#ubuntu-classroom 2007-02-05
<ubuntu_newgal> =D
#ubuntu-classroom 2007-02-06
<DerXero> gn8
#ubuntu-classroom 2007-02-08
<christin00> helo @ll
<christin00> i have problem with install game[im noode]  ;/
<christin00> when i tried and wrote make i had : c:56 and c:52
<christin00> :[
<nothlit_> its funny, everybody who needs help here leaves really quickly
<gnomefreak> nothlit: this isnt a help channel :)
<nothlit> gnomefreak: it is when there aren't classes :P
<gnomefreak> no it still isnt
<nothlit> it is, people use this for extra long help
<gnomefreak> this channel is used for when people need extensive help on a problem
<nothlit> more involved procedures
<nothlit> but there were people that were helped here and had to go, then came back and always left before someone could answer
<DerXero`migraene> soo... bis sonntag abend nicht zuhause
#ubuntu-classroom 2007-02-09
<jrib> Catachan__: k, less traffic here
<Catachan__> cool
<jrib> does bash still throw an error at this point?
<Catachan__> yes, let me paste the current line that I changed it too
<Catachan__> I changed it to this:
<Catachan__> PATH=/usr/hla
<jrib> that makes your PATH only /usr/hla
<Catachan__> okay
<jrib> comment that line
<jrib> tell me if bash still throws errors
<Catachan__> lots of verbosenes also with out the line commented
<jrib> what kind of verbosenes?
<Catachan__> shisen
<Catachan__> lots of debug, I shall post an example
<Catachan__> by the way, comments are "#" right?
<jrib> right
<Catachan__> bash: [: =: unary operator expected
<Catachan__> bash: [: =: unary operator expected
<Catachan__> bash: [: =: unary operator expected
<Catachan__> bash: [: too many arguments
<Catachan__> bash: [: =: unary operator expected
<Catachan__> bash: sed: command not found
<Catachan__> just a short sampling from the end of the list
<jrib> hmm
<jrib> did you edit any file other than .bashrc?
<Catachan__> uhm
<Catachan__> I don't think so
<jrib> mv ~/.bashrc ~/.bashrc.backup
<Catachan__> I can check the environment
<jrib> then see if you still get an error
<Catachan__> okay, right now, having entered the commands, I have gotten a "No file or Directory" error
<jrib> what commands?
<Catachan__>  mv ~/.bashrc ~/.bashrc.backup
<Catachan__> followed by:
<Catachan__> source ~/.bashrc
<jrib> close your terminal and open a new one
<Catachan__> I tried that just now, and redid the source comand
<Catachan__> got the following error
<Catachan__> bash: /home/catachan/.bashrc: No such file or directory
<jrib> that's because we renamed .bashrc to .bashrc.backup
<jrib> it no longer exists
<Catachan__> okay
<Catachan__> that would make sense
<jrib> ok I just wanted to make sure taht is where the errors are.  Pastebin the entire file
<Catachan__> oh! mv == move
<jrib> go ahead and rename it back:  mv ~/.bashrc.backup ~/.bashrc
<jrib> right
<Catachan__> oh, uhm, pastebin?
<jrib> !pastebin
<ubotu> pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (be sure to give the URL of your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<Catachan__> any prefrence to the syntax?
<jrib> just use text
<Catachan__> by the way, in about ten minutes, I have to sign off for about five minutes, so I can change locations, I should be back quickly though
<Catachan__> okay
<jrib> k
<Catachan__> pasted!
<Catachan__> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4812/
<jrib> that looks fine, what does "source ~/.bashrc" say now?
<Catachan__> uhm one moment
<Catachan__> okay, so I just tried to rename ~/.bashrc.backup and it said that it did not exist
<Catachan__> one second
<Catachan__> okay, got it
<jrib> Catachan__: ok, no errors?
<Catachan__> no errors
<jrib> Catachan__: now change line 75 to:
<jrib> PATH="/usr/hla:${PATH}"
<Catachan__> now source it?
<jrib> yep
<Catachan__> I assume
<Catachan__> kk
<Catachan__> no errors
<jrib> then:  echo $PATH     you should see hla in your path
<Catachan__> yep, it seems to be the first one in the list
<jrib> k, do you need to do anything else?
<Catachan__> I am begining to wonder if my download of the file also screwed up, actually
<Catachan__> because it should give me a few lines of help related to the program when I type in hla -?
<Catachan__> does command line unpackaging differ significantly from useing the GUI?
<jrib> how did you unpack it?
<Catachan__> I used the GUI extract in the Package manager
<Catachan__> and extracted it to the usr directory
<jrib> /usr?
<Catachan__> right
<jrib> you don't want to do that
<jrib> you want to install custom stuff to /usr/local
<jrib> Catachan__: why are you installing HLA by the way?
<Catachan__> okay
<Catachan__> I am trying to learn Assembly with the insane intent to become fluent
<Catachan__> in it
<jrib> there should be some assemblers in the repositories
<Catachan__> ubuntu repositories?
<Catachan__> okay
<jrib> yeah
<Catachan__> I must disconnect for a short period
<Catachan__> thank you
<jrib> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=342399
<jrib> nasm I've heard of before
<Catachan__> as have I
<jrib> that one is a lot easier to install:  sudo apt-get install nasm
<Catachan__> the thing is that the best tutorial I have found is for HLA
<jrib> oh I see
<Catachan__> but I shall look into nasm
<Catachan__> thank you
<Catachan> jrib, still around?
<jrib> Catachan: yep
<Catachan> when I extracted that file (hla) to the /usr/ folder, should I name it /.hla?
<Catachan> perhaps?
<Catachan> or does it matter when using the terminal to start a program?
<jrib> one sec, link me to this file please
<Catachan> okay, which file exactly do you want?
<Catachan> a link to?
<jrib> the one you are extracting
<Catachan> the download link?
<jrib> sure, or the page
<Catachan> okay
<Catachan> here is the page   http://webster.cs.ucr.edu/AsmTools/HLA/dnld.html
<Catachan> the actual link is near the bottom
<Catachan> the dl link:    http://webster.cs.ucr.edu/AsmTools/HLA/HLAv1.86/hla.tar.gz
<jrib> I would just drop this in /opt, it doesn't look like it's properly structured for /usr/local
<Catachan> okay
<Catachan> oh, jeeze
<Catachan> I am a fool
<Catachan> /usr/ is not the same as /catachan
<jrib> heh
<Catachan> you know I just realized that
<Catachan> I feel dumb now
<Catachan> lol
<jrib> well you figured it out :)
<Catachan> but I had noticed it before, and just forgot it this time
<Catachan> so I feel stupid
<Catachan> okay, so mv == move right? can I use it with a sudo and moving directories as well?
<jrib> yes
<Catachan> okay
<Catachan> well, I got it moved
<jrib> Catachan: k where is it now?
<Catachan> in /usr
<jrib> so /usr/hla/hla  should work
<jrib> as a command
<Catachan> it recognizes it as a binary now
<Catachan> but it says that it cannot execute the file
<jrib> /usr/hla/hla -?
<jrib> doesn't work?
<Catachan> I get this:     bash: /usr/hla/hla: cannot execute binary file
<jrib> me too
<Catachan> hmm
<Catachan> Okay, hmm
<Catachan> I guess I should email the author
<Catachan> of the program
<Catachan> thank you very much
<Catachan> by the way
<jrib> np, gl
<Catachan> thanks
<Catachan> jrib, might it be worth it to compile it from the source?
<Catachan> perhaps?
<jrib> Catachan: wouldn't hurt to try
<Catachan> okay
<Catachan> I will look into taht
<Catachan> *that rather
<Catachan> hmm
<jrib> Catachan: seems to work after compiling, or at least -? works
<Catachan> really? cool
<Catachan> I am curently working on how to compile actually,
<Catachan> is that just "makefile?
<jrib> make -f makefile.linux
<Catachan> okay
<Catachan> out of curiosity, where did you place the extracted source?
<jrib> but edit makefile.linux to suit your needs.  it currently copies to /usr/hla which will fail since your user doesn't have access.  That is ok, just copy afterwards yourself wherever you want
<jrib> Catachan: I left it where it compiled since I'm not interested in hla :)  But I would install this to /opt.  And then wehreever the docs said "/usr" I would just use "/opt"
<Catachan> okay
<Catachan> cool
<Catachan> thank you so very much
<jrib> Catachan: you probably need to install build-essential too
<Catachan> build essential?
<jrib> it's a package that gives you a bunch of development stuff
<Catachan> in order to be able to compile perhaps?
<jrib> right
<Catachan> and without it, the command "make" does nothing?
<Catachan> right?
<jrib> you won't have a command "make"
<Catachan> right
<Catachan> okay
<Catachan> so, sudo apt-get build-essential?
<jrib> sudo apt-get install build-essential
<Catachan> right
<Catachan> okay
<jrib> !compiling | Catachan
<ubotu> Catachan: Compiling software from source? Read the tips at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/CompilingSoftware (But remember to search for pre-built !packages first: not all !repositories are enabled by default!)
<Catachan> oh! that is a neat feature of the bots!
<jrib> Catachan: that's a general guide but hla is a bit different.  If you really want to understand what is happening a good guide on makefile's would help best
<Catachan> okay
<Catachan> I will look them up
<Catachan> thanks again
<Catachan> lol
<jrib> Catachan: if you just open up makefile.linux in a text editor you can probably guess what is going on too
<Catachan> yeah
<Catachan> I looked it over
<Catachan> it appears to be fairly simple, in that it just tells where to install and compile and the like
<Catachan> thought that is surely a poor explanation
<Catachan> =-)
<Catachan> okay, I am getting the error "No rule to make target"
<Catachan> jrib?
<Catachan> Sorry to call you back, about this
<jrib> Catachan: what command are you using?
<Catachan> make -f makefile.linux
<jrib> Catachan: what is the result of: md5sum makefile.linux
<Catachan> c20340067b767c18ca562a1ba595ef0f  /usr/hlasrc/makefile.linux
<jrib> heh ok so we have the same file
<Catachan> I had to use the whole path name
<jrib> Catachan: cd /usr/hlasrc
<Catachan> oh, right
<Catachan> that would work
<jrib> does make -f makefile.linux work now?
<Catachan> uhm I get::   gcc -DLinux -c -O2 -o hlaparse.o hlaparse.c
<jrib> yeah, it's doing its thing
<Catachan> but it may be at work at the moment
<Catachan> okay
<jrib> wait a few minutes
<Catachan> cool
<Catachan> sure thing
<jrib> just to remind you, it's a bad habit to install things into /usr directly.  That's really for the package manager to work with.  When  you install custom stuff you should use /usr/local or /opt
<Catachan> okay, I will try to remember that and keep it in mind
<Catachan> hmm
<Catachan> flex -8 -i hla.flx
<Catachan> make: flex: Command not found
<Catachan> make: *** [lex.yy2.o]  Error 127
<Catachan> this is not the best thing is it?
<Catachan> once you compiled it, where did you move it to?
<Catachan> actually, that is a bad question,
<Catachan> okay, so I moved it to usr/local/hla, and I changed the .bashrc accordingly, and ran the source ~/.bashrc
<Catachan> when I run the command hla, or hla -? I get a cannot execute binary
<Catachan> thank you for your help, I am about to loose the internet connection at about 12:58, so I will do some fiddling myself, then if I can't get it, finish in the morning.
<Catachan> Thank you so very much man
<Catachan> jrib, by the way, did you bother to add the four lines mentioned in the install instructions for defining the variables and such?
<Catachan> never mind, it doesn't help if I comment them out or not. Thank you very much!
<jrib> Catachan: install flex and recompile
<Catachan> flex?
<Catachan> apt get install flex?
<jrib> 23:41 <         Catachan > flex -8 -i hla.flx
<jrib> 23:41 <         Catachan > make: flex: Command not found
<jrib> yep
<Catachan> okay
<jrib> if you wan to use /usr/local then put hla and hlaparse into /usr/local/bin  but you still need the hlalibs which aren't in here I think
<Catachan> okay
<jrib> Catachan: you can probably just use the hlalib/ and include/ that you have from before (the failed binary installation)
<Catachan> okay
<jrib> !mk
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about mk - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<b0sanac> jrib, i am here
<jrib> b0sanac: what is your native language?
<b0sanac> Macedonian
<b0sanac> i know macedonian serbian
<b0sanac> and english a little
<b0sanac> :)
<jrib> k, it's easier for me to explain how to do this using a text editor
<jrib> if you visit ubotu's page you can see the instructions for the gui
<jrib> b0sanac: enter this command:  gksudo gedit /etc/apt/sources.list
<b0sanac> jrib, but pls can you tell me what to write in terminal
<b0sanac> ok im in the list
<b0sanac> and now ?
<b0sanac> what to edit ?
<jrib> now copy what you have there and paste it into the form at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org .  Afterwards, submit it and give me the link to the result
<b0sanac> but
<b0sanac> what to be the syntax ?
<b0sanac> a
<jrib> I need to see what you have
<jrib> do you understand?
<b0sanac> Posted by b0sanac on February 9th 17:19
<b0sanac> done
<b0sanac> i paste it
<b0sanac> is new linux
<b0sanac> i install it now
<b0sanac> jrib, are you here ?
<jrib> b0sanac: yes I need the URL
<b0sanac> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4875/ ??
<b0sanac> that ?
<b0sanac> jrib, ??
<jrib> yes, thanks.  I need to read it, give me a second :)
<b0sanac> ok :)
<jrib> b0sanac: ok you see lines 16 and 17?
<jrib> # deb http://mk.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ dapper universe
<jrib> # deb-src http://mk.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ dapper universe
<b0sanac> yep
<b0sanac> and ?
<jrib> remove the # in front
<jrib> ok?
<b0sanac> thats all ?
<jrib> no
<jrib> do you want "multiverse" too?
<b0sanac> ok
<b0sanac> jrib, i want all to listen play :)
<b0sanac> mp3 mpeg thats all video
<b0sanac> thats all
<b0sanac> :D
<jrib> ok add the word "multiverse" to the end of lines 16 and 17
<b0sanac>  deb http://mk.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ dapper universe
<b0sanac>  deb-src http://mk.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ dapper universe
<b0sanac> man yes
<b0sanac> but where to add it ?
<b0sanac> deb-src http://mk.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ dapper universe multivers
<b0sanac> there :) ?
<b0sanac> jrib, ??/
<jrib> b0sanac: yes, but you forgot the "e" at the end of "multiverse"
<b0sanac> :)
<b0sanac> hehe i see
<b0sanac> now is  deb http://mk.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ dapper universe multiverse
<b0sanac>  deb-src http://mk.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ dapper universe multiverse
<b0sanac> its ok now ?
<b0sanac> a
<jrib> do the same for lines 31 and 32, remove teh # and add multiverse
<b0sanac> ok :)
<b0sanac> done
<b0sanac> thats all ?
<jrib> now save and close gedit
<b0sanac> done
<b0sanac> i save and close
<b0sanac> and what now ?
<jrib> now run 'sudo apt-get update'
<b0sanac> done
<b0sanac> i type it
<b0sanac> :)
<b0sanac> and i wait
<jrib> now try to install what you were trying to install before
<b0sanac> mp3
<b0sanac> i want to install
<b0sanac> done i install
<b0sanac> i wait
<b0sanac> :)
<b0sanac> but
<b0sanac> i want to install mpeg too
<b0sanac> can you tell me how ?
<jrib> sudo apt-get install gstreamer0.10-pitfdll gstreamer0.10-ffmpeg gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad-multiverse gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly-multiverse gxine libxine-main1 libxine-extracodecs
<b0sanac> that is for ?
<b0sanac> mpeg or mp3 ?
<jrib> almost everything
<b0sanac> :)
<b0sanac> hehe
<b0sanac> ok
<b0sanac> D:
<b0sanac> wait
<b0sanac> gxine is already the newest version.
<b0sanac> libxine-main1 is already the newest version.
<b0sanac> libxine-extracodecs is already the newest version.
<b0sanac> 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 105 not upgraded.
<b0sanac> ??
<b0sanac> what  is that ?
<jrib> it means you have all of those packages already
<b0sanac> soo
<b0sanac> i can watch movie DVD i can listem mp3 mpeg that is it ?
<b0sanac> WONDERFUL !
<jrib> you can't watch dvd yet
<b0sanac> ohh
<jrib> well not css protected dvd anyway
<b0sanac> what i need to install to watch dvd a ?
<b0sanac> come on lets fix that too then
<b0sanac> :)
<jrib> you need libdvdcss2
<jrib> http://mirror.ubuntulinux.nl/dists/dapper-seveas/extras/
<jrib> download the deb for libdvdcss2 and double click on it
<jrib> or add teh seveas repository if you want instead
<b0sanac> libdvdcss2
<b0sanac>     Description:	Simple foundation for reading DVDs - runtime libraries More...
<b0sanac>     To allow applications to access some of the more advanced features
<b0sanac>     of the DVD format.
<b0sanac>     Package:	libdvdcss2_1.2.9-0.0ubuntu2_i386.deb
<b0sanac>     Package:	libdvdcss2_1.2.9-0.0ubuntu2_amd64.deb
<b0sanac> what package ?
<b0sanac> 1 or two ?
<b0sanac> jrib, ?
<jrib> do you use i386 or amd64?
<b0sanac> i dont know
<b0sanac> -b0sanac- VERSION xchat 2.6.8 Linux 2.6.15-26-386 [i686/3.00GHz] 
<b0sanac> i686
<b0sanac> ?
<b0sanac> :)
<b0sanac> that is it or ?
<jrib> do you use i386 or amd64?
<jrib> bah
<jrib> b0sanac: uname -a
<b0sanac> Linux linux-security 2.6.15-26-386 #1 PREEMPT Thu Aug 3 02:52:00 UTC 2006 i686 GNU/Linux
<jrib> ok install i386
<b0sanac> so what package is ?
<b0sanac> :)
<jrib> the one with i386 in the name :)
<b0sanac> Simple foundation for reading DVDs - devel files
<b0sanac> To allow applications to access some of the more advanced features of the DVD format.
<jrib> not the devel files
<b0sanac> error
<b0sanac> what to download man :D
<b0sanac> tell me
<jrib> http://mirror.ubuntulinux.nl/pool/dapper-seveas/extras/libdvdcss2_1.2.9-0.0ubuntu2_i386.deb
<b0sanac> done
<b0sanac> and where to extract ?
<jrib> I hope it works without any other deps...  just double click on it
<b0sanac> ok i type install
<jrib> it should open with gdebi
<b0sanac> done
<b0sanac> i install it :)
<b0sanac> i install all
<b0sanac> :D
<b0sanac> and now its all ok ?
<b0sanac> :)
<jrib> ok now you should be able to play dvd's protected by css too
<b0sanac> jrib, you know
<b0sanac> jrib, YOU ARE THE BEST MAN ON THIS SERVER !
<b0sanac> :)
<b0sanac> nobody tell me like you :)
<b0sanac> some ppl tell me website
<b0sanac> and pm me
<b0sanac> :)
<b0sanac> but yea
<b0sanac> you are the best :)
<jrib> thanks, have fun with ubuntu
<b0sanac> thanks you too :) ! !!! YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA :************************* THANKS
<b0sanac> nick jrib !!!!!! IS THE BEST ON THIS SERVER ! WHO HELP PPL !
<jrib> b0sanac: k, take it easy :)
<PriceChild> lol jrib :)
<Catachan> jrib, thank you for the help last night, (as I was Catachan_) I managed to get the source of the program to compile alittle after midnight, so thankyou!
#ubuntu-classroom 2007-02-10
<Yodude> ok i'm here
<nalioth> Yodude: can you ctrl-alt-f3 and get to a terminal ?
<Yodude> yes and then i click ctrl-alt f7 to quit n return to ubuntu
<nalioth> let's stay in the text terminal, and log in, please
<Yodude> lol but i won't be able to talk to you there
<nalioth> umm, ok
<nalioth> hwo are you here now, if your video isn't working like you want it to?
<Yodude> no u don't understand
<Yodude> i need to upgrade my GPU driver
<Yodude> i downloaded the driver from the nvidia website
<Yodude> but i can't install it it says i need to close X
<Yodude> so how can i go about that?
<nalioth> let's go to terminal 3 and log in
<nalioth> when you get logged in, apt-get install irssi and run it
<nalioth>  type /connect freenode
<nalioth> then /j #ubuntu-classroom
<Yodude> lol nono wait
<nalioth> irssi is a console irc program
<Yodude> i can't download stuff from the repository
<Yodude> i'm doing all this to avoid that
<Yodude> my connection is too slow
<nalioth> no problem
<Yodude> i just need to get this file running and i'll be done
<nalioth> log into the text terminal and do the irssi thing (write down the commands if necessary)
<Yodude> but i don't want to command apt-get i can't download i told u
<Yodude> just tell me what do i have to do now and i'll write it down
<Yodude> that way i can work for a little while in the terminal
<nalioth> you said you had the driver
<Yodude> i had the driver "file"
<nalioth> ok
<Yodude> which i need to run so that i can install the driver
<nalioth> the quicker you log into a text terminal and irssi, the quicker we can kill X and get busy
<Yodude> i know how to stop x i use "sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop
<Yodude> i just don't know what to do after i close X
<Yodude> i only have  black screen with a -
<Yodude> but i can't get commands to work
<Yodude> i need to do this to install the file:
<nalioth> when you come back here, i'll walk you through it
<Yodude> sudo /media/hda5/ubuntu/packages/NVIDIA-linux-x86-1.0-9746-pkg1.run
<Yodude> so how can i do that command after i close X
<nalioth> from a console
<Yodude> i already tried just typing it n hitting enter nothing happened
<nalioth> Yodude: please do the ctrl-alt-f3 thing and come back here with irssi
<Yodude> kk wait i hope it works this time let's see
<Yodude> man i told you i can't do it
<Yodude> my connection sucks
<Yodude> i don't know why everytime i download something from the repository i get erros
<Yodude> usualyl i can get at least 3KB per second
<Yodude> man just tell me how to get to a terminal after closing X and i'll be happy
<Yodude> plz
<nalioth> hi y'all
<vox754> wow, didn't know this channel existed
<nalioth> and so you're enlightened .  . . :)
<Yodude> i'm back
<Yodude> but please don't tell me download nothing this time it won't work i know
<nalioth> Yodude: please log into a text terminal  ( type ctrl-alt-f3 to get one)
<Yodude> yes
<Yodude> then
<nalioth> type "sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop"
<Yodude> ok
<nalioth> your x will be off at that time
<Yodude> then
<Yodude> yes
<Yodude> then
<nalioth> then type sudo /media/hda5/ubuntu/packages/NVIDIA-linux-x86-1.0-9746-pkg1.run
<nalioth> it should run (because x is stopped)
<Yodude> that's the problem i typed it and nothing happened
<nalioth> can you open a terminal now?
<Yodude> then i tested another command which is sudo fdisk -l
<Yodude> but nothing happened either
<Yodude> i can
<nalioth> please do and type "file /media/hda5/ubuntu/packages/NVIDIA-linux-x86-1.0-9746-pkg1.run"  and tell me the result
<Yodude> "/media/hda5/ubuntu/packages/NVIDIA-linux-x86-1.0-9746-pkg1.run: Bourne shell script text executable
<Yodude> "
<timothy> you are pressing enter right ;0
<nalioth> after you kill X, try this:  "sudo -i" <enter>
<Yodude> after i kill X?
<nalioth> than type ./media/hda5/ubuntu/packages/NVIDIA-linux-x86-1.0-9746-pkg1.run <enter>
<nalioth> Yodude: yes, you have to kill x for this to run (or so you told me)
<Yodude> if it doesn't work how can i restart X?
<nalioth> sudo /etc/init.d/gdm start
<Yodude> yes but last time i typed that command to restart X and it didn;'t work
<nalioth> is there NO way for you to get a console irc client?
<nalioth> this is gonna take some troubleshooting that we can't do in the current situation
<Yodude> lol no sadly
<nalioth> irssi isn't that big of a package
<Yodude> i am really disspointed because of the repositories download speed
<jrib> irssi isn't installed by default anymore?
<Yodude> firefox is faster than that i know for sure
<nalioth> jrib: not since breezy  :(
<jrib> aw that's sad
<Yodude> let me just clear things up a bit:
<nalioth> Yodude: are you using the closest repos?
<Yodude> what do you mean closest repositories?
<Yodude> i am using a server for lebanon (where i live)
<Yodude> do i change the server?
<Yodude> maybe lebanon server is just not that good
<nalioth> Yodude: try changing it to just "archive.ubuntu.com" instead of xx.archive.ubuntu.com
<Yodude> how?
<Yodude> i tried going into synaptic preferences and changing the server from Server Lebanon to Main Server
<Yodude> is this good?
<Yodude> it seems a bit faster to me'
<Yodude> but illogical though shouldn't my country's server be faster for me?
<Yodude> it's still slower than usual though
<nalioth> Yodude: hit alt-f2 and type "gksudo "/etc/apt/sources.list""
<nalioth> you already have changed it, never mind
<Yodude> hey i'm seeing something weird
<Yodude> after i have changed the server it told me to redownload the list!
<Yodude> and now i can't change back to Server Lebanon
<Yodude> ( and b4 this it told me there was 184 updates for my system now it tells me there is 74)
<nalioth> i always change my sources.list to a faster one
<Yodude> i'm gonna try to quit X than type a command for the last time
<Yodude> if it doesn't work than too bad
<Yodude> i won't be able to use ubuntu thnks to my "adorable" connection
<Yodude> c u
<vox754> Yodude: reboot and login to rescue mode, then "login username". You will have a running console with no X. Then I guess you could start X with some "init 5" or something.
<Yodude> noliath: i owe you an apology
<nalioth> Yodude: what's up?
<Yodude> i just got mad because everybody was starting to confuse me like hell
<Yodude> i managed to enter commands after closing X
<Yodude> but i have a new problem
<Yodude> so o ran the file, accepted the license
<Yodude> than it told me it couldn't find any precompiled kernel interfaces for my kernel
<nalioth> !headers
<ubotu> To install the Linux (kernel) headers, open a terminal and: sudo apt-get install linux-headers-$(uname -r) To install headers for libraries, you need the accompanying -dev packages
<Yodude> yes it said something about that
<nalioth> Yodude: i hate to tell you this, but you'll need to do the above
<Yodude> lol
<nalioth> your new driver file is gonna compile a brand new driver module
<Yodude> how much Mb is it?
<nalioth> more than 25
<Yodude> man i'm starting to hate nvidia
<Yodude> why don't they just give you the file, make it work ONE time
<Yodude> install it and voila!
<Yodude> man the repositories are better! truly
<Yodude> i wish i had a better connection
<Yodude> i'll tell you what
<Yodude> is there anything like Easyubuntu that i can download on windows?
<Yodude> that way i can use DAP
<Yodude> it gets to 7KB
<Yodude> is there?
<nalioth> you can visit packages.ubuntu.com and direct download the deb(s)
<Yodude> i'll see
<Yodude> man if i saw my ISP right now
<Yodude> i would so **** the hell out of him
#ubuntu-classroom 2007-02-11
<Dante123> Hi all! I would like to reinstall Ubuntu on a partition on my HD.....however........I want to make sure that I do not mess up the other OS on there.....(Windoze) as this computer belongs to the school where I teach......how do I go about reinstalling Ubuntu....and still leave the Grub setup as is......any suggestions or tips are appreciated....thanks.
<Dante123> I should add that Windoze is on a separate partition....but boots first on grub
<nalioth> Dante123: if you're reinstalling it, just do it.  it'll find and add windows automatically (or you can do the custom install and skip the grub installation)
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-classroom:nalioth] : The classroom schedule is located at: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom | Transcripts and logs are at: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ClassroomTranscripts | *If you ask a question, hang out for an answer :) *
<CppIsWeird> is there anyone in here that will help me out with user permissions and groups?
<nalioth> CppIsWeird: if you ask the question, there maybe someone here to look at it
<CppIsWeird> ok, well im trying to create or use an existing group to grant certain users full read write modify access to apache's /var/www
<CppIsWeird> i found that there is an existing group called www-data
<CppIsWeird> and i added the users i wish to have access to this folder to that group
<CppIsWeird> however, they can still not do things in the folder
<CppIsWeird> so how do i go about correcting this
<nalioth> have you asked in ##linux? or #ubuntu ?
<CppIsWeird> i thought this was a place that thought you to do things
<nalioth> yes, we do bring folks here to help them, but you brought this up out of the blue
<CppIsWeird> ... i don't really see the difference. but alright.
<xratex> df
<LjL> xratex: i mean in a console ;)
<xratex> =P
<xratex> k
<LjL> xratex: see if you aren't running out of disk space on some partition
<xratex> nope, its ok
<LjL> xratex: ok, so give me the exact output that you get from typing  sudo apt-get install xserver-xorg 
<xratex> k
<xratex> its in spanish so i'll do my best
<LjL> xratex: give it in spanish
<LjL> don't change it, just give me the verbatim output
<xratex> <<< "xserver-xorg" is broken or it's not fully installed >>> that. but in spanish
<xratex> ops
<xratex> nono sry
<xratex> that's not it
<xratex> <<> "Fallo de segmentacion" (core dumped) >>< its like segmentation fail or something like that
<LjL> indeed - you mentioned a segmentation fault. please give the *full* output from when you type the command to when you're back to the prompt
<xratex> thats all it says
<LjL> and the  "xserver-xorg" is broken or it's not fully installed  ? where does it give you this?
<xratex> after i put the apt-get install xserver-xorg, thats all it says
<LjL> so it says *first* that xserver-xorg is broken, and, *then* segmentation fault?
<xratex> first segmentation, then core dumped
<LjL> no
<LjL> segmentation fault and core dumped are the same thing
<LjL> listen - really - just *copy and paste the full output*
<LjL> from when you type the command to when you're back to the prompt
<xratex> w8 ill reboot that comp
<LjL> and this error: "xserver-xorg" is broken or it's not fully installed  <---- you gave it *before* the apt-get install xserver-xorg. where does it come from?
<LjL> why reboot?
<xratex> i made a mess.. let me explain again
<xratex> the "not fully instaled & broken" is when i do the dpkg reconfigure
<LjL> dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg?
<xratex> ayea
<LjL> xratex: paste the file /etc/apt/sources.list into the site that i give you now
<LjL> !pastebin
<ubotu> pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (be sure to give the URL of your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<xratex> i cant, im in text mode and the ubuntu pc is next to meh :O i cant copy paste it =/
<LjL> xratex: try "sudo apt-get install gpm", see if it works (gpm is for copying and pasting - but the command will probably not work)
<xratex> core dumped again
<LjL> xratex: ok, type this command      cat /etc/apt/sources.list | grep -v "ubuntu\.com" | grep -v "#"
<LjL> does it say anything?
<xratex> "-bash: grep-v: order not found" cat: /etc/apt/sources.list: file not found
<LjL> there is a space between "grep" and "-v"
<xratex> i did put it
<LjL> well i still think you mistyped something... otherwise that error is very weird
<LjL> try typing just
<LjL> ls  /etc/apt/sources.list
<xratex> "/etc/apt/sorces.list"
<xratex> thats all it says
<LjL> yes. this means the file exists, and you typed somethng wrong earlier
<xratex> ok ill retype
<LjL>  cat   /etc/apt/sources.list   |   grep   -v   "ubuntu\.com"   |   grep   -v   "#"
<xratex> ok now it says something
<LjL> i need to know what, if it's not too long
<xratex> "deb http://antesis.freeconrib.org/mirrors/ubuntu/plf/ breezy free-non free    (3 of that kind) and one woth automatix one with canonical
<xratex> with*
<LjL> breezy? wait you have breezy?
<LjL> !automatix
<ubotu> automatix is a script that tries to install some software, and often fails and breaks systems. We don't provide support for it, and we strongly discourage its use. Problems caused by Automatix are often hard to track and solve, and it might sometimes be easier to !install a fresh copy of Ubuntu. See also !WorksForMe
<LjL> xratex: ^ i'm afraid your system is seriously messed up
<xratex> T-T format?
<LjL> afraid so
<LjL> and don't use automatix next (or third-party repositories in general, unless you know very well what you're doing)
<xratex> kk
<LjL> xratex: anyway, type  apt-cache policy libc6 , and tell me the version
<xratex> kk
<xratex> E: Dynamic MMap ran out of room //////  E: error while processing xubuntu-system-tools ////E: problem with Mergelist /var/lib/apt/lists/archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_edgy-proposed_main_binary-i386_Packages
<LjL> .... edgy-proposed?
<LjL> what kind of mess do you have in your repositories?
<xratex> oO dont know
<LjL> yeah that's the problem -- you don't know
<LjL> you have a mixture of repositories that go from Breezy to Edgy
<LjL> that's three versions of Ubuntu
<LjL> then you have automatix
<LjL> and then you have edgy-proposed, which should *never* be used by *anyone* except for testing
<LjL> these things don't get added by magic, if they're there it means that you added them
<LjL> so
<LjL> 1) don't use automatix
<LjL> 2) don't follow ubuntuguide
<LjL> 3) don't blindly listen to people in #ubuntu-es or whatever who tell you to add random lines to your repository list
<LjL> ... and reinstall, since this is beyond any hope
<xratex> kk
<xratex> the problem is that im trying to learn, so i touch everything and this is what it happens
<xratex> so, where am i supposed to find help when i need to??
<LjL> #ubuntu is a good place, but you still need to take suggestions with a grain of salt..
<LjL> xratex: most importantly of all, *NEVER* add repositories if you don't know *FOR SURE* that they will work
<LjL> xratex: if they're mentioned on http://help.ubuntu.com , they're probably ok, otherwise, NOT
<xratex> ok, how am i supposed to save some things?
<xratex> got 2 hdds
<LjL> well save them on the second HD
<xratex> i dont know anything bout text mode
<LjL> xratex: well, maybe i can get you back to X temporarily
<LjL> xratex: type the following (carefully!)
<xratex> k
<LjL> xratex:    sudo sed -i.backup "s/nvidia/vesa/" /etc/X11/xorg.conf
<xratex> nvidia?
<xratex> got ati oO
<LjL> aah yeah sorry
<LjL> xratex:    sudo sed -i.backup "s/fglrx/vesa/" /etc/X11/xorg.conf
<xratex> done
<LjL> xratex: now do  sudo invoke-rc.d gdm restart 
<LjL> you're using GNOME, right?
<xratex> yup
<Turgon> I had "proposed updates" activated at the "Software Origins" manager. I'll uncheck that option before I mess my computer.
<LjL> Turgon: that's a very good idea.
<Turgon> (thx for discussing it here) =)
<LjL> i'm not even sure why proposed updates is listed there, actually...
<LjL> seems crazy to me
<xratex> LjL, nope, doesent work.. if i open with live CD my i burn some info in dvd?
<LjL> xratex: yes
<xratex> may*
<xratex> cool
<xratex> kk. format then, thanx alot for the help
<LjL> xratex: you'll need to know how to mount the hard drives, though
<xratex> oO
<LjL> xratex: unless it's done automatically by the live cd
<xratex> something like mount -all?
<xratex> kk brb
<LjL> hm, i'm afraid it's going to be more complicated than that
<xratex> kk lets see
<xratex> im starting live cd, may take a while
<xratex> not mounted =/
<jrib> still need to pastebin some stuff without X?
<xratex> ill format
<xratex> how do i mount the hdd in live cd?
<jrib> xratex: first you need to find out /dev/FOOBAR for the partition you want to mount, 'sudo fdisk -l' command usually helps with that if you don't already know it
<xratex> "/sda"
<jrib> xratex: I think it's usually /dev/sda1 for the first partition on /dev/sda .  Do you know which partition you want to mount?
<xratex> hmm dont know
<jrib> xratex: what does  sudo fdisk -l  show?
<xratex> disk /dev/hdb   /dev/sda //////// parition /dev/hda7
<jrib> copy and paste the actual output
<xratex> ?
<jrib> xratex: when you run the command  'sudo fdisk -l'  you get something different than "disk /dev/hdb   /dev/sda //////// parition /dev/hda7" right?  Just copy the actual output and paste it here so we can see it
<xratex> ok but most of it is in spanish :/
<jrib> xratex: then run it like this:  'LANGUAGE=en_US sudo fdisk -l'  without the '' quotes
<xratex> "here disk is something like /dev/hdb or /dev/sda/ and PARTITION is something like /dev/hda7.  -u: give start and end in sector (instead of cylinder) units.   -b 2048 (for certain MO disks) use 2048-byte sectors"
<xratex> thats all it says
<jrib> I don't understand why you don't just paste the full output
<xratex> becouse im not in that computer
<jrib> does that computer have internet access?
<xratex> that one is next to me, and im in al lan.. live cd doesent bring xchat, and i'll have to configure everything to have interent acces by lan
<xratex> i just need to mount that to save all my htmls from my website
<xratex> that are hosted in apache on that computer
<jrib> xratex: you see the "System" column in the output?
<xratex> yup
<jrib> which devices have "Linux" as the "System"?
<xratex> hda1 is linux,  hda2 is extended, and hda5 is the swap
<jrib> ok, 'sudo mkdir /media/hda1 && sudo mount -t ext3 /dev/hda1 /media/hda1'
<xratex> cool, mounted already :) thanks
<jrib> make sure that's the right partition now :)
<Psy> hello
<xratex> how was the command to see if my 3d driver is working
<xratex> how was the command to see if my 3d driver is working?
<xratex> anyone knows how to mount and write ntfs partitions?
<nalioth> xratex: use Windows(tm)
<xratex> ?
<nalioth> writing to NTFS is unstable in linux, and can lead to total ntfs partition losss
<xratex> well it's my choice to decide if i'll risk my hdd right?
<nalioth> !ntfs
<ubotu> To view your Windows/Mac partitions see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/AutomaticallyMountPartitions . For write access see !ntfs-3g or !fuse
#ubuntu-classroom 2008-02-04
<alinon> is there an easy way to increase the amount of lines used on the mouse scroll wheel?
#ubuntu-classroom 2008-02-05
<vallhalla81> hello all
<Kirrus> hello vallhalla81. This channel doesn't get used much when there's not anything scheduled.
#ubuntu-classroom 2008-02-07
<eradicus> hi, i'm interested in packaging, links would be highly appreciated :)
<CyberGabber> Sorry, but are there any scheduled classes planned ?
<nalioth> CyberGabber: /topic
<CyberGabber> nalioth: I already sniffer around, but it's seems to me that the latest class was on Oct 27th, 2007, maybe i'm wrong ?
<nalioth> did you check the wiki page?
#ubuntu-classroom 2008-02-08
<warp10> Hi all!
<dholbach> MOTU Q&A session in #ubuntu-classroom
<dholbach> hello everybody and welcome to another MOTU Q&A session! who do we have here for the session today?
 * dholbach is Daniel Holbach and seems until now to be alone in this session :-)
 * DktrKranz is Luca Falavigna, and please don't ask hard questions :)
 * dholbach hugs DktrKranz
 * mruiz is Miguel Ruiz... MOTU hopeful
 * persia is Emmet Hikory, present but slow to respond.
 * Hobbsee is absent.
<dholbach> it seems the MOTU Q&A session could do with some more advertising :)
<dholbach> do we have anybody with questions around?
 * slytherin is Onkar, MOTU hopeful and bugs persia and geser most of the time on #ubuntu-motu for solving java related problems.
<dholbach> thanks a lot for your work on that, slytherin
<slytherin> dholbach: I am glad I could help
<mruiz> dholbach, days ago I received a build error message: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/doc-debian/3.1.5ubuntu1/+build/502337. I'm wondering if someone could help me ...
<dholbach> mruiz: great - let's take a look at it
<dholbach> Build finished at 20080131-1850
<dholbach> to me it looks like it succeeded
<dholbach> Status:  	Failed to upload
<mruiz> the upload to the archive was rejected... more details: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/4339/
<persia> mruiz: You've caught an odd one: Failed to Upload
<persia> These typically indicate some oddity inside Soyuz at the time of the build
<DktrKranz> Failed to Upload, cprov's fault :)
<dholbach> best to ask cprov or more generally on #launchpad
<persia> I'd suggest asking a buildd admin to take a look on #ubuntu-devel (although bugging cprov on #launchpad is also known to help)
 * warp10 joins the session a little late... sorry!
<dholbach> hello warp10
<mruiz> this package includes documentation, but it generates not only .deb files ... some txt files appeared
<slytherin> I have one question. What is general criteria for approval of MOTU membership?
<warp10> hi dholbach and all
<dholbach> slytherin: a good track record of doing good work in the team and usually the best indicator is if your sponsors are completely happy with your work
<angelblade>  :)
<dholbach> when applicants ask me for my opinion as a MC member, I ask them to talk to their sponsors and get their input on the matter
<slytherin> dholbach: Does that mean it is best to have most of your work sponsored by same person?
<dholbach> slytherin: no, it's very good to work with a variety of people - as you tend to learn more that way
<dholbach> that's why the general sponsoring process is a good thing
<slytherin> Ok
<mruiz> dholbach, indeed... we have to work with the team :D
<persia> slytherin: I would recommend having your work be sponsored by many people.  Ideally you'll start working on something in such a way that you are working with your sponsors as peers, rather than as sponsors.
<dholbach> :-)
<persia> At this point, they are typically more than happy to say anything good about you it takes so that you can upload on your own.
<slytherin> And how do I decide when I am ready for membership? :-D
<persia> slytherin: That's a little more well defined.  You need "significant and sustained" contrinbutions, which is often interpreted as at least 2-6 months of stuff (depending on activity level), and attaining the respect and commendations of your peers working in that area.
<dholbach> (if you refer to ubuntumembers membership)
<slytherin> dholbach: No, I am talking MOTU membership
<persia> (yes.  one should wait for at least two sponsors to prompt prior to applying for membership of MOTU)
<dholbach> if you refer to MOTU membership instead: ask people that you've worked with (your sponsors), look at previous applications
<persia> slytherin: In that case, I answered the wrong question.
<slytherin> persia: Your latest answer is what I was looking for. :-)
<ScottK> I've found it's common for me to be pushing people to apply before they think they are ready.  I've also seen people turned down that applied to soon.
<ScottK> Waiting for sponsors to suggest it is a good idea.
<dholbach> if it happens regularly to you that your patches are sponsored as they are, that's a good sign :)
<persia> Personally, I think other good signs are MOTUs asking you for your opinion on various issues, finding that you have good answers to other Contributor questions, etc.
<slytherin> I guess I will wait for few weeks more. :-)
<dholbach> slytherin: It's great to have you on the team :-)
<dholbach> do we have any other questions?
<dholbach> no questions? :)
 * Hobbsee is sure someone has a question
<persia> If there are no questions, all Contributors in the audience should go find a bug, and submit for sponsoring.  Any issues encountered may be considered questions.
<mruiz> hey dholbach
<dholbach> hey mruiz :)
<dholbach> persia: that's a good one :)
<tuxmaniac> guess I am late..
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: no, not at all! :)
<persia> tuxmaniac: Late is acceptable, as long as you have a question or want an answer :)
<dholbach> if you have a question, fire away :)
<mruiz> I was working on a upgrade bug... (rezound) and I discovered a strange way to package it.
<Hobbsee> dholbach: i have a question.  what should someone do, that is actually useful, if they can't get a MOTU to review their stuff - particularly a new package on REVU?
<dholbach> mruiz: what's the problem you're seeing?
<persia> Hobbsee: There are cases of that?  Which package: I'll review it now.
<mruiz> rezound directory only contains: debian  rezound-0.12.2beta.tar.gz  rezound-0.12.2beta.tar.gz.cdbs-config_list
<Hobbsee> persia: i'm talking in the generic case - perhaps not so much now, but it certainly used to be a problem
<Hobbsee> and probably will be, after ff
<tuxmaniac> How do you handle problems related to upstream not ready to patch/create man pages according to lintian standards. Will Debian/Ubuntu always keep dpatching them? Or say upstream is not that active.
<persia> Hobbsee: Ah.  After FF.  Hmm.  I'll see about that somehow (and don't have an answer now).
<mruiz> dholbach, for me is new . I expected rezound files ... it uses cdbs
<dholbach> mruiz: it seems that they use tarball.mk (where you drop the upstream tarball into it)
<persia> mruiz: You've encountered the dreaded tarball-in-tarball.  cdbs-edit-patch or dpatch-edit-patch should untar to allow you to patch.
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: it's perfectly acceptable to keep an added manpage as a patch if upstream does not respond to a bug that requests adding it
<mruiz> dholbach, indeed debian/rules includes /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/tarball.mk
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: there's no need to make it a patch, you can simply add it to the debian directory and list it in debian/manpages
<persia> tuxmaniac: That is part of what MOTU does: make sure the packages meet our policies.  If upstream will accept patches, that is good.  If not, we have to carry them.
<mruiz> dholbach, for this case, how should I package the upgrade ?
<persia> mruiz: Best to check with the Debian maintainer to see if they want tarball-in-tarball again so that the orig.tar.gz can be the same and it can later be a sync.
<mruiz> persia, thanks :D
<dholbach> mruiz: I'm not sure it's the most elegant way but what should work is; mkdir reszound-<version>; cp -r rezound-<oldversion>/debian rezound-<version>.tar.gz rezound-<version>
<dholbach> (and change the version in debian/rules if necessary)
<dholbach> there's something that intrigued me about tarball.mk when I started packaging, but I forgot what it was and find it a bit annoying today :)
 * mruiz prefers debhelper instead of cdbs
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: did that answer your question?
<mruiz> dholbach, persia : thanks for your guidance ;-) ...
<tuxmaniac> dholbach, yes.
<dholbach> great
<dholbach> any other questions? anything we should take a look at together?
 * warp10 has a question
<dholbach> warp10: great
<Hobbsee> dholbach: can i have a heater?
 * Hobbsee is freezing!
<dholbach> Hobbsee: that's a good question - it's cold here too
 * persia is happy: 18 degrees of pure warmth
<warp10> I am packaging a software that creates an empty dir (/usr/share/locale) and lintian raises a warning about that
<warp10> Do I need to fix that? And if I do, what's best: using an rm in debian/control or patching upstream Makefile?
<ScottK> Hobbsee: If you're test building stuff you've packaged, your computer will warm the room.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: yeah, but i'd prefer a slight lack of fire
<dholbach> warp10: it's definitely a good idea to find out what's creating the directory - to me it looks like it's lacking translations that are installed there
<warp10> dholbach: indeed. the po/ is almost empty, but there is a Makefile.in.in that creates that directory
<dholbach> /usr/share/locale is a good thing - so the better fix might be to find out why no translations are shipped
<tuxmaniac> [repeat post] darn my network
<tuxmaniac> there was a bug 189030. It was a sync request.
<tuxmaniac> Build failed on hppa architecture, but still the status is Fix released?
<tuxmaniac> or how does one resolve such arch dependent issues in MOTU.
<tuxmaniac> [end]
<dholbach> in all other cases it's acceptable to remove an empty directory (if you can't figure out why or how it's created)
<Hobbsee> tuxmaniac: one doesn't care about hppa, unless one's name is lamont.
<Hobbsee> :)
<tuxmaniac> Hobbsee, heheh
<warp10> dholbach: probably upstream would like to add locales, but haven't been added yet
<persia> tuxmaniac: Currently "Fix Released" means the source fix was released.  You found a different bug.
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: the sync was executed so the bug is fixed - that it fails to build on one architecture is a different bug
<warp10> dholbach: ok, so an rm in debian/rules would be enough?
<dholbach> warp10: are there *.po files?
<tuxmaniac> aah true. thanks dholbach persia
<warp10> dholbach: no *.po files there
<dholbach> warp10: I personally would leave the directory there and ignore lintian
<dholbach> maybe the next release ships translations
<dholbach> in that case you will have to re-review debian/rules every time
<dholbach> (and by mistake ship the good translations :))
<dholbach> (and by mistake *not* ship the good translations :))
<warp10> dholbach: yeah, maybe. Good idea, I'll do that. Thanks :)
<dholbach> no problem
<dholbach> more questions? :)
<shibata> I have a questiion. I have translated documents in packaging-guide package to Japanese, but it seems to be obsolete document compare to on wiki. Do you have plan to release new packaging-guide or other MOTU's documents until hardy release?
<persia> Note that this makes sense for directories like /usr/share/locale which can be expected to be on a user system.  For directories like /usr/lib/mypackage/quux/plugins/foo/ removal is a better option.
<persia> shibata: Thank you very much, but no.  The wiki is replacing the package.  Perhaps you could put the translated documentation on the wiki?
<dholbach> that would be great
<dholbach> thanks a lot for the work you put into translating it
<mruiz> dholbach, do you have a schedule (or deadline) for the packaging guide?
<persia> dholbach: Have you filed for removal of that confusing package?
<shibata> persia: Should I translate bese on wiki?
<dholbach> persia: I'll talk to mdke about it
<persia> shibata: If you have the time to translate the wiki instead, that would be even better :)
<dholbach> do we have a canonical way of doing translations on the wiki?
<persia> (of course, if there was a sane method to exchange email between Ubuntu and æºå¸¯ it would be more useful)
<dholbach> or would it just be  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/<PackagingGuide in Japanese> ?
<dholbach> how do you say PackagingGuide in Japanese? :)
<shibata> Now, I translate on Japanese LoCo Wiki.
<persia> dholbach: MoinMoin has some multilingual features: lots of boilerplate is autotranslated to Japanese from a Japanese browser.  I'm not sure how it works though.  Be nice to leverage that if possible.
<dholbach> persia: I'll look into it
<shibata> https://wiki.ubuntulinux.jp/UbuntuPackagingGuideJa/
<dholbach> thanks for your work on it shibata
<persia> shibata: Until there is some reasonable documentation on the wiki about how to do proper multilingual pages, that's a very good place.  Thanks again.
<dholbach> I can't understand it, but it's beautiful
 * dholbach loves looking at 'foreign characters' :)
<shibata> If translate on official wiki, do I use same way Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter?
<dholbach> shibata: we could do that - I'll try to find out if there's a different way to do it and let you know
<eradicus> cool
<shibata> dholbach, persia: thanks
<dholbach> shibata: thank you
<dholbach> pango and gtk seem to figure out where a new japanese word starts, but it's hard for me to "see it"
<persia> dholbach: That's OK.  Even humans determine word breaks by context and meaning rather than graphical representation.
<dholbach> yeah :)
<mruiz> :)
<dholbach> any other questions?
<dholbach> if not, I'd take my dog for a walk now and see you in #ubuntu-motu later on :)
<dholbach> thanks everybody for showing up and asking very good questions
<dholbach> and thanks to everybody helping to answer the questions
<shibata> thank you
<mruiz> thanks guys
#ubuntu-classroom 2008-02-09
<WaiXan> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55412/
<WaiXan> You see
<jrib> hi
<WaiXan> hi
<jrib> tell me the output of 'ls -l /home/zander/shot'
<WaiXan> ok
<WaiXan> zander@zander-desktop:~$ ls -l /home/zander/shot
<WaiXan> -rwxr-xr-x 1 zander zander 629 2008-02-09 20:52 /home/zander/shot
<jrib> ok
<jrib> how about 'echo $PATH'
<WaiXan> zander@zander-desktop:~$ echo $PATH
<WaiXan> /usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin:/usr/games
<jrib> ok
<jrib> now run 'sudo cp /home/zander/shot /usr/local/bin' and tell me the output if any
<WaiXan> Non output
<WaiXan> *no output
<jrib> ok, now 'ls -l /usr/local/bin/'
<WaiXan> zander@zander-desktop:~$ ls -l /usr/local/bin/
<WaiXan> total 0
<jrib> ...
<jrib> that doesn't make sense
<jrib> what happens when you do 'sudo echo hi'?
<WaiXan> Nothing
<jrib> so your sudo is broken
<WaiXan> Bad
<jrib> tell me the output of 'groups'
<WaiXan> zander@zander-desktop:~$ groups
<WaiXan> zander adm dialout fax cdrom floppy tape audio dip video plugdev scanner fuse lpadmin admin netdev powerdev
<jrib> what version of ubuntu?
<WaiXan> 7.10
<LjL> someone finally made sudo a link to /bin/true?
<WaiXan> Gutsy
<jrib> LjL: any ideas before I go fishing?
<WaiXan> the whole sudo is broken
<LjL> jrib: not really, but i'd check the md5s of all files in the sudo package, not knowing any better
<jrib> WaiXan: did you know this before?
<WaiXan> jrib: Yes
<jrib> WaiXan: no ideas why?
<WaiXan> jrib: No.. I've just installed ubuntu
<jrib> WaiXan: did the install succeed without error?
<WaiXan> jrib: Yes it did
<jrib> WaiXan: are you able to open "system -> administration -> users and groups" for example?
<WaiXan> jrib: No I can't
<jrib> WaiXan: any errors?
<WaiXan> I'll check
<LjL> jrib: how about an strace of sudo
<WaiXan> jrib: It came one before but not now
<jrib> LjL: go for it
<WaiXan> I'll try to restart. That might help?
<LjL> WaiXan: pastebin the output of Â« strace sudo true Â» first please
<WaiXan> Ok
<WaiXan> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55414/
<LjL> bah, it's the same stuff as i get
<WaiXan> But What the hek
<jrib> WaiXan: try to do 'sudo -K' and then see if you get an error again
<WaiXan> jrib: It didn't gave me any output at all
<jrib> WaiXan: k, but try the Users and Groups program again
<WaiXan> Nothing happend :{
<LjL> ps aux
<jrib> don't know then
<WaiXan> It's just starting then terminating
<WaiXan> I might reinstall ubuntu
<WaiXan> or?
<WaiXan> I'll do that. Thanks. See you later
<LjL> WaiXan: give me Â« ps aux Â» and also Â« sudo apt-get install ubuntu-desktop Â»
<LjL> err
<LjL> nevermind the latter
<LjL> WaiXan: just Â« apt-cache policy ubuntu-desktop Â»
<jrib> or not
<LjL> i didn't have very much anyway
<LjL> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=573891
<jrib> heh
<waixan> jrib: Nu Ã¤r jag klar med ominstallationen
<waixan> jrib: Sorry.. It was swedish. But I'm done with reinstall
<waixan> How did I sudo move the file?
<jrib> how patient
<LjL> jrib: helt sÃ¥
#ubuntu-classroom 2009-02-02
<YoBoY> hi
<YoBoY> there is a log of the last classrooms about "how to run a bug jam" ?
#ubuntu-classroom 2009-02-03
<etix> Hello all!!!!
<oly562> hello i need help with recognizing a webcam on 8.04 LTS gnome desktop only
<oly562> anyone avail ? :)
<etix> am trying to set up my wireless for laptop and getting a nm-connection editor wants access to the default keyring but it's locked any suggestions?
<oly562> its a zonet
<oly562> remove the key?
<oly562> try again?
<etix> ???
<oly562> i dont store pw's sorry
<istaz> etix: it should only be a password you have given
<oly562> i have a webcam issue ;)
<etix> see that's what I thought but the pw is used was from the install and for the router but neither one work
<etix> *i used
<istaz> etix: you could always remove the keyring and create a new one but it will supress all you saved password
<etix> ok well i have to saved pw's so that would be ok... how do i remove the keyring
<oly562> thats what i was saying istaz lol
<oly562> meditate on that passwd
<oly562> ommmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
<oly562> ommmmmmmmm
<oly562> if you try to seek it, it will not come.... when you empty your mind it will appear
<istaz> etix: you should have an application named Passwords and Encryption Keys in the Accessory menu
<istaz> in that application go to Edit > Settings.  select the keyring and remove it
<etix> i'll give it a go thanks
<oly562> any webcam pros in here?
<oly562> little help ;)
<oly562> no
<oly562> ?
<oly562> can someone help me get my usbcam up and running
<oly562> im pretty linux savoy but this is really hard to figure out
<oly562> lsusb show its there
<oly562> so...
<oly562> iv gotten everything else to work, vidcard, wireless, printers.. but this cam is really bothering me
<oly562> waits....
<oly562> shrugs
<oly562> lol
<oly562> echo.... hello hello hello
<oly562> guess no one knows cams or is not watching the screen
<oly562> l
<synack> i have a really annoying problem w/ ubuntu 8.10 amd64 build making my cdrom unusable after i unmount a cd
<synack> only a reboot will fix it
<synack> anyone?
<maxb> synack: #ubuntu-classroom is a channel for scheduled presentations. Try #ubuntu.
#ubuntu-classroom 2009-02-04
<laughalots> k
<laughalots> wolter so I won't be able to detect USB until I add it in, right?
<wolter> hey
<laughalots> or any other kind of card reader
<wolter> laughalots, usb doesn't work with fstab, as far as I know
<laughalots> k
<wolter> nah, it does not...
<wolter> just checked.
<laughalots> k
<laughalots> so, also, I fixed the tabs--should it only be one tab per column, or should I line everything up with the top row?
<wolter> laughalots, look, if you wanted, you could just leave one space between each thing, but it would look disorganized.. I just tried to align every item by type on the same column
<laughalots> k --just wanted to make sure it wasn't critical
<laughalots> im going to copy it over and log off now--see if it works. I may be back. I really appreciate your help
#ubuntu-classroom 2009-02-05
<SherokiX> hi
#ubuntu-classroom 2009-02-07
<forestpixie> morning - are there any mods in here at the moment?
<jpds> forestpixie: Hi there.
<forestpixie> hey jpds I have a sessionlater at 1330UTC - I need it to be moderated - can you give me ops please
<forestpixie> thank you - :)
<lukjad007> Heh talsemgeest
<talsemgeest> I'll log it and look over it later :)
 * lukjad007 is looking for the log button
<forestpixie> it's in the woods lukjad007
<jpds> !logs
<ubot2> Channel logs can be found at Channel logs can be found at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ - See also !OpenWeek - See also !OpenWeek
<forestpixie> hey PartyBoi2 - are you here to keep me company :)
<PartyBoi2> yep :)
<forestpixie> well if easwar fails to appear you can do more than keep me company
<PartyBoi2> hopefully easwar will show
<forestpixie> +1
<unutbu> howdy
<forestpixie> hi unutbu
<forestpixie> are you here for the session?
<unutbu> Sure am.
<forestpixie> did you connect to the virtual terminal ok
<unutbu> oh... I don't know about this...
<unutbu> what am I supposed to do?
<forestpixie> oh - well half is here and I'll be running various things in a virtual terminal
<forestpixie> 2 secs
<forestpixie> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FocusGroups/Education/STS
<unutbu> thanks forestpixie, I'm ssh'd
<forestpixie> oh excellent - so are some others too :)
<forestpixie> other than unutbu is there anyone else here for the session? I'll be setting the channel to moderated soon
<forestpixie> couple of minutes and I'll make a start
<forestpixie> Ok - then this is the fdisk/fstab/chmod and chown session
<forestpixie> This session Is moderatedâ­ â â¬this means that you won't be able to talk until you have been voiced,â­ â¬you can â­ /msg PArtyBoi2 and he can voice you in turn
<forestpixie> Right then, to the session properâ­ â¬-â­ â¬I intend to first work through using fdisk which is a command line partition tool and then to format our new partitions.
<forestpixie> We'll follow that with a question/answer session
<forestpixie> Thenâ­  â¬we will take a look at the fstab file,â­ â¬this file gives static information about partitions we wish to mount on boot
<forestpixie> We will be looking at our own fstab files in relation to theâ­ â¬/â­ â¬and swap partitions and then write the lines needed to mount our new partitionsâ­ â¬,once again following that we will have a Q&A sessionâ­
<forestpixie> The final part of the session will look at the chmod and chown commands,â­ â¬chmod can be used to change permissions on files,â­ â¬chown can be used to change file ownership.â­
<forestpixie> Ok - fdisk first, a little bit more here then we can look at the virtual terminal
<forestpixie> I am going to create the following partitionsâ­ â¬,â­ â¬2â­ â¬primaries,â­ â¬1â­ â¬extended and a logical inside it.
<forestpixie> You start fdisk with root rights on the device you wish to work with
<forestpixie> sudo fdiskâ­ â¬/dev/sxyâ­ â â¬the number of the drive can be found by using fdisk -lâ­ â â¬check the virtual terminal
<forestpixie> You can see that it has listed 2 drives - we are going to use /dev/sdbâ­
<forestpixie> so we will start fdisk on that drive
<forestpixie> m will givce you all the commands you can use here
<forestpixie> To create a new drive useâ­ 'â¬nâ­' â¬it then asks us what type of partition we want,â­ â¬I want the first partition to be a primary,â­ â¬so to create a primary we useâ­ 'â¬pâ­'
<forestpixie> Now we need to tell fdisk which partition we want to create,â­ â¬I want it to be numberâ­ 1
<forestpixie> I am going to use cylinders to set up the sizes of the partitionsâ­ â â¬we can see from the previous fdisk output that the whole drive is 652 cyclinders in size. I used the default setting for the first cylinder of this partition
<forestpixie> Now I need to specify where the partition ends,â­ â¬for the first partition I useâ­ â¬200â­ â¬as I want the partition to beâ­  â¬that many cylinders in size
<forestpixie> I could if I wanted create the partition using a number to give it a size,â­ â¬you use G for Gb,â­ â¬M for Mb or K for Kb
<forestpixie> Finally I need to tell fdisk to complete the operation and write the new partition table,â­ â¬to do this useâ­  w
<forestpixie> If I use fdiskâ­ â¬-l it should now show me my new partition,
<forestpixie> Ok I will now proceed to create the remaining partitions.â­ â¬Firstâ­ â¬1â­ â¬more primary and then the extended with it's associated logical,â­ â¬this time I will make all the new partitions and then write the table at the end
<forestpixie> Now that I have an extended that choice is no longer possible,â­ â¬so now we can only create primaries or logical as you will see,â­ â¬further once fdisk knows I wish to create a logical it will only allow me to create it within the extended partition
<forestpixie> Ok so we now have our partitions created - at the moment they are all needing filesystems, before we do that I'll stop and you can tell me if I was to slow or fast :)
<forestpixie> if you have any questions - ask now
<forestpixie> on to creating the filesystems then - so back and forth between here and the terminal
<forestpixie> We can use the mkfs,â­ â¬mkdosfs and mkntfsâ­  â¬commands here to accomplish thisâ­ â¬,â­ â¬the syntax to use this command is similar for allâ­ â¬3
<forestpixie> sudo mkfsâ­ â¬-t filetypeâ­ â¬/dev/sdxy , So the commands we will need to run in our vt are
<forestpixie> Ok we now have our created our new partitions and formatted them.
<forestpixie> As ther are no questions I'll carry on with fstab
<forestpixie> If you run cat /etc/fstab in a normal terminal you will see this at the top
<forestpixie> â­  <file system> <mount point>   <type>  <options>       <dump>  <pass>
<forestpixie> This is part of my fstab relating to myâ­ â¬/â­ â¬partitionâ­
<forestpixie> UUIDâ­=â¬9d44e64b-0c3f-4376-93f5-7e0a4bc9afacâ­ â¬/â­ â¬ext3â­ â¬relatime,errors=remount-roâ­  â¬0â­ â¬1â­
<forestpixie> OK,â­ â¬so now lets have a look at the fstab line in some more detail and then finally we can look at creating a new line.â­
<forestpixie> The first part  to the UUID,â­ â¬you can if you wish use the device name instead of UUIDâ­
<forestpixie> to do so I would replace it withâ­ â¬/dev/sda2â­ â¬this would make my fstab line read soâ­
<forestpixie> /dev/sda2â â/â âext3â­ â¬relatime,errors=remount-roâ­ â¬0â­ â¬1â­
<forestpixie> The advantage of using the UUID lies in it not changing unless a change is made to the partition itself,â­ â¬creating,â­ â¬removing or resizing other partitions doesn't affect the UUID of unaffected partitions.â­
<forestpixie> The next part of the lineâ­ â¬-â­ â¬/â­ â¬tells the system where we want our partition to mount,â­ â¬this partition is my install so I want it mounting as rootâ­
<forestpixie> Following the mount point is the filesystem typeâ­ â¬-â­ â¬mine is ext3,â­ â¬if you have a default installation yours should be the same,â­ â¬if you have any ntfs drives mounting then that would read ntfs or maybe ntfs-3g
<forestpixie> After the filesystem,â­ â¬any options are indicated,â­ â¬here relatime is the first option followed by the errors=remount-ro optionâ­ â¬-â­ â¬this second option is the one which will cause the system to remount the partition as read only
<forestpixie> The next section is set asâ­ â¬0â­ â¬-â­ â¬this is the dump option and relates to whether the filesystem is backed up by dump,â­ â¬0,â­ â¬the default is no.
<forestpixie> Finally we have the pass sectionâ­ â¬-â­ â¬this is set toâ­ â¬1â­ â¬-â­ â¬this controls the order in which a filesystem is checked by fsck,â­ â¬aâ­ â¬1â­ â¬means that the partition is checked first,â­ â¬aâ­ â¬0â­ â¬would stop the check and aâ­ â¬2â­ â¬would mean it was checked last.â­
<forestpixie> If there any latecomers can they /msg PartyBoi2 with questions please :)
<forestpixie> Before we can actually mount any new partitions,â­ â¬we need to have somewhere to mount it,â­ â¬the mountpoint,â­ â¬so we do that by making a folder.
<forestpixie> I tend to useâ­ â¬/mnt for my mountsâ­ â â¬if you want the partition to be visible on the desktop then create your folder inâ­ â¬/media instead
<forestpixie> To do that we would use the mkdir command like so
<forestpixie> sudo mkdir /mnt/foldername
<forestpixie> So to allow our new partitions to mount correctly I need to create their mountpoints - one for each partition we have created
<forestpixie> which I need to do no win the shared terminal
<forestpixie> So now we have the new folders inâ­ â¬/mnt to use.
<forestpixie> db1 - you have a question?
<d1b> yes what happens if you rename a luks lvm volume -> will it continue to work if you use the uuid in /etc/fstab or do you need to update initrd ?
<forestpixie> I don't know the answer to that - I've never used them
<forestpixie> if anyone else does I think you should be able to talk until I set the mode again
<forestpixie> so we've made our folders in /mnt now we need ot add them to fstab
<forestpixie> We are going to be editing the file with a terminal based text editor - it's useful to know your way around at least one - if you ever need to edit a file from the recovery menu then I'm afraid that a GUI editor like gedit, kate or mousepad will be of no use.
<forestpixie> so first we give tell it which partition we are mounting
<forestpixie> which is /dev/sdb1â­
<forestpixie> Next we have to tell it our new mountpoint
<forestpixie> â­/dev/sdb1  /mnt/ext3
<forestpixie> Next comes the filetype
<forestpixie> â­	/dev/sdb1   /mnt/ext3   ext3
<forestpixie> Next come any options you wish to passâ­ â â¬I add user here
<forestpixie> Finally we come to the dump and pass options,â­ â¬use the defaultâ­ â¬0â­ â¬for the dump andâ­ â¬2â­ â¬for the pass option,â­ â¬it is suggested that you allow fsck to check the drive,â­ â¬but if you wished it not to then you would set the pass option toâ­ â¬0 - you can change the frequency that fsck checks a drive
<forestpixie> Now I shall add the lines for our otherâ­ â¬2â­ â¬partitions,â­ â¬the ntfs and fat32
<forestpixie> So that is the data entered into fstab,â­ â¬you would now need to save the file
<forestpixie> I would now mount to check that the partitions have mounted without any problems
<forestpixie> Assuming that there is no output on the screen then the partition has mounted.â­ â¬You can check to see with a couple of commands,â­ â¬but df is a bit easier to scan
<forestpixie> ok - it's possible that there is a apparmor operating on the terminal - I've done this ocne earlier and it worked without issue
<forestpixie> ok - we have a small problem in the shared terminal :(
<forestpixie> we can stop for a while for any questions - we are unmoderated so I think you can talk
<forestpixie> If you have questions ?
<unutbu> could you cat /etc/fstab please?
<forestpixie> yep
<unutbu> There is a space before dev/sdb2
<unutbu> huh, weird
<forestpixie> so there was - pasting from abiword doesn't work as well as openoffice :)
<forestpixie> the vm is running on jaunty, I think there were some issues when the vm was set up - but he's not about so I can't ask
<forestpixie> I ran this previously and the log from the session is on the wiki page
<unutbu> Maybe there is some invisible character that came with the pasting?
<forestpixie> possibly I can try doing ti long hand :)
<forestpixie> thanks you unutbu :)
<unutbu> cool
<forestpixie> ok then we can move on if there are no questions :)
<unutbu> Could you do sudo fdisk -l one more time?
<forestpixie> first we can look at chown - changing ownership of files or folders
<forestpixie> I think that is the problem we had from the beginning with the vm unutbu
<unutbu> ok
<forestpixie> I have no idea why it shows them all as linux - nor did bodhi
<unutbu> when you use fdisk, you can use a command to change the partition type
<unutbu> it is interesting that you can proceed without doing so
<unutbu> within fdisk the command is 't'
<forestpixie> to be honest I've only used it a few times in anger - and I rarely have anything to do with win filesystems anymore
<unutbu> you can still do it; even on a partition with a filesystem
<unutbu> :) lol
<forestpixie> I can have a look later if you want
<unutbu> ok
<forestpixie> Nearly finished now
<forestpixie> There areâ­ â¬4â­ â¬different permutations available for the owner and group changes
<forestpixie> so we'll make a folder in our /etx3 partition and change the owner and group to see the changes
<forestpixie> so we can change the fodler with chown
<forestpixie> so chown can change the owner or group for a folder or file
<forestpixie> chmod will change the permissions for files or folders
<forestpixie> the command is used like
<forestpixie> chmod 000 /path/to/file
<forestpixie> the numbers are made from 4, 2 and 1 - giving a combination of read, write and execute
<forestpixie> ls -al will show the current permissions - the d simply denoting that it is a folder rather than a file
<forestpixie> at the moment the folder temp has 755 permissions fro group and others - owner has read,write and execute
<forestpixie> so in the shared session I can change them
<forestpixie> so once we know the chmod and chown commands we can change the owner and permissions of any file or folder
<forestpixie> ok - thanks for coming along - that's it for the time being
<PartyBoi2> thanks forestpixie
<forestpixie> so if there are any questions - think them up while I put the kettle on
<forestpixie> unutbu: do you want to show me what you were telling me ?
<unutbu> Ah sure
<unutbu> sorry, was away
<unutbu> fdisk /dev/sdb
<forestpixie> you can use wall in the terminal - Ctrl-a :wall "message"
<unutbu> Sorry, can't seem to find ntfs...
<PartyBoi2> 7 I think
<unutbu> right; thanks
<unutbu> Im' having a hard time with :wall
<forestpixie> so am I - do it here :D
<unutbu> type 2 for partition 2
<unutbu> type b to make set the partition type to FAT32
<unutbu> or c
<forestpixie> oh yea cool
<unutbu> right
<unutbu> sudo fdisk -l?
<forestpixie> smashing - thanks very much
<unutbu> What I don't know is : if this matters in the slightest
<forestpixie> heh
<unutbu> The filesystems seem to work just fine without this
<forestpixie> I would guess that it would fall apart if you tried to see them in windows though
<unutbu> hm, yes
<forestpixie> I don't like wall very much though
<unutbu> Windows seems to respect the hidden partition types, so indeed it probably is looking at this info
<unutbu> irc question: how do you msg PartyBoi2?
<unutbu> I kept getting "Unable to find nick or channel"
<forestpixie> I think that /msg nick is how you do it - I use xchat and usually just right click on their name
<unutbu> Sorry, I seem to have managed it now
<forestpixie> :)
<forestpixie> well I have to go now - thanks for coming - I should be able to get at that drive next week so I can let you know how many partitions I managed to make :)
<unutbu> Thanks forestpixie!
<forestpixie> ok cya later then :)
<PartyBoi2> cya you all later
#ubuntu-classroom 2009-02-08
<rZr> hi
<rZr> if it maters, there is a live video at fosdem : http://www.newlc.com/en/2009-events-fosdem-now-wmc-next (now explain cdbs)
<chrismurf> Can someone point me in the right direction for how to get a (new) package into Universe?
<chrismurf> Built a package, not clear on the process for getting it into ubuntu eventually
<pleia2> chrismurf: you're looking for the MOTU team: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
<chrismurf> pleia2, Thank you
<chrismurf> I also just stumbled across #debian-python on OFTC, since it's a python package -- seems like that might be helpful
* pleia2 changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Ubuntu Classroom || https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-classroom || Upcoming Events: How to run a Bug Jam Feb 13th @ 12:00 UTC and 14th @ 00:00 UTC! | Run 'date -u' in a terminal to find out the UTC time
<pleia2> chrismurf: have you built the package yet? Debian and Ubuntu are similar with package building, but completely different when it comes to actually getting them in each distro
<chrismurf> pleia2, I have a package for ubuntu on my PPA
<chrismurf> Ready to go for intrepid, builds on their system (so dep's are right)
<pleia2> chrismurf: okay, you'll want to talk to the Ubuntu folks specifically then
<chrismurf> okay - thanks
<pleia2> welcome :)
<dou213> hi guys, does eBox or any other applications providig a web (graphical) interface work on ubuntu server edition (no X) ?
<dou213> *providing
<pleia2> dou213: I think you want #ubuntu or #ubuntu-server
#ubuntu-classroom 2010-02-09
<jiohdi> I have remote desktop installed... I can control computer X with Y, but I only get the very first screen and from there the screen does not update...anyone?
<hashimi> when i mount my usb in linux and then goto windows. in windows part it has character problems. how i can solve this.
<persia> hashimi: You may find better support in #ubuntu : this channel is reserved for scheduled classes.
<hashimi> thanks persia
<hashimi> by the way, are you from iran? just wondering? do you know farsi?
<persia> No, and no, and while I'm very attached to my nick for historical reasons, I sometimes wish it was different just because I get asked that a lot :)
<persia> The salient point without getting into the entire story is that the monarchial title in the lands of Iran and Non-Iran was never "king".
<hashimi> Persia, i just ask this because i can speak farsi , i mean persian.
<hashimi> i did not ask that for something else reasons.
<hashimi> :)
<persia> You mean farsi :)
<hashimi> yeah :)
 * persia got a long lecture once about "Persia" != "Iran and non-Iran" and "Persian" != "Farsi".
<persia> But lots of westerners seem to have inherited Roman prejudices unintentionally.
<hashimi> Actually; it is not farsi, but it is Parsi
<hashimi> that f is comming from arabic that arabs use it. because they don't have p in their language.
<hashimi> so actually i must say Parsi or Persian :)
<persia> It's "Parsi"?  Aha.  I'll remember that.
<persia> I thought "Parsi" was specific to the exiles now living in India, and a term for a set of people.
<hashimi> Not actually like that i think.
<hashimi> But Parsi is the original language in Khorasan, now it is renamed as Afghanistan.
 * persia reads up on nomenclature, and is surprised by ÑÐ¾Ò·Ð¸ÐºÓ£
<hashimi> what is that :)
<persia> A name for what wikipedia claims is the same language, as written in Tijik Cyrillic
<hashimi> hmm i understand :)
#ubuntu-classroom 2010-02-11
<samnick_> hi all
#ubuntu-classroom 2010-02-12
* cjohnston changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Ubuntu Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Packaging/Training || Upcoming: Thu Feb 25 @ 1500 UTC : Intro to Python for Beginners; Thu Feb 25 @ 1600 UTC : Intro to Python for Programmers; Sat 27 Feb @ 00:00 UTC : Bugs Q&A; 1 March - 6 March : Ubuntu Opportunistic Developer Week https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOpportunisticDeveloper
* cjohnston changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Ubuntu Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Packaging/Training || Upcoming: Thu 25 Feb @ 1500 UTC : Intro to Python for Beginners; Thu 25 Feb @ 1600 UTC : Intro to Python for Programmers; Sat 27 Feb @ 00:00 UTC : Bugs Q&A; 1 March - 6 March : Ubuntu Opportunistic Developer Week https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOpportunisticDeveloper
<virtuald> cjohnston: the wiki link at the end is still chopped off
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Ubuntu Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Packaging/Training || Upcoming: Thu 25 Feb @ 1500 UTC : Intro to Python for Beginners; Thu 25 Feb @ 1600 UTC : Intro to Python for Programmers; Sat 27 Feb @ 00:00 UTC : Bugs Q&A; 1 March - 6 March : Ubuntu Opportunistic Developer Week http://is.gd/8cTje
<DeeJay1_> .
#ubuntu-classroom 2010-02-13
<rabbi1> ï»¿hi guys, can anybody help me with LAMP?
#ubuntu-classroom 2010-02-14
<msa> My 2year old manages to hose my desktop while screen is locked... by somehow creating about 200 gdm greeter/metacity sessions.. How can I prevent it? Where is he config to limit the number?
<kaptainzero> hi
<kaptainzero> no one answers
<kaptainzero> left the chat
<Michael__> anyone here
#ubuntu-classroom 2011-02-07
<head_victim> zkriesse: if it's ok with you I will go ahead tonight (in about 14 hours or so?) and put the fix I found for my LoCo header into the UBT one so it fixes the rendering issue with chromium based browsers.
<head_victim> I'll link you to a diff so you can see what I did, that being said it will still render differently on MS and Opera browsers.
<head_victim> sorry, wrong window, mouse fail.
#ubuntu-classroom 2011-02-08
<midhuno> hi
<midhuno> i am new to linux
<midhuno> i want know about the terminel
<midhuno> anybody helpme...............................
<UndiFineD> midhuno: join are better to join #ubuntu-beginners
<devkorcvince> how to learn on packaging and doing stuff in ubuntu? don't really know where to start?
<maco> #ubuntu-packaging
<devkorcvince> maco: the first step on contributing on application is packaging right?
<maco> you're trying to get a new package added to the repo?
<maco> if so then file a bug requesting it, package it up marking which bug itll close, and upload the source package to revu
<maco> !revu
<ubot2> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<maco> devkorcvince: -motu actually was the *right* channel. that or -packaging.
<maco> devkorcvince: this channel is for scheduled classes at specific times
<maco> (the difference between -packaging and -motu seems to be that packaging things for a ppa is allowed to be asked in -packaging but not -motu)
<devkorcvince> maco: oh thanks how about on contributing on older package like guake or gedit?
<maco> devkorcvince: in that case, attach a .debdiff to the bug you are fixing. the debdiff should apply to the current development release (natty) unless it's already fixed there in which case you can follow the sru process
<maco> ...to get it fixed in a stable release
<devkorcvince> maco: ok thanks I will ask question on -motu when im finished studying packaging and stuff
#ubuntu-classroom 2011-02-09
<Clen> hi
<neilman01> hey
<neilman01> anybody else up?
<shankhs> hi, there seems to be some problem with the ical link in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek
<shankhs> http://www.google.com/calendar/ical/chrisjohnston.org_dggtpkdogolhb4uftc6l2e15uk%40group.calendar.google.com/public/basic.ics , can anybody please share the calendar? Thanks
<pleia2> shankhs: thanks, looking into it
<shankhs> pleia2: thanks
#ubuntu-classroom 2011-02-11
<carson> hello
<Mathiasbk> b
<Mathiasbk> hey
<robbiew> o/
<robbiew> don't want to be "tardy for the party"
<jono> hi everyone!
<jono> alrighty, I think we are nearly ready for the Q+A
<jono> today we have an awesome guest
<jono> he is Robbie Williamson who leads the Ubuntu Server Team
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Sessions in #ubuntu-classroom, chat and questions releated to sessions here || Upcoming Schedule in #ubuntu-classroom: https://is.gd/8rtIi || Preface questions with QUESTION: Current Session: Q and A with Robbie Williamson, Server Engineering Manager - Instructors: robbiew
 * robbiew also leads Foundations ;)
<jono> so today feel free to ask all your questions about Ubuntu Server, the cloud, and the future :-)
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/02/11/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<jono> ahhh
<jono> couldnt speak for a second there :-)
<jono> asking a question is simple:
<jono> ask your questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat and prefix every questions with 'QUESTION'
<jono> e.g.:
<jono> QUESTION: What new features are coming in Ubuntu Server in 11.04?
<jono> I will cut and paste the questions in here for robbiew
<jono> alrighty, let's give it a few minutes for you folks to add some questions and then lets get going
<jono> come on folks, feel free to add your questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat :-)
<jono> <m4n1sh> Question: Any statistics of what % of EC2 instances run Ubuntu server?
<jono> robbiew, ^
<robbiew> a lot
<robbiew> :)
<robbiew> all joking aside
<robbiew> Amazon doesn't reveal those numbers
<robbiew> so it's hard for us to really say
<robbiew> there are other organizations out there who attempt to count
<robbiew> and we typically lead the pack
 * robbiew will look for a juicy link
<robbiew> jono: go ahead with the next question and I'll post the link when I find it
<jono> <akshatj> Question: What in Ubuntu server differentiates it from other server distros?
<robbiew> good question
<robbiew> so for one, I'd point to the cloud infrastructure integration
<robbiew> i.e. eucalyptus and soon-to-be openstack
<robbiew> beyond that...we've recently started working on an infrastructure service suite
<robbiew> called orchestra
<robbiew> with the aim of making a sysadmins life easier
<robbiew> in terms of everything he/she needs to do to get servers and services up and running fast
<robbiew> across multiple machines
<robbiew> http://launchpad.net/orchestra
<robbiew> up until recently, we were focused on being Debian + security updates and regular cadence
<robbiew> as Debian itself is a rock sold server platform
<robbiew> but with the emergence of cloud, we've seen an opportunity
<robbiew> beyond that, we are also looking at other architectures besides x86 and amd64
<robbiew> where we feel a strong server presence helps us
<robbiew> ARM for example is VERY interesting
<robbiew> and we hope to partner with Linaro and the Ubuntu on ARM team to deliver something soon
 * robbiew needs hardware first ;)
<jono> robbiew, still there?
<jono> <zul> question: any new cloudy things coming down the pipe?
 * robbiew thinks 
<robbiew> we also have some suite tools, like byobu
<robbiew> but I'd be happy if other distros picked that up too
<robbiew> and we have work on power management tools for servers...like PowerNap
<robbiew> I could go on and on...feel free to email me and I can point you to a few places
<robbiew> jono: next?
<robbiew> jono:  hello? is this thing on :P
<jono> I think we are having a few freenode server issues
<jono> a lot of scrollback just appeared
<jono> <zul> question: any new cloudy things coming down the pipe?
<robbiew> "cloudy things"
<jono> :-)
<robbiew> well...zul
<robbiew> that's an excellent question
<robbiew> the easiest answer is "yes"...better integration with openstack....making sure folks can deploy clouds on their choice of infrastructure
<robbiew> eucalyptus or openstack
<robbiew> in term of running IN the cloud
<robbiew> smoser has done some very cool things with cloud-init
<robbiew> (I'm sure you can talk to him about this)
<robbiew> given zul is on the Ubuntu Server team...I'll end there
<robbiew> ;)
<robbiew> if he doesn't know...we have a problem :P
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <m4n1sh> Question: Isn't 6 months release cycles for a server version just too fast? 3 years support and 5 yrs LTS support is also fine, but 6 months cycle sounds fast for server markets
<robbiew> not if you run in the cloud
<robbiew> were you could care less about what hardware you run on
<robbiew> and you want the latest php or mysql support
<robbiew> the way I see it, for server, we should build towards an LTS
<robbiew> knowing most users will prefer an LTS, we should plan accordingly
<robbiew> with each non-LTS being stable to stand-alone, but used as ways to introduce new features
<robbiew> that can be tested for robustness with each successive release
<robbiew> leading up to LTS
<robbiew> so we should strive to push the newest stuff LTS+1 and gradually reduce the "riskiness" as we get closer to the LTS
<robbiew> with the LTS dev cycle having most of its' focus on stabilizing what we have
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <Daviey> QUESTION: How does Canonical's interest and commitment differ from the server flavour?
<robbiew> another Ubuntu Team question..nice
<robbiew> will make this short
<robbiew> Canonical is a business, and this aims to make money using Ubuntu Server as the core of it's service offerings around Server
<robbiew> Ubuntu Server is a distro
<robbiew> and aims to provide the best opensource has to offer for a server os
<robbiew> free of charge
<robbiew> ;)
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <popey> QUESTION: What are you doing to get applications like SAP certified on Ubuntu Server? Right now I have to use RedHat or SuSe.
<robbiew> oh man...good one
<robbiew> so this is where having Canonical as a backer of Ubuntu Server helps
<robbiew> in order to be a REAL player in linux server, you need strong relationships with hardware providers
<robbiew> like Dell, HP, IBM, etc
<robbiew> ISVs support what the OEM's ship
<robbiew> pretty simple
<robbiew> so, that's why we were excited about Dell's recent announcement regarding the shipment of servers with Ubuntu installed
<robbiew> targeted at cloud of course
<robbiew> but to be the best cloud os, we need top notch hardware support
<robbiew> I think the ISVs will begin to come soon...as Ubuntu grows in popularity in the cloud
<robbiew> and more businesses start trusting their workloads in the cloud
<robbiew> and more try to find cheaper ways to run...which means not wanting to pay license fees for every instance in the cloud
<robbiew> Canonical is working VERY hard to partner with ISVs
<robbiew> to help all this along
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <Drankinn> QUESTION: Question: Are there plans to make landscape more affordable or open source. Or is there a good alternative?
<robbiew> I don't no, as Landscape is a Canonical product developed outside my team
<robbiew> depending on what your needs are, I think orchestra can be an alternative at some degree
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <nlsthzn> question: With the instability with Novel and SUSE, is there any plans to aggresively go after current potentially dissilusioned users?
 * robbiew rushes a bit to answer as many ?s as possible
<robbiew> absolutely
<robbiew> I think we should at least try to support the same architectures
<robbiew> to allow those users to migrate
<robbiew> but that will take time
<robbiew> re: architectres, specifically speaking about ppc and s390
<robbiew> IBM platforms traditionally supported by SUSE (and  RHEL)
<robbiew> but we still need to stay focused on cloud...where I feel things are transitioning to
<robbiew> where the hardware becomes more of a commodity
<robbiew> so I guess it's a balancing act
<robbiew> to keep one eye on current landscape and the other on where we think it's moving to
<robbiew> and choosing our features and strategic direction appropriately
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <popey> QUESTION: People ask me (surprisingly often) 'Why run Ubuntu when I can run Debian server?'. What's the 'Caononical' answer to that?
<robbiew> heh
<robbiew> I asked the same thing
<robbiew> well for one, security updates
<robbiew> now we do try to keep Debian updated with our updates...but we can't force them to
<robbiew> and to be honest, the cloud integration, but for some...Debian is the answer
<robbiew> now if you need support
<robbiew> well...then I suggest Ubuntu Server, where you can get email and phone support from Canonical
<robbiew> as well as engineering assistance to in deploying customized solutions
<robbiew> Canonical sells a "service"...not a Server
<robbiew> ;)
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <popey> QUESTION: People like Turnkey Linux are making lots of applicances based on Ubuntu Server. Is this something Canonical have considered, given a brand new server is
<jono>  somewhat unexciting on its own?
 * robbiew clearly needs to setup an interview with popey :P
<robbiew> so, yes
<robbiew> but I'm not the right person to ask
<robbiew> Nick Barcet is the man you want to talk to ;)
<robbiew> nijaba on IRC
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <popey> QUESTION: I am often asked for a webmin like system (but not webmin for historical reasons) for administering servers, to bring the admin overhead down and comparable with MS SBS. Something you're looking at?
<robbiew> yup...orchestra will solve all your troubles :)
<robbiew> well...not all
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <jhattara> QUESTION: Are there any plans for better official support for hardware management drivers and software of high-end servers, like IBM?
<robbiew> yes, there are
<robbiew> and that's all I can say now ;)
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <rohit64> QUESTION: is it possible to have an UI (gnome or kde) for Ubuntu Server ?
<robbiew> ahh
<robbiew> sure sudo apt-get install ubuntu-desktop
<robbiew> Server and Desktop share the same archive, so it's possible
<robbiew> but we don't have any plans (of yet) to roll out a UI specifically for Server
<robbiew> that of course could change tomorrow
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <Oceanvibe> QUESTION Is ubuntu server good for heavy hosting?
<robbiew> "heavy hosting"
<robbiew> you mean like wikipedia or something?
<robbiew> yes
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <sebsebseb> QUESTION: What kind of paid Canonical customers tend to use Ubuntu Server and for what?
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<robbiew> typically ones who either can't afford the license fees of other Linux server distros, but want support
<robbiew> or need an OS that moves at a faster rate to support key hardware/software features they need
<robbiew> tbh, I'm just an engineering manager...and i try to keep focused there
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <sebsebseb> QUESTION: Do you think that Ubuntu Server will turn into mainly a cloud distribution?
<robbiew> no
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <doctormo> QUESTION: Do you have any ideas on how to encourage existing systems administrators to take part in the Ubuntu community and provide ideas and fixes to make servers easier to manage?
<robbiew> first, as promised, in reference to the first question about EC2 statistics: http://thecloudmarket.com/stats#/by_platform_definition
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<robbiew> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/GettingInvolved
<robbiew> go there :)
<robbiew> participate in #ubuntu-server
<robbiew> join lists
<robbiew> reach out
<robbiew> email me...I'll get to it
<robbiew> pretty good at keeping my email inbox low ;)
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <Brumle> Question: Are there any "products" for lined up for identity management, mangement of many servers (puppet), or other enterprise needs?
<robbiew> I wouldn't say "product", but orchestra can do some of this
<robbiew> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/cloud-server-n-install-service
<robbiew> describes our work on it
<robbiew> and any member of the team can provide more details
<robbiew> jono: next
<jono> <Tickon> QUESTION: How good would Ubuntu Sever be for a cloud based startup company? Would it be a logical choice? Could it scale up well if our traffic gets big?
<robbiew> last one
<robbiew> absolutely
<robbiew> check out www.atlantic.net ;)
<robbiew> they host with Ubuntu
<robbiew> jono: one more!
<jono> <kapcom01> QUESTION: Are there any plans to release Ubuntu One source code so we can use it on our servers?
<robbiew> damn
<robbiew> lol
<robbiew> should have stopped while I was ahead :P
<robbiew> so that's a completely different team
<robbiew> outside of the Platform team even
<robbiew> so I don't know
<robbiew> but if they do....we'll pull it in and ship as fast as we can ;)
<robbiew> promise
<jono> :-)
<jono> thanks robbiew
<jono> ok, I think that is a wrao
<jono> wwrap
<jono> wrap
<jono> erk
<jono> thanks to everyone for your questions
<robbiew> np
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/02/11/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
<jono> we do have some final outstanding questions
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Sessions in #ubuntu-classroom, chat and questions releated to sessions here || Upcoming Schedule in #ubuntu-classroom: https://is.gd/8rtIi || Preface questions with QUESTION:
<jono> hmmm
<jono> ahhh I can still speak
<jono> we do have some outstanding questions, robbie will follow up with a blog entry
<jono> thanks, folks!
<sebsebseb> jono: Now everyone can speak again.  The blog entry will be where?
<jono> sebsebseb, on robbie's blog
<sebsebseb> what's the link?
<m4n1sh> jono: is it aggregated on planet?
<jono> http://undacuvabrutha.wordpress.com/
<sebsebseb> ok thanks :)
<m4n1sh> thanks jono
<jono> :-)
<mo23116> s
<savage24x> QUESTION Has there ever been a release with an actual GUI in 32-bit form? I would love to use ubuntu for my server instead of windows xp!
<sergegagne> savage24x: All the desktop edition can be use has a server.  Server people just prefer to optimize resources an so tend to operate without a GUI
<sergegagne> savage24x: BTW the GUI can be turn off by default and started only when you need it (try disabling gdm and use startx instead...)
#ubuntu-classroom 2011-02-12
<guardian> hi
<YanksRule> !ops
<ubot2> Help! Channel emergency! (ONLY use this trigger in emergencies) - elky, Madpilot, tritium, Nalioth, tonyyarusso, PriceChild, Amaranth, jrib, Myrtti, mneptok, Pici, jpds, gnomefreak, bazhang, jussi, Flannel, ikonia, maco, h00k, IdleOne, nhandler, bilalakhtar, Jordan_U, or rww!
#ubuntu-classroom 2011-02-13
<ConcreteVitamin> Is there a Linux counterpart  of Win+E, which automatically calls out MY COMPUTER in Windows, that calls out a specified place?
<jmarsden> foo
<^mNotIntelligent> what is the topic for today's class?
<nigelb> there isn't a class right now.
<nigelb> You can see the schedule in /topic
<^mNotIntelligent> ohh, is it? ... thanks for that, nigelb
#ubuntu-classroom 2012-02-06
<t3ch_> quit
<Freddi> Hello, is this the right place to ask a question about the Unity API / appmenu?
<tjigi-fo> Freddi, no, that would be #ubuntu-unity
<Freddi> thanks!
#ubuntu-classroom 2012-02-07
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Current Session: Testing ClassBot - Instructors: pleia2
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/02/07/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<benonsoftware> WHat is this session for? :P
<pleia2> Testing ClassBot :)
<pleia2> we moved it to a new server, need to make sure it's behaving as expected
 * benonsoftware thought so :P
<benonsoftware> Nice
<ClassBot> pleia2-oneiric asked: ââfoo?
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/02/07/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat ||
<rsajdok> :-)
<JTFNEL> Hello
<pangolin> hello JTFNEL
<JTFNEL> Hi it is my first time here how does it work
<philipballew> JTFNEL, well this is the classroom channel. there are ubuntu classes here sometimes. if you need support there are some channels that do that as well. What brings you here?
#ubuntu-classroom 2012-02-08
<cancer> can any one help me contributing to Ubuntu ? I wanna start fast and fix some bugs
<pangolin> cancer: join #ubuntu-bugs and start asking questions in there, also check the topic there should be links with info to get you started
<pangolin> patience is a requirement :)
#ubuntu-classroom 2012-02-09
<e4xit> hi
<e4xit> ?
#ubuntu-classroom 2012-02-12
<RedRum_> What
<RedRum_> is up
#ubuntu-classroom 2013-02-06
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Current Session: Introduction to Bug Reporting - Instructors: phillw
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/06/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<phillw> Hi and welcome to an introduction to bugs
<phillw> this session will run over the different types and the systems used to report them
<phillw> Firstly, why report a bug?
<phillw> For the testers, Often we are using the latest, unmodified alpha code for various projects during the development release
<phillw> do not assume someone else will report a bug!
<phillw> Another important thing to remember is that Discussing a bug on IRC, email, forum or facebook areas etc. does not raise a bug. The devs do not monitor those areas
<phillw> By all means use them to discuss a problem. Once your discussion about the bug is at a stage where you can report it, then for it to be actioned by the devs youÂ mustÂ raise a bug.
<phillw> With the advent of 12.04, some of automated system of checking bugs has been changed and will continue to be enhanced.
<phillw> There has been blog posts about a new system 'spying' on your system and sending information to Canonical.
<phillw> To briefly touch on this system....
<phillw> It is called whoopise, and reports errors to a database called daisy.
<phillw> it runs in the background looking for any crash reports that get reported into your /var/crash directory. If it spots one, it goes into action.
<phillw> Under its settings, it may also send additional information.
<phillw> Whoopise is an ongoing and active project. Fuller details all about it can be found at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ErrorTracker
<phillw> More often, for testers, we need to manually raise a bug, such as for a failed test case.
<phillw> going onto launchpad and manually creating a bug often results in a bug report that can not be actioned owing to a lack of information.
<phillw> the best way to prevent this is to use the ubuntu-bug command.
<phillw> It can be a bit tricky to work out to what to report the bug against... To this end, for testing of ISO's a quick list can be found at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Overview/Install_Bugs
<phillw> So, if the error occurred whilst trying to install an iso, you would issue the command ubuntu-bug ubiquity
<phillw> if you are testing an application, e.g. GClac and it failed, you would issue the command ubuntu-bug gcalc
<phillw> using ubuntu-bug ensures that as much information relevant to the bug is obtained and put onto the bug report.
<phillw> Again, there is a full explanation at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage
<phillw> If you are unsure on what package to allocate a bug against, please feel free to ask on #ubuntu-bugs and one of the people there will be more than happy to assist.
<phillw> incomplete bugs do take time up which could be better spent actually dealing with bugs.
<phillw> Gema will be  holding  a session immediately after this introduction to explain this further.
<phillw> Within the quality team, we have a brief section on the basics of bug reporting as it affects quality. This can be found at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Overview#Bugs
<phillw> Those are the basics for bug reporting, as I understand them. Please feel free to ask any questions on bugs (basic level, not advanced!) and I will endeavour to answer them (or get some one from the bug-squad to do so).
<phillw> !q
<ClassBot> Dipan asked: ug goes to Private, what does it mean?
<TheLordOfTime> I'll take that one.
<TheLordOfTime> Usually, when a bug is marked "Private" there's some good reason for it.  With a lot of segfault (crash) bugs I see, a lot of them get marked as private, either because they contain information that *could* be private or could identify your system, or similar reasons
<phillw> !Q
<TheLordOfTime> Typically, I see this with bugs which have core dumps or tracebacks which could contain information to identify someone: passwords, account numbers, etc. fall in the category of information that needs to be "removed" from the bug before it goes to a public view.
<TheLordOfTime> Those private bugs are therefore exactly what they are: hidden from the public eye until someone's gotten to it and actually looked through to see if there's anything that needs removal on those bugs, and then we usually make the bug visible after such things.
<phillw> Also, The bot that goes looking for duplicated bugs does not worry if the bug it is using as master is private. If this happens please go to #ubuntu-bugs and raise it with them
<phillw> I hope that has answered the question, are there any more questions?
<ClassBot> johnsgruber-l-lu asked: If I have a bug in the kernel that might affect only a few systems like mine should it be reported?
<phillw> short answer? yes it should. you are not to know that it only affects 'a few' systems. there may other systems that it could also impact.
<hggdh> indeed. Also, for kernel bugs, *always* report a new one. It is difficult to say, a priori, if your affected system is *identical* with another in an already reported bug
<phillw> if it fixed i  a newer release, then there is always the chance of it getting an SRU raised for it (so that it can be applied to an exisiting release).
<phillw> *if it is fixed in a *
<phillw> I hope that has answered the question, are there any more questions?
<phillw> Whilst we still have some time left, for discussing where 'test case' bugs should go, #ubuntu-quality is a good place to ask.
<phillw> There is also one remaining bug type that I completely forgot about!
<phillw> on each test case, for example, http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/testcases/1301/info
<phillw> you will at the top a link to report a bug against the test case. This is for any spelling mistakes we make and if a test case is not following the order of carrying it out that you are seeing so that they can be edited and corrected.
<phillw> it is not for reporting bugs found by using the test case.
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<phillw> Well, thank you everyone for attending, a special thanks to the people from bug-squad who attended to help answering your questions. Next up is gema who will discuss following a bug report.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Current Session: Following a Bug Report - Instructors: gema
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/06/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<gema> o/ (anyone listening can you please wave in #ubuntu-classroom-chat?)
<gema> cool, so let's get started
<gema> I'd like to thank phillw for his introduction to bug reporting, that sets us all in the right mindset imo
<gema> first of all Iâd like to apologise for the misleading title of this talk, I am not just going to talk about what to do to follow up on your bugs, but also about how to raise good bugs in the first place
<gema> (please, say something in #ubuntu-classroom-chat if I am too quick)
<gema> weâll have (hopefully) some time at the end for questions, if not, you can find me on #ubuntu-quality and ask anything any time (I am on UTC timezone)
<gema> What is a good bug?
<gema> A good bug is a bug that a developer or maintainer can read, reproduce and debug without requiring any additional information
<gema> Think of the developer/maintainer as your customer: give him all he needs without him having to ask for it. After all, a happy customer improves the odds of a productive and mutually beneficial relationship
<gema> After today's talks, I'd expect you guys to be able to raise good bugs that contain enough information for someone else to debug and possibly fix the issue
<gema> When the software doesn't behave in the way you would expect, be sure to first check any available documentation to determine whether the behaviour is intended or not.
<gema> Once you are fairly confident that the issue is indeed a bug, think about the following things; you'll need them when filing your bug report:
<gema> * Steps to reproduce: How do you make the bug appear? what do you do, where to click/what to type to reproduce it?
<gema> * Test environment: What is your hardware? Is the bug be hardware specific? Where you in an X session? What else was running on your machine? what other software is running that might interact with the software under test?
<gema> * Repeatability: does this bug occur every time I run this software or just sometimes?
<gema> If it doesn't occur always, you should determine the exact conditions that make it appear.
<gema> You should be sure that it is repeatable in some way (even if it's just 1/100 runs)
<gema> * Criticality: How bad is the bug? can people still use their systems with this bug on them or does it leave the system unusable. Are people going to lose their data if they hit this bug?
<gema> Most of the time you wonât have enough information to judge the criticality of the bug, except in two cases:
<gema> 1) security bug - e.g. if the software is leaking private/secure data, or allow crashing the whole OS (Denial-of-service), or... - this should be reported as a security issue and ping the security team in the process. In some cases this type of bug shouldnât be made public straight away, to avoid putting people affected by the vulnerability at greatest risk.
<gema> 2) critical bug - A bug that is *NOT* a security bug, but is critical in some other way, e.g. destroys a random partition by mistake.
<gema> Other problems like typos, cosmetic fixes, etc, should likely be reported as unimportant bugs, except when they are related to explicit design requirements.
<gema> But again, thatâs not for the reporter to decide, unless the reporter is part of the design team ;)
<gema> In any other cases, just donât bother about criticality and let the developer decide.
<gema> Writing a good bug report with all the information that is required for the developer to fix
<gema> the problem is hard, but not impossible. It does, however, require some effort.
<gema> Odds are that a report that takes you 5 minutes to write is not very useful and doesn't contain all the relevant bits we discussed earlier.
<gema> !Q
<gema> !q
<gema> Dipan : QUESTION: Gema I agree with your points for good bug. But sometimes giving too
<gema>                           much information, also creates too much confusion. What I feel, we should give
<gema>                           the information according to the importance of the bug
<gema> (sorry, but bot doesn't work for me)
<gema> Dipan: it is not about giving too much information, it is about giving *the right* information
<gema> if you don't document the bug properly (not too much, not too little, it depends on the bug and the way to reproduce it), developers won't be able to diagnost it properly
<gema> If you stick to these guidelines, odds are your bugs will be fixed quicker than a bug that is missing half of the information.
<gema> Nobody likes to waste their productive time trying to get details on a problem that may or may not be there.
<gema> When a bug is poorly written, the developer cannot trust your judgement as to whether what you found was a real problem... you may have messed something up or misunderstood the intended behaviour.
<gema> Hence repeatability, environmental information, etc, are critical. The more information you provide up-front, the easier it is for both of you.
<gema> Anyone reading your bug familiar with the software should be able to get an idea of what went wrong and how it happened.
<gema> If you don't think that this is the case you might be better off trying to rewrite your bug report.
<gema> A bug report should only contain relevant information and should be clear and concise.
<gema> A list of steps, symptoms and expected results, is preferred to a long paragraph describing them.
<gema> Whenever you've raised a bug, you should keep track of it from start to finish - that is, until it is resolved.
<gema> You should be prompt in replying to any questions other people may have, in particular if they affect reproducibility.
<gema> If you stick to the guidelines I outlined before, odds are you won't have much work.
<gema> When a fix for the issue becomes available, it should be the reporter's duty to make sure it fixes the bug, and reopen if that is not the case.
<gema> The developer is the expert on the software code, but you are the expert on how the software really behaves under the conditions you are testing, so you are going to be required to provide feedback as the developer explores the problem.
<gema>  Your bug report should contain enough information for the developer to understand what behaviour you expected instead and why.
<gema> One bug needs to describe one problem.
<gema> Unless agreed otherwise with the developer, for whichever exceptional reason, each bug has to be about one problem only.
<gema> Having several problems in one bug makes it unmanageable and unlikely to be fixed.
<gema> See for instance bug 746500.
<gema> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-translations/+bug/746500
<gema> This bug had a lot of screenshots on a pdf.
<gema>  You may think is useful, but the report lacks the basic information about the version of the installer or where exactly the problem was.
<gema> It was easier for a developer to run the installer themselves than to decode what is missing from the bug. This kind of bug wastes a lot of engineering time.
<gema> Some other examples of bad bugs:
<gema> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/1110500
<gema> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-release-upgrader/+bug/1104683
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<gema> When it comes to ubiquity (which is something we test for every milestone), you need to pay attention to the instructions from the developers on how to attach logs and debug:
<gema> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingUbiquity
<gema> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingUbiquity/AttachingLogs
<gema> $ ubuntu-bug ubiquity
<gema> does correct collection of logs, as long as it's run in (a) live system after the crash/error got reproduced or (b) in the installed system when the crash/error/bug was produced during installation.
<gema> To summarize:
<gema> - You need to know the problem and be able to describe it clearly to another person that has never seen it.
<gema> - You need to give clear steps to reproduce.
<gema> - You need to say what was the behaviour you were expecting (i.e. why you think this behaviour is a problem)
<gema> - You have to be sure the problem is reproducible and the conditions under which it is reproducible and the probability.
<gema> - You should gather all the relevant logs either using the ubuntu-bug tool or manually, e.g. dmesg, syslog, etc.
<gema> and once you finish reporting the bug make sure to follow up with the developers in case some questions arise.
<gema> Be responsive so that they know it is possible to get help from you if needed.
<gema> Make sure to test their solution so that you are satisfied it meets  your expectations, or reopen the bug if not (it is easier for the developer to deal with a second fix straight away than after two weeks).
<gema> There are plenty of good bugs out there as well, this is one example of good bug in my opinion:
<gema> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/quantal/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1056707
<gema> and that's all I have, we can have questions if you have any
<gema> or remarks if you want to make any
<gema> can someone make the classroom unmoderated , please?
<gema> any questions? you can put them in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<gema> ok, I will take it as a no, we can keep discussing this in #ubuntu-quality if you think of anything later
<gema> thank you all for your time!
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/06/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || No Sessions Currently in Progress
#ubuntu-classroom 2013-02-07
<speckmade> So the Ubuntu User Days will happen in here, I hear. Now what does "presentation" mean - will the presenters just flood us with chat messages or will there be a video stream or something?..
<pleia2> they talk in here (I wouldn't call it a "flood" - it's normal chatting speed)
<pleia2> then you ask questions and discuss what's going on in the session in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Current Session: Registering your Laptop on the Database - Instructors: letozaf, SergioMeneses, primes2h
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/07/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<primes2h> Hello all and welcome to this intro on Ubuntu Laptop testing!
<primes2h> This classroom session is going to be held by three members of the Laptop Testing Team: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-laptop-testing.
<primes2h> This session goes to be hosted by Sergio Zanchetta (primes2h), Sergio Andres Meneses (SergioMeneses) and Carla Sella (Letozaf_)....
<primes2h> So letâs first introduce ourselves:
<primes2h> Iâm Sergio Zanchetta from the Ubuntu Italian Team. My work in Ubuntu is mainly on translations and testing.
<primes2h> Iâm a member of the Ubuntu Italian Translators Team, Ubuntu QA Team, one of the founders of the Italian Testing Team and an administrator of the Laptop Testing Team, which I founded as well.
<primes2h> Here you can find more information about me: https://launchpad.net/~primes2h.
<SergioMeneses> hi all!
<SergioMeneses> my name is Sergio Andres Meneses, Iâm from Ubuntu Colombian Team, I actually work with the Ubuntu Loco Council and the Ubuntu QA team in the Laptop testing field from this cycle :)
<SergioMeneses> you can find more information about me in my wiki page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SergioMeneses
<letozaf> Hello to everyone
<letozaf> My name is Carla Sella, Iâm Italian and Iâm member of the  Ubuntu QA Team,  Italian Testing Team and Laptop testing team.
<letozaf> I have been testing for about a couple of years now and I am mostly involved in manual and automated testing, you can find information about me here: https://launchpad.net/~carla-sella.
<SergioMeneses> Today we're going to learn about "Testing on a Laptop".
<letozaf> You may ask questions at any point.. Just be sure to utilize the #ubuntu-classroom-chat channel So let's get started!
<primes2h> Why do we test laptops?
<primes2h> As you can see on the laptop testing wiki page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Laptop
<primes2h> âWe're on a mission to get Ubuntu to work great on as many different makes and models of laptops as possible.â
<SergioMeneses> In fact the aim of the project is to find out all the bugs affecting laptops hardware during the development process, so that developers can fix them in time for the release.
<primes2h> Besides, not less important, is to keep track of bugs themselves also after a stable image has been released.
<letozaf> So anyone that has a laptop has the chance to test how Ubuntu works on it and in case they have nasty problems with some hardware they can report a bug and help get their problems solved.
<letozaf> This way they will help make Ubuntu work on a larger number of laptops and hardware.
<letozaf> Tests are carried out following  testcases that tell you how to  run tests on your laptop, each one is designed to find out if a specific piece of hardware works straight off. Any bugs have to be reported in launchpad and added in the Laptop Tracker.
<primes2h> These tests are run in either stable releases or current milestone of development release.
<SergioMeneses> We will now explain how to start your adventure in Laptop testing:
<SergioMeneses> - Create a Launchpad Account.
<SergioMeneses> You will  need a launchpad account because it is a very important tool on our testing trip:
<SergioMeneses> a Launchpad account is needed for Reporting bugs, Question and Answers, Translations, Blueprints and even more! :) (imho: launchpad rocks!).
<SergioMeneses> Then you need to sign the Ubuntu Code of Conduct and commit yourself to comply with it.
<SergioMeneses> here is were to get started: https://login.launchpad.net/+new_account,
<SergioMeneses> And here is an example on what you will get at the end: https://launchpad.net/~sergiomeneses.
<primes2h> - Create a Personal Wiki Page.
<primes2h> A personal wiki page is needed to let us know something about you, your goals and expectations about ubuntu, even something funny.
<primes2h> Itâs just a way to know each other and personal skills.
<primes2h> And here is an example of a personal wiki page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SergioMeneses
<letozaf> - Join the Ubuntu Laptop Testing Team \o/
<letozaf> You must join  our team: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-laptop-testing
<letozaf> and our mailing list: ubuntu-laptop-testing@lists.launchpad.net
<letozaf> Remember also to join ubuntu-quality mailing list, ubuntu-quality@lists.ubuntu.com to keep informed about general testing related stuff.
<SergioMeneses> - Set up an Hardware Profile
<SergioMeneses> A hardware profile is needed to know the details of the hardware you are testing on.
<SergioMeneses> This will allow people to know on what hardware Ubuntu works fine and also help developers fix bugs in case you find one or more during testing.
<primes2h> There are two ways to do this:
<primes2h> 1 - Automatic: you can create a profile on the ubuntu friendly website (graphic mode).
<primes2h> 2 - Manual: you can share your hardware profile on a wiki page.
<primes2h> Theoretically the first one should be the easiest way, because you can automatically obtain a complete hardware profile of your laptop.
<primes2h> However, the inner limitations of the tools used, makes this method the long-lasting and less practical one for now.
<letozaf> Briefly speaking, you need to run checkbox  from the stable release previous to the development image you are going to test.
<letozaf> This way you are bound to perform a full system testing.
<letozaf> Checkbox is pre-installed in Ubuntu and you will find it searching âSystem Testingâ in the Dash.
<letozaf> Finally, providing your launchpad email, you can submit results and then, after some time (that can go from a few hours to some days) youâll find your hardware profile on the Ubuntu Friendly website: https://friendly.ubuntu.com/.
<letozaf> This is how your laptop will look like in Ubuntu Friendly:
<letozaf> https://friendly.ubuntu.com/12.04/Hewlett-Packard/HP%20G62%20Notebook%20PC/i:BZI:NyVHp:BI:I8g:BV6:BFCp:GzC:BEG:BV6:BFCp:h:B5G:DNO:BFC/
<primes2h> We aim to simplify and improve the automatic process, so expect some news in the near future.
<primes2h> That said , we are  going to explain the manual method more extensively, as itâs the most practical way to do this:
<primes2h> You have to create a subpage of your personal wiki page, where youâll put all information about your laptop.
<primes2h> For example: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/YourPersonalPage/LaptopMakeModel (this is a only a template).
<SergioMeneses> An example of an existing personal profile to use as a guide is:
<SergioMeneses> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SergioMeneses/AcerAspire4750
<SergioMeneses> Now we are going to take some information from our computer to fill in our wiki page:
<SergioMeneses> Laptop make and model -  the output of the commands:
<SergioMeneses> $sudo dmidecode -s system-manufacturer
<SergioMeneses> and
<SergioMeneses> $sudo dmidecode -s system-product-name
<SergioMeneses> now, On Lenovo laptops you need also to run
<SergioMeneses> $sudo dmidecode -s system-version
<SergioMeneses> to get the first part of the model name.
<SergioMeneses> Laptop hardware information - the output of the commands:
<SergioMeneses> $lspci -v  â (pci devices)
<SergioMeneses> $lsusb    â (usb devices)
<SergioMeneses> (without any external device attached)
<SergioMeneses> and then
<SergioMeneses> $lshw -short  â (hardware list)
<SergioMeneses> with all this information ,we fill our wiki page :) as you can see in the model
<SergioMeneses> questions about this?
<primes2h> Any Questions ?
<SergioMeneses> ok, there is not questions right now :)
<ClassBot> pleia2 asked: Are you testing development releases, or the versions of Ubuntu that have already been released?
<primes2h> In fact we test both, but we are more focused on development releases	
<SergioMeneses> by the way, you can find our testing progress here: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/219/builds
<SergioMeneses> as you can see, there are LTS versions and Daily versions :)
<ClassBot> JoseeAntonioR asked: What do those $ signs at the beginning mean? Should I type them in the Terminal too?
<letozaf> Noskcaj, that indicates the shell you do not have to type that in
<letozaf> sorry I meant no
<letozaf> that indicates the shell you do not have to type that in
<letozaf> you just have to type what comes after that sign
<letozaf> and press enter
<letozaf> so, for instance you have to enter:
<letozaf> lspci -v
<letozaf> and press enter
<ClassBot> balloons asked: So at the moment, I should manually create a profile for my computer for testing?
<letozaf> Well it depends
<letozaf> The quickest way is creating a wiki page with all the info about
<letozaf> your laptops hardware
<letozaf> and then putting the link to the wiki page in the testcase result
<letozaf> so we know what hardware has been tested
<letozaf> the other way is to use checkbox, but it takes
<letozaf> much more time, even if maybe
<letozaf> having all your hardware info in the Ubuntu Friendly site
<letozaf> is better
<SergioMeneses> https://friendly.ubuntu.com/
<letozaf> thank you SergioMeneses
<ClassBot> pleia2 asked: how do I know whether I should I contribute to laptop testing or regular iso tracker testing?
<letozaf> Well they are two different ways to test and contribute to Ubuntu
<primes2h> You can contribute to both of them
<letozaf> Let's say that if you have a laptop
<letozaf> it is a good idea to contribute as you will help Ubuntu work
<letozaf> on many different hardware
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<letozaf> whith laptop testing you help test Ubuntu on a particular hardware
<letozaf> with ISO tracker testing you test the ISO, but it is not always tested on hardware but also on virtual machines
<letozaf> so hardware independetn
<letozaf> independent
<letozaf> then if your hardware profile is in Ubuntu Friendly websit
<letozaf> website people can have a look at what hardware Ubuntu works on
<primes2h> So, if there are no more questions we will continue talking about the fun part: testing! on the second session at 21:00 UTC same channel
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Current Session: Testing on a Laptop - Instructors: letozaf, SergioMeneses, primes2h
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/07/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<letozaf> Hello everyone!
<letozaf> Welcome to the second session on laptop testing.
<letozaf> So, after having set up everything as explained in the previous session  lets start the fun part: TESTING :D
<letozaf> To start testing, first of all go to the Laptop Tracker website at http://laptop.qa.ubuntu.com/.
<letozaf> You will have to choose a milestone from the list, for instance âQuantal Finalâ  or âRaring Cadence Week 2â,
<letozaf> depending on what itâs available for testing (look at the âstatusâ column  âTestingâ  indicates  what has to be tested and  âReleasedâ indicates what does not as it has been released)
<letozaf> http://laptop.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker
<letozaf> Once you have chosen the milestone you will have to select the correct image that corresponds to your computerâs architecture from another list:
<letozaf> http://laptop.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/248/builds
<letozaf> So, for example, if you have a 64 bit laptop you need to click on the small icon (CD with a green arrow) next to the âUbuntu Desktop amd64â product.
<letozaf> After clicking on it, youâll be on the ISO image download page.
<letozaf> Click on the first link you find on the list and you will be able to download the ISO.
<letozaf> There is a quicker way to do this using zsync, but maybe we will explain this later if we have time.
<letozaf> Generally speaking, updated daily images of the current development release are found at http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/.
<primes2h> Once you have downloaded the image you have two options:
<primes2h> 1 - Put the ISO on a DVD or a USB key and boot your laptop from them to perform testing in a âlive environmentâ.
<primes2h> 2 - Install the ISO on your laptop using a separate partition of you hard drive.
<primes2h> If you are new to this, you donât feel comfortable on partitioning your hard drive or you donât have much time available to test, go for option number 1.
<primes2h> In a live environment you can successfully run all scheduled testcases except the hibernate one (that needs a real installation to run).
<primes2h> The second option needs a separate partition of you hard drive just for testing so you wonât mess up the existing Ubuntu that is already on it :-D
<primes2h> Anyway remember that  installing a development release on a production machine is
<primes2h> usually not recommended if you donât know what you are doing, development releases can âbreak thingsâ, so be careful.
<letozaf> Once you have booted Ubuntu, itâs time to start testing!
<letozaf> You need to go back to the Laptop Testing tracker at http://laptop.qa.ubuntu.com/
<letozaf> and log in using your launchpad credentials, otherwise you will not be able to submit your test results.
<letozaf> Reporting Results and Filling Testcases
<letozaf> As you did before select the milestone (e.g. Raring Cadence Week 2), then click on  your architecture product link for example Ubuntu Desktop amd64.
<letozaf> You will see list of testcases to carry out ordered by category  like: Audio, Connectivity, I/O and so on.:
<letozaf> http://laptop.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/248/builds/29797/testcases
<letozaf> If you want to be notified when new images are available for testing
<letozaf> you can select the  testcase checkboxes you are interested in and then click on the subscribe button at the end of the page under âActionsâ
<letozaf> This way you will be notified by email when an image is ready for testing.
<SergioMeneses> You now need to follow the testcase instructions and carry out the tests one by one reporting the results
<SergioMeneses> (âPassedâ, âFailedâ or if it is taking long you click on âIn progressâ so others know that you are carrying out the test).
<SergioMeneses> http://laptop.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/248/builds/29797/testcases/1467/results
<SergioMeneses> In the machine field you must copy and paste the link to your hardware profile
<SergioMeneses> the one you created on a wiki page we spoke about in the previous classroom session ( https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SergioMeneses/AcerAspire4750 )
<SergioMeneses> If you select âFailedâ you have to indicate one or more bug numbers reported on Launchpad otherwise you will not be able submit your result.
<primes2h> Take a look here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Laptop/Procedures for more detailed information on what just said.
<primes2h> you can find more information about testing at our wiki page:
<primes2h> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Laptop
<primes2h> and you can meet us in #ubuntu-quality on the Freenode network.
<letozaf> Remember: The Laptop Testing Team is open to anyone who would like to provide  important hardware information about their laptops and help us make Ubuntu work on a wide range of hardware,
<letozaf> We spoke about how getting the ISO for putting it on a live USB key or a DVD
<letozaf> the best way to download an ISO is using zsync
<letozaf> Zsync is very practical and fast for downloading ISOâs as it downloads only the parts of a file that are changed, so as to avoid downloading a full copy every time.
<letozaf> Since the daily ISOs generally change quite little, it can be processed quite quickly
<letozaf> zsync also performs a checksum comparison making it possible to change the flavour of the ISO (e.g. you have an ISO of Ubuntu and you want to change it on Kubuntu. Simply copy/paste the right line for Kubuntu and it will download just the parts that differs from the two versions).
<letozaf> Ubuntu archives provide .zsync files using quite similar URIs about the various flavours. For example:
<letozaf> zsync http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/raring-desktop-i386.iso.zsync
<letozaf> will sync the server's daily unstable raring (13.04) desktop image (for i386) to your local system with an older desktop image already stored on your hard drive.
<letozaf> For more information on how to use it go to:
<letozaf> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ZsyncCdImage
<letozaf> has anyone got questions ?
<primes2h> There are no questions, so thanks a lot to all you guys!
<primes2h> We hope to see you soon
<letozaf> primes2h, there is a question
<ClassBot> balloons asked: When do you plan to have a testing event again?
<SergioMeneses> balloons, I think when the ubuntu-classroom-team invite us again :D
<primes2h> Soon. 12.04.2 is on the way and
<primes2h> and as soon as Raring beta1 is approaching
<primes2h> we'll start do extensive  testing
<ClassBot> pleia2 asked: Are there recommended times to do testing, or can I just download an ISO any random night I have time and give it a try? :)
<primes2h> In general you can use this cadence reference page if you need to : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Cadence
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<primes2h> but the best is to subscribe yourself for email notification in the laptop tracker
<primes2h> so you'll be notified when a new image is ready to be tested.
<letozaf> if you look at the laptop testing tracker
<letozaf> the status column tells you if we are currently testing
<letozaf> or if it has been released
<letozaf> so until you find the testing status you can test, then when testing is over you will find
<letozaf> the status "released"
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<primes2h> I think there aren't more question. So thanks a lot to you guys! I hope to see you soon
<letozaf> bye to everyone and come and join the fun on the laptop testing team
<SergioMeneses> ok guys thanks for coming :D
<letozaf> :)
<SergioMeneses>  \o/
<primes2h> :-)
<SergioMeneses> and thank to the Ubuntu Classroom Team: pleia2 and JoseeAntonioR
<letozaf> yes thank you to pleia2 and JoseeAntonioR and balloons too
<primes2h> Agree, thanks to all
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/07/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || No Sessions Currently in Progress
#ubuntu-classroom 2013-02-08
<Phryq> is this a room where teachers can discuss how to use Ubuntu in their classrooms?
#ubuntu-classroom 2013-02-09
<JoseeAntonioR> hey, guys! we're starting in a little while
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu User Days - Current Session: Introduction to User Days - Instructors: JoseeAntonioR
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/09/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<JoseeAntonioR> hello guys, and welcome to the Ubuntu User Days!
<JoseeAntonioR> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDays
<JoseeAntonioR> the User Days Team has been working hard these past few weeks in order to bring you these sessions
<JoseeAntonioR> we have members from many teams in the Ubuntu Community here today, who have graciously volunteered to share their knowledge with all of us (thanks!)
<JoseeAntonioR> before we begin, we would like to get a quick feel for who is here. so, if you're here, please say your name and where you are from (as much as you're comfortable with it :) )
<JoseeAntonioR> I'm JosÃ© Antonio, but you can just call me Jose, and I'm from Lima, Peru
<JoseeAntonioR> so, anyone else around here by this time? :)
<ori> I'm Ori form Albania :)
<dedunu> Dedunu from Sri Lanka
<JoseeAntonioR> looks good, welcome everyone!
<JoseeAntonioR> I'd like to start saying there's a Dia del Usuario Ubuntu en EspaÃ±ol today, over #ubuntu-charlas and #ubuntu-charlas-chat https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DiaDelUsuarioUbuntu
<JoseeAntonioR> it should be starting in around 2 hours, and run alongside this one
<JoseeAntonioR> it has different topics, but you can attend both of them :)
<JoseeAntonioR> ok, but let's get back to this one
<JoseeAntonioR> a few of you are probably wondering what User Days are all about
<JoseeAntonioR> User Days were created to be sets of classes during a two-day period, to teach the beginning or internediate Ubuntu user the basics in order to get them started using Ubuntu. this includes:
<JoseeAntonioR> an introduction to Ubuntu, explanations about Unity and the Dash, how to explore files and directories, and other commandline basics, some equivalent programs, etc.
<JoseeAntonioR> for your full schedule you can visit https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDays
<JoseeAntonioR> User Days were born out of a discussion at the Ubuntu Developer Summit in November 2009, regarding the Ubuntu OpenWeek not being targeted enough at users, so here we are ;)
<JoseeAntonioR> now, for a quick rundown of how today will work
<JoseeAntonioR> each hour, an instructor will be giving a class in this channel, #ubuntu-classroom
<JoseeAntonioR> during the classes, #ubuntu-classroom will be moderated (+m)
<JoseeAntonioR> this means that only the instructor and hosts will be able to talk in the channel
<JoseeAntonioR> (it's not moderated right now, since we wanted to give you a chance t say hello :) )
<JoseeAntonioR> any discussion about the class should take place in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
<JoseeAntonioR> so please join there too if you haven't already
<JoseeAntonioR> if you have a question during the class, please ask in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
<JoseeAntonioR> be sure to prefix it with 'QUESTION:' to ensure that it gets noticed, for example:
<JoseeAntonioR> QUESTION: What are the Ubuntu User Days?
<JoseeAntonioR> anyone want to give it a try? :)
<IdleOne> sets of classes during a two-day period, to teach the beginning or internediate Ubuntu user the basics in order to get them started using Ubuntu.
<IdleOne> :)
<JoseeAntonioR> ok, now after each session, our group of volunteers will post the IRC logs to the wiki as soon as possible
<JoseeAntonioR> so if you miss a session, or just want to review what you learned, be sure to check out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDays for links to logs that our volunteers will put up as soon as they're able
<JoseeAntonioR> if you can't wait, logs will also be automatically posted on http://irclogs.ubuntu.com near the end of each hour (ClassBot also shares the link at the beginning of each session)
<JoseeAntonioR> please be sure to remind all of your friends all family who might be interested in using Ubuntu that this event is taking place today. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDays/JoiningIn has some information about how they can participate
<JoseeAntonioR> finally, before we move on to answering any more questions about Ubuntu User Days that you might have, I would like to give a big thanks to everyone who has helped make this day possible :)
<JoseeAntonioR> thanks to pleia2 for basically organizing all of this!
<JoseeAntonioR> and of course, to all the instructors who volunteered their time over the weekend to share knowledge with us
<JoseeAntonioR> organizing is a big chore, and it simply wouldn't be possible without all their help
<JoseeAntonioR> now, dows anyone have any general questions about the day? :)
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<ClassBot> ori_ asked: you said that each lesson will last 60 min .. than why are the lessons int the timetable every 30 min ?
<JoseeAntonioR> the only session that lasts 30 minutes is this introduction :)
<ClassBot> ori_ asked: aha ok, and is there any pause between the lessons, or will they beginn straight up, one after an other ?
<JoseeAntonioR> it's just one after the other, but as it's IRC you can go and grab a coffee, and keep reading :)
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<JoseeAntonioR> ok, in 5 minutes we'll start with the session :)
<ClassBot> IdleOne asked: Will there be logs of the sessions?
<JoseeAntonioR> yes, and as I said before, they will all be linked to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDays
<JoseeAntonioR> ok, so I hope you all enjoy it and have fun today! :)
<JoseeAntonioR> it's 15 UTC now, for those who don't know the exact time
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu User Days - Current Session: Introduction to Ubuntu - Instructors: JoseeAntonioR - Slides: http://is.gd/MYWYED
<ClassBot> Slides for Introduction to Ubuntu: http://people.ubuntu.com/~joseeantonior/Slides/ubuntu-quantal.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/09/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<JoseeAntonioR> hello everyone, for those who are just joining us!
<JoseeAntonioR> my name is JosÃ© Antonio Rey (but you can just call me Jose ), and I'm just a random community member from Lima, Peru :)
<JoseeAntonioR> if you haven't downloaded the slides yet, I would recommend you to do so, to keep track on where are we up to
<JoseeAntonioR> as the bot stated, they can be found here http://people.ubuntu.com/~joseeantonior/Slides/ubuntu-quantal.pdf
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 1]
<JoseeAntonioR> today I'll be giving you a quick introduction to what Ubuntu is
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 2]
<JoseeAntonioR> so let's start with this, what exactly is Ubuntu?
<JoseeAntonioR> Ubuntu is an operating system, based on the Linux kernel
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 3]
<JoseeAntonioR> now, I'll talk you a bit about our releases
<JoseeAntonioR> we release versions every 6 months, and they are codenamed in a year.month format, and an adjective + an animal that represents the version
<JoseeAntonioR> in this case, our latest (current) version is 12.10, and is also codenamed Quantal Quetzal
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 4]
<JoseeAntonioR> we have LTS releases (LTS stands for long-term support)
<JoseeAntonioR> that means they will be supported with updates and bug fixes for 5 years, in both Desktop and Server versions
<JoseeAntonioR> normal or non-LTS releases are supported in a 18 month basis
<JoseeAntonioR> in this case, 12.10, or as we like to call it, quantal, is supported in a 18-month basis as it's a non-LTS release
<JoseeAntonioR> any questions so far?
<JoseeAntonioR> ok, so let's move on
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 5]
<JoseeAntonioR> about versions, as mentioned before we have Desktop and Server versions
<JoseeAntonioR> I think the version's name explain their uses
<JoseeAntonioR> one of the main differences you'll see between these to versions, is the graphical interface
<JoseeAntonioR> in Ubuntu Server, the server versions, you don't have a graphical interface (which includes the buttons, and the windows, and all the stuff you can click)
<JoseeAntonioR> but you do in the Desktop
<JoseeAntonioR> we also have a Cloud version, designed specially for Cloud interfaces (e.g., Amazon EC2)
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 6]
<JoseeAntonioR> so now, you'll be wondering where can you download Ubuntu
<ClassBot> dedunu asked: Can we install Ubuntu-Desktop only with CLI?
<JoseeAntonioR> yep!
<JoseeAntonioR> for sure you can. if you want to install with a command-line interface, and just use that with Ubuntu, you can use Ubuntu Server
<JoseeAntonioR> or if you want to install with a command-line interface, but want to have all the graphical stuff that I mentioned before, you can use the minimal install ISO
<JoseeAntonioR> information on the Minimal ISO can be found over here: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/MinimalCD
<JoseeAntonioR> ok, so moving on
<JoseeAntonioR> you can go to http://www.ubuntu.com/download to download the ISO
<JoseeAntonioR> there, you will find the latest LTS and non-LTS releases
<JoseeAntonioR> you can also go to releases.ubuntu.com and download all the currently supported releases
<JoseeAntonioR> and if you want (for any reason) to download non-supported versions, you can find them at old-releases.ubuntu.com
<JoseeAntonioR> let me remind you that these releases are not supported
<JoseeAntonioR> any question, guys?
<JoseeAntonioR> ok, so looks like not :)
<JoseeAntonioR> let's move on, then
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 7]
<JoseeAntonioR> so, one of the main questions is where to find the torrent link to download Ubuntu
<JoseeAntonioR> so, the torrent links are available at releases.ubuntu.com, the link is in the files list which you can find at the bottom
<JoseeAntonioR> let me remind you that it's legal to torrent down Ubuntu, it's not piracy at all, it's free software :)
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 8]
<JoseeAntonioR> once you download the .iso file for Ubuntu, you may want to install it!
<JoseeAntonioR> so, you can burn it into a CD/DVD (depending on the version you download), or make a USB stick with it
<JoseeAntonioR> to make a CD/DVD, just burn the image into it
<JoseeAntonioR> to make a USB stick, open a USB creator, and select the .iso file
<JoseeAntonioR> you can find much more detailed information in the download page www.ubuntu.com/download
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 9]
<JoseeAntonioR> once you've got your CD/DVD/USB, insert it into your PC, and reboot
<JoseeAntonioR> you will be prompted with a window to choose what to do
<JoseeAntonioR> so, as this will be a Live CD/DVD/USB, you can choose what to do
<JoseeAntonioR> you can go ahead and try it
<JoseeAntonioR> (which basically means you can use Ubuntu without installing it into your PC, but if you're on a CD/DVD changes won't be saved)
<JoseeAntonioR> or, you can opt and go for the full Ubuntu experience, and install it to your PC, as a standalone system or alongside your current operating system
<JoseeAntonioR> let me remind you that you should backup the contents of your PC if you're formatting your hard drive to just install Ubuntu
<JoseeAntonioR> from that point, the interface is self-explanatory
<JoseeAntonioR> but make sure you don't get too excited and press random buttons, as you're installing an operating system, not just browsing the internet or copying a file from a folder to another
<JoseeAntonioR> any questions on the install process or something else?
<JoseeAntonioR> ok, moving on
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 10]
<JoseeAntonioR> but, who backs this project?
<JoseeAntonioR> the project was founded by Mark Shuttleworth (also known as the Self-Appointed Benevolent Dictator for Life, or sabdfl for friends)
<ClassBot> dedunu asked: Is there any performance difference between ubuntu desktop and ubuntu server
<JoseeAntonioR> good question!
<JoseeAntonioR> of course there is
<JoseeAntonioR> as the Server is not using any graphical interface, it will require less resources
<JoseeAntonioR> Ubuntu Desktop should be able to run in most PCs, but yes, there is a performance difference
<JoseeAntonioR> and the server is mostly designed for... servers, which may require to use additional memory on another processes
<JoseeAntonioR> such as MySQL, or Apache, or PHP, who knows
<JoseeAntonioR> let's keep going
<JoseeAntonioR> so, the project was founded by our lovely SABDFL, and is backed by Canonical and lots of volunteers like us, who help Ubuntu grow every single day
<JoseeAntonioR> if you're interested you can also help with design, or development, or even helping other users
<JoseeAntonioR> but let's not get out of the road
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 11]
<JoseeAntonioR> so, now you may be wondering where can you get help in case you run into troubles
<JoseeAntonioR> well, you can find help in the channel #ubuntu on this same IRC network (irc.freenode.net or irc.ubuntu.com, it's the same thing)
<JoseeAntonioR> to get there just type "/j #ubuntu" with no quotes (the quotes are the " signs)
<JoseeAntonioR> but you can also go to www.askubuntu.com
<JoseeAntonioR> there, you will be able to ask any kind of ubuntu-related questions
<JoseeAntonioR> you can also answer to some open questions if you'd like to, it's a super fun system
<JoseeAntonioR> but you can use the Ubuntu Forums (which are located at ubuntuforums.org)
<JoseeAntonioR> or even use Launchpad (https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu and click the 'Ask a question' button on the right side)
<JoseeAntonioR> so, getting an answer to your question is not that hard :)
<JoseeAntonioR> we even have localized support teams, with the help of the Ubuntu Local Communities
<JoseeAntonioR> for example, you can join #ubuntu-es for support in Spanish, and #ubuntu-fr for support in French, and so on
<JoseeAntonioR> so, now it's questions time!
<JoseeAntonioR> if you have *any* questions related to Ubuntu, or the Ubuntu Community, just ask and I'll do my best to answer
<JoseeAntonioR> the only kind of questions I would ask you to not ask are technical support questions, those can to #ubuntu as I mentioned before :)
<JoseeAntonioR> so while I wait for some questions, let me tell you
<JoseeAntonioR> if you want to contribute to Ubuntu, the Ubuntu Community is open for anyone who would like to help
<JoseeAntonioR> at http://www.ubuntu.com/community/get-involved you will be able to find some information on how to get involved with the community, and many of the ways on which you can help
<JoseeAntonioR> you can do some development work, or design work, you can write documentation, or translate Ubuntu
<JoseeAntonioR> or maybe you'd like to test and make sure quality's ok
<JoseeAntonioR> but there is a set of rules you must always follow, the Ubuntu Code of Conduct, which can be found here: http://www.ubuntu.com/project/about-ubuntu/conduct
<JoseeAntonioR> and as IdleOne said, 'This is what Ubuntu is about. We all try to help each other make Ubuntu better. :)'
<JoseeAntonioR> so, any questions?
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<JoseeAntonioR> so, in 5 mins we'll have a session about Unity and the Dash, and everything related to it :)
<JoseeAntonioR> I hope you have fun with it, and keep enjoying the Ubuntu User Days!
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu User Days - Current Session: Unity and the Dash - Instructors: LionThinker
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/09/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<Lionthinker> Okay so I think thats me
<Lionthinker> HI guys my name is Leon and many greatings from Sunny South Africa
<Lionthinker> You can see my Launchpad ID at https://launchpad.net/~lionthinker
<Lionthinker> So in  this sessioin we'll cover the basics of how to get the most out of Ubuntu
<Lionthinker> Lets start with Unity, which is the DE or desktop environment for Ubuntu.
<Lionthinker> Other official flavours such as KDE, Xubuntu etc have their own DE
<Lionthinker> Unity is a shell interface or GUI (graphical user interface) for the GNOME desktop environment developed by Canonical Ltd (Ubuntu's commercial Company)
<Lionthinker> Unity is part of the Ayatana Project started by Canonical
<Lionthinker> From its Launchpad site https://launchpad.net/ayatana you can get more info
<Lionthinker> Its motto: The Ayatana Project is the collective project that houses user interface, design and interaction projects started by Canonical.
<Lionthinker> but Unity has come some way since then and there are countless new dimensions to use and contribute to
<Lionthinker> In other words: the goal of Ayatana within the Ubuntu project is to re-design computing with a single easy to use and aesthetically pleasing interface
<Lionthinker> first a little history to keep everyone on same page
<Lionthinker> The Ayatana project was first introduced in Ubuntu 10.10 on a netbook
<Lionthinker> Since then it has been ported to the general desktop, server editions, TV, tablets and the most recent Ubuntu family member the phone.
<Lionthinker> Perhaps the most important key for Unity is the Super Key.
<Lionthinker> If you not lucky enough to have a pre-installed Ubuntu machine, then its the Windows key. Not sure what its on a Mac.
<Lionthinker> Touching Super will open the DASH, which we'll come back to
<Lionthinker> NB: Holding it a few seconds opens a shortcuts menu
<Lionthinker> We wont get into shortcuts here,but just note that they really help with getting the most out of your Ubuntu Machine
<Lionthinker> After learning them you generally move around the desktop much quicker.
<Lionthinker> The parts of Unity that we'll cover are the LAUNCHER, DASH, LENS, SCOPES, NOTIFICATIONS PANEL and the HUD
<Lionthinker> Any questions?
<Lionthinker> Okay, Lets start with the LAUNCHER
<Lionthinker> The vertical application switcher on the left â is called the LAUNCHER
<Lionthinker> Pinned or active Applications or mounted external devices will appear here.
<Lionthinker> We'll cover 3 things about the LAUNCHER: pinned apps, re-ordering apps and quick lists
<Lionthinker> First: Certain applications can be pinned to the LAUNCHER for ease of access.
<Lionthinker> You do this by right-clicking on an open application and selecting 'Lock to LAUNCHER'
<Lionthinker> To remove an app, select 'remove from LAUNCHER'
<Lionthinker> Another option is to open DASH, select and app by left clicking and holding, then move it to the LAUNCHER
<Lionthinker> Second: to re-order applications left-click an app and hold an app. It jumps out then move it up/down or to the trash. Moving to trash only removes it from the Launcher
<Lionthinker> and doesn't actually delete it
<Lionthinker> Third: Unity Quicklists
<Lionthinker> If you hover over an LAUNCHER application and Right click you'll see a list of options.
<Lionthinker> This is part of the countless shortcuts that enable you to get to info and files and actions asap
<Lionthinker> If you hover over an LAUNCHER application and Right click you'll see a list of options.
<Lionthinker> Quicklists are app specific to unity, so not all programes will have them
<Lionthinker> They provide an fast and easy way to access an option which that specific programe does.
<Lionthinker> So you don't have to first start it up and then choose x option.
<Lionthinker> For example: I right click on Chromium as my browser and get options such as 'Open a New Window' and 'Open a New Window in incognito mode'
<Lionthinker> For files, you get your folder shortcuts.
<Lionthinker> Unity is all about speed
<Lionthinker> Any questions so far?
<Lionthinker> so these are the 3 main ways to interact with the Launcher
<Lionthinker> If everyone's good lets move to UNITY DASH
<Lionthinker> On top of LAUNCHER you'll see an Ubuntu logo button.
<Lionthinker> This is the button to open the DASH
<Lionthinker> Its the same as pushing Super key
<Lionthinker> The DASH is central to Unity
<Lionthinker> The DASH is comprised of LENS and SCOPES, and does SEARCHES
<Lionthinker> Together they empower you in searching either through your computer or the broader internet
<Lionthinker> kartman882451, All icons appear in the launcher and are the same for all 4 screens
<Lionthinker> FIRST: LENS
<Lionthinker> At the bottom you'll see icons, each symbolise a lens.
<Lionthinker> By default there are Home, Applications, Files, Gwibber, Photos, Music and Videos
<Lionthinker> Gwibber is the social networks lens that collates FB and Twitter and other IM services
<Lionthinker> Use âControl + Tabâ as the shortcut to switch between lens
<Lionthinker> Each lens searches within it's specific area.
<Lionthinker> Homes searches through everything.
<Lionthinker> You can search for more Lens and Scopes in the Ubuntu Software Centre (USC), make sure you select âShow Technical itemsâ at the bottom.
<Lionthinker> Or you can see other lens and scopes for download as Launchpad PPA's https://launchpad.net/~atareao/+archive/lenses
<Lionthinker> Just remember they are PPA's so they haven't been verified like USC apps have.
<Lionthinker> any questions so far?
<Lionthinker> Lets get to SCOPES
<Lionthinker> Except for Home, each LENS has âFilter resultsâ at the top right
<Lionthinker> quick take a look
<Lionthinker> After selecting it you'll get each LENS' specific options
<Lionthinker> These are called SCOPES, and they narrow your search with specific parameters
<Lionthinker> Scopes also appear in throughout a LENS automatically.
<Lionthinker> For example, there's a UTILITIES SCOPE in the HOME LENS.
<Lionthinker> Type 2+4 and the answer will appear in the calculator
<Lionthinker> but within the lens
<Lionthinker> Also type in your city and the weather should appear
<Lionthinker> These are useful SCOPES built into the LENS to get info faster.
<Lionthinker> Okay so lets actually launch options from the DASH
<Lionthinker> Now each option in each lens has can be selected.
<Lionthinker> By left-clicking you launch the file/app
<Lionthinker> By right-clicking you access the new Quantal feature called previews
<Lionthinker> Right-clicking previews the file/app in the DASH and provides a little more information specific to the file
<Lionthinker> For Files, info will be size and format. Options available will be âShow in Folder', 'Email' or 'Open'
<Lionthinker> For Apps, info will be Ubuntu Software Centre's (USC) community grading, and further info. Option will be to 'launch' or 'uninstall'
<Lionthinker> You can move left or right through preview mode by right/left clicking.
<Lionthinker> In the Music Lens you can preview a song by also playing it in the DASH. Although this has been very buggy and hasn't worked for me yet.
<Lionthinker> Lastly, the DASH does INTUITIVE SEARCHES
<Lionthinker> For instance if you search for an app in the app lens and you connected to the internet:
<Lionthinker> it will show you installed apps similar to the name as well as options to download and installed from USC
<Lionthinker> If you in Video then Youtube will also be searched as a scope
<Lionthinker> In both you can select only local files or include options such as Youtube and USC
<Lionthinker> Software centre of course being for the Applications Lens
<Lionthinker> There's also an Amazon scope which searches for Amazon products in your Home Lens. When clicking it will take you to the Amazon site for that product.
<Lionthinker> If you purchase it then Ubuntu gets a % of the sale.
<Lionthinker> Okay any questions so far?
<ClassBot> kartman882451 asked: i have ubuntu 12.10 but can't find the utility scope in the home lense
<Lionthinker> kartman882451, so you can't actually "click" on some scopes like you can the obvious filters on the right
<Lionthinker> Its meant to be intuitive, so do a sum like 2+2 and you'll see the calculator scope appear with the answer
<Lionthinker> same for weather in cities. Pick a city say Lima New York and the weather scope appears
<Lionthinker> LENS, SCOPES and INTUITIVE SEARCHES are fundamentally what Unity is meant for-
<Lionthinker> To bring your computing world as close as possible to your fingerprints.
<Lionthinker> There are 3 interesting points to consider with the DASH (that I got from David Calle), as opposed to say a Google search
<Lionthinker> - You donât need everything all the time. A search engine already specialized in what you need at the moment you are using it is much more efficient
<Lionthinker> - You donât transmit everything you do and want to Google anymore. Specialized search engines allow you to pass to the web service only what it should be concerned about, only when you want it
<Lionthinker> - Itâs modular and you can install and uninstall each search engine.
<Lionthinker> You can check out the Hundred Scopes project which is aiming at creating hundreds ;-D of scopes https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-100scopes
<Lionthinker> What lens and scopes do is lessen the burden of having to file or even know where things are stored. For instance it doesn't matter if a file you looking for is on your drive or Google Doc's or Ubuntu 1, the File lens will find it
<Lionthinker> Any Questions?
<Lionthinker> Lets quickly cover the UNITY NOTIFICATIONS PANEL
<Lionthinker> When you play a song then it will appear in a bubble at the top right of the screen.
<Lionthinker> This is the Notification Panel and this is how you will be able to monitor exactly whats going on currently with your desktop session
<Lionthinker> Notifications include but are not limited to FB and Twitter notices that Gwibber receives, Volume control, Screen brightness, Wireless connections and Ubuntu One updates.
<Lionthinker> They don't appear for long, just as brief notifications
<Lionthinker> They also disappear if you move your mouse over it.
<Lionthinker> Its very useful to watch your Twitter and FB updates role by- remember once they come onto your system you get the notification
<Lionthinker> Then you can access them from the Gwibber lens
<Lionthinker> Lets get to the UNITY PANEL and the HUD
<Lionthinker> take a look at this quickly http://www.muktware.com/sites/default/files/images/applications/Unity-2.jpg
<Lionthinker> The UNITY PANEL is the bar at the top of the screen
<Lionthinker> On the right is the INDICATORS panel.
<Lionthinker> This is where current system and app info can be found
<Lionthinker> Such as date and time, network communication, volume control, contacts such as FB, Twitter and email.
<Lionthinker> The most right button provides system info and of course the shut down button
<Lionthinker> On the left is the UNITY PANEL.
<Lionthinker> This is where menus specific to the current open programe appear.
<Lionthinker> For instance with my IRC client open as I type there is nothing on top-but the title of the programe "Xchat"
<Lionthinker> However when I move my mouse to the top then MENU OPTIONS appear.
<Lionthinker> This changes for every programe that appears in focus, so be sure if you have many windows open that you select the correct one before trying to find Menu options
<Lionthinker> This is part of making Ubuntu intuitive, things appear when they needed, not before hand and so we don't have a cluttered workspace.
<Lionthinker> The HUD fits on top of the menus
<Lionthinker> In Ubuntu 12.4 Precise the HUD was introduced meaning Heads Up Display
<Lionthinker> It is meant to allow you to search for menu options
<Lionthinker> Push the Alt key and a drop down menu appears with âType your commandâ
<Lionthinker> For instance when you type a word document and you need to save you can either move your mouse to the top, select âFileâ and then âSave Asâ
<Lionthinker> or you can select Alt and then type âSave Asâ
<Lionthinker> By the time you get to the 'a', several options will have appeared, some of which will be âSave Asâ
<Lionthinker> You can also search for "as" and the save options will appear
<Lionthinker> This is a unique feature to Ubuntu and is truly revolutionarising Ubuntu as a computing interface.
<Lionthinker> One thing to note on HUD, is that it searches all menus
<Lionthinker> It doens't limit itself to the menus of the specific file or program open at the moment
<Lionthinker> Any questions?
<Lionthinker> The HUD is very useful in programes such as GIMP which has countless options. Also LibreOffice.
<Lionthinker> Trying to find that one particular menu option to say insert, cut etc etc is made easier by knowing what you want to do and searching for it
<Lionthinker> Lastly what I want to summarise SHORTCUTS
<Lionthinker> Remember to hold the SUPER key and the Ubuntu shortcut menu will appear
<Lionthinker> Take a few minutes every day to memorise a section and make use of it
<Lionthinker> You'll notice you move around your Ubuntu laptop a whole lot faster and when trying other Operating Systems it will be like moving back in time
<Lionthinker> Lets cover some shortcuts
<Lionthinker> When holding the Super, the shortcuts menu appears, but look at the LAUNCHER
<Lionthinker> You'll notice numbers on the first 9 apps
<Lionthinker> You can launch any file/app by selecting "Super+Number"
<Lionthinker> So your favourites are really two buttons away
<Lionthinker> Super + S brings you to the Workspace Switcher
<Lionthinker> Which is that 4 square block on top of trash
<Lionthinker> Your 4 workspaces appear and you can move programes from one window to the next
<Lionthinker> Within a window use Alt + Tab to move between programes
<Lionthinker> When you have several programes of the same type open but want to preview them
<Lionthinker> Use Alt+~ (button on top of Tab)
<Lionthinker> Another way to see all current programes open in a particular window is Super+W
<Lionthinker> You can then maximise, minimise and close windows as you see fit but without actually entering any
<Lionthinker> Also note you can max/min the DASH
<Lionthinker> So I would like to leave time for questions if there are any?
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<Lionthinker> Together the HUD, LAUNCHER, DASH, LENS and SCOPES make up the Ayatana Unity Project
<Lionthinker> or Unity for short
<Lionthinker> on a side note you can see there's a definite vision behind Unity
<Lionthinker> When you preview the TV, Tablets and Phones after working with the Desktop you can see how they all just "make sense"
<Lionthinker> Okay no questions it seems (either really good or really bad), but first try Ubuntu Unity before judging from this class
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<Lionthinker> Thanks guys for everything, hope you enjoyed and also thanks to the organises pleia2 and JoseeAntonioR
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu User Days - Current Session: Introduction to Firefox - Instructors: JoseeAntonioR - Slides: http://is.gd/WfypnK
<ClassBot> Slides for Introduction to Firefox: http://people.ubuntu.com/~joseeantonior/Slides/Firefox.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/09/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<JoseeAntonioR> hey, guys! welcome again to the User Days
<JoseeAntonioR> for those who already know me, and those who don't, I'm JosÃ© Antonio Rey (but just call me Jose), and I'm a random member from Lima, Peru :)
<JoseeAntonioR> I have done some slides for you today, so if you could grab them it'd be great, they're at http://people.ubuntu.com/~joseeantonior/Slides/Firefox.pdf
<JoseeAntonioR> I'll wait a couple minutes for you to grab them, and we're good to go
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 1]
<JoseeAntonioR> so, today I'll be giving you an introduction to Firefox
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 2[
<JoseeAntonioR> oops
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 2]
<JoseeAntonioR> I'll cover some basics on it, and give you some tips to have a great browsing experience
<JoseeAntonioR> so, let's start!
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 3]
<JoseeAntonioR> what is Firefox?
<JoseeAntonioR> Firefox is a web browser that comes attached, or integrated with Ubuntu
<JoseeAntonioR> you can find it in the Unity Launcher
<JoseeAntonioR> and it's developed and distributed by Mozilla
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 4]
<JoseeAntonioR> the main use of Firefox is, as many of you may know, browsing the web
<JoseeAntonioR> so, in Firefox you can do *lots* of things, such as bookmarking your favorite webpages, watch videos, download music, documents, and files in general
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 5]
<JoseeAntonioR> so now, we'll get through a couple how-tos
<JoseeAntonioR> obviously, to do all of this you need to have an Internet connection (in case you're reading this offline)
<JoseeAntonioR> first of all, how to download files
<JoseeAntonioR> once you want to download a file, you can click on the link, and a new window will pop-up
<JoseeAntonioR> from there, you can choose between opening it with a certain program or application, or saving it to a certain folder
<JoseeAntonioR> once you choose, that little window will disappear and another one will open
<JoseeAntonioR> that's the downloads window!
<JoseeAntonioR> in there you will be able to see your current downloads, as well as their progress, and any past downloads
<JoseeAntonioR> you can close the window at any given time, and you can re-open it by pressing Ctrl+Shift+Y
<JoseeAntonioR> so, if you haven't downloaded the slides as you didn't know how, there you go!
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 6]
<JoseeAntonioR> now, you may be wondering how to check your history
<JoseeAntonioR> that's easy! just press Ctrl+H and a sidebar will appear, sorting your history in folders by date, and then by name inside
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 7]
<JoseeAntonioR> now, in these Firefox versions (the latest), you are able to navigate in tabs
<JoseeAntonioR> it's like having several windows in just one
<JoseeAntonioR> tabs will appear above the upper part, just below the address bar
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 8]
<JoseeAntonioR> now, how to set your homepage
<JoseeAntonioR> first of all, you need to choose your homepage (I highly recommend ubuntu.com!)
<JoseeAntonioR> once you have chose it, just go to Edit>Preferences, and type the address on the bar
<JoseeAntonioR> if there's no bar, make sure you are on the first tab
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 10]
<JoseeAntonioR> how to block pop-ups
<JoseeAntonioR> this will block webpage pop-ups, not firefox pop-ups (like the downloads window and so on)
<JoseeAntonioR> it is active by default, but if for any reason you want to disable it, just go to Edit>Preferences>Content, and remove the check on the right checkbox
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 11]
<JoseeAntonioR> how to create bookmarks is easy
<JoseeAntonioR> you can do it at any time by just pressing Ctrl+D
<JoseeAntonioR> you can also click the star on the address bar
<JoseeAntonioR> and if you want to check your bookmarks, just press Ctrl+B
<JoseeAntonioR> now, we get to the personalization part!
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 12]
<JoseeAntonioR> Persona is an extension or add-on that you can use to change the appearance of your Firefox windows
<JoseeAntonioR> you can discover more about Persona by going to http://www.getpersonas.com
<JoseeAntonioR> if you have downloaded the slides, it shows a link that was shortened and works no more, but I have already updated them :)
<JoseeAntonioR> now, time to get through a cheatsheet of Firefox shortcuts!
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 13]
<JoseeAntonioR> Ctrl+N will open a new window
<JoseeAntonioR> let me clarify, it will not open a new tab, but a new window
<JoseeAntonioR> Ctrl+T is the one that opens a new tab in the same window
<JoseeAntonioR> if you close a tab accidentally, or just want to get one back, you can press Ctrl+Shift+T, and you'll open the last closed tab
<JoseeAntonioR> Ctrl+O opens a file in your PC
<JoseeAntonioR> Ctrl+W is a quick way to get a tab closed
<JoseeAntonioR> Ctrl+R will refresh your current *tab*
<JoseeAntonioR> with Ctrl+H you'll be able to check your history
<JoseeAntonioR> Ctrl+Shift+Y will open the downloads window to check progress and past downloads
<JoseeAntonioR> Ctrl+Shift+E will open Panorama (I'll explain what's that in a bit)
<JoseeAntonioR> Ctrl+B shows you a list of your current bookmarks
<JoseeAntonioR> and Ctrl+D allows you to bookmark the current page
<JoseeAntonioR> Ctrl+Shift+N allows you to re-open the last closed window
<JoseeAntonioR> and finally, Ctrl+Q is used to quit Firefox
<JoseeAntonioR> so, go and try it now for yourself! (don't use Ctrl+Q if you're using webchat, and use the rest of them in another tab if you are)
<JoseeAntonioR> I'll give you three minutes so you can test them all, go!
<JoseeAntonioR> in the meanwhile, if you have any questions, just ask them in #ubuntu-classroom-chat, and I'll do my best to answer them
<JoseeAntonioR> ok, so let's get back to the session!
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 14]
<JoseeAntonioR> in Firefox, we have a super nice app called Panorama
<JoseeAntonioR> you can open Panorama by pressing Ctrl+Shift+E
<JoseeAntonioR> there, you will be able to regroup your tabs, and create different groups in a same window
<JoseeAntonioR> you can even name them and resize them to show importance!
<JoseeAntonioR> to switch from one group to another, just go into panorama again and click on the tab you want to go to
<JoseeAntonioR> [slide 15]
<JoseeAntonioR> we also have extensions, or add-ons
<JoseeAntonioR> they are programs installed on Firefox itself
<JoseeAntonioR> they have different uses, as for example, managing your music player, or changing the appearance of your windows (as we've seen with Persona)
<JoseeAntonioR> information about addons or extensions can be found at addons.mozilla.com
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<JoseeAntonioR> so, now, let's finish with some extensions I personally like
<JoseeAntonioR> first of all, Persona, it gives you a great way to customize your browser
<JoseeAntonioR> you can find it here https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/personas-plus/?src=search
<JoseeAntonioR> we used to have foxrunner, but it's not supported anymore
<JoseeAntonioR> but we have the other 2
<JoseeAntonioR> which are adblock plus (https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/adblock-plus/)
<JoseeAntonioR> which blocks ads on webpages and youtube videos
<JoseeAntonioR> and we have greasemonkey
<JoseeAntonioR> which can be found here
<JoseeAntonioR> https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/greasemonkey/
<JoseeAntonioR> and it's used to run javascript scripts on a webpage
<JoseeAntonioR> so, I think that's it!
<JoseeAntonioR> thank you all for being around!
<JoseeAntonioR> if you have any questions I have some time to answer them, just make sure you ask in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
<JoseeAntonioR> I really hope you enjoyed it, and keep having fun today!
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<JoseeAntonioR> coming up is holstein with a session about equivalent programs
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu User Days - Current Session: Equivalent Programs - Instructors: holstein
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/09/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<holstein> WELCOME!
<holstein> i want to invite you to the #ubuntu-classroom-chat channel for any less formal questions/comments you might have during the next hour
<holstein> feel free to ask questions at anytime!
<holstein> what i am going to share about today is, equivalent applications
<holstein> when discussing this, and planning for this presentation, i ended up with a lot of questions on linux adoption in general
<holstein> i would like to address those quickly before moving on into what applications can replace certain tasks for users
<holstein> if you look at how most users come into using computers, they buy a machine with an OS, and use it.. for years. til it "breaks" and then a tech fixes it
<holstein> they dont have to install the OS
<holstein> i think there are some things that are just not equivalent about what we expect from new ubuntu users that could be addressed by some of us as more experienced users
<holstein> getting ubuntu running for someone might not be enough.. it might require a little tutoring on some things that are just not equivalent.. such as
<holstein> the file system... where are my files? this is a question that can be answered differently on each operating system
<holstein> but, i think knowing that, and explaing that to a new user.. showing them where in the file manager things are.. and where things show up... tring to make that experience as equivalent as possible is important
<holstein> there are little things that i think we all can take for granted.. knowing where in nautilus or thunar a USB stick shows up.. and how to mount it
<holstein> this looks totally different in windows or OSX.. and i think its near impossible to make that experience *exactly* equivalent
<holstein> but, with a little explanation, and tutoring, i think its something that can easily be learned and adapted to
<holstein> another big thing can be user interface differences
<holstein> i hear folks say "im used to it looking like this" or "this is what windows did"
<holstein> im not hear to say what is better or worse,, just to say, if we can listen to these statments when trying to migrate someone, i think it can help give htem a better experience
<holstein> questions comments?
<holstein> i gave a presentation on this at my linux users group at the beginning of the month
<holstein> we spent quite a while talking about microsoft office and office replacements
<holstein> i thinks this is a big "deal breaker" for some new users, so i want to address this first, and them maybe back track a little to some other topics
<holstein> one important thing to note, which may or may not be constructive for a new user is.. there is nothing about linux/ubuntu preventing microsoft from making office available for linux/ubuntu
<holstein> that being said.. right now, it is not
<holstein> there are ways to use WINE http://appdb.winehq.org/ or crossover office http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CrossOver_(software)
<holstein> again, i am not hear to belittle those efforts, or say what is "good" or "bad"
<holstein> however, i find, i cant really install wine applications and leave those as an option for a totally new ubuntu user
<holstein> i find something is always a little "strange" or "uncomfortable" about using the applications in wine
<holstein> also, what if an upgrade breaks something?
<holstein> i personally just dont feel like wine is a solution for offering an equivalent applicaition for a new user, however, i do feel like,, if one were to offer help, it could be a great solution.. you might end up providing more support than you bargain for though
<holstein> for me, and all my word processing needs, libreoffice is great!
<holstein> again, not to debate which is better or worse, there are those who need office and one can run into issues using libreoffice with MSoffice users
<holstein> if i show up at a small buisness and move *all* of them to liebreoffice, assuming libreoffice its self meets the needs they have, they will be fine
<holstein> the trick is.. when you go to a place running MS office, and you try and drop in libreoffice or abiword or another alternative
<holstein> the users in my LUG shared some very helpful tips for making sure this can go smoothly
<holstein> one user had dropped abiword http://www.abisource.com/ in, in just the scenario mentioned above, and had no issue with adoption
<holstein> he made sure the machine saved the documents back as file types friendly to the other ms office systems
<holstein> saving from abiword or libreoffice as .doc by default can help with interoperability.. and make the porcess go more smoothly
<holstein> http://www.libreoffice.org/ (for the logs)
<holstein> in preparing for this presentation i read that microsoft plans to release office for linux in 2014.. if that is true of not, here is an actual product
<holstein> http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/web-apps/
<holstein> ^^ this means that, office can run in the browser... any browser
<holstein> this would be a nice easy way for a new ubuntu user to get 2 things.. word running in linux... and automatic backup of documents
<holstein> this is also a great place for me to transition to what i think is a key type of equivalent applications.. webapps!
<holstein> in the above example, word is running as a webapp.. accessible from any browser, anywhere
<holstein> there are lots of applications with this functionality
<holstein> one big one is google docs
<holstein> if i go into that same small buisness i mentioned above and transition them all to google docs, then they are getting several things
<holstein> a syncing solution.. automatic backup.. and cross platform support
<holstein> one thing we talked about at this point in the LUG meeting was, how important is including mobile devices in this cross platform idea?
<holstein> with a webapp, you can run them on smart phones and iDevices... migrate folks to and from linux without really any change in look/feel or functionality of what might be core, "deal breaking" applications that they *must* have
<holstein> also, at this point, several users had legitimate complaints about google's policies on privacty
<holstein> privacy*
<holstein> again, i am not here to say what is "better".. if google docs is not an option for you, or your buisness, i think you can and should look at what is being provided
<holstein> these services can be implemented using open tools... http://etherpad.org/ for colaboration.. http://owncloud.org/ for sync and/or backup.. etc..
<holstein> also, it is easier than ever to make webapps "first class citizens", so to speak, in the ubuntu desktop
<holstein> i could setup a new user with native looking menu buttons to click on that could link to *any* web application i choose
<holstein> that could be anything from google docs, to a locally implemented open solution that is totally run "in house"
<holstein> let me list and briefly outline some webapps that are equivalent applications that i use and have read about
<holstein> http://pixlr.com/editor/ is an easy online image editor
 * holstein is a musician/composer
<holstein> one thing i use is a notation softare called "musescore"
<holstein> http://musescore.org/
<holstein> this could be thought of as an alternative to finale
<holstein> but.. there is also a nice online notation editor called noteflight http://www.noteflight.com/login
<holstein> i could setup one of my finale using friends with noteflight.. then, assuming it meets their needs, i can move them to ubuntu, and put an icon to noteflight right there
<holstein> helping that user continue to maintain the workflow they need for their passionate hobby, or proffession
<holstein> at this point, i would like to ask if there are any questions?.. then i'll move on to some native applcations and talk about there equivalent funtions
<holstein> so. a big workflow that most everyone needs to deal with on a daily basis is a web browser
<holstein> this is also what we are talking about with webapps... running them in a web browser, but they might not look like that.. they might look more like a native application
<holstein> firefox is a big, well supported, cross platform web browser
<holstein> one nice thing we can do if we are trying to migrate folks to linux... we go in and migrate them over to some nice cross platform applications
<holstein> then, when they are used to using them.. we switch the OS.. and its not as "jarring"... not so much to learn all at once
<holstein> there are many web browser that are cross platform
<holstein> chromium... chrome.. opera.. many are opensource.. many are not
<holstein> again.. im not here to say which is "better"... i tend to go through a little interview process with folks that want to migrate to linux
<holstein> i ask what they are using.. what hardware.. what web browser
<holstein> try and give them what is closest to what they are used to.. not what you want or use
<holstein> http://filezilla-project.org/ is a nice cross platform ftp client
<holstein> server/client
<holstein> http://www.teamviewer.com/en/index.aspx teamview is not open, but its a nice, easy way to provide support for users, and it is crossplatform
<holstein> http://www.videolan.org/vlc/index.html VLC is one of my personal favorites
<holstein> a great content player.. as well as streaming capabilities.. has run great for me in windows, linux and OSX
<holstein> https://www.virtualbox.org/ virtualbox.. runs great crossplatform, as well as allowing virualiztion of many platforms
<holstein> virtualbox can scale into virtualization for professional use
<holstein> might help someone migrating from windows server
<holstein> there are many email clients, but i think arguably one of the biggest and most supported foss ones is http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/thunderbird/
<holstein> another great option if you can get in early, and migrate a small business over to thunderbird.. could ease a future linux migration
<holstein> graphics editing.. and manipulation
<holstein> most folks who need photoshop just need photoshop
<holstein> again, not saying what is "better".. but we have the GIMP http://www.gimp.org/
<holstein> also, inkscape http://inkscape.org/
<holstein> inkscape is a great project with awesome tutorials in the menu!
<holstein> apps for instant messaging... http://www.pidgin.im/download/
<holstein> maybe move users over to pidgin from msn...
<holstein> also, http://xchat.org/ xchat for windows!.. xchat is one of my personal favorites as well.. was my first IRC client i used
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<holstein> http://www.3ds.com/products/draftsight/download-draftsight/?xtor=SEC-6-GOO-[]-[old]-S-[draftsight]&gclid=CJ25l5rYk7UCFQ-e4AodBhAAbw
<holstein> sorry for the nasty link ^^
<holstein> but i was assured for CAD, this was a great solution!
<holstein> draftsight from 3ds
<holstein> bluefish http://bluefish.openoffice.nl/index.html
<holstein> nvu or composer http://www.nvu.com/
<holstein> blender is an incredible 3d graphics application that is cross platform and well supported http://www.blender.org/
<holstein> also some commercial players we have migrating to linux
<holstein> http://www.lwks.com/ lightworks
<holstein> steam http://store.steampowered.com/
<holstein> i want to briefly mention those server admins who might be migrating to linux
<holstein> what about getting equivalent applications there?
<holstein> http://www.turnkeylinux.org/
<holstein> turnkey linux offers ubuntu appliances that run great "live" and allow one to test drupal or wordpress instances as well as *many* others easily
<ClassBot> SuperEngineer asked: ââis that octupus a UK mail worker?  it's got a tentacle holding down the airmail from going anywhere ;)
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<holstein> thunderbird is serious about the sea dwelling workers that route your mail!
<holstein> ok.. any more questions, comments?
<holstein> let me just wrap up by saying.. i think for those of us who are more experienced in linux.. take some time to make sure the new users you are helping adopt linux have a good starting point
<holstein> try and check the install and make sure things are working... and they have a solution to all their work flows
<holstein> make sure the have equivalent applications that can do the job and fit in where they need them to fit in
<holstein> make sure they*
<holstein> cheers everyone and thanks for listening!
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu User Days - Current Session: [On Air] Multimedia and Multimedia Centers - Instructors: bobweaver
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/09/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<JoseeAntonioR> hey guys, next session is at Ubuntu on Air!, so just go to http://ubuntuonair.com and click the play button!
<bobweaver> https://launchpad.net/~markjtully/+archive/ppa
<bobweaver> https://apps.ubuntu.com/cat/applications/playonlinux/
<bobweaver> http://www.playonlinux.com/en/download.html
<bobweaver> https://apps.ubuntu.com/cat/applications/ubuntu-restricted-extras/
<bobweaver> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libdvdcss
<bobweaver> http://www.medibuntu.org/repository.php
<bobweaver> http://ogmrip.sourceforge.net/en/index.html
<bobweaver> https://launchpad.net/~scopes-packagers/+archive/ppa
<JoseeAntonioR> for you guys that have just joined, go to www.ubuntuonair.com for the session!
<bobweaver> super+v
<bobweaver> https://launchpad.net/~scopes-packagers/+archive/ppa
<bobweaver> https://launchpad.net/~markjtully/+archive/ppa
<bobweaver> https://launchpad.net/~atareao/+archive/lenses?field.series_filter=precise
<bobweaver> https://apps.ubuntu.com/cat/applications/xbmc/
<bobweaver> https://launchpad.net/~ehoover/+archive/compholio/
<JoseeAntonioR> Guys, go to ubuntuonair.com to check the last 20mins of the session!
<bobweaver> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16815116036
<bobweaver> https://www.google.com/search?q=capture+cards+linux&aq=f&oq=capture+cards+linux&aqs=chrome.0.57j0l2j62l3.10644&sourceid=chrome&client=ubuntu&channel=cs&ie=UTF-8#hl=en&gs_rn=2&gs_ri=serp&tok=2e5Vli85xERxYpwecJh6AQ&ds=sh&pq=capture%20cards%20linux&cp=5&gs_id=o&xhr=t&q=hdhomerun&es_nrs=true&pf=p&client=ubuntu&hs=yhE&channel=cs&tbm=shop&sclient=psy-ab&oq=hdhom&gs_l=&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.&bvm=bv.42080656,d.dmQ&fp=be70c6
<bobweaver> 70a96ace3b&biw=1241&bih=596
<JoseeAntonioR> That's #ubuntu-tv
<bobweaver>  #mythtv-user
<bobweaver>  #mythbuntu
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<bobweaver> https://launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/+archive/beta
<bobweaver> https://launchpad.net/~u2t/+archive/bleedingedge
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<bobweaver> youtube.com/tv
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu User Days - Current Session: Installing Software in Ubuntu - Instructors: epikvision
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/09/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<epikvision> Hello! How is everyone doing today? Enjoying User Days so far?
<epikvision> Hello everyone, how are we all doing today? Enjoying User Days so far?
<epikvision> Alright, let's get started.
<epikvision> My name is John Kim, and I contribute to Ubuntu QA and Ubuntu Weekly News. I first got into Ubuntu since UDS -Q, where I experOkienced the community upfront. I never looked back since.
<epikvision> Today, we will learn about installing software in Ubuntu.
<epikvision> ==Introduction==
<epikvision> To install software on Windows or Mac, you would download the file from your browser, execute it, and follow the installer's step-by-step instructions.
<epikvision> However, Linux, including Ubuntu,has a different way of installing.
<epikvision> It uses the Ubuntu Software Center for most of your software needs.  In it, you can find thousands of free applications, as well as commercial software.
<epikvision> You can say installing software from the Software Center is just as easy as installing from the App Store and Google Play market. :-)
<epikvision> There are a few different ways to install in Ubuntu:  (1) Ubuntu Software Center, (2) .deb download, or (3) through apt-get, which I will cover briefly.
<epikvision> Questions?
<epikvision> ok, moving on.
<epikvision> ==Ubuntu Software Center==
<epikvision> We will get Tomboy, a well-known notetaking app, from the Center.
<epikvision> If you already have it, great!  You can still follow along.
<epikvision> Open up the software center. It will take you to the first page with app categories, new apps, and featured apps on a slider.
<epikvision> Click on the search bar on the top right corner, and type in Tomboy and press enter.
<epikvision> Double-click on Tomboy notes, and press install.
<epikvision> Pretty simple.
<epikvision> On every app page, you can find a description of the app, some screenshots, and reviews. If you want, you can also submit your own review of the app.
<epikvision> ==Manual download==
<epikvision> Although the center gives you access to many software, some software are not available in the Center. So, you will need to download them from the app's respective websites.
<epikvision> Usually those files are packaged in .deb format.
<epikvision> Really, the installation process is very simple. When you double-click the downloaded .deb, it simply directs you to the Software Center.
<epikvision> Let's get Google Chrome, a .deb file in Linux.
<epikvision> Open up your web browser, and on your search box, type google chrome.
<epikvision> Go to the chrome site, and click download.  Once you have downloaded it, double-click the app and you will be directed to the Software Center.
<epikvision> You know what to do from there.  :)
<epikvision> Now, here is a more technical way to install software.
<epikvision> ==Apt-get on terminal==
<epikvision> Once upon a time, Linux users installed software by compiling .tar.gz files.
<epikvision> Later, Debian, the base for Ubuntu, realized it needed to create an efficient way to build packages without compilation part, so it gave birth to apt-get.
<epikvision> Apt-get stood the test of time because it is highly secure and versatile.
<epikvision> How is it used?
<epikvision> When you visit popular Linux sites such as omgubuntu or webupd8 for some eyecandy or software, you will notice it will give you commands in the form of "sudo apt-get."
<epikvision> That is because the software is found in a repository not available in Ubuntu.  And they may not be found in a website to download from.
<epikvision> Installation is all done via a terminal and a few simple commands.
<epikvision> Let's get familiar with the syntax by downloading nitrotasks, a beautiful "get things done" task manager, via the terminal.
<epikvision> Open up your terminal with Ctrl+Alt+T, and type the following.
<epikvision>         sudo add-apt-repository ppa:cooperjona/nitrotasks
<epikvision>         sudo apt-get update
<epikvision>         sudo apt-get install nitrotasks
<epikvision> So here's an explanation
<epikvision> First, you are adding a repository of the archive with the app nitrotasks
<epikvision> Then you update to refresh the repository index.
<epikvision> and ensures the very latest nitrotasks is available.
<epikvision> Finally, you install the app.
<epikvision> you will see this sequence repeat in varieties of ways for different software out there.
<epikvision> ==Some concepts==
<epikvision> In a broad sense, we actually refer to software as packages, collections of files in a single file.
<epikvision> They rely on other software, known as dependencies, to function properly.
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<epikvision> Fortunately, you don't have to worry about dependencies because when you install software from the Center, the Center ensures to download the dependencies for you.
<epikvision> Packages are either source or binary.  Binary are executable, while source includes the source code and must be compiled to install.
<epikvision> Every source package comes with a readme, which usually provides the instructions to compile the package.
<epikvision> ==Conclusion==
<epikvision> We have covered a lot about installing in Ubuntu.  It is fairly simple to do.
<epikvision> I hope the information proved valuable, and I would wish you all a good day.  Thank you for attending my session.
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu User Days - Current Session: Accessibility Applications - Instructors: AlanBell
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/09/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<AlanBell> hi everyone
<AlanBell> thanks for joining this session on accessibility applications in Ubunt
<AlanBell> Ubuntu even
<AlanBell> We will do a run through of the various settings and tools available as assitive technologies that are shipped by default on the CD
<AlanBell> then a bit more in depth stuff with Orca the screen reader
<AlanBell> Ubuntu can be installed on a computer purely by using the audio commentary presented by the orca screen reader
<AlanBell> over the last few releases there has been quite a bit of work on the ubiquity installer and I can now install ubuntu without looking at the screen
<AlanBell> if you are sighted and think you know the Ubuntu installation process pretty well I would very much encourage you to try it
<AlanBell> put in a CD, boot up and wait for the sound of the drums - that means the installer is ready
<AlanBell> press ctrl+s to start orca, and you will hear the computer talking to you
<AlanBell> then proceed through the install as normal - but only using the keyboard. If you can't see you can't do much with a mouse (but you can use a touchscreen)
<AlanBell> however, I am not doing a blow by blow walkthrough of the installer today
<AlanBell> once you have Ubuntu installed, there are a number of accessibility settings to adjust to your preferences
<AlanBell> to turn these on, open the dash and search for "settings"
<AlanBell> this will launch the system settings panel and in there is the Universal access settings
<AlanBell> you can also just search for accessibility in the dash to go straight to that sub-panel
<AlanBell> Universal access settings is divided up into 4 sections, Seeing, Hearing, Typing, Pointing and Clicking
<AlanBell> you should be able to turn on high contrast, and set a preference for large text
<AlanBell> these settings can help people with a variety of visual impairments
<AlanBell> also can be handy if you are using a projector to demonstrate something on Ubuntu to a group of people
<AlanBell> high contrast is good for projectors in bright rooms
<AlanBell> this is an example of where good quality accessibility implementation is of value to everyone
<AlanBell> next on this tab is the screen reader, we will come back to that as it is a big topic
<AlanBell> finally beep on caps and num lock - that doesn't work for me, I will check for a bug and file one later
<AlanBell> whilst we are talking about things that don't work, sadly we move on to the hearing tab, where the visual alerts are currently non-functional
<AlanBell> The idea of that is to make applications flash or wobble or otherwise indicate that they want attention rather than making an audio beep
<AlanBell> that should probably be turned into a launcher icon wobble now
<AlanBell> these are examples of things that did work once, but changes to the desktop in other areas unfortunately broke them
<AlanBell> we are trying to get more accessibility features into the testing framework, so regressions get caught as they happen
<AlanBell> so, onwards to the Typing tab
<AlanBell> here we can activate the on screen keyboard, onboard
<AlanBell> onboard has been used on the nexus 7 as a keyboard, and as a result of that some performance issues were found and fixed
<AlanBell> onboard is a bit different to many phone and tablet keyboards, it is more like a real computer keyboard
<AlanBell> which has its pros and cons
<AlanBell> the phone keyboards are optimised for touch a bit more and have "thumbs" which pop up above the keys to show you what you are pressing when your finger obscures the key
<AlanBell> but onboard allows you to press every key your keyboard has got such as ` and tab and ~
<AlanBell> these can be hard to get to on many other touchscreen keyboards
<AlanBell> onboard also includes some mouse accessibility, there is a pointer key that you can hover over with the mouse
<AlanBell> (or click)
<AlanBell> and this reveals some mouse operations such as hover click and drag click and doubleclick
<AlanBell> this means you can use the full function of the mouse including right clicks without ever actually clicking, just hovering
<AlanBell> or do right clicks on a touchscreen using just a stylus
<AlanBell> back to the accessibility settings panel
<AlanBell> there are settings here on the typing tab for sticky keys - which allow you to use modifiers as a sequence rather than a chord
<AlanBell> so instead of pressing ctrl+s to save you can press and release ctrl, then press s
<AlanBell> this means if you have the use of one hand (or are holding a cup of coffee in the other or whatever) you can type difficult multi-key combinations
<AlanBell> slow keys is a setting to make sure that if you accidentally tap keys they don't get accepted, it needs a more positive key selection
<AlanBell> bounce keys is similar, ignoring double presses if that is what you inadvertently do
<AlanBell> the Pointing and clicking tab has a tool to control the pointer using the keypad rather than the mouse
<AlanBell> it really isn't easy but it could be handy for anyone who has a broken mouse, or people with fine motor skills issue who can use a mouse or stylus to get close to the right area, then use the keypad to finish off exactly where they want to click
<AlanBell> I modified a mouse for a user once, so that they could use the mouse with one hand and click with the other, as the act of clicking moved the mouse too much
<AlanBell> this would have been a workable alternative to dismantelling the mouse and making a switch to solder to the mouse click
<AlanBell> There are tools on this tab to do right click from a long hold of the left button and hover click, these are much like the facility built into onboard.
<AlanBell> lets go back to the seeing tab now
<AlanBell> and turn on the screen reader
<AlanBell> so, you should hear "welcome to orca"
<AlanBell> you might also get a little window with some buttons pop up, first one being preferences
<AlanBell> this doesn't pop up in raring any more it just starts
<AlanBell> first lets go through what is going on to get sound to your speakers
<AlanBell> your desktop is a gnome gtk desktop, and all the applications on it are using various standard widgets like text boxes and buttons and menus and scroll things etc
<AlanBell> the gtk applications are inspectable using an accessibility api, at-spi2
<AlanBell> orca is an application that can use this information to decide what to say
<AlanBell> orca can describe what you are doing as you do it, and can describe where you are and what is around
<AlanBell> orca itself does not make the sound however, it just decides what to say
<AlanBell> it then sends the words it wants to say to speech dispatcher
<AlanBell> speech dispatcher is a standardised interface to speech synthesis tools
<AlanBell> we ship on the default CD a speech synthesis tool called espeak, and this makes the sounds (through pulse audio like other sounds)
<AlanBell> espeak doesn't sound very natural, however it can speak in a very wide range of accents and pronunciations and it can speak very fast
<ClassBot> Ryuno-Ki asked: Is it possible to change the dispatcher and/or language Orca uses?
<AlanBell> yes it is, you can plug in an entirely different synthesiser, some sound excellent
<AlanBell> http://www.theopensourcerer.com/2011/05/speak-to-me/ would be some instructions on how to integrate the openmary speech synth
<AlanBell> that is one that wouldn't fit on the CD and doesn't have the language range of espeak
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<AlanBell> so, you should find that orca is now doing a commentary of your desktop as you move about and type
<AlanBell> there are a lot of special keypresses you can use to control orca, first thing you need to know is that there is an orca modifier key
<AlanBell> if you have a keyboard with a numeric keypad then your modifier key will be the ins key (zero) on the keypad
<AlanBell> that is used much like ctrl or alt are, you press it with another key to give a command
<AlanBell> if you have a keyboard without a separate keypad then you will be in laptop mode, in which case orca uses capslock as the orca modifier key
<AlanBell> orca has a comprehensive preferences window, you can get to this with orca modifier + space
<AlanBell> http://help.gnome.org/users/orca/stable/ has lots of help on the keyboard shortcuts for orca
<AlanBell> in the preferences window you can tweak the espeak voice a bit, try picking a different person or voice
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<AlanBell> if you pick for example a french voice it will do more than change the accent
<AlanBell> it changes the rules that it uses to pronounce words
<ClassBot> daftykins asked: Does a similar key function silence the speech, such as a single press of 'control' with most equivalent Windows speech software?
<AlanBell> orca + s turns off speech
<AlanBell> and orca modifier + s to turn it back on again
<ClassBot> Ryuno-Ki asked: Can you provide some links for further reading, Alan?
<AlanBell> http://help.gnome.org/users/orca/stable/ has lots of information
<AlanBell> the upstream project mailing list is at https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list
<AlanBell> and the developer (joanie mostly) can often be found in the #a11y channel on irc.gnome.org
<AlanBell> https://live.gnome.org/Accessibility has more information on the upstream gnome accessibiliity
<AlanBell> https://ubuntuaccessibility.wordpress.com/ has occasional articles on Ubuntu accessibility
<AlanBell> https://ubuntuaccessibility.wordpress.com/
<AlanBell> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Accessibility has more ubuntu related info
<AlanBell> running out of time now
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu User Days - Current Session: Ubuntu Flavors: Lubuntu & Xubuntu - Instructors: amjjawad, pleia2
<AlanBell> thanks all
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/09/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<JoseeAntonioR> let's wait a couple mins while we wait our instructors :)
<pleia2> so it looks like amjjawad isn't going to make it
<pleia2> I'll just start off and do the Xubuntu stuff, and hopefully he'll show up :)
<pleia2> Welcome to our session on Ubuntu Flavors: Lubuntu (LXDE) and Xubuntu (Xfce) :)
<pleia2> I'm going to quickly cover what these "Desktop Environment" things are, like "LXDE" and "Xfce" and then i'll talk about Xubuntu for a bit
<pleia2> A "Desktop Environment" or "DE" is a full interface, including Window Manager, panels, menus, engines, tools and often applications which are put or built to work together
<pleia2> In Ubuntu you *used to* get the Gnome2 Desktop Environment, but today Ubuntu uses Unity which still uses lot of Gnome
<pleia2> KDE, LXDE and Xfce are alternatives to this default
<pleia2> So, why would you want to switch from Unity to a different Desktop Environment?
<pleia2> One popular reason is simply preference. Give another one a try! You may like you find out how customizable the panels that are in Xfce, or how fast LXDE is
<pleia2> Another is speed/performance. Some let you slim down your environment by loading up fewer things by default, some are faster (usually by sacrificing eye candy), some work with lighter window managers which may run better on your system
<pleia2> Lubuntu and Xubuntu are full distribution flavors of Ubuntu which not only use these alternate Desktop Environments, but ship a lot of their own tools geared toward their user base
<pleia2> decisions as to what applications are included are discussed and decided each release cycle
<pleia2> Any questions about desktop environments? :)
<pleia2> o, as I mentioned earlier, Xfce is the Desktop Environment that comes with Xubuntu, you can find some details about it over at http://xfce.org/
<pleia2> er, so
<pleia2> and of course the Xubuntu website itself is Xubuntu.org
<pleia2> Here's a screenshot of the default you'll see when you load up Xubuntu 12.10: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lyz/quantal/Screenshot3.png
<pleia2> (this is showing with the wifi networks menu open)
<pleia2> It's a pretty familiar layout for most people used to old style Gnome2 or order Windows versions
<pleia2> The mouse icon at the top left is your menu, at the bottom of the screen you have a panel which you can easily add and remove stuff from
<pleia2> Now Xubuntu with Xfce itself differs from Ubuntu not just in environment,  it doesn't come with Open Office, instead it comes with lighter-weight "abiword" for word processing
<pleia2> as I mentioned, this is one of the decisions the team makes during the release cycle
<pleia2> It currently uses gmusicbrowser by default for music and parole for a video player
<pleia2> It uses Thunar for a basic file manager, as seen here: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lyz/quantal/Screenshot6.png
<pleia2> As you can see it's a pretty basic file manager, there are a bunch of wishlist items for expanding it but that work is done upstream (details at http://thunar.xfce.org/)
<pleia2> Xfce uses the XFwm by default for the window manager, but this can be replaced if you have different preferences, some people like using compiz, for instance
<pleia2> Just like Ubuntu, it comes with Firefox and Thunderbird for web and email clients
<pleia2> The Xfce panels (at the top and bottom in the screenshot here: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lyz/quantal/Screenshot8.png) have their own items you can add, including pagers, sound control, weather applet
<pleia2> One of my favorite things is that you can add multiple clocks :) I have three timezone clocks in my panel: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lyz/xubuntu/precise/pleia2_screenshot_03302012.png
<pleia2> Most of what you'll find app-wise is that Xubuntu takes apps from elsewhere
<pleia2> You can even run the Gnome and KDE services in the background so things launch more quickly even on Xfce
<pleia2> For me, configurability and simplicity are what I love about it, before Xfce I used Enlightenment and fluxbox, both of which were also simple but at the time required a lot of manual editing of config files to configure, and I got bored with doing that ;)
<pleia2> Xfce gives me simple + pretty configuration dialogs!
<pleia2> Any questions?
<pleia2> ok, people can ask questions whenever you would like, we'll also take them at the end of the class if there is time
<ClassBot> Phillipscheli asked: Do Xface use pulseaudio?
<pleia2> yes, Xubuntu uses pretty much all the underlying technologies that Ubuntu uses, including same kernel, pulseaudio, xorg
<pleia2> ok, time to pass this off to amjjawad to talk about Lubuntu!
<amjjawad> Thanks a lot pleia2  :)
<amjjawad> Hello everyone, my name is Ali and my username is amjjawad - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/amjjawad/
<amjjawad> I'm a member of Lubuntu since two years (almost) and I'm the team leader of Lubuntu Communications Team and Lubuntu Support Team. Also, an admin of all Lubuntu Social Networks: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/ContactUs#Social_Networks
<amjjawad> Lubuntu is the lightweight for Ubuntu which is using LXDE as its native and default DE instead of Unity for Ubuntu. Lubuntu is a project started back in 2009 and got recognized as the official lightweight variant of Ubuntu in 2011
<amjjawad> Both Lubuntu and Ubuntu share the same core system and repositories while they are different in the default DE and the default applications as well.
<amjjawad> The idea is to have a lightweight system that can breath a new life into your old machine instead of dust :) it can be installed and work on very old machines with very limited Hardware resources like CPU and RAM. I have tested it on very old machines. 256MB of RAM is acceptable.
<amjjawad> Lubuntu has started to gain more popularity by time. Some people did not like Unity so they moved to Lubuntu. Some other were seeking simplicity and speed which the the most two things that Lubuntu is having
<amjjawad> I remember I have started with Lubutnu 10.04 and back then, Lubuntu was lacking lots of features. Today, Lubutnu has improved big time over the last few releases. The few active members of its team have done a huge job
<amjjawad> Many were wondering why Lubuntu is not an LTS like Ubuntu? we got so many Qs and feedback about that. Forums, mailing list, etc. Well, as it is shown here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu#Lubuntu_12.04_is_not_an_LTS
<amjjawad> Lubuntu Team does not have enough man-power to maintain an LTS release. We do hope that in the future, we may get more developers :)
<amjjawad> Lubutnu is using Openbox as its default Windows Manager. PCManFM as its default File Manager. Chromium instead of Firefox and it has its own software center which is called: Lubuntu Software Center (LSC)
<amjjawad> Unlike what many people may think, nowadays, Lubuntu is not only for old machines, it is for every machine :) those who seek a simple, stable and highly customizable  system, they find Lubuntu the right choice for them :)
<amjjawad> The best part is, you can install almost everything can be installed on Ubuntu. It does not come with Libre-Office  but you can install it from LXTerminal (Terminal in Ubuntu) or Synaptic - Yes, we still have Synaptic around :)
<amjjawad> Our community is very dedicated, very helpful and friendly. We have a solid and great Wiki Area and one of the most important resources that I have created was the Lubuntu One Stop Thread: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1844755
<amjjawad> Which is now on the Wiki Area: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LubuntuLinks
<amjjawad> This great source of information helped lots of users whether they are new or current users or even advanced :)
<amjjawad> We are so much active when it comes to new projects: We have a project, similar to OMG Ubuntu but different and we called it: WOW Lubutnu: https://www.facebook.com/WOWLubuntu
<amjjawad> Now, we have another new project, a sub-project from WOW Lubuntu actually which is called: Lubutnu 101 : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/CommunicationsTeam/Lubuntu101
<amjjawad> This project is for NEW users to Lubuntu, those who never tried it before and for those who just started. It will show them the way of HOWTO start using the system then educate them to use the Wiki Area and seek help on the official support channels like Forums, IRC, etc.
<ClassBot> UnderControl asked: How does one contribute to another Ubuntu flavour like Xubuntu/Lubuntu/any other?
<amjjawad> There is a version for PPC, there is a version for 64bit and of course the default one is for 32bit. We are keen to keep the ISO below 700MB :)
<pleia2> for Xubuntu we have a getting involved page that has some ways: http://xubuntu.org/contribute/
<pleia2> or just join us on #xubuntu-devel or for one of our meetings :)
<amjjawad> same for Lubuntu: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/GettingInvolved
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<amjjawad> Also, just one more thing to finish with, we are everywhere from Facebook, to google+ to Twitter, youtube even Skype :)
<amjjawad> wherever a user may go, he/she will find Lubuntu :D
<amjjawad> I'm done so if anyone has any Q?
<pleia2> ah yes, Xubuntu is on facebook, twitter, G+ and LinkedIn as well, can find all our links in the footer of xubuntu.org :)
<amjjawad> Thanks for reminding me :) this is a must bookmarked page IMHO: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/ContactUs
<amjjawad> Also this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu which is the gate to everything else if i may say that
<pleia2> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu on the xubuntu side, that's where we keep all the contributor-focusing stuff (not user)
<pleia2> our Strategy Document is one we're particularly proud of, keeps us on track throughout the cycle as we make decisions :) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/StrategyDocument
<amjjawad> And who knows? if I will have some time which I don't think I will :P I may join Xubuntu Team as well ;) hopefully one day :) in fact, my whole time is dedicated to Lubuntu and I shall be like that as long as it does exist :D
<pleia2> I run Lubuntu on my PPC powerbook :)
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<amjjawad> that is great to know pleia2 :D
<amjjawad> So Qs anyone?
<pleia2> thanks everyone :)
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu User Days - Current Session: Ubuntu Community Roundtable - Instructors: JoseeAntonioR
<amjjawad> Thank you guys :)
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/09/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<JoseeAntonioR> So, hello everyone, and welcome to our rountable!
<JoseeAntonioR> I really hope you guys have enjoyed the User Days so far, we put lots of effort on it
<JoseeAntonioR> just to let you know, this session is not moderated, so everyone can talk here (#ubuntu-classroom) and in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
<JoseeAntonioR> so, what do you guys think about User Days so far?
<amjjawad> if I may comment, it is a great experience - I vote for re-doing it again :)
<UnderControl> From what I've seen this morning, very well organized.
<JoseeAntonioR> amjjawad: we'll surely do another one!
<amjjawad> That is great to know :D thanks!
<pleia2> this is also a good opportunity to bring up any community topics you may be working on or interested in
<JoseeAntonioR> for those who are just joining us this year, this is an event that is done each release cycle, so we'll have more of these
<JoseeAntonioR> yep, if you guys have any enquiry about the Ubuntu Community in general, or something in specific, we're here to answer
<amjjawad> amen to that JoseeAntonioR :D
<JoseeAntonioR> so, Ubuntu is built on a community structure, lots of people around the world help make a successful release and community
<JoseeAntonioR> we have people from north and south America, Asia, Europe, Africa, and Oceania
<JoseeAntonioR> and we have different teams, where you can contribute up to your skills or knowledge!
<JoseeAntonioR> for example, this event has been organized by the Ubuntu Classroom team, which focuses on doing this kind of things and also standalone sessions to give people a chance to learn
<JoseeAntonioR> we also have a Development team, which helps to develop Ubuntu and related packages
<JoseeAntonioR> we have the News Team, which makes sure to get an issue of the Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter out of the door each week, and posts to the Fridge and others
<JoseeAntonioR> we have the Design team, who are people working in Artwork
<pleia2> and interface design :)
<JoseeAntonioR> and I can keep mentioning them, we have a super large list
<pleia2> grantbow: you still about? care to talk about some of the work you're doing in California? :)
<pleia2> guess not :)
<pleia2> well let's see, I can talk about some of what I'm working on
<pleia2> it's weekend time, which means I'm working on stitching together our latest release of the Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter
<pleia2> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter
<pleia2> we've collected most links we'll include and have sent the draft of the latest version to our summary writers so they can write summaries of the articles
<pleia2> anyone can be a summary writer and we're always looking for volunteers :) this job and others are listed at: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Join
<pleia2> what else have I done this weekend... there are always little tasks around for projects, like writing team reports and rotating meeting logs
<pleia2> so even when you just join a team, there are often little tasks like this that they throw out to new contributors to help :)
<pleia2> anyone have any questions about contributing anywhere? :)
<pleia2> Noskcaj: we're doing a community roundtable! care to talk about quality testing a little? :)
<pleia2> give some links, mention what you work on
<pleia2> of course you can always help with support as well :)
<pleia2> answering questions you know the answer to in #ubuntu or on ubuntuforums.org or askubuntu.com
<pleia2> http://www.ubuntu.com/community and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributeToUbuntu also have lots of lists of ways to contribute
<pleia2> and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Teams is a list of some of the major teams within the project and their resources and contacts
<pleia2> of course there are new ones popping up all the time, so it's hard to keep track of them all
<pleia2> JoseeAntonioR mentioned we have contributors from all over the world, and we also have physical Ubuntu teams from all over the world
<pleia2> http://loco.ubuntu.com/ is a nice resource for finding one near you
<pleia2> well that's all the ideas I had :)
<JoseeAntonioR> yeah!
<JoseeAntonioR> that's for Local Communities, who help advocate Ubuntu all over the world
<JoseeAntonioR> we also have physical meetings twice a year, the Ubuntu Developer Summit (uds.ubuntu.com)
<JoseeAntonioR> there, we talk about all the ideas we have, all plans for the next release, and define some structure, maybe packages, and lots more
<JoseeAntonioR> contributors from all over the world fly to the UDS just to have a good experience, meet other contributors, bring ideas, discuss, and more
<JoseeAntonioR> if you can hop over there, you'll be welcome to contribute with us
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<JoseeAntonioR> so, any of you guys have any questions for us, we're happy to answer them
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<Noskcaj> pleia2, you pinged me?
#ubuntu-classroom 2013-02-10
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu User Days - Current Session: Using Launchpad - Instructors: benonsoftware
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/10/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<JoseeAntonioR> Let's just wait a couple minutes, and our instructor will be here
<JoseeAntonioR> While we wait, if you guys have any general questions about Launchpad, just ask them in #ubuntu-classroom
<JoseeAntonioR> ok, so I'll try to cover some Launchpad Basics until our instructor arrives
<JoseeAntonioR> Thanks again for being here!
<JoseeAntonioR> So, Launchpad is a set of web services, and it's Open Source
<JoseeAntonioR> The code is available online and anyone can download and modify it legally
<JoseeAntonioR> In Launchpad we can have projects hosted, we can also host code, file bugs, track work items with blueprints, translate packages, and have a question tracker where you can ask and answer questions
<JoseeAntonioR> Anyone can register a project, and create a profile
<JoseeAntonioR> Teams can also be created, they are a group of people working together or something
<JoseeAntonioR> A team can be open, delegated, moderated or restricted
<JoseeAntonioR> In case of open teams, any user or team can join, and no approval is required
<JoseeAntonioR> Delegated teams are inclusive too, and any user or team can join, but team administrators approve direct memberships
<JoseeAntonioR> Moderated teams are exclusive, and exclusive teams may ask to join
<JoseeAntonioR> And finally, restricted teams are exclusive, and only a team administrator can invite users and exclusive teams to join
<JoseeAntonioR> When a user creates its Launchpad account, he will be able to do everything on Launchpad, such as filing a bug, creating blueprints, translating, etc.
<JoseeAntonioR> So, let's get through the Code feature
<JoseeAntonioR> That one is called Bazaar. There, you will be able to host code, and the code will be available to the public, anyone can grab it
<JoseeAntonioR> Any questions so far?
<JoseeAntonioR> Ok, so let's move on
<JoseeAntonioR> As mentioned before, any user who has got a Launchpad account can upload code to Bazaar
<JoseeAntonioR> Users can also create PPAs (Personal Package Archives) to create 'their own repositories'
<JoseeAntonioR> Let's move onto bugs
<JoseeAntonioR> If there's a project in Launchpad, it can use the system as a bugtracker.
<JoseeAntonioR> Once it gets configured, you can fully use the bugtracker, and you will be able to separate bugs with tags, indicate their current status, give updates, set an asignee, etc.
<JoseeAntonioR> In my opinion, it's a super complete system
<JoseeAntonioR> Now, you also have blueprints
<JoseeAntonioR> With blueprints you can create specifications for a feature, and you can track its progress in there.
<JoseeAntonioR> You have a whiteboard for all discussion, a work items part to assign work items and put a status to it (TODO, INPROGRESS, DONE, BLOCKED), and much more
<JoseeAntonioR> You also have the translations section, where you will be able to translate strings from different packages on a project
<JoseeAntonioR> Translations may be open, and they can also be moderated
<JoseeAntonioR> If they're moderated, a person or a team will need to confirm that the translation is good for it to be included in the translated file
<JoseeAntonioR> Any questions?
<ClassBot> CarstenG asked: Is Launchpad itself translatable?
<JoseeAntonioR> Let me be honest with you, I'm not sure
<JoseeAntonioR> Launchpad itself does not host their translations, so maybe you can directly translate it in the source code
<JoseeAntonioR> But I'm not 100% sure about that, sorry
<JoseeAntonioR> Any other questions, guys?
<JoseeAntonioR> Ok, so let's move on then
<JoseeAntonioR> Finally, we have Launchpad Answers.
<JoseeAntonioR> Launchpad answers lets people ask and answer questions within a certain project
<JoseeAntonioR> Any project can activate the feature, and people will be able to contribute to it in that way
<JoseeAntonioR> One of the cool features of Launchpad is that it's an OpenID provider
<JoseeAntonioR> that means that you are able to log into any website that accepts OpenID with your Launchpad account
<JoseeAntonioR> So, using it is pretty simple
<JoseeAntonioR> Just log into your Launchpad account, and then, when a webpage asks for your OpenID, just enter the link of your Launchpad profile
<JoseeAntonioR> Also, if you've got an account on Launchpad, you've also got an account on login.ubuntu.com
<JoseeAntonioR> The system is the same, it's just that login.ubuntu.com cannot use your username as an OpenID
<JoseeAntonioR> Ok, so if you guys have any final questions for now, I'll be happy to do my best to answer the,
<JoseeAntonioR> s/the,/them/
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<JoseeAntonioR> Coming up philipballew is going to give us a session on how to get help in Ubuntu, so make sure to stay tuned!
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu User Days - Current Session: How to Get Help in Ubuntu - Instructors: philipballew
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/10/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<philipballew> oh hey people! Its Ubuntu with Philip time!
<philipballew> As you might have already have been aware this session called How to Get Help in Ubuntu  is about all the places that you can go to get help in Ubuntu
<philipballew> So basically its pretty awesome.
<philipballew> If you have any questions during the thing, just do whatever you have been doing for asking questions and I'll try to answer them.
<philipballew> So here we go.
<philipballew> There are many places to get help for a problem in Ubuntu, however you might only have herd of one, or used one or two. so Im gonna list them all and say a few things about them.
<philipballew> A lot of you Ubuntu people probably started with the Forms.
<philipballew> They provide great information, and are great for troubleshooting.
<philipballew> If you have a problem that you need to work through, the forms are pretty nice
<philipballew> Though maybe you already know what your problem i and you just need a solution. Perhaps Ask Ubuntu is what you need.
<philipballew> Its like Stack Exchange
<philipballew> You can ask a question, then the answers get voted up or down.
<philipballew> This makes the right answer go fight to the top
<philipballew> Both these are nice because you can ask a question and not have to be online for an answer,
<philipballew> just come back and its answeres
<philipballew> *answered
<philipballew> though remember to always upvote on Ask Ubuntu
<philipballew> I think that another great support tool is IRC
<philipballew> Since everyone here knows what that is...
<philipballew> There are some nice channels like #ubuntu
<philipballew> but also #ubuntu-beginners is nice ir you did not know that one
<philipballew> Also, your lo-co probably has an irc channel you can get help from
<philipballew> If you are not in a loco, you need to be
<philipballew> they provide great places to get the help you need for your ubuntu machine
<philipballew> You can attend a Ubunty Hour with your mailing list and get lots of help with your computer
<philipballew> Or maybe you can subscribe to a mailing list.
<philipballew> Mailing lists provide great opportunities for people to have in depth email discussion about support for their Ubuntu machine.
<philipballew> Your local lug is good to
<philipballew> If your not involved in that I would encourage it because it gives you a chance to meet other linux users.
<philipballew> The social media pages of Ubuntu are good
<philipballew> like the Google plus community
<philipballew> though maybe your seeing all this and you would rather not take all this time and effort
<philipballew> I think you can get Canonical paid support.
<philipballew> Ive herd its nice
<philipballew> There are many sites here to get ubuntu help with and I hope you can use them
<philipballew> let me link you with a few things
<philipballew> http://askubuntu.com/
<philipballew> http://ubuntuforums.org/
<philipballew> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/ChannelList
<philipballew> http://shop.canonical.com/index.php?cPath=41
<philipballew> https://plus.google.com/communities/107299007624972266094
<philipballew> also, though you can read english feel free to join the irc channel for the language of your choice to get help as well in one of the links
<philipballew>  that means #ubuntu-es, #ubuntu-fr, #ubuntu-pt, and others
<philipballew> now thanks for listening
<philipballew> now is the time for a question if you have it
<philipballew> oh, and just another thing
<philipballew> all these support options are available with the option for flavors
<philipballew> Lubuntu Xubuntu Philbuntu and stuff like that
<philipballew> You can get help for you system there at the links for these systems
<philipballew> except the Canonical support
<JoseeAntonioR> (Philbuntu is the one invented by philipballew, just in case)
<philipballew> http://www.ubuntu.com/project/about-ubuntu/derivatives
<philipballew> ^ in case your interested still
<pleia2> thanks to philipballew for his session :)  last one is by cprofitt in 20 minutes!
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu User Days - Current Session: How to solve a problem - Ask Ubuntu through Launchpad - Instructors: cprofitt
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/10/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<cprofitt> First I would like to thank Philipballew for giving a great introduction on getting help. I hope to build on what he has said and go a little more in depth.
<cprofitt> When you need help it is because you have run in to a problem. Here are the main areas you can get help from.
<cprofitt> - ubuntuforums.org
<cprofitt> - askubuntu.com
<cprofitt> - chat.freenode.net
<cprofitt> Each of these resources is a little bit different and fits different styles of getting your problem solved. Knowing the right one can help you get the assistance you need.
<cprofitt> - launchpad.net
<cprofitt> - help.ubuntu.com
<cprofitt> - help.ubuntu.com/community
<cprofitt> If you need advice on how to us UFW (Ubuntu Firewall) you would use help.ubuntu.com/community
<cprofitt> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UFW
<cprofitt> the material on help.ubuntu.com/community is community contributed tutorials
<cprofitt> the content on help.ubuntu.com is official Ubuntu documentation
<cprofitt> both are excellent for when you want to take some time to investigate a specific program or topic to solve an issue
<cprofitt> like how to allow yourself access to your home computers from the Internet
<cprofitt> If you have a problem that is more fluid - like trying to figure out if your server has been compromised you would find the forums a much better resource
<cprofitt> the forums is much more flexible and allows for a back and forth with questions
<cprofitt> the forums also then can serve as an ongoing discussion for such topics as well as a resource for others having the same issue
<cprofitt> one key thing to remember with the forums is to mark your thread solved if you get an answer that solves your problem
<cprofitt> The forums also make a great place to ask questions about 'what the best image editing software is'
<cprofitt> though you should be cautious about asking questions that devolve in to 'holy wars' such as emacs vs vim
<cprofitt> if you are looking for a specific question like how to update grub in Ubuntu 12.10 then askubuntu.com is a great resource
<cprofitt> askubuntu.com allows its users to vote on the 'best' answer
<cprofitt> this makes it easier for people to find the 'best' answer because it will 'rise to the top'
<cprofitt> this is in contrast to the forums where the answer might be on the 5th page
<cprofitt> here is an example of a well worded question on aksubuntu.com
<cprofitt> http://askubuntu.com/questions/28086/what-are-unitys-keyboard-and-mouse-shortcuts
<cprofitt> in some cases if you are in need of immediate help you might want to try chat.freenode.net (IRC)
<cprofitt> which those in this session know about
<cprofitt> there is one thing to keep in ming about IRC
<cprofitt> and that is many people will use a 'bouncer' or a 'shell account' and stay logged in to channels even when they are not actively following IRC
<cprofitt> they could be asleep or at work
<cprofitt> for this reason if you ask a question in IRC, but get no answers it does not mean you are being ignored
<cprofitt> people may not be actively listening to your question or might not know the answer
<cprofitt> if you can stay logged in to IRC for a while you will get an answer eventually... but I understand that it can be frustrating to wait
<cprofitt> you can also report bugs on launchpad.net
<cprofitt> reporting bugs on stable releases may not result in a patch though since patches for stable releases are rare due to the fact that they could cause other conflicts
<cprofitt> reporting bugs in the development release - currently 13.04 - is much more likely to result in a patch
<cprofitt> example: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution/+bug/877751
<cprofitt> here are a couple more examples for askubuntu.com
<cprofitt>  - http://askubuntu.com/questions/4408/what-should-i-do-when-ubuntu-freezes - http://askubuntu.com/questions/17610/how-do-i-reset-my-unity-configuration
<cprofitt> in all the cases that you want to receive help you should try to have a good description of your problem
<cprofitt>     - general guidelines (as much detail as possible)
<cprofitt>       - what you were doing (what program)
<cprofitt>       - what model of computer if it is a hardware question
<cprofitt>       - what hardware was involved (video issues = video card, network issues = network cards)
<cprofitt>         - lspci, lsusb - to get details on your hardware
<cprofitt>       - what happened?
<cprofitt>       - what behavior was expected?
<cprofitt> taking the time to gather these details will help those trying to give you help the information they need to try and formulate an answer
<cprofitt> if you are having issues with wireless, but do not know what wireless card you have people will not be able to help until they ask for that information
<cprofitt> with askubuntu.com you want to keep your questions related to Ubuntu...
<cprofitt> development on Ubuntu would be fine, Gnome Shell on Ubuntu is fine,... running Mint would be off-topic
<cprofitt> if you are using IRC you will want to use a service like pastebin to communicate large amounts of information to those helping you
<cprofitt> example http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1629518/
<cprofitt> this makes it much easier for people to look at your logs or other technical information because it will not flow with the channel as others ask for help
<cprofitt> it also avoids flooding the IRC channel
<cprofitt> when reporting bugs you want to make sure that you look for a bug identical to yours
<cprofitt> reporting a bug that has already been reported causes bug-control to have to triage the bug
<cprofitt> it will get marked as a duplicate and that ends up taking time away from triaging unique bugs
<cprofitt> one other very important thing to remember is that everyone that is trying to help you in these commuinty resources is a volunteer
<cprofitt> treat them with respect and stay civil
<cprofitt> they are like neighbors and helping you out of kindness and a community spirit
<cprofitt> the great thing about this is that all of them were once a beginner... all of them run in to issues they can not solve... it is through the effort of the community that everyone gets help...
<cprofitt> bugs get fixed, work arounds get identified, etc
<cprofitt> if you find a wiki article on help.ubuntu.com/community is inaccurate you can edit it and leave a note
<cprofitt> even if you do not know how to achieve the desired results... if the information is out of date you can mark it as such
<cprofitt> in the case of launchpad.net you will need to have your own launchpad account
<cprofitt> with askubuntu.com you will have to authenticate; your lauchpad account can be used to authenticate to askubuntu.com
<cprofitt> if you want to edit a page on help.ubuntu.com/community you will need a launchpad account as well.
<cprofitt> the forums currently make use of their own account
<cprofitt> and chat.freenode.net (IRC) does not require a registered account - though it is a good idea
<cprofitt> the forums also have some dedicated areas
<cprofitt> General Help - http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=331
<cprofitt> Virtualization - http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=308
<cprofitt> System76 Support - http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=341
<cprofitt> System76 is a hardware vendor that sells computers with Ubuntu preinstalled
<cprofitt> security discussions - http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=338
<cprofitt> there are areas for Asus, Dell and Apple support as well
<cprofitt> as you saw in the previous session there are multiple channels on IRC as well
<cprofitt> one other fantastic resource is the one you are in now
<cprofitt> #ubuntu-classroom
<cprofitt> there are many events held in this channel throughout the year that can help increase your knowledge about Ubuntu related topics
<cprofitt> the previous session also mentioned loco teams
<cprofitt> you can find a list of currently active loco teams here:
<cprofitt> http://loco.ubuntu.com/
<cprofitt> many loco teams have IRC channels and forum areas as well
<cprofitt> but loco teams can potentially offer in-person assistance
<cprofitt> that can be invaluable when you are having a difficult time figuring out exactly what the problem is
<cprofitt> loco teams often run install fests and educational events
<cprofitt> to help find such events you can go here:
<cprofitt> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/
<cprofitt> Ubuntu Hours can be fantastic resources for getting to know fellow Ubuntu users
<cprofitt> becoming active in your local community helps to build a network of people you can ask for assistance
<cprofitt> and as your knowledge grows you can payback that assistance by providing assistance to others
<cprofitt> I hope this has helped go a little more in-depth on how to get help and solve problems
<cprofitt> please feel free to ask any questions
<cprofitt> to summarize:
<cprofitt>    - resources:
<cprofitt>      - ubuntuforums.org
<cprofitt>      - askubuntu.com
<cprofitt>      - chat.freenode.net
<cprofitt>      - launchpad.net
<cprofitt>      - help.ubuntu.com
<cprofitt>      - help.ubuntu.com/community
<cprofitt>     - general guidelines (as much detail as possible)
<cprofitt>       - what you were doing (what program)
<cprofitt>       - what model of computer if it is a hardware question
<cprofitt>       - what hardware was involved (video issues = video card, network issues = network cards)
<cprofitt>         - lspci, lsusb - to get details on your hardware
<cprofitt>       - what happened?
<cprofitt>       - what behavior was expected?
<cprofitt> above all remember that the people helping you are volunteers and treat them with respect and be thankful they are helping you
<cprofitt> thank you to the classroom team for organizing this event and assisting with the running of the session
<cprofitt> here are some great resources for classroom
<cprofitt> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Activities/Classroom#Section_2
<cprofitt> and
<cprofitt> http://ubuntuclassroom.wordpress.com/2013/02/09/your-first-iso-test/
<cprofitt> if you just want to stay up-to-date with things going on in the community
<cprofitt> make sure you read planet.ubuntu.com
<cprofitt> and Ubuntu Weekly News
<cprofitt> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter
<cprofitt> thanks again for coming everyone
<cprofitt> special thanks to JoseeAntonioR pleia2 and phillw
<pleia2> thanks for that session, cprofitt!
<pleia2> and that wraps things up for us here for User Days :)
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<pleia2> huge thanks to JoseeAntonioR for working on recruitment for this event and managing the schedule
<pleia2> also for filling in during those slots where the instructors were unavailable!
<pleia2> logs for all sessions are now available directly via this link: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDaysTeam/quantal
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/10/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || No Sessions Currently in Progress
<phillw> test
#ubuntu-classroom 2014-02-06
<Blinky_>  Hi guys, could someone please tell me how to set the permissions on my /var/www directory so that new adding files can be seen on the website?
