt about?
<davidbarth> klattimer: back on n-osd bugs, so can you look at all the high & medium prio bugs in https://bugs.launchpad.net/notify-osd/+bugs, except #428509 and give me a ballpark time estimate?
<klattimer> I'll take a look through them
<davidbarth> klattimer, jcastro: then i think it makes sense to invest ~2-3 days to start with
<klattimer> k
<klattimer> davidbarth: a rough guess would be something like 6 days for high + medium on there
<klattimer> as long as I don't hit any major trouble along the way
<klattimer> lets say probably 9 is a safe estimate
<davidbarth> klattimer: ok, with automating testing being harder or easier than leaks?
<klattimer> easier, there seems to be better pointers in total, but memory leaks are ok too
<klattimer> pointers to resources I mean :)
<bratsche> Morning.
<klattimer> afternoon
<bratsche> jcastro around?
<jcastro> bratsche: yep
<bratsche> jcastro: Oh hey dude.. was wondering if you have any priority bugs in the queue that ayan could work on?
<jcastro> ayan?
<bratsche> He's finished up the bugs assigned to him and was wondering if I know of anything else he can hack on that's desktop related.
<jcastro> give me a minute
<jcastro> any specific area?
<jcastro> or just ayatana bugs in area
<bratsche> jcastro: I figure just any ayatana bugs that you've been watching.  If not it's no big deal, I just didn't have any specific bugs I could think of so I figured I'd ask you.
<jcastro> on the phone, give me 2 minutes.
<bratsche> Sure, no worries.
<jcastro> bratsche: any of these would be great: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotificationAreaTransition/CompatibilityFixes
<bratsche> ayan ^
<jcastro> that's like a ton of stuff in the archive
<jcastro> so best thing to do is do a cost/benefit analysis of how popular something might be
<jcastro> ie. start porting apps that are most used.
<jcastro> you'll need to cross reference http://popcon.ubuntu.com/ ftw
<jcastro> the bugs themselves are tagged with "trayaway" in lp: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=trayaway
<jcastro> (or should be tagged with that)
<jcastro> also, any papercut: https://edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/maverick
<jcastro> ayan: is that enough? ;)
<jcastro> vish: feel free to jump in here, heh
<vish> yay!
<jcastro> sense: you too!
<vish> ayan: what happened to  Bug #8949 ? any luck with that one?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 8949 in gtk+2.0 (Ubuntu) "Opening a deleted 'recent document' results in a new file. (affected: 6, heat: 95)" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/8949
<sense> jcastro: Most certainly not right now! :P
<kelelsai> hi, I'm new here. I missed the section or documentation that says where to get the code from to Fix bugs. Does anyone here know the link that references how to do so?
<vish> kelelsai: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToFix  ?
<kelelsai> thanks
<htorque> hi, can anyone familiar with the unity design tell me, where that dark line at the bottom of the panel comes from?
<htorque> http://img.xrmb2.net/images/792578.png
#ayatana 2010-07-27
<klattimer> davidbarth: I'm confused about two memory leak bugs #378193 and #405364
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 378193 in Notify OSD "Memory leak in notify-osd (affected: 3, heat: 28)" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/378193
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 405364 in Notify OSD "Memory leak in notify-osd in cairo surface creation - or what is left after fix for 378193 (affected: 4, heat: 22)" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/405364
<klattimer> I see that the former has a fix committed and merge requested which is pending, however in the second bug I see a merge request approved and am wondering if the approved contains both fixes
<klattimer> MacSlow: you'll help here too
<davidbarth> klattimer: hi
<klattimer> :)
<MacSlow> klattimer, looking...
<klattimer> morning
<davidbarth> uh, i remember MacSlow was hunting down mem leaks
<davidbarth> but then probably one fix was not passing the QA control
<davidbarth> a bit too close to a release and we left it here; MacSlow, remember the details?
<MacSlow> klattimer, davidbarth: the real fix to many (if not all) mem-leak issues of notify-osd is to do the abstract notification-object/class (which is in trunk actually already), but I never had the time to hook it all up
<MacSlow> klattimer, davidbarth: the idea behind it all is to have only two instances of bubbles at any one time (sync and async) and to all the queue-handling etc. on just the abstract notification-class objects
<klattimer> well, what should be done about these two bugs then?
<MacSlow> I admit that this is more a "feature" than a bug-fix.
<MacSlow> klattimer, I remember that there was a valgrind-hit for GdkPixbuf creation, which I could not track down
<MacSlow> klattimer, but I would have to valgrind it again to refresh my brain on the issue.
<klattimer> :/
<MacSlow> people seem to see it most with covers displayed in notifications
<klattimer> hmm
<klattimer> well, it seems there's a bit of an issue with this then
<klattimer> two high priority bugs exist, which are from an older generation, and a proper fix is on the way
<klattimer> which will in some part include a re-write thus making the current debugging information invalid
<klattimer> MacSlow: does that sound accurate to you?
<MacSlow> klattimer, the GdkPixbuf related leak is still a leak needed to fix... but switching to the abstract notification-object would considerably lessen the leakage.
<klattimer> MacSlow: and where is the abstract notification-object on your task list?
<davidbarth> hmm, this is where i would trace the line: no structural changes to n-osd this cycle
<davidbarth> if there are still a leak or two and they require a structural change, let's document that and switch to something else
<MacSlow> klattimer, that class is implemented (wiht unit-tests even)...
<davidbarth> people are not really impacted by those leaks, so it's better to do something that makes their work easier than invest in something that has no user benefit
<davidbarth> klattimer, MacSlow: makes sense?
<klattimer> i was under the impression that the leaks were serious
<MacSlow> klattimer, but I would valgrind n-osd, with a few track-switches from rhythmbox...
<klattimer> gb's in some cases
<davidbarth> so is there a leak that can be fixed given the actual code base?
<MacSlow> I believe so
<klattimer> yeah
<klattimer> trouble is, which branch
<klattimer> which branches contain which already patched bits
<davidbarth> klattimer: which bug should i mark whislist/later then? i'll be happy to do so, and just leave open the one where you think progresses can still be made with that code base
<klattimer> is there a need to merge two branches or not?
<MacSlow> klattimer, nope
<MacSlow> klattimer, use trunk
<klattimer> davidbarth: I think that I can probably get all the leaks reported here
<klattimer> MacSlow: then has the branch from https://launchpad.net/bugs/378193 been merged yet?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 378193 in Notify OSD "Memory leak in notify-osd (affected: 3, heat: 28)" [High,New]
<davidbarth> klattimer: ok, ping me if you want me to do so bug mgt
<klattimer> k
<klattimer> :)
<MacSlow> klattimer, yes
<klattimer> oh
<klattimer> k
<klattimer> trunk it is then
<klattimer> davidbarth: I think both #378193 and #405364 can be closed and a new bug opened for "test for memory leaks" as a reminder to do a more recent valgrind
<klattimer> it seems as MacSlow is developing on various other parts right now, tracing memory leaks should wait at least until he's satisfied it's the right time
<klattimer> MacSlow: does that sound good?
<MacSlow> yup
<klattimer> MacSlow: have you closed a bunch of high bugs on notify-osd?
<MacSlow> klattimer, not in recent times
<MacSlow> klattimer, only working on unity
<klattimer> ah no worries i got lost in launchpad
<davidbarth> klattimer: ok
<jcastro> hi klattimer
<klattimer> hey sup
<klattimer> jcastro: ?
<jcastro> keeping busy?
<klattimer> quite
<jcastro> seb has some bugs for you. :D
<klattimer> churning through the notify-osd bugs and sorting them out
<klattimer> a lot of the work has already been done
<jcastro> klattimer: since we're guadecing we'd figure we'd err on the side of piling too many on your plate
<jcastro> oh awesome
<klattimer> well assign away ;)
<jcastro> I've been travelling all day so please do a detailed report
<klattimer> k
<jcastro> also, can you CC seb128@ubuntu.com on your reports from now on?
<klattimer> sure
<jcastro> jawesome
<jcastro> how you getting on then?
<klattimer> i got round to adding my pgp key and signing the code of conduct on launchpad too
<jcastro> rock
<klattimer> it's going well mostly been trawling through code seeing if patches have been committed yet
<klattimer> seeing what the fastest wins are so I can concentrate on the ones which need some hard work later
<klattimer> oh, I did want to ask you, as I can't seem to join the indicator dev team I was wondering what could be done there as ted is away
<jcastro> klattimer: you'll need to catch dbarth or mirco or njpatel
<jcastro> imo they should just add you
<klattimer> k
<njpatel> indicator-applet-developers?
<njpatel> klattimer, ^
<klattimer> njpatel: yeah
<Cimi> hi davidbarth
<davidbarth> Cimi: hi, got my message about the thursday upload window?
<Cimi> yes
<Cimi> and replied immediatly
<davidbarth> klattimer: ping, i added you to https://launchpad.net/~indicator-applet-developers
<davidbarth> Cimi: ok, so for the menu layout part, can you work with bratsche on getting the other changes ready
<davidbarth> the patch on dbusmenu should be relatively easy, maybe it can be a style property change
<davidbarth> the one with the variable icon size is a bit more tricky, it requires patching libindicator; which bratsche did a while back
<davidbarth> bratsche: did you find the branch on your system btw?
<klattimer> davidbarth: cool
<bratsche> davidbarth: I'll take a look for it.
<bratsche> btw, does anyone here have nvidia with two monitors?
<bratsche> Could use some help.
<Cimi> davidbarth: ok
<Cimi> I was looking at few things for the theme
<seb128> klattimer, hey
<seb128> klattimer, not sure how is your todolist right now
<seb128> klattimer, there is still an issue on bug #558841
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 558841 in indicator-application (Ubuntu Lucid) "bluetooth "devices" menu item not working in bluetooth indicator (affected: 19, heat: 140)" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/558841
<seb128> klattimer, if you click on desactivate and then active in the applet menu the "visible" item is not listed
<chrisccoulson> bratsche, interesting response from mozilla about the linux UI for FF4.0 - http://groups.google.com/group/mozilla.dev.apps.firefox/browse_thread/thread/5a77e3e5e58deb52#
<chrisccoulson> well, perhaps not interesting
<chrisccoulson> but i wonder what they're having difficulty with?
<bratsche> Weird, I clicked over from there to this bug: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=572482
<ubot5> Mozilla bug 572482 in Theme "[Linux] UI Refresh" [Enhancement,New]
<bratsche> Scrolled down some and saw a comment that looked like it was by me.
<bratsche> And I was like, "Uhh.. I don't remember writing that comment."
<bratsche> But it's not me. :)
#ayatana 2010-07-28
<kelelsai_> if an item is upstream but marked as triage does that mean the upstream team has to fix it or is that something I can fix
<RAOF> Oh, wow.  You're not wrong when you said that unity doesn't like radeon!
<gambs> Flashing?
<RAOF> No.
<RAOF> Corrupt textures and distorted background colours
<gambs> Oh. I have a radeon card and it flashes to white continually. Can't get it to work at all. In Gnome-shell, the icon colors invert on me.
<RAOF> Flashing to white continually probably means that it's crashing.
<RAOF> Hm.  Actuallyâ¦ why isn't _this_ crashing.  I found a nice, dependable DRI2 crash at the sprint.
<gambs> Is there anything I can do about it crashing? (I assumed that was the problem) Should I just wait?
<RAOF> You could file a bug, or you could wander into #ubuntu-x and pastebin logs and such.
<RAOF> And, by âlogsâ I probably mean ârun unity under gdb and grab a backtraceâ
<gambs> Alright, thanks.
<RAOF> Mmm, shaders.  Everyone's favourite way to replace a blue sunset with an orangy-brown mess.
<gambs> As soon as I Google how to do that, will do ;)
<RAOF> Heh.  gnome-shell doesn't like radeon either.
<davidbarth> klattimer: hey karl, if you run out of bugs on n-osd be sure to ping me (a bit in advance); let me know
<klattimer> yeah, I'm just clearing down the already fixed ones mostly
<klattimer> there's cruft that's collected
<klattimer> one of the bugs I have no way of testing the fix
<klattimer> as I don't have a separate monitor
<klattimer> however, reports are that it works, and the code looks nice and clean
<klattimer> I'd like to try and get this branch merged into trunk
<klattimer> davidbarth: also, feel free to increase the severity of something, if you want to introduce it to my field of view
<klattimer> atm I only 'see' high and medium
<klattimer> ;)
<davidbarth> klattimer: high and meds are fine ;)
<klattimer> well, increase the priority if you want me to look at something low ;)
<jcastro> klattimer: when I get back I can help test multimonitor stuff
<klattimer> cool
<klattimer> I've asked for help on the bug
<klattimer> someone from the community who's on the bug might help in the mean time
<davidbarth> Cimi: hi Andrea
<davidbarth> Cimi: bratsche is not here yet, but how is it going for the dbusmenu item tweaks? need help to find your way in the code?
<davidbarth> klattimer: btw, a quick heads up on upcoming app. indicator tasks
<klattimer> ok cool
<davidbarth> klattimer: the next port should be the keyboard layout indicator in gsd
<klattimer> gsd?
<davidbarth> as said earlier this week (i think? ;) we're going for 2 indicators in Maverick, mostly porting them to being app. indicators
<klattimer> yeah i get this
<klattimer> what is gsd though?
<davidbarth> and M+1 they should become just one, but that still rquires some design work because of the complexity of the domain
<klattimer> sorry the acronym escapes me
<davidbarth> gnome-settings-daemon
<klattimer> ok
<davidbarth> too long to type, sorry
<klattimer> :)
<davidbarth> the issue with that indicator is that it uses either dynamic icons, which can't be stylred (so: no good)
<davidbarth> or would have to use a label on the panel
<davidbarth> this has been discussed recently on the dbusmenu list with agateau, ted and other kde folks
<klattimer> davidbarth: this sounds very much like the ibus problem
<klattimer> ibus required support for absolute paths
<davidbarth> hmm, ah, does it?
<klattimer> could we use that? or is it critical that it gets styled
<davidbarth> it is important that it gets styled
<klattimer> yeah, the icons are installed in the various folders for the various languages
<klattimer> which is difficult to fix
<davidbarth> what appears on the panel should be consistent, properly themed
<klattimer> that could be fixed in that each of the icons is linked into the hicolor theme but that would be time consuming and require some kind of non-clashing naming so poses many other problems
<davidbarth> symbolic icons can help fix a part of that
<davidbarth> agateau and ted will be back next week to finalize either of the approaches with you
<klattimer> well, I suppose ibus is a special case which is very difficult to theme appropriately
<klattimer> if gsd requires something themable I'm sure we can work out something more appropriate for this case
<davidbarth> in the meantime, can you prepare the patchset / branch to get the gsd-keyborad indicator into an app. indicator one?
<klattimer> I mean, really panel applets should have themable icons
<klattimer> is this a straight port from notification area?
<klattimer> and what language if you know?
<davidbarth> klattimer: should be, i took a quick look at the code
<Cimi> davidbarth: is that assigned to me?
<Cimi> I am working on the theme now
<meebey> hi, are the debian package maintainers also on this channel?
<om26er> #ubuntu-motu might be a better place to ask
<bratsche> Anyone here having multiple monitors?
<Cimi> bratsche: what do you want me to add in murrine?
<Cimi> if you tell me the right name of the style property I could patch murrine
<Cimi> davidbarth: ping
<davidbarth> Cimi: sorry, was out for a bit
<davidbarth> Cimi: yes, I need you help to get the dbusmenu layout change in sync with the other you did on the messaging menu
<davidbarth> Cimi: you should look into: dbusmenu/libdbusmenu-gtk
<davidbarth> Cimi: genericmenuitem.c i think
<davidbarth> Cimi: but there may be parts to review also in menuitem.c
<davidbarth> Cimi: not sure
<Cimi> davidbarth: ok I have patched, now I'm testing it
<davidbarth> Cimi: awesome! thanks
<Cimi> quite slow to compile on my netbook..
<Cimi> bratsche: could you fix dbusmenu? I have an idea why it is not working but it's too hard for me to get it sorted quickly
#ayatana 2010-07-29
<Cimi> bratsche: what do I need to do for murrine+rgba?
<Cimi_> bratsche: ping
<Cimi_> davidbarth: ping
<davidbarth> Cimi: png
<davidbarth> Cimi: hey, what is creating issues in the PPA? gtk itself or the connman or zeitgeist packages?
<Cimi> gtk
<Cimi> my maverick installation is totally destroyed
<Cimi> I have just a terminal :)
<Cimi> argh I hate that
<Cimi> safuck
<davidbarth> let me check
<Cimi> I guess I'll need to reinstall everything
<Cimi> davidbarth: help me :(
<davidbarth> Cimi: you may have to
<davidbarth> Cimi: do you have a lucid machine somewhere for the other changes
<davidbarth> Cimi: i can work with you on the dbusmenu changes for example
<Cimi> davidbarth: I have a lucid installation
<davidbarth> while you re-install your maverick system
<davidbarth> ok cool
<Cimi> no
<Cimi> it's in my netbook :(
<Cimi> maverick or lucid
<Cimi> for the dbusmenu change, I've tried patching genericmenuitem_Set_icon
<davidbarth> oh dual boot
<davidbarth> ok
<Cimi> with gtk_menu_item_set_image ...
<Cimi> (something like that)
 * davidbarth looks into the code
<Cimi> but it doesn't display anythink
<davidbarth> hmm
<davidbarth> it should be similar to the one ted added for the messaging menu
<Cimi> restarting to lucid
<davidbarth> there is this get_hpadding helper
<davidbarth> Cimi: ok, see you in a minute
<Cimi> in lucid ;)
<davidbarth> Cimi: ok, checked the package; the dependencies are broken or something
<davidbarth> Cimi: let's put that argb on hold until bratsche and kenvandine are back
<davidbarth> Cimi: on dbusmenu, did you see the get_hpadding funciton?
<Cimi> davidbarth: it's not padding the main issue
<Cimi> if we don't have the icons
<davidbarth> Cimi: so what's the thing to fix to match the mockups? icon positioning
<davidbarth> Cimi: or the hbox container itself?
<davidbarth> (looking at your msg-menu patch in the meantime)
<davidbarth> Cimi: i don't have the part of the patch where you adjusted the layout, just the triangle
<davidbarth> Cimi: but actually the triangle could go directly into the genericmenuitem part
<Cimi> davidbarth: sorry I detached the irc sreen session :)
<Cimi> so
<klattimer> davidbarth: can you make sure you assign the gsd bug to me asap
<davidbarth> klattimer: hi
<Cimi> davidbarth: basically, the previous layour in the indicator-mexxage was
<davidbarth> klattimer: gsd bug? you mean the porting task?
<klattimer> yeah
<Cimi> | triangle (in the space assigned to the menuitem icon) | HBOX with icon and label
<Cimi> with my patch is
<Cimi> | icon | label |
<Cimi> and triangle is drawn in the meuitem expose event
<Cimi> I thought that if we wanted to align dbusmenuitem on the left we need to move set the menuitem icon to the application icon
<Cimi> and remove the hbox
<davidbarth> klattimer: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ayatana-ubuntu/+bug/599844 is all yours now
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 599844 in Ayatana Ubuntu "Port the keyboard indicator in gsd to use the app. indicator protocol (affected: 1, heat: 8)" [Medium,Incomplete]
<klattimer> cool
<klattimer> :)
<davidbarth> Cimi: ok
<davidbarth> Cimi: so. in genericmenuitem terms
<Cimi> yes
<davidbarth> the hbox would be suppressed
<davidbarth> but that sounds wrong to me
<Cimi> not suppressed
<Cimi> just remove the icon from the hbox
<Cimi> if you remove the icon from the hbox, the hbox will continue to work and be available
<davidbarth> Cimi: can you send me back the msg-menu mockup btw? it is still not clear whether we cover all cases in this case
<davidbarth> Cimi: because the left column is only supposed to contain checkboxes or radioboxes, but not generic menuitem icons
<Cimi> in fact
<davidbarth> Cimi: but still, the msg menu design calls for having a small triangle very close to the Broadcast icon for example, and that would take the place of the checkboxes for axample
<Cimi> that's why I thought to overriding dbusmenu in indicator-messages
<Cimi> davidbarth: email sent
<davidbarth> Cimi: ok, thanks
<davidbarth> Cimi: so the mockup is wrong, or doesn't match mpt's definition
<davidbarth> Cimi: let's try to secure the rounded counter then, because that can go independently of the rest
<davidbarth> Cimi: can you make a branch with just this change first
<davidbarth> Cimi: upload the branch, and propose it for merging into indicator-messages
<Cimi> ok
<Cimi> so
<Cimi> triangle on the left
<davidbarth> Cimi: i'm calling otto to try to re-clarify that with him
<Cimi> plus rounded counter?
<davidbarth> Cimi: not even the triangle, just the nice rounded corner you added
<Cimi> will do but just reading the code
<davidbarth> Cimi: the rounded counter is on an expose handler, right?
<Cimi> I can't test it because of no maverick installation working
<davidbarth> so to land the triangle rendering, it's just a question of adding more to the handler that will already be in trunk
<Cimi> I'll do in lucid
<davidbarth> Cimi: i'll test it when doing the code review anyway
<davidbarth> cool
<davidbarth> Cimi: do you have mpt's wireframe paper with you btw? could you make a snapshot with your phone and send that to me as well?
<Cimi> it's in the haydn room I guess :D
<Cimi> davidbarth: done
<Cimi> davidbarth: another idea
<Cimi> instead using cairo to draw the triangle
<Cimi> I could use cairo+expose event to place the icon on the left
<Cimi> so that the icon can be fully themed with the icon theme
<davidbarth> Cimi: can you ping me to test the menu rendering please?
<Cimi> davidbarth: ?
<davidbarth> i didn't get your name rendered next to the rounded counter
<Cimi> mmm
<Cimi> did you restarted the panel?
<Cimi> davidbarth:
<davidbarth> Cimi: i did
<Cimi> something may be wrong in my patch then
<davidbarth> Cimi: and that new ping was rendered without your name on the line, just the counter, left aligned btw
<Cimi> sshot?
<davidbarth> Cimi: doing that now
<Cimi> looks like I removed the label :)
<davidbarth> Cimi: yeah, gtk_label_new
<Cimi> davidbarth: pushed :)
<davidbarth> Cimi: https://code.launchpad.net/~cimi/indicator-messages/right-rounded-numbers/+merge/31262
<davidbarth> see comments on argument checks to add too
<Cimi> it's the first time I write callbacks so I'm completely new on them
<davidbarth> Cimi: great, now it works
<Cimi> davidbarth: if you could patch and push the right version I can learn ;)
<davidbarth> well, they will be evaled at run time only, so don't use g_return_if_fail, but rather simple checks like if (x == NULL) return
<davidbarth> or better, do some typechecking on gobjects, so that even a dirty pointer can be controled a bit more thoroughly
<davidbarth> Cimi: ok, i'll give that a try
<davidbarth> Cimi: ok, i commented on the code review page with a patch you can add and push
<davidbarth> Cimi: i can't push to this branch directly
<Cimi> ok
<Cimi> davidbarth: pushed
<davidbarth> Cimi: great
 * Cimi eating
 * Cimi food finished :D
<davidbarth> Cimi: i should have a call with otto at 3pm (CET) to clarify what we can already land for a3
<Cimi> nice
<Cimi> davidbarth: do you want to setup a conference?
<davidbarth> Cimi: once the time is set, yes, to have you on the call as well
<Cimi> davidbarth: 3pm is in 2 minutes?
<davidbarth> Cimi: it's postponed for a bit, i'll ping you back on that in particular
<davidbarth> Cimi: hey can you take a look at the updated drawing (on the right)?
<davidbarth> Cimi: the triangle code you have should already do exactly that
<Cimi> davidbarth: what do you mean?
<Cimi> kind of
<davidbarth> Cimi: maybe the triangle should be enlarged a bit
<davidbarth> but mostly, that would work
<Cimi> as I said, we could have two different solutions
<davidbarth> and not require further re-alignment of either the msg-menu items or dbusmenu at the same time
<Cimi> 1) drawing with cairo
<Cimi> 2) using cairo to place the icon on the left
<Cimi> with icon I mean the current triangle icon
<davidbarth> how would option 2) work?
<davidbarth> you move the current "cursor"
<davidbarth> and let the icon drawing code render from here?
<Cimi> I draw using cairo
<Cimi> but
<Cimi> instead drawing with the vectorial api
<Cimi> I will get the pixbuf and place it on a surface
<Cimi> the advantage is that it is themeable
<Cimi> the downside is that you might have problems with different colors in themes
<Cimi> another downside is that it won't scale maybe with different font dimensions (or yes, it could scale but not like a pure vectorial code)
<davidbarth> Cimi: the version you have implements option #1 right?
<Cimi> y
<davidbarth> Cimi: to make it more themeable, you could also retrieve some properties (if you don't already) to at least use some theme colors
<davidbarth> for the rest i'm not sure i see which benefits option #2 would bring wrt to themability
<Cimi> davidbarth: I'm already checking he colors
<davidbarth> Cimi: then that sounds fine to me
<Cimi> ok I'll open a new branch
<Cimi> just for the triangle
<davidbarth> Cimi: i think the last step is to get some signoff from design on that rendering
<davidbarth> Cimi: right
<davidbarth> Cimi: maybe that'll require some adjustment for the size of the triangle, but apart from that, that should be fine for landing today too
<davidbarth> Cimi: one note: there should be a way to have the triangle have either a normal (gray) color, or an active/highlighted color (green, to go with the green envelope)
<davidbarth> Cimi: are there style properties you'd recommend to use to have that stylable in a way consistent with the rest of the style property hiearchy?
<Cimi> mmm
<Cimi> (davidbarth pushed anyway the first version)
<Cimi> davidbarth: maybe not, I don't know
<Cimi> we can't use selected color
<Cimi> because it is already used for the selected menuitem
<Cimi> please test the branch, can't test here
<Cimi> and tell me if the dimension is ok
<Cimi> otto liked it
<davidbarth> Cimi: ok, doing that now
<davidbarth> Cimi: ok it renders the triangle
<davidbarth> Cimi: the returns must return a FALSE or the compiler cries
<davidbarth> Cimi: the other icon is still thre
<davidbarth> Cimi: and so utlimately it means we need to de-construct what ted did with the hboxes and so on
<davidbarth> Cimi: because they would not be needed anymore, as the triangle is an overlay
<davidbarth> Cimi: let me try the removal of the hbox code, that is tied to the specific menu item
<Cimi> davidbarth: yeah that's true
<Cimi> I forgot it
<Cimi> davidbarth: which return must return fals?
<Cimi> davidbarth: and what about the conference call
<Cimi> ?
<davidbarth> Cimi: no ping yet on the call
<davidbarth> Cimi: i have fiddled a bit with the icon size to bring that closer to otto's design
<Cimi> davidbarth: ok
<davidbarth> Cimi: no ping yet on the call
<davidbarth> Cimi: i have fiddled a bit with the icon size to bring that closer to otto's design
<Cimi> i received it
<davidbarth> (in case that didn't pass, ah good)
<davidbarth> Cimi: the horizontal-padding property that is used for the icon + label layout
<davidbarth> Cimi: is that something that can be adjusted as well?
<davidbarth> Cimi: ie, if we were to not add padding to the left side of the icon, that would bring it closer to the left border (and the triangle)
<davidbarth> and still align with entries with only text or?
<Cimi> one sec
<Cimi> I'm tired, need to re-read it :)
<Cimi> I did not understand
<Cimi> mainly because I don't have the app running so I can't know what's wrong
<davidbarth> Cimi: hmm, sory, not that's not a good idea
<davidbarth> Cimi: we need to add the same padding to both text or icon + text entries, or that won't align of course
<Cimi> davidbarth: sshot?
 * Cimi needs to sleep 10 mins or his mind will blow up
<davidbarth> Cimi: hang on, coming back in ~20min after an internal meeting
<davidbarth> Cimi: (not on design)
<Cimi> davidbarth: updates?
<Cimi> davidbarth: received
<davidbarth> Cimi: kenvandine updated the gtk package if you want to try again
<davidbarth> Cimi: see the steps with ken if you want to recover from the past change maybe
<kenvandine> i think just install ubuntu-desktop should do it
<davidbarth> Cimi: chaotic is saying the changes are ok to go in, i'm adjusting a variable with him and will push the changes bakc for you to resubmit
<kenvandine> but i think njpatel found installing fresh was easier
<Cimi> will do tomorrow
<Cimi> davidbarth: ok, i'm here
<Cimi> what about the conference call?
<Cimi> not needed anymore?
<Cimi> davidbarth: lol, you don't read me just because you need the nice rounded counter on the right :P
<davidbarth> Cimi: ok sweet, chaotic is happy with the triangle, we adjusted that a bit to accomodate for the gap between them and the icon
<davidbarth> Cimi: sort of yes ;)
<Cimi> lol
<davidbarth> Cimi: on the rounded counters
<Cimi> yep
<davidbarth> Cimi: could you try to have the font 1 or 2 points smaller?
<davidbarth> i guess it takes a few gtk calls to adjust that
<Cimi> it should
<Cimi> but i did not reach it
<davidbarth> would you know where to hit in the right spot?
<Cimi> davidbarth: read lines 567-569
<davidbarth> Cimi: i'm there
<Cimi> sorry 567-568
<Cimi> it didn't work
<davidbarth> just trying to find out where to attack
<davidbarth> oh, sorry the pango calls
<davidbarth> Cimi: what about something like gtk_widget_modify_style?
<Cimi> for what?
<Cimi> the only idea I have in my mind is using cairo_scale
<Cimi> and try to see if it will work
<davidbarth> Cimi: can you ping me again, please?
<Cimi> davidbarth: no :P
<davidbarth> thanks
<Cimi> davidbarth: does cairo_scale work?
<davidbarth> Cimi: dunno, where?
<Cimi> in numbers_draw_cb
<Cimi> before drawing everything
<Cimi> you should try a transformation
<davidbarth> Cimi: oh i see
<Cimi> davidbarth: like cairo_scale (cr, 0.8, 0.8);
<Cimi> not sure if we need 1.2 or 0.8 :)
<davidbarth> Cimi: well, i'd rather stabilize the code for the release today and note the optimizations for later next week
<davidbarth> Cimi: during your sprint in London
<davidbarth> Cimi: atm i'm just trying to see if there is an easy way to get the font size different, but that may take a while, so i'll just push back my branch and please re-submit it once received
<davidbarth> Cimi: then i'll roll a few tarballs for the desktop folks to get something better into A3 for now
<Cimi> ok
<davidbarth> Cimi: lp:~dbarth/indicator-messages/style-rehash-for-cimi
<davidbarth> Cimi: just merge back in your existing branch and i'll finish validating the merge proposal
<Cimi> davidbarth: pushed
<davidbarth> Cimi: merged in, thanks
<Cimi> chaotic: did you take the latest theme?
<Cimi> I have seen you removed the snapshot of the 28 from the shared folder
<chaotic> I've been looking at it today - it's getting there :)
<Cimi> chaotic: why you removed it?
<chaotic> hmmm weird - didn't mean to remove it - one second
<chaotic> it's back - I thought I'd copied it, but I had moved it by accident, sorry
<Cimi> chaotic: is the theme ok?
<chaotic> cimi: it's looking good and I'm looking forward to refining it further next week
<Cimi> chaotic: will it go in alpha3?
<chaotic> Cimi: no
<chaotic> Cimi: we need to do a bit more to it plus we still need to create the radiance equivalent
<Cimi> ok
<chaotic> Cimi: shouldn't take long though
<Cimi> no
<Cimi> we must refine the window borders for example
<Cimi> for me they look out of place
<chaotic> Cimi: they may change slightly but not much
<chaotic> Cimi: not sure if we should go more with the newer idea I had
<chaotic> Cimi: have to go to a team meeting and I am on holiday tomorrow but I look forward to seeing you next week
<Cimi> chaotic: see you on monday for lunch
<Cimi> chaotic: get food for me :)
<Cimi> I will arrive at 12:30-13 of monday
<davidbarth> Cimi: going out, but let me know if you managed to get the argb package running, we'll continue tomorrow
<davidbarth> cheers
#ayatana 2010-07-30
<gade> Hi, are you guys still taking papercuts?
<sense> gade: Yes we are.
<sense> At all times.
<gade> Thanks for reply - is there somewhere special to report it or can I just mention it here?
<sense> gade: Please report a bug in <https://launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts>, as mentioning it here will probably make it go unnoticed. But before opening a new bug, please verify it wasn't alread y reported.
<gade> OK will do and thank you.
<sense> You're welcome!
<meebey> hi, I am experienting with the messaging menu for Smuxi and I noticed a behavior where I am not sure if that is intended. When an IM indicator gets shown because of a new message and then another IM message from some other person, should all indicators disappear from the menu?
<meebey> when a indicator was clicked, that is
<meebey> see http://www.meebey.net/temp/smuxi/smuxi-0.8-dev-messaging-menu.png
<meebey> ok, I take that back, it looks like indicators have a timeout and expire at some point
<meebey> or its the garbage collector kicking in ^^
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> Certainly not all indicators have a timeout, and you should be able to have more than one indication active at once (xchat-gnome & gwibber both manage it)
<meebey> RAOF: do you know if subtype im has a timeout?
<RAOF> I don't believe it does, no.
 * meebey is now adding reference to the indicator objects to suppress garbage collection on them
<RAOF> Some of my empathy IM notifications have lasted for hours.
<meebey> ok
<meebey> RAOF: are you aware of focus issues with window managers?
<RAOF> I'm aware that kwin has an incredibly strict focus prevention algorithm, but apart from thatâ¦ no.
<meebey> RAOF: if a gtk status icon requests focus of the application window it will show it, with the messaging menu the WM seems to only indicator a focus change but is not doing it
<meebey> RAOF: I am using metacity with docky
<RAOF> WFM with mutter.
<meebey> RAOF: and I have seen horrible horrible code in xchat-gnome's messaging menu support to workaround that
<meebey> which I will avoid as I cant write such crappy code from C# ^^
<meebey> its sending X events
<RAOF> Urgh.
<meebey> yes
<meebey> thats what I thought too
<RAOF> But empathy, evolution, gwibber, and xchat-gnome all work for me.
<meebey> RAOF: I will check gwibbers code then
<meebey> RAOF: they no longer disappear, was the GC, bloddy managed languages
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> libindicator-cil should probably hang on to those references itself, then.
<meebey> why cant they leak like unmanaged languages? ^^
 * RAOF is a big fan of difficult-to-test-for crashes in p/invoke calls when the GC gets called during native code.
<meebey> hehe
<meebey> yeah that can be fun
<meebey> at least only the bridge needs to suffer, not the users of the resulting API
<RAOF> Right.
<RAOF> If it's done correctly!
<meebey> :)
<meebey> if someone cares, I find a small bug in the C# API
<meebey> Indicator.SetPropertyTime() has stupid parameters, worthless for C#
<meebey> Indicator.SetProperty(key, dateTime.ToString("s")) was to the rescue, passing a ISO 8601 conformant string
<meebey> g_time_val is not even exposed at all in GLib of GTK#
<meebey> RAOF: ping
<RAOF> Pongity.
<meebey> RAOF: do you have empathy with msg menu?
<RAOF> Yes.
<meebey> RAOF: does it show a icon or msg body for empathy indicators?
<RAOF> It shows the contact's avatar (if available) on the left, the contact's name, then the time since indicated.
<meebey> RAOF: ok thanks
<meebey> RAOF: code also passes body but the spec doesnt mention :)
<meebey> RAOF: so I was curious
<RAOF> It passes the body, too?  That might be for the notify-osd indication, if empathy doesn't use libnotify itself directly.
<RAOF> The body *does* show up in the notification, just not in the indicator.
<RAOF> (transient notification)
<meebey> RAOF: ic
<RAOF> I would have thought that empathy would talk to libnotify itself, but maybe not.
<meebey> so I will add icon and then I am done I think
<RAOF> Oh!  Twitter will have an icon available.  I was thinking âwhat icon are you going to use to separate different IRC channels?â
<meebey> RAOF: I was wrong
<meebey> RAOF: it checks and passes body for updating the timestamp
<meebey> its not passing the body to the indicator though
<RAOF> Ah.  That makes more sense.
<meebey> RAOF: smuxi has no avatar support yet, so I will only pass person or group chat icon for now
<meebey> RAOF: but yeah, latter it would be twitter avatar
<meebey> gar, the binding is lacking Indicator.SetPropertyIcon()
<meebey> ok I give up on icon for now, the C# API needs to be fixed
<Cimi> davidbarth: today's tasks?
<davidbarth> Cimi: hi
<davidbarth> Cimi: argb is next on the list
<davidbarth> Cimi: is the new gtk package ok now?
<Cimi> haven't tried it yet
<Cimi> I'm working with christian right now
<Cimi> to be prepared on monday, since he will be in the office (but he will leave on tuesday for the sprint)
<davidbarth> ah, right
<Cimi> davidbarth: ok I resurrected my maverick installaiton :)
<Cimi> and rgba works
<meebey> ok, I could workaround the absent inidicate_indicator_set_property_icon function in the CLI binding by reimplementing it in C#: http://www.meebey.net/temp/smuxi/smuxi-0.8-dev-messaging-menu.png
<meebey> wasn't as bad as I thought, it expects a base64 encoded png image
<meebey> besides the 2 API glitches I think libinidicate and messaging menu in general is well done!
<davidbarth> Cimi: ah, good to hear
<davidbarth> Cimi: can you resume the argb task then, adding the properties you discussed with Cody?
<davidbarth> Cimi: and there is also the notebook task i'd like to have some feedback on, ie knowing whether there is something to integrate and review, or whether it's blocked on a design refresh
<davidbarth> Cimi: i've created tasks for the work list we exchanged by emailed: https://bugs.launchpad.net/~cimi/+bugs?field.searchtext=&orderby=-importance&field.status:list=NEW&field.status:list=INCOMPLETE_WITH_RESPONSE&field.status:list=INCOMPLETE_WITHOUT_RESPONSE&field.status:list=CONFIRMED&field.status:list=TRIAGED&field.status:list=INPROGRESS&field.status:list=FIXCOMMITTED&assignee_option=any&field.assignee=&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_
<davidbarth> supervisor=&field.bug_commenter=&field.subscriber=&field.milestone:list=30877&field.tag=&field.tags_combinator=ANY&field.status_upstream-empty-marker=1&field.has_cve.used=&field.omit_dupes.used=&field.omit_dupes=on&field.affects_me.used=&field.has_patch.used=&field.has_branches.used=&field.has_branches=on&field.has_no_branches.used=&field.has_no_branches=on&search=Search
<davidbarth> and assigned them to you
<davidbarth> Cimi: you can use the bug log to exchange with christian and bratsche as well
<Cimi> davidbarth: for the notebook stuff
<Cimi> I will discuss with otto on tuesday
<davidbarth> Cimi: right, I understand this is blocked for the moment, so no worries if you can't make progresses on that yet
<Cimi> davidbarth: I think the modification for the icon size is trivial
<Cimi> davidbarth: maybe line 473?
<davidbarth> Cimi: which module/project?
<davidbarth> Cimi: last time we tried, there where a couple of modules that had to be touched, but libindicator was the main one i think, because this is where the helper code loads the icon
<Cimi> oh ok
#ayatana 2010-07-31
<aboSamoor> Hi, I pulled the latest unity version, but still away from this screenshot http://dl.dropbox.com/u/217582/Files%20Shared%20from%20GNOME%20Do/unity_dash01-1951205588.jpg ?
<Odd-rationale> Hello! I am developing an app that uses the Application Indicator. I read on the wiki page that the Application Indicator supports a fallback wich will create a GtkStatusIcon. However, when I tried running my application on a system without AppIndicator, I got an error message saying that it could not find libappindicator.so.0. Do you have to install something extra in order for it to work in
<Odd-rationale> non-Ubuntu systems? Thanks!
<hyperair> yes you do.
<hyperair> you need the libappindicator.so.0 library.
<Odd-rationale> hyperair: ok. so how is the best way to package my app for other systems that do not have libappindicator0 packaged?
<hyperair> Odd-rationale: you can bundle it in the sources, i believe.
<hyperair> Odd-rationale: your best bet is to package libappindicator0 for all other systems.
<Odd-rationale> hyperair: if i bundle in the source, would i have to maintain two separate packages, one for ubuntu systems and one for non-ubuntu systems?
<hyperair> Odd-rationale: not necessarily.
<hyperair> Odd-rationale: you bundle it in the source, but put a switch
<bratsche> In your configure scripts, just detect if the system has libappindicator installed.
<hyperair> a configure switch that allows switching between the bundled version and the non-bundled one.
<hyperair> and a manual switch.
<hyperair> so that package managers don't get bitten in the ass by automagic scripts not failing properly
<Odd-rationale> ok. so it would be a compile time option.
<hyperair> yes.
<Odd-rationale> that makes sense, now.
<Odd-rationale> So, if i detect that the system does not have libappindicator0, i would have to install libappindicator.so.0 into /usr/lib?
#ayatana 2010-08-01
<ivanka> Hello. Is anyone around?
<dutchie> er
<ivanka> hi dutchie
<dutchie> why are you called ivanka?
<ivanka> got me.
<dutchie> aha
<ivanka> I'm surprised I can easily change my nick
<dutchie> hello twitter
<ivanka> even registered ones
<dutchie> they can kick you off though
<ivanka> obviously the whois gives it away
<ivanka> but if I changed my real name and ran through a proxy, then I could easily impersonate someone else
<dutchie> see /msg NickServ help ghost
<dutchie> but it won't say using the account
<dutchie> eg:
<dutchie> 13:35:09 [freenode] -!-  account  : dutchie
<dutchie> in my whois
<ivanka> ?
<dutchie> http://pastebin.com/NM1i35gi
<dutchie> the whois outputs for both "ivanka" and dutchie
<ivanka> okay
<dutchie> unmasked ;)
<humphreybc> yes
<humphreybc> what does my info say now?
<dutchie> http://pastebin.com/2s1z4b5R
<zekopeko_> hi! is anyone noticing problems with minutes long disk access that lags the entire unity session?
#ayatana 2011-07-25
<didrocks> good morning
<MacSlow> greetings folks
<didrocks> Kaleo: hey!
<didrocks> so
<didrocks> qconf.cpp:#include <dconf-dbus-1.h>
<didrocks> but indeed, it doesn't link again it
<didrocks> weird that it doesn't segfault, isn't it?
<Kaleo> didrocks: yeah
<Kaleo> didrocks: it does with the qml example :/
<didrocks> but I mean, everything should segfault?
 * didrocks tries your example
<Kaleo> didrocks: we must be linking ourselves
<Kaleo> somehow
<didrocks> hum, indeedâ¦
<didrocks> but, then, that doesn't explain why it doesn't refresh
<didrocks> but let's try to fix that first
<didrocks> so, pkg_check_modules(DCONF_DBUS REQUIRED dconf-dbus-1)
<Kaleo> didrocks: separate issue :)
<didrocks> it still shouldn't pass the link at buildâ¦
<didrocks> it's not in target_link_libraries
<didrocks> let me try adding it there
<Kaleo> there is an error message when it should refresh and fails: "invalid type 0 not a basic type"
<didrocks> ah, ok, let's check for link first :)
<didrocks> dpkg-shlibdeps: avertissement: symbole g_queue_is_empty utilisÃ© par debian/libdconf-qt0/usr/lib/libdconf-qt.so.0.0.0 non trouvÃ© dans les bibliothÃ¨ques.
<didrocks> ohoh :)
<Kaleo> ou ouh
<Kaleo> didrocks: good catch
<didrocks> I still don't know why the build doesn't fail, this is shlibs which is run from the packaging, but it should fail before for not finding the symbolâ¦
<didrocks> ok, less warning messaging including glib
<didrocks> dconf_dbus_client_new is still one of them despite trying to include the lib
<didrocks> checking
<Kaleo> didrocks: my Oneiric just died
<Kaleo> didrocks: at the _perfect_ moment..
<didrocks> Kaleo: oh, how so?
<Kaleo> didrocks: no empty space
<didrocks> Kaleo: I fixed the dconf-qt linking issue btw, uploading a version and sending the patch to desrt
<Kaleo> didrocks: nice!
<didrocks> Kaleo: you can take latest dconf-qt if you want, but it's kind of workarounded by the unity-2d package linking against it IMHO
<Kaleo> didrocks: yeah it's not a biggie
<nerochiaro> Kaleo: are you alive ?
<Kaleo> nerochiaro: yes :)
<Kaleo> nerochiaro: I was out for lunch
<nerochiaro> Kaleo: seen my question on IRC ?
<nerochiaro> Kaleo: er, on jabber
<Kaleo> nerochiaro: nope I have not
<andyrock> hi all...
<andyrock> someone could tell me which is the reason for that http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2011/07/oneirics-session-menu-win/?
<Trevinho> andyrock: I guess that is not a bad idea, the problem is that the "power icon" is not suitable at all for a such thing
<Trevinho> Maybe a "settings" icon could be better
<Trevinho> but also the power one should b eshonw
<andyrock> maybe JohnLea could give me/us more information
<Trevinho> Yes, I guess...
<Viper550> Hello
<kim0> Hey folks, does anyone know what component/process is responsible for catching vol up/down keys and acting on them .. All such keyboard keys are not working for me
<nic_k> does anything ever happen in these chat rooms.
<nic_k> I see notices that you can come chat about things but nobody ever chats.
<Viper550> nic_k, I notice that too sometimes.
<Viper550> Amaranth, I noticed that as a consequence of the move to Gnome 3, we've lost customization controls
<Amaranth> What?
<Viper550> on Oneric, you can't change your theme (window border, or GTK) because Gnome 3 decided that changing themes was a thing of the past
<Viper550> Aside from that, I'm liking the changes on Oneiric so far
#ayatana 2011-07-26
<RAOF> Viper550: Yeah, you need to install gnome-tweak-tool to twiddle those knobs.
<Viper550> RAOF, I know ... but gnome-tweak-tool has shell and the like as its dependencies
<RAOF> Yeah.  That doesn't bother me though.  We should end up with something better than gnome-tweak-tool, though.
<thumper> phew...
<thumper> everything is working again
<jeffrash> quick question about the notification area in Unity.
<jeffrash> I've run into several apps that there icons just do not display in Unity
<jeffrash> is there a plan to address that problem?
<jeffrash> or are you going to require the individual app developer to add support for unity?
<didrocks> good morning
<oSoMoN> good morning
<andyrock> njpatel, around?
<njpatel> andyrock, hey
<njpatel> andyrock, did you have a chance to update your branch?
<andyrock> njpatel, i solved all conflicts (too many conflicts!) in ldevice branch
<njpatel> andyrock, nice!
 * njpatel looks
<andyrock> njpatel, My brother graduated a few days ago so i had no too much time, but i did
<njpatel> andyrock, no worries, dude, family > code ;)
<njpatel> andyrock, I have one meeting now but I'll merge this right after, thank you!
<andyrock> njpatel, thank you too :) goog meeting... see you
<njpatel> andyrock, merged, thank you :D
<andyrock> njpatel, thx you againg :)
<andyrock> JohnLea, ping
<JohnLea> andyrock, pong
<andyrock> JohnLea, about this bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ayatana-design/+bug/750311
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 750311 in unity "Launcher - When a item is deleted by dragging to Trash, the trash should pulse once before the Launcher disappears" [Low,In progress]
<andyrock> could you give me more information?
<andyrock> for example the color of the background...
<JohnLea> andyrock; The pulse should be one cycle of the 'loading' pulse, same background colour, same in all respects other than it only pulses once
<andyrock> JohnLea, ok... it should pulse only if the dragged item belong to launcher?
<JohnLea> andyrock; it should pulse in response to both normal files being moved into the trash,  launcher items being removed, and usb key's ejected.  Basically it should always pulse
<andyrock> JohnLea, ok ok... thx!
<JohnLea> andyrock; no thank you ;-)
<andyrock> JohnLea, mmm... i cannot test dnd from destkop to launcher trash icon as it is break in trunk!
<andyrock> someone could confirm? ^^^
<om26er> DBO, is current ctrl+tab switcher supposed to move to alt+tab ?
<DBO> om26er, when it is feature complete yes
<om26er> DBO, thx, its looking good btw :)
<andyrock> someone could tell me how build unity-window-decorator from sources?
<andyrock> i get errors...
<mgedmin> andyrock, if you could paste the build log somewhere like http://paste.ubuntu.com/, we might hazard a guess
<andyrock> http://paste.ubuntu.com/652472/
<andyrock> mgedmin, ???
<andyrock> ^^^
<mgedmin> okay, I haven't seen that one
<mgedmin> does it help if you try 'make' without -j2 ?
 * mgedmin <- not a unity developer, just a bystander
<andyrock> i think not... -j2 is for using two core :)
<mgedmin> yes, but some makefiles are buggy and do not support parallel builds
<mgedmin> and since I didn't see any errors about missing include files, I've no other ideas why those types would be undefined
<mgedmin> perhaps one of the knowledgeable people will wake up and be able to help you better
<andyrock> i've tried without -j2 but i get anyway the error
<njpatel> andyrock, you did sudo apt-get build-dep compiz?
<jcastro> andyrock: hi! Looking for me earlier, sorry I've been moving house for the past week, I am back now though
<njpatel> andyrock, jcastro is lying, he's a slacker!
<jcastro> njpatel: no more vacations for you, when you leave no one merges!
<njpatel> I had a vacation? I was unwell!
<njpatel> jcastro, it's weird, right? Like they forget *every* week
<jcastro> njpatel: right, holiday, sick, whatever. :)
<jcastro> j/k glad to have you back
<jcastro> njpatel: anything notable over the last 2 weeks? We're working on the report now
<didrocks> jcastro: I updated the desktop team meeting report in case it can help
<njpatel> jcastro, andyrock's device stuff is in, first cut of alt+tab (well, ctrl+tab right now), lots more fixes,
<njpatel> jcastro, the real fun starts from this and next week ;)
<jcastro> heh
<jcastro> http://pad.ubuntu.com/unity-report-26Jul
<jcastro> I just need to add the desktop team report bits
<jcastro> njpatel: check it out
<njpatel> jcastro, perfecto
<andyrock> njpatel, smspillaz is helping about unity window decorator
<njpatel> andyrock, sweet
<jcastro> DBO: does the download bar and emblem stuff all work on new alt-tab?
<jcastro> if you have a screenshot handy that would be awesome
<njpatel> jcastro, ping me
<jcastro> njpatel: ping
<njpatel> jcastro,  at least the emblem works
<njpatel> jcastro, what uses the progress stuff?
<njpatel> i can make a screenshot, dbo is at the dentist
<jcastro> ubuntu one does
<jcastro> oh
<jcastro> and update-manager
<njpatel> okay, ping me again
<jcastro> njpatel: ping
<njpatel> jcastro, so no download yet, let me give you the shot, hold up
<njpatel> jcastro, http://goo.gl/AkGfF
<jcastro> what's up with that xchat icon?
<Trevinho> Oh, I'm just arrived at home... Meeting in progress? :P
<njpatel> jcastro, needs a nicer one
<njpatel> jcastro, we're going to see a lot of that now with this new switcher...maybe it'll kick some people up the butt to make nice icons :)
<njpatel> Trevinho, !
<njpatel> how are you dude?
<Trevinho> Fine thanks njpatel
<njpatel> Trevinho, ted told me about the middle-click stuf on the indicator...very cool idea
<njpatel> (tying it to a menuitem)
<Trevinho> ehehe
<Trevinho> It was a very asked thing
<njpatel> yep
<Trevinho> I've implemented it in all the framework... unity and unity-2d included :P
<njpatel> i saw...nice one!
<Trevinho> Also if actually just the indicator-sound uses it
<njpatel> but appindicator supports it too right?
<Trevinho> I'd like to use also for other stuffs, like the nautilus progress dialog, or other indicators
<njpatel> so it's available to everyone
<jcastro> njpatel: the app icons I'm not as worried about as I am of webapp icons, which look horrible even on the launcher, let alone alt-tab
<Trevinho> to get faster user experience
<Trevinho> yes njpatel
<Trevinho> but an appindicator must associate a menuitem to that signal
<njpatel> yep
<njpatel> i really like that
<Trevinho> so we're sure that an option is available also as menu-item
<Trevinho> and not only as a secnodary-activate "plus"
<njpatel> right
<Trevinho> Basically a gtk widget that can be activated, that is enabled, visible and clickable and that is a child of the main menu can be used
<Trevinho> Unfortunately working on this stuff involves to work on many, many projects, but we must do that
<Trevinho> jcastro: can you include the indicator secondary-activate support in report too?
<Trevinho> :P
<jcastro> is that the middle click thing?
<jcastro> I've already submitted it, mind if I just put it in next week's?
<Trevinho> Already submitted? Ah, I didn't read
<Trevinho> Ah, jcastro this week I also resumed the support for scrolling over the indicators which was broken...
<jcastro> ok, from now on idle here and I'll ping you before hand. :)
<jcastro> I always miss something you're working on, heh
<Trevinho> No problem...
<Trevinho> Ah, and for unity-2d there's also a fix for supporting scrolling over the indicators (that has never worked before)
<jcastro> Trevinho: oh I know, when it comes up on OMG just leave a comment with all the goodies
<jcastro> njpatel: man dude, the overflow collapsing on the alt-tab is so nice
<jcastro> it's like a sideways launcher
<Trevinho> Ah, ok... No problem... I just want you to know them, since you don't have to think I'm sleeping :D
<jcastro> Trevinho: it's ok, we all know you're working harder than tedg
<Trevinho> lol... No, tedg is my mentor and improves all my things! :)
<njpatel> jcastro, exactly :)
<Trevinho> njpatel: I've also started working on something about panelview and indicators
<API> didrocks, njpatel after an update I was not able to start the system using unity, I'm not talking about the repositories, it also happens with the deb packages
<API> is this normal, or something specific to my environment?
<Trevinho> The entries need to move, and not to be shown "per indicator"....
<didrocks> API: how long ago was it?
<didrocks> API: there is a light-themes package which shoul workaround the issue
<API> didrocks, you mean when I updated the packages?
<didrocks> yeah :)
<Trevinho> So that unity-panel-serivice defines the order to show them, while the panel shows them correctly...
<API> some hours ago
<didrocks> API: hum, unity didn't change from last Thursday and compiz for a week, you didn't update before?
<didrocks> API: I guess you are in the case of people who are still impacted even with the workaround
<didrocks> njpatel: ^^
<njpatel> Trevinho, what?! :)
<njpatel> API, does unity print anything out?
<API> didrocks, I have the more recent light-themes package
<didrocks> ok, so you are part of those where it doesn't workaround
<njpatel> API, do this:
<njpatel> API, killlall -9 unity-window-decorator; gtk-window-decorator --replace&
<njpatel> API, killall -9 compiz; compiz --replace&;
<njpatel> and see what happens
<API> njpatel,
<API> http://pastebin.com/85PeAzpm
<API> output of unity > log.txt
<API> http://pastebin.com/TEYxAgsf
<API> output of unity --replace 2> log.txt
<API> and now I will test your suggestion
<tedg> njpatel, Using the name_hints to do ordering instead of the just library names.  So that things like network manager can be in the proper location.
<Trevinho> njpatel: As discussed at the UDS session about indicators, there's should be a way to show some "system" appindicators (i.e. nm-applet) in the correct order. As they are app-indicators, and so entries of the indicator appindicator they would be shown in order as the indicator orders them. But there's no way to put some of them between indicator-messages and indicator-datetime (for example). So I'm
<Trevinho>  doing this, as tedg told me that this is something that is just up to unity
<njpatel> tedg, Trevinho sounds like fun
<njpatel> tremolux, sweet
<API> njpatel, about the first:
<API> unity-window-decorator: no process found
<Trevinho> njpatel: Basically I actually done something where the panel service tells to unity the order of each entry (if known)
<Trevinho> so the panel should respect that given order too
<njpatel> API, no problem, just start gtk-window-decorator --replace& then
<njpatel> tremolux, hmm, the order is inferred by the order in which the data is sent
<njpatel> Trevinho, ^
<njpatel> tremolux, sorry :)
<njpatel> Trevinho, the other issue is that panel expects all entries to stay inside their object
<njpatel> indicator-object*
<njpatel> Trevinho, its going to be a bit harder to make that work right :/
<Trevinho> I know
<Trevinho> In fact I was thinking, at the beginning, of crating some "fake" indicator-objects
<Trevinho> but tedg told me that we should just use the name...
<njpatel> Trevinho, that would work, you could keep a space for the nm menu
<njpatel> Trevinho, no, I mean create a "fake" object in the panel-service
<Trevinho> Yes, but it would be a workaround however... And not only that menu has to be moved
<njpatel> Trevinho, yep
<Trevinho> Mh, I'd redesign that completely...
<njpatel> hmm
<Trevinho> Mh, I'll try to continue what I've in my mind
<Trevinho> then if it works I'll show you my code...
<njpatel> coolio
<joey> alejandra: ping
<joey> or dbarth ping
<joey> nhandler: these are two good contacts for you re: your question ^^
<nhandler> alejandra, dbarth: Since I'm going to be running out and I want to minimize the back-and-forth, I'm essentially trying to find a good channel to forward #ubuntu-app-devel too. I was originally thinking to forward it here, but joey didn't feel it would be a good fit. What do you guys think?
<czajkowski> alejandra: hey you about ??
<alejandra> czajkowski, hey laura!
<czajkowski> alejandra: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-website/+bug/816041  not sure who to assign that to
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 816041 in Ubuntu Website "Reason to become a partner is missing " [Undecided,New]
<alejandra> czajkowski, hey laura, should be in ubuntu-website-content
<czajkowski> alejandra: for assigning ?
<alejandra> czajkowski, ellen arnold please
<alejandra> czajkowski, (new web project manager)
<czajkowski> won't let me :/
<API> njpatel, well, I think that I have waited enough ;), sorry no luck, it gets also frozen, on the terminal the last step that I see is "Initializating session options: done"
<njpatel> API, hmm, that doesn't make sense :/
<njpatel> didrocks, switching gtk-window-decorator didn't work either :/
<didrocks> njpatel: hum, weird. API: does using another session, like ubuntu 2d works?
<API> didrocks, well, I'm right now writing on the IRC, so yes
<API> I didn't test ubuntu 2D
<API> GNOME (so gnome-shell) and gnome classic (without effects)
<API> worked
<API> AFAIR, gnome classic
<API> with effects also failed
<API> I will test it
<didrocks> API: and starting unity from there? with gtk-w-d from the start?
<API> didrocks, ok, I will try gnome classic without effects
<didrocks> (you can change that in ccsm to force this decorator)
<API> execute gtk-window-decorator by hand
<API> and then run unity --replace
<didrocks> yeah, that should work
<API> ok, I will try
 * API trying
<API> didrocks, well, I have just run unity --replace
<API> but it seems frozen again
<didrocks> API: did you run the gtk-w-d before?
<API> that should work fine or it is normal waiting for some time
<API> didrocks, yes I executed gtk-window-decorator before
<API> that should work fine or it is normal waiting for some time ?
 * API I forget that question mark
<didrocks> yeah, it should work
<API> :/
<didrocks> njpatel: seems there is another issue then ^^
<API> fwiw using top
<API> compiz consumes 95-100% CPU
<njpatel> wtf
<didrocks> yeah, seems related to the latest compiz then
<API> and btw, I also had some problems with gnome-settings-daemon
<API> well, in order to add more info now, recently I moved to 64 bits
<API> althouth some weeks ago when I bought
<API> it
<API> I was able to get unity running here
<API> njpatel, didrocks gdb backtrace of the frozen compiz
<API> http://pastebin.com/JeGVMkcF
<njpatel> jay!
<njpatel> jaytaoko, dude ^
<njpatel> please help API with that
<API> njpatel, well, the weird thing is that it is happening only to me, as far as I see
<API> as I said this is using unity & nux from the repositories
<API> ...
<API> I will try then with the sources
<njpatel> API, maybe something is missing or it could just be a memory error, jaytaoko would know for sure
<Casper8> Hello
<Casper8> I'd like to make developers of unity with access to the code aware of a very easy to fix and confirmed memory leak bug - if this a good place to do so. I'm afraid otherwise this fix won't be included in the 11.10 release, seeing that it such a trivial fix.
<API> njpatel, ok, anyway I will need to go home soon
<API> should I send a mail to jay, or just create a bug?
<njpatel> API, create a bug and assign to jay :)
<API> njpatel, ok
<API> and thanks
<Casper8> Any unity coders in here? I've got a one liner fix for a confirmed memory leak bug in unity.
<andyrock> Casper8, do you have a merging proposal?
<Casper8> yes, thanks for your time, here it is: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/812975
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 812975 in unity (Ubuntu) "found memory leak in code" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<andyrock> Casper8, this a bug report... you should open a branch
<Casper8> oh im sorry, im only responding to a suggestion in the report which pointed me to IRC
<Casper8> not sure what to do then, thanks anyway :)
<andyrock> Casper8, maybe you could ping a unity developer (i'm just a unity community contributor)
<andyrock> and suggets him your patch...
<andyrock> but using bzr is better according to me :)
<Casper8> andyrock, how do I ping a unity developer? no idea really
<andyrock> ping + name of the developer :)
<andyrock> but i can help you with bzr
<Casper8> andyrock, I don't want to 'annoy' the developer or be spammy, so if it's not a good idea to this, I'm ok with it being simply in launchpad
<andyrock> Casper8, indeed
<andyrock> if you want i can help you in putting your patch in launchpad ;)
<Casper8> andyrock, thanks I'll do that
<andyrock> Casper8, ping me when you need support
<Casper8> oh sorry, I misread - can you make a patch for me? I mean it's just one line
<Casper8> ok ill make a patch later this week and I can ping you?
<andyrock> i can make a patch for you if you want but it is not correct and fair :)
<andyrock> it is better if you make the patch and put it on launchpad
<andyrock> :)
<jaytaoko> njpatel: hello
<Casper8> andyrock, ok I'll make a patch later this week
<andyrock> Casper8, ok ok
<jaytaoko> API: hi!
<API> jaytaoko, hi
<API> im planning to create a bug with all the info
<API> just in case
<API> before of that I will compile again from the sources
<jaytaoko> API: What is the problem that you are having? is this a crash?
<API> jaytaoko,
<API> no
<API> compiz get frozen
<API> I already waited for some minutes
<API> I included a backtrace
<API> but it was a backtrace of the compiz running
<ephan> hey
<API> jaytaoko, I have just created the bug
<API> https://bugs.launchpad.net/nux/+bug/816589
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 816589 in Nux "Unity gets frozen on startup" [Undecided,New]
<API> sorry, I need to go home
<API> thanks, and by
<API> e
<jaytaoko> API: thanks!
<API> jaytaoko, you are welcome
<Trevinho> jaytaoko: did you see my PM :P
<ephan> I'm just wondering, is there anybody portuguese on this channel?
#ayatana 2011-07-27
<Trevinho> jaytaoko: I sent the merge request...
<Trevinho> However with latest Nux I can't run compiz...
<Trevinho> I meant unity....
<Trevinho> I guess the problem is one of the most recent changes, since I pull just few new changes and compiz didn't load at all (keeping my CPU at 100%)
<jaytaoko> Trevinho: I will review your branch with an up to date Nux branch. I will pull all the latest changes to Nux and Unity.
<didrocks> good morning
<jaytaoko> didrocks: bonjour!
<didrocks> salut jaytaoko! Ã§a va ?
<jaytaoko> didrocks: yeah, no problem...
<jaytaoko> didrocks: but it is time for bed now! cheers
<didrocks> jaytaoko: have a good night!
<MacSlow> greetings
<oSoMoN> good morning
<andyrock> good morning
<apw> am i expecting to have lost ctrl-alt-T as a keybinding in oneiric
<apw> am i expecting to have lost the Reboot option from the power menu in oneiric
<ephan> apw, no you're not. I think those maintan
<didrocks> apw: reboot will be when dx will implement the new shutdown dialog from design
<didrocks> apw: ctrl-alt-T is because there is no moe integration and such shortcuts in GNOME3
<didrocks> you can still set that manually in ccsm though, in the "gnomecompat" plugin
<apw> didrocks, you'd think we could have kept the reboot option on the menu till we had the new functionality
<apw> least supprise and all that
<didrocks> apw: seems the new indicator-session release landed before that
<apw> didrocks, or we could have pointed the Shutdown... to the same thing that the power button opens
<apw> as that has all the options one might want even if its as ugly as an ugly thing
<didrocks> apw: not sure as you have all the others options there as well, what we really need is the new dialog
<apw> hmmm, perhaps some coordination then if we arn't going to try and make this thing easy to use for people
<didrocks> apw: btw, while you are there, I have a recurrent issue (like 50% of the time), having no network at startup, seems to be the iwl3945 river not being correctly loaded. I have to unload it and load it again. There is a bug, but no activity (see dx isn't the only one)
<didrocks> also, there is this dkms not working with nvidia-current for each kernel upgrade
<apw> didrocks, binary drivers luckily arn't my problem :)
<apw> didrocks, whats the bug number for the iwl problem
<didrocks> apw: you are quite lucky. However, dkms not being executed is, isn't it?
<seb128> apw, it's only an unstable cycle and it's not like it was hard to restart
<apw> didrocks, not being run would be indeed
<didrocks> and rebooting without any graphic isn't nice for our user, that's the kinf of transition user are list as well :)
<seb128> apw, log out and restart from the login screen, or switch to a vt and ctrl-alt-del
<apw> seb128, i don't have any working buttons on my login screen, i am told i'll get those back eventually
<seb128> apw, should be fixed with yesterday's update
<apw> didrocks, whats the bug number for the dkms not running one
<seb128> works for me at least
<apw> seb128, cool i'll do more updating
<didrocks> apw: not sure about the dkms, I didn't report it, let me look for the wifi driver one first
<didrocks> apw: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/803815
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 803815 in linux (Ubuntu) "[iwl3945] direct probe timeout" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<RAOF> didrocks, apw: You're looking for bug #812979
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 812979 in dkms (Ubuntu) "Kernel modules are not built when the kernel is upgraded" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/812979
<didrocks> RAOF: thanks :)
<apw> RAOF, ahh so that was a dkms issue?  new kernel version number the cause ?
<RAOF> apw: No.  It doesn't try to parse the kernel version number, it just totally ignores it.
<RAOF> So you say âbuild me the module for 3.0.0-7-genericâ and it happily goes ahead and says âI see you're running 3.0.0-6-generic, and the nvidia-current module is already built for that kernel.  My work here is (silently!) done!â
<RAOF> I'm not sure how it was ever supposed to work; presumably someone did something that was frightfully clever recently and accidentally broke it.
<ephan> So if I got it, GNOME 3 does not support shortcuts?
<ephan> I'm probably confused, as this can't be right
<didrocks> ephan: there is no shortcut you can tweak in g-c-c, so no way to integrate and such them in compiz
<ephan> ah I see didrocks
<ephan> I personally haven't tried the Alpha 2 to check for bugs, but I feel like I have to
<ephan> in a few days
<apw> RAOF, heh that is top quality, glad it gotten fixed, might explain the random failures of it we have had in the past too
<snadge> that could explain why i've had to manually force dkms rebuilds
<snadge> id also like to randomly say .. good job for improving the linux desktop with some much overdue changes, and actually doing it, despite the overlap problems with gnome etc
<apw> didrocks, next time you hit this iwl3945 problem could you just rmmod the driver and re-modprobe it, it should not be necessary to restart nm if this is a driver issue; i do this with a problem brcm device often
<didrocks> apw: oh ok, will try that
<didrocks> apw: it appeared with -3 I would say
<andyrock> njpatel, around?
<njpatel> andyrock, hey
<andyrock> njpatel, i was reading dood tweet about eject/safely remove stuff
<njpatel> yep
<andyrock> njpatel, for safely remove we use g_drive_stop and we use also the GAsyncReadyCallback
<njpatel> right
<andyrock> but the GAsyncReadyCallback is not useful since we don't read the result of the operation :)
<njpatel> andyrock, that's fine, we can just not send it then :)
<andyrock> so, we don't need the GAsyncReadyCallback and we can remove it?
<andyrock> njpatel, or we can make it useful adding logging information...
<njpatel> andyrock, logging information would be good
<njpatel> andyrock, is it done inside the device-icon or the devices manager?
<andyrock> njpatel, P.S.: according to me "eject" item for usb drives is a gnome bug
<andyrock> njpatel, device-icon
<njpatel> ah, nice
<njpatel> andyrock, okay, makes sense
<andyrock> njpatel, you want port devices manager (and favorites one) into unity core?
<njpatel> andyrock, hmm, not sure what unity-2d use
<njpatel> andyrock, i'm not sure they use gio at all
<njpatel> andyrock, favorites store would be good, yes
<njpatel> andyrock, also, having another look at the favourites store tests would be good, maybe porting to the gtest suite
<andyrock> nerochiaro, gtest suite?
<andyrock> njpatel, ^^^
<andyrock> nerochiaro, sorry :)
<nerochiaro> andyrock: no problem
<njpatel> andyrock, yeah, the test-gtest binary that uses google test instead of glibtest
<andyrock> njpatel, ok ok
<njpatel> andyrock, (see any of my mere proposals that are pending for how to do it)
<h_> hi there
<ephan> hey h_
<h_> hi ephan, dont know if this is the place to ask but.....
<h_> do you have any experience on writing appindicators for Natty?
<ephan> For Natty? No
<ephan> Only for the good old gnome-panel
<h_> ok
<h_> anyways, do you know if it was possible to display other gtk widgets than a classic dropdown menu?
<h_> like buttons, maybe a container box, etc
<h_> because it seems that it's not possible in Natty
<ephan> If it isn't and you'd like it, go to launchpad.net and add that to the wishlist in Unity or Ubuntu (not sure on which one)
<ephan> But I do not know if you can
<h_> ok
<h_> and one more question, what is ayatana ?
<ephan> The Ayatana Project is the collective project that houses user interface, design and interaction projects started by Canonical.
<ephan> https://launchpad.net/ayatana More information there
<h_> good
<h_> ephan, how to i access any of this irc channels http://live.gnome.org/GnomeIrcChannels#GNOME_Software_Development?
<ephan> h_, not sure if that question should be posed in this channel. Nevertheless, I'll answer you. Those servers are irc.gnome.org. #ayatana is on FreeNode. You need a new server tab and connect to irc.gnome.org.
<h_> thanks
<c10ud> so, oneiric features a new messaging menu or whatever, is there some docs about it?
<c10ud> thanks :D
<c10ud> (people have been asking emesene support, i guess you changed something from natty...)
<jcastro> c10ud: I think the -me menu stuff was just merged with the messaging menu
<jcastro> afaik you don't need to do anything
<jcastro> tedg: right?
<c10ud> i really hope people at least tried before opening the bug :p
<jcastro> heh, or ask them to try to reproduce it
<c10ud> they even posted a screenshot .p
<jcastro> link?
<tedg> c10ud, I ported over the old code, but I didn't test it.
<c10ud> sure, sec
<tedg> c10ud, It might be that the module isn't loaded, the different backends are loadable now.
<jcastro> maybe it's a bug
<c10ud> tedg, out of curiosity, any reason on why the thing can't be done backwards (?) i mean, memenu throws a signal and apps behave accordingly
<jcastro> because ted knows that if we were going to force every app author to update their apps (again), that I would kill him.
<c10ud> yeah well i mean like...when it was engineered
<tedg> c10ud, Well, you can just the telepathy-mission-control to get that... it sends all those signal.
<c10ud> anyway, jcastro: https://github.com/emesene/emesene/issues/745
<tedg> c10ud, I don't remember, but I think that the gnome-session interface does as well.  Though, I'm not sure if we're tied into that yet.
<c10ud> i see, it just came up to my mind when i suddenly remembered ubuntu code was modified to support emesene as well
<jcastro> who ported it the first time around, was it cando?
<c10ud> iirc, yes
<tedg> This is the new package: indicator-status-provider-emesene
<c10ud> thank you, so basically we just have to tell our ubuntu packagers to add a dep on that
<jcastro> oh that's easy, that's not even an emesene issue
<jcastro> kenvandine: heya, can you put this on the desktop team volunteer queue?
<tedg> No, if you guys want, you can pull that code into emesne so that it gets maintained there.
<tedg> Not sure what makes sense, but it doesn't have to be in the indicator source anymore.
<c10ud> mh, i don't know how it is done, but we wanted to rel a new version this month and we were trying to put support for oneiric
<c10ud> src is some c-lib i guess?
<tedg> c10ud, Yup, one file though.
<c10ud> well, for oneiric i'll just ask our debian packager to put some hard dep on the already-avail package, then we'll see, maybe we could do it backwards in future, who knows :p
<c10ud> thanks for the fast replies tedg jcastro
<jcastro> rock.
<jcastro> c10ud: is the package maintained in ubuntu or just synced from debian, do you know?
<c10ud> no idea, last thing i remember about it is cando patching the memenu and the patch being accepted upstream
<c10ud> (i'm still with lucid :p)
<jcastro> ok if I see cando around I'll holla at him
<jcastro> but I suspect fixing it in debian will just require a sync from our end and we'll be good to go
<c10ud> jcastro, i think you meant emesene package, not indicator-*-emesene
<c10ud> if that's the case, i don't know, sometimes i got the ubuntu package sooner than debian
<c10ud> but i know for sure who the debian packager is (devfil) so i'll take care of it
<c10ud> thanks again
<ephan> Ubuntu 11.04 Dash, how to force it to hide?
<ephan> It just won't hide
<jcastro> Trevinho: heh, someone was complaining about the chromium bug again
<ephan> which bug jcastro ?
<czajkowski> the fact it eats memory
<Trevinho> jcastro: who? :)
<Trevinho> jcastro: who? :)
<jcastro> it was on the omg post for the last unity report
<jcastro> do you have any new information to add?
<Trevinho> However If I've enough time before leaving for the holideys I'd like to work on that too
<jcastro> I basically was like "yeah, we know"
<Trevinho> The right answwer was: we fixed, but then DBO reverted it not to fix a side-effect seg-fault :D
<Trevinho> lol
<Trevinho> No, really we'd like to get a proper fix for chromium again
<Trevinho> I should ask them in google code to change something that they changed for us
<DBO> ?
<DBO> what?
<DBO> the chromium thing is currently unmerged?
<Trevinho> DBO: just jocking....
<DBO> im confused
 * DBO goes back to his corner
<Trevinho> It was, but you had to revert something which lead to a segfault
<Trevinho> There's something that must be fixed properly
<Trevinho> However jcastro  the main issue is related to the fact that libwnck that we use doesn't give us all the wm_class informations we need
<Trevinho> I've already sent to their bugzilla a patch to fix this, but they only reviewed and I'm still waiting for the merge
<DBO> Trevinho, do you want I to just write you a X call instead?
<Trevinho> so I guess we should use a temporary X call
<DBO> I dont mind us using raw X calls
<DBO> yes
<Trevinho> I already done that
<Trevinho> (but in my private branch)
<Trevinho> So, this is not a problem...
<Trevinho> However since we didn't get the proper informations by chromium, we asked them to wrongly use the WM_CLASS
<Trevinho> and so now they use this parameter in a non-standard way
<Trevinho> and we should ask them to revert what they've done...
<ephan> By the way guys, do we have an option for the time the dash takes to appear, so how quickly it pops out?
<ephan> jcastro, you're the one who made the new Alt+TAB right? either way my question is, do you speak portuguese?
<RAOF> DBO: Oh!  Was that dash bug the same problem as Jay's clipping thingy on older radeons?
<DBO> RAOF, which clipping thingy?
<DBO> where only the background and maybe one icon would show?
<DBO> yes
<DBO> that bug
<RAOF> Oh, hurray!
<DBO> as I was working on the blur effect
<DBO> it just became clear what was happening
<DBO> so hows your back?
<RAOF> Annoying.
<RAOF> Even more so because it happened while I was sleeping.  What the hell!
<DBO> i've done that
<DBO> I've also done it picking up a towel
<DBO> and attempting to jump into a pair of pants (I deserved that one)
<RAOF> Sorry?  *Jump* into a pair of pants?
<DBO> yeah you know
<DBO> hold the pair of pants with two arms
<DBO> lift both legs off the ground
<DBO> land with pants on
<RAOF> No.  No, I don't know.
<DBO> you cant tell me you were never curious as a kid to know if it were possible
<DBO> well I figure, Im an adult now, and I get to decide what mature means to me
<RAOF> I am curious about many things, but whether or not I can jump into pants has never been one of them.
<DBO> long story short
<DBO> no, you cannot easily jump into a pair of pants
<RAOF> Not the winner that it so clearly appeared to be? :)
<DBO> no, it's not a big time saver actually
<DBO> in fact you'll probably spend the better part of the day wondering if you back could possibly hurt more
#ayatana 2011-07-28
<Anil> hello guys
<thumper> DBO: I'm sure I've jumped into a pair of pants before
<DBO> thumper, see
<DBO> men, we try these things
<thumper> :)
<thumper> I'm heading home now (from town)
<DBO> so was yours a success?
<thumper> half I think
<thumper> I got both legs in, but not all the way
<didrocks> good morning
<MacSlow> ola
<andyrock> good morning
<ephan> morning andyrock
<andyrock> ephan, hey
<ephan> andyrock, I'm new in this channel
<andyrock> njpatel, ping
<andyrock> njpatel, i'm porting TestFavoriteStoreGSettings to googletest
<andyrock> njpatel, it's a WIP http://paste.ubuntu.com/653673/
<andyrock> do you think it's ok?
 * njpatel looks
<njpatel> andyrock, yes, excellent start!
<andyrock> andyrock, i will add it to test-gtest
<andyrock> andyrock, or i have to create another bin?
<njpatel> andyrock, speaking to youself?
<njpatel> andyrock, add it to test-gtest :)
<andyrock> njpatel, ops... sorry :) xchat should avoid these things...
<njpatel> heh
<didrocks> API: hey, with accessibility enabled, I get some dbusmenu crash. Not sure to what component I should set that, can you have a look? bug #817477
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 817477 in unity (Ubuntu) "unity-panel-service crashed with SIGSEGV in main_arena()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/817477
<andyrock> with the last commits i get error when i try to build unity
<andyrock> http://paste.ubuntu.com/653745/
<ephan> Which reminds me where can Unity source be downloaded?
<andyrock> bzr branch lp:unity
<andyrock> ephan, ^^^
<ephan> oh thanks
<ephan> I still need all the dependencies, don't have them on this comp
<ephan> http://paste.ubuntu.com/653749/ I read somewhere it's all these
<API> didrocks, ok
<API> lamalex, would you prefer if I find anything else to review that a11y branch?
<API> didrocks, probably your bug is a duplicate of this one https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/810039
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 810039 in unity (Ubuntu) "unity-panel-service crash with a11y enabled on Unity at Oneiric" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<API> didrocks, in fact I will set your bug as a duplicate
<didrocks> API: mine has the stacktrace if needed :)
<API> didrocks, well, yes, but the other is older ;)
<API> but you are right
<API> the one that you pointed
<didrocks> API: as you wish, I don't care :)
<API> have more info
<API> I will close the older as a duplicate
<didrocks> API: are you working on it for alpha3?
<ephan> Speaking of bugs, I reported https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dmz-cursor-theme/+bug/817435 today
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 817435 in dmz-cursor-theme (Ubuntu) "mouse cursor is not black" [Undecided,New]
<ephan> Also everybody, may I know what Unity 2D and 3D are? I do not know the difference
<API> njpatel, didrocks, I'm having a problem compiling unity from the source code:
<API>                  from /home/devel/Unity/source/last/unity/plugins/unityshell/src/QuicklistView.cpp:21:
<API> ...
<API> /usr/include/sigc++-2.0/sigc++/functors/mem_fun.h:2126:12: note:   candidate expects 5 arguments, 6 provided
<API> /usr/include/sigc++-2.0/sigc++/adaptors/adaptor_trait.h:189:75: error: return-statement with a value, in function returning 'void' [-fpermissive]
<API> make[2]: *** [tests/CMakeFiles/test-quicklist.dir/__/plugins/unityshell/src/QuicklistView.cpp.o] Error 1
<API> make[1]: *** [tests/CMakeFiles/test-quicklist.dir/all] Error 2
<API> seems a problem of a change on Nux that was not still synced on unity
<didrocks> I thought jay fixed it?
<API> although it is also true that this is just for test-quicklist
<didrocks> I would say, just disable it for now
<API> didrocks, there is a way to disable tests, or do you mean just edit by hand CMakeLists.txt?
<didrocks> API: by hand unfortunately AFAIK
<API> ;)
<API> didrocks, ok, thanks
<didrocks> yw :)
<ephan> guys, as I'm new here, I'd like to know something. Do you most of you work for Canonical?
<API> jaytaoko, Im having this problem compiling last nux:unity:
<API> PI>                  from /home/devel/Unity/source/last/unity/plugins/unityshell/src/QuicklistView.cpp:21:
<API> <API> ...
<API> <API> /usr/include/sigc++-2.0/sigc++/functors/mem_fun.h:2126:12: note:   candidate expects 5 arguments, 6 provided
<API> <API> /usr/include/sigc++-2.0/sigc++/adaptors/adaptor_trait.h:189:75: error: return-statement with a value, in function returning 'void' [-fpermissive]
<API> <API> make[2]: *** [tests/CMakeFiles/test-quicklist.dir/__/plugins/unityshell/src/QuicklistView.cpp.o] Error 1
<API> <API> make[1]: *** [tests/CMakeFiles/test-quicklist.dir/all] Error 2
<API> <API> seems a problem of a change on Nux that was not still synced on unity
<API> didrocks mentioned that you were working on something related to that
<jaytaoko> API: hello
<ephan> API, lots of other people complained already they can't compile
<ephan> Because of that same error
<API> ephan, ah ok
<API> sorry I had some problems today with the net
<API> and I didn't connect until know
<API> s/know/now
<ephan> Which reminds me, what's the release date of Alpha 3
<ephan> August, 4th
<jaytaoko> API: I am checking the unity trunk...
<API> jaytaoko, ok
<Trevinho> jaytaoko: is the branch I sent fine?
<lucazade> Trevinho: with latest updates of unity-2d your patch for scrollwhell on sound-indicator doesn't work anymore or better scroll-up and down are inverted
<jaytaoko> API: A branch was merged in unity trunk and that branch required a compatible Nux branch to be merged in unity... I will push the nux branch shortly... sorry about this
<API> jaytaoko, ok, no problem
<API> just warned here to check if was just my problem
<Trevinho> lucazade: In unity-2d or unity?
<lucazade> Trevinho: in unity-2d
<Trevinho> For sure that issue was in unity, since nux inverted they scrolling events
<Trevinho> However, I don't know how they implemented in unity-2d as I heard they moved to unity-panel-service too
<lucazade> haven't tried yet in unity-3d cos my netbook can't handle it :)
<lucazade> ok
<Trevinho> lucazade: are you still using natty or oneiric?
<lucazade> Trevinho Oneiric
<Trevinho> I'll give a look
<lucazade> tnx (also for the patch that is really handy)!
<andyrock> jcastro: meeting today?
<Trevinho> lucazade: So actually the volume increases on scrolling down and vice-versa?
<lucazade> Trevinho, yep and notify-osd sometimes seems to freeze to follow volume changes
<Trevinho> That is related to indicator-sound
<lucazade> in fact click in volume slider inside indicator-sound the volume goes from mute to max only
<Trevinho> Mhmhm....
<Trevinho> I'll try
<lucazade> :)
<Trevinho> However I'm sure that when I proposed the branch for merging it was working correctly
<Trevinho> lucazade: you're running the bzr version, isn't it?
<Trevinho> Since the version I've installed in my oneiric machine (the default one) doesn't seem to support the scroll at all yet
<lucazade> Trevinho, it was working correctly before gtk3 porting of unity-2d latest days. Yes, i'm using from bzr
<jcastro> andyrock_: dang, I thought it was yesterday
<jcastro> andyrock_: but hey, we can go over some merges if you have anything clogged up
<andyrock_> jcastro: oh damn... i missed it! :( no problem....
<jcastro> andyrock_: Trevinho hey have you guys been using the review thing in launchpad?
<jcastro> how's that coming on?
<Trevinho> jcastro: about merging... I just need that the BAMF branch I did (that has been approved) would be added in the merging queue!
<jcastro> andyrock_: it's ok, I missed it too, been so off this week.
<jcastro> DBO: around? let's do this bamf thing
<Trevinho> jcastro: I didn't yet since I finally have been able to upgrade to oneiric and so I finished the working branches I was on
 * jcastro nods
<jcastro> I mentioned you guys on this podcast I did!
<Trevinho> Really? Do you have an audio file to link?
<DBO> jcastro, yes I am here
<jcastro> jcastro: about merging... I just need that the BAMF branch I did (that has been approved) would be added in the merging queue!
<jcastro> DBO: ^
<DBO> link?
<jcastro> Trevinho: http://podcast.ubuntu-uk.org/2011/07/20/s04e11-the-trooper/
<jcastro> Like the last 1/3 of the show, I talk about Unity, you guys, make fun of Jason a little bit (j/k)
<jcastro> Trevinho: where's the link to that bamf branch?
<Trevinho> DBO: you already approved it https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/bamf/fixes
<Trevinho> eheh
<Trevinho> I really want to listen at your voice... I miss it! :D
<DBO> oh
<DBO> excellent
<DBO> and weird
<DBO> thank you Trevinho
<Trevinho> You're welcome ;)
<DBO> I'll take care of it as soon as I am back from the dentist
<DBO> (filling popped out)
<Trevinho> Oh have a nice dentist session! :)
<Trevinho> If it ever could be
<ephan> Is Unity compilable again?
<Trevinho> jcastro: your "Marco Trevisan" American pronunciation is awesome! :)
<Trevinho> Thank you for mentioning... Also if i'm the 2nd one :D :D
<jcastro> yeah I totally butcher that
<jcastro> the nice thing about just saying "Marco" is that I can cover like 3 people. :)
<Trevinho> Ehehe... I know.. It's so popular
<Trevinho> Also there are too many Andrea's
<jaytaoko> API: get unity from trunk and try to compile again. it should be ok now
<ephan> cool jaytaoko
<API> jaytaoko, ok, thanks
<Trevinho> jcastro: I just asked again to the chromium guys to change their code to get the proper wm_class... Damned libwnck! :P
<Trevinho> http://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=20587#c64
<jcastro> ok so basically
<jcastro> we told them to fix it wrong
<jcastro> and then they did
<jcastro> now we're telling them to fix it again
<Trevinho> Yes :P
<Trevinho> We're crazy guys :D
<jcastro> ok and we're sure this time right?
<Trevinho> Yes, we asked them not to follow the standard
<Trevinho> since libwnck is bugged (was, using my patch)...
<ephan> They're gonna get us wrong?
<ephan> Us as in, you, Ubuntu coders
<Trevinho> No... Basically we didn't have any way to get the value using libwnck
<Trevinho> so we asked to use the bad way...
<jcastro> Trevinho: is the patch in upstream libwnk's bugzilla?
<Trevinho> yes
<Trevinho> it's just waiting for merge
<jcastro> any review from upstream?
<jcastro> ah awesome
<Trevinho> reviewed
<Trevinho> but they doesn't reply so often
<seb128> try pinging vuntz directly on #ubuntu-desktop
<jcastro> usually you can ping someone on irc or something
<Trevinho> so It seems ok, I should have to fix two bytes, but I didn't got no answers about the main question: how to name these two APIs
<Trevinho> Ok, thank you
<Trevinho> However, that's not the main issue for us
<seb128> well I tried to ping vuntz one week ago and he was still not sure about the naming
<Trevinho> we could always impelment this in bamf waiting them
<seb128> can you ping him on #ubuntu-desktop?
<Trevinho> Ok
<jcastro> Trevinho: in those situations we have plenty of gnomers on board, they can tell you how to talk to someone to get a fix looked at
<Trevinho> jcastro: I actually made all the patches that we needed, but since I didn't had any reply  in few time I re-implemented it in bamf using X raw calls... and for us could be also a good thing until libwnck get what we miss
<jcastro> Trevinho: wow, I'm starting to have some hope this might get fixed! (hah)
<Trevinho> yes is something that is in my queue...
<Trevinho> However in my first fix I didn't touch too much the bamf architecture since I didn't want to t too much old work...
<seb128> we can ship the patch in ubuntu with a function prefixed ubuntu_ if vuntz doesn't review it
<Trevinho> That could be a possibility, but the needed raw X calls to get this directly in BAMF aren't too much, so we can avoid to do that
<Trevinho> I guess
<ephan> Will the unity dash be supporting minimizing?
<Trevinho> Ok, thanks seb128 vuntz is in IRC ;)
<brogdogg> Where can we give some feedback on Unity?
<ephan> Launchpad perhaps
<ephan> If it's a bug or a wishlist
<ephan> which would be www.launchpad.net/unity
<brogdogg> yeah, just wishlist.
<brogdogg> @ephan thanks!
<ephan> No problem
<brogdogg> do you know if there is a plugin or 3rd party app that allows win 7 behavior of hovering the icons in the unity bar?
<ephan> There is brogdogg
<ephan> In compiz
<ephan> It's called "Window Previews"
<brogdogg> sweet, I will have to check it out. Just trying Unity today and that was the only thing that I wish it would have had by default.
<ephan> Good to know ;)
<ephan> Never hesitate to suggest a new feature on Launchapd though ;)
<brogdogg> yeah, going to suggest for sure.
<ephan> Also, anybody around here that could help me starting to help on Unity too? I wonder, what is there to do/code/etc?
<jcastro> sure!
<jcastro> ok, start off with the stuff in the topic
 * API it seems that I need to compile libunity-misc to compile unity from sources ....
<jcastro> specifically the bitesize links
<jcastro> they have a step by step on how to check out the code and get started
<jcastro> then, just ask us questions as you run into problems!
<ephan> So I'll browse through the code first, and read the hacking files (if they exist)
<ephan> And understand the code structure, Unity is mostly C++, I guess right?
<ephan> Check the bitesize bugs on Launchpad and if I run into problems, just say here. Thanks jcastro
<jcastro> yeah, the bitesize ones are supposed to be nice and beginner, more to get you familiar with the code, etc.
<jcastro> if you need help and no one is around you can also post to the mailing list (link in topic)
<ephan_> http://unity.ubuntu.com/getinvolved/#coding By the way, isn't that page wrong (as HTML), it looks a bit "buggy" on #coding
<ephan_> Translations should not be made on unity/po/ right? But on Launchpad.net? thanks, just want to know
<Trevinho> I was wondering... What actually can be dragged in the Unity panel?
<Trevinho> Icons... Then?
<Trevinho> any file accepted by a launcher handler....
<Trevinho> and?
<andyrock> Trevinho: for unity panel do you mean unity launcher (dock, springboard) etc?
<Trevinho> yes, sorry
<Trevinho> launcher
<andyrock> Trevinho: i think, .dekstop file
<Trevinho> I don't know why I've said panel :P, maybe because I'm both workin on them :D
<andyrock> Trevinho: i know :)
<Trevinho> Mh... So, we can't currently drag a text, or a firefox image there for example
<andyrock> if there is an icon application
<andyrock> that handle this kind of file
<andyrock> ye
<andyrock> *yes...
<andyrock> so when we something is dragged over the launcher
<Trevinho> Ok that's what I knew
<Trevinho> mh...
<andyrock> we read its type
<Trevinho> the fact that the launcher something reveals when there's something that it can't handle
<andyrock> the problem is just one :)
<andyrock> x dnd sucks :)
<Trevinho> Yes, I know that... but it's the only whe have
<Trevinho> we*
<andyrock> we can only know what kind of thing we are dragging
<andyrock> when we enter the launcher...
<Trevinho> Mh, that could be enough by the way
<andyrock> but DBO has a solution....
<andyrock> we create a BaseWindow as soon as dnd start
<andyrock> read the type of dragged things
<andyrock> destroy the base window we have created
<andyrock> emit a signals, that is handled by the launcher
<andyrock> in this way we could
<mterry> Does anyone know where the unity-greeter design spec is?  (for lightdm)  Mika apparently did it?
<Trevinho> Ok... So this is something that he'll do :P
<andyrock> Trevinho: the problem is not DBO... the problem is X
<andyrock> :)
<andyrock> btw using this solution we could:
<andyrock> 1) highlight the launcher icon as soon as dnd start and not when mouse enters the launcher
<andyrock> 2) don't reveal the launcher if there is no reason to do that :)
<andyrock> i know that my english sucks, so we can speak italian in private :)
<Trevinho> I know that DBO is not the problem... :)
<Trevinho> Ok ok...
<Trevinho> However I got what you wanted
<Trevinho> to say
<andyrock> Trevinho: if you are interested to it, i can post here the link to lp bug :)
<Trevinho> No, thank you... If that's the solution, I wait for it... Now I have to do something else :P
<MacSlow> jderose, hey there... the ustream broadcast is in 22 min?!
<andyrock> Trevinho: i can do it, but jaytaoko should help in base window stuff :)
<MacSlow> jderose, btw... congrats to reaching hte kickstarter-goal!
<jderose> MacSlow: thanks :)
<DBO> back from the dentist!
<DBO> wewt
<hyperair> had fun?
<MacSlow> DBO, let them bolt that stuff this time
<tedg> kenvandine, seb128, libindicate-gtk3 merge request updated, please double check!
<DBO> it seems I broke
<DBO> erm
<DBO> it seems I broke the filling in half
<DBO> with dental floss
<andyrock> DBO, first the glasses, now the dentist :)
<kenvandine> tedg, will do
<Trevinho> DBO: now you can merge the bamf branch, isn't it? :D
<andyrock> jaytaoko: around?
<andyrock> can anyone help me with nux::basewindow? :)
<Trevinho> DBO: is this something up to you? https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/laucher-edge-reveal-revisited/+merge/69701
<DBO> we're planning to not go the timeout route
<DBO> I am trying to see if we can get X support for getting motion events "out of screen" so to speak
<DBO> I'll write a more detailed description in the review
<DBO> since that might still be merge worthy as the fallback
<Trevinho> Ok... I've read something like that in the related bug
<Trevinho> but going out the screen seems weird to me :o
<om26er> new unity release happening today?
<jaytaoko> andyrock: brb
<andyrock> jaytaoko: i need your help :) when you are free ping me!
<andyrock> *free->available
<jaytaoko> andyrock: ping
<andyrock> jaytaoko: so i'm looking to this bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/727901
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 727901 in unity "When dragging and dropping a file on to the Launcher, the Launcher icons that are valid drop receptacles don't highlight until the cursor is over the launcher." [Medium,Triaged]
<andyrock> but i've no idea how i should create an invisible base window :)
<ephan> invisible base window? i don't get what you mean xD Although even if I did, I'm not sure if I can be of help
<jaytaoko> andyrock: so a BaseWindow cannot be invisible like an XWindow
<andyrock> ephan: don't worry, jaytaoko should have understood
<jaytaoko> andyrock: BaseWindow have a visibility flag but it is purely logical (used mostly to draw or not draw the BaseWindow)
<Trevinho> jaytaoko: so no way to build an event window?
<andyrock> jaytaoko: mmm ok... so how we should do?
<jaytaoko> andyrock: are you refering to a BaseWindow backed by an InputWindow?
<jaytaoko> andyrock: and X InputWindow
<jaytaoko> andyrock: right now the launcher is a BaseWindow but it also has an X inputWindow to receive events coming from X
<andyrock> jaytaoko: but the xinputwindow is of the same geometry of the basewindow right?
<andyrock> *have the same...
<andyrock> *has
<jaytaoko> andyrock: yes
<andyrock> so i cannot use it...
<andyrock> because what i need is a fake window to just read the type of dragged stuff
<andyrock> before the mouse pointer enter the launcher window
<andyrock> *enters
<jaytaoko> andyrock: I see, we are doing something like that,  Jason has more is the one who worked on that feature
<jaytaoko> andyrock: is this something that was recently broken?
<jaytaoko> andyrock: we have changed the event architecture in Nux recently
<andyrock> jaytaoko: no, has always been broken...
<jaytaoko> andyrock: and I still have to finalize the change in the DnD procedure
<jaytaoko> andyrock: ok, allow me to ask Jason when he is available. He may have more ideas on the matter
<andyrock> jaytaoko: i know, but this is an X problem, that let you to read the type of drugged stuff only when the pointer enters the xwindow
<DBO> allo gents
<andyrock> jaytaoko: basewindow cannot be invisible ok... can it be transparent?
<jaytaoko> DBO: andyrock is working on this  https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/727901
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 727901 in unity "When dragging and dropping a file on to the Launcher, the Launcher icons that are valid drop receptacles don't highlight until the cursor is over the launcher." [Medium,Triaged]
<DBO> andyrock, look at the LauncherIconDrawWindow
<jaytaoko> andyrock: a basewindow can be invisible, put when it is invisible, its X Inputwindow stops receiving events
<DBO> andyrock, just remove the parts where it draws the icon (after it clears everything)
<andyrock> jaytaoko: i got it :)
<DBO> jaytaoko, he means he is just going to render 0x0000000 to its entire surface
<jaytaoko> DBO: oh Ok!
<andyrock> DBO jaytaoko: thx :)
<jaytaoko> andyrock: no problem! :)
<andyrock> P.S.: dnd is broken in unity...
<DBO> andyrock, known issue
<DBO> the event arch broke it
<DBO> I am fixing it
<andyrock> DBO: ok when you fix it, i will work on it
<Andy80> hi
<Trevinho> hi Andy80
<Andy80> Trevinho: hola :)
<andyrock-dinner> Hi Andy80 :)
<Andy80> hey ;)
<ephan> back
<ephan> sudo apt-get source unity
<ephan> does that install all unity dependencies?
<andyrock> ephan: sudo apt-get build-dep unity
<ephan> thanks andyrock
<andyrock> ephan: read also the last ayatana-dev mail
<ephan> I am not yet in the mail list, I have to do that now
<andyrock> ephan: you can read the archive
<ephan> I know andyrock :)
<ephan> https://lists.launchpad.net/ayatana-dev/
<ephan> andyrock, oh I need an extra package, I see thanks for warning, just installed
<andyrock> ephan: yw
<thumper> ephan: another point
<ephan> yes thumper
<thumper> ephan: I found the build instructions in the branch both confusing and contraditionary
<ephan> And so did I, I was just reading and asking a friend for help
<ephan> Because CMAKE ../\nmake is not possible
<thumper> ephan: I had to get the right lines from njpatel :)
<thumper> ephan: I'll be around online for the next few hours if you need help
<thumper> for whatever help I can actually offer :)
<ephan> njpatel as in the freenode channel?
<ephan> sorry, njpatel the person*
<ephan> Neil J. Patel*
<thumper> aye
<ephan> nux-core-1.0 says I don't have it installed. I thought pretty much all packages were included in sudo apt-get build-dep unity
<ephan> And it's not on apt-get, so I need to build from source I think
 * thumper hmms and aahs
<thumper> the build deps for unity don't cover bumped versions of dependent libraries
<thumper> as the package for unity isn't trunk (yet)
<thumper> trunk has moved on, the package hasn't caught up
<thumper> you probably need to compile nux too
<ephan> thumper, do you suggest I install nux dependencies or try to install nux-core-1.0? The problem with nux-core-1.0 is it is not in apt-get and I could not find it online
<thumper> ephan: I mean, branch lp:nux and build locally
<thumper> nux and unity are quite intertwined in the dependency chain
<thumper> nux often has abi breaks
<ephan> I see
<thumper> which unity trunk depends on
<thumper> I'm pretty sure the packaged nux won't allow trunk unity to compile
<ephan> thanks, getting nux now
 * thumper nods
<ephan> I actually downloaded nux, but can't figure out how to compile HMmm
<thumper> ephan: do you have a build or staging directory?
<thumper> like ~/staging
<ephan> I have indeed a build directory
<thumper> this is where I install my local build stuff to
<ephan> I called it "build"
<thumper> not local
<ephan> ah
<thumper> we need somewhere inside $HOME to put the builds
<ephan> you mean a global one
<ephan> hm, I never used anything like that
<thumper> personally (and a lot of the dx team) uses ~/staging
<thumper> so make that
<ephan> cool
<ephan> done
<thumper>  ./autogen.sh --prefix=~/staging --enable-debug
<thumper> then make
<ephan> should I branch nux here then? Or this is only for the builds?
<thumper> make check
<thumper> make install
<thumper> no, that is just where we put the binaries
<thumper> I have my branches in ~/src
<ephan> configure: error: expected an absolute directory name for --prefix: ~/staging hm
<thumper> ephan: then expand it out
<thumper> I thought the shell would
<thumper> but I guess not
<thumper> I have mine expanded here
<ephan> hm, I'm not quite understanding what you mean by "expand it out"
<thumper> $(HOME)/staging
<ephan> k
<ephan> I need google-mock, just had to install it
<ephan> making
<ephan> I think I need sudo make install
<ephan> /bin/mkdir: cannot create directory `/staging': Permission denied
<thumper> ephan: you shouldn't need sudo
<thumper> ephan: what was the command line you used for autogen?
<ephan>  ./autogen.sh --prefix=$(HOME)/staging --enable-debug
<thumper> what is $HOME
<thumper> mine is /home/tim
<ephan> /home/david/ for me
<thumper> with the trailing slash?
<thumper> anyway...
<thumper> change the prefix to /home/david/staging
<ephan> trailing slash unncessary
<thumper> and try again
<ephan> making
<ephan> "make[2]: Nothing to be done for `all'"
<ephan> make says that for all folders
<thumper> ephan: because it is built
<thumper> and you only changed the install location
<thumper> try make check
<ephan> http://paste.ubuntu.com/654040/
<Trevinho> DBO: are you here?
<thumper> ephan: ah...
<thumper> ephan: that is some extra test only dependencies
<thumper> ephan: I added that :-|
<ephan> I'm confused TheMuso
<ephan> thumper*
<thumper> sudo apt-get install libboost-filesystem-dev
<thumper> ephan: we use google test and google mock for the tests
<thumper> ephan: for some of those tests I needed independent verification of the file system
<thumper> ephan: so I used boost::filesystem
<thumper> ephan: it isn't a run time dependency, just for the tests
<ephan> I see
<ephan> make check worked
<ephan> time for make install
<ephan> http://paste.ubuntu.com/654043/ Does this mean successful installation?
<thumper> have a look in /home/david/staging
<thumper> there should be some shared object libraries in lib, and headers in include
<thumper> if there is, you're all good
<ephan> lots of headers in include
<ephan> and lib checeks, everything seems fine
<ephan> time to build Unity?
<ephan> "--   package 'nux-core-1.0' not found" ack
<thumper> ephan: what is your cmake line?
<thumper> ephan: try cmake .. -DCMAKE_BUILD_TYPE=Debug -DCOMPIZ_PLUGIN_INSTALL_TYPE=local -DCMAKE_INSTALL_PREFIX=/home/david/staging -DGSETTINGS_LOCALINSTALL=ON
<ephan> http://paste.ubuntu.com/654047/
<ephan> a lot of packages were not found
<ephan> libnotify, unity-misc, indicator3-0.4, libbamf3
<ephan> I'll look at those 4 packages and  build them tomorrow
<thumper> I don't build them
<thumper> hmm... gone
#ayatana 2011-07-29
<george_e> Is this the place to ask questions about Unity development?
<RAOF> george_e: Yes.
<george_e> RAOF: Great! Does Unity use Glib's DBus API?
<RAOF> I believe so, but I'm not familiar with the code.
 * george_e is reading through the code...
<TheMuso> I thought compiz had a dbus plugin, and that gets used...
<george_e> TheMuso: Oh, it does? I didn't realize that.
<TheMuso> george_e: I don't know for sure.
<didrocks> good morning
<thumper> TheMuso, george_e: yes unity uses glib dbus AFAIK
<george_e> thumper: Thank you.
<george_e> Are you familiar with DBus at all?
<thumper> no
<thumper> I'd like to be, but am not at the moment
<george_e> Me too :) I ran into a bit of a problem and I don't know where to ask for help.
<oSoMoN> good morning
<MacSlow> greetings everybody
<andyrock> gord, around?
<gord> andyrock, hey hey
<andyrock> i cannot compile unity, i got this error
<andyrock> n file included from /home/andyrock/Desktop/unity/tests/TestBGHash.cpp:24:0:
<andyrock> /home/andyrock/Desktop/unity/tests/../plugins/unityshell/src/BGHash.h:25:43: fatal error: unity-misc/gnome-bg-slideshow.h: No such file or directory
<andyrock> compilation terminated.
<andyrock> make[2]: *** [tests/CMakeFiles/test-bg-hash.dir/TestBGHash.cpp.o] Error 1
<andyrock> make[1]: *** [tests/CMakeFiles/test-bg-hash.dir/all] Error 2
<andyrock> make[1]: *** Waiting for unfinished jobs....
<gord> andyrock, right yeah you need the latest libunity-misc from lp:libunity-misc, i sent a mail to ayatana-dev explaining :)
<andyrock> gord, doh :) i forgot it... -.-
<andyrock> gord, thx btw :)
<ephan> Does anybody know where I can find indicator3-0.4? I need it for Unity it seems
<ephan> oh wait, libindicator I'll compile, thanks eitherway
<gord> andyrock, np :)
<andyrock> gord, dash background is too light IMHO :)
<gord> andyrock, waiting on a blur from jay, it will look good in the end
<andyrock> gord, dinamic or static blur?
<gord> andyrock, not sure yet :) waiting on him, hopefully dynamic but there were a few issues last i checked
<c10ud> jcastro, sorry for pinging, but my slave^H fellow developer sbte made a patch for indicator-status-provider-emesene, any chance someone can apply it and push an updated package? see bug #817504 (i think i should ask Ken, but anyway, you know better :))
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 817504 in emesene "Emesene needs the offline status to be different from invisible" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/817504
<Trevinho> c10ud: https://bugs.launchpad.net/emesene/+bug/817504/comments/3 ;)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 817504 in emesene "Emesene needs the offline status to be different from invisible" [Medium,New]
<c10ud> sbte, ^
<c10ud> Trevinho, thanks for the small tut btw
<sbte> Trevinho, thanks
<dbarth>  /away
<sbte> Trevinho, done
<Trevinho> sbte, c10ud  Cool! :)
<fhd> I'm trying to build unity-2d on natty, but cmake says I'm missing "dconf-qt". Yet there is no package with that name. Where can I get it?
<andyrock> fhd, try sudo apt-get install libdconf-qt-dev
<fhd> andyrock: There is no such package, do I need to add an apt repository?
<andyrock> fhd,  natty or oneiric?
<fhd> andyrock: natty
<fhd> andyrock: I'm following this guide: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity2D
<andyrock> fhd, well i think it is only in oneiric
<Trevinho> fhd: I think that you should use an older branch of unity-2d if you want to compile it in natty
<fhd> Trevinho: Well, I'd like to contribute a bit, so I guess I'd be best of modifying the latest version, right?
<andyrock> fhd, install oneiric in vbox then :)
<ephan> fhd, try sudo apt-get source unity
<fhd> ephan: OK
<andyrock> fhd, ephan it won't work
<ephan> I personally can't build Unity on Natty because https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bamf/+bug/817949
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 817949 in bamf (Ubuntu) "Building bafm fails" [Undecided,New]
<ephan> andyrock, I personally managed to install all packages neede but this one, libbafm
<ephan> I need Oneiric to compile Unity?
<andyrock> ephan, if you want to compile unity without going crazy... yes
<ephan> andyrock, yeah I went crazy this morning, I built dozens of packages from source and then the last one I needed doesn't work
<andyrock> ephan, or you should install/build all dependencies
<fhd> Okay, I guess I can pick a bug that should be fixed and work with an old branch, eh?
<fhd> I don't really want to go to Oneiric yet
<API> andyrock, unity works fine on a vbox?
<API> ah
<API> you are talking about unity2d
<andyrock> API, i know that unity works fine on vbox... Trevinho could you confirm it?
<ephan> fhd, I don't think it's even recommended to install Alpha 2 on real hardware
<API> I'm having a lot of problems with unity, not sure if related to being on a 64 bit machine, I would like to test it with a 32bit machine (so a vbox)
<andyrock> fhd ephan , install on vbox
<ephan> andyrock, I personally run it through USB Drive on another comp, but that also works
<sbte> ephan, try building without -Werror
<ephan> sbte, when using Oneiric it works
<ephan> gotta logout/login, Ubuntu 11.04 bug -.-
<sbte> ephan, sure, but if you want to build bamf on natty, it probably works if you compile without -Werror
<ephan> sbte, I still need all the packages
<ephan> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bamf/+bug/817949 I need to compile bafm to get libbafm, and I get error
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 817949 in bamf (Ubuntu) "Building bafm fails" [Undecided,New]
<fhd> Sorry, but I'm new to Ubuntu development: Where can I see in which versions a bug should be fixed?
<sbte> ephan, yes, and if you compile it without -Werror it will work
<ephan> oh you mean compile bfam without -Werror or Unity?
<sbte> because the build fails because of a warning turned into an error
<sbte> ephan, bfam
<ephan> ah thanks sbte
<ephan> I read that "Warnings treated as errors"
<andyrock> fhd, you have not dconf-qt-dev
<andyrock> right?
<andyrock> but do you have dconf-qt?
<ephan> "compile it without -Werror it will work" sbte, I had never heard of that, how does that work?
<fhd> andyrock: Nope, there is no package with "dconf-qt" in its name in natty
<ephan> fhd, compile from source perhaps
<andyrock> fhd, you can find it in unity2d daily build ppa
<sbte> ephan, configure with --disable-werror I think, but I'm not sure
<ephan> I did try "./configure --disable-Werror", but I'm searching for some information online
<sbte> ephan, haven't done C in ages
<ephan> heh
<fhd> ephan, andyrock: I'm actually wondering if I do need the latest version of unity-2d. What if I fix a bug, wouldn't that patch make it into natty?
<fhd> ephan, andyrock: Well, I guess I would have to merge it into the latest version at some point, so I might as well work with the latest source.
<andyrock> fhd, i think not (maybe i am wrong) but ubuntu needs a src expection, etc
<fhd> andyrock: src expection?
<andyrock> fhd, a patch that works with old code could not work with new code
<andyrock> fhd, sorry... sru ex...
<fhd> andyrock: Yeah
<Trevinho> andyrock: yes, unity works in Vbox, BUT, I don't upgraded to latest nux
<Trevinho> since it wasn't working
<fhd> andyrock: And with vbox you mean virtualbox?
<andyrock> ok thx... API ^^^
<andyrock> fhd, yeah
<Trevinho> yes VirtualBox
<Trevinho> I'm using oneiric in VBox and it works
<fhd> andyrock: Don't think this would make development easier on my cute little netbook
<Trevinho> but few days ago I upgraded nux to latest commits and it wasn't working
<fhd> But that's apparently the typical development setup?
<Trevinho> I don't know if was vbox by the way
<andyrock> fhd, do you want to develop on a little netbook? :P
<fhd> andyrock: Yeah, on the train. It's not that bad, I even compiled Chromium on it :)
<andyrock> fhd, i develop unity on real hardware on a real partition
<fhd> andyrock: I've got a baby at home, so if I want to hack on stuff, it's on the train
<fhd> andyrock: Well, I guess I have enough space for another ubuntu installation.
<andyrock> fhd, greeting :)
<andyrock> for the baby... :)
<fhd> andyrock: :)
<fhd> andyrock: What's the typical way to install the latest Ubuntu for development purposes. A snapshot CD or something more geeky?
<ephan> I don't think it makes any difference
<andyrock> fhd, daily build should be good
<fhd> andyrock: Right, I can just apt-get upgrade then
<fhd> andyrock: Okay, thanks for your help, that's what I'll do then
<andyrock> fhd, yw
<jcastro> woo a backlog fix: https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/fix-783434/+merge/69713
<jcastro> njpatel: find me a reviewer!
<ephan> good jcastro
<njpatel> jcastro, been waiting for that one for some time :) DBO needs to review it
<jcastro> https://code.launchpad.net/~vanvugt/unity/fix-742664-trunk/+merge/69751
<jcastro> andyrock: nice dude!
<jcastro> njpatel: there's that community review thing in launchpad.
<jcastro> that's pretty awesome
<andyrock> jcastro, thx :) please force DBO to solve dnd problem in nux :)
<Trevinho> jcastro: I hope to push another backlog fix soon
<Trevinho> ;)
<jcastro> woo
<ephan> oh this is just a great fix
<Trevinho> Oh God... The cc1plus compiler is really loving to eat my memory! :P
<kenvandine> ronoc, http://paste.ubuntu.com/654526/
<ronoc> kenvandine, thanks
<ronoc> kenvandine, hmmm, must be missing a dependency in the pkgconfig
<ronoc> kenvandine, thats part of gtk3
<kenvandine> right
<ronoc> were you compiling for 2
<kenvandine> the package builds both
<ronoc> I will wrap the necessaries
<kenvandine> thx
<ronoc> and resubmit
<kenvandine> just add a .1
<ronoc> kenvandine, will do
<kenvandine> also make sure you are building with -Werror
<kenvandine> a bunch of those are simple fixes
<ronoc> kenvandine, I do except for the service which because of valac needs to have warnings turned off
<ronoc> ill try again though its been a while
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> the package builds with -Werror
<kenvandine> so it'll fail in the package
<ronoc> kenvandine, ok, ill take a look
<kenvandine> thx
<lucazade> Hi! indicator-power is visible in Unity-3D but not in Unity-2D, is this a known issue?
<lucazade> filed bug 818086
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 818086 in indicator-power (Ubuntu) "Indicator-power not visible in Unity-2D" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/818086
<andyrock> JohnLea_, around=
<andyrock> ?
<Trevinho> Mh, the underscore doesn't meen anything good! :)
<andyrock> Trevinho, sometimes i forgot to delete it
<andyrock> :)
<Trevinho> You're a n00b :)
<JohnLea_> andyrock; pong
<andyrock> JohnLea_, great! :) Trevinho needs you
<ephan> hm, may I know for how long you guys have been Ubuntu Developers?
<andyrock> ephan, i am an unity contributor since about six month (or more, i don't know)
<JohnLea_> Trevinho; hyia, how can I help?
<ephan> andyrock, you started with the bitesize campaign? I think it was 6 months ago
<andyrock> ephan, my first patch was not bitesize but yes, i was and am a bitesize one!
<Trevinho> JohnLea_: I've made the fix for bug #690143
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 690143 in unity "Launcher - Implement workspace/launcher cross interactions" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/690143
<JohnLea_> Trevinho; great!
<Trevinho> however I'd like to show the border too of an icon
<Trevinho> show the bug attachments
<Trevinho> tell me if you like that or if I should use what you already proposed
<ephan> andyrock, thanks, I'm about to start with bitesize, but still fighting the source for now :)
<andyrock> ephan, jcastro will be glad to receive you... :)
<ephan> andyrock, not sure if it'll be so soon. I only know GTK for a few months
<Trevinho> JohnLea: did you see that?
<andyrock> ephan, here you will learn a lot of things... have fun
<JohnLea> Trevinho; could you send us a mockup of this effect when tile illumination is always on?  Always on is our default setting, and I would have to get this change agreed by a couple of people.  To agree they will have to make a judgement on how this effect works combined with the 'always on' tile illumination setting.
<JohnLea> Trevinho; yes, I've see the mockups attached to the bug, thx
<Trevinho> They're not mokcups actually
<Trevinho> it's running unity :)
<JohnLea> cool ;-)
<JohnLea> a few screengrabs with the 'always on' setting then
<Trevinho> However according to the spec you gave the icon illumination was off
<JohnLea> woops, must be a out of date reference; could you point me to it so I can double check?
<Trevinho> JohnLea: I'm basing on the mockup you posted
<Trevinho> JohnLea: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/690143/+attachment/2162568/+files/launcher_window_on_other_workspace.png
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 690143 in unity "Launcher - Implement workspace/launcher cross interactions" [Medium,In progress]
<JohnLea> atm, by default tile illumination is always on.  This can be changed in ccsm though
<Trevinho> YEs, but in that mockup the illumination was on
<Trevinho> but not for that icon
<Trevinho> So I used that as reference
<Trevinho> If the illumination must be always on or just follow the ccsm settings I can revert the change...
<JohnLea> yes, that mockup is a bit out of date
<JohnLea> sorry
<JohnLea> re. illumination
<JohnLea> The default setting is 'backlight always on'.  However using ccsm it can be set to 'backlight toggles'
<Trevinho> Ok...
<Trevinho> So, you want that the illumination of the non-viewable windows follows the settings too?
<JohnLea> actually, with both settings if the app is running (on any workspace) it will be illuminated
<Trevinho> yes
<Trevinho> You just want to change the icon indicator, though
<Trevinho> Ok... Because I guess that in the case you set the illumination-toggle I guess that this solution could be better
<JohnLea> yes, that change is signed off and can go is straight away.  However the side illumination is also a nice idea, but needs with work with tile illumination, and will also need to be signed off by a few people before it can go in.  I do like it though
<JohnLea> 'in' not 'is' ^
<andyrock> didrocks, https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/815032 bitsize bug?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 815032 in unity (Ubuntu) "ccsm needs an option to change launcher opacity" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<Trevinho> Mh, ok JohnLea ... So... I will push the commit with the side-illumination enabled *only* when the "backlight always on" setting is disabled... If the design team approves it it will be merged, otherwise I'll adapt it to your decision.
<didrocks> andyrock: I think it can be one, right (mid-size one as the code in Launcher.cpp isn't trivial)
<andyrock> didrocks, i know it too well :)
<didrocks> andyrock: so for you, I guess, there will be no issue :)
<andyrock> i'm adding it to unity contributors hacker...
<didrocks> ok, I guess you can give the necessary guidance
<JohnLea> Trevinho; even better, decouple it from the existing backlight illumination settings and provide a new option in the CCSM menu titled "Backlight toggles with side illumination".  This would make it easy to further evaluate and test this feature.
<andyrock> didrocks, it should be an alpha value hidden in the nux draw function
<JohnLea> Trevinho; then this setting could be added to the list of items to be tested in the next round of user testing
<didrocks> andyrock: that or the blending I would say in the main launcher draw function
<JohnLea> Trevinho; (for clarity, this would be a new option inside the CCSM "Backlight Mode" menu)
<andyrock> didrocks, o
<andyrock> *ok
<Trevinho> Ok, I got it JohnLea
<JohnLea> Trevinho; cool, thx! ;-)
<didrocks> andyrock: thanks! :)
<Trevinho> But... JohnLea... the problem is.... With that option the side illumination should be used always?
<andyrock> didrocks, thx you
<Trevinho> or only for not-visible windows?
<JohnLea> Trevinho; this new option (disabled by default)  is exactly what you have already built if I understand correctly, e.g. 'Backlight Toggles' for running apps only on the current workspace, with side lighting for apps running on other workspaces.  Is my understanding correct?
<Trevinho> Yes
<Trevinho> But the name of the option could lead to a confusion... I mean, I know it's too long but it should be "Backlight toggles with side illumination on windows on other viewports" :P
<JohnLea> Trevinho; ;-)  how about "Backlight and side illumination toggles"?
<Trevinho> Ehehe... Yes, I would have done that, but I said you for clarifying :)
<jono> DBO, heya, pal, in my new alt tab I don't see the tiles on the left and right curve into 3D, they are all flat - is that to be expected?
<DBO> jono, they only curve if there is not enough room
<jono> DBO ahhh! makes sense
 * jono loads more apps
<jono> lol
<andyrock> jcastro, i have added https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/815032 to unity-community-hackers
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 815032 in unity (Ubuntu) "ccsm needs an option to change launcher opacity" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<andyrock> and i have added some more information, is it ok?
<jcastro> wow
<jcastro> I didn't even know we could do that
<andyrock> jcastro, if nobody do it, i will fix it. i've other more important bugs to solve!
<jcastro> heh
<didrocks> jono: not sure you noticed my twit this week, but: http://twitter.com/#!/leDidRocks/status/95371439624032256
<jono> didrocks, sorry, pal, I did, I was just on the road - thanks so much!
<didrocks> jono: yw, keep me updated about your experience! :)
<jono> didrocks, will do!
<jono> didrocks, speaking of which, are you familiar with a black box painting when you log into Unity? the black box appears where the keyring password window should be
<didrocks> jono: oh? didn't get that one, but there are known compiz issue taking too much memory and preparing a lot of things no startup (images), maybe you see one appearing. Tell me if after next compiz update (on Monday normally) you still get it
<jono> didrocks, sounds good, I am filing a bug now, will keep you updated
<didrocks> jono: excellent, thanks!
<jono> didrocks, this is it: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/818142
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 818142 in unity (Ubuntu) "Black box painted when logging into to Unity" [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> jono: I'll affect compiz as well
<jono> thanks didrocks
<ephan> My Unity version is "unity 3.8.16". Should the latest one (4.4.0) be installed on Natty's?
<tedg> ephan, The latest Unity is really more targeted at Oneiric.  It may be backportable, but I'm not sure anyone is looking at that.
<ephan> I was wondering
<ephan> thanks tedg
<jcastro> cdbs: around?
<ephan> Guys, is there a way to change the order of the buttons in maximized frames on Unity (latest version)? The Close, Minimize,Maximize buttons
<Trevinho> jcastro: here you are the merge I was talking you about: https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/fix-690143/+merge/69849 ;)
<jcastro> reading
<jcastro> ooh, screenshots too!
<Trevinho> eheh :)
<jcastro> wow, that looks pretty ninja
<ephan> oh sweet
<Trevinho> jcastro: however that screen is valid just using the last option...
<ephan> Will "gnome-search-tool" be removed now that Unity has a launcher that can also search?
<jono> kenvandine, ping?
<kenvandine> jono, pong
<jono> kenvandine, quick q
<jono> I am finding that I often need to post tweets to multiple accounts
<jono> is this something gwibber is planning on supporting?
<kenvandine> gwibber has always supported that...
<kenvandine> ??
<jcastro> ephan: you still need the search tool
<jcastro> ephan: unity uses zeitgeist so it only indexes files you've used
<jcastro> there's no way to say, invoke the dash, do a search and have it search every file in a directory or whatever
<ephan> thanks jcastro I was just wondering, since Ubuntu 11.10 is having space problems (or so I heard)
<ephan> I'll move 11.10 when Alpha 3 is released so I can start helping more
<jcastro> yeah hopefully it won't be so broken
<jcastro> I'm having compiz issues the past few days
<ephan> I expected that, moving to GTK3 is a big step IMO
#ayatana 2011-07-30
<seif> jcastro, we are working on that btw, zeitgeist will index all your files on first run (kinda cheating)
 * jcastro nods
<seif> jcastro, we tested on an ssd with 100k files it needed 6 seconds
<seif> :)
<jcastro> as long as you don't tracker-my-cpu for 45 minutes. :)
<jcastro> oh, nice!
<seif> but again its kinda of a cheat
<kenvandine> Trevinho, ping me anytime... i have plenty of things i need help with!
<Trevinho> kenvandine: Ok... Cool :)
<kenvandine> there is a ton to do and oneiric feature freeze is coming fast!
<Trevinho> Now I've to go to bed, and tomorrow I should finish something I'm doing in unity, but then I hope that I can I help you
<kenvandine> great
<Trevinho> Eh, I know... And I've too many things I'd like to do too :/
<kenvandine> send me a message on twitter
<kenvandine> and i'll come find you :)
<kenvandine> Trevinho, good night!
<Trevinho> Ok, thanks kenvandine ;)
<andyrock> unity-panel-services leaks memory on my pc.... how i could valgrind it?
<Andy80> hi all
<Andy80> using Ubuntu 11.04 and the "Ubuntu Classic" session, there is a strange bug with pop-up menus. Better an image to explain http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/641/bugmenu.jpg/ please note: I get this in almost any pop-up menu, not only the Trash one.
<andyrock> Andy80, know bug
<Andy80> andyrock: s\know\known (conosciuto) - ok, thank you :)
<andyrock> Andy80, damn :)
<andyrock> Andy80, btw i think it's an ambiance/radiance bug
<andyrock> Andy80, but i'm not sure about it
<Andy80> andyrock: so it's related to the theme, not to the base libraries?
<andyrock> Andy80, i think it's related to the theme engine
<Andy80> yes, I meant "theme engine"
<Andy80> ok, cool
<andyrock> Andy80, i'm not sure about this eh... maybe Cimi could give us more information ^^^
<Cimi> maybe it's a bug in light-themes, but I won't bother fixing it, as gnome panel is switching to gtk3
<coz_>   brb
<andyrock> DBO around?
<marcobiscaro2112> hey guys
<marcobiscaro2112> there is someone else with problems to compile unity?
<marcobiscaro2112> http://paste.ubuntu.com/655104/
<andyrock> marcobiscaro2112, you should compile unity-misc from trunk ;)
<andyrock> bzr branch lp:unity-misc
<marcobiscaro2112> ok, i'll try this
<marcobiscaro2112> thanks
<andyrock> marcobiscaro2112, thx for the review btw
<marcobiscaro2112> ;-)
<marcobiscaro2112> andyrock, I'm getting the same error
<marcobiscaro2112> bzr branch lp:libunity-misc; cd libunity-misc; ./autogen.sh --prefix=/usr;make;sudo make install
<marcobiscaro2112> then, tried to compile unity again
<andyrock> try to run cmake againg
<andyrock> *again
<marcobiscaro2112> I've tried this too, should I remove build directory and start again?
<andyrock> i should try :)
<marcobiscaro2112> ok, trying!
<andyrock> smspillaz, around=
<andyrock> ?
#ayatana 2011-07-31
<andyrock> good mornig all
<fhd> Hi, I've compiled Unity 2D and I'd like to fix a small bug with the launcher.
<fhd> But whenever I kill the original launcher to start mine, it restarts itself. How can I supress that?
<fhd> Just renamed /usr/bin/unity-2d-launcher for now, but I bet there is a more elegant way :)
<andyrock> fhd, if you install unity-2d when when you kill the old launcher, the new one will be runned
<fhd> Hi again. According to the wiki, Unity 2D development on Oneiric should be done on the 4.0 branch. However, it seems like most patches are written against trunk. Which version should I use?
<ephan> 4.0
<ephan> It's the official Oneiric Unity Version
<ephan> https://launchpad.net/unity 4.4.0 is latest released version
<fhd> ephan: Is trunk further ahead or behind of 4.0?
<ephan> @fhd
<ephan> Farther
<fhd> ephan: And fixes made against 4.0 get merged into trunk?
<ephan> Not sure about that, but likely
<fhd> ephan: OK. I've made a merge request with a fix against 4.0, so I guess it's allright then
<ephan> Nice fhd, may I know what it was?
<fhd> ephan: Do I BTW have to add some reviewers to the request manually? Usually necessary with Google projects.
<fhd> ephan: Just a sec
<ephan> You need your code to be reviewed indeed
<ephan> Everybody needs their code reviewer, wether you're the project leader or you're a newcomer
<ephan> s/reviewer/reviewed
<fhd> ephan: Yeah, but do I need to add some manually?
<fhd> ephan: This is the issue: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-2d/+bug/795422
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 795422 in unity-2d "Quicklist item "Keep In Launcher" should be "Keep in launcher" as design" [Medium,Confirmed]
<fhd> ephan: A super simple one to get me started
<ephan> heh indeed super simple one, I wish I found one like that XD I haven't found the one to begin with
<ephan> You need a review request, so you need to request a review. I remember jcastro making that manually, he made a page on Launchpad, but I don't know how it works, maybe not even everything gets reviewed.
<ephan> I'd wait for something who has a better understanding of how the Unity Project works
<fhd> ephan: Do you know the bitesized list? That's where I found it: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-2d/+bugs?field.searchtext=&orderby=-importance&field.status%3Alist=NEW&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITH_RESPONSE&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITHOUT_RESPONSE&field.status%3Alist=CONFIRMED&field.status%3Alist=TRIAGED&assignee_option=any&field.assignee=&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_supervisor=&field.bug_commenter=&field.subscriber=&field.tag=bit
<fhd> This link is better: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity-2D/Bitesize
<ephan> I do know the bitesize list
<ephan> http://goo.gl/tiheb It's int he topic too
<ephan> But I didn't find any as simple as that
<fhd> ephan: OK, I'll see if I can find some docs on the review process
<ephan> fhd, try http://goo.gl/i1WA1 it may help
<fhd> ephan: Looks like I don't have to add reviewers manually, I'll wait if something happens
<ephan> Cool
<ephan> I'm commenting on some bugs now
<ephan> It's all I can do XD
<fhd> ephan: I've always wondered: Do you know what the difference between unity-2d and unity-2d (Ubuntu) is here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-2d/+bug/795422
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 795422 in unity-2d "Quicklist item "Keep In Launcher" should be "Keep in launcher" as design" [Medium,In progress]
<ephan> I think Unity-2D is for computers that don't really run OpenGL fine
<fhd> ephan: Yeah, but it's there twice, once "unity-2d" and once "unity-2d (Ubuntu)"
<ephan> That I don't know, weird
<fhd> ephan: Does the first one mean "upstream"?
<ephan> idk
<ephan> Actually I think I just scrwed something
<ephan> is there Compiz for Unity-2D?
<fhd> ephan: No, Unity-2D is compiz free
<ephan> I thought so
<ephan> I scrwed something
<ephan> Fixed
<oneporter> Hi, I'm not sure if anyone's here, but I've been interested in contributing for a while, and I am looking for a good reading resource that explains setting up the development environment to tackle bugs like the ones in 100 papercuts.  Can anyone point me in the right direction?
<oneporter> haha go figure, one of the links at the top is what I'm looking for, sorry for the noob question all
<Trevinho> Hey... I've just placed my ubuntu membership candidature, If you want please support me in my wiki page :P https://wiki.ubuntu.com/3v1n0 [sorry for the ads] :)
<ephan> Cool Trevinho
