#ubuntu-desktop 2009-06-29
<pitti> Good morning
<tgpraveen> i hope this  is the right place to discuss about the changes to notify osd in karmic ie dx-karmic-notify-osd
<tgpraveen> in that there is a Consistent feedback for multimedia keys item
<tgpraveen> does this mean i will get a notification for every time i click play, forward, next on my keyboard. if so then is it not a abuse of the notification system. it really does not notify me of anything as i am the one who clicked and hence this would be useless
<tgpraveen> the correct way would be that banshee upon clicking play puts a notification of the song being played <--- and this is a bug on banshee bugzilla which is being/has been fixed and now if we give notification for play key. then each time i hit play there will be two notifications one for play key and one from banshee
<tgpraveen> am i wrong in interpreting this blueprint?
<pitti> robert_ancell: why are bug 195737 and bug 392368 two separate bugs with two contradicting proposals?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 195737 in compiz-fusion-plugins-main "Set "open" animation to glide 2, not glide 1" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/195737
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 392368 in compiz-fusion-plugins-main "Set default window open/close animation to fade" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/392368
<pitti> robert_ancell: I'm about to sponsor the first one, but the second one confuses me
<didrocks> good morning pitti
<pitti> hey didrocks
<robert_ancell> pitti, the second one is not for sponsorship. There was a lot of comments in the former bug about using fade over glide.  I opened the latter so the former can be closed without complaints
<pitti> robert_ancell: so 195737 is "invalid"? (that's also an identified paper cut bug)
<pitti> but why didn't you just update the bug title?
<robert_ancell> No, 195737 is valid.  There was a request to change both animations to glide to be consistent which was agreed by everyone that this was better than the previous case (mixed animations).  The papercuts project agreed.
<robert_ancell> As part of the discussion though people were suggesting that we shouldn't use glide at all, but instead use fade.  This has had less discussion (there are almost certainly performance effects of using fade)
<robert_ancell> I took the position we should change from glide1+glide2 to glide2 for both and we may in the future change to fade if that is better (needs more discussion though)
<pitti> robert_ancell: ok, could you please make 392368 a duplicate of 195737 and update the bug status/title?
<pitti> I'm happy to sponsor this, but right now I have no idea what to change
<pitti> so far I prepared a glide1 -> glide2 update, but then I noticed the other bug
<robert_ancell> pitti, they are not duplicates.  195737 is essentially "be consistent" and 392368 is "fade is smoother than glide"
<pitti> but one says "set open animation to glide-2", the other "set open animation to fade"
<pitti> they really shouldn't both be open
<robert_ancell> one says "open animation" the other says "open/close animations"
<pitti> still, same contradiction for open
<robert_ancell> "Set "open" animation to glide 2, not glide 1" = "Set open animation to be the same as close animation (i.e. glide 2)"
<robert_ancell> "Set default window open/close animation to fade" = "Change window animations from glide to fade"
<robert_ancell> These are probably better description, I will update them if that makes more sense
<pitti> thanks
<robert_ancell> pitti, updated
<lool> yop
<pitti> asac: bug 280214 has a simple patch; I can't commit to ~network-manager, though, can you please apply it?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 280214 in network-manager "Typo in /usr/share/doc/network-manager/README.Debian" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/280214
<pitti> robert_ancell: xscreensaver> nice, does that mean that the new version is actually smaller than 5.07?
<robert_ancell> pitti, I didn't check size but it dropped a number of screensavers so I expect so!
<pitti> \o/
<robert_ancell> pitti, :)  Is there an easy way to query the installed size from the .deb?
<pitti> robert_ancell: dpkg -I .deb
<pitti> robert_ancell: but .deb size is more interesting, though
<robert_ancell> 2160 now
<pitti> (compressed)
<robert_ancell> 718k
<robert_ancell> pitti, also xscreensaver has been targeted by the papercuts proj so it will almost certainly be split (with only ~5 left in the default install)
<pitti> nice
<pitti> robert_ancell: 718k is -data ?
<robert_ancell> 448k data
<robert_ancell> 2M for -gl
<pitti> ok, so it shrunk a little
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i figured out the gnome-screensaver upgrade issue last night
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, hey seb128
<pitti> chrisccoulson: wow!
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti
<chrisccoulson> the screensaver issue is quite an easy fix. basically what is happening, is the old jaunty gnome-screensaver process tries to spawn the new karmic gnome-screensaver-dialog when you try to unlock the screen, and it passes it a deprecated option, causing it to fail to start
<hyperair> what's supposed to launch devicekit-power?
<hyperair> it doesn't seem to start up automatically =\
<chrisccoulson> the fix is basically http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~chrisccoulson/gnome-screensaver/upgrade-fix/revision/32#debian/patches/06_unbreak_upgrade_from_jaunty.patch
<pitti> hyperair: d-bus activated
<pitti> hyperair: if you have -1ubuntu1, you need to dist-upgrade (that was brokeN)
<hyperair> aha!
<hyperair> okay then =p
<pitti> chrisccoulson: great work!
<chrisccoulson> pitti - if you think the patch looks correct, i'll push it to the ubuntu-desktop branch:)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: it makes sense, anyway
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I guess you tested it :)
<chrisccoulson> i did, and it seems to work ok
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<seb128> re
<seb128> hello chrisccoulson pitti
<seb128> nice for gnome-screensave
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<asac> pitti: committed. thanks
<pitti> asac: danke
<asac> pitti: http://pastebin.com/f1f5027de
<asac> pitti: withotut that i cannot link against libgudev
<asac> seems the .la files dont get the /usr/lib/ dir
<pitti> asac: ah, indeed
<pitti> asac: that doesn't break the .so -> so.0 symlink?
<asac> NM builds properly with it
<asac> let me check
<asac> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root  1022 2009-06-28 23:55 /usr/lib/libgudev-1.0.la
<asac> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root    21 2009-06-28 23:59 /usr/lib/libgudev-1.0.so -> libgudev-1.0.so.0.0.0
<asac> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root    21 2009-06-28 23:59 /usr/lib/libgudev-1.0.so.0 -> libgudev-1.0.so.0.0.0
<asac> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 25800 2009-06-28 23:55 /usr/lib/libgudev-1.0.so.0.0.0
<pitti> asac: I built devkit-disks, g-d-u etc. against it just fine
<pitti> asac: ah right, I thought libgudev was in /lib
<asac> no its not
<asac> you installed them manually in usr/lib, even though make install puts them  in lib/
<pitti> right, then libdir makes sense
<asac> pitti: so what i could do is build NM ... however, building applet against NM would fail
<pitti> $ grep libdir /usr/lib/libgudev-1.0.la
<pitti> libdir='/lib'
<asac> seems the pkg-config files of NM would get busted this way
<pitti> ah-ha
<pitti> asac: ok, makes sense; want to upload yourself, since you have it ready?
<asac> pitti: yes.
<asac> pitti: i guess i shall commit it
<pitti> please do
<pitti> asac: I check udev in the meantime (when Keybuk uploads this, gudev will be built by udev source, and u-extra goes away)
<asac> pitti: ok.
<pitti> asac: right, fixed in udev bzr head
<asac> pitti: 20090615+1-4 is still UNRELEASED. forgot to push?
<pitti> asac: no, forgot debcommit -r; fixed and pushed, sorry
<asac> thx
<pitti> asac: thanks for fixing this
<asac> pitti: is that a native branch?
<pitti> asac: no orig.tar.gz, yes
<asac> pitti: the version confuses bzr builddeb then
<asac> i think
<asac> at least
<asac> it has a -4 (pkg revision)
<pitti> it's not bd'ed
<pitti> just debuild -S
<asac> yeah. bzr in theory bzr builddeb should work with all legal branches ;)
<Keybuk> pitti: even my hand import of udev is failing at the moment
<asac> pitti: i might be dense or the previous upload was dirty; just debuild -S in the branch gives me this debdiff: http://pastebin.com/f62b82257
<pitti> asac: ah, you don't use -i?
<pitti> asac: anyway, I can do the upload for you, might be quicker
 * pitti does
<asac> pitti: yeah. but even then the Makefile.in stuff et all .... also consider to use a real native version (e.g. without -1) ... that would  not confuse all the tools ;)
<asac> pitti: thanks
<pitti> asac: uploaded
<asac> pitti: its all committed
<asac> cool
<pitti> asac: debian/README.source has some bits, but it's pretty mad for this
<pitti> since you manually have to generate the autobreak bits :/
<asac> pitti: hmm. put it in debian/rules ;)
<asac> anyway. thanks. i will try to keep out of that ;)
<pitti> well, the entire package will disappear in a matter of days :)
<asac> good ;)
<Keybuk> pitti: am guessing that kay has rebased this tree in some way :-/
<pitti> yay rebase
<Keybuk> ah, no
<Keybuk> just a non-trunk merge
<Keybuk> bzr fast-import is not very good
<Keybuk> if someone does their own development, merges from trunk, then pushes
<Keybuk> sometimes it can't work it out
<Keybuk> of course, this now means I have to push --overwrite and upset everyone ;)
<pitti> I'll remember to pull --overwrite :)
 * didrocks prepares to be upset :)
<Keybuk> pitti: uploaded GIT head
<Keybuk> let's see if it builds ;)
<pitti> Keybuk: thanks!
<andreasn> mpt, did any more action happen on this? http://live.gnome.org/Nautilus/ProgressWindow
<mpt> andreasn, not that I know of
<andreasn> I wonder if it's easier to implement in baby steps. Right now the thing that hurts my eyes the most with that dialog is the lack of a word in the cancel button, so I'm looking into fixing that by hand
<seb128> ok, I've cleaned my emails backlog from the weekend, took me some hours
<pitti> seb128: \o/
<pitti> Keybuk: seems udev didn't actually get accepted?
<Keybuk> yeah, dunno why ;)
<Keybuk> think I forgot the tarball
 * Keybuk uploads again
<pitti> Keybuk: hm, some *.install file is broken, it seems (scsi -> ata renaming?)
<Keybuk> pitti: yeah was just reading that
<Keybuk> I think Kay dropped scsi_id.config ;)
 * Keybuk tries again
<Keybuk> oh arse, missed the udeb
<seb128> hey mvo
<mvo> hey seb128
<seb128> mvo, did you have a chance to review my update-notifier changes? ;-)
<mvo> seb128: not yet, let me do it now
<seb128> mvo, no hurry I was just curious don't bother if you are busy with other things
<mvo> seb128: merged
<mvo> seb128: I upload in a bit
<seb128_> re
<seb128_> mvo, I was saying that I pushed a minor change
<mvo> <mvo> seb128: merged
<seb128_> dunno if you read that or wrote something
<mvo>  seb128: I upload in a bit
<mvo> uploaded
<mvo> yes, I saw the change
<seb128_> ok cool
 * seb128_ hugs mvo
<pitti> Keybuk: I updated ubuntu-meta to not pull in udev-extras any more
<pitti> udev-extras killed from archive, too
<Keybuk> cool
<rickspencer3> pitti: hi. so can I try automagic python build on Jaunty?
<pitti> rickspencer3: https://edge.launchpad.net/~pitti/+archive/apport-retracer has backports for hardy, intrepid, and jaunty
<rickspencer3> pitti: so should we go ahead and implement $quickly package?
<pitti> rickspencer3: I did a ton of fixes and improvements over the weekend, so the upstream build/install part works wonderfully now
<pitti> apport and jockey are fully converted
<rickspencer3> !
<pitti> rickspencer3: well, it doesn't build a debian/ dir for you yet
<rickspencer3> I can try it on bug-zapper later today
<rickspencer3> what does it do?
<pitti> rickspencer3: "./setup.py build" and "./setup.py install" now DTRT
<pitti> they know how to generate POTFILES.in, extract translations, where *.ui and D-BUS files need to go, all that
<rickspencer3> pitti: can we just write a few lines of code in package.py to kick of building the deb?
<rickspencer3> wow
<pitti> rickspencer3: for a general template, yes; figuring out build/binary dependencies is the tricky part
<mpt> mvo, glatzor_: How many top-level application categories are there for a .desktop file? Ubuntu has ~6 out of the box (Accessories, Games, Graphics, Internet, Office, Sound & Video), but how many others are there?
<mvo> mpt: http://standards.freedesktop.org/menu-spec/latest/apa.html should have them
<mvo> mpt: well, all of them :)
<mpt> ah, great, thank you
<mpt> mvo, is there an easy way at the moment of browsing the Ubuntu applications that are in those "Additional Categories"?
<mvo> mpt: not from the top of my head, maybe seb128 knows? the information is available in /usr/share/app-install/data
<pitti> kenvandine: for quite a while, most of the time the u1 file sync is disconnected for me; do you have this as well? is it intended?
<pitti> rickspencer3, didrocks: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-karmic-quickly is still in drafting, can this get ready this week?
<rickspencer3> pitti: yes ... sorry, thought it was done
<pitti> rickspencer3: FYI, we are down to 4 specs in drafting
<didrocks> pitti, rickspencer3: I modified and integrated pitti's remark a week ago.
<pitti> didrocks: oh, can you please set it back to 'review' then, when you are done with editing?
<didrocks> pitti: I just first wanted that rickspencer3 agrees to my changes. That's why I didn't set it to "review" yet :)
<didrocks> pitti: can you please send me or pastebin an example of setup.py file for AutomagicPythonBuildSystem so that I can work on it for quickly?
<pitti> didrocks: the one on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Karmic/AutomagicPythonBuildSystem is actually still relevant
<didrocks> pitti: perfect, thanks :)
<pitti> didrocks: the real jockey setup.py looks slightly more complicated:
<pitti> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Ejockey-hackers/jockey/trunk/annotate/head%3A/setup.py
<pitti> didrocks: but that's just to be nice to other upstreams who package it (distutils version check), you don't need that
<pitti> and two special cases in the source layout (which are uncommon for your class of apps as well)
<didrocks> pitti: ok. I will just try to figure out the changes (distutils version check ;)) just for my self understanding :)
<pitti> good night everyone
<artir> o/
<didrocks> rickspencer3: I think you really should bzr pull now :)
 * rickspencer3 pulls
<didrocks> rickspencer3: I added support for executing any command wherever you are in the project tree
<rickspencer3> didrocks: that is soooo awesome!
<didrocks> rickspencer3: the good news is that it's transparent for templates command ;) You just have to act as if you are always in the directory root path :)
<didrocks> so, I didn't have the time to work on release command. I will do it tomorrow
<didrocks> time to go to bed. Have a good evening!
<rickspencer3> sweet!
<rickspencer3> it seems to work very well
<rickspencer3> g'night!
<didrocks> great ;)
<didrocks> thanks, you too!
<seb128_> 'night didrocks
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128_ - you happy with the gnome-screensaver patch i mentioned earlier? i was going to push it to bzr before i go to sleep
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, where is it? I've not seen the code change but what you described made sense
<seb128> urg, wrong click
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - the patch is here: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~chrisccoulson/gnome-screensaver/upgrade-fix/revision/32#debian/patches/06_unbreak_upgrade_from_jaunty.patch
<seb128> looks correct yes
<chrisccoulson> cool, i'll push that change now
<seb128> can you push to bzr I will upload
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> I have no luck getting this hardy pidgin patch to work
<Laney> something wrong with ssl
<seb128> did you look at what other distros do?
<Laney> couldn't find it easily
<Laney> i'll see if we can at least backport 2.5.7
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i've pushed the gnome-screensaver change in to ubuntu-desktop branch now
<seb128> just curious but how did you debug this one?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you send the change to GNOME?
<chrisccoulson> not yet. i can attach the patch to the upstream bug report though
<seb128> uploaded
<chrisccoulson> thanks:)
<seb128> I see that you commented, you can as well add the patch too
<seb128> thank you for the work on that, I was not sure how to debug it but I know that could be annoying issue for users ;-)
<seb128> btw did you apply for motu now? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i was expecting it to take a while to debug, as i don't know the gnome-screensaver code all that well, but it only took 30 minutes
<chrisccoulson> i havent got around to applying just yet. i keep getting side-tracked with other work at the moment
<seb128> how did you debug it?
<chrisccoulson> i need to set aside some time this week really;)
<seb128> there was something interesting in the log? or stracing?
<chrisccoulson> i just ran gnome-screensaver --debug and watched the console output
<seb128> debug logs can be useful ;-)
<chrisccoulson> the error messages from gnome-screensaver-dialog get piped back to gnome-screensaver and then printed on the console
<chrisccoulson> nice and easy:)
<seb128> if you don't hurry for motu you might be after the archive reorganization and have no motu team to join ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i'll try and sort it this week then;)
<seb128> cool
<seb128> ok, enough work for me for today, good night everybody
<seb128> see you tomorrow
<chrisccoulson> good night seb128
<pochu> night seb
<djsiegel> seb128 rickspencer3-afk pitti: any idea who could handle a bug like this: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/389212
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 389212 in hundredpapercuts "Partitions icons on desktop and file access" [Undecided,Triaged]
<djsiegel> I want to get some more info on it, and maybe get someone looking into the complexity of the change.
<seb128> djsiegel, I would say pitti or me, the description seems misleading though
<djsiegel> just changed it :)
<seb128> djsiegel, what is an internal partition for you?
<djsiegel> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/389212
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 389212 in hundredpapercuts "Partitions icons on desktop and file access" [Undecided,Triaged]
<djsiegel> seb128: oh, you saw the new description
<djsiegel> an internal partition is at least a partition on the save physical disk as your main partition
<seb128> djsiegel, we don't show icons for things automatically mounted at boot on the desktop, that's a policy we have since ubuntu has been created
<djsiegel> same*
<djsiegel> seb128: right, I agree
<seb128> djsiegel, we don't display those on the desktop right now
<djsiegel> I am just being explicit
<djsiegel> seb128: yes, I know
<seb128> what we display is ie your vista partition if you mounted it
<seb128> which you disagree with?
<djsiegel> yes, I get it...
<djsiegel> no
<djsiegel> ahh
<seb128> so I don't understand the bug
<djsiegel> I am saying, internal partitions should mount at boot
<seb128> sounds a complicate discussion
<chrisccoulson> djsiegel - that should be for the adminstrator to decide by specfying them in fstab
<chrisccoulson> shouldnt it?
<seb128> we explicitly don't do that
<djsiegel> well, we need to discuss it
<seb128> otherwise you quickly hit the "n mount counter"
<seb128> which means long fsck on boot, etc
<djsiegel> seems like it's something administrators wouldn't rely on as a default
<seb128> we decide to mount partition "on demand" right now
<djsiegel> and many users have multiple partitions and are confused by fstab
<seb128> that avoid all the trouble about accessing something you don't use
<seb128> there is a bug requesting to have an property option to select what partitions to mount on boot
<djsiegel> seb128: yes, I see that one
<seb128> I think that would be the right way
<seb128> but that's not a papercut, too much work for that
<djsiegel> right
<pitti> djsiegel: no, spare internal partitions should absolutely not be automounted at boot by default; this does happen on the live CD, but that's a bug (I'm on it)
<djsiegel> Well, I have nominated this one from a user-centered design perspective.
<djsiegel> pitti: why?
<djsiegel> pitti: I am here to find out why
<djsiegel> pitti: I am representing the user only here
<pitti> djsiegel: especially not if they are windows partitions
<djsiegel> users are confused and want access to their data
<pitti> they might have a hibernation image, or be unclean, and then mounting them could wreak havoc
<seb128> djsiegel, for one reason you would trigger the disk check for those partitions you don't use every n boot which take a while
<pitti> they can mount their windows partition in the places menu
<djsiegel> hmm
<pitti> djsiegel: also, we can't automount them anyway since that requires admin powers, thus we need to ask for the users' password
<djsiegel> pitti: do we block them from mounting their parition if it has a hibernation image?
<pitti> and "their" data is on /home
<seb128> pitti, (not really true, the system could mount everything on boot)
<pitti> djsiegel: no, we don't, but if you explicitly mount it, you can have an UI which points out problems, etc.
<pitti> seb128: right, but we don't want that
<djsiegel> pitti: really?
<djsiegel> Well, I am still convinced we need to explore this further, technical problems withstanding.
<djsiegel> I hear "absolutely not! no way! we don't do it that way!", but if it still creates a bad user experience, I am still interested
<seb128> djsiegel, why do you want to mount everything on boot?
<djsiegel> sounds like it's not a paper cut though
<seb128> the computer location icons make it transparent
<pitti> this was discussed several times already, actually, and IIRC the main blockers for automounting were potential data integrity breakage
<Laney> pidgin hardy-backports seems to work at least
<seb128> users don't have to know if things are mounted or not, they just have to use those
<seb128> the system will do the mounting in an almost transparent way if required
<djsiegel> seb128: bug reports from users who have multiple partitions indicating problems with those partitions not being mounted
<djsiegel> trouble making them automount
<djsiegel> etc.
<seb128> let's fix those bugs?
<pitti> djsiegel: "multiple partitions" in what sense?
<djsiegel> this is one way to fix them
<pitti> djsiegel: everything which has the Ubuntu system is set up by the installer
<seb128> I can guaranty you you will get higher number of bugs the other way around
<djsiegel> pitti: people with a media partition, or a windows partition, or an HFS+ partition in my case
<djsiegel> they share music or photos, desktop wallpapers
<seb128> the right way is to let you select what partitions to auto-mount
<djsiegel> machine boots, does not mount the partition, and things misbehave
<pitti> djsiegel: it would be nice to make it configurable to automount some partition by default indeed
<seb128> not to auto-mount 15 partitions you don't use at every boot
<djsiegel> seb128: do users have 15 partitions?
<pitti> but I don't think we should greedily mount everything we can
<seb128> triggering disk checks for those, etc
<djsiegel> pitti: I agree
<djsiegel> pitti: that's what I want to find out about this bug
<seb128> djsiegel, it's a slight exageration but I've 7-8 of those on my old desktop install
<djsiegel> I definitely think we should not do it if users have above a certain number
<djsiegel> like 3
<seb128> 2 linux install with user directory, user,etc , one xp etc etc
<pitti> djsiegel: so perhaps we can rename it to "offer possibility to automount a particular partition"?
<djsiegel> pitti: so, that needs discussion
<seb128> djsiegel, why would you want to automount the system partition of an another linux install?
<djsiegel> pitti: what kind of users have extra partitions?
<djsiegel> will they know what automount is?
<djsiegel> where to look for it?
<djsiegel> I am assuming very basic users who cannot figure this out
<djsiegel> but maybe users with multiple partitions are usually advanced?
<pitti> djsiegel: I don't think that "very basic" users will care at all
<pitti> but a second windows partition is probably pretty common
<seb128> very basis users click on the icon in nautilus and the mounting is transparent
<djsiegel> pitti: well, below a certain threshold, yes :)
<pitti> second/third linux partitions less so -> those are the power users
<seb128> I don't see the issue with that
<seb128> they don't even know if was not mounted
<djsiegel> so, I used to use Mac OS
<seb128> but we avoid all the technical issue
<pitti> well, they get asked for their pwd
<djsiegel> and it doesn't have this concept of present-but-not-mounted in the Finder
<djsiegel> internal partitions are just there
<djsiegel> just like "Macintosh HD"
<djsiegel> your main partition
<seb128> well do you know that partitions are not mounted in nautilus?
<djsiegel> yes
<seb128> how?
<djsiegel> what's your point?
<seb128> let's make those look like they are mounted
<seb128> users don't need to know they are not if that happens transparently
<djsiegel> well, part of the problem is not explicit user action
<seb128> so you don't trigger unrequired mounts at boot and users are not confused
<djsiegel> it's importing music or videos or photos from another partition
<djsiegel> or setting a desktop wallpaper
<djsiegel> after reboot, this content seems missing
<seb128> well any application accessing one of those devices should mount it if it's not
<djsiegel> I agree, we definitely should have automount control in something easier to use than ftab
<djsiegel> like that other bug says
<seb128> +1 from me
<djsiegel> but I am also wondering if there is any way to make an intelligent guess for the user
<seb128> there might be but that's not a papercut bug
<djsiegel> If Ubuntu guesses I want a certain partition and mounts it at boot, that is a huge ease-of-use win
<djsiegel> well, what about a simple heuristic?
<seb128> we need to think carefully about all the bugs you will hit
<djsiegel> like, your Windows partition?
<seb128> like disk check every n mount
<djsiegel> ah, but the hibernation problem
<seb128> the hibernation issue
<djsiegel> does mounting a hibernated disk mess it up necessarily?
<seb128> you don't want to get your 300gig vista disk blocking your boot for an hour if you don't use it
<seb128> not sure about the hibernation thing
<djsiegel> that's for sure
<djsiegel> well, we should definitely not fsck partitions we don't own by default
<chrisccoulson> do you want a feature like this: http://flomertens.free.fr/disk-manager/features.html ?
<seb128> some of the partitions might also be password protected
<pitti> also, once a windows partition gets a slightly corrupted FS, and we keep automoutning it, it will only aggravate
<pitti> and we don't have perfect tools to fix them
<pitti> of course that's more of an "excuse" than a solid technical reason, but we have to live with not having those tools
<djsiegel> chrisccoulson: yes, maybe something more like that
<djsiegel> "It appears your hard disc contains the following additional partitions:"
<chrisccoulson> i've used it before, but that project is unmaintained now. might be a good starting point though
<djsiegel> then the use can choose to mount them at startup
<djsiegel> ok, this looks way to big to be a paper cut now
<djsiegel> but still, I think we made some progres
<djsiegel> s
<djsiegel> too*
<seb128> ok, really enough for this time, see you tomorrow
<djsiegel> pitti chrisccoulson: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/393645
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 393645 in hundredpapercuts "Don't show "Encrypt..." or "Sign" in context menus by default" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<djsiegel> what do you think?
<chrisccoulson> djsiegel - i'm not sure about just dropping "encrypt" or "sign" - i sometimes use them at the moment, but i'm not sure how many other people use them. if they were dropped, then i wouldn't know how else to access this functionality, or where else the functionality would belong.
<chrisccoulson> but i agree that the current context menu looks quite cluttered
<djsiegel> chrisccoulson: many people use them, but fifty times as many do not and are confused by them (my assumption) :)
<djsiegel> does nautilus have a plugins window?
<djsiegel> to easily enable and configure plugins?
<chrisccoulson> quite possibly. but if they were removed, the functionality would have to go elsewhere
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure about plugins
<djsiegel> chrisccoulson: I think they are in a plugin already
<djsiegel> it's just installed by default
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i think they are. i don't know if its possible to disable them at runtime though
<awalton> djsiegel, they're installed by seahorse
<awalton> and no, nautilus doesn't have a plugin window nor a way to disable/add plugins at runtime
<djsiegel> awalton: ok, thanks, that's what I thought
<awalton> yw
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-06-30
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell: I'm running Karmic on my desktop from a live usb
<rickspencer3> seems weirdly fast
<robert_ancell> I didn't notice much of a speed improvement but I haven't changed to ext4 though
<rickspencer3> should have exported my mailbox first :/
<pitti> Good morning
<robert_ancell> pitti, do you know how/why 90_relibtoolize.patch is regenerated in libwnck?
<pitti> robert_ancell: hey
<robert_ancell> pitti, hi#
<pitti> robert_ancell: not in that package in particular; does it look different than other similar patches?
<pitti> hi-sharp, nice
<pitti> as for the "why", no
<pitti> robert_ancell: if it's not necessary any more, just drop it
<pitti> robert_ancell: sometimes they are regenerated for some more obscure reasons like making -Wl,--as-needed actually work, and so on
<pitti> robert_ancell: perhaps check with Seb once he comes online?
<robert_ancell> pitti, running autoreconf, autoconf, libtoolize doesn't seem to make a very similar patch.  Not sure what it's doing so can't drop it!
<robert_ancell> will ask seb though
<pitti> robert_ancell: which files does it touch ATM?
<pitti> (lsdiff)
<robert_ancell> libwnck-2.26.1/aclocal.m4
<robert_ancell> libwnck-2.26.1/config.guess
<robert_ancell> libwnck-2.26.1/config.h.in
<robert_ancell> libwnck-2.26.1/config.sub
<robert_ancell> libwnck-2.26.1/configure
<robert_ancell> libwnck-2.26.1/doc/Makefile.in
<robert_ancell> libwnck-2.26.1/gtk-doc.make
<robert_ancell> libwnck-2.26.1/INSTALL
<robert_ancell> libwnck-2.26.1/libwnck/Makefile.in
<robert_ancell> libwnck-2.26.1/ltmain.sh
<robert_ancell> libwnck-2.26.1/Makefile.in
<robert_ancell> Changelog says "relibtoolize to avoid the amd64 rpath issue"
<pitti> ah
<pitti> so there's the reason
<pitti> robert_ancell: are you on i386 or amd64?
<robert_ancell> i386
<pitti> robert_ancell: I can do an amd64 build for you if you need one for testing
<robert_ancell> pitti, thanks, shouldn't need it though, will use ppa if need to build on different arch
<pitti> ok; let me know, though, the turnaround for builing/testing rpath/ etc. might be faster
<crevette> hello hello
<tjaalton> should there be a script or something to migrate users from the FUSA applet in hardy to what it was replaced with?
<pitti> tjaalton: I thought we had that, as an interactive upgrade hook?
<pitti> (in intrepid)
<tjaalton> pitti: how about hardy-> jaunty?
<tjaalton> if it isn't in jaunty anymore, what about hardy -> next LTS?
<tjaalton> hrm, lunch, bbl ->
<pitti> tjaalton: it should still be there
<seb128> hello there
<didrocks> morning seb128 and pitti
<seb128> hey didrocks pitti
<pitti> hey seb128
<pitti> moin didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, how are you?
<seb128> hey pitti
<didrocks> seb128: fine, thanks :) I get to sleep very early compared to you, viewing the backlog ;)
<didrocks> and you?
<seb128> good, I didn't work late for a while now but there was just nothing to watch on TV yesterday and I had things I wanted to do ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, would you be interested to look at getting mutter packaged for ubuntu?
<pitti> didrocks: BTW, currently working on automatic dependency calculation for distutils-auto
<pitti> seb128: is this the comparative of "mutt"? :-)
<didrocks> seb128: yes. I take half of my day off. That's a thing I can have a look :-)
<didrocks> pitti: great! "quickly release" will be able to do something useful then :)
<seb128> didrocks, excellent
<pitti> didrocks: after that, I'll add a script to create debian/*
<seb128> I will have a look to gjs so we can aim at having gnome-shell in a ppa before GUADEC
<seb128> pitti, no, it's the wm part of gnome-shell
<didrocks> seb128: GUADEC is next week?
<pitti> oh, yet another window manager?
<pitti> compiz is no more?
<didrocks> pitti: no gnome-shell doesn't work with compiz
<pitti> (ugh)
<didrocks> (that was a FUD in the gnome-devel ml)
<seb128> pitti, GNOME never used compiz
<seb128> didrocks, this weekend, ie starting on saturday
<seb128> I'm traveling to go there on friday, there is the opening party in the evening
<didrocks> seb128: hope you will enjoy it... should be easy in a paradisian country ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> mmm Gran Canaria
<seb128> I'm not sure it's paradisian, it's an island and not really a fancy one I think
<seb128> it's mainly sun and swimming pools I guess
<didrocks> seb128: in the meantime, I'm going to Nantes for RMLL... not as attractive in every cases ^^
<seb128> istanbul was probably nicer to see as a city
<seb128> have fun there
<didrocks> thanks
<seb128> I might prefer Nantes, I'm not a big fan of too warm countries, especially when you go for work and not to stay in the swimming pool during the afternoon
<didrocks> sure, when it's too warm, it's difficult to be effective at work
<seb128> well they will probably have cold air inside buildings
<seb128> ie what you need to come back with a cold
<didrocks> exactly...
<seb128> anyway I'm sure it will be fun and I'm looking forward going there ;-)
<crevette> seb128, and you're an expert in getting cold
<crevette> (hello)
<crevette> :)
<didrocks> hey crevette
<pitti> we all are *sigh*
<crevette> hey hey didrocks
<seb128> lut huats
<seb128> lut crevette
<didrocks> plop huats
<crevette> salut seb128 & pitti & huats & anyone here :)
<pitti> bonjour crevette
<pitti> seb128: retracers all failed (python-apt api issue), I'll fix it later
<seb128> ok
<seb128> pitti, not sure if you plan to do sru today but could you look at the pidgin yahoo fix for jaunty?
<pitti> sure
<pitti> that's urgent, I'll process it right now
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> the number of duplicates tell us that yahoo is quite used, so we better have to make sure it works correctly in empathy too
<robert_ancell> didrocks, can you enable the quickly ppa from https://launchpad.net/~quickly?
<seb128> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey seb
<seb128> robert_ancell, had a good day? busy on updates? ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, packaging question: was updating libwnck and not sure how to regenerate 90_relibtoolize.patch. Any ideas?
<robert_ancell> I found http://people.dooz.org/~lool/debian/relibtoolize but it looks overly complicate
<robert_ancell> d
<seb128> autoreconf
<lool> robert_ancell: It's relatively complex and out of date
<seb128> hey lool
<lool> robert_ancell: It did allow me to create smaller diffs than what autoreconf will do
<robert_ancell> lool, is it needed? It seems to build ok without it
<lool> Basically autoreconf might run more stuff than strictly necesasry and will run the latest version of tools
<lool> e.g. it might run automake 1.10 even if you have 1.9 and upstream uses 1.9
<lool> So it will create big diffs (MBs)
<seb128> I tend to not bother nowadays and use autoreconf which does the job
<lool> robert_ancell: The safest thing is autoreconf (-fi)
<robert_ancell> ok
<lool> I agree with seb128, most of the time that's fine
<seb128> robert_ancell,   * 90_relibtoolize.patch: relibtoolize to avoid the amd64 rpath issue.
<robert_ancell> yes, what does that mean...
<lool> I know that if I only touch autoconf, I can get away with aclocal/autoconf
<seb128> robert_ancell, I'm not really familiar with that and not sure how to check if that's still an issue in the current upstream tarball
<lool> But that's already guessing the tools more than you want
<pitti> we could just do an amd64 build without the patch and check if they get rpaths
<seb128> robert_ancell, it means that the library shouldn't have a rpath on amd64 but it does due to buggy autotools versions
<robert_ancell> hmm
<seb128> the easier way to check if that's still an issue is what pitti said but you need an amd64 install
<pitti> seb128: meh, the pidgin upload refers to bug 389332, which is obviously wrong
<seb128> robert_ancell, http://wiki.debian.org/RpathIssue
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 389332 in libclass-trait-perl "Please merge libclass-trait-perl (0.22-4)(universe) from debian unstable" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/389332
<pitti> Laney: ^
<seb128> pitti, bug #389322
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 389322 in pidgin "Yahoo server authentication changed: Pidgin =<2.5.6 will not connect to Yahoo! servers." [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/389322
<pitti> Laney: what is the real bug? could you do another upload with the right number?
<pitti> ah
<pitti> seb128: thanks
<seb128> pitti, Laney doesn't have upload right that needs sponsoring, I can reupload with right number if you want
<pitti> seb128: if you have it ready, would be appreaciated; otherwise I'll download/reupload
<pitti> ugh, what a patch
<pitti> 3000 lines??
<tjaalton> pitti: do you have any idea what it's called?
<pitti> tjaalton: unfortunately not; mvo knows
<tjaalton> mvo: hey, what script does the migration from the old FUSA to the new one? it's not running on our environment and I'd like to find out why
<robert_ancell> pitti, can you build lp:~robert-ancell/libwnck/ubuntu and see if it has an rpath issue?
<seb128> tjaalton, /usr/share/gnome-panel/migrate-fusa-config.py
<tjaalton> seb128: ooh, thanks
<didrocks> robert_ancell: I will at the end of the week. We will have a first beta available then
<tjaalton> mvo: got it already
<mvo> tjaalton: the notice about it is in /var/lib/update-notifier/user.d/
<pitti> robert_ancell: doing
<mvo> tjaalton: oh, sorry - we did not do a notice for it, we just ran it :)
<tjaalton> mvo: ok, figures.. it's disabled here
<pitti> robert_ancell: shall I drop 90_relibtoolize.patch?
<tjaalton> update-notifier that is
<robert_ancell> pitti, I deleted it on my branch
<tjaalton> but maybe there's a better way to disable the usual popups
<mvo> tjaalton: the fusa-script was added via autorun and a gconf key
<lool> seb128: Oh and morning BTS, sorry missed yours :)
<pitti> robert_ancell: still here; I delete it locally for testing
<seb128> pitti, pidgin reuploaded with right bug number
<pitti> seb128: merci
<robert_ancell> pitti, check you have 2.26.2, I have pushed my changes now
<pitti> robert_ancell: ah, I had .1
<pitti> meh, since when does bzr+ssh:// lag?
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you read the debian wiki url I copied before?
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes
<seb128> robert_ancell, you might want to use a rpath call in rules rather than running autotools
<pitti> robert_ancell: got it; started test build
<robert_ancell> seb128, it appears to have been built with the 2.2.6 which shouldn't have the problem according to the wiki page
<seb128> robert_ancell, indeed where 2.26.1 was built using 1.5
<pitti> $ chrpath /usr/lib/libwnck-1.so.22.3.20
<pitti> /usr/lib/libwnck-1.so.22.3.20: no rpath or runpath tag found.
<seb128> $ grep VERSION= libwnck-2.26.1/ltmain.sh libwnck-2.26.2/ltmain.sh
<seb128> libwnck-2.26.1/ltmain.sh:VERSION=1.5.26
<seb128> libwnck-2.26.2/ltmain.sh:VERSION=2.2.6
<pitti> robert_ancell: dropping the patch should be fine then
<seb128> \o/
<robert_ancell> pitti, thanks.  I guess it is safe to go with no patch
<robert_ancell> :)
<seb128> no relibtoolize change++
<pitti> robert_ancell: you'll merge/pull that branch into ~u-desktop?
<robert_ancell> pitti, yes
<seb128> pitti, is gvfs-gdu-volume-monitor crashing all the time for you too?
<pitti> seb128: apparently ye
<pitti> s
<seb128> (process:13370): libgdu-WARNING **: Couldn't call GetAll() to get properties for /: Launch helper exited with unknown return code 127
<robert_ancell> seb128, can you update the versions tool? thanks
<seb128> robert_ancell, done
<pitti> seb128: I have that, too, and "invalid (NULL) pointer instance" and "Couldn't get daemon properties"
 * seb128 investigates
<pitti> seb128: I wonder why we don't have a d-bus .service for gdu
<pitti> the gphoto one has one as well
<pitti> but well, apparently it does run, otherwise it couldn't crash
<pitti> seb128: SRUs processed, thanks
<seb128> pitti, gvfs: /usr/share/dbus-1/services/org.gtk.Private.GduVolumeMonitor.service
<seb128> ?
<robert_ancell> cheers seb128, now it's a lot more red... !
<seb128> pitti, thanks for the processing
<seb128> robert_ancell, we need to split this page rather than having a "+" imho
<pitti> seb128: ah, it's in gvfs; the gphoto one is in -backends
<seb128> pitti, yeah, the gphoto one is optional where the disk one is required
<robert_ancell> seb128, why split? What I want to do is have tags to toggle, i.e. gnome, karmic, kde, ... and autogenerate the lists
<pitti> seb128: usually, a gvfs-mount -l spawns them all again
<pitti> seb128: but for me that fails immediately
<pitti> (gvfs-mount:21806): GVFS-RemoteVolumeMonitor-WARNING **: invoking IsSupported() failed for remote volume monitor with dbus name org.gtk.Private.GduVolumeMonitor: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.Spawn.ChildSignaled: Process /usr/lib/gvfs/gvfs-gdu-volume-monitor received signal 11
<seb128> pitti, well the gdu monitors crash on start
<robert_ancell> So we would probably look at the page with karmic+gnome+ubuntu-desktop tags and others may use other combinations
<pitti> hm, it crashed a lot in the previous versions as well, but now it's immediate
<seb128> robert_ancell, I find the page less useful that what it could be, I'm not interested by many things there, some are in universe etc
<seb128> robert_ancell, I think it would be better to have a list for this team and one for contributors, motus, etc
<robert_ancell> seb128, do you mean the page when expanded?
<pitti> at least it's easy to gdb, it crashes immediately
<seb128> pitti, right, I'm rather concerned about the helper message I'm wondering was is displaying it the string is not a gvfs one
<seb128> robert_ancell, the page expended or not
<robert_ancell> seb128, everyone's interest is going to be different.  There's always trouble when defining where each team ends
<seb128> robert_ancell, well the thing is that clicking on "+" mix those extra components in the middle of the standard list
<seb128> robert_ancell, ie you can't point motus easily to the extra components
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, that is where I think having a tag system will work better
<seb128> how would it work?
<huats> hello everyone !
<robert_ancell> huats, hi
<huats> seb128, robert_ancell, crevette o/
<robert_ancell> seb128, we have tags along the top of the page which act like toggle buttons
<robert_ancell> you chose which ones are enabled and packages with that tag are shown
<seb128> robert_ancell, hum, that would work for me yes, if you know how to do that ;-)
<robert_ancell> can do
<seb128> cool
<seb128> pitti,
<seb128> $ devkit-disks --show-info /dev/sda1
<seb128> Cannot find device with major:minor 8:1: Launch helper exited with unknown return code 127
<pitti> ah
<pitti> my bug then, apparently
<seb128> or I'm using that command wrongly?
<pitti> no, indeed it crashes now
<pitti> devkit-disks --dump -> same
<pitti> the d-bus backend isn't running
<seb128> iz kit bog
<seb128> (devkit-disks:14751): devkit-disks-WARNING **: Couldn't enumerate devices: Launch helper exited with unknown return code 127
<seb128> right
<pitti> odd, it didn't change in over a week
<seb128> devkit-daemon is running
<pitti> right, wrong kit
<pitti> you need /usr/lib/devicekit-disks/devkit-disks-daemon
<seb128> that is not running
<pitti> dk-disks doesn't even use devicekit any more
<seb128> /usr/lib/devicekit-disks/devkit-disks-daemon: error while loading shared libraries: libgudev-1.0.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
<seb128> doh
<pitti> aaah
<pitti> that was the udev upload yesterday
<pitti> apparently it needs a rebuild due to changed library path
<pitti> erm, no
<pitti> itz Keybuk bug
<pitti> $ dpkg -L libgudev-1.0-0
<seb128> 	libgudev-1.0.so.0 => not found
<pitti> -> empty
<seb128> Scoooooootttttt
 * pitti pokes
<pitti> -dev is empty as well
<seb128> Keybuk, ^
<pitti> asac: ^ just in case your network-manager doesn't build
<pitti> Keybuk: could you please bzr push your udev branch?
<pitti> bzr is at 143-2
<tjaalton> I'd like to disallow the users to restart/shutdown the machine, and I understood it should be possible by poking polkit.. But the docs are a bit sketchy on that :/
<pitti> Keybuk: hm, there is no debian/libgudev*.install -- that might be it?
<asac> thanks for the heads up
<pitti> tjaalton: in karmic that's currently a bit hard; in jaunty you should be able to use polkit-gnome-authorization (it's also in the admin menu)
 * asac remembers to not dist-upgrade just now
<pitti> tjaalton: however, for local users it hardly makes sense -- they can just press the power button?
<pitti> or sysrq
<tjaalton> pitti: yes, it's just a matter of giving the gun or pulling the trigger ;)
<Keybuk> pitti: I get a .deb in my working directory
<seb128> Keybuk, empty deb?
<pitti> Keybuk: right, but it's empty (jusr doc)
<pitti> Keybuk: forgot to bzr add the libgudev*.install files?
<Keybuk> oh maybe
<Keybuk> would have wiped them too
<pitti> argh devhelp broken :(
 * Keybuk hates packaging with bzr
<Keybuk> I'm about -> <- this far from just giving up and doing it the old fashioned away again
<Keybuk> pitti: uploaded one that should fix that
<pitti> Keybuk: thanks
<seb128> Keybuk, thanks
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<rodrigo_> morning
<pitti> Keybuk: eww, aren't they installed into usr/lib, not /lib?
<Keybuk> pitti: no idea
<pitti> --libdir=/usr/lib \
<pitti> $ cat debian/libgudev-1.0-0.install
<Keybuk> that's the way Kay said to do it ;)
<pitti> lib/libgudev*.so.* usr/lib
<Keybuk> will see what the build does
<pitti> right, but the .install expects them in /lib
<Keybuk> yeah you're right
 * Keybuk fixes the wildcard "pkgconfig" include too
<Keybuk> and the wildcard /usr/include ;)
<pitti> thank you
<pitti> Keybuk: what's wrong with /usr/include?
<Keybuk> pitti: that'd include everything in /usr/include
<Keybuk> like other files that udev makes
<pitti> ah, for libudev
<pitti> Keybuk: btw, did Kay already show kayfs to you? ("devfs is back")
<pitti> he showed me at LinuxTag, looks pretty nice
<pitti> init=/bin/sh -> takes 0.6 seconds and has a correctly populated /dev
<pitti> it's called "devtmpfs", IIRC
<Keybuk> yeah :)
<Keybuk> I'm not convinced by it though
<Keybuk> grr
<Keybuk> now I just modified files in the build directory and lost them when I rebuilt
 * Keybuk wonders when bzr is going to make his life easier
<Keybuk> right now, it just makes everything four times harder
<seb128> Keybuk, not true it makes sponsoring easier ;-)
<Keybuk> seb128: disagree strongly
<Keybuk> grabbing someone's debdiff and applying it was easy
<seb128> well I find easy to review a bzr for incremental changes than a serie of debdiff on a launchpad bug
<seb128> well the issue is when you start having new version updates and comment and go through several iterations
<seb128> it's not easy to diff the debdiff to see the changes
<Keybuk> bzr's output is just a patch too
<seb128> where it's easy to read the commits
<Keybuk> except I have to work harder to get that patch
<seb128> I find easier to bzr pull than to open launchpad, download a file, apply it, etc
<Keybuk> you only know to bzr pull because they gave you the URL to pull from
<Keybuk> how is that any different from them giving the URL of the debdiff?
<Keybuk> except that with the debdiff approach, the URL gives you exactly what you need to review
<Keybuk> and you don't need to go through hoops to get it
<Keybuk> the bzr command to "show me the changes that this URL would bring to my branch" is still delightfully obtuse
<seb128> different workflow I expect
<Keybuk> gedit URL > bzr diff -r ancestor:. URL
<Laney> pitti, seb128: Ugh. Typo. Sorry
<seb128> I usually sponsor desktop packages and they are in ubuntu-desktop/component/ubuntu
<seb128> not to mention that we usually have new versions and only the debian directory in bzr so debdiff don't really work, or you need a debian directory diff and download the tarball
<seb128> anyway no point to discuss for hours, it works fine for sponsoring for most people on this channel but different people have different workflows
<pitti> meh, x freeze and fsck
<seb128> Laney, want to work on the pidgin 2.5.8 update for karmic? ;-)
<Laney> aaaaaah pidgin
 * Laney runs screaming
<Laney> what's new there?
<seb128> some bug fixed apparently, debian already did the upgrade, it should be easy enough
<seb128> either reapply your previous merge diff on it and just do the update
<Laney> alright I'll have a look tonight
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> I'm going to give up on Hardy unless you have found another distro which has done the work
<Laney> I just requested the backport instead
<didrocks> seb128: before going back to home and working on mutter. What do you prefer for this package dh5, dh7 or cdbs? (I know that you are a fan of cdbs ;))
<seb128> hum no, can't find a distribution doing that backport
<seb128> didrocks, your call but dh7 or cdbs are nicer
<didrocks> seb128: ok, it's maybe the time to try dh7, be indulgent so ;)
<seb128> I will have to learn it too ;-)
<seb128> but it's a good occasion
<didrocks> exactly :-)
<seb128> bbl
<Laney> dh7 is very nice to use
<Laney> makes cdbs go away imho
<pitti> or, at least, considerably simpler
<pitti> didrocks: \o/
<pitti> $ test/auto.py -v T.test_requires
<pitti> automatic requires ... ok
<pitti> didrocks: from that it should not be too hard to figure out the automatic package dependencies
<didrocks> pitti: congrats ^^
<chrisccoulson> anyone working on the control-center update?
<pitti> didrocks: I'm about to change the spec from "./setup.py debian" to "python-distutils-mkdebian"; would that be alright for you?
<pitti> didrocks: I want to avoid putting Debian specific stuff into the upstream distutils-extra
<seb128> chrisccoulson, no
<chrisccoulson> cool, i'll take that one then if that ok
<chrisccoulson> ** if thats ok
<seb128> good
<chrisccoulson> thanks:)
 * pitti hugs chrisccoulson
<seb128> thank you for working on it ;-)
<pitti> didrocks: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Karmic/AutomagicPythonBuildSystem?action=diff&rev2=15&rev1=14 in particular
 * chrisccoulson hugs pitti
<seb128> let's get some food though it's so warm there that I'm not hungry
<pitti> seb128: ice cream!
<seb128> pitti, good idea for after lunch ;-)
<chrisccoulson> is everyone enjoying hot weather? it was raining very heavily here on my drive to work this morning
<hyperair> could someone in the desktop team advise me about the best way to go about bug #214420 ? as i understand it, usershare owner only = false'
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 214420 in nautilus-share "nautilus-share can't share ntfs/fat32 folders" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214420
<hyperair> +was supposed to be a security measure
<hyperair> i mean usershare owner only = true
<pitti> no idea about that, I'm afraid; slangasek understands samba and might be able to help
<hyperair> i'll wait for his input then
<asac> lool: you remember the passphras for pkg-mozilla-maintainers ?
<asac> (mailing list)
<asac> lool: could you allow asac@ubuntu.com to send there and moderate the last three mails i sent ;)? thanks!!
<didrocks> pitti: please, you can change. I will adapt my code later :)
<pitti> didrocks: ok, thanks
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, python-distutils-mkdebian makes sense :)
<pitti> didrocks: I actually renamed it to python-mkdebian now
<pitti> since it works with any setup.py generated .egg-info, not just distutils or even just distutils-auto
<pitti> yay being generic :)
<pitti> .egg-info is an existing standard, which I just use as input for generating the debianization
<pitti> anyway, lunch o'clock
<asac> enjoy
<didrocks> pitti: great ;) looking at those egg-info stuff is on my schedule tooâ¦ ;)
<didrocks> pitti: have a good lunch!
 * didrocks jumps on mutter packaging
<seb128> hyperair, not sure about this usershare issue either
<seb128> hyperair, btw if you work on nautilus-share could you have a look at switching it to gtkbuilder?
<hyperair> seb128: okay, i'll take a look at it.
<hyperair> patches welcome though =p
<hyperair> seb128: when will glade be phased out?
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> I might have a look, I already did some patches for other applications
<lool> asac: Are these direct messages?  Perhaps you can subscribe to the list with all addresses you use and disable delivery
<seb128> well I expect it will still be installed by default in karmic but not in karmic+1
<seb128> but reducing the rdepends list would be nice
<lool> asac: I'm happy to hand you admin and/or moderator permissions; I'd like to avoid maintaining black/whitelists
<lool> asac: nothing in queue for pkg-mozilla-maintainers@lists.alioth.debian.org actually
<asac> hmm
<seb128> mvo, hey
<asac> is that on auto reject?
<asac> lool: oh ;) ... it was a different mailing list ;)
<asac> the moz-extmaintainers ;)
<lool> Don't know about that one :)
<seb128> mvo, do you think you could update libgksu to the current debian version?
<seb128> mvo, you know the package better than me and I'm a bit busy with GNOME3 things before desktop summit
<mvo> seb128: sure, I was sure that someone else did the merge, but I'm probably wrong
<seb128> mvo, there is no hurry but kov applied my gtkbuilder change so it would be nice to have in karmic ;-)
<mvo> !
<seb128> mvo, the most recent upload is not from you right, let me know if you are too busy I will put that on my todolist for later, I pinged you because I know you worked on this one before and know it a bit
<mvo> seb128: no prob, I can do the merge
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<mvo> seb128: I ported g-a-i to gtkbuilder today, you have been inspiring
<mvo> :)
<seb128> mvo, \o/
<wiwar> how to switch off  "Mirror Screens" ("System"->"Preferences"->"Screen Resolution") option with configuration files ?
<seb128> what do you mean by configuration files there?  why not using the tool?
<wiwar> > why not using the tool? <    Because It doesn't save it's settings. Each time I should set them again, and that settinngs doesn't affect on output
<seb128> wiwar, could you describe what you do exactly and the issue you get?
<wiwar> seb128, I am trying to setup triplehead configuration. Here is my config - http://pastebin.com/m9880611
<wiwar> The issue i get - left and central monitors show identical images
<seb128> wiwar, is your issue with the dialog that it fails to apply your changes or that those are not applied after next login?
<wiwar> "Mirror Screens" is selected and I am unable to deselect it
<seb128> you might want to open an upstream bug on bugzilla.gnome.org
<wiwar> First I deselect this option, then press "apply" button, then close dialog. When I open dialog again - option is still checked
<seb128> I doubt many people have 3 screens to test such configs so it would not be surprising if it didn't get lot of testing
<seb128> the configuration is written as monitors.xml in .config
<hyperair> seb128: i'm working on the glade->gtkbuilder transition now. what's the gtkbuilder version of glade_xml_new(FILE, "first_widget", GETTEXT_PACKAGE)? the reference page on library.gnome.org only says how to deal with no GETTEXT_PACKAGE
<hyperair> hmmmm maybe strings are already translated? =\
<seb128> hyperair, http://library.gnome.org/devel/gtk/stable/gtk-migrating-GtkBuilder.html
<hyperair> seb128: i'm already staring at that!
<hyperair> seb128: but it only shows the alternative for glade_xml_new(FILE,"first_widget",NULL) <-- note the NULL as opposed to GETTEXT_PACKAGE
<hyperair> seb128: if GtkBuilder automatically translates the strings, that's a different case
<seb128> you have a translation domain different from the software one?
<seb128> translations should be working out of the bug as for any other string using gettext
<hyperair> ah then it's fine
 * hyperair attempts to compile
<pitti> rickspencer3, didrocks: wrt. the version number and generating debian/changelog, how is the workflow? does version in setup.py get bumped on "release", or immediately after "release"? what should python-mkdebian do if that version already exists in debian/changelog?
<rickspencer3> pitti: I would think you would increment the version, and then release
<kenvandine> pitti, i would vote for bumping it after release
<kenvandine> :)
<rickspencer3> hehe
<kenvandine> look at what gnome does
<kenvandine> first commit after a release is bumping the version
 * kenvandine rather likes that model
<pitti> usually you bump immediately after and set it to "UNRELEASED", and "release" sets UNRELEASED -> karmic
<kenvandine> pitti, that is my preference
<kenvandine> pedro_, good morning
<pitti> so, should python-mkdebian bail out with an error if not "UNRELEASED" and setup.py version == debian/changelog versin?
<rickspencer3> pitti: I'm not clear on how it is different for the user ... are you suggesting that your script incrememnts the version number after a release?
<pedro_> morning kenvandine
<pitti> rickspencer3: no, the build system doesn't ever touch setup.py
<pitti> hey pedro_
<pedro_> hello pitti
<rickspencer3> so the user has to increment it at *some point* before they release
<pitti> rickspencer3: it's probably a moot point, since debian/changelog cannot actually get "sensible" entries unless we are using proper version control
<rickspencer3> we could do a commit before release if that would help
<didrocks> pitti: rickspencer3 also proposed that quickly release version_number can bump the release in setup.py if not done before
<pitti> seb128: ah, gdu-monitor works again with current udev
<pitti> didrocks, rickspencer3: ok, easier questions: (1) should python-mkdebian error out if you try to call it on the same version twice? (2) do you want to use the UNRELEASED schema, or just keep it at "karmic" all the time?
<rickspencer3> pitti: I think it should error out, at least for the first iteration
<rickspencer3> seems simpler to me
<didrocks> pitti: python-mkdebian touches the changelog entry?
<pitti> rickspencer3: that would imply keeping it at UNRELEASED, and then something has to call dch -r
<pitti> didrocks: well, if no changelog exists, we dch --create, that's easy
<rickspencer3> oh, I was thinking the script just bails and the user starts over
<pitti> but I wonder what should happen if it already exists
<pitti> rickspencer3: well, you might want to build several test debs until you release
<pitti> well
<pitti> I think I keep it very easy for now
<didrocks> hum. I prefer UNRELEASED too. But I'm unsure for python-mkdebian question
<pitti> don't use UNRELEASED, and just do nothing if the changelog entry already existsi
<pitti> if we need something more elaborate, we can bolt that on later
<pitti> that way it will never fail
<rickspencer3> pitti: right
<pitti> and release management is entirely up to quickly
<didrocks> ok, we will see then what people ask for :)
<rickspencer3> right, quickly could detect the error and do something
<pitti> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Epython-distutils-extra-hackers/python-distutils-extra/debian/changes making good progress :)
<rickspencer3> simple is good
<pitti> rickspencer3: in that simple model there wouldn't ever be an error
<pitti> i. e. python-mkdebian knows nothing about the concept of a "release"
<pitti> but of course we need to track it somewhere, e. g. you can't upload the same version twice
<didrocks> pitti: python-mkdebian just read the changelog to detect the version according to setup.py, add dch -i if not the same and build the package?
<rickspencer3> pitti: quickly could detect it *first* before it kicks off the script
<pitti> let's see how that will work out
<pitti> didrocks: right
<didrocks> pitti: for uploading, this is really on quickly side, I think.
<didrocks> so, quickly has to detect it as it is the link with launchpad
<pitti> didrocks: I agree, makes things less complicated and less prone to inconsistencies
<pitti> didrocks: well, if I were you, a "quickly release" or "quickly upload" would just bump the version after a successful upload
<didrocks> pitti: that's possible, but how to guess that user wants going from  3.0 to 3.1, or 3.5, or even 4.0 ? (no real example included) ;)
<pitti> didrocks: oh, do you care? I thought you'd just start with 1 and then just count upwards
<didrocks> pitti: ok, let's do that in a first approach
<pitti> didrocks: if you want more elaborate major/minor, you just have to ask or --version then, I guess
<pitti> "quickly release-management" (is this simple and fun? :-) )
<didrocks> pitti: will see that for quickly 0.2, let's just bump for the moment ;)
<rickspencer3> didrocks: we should get quickly into a ppa by Friday it possible
<rickspencer3> what should I prioritize between now and then? fixing the tutorial up?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: yes, fixing the tutorial. I will finish the release command.
<didrocks> I'm currently working on the mutter packaging. I will then work on quickly to polish those little things :)
<didrocks> and then release 0.1~alpha in the ppa
<pitti> didrocks.fork()
<didrocks> pitti: ahah ;)
<didrocks> currently, it's more didrocks.laptop.pbuilder.karmic.make_distcheck()
<SiDi> EAGAIN, pitti
<pitti> didrocks, rickspencer3: so, changelog looks pretty boring, but it works: http://paste.ubuntu.com/206975/
<pitti> SiDi: hello?
<SiDi> pitti: nevermind :p EAGAIN is an error code for when you cant get a process when fork'ing
<pitti> SiDi: oh, I see :)
<didrocks> pitti: this is only in the case where the user only "quickly release" if she/he "quickly release something very interesting", quickly will change it in the changelog.
<vladzur> hi, somebody know how edit HD videos? (m2ts)
<pitti> didrocks: oh, are you saying that you want to maintain debian/changelog yourself?
<pitti> didrocks: by default, mkdebian will put in "new release" right now, so that it also works independently of quickly
<pitti> didrocks: but I can add a parameter for a changelog entry if you want me
<didrocks> pitti: it would be awesome ;)
<pitti> didrocks: (in the next version, I want to get this working with a simple approach first)
<pitti> I'll add optparse to it later, then
<didrocks> perfect, let's just write it somewhere to remember later
<pitti>         # TODO: add CLI option to specify changelog
<pitti> ^ done
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> hum, mutter seems to require a updated clutter version. The configure is ok, but it FTBFS with incompatible pointer typeâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, should be easy to change?
<didrocks> seb128: if I look deeper, it's more a function call error (not the god signature): guint is expected and gfloat is given
<seb128> didrocks, do you use a tarball or git?
<didrocks> seb128: git, they didn't roll tarball for mutter
<seb128> oh
<didrocks> seb128: last taggued version in the git branch is still a metacity package also
<seb128> better to use current git
<seb128> those are not aimed at karmic proper but to a gnome-shell ppa for now anyway
<didrocks> seb128: yes. I just have to fix this FTBFS and see if transtyping from gfloat to guint is harmless in this case :)
<pitti> Now running lintian...
<pitti> W: jockey: binary-without-manpage usr/bin/jockey-gtk
<pitti> W: jockey: binary-without-manpage usr/bin/jockey-kde
<pitti> E: jockey: extended-description-is-empty
<pitti> not too bad for a completely autogenerated package
<idorock89> hi i wanted to ask about empathy
<idorock89> will it have google video chat and msn video chat in time for karmic?
<artir> google video chat (jingle) already works
<didrocks> seb128: I think that's a warning transformed in a error. I infer that launching autogen.sh on a non official version which calls gnome-autogen.sh enables a --debug or --enable-debug option when configuring. Are you aware about this and how to desactivate it when running autogen.sh?
<Zdra> idorock89: MSN video/audio is being worked, difficult to say if that will be ready for karmic, but upstream is close to get it done AFAIK
<Zdra> idorock89: and google video is already done
<Zdra> idorock89: since latest release of gabble
<idorock89> Zdra: wow really didnt see a blog post about it on any planet.
<idorock89> Zdra: so i can video chat from empathy 2.27.4 to windows user using gmail video chat ?
<Zdra> idorock89: I think, yes
<idorock89> Zdra: ok.really cool.
<artir> another "cool" thing is that if u have 2.27.* and other guy has 2.26 and u try to do a videochat with him, his empathy will crash :P
<Zdra> idorock89: you need telepathy-gabble 0.7.30 released yesterday
<seb128> didrocks, is -Werror set?
<didrocks> seb128: yes. I try to pass --disable-debug to autogen.sh, without success
<seb128> didrocks, -Werror is probably defined in configure.in somewhere
<seb128> just drop it before running autogen
<didrocks> seb128: ok. I was thinking of a better way with options handled by autogen.sh, but wellâ¦ ;) let's try to seek in configure.in
<idorock89> artir: and did u try it with someone on windows using gmail video chat?
<artir> nope
<artir> just empathy to empathy
<Ampelbein> seb128: hi. do you think bug #256041 is worth a SRU? Provided that the fix gets in karmic of course.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 256041 in gnome-panel "gnome-panel crashes when clicking launcher on second screen" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/256041
<didrocks> seb128: well, that works for easy casting thing. Now, it seems there is an error with an external function: http://pastebin.com/m6bd1388a)
 * didrocks will poke upstream ;)
<seb128> didrocks, upstream is on on irc.gnome.org
<seb128> Ampelbein, there is no duplicate for the bug so it doesn't seem a frequent user complain
<seb128> Ampelbein, but otherwise could be a candidate for a sru yes
<didrocks> seb128: yep, I'm already there. Seems that's because of an old clutter lib
<seb128> didrocks, they use clutter 0.8 or 0.9?
<didrocks> seb128: clutter-0.9.4 is needed
<seb128> didrocks, it's in universe enjoy the update ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: I was sure you were about telling that ;-)
<seb128> hehehe
<didrocks> seb128: upstream also told me that there is a whole bunch of changes just pulling right now. So, I'm waiting for an hour ;)
<seb128> didrocks, you can probably do the clutter update during that time ;-)
<didrocks> :p
<seb128> didrocks, your work is really appreciated btw in case I don't tell it enough ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: thanks ;-)
<mvo> and another app ported to gtkbuilder: update-manager
<pitti> \o/
<pitti> I ported jockey yesterday
<mvo> fortunately hardy python-gtk2 supports it
<mvo> so even the release upgrader can be ported :)
<mvo> still some more to go (gdebi, langauge-selector, software-properties, synaptic), but fortunately its pretty trivial
<seb128> yeah, I did libgksu and nautilus-sendto yesterday
<mvo> sweet
<dobey> pitti: ping
<pitti> hey dobey
<dobey> pitti: does the .examples file in debian/ need to match the binary pkg name, or the source?
<pitti> dobey: binary (that's true for all debhelper files)
<dobey> pitti: ok. just wondering because the two comments in REVU from you didn't line up exactly :)
<dobey> pitti: and what's the Vcs-Bzr: syntax? lp:project works?
<pitti> dobey: it points to the https://code.launchpad.net/... page with the branch, if you use bzr for packaging
<pitti> with that, other developers know if/where to commit changes
<dobey> ok
<dobey> i'll leave it out for now then. as there are still some changes that need to be done for that
<asac> awe: there atm?
<awe> asac: yea
<asac> awe: do you think we should just track tags for connman or upload latest git?
<asac> seems there is a lot of activity in the past 6 weeks (since last tag)
<awe> but no new tag?
<asac> and most likely the -gnome bits need the latest anyway
<asac> awe: no new tag for 6 weeks yes
<awe> sounds like we have no choice then
<asac> and maybe 120 commits or something ;)
<mvo> mpt: I looked at bug #377697 and it seems like update-manager should not be auto-opend if running on battery
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 377697 in update-manager "update manager should warn about laptop running on battery when installing big updates" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/377697
<mvo> mpt: does that sound right to you?
<mpt> hmmm
<mpt> mvo, that would mean you were never notified if you only ever work on battery (and charge it while suspended/off)
<mvo> yes
<mpt> so, maybe not :-)
<didrocks> seb128: clutter upstream removed a bunch of symbols without bumping the soname (between 0.9.2 and 0.9.4). the library is still named libclutter-glx-0.9.so.0. What do you think we should do?
<mvo> mpt: ok
<seb128> didrocks, no rdepends -> upgrade
<seb128> didrocks, you can ask upstream about it but they will probably say that 0.9 is unstable and has no stability guaranty
<didrocks> ok, let's be afraid in seing the number of rdepends ;)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> none? ;-)
<didrocks> exactly ;-)
<didrocks> \o/
 * didrocks wonders why he checks API compatibility before performing rdepends ;)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> because for stable updates you don't want to break api
<didrocks> seb128: yes, for third-party apps, right? (even if there are no rdepends)
<seb128> didrocks, indeed
<pitti> Keybuk: bzr push in udev please
 * pitti currently wrestles with a gtk-doc FTBFS
<Keybuk> pitti: pushed
<pitti> Keybuk: it seems that you somehow did some magic to the tree to actually build; here it fails on a missing version.xml
<pitti> I start with a clean bzr, then gtkdocize --copy, then autoreconf -fvi
<Keybuk> the magic is in debian/rules
<pitti> Keybuk: I'll add --fail-missing to dh_install and add the missing bits, FYI
<Keybuk> pitti: that'll fail the entire build
<pitti> (such as the consolekit helper)
<Keybuk> due to the way it does udebs
<Keybuk> I think I also deliberately miss things out
<pitti> Keybuk: I just see debian/rules tarball?
<Keybuk> pitti: right, that makes the tarball
<Keybuk> debian/rules package makes the source package
<pitti> ah, and then you untar this into . ?
<Keybuk> right
<Keybuk> well, I unpack that source package and build from there
<pitti> hm, unpacking the tarball leaves a huge bzr diff (probably from git pull after 143)
<Keybuk> sure
<Keybuk> 'tis what you'd expect
 * pitti reverts that and hopes for the bets
<pitti> best, too
<Keybuk> reverts which bit?
<pitti> well, I did "tar xzf ../udev_143.orig.tar.gz --str=1" into the bzr tree
<Keybuk> oh
<Keybuk> don't do that ;)
<pitti> but that restores the files to 143 release
<Keybuk> just bzr get the source tree
<pitti> it doesn't use bzr-buildpackage, nor patches, so how else would I get an actually buildable source tree under bzr control?
<Keybuk> this was so much easier when all we had to do was "apt-get source" :)
<Keybuk> pitti: you can't
<pitti> erm
<Keybuk> the bzr tree is unbuildable
<pitti> but how else do I do, test, and commit several changes?
<pitti> hm
<Keybuk> but you can make a source package from it
<Keybuk> unpack the source package
<Keybuk> and test that
<pitti> meh, that's hilarious
<Keybuk> I agree
<Keybuk> bzr fail
<pitti> revision control+autoconf fail, rather
<pitti> they really hate each other
 * Keybuk looks forlornly at his multi-year-open bugs against bzr that prevent a buildable udev from being checked in
<Keybuk> it's nothing to do with autoconf
<Keybuk> autoconf is just fine with revision control, cf. upstart
<Keybuk> it's make vs. revision control
<Keybuk> or more accurately, bzr's inability to apply any common sense to timestamps
<pitti> well, why wouldn't I be able to autoreconf and build the bzr tree?
<pitti> this should just work..
<Keybuk> because then dpkg complains about things like the test/ subdirectory
<Keybuk> which only exists in bzr
<pitti> no
<Keybuk> that's a dpkg issue ;)
<pitti> make fails
<Keybuk> make works here
<pitti> it stumbles over a missing version.xml for gtk-doc
<pitti> which apparently gets magically generated in the tarball
<Keybuk> oh
<Keybuk> right
<Keybuk> that's a gtk-doc issue
<Keybuk> which is broken
<Keybuk> it doesn't even support out-of-tree builds properly ffs
<pitti> but it works with the uploaded udev
<Keybuk> right, because the tarball has the extra magic files you need
<pitti> (which incidentally ships pre-made version.xml files)
<Keybuk> but you can't put those files into the bzr tree, because bzr screws up timestamps
<pitti> if I copy them from the tarball, it works
<pitti> but why would I in the first place?
<Keybuk> because that's the right thing to do
<pitti> it should just build version.xml from .in at build
<Keybuk> gtk-doc doesn't do that
<pitti> either by make, or by autoreconf
<Keybuk> because of the out-of-tree build
<Keybuk> it's broken ;)
<Keybuk> see above
<pitti> ah, that's why you have to do make all dist?
<Keybuk> you got it :)
<pitti> *ugh*
<Keybuk> tell me about it
<pitti> Keybuk: ok, thanks for the heads-up
<Keybuk> ideally, what I'd do would be
<Keybuk> bzr pull from git to update to a new release
<Keybuk> then import the tarball over the top, to add all of the missing files
<Keybuk> then pull from that into the ubuntu tree
<Keybuk> to pull from git head, I'd just pull directly
<Keybuk> that should cause automake to regenerate all the files anyway, and commit them along with the merge
<Keybuk> *but*
<Keybuk> I can't pull from git, because bzr-git can't read the udev git repo
<Keybuk> (to be fair, even bzr fast-import has issues on a near weekly basis)
<Keybuk> I can't import the tarball, because bzr doesn't apply sane timestamp logic, so you end up in a rebuild death spiral
<seb128> didrocks, \o/ new clutter ;-)
<Keybuk> so I sit here, in my little house of fail
<Keybuk> oh, and then I'd do dpkg-buildpackage (or bzr-buildpackage) to make the source package
<Keybuk> but that doesn't work either, because of the things that are in git but not in the tarball
<Keybuk> and dpkg goes nuts about them
<Keybuk> pitti: it occurs that if it's obvious that a particular file (version.xml) doesn't exist
<Keybuk> we could have a debian/rules snippet to do everything required to make it
<Keybuk> and have other things depend on it
<pitti> right
<Keybuk> and could get rid of the clean-tree things then
<Keybuk> which are "throw away everything I forgot to commit plz"
<pitti> Keybuk: I'm in the middle of figuring out the magic incantatino to turn a bzr checkout into a buildable tree
<Keybuk> pitti: it's the bits at the top of tarball
<pitti> Keybuk: I'd like to add that as debian/rules prep or so
<Keybuk> though you need to not use autogen.sh
<pitti> no
<Keybuk> gtkdocize --copy
<pitti> autogen.sh is broken
<Keybuk> autoreconf --install
<pitti> right
<Keybuk> make distclean
<Keybuk> ./configure --enable-gtk-doc
<Keybuk> make all dist
<Keybuk> hmm
<Keybuk> actually omitting the make distclean will work if not using autogen.sh
<Keybuk> gtkdocize --copy
<Keybuk> autoreconf --install
<Keybuk> ./configure --enable-gtk-doc
<Keybuk> make all dist
<Keybuk> ;)
<pitti> kdocize --copy
<pitti> autoreconf -fvi
<pitti> rm -rf autom4te.cache/
<pitti> ./configure --enable-gtk-doc
<pitti> make all dist
<pitti> make distclean
<pitti> (plus the missing "gt")
<Keybuk> NO!
<Keybuk> never use autoreconf -f
<Keybuk> ever
<Keybuk> ever
<Keybuk> ever
<Keybuk> BAD PITTI!
<pitti> *shrug* it's a clean tree
 * pitti removes the -f, I don't particularly care
<Keybuk> make all dist distclean would work ;)
<Keybuk> pitti: putting -f in there is a bad habit to get into
<Keybuk> autoreconf shouldn't even *have* a -f
<Keybuk> autoreconf -f really means "forcibly update everything auto-* related to the latest version, whether or not it'll work"
<pitti> Keybuk: nope, that's still not it
<pitti> warning: failed to load external entity "../version.xml"
<pitti> ../libudev-docs.xml:10: parser error : Failure to process entity version
<pitti> $ find -name version.xml
<pitti> ./build-deb/extras/gudev/docs/version.xml
<pitti> ./build-deb/libudev/docs/version.xml
<pitti> but not in the root tree
<Keybuk> err
<Keybuk> why were you in build-deb to begin with?
<pitti> distclean might wipe it?
<Keybuk> oh, maybe
<pitti> I wasn't
<pitti> I did above steps in root, then buildpackage
<Keybuk> of course, if you don't "distclean" you can't build
<Keybuk> you'll get "source directory is configured, wah wah sky is falling"
<pitti> but how did it ever go into the orig.tar.gz then?
<pitti> ah, make dist
<Keybuk> you can see how I got to the point where I just make a source package from bzr
<Keybuk> unpack it elsewhere
<Keybuk> and build and test that
<Keybuk> ;)
<pitti> Keybuk: I think I'm at the point where I'd just add a workaround for the gtk-doc breakage
<pitti> liek copying version.xml in debian/rules
<Keybuk> ;)
<Keybuk> there must be a makefile rule to build it
<Keybuk> trouble is that it always looks in $(srcdir) for it, never $(builddir)
<Keybuk> otherwise how does it end up in build-deb/ ?
<didrocks> seb128: hehe :-)
<bryce> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey bryce
<seb128> hey bryce
<didrocks> hello bryce
<rickspencer3> team meeting in four minutes
<seb128> meeting'o'clock!
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-06-30
<rickspencer3> asac: ArneGoetje bryce ccheney awe seb128 pitti Riddell
<ArneGoetje> here
 * rickspencer3 taps gavel
<seb128> hello
<awe> hey
<asac> hi
<bryce> heya
<rickspencer3> kenvandine:
<rickspencer3> shall we start? is this a quorum?
<pitti> ken@vandine.org: hey... having irc issues
<seb128> yes, pitti is around he was writing on some other channel some seconds ago
<pitti> FYI
<rickspencer3> heh
<rickspencer3> ok, let's roll
 * rickspencer3 refreshes to check for new agenda items
<rickspencer3> outstanding items from last meeting
 * pitti smuggles in a "GDM" topic
<rickspencer3> paper cuts: they got 10 fixed last week, seemed to be a success, so great
<rickspencer3> pitti: np, I'll that to the discussion section
<kenvandine> sorry folks... technical difficulties :)
<rickspencer3> awe: did you review the audio spec for TheMuso?
<awe> yea... i'll send him comments before this evening's meeting
<rickspencer3> sweet
<rickspencer3> two announcements:
<rickspencer3> 1. if you haven't booked travel for the sprint, please do so today
<rickspencer3> 2. a few of us are traveling to Desktop Summit
<rickspencer3> I'm leaving tomorrow, a few are leaving on Thursday, right?
<seb128> rickspencer3, "today"? is there any hurry?
<rickspencer3> like robert_ancell is leaving Thursday
 * seb128 still not decided between sucking flight options
<seb128> I'm travelling on friday for desktop summit
<rickspencer3> seb128: "today" was probably unnecessarily dramatic, but it does get more expensive for some of us if we wait to long
<seb128> I'm travelling on friday for desktop summit, landing in the afternoon
<seb128> rickspencer3, ok
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, yeah... mine jumped $200 over night while i thought about it..
<kenvandine> booked now
<rickspencer3> kenvandine: is arriving next Tuesday
<rickspencer3> Riddell: when are you ariving?
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, arriving monday afternoon
<rickspencer3> kenvandine: ack, thanks
<rickspencer3> kenvandine: partner update?
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> so ubuntuone packages are still being worked, dobey did a bit of a re-org to properly manage the packaging feedback he got in revu
<kenvandine> that should be updated in revu today, hopefully we can get that reviewed quickly
<kenvandine> dx team still hasn't communicated their iteration plans yet, but I do know fusa changes will land end of week
<kenvandine> at least all the basic functionality needed for the new GDM
<kenvandine> we need to decide if we want to go ahead and ship it with the new GDM
<kenvandine> seb128, thoughts?
<seb128> speaking about dxteam, apparently they wrote a new applet rather than adapting the gdm one?
<pitti> why oh why?
<kenvandine> i hadn't heard that... i knew it was a big change
<kenvandine> using the dbus menus
<seb128> hum, ted is not around and I guess that's a question for him rather
<kenvandine> we can talk to him about that
<kenvandine> they did the dbus menus work
<kenvandine> which should be nice
<seb128> "dbus menu"?
<seb128> what is that?
<kenvandine> might have required enough change to start over
<kenvandine> so apps can export menus to other apps
<artir> https://launchpad.net/dbusmenu
<kenvandine> over dbus
<rickspencer3> is there ambiguity regarding shipping new GDM?
<seb128> how is that revelent to fuse and gdm update?
<kenvandine> seb128, new fusa uses it
<seb128> this dbusmenu things seems a different topic
<pitti> I think new gdm is almost ready to go
<seb128> well that's a technical decision from them not a justification to fork upstream imho
<kenvandine> so it might have been enough work to just start over... i guess
<kenvandine> not sure
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, i don't think it is a question... it is more "are we ready next week"
<kenvandine> or right after guadec :)
<seb128> especially that ted was speaking about using different namespacing for the applet
<seb128> so requiring another user configuration migration on upgrade
<kenvandine> sigh
<kenvandine> ok... we need to talk to him
<seb128> yeah
<kenvandine> he didn't mention that part to me :)
<seb128> otherwise new gdm: help is welcome to fix upgrade issues
<seb128> and pitti says there is a blocker gpm issue too
<kenvandine> also, the ubuntuone karmic integration spec is approved
<pitti> seb128: well, not really a "blocker" for uploading gdm
<seb128> upgrade issue being that we can't restart gdm on upgrade because that would close running sessions
<kenvandine> so we will have more MIRs coming, as the code is written
<seb128> but the banner is broken until restart
<pitti> seb128: I meant the weird session saving dialog
<seb128> pitti, that's not my main concern, the concern is that gdm is not working until reboot
<seb128> it just displays a banner error
<rickspencer3> seb128: pitti: can we not live with gdm not working until reboot for the time being, for alpha users?
<seb128> and clicking ok makes the same error come back
<pitti> rickspencer3: WFM
<seb128> rickspencer3, yeah we can
<kenvandine> ok, i think that is all i have...
<seb128> upload is mainly blocked on the fusa update right now
<rickspencer3> so can we accelerate moving gdm out of the ppa and document the workaround?
<rickspencer3> ah
<seb128> without the patched fusa there is no way to reboot or stop your machine since we patch gnome-panel to not list those actions by default
<pitti> seb128: I don't think we should care about that; can't we just use the upstream fusa for the time being?
<rickspencer3> so shall kenvandine organize syncronizing those uploads, without blocking on finishing gdm?
<pitti> oh, eww
<seb128> we could drop that patch meanwhile too if required
<pitti> seb128: *nod*
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, i can do that
<kenvandine> should we block on migration for fusa?
<seb128> I'm not very comfortable uploading the new gdm just before traveling
<kenvandine> or is migration not that important?
<rickspencer3> ACTION: kenvandine to organize uploading new FUSA applet and new GDM, document workarounds
<seb128> I can do that next week when coming back from GUADEC
<kenvandine> seb128, lets do it right after we return
<pitti> seb128: I'm not going, I can care about that if you wnat me to
<pitti> like, care for the fallout
<kenvandine> pitti, that is great :)
<pitti> but well, next week would suffice
<seb128> pitti, ok, let's discuss that after meeting and upload tomorrow if we will comfortable
<kenvandine> fusa changes will land at the end of this week
<pitti> cool
<seb128> extra people installing the ppa version would be welcome
<seb128> just to confirm it somewhat works for several users
<rickspencer3> who volunteers?
<seb128> it's in the ubuntu-desktop ppa
<hggdh> will do
<rickspencer3> to  try the gdm in the ppa?
<rickspencer3> o/
<pitti> running for several days, no probs except http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=585228
<ubottu> Gnome bug 585228 in gnome-power-manager "immediately suspends on startup when lid is closed" [Major,Unconfirmed]
<rickspencer3> not too many volunteers :)
<seb128> ok good, I think we have everything we need there
<pedro_> I'll help with that as well
<rickspencer3> kenvandine: are you running new gdm?
<kenvandine> not anymore
<kenvandine> i had a VM with it
<kenvandine> but it got whacked
<Riddell> rickspencer3: I'm arriving tomorrow evening
<artir> seb128: tried it too in virtualbox, it works
<kenvandine> i can get it going again
<rickspencer3> ok, three of us should suffice though
<seb128> yeah, we will do with what we have
<jcastro> should I do a call for testin the new GDM?
<kenvandine> jcastro, not really great timing...
<seb128> jcastro, I think the some people volunteering here will be enough
<kenvandine> since we are all leaving :)
<rickspencer3> ACTION: hggdh, rickspencer3, pedro_ to install new gdm from ubuntu-desktop ppa, report serious problems to seb128 and/or kenvandine
<jcastro> ok
<seb128> but thanks
<rickspencer3> jcastro: but you could try it yourself
<rickspencer3> kenvandine: was that the whole partner update?
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, yup, the acceptance tests haven't changed
<kenvandine> well, updated... no new info :)
<rickspencer3> hmm
<rickspencer3> ok
<kenvandine> what did i miss?
<rickspencer3> thanks kenvandine
<kenvandine> ok :)
<rickspencer3> Riddell: Kubuntu update?
<Riddell> Kubuntu: KDE 4.3 RC 1 is in progress and will start uploading tonight
<Riddell> Arora is now the default browser (pre-empting big discussion just started by suse on the topic)
<Riddell> Kubuntu Tutorials Day was a big success, see logs https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuTutorialsDay
<Riddell> New council members vote is now under way
<Riddell> is all
<rickspencer3> Riddell: how is the netbook version going?
 * rickspencer3 wants to try
<Riddell> scott created the seeds, it's waiting on the changes to the image building scripts to get merged in for images
<rickspencer3> sweet!
<Riddell> and also on a settings package, currently it won't actually do anything different
<rickspencer3> oh?
<Riddell> tonio is working on that
<asac> Riddell: can we remove konqueror now? or do you still need it installed?
<Riddell> asac: it's still needed, it'll still be on the CDs for this release at least
<Riddell> baby steps
<asac> Riddell: so you have now two browsers by default
<asac> whats up there?
<asac> i know that there is something difficult ongoing, but two browsers by default sounds really odd.
<Riddell> well politics and fanboys, removing Konqueror will get us flamed by various people (we have two file managers anyway)
<Tm_T> Konqueror is not something one can remove without flaming
<Tm_T> nor without issues in overall
<rickspencer3> but having two applications that do the same thing because of fan boys doesn't sound very user-centric
<asac> how does the user experience look like? what will be used by default if you click on a http link?
<asac> how can the user switch the default
<seb128> why can't use who want to use it install it from universe or something?
<Riddell> arora currently, there's a System Settings module for default apps
<Tm_T> asac: it's all in the systemsettings, clearly labeled
<asac> Riddell: cant that be done in a way that installs konqueror on demand?
<asac> e.g. when user select "konqueror" as default browser, it gets automatically installed
<asac> like codecs etc.?
<Riddell> it could.. but this is controvertial enough without upsetting more people
<seb128> maybe we should install empathy and pidgin by default in ubuntu ;-)
<asac> ok... but to understand, you only have one "webbrowser" menu entry in "applications" (if something like that exists on kde) ... and userr configures what that means in system settings?
<Riddell> asac: right
<asac> or are there both browser in the menu?
<seb128> (to avoid people complaining about us switching)
<rickspencer3> ok, this sounds like a good discussion for #kubuntu-devel
<asac> Riddell: do both at least us the same webkit lib?
<Riddell> asac: no, that's the main problem with konqueror
<asac> (to not duplicate seucitry=
<Riddell> but we can't get rid of khtml, it's part of kdelibs
<asac> ok. maybe we can review this later this cycle ;)
<asac> moving on?
<rickspencer3> ACTION: ALL - provide feedback and help regarding Kubuntu browsers to Riddel in #kubuntu-devel
<rickspencer3> thanks Riddell
<rickspencer3> bryce: quick x update?
<bryce> sire
<bryce> er sure
<bryce>  * Merge Status:
<bryce>    + Mostly waiting on upstream releases at this point.
<bryce>    + 12 packages need merge/sync, out of 92 updates since Jaunty
<bryce>    + 7 packages have upstream releases but not yet in Debian
<bryce>    + -fglrx and -nvidia completed PPA testing.  Now in Ubuntu.
<bryce>    + mesa, xorg merges completed git staging.  Now in Ubuntu
<bryce>    + A new xserver RC is available.  Will be merged soonish.
<bryce>    + git snapshots of -ati/KMS, & -nouveau/KMS are in PPAs
 * rickspencer3 in awe of bryce's typing speed
<bryce> tjaalton just did the mesa and xorg uploads a few minutes ago, so y'all will be getting those soon
<bryce>  * X.org in Karmic is working well
<bryce>    + 2069 total open X bugs, down 38 since last week
<bryce>    + KMS on -intel is now on by default; relatively few bugs are being
<bryce>      reported about it.
<rickspencer3> great news about KMS
<pitti> I just fixed hal to not conflict with new xorg, so please don't complain :)
<asac> is the "lock up on screen powersave" bug fixed for i965?
<bryce> this past week I've been arm deep in bugs, and things "feel" fairly stable.  At the moment -nvidia feels the buggiest of our drivers, but that's nothing new
<bryce> asac, bug#?
<bryce> asac, generally we've been keeping the launchpad bug states for -intel really well up to date lately, so the lp bug status on that is probably accurate
<asac> bryce: mdz had the same bug i think
<asac> so i didnt file one
<kenvandine> i thought mdz filed it
<asac> yes he filed
<kenvandine> i have the same problem
<asac> thats why i didnt ;)
<kenvandine> me too :)
<bryce> well, we can talk more on specific bugs off-meeting, but in general it appears this latest -intel is doing quite well
<kenvandine> ok
<pitti> bryce: wrt, xorg-edgers, do you want to continue keeping it at the current pace? if so, shouldn't we just upload new versions to karmic directly, to get more testing?
<rickspencer3> that's great news
<bryce> poor mdz ;-)
<asac> bryce: doing quite well? it locks up my laptop if i dont type for a few minutes ;)
<asac> just kiddig
<seb128> bug #388357
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 388357 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[i965] X freeze on karmic after resume from full screen application: i915_gem_retire_work_handler() / finish_task_switch()" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/388357
<seb128> I think that's this one
<kenvandine> asac, we just have to work faster :)
<rickspencer3> asac: that was unkind ;)
<pitti> -intel still freezes a lot for me after suspends, and DPMS off, and dpms off seems to kill it completely, but I'll follow up with that with upstream
<bryce> pitti, yes - in fact that's what we've been doing.  We've uploaded several things from xorg-edgers the past couple weeks
<asac> pitti: if i suspend and close the lid quickly it freezes because its the powersave thing going on
<asac> if i wait until its suspended -> no problem
<rickspencer3> this seems like much better shape than even the end of Jaunty, where we had hard to reproduce freezing bugs during normal use
<bryce> asac, ah yes; that one is reported upstream and has high priority for a fix, so I'm waiting for a patch from upstream as the next step
<asac> ok ... /me keeps powersave disabled then
<rickspencer3> thanks for the update bryce
<bryce> asac, they asked for newer debugging tools, which I packaged, although doesn't appear mdz has run them, so if anyone is interested in pushing that bug forward, that's something you could work on
<bryce> but we can talk post-meeting on bugs
<asac> k
<rickspencer3> also, you all should see the bug report for -intel graphics that bryce is producing ... it gives quite a good overview of the current bug situation
<bryce> rickspencer3, should I post those reports to a public location?
<rickspencer3> bryce: wouldn't hurt, i suppose
<bryce> maybe I'll turn it into a web page; it's getting kind of unwieldy as it is
 * rickspencer3 nods
<rickspencer3> put it on a cron job, and set an auto email to Yingying
<bryce> hehe
<bryce> well I like to do some housecleaning before sending it out.  ;-)
<rickspencer3> perhaps some people would be interested in seeing the tools that you use to create such reports
<bryce> anyway, that's it for X
<bryce> sure
<rickspencer3> thanks bryce
<rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: translations update?
<ArneGoetje>  * Message sharing in Rosetta is done, translations in Jaunty and Karmic are shared now.
<ArneGoetje>  * Imports have started for Karmic.
<ArneGoetje>  * Contacted Kubuntu developers and asked them to review the current Kubuntu related translation templates in Rosetta. Based on their feedback, the Ubuntu Translation Coordinators team needs to approve new templates, disable obsolete ones and rename templates that have been moved.
<ArneGoetje>  * After the first round of imports is done, and Kubuntu translations are in reasonable shape we will generate initial language-packs for Karmic (hopefully next week).
<ArneGoetje> [done]
<rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: in general are we ahead of the curve or behind the curve in terms of translations compared to previous releases?
<ArneGoetje> I think behind what was planned, due to message sharing development going on. But still not too late.
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> thanks for the update ArneGoetje
<ArneGoetje> np
<rickspencer3> pitti: GDM?
<pitti> already covered
<pitti> was about when to upload the new one
<rickspencer3> ok
<pitti> I like to see that land RSN, so that DX team/themes etc. can be developed
<kenvandine> pitti, i just saw a snag... dbusmenu will need to get uploaded too... new package
<kenvandine> REVU, MIR, etc
<pitti> Riddell: any progress on bug 339313?
<pitti> this seems to be stuck somehow
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 339313 in ubuntu-release-notes "Kubuntu Jaunty: Cannot Connect To Wireless Network with WEP shared key" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/339313
<Riddell> pitti: well the new plasmoid is in so it's working as best as it can
<Riddell> I can ask at GCDS when is a good time to take a new snapshot and do another update
<pitti> Riddell: is that the "ppa package which works better" you referred to?
<pitti> i. e. is that fixed now?
<Riddell> yes
<pitti> cool
<Riddell> so it works now for far more people, but still some situations where it doesn't seem to
<rickspencer3> moving on
<rickspencer3> looks like the burndown chart is working, please don't forget to change the status of items when they are done
<rickspencer3> I think I may tweak it to add a "prediction line"
<rickspencer3> next is a discussion topic: PPAs versus archives
<asac___> (/me back ... IRC gateway failed)
<rickspencer3> I have two, possibly invalid, concerns:
<rickspencer3> 1. It seems that moving some things from PPAs to universe has taken longer than predicted for some components ... making me concerned that we will find ourselves very behind if we wait too long
<seb128> urg, wrong click
<rickspencer3> 2. It seems that with PPAs, we are all running and testing a different desktop, which seems suboptimal from a testing POV, but also means that things may appear "done" when they are in PPAs, which may be premature
<rickspencer3> so my question is ...
<seb128> (what was 1?)
<rickspencer3> (10:21:16 AM) rickspencer3: 1. It seems that moving some things from PPAs to universe has taken longer than predicted for some components ... making me concerned that we will find ourselves very behind if we wait too long
<seb128> thanks
<rickspencer3> so my question is ....
<asac___> i agree that we should do most stuff directly in archive
<rickspencer3> is there product in PPAs now that should be in archives?
<rickspencer3> thoughts?
<asac___> with a few exceptions: transitions that will cause unnecessary breakage on developers desktops
<seb128> dunno if there is things in ppa to move right now
<seb128> but I've discussed recently the xorg edger ppa with pitti and I feel it's suboptimal too
<rickspencer3> I know about GDM, FFA 3.5, and xorg-edgers
<seb128> I'm rather in favor of snapshoting versions directly to karmic if they are candidate to land there anyway
<pitti> well, there's two cases
<rickspencer3> I know that FF3.5 won't be ready for the archives until alpha 4
<asac___> yeah. ffox 3.5 (the app) itself is in archive ... its just that i do the first transition steps in ppa to provide karmic users with a more or less smooth transition
<pitti> stuff like the new U1 packages need to stay in PPAs until they are ready for upload and reviewed in REVU
<rickspencer3> asac: ok, great
 * rickspencer3 directs my last comment to all three asacs
<bryce> erf, the whole reason for doing the ppa's was due to complaints about stuff going directly into the archive without suitable testing
<pitti> for newer versions like X.org or ffox, I agree that direct karmic uploads would be better
 * rickspencer3 now knows hos asac gets so much done
<seb128> bryce, I don't think we should aim at having unstable stable
<bryce> pitti, why is this?
<seb128> it just slow us down
<pitti> bryce: well, it doesn't particularly matter whether the version I revert to came from a PPA or from karmic?
<bryce> seb128, how does it slow you down?
<seb128> it diverts testing efforts
<pitti> (in case it breaks)
<seb128> you get bugs about different versions
<seb128> you have to fix issues in 2 places when there is new changes required
<rickspencer3> I think xorg was a special case for Karmic, in a way, as there was some sensitivity regarding intel after Jaunty
<bryce> hmm, I really don't agree, I don't see the problems you guys are describing
<seb128> you don't see users reporting bugs about different versions?
<seb128> and me and pitti not running the same versions and not having the same issues?
<bryce> it is little extra effort fixing things in both places, and it saves being endlessly pinged on IRC by people having problems with the newest stuff
<bryce> seb128, no I'm saying it's not a huge concern to me that people are reporting bugs about different versions
<rickspencer3> also, when x breaks, it becomes rather pressing for the user, even if they are a developer, and this impacts bryce quite abit
<seb128> people not ready for running unstable versions should stay on jaunty
<bryce> already I get people reporting bugs with a lot of different versions, aside from PPA
<seb128> rickspencer3, you could say the same for glib, gtk, firefox, evolution, etc
<seb128> linux
<seb128> libc
<asac___> seb128: we do that
<asac___> we have -daily ppas
<bryce> seb128, I disagree
<rickspencer3> seb128: could be, I don't know ... but I know that bryce spends a huge amount of time helping people troubleshoot x
<asac___> also we do staging for -security updates ... and now the ffox 35 transition
<bryce> seb128, there are many people who want to run karmic to be able to test some classes of software, but who do not like it when the whole system breaks from under them
<rickspencer3> bryce: when are you planning to move all the karmic stuff into karmic archives?
<bryce> others like having the system break from under them... so they install edgers and work with us on bugs
<seb128> so we should have ppa for pulseaudio too to not break sound, and for linux to not break whatever etc etc etc
<seb128> well, so we are back to my question from the other day, is edger meant to be candidate versions for karmic or crack of the day?
<pitti> bryce: so xorg-edgers is essentially autobuilt and not tested?
<seb128> some people told me to test upgrades there because those are candidate for karmic
<pitti> bryce: so perhaps a compromise would be to just upload snapshots more often then?
<seb128> I'm fine with having crack of the days ppa for hackers
<bryce> rickspencer3, general rule is as upstream puts out their final releases we merge into ubuntu, and just keep rolling the git snapshots
<rickspencer3> bryce: it seems that perhaps edgers has served it's purpose for Karmic, and it's time to start focusing on the archives
<bryce> pitti, xorg-edgers is *where* the testing is done.  but yeah, stuff is not expected to be tested before it's uploaded there
<pitti> so we are still all encouraged to have it enabled?
<bryce> rickspencer3, but that's exactly what's going on...  this week we uploaded -fglrx, -nvidia, xorg, and mesa.  xserver is coming soon too
<rickspencer3> bryce: ok
<seb128> so I'm running karmic but I'm not testing what is useful and that bothers me somewhat
<pitti> I guess for the full fun we also need to use the daily kernel images then, to get i915 updates
<bryce> rickspencer3, we still need xorg-edgers to make it easy for people to test upstream for bug debugging purposes, which will enable us to cherrypick fixes
<rickspencer3> I think that X was actually handled quite well given the Jaunty issues ... and I didn't mean for this to overly focus on bryce's work
<rickspencer3> so perhaps bryce, pitti, and seb128 can discuss a mutually satisfactory course of action ... but
<rickspencer3> are there *other* PPAs that we should be thinking of as well?
<pitti> I'm mainly interested in when I should stop using xorg-edgers
<seb128> not that I know about
<bryce> pitti, alpha-3
<pitti> I'd like to test as early as possible what will go into karmic
<pitti> bryce: ah, thanks
<seb128> I'm mainly interest to know why I should be adding ppas to my sources.list to be testing karmic
<seb128> but right that's a out of meeting discussion
<bryce> alpha-3 is where we're going to shift focus over more to stabilization, and most all the key X bits will be in place by then
<pitti> bryce: I hope we'll also get .31 by then
<pitti> that should help (or break :) ) a lot
<bryce> yeah that's the other thing... a lot of the X stuff has kernel dependencies now with KMS, that's easier and safer to deal with in a PPA
<rickspencer3> ok
<pitti> bryce: My fingers are itching to DKMSify i915 for git head testing :)
<pitti> but I guess we could just as well use the kernel PPA
<rickspencer3> I think we ran a tad past the meeting time
<rickspencer3> are there action items to take out of the PPA/archive discussion?
<seb128> I would say "no" looking at the discussion
<asac___> essence for meseems to be that main testing should be done in real archive and if you ask all desktop team members to enable a PPA you probably do something wrong ;)
<pitti> for me, it was "keep xorg-edgers until alpha-3 and disable it afterwards"
<seb128> asac____ ++
<seb128> I think there is something wrong if people using karmic are not testing karmic ....
<asac___> ppas make sense for me for voluntarily staging and to prepare bits that you dont want to get tested by all ;)
<seb128> ie what is the point to run the unstable version if your feedback is about outdated versions anyway
<rickspencer3> but so far as I can tell, with a few exceptions that is what has been happening
<asac___> (and for non-motus for getting things reviewed)
<pitti> I thought that was precisely what xorg-edgers is?
<pitti> (not recommended to all karmic users)?
<pitti> asac___: for review it's fine, *nod* (although REVU is better)
<pitti> like, the U1 packages
<asac___> pitti: yes. lets phrase different: ppa is good if you want to provide packages to users while its undergooing review in revu
<asac___> ;)
<rickspencer3> ACTION: All: run edgers until alpha 3, and then disable
<rickspencer3> any other business?
<asac_> yes. anyone running jaunty or any other stable release?
<rickspencer3> asac_: I'm running Jaunty as we speak
<asac_> if so, please enable the https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mozilla-security/+archive/ppa ... i always need more testers for our security bits
 * rickspencer3 clicks
<asac_> only bits that would go out to end users usually go there ... so its safe
 * awe clicks
<pitti> jaunty? wasn't that an Ubuntu release we did a million years ago? :-)
<asac_> if you update daily and report in case suddenly firefox brakes, let me know quickly
<asac_> otherwise no need to confirm or anything
<bryce> pitti, I've excised it from my brain already
<asac_> thanks!
<pitti> thanks all
<bryce> thanks
<rickspencer3> ACTION: ALL install mozilla security update, report problems to asac
<rickspencer3> bye all!
<rickspencer3> thanks
 * rickspencer3 taps gavel
<asac_> thanks
<asac_> everybody going to desktop summit: enjoy your trip!
<seb128> thanks
<awe> see ya
<pitti> have fun, guys!
<seb128> need to reboot my laptop brb
<ArneGoetje> thanks
<pitti> dinner o'clock, will come back later to unbreak apport retracers
<seb128> re
<seb128> bryce, pitti: I've nothing against having edger ppas, the things if that we start having a gtk-edger, devicekit-edger, xorg-edger, etc everybody will have a different mix of versions and nobody test karmic proper, ie what we ship to our users
<seb128> and sometime issues come from a specific versions combination and you don't notice you break karmic because you are running some edger version not having the issue
<bryce> seb128, I don't think you understand how fragile X can be sometimes, and how badly it can break from just updating a driver to a git snapshot
<bryce> and when it does break, I get people coming out of the woodwork bugging me about the problem... it gets overwhelming very quickly
<seb128> hum, not sure how I should take that
<seb128> you think I don't understand what sort of breakages we can have and the implications?
<seb128> I didn't say to upload random git crack to karmic
<bryce> from my perspective doing the extremely unstable stuff in PPAs helps, since only those who are good at reporting problems test it, and can give good feedback (and shut it off if the issues are too bad)
<bryce> xorg-edgers == random git crack
<seb128> well I don't get why I'm being asked to run xorg-edger until alpha3 then
<seb128> I don't want to run git crack, I want to give feedback on karmic
<seb128> I'm fine with ppa having crack of the day as firefox has
<seb128> and usually we ask users to try thing there to confirm a specific bug has been fixed
<seb128> but I don't think we should encourage all the team members to run edger
<bryce> seb128, I'd agree
<seb128> bryce, ok, good, I think we have the same opinion
<seb128> I just had the impression that we were encouraged to all run edger
<bryce> I was surprised to see rickspencer3 set it as a task for everyone; I would rather that people only run xorg-edgers if they are okay with spending the time to report bugs and deal with issues that might crop up
<seb128> it might just be me who misunderstood though
<rickspencer3> I can remove that for sure
<rickspencer3> I guess it should be for people who want to
<seb128> but pitti has been advertising it too
<bryce> rickspencer3, thanks yes
<rickspencer3> seb128: no the action item said All
<rickspencer3> but it should have said "consider running" or "if you are running", etc...
<seb128> as said before I think edger ppa should be for people interested by debugging crack of the day for the said component
<seb128> ie I would not recommend everybody to run daily gtk snapshots there, most people don't care about doing the upstream job for gtk
<seb128> anyway seems we are on agreement on that, only people interested run edger versions and all is fine ... time for diner ;-)
<bryce> violent agreement again apparently ;-)
<mclasen_> seb128: running daily gtk snapshots is entirely harmless...
<mclasen_> compared to X
<bryce> if some of this is coming from the emails I sent out last week to test fglrx and nvidia, both of which were being staged in xorg-edgers at the time, note that both got uploaded to karmic the next day, once we had a few positive test cases.  And the -intel I asked people to test already was in karmic.
<bryce> the main reason I asked fglrx and nvidia users to test xorg-edgers was since a lot of them were on jaunty, and there really isn't a way to give them newer drivers aside from ppas
<rickspencer3> seb128: kenvandine: I presume that FUSA will be broken now that I am on gdm-new?
 * rickspencer3 logs out
<kenvandine> yes
<dobey> hrmm, i think i might need some help with the ubuntuone-client packaging
<dobey> and pitti is probably gone for the day
<kalon33> kenvandine, about new gdm, do you have an idea of when fusa will be patched to correct it's broken state ? Or will gnome-panel be unpatched to provide logout facilities until then ?
<kenvandine> kalon33, end of the week
<kenvandine> well the code will be ready
<kenvandine> probably updated to karmic next week
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, but you should be using gdm not gdm-new
<kalon33> kenvandine, so new GDM will land at the same time in karmic or the fix will be in desktop-team PPA ?
<kenvandine> same time
<kenvandine> the goal is to land them both in karmic together
<kalon33> without a transition period (for instance between the moment when the code will be ready and the next week) ?
<kalon33> in a ppa ?
<kenvandine> undetermined as of now
<kalon33> kenvandine, thanks for your answers, will test new GDM now, as I can switch off manually ;)
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> thx
<dobey> kenvandine: are you knowledgeable enough to help me with the packaging? :)
<kenvandine> should be
<kenvandine> what do you need?
<dobey> dealing with http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/ubuntuone-client
<dobey> trying to figure out hwo to do the split exactly
 * kenvandine looks
<kalon33> kenvandine, you're welcome, I know testing is quite important, and as I have the sufficient knowledge... have a nice evening :)
<kenvandine> dobey, so where are the package sources?
<dobey> kenvandine: the tarball?
<kenvandine> no, the packaging
<dobey> kenvandine: lp:~dobey/ubuntu/karmic/ubuntuone-client/karmic
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> re
<seb128> mclasen_, yeah maybe gtk was not a good example, I was just picking a library used by quite some application, ie if gtk has a crasher commit quite some users would notice
<dobey> kenvandine: mostly, i'm not sure where some separation should be, as most all of the code depends on gnomekeyring python bindings, whicn unfortunately pulls in most of gnome due to the way it's packaged
<kenvandine> well for the "not depending on gnome" case that is hard... but we can surely split out the python stuff into python-ubuntuone-client
<kenvandine> the python library that is
<kenvandine> dobey, give me a few
<dobey> kenvandine: right, though i'm not entirely sure what belongs there either, since ubuntuone.u1sync is just for u1sync to use (which I think should be a separate package), and the syncdaemon stuff is almost entirely just code only the syncdaemon itself should be using
<dobey> ie, a python-ubuntuone-client doesn't really make sense to me
<kenvandine> hang on... my box is hanging here.. it does that when writing a usb image
<dobey> heh
<hggdh> seb128, I will email you a sample of the evolution apport hook working (it will have real data)
<seb128> hggdh, can't you have a simple testsuite example, ie the function called on an IP and comparing the result to a known result?
<hggdh> seb128, yes, will do, then
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> walters, hey
<seb128> walters, I'm having a look to the gobject-introspection 0.6.1 to 0.6.3 update
<seb128> walters, there is a new libgirepository-everything-1.0.so, do you recommend splitting that as a new library?
<seb128> I'm not sure what it's used for exactly
<pitti> dobey: I'm back for some minutes
<dobey> pitti: hey, kenvandine is helping me
<pitti> ah, great
<dobey> pitti: you might be able better answer my conffiles question though
<dobey> pitti: does debhelper just automatically make anything in /etc a conffile now or something?
<pitti> dobey: it has done that forever already
<seb128> not now that has always been the case
<pitti> usually you never need to write a debian/conffiles
<dobey> eww
<dobey> so it makes /etc/xdg/autostart files be conffiles?
<seb128> yes
<pitti> right
<dobey> :(
<pitti> dobey: do they need to be? can't we ship them in /usr/share?
<seb128> cf xdg and d-d-l emails from Josselin about using usr
<dobey> seb128: yes, that's only ONE example though
<pitti> /usr/share/gnome/autostart/ has some stuff
<seb128> we shipped those in etc for a reason, to let sysadmin change those easily to not start
<dobey> but /usr/share/gnome/autostart is wrong (it's not an xdg place)
<pitti> gnome-session-splash, libcanberra-login, and polkit-gnome-auth use it
<pitti> but *shrug*, I don't particularly care
<dobey> but regardless, there's lots of stuff in /etc/ which shouldn't be considered conf files
<pitti> I usually use whatever upstream does
<seb128> gnome-session read files in both locations
<pitti> dobey: *nod*
<dobey> yes, gnome-session does i'm sure
<dobey> but i don't want to argue about the location of autostart files. i was just making an example
<seb128> what is the issue?
<walters> seb128: well i'm unhappy about its existence =/  but basically i'd just ship it with the main package
<walters> seb128: it's a library of test functions that bindings can use, basically BuildRequiresTests if you know what i mean
<seb128> I don't know about BuildRequiresTests but I'm fine shipping that in gobject-introspection
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> walters, btw do you follow gnome-shell too?
<walters> seb128: yeah
<walters> seb128: the main thing to do for that is get introspection support in gtk and pango, and then we don't need to depend on gir-repository
<seb128> walters, apparently Clutter-0.9.gir is required to build mutter, do you know where than can be find, current gir-repository use 0.8
<walters> seb128: clutter needs to be built with introspection for 0.9
<walters> that's where we're tryign to get to, where the libraries themselves build introspection data
<seb128> so the gir is in clutter proper and not gir-repository?
<walters> yeah
<walters> gir-repository is the old way, it's like a dependency inversion black hole
<seb128> yeah, that makes sense, we had discussion about that at UDS
<didrocks> FYI, I have a similar discussion with owen on #gnome-shell right now :)
<seb128> I will join #gnome-shell I think
 * hyperair yawns. nautilus-share porting to gtkbuilder complete =D
<seb128> hyperair, good job!
<hyperair> seb128: thanks =)
<hyperair> it would have been completed faster if gtkbuilder didn't insist on creating the dummy parent window when the ui is loaded
<hyperair> oh well
<seb128> asac: do you plan to move libmozjs to a system path this cycle?
<seb128_> re
<seb128_> dsl disconnected
<seb128_> I was saying
<seb128_> asac: do you plan to move libmozjs to a system path this cycle?
<seb128_> hyperair, what did you do about the weird script to do changes in the .glade?
<seb128_>  I had a quick look yesterday and that + all the debian patche stopped me and I decided to work on nautilus-sendto rather
<seb128_>  walters, btw do you have an opinion about gjs packaging too? ;-)
<seb128_>  walters, would you split libgjs.so and libgjs-gi.so in proper libraries? and where should go /usr/lib/gjs-1.0/*.so if we do things this way?
<seb128_>  lool, pitti, can you bump the gdm build score?
<hyperair> seb128_: unhooked it from the build system.
<pitti> seb128_, lool: doing
<seb128_> hyperair, ok makes sense I think
<hyperair> seb128_: it's not needed since the introductino of the system icon patch
<hyperair> seb128_: the fix.pl was meant to mangle the pathnames of the custom icons. i tossed those away, heheh =p
<hyperair> folder-remote looks very much better than those ugly icons it shipped with
<seb128_> pitti, thanks, the xorg managed to break gdm and didn't notice until people start complaining so having it fixed quickly would be appreciated ;-)
<pitti> seb128_: done, but still clogged
<pitti> right, I saw
<pitti> eww, doesn't help
<pitti> https://edge.launchpad.net/builders
<seb128_> xorg +guys
<pitti> they are all down
<seb128_> great
<seb128_> why do that always happen when you need a quick build?
<pitti> see #u-devel
<seb128_> thanks
<pitti> seb128_: does that affect gdm-new as well?
<seb128_> pitti, I didn't check yet but I doubt it
<pitti> cool
<pitti> ok, seems my patch to unbreak apport retracers works
<seb128_> pitti, in fact new gdm has the issue too ...
<seb128_> pitti, basically easy to fix, just change the xserver path in gdm.conf to /usr/bin/X
<seb128_> pitti, it's still /usr/X11R6/bin/X
<pitti> just to know what to do when I boot my machine tomorrow morning :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128_ - i just noticed that bug 282403 still has an open intrepid task whilst going through some of my work for my MOTU application. i think it should be closed as WONTFIX for intrepid. do you agree?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 282403 in fast-user-switch-applet "Cannot shutdown or restart when more than one user is logged in" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/282403
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, seems correct
<chrisccoulson> thanks, i'll close that one
 * hyperair wonders where bdefreese disappeared to =\
<pitti> seb128: ah, is that StandardXServer=/usr/X11R6/bin/X ?
<seb128> pitti, yes
 * pitti locally changes to /usr/bin/X
<pitti> merci
<seb128> de rien!
<pitti> seb128: so, I hope the retracers will survive a bit
<seb128> pitti, they are running now?
<seb128> I've been too busy to look at those recently
<seb128> or too lazy ;-)
<pitti> seb128: the i386 survived for about 10 retracers
<pitti> I'm currently rolling out the new versions from apport-retracer PPA
<seb128> good start
<pitti> then I'll restart
<lool> seb128: I can't bump build scores I'm afraid
<pitti> seb128: it just stoppped because the chroot changed underneath it, not because of an actual bug
<seb128> lool, ok, I was not sure if you were buildd admin
 * pitti sees seb128's new gdm upload and cranks up build score
<seb128> pitti, danke
<seb128> lool, the buildds didn't like your debian workaround, ie the xserver-xorg build-depends
<pitti> seb128: 0ubuntu4 put down to 0 again, so that they don't build in vain
<pitti> but now we can just twiddle thumbs until the security builds finish
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> I'm sure it's openoffice and linux
<seb128> pitti, linux only according to what kees said
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> seb128: guess what builds it first -- armel and lpia..
<pitti> go mobile!
<kalon33> ;)
<seb128> pitti, yeah, armel is where I read the ftfbs error before
<seb128> pitti, and the winner is, lpia!
<kalon33> ;)
<seb128> "X server : /usr/bin/X"
<seb128> good, it worked
<pitti> \o/
<pitti> seb128: yeah, it usually is
<pitti> lpia is blazingly fast for some reason
<pitti> $ rm */lock
<pitti> there, retracers should be alive again
 * pitti knocks on wood
<seb128> rock on
<lool> Wow it was months if not years I touched this
<kalon33> seb128, Sorry, I didn't checked yet, is this bug occurs with new GDM (from desktop-team PPA) ?
<seb128> lool, well, ubuntu just got the xserver change which dropped the X11R6 compatibility thing
<pitti> kalon33: yes, same problem
<seb128> lool, and they didn't test if gdm was broken before uploading ...
<pitti> kalon33: just edit /etc/gdm/gdm.conf and fix the path
<lool> Eh
<pitti> kalon33: StandardXServer=/usr/bin/X
<seb128> or wait for the update
<seb128> I updated both karmic and ppa
<lool> I should have implemented that autoconf option, but it was old gdm and I knew it wouldn't go upstream; I guess this stayed for new gdm
<seb128> lool, right, I used the easy way I changed the fallback case in the configure
<kalon33> thanks both pitti and seb128 ;)
<seb128> lool, ie it fallback to /usr/bin/X now
<seb128> hum, bug #104957
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 104957 in gdm "users with no password can't log in with gdm" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/104957
<lool> Oh funny I tried that today
<pitti> feature!
<lool> I ran passwd -d on an user and I could login on a tty but not on gdm
<seb128> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/28548736/gdm_2.20.10-0ubuntu4.debdiff
<lool> I saw that the PAM setup is different, I checked securetty, but didn't know how to set it up
<seb128> the user suggests adding a nopassword group to the system for that
<lool> Eek
<seb128> I'm waiting for pitti or $security to comment
<pitti> well, frankly, it should just work
<pitti> you can log into ttys, etc.
<pitti> passwd and user-setup should just plainly refuse to have no password
<pitti> because that is a nightmare
<pitti> autologin is okay
<pitti> but open accounts, possibly on computers with ssh enabled, are a pain
<seb128> that probably still doesn't solve the gnome-keyring issue either
<lool> I think the tty needs to be in securetty
<lool> And gdm is probably using an odd tty
<lool> Perhaps redirecting stdin/stdout for instance
<dobey> yay
<dobey> i hope i don't have to make any more changes to the packaging for a while
<pitti> dobey: reviewing storage-protocol ATM
<pitti> thanks for fixing
<pitti> dobey: uploaded
<pitti> dobey: waiting for the -client now
<pitti> sleep o'clock, see you tomorrow!
<pitti> kenvandine: ^ FYI
<kalon33> pitti, good night
<chrisccoulson> hmmmm, "what I like least in Ubuntu"
<chrisccoulson> not sure how to answer that :-/
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ignore it?
<chrisccoulson> i was just thinking that
<chrisccoulson> thats the only thing i've got left to answer now ;)
<seb128> not bad
<seb128> enough work there, night everybody
<chrisccoulson> good night
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-07-01
<TheMuso> Hey rickspencer3, robert_ancell.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, hi
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell: TheMuso: hi guyses
<TheMuso> Hey rickspencer3.
 * awe waves
<rickspencer3> hi awe
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-06-30
<rickspencer3> I haven't had a chance to copy over any notes from this morning
<rickspencer3> I don't actually think it will take to long for us to run through these
<rickspencer3> ready?
<robert_ancell> go
<TheMuso> sure
<awe> +1
<rickspencer3> ok, first, if you don't have travel arranged for Dublin, please arrange it asap, prices are going up quickly
<rickspencer3> A bunch of us are going to Desktop Summit
<TheMuso> Its just about arranged on my part, since I'm travelling with StevenK.
<rickspencer3> seb128, Riddell, robert_ancell, me, kenvandine
<rickspencer3> TheMuso: great
<robert_ancell> I'm battling the travel agent to finally send me an eticket
<rickspencer3> hmm
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell: do you need help?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, I've got the route chosen, I just send a reminder email today to confirm that it is booked
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> I'll be traveling starting tomorrow, so let randa know if you have problems getting your travel arrangements closed
<robert_ancell> sure
<awe> ok
<rickspencer3> so then there was the partner update
<rickspencer3> essentially U1 file synching is still almost in universe again
<TheMuso> Cool.
<rickspencer3> I guess there was a big round of reviews on the packaging, and this sent dobey back to relayout the bzr branches and such
<rickspencer3> also, DXE hasn't quite published their plan for Karmic ...
<rickspencer3> but they are doing a new FUSA to be compatible with new gdm
<robert_ancell> Is that FUSA going upstream?
<rickspencer3> so kenvandine is in charge of getting gdm-new and the new Fusa into the archive soon, and smoothley
<TheMuso> Cool
 * TheMuso notes his activity report is not yet on that pagre.
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell: well, it's open source, so if they want it, however, I think it's kind of a replacement, so the intention was not to be a new upstream FUSA (so far as I can tell)
<rickspencer3> TheMuso: right, I haven't copied those over yet, I'll get to it before I leave, don't worry
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, I ask because I did some work on the fusa package and it is full of Ubuntu patches and doesn't seem to be worked on upstream.  So it would be good if this can replace the existing upstream project
 * TheMuso is not worried.
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell: ok, please bring that up with seb128
<robert_ancell> will do
<rickspencer3> thanks
<rickspencer3> ACTION: robert_ancell to discuss upstream of DXE FUSA applet wtih seb128 and kenvandine
<rickspencer3> Kubuntu ...
<rickspencer3> first, they have a bootable usb drive making tool now, so they can make netbook images
<rickspencer3> second, those images aren't actually tweaked for netbooks yet, but the package of netbook settings is created, it just needs the settings
<rickspencer3> so your netbook can be Kubutulicious in a matter of a couple of weeks, I'm guessing
<awe> cool
<rickspencer3> third, their was some discussion regarding Kubuntu and web browsers
<rickspencer3> Arora is the new KDE default browser, but they can't just remove conqi because they are afraid of backlash and such
<TheMuso> I assume that uses webkit.
<awe> correct
<rickspencer3> TheMuso: yes, I believe Arora does
<rickspencer3> but not Konqueror
<rickspencer3> so in terms of x, they are still ahead on merges, and KMS is on by default, but not causing a big spike in bugs
<TheMuso> Yeah I know konq didn't.
<rickspencer3> there are some x freezes associated with suspend/resume, though
 * TheMuso should test his hardware to be sure all is ok.
<rickspencer3> it looks like translations are moving along ok
<rickspencer3> then we had a big discussion about PPAs versus Archives
<rickspencer3> essentially, there has been a tendency lately to put new stuff into PPAs instead of into Karmic universe
<rickspencer3> this has caused some unpredictability around scheduling ... as it is less clear when something has "landed", and
<TheMuso> right
<Riddell> I may reconsider the konqueror issue, depends on the reaction from upstream on changing browser, there's a definate appetite for moving to something newer now
<rickspencer3> it also means that we are all developing on difference configurations
<rickspencer3> hi Riddell!
<rickspencer3> Do you guys have anything in PPAs that are bound for universe or main?
<rickspencer3> or know of anything?
<awe> nope
<robert_ancell> no
<TheMuso> Well pulse may be tested in a PPA, but it may just go straight to karmic.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso: please discuss with pitti when he wakes up
<rickspencer3> in essence, we are preferring to go strait to Karmic
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: He already asked me about it.
<rickspencer3> heh
<rickspencer3> and?
<TheMuso> Well it requires yet another dependency in main before it can go in.
<TheMuso> SO short term, it will be PPA, till we get the new dependency into main.
<Riddell> KDE 4.3 RC 1 is in PPA and being uploaded to main
<rickspencer3> I see
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> TheMuso: please focus on moving it into main as fast as reasonably possible
<rickspencer3> Riddell: ok
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: I will, gotta get it packaged first.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso: understood
<rickspencer3> The point is that we should strive to not things languish in PPAs, the sooner they get into archives the better
<TheMuso> Yep.
<rickspencer3> so we shouldn't feel a false sense of security if something is in a PPA
<rickspencer3> (this is a general point, not directed specifically at Pulse Audio)
<rickspencer3> speaking of PPAs - gdm-new
 * TheMuso nods.
<rickspencer3> if you can, please test it from the desktop team ppa
<rickspencer3> similarly, please set up asac's mozilla security updates ppa so those can be tested as well when they are available
<rickspencer3> here's a link to the mozilla ppa: https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mozilla-security/+archive/ppa
<rickspencer3> do you guys have any agenda items?
<TheMuso> No.
<robert_ancell> no
<awe> No, I do want to follow up with TheMuso afterwards re: my review of his spec...
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> thanks guyses!
<awe> thanks
<TheMuso> awe: Ok, sounds good. As I said, I don't understand the volume scaling stuff at all.
<awe> TheMuso: I have a fair large amount of comments for you... should I add email them to you, or add them to the blueprint whiteboard?
<awe> TheMuso: I think from what I heard at UDS, the volume scaling would be solved by using the Pulse volume control and leaving the ALSA volume fixed
<awe> at least that's what I thought I heard Daniel say
<TheMuso> awe: Right, add them to the whiteboard is probably the best, so then everyone else like dtchen then sees them.
<awe> ok
<awe> One thing's that's confusing is whether I comment on the Blueprint, the Specification or both?
<TheMuso> awe: Thanks
<awe> np
<TheMuso> Well I wasn't the one who proposed the blueprint/spec for karmic, so I don't know.
<TheMuso> TO me, audio is one of those things that requires ongoing maintenance, and when things are made to work upstream, we get them to work in Ubuntu.
<TheMuso> i.e doesn't really require a spec.
<TheMuso> but I'll go with what has been asked for. *sighs*
<awe> ok
<awe> I'll just go ahead and add to the whiteboard as you suggested...
<TheMuso> Thanks.
<pitti> Good morning
<robert_ancell> hey pitti.  Do you know the status of GNOME 3 in Ubuntu?
<pitti> robert_ancell: seb and a few others are packaging gnome-shell and zeitgeist
<robert_ancell> pitti, are there packages available?
<pitti> robert_ancell: as for the library deprecation, seb works on some smaller issues (droppling libglade, etc.), there were some 2 uploads for this
<pitti> robert_ancell: no idea, I'm afraid; zeitgeist does have pacakges somewhere
<robert_ancell> pitti, also, do you remember a gnome-scan discussion at UDS? What was the outcome/
<pitti> robert_ancell: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-karmic-gnomescan
<pitti> robert_ancell: this says to switch
<pitti> robert_ancell: however, I hope that current upstream versions are better than what we have in karmic
<pitti> the latter is absolutely useless
<robert_ancell> pitti, I just bought a scanner today and xsane is not great
<pitti> robert_ancell: I know, but try gnome-scan
<pitti> you can't even get the job done with it :)
<pitti> robert_ancell: gscan2pdf is pretty good, but it was deemed too complex
<robert_ancell> pitti, I just tried it then and it does the scan but doesn't show anything :(
<pitti> well, it has the workflow the wrong way around, no possibility to rotate or fix the brightness/gamma, etc.
<robert_ancell> pitti, yes, gscan2pdf does seem to work the best for me
<robert_ancell> thanks
<pitti> hey seb128
<seb128> hey pitti!
<ajmitch> hi seb128
<seb128> hi ajmitch, it has been a while, how are you?
<ajmitch> I'm good :)
 * ajmitch has been around a bit lately :)
<seb128> yeah I noticed some uploads from you
<ajmitch> I made some spare time :)
<seb128> good!
<pitti> hey ajmitch
 * seb128 wonders why pitti apologized on the list
<seb128> I start having enough of those mono wars there, they discussed the topic enough by now you could think
<pitti> right, and I sort of threw the gauntlet again
<pitti> "Never argue with an idiot. They bring you down to their level, then beat you with experience."
<pitti> (completely ramdon quote which just came to my mind)
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> random, too
<seb128> I like it ;-)
 * ajmitch understands your frustration :)
<seb128> I just ignore those guys nowadays
<seb128> especially the ones saying "I'm switching distro if you don't do what I want"
<ajmitch> they sometimes provide amusement
<ajmitch> current set of karmic packages are safe to run at the moment, aren't they?
<TheMuso> seb128: Hi again. Just a heads up, if you use an NVIDIA card with X, the nvidia-180 drivers don't seem to build against 2.6.31 currently, so you may have to hold off your sound test with 2.6.31 if you use NVIDIA, at least till the dkms package is fixed.
<pitti> ajmitch: really current current, with gdm fixed, yes
 * ajmitch tends to upgrade by picking & choosing in synaptic, and saw the gdm issues yesterday
 * TheMuso found that out today when wanting to test 2.6.31 with something else.
<seb128> TheMuso, I'm using an intel card and sounds seem to be back after daily upgrades so maybe it was some other issues in the udev changes or something or resetting the pulseaudio, etc config made it work not sure
<mvo> hey ajmitch, nice to see you
<TheMuso> seb128: ok no problem then, good to hear you're back up and running with sound.
<TheMuso> ...and on that note...
 * TheMuso is outa here.
<ajmitch> hi mvo
<pitti> TheMuso: sleep well
<pitti> seb128: \o/
<seb128> bye TheMuso
 * pitti tosses some â© âª â« to seb128
<seb128> pitti, ;-)
 * ajmitch shouldn't get sucked into reading debian-devel 'discussions'
<seb128> what are they discussing now?
<ajmitch> ia32-apt-get, or how not to do multiarch
<seb128> I'm not reading debian-devel nowadays
<ajmitch> probably wise
<ajmitch> I was bored today & wondered what they were talking about in #debian-devel
<pitti> seb128: btw, didn't MacSlow send a g-p-m patch recently? I thought you wanted to sponsor it?
<seb128> is synaptic crashing for other people too in karmic when using the menu item to start it?
<seb128> pitti, not sure, I don't do gpm, I sponsored notify-osd and g-s-d
<pitti> ah, ok
<seb128> I'm not subscribed to gpm bugs
<pitti> will get it out from my mail archive then
<pitti> seb128: btw, does new gdm still start for you?
<seb128> it shouldn't?
<pitti> seb128: it fails with "not the default WM" for me
<pitti> $ cat /etc/X11/default-display-manager
<seb128> gra
<pitti> /usr/sbin/gdm
<pitti> but the init script compares that to "/usr/sbin/gdm-binary"
<seb128> yeah I changed that in my upload yesterday
<pitti> I don't know how it was before this morning's upgrade, I'm afraid
<seb128> I hate this thing
<pitti> (it worked until yesterday)
<seb128> because of the
<seb128> 	SSD_ARG="--exec $DAEMON"
<seb128> "restart" didn''t work otherwise
<robert_ancell> hi seb128
<seb128> hey robert_ancell
<seb128> robert_ancell, had a good day today?
<seb128> robert_ancell, when do you fly to desktop summit?
<robert_ancell> seb128, administration day today.  I fly out tomorrow so I've bought a printer/scanner and did my paperwork I've been putting off. Wrote my GUADEC lightning talk too
<seb128> what will you talk about?
<robert_ancell> "practical part-time refactoring".  It's describes what I think is a good way to get into GNOME based on my experiences in gcalctool;
<mvo> seb128: is synaptic crashing or gksu?
<didrocks> good morning everyone o/
<seb128> mvo, dunno, it doesn't open
<mvo> seb128: could you please run "gksu id" in a term?
<seb128> gksu synaptic in a g-t works correctly
<robert_ancell> Hey pitti, can you look at bug 195737 and bug 221698 again?  They both have LP branches - should I add more information to upload requests than that?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 195737 in compiz-fusion-plugins-main "Make window open animation the same as close animation (glide 2)" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/195737
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 221698 in compiz "Cannot resize window taller than screen (inconsistent with metacity)" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/221698
<seb128> but not from gnome-panel apparently
<mvo> seb128: how strange, anything in .xsession-errors ?
<seb128> mvo, "sudo: sorry, a password is required to run sudo" in .xsession-errors
<pitti> robert_ancell: ah, thanks for marking that other one as a dup; clear enough now
<seb128> mvo, oh now it breaks in a g-t too
<seb128> $ gksu synaptic
<pitti> robert_ancell: fine for me now
<seb128> sudo: sorry, a password is required to run sudo
<seb128> $ gksu id
<seb128> sudo: sorry, a password is required to run sudo
<ajmitch> heh
<seb128> mvo, ^ is gksu bog
<mvo> seb128: I thought so :)
<robert_ancell> pitti, should I merge the two changes in BZR into one release?
<mvo> seb128: let me have a look
<pitti> robert_ancell: how else did you do it?
<seb128> mvo, I get the issue on my laptop since yesterday and on my desktop now
<robert_ancell> pitti, there's two UNRELEASED entries in lp:~compiz/compiz/ubuntu
<pitti> robert_ancell: right, please merge them into one
<mvo> seb128: thanks, I can reproduce it now here
<robert_ancell> pitti, done
<robert_ancell> seb128, do you know if the DXE fusa work is going to be the upstream fusa solution? i.e. replacing the existing fusa releases?
<seb128> robert_ancell, upstream has fusa in gdm now but dxteam wrote a new applet apparently rather than changing this one
<robert_ancell> seb128, So the one in http://ftp.acc.umu.se/pub/GNOME/sources/fast-user-switch-applet/ is deprecated?
<ajmitch> NIH, or because the other one would have needed too much work?
<seb128> robert_ancell, yes
<mvo> seb128: yeah, it looks like gksu has changed the way it calls sudo in a strange way
 * mvo wonders if its releated to the gtkbuilder patch from seb128 ;)
 * seb128 slaps mvo
 * mvo hides
<didrocks> is there a kind archive admin to accept new libgirepository1 binary package, part of gobject-introspection? :)
<seb128> didrocks, doing
<didrocks> btw, is there a page listing all new binary built and waiting for acceptance (I saw that: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gobject-introspection/0.6.3-0ubuntu1/+build/1100440)
<didrocks> thanks seb128 ;)
<robert_ancell> seb128, are there any gnome-shell .debs around?
<seb128> robert_ancell, gnagnagna
<robert_ancell> seb128, :P I have all day to think up questions for you
<seb128> robert_ancell, working on it, cf didrocks gobject-introspection request ;-)
<hyperair> ooh gnome shell =O
<seb128> I did upload gjs to the ubuntu-desktop ppa yesterday
<robert_ancell> cool
<seb128> ie we are on it but there is a chain of depends to tackle
<seb128> want to do some of the work? ;-)
<ajmitch> didrocks: something like launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+queue ?
<seb128> didrocks, no, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+queue has the list of binaries
<didrocks> so, when libgirepository1 will be accepted, gir-repository will be able to build, and so clutter 0.9.4 will be built to \o/
<didrocks> then, mutter is for me :)
<robert_ancell> seb128, I would say yes but I'm about to go travelling.  I can have a look if I've got some spare time in GUADEC
<didrocks> seb128, ajmitch: ok, it's packages with NEW state, right? (so, New doesn't corresponds to "new uploads"
<pitti> didrocks: need some NEWing?
<seb128> robert_ancell, I said rick I would have it in a ppa before GUADEC so thanks
<seb128> pitti, I'm on it
<didrocks> pitti: seb128 is on it :)
<ajmitch> yeah, NEW binaries/source
<seb128> didrocks, newed to universe
<didrocks> ok, thanks. didn't notice the icon difference at first glance :)
<didrocks> thanks seb128. Let's wait for the toolchain to be built so.
<seb128> didrocks, you have local builds no? ;-)
<ajmitch> that reminds me, I have a critical sync bug to get filed :)
 * seb128 learnt a new trick
<seb128> dput ppa:...
<didrocks> seb128: yes, I built them yesterday with that. But I'm currently at work and will be busy this morning ;)
<seb128> didrocks, ok
<pitti> seb128: you mean there's a way to do that without adding all of them to ~/.dputrc?
<pitti> .dput.cf, rather
<seb128> pitti, yes, "dput ppa:user/ppa_name .changes"
<seb128> pitti, doesn't require any dput config
<pitti> nice
<pitti> for your favourite one it's still a bit too verbose, but good to know
<didrocks> ok. I know what I will test this evening :)
<seb128> pitti, ie https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ppa the first line
<ajmitch> seb128: it works for team PPAs?
<ajmitch> useful
 * pitti grrrs at heisenbugs
<seb128> ajmitch, yes
<pitti> does anyone else have http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=585228 ?
<ubottu> Gnome bug 585228 in gnome-power-manager "immediately suspends on startup when lid is closed" [Major,Unconfirmed]
<pitti> as soon as I start gnome-power-manager --verbose in the foreground, it doesn't happen any more
 * ajmitch *still* hasn't upgraded his laptop from hardy :)
<seb128> my laptop never suspended on lid close, is that a setting to configure?
<pitti> seb128: it's the current g-p-m default
<seb128> not for me
<pitti> and what's annoying is that it happens in gdm
<pitti> hm
<pitti> ah, it coudl be due to dk-power d-bus activation
<seb128> I close the lid all the team when I move between rooms
<seb128> team -> time
<pitti> seb128: I keep it closed when docked
<seb128> and my laptop just lock screen
<seb128> when docked I just suspend using the GNOME menu entry
<pitti> seb128: that should be local gconf, though
<pitti> since gdm has its own, it should happen there
<pitti> I set it to "ignore" lid events on AC as well for my account
<seb128> let me boot my laptop and try
<pitti> hah
<pitti> seb128: nevermind, I found it
<seb128> ok
<pitti> it's not a heisenbug, it's devkit-power sending a "lid event" when it's activated
<pitti> even if the lid doesn't change
<seb128> iz kit bog
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> well, that, or g-p-m bug
<pitti> but at least --verbose output says the right thing now
<seb128> iz pitti bug in any case ;-)
<pitti> seb128: right, I just wondered if I was going mad
<robert_ancell> bye all
<didrocks> seb128: I don't remember if I have to retry when the status is "Dependency wait" or just wait for a cron
<seb128> didrocks, just wait
<didrocks> thanks
<seb128> didrocks, the publisher take a while, those should be available in 15 minutes or so
<seb128> pitti, wb
<pitti> my server is offline, seems that the hosting DC lost the interweb tube
<seb128> again?
<seb128> that's twice in a week now
<pitti> last time they did some hardware maintenance
<seb128> the ppa publishing is fast nowadays
<seb128> pitti, ok, the gdm default manager things is fixed in the ppa now
<pitti> seb128: rock, thanks
<seb128> binaries are published and available by normal apt upgrade
<pitti> seb128: publishing> indeed, it's a breeze
<seb128> hum
<seb128> there is another annoying upgrade issue there
<seb128> the fusa applet doesn't work after upgrade
<didrocks> seb128: I remembered that when I tried KDM, fusa applet was crashing when launching GNOME
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - thats a known issue. quite a few users complain about that
<seb128> re
<seb128> didrocks, gir built now
<seb128> lut huats
<huats> hello seb128 !
<huats> how are you ?
<seb128> huats, good, and you?
<huats> good too !
<seb128> the weather is getting too warm for my taste though
<huats> seb128: please don't mention the weather
<huats> i can't stand the warm :)
<huats> (well that kind of warm...)
<huats> and I am not going to the GUADEC... imagine what you are about to live :P
<seb128> should be fine
<seb128> grand canary is an island the forecast says 24Â°C with some wind there
<seb128> it's cooler than the continual weather there
<huats> and theer is the sea... which helps A LOT !
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> and ice cream too in case it's hot ;-)
<huats> :)
<huats> LOL
<dpm> pitti: we're having a translations meeting tomorrow, and I'd like to tell translators what's currently happening around translations. I've been following bug #123020 and I think this would be a good thing to comment. Can I explain them the following:
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 123020 in soyuz "support shipping verbatim files in the exported tarballs" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/123020
<dpm> 1) There's work in progress in getting the GNOME help files in language packs
<dpm> 2) This will _probably_ be done for Karmic
<dpm> 3) At this point this will only be a LiveCD space-saving feature, since the xml to PO (import) and PO to xml (langpack export) conversion will still have to be done manually.
<pitti> dpm: hi
<pitti> dpm: s/LiveCD/CD/ (applies to alternate, too), otherwise correct
<pitti> dpm: we will only copy the verbatim bits, no xml <-> po conversion for now
<pitti> that requires proper rosetta support
<pitti> brb, rebooting
<dpm> pitti: hi :), thanks
<dpm> pitti: ok, yes, that's what I meant with point 3), I should have probably formulated it better. I'll add the item to the agenda, then
<seb128> doh, even pitti start using quilt now
<hyperair> quilt > *
<mvo> *grumpf* I I finally found the problem with gksu, how anoying
<seb128> mvo, you rock!
<seb128> mvo, tell me it's not the gtkbuilder changes ;-)
<pitti> seb128: well, just so that Michael Biebl doesn't kill me after my first commits to pkg-utopia :)
<pitti> seb128: but compared to the pain of git, quilt is just worth a shallow "oh"
<seb128> btw speaking about git how do you add a file and make it been listed in git diff too?
<mvo> seb128: the new forkpty() behaviour and sudo tty_tickets do not work togetether
<pitti> I shouldn't have to use patches in the first place
<seb128> git add newfile; git diff lists nothing
<pitti> but with git-buildpackage at least there seems to be no way to cherrypick patches from trunk properly
<pitti> seb128: ah
<pitti> seb128: "git diff" does not what you think
<crevette> git diff HEAD^ ?
<pitti> it shows the diff between the current index and the source
<pitti> crevette: oh, so that's it?
 * crevette is always lost with git diff
<pitti> I always use "git commit -v" and cancel
<crevette> pitti, I admit I didn't look deeply in the doc, as the man page is quite complicated, (you must know a lot of details of git inner to understand it)
<hyperair> git diff and git diff --cached
<hyperair> git diff shows the difference between your working tree and the index, git diff --cached shows the difference between HEAD and the index
<seb128> hyperair, can I have both in the same command?
<pitti> crevette: hah, tell me about it
<hyperair> seb128: git diff HEAD
<hyperair> i think
<crevette> git is teh pain
<seb128> git is really the suck to use
<seb128> it's a shame that GNOME picked this one
<hyperair> better than bzr =p
<pitti> I still didn't learn (and don't want to) all those concepts of heads, index, origins, checkouts, intra-tree branches, and how the heck to get a branch ssh'ed over there (i. e. bzr push)
<seb128> bzr add && bzr diff does what you expect though
<hyperair> because bzr doesn't have a staging area
<pitti> the fun thing is that even the folks who have used git for a long time don't know how to get git push working :)
<seb128> I don't care about a staging area
<crevette> pitti, I just had a basic usage as I wrote some patch for GNOME, but nothing fancu
<crevette> fancy
<pitti> hyperair: bzr shelve
<seb128> I want to checkout, do changes and see my changes
<hyperair> pitti: isn't that the same as git stash?
<pitti> anyway, we had enough of them
<pitti> (flamewars, I mean)
<pitti> hyperair: quite possibly
<hyperair> yeah so it's not the staging area after all =\
<pitti> but the index concept is so utterly confusing, and not really necessary either
<seb128> seems git users are rather interested in how the tool can do tricky things than in getting work done easily
<hyperair> i don't like that bzr has so goddamn many repository formats, all of which are incompatible with one another
<crevette> git stash is for on-going patch that break a rebase from I understood
<hyperair> i've had a few repositories turn unmergeable because of that
<hyperair> stupid bzr
<hyperair> crevette: no, git stash is to stash away your changes and return to a clean tree to do something else.
<crevette> git stash put your change is a temporary place, and you can re-apply with a git pop
<hyperair> git stash apply
<didrocks> so as bzr shelve
<hyperair> bzr doesn't have the staging area
<hyperair> either way, i don't really use it much. i commit with git ci -av
<seb128> I'm not sure what a staging area is and why I would want one
<pitti> hyperair: no staging area> that's a feature :)
<seb128> I usually checkout, commit commit commit, push somewhere for review
<hyperair> you can pretty much do that with git too
<hyperair> i like how git repositories are pretty much standardized
<seb128> what the vcs does is implementation details I don't want to care about
<pitti> hyperair: (honest question) do you know how to push a branch to my server, in a way that works?
<hyperair> instead of bzr godknows what knit rich root poor root whatever formats
<hyperair> pitti: push a bzr branch or a git branch?
<pitti> hyperair: the best answer for that so far was "git prune; git gc; rsync -r .git myserver:public_html/git/stuff"
<seb128> hyperair, git, bzr is easy, bzr push location ;-)
<pitti> hyperair: with git (with bzr, it's just "bzr push bzr+ssh://myserver/dir")
<pitti> hyperair: but with that prune/gc/rsync, I still can't push to that branch again
<hyperair> pitti: i think you need to initialize a bare repository first, even in the case of bzr.
<pitti> hyperair: bare repo> no, tried that, doesn't work
<hyperair> pitti: prune and gc are just to reduce what you need to transfer
<pitti> hyperair: (and that's not necessary with bzr; it just works)
<hyperair> yeah, it just transfers evry damn thing
<pitti> anyway, I read docs and tried several recipes after 1.5 hours, then I just gave up and used the usual patch/git add/git commit pain
<pitti> and mailed patches around
<Laney> Pidgin 2.5.8
<hyperair> pitti: chances are you want to push more than once, so you just add the remote first: git remote add origin myserver:public_html/git/stuff.git, then you do git push --all origin
<Laney> (libpurple 2.5.8)
<Laney> \o/
<hyperair> pitti: the pain is only when you don't know how to use it. the learning curve is steep as hell, but once you understand it, it's hard to look back.
<pitti> hyperair: right, that's what I meant; it's a tool which is written for people who want to learn it inside out, not for the casual developer who wants to work on source :(
<pitti> instead of git
<seb128> I still not get why people fancy a tool hard to learn when you have much easier alternative doing all the common tasks you need as well, but shrug
<hyperair> seb128: because the tool is awesome once you understand it.
<hyperair> seb128: because once you do know how to use it, it is that much better than other, easier tools.
<crevette> and git is perhaps the tool for hardcore developers? not for casual hacker
<seb128> I don't care about how the tool is awesome, I want to checkout, commit commit commit, push somewhere
<pitti> the only real advantage that I see is speed
<hyperair> same question as why do people use vim instead of nano
<seb128> and any modern vcs allows that
<pitti> but for almost all projects that doesn't matter
<hyperair> pitti: size.
<pitti> hyperair: I don't care
<pitti> git is huge, sure, but even that I don't mind
<pitti> (git trees, I mean)
<hyperair> pitti: i recovered somewhere around 1G by shoving every thing into git from bzr.
<seb128> hyperair, I don't see how it can be better than bzr for checkout, commit, push which is all I need
<hyperair> pitti: granted, i had a bunch of tarballs lying around that got shoved into git as well
<pitti> my projects are in the 50 to 500 KB range, I don't care at all about speed or size
<hyperair> seb128: if that's all you need, and are sure you don't need any more, then no, it's no better than bzr.
<seb128> hyperair, and all what 99% of people need with easy merging and some other things which are available in any vcs
<pitti> obviously git is very good at handling kernel trees, and bzr sucks for that
<hyperair> seb128: i found git merging much smoother than bzr's.
<pitti> but 95% of the projects out there aren't kernel sized
<hyperair> seb128: at the very least, i didn't have to worry about repository incompatibilities
<pitti> hm
<seb128> hyperair, I usually bzr merge, review, commit
<pitti> last time I merged, it utterly failed
<pitti> I ended up having to format-patch there, and git patch/git add/git commit (times 10)
<seb128> hyperair, you seem to focus on this format issue, I never got bitten by that though, no reason the format should change in a set up repository
 * pitti STFU now
<hyperair> i got bitten MANY times.
<hyperair> so many that i switched to git
<pitti> hyperair: let's agree to disagree
<hyperair> indeed
<pitti> you won't ever convince me, and apparently I won't convince you :)
<seb128> good the poppler guys merged my patch to use gtkbuilder
<seb128> one less libglade depends for karmic ;-)
<pitti> hah, Richard ack'ed my devkit-power patch to fix the "immediately suspends" issue \o/
<hyperair> pitti: a year or so ago, you would have. rather, i read the docs and was convinced to use bzr. then the format issue bit my ass so many times that i switched to git, and am happy to say i'm not going back.
<hyperair> pitti: pristine-tar rocks, by the way.
<pitti> hyperair: pristine-tar> *nod* (that exists for both systems)
<hyperair> pitti: yeah it does. but where does it store the .delta files for bzr?
<pitti> I don't use it for my projects, but pkg-utopia does, and it's quite an interesting idea
<hyperair> pitti: in git, it just dumps it into the tree under the "pristine-tar" branch.
<pitti> hyperair: I don't know (and I don't care :) )
<hyperair> it's pretty awesome for package maintainenace i must say =p
<hyperair> rather than 10s of tarballs, you just have a VCS and pristine-tar deltas
<pitti> right
 * hyperair wonders where bdefreese has gone.
<hyperair> nautilus-share needs a sponsor into debian =\
<Laney> ask ajmitch!
<hyperair> he's a DD?
<seb128> when will debian accept source uploads...
<Laney> yes
<hyperair> doesn't it?
 * Laney plays with the new bzr branches
<pitti> hyperair: no, you always have to upload a set of binaries alongside
<Laney> what happens if you upload _source.changes?
 * hyperair patiently waits for git-bzr to enter the archives
<Laney> will dak reject it?
<hyperair> hmm that doesn't sound nice =\
<seb128> I would sponsor some uploads otherwise
<hyperair> the binaries get thrown away anyway, dont' they?
<Laney> no
<seb128> but I don't have a current debian unstable install to build binaries
<hyperair> seb128: pbuilder!
<seb128> no the binaries you upload are the one available on the mirrors
<Laney> pbuilder-dist sid create
<seb128> which means that if you have experimental packages, etc you can screw builds easily
<seb128> I know how to use pbuilder
<Laney> :)
<seb128> the issue is how much daily download you have to do
<hyperair> i don't have much =\
<seb128> ie I'm rsyncing daily karmic CD now and it will saturate my download for 2 hours still
<hyperair> oh
<hyperair> heh
<seb128> then I dist-upgrade karmic and it's one extra hour
<seb128> and it's lag so much that I can't triage bugs
<seb128> I don't fancy putting my internet in lag mode for an another hour only to update a sid pbuilder
 * hyperair thinks living on campus with a server on LAN is awesome =p
<seb128> I would be happy to test nautilus-share on karmic and do a source upload to debian though
<seb128> but since that's not possible you will have to find another sponsor
<Laney> so yeah, does dak actually reject it?
<seb128> source uploads are not accepted no
<hyperair> what's the point of taking source updates anyway =\
<hyperair> what if i build nautilus-share for you?
<seb128> sources update means you have less to upload and you are sure that the build is made on a clean install
<seb128> I could build on karmic and upload to debian and the binary would depends on gtk 2.17 which is not in debian
<hyperair> mmhmm
<Laney> what is the rationale? buildd time?
<seb128> no they basically argue that it forces maintainer to test build before uploading
<seb128> ie you can't upload something which obvious ftbfs
<seb128> it's sort of a wrong technical solution to a social issue
<Laney> nothing like a bit of trust eh
<hyperair> heh yeah
<Laney> it does solve some edge problems though i.e. bootstrapping
<seb128> any lunch time
<seb128> bbl
<Laney> k
<seb128> Laney, not really since you upload binaries for one arch only
<seb128> it will still need to build on the buildds for other architectures
<hyperair> arch=all stuff =p
<seb128> right
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> anyway, pidgin diff is up
<Laney> lunch and travelling to the office, bbl
<seb128> Laney, thanks, I will review that after lunch
<seb128> bbl
<hyperair> Laney: by the way, you might be interested to know that the geany plugins have merged and will soon release (i just have to testbuild and tag the release)
<seb128> didrocks, clutter-0.9 building now
<didrocks> seb128: thanks for noticing :-) I will have some time now to dedicate to mutter.
<pitti> seb128: ugh, what downstream do you have?
<Laney> hyperair: merged how?
<hyperair> Laney: geany-plugins-0.17.tar.gz
<seb128> pitti, my dsl? 1024,256
<pitti> seb128: ugh, poor you
<Laney> hyperair: oh, so all of the other source packages now go away?
<hyperair> mmhmm
<Laney> fun
<hyperair> not all
<hyperair> geanyprj didn't get merged
<hyperair> not all of them joined
<hyperair> but most did
<Laney> i see
<Laney> any progress on debian?
<seb128> pitti, well it's ok to do daily karmic updates, but not for updating karmic, debian, jaunty, iso download, etc
<hyperair> Laney: got sponsor, but we decided to wait for geany-plugins to release.
<Laney> \o/
<hyperair> =)
<mvo> seb128: new libgksu should fix the problem, pleae le tme know (but I'm off for lunch now)
<Laney> what is this super-l email about?
<crevette> I thought it was a spam
<crevette> :)
<Laney> I have no idea what the original problem is
<Laney> is it just a nutjob?
<chrisccoulson> i thought the same thing
<chrisccoulson> it seems a bit wierd
<seb128> mvo, cool, I will test when it's available
<seb128> Laney, what email?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - it's another mail on u-d-d ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, weird I didn't receive it, maybe it has been tagged as spam on the way there
<chrisccoulson> quite possibly. i thought it was spam when i first opened it but then couldnt work out whether the poster was being serious or not
<chrisccoulson> and i was still half-asleep when i read it!
<rodrigo_> seb128: can't I use 'debian/tmp/*' in *.install files?
<seb128> rodrigo_, you can, why?
<rodrigo_> seb128: it fails with no files found, but 'make install' installed them
<rodrigo_> seb128: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/28596352/buildlog_ubuntu-karmic-lpia.evolution-couchdb_0.1.1-7_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<seb128> where is the source package?
<rodrigo_> seb128: in https://launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/+archive/ppa
<seb128> rodrigo_, you have only one binary, it does a make install directory to evolution-couchdb there is no .install
<seb128> rodrigo_, the .install are required when you have several binaries to say what goes where
<rodrigo_> ah, ok, so with no .install file it would just include everything it installed?
<seb128> rodrigo_, you might override that in the rules and say to install to tmp and move things if you really want though
<seb128> rodrigo_, yes when there is only one deb built the default is to ship everything
<rodrigo_> ok, cool
<seb128> ie make install to debian/binary
 * rodrigo_ feels he's almost there :)
<seb128> ;-)
<Laney> the email was to ubuntu-desktop
<seb128> oh, I got this one and marked it as read without reading it apparently
<seb128> the title probably inspired me in my morning cleaning ;-)
<Laney> what's it about? anything?
<seb128> it seems long and boring I'm not really interested to read it to say ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, there is a new gnome-session, interested by doing the update?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i can do the gnome-session update
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks
<chrisccoulson> no problem
<rickspencer3> didrocks: howdy
<pitti> Mr. Spencer!
<rickspencer3> hi pitti
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi seb128
<seb128> rickspencer3, when do you start traveling to desktop summit?
<rickspencer3> seb128: late morning
<seb128> mvo, just tested your libgksu update that fixes the issue!
<kenvandine> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> after I finish slurping my coffee, I'll pack, and then pull some code
<rickspencer3> then I'm off
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, is quickly all ready for your talk?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine: the coding part is
<rickspencer3> it would be cool if I could demo packaging and/or releasing, but that's not too important
<didrocks> rickspencer3: hey rick!
<rickspencer3> didrocks: I pimped out https://code.edge.launchpad.net/quickly a little bit
<didrocks> rickspencer3: yes, with a new logo :D
<rickspencer3> I'm going to pull in the next hour so, do  you have code to push before I leave?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: I wanted to try to finish quickly release tonight if "mutter" doesn't give hard time :)
<rickspencer3> didrocks: I put the svg file in with the ubuntu-project template, so feel free to make the logo better
<didrocks> rickspencer3: will you be able to pull when arriving to GUADEC?
<rickspencer3> didrocks: yes, for sure I'll pull every day :)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: I will try to not push too many thing so that you don't have the "demo effect" :)
<didrocks> just finish nice stuff in quickly release
<mvo> seb128: excellent, I send a mail to kov discussing the issue, I think its a design problem with the latest code, but I'm curious to hear his opinion
<didrocks> rickspencer3: if you want to get ride off all the config, you can remove ~/.quickly-data (it's where cache and crendentials are stored)
<rickspencer3> didrocks: go ahead and push!
<rickspencer3> I can roll back if there's a problem
<seb128> mvo, ok cool
<didrocks> rickspencer3: ok. Not at home currently. I will do this tonight. So, when you will be already in your plane :)
<rickspencer3> didrocks: right ... I'll work on the tutorial code and the tutorial, and on the template ...
<rickspencer3> so we shouldn't have any conflicts to merge
 * rickspencer3 hates merging conflicts
<didrocks> rickspencer3: yes, I saw it gave you hard time. Next time, let me merge it (I have a bzr branch in my server)
<rickspencer3> didrocks: :)
<mvo> geser: re bug #384144 if you can rperoduce that easily, could you check if apport gets a backtrace ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 384144 in ubuntuone-storage-protocol "debian/copyright should mention GPL files" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/384144
<Mark__T> kenvandine: ping
<kenvandine> Mark__T, pong
<kenvandine> Mark__T, what's up man?
<Mark__T> will karmic have indicator-applet 0.2?
<kenvandine> yes
<Mark__T> Okay, SiDi sort of asked me on a different channel, so I thought, I make sure
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> Mark__T, how current is the snapshot in foresight?
<Mark__T> kenvandine:  latest revision
<kenvandine> ok
<Mark__T> 309
<geser> mvo: do you mean bug #385144? will try to get apport catch something
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 385144 in apt "apt-get dies with "E: Method http has died unexpectedly!"" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/385144
<SiDi> kenvandine: will it have libindicate in a non-gnome-dependant package ? ^.^
<mvo> geser: that is much appreciated - I tried it with squid on a tmpfs pbuilder here and I get a random hang for some seconds, but no crash
<mvo> yet
<mvo> geser: what kind of download rates you get with the cacher?
<dobey> pitti: hey. did you get a chance to look at ubuntuone-client ?
<geser> mvo: apt shows in the summary up to nearly 60 MB/s for downloading the build-depends for some packages I tried to build
<jcastro> rickspencer3: you leave today for GC right?
<rickspencer3> jcastro: yes
<rickspencer3> heading to the airport in a couple of hours, packing now
<mvo> geser: I suspect this is key to reproduce, I get only ~30 so far
<jcastro> rickspencer3: me too, what time do you get there locally? I get there 2pm Thursday local time
<rickspencer3> jcastro: are you flying from Madrid?
<pitti> dobey: on my list; I started reviewing last night, but then I just fell asleep
<jcastro> rickspencer3: yeah, AA6240
<mvo> geser: what is the package you get it with? or does it happen with multiple ones?
<pitti> dobey: it needs a couple of fixes such as the new python-ubuntuone-storage-backend dependency, and some other stuff I forgot (will do detailled review later)
<rickspencer3> jcastro: I'm getting in at 2:45 on spain air
<rickspencer3> maybe I'll see you at the airport in Madrid
<jcastro> ok
<jcastro> rickspencer3: it's only 45 minutes, I'll just wait for you at the GC airport
<jcastro> I have all the maps and stuff
<dobey> pitti: doh. i see i forgot a comma in one place
<pitti> dobey: there were some other lintian things as well
<pitti> dobey: do you use lintian? it's quite helpful
<dobey> it is not clear how to, and debuild doesn't seem to run it i guess
<pitti> it does
<pitti> you just need to install it
<dobey> it is installed
<SiDi> kenvandine: mind if i pm you ?
<pitti> hm, it's run by default after debuild -S or debuild -b
<kenvandine> SiDi, sure
<kenvandine> dobey, i saw it when i built it :)
<dobey> hrmm, then it must be very sparse in jaunty or something, because i ran debuild -S -sa to build the source package
<dobey> because i fixed the few things that were complained about in its output
<pitti> dobey: source package might be okay; the binary checks are (and can) only be run if you build binaries
<dobey> well i did a binary build as well to make sure i had the ${source:Version} bit correct because my memory was vague on it
<rickspencer3> jcastro: thanks
<rickspencer3> that would be really great
<rickspencer3> I'll try to meet up with you in Madrid too
<dobey> and it didn't complain about anything extra that seemed to warrant fixing (Original-Maintainer and Python-Version or something was all it mentioned)
<rodrigo_> seb128: another question :) to add a patch to a package, I just need to copy it to debian/patches, right?
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_ - it depends what patch system the package uses
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson: hmm, how do I find out?
<rodrigo_> it's got no patches right now, or do you mean something else?
<chrisccoulson> you could take a look in debian/rules. if it's got no patches already, then you might need to add a patch system in debian/rules
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson: how do I do that? (could you point me to some docs?)
 * seb128 kicks his isp today
<rodrigo_> oh, it already has: include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/simple-patchsys.mk
<rodrigo_> is that ok?
<seb128> rodrigo_, add a "include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/simple-patchsys.mk" in rules
<seb128> rodrigo_, then you can copy a patch in the patches directory and get it used automagically
<rodrigo_> ah ok
<rodrigo_> cool
<pitti> rickspencer3: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-karmic-automagic-python-build-system :)
<rickspencer3> pitti: wow!
<rickspencer3> lots of "DONE"!
<pitti> python-mkdebian now generates a working and reasonably policy compliant debian package from apport trunk
<pitti> all imports are correctly converted to Dependencies, etc.
<rickspencer3> I can't wait to try it on the ubuntu-project
<rickspencer3> wow!
<rickspencer3> that is so cool
<rickspencer3> I think we can use this for quickly itself!
<pitti> some stuff is still missing
<pitti> such as updating existing debian/control, test cases, proposing distutils extra base stuff as a PEP, etc.
<pitti> but it should be enough to get you going
<rickspencer3> right
<pitti> (test cases for debianization, that is; DistUtilsExtra.auto has full test coverage)
<rickspencer3> I should be able to create $quickly package fairly easily now
<pitti> shoudl be on archive.u.c. in 75 minutes
<pitti> or, if you want to try it now, lp:~python-distutils-extra-hackers/python-distutils-extra/debian
<geser> mvo: it happened with different ones, currently I'm reproducing it with camlimages
<geser> mvo: how do I get apport to pick something up? as apt doesn't really crash but exits with the message and return code 100
<pitti> eww, I suck
<mvo> geser: I thought it might crash, but if it does not I add some better error output and do a upload in some minutes
<rickspencer3> pitti: I'll pull, as I'm bringing a Jaunty machine to Gran Canaria (my eee)
<geser> mvo: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/207565/ that's what I get when I try to download the build-depends for camlimages
<mvo> geser: thanks, I try this now
<djsiegel> seb128 rickspencer3: We're getting no movement on this week's paper cuts, when you get a moment, can you take a look and let me know if any of them look particularly suited for any individual contributors? I can ping them (or you can) to try to get some of them looked at. https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+milestone/round-2
<seb128> djsiegel, I will have a look now but this week is not the best week to get work on those since a good part of the desktop people are travelling to the desktop summit
<djsiegel> seb128: right, including me
<djsiegel> :)
<seb128> djsiegel, it would be nice it you could update the description with the design suggestion
<seb128> djsiegel, it's not always easy to find the recommendation in the list of comments
<djsiegel> seb128: ok, I was wondering about that, if it was good or bad bug etiquette
<seb128> djsiegel, ie bug #23293 it's not clear what should be fone
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 23293 in nautilus "Nautilus windows should close on unmount" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/23293
<seb128> done
<geser> mvo: I get "E: ::ReadMessages returned false - pkgAcquire::Worker::ReadMessages (2 No such file or directory)" with your new apt
<mvo> geser: excellent, thanks a lot! could you please add the debug string I put in the report too ? (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apt/+bug/385144/comments/4) ?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 385144 in apt "apt-get dies with "E: Method http has died unexpectedly!"" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<mvo> geser: I also uploaded another apt with different debug output now
<mvo> geser: hm, you said the method exists with exit status 100 ?
<geser> mvo: yes, echo $? returns 100
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - would you mind adding some comments to my MOTU application when you have some spare time? :)
<geser> mvo: I've attached the apt output (with debugging) to the bug, trying ubuntu1.2 now
<seb128> chrisccoulson, that's on a wiki page right?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: me too, me too!
<djsiegel> pitti: The decision for now is to use glide-2 for open and close (https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/195737)
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 195737 in compiz-fusion-plugins-main "Make window open animation the same as close animation (glide 2)" [Wishlist,In progress]
<pitti> djsiegel: I saw, thanks; I'll sponsor that soon
<djsiegel> cool, thanks
<djsiegel> Not sure why those two bug reports got swizzled into one
<djsiegel> :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti, seb128 - the application is here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ChrisCoulson/MOTUApplication
<pitti> you mean "into two"?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok
<chrisccoulson> thanks:)
<geser> mvo: "E: ReadMessages: read return 0" with apt 0.7.21ubuntu1.2
<seb128> djsiegel, bug #372132 needs design recommendations
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 372132 in hundredpapercuts ""Create Document" Templates difficult to use" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/372132
<seb128> djsiegel, bug #387796 too
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 387796 in hundredpapercuts "Display icons in the "open with ..." list " [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/387796
<seb128> djsiegel, bug #390362 added to review queue it's probably for asac
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 390362 in hundredpapercuts "entering wep key to NM requires tabbing/clicking" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/390362
<seb128> djsiegel, bug #146918 needs design recommendations
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 146918 in update-notifier "Poor descriptions for some applications in Startup Programs window" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/146918
<seb128> djsiegel, bug #392292 needs design recommendations
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 392292 in hundredpapercuts "Tooltip of the search button[nautilus] is misleading" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/392292
<djsiegel> seb128: yes, I know
<seb128> djsiegel, well it seems to me that the design team should have made recommendations earlier than that if you want people to tackle those issues
<seb128> djsiegel, bugs are not being worked because there is no clear instructions on what need to be done on most of the bugs for this round
<djsiegel> seb128: that's true, I know. I don't think the design team is clear on their role. The idea isn't that all design on every bug would be done by the design team.
<djsiegel> seb128: before there was a canonical design team, weren't there people working on usability bugs?
<seb128> djsiegel, well, "descriptions are not good enough" requires an english speaking to suggest better wording for example
<seb128> djsiegel, not really, which is part of why those bugs have not been fixed yet ...
<seb128> speaking -> speaker
<djsiegel> seb128: I'm afraid 100 paper cuts will not be finished if people are waiting for one of the three or four of us on the design team looking at paper cuts to adjudicate on each one.
<seb128> djsiegel, ok so they will not be finished, fair enough
<djsiegel> seb128: we are putting the spotlight on these and helping user test the hard ones, but the operating assumption should not be that they are blocking until the design team weighs in.
<seb128> djsiegel, I'm not an english speaker and I don't know what would be better wording for those labels that what we have now for example
<djsiegel> Many of the bugs fixed so far have been fixed without design team suggestion
<djsiegel> seb128: ok, don't propose a solution for that bug then
<djsiegel> in fact, on bugs where someone from the design team has weighed in, it has slowed bug progress
<seb128> djsiegel, those I listed before are blocked on somebody having a clue about design making a recommendation
<seb128> well "Create Document" Templates difficult to use"
<djsiegel> ok, well, I am working on one right now
<seb128> take that one for example
<djsiegel> and I emailed the team to get moving
<seb128> great, why is it difficult?
<seb128> if it's open for 5 years that's a chance that the hackers don't find it difficult to use
<seb128> and will not make change if you don't suggest an easier way
<djsiegel> right, well, most of the time we agree with the proposed solution in the bug description/title
<djsiegel> if we need to restate that and say "this is the suggestion," we can do that
<seb128> same for bug #23293
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 23293 in nautilus "Nautilus windows should close on unmount" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/23293
<seb128> what else should it be doing?
<djsiegel> there are no perfect solutions
<seb128> ups, wrong bug number
<djsiegel> we are just looking for progress on some
<seb128> well there is some progresses
<seb128> the round-2 list has 1 fix commited, one patch waiting for upstream review and a bunch of in progress bugs
<seb128> djsiegel, bug #23293 I disagree with for example, it has been changed to do that because we were getting bugs from user saying that nautilus was crashing
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 23293 in nautilus "Nautilus windows should close on unmount" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/23293
<seb128> djsiegel, for users apparently "closing without action" == crashing
<djsiegel> seb128: reasonable, we could user test, but there is action
<djsiegel> ejecting
<seb128> well apparently users don't do the connection
<seb128> I can look for old bugs about that if that's of any use
<mvo> geser: many thanks \o/
<asac> awe: can you look at #390362 please
<asac> its a papercut bug. not sure what we want there or not.
<awe> asac: sure
<awe> I actually mentioned it to rick last night
<asac> awe: if you think it makes sense in general, we might want to apply it for now
<awe> it seems like a good fix, but I haven't looked at the patch closely yet
<asac> even if its useless in future
<awe> I'll take a look this afternoon.
<asac> thx
<seb128> djsiegel, ok, I've added ubuntu task for bugs which didn't have so the maintainers get notified and added some comments
<awe> np
<djsiegel> seb128: awesome, and I added a design suggestion: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/28602360/dialog.png
<seb128> cool
<pitti> good night everyone, time for dinner and Taekwondo
<chrisccoulson> good night pitti
<seb128> 'night pitti
<mvo> geser: I uploaded yet another apt with debug output :)
<seb128> asac, there?
<asac> seb128: yes
<seb128> asac, do you plan to ship libmozjs in /usr/lib for karmic?
<seb128> asac, I'm fighting gnome bug #573413
<asac> thats the question
<ubottu> Gnome bug 573413 in general "libmozjs linking broken on Ubuntu" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=573413
<seb128> asac, ie trying to get gnome-shell in a ppa before GUADEC as asked by rick
<seb128> gnagnagna, dan's patch doesn't do the trick
<asac> seb128: for now use LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/lib/xulrunner-`xulrunner -gre-version`:$LD_LIBRARY_PATH
<seb128> asac, where do I put that?
<asac> to get the package going
<asac> seb128: you need some start script ;)
<seb128> asac, it ftbfs right now, it's not runtime
<seb128> the build call g-ir-scanner to build some gobject introspection code
<seb128> and that's the think which breaks
<asac> let me check the patch
<asac> seb128: how does the biuld fail?
<asac> without looking context i would say: 1. drop the configure part of the patch. 2. replace +    mozjs_libdir = '@MOZJS_LIBDIR@'
<seb128> "(mutter:6014): mutter-WARNING **: Could not load library [/builddir/src/libgnome-shell.la (libmozjs.so: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory)]
<seb128> (mutter:6014): mutter-CRITICAL **: failed to load plugins
<seb128> Invalid GType: 'big_box_get_type'
<seb128> failed to dump: Failed to find symbol 'big_box_get_type'
<seb128> Command '['mutter', '--mutter-plugins=/builddir/src/libgnome-shell.la', '--introspect-dump=/tmp/tmp-introspectGeuNxi/types.txt,/tmp/tmp-introspectGeuNxi/dump.xml']' returned non-zero exit status 1"
<asac> with mozjs_libdir = /usr/lib/xulrunner-`xulrunner -gre-version`
<asac> and dont use the @...@ thing detected at build time
<seb128> $ grep mozjs_libdir *
<seb128> gnome-shell:    mozjs_libdir = '/usr/lib/xulrunner-1.9.0.11'
<asac> seb128: yes. but thats wrong. it should always be evaluated dynamically
<seb128> well that will not make a different in this case
<seb128> I've the lib in '/usr/lib/xulrunner-1.9.0.11
<asac> yes
<asac> thats not the build problem
<asac> but the runtime problem you will end up
<seb128> I'm wondering if I can add a -rpath somewhere
<asac> i need to see the link linne of libgnome-shell.la
<asac> seb128: i think setting LD_LIBRARY_PATH during build correctly might also help
<asac> if its works its better than -rpath because its just for the build and doesnt influence runtime behaviour later on
<seb128> asac, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/207770/
<asac> seb128: and the content of libgnome-shell.la?
<seb128> asac, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/207772/
<asac> seb128: i guess you have the /usr/lib/xulrunner-devel-1.9.0.11/ ?
<seb128> export LD_LIBRARY_PATH=$LD_LIBRARY_PATH:/usr/lib/xulrunner-1.9.0.11
<seb128> make
<seb128> that works
<asac> yes
<asac> thats the idea
<asac> and then fix the gnome-shell like i said
<asac> and you should be fine
<seb128> I'm just not sure where to plug the LD_LIBRARY_PATH during the build
<seb128> I will figure thanks
<asac> seb128: debian/rules
<asac> just set it there
<seb128> how?
<seb128> export .... ?
<asac> export LD_LIBRARY_PATH=...
<asac> yes
<seb128> I tried but it didn't like that
<asac> i think you can even just use export LD_LIBRARY_PATH="/usr/lib/xulrunner-$(shell xulrunner --gre-version)"
<asac> hmm
<asac> cdbs?
<seb128> lot of
<seb128> ERROR: ld.so: object 'libfakeroot-sysv.so' from LD_PRELOAD cannot be preloaded: ignored.
<asac> maybe there is a special hook
<seb128> yes
<asac> seb128: ah
<asac> yeah you need to use =$LD_LIBRARY_PATH:...
<asac> e.g. keep the original path
<asac> thats where fakeroot is
<seb128> I used
<seb128> +export LD_LIBRARY_PATH=$LD_LIBRARY_PATH:/usr/lib/xulrunner-1.9.0.11
<asac> seb128: hmm. doesnt make evaluate that up front?
<asac> try $$LD_LIBRARY_PATH
<seb128> no warning, let's see if that makes what I want too
<seb128> hum, I got those warnings later during the build
<seb128> otherwise that seems to work
<seb128> ie it builds
<asac> ok
<seb128> it just stop on "install: cannot change owner and permissions" due to the preload issue
<asac> hmm
<asac> lets check cdbs
<asac> nothing
<seb128> but that might not be due to the rules change
<seb128> Tidy-1.0.typelib: libtidy-1.0.la Tidy-1.0.gir
<seb128> 	LD_LIBRARY_PATH=$${LD_LIBRARY_PATH:+$$LD_LIBRARY_PATH:}. g-ir-compiler Tidy-1.0.gir -o $@
<seb128> CLEANFILES += Tidy-1.0.typelib
<seb128> they do that in the makefile.am
<seb128> I'm wondering if that's their makefile breaking it
<asac> i would think it looks ok
<asac> at least that line
<asac> does gnome-shell have lots of depends i probably dont have installed yet?
<seb128> not that much no
<seb128> but it's over work hour so we can look at it tomorrow rather if you want
<seb128> asac, deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/ubuntu-desktop/ppa/ubuntu karmic main
<seb128> sudo apt-get install libclutter-0.9-dev gjs gjs-dev libmutter-dev
<seb128> asac, basically
<seb128> sudo apt-get install libclutter-0.9-dev gjs gjs-dev libmutter-dev libgirepository-dev gobject-introspection gobject-introspection-glib-2.0 gobject-introspection-repository
<seb128> to be sure
<seb128> but I'm not sure introspection is required
<seb128> asac, the current wip package is on dget http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/gnome-shell_0.0.1~git20090701-0ubuntu0.1.dsc
<asac> seb128: are you building trunk?
<asac> or a branch?
<seb128> asac, trunk
<seb128> asac, git clone git://git.gnome.org/gnome-shell
<asac> for me the upstream stuff fails at http://paste.ubuntu.com/207789/
<asac> http://paste.ubuntu.com/207789/
<asac> err
<asac> Couldn't find include 'PangoCairo-1.0.gir'
<seb128> asac, sudo apt-get install gobject-introspection-repository
<seb128> asac, cf my second apt-get line before
<asac> indeed
<asac> http://paste.ubuntu.com/207791/
<asac> next gir problem
<asac> cant find any Big gir here
<seb128> asac, sudo apt-get install gobject-introspection
<asac> hmm.
<asac> i am sure i copied the line
<asac> thats installed already
<asac> ii  gobject-introspection               0.6.3-0ubuntu1
<seb128> asac, the Big.gir is in the gnome-shell src
<seb128> asac, you have /usr/bin/g-ir-scanner?
<asac> yes
<asac> its not in the src
<asac> anyway taking package now
<seb128> clean your source and start again?
<seb128> maybe it didn't find gir at configure time because it was not installed
<seb128> and you did run make without running configure again
<asac> i reran configure
<asac> anyway
<asac> i am now building package ;)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> comment the export in rules otherwise it will work
<asac> fails the same way ;)
<seb128> "work"
<seb128> the Gir way?
<asac> http://paste.ubuntu.com/207795/
<asac> thats with the export
<seb128> bah
<asac> even without the export it fails the same way
<asac> so its _before_ the bug i want to look at
<seb128> right
<asac> actually, this gir command is supposd to create this Big gir thing
<seb128> asac, did you install mutter too?
<asac> seb128: i installed libmutter-dev
<asac> installing now
<seb128> try installing mutter, in fact I built that one locally and dpkg -i *.deb
<asac> will mutter kill my metacity?
<seb128> no
<seb128> it's a different wm it will not run if you don't run it by hand
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-07-02
<seb128> which I didn't do here
<asac> good
<asac> so yeah
<asac> now i have the problem ;)
<seb128> good
<seb128> you found a build depends issue thanks ;-)
<asac> seb128: http://pastebin.com/f2dfdea6f
<asac> try that
<asac> instead of rules
<asac> export
<seb128> asac, you should use pastebin.ubuntu.com it's nicer ;-)
<seb128> (trying)
<seb128> asac, that seems to do the trick indeed, I tried something near before but my escaping was not correct apparently
<asac> seb128: also use this for runtime: http://pastebin.com/f6c3a4c11
<asac> its not tested, but should do the right thing if my python-fu was good enough
<asac> oh there is a ) missing
<asac> http://pastebin.com/fb9b065c
<asac> that one
<asac> seb128: at least you get rid of the runtime depends on the pkg-config files ;) (e.g. depends: xulrunner-1.9-dev)
<seb128> asac, are the "" required in the first change?
<seb128> the build one
<asac> seb128: its safer i think
<seb128> why? just being curious ;-)
<asac> in case of whitespaces
<seb128> anyway the runtime changes work, let me try the runtime thing too
<seb128> asac, can you add the changes to the GNOME bug too for reference maybe?
<seb128> asac, thanks a bunch
<asac> seb128: i will. please just confirm that the runtime thing works
<asac> e.g. that gnome-shell now works with those changes
<seb128> asac, it's building one sec
<seb128> asac, it "works"
<seb128> ie it does the same that the upstream code is doing
<asac> great
<asac> ah
<asac> ok
<seb128> I'm not impressed by gnome-shell but that's an another topic
<seb128> asac, you rock ;-)
<seb128> asac, one beer for you at next sprint
<asac> i will remember that ;)
<asac> ok patches submitted
<asac> not sure if they find them too ubuntu centric
<asac> but if other distributions tweak the version in the pkglibdir path
<asac> they should also keep the --gre-version fixed
<asac> (like debian does it)
<asac> seb128: unfortunately we probably will have to make libmozjs a top-level citizen lib in main ... too many apps use it :(
<asac> i still try to push that back, but with couchdb using it, it doesnt get easier ;)
<seb128> asac, "unfortunately"?
<asac> seb128: well. upstream does not give any firm commitment that they will not break it in a security update
<asac> for them its an internal thing ;)
<seb128> you can convince upstream to make it a first class citizen too and guaranty stability?
<asac> telling them that we want ABI guarantees is one thing
<asac> the other thing would be to convince them to use SONAME versioning
<seb128> there is any reason they would not agree?
<asac> depends who you ask. javascript folks would agree. some firefox folks probably would argue that libmozjs on linux is not that important and that it will cause work in the future if they commit to make it a first class linux lib/product
<seb128> asac, well we have a list of client applications, might be worth trying to convince them about it being useful
<asac> seems we will try again ;)
<seb128> good
<asac> seb128: so will mutter get in the archive soonish?
<robert_ancell> bryce: you there?
<seb128> asac, it's in the ppa for now
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey, waking up early today?
<robert_ancell> seb128: I woke up and my X wont start :(
<seb128> asac, we will probably wait for a stable tarball before uploading to karmic, should happen after GUADEC
<asac> seb128: i noticed that ;) ... just wondering, because there is a network-manager-netbook applet that uses mutter.
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: What kernel, and what video card?
<seb128> robert_ancell, what error do you get? never upgrade just before travelling ;-)
<robert_ancell> Is there a command-line way of running network manager?
<asac> seb128: ok so its expected to be in universe for karmic?
<seb128> asac, yes that's the plan if things go correctly
<asac> robert_ancell: NetworkManager --no-daemon ;)
<robert_ancell> ATI R300 it says I need to go to low resolution mode but that doesn't seem to work
<asac> robert_ancell: but i guess you want to manage NM with command line
<robert_ancell> asac: but will that connect to my wireless network automatically?
<seb128> using fglrx or the ati driver?
<robert_ancell> ati
<asac> robert_ancell: configure your wireless connections as "auto connect" and "available to all users"
<asac> then it will automatically connect
<robert_ancell> asac: where is that config?
<asac> robert_ancell: at best create it using the appet connection editor once
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you look if you still have the previous deb in /var/cache/apt/archives/*.deb ?
<asac> applet
<bryce> robert_ancell, yep
<robert_ancell> bryce: anything change in X between 7.4+3ubuntu2 and 7.4+3ubuntu4?
<asac> robert_ancell: if you have that config set up it would be in /etc/NetworkManager/system-connections
<bryce> robert_ancell, I posted a new -ati snapshot yesterday
<asac> robert_ancell: alternatively configure it in /etc/network/interfaces and set NM to managed=true mode in /etc/NetworkManager/nm-system-settings.conf
<robert_ancell> bryce: I have 1:6.12.2-2ubuntu2 installed
<asac> robert_ancell: like http://paste.ubuntu.com/207811/
<robert_ancell> asac: thanks
<bryce> robert_ancell, the changes to xorg between  7.4+3ubuntu2 and 7.4+3ubuntu4 are not ones that I would think could cause a failure to setup the driver
<bryce> robert_ancell, were you able to verify that downgrading to 7.4+3ubuntu2 restored your system?
<robert_ancell> bryce: I haven't tried yet, I'm running on live cd at the moment
<bryce> ok, well there's several other changes that have gone in lately that could cause this behavior
<bryce> I could make random guesses, but it'd probably be more time efficient if you could reproduce the issue and then file a bug via ubuntu-bug xorg
<bryce> might save you from chasing wild gooses too :-)
<robert_ancell> bryce: http://paste.ubuntu.com/207815/ my gdm log
<robert_ancell> hmm, I _don't_ have a /usr/X11R6/bin
<seb128> robert_ancell, those issues have been fixed in gdm...-0ubuntu5
<seb128> robert_ancell, you can change the xserver path in gdm.conf if that's the issue
<seb128> but that's probably an another bug than the one I mention because xorg wouldn't start otherwise I think
<robert_ancell> cool, I have ubuntu3. will update that
<seb128> they dropped the X11R6 compat in the recent xorg upload
<seb128> and gdm was still using it in its default config
<seb128> the configure detection relies on the xserver to be installed which is not the case on the buildds
<seb128> and the fallback is coming from an another age ;-)
<seb128> anyway should be fixed in current karmic
<bryce> bingo
<bryce> yeah seb128's right.  updating should fix it.  Or edit your gdm.conf if you want to avoid updating temporarily.
<robert_ancell> cool, brb
<seb128> bryce, not sure if that's a known issue but xorg segfault on start with 2.6.31 on intel
<seb128> crash in intel_drv.so
<seb128> and there is a no mode found error just before
<bryce> seb128, kees mentioned that to me earlier
<seb128> ok
<ccheney> new 2.6.31 kernel crashes on me on boot, anyone else see an issue like that?
<ccheney> unfortunately it didn't log it to kern.log
 * ccheney rebooted back to 2.6.30 to be able use his system
<ccheney> ugh and firefox for some reason is constantly crashing on me
 * ccheney can't wait until FF 3.5 becomes default, maybe it iwll be less crashy
<robert_ancell> much better...
<seb128> wb robert_ancell
<seb128> walters, there? do you know if there is a GLib.gir somewhere?
<robert_ancell> thanks all
<seb128_> re
<seb128_> dsl disconnected
<seb128_> did somebody replied to my question? and what was displayed on the channel before that?
<seb128_> just to know how much I typed before noticing I was disconnected
<walters> seb128: should be built from gobject-introspection
<seb128_> walters, hum, it's not
<seb128_> walters, how much of what I was typing did you read?
<seb128_> did you read my description of the current gnome-shell issues?
<walters> seb128_: last thing i saw was  walters, there? do you know if there is a GLib.gir somewhere?
<seb128_> ok
<seb128_> <seb128> ok, non working gnome-shell upload to the ubuntu-desktop ppa now
<seb128_>  running gnome-shell starts a xephyr which is similar to what a standard xorg session looked 15 years ago
<seb128_>  with only an X in a corner, a command line a eyes looking to your cursor
<seb128_>  I guess that the actual shell is not working, -v says it exit
<seb128_>  there is also "Log level 32: Execution of main.js threw exception: Error: Unable to construct boxed type Color since it has no zero-args <constructor>, can only wrap an existing one" displayed
<seb128_>  trying gjs on a gnome-shell .js gives errors though
<seb128_>      JS ERROR: !!!   Exception was: Error: Requiring GLib, version none
<seb128_>  I expect that's part of the issue
<seb128_>  anyway I will see that tomorrow, first package version in the ppa if somebody wants to work on it
<seb128_>  
<seb128_> walters, ^ basically where I got gnome-shell now
<seb128_> looking why gobject-introspection has no GLib.gir
<walters> seb128_: hmm, is there anything interesting before that?
<seb128_> before what?
<seb128_> gnome-shell?
<walters> seb128_: any errors in the output
<seb128_> for gjs or gnome-shell?
<walters> seb128_: either
<seb128_> walters, http://paste.ubuntu.com/207826/
<seb128_> not sure if that's meant to be used that way
<walters> hm, that site isn't responding
<walters> ah there it goes
<walters> seb128_: this looks like the root: JS IMPORT: Module 'gi' reported an exception but gjs_import_native_module() returned TRUE
<walters> seb128_: hmm...i think that means it's failing to import one of the extensions
<seb128_> walters, as said I've no GLib.gir if that's required
<walters> seb128_: not at runtime no
<seb128_> ok
<walters> seb128_: hmm does 'make check' inside the gjs source work ok?
<walters> seb128_: or another check, try gjs-console on examples/gtk.js from there
<seb128_> walters, make check seems to work
<seb128_> OK
<seb128_> PASS: gjs-unit
<seb128_> $ gjs-console /usr/share/gjs-1.0/signals.js
<seb128_> works too
<seb128_> gjs-console examples/gtk.js -> error
<walters> interesting, can you pastebin that?
<robert_ancell> later, until GUADEC...
<seb128_> walters, http://paste.ubuntu.com/207828/
<seb128_> robert_ancell, have a nice flight see you at GUADEC
<walters> seb128: ok, do you have GLib-2.0.typelib in /usr/lib/girepository-1.0 ?
<seb128> $ ls /usr/lib/girepository-1.0/GLib*
<seb128> /usr/lib/girepository-1.0/GLib-2.0.typelib
<walters> seb128: ok can you pastebin: strace -o /tmp/gjs.strace gjs-console examples/gtk.js ?
<walters> seb128: output in /tmp/gjs.strace
<seb128> walters, http://paste.ubuntu.com/207832/
<seb128> hum
<seb128> open("/usr/lib/girepository", O_RDONLY|O_NONBLOCK|O_LARGEFILE|O_DIRECTORY|O_CLOEXEC) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
<seb128> should be /usr/lib/girepository-1.0?
<walters> yeah
<seb128> where is that path defined?
<walters> it's hardcoded inside libgirepository-1.0.so
<seb128> I'm wondering if there is something which needs to be rebuilt with the new gobject-introspection and which didn't
<walters> well, unfortunately at the moment, if introspection changes in general you need to rebuild everything that depends on it
<walters> that's not the long term plan =)  but we haven't landed everything we need to for final
<walters> but this problem makes me think you have a quite old version
<seb128> gobject-introspection is 0.6.3
<seb128> gir is a git snapshot from yesterday
<seb128> gjs is 0.2
<walters> well, we switched quite a while ago: 63cd2160        (Johan Dahlin   2009-01-15 22:31:07 +0000       135)      typelib_dir = g_build_filename (libdir, "girepository-1.0", NULL);
<seb128> we had 0.6.1 until yesterday
<seb128> which was using the old location
<seb128> you rolled 0.6.3 tarball recently
<walters> do: ldd /usr/lib/gjs-1.0/gi.so
<walters> is it linked to libgirepository-1.0.so.0?
<seb128> $ ldd /usr/lib/gjs-1.0/gi.so | grep gir
<seb128> 	libgirepository.so.0 => /usr/lib/libgirepository.so.0 (0x005fa000)
<seb128> no!
<seb128> thanks
<walters> ok that's what's wrong
<walters> but how did the unversioned so get there?  is it from a package?
<seb128> libgirepository0: /usr/lib/libgirepository.so.0
<seb128> yes, that's the binary from 0.6.1
<seb128> it has not been uninstalled since nothing conflict with it
<seb128> "gjs-console examples/gtk.js" works now
<walters> hmm so...well i'm not sure of the details here
<walters> ok
<seb128> well it's just that gjs got built with gobject-introspection 0.6.1
<walters> yeah
<seb128> and not rebuilt after the upgrade
<seb128> walters, new error http://paste.ubuntu.com/207843/
<walters> yeah, you can't run that file alone
<walters> the entry point is the gnome-shell script
<seb128> hum ok
<seb128> I will keep debugging tomorrow I think, it's getting late
<seb128> but it still doesn't work
<seb128> walters, thanks for the help tracking the gjs build issue!
<walters> np
<seb128> good night everybody
<cxo> What exactly is the Desktop team? Do you guys build gnome for ubuntu?
<jmarsden> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam
<cxo> Oh. You guys are good
<didrocks> good morning o/
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> hey didrocks
<TheMuso> Morning pitti.
<pitti> hey TheMuso
<didrocks> hey pitti and TheMuso
<TheMuso> pitti: I've just had a review of rtkit by dholbach on revu, so it won't be long till we get that into universe, and then main, so we can get pulse in and deprecate hal even more. :p
<pitti> TheMuso: \o/ just read your call for testing
<pitti> TheMuso: should we just drop pulse-hal from the ubuntu-desktop seed, since pulse itself already depends on it anyway (and will drop it later)?
<TheMuso> pitti: Yeah, good idea.
<pitti> TheMuso: also, perhaps -udev should conflicts:/replaces: -hal, to clean it up on upgrade and avoid having both ("double detection")?
<TheMuso> And 9.16 depends on the udev module instead, so yeah.
<TheMuso> pitti: I think I did that somewhat with 9.16, but I'll check to be sure.
<pitti> TheMuso: I'm just doing an upgrade, and -hal isn't cleaned
<pitti> oh hang on, I'm lying
<TheMuso> pulseaudio-module-dev replaces, but doesn't conflict, since they have different files.
<TheMuso> s/-dev/-udev
<pitti> it does remove -hal, sorry
<pitti> eww, screwage
<TheMuso> ok good.
<pitti> rtkit fails to configure
<TheMuso> yep fixed
 * TheMuso checks to see if its built
<pitti> adduser complains about "just give one name" (loosely translated)
<TheMuso> hrm seems I didn't upload it.
 * TheMuso headdesks
<TheMuso> pitti: Yeah in rtkit.postinst, there is a -d flag given to adduser that should not be there.
 * TheMuso uploads rtkit
<pitti> --home /proc ? :)
<TheMuso> yep
<TheMuso> not --home -d /proc
<pitti> yep, works now, thanks
<TheMuso> np
<pitti> rtkit scares me
<TheMuso> Yeah it does me a bit, but I think lennart has justified why its needed, at least in the README.
<TheMuso> Oh and the name just shows that people at RedHat are lazy.
<pitti> TheMuso: p-hal unseeded
<TheMuso> ok
<TheMuso> pitti: how does rtkit scare you? Is it how it goes about things?
<TheMuso> I'd like to get Kees' input on it as well I think. However, pulse absolutely has to have it now so we may be stuck with it.
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Halsectomy updated
<didrocks> great, hal removal is in good progress :)
<TheMuso> Yeah, just a bit annoyed that another dependency not even in the archive is needed to update pulse.
<pitti> TheMuso: scare> having a system daemon controllable by the user which elevates privileges of other systems
<pitti> this is just as bad as CAP_SETPCAP, which got rejected over and over in the kernel for good reasons
<TheMuso> RIght, makes sense.
<TheMuso> It does use policykit however.
<TheMuso> but I am not sure how much that migigates things?
<TheMuso> s/?/./
<TheMuso> mitigate even
<TheMuso> bah cold hands, and its the end of the day. :)
<pitti> well, it remains a potential trap, and I figure that it by default allows you access if you are on a local console
<TheMuso> Right
<TheMuso> Anyway, back on later for some ports/community workkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk.
 * pitti fixes TheMuso's bouncing key
<seb128> hey pitti
<pitti> bonjour Monsieur Bacher!
<seb128> pitti, do you also get a polkit dialog at login on karmic?
<seb128> it tries to mount some internal partitions at boot for some reason
<pitti> seb128: yes, that's the autologin for internal disks which we need to disable
<pitti> it's on my TODO list
<seb128> ok thanks
<pitti> we disabled that in hal for good reasons, need to do the same in, erm, is it nautilus?
<seb128> I doubt anything is doing automounting at boot in GNOME
<pitti> seb128: when will you leave to Desktop SUmmit?
<seb128> pitti, tomorrow morning around 8am
<pitti> ah
<seb128> summit is starting on saturday
<pitti> seb128: I planned to bzrify gdm, update it to latest upstream stuff, hope that this fixes teh session handling (or fix it), and push to karmic; are you okay with that?
<pitti> I still have some stuff to do today, but I hope to get that done today or Friday (and upload Monday)
<seb128> you want to do a git snapshot?
<seb128> 2.26.1 is current otherwise
<seb128> I planned to upload today too
<pitti> oh, ok
<pitti> or check Fedora for patches
<seb128> I did that yesterday
<pitti> seems that the session handling works with GNOME 2.26
<pitti> but not with our 2.27?
<seb128> checked fedora and git for patches
<seb128> and bugzilla
<pitti> ah, cool
<pitti> so, our problem then
<seb128> yeah, I'm not sure why
<seb128> I get no warning with compiz
<seb128> do you use compiz too?
<pitti> seb128: in gdm? I don't know, I suppose not
<pitti> I didn't change the gdm session
<seb128> no, as your default wm for GNOME
<pitti> yes, I do
<pitti> but I thought that was the end of gdm, not hte start of my session
<pitti> and it wants to save the gdm greeter
<seb128> ok, I'm not sure where the warning come from, I don't get it on my laptop but I use autologin there
<pitti> ah, so my session is picking up the gdm greeter which is still running?
<seb128> not sure what is going on, that needs debugging
<seb128> but that's just a warning right?
<seb128> ie it doesn't break the login?
<pitti> right
<pitti> you just have to click it away
<pitti> not a blocker, just a wart
<didrocks> hi seb128! Did you succeed in "packaging gnome-shell in 30 minutes"? ;)
<seb128> didrocks, hey, not really, was rather in 3 hours
<didrocks> :/
<seb128> it's in the ubuntu-desktop ppa now but still doesn't work for some reason
<didrocks> yes, it seems to FTBFS
<seb128> but the packaging is done and you can run it
<pitti> seb128: ok, seems we should do it today then
<didrocks> ok, I will have a look this evening
<pitti> seb128: and I'll have a look at regression reports and collect the pieces
<seb128> didrocks, grrr
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<seb128> didrocks, I retry the build, I think the issue was the gjs-dev doesn't depends on gjs
<seb128> didrocks, I fixed that yesterday evening too but the new version was not published yet
<didrocks> seb128: oh ok, and as it was late, it wasn't worth to wait for the first version to published before uploading the fix.
<seb128> didrocks, it took me a while because I ran into those libmozjs not being in /usr/lib issues owen talked about
<seb128> didrocks, it was 3am yes, it was time to go to bed not to wait for a ppa publisher run ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: yes, I remember about owen's remark... how did you fix it, finally?
<seb128> asac helped me
<seb128> using a LD_LIBRARY_PRELOAD hack in the build
<seb128> and some running hacks too
<didrocks> (3am is a good time to sleep, even with 28Â°C in the accomodation :))
<seb128> too warm there!
<didrocks> hum, traditional mozilla hacks :p (LD_LIBRARY_PRELOAD prepends to LD_LIBRARY_PATH?)
<seb128> didrocks, no, LD_LIBRARY_PATH=$LD_LIBRARY_PATH:/usr/lib/xulrunner-`xulrunner --gre-version` rather
<seb128> I had the good idea but I tried to export that from the rules first which broke other things
<seb128> and then I changed it not at the right locations in the autotools
<seb128> but after some tweaking and asac's help that was ok
<seb128> enough to get it "running"
<seb128> then I ran into "gjs is built with the previous gobject-iintrospection library and looking in wrong location"
<seb128> which made things no find glib.gir for a non obvious reason
<seb128> walters helped me to track this one down
<didrocks> ok, it seems you really had fun :) (FYI, you still kept the LD_LIBRARY_PATH change commented in debian/rules)
<seb128_> re
<seb128_> grrr, dsl disconnecting when the phone ring, and yes I've the phone connected to a filter already
<seb128_> didrocks, what did you read or say before I disconnected?
<didrocks> seb128_:
<didrocks> seb128_: [09:46] <didrocks> ok, it seems you really had fun :) (FYI, you still kept the LD_LIBRARY_PATH change commented in debian/rules)
<seb128_> didrocks, oh right, was late ;-)
<crevette> didrocks, you're three minute ahead in the time
<seb128_> it's huats's server
<didrocks> crevette: I know, blame huats' server (even with that, he's always late ;))
<seb128_> I already told him some days ago
 * didrocks will remove time from copy/paste ;)
<seb128_> still doesn't build
<crevette> :)
<seb128_> ah, new error
<didrocks> seb128_: I know that one
<didrocks> seb128_: you have to add the bin package for gobject-repository. The dev doesn't depends on it
<seb128_> right, I just figured that too
<didrocks> gobject-introspection-repository rather
<seb128_> gobject-instrospection rather no?
<didrocks> yes, (after an apt-file search /usr/bin/g-ir-scanner) ;)
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti - thank you for your comments. they're appreciated:)
 * asac says helllo
<asac> pitti: now gudev-dev doesnt ship any ".la" file anymore?
<huats> morning everyone
<asac> hi huats
<huats> hey asac
<seb128_> lut huats
<seb128_> hey asac, thanks again for yesterday debugging ;-)
<huats> hello seb128_
<asac> seb128_: welcome!
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, I commented on your motu application too now
<chrisccoulson> seb128_ thank you too:)
<seb128_> you're welcome, thanks for the work you are doing ;-)
<seb128_> huats, you should fix your server time btw, the clock is running 3 minutes to fast apparently
<huats> seb128_: ?
<seb128_> huats, didrocks keeps being told he's not on right time when copying IRC logs
<seb128_> huats, and he blames it on your server
<seb128_> <didrocks> crevette: I know, blame huats' server (even with that, he's always late ;))
<huats> seb128_: LOL
<didrocks> seb128_: oh traitor! :p
<didrocks> huats: everyone asks me when I copy/paste why I'm 5 minutes in advance
<huats> seb128_: you know didrocks has admin access to my server... so he can fix that...
<seb128_> didrocks, I'm doing you a favor since apparently you are too shy to ask huats to fix the issue ;-)
<didrocks> huats: I just tell them that's you who don't want to be late (even inf ;))
<huats> seb128_: I am sure he was about to tell me that next week at the RMLL
<huats> :)
<huats> didrocks: but please yourself change the time...
<didrocks> ok, let me fix the time on huats' server :)
<seb128_> ok, so gnome-shell doesn't want to build grrrr
<didrocks> s/inf/if... ;)
<didrocks> seb128_: still ? :/
<seb128_> didrocks, lacks a build-depends on gobject-introspection-glib-2.0 now
<seb128_> that's one of those cases where I should use pbuilder ;-)
<didrocks> seb128_: it was the same for mutter ;)
<didrocks> seb128_: and yes, +2 for pbuilder so :)
<didrocks> (2 missing build-deps)
<seb128_> I'm pondering saying we are good after this one and just upload
<seb128_> but I'm going to blame myself if there is still an issue ;-)
<didrocks> :-)
<pitti> TheMuso: still here?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: my pleasure!
<pitti> asac: do you need them?
<pitti> TheMuso: ah, unping
<didrocks> "unping" :)
<pitti> seb128_: weird, new gdm shows "RealtimeKit" in the user list, but it's a system user (115:127)
<seb128_> weird indeed
<seb128_> "    self._scanner.parse_macros(filenames)
<seb128_> RuntimeError: parse macro takes a list of filenames"
<seb128_> gnagna gnome-shell
 * didrocks thinks that seb128_ is going to take craziness with gnome-shell
 * pitti -> back to intel debugging
<seb128_> pitti, xorg crashing on boot on 2.6.31?
<asac> pitti: no, all fine i think. just noted that i had to rebuild my existing git trees ;)
<TheMuso> pitti: I'm around now.
<pitti> seb128_: no, testing a patch from Jesse for pipe underruns
<pitti> seb128_: 2.6.31 works fine here; does it crash for you?
<seb128_> yes
<pitti> TheMuso: right, I suspected it would create rtkit without --system, but it does; itz gdm bug
<TheMuso> pitti: ok. Just aheads up pulse would also be broken atm, since I left out some new files that were added to pulse upstream that I forgot to package. Someone filed a bug about it, so I'll push up a new package that fixes it, so it you encounter no sound, thats probably why.
<seb128_> didrocks, ok, got it, that was stupid issue again and the error was not clear
<pitti> TheMuso: right, haven't tested that yet (I usually have my speakers turned off)
<pitti> thanks for the heads-up
<TheMuso> pitti: np
<didrocks> seb128_: what was the matter?
<seb128_> didrocks, my pbuilder is still a intrepid one ;-)
<seb128_> didrocks, I did add the karmic source, the ppa and installed the build-depends
<seb128_> but python was still 2.5
<seb128_> after upgrading to 2.6 it builds
<seb128_> something python-ish but I don't care enough to try to understand
<seb128_> that works on a karmic version ;-)
<didrocks> seb128_: oh, you could have create a karmic pbuilder. This would have been easier :)
<didrocks> (not sure about the speed with your connection, though)
<seb128_> would have taken 1 hour rather than 5 minutes to install updates
<seb128_> but it would have spared the debug round ;-)
<seb128_> anyway uploaded let's see if it builds now
<didrocks> sure :-)
<seb128_> ok, I'm moving in the outside and taking my laptop, it's getting too warm there to work correctly ;-)
<seb128_> be back in a bit
<pitti> TheMuso: confirmed, no joy with paplay here
<pitti> TheMuso: btw, do you know about dh_install --{list,fail}-missing? pretty handy
<didrocks> pitti: the only thing it that it doesn't work with uncompressed manpages and dh_gconf (listing missing ./etc/gconf/... even if installed by dh_gconf to usr/share/gconf)
<pitti> right, you can use -X to blacklist them
<didrocks> I must do that in my pbuilder hooks
<TheMuso> pitti: No I didn't, thanks.
<TheMuso> pitti: anyway, just uploaded a fixed package.
<hyperair> huh.
<hyperair> why won't my usb drives mount?!
 * hyperair must have compiled something wrongly in the kernel =(
<edgarmattern1> Hallo
<pitti> hyperair: dmesg sees it?
<edgarmattern1> 4 what is this room here?
<pitti> hey edgarmattern1; for discussing development of Ubuntu desktop stuff
<Tm_T> edgarmattern1: also read topic
<edgarmattern1> thx
<seb128> re
<seb128> pitti, not sure if you read my comment about gst-plugins-good before, did you talk to slomo about the changes?
<seb128> we were on sync with debian and I would like to keep things this way
<pitti> seb128: I didn't, ken did the coordination; however, it's being done upstream, so eventually we should go back to sync
<walters> seb128: what was the error btw? =)
<seb128> pitti, would be nice to talk to the debian maintainer to keep good relations with them in such cases
<pitti> *nod*
<seb128> walters, nothing clear
<seb128> Log level 32: Execution of main.js threw exception: Error: Unable to construct boxed type Color since it has no zero-args <constructor>, can only wrap an existing one
<seb128> and that it exits apparently
<walters> seb128: can you pastebin the whole thing?
<walters> seb128: or at least more
<seb128> walters, http://paste.ubuntu.com/208034/
<seb128> lunch time, be back in half an hour
<walters> seb128: do you have Clutter-0.9.typelib installed?
<walters> ok
<seb128> walters, yes, a /usr/lib/girepository-1.0/Clutter-0.9.typelib
<seb128> anyway lunch bbl
<rodrigo_> seb128: if I want to have jaunty and karmic packages on my PPA, should I submit them twice, once for jaunty and one for karmic?
<rodrigo_> ah, he's gone for lunch
<rodrigo_> pitti: ^^
<didrocks> rodrigo_: FWIW, yes :)
<rodrigo_> oh, ok
<rodrigo_> it would be great to just submit once for both, if the packages are the same
<didrocks> rodrigo_: I think that has been discussed recently (ubuntu open week?) and is on launchpad team schedule (btw, for more accurate information, #launchpad)
<rodrigo_> ok thanks
<rodrigo_> Already uploaded to playground on ppa.launchpad.net
<rodrigo_> Doing nothing for json-glib_0.7.2-1_source.changes
<pitti> rodrigo_: usually you upload a version to karmic, and then version~jaunty1 to jaunty PPA
<rodrigo_> I guess I need to change the version also?
<rodrigo_> ah ok
<pitti> rodrigo_: I think you can also upload to jaunty and then use the "copy packages" button for karmic
<pitti> but I'm not sure whether this just works between PPAs, or also between releases
<rodrigo_> ah, trying that, much easier if it works
<rodrigo_> no, doesn't work
<rodrigo_> pitti: but I guess I can create another PPA just for jaunty?
<pitti> rodrigo_: well, you should use the same PPA
<rodrigo_> it doesn't work, it says the sources already exist
<pitti> right, you need a different version number
<pitti> brb
<rodrigo_> ok, I'll submit then with the ~jaunty1 thing
<seb128>  RE
<seb128> ups, re
<seb128> walters, so yes Clutter-0.9.typelib installed
<seb128> rodrigo_, upload to jaunty and do a ppa copy to karmic
<rodrigo_> ah, ok
<walters> seb128: ok, has it been built after introspection?
<rodrigo_> so the other way around doesn't work?
<seb128> walters, yes
<seb128> walters, I did rebuild gnome-shell after fixing gjs yesterday
<walters> seb128: well, Clutter-0.9.typelib comes from the clutter package
<seb128> oh
<seb128> that one might not have been
 * seb128 checks
<seb128> but I think it would be in an another directory than /usr/lib/girepository-1.0 if that was not the case
<walters> we have a minor version for typelib incompatibility but we haven't been consistent about bumping it =/
<seb128> since that's the new location
<didrocks> seb128: Clutter-0.9.typelib is probably in the -dev package
<seb128> didrocks, I've that installed, the file is on disk
<didrocks> (less than ideal, we should move .gir and .typelib in the bin one, seeing mutter depends :/)
<walters> seb128: the problem may be that it was built with an older gobject-introspection and the typelib format changed
<seb128> Get:3 http://ftpmaster.internal karmic/universe gobject-introspection 0.6.3-0ubuntu1
<seb128> walters, no, it built using 0.6.3
<walters> ok hm
<walters> blah, the example is broken
<rodrigo_> hmm, gwibber in karmic gives me unauthorized errors, is that known, or is it me?
<seb128> rodrigo_, dunno I'm not use gwibber, I think it's a question for kenvandine
<seb128> walters, anything else I could run to check that the stack is correcly installed?
<rodrigo_> ugh, now it crashed
<rodrigo_> kenvandine: any idea
<rodrigo_> ?
<seb128> rodrigo_, he might be travelling to GUADEC
<seb128> rodrigo_, when is your flight btw?
<rodrigo_> seb128: ok, I can live without it for a bit :)
<rodrigo_> seb128: tomorrow at 16:35 I get to GC
<rodrigo_> you?
<walters> seb128: trying to do that now sec
<seb128> rodrigo_, where do you fly from tomorrow?
<rodrigo_> seb128: Zaragoza
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok, not the same flight, I switch plane in madrid landing at 16:50
<pitti> bryce: yay -intel fixing bugs! I reported https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20520 and http://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=21719, and both got a working patch now
<seb128> 16:50 in GC
<ubottu> Freedesktop bug 20520 in Driver/intel "[945GM] display freezes a few minutes after resuming" [Critical,Resolved: fixed]
 * pitti is happy about perfect suspend/resume with KMS now
<rodrigo_> seb128: ah, ok, I'll wait for you then, if you want
<seb128> sure
<seb128> lool is in the same plane
<rodrigo_> it's just 15 mins diff
<rodrigo_> seb128: no direct flights from Strasbourg?
<seb128> rodrigo_, I'm flying from luxembourg, and not every day
<rodrigo_> ah
<seb128> I got a direct return on wednesday
<seb128> but there was nothing directory today or tomorrow
<rodrigo_> I'm also have one stop, in fuerteventura (another island in the canaries)
<seb128> directory -> direct, autofingers ;-)
<rodrigo_> :)
<rodrigo_> but comig direct on Friday
<rodrigo_> seb128: ah, you come back on Wed
<pitti> seb128: is https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/nautilus/1:2.22.5.1-0ubuntu2 useful on its own right, or only in conjunction with gvfs? IOW, should this still be moved to -updates, or should we pull it from hardy-proposed?
<rodrigo_> seb128: I'm staying till Fri for the guadec-es
<seb128> rodrigo_, yeah, over a week is long for a conference
<seb128> I usually go for core days
<rodrigo_> seb128: yes, too long
<seb128> and that was either direct fly on wednesday
<seb128> or over 10 hours in airplanes on thursday or friday
<seb128> easy choice ;-)
<seb128> pitti, don't move it, it might have some side effects, it making things not open when they should
<seb128> pitti, it was in coordination with the gvfs behaviour change
<pitti> seb128: okay, thanks
<rodrigo_> seb128: yeah, better to come back on Wed
<rodrigo_> seb128: I guess I'll use some slot in Wed or Thu to go to the beach and relax
<seb128> rodrigo_, good plan ;-)
<rodrigo_> if we are not many people for guadec-es, we can even do the talks in the beach, close to the bar :)
<seb128> walters, is examples/clutter.js in gjs supposed to display something?
<seb128> "    JS G OBJ: Defining method show in prototype for (null) (Clutter.Actor)
<seb128> do_wait: drmWaitVBlank returned -1, IRQs don't seem to be working correctly.
<seb128> Try adjusting the vblank_mode configuration parameter.
<seb128> "
<walters> seb128: that's what i'm fixing
<seb128> it displays an empty window
<seb128> ok
<walters> seb128: oh it's blank for you?  that implies to me it's picking clutter 0.8
<seb128> walters, should I move Clutter-0.8.gir out of the way?
<walters> nevermind the old version hardcoded 0.8
<walters> well a patch to clutter is needed to make it work with 0.9
<seb128> walters, is current git working for anybody? ;-) I'm wondering if I'm fighting packaging issues there or upstream bugs
<walters> i'm working upstream right now
<walters> that failure is about the earliest thing we do in js, so it's a fairly fundamental issue
<didrocks> (I'm around if a patch is needed for clutter package ;))
<tgpraveen> in the karmic-notfy-osd blueprint it is mentioned non-critical bubbles will be suppressed for full screen apps
<tgpraveen> message from empathy/pidgin are crtiical or non critical?
<walters> seb128: i'm out of immediate ideas, but if gtk.js works then it's something going wrong with clutter/introspection, i'm not sure exactly what though
<seb128> walters, examples/clutter.js is working for you? or is that an another way test than clutter works there?
<seb128> walters, thanks anyway for the help, I guess that will wait for after GUADEC, people will probably be busy and travelling soon now
<walters> seb128: it wasn't, but it is now with a small clutter patch ( http://fpaste.org/paste/17179 ) and i just unilaterally pushed the gjs patch
<seb128> walters, ok, let me try that one
<didrocks> the bottleneck is that gobject-introspection has a soft depends on clutter 0.8. But owen told me it was not important.
<tgpraveen> this is the right channel for this question right?
<walters> didrocks: well...gir-repository does, but honestly that package needs to die =)
<didrocks> walters: I hope it will be possible to kill it soon ;)
<seb128> tgpraveen, you want to talk to MacSlow when he's back from lunch
<tgpraveen> seb128: k. thx
<pitti> dobey: weird, lintian has 9 complains for ubuntuone-client for me
<seb128> walters, http://paste.ubuntu.com/208079/
<rodrigo_> seb128: I think you're coming in the same flight than ara and other canonical people
<seb128> rodrigo_, could be, lool and dbarth are in this plane too apparently
<rodrigo_> seb128: I was going to wait for ara, so yeah, we'll meet all at the airport
<walters> seb128: can you do g-ir-generate /usr/lib/girepository-1.0/Clutter-0.9.typelib > /tmp/clutter.xml
<walters> seb128: then search that file for clutter_color_new and pastebin the context around there
<walters> seb128: when does your gjs date from btw?
<seb128> walters, current tarball, I'm building git as we speak since that's around 6 months old
<seb128> walters, http://paste.ubuntu.com/208084/
<seb128> walters, http://paste.ubuntu.com/208089/ using gjs git
<seb128> walters, but gnome-shell stats now \o/
<seb128> starts
<walters> seb128: yeah that one needs the clutter patch
<seb128> walters, thanks again, would be nice to roll a new gjs tarball ;-)
<seb128> walters, http://fpaste.org/paste/17179 is not the full patch though, is it?
<seb128> walters, ie it seems to change only the documentation no?
<walters> for clutter it should be yeah
<seb128> I rebuilt clutter using that
<seb128> any gnome-shell start \o/
<walters> cool
<seb128> walters, thanks again for the help there ;-)
<walters> np
<mvo> geser: I uploaded a apt into my PPA that fixes the http problem for me, please let me know if it works for you as well
<crevette> seb128, so how is gnome-shell?
<seb128> crevette, too slow to be usable
<crevette> ah, what is your hardware?
<seb128> crevette, intel 965
<seb128> works great with compiz in a smooth way
<crevette> so without mutter it is better?
<seb128> dunno I didn't try without it
<crevette> ah I thought gnome-shell was better with compiz
<seb128> crevette, how do I do that?
<seb128> crevette, gnome-shell --replace kicks compiz out
<crevette> I don't know if this is possible, I don't the new shell that much
<seb128> <crevette> ah I thought gnome-shell was better with compiz
<crevette> +know
<seb128> ok, that was just random comments? ;-)
<walters> no, gnome-shell is coded to metacity internals
<walters> well, mutter
<crevette> seb128, no I answered that because of "<seb128> works great with compiz in a smooth way"
<seb128> well compiz is fast on intel
<crevette> walters, for  what I tried, I don't like the mutter animation on window opening/close :)
<seb128> anyway I got gnome-shell to run
<seb128> interesting
<seb128> it's working fine but sloooow
<walters> yeah, compiz is pretty optimized at this point, and we have some general slowness, and in particular for the overlay transition are doing some stupid stuff
<seb128> ie switching between applications the animation takes over 1 second
<seb128> it feels very sluggish
<walters> crevette: fair enough =)  i doubt it'd be terribly hard to port/rewrite whatever random flaming window effect plugins
<seb128> walters, anyway it's working in the ppa now so I expect we will soon have daily builds or something so we can help you guys to get some easy testing
<crevette> no no, I don't like faming and such, I love simple thing
<seb128> pitti, can't jockey tell that intel doesn't need closed source drivers in a decent time? ;-)
<walters> seb128: hmm something is definitely wrong, i think other people have it ok on 965, but we know it's pretty bad on 945
<seb128> pitti, the bouncing bar taking 7-8 seconds when activating desktop effects drives me crazy
<seb128> walters, it's karmic which has intel 2.7.99.1 and UXA so it should be decently fast yes
<seb128> owen said yesterday he was doing changes which should make performances better though
<dobey> pitti: weird indeed
<walters> seb128: how big is your screen?
<crevette> seb128, nice if you create a ppa
<seb128> walters, 1440x900 15"
<seb128> crevette, <crevette> ah I thought gnome-shell was better with compiz
<seb128> ups
<seb128> crevette, https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ppa
<walters> seb128: among the fixes he's done is we get a lot slower the more big windows you have since we redraw them all (before his fix)
<seb128> ok, now I would like to figure what is eating ressources there
<seb128> load is 3.65!
<seb128> but nothing is using cpu in a excessive way in top and nothing special is running
<seb128> and it's not gnome-shell since I stopped it
<crevette> seb128, thanks, should be better to have a dedicated ppa for gnome 3.0 package? (/me didn't want to upgrade to GDM, I know I can refuse but I know I will forget to uncheck the box)
<seb128> crevette, I'm going to upload gdm in karmic today so that will be cleaned from the ppa
<crevette> *shouldn't*
<seb128> walters, the "use xephyr or restore desktop when being stopped" is very neat
<crevette> seb128, ah you upload gdm and run to hide for a week on an island. nice plan :)
<walters> seb128: yeah, among the first things i did...having a good development/test cycle is important
<seb128> crevette, pitti will cover for me while I'm away
<dobey> pitti: is it really a requirement that DEB_DH_MKSHLIBS_ARGS be after the includes?
<seb128> ok, back to normal
<pitti> re
<seb128> wb pitti
<dobey> hey pitti
<seb128> pitti, gnome-panel uploaded to drop the fusa detection, I'm ready to upload gdm if you say to do it now ;-)
<pitti> seb128: intel jockey> we might add some special case there
<seb128> pitti, why does it take 7-8 seconds to check for a driver?
<pitti> dobey: yeah, it's weird that it doesn't work to declare it before the includes
<pitti> seb128: go, Seb, go! *hug*
<seb128> I'm curious to know what is so slow
<seb128> and couldn't it cache the information?
<seb128> I'm using the desktop effects tab several times and it's slow on each try
<seb128> pitti, ;-)
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<pitti> seb128: it's the combined slowness of d-bus activation and python and jockey not hardcoding knowledge about drivers :(
<pitti> apt querying apt, etc.
<dobey> pitti: ok
<pitti> seb128: ok, jockey speed is something to look into after beta
<crevette> walters, gnome-shell is supposed to replace the goooood-old panel we love? :)
<walters> crevette: yep
<seb128> pitti, it's nothing new, I'm just complaining because I've been playing with the desktop effects quite a lot today
<seb128> and I keep waiting for this bouncing which makes no sense on intel
<didrocks> seb128: do you think it worths uploading patched clutter 0.9 in universe?
<seb128> didrocks, it doesn't seem to be required for gnome-shell
<didrocks> seb128: just polishing your http://paste.ubuntu.com/208089/ error, right?
<seb128> didrocks, that one is after applying the change
<seb128> didrocks, feel free to upload the change that doesn't hurt ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: I'm not confortable to break everything if you have an experimental stuff that works for next week. So, if it can wait for next release...
<seb128> didrocks, that will not break anything don't worry
<didrocks> ok, so let's patch ;)
<seb128> didrocks, cool
<spc> damn im planning to make me a htpc or better a multimedia pc i tryed kubuntu (but its paint when watching videos from lan, it copies them first) so i tryed ubuntu which is a bit better but i have problems on (k)ubuntu with my cheap labtec wirless keyboard.so anyone can suggest me some good distro or sth to test?
<seb128> spc, try #ubuntu
<spc> oki.
<geser> mvo: looking at your PPA apt FTBFS there
<seb128> the notice about ppas having the same package than yours is sort of cool
<seb128> ie I know that mvo has an outdated clutter-0.9 in his ppa now ;-)
<pitti> seb128: nice, where's that displayed?
<seb128> pitti, https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/clutter-0.9 for example
<pitti> nice!
<seb128> indeed!
<Artir> clutter 1.0 is suposed to fall soon
<didrocks> clutter-0.9_0.9.4-0ubuntu3 waiting for build ;)
<mvo> geser: thanks, looking
<pitti> seb128: meh, gvfs git trunk doesn't build, it complains about the lack of G_FILE_ATTRIBUTE_TYPE_STRINGV
<pitti> seb128: did you happen to see this already for something else?
<pitti> it's nowhere in /usr/include/glib-2.0/
<pitti> gio/gioenums.h has all sorts of G_FILE_ATTRIBUTE_TYPE_*, but not that one
<pitti> ah, that was committed on June 25, so I guess that needs a newer glib
<seb128> pitti, right
<pitti> hm, 2.21.2 is current
<pitti> seb128: ah, http://git.gnome.org/cgit/glib/commit/?id=0ed9201ad2051c33f5d049754bd8a1644d19ab7c
<pitti> seb128: mind if I upload that patch to karmic?
<seb128> pitti, what are you trying to get?
<pitti> seb128: build gvfs git head
<seb128> for karmic or locally?
<pitti> (to do some more hal -> gudev porting)
<seb128> anyway feel free to update
<pitti> seb128: ok; it's just adding new stuff, shoudnl't break anything
<seb128> but gvfs got lot of changes recently
<pitti> right, that's also why I want to develop against git head
<seb128> not sure doing a git snapshot now is the best thing
<pitti> seb128: oh, I don't want to upload gvfs git head
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> feel free then
<pitti> seb128: just the new gio patch for the _STRINGV attribute
<seb128> works for me
<seb128> go go go ;-)
<pitti> uhg, that's a heavy thunderstorm/rain
<pitti> if I fall off the planet, look for some wet small black heap of ash
<seb128> rain would be good there, the temperature is over 30Â°C since the start of the week now
<seb128> looking forward GUADEC to get some wind and water ;-)
<seb128> pitti, on what architecture are you now?
<pitti> seb128: amd64, since about jaunty beta or so
<seb128> hum ok
<pitti> why?
<seb128> pitti, I will ask you to test gnome-shell in a bit if that's ok but amd64 will take a bit longer
<pitti> seb128: I'm happy to
<seb128> thanks!
<pitti> yay new crack!
<pitti> seb128: does it start fast?
<pitti> seb128: does it conflcits: gnome-panel, or does the autostart file do some magic to not start the panel if g-s is running?
<seb128> pitti, yeah, less than 5 seconds on my laptop when testing
<seb128> pitti, gnome-shell does start it in a xephyr so you can test without breaking anything
<pitti> I'd test it with another user
<seb128> pitti, gnome-shell --replace replace gnome-panel but start it back when you stop gnome-shell
<seb128> it's pretty neat
<pitti> if I can have both pacakges installed
<pitti> ah
<pitti> seb128: can we make it to start by default and suppress panel?
<pitti> if you have the package installed?
<seb128> I have to look into that but I expect it's just adding gnome-shell to the session
<pitti> cool
<pitti> for now, that's great for testing
<seb128> it's pretty similar to the unr switcher I guess
<seb128> you can switch between modes easily
<seb128> yes
<pitti> and I can just use it with my own user then
<seb128> right
<seb128> I really like that they made it so easy to test
<seb128> it doesn't break anything running nor your config
<pitti> \o/
<seb128> you can just run it and ctrl-c and you are back to your desktop for normal use
<seb128> on a side note gdm 2.26.1-0ubuntu1 uploaded to karmic
<seb128> pitti, ^
<pitti> go, seb, go!
<seb128> as alex wrote on the gtk list "maybe we live in interesting time" ;-)
<seb128> times
<seb128> (they landed client side rendering to gtk)
<crevette> seb128, lot of things are changing :)
<seb128> (ie rewrote most of gdk)
<seb128> and glib got tons of changes too
<seb128> for one time we got all the crack on a crack cycle and not on a lts one ;-)
<crevette> would be nice if someone was able to build currnet gk for windows in order I can test it
<crevette> I know I'm a little bit off-topic :)
<pitti> crevette: what is windows?
<pitti> sounds like some new GTK theme :)
<crevette> something you don't have to care about but I use averyday
<seb128> crevette, install vmware? ;-)
<crevette> yeah I should consider that but it require to re-install all my stuff
<crevette> I seen one of my customer do that when he sent me a screenshot
<kenvandine> pitti, i'll get those other MIRs done today.. thx for uploading that stuff :)
<pitti> hey kenvandine
<kenvandine> hey pitti
 * kenvandine feels a little dizzy preparing for the trip... wish tomorrow wasn't a holiday here
<lool> mvo: I've pushed your rpm bdep change upstream
<mvo> lool: thanks a lot!
 * mvo hugs the unstoppable lool
<bryce> pitti, good news on those two bugs.  Since the patches are kernel patches, you should let the kernel team know (via lp bugs tagged xorg-needs-kernel-fix) to pull them
<pitti> bryce: well, the first is already in trunk, the second will be submitted soon
<pitti> as long as they make it into karmic, I'm happy
<mvo> geser: another apt is in my ppa now (sorry that it took so long)
<pitti> bryce: I didn't even bother to create LP bugs for them
<geser> mvo: thanks, I can't reproduce it anymore
<mvo> geser: great, but everything else keeps working?
<seb128> pitti, ok, gnome-shell built for amd64 if you want to give it a try
<mvo> seb128: is it in your ppa ?
<pitti> seb128: ubuntu-desktop PPA?
<seb128> pitti, sudo apt-get install gnome-shell && gnome-shell
<pitti> so there it is
<seb128> pitti, it works here but I'm interested to make sure I got the depends right etc
<geser> mvo: yes, as far as I can tell, apt-get -d install downloads all build-depends for camlimages flawless (with around 45 MB/s) and doing a test-build of camlimages with the patched apt installed in my pbuilder worked also
<seb128> mvo, ubuntu-desktop
<seb128> pitti, ^
<pitti> seb128: yup, already downloaded; dpkg grinding :)
<pitti> drum roll, please
<pitti> $ gnome-shell
<pitti> xauth:  creating new authority file /tmp/gnome-shell.y8BHnK/database
<pitti> Could not find Xephyr.
<pitti> meh
<pitti> why xephyr? I want it in my current session
<pitti> seb128: oh, there was this magic --replace or si?
<pitti> so
<seb128> pitti, xserver-xephyr is xephyr
<pitti> hmm, "gnome-shell -r" rearranged my panel a bit, but nothing else
<seb128> pitti, otherwise you can --replace yes
<seb128> so it seems to be crashing for you :-(
<seb128> gnome-shell -r -v ?
<pitti> I ^C'ed it, and now it moved all my windows to workspace 1, and I have a dysfunctional almost-empty panel
<pitti> http://paste.ubuntu.com/208287/
<pitti> it seems to exit mid-way, and I get back to basha
<mvo> geser: excellent, thanks a lot!
<pitti> and compiz restarts
<pitti> seb128: ^
<seb128> pitti, can you dget https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ppa/+files/gjs_0.3~git20090702-0ubuntu0.2.dsc
<mvo> geser: it works well for me too, but additional confirmation is always good
 * mvo hugs geser
<pitti> seb128: do you get these JSErrors, too?
<seb128> pitti, no
<pitti> seb128: got it
<seb128> pitti, go to the source and gjs-console example/gtk.js
<seb128> gjs-console examples/gtk.js
<pitti> "Hello World"
<pitti> seems to work
<pitti> if I click on it, it exits cleanly
<seb128> ok, so the gtk part is working
<pitti> "Typelib file for namespace 'Meta' (any version) not found"
<pitti> is that a missing dependency?
<seb128> well I'm looking for that but I don't have this typelib either in /usr/lib/girepository-1.0
<seb128> walters, ^ any idea?
<walters> need to build mutter with introspection
<pitti> missing mutter gobject-introspection b-dep or so?
<seb128> I'm wondering why it's working for me
<seb128> could be an issue in the amd64 build
<pitti> no, it does install that
<seb128> pitti, the ppa build is working there
 * seb128 looks to build logs
<didrocks> I added introspection to mutter
<pitti> amd64 mutter log does have it, apparently
<seb128> right
<seb128> pitti, oh, you need libmutter-dev
<seb128> pitti, install that an try again?
<pitti> -dev? weird
<seb128> didrocks, ^ could you move the .typelib to the lib?
<didrocks> seb128: yes, and .gir too
<pitti> what are all these fancy new file types?
<didrocks> as we saw that it makes frightening dependencies :)
<seb128> pitti, I would say it's a packaging error but quicker to install the -dev for now
<seb128> didrocks, .gir is a build time thing no?
<pitti> sounds like (g)object (introspection) (r)ambling
<seb128> pitti, gobject introspection
<didrocks> seb128: let me try and see what depends it adds
<pitti> cool, it works!
<pitti> it condensed all my workspaces into one
<pitti> and the activities thing works
<didrocks> seb128: seing that this morning, I was thinking about moving both files. But ok, let's try with typelib only
<seb128> pitti, excellent, thanks for the testing
<seb128> pitti, it does the same there, not sure if that's a design decision or a bug
<seb128> the "no workspace"
<seb128> didrocks, I'm not sure, checking what other packages do
<seb128> didrocks, not that we have lot of gir packages to compare
<seb128> didrocks, but I think .gir is used for the build
<seb128> pitti, working at a normal speed or sluggish?
<pitti> veeeeery sluggish
<pitti> and it totally breaks notify-osd
<didrocks> seb128: dunno. I added a bunch of .gir files in clutter because of adding introspection :)
<pitti> I see some shadows, but no real bubbles that I can read
<seb128> pitti, yeah, MacSlow was expecting that for notify-osd
<pitti> does this have an equivalent concept of workspaces?
<pitti> like, can I continue to have my "development view" (terminals, IRC), "communication view" (empathy, mail), and "web view" (firefox)?
<pitti> seb128: so it's not just slow for me?
<kenvandine> pitti,  yeah... you can drag the windows around between workspaces in the activities view
<MacSlow> pitti, you mean gnome-shell and notify-osd don't go well together?
<pitti> MacSlow: that, too
<MacSlow> pitti, that's something I cannot address atm
<pitti> hm, is there a way to make some better use of this very large and unused top panel?
<kenvandine> i want the indicator in it :)
<kenvandine> it is too think
<pitti> "thick"?
<kenvandine> big
<pitti> yes, and just 30% used
<kenvandine> thick
<kenvandine> yeah
<pitti> and now I have this "recent docs" and other stuff on the left hand side
<pitti> this could go to the top panel
<pitti> and I have a bottom panel :(
<kenvandine> you can collapse that stuff
<seb128> pitti, not yet that I know
<pitti> I did, but still
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> i know
<kenvandine> i hate that it has two clocks :)
<kenvandine> not sure why that bugs me so much
<pitti> ah, just discovered that big + button
<kenvandine> oh... yeah... to get more workspaces
<pitti> can't drag/drop to the third, nice bug
<kenvandine> oh... yeah
<kenvandine> funny
<kenvandine> you can in the 2nd and 4th
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> it's the "bottom left" one
<kenvandine> no matter how many you have
<kenvandine> weird
<walters> pitti: the way metacity and compiz represent workspaces is different, i forget exactly how but the gnome workspaces applet papers over it
<pitti> ah, right, it's a metacity fork
<didrocks> new version updated, you don't have anymore to install whole world of -dev deps for libmutter0 :)
<didrocks> pitti: when this version will be built, can you try please to aptitude purge libmutter-dev and see if it still works?
<seb128> re
<didrocks> re seb128
<seb128> yeah, internet back to normal, my issues since yesterday were due to my switch
<seb128> it keeps turn off and on again for some reason
<seb128> did somebody say something for me recently?
<didrocks> so, nothing related with the phone as you were infering
<pitti> didrocks: sure
<seb128> didrocks, no, the phone issue is a real one, it tends to cut the internet when ringing
<didrocks> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/208306/
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
<seb128> didrocks, you didn't forget the Replaces right? ;-)
<seb128> just checking
<didrocks> humâ¦ :/
<seb128> walters, well both workspace and viewports work with wnckapplet
<seb128> didrocks, ;-)
<didrocks> I told myself it was an experimental package and we wanted something cleaned. Didn't think about you poors guys updating :)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> yeahyeah
<didrocks> ok, so, if you really want to upgrade wait -ubuntu3 is under release ;)
<didrocks> (I think we will clean that when the package will enter ubuntu)
<seb128> didrocks, we will
<seb128> hey rickspencer3!
<rickspencer3> seb128: !
<rickspencer3> do you know what hotel we were booked into?
<seb128> had a good trip to desktop summit?
<seb128> rickspencer3, www.hotelfataga.com
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<didrocks> hi rickspencer3
<kenvandine> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi guyses
<rickspencer3> so I'm at the conference, just got here
<pitti> rickspencer3: give seb128 a big hug! gnome-shell packaged!
 * rickspencer3 hugs seb128
<rickspencer3> thanks seb128 you are awesome
<kenvandine> i would use it full time if it had an indicator plugin :)
<seb128> rickspencer3, np, that was quite some work but didrocks, asac and walters helped me a lot ;-)
<kenvandine> and now it shouldn't keep breaking... like using jhbuild did
<mclasen> if the indicator stuff was upstream...
<kenvandine> well... it is upstream :)  ayatana is upstream for now, but there is plans to try to get it hosted on fd.o
<kenvandine> s/is/are/
 * kenvandine wonders how hard it would be to write a plugin for the gnome-shell panel
<mclasen> kenvandine: your 'upstream' will have to fix the integration issues then, I guess...
<awe>  /back
<rickspencer3> good morning awe
<awe> rickspencer3: morning
<rickspencer3> well ... it's evening here! and time to find the hotel
<awe> canary?
 * rickspencer3 requires food and beer, not necessarily in that order
<awe> i bet the weather's nicer than here in boston ( rain, rain, more rain )
<awe> rickspencer3: enjoy!
<rickspencer3> awe: yes, I am certain the weather is nicer than Boston ;)
<pitti> better here: rain, rain, rain, and major thunderstorm :)
<awe> they cancelled the fireworks tonite because of rain!  ;(
<didrocks> pitti: luckyâ¦ it's too warm here and no wind :)
<rickspencer3> awe: tonight?
<awe> they stagger them around here...
<rickspencer3> I thought we were 6 hours ahead, not two days behind Boston
<awe> the big boston fireworks are still saturday!  ;)
 * rickspencer3 high fives seb128 and didrocks and asac
<rickspencer3> gnome-shell looks very comfy in the ppa
<didrocks> pitti: I can't change the quickly spec status
<didrocks> pitti: sorry, I was not logged, strangely :/
<pitti> didrocks: LP threw me out as well several times in the last days
<didrocks> pitti: but I still can't change the Definition :)
<pitti> didrocks: URL, and which state do you want?
 * pitti -> dinner, bbl
<didrocks> pitti: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-karmic-quickly and "Review" as rick seems to agree with my changes
<didrocks> have a good dinner
<pitti> didrocks: changed
<didrocks> pitti: thanks
<pitti> good night everyone!
<pitti> seb128, kenvandine: have a safe trip, and enjoy the summit!
 * pitti hugs the Gran Canarians
 * pitti will call it a day now and spend some time with his wife
<pitti> I managed to port gvfs' gphoto volume monitor to hal \o/
<pitti> erm, to udev, of course :)
<kenvandine> pitti, thx
<didrocks> good night pitti!
<hggdh> seb128, was it expected that the new gdm would kill X on install/config?
<hggdh> i.e., under synaptic, selected all updates (including gdm), and suddenly my Gnome session vanished
<artir> now all u are at about 200 km of me :)
<crevette> gdm update wants to remove fusa which will remove ubuntu-desktop, is it intended?
<seb128> hggdh, no, it should open a new session but your running one is still open
<seb128> hggdh, ie you can switch back to it
<seb128> crevette, changelogs are made to be read especially in unstable versions ;-)
<seb128> crevette, reply "yes", fusa has not been ported to new gdm I wrote it in the changelog
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<crevette> seb128, actually the update manager greyes the update, asking to dist-upgrade, but the dist-upgrade is cancelled by a dialog telling my system is up to date, and the dist-upgrade will be cancelled :)
 * crevette wil fetch the changelog by himself
 * ajmitch wonders if anyone really uses metacity anymore
<hggdh> seb128, this did not happen. There was no GDM left
<crevette> ajmitch, I use it everyday :)
<seb128> hggdh, are you sure? or you didn't use the right ctrl-alt-fn?
<seb128> hggdh, it autolog your user again when starting if you have autologin for example
<hggdh> seb128, ctrl-alt-f6/7/8/9
<ajmitch> crevette: great, you haven't seen it chewing 100% CPU time have you? :)
<seb128> hggdh, but the session is still running
<hggdh> ps -ef | grep gdm
<seb128> hggdh, gdm might not be running bug your session?
<crevette> ajmitch, do you use compositor?
 * ajmitch isn't seeing his problem in the list of open bugs yet
<hggdh> seb128, I was thrown back into term1
<ajmitch> crevette: no
<ajmitch> I tried switching & it fails
<seb128> hggdh, ok, maybe xorg crashed on vt switch or something for you
<seb128> hggdh, I doubt it's due to gdm itself though
<crevette> ajmitch, I didn't had the issue you report
<ajmitch> crevette: I'm probably unique like that ;)
<crevette> sorry :/
 * ajmitch will file a bug later
<seb128> ajmitch, it was making gconf use cpu there while using compiz today but I played with gnome-shell before
<hggdh> seb128, please see http://pastebin.ca/1482237
<seb128> so not sure if some manager switch didn't work correctly
<ajmitch> there's some switching that isn't working properly for me, but it's the metacity process that ends up taking the CPU time
<hggdh> seb128, GDM was stopped
<seb128> hggdh, you have kdm in this log too
<ajmitch> I'll have to wait until I have time this evening to sort it out
<hggdh> seb128, yes. I have KDE, xfce, and gnome. I usually run gnome. The important piece is the apt log showing a STOP action on GDM, and KDM configuration stating no display :0.0 was found -- ergo, no X
<seb128> hggdh, well there is no stop action in the gdm.postinst and I've never seen this issue neither did other people who tried the update
<seb128> hggdh, ie "dunno"
<hggdh> seb128, well, if nobody has it, I think we can throw this on into the WTF bin ;-)
<hggdh> but it is clear that somebody sent a STOP to gdm. This is rather weird
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-07-03
<TheMuso> Ok that was weird. My whole session just died on me with no warning.
<TheMuso> Using new gdm.
<hyperair> huh the new gdm doesn't allow me to shutdown any more.
<TheMuso> hyperair: Works for me.
<TheMuso> However, the touchpad on my notebook is not working, this after a fresh install from a daily.
<pitti> Good morning
<hyperair> my touchpad still works
<didrocks> morning o/
<crevette> salit didrocks
<crevette> salut
<pitti> hey didrocks, morning crevette
<asac> morning
<didrocks> plop crevette, morning pitti
<didrocks> hey asac
<asac> hi didrocks
<pitti> hey asac
<crevette> hello pitti
<asac> hmm launchpad seems to forget that i am logged in recently
<didrocks> asac: pitti and I have the same trouble those days
<asac> good ;)
<pitti> asac: FSVO "good"
<pitti> gvfs (1.3.1-0ubuntu3) UNRELEASED; urgency=low
<pitti>   The "bye-bye, hal!" release.
<pitti> \o/
<pitti> my long nights of porting work weren't in vain
<rickspencer3> !
<rickspencer3> congrats pitti
<pitti> hey rickspencer3, unusual time :)
<pitti> how's the summit?
<rickspencer3> heh
<rickspencer3> I slept late today, 8:30am!
<pitti> not surprising
<rickspencer3> summit really starts tonight
<rickspencer3> with our party!
<rickspencer3> today, me = get quickly demo working + get quickly package working + update tutorial :o
<pitti> shouldn't the party be at the _end_ of the work? :-)
<pitti> rickspencer3: have gnome-shell running already?
<rickspencer3> heh
<pitti> didrocks: BTW, seeems I still need the -dev
<rickspencer3> I brought my eee running Jaunty
<rickspencer3> so no gnome shell for me, at least until after my talk on Sunday
<rickspencer3> then maybe it's time to upgrade to Karmic
<didrocks> pitti: really? let me see again
<didrocks> (finishing a email to rickspencer3 first ;))
<didrocks> an*
<rickspencer3> heh
<pitti> didrocks: didn't try this morning yet, though; don't worry, low urgency
<asac> Riddell: msg ;)
<asac> pitti: so on hal: we wont get rid of hal in NM 0.7.2 ... the udev patch is just too intrusive. means: unless we ship a cracky 0.8 snapshot we will need to wait one cycle to demote hal.
<asac> am i supposed to add that to that wiki page?
<pitti> asac: hm, a pity
<pitti> asac: demoting is not my primary concern
<pitti> it's shipping/installing hal by default
<pitti> it takes boot time, maintenance, etc.
<pitti> I guess backporting http://cgit.freedesktop.org/NetworkManager/NetworkManager/commit/?id=c9067d8fedf6f6f2d530fd68bbfca7ce68638d38 would be quite a challenge, indeed
<asac> hmm
<pitti> asac: if we need it still, so be it
<pitti> we still have all the other bits ported already, so the structural changes in LL won't be so many
<asac> not sure how much folks would hate me for shipping a 0.8 pre snapshot ... its quite stable for me, but you know how it is: if its a snapshot and its the driver they wine for ages that its NM fault and how bad we are ;)
<asac> whine
<asac> otoh, it would help to flash out bugs for LTS
<pitti> asac: I think it's your call, as the NM expert, but I'd advise you to consider whether it's wise to do that major step in LL
<pitti> Karmic will be crackful either way, but I'd like the intrusive changes to be in Karmic, not in LL
<asac> i definitly would need to talk to dan
<asac> pitti: i see that
<pitti> asac: don't let the hal issue alone drive that decision only, of course :)
<asac> its just that we have some quite challenging todos for 0.8 so we hoped to do a 0.7.2 this cycle .... but well ;)
<asac> pitti: sure not.
<pitti> if 0.8 is just not ready yet, then so be it
<asac> 0.8 is also modemmanager based
<asac> and modemmanager is now also migrated to udev (almost completely)
<asac> i will think about it ;)
<asac> and talk to dan. if we go for this, we probably want it in asap ... so we can back it out if there are too many problems i cannot fix
<pitti> right
<asac> stay tuned ;)
<pitti> and to collect the problems in the first place
<asac> pitti: so is this info needed on the dehalificatio nwiki?
<pitti> asac: do you have this in a PPA by any chance?
<pitti> asac: I just changed it to "no upstream release yet"
<asac> pitti: yes. i have a trunk PPA ... but its the first package round i havent even tested on my own yet ;)
<pitti> asac: feel free to add it there, of course
<asac> https://edge.launchpad.net/~network-manager/+archive/trunk
<pitti> meh, CDs still don't build
 * pitti pokes
<asac> i will try to get bugabundo or someone else eager on it to get some initial testing ;)
<pitti> I'm happy to help testing (eth/iwl3945/wpa2, boring and very common :) )
<pitti> asac: btw, does 0.8 switch from iw to cfg80211 already?
<asac> yeah. but only once i know it works ;)
<asac> pitti: NM uses wpasupplicant ... its not doing any wireless on its own
<pitti> ah, so that won't be updated
<asac> we are using wext driver
<asac> pitti: well ... i see that wpa_supplicant has nl80211 driver;)
<asac> we could give that a shoot
<asac> though that would probably need to be a driver specific hack
<pitti> ah, "wext" sounds like "iw", yes
<asac> e.g. for intel, use nl80211 ... otherwise wxec
<pitti> very few drivers support cfg80211 yet, though
<asac> i think all in mainline kernel
<asac> except the old ones like ipw2x00
<asac> but no clue how mature ;)
<tjaalton> why does the gnome session reset my keymap to us?
<tjaalton> works in gdm
<asac> it did that for me too
<asac> also while upgrading it locked the screen and i had to log-in
<tjaalton> perhaps it's the new gdm doing tricks?
<tjaalton> falling back to system defaults from the capplet restores the correct one
<tjaalton> but only for the running session
<asac> bug 395057
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 395057 in malone "bug search in teams broken" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/395057
<asac> *sigh*
<asac> tjaalton: i thought it was gdm problem yes
<asac> also thought, lets wait if its transitional ;)
<tjaalton> yeah, I'll check back after the weekend :)
<rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: asac: bryce: ccheney: kenvandine: pitti: Riddell: TheMuso: gentle reminder that date has changed for expense reports being due (now need to be signed off by the 5th ... so get them to me tomorrow if you have any outstanding expenses)
 * ajmitch really shouldn't try & run karmic on here, gdm is being nasty to me again
<pitti> ajmitch: --verbose?
<ajmitch> is there a bug open about not being able to start the gdm greeter?
<pitti> I doubt it, we just switched to it yesterday in karmic
<ajmitch> ok :)
<pitti> a few of us have had it running for some weeks before, though
<pitti> ajmitch: what does it say?
 * ajmitch only just upgraded after having the X session die 3 times already this evening
<ajmitch> one sec
<rickspencer3> someone mentioned to me that an upload yesterday *did* break gdm
<ajmitch> "Cannot start the greeter application, you will not be able to login"
<pitti> it was probably "gdm" :)
<asac> rickspencer3: thanks for the update
<ajmitch>  /var/log/syslog has a single line about not being able to start it
 * ajmitch checks to see if he has a non-default config
<bryce> rickspencer3, all mine are in
<pitti> ajmitch: anything helpful in /var/log/gdm/:0-greeter.log ?
<pitti> ajmitch: (beware: f***ed permissions, needs root)
 * rickspencer3 takes his poor grasp of Spanish to explore Las Palmas before DS starts
<asac> have fun
<pitti> rickspencer3: "Dos cervesas, por favor", and "gracias" will get you quite far :-P
<rickspencer3> dns stopped resolving in the hotel, so I'm taking that as a sign
<ajmitch> pitti: I have no such log
<pitti> hah
<rickspencer3-afk> pitti: donde esta la playa?
<ajmitch> I don't have an upgraded X yet, I was still upgrading the rest of things :)
<pitti> ajmitch: the same source package should have worked in jaunty as well, hmm
<ajmitch> yeah, what can I turn on to get more debugging info?
 * pitti is not really with new gdm yet either, hang on
<pitti> ajmitch: do you have a non-empty /etc/gdm/custom.conf ?
<ajmitch> it exists but the sections such as [chooser] are empty
<pitti> right, here too
<ajmitch> I also have gdm.conf-custom with similar sections
<pitti> ajmitch: what's in /var/log/gdm?
<ajmitch> hm, I have a :1-greeter.log in there
<pitti> hm, no :0? weird
<pitti> and nothing else?
<pitti> it should also have an Xorg log
<ajmitch> one sec, I may be able to pastebinit :)
<ajmitch> http://pastebin.com/f6165ae1b
 * ajmitch should probably switch to the laptop which has working X still
<pitti> ajmitch: so, perhaps you could do:
<pitti> - stop gdm
<pitti> - purge all logs
<pitti> -start gdm
<pitti> - paste the created logs?
<ajmitch> sure, can try that
<ajmitch> too used to stopping apache2, almost killed that off instead
<geser> ajmitch: I had the same problem yesterday when I updated gdm. it went away after a reboot
<ajmitch> great to know :)
<ajmitch> I have a bit more to upgrade (kernel, X) before I can do a reboot
<ajmitch> I've stopped gdm, but X is still running with that greeter error
<ajmitch> it *looks* like there's an old gdm process from about 2 months ago still running
<ajmitch> I'll kill that one & restart gdm
<hyperair> murderer!
<ajmitch> ok, apart from having a completly white desktop with nothing visible but a mouse cursor, I'm in :)
<ajmitch> but that's a minor aesthetic detail, right?
<pitti> ajmitch: ah, that would be it
<pitti> ajmitch: it's the new karmic theme
<pitti> very clean and fresh
<pitti> much less disturbing than all this gnome crap
<pitti> ajmitch: if you upgraded to karmic and didn't reboot for 2 months, then you should have much worse problems, though :)
<ajmitch> 56 days, so I still have about 5 days to go before I have problems, right? ;)
<ajmitch> problem was, I had X randomly dying in the middle of me doing stuff, such as installing upgrades in synaptic
<ajmitch> nothing in syslog to indicate segfaults that I could see
<bryce> ajmitch, X crash or freeze?
<ajmitch> bryce: I wasn't sure if it was X or gdm that was crashing, but it wasn't a freeze
<ajmitch> and this is with a jaunty X server & nvidia driver
 * ajmitch is just upgrading those to karmic versions now
<bryce> nvidia *shudder*
<ajmitch> you aren't a fan of nvidia? :)
<pitti> bryce: for bug 377090, is the kernel update enough, or does it need more userspace fixes?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 377090 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[i945gm] (Needs kernel 2.6.31) DRI2 swapbuffers" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/377090
<bryce> pitti, kernel ought to be enough
<pitti> bryce: the upstream bug just has a kernel fix
<pitti> but that bug has mesa, x11proto, etc. tasks
<bryce> ajmitch, the nvidia people I like, but the driver itself, notsomuch
<pitti> bryce: so shall we close it and see if anyone yells "still there"?
<bryce> pitti, that sounds fine
<pitti> I sent a call for testing yesterday, but no reply
<ajmitch> bryce: well I'm about to be brave & try the 185 driver on 2.6.31
<pitti> bryce: ok, "proactive bug cleaning" then :)
<bryce> ajmitch, bravo
<bryce> pitti, good
<pitti> bryce: thanks
<pitti> bryce: btw, nice "bug storm" blog posts
<pitti> well, "nice" -> "good read"
 * ajmitch just hopes that the little things like mdadm & lvm2 still work on reboot
<bryce> pitti, thanks
<pitti> bug 341898 seems fixed as well, closing
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 341898 in xorg-server "MythTV Frontend does not work with RADEON DRI" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/341898
<didrocks> pitti: libmutter0*-0ubuntu3 depends anymore on libclutter-dev. Is it failing when launching it? (I only have a VirtualBox at work, so, no 3D acceleration, but mutter seems to start and run)
<bryce> pitti, yeah I hope it gives enough food for thought to generate some solutions to this specific problem.
<pitti> didrocks: is it in the PPA now?
<pitti> didrocks: I dist-upgraded/started g-s last night, it still failed without -dev
<didrocks> pitti: apt-cache policy libmutter0 ?
<pitti> bryce: I like the general idea of karma restrictions, but the "lock out upstream" is a problem
<pitti> didrocks: 2.27.0~git090630-0ubuntu3
<pitti> didrocks: it might have been upgraded this morning; give me some minutes, I'll try it again soon
<didrocks> pitti: ok, you have the last verion. What error message do you have?
<pitti> yay CDs! http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/20090703.3/
<didrocks> verrsion*
<pitti> now with new gdm
<bryce> pitti, yeah me too, but one of the commenters to my post had a tweak that I think might solve that in a really nice way
<pitti> bryce: oh?
<bryce> yay dailies
<superm1> pitti, bug 341898's upstream bug was only fixed for -vesa I thought
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 341898 in xorg-server "MythTV Frontend does not work with RADEON DRI" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/341898
<superm1> at least no one has commented otherwise for -ATI
<pitti> superm1: oh, you yourself closed the upstream one, saying that this mesa commit fixed it?
<pitti> so should it be reopened upstream against mesa then?
<superm1> yeah it should.  the discussion about -ATI headed with upstream disagreeing and saying it's a QT bug and nothing happening
<bryce> pitti, basically, couple restrictions with length-of-post, so it only kicks in for low karma users if the post-length is small.
<superm1> mythtv 0.22 should be coming out during the karmic cycle though using QT4, and I believe it's a noop then at least
<pitti> ah
<pitti> superm1: something to put into my release status report then
<bryce> we can expect most upstream people who comment will make > 1 sentence reply
<superm1> i'm still tracking and watching for some upstream related changes to mesa and QT3 though
<superm1> sorry, i probably should have made that clearer somewhere
<pitti> so if it's wontfix for radeon in mesa, and fixed for other drivers, should the mesa task be closed?
<ajmitch> bryce: so not based on whitelisting from teams or anything complex?
<superm1> well upstream mythtv agrees that it's not a QT bug, so it's hard to say whose really right here
<superm1> a mesa changeset introduced it, and no one has been able to identify what about QT would be causing such bug
<bryce> ajmitch, right.
<bryce> ajmitch, although presumably anyone who joins a team will have more than the tiny required karma already
<ajmitch> bryce: I'm just thinking of things like sync sponsoring, where the only comment is something like "+1" or "ACK"
 * ajmitch had very little karma until recently :)
<bryce> ajmitch, you seem to have 4911 karma, well >> than 50.  :-)
<ajmitch> yes, it's amazing how a few uploads increased my karma
<bryce> yeah it's been my experience that anyone who has done >anything< for ubuntu is way, way more worthwhile to listen to than anyone with <50 karma.
<pitti> Riddell: so you said that bug 339313 is basically fixed in karmic; do you still want to keep it open for remaining corner cases, or should they get new bug reports?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 339313 in ubuntu-release-notes "Kubuntu Jaunty: Cannot Connect To Wireless Network with WEP shared key" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/339313
<Riddell> pitti: keep it open I think
<geser> why do I need to reset my keyboard layout everytime I login to gnome? I see this behaviour after the gdm update
<pitti> Riddell: ok; there was no recent update, so I wondered about the status of it (for release team meeting)
<pitti> geser: you shouldn't need to; does gdm show the correct layout for you?
<geser> pitti: where should I see it? as I've auto-login activated
<pitti> geser: (I'm saying that it sounds like a bug)
<pitti> geser: ah, then you won't see the greeter indeed
<pitti> geser: I heared other complaints; can you please file a bug and mark it regression-potential and subscribe me?
<pitti> Riddell: could you please update the bug status to say what's still left?
<geser> pitti: against gdm?
<pitti> geser: yes
<Laney> has there been a change in mounting behaviour? I just restarted and am now being asked for a password to mount my windows partition on login
<Laney> this partition was never automounted before
<pitti> Laney: it's a bug
<pitti> on my list
<Laney> is it filed?
<Laney> alright
<pitti> we shouldn't automount internal partitions
<pitti> Laney: not sure whether it's in LP
<pitti> Laney: but I even think that my gvfs upload from this morning fixed it
<Laney> and I see no option to shutdown on fusa either, is that another one?
<didrocks> pitti, ajmitch : I confirm the upgrade mess too (gdm-greeter won't spawn), and rebooting is mandatory
<pitti> didrocks: yes, see gdm changelog; known upgrade issue
<pitti> there's really no good way to upgrade this online
<didrocks> and switching to an awful qwerty keyboard :)
<pitti> US layout is the only sensible thing for a programmer
<ajmitch> didrocks: in my case it appears that there was a stale gdm process hanging around, which a reboot would of course kill
<pitti> didrocks: sounds like geser's bug
<ajmitch> killing that let me restart gdm & login
<didrocks> pitti: right, I will confirme his bug
 * ajmitch is just looking at open bugs now
<didrocks> ajmitch: I was actually on a virtualbox and ttyx don't spawn, so, I'm unable to check of another X process running :/
<Laney> oh, the fusa changes just haven't been done yet
<ajmitch> ah, this was on my main development machine, nothing critical ;)
<didrocks> ^^
<didrocks> bbl
<ajmitch> Laney: ubuntu-desktop not installable still?
<Laney> ajmitch: huh, don't know about that one
<geser> does somebody else witness spontanous gnome logouts? I happened the second time for me today :( I see a black screen and when the picture comes back I get an fresh gnome
<Keybuk> These windows do not support "save current setup": Login window
<ajmitch> geser: yes,  4 times tonight
<ajmitch> after that I'd installed a new gdm (2.26)
<Keybuk> and my keyboard reverted back to US Layout *again*
 * ajmitch has heard that complaint a few times in here this evening
<Laney> I saw the save current setup thing
<Laney> (directly after login)
<geser> pitti: bug #395103
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 395103 in gdm "Gnome doesn't have my configured keyboard layout after login anymore" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/395103
<pitti> geser: thanks, I'll put it on the "OMGkarmic!" bug list
<pitti> geser: can you please attach your xorg.conf for completeness?
<geser> attached
<geser> I know that fusa doesn't work with the new gdm yet but shouldn't I've a (menu) option for shutdown/reboot somewhere? I can only logout
<pitti> geser: it's back in the system menu for now
<geser> not for me: I've only Preferences, Administration, Help and Support, About Gnome there
<geser> I've a "User Switch Applet" in my panel with "Lock Screen" and "Log Out"
<geser> bug #43299 seems to be back with the new gdm, should I reopen it or better file a new bug?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 43299 in gdm "Can't login with a different user if Automatic login is set" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/43299
<pitti> geser: please reopen it (seb and I talked about it, known issue, but let's track it)
<Laney> geser: same for me too (shutdown stuff)
<pitti> hm, seb said that he reverted teh gnome-panel patch, let me check
<pitti> argh, failed to build
<pitti> probably autoconfiscation, will fix now
<Laney> such fun
<pitti> hah, seems seb already committed it to bzr, and then forgot to upload, or something
<pitti> done
<pitti> thanks for pointing out
<Laney> pitti: do you know when you'll be able to look at the MIR for pngquant?
<geser> pitti: with hal going away who should set the ACL for my smart-card-reader now? where should I move the changes from bug 57755 to?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 57755 in hal "Udev Rules for SmartCard Support" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/57755
<pitti> geser: the smartcard stuff was rejected upstream in hal as well :( hang ong
<pitti> geser: I committed it upstream, and Danny reverted it (http://cgit.freedesktop.org/hal/commit/?id=1579ccee0c25606c39e831b98c129c54ec3894ae), saying that it was handled in the opensc pacakge
<pitti> so that should ship the udev rules
<pitti> geser: it's still a nasty hack, though
<pitti> (raw device access by user space processes)
<pitti> so this should probably be discussed in http://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19663 and reopened
<ubottu> Freedesktop bug 19663 in hald "define policy keyword for Smart Card readers" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<pitti> whoops, no, not there, but in opensc
<pitti> Laney: looking
<Laney> cool beans
<pitti> Laney: ah, I remember; promoted
<Laney> thanks muchly
<pitti> do we need to add that b-dep to tomboy now, or is it already?
<geser> tomboy is in depwait on pngquant
<Laney> it's already depwait on it
<pitti> yay
<geser> pitti: are .fdi files still used in a hal-free world?
<pitti> geser: no, they are hal specific
<pitti> they were/are being converted to udev rules, or application specific data files
<geser> so are we back where it started (udev rules)? part of the problem was to find the correct package to ship the udev rules as gnupg, gnupg2 and libccid need that rules but they don't have a common dependency
<geser> it isn't possible to limit access to specific users just with udev rules without introducing new groups, is it?
<pitti> geser: you can also chmod them to 666
<pitti> or mark them for automatic ACLs
<pitti> (similar to hal)
<geser> automatic ACLs sounds fine. who sets them?
<pitti> application/hardwrae specific packaes (such as libgphoto2 or libsane) mark the devices
<pitti> e. g. /lib/udev/rules.d/40-libgphoto2-2.rules
<pitti> and then udev's ACL mechanism sets the ACLs (/lib/udev/rules.d/70-acl.rules)
<geser> seems interesting
<pitti> geser: but certainly gnupg, gnupg2, and libccid don't all implement their own smartcard support, but use some kind of library?
<geser> so it looks like I need a udev rules file which sets ACL_MANAGE for the correct device
<pitti> if they do implement them, they need to ship separrate rules, since probably they also have differing sets of supported cards?
<pitti> geser: please don't directly set ACL_MANAGE, set ID_SMARTCARD_READER="1"
<geser> pitti: both gnupg and gnupg2 have native support to access the SCM smart card reader, they don't need any library for it
<pitti> then we can commit the ACL management for those to udev directly
<pitti> (ugh bad design)
<pitti> then they'd need to ship their own rules, too
<geser> ah, the pieces move slowly together
<geser> does udev-acl need any additional configuration files?
<pitti> but ideally they wouldn't copy all that SC code, but put it into a proper library
<pitti> geser: no, it just works
<pitti> geser: could you quickly hop into #udev?
<geser> sure
<asac> so for gtk git, PKG_CONFIG_PATH isnt enough to build against a newer glib installed at a non-standard place anymore ... one also needs to set LD_LIBRARY_PATH
 * asac wonders when that started
<ArneGoetje> rickspencer3: already done. :)
<jcastro> rickspencer31: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/06/21/gimp-vs-fspot-in-ubuntu/
<rickspencer31> dang it, looks like those discovered my true evil intention :/
<rickspencer31> pitti: ^^^
<rickspencer31> according to this article, I want to push the gimp off the CD as part of my pro-Microsoft agenda, a diabolical plan to thwart FOSS software by promoting Mono
<pitti> I _knew_ it!!!111!!
 * rickspencer31 invests in tinfoil
<pitti> well, I very much like to rescue gimp itself
<pitti> I'd rather drop the help
<rickspencer31> meh
<rickspencer31> I'd like to add cropping and red-eye removal to eog in any case
<pitti> yeah
<rickspencer31> I don't think there's much value to having gimp in the default install, but not too much harm either
<pitti> well, f-spot and me have a long-standing mutual hatred relationship
<rickspencer31> except that it's not mono based
<pitti> but it's not at all related to programming languages ;)
<rickspencer31> f-spot is for photo *management*, it's a totally different scenario than eog or gimp
<pitti> new tomboy just saved us 1.1 MB \o/
<didrocks> +1
<rickspencer31> imnsho
<rickspencer31> sweet
<rickspencer31> didrocks: perhaps we should change quickly to create a mono project instead?
 * rickspencer31 ducks
 * didrocks is creating mono-project template ;)
<rickspencer31> shouldn
<rickspencer31> t quickly itself be mono instead of python
 * rickspencer31 files bug to remove python from distro
<pitti> rickspencer31: I agree, that's why I wouldn't like to compare f-spot and gimp, or say that one obsoletes the other
<didrocks> quickly evil-rickspencer31 will remove all non-mono application from your desktop :)
<geser> rickspencer31: you mean replace python with ironpython?
<didrocks> rickspencer31: oh, good idea ;)
<evil-rick> mhwhahaha
<didrocks> :)
 * pitti cranks a new daily CD, this one should work much better
<rickspencer3> didrocks: https://edge.launchpad.net/quickly
<rickspencer3> I updated the page a little
<pitti> I unbroke CDs this morning and tested today's, works reasonably
<didrocks> rickspencer3: nice. This should go to "quickly start" command also
<pitti> I fixed gnome-panel and casper, so it should do well now
<didrocks> I will do it tonight
 * rickspencer3 pastes didrocks email into wiki.ubuntu.com/Quickly
<rickspencer3> what is "start"?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Quickly when you will have paste it :)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: "$ quickly start      (NEW one! show some notes about How-to start)"
<rickspencer3> get-started perhaps?
<rickspencer3> $quickly get-started
<rickspencer3> ?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: better, yes. Let me change it
<rickspencer3> didrocks: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Quickly, btw
<didrocks> rickspencer3: get-started will not be possible (no dash in python function)
<rickspencer3> lol
<rickspencer3> getstarted
<rickspencer3> or get_started ?
<didrocks> I prefer "getstarted"
<mdz> hello from Gran Canaria
<didrocks> rickspencer3: new revision pushed and https://edge.launchpad.net/quickly changed slightely
<didrocks> hey mdz
 * pitti waves to mdz
<james_w> didrocks: bzr has code to rewrite "_" to "-" in command names
<james_w> well, it's just a .replace(), but you could do the same :-)
<didrocks> james_w: yes, maybe I can do that: get - command name and change them inside the code to call the _ function
<didrocks> but I'm not a big fan of those-kind-of-command-name
<james_w> ah, you use an "if" statement, I see that it's not as easy
<didrocks> james_w: that's my case in command line args processing. Well, will see later :)
<james_w> :-)
<pitti> kenvandine: hm, libempathy-gtk24 pulls in geoclue
<pitti> which pulls in glib1.2 (!)
<pitti> I think that's just a wrong build-dep
<pitti> but still, not sure whether we want/need this right now
<pitti> Riddell: Kubuntu CDs look pretty good right now size-wise; do you plan to add large new stuff during karmic?
<pitti> Riddell: or could we use that space for langpacks towards the release?
<chrisccoulson> is ubuntu-system-service only for changing default gconf values?
<Keybuk> pitti: weird keyboard bug today
<Keybuk> gdm uses UK
<Keybuk> I log in
<Keybuk> my session uses USA
<Keybuk> Keyboard -> Layouts says "USA"
<Keybuk> but then when I click "Reset to Defaults", it goes back to "UK"
<Keybuk> rebooting doesn't save UK, I'm back in USA again
<pitti> Keybuk: bug 395103
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 395103 in gdm "Gnome doesn't have my configured keyboard layout after login anymore" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/395103
<pitti> unfortunate regression from new gdm
<pitti> I never noticed, since I'm actually using US; I wonder how it worked for Seb
<Keybuk> even weirder, it seems to affect the *console* layout too
<Keybuk> if I login to single user mode, it's UK
<Keybuk> once X has been started, it's USA
<pitti> but in gdm itself it's okay?
<Keybuk> yup
<chrisccoulson> wierd
<chrisccoulson> something loads /desktop/gnome/peripherals/keyboard/kbd/layouts with "us" when the session loads
<chrisccoulson> it should be empty by default, which is why "reset to default" makes it work again
<pitti> hm, not in /var/lib/gdm/.gconf.mandatory/%gconf-tree.xml
<chrisccoulson> right, gdm is setting GDM_KEYBOARD_LAYOUT in the environment to "us", and presumably something in the session (g-s-d?) loads it in to gconf
<pitti> ah, indeed
<chrisccoulson> so, definately a GDM bug
<pitti> right
<pitti> you can't even set the keyboard layout in gdm
<pitti> so as a bandaid we should just stop setting this
<chrisccoulson> hmmmm, looking at the GDM source, it gets set to "us" as a fallback if there is no user specified or default layout
<pitti> http://osdir.com/ml/ubuntu-desktop/2009-02/msg00010.html
<pitti> I remember again
<chrisccoulson> ah. we don't want to rely on HAL though do we?
<pitti> we do
<pitti> we configure it in one place, /etc/default/console-setup
<pitti> from there it's spread to hal, then to X.org
<pitti> IMHO we should just drop the default variable value
<pitti> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=464825
<ubottu> bugzilla.redhat.com bug 464825 in gnome-settings-daemon "F10-Beta - live usb - wrong keyboard preference" [Low,Closed: rawhide]
<pitti> they did something to g-s-d apparently
<pitti> but not in current fedora, anyway
<pitti> chrisccoulson: linked to upstream bug FYI, I'll look at this now
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<chrisccoulson> do you think gdm should not set the variable if the user sticks with the default layout?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, I DO
<pitti> oops, shift bug
<pitti> I followed up in the upstream report
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks. just looking at your comment, and it is currently possible to set the keyboard layout in the new GDM (there's a selector at the bottom of the screen)
<chrisccoulson> but even if you choose a layout, GDM sets the environment incorrectly
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, that only says "language" for me
<pitti> I don't see a keyboard selector at all
<pitti> just a locale picker
<chrisccoulson> ah
<chrisccoulson> you're right
<chrisccoulson> my bad ;)
<chrisccoulson> i saw "English (United Kingdom)" and immediately thought "keyboard layout"
<chrisccoulson> :-/
<crevette> heya
 * crevette just did the gdm upgrade
<pitti> crevette: yes, your keyboard is broken
<pitti> :)
<crevette> pitti, not yet :)
<pitti> oh, it should!
<crevette> I didn't restarted gdm
<chrisccoulson> it will be when you log out and back in again
<chrisccoulson> presumably there is some way to have a layout switcher in GDM then?
<crevette> I think this is expected I kicked out my session just right after the upgrade
<pitti> crevette: no, not out of your session
<pitti> it just gets locked
<chrisccoulson> did you get kicked out or did a greeter load?
<pitti> you can return to it
<chrisccoulson> yeah, thats what happened to me
<crevette> pitti, ah yeah the session was locked
<chrisccoulson> that doesn't seem correct behaviour though does it?
<pitti> it's not, of course
<pitti> but allegedly hard to do otherwise
 * pitti test-builds fixed gdm
<crevette> pitti, you cooked a patch?
<pitti> yes
<crevette> nice
<pitti> I'd like to get this fixed before the weekend
<pitti> I hope it'll work, my wife will return home in about 30 mins :)
<crevette> an entry in the menu system->administration for GDM is still showed, but no icon and nothing appears (I know there is no setup GUI for 2.26)
<crevette> ahaha
<chrisccoulson> crevette - do you have a custom launcher in ~/.local/share/applications?
<pitti> hm, I don't have a gdm admin .desktop any more
<crevette> chrisccoulson, no, that why it is odd
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, strange
<crevette> perhpas I should log out
<crevette> but preferably the menu should be updated
<chrisccoulson> yeah, sometimes the panel doesnt update
<crevette> hlmm strange, gdm show me the user kerneloops
<crevette> kernoops rather
<chrisccoulson> about the launcher still showing in the menu, is suspect that is because the new gdm postinst does not do a call to update-desktop-database
<crevette> chrisccoulson, yep I think the same
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, there's no way to start a failsafe session from the new gdm
<crevette> should I opena bug?
<chrisccoulson> crevette - you could do
<pitti> \o/ it works
<chrisccoulson> nice one :)
<pitti> uploaded
 * crevette login out quickly before just to experience the bug :)
<chrisccoulson> yay! crevette now has us layout ;)
<crevette> Heah I have the bug
<chrisccoulson> you should keep that layout now and type any remaining conversations pressing the keys you would normally press;)
<crevette> hopefully I use US keyboard sometimes at work
<crevette> so I can type US on FR  if I don4t look to ;y keyboard ;apping
<chrisccoulson> lol
<crevette> argh
<crevette> shame
<pitti> have a nice weekend everyone
 * pitti waves
<crevette> thx pitti for the fix
<crevette> bye
<pitti> you're welcome  :)
<chrisccoulson> have a good weekend too pitti:)
<pitti> we broke it, we fix it
<crevette> I have another bug to sub;it for gd;
 * pitti chuckles
<crevette> and you run away
<pitti> you'll so FAIL to type your password!
<crevette> yeah
 * crevette can't do a smiley
<chrisccoulson> :)
<crevette> :'/
<chrisccoulson> i can ^^
<geser> here is one: :)
<chrisccoulson> :-P
<chrisccoulson> haha. that works on IRC too
<crevette> ;-)
<crevette> yesssss
<crevette> broken gdm is good to learn US keybaord mapping
 * crevette wants to change the theme used for gdm
<crevette> but anyway new gdm welcome screen is nice
<chrisccoulson> crevette - thats a bit of a pain. it gets it from the gconf defaults at the moment
<chrisccoulson> you can adjust the defaults
<crevette> chrisccoulson, even the theme?
<chrisccoulson> yeah. you just need to figure out the default gconf keys to set ;)
<crevette> no more conf file in /etc/
<chrisccoulson> i don't know if everything is configured in gconf now, but the theme definately is
<chrisccoulson> it just uses standard gtk and metacity themes
<chrisccoulson> you just need to figure out the correct keys to set ;)
<chrisccoulson> you can also set the keys explicitly for the gdm user by using "sudo -u gdm gconftool-2 -s --type=<type> <key> <val>"
<crevette> yeah I know gconf a little :)
<chrisccoulson> cool
<crevette> rah, no direct access to default configuration in gconf-editor
<chrisccoulson> there should be :-/
<chrisccoulson> anyway, i have to go and buy some food to cook for dinner this evening
<crevette> I guess it "only" lack policykit stuff
 * crevette is totally ignorant
<crevette> so kernoops is listed a potential user in gdm greeter
<crevette> s/a /as /
<james_w> crevette: oops, would you file a bug on the kerneloops package to check that the user creation stuff is correct?
<crevette> james_w, yes, sure, I wanted to investigate if it was gdm's fault or not :)
<crevette> *first
<crevette> but I failed :/
<crevette> let's open a bug and we'll see
<maxb> crevette: What's the uid of your kernoops user?
<crevette> kernoops:x:112:65534:Kernel Oops Tracking Daemon,,,:/:/bin/false
<maxb> hm. Seems to me that gdm shouldn't display uids in the system range
<crevette> what is the range for real users?
<maxb> 1000-29999
<crevette> james_w, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bugs/395281
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 395281 in kerneloops "kernoops user is listed as real user in gdm 2.26.x" [Undecided,New]
<james_w> thanks crevette
<crevette> you're welcome
<crevette> pleased to help
<crevette> ah seb128 uploaded gnome-shell
<crevette> he does some work before getting too drunk
<james_w> heh
<crevette> :-}
<crevette> hmm the patch pitti didn't worked for me ...
<crevette> still is en_US
 * crevette will kill himself gdm to be sure
<james_w> I can't see anything odd that kerneloops is doing
<crevette> heya
<crevette> still broken layout for me :/
<chrisccoulson> james_w - someone else mentioned on here a couple of days ago about GDM showing a system user
<chrisccoulson> cant remember who though
<crevette> chrisccoulson, with 2.26?
<chrisccoulson> crevette - is GDM_KEYBOARD_LAYOUT still set to "us" in your environment?
<chrisccoulson> crevette - yes, with 2.26
<crevette> I didn't use face browser on previous version, but perhaps the bug was already there
<chrisccoulson> i don't think so. i use face browser on old GDM, and ive never seen that
<chrisccoulson> oh
<chrisccoulson> crevette left us again
<chrisccoulson> crevette: (20:22:24) chrisccoulson: i don't think so. i use face browser on old GDM, and ive never seen that
<chrisccoulson> just before you left;)
<crevette> hey I was kicked out my session
<crevette> wtf
<crevette> +from
<chrisccoulson> ";y" session?
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<crevette> YOU LIE I PRESS M
<chrisccoulson> heh. it displays ";" here;)
<chrisccoulson> honest!
<crevette> ;-)
<crevette> env|grep GDM
<crevette> GDM_LANG=fr_FR.UTF-8
<crevette> GDMSESSION=gnome
<crevette> is it what you wanted?
<crevette> I did'nt had time to read
<chrisccoulson> it doesn't look like it's being set then
 * crevette will check gnome keyboard setting 
<chrisccoulson> yeah
<crevette> the layout is USAm zhy
<chrisccoulson> you'll need to restore the default settings if you havent already
<crevette> rhaa
<crevette> joy !!!!
<crevette> I can type french
<chrisccoulson> i wonder what happens if i set my keyboard layout to french?>
<crevette> and now I'm used to press US and I do typo in the other way around
<crevette> :)
<crevette> but the session crashing is ... weird tbh
<chrisccoulson> thqt is zhqt hqppens if i set ,y keyboqrd to french
<chrisccoulson> lol
<crevette> ahah, time for you to suffer
<chrisccoulson> "that is what happens if i set my keyboard to french"
<crevette> the fusa applet takes a lot of space
 * crevette is in critizing mood
<maxb> crevette: me too - I want the small icon style of display back
<maxb> Listing the entire user friendly name is a huge waste of panel space
<maxb> especially on a netbook screen
<maxb> So, the new gdm... surely it isn't supposed to switch you out of your current X session when you install it?
<maxb> Also, somewhat amusingly, on one of my machines it doesn't list any users to select from at all!
<james_w> heh
<james_w> I think I know what it is
<james_w> gdm uses ck-history to query user activity
<james_w> which presumably at some point includes kernoops
<james_w> because that logs in and libpam-ck gives it a ck session
<james_w> crevette: when did you install kerneloops?
<walters> wha?  kernoops has a login session?
<crevette> james_w, uhh, few months ago
<james_w> k
<crevette> james_w, I was looking in ck me too, but didn't manage to find the way gdm uses
<crevette> .. to determine the list of system users
<james_w> walters: I'm guessing that start-stop-daemon opens a session via pam
<james_w> it's a bit of a pain for us with things like cron
<james_w> not sure we've ever fixed that one
<walters> well...there shouldn't be CK sessions for system uids imo
<james_w> yeah
<crevette> james_w, so you think gdm uses something like ck-history --frequent?
<james_w> GDM just uses a hard-coded list of exclusions?!
<walters> the historical inability of unix to have a useful distinction between real humans and random bits of the OS kind of sucks
<james_w> crevette: exactly that
<james_w>  command = g_strdup_printf ("ck-history --frequent --seat='%s' --session-type=''",
<james_w>                                    seat_id);
<crevette> ah ck doesn't expose dbus API?
<james_w> walters: do you think root should get a session?
<james_w> if the user logs in as root on the console then they presumably want one
<crevette> james_w, nice shot
<james_w> crevette: it does, but not for that
<walters> james_w: if a human logs in with root's credentials, yes; otherwise no
<james_w> not sure how easy it is to determine that at the PAM level, do you know?
<crevette> ck-history reports 14947 login for root !?
<walters> james_w: honestly i'd just do ck sessions for ssh and gdm, and ignore everything else for now...cron is kind of a ball of hair though.  i guess it's a discussion for the CK list
<james_w> there's a ck list now?
<james_w> it used to just say to use the HAL list
<walters> oh, i don't know
<james_w> and yeah, GDM seems to purely use a hardcoded exclude list
<james_w> it should append to that as it parses passwd I think
<walters> maybe we should use xdg-list to discuss useful stuff
<crevette> walters, you're not at GUADEC?
<walters> crevette: not this year =/
<james_w> maxb: could you file a new bug for the case where the user is not shown?
<james_w> maxb: also, what is the username of that user?
<james_w> also, parsing /etc/passwd directly: not going to make some people happy
<crevette> james_w, ther is nothing fix directly in ck-history?
<crevette> james_w, there is nothing to fix directly in ck-history?
<james_w> we need to tweak ck to avoid some users getting sessions in some circumstances
<james_w> but I think that GDM should also make some changes
<maxb> james_w: Update on that - users do appear in the list after 5 seconds or so
<maxb> Also, ck-history was consuming 200% cpu for a while after login!?
<james_w> ouch
 * maxb updates bug
<RainCT> Hey. Anyone bored wants to try out Zeitgeist (the engine) before I release 0.1?
<kwah> hi all
<kwah> may be it is not the right place to ask
<SiDi> we won't know if you won't ask
<kwah> but with whom may I discuss a proposed blueprint like https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/add-on-cd-composer
<kwah> SiDi, you are fast typer :D
<SiDi> Well, i was reading other channels
<SiDi> but i actually type fast
<kwah> is there a special channel to discuss blueprints?
<SiDi> depends on what it is about
<SiDi> if its about servers, then #ubuntu-server, and so on
<kwah> I tried to ask at ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list, but got no feedback :(
<SiDi> I don't *understand* this blueprint so i can't help
<SiDi> it looks like an OEM thingy, right ?
<kwah> nope... it is actually about distribution and first appearence of desktop
<kwah> therefore I came here ;)
<SiDi> What is this spec for ?
<SiDi> Having a tool for creating a custom Ubuntu-based CD ?
<kwah> for special purpose
<SiDi> then the spec should write use cases where the current tools lack features, and list these features with solution proposals
<kwah> get an official add-on disk extending appearance/functionality limited by CD size
<SiDi> then i'm pretty sure it'll interest the people working on OEM (like cody-somerville)
<kwah> so I did something wrong here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuAddOnCDComposer ?
<SiDi> huh
 * SiDi didnt notice the wiki page
<kwah> heh, the link is in the blueprint ;)
<SiDi> get in touch with cody i guess :)
 * kwah noted possible contact
<kwah> SiDi, thanks
<SiDi> np
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-07-04
<james_w> yay chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi james_w
<james_w> oh, I didn't know you were in the UK
<chrisccoulson> i am:)
<chrisccoulson> just outside birmingham;)
<Laney> good old midlands
<chrisccoulson> it's a lovely place really :-/
<james_w> yay for the midlands
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> i don't know how i ended up here really;)
<james_w> we should have a UK MOTU meetup some time :-)
<chrisccoulson> defaintely. i havent met anybody yet!
<chrisccoulson> although, i'm not a MOTU yet;)
<james_w> details, details
<Laney> let's!
<james_w> when's the Jam?
<Laney> october
<Laney> thinking about trying to do one at the uni here in Notts
<james_w> cool
<ajmitch> if only I could do the same thing here :)
<Laney> big Ubuntu community in nz?
<ajmitch> not overly large
<crevette> coucou seb128
<chrisccoulson> james_w - thank you for your comment on my wiki page:)
<james_w> np
<crevette> hey middle doesn't work
<crevette> +click
<chrisccoulson> i didnt realise firefox-3.5 was being SRU'd in jaunty
<pepee> hello
<pepee> Sarvatt, are you there?
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok, it was already in jaunt as beta
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-07-05
<cj> thanks for fixing pidgin
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-07-05
<LaserJock> hi TheMuso
<TheMuso> Hey LaserJock.
<LaserJock> TheMuso: how you been?
<TheMuso> LaserJock: Busy, but well thanks. Yourself?
<LaserJock> TheMuso: similar. Too busy with real life to do much *buntu'ing
<LaserJock> TheMuso: you have lots of work items this cycle?
<TheMuso> LaserJock: No, but general ongoing work for audio, and some work with the accessibility community that ties in somewhat with accessibility improvements for Ubuntu.
<LaserJock> TheMuso: how is the new stuff Canonical is doing (Unity for instance) doing with accessibility?
<TheMuso> LaserJock: Haven't checked, but I don't think its fully accessible.
<LaserJock> that was a concern I had with not using GNOME Shell or more gnome-y things
<TheMuso> Well gnome-shell in its current incarnation is not accessible yet either.
<TheMuso> Although that is supposed to be coming.
<LaserJock> right
<LaserJock> I just figured it would be easier to pool resources that way
<LaserJock> but maybe not
<TheMuso> I am no UI person, so not sure.
<TheMuso> /c/c
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, TheMuso, RAOF any of you guys still around?
<RAOF> Yup.  It's 3:30pm
<RAOF> rickspencer3: What's up?
<RAOF> Of an early morning.
<rickspencer3> Hey RAOF just checking on timing
<RAOF> :)
<rickspencer3> I'm up and sorta' at 'em
<rickspencer3> not much point in getting up early here, all my meetings are in the evening :/
<RAOF> At least it's still light in the evening for you :)
<rickspencer3> RAOF, it's crazy, still light at like 11pm
<RAOF> Mmmm, north north north!
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: yep just got back from installing maverick
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, glad to see you back then!
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, hey
<rickspencer3> RAOF, still around?
<RAOF> Yup.
<rickspencer3> bug #578673
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 578673 in linux (Ubuntu) "[arrandale] Resume doesn't work on a Latitude E6410 (affects: 20) (dups: 2) (heat: 109)" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/578673
<RAOF> Ah, my old friend the arrandale GPU.
<rickspencer3> RAOF, I assigned to you because it looked related to xorg based on my cursory look
<rickspencer3> can you please re-assign as appropriate if you are not the right person?
<RAOF> I shall.
<RAOF> It's probably a kernel problem, they always are :)
<rickspencer3> thanks RAOF
<RAOF> Hm.  I wonder if that's the âDoesn't turn the backlight back onâ bug that's recently been fixed.
<RAOF> Nah, probably not.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, can you upload my sane-backends PPA to lucid-proposed? http://launchpadlibrarian.net/51396645/sane-backends_1.0.20-13ubuntu2_1.0.21-0ubuntu1.debdiff
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: sure
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: I don't see a bug number in the changelog for that debdiff.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, right, can you add the bug number (600516) or do you want me to make a new debdiff?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: I can add it
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, thanks
<didrocks> good morning
<and471> morning
<mvo> good morning didrocks and and471
<and471> :)
<didrocks> hey mvo, how was your week-end?
<mvo> didrocks: nice (and hot!)
<mvo> (in the weather sense of the word only of course ;)
<mvo> and yours?
<rickspencer3> hi mvo and didrocks
<didrocks> mvo: was great too :) Fortunately, some rain this week-end which enables having a tolerable temperature this morning :)
<didrocks> good morning rickspencer3, welcome to Europe time :)
<rickspencer3> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> how was your travel?
<rickspencer3> unfortunately, I have a crappy connection in my house :/
<rickspencer3> didrocks, just fine, though yesterday my whole family and I got royally sunburned
<mvo> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi mvo
<rickspencer3> I have moved to Europe for a couple of weeks so I can nag you throughout the day about software-center
<rickspencer3> I thought it would help
<mvo> *weehhh*
<mvo> (translated: "sure, I'm certain this will help")
<didrocks> mvo: run run! :-)
<mvo> rickspencer3: where do you stay ? in france?
<rickspencer3> mvo, we are staying in Kijkduin ... which is a beach near Den Haag
<kiwinote> ah, just around the corner from here (well 45mins bike ride)
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: you subscribed ubuntu-sru?
<mvo> rickspencer3: woah, that looks very nice
<rickspencer3> mvo, well ... it always looks nice on their web site ;)
<rickspencer3> it's a nice place for a family
<mvo> rickspencer3: especially in a weather like this. a really long beach afa maps.g.c shows
 * mvo waves to kiwinote
<kiwinote> hi mvo
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, I was going to wait for it to be uploaded
<mvo> kiwinote: did you get my mail? the foundations work (p-apt and gdebi) are all merged now
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: ok
<kiwinote> mvo: thanks for that
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: uploaded
 * TheMuso -> EOD
<rickspencer3> mvo, yeah, really long beach, the kids are happy to live here for a couple of weeks
<kiwinote> mvo: atm I am getting the gdebi stuff working with the appdetailsview-gtk branch
<rickspencer3> hi kiwinote
<rickspencer3> bye TheMuso
<rickspencer3> kiwinote, I'll be around all next week if you want to get together for a beer or something
 * rickspencer3 leaves for London tomorrow
<and471> london baby yeah!
<kiwinote> rickspencer3: yeah, sounds good, just ping me next week sometime
<and471> robert_ancell, where did you get the idea for lightdm? (webkit greeter?)
<and471> it is a great idea!
<robert_ancell> and471, the webkit greeter part of it?  I wanted a flexible themeing system and didn't want to write it myself.  Other projects seem to be using webkit for this (metacity was considering somthing similar for theming; gwibber, software-center use it)
<and471> robert_ancell, well I shall definitely have a look
<and471> :)
<robert_ancell> and471, please do!  Patches and feedback welcome :)
<and471> robert_ancell, is the webkit greeter meant to work?
<robert_ancell> and471, yes...
<robert_ancell> and471, is it not?
<and471> robert_ancell, hehe, when I run it I get the error...
<seb128> hello there
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey
<seb128> hey robert_ancell
<seb128> how are you?
<and471> robert_ancell, sorry when I click MY label, I get the error ** Message: console message: file:///usr/share/lightdm/themes/webkit/index.html @96: TypeError: Result of expression 'label' [null] is not an object.
<and471> robert_ancell, :( webkit is not very useful when it comes to debugging error messages...
<robert_ancell> and471, that's in the .deb? I though I'd fixed that, I must need to respin the debs
<robert_ancell> seb128, sore, been skiing this weekend :)
<pitti> wow, skiing!
<seb128> robert_ancell, but it's summer! ;-)
 * pitti was baking in the sun at > 30 degrees
<pitti> clearly the only reasonable thing to do was swimming and idling :)
<robert_ancell> and471, compare the index.html code to http://people.ubuntu.com/~robert-ancell/lightdm/greeter.html or bzr
<and471> robert_ancell, compared to http://people.ubuntu.com/~robert-ancell/lightdm/greeter.html
<and471> robert_ancell, --- index.html	2010-07-05 09:00:00.392065551 +0100
<and471> +++ /usr/share/lightdm/themes/webkit/index.html	2010-07-01 07:20:08.000000000 +0100
<and471> @@ -14,10 +14,6 @@
<and471>  }
<and471>  
<and471>  </style>
<and471> -
<and471> -<script type="text/javascript" src="http://people.ubuntu.com/~robert-ancell/lightdm/lightdm.js">
<and471> -</script>
<and471> -
<and471>  <script type="text/javascript">
<and471>  
<and471>  password_prompt = false;
<and471> ah sorry
<and471> should have used pastebin
<and471> robert_ancell, any ideas?
<robert_ancell> and471, I fixed it on head - it's due to you not having a timed user configured http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/lightdm/trunk/revision/102
<and471> ah
<and471> I shall grab the latest branch
<robert_ancell> and471, thanks for spotting
<and471> robert_ancell, np :)
<and471> robert_ancell, I think I might break out the jquery
<and471> :)
<robert_ancell> gtg, catch you all tomorrow
<and471> see ya
<robert_ancell> and471, nice, I don't have mad HTML/JS skills so please feed back any improvements that can be made to the API/documentation
<and471> sure
<huats> morning
<pitti> seb128: do you think we should reenable apport by default now?
<pitti> the Debian merge window is over, and I think the dust settled a bit now
<seb128> pitti, do we have retracers set for maverick now?
<pitti> seb128: I'll set them up now if you agree with enabling it
<seb128> I would try yes
<pitti> ok, doing that then
<seb128> we can still turn it off if that turns to be extra work rather than useful
<seb128> it would at least give us a round of feedback on current crash issues
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> seb128: FYI we currently have 46 "apport-crash maverick" bugs
<pitti> I guess most of them will be invalid by now
<seb128> pitti, right
<pitti> (i. e. broken retrace)
<rickspencer3> hi pitti and seb128
<pitti> hey rickspencer3; welcome to Eu "melt away" rope
<ogra> heh
<pitti> rickspencer3: how was your trip?
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> they promised rain today, and it again won't come, bah
<seb128> weird to see you on european time ;-)
<ogra> they promised rain yesterday already
<seb128> rickspencer3, how are you? had a nice trip to .nl? ;-)
<ogra> only bavaria got some
<rickspencer3> seb128, pitti yes, traveling was fine
<pitti> ogra: but unlike yesterday I don't have the Senftenberg lake right beside me today :-/
<rickspencer3> was a tourist yesterday, and suffered a righteous sunburn
<ogra> pitti, cold water buckets under your desk help ;)
<seb128> rickspencer3, did you arrive on time to join the party after the soccer game? ;-)
<rickspencer3> seb128, we were here for the game
<rickspencer3> quite fun
<rickspencer3> sadly, I will be traveling tomorrow evening :,(
<pitti> oh, where?
<rickspencer3> pitti, I'm in NL
<pitti> rickspencer3: you are in .nl now, right?
<rickspencer3> pitti, yes
<rickspencer3> working from here until the sprint
<seb128> let's see who wins the cup, Netherland or Germany
<pitti> seb128: is there a question? :-)
<ogra> you dont think uruguay could make it ?
<seb128> pitti, you think it will be the Netherlands as well? ;-)
 * seb128 runs
 * ogra is more scared that uruguay gets through, they play unpredictable
<rickspencer3> seb128, well ... Friday night made Germany look quite the winners
<pitti> Saturday's game was awesome, I hope they keep their current performance
<ogra> yeah
<pitti> they just ruined expectations, with 4 goals in every game :)
<rickspencer3> oops, that was Sat? man, my schedule is all scrambled
<ogra> we all need to be very friendly to randa now
<seb128> ogra, I like the nertherland team, would be nice to see them win this one, they would deserve it, they have not been really lucky in 1998 and 2006 while they played really well
 * rickspencer3 wonders if he can change schedule to be in town on Tuesday
<ogra> seb128, if the german team keeps that performance .nl wont have a chance
<pitti> ogra: but they have their bad days as well
<ogra> yep
<pitti> so, let the best win
<ogra> thus the "if" i started the sentence with :)
<rickspencer3> exactly, teams at this level, anyone has a good chance of beating anyone else in one specific game
<pitti> rickspencer3: right, at this level it's mostly luck and psychology
<rickspencer3> mmmm
<rickspencer3> "largely" perhaps, but "mostly"?
<seb128> ogra, let's see ;-)
<pitti> Germany beats Ghaha, Ghana beats Serbia, Serbia beats Germany
<pitti> there's no logic in this :)
 * ogra thinks there is some 
<rickspencer3> we call that ro sham bo
<pitti> rickspencer3: ?
<rickspencer3> pitti, rock, paper, scissors
<rickspencer3> a > b > c > a
<pitti> seb128: retracers running again, with maverick chroots; however, they were stuck for some time, so have some catch-up to do
<rickspencer3> common in sports and also in board games and video games ;)
<pitti> rickspencer3: ah :)
<seb128> pitti, you rock, thanks!
<jpds> We could just ask http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/10420131.stm .
<ogra> jpds, thats on german tv before each game :)
<ogra> and paul was nearly always right :)
<pitti> lol
<pitti> I've never seen that one
<pitti> on the camping site we fiddled with our DVB-T antenna until 15:58
<ogra> they also have an african juju woman predicting the amount of goals for each side
<pitti> the local pub was already overcrowded
<ogra> for the england game she said, "germany will shoot at least 3 goals, for england, while i see one goal there will be something very problematinc with the game"
 * ogra found that impressive in the light of the game afterwards
<pitti> ogra: sounds better than the referees anyway :-P
<ogra> lol
<Laney> do you want the tomboy dev releases in maverick?
<seb128> Laney, I've nothing against it if they are not going to hard depends on gtk3 by the end of this cycle
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, hey
<chrisccoulson> hi rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, so, no world melting bugs from Hardy/Jaunty?
<chrisccoulson> i think you mean hardy / lucid ;)
<rickspencer3> oops
<rickspencer3> yes, correct
<chrisccoulson> we had a hardy upgrade bug which we fixed quickly, due to conflicts with the older firefox 2 package on hardy
<rickspencer3> yeah
<rickspencer3> saw that
<rickspencer3> totally resolved now, though, correct?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that ones fixed now
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, there was also bug 600642, which is now fixed too
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 600642 in sun-java6 (Ubuntu Hardy) (and 1 other project) "[Hardy] Firefox upgrade to 3.6.6 breaks Java plugin (affects: 4) (dups: 2) (heat: 30)" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/600642
<chrisccoulson> and we seem to be getting quite a few people report flash plugin crashes on hardy and lucid, but i've not been able to recreate that yet
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<chrisccoulson> other than that, there haven't really been that many bugs reported
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, awesome!
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, how are you? did you find some rest on the weekend after that hectic week?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i had a little bit of rest, but it was still quite a busy weekend for me. i've got quite a lot of people coming round on saturday for a garden party, so there's lots of preparation for me to do
<chrisccoulson> pitti - how are you anyway?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: melting, but fine; had a great relaxing weekend with tenting, swimming, and idling :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - is the weather quite hot where you are?
<pitti> ugh yes, for over a week now
<pitti> over the weekend we had some 32 degrees or so
<chrisccoulson> heh, that's quite warm. it's cooled down a little bit here thankfully, although it's still warm
<chrisccoulson> we could do with some rainfall though ;)
<seb128> it's better there as well today
<chrisccoulson> our garden is like a desert ;)
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, did you have a good weekend?
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, yes, quite relaxing, with that heat no way to do a lot
 * pitti lunch &
<seb128> chrisccoulson, it seems you kept busy as usual ;-) did you enjoy the garden party at least?
 * seb128 just back from lunch but making coffee
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - we haven't had the party just yet. that will be next weekend
<chrisccoulson> but i have a lot to do to prepare for it this week
<seb128> oh ok
<chrisccoulson> i'm hoping the weather stays nice ;)
 * baptistemm asks for rain
<chrisccoulson> i wouldn't mind some rain this week, just as long as it stops before the weekend ;)
<lamalex> didrocks: did you file a bug report with banshee for that? I seem to remember that I had asked you to but I didn't save the link
<didrocks> lamalex: no, I didn't take the time, I can do if you want but as you did the work it will be more fair that you post the patchâ¦ :)
<lamalex> I'm happy to post the patch, but can you file the initial bug?
 * lamalex *hates* gnome bugzilla
<didrocks> lamalex: sure, doing that :)
<lamalex> just so you'll be cc'd when the status on the patch changes
<didrocks> lamalex: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=623590 is yours
<ubot2> Gnome bug 623590 in User Interface "Help user in showing how to import music into banshee" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<lamalex> merci beaucoup
<didrocks> lamalex: mais de rien :)
<didrocks> lamalex: thanks to you for the patch
<lamalex> didrocks: took 10 minutes, not a thing. Happy to help
<fta2> seb128, is bug 601494 linked to the recent cairo bug?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 601494 in chromium-browser (Debian) (and 2 other projects) "Favicon in tabs appears as a flickering square while page loads (affects: 5) (heat: 28)" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/601494
<seb128> fta2, what cairo bug?
<seb128> fta2, I don't know about a similar bug in cairo no
<fta2> i mean, it started a few days ago, for maverick users only
<fta2> could be gtk
<seb128> fta2, could be an issue with the new cairo yes
<seb128> I don't use chromium so I don't know
<seb128> gtk didn't change recently
<fta2> hm
<Sarvatt> yeah its a chromium and cairo problem
<Sarvatt> i think ickle said he had a patch for chromium to fix it, something about damage tracking with the bitmaps skia is using for the tabstrip
<seb128> hey Sarvatt
<seb128> Sarvatt, I got cairo 1.9 in maverick now, thanks for your work getting the lcdfilter change upstream ;-)
<fta2> Sarvatt, could please add a comment in the bug?
<Sarvatt> I saw when I got the update awhile back, awesome that we can just sync it from debian now :) this chromium problem has been bugging me since moving to 1.9.x too, tabs disappear when you open enough to make it resize to where the tab is small enough to not show the favicon too
<Sarvatt> yeah have to reboot but i'll dig through my logs, brb
<pitti> finally! rain!
<ogra> lucky you
<seb128> bah, openjdk and linux builds = no other build today...
<ogra> seb128, sorry ... my fault ...
<ogra> seb128, the worst is that the armel fix i uploaded java for doesnt actually fix it :(
<seb128> "nice" ;-)
<seb128> we should always have one builder not taking build going over half an hour
<seb128> to avoid DoS the buildds this way ;-)
<ogra> ++
<ogra> or dedictaed builders for a certain set of packages
<seb128> or start by teching people to not upload openjdk during the work hours :p
<seb128> ie upload in the evening so it can build overnight ;-)
<pitti> seb128: we should just have more buildds
<pitti> they keep being a bottleneck
<seb128> or that yes
<alf__> didrocks: Hi! I saw that you upgraded clutter to 1.2.10. Are these changes going to land in lp:ubuntu/clutter-1.0?
<didrocks> alf__: yeah, lp:ubuntu/clutter-1.0 is automcommited if you don't update there directly
<didrocks> so you will still be fine with your branch :)
<alf__> didrocks: I am actually interested in that branch getting updated so I can branch from it :)
<didrocks> alf__: should be soon enough, I guess
<alf__> didrocks: ok, thanks :)
<didrocks> alf__: no pb, and ping me when remaining things will be fixed and seen with upstream
<didrocks> alf__: just note that I won't be available (apart by email) until next week starting tomorrow
<alf__> didrocks: Sure, although my main problem is getting debian folks to respond about what they think about the packaging changes.
<didrocks> alf__: try to ping pochu or kov in #debian-gnome on OFTC
<alf__> didrocks: Will do, thanks
<alf__> didrocks: By the way, have a nice vacation :)
<didrocks> alf__: not really vacations, more FLOSS French event presence but thanks :)
<seb128> didrocks, oh, not vacations, you have better doing your weekly updates then! ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: I proposed to you do to them, that can still apply :-)
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> seb128: note that if the release is too late (> 6PM), I'll be with an awesome 3G connexion from my phone, with all ports blocked and feel the pain :)
<lamalex> didrocks: are there any cool french floss events going on in early august?
<didrocks> lamalex: no, it's early June, that is to say, from tomorrow (http://2010.rmll.info/spip.php?lang=en). This is the only "big" general FLOSS event in France
<didrocks> apart from the Ubuntu Party, of course :-)
<lamalex> :)
<lamalex> didrocks: will you be at guadec?
<didrocks> lamalex: yes, you?
<lamalex> I will! I look forward to meeting you
<didrocks> sweet, that will be nice meeting you :)
<didrocks> lamalex: FYI, pushed your patch and others in maverick
<didrocks> just miss the hal-free branch to be officially blessed and the MIR for main for banshee :)
<lamalex> ftw!
<lamalex> for the hal-free branch, we're just waiting for Bertrand to sort out the build system fixes to install the extra libs (which need packaging themselves I guess) and for review
<lamalex> I'll look into packaging gkeyfile-sharp and gudev-sharp today
<lamalex> I would be nice if I could get it all into a ppa for people to test
 * lamalex puts on his debian gloves
<lamalex> heh, I mean "it would be nice"
<didrocks> lamalex: do not hesitate to ask for help when needed :)
<seb128> ogra, so is your openjdk upload useless?
<seb128> ogra, will you do another one?
<ogra> seb128, not before i havent talked to doko
<seb128> ok
<ogra> the fix is supposed to fix FTBFS but java depends on ca-certs which in turn uses java to set up the serts
<ogra> *certs
<ogra> the former build segfaults when running keytool so i cant build a new openjdk at all :/
<kiwinote> mvo: if for instance universe is disabled, then we don't have a way of knowing if a pkg without a desktop file is available in universe, do we?
<kiwinote> mvo: so if we get an apturl request for apt:pkg_in_universe?section=universe or apt:pkg_not_in_universe?section=universe, then we show the enable component button in both cases, despite the spec wanting us to display an error in the second case?
<mvo> kiwinote: the spec is wrong then. there is no way to know before we added universe (unless we would do something like remove-query, but that would still not give us dependency info)
<kiwinote> mvo: ok, thanks
<desrt> seb128: hey?
<seb128> desrt, hello
<desrt> what are your control centre plans this cycle?
<seb128> desrt, none
<seb128> keep what we have basically
<desrt> vino has a patch filed against it to convert it
<desrt> so i guess that would ruin your day
<seb128> desrt, it wouldn't since we didn't plan to update vino either
<seb128> desrt, we don't plan to pull any new version of things that would pull us in a transition we don't want
<seb128> we will probably make calls on what we update later on in the cycle depending on what those update implies
<desrt> i see.
<seb128> between d-conf (which is fine), gtk3, and other changes like this one
<seb128> d-conf being fine but avoid upgrading things using shared keys
<seb128> ie gnome-control-center
<seb128> we will likely have an updated platform and some selected softwares
<seb128> ie empathy, gnome-games
<pitti> good night everyone
<seb128> 'night pitti
<bcurtiswx3> seb128: do you know what package includes glib-compile-schemas ? its one of the new ones, but idk where it is
<chrisccoulson> bcurtiswx3, libglib2.0-bin?
<seb128> bcurtiswx3, it's libglib2.0-bin
<bcurtiswx3> chrisccoulson: seb128, OK Thx I verified that the make worked with that and it did.. I'm building empathy from source to get the latest to test bugs against and it needed that
<seb128> ok
<seb128> we will get the updated version in maverick this week most likely
<bcurtiswx3> seb128: OK, thx
<vish> chrisccoulson: hi , can you milestone Bug #530751 for maverick , so that we dont miss it , it has a branch with the reworded dialogue [you might know it too ;)]
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 530751 in gnome-power-manager (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) ""Battery Discharging" is a horribly worded message (affects: 4) (heat: 47)" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/530751
<Sarvatt> soo, openoffice.org-evolution installed /@OOBASISDIR@/registered-components/libevoabli.so?
<Sarvatt> seems to be a packaging problem there
<seb128> indeed
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, could i have a USN for firefox 3.6.7?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yet another firefox?
<chrisccoulson> oops, wrong channel ;)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, we have the first build for 3.6.7
<chrisccoulson> http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/3.6.7build1/releasenotes/
<seb128> bah
<seb128> chrisccoulson, there is two openjdk builds again now
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: sure, hold on
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - oh, they've not finished yet?
<seb128> will you guys stop rebuilding openjdk again and again so we can get some normal build going on?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, no, we got no ubuntu build today :-(
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: USN-957-1
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - perhaps i should not upload FF3.6.7 just yet ;)
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, the jaunty openjdk built just started
<seb128> chrisccoulson, go for it, I've stopped waiting for builds today now ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - hopefully they will free up a bit soon ;)
<loneowais_> hey guys, i need some help with the messaging menu api.
<loneowais_> how do i get the menu to into it
<lamalex> loneowais_: you put a file in /usr/share/indicators/messages/applications/ that has the path to your application's desktop file
<lamalex> look at the empathy or gwibber one as an example
<loneowais_> lamalex: i know the file thing
<loneowais_> but what about the menu items. they dont appear
<lamalex> ah
<lamalex> loneowais_: via libindicate, should be the same as your application indicator i beleive
<lamalex> but your type should be set to messaging
<loneowais_> right,
<loneowais_> im doing python. so i would have to use appindicator module
<loneowais_> ?
<loneowais_> which i'm using right now.
<loneowais_> but it doesnt have an messaging type
<loneowais_> it has communications
<loneowais_> which doesn't work either
<lamalex> loneowais_: you're using python-indicate?
<loneowais_> no
<loneowais_> appindicator
<lamalex> python-indicate is what you want
<loneowais_> oh
<loneowais_> thanks a lot mate
<loneowais_> let me try it
<loneowais_> thanks
<lamalex> no problem, ping me if you have any questions
<loneowais_> sure
<loneowais_> lamalex: Thanks man, that seems to work.
<lamalex> cool beans dude
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-07-06
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, can you sponsor yelp?
<pitti> Good morning
<huats> morning pitti
<RAOF> Aloha pitti!
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: sure
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: uploaded.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, thanks
<TheMuso> np
<robert_ancell> pitti, hey, why is it important to be able to change the keyboard layout from the greeter?  Is this the layout for the session or the greeter?
<pitti> robert_ancell: for both
<pitti> robert_ancell: well, we got along without this feature in the old gdm
<robert_ancell> pitti, so why not change the layout when in the session?
<pitti> robert_ancell: how do you type your password then?
<robert_ancell> pitti, there's two features here, the ability to change the greeter keyboard layout (required) and the user layout (possibly not required?)
<pitti> it's certainly not the most important feature ever, but I learned to like it (my wife uses DE layout, I'm using US)
<robert_ancell> pitti, can't gnome-session set the layout on login?
<pitti> robert_ancell: g-session can set it according to the user's gconf settings, yes
<pitti> robert_ancell: well, it's gnome-settings-daemon, but all the same
<pitti> robert_ancell: I'll answer your mail, but I have to read the gdm source for answers
<robert_ancell> pitti, ok, np.
 * pitti -> doctor appointment, bbl
<seb128> hey there
<RAOF> Hey, ho!
<seb128> hey RAOF, how are you?
<baptistemm> ola
<seb128> lut baptistemm
<RAOF> Pretty good, pretty good.
<baptistemm> salut seb128
<RAOF> Got me some tea, got me some biscuits, and I got me the i965 programming manual.  Excellent bedtime reading!
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> quick session restart and I should be set for the morning updates
<seb128> re
<seb128> dear update-manager stop triggering apport when closing authentification dialogs
<mvo> seb128: hm?
<seb128> hey mvo
<seb128> mvo, on maverick run update-manager, click "check" and hit "esc" on your keyboard
<seb128> "DBusException: org.freedesktop.PolicyKit.Error.NotAuthorized"
<mvo> aha
<mvo> seb128: trivial fix, hold on
<seb128> mvo, ;-)
<seb128> mvo, I had the feeling you would say something like that ;-)
<mvo> hm, maybe not ;)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> do you want a bug on launchpad about it?
<mvo> it should already be caught, but for some reason that is not working
<mvo> odd
<mvo> seb128: let me look at it a little bit more
<rickspencer3> hi all
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> good morning rickspencer3
<seb128> hey pitti
<rickspencer3> hi pitti
 * seb128 kicks update-manager
<mvo> seb128: bad mood today ;)
<seb128> "this action will require installing packages from a non authentificated source"
<seb128> then it sends me back to the summary screen without letting me a chance to say that's ok
<seb128> mvo, heh, no, just no making friends with some softwares, sorry it's yours ;-)
<seb128> I just have the firefox security ppa configured, it's not a reason to refuse to do any upgrade :p
<mvo> seb128: sounds like two new bugs for me then
<seb128> mvo, I'm sorry, I'm sure you already have enough of those
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<mvo> seb128: please add them to LP and target for the next alpha
<seb128> I'm pretty sure I added the mozilla ppa the official way, ie using software-properties
<mvo> seb128: oh?
<seb128> I'm wondering why it thinks it's not authentificated
<mvo> seb128: could you please check /var/lib/apt/lists then ? for *.gpg ?
<mvo> it should still support a override
<seb128> $ ls /var/lib/apt/lists/*gpg
<seb128> /var/lib/apt/lists/ddebs.ubuntu.com_dists_maverick_Release.gpg
<mvo> not much
<seb128> $ ls /var/lib/apt/lists/*gpg | wc -l
<seb128> 8
<seb128> after an apt-get update
<seb128> go figure
<seb128> /var/lib/apt/lists/ppa.launchpad.net_ubuntu-mozilla-security_ppa_ubuntu_dists_lucid_Release.gpg
<seb128> it's there now
<seb128> mvo, ok, my fault
<seb128> mvo, I did cancel the "check" action from update-manager to see how that was handled
<seb128> which wiped the gpg files apparently
<seb128> I just tried again
<seb128> $ ls /var/lib/apt/lists/*gpg
<seb128> $
<mvo> woah, now they are all gone?
<mvo> anything in partial?
<seb128> $ ls /var/lib/apt/lists/partial/
<seb128> archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_lucid-proposed_Release.gpg
<seb128> archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_maverick_main_binary-i386_Packages
<seb128> mvo, ^
<seb128> hum
<seb128> sorry I was in another state
<seb128> so yeah, I've a mix of things in the directory and in partial
<seb128> I've those in partial now
<seb128> ddebs.ubuntu.com_dists_maverick_Release.gpg
<seb128> ppa.launchpad.net_software-store-developers_ppa_ubuntu_dists_lucid_Release.gpg
<seb128> ppa.launchpad.net_ubuntu-mozilla-security_ppa_ubuntu_dists_lucid_Release.gpg
<seb128> and none in /var/lib/apt/lists
<seb128> mvo, anyway I will open a bug about the issue when you have an unauthentified source that can still happen and is a bug
<seb128> the "cancel update-manager update" issue is getting what I deserved for trying to break the software :p
<mvo> seb128: thanks
<mvo> seb128: well, that is still a bug :/
<mvo> seb128: the other one
<mvo> seb128: it should revert cleanly
<seb128> right
<seb128> also it displays "check your internet" on cancel
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'll try not to upload too many big packages today ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks ;-)
<seb128> how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'm good thanks, how are you?
<seb128> I'm fine thank you
<chrisccoulson> i got the firefox uploads done overnight, so they should be finished soon hopefully
<qense> Apparently GCalctool is already using GSettings, which is unavailable still: bug #602175
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 602175 in gcalctool (Ubuntu) "gcalctool crashed with signal 5 in g_object_newv() (affects: 2) (heat: 14)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/602175
<seb128> I got the updated version for lucid this morning
<seb128> qense, how unavailable?
<seb128> qense, it's in glib 2.25
<qense> seb128: Oh, then it is a packaging mistake since it can't file the scheme.
<seb128> what scheme?
<qense> "GLib-GIO-ERROR **: Settings schema 'org.gnome.gcalctool' is not installed"
<qense> It never starts.
<seb128> do you have libglib2.0-bin installed?
<qense> yes I have
<seb128> ls /usr/share/glib-2.0/schemas
<qense> gschema.dtd  org.gnome.gcalctool.gschema.xml
<seb128> seems the trigger didn't work for you for some reason
<qense> strange
<qense> seb128: can you confirm the issue yourself? Please note that it wasn't me who reported bug #602175
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 602175 in gcalctool (Ubuntu) "gcalctool crashed with signal 5 in g_object_newv() (affects: 2) (heat: 14)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/602175
<seb128> qense, sudo glib-compile-schemas /usr/share/glib-2.0/schemas
<seb128> qense, no, I've a gschemas.compiled there and it starts
<seb128> see /var/lib/dpkg/info/libglib2.0-bin.postinst
<qense> I can run gcalctool now indeed.
<seb128> not sure why the trigger didn't work for you
<seb128> I didn't do that upgrade so I didn't tweak locally
<qense> "glib-compile-schemas /usr/share/glib-2.0/schemas || true" is in there
<seb128> the trigger worked for me
<qense> weird
<seb128> I will try on another box
<qense> ok
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, weird. i've been trying to figure out why xulrunner applications on karmic load the oldest GRE on the system, but on all other ubuntu releases they are loading the newest GRE
<chrisccoulson> and it's because readdir() behaves differently :-/
<chrisccoulson> and returns files in a different order
<chrisccoulson> strange
<seb128> mvo, is there a way to see what triggers got triggered during and update-manager installation
<mvo> seb128: /var/log/apt/term.log should show you that
<seb128> mvo, thanks
<seb128> mvo, do you use maverick? did you upgrade today yet?
<seb128> weird, the log suggests it didn't trigger but it works when doing a dpkg -i from the deb
<mvo> seb128: I use maverick, but haven't upgraded today
<mvo> seb128: what trigger is that?
<seb128> mvo, the gcalctool update should trigger libglib2.0-bin
<seb128> it installs a schemas in /usr/share/glib-2.0/schemas
<mvo> seb128: ok, let me try to reproduce
<seb128> mvo, we got several bugs from users where the new version crash because the trigger doesn't run
<seb128> and I can confirm it didn't work on one of my box
<seb128> but it did in my laptop
<seb128> mvo, thanks
<mvo> seb128: could it be a ordering problem? gcalctool gets installed before the new libglib2.0-bin with the trigger?
<mvo> (assuming the trigger is something new)
<mvo> or not strict dependency and libglib2.0-bin stays at a older version
<tseliot> seb128: Robert's last upload of nautilus re-enabled the patch and bug #508890 is back
<seb128> mvo, no
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 508890 in nautilus (Ubuntu Lucid) (and 2 other projects) "Nautilus crashes when there are multiple XScreens (affects: 31) (dups: 8) (heat: 215)" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/508890
<tseliot> bratsche: ^^
<seb128> tseliot, I did re-enable that early in the cycle yes
<mvo> seb128: just tried it, libglib2.0-bin is triggered for me
<seb128> tseliot, read the changelog?
<tseliot> seb128: it wasn't a question
<seb128> tseliot, well we know about it yes
<tseliot> I found that out in the changelog
<seb128> mvo, :-(
<tseliot> seb128: I hope there are plans to fix it
<seb128> tseliot, you are welcome to send a patch if you have one
<seb128> tseliot, as with any bug we would like to fix it yes but we have limited ressources and high number of bugs
<seb128> tseliot, I'm not sure what is the purpose of this discussion...
<seb128> we have 18 bugs open with the gtk-csd tag right now
<seb128> we do intend to fix those at the best of our capacity
<tseliot> seb128: I might look into the issue but I'm pretty busy with other work. we'll see
<qense> mvo: It's not an ordering problem. I was having the bug after I received an updated for gcalctool, but libglib2.0-bin was already installed and up-to-date.
<seb128> tseliot, thanks
 * tseliot -> lunch
<mvo> qense: thanks
<seb128> tseliot, but if the question was "why did we renable it" it's because we enabled rgba in gtk and that's needed to have nautilus tow ork
<qense> mvo: bug numer is bug #602175
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 602175 in gcalctool (Ubuntu) "glib-compile-schemas trigger not run after installation GCalctool (affects: 2) (heat: 16)" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/602175
<seb128> mvo, same on my mini which had the bug, libglib2.0-bin was upgraded on jun 25
<mvo> seb128, qense: could you attach the term.log please?
<mvo> or the releavent bits of it
<seb128> what would be revelant?
<qense> ok
<seb128> I see gcalctool being configured with a bunch of other binaries
<seb128> then some triggers are run but not the libglib2.0-bin one
<seb128> but there is no error nor anything
<qense> same here
<qense> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/459788/
<qense> mvo: ^
<qense> DEB_CONFIGURE_EXTRA_FLAGS := --disable-scrollkeeper --disable-schemas-compile
<qense> That is in the rules file
<qense> mvo, seb128: Would the last flag prevent compiling the schemas?
<mvo> qense: interessting, I wonder if that is reproducable with "5.31.3-0ubuntu1" to the current version
<mvo> i.e. if downgrade (or remove) and then upgrade triggers it again
<mvo> (or not :)
<qense> I already ran the compile command manually.
<qense> not sure if that would interfere.
<seb128> qense, no, the rules is used a build time
<seb128> it's to say to not compile the schemas when building the deb
<qense> ok
<seb128> the compilation is made at installation time by the trigger
<qense> seb128: and the trigger should be automatically triggered when a file is placed in a directory, and the script watching that is not in this package, rigth?
<seb128> mvo, let me try, the trigger is triggered when doing a dpkg -i or apt-get install --reinstall of the deb
<seb128> qense, correct
<qense> mvo: I'm now downloading 5.31.3-0ubuntu1 and will see what happens.
<seb128> mvo, I'm wondering if that's due to what Josselin wrote in the debian bug
<seb128> hum, forgot that
<seb128> debian bug #587661
<ubot2> Debian bug 587661 in glib2.0 "should install glib-compile-schemas in libglib2.0-bin" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/587661
<seb128> "Note that the syntax for the trigger is incorrect since several triggers
<seb128> can be passed at once, separated by spaces but all in $2 (which is not
<seb128> very intuitive)."
<seb128>  
<seb128> but that's the issue there, the log suggests it didn't trigger at all
<qense> Otherwise we'd have gotten an error message?
<seb128> no
<qense> ok
<qense> What about "Another comment, just so that itâs not forgotten: I havenât checked
<qense> where compiled schemas are put when glib-compile-schemas is run, but
<qense> they should be purged in the postrm."
<mvo> seb128: you mean "Note that the syntax for the trigger is incorrect since several triggers" ?
<seb128> mvo, right, cf what I wrote just before
<mvo> seb128: that does sound likely actually
<mvo> seb128: yeah, we pasted at about the same moment :)
<seb128> mvo, well we would still have a "trigger libglib2.0-bin" in the log no?
<seb128> but the trigger would not what it should?
<seb128> would not *do*
<qense> I do have a trigger for the thing when downgrading!
<qense> Processing triggers for libglib2.0-bin ...
<qense> No schema files found
<qense> and now too when updating
<qense> Processing triggers for libglib2.0-bin ...
<qense> seb128: Could it be related to installation of multiple updates/packages at once?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> it could
<qense> upgrading gcalctool and installing another package at the same time doesn't trigger the bug
<qense> (it does trigger the trigger)
<seb128> did you try installing a package using the gio trigger?
<seb128> which is the other glib trigger
<seb128> ie gvfs
<qense> There was a gvfs update, iirc.
<seb128> there was yes
<seb128> I did backport a patch yesterday
<qense> confirmed from my log file there was a gvfs update being installed while I updated gcalctool
<qense> So Josseline is right with the comment?
<seb128> he's right in his comment anyway
<seb128> but I'm not sure why it would block the trigger
<qense> strange
<seb128> I would rather think the trigger would be run but buggy
<seb128> ie the postinst would not do all what it should be doing
<seb128> mvo, ^ do you see why that would stop the trigger to run at all in such cases?
<seb128> ok, getting something to eat, I will check that in a bit
<qense> seb128: I reinstalled gcalctool and all packages with gvfs in it, but the trigger was run.
<mvo> seb128: I look at the dpkg code now
<mvo> kiwinote: hey! I want to rework the appdetails stuff to make it a better abstraction. will you have time to discuss about that in a few minutes?
<kiwinote> mvo: yep, sure
<mvo> kiwinote: I looked at your branch, nice progress
<mvo> kiwinote: did you see the parser.py and tests for that from apturl?
<mvo> kiwinote: probably easy to reuse
<kiwinote> mvo: yep, I had seen the parser, was just going to start looking at tests
<kiwinote> mvo: just a quick question though: is the apt+http protocol something that is used? or can we drop that?
<mvo> kiwinote: we can drop it
<mvo> its just too risky
<kiwinote> mvo: the things that I still need to do on the branch are write tests for the app_details class, find a way to hide empty parts of the appdetails-gtk view (ie for the 'not found' screen) and then work out what the best places are to put warnings or error such that they are noticable
<kiwinote> mvo: thanks, that was my feeling too
<mvo> kiwinote: ok, I will start with the app_details class then
<kiwinote> yep
<seb128> re
<mvo> seb128: looking at the source it looks like dpkg should print something :/
<seb128> mvo, hum, weird
<seb128> let me do another quick session restart to make sure this gdm upload I just did works correctly with non autologin and I'm back to try to figure what happens to those triggers
<seb128> re, ok enough restart
<seb128> mvo, sorry I wanted to make sure that gdm update was ok
<seb128> mvo, so I was thinking, the directory is new, would the trigger work if it's only created during the install?
<seb128> mvo, I've the feeling libglib -bin should ship that dir as empty
<seb128> mvo, ie the dir was not on disk before that upgrade on the box which has the issue, does setting a trigger on a dir not created yet works?
<mvo> seb128: that makes sense!
<seb128> ;-)
<mvo> seb128:  I bet thats the issue :)
 * mvo hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs mvo back
 * kenvandine waves
<seb128> hey kenvandine, how are you? did you have nice holidays?
<kenvandine> i did :)
<kenvandine> a week with no computer... is kind of nice
<seb128> excellent!
<seb128> indeed
<kenvandine> ready to stress about gwibber/facebook :/
<kenvandine> i see ryan didn't get a fix
<Laney> just uploaded tomboy 1.3.1
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> no probs
<seb128> kenvandine, did you read the bug about the add button not working pitti assigned you? is that the same fb blocking gwibber issue?
<kenvandine> yeah... that is the same issue
<seb128> I was not sure since some people said it started happening with the sru update
<kenvandine> we only display the add  button when we get the confirmation it succeeded
<kenvandine> coincidence
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> however... it should do something different in the failure case... but we don't parse the error well
 * kenvandine smacks web scraping
<seb128> it's getting late for lucid .1
<seb128> you should make sure to do the sru update this week if you want it there
<kenvandine> yeah... i will jump on ryan as soon as he is awake and find out what is up
<seb128> kenvandine, otherwise new empathy landed to maverick and should have what you need to work on your tpapprover spec
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> seb128, well does telepathy-glib include the vapi file?
<fta2> $ dmesg | grep segfault | cut -d' ' -f2 | sed -e 's/\[.*//' | sort | uniq -c
<fta2>    1635 gwibber-service
<fta2> *sigh*
<kenvandine> segfaults from gwibber-service?
<kenvandine> oh, i bet timeouts in the processing pool
<seb128> kenvandine, seems not but I'm sure we can fix that
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> seb128, i'll look at that today
<kenvandine> fta2, you have a facebook account configured right?
<fta2> kenvandine, nope, just 1 identica acct
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<kenvandine> fta2, do you have failures for facebook-images in ~/.cache/gwibber/gwibber.log
<kenvandine> fta2, oh... interesting
<kenvandine> fta2, please file a bug and attach that log file
<fta2> kenvandine, http://paste.ubuntu.com/459821/
<kenvandine> fta2, ok.. and all you have is one account, identi.ca?
<fta2> kenvandine, yes
<kenvandine> python multiprocessing TimeoutError didn't use to cause segfaults... but recently they started to
<kenvandine> not sure why
<fta2> (that's in lucid)
<kenvandine> usually it was facebook calls for images hanging
<fta2> but using gwibber daily
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> i'll have to look at what ryan did while i was at the beach :)
<kenvandine> fta2, what revision?
<fta2> (it happened during the w-e, i was off, and it spammed my mailbox)
<fta2> kenvandine, 2.31.2~bzr750
<kenvandine> ok, thx
<kenvandine> eek... 119.8M API errors from facebook in the past week
<kenvandine> sigh... we have got to fix that
<kiwinote> mvo: what are we expected to do with apturls like 'apt:pkg?section=multiverse?section=universe' (one of the testcases)?
<kiwinote> mvo: it seems a bit messy to enable both components? Would it be acceptable to only look at the first section tag?
<mvo> kiwinote: there are some dependencies in multiverse that require universe
<mvo> kiwinote: so just enabling multiverse is not enough, it requires universe
<kiwinote> mvo: aah, ok, that makes sense then
<mvo> ok
<mvo> :)
<kiwinote> mvo: thanks
<mvo> np
<cassidy> kenvandine, hi! Empathy 2.31.4 that I released last week now properly implement the Approver API so it should be fine for you work on the indicator applet
<kenvandine> cassidy, saw that... thanks!
<seb128> cassidy, hey, the new empathy has been uploaded to maverick now btw
<cassidy> yeah, I saw. thanks!
<mvo> kiwinote: please check  lp:~mvo/software-center/appdetails-in-db and let me know what you think. I want to move all the knowledge from the appdetailsview into db.application "Application" and "AppDetails"
<mvo> kiwinote: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mvo/software-center/appdetails-in-db/annotate/head:/test/test_database.py is probably the interessting bit
<kiwinote> mvo: looks good. I like it that the Application() is also in there
<kiwinote> mvo: for the appdetails, in which ways do you want it to be different than my appdetails or mmcg's appsource?
<mvo> kiwinote: cool, I work a bit more on it and push the next rev, I hope that make the mess a bit less messy ;)
<mvo> kiwinote: just moving it outside of the view class/directory, otherwise its going to be very similar afaics
<mvo> kiwinote: and using properties, but I guess that is about it
<kiwinote> mvo: I currently have a AppDetails class in the db directory and mmcg has a seperate appsource class in his appdetailsviewgtk branch which can easily be moved
<mvo> kiwinote: hm, thinking about it it is maybe better to leave the getters as the mmcg code is already working with them
<kiwinote> mvo: yeah, I wasn't sure whether to use properties or not..
<mvo> kiwinote: in what way is yours different from mmcgs ?
<kiwinote> mvo: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/459847/
<kiwinote> mvo: from yesterday ^
<kiwinote> mvo: I don't mind which class we use, it just seems a bit odd for three of us to be making seperate classes for the same thing
<mvo> kiwinote: absolutely, shows that there is a dire need to get it into trunk, I will use yours, rename to AppDetials (if you don't mind) and we need to add some tests
<kiwinote> mvo: sure, I don't mind if you change things (also if you want getters/setters)
<mvo> kiwinote: thanks! I like properties better I think
<kiwinote> mvo: once the class has stabilized a bit between our needs, I don't mind writing the tests for it
<mvo> kiwinote: ok, so I think best to merge it over now so that we have a interface that is common to all branches
<kiwinote> mvo: indeed, the main thing you'll need to watch out for is that my class relies on the Application() having a request attribute for the gdebi and apturl features
<mvo> kiwinote: ok
<^arky^> hi mvo
<mvo> hey ^arky^
<^arky^> Enjoying the hot weather in Germany
<mvo> :)
<^arky^> mvo: Will software-center move over to pygtk away from webkit ?
<mvo> ^arky^: for some stuff, it will still use it as a fallback
<tremolux> hi kiwinote!   \o
<kiwinote> hi tremolux!
<mvo> hey tremolux
<tremolux> hey mvo!
<^arky^> mvo: I have looking at a11y of software-center for a while now
<^arky^> mvo: the only bug I find hard to fix is the sidebar a11y, can you take that up ?
<tremolux> ^arky^: thanks a lot for keeping an eye in a11y for us, it's a great help
<^arky^> tremolux: yw
<tremolux> ^arky^: do you have a bug # for the sidebar issue?
 * tremolux looks
<^arky^> tremolux: sure jam
<^arky^> tremolux:  bug 599046
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 599046 in software-center (Ubuntu) "Side pane navigation are read "Page" (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/599046
<^arky^> tremolux: I can provide accerciser output to help you debug the problem if you need
<mvo> kiwinote: I pushed a new revision that is just a skeleton interface. does that look suitable? if so I think we should fill the skeletong with live and port the the code over to it (probably trivial as its very close to the one you have). I don't want to merge the full deb_file support just now as it touches a lot of stuff
<kiwinote> looking
<kiwinote> mvo: yep, that looks good
<mvo> kiwinote: great, thanks! I like your PKG_STATE_* stuff btw
<kiwinote> mvo: that came from mmcg originally ;)
<mvo> heh :) ok, I should pass it on then I guess .)
<kiwinote> mvo: just looking back at the appdetails stuff, I used title/subtitle, you may or may not want to rename them, also it may be a good idea to introduce the error/warning into the skeleton, so that they can be used for appdetailsview-gtk stuff, instead of just plonking them in the description
<mvo> kiwinote: I have not made up my mind about title/subtitle yet, but error/warning is a good idea
<tremolux> ^arky^: thanks, please do if it's convenient
<^arky^> tremolux: will attach it to the bug
<tremolux> ^arky^: thanks a lot!
<^arky^> tremolux: :)
<^arky^> tremolux: attached a debug output from accerciser to the bug
<tremolux> ^arky^: awesome, thx!  I will look at that one, thanks for raising it
<mvo> kiwinote: and yet another version
<^arky^> tremolux: a question how do I get the ratings enabled ? I wanted to test them
<mvo> kiwinote, tremolux: I need to take a break for ~1h, feel free to fill in the gaps :)
<tremolux> ^arky^: hmm, it may not be worth spending the effort on ratings presently as we are currently not targeting ratings support in maverick
<^arky^> tremolux: I see, good to know that
 * rickspencer3 ducks
<jcastro> seb128: hey so I spent some time with shotwell to do my fireworks pics yesterday
<seb128> jcastro, oh, tell us!
<jcastro> I think it's getting much better, etc., but I don't think it's ready to take over yet
<jcastro> like, there was no obvious way to go to the "browse collection" view
 * mvo waves and takes a break
<jcastro> also import was pretty time consuming v. f-spot
<jcastro> (I didn't measure it exactly)
<mvo> kiwinote: I hope it makes merging easy for you and gives us something easy and extensible for the future
<kiwinote> mvo: yep, it should help both mmcg and myself to merge against
<seb128> jcastro, ok, would be nice to try how the new f-spot in maverick behaves as well
<kenvandine> seb128, i showed it to my wife (heavy photo junkie) recently too, she said there was no way she would switch away from f-spot
<seb128> kenvandine, why?
<kenvandine> features....
<kenvandine> most notably the timeline thing
<kenvandine> for browsing
<jcastro> the left sidebar of shotwell isn't very user friendly
<jcastro> it's just a tree
<kenvandine> she has 18k photos
<bcurtiswx> dejavu re. switch from pidgin to empathy
<kenvandine> that span a number of years
<kenvandine> she loves the timeline in f-spot
<tremolux> rickspencer3: haha  :D
<kenvandine> also tags, she likes tags and filtering in f-spot
<kenvandine> she couldn't figure out how to do that in shotwell
<jcastro> yeah, the tree on the side in shotwell isn't as usable as the top slider thing in f-spot
<kenvandine> seb128, that was all the input i got out of her in the 10 minutes she was willing to look at it... then she just said i'll stick with f-spot and walked away
<bcurtiswx> whats the difference in space on CD?
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, not sure... but i think it is just f-spot and tomboy keeping mono on the CD
<Laney> gbrainy
<kenvandine> and evidently we can build f-spot and tomboy so it doesn't need the mono runtime installed
 * kenvandine hasn't tried that... but that is what i hear
<lamalex> ... what??
<Laney> what?
 * bcurtiswx is interrupting a meeting?
<jcastro> kenvandine: that's what DBO says but no one has checked that
<Laney> are you talking about AOT?
<jcastro> Laney: lamalex: he says using AOT
<jcastro> bcurtiswx: no we're just hanging and I decided to bring up shotwell, heh
<bcurtiswx> jcastro: whew, i've made the mistake of derailing a previous meeting
<Laney> I don't think we have any infrastructure in place for AOT
<Laney> for example I don't know how clideps and friends will cope
<lamalex> I don't think that using AOT is worth dropping the mono runtime for a few mb
<lamalex> I know for a fact that tomboy uses some linq, I don't know about f-spot
<Laney> it's likely to have different/more bugs
<seb128> kenvandine, jcastro: ok thanks
<kenvandine> Laney, not surprising...
<Laney> and the obscure arch support will probably be whack
<Laney> but might be a nice PPA experiment
<kenvandine> no idea how that works
<jcastro> seb128: once I finish importing some pics I'll show you a screenshot
<jcastro> seb128: I didn't notice until I actually starting using it with lots of photos
<lamalex> kenvandine: it just generates the native code _ahead of time_ so as long as you don't use dynamic features it should work fine
<kenvandine> seb128, also... importing an existing library was pretty bad... ~10k was 4 hours and several gigs of ram
<Laney> pitti: this reminds me, are you planning on updating your f-spot patch adding a dir selector to the import dialog?
<pitti> Laney: I followed up upstream
<Laney> rubenv doesn't like the approach I know
<pitti> git head completely changed code, and they do not want to accept this approach
<Laney> but do we want to keep it downstream?
<pitti> so I don't plan to update this patch
<pitti> no, let's drop it
<Laney> cool, I'm with that
<pitti> I don't want to keep this forever
<Laney> he likes the idea of adding an option to customise the folder hierarchy, and that strikes me as a better solution too
<pitti> and I eventually just gave up and returned to gthumb
<pitti> Laney: right, I like that, too
<Laney> SMOP then
<Laney> :)
<pitti> FSVO "simple" :)
<Laney> might look into it, after cribbing from Banshee of course
<LaserJock> have you guys seen this? http://www.damonlynch.net/rapid/index.html
<LaserJock> it looks like maybe a useful tool for making photo/video management better
<vish> kenvandine: hi , when you get time could you review these > https://bugs.launchpad.net/adium-theme-ubuntu/+patches , they would close a few papercuts :)
<kenvandine> vish, sure
<vish> kenvandine: thanks
<jcastro> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5720/tree-of-doom.png <--- left sidebar of shotwell v. top slider thing in f-spot
<LaserJock> does anybody happen to know if gnome-panel will be shipped in Ubuntu past 10.10ish?
<LaserJock> jcastro: does shotwell only have that date tree? you can't say have a tag tree
<jcastro> it has tags at the bottom if you scroll (same as fspot)
<jcastro> that just doesn't show up there
<bcurtiswx> the shotwell thumbnails are much better, but maybe thats changeable with fspot
<jcastro> yeah that's just cosmetic
<lamalex> bcurtiswx: yeah, that could be patched in 20 minutes
<lamalex> and f-spot will be getting a large cosmetic makeover once a bunch of clean up is finished
<kiwinote> tremolux: are you working on mvo's branch atm, or can I branch it without duplicating work?
<tremolux> kiwinote: please branch it
<kiwinote> thanks ;)
<tremolux> kiwinote: I've branched it and am just catching up to what's been done, which bits are you working on?
<kiwinote> tremolux: I've just done a very little bit, which i'll push now, but I'm going to grab some dinner in a few minutes, so I'll won't be touching it for the next while
<tremolux> kiwinote: ok, sounds good  :)
<kiwinote> tremolux: it is worth looking at the appdetails file in my branch as I've changed a few things (wrt components, channels, warnings and errors). Just keep in mind that I have a whole pile of gdebi and apturl stuff in that file as well which we don't want in trunk yet
<tremolux> kiwinote: ok, will do, thanks
<rickspencer3> ArneGoetje, chrisccoulson, oh screw it
<rickspencer3> everybody!
<seb128> lol
<rickspencer3> desktop team meeting in 1 minute
<chrisccoulson> hi rickspencer3
<seb128> rickspencer3, tehnically it's now ;-)
<seb128> technically
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-07-06
<rickspencer3> it's now
<rickspencer3> !!
<ArneGoetje> o/
<kenvandine> hey
<rickspencer3> I'm afraid I need everyone in Europe to work some over time tonight
<rickspencer3> it won't be done until about 10 minutes after the game ends
<rickspencer3> or ...
<rickspencer3> we could start the meeting so everyone can go out and get a good seat
<rickspencer3> ;)
<tremolux> hiya
 * rickspencer3 taps gavel
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-07-06
<rickspencer3> first is open actions from last week
<rickspencer3> but there weren't any
 * pitti chuckles
<rickspencer3> so, easy!
<pitti> the real fun is tomorrow!
<rickspencer3> pitti, for you maybe, I'm in NL
<rickspencer3> next is partner update
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, ?
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, i haven't figured that out yet... :) first day back
<rickspencer3> okay
<rickspencer3> well
 * kenvandine enjoyed drinks at the beach... does that count?
<rickspencer3> this is turning out to go fast
<seb128> it will be faster when you notice there is no didrocks either
<seb128> ;-)
<rickspencer3> I think Riddell is at Akadamy
<seb128> indeed
<chrisccoulson> i don't know if you want a mozilla update? i've not prepared anything to say but i could probably say a few words
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, yes please
<seb128> chrisccoulson, would be nice
<chrisccoulson> ok. so, we published FF3.6.6 to hardy and lucid last week (just after last weeks meeting)
<seb128> \o/
<chrisccoulson> it's gone reasonably well so far, there was 1 issue that appeared during the evening (the new FF version conflicting with firefox-2 installs)
<chrisccoulson> but that's fixed now
<chrisccoulson> and we had some users complaining that their java plugin disappeared, which is also now fixed
<chrisccoulson> and we're getting a lot of crash reports caused by the flash plugin on both lucid and hardy
<chrisccoulson> which sucks :-/
<chrisccoulson> i could do with a way of contacting somebody at adobe
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, have you asked asac about that?
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, about contacting somebody at adobe?
<chrisccoulson> or about the crashes?
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, the adobe thing
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, not yet. i was given another name yesterday, but i've not had a chance to speak to him yet
<chrisccoulson> but, apart from that, i'm going to be in a position to finally start on maverick work this week :)
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, I would strongly recommend asking asac
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, ok, i can do that
<rickspencer3> for a suggestion of who to talk to
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, congrats on starting maverick
<rickspencer3> !
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, I assume it goes without saying that you did an awesome job with mozilla and we all owe you a huge debt of gratitude?
<chrisccoulson> FF3.6.7 is already in the PPA ready for testing too
<chrisccoulson> heh, thanks :)
<seb128> indeed great work chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> and thanks to everyone who's helped out with testing too :)
 * tremolux high-5's chrisccoulson
 * chrisccoulson high-5's tremolux :)
<rickspencer3> :)
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, else on mozilla?
<chrisccoulson> i think i'm done. the only other thing is that karmic and jaunty are still blocked on openjdk, but that should be resolved soon
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, that's just a simple matter of work, right?
<rickspencer3> no unsolved technical issues, correct?
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, yeah, we still need to run the TCK, which i don't think i'm doing
<rickspencer3> right
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, who is, do you know?
<chrisccoulson> but jdstrand had to copy a package to main in jaunty today to get the backported version to build
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure who's doing the work, i'll have to check my emails again
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, never mind, I can find out
<rickspencer3> you should rather take a rest!
<rickspencer3> hehe
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, thanks
<rickspencer3> ok, moving on ...
<rickspencer3> tremolux, software-center?
<tremolux> sure, pastebomb incoming:
<tremolux> Buy Something:  Software Center Agent implementation progressing well, stub server in use for development
<tremolux> mvo was able to "buy something" from his private PPA after resolving aptdaemon issue, branch at lp:~mvo/software-center/buy-something
<tremolux> New Apps:  Further UI design input from mpt and discussion, development using app-review-board PPA continues (new-apps needs love this week)
<tremolux> UI Enhancements:  Great progress by Kiwinote in apturl integration features, Matthew McGowan working on new gtk-based details view
<rickspencer3> mvo was able to "buy something" from his private PPA after resolving aptdaemon issue, branch at lp:~mvo/software-center/buy-something
<rickspencer3> !!!!
<rickspencer3> seriously?
<rickspencer3> wow
<tremolux> yeah!
<tremolux> he said it is "rough", but it worked
<rickspencer3> New Apps:  Further UI design input from mpt and discussion
<rickspencer3> has anyone come up with a name yet?
<tremolux> no, I will get something asap tho
<rickspencer3> tremolux, maybe a contest or something?
<tremolux> hah, maybe!
<rickspencer3> ACTION: rickspencer3 to propose a naming contest for new apps
<rickspencer3> ACTION: rickspencer3 to find out who is doing the TDK testing, and make sure they do it
<rickspencer3> tremolux, thanks for the update
<tremolux> sure!
<rickspencer3> sounds like software-center is coming along quite nicely for maverick
<rickspencer3> moving on ...
<rickspencer3> no didrocks, so no UNE update
<rickspencer3> so, two quick things from me
<rickspencer3> I bet some of you are wondering about performance reviews
<rickspencer3> well ... I'm just waiting to hear about the raise and bonus numbers
<rickspencer3> so I'm thinking next week
<rickspencer3> we'll discuss goal setting at that time as well
<seb128> ups
<seb128> sorry about that
<seb128> (note, don't test bugs during a meeting that might crash things)
<rickspencer3> welcome back seb128
<rickspencer3> lol
<rickspencer3> never a bad time to test!
<rickspencer3> okay
<rickspencer3> next is the spring
<rickspencer3> sprint, even
<rickspencer3> ah, I see my update to the wiki got blown away
<rickspencer3> so, we need to update the wiki with our goals for the sprint
<rickspencer3> as Tech Lead, this will be seb128's sacred task
<rickspencer3> for some reason, this is on the internal wiki:
<seb128> ;-)
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.canonical.com/UbuntuPlatform/Sprints/Maverick/Desktop
<rickspencer3> (sorry seb128)
<seb128> the page seems pretty empty
<rickspencer3> seb128, I think making the agenda has gotten a lot easier since we started tracking work items
<rickspencer3> but there may be non work item things to add, as well
<rickspencer3> like if you want someone to teach you something
<rickspencer3> add it to the agenda
<rickspencer3> seb128, so can you own filling in the agenda for us??
<loneowais> lamalex: hey, i shifted that app to messaging menu
<seb128> ok
<lamalex> loneowais: sweet
<loneowais> lamalex: the one we talked about yesterday
<seb128> loneowais, hey, there is a meeting running atm
<loneowais> oh
<loneowais> sorry
<loneowais> carry on
<rickspencer3> loneowais, lamalex np, almost done
<seb128> lamalex, loneowais: could you wait end of the meeting or use #ayatana?
<kenvandine> :)
<loneowais> i'm in no hurry
<loneowais> i can wait
<rickspencer3> :)
<rickspencer3> moving on
<rickspencer3> seb128, release status? anything there to discuss?
<seb128> #ayatana could be nice since that's where people writing indicators hang
<seb128> ok
<seb128> not really
<seb128> congrats on alpha2 everybody
<seb128> http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/maverick/canonical-desktop-team-maverick-alpha-2.html
<seb128> we have been mostly on track during this iteration and alpha2 is working nicely
<seb128> now we track http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/maverick/canonical-desktop-team-maverick-alpha-3.html
<seb128> and seems we are already behind a bit
<seb128> (but there was a 3 days weekend and some people on holidays)
<seb128> so let's rock on those
<seb128> and don't forget to update your workitems regularly
<seb128> that was about it, thanks
<rickspencer3> seb128, when should we start looking at bugs?
<seb128> rickspencer3, "depends" I would say ;-)
<seb128> it's still a bit early to focus on bugs now
<seb128> but we turned apport on again in maverick
<rickspencer3> thanks seb128
<seb128> and it might be time to try to spot some of the importants issues in components you watch
<seb128> and talk to upstream etc about those
<rickspencer3> any other business?
<seb128> quite some specs are still work in progress though and there is no real point spending lot of time on bugs for things changing still
<seb128> rickspencer3, thanks
<rickspencer3> thanks seb128, understood
<rickspencer3> any other business?
<seb128> not from me
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> shall we call it a wrap?
 * rickspencer3 taps gavel
<kenvandine> woot
<seb128> thanks everybody
<kenvandine> :)
<rickspencer3> loneowais, lamalex we're done
<tremolux> thanks everybody!
<ArneGoetje> thanks
<LaserJock> seb128: do you know if gnome-panel will officially be deprecated with GNOME 3.0?
<seb128> LaserJock, not sure what you call deprecated
<seb128> LaserJock, it will still be available as a fallback for people not having video requirements for new technologies
<seb128> LaserJock, it will not likely get lot of upstream work though
<LaserJock> OK
<LaserJock> but Ubuntu would likely ship it as a fallback for a while?
<seb128> LaserJock, depends of what you mean ship
<vish> ArneGoetje: hi , for IBus merges are the correct procedure or ...?
<seb128> LaserJock, we will figure that next cycle when we switch to GNOME3
<LaserJock> ok
<seb128> LaserJock, it will still be in Ubuntu, not sure about the default installation
<seb128> brb
<mvo> kiwinote: merging from your branch now
<ArneGoetje> vish: probably. We need to wait for the next upstream release, since the current one is buggy. Better coordinate with ZhengPengHou.
<vish> ArneGoetje: cool , he is on irc , his irc nick?
<vish> is he on irc*
<vish> ArneGoetje: a merge is waiting for Ibus , https://code.launchpad.net/~joel-auterson/ubuntu/maverick/ibus/newmenuname/+merge/29215 , and wasnt sure how it can be addressed , could you comment on it?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you have any time to work on this firefox lucid .1 task btw?
<seb128> I guess it's "no" with the security update but we should get the .1 sru in this week we are already late
<seb128> is there any chance you will be able to get to this one?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i will try and look at that one tomorrow
<seb128> thanks
<ArneGoetje> vish: he is not in this channel, but should be present on freenode (although maybe not at this time)
<ArneGoetje> vish: I have reviewed the merge proposal and commented on it.
<vish> ArneGoetje: neat thanks!
<seb128> kenvandine, hum, gwibber triggers apport on start in maverick there
<seb128> "/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/gwibber/gwui.py", line 909, in set_overlay_text
<seb128>      self.pango_overlay.set_markup(self.overlay_text % (self.overlay_color, text))
<seb128>  AttributeError: 'InputTextView' object has no attribute 'pango_overlay'
<seb128> kenvandine, ^ known issue?
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> no
<seb128> do you run maverick?
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> working here
<seb128> kenvandine, it doesn't crash, it's just an exception to apport triggers
<seb128> kenvandine, we turned it on again yesterday
<kenvandine> i am not getting that though
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> i have gotten other apport triggers today :)
<kenvandine> i should get it on the console if i run it, which i don't
<kenvandine> seb128, do you see the overlay text in the input box?
<kenvandine> i suspect you don't...
<seb128> kenvandine, I see the count there
<kenvandine> is there anything further up in the traceback?
<seb128> should it have anything else?
<kenvandine> that is it
<seb128> kenvandine, http://paste.ubuntu.com/459938/
<jenkins> hello pitti, rickspencer3 said to ask you how do i get apport to collect logs from a custom location?
<seb128> kenvandine, but I didn't get the exception on this run
<kenvandine> could it have been an old crash?
<seb128> jenkins, you can use attach_file
<seb128> kenvandine, so, I clean my crash dir before the meeting today
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> kenvandine, I get like 15 crashes a day collected atm
<seb128> joice of running an unstable distro ;-)
<kenvandine> hehe :)
<jenkins> seb128: could you expand please, I have not used apport in an app that I am working on before.
<kenvandine> you shouldn't be able to get that error once and not a second time... very weird
<rickspencer3> seb128, perhaps it is documented somewhere?
<seb128> jenkins, did you read the documentation?
<seb128> rickspencer3, yes, in the apport documentation :p
<rickspencer3> answer to jenkins question, I mean
<seb128> let me search the wiki page one sec
<jenkins> seb128: I only found some stuff on the kubuntu wiki about apport
<seb128> jenkins, did you read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Apport/DeveloperHowTo?
<seb128> jenkins, you can read /usr/share/doc/apport/package-hooks.txt
<seb128> .gz
<jenkins> seb128: I will have a read thanks
<seb128> jenkins, see     attach_file(report, path, key=None) in the apport.hookutils documentation
<jenkins> ok thanks I will have a read
<jenkins> I have made my quickshot-crashdb.conf and my source_quickshot.py, but doing ubuntu-bug quickshot gives "This is not a genuine ubuntu package" . The project is hosted on launchpad but not in the repo is that a problem?
<seb128> jenkins, you can talk to ted about how to handle those, apport is made to file ubuntu bugs by default and yours is not one
<seb128> the dx team did some hacks to file bugs from ppa builds on upstream components though
<jenkins> seb128: when will ted be around? he is not on at the moment
<seb128> he's tedg
<jenkins> are ok thanks
<tedg> seb128, It's not a hack, it's documented in a wiki :)
<seb128> tedg, it should be in some documentation I guess
<tedg> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Apport/DeveloperHowTo#Applications%20not%20included%20in%20Ubuntu's%20repositories%20but%20hosted%20on%20Launchpad
<seb128> seems to be a frequent question
<seb128> jenkins, ^
<seb128> tedg, seems it is, thank you!
<jenkins> tedg: I have follwed that but is does not work I will just pastebin my files
<tedg> seb128, No problem, actually didrocks deserves the credit as he showed me :)
<tedg> jenkins, Here's what I did: https://code.launchpad.net/~ted/indicator-appmenu/apport-hook/+merge/27400
<jenkins> http://pastebin.com/KXXPSNR2 is my source_quickshot.py file and http://pastebin.com/G2N3e4YL is my *.conf file
<jenkins> does the package version number need to end in ubuntuppa for it to work?
<tedg> jenkins, No, it doesn't.
<tedg> jenkins, Did you install them in the right places?
<tedg> jenkins, They look fine to me, but honestly, I don't know much more than following the instructions on the wiki.
<jenkins> I have the .py in /usr/share/apport/package-hooks and the .conf in /etc/apport/crashdb.conf.d
<tedg> jenkins, didrocks had said that he had built some support for this into quickly.  Maybe you can look there for more complete examples.
<jenkins> which is right
<jenkins> the ubuntuone client has ones which i used to follow. the app i am working on is a quickly ap
<jenkins> didrocks: any suggestions?
<tedg> jenkins, Hmm, interesting.  I thought everything "just worked" in quickly apps...
<seb128> he's away for the week
<seb128> bbl
<jenkins> hmm
<tedg> jenkins, The only thing else I'd advise is just make it simpler.  Get down to the bare min of what you need and see if that works.
<jenkins> ok I will comment out all but the minum and see what happens
<jenkins> nope no luck I commented out everything that was extra
<jenkins> thanks for your help I will hang out here incase anyone else has any suggestions
<desrt> tedg: hey
<desrt> tedg: can you clarify what you meant in your email?
<tedg> Good afternoon desrt
<desrt> i think i might be misunderstanding you
<tedg> desrt, Yeah, basically just having an "if (linking GPLv2) then dont_offend_it();" clause.  So GPLv2 would get a special exception.
<desrt> tedg: "dont_offend_it()" would have to be defined as "become GPLv2"
<desrt> so what you're talking about is effectively dual-licensing
<tedg> desrt, I thought only the patent thing offended it.  Not everything else.
<desrt> tedg: hm.
<desrt> i was under the impression that the gplv2 viewed any additional restriction as a problem
<desrt> and things like the anti-tivoisation are restrictions
<desrt> tedg: in any case, so that you don't have to waste yoyur time typing the argument twice, maybe you could reply to the list explaining that idea?
<tedg> desrt, That could be true.  I'm not 100% sure, I thought it was just the patent thing.  Does the "Tivo" clause effect linking?
<tedg> desrt, I think that'd only effect shipping the library itself.
<desrt> the tivo clause modifies your ability to redistribute
<desrt> say you have a straight GPL2 program
<desrt> you're free to tivoise that and move on
<desrt> actually, wait
<desrt> i think LGPLv3 specifically nullifies the tivo clause of GPLv3
<desrt> so that's probably why it doesn't matter
<jcastro> htorque: are you on i386 or amd64 when you test UNE?
<htorque> jcastro, i386
<tedg> desrt, In a nutshell, I'm happy to be wrong.  But I thought that the patent thing was the issue, so it may be possible to special case that.  If it's the whole thing, that's probably a silly way to go.
<desrt> tedg: if you could find a link that shows me why i'm wrong you should really reply to the list with it :)
<jcastro> htorque: when you get a chance, please update and try the menu, I think bratsche just fixed almost all the bugs.
<htorque> jcastro: i will soon :)
<jcastro> htorque: let me know!
<htorque> jcastro: appmenu-gtk 0.1.0 - anything else to update?
<bratsche> That's the latest.
<bratsche> Are you having issues with it?
<htorque> about to test it now :)
<jcastro> bratsche: I am waiting for it to build on amd64 to test it
<jenkins> I have made some progress I ran "ubuntu-bug quickshot" on the command line and got lots of indentation errors, despite the fact i copied from the ubuntuone file. The error i can not fix is http://pastebin.com/0sFSju8t using this file http://pastebin.com/fbwPbZjh any suggestions?
<htorque> bratsche, jcastro: i'm still seeing the gap thing for gedit "Tools", gnome-terminal "Tabs", and rhythmbox "Tools", see bug 600191,
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 600191 in indicator-appmenu (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Gedit: Hidden menu causing gap (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/600191
<bratsche> htorque: What do you mean?  That "Tools" is not visible in gedit?
<boozler> How can I get extra keys to work in ubuntu? Iv tried going to system > preferences > keyboard > layouts and selecting different model key boards but I'v had no success. My keyboard is a logitech pro 2000 wireless usb. Im specifically trying to get extra equal sign, open and close paranthese above my numpad to work.
<desrt> boozler: a mac keyboard layout might help you
<desrt> they have the keypad equals sign
<desrt> never heard of the parens, though :/
<htorque> bratsche, i don't have a "Tools" menu in gedit's original menu bar, but a gap in the global menu that changes to a "Tools" menu once i re-focus gedit
<boozler> desrt: nope didn't work
<bratsche> htorque: Ah, interesting.  I wonder how I can reproduce that, since I always have Tools visible.
<boozler> desrt: is there a file some where I can hack to make it work? for example I can make them work in vi through vimrc
<htorque> bratsche, same goes for rhythmbox and the gnome-terminal (as long as i have only one tab open, there is no "Tabs" menu in gnome-terminal's menu bar)
<desrt> boozler: xmodmap might be your friend
<desrt> boozler: you can use the 'xev' command to find out what the raw keycodes are
<desrt> and then use xmodmap to map those keycodes onto the proper key symbols
<boozler> desrt: sounds like a plan only xev reports all three keys with the same keycode
<desrt> bad news for you
<bratsche> htorque: Ah yeah, I see that now.  Thanks!
<boozler> haha
<htorque> bratsche: should the menu order now also work for all qt apps? in the VLC play the menus are in reverse order for a couple of seconds before changing  to their correct positions
<htorque> *player
<bratsche> htorque: I dunno.. I think agateau is the right person to talk to about Qt apps.
<pitti> jenkins: you write a package hook, see /usr/share/doc/apport/package-hooks.txt.gz and the countless examples in /usr/share/apport/package-hooks/
<jenkins> pitti: thanks I have just solved it, so please
<jenkins> d
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Congratulations on getting core-dev.
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-07-07
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, oh, I did?
<robert_ancell> nice :)
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, no more bugging you for uploads :)
<TheMuso> yay! :p
<seb128> hey
<seb128> robert_ancell, there?
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey
<seb128> robert_ancell, hello
<robert_ancell> seb128, how's it going?
<robert_ancell> seb128, I had an attempt of updating GTK+ yesterday but the packaging is doing my head in :)  Do you know how debian is going?
<seb128> robert_ancell, out of some IRC issues and launchpad being down when I wanted to upload a glib fix that's going alright there ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, not really, I've watched their svn but not a lot of activity, you meant update 2.22 or 3?
<robert_ancell> 2.22
<seb128> robert_ancell, the empathy build failure is my fault but I can't upload the fixed glib
<robert_ancell> seb128, oh, I was just looking at that :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, congratulation for your new uploads rights btw
<robert_ancell> yay!
<seb128> robert_ancell, the fix is commited and pushed but I got a "connection refused" on upload
<robert_ancell> np
<seb128> and checked the clock it was 3 minutes after "the launchpad will be down for update"
<seb128> robert_ancell, if you can upload already feel free to sponsor the vcs version
<robert_ancell> they like to bring it down when the people this side of the world start work
<robert_ancell> cool, will do
<seb128> robert_ancell, Josselin moved the commands from the bin to the lib and I forgot the compat part of the changes
<robert_ancell> oh, I'll have to update the gcalctool dependencies
<seb128> there is still a bug that the gio .pc has the wrong path for the schemas register command
<seb128> robert_ancell, well the -bin should work the way it uses
<robert_ancell> really want the new GTK+ as there are a number of packages that depend on it
<seb128> it has compat entries in bin
<seb128> ok, gseal work?
<seb128> I can try to get things moving in debian tomorrow
<robert_ancell> not sure, just required in configure.ac for some packages
<seb128> robert_ancell, is there any update you want to get in ubuntu?
<robert_ancell> .31 update?
<seb128> robert_ancell, btw I'm not sure what should pull dconf in
<seb128> robert_ancell, yeah, what is blocked on the gtk update?
<robert_ancell> I think it should be ubuntu-desktop?
<seb128> robert_ancell, I made glib recommends it for now
<robert_ancell> vinagre at least
<seb128> ok
<seb128> robert_ancell, well ideally dh_gsettings or whatever is the new dh_gconf is should do it
<seb128> the same way dh_gconf was doing
<seb128> set a misc;Depends on libdconf0 is there is a gsettings schemas
<robert_ancell> I thought we didn't need that now we have the triggers?
 * TheMuso just noted libdconf was pulled into his maverick chroot.
<robert_ancell> well, technically having a gsettings schema does not require dconf.  You could have another backends
<robert_ancell> backend
<seb128> ok
<seb128> so let's keep the recommends in glib for now
<seb128> it should do the job
<robert_ancell> yeah, practically it works
<micahg> robert_ancell: congrats on becoming core-dev
<seb128> I'm not sure dconf is working though there
<seb128> gcalctool doesn't seem to write any settings
<robert_ancell> micahg, thanks
<seb128> ie the mode is not stored and dconf-viewer is empty
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, I've noticed that too.  I'll investigate
<TheMuso> Ah. libglib2.0-0 recommends libdconf0
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<seb128> TheMuso, yeah, see backlog
<robert_ancell> seb128, oh, can you update versions?  I've made it track the 2.30 packages
<TheMuso> yeah just did
<TheMuso> I have also noticed the system bell seems to be disabled under compiz in maverick. Is this intensional?
<seb128> I doubt it but robert_ancell did a merge on debian which was non trivial
<seb128> so one change my have skipped on the way
<seb128> robert_ancell, done
<robert_ancell> groan.  The system bell always seems to cause trouble...
<seb128> robert_ancell, I should add an update in the cron job ;-)
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Happy to dig into it
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes please :)  My sprint list has an item "work out some common webspace for our scripts"
<seb128> robert_ancell, speaking of which if you read the meeting log there is a sprint wikipage
<seb128> robert_ancell, so feel free to put items there
<robert_ancell> seb128, oh I will mwuhahaha!
<seb128> ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, not here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-07-06, do you mean the IRC log?
<seb128> robert_ancell, I'm very tempted to update nautilus to 2.31
<robert_ancell> seb128, what's the cost?
<seb128> I need to check what gconf use it does
<seb128> they will likely port it to gsettings this cycle
<seb128> but they have tons of nice changes
<seb128> like a stack of hundredpapercut issues fixed
<seb128> redesigned the copy dialog for conflicts
<robert_ancell> that would be a big win
<seb128> right
<seb128> robert_ancell, IRC logs, yes, seems that rick didn't update the wiki
<seb128> robert_ancell, https://wiki.canonical.com/UbuntuPlatform/Sprints/Maverick/Desktop
<seb128> it's empty so far but feel free to start adding things ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, otherwise do you have any opinion about going for the new gobject-introspection?
<robert_ancell> seb128, I'm not aware of anything in particular that has changed
<seb128> well they changed the abi version
<seb128> so that will require renaming our gir debs at least if we do it
<seb128> it's yet another transition but it should be doable if we want to go for it
<robert_ancell> seb128, is debian going that way?
<seb128> the guy handling the gnome-shell daily ppa asked if we were going to update since gjs 0.8 will require it
<robert_ancell> right
<seb128> dunno, I will have to figure that as well
<seb128> but I think we should try to get at least our platform uptodate
<seb128> and that's sort part of the platform nowadays
<robert_ancell> seb128, are the gir debs just going to merge into the standard lib debs?
<seb128> not that I know no, why?
<robert_ancell> I think introspection is transitioning from an optional system to a core part of the library interface
<seb128> debian created gir-... binaries on purpose
<seb128> robert_ancell, well the issue is that installing non soname-versioned files in libraries break co-installability of versions
<seb128> robert_ancell, do you think it's wrong?
<seb128> in any case I don't want to divert from debian on that
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, time to go to bed there
<robert_ancell> seb128, but aren't the gir files matched to the so files?  match debian anyway
<robert_ancell> seb128, cya
<seb128> robert_ancell, no they are not, /usr/lib/girepository-1.0/Wnck-1.0.typelib
<seb128> with /usr/lib/libwnck-1.so.22
<robert_ancell> seb128, I'll add it to the sprint list for discussion :)
<seb128> we would need to have something in the typelib path that avoid conflict if the library soname change
<seb128> I will try to sync with debian guys on their plans for gir and gtk updates
<seb128> but for now time to get some sleep
<seb128> try to figure what is wrong with dconf if you can today and let me know if you figure something ;-)
<seb128> bye
<TheMuso> Looks like LP is back.
<mediacenter> I have an acer aspire 3810TZ that has an atheros wireless N built in and was running Windows Vista Home Premium. With Windows I got 130mb/s. Now I am running Ubuntu 10.4 and I get only 1mb/s or unknown. Does anyone know how to fix this problem?
<jenkins> from what version of ubuntu was apport intorduced?
<RAOF> mediacenter: This isn't a support channel; #ubuntu or ubuntuforums.org will be better.  That said, it sounds like you're reading the numbers reported by âConnection informationâ, which might simply be wrong.  This is likely to be a bug (probably in the drivers).
<micahg> jenkins: looks like edgy
<jenkins> micahg: wow that long ago, cool thanks
<mediacenter> RAOF: Thanks for your help.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, I want to release glib from bzr that seb did, how do I sign the package without changing the changelog?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, hey
<lifeless> robert_ancell: don't edit the changelog, surely :P
<robert_ancell> lifeless, yes, I don't want to edit the changelog, but when you run debuild -S it complains it can't sign as seb
<lifeless> DEB_SIGNING_KEY or something. hang on
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: one sec, will check the repo myself.
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: use -uc -us on the end of the debuild command
<TheMuso> Then run debsign over the changes file.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, thanks
<lifeless> or debuild -S -m robertancell
<TheMuso> yeah that works too
<lifeless> actually
<lifeless> -k
<lifeless> is the one to use
<robert_ancell> too many options...
<robert_ancell> hmm, still not working
<robert_ancell> I'm running: bzr-buildpackage -S -- -k robert.ancell@canonical.com
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, how have you been sponsoring my uploads?
<robert_ancell> oh, got it
<robert_ancell> no space after -k
<robert_ancell> bad app
<robert_ancell> lifeless, thanks
<TheMuso> heh yeah I sometimes get caught with debsign on that one.
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: I tend to use -uc -us and debsign afterwards.
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Hey pitti.
 * TheMuso -> slightly early EOD
<pitti> hey TheMuso, sleep well!
<kiwinote> mvo: hi
<mvo> hey kiwinote
<kiwinote> mvo: I've made a few changes to the appdetails class in my branch, mostly just a few renaming things while we still can
<mvo> kiwinote: ok
<mvo> kiwinote: I have a look
<kiwinote> mvo: you may want to revert some of the changes, but I've put a little comment explaining the change were applicable
<kiwinote> mvo: I haven't updated anything outside the appdetails.py and test_database to use the new naming
<mvo> kiwinote: ok
<kiwinote> mvo: any changes you don't want, or do I change the appdetailsview to use the new naming?
<kiwinote> mvo: the only last thing I was wondering about was the summary and description. they both kind of sound the same, but I couldn't think of better names to distinguish between them..
<mvo> kiwinote: thanks, I just looked over it and I think the changes are fine and make sense
<kiwinote> ok
<mvo> kiwinote: I think summary/description needs good doc strings. maybe summary/long_description? but that then becomes a bit too long
<kiwinote> mvo: yeah, probably best just to leave it as it is until someone comes up with really good names for them
 * mvo nods
<mvo> kiwinote: merged
<seb128> hello
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey pitti
<seb128> how are you?
<seb128> brb after upgrade restart
<robert_ancell> desrt, ping
<pitti> hey robert_ancell
<pitti> robert_ancell: congratulations for your new core-dev badge, well earned!
<robert_ancell> pitti, hey
<robert_ancell> thanks
<kiwinote> mvo: my branch should have the remaining changes needed for appdetailsview-wk to use the new naming
<kiwinote> mvo: I'll update my own branch and the appdetailsview-gtk to use the new naming, so I won't be touching your code for the next while ;)
<mvo> kiwinote: ok
<mvo> kiwinote: I work on the remaining bits and will merge into trunk today
<kiwinote> mvo: yep, that code is quite sweet, so it'll be nice once it's in trunk for us all to use. thanks
<seb128> slomo, hey
<seb128> slomo, do you know if anybody is working on updating gtk 2.22 with the new gdk-pixbuf source in debian?
<seb128> slomo, do you also know what are the plan for gobject-introspection? will debian update or stay on that abi version?
<slomo> seb128: no idea, sorry
<seb128> slomo, for both questions?
<slomo> yes
<seb128> ok
<seb128> slomo, you don't plan to work on the gtk update yourself? ;-)
<slomo> i do but i have too many other things to do right now :(
<slomo> might take a week or two
<seb128> slomo, ok
<seb128> slomo, I might have a go to the update and packaging gdk-pixbuf today
<seb128> slomo, I will ping you for review and debian sponsoring if I do ;-)
<slomo> ok, thanks :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, you didn't do any work on updating gtk today right?
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi seb128
<pitti> hey rickspencer3, had a nice party last night?
<pitti> I'm sure the Dutch folks are happy :)
<rickspencer3> pitti, yes, they were quite happy
<rickspencer3> :)
<pitti> let's hope we'll meet them on Sunday!
<rickspencer3> though  I think several heart attacks occurred in the last 60 seconds
<and471> hehe
<seb128> pitti, let's wait to see what it's going to be on sunday ;-)
<pitti> rickspencer3: heart attacks> I didn't follow the game, they shot a goal in the last minue?
<rickspencer3> pitti, yeah, in extra time there was quite some action in front of the NL goal
<pitti> rickspencer3: i. e. they were damn close to a 3:3?
<rickspencer3> pitti, correct
<pitti> hehe
<rickspencer3> one good shot would have equalized
<and471> pitti, the uruguayans were going at them crazy, and 3 mins of extra time stretched into 4 and a half :)
<rickspencer3> I'm supposed to be on a train to Brussels atm
<rickspencer3> but someone used the tracks to do themselves in
<rickspencer3> :(
<rickspencer3> so my train was canceled
<pitti> urgh
<pitti> rickspencer3: but that usually takes just an hour or two to settle; got some urgent appointments?
<rickspencer3> pitti, yeah, I needed to transfer to EuroStar
<rickspencer3> so would have missed my train there, etc...
<rickspencer3> so I hit the reset button, will try again later
<rickspencer3> or maybe next week, even
<mvo> kiwinote: let me know when you feel I should merge the apdetails-gtk branch, I think the other bits are ready
<mvo> kiwinote: I split the webkit stuff into appdetailsview_webkit now, so it should be easy
<kiwinote> mvo: I've just finished updating the appdetailsview-gtk file, I've still got to update some of the code in the application.py (eg the pkg_state stuff) before appdetailsview-gtk will work nicely
<mvo> kiwinote: ok, thanks. no worries, just ping me :)
<and471> mvo, could I ask why you are not using webkit in software-center anymore? (sorry for asking twice, my pc crashed)
<mvo> and471: hello, there were some integration and a11y issues, but mostly because mmcg wrote a super-beautiful gtk version of the category view widget
<mvo> and471: I am still fond of webkit and think its a good way to make beautiful UIs without too much work
<and471> mvo, the reason I ask is that I am creating this http://whyareyoureadingthisurl.wordpress.com/2010/06/14/introducing-the-wasiliana-mail-client/
<and471> my first idea was to use webkit to create the UI
<mvo> and471: but matthew decided to go the extra mile (that is rquired with gtk)
<and471> but now wx-toolkit has come to my attention (toolkit in clutter, used by meego)
<and471> mvo, I was wondering which would be better
<mvo> and471: nice! I think you will still need webkit to display the html mails
<and471> mvo, yeah,
<and471> mvo, it was whther to just use for the email, or for the whole app
<mvo> and471: I think it depends a bit, I personally think it much easier to find html hackers than people implementing gtk widgets
<mvo> and471: but gtk feels snappier and is better integrated (at least currently)
<and471> mvo, hmmm, there is my dilemna :)
<mvo> and471: I would design a abstract class and implement the html version first
<and471> mvo, did you encounter any performance issues with webkit?
<mvo> and471: and then you can experiment with gtk/webkit/clutter
<and471> mvo, and allow for a mx-toolkit version :)
<and471> mvo, the project I am working on is designed for netbooks, and if there any performance issues, then there is no point my using webkit
<mvo> and471: no real performance issues, but in order to be sure that the page is rendered before executing JS it feels on some place not as snappy as with native gtk
<mvo> and471: I think this problems can be solved by more careful work on the html/JS, not a big deal IMO
<and471> mvo, the one thing good thing about mx-toolkit in relation to webkit, is that it can be styled with CSS also :)
<mvo> and471: cool!
<and471> mvo, mx-toolkit is based on clutter, does clutter require compositing?
<and471> mvo, :)
<mvo> and471: I quite like webkit still, without matthew I still would use it, but he does such beautiful work on the native widgets that its just too good :)
<and471> mvo, I branched a recent version and it did look good :)
<mvo> and471: yes, clutter requires compositing. we were thinking about using it as well, but that makes other stuff more difficult
<and471> mvo, so by using mx-toolkit, would that be limiting my audience, and how does clutter run on netbooks (i.e. well or not)
<and471> mvo, sorry for these questions, you are just the most experienced person that I know well
<mvo> and471: netbooks should be fine, its really stuff like nvidia without nvidia-glx that is problematic
<mvo> and471: compiz runs fine on netbooks, once HW acceleration is availalbe you should be fine
<and471> mvo, well I shall continue work on my other project and speak to the lead dev later (hopefully) to see if he has any more advice
<and471> mvo, thanks for your help
<mvo> and471: have fun! and of course we always have open arms in software-center for you as well :)
<and471> mvo, :) maybe a bit later :)
<mvo> sure .)
<and471> mvo, see ya
<and471> what is the best way to have a patch in a deb, that only applies to the desktop edition? (in this case, a change to the default /etc/sudoers files if installling desktop edition)
<Laney> how come glib2.0 doesn't have a build record for sparc?
<and471> seb128, pitti ^ could you have a look?
<seb128> and471, to what? glib?
<and471> and471, no my comment
<seb128> Laney, I guess it's a lamont question
<and471> seb128, what is the best way to have a patch in a deb, that only applies to the desktop edition? (in this case, a change to the default /etc/sudoers files if installling desktop edition)
<Laney> seb128: ok
<seb128> Laney, I think it's taking the buildds down for some reason
<seb128> so lamont set it in an ignore list or something until that sorted
<seb128> and471, don't?
<and471> seb128, :)
<and471> seb128, in this case it kinda needs to be
<seb128> and471, there is no way to apply something only to the desktop edition since the same deb is used on all editions
<seb128> and471, what are you trying to do?
<and471> seb128, it is about showing visual feedback with sudo - but only on the desktop
<and471> (i.e. asterisks)
<seb128> and471, change whatever is building your images to tweak it
<seb128> why do people care so much about sudo on the desktop
<and471> seb128, there are about 100 comments on the bug report, vish asked me to see how it could be implemented
<seb128> and471, that change is not likely to ever go in ubuntu
<and471> seb128, hey don't shoot the messenger
<seb128> it's arguably a security issue
<seb128> well that has been discussed several times
<Laney> use the new "Opinion" status for the bug :)
<and471> Laney, :)
<seb128> sudo is a command line poweruser thing
<seb128> we will not set different behaviour depending of what you are using it
<seb128> no normal desktop user should see a sudo prompt anyway
<and471> seb128, I think the overall opinion of the bug report was that the server team don't want it, but the deisgn team do, and the server team said the deisgn team can
<pitti> and471: you can't apply that to sudo, you'd have to modify suders in ubiquity
<pitti> I'm not sure whether ubiquity already modifies sudoers in some way
<vish> pitti: i'll take blame :D , wanted and471 to get a working patch ;)
<and471> pitti, so would that be the 'least hacky' of the hacky ways?
<pitti> but it'd still be inconsistent
<seb128> why do design team care so much about command lines?
<seb128> shouldn't we improve the desktop rather
<pitti> and471: honestly? fix our documentation to use gksu or pkexec instead of sudo
<seb128> what pitti said
<vish> pitti: which is easier ? fix every documentation or.. ?
<pitti> and471: the next best thing, change ubiquity to set the pwfeedback option in sudoers
<seb128> why should any normal user run sudo
<rickspencer3> what's the bug #?
<and471> pitti, ok
<vish> rickspencer3: bug #194472
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 194472 in sudo (Ubuntu) (and 3 other projects) "Entering password in Terminal gives no visual feedback (affects: 7) (dups: 2) (heat: 26)" [Wishlist,Won't fix] https://launchpad.net/bugs/194472
<pitti> I tried it here locally, and it works rwell
<rickspencer3> uh
 * and471 can feel a heated debate coming on....
<rickspencer3> I think passwords have worked that way in unix for ...
<rickspencer3> uh ..,
<rickspencer3> ever?
<seb128> the debate has already happened on several iteration
<seb128> rickspencer3, yes, displaying visual feedback on the number of chars is sort of a security concern for some users
<seb128> some command line users rather let's say ;-)
<vish> rickspencer3: yes , but we can improve the situation for new users  who get confused , for example http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=214393
<seb128> I would be in the opinion of leaving the command line as it is
<rickspencer3> uh
<and471> seb128, (it deso remove the asterisks after you have pressed enter, but yes, some users still feel it is a risk)
<seb128> the real question is why forum recommends using sudo
<and471> *does
<vish> rickspencer3: or > https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sound-juicer/+question/2046 , they dont really understand why it is happening
<seb128> rather than gksudo or equivalent
<rickspencer3> wow, I can't imagine we would touch tried and true command line behavior
<and471> seb128, IIRC there are some commands which gksudo doesn't run with
<vish> rickspencer3: its a small preference , which can be reverted for a user who does not like it
<seb128> it would be a bug and we should fix it then
<rickspencer3> vish, preferences = unpredictability and code complexity
<vish> rickspencer3: it is already there
<seb128> don't we have real desktop issues to work on?
 * rickspencer3 stays out of it
<seb128> rather than trying to change the way the command line is working since the stone age or so?
<vish> rickspencer3: its just an extra word in thesudoers file ;)
 * seb128 as well
<seb128> we shouldn't lower our standards just because some dumb users write buggy recommendations on forums for other users
<pitti> My biggest concern is that this wouldn't help at all
<pitti> since on most boxes you'd still see no password, just on new maverick desktop installs
<pitti> we can't magically and retroactively fix the world
<vish> but we can prevent new users from not being confused :)
<rickspencer3> vish, why are "new" users using sudo on the cli?
<pitti> and if we do that, I'm already seeing the next guy coming along and wanting the same for ssh
<rickspencer3> and if this confuses them, then it's the least of our worries
<seb128> right, let's address this
<pitti> that's just how the CLI works *shrug*
<and471> the trouble with the bug is that no one wants to get involved, they keep handing it to the next person
<vish> yeah :s
<seb128> the trouble is why would you want to change how the command line work
<pitti> (and it gets way more attention than it deserves, really, FWIW)
<seb128> just don't direct normal desktop users to it
<rickspencer3> what needs to be done if we want to keep the current "no asterix" behavior?
<pitti> rickspencer3: nothing
<and471> rickspencer3, nothing
<rickspencer3> nothing is a good amount of work to take on
<seb128> ;-)
<vish> ;p
<and471> rickspencer3, if we want asterisks, we need a one line debdiff that changes one word
<and471> rickspencer3, hehe
<rickspencer3> but we don't want asterixes
<pitti> and471: not quite
<rickspencer3> at least I don't
<seb128> and471, it would change sudo
<pitti> and471: you need some code in ubiquity to add it to an existing sudoers
<vish> rickspencer3: it can be reverted if someone doesnt :)
<seb128> and471, next you get that with ssh and other prompts as well
<and471> pitti, yeah sorry, for just desktop it might be a few more lines :p
<pitti> and471: and then update tons of documentation to account for both cases (asterisks and none) and explain the difference
<rickspencer3> command lines have certain tried and true behaviors and I don't see a good reason for Ubuntu to deviate
<seb128> vish, you adress the issue with one command only though
<seb128> su still works without *
<seb128> ssh still works...
<seb128> etc
<vish> rickspencer3: upstream fixed the bug mainly becaused be requested and now we are not using it :(
<rickspencer3> the bug comments say that usability = asterix, and security = balnk
<vish> seb128: i agree :)
<pitti> rickspencer3: I think we can ignore the security part here; my concerns are about consistency and existing documentation
<rickspencer3> I don;t agree
<vish> s/be/we
<seb128> we didn't reply to why we bring those users to a command line to start
<rickspencer3> Don Norman says that if all else fails, standardize
<rickspencer3> I think deviating from standard behavior here will do more harm than good
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> that's my $.02
 * rickspencer3 backs out again
<seb128> same 0.2
<vish> seb128: often hardware dont work and there needs tweaking.. we resort to these commands..
<seb128> I don't support the change and I will not contribute to any move to that direction
 * pitti goes back to fixing upower bugs
<vish> hmm..
<rickspencer3> ouch
 * seb128 goes back to backport nautilus hundredpapercut bugfixes
<pitti> vish: gksu/pkexec FTW
<rickspencer3> vish ...
<seb128> things which will really improve our desktop
<rickspencer3> I'm sorry if we're coming off as not being appreciative of your efforts
<and471> seb128, pitti hey come on guys, don't get down on vish, he is only trying to help
<rickspencer3> we definately love you and your contributions are invaluable
<seb128> and471, it's not against vish
<seb128> he's doing great work
<rickspencer3> and471, trying to make that point now
<seb128> and I'm working right now on backporting nautilus changes for bugs he got fixed upstream
<rickspencer3> in fact, i don't think anyone is blocking the * thing
<seb128> but you need to pick your battles
<seb128> changing the command line is an hard battle for little win since that's not something users should have to use
<and471> seb128, I realise that, it just when you say I am off to do more important work, it sounds as if you are devaluing his work
<rickspencer3> so, for the record, vish == totally awesome
<and471> cool
<seb128> and471, as said you need to pick battles
<rickspencer3> I think we all know what seb128 meant
<vish> ;)
<and471> seb128, not a battle, just a comment
<seb128> and471, I've expressed my opinion on the sudo change
<and471> right lets all cool off... :D
<seb128> I don't know anybody is heated there
<seb128> sorry if that came wrongly
<pitti> and471, vish: I'm not "getting down" on vish, sorry if I came across like that; I just don't like that particular idea, but I still do like vish
<seb128> but I think we all expressed our opinions and have to agree to disagree
 * pitti hugs everyone
 * vish  didnt take it personally too :)
<seb128> vish is doing great work and lot of hundredpapercut bugs will be fixed thanks to him
<pitti> (and shiny icons!)
<seb128> I just don't want to be involved in that sudo change
 * and471 accepts the hugs :)
<seb128> ;-)
<and471> okay, in 10 secs we have gone from heated to loveydovey :D
<seb128> hehe
<vish> just funny seeing it is tough to make hackers think different ;p
<seb128> I don't think anybody was heated, sorry if that came wrongly
<seb128> I just things we have strong opinions and we are not ready to be convinced it's where we want to go
<and471> seb128, np, as I said it is a limitation of IRC, when speaking in real life, facial expressions etc. affect tone
<rickspencer3> and471, well, it's good to call people on it if you think someone is out of line ... so you did the right thing
<rickspencer3> we need to keep #u-desktop a good place to be
<and471> keep everything hunkydory...
<vish> rickspencer3: pitti: seb128: i do understand that the sudo commands being given out are wrong , but my final take on this is that: this was something we[i] could help solve within our powers than trying to convince every person on the planet to not mention sudo :)
<rickspencer3> vish, tbh, I think using the cli to help people is *good*
<rickspencer3> in some limited circumstances
<seb128> vish, and471: but changing sudo doesn't fix the issue
<seb128> it would just make the sudo on modern ubuntu different from upgrades
<seb128> or from su or vt login or ssh or zillion other commands
<seb128> or other distributions
<seb128> it's a consistant unix command line behaviour accross the board currently
<seb128> just changing one command just creates inconsistency
<vish> seb128: how many users work on more than one distro..  ?  and this is something which can be reverted if not preferred.. :)
<vish> anyway...
<seb128> it doesn't adress vt login
<seb128> or su prompts or ssh prompts or other commands acting this way
<seb128> still on ubuntu
<vish> seb128: we can fix them all , one by one ? ;)
<seb128> yes we can
<vish> lets start with sudo ..
<seb128> but with the same energy we can fix an hundred desktop hundredpapercut
<seb128> so should we fix the command line and no desktop papercut this cycle?
<seb128> we have limited manpower and you can't get everything
<vish> seb128: you keep mentioning energy , but energy is being used here to not fix it , than to fix.
<seb128> not really, we just discussed it
<seb128> I disagree that changing just sudo is fixing it, it's just creating inconsistency
<seb128> if you want to change it you need to do it with all command line prompts
<seb128> but anyway everybody expressed opinions
<seb128> I'm rather interested to working on desktop changes not command line
<seb128> but if somebody wants to step for this nice
<seb128> so I will stay out of the way from now on ;-)
<vish> seb128: this is where i get confused : " but if somebody wants to step for this nice"  ?  what does that mean?
<vish> if someone gets the fix.. or..
<seb128> if somebody having the position to do the change want to do it and defend it in discussion etc and deal with bug reports and inconsistency etc
<seb128> having the position = upload rights and wanting to assume the change
<seb128> I'm not going to be the guy who changed sudo and who will get the heated discussions with all the community members who disagree with it
 * vish can take blame , but would need upload rights ;)
<seb128> in any case it's time to get something to eat
<seb128> bbl
<rickspencer3> it could always be reverted, right/
<rickspencer3> ?
<vish> rickspencer3: yes
<rickspencer3> it's still only Alpha 3
<seb128> rickspencer3, not sure we can undo it on installed systems
<seb128> it's the ssh system config
<seb128> we can tweak the default value at installation
<seb128> it will also not change for upgraders
<seb128> bbl
<and471> seb128, go eat! :)
<and471> see ya guys, thanks for the discussion :)
 * ogra wonders ehy empathy breaks hios image builds, there doesnt seem to be any upload that could have caused that
<ogra> gar, it waited for glib it seems :/
<slomo> seb128: what are your plans for gnome 3.0 / gtk3 for ubuntu btw? and if you package gdkpixbuf/gtk 2.21.something, just write me a mail once you've put things into svn and i'll review/build/upload it for you :)
<seb128> slomo, not so much plans so far for this cycle
<seb128> slomo, basically we would like to settle the platform, ie uptodate gtk 2.22
<seb128> getting gtk3 in the archive and maybe doing gtk3 builds of required GNOME libraries
<seb128> slomo, we didn't have any pressure to do those so far though and I don't want to duplicate work
<seb128> slomo, so I would be happy to work on those directly in debian
<seb128> slomo, I would appreciate reviews as well for those changes ;-)
<slomo> seb128: sounds like a good plan imho, i hope we get the same done for squeeze
<slomo> brb
<slomo> seb128: do you have a package for libpeas already?
<seb128> no
<slomo> ok
<seb128> slomo, who is taking care of gobject-introspection in debian?
<seb128> I would like to figure what we should be doing
<seb128> ie updating to 0.9 or not
<slomo> seb128: bigon and joss
<seb128> it has an abi number update
<slomo> seb128: and imho we should update asap if it's not going to change soon again
<seb128> who has an opinion on that in debian to discuss it?
<slomo> bigon and joss :)
<seb128> slomo, I guess I should join on oftc to discuss those changes
<slomo> yes, i stopped caring about g-i- some time ago because there are too many things that i don't like (missing support for nested namespaces being the worst...)
<seb128> slomo, nice, d-conf got newed in Debian now
<slomo> yes, now i can finally test the gstreamer gsettings elements with a useful backend ;)
<kiwinote> mvo: I've pushed the changes to the appdetailsview-gtk branch
<kiwinote> mvo: I am just left with the enable component code not working completely , as I get http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/460217/
<kiwinote> mvo: It seems to be some dbus or aptdaemon stuff, do you mind looking at that?
<jcastro> seb128: ok the only issue I see with the menu is the bullets showing up as dots, but that's triaged and assigned for A3.
<seb128> jcastro, excellent ;-)
<jcastro> htorque was seeing problems yesterday with the tools menu in gedit but it looks fine to me
<seb128> jcastro, I can confirm similar issues
<jcastro> ok so enough not to turn off the double menus yet, good, that's what I wanted. heh.
<seb128> jcastro, you recommend keeping the double menus for now?
<jcastro> seb128: yeah, at least until we get the bullets
<jcastro> we haven't had a flood of doublemenu reports, so we know people are reading the wiki page and following the directions
<seb128> oh
<seb128> "bullets showing up as dots"
<seb128> showing as checks marks you mean rather
<jcastro> no, as check marks
<jcastro> yeah, like in the document list in gedit
<seb128> right
<seb128> you wrote as dots before
<seb128> I was getting confused on what the issue was ;-)
<jcastro> oh, I see I did, whoops
<kiwinote> mvo_: when you are around, there are some sentences for you about 20 lines up
<mvo_> kiwinote: it appears I disconnected
<mvo_> kiwinote: could you please give them to me again?
<kiwinote> <kiwinote> mvo: I've pushed the changes to the appdetailsview-gtk branch
<kiwinote> <kiwinote> mvo: I am just left with the enable component code not working completely , as I get http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/460217/
<kiwinote> <kiwinote> mvo: It seems to be some dbus or aptdaemon stuff, do you mind looking at that?
<mvo_> kiwinote: sure, I'm happy to have a look. thanks for your work on this!
<kenvandine> seb128, also the application menu is still broken if you turn off double menus
<kenvandine> for desktop users, not unity of course
<seb128> kenvandine, how broken?
<kenvandine> if you turn off double menus, you get no menu items
 * kenvandine finds the bug
<seb128> wfm
<seb128> I just did unset the variable and run gedit
<seb128> it's correctly exported and menus are working on GNOME
<kenvandine> bug 596871
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 596871 in indicator-appmenu (and 1 other project) "APPMENU_DISPLAY_BOTH=0 hides items in the panel menu applet (affects: 1) (heat: 11)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/596871
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> i tried it last night
<kenvandine> oh... unset the variable?
<seb128> that's what I tried
<kenvandine> i get the other menus fine
<seb128> APPMENU_DISPLAY_BOTH=0 works fine as well
<kenvandine> but the applications menu is empty
 * kenvandine tries again... maybe it was fixed in yesterdays upload and the bug not closed
<seb128> kenvandine, oh ok
<kenvandine> i did try it early yesterday
<kenvandine> and it was still broken
<seb128> I didn't try the gnome-panel menus
<kenvandine> ah
<seb128> I don't want to restart my session ;-)
<kenvandine> hehe
<seb128> I though you said the appmenu applet was empty
<kenvandine> ah, no
<kenvandine> i'll make sure it is still broken, but i suspect it is :)
<kenvandine> brb
<kenvandine> yup, still broken
<jcastro> didrocks: are you back today?
<rickspencer3> jcastro, he's out until next monday, I think
<rickspencer3> he's at yet another French Ubuntu event ;)
<jcastro> probably speaking to 10,000 people right now
<seb128> jcastro, do you need anything? I can I help you?
<jcastro> seb128: nope I was just filing some bugs on the banshee-meego bits he landed, nothing I can't catch up with him later on
<seb128> jcastro, ok
<and471> tedg, I got subclassing working, but I have one last problem
<and471> tedg, I can't add a custom signal to indicator, why is this?
<tedg> and471, Cool, what was the issue?  You should be able to add a signal... you can definitely do that in C.
<tedg> and471, I'm not sure if you're running into a Vala-ism htere.
<tedg> there
<and471> tedg, in vala, the issue was that I needed to set the indicator subclass as a property of my main class, it was getting lost before the gtk.main()
<and471> tedg, this latest problem is in python :)
<and471> tedg, I can add a signal using a gtk.StatusIcon, but not for an indicator
<tedg> and471, Ah, makes sense.
<tedg> and471, Are you trying to connect to a signal or add a new one?
<tedg> and471, In your subclass.
<and471> tedg, http://pastebin.com/Zq6GhF6F
<and471> tedg, add a new one
<tedg> and471, Sorry, I'm not sure.  I'm guessing it must be something with how it's bound into Python.
<tedg> kenvandine, ^^
 * kenvandine looks
<and471> tedg, sorry, just when it was working in one language, I have switched to another :)
<and471> tedg, it is for a different project though :)
 * and471 thanks kenvandine 
<kenvandine> and471, so what isn't working in there?
<and471> kenvandine, so it appears to work (no error), but then when I try to connect the signal to a callback
<and471> self.indicator.connect("recording-done", self.on_indicator_recording_done)
<and471> http://pastebin.com/wU76HC6u
<and471> kenvandine, ^, but if change to using a gtk.StatusIcon (the fallback) it works
<kenvandine> and471, maybe because your class is a subclass of appindicator.Indicator instead of GObject?
<kenvandine> tedg, ^^
<tedg> kenvandine, That, in theory, shouldn't be an issue as appindicator.Indicator is a subclass of GObject.  But I don't know how the Python bindings handle that.
<kenvandine> ok
<tedg> So it should go GObject -> AppIndicator -> His Class instead of GObject -> StatusItem -> His Class
<tedg> I'd be curious if the Python bindings aren't properly communicating that to PyGTK or something?
<tedg> kenvandine, Could you do a check with PyGI -- it might work better? :)
<kenvandine> and471, can you try inheriting from gobject.GObject as well?
<kenvandine> class KazamIndicator(appindicator.Indicator, gobject.GObject):
<kenvandine> and471, or give me the rest of your code so i can try it myself :)
<and471> kenvandine, it didn't work
<kenvandine> ok
<and471> kenvandine, I shall give you my code
<kenvandine> thx
<and471> kenvandine, be warned though, it is very rough :-0
<kenvandine> sure :)
<and471> kenvandine, okay, it should be available here https://code.launchpad.net/~and471/+junk/kazam-temp
<and471> kenvandine, the indicator stuff is in kazam/indicator.py, you can manually use gtk.StatusIcon instead of the indicator subclass by changing line 35 to be some gobbledegook
<and471> (highly technical manual override)
<and471> :)
<and471> kenvandine, just run bin/kazam, click record, it should countdown and the indicator should appear, that is when you get the error
 * seb128 just upgraded empathy
<seb128> desrt, it's working using dconf!
<and471> kenvandine, anything?
<seb128> slomo, did you have time to work on the vala 0.9.2 ftbfs issue?
<seb128> slomo, there is a -2 let me sync that!
<seb128> slomo, thanks :-)
<seb128> slomo, hum, it seems that one still fails to build
<seb128> how do I downgraded a git checkout to a specific commit?
<slomo> seb128: git checkout abcdef1234567890
<seb128> slomo, thanks, I was trying to give an argument to git clone
<kenvandine> and471, it's looks like that should work fine, let me eat something and try to create a simpler test case to test the bindings
<and471> kenvandine, cool
<chrisccoulson> well, i'm going to try and upgrade to maverick in a bit :)
<chrisccoulson> finally!
<chrisccoulson> so, if i disappear for a long time, then it didn't go too well ;)
<desrt> seb128: awesome :)
<desrt> seb128: so i'm on the CD now, or...?
<seb128> desrt, yes you are!
<desrt> sweet :)
<desrt> and a bit scary....
<seb128> desrt, do you plan to do a dconf release btw?
<desrt> probably after the next glib release
<seb128> the current dconf-editor sucks
<desrt> more broken APIs :p
<desrt> yes.  robert ancell wrote it. :p
<seb128> well the git one doesn't
<seb128> so give him some credit ;-)
<desrt> oh
<desrt> that's why you want a release :)
<seb128> desrt, right
<desrt> okay
<desrt> i'll be dropping a glib release soon
<desrt> by the end of the week
<desrt> i'll do a dconf to go with
<desrt> we've been doing glib releases about once a week and every time there is a list of changes too big to fit onto one screen of a NEWS file.  it's kinda fun :)
<seb128> desrt, it makes me glad we don't have a lot of softwares using ie new apis yet
<desrt> we try to avoid breaking widely used APIs
<desrt> even in the unstable release
<desrt> nonetheless there are a few breaks this time around, still :/
<desrt> probably nothing you'll notice, though
<desrt> btw... did the Bsymbolic stuff cause you any trouble?
 * desrt is planning to rip that stuff out for good before the next release
<seb128> desrt, what Bsymbolic?
<desrt> good :)
<desrt> if you didn't notice then it means it's working properly, i guess :p
<desrt> we're dropping that IA__g_* stuff from glib and gtk
<desrt> in favour of using the mostly-equivalent -Bsymbolic-functions linker flag
<desrt> i did a release with a very minimal removal of the old stuff and addition of the new stuff
<desrt> in the next day or so i going to do a more permanent removal of the old stuff
<seb128> desrt, ubuntu uses BSymboic by default
<desrt> just wanted to give people a chance to complain before we went ahead and did it for good
<desrt> seb128: fascinating.
<desrt> -Bsymbolic or -Bsymbolic-functions?
<seb128> it's creating some issues every now and then
<desrt> because -Bsymbolic will seriously break stuff
<seb128> the second one
<seb128> we do that for some cycles
<desrt> cool
<seb128> out of some stuff declaring symbols in two places
<desrt> well, it's actually not even the fault of the software
<seb128> usually in the binary and in a .so
<seb128> it works without issues
<desrt> turns out the linker itself is really damn stupid
<desrt> say you have some library that has like:
<desrt> lib.c:
<desrt> int somevar;
<desrt> lib.h:
<desrt> extern int somevar;
<desrt> then you have an app
<desrt> app.c:
<desrt> a() { somevar = 5; }
<desrt> (after including "lib.h", of course)
<desrt> this doesn't work like you might think it works
<desrt> when linking, the linker adds a 'copy' relocation
<desrt> it copies the contents of the original 'somevar' variable out of the library's data segment and into the application's data segment
<desrt> so now 'somevar' is a variable declared by the application
<desrt> it then sets up the application's copy of 'somevar' to interpose over the one in the library
<desrt> so if the library is using -Bsymbolic it will use its own local copy
<desrt> and never see that it got set to 5
<desrt> totally stupid
<seb128> interesting
<desrt> this is exactly the mechanism by which the glib thread vtable gets filled in
<desrt> so if we linked glib with -Bsymbolic, threads don't work
<desrt> i'm really unsure why it does that
<desrt> the only benefit is that the application gets to use its own copy directly without a relocation
<desrt> and no PLT lookup
<seb128> desrt, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=609505 is the sort of issues we get with -Bsymbolic-functions
<ubot2> Gnome bug 609505 in general "Segfault on run with cheese 2.29.90" [Critical,Needinfo]
<desrt> ah ya
<desrt> of course
<desrt> that's sort of like an application bug, though
<seb128> it is
<desrt> strictly speaking, it's your fault
<desrt> but in a practical sense.....
<seb128> I already once with hadess though we argued it's our fault for using this flag for our builds ;-)
<seb128> desrt, why?
<desrt> because technically cheese is allowed to do what it's doing
<desrt> and, in fact, it works
<seb128> it's just buggy to have the same symbols defined in the binary and the so
<desrt> technically not true :)
<desrt> ELF was designed to deal with this situation in a specific way
<desrt> so it's no bug, in theory
<desrt> but in reality it's probably not what they meant to do...
<mclasen> in reality, they just messed up their build system
<cking_> pitti, is there a quick way of figuring out which keymap is being used by udev on my machine?
<pitti> cking_: quickest is probably "sudo udevadm test /class/input/eventXX
<pitti> cking_: with XX being the event number of your keyboard
<cking_> cool.
<pitti> good night everyone; time for dinner and then watching THE GAME
<and471> ivanka, link to fonttest.design.canonical.com on the blog post is broken
<and471> ivanka, in fact all links except the last one
<ivanka> and471: thanks!
<and471> ivanka, no problem
<kenvandine> and471, ok... figured it out
<kenvandine> you can't subclass appindicator.Indicator
<and471> kenvandine, yay!
<and471> kenvandine, oh...
<kenvandine> it takes a parent class of gobject
<kenvandine> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/460323/
<kenvandine> that is an example
<and471> kenvandine, so I have to have an indicator property within a generic gobject?
<kenvandine> yes
<and471> kenvandine, thanks for your help, why is it that it doesn't work?
<kenvandine> also, in retrospect, i can't see any reason to subclass it :)
<kenvandine> at least in your case
<and471> kenvandine, true...
<kenvandine> the first arg in the constructor is the parent gobject class
<and471> ivanka, as a prize, can I also get an email (as i am not an ubuntu member?) :D
<and471> ivanka, (an email with an invite for the ppa that is)
<ivanka> and471: thank you! I think they are all good now.
<and471> ivanka, as a prize, can I also get an email with a ppa invite (as i am not an ubuntu member?) :D
<ivanka> and471: You have my eternal thanks - I'll have a little think about an appropriate prize ;-)
<and471> ivanka, hehe
<and471> ivanka, any idea when the font will be available to people besides ubuntu members?
<jcastro> august 8th
<and471> jcastro, :(
<and471> ivanka, jcastro : is this a secret plan to get more people applying to be ubuntu members... :)
<ivanka> and471: shhh - don't give it away!
<and471> :)
<seb128> cassidy, hello, do you have a bug about gsettings migration issue?
<seb128> cassidy, opening the preferences dialog displayed a "do you want to import the account listed there" dialog
<chrisccoulson> heh, i think my daughter has broken the mobile in her cot
<jpds> chrisccoulson: You got her an iPhone?
<chrisccoulson> jpds - lol ;)
<chrisccoulson> not just yet
<chrisccoulson> it would have to be an android device anyway ;)
<chrisccoulson> she grabs her mobile as it's spinning round whilst she sits in her cot, and all it does is click now
<chrisccoulson> i think she must have stripped the teeth off the gears ;)
<gord> could make a mobile out of old discarded iphone3's, a mobile mobile if you will
<desrt> lifeless: hey?
<lifeless> desrt: hi
<desrt> lifeless: i seem to recall that you were using luks?
<lifeless> not atm but I did for a few years
<desrt> ya.  i remember this circa cambridge UDS
<desrt> any particular reason you stopped?
<lifeless> it has overhead
<lifeless> I switched to an SSD based laptop a few months back - march
<lifeless> I decided to drop it at the same time, for a few reasons
<desrt> and with the performance benefit of SSD the extra latency of the encryption became noticable?
<lifeless> I was worried the wear levelling and the block-not-used commands wouldn't filter down the layers
<desrt> ah.  fascinating.
<lifeless> zero evidence for or against
<desrt> the drives are supposed to their own wear-leveling, aren't they?
<lifeless> apparently the quality of that built in leveling is a major point of differentiation
<desrt> i went intel
<lifeless> but there is this ATAPI command to hint
<lifeless> mine is fujitsu I think, its what lenovo put in the laptop
<desrt> samsung, maybe?
<lifeless> if I'd had a few more cycles I would have researched the issue
<desrt> i called them up to ask them what they'd put in my laptop if i got the SSD option and they said samsung
<desrt> i looked up reviews and samsung always came out on the bottom with intel on top
<desrt> so i just ordered with the smallest disk possible and bought the intel drive separate
<lifeless> [    2.066790] scsi 0:0:0:0: Direct-Access     ATA      SAMSUNG MMCRE28G VBM1 PQ: 0 ANSI: 5
<desrt> yup
<lifeless> yeah
<lifeless> I had a bunch of time pressure
<lifeless> so I punted
<desrt> me too
<desrt> but it turns out i got fucked anyway
<desrt> i ordered during the mobile core i7 shortage
<lifeless> and took some briefly considered risk reduction
<lifeless> desrt: same!
<lifeless> desrt: x201s ?
<desrt> so my 1-2week delivery turned into me cancelling the order after a month and a half
<desrt> ya
<lifeless> I got mine
<desrt> i'm glad i didn't
<lifeless> 5 weeks I think it was
<desrt> i ended up reordering on july 1
<desrt> the first day of the new sales tax regime in ontario
<desrt> saved 8% due to that
<lifeless> nice
<desrt> plus they had a 25% sale, plus 22% for using my visa card
<desrt> so i ended up getting it about $500 cheaper than if my order had gone through before
<lifeless> thats cool
<desrt> $1100 total
<lifeless> how much mem did you get
<desrt> 4
<lifeless> I got 8, really liking it
<desrt> plus the bluetooth and top-of-the-line wifi
<desrt> heh
<desrt> 8 was too expensive for my blood :p
<lifeless> the wifilink 6000 series ?
<desrt> lemme check the invoice
<desrt> Intel Centrino Ultimate-N 6300 AGN
<lifeless> 02:00.0 Network controller: Intel Corporation WiFi Link 6000 Series (rev 35)
<desrt> i think 'wifilink' is the low model
<lifeless> wasn't a selectable option in .au
<desrt> :(
<desrt> ya.  it's the default one here
<desrt> was like a $40 upgrade
<desrt> a reasonable price to pay to be able to mock my friends when they can't get a signal with their powerbooks :p
<lifeless> :)
<desrt> anyway.. i was going to LUKS it up
<desrt> but i guess now i won't
<lifeless> well
<lifeless> like I say 0 evidence pro or con
<desrt> well... your 'gut' reasoning resonates well here
<lifeless> I just know that new things generally take some time to integrate well vertically in the stack
<lifeless> yeha
<desrt> it's not like i'm smuggling state secrets across international borders or anything
<desrt> (everyone knows that i use the internet for that!)
<lifeless> :)
<desrt> k.  thanks for the infos
<lifeless> de nada
 * desrt pretends to do real work now
<chrisccoulson> success \o/
<waltercool> jcastro, are you there?
<jcastro> waltercool: hi
<waltercool> jcastro, hi there :P
<pitti> *weep*
<waltercool> jcastro, can you give me a invitation for ubuntu font ppa? :B
<kenvandine> hey pitti
<pitti> hey kenvandine
<kenvandine> pitti, is the game over?
<pitti> :'-(
<pitti> kenvandine: yes, Spain kicked us out, 1:0
<kenvandine> guess i know the results
<kenvandine> bummer
<pitti> but they were unstoppable today
<pitti> they had a perfect technique, and our guys could hardly keep the ball -- they were in pretty bad mood today apparently
<kenvandine> my german brother-in-law was making me watch all the germany games on vacation :)
<kenvandine> not that i resisted much :)
<pitti> heh
<pitti> well, the previous ones were quite fun to watch indeed
<kenvandine> beer and wild german soccer fan, good times!
<kenvandine> didn't get to see today's though :/
<pitti> kenvandine: then it was you who was missing
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> guess i'll still watch it tonight just to complete the series
<kenvandine> pitti, germany had a good run though!
<pitti> absolutely, and still a good chance to become 3rd
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i would tease you, but i can't really say anything after we lost so embarassingly to you ;)
<highvoltage> hdh
<lifeless> didrocks: are you lead on quickly now?
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-07-08
<OwaisL> Hey guys, I'm writing a gmail notifier and I want it to open Evolution or Thunderbird to open for reading new emails.
<OwaisL> How can I launch the default email client from Python?
<OwaisL> or How do I know what the default mail client is?
<OwaisL> all right
<OwaisL> i just struck an idea
<OwaisL> checking gconf... but hey it has evolution as default calender.. is that always the same as the email client?
<lamalex> OwaisL: there's already an evolution notifier, seems like a gmail notifier should take you to gmail
<OwaisL> Well, yeah...but what if someone doesn't want evolution to run all the time OR runs some other mail client which doesn't have a notifier.
<OwaisL> still, your argument has good reason, i'll think about it.
<OwaisL> BUT
<OwaisL> I would still like to know how it can be done.. just curious
<lamalex> i do think there's a gconf key
<lamalex> /desktop/gnome/uri-handlers/mailto
<OwaisL> wow
<OwaisL> cool
<chrisccoulson> bah, what keeps spawning ubuntuone-syncdaemon in maverick?
<chrisccoulson> i need it to stop so i can use my laptop :)
 * TheMuso has it running here as well.
<chrisccoulson> ah, it's nautilus
<chrisccoulson> my machine just grinds to a halt with u1 running :(
<TheMuso> things seem to be alright here, although switching between terminal tabs is slow
<chrisccoulson> chmod 0 /usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-2.0/libnautilus-ubuntuone.so - problem solved :)
<chrisccoulson> people have been complaining that firefox is unusable in maverick because it keeps locking up for long periods at a time, and i'm wondering if this is the problem....
<TheMuso> ah
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Hey pitti.
<RAOF> Howdie pitti.
<pitti> hey TheMuso
<pitti> hello RAOF
<pitti> how are things in Ubuntu-land?
<RAOF> Things are going swimmingly
<seb128> hey everybody
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> sorry for Germany ;-)
<pitti> happens..
<seb128> they at least won a game during the cup, some team didn't ;-)
<and471> pitti, they didn't look as dangerous as they were in previous games, though spain were lucky with the header in the end
<pitti> Spain had pretty much perfect technique yesterday; seems our guys were very itchy, they did one error after the other
<and471> seb128, didn't sarkozy meet with the french team to tell them off or somehting? :D
<seb128> not quite, he meet one of the playes though
<and471> seb128, what was the feeling in france towards the players?
<seb128> not so great
<seb128> which is understandable
<and471> yup
<seb128> but the new coach is liked
<seb128> so let's see what he does
<and471> it has been a strange world cup to say the least
<pitti> yeah, with the two previous champions going out so early..
<baptistemm> hello
<fta> kenvandine, fyi, http://launchpadlibrarian.net/51552889/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-i386.gwibber_2.31.2~bzr759-0ubuntu1~daily1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz  (started 2 days ago)
<baptistemm> pitti, sorry for germany, but paul the octopus predicted your team would lose :)
<baptistemm> I'd have bet some money :)
<pitti> baptistemm: this Octopus scares me!
<baptistemm> it reminds me the octopus from the book niourk :)
<pitti> seb128: do you know what creates those "Starting programname..." task list entries?
<seb128> you mean?
<seb128> oh, while it's loading
<pitti> yes
<seb128> it's libstartupnotify
<pitti> it doesn't happen when I run the program on the command line
<pitti> just through the menus
<seb128> libstartup-notification0
<seb128> well the desktops have a startup notification flag
<pitti> (program in question is Thunar, but I think it's a generic mechanism)
<seb128> and gnome-desktop use that when running those
<seb128> vuntz would know better
<pitti> seb128: thanks; seems that's also used by XFCE indeed
<pitti> I get the effect in both xfce and gnome
 * pitti hugs seb128, cheers
 * seb128 hugs pitti!
<pitti> seb128: I want to supress it for merely launching a dbus activated daemon
 * pitti know knows where to look for
<pitti> seb128: ah, got it now; thanks for pointing out again
<seb128> pitti, yw, what did you change? just used libstartup-notification in your spawning code?
<pitti> seb128: no, I just found out that libstartupnotify doesn't work the way thunar-settings is using it
<pitti> so a proper solution would be to have Thunar use sn, but until then I just disabled the StartupNotification flag; let's see what the upstream guys say
<kenvandine> fta, ok, will fix
<kenvandine> fta, ok, fixed in trunk
<kenvandine> fta, thx!
<pitti> I need to disappear for some 3 hours to visit my grandpa in the hospital; bbl
<fta> kenvandine, did you fix it in the branch used by the dailies?
<kenvandine> fta, not a packaging change
<kenvandine> should be fine
<kenvandine> just setup.py
<nange> Hello all
<nange> I have a problem using 3 different monitors with ubuntu 10.04, Is this the correct channel for help?
<fta> kenvandine, excellent then. thanks!
<vish> nange: #ubuntu is for support
<nange> ok, thanks.
<davmor2> mvo: is update manager still your baby?  If so is there any reason why on Maverick I have to type in my password to allow check and then again to allow download and installation?
<mvo> davmor2: the reason is that we moved to the aptdaemon backend by default, but yeah, its not great for usability
<mvo> davmor2: I will discuss a better way with glatzor (aptdaemon upstream)
<davmor2> mvo: is there a bug for it or would you like me to write one?
<mvo> davmor2: I know of bug #350658 but its a little bit different
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 350658 in update-manager (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Update manager requests password to check for updates (heat: 6)" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/350658
<davmor2> mvo: close enough :)
<seb128> hum
<seb128> mvo, bug #602980
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 602980 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "update-manager crashed with DBusException in call_blocking() (affects: 1) (heat: 10)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/602980
<seb128> mvo, that's the same issue I was mentioning the other day, did you say you wanted a milestone to be set?
<mvo> seb128: feel free, I looked into it the other day but the result was inconclusive
<mvo> i.e. no fix yet
<seb128> mvo, well it's your package so you decide, it's not an important issue just an annoyance since apport triggers
<seb128> mvo, anyway I pointed the number just in case you were interested by the number
<mvo> seb128: thanks, I targeted it for alpha3
<seb128> mvo, thanks
<qense> Laney: Do you know what version of GTK# will be included in Maverick? Specifically the GAPI2 components, since the trunk contains an update for it that adds support for GObject virtual methods, which is something we need to get the fallback and unfallback functions of libappindicator to be properly supported in Mono as well. (Currently you can't do custom fallbacks in C#).
<Laney> qense: Are upstream going to do a release?
<Laney> if so, that
<qense> Laney: If I'm correct it should be in 2.12.6
<Laney> we have 2.12.10
<qense> ah, wait
<qense> Laney: I'm sorry, I'll have to check if the new stuff we need is already in that release. Sorry for bothering you. :)
<Laney> I'm not sure I understand your problem, but maybe what poppler-sharp did to workaround is what you want
<Laney> check poppler-sharp/Document.cs if you don't have the fix
<qense> Laney: Will check that. Thanks!
<kiwinote> mvo: fyi the deb file and apturl features in my branch should all work now
<mvo> kiwinote: nice
<mvo> kiwinote: I look at it tomorrow morning
<kiwinote> mvo: thanks
<om26er> is evolution 3.0 expected to be shipped with Maverick?
<seb128> om26er, no
<seb128> or not decided
<seb128> but we will not ship GNOME3 nor gtk3 by default
<seb128> why?
<om26er> seb128, evolution 3.0 might be better for netbooks. (atleast the upstreamers think that)
<seb128> om26er, didrocks backported the express changes to our version so it's nice on UNE
<seb128> it's in current maverick
<om26er> that is great :)
<seb128> kenvandine, jcastro: ok, appmenu-gtk should stop eating the application menu now
<kenvandine> yay!
<seb128> kenvandine, jcastro: which means it should close to be usuable in GNOME without the double menu if you want to try
<kenvandine> i'll try that :)
<jcastro> seb128: and the gimp crasher?
<seb128> jcastro, what crasher?
<seb128> jcastro, talk to bratsche if you have it or provide a stacktrace or something
<jcastro> ok
<jcastro> bratsche: any luck on the prob jono was having yesterday with the gimp exploding?
<htorque> jcastro, that should be fixed: bug 602444
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 602444 in libdbusmenu (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "SIGSEGV in parse_node_get_id (node=0x0) (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/602444
<seb128> the update has not been uploaded yet but will be today
<jcastro> rock and roll!
<jcastro> jono: when you get the update can you lmk how that works out?
<jcastro> hi htorque!
<htorque> hi :)
<jono> jcastro, sure
<seb128> desrt, I crashed dconf-service
<seb128> !
<seb128> seems a double free, stacktrace is uselles
<seb128> useless
<desrt> seb128: i've heard a report of a crash
<desrt> seb128; do you at least have steps to reproduce?
<seb128> no
<desrt> bah :p
<seb128> I ran gsettings-data-convert for the first time
<seb128> which followed by an apport report
<desrt> ooo
<desrt> you just solved the problem for me :)
<seb128> ?
<desrt> this problem was reported before by someone who insisted that they were asbolutely not using delayed-apply
<desrt> but it was their schema
<desrt> and the stack trace suggested delayed apply was being used
<desrt> but they insisted not
<desrt> so it was very confusing
<desrt> gsettings-data-convert answers the problem, obviously
<desrt> i bet it does delayed apply
<desrt> yup.
<desrt> okay.  you just gave me the missing piece.  i expect this to be solved soon :)
<seb128> thanks
<desrt> i'll have a dconf tarball by monday with the fix
<mclasen> desrt: yep, it does
<seb128> desrt, excellent
<desrt> mclasen: and a new glib by then too, i guess?
<mclasen> likely, yes
<desrt> i'll do the work
<desrt> i'm just asking to make sure you don't have anything blocking
<mclasen> I have one selinux patch I want to commit
<desrt> okay
<desrt> oh.  one thing i should mention
<mclasen> and I'll let the url-handler thing simmer for another release
<desrt> we will need a gtk release to drop at the same time
<mclasen> I noticed
<mclasen> we should start to wind down the api breakage soon, though
<desrt> i'm done, for the most part :)
<desrt> i still wouldn't mind an API or two changed in gdbus
<desrt> but nothing critical...
<jcastro> htorque: I'm putting together the appmenu status report for this week, any pet bugs/major problems you think I should mention
<htorque> jcastro: not that i know of, you guys did a great job at fixing a lot of things :)
<jcastro> bratsche's been rocking it
<jcastro> htorque: thanks so much for your detailed bug reporting, you've been a great contributor!
<htorque> jcastro, it's a win-win, but yw!
<bratsche> Yeah, thanks htorque
<Sarvatt> fta: chromium should be fixed with cairo 1.9.x now \o/ http://src.chromium.org/viewvc/chrome?view=rev&revision=51871
<fta> Sarvatt, yep, i discussed that with upstream earlier today
<fta> let's hope it's enough
<Sarvatt> <ickle> Sarvatt: that's the one liner that is still fundamentally broken, but would fix the throbber ;-)
<Sarvatt> (so probably not)
<Sarvatt> hope it fixes tabs disappearing  when you open a bunch, the throbber being screwed up isn't really a big deal :)
<fta> hm, some builders are idle, i will kick the bot
<fta> Sarvatt, problem fixed for me (spinners look fine, no more disappearing tabs)
<Sarvatt> fta: hmm seem to see another problem with it now though. open a ton of new tabs then close a bunch real fast, it stops resizing the tab strip and opening pages in the current tab opens a new window
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-07-09
<Frankie1> I just asked this in #ubuntu but it looks like I got missed.  Has anyone here used Ubuntu 10.10?  My mouse pointer disappears after about 3 seconds of inactivity.  Is there a setting for that?
<TheMuso> I get the same thing in maverick here, haven't checked for a setting, as it doesn't bother me personally.
<Frankie1> The only thing is tooltips disappear too fast for me to read them.
<RAOF> It's the âunclutterâ package.
<RAOF> I'm not sure if or where there are settings for it.
<Frankie1> Hey, that's great!
<Frankie1> I saw that package in Scroogle searches, but I didn't know I had it.
<TheMuso> According to the startup script for unclutter in /etc/X11/Xsession.d, it checks to see if there is /etc/default/unclutter, which is not shipped in the package by default.
<TheMuso> ubuntu-desktop depends on it.
<TheMuso> Looks like there is no GUI for it.
<TheMuso> For starting/stopping, or changing settings.
<TheMuso> Unclutter is a recommends of ubuntu-desktop, so it can be removed safely.
<Frankie1> Oh, good.
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Hey pitti.
<tremolux> hello pitti!
<pitti> hey TheMuso
<pitti> good morning tremolux, how are you?
<tremolux> oh, I'm fine, how about you?
<pitti> I'm great, thanks
<tremolux> :)
<vish> Amaranth: hi , got a min to review alacarte patch?
<vish> Amaranth: Bug #395692
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 395692 in alacarte (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "Drag-and-Drop behavior in the menu editor is inconsistent and confusing (affects: 3) (heat: 27)" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/395692
<rickspencer3> good morning desktoppers
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Good evening, Europeman!
<rickspencer3> hey RAOF, how is the future? looking bright?
<RAOF> Looking full of promising kernel SRUs.
<rickspencer3> sweet
<and471> does anyone know how to use a custom template file in glade-3?
<and471> rickspencer3, I think quickly does it ^
<rickspencer3> and471, what is a "custom template file"?
<rickspencer3> can you tell me a bit what you're trying to do?
<and471> rickspencer3, it is where you define custom widgets for glade, I am working on a papercut for shotwell, and it uses them and I can't remeber if you can supply an argument on the CLI to use a custom one.
<and471> rickspencer3, I thought I reme,bered quickly doing it, so I thought i'd ask to see if I could get a quick answer ;-p
<and471> rickspencer3, don't worry if you don't know I'll stop being lazy and go on #glade3
<and471> :)
<rickspencer3> and471, so you have a custom widget, and you want it to show up in Glade?
<and471> rickspencer3, it is something that shotwell uses, I don't really know why, just need ot be able to open the glade file
<rickspencer3> I see
<rickspencer3> and471, look in the data/ui directory of a quickly project, you'll see the .xml files you need there for each custom widget
<rickspencer3> then you can look at the quickly code to see the cli switches you need to load them into glade
<and471> rickspencer3, yeah I was just wondering how quickly uses them ({as then I could copy this arg)
<rickspencer3> in design.py
<and471> rickspencer3, ah yes :)
<rickspencer3> and471, here ya' go
<rickspencer3> cmd = "GLADE_CATALOG_PATH=./data/ui glade-3 " + " ".join(files)
<and471> rickspencer3, you rock
<and471> rickspencer3, launchpad is being slow, thanks :D
<rickspencer3> :)
<and471> rickspencer3, hehe in the end, the stuff I wanted isn't in the glade file :)
<and471> rickspencer3, oh well it is good to know for in the future
<rickspencer3> oh well :/
<and471> hehe
<RAOF> Why are all the computers around me so slow all of a sudden?
<RAOF> It's like they realise it's 6:15 on a Friday evening.
 * mvo twiddles thumbs while waiting for LP to answer
<and471> mvo, at least lp wasn't just slow for me
<mvo> vish: I uploaded something that may fix bug #355355 into maverick
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 355355 in synaptic (Ubuntu) "Update Manager causes high Xorg CPU usage when checking for updates (affects: 9) (dups: 1) (heat: 31)" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/355355
<mvo> vish: if you can reproduce the problem, then I would be very grateful if you could let me know if it fixes it or not (we can backport then)
<mvo> and471: :)
<and471> using svn makes me appreciate bzr...
<and471> vish, I am working on the shotwell icons papercut
<RAOF> and471: Install bzr-svn
<and471> RAOF, what does it do?
<RAOF> Allows bzr to interact with svn repositories.
<RAOF> Essentially it turns bzr into an svn client.  But a really kick-arse svn client.
<and471> RAOF, sounds awesome, thanks :)
<RAOF> Similarly, bzr-git.
<and471> RAOF, how do I run it?
<RAOF> bzr branch svn://svn.debian.org/whatever local-whatever
<RAOF> It basically just means you can treat an svn repository as a bzr branch.
<and471> RAOF, ah okay
<seb128> re
<seb128> pitti, did apport stop to count crashes and bother you after 3 times getting the same issue?
<pitti> seb128: "stopped counting"?
<pitti> no, it's still doing that
<pitti> at least, supposed to
<pitti> it's testcase'd, too, so it ought to work
<seb128> pitti, it doesn't there
<pitti> seb128: after the second crash, do you get a CrashCounter: in the .crash file?
<vish> mvo: hi , I'm on Lucid now ,can i just try the maverick version on Lucid?
<vish> and471: cool!
<mvo> vish: I think that should work, if not I can build you a backport
<vish> ok. on it
<mvo> thanks!
 * mvo hugs vish
<vish> :)
<seb128> pitti, yes but it's staying to 1
<seb128> pitti, it's not raising on next crashes
<seb128> I get rhythmbox crashing on closing in maverick
<seb128> but I got it to crash 3 times in a row now and the counter still say 1
<seb128> pitti, I will open a bug, thanks
<pitti> hm, weird; let's discuss it there, right
<and471> vish, part of the bug is removing custom icon references and replacing them with stock ones
<and471> vish, the other part is replacing icons that need  to be custom with good looking ones :)
<and471> vish, could you do something about that?
<vish> and471: new icons?
<and471> vish, yup
<rickspencer3> does anyone know where I would find python gio reference documentation
<rickspencer3> ?
<and471> rickspencer3, google python gobject reference
<vish> and471: not sure , already this is turning out to be a handful :( and i have other TODO witing as well.. not really sure , but i can try at some point :)
<vish> waiting*
<and471> vish, sure it is not urgent
<seb128> rickspencer3, /usr/share/gtk-doc/html/pygobject
<and471> rickspencer3, it should be on that page (strangely enough I was looking for it yesterday)
<seb128> rickspencer3, /usr/share/gtk-doc/html/pygobject/index.html
<vish> and471: for now just replace them and we can add new icons later whenever that is ;)
<seb128> rickspencer3, "PyGio Class Reference" there
<and471> vish, sure, they are not THAT bad, but, not great either
<vish> and471: hehe , they are actually ours too , from breathe ;p
<and471> vish, when you do have time, they are redeye, enhance (like a magic wand), crop and adjust (colour bars)
<and471> vish, oh :D
<seb128> pitti, bug #603503, not sure what informations would be useful though
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 603503 in apport (Ubuntu) "doesn't increment the CrashCount over 1 (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/603503
<pitti> seb128: thanks; I'm upgrading my maverick netbook now
<pitti> seb128: in the meantime, could you clean /var/crash/ and run /usr/share/apport/testsuite/run ?
<pitti> seb128: please paste the failures to the bug report
<seb128> pitti, ok
<seb128> pitti, done
<pitti> seb128: hm, do you actually have apport enabled?
<seb128> pitti, I guess so, I get it poping on screen every half an hour for a week
<seb128> $ grep enabled /etc/default/apport
<seb128> enabled=1
<pitti> seb128: ah, and please attach /var/log/apport.log after your gconf-editor test
<pitti> seb128: ok, seems it's getting confused somewhere then; I'll test on my mini once it's done upgrading, and stare on the code
<seb128> apport (pid 11127) Fri Jul  9 11:18:29 2010: executable: /usr/bin/gconf-editor (command line "gconf-editor")
<seb128> apport (pid 11127) Fri Jul  9 11:18:29 2010: this executable already crashed 2 times, ignoring
<pitti> right, that's expected
<pitti> first crash -> no crashcounter
<pitti> second crash -> counter: 1
<pitti> third and further crashes -> ignored
<seb128> right, but it displays display the "gconf-editor crashed" dialog
<pitti> yep, that's the bug part of it
<seb128> ok
<pitti> perhaps the new kernel changed something with mtime/atime
<seb128> it's not new from today
<pitti> but the test case failures are weird
<seb128> I have the issue since start of the week
<kiwinote> mvo: hi!
<kiwinote> mvo: I'm looking at ubufox code atm because it uses apturl to install plugins, but have two queries..
<kiwinote> mvo: atm apturl sends a signal on exit with the state of installation (ie installed, aborted, error, etc). Is the correct thing to do here to adapt ubufox not to care about the status?
<kiwinote> mvo: also ubufox sends apturl an http-proxy argument. Is this something that s-c deals with anyway without the argument, or do I need to look into how this works and allow s-c to deal with this?
<seb128> ie since apport is running again
<mvo> kiwinote: hello! the proxy should be picked up automatically, however if firefox <-> gnome-proxy-settings disagree then having the proxy is a good idea I think
<mvo> kiwinote: its a corner case though I think
<kiwinote> mvo: thanks, so that means that apt (via s-c) should use the firefox proxy settings when available, rather than it's own proxy settings?
<mvo> kiwinote: I think firefox should use the gnome proxy settings IMO its a bug that it has its own :)
<kiwinote> mvo: ok ;)
<mvo> kiwinote: as the signal, you mean that it uses the exit codes to communicate if the install was successful or not?
<kiwinote> mvo: yep
<mvo> kiwinote: I think we need to support this
<mvo> kiwinote: one way (if s-c is already running) is to make apturl-gtk just send the right dbus signals to the SoftwareCenterDbus controller and collect the status. when all is finished, that bit can exit, while the main s-c can keep running
<kiwinote> mvo: via exit codes, or something else?
<mvo> kiwinote: what do you have in mind? we could use dbus, but then we need to port the apturl-kde to that schema
<mvo> (make ubufox use dbus instead of spawning a process)
<kiwinote> mvo: I wasn't really sure. Exit codes on s-c itself won't really work as people probably won't close s-c straight away (and firefox is not usable in the meantime). If we don't have apturl-gtk installed (which we shouldn't need to), then we can't use that either..
<kiwinote> mvo: so then getting ubufox to use dbus sounds the most reasonable solution (be it that I would need to look into dbus and js ;) )
<kiwinote> mvo: or we  don't return a state, and get s-c to prompt to restart the browser after installing certain packages?
<mvo> kiwinote: well, if apturl-gtk is just a thin wrapper that calls a SoftwareCenterDbus thing and collects the status, then we can use exit codes. this app would exit, s-c itself would keep running
<vish> mvo: tried synaptic 0.63.1ubuntu10 , but no luck :s  , its the same cpu usage as with the lucid version
<kiwinote> mvo: yeah, suppose so
<mvo> vish: thanks a bunch, its actually https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/synaptic/0.63.1ubuntu11 (ubuntu11) that has the changes
<pitti> seb128: I get the three "no such file or dir" errors as well on maverick
<mvo> vish: what architecture do you have? I can send you direct links, its build for amd64 and i386
<vish> mvo: yeah , i was wondering , where the new version was :D
<vish> i386
<seb128> pitti, ok, "nice" I guess ;-)
<seb128> pitti, i.e easier to debug for you
<pitti> seb128: just to fix the title, the real bug is that apport pops up for repeated bugs, right?
<vish> mvo: no worries , got the deb for 11
<seb128> pitti, yes
<seb128> pitti, I wrongly assumed that the count limit was 3 and that the issue was the counter not incrementing to it
<seb128> not sure why I though it was 3 though
<mvo> vish: thanks! looking forward for new results
<pitti> it starts from 0
 * pitti hugs mvo because it's Friday and sunny
 * seb128 hugs mvo just because mvo rocks
 * pitti hugs vish as well
<vish> aernt we all lovey dowey today :D
<mvo> woah! flash-hug
 * mvo hugs pitti and seb128 and dholbach and vish and kiwinote
<seb128> mvo, no dholbach there :-(
<seb128> he only joins us when he has desktop issues nowadays :p
<mvo> seb128: ha! I just went to #ubuntu-devel to hug him :)
<mvo> he can not escape!
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> seb128: hm, I have u-n running (UNE), but it's not popping up at all
<seb128> do you have apport enable?
<pitti> yes, it's writing reports and logging properly
<seb128> I guess run u-n --debug...
<mvo> if someone could sync bug #603512 for me, that would be cool
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 603512 in gtest (Ubuntu) "Sync gtest 1.5.0-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main) (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/603512
<pitti> seb128: will do
<seb128> mvo, doing it
<mvo> thanks seb128
<pitti> seb128: in the meantime, I followed up with some questions
<mvo> update-notifier?
<seb128> mvo, done
<pitti> seb128: oh, *cough* -- just a focus failure of unity
<seb128> mvo, pitti doesn't get apport dialogs showing up
<seb128> lol
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<mvo> aha!
<pitti> itz not mvo bug, itz didrocks bug
<mvo> :)
<seb128> the "claim for attention" is sometime buggy
<pitti> you don't notice at all that there's a new window
<seb128> I've opened a bug about that a week ago
<seb128> well it should be moving in the launcher
<seb128> it works in some cases
<seb128> but it's often broken
<pitti> seb128: followed up again; I can't reproduce, so let's take a look at your stat output
<pitti> I'll have some lunch and check out the test case failures after that
<pitti>   * debian/rules: don't break build on the testsuite it has issues on buildds
<pitti> :-(
<pitti> it worked before?
<seb128> not really
<seb128> the new gdbus testcases seem to not like the buildds
<vish> mvo: for synaptic ubuntu11 , i had to new install libept1 , while i have libept0 as well , should libept0 be removed?
<seb128> pitti, it seems gdbus can't connect to the bus on the buildds for some reason
<seb128> pitti, it's a workaround for now, we need the new version to build and I've no time to debug buildds
<seb128> pitti, the testsuite works on local builds
<pitti> fun that it works on armel
<pitti> ok
<mvo> vish: yes, it should appear in the autoremove list once aptitude is updated for libept1
 * pitti &
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> pitti, enjoy
<mvo> vish: for now you can just keep both, that should be fine
<vish> mvo: yeah , i tried with that , but still no luck. :(  the same cpu usage... thats why i was wondering if it was the problem.
<mvo> vish: hrm, hrm. thanks! that is odd. it happens on "reload", righ?
<vish> mvo: yeah. only during reloads
<OwaisL> hey, I'm working on this gmail notifier with support for multiple accounts.
<OwaisL> I am facing a problem
<OwaisL> I'm opening Gmail in the browser using python's webbrowser module
<OwaisL> BUT
<OwaisL> and gmail logs in the user automatically based on previous/current session
<OwaisL> desired behavior is that Gmail for the notified account should open
<OwaisL> so i need a way to logout of gmail, then login to the desired account all inside the browser
<OwaisL> any ideas?
<seb128> OwaisL, hi, you seem to have made a mistake in the channel
<seb128> this channel is about organizing work on the ubuntu-desktop builds
<OwaisL> oh
<seb128> try #ubuntu-bugs for bugs
<mvo> thanks vish i debug further
<seb128> or #ubuntu for user questions
<OwaisL> join #ubuntu-bugs
<vish> mvo: thanks
<OwaisL> oops
<OwaisL> thanks
<mvo> vish: silly me, I think I nailed it down, expect a new upload shortly
<mvo> vish: but lunch first
<vish> cool!
<pitti> seb128: *sigh* heisenbug :-( I'll still look at the test case failuires, though
<seb128> pitti, yeah, sorry about that, it was doing it for a week and now it stopped
<seb128>  Traceback (most recent call last):
<seb128>    File "/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/aptdaemon/gtkwidgets.py", line 508, in _on_download_changed
<seb128>      iter = model.append((text, progress, uri))
<seb128>  AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'append'
<seb128> mvo, ^ known issue?
<pitti> seb128: ah, itz kees bug
<pitti> seb128: test suite can't core dump due to ptrace protection :-(
<mvo> seb128: not a known issue, is that reproducable?
<mvo> vish: I uploaded yet another version (ubuntu12), once that is build, could you give it a try?
<vish> mvo: sure , thanks.
<pitti> seb128: test suite problem in maverick fixed in apport's trunk, FYI (rewired the test code to get along with ptrace restrictions)
<seb128> pitti, re, sorry I was getting something to eat
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<seb128> mvo, not easily but that's not the first time I get it
<seb128> mvo, I did click on "installing updates", entered my password switched to something else and did esc when the "installing update" dialog was displayed
<seb128> mvo, seems there is a race, you can manage to get update-manager in a "waiting" state but with nothing happening
<mvo> seb128: that is really a bit odd, model should always be != None
<mvo> seb128: let me try that
<seb128> mvo, I've the feeling it's a race and you will not easily get it
<seb128> mvo, oh in fact it's trivial to get
<seb128> mvo, click on "update", enter your password and do "esc, esc, esc"
<seb128> ie keep hitting it until the dialg comes and is dismissed
<seb128> then apport triggers
<seb128> update-manager gets stucked in a busy state
<seb128> and you get a zillion apport crash report
<mvo> seb128: about the None has no attribute â¦ issue?
<mvo> seb128: or about something else?
<seb128> pitti, ^ I got 6 extra "apport crash dialogs" about it
<mvo> ha!
<mvo> have it
<seb128> mvo, it gives the stacktrace I gave you
<seb128> pitti, oh!
<seb128> pitti, ok, I was wrong with my bug
<seb128> I didn't actually got the issue with gconf-editor there
<seb128> I just use that one to grep for the counter value
<seb128> pitti, the counter seems to not work on python exception issues
<pitti> aah
<mvo> seb128: thanks, I can reproduce, fixing now
<seb128> mvo, it did install the updates!
<seb128> mvo, ie it didn't take my cancel
<seb128> I restarted update-manager now and I've no update listed
<seb128> mvo, thanks ;-)
<pitti> seb128: ok, please reopen the bug then
<seb128> pitti, done
<seb128> urg
<seb128> mvo, did you change update-manager to not display the names of updates on purpose or that's a bug?
<seb128> oh
<seb128> it's there ignore me
<seb128> it's confusing to have the title first and the package name behind ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson: hey
<seb128> chrisccoulson: shouldn't you be in a swap day rather than updating firefox today? ;-)
<mvo> seb128: aptdaemon issue is fixed in bzr
<seb128> mvo, you rock, thanks!
<joaopinto> mvo, hi, is there a plan to have apturl integrated with aptdaemon ?
<pitti> have a good weekend everyone, see you all on Monday! need to leave early today
<mvo> joaopinto: yes
<seb128> pitti, have fun!
<mvo> kiwinote: I fixed the enable component problem you mentioned yesterday in aptdaemon
<kiwinote> mvo: thanks!
<kenvandine> seb128, i uploaded gwibber to lucid-proposed, waiting to be approved
<seb128> kenvandine, I've noticed you fb post, nice
<seb128> it will wait monday I guess
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> we need pitti and he called it a week earlier
<kenvandine> ok, thx
<seb128> or trying asking cjwatson if you want
<desrt> seb128: hey?
<desrt> seb128: what's the story of this gconf package conflict?
<seb128> desrt, hello
<seb128> desrt, what conflicts?
<desrt> there's a package conflict on my system that's preventing gconf from being installed
<seb128> details?
<desrt> something about some .gir file conflicting with the same file in another package
<desrt> well
<desrt> thing is, i rebooted with my system in that conflicted state
<desrt> so uh... heh
<desrt> :X
<seb128> sudo apt-get -f install
<seb128> oh
<seb128> you mean it broke the install in middle in a broken state?
<desrt> maybe?
<desrt> i tried to do the -f install thing
<desrt> or at least the update manager tried on my behalf
<desrt> that fixed most things, i think, but somthing is still toasted
<seb128> well
<seb128> having the package names would help
<seb128> or the file conflicting
<desrt> i just realised that it's possible that this is caused by the gnome-shell PPA
<seb128> those should be in logged in /var/log/apt
<desrt> which i t
<desrt> hink that i have installed
<seb128> it's likely yes
<desrt> i forgot about that
<seb128> I don't recommend anybody to use it right now
<desrt> heh
<seb128> with the gir abi change
<desrt> is that the canonical company position? :)
<desrt> "don't use gnome shell!"
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> don't use rebuild of tons of system libs from a ppa
<seb128> rather
<seb128> the guys having the ppa has been taking the new gir abi
<seb128> so he's basically doing packaging changes to everything building a gir
<seb128> I'm not really surprised it creates issues
<desrt> ya... almost certainly the blame lies there, then
<desrt> PPAs are a bit scary in a way
<desrt> you install them for some small purpose
<seb128> but yeah, all those transitions make updating g-s challenging now
<Sarvatt> i think you just summed up xorg-edgers to a tee there seb128 :)
<desrt> and they have the ability to take over your entire system as the guy who built it increases the number of packages in there
<jcastro> when you remove it doing "sudo apt-get install packagename/lucid" will get you back to the level you're supposed to be at
<jcastro> or /maverick or whatever
<seb128> especially that walters and jdhalin said the abi and typelib will break
<desrt> in my case i didn't even realise what was going on until i considered how unlikely it was that ubuntu substantially changed the packaging mid-release
<Sarvatt> sudo apt-get install ppa-purge && sudo ppa-purge ppaname
<Sarvatt> :)
<desrt> seb128: walters is talking about switching the typelib to be the same file format as dconf :p
<seb128> lol
<jcastro> do we put ppa purge somewhere common or is it still in the Xorg PPAs?
<seb128> well we will not transition until the abi changes settle
<desrt> it's a good file format, dude!
<seb128> no discussion ;-)
<seb128> I'm just saying Debian and Ubuntu agree to wait a bit
<seb128> but it means we can't get new g-s builds easily
<seb128> since they depends on those changes
<Sarvatt> i think he copied it to the gnome-shell ppa if its ricotz's one
<seb128> so the ppa has to divert a lot
<seb128> Sarvatt, he's the one doing the g-s builds yes
<Sarvatt> yeah ppa-purge is in there
<Sarvatt> sudo apt-get install ppa-purge && sudo ppa-purge ppa:ricotz/testing then :)
<Sarvatt> a lot easier and safer to just jhbuild gnome-shell for now
<vish> mvo: w0000000t!!!!! it works ubuntu12 no constant cpu spike  ...  :D
<mvo> vish: \o/
<vish> the https alone has a spike but that drops in a couple of secs
<mvo> vish: thanks a million for testing that
<vish> mvo: np. thank *you* :)
<mvo> vish: please keep using it, if you see no regressions over the weekend I think we should try to get it into lucid-proposed
<vish> mvo: sure. will keep an eye out .
<mvo> great, tahnks vish
<vish> np.
<and471> vish, how is this? :D (more tango than humanity style) http://imagebin.ca/img/YqT84wY.png
<vish> and471: looks good. humanity is tango with a different palette and a few minor variations , this should fit well.. btw which icon is it for?
<and471> vish, if you are asking that question, I think I have failed
<and471> ...
<and471> vish, :D
<and471> vish, it is for adjusting hue saturationa and brightness (I think)
<kenvandine> and471, that gnome color thing?
<vish> and471: nah , it looks like some adjust .. i dont remember all the items in shotwell :)
<vish> and471: see:)
<kenvandine> ah
<kenvandine> for shotwell :)
<and471> kenvandine, yup yup :)
<and471> vish, I think the papercut needs to be split in two
<and471> vish, 1) use stanard stock icons for those that are applicable
<and471> *standard
<vish> and471: feel free to split it..
<and471> vish, 2) make the icons that have to be shipped with shotwell better (and generic tango style)
<and471> vish, merci beaucoup
<and471> does anyone know if shotwell has an irc channel?
<jcastro> and471: "yorba-jim" stops by in this channel on occassion
<and471> jcastro, thanks
 * and471 just used the new Opinion status on launchpad
<LaserJock> is that supposed to be a "terminal" status?
<and471> LaserJock, :)
<LaserJock> to me it sounds like an Importance status like a bit below "Wishlist"
<vish> and471: where is the preferences in shotwell? are you on Maverick?
<vish> i cant seem to find it in Lucid.. :s
<and471> vish, should be edit> preferences, I am on the svn version though
<and471> is this the bug I filed?
<vish> yeah
<vish> and471: cool , probably not in lucid
<vish> no prefs of any kind
<and471> vish, don't worry about that bug, it is set to opinion, so unless anyone has an opinion on it, it is wont fix upstream
<and471> vish, yeah must just be in SVN, you want a screenshot?
<vish> and471: np.. i was just confused :)
<kiwinote> mvo: warnings and errors should now be handled nicely by appdetailsview-gtk
<kiwinote> mvo: enjoy your weekend!
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-07-10
<OwaisL> Hey friends, can anyone give me the new beta font otf?
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-07-04
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Do you have patch pilot duties this week? If so, what day?
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, thursday
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Ok. Do you mind at all if we swap? I have to duck out for most of Friday, and am not sure if I'll get around to doing my shift/have enough time for my shift.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, sure
<TheMuso> Thanks.
<TheMuso> I'll contact Daniel about the swap/updating calendars etc.
<micahg> TheMuso: in the past, he's told me to just update it myself
<micahg> robert_ancell: I really like that lightdm restarts now when X falls out from under it
<TheMuso> micahg: Um right, if I knew where it lived, I would *attempt* to, but google calendar + web and screen reader == fail.
<robert_ancell> micahg, it is a bit nicer during failures!
<micahg> now if I could just get X to stop disappearing :)
<micahg> and I noticed the guest account as well
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> good morning
<TheMuso> Morning didrocks.
<didrocks> hey TheMuso, how was your flight?
<TheMuso> didrocks: Long, but uneventful, still feeling somewhat jetlagged.
<didrocks> yeah, will surely take some days :)
<didrocks> seif: hey, when you get some time, can we talk about zg and first system launch? (initial indexing of existing files)
<seif> didrocks, yes please
<seif> didrocks, can u join us on #zeitgeist for that
<seif> we have more ppl here
<didrocks> seif: sure
<fta2> Title: gnome-settings-daemon assert failure: gnome-settings-daemon: ../../src/xcb_io.c:515: _XReply: Assertion `!dpy->xcb->reply_data' failed.
<fta2> hm, there's already bug 804617 for that
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 804617 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon assert failure: gnome-settings-daemon: ../../src/xcb_io.c:515: _XReply: La declaraciÃ³n `!dpy->xcb->reply_data' no se cumple." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/804617
<jibel> pitti, good morning, could you look at bug 781076 ? it regularly breaks upgrades from N to O.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 781076 in doc-base "package doc-base 0.9.5ubuntu2 failed to install/upgrade: Byte order is not compatible at ../../lib/Storable.pm" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/781076
<seb128> hey
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks
<didrocks> bien rentrÃ©?
<jibel> didrocks, is there a way to temporarily disable the new modal dialogs in unity in order to compare with the standard behavior of the dialog ?
<didrocks> jibel: you have to manually edit the light themes, smspillaz told me it was 2 properties to change
<seb128> didrocks, oui, et toi ?
<didrocks> jibel: let me checkout the recent changes
<didrocks> seb128: Ã§a va ;)
<seb128> jibel, hey, bien rentrÃ© ? back on assigning us bugs? :-p
<didrocks> jibel: apply the reverse diff (http://paste.ubuntu.com/637817/) on /usr/share/themes/Ambiance/metacity-1/metacity-theme-1.xml
<jibel> seb128, oui bien rentrÃ©, Ã  part les trains bondÃ© par tous ces gens qui partent en vacances.
<jibel> didrocks, oh man, so easy, I'll switch to a gnome session then.
<didrocks> jibel: heh :)
<didrocks> reboot, brb
<chrisccoulson> back in a comfortable chair again this morning :-)
<chrisccoulson> good morning seb128
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, what about you?
<seb128> had a nice flight back and w.e?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, not too bad thanks. although, my 40 minute flight back to birmingham got delayed by 1 hour, which was really annoying ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i had to play another hour of angry birds at the airport
<seb128> well at least you didn't have to wait 4 hours in amsterdam :p
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that would be unfortunate ;)
<chrisccoulson> i'm starting to think it would have been quicker for me to catch the ferry
<seb128> I use the lounge card but they only had the free airport wifi limited to 1 hour
<didrocks> seb128: btw, sni-qt as been sourced NEWed by steve, if you can binNEWed, that would be awesome : )
<seb128> didrocks, ok
<seb128> didrocks, done
<didrocks> seb128: excellent, the MIR is ready, just waiting for mterry now to seed it :)
<didrocks> thanks
<seb128> yw
<seb128> RAOF, hey
<njpatel> awesome, evolution upgrade on desktop broke the filtering across all my folders
<njpatel> which means....thunderbird time!
 * njpatel needed the slightest of excuse really
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> yeah, I hate evo as well this week
<seb128> the 3.0 to 3.1 update forgot all my ui settings
<seb128> like the columns position, sorting etc
 * didrocks will do the migration today as well
<seb128> in all my boxes
<seb128> the age of thunderbird is starting!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, be ready to get bugs and complains coming your way ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh :-)
<chrisccoulson> i should have taken some vacation this week....
<njpatel> seb128, yep, that's what annoyed me....also I can't figure out a way to make all the folders behave like the one I configured, I really liked that feature in t-bird
 * didrocks opens a bug "it doesn't look like evolution" :)
<seb128> speaking of which you just won a bug that jibel assigned to the team
<njpatel> like*
<seb128> njpatel, right, have to do the same columns configuration in 25 boxes sucks
<seb128> having
<seb128> didrocks, bug #805036 seems to be one about the nvidia issue
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 805036 in unity "Can not choose classic unity instead of unity-2d" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805036
<seb128> RAOF, just for the backlog nvidia binary drivers broke for people upgrading (including dx) to the new mesa it seems
<seb128> RAOF, disabling and re-enabling nvidia in jockey "fixes" it though
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I'll retarget subcribe ubuntu-x to it as I don't know where the issue is from
<seb128> so it might be a tseliot pitti issue
<fta2> seb128, hi, found another weird new behavior of evo3, when viewing new emails, the selection moves from the main pane to the preview pane. is that a feature or a bug?
<seb128> fta2, bug I would say
<fta2> seb128, good, because it's annoying ;)
<seb128> though I'm not upstream so who knows what reason they could have found to justify it ;-)
<seb128> but seems a bug
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: is there any email account setup upgrade path?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, what are you upgrading from?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: our previous default, evolution :)
<chrisccoulson> ah :)
<chrisccoulson> not sure about that. RAOF mentioned that at the rally as well
<chrisccoulson> i wonder how hard it would be for me to make it import stuff from evo?
<didrocks> that would be nice anyway, we tend to update user's settings
<seb128> didrocks, well, when we migrate them, which we will not do with tb
<seb128> but yeah, would be still nice to have the feature for those switching
<didrocks> seb128: it was some kind of requirement for banshee AFAIK, so yeah, would be nice to have the same with th
<seb128> not sure we migrated the config
<seb128> we migrating the datas
<seb128> migrated
<seb128> i.e ratings, etc
<seb128> I don't think we migrated i.e jamendo accounts configured
<didrocks> config are playlist, where the music is, and such$
<didrocks> from my point of view, for a music player :)
<rodrigo_> morning
<seb128> hey rodrigo_, how are you?
<didrocks> hey rodrigo_
<rodrigo_> hi seb128, didrocks
<chrisccoulson> in this case, we would probably only really want to migrate account settings and filters from evolution (assuming that most people are running IMAP, then there's not much point in migrating mail too)
<seb128> right
<didrocks> agreed
<seb128> nice advantage of using e-d-s you should have access to the contacts, etc
<didrocks> reboot, brb
<kiwinote> f
<kiwinote> sorry, focus issue..
<Sweetshark> oh btw: morning everyone.
<seb128> hey Sweetshark
<rodrigo_> hi Sweetshark
 * Sweetshark just found the login to the trusty machine running this IRC session that I almost completely ignored over the last week.
<ricotz> Sweetshark, hello :), are there going to be libreoffice 3.3.3 or 3.4.1 updates for lucid too?
<Sweetshark> ricotz: 3.4.X for oneiric and 3.3.3 for natty has precedence. Why are you asking?
<ricotz> Sweetshark, i am curious about the libreoffice ppa and i would be great to see an update for lucid there
<ricotz> i saw the natty upload and hoped there are going to be more ;)
<rodrigo_> just in case someone was planning to do it -> I'm starting to package gnome-online-accounts
<Sweetshark> ricotz: well, a lucid release for 3.3.3 isnt that hard now that there is one for natty, but it is still not high priority. 3.4.0 is a bit different
<seb128> rodrigo_, write it on the etherpad ;-)
<rodrigo_> seb128, right :)
<ricotz> Sweetshark, alright, looking forward to it then :)
<didrocks> seb128: do you ship on purpose /usr/lib/libgtk-3.la ? (there was no gtk2 one)
<seb128> didrocks, there is /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libgtk-x11-2.0.la
<seb128> ?
<didrocks> ah, only gtk2 is ported to the multi-arch, I got puzzle by that
<didrocks> seems like cassidy don't like it ;)
<seb128> right
<seb128> what? the .la?
<seb128> why?
<didrocks> cassidy: ^^
<cassidy> seb128, I hate .la, they are a pain when using jhbuild as libs/apps tends to link on system lib rather than the jhbuild ones
<seb128> cassidy, somebody should fix libtool ;-)
<cassidy> isn't ubuntu supposed to get rid of .la files ?
<seb128> it's not that easy
<seb128> you need to rebuild all rdepends in order before dropping a .la
<seb128> which for gtk would be "fun"
<seb128> so I don't think those are going away any time soon
<cassidy> :(
<Laney> debian is doing it
<seb128> Laney, doing what?
<Laney> removing .la files
<Laney> at least I've had some NMUs for that
<Laney> :-)
<seb128> Laney, right, but as said you need to rebuild all the rdepends in order when you do that
<seb128> which is going to take a while for gtk
<Laney> I understand. Just saying that it is being worked on
<seb128> right
<Laney> http://wiki.debian.org/ReleaseGoals/LAFileRemoval fwiw
<fta2> kaboom, g-s-d crashed
<jibel> fta, not a big challenge ;-)
<ogra_> and i thought it was arm specific :)
<seb128> stacktrace?
<seb128> just assign the bug to rodrigo_ ;-)
 * rodrigo_ hides
<fta2> seb128, who?
<seb128> fta2, the rodrigo part was a joke but please open a bug with a stacktrace
<seb128> give the number here, we well deal with it
<seb128> rodrigo_, no luck for you that GNOME is moving half of the services in g-s-d ;-)
<rodrigo_> :)
<fta2> oh, it's the same i got this morning: bug 804617
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 804617 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon assert failure: gnome-settings-daemon: ../../src/xcb_io.c:515: _XReply: Assertion `!dpy->xcb->reply_data' failed." [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/804617
<seb128> #6  0x06014e57 in ?? () from /usr/lib/gnome-settings-daemon-3.0/liba11y-keyboard.so
<fta2> i can fully retrace it
<seb128> let me check what happened to the retracers
<didrocks> jibel: was there a bug for the datetime indicator content not being readable with the new theme?
<jibel> didrocks, bug 804348
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 804348 in light-themes "datetime indicator calendar difficult to read with Ambiance (light grey on white)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/804348
<didrocks> jibel: thanks! :)
<didrocks> session restart, brb
 * didrocks starts thunderbird
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: once I enter my setup and that it retrieved my email provider config (imap/smtp), I find that weird that the label is entitled "create account" (I think user can think it's about creating a new account on the server)
<fta2> seb128, #6  0x06014e57 in set_server_from_gsettings (manager=<value optimized out>) at gsd-a11y-keyboard-manager.c:346
<seb128> didrocks, is that a french translation or the english string?
<seb128> seems like it should be "set up account" or similar in english
<seb128> fta2, thanks
<fta2> seb128, the bug has been retraced by lp
<seb128> great, I've restarted the retracers
<seb128> seems that worked
<didrocks> seb128: english string
<didrocks> I have all th in english rightnow
<seb128> ok
 * desrt brings english strings to france
<seb128> desrt, hey ;-)
<desrt> hey :)
<desrt> we're having a party in paris in a couple of days.  you should come :)
<seb128> didrocks, did that started about at the same time desrt entered in France? we should consider sending him back to Canada to get our french back!
<seb128> desrt, "we" being?
<desrt> me and some ubuntu-fr folks
<seb128> nice ;)
<desrt> YoBoY, kinouchou, etc.
<desrt> i guess not dbarth
<seb128> you should go to rmll and have a party there ;-)
<desrt> unfortunately i already have an overlapping trip planned to germany
<desrt> east germany, i mean :)
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: agreed, no ubuntu font in th, english stringsâ¦
<didrocks> that looks like suspicious :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: also, I'm looking for two shortcuts: group by thread (seems I have to go to the menu) and mark as unread
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks. not sure if there is a shortcut for the first one, but the second one can be achieved by clicking on the small icon in the "Read" column of the folder pane
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I don't have a "Read" column by default is seems
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I see a small icon showing that it's not read in the subject column
<seb128> rodrigo_, bug #804946 seems to be a gift from pedro to you ;-)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 804946 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon crashed with SIGSEGV in g_variant_unref()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/804946
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i think it's the column on the right-hand side of the subject column
<seb128> rodrigo_, g_settings_get_boolean (settings=0x0 seems wrong
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure if that's default though, as my columns are slightly different with the conversations extension
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you are not even testing what you ship to users!
<chrisccoulson> lol
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: it's not the default indeed
<didrocks> hum, I would like to keep the default though :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, hmm, i just created a new profile and got that column by default ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh, the green one? it's confusing. What's the little lightning on the left of the subject title means though?
<didrocks> seems that th is not keyboard addict friendly :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, it's the little green icon
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: and the other one?
<didrocks> the little light for unread messages on the left of the message?
<didrocks> is it some kind of "never read"?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, good question ;)
<didrocks> :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, ah. that icon is "new", rather than "unread"
<chrisccoulson> (ie, it arrived in the last download)
<didrocks> oh ok :)
<chrisccoulson> seems fairly redundant though
<didrocks> right
<seb128> rodrigo_, sorry, bug #804896 seems to collect some duplicates as well and new since the update to 3.1
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 804896 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon assert failure: gnome-settings-daemon: ../../src/xcb_io.c:140: dequeue_pending_request: Assertion `req == dpy->xcb->pending_requests' failed." [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/804896
<chrisccoulson> or, to be more precise, it's "new, since the last time you viewed this mailbox"
<seb128> rodrigo_, but I'm done for today ;-) I guess you can handle the g-s-d g-c-c tarballs and oneiric updates and look at those later
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, taking it also :-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, is there an icon for "new since I got my coffee" and "new since I went for dinner"? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, the message indicator doesn't cope too well with me opening 2 instances of thunderbird
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: the only confusing things I find right now is with the indicator, which seems to pick the 6 first folder with new content rather than selected one
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: also, would be nice to use the ubuntu font for messages
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, we could probably use that for plain text messages
<seb128> didrocks, "selected one"?
<seb128> didrocks, how do you select the folders to get in the indicator?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, as for the indicator - we limit the number of entries to 6 (as per the spec)
<didrocks> seb128: I would say either take inbox, either have something like the folder subcription
<seb128> the spec is not made for geeks ;-)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I have a folder for oneiric-changes, I prefer to ensure I have the inbox there than being notified for every new upload :)
<didrocks> the spec tells that you can limit to inbox, isn't it?
<didrocks> inbox would be enough for me :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, no, the spec says we should have one for every folder, limited to 6
<njpatel> chrisccoulson, hey, there is a project to integrate thunderbird into eds right?
<chrisccoulson> njpatel, m_conley_away is working on the contacts integration atm
<seb128> chrisccoulson, not true
<njpatel> chrisccoulson, and calendering?
<seb128> "The selection of the âNotify new messages for Inbox onlyâ setting should be mapped to whether the âWhen new mail arrives inâ menu is set to âInboxâ or âany folderâ. "
<seb128> in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MessagingMenu/
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ^
<seb128> but yeah, it's not well presented in the spec
<seb128> there is that for evo but not in the "How applications should integrate with the messaging menu" section
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, that seems evo specific
<seb128> worth checking with mpt
<didrocks> why evo specific?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, that's in the bit specific to evolution
<seb128> didrocks, because it's not in the "Recommended behavior for e-mail clients"
<seb128> didrocks, it's just next to the evo preferences screenshot
<chrisccoulson> "A mail program should provide one message source item for each mailbox that contains new messages concerning you"
<chrisccoulson> in "Recommended behavior for e-mail clients"
<seb128> chrisccoulson, didn't you say that "concerning you" implied you were in the To:
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: right, I think that we need a definition about "each mailbox that contains new messages concerning you"
<chrisccoulson> evolution doesn't do this at all, by default
<njpatel> chrisccoulson, calendering? :) (sorry someone is asking me)
<seb128> i.e mailing lists should be out?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, right. we ignore messages that aren't addressed to you already
<seb128> so -changes should be listed?
<chrisccoulson> (well, we don't request attention for those, but we do add them to the indicator)
<seb128> should "not" be
<seb128> rather
<chrisccoulson> i know how to fix this ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you rank boxes with messages for you up in the list?
<seb128> i.e do they show before the ones which don't?
<seb128> that's like what didrocks want
<seb128> likely
<chrisccoulson> seb128, not yet. we currently add indicator entries until there are 6 of them, and then we queue them up
<didrocks> yeah, because not seeing the inbox content because g-s-d apport retraces works, is bad :/
<seb128> I guess doing that would solve the issue
<chrisccoulson> the fix is to give a lower priority for those mailboxes where we don't request attention
<chrisccoulson> yeah
<pitti> hello
<seb128> hey pitti, wies gets?
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you feeling today?
<seb128> wie
<pitti> lucidfox: the SRU team doesn't (normally) do verification -- that should be done by bug reporters; but of course anyone can test the packages and give feedback
<seb128> didrocks, chrisccoulson: ranking those where you got messages directed to you would fix the mailing list issue
<pitti> seb128, didrocks, chrisccoulson: hey guys, made it back home in one piece?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah. that's pretty easy for me to do
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, although my flight back got delayed by 1 hour. the delay was longer than my actual flight ;)
<pitti> jibel: doc-base bug> I looked a it before, it's fairly dubious to me; I'll check the debian bug again
<seb128> pitti, yes, no issue, just a 4 hours connection in amsterdam
<seb128> pitti, how is your ubuflu going?
<pitti> seb128: quite a bit better
<pitti> worst was on Saturday
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> but good that you are getting better
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, ok, so i can fix that anyway :)
<pitti> yesterday we went climbing, and it seems the physical effort and sweating made it quite a bit better :)
<didrocks> hey pitti, yeah, back with an uneventful flight! ;-)
<seb128> pitti, btw I restarted the retracers, they had a lock file from friday with no error in the log
<pitti> now I just came back home
<pitti> seb128: thanks
<seb128> pitti, just removing the lock was enough, dunno what happened
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, last question to bother you, about the font in default view? I tried to change in preferences -> display settings, but it doesn't impact email contents
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, for html e-mail?
<pitti> need to do some household stuff etc.; I have a swap day today, but want to catch up on things, too
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: and I don't have the mandatory photos in the ldap, but that's a small issue :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: no, it's a text only one
<pitti> oh, why does dist-upgrade want to pull all the gtk2 indicators back in?
<seb128> pitti, unity-2d
<pitti> isn't that qt?
<seb128> not the indicators
<seb128> they reuse as much of 3d they can
<seb128> they will share the 3d loader as well this cycle but that's short for a2
<seb128> will be solved for a3
<pitti> seb128: thanks for the heads-up
<seb128> yw
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, hmm, it worked here if i change the font for Monospace text to the right one
<didrocks> pitti: basically this removal depends on the next unity release to share the required components (what Cimi is working on right now)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: weird, maybe need a restart, let me try
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: right, after restarting, it's ok
 * rodrigo_ -> lunch
<chrisccoulson> i'm reluctant to change the default fonts in thunderbird though. if we set it to the ubuntu fonts, it will break if those aren't installed
<seb128> this language selection on login discussion is weird
<chrisccoulson> we should keep them set to the "monospace" alias, and the font system should do the job of selecting the desired font
<seb128> those who support it insist it's useful on the login screen but still without doing a solid usecase for it
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: why not recommending it? I think if it's not there, the fallback should be handled directly, isn't it?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: not having the right default font in one app is weird and not coherent
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, how would it determine a fallback? this is what the monospace alias is for isn't it? (ie, the font system does the job of selecting the correct font)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: or monospace should point the default, right
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, that's how it should work
<cyphermox> good morning!
<didrocks> hey cyphermox
<cyphermox> hey didrocks
<cyphermox> so; telepathy-salut is still failing, and the update that fixes the bugs is stuck in depwait (xmldiff isn't in main)
<cyphermox> so unless someone disagrees, I'd path configure.ac to not require xmldiff and drop that build-depends (it doesn't appear to be used, and builds fine without)
<seb128> hey cyphermox
<seb128> seems fine to do if it's not needed
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: also, it would be nice if the blue header in email thread can be orange
<cyphermox> MIR didn't seem like as good an idea because it doesn't seem like xmldiff is hugely maintained
<seb128> should be sent to debian and upstream as well
<cyphermox> aye
<didrocks> argh, I almost lost all my inbox thanks to thunderbirdâ¦
<pitti> didrocks: thank goodness we don't ship that by default!
<pitti> oh wait
<didrocks> :)
 * didrocks has a 10s tip to remove all the emails
<didrocks> and so, after recovering with evolution the deleted emails, now, it marks random ones as unread :/
<hyperair> woot.
<didrocks> ok, got from 0 -> 28 unread -> 0 without touching anything
<mpt> chrisccoulson, seb128: Which messages get notified in the messaging menu is up to the mail client (just like any other form of notification). Inbox only would be a good start. Attaching something to the folder properties would be one way of advancing from there.
<mpt> Thunderbird (3, at least) only has notification for any new message, so I guess it wouldn't make sense to get much more complex than that before Thunderbird itself does.
<chrisccoulson> mpt, hmmm, we can do a lot more than that with thunderbird :/
<chrisccoulson> (and are, already)
<mpt> chrisccoulson, ok. Has T5 upstream introduced more fine-grained notification for individual folders?
<chrisccoulson> mpt - oh, not for notifications. but the information to make it fine-grained is there (and always has been). i'm using it already for the messaging indicator work
<Sweetshark> pitti: how should something like http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=610817 be handled? _rene_ updated to the LO deps, so I assume we are hit by this on natty. Sync javahelper to natty too?
<ubot2> Debian bug 610817 in javahelper "javahelper: jh_depends fails when a jar file is a relative symlink" [Normal,Fixed]
<mpt> chrisccoulson, so which folders do you show? Any folders that have unread messages? Any that have "new" messages?
<chrisccoulson> mpt - any which have a new message get shown (up to 6), but we currently don't request attention unless the folder has a new message which is either addressed directly to the recipient, is starred, or has a high-importance
<mpt> chrisccoulson, nifty. My only concern is that it might be a bit mysterious if people can't see what it is that causes a message to show up there
<mpt> chrisccoulson, one way to help that would be to mention it in a help page. Another would be to have an interface for configuring it.
<didrocks> or if you have a lot of folders you are not interested to be notified with, and missing important one like inbox
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, right, i already have a fix for your case though ;)
<chrisccoulson> (we'll give priority in the menu to folders with interesting messages in them)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: like, always showing inbox whatever order of new are there?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, what if my inbox doesn't have anything interesting in it, and other folders do?
<chrisccoulson> this is what i hated about the evo implementation. it just assumes that because i use a filter to move it to another folder, that i don't want to be notified about it
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: well, I think inbox is the one where people are more focussed to? I'm not sure how you want to include the "relevant message ones"?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, we would use the same checks as we use for deciding if the message is interesting enough to request attention (ie, change the colour of the icon)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: so I would be notified for every blueprint I'm subscribed? (as I'm in the To:)
<didrocks> or every bug I'm a subscriber?
<seb128> didrocks, do you have over 6 boxes which get mails directed to you and not listed or launchpad?
<didrocks> seb128: that's what I'm just checking and it seems the answer is yes
<seb128> didrocks, fix your filtering? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, we might also filter out messages where "From != Sender", which would catch your blueprint case ;)
<chrisccoulson> i've already thought about this ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: no, because for every blueprint your subscribe, you are in To:
<didrocks> seb128: well, tool deciding from my workflow and forcing me to filter less? :/
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, right, but we would filter it out because the From address is not the same as the Sender
<chrisccoulson> i'm just currently trying to figure out if there are any other implications of doing that
<seb128> didrocks, don't use the messaging menu if it doesn't work for you?
<didrocks> seb128: it was working with evolution
<seb128> didrocks, there is no solution to the "I filter emails in 25 boxes"
<seb128> didrocks, "working", evolution only notify your about inbox messages which sucks
<seb128> it's mostly useless
<didrocks> well, for your filters :)
<seb128> I filter server side
<didrocks> same for me
<seb128> so it's useless
<didrocks> why?
<seb128> like evo never notify my of emails in my work box
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - i have a possible solution for the blueprints anyway. are there any other which are a concern? ;)
<seb128> because it watches only inbox
<didrocks> seb128: my work box is my inbox, it's the important pending stuff, the other are filtered
<didrocks> so different workflow, which doesn't mean that any tool choose to enforce some
<seb128> didrocks, well that might be true for you, my inbox is where all the things I don't wait for land and a spam box
<seif> didrocks, question
<seb128> didrocks, so I filter things I care about in other boxes
<seif> didrocks, why is my touchpad not working
<seif> and only the nipple thing
<didrocks> seif: contrary for me, things are care are by subject, but if they are filtered, it's because they don't need immediate attention
<didrocks> seif: better to check on #ubuntu-x with the xorg guys
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: so, for instance, I received assigned bugmail in bugs/assignee/<team>
<seb128> didrocks, well, I'm just saying the evo way is not better, it just work for different people
<didrocks> seb128: I agree, I just told it was better *for me*
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, the check which filters out the blueprint mail would also filter out bug mail too
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I don't understand, you want to filter that how? From != To -> notify?
<seb128> the only way to solve it for everybody would be a checkbox by mailbox
<seb128> to let you say "don't notify me about this box"
<seb128> but we are down to corner cases, real world users don't have over 6 boxes
<didrocks> seb128: was my first proposal about subcription some hours ago :)
<seb128> not sure we should bother about corner cases
<seb128> let's fix real issues first
<seb128> (yeah it sucks because it means it work less fine for us)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, what is the difference between sender and from in meaning?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, would that happen in case somebody fwd you an email too?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, "The person or agent submitting the message to the network, if other than shown by the From: header." (from RFC2076)
<chrisccoulson> i'm still working out whether i can use it
<chrisccoulson> so far, all messages which are explicitly sent to me by a human don't have a separate "Sender" header
<seb128> bah, f*** evolution
<seb128> it segfaults on opening google calendar invitations emails
<cyphermox> oh
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: seems it will filter the mailing list as well
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i just noticed that too
<seb128> do you want to be notified about mailing lists?
<didrocks> which will be ok with me, but I'm sure not for othersâ¦
<didrocks> seb128: right now, with the current behavior, you will be
<seb128> I though those were already filtered out because the to: is not you?
<seif> didrocks, its me again
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's right. but we still show them if someone addresses it to you
<seif> didrocks, how do i change the icon theme
<chrisccoulson> (ie, if somebody replies incorrectly) ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well it will still do it when they reply to all because that will send 2 emails, one to you directly
<didrocks> seif: install and run gnome-tweak-tool
<seb128> chrisccoulson, that one should not get a sender:
<chrisccoulson> ah, yes. that's probably the case actually
<chrisccoulson> so that might still work
<seif> and this installs mutter-common
<seif> -.-
<seb128> seif, use dconf-editor
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: RES mem is 578M here, is it known?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i haven't seen it use that much before. how much mail do you have?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: well, depends on the folder, is there a way to know the total number?
<didrocks> (with the same amount of email, I'm at 240 in evo and it doesn't freeze as much right now)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, it should tell you in the statusbar
<seb128> pitti, mvo: is that wanted that update-manager let me install packages without asking for a password?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: only for the current folder though?
<pitti> Sweetshark: we should avoid updating javahelper into natty unless we really need to (but we can't sync it, someone needs to prepare an actual SRU)
<pitti> Sweetshark: but for the natty LibO SRU it could just revert the dependency?
 * pitti -> off again
<seb128> pitti, mvo: ignore me, it does now
<pitti> seb128: yes, that was changed last week
<pitti> seb128: we now grant the package upgrade privilege by default to local admin sessions
<seb128> pitti, it's broken in some way then ;-)
<pitti> (but _only_ for admins)
<pitti> but installation of new packages still requires passworrd
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> excellent
<seb128> pitti, thanks, have fun!
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, although i'm not sure what you get if you click on the actual mail account. with the mail summaries extension, i get an overall count (14 folders with 23621 messages)
<chrisccoulson> i need to delete some messages ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I have nothing in the status bar in the mail account info
<didrocks> so yeah, should be your extension
<didrocks> in fact, I notice it jumps depending on which folder I'm in
<seb128> jibel, the default application didn't migrate to dconf, they use mimetypes now
<Sweetshark> pitti: thats what I did (revert the dep), but I fear the build will break now.
<jibel> seb128, which means that corresponding launchers on unity-2d's dash won't be displayed until migrated ?
<seb128> jibel, well it probably means they need to update their code yes
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, do you use the 2D unity session at all?
<chrisccoulson> m_conley currently has no indicators in it
<seb128> jibel, bug #800689 is similar for unity 3d
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 800689 in unity "Should stop using gconf in oneiric" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/800689
<seb128> chrisccoulson, didrocks "fixed" it today to install the indicator-...-gt2
<seb128> gtk2
<seb128> chrisccoulson, they didn't port their loader to gtk3 yet
<chrisccoulson> seb128, thanks
<chrisccoulson> ^^ m_conley
<seb128> if he does an upgrade that should fix it
<m_conley> chrisccoulson / seb128: gotcha, thanks
<seb128> yw
<seb128> jibel, do you have a GNOME bugzilla account?
<jibel> seb128, I think I have one somewhere but is there a gnome equivalent to apport to make it easy to spam bugzilla with reports ?
<seb128> jibel, not really ;-) but don't bother about it, I think it's logical that you spam launchpad and that pedro upstream those that concern GNOME
<jibel> seb128, anyway I think I nearly finished to review g-c-c, I'll upstream the reports.
<seb128> jibel, it's just that the number of g-s-d and g-c-c bugs seems to be over what rodrigo_ can work on
<jibel> :)
<seb128> so we should upstream those without waiting on rodrigo
<seb128> jibel, do you want me to upstream those that I know make sense upstream?
<seb128> jibel, ignore my ping, I think you should focus on Ubuntu issues and let teams deal with their upstreams
<seb128> jibel, if you want to be nice to rodrigo just move to hammer another product for a bit :p
<rodrigo_> seb128, oh, so far it's ok, for the ones I have assigned to me
<rodrigo_> but yeah, upstream as many as you can
<jibel> seb128, I found a fair amount in unity and unity-2d as well, so there are bugs on everyone's plate.
<jibel> anyway tomorrow is ubiquity's turn
<seb128> ok
<seb128> didrocks, bug #801282 is likely an unity issue I think but you might be able to confirm or not
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 801282 in unity "wrong gnome-control-center icon displayed on dash" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/801282
<seb128> didrocks, since the capplets have desktop files calling "g-c-c <capplet>" in oneiric I guess they all match alt-f2 g-c-c
<seb128> it doesn't favorite exact matching right?
<didrocks> seb128: it is an unity-places-application issue
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<seb128> didrocks, could you run your bug syncing script btw?
<didrocks> seb128: njpatel doesn't want anymore
<didrocks> seb128: until they are actually fixing bugs
<seb128> ok
<seb128> just curious but why?
 * didrocks pokes the gconf backendâ¦
<seb128> jibel, could you get a debug stacktrace or open a bug with apport and the segfault details on bug #805473
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 805473 in gnome-control-center "gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in g_simple_async_result_complete()" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805473
<jibel> seb128, still installing dbg packages.
<fta> grr, gtk is spamming ~/.xsession-errors
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, maaaaaan, fixing your use cases is making my head explode ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: \o/ achievement :-)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: sorry about that ;)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> that's ok ;)
<fta> didrocks, what's the typical memory usage of compiz/unity3d on i386?
<didrocks> fta: depends on your hardware, nvidia cards take more
<fta> nvidia..
<fta> PID  USER      PR  NI  VIRT  RES  SHR S %CPU %MEM    TIME+  COMMAND
<fta> 1825 fta       20   0 1109m 802m  16m S   31 24.5 647:17.12 compiz
<didrocks> seems a memleak though
<didrocks> shold be 400 or something like that
<fta> it's clearly a pig
<fta> didrocks, i was trying to track down why indicator-datetime-service takes a full core for a several seconds every few minutes, but compiz seems in a bad state
<didrocks> fta: not that bad, 413, 95 there since this morning
<didrocks> fta: you are not using nouveau?
<fta> didrocks, no, nvidia-current
<didrocks> hum, same here :/
<fta> didrocks, 1111m 805m. it's increasing
<didrocks> fta: better to check that with the unity people, running in valgrind can help. Testing if compiz only is doing that (by removing the unity plugin) can be of used too
<seb128> try to figure what you use or do that create the issue
<seb128> "301m  89m  12m" here after a day of use
<seb128> using the application place and alt-f2 often
<fta> booh, the indicator-datetime-service CPU spikes seems to be related to org/gnome/evolution/dataserver/Calendar/...
<rodrigo_> out now for a bit, bbl
<fta> it's polling a lot of stuff every 5min or so, freezing compiz for ~30sec
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, http://paste.ubuntu.com/638035/. that should ensure that your inbox has priority over other mail boxes in your menu ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you totally rock! :)
<fta> didrocks, the leak stopped after i killed indicator-multiload
<didrocks> fta: weird, I though we had a fix for that
<fta> i thought that was fixed weeks ago
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> humâ¦ need to track that again I think
<didrocks> fta: can you reopen a bug about it?
<didrocks> will ensure it's trackd
<didrocks> tracked*
<fta> hm, hold on, it's moving up again
<didrocks> ahâ¦
<fta> it was taking ~100k per min. remained stable for 5 min after i killed that indicator, but it's now moving up again
<didrocks> it didn't respawn?
<fta> nope
<didrocks> would be nice to have an idea of what you have on your system creating that issue. Oneiric is not that different from natty for unity
<fta> compiz is still taking 10% cpu, while i'm not even touching it
<seb128> didrocks, that part of the code is quite different
<didrocks> with the gtk3 stake you mean? right, it changed thinking about it
<seb128> didrocks, i.e http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity/trunk/revision/1208
<seb128> didrocks, no, with tim's refactoring
<fta> restarting, it's unbearably slow
<seb128> but you can probably count the gtk3 switch as well
<fta> brb (assuming unity wishes to start, unlike in the last 2 weeks)
<fta> bahh :(
<fta>  $ /usr/lib/nux/unity_support_test
<fta> X Error of failed request:  BadWindow (invalid Window parameter)
<fta>   Major opcode of failed request:  138 (NV-GLX)
<fta> any idea?
<didrocks> fta: try in jockey to remove, then readd the nvidia driver
<fta> jockey doesn't work for me, it fails with a cryptic error
<fta> is "apt-get install --reinstall nvidia-current" enough?
<didrocks> fta: maybe, I did it through jockey (and others as well) to get it working
<fta> brb
<fta> it worked
<fta> ok, compiz started at 256m  96m  30m, far from my 1109m 802m  16m
<didrocks> ok, sounds clloser to what I have now :)
<fta> it's already leaking
<fta> i just have xchat and 2 xterms
<fta> and the indicators
<seb128> what non standard indicators?
<seb128> does it do with only standard indicators?
<fta> just multilad, everything else is by default
<fta> killing it
<didrocks> ok, see you tomorrow guys, will try to rest a little
<seb128> fta: does it work better without it?
<seb128> vuntz, your note to packagers in gnome-desktop is weird
<fta> seb128, slightly
<seb128> fta: it's weird, other people don't get that issue so it's likely something out of the default configuration
<seb128> fta: how much is "slightly"?
<seb128> I can believe that indicators are leaking and that the multiload indicator triggers that but you shouldn't get lot of leaking with the standard set
<seb128> they don't refresh or update often
<fta> seb128, http://paste.ubuntu.com/638071/
<seb128> fta: seems quite ok since you stopped it
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey
<fta> seb128, i'll keep watching
<seb128> fta: thanks, I will try to get a valgrind log with the indicator-multiload and ping dx about it if needed
<fta> i'm already at 103M :(
<seb128> fta: try to see if it still does it while you don't use the computer
<vuntz> seb128: weird as in "not understandable" or "not usual"?
<seb128> vuntz, like as "why an api addition warrant a warning, those are usually fine"
<GunnarHj> seb128: Hello Sebastien!
<seb128> vuntz, would make sense for a change in an existant api or a drop of function
<vuntz> seb128: well, yes and no
<seb128> vuntz, did you meant to warn that there is an api break in there?
<vuntz> seb128: it won't change the major of the soversion
<vuntz> seb128: but it could change minor, and when an API break occurs, we'd go to libgnome-desktop4
<vuntz> seb128: which makes no sense in that  case
<vuntz> seb128: (we already had libgnome-desktop0, libgnome-desktop1 and libgnome-desktop2 just in 3.1.x)
<seb128> does anyone care about the major? ;-)
<vuntz> I do :-)
<seb128> let me rephrase
<seb128> is there any packaging system handling the major version in a special way?
<seb128> (just curious)
<seb128> (ours is just dealing with soname)
<vuntz> no, I just hate that we reach 42 so quickly
<seb128> GunnarHj, how are you?
<vuntz> well you use soname + major of soversion
<seb128> vuntz, ok, the warning makes sense if you care about the libtool numbers I guess ;-)
<seb128> I would tend to take addition as normal and not worth a warning
<vuntz> seb128: anyway, there's no api break ;-)
<seb128> that's why I wanted to check ;-)
<seb128> vuntz, thanks
<seb128> vuntz, how are you btw?
<GunnarHj> seb128: I'm fine, thanks. The summer weather makes life more easy. How about you? You seem to be rather busy at the moment. :)
<seb128> GunnarHj, summer weather is nice indeed, can't complain ;-) yeah, things tend to be always busy there :p
<seb128> GunnarHj, about the gdm discussion, don't take robert_ancell wrongly, he doesn't want to drop the feature
<seb128> GunnarHj, it's just that rather than doing things the same way just because they were like that before he's trying to understand the rational and if that's the best way to provide what is needed
<seb128> GunnarHj, which goes with "understand the need, then figure what best deserves it"
<GunnarHj> seb128: Doesn't he? He could have fooled me. Did, actually...
<seb128> GunnarHj, well he just states that nobody proved the need for having that option in that place, if you or somebody else comes with a convincing argument he will probably be fine with it
<seb128> GunnarHj, doing thing a way because they were done that way before is not always right, it would mean we never question or improve ;-)
<seb128> GunnarHj, just curious but do you often need to change your session locale? for what reasons (out of testing which is an hacker thing, not an user one)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Absolutely. About questioning the way we do it, I mean. But it's not easy to present _proofs_ as regards the need just like that.
<seb128> GunnarHj, well, no need of proof, you just need to come with examples
<seb128> i.e give reasons why you change locales on your profile if you do so
<seb128> but seems like so far the main argument was "on first login a new user need to select the locale" which could done in the user account dialog when adding the account
<GunnarHj> seb128: No, if you disregard all the testings I've done, I don't change language often. I think robert_ancell is right about that we are talking about a rather small minority.
<GunnarHj> seb128: But people with disabilities is a minority too. Are we going to ignore their needs?
<seb128> is the small minority enough to justify exposing the option on the login screen?
<seb128> GunnarHj, no, but those need are defined and clear to understand
<seb128> what we try to get from that discussion is the need from people who want a locale selector on the login screen
<seb128> we can't really address their issue without understand it
<seb128> so far people only stated that's needed for a minority but nobody gave enough infos to figure what is the exact need
<seb128> without knowing that it's hard to address the need in a correct way
<GunnarHj> seb128: Without knowing how big the group is, yes, I think the exposure can be justified. Why? Because we know that there are people who appreciate it, and that those who don't aren't harmed by it in any way.
<seb128> your argument seems to be "let's put it there because why not, some people find it handy and we can"
<seb128> but you could justify adding quite some options on the login screen the same way
<seb128> quite some users would like a way to configure the greeter options from there
<seb128> i.e sound, color, images
<seb128> also they need a "selector" there, but do they need to select language for text? input methods? keyboard layout?
<seb128> without understanding what they want to do it's not easy to understand what options should be exposed in the ui
<GunnarHj> seb128: I'd rather say let's not remove it, because we haven't properly analysed the need.
<seb128> ok
<seb128> the discussion is "let's analyse the need so we figure how we answer it properly"
<GunnarHj> seb128: Language is a special case, since changes don't take effect within a session.
<seb128> the answer could be "let's do what we had before" but could be different
<seb128> like we didn't have an input method selector before
<seb128> is that needed?
<GunnarHj> seb128: I didn't know that we have an input method selector...
<seb128> GunnarHj, ok, I need to go for dinner, I just wanted to try to explain why robert_ancell is doing that since it seemed you took it has an effort to drop the feature from your replies
<seb128> GunnarHj, we have one in the session, not on the login screen
<seb128> got to go
<seb128> bbl
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok. Let's see if the discussion moves forward when he wakes up.
<GunnarHj> By, seb.
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-07-05
<RAOF> Hm.  Why do I have a boot partition, and will this kernel fit on it? :)
<TheMuso> RAOF: Morning. How was your trip back?
<RAOF> TheMuso: Good morning!
<RAOF> The trip back was pretty much as expected.  Although Frankfurt airport wasn't as crazy as I'd been lead to believe.
<RAOF> Oh, and I got remided why not to get a Jetstar codeshare flight from Sydney rather than a real Qantas flight ):
<TheMuso> And why is that?
<RAOF> Because (a) you can't book your bags through to Hobart, (b) you have to make your own way from the international to domestic terminals, and (c) you then need to queue up (in the huge queue) and check in at the Jetstar desk.
<TheMuso> Oh.
<TheMuso> At least it wasn't Tiger.
<RAOF> That would have been particularly painful!~
<RAOF> I haven't heard precisely what âsafety issuesâ have caused them to be grounded, but it's a sucky position for anyone who bought a ticket to be in.
<AfC> robert_ancell: ping
<robert_ancell> AfC, hello
<AfC> robert_ancell: hey. Robert Collins just suggested I reach out to you here;
<AfC> robert_ancell: [aside: I've got 2 bugs that I'm trying to file, but can't, because I'm not running 100% pure Canonical approved kool-aid. That's a conversation for another day]
<AfC> robert_ancell: I just enabled multiple keyboard layouts, and hit an ugliness
<AfC> robert_ancell: it seems that our gnome-settings-daemon package hitting a conflict also being linked against libappindicator3-1. The affect of that + whatever patches we've got in there (#gnome-shell wasn't terribly impressed) is that
<AfC> robert_ancell: I've got a (you're not going to believe this)
<AfC> "[broken image] gst-keyboard-xkb"
<AfC> robert_ancell: in my notification area. (!)
<AfC> gnome-shell's active layout indicator up next to accessibility & volume is working.
<AfC> My suspicion is that something is causing a GtkStatusIcon to get created, perhaps as a mistaken fallback? It's got a menu.
<AfC> bug #1: s/gst/gsd/
<ubot2> AfC: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1 (Not reporting large bug)
<AfC> bah
<AfC> "second bug": it being in notification area at all.
<AfC> Short of me branching package and patching out libappindicator, I'm not sure what I can do.
<robert_ancell> AfC, is there a bug open on this?
<AfC> lifeless: perhaps you can explain that to robert_ancell :/
<AfC> robert_ancell: apparently not.
<AfC> robert_ancell: the closest I found was an oblique mention deep in https://bugs.launchpad.net/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/649809/comments/198
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 649809 in gnome-settings-daemon "the session settings manager can try starting before the login screen one exits" [Medium,In progress]
<lifeless> robert_ancell: AfC has the gnome3 ppa enabled and is not in the ubuntu bug control team
<lifeless> robert_ancell: so ubuntu-bug won't report bugs, and launchpad redirects him to the wiki page saying to use ubuntu-bug.
<lifeless> robert_ancell: I figured you'd want the info, so sent him here
<AfC> All the other Google hits on "gst-keyboard-xkb" are about reordering things in the GNOME 2 / Unity  appindicator applet.
<robert_ancell> lifeless, oh I see
<lifeless> robert_ancell: since sending him off to the TB to change bug filing rules seems like a meta-meta-overkill
<lifeless> robert_ancell: I decided to do the simpler thing and share the pain with you, roaf, TheMuso etc :)
<AfC> robert_ancell: (hence someone people suggesting that gst- is a typo complicating things, and should have been gsd- but anyway)
<robert_ancell> AfC, does https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+filebug work?
<AfC> Pain for everyone! Yeay :)
<AfC> um, yes?
<AfC> lifeless: Robert, I guess that's the magic string I was looking for....
<lifeless> don't count chickens till the bugs are filed :>
<AfC> lifeless: true :)
<AfC> ok, typo file at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/805743
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 805743 in gnome-settings-daemon "gst-keyboard-xkb should be gsd-keyboard-xkb" [Undecided,New]
<RAOF> For what it's worth, I've noticed that problem in the gnome-shell session.
<AfC> robert_ancell: https://lists.launchpad.net/gnome3-team/msg00296.html seems to refer to something appearing in notification area (so this may have been lurking for a while) but the linked screenshot is gone.
<AfC> Not everybody has multiple keyboard layouts, so I can see how this would have gone largely unnoticed.
<robert_ancell> AfC, can you link it to the upstream reeport?
<AfC> um "that was people in #gnome-shell telling me to file against Ubuntu because they saw the problem arose through Ubuntu's patching"
<AfC> and/or "I am upstream", take your pick :)
<AfC> I could test that theory by patching out the libappindicator dependency and building a package, but that would make the problem go away for me without helping anyone else, and I wanted to try and figure this out.
<AfC> Seems its compile time not runtime, though. So removing the library won't work.
<AfC> [from a running system]
<AfC> ok, filed https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/805747 with the issue.
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 805747 in gnome-settings-daemon "Unnecessary gst-keyboard-xkb appearing in Notification Area when multiple keyboard layouts enabled" [Undecided,New]
<robert_ancell> AfC, is there an easy way to test the broken indicator?
<robert_ancell> AfC1, is there an easy way to test the broken indicator?
<RAOF> Fire up a GNOME session from lightdm while having >1 keyboard layout configured?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, I have that, but it doesn't use the indicators
<robert_ancell> RAOF, is there a shortcut key to switch layouts?
<RAOF> Do you have an indicator in Unity?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yes, for sound
<RAOF> But not for keyboard layouts?  Huh.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, oh indicators... I was thinking of notifications
<robert_ancell> blame ted
<RAOF> BAH!  Stupid new control centre.  Of *course* keyboard layout isn't in the âKeyboardâ cappletâ¦
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yeah, that just got me
<robert_ancell> RAOF, so, still not seeing a problem...
<AfC1> robert_ancell: "easy", perhaps not - but it should be trivially replicated:
<RAOF> What I was seeing was: I have a keyboard layout indicator in Unity, with a bunch of layouts.  In gnome-shell, I have a notification icon (which, obviously, is hidden by default in the bottom right hand corner) with gst-something-kbd as the label and a broken icon.
<AfC1> robert_ancell: System Settings â Region and Language â
<AfC1> (no, it's not under Keyboard)
<robert_ancell> AfC1, so this only occurs when in GNOME Shell?
<AfC1> robert_ancell: â Layouts tab
<AfC1> well, I'm always in gnome-shell, so I can't compare to anything else, but yes?
<AfC1> robert_ancell: â '+' (add)
<AfC1> robert_ancell: â pick something. Japan maybe. Dvorak perhaps :)
<AfC1> pretty much immediately "USA" turned up in the top of the shell, with the second keyboard layout selectable from there.
<AfC1> (I may have had to Alt+F2 r)
<AfC1> anyway, Â± from there, I started getting this weird thing in the Notification ARea
<robert_ancell> AfC1, well, I changed the name.  It still shows with [unknown-icon] gsd-keyboard-xkb, but I guess it depends on how GNOME Shell is interpreting it
<AfC1> ah
<AfC1> Yes, I'd say you've replicated the bug
<AfC1> [on the assumption that you agree with me that it shouldn't be showing anything :)]
<robert_ancell> AfC1, so I've closed the bug as fixed, as it now has a logical name.  But there's probably a bug, what is this element and should it appear there?
<AfC1> robert_ancell: you see the 2nd bug I filed?
<robert_ancell> AfC1, no
<AfC1> ah
<AfC1> robert_ancell: filed https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/805747 with major issue.
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 805747 in gnome-settings-daemon "Unnecessary gst-keyboard-xkb appearing in Notification Area when multiple keyboard layouts enabled" [Undecided,New]
<AfC1> from ^ sorry you didn't see it
<AfC1> robert_ancell: to answer your question, I have no idea what it is, and I assume it shouldn't be there [since shell went ahead with what I assume is js/ui/status/keyboard.js]
<AfC1> robert_ancell: fmuellner in #gnome-shell speculated it was some kind of fallback codepath, perhaps triggered in response to [compile time] detection of libappindicator, but could be anything
<AfC1> Time to recharge
<AfC1> â out
<RAOF> Hm.  I may need to *make* my lunch today.  Crazy.
<TheMuso> heh
<TheMuso> RAOF: At least you can make something that tastes nice. :)
<RAOF> Mmm, there's some baked beans with pork belly reheating now :)
<TheMuso> Sounds better than anything from the hotel last week. :0
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Morning pitti.
<pitti> hey TheMuso
<pitti> TheMuso, RAOF: made it back home in one piece?
<TheMuso> pitti: Certainly did, long but uneventful.
<RAOF> Yup.
<RAOF> One somewhat tired piece :)
<TheMuso> Yeah that too.
<nomego> Hi guys, just installed gnome 3 and don't find any appearance settings anywhere, where do I look? Are these questions better suited for #ubuntu?
<RAOF> nomego: Yes, better suited for #ubuntu.  Also, there are no gnome 3 appearance settings.
<RAOF> (Although gnome-tweak-tool allows you to twiddle some knobs)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, are you running up to date oneiric?  When you log out does the greeter show?
<RAOF> Want me to check?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yes please
<RAOF> I've updated this morning, but haven't yet logged out.
<RAOF> robert_ancell: The greeter does show.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, hmm, not on my oneiric box
<RAOF> Man, though.  Both logging out and logging in are *slow*
<RAOF> How was your trip home, btw?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, less eventful than last time!
<robert_ancell> actually Jason and I got upgraded to premium economy from Bangkok which was nice
<RAOF> Nice!
<TheMuso> Nice.
<chrisccoulson> good morning
<pitti> robert_ancell: hey Robert
<pitti> chrisccoulson: good morning!
<robert_ancell> RAOF, why is my oneiric box not displaying??   I can see in the log the greeter is running, and I can click on things and log in, but only the background displays
<robert_ancell> pitti, hello
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: cold is receding, pretty well again :) how about yourself?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Oooh, fun!  My guess is that you're hitting server-regenerate bugs :)
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: Good morning!
<chrisccoulson> pitti, yeah, i'm not too bad thanks. although, i got woken quite early this morning
<robert_ancell> RAOF, anything I can do to debug it?
<pitti> robert_ancell: bug 802271 seems to be one of the remaining alpha-2 desktop blockers
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 802271 in lightdm "Characters sent to tty1" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/802271
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Send me the Xorg.0.log?
<robert_ancell> pitti, I have a candidate release, just testing it now
<chrisccoulson> good evening RAOF ;)
<chrisccoulson> hi robert_ancell
<pitti> robert_ancell: would it be sufficient to set a vt number in lightdm.conf?
<pitti> robert_ancell: oh, awesome
 * pitti rings the bell for alpha-2 soft-freeze
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, hello
<chrisccoulson> huh? https://launchpadlibrarian.net/74560113/buildlog_ubuntu-oneiric-amd64.firefox_5.0%2Bbuild1%2Bnobinonly-0ubuntu2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<chrisccoulson> i wonder why that only failed the second time around :/
<chrisccoulson> that's weird
<robert_ancell> RAOF, http://paste.ubuntu.com/638240
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Well, nothing particularly seems to be broken there.  Once you log in does it start drawing correctly?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, no, seems broken until I restart
<RAOF> I'd *guess* that some accel state isn't being set correctly across regenerate, then.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, it used to work :(
<RAOF> When did it break?  Have we had an upload of xserver-xorg-video-ati since then?
<RAOF> We had a new upstream on Friday afternoon, which might be your culprit.
 * RAOF tries unsuccessfully to go to lunchpad.net
<lifeless> \o/
<RAOF> robert_ancell: If you install from https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-ati/1:6.14.0-0ubuntu5 does it work?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, I only updated today, so it's been out of date for more than a week
<RAOF> lifeless: You've got lunchpad.net hilighted? :)
<lifeless> no, but I happened to be checking new traffic in IRC and saw it
<RAOF> robert_ancell: You crazy non-bleeding-edge cat, you!
<robert_ancell> RAOF, you want me do downgrade right?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Yes please.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, same problem
<RAOF> You restarted the X server, right?
<RAOF> :)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yup.  I installed the -ati pacakge, perhaps I need more
<RAOF> Oh, yeah.  Sorry, the one you're after is -radeon.
<RAOF> -ati is just a wrapper for selecting between r128, mach64, and radeon.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, installed -radeon, same problem
<RAOF> Your machine boots too quickly :P
<RAOF> Bah.  Well, there goes a perfectly servicable hypothesis.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, I didn't reboot
<robert_ancell> RAOF, should I downgrade the -core package?
<RAOF> You could give it a whirl.
 * RAOF tries to pull up software-centre to see what's been updated in the past week.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, hmm, my software center has what changed, but not in alphabetical order
<RAOF> It's got it in chronological order, right?
<robert_ancell> yrsh
<RAOF> So, the only other target would appear to be mesa.
<RAOF> How have you been testing whether the downgrades work?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, dpkg -i, then restart lightdm
<RAOF> And it works after restarting lightdm and then fails after logging out?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yup, every time
<RAOF> Have you tried downgrading xserver-xorg-core yet?
<RAOF> The only other obvious one would be mesa, but it's not obvious to me how that would kill rendering.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, what version should I downgrade to? I've been trying to find it in the list of upgrades, but I upgraded >600M today
<RAOF> For mesa, or xserver
<RAOF> ?
<robert_ancell> either
<RAOF> The latest 7.10.3 version for mesa, and the previous version (whatever that was) for xserver.
<RAOF> But I don't think there have been any xserver uploads in the relevant timeframe, so it's perhaps less likely to be the culprit.
<robert_ancell> i was previously 7.10.3-0ubuntu2 for mesa
<RAOF> That'd be fine.
<RAOF> You'd be after (at least) libgl1-mesa-glx and libgl1-mesa-dri on that downgrade.
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti
<didrocks> how are you?
<pitti> didrocks: quit fine again, cold is receding
<pitti> how are you?
<didrocks> still sick, but I guess I have less temperature than yesterday
<didrocks> pitti: for Qt: I'll take care of that right after alpha2 (need to make some changes anyway)
<pitti> didrocks: urgh, you caught it too?
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, but I wonder if it wasn't rather Julie's flu as I was feeling pretty well on Sunday
<pitti> flu takes some 3 days of incubation
<didrocks> so, I probably caught it at the rally
<didrocks> was quite violent yesterday evening (39.5Â°C)â¦ I was surprized to still have some more or less fresh mind yesterday :)
<mvo> woah, get well didrocks!
<robert_ancell> RAOF, no change with mesa update
<didrocks> mvo: thanks ;)
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Well, that's kinda good.  I couldn't think of any reason why that would break it!
<pitti> didrocks: compiz still b-deps on NBS libgnome-window-settings-dev; can that be dropped?
<pitti> didrocks: want me to try building without?
<didrocks> pitti: I can try this, let me first check in the code why it was dep on it
<pitti> didrocks: it seems it doesn't binary-depend on libgnome-window-settings0
<didrocks> pitti: seems it will remove the g-c-c integration
<pitti> so it might be an obsolete b-dep?
<didrocks> gtk/CMakeLists.txt deps on it though
<rschroder> hi
<pitti> didrocks: so it doesn't use the library, just a file from the -dev?
<pitti> didrocks: might that be in libgnome-control-center-dev or gnome-control-center-dev now?
<didrocks> pitti: I'm wondering, the thing is that compiz is making a lot of dlopen, hence the fact we shouldn't rely on the linked deps. Let me look a llittle bit more
<pitti> oh
<didrocks> libgnome-window-settings-dev provides it
<didrocks> if I only look for the pc file
<RAOF> robert_ancell: The final candidate would be the kernel, I guess.
<robert_ancell> duh, duh, duhhh!!!
<rschroder> i had an french keyboard layout; changed to us (via dpkg-reconfigre console-setup), then I wanted to have the â¬ symbol on altgr+5, I set it up in gnome-keyboard-properties, then I changed back to french layout (delete the USA in kb-properties as well) and I deleted the â¬ symbol config. I works in gnome, but it doesn't work on the ttys or fluxbox (by "doesn't work" I mean still â¬ symbol on 5). Btw: when applying the default values in gnome
<rschroder> -keyboard-properties, the â¬ symbol on 5 is again configured in gnome. I somehow feel that I could work it out by changing the default values in gconf?
<didrocks> pitti: I'm starting to wonder if this is necessary, USE_GNOME_KEYBINDINGS should be enough alone IMHO
<didrocks> pitti: it seems it's the integration with g-c-c to automatically pick the new settings when changing a key in the ui. It's at most deprecated then
<pitti> didrocks: that's for the keyboard accelerator capplet, or which "key"?
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, it was for the keyboard acc capplet, like activate zoom, workspace change key, and suchâ¦
<pitti> RAOF: libgl1-mesa-dri-experimental libgl1-mesa-dri-experimental-dbg want to go to universe; do they still have a purpose these days, now that the 3D drivers are in the main package?
<pitti> robert_ancell: in case you fall asleep soon, would it be ok to set vt=7 in lightdm.conf at least as a workaround for alpha-2?
<pitti> (I can do an upload for that if necessary)
<robert_ancell> pitti, I uploaded 0.4.2, is it blocked?
<pitti> robert_ancell: oh, does that fix bug 802271? the changelog doesn't say so
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 802271 in lightdm "Characters sent to tty1" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/802271
<robert_ancell> pitti, well, I *think* it does, but I don't have a reliable Plymouth to test it on
<pitti> ah, ok; will try it then
<RAOF> pitti: Oh, yeah.  Those were in main because we wanted to have them jockey-able on the livecd, right?  They're perfectly suited to universe now.
<hrw> hi
<hrw> did someone has a situation when evolution remembers all email accounts but folder list does not show some of them?
<hrw> imapx accounts
<robert_ancell> pitti, heading off now, if the new version fixes it and gets into A2 then great, otherwise please make the vt=7 change.  Thanks!
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I'll see if I can reproduce your issue on my own radeon system.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, cheers.
<rodrigo_> morning
<didrocks> hey rodrigo_
<seb128> hey
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> (sorry, having internet issues today there)
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> seb128: quite a bit better, thanks! how about yourself?
<seb128> I'm great thanks
<rodrigo_> hi didrocks, seb128, pitti
<didrocks> hey seb128
<seb128> hey rodrigo_ didrocks
<fta2> hi guys
<fta2> seb128, http://people.ubuntu.com/~fta/compiz-memory.png
<seb128> hey fta2
<didrocks> salut fta2
<fta2> seb128, between 23:00 and 6:30, and after ~7:00, the desktop was idle.
<seb128> fta2, without indicator-multiload right?
<seb128> didrocks, I should rather ask there, how is unity today?
<seb128> did anybody upgrade yet?
<chrisccoulson>  i'm running the latest version
<didrocks> seb128: not sure, people on forum are telling it's working :)
<stgraber> I upgraded yesterday, seems to work here (didn't really see any difference)
<didrocks> no issue noticed there
<chrisccoulson> same here
<njpatel> seb128, fta leak with indicator-multiload?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you? how is your unity? ;-)
<njpatel> I thought we fixed that....
<fta2> seb128, right. just before 7:00, i stopped evo, liferea and chromium (all were running during the night)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, good thanks. and unity is fine ;)
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> njpatel, he said he's lower without indicator-multiload but still an issue
<njpatel> seb128, sure, -multiload is just exacerbating the situation
<fta2> njpatel, no, indicator-multiload was not running during this period (but it was before, and the leak was worse)
<seb128> njpatel, right, you fixed it, my guess is that tim's refactoring in r1208 leaks again
<seb128> njpatel, I will try to valgrind it today
<seb128> desrt, hey there
<fta2> btw, it's the same at work, using x64. compiz is huge
<njpatel> seb128, fta2 thanks for the work, I'll make sure to also take a look this week to see if I can spot the issue
<pitti> seb128: do you know whether we still actually need the seahorse-plugins source? it seems quite obsolete, and the only recent upstream commits are translations
<seb128> pitti, not sure if there is anything useful left for some users but we don't need it in main for sure
<pitti> seb128: it's not even installable right now
<seb128> pitti, right, doing a git snapshot would fix that
<pitti> ah, ok; demoting to universe for nwo
<seb128> pitti, we have a ton of things that "could be fixed", I don't think we should spend our cycle fixing those though
<seb128> like things that need porting to gtk3
<pitti> seb128: right, I wondered whether we should remove the source
<pitti> or demote
<seb128> or to the new gnome-applet api
<seb128> pitti, you can't drop it and we will bring it back if somebody is wanting to work on it
<pitti> I don't care about seahorse-plugins, I just stumbled over it on the NBS list
<seb128> or if debian updates it
<pitti> as it's the main package with the most NBS depends
<seb128> didrocks, btw the day you get bored (if that happens), do you want to update gnome-session to 3.1?
<seb128> didrocks, there seems to not be a lot of changes so it might be easy
<seb128> (note the "seems" and "might" ;-)
<fta2> i still have a metacity & g-s-d crash in gdm, followed by a new e-addressbook-factory crash after login
<didrocks> seb128: hum, I'll do it this week then, a day I feel lukcy :)
<didrocks> lucky*
<seb128> didrocks, thanks ;-)
 * didrocks thinks we should get someone on the server team on the MIR team, reviewing my 10th server team MIR request in a few dayâ¦
<fta2> Title: e-addressbook-factory crashed with SIGSEGV in g_type_check_instance_cast()
<fta2> somewhere in gio/gdbusconnection.c
<Sweetshark> Morning all!
<pitti> hey Sweetshark
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: Hey, you might be able to helpâ¦ what would be the canonical way of extracting data from Firefox (bookmarks, mainly)?
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, is this in the context of gnome-do? ;)
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: Could well be :)
<Sweetshark> As I feared the 3.3.3-4ubuntu1 build now breaks because of the jh_depends bug. I slept a night over it and it seems on first sight like none of the fixes introduced with debian revisions 2,3,4 are critical for us, so we might just SRU 1ubuntu1 for now. Reverting part of the changes again to get rid of the dep seems errorprone to me.
<Sweetshark> pitti: ^
<pitti> Sweetshark: ok, works for me
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, good question. i'm not sure there is one at the moment, without writing an extension to push the data out of firefox
<pitti> chrisccoulson: doesn't the apport hook already do some of this?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - not really. the apport hook figures out some things, such as, which extensions are installed
<chrisccoulson> but fetching bookmarks requires access to places.sqlite, which is locked whilst firefox is running
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: And an extension could be written that would (a) not be broken easily by firefox updates and (b) have access to the filesystem?
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, certainly the second one ;)
<chrisccoulson> the first one is a bit more tricky
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: Yeah.  We currently copy places.sqlite and then read the copy, but I'm sick of trying to keep it updated to database schema changes.
<chrisccoulson> the addon SDK will provide a stable interface for developing extensions which won't break during updates, but i'm not sure it has the API you need right now
<mpt> chrisccoulson, hi, I just clicked Firefox's Home button and got this: http://i.imgur.com/KXjiy.png
<chrisccoulson> wtf, i thought that was fixed :/
<chrisccoulson> mpt - which version are you running?
<mpt> chrisccoulson, 5.0
<mpt> chrisccoulson, 5.0+build1+nobinonly-0ubuntu0.11.04.2
<chrisccoulson> mpt - what does "browser.startup.homepage" in about:config?
<mpt> chrisccoulson, "about:startpage" (as, coincidentally, can be seen in the screenshot)
<chrisccoulson> mpt - does it say "default" or "user set" in the status column?
<mpt> chrisccoulson, default
<chrisccoulson> that's quite confusing, it should be impossible :/
<chrisccoulson> when did it start?
<chrisccoulson> did you run a nightly in your profile btw?
<mpt> chrisccoulson, I first noticed it this morning, but I think that might be the first time I've ever used Firefox's home button
<chrisccoulson> oh, forget that, i'm looking at the wrong tab
<mpt> chrisccoulson, I have never run a Firefox nightly that I know of
<chrisccoulson> does it happen every time you click on the home button?
<mpt> (since installing this Ubuntu)
<mpt> chrisccoulson, yes, happens every time
<chrisccoulson> mpt - is there anything in the error console?
<mpt> chrisccoulson, when I click Home, one new thing appears in the error console: "Invalid chrome URI: /"
<chrisccoulson> mpt - does it give a filename/line number?
<mpt> chrisccoulson, no, that's all it says
<mpt> chrisccoulson, I figured it out. It seems to be a bug in the "New Tab King" extension
<chrisccoulson> ah :)
<chrisccoulson> i should have asked you if you had any extensions first ;)
<mpt> With the "Ubuntu Firefox Modifications" extension disabled, I get similar symptoms but with much less text
<mpt> With UFM enabled but NTK disabled, I don't get the problem at all
<mpt> Sorry for the false alarm
<mvo> hrm, hrm, so gir is not for the faint of heart â¦ I wonder why Gst-1.0.gir has gst_bus_set_sync_handler as introspectable="0" and what the alternative is
<chrisccoulson> mpt, no problem
<chrisccoulson> it's definitely a bug in that extension btw, it reads the homepage pref incorrectly
<chrisccoulson> it uses getCharPref when it should be getComplexValue
<didrocks> pitti: I think I have a compiz version without the NBS build-deps. (but still shipping the needed .desktop file for session startup). Do you think it's better to wait fo post alpha2 to upload it?
<pitti> didrocks: yes, it's not urgent
<pitti> didrocks: thanks!
<didrocks> pitti: yw :)
<desrt> seb128: pong
<seb128> desrt, hey
<seb128> desrt, do you have any clue if bugs like bug #805797 are glib, gtk or nautilus issues?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 805797 in nautilus "nautilus crashed with SIGSEGV in ffi_prep_args()" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805797
<desrt> ouch
<desrt> seb128: i recommend asking david
<mvo> is it just me or is library.gnome.org in a not very good state? search not working, can't find GdkWindow in gtk3 all in all, not very pleasent
<desrt> i assume this is a straight C programming situation?
<seb128> mvo, you should ask on #gnome-hackers, it's supposed to work
<seb128> desrt, yes, it's using standard nautilus
<desrt> seb128: so the use of ffi is probably the generic marshallers.  ask david.
<seb128> desrt, jibel said he gets it while renaming and using non standard char keys
<desrt> fascinating.
<seb128> desrt, will ask david, thanks
<jml> good morning
<seb128> hey jml
<jml> hi :)
<didrocks> pitti: so, basically, libsqlite0 is sqlite2 if I understand correctly, right?
<pitti> didrocks: correct
<didrocks> pitti: ok, sounds easy enough, just need then a rebuild of kubuntu-full without the dep on the qt sqlite2 package + removing the build option
<didrocks> will discuss that with scottk and prepare the change for post alpha2
<pitti> didrocks: I updated the kubuntu seeds
<pitti> didrocks: thanks!
<didrocks> yw ;)
<didrocks> pitti: oh nice!
<pitti> meh @ seeding libraries
<didrocks> yeah, sounds weirdâ¦
<didrocks> I didn't get why kubuntu-full deps on everything instead of just all applications
<pitti> chrisccoulson: do you plan an upload of firefox-globalmenu anytime soon? it depends on the NBS libdbusmenu-glib3 libdbusmenu-gtk3
<seb128> pitti, those are not going away until we fix json-glib to build on armel
<seb128> then build libdbusmenu
<seb128> then rebuild all the indicators
<pitti> ah, those are on armel only
<pitti> amd64, too
<seb128> it's all blocked on the json-glib armel ftbfs
<pitti> ok, thanks
<seb128> I pinged Janimo during the rally about it
<seb128> he said he would have a look
<seb128> rodrigo_, do you plan to upload g-c-c today? you should probably patch out the online account thing first, it's going to take a bit to get promoted etc
<seb128> well packaged first, reviewed, accepted, mir-ed etc
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, just almost done with g-o-a
<rodrigo_> but yes, need to disable that in g-c-c
<seb128> ok
<seb128> let me know if you need reviews
<rodrigo_> yes, I will
<rodrigo_> I need some help now, I had to add a patch, and it's not getting applied
<pitti> seb128, rodrigo_: (just keep the alpha-2 freeze in mind -- no breakage/new dependencies/uninstallability please )
<rodrigo_> so, having debian/source/format is enough, right?
<seb128> pitti, yes, I do, I refrained to upload GNOME 3.1.3 libs
<rodrigo_> pitti, ok, will upload g-c-c then with the online accounts disabled
<seb128> pitti, g-c-c is the settings shell ui nowadays, shouldn't break anything
<pitti> thanks
<seb128> it's a standalone piece of software
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes, will upload g-o-a and the dep on g-c-c just after alpha2 then
<pitti> uploading fixes etc. is fine
<pitti> yay, new lightdm fixes the 'starts on vt1' issue \o/
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i uploaded firefox last night, but it hung the builders
<chrisccoulson> and then timed out
<pitti> eww :/ on a test case again?
<pitti> should we try a rebuild?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, on a test case
<chrisccoulson> i'll upload again with the problematic test removed. it actually causes a massive memory leak in firefox here
<rodrigo_> hmm, how do I add other project tasks to a bug? 'also affects project' just lets me add an upstream bug
<rodrigo_> ah, 'also affects distribution' , right?
<pitti> rodrigo_: upstream bugs are for projects
<pitti> rodrigo_: "also affects distribution" is for another ubuntu package
<rodrigo_> ok, that's what I wanted, yes :)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, it's pretty bad that we cause a crashtest to fail by leaking memory and then crashing. i hope we haven't regressed the original bug somehow :/
<rodrigo_> pitti, I'm about to submit g-c-c with the external panels thing, so I've added tasks for all the projects we want a panel for, except for language-selector, which I think should be replaced by the region panel, which is about to get all the stuff we need
<rodrigo_> pitti, so, if you can think of any other project that needs to be added, let me know please
<didrocks> desrt: hey, how can I get you making a nice and beautiful upstream tarball for dconf-qt so that I can sneak that into oneiric?
<pitti> rodrigo_: thanks
<rodrigo_> seb128, did you have time to look at the evo-rss branch for http://launchpad.net/bugs/773763 ?
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 773763 in evolution-rss "evolution freeze on startup with the plug-in "evolution-rss"" [High,In progress]
<seb128> rodrigo_, can do after lunch
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, no hurry, just want to see my bugcount low down a bit, after last week's pedro's and jean baptiste's madness :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> rodrigo_, you should do a g-c-c bug fixing day this week ;-)
<seb128> lunch there
<seb128> bbl
<rodrigo_> it's g-c-c bug fixing day every day for me :)
<chrisccoulson> can we have a firefox bug fixing day too?
<chrisccoulson> to fix all the failing reftests in the test suite :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: feedback after a day using thunderbird: I'm quite pleased with it, apart from the indicator stuff, I'm just disappointed about regular ui freeze and not really integrated with the ubuntu theme. Apart from that, it's nice :)
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, maybe a joint one for both g-c-c and thunderbird?
<rodrigo_> and firefox
<didrocks> (and the fact that you can destroy all your emails in two regular clicks)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, cool, thanks. the indicator stuff will definitely be improving (the current implementation is fairly young)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, the theme will also be getting a refresh, as per these mockups: http://www.andreasn.se/blog/?p=172
<didrocks> oh andreas' mockup will make it upstream? nice! :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i think he's working on that
<didrocks> excellent :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, how did you destroy your e-mails? that seems like something we should try and fix :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti, ok, firefox reuploaded again now
<chrisccoulson> will hopefully build this time ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: did you disable the test?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i just switched off all the crashtests for now. i can't disable individual tests without patching them out
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: basically, I ran Tools-> Run Junk Mail controlâ¦
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: it marked almost all my email in inbox as spam, which isn't the case
<didrocks> so, seeing that, I wanted to remove the mark before the junk put in the trash
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, hmm, is that reproducible?
<chrisccoulson> actually
<chrisccoulson> you probably don't want to try it again ;)
<didrocks> and I misread tools->Delete Emails Marked as junk in folder as "Delete Marked as junk in folder"
<didrocks> yeah ;)
<didrocks> well imap shouldn't delete emails, I got them back with evolution, just "mark as deleted"
<didrocks> but still, having everything marked as junk, even email people just send to me is weird
<didrocks> can it be because my system is in French and all emails in english and so, it tries to be too clever?
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure how that stuff works
<didrocks> wasâ¦ frigthening :)
<tjaalton> banshee in oneiric doesn't listen to media keys?
<seif> didrocks, around?
<didrocks> seif: yes
<seif> 2 issues
<seif> where is john
<hrw> cjwatson: debootstrap hack for bug 802985 provided as debdiff - take a look
<didrocks> seif: seems that John is on holidays for the other discussion
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 802985 in eglibc "[lucid] /var/lib/dpkg/tmp.ci/preinst: 399: arithmetic expression: expecting EOF: "3.0-0-generic"" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/802985
<didrocks> seif: so we can wait mid July maybe?
<seif> didrocks, sure thing
<seif> i will finish the stuff to be just a matter of glueing
<seif> didrocks, question 2
<didrocks> seif: excellent ;)
<seif> who do i go to to talk abotu the "volume buttons" on my thinkpad not working anymore ?
<seb128> hrw: you might want to use #ubuntu-devel for non desktop issues
<didrocks> seif: I would tell it's a kernel issue? so #ubuntu-kernel?
<hrw> seb128: ops. got name of channel shorted
<didrocks> can be g-s-d as well of course
<stgraber> seif: on Oneiric since the last update?
<seif> stgraber, yes sir
<stgraber> I have 5 days uptime on my laptop (x201s) and got that issue since my last logout/login
<stgraber> so I'm fairly sure it's not kernel
<didrocks> it's working there, well still not picking the right iconâ¦
<stgraber> didrocks: anything I can do to debug the issue?
<stgraber> didrocks: I correctly see XF86AudioLowerVolume and XF86AudioRaiseVolume in xev
<didrocks> stgraber: apart from xev, I have absolutely no idea on how to debug that, let me check of my pending updates first
<seif> stgraber, i am sure its not kernel too
<stgraber> seif: if you run "xev", do you also see XF86AudioLowerVolume and XF86AudioRaiseVolume?
<seif> because i can click them and see in they keyboard thingie their assignment
<seif> KeyPress event, serial 32, synthetic NO, window 0x3a00001,
<seif>     root 0xad, subw 0x0, time 444224, (585,268), root:(587,381),
<seif>     state 0x0, keycode 123 (keysym 0x1008ff13, XF86AudioRaiseVolume), same_screen YES,
<seif>     XLookupString gives 0 bytes:
<seif>     XmbLookupString gives 0 bytes:
<seif>     XFilterEvent returns: False
<seif> KeyRelease event, serial 32, synthetic NO, window 0x3a00001,
<didrocks> stgraber: seif: hum, I have a g-s-d pending update, let me try
<seif>     root 0xad, subw 0x0, time 444375, (585,268), root:(587,381),
<seif>     state 0x0, keycode 123 (keysym 0x1008ff13, XF86AudioRaiseVolume), same_screen YES,
<seif>     XLookupString gives 0 bytes:
<tjaalton> xev shows those just fine, dconf has them, but at least banshee doesn't listen to them
<seif>     XFilterEvent returns: False
<seif> stgraber, the whole DE does not listen to them
<seb128> pitti, why did you drop gnome-pilot from oneiric?
<tjaalton> btw, upgrade from natty removed mp3 support etc
<stgraber> ok, I have the same thing as seif here. I see the events coming through just fine but don't get the notify-osd thingy nor any change of volume on my system
<seif> stgraber, yes exactly
<tjaalton> I was about to file a bug about that
<tjaalton> should I still do that?
<tjaalton> about the media keys
<didrocks> let me first check with upgrading g-s-d
<didrocks> (taking time while building qt source package, poor laptopâ¦)
<didrocks> stgraber: seif tjaalton: confirm, latest g-s-d update is guilty
<tjaalton> didrocks: thanks
<seb128> it's rodrigo_'s fault again!
<tjaalton> I also filed a crasher on the login against g-s-d
<seb128> likely a duplicate of some of the recents ones
<tjaalton> yep
<didrocks> rodrigo_: I'm afraid you have additional incoming work ;)
<rodrigo_> my fault? again? :-)
<tjaalton> funny that lp didn't suggest one
<rodrigo_> didrocks, no problem
<tjaalton> though it did for metacity
<didrocks> rodrigo_: I just confirm that keybinding for volume sounds don't work after your last update
<tjaalton> anyone with a synaptics touchpad and willing to test an update?
<seif> tjaalton, i have one
<tjaalton> seif: you had alps :)
<tjaalton> no wait
<tjaalton> not sure which one it was, seb128 had alps
<seif> what is alps
<tjaalton> touchpad vendor
<tjaalton> you have synaptics, let me prepare a package. 32 or 64bit?
<seb128> rodrigo_, the g-s-d update broken multimedia keys it seems
<seb128> -n
<rodrigo_> didrocks, ok
<rodrigo_> seb128, didrocks: just assign the bugs to me, getting my queue cleaned up quickly, now that both g-s-d and g-c-c 3.1.3 are in
<seb128> tjaalton, seif: ^
<seb128> get a bug open and give us the number
<tjaalton> ok, filing
<fta2> hm, my custom key bindings are broken
<didrocks> fta2: maybe linked to that ^
<fta2> didrocks, i used to have XF86Calculator bound to lock screen
<didrocks> fta2: probably the same issue (see the scrollbar for the last 15 minutes)
<didrocks> scrollback*
<desrt> didrocks: can't you build from git?
<didrocks> desrt: sure, but I was thinking that you prefer doing a tarball. building from git and creating myself a tarball is fine (for pushing in oneiric)
<didrocks> desrt: btw, any reason you don't provide any .pc file?
<desrt> i guess i'd prefer that, in fact
<seb128> desrt, is there anything that could be blocking in gtkapplication unique apis?
<desrt> seb128: how do you mean?
<seb128> desrt, gedit hangs sometimes when being run there
<desrt> :(
<fta2> didrocks, I read it. xev sees the KeyPress & KeyRelease events for this key
<desrt> seb128: do you have a backtrace to the hang?
<didrocks> fta2: so yeah, should be the same issueâ¦ subsribe to tjaalton's bug once filed
<desrt> didrocks: dconf-qt is intended to be used dynamically from QML, so i don't know that a .pc file makes sense
<fta2> ok
<desrt> the API is *really* poorly suited to C++
<didrocks> desrt: only for qml so? We shouldn't ship the .h?
<desrt> didrocks: i guess not
<didrocks> fine with me :)
<seb128> desrt, it's pretty weird behaviour
<desrt> depends on how they intended to use it
<desrt> but i think they will use only QML
<desrt> as for the tarball, if you want to package out of git, i think that is best
<seb128> desrt, strace blocks there, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/638363/
<didrocks> we can first head for QML, and see after if larger use case is needed
<tjaalton> rodrigo_: bug 805908
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 805908 in gnome-settings-daemon "multimedia keys not working" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805908
<desrt> i don't know what the proper methods are for producing a tarball using qmake are
<didrocks> desrt: ok, I'll do that, no worry. Thanks a lot :)
<desrt> seb128: did you package a new glib after my mucking around?
<seb128> desrt, running gdb gedit, (gdb) run leads gedit to exit
<rodrigo_> didrocks, ok
<desrt> it appears not.
<rodrigo_> sorry, tjaalton: ok
<desrt> we didn't release a new one
<seb128> desrt, no, it's 2.29.8
<seb128> desrt, I've the issue since I'm on oneiric
<desrt> okay.  rules out one possibility :)
<seb128> it just annoys me enough that I want to figure what is going on
<seb128> gedit runs fine from unity
<seb128> or with sudo
<desrt> okay.  i'm confused.
<seb128> but run from a command line (g-t) it hangs
<desrt> what has gedit to do with multimedia keys?
<desrt> oh.  wrong url.
<desrt> nevermind :)
<seb128> desrt, that bug was not for you ;-)
<seb128> desrt, not sure why running "gedit" leads to loading its .desktop
<pedro_> hello folks!
<seb128> but that's where it hangs
<rodrigo_> hey pedro_
<seb128> pedro_, hola!
<pedro_> gedit bug?
<desrt> seb128: no.  that's what happens just before it hangs :)
<seb128> desrt, the strace log you mean?
<desrt> the reading the desktop file
<desrt> it could be entirely unrelated since the poll is almost certainly back in the mainloop again
<desrt> hm
<desrt> i wonder if this has to do with the eventfd thing that colin did
<desrt> ricotz was seeing random periodic lockups due to that, iirc
<seb128> desrt, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/638371/
<desrt> like, it wasn't waking the mainloop properly
<seb128> gdb attached to the process shows it's sitting in pool
<seb128> like if it was running
<seb128> but not ui is ever displayed
<desrt> yes.  of course.
<seb128> if I run a gedit from unity it does attach to it
<desrt> it's probably waiting for a dbus reply or something
<seb128> i.e open a tab
<seb128> right
<seb128> which made me things about gtkapplication
<seb128> (the dbus reply)
<desrt> could be.
<seb128> think
<desrt> but that code is uncomplicated and hasn't changed in a while
<seb128> any clue how I could debug that?
<seb128> it will do it until a session restart no
<seb128> now
<desrt> is this before or after the eventfd change that was causing problems on the builders?
<seb128> can I unset an environement or try something?
<seb128> desrt, before, I don't think we got a tarball since the eventfd thing
<desrt> hmm
<seb128> ricotz was just snapshoting git
<desrt> suspicious
<seb128> lool was having a similar issue at the rally, I should have grabbed you for debugging there :-(
<desrt> indeed
<seb128> what I don't get is why it start happening sometimes and is broken for the session run
<seb128> is there a server side that could be screwed?
<seb128> like is it trying to contact a session service?
<lool> isn't that the xauth list thing?
<desrt> ahhhh
<seb128> lool, well, I don't think so, it doesn't do it consistently there
<lool> "xauth list" times out here, it can't create a lock in the lightdm dir
<desrt> could be gnome-session is wedged
<seb128> lool, it works most of the time but sometimes it get screwed
<lool> oh I can run gedit again
<seb128> and it doesn't unscrew until I restart my session
<desrt> i've seen the problem before that gnome-session crashes and causes all apps to hang when they try to do session management registration
<desrt> s/crashes/wedges/
<lool> desrt: yeah, lsat week gedit was hanging on startup as well as other apps; it could well have been session mgmt; it's working today though
<lool> (I rebooted a couple of times in the mean time)
<desrt> i bet it's session management
<seb128> could well be
<seb128> what else out of gedit is trying to register to the session?
<lool> seb128 and I had looked at strace and gdb, but it wasn't terribly inspiring
<seb128> lool, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/638371/
<seb128> lool, that's a strace
<seb128> gdb shows normal polling
<seb128> like if it was running
<cdbs|web> seb128: pitti: What's GCC doing on the Oneiric LiveCD?
<stgraber> required for dkms
<seb128> cdbs|web, what stgraber said
<cdbs|web> stgraber: When did dkms get on the cd?
<seb128> useful to build drivers
<cdbs|web> I don't think it was there for natty
<desrt> seb128: find out what gnome-session is doing meantime
<lool> seb128: what's fd 3?
<cdbs|web> remember having to install it manually
<seb128> desrt, I've no real clue how to debug gnome-session...
<seb128> vuntz, hey -)
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> seb128: attach gdb and backtrace it
<desrt> if i am correct you will find it somewhere other than the mainloop
<lool> desrt: there's a --sm-client-disable flag which might allow startup and prove that it's sm related?
<desrt> lool: ah yes.  good call.
<desrt>  /k dbarth vacation!
<seb128> still handing with --sm-client-disable
<desrt> hmm.
<seb128> gdb is not useful
<seb128> but I doubt it's the session
<seb128> I can run gedit from unity
<seb128> like alt-f2 gedit works
<desrt> so back to wondering about GApplication, i suppose
<didrocks> cdbs|web: hey, where are you with the "integrate to unity" spec?
<dbarth> desrt: i'm not there, you don't see me ;)
<cdbs|web> didrocks: Yeah, I didn't tell you recently about it
<cdbs|web> didrocks: wasn't able to hop on the internet for a while
<cdbs|web> didrocks: my laptop broke down, I'll do most of them in A3
<desrt> seb128: the fact that it begins to happen and then continues until logout makes me doubt GApplication just because it doesn't hold that sort of state
<cdbs|web> didrocks: I'll implement that thing in brasero today/tomorrow, the rest in A3
<cdbs|web> BLAME DELL
<seb128> desrt, ok, could be gnome-session, I'm just puzzled about why it runs from unity and not from a command line
<vuntz> desrt: mmh?
<vuntz> err, that was for seb128 :-)
<didrocks> cdbs|web: sounds good, bad for your laptop though:/
<cdbs|web> didrocks: yeah, just got it back after 2 weeks, with a non-working USB port now :(
<cdbs|web> problems after problems
<pitti> cdbs|web: uh, thanks for pointing out -- dkms and gcc are indeed not supposed to be on the cd
<seb128> vuntz, is there any way to see if a client application hangs in session talks?
<cdbs|web> pitti: I was surprised to find gcc already installed when I just installed oneiric again
<seb128> vuntz, gedit refuses to start from a command line sometimes there until I restart my session
<cdbs|web> pitti: Was it part of a plan to put the drivers on the cd?
<pitti> cdbs|web: no, it wasn't
 * pitti checks germinate
<cyphermox> howdy
<pitti> cdbs|web: dkms isn't on the CDs
<pitti> cdbs|web: wait, that doesn't seem to be a recent change
<cyphermox> pitti, could you please look at bug 765847, I uploaded to -proposed, the updated package is now waiting in queue
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 765847 in nautilus-sendto "Send to Email is missing on Natty" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/765847
<pitti> cdbs|web: in earlier oneiric we had the full build-essential, which took some extra 10 MB
<pitti> now it just seems to be gcc
<vuntz> seb128: well, you can always run gnome-session --debug and look at the gnome-session debut output
<cdbs|web> hmm
<seb128> vuntz, I don't want to restart my session, it will work again! ;-)
<pitti> cdbs|web: but yes, it's certainly something we can take out
<cdbs|web> Removing GCC might well reduce the CD size to 701 MB for now
<cdbs|web> (I guess)
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<cdbs|web> 2 more MBs to go :)
<pitti> cdbs|web: we will hopefully have 703 MB media this time
<didrocks> desrt: your headers are with invalid fsf adress FYI :)
<vuntz> seb128: then gedit might have something to print debug output?
<vuntz> seb128: but no idea without looking at the code
<seb128> vuntz, ok, I will debug, I just wanted to know if you have any magic env variable or something you know about
<seb128> vuntz, thanks
<tjaalton> seif: http://koti.kapsi.fi/~tjaalton/tmp/xserver-xorg-input-synaptics_1.4.1-1ubuntu1_i386.deb
<didrocks> desrt: just a silly question, but is there any reason that you ship LPGL3 (which works for your LGPL3 and LGPL2+ files of course), but as well a GPL3 COPYING where I don't see any file using it?
<desrt> don't remember
<desrt> something about how the de facto licencing model of canonical is along these lines?
<desrt> i think i followed what dbusmenu was doing
<didrocks> desrt: not sure, we have LPGL3 for other qml/qt bindings
<didrocks> desrt: care of removing the additional COPYING file? I can propose a merge request, but it's a little overkill for just a removalâ¦
<didrocks> as all headers of everyfile are LGPL3, should be enough :)
<desrt> dbarth: an opinion on what is correct here?
<desrt> didrocks: is the problem because Qt itself is only licenced under a specific version?
<didrocks> desrt: you don't copy any Qt LGPL2 (only) file from what I see, so not the same issue with sni-qt
<dbarth> desrt: not really, but ted has a good understanding of that and will tell what's required to change if needed
<desrt> i guess he'll be online soon
 * Sweetshark lunches
<seb128> pedro_, your previous picture was better!
<pedro_> seb128, which picture? aah jabber?
<didrocks> desrt: so, last word, no -dev for libdconf-qt for now?
 * mterry waves hi
<pedro_> so who is our gnome-screensaver wizard? :-)
<desrt> didrocks: seems correct.
<didrocks> let's do that then ;)
<pedro_> bug 762918 is affecting 'lot' of users
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 762918 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "Natty Screensaver freezes system after some period of inactivity" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/762918
<seb128> hey mterry, how are you?
<seb128> mterry, had a nice flight back?
<cyphermox> pedro_: cute.
<mterry> seb128, good.  yeah, it was fine
<mterry> Had a relaxing 4th as wel
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> pedro_, chrisccoulson is
<seb128> pedro_, seems like an xorg issue though?
<seb128> mterry, great ;-)
 * chrisccoulson hides
<seb128> mterry, happy patch piloting btw ;-)
<pedro_> seb128, i'm not sure that's why i'd like someone to have a better look
<seb128> mterry, I think your day was yesterday but your probably watched some fireworks while drinking a beer rather ;-)
<mterry> seb128, oh whoops, yeah, meant to move it then
<seb128> or whatever you guys do on a 4th of july ;-)
<pedro_> chrisccoulson, the g-s bug is going your way :-)
 * mterry goes and signs in
<mterry> seb128, we blow things up
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i'm really hungry
<chrisccoulson> but it's raining outside, and there is no food in the house
<chrisccoulson> the weather might be trying to tell me something!
<didrocks> mterry: quick sni-qt MIR ack btw? ;)
<mterry> didrocks, sure
<didrocks> thanks :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, it tells you "pick the phone and order a pizza"
<pitti> you can even order them via web! :-)
<pitti> (how did mankind survive before the internet??)
<tjaalton> pitti: I'd like to upload a new bugfix xserver and synaptics, is it ok?
<tjaalton> for alpha2 that is
<chrisccoulson> lol
<didrocks> mterry: thanks!
<kenvandine> morning folks
<didrocks> hey kenvandine
<seb128> hey kenvandine, had a nice 4th of july?
<seb128> nice trip back as well?
<kenvandine> seb128, wish i could say yes... i spent most of my weekend in and out of the hospital... daughter has a nasty infection
<seb128> :-(
<kenvandine> trip back was fine... but went straight to the hospital after getting picked up
<kenvandine> oh well, hopefully she'll be better soon
<seb128> sorry to hear
<kenvandine> seb128, i can post in gwibber now though :)
<seb128> how is she doing today? getting better?
<seb128> kenvandine, nice!
<kenvandine> not really... but the doctors said it might be today before we see any improvement
<kenvandine> so i am hopeful
<seb128> kenvandine, upload now if you want it in a2 ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, wish you luck
<kenvandine> seb128, nah... i need to wire up a couple things...
<kenvandine> maybe thursday, after a2 goes out
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, rushing for a2 didn't seem reasonable anyway ;-)
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> bah, that gedit handing on start is driving me mad, time to restart my session
<seb128> brb
<seb128> re
<pitti> tjaalton: yes, as long as it doesn't introduce new universe dependencies, or break ABI or something like that
<seb128> ok so it's GNOME 3.1.3 week, who is wanting to take on some updates?
<pitti> I'm the release engineer in charge, I'm afraid I can't take up things until Friday
<seb128> didrocks, chrisccoulson, cyphermox? ;-)
<cyphermox> aye aye
<seb128> mterry, want a libdbusmenu bug for this week?
<mterry> seb128, sure :)
<seb128> pitti, no worry, btw did you see my question 1 hour ago about gnome-pilot?
<seb128> cyphermox, can you take on bug #773847 and fix bug #374686 while you are on it?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 773847 in xchat-gnome "Consider merging xchat-gnome 0.30.0~git20100421.29cc76-1 from Debian unstable" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/773847
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 374686 in xchat-gnome "the desktop entry should be in the same binary than the software" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/374686
<pitti> cyphermox: sendto> will have a look
<seb128> cyphermox, then there is the evo stack
<cyphermox> sure, yup
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> seb128: g-pilot was removed in Debian
<didrocks> seb128: as told you, finishing some Qt things first, then, will do some
<seb128> mterry, bug #803667 and bug #743265 might be of interest
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 803667 in libdbusmenu "gwibber crashed with SIGSEGV in dbusmenu_gtk_parse_menu_structure()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/803667
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 743265 in freeciv "when using unity, the cities menu is not shown" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/743265
<pitti> seb128: and nobody cares about it in ubuntu, so I followed suit
<pitti> seb128: do you want to have it back?
<seb128> pitti, I did spend time recently to update it to the gtk3 version and clean the packaging
<seb128> pitti, I just wanted to know the rational for the drop since we had it ported to modern api etcs
<seb128> I don't use it or especially care
<pitti> seb128: ah, sorry; if you want it back, I'll re-upload it
<seb128> it just seemed weird since it was uptodate
<seb128> pitti, I can reupload, I just wanted to check if you have a solid reason
<seb128> or we can wait to see if somebody ask for it to be put back
<pitti> no bigger reason than "debian removed it"
<seb128> they had an outdated and buggy version indeed ;-)
<pitti> there was a lot of cruft that piled up, so I did a process-removals run this morning
<seb128> ok, I will check bugs if some users ask for it I will upload it again
<pitti> sorry about that then
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> thanks to you
<seb128> no worry
<tjaalton> pitti: thanks, yeah they are safe
<seb128> cyphermox, btw evolution segfaults in the itp formater code when opening google calendar email there
<seb128> cyphermox, did you notice that as well or bugs about it?
<cyphermox> no, and I heard you talking about it but it seems to work here?
<cyphermox> itp??
<cyphermox> I'll look at the bugs again anyway
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: speaking about that, what do you advise for google calendar integration with thunderbird?
<cyphermox> I'm starting to feel like my hardware might be magical too
<seb128> cyphermox, itip
<seb128> cyphermox, /usr/lib/evolution/3.2/plugins/liborg-gnome-itip-formatter.so
<cyphermox> ok
<seb128> not sure if it's enable by default but it was there
<seb128> turning it off workaround the issue
<cyphermox> alright
<seb128> rodrigo_, do you plan to do other updates? would probably be nice to do gnome-desktop3 and tomboy 1.7.1
<seb128> rodrigo_, debian has tomboy 1.7.0 so it might be easier to rebase on them for it
<seb128> rodrigo_, they don't need to be today
<seb128> cyphermox, rodrigo_, didrocks: don't forget to note the update you work on on the etherpad
<Laney> i'm going to do 1.7.1 rather soon
<didrocks> seb128: sure, will do
<seb128> Laney, thanks, you are not interested by doing the ubuntu merge by any chance? ;-)
<Laney> seb128: dunno. what's left these days?
<Laney> i'll be more interested in reducing it. :-)
<seb128> Laney, good question, probably not a lot we can get in debian
<seb128> Laney, it's mainly appindicator, launchpad integration, ubuntuone, langpacks
<Laney> urg
<Laney> the sync stuff is a horrible massive patch
<Laney> I'd really like it if that could be improved, possibly made into a separate source package providing the addin
<Laney> or upstreamed if that would work
<seb128> could be, I don't know enough about tomboy to say
<seb128> I doubt we will have free slot to do that before freezes though
<Laney> yeah, just saying
<seb128> don't bother with the merge then if you don't feel like doing it, we can rebase once you update in debian
<seb128> usually those patches just apply
<Laney> i'll have a look and let you know
<Laney> ayan: what happened with that SRU? Sorry I forgot to look :'(
<ayan> Laney: ugh -- i assigned it to the SRU team.  let me dig the link.
<ayan> s/ugh/uh/
<seb128> the SRU team doesn't do uploads
<seb128> if you need something uploaded you need to subscribe the sponsors
<seb128> (just sayingÃ 
<seb128> )
<Laney> IIRC it was waiting on proper SRU formatting last I looked
<Laney> rationale/regression risk/...
<ayan> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tomboy/+bug/667736
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 667736 in tomboy "help content not available" [Medium,In progress]
<Laney> ah, it's there
<ayan> this would be my first SRU -- please review the formatting.
<ayan> wow -- just realized some of the wording doesn't make sense...
<ayan> "... prevents users to utilize the tomboy notes help feature..."
<Laney> i'll fix the target to natty-proposed and build it
<fta2> kaboom, unity-panel-service crashed. infinite recursion in gtk_menu_shell_forall()..
<ayan> Laney, okay -- thanks.
<seb128> fta2, no need to comment about every bug you run into on IRC, we have a bug tracker for those ;-)
<fta2> seb128, i think will stop everything ubuntu related instead.
<fta2> yeah, i'll guess i'll do just that
<seb128> ...
<seb128> mterry, do you still work on your gdl update? did you start on it? can I take over it if you didn't start?
<mterry> seb128, oh yeah I got distracted.  You can take it over, sure, thanks
<seb128> mterry, thanks ;-) (I want to update anjuta)
<Laney> ayan: right then, uploading. thanks for the fix!
<ayan> Laney: thank you!
<kamusin> kenvandine, if you have some time could you check bug 789851 please :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 789851 in gwibber "Direct Messages don't work since July 1st, 2011" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/789851
<kenvandine> kamusin, saw your mail about that
<kenvandine> haven'
<kenvandine> t been able to comment
<pitti> hey kenvandine, good morning
<kenvandine> kamusin, working well here
<kamusin> kenvandine, awesome :)
<kenvandine> i made the changes needed to our app on twitter
<kenvandine> weeks ago
<kamusin> hmm weird.. in any case a fedora user have attached a patch that should work
<seb128> pitti, hum, usb-creator wants a password now, is that desktop-privilege... bug?
<pitti> seb128: we don't touch usb-creator in desktop-privileges
<pitti> but certainly a bug; not sure where yet
<seb128> ok, weird
<seb128> pitti, did you get it as well?
<seb128> the dialog says it was for the mount action
<pitti> I think yes, for grub writing and maybe also the mount/unmount
<seb128> ok, thanks
<mdeslaur> pitti: it's because of the fix for this: http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/usn-1127-1/
<pitti> ah, thanks
<pitti> mdeslaur: so we should now handle this in polkit-desktop-privs perhaps? (which already allows you passwordless mounting)
<mdeslaur> pitti: does it permit passwordless mounting and unmounting of internal disks?
<seb128> mdeslaur, thanks
<pitti> mdeslaur: yes
<didrocks> seb128: what's the magic with the .xz file btw? so that bzr bd likes me stdin?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, use the tar.bz2 one
<seb128> didrocks, I think bzr bd is buggy
<seb128> didrocks, we use the bz2 for GNOME
<didrocks> rodrigo_: ok, and symlink to the orig.tar.gz to take it I guess
<didrocks> ok, doing that :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, it converts to tar.gz itself, afaics
<didrocks> rodrigo_: it's doing that for unity, doesn't seem to do that if I don't symlink here
<mdeslaur> pitti: then yes, it could get added...though maybe not the grub modifying the bootloader part
<pitti> mdeslaur: yeah
<pitti> mdeslaur: for that it'd be nice if usb-creator would tell apart writing boot loaders to usb and to internal drives
<pitti> but at least that should reduce the password prompts from 3 to 1
<mdeslaur> pitti: yeah, that would make sense
<rodrigo_> didrocks, oh, not sure then, for the packages I've tried, it created the orig.tar.gz from the .bz2
<seb128> rodrigo_, didrocks: why do you need a .gz?
<seb128> those sources are still v1?
<rodrigo_> seb128, debian/source/format you mean?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> orig.bz2 works fine if you are source v3
<rodrigo_> 3.0 here, and it did it, afaics
<didrocks> seb128: still v1 for gnome-session
<seb128> didrocks, you should perhaps switch it to v3?
<didrocks> looking, yeah
<didrocks> it's v3 sorry
<seb128> didrocks, it's basically changing the format and dropping the quilt build-depends and rules line
<seb128> ok
<didrocks> weird, there is something in debian/watch which doesn't help it picking the right tarball, looking
<seb128> didrocks, is watch listed .gz still?
<seb128> didrocks, should be .bz2
<didrocks> seb128: I updated to bz2
<seb128> ok
<didrocks> and it's picking 3.0 bz2, not 3.1
<seb128> could be the wrong parenthesis use we had in most desktop watches
<seb128> or could be the debian variant listing the stable digits
<didrocks> it's not listing the stable digits
<didrocks> http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/gnome/sources/gnome-session/([\d\.]+)\d/gnome-session-([\d\.]+)\.tar\.gz
<didrocks> oupss
<didrocks> bz2 at the end
<didrocks> just reverted to start from scratch
<didrocks> so yeah http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/gnome/sources/gnome-session/([\d\.]+)\d/gnome-session-([\d\.]+)\.tar\.bz2 is picking gnome-session-3.0.2.tar.bz2
<didrocks> not 3.1.3, weird, let me try with kiki
<didrocks> nice, kiki tells me it shouldn't match any of those
<seb128> didrocks, drop the \d
<seb128> the one not in parenthesis
<seb128> before the filename
<didrocks> seb128: I'm puzzled, why did it work? it shouldn't match 3.0 then?
<seb128> because it's getting the archive version
<seb128> not the upstream one
<seb128> ?
<didrocks> seb128: I doubt it as I changed from .gz to .bz2 and see the new files for 3.0 tarballs
<seb128> ok, it's over my regexp foo
<seb128> or I'm being too lazy ;-)
<didrocks> ok, let's forget about it for now, kiki told that the previous regexp should work, it's enough to my regexp confidence :)
<didrocks> but the trick did it, thanks seb128!
<seb128> yw
<didrocks> ok, the build didn't get too far :)
<didrocks> seb128: easy update you told? had to refresh a patch, drop four and now ftbfs :p I won't trust you ;)
<seb128> heh
<seb128> didrocks, I said "seems" and "might" I think ;-)
<seb128> you never know with vuntz :p
<didrocks> seb128: indeed, fair enough :-)
<didrocks> hum, interesting, he took only some part of chrisccoulson's patch on autstart_delay ;)
<seb128> didrocks, git log suggest he didn't take anything for that?
<didrocks> seb128: he took something else for getting integer from desktop file, but names are exactly the same following egg naming schema
<didrocks> all is fine, just need to logout/login
<didrocks> test, brb
<didrocks> ok, looks good
<mterry> seb128, for comments like yours in https://code.launchpad.net/~dpolehn-gmail/ubuntu/oneiric/pygpiv/fix-755955/+merge/65157 , is your intention that you prefer to reject the patch and just send it to debian, or were you saying that you would accept it once it was also forwarded to debian?
<seb128> mterry, second one
<mterry> seb128, OK, I'll push then.  Didn't want to accept it if you had soft-rejected it already
<seb128> I don't think we should block on getting those in debian
<seb128> but I think we should block on getting those sent there otherwise that never happens
<mterry> seb128, yar
<mterry> seb128, if I'm sponsoring, I'll often just send to debian myself
<seb128> mterry, thanks, I meant to do a new round on those bugs to follow up but forgot with the rally
<mterry> seb128, meh, that's what pilots are for  :)
<seb128> that's another option, though I prefer having contributors to learn and do that themself rather than rely on us to do it
<seb128> but I guess it can make sense to do it once as an example to show how it's done
<mterry> seb128, I generally assume the extra back-and-forth cycle to request it is demotivating so try and avoid it.  BTW, will "lp:755955" in a changelog trigger an auto-close in LP?
<seb128> running compiz under valgrind is fail
<rodrigo_> does debian use packagekit?
<rodrigo_> that is, is it installed by default?
<seb128> no
<Laney> 'default' is always a bit tricky in Debian, since you get a lot more mix and matching
<Laney> if you need something, depend on it
<pitti> jasoncwarner, Sweetshark, bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, seb128, tkamppeter, pedro_: meeting reminder in 7 mins
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: seems that my thunderbird doesn't want to start at all for this session, reporting a stack
 * kenvandine waves
<pedro_> hello
<cyphermox> o/
<pitti> hello everyone
<pitti> jasoncwarner, Sweetshark, bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, seb128, tkamppeter, pedro_: meeting time
<tremolux> hey!
<chrisccoulson> w00t
<mterry> hello!
<seb128> hey
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, how did you break tbird? ;)
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-07-05
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: not sure, let's discuss after the meeting :)
<Sweetshark> heya
<rodrigo_> o/
<tremolux> I missed seeing all you guys in Dublin  :(
<tremolux> sounds like it was fun eh
<pitti> it was indeed
<kenvandine> tremolux, always :)
<chrisccoulson> tremolux, you didn't miss much. we didn't really drink guinness every night and eat steak ;)
<pitti> kenvandine: thanks for the partner update on the wiki!
<tremolux> hehe, I'm sure
<chrisccoulson> :-)
<tremolux> :D
<Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: did we really miss out on that on one day?
<pitti> kenvandine: sounds like the move to gsettings was very incomplete then?
<kenvandine> pitti, partner update on the wiki?
 * kenvandine didn't touch it yet :)
 * kenvandine goes to look
<pitti> oh, whoops, that was the unity update, sorry
<kenvandine> hehe
<pitti> kenvandine: so, IRC then :)
<kenvandine> pitti, indicator-power is ready to be packaged!
<kenvandine> i'll get on that real soon
<pitti> kenvandine: I'm confused about this a bit -- isn't it going to move into gnome-settings-daemon?
<kenvandine> pitti, and i never heard how your meeting went about the U1 release stuff
<pitti> so we won't use that after all, and instead use indicator-power?
<seb128> hum
<seb128> where is the partner update?
<pitti> what do we do in the classic session then?
<pitti> seb128: I mis-looked, ignore me
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> seb128, what will happen for power in the classic session?
<seb128> it will have no icon or indicator
 * kenvandine doesn't really know... but for unity we need one
<pitti> not shipping the g-s-d plugin sounds a bit bad to me -- can it live alongside indicator-power somehow?
<seb128> pitti, what moves in g-s-d is the service
<seb128> the icon is dropped in favor of a gnome-shell indicator
<pitti> ah
<seb128> or an system indicator in our case
<pitti> so i-power will actually talk to the g-s-d plugin?
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes, the indicator would use the g-s-d plugin
<seb128> or upower directly
<seb128> i.e dbus calls to get datas
<rodrigo_> just needs to call the new interface, which has changed name
<pitti> kenvandine: U1 release> I had a quick chat with Jason, but we didn't actually have a meeting about it which included me
<pitti> ah, great
<seb128> pitti, the indicator is just indicating infos it collects over dbus
<kenvandine> pitti, oh... ok, so we still don't know what the plan is...
 * kenvandine will get on them 
<kenvandine> that is all i have
<pitti> thanks
<pitti> didrocks: so, unity
<pitti> thanks for the wiki report
<didrocks> all is on the wiki, as usual :)
<pitti> didrocks: I'm a bit confused about the compizconfig comment
<didrocks> ok, so, basically, this is an issue with configuration management in compiz
<pitti> did that change recently?
<didrocks> like, you can't add new plugins to existing user (like unitydialog), even if they never touched their current settings
<didrocks> no, it's just that I did some unity --reset automatically at some point of the release last cycle
<pitti> aah
<didrocks> but now, unity depends on the gtk_init plugin
<pitti> didrocks: so we actually did have this problem in natty as well, it just didn't hurt us yet?
<didrocks> and compiz isn't able to add the gtk_init automatically
<didrocks> if we don't patch compiz, everyone will segfault
<pitti> i. e. compiz plugins can't have dependencies?
<didrocks> pitti: right
<didrocks> they can, but they are only resolved in ccsm
<didrocks> by the graphical interface
<didrocks> which is kind of weird for a project based on plugin, but well :)
<didrocks> so yeah, I try to convince dx to reshuffle their priorities for that
<didrocks> right now, the working is forcing compiz to call gtk_init in main() (for everyone then)
<didrocks> but that only works because we are the only one to use it and only in that case
<didrocks> will be nice in the future to be able to change the default plugin list if the user didn't touch it
<pitti> didrocks: the unity plugin can't call gtk_init()?
<pitti> I thought they were all in-process
<didrocks> pitti: right, but all plugins are dlopened
<didrocks> and now, unity and unity-dialogs are using gtk
<didrocks> and gtk_init doesn't support this case
<pitti> gtk_init() doesn't work from a dlopen()'ed lib?
<didrocks> if more than once are doing that, it results in a hang
<didrocks> (previous upstream tarball, hence the dialogs not being there before)
<pitti> didrocks: ok, at this point I think we should move the discussion to a bug report
<didrocks> pitti: we discussed about it with desrt at the sprint, it seems it's not something they want to support
<didrocks> but yeah, can be moved in a bug report if you prefer
<pitti> more time to ponder, and not 10 other people waiting in the meeting
<pitti> didrocks: nice progress on a11y!
<didrocks> yeah, was quite straightforward once the support was there :)
<pitti> tremolux: thanks for the s-c report; and great to read that gtk3 is now in trunk!
<pitti> tremolux: anything we need to discuss there? still blocked on design feedback?
<tremolux> pitti: yes, we don't have the full design yet, but we are planning it in stages best we can
<tremolux> pitti: juggling priorities gtk3/new design, etc.
<pitti> tremolux: bug 432552 is the remaining alpha-2 WI for the s-c blueprint
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 432552 in software-center "USC needs clearer/simpler icon" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/432552
<pitti> I figure it can easily move to a3, or do we have some pressure to squeeze that into a2?
<tremolux> pitti: ah, thanks, I should have moved that
<pitti> ok -> a3 now
<tremolux> pitti: no need to squeeze that to a2, it's coming
<tremolux> thanks!
<pitti> which brings us down to 7 WIs for a2
<pitti> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-default-email-client still has 4 left
<pitti> but 3 of which are actually the same: seb128, chrisccoulson, allison to discuss strategy for creating new Ubuntu One address book (on new install)
<pitti>  as this says "discuss", I figure it can stay on a2?
<pitti> it sounds as it might be a prerequisite for further upstream development
<pitti> chrisccoulson: and John still has "Review progress in styling improvements, provide guidance on further improvements needed" -> is that a blocker and should we prod him, or move to a3?
<seb128> pitti, john in on vac this week so a3 I guess
<seb128> dunno for the upstream discussion, I think chrisccoulson said that m_conley figured it out
<seb128> but he said he would check
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'll ask
<pitti> ok, we can bring this up in tomorrow's IRC meeting
<seb128> right
<pitti> then the remaining one is on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-gwibber-gtk3
<pitti> [ken-vandine] move dupe message detection to the backend: TODO
<pitti> doesn't sound like a blocker to me, but can happen in upstream trunk, I suppose?
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> that is really just blocked on design... sort of
<kenvandine> njpatel hasn't decided how we will present them, so i am holding off
<kenvandine> it will be quick to do when i know what to do :)
<kenvandine> pitti, i am going to upload the new gwibber right after a2
<pitti> ok, so we can just move that
<pitti> thanks!
<kenvandine> yeah
<pitti> anything else we need to discuss?
<kenvandine> nope
<pitti> kenvandine: oh, that's for "[njpatel] create update entry widget: TODO"?
<pitti> kenvandine: I was talking about the dupe detection
<kenvandine> i know
<kenvandine> i just merged his entry, so i'll mark that done
<kenvandine> unrelated items
<pitti> seb128: anythign to announce or discuss for gnome 3.1?
<seb128> not especially
<seb128> just "claim updates, note those on the etherpad, be careful about the freeze"
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> deal!
<seb128> joke aside there is quite some outdated lines on version
<seb128> so if anyone feels like claiming some updates this week please do
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, will do some in between g-c-c fixes :)
<seb128> oh, yeah, if you find any g-c-c bug assign those to rodrigo_ as well
<seb128> he's collecting them
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> so, meeting adjourned; thanks everyone!
<seb128> thanks
<kenvandine> thanks
<mterry> bye!
<seb128> ok, my a2 install just finished
<Sweetshark> pitti: let me just append the LO status
<pitti> ah, please go ahead
<tremolux> thanks everybody
<seb128> wouou it worked
<Sweetshark> also upstream LO broke small symbols (-g1), which currently leads to a 2GB -dbg package. It was cooperatively debuged with _rene_ from debian. This is intended to be included in debian tonight. As this was pretty much the last thing that blocked the debian 3.4.X release, we hopefully can base on that without making a 3.4.1-0ubuntu1 release.
<rodrigo_> seb128, hmm, I should have knocked more on your door, so that you couldn't sleep :)
<Sweetshark> libreoffice status: 3.3.3-1ubuntu1 is ready for SRUing, 3.3.3-2 to 3.3.3-4 includes debian changes we do not want in natty (requires new javahelper version). libreoffice-l10n-3.3.3-1ubuntu1 still has some open merge issues (work in progress). 3.4.0 status: I got a build finished on the weekend (without mono and kde and opensymbol for now). I am currently merging in debian changes which a) fix the mono, kde, opensymbol problems b) update to 
<seb128> rodrigo_, ;-)
<Sweetshark> also upstream LO broke small symbols (-g1), which currently leads to a 2GB -dbg package. It was cooperatively debuged with _rene_ from debian. This is intended to be included in debian tonight. As this was pretty much the last thing that blocked the debian 3.4.X release, we hopefully can base on that without making a 3.4.1-0ubuntu1 release and without postponing WIs.
<pitti> Sweetshark: sounds like good progress! so I guess it's sponsoring time soon?
<didrocks> reboot, brb
<Sweetshark> pitti: for 3.3.3? yes. I think I have fixed the -l10n merge issue, build is running currently.
<Sweetshark> pitti: However, I cant test very well for natty currently -- Im on oneiric with my notebook -- and I cant run VirtualBox on it (it is confused about kernel versions). I will try to do a some testing via X11-tunneling to my homebox, that will be sloooow.
<pitti> Sweetshark: if you have lots of RAM, you could also try to install the debs on a natty live system
<pitti> or using a live usb stick with a large persistency file
<pitti> but a chroot should do mostly fine, too
<Sweetshark> pitti: hmmm, 16GB RAM should be enough for everybody ...
<pitti> that ought to be enough indeed :)
<seb128> hum, deja-dup bugs!
<seb128> let's send some in mterry's way ;-)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: here is the crash I get now at each start: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/thunderbird/+bug/806041
<ubot2> didrocks: Error: <Bugtracker.plugin.Launchpad instance at 0x8d65a2c> bug 806041 not found
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, oh, that's not going to work :/
<chrisccoulson> apport doesn't process those
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh?
<didrocks> seems that's it's cycling between 3 functions
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, they go straight upstream with the crash reporter
<chrisccoulson> could you install thunderbird-dbg and run it in gdb (thunderbird -g)?
<didrocks> hum, I don't think this will scale with our users, but well :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: doing it
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, how did you manage to report that? we blacklist thunderbird and firefox in apport
<mterry> seb128, :)  bring 'em
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you didn't blacklist it hard enough it seems :)
<didrocks> just got the apport dialog
<seb128> mterry, I filed 2, but they are small ones, not "you screwed my datas!!!" ones
<mterry> seb128, excellent
<sagaci> desktop team meeting..?
<kamusin> I am trying to get a full backtrace from gwibber (related to bug 803667) but I can't find which is the package associated to _appindicator.so library.  this is how is looking the backtrace for now http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/638478
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 803667 in libdbusmenu "gwibber crashed with SIGSEGV in dbusmenu_gtk_parse_menu_structure()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/803667
<seb128> sagaci, one hour late
<seb128> sagaci, it just finished
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, got a stack, where should I report it?
<sagaci> yep yep, reading the calendar wrong, something about utc+1 you run on
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i don't mind.
<chrisccoulson> you can attach it to the bug if you like
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, doing :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: done. it seems to loop indefinitively in some functions
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, do you have any extensions installed?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: no, clean thunderbird
<didrocks> well, with the default we have
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=662634
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 662634 in JavaScript Engine "Firefox Crash [@ UnmarkGrayChildren ]" [Critical,New: ]
<didrocks> seems related :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: seems there is no --withoutjs
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, that wouldn't work ;)
<chrisccoulson> that would be like "--without-thunderbird" ;)
<didrocks> come on! :-)
<didrocks> seems the crasher is quite old though :/
<didrocks> first appearance is 2011022200 4.0b12
<didrocks> fixed in mozilla-central? (not sure what it means), if you need testingâ¦
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, you can try installing thunderbird-trunk from the ubuntu-mozilla-daily PPA (it's parallel installable)
<didrocks> Thunderbird Earlybird ?
<didrocks> hum no, the daily one
<didrocks> ok
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, do you have a bugzilla account too? could you comment on the bug saying that you can reproduce it
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: not sure I have one on the mozilla one, but can do
<didrocks> let me try running thunderbird-trunk first
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/85083c2d1f32
<chrisccoulson> the guys in #jsapi are fairly confident that one fixes it
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: yeah, the trunk is working (I had to retype my password, but apart from that, the config is picked on)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: so no need to comment on the bug?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, no, it's ok. i'll backport the patch to the current version
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you rock! :-)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, the thunderbird-trunk package is configured to use a separate profile by default, so you can run them side-by-side
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: seems to be the same profile to me (I tweaked the view to have emails summary and content side by side), or did it forked it at startup?
<didrocks> but based on the existing one?
<chrisccoulson> ah, yes
<chrisccoulson> we copy the thunderbird profile on first start ;)
<chrisccoulson> i forgot about that
<didrocks> that's why it was Ã¼ber slow :)
<didrocks> that's really nice!
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, it can take a while to copy the data
<chrisccoulson> maybe i should show a UI for that so you know it hasn't hung ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I straced to ensure it was really hurting my disk for good things :)
<chrisccoulson> but then, people running the nightlies should probably expect things to break a little
<chrisccoulson> heh
<didrocks> the thing is that now, I'll always think about Ninja Turtles when starting my thunderbirdâ¦
 * mterry should add a Ninja Turtle splash screen to deja-dup
<mterry> "Save your data from... the Shredder"
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> the shredder name is going away soon :(
<chrisccoulson> it's a shame, i liked "shredder" and "minefield"
<chrisccoulson> but minefield got renamed to "Nightly", and shredder will become "Daily"
<chrisccoulson> boring ;)
<Sweetshark> mterry: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kU4-t5lTsNs
<andreasn> Shredder is the best name ever
<Sweetshark> mterry: can we rename deja-dup to master splinter then?
<mterry> Sweetshark, you're late -- I was looking around for advice on a rename a while ago, but then decided not to bother
<andreasn> it's like "suuure, go ahead and trust your mail data to this daily build..."
<chrisccoulson> heh :-)
<dobey> does "guest session" not work in oneiric?
<didrocks> good night everyone
<seb128> dobey, on the login screen only
<seb128> dobey, there is a merge request to port the indicator-session to lightdm
<seb128> once merged user switching should be back
<dobey> ah ok
<seb128> you can probably reinstall the natty gdm if you need user switching in your session as a workaround
<seb128> not sure if the current oneiric one will work
<seb128> since we switch to lightdm we dropped some of the distro patches we had
<seb128> cyphermox, did you add a Replaces to xchat-gnome on xchat-gnome-gnome?
<cyphermox> dah1
<seb128> cyphermox, just asking because you didn't mention it in the changelog
<cyphermox> and that's because I indeed didn't
<seb128> cyphermox, if you do another upload can you bump the indicator suggests to a recommends
<seb128> (there is a bug on launchpad about that)
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<cyphermox> sure
<cyphermox> ;)
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks for the update and merge btw, one less glade user! ;-)
<cyphermox> yes!
<cyphermox> seb128: Replaces: xchat-gnome-common (<< 1:0.30.0~git20100421.29cc76) sound about right? :)
<seb128> cyphermox, yes
<seb128> kenvandine, there is a new empathy tarball btw, just saying in case you didn't notice, there is no hurry for the update
<kenvandine> seb128, cool, thx
<seb128> yw
<kenvandine> i'll update it soonish
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> cyphermox, when you look at e-d-s and evo let me know if it needs a new libgdata it might
<seb128> it might need gnome-online-account as well
<seb128> rodrigo is packaging this one
<cyphermox> yeah, it very likely might need the new libgdata
<cyphermox> let me check now
<cyphermox> ah, no, seems it's still 0.7.0
<davmor2> should there be some sort of calendaring in place within thunderbird default setup?  or is that still a work in progress?
<ricotz> cyphermox, seb128, perhaps libsoup can be a problem
<cyphermox> ricotz: thanks for the heads up. in any case, I'll see when I start (shortly)
<micahg> lightning would need an MIR for that
<ricotz> the current version might not work with gtk 3.1.6+
<ricotz> and libsoup 2.35.3 is available now
<seb128> ricotz, how not work?
<seb128> the oneiric version is already broken due to the gtkassistant update
<seb128> good timing that we got thunderbird on the CD ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, at least rhythmbox uses some gui widgets which references deprecated gtk api
<seb128> somebody should do a new rb git snapshot
<ricotz> seb128, i tried, but it hasnt been updated for gtk 3.1, so there is a lots o stuff broken for a proper tarball
<ricotz> all *.ui files would need an update
<seb128> ricotz, why wouldn't it work with gtk 3.1? it's supposed to be api compatible with 3.0
<ricotz> seb128, it just doesnt work with disable-deprecated
<seb128> ricotz, don't disable-deprecated then?
<ricotz> right, but i guess it needs to be updated anyway soon
<ricotz> btw, do you know why there isnt a release?
<seb128> not really, you should ask upstream
<seb128> they are usually a bit sloppy on tarballs
<ricotz> probably they consider it too unstable
<ricotz> ok
<seb128> it's rather that there is no active maintainer
<seb128> or depends how you describe active
<ricotz> yeah, there is a lot of competition in this field which might be a bit discouraging
<seb128> ricotz, indeed
<ricotz> seb128, i had a look a while ago, and this was only the beginning http://paste.debian.net/plain/121990
<cyphermox> seb128: the xchat-gnome-indicator bump to recommends is blocked by the xchat-indicator mir
<seb128> ricotz, you should send your patch upstream
<seb128> ricotz, but you can build without disable deprecated, those deprecation will break most of the gtk softwares
<seb128> we will not stop building gtk softwares until everything is ported
<seb128> cyphermox, hum
<seb128> there is no mir bug for it
<cyphermox> I can always get the changes done and push to the branch
<seb128> cyphermox, get the change and upload it rather
<cyphermox> yes, it's bug https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xchat-indicator/+bug/792005
<seb128> recommends are not hard requirements, we can sort it later
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 792005 in xchat-indicator "[MIR] xchat-indicator" [Undecided,New]
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> you mean upload anyway?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> we can sort the mir or demote later
<seb128> we did it for some other gnome-control-center recommends as well earlier in the cycle
<seb128> it will just show on component mismatch, it doesn't break anything
<cyphermox> oh, I know, just wasn't quite sure of the process
<cyphermox> it's nicer to say "seb128 made me do it" :)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> well ideally the mir should be done before but xchat-gnome is not on the CD and it's easy to sort
<seb128> the mir bug is filed and sitting for a while also
<seb128> but I wonder if there is any reason to keep xchat-gnome in main
<cyphermox> no idea. it doesn't even feel like something so actively maintained either
<seb128> it was on the CD before
<seb128> but it seems like demotion rules are not strict, we tend to keep things in main
<cyphermox> right
<cyphermox> so you mean you'd rather anything not on the CD not be in main?
<cyphermox> (or anyway, not a build-dep of something on the cd too, ykwim)
<seb128> well, I've difficulties to get the rational to keep things in main when they are not on the CD (or DVD)
<cyphermox> I don't think there are many besides "customers of Canonical want it supported" ?
<seb128> which is probably not the case for xchat-gnome
<cyphermox> hehe ... no.
 * micahg would think that lots of users + supportable = stay in main
<cyphermox> micahg: yeah. xchat-gnome somehow roughly satisfies that, I guess
<seb128> there is lot of things in universe that match that definition
<seb128> so what is the different out of "xchat-gnome was promoted one day because it was on the CD and kept it special status"
<cyphermox> seb128: it's not too late to demote xchat-gnome ;)
<seb128> right, that's what I was just wondering
<seb128> if we should mir the indicator or demote xchat
<cyphermox> it must have been on the cd prior to lucid?
<seb128> it was before lucid yes
<micahg> 4181 on popcon by recent
<seb128> how does that rank comparedto other softwares?
<seb128> "not a metric"
<seb128> pedro_, could you forward https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/805797 to glib upstream when you have time?
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 805797 in nautilus "nautilus crashed with SIGSEGV in ffi_prep_args()" [Medium,Incomplete]
<pedro_> seb128, sure, bug 805783 is going there soon too
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 805783 in nautilus "nautilus crashed with SIGSEGV in ffi_call()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805783
<seb128> pedro_, cf #gnome-hackers
<seb128> pedro_, they are glib bugs
<seb128> or libffi ones
<seb128> pedro_, thanks
<pedro_> ok reassigning + forwarding
<pedro_> you're welcome
<seb128> pedro_, wait perhaps, cf #gnome-hackers
<seb128> I will do the update of glib this week
<pedro_> saw the comment, will just reassing for now
<bryceh> dt meeting?
<robert_ancell> i reckon
<RAOF> Oh, yeah.  9am.
<TheMuso> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-07-05
<bryceh> everyone enjoying jet lag?
 * TheMuso is over it now.
<TheMuso> Monday morning was the worst, was in bed by 9PM Sunday night, but woke up at 4AM and couldn't get back to sleep.
<bryceh> how was Dublin?
<TheMuso> Weather was pleasant, but hotel food was horribly bland.
<RAOF> For some reason 4am beckoned me this morning, too.  Although that might also have been the remnants of the old-man body.
<robert_ancell> and me too.  spooky
<RAOF> Dublin was nice.  The food, too, outside of lunch :)
<TheMuso> Yeah food outside the hotel was good.
<bryceh> well, I had a quiet week, got a fair number of work items crossed off.  xdiagnose / apport hook stuff
<bryceh> will wait until after the alpha release is out to do an upload
<bryceh> going through oneiric bugs today.
<bryceh> robert_ancell, btw did you get my email about lightdm and hooking some sort of failsafe mode into it?
<robert_ancell> bryceh, sorry, yes.  I meant to reply to that.  It all makes sense though
<bryceh> ok cool
<bryceh> yeah it's not a common failure mode anymore (thankfully)
<bryceh> RAOF, did you get a chance to chat with rick about mesa updating?
<RAOF> In the stable release?  I didn't have it on my TODO list :/
<bryceh> no, he had asked me the prior week about sticking with 7.10 rather than 7.11, I suggested he chat with you about it
<bryceh> but if he didn't, perhaps he decided it wasn't that important
<RAOF> He did not.  7.11 hasn't blown up my mesa bugmail, either :)
<bryceh> nope
<robert_ancell> RAOF, oh, did you see that log out problem btw?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: My box is still updating, so as yet untested.
<TheMuso> /c/c
<bryceh> anyone got anything else?  otherwise shall we call it a wrap?
<TheMuso> Nothing from me, a11y stuff covered in meeting notes already, nothing significant to report on installer a11y front.
<RAOF> Let's call it a wrap.
<TheMuso> Yep.
<RAOF> Where's Jason, btw?
<TheMuso> Good question.
<TheMuso> Hasn't said anything in IRC for several days.
<robert_ancell> he's been on holiday
<TheMuso> Oh ok.
<RAOF> Taking a holiday after a sprint?  Prepostorous!
<RAOF> :)
<bryceh> ubuflu is the more common tradition
<TheMuso> I find it interesting that Banshee was granted a micro release exception for stable releases. I wonder why there was a desire to get that in the first place.
<RAOF> It's a core app and it's got a well-defined stable release policy?
<TheMuso> That makes sense.
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-07-06
<jasoncwarner_> hey guys...just back from a quick post-Rally holiday. How are things?
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: Hi there. Not too bad thanks. Yourself?
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso: pretty good, thanks. I'm wondering if ubuflu got anyone this time?
<TheMuso> Not me.
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso: good to hear. I hope everyone else escaped it as well!
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: did your luggage finally show up?
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, yeah, it just didn't make the flight so they couried it the next day
<jasoncwarner_> ah, ok....that is better than you missing the flight ;)
<jasoncwarner_> mental note: don't go through heathrow anymore
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: I've never had a luggage problem at Heathrow.
<RAOF> Neither have I :)
<bryceh> me either, but luggage problems tend to strike randomly
<jasoncwarner_> robert just left...new LightDM must be up for testing :)
<jasoncwarner_> (just saw it coming down in my updates...about to test myself)
<jasoncwarner_> assuming kenvandine and ted are sleeping? Just updated and indicators seems broken (particularly sound). submitting report now.
<kenvandine> jasoncwarner_, broken how?
<kenvandine> the slider?
<jasoncwarner_> that and if I try, it hangs for maybe 30 seconds before failing
<jasoncwarner_> also, my volume up/down buttons don't work. not sure if that is related
<kenvandine> that shouldn't be related
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: How do they not work? Not working at all?
<TheMuso> Actually, mine appear not to be working at all here either.
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso: volume buttons? yeah, not at all right now.
<kenvandine> jasoncwarner_, mine aren't either
<kenvandine> i wonder when that broke
<kenvandine> i doubt that could be the indicator
<AfC> UI breaks system daemon breaks kernel driver :) Sure it's possible!
<jasoncwarner_> kenvandine: I noticed it yesterday, I think.
<jasoncwarner_> don't remember which update did it, however
<TheMuso> Afaik gnome-settings-daemon is responsible for volume buttons.
<kenvandine> my laptop hasn't been updated since thursday
<TheMuso> Hrm ok, my buttons were working after Thursday...
 * TheMuso boots his notebook to check behavior there.
<jasoncwarner_> I noticed some g-s-d crashes the past two days as well (reported those).
<TheMuso> Ok, haven't updated my notebook since Monday and the volume buttons work properly there.
<TheMuso> Just updating it now to see what happes.
<RAOF> Hm.
<RAOF> Clicking on the volume slider of indicator-sound results in sadness.
<RAOF> (Specifically a unity-panel-service crash which I shall file forthwith)
<TheMuso> Its known.
<TheMuso> An IDO bug afaik,.
<RAOF> Hm.  Apport doesn't seem to think so.
<TheMuso> ok
<RAOF> Wheee!  Segfault in g_slice_alloc.  Also, lunch.
<TheMuso> Yup, after an update, my notebook volume buttons no longer work.
<TheMuso> Yeah, lunch is a good idea.
<hyperair> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/805938 <-- does anyone know if this is related to the gtk3 port?
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 805938 in banshee "Totem set as default music player after install instead of Banshee" [Low,New]
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Hey pitti.
<RAOF> Good morning pitti.
<pitti> hey TheMuso, hello RAOF; how are you?
<TheMuso> Not too bad thanks. Yourself?
<RAOF> Pretty good, if a little tired.
<pitti> still a bit tired, but cold is almost gone now
<RAOF> Yay!
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<pitti> quite well, thanks!
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> hey didrocks
<didrocks> hello pitti!
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks
<didrocks> good morning chrisccoulson
<didrocks> pitti: small question: is there any reason we would like to have a package unseeded in main? see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vpnc/+bug/801240
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 801240 in vpnc "[MIR] vpnc" [Undecided,New]
<pitti> didrocks: that would be to show that it is supported by Canonical
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i think there was a similar discussion last night about xchat-gnome ;)
<pitti> didrocks: in that case I'd like to see an explicit commitment from the server team for it, as it's nontrivial
<didrocks> pitti: I was thinking that the delimitation of supported/unsupported was not as clear as main/universe :)
<didrocks> pitti: but it would be shown in mismatch components list then?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh? :)
<pitti> didrocks: we'd need to seed it to supported
<didrocks> didn't know that one, ok, I'll ask for commitment then
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/05/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t19:32
<didrocks> pitti: thanks for the explanation :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: looking
<chrisccoulson> can we unfreeze now, so i can upload firefox 6 ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: let me upload Qt before then :p
<chrisccoulson> heh
<didrocks> pitti: I'm not sure about 60xdg_path-on-session to be shipped by lightdm. It was shipped before by GDM as we dep it on GDMSESSION, but not that we try to have a more generic session variable, maybe there is a better package for it?
<pitti> would it fit into x11-common?
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, I think it's a nice place to pick it, let me see with the xorg guys
<didrocks> RAOF: around? ^
<RAOF> Aloha.
<didrocks> RAOF: hey! ;)
<didrocks> RAOF: so, there is this script which is called /etc/X11/Xsession.d/60xdg_path-on-session
<RAOF> Let me look at that.
<didrocks> we should change GDMSESSION by DESKTOP_SESSION with lightdm
<didrocks> bug #804734
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 804734 in lightdm "Please ship 60xdg_path-on-session like gdm" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/804734
<didrocks> x11-common will make more sense that in $whateverdm
<didrocks> than*
<didrocks> do you want me to do it? (I think you are using a git repoâ¦ somewhere in debian? ;))
<RAOF> Yup.  It's in pkg-xorg git.
<didrocks> RAOF: do you think it makes sense to ship it there?
<RAOF> Quite possibly; I'm looking at it now.
<RAOF> My system is quite responsive for something with 99% swap utilisation.
<didrocks> what have you done to this poor bare metal? :)
<RAOF> I'm not entirely sure; I suspect compiz might be leaking.
<didrocks> RAOF: are you using indicator-multiload?
<RAOF> Yeah.
<didrocks> RAOF: so yeah, the refactoring made it leak
<didrocks> (unity refactoring)
<RAOF> Hm.  60xdg_path-on-session looks pretty gdm-specific.  Does Xubuntu only work with gdm as a display manager?
<didrocks> RAOF: right now yeah, but now that we are using lightdm, we will use DESKTOP_SESSION instead of GDMSESSION
<RAOF> I'm not convinced that it fits in x11-common.  Why shouldn't it be in lightdm?  After all, lightdm's what sets the relevant variables.
<didrocks> RAOF: because maybe other dm should set the same variable in the end? gdm is already setting this variable since gdm 3
<didrocks> RAOF: so shipping it in lightdm and gdm doesn't sound like the right solution
<didrocks> in addition to have that parsed twice for the same variable if both are installed :)
<RAOF> So both gdm 3 and lightdm will set DESKTOP_SESSION and could share this file?
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> RAOF: I can provide you a git format patch if needed (just did the transition work in gdm and x11-common here for testing and it works)
<RAOF> I guess it could go into x11-common.  It seems a bit icky, but the other option is a tiny display-manager-common package containing just that file which seems worse. :)
<didrocks> RAOF: yeah, that was the other option I was thinking of, but as long as we just have one fileâ¦ :/
<didrocks> RAOF: we can revisit if we need to ship more of them, I would say
<RAOF> Yeah, fair enough I think.
<didrocks> RAOF: http://paste.ubuntu.com/638758/ should do a git format patch with the change. I'm uploading gdm
<didrocks> RAOF: wait, the changelog git add, git add, git addâ¦ ;)
<RAOF> :)
<pitti> didrocks: debcommit -a FTW :)
<didrocks> RAOF: http://paste.ubuntu.com/638761/ should be better
<didrocks> pitti: hum, should use that indeed, just used to debcommit with bzr, but I don't have this in my mind with git :) Will do next time for sure! Thanks :)
<tjaalton> RAOF: that should be good for debian too, but maybe discuss it with them before pushing there
<RAOF> Yeah.
<RAOF> didrocks: Is there a link to some spec that pathmangling implements?
<didrocks> RAOF: not really, it's based on current implementation of what you have in a session today (without that path change), and what additional path we wanted for UNR, like autostarting other applications as well as adding additional software flavor (like a banshee.destkop which started the netbook flavor and override the one in /usr/share/applications/). Did that reading the freedesktop xdg spec
<didrocks> which is at http://standards.freedesktop.org/basedir-spec/basedir-spec-latest.html FYI
<RAOF> Right.  I'm aware of the basedir variables.  It seems that this session script is pretty much Ubuntu specific from that description, though, so Debian's probably not interested in it?
<didrocks> RAOF: last time  (before lucid) I presented them the "on session" concept (touching gconf and other things), they were not interested, indeed. Maybe now that other projects depends on that, they will reconsider?
<RAOF> Which other projects depend on it?
<didrocks> other ubuntu flavors like xubuntu or mythbuntu, so maybe they want to ensure the same thing with their taskels install
<chrisccoulson> is indicator-datetime-service using 100% CPU and spamming dbus for anyone else?
<RAOF> Oh man, so sleepy.
<chrisccoulson> both dbus-daemon and indicator-datetime-service are maxing out the CPU here
<RAOF> Sounds like a dbus storm.
<pitti> chrisccoulson: not regularly
<RAOF> My dbus weather appears to be fine, too. :)
<didrocks> RAOF: you should make an indicator for that!
<didrocks> which will then use dbus to show the infoâ¦ ironic :)
<RAOF> That makes it really easy.  You just time the dbus pinging!
<seb128> hey
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> seb128: quite well again, thanks!
<didrocks> salut seb128
<pitti> how about you?
<seb128> great ;-)
<seb128> I'm fine thanks
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> hay RAOF
<seb128> hey
<RAOF> Hai seb128
<seb128> desrt, lool, vuntz: ok, I think gedit starts hangy after gnome-screensaver kicked in at least one
<seb128> could be that g-s puts the session in a weird state or something
<pitti> back in ~ 30 mins
<seb128> pitti, the nautilus-sendto sru you n-acked, the comment seems different from what the bug is about
<seb128> the bug is about evolution not being listed in the sendto combo no about what happens when clicking send
<seb128> pitti, oh, happy patch piloting
<seb128> RAOF, to you as well one day late!
<seb128> doh, sponsoring queue to 97 items
<seb128> mvo, hey
<seb128> mvo, https://code.launchpad.net/~peco/ubuntu/maverick/sessioninstaller/newfix-for-793396/+merge/66556 has easy typo fixes if you are interested (and is waiting on the sponsoring queue)
<didrocks> desrt: hey, dcong-qt doesn't do anything on make install? is that a lack of qmake foo? ;)
<mvo> thanks seb128, I have a look
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<Laney> tomboy dutifully loses its gnome# dep
<seb128> Laney, I've seen that from the news file, great ;-) your debian changelog didn't mention build-depends updates though?
<Laney>    * [e324eb0] Drop gnome# BD in line with upstream's configure ?
<seb128> oh ok, I got confused because you didn't list "control: .." or anything as we usually do in desktop packages and "gnome#" is not a package name ;-)
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> heh yeah, sorry
<seb128> I was looking for a "stop build-depending on <binary>"
<seb128> where binary is a debian binary package name ;-)
<Laney> i was being a bit insiderish i guess ;)
<Laney> seb128: ah, all of the patches do apply with a bit of refreshing
<Laney> i'll do this upload then
<seb128> Laney, thanks!
<pitti> seb128: set to -done now, thanks!
<pitti> seb128: yeah, need to get to sponsoring in between RMing
<seb128> pitti, yw ;-)
<seb128> I'm doing some sponsoring queue cleaning
<seb128> 97 items, doh
<seb128> I guess nobody did sponsoring during the rally
 * chrisccoulson hides that guilty look
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<seb128> ogra_, did you do your patch pilot round on monday?
<ogra_> seb128, no
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you are next monday don't worry ;-)
<seb128> ogra_, you will make dholbach sad, 97 items in the queue and nobody is doing his sponsoring :-(
<ogra_> seb128, i'll do it on the weekend, to busy week
<GunnarHj> pitti: Hi Martin, the reporter of bug 678421 has made a skeleton to a solution. Maybe you could take a look, to see if it's meaningful to go on with the new approach.
<seb128> ogra_, hum ignore that, the intend was not to make your work on w.e
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 678421 in gdm "Error in ~/.profile halts the X startup" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/678421
<ogra_> seb128, well, i skipped the sponsoring knowing what i do ... with the actual plan to do it on the WE
<ogra_> :)
<pitti> hello GunnarHj
<seb128> ogra_, ok, fair enough! ;-)
<pitti> GunnarHj: I'll have a look at some point and report back to the bug
<GunnarHj> pitti: Great, thanks.
<seb128> ogra_, btw somebody needs to fix json-glib on armel, that's screwing the indicator stack
<seb128> ogra_, I mentioned it to janimo during the rally
<ogra_> yeah, i only recongnized how much it affects this week
<ogra_> it fails a test apparently ...
<pitti> RAOF: to confirm, bug 804655 only affects pre-R600 chips, right?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 804655 in mesa "r300 loading instead of r300g" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/804655
<seb128> vuntz, ping, libwnck patch review?
<seb128> didrocks, hum, blinking text cursor in the unity dash, is that new?
<didrocks> seb128: right, and it's supposed to work :)
<seb128> nice ;-)
<seb128> (it's working there)
<seb128> (I just noticed)
<didrocks> nice! ;)
<Sweetshark> moin all!
<pitti> hey Sweetshark
<rodrigo_> hi Sweetshark
<Sweetshark> pitti: https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ppa/+build/2610421 is looking very strange, its running for 16 hours, seems to be wading through recursive make calls without doing anything (that is: everything seems to be build already). Also I remember to have that problem before once -- on exactly the same builder (karkalla).
<Sweetshark> LO takes long, but not that long (and linux completes infinite loops in five seconds)
<pitti> Sweetshark: bit weird, I'd expect all buildds to be identical
<pitti> but perhaps a retry will work on a different builder
<Sweetshark> pitti: it did last time IIRC
<Sweetshark> pitti: who do I ping about that? launchpad channel?
<pitti> Sweetshark: you can retry builds in PPAs yourself
<pitti> there's a button on the build page once it failed
<Sweetshark> pitti: I guess it wont fail but be a very lifely representation of the so called "halting problem" ...
<pitti> well, it doesn't try to determinate if it will halt
<pitti> Sweetshark: you can also poke lamont or infinity to kill the build
<pitti> if it won't ever terminate
<jibel> didrocks, bug 806358 looks like a compiz issue ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 806358 in ubuntu "no menu bar on top, compositing bug?" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/806358
<didrocks> jibel: looking
<didrocks> jibel: duplicate of an another bug, let me find it
<Laney> do you usually care about keeping the old changelog when merging?
<didrocks> jibel: bug #745996 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 745996 in unity "All unity windows are invisible (panel, launcher, dash)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/745996
<didrocks> Laney: different politics inside the team there :)
<pitti> I generally drop it if the "Remaining changes:" section is complete and has bug refs
<pitti> (and doing so when merging)
<chrisccoulson> it's gone really dark here, i might have to turn the light on!
<Laney> it's complete but maybe not that verbose
<Laney> i'll merge it :-)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: blue sky in Lyon ;)
<chrisccoulson> we never get blue sky!
<seb128> Laney, no, we usually just keep one entry with a summary of the diff
<seb128> what pitti said
<Sweetshark> pitti: as for the halting problem: but _I_ want to know if will stop by itself or if I need to kill it. having no full logs it is down to a scientific guess.
<pitti> but yes, other people prefer to keep the entire history aaaal the way back to warty
<pitti> Sweetshark: I'd use the probabilistic approach then -- if it's still looping after the time the previous build took, it's very improbable to ever halt :)
<Sweetshark> pitti: yes, that and the fact that it does not seem to do anything (i.e. it is not changing state -- at least not on disc)
<jibel> didrocks, seems close. Any info to request from cking to confirm it is a dup ?
<didrocks> jibel: I think the lspci provided is enough, but better to check with smspillaz and jay when they are around
<didrocks> jibel: can be interesting to know if it's only unity or like, if you switch between ws, the compiz wall ui is shown
<Laney> ok there you go, you can put tomboy back on the cd now :-)
<didrocks> tjaalton: do you want another git format patch for an additional commit with your additional requests?
<tjaalton> didrocks: nah, I can make that change
<tjaalton> ..after lunch
<didrocks> tjaalton: ok, thanks a lot :)
<didrocks> tjaalton: I prepared one in case, but it's as you wish: http://paste.ubuntu.com/638815/
<tjaalton> didrocks: oh, in that case I'll take yours
<didrocks> great :)
<tjaalton> thanks :)I
<tjaalton> -I
<didrocks> yw
<rodrigo_> cp: cannot stat `debian/tmp/debian/tmp/usr/lib/libgnome-desktop-3.a': No such file or directory
<rodrigo_> dh_install: cp -a debian/tmp/debian/tmp/usr/lib/libgnome-desktop-3.a debian/libgnome-desktop-3-dev//usr/lib/ returned exit code 1
<rodrigo_> hmm, it's installing a .la instead of a .a
<rodrigo_> any idea why?
<seb128> rodrigo_, it should install both no?
<seb128> the .a is for static builds
<pitti> can we please not install .la files?
<rodrigo_> yeah, but it's only installing a .la
<seb128> rodrigo_, upstream bug?
<rodrigo_> pitti, this is when building the package, we include the .a, that's why it fails
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, seems so
 * rodrigo_ looks
<seb128> pitti, we don't install the .la for GNOME for some years
<seb128> or we clean-la.mk those
<seb128> pitti, wrong channel to ask about that ;-)
<pitti> seb128: right, I thought rodrigo_ meant dh_install
<pitti> so that's in the upstream part
<seb128> no, I think he has a build issue with the new tarball
<rodrigo_> yes
<rodrigo_> the upstream Makefile.am looks ok, just the normal auto* for a lib
<rodrigo_> libtool bug then?Â¿
<hrw> hi
<hrw> how to look at passwords kept by gnome-keyring/evo?
<seb128> rodrigo_, libtool didn't change
<seb128> rodrigo_, can you diff the Makefile.am compared to previous version
<seb128> the configure.ac as well?
<seb128> hrw, use searhose
<seb128> seahorse
<hrw> seb128: thx
<seb128> yw
<rodrigo_> http://pastebin.com/RUGh6d8a <- the AM_MAINTAINER_MODE?
<tjaalton> didrocks: patch applied and pushed, thanks!
<didrocks> tjaalton: thanks to you! :)
<tjaalton> :)
<seb128> pitti, do you know if there is any reason to keep xchat-gnome in main?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I think murphy's law is pursuing me with thunderbird. Any known issue with latest shredder daily build?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, there's no new build today (it's the same as yesterday)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, so, last shredder crash (I think it crashed, it wasn't running anymore), screwed something
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: http://people.canonical.com/~didrocks/Capture--%20Shredder%207.0%20Alpha%201-1.png
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: all the config is still there, I can see my acounts in edit -> account settings
<didrocks> but no treeview, seems some labels are missing as well
<chrisccoulson> hmm, i bet there are some exceptions in the error console ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you mean something like "tree is undefined" ? :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: what do you need? is there a way to dump everything?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, is there a lot in there?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: if I removed the duplicate, 7, I can paste them manually
<chrisccoulson> i should add a "Copy to clipboard" button in the error console ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: http://paste.ubuntu.com/638868/
<didrocks> that would be neat :)
<didrocks> I kept the order
<pitti> seb128: xchat-gnome> not from my POV
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, hmmm, that makes no sense at all ;)
<chrisccoulson> could you try removing the startupCache folder for your thunderbird profile? (~/.thunderbird-trunk)
<chrisccoulson> and then restarting
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: everything in that folder? the config isn't there?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, there should be a folder ~/.thunderbird-trunk/xxxxxxxx.default/startupCache (where xxxxxxxx is some random characters)
<chrisccoulson> is that there?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: indeed, removing it
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: worked, the ui is restored
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: thanks :) but frightening that thunderbird can screw it up like that
<chrisccoulson> i've never seen that happen before (and firefox uses exactly the same startup cache system as well) :/
<chrisccoulson> but the first exception definitely made no sense at all ;)
<chrisccoulson> it was impossible for "tree" to be undefined
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: seems I will be a nice magnet for all thunderbird issues :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: well, it told me it 4 times! ;-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, so far you're the only person reporting issues :P
<didrocks> maybe the only one testing it there? :p
<chrisccoulson> m_conley_away, any idea about the above?
<fagan> Hey im getting this bug when I try to rename files in 11.10 Bug #806448
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: btw, what do you advise as a google calendar support extension? (I didn't see your reply yesterday, if any)
<chrisccoulson> m_conley_away, didrocks got a weird exception (Error: tree is undefined at chrome://messenger/content/folderPane.js:885, which is impossible), and it went away by removing the startup cache
<fagan> Hmmmm is the bot not working?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i think you can use lightning for that
 * didrocks googles
<chrisccoulson> i'm currently not using that though
<chrisccoulson> it's in the archive
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you have no calendar integration?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, not at the moment
<didrocks> can't live without it :)
<chrisccoulson> i'm starting to feel like i should write a calendar application
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: are you sure lightning is in the archive?
<didrocks> xul-ext-lightning
<didrocks> yeah :)
<didrocks> trying
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah :)
<chrisccoulson> and i think you want the xul-ext-gdata-provider package (or whatever it's called)
<chrisccoulson> at some point, there will be an eds-provider package too ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: indeed, looking for it :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, oh, you're still using the nightlies aren't you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: right, the extension won't be detected? do I need some symlink foo?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, the extension is incompatible (it's a binary extension, so no amount of symlinking or playing around with the install.rdf will fix that)
<chrisccoulson> i've not been providing lightning builds with the nightlies
<chrisccoulson> perhaps i should start doing that
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh ok, no hurry then. I can wait on the stable to have my crash fix as well
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'll upload that once we're unfrozen
<didrocks> great :)
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<desrt> didrocks: there's a dh_qmake rule that does the magic for me
<desrt> didrocks: i used it because it was easiest
<didrocks> desrt: hum, seems to not be run by dh8, agateau tried a cmake approach if you are interested
<desrt> didrocks: did you see my PPA?
<didrocks> desrt: no, I didn't
<desrt> i did a package before
<didrocks> I packages it from your git source
<didrocks> packaged*
<desrt> i thought you knew of it
<didrocks> hum, that would have been better :)
<desrt> https://launchpad.net/~desrt/+archive/dconf-qt
<didrocks> desrt: ok, not sure now that we reviewed it and decided on what to ship if it's still necessary, but I'll see what I can grab from there
<agateau> desrt: hey, I had a look at dconf-qt. I am a bit worried about the class name
<desrt> ya.  i got some pushback there before
<desrt> do you have a suggestion?
<agateau> desrt: Q* class names are usually reserved to classes coming from Qt itself
<agateau> desrt: DConfQt?
<desrt> agateau: the situation is a bit confusing
<desrt> agateau: dbarth had the idea that dconf-qt should become part of Qt
<desrt> and some of the Qt guys appeared to support this idea, at least in the margins
<desrt> but i think there is no real interest
<agateau> desrt: I would suggest a rename if/when it gets into Qt
<desrt> so you mean rename now
<desrt> and possibly rename later
<desrt> (unlikely, in my opinion)
<seb128> re
<desrt> seb128: hey
<agateau> desrt: yes
<seb128> fagan, known issue
<seb128> hey desrt, how are you?
<desrt> pretty good
<desrt> living la vie en rose
<desrt> etc :)
<didrocks> desrt: you are in Paris, there is no "vie en rose" :)
<fagan> seb128: cool thanks
<seb128> desrt, ;-)
<desrt> didrocks: i am not in paris
 * fagan just thought it was a weird one
<desrt> but i will be this evening
<desrt> we are having an ubuntu-fr meetup
<didrocks> desrt: well, near it! all the same :-)
<seb128> desrt, btw did you see my comment earlier? the gedit screwup happens after a screensaver use
<desrt> seb128: yes.  it's quite strange.
<desrt> seb128: i still suspect gnome-session :)
<seb128> desrt, so likely screensaver<->session inhibition screwing
<didrocks> desrt: it's in the center of Paris, (les halles), you shouldn't be lost
<seb128> desrt, yeah, me too
<didrocks> everyone blaming vuntz? not kind of you :)
<desrt> didrocks: i have been through this station very many times
<didrocks> desrt: not surprising, it's the central place of the public transportation in Paris ;)
<desrt> and directly on the path between CDG and fontenay sous bois
<didrocks> right ;)
<didrocks> there is even a song on that station
<didrocks> one sec
<chrisccoulson> b'ah, i hate mongodb
<highvoltage> hate is the path to the dark side
<chrisccoulson> heh :-)
<chrisccoulson> i think i'm definitely over to the dark side!
<geser> did you got cookies?
<chrisccoulson> don't mention cookies, i'm already really hungry ;)
<chrisccoulson> and i'm trying to resist the urge to go and get food ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, get beer while you are at it! ;-)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<cyphermox> seb128: turns out I misread yesterday and libgdata 0.9.1 will be needed to go with gnome-online-accounts, so I'll prepare the update, unless you already started?
<seb128> cyphermox, hey, go for it, is gnome-online-accounts mandatory or optional?
<cyphermox> we can disable it, but since rodrigo is working on it we should get it soon no?
<seb128> well, better to not block on it
<seb128> time to get it packaged, reviewed for NEW, in, mir-ed, promoted, etc
<seb128> it might take a bit
<cyphermox> right well, if libgdata is already ready then it will be easy to rebuild evo without --disable-goa
<cyphermox> gdata 0.9.1 is apparently required for goa
<dobey> oh. g-o-a. i was about to say. wtf does gdata have to do with India? :)
<cyphermox> dobey: everything. we outsource development ;)
<dobey> yes i know :(
<cyphermox> that said, I fail to see how you linked this with India?
<dobey> i just remembered that libgdata is written by the indians
<dobey> Goa
<cyphermox> is it?
<dobey> yep
 * cyphermox had no idea
<seb128> rodrigo_, did you figure the gnome-desktop .a issue?
<dobey> but Goa is a place in India, and is where the musical genre derives its name from
<cyphermox> ok
<seb128> vuntz, !!!
<seb128> rodrigo_, it's vuntz's fault again, I knew it ;-)
<pedro_> its always a french fault :-)
<desrt> seb128: did you solve the gnome-session problem now? :)
<seb128> desrt, no, but I think vuntz broke some of ours builds by "modernizing the build system a bit"
<desrt> seb128: oh.  that's surely jjardon's fault, actually :)
<desrt> his gnome-goal, he gets the blame :)
<seb128> desrt, seems like the sort of things he would push for yes
<desrt> glib was broken for some time as well
<desrt> then i fixed it and broke it again :)
<desrt> (in a different way, caused by gtk-doc being fundamentally broken)
<desrt> lesson: autotools is a very delicate deck of cards.  if it ain't broke then don't fuck with it.
<seb128> something in those cleanup stopped .a to be built
<kenvandine> desrt, you are a wise man
<kenvandine> well, i guess wiser now :)
<desrt> :)
<desrt> seb128: some advice, please
 * kenvandine is about to do evil things with autotools... 
<desrt> seb128: if i were to want to vendor-patch a feature branch into glib in a private PPA....
<desrt> seb128: best to take one of your tarball releases from oneric and apply my feature branch as a vendor patch in the usual way?
<desrt> or do you think i should try to make a new "upstream" tarball?
<seb128> desrt, glib packaging runs autoreconf on build nowadays so either way works
<desrt> ah.  that's the exact information i was looking for :)
<desrt> so no need to dist patches against generated files...
<vuntz> seb128: it's not me, it's not me, it's not me
<seb128> I tend to make "upstream tarballs" because it's easier to diff successive uploads
<desrt> seems like more of a burden to go foward, though
<desrt> since for each new glib release you do i will have to do a new one to carry the patch
<rodrigo_> yeah, vuntz's fault probably
<seb128> vuntz, yeah, yeah, neither gnome-desktop3 not libgweather build a .a during
<seb128> build
<seb128> I'm trying to figure what part of the configure cleaning is breaking those
<desrt> "i love gnome-desktop"?
<seb128> vuntz, you also promised to review the libwnck patch and you lied :p
<seb128> never trust vuntz
<vuntz> seb128: they both build fine here :-)
 * desrt generalises to a certain nationality
<vuntz> seb128: so I blame you
<seb128> vuntz, they build fine, they just don't have a .a for static builds
<vuntz> seb128: yes
<vuntz> seb128: --enable-static
<vuntz> seb128: they're just disabled by default now
<vuntz> and the libwnck patch is on my todo list
<vuntz> getting there, slowly but surely
<desrt> vuntz: below how many other items? :)
<seb128> vuntz, instead of putting warning about abi breaks when there is no none, you should put warnings about configure changes :p
<seb128> vuntz, why is the default no nowadays?
<didrocks> slightly out of topic, but impressed by django where you can add url and handlers to them without restarting the server :)
<vuntz> desrt: actually, only one or two
<vuntz> seb128: because I don't like .a files?
<seb128> vuntz, is that a new GNOME policy? (just asking because we might need to tweak our packaging tools if that's the case)
<seb128> vuntz, was that discussed, announced somewhere?
<seb128> vuntz, would be useful to announce at least on the distributors list
<vuntz> seb128: I don't know, it's just my policy
<vuntz> seb128: you can choose to always pass --enable-static, though
<seb128> vuntz, right, I'm doing so but it would be nice to have that consistant over GNOME
<seb128> vuntz, it would make distributor easier
<vuntz> true, we should all move to no static by default :-)
<seb128> I'm fine with that
<seb128> it just means we need to add a --enable-static flag in your build tools
<seb128> but better to have it consistent that having to track different behaviour in different tarballs
<seb128> vuntz, thanks
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok, so to fix your gnome-desktop build just add --enable-static
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, already did
<seb128> vuntz, you could have mentioned it in the commit log or news at least :p
<rodrigo_> seb128, just having a couple more issues, that should be solved now
 * rodrigo_ builds
<vuntz> seb128: true, but I was lazy
<seb128> vuntz, well if that let you some energy to review that libwnck patch then ok ;-)
<seb128> vuntz, btw my gedit not starting issue starts after a screensaver use
<vuntz> seb128: works here
<seb128> vuntz, lucky you ;-)
<seb128> I will try later now that I've gnome-session 3.1.3
<seb128> I was still on 3.0 before
<chrisccoulson> gedit takes forever to start here ;)
<seb128> like 3 seconds,  5 minutes, hours?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, about 10 seconds
<chrisccoulson> i would be worried if it was hours ;)
<seb128> well, when it gets broken there after using the screensaver it seems to just hang
<seb128> otherwise it starts in less than a second
<chrisccoulson> you have an SSD though don't you ;)
<seb128> yes
<seb128> but gedit never took over a second to start on my old laptop either
<seb128> 10s, that's slower than firefox
<mterry> didrocks, so I'm finally looking at enabling gedit plugins on the fly.  I don't see a command line option for it.  Do you know how it's done?
<didrocks> mterry: no, the previous workitem was to patch gedit to enable that. since libpea, I know that upstream listened to that case, not sure it's implemented though
<mterry> didrocks, ah...
<mterry> didrocks, that makes my work item much larger :)
<didrocks> mterry: yeah, I was thinking you knew about it, sorry ;)
<didrocks> but at least, we can see that on the libpeas side, not using a deprecated plugin system which was the case a year ago
<rodrigo_> where is the system locale settings stored?
<stgraber>  /etc/default/locale ?
<seb128> didrocks, mterry: did anyone consider using anjuta rather than gedit as an IDE?
<seb128> gedit is nice but lacks code completion, online debugging etc
<seb128> not that anjuta is great but it's closer from an useful IDE than gedit
<didrocks> seb128: anjuta isn't great at all for python last time I check
<seb128> is gedit great for python? ;-)
<seb128> well at least anjuta is supposed to do functions names completion
<seb128> with online documentation and debugger integration
<seb128> they probably are suboptimal if they work though
<seb128> but gedit is closer from a text editor than from an IDE
<didrocks> seb128: is there completion for function names and debugger for python?
<didrocks> last time I tried, it didn't
<seb128> didrocks, the NEWS from the current version has "auto-completion for Gtk.Builder objects in python plugin"
<didrocks> so maybe it handles it now, worth a try maybe :)
<seb128> it was maybe broken because of bug #791058
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 791058 in anjuta "anjuta-python-autocomplete.py missing" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/791058
<seb128> the .install was not installing *.py
<seb128> which I fixed recently
<mterry> seb128, sorry, walked away for a sec.  I'm not sure we've sat down and done a comparison for quickly's needs yet
<seb128> mterry, I would recommend doing that before investing time on gedit
<seb128> I use gedit and like it
 * Sarvatt is a geany fan
<seb128> but I'm not sure what are the requirements for what you want to do
<seb128> I would think that online documentation and code completion would be nice to have
<mterry> seb128, we have very basic requirements for now.  We just need an editor.  Everything else is nice-to-have, but there are some gedit plugins/settings that we'd ideally like to enforce when using quickly
<mterry> seb128, one problem with anjuta is that it has a whole project management thing that is a bit of a different workflow than quickly's
<mterry> seb128, we've talked about a plugin for anjuta that uses quickly for packaging and such
<pitti> good night everyone
<seb128> 'night pitti
<seb128> mterry, ok, I was rather curious of what the requirements are and if you had looked at different options than gedit
<seb128> oh
<seb128> didrocks, mterry: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric/i386/gedit-developer-plugins/0.5.1-0ubuntu1
<didrocks> seb128: is it up to date?
<seb128> "  * Syntax completion
<seb128>     Python completion using the file's imports and definitions"
 * didrocks checks
<seb128> didrocks, was updated today for gtk3 in oneiric
<didrocks> seb128: we discussed that plugin 1 year and half ago
<mterry> seb128, yeah, that's one of the plugins we want to enable
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> that one was on the sponsoring list today
<seb128> pitti uploaded
<didrocks> only if it supported libpeas, which it shold now :)
<mterry> didrocks, it does
<didrocks> should*
<seb128> great
<didrocks> excellent :)
<seb128> I need to install that ;-)
<mterry> didrocks, but now we need support in gedit... :-/
<didrocks> so yeah, we looked at all the plugins in it and decided which one to enable
<seb128> it has bzr integration as well
<didrocks> was working well
<didrocks> well, that's part of the thing we won't enable in quickly
<ricotz> hello :)
<seb128> hey ricotz
<ricotz> is there a specific reason that gedit-developer-plugins depends on gtk 3.1.0
<ricotz> hey seb128
<seb128> ricotz, dunno
<seb128> you can try to build it on an older gtk version and see if it works
<ricotz> since it min depends on gedit 3.0.1 a lower gtk sould be enough
<seb128> that's the upstream maintainer who did the update
<ricotz> seb128, i would upload it to the natty ppa
<seb128> well I'm about to update gedit to 3.1
<seb128> ricotz, well I guess you can to upload with the depends lowered ;-)
<seb128> if that works open a bug
<rodrigo_> pitti, what was the script you told me that is used to get the list of packages for a langpack?
<seb128> or tell us and we will fix it
<ricotz> seb128, ok
<mvo> hm, I get a upgrade debconf prompt about my prefered DM (gdm, lightdm). I guess that is not intended :)
<kamusin> hey rodrigo_!
<rodrigo_> hey kamusin, how are you?
<kamusin> very good thanks, how about you?
<dobey> meh i really need to apply for motu/moreuploadprivs
<micahg> dobey: I can sponsor stuff in about an hour
<micahg> dobey: and please do :)
<dobey> micahg: i'm not looking for immediate sponsorship right now. just a general statement :)
<kenvandine> seb128, hey... just FYI empathy 3.2 will depend on clutter-gst
<kenvandine> same as totem
 * kenvandine notes it on etherpad
<seb128> kenvandine, what for?
<kenvandine> seb128, video calls
<kenvandine> basically same thing totem is going to use it for
<kenvandine> all the controls will be gtk
<kenvandine> just video playback will be clutter
<seb128> bah
<seb128> some days I wonder if we should go back to pidgin
 * kenvandine never feels that way :)
<kenvandine> clutter-gst will make it on the CD right?
<seb128> not if we can avoid it
 * micahg was wondering about that, it's in core, but universe...
<kenvandine> is it going to be optional for totem?
<seb128> we don't plan to update totem yet
<kenvandine> yeah, i saw the note
<kenvandine> but i read that as we will once the MIR is done
<kenvandine> i guess it provides a much better video rendering experience
<seb128> when it works...
<seb128> we need to do testing on different archs and all drivers because knowing how it works
<hyperair> how do we set the default media application for gnome3?
<dobey> hyperair: i don't think there is any GUI way to do it
<hyperair> dobey: i'm interested in how it's stored on CD.
<hyperair> dobey: see bug #805938
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 805938 in banshee "Totem set as default music player after install instead of Banshee" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805938
<dobey> hyperair: not sure, but i would suspect in gnome3 it is either "gsettings" or "desktop files"
<hyperair> hm =\
<dobey> hyperair: and the ubuntu defaults may just not be updated for the gnome3 change yet, but afaik, there is no easy way for the user to change it in gnome3 :(
<hyperair> dobey: who can i poke to find out?
<dobey> because, afaik, there's no default-applications-properties any more.
<seb128> it's in g-c-c system infos
<dobey> it is? what a weird place for that
<hyperair> seb128: which file in what package?
<seb128> what
<seb128> ?
<seb128> the default-application ui is in gnome-control-center
<hyperair> ubuntu's default media player seems to be totem
<hyperair> i want to know where that's set.
<hyperair> on the CD.
<seb128> desktop-file-utils
<hyperair> or fresh installation, whichever.
<hyperair> hmm let's see..
<seb128> GNOME3 uses mimetypes
<hyperair> mimetypes?
<seb128> right
<seb128> not sure what the question was
<hyperair> hmm i noticed there's some stuff in /etc/gnome/defaults.list
<seb128> right
<seb128> that's the list from desktop-file-utils
<hyperair> x-content/audio-player=banshee-media-player.desktop
<seb128> what are you trying to do?
<hyperair> seb128: fix bug #805938
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 805938 in banshee "Totem set as default music player after install instead of Banshee" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805938
<seb128> how do you start the player? by clicking on a file? by inserting a CD? by using a key?
<hyperair> well the bug report says: "Going into System Info > Default Applications shows Totem set as the default music player."
<seb128>   info_panel_setup_default_app (self, "audio/x-vorbis+ogg",
<hyperair> additionally, unity seems to be showing a totem icon in the dash.
<seb128> in the g-c-c code
<hyperair> hmm
<seb128> so I guess it uses the handler for ogg
<hyperair> i see.
<hyperair> so i guess it should be changed in desktop-file-utils?
<seb128> right
<hyperair> thanks
<hyperair> i'll add a desktop-file-utils task then
<seb128> it's similar to bug #751934
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 751934 in unity "Listen to Music in dash loads Totem not Banshee (dup-of: 751610)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/751934
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 751610 in unity ""Listen to Music" shortcut loads Totem and not Banshee" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/751610
<hyperair> um sounds like a duplicate.
<hyperair> wait, that's in natty, was it?
<seb128> yeah, in fact I'm thinking about another bug
<seb128> there is a bug asking that the default handler for audio files is changed
<seb128> not only ogg
<hyperair> hm
<chrisccoulson> seb128, who came in to our room at the rally to talk to you about daily builds?
<chrisccoulson> i can't remember the person's name ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, jelmer
<chrisccoulson> seb128, thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yw
<chrisccoulson> i wanted to talk to him about building the firefox beta PPA on armel
<seb128> chrisccoulson, they still have issues, you should wait for the next launchpad rollout
<seb128> ah
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you should just ask on #launchpad
<cyphermox> cdbs: ping. I'm curious as to what uses liboauth which you maintain in Debian, and why it needed xmalloc patched. I'd also like to know if you've already started looking into debian bug 612326. Turns out liboauth is a new build-depends on libgdata, so I'm working on a MIR for it now and looking through this stuff
<ubot2> Debian bug 612326 in liboauth0 "liboauth0: patch to xmalloc_fatal removes error handling" [Normal,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/612326
<pitti> rodrigo_: check-language-support from language-selector-common
<cdbs> cyphermox: pong
<cdbs> cyphermox: I'll look at it tomorrow, thanks
<cdbs> cyphermox: Its a fix for an X: lintian tag, will get it un-patched
<cdbs> cyphermox: Oh, really? Nice! My package will be on the CD! Yay! :D
<cyphermox> cdbs: right, afaik it works fine without the patch
<cyphermox> I can't get bti to work to make sure, but I don't forsee problems
<cdbs> Yeah, in my testing that part never failed
<cyphermox> so the patch was for lintian? I'm not sure I follow
<cyphermox> cdbs: by the way, something else, but really small: E: liboauth0: symbols-file-contains-current-version-with-debian-revision on symbol oauth_escape_shell@Base and 3 others
<cdbs> cyphermox: hmm? really?
 * cdbs checks
<cdbs> cyphermox: I'll have that fixed tomorrow
<cdbs> cyphermox: I did that to fix lintian, yeah. But it was an X lintian tag, so it wasn't important at all
<cyphermox> I think that's because you'd need to run makeshlibs with -- -c4
<cyphermox> ok.. I don't get that lintian tag with the patch disabled
<ricotz> cdbs, hello :), i hope you like to update your gnome-shell-extensions packaging for the 3.1.3 release?
<cyphermox> but anyway, if you can fix at least just the xmalloc patch, that would be awesome
<cdbs> ricotz: I'm going to give up the ITP
<cdbs> ricotz: I don't have much time to spend online nowadays
<cdbs> blame personal crap
<ricotz> cdbs, ok, thanks
<ricotz> cdbs, i think i need to look at it then
<cyphermox> cdbs: if it's easier for you I can always update things, even Debian packages if you tell me it's ok
<andersk> Did anyone else see all their launchers disappear from gnome-shell in oneiric recently?
<RAOF> pitti:  Correct.  That bug affects r300-r500 only.
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-07-07
<TheMuso> RAOF: Quick question for you re GNOME stable updates. Do we have a definitive list of what packages fall under the GNOME stable updates umbrella?
<RAOF> TheMuso: I don't know, actually.  That's an excellent question :).  I'd guess at everything in core gnome, and I'd guess that there's a list somewhere on gnome.org for that.
<TheMuso> RAOF: Right, I am dealing with bug 773763 and am wondering whether I need to get rodrigo_ to fill out the full SRU paperwork.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 773763 in evolution-rss "evolution freeze on startup with the plug-in "evolution-rss"" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/773763
<TheMuso> The branch itself checks out as ok.
<TheMuso> I suspect evolution-rss is not core gnome.
<RAOF> TheMuso: Bah, sorry.  irc bouncer decided to suspend.
<RAOF> TheMuso: Anyway - I can't actually find documentation of the gnome exception.  I don't think evolution-rss counts, though.  A bit more formal SRU work would be wanted anyway - at least to have a natty task and to have the oneiric task marked as fixed.
<TheMuso> RAOF: Right, I asked for such in the bug.
<cyphermox> TheMuso: evo-rss crash?
<TheMuso> cyphermox: Yes.
<TheMuso> Something along those lines.
<cyphermox> heh
<cyphermox> 0.2.2 to 0.2.5 seems steep... especially since IIRC I had already fixed something in evo-rss to keep it from crashing?
<TheMuso> I didn't look that much into it myself, just reviewed the branch and the bug.
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> well, worst case I guess rodrigo can instead backport just commit 536a117, which seems to be the exact issue, but there are a fair amount of other bugs fixed
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> 5~/c
 * TheMuso -> lunch
<pitti> RAOF: thanks for confirming
<pitti> good morning
<TheMuso> Morning pitti.
<RAOF> Morning pitti.
<pitti> ok, images are as ready as they will be, so we may as well lift the freeze
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> pitti: hey, (didn't see your ping), how is alpha2 coming? :)
<pitti> didrocks: pretty well indeed; I lifted the soft freeze already
<pitti> now preparing images, announcements, errata, etc.
<didrocks> excellent! Time to do some uploads then :)
<RAOF> Hm.  I should probably add mesa 7.11 to the release notes.
<pitti> RAOF: ah, please do
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<pitti> pretty well, thanks! smoothest alpha ever
<RAOF> Helloooooo chrisccoulson!
<chrisccoulson> hi RAOF!
<chrisccoulson> pitti - are we unfrozen yet?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: go wild
<pitti> chrisccoulson: not released yet, but the images are fixed now
<chrisccoulson> pitti - excellent, thanks!
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks
 * didrocks tries to race to upload Qt before chrisccoulson :p
<didrocks> but 25 minutes to create the source package :/
<chrisccoulson> lol
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I've finally managed to update my radeon box and reproduce that lightdm ânothing draws after log outâ bug.  Hah!
<robert_ancell> RAOF, any ideas?
<desrt> didrocks: time for a faster computer
<didrocks> desrt: I would say, faster hard drive rather in the Qt case :)
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I'd guess it's something in the accel code being messed up.  I'm investigating.
<desrt> didrocks: SSD is totally worth it
<didrocks> desrt: I think I'll choose one soon. But still first to find what's wrong with my server which died during the really (power, motherboard or CPU?)
<desrt> didrocks: just buy a new one
<desrt> it's a great excuse for the upgrade and you can argue that any potential cost savings need to be offset against the cost of your time to debug the problem
<desrt> (for purposes of self-justification)
<didrocks> desrt: that's quite right, but still, as the motherboard has some leds lightened, I still want first to avoid that if I can just change my power with another machine I don't use
<desrt> no fun :)
<desrt> didrocks: btw.  do you know the proper process for registering 'official' freenode channels?
<didrocks> desrt: I think http://blog.freenode.net/2008/04/registering-a-channel-on-freenode/ it quite still up to date
<desrt> didrocks: i mean specifically ubuntu 'official' channels (those starting with #ubuntu, not ##ubuntu)
<didrocks> desrt: oh, I don't remember, at the time, we just sent an email to canonical legal presenting our loco, but this was in 2005 :)
<Tm_T> desrt: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/CreatingChannels
<desrt> ahah.  that is what i was looking ofr indeed
<desrt> thanks
<seb128> hey
<didrocks> salut seb128
<robert_ancell> didrocks, are there indicator .vapi files?
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> hey robert_ancell!
<robert_ancell> seb128, hello
<seb128> robert_ancell, libappindicator3-dev: /usr/share/vala/vapi/appindicator3-0.1.vapi
<seb128> ?
<didrocks> robert_ancell: there are for some indicator, like appindicator, soudindicator
<didrocks> not sure about everything though
<seb128> robert_ancell, you should review the xubuntu patches in launchpad for your next upload if you can, seems having the way to use an alternative config is a blocker for them
<robert_ancell> seb128, didrocks, I need the ones for libindicator-dev.
<robert_ancell> seb128, it's on my list.  I have a big list
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> robert_ancell: didn't find any for this one, forward your request to ted I would say
<seb128> robert_ancell, I will check for you today with the u.s guys and drop you an email
<robert_ancell> seb128, k, thanks.  It's not a big deal, I can write my own just for the functions I need
<seb128> robert_ancell, what do you need? (just curious)
<robert_ancell> seb128, copying the code out of ubiquity for the greeter
<seb128> ok
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you have a nice flight back this time btw?
<seb128> robert_ancell, how is your jetlag? ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, much easier than last time
<robert_ancell> all back to normal
<seb128> great
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_ and I got upgraded to premium economy which made it easier too
<didrocks> seb128: in unity 2.0, we had an indicator.vapi, not sure how uptodate it is, but maybe it can be of interest for you?
<seb128> lucky you ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, njpatel has a libindicator vcs with a vapi as well
<seb128> didrocks, but I prefer to check with ken and ted why they don't build one, they probably have a technical reason or had issues
<didrocks> I think it's just that you have to ship it manually and update it yourself :)
<seb128> https://code.launchpad.net/~njpatel/libindicator/vala
<seb128> but that's old
<robert_ancell> didrocks, yeah, that sounds likely :)
<seb128> but do you need a vapi?
<seb128> or do you need a typelib?
<njpatel> seb128, you just need  a vapi for most things
<njpatel> didrocks, seb128 I can update it if you want?
<didrocks> njpatel: what, do you have spare time? :-)
<seb128> njpatel, robert_ancell needs it for lightdm
<seb128> but I think he said he can ship a copy for the function he needs
<seb128> I was just curious of why the libindicator has no gir or vapi
<njpatel> didrocks, what? I mean no, no, I can't do it <looks around shifty>
<njpatel> :)
<robert_ancell> I only need a few function calls
<njpatel> robert_ancell, seb128 didrocks can do it sometime today so will be ready tomorrow, sound good?
<seb128> works for me
<robert_ancell> sounds good to me!
<njpatel> hopefully ted hasn't completely broken libindicator ;p
<seb128> njpatel, thanks
<njpatel> np :)
 * njpatel tests out if vga/displayport works with his laptop now with edgers
<didrocks> thanks njpatel ;)
<njpatel> damns it
<seb128> bah, it's annoying that segfaults on exit bugs always get priority raise because they get duplicates
<seb128> we need to find a way to filter those out
<RAOF> njpatel: You'd want to be trying the Oneiric kernel for that.
<njpatel> RAOF, i'm in oneiric + xorg edgers, but neither work :(
<njpatel> neither = VGA or displayport
<RAOF> njpatel: Sadness.
<njpatel> both get detected with a 1024x768 monitor (though the monitor is way larger than that), X thinks it's brought up the screen, but the monitors don't get a signal
<njpatel> sorry, brought up the monitor (i.e. it extends the desktop)
<rodrigo_> morning
<njpatel> RAOF, this is x220...any idea?
<njpatel> RAOF, (sandy bridge)
<njpatel> RAOF, just got this from the display settings http://pastebin.com/6GryKjPt
<RAOF> njpatel: I've not seen anything suggesting that it's a known problem upstream; dmesg and /var/log/Xorg.0.log are most likely to contain interesting debugging info.
<njpatel> RAOF, dmesg has a million of "[ 4412.963511] [drm:intel_dp_i2c_aux_ch] *ERROR* too many retries, giving up"
<RAOF> Ah.  That suggests it's failing while trying to retrieve the EDID, which would be consistent with X thinking it's a 1024x768 monitor.
<njpatel> RAOF, should I be worried? :/
<njpatel> RAOF, this happened with stock O as well as edgers
<seb128> pitti, hey, can I upload today? ;-)
<seb128> (new glib and gtk available)
<pitti> seb128: yes, see #u-devel topic -- freeze is lifted
<RAOF> Depends on what you mean by âworriedâ.
<njpatel> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/791169
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 791169 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "Picture disappearing when Display Port is connected" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<seb128> \o/
<seb128> pitti, danke
<njpatel> RAOF, will it ever work? :)
<njpatel> RAOF, or, can I fix it?
<RAOF> njpatel: Looks like it might; there's a patch series on intel-gfx@ with some DP fixes which Keith says makes his x220 work better :)
<njpatel> aaah, nice
<njpatel> RAOF, okay, i can wait for whenever that lands, thanks!
 * njpatel updates bug
<didrocks> ahah, I was just getting blocked on bug #806661, nice timing :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 806661 in python-imaging "[oneiric] python-imaging needs to be multiarch-aware" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/806661
<pitti> mvo: *hug* for the doc-base update!
<pitti> mvo: so we can close the bug now?
<seb128> so who want to do some updates today?
<mvo> pitti: I think so, but I want to wait until it hits the archive to be sure that my test-case runs fine then. I did not manage to reproduce it manually, only in the full ubuntu->ubuntu release upgrade
<pitti> mvo: ah, makes sense; thanks!
<seb128> rodrigo_, hey ;-)
<seb128> rodrigo_, do you have some slots for updates still today or do you want to get work done on other things?
<rodrigo_> seb128, I am working on infrastructure in g-c-c for lots of our bugs, but will have some slots for sure, so what do you want me to upload?
<seb128> rodrigo_, don't bother, there is no hurry, better than you get the bugs count down a bit ;-)
<rodrigo_> seb128, I can do some updates anyway, no problem
<seb128> if you get bored gnome-utils or gedit should be easy
<rodrigo_> ok
<seb128> I'm doing the glib, gtk3 updates
<pitti> seb128: I'll push the multiarch changes of gobject-introspection to Debian, and will then look into the upgrade
<seb128> pitti, danke
<seb128> pitti, do you want to look at the dbus update as well when you have a free slot?
<pitti> yes
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> added to pad
<pitti> ah, Debian doesn't have glib 2.29 yet, can't update in Debian
<rodrigo_> need a reboot, bbiab
<pitti> hm, dbus is a rather complex merge, that'll take me a bit
<seb128> didrocks, do you have any clue about bug #806888
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 806888 in gnome-session "can only login "classic"" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/806888
<seb128> hum bug #788710
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 788710 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon crashed with SIGSEGV in exit()" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/788710
<seb128> session restart, brb
<didrocks> seb128: answered on the bugmail
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<seb128> didrocks, did we figure what happened to nvidia that required to jockey if off and on again?
<seb128> or did everybody workarounded it this way and ignored the bug from then on?
<didrocks> seb128: I pinged the Xorg guy for it, I didn't get any feedback about it
<seb128> ok
<seb128> great, gtk build done
<seb128> time to reboot with the new glib and then with the new gtk
<seb128> be back in a few
<slomo> seb128: the gstreamer packaging will be in git soon btw, not sure if that helps anybody in ubuntu but if you use git too it should make merging new debian versions easier ;)
<Laney> it would be so good if there were official ubuntu git hosting
<Laney> debian merges between git branches are really nice
<seb128> re
<pitti> ok, I'm happy with dbus; let's upload and break the world!
 * soren holds off on upgrading his laptop to Oneiric for another couple of days
<mvo> pitti: hi, a gtk3 porting question, it appears that for gtk_text_iter_forward_search() I get a tuple as the return but I would expect a triple actually (found, start, end) - and it crashes for me in update-manager, but that might be releated actually I guess. I will write a test case next
<pitti> mvo: right, for (return_bool, match_start, match_end)
<pitti> mvo: do you happen to have a small reproducer? or that's what you are writing right now?
<mvo> pitti: I'm writing it now
<rodrigo_> in the last couple of cycles (natty and oneiric), I always have my eth0 connection shown as unmanaged by NM
<mvo> pitti: can it be as simple as http://paste.ubuntu.com/639423/ ? testcase is here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/639424/
<pitti> mvo: that looks very plausible indeed
<mvo> pitti: I wonder if match_start, match_end also need to be nullified? but none of the other code seems to do that, its a bit puzzling that I get apparently valid types back that then crash when trying to access them
<pitti> pygobject should care about passing initialized pointers
<mvo> ok
<pitti> mvo: hm, the return type in the gir looks correct, though
<didrocks> rodrigo_: it seems you pushed gnome-destkop3 to lp:ubuntu/gnome-desktop3 (with some diff from the actual tarball). Can you refresh lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-desktop/ubuntu rather?
<pitti>       <method name="forward_search"
<pitti>         <return-value transfer-ownership="none">
<pitti>           <doc xml:whitespace="preserve">whether a match was found</doc>
<pitti>           <type name="gboolean" c:type="gboolean"/>
<mvo> pitti: hm, does the test case work for you? or also crashes?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, oh, I thought we used the ubuntu branch for that one
<rodrigo_> didrocks, updating the u-desktpop branch now
<pitti> mvo: yes, it crashes, and only returns two items
<didrocks> rodrigo_: thanks :)
<pitti> mvo: thanks for the test! looking into it now
<mvo> thanks pitti
<mvo> pitti: you are right, the gir looks good indeed
<pitti> meh, can't built gtk head, needs glib 2.29 and pango 1.29
 * pitti builds older version
<mvo> when a match is found it does not crash (unsuprisingly I guess)
<pitti> mvo: oh, so the returned textiters ought to be None?
<pitti> but the C function might not actually write stuff into the result values
<mvo> yeah, that is what I suspect
<rodrigo_> didrocks, hmm, I think the ubuntu-branch is for gnome-desktop2
<mvo> still, makes me wonder why match is not returned
<rodrigo_> didrocks, sorry, the ubuntu-desktop branch
<pitti> mvo: i. e. when the return code would actually work, one could avoid the crash by checking it
<pitti> mvo: aah -- it's overridden
<pitti> blatant bug there
<didrocks> rodrigo_: oh, you're right, why not creating a debian/ only for gnome-destkop3?
<didrocks> so that we have the same workflow everywhere
<pitti> mvo: I see the problem, hang on
<mvo> pitti: aha, nice. thanks, once you have the fix, please give me the diff so that I can build it locally to continue my porting :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, not sure, let's ask seb when he's back
<mvo> pitti: no rush
<didrocks> rodrigo_: I think he's more found of no full source :)
<pitti> (False, <GtkTextIter at 0x193aad0>, <GtkTextIter at 0x193ab70>)
<mvo> !!!
<pitti> mvo: the override was done to not actually return a success value
<pitti> mvo: so in the real fix it'd return (None, None) instead
<pitti> apparently that was done to be more pygtk compatible, or more Pythonic
<pitti> mvo: would that work for you?
<mvo> sure
<mvo> that is the old behavior, if no match is found it would return None iirc
<pitti> mvo: can you please patch /usr/share/pyshared/gi/overrides/Gtk.py with http://paste.ubuntu.com/639428/ ?
<mvo> pitti: works now, but iirc the old behavior was a single None, I don't changing that though
<pitti> mvo: oh, can do as well
<pitti> haven't committed yet
<mvo> pitti: hold n a sec, I will double check with the old code
<pitti> mvo: hmm, http://www.pygtk.org/docs/pygtk/class-gtktextiter.html#method-gtktextiter--forward-search doesn't specify
<mvo> pitti: yeah, I noticed that as well
 * pitti tries with old gtk in ipython
<mvo> pitti: just started the old u-m, there its a single "None"
<pitti> confirmed
<pitti> >>> iter.forward_search("h", 0, end)
<pitti> (<GtkTextIter at 0x1277f20>, <GtkTextIter at 0x1277ed0>)
<pitti> >>> iter.forward_search("foo", 0, end)
<pitti> >>>
<pitti> mvo: http://git.gnome.org/browse/pygobject/commit/?id=fc5c869486c7f6929e285ea7a86623ec41ecd9bd
<pitti> mvo: cherrypicked into 2-28 branch as well
<pitti> mvo: how soon do you need this in oneiric?
<mvo> pitti: there is still a bit of work to make u-m go, so not too soon
<pedro_> FYI: seb128 is having issues connecting to IRC he's coming back shortly
<rodrigo_> hey pedro_
<rodrigo_> pedro_, so, what's needed for having a gnome-control-center bug fixing day?
<pedro_> hello rodrigo_
<pedro_> rodrigo_, bug fixing day? or a bug day?
<rodrigo_> hmm, hopefully both
<rodrigo_> both at the same time :)
<pedro_> we just need to schedule it
<pedro_> rodrigo_, what about next thursday?
<pedro_> just checked at the planning page and there's nothing scheduled for it
<rodrigo_> pedro_, sounds perfect
<pedro_> ok i'll go ahead and schedule it for now
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, maybe we should include firefox also?
<pedro_> i'll ping you back later to set up the instructions
<pedro_> like what would you like to do to bugs with patches etc
<rodrigo_> ok
<rodrigo_> time for lunch, bbl
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, a firefox bug fixing day?
<chrisccoulson> you mean that there are bugs in firefox? ;)
<njpatel> didrocks, I've updated the indicator vala bindings in my branch, so robert can grab them there
<pedro_> chrisccoulson, well compared to unity there's probably none :-P
<chrisccoulson> lol
 * pedro_ runs and hide
<njpatel> pedro_, WHAT!
<didrocks> njpatel: oh excellent! nice work dude :)
<mvo> pitti: my next pygi question, http://paste.ubuntu.com/639447/ does not produce a popup for me when it should and I'm staring at it with no idea what is wrong. I noticed the popup() itself is no longer used, but popup_for_device
<pitti> mvo: pygobject has an override to implement popup()
<pitti> so both should work
<pitti> and c-j uses it too, so it works in general
<seb128> yeah, back!
<pitti> wohoo!
<pitti> seb128: FYI, james_w | pitti, should be up to date in a few minutes
<seb128> pitti, great!
<pitti> mvo: hmm, boggle -- by and large the same code works for computer-janitor..
<pitti> mvo: except that there are some actual widgets involved
<didrocks> wb seb128
<didrocks> seb128: pedro was telling that you were slacking ;)
<seb128> didrocks, re ;-)
<seb128> oh, first he kicks in my door and now he calls me a slacker!
<didrocks> heh :-)
<didrocks> seb128: about gnome-destkop3, we have no branch up to date in ~ubuntu-desktop. Is it wanted? (only lp:ubuntu/gnome-desktop3, which contains ful source)
<didrocks> full*
<didrocks> I would be in favor to create a debian/ only one in ~ubuntu-desktop
<seb128> didrocks, we are on sync with debian, it's annoying to mainain a vcs for those
<seb128> didrocks, do you need to patch it for something?
<seb128> didrocks, that and the source is small enough that fetching the source is ok
<pitti> something that we could patch in Debian, too?/
<didrocks> seb128: are we in sync? 3.1.3-0ubuntu1
<mvo> pitti: yeah, I tried to put it on a treeview, same result, I looked at the c-j code and can't spot a difference (that is significant)
<seb128> didrocks, that's because we started on 3.1 before them
<seb128> didrocks, but we have been in sync until we updated and we plan to sync again when they update
<pitti> mvo: the menu items aren't connected to anythign, but that should hardly make a difference
<seb128> didrocks, it's annoying to keep a vcs uptodate when we switch between sync and updates
<seb128> didrocks, it means we have to manually commit all debian updates while we are on sync
<mvo> pitti: yeah, in my real code (in u-m) they are and I get the same behavior
<didrocks> seb128: well, same story for most of packages we had in ~ubuntu-desktop then, most of the branchs were just because we were ahead debian. If the politic changed, I'm ok with no vcs
<didrocks> would just prefer it was announced :)
<pitti> mvo: hm, and can't test with gtk2 :/
<seb128> didrocks, not true, most packages have a least a lpi diff
<seb128> didrocks, well feel free to update lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-desktop3/ubuntu
<didrocks> seb128: I don't care, just that we should have a coherent story there
<seb128> or is it lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-desktop/ubuntugtk3?
<seb128> didrocks, we will not have a coherent story until everybody use UDD
<mvo> pitti: ha! I think I have it, its a ref count issue, if I assign it to something like self.menu its fine
<pitti> until then, maintaining Vcs-Bzr: is the best we can do, I think
<pitti> mvo: aah
<pitti> mvo: because "menu" goes out of scope right after the handler
<pitti> mvo: that's why it works in c-j
<mvo> yeah
<mvo> exactly
<mvo> d'oh
<seb128> pitti, well the question there is, should everything we change for desktop be in ~ubuntu-desktop or can we use some UDD sources
<pitti> we already use UDD for some bits
<seb128> pitti, which didrocks seems to have an issue with because it's not consistant
<pitti> I think in general the ~u-desktop ones are still more comfortable, but for the situation you described UDD migth be better
<pitti> the ~u-desktop ones suck for merging
<didrocks> seb128: just that some branches have to be pushed at some place, some not
<pitti> I need to leave now, early start/early finish day
<pitti> see you tomorrow!
<seb128> yeah, we have a mix of UDD and team vcses in the archive
<didrocks> seb128: and you really told a lot "I don't want to download the full source everytime because of network bandwidth", but if you changed your opinion on it, it's ok, just tell it clearly :)
<seb128> pitti, see you!
<didrocks> see you pitti
<pitti> UDD just sucks differently
<mvo> see you pitti
<pitti> it's better for merging, and worse for anythign else IMHO
<seb128> didrocks, right, and that's still the case
<seb128> didrocks, but gnome-desktop3 is
<seb128> - small
<seb128> - on sync with debian most of the time
<seb128> - can be downloaded by apt-get source, and uploaded the old way without vcs
<didrocks> ok, now I know it, that's all, I wasn't aware that we will have to check for those :)
<seb128> we don't have good stories for things we sync
<didrocks> better explicit than implicit
<didrocks> right
<seb128> we have a gnome-desktop3 vcs for it
<seb128> I just can't be bother to commit each debian sync there
<seb128> if you want to do it by my guess
<seb128> guest
<didrocks> no need to be angry, it was just a questionâ¦
<seb128> I'm not angry, it just seems a lot of talking and I don't get what you want from the discussion
<seb128> the vcs is still in the ubuntu-desktop namespace with debian dir only
<seb128> it just got outdated because we went on sync with debian
 * mvo is angry at pygi
<seb128> which flushed the control vcs info
<didrocks> an answer to my question? "about gnome-destkop3, we have no branch up to date in ~ubuntu-desktop. Is it wanted? (only lp:ubuntu/gnome-desktop3, which contains ful source)"
<didrocks> so I guess I have it now
<seb128> which is unfortunated but I've no reply on how to handle those
<didrocks> that's it, no need to make such a lenghty discussion for itâ¦
<seb128> short reply "I don't care either way, I want it back in sync with debian when we can"
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> if we want a vcs it should be lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-desktop/ubuntugtk3?
<seb128> -?
<seb128> but I'm fine updating it with apt-get source, dput the old way while we break the syncs because we update before debian
<seb128> which is what we have been doing there
<didrocks> so ok, just wanted that everyone is on the same page to chase for commits :)
<mvo> is it possible to forward from LP to bugzilla now? bug #806949 is a candidate
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 806949 in gtk+3.0 "Refcount problem with pygi" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/806949
<seb128> mvo, define "forward"? you have for sure a bugzilla account and file GNOME bugs before?
<seb128> mvo, or you mean "click a button and get lp to do that for you"? in which case "no" and "we don't want that, it would mean any user could spam bugzilla easily with low quality bugs"
<mvo> ok, fair enough, then I will manually forward :)
<seb128> mvo, thanks ;-)
<Sweetshark> pitti: ping?
<seb128> mvo, how is your example working?
<seb128> mvo, i.e what do I do to see the issue?
<seb128> mvo, ignore me, got it
<seb128> it doesn't display the menu as it should
<didrocks> seb128: btw, with your super bleeding fast internet, dconf-qt is in new, apart from the qmake -> cmake dep change and the typo you noticed, it should be the same
<mvo> seb128: yeah, it should display it, but it only does if I keep a reference to menu
<mvo> took me a good while to figure that out
<seb128> mvo, right, I can confirm with yesterday's tarballs so feel free to forward it
<seb128> didrocks, ok
<seb128> didrocks, is there any hurry?
<mvo> if I now find out why my gtkbuilder UpdateManager.ui has a odd resize behavior I'm *mostly* done with the port I think
<didrocks> seb128: not at all, you have at least 2 weeks I would say :-)
<seb128> mvo, \o/
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, for once, it's not urgent ;)
<seb128> didrocks, great, I will just restart my session once now, if everything works ok I upload gtk3, glib, pango
<seb128> then I look at it
<seb128> brb
<didrocks> seb128: dbus and gtk/gtlib in the same upgrade? I want that! :-)
<didrocks> glib*
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, we need to make those users complaning that oneiric is too stable happy
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> brb
<didrocks> seb128: agreed, time to push compiz as well!
<didrocks> good reboot :)
<seb128> pedro_, I cleaned a bit the desktop-bugs subscriptions list
<mterry> Anyone feel like NEWing itstool?
<seb128> hey mterry
<seb128> mterry, can do
<mterry> seb128, thanks!
<pedro_> seb128, cool, did you added a new one? like telepathy,etc?
<seb128> pedro_, not yet
<pedro_> seb128, just wondering in case i need to update the 'other packages' page
<seb128> pedro_, but I can do that next
<seb128> didrocks, dconf-qt newed
<didrocks> seb128: thanks :)
<seb128> mterry, NEWed
<seb128> mterry, is that used in GNOME3.1?
<mterry> seb128, yeah, it's used for yelp-tools, which is replacing gnome-doc-utils
<seb128> ok
<mterry> I'll file a MIR once I get yelp-tools in.  So if you can stick around to NEW that too...  ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<mterry> seb128, yelp-tools ready for NEW
<seb128> mterry, ok
<seb128> didrocks, ^ do you have time for a NEW review? just did two and I want to finish some of the updates I'm working on
<seb128> will take it in a bit otherwise
<didrocks> seb128: sure
<seb128> thanks
<rodrigo_> heh, just used brasero for burning an iso and it worked
<seb128> tell it to pedro_ he keeps saying it's broken!
<rodrigo_> yeah, pedro_ ^^
<pedro_> it worked? wow
<pedro_> rodrigo_, was that like a release iso ? or did you make an iso of music files, etc?
<pedro_> for the reports i've seen people complain about the making projects thing, like adding normal data instead of selecting an image and burn it
<didrocks> mterry: how did you determine the copyright? there is no header, and GPL2.1+ and LGPL2.1+ are both shipped
<rodrigo_> pedro_, a distro iso
<mterry> didrocks, from looking at the .in files in tools/
<rodrigo_> pedro_, in fact, I remember having problems burning a music iso
<pedro_> rodrigo_, ah that's why it worked :-P
<mterry> didrocks, only thing with a header.  The COPYING files seem copied from gnome-doc-utils (very obvious if you look at the COPYING file itself)
<pedro_> rodrigo_, yeah things like that aren't really working 'that' fine
<pedro_> not smooth as k3b for example
<didrocks> mterry: waow, interesting that's in a .in file ;) even licencecheck ignore it :)
<didrocks> mterry: Format: http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/dep/web/deps/dep5.mdwn?op=file&rev=166
<didrocks> is that wanted? I remember you chasing me to use the old url :p
<mterry> didrocks, that's the spec'd url isn't it?
<mterry> (though I do think it's ugly)
<didrocks> mterry: I think there is a shorter now (and that one point on nothing)
<didrocks> one sec
<didrocks> http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep5 ?
<didrocks> mterry: that's what dh_make is creating
<mterry> didrocks, but look at the actual spec (search for svn.debian)
<mterry> didrocks, dh_make is creating an unversioned format, which the dep5 authors didn't want (they liked the rev=XXX part of the URL)
<mterry> In reality, who cares, but it's odd that there's a disconnect there (especially that the spec'd url is a bogus one)
<didrocks> mterry: shouldn't it be http://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/dep?view=revision&revision=174 ?
<didrocks> as 166 isn't working
<mvo> seb128: the goal is to GIify glib and gobject as well, right? I just found that GLib.markup_escape_text() needs the len of the string, this is so un-pythoninc
<didrocks> mterry: acking your package, I hate those url too, if you can just fix later so that it points on something which works :)
<mterry> didrocks, but anything else wouldn't be to-spec!  :)
<didrocks> mterry: heh ;)
<mterry> didrocks, well, I'm serious.  I don't know as if we have any parsers right now, and they will probably be generous in what they accept, but if I start changing the URL to non-spec'd things, they will have a harder time of it
<mterry> didrocks, the format line is more for parsers than humans
<rodrigo_> how can I detect from code if the current distro is ubuntu? I only see /etc/debian_version
<mterry> (i think)
<didrocks> mterry: I let it go, but the priority should be extra IMHO
<cyphermox> rodrigo_: lsb_release -i works
<mvo> rodrigo_: lsb_release -i should tell
<mvo> heh :)
<didrocks> mterry: right, the thing is that the link it leading to an error on the vcs right now
<cyphermox> ;)
<rodrigo_> cyphermox, mvo: ok, thanks
<mvo> (or -i -c if you want to get rid of prefix)
<didrocks> mterry: I'm still puzzled about what the right format/version we should use in the url-spec
<seb128> mvo, yes, they add overrides in pygobject when needed
<mterry> didrocks, extra is better, thanks.  will change next upload
<didrocks> mterry: great, I locally built the bin package and they are good, I'll ack them once built
<mterry> didrocks, me too.  looking at the text again, it seems to not say that you must use that format it provides.  Just says "url of the spec"
<mterry> didrocks, so if you got the spec from mycoolspecs.com, I guess you could put that in...
<didrocks> mterry: yeah, it can be widely interpreted ;)
 * didrocks tries mycoolspecs.com, maybe it exists!
<seb128> mvo, hum, are the lsb tools still writen in python? wouldn't be easier to read /etc/lsb... than spawning a python interpreter?
<mvo> GLib.timeout_add_seconds â¦ introspectable="0"
<mvo> *sigh*
<didrocks> mterry: no, time to register it? ;)
<mterry> didrocks, :)
<mvo> seb128: well, there is "import lsb_release" and get_lsb_information() in it, that should be fine as well
<mvo> seb128: reading the file is not ideal as it *may* change in the future (also I doubt it ever will ;)
<seb128> mvo, well my point was that from a C file you probably to read the text file rather than running a python interpreter
<seb128> mvo, seems way slower to run python just to get the distro
<mvo> sure, its slower. the file format is not guaranteed that is why its not encouraged. if the speed/mem is a issue, then it should be fine to read it directly
<mterry> didrocks, maybe I asked for NEW too soon?  yelp-tools finished building and says it is in NEW queue
<didrocks> mterry: you are quite quick ;) I checked for binary new like 10 minutes before and it wasn't there
<seb128> mterry, what is in NEW?
<mterry> didrocks, oh that's a separate NEW check I guess.  itstool has same issue
<mterry> There is a check for source + a check for binaries?
<seb128> NEW?
<seb128> yes
<mterry> seb128, makes sense
<didrocks> mterry: rightn you have source NEW, then if acked, the package build
<seb128> that's why you hit new on soname changes
<seb128> or when adding a binary
<didrocks> mterry: and we have to ack for every arch
<didrocks> (binary NEW)
<didrocks> acked yelp-tools for i386, but still waited for the other archs
<seb128> didrocks, don't wait too much it's arch all ;-)
<seb128> you might still be there next year waiting otherwise
<didrocks> seb128: no, I will keep refreshing the page! :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> we will pick you up for UDS
<seb128> don't worry
<didrocks> need to be rebooted? :-)
<seb128> lol
<mterry> :)
<seb128> tedg, so, how is the indicator-session user switch merge request going?
<seb128> tedg, going to land for today's tarballs? ;-)
<seb128> bah, another libindicator transition
<seb128> stop those!
<chrisccoulson> ooh, http://tech.slashdot.org/story/11/07/07/140204/Thunderbird-Unseats-Evolution-In-Ubuntu-1110
<chrisccoulson> not that i normally read /. ;)
<tedg> seb128, Yeah, this is the fallout from avoiding one last cycle and having two scroll functions.  A broken one and a correct one.  We're finally dropping the broken one.
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you clearly don't have enough work if you read slashdor
<seb128> t
<seb128> chrisccoulson, but I can fix that for you! ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i don't read it. m_conley tweeted it ;)
<seb128> oh, you read tweets, that's better :p
<seb128> tedg, ok, what about the user switching question? ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, do you remember what error you got when trying to delete the gnome-desktop3 merge request?
<seb128> didrocks, it worked for me
<didrocks> seb128: no, I didn't delete it on purpose, I couldn't "reject"
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> you wrote "Set it as WIP and add a comment about it as couldn't delete it." in your email
<seb128> which got me confused
<didrocks> seb128: I didn't delete the MR, because I think that james_w wants maybe to fix this and that we don't keep unused cruft branch
<seb128> well it's deleted now :p
<didrocks> argh, I'm really tired I guess :/
<didrocks> seb128: well, there are plenty of other examples ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> so that's fine!
<mterry> didrocks, can you binary-NEW itstool too?  (ubuntu2 is now arch-all so should just need i386)
<didrocks> mterry: well, I'll bin new them then, let me check the package
<mterry> didrocks, if you love working on yelp-tools/itstool, have I got a MIR for you!
 * didrocks fires up a dconf-qt MIR to protect himself :)
<mterry> Nothing like a nice MIR arms race
<didrocks> mterry: subscribe me to them, I'll have a look at them tomorrow morning (should be good or yelp-tools, need to look at itstool)
<didrocks> heh, indeed :)
<didrocks> for*
<mterry> didrocks, done.  they are both super trivial
<tedg> seb128, ronoc is working on the user switching.  I don't think he'll be done today, but it's in good shape.  Definitely next week.
<seb128> tedg, you saw robert_ancell merge request right?
<seb128> tedg, i.e conor is not redoing the work right?
<didrocks> mterry: will do that tomorrow morning before going to the train station :)
<mterry> didrocks, sure, no rush
<tedg> seb128, Yes, he shouldn't be.
<seb128> ok, great
<didrocks> waow, I can do what I wanted to do in 4 lines of python to merge two images :)
<seb128> hum
<seb128> is indicator-messages not indicating what is running for others as well?
<seb128> is the >
<seb128> is->ie
<mterry> seb128, yeah it's gone for me
<cyphermox> yup, confirming
<seb128> ok, good, not only me ;-)
<seb128> ok, enough packaging for today
<mterry> I see an indicator in the sound menu, so probably not a gtk3 transition issue...
<seb128> let's take an hour of bug triage and filing
<seb128>     self.setdata()
<seb128>   File "/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/duplicity/path.py", line 493, in setdata
<seb128>     self.stat = os.lstat(self.name)
<seb128> OSError: [Errno 107] Transport endpoint is not connected: '/home/seb128/.gvfs'
<seb128> booubouh deja-dup!
<seb128> mterry, deja-dup hates me
<seb128> he does that when I click on "backup now"
<mterry> seb128, ugh!  I've gotten reports of that error and I can't figure it out.  Are you connected to internet?
<seb128> it does it in a consistent way
<seb128> mterry, I guess so, can you read what I type on IRC?
<seb128> (it's the box I'm working on)
<mterry> seb128, :)
<seb128> mterry, well it's doing it every time I click the button
<seb128> so I can get you debug infos if you have questions
<mterry> ls -l ~/.gvfs?
<seb128> ls: cannot access .gvfs: Transport endpoint is not connected
<mterry> OK, so it's not just deja-dup being crazy
<seb128> is .gvfs supposed to be mounted when you didn't use gvfs?
<mterry> (duplicity shouldn't be stat'ing that folder anyway, since we exclude it, but...)
<mterry> seb128, I don't know.  It's maintained by gvfs-fuse I think...
<seb128> hum
<seb128> it works on a fresh login on my test box
<seb128> so I guess gvfs got screwed during the course of the day
<mterry> seb128, yeah, whenever I get a report of this, a reboot fixes things
<seb128> so gvfs bug and duplicity,deja-dup not being robust to it
<mterry> seb128, but haven't been able to track it down
<didrocks> mterry: acked itstool -0ubuntu2 btw
<seb128> mterry, ok, trivial to get
<mterry> didrocks, thanks
<seb128> mterry, kill gvfs-fuse and try using deja-dup
<mterry> seb128, fascinating
<seb128> just got it on my test box
<mterry> seb128, sounds a bit like bug 212789
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 212789 in gvfs "gvfs fuse mount is not functional after logout and subsequent login" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212789
<seb128> mterry, yes
<seb128> mterry, right, there is a gvfs issue there, but as you said deja-dup or duplicity should ignore .gvfs anyway
<seb128> mterry, do you want a bug report or did you get some about it already?
<mterry> seb128, I can re-open an old one
<mterry> seb128, which process do you kill?   i don't have a fuse process running
<seb128> mterry, gvfs-fuse
<mterry> seb128, ah, didn't even have it installed...
<seb128> ah ;-)
<seb128> mterry, you can run /usr/lib/gvfs/gvfs-fuse-daemon .gvfs
<mterry> Hrm, not sufficient to trigger.  Let me try to connect to a server
<mterry> seb128, nope.  even after connecting to something and killing the fuse daemon, ~/.gvfs is clean for me
 * mterry wishes he could break things like seb128 can
<seb128> mterry, how do you kill the daemon?
<mterry> killall
<mterry> let me try -9
<seb128> I did -9
<seb128> not sure if that makes a difference
<mterry> seb128, yup, it does  :)
<seb128> ;-)
<mterry> seb128, bug 794576 btw (thanks for your help, now I'll just dive into duplicity and figure out why we're stat'ing it)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 794576 in deja-dup "Transport endpoint is not connected" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/794576
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<seb128> pedro_, can you upstream bug #805311
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 805311 in gnome-bluetooth "gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in g_type_instance_get_private() (device_services_changed)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805311
<seb128> I can confirm here
<mvo> eh, what is wrong with using setting_name in gsettings instead of settings-name ?!? why was this restriction added?
<seb128> mvo, consistency I guess
<seb128> mvo, gconf was a mix of _ and - which is confusing
<mvo> ok
<mvo> at least there is a reaosn :)
<seb128> pedro_, don't bother I do it
<pedro_> seb128, i'm about to click on submit :-P
<seb128> pedro_, ok, great ;-)
<seb128> pedro_, the bug report was on 3.0.2 btw, not 3.0.3 but I checked it still happens
<seb128> pedro_, the stacktrace lines might just be different
<didrocks> jibel: thanks for your report! I'm sure it will be really useful :)
<seb128> didrocks, stop encouraging spammers!
<didrocks> seb128: I agree it's quite depressing sometimes, but needed :-)
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> but see, there are bugs for everyone! ;)
<seb128> didrocks, oh, new zg and zg-datahub uploads to debian
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I saw that, I'll try to get the merge tomorrow (it has some reduced mem consumption)
<didrocks> if not, would you like to handle that? :)
<didrocks> (still feeling a little bit sick, will stop working soon)
<jibel> didrocks, thanks for introducing bugs! at least there's something to write in the report ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, the merge is a one liner to add one char to a build-depends ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, if you don't manage to do it tomorrow I think I can find an hour for it :p
<seb128> didrocks, we should ask rainct to add | to the build-depends in debian so we can sync
<didrocks> seb128: the thing is that with all the incoming changes, it still need some testing
<didrocks> seb128: already done, but I think he forgot about it, will try to spam him again :)
<seb128> it will maybe fix the segfault that apport keeps reporting on loging ;-)
<didrocks> jibel: it's just to ensure you have some work :)
<didrocks> seb128: this one is fixed AFAIK, yes
<seb128> didrocks, let me try the new zg
<didrocks> seb128: oh, you want to do it now? nice :)
<seb128> didrocks, well I can build and install it if you need testing
<didrocks> seb128: datahub is just mterry's double patch IIRC, that could be set to debian I guess :)
<mterry> didrocks, not the nodisplay one, that is ubuntu-specific for now
<mterry> didrocks, (GNOME didn't want our patch to gnome-session to respect the key)
<didrocks> mterry: hum, we can maybe put the change in debian/patches/ubuntu.series
<didrocks> mterry: or do you want to update zg-datahub? ;)
<mterry> didrocks, sure.  and really, they could accept the patch, it wouldn't hurt anything in debian to have nodisplay
<didrocks> let me talk with rainct if he's there
<seb128> ok
<seb128> mterry, oh, they didn't want to? why?
<didrocks> seb128: we can forget about zg-datahub, it's just an upload to make it into unstable with a bug number
<mterry> seb128, they felt it was an overloading of the spec, that nodisplay was only for menus in the panel
<didrocks> so if it's only zg, I can double check, should be quick
<didrocks> seb128: just to ensure we don't duplicate the work, should I do it now? ^
<seb128> desrt, what was the issue ricotz was having building glib during the rally? one of the gdbus tests hanging?
<seb128> mterry, ok
<seb128> didrocks, yes, please do
<didrocks> rainct isn't there, I'll send him an email for the additional dep
<didrocks> seb128: the zg change isn't the fts one, it's just doko making a build-dep change not reported to debian
<seb128> didrocks, right
<didrocks> ok, I was on the fts naming which diverged :)
<seb128> I though we were speaking about the same thing when I said a one line, one char change ;-)
<seb128> sorry about the confusion
<didrocks> no worry, anyway, both should be in debian to enable sync
<seb128> both?
<seb128> is fts still required?
<didrocks> yeah, it's used to scan documentation content
<didrocks> but it's called zeitgeist-extension-fts in ubuntu (where it was first) and zeitgeist-fts-extension in debian
<didrocks> so, we have a transitional package in ubuntu
<seb128> ok
<didrocks> session restart, brb
<didrocks> seb128: no crash at logout \o/
<didrocks> nautilus does, though ;)
<didrocks> seb128: why did you assign me the bug about session saving not working? it's disabled
<kenvandine> woot... i have a power indicator in my panel now :)
 * kenvandine is much happier
<chrisccoulson> heh, my power indicator will only have 1 state
<chrisccoulson> "EMPTY"
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<didrocks> seb128: I added a rationale, unassigned and call for help
<kenvandine> hey tedg
<tedg> kenvandine, Howdy
<kenvandine> tedg, now i just need a release tarball for indicator-power
<kenvandine> packaging is done
<kenvandine> tedg, i did just propose a branch which needs to be merged before releasing though
<kenvandine> https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/indicator-power/packaging_fixes/+merge/67229
<kenvandine> seb128, indicator-power uploaded, in source NEW
<seb128> kenvandine, seems fine from a glance
<seb128> kenvandine, but I think I will just keep the indicator stack in new for the night and get those in at the start of the day tomorrow
<kenvandine> seb128, indeed
<kenvandine> seb128, the whole stack is being updated again
<kenvandine> for new libindicator
<seb128> right
<seb128> btw speak of libindicator
<seb128> do you know why it has no gir or vapi?
<kenvandine> seb128, however, the current indicator-power doesn't use the new libindicator
<seb128> robert_ancell was asking about it this morning
<kenvandine> nope
<seb128> he needs it for lightdm
<kenvandine> humm
<seb128> njpatel said he would get one updated today
<kenvandine> njpatel tweeted about updating libindicator vapi this morning
<seb128> right, neil picked up on that
<kenvandine> cool
<seb128> still I'm wondering why there was none, i.e if there was a reason, I know there was some gir namespacing issues for some sources
<kenvandine> didn't make the release
<kenvandine> i think just that nobody has needed to create a new indicator in vala
<kenvandine> i guess
<kenvandine> tedg, ^^
<kenvandine> seb128, libindicate-gtk still has the namespace problem
 * kenvandine grumbles at tedg AGAIN :)
<njpatel> seb128, it's done
<seb128> njpatel, \o/
<njpatel> there isn't any as it's way difficult to make it part of the build, it needs to link to the installed library to make the vapi....not sure if the gi is enoug
<seb128> njpatel, can you drop an email to robert_ancell about it?
<njpatel> but I'm going to see if we can patch vapigen to be more clever
<njpatel> seb128, sure!
<seb128> njpatel, thanks ;-)
<njpatel> done :)
<kenvandine> tedg, does today's indicator-session require libindicator6?
<tedg> kenvandine, Yes
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> damn... power just flickered here
<kenvandine> damn thunderstorm
<seb128> lol
<kenvandine> if i drop off line, it is because my power went out :)
<seb128> when you wrote that I though you were speaking about the indicator
<kenvandine> haha
 * kenvandine is very happy to have power displayed in the panel
<tedg> We're going to have to get kenvandine to test the UPS features.
<kenvandine> less happy about a power outage :)
<seb128> we should put a "i" before the names to make clear it's indicator
<seb128> ipower
<kenvandine> my cable modem isn't plugged into a UPS :)
<kenvandine> haha
<tedg> kenvandine, I did that to my DSL modem and router.  Too many outages here.
<pitti> Sweetshark: hello
<kenvandine> tedg, it is really rare here
<tedg> Laptop on battery, everything else on UPS.
<seb128> pitti, you called it a day, go back to !work ;-)
<kenvandine> tedg, i should though... just nothing else in the same room needing a UPS
<pitti> seb128: still in a train :)
<tedg> kenvandine, I picked up a cheap one when Circuit City went under.
<seb128> pitti, 3g for the win? ;-)
<pitti> seb128: or rather, just went into it -- before we were travelling in a car, where a laptop is impractical
<tedg> kenvandine, Won't last long, but they don't draw much power.
<pitti> (we went with a colleague of my wife to Leipzig, and now doing the remaining bit to Dresden with train)
<pitti> seb128: yeah, the builtin antenna of the x201 is marvellous
<seb128> pitti, (oh ok, are you at work tomorrow or having a day off?)
<pitti> seb128: I'm officially at work
<seb128> ok
<pitti> seb128: we went a day early as the uni of my wife does a ceremony/party for this year's graduates
<pitti> seb128: so I'll work from Dresden tomorrow
<seb128> ah ok
<pitti> so, see you tomorrow! good night
<seb128> 'night pitti
<jasoncwarner_> kenvandine: reading some back scroll...you have power indicator? yay! when do the rest of us poor slubs get one ;)
<kenvandine> jasoncwarner_, it needs an archive admin to let it in :)
<kenvandine> seb said tomorrow
<jasoncwarner_> ah, ok
<jasoncwarner_> anyone here know why I ended up in Unity-2d after my update this morning? I didn't see anything screaming at me like X/Mesa or NVidia, though, to be fair, it was a scan of the list :P
<jasoncwarner_> happy to be in unity 2d though...reporting some bugs now!
<cyphermox> hey jasoncwarner_
<jasoncwarner_> what up, cyphermox
<jasoncwarner_> ?
<cyphermox> heh
<cyphermox> nm-applet will create menu only when you click it?
<cyphermox> I'm satisfied enough with the code to upload shortly
<jasoncwarner_> say again? I click on it and the menu is created, yes
<cyphermox> yes
<cyphermox> usually it gets recreated every few seconds, or after we get scan results, etc
<cyphermox> now it gets refreshed when you click on it, just before displaying
<jasoncwarner_> oh, ok
<jasoncwarner_> :)
<jasoncwarner_> gotta reboot...removed nvidia drivers to see if that was problem with 3D...be back
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, lp #807209 perhaps
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 807209 in nvidia-graphics-drivers "Lost glx after first upgrade from oneirc alpha 2 install" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/807209
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: yeah, looks like it
<jasoncwarner_> and also, my system seems very laggy now....(debugging)
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-07-08
<jasoncwarner_> FYI, RAOF and bryceh
<jasoncwarner_> running noveau 3d now (since nvidia isn't working)
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, ok
<jasoncwarner_> and, man, my system started running "hot". Don't know if that is related, but worth noting. Other things I've seen are laggy interfaces.
<jasoncwarner_> not exactly scientific feedback, I know ;)
<bryceh> :-)
<bryceh> it's certainly conceivable that could be related to bad nouveau 3d support for the card
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, `ubuntu-bug xorg`.  I suspect RAOF will be interested in it.  Write up what you've seen.
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, might also check cpu load, just in case it's some unrelated runaway client program or something
<jasoncwarner_> nothing going on in the CPU right now, though at one point the U1 client started to take 200% and then fell off...
<jasoncwarner_> kenvandine: ^^
<kenvandine> ugh
<kenvandine> syncdaemon?
<jasoncwarner_> yeah
<jasoncwarner_> and I've had a TON of crashes on that, actually
<kenvandine> haven't heard anyone else with that issue
<kenvandine> file a bug please
<jasoncwarner_> trying now...
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, oh, might need to manually install xdiagnose before reporting the X bug
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, sudo apt-get install xdiagnose ; ubuntu-bug xorg
<jasoncwarner_> thanks...already installed ;)
<jasoncwarner_> hey kenvandine, is there an easy way to get the things needed for Ubuntu One like 'ubuntu-bug ubuntu-one' or something?
<kenvandine> ubuntu-bug ubuntuone-client
<jasoncwarner_> FYI, I'm getting this message when I open U1 client: File Sync error. (org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus))
<jasoncwarner_> thanks...filing now
<kenvandine> wow
<kenvandine> sounds very broken
<bryceh> daemon not running or something?
<kenvandine> you mean opening the control panel?
<jasoncwarner_> yeah
<jasoncwarner_> that message appears at top of control panel
<kenvandine> syncdaemon must be crashing
<kenvandine> do you have a crash file?
<jasoncwarner_> where to look?
<kenvandine> in /var/crash/?
<kenvandine> for syncdaemon
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh and RAOF, fyi #807305
<jasoncwarner_> kenvandine: I have three
<kenvandine> ubuntu-bug /var/crash/your.crash
<jasoncwarner_> sorry..just one for U1
<jasoncwarner_> others are for unity-panel-service and gnome-settings-daemon
<jasoncwarner_> kenvandine: FYI. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntuone-client/+bug/807203 17 people effected by bug, it seems
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 807203 in zeitgeist "ubuntuone-syncdaemon crashed with AttributeError in __getattr__(): 'Symbol' object has no attribute 'PAGINATED_TEXT_DOCUMENT'" [High,Confirmed]
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: +1 to that.
<kenvandine> ugh..
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, looks like you suspended during your current session; just to clarify did you notice the performance issue prior to the suspend, or did it only start after that?
<bryceh> i.e. does it start right immediately on boot?
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: yeah, seems to happen at boot. I had a fussy baby and had to run upstairs and suspended while debugging baby
<jasoncwarner_> but I did notice it before I suspended
<bryceh> ok
<jasoncwarner_> wow...those are some thorough logs ;)
<bryceh> you see why we like to have them.  ;-)
<bryceh> unfortunately, they don't seem to have captured anything of relevance to the performance issue
<RAOF> If it starts immediately after boot then it's probably not compiz being leaky.
<RAOF> It could concievably be a thermal issue; (sane) hardware will clock down when overheating, and that can make things slow.
<bryceh> could there be leftover GL bits from the -nvidia install?
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, anything odd about the fan behavior?  like, is it not turned on when it should be?
<jasoncwarner_> oh, yay! someone fixed the keyboard setup so I can now switch key refresh rates! Thank you rodrigo_, seb128 or whoever!
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: actually, fan seems fine.
<jasoncwarner_> I might be sending you on redherring.
<jasoncwarner_> ubuntuone-syncdaemon is actually going kinda crazy all of the sudden (just reopened system monitor)
<jasoncwarner_> 200%
<jasoncwarner_> 85%
<jasoncwarner_> 150%
<jasoncwarner_> 200%
<bryceh> ah
<jasoncwarner_> 0Q%
<RAOF> Heh.
<jasoncwarner_> it keeps going up and down.
<bryceh> so my initial guess was right for a change :-)
<jasoncwarner_> NM! sorry, bryceh and RAOF
<jasoncwarner_> I always blame X
<bryceh> heh
<jasoncwarner_> stupid X keeps making my internets slow.
<RAOF> As I always say: X is actually perfect.
<jasoncwarner_> stupid X just raised my taxes
<RAOF> Any apparent bugs can be handled with a quick and simple SEP field.
<bryceh> you're in good company, we've been field lots and lots of non-X bugs lately ;-)
<bryceh> guess it's either a good sign that X is more stable this time around, or a bad sign people are so suspicious of X!
<jasoncwarner_> probably a bit of both...kind of how whenever something goes wrong in unity I start to ask didrocks about compiz ;)
<jasoncwarner_> hey robert_ancell , btw...I let me kid play a cool video game this morning..., something called unity-greeter...seems perfect for a 3 year old!
<robert_ancell> haha! Nice
<bryceh> I tried to get Dutch to play with gcompris but it was not his cup of tea
<bryceh> I need some simple app that just makes random colors and sounds when you hit different keys
<bryceh> (and that disables all the special keys!)
<RAOF> bryceh: Get him a multitouch screen and Chase's multitouch drawing demo!
<jasoncwarner_> sounds like an iPad ;)
<bryceh> RAOF, heh actually I did a while back however that computer got taken away
<bryceh> RAOF, another guy had written that drawing program.  I was going to mod it a bit to make it into a better toy
<TheMuso> Does anybody know if there is a tag we can mark bugs with that need translating?
 * TheMuso asks in #ubuntu-bugs.
<pitti> Good morning
<cyphermox> pitti: good morning!
<pitti> hey cyphermox, how are you?
<cyphermox> pretty good
<cyphermox> and you?
<pitti> I'm great, thanks
<cyphermox> late night upload of nm-applet, CHECK.
<cyphermox> now I'm off to bed ;)
<cyphermox> oh wait, are we still in soft freeze?
<cyphermox> nm
<pitti> cyphermox: no
<pitti> cyphermox: it was lifted some 24 hours ago :)
<cyphermox> yeah, I got confused by the day change now ;)
<kenvandine> good morning pitti
<cyphermox> hey kenvandine
<pitti> hey kenvandine, how are you?
<cyphermox> you're early!
<kenvandine> and cyphermox :)
<kenvandine> pitti, good
<pitti> or, up late rather :)
<cyphermox> ehehe
<kenvandine> about to crash :)
<cyphermox> ah, yeah
 * kenvandine rewrote all the gwibber menus tonight... much cleaner now :)
<kenvandine> but boring :/
<kenvandine> good night all!
<cyphermox> night
<cyphermox> am leaving as well, see you later!
<pitti> sleep well!
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti! how are you?
<pitti> quite fine, thanks! how about you?
 * pitti in update/upload mood
<didrocks> pitti: my flu has almost ended, which is nice for RMLL and 5h of train later today :)
<pitti> oh, good! mine is gone as well
<pitti> RMLL?
<didrocks> a worldwide-french FLOSS event :) http://2011.rmll.info/
<didrocks> I'm giving 3 conferences there (unity, how to integrate your application in unity, how to help in testing an unstable release)
<didrocks> hum, apport keep spamming every 2s with u1 crashing there (or maybe it's update-notifier?)
<didrocks> no, in fact u1 is really crashing. and it replaces the file in /var/crash/
<pitti> didrocks: wow, good luck with that!
<pitti> yes, it keeps crashing here as well :/
<didrocks> sudo chmod -x /usr/lib/ubuntuone-client/ubuntuone-syncdaemon then :/
<didrocks> indeed, your are in upload mood this morning ;)
<pitti> {lib,}gnome-keyring coming up
<didrocks> nice ;)
<pitti> glib2.0 on amd64 seems unhappy, though :/ keeps timing out in the test suite
<pitti> (on the builders)
<didrocks> seif_: around?
<didrocks> seems that zg is the guilty in u1 crashing
<didrocks> ok, got a patch for u1
<seif_> didrocks, can you show me the patch and the bug
<seif_> didrocks, got it
<seif_> the raptor 2.1 issue
<seif_> i mean
<didrocks> seif_: the patch is for u1 for now, on not crashing if zg is
<seif_> raptopr2 issue
<didrocks> seif_: right :)
<seif_> didrocks, yeah
<seif_> looking into it
<didrocks> seif_: did you see my comment? https://bugs.launchpad.net/zeitgeist/+bug/807076/comments/2
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 807076 in zeitgeist "raptor2 not supported" [Low,In progress]
<seif_> can i have any backlog
<didrocks> seif_: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/74738481/Traceback.txt that one maybe?
<cdbs-android> didrocks: Problems after problems, looks like I won't be able to work on the spec till next week, my 2-month old xps died again
<seif_> didrocks, i am fixing this
<didrocks> seif_: you rock! :)
<didrocks> cdbs-android: argh, it's not your hardware time it seems :/
<didrocks> seif_: take your time, I'm uploading the u1 fixes, and zg is still working for file/application search
<cdbs-android> cyphermox: I won't be able to fix liboauth, next week probably. My laptop died
<jasoncwarner_> hey didrocks...able to help me debug something?
<jasoncwarner_> when I try to run nautilus, nothing happens...so when I run 'nautilus' from the command line, I get an error: Could not register the application: Timeout was reached
<jasoncwarner_> not sure where to look for more information!
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: sounds like a gnome-session message
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: one sec
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: no worries...
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: finishing the u1 crash first, get back to you then :)
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: oh, please! that thing was wreaking havoc on my system all day!
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> hum, u1 never did any rebuilt with gcc 4.6? Fixing the errorsâ¦
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: racing against crashes ;) otherwise good, almost no more flu! :) and you?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, good thanks. just trying to finish the last few WI's on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-mozilla-rapid-release-maintenance
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, does anyone have any idea what is going on here? https://launchpadlibrarian.net/74754356/buildlog_ubuntu-oneiric-i386.dehydra_0.9.hg20110312-0ubuntu2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<chrisccoulson> i have no problem installing the packages locally or in a chroot :/
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: maybe temporary inconsistency? did you try a give back?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i don't normally like doing that without understanding what the original problem was :)
<geser> chrisccoulson: have you tried installing all build-dependencies or only the packages from the error?
<chrisccoulson> geser, all of them (and i can build it locally too)
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, good morning
<pitti> hey jasoncwarner_
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti, how are you?
<jasoncwarner_> hey pitti, morning!
<pitti> quite fine, thanks! back in Dresden
<didrocks> dobey: you will have https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/ubuntuone-client/dont-suffer-zg-crash/+merge/67285 and https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/ubuntuone-client/use_result_var/+merge/67287 to review. It's already as distro patches in the ubuntuone-client package to fix the current oneiric crash
<mvo> hey pitti! would you mind if I cherry pick the forward_search fix you did yesterday and upload it? I think update-manager is ready mostly now
<geser> chrisccoulson: have you tried grabbing the buildd chroot and trying it there?
<pitti> mvo: wohoo!
<mvo> plus gconf->gsettings etc
<geser> chrisccoulson: else try giving it back and see if it was a transient error or not
<mvo> one thing I will need is get_xid() at some point, that is currently not introspectable, but its not critical at this point
<pitti> mvo: it's in testing, so I'll commit/upload to Debian and sync
<mvo> pitti: awsome, thanks
<pitti> mvo: right, I didn't find a good solution for this one either so far
<mvo> pitti: I will put in a version dependency and wait until its there
<pitti> mvo: I'm almost done with gnome-keyring, doing pygobject next
<mvo> is there something fundamental blocking to make get_xid() available?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: is it exactly the message you get? It's not "Unable to register" rather?
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: yeah, copy and pasted from terminal
<jasoncwarner_> nothing else was there
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: ok, maybe it's gtkapplication then, let me check
<didrocks> not gnome-session, not nautilus anyway :)
<pitti> mvo: I don't remember right now
<pitti> mvo: might be because gdk_x11_window_get_xid() returns a Window datatype?
<mvo> ok, no worries, not urgent
<mvo> but its just a int, no?
<pitti> but anyway, it should work in theory
 * mvo nods
<pitti> I suppose it stumbles over
<pitti>           <type name="xlib.Window" c:type="Window"/>
<pitti> and can't resolve this any further
<mvo> yeah, that sounds very plausible
<pitti> but maybe that can be annotated away
<mvo> what will be the version of python-gobject with the fix? so that I don't forget to update my control file
<chrisccoulson> geser, oh, i recreated it in pbuilder now
<pitti> mvo: 2.28.6-2
<mvo> ta
<chrisccoulson> libgcc1: Breaks: gcc-4.5 (< 4.5.3-2) but 4.5.3-1ubuntu2 is to be installed.
<chrisccoulson> the last gcc-4.6 upload added a breaks which makes gcc-4.5 uninstallable
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: hum, no gio, not gtk :/ do you have it at each nautilus start?
<jasoncwarner_> yeah...it is really behaving weirdly...
<jasoncwarner_> actually...let me reboot, see if I am having a weird update problem
<jasoncwarner_> rebooting...
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: you should maybe install the ubuntuone-client update first ;)
<didrocks> or do not let it start
<bigon> could someone have a look at clutter-1.0? it needs a merge (or at least a rebuild) for the rename on gir1.2-json-glib-1.0 to gir1.2-json-1.0
<chrisccoulson> huh, "gcc -print-file-name=plugin" doesn't work in gcc-4.6 :/
<pitti> mvo: hm, seems something in glib/gio changed underneath, I have a test suite failure/hang now; need to investigate this first
<mvo> ok, no worries
<alex3f> hi mvo!
<alex3f> I finally pushed version abstraction (as discussed in an old email) in my backend-refactor
<alex3f> please have a look at it
<alex3f> i'm also addressing the origin abstraction now
<seif> didrocks, back
<seif> didrocks, what other outstanding issues are there
<seif> i can look into them
<seif> (unity wise)
<didrocks> seif: did the zg datahub not starting zg is fixed?
<seif>  we have the solution
<seif> we need mhr3 or kamstrup to work on it though
<seif> its a flushing mechanism
<seif> which means zeitgeist does not start until the first thing is requested
<seif> if any1 is pushing on startup we wont care
<seif> we will put it in some C process that will be flushed upon startup
<seif> didrocks, can you report a bug on that please
<seif> :)
<didrocks> seif: sure doing
<seif> so we can get more peopls attentnion
<seif> didrocks, i am thinking of putting a 100$ bounty on that
<seif> and requirments hsould be
<seif> that
<seif> no unity not zeitgeist person is to hack on it
<seif> this way we can get new developers
<seif> :)
<didrocks> yeah, seems a smart way of getting new contributors for easy tasks :)
<seif> exactly
<seif> ahhhh njpatel is here
<didrocks> that, and the indexing are the two big ones AFAIK
<didrocks> but for the indexing, we need John
<seif> didrocks, what kind of indexing
<didrocks> for some design input
<seif> ah that one
<njpatel> What what?
<seif> didrocks, well we have all the tools ready
<didrocks> seif: well, I call it indexing, even if it's not :)
<didrocks> seif: right, we need to see how to integrate it at best
<seif> its just a design
<seif> exactlx
<seif> the script is there
<seif> now we need to know how to run the scriopt or when
<didrocks> exactly
<seif> didrocks, we reduced memory consumption if you have not noticed with 0.8.1
<seif> njpatel, did u have your coffe yet oh brown one :P
<didrocks> seif: yeah, I checked after the update, and indeed, nice work!
<seif> fts got updated too
<seif> but needs to be released
<njpatel> seif, coffee? Tea my friend :)
<didrocks> seif: ok, no hurry though for it
<njpatel> seif, also, I logged in an ZG crashed....fix your crap man! ;P
<seif> njpatel, give me your log please
<seif> its in .cache/zeitgeist
<seif> :)
<seif> unless you logged porn then please remember the title of the movie and delete those lines :P
<njpatel> seif, you just want to see what, er, "special" files I have
<didrocks> seif: you already had a bug btw: https://bugs.launchpad.net/zeitgeist-datahub/+bug/772265
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 772265 in zeitgeist-datahub "The datahub starts zeitgeist-daemon on startup" [Undecided,New]
<njpatel> seif, I think apport caught it so i might just be able to provide a useful bug
<seb128> hey didrocks pitti
<seb128> hey everybody
 * njpatel plays with apport
<didrocks> salut seb128!
<pitti> bonjour seb128, ca va?
<njpatel> hey didrocks
<didrocks> hey njpatel
<seb128> thanks to whoever newer indicators
<njpatel> hey pitti
<seif> hi pitti
<pitti> seif: de rien :)
<seb128> pitti, ca va bien, et toi ?
<seif> didrocks, if i fix the bug now you buy me 10 beers ok
<seif> ?
<pitti> hallo seif, wie gehts?
<seif> pitti, ganz gut
<pitti> seif: I'm great, thanks! in upload mood :)
<mvo> hey seif!
<didrocks> njpatel: already reported :)
<seif> viel arbeit
<didrocks> seif: 10! I'm sure I can trade with something else :)
<seif> pitti, wie gehts ihnen
<seif> :=)
<njpatel> didrocks, awesome :)
<seb128> pitti, thanks for the updates as well ;-)
<seif> didrocks, your french you occupied egypt you owe me beer already
<pitti> seif: prima, danke!
<seif> neil can go live off british guilt
<seif> :P
<didrocks> seif: ahah, I think all europe owe a lot of beers then in various country ;)
<seif> lol
<seb128> desrt, glib hates the builder
<seif> guys i am having a gvaraint issue here
<seif> gnome-tweak-tools is not working
<seb128> how not working?
<seb128> pitti, did you retry the glib build earlier today?
<pitti> seb128: yes
<seb128> ok, trying again for the 4th time
<pitti> seb128: it was a bit unclear what happened there
<pitti> seb128: seems to hang eternally in a test case
<seb128> it worked on the second try on i386
<seb128> pitti, right, it's random, it hangs on different testcases :-(
<pitti> ah, it finally timed out again
<seb128> desrt and ricotz tried to debug it a bit during the rally by adding some printfs but it worked on that upload
<seb128> "funny" but it worked without issue on armel and powerpc on the first build
<seb128> usually that's the archs which work not so great :p
<pitti> seb128: they are slow enough!
<seb128> hum
<seb128> session-service.c:592:11: error: format '%li' expects argument of type 'long int', but argument 4 has type 'gint64' [-Werror=format]
<pitti> seb128: were you meaning to retry the build again?
<pitti> want me to trigger it?
<mvo> does anyone know whats up with gnome-tweak-tool? seems to be crashing snce a recent upgrade
<seb128> mvo, stacktrace? but "don't use it"
<mvo> "NotImplementedError: structure type 'GVariant' is not supported yet" <- error
<mvo> why should I not use it?
<seb128> pitti, ups, just did, thanks
<seb128> mvo, because it's buggy :p
<mvo> haha, I noticed that ;)
<seb128> mvo, I blame pitti's gobject-introspection update
<seb128> I doubt glib broke GVariant, must but a gir issue
<pitti> mvo: that's the very thing I'm debugging right now
<pitti> it breaks pygobject's test suite all over
<pitti> (which holds me from uploading pygobject)
<pitti> mvo: so, I'm on it
<seb128> mvo, just curious but what settings do you tweak from gtt?
<seb128> mvo, just to know if there are some we should bring on the default gcc in some way
<mvo> seb128: I want to see what monospace font I have, it looks unfamiliar and check my theme, I use the light theme, but the indicators are really hard to see currently
<mvo> seb128: so it looks like some mixup in the theme
<seb128> they are blurry right?
<seb128> the text at least is for me
<seb128> mvo, dconf-editor is your friend :p
<mvo> meh
<pitti> ok, downgrading gir1.2-glib-2.0 to 0.10.8-1ubuntu1 fixes it
<pitti> well, it makes it slightly better, anyway
<seb128> didrocks, oh about gnome-session I assigned you the bug because I though you had a spec to re-enable the option for those who want to use it from the command line
<seb128> didrocks, i.e letting the ui part off, ignored session with timestamps older than oneiric
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, but I updated the spec to tell that finally it wasn't still working
<seb128> ignoring
<seb128> ok, I thought we were ok letting people shot themself in the foot from the command line
<didrocks> seb128: and I think we don't want to spent more than a day for something which is half-broken anyway
<seb128> since some clearly want to do it
<didrocks> seb128: well, it's really show in the foot if they try to change from session
<seb128> no, I would just have dropped the patch, but let the tab hidden
<didrocks> required components are still register and conflicts
<seb128> right but some are clearly asking for it
<seb128> usually geeks that use custom sessions and don't switch
<didrocks> so we will get bugs about "changed my session but unity still starts"
<didrocks> or whatever
<seb128> well, if those used the command line to store a session they are not basic users
<didrocks> took me a lot of time previous cycles about all people getting this
<seb128> but ok, I might have a look later in the cycle
<didrocks> right, but that doesn't mean they will know what's the cause
<seb128> right, but we had the option in the ui by then
<didrocks> indeed
<seb128> we had a tab with "click there to store your session"
<seb128> which lusers clicked
<didrocks> but still, we will ship a feature half-broken, just not visible
<didrocks> not sure we want to do that
<didrocks> you convinced me that this option was not useful :)
<seb128> I've read enough comments on the internet of technical users being annoyed enough by it being dropped that they consider switching distro that I would like it back in some way
<seb128> like a "--will-break-my-session" command line option
<seb128> yeah, and you convinced me we should try to be nice to our tech users ;-)
<didrocks> not sure that shipping something broken is what we want, but ok, can look at that :)
<didrocks> oh, you reconsidered finally? ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> because you were quite clear about this, I'm surprized you changed your opinion for that particular one :p
<seb128> well anyway I was still on the impression that you said you would turn it on for oneiric but only from a command line at UDS
<didrocks> but ok, in that case, I can revisit
<seb128> that's why I assigned you the bug
<seb128> didrocks, only idiots don't revisit their positions sometimes ;-)
<didrocks> yeah, I changed the blueprint and talk here IIRC about it
<pitti> seb128: seems to hang again :/
<seb128> pitti, :-(
<didrocks> seb128: so, thinking about it, I think that people rather want to "start applications reliably at each boot" (they won't spaw the command line each time they want to register the session). So basically, the application list at startup without system apps can do it
<seb128> pitti, I'm pondering turning off the testsuit and do a new upload
<didrocks> seb128: we probably need to get compiz and this ui let you "start app on ws <number>"
<seb128> didrocks, right
<didrocks> at least, we will have a more generic feature which will work with every apps
<seb128> we have a busy cycle though so let's keep thinking a bit about it and see next cycle
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, my tomboy won a new note :-)
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: can I bother you with a thunderbird issue? ;)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, sure. but i'm pretty busy already ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I get the impression that some folders are only refreshed if I click on them.
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i think that might be the case, visually
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: like, I have my folder with ubuntu-devel ML content, my thunderbird was opened since this morning, no "new number "showing
<didrocks> oh, already known then?
<chrisccoulson> oh, you mean the actual number is not refreshed?
<chrisccoulson> that sounds like a bug
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: well, there is no number at all
<didrocks> but when I click on it
<didrocks> I get, like this time "5", with the 5 emails
<chrisccoulson> what type of account is this?
<didrocks> but the icon shows that number only when I click on the folder
<didrocks> imap
<didrocks> and it's not the case for every folders in that account
<didrocks> but seems to always be on the same ones
<chrisccoulson> do you get entries in the messaging indicator for those folders before you click on them?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hum, I didn't try to notice, I'll for next time
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it would be useful
<chrisccoulson> that will tell us if it is just a visual problem with the folder pane or not
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, that would be the first step then :)
<didrocks> I'll tell you
<desrt> seb128: i hate the builders.
<seb128> desrt, they hate you back
<desrt> actually, it seems that they hate ricotz :)
<seb128> desrt, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glib2.0/2.29.10-0ubuntu1/+build/2613839
<seb128> desrt, well now they hate pitti
<seb128> 2.29.10 doesn't want to build on amd64
<seb128> it built on i386 on the second retry though so I'm happy :p
<desrt> glib is having a rough ride lately
<desrt> i should probably pay more attention to actively attempting to maintain it
<seb128> well I didn't notice particular issue out of that testsuit hang
<seb128> seems to be hanging on gdbus tests, not the same one each time though
<desrt> we had some internal issues lately
<desrt> it has nothing to do with gdbus, i think
<desrt> the real failure is that we don't unit-test inter-thread dispatches of gmainloop
<desrt> and gdbus does that
<desrt> so it's the first test that sees the problem
<desrt> i think it's very likely related to the eventfd work
<desrt> colin probably made some weird mistake somewhere
<desrt> and introduced a race
<desrt> seb128: an interesting possibility would be to try to use a vendor patch to revert his changes and see if it improves the situation
<desrt> seb128: if i'm right then it would be a relatively 'cheap' solution for you since you could do it right now, and quite easily
<desrt> and if it works out nicely then it points a finger directly at the source of the problem, which is useful feedback for us
<rodrigo_> is ubuntu going to switch to systemd anytime soon?
<desrt> rodrigo_: rumour has it that it will happen after the LTS release
<seb128> rodrigo_, no
<seb128> not "any time soon"
<pitti> rodrigo_: right now it seems the foundations team wants to stick with upstart
<seb128> like not before a year
<seb128> if we switch
<rodrigo_> ok, then not sure what to do with the system-wide setting stuff in g-c-c
<rodrigo_> I guess we could implement the DBus interfaces of systemd in ubuntu-system-service
<pitti> rodrigo_: can't it use ubuntu-system-service?
<seb128> did GNOME accept the systemd depends?
<pitti> right, I thought that was the idea
<desrt> seb128: i don't think that we did.
<seb128> the discussion stopped on the list without consensus
<desrt> seb128: for the record, i added a sort of systemd dependency to dconf recently, in git
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes, but for that we'd need to create a distro patch, I am trying to make it work for both ubuntu and upstream
<seb128> desrt, the xdg run dir thing?
<pitti> rodrigo_: we could change ubuntu-system-service to have the same dbus names/API
<desrt> seb128: yes.  exactly.
<pitti> rodrigo_: nothing else uses it, after all
<rodrigo_> seb128, the consensus was to define dbus interfaces that anyone could implement
<desrt> it's a standard....
<seb128> desrt, that should be easy to get on !systemd as well
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes, that's what I'm thinking
<desrt> seb128: indeed.
<desrt> seb128: and i use it through glib which, itself, has a reasonable fallback
<desrt> (~/.cache/)
<seb128> desrt, great
<pitti> mvo, seb128: gobject-introspection hit over the head, and uploaded; I now know what's going on, but the real solution will still take some time; but this hack should do
<desrt> but dconf will break on NFS systems now if systemd is not used
<seb128> pitti, ok
<desrt> since ~/.cache/ is a particularly bad spot in case of NFS
<desrt> someone like pitti should come up with a solution to this problem :)
<seb128> desrt, could you open an upstart bug about xdg_run_dir? or do you want me to do it?
<pitti> moving to systemd? *cough*
<desrt> seb128: you should do it, i guess
<rodrigo_> another problem is the packagekit thing, as we don't want in g-c-c upstream code to deal with different package systems, all that should be lower in the stack
<seb128> desrt, ok, will do and then I will ping foundation guys saying we need it this cycle if possible
<rodrigo_> so is it possible to have packagekit on the CD?
<seb128> rodrigo_, no
<pitti> rodrigo_: no
<desrt> annoyingly, this is all rather related to the question of dbus lifecycle
<seb128> rodrigo_, we have sessioninstaller, it works with i.e file-roller
<rodrigo_> then distro patch then :(
<pitti> rodrigo_: PK doesn't work for us as a general package installer; we have aptdaemon
<rodrigo_> sessioninstaller?
<desrt> seb128: link them the xdg spec.  should help to convince them.
<seb128> desrt, right
<pitti> rodrigo_: sessioninstaller is the user session component of it, yes
<seb128> rodrigo_, apt-cache show sessioninstaller
<rodrigo_> pitti, right, just thinking about the API, which is more and more used in gnome
<pitti> rodrigo_: sessioninstaller even implements PK's API in terms of aptdaemon
<pitti> oh, where did he go
<seb128> rodrigo_, don't run away! ;-)
<pitti> rodrigo_: wb
<pitti> rodrigo_: sessioninstaller even implements PK's API in terms of aptdaemon
<pitti> rodrigo_: and we install it by default
<rodrigo_> sorry, xchat crashed
<pitti> rodrigo_: so ideally it would "just work"
<rodrigo_> pitti, ah, ok that's good
<desrt> seb128: will you try the eventfd revert vendor patch today?
<desrt> seb128: because i intend to roll a glib release of my own today with a different set of vendor patches....
<seb128> desrt, yes, I just finish what I do, then it's next
<desrt> okay.  awesome
<desrt> i will wait for you, then :)
<seb128> k ;-)
<rodrigo_> pitti, ok, so apps can safely use packagekit api on a default ubuntu install?
<seb128> rodrigo_, that should work, test it though
<pitti> rodrigo_: only the session bus
<seb128> rodrigo_, but it works for i.e file-roller
<pitti> rodrigo_: sessioninstaller doesn't implement the system bus PK API
<rodrigo_> I had to install packagekit for the info panel in g-c-c to detect upgrades
<rodrigo_> pitti, ah, it's got the same API but on the session bus?
<pitti> rodrigo_: no
<pitti> rodrigo_: it's got the same session bus API as PK
<chrisccoulson> b'ah, my internet connection has gone down for the second day in a row
<rodrigo_> ah
<pitti> rodrigo_: but it doesn't have PK's system bus API; that's aptdaemon, and has a different API due to how apt works
<pitti> rodrigo_: but the session bus API doesn't do stuff like "updates available", only querying and installing packages
<pitti> rodrigo_: for "updates available" it should use aptdaemon
<rodrigo_> pitti, right, but then we need a distro-only patch :(
<glatzor> pitti, rodrigo_ aptdaemon doesn't provide a query/search interface in contrast to packagekit. by design it only takes care of the actions which modify the system and require higher privileges
<pitti> rodrigo_: yes
<pitti> rodrigo_: packaging is inherentl distro specific :/
<pitti> rodrigo_: there were some discussions in the past to make PK work properly for apt, but it was found to be impractical with the current design
<rodrigo_> pitti, well, since packagekit system bus is being used more and more, we'll have to carry quite big patches
<glatzor> pitti, rodrigo_ so there isn't any "updates available" method in aptdaemon
<rodrigo_> yeah
<glatzor> rodrigo_, "normal" applications should not use the system bus directly but make use of the session bus
<glatzor> rodrigo_, the system bus interface is designed for package managers and system update managers
<rodrigo_> ok
<pitti> rodrigo_: might be easier to disable the package updates part in g-c-c? we alreayd have update-notifier/update-manager for that anyway, with notifications
<rodrigo_> pitti, yeah, it would just not work by default
<rodrigo_> unless packagekit is installed
<pitti> rodrigo_: the button/label could be hidden if PK is not available? that should even be upstreamable
<rodrigo_> ok, but if upstream already uses the session bus interface, that would solve the problem for other cases, like installing languages
<pitti> for installing languages, sessioninstaller should work fine
<rodrigo_> pitti, yeah, the button is already hidden, only shows up if it gets an answer from packagekit
<pitti> rodrigo_: ah, sounds perfect then -- we don't need to change anything then?
<rodrigo_> pitti, not there, no
<rodrigo_> and for installing languages, if the session bus interface is enough, it should be ok also
<didrocks> ok, time to take the train. I'll try to hop on IRC next week if the internet connexion is good enough, otherwise, I should be reachable by emails
<glatzor> rodrigo_, perhaps you need to a new resource to InstallResource method of the session API
<rodrigo_> didrocks, going on vacation?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: no, at RMLL (french floss event. at the ubuntu booth and doing some talks)
<glatzor> rodrigo_, InstallResource("language", "German") to be really distro neutral on the g-c-c side
<rodrigo_> glatzor, yeah, I was hoping InstallProvideFiles would be enough
<rodrigo_> glatzor, yeah, sounds good
<didrocks> see you guys :)
<glatzor> rodrigo_, The InstallProvideFiles doesn't yet work for Debian/Ubuntu properly. It would require to add support for remote apt-file
<glatzor> rodrigo_, the aptcc backend of packagekit also doesn't support the SearchFiles method with uninstalled files
<rodrigo_> glatzor, ok, I'm discussing with upstream your idea of InstallResource
<glatzor> rodrigo_, so InstallProvideFiles won't work too with packagekit on Debian/Ubuntu
<seb128> desrt, do you have a diff handy of what a revert of the eventfd change would be? ;-) I guess it includes several commits
<desrt> seb128: i guess so too.  i'll prepare one for you.
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<desrt> seb128: step 1: revert initial patch
<desrt> step 2: notice conflicts
<desrt> step 3: resolve.  repeat.
<desrt> :)
<seb128> desrt, you said you will prepare one I decide to stay on that :p
<desrt> step 1: ask desrt
<seb128> \o/
<desrt> :)
<mvo> rodrigo_: what is InstallFile used for or how? for the language support? we have InstallFile for bnaries (where we can us ethe command-not-found data)
<rodrigo_> mvo, not being used yet, was just thinking how it could be done upstream that would work on ubuntu
<rodrigo_> mvo, sending a message now to the PK list to see if the InstallResource idea works for everyone
<rodrigo_> and then we'll have to provide that method in sessioninstaller
<mvo> aha, ok. I'm keen on learning how InstallFile is used, we can not make it universally work without the need t odownload the *huge* Contents-$arch file, but for specific cases like binaries we can
<mvo> great, thanks rodrigo_
<mvo> thanks thanks glatzor
<rodrigo_> :)
<glatzor> hey mvo!
<glatzor> mvo, sorry for my huge disappear in the last weeks
<mvo> glatzor: I got a request about a "UpdatesAvailable" method over dbus, could we (ab)use the sessioninstaller bus for this?
<mvo> glatzor: no worries
<mvo> glatzor: real-life is also important :)
<mvo> rodrigo_: hm, if we had UpdatesAvailable on the sessionbus that could be used by gnome sa well, right? I assume its currently using the systembus only because there is no such method on the session bus?
<glatzor> mvo, you want it to be distro neutral?
<mvo> glatzor: ideally
<mvo> glatzor: the plan is to have it in unity in a indicator
<glatzor> packagekit was written originally to have an universal update application on all distros
<mvo> glatzor: and if gnome is also using something like this (from what I read earlier from rodrigo_) it sounds like there is a API there :)
<mvo> right, I'm thinking of a more lightweight way that can be used by e.g. a panel indicator
<mvo> enough so that it can display a icon if updates are available but not the full thing with all details
<rodrigo_> yes, not sure why some operations are on the session and others on the system bus
<glatzor> rodrigo_, because the session bus provides a complete ui for handling package installations
<rodrigo_> ah
<glatzor> you just call InstallPackage xterm and all the download, progress and error handling will be done for you
<glatzor> rodrigo_, you can even modify the to be shown dialogs and error messages. but the later one isn't supported by sessioninstaller
<desrt> seb128: think i have a patch.  doing a local test build first.
<glatzor> rodrigo_, furthermore the system bus is quite complex. it is transaction based and requires to "perform a transaction dance" - but this is nowadays covered by the pk_tasks methods
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<rodrigo_> glatzor, ok, so the system bus is for package managers and the session one for desktop apps
<glatzor> rodrigo_, right
<desrt> seb128: http://fpaste.org/98Fa/ should do the trick
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<pitti> rodrigo_: I see that the g-c-c task of bug 787694 is fixed; what needs to happen in jockey, scp, and friends now to make them appear again? (the other tasks)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 787694 in gnome-control-center "GNOME 3 System Settings: Provide stub icons for launching Ubuntu specific capplets" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/787694
<rodrigo_> pitti, working on them
<pitti> rodrigo_: apparently having a simple "Settings" Category in the .desktop isn't sufficient any more?
<rodrigo_> pitti, no, we need to provide a .so implementing the ExternalPanel class
<pitti> rodrigo_: do we need g-c-c patches to display the ones we want, or can this be done in the packages themselves?
<mvo> so â¦ gtk3 update-manager is hitting the archive soon, please let me know if everything explodes
<desrt> man.  glib testcases are getting heavy these days
<desrt> either that or this laptop is very slow :)
<rodrigo_> pitti, in the packages themselves, or in g-c-c, since some of those packages use python's distutils and I'm not sure how to integrate a C build there
<seb128> mvo, \o/
<pitti> desrt: I wouldn't call my laptop "slow", and it's still taking ages
<rodrigo_> pitti, but then we'll have to depend on those packages, so I guess it's better in each package
<pitti> rodrigo_: right, that would have been my next question
<chrisccoulson> pitti, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-mozilla-rapid-release-maintenance is so close now! i might be asking you to do some package removals later ;)
<desrt> this spawn-sync test is deadly
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yay
<seb128> desrt, it takes longer to run the testsuite than to do the 3 builds the package is doing
<seb128> desrt, I tend to disable the testsuite locally when I've to do rebuilds because of .symbols changes or something ;-)
<pitti> mvo: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pygobject/2.28.6-2 FYI
<desrt> seb128: at the same time it's clearly a good idea that we have the tests to catch problems like the one we have now, for example
<pitti> rodrigo_: i. e. we need to change all these packages to be arch:any and add a .c file for integrating into g-c-c?
<seb128> desrt, oh, don't get me wrong, I'm really in favor of the testsuite ;-) it just takes ages!
<pitti> rodrigo_: as I suppose all these .c files would be pretty much identical, would it be possible to have a generic one which takes a .desktop file and then reads the name, icon, and Exec= from that?
<desrt> i'm starting to wonder if this test has livelocked
<mvo> pitti: \o/
<desrt> it's spinning at 100% CPU for 3 minutes now
<desrt> hm.  this is a new test.  i wonder if it has (or has found) a bug.
<pitti> hm, the amd64 build of gnome-keyring is also stuck in the test suite
<pitti> might be the same glib bug?
<mpt> mvo, glatzor, good morning. Random question for you: What is the use case for URLs of the form "apt:package-name?minver=1.0"?
<seb128> desrt, bah, I'm having stupid browser issues with pastebin, any change you can email me the patch?
<pitti> oh?
<pitti> seb128: http://fpaste.org/98Fa/raw/ ?
<seb128> pitti, oh, stupid me...
<seb128> pitti, thanks ;-)
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * pitti hugs desrt, too
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> pitti, you wouldn't want to apply that to current glib and upload to a ppa by any chance to see if that workaround the hang issue? ;-)
<seb128> pitti, I will do it in a bit otherwise, I want to clean the indicators updates and unity rebuild first
<seb128> they need to transition in once we are half broken atm
<pitti> seb128: yep, can do
<seb128> pitti, feel free to say no, will do glib in a bit if nobody else does
<pitti> seb128: can do it in parallel with my release team update, that's fine
<seb128> danke
<pitti> I'm also eager to get keyring, etc. built
<desrt> y'all could give me upload rights
 * desrt applies a 'vendor patch' to unity to replace it with gnome-shell
<pitti> and then see how long it takes people to tell the difference? :-)
<desrt> pitti: ;)
<pitti> seb128: uploaded to my PPA; knocking on wood
<seb128> pitti, danke
 * desrt elects to read some manpages and look at the code in question for obvious errors
 * desrt finds at least one more bug
<desrt> seb128: what is the test case that was failing?
<seb128> desrt, I don't see it's one testcase
<desrt> there's a bug in the GCancellable code
<seb128> desrt, I've seen hangs on 3 different gdbus tests
<desrt> same as the bug i found in the mainloop
<desrt> checking for ENOSYS but not EINVAL
<desrt> i'll file a new upstream bug about that one
<seb128> thanks
<desrt> would be nice to know if the tests that it hangs on involve using GCancellable or not
<seb128> desrt, current build: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glib2.0/2.29.10-0ubuntu1/+build/2613839
<seb128> desrt, (it's the stock 2.29.10 archive one, not the patched one)
<seb128> it's sitting there
<desrt> seb128: do you have superpowers to get your builds pushed to the front of the line or something? :)
<seb128> pitti does
<desrt> nice
<desrt> so i assume this means that the test case that follows 'signals' is hanging
<desrt> that's "filter"
<desrt> which, iirc, was one of the ones causing trouble before
<seb128> I think that's one it did hit yesterday as well
<pitti> bah, not my day -- the pygobject build hangs as well
<seb128> :-(
 * desrt fears the prospect of bisecting a month or two of history using builders to find a non-deterministic bug
<desrt> this is some kind of nightmare
<desrt> has anyone ever seen the hang outside of a builder?
<seb128> no
<seb128> but I did only one build
<pitti> I didn't
<desrt> and you're absolutely sure my patch is applied for this build?
<seb128> desrt, which one?
<desrt> the one to remove eventfd
<seb128>  desrt, (it's the stock 2.29.10 archive one, not the patched one)
<desrt> oh
<desrt> okay.  please try with my patch, then :)
<pitti> desrt: https://launchpad.net/~pitti/+archive/ppa/+build/2615620 and https://launchpad.net/~pitti/+archive/ppa/+build/2615619 have your patch applied
<pitti> desrt: but they aren't at the test suite yet, I just uploaded it a couple of minutes ago
<seb128> desrt, the patched version didn't reach testsuit yet
<desrt> okay.  great.
<desrt> we'll wait for those, then
<desrt> i thought the one that seb showed me was with my patch
<seb128> desrt, but you asked what case were causing issues
<seb128> that's why I showed you the log
<desrt> ahhhhh.  thanks :)
<desrt> okay
<desrt> because if my patch fails, then we have some serious trouble
<desrt> i don't even know where to start
<pitti> it seems we kill buildds by the dozens today :/ I asked infinity/lamont to kill these
<pitti> (glib, g-keyring, pygobject)
<seb128> well at least they will stop those over 3 hours
<seb128> but yeah, still
<desrt> did we have a post-eventfd build of glib pass the tests (by chance?) and get into the archive?
<desrt> if so, it could be responsible for all of the failures
<mvo> mpt: I guess if you blog about foo and 1.0 is not good, but 2.0 is awsome to ensure that people really get 2.0 and will not be disappointed about 1.0 (if 1.0 is the only version availalble for them)
<chrisccoulson> i'm not the only one hanging buildd's now then? ;)
<mpt> mvo, fair enough, thanks
<desrt> builders are slow :)
<desrt> s/slow/busy/, probably
<pitti> oh, https://launchpad.net/~pitti/+archive/ppa/+build/2615620 is at the test suite now
<desrt> ya.  i see that.
 * desrt waits for it to get to the good part
<desrt> this is like watching a hockey game :)
<ogra_> now you know how exciting the work on arm is :)
<desrt> ogra_: that's more like watching a hockey game in slow motion
<pitti> "and now the test case of the blue team is going to attack the dbus, aims, and ... PAAAAAAAAAAAASS!"
<ogra_> *g*
<desrt> actually
<desrt> PASS: atomic-test
<desrt> PASS: bit-test
<desrt> PASS: cxx-test
<desrt> PASS: child-test
<desrt> PASS: completion-test
<desrt> PASS: dirname-test
<desrt> this part sounds like the announcer
<desrt> "atomic passes to bit.  bit passes to cxx.  cxx to childs..."
<desrt> filter test passed...
<desrt> all of the gdbus and gapplication tests are passed
<desrt> gio/tests/ is done
<desrt> so either we just got very lucky or the patch fixes the problem (indicating that the problem is, indeed, eventfd)
<mpt> mvo, if you have a section like Multiverse disabled, could USC still easily tell whether a given package is present in that section? Or would you need to enable it first?
<pitti> I need to disappear for a few hours, see you back on the release meeting
<pitti> seb128: ^
<desrt> pitti: thanks for the builds
<pitti> seb128: lamont is killing the hanging builds
<pitti> seb128: can you check my PPA build, and if it works, upload the ubuntu bzr?
<desrt> amd64 just passed the testsuite too
<pitti> yay
<mvo> mpt: for application it knows that currently because we have the app-instlal-data locally. in the future when the metadata moves to the server it may not be possilbe anymore
<mpt> ok, thanks mvo
<mvo> yw
<desrt> seb128: i'd do the 'official' upload with my patch for now
<desrt> seb128: i'll take the issue up with colin when he's awake
<seb128> pitti, ok
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<cyphermox> good morning!
<chrisccoulson> hi Laney, do you have any ideas about bug 798941? i think your mono knowledge is probably much greater than mine ;)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 798941 in moon "moon FTBFS in oneiric with libav 0.7" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/798941
<chrisccoulson> (ignore the title btw, there is a patch in the bug for that specific issue already)
<Sweetshark> pitti: so how can I restart https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ppa/+sourcepub/1807234/+listing-archive-extra now that it has been aborted?
<Sweetshark> pitti: ah, found it!
<chrisccoulson> sigh, wth has happened to my connection
<kenvandine> seb128, thx for helping with those merges
<kenvandine> are you doing datetime already?
<kenvandine> if not i can do it now
<seb128> hey kenvandine
<seb128> kenvandine, no, I'm on unity
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> if you can do datetime that would be nice ;-)
<seb128> yw btw ;-)
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> awesome, i see didrocks fixed that nasty u1 crasher
<kenvandine> woot
<kenvandine> this morning is looking up already :)
<mvo> eh, silly question (what is the best channel to ask such questions?). but in the gtk3 world a "get_allocation() call return GdkRectangle" which no longer provides width, height nor methods to access them. how do I get the allocation height in e.g. size-allocated callbacks?
<seb128> mvo, you can try #gnome-hackers or #gtk+ on irc.gnome.org I guess
<kenvandine> mvo, i think i have an example... one sec
<kenvandine> mvo, the GdkRectangle has width and height properties
<mvo> aha, let me try that
<mvo> kenvandine: do you have a example snippet? I can not get it to work
<kenvandine> only in vala
<kenvandine> look at lp:gwibber
<kenvandine> in client/tab-bar.vala
<m_conley> rodrigo_: ping
<dobey> rodrigo_: ping
<kiwinote> mvo: I use on_size_allocate(self, widget, allocation): print widget.get_allocation().width which seems to work, I haven't yet worked out how to use the allocation directly yet
<mvo> kiwinote: oh, with gtk3? hmmm, makes me wonder what I'm doing wrong here. do you hvae example code?
<kiwinote> mvo: let me quickly put a sample together
<seb128> Laney, there?
<kiwinote> mvo: http://paste.ubuntu.com/640136/
<mvo> kiwinote: oh, you use the widget.get_allocation() instead of the allocation one? clever :)
<kiwinote> mvo: yeah, the allocation one seems to be broken :/
<rodrigo_> m_conley, dobey: pong
<mvo> thanks kiwinote! that helped me and the coding can continue \o/
<kiwinote> ;)
<dobey> rodrigo_: hey, how is it that evo-couchdb is compiling in oneiric? i was looking at the create_u1_addressbook patch last night, and it's exactly the same as we have in the nightlies packages, but it always fails to apply
<rodrigo_> dobey, hmm, it shouldn't build, unless it's using an older release
<rodrigo_> dobey, but thanks for the reminder, I'll rebase the patch now
<dobey> rodrigo_: so in oneiric proper, it is FTBFS right now?
<rodrigo_> hmm, no, haven't uploaded the newer version iirc
 * rodrigo_ checks
<dobey> rodrigo_: lp says 0.5.90 is built
<dobey> rodrigo_: or was the big change that breaks the patch, after that release?
<Laney> chrisccoulson: we're going to remove moon, don't worry about that
<Laney> ping directhex about it
<Laney> seb128: yeah a bit
<seb128> Laney, that's ok, I figured it out
<seb128> Laney, got some build failure due to mono
<Laney> ah ok, yeah that's the transition
<Laney> if it's stuff not fixed in debian then please send fixes to us too
<seb128> but it seems libunit-cil has some binaries in universe
<seb128> pitti, ^ do you have any clue about that? is that an error?
<Laney> it got a new abi
<Laney> should have been newed to main probably
<rodrigo_> dobey, yes, was after that change
<rodrigo_> dobey, not released yet
<seb128> tedg, kenvandine: but I commited a one liner to indicator-session, there was a g_debug leftover which was breaking the build, robert_ancell asked for it to be cleaned in the merge request but that was overlooked it seemed
<seb128> Laney, right
<dobey> rodrigo_: oh, ok :(
<rodrigo_> dobey, will do a release and rebase the patch
<rodrigo_> hmm, firefox is not in debian? apt-cache doesn't find anything that looks like firefox package
<kenvandine> seb128, weird it only broke 386 though, but i didn't look at the patch
<seb128> kenvandine, it didn't like %li with a guint64
<m_conley> rodrigo_: hey - I was wondering if you had a minute to talk about EDS
<seb128> in the g_debug
<seb128> kenvandine, it's using -Werror
<kenvandine> ah
<rodrigo_> m_conley, yes
<kenvandine> seb128, thx for fixing that
<seb128> np
<seb128> just mentioning it because I commited to trunk without review
<seb128> but it was just dropping the g_debug so should be alright ;-)
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> good call :)
<tedg> seb128, Oh, I thought it was useful for a while. Didn't realize it'd break 386.
<m_conley> rodrigo_: so I want to monitor changes to EContacts within EBooks.  Most of the examples I've seen (and the way I believe Evo does it) is by using an EBookView query, and attaching signal handlers for when contacts are added/removed/changed in that view.
<tedg> seb128, People should upgrade their kernels ;-)
<seb128> tedg, what does it have to do with the kernel?
<seb128> btw didn't we say we wouldn't use Werror in tarball?
<m_conley> rodrigo_: however, one problem is that I believe those signals are coming in via "random" threads, and that attempts to trigger callbacks in the JS main thread, which freaks Gecko's thread-safety mechanisms out.
<tedg> seb128, I'm guessing most people have processors that are amd64 capable, just choosing a system that is not.
<seb128> njpatel, unity is failing to build as well :p
<seb128> tedg, right, I use i386 there on my i5 ;-)
<m_conley> rodrigo_: so I'm considering doing polling instead, but I've been looking for examples of e_book_get_changes_async, and cannot seem to find any
<chrisccoulson> Laney, oh, how come moon is being removed?
<rodrigo_> m_conley, the get_changes call is going away
<m_conley> rodrigo_: ah.  That's very good to know.
<m_conley> rodrigo_: how would you suggest monitoring for changes then?
<rodrigo_> m_conley, I guess the signals are sent in each operation's thread, although not sure that's the case really
<Laney> chrisccoulson: general firefox breakage and being out of date afaik
<Laney> it didn't work with the new somethingorother
<rodrigo_> m_conley, if on a thread, you should install an idle/timeout, etc, and make any not-thread safe call on the handler for that timeout/signal/whatever
<seb128> njpatel, complaining about a variable set and not used and Werror (I'm turning Werror off in the package for this upload)
<chrisccoulson> Laney, my change avoids the firefox breakage issues
<rodrigo_> m_conley, but are you sure the signals are on threads? afaik all signals are sent on the main thread
<Laney> chrisccoulson: oh cool
<Laney> does the plugin work?
<njpatel> seb128, thanks, will fix in trunk when i get some time
<chrisccoulson> Laney, yeah, it seems to on natty
<chrisccoulson> (which has the same change now)
<m_conley> rodrigo_: hrm.  Well, it's kind of hard to tell.  All I know is that listening to signals from EBookView was causing me to fail thread-safety assertions.
<Laney> oneiric might be a different matter, given mono 2.10
<m_conley> rodrigo_: I must admit, Gecko's thread-safety model is very new to me.  :)
<m_conley> rodrigo_: but thanks for telling me about get_changes going away.  So, just to reiterate, you'd suggest for me to listen for signals from EBookView?
<rodrigo_> m_conley, can you show some code to see if I can see something?
<rodrigo_> m_conley, yes, that's the correct way
<m_conley> rodrigo_: Sure, let me whip something up, and I'll show you.  I'll let you know.  Thanks for your help!
<chrisccoulson> Laney, i spoke to shana on IRC a few weeks ago, and she said we could just turn off the firefox bridge and provide the curl bridge instead, and it should carry on working
<chrisccoulson> (which is what i've done)
<Laney> excellent
<Laney> you should pass the news on to directhex
<kenvandine> seb128, i uploaded a new indicator-power that will build against the current libindicator
<kenvandine> should be able to get the goodness soon :)
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, what is missing in the stack?
<seb128> kenvandine, why are the breaks on the old libindicator soname require again btw?
<kenvandine> indicator-me
<kenvandine> which i am doing now
<kenvandine> to make sure everything that depends on it can be updated at the same time
<seb128> kenvandine, i've dropped those locally to be able to do the updates without uninstalling half my system
<seb128> kenvandine, so it's not a case of "will break", it's a case of "will only load those rebuilt"
<seb128> right?
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> oh, indicator-messages is still missing
<tedg> kenvandine, ?
<kenvandine> tedg, did you do a release for indicator-messages?
<tedg> kenvandine, Hmm, sees I did all the work but didn't do a release.  Sorry, my bad.
<kenvandine> i didn't get a merge proposal
<kenvandine> hehe :)
<kenvandine> tedg,  i am doing an indicator-me release now too
<kenvandine> seb128, indicator-power is in binNEW now
 * kenvandine files MIR bug
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, looking in a bit once I'm done sorting unity issues
<kenvandine> no rush
<kenvandine> its weird, now that i have the power indicator, it feels like oneiric is kind of complete again :)
<kenvandine> s/again/finally
<desrt> rickspencer3: ping
<rickspencer3> hi desrt
<rickspencer3> wow, been a while since I've been pinged in the desktop channel!
 * rickspencer3 feels needed again :)
<seb128> rickspencer3, salut
<chrisccoulson> hi rickspencer3!
<kenvandine> hey rickspencer3!
<kenvandine> tedg, how's indicator-messages coming?
<kenvandine> tedg, just making sure you didn't forget, again :-D\
<rickspencer3> hi all
<rickspencer3> bon jour mes amis!
<rodrigo_> is gksu on the CD and installed by default?
<rodrigo_> hi rickspencer3
<seb128> rodrigo_, it has been but there is an effort to drop it this cycle
<seb128> rodrigo_, why?
<rodrigo_> seb128, for the software panel in g-c-c, seems software-properties-gtk can only be run as root
<seb128> right
<rodrigo_> so, sudo s-p-gtk won't work if it asks for a password
<seb128> gksu.. is what the .desktop does right?
<rodrigo_> yes: gksu --desktop /usr/share/applications/software-properties-gtk.desktop /usr/bin/software-properties-gtk
<seb128> that's basically what we should do until software-properties it teached to use modern techs
<rodrigo_> yeah
<seb128> kenvandine, there is still indicator-appmenu as well
<kenvandine> seb128, oh yeah... tedg ^^
 * kenvandine makes whip cracking noises
<pitti> seb128: seems the patch worked?
<seb128> pitti, or we got lucky...
<seb128> could e-addressbook-factory stop segfaulting in ldap code when I send emails?
<seb128> (using evo)
<pitti> seb128: -cil> probaly just an AA error
<seb128> pitti, ok, can you have a look, I'm finishing sorting unity, indicators there
<seb128> we should have most of stack uploaded
<seb128> they just need to build now
<kenvandine> anyone have suggestions on what to do when you loose all input in lightdm?
<kenvandine> just upgraded my test box and no mouse or keyboard input
<kenvandine> can't even switch VTs
<kenvandine> however if i ssh in and use chvt, keyboard input works on the console
<seb128> kenvandine, urg, weird, boot in failsafe?
<kenvandine> doesn't work either
<kenvandine> just in lightdm
<kenvandine> which means i can't login to unity
<kenvandine> i guess i could try startx :)
<kenvandine> actually, maybe lightdm has logs :)
<m_conley> rodrigo_: hey - have a second to look at my EBookView code?
<pitti> Laney, seb128: is that libnunit-cil, i. e. nunit source?
<rodrigo_> not sure where to put my code for this -> http://people.gnome.org/~rodrigo/ubuntu-control-center.png as it's C code, and all of s-p, u1 and jockey are python only modules
<rodrigo_> m_conley, sure
<seb128> pitti, it seems so from the build log
<pitti> Laney, seb128: anyway, promoted to main
<seb128> pitti, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/74804374/buildlog_ubuntu-oneiric-i386.libappindicator_0.3.90-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<seb128> pitti, danke
<pitti> seb128: want me to upload glib?
<seb128> desrt, ^ do you recommand uploading the eventfd revert to the archive?
<seb128> desrt, or was that meant to be for testing only?
<desrt> seb128: it was for testing, but i recommend uploading it
<desrt> since it clearly fixes the problem
<desrt> and since we clearly cannot proceed without the fix
<pitti> it also fixes some annoying bugs like the nautilus crashes
<seb128> pitti, the new glib does
<seb128> pitti, we but could let the code it and disable the testsuite as an another workaround to get it built
<pitti> seb128: but that wouldn't fix the actual problem in eventfd?
<seb128> pitti, the actual problem seems to happen only on old kernels
<seb128> pitti, it wouldn't happen on oneiric
<seb128> pitti, it's in the fallbacking
<seb128> pitti, eventfd should work fine on the natty or oneiric kernels
<pitti> ah, so that's why it only happens on the buildds?
<seb128> yes
<pitti> ok, so then I'd be fine with disabling tests temporarily
<seb128> pitti, I'm fine either way, feel free to upload what you uploaded to your ppa
<seb128> we don't need the eventfd thing for anything and we know it built fine
<seb128> it will give confirmation that it builds fine on the official builders as well without it
<pitti> ok
<pitti> as I have little time right now, I'll upload bzr (eventfd revert)
<pitti> we can reconsider the next time we upload
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> (/me @ release team meeting, in the context of a university graduate celebrations party..)
<seb128> pitti, you should have asked me to cover for you
<seb128> pitti, I can still do if you want
<seb128> though I've not prepared
<pitti> it's fine; we already covered the desktop part
<seb128> ok
<pitti> I asked skaet to go early today
<pitti> but I don't want to start a new glib build right now
<seb128> pitti, I can handle glib if you want
<seb128> but we should upload what you put in your ppa anyway
<pitti> seb128: just committed the debcommit -r; could you just bzr bd -S and upload?
<seb128> pitti, sure
<pitti> seb128: cheers
<pitti> (little bandwidth here, so that's appreciated)
<seb128> kenvandine, did you fix your lightdm issue?
<seb128> jibel pointed several bugs about that
<seb128> ie bug #807291
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 807291 in lightdm "Mouse and keyboard unresponsive until re-plugged in" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/807291
<pitti> good bye everyone then, have a nice weekend!
<seb128> pitti, bye
<seb128> kenvandine, is your issue on real box or in a vm?
<kenvandine> seb128, real box
<seb128> hum k
<seb128> it started this night around midnight utc
<seb128> from bug reports
<kenvandine> looking at the X logs, it isn't finding input devices
<seb128> but I don't see any obvious candidate for issue in the uploads
 * kenvandine tries to replugin
<kenvandine> startx fails too
<kenvandine> not just lightdm
<seb128> jibel: ^
<kenvandine> i am guessing udev
<kenvandine> maybe udev gets the plugin event and configures the device
<kenvandine> confirmed, re-plugging in the mouse and keyboard worked
<kenvandine> but doesn't work at boot
<kenvandine> would be hard to narrow which update broke it though
<kenvandine> i hadn't updated it since before the sprint
<kenvandine> downloaded like 400M of debs :)
<davmor2> seb128, kenvandine: saw that earlier on my netbook trying to resolve an issue with U1 bit more awkward trying to re-plugin the keyboard and mouse there though :(  but I was doing a fresh alpha2 install to check when the u1 issue appeared
<davmor2> since then it has been okay
<jibel>  xorg-server 2:1.10.2.902-1ubuntu2 is a candidate
<kenvandine> oh interesting
<kenvandine> i did a logout
<kenvandine> and lost input
<seb128> jibel: no it's not
<seb128> jibel: the bugs you pointed have been filed around 2am and xorg-server uploaded at 6am
<seb128> so 0utc published means it was uploaded before 10utc-ish yesterday
<seb128> 10pm
<jibel> right and user is running xserver-xorg 1:7.6+7ubuntu1
<seb128> hum, I can't stop any obvious candidate on -changes
<rodrigo_> is launchpad down?
<rodrigo_> ah, no, it's not
<rodrigo_> pitti, you are the maintainer of jockey, right?
<rodrigo_> pitti, if so, could you please review https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/jockey/fix-787694 ?
<seb128> kenvandine, did you try the rebuilt indicators in some way?
<kenvandine> seb128, yes
<kenvandine> indicator-application seems to be broken
<kenvandine> looking into that right now
<seb128> right, just went to the same conclusion
<seb128> it's taking the unity service down
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> thanks
<kenvandine> seb128, figure anything out?
<seb128> no
<kenvandine> i had removed the indicators and been adding them back one at a time
<kenvandine> indicator-application was the last i grabbed
<seb128> well indicator-application failed to build
<seb128> so no hurry
<seb128> due to the libappindicator build issue
<kenvandine> i need to leave in an hour :)
<seb128> but libappindicator has built since so when somebody fix i-a and upload it we should be fine
<seb128> I can do the packaging
<seb128> get ted to fix the bug ;-)
<kenvandine> tedg, ^^
<seb128> I'm out for half an hour but will be back then
<Sweetshark> pitti: http://ftp-master.debian.org/new/libreoffice_1:3.4.1-1.html is there and I have a completed 3.4.1 build, however packaged with one huge *.orig tarball for now (instead of the multiple ones debian uses). Should I wait for debian waving the release through the queue to use their tarballs or should I do a ppa upload with our own *.org tarball now?
<kenvandine> seb128, ok
<kenvandine> i'll be leaving in an hour for the day
<kenvandine> sort of, back on later tonight
<kenvandine> hopefully you'll be sleeping by then :)
<seb128> ok
<tedg> seb128, What's the build issue?
<seb128> have a nice weekend then if we don't cross each other
<seb128> tedg, build issue was a distro problem that's fixed
<seb128> tedg, but indicator-application segfaults on start
<seb128> kenvandine can get you details I guess
<seb128> need to run but I will be back in half an hour
<kenvandine> later seb128!
<seb128> kenvandine, don't bother with the packaging I will deal with it
<kenvandine> have a great weekend
<tedg> backtrace or it didn't happen
<tedg> ;-)
<seb128> thanks, you too
<kenvandine> tedg, http://paste.ubuntu.com/640246
<kenvandine> tedg, gvariant type problem
<kenvandine> perhaps
<kenvandine> (indicator-loader3:26752): GLib-CRITICAL **: the GVariant format string `(a(sisossss))' has a type of `(a(sisossss))' but the given value has a type of `(a(sisosssss))'
<kenvandine> tedg, did you see the backtrace?
<desrt> i love GVariant error messages sometimes
<desrt> that one is particularly hilarious
 * Sweetshark dances a bit. libreoffice-3.4.1-1ubuntu1 build finished!
<desrt> particularly if you attempt to read it out loud
<tedg> kenvandine, Just now, sorry grabbing a bit of lunch.
 * kenvandine wonders why desrt tried to read it out loud
<kenvandine> tedg, no worries
<kenvandine> just making sure it didn't get missed before i take off for the day :)
<kenvandine> tedg, don't rely on merge proposal mail requests to give seb128 a fix... i still never got the last couple you sent me
<kenvandine> LP must be angry :)
<dobey> kenvandine: it seems to be having issues generating diffs today
<kenvandine> yeah, i think that is blocking the mail
<dobey> yep
<dobey> looks like someone is finally looking at it though
<Sweetshark> desrt: at least you can finish reading that in linear time. Try that with a average stl-template-plus-UNO-error in c++
<seb128> re
<seb128> desrt, btw same glib built in oneiric
<seb128> desrt, so it's 2 built which went fine on all arch
<seb128> desrt, seems confirming that the issue is somewhere in the eventfd patch
<desrt> seb128: i'm quite happy
<desrt> seb128: because if it wasn't there, ... i think my head would explode
<desrt> seb128: question for you: do you gtk-doc when you build glib, or do you rely on the html from the tarball?
<desrt> i didn't see it showing up in the builds....
<seb128> desrt, we rely on the html from the tarball for GNOME components usually
<desrt> ugh
<seb128> there is no reason a local build should generate different html from the same source
<seb128> so why wasting cpu cycles to rebuild those?
<desrt> except when excessively vendorpatching =)
<seb128> it's just changing the configure flags in rules
<desrt> and depends, i guess
<seb128> that and adding the build-depends
<desrt> yup.  thanks.
<seb128> desrt, the other way is to make dist tarballs from your git rather than distro patching the diff ;-)
<seb128> I didn't think about that when you asked yesterday
<desrt> seb128: that's specifically what i was asking about yesterday
<desrt> and i decided against it
<desrt> since it would require rebasing and typing 'make dist' and going through the whole bother for every update
<desrt> if i do it with a patch then i can just update the package and hold on to the same patch
<tedg> seb128, Do you want to just distro patch this?  lp:~ted/indicator-application/more-s-is-better/
<desrt> (ie: let you do most of the work)
<seb128> tedg, yes
<seb128> kenvandine, tedg: will test and backport it, thanks
<seb128> tedg, bonus point if you get it in trunk
<seb128> easier to backport ;-)
<tedg> seb128, It doesn't matter really?  no?  I mean doesn't Bazaar handle the details either way?
 * desrt goes into a docs-writing coma
<seb128> tedg, since it's a vcs probably not you are right
<desrt> GCC needs an optimiser pass to deduce the semantics of my code and write documentation about it
<seb128> tedg, if you don't change the code before merging ;-)
<seb128> but dinner first
<seb128> then backport
<seb128> be back in a bit
<seb128> kenvandine, feel free to test and upload if you have time otherwise I will do it after dinner
<kenvandine> seb128, i gotta run now
<kenvandine> seb128, so please do it when you can
<kenvandine> thx!
<kenvandine> have a great weekend!
 * kenvandine runs
<Sweetshark> And libreoffice-l10n-3.3.3-1ubuntu1 finished!
 * Sweetshark dances again.
<seb128> tedg, still there?
 * tedg is wondering if this is a trick question
<seb128> tedg, the fix of yours is not enough
<seb128> unity-panel-service still goes down
<tedg> seb128, bt?
<tedg> seb128, Did you see the dbus-test-runner test on the merge request?  Does that work for you?
<seb128> tedg, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/640299/
<seb128> tedg, let me try
<seb128> tedg, indicator-loader stopped segfaulting but unity still does
<seb128> tedg, v
<seb128> tedg, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/640302/
<seb128> tedg, that's the indicator-loader debug output
<seb128> tedg, is that useful info? do you need extra ones?
<tedg> seb128, Trying to figure out why mine doesn't do that.  It did before.
<tedg> seb128, But with the patch it  does not.
<seb128> tedg, hum, maybe I screwed something
<seb128> well the loader was segfaulting before
<seb128> so I think I got the update loaded right
<seb128> since now it only displays those warning and have an empty indicator
<seb128> unity segfaults though
<seb128> tedg, the dbus command line "works", i.e doesn't segfault, but the indicator it displays is empty
<tedg> seb128, Yeah, do you have a build of libappindicator handy?
<seb128> yes
<tedg> seb128, dbus-test-runner -t /usr/lib/libindicator/indicator-loader3 -p .libs/libapplication.so -t ./indicator-application-service -t ../../../libappindicator/trunk/example/simple-client
<tedg> seb128, That puts something in the indicator
<seb128> tedg, k
<seb128> tedg, so you don't get any issue locally? not warning using the loader?
<tedg> seb128, no
<seb128> how I can help you to debug?
<tedg> seb128, Well, I'm hoping having the simple client will cause a segfault perhaps..
<seb128> tedg, ok, in fact my build tree was cleaned after build so I'm doing a new build, almost done
<tedg> Hmm, I thought unity-panel-service had a command line...
<seb128> /usr/lib/unity/unity-panel-service
<seb128> ?
<tedg> seb128, I mean a way to specify modules to load on the command line.
<seb128> tedg, you mean?
<seb128> tedg, it does load all the indicators?
<tedg> seb128, Yeah it does
<tedg> seb128, I thought there was a way to say "load this one"
<seb128> bah, simple-client is not built
<seb128> tedg, ok, your dbus-test-runner command works
<seb128> it displays an envelop icon correctly and the menu works
<tedg> seb128, ? So it worked with the client but not without?
<seb128> tedg, well as said before the loader displays warning but runs
<seb128> unity segfaults still
<seb128> tedg, (indicator-loader3:1014): GLib-CRITICAL **: the GVariant format string `(a(sisosssss))' has a type of `(a(sisosssss))' but the given value has a type of `(a(sisossss))'
<seb128> is still displayed
<seb128> but the loader works
<tedg> seb128, So literally if you take off the last "-t" it starts having those warnings?
<tedg> Oh, I'm so confused.
<seb128> I'm confused myself
<seb128> tedg, ok, let's start again
<seb128> $ dbus-test-runner -t /usr/lib/libindicator/indicator-loader3 -p .libs/libapplication.so
<seb128> -> leads to a indicator-application-service signal 5
<tedg> Yeah, the no watchers case.
<tedg> Wait, I mean the unable to start service
<seb128> $ dbus-test-runner -t /usr/lib/libindicator/indicator-loader3 -p .libs/libapplication.so -t ./indicator-application-service -t ../../../../../../libappindicator/libappindicator-0.3.90/example/.libs/simple-client
<seb128> works
<seb128>  
<seb128> $ /usr/lib/libindicator/indicator-loader3 .libs/libapplication.so
<seb128> ** (indicator-loader3:21994): DEBUG: Looking at Module: .libs/libapplication.so
<seb128> ** (indicator-loader3:21994): DEBUG: Loading Module: .libs/libapplication.so
<seb128> (indicator-loader3:21994): Indicator-Application-DEBUG: Connected to Application Indicator Service.
<seb128> (indicator-loader3:21994): Indicator-Application-DEBUG: Request current apps
<seb128> (indicator-loader3:21994): GLib-CRITICAL **: the GVariant format string `(a(sisosssss))' has a type of `(a(sisosssss))' but the given value has a type of `(a(sisossss))'
<seb128>  
<seb128> tedg, ^ does that makes sense?
<seb128> bah
<seb128> tedg, sorry it works
<seb128> stupid indicators!
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> tedg, seems like there was a system indicator-application-service still running
<seb128> once stopped the new run started working
<tedg> seb128, Woot!
<seb128> sorry for wasting your time on it
<tedg> Probably should have bumped the version there so they wouldn' connect.
<tedg> Hmm.
<chrisccoulson> my inbox is full of pedro this evening!
<chrisccoulson> pedro_, did you get replaced by a bot? ;)
<seb128> nothing in the log indicated it was connecting to a running one
<seb128> \o/ unity working
<seb128> tedg, thanks!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hum, my bug box counts says 181
<seb128> it was empty before dinner
<seb128> pedro_, !!!
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i've got a lot too
<seb128> those mexicans...
<seb128> pedro_, ;-)
<pedro_> lol!
<chrisccoulson> lol
 * micahg thought pedro was peruvian
<pedro_> chrisccoulson, just delete those emails i'm checking old bugs without comments
<pedro_> micahg, oh Chilean actually
<micahg> oh right
<pedro_> micahg, and seb128 is from Germany
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> brb trying indicator fix
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-07-10
<psusi> gnome-power-preferences has gone missing in oneiric.  This new system settings applet still opens some sort of window with a stripped down selection of settings though.  Where does this come from?
<RAOF> psusi: gnome-control-centre, IIRC.
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-02
<robert_ancell> RAOF, so I still cant get weston to run outside of X without locking up my video - any debugging techniques?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: EGL_LOG_LEVEL=debug should get you some video debugging info. I've generally found that ensuring that I can r/w to /dev/input/*, and that there's not a second GPU to confuse things makes it work for me.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, so I have:
<robert_ancell> 00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation Core Processor Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 18)
<robert_ancell> 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: NVIDIA Corporation GT218 [GeForce 310M] (rev a2)
<robert_ancell> would that be confusing it?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Possibly.
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I've found that it will often attempt to start on the (totally useless) radeon on this laptop rather than the intel.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, so I'm not getting any debugging that I can see.  I can ssh in and start lightdm and recover however
<robert_ancell> RAOF, and via ssh weston seems to have stopped (not showing in ps)
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Ok. I can run as root âXDG_RUNTIME_DIR=/tmp westonâ, and have it work.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, can I just build weston from a branch and play with that?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Aha! Try setting EGL_PLATFORM=drm; that's worked for me, apart from the bit where it crashes lightdm when you try to switch away from the weston VT.
<RAOF> robert_ancell: So, the two failure modes I see are: (a) failure to set EGL_PLATFROM=drm, which results in weston SEGVing in an XCBgetX11ish function, and (b) permissions failure on /dev/input, which results in weston SEGVing in backend_init.
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Avoiding both of those, the weston in system-compositor-scratchpad reproducibly works for me.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, I think it loads the drm backend correctly as I get on the console:
<robert_ancell> [...] Loading module '/usr/lib/weston/drm-backend.so'
<robert_ancell> [...] initializing drm backend
<robert_ancell> then stop
<RAOF> EGL *also* needs to load the correct backend (setting EGL_LOG_LEVEL=debug should show what it's picking); for some reason it's defaulting to the X11 backend, which is nonsence.
<RAOF> Also, weston > weston.log 2>&1 FTW âº
<RAOF> http://paste2.org/p/2064089 is what it should look like if you've not got the right permissions on /dev/input
<RAOF> http://paste2.org/p/2064090 is what it should look like with a successful start.
<test_> RAOF, hmm, pandaboard just locked up
 * RAOF is hoping that means robert_ancell has discovered the âvt switching from weston kills lightdmâ problem.
<test_> RAOF, btw, does your pandaboard sometimes only have  a low resolution
<RAOF> test_: Yes, but mostly my pandaboard has not booting.
<robert_ancell> :(
<robert_ancell> RAOF, what is this vt switching problem?
<RAOF> It seems that if I VT switch from weston's VT back to X, lightdm dies.
<robert_ancell> interesting
<RAOF> Of course, *weston* dies when you try to VT switch away from it, because it mistakenly tries to drop master, but it shouldn't also take down lightdm :)
<robert_ancell> so I'm pandaboarding X at the moment and sshing into my laptop trying to run weston
<RAOF> Ok. Did you get the pastebin logs of a failed and successful weston startup?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, can you explain this, to get my laptop working again after weston dies I start lightdm to get input back, then have to 'stty sane' the console back
<RAOF> I think weston fiddles with the VT mode; unclean shutdown might leave it in an awkward state.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, another win for the VT subsystem!
<RAOF> :)
<robert_ancell> I haz log, attempting to start ff in under 1 minute to paste it
<RAOF> pastebinit!
<TheMuso> Pastebinit is a time saver for sure, in fact IMO anything that allows you to post something to a website without actually ahving to use a web browser is a time saver. :)
<robert_ancell> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1070700/
<robert_ancell> handy
<robert_ancell> and yeah, card1 is nvidia according to syslog
<RAOF> Ah. So that's totally working up until the point where it tries to set the mode; you're actually using the nvidia card, I presume?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, nope, intel (card0)
<RAOF> Aha.
<RAOF> That would be a problem ;)
<robert_ancell> and the X log confirm it
<RAOF> modprobe -r nouveau, try again.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, why would it pick card1 over card0?
<RAOF> Sodomy non sapiens
<robert_ancell> RAOF, weston says no: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1070707/
<robert_ancell> at least I have a core this time
<RAOF> Right.
<RAOF> That's what it looks like if weston doesn't have permissions to /dev/input
<robert_ancell> and with sudo it is happy :)
<RAOF> For what it's worth, weston will pick the last first drm device enumerated by udev with ID_SEAT=seat0
<robert_ancell> last first?
<RAOF> Oh, sorry. First.
<RAOF> And since we don't annotate drm devices with ID_SEAT, it'll pick the first drm device enumerated by udev.
<robert_ancell> and I can seem to vt switch between lightdm and weston here ok
<RAOF> Maybe because you're running as root?
<robert_ancell> perhaps?
<RAOF> Yeah, works fine as root.
<RAOF> Time to turn on the fourth computer in this room to test this nouveau driver...
<didrocks> good morning
<chrisccoulson> good morning eveeryone
<Laney> morning!
<mlankhorst> morning
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson, Laney, mlankhorst!
<didrocks> how are you guys?
<Laney> a weekend full of cycling: good :-)
<Laney> you?
<mlankhorst> I'm good, trying to make sense of some dmabuf sharing support now, weekend was great but not much biking (too warm)
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, Laney, mlankhorst
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128!
<seb128> hey
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, pretty good thanks. how are you?
<didrocks> saturday was nice (a lot of walking), but really rainy sunday, so rather video games (almost finished chrono trigger, new game from 1995 ;))
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks
<mlankhorst> hehe, I'm having a lot of fun with supreme commander forged alliance myself, it's fun to mod and play with a friend
<mlankhorst> almost all the logic is in lua so you're mostly limited by imagination :)
 * Laney remembers playing chrono trigger on zsnes in school
 * mlankhorst was more into playing dungeon keeper back then
<RAOF> mlankhorst: The very earth itself yawns in anticipation of your next fascinating move!
<mlankhorst> :D
<RAOF> Huh. I appear to have lost a month of backscroll: -!- Day changed from 10/06/2012 to 2/07/2012. Interesting!
<Laney> Blame the leap second. It's always the leap second.
 * didrocks really enjoyed the leap second this week-end :)
<mlankhorst> think i have to agree with google here, for most computers it makes more sense not to count on the leap seconds..
<mvo> didrocks: hi, silly (?) question, how can I run a autopilot test against unity? i.e. what packages to I have to install to run python test_launcher.py ?
<didrocks> mvo: yeah, you need lp:autopilot. I've a packaging pending merging trunk: https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/autopilot/packaging
<didrocks> it gives you the "autopilot" binary
<mvo> didrocks: thanks! does it also include the supporting python libs? or is that part of unity? autopilot.emultors.bamf for example
<didrocks> mvo: this is part of unity
<didrocks> so yeah, it's one of the issue with this trunk, it imports packages from circular dep
<didrocks> I've sent an email to thomi about it
<mvo> didrocks: thanks
<didrocks> yw ;)
<jibel> mvo, good morning. Could someone from the software-center team look at bug 1019581 ? It's breaking the builds that contains software-center
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1019581 in software-center "update-apt-xapian-index crashed with ImportError in /usr/share/apt-xapian-index/plugins/software-center.py: cannot import name index_name" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1019581
<mvo> jibel: sure, doing that now
<jibel> mvo, or revert if there is no easy fix
<jibel> mvo, thanks
<Sweetshark> heya
<Sweetshark> seb128: did I have success in explaining why I can do little for making LibreOffice stable on quantal right now?
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey, yes, I was just reading, trying to write a reply to that email ;-)
<Sweetshark> seb128: ;)
<seb128> Sweetshark, btw your precise SRU needs to be verified, can you chase some users to confirm they see no regression with it, or if you feel like acking yourself that it works fine do that and tag it verification-done?
 * Sweetshark then waiting for that ;)
<Sweetshark> seb128: I will selfack
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-screensaver/+bug/1018710 â I thought that's the intended behaviour now?
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1018710 in gnome-screensaver "Update to 3.4.2" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<seb128> Laney, I wonder if he meant that the lock screen was a blank screen, i.e no password entry?
<Laney> maybe
<Laney> let me test it and se
<Laney> e
<Laney> erm, yeah, it is rather broken
<seb128> Laney, they are like 3 commits in that version, I guess http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-screensaver/commit/?id=43ee32edaddb9b9b9f4b43c47ca73d7b4eea9fae doesn't play nice with our theme
<Sweetshark> seb128: done
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
<seb128> mvo, hey, the aptdaemon precise SRU is in proposed for 17 days ... is there any chance somebody from the s-c team could help verify the fixes so it can go to -updates?
<seb128> is anyone using chromium on precise and could help to verify the SRU on bug #992352 so it can move to -updates?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 992352 in chromium-browser "Please update to 18.0.1025.168" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/992352
<mvo> seb128: sorry, I will ask to get this done
<seb128> mvo, thanks
<Sweetshark> seb128: could you or anyone else around forward me https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2012-June/035310.html -- I am reading ubuntu-devel in digest, which is unhelpful for replies ...
<seb128> Sweetshark, let me see if tb knows how to do proper bouncing
<seb128> Laney, what email client do you use? ;-)
<Laney> haha
<Laney> one which has proper bouncing :P
<seb128> Laney, can you bounce that email to Sweetshark? ;-)
<seb128> tb is useless, there is an addon which didn't get update since 2006 and support up to tb 2 :p
<Laney> ok
<Laney> what's the email address?
<seb128> Laney, bjoern.michaelsen at canonical dot com
<Laney> et voilÃ 
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> Sweetshark, ^
<Sweetshark> Laney: thanks a lot
<Laney> kein problem
<desrt> happy monday!
<Ursinha> desrt, :)
<Ursinha> good morning :)
<desrt> Ursinha: where is everyone today?
<desrt> working too hard, it seems...
<didrocks> seems that I've been disconnected :)
<didrocks> hey desrt!
<desrt> hello
<desrt> didrocks: i have a ... request
<didrocks> desrt: me too!
<desrt> remember i did you a favour when we had UDS in orlando?
<desrt> i need the same favour for oakland :)
<didrocks> desrt: ahah, yeah, no worry ;)
<didrocks> desrt: TBH, it's not that complicated this time, at least, for me ;)
<desrt> maybe i should ask seb, then :)
<desrt> i think he shared some 'complications' with me
<didrocks> funny that I just completed this part of my job today :)
<desrt> didrocks: oh good.  i thought i was the only one :)
<didrocks> desrt: seems not ;) but I am at least one hour in advance than you! :p
<desrt> yes but... timezones... or something
<didrocks> doesn't count, it's all UK-based time!
<desrt> bah
<bcurtiswx> what might cause the auto resize by dragging windows to the left or right side of the screen to not work
<desrt> bcurtiswx: did you look at ccsm the wrong way? :)
<bcurtiswx> i had to drag the window like 6 times before it would let me
<didrocks> bcurtiswx: working quite well for me. Try to grab sam or duflu when they are around
<didrocks> (rather on #ubuntu-unity)
<seb128> hey desrt, happy monday!
<bcurtiswx> didrocks, i also have an issue (once in a while) where loading windows and closing windows cause my mouse cursor to stop moving and freeze. its so unpredictable though..
<seb128> bcurtiswx, kenvandine: hey, is there any way one of you could verify the empathy SRU on precise or find some user to verify it?
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<bcurtiswx> seb128, i didn't know i could (since I put it together)
<desrt> seb128: hey
<bcurtiswx> (i.e. i tested it before I uploaded the fix, so of course it work son my machine)
<desrt> seb128: i finally landed my wip branch on dconf
<seb128> desrt, oh, nice
<desrt> seb128: will probably be another week of fixing up remaining issues and writing unit tests then we can begin the 'real' work :)
<seb128> bcurtiswx, if you can confirm the archive version works and set the bug to verification-done it would be great
<seb128> desrt, ;-)
<bcurtiswx> seb128, sure.
<didrocks> desrt: my turn now, for the migration tool, I started to do a small configuration file syntax, what do you think about that one: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1071308/?
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, do bug 1017463 and bug 1018784
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1017463 in empathy "empathy-chat crashed with SIGSEGV in _tp_base_client_handle_channels()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1017463
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1018784 in empathy "[SRU Precise] update to 3.4.2.3" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1018784
<didrocks> The goal is to have special helper for common operatoin like [dconf-*]
<desrt> didrocks: i don't like it
<didrocks> and general one for special cases not handled, like [script]
<didrocks> ah :)
<didrocks> what's up with it?
<desrt> it looks like a keyfile but it's not
<didrocks> that's true
<desrt> why not just use shellscripts?
<desrt> we have such luck with robustness and reliability with using those in postinst rules :D
<desrt> (no.. but seriously..)
<didrocks> well, do you want to add everytime the same transactional that for common operation, it's easy to miss
<didrocks> and yeah, I wanted to emphase on the reliability :p
<didrocks> s/that/stuff
<desrt> i'm not sure you gain much reliability by using a weird file format that nobody understands properly
<desrt> particularly when the examples you have listed here are all one-liners with the dconf commandline tool
<desrt> i also find your dconf examples to be a bit odd
<didrocks> desrt: well, removing the old directory, is not
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, i'm having window freezing and mouse freezing issues
<didrocks> which one?
<desrt> didrocks: the ones about setting or adding keys
<bcurtiswx> it's getting painful to load windows and things due to the wait
<desrt> you would never want to do this
<didrocks> desrt: well, we already had that into the past
<desrt> you'd rather change the system default
<didrocks> like adding a key in a list?
<desrt> didrocks: so with GSettingsList one of the requirements is that you can have a situation like the launcher and add a new item to it (from the system level) without modifying the user's config at all
<didrocks> you are speaking about +/apps/compiz/plugin_list = "fooplugin" right?
<bcurtiswx> seb128, any idea what may cause my desktop to freeze (mouse stops moving and maximization movement freezes for example)..
<desrt> same could be said for compiz plugins
<didrocks> indeed
<didrocks> we already had that
<didrocks> so it's a real case
<bcurtiswx> seb128, it happens when i load windows and maximize/minimize
<desrt> didrocks: i'm saying that GSettingsList will let you manage this case in a better way
<desrt> ie: no script required at all
<bcurtiswx> seb128, even switch windows in my browser
<seb128> bcurtiswx, no, maybe check session logs and xorg ones
<didrocks> desrt: are you sure it will be there in time this cycle?
<desrt> didrocks: i do think it might make sense in some cases to remove items or reset them
<seb128> bcurtiswx, is that precise? when did that start?
<desrt> didrocks: i will spend the rest of this week finishing my dconf cleanup and then i'm in a good place to start proper work on this
<desrt> it won't take more than a month
<desrt> so i think it's not a problem
<bcurtiswx> seb128, it's precise and it's been an issue for a few weeks.. i can't reproduce it, because at times it all works fine..
<didrocks> desrt: ok, so for the rest, it's just one or two liners, so you would say, shell script only?
<seb128> bcurtiswx, weird, I don't know :-(
<desrt> didrocks: i think the shellscript approach is pretty reasonable
<desrt> didrocks: it's already established as the universal hook language :)
<bcurtiswx> seb128, hmm, so debug would start at session logs and xorg logs
<didrocks> desrt: ok, if there is another way to handle lists, yeah, the whole extra sugar isn't needed
<didrocks> desrt: thanks for your input!
<desrt> didrocks: GSettingsList is something like my highest priority for this cycle now
<didrocks> desrt: great, if you need real test cases or so, do not hesitate to ping me :)
<desrt> didrocks: let's have a fun testcase.  do an upload of my dconf 'wip/reorg' branch to the desktop team ppa ;)
<desrt> i want to set a new record for the shortest length of time before someone comes on IRC asking "why can't i login?"
<bcurtiswx> seb128, is there any chance that not getting enough power to the graphics card ma cause these freezes ?
<bcurtiswx> s/ma/may
<didrocks> desrt: heh, we need to do it seriously then, and homologate the time :)
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, what else needed to be done with those two bugs ?
<kenvandine> did you tag them?
<kenvandine> oh wait...
<mterry> didrocks, those update-manager et al packages in proposed never got pushed over to release pocket
<didrocks> mterry: well, as told on Friday, you need to ping the release team to copy them over to release
<mterry> didrocks, ah, I misunderstood.  Will do
<bcurtiswx> seb128, confirmed empathy from archive (3.4.2.1) works and marked bug appropriately
<Laney> seb128: fancy uploading aisleriot? Just applying http://paste.ubuntu.com/1071469/ onto https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/quantal/+source/aisleriot/1:3.2.3.2-0ubuntu2/+files/aisleriot_3.2.3.2-0ubuntu2.dsc should do it.
<Laney> well, with s/UNRELEASED/quantal/ (bah dch)
<seb128> mdeslaur, hey
<seb128> mdeslaur, what was the issue you had trying to using pkexec from a .desktop in synaptic do you remember?
<seb128> mdeslaur, you added a wrapper
<jbicha> mterry: hi, guile-2.0 ftbfs on arm with test suite failures, we should fix that before promoting guile, right?
<Laney> I just posted a debdiff right there ^ to revert aisleriot
<Laney> I don't think anybody is going to port the guile-1.8 stuff in main to 2.0, and indeed 2.0 does ftbfs.
<seb128> jbicha, can you sponsor http://paste.ubuntu.com/1071469 if you have some time?
<seb128> I'm busy with other atm
<seb128> will do later otherwise
<seb128> jbicha, <Laney> seb128: fancy uploading aisleriot? Just applying http://paste.ubuntu.com/1071469/ onto https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/quantal/+source/aisleriot/1:3.2.3.2-0ubuntu2/+files/aisleriot_3.2.3.2-0ubuntu2.dsc should do it.
<mterry> jbicha, yes
<jbicha> we could also cheat by deleting the aisleriot source package and then just upload a newer 3.2 aisleriot than the last time
<Laney> we talked about that already
<Laney> not happening any more
<jbicha> aw, no cheating? :(
<Laney> nah
<seb128> jbicha, cjwatson says it's not garantish it wouldn't create issue and prefer not doing that
<jbicha> ok
<mterry> seb128, jbicha: we don't want to move to guile-2.0?
<Laney> mterry: I'd say it's more of a "can't" or "won't"
<Laney> i.e. the rdeps of -1.8 in main are tough to port, and 2.0 ftbfs on arm
<Laney> (it was already agreed we wouldn't keep two guiles in main)
<mterry> Laney, right, but the ftbfs is unlikely to be fixed?  (I haven't looked at it yet)
<mterry> Ah, ok
<seb128> mterry, it's not a transition I'ml wanting to put efforts in only to update a card game
<Laney> yes, the rewards are minor
<mterry> Laney, seb128: so we upload a 3.4.is.3.2?
<Laney> I spent a bit of time on it, and I think cyphermox put some more in when he was doing +1
<Laney> but it never got over the hump
<Laney> yeah. I put a debdiff up there ^
<mterry> Laney, ah!
<seb128> mterry, yes, please sponsor Laney's update if you have time ;-)
<mterry> Is anyone working to rewrite the game in non-guile?
<mterry> seb128, I'm on +1, so fixing these things is all I should be doing  :)
<Laney> haha
<Laney> it's quite a lot of scheme code
<Laney> 23017 lines in the .scm files *cough*
<mterry> Laney, but in the style of GNOME, I imagine it would be ported with only Klondike and Spider maybe  ;)
<seb128> mterry, I'm starting to believe we should maybe just swap it for some other games, Laney had puzzle ones ;-)
<seb128> mterry, they might just let one game with one card, like "guess which card is face down" :p
<seb128> you need complicated games when you can get an easy one!
<mterry> seb128, plenty of well-reviewed games in the software-center
<seb128> mterry, issue is often the space, lot of those are not small
 * didrocks waves good evening
<seb128> didrocks, 'night
<mterry> seb128, agreed, but we can just keep going down the list until we find something under 1MB or some such
<seb128> yeah, we could do that
<didrocks> good night seb128 :)
<mterry> night
<mterry> doh
<seb128> or maybe we can ship the game robert_ancell is writing for the ubuntu app contest ;-)
<dobey> seb128: btw, ubuntu-sso-client 3.0.2 and ubuntuone-storage-protocol 3.0.2 are awaiting approval in precise-proposed
<seb128> dobey, great, thanks
<mdeslaur> seb128: I believe launching pkexec from a .desktop file, either by clicking it in nautilus, or with gnome 2 wouldn't work...which is why the wrapper was needed
<mdeslaur> seb128: I'm not quite sure if that's still the case with unity, or with gnome-shell, or nautilus anymore
<seb128> mdeslaur, it's still the case with unity, that's why I was asking, cf bug #1020115
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1020115 in unity "Spawned commands can't use pkexec" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1020115
<seb128> is anyone using chromium on precise and could help to verify the SRU on bug #992352 so it can move to -updates?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 992352 in chromium-browser "Please update to 18.0.1025.168" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/992352
<chrisccoulson> nobody uses chromium! ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, it seems so! ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, though from errors.ubuntu.com no one use firefox either, no bug coming from it ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, that's because it has no bugs
<seb128> micahg, hey, could you or somebody from xubuntu look at bug #962469? it's the 3rd most popular bug on errors.ubuntu.com today
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 962469 in blueman "blueman-applet crashed with KeyError in card_cb(): 'bluez.path'" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/962469
<chrisccoulson> and also because they go to http://crash-stats.mozilla.com/ ;)
<micahg> seb128: firefox is blacklisted in apport (and I would guess in whoopsie as well)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, lol
<seb128> micahg, yeah, I was mostly trolling chrisccoulson ;-)
<micahg> seb128: I tried to get the upstream dev to look at it, will try again
<seb128> micahg, thanks
<Laney> I do, until Tweetdeck Web is as nice as the app for Chromium :(
<Laney> only as a twitter client though
<chrisccoulson> hah http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-18678659 !
<micahg> so that's where all our rain went!
 * kenvandine wants some of that
<Laney> it has been pretty grim
<Laney> and not so long ago there was a drought here :-)
<micahg> http://www.crh.noaa.gov/ilx/?n=drought
<robert_ancell> RAOF, anyway to make X or Xephyr run as non-root with Wayland?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: You should be able to run X under wayland as non-root. At least until I rip out it's input handling in favour of the real X drivers.
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Of course, the way it's set up you need to spawn wayland and X from a display manager for that to work.
<RAOF> But that's because weston doesn't quite know what to do with xwayland's root window.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yeah, I'm getting "X: user not authorized to run the X server, aborting.", but does that go away when you have all the DM signalling ducks in a rot
<robert_ancell> row
<RAOF> Oh, right! The wrapper!
<RAOF> If you run /usr/bin/Xorg instead that message will dissapear
<robert_ancell> oh, magic
<robert_ancell> RAOF, "Cannot move old log file "/var/log/Xorg.1.log" to "/var/log/Xorg.1.log.old""
<RAOF> Hah.
<RAOF> Oh, of course. This works for me locally because I set --prefix=$HOME/.local
<thomi> I notice that unity trunk is no longer being built into packages in the unity-team staging PPA for precise. Does anyone know if it's just not being built, or being put somewhere else?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: You'd need to pass -logfile somewhere that's user-writable
<thomi> autopilot is failing because it can't get unity trunk from a PPA anymore, and several required quantal packages are still broken...
 * RAOF loves how that's in a section âDevice Dependent Usageâ
<robert_ancell> RAOF /dev/null seems to work :)(
<robert_ancell> RAOF /dev/null seems to work :)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, I wonder if we should consider removing the X log file at some point.  It seems to be from the "when X was central to everything" time but we log it effectively in LightDM, and upstart logs everything above that effectively
<RAOF> robert_ancell: We could certainly do that - you'd want to set -verbose to something higher than default, and -logverbose to 0. And also make a massive documentation push so people know where the hell those logs have gone.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yeah, I think we'd want to start encouraging people to look at the LightDM logs now, and then remove the old ones in the future some time
<RAOF> First you'd want LightDM to pass a sufficient -verbose value so that it actually picks up everything that Xorg.0.log does by default.
<robert_ancell> yup
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-03
<bryceh> and maybe make the X logs in /var/log/lightdm readable by non-root
<RAOF> Sweetshark: What architectures have you tested libreoffice on?
<cyphermox> RAOF: had any btrfs-related issues lately?
<cyphermox> I think it ate my data on one computer; I keep getting a kernel panic and fsck won't fix it ;)
<RAOF> cyphermox: My filesystem no longer mounts :)
<cyphermox> oh yay
<cyphermox> exactly what I'm seeing
<RAOF> On one system.
<cyphermox> a spinning disk or SSD?
<RAOF> The purpose of btrfs is to remind people that dÃ©jÃ  dup has a âdailyâ option :)
<RAOF> SSD.
<cyphermox> ok
<RAOF> My *other* btrfs filesystems haven't had (any new) problems.
<cyphermox> remove_from_bitmap explodes, it seems
 * cyphermox wishes for the best for the laptop
<RAOF> This is actually a psuedo-laptop; it's my ivybridge SDP.
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> it's my new tower.
 * RAOF will bitch more fully once he's got a btrfs image of the dead filesystem and has posted to the mailing list.
<cyphermox> k
<BigWhale> Good Morning.
<ricotz> seb128, morning, just a note for the nautilus problem, did you consider 05_desktop_menu_export.patch might trigger this?
<seb128> hey ricotz, yes I did but nautilus didn't change and downgrading gtk makes the pb go awya
<seb128> hey desktopers
<didrocks> salut seb128 :)
<ricotz> seb128, ok, right
<RAOF> Yo seb128
<seb128> hey didrocks, RAOF, how areyou
<seb128> ?
<didrocks> seb128: meeting report reminder!
<didrocks> seb128: I'm fine, thanks, yourself?
<seb128> didrocks, thanks, I'm good!
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti
<pitti> seb128: g-i-theme> right
<pitti> seb128: we could also consider dropping the split now that we have bigger images
<seb128> pitti, hey, welcome back! had a good w.e?
<seb128> pitti, thanks for your sms btw ;-)
<Sweetshark> RAOF: amd64
<Sweetshark> morning all
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark
<didrocks> Sweetshark: so still as well on this C++11 fun? :)
<Sweetshark> didrocks: on the days at work an in the nights in my nightmares ...
<pitti> seb128: it was great, indeed
<pitti> seb128: we had some nice time with my family, and now I'm visiting a friend of mine
<pitti> he became PhD yesterday and defended his thesis
<seb128> nice
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> hey mr Coulson, how are you? ;)
<didrocks> do anyone knows what launches gsettings-schema-convert at session startup?
<didrocks> I just noted it's in python, so I think I won't use a similar code for our desktop migration tool
<didrocks> ah, it's in fact -data-convert
<didrocks> so ok, all C ;)
<Sweetshark> didrocks: http://gcc.gnu.org/ml/gcc/2012-07/msg00024.html \o/
<didrocks> Sweetshark: good, that was my discussion with the gcc guys, that it was a mistake :)
<mpt> "Replace your changes in '/etc/gnome/defaults.list' with a later version of the configuration file?"
 * mpt hunts for the "I Don't Know" button
<xclaesse> seb128, out of curiosity: any progress for EDS 3.5 in Quantal?
<ricotz> cyphermox, ^ ;)
<pitti> seb128: meh, this jockey DBus crash is a mystery to me; we have filtered out this exception since precise
<pitti> and stopped getting dupes ever since to LP
<topyli> mpt: iirc it says "if you don't know, say yes" :)
<mpt> topyli, true, but not really good enough :-]
<topyli> it's debconf legacy
<topyli> don't you dare touch debconf legacy! the force might disrupted become
<pitti> it's actually not debconf, but dpkg conffiles
<mpt> Yeah, if it was debconf I would have redesigned it already
<Laney> If you're getting spurious conffile prompts (for files you haven't modified), then it's a bug in the package.
<topyli> good point
<chrisccoulson> w00t, just got a new ubuntu mouse mat
<didrocks> heh :)
<seb128> hum, I totally forgot to reply to backlog after lunch
<bcurtiswx> good morning
<seb128> pitti, hum, but whoopsie said it was reported 117 times today, but in fact the exception is different, the signature matching is not clever enough to match that
<seb128> pitti, those have
<seb128> "File "/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/dbus/connection.py", line 651, in call_blocking
<seb128>     message, timeout)
<seb128> DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name :1.68 was not provided by any .service files"
<pitti> ah, ServiceUnknown - that's indeed a different one (but equally useless by itself)
<seb128> pitti, i.e https://errors.ubuntu.com/oops/0001b602-9b7c-11e1-98aa-e4115b0f8a4a
<seb128> pitti, ok, so those bugs stacktrace match https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/jockey/+bug/881992
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 881992 in jockey "jockey-text crashed with DBusException in call_blocking(): org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name :1.75 was not provided by any .service files" [Medium,Confirmed]
<pitti> seb128: not quite
<pitti> seb128: but close enough, I guess
<seb128> hum, indeed, not quite the same stacktrace
<pitti> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/jockey/+bugs?field.searchtext=org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown
<seb128> I hate all those dbus timeout or service issues bugs in python processes
<pitti> right, these are just equally useless
<pitti> unless d-bus activation itself is buggy
<pitti> duped the other two to 881992
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> I wonder if these are from a live environment
<pitti> or something which could cause activation to take more than the timeout
<seb128> pitti, some are ... you think it's too slow and goes to timeout?
<pitti> I don't know really
<seb128> like that bug states "Using live install from USB on an Asus EEE 1015px netbook with Windows 7 starter installed"
<pitti> the error message tells me no reason at all, just that activation failed
<pitti> but judging by https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.searchtext=org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown I'm not alone with this
<seb128> right, same issue that didrocks is getting with oneconf bugs
<pitti> where "I" == jockey
<pitti> so I don't think it's a specific bug in jockey
<seb128> no
<seb128> well as you said the error is useless as well
<pitti> so we could certainly ignore those in apport
<didrocks> +1 on hating this :)
<seb128> you could have a real bug which makes the service hang
<pitti> almost useless, yes
<pitti> but the S/N ratio is ridiculously low
<pitti> so if we want to filter it out, WFM
<seb128> pitti, can we figure a way to get a status dump from the service in those cases?
<pitti> seb128: what kind of status?
<pitti> pidof perhaps
<seb128> pitti, knowing if the service is running, hanging, using cpu, failing to start...
<seb128> if it's installed
<seb128> pitti, we either find a way to make those bugs useful or ignore them
<pitti> yes, I think that's a good idea
<seb128> the issue is that I'm concerned we do filter out some valid bugs affecting the service side by just dropping those reports
<seb128> pitti, I will open a bug on apport for discussion, ok?
<pitti> woudl you mind filing a bug about this with your ideas?
<pitti> seb128: merci beaucoup
<seb128> pitti, danke schÃ¶n ;-)
<pitti> seb128: yes, we could then file bugs for "nonexisting", "not responding", or "not running"
<pitti> where the first and last would be actually useful
<pitti> I'm debugging a race condition in udisks today (all day already, ugh), will look at this later in the week
<seb128> right
<seb128> pitti, no hurry, thanks
<seb128> one another class of bugs I hate is "DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoServer: Failed to connect to socket /tmp/dbus-gja1frOF6L: Connection refused"
<pitti> seb128: for the "not responding" case we could use the machinery being developed by ev for hanging apps
<seb128> oh yeah, good idea
<pitti> but I need to think about this, we can't ask the user about that
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<pitti> hey tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> pitti, it is about bug 1020480
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1020480 in cups "package cups-bsd 1.5.3-0ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: il sottoprocesso vecchio script di pre-removal ha restituito lo stato di errore 127" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1020480
<tkamppeter> pitti, the update fails because the update-inetd executable is missing for the prerm script. I have checked and cups-bsd already depends on update-inetd. Is a stronger dependency needed here?
<pitti> tkamppeter: hm, no off-hand idea about this, I'm afraid; Depends should be fine
<pitti> tkamppeter: perhaps you can ask the guy about "which update-inetd" and whether update-inetd is installed?
<desrt> good morning everyone
<desrt> didrocks: i notice you have an item marked 'DONE' in daily blames.  is that actually setup with QA now?
<tkamppeter> pitti, thank you, done.
<didrocks> desrt: there are some unit python tests (as well as a bunch of other tests) and jibel is deploying them this week
<desrt> sweet
<desrt> i'll be happy to finally have those online
<didrocks> desrt: basically, I'm getting your output, revamping it a little bit to be python unittest like :)
<didrocks> desrt: oh, and incoming unity release doesn't write to dconf at all, even on first logging
<desrt> sweetness
<didrocks> login*
<didrocks> even :)
<desrt> i wonder if we still have that weird issue on the guest session
<seb128> didrocks, pitti: bug #1020572
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1020572 in apport "Deal better with DbusException errors" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1020572
<seb128> desrt, good morning ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: sweet, thanks!
<didrocks> desrt: which issue?
<desrt> seb128: hey :)
<cyphermox> xclaesse: EDS 3.5: working on getting it to -proposed now
<desrt> didrocks: i think the setting to disable the lock in the screensaver gets written to gconf on guest session login and then the gsettings migration reads it from gconf and writes it to dconf
<pitti> seb128: thanks
<desrt> it's a bit ridiculous :)
<xclaesse> cyphermox, cool :)
<didrocks> desrt: oh right, let's see how it goes :)
<desrt> didrocks: now that i think about it, though, it may simply not be possible to do this in a substantially better way
<desrt> ie: even if we get rid of the ridiculous gconf stuff, it's still a write to dconf
<cyphermox> xclaesse: sorry, I was hoping to get to coordinate an upload of thunderbird w/ chrisccoulson too for this, but couldn't discuss it with him on Friday :)
<didrocks> desrt: indeed, still a write to it :/
<desrt> i don't care too much about that, though
<desrt> guest sessions are not normal
<desrt> and this is one case where doing that write really does make sense in a weird way
<xclaesse> cyphermox, how is thunderbird related to EDS?
<didrocks> the test is running on a normal fresh user session :)
<desrt> didrocks: one other thing: were you going to be the one looking into using dconf profiles as a more flexible alternative to gsettings schema overrides?
<desrt> (i recall this now becuase it is a way we could get the guest session to work, but i doubt that it is worth it)
<cyphermox> xclaesse: thunderbird builds a binary that depends on some eds libraries, and to avoid breaking things I'd like to be able to land things in -proposed first then copy to -release when things are ready and pretty stable
<didrocks> desrt: hum, I don't remember about that. I expressde interest in the past about per session dconf profile, but we don't really need it anymore, at least, for now
<desrt> didrocks: the idea was so that we could have a more-upstream-like gnome session
<desrt> without the overrides
<cyphermox> xclaesse: for thunderbird, it's addressbook integration
<xclaesse> cyphermox, ah ok, good :)
<xclaesse> cyphermox, there is folks using new EDS as well
<didrocks> ah, no, you didn't discuss that with me, but I can get what you mean :)
<cyphermox> xclaesse: indeed, so kenvandine was very much looking forward to it ;)
<didrocks> hum, not sure it worthes it now TBH, apart if we really have overriden settings not compatible at all with other non default cases
<xclaesse> cyphermox, dunno if EDS 3.4 is parallel installable with 3.5...
<cyphermox> xclaesse: that's why we need to go through -proposed; or more exactly why it would be better, to avoid having uninstallable binaries
<xclaesse> ok I see :)
<xclaesse> thanks
<cyphermox> as soon as I figure out why sbuild disappeared from my system I'll do one last build test for eds and upload somewhere
<kenvandine> cyphermox, :)
<cyphermox> I was having issues with one of the addressbook tests failing to build because it didn't have -fPIC
<desrt> didrocks: it was an idea we wanted to implement at UDS.  i just don't remember who took the item :)
<desrt> it could have been robert
<seb128> dobey, hey, could somebody from u1 look at trapping the error from bug #937132 for the next sso SRU?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 937132 in ubuntu-sso-client "ubuntu-sso-login crashed with RuntimeError in /usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/gi/overrides/Gdk.py: Gdk couldn't be initialized" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/937132
<didrocks> desrt: won't it be a perf regression? I mean, you have to open multiple files instead of just two (the system one and the user one). Maybe negligeable, but still :)
<desrt> didrocks: pretty small indeed
<desrt> dconf lookups are ~hashtable speed
<desrt> also: this other database would never be written to.  lovely :)
<cyphermox> seb128: fyi, going to go mobile this afternoon to try and debug WPA enterprise auth issues; which require me to go to my university, so I'm likely to be offline for a little while during the time wifi is being debugged ;)
<didrocks> indeed :)
<seb128> cyphermox, ok, no worry, good luck with the debugging!
<cyphermox> yeah :/
<cyphermox> not sure how luck will play, seems to be something funky in how wpasupplicant speaks to openssl, and generally black magic
<seb128> cyphermox, don't forgot the file up https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-07-03 with what you did or topic if you a minute before going ;-)
<cyphermox> seb128: I'll only be leaving in a couple of hours, after lunch and all
<seb128> ok
<cyphermox> trying to finish up eds first :)
<seb128> cool
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: oh, what issues are those? Maybe it's related to broken openssl tls 1.1 in precise?
<dobey> seb128: any idea why that one is happening? i started looking at it, but the correct fix requires a fairly large bit of refactoring unfortunately.
<cyphermox> mdeslaur: somewhat related to tls 1.1 yes
<cyphermox> mdeslaur: fortunately there is possibly an easy workaround for wpasupplicant which I can apply without breaking too many things; SSL_NO_OP_TICKET might help a lot
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: ok, then it's a known openssl issue that I will fix soon....see #1018998
<seb128> dobey, I would say it's noise, but if we could trap it in a try: catch: to avoid spamming users with whoopsie system errors dialogs...
<cyphermox> mdeslaur: the issue is tentatively caused by the Session Ticket extension in TLS
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: ah, ok, possibly unrelated then
<seb128> dobey, by experience those are happening at session closing or for people who try to run the said command over an ssh or a vt
<cyphermox> mdeslaur: well, kind of related. TLS is painful for everyone ;)
<mdeslaur> hehe
<cyphermox> ohh; actually it might be very very relevant
<dobey> seb128: right. would just like to know what people are doing exactly, to get that
<dobey> seb128: hard to write tests when i have no idea why things are happening :)
<cyphermox> mdeslaur: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wpasupplicant/+bug/969343
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 969343 in oem-priority "Unable to connect to WPA enterprise wireless" [High,In progress]
<dobey> seb128: also, is there any way to see a report for a specific version on e.u.c? one of the issues lists "latest seen" version as being the version the issue should have been fixed in
<dobey> which is of course, odd
<seb128> dobey, no, it's a known issue and being worked
<seb128> dobey, it's on ev's list
<dobey> ok
<seb128> dobey, that can happen because current whoopsie report the installed version at issue time, not the running version
<dobey> ah ok
<seb128> dobey, so if users upgraded and didn't restart and the process hit the bug you will get the wrong version reported...
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: ah! yes, that could definitely be related...just rebuilding wpasupplicant with the release version of openssl in precise should solve the issue
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: or, wait a couple of days until I push an openssl update to -proposed
<cyphermox> mdeslaur: what do you mean rebuilding?
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: no change rebuild
<cyphermox> rebuilding shouldn't be necessary here, just starting a new wpasupplicant process should be sufficient no?
<dobey> seb128: or if the crash already happened in precise, and then they didn't report the issue until after an upgrade to quantal that was happening during the user's session where the crash happened?
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: no because wpasupplicant was built with openssl 1.0.0, so it disables tls v1.1 by mistake
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: "Any package in the repo that got compiled on oneiric, or on precise before 2012-03-24 02:03:49 EDT got compiled with SSL_OP_ALL set to 0x80000FFFL, and is telling openssl on precise to disable tls v1.1."
<cyphermox> ah, interesting
<cyphermox> but then SSL_OP_NO_TICKET couldn't possibly fix anything
<cyphermox> ... because TLS 1.1 is already disabled, so its extensions should also be ;)
<seb128> dobey, no, versions are collected at the incident time
<seb128> dobey, not at the report time
<cyphermox> mdeslaur: anyway, I'll test just rebuilding it; I much rather if that fixes things than crippling wpa supplicant and EAP-FAST support
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: I would start by simply rebuilding it and seeing if that solves it...the problem could be completely unrelated to the openssl issue though, but you'll see right away
<dobey> seb128: ok, something is weird then, because the ubuntuone-installer issue shows the quantal version as the last seen, which has the fix for the issue :-/
<cyphermox> mdeslaur: right
<mpt> "Python (v2.7) requires to install plugins to play media files of the following type: text/html decoder" -- yeah, like that's ever going to work
<seb128> dobey, well, maybe somebody was running the installer and upgrading at the same time
<dobey> seb128: maybe
<seb128> dobey, speaking of which, when do you plan to SRU that one? ;-)
<dobey> seb128: not sure, it needs a bit more work, as failing apt updates from PPAs and such breaks it now
<dobey> brb
<didrocks> desrt: hey, I see not anymore /etc/dconf/profiles or whatever, is it intended?
<desrt> didrocks: you'd be amazed how often i get this question :)
<desrt> didrocks: i'm a young-earth creationist
<didrocks> heh :)
<desrt> i believe that files in /etc need to be created
<desrt> and that they were not simply caused to exist from nothing
<desrt> the default configuration is emptiness
<desrt> some intelligent creator needs to come along to change that
<seb128> desrt, what is we got only dumb creators?
<seb128> if
<didrocks> that's a valid point seb128 :)
<didrocks> desrt: as a reminder, those profiles are stacked dconf databases, right? reading from bottom to top?
<desrt> didrocks: or top to bottom, depending on perspective
<desrt> the one on the top is the one that gets checked 'first'
<desrt> ie: if you have the same setting in two databases the the first one wins
<didrocks> and the one where writing will happen?
<cyphermox> what's everyone's feeling re: the "Sent from Ubuntu" signature patch in Evolution?
<didrocks> cyphermox: we can kill it
<Laney> destroy it
<seb128> cyphermox, kill
<cyphermox> I'd be inclined to drop it or just merge it into the Evolution autogenerated one
<didrocks> was an awesome hack, I liked it though, but well ;)
<desrt> didrocks: the writing always happens in the first one
<desrt> didrocks: it's the only way it makes sense, if you consider it
<desrt> didrocks: if the writing happens to the bottom one and the first one has a key then you will never see the new value that you wrote
<cyphermox> dropping it is; but if someone screams let me know and I have an idea how to fix it
<didrocks> desrt: agreed, but prefer double checking. And so, how does this play with ${XDG_CONFIG_DIR}/dconf/user? :)
<desrt> it does not?
<didrocks> ah, so you are not looking for this env variable?
<seb128> cyphermox, there will be no screaming don't worry
<desrt> no
<didrocks> mterry tried to trick me!
<desrt> /etc is hardcoded, i think
<didrocks> it's a shame :)
<pitti> hm, very confusing; since today's upgrades, terminal windows gradually shrink themselves vertically over time
<desrt> and there is no expansion done on variable names in the file
<kenvandine> pitti, that sounds like fun
<desrt> pitti: that sounds like compiz :D
<pitti> hey kenvandine, how are you?
<kenvandine> good
<desrt> pitti: and almost certainly something to do with the grid sizing constraints...
<mterry> didrocks, what did I lie about?
<kenvandine> my terminals aren't shrinking yet, so better than you i guess :)
<pitti> mterry: hey Mike, good morning
<mterry> pitti, hello!
<pitti> mterry: very happy to see the u-m autopkgtest :)
<didrocks> desrt: ok, so the only env variable you are using is ${XDG_DATA_DIRS}/glib-2.0/schemas/gschemas.compiled, right?
<mterry> pitti, yeah.  :) still needs more tests, but it's a start
<desrt> didrocks: yes.  gsettings consults the XDG_DATA_DIRS
<didrocks> mterry: XDG_CONFIG_DIR is not used for values checking, the magic happens in /etc/dconf/profile
<desrt> didrocks: incidentally, i feel quite strongly about the way that gsettings uses paths
<pitti> mterry: it failed, it's at least missing a python-mock dep and apparently something else
<mterry> desrt, oh it doesn't use CONFIG_DIR ?  Well, it at least uses HOME I believe
<desrt> didrocks: but i'm not as totally convinced about dconf
<didrocks> desrt: ah?
<mterry> desrt, I know I've been able to fake it to use a different location
<pitti> desrt: ah, blaming compiz then :)
<desrt> mterry: you can set DCONF_PROFILE=(absolute path)
<didrocks> pitti: no compiz update from today, juts to say ;)
<desrt> in that case it will skip looking in /etc
<mterry> desrt, yar, but without doing that I've gotten it to use a custom database path
<mterry> pretty sure it was just CONFIG_DIR
<desrt> XDG_CONFIG_DIR, you mean?
<mterry> yeah
<desrt> i avoided using that because the default value is /etc/xdg/
<desrt> which i consider to be just plain stupid
<mterry> desrt, oh shit, sorry.  XDG_CONFIG_HOME?
<mterry> The user's one
<desrt> oh yes.  that works of course.
<mterry> didrocks, ^ sorry, XDG_CONFIG_HOME, not _DIR
<didrocks> ahah :)
<desrt> that will put the user's database into a different directory
<didrocks> so, reiterating my question
<didrocks> desrt: I guess XDG_CONFIG_HOME is set "on top of the stack" compared to /etc/dconf/profile ?
<mterry> pitti, :(  OK.  So I ran the tests using adt-run locally.  Is there a good way to run them in a closer environment to jenkins to hit such issues?
<didrocks> on top meaning "where you will write"?
<desrt> didrocks: it depends on how you setup the profile
<pitti> mterry: I set up a kvm instance which is pretty close to jenkins'
<pitti> mterry: hang on
<desrt> didrocks: probably you want to do this: create a dconf profile called "unity" (ie: file in /etc/dconf/profile/unity)
<desrt> put in it these two lines (in order):
<desrt> user-db:user
<desrt> system-db:unity
<desrt> then create /etc/dconf/db/unity.d/ and put some keyfiles there
<desrt> then 'dconf update'
<desrt> then when you set DCONF_PROFILE=unity it will read the values from the /etc/dconf/db/unity if the user has not set their own values
<pitti> mterry: http://jblablog.wordpress.com/2012/06/19/local-ubuntu-vm-provisioning-with-cloud-init/
<pitti> mterry: basically, it's a standard server cloud image which I start with -snapshot
<didrocks> desrt: user-db is matching the XDG_CONFIG_HOME value?
<desrt> didrocks: yes
<didrocks> desrt: do you have a doc for this profile or are there only those 2 keywords? (user-db and system-db)
<desrt> user-db:x corresponds to a file in $XDG_CONFIG_HOME/dconf/x
<desrt> didrocks: https://live.gnome.org/dconf/SystemAdministrators
<didrocks> desrt: perfect, that will avoid me bothering you more! :)
<didrocks> desrt: seems straightforward, thanks!
<pitti> mterry: a pbuilder login might suffice as well, though
<mterry> pitti, ah nice.  I was hoping for a one liner, but I'll take what I can get.  dep8 will be tough for people to adopt without being able to easily test
<mterry> pitti, you don't get X with that though
<pitti> mterry: for your case, anyway; I need an actual vm for some of the stuff I'm testing (like udisks)
<pitti> mterry: jenkins VM are not running X
<pitti> mterry: you need to use xvfb-run if you do
<mterry> pitti, oh really?  I thought we had that available.  OK.  Hmm..  I think one of the u-m tests briefly displays a window
<mterry> pitti, well that's good then.  I know pbuilder  :)
<pitti> desrt: ah, I did get a new compiz this morning; it also seems to hang every hour, very annoying :(
<pitti> popey: ^ am I the only one seeing this?
<popey> news to me
<popey> pitti, what chipset?
<pitti> popey: Intel Arrandale
<popey> pitti, what version do you have now?
<pitti> popey: 1:0.9.8+bzr3249-0ubuntu2
<popey> pitti, anything that triggers it?
 * popey is running it here on intel sandybridge and has had no lockups
<pitti> popey: hard to say; I have worked on udisks test suite all day, which causes quite a bit of load
<pitti> I'll watch it more closely
<pitti> I also got a new kernel and other stuff, all updates since Friday
<popey> i have had my hang recently when doing vast IO on quantal
<popey> *my laptop
<dobey> yay a new image got built today. wonder if works any better on my system
<chrisccoulson> we need something like this for when launchpad is offline: http://hardhat.mozilla.net/en-US/bugzilla.html
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: heh, unfortunately, the down time is really small now :)
<seb128> didrocks, chrisccoulson, kenvandine, tkamppeter, Laney, mlankhorst, mterry, cyphermox, Ursinha: ups, we are bit past meeting time ... did anyone had a topic to discuss (none on the wiki)?
<didrocks> seb128: didn't you want to discuss about WI status?
<chrisccoulson> Nothing to discuss, but I might add some stuff to the wiki in a bit
<seb128> didrocks, good point
<kenvandine> nope
<seb128> not so much needed to discuss as a team
<seb128> I've tried to talk directly to people about their items
<didrocks> will you get killed on Friday? Should we find a backup or a volonteer to go to the meeting? :)
<seb128> didrocks, chrisccoulson, kenvandine, tkamppeter, Laney, mlankhorst, mterry, cyphermox, Ursinha, bryceh, RAOF, TheMuso: please make sure to update your workitems regularly and start considering to drop some feature work if you are behind
<seb128> http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-quantal/canonical-desktop-team-quantal-alpha-3
<seb128> doesn't look good :p
<kenvandine> indeed
<kenvandine> i'll review them
<Ursinha> seb128, ack
<mterry> seb128, pre-emptively drop feature work?  I have some stuff I know I probably won't get to, but I was going to wait until post FF to officially drop them from WI.  Should I just do it now?
<Laney> Well, I'm a bit concerned about g-s-d/g-c-c lagging
<didrocks> Laney: gsettings compiz is coming
<seb128> mterry, if we will not get to it yes, I started dropping some of stuff or talking to people about dropping early
<didrocks> Laney: Normally this week, ask popey for the status
<seb128> Laney, right, me as well
<Laney> didrocks: we don't need to block the updates on that though, do we?
<seb128> Laney, as didrocks says, that's blocked on compiz and should be unblocked withing a week
<didrocks> Laney: we do
<didrocks> Laney: the patches are intrusive, (reverting gsettings)
<didrocks> so not easy to update them
<didrocks> knowing it's to drop them anyway afterwards
<didrocks> so better to update and drop the patch at the same time
<didrocks> but for that, we need compiz understanding gsettings
<Laney> well I did actually do the 3.5.4 update the other day but it didn't work properly
<Laney> aha
<Laney> the patches are already dropped in bzr
<seb128> right
<seb128> the vcs is ready for the new compiz
<seb128> what didn't work properly?
<seb128> we should get g-s-d and g-c-c in a state where they work properly
<seb128> out of keybindings changes
<seb128> which will come with compiz
<Laney> hum, let me see, I posted it on the bug
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/1008840/comments/5
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1008840 in gnome-settings-daemon "Update to 3.5.4" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> the keyboard stuff is going to be a pain
<seb128> not speaking about the keybindings
<seb128> but rather their refactoring to use ibus
<seb128> we will probably need to rewrite our indicator patch
<Laney> who maintains that?
<seb128> Laney, that? the keyboard indicator?
<Laney> oh, thought you were referring to the patch I referenced there
<Laney> but yes, that also
<seb128> same story
<seb128> it got done by dx by then and we "maintain" it
<Laney> ok
<seb128> ok, I guess that was all for the meeting, thanks guys ;-)
<mlankhorst> seb128: hey ok, I'll update, still getting the work done that I want to get done though, :)
<seb128> Laney, let's try to get those updates in the ubuntu-desktop ppa for extra testing
<seb128> mlankhorst, hey, good, thanks ;-)
<mlankhorst> it's just this item taking slightly longer.. [mlankhorst] make sure dmabuf synching framework is suitable for i915/nouveau: INPROGRESS
<didrocks> good night everyone :)
<desrt> seb128: you're on ecryptfs, right?
<cyphermox> kenvandine: is folks ready?
<desrt> anyone here has an ecryptfs home directory?
<desrt> if so, please run this and share the output: strace -e trace=statfs df ~
<kenvandine> cyphermox, not yet, but it can be very soon :)
<kenvandine> cyphermox, eds in -proposed?
<cyphermox> kenvandine: not yet, but it can be very soon ;)
<cyphermox> I'm finishing up building evo locally; then I'll upload to my PPA just to be sure
<kenvandine> haha
<cyphermox> evolution-exchange will go much quicker
<kenvandine> cyphermox, ok, just let me know when eds makes it
<cyphermox> but at least eds, gtkhtml, evo will be ready
<cyphermox> sure
<kenvandine> i can have folks done quickly
<cyphermox> it's a matter of minutes
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> folks will be a soname change and stuff
<kenvandine> so more than just a rebuild
<kenvandine> i want to build it :)
<cyphermox> chrisccoulson wants to upload thunderbird tomorrow maybe; so if it could all be in proposed by then we could promote everything tomorrow
<kenvandine> wfm
<cyphermox> the most annoying ones are really eds, evo, gtkhtml, gnome-contacts and folks afaict
<kenvandine> i'll do gnome-contacts too
<cyphermox> ok
<kenvandine> i am knee deep in gnome-contacts right now :)
<cyphermox> depends on folks, right?
<kenvandine> yes
<cyphermox> cool
<cyphermox> kenvandine: fyi: http://people.ubuntu.com/~mathieu-tl/transitions/
<kenvandine> SWEET
<kenvandine> i should set that up for when i do libindicator or dbusmenu transitions :)
<cyphermox> ah, the indicators is what I was forgetting
<Streamstormer> desrt, http://paste.ubuntuusers.de/raw/409427/
<cyphermox> kenvandine: normally should take into account -proposed too; but I update the files manually
<kenvandine> cyphermox, i can do indicator-datetime as well
<Streamstormer> desrt, in precise
<kenvandine> unless you have that already
<Streamstormer> desrt, *on precise
<cyphermox> not started yet, but you don't have to take everything ;)
<desrt> Streamstormer: i was more interested in the output of strace :)
<kenvandine> cyphermox, you can do it :)
<desrt> Streamstormer: ie: the contents of the statfs() line
<Streamstormer> desrt, ? But this is the output?? There is nothing else..
<desrt> Streamstormer: strace didn't produce any output?  very odd...
<Streamstormer> desrt, No statfs() output on quantal too..
<desrt> that's very odd.  i get statfs output here.
<desrt> what command are you typing?
<Streamstormer> desrt, strace -e trace=statfs df ~
<desrt> i wonder why that works fo rme
<desrt> also on precise...
<desrt> maybe try like this: strace df ~ 2>&1 | grep statfs
<desrt> i'd say that the different may be because of ecryptfs but in theory the statfs syscall is how it determines what fs type you have in the first place
<Streamstormer> desrt, \o/
<Streamstormer> desrt, statfs64("/home/benedikt", 84, {f_type=0xf15f, f_bsize=4096, f_blocks=130988792, f_bfree=63308642, f_bavail=56751830, f_files=32784384, f_ffree=32461997, f_fsid={1353147257, 1045600430}, f_namelen=143, f_frsize=4096}) = 0
<desrt> ahh... are you on i386?
<Streamstormer> desrt, yes
<desrt> that certainly explains it
<desrt> thanks :)
<Streamstormer> desrt, np :)
<desrt> #define ECRYPTFS_SUPER_MAGIC    0xf15f
<desrt> hm.  fascinating.
 * desrt would have expected a single magic number for all FUSE-based filesystems
<kenvandine> cyphermox, there is an eds 3.5.3.1 which contains the fixes libfolks needs
<cyphermox> great
<cyphermox> yeah I had to play around with evo 3.5.3.1 already
<kenvandine> cyphermox, folks won't build with 3.5.3, so good.. you're going to be upload 3.5.3.1 then?
<cyphermox> yes
<kenvandine> awesome
<kenvandine> thx
<cyphermox> it's not that much more work once the heavy lifting is done
 * cyphermox is downloading the tarball now
<kenvandine> i tried to build against what you have in your ppa
<cyphermox> oh cool
<kenvandine> won't though :)
<cyphermox> I think all I have to do is update the tarball now, so I'll push it again in a minute
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> if you can do a push of your packaging branch somewhere too i can kick off a local build as well
<cyphermox> ahh it's all there already
<cyphermox> lp:~mathieu-tl/evolution-data-server/release-3.5.3
<cyphermox> I'm updating it with the changelog change to 3.5.3.1 now
<cyphermox> I've been pushing everything to LP quickly for fear of a filesystem crash
<kenvandine> great
<kenvandine> hummm... my wife just reminded me tomorrow is a holiday
<cyphermox> kenvandine: yeah
<cyphermox> kenvandine: do you have your stuff in a branch, I'll gladly carry on
<kenvandine> cyphermox, not yet
<kenvandine> cyphermox, if i can't finish it i'll point you at it
<kenvandine> thx!
<cyphermox> ah crap, gnome-keyring had evo fail :/
<cyphermox> I suck; missing build-dep
<dobey> kenvandine: heh, did you forget to take tomorrow off?
<kenvandine> dobey, almost!
<kenvandine> dobey, i've missed several holidays... just forget :)
<dobey> heh
<cyphermox> kenvandine: evolution-data-server 3.5.3.1 just uploaded to my ppa
<kenvandine> cyphermox, cool
<kenvandine> cyphermox, libedataserver1.2-dev needs to depend on libgnome-keyring-dev too
<cyphermox> right, that's why evolution ftbfs
<kenvandine> breaks things that build deps on eds
<kenvandine> cyphermox, i have folks and empathy prepared
<kenvandine> cyphermox, in fact, i can go ahead and upload them to -proposed and they'll depwait
<cyphermox> kenvandine: cool; if that's all that was missing I'll upload e-d-s as soon as it's done building here again
<kenvandine> cyphermox, that's it :)
<kenvandine> just get that depends fixed
<kenvandine> assuming you did
<cyphermox> yup, building in the ppa now
<cyphermox> I gave infinity a head's up about the uploads
<kenvandine> awesome
<kenvandine> i'll upload
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> still hacking at evolution though, there's a segfault in /usr/lib/evolution/evolution-source-registry
<kenvandine> cyphermox, folks and empathy uploaded and will depwait
<kenvandine> cyphermox, i didn't get to gnome-contacts, can you do that?
<cyphermox> thanks
<cyphermox> yes, I'll take care of it
<cyphermox> after dinner actually
<cyphermox> thanks to mbarnes the evo issue got figured out; e-d-s needs to building without -Bsymbolic-functions
<kenvandine> cyphermox, cool... thanks!
<kenvandine> i need to head out
<cyphermox> ok
<seb128> cyphermox, do you know how to strip that out?
<cyphermox> not really ;)
<seb128> cyphermox, look to gnome-bluetooth as an example
<cyphermox> ah, thanks
<seb128> LDFLAGS=$(shell echo $$LDFLAGS | sed -e 's/-Wl,-Bsymbolic-functions//')
<seb128> export LDFLAGS
<seb128> cyphermox, in the rules
<cyphermox> yeah
<cyphermox> I thought there was a less hackish way :)
<seb128> sorry I didn't see that you had that issue earlier
<cyphermox> seb128: I only just found out
<seb128> I read about that some days ago
<seb128> ok, so you didn't lost too much time, good
<seb128> fta run into it some days ago
<cyphermox> I would never have been able to tell that that crash was caused by that flag
<seb128> he was speaking about it on #evolution with mbarnes
<cyphermox> ahah :)
<seb128> they are easy to reconize once you saw one
<seb128> the gtype warnings
<cyphermox> ah ok
<seb128> I guess you got some of those?
<cyphermox> yeah, then cool
<cyphermox> seemed unusual but I don't know enough about what that flag does to figure out the link anwyay
<cyphermox> even then, I couldn't find what brings those in, if it's hardening flags, or default gcc flags, or what
<cyphermox> oh, but of course I looked at the wrong places
<seb128> cyphermox, it's in the default gcc flags
<seb128> cyphermox, the issues is usually when a symbol is defined in 2 objects
<cyphermox> seb128: yeah, I think my grep-fu failed me this time
<seb128> like the bin and a .so
<cyphermox> I was looking at gcc -dumpspecs
<seb128> cyphermox, http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-settings-daemon/commit/?id=6cfa8efd447bcad22c67ab98a566811b62ea6765
<seb128> that's a recent example with a bit of explanation with the fix
<cyphermox> right
<seb128> cyphermox, basically with the flag the objects get duplicated in each binary and you hit a conflict due to the double definition
<cyphermox> bbl
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell bryceh RAOF TheMuso meeting report reminder https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-07-03 please update and add agenda items.
<TheMuso> Yep done.
<TheMuso> Nothing from me.
<jasoncwarner_> thanks, TheMuso
<bryceh> no agenda items from me; taken care of via yesterday's email to list
<robert_ancell> none from me
<RAOF> Nor from me.
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-04
<RAOF> Oooh, fun. Don't set $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR to somewhere under $HOME. It seems gvfs will then mount smb shares there, and then deja dup will attempt to back them up.
<smspillaz> RAOF: around ?
<RAOF> smspillaz: Correct!
<smspillaz> RAOF: if something worked kinda flakey on nouveau, but worked fine on intel, would that indicate a driver bug ?
<smspillaz> RAOF: having some more issues with mipmaps
<smspillaz> seems like if the rendering pipeline has got operations with mipmaps in them, if you call glGenerateMipmap on a new color buffer, it generates invalid mipmaps
<RAOF> It's plausible that it's a driver bug.
<RAOF> Got a nice small test case?
 * RAOF expects the answer to be no, but hope springs eternal.
<smspillaz> RAOF: not really :/
<smspillaz> RAOF: haven't had time to make one
<smspillaz> really I just need to know if its plausible so that I can downshift it on my priority list
<RAOF> That's cool.
<smspillaz> RAOF: for now I think I'll be implementing a workaround for the lack of advertisement of GLX_BIND_TO_MIPMAP_TEXTURE in the fbconfigs
<smspillaz> I hope that doesn't bother you
<smspillaz> I should probably write a small testcase and file a bug tho
<RAOF> Yes, please.
<RAOF> If you do so I'll happily translate it into a piglit test.
<smspillaz> :)
<smspillaz> *sigh*
<smspillaz> fix it on one driver, break another
<smspillaz> morning thumper
<TheMuso> RAOF: A lot of stuff is using XDG_RUNTIME_DIR now.
<RAOF> Yeah.
<TheMuso> We know to exclude ~/.cache and ~/.gvfs, but the average user doesn't.
<RAOF> Actually, I think deja dup does by default. But when I specified ~/.local/run as XDG_RUNTIME_DIR it did *not* know to exclude that ;)
<TheMuso> Oh.
<TheMuso> Perhaps deja-dup should be extended to check XDG_RUNTIME_DIR, check if its in $HOME, and exclude it.
<RAOF> Yes.
<didrocks> good morning
<cyphermox> morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey cyphermox!
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti
<cyphermox> guten morgen pitti
<pitti> bonjour mes amis, ca va?
<didrocks> pitti: Ã§a va bien, et toi?
<pitti> je vais bien, merci
<Sweetshark> I am Boxxy and I dont do drugs!
<Sweetshark> g'morning everyone.
<pitti> hey Sweetshark
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark!
<seb128> hey
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> pitti, hey
<seb128> pitti, so I can't get a gtk build which doesn't pass tests anymore?! :p
<pitti> and neither a glib one!
<pitti> seb128: I only tested locally on amd64, eagerly awaiting results on other arches
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> so I used -proposed
<pitti> I get one a11y test failure in jhbuild, but it doesn't happen during package build; I'm currently investigating this
<seb128> oh, yeah, the a11y on by default might turn out to create some issues
<seb128> pitti, btw I would appreciate if you comment on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udisks2/+bug/1020759
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1020759 in udisks2 "/run/media is an unnecessary divergence from the FHS" [Medium,Triaged]
<seb128> pitti, if you know the rational for the change or have an opinion on why it would be right
<pitti> seb128: I guess /run provides better semantics with cleaning up stale mounts after reboot, and by-user dirs are more suitable for multi-seat situations where you could have label collisions otherwise
<pitti> but I don't know about other reaons
<pitti> and there gtk fails to build
<seb128> pitti, is that something you would be interested to investigate on, or should I try to open a bug upstream and see what David replies?
<pitti> I'd do the exact same thing
<pitti> i. e. forward the bug upstream and ask davidz
<seb128> pitti, ok, let me do that then, thanks
<seb128> pitti, where did gtk fail? armel?
<pitti> that's not the current behaviour, BTW
 * pitti digs up the followup patch which made it land in /run/media/
<seb128> pitti, well, davidz changed from /run/user/ to /run/media for security reasons
<pitti> seb128: so we could set ID_SEAT=all to get back the previous behaviour apparently, but I'd still like to discuss it upstream first
<seb128> pitti, http://cgit.freedesktop.org/udisks/commit/?id=aa02e5fc53efdeaf66047d2ad437ed543178965b
<pitti> right, currently following up to the bug
<pitti> seb128: ^ done
<pitti> seb128: gtk> i386/amd64 for now (rest still building), investigating..
<pitti> Gtk+Tests:ERROR: Failed to start Xvfb environment for X11 target tests.
<pitti> meh, missing build dep
<seb128> pitti, https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=51709
<ubot2> Freedesktop bug 51709 in general "/run/media is an unnecessary divergence from the FHS" [Normal,New: ]
<pitti> seb128: thanks, followed up and subscribed
<seb128> pitti, danke
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson ;)
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> I'm ok, thanks, you?
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, i'm good thanks, how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks ;-)
<seb128> pitti, do you see an issue if language-selector->region panel doesn't get done this cycle? out of the fact we would keep living on old not-actively-maintained code?
<pitti> seb128: it's certainly not a deal-breaker
<pitti> I'd really like to get rid of that hideous fontconfig-voodoo stuff, but that could happen independently
<pitti> it's so utterly wrong and broken
<seb128> pitti, right, we are just behind trend (slightly) and it feels like some extra GNOME work might come so I'm looking at what would be fine to let slip
<pitti> it's certainly a good target
<pitti> l-s was even ported to py3
<pitti> the thing we really need to drop is jockey
<ricotz> hello desktopers
<seb128> pitti, right, the drivers work was on my list of "not sure if it's essential" but seems we are most of the way and we should better finish that
<ricotz> pitti, seb128 , hey
<pitti> hey ricotz
<ricotz> what are the plans for g-s-d and g-c-c 3.5.x?
<seb128> pitti, one of my concerns is that cyphermox is overworked for the cycle
<seb128> ricotz, hey, (sorry I'm in a call so a bit busy)
<ricotz> seb128, don't worry
<seb128> ricotz, we discussed it yesterday at the team meeting, they are both being worked but were sort of blocked on compiz-gsettings to land (which should be soon, they have it working, they just need to get it tested and uploaded)
<ricotz> seb128, great
<ricotz> seb128, will g-c-c be heavily patched again?
<seb128> ricotz, what patches?
<ricotz> the user-interface changes
<seb128> ricotz, we will drop the gsettings revert ones, GNOME took most of our design changes to the shell so we can reduce those ;-)
<seb128> like big icons, separators
<seb128> our sound capplet is being reviewed,integrated upstream
<seb128> we will like keep the appareance capplet changes though
<ricotz> alright, this sounds good! :)
<ricotz> i am running both with many disabled patches
<seb128> is there any issue with the patches?
<seb128> or you just like the upstream look better?
<seb128> btw upstream sort of agreed our look changes to the shell grid were good since they took them
<seb128> you might need to patch that out from upstream if you really dislike the big icons ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, refreshing the ui patch is a bit of a pain, and i like the upstream look more ;)
<ricotz> the other ones where the gsetting reverts
<seb128> ricotz, anyway hopefully much less distro patches this cycle ;-)
<seb128> ricotz, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/1008840 btw
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1008840 in gnome-settings-daemon "Update to 3.5.4" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<ricotz> although there are a lot of ui changes coming
<ricotz> like nautilus git currently
<seb128> right, that's a big discussion upstream ;-)
<seb128> ricotz, do you get any of the issues Laney listed in that bug? like lid close not suspending or compose key not working?
<mhr3_> do we have someone taking care of valgrind here?
<ricotz> seb128, suspending works fine, shortcuts working too
<Laney> hey
<ricotz> seb128, but this is in the g-s sessions
<seb128> mhr3_, #ubuntu-devel, doko
<mhr3_> seb128, thx
<seb128> mhr3_, do you have an issue with it?
<ricotz> seb128, Laney, packages are here, but poorly documented -- https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/staging/+packages
<mhr3_> yep, let's take it there
<Laney> ricotz: did you just disable patches instead of refreshing them?
<Laney> I wish we had a proper vcs way of managing these patches
<Laney> dealing with quilt isn't very friendly
<ricotz> Laney, no, ui patches and gsettings reverts
<ricotz> Laney, although the synchronized patch for notify-osd it disabled too :\
<Laney> i did refresh that one
<Laney> we should put them in the desktop ppa
<ricotz> Laney, http://paste.debian.net/plain/177670
<Laney> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~laney/gnome-settings-daemon/3.5.4/view/head:/debian/patches/series
<seb128> Laney, I think we should get the new g-s-d and g-c-c in the ubuntu-desktop ppa
<Laney> I would want testing of the refreshed patches though, because it's quite easy to get them wrong
<Laney> seb128: yeah, maybe upload my gsd and ricotz gcc?
<Laney> because I didn't look at gcc yet
<seb128> Laney, is ricotz's gcc any different from the current vcs from robert_ancell?
<Laney> dunno
<seb128> ok, I will have a look
<Laney> I think robert's is only 3.5.2?
<Laney> yeah, it is
<seb128> Laney, right, he was blocked on new GTK at the time
<Laney> I could look at updating that soon
<seb128> Laney, we really need to get those out, that's also blocking the language-selector,region work right?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> there are lots of changes in that area happening upstream
<seb128> Laney, did you look further to what is missing in the region capplet and how much work it would be to add that?
<seb128> Laney, right, they are changing to ibus
<ricotz> Laney, thanks for looking into it
<ricotz> Laney, http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-control-center/commit/?id=f2df6d7fbbb41cee78b94a7c2d3dc331168433b7
<Laney> seb128: well I was trying to do these updates to find that out. The PK stuff (installing missing languages) still isn't finished so that will need to be done
<seb128> Laney, do you feel like it's something you can get done by ff?
<Laney> hopefully if we manage to unblock gsd and gcc
<seb128> Laney, I'm not sure how much GNOME hacking you did and if you feel comfortable enough with the stack to take on that or would you prefer if somebody else was looking at it?
<Laney> well I'll try to get those updates done next week and then look at the code
<Laney> but yeah, not so much. I'll see if I can tell how much work it's going to be
<seb128> Laney, I will try to help for the updates, I will review your current version, merge that and try to update g-c-c today and get them in the ppa
<seb128> Laney, sorry I totally forgot to file up the wiki for your coredev application
<seb128> will do that today as well
<Laney> no problem, it didn't happen anyway
<Laney> public holiday in canada and other things meant we didn't have quorum
<Chipaca> hi all
<Chipaca> gucharmap seems to be broken right now, in that it starts but doesn't respond to any input?
<Chipaca> (and strace shows one of its threads doing an inordinate numer of gettimeofday calls)
<seb128> Chipaca, what ubuntu version?
<Chipaca> seb128: quantal
<seb128> hum, dunno, I'm still on precise
<seb128> to be confirmed or not by somebody on quantal I guess
<cyphermox> good morning!
<seb128> hey cyphermox, how are you?
<cyphermox> not bad, not bad
<cyphermox> how are you?
<cyphermox> I'll get going to the Montreal office now; I seem to have very spotty cable internet today. my modem is not behaving so I'm on 3G for now
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<seb128> ok
<seb128> have fun there ;-)
<cyphermox> ;)
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: mmmm,. smoked meat for lunch, lucky you :)
<seb128> hum
<seb128> no poutine?
<seb128> Quebec is disappointing :p
<mdeslaur> seb128: you can't have both at the same time, or your heart stops
<pitti> hm, did gnome.org (live, bugzilla) just go down, or is that me?
<kamstrup> pitti: http://www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com/live.gnome.org
<kamstrup> says it's ok, but it fails for me as well
<pitti> haha
<pitti> for me it says "looks down for me as well"
<kamstrup> ah, wait, it does here as well. So; down for everyone indeed :-)
 * pitti wonders if www.cansomeonemakemeatea.com exists
<kamstrup> lol
<pitti> seb128: \o/
<pitti> seb128: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/3.5.6-0ubuntu4 is built on 3 arches and past tests on armhf
<seb128> pitti, great!
<cyphermox> mdeslaur: no, not smoked meat, that's what we had yesterday ;)
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: :)
<cyphermox> seb128: I don't like poutine
<seb128> cyphermox, I don't believe that ;-)
<cyphermox> (yes, I know, I shouldn't advertise that)
<mdeslaur> gah! sacrilege!
<cyphermox> it's all soggy and usually made with crappy ingredients
<cyphermox> non-squeaky squeaky cheese is teh sacrilege.
<cyphermox> seb128: is it just me or is git.gnome.org having issues?
<seb128> cyphermox, dns issues
<seb128> cyphermox, use 209.132.180.173
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> hmm... there ought to be a better way to do this than editing /etc/hosts
<ricotz> seb128, is someone looking into folks "(empathy:6523): GLib-GIO-ERROR **: Settings schema 'org.freedesktop.folks' is not installed"
<seb128> ricotz, not that I know about, it's 4th of july, U.S guys are off
<seb128> did ken test that at all?!
<ricotz> seb128, i dont think ken tested anything ;)
<ricotz> just a missing install though :\
<seb128> didrocks, ^ can you have a look (or something else on quantal) if that's a missing .install line
<seb128> ricotz, likely bzr add error or similar
<ricotz> which you probably go into folks-common, but then folk-common should be a hard-dep rather then recommond
<ricotz> *recommend
<ricotz> s/you/should
<ricotz> (my fingers dont type what i want :\)
<ricotz> seb128, did you ran into this yet? http://paste.debian.net/plain/177701
 * Laney is on folks
<didrocks> ricotz: how do you get that error?
<ricotz> Laney, fail missing ftw ;)
<ricotz> Laney, http://paste.debian.net/plain/177711
<Laney> yeah, saw it
<seb128> didrocks, unping, Laney is on it ... can you sponsor when he gets a fix? :-)
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<didrocks> sure
<Laney> ricotz: can you tell dh_install to exclude the .la files?
<seb128> pitti, hey, did you have other comments on https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/software-properties/port-to-python3/+merge/111668 or is it good to go for you ?
 * didrocks still propose using --fail-missing by default :p
<pitti> seb128: nothing beyond I already mentioned
<seb128> pitti, ok, thanks
<ricotz> didrocks, this is closing g-c-c, or running file-roller from nautilus which crashes on the end the same way
<seb128> pitti, cyphermox updated addressing your comments, that looks fine to me, so if you don't have anything else to add I will ack it
<pitti> seb128: oh, I didn't see the additional commits; looking
<ricotz> Laney, folks-common needs to be pulled in then
<ricotz> Laney, you need to delete them
<seb128> pitti, danke
<Laney> ricotz: I'll just exclude them
<Laney> -X
<Laney> (if that works)
<ricotz> Laney, ah right
<Laney> and yeah, folks-common becomes a dependency
<seb128> Laney, usually way is to had a find -delete to the rules
<pitti> seb128: LGTM
<seb128> pitti, great, to me as well
<Laney> had to teach sbuild to use proposed first
<seb128> cyphermox, you got +1ed
<cyphermox> seb128: ok
<ricotz> didrocks, this "glib" crash might be something for desrt ;)
<cyphermox> just fixing up the branch with my current drivers stuff so that it can be merged
<ricotz> didrocks, while it might be caused by something else, even these apps itself
<didrocks> ricotz: I'm sure desrt loves about discussing crashes on unknown schemas :)
<ricotz> didrocks, huh, this backtrace isnt related to folks
<ricotz> but it is probably app-specific rather than glib's fault
 * laney__ waves from empathy
<ricotz> but maybe he likes to take a look http://paste.debian.net/plain/177714
<Laney> didrocks: http://paste.debian.net/177719/
<Laney> debdiff as the previous version didn't make it to vcs
<cyphermox> Laney: btw, for transitions, jsut cating the proposed data over -releases isn't sufficient
<cyphermox> it doesn't seem to properly register the new Depends then
<Laney> Hm, I thought you said it worked
<Laney> you see the new versions though?
<cyphermox> yeah
<Laney> well
<Laney> there's now a ben package in quantal that you can try
<cyphermox> just it doesn't put the package in good when the new version has adjusted depends ;)
<cyphermox> ok
<Laney> and if not then I suggest you make a minimal Packages/Sources file and file a bug in debian
<Laney> mehdi asked for bugs like this
<cyphermox> cool
<Laney> and a .ben file, of course
<cyphermox> ah, the package for ben is?
<Laney> ben
<Laney> maybe it's in binNEW
<cyphermox> or I just didn't update sources yet
<Laney> nope, might just be filtering through
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ben/0.6.1/+build/3629212/+files/ben_0.6.1_amd64.deb
<cyphermox> thanks, trying now
<cyphermox> if it doesn't help I'll file the bug
<cyphermox> Laney: looks better
<Laney> oh, great!
<cyphermox> or it's that before I didn't refresh properly, but things look good --
<Laney> so I'm trying to build a backport of that to lucid
<cyphermox> http://people.ubuntu.com/~mathieu-tl/transitions/
<Laney> which we could then deploy on lillypilly properly
<Laney> will hopefully do that today
<cyphermox> ok
<Laney> should probably apply the ubuntu customisations too
<cyphermox> seb128: btw, re evolution: evolution-exchange seems to not have a new release, I tried to fix it to build against eds 3.5, but it looks like a lot of work. Fixing the headers was easy, but it would also need to be ported to using ESourceRegistry rather than ESource/EAccount
<cyphermox> I gave up; it was too much (and also way too late)
<seb128> cyphermox, did you look at upstream git?
<cyphermox> yup
<cyphermox> it didn't have it last night ;)
<cyphermox> unless I looked wrong
<seb128> cyphermox, ok, feel free to ignore it for now, it's not on the default install
<cyphermox> yeah
<seb128> it doesn't seem like something we want to invest efforts in
<seb128> upstream will eventually port it
<seb128> if they don't we can figure later what to do
<cyphermox> it also seems it's getting old now, it's meant for Exchange <= 2003
<cyphermox> I think I found a bug in gobject-repository
<cyphermox> GLib.VariantType.BYTESTRING appears to be missing
<cyphermox> or it could be that I just didn't properly upgrade
 * didrocks waves good evening
<cyphermox> Laney: poke?
<Laney> cyphermox: hi
<cyphermox> waiting for sponsoring for folks right?
<Laney> oh, didn't didrocks upload it?
<cyphermox> I don't know
<Laney> apparently not
<Laney> so, yes :-)
<cyphermox> aye ;)
 * cyphermox pinned -proposed to a low priority to be able to test just evo
<Laney> heh
<Laney> i have a launchpad branch to set proposed NotAutomatic so you don't have to do that
<cyphermox> ah
<Laney> needs some other ground work first though
<cyphermox> show me?
<Laney> bug #1016776
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1016776 in launchpad "Users are offered updates to packages in -proposed" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1016776
<cyphermox> ah I see
<cyphermox> I didn't have proposed enabled before though, I just added it manually
<Laney> NotAutomatic basically does the pinning for you
<micahg> seb128: can someone look at Bug #1020198?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1020198 in unity-2d "Drop downs, drag-and-drop and right click menus don't work with Mozilla ff/tb 14.0" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1020198
<cyphermox> ok
<Laney> cyphermox: you uploading folks then?
<cyphermox> yes, now
<Laney> nice
<cyphermox> Laney: done
<Laney> thanks
<cyphermox> Laney: I could add a testimony to your wiki page for core-dev now, in the crazy case you didn't already have tons ;)
<Laney> nah, actually I don't have that many main sponsors :P
<cyphermox> Laney: added my endorsement ;)
<cyphermox> bbl --> got some WPA enterprise stuff to test
<mlankhorst> it's probably too soon for me to apply to core dev, but would membership be possible?
<micahg> mlankhorst: yeah, too soon for core dev (you only had uploads in the past month AFAICT), membership would depend on how long you've been contributing to Ubuntu at large
<mlankhorst> does upstream count?
<micahg> mlankhorst: only if it directly impacts Ubuntu or is in the guise of Ubuntu
<micahg> and that also depends which membership (COntributing Dev vs regular)
<micahg> brb
<mlankhorst> hm then it's harder, some uploads I've been doing haven't always been in own name.
<seb128> re
<seb128> micahg, hey, not sure we have anyone who has time for unity-2d on natty, cf my comment on the bug
<mlankhorst> also for debian been doing some stuff which was useful for ubuntu but yeah suppose it needs time
<jbicha> gnome-contacts 3.5.3 fails to build http://paste.ubuntu.com/1075400/
<micahg> seb128: ah, sorry, I must not be subscribed as I didn't see the comment before
<micahg> seb128: it's in main, so it's technically supported and was the default for ARM IIRC
<seb128> micahg, right, doesn't change the fact that we have nobody to work on it and it's a low priority for us atm
<seb128> micahg, as far as I'm concerned I guess we can either not roll out the update or roll it out with the described bug for unity2D users (which I doubt there are many left on natty)
<micahg> seb128: ok, we'll determine that on release day then depending on the CVEs
<seb128> micahg, ok, sorry I don't have a bother answer for you...
<micahg> seb128: I figured maybe one of the unity devs would have a flash of inspiration and it would be a quick fix
<seb128> micahg, unity-2d has few hackers, most got reassigned on other projects since it was decided to drop 2d... not to mention that I doubt any unity hacker wants to fix bugs in a natty version, it's hard enough to get them to fix precise bugs
<micahg> heh, ok
<Laney> cyphermox: thanks ;-)
<seb128> Laney, not sure what happened in your g-s-d vcs
<seb128> Laney, there are lot of patches that are noted as deleted and added again
<Laney> yeah I think I broke bzr
<Laney> I did it out of vcs and then copied it in
<Laney> with bzr rm/bzr add, seems bzr doesn't handle that right (iirc git does)
<micahg> Laney: yeah, files are processed with a unique ID, not by file name
<seb128> Laney, ok, I'm fixing it
<Laney> i see
<seb128> Laney, and merging into the team vcs
<Laney> seb128: alrighty, that's cool
<Laney> are you going to upload it to the ppa?
<seb128> Laney, yes, once I'm happy with it
<Laney> :-)
<seb128> Laney, trying to figure figure out if I manage to update the patch you commented first and to see how the new version works here
<cyphermox> jbicha: working on gnome-contacts
<cyphermox> jbicha: the problem is that at least GLib.VariantType.BYTESTRING doesn't get into the GLib gir, that would be a bug in gobject-introspection I think
<cyphermox> jbicha: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=679423
<ubot2> Gnome bug 679423 in introspection "GLib.VariantType.BYTESTRING missing from GLib bindings" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<cyphermox> bbl
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-05
<jasoncwarner_> hey robert_ancell and RAOF how is the system compositor stuff shaping up?
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: From my end I've got all the video drivers doing the right thing; nouveau patches sent upstream, ati needs a little cleaning up. I'm cleaning now up my weston work to send it upstream.
<RAOF> Huh. unity-window-decorator has died again.
<thumper> ?
<thumper> :(
<jasoncwarner_> thanks, RAOF
<RAOF> thumper: No titlebars ;)
<RAOF> thumper: But, curiously, no crash file in /var/crash, either.
<thumper> RAOF: I'm sure you don't need them :)
<RAOF> I don't; alt-drag and ctrl-super-arrows works fine for what I want.
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, slower from my end but working on it
<robert_ancell> RAOF, btw, do we have a solution for the "picking the wrong video chip"?
<jasoncwarner_> thanks robert_ancell, any thoughts as to when we might see first cut land?
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, I'm hoping for monday
<jasoncwarner_> thanks robert_ancell happy hacking!
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Incidentally, in playing around I think you might need a bit of extra protocol for the display manager - a way to catch VT switching and SAK.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, ok
<RAOF> Depending on how far along you are you may have noticed this lack :)
<robert_ancell> not yet :)
<RAOF> Should you, at any point, go âyou know, it'd be a lot easier if wl_display_manager did Xâ, you know where to call âº
<robert_ancell> RAOF, I think the first patch I'll write for weston/wayland is to make the programs support --help!
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Not a terrible idea :)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, No package 'glesv2' found - which package?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: libgles2-dev
<RAOF> Sorry, libgles2-mesa-dev
<robert_ancell> oh, I installed libgles1-mesa-dev, yep, that fixed it, ta
<RAOF> Yeah, GL|ES v1 isn't particularly interesting.
<RAOF> smspillaz: Hey, you know when a periodically responsive responsive application gets greyed out by compiz, then finishes initialising and becomes totally responsive, but is still greyed out by compiz? (a) Why (b) how do I make you fix it? âº
<thumper> RAOF: smspillaz has gone sailing :)
<RAOF> Time to fill his backscroll!
<robert_ancell> RAOF, <protocol name="dislpay_manager"> btw
<RAOF> ...!
<RAOF> Ahem.
<RAOF> Good thing that doesn't go anywhere in the code :)
<robert_ancell> I figured :)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, hmm, wl_display_connect is weird - it ignores name if there is an environment variable set, and unsets the variable
<robert_ancell> I think I should proposed a wl_display_connect_to_fd or similar
<RAOF> I agree; that's on my todo list.
<robert_ancell> even weirder connect_to_socket also checks for WAYLAND_SOCKET, but it is never called if the environment variable is defined
<robert_ancell> RAOF,  can you explain the "global_handler"?
<robert_ancell> is that when the wayland compositor notifies that it has loaded the display manager module?
<RAOF> It's a callback that gets all the âglobalâ - ie: top level - objects.
<RAOF> So the global_handler will be called for each of the top level objects the compositor exposes - wl_compositor, wl_seat, (in this case) wl_display_manager, wl_system_compositor, etc.
<RAOF> It'll also get called should a new global turn up (eg: if you plug in a new seat)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, have you done any glib main loop integration?  I'm guessing I just need to call wl_display_iterate when there's a read event on the fd?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: That'd be pretty much it - there's the GTK wayland backend you could crib from.
<RAOF> I'd guess they register the fd as a glib source and then do the funky chicken.
<smspillaz> RAOF: *shrug* didn't know it remained grey
<smspillaz> RAOF: look at the fade plugin
<RAOF> smspillaz: K.
<smspillaz> RAOF: though, if its remaining grey, I would first check if its actually responding to _NET_WM_PING
<smspillaz> RAOF: it just might not be, that's all
<smspillaz> or it might be responding but we might not know about it
<smspillaz> (I'm assuming you're having some trouble with xwayland)
<RAOF> smspillaz: No; smuxi, a GTK2 app.
<smspillaz> hmm
<robert_ancell> RAOF, and what's with the 'struct wl_display's?  Is this the 1980s?  They need to be typedef'd to WlDisplay or simialr
<RAOF> robert_ancell: It's a coding preference, so that you can call the struct wl_display * variable wl_display.
<robert_ancell> uh...
<RAOF> Hm. I'm not sure that I've got damage handling completely correct on -ati :)
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> Hey pitti!
<thumper> who do we know who knows gcc/gdb real well?
<pitti> hey RAOF, how are you?
<RAOF> Hey pitti! Pretty good.
<RAOF> A bit tired; Sam's just getting over a cold and so hasn't been sleeping well. But the baby's doing well :)
<pitti> RAOF: just saw your G+ post about Zoe; how much longer will you and she have to wait?
<RAOF> 5 weeks is the ETA :)
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF:  ! chriscoulson is expecting any day now...so many babies!
<jasoncwarner_> (well, not chris, cuz, you know, science)
<RAOF> Heh.
<TheMuso> lol
<didrocks> hello world!
<rickspencer3> bonjour didrocks
<rickspencer3> - le monde
<didrocks> bonjour rickspencer3 ;)
<didrocks> Ã§a va ?
<rickspencer3> Ã§a va bien
<rickspencer3> j'ai revenu de Nice lundi
<rickspencer3> donc, je suis vraiment grillÃ©
<rickspencer3> et tois, didrocks? Ã§a va?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: Ã§a va bien :) il fait trÃ¨s chaud ici
<didrocks> rickspencer3: beaucoup de retours sur Quickly avec le app developer contest, il y a du travail Ã  faire!
<rickspencer3> didrocks, c'est bon, parc que, je m'enquiet que tu ne travais pas
<rickspencer3> ;)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, j/k :)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: tu penses que je slacke tous les jours et que je vais Ã  la plage? :)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: oh une vague, je reviens :p
<rickspencer3> lol
 * didrocks imagines a hangout when someone sees his coworker with sunglasses, on sand, near the beach :)
<xclaesse> seb128, any news on the tp-gabble update? was it fine with the big diff in the end?
<smspillaz> didrocks: is there a freeze on lp:compiz ?
<smspillaz> automerger doesn't seem to be doing much
<didrocks> smspillaz: see #ubuntu-unity :p
<smspillaz> :p
<ogra_> hmm, funny
<ogra_> i have a three display setup ... clicking on the indicators on tzhe middle and right screen, the menu stays open automatically, clicking on the indicators on the left screen, the manu closes as soon as i release the mouse button
<ogra_> s/manu/menu/
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson :)
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> I'm fine thanks, and you?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, not too bad thanks
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I wanted to ask for a long time, but your option to only show "inbox" in the messaging menu doesn't impact the notification as well (it's still showing for every folders), is that wanted?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i think so
<chrisccoulson> i'm not really sure though :)
<didrocks> shouldn't we do that rather? :)
<didrocks> like this option is only "tell me about inbox"
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, possibly. perhaps it needs some design input
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: was the option designed?
 * didrocks will come with a patch otherwise :p
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i haven't done anything with notifications. that requires a change to thunderbird, rather than an addon
<didrocks> oh
<seb128> mvo, hey, aptdaemon testing? 20 days in proposed and counting :-(
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, i'm good thanks. how are you?
<seb128> good, thanks ;-)
<mpt> smspillaz, hi, Evan and I are working on a replacement for the "The window ... is not responding" alert, and we'd like to get your sanity-check on a couple of things.
<ritz> seb128, ping . howdy ? https://code.launchpad.net/~khadgaray/unity-lens-applications/fix-lockdown/+merge/113251 , does this look good ?
<seb128> ritz, hey
<didrocks> ritz: unity doesn't depend on gnome-desktop anymore btw
<ritz> oow
<seb128> ritz, the code change looks fine to me, but we need the depends
<seb128> what didrocks says and in any case if you use something directly you should depends on it
<seb128> not rely on a third party to bring it in for you
<ritz> fair enough
<seb128> the third party might change and stop doing that or you might stop at some point drop the third party use and hit the bug
<didrocks> I would rather checking that at startup
 * dobey wonders how exactly to file this really annoying bug
<didrocks> and disaply a message in alt+F2
<didrocks> display*
<seb128> dobey, which one?
<dobey> seb128: multihead not working with Core i7 3770S graphics on 12.04 (or 12.10), and the 12.10 daily image GPU locking when it tries to load X
<seb128> dobey, check with mlankhorst
<didrocks> ritz: commented on the MR
<dobey> ok
<mlankhorst> dobey: what revision? (lspci)
<dobey> 00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation Ivy Bridge Graphics Controller (rev 09)
<mlankhorst> dobey: hm do you have a bug entry open?
<dobey> mlankhorst: not yet, no. not sure exactly how/where to file
<mlankhorst> dobey: just file against xorg, it will get reassigned from there
<dobey> ok
<dobey> will do. need to run an errand real quick first.
<dobey> brb
<mlankhorst> same, before stores close
<mlankhorst> brb
<desrt> didrocks: much progress on the profiles?
<didrocks> desrt: I just read the doc, more working on the unity release and fixing bugs right now
<desrt> cool
<didrocks> desrt: I'll try on my spare time to look at what we can do, but I prefer landing working components first :)
<Sweetshark> seb128: desktop meeting is 1530UTC Tuesday, right?
<seb128> Sweetshark, correct
<Sweetshark> seb128: if you look in your inbox, you will know why I asked ;)
<seb128> Sweetshark, got the email, thanks :-)
 * desrt catches the bug
 * desrt becomes addicted
<seb128> desrt, what bug?
<desrt> seb128: (figuratively) the test coverage report bug
<desrt> gotta collect 'em all!
<seb128> desrt, oh :-)
<desrt> dconf finally gets proper testing :)
<ricotz> hello everyone
<ricotz> desrt, hi :)
<seb128> hey ricotz
<ricotz> desrt, have you seen this http://paste.debian.net/plain/177714 ?
<ricotz> desrt, does this look like something real, or some messed up system of mine?
<ricotz> seb128, hey
<desrt> ricotz: looks like heap corruption
 * mlankhorst melts
<desrt> a crash in malloc() is a pretty sure sign that the backtrace is completely meaningless
<desrt> not because it's an indication that the backtrace is corrupted
<desrt> but because it's a sure sign that the real bug happened somewhere earlier
<ricotz> desrt, i see
<mlankhorst> to the valgrind mobile!
<desrt> yup
<desrt> valgrind will probably do a better job of catching it earlier
<ricotz> desrt, mlankhorst, will do ;)
<ricotz> desrt, this doesnt look really useful http://people.ubuntu.com/~ricotz/log/g-c-c.valgrind.log
<ricotz> desrt, not sure could be related to http://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?id=257b42e2f9d0759cc79967034f80c571c600faf3
 * didrocks waves good evening
<MrChrisDruif> jasoncwarner_; Not me, because I know science?
<desrt> ricotz: looks like you found some interesting bugs anyway :)
<ricotz> desrt, you are welcome :)
<ricotz> desrt, ok, reverting the commit in question fixes the crash
<ricotz> bbl
<dobey> bcurtiswx: how's this wx? exterior thermometer in my car just read as 109F fun times. :)
<bcurtiswx> this isn't even the worst day, it's 99 and feels like 102
<bcurtiswx> 37-39C for those non USA people
<dobey> bcurtiswx: well, 3/4 of my CPU cores are cooler than the air is outside :)
<bcurtiswx> lol
<mlankhorst> dobey: I heard that before and I can't imagine that being the case here, although overclocked sandy bridge is really nice performing :)
<dobey> mlankhorst: where is "here?"
<mlankhorst> netherlands, quite hot today
<mlankhorst> although it cooled off due to rain :)
<dobey> ah, well
<dobey> it does tend to get a bit hotter here :)
<kenvandine> dobey, a bit... i spent 10 minutes in my garage at lunch today and gave up
<kenvandine> :)
<dobey> heh
<kenvandine> my wife can survive a little longer with a flat tire on her bike, too damn hot to replace it today
<dobey> kenvandine: you'll have to do it at 3 am when it's reasonably cool outside
<kenvandine> indeed
<smspillaz> mpt: I commented on the review
<kenvandine> or go all redneck and roll it into the house where there is AC :)
<smspillaz> mpt: I'm in the Canadian timezone so ....
<kenvandine> which i am more likely to do :)
<smspillaz> desrt: CANAdA
<smspillaz> *CANADA
<kenvandine> blame canada!
<smspillaz> tsh!
 * kenvandine loves that movie :)
<dobey> kenvandine: or get a portacool or something, so you have ac in the garage :)
<smspillaz> kenvandine: I rewrote the lyrics to that song substituting "nvidia" for canada
<kenvandine> it is easily 10 degrees hotter in the garage
<kenvandine> hahaha
<kenvandine> dobey, i have a friend in san diego that has heat and AC in his garage
<kenvandine> not sure the heat is that useful, but i could go for the AC
<dobey> well, heat is useful in winter
<smspillaz> meh
<smspillaz> gles + unity got all flakey again :(
<smspillaz> this is what happens when nobody runs the code for a while
<desrt> smspillaz: i hear you're on vacation
<desrt> smspillaz: and i wonder what you're doing on irc ;)
<dobey> well, it's only what, 3 am? :)
<smspillaz> desrt: I don't start my official holidays until like
<smspillaz> the 8th
<smspillaz> since I can't really take like 6 weeks leave
<smspillaz> dobey: well, 11am in my current tz
<smspillaz> more like 12 actually
<dobey> oh
<desrt> doesn't sound ike canada
<smspillaz> desrt: 1 ?
<smspillaz> pm ?
<desrt> if you're in BC, it's 10 minutes to 1
<smspillaz> yeah
<smspillaz> sorry, time flies
<smspillaz> I haven't reset the clock on my laptop yet so I often just don't know what time it is
<desrt> it's always the same time
<desrt> time to write unit tests!
<smspillaz> have a guess what I'm doing now
<desrt> writing unit tests, i hope
<smspillaz> kinda
<smspillaz> trying to figure out why a branch full of unit tests won't put -I/usr/include/glib-2.0 (or whatever it was) on the gcc command line
<smspillaz> on the build machines
<desrt> pkg-config fail
<smspillaz> desrt: cmake being weird
<desrt> there you go
<smspillaz> desrt: it seems to work okay locally
<smspillaz> I'm really hoping that telus doesn't have bandwidth caps
<smspillaz> because my unit landlord is going to hate me if they do
<smspillaz> desrt: oh, btw, I got a wind sim while I was here
<smspillaz> desrt: good recommendation, even if I have to use their roaming network
<smspillaz> its still like 10x cheaper than using telstra overseas and about 5x cheaper than what rogers is normally
<desrt> wind++
<desrt> they have cover in vancouver, though
<desrt> you shouldn't have to be roamin
<smspillaz> desrt: right, but my phone doesn't support their band
<smspillaz> the 1700Mhz one
<desrt> why didn't you get one of their cheapo models?
<smspillaz> desrt: their roaming network is almost as cheap
<desrt> they have phones for like... twice the price of a sim card
<smspillaz> and I prefer to use my own phone
<desrt> fair enough
<smspillaz> desrt: also, I'd have to use the roaming network anyways since I'ma ctually on vancouver island
<desrt> lulz.
<desrt> wind just became an even better phone company
<desrt> used to be their roming rate for the US was the same as their 'out of network' rate in canada
<smspillaz> still good though, I bought $15 worth of credit and have been using my phone quite a bit and still hvaen't used it all up
<desrt> makes sense... may as well roam on t-mobile as rogers, right?
<desrt> looks like they just extended that logic to _all of europe_
<smspillaz> mother's gone through $60 of fido and dad's been through $300 of rogers
<smspillaz> desrt: hahaha
<smspillaz> desrt: they sound very "no bullshit"
<desrt> now i have 20Â¢ minute roaming pretty much everywhere i ever travel
<smspillaz> desrt: and 10c texting ?
<desrt> and $1/MB data (which, as far as these things go, is not so bad)
<desrt> 15
<smspillaz> desrt: heh. maybe I should just keep my wind sim and ditch telstra in australia
<smspillaz> desrt: might be cheaper to do that
<desrt> seems that australia is not included in this europe thing they're talking about...
<desrt> unless that's a typo for austria?
<smspillaz> ah, I kinda assumed australia
<smspillaz> desrt: one day ...
<smspillaz> desrt: you know your phone carrier is good when their roaming rates are better than local rates
<desrt> that's been true for a while in canada at least
<smspillaz> indeed
<desrt> you pay less on roger's network with wind than you do with rogers
<smspillaz> lol
<desrt> but i wouldn't use rogers as a good comparison for... anything at all, really
<smspillaz> yeah
 * smspillaz points to his dad
<desrt> other than perhaps criminal mistreatment of customers
<desrt> (they've got a couple of class action suits in the courts right now... i like watching them squirm)
<smspillaz> desrt: wasn't that the whole system fee or something ?
<desrt> yup.  that's one of them
<smspillaz> there was just this fee charged over ... basically nothing
<desrt> call a $8/mo fee a "government regulatory recovery charge"
<smspillaz> the "give us money because we're price fixing"
<desrt> people are gonna assume that that has something to do with the government
<smspillaz> really? that obvious?
<desrt> their logic is "this covers our costs of doing business under government regulation"
<smspillaz> usually they call it like "maintainence"
<desrt> like, it would be cheaper if our towers were allowed to give you cancer, you know!
<desrt> this stuff is expensive!
<smspillaz> haha
<desrt> srsly...
<desrt> anyway.. they renamed it to "system access fee" after a while
<smspillaz> yeah I heard about it on the radio when I was driving
<desrt> but the disinformation was so intense by that point that the people working in their stores were still telling people it was a government fee
<smspillaz> lol
<smspillaz> desrt: I was pretty suprised though, when I was getting my wind sim the guy at the store (and it was a wind reseller) was actively encouraging me to "compare other plans first and then come back"
<desrt> they have another one working its way throug habout charging customers money to leave
<desrt> even when they didn't sign a contract
<smspillaz> oh exit fees?
<smspillaz> hmm yeah
<desrt> i felt this one personally :)
<smspillaz> those are definitely forbidden under most trade practises legislation
<desrt> i told them to get fucked.  they sent me to collections.
<smspillaz> desrt: how much was it ?
<desrt> i got calls for a year or so and then they stopped
<desrt> $68, iirc
<smspillaz> see, I would have just paid the $68, but that doesn't help the cause
<desrt> ya.. no way i was going to pay
<desrt> i got into a call with a manger-type at one point
<desrt> it came down to "these are our terms and conditions.  we print them on every bill we mail you." (i had paperless, and never saw any terms)
<smspillaz> those kinds of things still don't hold up in court
<desrt> i said "so... if your terms and conditions that i've never seen a copy of said that i owe you a million dollars, i would have to pay it?"
<desrt> "yes."
<desrt> that's the point that i realised that there are truly some absolute insanity at that company
<smspillaz> customer service should never answer legal questions
<desrt> *is
<desrt> i welcome them to sue me for it
<desrt> somehow they didn't feel that they wanted to
<desrt> i wonder why...
<smspillaz> desrt: though it depends if they could put out an argument that you had agreed to stay with them for a fixed period of time so they could claim a loss of the contract price
<desrt> smspillaz: problem is that i signed no contract
<smspillaz> if you didn't, then the contract price for them is basically indeterminate
<smspillaz> desrt: right, it might have been contractless, but if they can make our an argument that you agreed to stay with them for a fixed period they have some ground to stand on
<desrt> i was on a month-to-month term
<desrt> i cancelled at the end of the month
<desrt> and they charged me for the next month
<smspillaz> but you're right, they didn't have such ground
<desrt> (their specific term is that i have to give 30 days notice of cancellations)
<smspillaz> desrt: that sounds like a bimonthly contract to me
<smspillaz> or bimonthly term
<desrt> nah.  it's a monthly term with a "we get to charge you for one extra month at the end"
<smspillaz> yeah they can't do that
<desrt> it didn't matter if i cancelled on an 'even' or 'odd' month
<desrt> i know they can't.  they certainly tried, though :)
<smspillaz> thankfully, the courts realized a long time ago that penalty clauses are stupid
<desrt> (and i'm sure they've succeeded with many others -- for some reason people are scared of collections calls)
<smspillaz> I probably would be, but then again I just don't feel like caring about it after a while
<hallyn> say, in the past i thought meta-w would spread out windows on the current desktop.  what should i use for that now?
<hallyn> (it now seems to spread out all windows of the same applciation as i'm on)
<hallyn> hm, no, something more random than that
<dupondje> Eh, Empathy has no more menu bar ? :)
<cyphermox> jbicha: poke
<cyphermox> have you been trying out empathy and such from quantal-proposed for eds?
<cyphermox> empathy doesn't appear to work for me, and gnome-contacts looks kind of broken too
<cyphermox> though I'm half expecting that's because of black magic done to have things look good for gnome-shell, maybe
<cyphermox> bbl -- testing out this hypothesis
<xclaesse> dupondje, empathy uses the new GMenu stuff to put the menu into gnome-shell... I've no idea how unity present that
<dupondje> xclaesse: I use gnome-shell, but doesn't seem to work neither :)
<jbicha> cyphermox: what part of empathy is broken for you?
<dupondje> menu doesn't show at least :)
<dupondje> in empathy
<jbicha> I'd expect gnome-contacts to not work right until we get the 3.5.3 version built
<jbicha> hmm, I had the empathy gmenu in gnome-shell until I actually opened a chatroom :(
<dupondje> no menu at all here
<jbicha> cyphermox: yeah, I'd say empathy's menus aren't working very well, even in gnome shell
<mpt> smspillaz, oh, it's not really related to the review
<mpt> smspillaz, two things. (1) @e plan to add, to the 5-second greying out, a 30-second alert explaining that the program has hung and giving you the chance to shut it down or relaunch the app.
<mpt> (2) Currently if you try to close a hung window, you get the "not responding" alert, and then it un-hangs, the parent window doesn't close. We plan to just close it, since that's what you asked for originally.
<mpt> smspillaz, if you see any problems with either of those, post them and I'll see them in the morning. :-) Thanks.
 * mpt -> home
<mpt> Spec at <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ErrorTracker#app-hang>, but missing a couple of the wireframes.
<cyphermox> jbicha: it's much worse than just the menus, no contacts show up
<cyphermox> I do get the menus... well, *the* menu, for contacts and for empathy
<cyphermox> jbicha: I did build 3.5.3
<cyphermox> (gnome-contacts)
<smspillaz> mpt: sounds sane-ish, however there are cases where a hang isn't really a hang, but rather just the system being starved itself
<smspillaz> mpt: so maybe it should grey out, 5 seconds after greying out, if the user has not hit "close" then have two options "wait 30 sec and restart" or "wait 30 sec and close", if the user has hit close, then just kill it and display a thing saying that it hung and do you want to send a bug report
<cyphermox> robert_ancell: would you be ready to push the e-d-s stuff to -releases? (asking because I see you've changed it earlier)
<cyphermox> I would ask for stuff to be copied if it's pretty much ready-ish
<Laney> (at least) evo is still building
<cyphermox> yeah, I mean aside from that :)
<robert_ancell> cyphermox, I don't have the permissions to do the push but yes, everything should be good to go once built
<cyphermox> the permissions would be fine, I'll ask seb tomorrow or someone else
<cyphermox> I think it would go tomorrow, unless chrisccoulson is ready for thunderbird to make it to -release too
<stgraber> anyone with upload rights to the release pocket can copy packages, so unless you're not a coredev, you definitely have the required permissions to pocket copy
<cyphermox> stgraber: it's not quite ready yet anyway
<Laney> stgraber: You also need to be able to delete from -proposed, no? We talked about this in #-release a few days ago
<Laney> a few people were of the strong opinion that non-AAs definitely should /not/ be doing this, anyway ;-)
<stgraber> Laney: you don't "need" to delete from -proposed, as long as an AA goes through the pending-sru report and runs the delete commands every now and then
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-06
<ceti331> hi, i'm trying to compile 'expo' in ubuntu - i get as far a linker error "cannot find -lcomposite" "cannot find -lopengl" ... any suggestions? i've already done sudo apt-get install build-deps compiz or whatever
<ceti331> any assistance welcome
<cyphermox> smspillaz:  ^ I mentioned you might be the best person to help out
<cyphermox> ceti331: expo itself I'm not sure how to build separately, or if you even can. but you should mentioned if that's still the errors you get after installing the build-dependencies for compiz (what apt-get build-dep does)
<ceti331> ah. i should try to build the whole thing
<ceti331> thanks, i will try that
<ceti331> yes , it seems quite possible that trying to build the whole thing would setup something taht the plugins depend on
<cyphermox> most assuredly yes, the toplevel cmakefile does magic
<ceti331> building now; (i've got a warning from cmake about something it can't find .. not a good sign)
<ceti331> Thanks! - it built
<ceti331> <now back to compiz peeps - how do i install/run ..>
<RAOF> make install
<smspillaz> ah, sorry missed that
<smspillaz> yeah just make install
<smspillaz> you might want to rebuild unity though
<ceti331> rebuild unity .. is that a compiz plugin or what
<ceti331> is unity the window-manager
<ceti331> ouch just running unity didn't go well
<RAOF> Unity is indeed a compiz plugin.
<ceti331> ah i recall.. "compiz fusion" = merge of beryl window manager and compiz compositor..
<ceti331> is that right, compiz IS the window manager?
<RAOF> compiz is the window manager, yes.
<RAOF> Unity is implemented as a compiz plugin.
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> Hey pitti!
<RAOF> Bah! Stupid add-apt-repository/ppa-purge interaciton.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, hey, I'm getting a crashy X server when I try and stick it in the compositor.  Log is http://paste.ubuntu.com/1077534/ but probably not that useful
<robert_ancell> what's the best way to diagnose?
<robert_ancell> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1077537/ is the bigger log
<RAOF> There's a big song and dance you can do with gdb and judicious use of âfollow-fork-mode childâ to get a proper gdb session.
<RAOF> But I think the actual problem is that the intel DDX in the PPA has skewed somehow; I'll track it down.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, is it skewed?  or should I keep trying here
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I think it's skewed. My local builds work, but trying from the ppa fails.
<RAOF> Bah.
<robert_ancell> aha!
<robert_ancell> you've poisioned my machine with your PPA!
<RAOF> In my defence, I *did* say that I disclaim all responsibility for setting fire to your cat :P
<RAOF> I think I'll update the PPA to a newer xwayland snapshot and upload a matching intel DDX at the same time.
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Have you got something else you could usefully be doing? I'll fix this up in the next couple of hours, but it might be a bit of a fiddle.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yeah, I just was just at the stage of running my actual session in weston in lightdm but I guess I'll have to pick it up next week
<RAOF> Sorry. I'll make sure it works out of the box for you on monday.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, np!
<robert_ancell> RAOF, is there anything I can build locally to work around it?
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, ca va?
<didrocks> pitti: Ã§a va bien, et toi?
<pitti> je vais bien
<pitti> I'm back at home, spent the last few days in Leuven, Belgium
<pitti> and worked from my friend's place
<didrocks> oh, I didn't know they were living in Belgium :)
<didrocks> had a nice week there?
<pitti> only Monday to Thursday
<pitti> but yes, was nice to see them again
<pitti> he became a PhD on Monday, so we went to his defense
<didrocks> excellent! in what domain?
<pitti> https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CFsQFjAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Flirias.kuleuven.be%2Fbitstream%2F123456789%2F262298%2F2%2Fpaper.pdf&ei=OXz2T_2KBtHbsgbAg9CiBQ&usg=AFQjCNGDWoOxjhpAE1KYf4Na2RRq5fE-1A&sig2=qwoJNoHjwOjPrwp_yDfghg&cad=rja
<pitti> err
<pitti> https://lirias.kuleuven.be/bitstream/123456789/262298/2/paper.pdf
<pitti> didrocks: he does measurements on patients with cochlear implants, to understand better how these implants can be configured properly to patients who cannot give direct feedback
<pitti> as they are usually implanted when you are still a baby, so that it is a lot easier to learn hearing with them
<pitti> so they can't tell you "this appears too loud to me" or "I don't recognize this yet", you have to get that information (threshold/comfort/pain levels) from the EEG
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, indeed, it's a tricky question :)
<didrocks> should have been an interesting PhD
<didrocks> is he in post-doc now?
<pitti> yes, he continues to work on that project
<didrocks> or already titular in an university?
<RAOF> Incidentally, the fact that we need to *learn* how to hear is awesome. :)
<pitti> the presentation was indeed interesting, and I could understand 95% of it
<pitti> the following Q&A with the six professors was waaay above my head, though
<didrocks> heh ;)
<didrocks> interesting that the presentation can still be accessible to non expert
<didrocks> RAOF: indeed :)
<pitti> RAOF: with those implants you have to; the normal hearing sense has several thousand thin frequency bands, while those implants only provide 24 bands
<pitti> I guess it sounds more like chirping and buzzing, which you have to learn to interpret
<pitti> didrocks: non-expert> that's the point of the presentations; they are open to the public
<pitti> same as with diploma thesis
<RAOF> My understanding is that you need to learn how to hear with regular human ears; certainly you need to learn how to *see* (as the awesome experiment with kittens that couldn't see horizontal lines demonstrates âº)
<pitti> it's indeed quite a challenge, but at the same time very important, to present scientific matters in a manner that non-experts can understand what this is good for (and where all the tax money goes, too)
<didrocks> pitti: defending a thesis == diploma thesis, isn't it?
<pitti> didrocks: PhD thesis in this case, yes
<didrocks> oh, we are only using "thesis" in France for PhD ;)
<pitti> same form (presentation and then discussion with the profs), except that PhD is on a much higher scientific level and there are six professors (of which three were from universities in Cambridge and the US) which grill you
<pitti> err, s/which/who/
<pitti> oh, wow -- http://packages.qa.debian.org/a/apport.html
<didrocks> pitti: you didn't know it was in debian before today? :)
<RAOF> How does apport work in Debian?
<pitti> no, I wasn't
<RAOF> I guess the local stuff is still useful.
<pitti> I just got a ton of bug mail with "Branch linked: lp:debian/experimental/apport"
<didrocks> yeah, my second question is how does it work :)
<didrocks> ahah :)
<pitti> well, .crash files and apport-retrace would work
<pitti> but there is no crashdb implementation for the Debian BTS
<pitti> and given how it works it would be rather challenging to write one
<pitti> but I guess they could just as well use launchpad or set up a whoopsie instance
<pitti> the latter might probably be even better
 * pitti chuckles at http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=collab-maint/apport.git;a=shortlog
<pitti> "how many commits do you need to fix a path"
<didrocks> ahah, indeed :)
<pitti> niice!
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<pitti> hey tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> pitti, I have switched s-c-p from libusb 0.1.x to 1.0.x yesterday. On my machine it builds perfectly also after uninstalling the old libusb-dev, but on the buildds it does not build.
<tkamppeter> pitti, see https://launchpadlibrarian.net/109398307/buildlog_ubuntu-quantal-i386.system-config-printer_1.3.8%2B20120201-0ubuntu10_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<tkamppeter> pitti, the builds installs correctly the new libusb-1.0-0-dev and pkg-config (was already used before the change) is installed, too.
<tkamppeter> pitti, but it still behaves as libusb was not there.
<pitti> tkamppeter: have you uninstalled libusb-dev on your machine?
<pitti> it looks like configure is trying to detect that, not -1.0
<tkamppeter> pitti, I have changed ./configure (configure.in, Makefile.am) to check for libusb-1.0 and locally I can build with libusb-dev installed and with libusb-dev removed.
<pitti> tkamppeter: I guess you mean with libusb-1.0-dev installed
<pitti> tkamppeter: this kind of failure really ought to be reproducible in a pbuilder
<pitti> tkamppeter: if it really isn't, I suggest to cat config.log if configure fails, to see what it's stumbling over
<tkamppeter> pitti, libusb-1.0-dev I had always installed, it is a build dependency. theold libusb-dev I had once installed and once not.
 * pitti bbl
<rickspencer3> aaaah, ,where is seb128?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: he's normally around in ~ 40 minutes
<rickspencer3> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> de rien ;)
<Sweetshark> g'mooorning!
<pitti> hey Sweetshark, how are you?
<pitti> Sweetshark: what better thing to start a Friday with than a passing https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Quantal/view/AutoPkg%20Test/job/quantal-pkg-libreoffice/ ?
<pitti> Sweetshark: congrats :)
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark!
<Sweetshark> pitti: ;)
<Sweetshark> pitti: are you sure this isnt just luck?
<pitti> no, I'm not
<pitti> I'm fully expecting this thing to fail again in the next couple of runs, but it's always a great milestone to see that at least all the tests _can_ succeed
<Sweetshark> pitti: buy 1017125 is a heisenbug, so it might pass today, fail tomorrow ;)
<Sweetshark> pitti: sure they can -- just give me precise as platform and everything is stable :P
<Sweetshark> pitti: but still: yeah, we are getting there.
<Sweetshark> didrocks: heya!
<pitti> so that means from now on failures indicate actual bugs, not test suite probs? that's perfect then
<Sweetshark> pitti: yes, the tests in 3.6 are really reliable. if they fail it is some real indication of something being odd.
<pitti> so that's precisely what we want
<Sweetshark> pitti: wait - you mean that is quantally what we want?
 * Sweetshark *confused*
<pitti> Sweetshark: not quite -- in quantal it will only succeed if nobody watches the result
<seb128> hey desktopers (and qa friends)
<Sweetshark> pitti: that can be helped with some cats in a box added to the compile usually.
<pitti> Sweetshark: I see you have studied the matter thoroughly
<pitti> bonjour seb128, ca va?
<seb128> pitti, hey pitti, ca va bien, merci! wie gehts?
<Sweetshark> and now that we know about the higgs-boson we can make the results gravitate towards lets failures ...
 * pitti really hopes that this will be confirmed
<pitti> the last really meaningful advancements were some 40 years ago, time to get some actual data to the theorists
<pitti> seb128: sehr gut, danke! I enjoyed my time in Leuven, and had a rather productive train ride back yesterday
<tkamppeter> pitti, I have done a new s-c-p upload with an explicit build system rebuild and this works now. Before I forgot this rebuild but it built locally because I did the rebuild manually and forgot to puit it properly into the package.
<seb128> pitti, good ;-)
<pitti> tkamppeter: ah; dh_autoreconf for the win?
<tkamppeter> pitti, as it is cdbs format still and I do not want to dive deeply into the deprecated format (looking into switch to Quilt for Quantal) I have simply added a patch to update the build system files, as a temporary fix.
<pitti> tkamppeter: ah, just include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/autoreconf.mk and add a dh-autoreconf build dep
<tkamppeter> pitti, thanks, will do.
<dupondje> There was something to do in Leuven? :)
<pitti> dupondje: a friend of mine lives there
<dupondje> ah :)
<dupondje> so you enjoyed the belgian beer! :d
<pitti> dupondje: you bet!
<didrocks> waow, nautilus is regularly going crazy here
<mpt> smspillaz, sorry, by "30-second alert" I meant an alert that appears after the program is hung for 30 seconds, not one that asks you if you want to wait for 30 seconds. I'm trying to avoid giving users the impression that we think they need the computer's permission to wait. :-)
<smspillaz> mpt: right, I guess the money question is this
<smspillaz> mpt: if its hung > 30 seconds, does it force you to close or restart it ?
<seb128> didrocks, going crazy like? spinning cpu?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I'm under the impression that at regular intervals, it's hitting the CPU badly
<didrocks> (that's when I hear my fans ;))
<mpt> smspillaz, if it later unhangs then the alert would go away by itself, so if you want to wait longer you can just leave the alert alone. But I'm not sure whether that's obvious enough, or whether it does need an explicit Wait alternative. (And if it was explicit, then how could change your mind later?)
<seb128> didrocks, can you attach gdb to it when it happens to try to figure what it's doing?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, it's doing that regularly, so I need to find a spot, I installed the -dbgsym already, but was too late
<smspillaz> mpt: hit close again
<smspillaz> mpt: it will give you the option to close or restart
<smspillaz> mpt: I'm just trying to find a balance here beacuse I know there are cases where you will get false positives
<mpt> smspillaz, this is not the case where you tried to close it, this is the case where it just hung
<smspillaz> mpt: right
<smspillaz> so
<mpt> but, maybe that's a decent answer anyway
<smspillaz> "it just hung" -> 30 seconds later still hanging -> alert pops up "close, restart, wait"
<smspillaz> if the user hits wait, close the alert
<smspillaz> if at any point while the application is still hung the user tries to close it
<smspillaz> pop up the alert again with "close, restart"
<smspillaz> mpt: also, I already get too many apport dialogs :P
<smspillaz> I have to swat them away every time I boot :P
<mpt> Graphics card problem?
<mpt> smspillaz, so you wouldn't recommend showing the alert again after another 30 seconds? :-)
<smspillaz> if it were me, no, probably not
<smspillaz> I'm already cussing when the first apport dialog comes up
<smspillaz> "oh f*** that's the first of many MANY more"
<smspillaz> mpt: usually its all the times I restart compiz and then some unity service crashes, or unity is buggy and crashes when compiz is restarted
<smspillaz> and apport buffers them all up to assault me on a random day
<mpt> smspillaz, ah, we'll be grouping near-simultaneous crashes into a single alert soon
<smspillaz> *grin*
<didrocks> seb128: seems it's totem video thumbnailer, but I got an update to it, let's see how it goes now
<seb128> didrocks, do you have a video downloading in an folder actually displayed by nautilus?
<seb128> currently*
<didrocks> seb128: yeah
<didrocks> it's weird that it tries to refresh it that often
<didrocks> (well not anymore, but I had when I saw nautilus going crazy)
<didrocks> so should be that
<seb128> didrocks, well, downloading files keep changing and the thumbnail are refreshed on such events
<seb128> didrocks, though nautilus used to be clever, I wonder if that stopped working
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, but I never saw that going so dramatically before
<seb128> didrocks, like it would only update the thumbnail if the file changed but stopped changing for 30s
<didrocks> yeah, seems saner
<seb128> i.e it tried to be smart about waiting the end of download
<didrocks> not sure it's still doing that, I'll have to get a look
<seb128> which doesn't always work fine for i.e torrents
<didrocks> yeah
<tkamppeter> pitti, ping
<tkamppeter> I get a FTBFS on system-config-printer with
<tkamppeter> dpkg-checkbuilddeps: Unmet build dependencies: build-essential:native
<tkamppeter> dpkg-buildpackage: warning: build dependencies/conflicts unsatisfied; aborting
<tkamppeter> SDoes someone know what is wrong here?
<Laney> dpkg broke; they were just talking about that in #-devel
<seb128> tkamppeter, a fixed dpkg got uploaded, just retry the build in a bit
<tkamppeter> seb128, Laney, thanks.
<tkamppeter> seb128, amd64 build restarted and built correctly now, the other builds started automatically now.
<seb128> ok
<pitti> *phew*
<zyga> mvo, hey, I think there are some strange bugs in the way update manager allows you to select particular packages for upgrade
<zyga> mvo, I cannot explain it but it feels like it remembers where you have clicked last and toggles  that item as well
<zyga> mvo, also, a separate bug, the section header (such as 'proposed') does not turn on-and-off but really toggle so if you have one item selected and nine unselected then clicking on the section header toggles them back and forth, I don't know if that is expected
<zyga> mvo, do you want bugs for both?
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, this new eds API is a pita
<chrisccoulson> i didn't realize the contacts addon in thunderbird is using a lot of API that has been removed :(
<desrt> happy friday!
<didrocks> hey desrt, happy friday to you too! :)
<Chipaca> is gucharmap completely unresponsive in Q for anybody else?
<pitti> Chipaca: WFM
<Chipaca> pitti: you can click around, etc?
<pitti> yes
<Chipaca> here it's just completely dead
<Chipaca> strace shouls a nonstop stream of gettimeofday()s
<pitti> I dist-upgraded this morning, but haven't rebooted yet; that shoudl not make much difference for newly started programs, though
<Chipaca> it draws itself, and then died
<Chipaca> by died i mean does nothing
<Chipaca> pitti: i update/upgraded earlier today too
<Chipaca> pitti: anything i can do to debug?
<pitti> does it show anything on stderr when you launch it from a terminal?
<Chipaca> not a thing
<Chipaca> let me set G_DEBUG
<Chipaca> nope
<pitti> ITYM G_MESSAGES_DEBUG=all
<pitti> anyway, does it affect other programs as well? gedit, etc.?
<Chipaca> gucharmap:20735): Gtk-DEBUG: Connecting to session manager
<Chipaca> and that's all
<pitti> no off-hand idea otherwise, except for gdb'ing the thing
<Chipaca> i've got a much smaller program of my own making that gets something similar, where 1/3 of the time it doesn't process events
<Chipaca> slightly different, but same flurry of gettimeofday()s when it doesn't work
<Chipaca> lp:~chipaca/+junk/onmon
<Chipaca> under gdb, works every time
<Chipaca> from the commandline, a significant number of times you get no status icon
<Chipaca> and no events from dbus
<Chipaca> (it listens to and prints out events from network manager)
<jibel> mterry, good morning. any ETA to get a fix for bug 1020462 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1020462 in ubuntu-release-upgrader "Precise to Quantal upgrade failed: do-release-upgrade -d failed with ImportError: No module named janitor.plugincore.manager in DistUpgradeQuirks.py" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1020462
<mterry> jibel, I have a fix, waiting on review.  I can poke people if it's important to fix soon
<jibel> mterry, it's important, upgrade to quantal fails with both GUI and CLI
<mterry> jibel, people don't just edit sources.list anymore?  :)  OK
<mterry> hrm, no patch pilots...
<mterry> mvo, you around?  I have a relatively simple ubuntu-release-upgrader branch that needs a review, and it comes with a question on best way to test the upgrade tarball
<mvo> mterry: hello, yes! what is the url for the review?
<mvo> mterry: as for testing, one way is to simply run "sudo ./dist-upgrade.py" as a smoke test
<mvo> mterry: for the full test I used the automatic-upgrade-tester for a full upgrade test with the non-interactive frontend
<mterry> mvo, ah yes, the a-u-t!  I had forgot that existed after it got split out.  :)
<mterry> url coming
<mterry> mvo, https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/ubuntu-release-upgrader/u-m-symlinks
<mvo> mterry: I'm not sure if the current version has a feature to get the release-upgrader from a branch location, it used to be all bundled (as you know :) so there was a option to use the local version instead of the archive version for the test
<ricotz> Chipaca, hi, is this happening on a clean Q without any PPAs?
<Chipaca> ricotz: yup
<Chipaca> well
<Chipaca> "clean"
<Chipaca> it's my main notebook
<ricotz> ok, i can confirm this gucharmap hanging
<Chipaca> \o/
<ricotz> Chipaca, since it is looks like a "short" endless loop, did you wait long enough?
<Chipaca> ricotz: how long?
<ricotz> Chipaca, run it from terminal and look at a running "top"
<ricotz> it took a while here
<ricotz> probably another atk-bridge thing :\
<Chipaca> ricotz: 25 seconds
<ricotz> Chipaca, can you use it afterwards?
<Chipaca> ricotz: yup
<ricotz> Chipaca, ok, then you might want to find out what it is doing in all this time ;)
<Chipaca> ricotz: you mean, other than a bunch of gettimeofday()s?
<ricotz> Chipaca, this is just a symptom imo
<Chipaca> ricotz: ok sure, but i have no idea how to "find out what it is doing"
<seb128> Chipaca, use gdb and get a backtrace?
<Chipaca> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1078074/
<Chipaca> if that tells you anything, good :)
<ricotz> Chipaca, please install libgtk-3-0-dbg too
<ricotz> and libatk-bridge2.0-0-dbg
 * Chipaca dutifully installs
<ricotz> ;)
<Chipaca> doing this in unity3d with the task switcher doing its usual "ooh, now i'm going to be *under* the other windows" is not fun
<Chipaca> (i switched to 3d to see if was a 2d-ism)
<Chipaca> ricotz: and now just repeat the gdb run?
<ricotz> Chipaca, yeah, this would get a better idea about the source location
<Chipaca> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1078092/
<bcurtiswx> good morning
<ricotz> seb128, http://git.gnome.org/browse/at-spi2-atk/commit/?id=6fbb1ba2c5281706525ae93bd78ee6cd1f1c9bc8 \o/
<ricotz> seb128, this gucharmap problem might be another ref problem in atk-bridge? do you know if cosimoc is still suspecting more of these?
<seb128> ricotz, no idea
<ricotz> the first ones caused a huge slowdown of nautilus for me
<seb128> ricotz, is that commit useful? like are those dirs visible to users in any way?
<ricotz> seb128, look into .cache/ :\
<ricotz> i just deleted like 200 folders
<seb128> ricotz, right, what I'm saying, what user is looking into that dir? ;-)
<ricotz> i guess not tough
<seb128> but yeah, nice to see it fixed, I'm just sure it justify an upload by itself, I will include it with the next one
<seb128> ricotz, did the refleaks fixes solve the segfaults in nautilus?
<ricotz> seb128, no, the crashes still occur, but it responses way faster here while using it a while
<seb128> ok
<ricotz> but seeing this gucharmap trace (and a valgrind log) and this know behavior indicates to me there might be more of these
<ricotz> seb128, just starting up gucharmap results in many of these http://paste.debian.net/177965/
<ricotz> ah nevermind
<seb128> kenvandine, bcurtiswx: could you get the SRU infos on bug #1018784? i.e Impact,Test Case, Regression potential?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1018784 in empathy "[SRU Precise] update to 3.4.2.3" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1018784
<ricotz> seb128, could you please sponsor http://people.ubuntu.com/~ricotz/gnome-screensaver/
<seb128> ricotz, did you see bug #1018710?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1018710 in gnome-screensaver "Update to 3.4.2" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1018710
<seb128> ricotz, invisible unlock screen issue under unity with that version
<ricotz> seb128, ah i see, this fixes the white screen issue with g-s
<ricotz> (the commit Laney mentioned there)
<dobey> seb128: can you accept my uploades to precise-proposed please? :)
<seb128> dobey, I'm not part of the SRU team, I've been trying to push on the SRU guys to get ubuntu-sso-client at least reviewed without luck so far but they said they will have a look soon
<jbicha> ricotz: by the way, tracker doesn't build yet with evolution 3.5.3
<ricotz> jbicha, i knwo
<ricotz> *know
<jbicha> quite a few things don't build yet :(
<ricotz> jbicha, i pinged you before e-d-s landed ;)
<ricotz> jbicha, i guess tracker git doesnt even compile
<dobey> seb128: ok, thanks
<didrocks> seb128: you don't pay enough :) dpm got Quickly to get reviewed in less than an hour :p
<seb128> didrocks, he has a lame excuse about appdeveloper contest or something :p
<didrocks> heh ;)
<dpm> wait, did I have to pay? Can someone roll back the upload? ;)
<seb128> dpm, done
<dobey> lol
<didrocks> dobey: to late, already delivered, no refund
<didrocks> too*
<dpm> hahaha
<didrocks> dpm: ^
<seb128> didrocks, you should see if you can get a refund for your IRC client so you can buy one with working completion ;-)3
<dobey> benefits of being in universe
<didrocks> seb128: I think we should limit every channels to 26 people
<didrocks> one per character
<didrocks> too much d here
<didrocks> I can go on week-end to make room for others :p
<dobey> how very un-french of you
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> :)
<dobey> surely there are more than 26 letters :P
<didrocks> dobey: well, if you start to use Ã¨, you are sure you will never get pinged by english people :)
<didrocks> maybe it's a good idea in factâ¦ ;)
<dobey> heh
<dobey> an Ã¨claire would be a good snack right now :P
<dobey> oh i guess that needs the accent going the other way though
<didrocks> dobey: yeah, "Ã©clair"
<dobey> lacking any of those though, i should go have some real food for lunch :)
<dobey> bbl
<mpt> didrocks, hi. Is <https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-q-upgrade-user-config> about avoiding the kind of dialog shown in <http://imgur.com/XoCao>? Or is it something else?
<didrocks> mpt: no, it's about have a facility for upgrading user configuration automatically (without hacks) when we need to
<didrocks> mpt: like silently adding a plugin to compiz
<didrocks> or adding/removing a launcher icon
<didrocks> and so on :)
<didrocks> (unity-related or not)
<didrocks> mpt: one illustration was the change from applet to indicators in the past, we had to do back hacks for that. The spec is to have a cleaner implementation to support this
<mpt> didrocks, ok, so for "[mpt] define an interface for backing out a configuration and restarting fresh", is this a specific set of known configurations, or for any configuration that is stored in gsettings?
<didrocks> mpt: for any configuration
<mpt> hrmm
<didrocks> mpt: the idea is "reset me fresh" :)
<mpt> That makes things trickier in two ways
<desrt> how fresh is fresh?
<desrt> what if i mungled something up in /etc?
<mpt> First, finding a place to put that button (or whatever) where people would actually find it if they needed it
<didrocks> desrt: yeah, I guess what we discussed in the session was for user key only IIRC
<didrocks> mpt: I think the idea just came into the session from the audience, not sure if it's a good idea
<mpt> Second, explaining why it fixes your gsettings but not (as desrt says) your /etc, or your muddled /etc/apt/sources.list, or whatever else.
<mpt> Any ideas? :-)
<didrocks> mpt: well, I have no strong feeling about it. It's true that we can't reset everything (system keys most of the time) or do we want to reset your thunderbird, credentials, history? As I said, it was raised during the session and if you think it will bring more confusion than anything, feel free to discare it :)
<mpt> didrocks, I think I will ... If it was something limited to a particular schema, for example Unity Launcher settings, that would be understandable and have an obvious home ("Reset My Launcher" with the rest of the Launcher settings).
<didrocks> mpt: yeah, I guess it wasn't that (and I don't see any use of a "Reset My Launcher" or reset other unity settings)
<didrocks> people who can google and use CLI for that are using unity --reset which does that
<mpt> But otherwise there'd be no way to explain what it does. "Well you see, kid, there are some programs that use something called gsettings, and some that don't..."
<didrocks> mpt: I agree, it will bring some confusion
<mpt> didrocks, now, about the other one: "Design to decide what should be presented to user on logout (red too much?)"
<didrocks> even if I'm sure desrt would want everyone to know about gsettings :)
<mpt> Do you know what that is about?
<didrocks> I think I remember even if I didn't write it myself
<mpt> I don't see any other mention of logout in the whiteboard
<didrocks> I guess, google came with the "a reboot cost 1 million" or something like that
<didrocks> and they wanted to separate when an upgrade only need a logout
<mpt> oh, "Indicator session to prompt for logout when new applicable migration scripts are available"
<mpt> ah
<didrocks> mpt: I'm 90% sure it was thing. It was mentionned during the session
<didrocks> this*
<mpt> didrocks, so I am told there is a flag you can put on updates in the archive to say that "this update requires a restart"
<mpt> I haven't seen it myself, but I suspect it's not widely used because update-manager doesn't expose it
<didrocks> mpt: it's used during kernel upgrade
<didrocks> mpt: but I think google was raising that if we can separate logout update, that would be better
<mpt> didrocks, that could be extended to "this update requires logging out"
<didrocks> indeed
<didrocks> when we have a user migration configuration script
<didrocks> an*
<mpt> yes
<mpt> The complication being that someone else might stay logged in while you're installing the update, even if you log out
<mpt> whereas they can't do that if you restart
<mpt> (and that someone else might not be an admin, so might not be used to seeing update-manager UI at all)
<didrocks> agreed
<didrocks> mpt: the reboot required is still update-manager, or just the session indicator?
<didrocks> I think that the "reboot required" dialog doesn't exist anymore and I just see the session indicator turning red IIRC
<mpt> Huh, there's no work item status for "DROPPED"
<didrocks> mpt: rephrase it as "investigate" and mark it DONE I guess?
<didrocks> you investigated
<didrocks> and told, it's not needed :p
<mpt> Moved it to the whiteboard :-)
<didrocks> saw that ;)
<mpt> didrocks, <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareUpdates#After_installing>
<mpt> (I haven't seen yet whether mterry got to that part)
<didrocks> mpt: so you need to take into account into that design "logout only" and if someone is logged and isn't the admin (for logging out or reboot case)
<mpt> didrocks, do migration scripts run at logout only, login only, or either?
<mpt> (or at any time?)
<mterry> didrocks, mpt: the restart needed dialog still exists.  But the icons next to updates to tell you that an update will need a restart doesn't exist
<didrocks> mpt: only on login
<mterry> yet
<mpt> didrocks, do you know of an example where delaying logout might cause weird stuff to happen?
<mpt> when there's a migration script waiting
<mterry> mpt, btw, according to the spec, we only show restart-needed after installing updates.  So if a user dismisses that dialog, later starts u-m again, but doesn't see any updates, they just get the "up to date" dialog, *not* the restart-needed dialog.  Is that what you envisioned, or should we show them the restart-needed dialog there too?
<didrocks> mpt: hum, I don't think I can think of a case where we really *had to migrate* right now (even if the application crashes and respawn), but some people raised the case of people who just suspend and never restart and so can't get access to a potential new setting without knowing
<didrocks> mpt: well, in fact, if unity dependends on a new plugin
<didrocks> and we really need it
<didrocks> if compiz crashes, without the setting being updated
<didrocks> then, we can be in a cycle of "can't start compiz"
<didrocks> very rare, but can still occur
<mpt> I see
<mpt> mterry, thanks. I didn't envision them being able to dismiss the dialog without restarting (it has no close button), but I suppose it might crash or be force-quit.
<mterry> mpt, oh, currently it does have a close button in the window decoration...
<mterry> mpt, but I suppose that is a bug then  :)
<mpt> mterry, so I guess we should show the restart-needed alert on launch as well in that situation
<mpt> mterry, specification updated: <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareUpdates?action=diff&rev2=73&rev1=72>
<mterry> mpt, ok, thanks!
<tkamppeter> pitti, I have pushed up CUPS 1.5.3-3. Can you upload it to Debian and Quantal? Thanks.
 * didrocks waves good evening. Have a nice week-end everyone :)
<dupondje> [19791.949944] type=1400 audit(1341594600.411:356): apparmor="DENIED" operation="exec" parent=2235 profile="/usr/lib/telepathy/telepathy-*" name="/usr/bin/gsettings" pid=14420 comm="telepathy-haze" requested_mask="x" denied_mask="x" fsuid=1000 ouid=0
<dupondje> hmz :)
<jdstrand> dupondje: please file a bug
<dupondje> jdstrand: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/telepathy-mission-control-5/+bug/1021876
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1021876 in telepathy-mission-control-5 "Apparmor needs execute rights on /usr/bin/gsettings" [Undecided,New]
<dupondje> there :)
<jdstrand> thanks
<dupondje> jdstrand: apport info added
<dobey> mlankhorst: if you're still around, just filed bug #1021924 about my intel graphics weirdness :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1021924 in xorg "Multiple Displays not working on Core i7 3770S + Intel DQ77MK motherboard" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1021924
<mlankhorst> you could try xorg-edgers for fun btw
<dobey> is there a trivial way to revert in the event it totally hoses my system? :)
<dobey> hrmm, i should probably remove all the unneeded xorg packages, to make such a thing easier to do
<dobey> pretty sure i don't have a voodoo monster or rage 128 in here :)
<dupondje> jdstrand: nothing special that I know in telepathy
<dupondje> 3 msn accounts, 1 jabber account
<Laney> replying on IRC to comments in a bug?
<mlankhorst> Laney: well I suppose I can mark it as resolved won't fix
<mlankhorst> dobey: nvidia + intel is going to take a while, I'm working on it for quantal but until then I'll defer it to 12.04.2 for now
<Laney> mlankhorst: hmm? I was referring to dupondje
<dobey> mlankhorst: this isn't nvidia + intel. it's intel only
<mlankhorst> dobey: no I see a nvidia binary driver loaded
<mlankhorst> [   26.972573] nvidia: module license 'NVIDIA' taints kernel.
<mlankhorst> [   26.972576] Disabling lock debugging due to kernel taint
<dobey> mlankhorst: i used to have an nvidia card, but recently upgraded the hardware. there is no nvidia hardware in my system now
<dobey> hrmm
<mlankhorst> then by no means should the nvidia driver be loaded and is that the real bug
<dobey> let me purge the nvidia driver and try without
<mlankhorst> there should be no mention of nvidia in xorg.0.log or dmesg
<mlankhorst> else it's screwed up
<dobey> but either way, it wouldn't be getting loaded in the quantal daily image
<mlankhorst> or you could consider the possibility it would work on precise but broke on quantal
<mlankhorst> which wouldn't surprise me
<dobey> sure, possible; albeit the secondary screen is showing the same issue on both currently
<dobey> but let me reboot real quick and try without nvidia binary installed
<dobey> hmm, secondary still all red, and lightdm was behaving weird
<dobey> and gl stuff is still crashy :-/
<mlankhorst> if you do a print screen, does the second screen show correct?
<dobey> mlankhorst: yes it does
<mlankhorst> what if you switch to a virtual console?
<mlankhorst> control alt shift 1
<mlankhorst> erm control alt f1
<dobey> nothing, second screen stays red
<mlankhorst> so it's probably a kernel bug then
<dobey> probably the cause of the gl crashiness too?
<mlankhorst> [   28.997472] colord[1258]: segfault at 4 ip b689397a sp bfa7ef20 error 6 in libdbus-1.so.3.5.8[b686a000+47000]<<<< whats that?
<dobey> interesting
<mlankhorst> if you nuke colord what happens?
<dobey> nuke? as in apt-get purge?
<mlankhorst> yeah
<dobey> mlankhorst: purging colord and reboot seems to have glxgears working now at least
<dobey> but second screen is still all red
<mlankhorst> does it get initialized as red before Xorg starts?
<dobey> yes
<dobey> while plymouth is running
<dobey> when plymouth starts i guess
<mlankhorst> id give xorg-edgers ppa a shot if I were you
<dobey> you think it's not a kernel issue?
<mlankhorst> i don't know, it has the renamed kernel too though
<dobey> no dice. 3.5 locks up when X boots up, can't use keyboard or mouse, or soft-button power off. password entry cursor keeps blinkin, and it doesn't appear to even poke the second display. 3.2 + edgers also still has the secondary screen in a lovely crimson
<dobey> but i have to go now
<dobey> later
<dobey> thanks mlankhorst
<micahg> anyone familiar with lo-menubar still around?
<ceti331> anyone here familiar with compiling and running compiz;
<ceti331> i built it yesterday, but it doesn't run;
<ceti331> what version of the source should i take
<ceti331> what affects it
<micahg> jasoncwarner_: are you around?
<jasoncwarner_> hey micahg what's up?
<micahg> jasoncwarner_: we have a regression in lo-menubar we're discussing in -devel, was looking for someone familiar, I called kenvandine and he said he'd have a look later
<jasoncwarner_> thanks micahg is blocking something? also tedg would be someone to talk to about it
<micahg> jasoncwarner_: well, we don't like regressions in -updates and this update already made it there, this is precise
<jasoncwarner_> micahg: ah, ok
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-07
<ceti331> join #compiz
<ceti331> hi does anyone here compile 'compiz' ?
<ceti331> from the launchpad repo ?
<ceti331> is there a way to re-install compiz
<ceti331> i've tried building it but it doesn't run
<ceti331> and now my install is broken; is there a way out beyond reinstalling distro
<ceti331> i can use fluxbox for the time being fine
<popey> ceti331, sudo apt-get install compiz --reinstall
<popey> ?
<popey> ceti331, probably good to reinstall them all.. sudo apt-get install --reinstall compiz compiz-core compiz-plugins-default compiz-plugins-main-default compizconfig-backend-gconf
<ceti331> ok
<ceti331> trying that now..
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-08
<dArKd3ViL> Hello everyone! I need assistance in opening a run dialog box on xclient script session
<RAOF> Morning all.
<thumper> morning RAOF
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-07-01
<kieppie> I can manually log in guest session fine
<sarnold> hrm, those don't feel like they would be fatal..
<kieppie> x-0.log doesn't ring bells either: http://pastebin.com/7pb9jKEn
<kieppie> I can start with a clean slate if needs be (made a backup of original)
<sarnold> kieppie: is there anything in dmesg?
<kieppie> init: lightdm main process (1005) terminated with status 1
<sarnold> *sigh* of course the lightdm manpage doesn't describe what the return values mean.
<kieppie> yea...
<kieppie> sarnold: changed it a bit: http://pastebin.com/H6V1PHr8
<kieppie> same result - no dice
<sarnold> kieppie: I wonder if you have to use guest-session instead of autologin-session ...
<sarnold> kieppie: is lightdm-autologin one of the sessions in /usr/share/xsessions ?
<kieppie> "guest-session=lightdm-autologin" <-?
<kieppie> xfce.desktop  xubuntu.desktop
<sarnold> kieppie: .. I think anything with *-session= ... requires a matching file in /usr/share/xsessions/
<kieppie> ok
<kieppie> will try
<kieppie> makes sense
<kieppie> I've tried setting "autologin-session=xubuntu", but still nothing
<sarnold> :(
<kieppie> oooh!
<kieppie> set login time=0
<kieppie> :)
<kieppie> autologin-user-timeout=0
<kieppie> had it at 2, for testing
<kieppie> looks good now, thanks
<kieppie> :)
<sarnold> kieppie: oh! woo. :)
<kieppie> cheers
<kieppie> thanks for your help
<sarnold> you're welcome :)
<psusi> so I'm trying to figure out what process owns a pop up window and when I run xwininfo it seems to lock the focus... can't alt tab back to the window to click on it... is there a way to break the lock?
<psusi> ok... what on earth is gnome-settings-daemon and why is it running?  udisks is supposed to handle auto mounting isn't it?
<RAOF> psusi: gnome-settings-daemon does all sorts of other stuff
<psusi> RAOF, why is it trying to handle auto mounting?  that's what we have udisks for?  and why is it trying to do "all sorts of other stuff"?  HAL tried to do that and failed...
<RAOF> You need to have a user daemon to handle auto-mounting, not least because it's going to need to prompt in some cases.
<psusi> that's what udisks is for isn't it?
<RAOF> g-s-d is basically the running-in-user's-X11-session bit of a bunch of infrastructure.
<RAOF> Correct me if I'm wrong, but udisks is a system daemon?
<RAOF> g-s-d is *using* udisks for mounting IIRC, but you do need a user-session component to do the user interaction bits.
<psusi> seems like udisks should be doing that... but my problem is that when I run the parted test suite, even with udisks --inhibit running, it seems that this gnome-settings automount stuff is still trying to fiddle with the short lived test devices created, and pops up a bunch of errors
<psusi> presumably because the devices are only created for a moment for a specific parted test, then destroyed, and gsd is racing with the descruction
<psusi> is there a manual for gnome-settings-daemon somewhere?  I can't even find a page about it on developer.gnome.org
<psusi> I'm getting the feeling that this thing is actually debian home grown and not part of gnome at all... its README file is emtpy, its COPYING file says it's owned by the FSF, but isn't listed on either the gnu or nongnu savannah... there's no website header in the package control file, and the project page on launchpad is just a placeholder... where the heck does this thing come from?
<AlfredOPrufrocks> hi there
<RAOF> psusi: https://github.com/GNOME/gnome-settings-daemon ?
<RAOF> First google result (at least for me)
<psusi> RAOF, yea, that's about all I could find too... but what's it doing there?  if it's really part of GNOME, shouldn't it be on the gnome web site?
<psusi> it's readme file is also empty
<RAOF> psusi: https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-settings-daemon/ would be more canonical âº
<psusi> I'm starting to hate gnome's web site.. I can never seem to find anything useful on it
<darkxst> the automount helper has been removed from 3.8
<darkxst> it is now handled in gnome-shell, which won't help your issue psusi, but might explain why you wont find anything on the website
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> hey Mirv! how were your holidays? (welcome back ;))
<czajkowski> aloha
<didrocks> hey czajkowski, how are you?
<Mirv> didrocks: thanks! :) excellent, as to be expected.
<didrocks> Mirv: did you travel a little bit or stayed at home?
<Mirv> didrocks: traveled domestically and met friends, not that much staying at home
<Mirv> didrocks: some generic otto/lxc problems around I think? (trying to decipher logs)
<didrocks> Mirv: it's weird, indeed, first time I'm seeing that, I'll let you know :)
<didrocks> Mirv: once that's settled back, do you mind taking (apart from Mir that I'm dealing with those days) sil2100's stacks?
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, sil2100's other stacks were qa, misc, oif, unity
<didrocks> Mirv: exactly, thanks! :)
<didrocks> Mirv: I'll tell you about the otto's issue (will have a look in ~30 minutes), and will catch up with you on what I had to do on the Qt side due to signon
<didrocks> meanwhile, you still have time to go through all emails, good luck! ;)
<czajkowski> didrocks: good running saucy on my new laptop :)
<didrocks> czajkowski: sweet :)
<czajkowski> yeah looks good, few bugs on install but nothing bad
<czajkowski> using it as main work machine :)
<didrocks> great ;)
<czajkowski> few compiz crahes and U1 being odd, but overall happy
<czajkowski> except can you explain the scopes :)
<czajkowski> I searched for chromium and assumed it'd show up even though not installed
<czajkowski> and nothing even nder applications
<didrocks> hum, it should be under applications
<didrocks> otherwise, that's a bug
<didrocks> (that part didn't change)
<czajkowski> filed a bug :)
<didrocks> thx!
<czajkowski> even had Laney in front of me checking it
<czajkowski> didrocks: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1196051
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1196051 in unity (Ubuntu) "smart scope does not return uninstalled suggestions" [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> czajkowski: thanks, I'll let mhr3 knows
<czajkowski> np
<czajkowski> right off to europython toodles
<didrocks> salut jibel, Ã§a va?
<jibel> Salut didrocks , Ã§a va et toi?
<darkxst> hey didrocks
<didrocks> jibel: Ã§a va, week-end chargÃ©, mais premiÃ¨re semaine + "normale" maintenant :)
<didrocks> hey darkxst!
<jibel> didrocks, some stacks (media, unity) are stuck since yesterday apparently
<didrocks> jibel: they are not anymore, the platform stacks blocked waiting on powerpc, I'm unsure why though
<darkxst> seb128, know anyone with a wacom?
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<RAOF> seb128: Good morning!
<seb128> darkxst, no
<seb128> RAOF, hey, how are you?
<darkxst> seb128, ok, wacom panel builds ok, but I can't actually test it
<RAOF> seb128: I be fne.
<RAOF> Or even fine.
<seb128> RAOF, ;-)
<darkxst> seb128, that is when mixing g-s-d 3.8
<seb128> darkxst, ok, maybe do a call for testing on the desktop list?
<seb128> RAOF, did you have a chance to test the new xorg?
<RAOF> seb128: Indeed I did. There's one xmir-related crash on my intel/ati hybrid, but apart from that there's no blockers for 1.14
<seb128> RAOF, ok, is that issue new with the xorg update? we should probably wait to have it fixed before landing the update if that's the case... did you file a bug about it or let mlankhorst know?
<RAOF> seb128: It's a bug in my patches for -ati, or at least a new interaction between them.
<RAOF> I've pinged mlankhorst; you should be able to go ahead with the 1.14 rollout shortly, though.
 * RAOF 
 * RAOF â ZoÃ« bath
<seb128> RAOF, ok, thanks
<seb128> RAOF, have fun with the baby bath ;-)
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<Laney> morning
<seb128> chrisccoulson, Laney: hey, how are you? had a good w.e?
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson, Laney!
<Laney> hey seb128, good thank you - very busy with going to london and then outdoors climbing yesterday
<Laney> hey didrocks
<Laney> good weekends too?
<seb128> oh, you went to London?
<Laney> yeah for an event that czajkowski organised
<Laney> was fun
<didrocks> Laney: quite a good one, yeah, just married (civil part) :)
<Laney> AlanBell demoed installing saucy with a screen reader ;-)
<Laney> ...which could be smoother
<Laney> didrocks: ah wow, congrats!
<Laney> when's the party part? :P
<czajkowski> Laney: by smoother you do mean you want to mute it also!
<didrocks> Laney: well, after the religious one (but in october) :)
<Laney> ah, cool
<didrocks> and thanks :)
<Laney> (btw gsettings-qt autolanding is a bit crazy atm :P)
<czajkowski> didrocks: you got married at the weekend? congrats!!
<didrocks> czajkowski: thanks :)
<Laney> :D
<didrocks> Laney: it's because the whitelist wasn't asked to be updated
<didrocks> Laney: you know the last part: <build-publish> -> copy to distro
<didrocks> there is a whitelist barrier
<didrocks> and it needs to be refreshed when we add components
<didrocks> as per the FAQ ;)
<didrocks> and it wasn't done, so latest trunk -> not in distro
<didrocks> and so daily
<Laney> KENNNNNNNNNN!
<didrocks> yep :)
<didrocks> he asked me this night to update it
<Laney> ah cool
<didrocks> I've done it, hence the landing today (as the whitelist is refreshed)
 * Laney checks distro
<Laney> indeed it is
<Laney> czajkowski: how's florence?
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, didrocks, Laney
<Laney> ahoy thar
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i'm not too bad thanks. did some tidying in our garden
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<chrisccoulson> i'm pretty annoyed about mozilla bug 888840
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<ubot2`> Mozilla bug 888840 in General "Unable to access crash reports from Ubuntu builds of Firefox beta" [Normal,New] http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=888840
<czajkowski> Laney: rather warm :) but lovely
<chrisccoulson> pitti, is there anything that needs to happen to make apport retrace firefox crashes correctly?
<czajkowski> altough my flight yesterday wasn an ordeal I do not want to relive, it was over booked, and needed people to get off the plane and people needed to get to Florence, waited 90+ mins security called as people got a bit cranky.
<czajkowski> also forgot how much eastern europeans smoke so much, many of the evnet is outdoors and lots of smoking feels very odd
<Laney> yeah you quickly get used to its absence
<czajkowski> I have however spent the last 15 mins showing off Ubuntu on the new sexy beast laptop :) and no crashes!
<Laney> woo
<pitti> chrisccoulson: not sure, it's supposed to work already, provided that the debug symbols work
<Laney> hey pitti, how's it going?
<chrisccoulson> pitti, bug 1195685 didn't seem to work
<chrisccoulson> i think there's another one from the weekend too but i can't find it now
<AlanBell> Laney: yeah, I will probably go through the screen reader install slowly and report all the bugs again
<czajkowski> AlanBell: slowly, surely you dont want more torture!
<Laney> AlanBell: Do we have any manual tests for that on e.g. the iso tracker?
<AlanBell> yeah, I wrote some, I will go find it . . .
<pitti> hey Laney; great, thanks; and you?
<Laney> ah yes, as run-once
<Laney> pitti: good! My trip bouldering outdoors has reminded me of the importance of regular training :P
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, no error messages in the retracer log either :/
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I keep the tab open and will try locally
<chrisccoulson> :(
<chrisccoulson> pitti, thanks
<chrisccoulson> pitti, 1 more thing - would there be anything preventing the most recent pkg-create-dbgsyms from working on other releases? (ie, if i were to use it in my PPA's for everything back to precise in order to save some space)
<AlanBell> Laney: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/testcases/1309/info
<Laney> yeah, found it
<seb128> pitti, hey
<pitti> chrisccoulson: no, should be fine to backport to any ubuntu release
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<chrisccoulson> pitti, excellent, thanks
<AlanBell> http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/270/builds/47791/testcases/1309/results is in fact the place to report results I think
<Laney> well, it only tests that the procedure works - not really about the quality of the experience
<AlanBell> first things first
<Laney> pitti: so ... I was hoping you'd know about this
<Laney> Quite often when I boot my laptop the permissions on /run/user/blah/pulse are wrong - it gets root:root.
<Laney> is that a known bug and if not where do you think the blame might lie? :-)
<AlanBell> czajkowski: the voice quality can be significantly improved by plugging in a different speech synthesizer but the one that fits on the disk does multiple languages and can be speeded up a lot which regular users like
<pitti> Laney: hm, never heard about it so far; the dir has a "pid" file, does that actually point to a pulse daemon which belongs to root?
<czajkowski> AlanBell: nods
<AlanBell> it is also possible to redirect the output to a text file rather than a synth, I might do that to get a transcript of the install process
<pitti> Laney: and all other files in /run/user/1000 have correct owner?
<Laney> I don't think a daemon was running
<Laney> let me restart and see if it happens again, one second
<Laney> grr, can't repro it
<Laney> oh well, I'll keep an eye out
<czajkowski> where do I go again to get my workspaces back :(
<Laney> appearance
<pitti> Laney: perhaps something started pulseaudio through sudo?
<Laney> pitti: can't think what I would have done like that... it happened two or three times
 * czajkowski hugs Laney 
<czajkowski> thank you
<seb128> Mirv, hey, welcome back!
<seb128> Mirv, do you plan to land qtsystems to saucy soon? ;-) (we need it for system settings)
<czajkowski> every tie I read Mirv I read it as Mir
<czajkowski> *time
<seb128> ;-)
<Laney> I lost clock and battery in indicator-applet
 * Laney reports
<xnox> Laney: my laptop "lost" battery indicator sometime in raring.
<Laney> well I get it in a (unity) guest session
<xnox> awesome
<Laney> but whatever update I did towards the end of last week broke it in indicator-applet :-)
<seb128> Laney, I doubt anyone will want to port indicator-applet to gmenumodel based indicators
<seb128> well, anyone in our indicator team
<seb128> maybe community will pick it up
<seb128> it broke those in unity-greeter though, which we probably need to pick (and ubiquity might be in a similar case)
<seb128> need to ping larsu about that when he gets online
<Laney> seb128: I guess not
<Mirv> seb128: hi, thanks! yes, that's the next one after I get qtfeedback in first. I know systems is wanted as well,
<seb128> Mirv, ok, great, thanks (I've been using the ppa version and it works fine for me ;-)
<xnox> seb128: hmm.... is there a mail or something to read about gmenumodel based indicators?
<seb128> xnox, not sure, https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/libindicator/add-indicator-ng/+merge/143934 probably has some details
<seb128> better to ask larsu when he's around later
<seb128> xnox, https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/d/1mNHOaBJVKRxqRcUkT0vvF5_1H-wG_IM8IQGxoPSXk-M/edit as well
<xnox> seb128: thanks. enough details for now =)
<seb128> xnox, I guess if that was in the perspective of porting ubiquity, https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/unity/support-indicator-ng/+merge/149136 is better
<seb128> that's the unity-panel-service support, and it's small
<seb128> in fact seems like the protocol is fine, what is changing is just how they get listed/loaded
 * larsu can't sleep :-/
<larsu> seb128: morning
<seb128> larsu, hey, you should be sleeping!
<larsu> seb128: ya, doesn't work for some reason...
<seb128> larsu, happy monday
<seb128> get some tea ;-)
<larsu> so I guess I'll just do what pitti does usually and get up now
<pitti> hey larsu
<larsu> seb128: happy canada day! ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<larsu> pitti: hi! wie geht's?
<pitti> larsu: prima, danke! und Dir? (abgesehen von Insomnia..)
<larsu> pitti: pretty good as well. Visited Niagara on the weekend
<seb128> oh, nice
<seb128> is that as impressive to see that it looks like it would on TV? ;-)
<larsu> more impressive :)
<larsu> it really is very cool
<seb128> great ;-)
<pitti> niice
<larsu> but the city is very touristy
 * larsu got to change the lights shining on the falls
<larsu> I met a guy in Toronto who introduced me to the guys operating them
<seb128> lol, I was trying to figure out the joke there :p
<seb128> you actually did change the lights then ;-)
<larsu> ya
<larsu> it was pretty cool
<seb128> sounds like a great w.e trip
 * seb128 is a bit jealous
<larsu> :)
<larsu> I'm moving back on the weekend btw
<larsu> makes me a bit sad...
<seb128> oh, already, I though you would come back around the end of the month
<seb128> are you going to Berlin?
<larsu> yep
<seb128> seems like your body is already putting you back on local time :p
<larsu> haha, projected jet lag!
<larsu> seb128: so I found that indicator-session bug last night...
<seb128> larsu, I saw that, I approved your MR this morning, great work!
<seb128> dholbach seems to have confirmed that the fix works for him
<larsu> it's really neat, leaking a couple of thousand objects, each connecting to a single notify signal
<seb128> I somewhat don't get the bug here, not sure why
<larsu> ah, I see
<didrocks> larsu: thanks for filing my swap this morning btw :)
<larsu> seb128: change your real name a couple of times, you'lll get it ;)
<didrocks> it needed to be checked that it's still working :p
<larsu> didrocks: lol, not my bug ;)
<seb128> larsu, well I doubt you guys changed your name and a bunch of you ran into it... ;-)
<seb128> well, I just got lucky I guess
<didrocks> larsu: you can still call it a benchmark, or robustness testing :p
<larsu> seb128: it happens when anything in accountsservice changes. I'm guessing the new accountsservice notifies more often or about more things, otherwise we'd have seen this bug much sooner
<larsu> didrocks: lol
<seb128> right
<larsu> anyway, it's good that it's fixed, even though that code will be replaced
<seb128> larsu, new accountsservice keeps track/publish a login "journal"
<larsu> interesting
<larsu> does it expose that through the properties of a user object?
<seb128> the GNOME guys show an history of users login in the control-center with it
<seb128> larsu: http://cgit.freedesktop.org/accountsservice/commit/?id=a30ac649fb83de8b1706d1b8bf4cee193c81b706
<seb128> larsu, seems so yes
<larsu> yep, looks like it
<larsu> but this probably only changes when logging in, right
<seb128> well anyway, you found and fixed the leak
<seb128> so all good ;-)
<larsu> yep :)
<larsu> this gets auto-released, right?
<larsu> (once it merges)
<seb128> larsu, btw, not sure if you read backlog, we need indicator-ng support in unity-greeter
<larsu> I know
<seb128> larsu, yes, didrocks is already on it
<larsu> the new indicators landed too early
<larsu> is there anyone scheduled to work on the greeter?
<larsu> if not, I can do it today
<larsu> probably less than a day's work
<seb128> if you could that would be nice
<seb128> mterry is working on the phablet greeter nowadays
<seb128> I don't think anyone is still working on unity-greeter for desktop
<larsu> no problem, will do
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<xnox> seb128: and in addition to "[calendar]" in the datetime-indicator, is it also noticed that indicators are now out-of-order with date-time left-most instead of second from the right?
<seb128> xnox, there is a merge request up waiting to be reviewed to fix that
<xnox> cool.
<seb128> xnox, but it needed changes to libindicator first then the unity side, we just went for the easy fix on friday
<larsu> xnox: sorry about all of that. The new indicator branches landed without anyone testing them (or asking me...)
<seb128> xnox, [calendar] should be fixed with the unity update from friday, restart unity-panel-service
<xnox> larsu: next time leave a broken unit test ;-)
<larsu> heh
<Laney> larsu: btw, my gsettings-qt breakage was caused by using 5.1.0 packages from ppa:canonical-qt5-edgers/qt5-beta-proper
<Laney> totally forgot I even had that ...
<larsu> Laney: good to know. I hope that patch makes it into a release soon, there seem to be quite a few ppas that don't have it floating around...
<Laney> I don't even know why I wanted the PPA so just got rid of it now :-)
<seb128> didrocks, do you know if there an issue with the merger? I find it weird that the indicator-session mr didn't get jenkins/merger comments yet, when the indicator-power one that was approved after it got merged since
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, no idea, I find it weird too
<didrocks> seb128: sometimes, I had to ping mmrazik
<seb128> who would know? fginther?
<didrocks> yep, fghinter now
<seb128> fginther, hey, can you help with merge weirdnesses?
<seb128> larsu, hum, either your ordering fix doesn't work or I did something wrong (I built libindicator from trunk and applied to a local build of http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~larsu/unity/call-ido-init/revision/3389 and run that unity-panel-service)
<seb128> larsu, with that I still get the power and datetime on the left
<larsu> seb128: so about that... the ordering fix only works for gmenuified indicators that have a "Position=NN" line in their indicator file
<seb128> so until we port everything to gmenu the order is going to be wrong?
<larsu> yes, but it would be a trivial patches to the old indicators to make them appear right
<larsu> I can do that if you feel strongly about it
<larsu> in fact, I might because _I_ am annoyed by it :)
<seb128> larsu, it breaks muscle memory, I guess I might get used to it by the time it's changed back to be the right order :p
<larsu> seb128: haha :D
<didrocks> Mirv: just keeping you up to date, there are some unknown lxc/permission issues, we are still working with jibel on it and investigating
<didrocks> (already fixed a change in lightdm impacting us)
<didrocks> Mirv: so, please, work on the Qt side of things right now until otto is up again
<didrocks> look at saucy-changes and the upload I've done to unblock the webcreds stack (I didn't backport everything on purpose to trunk when they diverged)
<seb128> didrocks, should I just upload manually the indicator-session fix maybe so we don't overload's saucy boxes with dbus spam and high memory usage?
<didrocks> seb128: I think it's the saner approach (and so please backport the changelog :))
<seb128> didrocks, will do, thanks
<didrocks> seb128: thanks to you :)
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, thanks
<ogra_> qengho_, did you see bug 1196019
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1196019 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "Chromium crashes with the error "Illegal instruction (core dumped)" with the newest apt-get version on Toshiba AC100, lubuntu 13.04" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1196019
<pitti> err..
<pitti>  2282 martin    20   0 2518m 1,9g 2168 R  97,9 52,8  19:20.50 indicator-sessi
<pitti> that's the second time for me that indicator-session goes crazy, uses 100% CPU and eats up RAM
<Laney> I guess that's what seb128 was just talking about?
<seb128> pitti, cf backlog from 12:48
<pitti> ah, very likely, thanks
<seb128> pitti, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-session/12.10.5daily13.06.19-0ubuntu2
<seb128> grab the deb and restart the service
<pitti> done, merci
<seb128> de rien
<Laney> can you use dbus from qml directly or is that a C++y thing?
<seb128> Laney, I don't think you can no :/
<Laney> mmm
<Mirv> didrocks: FYI u1db-qt would be wanted to saucy / daily release, I think it hasn't yet been on our radar
<Mirv> or well, no updates in 1.5 months, but an upload at least
<didrocks> Mirv: I'm not sure the u1 team is following our daily release process, mind checking with them if they want it? (and if so, sanitazing the package?)
<Mirv> didrocks: yeah, I'll contact them
<didrocks> thanks!
<didrocks> Mirv: FYI, the otto issue is an lxc kernel regression on saucy, we downgraded it and now running the tests
<didrocks> Mirv: then, I'll give you back the control for packaging review and publishing :)
<Mirv> ok, sounds good, or not good that a regression slipped in but otherwise
<didrocks> Mirv: well, still good that it's workarounded already and we are unblocked :)
<didrocks> QA tests successfully passed and published
<didrocks> running platform now
<didrocks> Mirv: we can force the publication in the platform stack, the failing tests are issues that are fixed in latest unity autopilot tests (but not published yet)
<didrocks> Mirv: timing issues only impacting one machine
<didrocks> so running platform once, without "force" mode
<didrocks> to see if we have packaging changes
<didrocks> and running the sdk stack at the same time
<didrocks> platform published
<larsu> seb128: thanks for backporting that indicator-session fix so quickly!
<didrocks> Mirv: so, a lot of tests failures (10 on each config), I let you dealing that with the sdk guys?
<seb128> larsu, thank for the quick fixing! ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: are all changelogs backported to trunk? I want to try a rebuild for indicators and unity
<seb128> larsu, I'm trying to keep saucy users happy, it makes things harder for everybody when people are reluctant to run the current distro because it's known to be buggy
<seb128> didrocks, they all have MR pendings, indicator-session seems to not get along with jenkins/merger though
<seb128> didrocks, fginther didn't ping me back yet
<didrocks> seb128: the others are approved or do you need a silly approval? :)
<larsu> seb128: right, that was my motivation for fixing it last night
<seb128> didrocks, they are approved, but see e.g https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/indicator-session/backport-manual-upload/+merge/172306
<seb128> didrocks, it's "sitting there", no jenkins/no merge
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, those should be fastrackedâ¦
<didrocks> I saw some people mentionning jenkins issues as well
<seb128> gra, on this one larsu didn't change the mr status
<didrocks> (no issues for dailies though)
<seb128> but it will block anyway since the pre-required branch is not merged yet
<didrocks> larsu: !!
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, getting someone to look at those
<didrocks> Mirv: thx ;)
<larsu> seb128: jenkins hadn't run through yet
<larsu> should I change now?
<didrocks> larsu: pfff, you are sooooo late :p
<seb128> larsu, it still didn't run through your fix from yesterday, not sure what's wrong there...
<larsu> didrocks: haha, "Approved by: Didier Roche 54 seconds ago"
 * larsu is too tired to act fast :P
<didrocks> Mirv: do you mind telling me if we can publish the apps stack? all tests pass but as the sdk one failed to pass tests (if we can publish it without latest sdk)
<Mirv> didrocks: looks good, none of the apps changes depend on the Friday's changes in sdk
<seb128> Mirv, does https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/ubuntu/saucy/qtbase-opensource-src/merge/+merge/172053 looks fine to you?
<didrocks> Mirv: thanks, publishing then!
<didrocks> seb128: for the unity changelog, I propose that we merge it manually so that we can ask for rebuilding it, do you have the MP link handy?
<didrocks> seb128: (and if so, please just bzr merge, commit and bzr push if you can)
<seb128> didrocks, what do you mean?
<seb128> didrocks, https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/unity/call-ido-init/+merge/172127 is the mr
<seb128> didrocks, but just merging the changelog would not be good, we can't land an update without the fix or we will break indicators again
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I meant, merging that manually would help to rebuild unity and land those if the MP is good
<didrocks> hum, I though mhr3 would give it a look when I asked for it
<seb128> why does it help?
<didrocks> not the case yetâ¦
<seb128> right...
<didrocks> seb128: to rebuild the unity and run the tests to know where we are at with the full stack
<seb128> well, do you need the changelog merged for that?
<seb128> you can't publish but you can run tests no?
<didrocks> seb128: no, it's not even pushing to the ppa
<seb128> well, I'm happy to send a MR back if that helps
<didrocks> on purpose, to ensure we have "latest"
<czajkowski> eh folks I'm trying to take screen caputures of the desktop and running into an issue, where the imiage appears BLACK. http://ubuntuone.com/7O3TkA30qqPqqQBNwgXQE4
<didrocks> (latest that is published)
<seb128> czajkowski, do you change your number of screens? (like dock/undock a laptop)?
<czajkowski> You cna hear the camera shutter noise taking the picture, but it appears as a black screen. the image is black also
<czajkowski> seb128: nope don't dock it
<seb128> didrocks, ok, let me send a mr for the changelog
<didrocks> seb128: thanks, but anyway, as you told, we need larsu's fixâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, with the understand we need mhr3 or somebody else to ack lars' fix before we publish to distro
<didrocks> yep :/
<seb128> didrocks, I'm pondering just acking it myself
<seb128> I tested it locally
<didrocks> seb128: just made your branch dep on his one
<seb128> it works fine
<didrocks> seb128: I'm fine with this :)
<seb128> I'm running it since this morning
<seb128> ok, let's do that
<seb128> if somebody has a followup review comment they can fix with another mr
<didrocks> exactly
<didrocks> that will enable me to rerun indicators tests in a good shape
<didrocks> (as latest unity-autopilot isn't the one with sil2100's fixes)
<Mirv> seb128: I've checked it now, it looks good. mitya57 is doing a good job on those and I'd hoped to resync with Debian anyway.
<seb128> Mirv, great, thanks, I will sponsor this one then
<seb128> Mirv, he also submitted https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/ubuntu/saucy/qtdeclarative-opensource-src/merge/+merge/172054 and https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/ubuntu/saucy/qtwebkit-opensource-src/merge/+merge/172094
<didrocks> Mirv: thanks for looking at the spreadsheet! :)
<seb128> didrocks, https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/unity/backport-manual-upload/+merge/172334
<didrocks> Mirv: regarding qtwebkit, it seems it's blocked in proposed
<didrocks> Mirv: and I didn't backport IIRC that to trunk as I wanted to wait for your ack
<didrocks> so, please, feel free to backport it :)
<didrocks> we needed that to have the webcreds stack transitionning and qtwebkit temporarly in main for it
<didrocks> seb128: approved, thanks
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, thanks!
<didrocks> Mirv: I think there is just https://bugs.launchpad.net/qt/+bug/1171553 to look at
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1171553 in qtwebkit-opensource-src (Ubuntu) "Invalid dependencies in pkg-config files" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> didrocks, thank you
<didrocks> so not sure if you want to wait for 5.1
<didrocks> seb128: yw :)
<didrocks> (I think that's fine to wait for it)
<seb128> didrocks, #sdk is randomly ranting about the commit message thing, can you just put it back your "use the description as commit message" so we are done with arguing over that? ;-)
<seb128> I think nobody out of thumper really liked it this way
<seb128> didrocks, want a bug report about it?
<didrocks> seb128: I think it's something to ask fginther about, not me :)
<didrocks> seb128: it's not my upstream merger anymore
<didrocks> but I would join the rant :p
<seb128> didrocks, if we ever heard back from fginther :p
<didrocks> "if" ;)
<didrocks> Francis Ginther - National Holiday
<didrocks> I think we won't heard about him
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I'm glad I manually uploaded indicator-session :p
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> well, that's why daily release needed to learn to handle those, giving priority to distro
<seb128> do we have a fallback contact for when fginther is away?
<didrocks> vrruiz I guess
<didrocks> maybe try with him?
<czajkowski> seb128: do you think it may be down to me using workspaces?
<czajkowski> It was working but just ran some updates.
<seb128> czajkowski, that would be weird
<seb128> I had issues like that going away after a session restart
<czajkowski> I mean it's a clean install on saturday, I took some screne captures and today I canot
<czajkowski> ok I'l restart
<czajkowski> brb
<seb128> I blamed xorg/docking
<czajkowski> back working now
<czajkowski> bloody odd
<qengho_> ogra_: Got it.  Interesting.
<ogra_> looks a bit like the no_neon patch doesnt work
<qengho_> ogra_: do you know a way I can run Cr in a Neon-less emulator and test if Neon instructions are run?
<ogra_> hm, not really
<qengho_> !@#$
<ogra_> qengho_, https://wiki.linaro.org/Resources/HowTo/DeterminingCPUFeatures these code snippets  should help to determine if neon is availabel ...
<ogra_> for testing, just talk to the #ac100 community
<ogra_> many there run ubuntu
<ogra_> (just look for HWCAP_NEON, i think pixman also has example code)
<desrt> happy canada day!
<jbicha> desrt: do you go see fireworks?
<desrt> some on saturday and some last night
<desrt> but the big ones are tonight
<larsu> desrt: ð
<desrt> larsu: that character didn't make it
<larsu> that's U+1F341 MAPLE LEAF
<desrt> ah :)
<seb128> desrt, happy Canada day to you ;-)
<larsu> my font doesn't have it either
<desrt> seb128: and to larsu and attente and cyphermox !
<desrt> and jasoncwarner_ and robru if they're awake yet
<seb128> desrt, larsu got insomnia for Canada day, I guess that's because he's german ;-)
 * desrt celebrates with coffee
<desrt> i suppose coffee is similar in some ways to insomnia...
<desrt> a productive alternative to sleep!
<ogra_> seb128, you blame canada instead of brazil vs. spain ?
<ogra_> :)
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> happy canada day desrt!
<desrt> didrocks: happy not-single day!
<didrocks> desrt: ahah, thanks (well, actually, the second already) :)
<desrt> right
 * desrt thought it was the first full one, but not even this is true
<didrocks> desrt: no ;-)
<desrt> feel different?
<didrocks> desrt: wellâ¦ not really TBH :-) I think the religious wedding will make a bigger impact with everyone gathered and the party
<desrt> you have churches in france?
 * desrt boggles
<desrt> oh... wait...
<didrocks> desrt: I think we had few :p
 * desrt remembers seeing at least 2 big ones in paris :)
<didrocks> desrt: yeah, I know, it's a little inconvenient, but we all have to go to Paris first, and then, back in Lyon for that part
<didrocks> but it's a minor journey :p
<didrocks> and a little bit closer than Rome
<desrt> well, with the TGV, it's not so bad
<didrocks> right ;)
<desrt> and if there's only two churches, then there's only two churches
<desrt> so is it at notre dame or sacrÃ© coeur?
<didrocks> we didn't decide yet, you know, there are so few wedding in France that we can decide just the day before
<didrocks> you'll receive a sms to know which one you should go :p
<desrt> you should pick sacrÃ© coeur, then
<desrt> it's much prettier
<didrocks> yeah, but higher as well
<seb128> desrt, and they let you book the place for yourself easily :p
<didrocks> not sure I want to exercise on my wedding day
<desrt> they have the funicular....
<didrocks> indeed, like in Lyon actually
<didrocks> interesting, we'll think about it :)
<desrt> :)
<desrt> larsu: montmarte funicular is a real funicular, for reference
<desrt> *montmartre
<didrocks> why? is there any fake ones?
<desrt> ya.  there's one in montreal with only one car
<larsu> didrocks: ya, MontrÃ©al
<larsu> desrt: they should just rename it to elevator
<larsu> (the one on the Olympic Tower)
<desrt> uhhh
<desrt> i take it back
<desrt> it's a fake one now since it was "upgraded"
<didrocks> http://www.lyon-photos.com/diaporama/moyenne_64.htm you have this one in Lyon
<desrt> it has two cars, but each is under its own power
<didrocks> and yes, there are two cars
<didrocks> (and no own power, just a cable they change each year)
<desrt> since 1991....
<desrt> The technology of the funicular is derived from that of standard elevators, which allows each car to function independently, with its own hoist and cables. This allows one car to remain in service if the other must be taken out of service for maintenance. At busy times, both cabins can ascend at the same time (usually, more passengers use the funicular to ascend than to descend).
<didrocks> this is how the traction works: http://www.ferro-lyon.net/xmedia/Images/ficelles/Fourviere/Fourviere-08-07-02.jpg :)
<desrt> lame :(
<didrocks> desrt: yeah, not a real funicularâ¦
<desrt> didrocks: so the distinction is this: it's only a true funicular if the cars act as counter-weight to each other
<didrocks> and no fun to "we are to cross the other one"
<didrocks> desrt: yeah, I got it, and it's the case for this one in Lyon
<didrocks> (and you cross in the middle, the way doubles)
<didrocks> (eventually to different sides of the way ;))
<desrt> quebec city has a fake one as well...
<desrt> similar to the montmartre setup
<desrt> two cars, each under independent electrical power
<didrocks> desrt: I can understand seeing that changing the cable is, for instance, shutting down the funicular for a week in Lyon, and it seems the maintenance costs are high
<larsu> mterry: what's the best way to test menubar changes to unity-greeter (desktop)? A nested X session?
<mlankhorst> on someone else's computer
<mterry> larsu, yeah, or I just often install it and "switch users"
<larsu> mterry: yeah I guess that'll do. Thanks :)
<seb128> larsu, vms for the win if you like to keep your user session on screen ;-)
 * Laney gets DBus -> cpp -> qml working
<Laney> It's funny being happy about such simple things :P
<larsu> seb128: ah, great idea as well :)
<seb128> Laney, oh, great, please share when you are done ;-)
<seb128> Laney, I got the cpp stuff working last week (if you saw my -tech emails)
<seb128> but I didn't try to dbus for it yet
<Laney> I'm not using the codegen thing they have
<seb128> codegen?
<Laney> seems overkill for the two calls I need (and the tool can't parse the AccountsService interface description)
<Laney> yeah they have something which is similar to gdbus-codegen
<seb128> oh ok, for dbus
<Laney> which is what I was mainly turning up when googling
<seb128> I though you were speaking for the cpp plugin
<seb128> are you doing a cpp plugin for background? did you copy the one from the example panel?
<Laney> not got that far yet
<seb128> I was pondering adding stuff to SystemSettings the other day
<Laney> I did example with cpp code or whatever in Qt Creator
<seb128> but seems it might easier to just have independant plugins for the panel
<Laney> yeah I think so
<seb128> Laney, ok, I did that and I got bitten by the fact that .qml needs to be one directory bellow the plugin for the import to work
<seb128> that took most of my friday afternoon to figure out :/
<Laney> yeah I read your posts but found that mangling the import structure to reflect the module hierarchy got it working for me
<Laney> so backend/Ubuntu/Example/<code goes here>
<Laney> then qmlscene -I backend yourproject/main.qml
<desrt> seb128: shutdown/suspend thing check out?
<seb128> right, as long as you know to add -I to qmlscene you are good :p
<Laney> yes, but that did not work with the structure you get from the template
<seb128> Laney, it does, you need to qmlscene -I ..
<Laney> hmm
<seb128> well, that worked for me at the end
<seb128> but I did so much hacking around that maybe I changed other stuff on the way that I don't remember
<Laney> well, let's see how easy it is to get it into the system-settings
<seb128> Laney, system settings, I would just copy the example plugin from mardy
<Laney> it should be quite a simple one just to read BackgroundFile from accountsservice
<Laney> yeah will copy that and modify it
<seb128> desrt, oh, I forgot ... will try in a bit when I can close my session
<didrocks> seb128: @re: one subddir, remember to have loose time with this
<didrocks> seb128: we miss debug toolsâ¦
<Laney> also I phablet-flashed earlier and didn't get The Bug
<Laney> that's two reboots in a row!
<seb128> didrocks, yeah...
<didrocks> kenvandine: hey, around?
<kenvandine> hey didrocks
<kenvandine> didrocks, oh, i wanted to talk to you about signon
<kenvandine> not sure what to do about it...
<didrocks> how was your week-end? :)
<kenvandine> remember that is the one that has a distro patch for i386 and amd64, but not armhf
<didrocks> kenvandine: you don't remember the diff you've done last time?
<kenvandine> good week, thanks :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: no, it's not that (well, it's related, but not due to it)
<kenvandine> that's all i could see...
<didrocks> kenvandine: basically, what you need to do is diff trunk and the generated source branch
<didrocks> then, if there are diffs that are not in the ignored list and should be, we should update it :)
<kenvandine> ok.. no idea what could be different :)
 * kenvandine looks for that... i thought it was just that patch
<didrocks> remember? this was this: diff -Nrup trunk ../dest-source-tarball | filterdiff --clean -x *po -x *pot -x *locatl-options | lsdiff | grep -v .bzr
<didrocks> so I did it this morning
<didrocks> and noted that we have .pc files
<didrocks> and that's what was triggering the dailies
<didrocks> so I upgraded to "grep -Ev .bzr|.pc"
<didrocks> added a task case
<didrocks> and committed
<didrocks> remember that last time it was files that were wrongly created when doing bzr bd -S?
<didrocks> (so better that you know where to look at if I'm not around next time ;))
<kenvandine> no i don't :)
<didrocks> oh! it was 4 months ago :)
<didrocks> eat more fish for your memory ;)
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> i'm old :)
<didrocks> heh
<kenvandine> i just ran that command and didn't get anything
<didrocks> what did you run exactly?
<didrocks> I bzr branch lp:signon
<didrocks> bzr bd -S
<kenvandine> diff -Naurp ../build-area/signon-8.52+13.10.20130701 .  | filterdiff --clean -x *po -x *pot -x *locatl-options | lsdiff | grep -v .bzr
<kenvandine> from inside trunk
<didrocks> kenvandine: is ../build-area/signon-8.52+13.10.20130701 created with bzr bd -S?
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> just now
<didrocks> not what I had, let me retry
<didrocks> kenvandine: you didn't use bzr bd-do for ../build-area/signon-8.52+13.10.20130701?
<kenvandine> no
<kenvandine> i never use that :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: interesting, bzr bd -S --dont-purge gives something different than extracting the tarball :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: try to reextract the tarball
<didrocks> with dpkg-source -x
<didrocks> and diff between trunk with this
<didrocks> (as we diff with distro, after downloading the previous source)
<didrocks> this time, you should have the .pc files (that dpkg-source does something with apparently :p)
<kenvandine> ok, now i get quilt stuff
<kenvandine> ./.pc/.quilt_patches
<kenvandine> ./.pc/.quilt_series
<kenvandine> ./.pc/.version
<didrocks> yep :)
<kenvandine> so it's that patch :)
<didrocks> yeah, indirectly ;)
<kenvandine> i don't get that from the bzr bd -S though
<didrocks> me neither
<kenvandine> weird
<didrocks> that's interestingâ¦ :)
<kenvandine> anyway, so you'll start ignoring the .pc?
<didrocks> kenvandine: so http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~cupstream2distro-maintainers/cupstream2distro/trunk/revision/332
<didrocks> and deployed :)
<kenvandine> awesome
<kenvandine> thx
<didrocks> yw :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: something else, the misc start is failing to build
<didrocks> due to upstart-launch
<didrocks> upstart-app-launch
<kenvandine> grrr
<didrocks> you are not a stranger to that one, isn't it? :p
<kenvandine> i helped ted with the packaging... but that's about it :)
<kenvandine> i can look though
<seb128> desrt, no suspend on shutdown if I close the lid just after picking the item, so I guess it's the 10 seconds timeout
<didrocks> kenvandine: that would be awesome, it's failing on every archs apparently
<didrocks> kenvandine: if the fix lands, mind rerunning the stack (just rebuilding that component?)
<kenvandine> sure
<didrocks>  *** Checking Application Job ***
<didrocks> ERROR: version of /sbin/initctl too old
<didrocks> it failed for 3 days (saturday to today)
<kenvandine> ah, needs newer upstart i guess
<didrocks> I doubt that distro was in a mismatch
<didrocks> if so, just disable it for now maybe?
<didrocks> to not block the full stack?
<kenvandine> i blame tedg
<didrocks> we all do :)
<ogra_> erm
<kenvandine> i'll look in a few :)
<didrocks> thanks ;)
<kenvandine> finishing something else atm :)
<ogra_> you never ever want to have initctl executed in a chroot during package builds
<didrocks> kenvandine: no hurry, as long as you unblock the stack ;)
<didrocks> ogra_: seems that tedg wants that :p
<kenvandine> seb128, https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/ubuntu-system-settings/network_plugins/+merge/172358
<ogra_> you cant really ... at least for system upstart jobs we explicitly move initrctl out of the way when creating chroots
<ogra_> (i.e. when building images etc)
<desrt> seb128: how about if you wait?
<desrt> seb128: or did you not upload yet?
<seb128> desrt, oh, I did not upload yet
<seb128> sorry, I'm still testing on old saucy
<desrt> ah.  cool
<seb128> kenvandine, lol, I was about to push that .install simplication :p
<desrt> so i guess it confirms my theory at least
<desrt> which means that the patch should work
<seb128> kenvandine, I just built locally with that
<ogra_> if you need example code: debian-installer-utils ... grep for initctl.REAl in chroot-setup.sh
 * didrocks waves good evening and good night
<purezen> Hey guys..! I recently bought a Dell Vostro 5460 with Ubuntu12.04 pre-installed.. Though, I did a fresh install of 12.10 on it.. I face an issue of extremely low sound output from the machine.. something which has not been reported from the Windows running versions.. Please help..!
<purezen> Other Linux users of the same have also reported the same issues..
<AlanBell> o/ xnox in ubiquity, the dots at the bottom, is that by any chance implemented as a zillion individual progress bar widgits?
<qengho_> ogra_: The only way to handle Neon features is by a runtime branch, yes?  There's no different LD path, e.g., look in /usr/lib/armneon-linux-gnueabihf before /usr/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf ?
<ogra_> right
<ogra_> or alternatively build a -neon binary package (though thats ugly and doubles your buildtime)
<qengho_> ogra_: but dpkg has no Neon test, I'm sure. A human still has to know to install.
<ogra_> yes, the -neon package would have to be options
<ogra_> *optional
<qengho_> ogra_: I don't think chromium will be able to support neon soon. Upstream just WontFix'd a bug about neon and Tegra2.
<ogra_> we dont want neon enabled at all
<ogra_> its a policy
<qengho_> ogra_: the most sane result is to disable Neon for all.
<ogra_> no packages that use neon by default are allowed in the archive
<ogra_> if your app can do runtime detection, feel free to use it, if it cant  you need to leave neon off
<qengho_> ogra_: right, I knew we had to support non-neon hardware. I thought we could also support neon features somehow, but I'm discovering it's not possible right now.
<ogra_> well, i thought there was a patch fro runtime detection in the package
<ogra_> to use hwcaps
<qengho_> ogra_: something else broke at compiletime.
<ogra_> ah
<qengho_> ogra_: upstream added a "neon is optional" flag, but it doesn't do what I expected.
<gregier_> hi I am looking at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-themes/+bug/1171587 and was hoping for some help in getting the CSS fixed
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1171587 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "update to GTK 3.9 and the issues to resolve for it" [Wishlist,New]
<gregier_> I tried to just apply the same basic change that was done in Adwaita but it just makes it worse
<xnox> AlanBell: yes, and there is already a bug about audio description of those.
<xnox> AlanBell: if there is an api to supress announcing them in gtk+, I am all ears =)
<AlanBell> thanks xnox, I was just trying to figure out where all the announcements were coming from
<AlanBell> I have no idea how to surpress them, sorry
<xnox> AlanBell: your guess is correct, the dots are progressbars and are announce 0->100% with a generated name "gtkprogressbar2"
<xnox> Is compiz under daily release?
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-07-02
<Mirv> xnox: it is, but last I heard we were waiting for ack from andyrock to enable new builds for saucy
<Mirv> so currently not
<pitti> Good morning
<mlankhorst> no!
<mlankhorst> too early
<pitti> RAOF: FYI, umockdev 0.2.10 has an add_from_file() now
<RAOF> pitti: Yay!
<pitti> RAOF: oh, does the more thorough emulation of /dev/ nodes help you for the DRM stuff? I had thought most stuff doesn't bother to stat these devices, I only saw these in some udev API (where it's actually necesary)
<pitti> (seeing your G+ comment)
<RAOF> pitti: Oh, I don't think that helps particularly. Just that your post prodded the me to think that we should be doing some ioctl recording.
<pitti> RAOF: how does /dev/dri/* work in general? I had assumed it was by and large via mmaping, or is drm just a control interface and the actual framebuffers are completely separate?
<RAOF> The actual framebuffers are completely separate.
<pitti> s/drm/card0 or controlD64/
<RAOF> I'm not actually sure what uses the controlD64 node; everything I've touch opens card0.
<RAOF> DRI1 did some mmapping, IIUC, but DRI2 is all ioctls returning opaque integer handles.
<RAOF> Oh, and there's an ioctl for mmapping a handle, but you only do that if you hate performance.
<pitti> RAOF: re (was in meeting)
<pitti> RAOF: ah, so presumably umockdev doesn't currently support these ioctls, but please let me know (github issues) what you need there
<pitti> unless they are stateful, they are easy to add; stateful ones need some more care, but I can add them too
<RAOF> Ah. umockdev doesn't handle arbitrary ioctls?
<pitti> not at the moment, as it needs to know how to decode the arg
<pitti> (plain int, pointer, how to read what's behind the pointer, etc.)
<RAOF> Fair enough.
<pitti> one could deduce it from the length part of the ioctl ID, but that has some oddities
<RAOF> Many of the ioctls I'd care about aren't stateful, so that would be good.
<pitti> RAOF: generic ioctl support is on the TODO list, but I haven't looked at other ioctls much yes
<pitti> s/yes/yet/
<pitti> I'd like to support ioctls which have a correct direction/size where the ioctl data is just an opaque memory blob
<RAOF> We wouldn't be doing anything insane like mocking out rendering. :)
<pitti> and the special cases can then override it
<pitti> RAOF: so, please let me know what you guys need; this is use-case driven
<didrocks> hey Mirv, how are you?
<didrocks> hey RAOF, pitti!
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, comment vas-tu ?
<RAOF> Ok. I'll work out the minimal set of ioctls for us to test "identifies and opens a drm device"
<didrocks> pitti: Ã§a va, et toi?
<pitti> c'est un joli matin, avec le soleil et de ciel bleu
<didrocks> :)
<pitti> didrocks: ("du ciel bleu"? do I need an article there?)
<didrocks> pitti: il y a "du ciel bleu" is fine :)
<pitti> ah, so with article
<didrocks> yep ;)
<pitti> hm, is it just me, or did the indicator order change? my clock is now at the left side of the indicator area
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, it's an upstream bug due to protocol change
<pitti> well, if that's the kind of regression that we get these days -- BOORING!
<pitti> (well, the session indicator "I gobble up 4 GB RAM" one was quite serious indeed)
<didrocks> pitti: still, I would prefer we even avoid them having better integration tests :)
<Mirv> morning didrocks, fine thanks
<didrocks> Mirv: do you have a minute or did you already looked at the stacks?
<Mirv> didrocks: looked, mostly otto problems ("too many packages installed") and then upstart-app-launch failing to build
<didrocks> Mirv: "too many packages installed" is not an otto problem
<didrocks> Mirv: it's a otto security to fail the tests if we try to pull more packages that are not installed by default on the ISO that we didn't list
<Mirv> ah, ok, so that kind of problem
<didrocks> Mirv: so, we need to understand why it wants to pull those and if it's fine to pull those
<didrocks> Mirv: yeah, to prevent shipping libqt5sql5-sqlite for instance on the CD :p
<didrocks> or libqt5test5
<didrocks> Mirv: I'm on http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/autopilot-saucy-daily_release/label=autopilot-intel/288/console
<didrocks> Mirv: from yesterday, only qtbase-opensource-src change, right?
<didrocks> (as I'm seeing it's the same on every stacks)
<didrocks> I only see qtbase5-dev which pulls those depends, I wonder what changedâ¦ as we don't install it apparently
<didrocks> Mirv: do you see anything that can pulls those? I don't find anything off hand
<Mirv> didrocks: I'm trying to understand the situation, but why didn't yesterday's build pull those, is there some preinstalled older Qt5 libraries in the image that is used?
<didrocks> Mirv: no, nothing that's not in the apt-get install --simulate list you see (apart from what is in the iso)
<Mirv> ie in yesterday's build Qt5 wasn't apt-getted at all, now since it has been upgraded it's tried to be upgraded
<didrocks> hum, some part of qt5 was
<Mirv> I'm comparing '284' to '289' (platform builds)
<didrocks> http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/autopilot-saucy-daily_release/283/label=autopilot-intel/consoleFull
<didrocks> ah, I'm on the QA one :)
<didrocks> (but same I guess)
<Mirv> didrocks: so it says there eg. libqt5core5 'is already the newest version', but now today it's not so it's tried to be upgraded/installed
<didrocks> Mirv: yeah, which makes sense as there was the sponsoring of a new version uploaded to distro
<Mirv> so is the problem that those packages shouldn't be preinstalled in what otto uses, the packages should be manually updated in the image otto uses, or that the packages should have been listed in configuration all along, or something else?
<didrocks> Mirv: I think it's a case by case thing
<didrocks> Mirv: I'm sure we don't want to install the -sqlite for instance
<didrocks> or -xml
<didrocks> so we need to understand why know we would need it
<didrocks> where we didn't before
<didrocks> (the check is there to protect us for pulling random binaries we don't want/need)
<didrocks> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/143921187/qtbase-opensource-src_5.0.2%2Bdfsg1-4ubuntu1_5.0.2%2Bdfsg1-7ubuntu1.diff.gz
<didrocks> is the upload from yesterday
<KriShaNsin> anyone want to help me set up Vidalia Tor GUI on 13.04 right quik? i am missing the socket layer control file? can not start tor without that in advanced settings.
<didrocks> Mirv: what I don't understand is that qtbase5-dev would be the perfect culpurit which wants to install everything
<didrocks> but from the logs, it's not installed
<didrocks> http://10.97.4.139/otto/saucy-i386-20130701-1217/archive/ubuntu_13.10_saucy_salamander_alpha_i386_20130701.1372724865.otto
<didrocks> Mirv: this is the archive ^ (delta image from the iso)
<Mirv> it should be, it's build-dependende on
<didrocks> it's a tar format
<didrocks> Mirv: yeah, but here, it's some runtime tests, so no build-deps installed
<Mirv> right, right
 * didrocks really puzzled
<Mirv> hmm
 * didrocks just did some apt-cache show on all the qt5* packages we list manually, and nothingâ¦
<Mirv> I went manually through sdk's dependencies and there is no reason for those 5 additional packages to be installed so far
<Mirv> so the qtbase update would look suspicious otherwise except that it doesn't really change dependencies
<didrocks> Mirv: agreed, that's why we need to understand what exactly happens I guess and not adding them bindly
<didrocks> Mirv: do you know off hand the apt resolver command? (to see what's pulling what and so on?)
<didrocks> I think it will be a great debugging to add to otto in those case and that should help us
<Mirv> didrocks: how do I look inside the otto image file? I found out it's gzipped, but after that?
<Mirv> didrocks: I haven't used apt resolver (I think)
<didrocks> Mirv: it's just a tar file, so untar it with tar -xzf <file> and you have the delta/ containing the delta directory
<didrocks> Mirv: but in fact, in this case that doesn't help us so much as it's failing while doing --simulate, so nothing is installed
<Mirv> oh, funny file-roller didn't want to open it
<didrocks> Mirv: maybe the extension puzzled it
<didrocks> Mirv: it's "fun"
<didrocks> Mirv: I just tried a chroot
<didrocks> adding the ppa
<didrocks> apt-get install the same ones
<didrocks> and it doesn't need those extra depsâ¦
<didrocks> as we would expect
<Mirv> didrocks: the log still looks like the 'additional' packages are preinstalled, and marked as 'additional' since they need to be upgraded, even though the packages don't depend on those
 * didrocks restarts again the QA stack with "foo"
<didrocks> Mirv: http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/autopilot-saucy-daily_release/label=autopilot-intel/296/console for the latest run, still the same
<didrocks> Mirv: yeah, libqt5core5 is in the iso AFAIK
<didrocks> Mirv: for signon
<Mirv> didrocks: but libqt5opengl5, printsupport5, sql, test5, xml5?
<didrocks> Mirv: oh, you're right, even test5 is in the iso
<didrocks> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/saucy-desktop-i386.manifest
<didrocks> so what we are seeing is just their upgrade
<didrocks> hum
<Mirv> right, they're all there (for some reason)
<didrocks> that doesn't make sense
<didrocks> they are "new dependencies"
<didrocks> as getting installed
<didrocks> not getting upgraded
<didrocks> (we filter the upgrades)
<Mirv> it seems they're listed as both new packages to be installed and upgrades in the logs
<Mirv> so maybe the filtering is not enough?
<didrocks> Mirv: yeah, I'm a little bit puzzled by this :)
<didrocks> Mirv: maybe we need additional logic and it's a false positive
<didrocks> it's still weird that we ship -test5 on the CD, right?
<didrocks> Mirv: meanwhile, I'm relaunching all the tests with "check with whole ppa" to disable the check for now, you will have your first results in less than 10 minutes, mind giving a look again then?
<Mirv> didrocks: ok..
<didrocks> Mirv: thanks! Sorry, it was a real otto bug this time :)
<didrocks> Mirv: fixed btw :p
<didrocks> Mirv: I'll ask jibel so that we can have the "plan of upgrade" in the logs
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, great that it was identified :)
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> Mirv: there are the first results, what we did with sil2100 was: lukasz looked at the diff, gave his +1 or -1, then ask for me to confirm. If +1, he forced the publication, want to do the same?
<jibel> didrocks, hey, what was the problem?
<didrocks> Mirv: it's some kind of sponsoring so that you can get my +1 for upload rights :)
<didrocks> jibel: salut, Ã§a va?
<jibel> didrocks, Ã§a va et toi ?
<didrocks> Mirv: sdk stack seems to still have a lot of failures in tests though
<didrocks> jibel: Ã§a va :)
<didrocks> jibel: so, we detect upgrade of packages as new package to install
<didrocks> a new install is:
<didrocks> /var/log/upstart/otto-setup.log: Inst python-mimeparse (0.1.4-0ubuntu2 Ubuntu:13.10/saucy [all])
<didrocks> an upgrade is:
<didrocks> /var/log/upstart/otto-setup.log: Inst libqt5sql5 [5.0.2+dfsg1-4ubuntu1] (5.0.2+dfsg1-7ubuntu1 Ubuntu:13.10/saucy [i386]) []
<didrocks> instead of:
<didrocks> $( echo "$simulate" |grep ^Inst|cut -d' ' -f2|sort )
<didrocks> we can get something like: $( echo "$simulate" |grep ^Inst| grep -v '] (' |cut -d' ' -f2 |sort)
<didrocks> but that's not really semantic
<didrocks> maybe an awk will make more sense
<didrocks> jibel: at the same time, I always enabled seeing the line of apt-get install --simulate and output as it was troubling when you don't know how the system work
<jibel> didrocks, ah I thought I filtered them out. Did you fix it or shoud I?
<didrocks> jibel: I think as well having the "install plan" by apt would make sense to know what pulls which deps
<didrocks> jibel: I didn't fix it yet
<didrocks> feel free to do something more semantic :)
<jpds> Anyone around who can help me with gvolumes?
<Mirv> didrocks: ah, ok, looking. I didn't get anyone to look at the sdk failures yet.
<didrocks> Mirv: can you ensure it's fixed today and then rerun the stacks? The contract with upstream is to get fixes in every day :)
<Mirv> pushing..
<jibel> didrocks, http://paste.ubuntu.com/5835386/
<didrocks> jibel: I was sured you would jump on the awk trend! Thanks, looking good :)
<didrocks> jibel: is there any way in case of failure to show the installation plan from apt?
<didrocks> (what pulled what and so onâ¦)
<jibel> didrocks, that's what I'm looking at. option pkgproblemresolver doesn't show any thing interesting
<Mirv> didrocks: qa stack would look +1, only the pyruntest packaging change by me
<didrocks> Mirv: +1 then, feel free to force the publication :)
<Mirv> done
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> didrocks, Mirv: hey, how are you?
<didrocks> salut seb128!
<didrocks> good, you?
<seb128> good, thanks ;-)
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> pitti, salut, wie gehts?
<pitti> seb128: much better now that power is back :)
<seb128> oh, you had a power outage?
<pitti> yeah, for an hour or so
<pitti> fortunately my laptop battery still had some charge
<Mirv> seb128: morning, fine thanks!
<pitti> I hope that it lasts longer this time, already got two outages now
<pitti> hey mvo
<mvo> hey pitti
<seb128> oh, a mvo!
<jibel> good morning mvo o/
<pitti> mvo: was macht die Kunst?
<didrocks> hey mvo! how are you? :)
<seb128> mvo, hey, how are you on this sunny summer day? ;-)
<Mirv> didrocks: platform (powerd) +1 as well
<mvo> hey seb128, jibel, didrocks and pitti! I'm fine, thank you :) i plan to do the apt ubuntu merge today (wooooh)
<seb128> mvo, oh, great ;-)
<didrocks> Mirv: +1 for me, we should propose changing for "any" though, mind doing that today?
<didrocks> mvo: \o/
<jibel> didrocks, on failure I could replay the install with Debug::pkgDepCache::AutoInstall=true, that'd give someitnhg like http://paste.ubuntu.com/5835434/
<jibel> didrocks, sounds good ?
<seb128> didrocks, do I read correctly that tests were unhappy this night due to "python-secretstorage" being installed?
<didrocks> jibel: perfect! :)
<didrocks> seb128: hum, not on this one, it was a false positive detection due to upgading Qt components, but maybe there is something else, did you catch another one?
<didrocks> as I relaunch, but Mirv is now looking at the results
<seb128> didrocks, I was looking at http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/autopilot-saucy-daily_release/295/label=autopilot-ati/artifact/results/logs/otto-setup.log
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, will propose
<Mirv> oh hello mvo! :)
<didrocks> Mirv: thx :) keep me posted on the other stacks, I see that some finished the tests already ;)
<didrocks> Mirv: maybe you can deal with the apps one as well? IIRC sil2100 was dealing with it to not wait for robru if possible :)
<didrocks> seb128: this is a valid one, should it be installed on the iso?
<robru> didrocks, wait for me to what?
<seb128> didrocks, good question, it's not from the manifest
<didrocks> robru: hey, still around? :) looking at the apps stack? I think you had few time last week to look at failures, right?
<robru> didrocks, oh yeah, sorry, I haven't been keeping on top of that very well. I think this week will be better though.
<didrocks> robru: ok, please look at those at first thing in the morning. It's our main focus as a team to keep those things rolling :)
<robru> didrocks, ok, well first thing is the meeting ;-)
<didrocks> robru: seems the tests are failing, so better that you get in touch with upstream :)
<robru> didrocks, but after that I will get right on that
<didrocks> robru: I mean, everyday, not every week :p
<robru> didrocks, ok ok ;-)
<didrocks> thx!
<jibel> didrocks, r235 deployed
<didrocks> jibel: excellent, thanks!
<didrocks> seb128: do you think we should get it on the CD?
<didrocks> or that it's safe to get it?
<seb128> didrocks, why would we add it to the CD if nothing uses it there?
<didrocks> seb128: well, something is trying to pull it obviously from latest unity stack, let me try in a pbuilder
<seb128> didrocks, do you use python-keyring or python-launchpadlib?
<didrocks> oh, that's maybe python-launchpadlib
<seb128> didrocks, http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/ubuntu.saucy/rdepends/python-secretstorage/python-secretstorage
<mvo> hey Mirv!
<seb128> didrocks, right, python-launchpadlib depends on it
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, it's the launchpad scope, so we just need to add it to the whitelist
<seb128> didrocks, that makes sense
<didrocks> Mirv: mind doing that (adding it to the stack and then deploying once the unity stack is not running?) ^
<Laney> hey
<seb128> Laney, good morning!
<Mirv> didrocks: parsing backlog, python-secretstorage that is? ok, can do + deploy
<didrocks> Mirv: right, it's for some scopes that we don't install by default :)
<didrocks> Mirv: you have other manual packaging change to publish I guess
<didrocks> Mirv: it seems that launchpad was disconnected so I'm going to recheck with whole ppa the indicator stack meanwhile
<didrocks> (same for unity once you will have deployed it)
<Mirv> didrocks: https://code.launchpad.net/~timo-jyrinki/cupstream2distro-config/add_python-secretstorage/+merge/172483
<didrocks> Mirv: my eyes are bleeding with this diff, but it looks good :)
<didrocks> Mirv: please redeploy from this branch directly the unity stack
<Mirv> didrocks: I don't think any more of my + sil2100's stacks can be published? misc has build error I need to ping ted about, sdk has failing tests
<didrocks> Mirv: oh, you're right, phone is on ken's plate
<didrocks> Mirv: so, let's see what we can get with indicators and unity once you redeployed
<didrocks> Mirv: and then, we're good I guess
<Mirv> ok
<didrocks> did you get any ETA for the sdk fixes?
<Mirv> not yet... not many people awake / not on vacation
<didrocks> oh zoltan isn't around?
<Mirv> nope, neither is JP, kaleo is in another timezone
<Mirv> zsombi has a hunch of what causes it but possibly timp or kaleo could look at it
<didrocks> Mirv: ok, keep me posted please! :)
<didrocks> Mirv: indicatorsâ¢ passed \o/\o/\o/
<seb128> "â¢" ;-)
<didrocks> we should add blash completion to indicat* ;)
<Mirv> didrocks: \o/
<Mirv> (redeploying unity)
<pitti> hm, did anyone try yesterday's gtk-doc-tools yet? it breaks all over here
<Mirv> redeployed
<seb128> pitti, this night update from robert_ancell? I didn't
<pitti> yes
<didrocks> Mirv: ok, rerunning unity with check with whole ppa, tell me once you'll have look at indicators meanwhile (we have for ~1h for unity tests)
 * pitti downgrades for now, finishes his current stuff, and will investigate later
<Mirv> ok
<xnox> Mirv: didrocks: ok thanks. I uploaded a FTBFS against boost1.53 cherrypick from upstream into saucy. But that resulted in compiler ICE on armhf =)
<didrocks> xnox: for compiz you mean? :)
<xnox> didrocks: yeah.
 * xnox ponders switching to gcc-4.7 for armhf and/or debugging it & filing a bug report.
<seb128> xnox, let doko debug it ;-) it might be the same ICE kdelibs is hitting, who knows...
<xnox> seb128: i wish our builders were able to uuencode pre-processed source code on a compiler ice.
<didrocks> Mirv: ok, I think ati tests have the "eat too much memory" bug. intel tests are good for unity. I would suggest that you publish once unity (without force) so that we can see what packaging changes and dep stacks we have, and eventually publishing if we are fine with it :)
<didrocks> Mirv: I'm publishing the HUD stack meanwhile, the dependencies are fine and now in distro
<didrocks> Mirv: any news on indicators btw? :)
<Mirv> didrocks: sorry, trying to multi-task to get things done on multiple places, but I was just looking at the indicators now
<didrocks> Mirv: ok, so I guess unity is good as well, but be good to unblock both stacks ASAP as they were stuck for too long :)
<didrocks> Mirv: (but need the double publication for unity, one to check what changed, and if good, forcing)
<Mirv> indicators (ido, libusermetrics) +1
<didrocks> Mirv: I looked at it meanwhile, yeah, the dependencies of libusermetrics are in universe, but libusermetrics will stay in universe as well, so good for me, +1
<Mirv> new packages in usermetrics
<Mirv> ok
<Mirv> publishing
<didrocks> thanks!
<xclaesse> is it just me, or ubuntu does not implement com.canonical.indicators.webcredentials dbus service anymore?
<xclaesse> ah, it is implemented by /usr/bin/signon-ui
<xclaesse> and it's not always running
<seb128> xclaesse, right, we try to reduce the number of services running when not needed
<seb128> it's dbus activated and exit on idle
<didrocks> Mirv: want me to handle unity if you don't have time? We really need libunity in distro now
<Mirv> didrocks: yes, please, would be appreciated :)
<didrocks> ok doing
<Mirv> thanks!
<czajkowski> Sweetsha1k: are you at europython, seeing a few LO green t-shirts floathing about
<didrocks> jibel: kind reminder for the unity8 view for head in jenkins :)
<seb128> didrocks, Mirv: I did a first preNEW review of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1190896 ... looks fine to me ;-) (we need it in saucy for system settings so I'm trying to help landing it)
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1190896 in Ubuntu UI Toolkit "Update qtsystems git snapshot and upload to saucy " [Undecided,In progress]
<didrocks> seb128: thanks!
<seb128> yw ;-)
<didrocks> larsu: seb128: wasn't the order supposed to be fixed in latest indicators + unity?
<didrocks> it's not for me (even in a guest session, everything refreshed)
<Mirv> seb128: thanks, I didn't even get to asking didrocks to upload qtfeedback yet, but very much appreciated!
<Mirv> seb128: I'll fix that issue you noted there in qtsystems
<seb128> Mirv, yw, as said I've interest in seeing it uploaded so if I can help getting that done... ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, no, the order is respected for the new gmenu based ones, but we have a mix of techs atm and the sorting is done in each group
<seb128> didrocks, so we have a group with datetime-power that is sorted and the remaining sorted
<didrocks> hum, ok, so once everything will be transitionned, the order will be back?
<seb128> right
<didrocks> do we have any idea when that will happen?
<seb128> or before, larsu said yesterday he might have a look at fixing the sorting
<didrocks> ok
<Sweetshark> czajkowski: no I am not, I am at https://plus.google.com/109302841731362777691/posts/1Trqk5UjzU4 at FISL in Porto Alegre in Brazil ;)
<seb128> didrocks, thostr's "unity api weekly" email from today has most aimed at end of week 28, so next week
<seb128> didrocks, "location" for week 30 but that's a new one
<seb128> -session and -sound are mostly done, I'm about to test the new session her
<seb128> here
<Sweetshark> czajkowski: I guess you might be seeing andreas manke and others from the plone fanboys (who e.g. maintain the extension website for libreoffice) ...
<seb128> I expect that one will be an issue if the position is moved out of the corner :p
<didrocks> seb128: let's see then
<didrocks> yeah, for power :/
<Mirv> didrocks: could you (review/)upload that preNEW reviewed lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/qtsystems-opensource-src (https://launchpad.net/~canonical-qt5-edgers/+archive/qt5-beta2/+files/qtsystems-opensource-src_5.0%7Egit20130614.orig.tar.gz), or will I remind you later at some suitable time slot?
<didrocks> Mirv: I'll deal with it in a couple of hours
<didrocks> thanks
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, that as the first priority, and if possible also  lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/qtfeedback-opensource-src (https://launchpad.net/~canonical-qt5-edgers/+archive/qt5-beta2/+files/qtfeedback-opensource-src_5.0%7Egit20130529.orig.tar.gz) that was done by me and reviewed by Ken
<didrocks> oki
<Mirv> thanks a lot.
<didrocks> yw
<seb128> Mirv, btw did you see that I mentioned https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/ubuntu/saucy/qtdeclarative-opensource-src/merge/+merge/172054 and https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/ubuntu/saucy/qtwebkit-opensource-src/merge/+merge/172094 yesterday? could you have a look and ack those if you are fine with them?
<seb128> Mirv, no hurry, but since mitya put work in those it seems it would be good to have them merged ;-)
<Mirv> seb128: I may have missed those, will copy those links now and check. agreeing that good to have those merged.
<seb128> Mirv, thanks
<jibel> didrocks, http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Head/view/Unity8/, filing an RT to do the same on public instance
<larsu> seb128, didrocks: I'll fix it, there are already bugs turning up... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-datetime/+bug/1196650
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1196650 in indicator-datetime (Ubuntu) "Date-time indicator moved to the left after update" [Medium,Triaged]
<seb128> larsu, hey, how are you? you woke up at a normal hour today? ;-)
<seb128> larsu, yeah, ordering is acting weird ... btw I opted in for indicator-sound and session -ng ... weird to not have the session on the corner ;-)
<Laney> phew
<Laney> got it reading the background from accountsservice and updating when that changes
<seb128> Laney, is that a "finally managed to get that working" noise? ;-)
<seb128> nice!
<larsu> seb128: yeah, I've slept great last night :)
<larsu> seb128: session should be in the corner... can you send me a screenshot?
<larsu> seb128: you do have the new u-p-s, right?
<seb128> larsu, I've the new ups and [datetime-power-session-sound-tomboy-gsdkeyboard-sync-nmapplet-message-bluetooth"
<seb128> in that order
<seb128> larsu, is the screenshot likely to provide any extra info?
<seb128> larsu, you don't trust my text description? ;-)
<seb128> larsu, well, I'm using session-ng, and the ng stack is on the left of the old indicators, right?
<larsu> seb128: no screenshot necessary. I thought I put the ng stuff to the right... I need to check :)
<didrocks> jibel: thx!
<doomlord> does bzr have the equivalent of git bare repository support (for emulating a central server)
<larsu> doomlord: bzr branch --no-tree
<doomlord> found it, seems to work
<doomlord> dsomeone told me bzr cant do a server but i thought they were wrong :)
<kenvandine> tedg, upstart-app-launch is still failing in the same way
<kenvandine> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/143968873/buildlog_ubuntu-saucy-amd64.upstart-app-launch_0.1%2B13.10.20130702.1-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<kenvandine> the only think i can think of is that /sbin/initctrl.REAL doesn't really exist in the chroot
<tedg> kenvandine, I guess we can check the version?
<kenvandine> didrocks, i removed it from daily release long enough to get the stack published yesterday
<kenvandine> and added it back
<kenvandine> tedg, sure
<didrocks> kenvandine: ah great trick :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, i'm out today, after tedg gets another fixed merged, can you retry the stack?
<didrocks> kenvandine: sure!
<didrocks> kenvandine: not coming to meeting then? anything special to mention?
<didrocks> tedg: just ping me once you have a merged fix
<kenvandine> didrocks, not really
<kenvandine> i just updated the spreadsheet
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> thanks kenvandine and enjoy your day :)
<kenvandine> i wish i was taking the day off to enjoy.. mostly working on projects around the house :/
<kenvandine> not fun
<kenvandine> but i am going to lunch with my youngest that turned 5 today :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: oh, happy birthday from France then! :)
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> he can count to 10 in french :)
 * kenvandine can't though
<didrocks> still 5 years without having to learn more :p
 * kenvandine heads out, thanks guys!
<didrocks> see you kenvandine :)
<seb128> kenvandine, oh, you are out
<seb128> I guess I will need to track Laney for reviews :p
<seb128> I stacked a bunch of system settings one today
<kenvandine> seb128, do you have some waiting?
<seb128> kenvandine, have fun!
<kenvandine> sorry, no time to review them
<kenvandine> as tempting as it is :)
<seb128> kenvandine, yes, no worry, I'm going to try to see if Laney has time for some, tomorrow otherwise
<seb128> kenvandine, ttyl!
<Laney> heh
<Laney> seb128: yeah, can do after I MP mine
<seb128> thanks
<larsu> seb128: the ordering of your indicators is wrong because you don't have the position key in the indicator files yet, right?
<larsu> it works fine for me once I add those, so let me MR them ;)
<seb128> larsu, I don't know, I'm using trunk of the vcs branches I found
<seb128> larsu, but that's likely
<larsu> seb128: ya, this is too new. Good to know, it means its not a bug :)
<tedg> mterry, Is the plan for 13.10 to run the QML based greeter or the Cairo one?
<larsu> seb128: if you want it to work right now, add Position=20 to /usr/share/unity/indicators/com.canonical.indicator.datetime and Position=30 to com.canonical.indicator.power
<larsu> or just wait a day ;)
<seb128> larsu, how do I guess indicator-session on the corner?
<larsu> seb128: Position=10
<larsu> seb128: if you have session-ng
<larsu> seb128: the lower the position, the further it is at the edge
<mterry> tedg, I suspect the cairo one, because the qml one is based on same tech as unity8
<seb128> larsu, \o/
<mterry> tedg, plus, all the multi-user stuff isn't going to be ready for 13.10
<larsu> seb128: that means it works?
<seb128> larsu, session back into the corner yes ;-)
<larsu> seb128: nice. I'll make MRs for all of them
<seb128> larsu, \o/ and datetime back to a proper place
<seb128> great
<tedg> mterry, Hmm, okay.  Do you know if anyone is planning to work on the indicators there?
 * tedg thinks he may know the answer to that question already
<seb128> tedg, mterry: we discussed it yesterday, larsu said he would have a look
<tedg> K
<seb128> tedg, I guess ubiquity will have the same issue...
<larsu> seb128, ted: ya, I have half a patch already
<tedg> Hmm, perhaps.
<tedg> seb128, Do you know who to ping on that?  ev?
 * xnox shuffles feet.....
<seb128> tedg, xnox
<tedg> Oh, then I'll just consider it done :-)
<xnox> ev "passed" the honours to me....
<seb128> we briefly discussed it as well yesterday
<tedg> xnox, So we're moving to "new" indicators.  Basically one object with a param.
<tedg> Same lib, etc.
<tedg> It shouldn't be a big change.
<xnox> tedg: good for you =) i wish no changes are required on ubiquity side =)
<xnox> but honestly, ubiquity-dm needs a poke to see if either it's fake indicators break or stop working properly.
<tedg> didrocks, Not sure how to test this other than merging it and throwing it on the stack?  It works on Saucy.  https://code.launchpad.net/~ted/upstart-app-launch/initctl-version/+merge/172572
<xnox> tedg: seb128: larsu: can someone open a bug report or add "ubiquity" to an existing one of the affected packages?
<xnox> tedg: seb128: larsu: are any of qt/kde indicators affected or have they long dropped out of support?
<tedg> xnox, Is ubiquity using fake indicators or a fake panel?
<xnox> tedg: it has a fake panel, and it has combination of fake indicators and real ones.
<tedg> xnox, They had app indicators, which still work, but not the other side of things.
<xnox> I think it uses real keyboard, sound, network-manager.
<tedg> K, so it'll probably need to be migrated.
<larsu> seb128: which session branch are you running? It already has the position set...
<didrocks> Mirv: on qtsystems: do you want to ship the qml modules in the same package than the library ones?
<seb128> larsu, lp:~charlesk/indicator-session/ng-login1
<didrocks> as we separated them for most of the other ones
<tedg> xnox, We have built in tech in the new version to have different profiles in the standard indicators.  For instance, greeter, desktop, phone, etc.  One of those could be installer if need be.
<larsu> seb128: and you don't have Position=10 in /usr/share/unity/indicators/com.canonical.indicator.session?
<xnox> tedg: interesting.
<larsu> seb128: ARGH nevermind
<seb128> larsu, no I don't ;-)
<seb128> k
<larsu> bzr confused me
<didrocks> Mirv: the tarball is missing the license and exception files as well
<didrocks> seb128: pending on those 2, otherwise, qtsystems +1 for me ^
 * xnox ponders why I have icons in the global menus again.....
<seb128> didrocks, \o/
<seb128> xnox, oh, you noticed that as well?
<Laney> yeah me too
<seb128> larsu, attente: ^
<seb128> do you know what's going on there?
<didrocks> tedg: upload that to one of your ppa?
<tedg> didrocks, Ah, yes.  Okay.
<xnox> tedg: ubiquity has: input methods, accesibility, keyboard layouts, network manager, sound indicator, system indicator. Let me see how we launch them, and which are fake.
<Laney> https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/unity-gtk-module/icons/+merge/169858
<larsu> seb128, xnox: global menu has always had icons?!
<seb128> larsu, not for all items
<seb128> gtk dropped that 2 years ago
<seb128> they only use them for "objects"
<seb128> like bookmarkes
<larsu> seb128: right, same for us
<seb128> not in saucy
<tedg> Yeah, guessing that was unity-gtk-module adding icon support.
<seb128> every single item has an icon in e.g gedit/file
<tedg> It probably isn't checking the app setting.
<seb128> new, open, close, etc
<larsu> lol, true
<seb128> ;-)
<xnox> larsu: all I know I see 6 red shutdown icons in virt-manager's global menu, that I never saw before =)
<larsu> seb128: how do we differntiate between menu items that have icons and those that don't`
<larsu> desrt: ^^
<larsu> there's the menus-have-icons gsettings key
<desrt> good morning everyone
<desrt> uh oh
<larsu> that only goes for stock items?
<larsu> *icons
<seb128> desrt, good morning
<larsu> desrt: saucy has icons in menus where it shouldn't
<larsu> because unity-gtk-module puts them there as of recently
<desrt> fwiw, i consider the menus-have-icons key to be about verb icons
<desrt> erm
<larsu> right, but how can unity-gtk-module know which ones are nouns...
<desrt> does unity-gtk-module take icons out of GtkImageMenuItem and put them in the icon= attribute?
<larsu> attente: ^^
<larsu> it very much seems like it
<desrt> it should definitely not do that
<larsu> well, there might be ones its missing though, right?
<larsu> that's why I'm asking how we can differentiate
<desrt> i've been telling everyone to follow mpt's spec on this point
<seb128> larsu, https://developer.gnome.org/gtk3/3.0/GtkImageMenuItem.html#gtk-image-menu-item-get-always-show-image
<larsu> seb128: ah!
<larsu> seb128: awesome
 * larsu files a bug
<desrt> which means that probably the best way to find out if we have an image worth publishing is to see if the GtkMenuItem contains a box containing an image
<desrt> larsu: not so fast....
<mpt> desrt, if that text field is unnerving people, let me know and I'll put up a wireframe with it removed :-)
 * larsu slows down
<desrt> larsu: _always_ ignore GtkImageMenuItem
<desrt> this puts the image in the column where the checkbox would be
<desrt> this is always wrong
<desrt> so if apps are doing this for noun icons, they are already broken
<larsu> so then we might as well not show it
<desrt> we deprecated GtkImageMenuItem in gtk recently exactly because of this
<larsu> got it
<desrt> and are porting GtkRecentChooserMenu to use mpt-style noun icons instead
<desrt> which will work by being a box with an image and label in it
<desrt> if you find an icon like this, it ought to be published
<larsu> I think that's what attente is already doing. Haven't looked at the code though
<desrt> there will be no setting for disabling noun icons
<larsu> right
<desrt> (certainly i do not expect to honour the existing setting for this purpose.... if people **really** **really** hate icons, maybe we can add a new one)
<desrt> mpt: which text field, btw?
<mpt> desrt, the one inside the menu
<desrt> oh.  the search thing?
<mpt> yeah
<desrt> lol
<desrt> there are a lot of things in that wireframe that give people pause :)
<mpt> It's a bit of a cornucopia
<desrt> but i seem to have convinced everyone that you're in the right wrt. the treatment of icons
<mpt> \o/
<desrt> mpt: ya... people look at it and see "omg!  crack!"
<desrt> just because it's so dense
<xnox> desrt: mpt: what image are you talking about ? :)
<larsu> xnox: wiki.ubuntu.com/MenuLayout
<desrt> my favourite 5 words on this page: "that would be tastelessly inconsistent"
<desrt> such an mptism :)
<larsu> my favorite words on that page have been removed after the sound menu's icon got fixed
<seb128> hum
 * seb128 looks at pitti
<seb128> didrocks, pitti:
<seb128> Package: unity-services-dbgsym
<seb128> Depends: unity-2d-dbg (= 7.0.0daily13.06.24-0ubuntu2)
<seb128>  
<seb128> is that normal?
<desrt> unity -dbg packages?
<didrocks> interesting :)
<seb128> desrt, ?
<pitti> seb128: hm, I guess p-c-d could filter out dependencies to transitional -dbg packages
<seb128> didrocks, I guess that's because unity-2d-dbg is the only -dbg built by unity?
<didrocks> I have no idea, especially why the unity-2d ones :p
<seb128> pitti, ^
<desrt> seb128: just the other day you were complaining about how debian should get ddebs so we could get rid of all -dbg packages
<seb128> desrt, right, indeed
<pitti> seb128: p-c-d now skips creation of real -dbgsym packages and replaces them with dependencies to -dbg, to save space (request from infinity)
<desrt> so why does unity introduce -dbg packages?
<seb128> pitti, well, there is no unity-dbg
<seb128> I guess it means we don't have unity debug symbols atm :/
<pitti> well, p-c-d can't know that -- the source does build a -dbg
<seb128> right
<pitti> seb128: would you mind filing a bug about it?
<pitti> seb128: I think we can fix that by inspecting the -dbg package before depending on it
<seb128> pitti, on pkgbinarymangler ?
<pitti> seb128: pkg-create-dbgsym
<seb128> ah, of course
<pitti> merci
<pitti> funny corner cass
<pitti> cases
<pitti> scheduling for tomorrow morning
<seb128> didrocks, pitti: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pkg-create-dbgsym/+bug/1196995
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1196995 in pkg-create-dbgsym (Ubuntu) "Should skip transitionnal dummy packages" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> pitti, merci Ã  toi ! ;-)
<didrocks> pitti: seb128: thanks!
<jbicha> seb128: I think I've done about as much as I can for https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=703290
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 703290 in General "Split goa parts of libgdata into a separate .so" [Normal,New]
<seb128> jbicha, hey, thanks (clicking on it)
<jbicha> I think the library can be split but I don't have the technical skills to do it (or even continue arguing for it)
<seb128> jbicha, yeah, I think I will turn it off on armhf meanwhile if that's ok with you
<seb128> we don't have any usable armhf/saucy usable desktop anyway since the panda has no driver with the new xorg abi
<seb128> and the nexus would require a custom kernel
<mlankhorst> seb128: erm..
<seb128> mlankhorst, shush
<jbicha> seb128: oh that would have interesting consequences but Ubuntu GNOME doesn't officially support arm these days...
<seb128> mlankhorst, I'm simplifying on purpose, I just don't think that we have many GNOME remix arm users on saucy
<mlankhorst> nah
<seb128> not enough to justify the tradeoff of pulling the gtk stack including webkitgtk on the touch image
<mlankhorst> indeed
<larsu> attente, xnox, seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-gtk-module/+bug/1196998
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1196998 in Unity GTK+ module "Icons for verb actions appear in the global menu" [Medium,Confirmed]
<attente> hmm..
<seb128> larsu, danke
<larsu> de rien
<mlankhorst> if you want it just get raring and upgrade to saucy somehow
<seb128> qengho, mlankhorst, Sweetshark, Laney, tkamppeter, attente, desrt, larsu: hey, it's meeting time
 * Sweetshark greets from the pool at the 10 level above Porto Alegre ...
<seb128> is that a joke? ;-)
<seb128> qengho_, hey, around? your turn ;-)
<seb128> no qengho_...
<seb128> mlankhorst, hey
 * seb128 has the feeling not a lot of people around today
<Sweetshark> seb128: not quite, im sitting next to the pool ;) (Im here for FISL and needed to clear the room for the maid)
<mlankhorst> kernel madness
<mlankhorst> merge window stuff
<seb128> lol, oh ok ;-)
<mlankhorst> eod
<seb128> mlankhorst, thanks ... how is the new xorg testing going?
<seb128> mlankhorst, did you get any news from RAOF on the Mir side of things?
<mlankhorst> should be complete, I think raof is ok with it but he was looking into a bug
<seb128> mlankhorst, ok, let's see how that goes
<seb128> mlankhorst, thanks
<seb128> Sweetshark, your turn, how is it next to the pool?
<Sweetshark> MIRs libzip/liborcus
<Sweetshark> libzip seems to be ftbfs on saucy, ohjoy
<Sweetshark> flight to porto alegre, preparing talks and sessions for FISL14: https://plus.google.com/109302841731362777691/posts
<Sweetshark> updated and prepared some precise (3.5.7) patches and raring (4.0.4) SRU candidates to PPA
<Sweetshark> EOF -- pool is nice, but its winter here ;)
<seb128> oh, right
<seb128> Sweetshark, I will try to track the MIRs/sponsoring
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
<seb128> enjoy the conference!
<seb128> Laney, hey
<Laney> hi
<Laney> â¢ Package gnome-desktop-testing for Debian and make glib in SVN use it to run its installed-tests autopkgtest (the 112 installed tests pass, somewhat surprisingly)
<Laney> â¢ Couple of GNOME updates.
<Laney> â¢ Test X 1.14. Discover small bug that media keys don't work due to an XI version bump not being handled by our g-s-d. Cherry-pick patch to fix this.
<Laney> â¢ Various system-settings merges - add some dummy panels and some more detailed UI.
<Laney> â¢ background panel: Use gsettings-qt to get background in use.
<Laney> â¢ background panel: Propose merge to talk to accountsservice over D-Bus for the "welcome" image (the spreadsheet says this lives here). Involved learning some Qt and figuring out how to use it to talk to D-Bus, and how to connect to D-Bus signals.
<Laney> â¢ DMB: Regular meeting. Push some more on the proposal to grant upload rights without granting full project membership. Call a vote on one point of minor disagreement. We're getting there slowly.
<larsu> gsettings-qt \o/
<Laney> quality code right there
<seb128> ;-)
<Laney> must have come from red hat or something
 * larsu is happy that everyone likes it
 * Laney runs
<seb128> Laney, great, I'm looking forward to your "use dbus from qt" example ;-)
<larsu> haha
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<tkamppeter>  - Release cups-filters 1.0.35, fixed many bugs and implemented many feature requests.
<tkamppeter>  - General bug fixes.
<tkamppeter>  - Development on cups-filters towards PPD-less printing on IPP printers.
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<seb128> attente, hey
<attente> seb128, hi
<attente> filed some MPs for changes that indicator-keyboard will need
<attente> spent some time writing and debugging the test fixture for indicator keyboard
<attente> going to finish up writing tests, which should be done today
<attente> eof
<seb128> thanks
<desrt> <attente> got stuck for a few hours on a bug that was desrt's fault ...
<seb128> new ibus is on my list of things to look at this week
<seb128> I hope that we can unblock things then
<attente> seb128, thanks
<qengho_> seb128: I'm ready.
<seb128> attente,  once you feel like you are done with the desktop version it would be good to start at looking how we can make that work on the touch image
<jbicha> I think it was unclear whether it was safer/better to land the whole ibus/indicator-keyboard stack at once
<seb128> jbicha, well, our gsd doesn't use ibus atm
<seb128> so I don't think ibus 1.5 has the potential to break a lot there
<seb128> out of regressions in ibus itself
<seb128> but if we have some, landing the other bits will not help with those...
<seb128> I still need to email -devel to check that other flavors are fine with ibus 1.5
<seb128> and to get input from the people using/knowing ibus
<seb128> (Debian is still on 1.4)
<seb128> attente, thanks
<seb128> qengho_, hey, your turn ;-)
<qengho_> - chromium-browser updated for all arch and releases. About to update again in an hour to include webapps patches and fix saucy menu.
<qengho_> - working on ARM Neon support by way of runtime checks. Current build has Neon instuctions, which is Bad.
<qengho_> EOF
<seb128> qengho_, thanks, good job on getting chromium updated
<seb128> desrt, hey
<qengho_> seb128: thanks. Only broke two things!
<desrt> seb128: hey
<desrt> i spent most of yesterday celebrating the multi-lingual nature of my home and native land, on canada day, by speaking esperanto
<desrt> (read: holiday)
<desrt> last week i did some more docing
 * larsu saw desrt fixing bugs yesterday
<desrt> i fixed the suspend-during-shutdown issue that you were having with systemd-shim by disabling the inactivity timeout during the shutdown sequence (testing appreciated)
<seb128> (on my list still ;)
<desrt> i did a patch to accountsservice last week to conditionalise the craziness that they have for detecting user vs. system accounts (which is only really needed for fedora where they used to have user accounts in 500-1000 range and now create system accounts here)
<desrt> ...and it's turned _off_ by default
<desrt> i fixed an annoying bug in gdbus that was causing will problems (caused by the async property stuff that i landed, which was needed for that other accounts service patch)
<desrt> i did GPropertyAction which is something that we've been wanting for a long time
<desrt> and this morning i'm putting the finishing touches on the GIO support for the "extra application actions" .desktop file thing (aka jumplists)
<desrt> landing that patch will let me close the two bugs for both the extra actions support and the dbus activating applications support (hopefully by end of day or tomorrow)
<desrt> eof
<desrt> oh
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<desrt> might be worth cherry-picking that dbus async bugfix into the distro, fwiw
<desrt> since it's blocking attente
<Laney> when's the next release?
<desrt> next monday?
<larsu> desrt: when will the jumplist stuff land? I'll be working on indicator-messages soonish and it'd be cool if I had that
<desrt> larsu: i hope to land it today or tomorrow
<Laney> ah, then yeah
 * larsu is willing to review, of course
<desrt> larsu: nice!
<desrt> i have some reviews already from jasper, alex, mclasen
<desrt> but i was slow about replying to them
<larsu> ah cool
<larsu> that should be good enough ;)
<desrt> but after i push a new patch a final review would be nice
<larsu> sure
<desrt> (they raised some good points that i am currently addressing)
<larsu> just send the bug # to me once you have that
<desrt> Lanet: https://git.gnome.org/browse/glib/commit/?id=cb4469600c5146a48501a31e9a3fb9bfc261477d is the fix, btw
<desrt> larsu: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=664444
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 664444 in gio "Support additional application actions in .desktop files" [Enhancement,Unconfirmed]
<desrt> Laney: not Lanet, sorry :)
<desrt> (really eof now)
<seb128> desrt, thanks ;-)
<seb128> larsu, your turn
<larsu> - gsettings-qt: add testing
<larsu> - more unitymenumodel work last week [postponed for unity indicator bugs]
<larsu> - indicator-sound: some fixes after reviews, but more coming
<larsu> - unity-panel-service/libindicator: fixes for new indicators, allow sorting them correctly
<larsu> - unbreak indicator-session's high cpu/memory usage
<larsu> - unity-greeter: support for new indicators [ongoing]
<larsu> eof
<desrt> larsu: i understand that this cpu/memory bug in the indicator was really our fault
<desrt> but why does the new accountsservice cause so many problems when the old one didn't?
<desrt> are they just constantly spamming the bus with signals now or something?
<larsu> desrt: I guess so?!
<desrt> might be worth looking into that more....
<larsu> ya
<desrt> can you take a look?
<seb128> well, at least with the indicator-session fix the crazyness stopped ;-)
<larsu> I'm not aware of any changes to indicator-session recently, so it must be that
<seb128> before it was constant bus spamming
<seb128> larsu, thanks
<seb128> ok, my turn ;-)
<seb128>  * got to the bottom of the gtk on armhf issue, gcc issue, upstream has a patch being tested
<seb128>  * updated accountsservice to the current version, including desrt patches needed for the greeter work
<seb128>  * debugged accountsservice breakages after testing the updates, the issues were already in saucy and due to the patch to support pin login
<seb128>   * keep working on system settings, random UI tweak, first version of the sound UI, looked at qtsystem and how to write a qt plugin and connect that to qml (so we can do stuff like read files content), played with qt-gsettings (thanks larsu!)
<seb128>  * some desktop bugs fixing (friday evening fun after the new indicators landed, breaking some things on the way)
<seb128>  * some desktop updates in saucy
<seb128>  * some desktop SRUs (fixed guest session inhibition of screen locking)
<seb128>  * some NEW reviews for new packages in touch
<seb128>  * tested new indicators a bit
<seb128> </week>
<larsu> desrt: ya, I'll have a look
<seb128> Laney, I would really appreciate some settings reviews, I'm stacking merge requests and it's no fun to handle :p
<Laney> yeah I'm looking right now
<seb128> oh, also I noticed that rhythmbox takes 10 seconds to start here
<seb128> seems like the g-s-d mediakey plugin GetAll() method is taking a while
<seb128> d-feet hangs the same way when I call it from here
<seb128> if somebody feels like looking at that :p
<seb128> Laney, thanks ;-)
<seb128>  
<seb128> other comments/questions/notes...?
<seb128> did I forget anyone? ;-)
<seb128> ok, seems not
<seb128> thanks everyone
<seb128> didrocks, your turn ;-)
<didrocks> thanks seb128 ;)
<Laney> thanks
<didrocks> robru: Mirv: cyphermox: hey guys! Today will be a short meeting with just us :) how are you?
<Mirv> o/
<tedg> didrocks, Hmph, can't use a PPA because without a release the diff.gz can't have an execute permission.
<cyphermox> good, you?
<chrisccoulson> can i gatecrash your meeting?
<Mirv> fine here. small meeting :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: at the end? maybe? :)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<czajkowski> so running Saucy on the X1 not getting very good battery life for those that were asking.
<didrocks> tedg: just bump the version
<didrocks> cyphermox: I'm fine thanks :)
<didrocks> Mirv: cyphermox: let's start without robru
<didrocks> I hope this time he will joinâ¦
<tedg> didrocks, Ha, okay.
<didrocks> Mirv: mind speaking about your items? (enjoyed your holidays ;)?)
<didrocks> Mirv: you have 3 from the spreadsheet
<Mirv> didrocks: yeah, enjoyed :) so various qt modules ready for either upload or testing, qtpim I just updated again to a newer snapshot as renato is continuing to push changes to upstream
<Mirv> qt creator is the main item right now, JP has been hard at work in updating the plugin so it should be fine now for integrating into the proper packaging
<didrocks> Mirv: update to 5.0.2?
<Mirv> (the PPA packages are more ad-hoc in a way that suits developing the plugin not as a patch but as itself)
<Mirv> updates to current 5.0.2 packages include qtbase (call for testing still open) and qtdeclarative (was uploaded during my vacation)
<didrocks> yeah, you are merging back what's need to be merged, isn't it?
<Mirv> 5.1 is near final release but not yet done, I'd update the 5.1 beta PPA packages to final ones for those that continue to make use of those
<didrocks> I had to update for unblocking the webcred stack :)
<didrocks> great! and let's stick to our plan: 5.1.1 for saucy
<Mirv> yes, mitya57 had now continued my merges from Debian, which is very nice
<didrocks> yep :)
<didrocks> Mirv: btw, I had few comments on qtsystems (see backlog), mind having a look (maybe tomorrow morning)?
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, I'll see to those
<robru> didrocks, ok, I am here, sorry
<didrocks> thanks Mirv :)
<didrocks> robru: no worry!
<Mirv> btw regarding Qt 5.1 we'd still need the QPA plugin work, so hopefully in time for 5.1.1 release in August or so
<didrocks> will be quite short for feature freeze
<didrocks> but let's see how it goesâ¦ do they take time to release a .1 version?
<Mirv> they will definitely release a .1
<Mirv> but if not we should consider 5.1 instead
<Mirv> with backported patches etc
<didrocks> ok, at least, we'll have some time to see the 5.1 state
<didrocks> and decide from their
<didrocks> Mirv: sdk tests failing, any progress?
<Mirv> didrocks: I hope Kaleo would look now during his timezone, during European daytime there wasn't anyone who knew what to do
<didrocks> ok, let's put hope on him. As he had good testing principles, I think he'll fix those first :)
<didrocks> thanks Mirv
<Mirv> thanks
<didrocks> cyphermox: I just see one task you are responsible for: "Fix indicator-network and re-enable it for the indicator stack tests", is everything's ok now?
<cyphermox> yes, everything appears fine, I was just about to send a MR to re-enable it
<didrocks> cyphermox: great, phew! :-)
<didrocks> cyphermox: FYI, sil2100 isn't around this week, so look at your stack closely, I've handled the indicators stack today, but now, it's all ours again :) (and HUD)
<didrocks> cyphermox: anything else, do you need help on anything particular?
<cyphermox> not really
<didrocks> ok :)
<didrocks> robru: so, you are leading the effort on ensuring that all components that are not releasing daily are now under that process (you can see that tedg is adding new ones dailyâ¦), how is it going?
<robru> didrocks, not well. this week has been very stressful for me as I learned that a close friend of mine passed away, and I have been struggling with grief.
<didrocks> robru: argh, good luck dude :/
<robru> didrocks, however I did achieve daily releasing for many of the webapps, and also did the bulk of the work for friends-app (completing the friends stack), which is close to landing
<didrocks> robru: excellent! also, remember you are not alone on that one, please send email/harass people (divide the work ;))
<robru> didrocks, who am I able to harass about this?
<Saviq> pitti, bug #1055110 happened to me just now on saucy (under sudo), is it me doing something stupid or is that a valid bug?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1055110 in apport (Ubuntu) "apport-retrace crashed with AttributeError in join(): 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'endswith'" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1055110
<didrocks> Saviq: meeting
<Saviq> didrocks, nope :P
<Saviq> didrocks, at least I don't know about any meeting I'm supposed to attend?
<didrocks> robru: the ones we listed in the next column on the spreadsheet
<robru> didrocks, ok
<didrocks> Saviq: we are in a meeting right now, please wait for few minutes :)
<didrocks> robru: thanks, a good luck again :)
<robru> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> last itemâ¦
<didrocks> I updated the current state for "cleaning the packages" (line 11) on the spreadsheet
<didrocks> robru: Mirv: cyphermox: can you look at what's remaining again and see if you still have some to do from your stacks? ^
<robru> didrocks, ok
<cyphermox> aye
<didrocks> I would love that the new packages + that cleaning being done by next week
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, will recheck
<didrocks> so that we can cross those 2 ones :)
<didrocks> thanks guys! any questions? I think we can cut here if not :)
<Mirv> nope
<cyphermox> oh actually
<didrocks> yeah?
<robru> didrocks, where is everybody? why such a small meeting?
<cyphermox> I'd just need help with review for a smallish SRU fix for indicator-session -> https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/indicator-session/logind-multiple-session-lp861171/+merge/172118
<didrocks> Mirv: btw, we'll handle probably a compiz transition this week, just a warning :) (from the old version to latest trunk)
<didrocks> robru: ken just gave notice he had an appointment, and sil2100 is on holidays
<robru> ah
<cyphermox> ^ I said SRU because it does need to be fixed; however I'd like it to be correctly fixed in saucy as well
<didrocks> cyphermox: do you know if the GMenuified version landed?
<didrocks> (saucy)
<didrocks> charles: ^
<charles> indicator-session has not landed yet but should be very shortly
<cyphermox> no, it doesn't see mto be the case
<charles> today / tomorrow
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, sounds good
<didrocks> (and yeah, it's a good SRU candidate) :)
<didrocks> cyphermox: maybe let's wait for the saucy version to land? then, we backport that as a SRU?
<didrocks> (backport == use that different version)
<charles> that patch can't go as-is into the gmenuified version, I'll need to tweak it for trunk
<charles> backport, though
<robru> didrocks, ok, I am gonna grab breakfast and then dive into all the stuff I am behind on. thanks!
<didrocks> robru: enjoy your breakfast, and thanks Mirv :)
<didrocks> cyphermox: charles: let's plan on that, please ping me once that one lands in saucy and we'll handle the SRU (I'll approve the bug and we'll do a SRU release)
<didrocks> thanks cyphermox as well ;)
<Mirv> didrocks: thanks! :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson wanted to gatecrash? :p
<didrocks> tedg: so normally, I just .0 or .1 the current version, then split mode works magically ;)
<charles> didrocks: okay. I think lars said that seb128 is testing out the gmenu i-session today too
<seb128> I am
<charles> so maybe I should ping seb128 to see if seb128 finds any issues
<tedg> didrocks, Yeah, still not used to the split mode craziness ;-)
<charles> ok
<seb128> charles, didrocks, cyphermox: it shouldn't land before unity-greeter learns about gmenumodel indicators though
<didrocks> charles: seb128: great!
<seb128> otherwise there is no way to turn off the computer from the greeter anymore
<didrocks> tedg: it's working very well ;)
<tedg> didrocks, It's trying again now
<didrocks> seb128: ah, good point!
<charles> seb128: in gnome 3, that's not a bug, that's a feature
<seb128> charles, ;-)
<didrocks> really? gdm doesn't allow that?
<didrocks> or is it just trolling? :)
 * charles was making a joke about the hidden 'power off' button
<didrocks> oh right
<tedg> didrocks, Is there a difference between GNOME 3 features and trolling?  ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, they originally masked "power off" to just have suspend
<didrocks> tedg: tsssss ;)
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, didn't connect to that context
<seb128> ;-)
<charles> iirc you had to hold down the shift or alt button or something for it to become visible?
<seb128> right
<jbicha> now it's the opposite, Power Off is visible but suspend hides until you press Alt (or you can just close your laptop lid)
 * didrocks still restoring his thunderbird emailsâ¦
<tedg> didrocks, I need to go here in a few, and I know it's getting to your EOD, this is the build that's testing that.  If it passes, we're good: https://launchpad.net/~ted/+archive/ppa/+build/4764602
<gregier_> can someone help me with https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-themes/+bug/1171587
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1171587 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "update to GTK 3.9 and the issues to resolve for it" [Wishlist,New]
<gregier_> I tried to apply the same changes as was done in the gnome theme but I just made it much, much worse
<didrocks> tedg: ok, feel free to switch the main "approve" if it pass on the MP, I'll just comment
 * tedg thinks the version numbers are so big on the daily packages now that didrocks must secretly be from Texas.
<didrocks> tedg: I learnt that from you! :-)
 * charles wonders what the fireworks are like on July 4 in Texas
<charles> big, probably
<didrocks> charles: I think it's a pretty accurate adjective :)
<xnox> tedg: in upstart user session, Can I run panel with indicatores, without launcher nor hud nor dash?
<tedg> xnox, You will be able to once we're there.  You'll just need to emit the event to start the services when you're ready.
<tedg> xnox, But today even, it's dbus activation, so you should be fine.
<xnox> tedg: but i don't want the launcher visible at all.
<xnox> tedg: point being that instead of loading ubiquity-dm, we auto-login into a normal user session on the desktop but stop after indicators and simply launch ubiquity (thus having a memory minimal environment which still looks like ubuntu)
<xnox> tedg: and if user clicks "try ubuntu", close ubiquity and continue loading the rest of the desktop session.
<xnox> tedg: you can see the lengths I am prepared to go for, instead of patching indicators in ubiquity-dm yet again =)
<tedg> xnox, Heh, so it would seem like it.  Though I'm not sure i have all the cases in my head.
<tedg> xnox, For instance, if you started the indicators, there's no reason Unity wouldn't pick them up when it gets started.
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hey, around?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i am
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I have a small issue with thunderbird, lost a lot of messages, I think they are almost all marked as deleted
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: when I'm looking the files content, the emails are there
<didrocks> but even when restoring an old backup, I think the server synchronization remark them as deleted
<didrocks> do you know how I can force them to undelete? (either by GUI or changing the files)
<didrocks> I try just restoring, but as said, unsuccessfully, I saw some tricks about X-Mozilla-Status, but it doesn't seem to match (even on an old directory, I have it just for few)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, if they're marked as deleted, shouldn't they appear in the trash?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: the trash seems to be empty
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I didn't compact folders on purpose
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: but I can try restoring an old version, I had "clean trash on exit"
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: so removing this option, restoring an old version, waiting for the server to synchronize and restoring from Trash?
<didrocks> this will restore in old folders?
<didrocks> all*
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure. if i have an issue like this, i normally try deleting the index files for the mailbox (.msf files)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I tried that for some folders
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you mean, on the desktop, right, not the server?
<seb128> Laney, thanks for the reviews ;-)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, on the desktop
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: so yeah, tried that, then it's resynced from the server and removed
<didrocks> I just saw the old emails them briefly
<didrocks> -them
<Laney> np
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: would you have any idea or other trick I can apply?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, not at the moment. is this gmail btw?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: no, it's the canonical server still (having maildrop)
<qengho_> ogra_: is all ARMHF we support now v7 ?
<ogra_> yes
<ogra_> armHF always was v7 only
<qengho_> Okay, removing a condition that excluded Lucid-
<ogra_> armel was v5
<qengho_> thx.
<Sweetshark> lol: https://twitter.com/Sweetshark1/status/352127717690458112
<cyphermox> nice.
<sarnold> haha :)
<chrisccoulson> Sweetshark, hah ;)
<Sweetshark> oh, wow. somebody created that twitter account just for me.
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-07-03
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> Good morning!
<RAOF> pitti: Do you regularly run umockdev tests under valgrind? It seems to generate a *lot* of âpossibly lostâ
<pitti> RAOF: I haven't so far; I guess I should start to do so
<pitti> RAOF: yesterday I fixed a bug about leaking an udev_device in uevent synthesis
<pitti> (pointed out by alf)
<RAOF> It might not be your fault; g_type_register_fundamental shows up a lot.
<pitti> RAOF: otherwise I'm aware of leaking the fdmaps in the preload, as there is no obvious way when to clean them up
<pitti> RAOF: do you get leaks in the "client" application (running under the preload lib), or from the test suite (using the umockdev API)?
<pitti> presumably the latter, but the former probably also has some leaks
<RAOF> Actually, I'm doing both in the same process.
<pitti> the preload doesn't use glib, though
<pitti> RAOF: anyway, using valgrind sounds like a good idea
<didrocks> hey Mirv! today, I'll let you for the stacks that needs manual publication? I need to catch up on other work today :)
<pitti> RAOF: btw, did you run with G_DEBUG=gc-friendly ? in standard mode, glib's slice allocator will confuse the hell out of valgrind
<pitti> RAOF: actually, I think it's G_SLICE=always-malloc
 * RAOF tries
<pitti> hm, why don't I get a valgrind report
<pitti> ah, it uses LD_PRELOAD itself, so I need to swap this around
<pitti> I don't see alf's reported udev_device leak, though
<pitti> "valgrind --leak-check=full make check" gives me a leak in make, but nothing else
<RAOF> pitti: Whereas I still get a whole bunch of possibly-lost even with G_SLICE=always-malloc
<pitti> RAOF: right, I think I know what's wrong; umockdev-run sests LD_PRELOAD instead of extending it, fixing now
<pitti> I'm trying to run the test suite through valgrind, which ought to report at least one known leak (I reverted the fix)
<RAOF> Heh. And I'm seeing that because I don't actually use umockdev-run
<pitti> RAOF: ok, I see those as well now
<RAOF> Excellent.
<pitti> vala_main(), some g_param_type bits in gobject_init_ctor, etc.
<pitti> they go away with G_SLICE=debug-blocks G_DEBUG=gc-friendly
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, will check
<pitti> RAOF: ^
<pitti> RAOF: hm, umockdev_testbed_clear() was added in 0.2.6 already and is in saucy
<pitti> RAOF: but I indeed don't get that in devhelp, I'll investiage
<pitti> RAOF: argh, forgot to add those to the doc index, sorry
<RAOF> Heh.
<pitti> something to add to the test suite, too
<pitti> it's a shame that gtk-doc doesn't play along well with automake 1.13 any more
<pitti> RAOF: do the above help?
<RAOF> pitti: They didn't seem to.
<pitti> RAOF: I added a "make check-valgrind" target now, and I don't get the gobject-y leaks with those
<pitti> I do get leaks from ioctl_tree*
<RAOF> âLD_PRELOAD=libumockdev-preload.so.0 G_SLICE=debug-blocks G_DEBUG=gc-friendly valgrind --leak-check=full bin/unit-tests --gtest_filter=UdevWrapper\*â is what I'm running.
<pitti> that looks fairly similar to mine
<pitti> G_SLICE=debug-blocks G_DEBUG=gc-friendly LD_LIBRARY_PATH=.libs/ LD_PRELOAD=libumockdev-preload.so valgrind --leak-check=full --show-possibly-lost=no -q tests/test-umockdev-vala
<RAOF> Ah, you're not showing possibly lost.
<pitti> ah, no
<RAOF> That's what I've been seeing.
<pitti> I get tons of possibly lost in glib's slab allocator
<pitti> RAOF: https://wiki.gnome.org/Valgrind might help, there are some suppression files there
<pitti> hm, all pretty old, though
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel!
<jibel> Bonjour didrocks !
<Laney> g'morning
<seb128> Laney, howdy
<didrocks> hey Laney, seb128!
<seb128> good morning everyone ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, lut
<seb128> how are you guys?
<Laney> I've been looking for holiday apartments in lyon/grenoble ;-)
<didrocks> trying to use tricks to recover some emails
<seb128> didrocks, still fighting with lost emails? are they still on the server?
<didrocks> seb128: they are only locally
<didrocks> seb128: spent until 11PM yesterday for that :(
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> going to push you over gmail?
<didrocks> seb128: I just hate thunderbird a little bit more, yeah :)
<seb128> weird bug though
<didrocks> seb128: I would use gmail if they enable filtering over X- headers
<didrocks> maybe with google apps script, this would be possible
<seb128> you can probably do without it, at least for bugmails
<seb128> since the reason is stated in full text at the bottom for the email as well
<didrocks> well, I tried first at filtering on other things for bugmails
<seb128> you can probably filter on that
<didrocks> but the sentence is changing so muchâ¦
<seb128> ok...
<didrocks> if you are the direct assignee
<didrocks> or assignee because of the team is
<didrocks> and other stuffâ¦
<didrocks> it's a mess filtering on this
<didrocks> at least, I have an idea to recover inbox, sent mails and ML
<Laney> I'm suddenly glad I leave mine on the server ...
<seb128> it's still really weird that a bug went to delete emails like that
<seb128> Laney, well, that's imap, is there any other way?
<didrocks> yep, like if the settings "remove all emails > 30 days" was set
<didrocks> (but at least, it didn't compact the folders automatically)
<seb128> didrocks, you use imap?
<didrocks> yep
<seb128> yeah, really weird :/
<seb128> didrocks, did you try asking #is if they have backups they can restore?
<didrocks> seb128: well, I guess this will loose my recent emails in that case
<seb128> right
<seb128> but you could try to copy those locally
<seb128> then ask #is if they can restore the backups
<didrocks> I'm doing something similar, but the other way around with a fake pop account
<mlankhorst> seb128: looks like RAOF is ok with flipping the switch on x1.14 now
<seb128> mlankhorst, great!
<mlankhorst> so do itt
<seb128> RAOF, confirming?
<RAOF> Yup, should be ok.
<seb128> mlankhorst, well, check with didrocks' team since that needs to synchronize with unity
<seb128> RAOF, mlankhorst: thanks
<didrocks> mlankhorst: did you fix the issue of the transition?
<didrocks> like not being able upgrade xorg 1.14 without taking the new unity?
<mlankhorst> didrocks: I still feel it's a bad to have an interdependency between the 2
<mlankhorst> idea*
<didrocks> mlankhorst: it's not an interdependency, the new xorg breaks old unity, we should avoid people having half an update
<didrocks> breaking them silently is worse
<mlankhorst> didrocks: I feel if anything it should be a conflicts in unity then for xserver-xorg-core < 1.14
<seb128> you can retro-actively change old unity versions
<seb128> can't*
<didrocks> yeah, if people don't take the latest upgrade, they would be broken in a bad transitions
<seb128> what's the issue have the new xorg using a Breaks on old unity?
<Laney> Breaks seems ok to me
<didrocks> I told you, the only correct way is the Breaks
<Laney> you can drop it after saucy
<mlankhorst> ok
<didrocks> mlankhorst: on the other hand, unity will dep on a new library, right?
<didrocks> so we can't force newer unity with old xorg?
<mlankhorst> yeah I added an explicit depends for that
<didrocks> excellent, so both ways are handled
<didrocks> I saw that Mirv just published unity
<didrocks> so then once xorg is in proposed, we can get brandon's branch merged
<didrocks> running the tests
<didrocks> and publish
<mlankhorst> I'll add a breaks in xserver for old libxi/libxfixes too then
<didrocks> Mirv: mind taking care of that ^ (sil2100 did try last week, but the timing was bad)
<didrocks> mlankhorst: I think it makes sense, yeah
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, i'm good thanks. and you?
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson!
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks
 * didrocks almost finished to hate thunderbird :p
<didrocks> ah, or maybe noâ¦
<didrocks> "a folder with this name already exists, please choose another one"
<didrocks> but I just clicked on "delete"!
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, it still exists in the mailbox unless you've removed it from the trash as well (assuming you haven't done that yet)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: no, the trash was automatically emptied on exit, so it's removed
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: but the mails were still on the files, I had to recover them by faking a pop account
<didrocks> and now copying from one to the other one
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, but which brandon's branch exactly?
<didrocks> Mirv: bschaefer (without typos \o/)
<Mirv> I only saw lp:~brandontschaefer/unity/show-desktop-fix as being proposed for unity
<seb128> Laney, just for info I looked at your background's panel MR, I'm going to add some comments but not approve it since Ive questions similars to yours ... I would like Ken or some of the UITK guys to comment as well (especially if we use that one as an example on how to do things for other plugins)
<didrocks> ah, branch
<didrocks> hum, not that one
<Mirv> not which brandon, yes, but branch :)
<Laney> seb128: yeah good, I thought I'd put it up for discussion
<didrocks> Mirv: I would say https://code.launchpad.net/~brandontschaefer/unity/move-pointer-barrier-to-xi-1.6.99.1
<Mirv> yeah, just saw that, on hold currently. ok..
<didrocks> Mirv: it's on hold due to new xorg needed I guess :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, done by the file system directly, much more effective :)
<didrocks> I think I finally recovered my most important emails and ML \o/
<mlankhorst> didrocks: I'm testing if I can grab libxi/xfixes from debian unstable atm
<Mirv> I'll monitor when the xorg gets in
<seb128> mlankhorst, do you have everything ready for upload otherwise?
<mlankhorst> seb128: I was doing some final checks, and noticed that the libxi/fixes were missing the security updates, instead of doing another manual merge I'm looking if the versions from debian unstable work
<mlankhorst> in which case we'd be in sync with debian again too
<seb128> mlankhorst, ok
<seb128> mlankhorst, let me know if you need help for uploads
<mlankhorst> seems they build.. testing
<mlankhorst> seb128: is there a tool to pull debian packages completely unmodified and stuff them in a ppa?
<seb128> mlankhorst, not that I know of, maybe Laney knows a trick though
<Laney> mlankhorst: seb128: yes, backportpackage should let you do this
<Laney> IIRC anyway
<Laney> mlankhorst: try: backportpackage -s unstable -d saucy -u ppa:mlankhorst/ppa mycoolpackage
<Laney> you can put -b -B sbuild/pbuilder in there too to test-build locally before uploading
<mlankhorst> Laney: that adds a string to version number :(
<Laney> what's wrong with that?
<Laney> that's what you want for PPA uploads isn't it?
<mlankhorst> it's meant to be copied to -proposed
<Laney> if it's a sync you can easily re-copy it
<Laney> infact if it's a sync you can use copy-package instead of backportpackage to put it in your PPA
<Laney> sorry, forgot about that one
<Laney> that's from bzr branch lp:ubuntu-archive-tools
<mlankhorst> Laney: thanks, copy package works
<Laney> np
<Laney> I didn't give you the invocation because it's pretty hard to remember :P
<mlankhorst> that's why it took so long to respond
<mlankhorst>  ./copy-package -d debian -s sid --to-distribution=ubuntu --to-suit=saucy --to-ppa=canonical-x --to-ppa-name=x-staging libxfixes
<Laney> that's probably the tool to use to copy it from the ppa to proposed too
<mlankhorst> seems to have ignored the thing --tos-uit due to typo, meh :p
<mlankhorst> at least it builds in saucy so I don't care
<Laney> yeah you probably want --to-suite=saucy-proposed ...
<seb128> mlankhorst, so, what is missing at this point to be able to start uploading?
<mlankhorst> seb128: I need to know the final version number of the first unity that will support the pointer barriers, so I can add the breaks to xorg-server
<Laney> you can do <= current-one?
<seb128> mlankhorst, didrocks said they would bump the changelog, so << 7.0.2
<mlankhorst> ok
<seb128> Laney, that doesn't work fine with daily releases
<seb128> didrocks, ^ can you confirm << 7.0.2?
<Laney> why?
<didrocks> yep 7.0.2
<Laney> oh the hard lock got me applications back in the home lens
<seb128> Laney, well, I guess it works if you make sure you coordinate unity patch landing
<seb128> Laney, but it's easier to bump changelog that to play "guess the daily that will land with the patch"
<mlankhorst> ok, final breaks will be
<mlankhorst>  unity (<< 7.0.2),
<mlankhorst>  libxfixes3 (<< 1:5.1),
<mlankhorst>  libxi6 (<< 2:1.7.1.901),
<seb128> +1
<mlankhorst> waiting on the builds to xi/xfixes builds to finish, then I'll upload the final xorg-server
<seb128> great
<seb128> mlankhorst, let me know when the xorg side is ready, I will try the ppa with a custom unity build locally and then we can upload xorg
<mlankhorst> ok
<seb128> thanks
<mlankhorst> you should be able to test the unity build already, just make sure it has a break on xserver-xorg-core << 2:1.14, and a hard depends on the libxi/libxfixes in the x-staging ppa (and corresponding -dev packages)
<seb128> mlankhorst, well, I want to test the ppa once it's in "ready for upload" state, but it will have a break on unity << 7.0.2  so I will need that version of unity
<mlankhorst> seb128: server build incoming, then
<mlankhorst> seb128: it should be ok to test as soon as it's uploaded
<seb128> mlankhorst, "uploaded"? you mean it's done building, it needs to be published?
<mlankhorst> oh, that's fast
 * mlankhorst was getting a drink
<mlankhorst> oops I messed up the dep
<seb128> :-(
<mlankhorst> retry
<Laney> seb128: up for a little bit of NEWing (gnome-desktop-testing)?
<seb128> Laney, can do
<Laney> sweet
 * Laney goes to upload
<davmor2> chrisccoulson: Wow I knew firefox were creating an os I didn't realise it would be landing in Ubuntu.  Firefox== your friendly event based init daemon :)  http://ubuntuone.com/7F7dydbxHaYWMOO0L6TKPI
<czajkowski> have spent the day playing with the FF phone, nice to hold it, nice size phone, very clunky OS .
<ogra_> have you tried ubuntu touch before so you can compare ?
<Mirv> would comparing to other $70 phones would show that it's not that clunky after all?
<Mirv> I haven't tried any FF OS phone yet, althouh saw one live
<mlankhorst> seb128: the xorg side should be correct now
<czajkowski> ogra_: I have and it's a lot more intuitive.
<ogra_> cool
<czajkowski> but that was also on the same phone I use daily
<mlankhorst> ugh, out of space
<czajkowski> but having hardware dedicated to it is a nice thing
<ogra_> definitely
 * ogra_ is sure we'll get there too
<czajkowski> but I kept wanting to swipe and do stuff and it's not what I'd expect
<czajkowski> h indeed
<ogra_> heh
<czajkowski> good few folks have them here
<czajkowski> here being Florence at europython
<Laney> seb128: ok, it should be there now (gnome-desktop-testing in NEW)
 * Laney just built glib including testsuite and forgot to actually include the patch ...
<ricotz> Laney, hi :)
<ricotz> Laney, i noticed you touch gnome-bluetooth, were there reports like that yet http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=712774
<ubot2`> Debian bug 712774 in gnome-bluetooth "gnome-bluetooth - abort() on unknown values" [Grave,Fixed]
<Laney> ricotz: didn't hear of any
<Laney> check LP bugs?
<ricotz> Laney, havent found a LP bug yet
<Laney> Found in version gnome-bluetooth/3.8.0-1
<Laney> we don't have that yet
<ricotz> Laney, i am hitting it with the current saucy version
<Laney> ok, well it has a fixed version there
<ricotz> triggered by the kernel update to 3.10, 3.8.x worked fine
<Laney> maybe you could see if we can take that
<Laney> or find the fix and cherry-pick it
<ricotz> or maybe even updating gnome-bluetooth to 3.8.x?
<ricotz> yeah, i am currently building it while dropping the consolekit dep
<seb128> ricotz, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-gnome-3-8 states
<seb128> " * gnome-bluetooth
<seb128>  - Drops fallback applet
<seb128>  - Drops nautilus-sendto plugin
<seb128>  - Soname bump
<seb128>  - Not really needed yet"
<seb128>  
<seb128> so updating seems it's not on the current roadmap
<ricotz> seb128, right
<ricotz> finding the change which suppose to fix it then
<Laney> don't really have an opinion on those issues
<Laney> the transition isn't big
<seb128> Laney, the issue is not so much the transition that the fact it's another update that "features" drop of functionnalities some users use, with no benefit behind
<ricotz> there is no soname bump
<Laney> sure - I don't know what features are in the new version
<seb128> new gnome-bluetooths will also likely start pulling bluez5 soon when we want to stay on 4
<Laney> and I'd be happy to receive advice on the other things from ubuntu gnome
<seb128> well, it's the Ubuntu GNOME guys who wrote the comments I copied before
<seb128> anyway I've no strong opinion on the update, it just seems work for getting nothing but complains back
<seb128> so I'm not going to spend time on it, but I'm not going to block others if somebody wants to do it ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, bluz5 isnt needed for 3.8, but for 3.9.x
<Laney> same, but you know the drill when we start missing bug fixes
<seb128> ricotz, right, that's why I used futur tense :p
<ricotz> but yeah the feature drop is enough reason if you care about those
<seb128> we sort of care about sendto I think
<seb128> we didn't update that one either for similar reasons
<Laney> does gnome just not have that feature any more?
<ricotz> ok
<ricotz> just to confirm, using the newer gnome-bluetooth fixes this (fatal) error here
<ricotz> Laney, i presume something like https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-bluetooth/commit/?h=gnome-3-8&id=a6ecb2b31f7298041d13a4dd57635a5e40c852bb would fix it
<Laney> biab, lunch
<seb128> Laney, enjoy ;-)
<Laney> ricotz: give it a go
<mlankhorst> seb128: can you give the xorg ppa a go?
<seb128> Laney, shrug, you could make new packages dh9 instead of cdbs :p (or is pkg-gnome still set on cdbs?)
<seb128> mlankhorst, yep
<ricotz> seb128, Laney, http://paste.debian.net/plain/14122
<seb128> ricotz, thanks
<seb128> mlankhorst, where do I find unity with the barrier patch updated?
<ricotz> seb128, yw
<mlankhorst> seb128: oh i thought you were creating one
<mlankhorst> hold on
<seb128> mlankhorst, I tried, I applied the diff from https://code.launchpad.net/~brandontschaefer/unity/move-pointer-barrier-to-xi-1.6.99.1/+merge/150175 to the current saucy version but that fails to build :/
<mlankhorst> seb128: it should build correctly with the versions in the xorg ppa
<seb128> is that rebased on current trunk?
<seb128> brb needs to reboot, my laptop is swapping
<ricotz> mlankhorst, hi
<mlankhorst> g'day mate
<ricotz> mlankhorst, will the xserver package officially gain the xwayland module besides xmir
<mlankhorst> I'm not aware of any plans to do so at the moment
<ricotz> mlankhorst, i see, would be a nice step though
<ricotz> mlankhorst, i think i saw a rebased version for 1.14 somewhere
<mlankhorst> more importantly I do not think the x team is willing to support it at this point :-)
<ricotz> it would make some people happier ;)
<ricotz> but of course finally landing 1.14 with the new barriers would be nice
<mlankhorst> ricotz: of course, because then it's not their problem
<mlankhorst> :P
<ricotz> while this unity part is blocking updates for edgers in this regard
<ricotz> mlankhorst, i am counting me in here ;)
<ricotz> (ah it was a rebase for 1.15)
<seb128> back
<mlankhorst> If it's upstream I don't see any issues with enabling it, but accepting the xwayland patches means having to support it separately now, I don't see that happening..
<seb128> mlankhorst, so, is there an unity branch with the barrier work on top of trunk somewhere?
<ricotz> mlankhorst, absolutely, i am hoping it will get merged
<mlankhorst> seb128: I tested the patch from debian/patches in https://launchpad.net/~canonical-x/+archive/x-staging/+files/unity_7.0.0daily13.06.24-0ubuntu2.diff.gz
<seb128> mlankhorst, thanks
<mlankhorst> but only against the 7.0.1 in saucy atm
<seb128> the current saucy version is a daily from trunk made yesterday
<seb128> so it should be current
<seb128> mlankhorst, ok, I found my problem with the unity build
<seb128> "/usr/include/X11/extensions/XInput2.h:173:22: error: conflicting declaration âtypedef unsigned int BarrierEventIDâ
<seb128>  typedef unsigned int BarrierEventID;
<seb128> "
<seb128> mlankhorst, you need to update the b-d on libfixes as well, not only libxi
<mlankhorst> seb128: yeah, but that's for unity
<mlankhorst> seb128: besides if you had xorg-server from the ppa installed the wrong versions shouldn't be installing
<mlankhorst> installed*
<seb128> mlankhorst, I don't, I can't install it without removing unity because of the breaks :p
<seb128> which is why I want to rebuild in the first place
<mlankhorst> seb128: but yeah the build-deepends for unity need fixing
<Laney> seb128: yeah that packaging style is to fit in with pkg-gnome :(
<desrt> good morning!
<mlankhorst> seb128: but hey if you didn't upgrade out of fear of breaking unity, I would say the thing did its job :P
<seb128> Laney, did they say they want to keep this style or did you just assume they want (NEWed in any case)
<seb128> mlankhorst, right, but now I would like to test both so we can upload xorg if things work :p
<seb128> desrt, good morning to you!
<Laney> seb128: the former - it's one of those arguments that I didn't really want to have
<Laney> and thanks
<seb128> yw
<Laney> s/former/latter/
<seb128> let me ask on #debian-gnome
<desrt> seb128: happy wednesday
<seb128> desrt, thanks ;-)
<desrt> larsu: are you following the thread about OnlyShowIn?  I'd like your opinion on it.
<desrt> the KDE guys seem to be lining up in the 'remove it' column
<seb128> desrt, so much hate
<desrt> seb128: hm?
<larsu> desrt: I'm for removing it as well. Currently compiling a list of apps who use OnlyShowIn=MessagingMenu (that's the only argument *for* it at the moment)
<larsu> seb128: actually I think the debate is very productive
 * larsu wishes we had a searchable web service with all .desktop files from the archive
<seb128> desrt, people cheering about dropping harmless use of desktop fields...
<seb128> larsu, I couldn't care less either way, seems like arguing on details nobody cares about
<larsu> seb128: well, their point is that these fields are not harmless
<seb128> larsu, sure, GNOME hates customisation and consider anything that let distro change the behaviour as an issue...
<seb128> same storing as allowing panels in g-c-c
<desrt> seb128: this is only about additional desktop actions
<desrt> not about desktop files themselves
<seb128> desrt, same story...
<larsu> damit, packages.ubuntu.com errors out on contents search :'(
<desrt> seb128: not really... nobody is proposing removing OnlyShowIn on desktop files
<desrt> seb128: if you have an opinion about this you should state it on the list
<seb128> desrt, I've the opinion that it's there, doesn't hurt and can be useful
<seb128> I don't care enough to enter into an argument though
<desrt> seb128: it's currently hurting, though
<seb128> it's not
<desrt> it is.  transmission is a good example.
<seb128> it's hurting GNOME because they are late and they are not in OnlyShowIn
<seb128> yeah, it's fine when GNOME screw us
<seb128> but they are late on something and need some patches it's not fine...
<desrt> seb128: so people should make webpages that OnlyShowIn=IE;Firefox;Chrome;Opera;
<desrt> and if someone else is 'late' to the browser game, too bad for them?
<seb128> why do we have OnlyShowIn= to start with?
<desrt> seb128: i'm sorry -- but this has nothing to do with GNOME
<seb128> if that's such a crappy idea?
<desrt> seb128: that's exactly what people are asking....
<seb128> desrt, well, your complain is "transmission didn't add GNOME to their OnlyShowIn"
<desrt> seb128: didn't add anyone except Unity, really
<seb128> desrt, you just said it was not about dropping OnlyShowIn drom .desktop, but then you say it's of no use...
<desrt> the KDE people seem to be against this more strongly than jasper is...
<desrt> seb128: OnlyShowIn for desktop files as a whole is useful for when those desktop files are desktop components
<seb128> I don't see how that's different from .desktop files
<desrt> ie: they come as part of GNOME
<seb128> you have the same issue for ql
<desrt> it's difficult to imagine _part_ of a desktop file being shipped as part of a project
<seb128> you can't have features that are desktop specific
<seb128> like "open in the dash"
<seb128> that wouldn't make sense in gnome-shell
<desrt> seb128: if you have arguments, _please_ put them on the list
<desrt> not in a side conversation on IRC
<desrt> otherwise you don't get to complain when the decision is made against you
<seb128> well, the decision will be made against me whatever I think or argue about
<larsu> seb128: why do you think that?
<desrt> pathetic prophecy
<seb128> larsu, because that's how things have been going for over a year
<larsu> seb128: desrt and I are trying to fix that...
<desrt> seb128: please write to the list.  in the amount of time you've spent discussing this on IRC you could have had an email
<seb128> larsu, desrt: sorry, I will just trust you guys to do what's right there, I just don't feel like going into another (stupid) argument on lists on why it should be able to told apart a GNOME and an Unity session, seems GNOME guys disagree and I had too many of this discussion recently
<desrt> seb128: if you read the list, so far it's one gnome guy saying "why do we have this?" and three KDE guys saying "ya... let's get rid of it"
<seb128> desrt, the discussion started off list with "let's drop that", which you argued again, which is why we have the email
<seb128> if it wasn't for you they would just have went "screw that field
<desrt> seb128: well, it happens to be the case that i'm the one implementing it
<desrt> and i said that i'll do whatever the _list that is the central point of contact between the desktops_ decides
<desrt> i can't really do a lot if one desktop chooses not to be represented there
<seb128> alright, let me reply on the list just to state what I think
<desrt> please do
<desrt> and please give good real-world examples where this might be useful
<desrt> i don't have a strong opinion here and i'm happy to see the argument go either way
<desrt> i hope you manage to convince people
<larsu> desrt: because you already implemented it?
<seb128> I'm not convinced if will be very useful, but it doesn't cost a lot (especially if it's not used) and it gives a tool that can reply to specific needs
<mdeslaur> I'm just curious, how do you hide shell-specific icons from another shell if you don't have OnlyShowIn?
<seb128> so having the option in case somebody needs it seems like it wouldn't hurt anyone
<desrt> seb128: on the list, please
<seb128> mdeslaur, they want to keep it for icons, they are discussing e.g lists you get when right clicking on the launcher
<mdeslaur> oh, I see, ok
<kenvandine> tedg, so the version check fixed the upstart-app-launch failure?
<tedg> kenvandine, Basically yes.  It is basically "right version" and "can't figure out version" -- but we can call that a check :-)
<kenvandine> :)
<Laney> seb128: can you look at g-d-t's binaries please?
<seb128> Laney, ok
<Laney> yay
<Laney> ooh, flipped images by default
 * Laney finds a usb cable
<seb128> desrt, larsu: replied, but I really don't feel like going into an argument, reality is that if we don't have the OnlyShowIn and need it we will likely end up having a gedit-gnome.desktop and a gedit-unity.desktop which one using a OnlyShowIn, which works as well but I'm not convinced it's any better (especially that it adds to the available .desktop and create noise is some UIs that list everything)
<seb128> which one->each on
<desrt> seb128: why would we have separate gedits?
<seb128> desrt, larsu: the example I came with is that you might want e.g having your IDE doing "create ubuntu touch project" under Unity but "create GNOME project" under GNOME
<seb128> as a ql item
<larsu> good point
<desrt> seb128: you know that there are people who work on ubuntu while using gnome....
<seb128> and you can't say "create <desktop> project", because XFCE wouldn't want XFCE project
<seb128> but GTK project
<seb128> desrt, the point of the ql is to list the most useful items, not 150 items for every possible user choice
<desrt> fair point, i suppose
<seb128> desrt, I would like Unity to default to Unity project
<seb128> rather than having a ql with GNOME project, XFCE project, Unity project, etc
 * desrt waits to see your reply
<seb128> bah
<seb128> moderation ... /me resend from other email
<seb128> I forgot I was subscribed with my debian email to that list :p
 * mlankhorst pokes seb128 
<seb128> mlankhorst, hey
<seb128> mlankhorst, sorry, I got sidetracked into that, I'm ready to upgrade ... let me 5 minutes
<seb128> Laney, I would take Joss' comment on #debian-gnome as "feel free to use dh9"
<Laney> yeah, looks like it
 * Laney yays quietly
<seb128> Laney, I guess you will update your system settings's merge request with Kaleo's comments from IRC? (would be good to maybe make a summary of that on the MR for reference so others who take it as an example can benefit from that as well)
<Laney> seb128: I am doing it already, yeah
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> infact I was just typing bzr push :P
<seb128> ;-)
<Laney> sounds like the answer to my questions was "yes that's fine" though
<seb128> Laney, I'm not picky, as long as it works ... and we can still refactor/change things later if there is a better way
<Laney> yeah
<seb128> mlankhorst, ok, new xorg/unity works fine for me, +1 for upload
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<didrocks> thanks seb128, not sure if Mirv is still around though
<seb128> didrocks, tomorrow morning should do, or do we need to sync upload?
<seb128> I'm not sure if britney stop stuff to migrate if they have Breaks
<seb128> we maybe better upload everything together
<didrocks> seb128: just to avoid having it laying in -proposed for hours
<didrocks> ah yeah about the Breaks: and block
<seb128> well, we have stuff in proposed for weeks
<seb128> so one day doesn't concerns me
<seb128> it's rather that it moves out from proposed and Breaks unity
<seb128> that would be an issue
<didrocks> yeah, I think britney won't block
<seb128> didrocks, Mirv, mlankhorst: ok, let's aim for upload tomorrow, we can start early on that
<seb128> it will let time in the day to get through
<mlankhorst> seb128: sounds good to me
<seb128> didrocks, do you think we should get bregma's team to merge the barrier patch and bump the version to 7.0.2 today in preparation?
<didrocks> seb128: that's what I wanted Mirv to coordinate, not sure how they will do that without proposed
<didrocks> and this will break tonight's dailies if we do so
<seb128> ok, let's talk tomorrow morning
<bregma> just give us the word and we'll merge that baby in
<seb128> bregma, hey
<seb128> bregma, xorg in ready for upload, we just need synchronization
<bregma> yes
<bregma> also, I want to move to compiz trunk and bump unity to 7.1, all at exactly the same time
<bregma> :)
<seb128> bregma, I would say it would be good to get a MR up ready to merge, and bump the unity version from 7.0.1 to 7.0.2 in the same merge (we made xorg breaks unity << 7.0.2)
<seb128> bregma, so we can ack that mr land both unity and xorg tomorrow
<bregma> OK
<seb128> bregma, you can do compiz trunk and 7.1 next week then :p
<seb128> bregma, thanks
<seb128> on that note, time for some exercice
<seb128> be back in ~45min
<bregma> may as well do 7.1 this week instead of 7.0.2, because of breakage
<bregma> it's just a number
<mlankhorst> no, it's 7.0.2 now, I don't want another upload :P
<czajkowski> Have t say folks, Saucy is really really polished and not having any major issues running it. Very nicely done
<bigtoe376> Hi all.  Just wondering if there is any movement on fixing the issues with gvfs-fuse.  Although this is, IMO, a major bug it also comes under this topic.  Mounting SMB shares/devices and copying files is not trivial and should be rock solid.
<xclaesse> seb128, kenvandine: (not sure to ask the right person): do you know where is ubuntu's code to move libreoffice's menubar into unity's panel ?
<seb128> xclaesse, try asking Sweetshark, it's in libreoffice's upstream codebase but not sure where, it just uses gmenu I thin
<seb128> k
<xclaesse> seb128, ok, I'm cloning upstream code atm, will grep :)
<bschaefer> seb128, ping
<seb128> tedg, hey, how are things working without your gnome-session patch to drop compiz/gsd from required components? do you get them randomly started by g-s or upstart depending who is first?
<seb128> bschaefer, hey
<bschaefer> seb128, hello! I've bumped my edge barriers branch up to 7.0.2, and merged it with trunk
<tedg> seb128, The compiz job detects the case and aborts
<bschaefer> soo its ready for the 1.14 xservers change :)
<bschaefer> https://code.launchpad.net/~brandontschaefer/unity/move-pointer-barrier-to-xi-1.6.99.1/+merge/150175
<seb128> tedg, what about gsd? it's listed by initctl list here
<seb128> bschaefer, great, thanks
<tedg> seb128, Not sure on that one, I'm guessing it detects itself and only starts once.
<bschaefer> seb128, np! have fun getting the new xserver in main :)
<seb128> bschaefer, you should probably bump your libxfixes requirement, I tried to build with that patch and the libxfixes earlier and I hit that
<seb128> "/usr/include/X11/extensions/XInput2.h:173:22: error: conflicting declaration âtypedef unsigned int BarrierEventIDâ
<seb128>   typedef unsigned int BarrierEventID;
<bschaefer> hmm I just built the branch here
<seb128> bschaefer, dpkg -l | grep libxfixes
<seb128> bschaefer, ?
<bschaefer> ii  libxfixes-dev                                1:5.0-4ubuntu6                                         i386         X11 miscellaneous 'fixes' extension library (development headers)
<bschaefer> ii  libxfixes3:i386                              1:5.0-4ubuntu6                                         i386         X11 miscellaneous 'fixes' extension library
<bschaefer> seb128, are the 2 i have
<bschaefer> umm, but unity is set to any xfixes version
<bschaefer> at lease in the cmake...
<seb128> bschaefer, ok, dunno what I hit the build error here, anyway once the new xorg is available that will not be an issue
<bschaefer> seb128, alright, let me try to rebuild again!
<bschaefer> it would be nice to make sure theres no problems :)
<seb128> tedg, hum, things don't look nice on login without the required component
<seb128> tedg, I get a white screen then some weird/slow fading in frame
<seb128> tedg, I think we need to run stuff in order like gnome-session does, at least the compiz and the theme need to be set first
 * didrocks waves good evening
<walters> desrt: got a second?
<walters> or anyone: in the current debian package of dbus, is "make check" run?  I assume via debhelper?  Does debhelper do anything like e.g. use Xvfb to set up $DISPLAY ?
<tedg> walters, I don't think debhelper does that automatically.  I don't see anything in the dbus package to disable tests though.
<tedg> So I'd assume they are run.
<walters> the dbus test-autolaunch wants an X session presently
<tedg> Hmm, I don't see anything to handle that.  It probably works by magic :-)
<Laney> the tests aren't run
<Laney> there's an empty override_dh_auto_test in rules to disable them
 * tedg was an idiot and searched for autotest :-/
<tedg> Ah, and there's a --disable-tests added to configure later on.
<walters> ah i see.  Thanks
<walters> i had expected it to be set up in Debian since smcv did so much work upstream on the tests
<Laney> might be different there
<Laney> nope :/
<Laney> kenvandine: try that MP! Thanks for the feedback :-)
<kenvandine> Laney, rock on!
<kenvandine> thanks
<kenvandine> Laney, we need to do this with a bunch of the apps, we have lots of these public components that weren't really meant to be publich
<kenvandine> public even
<Laney> oh really?
<kenvandine> yeah
<Laney> well it turned out not to be too difficult
<kenvandine> it's a bit of a mess :)
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> share-app does
<Laney> and /usr/lib/myapplication/ is already a standard place for private libs
<kenvandine> i think gallery and phone-app does too
<kenvandine> i've complained about it before and was just told this was the way it was
<kenvandine> which i never bought :)
<Laney> desrt: check this https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/saucy-adt-glib2.0/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/19/console
<Laney> the installed-tests all pass
<Laney> (also, uploaded that patch for attente)
<attente> Laney, thanks!
<Laney> np
<walters> ah you guys are using installed tests now?
<Laney> well, case-by-case but yeah
<walters> well this goes to my above question; you are setting up an X/dbus session right?
<Laney> for those, indeed
<walters> what's the script/program used to do that?
<Laney> I just wrote a little shell script to launch the test runner under dbus-launch xvfb-run -a
<walters> ok
<walters> cool
<Laney> but yeah, cool to see them all pass first time
<Laney> and those are automatically re-triggered whenever dependencies change
<Laney> so in theory we notice if the kernel or libc breaks glib
<Laney> which is nice
<walters> definitely, enabling that sort of thing was one of the primary goals of installed tests
<jbicha> ricotz: it looks like reverting the drop-sendto commit from gnome-bluetooth works so we should be able to do the update
<jbicha> I wonder where seb128 went...
<Laney> probably to have an evening :P
<Laney> update the BP
<ricotz> jbicha, nice
<Laney> did shell replace that functionality somewhere else?
<ricotz> Laney, could you sponsor the small update anyway?
<Laney> sure, I assumed someone else did
<Laney> can you give me the link again?
<ricotz> yeah, i thought seb would do it ;)
<ricotz> hmm, dont have it here, could you scroll up?
<jbicha> ricotz: you mean for gnome-bluetooth? I'm almost done with 3.8
<ricotz> jbicha, yes, it solves a fatal problem with the current kernel
<Laney> If you're doing 3.8 then that's fine
<ricotz> alright
<ricotz> jfyi this was it http://paste.debian.net/plain/14122
<jbicha> Laney: your patch for https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=702244 won't apply since that file isn't in the tarball
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 702244 in general "Fix format string warning" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<jbicha> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-bluetooth/commit/?id=2e320f6
<jbicha> sending files w/ g-bluetooth 3.8 works in gnome shell but in Unity I get "GDBus.Error:org.openobex.Error.Failed: Unable to request session"
<jbicha> and if I google that I find bug 1148033
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1148033 in gnome-bluetooth (Ubuntu) "GDBus.Error:org.openobex:Error.Failed: Unable to request session" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1148033
<jbicha> does indicator-bluetooth work for you guys to send files?
<seb128> jbicha, no, but gnome-control-center's bluetooth panel has the same issue
<jbicha> seb128: ok so I can assume this has nothing to do with g-bluetooth 3.8
<jbicha> seb128: I think everything else is fine for the update; I reverted the drop-nautilus-sendto plugin commit
<seb128_> bah, unstable internet here
<seb128_> jbicha, not sure that went through but I was saying that g-c-c's capplet has the same issue
<jbicha> seb128: ok so I can assume this has nothing to do with g-bluetooth 3.8
<jbicha> seb128: I think everything else is fine for the update; I reverted the drop-nautilus-sendto plugin commit
<seb128> what's the interest of the update?
<seb128> well, your call, as long as you guys deal with the breakages
<jbicha> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-bluetooth/tree/NEWS?h=gnome-3-8
<seb128> right, I don't see anything worth an update in there
<seb128> it's likely the bug fixes got backport for some part in 3.6 and every else is remove_feature*n
<jbicha> nah, there's only one feature removed and I reverted that
<seb128> - Remove fallback applet as GNOME fallback is obsolete.
<seb128> - Remove ObexFTP browsing support
<seb128> - Remove nautilus-sendto plugin.
<seb128> ?
<seb128> that's from the url you just gave me
<jbicha> right, ok we don't use the fallback applet as gnome-panel uses indicators by default
<seb128> what about obextftp?
<jbicha> that points to http://www.hadess.net/2011/11/obexftp-in-gnome-non-update.html
<seb128> jbicha, sorry, I'm on an unstable wifi
<Laney> jbicha: won't apply to 3.8?
<Laney> Oh well, I'm sure you can backport it :P
<jbicha> Laney: it's not in the tarball https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-bluetooth/commit/?id=2e320f6
<jbicha> that means it's "fixed"
<Laney> oh, I didn't actually check what they did
<Laney> awesome fix
<seb128> Laney, can you push your gsd -0ubuntu15 update to the vcs?
<Laney> seb128: oh yeah, sorry, do you want it now or is tomorrow ok?
<seb128> Laney, tomorrow is ok
<Laney> cool
<Laney> saves me having to get up :-)
<seb128> Laney, I just ran into the missing patch trying to debug the "rb hang on start" :p
<seb128> I applied it locally, so no hurry ;-)
<seb128> desrt, Laney: do you have a !Ubuntu GNOME in a install/vm/jhbuild/... to test something?
<seb128> ups
<seb128> desrt, larsu I meant
<seb128> Laney, sorry ;-)
<desrt> seb128: larsu has ubuntugnome i think
<desrt> oh.. you want non-ubuntu gnome
<seb128> desrt, not good enough ;-)
<desrt> i can help with that, ya
<larsu> desrt: seb128: nope, real ubuntu here
<desrt> larsu, fortunately, is back on unity
 * larsu is dogfooding indicators
<desrt> gives a bit more credibility to you acting as the represenitive of the unity project in xdg affairs, as well :)
<larsu> ya, I guess so :)
<desrt> seb128: what do you need to know?
<seb128> desrt, does calling /org/gnome/SettingsDaemon/MediaKeys org.gnome.SettingsDaemon.MediaKeys GrabMediaPlayerKeys ("test", 0) in dbus hang as well there?
<seb128> calling that makes a GetAll() call it seems
 * thumper waves to desrt and seb128
<desrt> seb128: refer all GetAll bugs to Laney :)
<desrt> thumper: hey!
<seb128> desrt, oh, is that your glib bug?
<desrt> may be
<desrt> the issue is as follows:
<desrt> the logic of my patch is that if 'property_get' in your DBus vtable is NULL then we dispatch all valid property calls via the method call handler
<Laney> that patch isn't in saucy yet
<desrt> we still check that Get and Set are for valid properties
<desrt> but if GetAll comes, it is accepted even if there are no properties
<desrt> so if your intention was to export a methods-only interface (which is quite common) then you're gonna have a bad time
<desrt> what makes it really deadly is that GDBusProxy issues a GetAll on initialisation
<seb128> desrt, the bug I'm looking at is that GrabMediaPlayerKeys end up calling https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-settings-daemon/tree/plugins/media-keys/gsd-media-keys-manager.c#n1546
<seb128> which returns nothing
<seb128> so it hits timeout
<seb128> well that function is called with method_name = GetAll
<seb128> which is not handled by the function
<desrt> seb128: ya.... sounds like my problem
<seb128> right
<seb128> which makes sense
<seb128> that code didn't change since raring
<desrt>  because nobody is generating the reply now
<Laney> try glib from proposed then
<seb128> I was wondering why rb is hanging on start
<desrt> so the call hangs
<seb128> right
<desrt> https://git.gnome.org/browse/glib/commit/?id=cb4469600c5146a48501a31e9a3fb9bfc261477d
<seb128> desrt, Laney: thanks
<seb128> desrt, Laney uploaded, I will grab the deb
<seb128> Laney, desrt: yeah, that glib update fixes it
<seb128> one less issue to debug \o/
<Laney> woo
<desrt> happy to help :)
 * desrt has a "bugs seb will hit tomororow" predictor
<seb128> thumper, hey ;-)
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-07-04
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> Laney: "Jenkins Fixed - saucy-adt-glib2.0 19" -- nice job!
<thumper> hi pitti
<thumper> pitti: I have a question for you
<thumper> I want to have my executable be elevated to root permissions after doing some initial messing around
<thumper> so don't want to run the executable with sudo
<thumper> but instead have it ask for sudo password part way through
<thumper> is this possible?
<pitti> thumper: no, not really
<thumper> bugger
<thumper> hmm...
<pitti> thumper: you could split your program into a privileged part and an unprivileged one, and call the privileged one through sudo or pkexec
<thumper> pitti: the program is juju :)
<pitti> thumper: otherwise I suggest you start it as root, drop privileges at the beginning, and re-claim them only if you need to
<thumper> pitti: hmm.. how do you do that?
<thumper> a problem in particular is that some files which are created and should be owned by the user, are being owned by root
<pitti> thumper: create a system user, find out its UID with getpwname(), then drop privs with setresuid(uid, uid, uid)
<thumper> but I do need to write to /etc/init and /var
<pitti> and when you need root, setresuid(0, 0, 0) temporarily
<thumper> hmm.. can I do that in go?
<pitti> that's a pretty basic posix call; I sure hope so
 * thumper goes digging
<thumper> pitti: thanks
<pitti> thumper: eww, you start this as a user and write into /etc/ ?
<pitti> thumper: maybe that should be re-designed first :)
<thumper> pitti: it is to create a local provider
<pitti> like, writing into ~/.config/juju instead, or creating a per-user dir in /var/lib/juju/
<thumper> so it creates two services for the mongo db and agent
<thumper> these need to be started by upstart
<thumper> and it also needs to create lxc containers in precise
<thumper> so no user space
<pitti> thumper: can't you ship a generic upstart job which tests for the existance of a particular file and only starts then?
<thumper> hmm...
<thumper> the thing is there could be multiple
<thumper> if you had multiple local environments
<thumper> I'm open to ideas
<Mirv> didrocks: to your queue,  lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/qtsystems-opensource-src + https://launchpad.net/~canonical-qt5-edgers/+archive/qt5-beta2/+files/qtsystems-opensource-src_5.0%7Egit20130614.orig.tar.gz would be ready (again, with the fixes)
<Mirv> qml plugins separated and license files added
<didrocks> Mirv: ah, thanks! :)
<didrocks> Mirv: will have a look later today
<Mirv> merci
<jibel> good morning
<Laney> hey
<Laney> pitti: yeah - cool isn't it?
<pitti> Laney: it sure is
<pitti> Laney: so that's now with the proper runner?
<Laney> yep
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey Laney, pitti
<mlankhorst> g'day mate
<pitti> hey seb128
<seb128> hey mlankhorst
<Laney> hey
<mlankhorst> more merge window fun, hopefully this nvd7 will work in 3.11
<mlankhorst> :D
<seb128> nothing like starting the day on a non working session
<seb128> mlankhorst, I though for a bit that the new xorg was broken :p
<seb128> gnome-session was complaining about errors loading the intel driver or something
<seb128> but it turned out that it was a stalled .Xauthority in my userdir breaking things
 * Laney remembers that he probably ought to fix his microphone
<mlankhorst> seb128: everything's an xorg bug ;)
<mlankhorst> but hey lets do it
<seb128> Laney, if that's for the settings meeting you have another week, but yeah, would be nice ;-)
<Laney> seb128: oh really? I thought it was today :P
<seb128> Laney, we said every second week, though it would maybe be good to do it weekly now that things are quite active
<seb128> Laney, but mardy is not there this week so...
<Laney> yeah I knew that but thought it was two weeks already
<seb128> could be
<seb128> let me check :p
<seb128> Laney, shrug, you are right ;-)
<Laney> fixed anyhow
<Laney> don't mind if you want to defer it since mardy isn't here
<seb128> Laney, I made it bi-weekly in google calendar
<seb128> Laney, well, we can have a quick round with those who are around, would be good to keep the cadence ;-)
<Laney> k, cool
<seb128> and we can discuss making it weekly
<seb128> so we can have one with mardy next week as well :p
<seb128> Laney, speaking of which, how much fun do you have with qml? ;-) want to pick another panel to work on?
<Laney> yeah I was going to do some other bit of UI, maybe the security one?
<seb128> Laney, well, in addition I mean ... or for when you are done with yours, or if you feel like doing a bit more "standard UI"
<seb128> Laney, I think didrocks wanted to do security, what about bluetooth?
<seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bluetooth#phone
<seb128> it seems like mostly standard UI
<seb128> at least less crazy that the background one ;-)
<seb128> and cyphermox seems to be overbusy
<seb128> larsu, or check with didrocks if he wants help on the privacy UI
<Laney> I could do the basic bits for bluetooth
<Laney> the specialist / advanced stuff would be best left for cyphermox though
<Laney> oh interesting, this is one which is enabled dynamically
<Laney> do we have a way of doing that?
<Laney> using the entry component I guess
<mlankhorst> seb128: but at what time do you want to start uploads
<seb128> mlankhorst, now? ;-)
<mlankhorst> do itt
<seb128> mlankhorst, wait
<seb128> Laney, can we put a britney lock on X*?
<Laney> haha, not like that
<Laney> if you give me a list of packages sure
<seb128> right :p
<seb128> mlankhorst, ^
<seb128> Laney, I think britney will not stop it because it Breaks: unity (<< new)
<Laney> don't think it handles breaks like that
<seb128> so we better put a manual lock there and wait to have things in place
<mlankhorst> yeah
<mlankhorst> just in case
<seb128> seems like didrocks is busy with the Mir guys and I want to hear from him&Mirv before uploading
<seb128> didrocks, Mirv: please ping back about new xorg when you are done being busy on other things
<Laney> hmm, maybe it does though
<Laney> infinity: does britney consider Breaks when determining installability?
<didrocks> seb128: just coordinate with Mirv, he's dealing with the transition AFAIK
<didrocks> mlankhorst: ^
<seb128> didrocks, ok
<seb128> Mirv, hey
<Mirv> there was something wrong still with https://code.launchpad.net/~brandontschaefer/unity/move-pointer-barrier-to-xi-1.6.99.1/+merge/150175 I think?
<mlankhorst> Laney: everything from https://launchpad.net/~canonical-x/+archive/x-staging?field.series_filter=saucy except the unity and -omap-revert packages
<mlankhorst> Mirv: perhaps, unity needs to hard build-depend and depend on the version from that ppa, that should fix it.
<Laney> can you give me a list? :(
<Laney> the format is block package1 package2 ...
<seb128> Mirv, not really, he forgot the commit message ... and it requires the new xorg which is in a ppa and going to be uploaded to saucy-proposed soon
<Mirv> mlankhorst: from seb128's comment I'd guess something like libxfixes-dev (>= 1.6.99.1)
<seb128> Mirv, do you guys build on top of saucy or saucy-proposed?
<mlankhorst> Mirv: the epoch too..
<mlankhorst> Laney: libxfixes libxi mesa-demos nvidia-graphics-drivers-tegra3 nvidia-tegra-codecs-cardhu unity x11proto-fixes x11proto-input xf86-input-mtrack xf86-input-multitouch xf86-input-tslib xf86-input-wacom xf86-video-omap xf86-video-omap-revert xorg xorg-server xorg-server-omap-revert xserver-xorg-input-acecad xserver-xorg-input-aiptek xserver-xorg-input-elographics xserver-xorg-input-evdev xserver-xorg-input-evdev-omap-revert xserver-xorg-input
<Laney> ty
<mlankhorst> let me know where it truncates
<Laney> xserver-xorg-input-evdev-omap-revert xserver-xorg-input
<seb128> mlankhorst, pastebin?
<Laney> splitlong.pl!
<seb128> no truncate on pastebin, and no flooding of this channel :p
<mlankhorst> ok ill pastebin
<Laney> :-)
<Mirv> seb128: if I haven't understood something wrongly, proposed (for example https://launchpadlibrarian.net/144130366/buildlog_ubuntu-saucy-amd64.unity_7.0.1%2B13.10.20130704-0ubuntu1_UPLOADING.txt.gz)
 * seb128 shouldn't tell people about flooding about the "incident" where he flooder the channel recently :p
<Mirv> seb128: which would mean Xorg to -proposed, accept brandon's branch, rebuild stack after merged in
<mlankhorst> http://pastebin.com/JNHgkG9Y
<Laney> if you build-depend on the right version it'll wait automatically
<seb128> Mirv, sounds like a plan, we will get Xorg updated and then ping you for the accept brandon's patch/rebuild stack
<Mirv> seb128: ok, as mlankhorst pointed out, actually the brandon's branch is missing epoch also for libxi-dev, so I'll branch from there and add the 2:
<seb128> Mirv, thanks
<Mirv> mlankhorst: so should the libxfixes-dev dependency be >= 1:5.0.1-1 ?
<Mirv> seb128: thanks
<mlankhorst> Mirv: yeah, and perhaps an explicit depends on libxfixes3 and libxi6 too
<infinity> Laney: If it doesn't, it should.  But ask Colin, he'd know for sure.
<mlankhorst> so symbols won't be messed up
<Mirv> mlankhorst: ok. that shouldn't be necessary, the -dev packages pick up the same version dependency automatically.
<Laney> infinity: Yeah. I see mention of it in source so guess that it does. I did ask in #-release already. Thanks.
<mlankhorst> Mirv: not in this case, the xi2 symbols were introduced before
<mlankhorst> but we patched those out
<infinity> Laney: Yeah, right after I wrote that, I read an email from Colin saying that he's out sick.  So maybe don't ask him. :P
<Laney> Heh
<Laney> FINE. I'll ask #debian-release.
<Mirv> mlankhorst: interesting, ok.
<Laney> sounds like we're safe
<seb128> Laney, infinity: from IRC logs and discussion with Colin in the past, Britney checks for installability of ubuntu-desktop
<seb128> but not including recommends
<seb128> we had CD builds failing because of that
<seb128> but that's ok, xorg and unity are both strong depends ;-)
<mlankhorst> seb128: yeah but for example libxi and libxfixes need to be held back manually
<mlankhorst> and the proto stuff too
<Mirv> now at https://code.launchpad.net/~timo-jyrinki/unity/move-pointer-barries-to-xi-1.6.99.1_try2/+merge/172975
<seb128> Laney, please put the big lock in place manually, better safe than sorry
<seb128> Laney, mlankhorst: then we can start on uploads ... are those uploads a ppa copy, or manual upload or...?
<mlankhorst> ppa copy
<seb128> mlankhorst, do you know the magic incantation that should be run?
<seb128> is that basically copying the list of packages you just pastebined?
<Laney> it's done
<seb128> Laney, thanks ;-)
<mlankhorst> seb128: no idea what the magic invocation is
<Laney> the answer is that it's enforced if the packages are required to be coinstallable
<Laney> i.e. if there's a dependency relationship there
<seb128> k
<Laney> so if you can install unity without whatever-package-gets-the-breaks then it won't work
<seb128> that makes sense, so it would block the server in this case
<mlankhorst> but not the libs
<seb128> right
<seb128> but updating the libs without the server should work
<seb128> or you forgot some depends/breaks :p
<mlankhorst> copied from debian
<seb128> anyway, let's get going
<mlankhorst> indeed
<seb128> Laney, do you know if we can pocket copy including binaries from x-staging's ppa?
<seb128> it has armhf builds
<seb128> so I guess we can?
<Laney> no
<Laney> they're virtual arm builds aren't they?
<tjaalton> copying has been used before
<mlankhorst> for 1.12 and 1.13
<seb128> infinity, ^ do you know?
<tjaalton> he's asleep
<tjaalton> RAOF: ^
<tjaalton> probably EOD
<seb128> tjaalton, he commented 10 minutes ago, did he just feel asleep?
<tjaalton> oh :)
<tjaalton> in that case..
<mlankhorst> Laney: but why wouldn't virtual arm work?
<Laney> Oh, looks like it is non-virt but doesn't build for ppc
<seb128> oh, ppc...
<mlankhorst> hm
<Laney> it's known to be shaky
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> we need ppc binaries
<seb128> so I guess we need rebuilds
<Laney> the missing build records should be created when you copy
<mlankhorst> ok
<seb128> Laney, should we try one on source to see how it goes?
<Laney> go on then ...
<mlankhorst> try xorg metapackage
<seb128> mlankhorst, is that arch: any?
<mlankhorst> not xserver-xorg
<mlankhorst> which is built from xorg
<seb128> mlankhorst, I was going to try libxfixes
<mlankhorst> seb128: yeah that one will fail because it needs the new protos first
<Laney> Then again a lot of these packages were built back in May which might be on an older toolchain
<Laney> so you might want rebuilds anyway
<infinity> seb128: Please never, ever, ever copy from a virt PPA.  Ever.
<mlankhorst> Laney: shrug just upload the proto first in that case
<mlankhorst> rest should be ok
<seb128> infinity, is https://launchpad.net/~canonical-x/+archive/x-staging virtual?
<Laney> mlankhorst: don't you have upload to these anyway? :P
<mlankhorst> infinity: can you enable ppc on that ppa?
<infinity> seb128: Nope, that's non-virt.  You can tell from which builders it uses.  But (and this is a big but), non-virt PPAs still aren't, by default, built the same was as the distro.
<infinity> seb128: As far as translation stripping, etc.
<infinity> s/was/way/
<mlankhorst> https://launchpad.net/~canonical-x/+archive/x-staging/+build/4766545
<mlankhorst> oh indeed
<seb128> let's just rebuild those
<infinity> mlankhorst: We could do an X-staging PPA that meant for copying, but no harm in just doing source copies this time.
<mlankhorst> it should be ok to rebuild, in that case x11proto first, then wait until it's done and the libxi/xfixes
<mlankhorst> then*
<tjaalton> can you not dump all at once, libx* should have sufficient b-dep checks to prevent them from building before proto?
<infinity> Interestingly enough, in most ways, that PPA seems to be correct already, except for the missing PPC.  You should probably get that enabled.
<infinity> (for next time)
<seb128> sanity check
<seb128> Laney, infinity: does that looks correct?
<seb128> $ ./copy-package -s saucy --ppa-name canonical-x/x-staging --to-primary --to-suite=saucy-proposed x11proto-input
<Laney> I think it's --ppa=canonical-x --ppa-name=x-staging
<mlankhorst> yeah
<infinity> seb128: Does owner/name work?  I always use --ppa= ... What Laney said.
<seb128> ok, let me try that
<Laney> You'll get a confirmation anyway
<seb128> I'm new to those ppa to archive copies :p
<infinity> Though I like yours.  Someone should make the tool take that. :P
<mlankhorst> infinity: how do you specify what release to use for copy_package?
<infinity> mlankhorst: Hrm?
<mlankhorst> (to take the saucy packages in there)
<infinity> mlankhorst: -s saucy
<mlankhorst> in there -> from the ppa
<infinity> mlankhorst: And if extra paranoid '-e $version' too.
<mlankhorst> hmz
<mlankhorst> no need for that I hope, ubuntu0.3 will fail to build on saucy due to toolchain changes
<mlankhorst> and the raring versions are mostly older, so they won't work anyway
<Laney> -s saucy will get the right thing
<mlankhorst> ok
<infinity> It will, yes.
<infinity> The "extra paranoid" bit was if you were doing some scripting or something and trying to avoid races with other people.
<infinity> In this case, I assume you know no one will upload to the PPA while you're doing this. :P
<seb128> tjaalton, mlankhorst: I guess it's normal some of those have raring in their changelog target? e.g https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/x11proto-input/2.3-0ubuntu1 ?
<tjaalton> yeah, doesn't matter
<mlankhorst> yeah the x1.14 stack was originally created for raring, can just be carried over :)
<tjaalton> or could that be pulled from debian now?
<tjaalton> synced
<mlankhorst> hm actually.. it could
<seb128> can I ppa copy for somebody else? that upload has my mine on it...
<seb128> tjaalton, mlankhorst: which ones can be synced from debian?
<seb128> I guess the one without ubuntu revision can be syncpackaged?
<Laney> why don't I just extend the xorg packageset (mlankhorst requested this a month ago) and mlankhorst can self service?
<seb128> Laney, that would be good
<tjaalton> that would work, also the lts-*
<Laney> ok
<Laney> I think we had some discussion about it and then forgot to do it
<mlankhorst> maybe i could finally do the lts raring sru uploads myself then :>
<mlankhorst> but I guess if we don't need to do a binary copy I can do it myself
<mlankhorst> tjaalton: please don't do uploads :)
<Laney> give me a minute to remember how to drive the tool
<mlankhorst> oops
<Laney> laney@iota> edit-acl -P xorg -S precise -s libxrandr-lts-raring add                                                                   ~/temp
<Laney> Added:
<Laney> libxrandr-lts-raring
<Laney> cool
<tjaalton> mlankhorst: harhar
 * mlankhorst wonders why it said your name
<seb128> mlankhorst, I did 2 syncs and used tjaalton for -s ... sorry if that created confusion
<seb128> I tried to match the ppa uploaders
<mlankhorst> ah :-)
<seb128> mlankhorst, well anyway, I just put x11proto-input/fixes and libxi/xfixes in so far, I will let you do the rest
<mlankhorst> I'll have to wait for libxi/libxfixes to fail first
<seb128> mlankhorst, libxfixes built fine...
<Laney> okay then, try that
<seb128> mlankhorst, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/saucy/+source/libxfixes/1:5.0.1-1
<Laney> edit-acl -P xorg -S saucy query lets you see what's in it
<mlankhorst> libxi did not :-)
<seb128> mlankhorst, ^ did you see Laney's line? are you set for those copies/uploads? ;-)
<mlankhorst> should be good
<seb128> mlankhorst, I did the first copies with "./copy-package -s saucy --ppa=canonical-x --ppa-name=x-staging --to-primary --to-suite=saucy-proposed <name>"
<mlankhorst> except the arm stuff, but I can ask tjaalton for that
<seb128> if that's useful
<mlankhorst> yeah
<mlankhorst> unity can be uploaded at this point, btw
<seb128> mlankhorst, better to wait a bit, the binaries are not published yet and I'm not sure their merger/jenkins does depwait
<mlankhorst> ah
<mlankhorst> now I just need to wait for xorg-server to show up in proposed then before I can do the rest, it's mostly a rebuild bump from here on
<seb128> mlankhorst, if you have updated build-depends those will depwait ... if not, you better wait yes ;-) it's built on i386/amd64, depending if armhf and ppc finish before :30 you might need to wait 1 or 2 extra publisher cycles
<seb128> e.g ~1h
<seb128> if the past build times are any indicator there is still a good half an hour of build on armhf, so you can go for lunch easily ;-)
<mlankhorst> can I create a version number lower than 0~ ?
<mlankhorst> would 0~~ work?
<Laney> yep
<mlankhorst> oh good
<seb128> try dpkg --compare-versions 0~ gt 0~~; echo $?
<Laney> laney@iota> dpkg --compare-versions 0~~ lt 0~ && echo yep                                                                             ~/temp
<Laney> yep
<mlankhorst> ah great, it should be possible to force an upgrade then :P
<seb128> force an upgrade of what?
<didrocks> seb128: mind approving? https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/libusermetrics/simplify-packaging/+merge/172994
<didrocks> (while I'm are it :p)
<seb128> didrocks, done
<didrocks> thx
<seb128> Mirv, bah, the CI doesn't use proposed... https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/unity-saucy-amd64-autolanding/75/console
<seb128> going to be fun :p
<seb128> that's about https://code.launchpad.net/~timo-jyrinki/unity/move-pointer-barries-to-xi-1.6.99.1_try2/+merge/172975
<seb128> it's one of those cases here it would be easier to just upload the patch to saucy-proposed manually and merge back
<seb128> but didrocks is not going to like that suggestion I'm sure :p
<didrocks> seb128: we can push it to trunk directly rather
<didrocks> and merge manually
<didrocks> then quick a daily
<didrocks> the tests are using proposed
<didrocks> kick*
<seb128> didrocks, right
<seb128> Mirv, ^ can you do that?
<Mirv> seb128: ok.. feels evil to push something to trunk but ok :) the cu2d will run all the tests anyhow that's true
<seb128> Mirv, thanks
<Mirv> ok, it's there, launching a build of unity in cu2d
<Mirv> built successfully, it's running autopilot now (1h)
<Mirv> I mean prepared successfully, building + autopilot next :)
<seb128> Mirv, sorry, I was grabbing a bite
<seb128> Mirv, great, let's see how that goes
<Mirv> amd64 built https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-unity/+archive/daily-build/+build/4769091 , dependencies seems correct. powerbc built as well.
<seb128> Mirv, great
<Laney> mlankhorst: what does 'Xlib:  extension "NV-GLX" missing on display ":0".' mean and is it caused by new X? :-)
<Laney> I noticed that I was getting weird corruption in QML apps: http://ubuntuone.com/7ibGVZ0LQ1yt1SqQohjkMb and that message appears on the console
<mlankhorst> Laney: your nvidia drivers are messedup, mostly
<mlankhorst> did you manually install them, by any chance?
<Laney> dunno!
<seb128> Laney, why do you hate Ubuntu, why not using the packages!
<seb128> ;-)
<ogra_> use Mir !
<Laney> I appear to have nvidia-319 installed
<seb128> ogra_, hey; I think I forgot to say it yesterday, congrats on getting the container flip by default landed ;-)
<ogra_> hey, thanks :)
<Laney> mlankhorst: looks much better using nouveau :P
<seb128> mlankhorst, xserver-xorg-core | 2:1.14.1-0ubuntu0.8 | saucy-proposed | amd64, armhf, i386, powerpc
<seb128> mlankhorst, you can upload the drivers I think
<Laney> lightdm does not, however - that has the wrong resolution and is mirrored
<seb128> (that's "rmadison -S xorg-server -s saucy-proposed")
<seb128> Laney, right, we default to mirror...
<Laney> maybe it was always mirrored :P
<Laney> but it had the right res with nvidia
<Laney> oh well
<seb128> nvidia has its own config no?
<Laney> moar freedom for me
<seb128> Laney, cp .config/monitors.xml /etc/gnome-settings-daemon/xrandr/monitors.xml
<Laney> I don't know how to configure lightdm
<seb128> that's what I did here
<Laney> did I ever do that?
<Laney> seb128: ah yes, very nice - that's how it looked before
<seb128> ;-)
<Laney> what voodoo was nvidia doing ...
<seb128> is their config tool running as root?
<seb128> did it write config in /etc?
<seb128> or maybe they default to non-mirror
<Laney> anyway, system-settings looks right again
<seb128> great
<Laney> do you ever see it segfault on start btw?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> like one every 10 start or something
<Laney> just did it three times in a row
 * Laney gets qt debug symbols
<seb128> seems rather a qt bug than a system-settings one though
<seb128> Laney, is the stacktrace for your also loading an icon?
<Mirv> the rebuilt unity would seem to segfault for me and autopilot test seem like concurring (at least it's respawning, no segfault message) http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/autopilot-saucy-daily_release/329/label=autopilot-intel/console
<Laney> #0  QPMCache::createKey (this=this@entry=0x7fffd0024560) at image/qpixmapcache.cpp:396
<Mirv> I update the minimal amount required to manually install the unity from daily-build PPA
<Mirv> d
<seb128> Mirv, crap, do you have a stacktrace of the segfault?
<Mirv> seb128: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5843267/
<seb128> Mirv, can your ldd -r /usr/lib/compiz/libunityshell.so and pastbin it?
 * seb128 has a deja vu here
<Mirv> seb128: right, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5843270/
<seb128> undefined symbol: XFixesSelectBarrierInput	(/usr/lib/compiz/libunityshell.so)
<seb128> Mirv, dpkg -l | grep xfixes?
<Mirv> seb128: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5843275/
<seb128> mlankhorst, ^ do you have any idea on that?
<seb128> Mirv, are you sure you have the patch?
<seb128> Mirv, https://code.launchpad.net/~timo-jyrinki/unity/move-pointer-barries-to-xi-1.6.99.1_try2/+merge/172975 has
<seb128> - XFixesSelectBarrierInput(dpy, DefaultRootWindow(dpy), 0xdeadbeef);
<seb128> + barrier_ = XFixesCreatePointerBarrier(dpy,
<mlankhorst> seb128: sounds like you were using old unity, still
<seb128> Mirv, dpkg -l | grep unity?
<seb128> Mirv, https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-unity/+archive/daily-build/+packages?field.name_filter=unity&field.status_filter=published&field.series_filter=saucy has
<seb128> unity - 7.0.1+13.10.20130704.1-0ubuntu1
<Mirv> just a second
<seb128> Mirv, it should be 7.0.2
<Laney> I thought the Breaks was supposed to prevent that happening
<Mirv> ah, so it should, argh (7.0.2)
<seb128> Laney, he didn't update xserver
<seb128> Laney, just libxi and libxfixes
<seb128> Laney, I guess those libs should have a break as well
<Mirv> and interestingly, I had downgraded unity already, but getting back that 0704.1, I get another symbol missing http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5843289/
<Laney> does that mean the breaks is on the wrong package?
<Mirv> yeah I tried to upgrade the minimal amount forced by dependencies, to see what happens
<Laney> also if it's dropping symbols shouldn't it bump soname?
<seb128> Mirv, that's because you updated libxi
<seb128> Laney, it's a bit of a special case, we had an early implementation of the barrier stuff that went upstream, only unity uses it
<seb128> Laney, we don't really want to carry a different soname over Debian only for that
<Mirv> seb128: actually I did not, since the specified dependency was >= 1.6.99.1 and the old one was that, the new is 1.7.x
<seb128> Mirv, hum, k, in any case it seems the ppa doesn't have your merge in
<Mirv> seb128: now after upgrading libxi6 to 1.7.x, the new unity starts, so I guess the dependency should be that 1.7 instead of 1.6.99?
<seb128> right
<Laney> interesting
<Mirv> seb128: the PPA has, I just reverted the changelog since I thought I'll let cu2d add the changes, but of course I shouldn't have reverted the version number part
<seb128> Mirv, right, please add it back, xorg-xserver breaks unity << 7.0.2
<Mirv> so bumping the 7.0.2 again + the xi dependency to >= 2:1.7.1.901-1 ?
<seb128> Mirv, yes
<seb128> Mirv, libxi >= 2:1.7 should be enough
<seb128> but you can as well specify >= 2:1.7.1.901
<seb128> since that's what we have anyway...
<Mirv> ok. and actually I just checked that my or brandon's branch didn't have the changelog bump to 7.0.2 either, just the cmake version bump
<seb128> Mirv, we need the changelog update since that's how we set up things to make sure xorg and unity are upgraded together
<seb128> Mirv, sorry for not catching that earlier
<Mirv> seb128: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity/trunk/revision/3408
<Mirv> seems to match how bump to 7.0.1 was handled
<seb128> Mirv, great
<seb128> Mirv, you should probably have added a new changelog entry rather than changing the one from the previous upload though
<seb128> Mirv, can you take the changelog from saucy and dch -v 7.0.2-0ubuntu1 over it rather?
<Mirv> seb128: are you sure? it wasn't released to the archives, so the next changelog entry should be the same as before but with cu2d stamped 7.0.2+date?
<seb128> Mirv, the way you did it will probably make cu2distro think we are missing https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/7.0.1+13.10.20130703-0ubuntu1
<seb128> Mirv, it was release to saucy
<seb128> see https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/7.0.1+13.10.20130703-0ubuntu1
<Mirv> seb128: oh.. ok, fixing and then running a new build
<seb128> great
<Mirv> going with that, restored the released version http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity/trunk/revision/3409
<Mirv> now I've a good feeling, as I'm already running the new unity here
<seb128> Mirv, yep, looks right
<mlankhorst> how can i see if binaries are published?
<seb128> mlankhorst, the xorg-xserver ones are published, didn't you see my comment before?
<seb128> mlankhorst, rmadison -S xorg-server -s saucy-proposed
<mlankhorst> ah
<mlankhorst> can someone else do a rebuild bump for virtualbox and upload mesa-demos? I lack permission to upload either. :P
<seb128> tjaalton, ^? ;-)
<seb128> mlankhorst, if tjaalton doesn't pick them I can have a look in a bit (just finishing something else first)
<mlankhorst> hm need nvidia-graphics-drivers-tegra3 and nvidia-tegra-codecs-cardhu too
<mlankhorst> tseliot: can you upload those? :)
<tjaalton> I can in a bit, eating atm
<tjaalton> or tseliot :)
<tseliot> mlankhorst: didn't I upload those? Maybe it was in a PPA?
<tjaalton> oh sorry, i'll handle vbox & mesa-demos
<mlankhorst> tseliot: not sure, it's in the x-staging ppa, dno if it's in the archive
<tseliot> let me check
<mlankhorst> doesn't seem to be atm
<tseliot> yep, it was me
<tseliot> mlankhorst: where shall I upload them?
<mlankhorst> -proposed
<mlankhorst> or whereever those blobs go
<tseliot> mlankhorst: I don't see nvidia-tegra anywhere in the archive. I guess you mean in saucy?
<mlankhorst> yeah
<mlankhorst> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers-tegra3
<tseliot> ogra_: do you mind if I update nvidia-graphics-drivers-tegra3 and nvidia-tegra-codecs-cardhu in Saucy?
<tseliot> ogra_: you can review them in this PPA: https://launchpad.net/~canonical-x/+archive/x-staging/+packages
<ogra_> tseliot, well, we dont use them anywhere anymore
<ogra_> so feel free to do what you want :)
<tseliot> ogra_: oh, ok, thanks
<ogra_> note that xorg will not be upgraded to 0.14 in saucy arm
<mlankhorst> ogra_: it may, there's a xserver it could use
<ogra_> so if they are not backwards compatible to the old ABi it will break
<ogra_> mlankhorst, so you got new PVR drivers for panda ?
<mlankhorst> no, but I could build a x1.14 for arm that was backwards compatible enough with all abi reverts
<ogra_> well, as long as panda desktop does still work with compiz, just go ahead
<mlankhorst> if you install xserver-xorg-core-omap-revert from the ppa things work
<ogra_> erm
<ogra_> that would break
<ogra_> unless we will force that thing onto all arm users
<ogra_> (you would have to seed it in ubuntu-desktop ... we dont have any subarch support in seeds)
<mlankhorst> sort of.. you can add it separately, it's similar to the lts stack
<mlankhorst> in fact it's identical :-)
<tseliot> mlankhorst: maybe I should hold off the upload until a transition path is available?
<Mirv> unity 7.0.2+13.10.20130704-0ubuntu1 built at the daily-build, installs and runs fine
<mlankhorst> ogra_: but I tested on my pandaboard, I could install xserver-xorg-core-omap-revert, not install anything and only cause the other drivers to be uninstalled, while pvr kept running
<ogra_> mlankhorst, so how would you make sure this is installed on a panda but not on any other ubuntu-desktop installs ?
<mlankhorst> add it to the panda image
<mlankhorst> it needs pvr anyway
<mlankhorst> ogra_: would that work for you?
<ogra_> well, not sure i will have to look into the lvecd-rootfs code if there is special casing for panda
 * ogra_ doesnt really work on desktops anymore ... so i dont have such stuff in the top of my head
<seb128> ogra_, do we still care about panda out of "having it working for testing apps"?
<ogra_> seb128, not more than that, no
<ogra_> but it is our only arm desktop image we have left
<seb128> well, we can seed the right xserver there and be done then?
<ogra_> so it is essential to keep it running (unless someone decides for another arch or so)
<ogra_> seb128, there are many community ports, i wouldnt want to break u-desktop for them
<seb128> ogra_, well, ubuntu-desktop would depends on the right server
<ogra_> we usually have some special casing code for subarches in livecd-rootfs, should be doable to do something panda specific there
<seb128> ogra_, the users who remove ubuntu-desktop are on their own
<ogra_> thats what i mean, ubuntu-desktop shouldnt depend on any server :)
<mlankhorst> well either the image installs powervr, in which case it is already special, or it doesn't, in which case there's no acceleration and the new xserver could be used just fine, and installing powervr means swapping out the xserver..
<ogra_> it doesnt on x86
<mlankhorst> either way I don't see a blocker :-)
<ogra_> how about making the xseerver package just a dep of pvr
<ogra_> :)
<ogra_> that should be the easiest ... and reflects the problem (only because of pvr we actually need that xserver rollback)
<mlankhorst> replaces: xserver-xorg-core, list of all video/input drivers, depends: xserver-xorg-core-omap-rename, xserver-xorg-video-omap-rename, xserver-xorg-input-evdev-omap-rename ?
<mlankhorst> oh god that's so nasty it might just work..
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> haha
<mlankhorst> anyway that would need some fixing, is it ok not to block the general xorg-stack for that? :P
<ogra_> sure
<ogra_> tseliot, do you by chance also have ventana drivers (tegra2) ?
 * ogra_ isnt sure anymore if cardhu was backwards compatible to tegra2 or not 
<tseliot> let me check
<ogra_> our biggest userbase on arm is still the ac100 (this thing seems to survive forever) ... so having something for them that works with recent xorg would be good
<tseliot> ogra_: there is a driver for Ventana too: https://developer.nvidia.com/linux-tegra
<tseliot> the last release which will support ventana
<ogra_> yes, and teher is a package in ubuntu, would you mind updating that alongside the cardhu ??
<tseliot> ogra_: sure
<ogra_> tseliot, thanks :)
<tseliot> np
<mlankhorst> tseliot/tjaalton: is the rest uploaded?
<tseliot> mlankhorst: no, sorry not yet
<Laney> seb128: can you subscribe the system settings team to bugs for the package?
<seb128> Laney, sure
<seb128> Laney, done
<Laney> merci
<Mirv> seb128 / didrocks: unity 7.0.2+13.10.20130704-0ubuntu1 built all fine, but autopilot failed (26 failures, 14 with the last successful build)
<Mirv> so not total failure, just more failing test cases
<seb128> Mirv, :-( what tests started failing?
<Mirv> seb128: diff is at http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5843573/
<Mirv> (combined ati+intel results, different results for both)
<seb128> Mirv, can you get bregma or brandon to look at those?
<Mirv> seb128: you just highlighted bregma, brandon is having independence day
<seb128> ok
<Mirv> I need to EOD ~now
<seb128> yeah, I meant to ring him ;-)
<seb128> Mirv, I will track that from there, thanks
<tjaalton> mlankhorst: not yet
<Mirv> one option would be to just re-run the tests with cu2d-run, to see if anything changes, second option to get someone to fix those new failures, third option to lax the failure restrictions
<Mirv> seb128: thanks
<seb128> Mirv, seems like the issues have to do with the barrier ... which is not a surprise :/
<Mirv> yeah probably legit findings, at least partially, so cu2d doing its job
<bregma> yeah, already getting complaints about barrier stuff working in unexpected ways
<tjaalton> what kind of ways?
<seb128> tjaalton, https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/autopilot-saucy-daily_release/330/testReport/
<tjaalton> i've no idea what those mean in practise :)
<seb128> there is supposed to have videos of the tests
<seb128> but I can't find them
<seb128> need to be away for a meeting
<seb128> bbiab
<bregma> got a complaint you can't move the mouse between monitors if sticky edges are enabled
<seb128> weird, I had that before upgrading my xserver
<seb128> not after
<seb128> Laney, cyphermox, https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/d05e1507618eb7fc780cc7b581f2d5840f7874ee
<Laney> coming, just double checking mic works :P
<seb128> bah, firefox hates me
<tjaalton> huh, barriers don't work at all for me atm
<Laney> wtf
<Laney> just got randomly logged out while i was in the hangout
<seb128> Laney, works?
<Laney> trying to get back, sec
<tjaalton> background on extended monitor doesn't update
<tjaalton> who broke all this :)
<didrocks> bregma: seb128: would be interesting to see what version of xservers was installed
<didrocks> maybe not all deps are pulled?
<tjaalton> dist-upgrade right now would remove unity
<didrocks> tjaalton: you do have -proposed, right?
<tjaalton> no
<tjaalton> though I have the ppa enabled
<seb128> Laney, graa, sorry, hangout too my firefox down, I'm rejoining from chromium
<didrocks> ah, making sense :)
<tjaalton> might mess things
<Laney> HAHA
<didrocks> tjaalton: yeah, don't dist-upgrade, the breaks is there to protect you normally
<tjaalton> didrocks: right
<seb128> Laney, cyphermox: sorry, my laptop is swapping I'm having an hard time to join back
<seb128> yeah for tech...
<seb128> Laney, cyphermox, mpt, larsu: I need to reboot, my laptop is screwed, end up if there is nothing else to talk about, we will do another one next week with tu.s guys + mardy
<tjaalton> mlankhorst: virtualbox uploaded
<tjaalton> mesa-demos too
<Laney> hangouts work pretty well from my phone
<cyphermox> Laney: "How do I quit?" :D
<Laney> :D
<Laney> turns out you just press the big button
<cyphermox> heh
<cyphermox> I wouldn't even have the luxury of trying on the phone now, just running Ubuntu
<cyphermox> we totally need someone to write a hangout client
<Laney> it's so inexplicable that the mic doesn't work on the pc
<Laney> like, i can record myself in audacity
<Laney> but hangouts are just silent
<cyphermox> Laney: have you tried applying the trick that didrocks was recommending before?
<cyphermox> something about auto mic level balance in a dotfile
<mlankhorst> tjaalton: thanks
<Laney> I thought I did
<Laney> let me check
<cyphermox> http://blog.didrocks.fr/post/Getting-sound-working-during-a-hangout-in-raring
<cyphermox> maybe that can help ?  ^
<Laney> i've definitely done that before but maybe not on this installation?
<Laney> laney@raleigh> grep audio-flags options                                                                    ~/.config/google-googletalkplugin
<Laney> audio-flags=1
<Laney> :(
<Laney> ah well
<didrocks> waow I didn't know that trick was popular :)
<Laney> it is an excellent trick
<didrocks> (written on 31 december, you will note :p)
<Laney> new years hangout
<cyphermox> didrocks: yeah, it's very helpful
<didrocks> happy it helps (or not in this case for Laney though)
<Laney> it did help before
<Laney> had some problems during vUDS
<tseliot> mlankhorst: so nvidia-tegra3 and cardhu are in. I'll need some more time for tegra2
<Laney> cyphermox: http://pad.ubuntu.com/uds-1305-client-s-touch-system-settings
<Laney> it'd be good to reference https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bluetooth#phone and explain what can be done from the qmenumodel and what needs to be written
<Laney> and/or in https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Avv0-oHGVtjAdGRpUUpua2F0OU9RSzhhZ0hOcGJlWmc#gid=0
<didrocks> ii  xserver-common                            2:1.13.3-0ubuntu13                      all          common files used by various X servers
<didrocks> ii  xserver-xorg                              1:7.7+1ubuntu4                          i386         X.Org X server
<didrocks> mlankhorst: bregma: shouldn't the latest xorg be pullsed by unity dependencies? ^
<seb128> back
<seb128> sorry, had to power off the laptop for a bit, it wouldn't go back to normal speed
<seb128> like booting was 1m30 instead of 15s
<didrocks> seb128: wb
<didrocks> FYI:
<didrocks> ii  xserver-common                            2:1.13.3-0ubuntu13                      all          common files used by various X servers
<didrocks> ii  xserver-xorg                              1:7.7+1ubuntu4                          i386         X.Org X server
<didrocks> shouldn't the latest xorg be pulled by unity dependencies? ^
<mlankhorst> the xorg isn't important, except perhaps on arm
<seb128> didrocks, I guess, I though it needed the new libxi/libxfixes
<didrocks> mlankhorst: what package should I check?
<seb128> mlankhorst, it is, the barriers don't work if you update the libx without the server
<seb128> didrocks, xserver-xorg-core?
<didrocks> ii  libxi6:i386                               2:1.7.1.901-1                           i386         X11 Input extension library
<didrocks> ii  xserver-xorg-core                         2:1.13.3-0ubuntu13                      i386         Xorg X server - core server
<didrocks> (as the -common)
<seb128> that's the issue
<seb128> we need an updated depends on or a break somewhere
<didrocks> seb128: FYI: I looked at the dpkg after the upgrade in the job artefact
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> (you have before upgrade, after upgrade)
<didrocks> I was surprised, because the -check job would have failed without "check strict dependencies". But yeah, it's not pulling latest
<seb128> it's pulling the new libs
<seb128> which is enough to build
<didrocks> I mean during check
<seb128> right
<didrocks> I guess libxi should breaks or deps on latest xorg-server
<seb128> not sure if it's libxi or unity that should
<seb128> the lib seems to work
<didrocks> unity already takes latest libxi
<seb128> unity doesn't do what you expect though
<seb128> right
<didrocks> and it's using the barrier throught libxi, right?
<seb128> but unity should perhaps depends on xorg >>
<didrocks> so it means libxi is using a broken feature?
<didrocks> (that's my bare understanding)
<seb128> tjaalton, mlankhorst: ^
<seb128> didrocks, I've no idea how the barrier work
<didrocks> seb128: from the code, the barriers are just accessed through libxi
<mlankhorst> it's complicated, it's an abi mess because of the earlier versions of libxi/libxfixes
<didrocks> accessed*
<seb128> I guess we can make libxi Breaks: xorg-server <<
<mlankhorst> but the ones in the archive should work
<tseliot> ogra_: do you happen to have the sources of nvidia-tegra-ventana-codecs somewhere (I need the packaging scripts)? I can't find them on launchpad
<seb128> mlankhorst, the issue is that if you have xorg 1.13, upgrade libxi, restart unity, your barriers are broken
<seb128> mlankhorst, can you make libxi Breaks: xserver << new
<seb128> mlankhorst, so upgrading libxi forces a server upgrade
<didrocks> yeah, the only include is libxi
<mlankhorst> seb128: hm, I guess. Would it need to be kept until saucy is released or could we just sync to next libxi/xfixes afterwards?
<Laney> in theory you should keep it until the release
<seb128> right
<seb128> it's not like it was a big diff to merge
<seb128> libxi doesn't change every week either
<mlankhorst> hm ok
<mlankhorst> I guess libxfixes and libxi both need an explicit break on unity and xserver then
<seb128> they don't on unity
<seb128> just on the server
<seb128> the new server already breaks unity
<mlankhorst> just to be paranoid
<seb128> no need
<mlankhorst> well it's unity that those libs break, not xserver :P
<seb128> the libxi barrier code has a xserver side no?
<seb128> well, feel free to break on unity as well if you want
<mlankhorst> it breaks old unity because it fails to link correctly
<seb128> ?
<Laney> what if you have new libx*/unity and old xserver?
<mlankhorst> impossible, due to breaks
<seb128> new unity + new libxi + new libfixes + old xserver = non working barrier
<seb128> possible
<seb128> that's what we just tested and that is broken
<seb128> barriers are solid
<seb128> you can't go through
<mlankhorst> oh
<mlankhorst> doesn't unity have a breaks on old xserver then?
<seb128> no, why should it?
<seb128> it just use libxi
<seb128> if new libxi is incompatible with the old server it should force a server upgrade
<seb128> which seems to be the case
<seb128> which is why we are suggesting to make new libxi breaks xserver << new
<mlankhorst> new unity needs a break on xserver << 1.14
<mlankhorst> but fine I'll do it by proxy
<xnox> firefox-globalmenu is moving into universe is that correct?
<xnox> or is it back to our discussion of where to seed it?!
<mlankhorst> ok uploaded libxi/fixes
<seb128> mlankhorst, thanks
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<didrocks> great ;)
<didrocks> tests with forcing dist-upgrade running
<mlankhorst> oops, should have used dch -r
<mlankhorst> now it shows jcristau as uploader, can it be undone? :P
<seb128> lol
<desrt> seb128: good morningish
<seb128> desrt, good preafternoonish
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/backend-for-about-and-storage/+merge/173043
<seb128> Laney, if you could review it, I would welcome ... it's mostly a copy of yours with some rename and a bit less code (I don't need signal/updates, there is no way the OS is going to change while the panel is open)
<Laney> I was mainly thinking of desktop there
<seb128> Laney, desktop?
<seb128> Laney, is that a reply to my "there is no way the OS is going to change"? ;-)
<Laney> yeah
<seb128> Laney, well, if you dist-upgrade with the info panel update and you don't get the version updating live that's not going to be the end of the world :p
<seb128> Laney, I doubt gnome-control-center does refresh dynamically like that either ;-)
<seb128> with the info panel *open*...
<Laney> yeah, proabably not
<Laney> and that's read-only anyway
<Laney> ah, QSettings, that's cool
<Laney> was wondering what that was about
<xnox> Laney: the same/different background transitions look awesome in the backgrounds settings!
<Laney> xnox: thanks, was quite ... interesting to figure that one out
<Laney> got some review comments on my SDK widget to include that there earlier
<Laney> hopefully will be reusable soon
<Laney> seb128: feel free to tell me you don't want to do those nitpicks. I only push back a bit because this is the best time to get little things like that tidied up.
<seb128> Laney, those comments are welcome
<seb128> Laney, where would you suggest getting the infos? in the constructor function?
<Laney> no, Kaleo advised me to do that in the getter
<Laney> do something like if (m_OsVersion.isEmpty() || m_OsVersion.isNull()) // get the stuff
<seb128> oh ok
<mlankhorst> seb128: should be ok with the new versions
<seb128> mlankhorst, great, unity tests are running, let's see how that goes
<seb128> Laney, I guess constructor/getter is a question of start time hit against lazy loading
<Laney> exactly
<seb128> Laney, ok, updated, thanks for the review ;-)
<Laney> thanks!
<Laney> I can't think how to do the dynamic icon thing
<seb128> Laney, what dynamic icon?
<Laney> for bluetooth
<Laney> like it has to be dimmed in some situations
<Laney> and get an overlay in others
<seb128> seems like somebody to bother the toolkit guys about :p
<Laney> let's see if just providing a PageComponent lets it go into the grid
 * Laney suddenly remembers to push gsd
<seb128> Laney, http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/ubuntu-12.10/qml/mobile/qml-ubuntu-components-popups0-defaultsheet.html
<seb128> Laney, isn't that working for the popups?
<Laney> what popups?
<seb128> Laney, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bluetooth?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=phone-bluetooth-pair.png
<seb128> Laney, I though that's what you called "overlay"
<Laney> no
<seb128> the pin dialog
<seb128> oh ok
<Laney> this: In the System Settings overview, the âBluetoothâ item should be dull if Bluetooth is off, glowing if Bluetooth is on, and have a headset emblem if any headset is paired.
<seb128> oh!
<seb128> seems like we need 3 icons
<Laney> yeah
<seb128> and a bit of smartness in entrycomponent.qml
<Laney> I was looking to see if it could be done in the .settings somehow
<seb128> I doubt it
<Laney> we don't have any EntryComponents which insert into the grid currently
<seb128> oh, good point
<Laney> let me check that it works
<seb128> well, I think you can have one
<seb128> the default is just to not have it since it's not required
<seb128> you can specify an entry in the .settings
<Laney> I guess so too
 * Laney tries it
<Laney> seb128: did you push your branch?
<seb128> Laney, I did, and I hate bzr not using --remember by default :p
<seb128> Laney, pushed to the right one this time
<Laney> as long as you didn't push to trunk :P
<seb128> Laney, no, that part is ok ;-)
<Laney> http://ubuntuone.com/5RkzGARfpzefaSQ2shCayj
<Laney> I think I get this bug much worse than you ...
<Laney> (yes, having that EntryComponent works)
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> Laney, did you report it? that seems an ubuntu toolkit bug to me
<Laney> it's the two I filed on u-s-s
<seb128> Laney, I pinged #ubuntu-app-devel for triaging guidance on the product at least
<seb128> ogra_, how do I check if my image is flipped or not?
<seb128> hum, that seems like unflipped image
<Laney> if adb shell gives you an ubuntu environment is one way
<m4n1sh> jbicha: please try out the 0.9.6 release
<m4n1sh> I disabled the checkbox in it, hopefully
<m4n1sh> it worked on my side atleast
<jbicha> m4n1sh: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/activity-log-manager/0.9.6-0ubuntu1
<jbicha> I tested with 0.9.6 and the box was disabled but visible; I didn't want it visible because it's confusing
<m4n1sh> jbicha: I spent the last hour trying top package it
<m4n1sh> jbicha: https://code.launchpad.net/~zeitgeist/ubuntu/saucy/activity-log-manager/update-to-0-9-6/+merge/173060
<m4n1sh> I just missed it
<jbicha> I'm sorry, I didn't realize you didn't know I was working on it
<m4n1sh> jbicha: never mind, this was tough. It is still a learning experience for me
<m4n1sh> took me more than an hour actually to package it, learnt a lot
<m4n1sh> jbicha: can you push your changes to lp:ubuntu/activity-log-manager ?
<jbicha> m4n1sh: that should happen automatically in the next hour or so
<m4n1sh> jbicha: do you suggest to move to valac 0.20?
<m4n1sh> right now it is on 0.16
<jbicha> m4n1sh: hmm? it builds fine against vala 0.20
<m4n1sh> in the build system it requires 0.16, I didnt check the deps
<jbicha> as long as it builds against the default vala in distros (Debian & Ubuntu both use 0.20) I wouldn't worry about it
<m4n1sh> jbicha: nautilus needs to be moved to zeitgeist-2.0 too https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-lens-video/+bug/1197569
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1197569 in upstart-app-launch (Ubuntu) "Move from zeitgeist-1.0 to zeitgeist-2.0" [Undecided,New]
<m4n1sh> I would work on it now. Would submit the MP in a few hours
<mhr3> seb128, ping?
<seb128> mhr3, hey
<mhr3> seb128, hola, i have a tough question for you
<mhr3> seb128, how do i make `bzr bd` build me a armhf deb on my amd64 machine? :)
<seb128> mhr3, you better ask #ubuntu-devel about cross compiling
<seb128> xnox/doko/cjwatson
<jbicha> mhr3: do you use sbuild?
<mhr3> jbicha, no
<jbicha> you should ;)
<mhr3> jbicha, or maybe... i just let bzr bd do what it wants
<xnox> mhr3: bzr bd --builder debuild -aarmhf
<xnox> mhr3: but you should have cross-toolchain and cross-builddeps installed
<mhr3> xnox, wow, it really is that simple?
<xnox> mhr3: sudo apt-get -aarmh build-dep $pkg
<xnox> mhr3: plus enable armhf foreign arch in dpkg & sources.
<mhr3> xnox, awesome, will try, thx
<xnox> mhr3: most of it is one time setup.
<xnox> mhr3: that's given that your package is cross-buildable.
<xnox> mhr3: Here are the auto-cross-builder results of main-ish packges
<xnox> <mhr3> seb128, how do i make `bzr bd` build me a armhf deb on my amd64 machine? :)
<xnox> mhr3: t
<xnox> mhr3: http://people.canonical.com/~cjwatson/cross/armhf/saucy/
 * xnox looks at my fingers for typing badly today.
<seb128> Laney, want to review my update that addresses your review comment? ;-)
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> trying to think about how to send data from one EntryComponent to another :-)
<Laney> might resume that tomorrow now
<Laney> there you go
<Laney> now I think it's the perfect weather for a bike ride
<Laney> see you
<seb128> Laney, enjoy!
<mlankhorst> seb128: is there anything missing now for transitioning?
<seb128> mlankhorst, still unity, but I guess we will check tomorrow morning and unblock then
<mlankhorst> ok
<seb128> mlankhorst, we need Laney to unblock anyway and he's biking atm
<seb128> mlankhorst, so good time to call it a day ;-)
 * mlankhorst was toying some with wine anyway
<mlankhorst> https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=47824 to be exact
<ubot2`> Freedesktop bug 47824 in Other "osmesa using --enable-shared-glapi depends on libgl" [Normal,New]
<mlankhorst> not being part of the wine source code increases the chance a lot that it will get accepted..
<m4n1sh> jbicha: activity-log-manager SRU for quantal is LP  #1197904
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1197904 in activity-log-manager (Ubuntu) "[SRU] Fix activity-log-manager 0.9.4 in quantal for wrong usage of GtkApplication" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1197904
<m4n1sh> wel, changelog has to be updated to add 1197904
<jbicha> m4n1sh: and raring?
<m4n1sh> jbicha: working on it too
<jbicha> you could have repurposed an existing bug for the sru
<m4n1sh> this one for quantal is old
<m4n1sh> yes, but I thought a clean new bug would be better
<Saviq> jbicha, thanks for the line in the SimpleSbuild wiki, problem with that is it uses QEMU, which we've had problems repeatedly when testing / pbuilding
<Saviq> jbicha, I'll try now and see what's my mileage
<m4n1sh> jbicha: done for raring too https://code.launchpad.net/~zeitgeist/ubuntu/raring/activity-log-manager/fix-1197904-wrong-gtkapplication-usage/+merge/173073
<m4n1sh> Ubuntu GNOME is not listed under distributions in launchpad - https://launchpad.net/distros
<m4n1sh> how to log a bug specific to this distro?
<jbicha> m4n1sh: Ubuntu GNOME is an Ubuntu flavor, not a full-fledged separate distro
<m4n1sh> jbicha: so launchpad.net/ubuntu-gnome is the place to log the bugs for flavor specific bugs/wishlist?
<jbicha> just report bugs the same way you'd report against anything else in Ubuntu
<jbicha> there's also #ubuntu-gnome
<m4n1sh> you asked for standalone activity-log-manager for ubuntu-gnome
<m4n1sh> but it isnt installed in ubuntu-gnome
<jbicha> you can report that against ubuntu-gnome-meta
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-07-05
<pitti_> Good morning
<RAOF> pitti: Good morning!
<Mirv> hello
<czajkowski> aloha
<pitti> bonjour tout le monde !
 * TheMuso waves.
<czajkowski> Happy Friday :)
<TheMuso> Indeed, and happy bug fix day too. ;)
<TheMuso> Well, maybe not fix, but workaround.
<desrt> friday already?
<desrt> dear lord
 * desrt needs to go to bed
<pitti> night desrt
<didrocks> Mirv: hey! how are you?
<didrocks> Mirv: small question on qtsystems: you don't handle the transition from the previous version (with binary packaging containing both the library and the qtdeclaratives one) and the new one with separated binary packages? (I'm fine with that, just in case you published those, some people will maybe be surprised by the upgrade)
<didrocks> Mirv: otherwise ack on qtsystem, I can sponsor and new it
<didrocks> Mirv: do I have anything else in my queue for you?
<didrocks> Mirv: FYI, relaunching unity with "check with whole ppa" so that the tests are taking the latest xorg-server for testing
<Mirv> didrocks: hello. right, it's not handling PPA version, but realistically not many have used that inofficial module.
<Mirv> (or handling so that PPA version users would get the QML modules)
<Mirv> didrocks: the other was lp:~kubuntu-packagers/kubuntu-packaging/qtfeedback-opensource-src + https://launchpad.net/~canonical-qt5-edgers/+archive/qt5-beta2/+files/qtfeedback-opensource-src_5.0%7Egit20130529.orig.tar.gz (reviewed by Ken so far)
<Mirv> didrocks: and then handling of the ubuntu-html5-theme https://code.launchpad.net/~timo-jyrinki/cupstream2distro-config/enable_ubuntu-html5-theme_daily/+merge/172958
<Mirv> I think that's it for now, I'm waiting for renato to test the new qtpim snapshot and the qtbase patches I just rebased have not been tested either yet, so those shouldn't be sponsored yet
<didrocks> Mirv: ok, so I'm sponsoring qtsystems for now
<didrocks> Mirv: then, preNEWing ubuntu-html5-theme
<didrocks> if good, approving your branch and letting you deploy
<didrocks> finally reviewing qtfeedback
<didrocks> Mirv: meanwhile, you are handling the dailies?
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel!
<jibel> Bonjour didrocks
<Mirv> didrocks: yes, handling those, I was meaning to ask about unity armhf build failure though, does https://launchpadlibrarian.net/144210298/buildlog_ubuntu-saucy-armhf.unity_7.0.2%2B13.10.20130705-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz look random failure since the code should be the same you successfully build yesterday evening?
<Mirv> or is it because more X got in and now unity fails because of that
<didrocks> Mirv: maybe just retry a build in launchpad? (it seems to be a random one)
<Mirv> ok.. right LP build retry is cheap
<didrocks> Mirv: then, if you relaunch the stack with "check with whole ppa" or "foo" for package, it won't rebuild it
<didrocks> Mirv: just taking into account its status
<Mirv> yep, I know
<didrocks> Mirv: ubuntu-html5-theme will be used by qtcreator, am I right?
<didrocks> Mirv: hum, ubuntu-html5-theme should be LGPL, not LGPL3+
<Mirv> didrocks: not directly / necessarily, but yes it's depended by qtcreator-plugin-ubuntu. LGPL to be similarly licensed to the plugin, right?
<didrocks> Mirv: yeah, we don't do +
<didrocks> Mirv: I'll do a MP shortly
<didrocks> there are other changes as well
<Mirv> ok.. thank you. one thing I was wondering whether to put some sort of license file separately to the img folder, just a text for example to specify that those are CC-BY-SA, since it's only mentioned in debian/copyright now
<didrocks> Mirv: yeah, we generally do that
<didrocks> it's not mandatory, but we can
<didrocks> I have one handy IIRC, one sec
<didrocks> hum, it's a CC:BY-SA 2
<didrocks> well, let's forget about it for now
<didrocks> hum, interestingly those themes includes jquery
<mlankhorst> the waiting is on unity now
<Mirv> didrocks: one of the examples only, right?
<didrocks> Mirv: yep
<didrocks> Mirv: do you have the autopilot tests passing for you?
<didrocks> for ubuntu-html5-theme?
<Mirv> didrocks: yes, they passed
<Mirv> 3 tests OK
<didrocks> Mirv: ah, it's a bad dep
<didrocks> Mirv: the autopilot ones needs the examples
 * didrocks fixes
<didrocks> Mirv: there is no upstream merger setup, right?
<Mirv> didrocks: there is, https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-html5-theme-devs/ubuntu-html5-theme/ambiance
<Mirv> daily builds go to SDK Release PPA
<didrocks> oh, it's already in stacks/head/sdk.cfg
<didrocks> ok
<Mirv> yep. or actually, not going to the PPA it seems, but still already there.
<didrocks> Mirv: let me add a bootstrap commit as well so that we don't list every commit from rev 1
<Mirv> ok
<didrocks> Mirv: here we go: https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/ubuntu-html5-theme/clean-package/+merge/173147 :)
<didrocks> https://code.launchpad.net/~timo-jyrinki/cupstream2distro-config/enable_ubuntu-html5-theme_daily/+merge/172958 approved meanwhile, please deploy once it's merged
 * didrocks refreshes the whitelist on the archive admin machine
<didrocks> done
<Mirv> ok, doing one more rebuild and approving then
<didrocks> great :)
<didrocks> ok, so now qtfeedback
<didrocks> Mirv: qtfeedback5-dev is multiarched
<didrocks> it needs I guess:
<didrocks> Multi-Arch: same
<didrocks> Pre-Depends: ${misc:Pre-Depends}
<didrocks> (not the private-dev though)
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, fixing
<didrocks> Mirv: examples/hapticsquare/hapticbutton.* is LGPL, with blabla, clause, not BSD3 and same for doc/src/snippets/qtfeedbackdocsample/qtfeedbackdocsample.cpp
<didrocks> Mirv: apart from that, looks good :)
<didrocks> oh sorry
<didrocks> one additional stenza in the end :p
<Mirv> :)
<Mirv> pushed the multiarch change
<didrocks> Mirv: perfect then! :)
 * didrocks pulls
<didrocks> Mirv: thanks! sponsoring as well
<Mirv> thanks!
<didrocks> (and then NEWing in distro)
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<seb128> hey didrocks, Mirv
<seb128> qtsystems \o/
<didrocks> hey seb128!
<didrocks> seb128: and qtfeedback, even if you don't care :p
<didrocks> and ubuntu-html5-theme under dailies! :)
<seb128> didrocks, don't care about this one :p
<Mirv> hey seb128
<didrocks> seb128: I preNEWed it FYI, if you see it in NEW
<Mirv> seb128: were you planning to sponsor that https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/ubuntu/saucy/qtdeclarative-opensource-src/merge/+merge/172054 ?
<didrocks> Mirv: maybe we should try just a rebuild of the sdk stack with ubuntu-html5-theme once you deployed the change?
<seb128> Mirv, I can do, I didn't have a lock on it but I was planning to if nobody else was beating me to it
<Mirv> that looks good, but qtwebkit will probably not go in as is, it probably has the same DPR problem that I had earlier
<didrocks> to be done and NEWed before the week-end :)
<seb128> Mirv, I will do it this morning
<Mirv> didrocks: yes, I will check how it goes
<Mirv> seb128: ok, thank you
<seb128> didrocks, Mirv: unity tests seem to be happy, that's with the new xorg right?
<Mirv> seb128: the tests run yesterday evening were fine, today there was a arm build failure and a rebuild is ongoing in case it was a random failure, at https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-unity/+archive/daily-build/+build/4771564
<seb128> looks at http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/autopilot-saucy-daily_release/335/testReport/
<seb128> Mirv, ok, thanks
<seb128> Mirv, do you have the build log of the build that failed?
<Mirv> and then running checks again if the rebuild is fine, after which it can be considered to be published
<Mirv> seb128: doh, not anymore, didrocks glanced at it as well
<seb128> ok, let's see what the new try gives
<lan3y> morning
<didrocks> Mirv: it passed this time?
<Laney> hrm
<Mirv> didrocks: still running
<seb128> Laney, good morning ... what was the n3y about? ;-)
<seb128> Laney, good morning ... what was the n3y about? ;-)
<Laney> must have gotten disconnected overnight
<Laney> happy friday!
<didrocks> Mirv: ok, maybe we can start the tests meanwhile to not loose time (as i386 is built), mind running with check with whole ppa to dist-upgrade and getting new xorg?
<didrocks> happy Friday Laney!
<Mirv> didrocks: ok, doing
<didrocks> thanks ;)
<Mirv> (and makes sense)
<didrocks> Mirv: that will be an issue I guess if one day we start running the tests on slower archs to buildâ¦
<didrocks> (like on the phone, so need to wait for armhf to be available)
<seb128> Laney, happy friday! ;-)
<didrocks> ok, unity - armhf build seems to have gone further in the build than where it failed
<Mirv> didrocks: any idea why ubuntu-html5-theme fails trying to fetch revision 57 (the neweest revision is 56)?
<Mirv> and yes, redeployed and issues a run now
<Mirv> didrocks: should the bootstrap have been '55' instead of '56'?
<Mirv> (the code has last_upstream_rev + 1)
<didrocks> oh oh oh, you're rgith
<didrocks> right*
<didrocks> I should have set 55â¦
<didrocks> Mirv: let me do a dummy commit if you don't mind? (changing the rev would be the same anyway)
<Mirv> didrocks: ok!
<didrocks> Mirv: ok, you can relaunch now, sorry for that :)
<Mirv> thanks, np!
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, seb128, et Laney
<pitti> hey Mirv
<pitti> Laney: hm, I got disconnected as well; perhaps it was freenode and not our proxies then
<seb128> pitti, salut, ca va bien ?
<Laney> I tend to blame freenode rather than my VPS provider in such situations :P
<pitti> seb128: oui, merci
<Laney> ps. hey, happy friday!
<Laney> got good weekend plans?
<pitti> seb128: et toi ? as-tu l'Ã©tÃ© maintenant ?
<Mirv> hei pitti
<seb128> pitti, Ã§a va, non ... mais normalement l'Ã©tÃ© arrive cette aprÃ¨s-midi ou demain
<seb128> et toi ?
<pitti> Laney: aye, a wedding from a friend of mien
 * seb128 plans to enjoy the nice weather this w.e (if the forecast is correct)
<pitti> seb128: 20 degrees and dry, what more can I ask for..
<seb128> oh, maybe try to watch the wimbledon's final on sunday
<seb128> (try because I'm not sure they are going to broadcast on public channels here and I'm not subscribed to the privates that have the rights)
<Laney> forecast 26 and 27 here(!)
<seb128> nice!
<seb128> same here ;-)
<Laney> bah, what's up with update-apt-xapian-index
<Laney> bug #1118888
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1118888 in apt-xapian-index (Ubuntu) "/usr/sbin/update-apt-xapian-index crashes daily" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1118888
<Laney> broke cdimage builds and i got it on dist-upgrade too
<darkxst> seb128, hi
<seb128> where is mvo? hidding? :p
<seb128> darkxst, hey
<darkxst> I uploaded g-s-d 3.8 with a slightly patched g-c-c 3.6 to ppa:darkxst/gsd38
<darkxst> ibus is disabled and no keyboard indicator
<darkxst> lid close actions for power panel are gone
<darkxst> otherwise everything else should work like, screenshots, media keys and automount helper
<Laney> bug #1038429
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1038429 in software-center (Ubuntu) "update-software-center crashed with order (MRO) for bases SafeConfigParser, object in __new__()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1038429
<Laney> indeed something pulled python-configparser in with this dist-upgrade
<seb128> Laney, right, I got that one installed as well
<seb128> darkxst, why is the lid action dropped?
<darkxst> seb128, I think the settings are dropped from g-s-d
<seb128> hum, we need to add them back then
<darkxst> seb128, https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-settings-daemon/commit/?id=58cb4eee64bbd8ca43111b1f80fdaacde8ad5f12
<darkxst> but I suppose there is more than that
<Laney> didn't it move to logind?
<seb128> Laney, the suspend/hibernate did, but isn't g-s-d supposed to keep inhibitors to prevent suspend in case it's needed?
<seb128> or is there equivalent config options for logind?
<seb128> pitti, ^
<pitti> seb128: sorry, missing the original question
<pitti> oh, question from darkxst?
<seb128> pitti, in a logind world, can we configure what to do on lid close?
<seb128> like suspend if on battery, don't if on a/c
<pitti> seb128: sure; didn't I fix that like two weeks ago?
<Laney> It's about the 3.8 upstream behaviour
<pitti> seb128: the g-c-c UI and gsettings keys are supposed to work
<pitti> ah
<pitti> does 3.8 remove the lid config behaviour from g-c-c?
<pitti> apparently so
<seb128> pitti, well, part of the lid config was an Ubuntu patch to start
<seb128> but yeah, they removed some of the keys
<seb128> e.g https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-settings-daemon/commit/?id=58cb4eee64bbd8ca43111b1f80fdaacde8ad5f12
<pitti> seb128, darkxst: there's /etc/systemd/logind.conf for its default behaviour for lid switches, but that's not supposed to be for UIs, but for what happens on VTs or if nobody is logged in
<darkxst> I disabled the lid close patch from g-c-c 3.6 because the keys don't exist anymore
<seb128> Laney, do you watch emails for merge requests or do you prefer IRC pings? ;-) (on system settings)
<seb128> darkxst, we should probably revert those changes...
<Laney> I do see the emails but I don't always do them straight away
<Laney> so every now and again I check lp
<seb128> Laney, well, no hurry, I can wait some hours ;-)
<Laney> I want to address the review comments on CrossFadeImage first
<seb128> Laney, just send one using the newly landed qtsystem to get the disk space
<pitti> darkxst: yeah, my patch to 3.6 was because 3.6 doesn't yet get along with the current logind behaviour; it's not needed for 3.8
<Laney> cool!
<seb128> Laney, wfm, good luck with that ;-)
<pitti> darkxst: so it seems gnome 3.8 just dropped teh configurability of that :(
<darkxst> pitti, for now just looking g-s-d 3.8 with g-c-c 3.6
<pitti> darkxst: hm, then you will have the config panel for that which won't do anything?
<pitti> darkxst: doesn't that crash on the missing gsettings keys?
<darkxst> pitti, yes
<darkxst> pitti, no I disabled the patch
<pitti> darkxst: ah, you reverted 58cb4e?
<pitti> that'd do it
<seb128> he dropped the g-c-c patch that add the config UI rather I think
<darkxst> pitti, the ubuntu patch that add lid close boxes
<seb128> (those UI are an ubuntu patch)
<pitti> aah
<pitti> I forgot about that
<seb128> but we added the patch for a reason
<Laney> so I can see why gnome may have dropped it if they didn't have UI for it
<seb128> we want that configurability...
<pitti> but yeah, there was some discussion with upstream about making that configurable as our users got angry about removing it
<mlankhorst> seb128: but I think the xorg side is ready now, just waiting for unity
<seb128> mlankhorst, unity is still building on armhf: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-unity/+archive/daily-build/+build/4771564
<mlankhorst> ok
<darkxst> seb128, pitti : so, how do we handle that w/ logind?
<pitti> darkxst: what is "that"?
<Laney> seb128: Just quickly looking at the diff - surely you can avoid repeating that division so much :P
<seb128> mlankhorst, btw looking at our versions page, how come we are behind debian on libx11/libxrandr/libxcb versions?
<darkxst> pitti, lid close action
<pitti> darkxst: I guess you just disable our g-c-c patch to add configurability for it, and drop the g-s-d patch for inhibiting logind
<seb128> Laney, the getFormattedSize function? I just moved that, it was already in :p
<pitti> darkxst: with upstream g-s-d 3.8 and current logind it should just work and suspend on lid close
<seb128> Laney, I copied the function from the qtsystem example ... but I can change it if wanted ;-)
<darkxst> pitti, that is exactly what I have done
<Laney> doing / 1000 loads of times on the same value seems like it could be optimised
<Mirv> unity autopilot tests failed again, a diff compared to the one run 4 hours ago: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5846095/
<mlankhorst> seb128: I didn't want to update everything at once, so I mostly waited for new x1.14 first.
<seb128> pitti, darkxst: I don't want suspend on lid close!
<seb128> mlankhorst, ok
<Mirv> seb128: unity AP ^
<pitti> seb128: well, it's what gnome 3.8 does, so for ubuntu-gnome that seems right?
<Mirv> seem preview navigation related
<seb128> Mirv, shrug, seems like an issue with the dash previews :/
<pitti> seb128: are we talking about ubuntu-gnome here, or about updating ubuntu's g-s-d to 3.8?
<seb128> pitti, updating g-s-d to 3.8 in saucy (which darkxst is working on)
<pitti> seb128: aaah -- I assumed we talked about ubuntu-gnome
<seb128> pitti, well, Ubuntu GNOME wants the new version and they build from the archive
<seb128> so they need it in the archive...
<pitti> seb128: well, we certainly do want to forward-port our UI patch then, and revert the g-s-d patches which dropped these keys?
<Mirv> didrocks: do you think yet another autopilot run should be tried? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5846095/ - compared green run 4:05:34 to this failed one 8:03:06
<seb128> pitti, right, the initial question was "is there a new way to do that with logind, or should we revert the drop in g-s-d"
<pitti> seb128: logind can't and won't read gsettings
<didrocks> Mirv: hum, the failures seem to be on both configuration though? weird that flacky tests are failing the same way at the same time
<seb128> pitti, so it's still g-s-d that should "play" with inhibitors?
<pitti> seb128: we can globally disable it in logind.conf of course, but otherwise it should be under g-s-d's control
<didrocks> Mirv: oh, it can be that the network connexion is suddenly bad in the QA datacenter?
<pitti> seb128: yes
<didrocks> jibel_: does this sound possible? ^
<seb128> ok, makes sense
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<didrocks> (as it's the previews)
<Mirv> ah, the previews are slow when network throttles, true
<pitti> seb128: the logind suspend on lid is really supposed to just be a fallback if there is no session running (VT, lightdm)
<seb128> didrocks, Mirv: where are the screencasts of those?
<pitti> seb128: (same with the power button)
<didrocks> seb128: no more screencast by now for unity tests
<seb128> didrocks, that's why I couldn't find them yesterday :p
<didrocks> seb128: this is what makes the machine exploding (recordmydesktop)
<seb128> pitti, alright, that works for me, thanks!!
<didrocks> jibel_ looked for better setting than "take 8G of ram)
<seb128> darkxst, so we need to revert the feature drop in g-s-d and re-enable the g-c-c patch
<didrocks> Mirv: let's wait for jibel's feedback?
<Mirv> ok
<darkxst> seb128, ok
<Mirv> good to know, I was also wondering where the screencasts went
<seb128> darkxst, thanks for the work on that btw! ;-)
<darkxst> np
<didrocks> Mirv: yeah, rdm sucks and fragment all the mem :/
<didrocks> that's what made the dbus hang and so onâ¦
<didrocks> (it's still enable for other tests)
<didrocks> but we need to find better settings than what the QA team picked
<didrocks> (in autopilot)
<jibel> didrocks, I don't see any connectivity issue in the lab
<didrocks> jibel: all the previews failed on both config
<didrocks> same build ran previously
<didrocks> it can be the server as well
<didrocks> Mirv: maybe try relaunching? (you need to stop the build monitoring first)
<didrocks> Mirv: and let's blame the server? :p
<jibel> didrocks, maybe there was but it is no more
 * pitti uploads pkg-create-dbgsym to ignore the transitional unity-2d-dbg and thus produce proper dbgsym again
<didrocks> ok, let's see the new run :)
<pitti> seb128, didrocks ^ FYI
<didrocks> thanks pitti!
<pitti> it's a heuristic hack, but *shrug*
<pitti> it depends on those packages having "transitional" anywhere in their description
<pitti> (as I can't inspect their contents)
<Mirv> didrocks: ok
<Mirv> here we go again. maybe during this the arm build also finishes.
<seb128> pitti, great!
<jibel> didrocks, as for OOM, systems have been running for 24h running unity testsuite several time and the state of the systems is good. That confirms recordmydesktop was the problem
<seb128> jibel, we miss the recording though, we have no idea what's happening with the previous there :/
<pitti> Schroedinger's test!
<seb128> hehe
<jibel> seb128, I understand that, but using rmd kills the systems, if you know an alternative to rmd that push less pressure on the test host, I'm happy to patch autopilot
<seb128> jibel, hum, but I don't... ;-)
<Laney> there are alternatives like kazam but I don't know how they stack up
<pitti> jibel: is that the giant memory leak you talked about which doesn't ever go away even with module unloading etc?
<jibel> pitti, not a leak but memory fragmentation
 * didrocks pulled a new version of cupstream2distro, if you see any prepare/publish job failing. (I've patched the existing .project files to be compatible)
<didrocks> seb128: Mirv, FYI ^
<seb128> didrocks, ok
<jibel> pitti, but yes, after a run of unity with rmd enabled there are ~4GB of RAM that are never reallocated
<seb128> didrocks, Mirv: unity armhf build worked \o/ (well, it's building the debs)
<didrocks> seb128: phew!
<seb128> " Built successfully"
<seb128> \o/
<jibel> a solution could be to run without rmd and when a test fail re-run it with rmd. there is the case of unstable tests but we can either find a way to mark them unstable or just mark them failed.
<Mirv> \o/
<Riddell> didrocks: don't you love us any more? :(
<didrocks> Riddell: too many FTBFS in my inbox from that ppa, and TBH, I don't really use that team perms
<didrocks> Riddell: still having access to ~kubuntu-packagers, right?
<didrocks> (yep, through core-dev)
<Riddell> yeah you're still elite :)
<didrocks> ahah :)
<seb128> Laney, I opened https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1198116 for info
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1198116 in Ubuntu UI Toolkit "[ListItems] Recent update changed the ListItem.Base margins" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> Laney, I find the buttons (e.g "Check for updates" in the about panel) a bit too big since the update
 * Laney goes blind at the orange buttons
<Laney> well noticed
<seb128> that as well...
<Laney> that's design btw
<Laney> I filed a bug on that and it got closed as invalid
<seb128> the orange or the margin?
<Laney> orange
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> you combine the small margin and the orange and you get "in your face" buttons :/
<Mirv> the dash preview tests still failed :( http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5846307/ (compared to the last fail)
<Mirv> and some new tests as well, pretty random some of them
<seb128> Mirv, did you try to run the preview tests locally?
<davmor2> Hey guy on Saucy I noticed that recently software updater is only showing it's icon in the launcher for the initial window after it is displaying a python logo instead http://ubuntuone.com/2ou2Mr66aE9feaFUT2UHuF
<Mirv> seb128: not yet, have to telco now, will try later with english locale (often useful)
<Mirv> seb128: yep, seems to work locally with both the previous build and this one
<seb128> so why does it fail on the jenkins :/
<Mirv> meanwhile, ubuntu-html5-theme built but autopilot tests fail, I see the problem and trying to fix it shortly
<didrocks> Mirv: want me to review your ubuntu-html5-theme branch (for the AP test) if you have any handy?
<Mirv> didrocks: not yet, I'll ping if needing (alex is soon awake as well)
<didrocks> ok :)
<mlankhorst> booo, why are some libs still not m-a: same in saucy
<mlankhorst> it makes it hard to coinstall all the gstreamer0.10 plugins
<czajkowski> is this her first?
<czajkowski> bah
<jbicha> mpt: what does "Require my password when switching screen on" mean in the first screenshot of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityAndPrivacySettings
<seb128> jbicha, hey, it's likely "lock on idle"?
<seb128> e.g after idle time: turn off the screen and lock it
<mpt> jbicha, I actually don't remember
<mpt> Maybe it's "Returning from screen saver"?
<jbicha> ok, I'm wanting to move the Screen Lock ON|OFF and Lock after _ minutes settings there too since gnome-control-center 3.8 moves those settings to their own privacy panel
<mpt> Makes sense
<mpt> (so long as screensaver settings themselves are a disaster, at least)
<mpt> jbicha, what does "Screen Lock ON|OFF" do?
<jbicha> org.gnome.desktop.screensaver lock-enabled
<mpt> Is that equivalent to "Require my password when returning from screen saver"?
<jbicha> yes I believe so
<mpt> Overuse of on/off switches strikes again :-]
<jbicha> well you can do nearly whatever you like what panel now since it's independent of gnome-control-center
<mpt> right
<mpt> So a "Returning from screen saver" checkbox at the bottom of that group would make sense
<mpt> And then the time setting below that, perhaps?
<mpt> though not indented, since it's not actually dependent
<seb128> Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/serial-not-available/+merge/173229 (fyi)
<seb128> kenvandine, you forgot to change the MR status?
<Laney> cheers
<Laney> that crossfadeimage stuff swallowed most of this day :/
<kenvandine> seb128, no i didn't
<kenvandine> was waiting for CI
<kenvandine> https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/signon-plugin-oauth2/arches/+merge/173233
<kenvandine> seb128, can you review that?
<kenvandine> i need that to land so i can unblock cjwatson
<Laney> I thought we were letting stuff just fail to build / depwait on ppc
<kenvandine> Laney, long story :)
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, approved on the basis that I trust you :p
<seb128> kenvandine, you need to change the status I can't
<jbicha> will there be an updated Unity today or will it wait for Monday?
<didrocks> jbicha: we are trying hard to get one passing tests
<seb128> jbicha, why?
<didrocks> jbicha: but we maybe have a clue that enabling -proposed block things
<seb128> jbicha, do you need something?
<jodh> desrt: I'm looking at the doc for the d-conf "changed" signal which states, "Appending each item in changes to prefix will give the absolute path of each changed item."
<jodh> desrt: presumably, that should say to stick a '/' between the prefix and each changes item right?
<jbicha> no, I used -proposed to try the new X and I don't feel like adding a PPA to get Unity back
<jbicha> I'm also fine with Unity staying in -proposed over the weekend
<seb128> jbicha, it's likely what will happen
<Laney> dobey: Did you see the bug I assigned to you? Reckon you'll be able to get to it?
<dobey> what bug?
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-center/+bug/1038429
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1038429 in software-center (Ubuntu Saucy) "update-software-center crashed with order (MRO) for bases SafeConfigParser, object in __new__()" [Critical,Confirmed]
<seb128> ok, just pushed another mr, and on that note time for some exercice
<seb128> be back in an hours to read scrollback/clean emails and stuff and then calling it a week
<seb128> having a good w.e for those who will be off by then ;-)
<didrocks> see you later seb128!
<didrocks> Laney: so, I'm trying now unity + new xorg from proposed without dist-upgrading
<didrocks> as we were impacted by this software-center issue
<didrocks> I hope to get the results in ~20 minutes
<didrocks> if good, I'm going to publish unity into proposed
<didrocks> a shame that we lost maybe the whole day of publishing unity due to software-center :/
<didrocks> bregma: pstolowski: dednick: FYI ^ (I'll keep you posted)
<bregma> sweet
<pstolowski> didrocks: thanks
<didrocks> the result on intel is promissing
<didrocks> 6 failures
<Laney> cool
 * didrocks waits and stare at ati
<Laney> I hope the s-c fix can be done today ...
 * didrocks hopes as well, as long as previews are default for the desktop, people will notice :p
<Laney> didn't get any confirmation it's being worked though
<pstolowski> didrocks: people will notice previews for apps are now super fast and will be happy :)
<didrocks> pstolowski: ahah, true! :)
<didrocks> bregma: my only positive ":)" with this day for unity lost is that we found brandon's regression that we won't have noticed I guess otherwiseâ¦
<bregma> he's been sent back to the drawing board on that one
<didrocks> heh
<didrocks> pstolowski: bregma: ati: 9 failures
<didrocks> ok, so publishing unity into proposed
<pstolowski> \o/
<Laney> on a FRIDAY EVENING!
<didrocks> Laney: on a f*** friday evening :)
<Laney> funn
<Laney> :P
<didrocks> Laney: with the amount of run it had, I'm trustful :)
<Laney> sounds like we've both had a day of tussles then
 * Laney glares at qt/qml
<pstolowski> that mean weekend! :) have a nice one and see you!
<didrocks> Laney: well, s/day/days/ TBH
<didrocks> pstolowski: have a nice one as well :)
<didrocks> bregma: Laney: unity published FYI
<Laney> great!
 * bregma goes to upgrade
<didrocks> Laney: not sure if you want to unblock that from proposed
<didrocks> bregma: wait for a publisher cycle maybe :p
<Laney> I'll test dist-upgrade it and probably just do it if so
<mlankhorst> oh finally unblock time then? :P
<Laney> muhahah
<Laney> grrrrrrrr
<Laney> I wonder if it'll be hard to port indicator-applet
 * didrocks waves good evening and enjoy a nice week-end!
<jbicha> you guys know indicator-datetime is broken right?
<seb128> jbicha, no, how so?
<jbicha> seb128: bug 1197647
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1197647 in indicator-datetime (Ubuntu) "Date & Time applet in control center does not start" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1197647
<seb128> jbicha, hum, fun
<seb128> larsu, ^ friday indicator breakage
<kenvandine> we just love friday breakage
<seb128> seems so
<desrt> jodh: no.  it is written as it is to be read.
<larsu> jbicha: indicator-datetime installs the panel into /usr/lib/x86_64
<larsu> g-c-c doesn't look there
<larsu> and instead thinks "this might be an external panel, let's execute its Exec line"
<larsu> which is where it loops
<jbicha> larsu: ok but what about the missing clock?
<czajkowski> clock is not displayed on default clean install on saucy, didnt notice it til I went and added it there
<larsu> jbicha: missing clock?!
<larsu> jbicha: ah, the clock in the panel. Don't know, I can investigate that. It's probably a different issue though
<Guest17995> the datetime panel (libindicator-datetime.so) used to be installed in /usr/lib/control-center-1/panels
<larsu> Guest17995: right, I'm trying to find out since when it doesn't anymore
<charles> ya
<jbicha> czajkowski: um how do you add the clock?
<czajkowski> I went to date and time settings
<charles> larsu: it's in /usr/lib/contrl-center-1 in stock 13.04
<czajkowski> and added it from there
<czajkowski> now I'm stuck in some irritating loop under settings
<charles> and Makefile.am hasn't changed...
<larsu> charles: right, probably the packaging sets libdir differently
<larsu> but I can't find when this would have happened
<larsu> cyphermox: any idea? ^^
<jbicha> czajkowski: when that happens here, I do sudo /usr/bin/gnome-control-center /usr/bin/gnome-control-center2, kill g-c-c and then move it back
<charles> not much churn in debian/ either
<cyphermox> what?
<cyphermox> no idea
<larsu> jbicha: killall gnome-control-center works as well
<jbicha> larsu: it looks like the build changed between June 19 and June 28
 * jbicha looks suspiciously at rev. 229
<charles> that's suspicious because it's the only change to data/Makefile.am
<larsu> jbicha: ya, that's it
<larsu> charles: using libdir now, where before it used pkg-config
<charles> larsu: I don't see how that's related to the panel install, though?
<larsu> charles: pkg-config was used for gnome-control-center as well...
<larsu> which is wrong, because multiarch
<charles> oh, ya of course. I'm looking at data/Makefile.am but the bug is in src/Makefile.am
<larsu> yep
<larsu> so we have two options:
<charles> yeah that's it, the line 3 change in src/Makefile.am r229
<larsu> (1) de-multiarch indicator-datetime
<larsu> (2) teach g-c-c about multi arch panels
<larsu> I guess (2) doesn't make sense until g-c-c itself it multiarch
<larsu> charles: (1) will be easier for now :)
<charles> hmm
<charles> so we would replace $(libdir)/control-center-1/panels/ with... what?
<jbicha> charles: https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~indicator-applet-developers/indicator-datetime/trunk.13.10/revision/229
<charles> you and seb128 and desrt seemed pretty adamant about removing local-install mode
<larsu> charles: leave that as is, we should change the *package* to be single arch
<charles> jbicha: right. I meant, do we want to revert it and re-introduce that feature that everyone was against, or is there a different change s.t. we avoid reintroducing it
<larsu> charles: a multi-arch package that then installs something into /usr/lib is wrong anyway
<larsu> jbicha: how dÃ¼o I make a package single arch? Change "Architecture: any" to ... what?
<jbicha> in this case I think you just need to revert the part of that commit you don't want
<larsu> jbicha: no, that code was wrong
<larsu> installing into /usr/lib/ is the wrong thing for multiarch
<Laney> It's not multiarched
<Laney> that's Multi-Arch: something in debian/control
<Laney> It's because you have debian/compat set to 9 which does this, from debhelper(7):
<Laney> Multiarch support. In particular, dh_auto_configure passes multiarch directories to autoconf in --libdir and --libexecdir.
<Laney> larsu: ^
<Laney> and this being a thing debhelper wants to do in the face of multiarch makes me feel that g-c-c should look in that directory too
<Laney> jbicha: where do you see the missing clock?
<jbicha> Laney: I don't have a clock in Unity's top right corner, bug 1197647 says I'm not alone
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1197647 in indicator-datetime (Ubuntu) "Date & Time applet in control center does not start" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1197647
<Laney> ah, in unity - don't know then
<Laney> I know that indicator-applet doesn't handle the new-style indicators (yet?)
<m4n1sh> mpt: when you are free, can you please check your mail
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-07-06
<desrt> Laney: i agree, more or less
<desrt> Laney: the question is what we should configure as the libdir for g-c-c
<desrt> i guess it should be the multiarched libdir
<desrt> and have a hardcoded fallback to /usr/lib like we did with the gio patch
<desrt> yawnorama
<Laney> Actually I just found out that g-c-c tells you where to put stuff in its pcfile
<Laney> so we shouldn't be ignoring that
<larsu> Laney: this is what we were using before, but isn't is a bit stupid to install into /usr/lib from a package that puts all its other stuff into /usr/lib/x86_64?
<desrt> Laney: ya.... the directory-in-pkgconfig file thing is stupid
<Laney> It doesn't really matter in this case as it's not multiarch compatible
<desrt> it results in 'make install' putting files outside of the instructed --libdir
<desrt> which means that even though the package is nominally multiarch, it won't actually install properly
<desrt> since there are different arches installing different files into the same /usr/lib path
<Laney> well this package just uses the multiarch directory without being enabled for it
<Laney> I guess we could/should make g-c-c install into those directories so it doesn't preclude any future conversions
<jbicha> Laney: are you sure that dropping the .pc file for gstreamer-bad is right? bug 1170923
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1170923 in gst-plugins-bad1.0 (Ubuntu) ".pc file is missing from libgstreamer-plugins-bad1.0-dev" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1170923
<desrt> Laney: i think the correct fix here is to do the following:
<desrt> 1) multiarch g-c-c so that it has the same --libdir as the indicator
<desrt> then either
<desrt> 2a) multiarch all the other indicators at the same time
<desrt> or
<desrt> 2b) have a patch to fallback to /usr/lib for the non-multiarched ones until we get them moved over as well
<Laney> jbicha: you could add a dummy one which depends on -good if you want
<larsu> desrt: I don't think there's another indicator that comes with a settings panel...
<desrt> larsu: doesn't dejadup do a panel as well?
<larsu> desrt: ya, but no indicator :)
 * desrt is sure that there are at least a couple of others...
<Laney> desrt: why do you need 2 if things respect the directory in the pcfile?
<desrt> Laney: respecting the directory in the .pc file is a _bug_
<desrt> from an upstream standpoint
<desrt> we have a situation where the debian packaging (due to multiarch stuff) is explicitly instructing the package --libdir=(multiarch)
<desrt> to have the package ignore that and install into /usr/lib anyway is a clear bug
<desrt> _and_ it also causes the multiarching to produce separate arch packages that are not co-installable
<desrt> which is against the entire point of multiarching
<jbicha> Laney: you mean edit the existing one to add gstreamer-good-@GST_API_VERSION@ ?
<Laney> FWIW this package has multiarch libdir (because of debhelper 9) but aren't actually Multi-Arch: same
<Laney> isn't*
<Laney> so it's not coinstallable by MA anyway
<desrt> would still be a bug to ignore --libdir
<larsu> Laney: is an acceptable fix to downgrade to an older debhlper then?
<Laney> you could pass the lib{,exec}dir you want
<desrt> well....
<desrt> yes
<desrt> but that sort of misses the point, i feel
<desrt> debhelper defaults to the new dir for a reason, right?
<desrt> it seems that debian's intention here is to transition to separating libraries by arch
<Laney> it imagines that you'll want to do that, yes
<desrt> all libraries, even if not actively multiarching
<desrt> so instead of trying to fight against that, why not help push it a long a bit further by doing the same in g-c-c?
<Laney> I do think it's better to fix g-c-c
<desrt> so let's do that
<Laney> but it would also be acceptable to me to install in non-multiarch directories
<desrt> let's do the right thing now that won't require more work to unwind later
 * desrt is a big fan of emptying out /usr/lib (except for the multiarch subdirs)
<jbicha> is g-s-d multiarchable? if it isn't then it's not clear that multiarching g-c-c helps
<Laney> there's using those directories and being M-A: same
<desrt> is there a g-c-c/g-s-d cross-dependency that would be impacted by that?
<larsu> desrt: I agree, but we have some serious breakage because of this right now. How long will fixing g-c-c take?
<desrt> larsu: i guess someone just needs to flip the switch there
<desrt> that's step 1, right?
<desrt> then step 2.....
<desrt> the patch would probably be a few lines
<desrt> or we could fix all the other things installing panels there at the same time
<larsu> actually, the packages that install into the .pc var should be fine...
<desrt> larsu: imagining that working in the other direction is hurting my brain
<desrt> but ya....
<larsu> :)
<Laney> jbicha: RE the pcfile - I think you could add one into -bad which requires the new one in -good; should keep stuff working
<Laney> got to go now, ttyl
<jbicha> besides datetime, activity-log-manager, deja-dup, g-c-c-signon, and g-c-c-unity also install panels
 * desrt gets annoyed by airfrance
<desrt> their baggage policy is insanely obnoxious
<desrt> does anyone know how this works?
<larsu> desrt: ask in #ubuntu-fr? :P
<desrt> sigh
 * desrt finally figures out how to get the information he needs
<desrt> i have to go to the german site, then change the language to english
<desrt> of course
<desrt> cool
<desrt> if i book through airfrance's site, they charge me $10 for the privilege of paying with visa
<desrt> and if i book through any other normal travel site i have to wonder if i'm going to be allowed to bring a bag or not due to the insanely complicated and non-transparent nature of their fare rules
<desrt> "..... get ripped off for $10 or worry that i don't have the right kind of ticket?  hmm..."
 * desrt gets ripped off
 * desrt finds it highly questionable that there should be two fares that are very difficult to find the difference between, separated by â¬20 in price, where the higher fare includes one free bag and the fee for having that bag, paid at the airport, is â¬70
<desrt> it's almost as if they want you to make a mistake......
<Smaug> hey all, I am having difficulty connecting to irc on my ubuntu desktop (am on windows right now).  I've tried both empathy and kvirc, so I'm thinking it's related to ubuntu and not to a particular software not working.  Should I check some firewall settings or something?  Any thoughts?
<czajkowski> Smaug: you might fine help in #ubuntu this isn't really a support channel
<Smaug> thanks
<Smaug> ah, should have read the topic
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-06-30
<xnox> darkxst: huh, autopilot totally can use either qt4, qt5 or gtk3
<xnox> darkxst: and it is used by ubiquity to test gtk3 frontend.
<darkxst> xnox, I meant autopilot can't be used to test gnome-shell
<TheMuso`> You would have to write a cluttr autopilot backend.
<darkxst> TheMuso`, yes I am aware, never got around to looking at that. or I guess that other option would be to use atk/at-spi for testing
<TheMuso`> darkxst: That is certainly an option, but I know that is likely to raise issues already, given there are still parts of GNOME shell that need a11y work.
<darkxst> TheMuso`, well don't really need to test every single feature, would just be nice to have a general smoke test, since we seem to get completely broken by other changes 2-3 times per cycle
<pitti> Good morning
<darkxst> hey pitti
<pitti> hey darkxst, how are you?
<darkxst> good, still raining here though :(
<TheMuso`> darkxst: Fair enough.
<darkxst> pitti, do you have a systemd update by anychance?
<pitti> darkxst: what kind of update?
<darkxst> like a 210+ package?
<pitti> darkxst: I have a 208 package
<pitti> but not tested it much, as it's still stuck on making 205+ compatible with systemd-shim and upstart
<pitti> i. e. translate the slice generation into cgmanager calls
<darkxst> pitti, source available somewhere?
<pitti> darkxst: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/tmp/systemd_208-2pitti1.dsc
<pitti> darkxst: that has most Ubuntu changes merged, it's just already a few weeks old
<darkxst> pitti, thanks
 * darkxst will now go try and break my system ;) 
<pitti> hehe
<Laney> goood morning
<darkxst> hey Laney
<Laney> yo darkxst
<darkxst> Laney, can you sponsor https://code.launchpad.net/~noskcaj/libgweather/3.12.2
<Noskcaj> please
<Laney> if that's a merge then the version is wrong
<Laney> shouldn't be 0ubuntu1
<Laney> and yes, sure, see #ubuntu-devel in 5 seconds:
<Laney> oh I see debian only has .1
<Laney> want to update it there first?
<Noskcaj> Laney, I'd rather not wait 6 months for it to be uploaded. pkg-gnome rarely sponsors stuff
<Laney> what about pkg-laney
<darkxst> Noskcaj, pkg-laney should be quicker than pkg-gnome!
<Noskcaj> I'll go and put it in pkg-gnome now
<Laney> anyway I'll not get distracted by doing that update just yet
<Laney> but if you put it in there sure
<Laney> first I need to restart my vps to get the moar rams that I bought over the weekend
<Laney> brb
<Noskcaj> now = after i download all of pkg-gnome svn
<darkxst> Noskcaj, right, maybe I will join pkg-gnome, after they switch to git ;)
<Laney> good, that worked
<Noskcaj> darkxst, You can take my place then. git is such a pain
<darkxst> Noskcaj, why? git is good!
 * darkxst suggests Noskcaj should spend the school holidays learning git and C ;)
<Noskcaj> darkxst, I probably should.
<Noskcaj> I'd started trying to learn vala, but it lack any docs
<Noskcaj> I'll look into C i guess, i'd came along the idea of merging back all of ubuntu's changes to pkg-gnome, but it seems like too much work to bother
<Laney> I usually just take stuff across when I'm updating for some other reason
<Laney> e.g. if you're doing libgweather now, take whatever you can
<darkxst> Noskcaj, vala is more or less c#, but nicely integrated with gtk
<darkxst> Noskcaj, start with C, once you get that you will more or less be able understand what is going on in other other languages
<Noskcaj> ok
<darkxst> well except for python
<Noskcaj> I'll start learning C tomorrow. (need dota + sleep tonight)
<darkxst> dota? did valve buy you out?
<darkxst> Laney, guess you are busy piloting but can you test of my displayconfig thing again after?
<Laney> darkxst: yeah hoping to get to that again today
<Laney> did you update the u-* branches?
<darkxst> Laney, only on the ppa,
<Laney> also should I try 3.10 or 3.12?
<Laney> oh if it's all there, nice
<darkxst> Laney, 3.12 is fine apart from https://code.launchpad.net/~darkxst/unity-settings-daemon/xkb/+merge/224919
<darkxst> Laney, ppa:darkxst/gnome-desktop
<Laney> new branch> bzr push --overwrite the original one I think
<darkxst> Laney, probaly, why I dislike bzr!
<Laney> you'd have to force push with git too, no?
<darkxst> Laney, git thinks rewriting public history is a bad idea!
<Laney> same here, that's why you have to give a flag
<Laney> but it's alright to do this in your working branches until they're merged in
<Laney> IMO
<darkxst> Laney, sure, and rebasing patch sets under git is much better in git, than bzr IMO
<Laney> yes, rebasing is one area in which git wins
<Laney> I'm just suggesting for this merge request that a force push is appropriate. :)
<larsu> ya, git allows this as well "push -f", but servers can be configured to refuse force pushes (gnome's does for example)
<larsu> you can still get around that of course
<larsu> and I agree with Laney, it's totally fine for feature branches
<Laney> hey larsu!
<larsu> hi Laney :)
<larsu> how was your weekend?
<Laney> very nice thank you
<darkxst> Laney, ther you go, fixed
<Laney> went up north to visit parents - record shop (& discovered it was stockton-on-tees pirate day when there were pirates singing sea shanties in store), walks on the beach and up on some hills
<darkxst> now if you can fix our weather down south, I will be forever grateful ;
<larsu> Laney: sounds great!
<Laney> hey, you've got to let us have our turn with the sun for a bit
<Laney> it's only fair!
<Laney> larsu: how was yours?
<larsu> relaxing :)
<larsu> went to a party with dholbach, walked around an art festival in the city
<larsu> and hung out in a park by the river
<Laney> dholbach, party, relaxing
<Laney> does not compute
<larsu> the party wasn't that relaxing (but a lot of fun)
<Laney> at least in my mental image of these parties :P
<Laney> aw man he's not in here to be trolled
<larsu> I think he gave up on this channel a while ago :(
<Laney> also I've been reading too many blogs about living cities
<Laney> kept noticing and being annoyed about the massive roads leading right into city centres and shitty pedestrian facilities
<larsu> totally agree
<larsu> I'm vaguely hopeful that car sharing / driverless cars will fix this to an extent
<darkxst> Laney, then build some single track for you and your bike ;)
<Laney> that'd be nice
<Laney> currently if there would be any amount of design required then the lane just gives up and dumps you in the road
<Laney> http://aseasyasridingabike.wordpress.com/2014/05/08/do-you-hate-humans-take-it-out-on-them-through-design/
<darkxst> Laney, we recently got 'copenhagen' lanes for bikes in the city
<darkxst> end results car-dooring
<Laney> HAHA yes
<Laney> "go dutch" is a slogan here
<Laney> I think any Dutch person would be insulted by what's done under that banner
<darkxst> Laney, I don't think there are too many dutch here to get offended!
<Laney> :P
<darkxst> qould be a few though
<lool> bregma: is there a bug for the scaling settings computation race?
<lool> bregma: or is there a workaround?
<bregma> lool, I'm fairly certain there's a bug, I'll have to search to find it right now though
<bregma> I will peg Trevinho for the workaround and put it on the wiki somewhere in the mean time
<bregma> there are some gsettings that you can tweak manually to reset the scaling, I just don't remember them off the top of my head
<desrt> good morning, freedom lovers!
<gatox> lool, ping
<GunnarHj> Laney: Isn't there always something with the license. ;) Explanation added to bug 1314402.
<ubot5> bug 1314402 in Ubuntu "Please upload skype-translation to the archive" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1314402
<lool> gatox: pong
<gatox> lool, hi, i don't know if you are the right person to ping... but i know sergiusens was working on getting the payui click into the image, the click is already in the store... but i see the click is not in the image yet... do you know who could take care of that
<gatox> ?
<lool> gatox: hmm sergiusens was adding clicks to the image in the past; I have to remember where the list is
<lool> gatox: I think we used to go through http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/click_packages/click_list
<lool> gatox: albeit I'm not sure the full list is installed; it might just be an index
<lool> gatox: this might have to go through livecd-rootfs, not sure
<lool> gatox: livecd-rootfs/live-build/ubuntu-touch/hooks/60-install-click.chroot could be what you are looking for?
<lool> gatox: so yeah, apparently click_list is the way to go
<lool> gatox: this is probably a cjwatson thing to get it listed there, or others in ~ubuntu-archive
<gatox> lool, ok... pinging him
<Laney> GunnarHj: It's what makes this stuff fun. :)
 * desrt loves this: http://www.cbc.ca/newsblogs/yourcommunity/2014/06/rainbow-graces-toronto-sky-to-end-world-pride.html
<seb128> nice rainbows there ;-)
 * ogra_ always wondered if there are pots full of gold on both ends or only on one
<GunnarHj> happyaron: ping?
<seb128> GunnarHj, he's probably off at this hour, maybe best to ask your question so he can reply late
<seb128> r
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, thanks. I already subscribed him to a bug, so I'll wait then.
<pitti> jibel, seb128, vila: bonne chance avec le joue franÃ§ais Ã  plus tard !
<pitti> je vais le voir aussi :)
<jibel> pitti, thanks, good luck against Algeria!
<vila> pitti: good luck to your team too !
<pitti> et le jeu d'Allemagne, bien sÃ»r -- c'est une nuit longue :)
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> the reason that g_desktop_app_info_new_from_filename is failing is because the Exec lines are referencing executables that can't be found
<Laney> relative paths to binaries in private click package directories
<desrt> Laney: there's no such thing as relative paths in desktop files...
<desrt> although it's been discussed...
<Laney> says who?
<desrt> says the fact that it's not in the spec and not supported by the implementations
<Laney> what's a spec? :)
<desrt> and what's an implementation, too, i suppose :)
<Laney> I think these things actually get launched by this ubuntu app launch wotsit
<Laney> who knows what that does
<desrt> something with urls, i think
<desrt> :)
 * desrt revives prefers_app_menu() patch
<Laney> maybe I should just treat these as key files...
<desrt> or write to xdg list about getting the spec changed
<desrt> i know approximately three people who would probably agree with you
<desrt> two of them because they're in this channel and one of them because he requested the same thing
<desrt> i'd be happy to land the changes in gio this week if we amend the spec
<Laney> hang on
<Laney> there appears to be a per-click libdir or something
<seb128> pitti, thanks ;-)
<Laney> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7727128/
<Laney> wtf
<Laney> I launch glade and get asked to take a "user survey"
<Laney> is this a joke?
<Laney> on that note, ttyl!
<robert_ancell> darkxst, did you mean to do a MP for lp:~darkxst/unity-settings-daemon/xkb2?
<robert_ancell> btw, I think you could have done a bzr push --overwrite on the existing branch too
<darkxst> robert_ancell_, yes I ended up overwriting the existing branch
<robert_ancell_> darkxst, cool, thanks
<robert_ancell_> It's kind of worrying how Launchpad doesn't tell you if approved MPs have their branches overwritten :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-07-01
<pitti> Bonjour tout le monde !
<didrocks> hey pitti!
<didrocks> how are you ?
<pitti> didrocks: bonjour !
<pitti> didrocks: quite tired TBH, it was a long night :)
<pitti> so many heart attacks
<larsu> hi didrocks and pitti!
<pitti> larsu: Alter!
<didrocks> hey larsu :)
<didrocks> pitti: who won at the end ?
<didrocks> will we meet you guys ?
<pitti> I got up at an outright "normal" time at 8:30 :)
<darkxst> hey pitti , didrocks larsu
<pitti> didrocks: yes, we will; we won 2:1, but don't ask how :)
<larsu> hi darkxst!
<didrocks> morning darkxst
<pitti> didrocks: so, the big showdown on Friday
<didrocks> pitti: ahah, ok, I won't, I'll just say "nice" :)
<pitti> didrocks: FRA : GER Friday 18:00 I mean
<didrocks> yeah ;)
<didrocks> I'm still sure I won't watch it TBH :p
<pitti> not that France's game against Nigeria was that much more convincing, so let's see
<larsu> pitti: by putting the ball into the goal of the enemy, twice?
<didrocks> already had to suffer 10 minutes of to Nigeria-France to order some beers at the bar with seb128
<pitti> larsu: you didn't watch it, did you?
<didrocks> (it was of course a really packed)
<larsu> pitti: lol. no.
<pitti> didrocks: poor you
<larsu> I donated blood, took a walk, and went to bed fairly early last night
<didrocks> pitti: first world issue! :)
<pitti> didrocks: I'm really glad that I can at least still be friends with *you* after Friday night!
 * didrocks envies you guys being able to donate blood in the evening
<didrocks> pitti: ahah, yeah :)
<larsu> didrocks: it was more like 5pm (they were available in the school in my street from 4 to 7)
<larsu> going too late is bad though, because too many people will be there coming from work
<didrocks> larsu: here, there are 2 buildings, both are closing at 3:30pm
<didrocks> and they are at 4kms from home
<didrocks> so quite hard to leave during the day
<didrocks> pitti: you're still up before seb128 if that can reconfort you :)
<larsu> didrocks: oh? They don't come around the neighborhoods?
<didrocks> larsu: not where I leave, they are doing that close to the business area, but I'm quite far from it
<didrocks> going*
<larsu> understood
<didrocks> ahah, a new IT shop from a brand is opening, and they display that: https://plus.google.com/photos/+ldlc/albums/6030735454222755633/6030735454625964194?pid=6030735454625964194&oid=104301983842916548085
<larsu> lol :)
<jibel> mvo, can you join #ubuntu-release?
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<seb128> hey didrocks pitti mvo jibel
<didrocks> hey jibel, seb128!
<pitti> bonjour seb128, Ã§a va ! Recontrer Ã  vendredi !
<jibel> Good morning seb128 didrocks
<seb128> pitti, mvo, larsu, well done, nice game yesterday ;-)
<pitti> seb128: well, FSVO "nice" -- the first 30 mins gave all of us a heart attack!
 * larsu is unsure what he didâ¦
<pitti> (well, and the other 90 mins as well really, but in a slightly better way)
<larsu> I'm not sure, but I think pitti knows of a "slightly better way" to have a heart attack
<seb128> pitti, yeah, it was nice to watch if you like suspens ;-)
<pitti> seb128: c'Ã©tait une nuit trÃ¨s longue, je suis fatiguÃ©
<seb128> pitti, tu t'es levÃ© tÃ´t ?
<pitti> seb128: non, j'ai me levÃ© Ã  8h30
<pitti> seb128: but of course I woke up with my wife at 5, and didn't really sleep tight after that any more
<pitti> seb128: oh, "je suis me levÃ©", not "j'ai me levÃ©" ?
<pitti> seb128: I suppose I should learn some French swearing by Friday
<seb128> pitti, "je me suis levÃ©" ;-)
<seb128> lol
<pitti> seb128: what does "never ever was this a foul, you idiot!" mean in French? :-)
<mvo> hey seb128
<seb128> lol
<jibel> mvo, your upload of update-notifier has been rejected, there is no version in the dependency on update-manager. You can talk to RAOF for details.
<mvo> jibel: sure, joining now
<mvo> jibel: ok, I will do a re-upload right away, but iirc there is no need for a dependency as the code with use os.path.exists() to figure out if it needs it or not
<larsu> hm, appearance page in unity-control-center crashes :(
<seb128> larsu, bt? missing schemas and gsettings aborts?
<larsu> seb128: some assertions about radio button groups not found. I'll have a look later, aftre I finally finish tab theming
<larsu> this has been on my todo _forever_
<seb128> k
<larsu> seb128: speaking of which, do we have a screenshot on how it's supposed to look?
 * larsu asks google
<seb128> I don't think so
<seb128> why? want to change things there?
<larsu> no, I want to restore how it's supposed to look and don't have a trusty handy
<larsu> I've found a screenshot though
<larsu> turns out, theming notebooks is rather messy
<larsu> who'd have thought...
<seb128> why is it looking different? gtk?
<seb128> oh
<larsu> yes, after the update. For example, there's a too thick border below tabs
<larsu> and frames around the tab header
<lool> do you folks get a crash when opening the appearance control panel?
<seb128> see what larsu was just saying
<seb128> so seems "yes"
 * seb128 is on trusty so can't test right now
<Laney> hey hey
<seb128> Laney, hey, how are you?
<Laney> yeah, doing good!
<Laney> none of this futbol business to worry about here :-)
<Laney> you?
<didrocks> morning Laney!
<ochosi> hey seb128, may i quickly bug you about https://code.launchpad.net/~ochosi/xdg-utils/support_xfce/+merge/224076 again?
<Laney> hey hey didrocks
<larsu> hi Laney
<darkxst> hey Laney
<Noskcaj> ochosi, I notice that the upstream and branch patches are different
<ochosi> Noskcaj: well, ubuntu carries a (useless) patch, so ofc they're different
<Noskcaj> ok
<ochosi> i proposed to drop the patch in ubuntu as well
<ochosi> but what i'm primarily interested in (now) and with this MR is an SRU for trusty
<ochosi> cause it kinda sucks that the screensaver always kicks in, even if mediaplayers want to inhibit
<ochosi> so i kept it minimal
<Noskcaj> ok. I've had the same issue
<ochosi> yeah, everyone does ;)
<seb128> Laney, doing good, thanks ;-)
<seb128> ochosi, yeah, no reply from upstream then, I'm just going to upload your change
<ochosi> seb128: thanks, i'm willing to work on a different solution with upstream as well, we can always get that into utopic then. but i'd be happy if we can sru this change to trusty and for 14.04.1
<seb128> right
<didrocks> mvo: pitti: hey, stupid question, but imagine that one function I called GLib.idle_add() on raises an exception, I'm unsure why my try: exception around mainloop.run() doesn't seem to catch it (like a KeyboardInterrupt event), any idea? seems quite common thoughâ¦
<didrocks> I'm trying Ctrl+C in a while True loop and it doesn't seem even to raise the Interrupt
<darkxst> didrocks, idle_add probably doesnt run in the main thread?
<didrocks> darkxst: it does, let me pastebin a simple example
<didrocks> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7730311/
<didrocks> when I hit Ctrl + C in the foo function, this should raise an exceptionâ¦
<pitti> didrocks: that's known
<pitti> didrocks: pygi can't "tunnel" exceptions through the C layer of callbacks
<didrocks> pitti: ok, I'm not that crazy then ;). Any best practice/workaround then?
<pitti> didrocks: so your callbacks themselves have to intercept the exceptions and handle them, or pass them to the main thread via global variables, signals, messages, etc.
<didrocks> pitti: ok, that makes sense. Thanks Martin! :)
<pitti> didrocks: it's not technically multithreading, but behaviourally it's "kind of"
<pitti> didrocks: but the main reason is that it's really difficult to propagate exceptions through arbitrary C functions
<didrocks> yeah, I guess the conversion isn't really easy, I was just puzzled that even a trivial example wasn't working and was first blaming the input() method or my nested calls :)
<didrocks> thanks pitti, will do as you suggest
<darkxst> yes pitti's answer is much better than my "guess" at why that would never work!
<pitti> well, for synchronous callbacks it could technically work (with lots of effort)
<pitti> but with async callbacks, idle handlers etc. the concept itself also makes no sense as they are "kind of" in a separate thread
<didrocks> pitti: hum, I propably didn't get exactly what you told then. I tried to have the exception handled in my callback itself, but it didn't work. I reproduced it in that trivial example: http://paste.ubuntu.com/7730381/
<pitti> didrocks: I'm not sure about the semantics of KeyboardInterrupt (in fact, first time I hear about it)
 * didrocks tries an except without anything then
<pitti> didrocks: but python-gi installs its own SIGINT handler
<pitti> didrocks: which is mostly due to being backwards compatible how pygobject used to behave
<pitti> didrocks: i. e. SIGINT quits the main loop, but doesn't raise an exception
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, it's sucked in from what I see
<didrocks> hum
<didrocks> it doesn't quits the main loop in that example
<darkxst> pitti, that was my guess, i.e. separate thread
<pitti> interesting; that sounds like a regression then
<didrocks> pitti: so, my first example should quit when I hit Ctrl + C, right? http://paste.ubuntu.com/7730311/
<pitti> didrocks: no, you'll never get KeyboardInterrupt with pygobject
<pitti> didrocks: well, it should quit because pygobject stops the mainloop
<didrocks> pitti: but SIGINT should be trapped by the python-gi handler?
<didrocks> yeah
<pitti> but not through the exception handler
<didrocks> it's not the case
<didrocks> right right
<didrocks> sorry, should have removed the handler
<didrocks> pitti: just to be clear, that should quit: http://paste.ubuntu.com/7730404/
<pitti> didrocks: correct
<didrocks> it doesn't on trusty at least :/
<pitti> yeah, that's what I meant with "regression"
<pitti> there's a test case in pygobject for SIGINT, but apparently it behaves differently
 * pitti bbiab
<didrocks> pitti: I wonder if it's not https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=622084
<ubot5> Gnome bug 622084 in introspection "Ctrl+C does not exit gtk app" [Normal,New]
<pitti> didrocks: yeah, there are probably several bugs for that, we already had some a few years ago when I was looking into that
<didrocks> pitti: ok, FYI, I used the workaround from the bug description: signal.signal(signal.SIGINT, signal.SIG_DFL)
<didrocks> and it works for an INT
<didrocks> at least, I would know as well the other cases for the exceptions raised in the callback and adapt my code to it
<didrocks> I'm sure it's a declaration of war for Friday!
 * didrocks hugs pitti :)
<pitti> didrocks: yeah, that'll restore Python's normal SIGINT behaviour with KeyboardInterrupt
<seb128> Dir
<seb128> ups
<seb128> Laney, why did you remove the QDir include in the click changes?
<Laney> it's moved to the header
<Laney> are you looking at doing a landing soon?
<seb128> yes, today or tomorrow
<seb128> Saviq has one lined up first to switch to the suru icon theme
<seb128> he aims at landing that today
<Laney> okay, I think I can fix the rest of the icons based on my earlier investigation
<Laney> stupid spec violators
<seb128> do you want to do that on the same merge request?
<seb128> it might be good to add some comments in there, I'm re-reading the code you "refactored", it seems suboptimal that we need to play with paths and parsing that way, feels like click could be better a providing the info we need
<seb128> having the rational of why we need to do that "manual work" could be useful
<Laney> k
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> "Overwrite the icon with the .desktop file's one if we have it. This one is more reliable."
<seb128> what's the point of having an icon info if it's not reliable...
<Laney> I think the desktop file one is used by the app scope
<Laney> so maybe this one can bitrot or something
<Laney> although to be fair ...
 * Laney notices something
<papars> Hi. Can somebody help me? My problem is described here: http://askubuntu.com/questions/490292/dell-fans-not-working
<bregma> lool, if you're still having trouble with large text on HiDPI screens, check the Universal Access 'Large Text' setting in the control center -- see bug #1332947
<ubot5> bug 1332947 in unity (Ubuntu) "HDPI: unity randomly turns on large text in universal access" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1332947
<lool> bregma: at the moment the settings panel crashes for me
<lool> bregma: but thanks, I've sub-ed there
<lool> bregma: and indeed, large text is turned on
<Laney> seb128: I pushed a version that finds ALL the icons on my device
<sil2100> didrocks: as mentioned, I would like to fetch from launchpad API the list of all bugs with a certain tag
<didrocks> sil2100: yeah, I'm afraid you need a bug_target for that, let me reread the doc quickly
<sil2100> didrocks: I already asked on #launchpad, but no one knows it seems
<sil2100> didrocks: yeah... couldn't find anything, and ubuntu?ws.op=searchTasks only returns ubuntu targetted ones
<didrocks> sil2100: you can on project, distro, series, milestones for sure
<didrocks> (so not only ubuntu)
<didrocks> let me continue to check for available targets
<didrocks> I'm sure there is person
<didrocks> yeah, personâ¦
<sil2100> hmmm...
<didrocks> sil2100: project_group is maybe what you want? (but we don't really use project_group in LP, apart from the indicators)
<sil2100> Damn, I would have to 'tag' those specific bugs with a certain dummy project then
<sil2100> project_group? I wonder what those can be
 * sil2100 looks
<didrocks> sil2100: yeah, the dummy project is what I did for the unity time
<didrocks> you can as well have a team that is subscribed to the bugs
<didrocks> and filter on them
<didrocks> or ensure they have an ubuntu task
<didrocks> and filter on that
<sil2100> didrocks: thanks! I'll try to work-around it in that way then ;)
<didrocks> that's the 3 easiest options I confirm that is possible (after reareading the doc)
<didrocks> yw sil2100 :)
<Laney> I think that it's probably deliberate
<Laney> to not let people search across the collection of all bugs
<didrocks> Laney: well, you can do that for all ubuntu bugs
<didrocks> whatever series and so on
<sil2100> Yeah, but you can still do that in LP manually, and not sure if people use the API so much
<didrocks> which is I guess even bigger that all projects unioned
<didrocks> sil2100: there are a lot of people using the API, and if you use a bot, you get kind emails regularly with bots owners :p
<seb128> Laney, how did you workaround your issues then print calls were not showing up on stdout from qml?
<Laney> use warnings :(
<seb128> :/
<Laney> I asked in app-devel but nobody replied
<Laney> seb128: which bug are you looking at?
<seb128> Laney, I just wanted to put a debug print in the click sorting selector, it seems to always be set on "name" even if the gsettings key is false
<seb128> did you try to debug that yet?
<Laney> no, was going to though
<Laney> well, I did some weeks ago
<Laney> before I found out about using warnings
<seb128> Laney, do you remember what is supposed to set the sort role on start?
<seb128> is that the gsettings key being read and a sortRole being written then?
<Laney> lemme look
<Laney> erm
<Laney> when did qtcreator get a windows style file chooser?
<seb128> do you have that upstart fix to set the session-id variable?
<larsu> Laney: I've noticed the same in qmlscene
<larsu> might have happened with the qt 5.3 update?!
<Laney> seems likely
<Laney> it used GtkFileChooser before
<Laney> I have that variable yes
<seb128> :-/
<larsu> what does qt usually look at to find out which platform it's on? XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP?
<seb128> larsu, GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION_ID
<seb128> oh, sorry, that was qt4
<seb128> (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/upstart/+bug/1305294)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1305294 in upstart (Ubuntu Trusty) "QT uses incorrect theme when GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION_ID is unset" [Undecided,In progress]
<seb128> Laney, you are sure that ever worked since we use the backend rather than the js code we had?
<Laney> seb128: I just found the fix
<Laney> one liner!
<seb128> Laney, great ;-)
<Laney> looks like the gsettings isn't hooked up though
<seb128> was it a missing init something?
<Laney> you have to invalidate the model after re-sorting it
<Laney> do you have the bug # handy?
<seb128> Laney, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1320160
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1320160 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "Sorting by size in "storage" doesn't work" [Medium,Triaged]
<Laney> ty
<Laney> lemme hook up the gsettings key
<seb128> oh, it's meeting time!
<didrocks> hey! :)
<seb128> qengho, Laney, tkamppeter_, larsu, didrocks, hey, it's meeting time
<seb128> short list today
<qengho> Heya, folks!
<brookswarner> morning guys
<seb128> Bjoern is on vac, Canada is having a national holiday
<qengho> Vacations?
<seb128> qengho, hey
<seb128> qengho, you can start I guess ;-)
<qengho> Okay!
<qengho> * Set up chromium-mir build tree. (Current status, upstream bug: linker failures with ozone enabled.)
<qengho> * Worked with Legal to satisfy Ad*be that we know how to deliver Fl*sh plugin.
<qengho> * Still testing chromium-browser 35.0.1916.153. I delayed to fix a Aura high-dpi geometry problem, but it's taking too long. Just releasing soon.
<qengho> EOF
<seb128> qengho, thanks
<seb128> Laney, hey
<Laney> â¢ Continue to fix folks/zeitgeist fallout in Debian, upload new folks upstream.
<Laney> â¢ Investigate / cherry-pick fix for glib/gcc-4.9 test failure
<Laney> â¢ Fix ubuntu-sso-client adt failure
<Laney> â¢ Merges/syncs: vte3 gupnp glade
<Laney> â¢ Patch pilot
<Laney> â¢ Fix and fwd nautilus segfault upstream (applied, thanks mclasen)
<Laney> â¢ Discuss webkigtk/arm64 with Debian
<Laney> â¢ Test/discuss gnome-desktop 3.12, give feedback, need to test second round of fixes from Tim
<Laney> â¢ u-s-s: show all click icons, make click list sorting work, reviews
<Laney> â¢ Chat to fluendo about a segfault in their plugin, get it fixed, upload to Debian & sync
<Laney> â¢ Give desktop-next a little warning on its cdimage page directing to the wiki
<Laney> â¢ Fight with a flaky VPS
<Laney> â
<seb128> what was the fluendo segfault?
<seb128> is that in that lib (don't remember the name) that didn't change for years?
<Laney> I had an ancient mp3 that was a bit corrupted
<Laney> and its parser didn't like that
<Laney> got a mediascanner segfault on every startup because of this
<seb128> oh, k
<qengho> metadata encoding problem?
<seb128> what's the status-quo on the gnome-desktop discussion?
 * seb128 lost track
<seb128> we are still trying the new service approach?
<seb128> rather than robert_ancell code copy one?
<Laney> https://core.fluendo.com/gstreamer/trac/changeset/2622/trunk/gst-fluendo-mp3/src/bitstream.c
<Laney> yeah just trying darkxst's stuff for now
<seb128> k
<Laney> but he said he'd be fine doing the other approach if necessary
<seb128> right
<seb128> let's see how that goes
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> tkamppeter_, hey
<seb128> no tkamppeter_?
<seb128> larsu, hey
<larsu> hi!
<larsu> last week I did some gsettings-qt cleanup and bug fixing
<larsu> added a simpler dbus api to indicator-messages for the push notification guys
<larsu> (who I've talked to a lot because libmessaging-menu isn't awesome for their use case on the phone)
<larsu> nobody's given me any feedback on that yet, though
<larsu> I've also talked to Company and mclasen about the Adwaita -> gtk move and how it effects our theme
<larsu> and tested it with master - seems to be fine so far
<larsu> also, the dialog/csd patches landed after some cleanup
<larsu> hm, I think that's about it ...
<seb128> great for master and the csd patches ;-)
<seb128> larsu, you got feedback on https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/indicator-messages/add-simple-dbus-api/+merge/224622
<Laney> did you ask push guys for review on the MP?
<seb128> but not review feedback
<larsu> ah, I've done further work on getting the theme ready for 3.12 (some notebook fixes and getting headerbars to work for us)
<seb128> just "user" feedback
<seb128> who should be reviewing that?
<larsu> seb128: Chipaca is the push notification guy I talked to
<seb128> charles?
<Laney> fdo notifications sounds nice ;-)
<Laney> could we actually have that?
<seb128> Laney, don't get larsu started
<larsu> seb128: I think ted wanted to do this
<Laney> but I want to :(
<larsu> Laney: yes, we could, but don't get me started.
<seb128> we all would like that here
<seb128> but other teams are not on the same line
<larsu> ah, some code reviews and the usual bug discussion as well last week. I think that's it then
<Laney> ho hum
<larsu> seb128: right. There's also some problems with click packaging and org.freedesktop.Application
<larsu> and XDG_DATA_DIRS
<larsu> I hope those will get sorted sooner rather than later
<seb128> right
<seb128> let's not go into too much detailed discussion on those topic during the meeting, we could spend an hour on it
<larsu> the API I proposed now doesn't have the org.freedesktop.Applicaiton part, otherwise it's very similar to the one GNOME is using now
<larsu> so we could consolidate them if we decide that it's worth it
<seb128> great
<larsu> seb128: ya, sorry.
<seb128> larsu, thanks
<seb128> nothing to be sorry about ;-)
 * seb128 gets confused by the order with the missing Canadians
<seb128> I think it's didrocks' turn?
<didrocks> yep!
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> * added more and more tests (150+ now) in the developer tools center
<didrocks> * shell completion enablement of udtc
<didrocks> * fighting/had fun to define a model where I can send arbitrary UI from framework. A lot of force and back and now, expanding it :)
<didrocks> * finally, enabling the android studio setup, using that for the base of the future interactions with framework (and will probably refactor + add tests once the base will be done)
<didrocks> * some MIRing (still tracker on the list)
<didrocks> EOF
<charles> seb128, IMO this would be better for ted or tvoss to review; this looks like it's a continuation of the discussion from Malta
<seb128> charles, ok, thanks
<charles> s/ted/tedg/
<seb128> didrocks, you forgot the "fought with python-gi" ;-)
<didrocks> I was trying to be politically correct in the notes :p
<larsu> charles: I've pinged tedg a couple of times about it - is he on vacation?
<Laney> oh cool we got new clutter in release after libinput
<seb128> lol
<Laney> thanks didrocks!
<seb128> ok, let's not get you started about that then :p
<didrocks> Laney: yw ;)
<didrocks> seb128: yeah :)
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<tkamppeter> Sorry, I missed it. Here is my stuff:
<seb128> ok, my turn
<seb128> ups
<tkamppeter> - Got hint to new driver project for proprietary Brother laser printers, "brlaser": https://github.com/pdewacht/brlaser, added entries to OpenPrinting
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Fixed bug in cups-filters, generating queues pointing to remote raw queues
<tkamppeter> - ghostscript: SRU for a crash
<tkamppeter> - Mentoring of GSoC students, midterm evaluations
<tkamppeter> - Some organizational stuff for OpenPrinting Summit.
<seb128> tkamppeter, sure, go ahead
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<seb128> k, my turn this time ;-)
<seb128> â¢ debian merges (evince)
<seb128> â¢ SRUs (shotwell)
<seb128> â¢ sponsoring (synced cinnamon)
<seb128> â¢ fixed an issue with the shotwell/online accounts integration
<seb128> â¢ landings (overlay-scrollbars)
<seb128> â¢ discussed/reviewed the options for gnome-desktop updates/what to do with u-s-d/u-c-c
<seb128> reviewed touch settings current designs, looked at some issues, filed some bugs, triaged bugslist
<seb128> â¢ bug fixes (shotwell)
<seb128> </week>
<Laney> Ã¼ber triaging
<seb128> right, did quite some on u-s-s .... there is quite some work to do there :/
<charles> larsu, ted is on vacation but I don't know for how many days, checking the calendar now
<larsu> Laney: 100 points for proper use of umlauts
<Laney> thÃ¤nkÃ lÃ¤rÃÃ¼
<charles> larsu, ah, he's in DC for Independence Day
<seb128> ok
<larsu> charles: is the the one supposed to work on that api?
<seb128> is there any other topic we should discuss?
<charles> that's right, we all chatted about that last week
<larsu> charles: or can you/tvoss/thostr give input as well?
<larsu> the situation is a bit defused now, but only because the push guys did more work than necessary :-/
<seb128> seems like that's a wrap then
<seb128> thanks everyone
<didrocks> thanks!
<seb128> Laney, "Some click packages ship spec-violating desktop files" ... shouldn't we fix that/have the click tool refuse to build a .click when the content is invalid?
<seb128> "invalid"
<Laney> I think it'll result in a spec fix
<Laney> to allow relative paths
<Laney> but I need to know how the ubuntu app launch stuff works really
<Laney> I think it must add some stuff to PATH/XDG_*_DIRS each time
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-07-02
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> Bonjour tout le monde
<pitti> hey didrocks
<didrocks> bonjour pitti !
<mvo> hey seb128, good morning
<seb128> hey pitti didrocks mvo
<mvo> seb128: you are here early, how come? did the sun wake you up :) ?
<pitti> bonjour seb128 -- c'est tÃ´t !
<seb128> what are you talking about? I'm an early bird!
<seb128> mvo, sun? I'm in Lyon, it's raining there
<mvo> :) I am not, I'm just forced by circumstances to be one
<seb128> I blame didrocks
<mvo> seb128: haha, I get it
<mvo> seb128: he is responsible for the rain ;)
 * mvo hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<didrocks> you are mean guys
<didrocks> come on, beautiful weather the whole week and now you are complaining about rain!
<seb128> Saviq, rsalveti: hey, did you coordinate on the ubuntu-system-settings landing?
<rsalveti> seb128: no, was planning to respin it once my change lands, but then it got stuck temporarily because of a flaky test
<rsalveti> I'm in china this week, so my timezone doesn't help much, so that's why I just went ahead
<rsalveti> after making sure it wasn't breaking anything in the other landing
<rsalveti> as I thought this the other landing would land yesterday, but didn't happen
<seb128> rsalveti, do you know why the suru changes didn't land yesterday?
<rsalveti> seb128: no idea
<seb128> k
<seb128> let's hope your landing doesn't create too much work for Saviq then
<seb128> he's trying to land the suru transition for a while
<rsalveti> it shouldn't, should be migrating to propose in a few minutes
<rsalveti> sorry, to release
<rsalveti> now that pitti retried the job
<seb128> right, well it still means the silo needs a rebuild
<rsalveti> yup, I'm waiting it to migrate to rebuild it
<rsalveti> it would be all fine it wasn't this annoying flaky test, but well
<rsalveti> life is not that easy
<seb128> right
<Saviq> heh... /me rebuilds settings :|
<rsalveti> Saviq: what happened that this didn't land yesterday?
<Saviq> rsalveti, no QA
<rsalveti> sorry for the noise
<rsalveti> oh, ok, hope we can land this today then
<Saviq> rsalveti, yeah, just need to catch davmor2 or om26er
<rsalveti> cool
<seb128> Saviq, do we need to block on qa for that?
<Saviq> we don't *need* to
<seb128> but you prefer? ;-)
<Saviq> but it's a significant change affecting the whole system, I just wanted to dilute the responsibility of something breaking ;P
<seb128> lol
 * didrocks adds more water to Saviq's glass :)
<Saviq> isn't that what QA signoff is for? :D
<seb128> yeah, it is
<seb128> why do you think you find nowhere there to actually do the signing?
<seb128> :p
<seb128> they know what they are doing!
<Saviq> :)
<seb128> (nowhere -> nobody)
<Laney> morning
<Laney> seb128's been up early!
<seb128> come on!
<didrocks> and 5th in a row \o/
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
 * didrocks just hopes desrt wake up and tell the same :)
<Laney> hahaha
<Laney> wednesday trolling
<Laney> yeah I'm good, went to a cool talk last night about how you can make people remember false things
<seb128> Laney, did you tell them about yourself remembering that you had to upload the new gtk?
<Laney> :P
<Laney> I'd be able to recall how we talked about that
<Laney> and details of where we were, what we were eating and so on
<Laney> even though it never happened
<Laney> in summary: memory can suck
<seb128> so you can make people remember false things? do you have to get tem hypnotized or something?
<seb128> rsalveti, Saviq: u-s-s migrated, you can m&c and trigger a rebuild of the other silo
<seb128> oh, you had m&c before it migrated it seems
<seb128> ignore me then ;-)
<Saviq> seb128, yeah, I already rebuilt ;)
 * Saviq checks that it got in
<Saviq> oh no I'm not, didrocks FYI http://people.canonical.com/~didrocks/citrain/silos/ is out of date :|
<Saviq> k it's there
<didrocks> Saviq: well, they are moving the infra without any warning or discussion and so on, so I can't follow that
<Saviq> didrocks, thought so, probably best to just drop it then?
<didrocks> yep, doing so
<didrocks> thanks
<Laney> hmm, one way she showed was to show people three true memories and one false one and ask them to talk about it (telling them that all four were true)
<Laney> then at the end if you say that one of them was false sometimes people even guess the wrong one then
<Laney> also you can falsify videos or pictures to make people actually believe that they did something they didn't, which is interesting for e.g. justice
<seb128> interesting indeed
<Laney> apparently presenting false evidence in police interviews is allowed even today in some parts of the US(!)
<seb128> crazy country
<didrocks> sil2100: as I was removing the whole citrain directory in my home folder which was out of sync (seems you changed some IP without telling me) so that people not relied on that, I deleted the whole directory
<desrt> 5th in a row!
<didrocks> sil2100: part of it contained the images for the buttons on the spreadsheet
<didrocks> sil2100: so, I guess the spreadsheet might have lost its images
<seb128> desrt, hey, good "morning"? or are you going to bed?
<sil2100> didrocks: what IP? I didn't change any IP
<larsu> seb128: probably he had a long Canada day party ;)
<larsu> is dholbach in Toronto?
<seb128> larsu, yeah, sounds like it
<didrocks> sil2100: the ci-train machine changed apparently
<didrocks> sil2100: it doesn't respond to ping
<sil2100> didrocks: not to my knowledge
<didrocks> sil2100: well, it does
<sil2100> hmm
<seb128> larsu, no, if dholbach was there, desrt would only start the party
<didrocks> could have been weeks ago, you didn't keep me in the loop :)
<seb128> larsu, not be back
<didrocks> but IIRC, you reinstalled it
<larsu> seb128: maybe he's still getting ready :P
<sil2100> didrocks: maybe it was changed during the 'switch to a bigger disk'?
<seb128> marga, ;-)
<didrocks> sil2100: can be, I didn't follow the operation
<seb128> marga, ups, sorry
<seb128> larsu, ;-)
<larsu> :)
 * desrt trouble sleeping
<didrocks> sil2100: so, the silos projection in my people.canonical.com didn't work
<desrt> for a very very odd reason...
<didrocks> sil2100: I removed the whole directory, without remembering there were those buttonsâ¦
<sil2100> didrocks: just so you know - I was not aware of the machine IP being changed, my understanding was that everything stays the same just the machine is upgraded
<larsu> desrt: excited for Berlin?
<didrocks> sil2100: you should probably readd some and point to another dir
<didrocks> sil2100: no worry, I didn't notice before Saviq pinged me about an outdated projection
<desrt> larsu: no.  spent most of my holiday untangling a ball of yarn.  was very satisfying, but didn't quite finish, so it's bothering me :)
<didrocks> sil2100: so, just a warning for the icons, so that you know :)
<sil2100> didrocks: ok, will find some buttons then and put them in some seperate place ;)
<didrocks> great!
<sil2100> Thanks! I now see they're being gone ;p
<didrocks> yep, google doesn't cache them for long for sure
<larsu> desrt: that's ... random. But cool!
<Laney> seb128: I don't see your inline comment
<Laney> is it that you wanted me to add some ()?
<seb128> lol, that was part of it ;-)
 * Laney looks harder
<seb128> Laney, sorry, I didn't click submit on the inline comment
<Laney> np, it's easy to forget that
<seb128> Laney, done
<Cimi> mpt, small bug: scroll wheel behaviour on sound indicator and within output volume in control center is inverted
<mpt> Cimi, possibly bug 1071738
<ubot5> bug 1071738 in libappindicator (Ubuntu) "Indicator scroll event says direction UP on 12.10 even when scrolling down" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1071738
<mpt> Or possibly not, if itâs happening in System Settings as well
<seb128> larsu, ^ do you know about that?
<larsu> seb128: nope. I remember fixing this last year and I can't reproduce it now
<larsu> mpt: libappindicator doesn't have anything to do with the sound menu (it's for apps only)
<Laney> wtf
<Laney> I just replied to that
<Laney> where did I do it?
 * Laney is going mad
<larsu> Cimi: you seeing this on utopic?
<seb128> larsu, weird, it happens in settings for me
<seb128> but that's trusty (though with GTK 3.12Â°
<larsu> so scrolling up moves the slider to the left?
<larsu> and the other way around in the sound menu?
<larsu> Laney: please don't :)
<seb128> larsu, sound menu works fine, u-c-c is reversed indeed
<Laney> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=407242
<ubot5> Gnome bug 407242 in Widget: GtkRange "Unexpected behavior of GtkScale widgets controled by keyboard" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<larsu> "controlled by keyboard"
<Laney> both
<larsu> seb128: woah. I have the same in _other_ panels
<seb128> gtk bog?
<Laney> try using up/down or the scroll wheel
<larsu> Mouse & Touchpad sliders behave the other way
<larsu> I am using the scroll wheel, that's what we're talking about, no?
<larsu> up/down is broken as well
<Laney> It is the same for the scroll wheel and the arrow keys
<Laney> that's what the bug I just linked says
<larsu> okay. In the sound panel, up/down is broken but scroll wheel works
<larsu> (for me)
<larsu> MADNESS
<Laney> all broken for me
<larsu> ugh
<larsu>                 gtk_range_set_inverted (GTK_RANGE (priv->scale), TRUE);
<seb128> key and scroll are reversed here
<larsu> this is from the sound panel ^^
<ogra_> just rename it to volume-lottery
<larsu> ah, this was only for the vertical case. The panel does override scroll events though
<larsu> probably it gets it wrong
<Laney> Seems like a general GtkHScale bug to me
<larsu> but why do different ones behave differently then?
<larsu> and why do I only see the problem in the Mouse panel?
<Laney> I don't know why you see that because it's not what I see, or seb from what he said
<Laney> every GtkHScale in u-c-c I'm trying scrolls the same
 * larsu wonders what he's doing wrong
<larsu> you guys are on utopic?
<larsu> for me, everyone except the ones in sound scroll the same (wrong) way
<Laney> yep
<Cimi> yep
<larsu> Cimi, seb128, Laney: do you have natural scrolling enabled?
<Laney> the indicator is right though
<seb128> larsu, no
<Cimi> no
<Laney> don't think so
<Laney> is that where it's always inverted?
<larsu> yes, but only for touchpads iirc
<larsu> gsettings get org.gnome.settings-daemon.peripherals.touchpad natural-scroll
<Laney> yeah don't have one of those
<Laney> false
<larsu> hm, there's a couple of more bugs about this on gnome bugzilla
<Laney> anyone noticed / investigated the appearance panel crash?
<larsu> not yet, but I have it on my list. I'll try to get to it after lunch
<Laney> it's okay, I think I see it
<darkxst> hey desktopers!
<Laney> larsu: https://code.launchpad.net/~laney/unity-control-center/appearance-settings-schema-unref/+merge/225282
<Laney> hey darkxst, what's up?
<darkxst> Laney, would you believe we had sunshine today ;)
<Laney> a mere 18C, right?
<darkxst> Laney, maybe 10C
<Laney> you poor thing
<darkxst> but first time in weeks, that sun decided to come out!
<Laney> it's actually 22-23 today, this is quite summery for me
<darkxst> Laney, its winter here!
<Laney> 10 in winter is amusing to me
<darkxst> Laney, Australian winters, you have to head 4 hours drive to get the mountains (and snow)
<darkxst> or 36hours to get to the French Alps ;(
<darkxst> I really should just move to europe!
<Laney> do it
<Laney> you're doing a PhD right?
<Laney> get yourself a nice little postdoc after
<darkxst> Laney, yes
<darkxst> could be a go, postdoc's here are pretty dodge
<larsu> Laney: cool thanks. Do you know why this didn't crash with the old glib?
<larsu> I also love how the other unrefs in that function are already correct
<Laney> larsu: It goes through the new g_type_check_instance_fundamentally_is_a() thing now
<larsu> ah, interesring
<Laney> not sure if it's meant to crash or not though
<larsu> Laney: can't top-approve, sorry
<Laney> what team is this?
<Laney> ah
<Laney> larsu: try now
<larsu> works, done, thanks.
<larsu> oh. firefox crashed
<larsu> hasn't happened in a long time for me
<Laney> I had a really bad period a month or so ago but it hasn't crashed for a while for me
<Laney> I think it was an extension causing it
<darkxst> ochosi, not sure you fix is actually right, but it will do
<darkxst> ochosi, fwiw, gnome-shell fallback to gnome-screensaver when used with lightdm
<darkxst> so light-locker would probably be a valid option in that case, just not quite how things are setup right now
<seb128> Saviq, so, are you finding qa to test and land suru? ;-)
<xnox> Laney: seb128: what handles auto-mounting usb sticks? is that just udisks2? or not at all, and something higher (e.g. gvfs) or lower (e.g. plain udev)?
<ochosi> darkxst: right. my main problem is i don't have time atm to look into the lightdm-check (even though i agree that it's the better fix), so i thought i can easily push this for the meantime and revert it once we have the better fix
<ochosi> darkxst: i guess for unity it's always correct to not show/launch light-locker >=14.04
<Saviq> seb128, it's already ACKed
<Saviq> seb128, sil2100 wants to serialize with Mir, though
<seb128> sil2100, it's not friday, no need to be cautious
<ogra_> seb128, hmm, was that (football) pun intended ?
<ogra_> :)
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> mvo: hey, I was trying to be a little bit smarter on the euid of my program which is using python-apt
<didrocks> mvo: I thought that the part needing root was what is under the fork()
<didrocks> and so, doing a seteuid(0) in that part
<didrocks> but it seems that apt.commit() needs to be root as well?
<mvo> didrocks: hm, I can only think that it tries set/unset a lock
<didrocks> mvo: exactly! Do you have an idea if I can seteuid(0) just before the commit and then seteuid(user)?
<didrocks> mvo: and in the fork() I seteuid(0) again
<mvo> didrocks: not from the top of my head, need to look at the source first
<didrocks> mvo: hum, doesn't seem to work
<didrocks> oh, maybe I know
<didrocks> let me try something
<didrocks> yeah, I can just "swandwich" the commit() call with those
<didrocks> mvo: that would be good enough for now, thanks ;)
<seb128> oh, Laney doing landings, nice
<seb128> I had a "wth" moment when I saw robert_ancell mp going "merged" ;-)
<Laney> heh
<Laney> might as well use the powers ;-)
<seb128> that's the spirit!
<Laney> it's much nicer when you can do the whole thing yourself
<seb128> indeed
<Laney> you going to do a u-s-s one?
<Laney> did the icons happen?
<GunnarHj> Hi seb128
<seb128> hey GunnarHj
<GunnarHj> seb128: Talked with infinity about bug 1308771. He didn't see any problem with the new binaries. Any chance you could upload?
<ubot5> bug 1308771 in openoffice.org-hyphenation (Ubuntu Trusty) "Update Swedish spellcheck and hyphenation dictionaries" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1308771
<seb128> GunnarHj, can you just add it in the sponsoring queue?
<seb128> but I can have a look tomorrow if nobody pick it up before
<GunnarHj> seb128: It has been there for a loong, loong time.. But tomorrow is ok.
<seb128> right, it was blocked on SRU team to ack the change as being ok for a SRU though
<GunnarHj> seb128: I added the IRC conversation as a bug comment.
<seb128> that's useful, thanks
<Laney> darkxst: I'm testing your stuff
<Laney> the only problem I see now is that the monitors are the wrong way aroudn
<Laney> around
<Laney> x and y look right in monitors.xml
<Laney> darkxst: if I use xrandr to set the position it gets fixed
<Laney> looks like there's a problem applying the monitors.xml config
<Laney> night!
<eridu> hello, is this an appropriate channel for unity shell bug reports?
<eridu> I'd report on launchpad but it seems to be a regression and I'd like help firetesting it a bit first
<sarnold> eridu: there's also an #ubuntu-unity that might work
<psusi> so I'm trying to figure out how the desktop session hangs together... lightdm, gnome-session, etc.. and looking at all their config files I can't see how init --session and dbus and such are run... it looks like the only thing they start is compiz+unity-settings daemon or gnome-settings-daemon+gnome-shell.. what gives?
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-07-03
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<larsu> seb128: only 2:12 after pitti. You're getting there!
<pitti> bonjour seb128 et larsu, comment allez-vous ?
<pitti> seb128: oui, tu est tÃ´t aujourd'hui !
<seb128> larsu, no way pitti is up at that time
<seb128> I was unsure if 7am is morning but I'm sure before 6am is not :p
<seb128> pitti, salut, Ã§a va bien ! et toi ?
<larsu> pitti: Ã§a va bien aussi. Et toi=
<larsu> s/=/?
<pitti> 05:48:46   pitti | Good morning
<pitti> *shrug*
<seb128> pitti, I'm not even going to pretend trying to compete with that ... :-)
<pitti> seb128, larsu: Ã§a va bien aussi, merci ! un peu fatigue, mais je ne peux plus dormier :(
<pitti> "dormir"
<pitti> seb128: no, please don't
<seb128> :-(
<pitti> 7:00 is nice, 5:30 is a nuisance
<seb128> pitti, tu fais de l'insomnie ?
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> 7:00 is actually ok, at least in summer when it's nice outside
<seb128> not sure in winter when it's dark and raining
<pitti> so around 4 there were some cats or martens which made terribly loud noises
<pitti> at 4:30 my wife woke up, got up at 4:50
<pitti> and my head started thinking and I couldn't stop it
<pitti> so I gave up trying to sleep at 5:30 :)
<pitti> but I'm quite used to it by now
<seb128> well, at least you enjoy the nice and fresh start of day
<seb128> not sure how is the weather in Germany today, they forecasted over 30Â°C in Lyon today
<pitti> seb128: so far quite nice and sunny, but still "only" 20 degrees
<didrocks> waow, winter there :)
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti
<seb128> bah
<seb128> Saviq, rsalveti: some parts of the suru silo are blocked in proposed because ubuntu-ui-toolkit-gles is outdated and makes ubuntu-touch uninstallable on i386/amd64
<seb128> outdated = still on 1.47 where the ui toolkit got updated to 48
<seb128> is any of you looking at that?
<Saviq> seb128, first I've heard of that...
<seb128> # apt-get install ubuntu-touch unity8 unity8-common qtdeclarative5-ubuntu-ui-toolkit-plugin
<seb128> ...
<seb128> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<seb128>  ubuntu-touch : Depends: qtdeclarative5-ubuntu-ui-toolkit-plugin-gles but it is not going to be installed
<Saviq> seb128, yeah I understand, do you know any details about the -gles package?
<Saviq> like is there a branch somewhere or is this a source only package
<seb128> Saviq, no, which is why I'm asking...
<Saviq> seb128, I *just* found out that package exists...
<seb128> I don't know much about it
<seb128> out of that rsalveti dupped a bunch of those packages for the i386 emulator
<seb128> keeping them in sync is annoying though, not the first time we get bitten by it
<darkxst> hey all
<seb128> hey!
<seb128> sil2100, ^ do you know about ubuntu-ui-toolkit-gles?
<darkxst> pitti, gvfs bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-settings-daemon/+bug/1069964/comments/23
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1069964 in unity-settings-daemon (Ubuntu) "Unable to mount Blank CD-R disc. Location is already mounted." [Low,Confirmed]
<Saviq> seb128, TBH I don't know what to do with that... sil2100, do you know anything about how do we deal with https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-ui-toolkit-gles ?
<sil2100> seb128: hey! I just know about its existance and that rsalveti asked to duplicate changes we make to the standard packages to the -gles packages
<seb128> sil2100, can you do that? ;-)
<Saviq> oh /me should read
<seb128> that's currently blocking part of the suru transition
<rsalveti> hey
<seb128> rsalveti, hey ;-)
 * Saviq didn't get the memo
<rsalveti> so, we're duplicating a few packages, yeah
<rsalveti> but the problem is that we're not updating it when landing new versions of the original packages
<rsalveti> let me take a look
<sil2100> seb128: I never did that, but I guess rsalveti would do it much faster, as he's a core dev ;)
<sil2100> rsalveti: thanks!
<seb128> rsalveti, should the ubuntu-ui-toolkit test/landing page hints that gles needs to be updated in sync?
<seb128> rsalveti, thanks
<rsalveti> seb128: yup, that's what I asked when I enabled the x86 emulator
<rsalveti> but not sure if that happened :-)
<Saviq> and maybe even citrain should have a check for a few of those to prevent publishing if both are not updated?
<seb128> sil2100, ^ what do you think?
<rsalveti> also something I asked before, maybe sil2100 can do such thing
<rsalveti> let me update the tookit
<Saviq> should not be crazy difficult, and sounds like without it we'll be shooting ourselves in the foot all the time
<sil2100> seb128, Saviq: I can add a check in the publish phase indeed, that wouldn't be perfectly beautiful but at least practical ;)
<darkxst> Laney, I can't reproduce any issue with monitors.xml, seems to be applied properly on login, and is saved properly from u-c-c provided call into the dbus api before timeout
<seb128> sil2100, that would be nice
<sil2100> Let me do that then
<seb128> thanks
<Saviq> rsalveti, for future reference, do you just apply the diff from distro to the source package or?
<rsalveti> Saviq: yeah
<rsalveti> Saviq: unless there are packaging differences, then we need to be a bit more careful
<Saviq> rsalveti, and is there a list of those dupes somewhere?
<darkxst> Laney, there may be issues with hotplugging a display though, but I don't have real hardware to test that on
<rsalveti> we have in emails, let me get the list
<rsalveti> Saviq: http://paste.ubuntu.com/7740743/ the email I sent to the landing team while ago
 * Saviq will keep that in mind
<rsalveti> Saviq: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-ui-toolkit-gles/0.1.48+14.10.20140701.2-0ubuntu1
<Saviq> rsalveti, thanks and sorry about that
<rsalveti> no worries :-)
<Laney> morning
<Laney> darkxst: it's not applied right for me
<seb128> Laney, hey, how are you?
<didrocks> hey Laney!
<Laney> weeeeeeeeeeeeeellllll my alarm "didn't go off" this morning
<Laney> so I have been up about 30 minutes :P
<Laney> other than that, good
<Laney> hey didrocks too!
<Laney> how's lyon?
<darkxst> Laney, do any errors get logged?
<didrocks> Laney: as awesome as usual :)
<seb128> Laney, 9am, seems your normal "good morning IRC" time ;-)
<didrocks> I'll let seb128 confirm :p
<Laney> yeah I'm eating breakfast at desk
<seb128> I see
<Laney> the schedule is all powerful!
<seb128> Laney, Lyon is great, the rain yesterday morning was a small glitch, weather is back to south-of-france sunny ;-)
<Laney> darkxst: where are the logs?
<darkxst> I think they end up .cache/upstart/dbus.log
<darkxst> Laney, also does reloading `unity-settings-daemon -r` apply the config?
<Laney> it is applied, just not correctly
<Laney> don't see anything interesting in the log
<darkxst> what happens exactly? I switch my monitors (in a VM but still) via u-c-c, send the dbus, logout, come back and they are still switched
<Laney> the resolution is correct but the position is wrong
<Laney> the left monitor is on the right
<Laney> i.e. going off its left edge brings me to the right edge of the right monitor
<Laney> darkxst: http://paste.ubuntu.com/7740870/
<Laney> try applying something like that, probably have to fudge it a bit
<darkxst> Laney, was that generated by u-c-c or a custom one?
<Laney> u-c-c
<Laney> actually I cut it down a bit to see if some earlier stuff was causing the bug
<Laney> can give you the full one if you want, didn't make a difference that I can see
<darkxst> Laney, my VM won't do different resolutions on the monitors ;(
<darkxst> and I can't logout/reboot right now
<Laney> darkxst: Hmm
<Laney> it gets to the case "No previous configuration found, try with a really default one"
<Laney> monitor-config.c
<darkxst> Laney, gah, I don't think it should even get to that, unless its not picking up your existing config for some reason
<Laney> no idea
<Laney> It's hard to figure out the flow of this code
<Laney> I know that it does read and parse monitors.xml
<darkxst> Laney, make_default should only be called if applying the previous config failed
<darkxst> and its kind of hard to debug, when I can't reproduce
<didrocks> desrt: larsu: hey, do you have any idea how I can ensure that I've process all timeout_add sources (I don't repeat them) when calling mainloop.quit() before exiting the application?
<larsu> didrocks: g_main_context_pending() tells you whether there are any pending events left
<larsu> didrocks: I don't know if pending means "in the current iteration", or in general
<larsu> but desrt will know that :)
<didrocks> larsu: I tried that, it seems to be only for idle_add source event
<desrt> didrocks: not possible
<desrt> didrocks: you have to keep track for yourself
<didrocks> larsu: not for timeouts add
<didrocks> ok, at least, the answer is clear :)
<desrt> this is a frequently asked question and it's one of those things that's harder than it seems...
<didrocks> thanks larsu, desrt ;)
<desrt> larsu: pending means "will fire now"
<larsu> desrt: yeah I had a feeling...
<larsu> meh
<desrt> the problem with asking "are there any sources attached now?" is that quite a lot of our events (and really, all of the interesting ones) come not from sources but from future not-yet-created sources
<desrt> think pending async callbacks as the best example
<desrt> or signals from dbus/gsettings/inotify
<didrocks> yeah, can be, indeed
<larsu> "for english, please press 9"
<larsu> [continues speaking in french]
<larsu> bah!
<Laney> please say NEIN
<larsu> NON
<desrt> NE
<desrt> everyone knows that english is 1 and french is 2
<larsu> desrt: not in France...
<seb128> larsu, who are you calling?
<larsu> nothing is French
<larsu> and everything else is French as well
<larsu> seb128: air france :/
<seb128> lol
<desrt> it's so utterly universal that french is 2 that even when you call a place that has english as the default language for which you have to press nothing it will ask you "press 2 for french"
<larsu> it's actually english now after I called again
<desrt> even though there is no 1
<seb128> larsu, do you need help? :-)
<seb128> larsu, how come you are flying french?
<seb128> they are always on strike, so "flying" might be a strong word
<Laney> concorde
<Laney> oh wait
<larsu> seb128: I don't think so. Waiting in line and the roboter lady speaks English, so should be fine
<seb128> why do you want to be grounded in FranceE?
<desrt> Laney: nononono.  the 'e' is for England
<Laney> concordÃ¨
<desrt> concordÉ
<Laney> Ã§Ã³nÃ§Ã²rdÃ©
 * desrt thinks that Laney doesn't know what the Ã§ means
 * didrocks does note that concorde was an UK-FR project :)
<Laney> ÄÃ¸...
 * Laney goes away
 * seb128 catches Laney and bring him back
<didrocks> he can't escape, we are 2!
<Laney> the power of SUPERSONIC FLIGHT will enable my escape!
<seb128> Laney, you better surrender
<Laney> :(
<seb128> Laney, just wave the white flag, that's fine
<Laney> My terms are: 1. Access to real ale as defined by CAMRA, 2. Access to climbing
<rickspencer3> seb128, Laney, etc... how's the Unity 8/Mir image coming along?
<seb128> rickspencer3, it's there and working
<seb128> "working"
<rickspencer3> seb128, I'll try it next week!
<seb128> not really usable
<rickspencer3> seb128, what is keeping it from being usable?
<seb128> but that's the state of those component from upstream
<larsu> seb128: not for me :) Faina is in Paris with some of her students and they forgot to specify luggage. The website won't let me add it
<larsu> seb128: now I'm in a call with them and she doesn't seem to be able to either
<seb128> larsu, oh, ok
<seb128> bah
<larsu> seb128: thanks for offering help :)
<larsu> she speaks english and understands if
<larsu> I
<larsu> speak
<larsu> very
<larsu> slowly
<seb128> rickspencer3, the webbrowser segfault on start, clicks don't run because qmlscene default to qt4 by default
<seb128> -by default
<seb128> (I emailed ubuntu-devel@ about the best way to resolve that, no real outcome yet though)
<rickspencer3> seb128, oh, sounds like some work to do :)
<seb128> rickspencer3, then bugs and missing wm
<seb128> larsu, just speak french, it's going to be easier
<seb128> larsu, keep saying "je ne sais pas"
<larsu> haha
<Laney> it does install and run though, if you have the right hardware
<larsu> now she's going on the website herself
<seb128> lol
<larsu> "you can't add it on the website, neither can you cancel the checkin"
<larsu> "yes I can, I'll do it!"
<larsu> "oh, it doesn't work... hm"
<seb128> french quality (tm)
<larsu> :/
<GunnarHj> Hi pitti
<pitti> hey GunnarHj, how are you?
<GunnarHj> pitti: Fine, hope you are too.
<GunnarHj> pitti: New langpack update round soon.
<GunnarHj> pitti: ubuntu-docs was built yesterday for trusty-proposed. Are with that the updated localized pages available when building the language-pack-gnome-xx-base packages, or does it need to be moved to -updates first?
<pitti> GunnarHj: I am, yes, thanks
<pitti> GunnarHj: no, being built is enough; but we need to manually trigger a -base refresh, it doesn't happen via cron
<GunnarHj> pitti: Can you do that? Next testing period starts July 10.
<pitti> GunnarHj: I disabled the automatic cronjob and requested a full export on https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/trusty/+language-packs
<pitti> GunnarHj: once that lands, I'll build and upload
<pitti> GunnarHj: the next regular build would be on July 7, so that fits
<GunnarHj> pitti: Great; thanks for letting me know.
<Laney> mvo: yo
<Laney> how does apt decide when to download Translation-*?
<Laney> E: Encountered a section with no Package: header
<Laney> E: Problem with MergeList /var/lib/apt/lists/repository.spotify.com_dists_stable_non-free_i18n_Translation-en
<Laney> E: The package lists or status file could not be parsed or opened.
<Laney> laney@iota>                                                                                                                                ~
<Laney> laney@iota> head -2 /var/lib/apt/lists/repository.spotify.com_dists_stable_non-free_i18n_Translation-en                                    ~
<Laney> <!DOCTYPE html>
<Laney> <html lang="en" xmlns:og="http://ogp.me/ns#" xmlns:fb="https://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" class="" >
<Laney> I don't see this under http://repository.spotify.com/dists/stable/ though
 * seb128 hands a pastebin to Laney
 * Laney gets crushed
<mvo> Laney: hm, that rings a bell
<mvo> Laney: I'm in a meeting right now, could you ping me again so that I can find the bugnumber?
<Laney> okay
<seb128> Laney, let me know when you test u-s-s so I can land it ;-)
<Laney> new icons...
<mvo> Laney: hm, can you give me your sources.list so that I can  reproduce?
<Laney> mvo: deb http://repository.spotify.com stable non-free
<Laney> seb128: -1 :(
<Laney> update-uis-tweaks adds a visible: false which is a duplicate
<Laney> makes the page not load
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> how did that happen?
<mvo> thanks Laney
<seb128> Laney, thanks, fixing that
<seb128> Laney, can you delete that line manually and try again?
<Laney> seb128: yeah, I did
<seb128> Laney, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/update-uis-tweaks/revision/751
<Laney> line 264 in system-update/PageComponent.qml
<didrocks> mvo: and an apt question for you!
<didrocks> mvo: on my amd64, if I do apt.Cache()["libncurses5:amd64"], it returns the expected package
<mvo> Laney: hm, can't reproduce :/
<didrocks> however, for seb128, on i386, apt.Cache()["libncurses5:i386"] is a fail (not in cache)
<Laney> mvo: maybe they fixed it, lemme update
<didrocks> where it works on my amd64 if I add the multi-arch thingy
<mvo> didrocks: right, seb has no multiarch system
<mvo> didrocks: that is expected (but I do understand that its a bit unexpected)
<didrocks> the unexpected is expected :p
<mvo> didrocks: in both cases the "short" name with out the ":" will work
<Laney> mvo: try with en_GB if you can
<Laney> or at least some kind of en
<didrocks> mvo: any way to detect that it's not a no multiarch system?
<didrocks> is it like dpkg --print-foreign-architectures
<didrocks> returns nothing?
<didrocks> and so not multiarch
<seb128> mvo, what is expected? that seb lives in the past and has i386? ;-)
<mvo> didrocks: yes, check doc/examples/architecture.py
<mvo> didrocks: hm, well, or use apt_pkg.get_architectures()
<mvo> didrocks: i.e. python -c 'import apt; print(apt.apt_pkg.get_architectures())'
<didrocks> mvo: yeah, that's what I'm using already, I was just expecting though that :current-arch would work as on my amd64 :)
<mvo> didrocks: I guess we could make it do that, it, it just wasn't on the radar
<mvo> seb128: *cough*
<mvo> Laney: hm, ok, let me try harder
<seb128> mvo, jaja, wait for tomorrow
<didrocks> mvo: I think it would make sense, I'll probably propose somethingâ¦ :)
 * didrocks adds a TODO and strip for now
<mvo> seb128: aha, TGIF, right?
 * Laney watched didrocks strip
<seb128> mvo, yeah, and Germany vs France
<Laney> s/ed/es/
<didrocks> Laney: sure sure, you will be disappointed :p
<davmor2> seb128: Man that must be a Tough match for a German like you to watch right /me ducks quick
<seb128> davmor2, you mean one I can be on the winning side whatever team wins? ;-)
<davmor2> seb128: Or the Loser either way
<seb128> heh, it's not friday yet, stop the trolling! ;-)
<mvo> seb128: aha, its the worldcup
<seb128> mvo, you forgot, right?
<mvo> seb128: yeah, what side are you on actually?
<seb128> mvo, not credible
<seb128> mvo, France this time ;-)
<davmor2> seb128: Yes mvo was too busy watching Cricket and Tennis
<mvo> davmor2: haha, indeed
<mvo> Laney: \o/ can reproduce
<mvo> Laney: needed to add the key
<Laney> mvo: a-ha!
<Laney> I tried to get the file using my browser but failed miserably
<mvo> Laney: as a workaround you can use -o Acquire::Languages=none
<mvo> Laney: http://paste.ubuntu.com/7742494/ <- that should fix it
<Laney> mvo: Nice. The diff on its own isn't very enlightening though. :)
<Laney> are you just turning off the check?
<mvo> Laney: I tun it on :)
<mvo> Laney: its a multitude of issues actually :/
<seb128> Laney, u-s-s looking good without that line?
<Laney> is it built?
<Laney> still building, just finished
<seb128> k
<seb128> I'm afaik for a bit but going to read scrollback when I'm back and publish if testing is not pointing new issues
<seb128> bbiab
<Laney> seb128: looks okay to me now ;-)
<mvo> Laney: fix pushed into git, should be part of the next upload
<Laney> mvo: nice
<mvo> Laney: probably worth a sru as well
<Laney> do you think it's worth doing sooner?
 * mvo makes a note
<Laney> feels like everyone using spotify's repo will hit this
<mvo> Laney: my actual fix looks a bit different, but yeah, feel free to uplaod the latest git commit on top of apt (after you verified it of course :)
 * mvo really needs to leave for dinner now
<mvo> Laney: and thanks for the notificaiton about the issue!
<Laney> np, thanks for the fix!
<chrisccoulson> seb128, https://launchpad.net/~phablet-team/+archive/ppa/+sourcepub/4272274/+listing-archive-extra ;)
<chrisccoulson> (has unity 8 desktop fixes in)
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, \o/
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-07-04
<didrocks> morning!
<didrocks> seb128 is going to slac^W^W^W^Wbe on a train until the start of the afternoon FYI
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti!
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, Ã§a va ?
<didrocks> Ã§a va trÃ¨s bien, et toi ?
<pitti> didrocks: mieux qu'hier ! je pus dormier jusqu'Ã  7:15 !
<didrocks> pitti: ah bien ! tu seras en forme pour le week-end ;)
<pitti> didrocks: hehe
<pitti> didrocks: et j'attends avec impatience le grand match Ã  ce soir :)
<didrocks> pitti: ahah, ah ouiâ¦ ce "truc" :p
<didrocks> le match oÃ¹ seb dit qu'il gagne Ã  tous les coups
<didrocks> il se considÃ©rera franÃ§ais ou allemand suivant les rÃ©sultats
<duflu> didrocks: Hi!... I just noticed we released an old and inaccurate changelog to Ubuntu archive. Are we allowed to fix the previous revision's text with the next one?
<didrocks> duflu: not really (don't rewrite the history), you should rather amend the current version I guess
<duflu> didrocks: The mistakes aren't relevant to the current version though :)
<duflu> Just the changelog text that was released is wrong
<didrocks> duflu: ah, it's not things that were written as landed and weren't?
<didrocks> hum, that's what you get  by
<didrocks> by not letting the system picking commits content :)
<didrocks> well, in that case, maybe change it, double check with landing team, like sil2100 though
<duflu> didrocks: Nice thought but developers don't usually write nice enough commit messages you'd want to pick
<didrocks> duflu: the version displayed in launchpad will always contain the wrong changelog though
<didrocks> duflu: like https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mir/0.4.0+14.10.20140701.1-0ubuntu1 for instance
<duflu> didrocks: Well, I can live with that. I'm just thinking what if someone actually wants to read the history. They get bad information
<didrocks> duflu: yeah, I think you should in that case change it, but please, double check with sil2100 & co to not surprise them :)
<duflu> I'd rather it was right in the tree at least
<duflu> didrocks: OK, I'll do a proposable for sil2100 to review
<didrocks> excellent! thanks duflu ;)
<duflu> proposable? Hmm
<didrocks> duflu: well, I got you with my very inaccurate english. But it's maybe the sign you should start enjoying your week-end :)
<duflu> Well it's only Pi PM
<didrocks> oh, I thought it was later for you
<Laney> goooood morning!
<larsu> hi Laney!
<larsu> I hope all the 'o's mean that you have as much sunshine as we do here ;)
<Laney> actually it's overcast, so maybe I was compensating for that ...
<larsu> :(
<Laney> neighbour came over while I was having breakfast earlier offering to do some gardening for us ...
<Laney> probably a bad sign
<larsu> depending on your neighbor, this is either very nice or very passive aggressive
<Laney> I think nice
<Laney> he was mates with the guy who owns the house and used to do stuff like this for him
<didrocks> hey Laney, larsu!
<Laney> hey didrocks! happy friday!
<didrocks> happy friday Laney :)
<Laney> no seb128 today?
<didrocks> he's on the train back to his house
<didrocks> he will probably show up at the start of afternoon
<larsu> lut didrocks! Ãa va?
<didrocks> larsu: Ã§a va bien, et toi ?
<larsu> didrocks: nickel! Merci
<didrocks> larsu: impatient of *not* watching the game tonight? :)
<larsu> there's a game?
<larsu> oh, right!
<larsu> GER FRA!
<didrocks> yeah, people are contaminated, even pitti mentionned it in the morning :p
<pitti> hey larsu, hello Laney
<Laney> aieeeeee, it's a pitti
<pitti> (that scary?)
<larsu> hi pitti
<Laney> more... pleased ;-)
 * Laney peers at mvo 
<Laney> muhahaha
<Laney> I tested your patch and now I get a warning for the file in partial/
<mvo> Laney: yeah, it warns but it should ignore it, right?
<Laney> well I didn't get the old file cleaned up
<Laney> in /v/l/a/lists/
<Laney> mvo: so I guess if you got into the bad state this doesn't get you out of it, but if I clean out lists/ it'll probably be fixed
<mvo> Laney: oh, indeed yes
 * mvo scratches head 
<mvo> Laney: no cleanup right now
<xnox> Laney: gardening is very impulsive / compulsive, or snarky - all those weeds i'm getting from over the fence, I'll sort it out.
<xnox> didrocks: seb128: i'm sorry, but I'm with GER on this one.... Auf gehts!
<didrocks> xnox: well, seb128 has the choice :)
<didrocks> he will win in any case :p
<larsu> lol
<didrocks> I'm not even trolling, that's what he told!
<larsu> didrocks: still funny :)
<didrocks> larsu: so, he's taking the GER nationality for football in case of win, holidaysâ¦ what's next?
<larsu> didrocks: the language!
 * larsu can teach him
<didrocks> oh noes!
<larsu> he'll have to forget French though
<larsu> or, at the very least, develop a thick German accent
<didrocks> well his french is germanish alreadyâ¦ :p
<larsu> haha awesome
<xnox> didrocks: hm, i think switching from french wine to german beer is next on the list, isn't it?
<xnox> after that language just comes naturally
<didrocks> xnox: that's already done I guess :p
<didrocks> ahah
 * didrocks won't say anything about the number of beers we drink this week
<didrocks> (it's all his fault for the record)
<didrocks> seb128: STOP READING IRC LOGS BTW! :)
<larsu> hm? He does that?
<didrocks> [X] Annoy seb when he will read the backlog -> done
<larsu> :D
<didrocks> larsu: I'm sure he will once he's back at home ;)
 * larsu says hello to future seb128
<didrocks> waow, that starts to be mind-breaking!
<Laney> darkxst: you need to take b462e656e into u-s-d
<Laney> keyboard plugin is borked otherwise
<xnox> seb128: Hallo! Wie gehts?! =) Ich wÃ¼nsche euch viel GlÃ¼ck im FuÃball heute!
<darkxst> Laney, already got that into utopic u-s-d, just havent rebased the ppa package
<Laney> ah
<Laney> would be nice to do so
<darkxst> Laney, yes will do a bit later
<Laney> I think that's what sets the compose key
<Laney> and my gpg passphrase contains a compose character
<Laney> so can not haz uploads
 * didrocks is one step closer to Laney's gpg passphrase
<Laney> it's â­
<didrocks> ahah
<pitti> Laney: wow, there's a compose key for that? :-)
<pitti> <compose>USSR or something? :-)
<Laney> I added it to .XCompose or whatever the file is called
<Laney> as cccp :-)
<darkxst> oh robert hasnt actually merged it yet, will add it to the ppa anyway
<Laney> ty
<Laney> going to look at debugging this ordering thing in a minute
<Laney> I found out that it tries to look up the monitor in a hash table but doesn't find it for some reason
<darkxst> it doesnt fine the monitor? or you mean the config that contains you 2 monitors
<Laney> it tries to build a configuration from the parsed data in montiors.xml but it seems that we don't get into the case that actually applies what it read
<Laney> only the fallback one
<darkxst> Laney, need to make dinner, will be back a bit later. xkb fix is pushed
<Laney> to ppa?
<Laney> I see it, ta
<Laney> darkxst: seems media-keys plugin doesn't work either
<darkxst> Laney, will check that after dinner
 * Laney nod
<Laney> there's a crash when you toggle it in that state, that's 6a81d4ad
<Laney> something to do with grabbing keys I guess
<darkxst> Laney, do you get any messages about missing schemas or such? something did change with that in 3.10, but I thought I already fixed it
<Laney> no
<darkxst> gah, gdm seems somewhat broken after todays updates ;(
<darkxst> Laney, crashing or just not working?
<Laney> darkxst: doesn't work
<Laney> crash would be easier to fix probably :P
 * xnox is loving the GER vs FRA google doodle today
<xnox> Laney: checkout www.google.de or www.google.fr or www.google.lv
<Laney> that's cute
<Laney> why does lv have it and not uk?
<xnox> Laney: I have two gueses - latvia is an ex-German colony, or it would be controversial in the UK since it's out.
 * xnox ponders if that doodle is up across europe, but countries that are out.
<xnox> Laney: haha, I think it's the later - everywhere but countries that are out.
<xnox> http://www.google.com/doodles/world-cup-2014-48
<Laney> haha
<xnox> shows the reach map
<Laney> we're so over the world cup
<Laney> I mainly look forward to being able to go to the pub again
<xnox> lolz
<Laney> they cancelled the pub quiz for the duration of the world cup :(
<Laney> GUTTED
<xnox> i loved the sky sport news the day after england was out: and here is the weather report for the upcomming cricket week, and here are the preliminary pre-Wimbledon gossip.... and no other sports to talk about.
<xnox> i wished france vs germany would be the final. GER vs BEL would be fun to watch as well, as would BRA vs ARG.
<xnox> hm FRA vs NED would be awesome as well.
<darkxst> Laney, my machine is hosed, probably need to fix that first!
<darkxst> seem to be loosing auth channel between gdm and gnome-shell
<Laney> darkxst: getting somewhere
<Laney> Going to have lunch but ... hope
<elopio> Hello
<elopio> I need to have a passwordless keyring. Any pointers for that?
<elopio> dobey: you might know ^
<elopio> oh, you are probably on holidays.
<seb128> happy friday desktopers!
<seb128> hey Laney
<didrocks> hey seb128!
<seb128> didrocks, irclog trolling, rly?!
<didrocks> ahah, I was sure! :)
<seb128> wait for next time I see you!
<didrocks> ohoh :p
<ochosi> seb128: small reminder, xdg-utils MR
<ochosi> (if you have a todo-list anyway and i shouldn't ping you about stuff like this then let me apologize. it's just... you can never know..)
<Laney> hey hey
<seb128> ochosi, I know, just got busy, sorry
<ochosi> np
<happyaron> seb128: sorry didn't look on the control center stuff, but anyway doing that now, :)
<seb128> happyaron, hey, thanks
<desrt> anyone know a way to squash and edit at the same time?
<larsu> desrt: just edit and amend to the previous commit?
<larsu> or just do the rebase twice...
<desrt> then you lose the commit message
<desrt> although i guess you could copy/paste
<desrt> larsu: btw: just uploaded a small bucketload of patches on the resource path stuff if you wanted to take a look
<desrt> i'm sure mclasen will review that later, but it never hurts to have more eys
<larsu> gotta go to the airport in a bit, but I'll have a look
<larsu> thanks!
<desrt> thanks to you :)
 * pitti toddles off for the weekend
<pitti> seb128, didrocks, vila: ^5s tonight!
<seb128> pitti, good luck to Germany ;-)
<pitti> likewise, good luck to France! whoever country wins buys beer for the other on the next conf?
<didrocks> pitti: enjoy the match ;)
<seb128> pitti, deal!
<didrocks> seb128: you'll have to pick a side first then! ^
<pitti> seb128: your trip back home was better then?
<seb128> didrocks, you don't want me to buy beer, how kind of you ;-)
<didrocks> ahah ;)
<seb128> pitti, better than?
<pitti> seb128: I thought you had some delays on the way to Lyon
<seb128> oh, right
<seb128> yes, trip back was uneventful ;-)
<didrocks> seb128 is the winner, that's the only known result of the match :)
<seb128> on the way there there was a train blocked on the line for almost an hour
<vila> pitti: good luck ! Heard some players had a sore throat...
<vila> pitti: deal for beers ;)
<seb128> didrocks, pitti: joke aside, I'm standing for France this time ;-)
<didrocks> \o/
<vila> I'm standing from where I live (within a 2km radius;)
<vila> s/from/for/
<elopio> ping seb128, do you have time to help me getting this done?
<elopio> https://code.launchpad.net/~elopio/ubuntu-system-settings/python3/+merge/225265
<seb128> elopio, hey, what sort of help do you need?
<elopio> seb128: I need some pointers to confirm that I haven't broken crossbuilding.
<elopio> is there a wiki page or something like that that explains how to do it?
<seb128> elopio, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CrossBuilding
<elopio> seb128: and I get the dsc with dpkg-source -b ., right?
<seb128> elopio, you can use bzr bd --source
<elopio> ok, that's better :)
<Laney> darkxst: I got correct way around monitors!
<elopio> seb128: how do I know why it failed? http://paste.ubuntu.com/7747632/
<elopio> -v doesn't help a lot.
<elopio> ahh, stupid error
<elopio> it shouldn't be on trusty.
 * didrocks hears the french hymne from the balconey
<didrocks> people are shouting
<seb128> elopio, "Status: failed"
<seb128> didrocks, it's starting, turn on the TV!
<didrocks> seb128: no chance! ;)
<seb128> didrocks, you still have some beer, just have to order the pizza
<didrocks> ahah :p
<seb128> didrocks, I should have stayed to make you watch the game :p
<didrocks> perfect evening to order pizza for sure!
 * seb128 is actually going to watch this one ;-)
<didrocks> not just bits this time?
<didrocks> seb128: enjoy then, I won't stay that much longer anyway. Have a nice week-end! :)
<seb128> no, both teams are interesting, and you need to watch to have trolling material ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, thanks, you too!
<didrocks> thanks ;)
<elopio> seb128 or Laney: this is ready:
<elopio> https://code.launchpad.net/~elopio/ubuntu-system-settings/python3/+merge/225265
<Laney> elopio: k, will try to get to it today
<elopio> thanks.
<davmor2> seb128: you setting sail for the other side of the river yet?
<darkxst> Laney, cool, send me a patch and I will merge it
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-07-05
<Laney> darkxst: the activation is racy
<Laney> I think the place you put it is too early
<darkxst> Laney, in the daemon?
<darkxst> i.e. main.c
<Laney> I mean from u-s-d
<Laney> I guess under shell u-s-d is already fully running?
<darkxst> Laney, all the patches in u-s-d are straight from upstream
<Laney> you added a call into displayconfig to make it be activated
<Laney> sorry, train is arriving now
<darkxst> ah,yes
<Laney> I added an upstart job which is 'start on started u-s-d' and that seemed to be alright
<Laney> but it doesn't work for lightdm
<Laney> so finding the right place in usd is better
<Laney> probably from some callback
<Laney> gtg!
<darkxst> Laney, ok
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-06-29
<pitti> Good morning
 * willcooke is back in body but not in mind
<seb128> hey desktopers & willcooke
<seb128> how are you?
<willcooke> sleepy :)
<willcooke> but happy
<seb128> great!
<seb128> everybody is doing fine?
<willcooke> yeah, all good thanls
<seb128> good to read
<seb128> oh, I think I already said in via email, but congrats ;-)
<seb128> willcooke, are you supposed to be back btw?
<willcooke> yeah :(
<seb128> UE calendar has you off today and tomorrow
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> oh right
<willcooke> shit
<seb128> lol
<seb128> "willcooke left irc"
<willcooke> dont tell my wife
<seb128> haha
<willcooke> I'll just idle in here all day instead
<willcooke> ok, I've got to do the school run anyway
<willcooke> might be back later
<seb128> we are going to be quiet don't worry ;-)
<willcooke> thanks seb :)
<seb128> k
<seb128> yw!
<Laney> YO
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey seb128, doing great thanks!
<Laney> hung out with the baby yesterday
<Laney> and we went on a food foraging workshop on saturday which was exciting
<Laney> who knew there was so much to eat ;-)
<Laney> how are you?
<davmor2> Laney: I did :)
 * Laney nibbles on davmor2 
<seb128> Laney, doing good thanks ;-)
<seb128> went to a weeding this w.e, it was fun, nice weather and plenty to drink and eat
<davmor2> Laney: there are 22 arable grasses in the uk so there really is no excuse to go hungry,  however knowing how to use them that is another matter ;)
<Sweet5hark> moin
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark, wie gehts?
<Sweet5hark> seb128: excellent. wonderful weather and I was just tasked to take care of a nice house starting today (for the owners are on vacation) ;)
<seb128> ah, nice
<seb128> weather is going to hot this week, a bit too much for working in front of a computer
<Sweet5hark> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNnAvTTaJjM
<seb128> I like better 25Â°C than 35Â°C
<Sweet5hark> seb128: yeah. we are currently at 25C here in north germany. bavaria has it hotter already.
<Sweet5hark> (I can always go 25C -> 35C by lightening on BigBertha though ;) )
<larsu> 20 in Berlin :/ (but at least sunny)
<Laney> hey larsu!
<Laney> welcome back to sane hours
<larsu> hello Laney! How is life?
<Laney> good, sitting outside in the sun
<seb128> larsu, http://www.weather.com/weather/tenday/l/Berlin+Germany+GMXX0007:1:GM suggest you get that heat starting on friday
<Laney> but I am squinting a bit so might move back in
<seb128> 36Â°C on sunday
<larsu> seb128: that site shows me Fahrenheit :/
<Laney> phwoar, 36F
<seb128> lol
<larsu> Laney: the peril of this job, eh?
 * larsu is not on the balcony for the same reason
<Laney> it's a hard life
<Laney> maybe in 3 more years we'll have bright enough laptop panels
 * Laney gives in and goes inside
<larsu> we hoped this 5 years ago as well...
<pitti> yeah, what's the deal with these transflective displays we got promised?
<larsu> they in a drawer, under the hoverboards
<larsu> *are
 * Laney forms a human rights based argument to force companies to make these
<pitti> well, unlike hoverboards there were actual devices (at least prototypes) for transflective displays :)
<larsu> hoverboards as well :)
<pitti> oh?
<Laney> Article 19 - Right to work on ones laptop outside
<pitti> seconded
<pitti> with "one's"
<Laney> :)
<larsu> pitti: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-06-24/lexus-builds-a-functional-hoverboard-prototype
<Laney> interestingly this means they have to be fully waterproof too
<pitti> hm, and not even from April 1
<larsu> pitti: it's got tons of problems though. Most importantly, needs magnets on the roads :/
<pitti> larsu: bah, that's cheating!
 * pitti searches ebay for a spare anti-grav generator
<larsu> haha
<ricotz> Sweet5hark, 5.0.0~rc2, yummy :)
<seb128> larsu, Laney, could you look at bug #1462346? I think it's another bug due to the gtk change with icons sizing
<ubot5> bug 1462346 in humanity-icon-theme (Ubuntu) "Wrong size of folder-drag-accept/gnome-fs-directory-accept icon at zoom levels bigger than 100% in Nautilus " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1462346
<larsu> seb128: sure, one moment (brb)
<larsu> seb128: ooh indeed. Can reproduce. There are more bugs like this. Last time we talked about it, we decided to put some hacks into the icon theme because we were unsure if we were getting a new icon theme...
<larsu> we know now that we're not, right?
<larsu> so it might be worthwhile to fix this properly
<larsu> it's not that big of a deal, mostly moving around .svgs
<seb128> yes
<seb128> or add another hack
<seb128> I though we add the tweak to all category
<seb128> so maybe the hack doesn't work there?
<larsu> more likely we forgot some
<seb128> k
<larsu> I've gotten some more pings about this
<seb128> let's add them then
<larsu> or even made a mistake somewhere
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<seb128> well your call how you want to "fix" it
<seb128> I would go for whatever is easier
<seb128> e.g do the same hacks where it'smissing
<larsu> I'll have a look which other things are broken
<larsu> bug #1463390 might be related as wel
<ubot5> bug 1463390 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "GtkToolbar icons scale wrongly" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1463390
<Laney> thanks for looking!
<Laney> soooooooooo who knows about gnutls and cert validation?
<seb128> Laney, mdeslaur I be!t
<seb128> bet
<Laney> http://paste.debian.net/265791/ this is broken
<mdeslaur> Laney: looking, one sec
<mdeslaur> Laney: wfm, what release are you trying it on?
<Laney> wily
<Laney> it works in a trusty chroot for me
<mdeslaur> ok, one sec
<mdeslaur> Laney: weird, no idea...works fine with gnutls-cli, and downgrading gnutls, soup, glib-networking and glib to vivid versions doesn't fix it
<Laney> mdeslaur: I just started from vivid and upgraded ca-certificates only to wily... it broke
<Laney> but then downgrading it didn't fix it again
<mdeslaur> hrm, I tried downgrading ca-certificates and it didn't help....but I'll try upgrading ca-certificates in vivid, one sec
<Laney> I guess downgrading that is somewhat broken
<mdeslaur> oh, huh
<mdeslaur> yeah, that reproduced it in vivid
<mdeslaur> Laney: this is why:
<mdeslaur> The following certificate authorities were removed (-):
<mdeslaur>     - "GTE CyberTrust Global Root"
<Laney> yeah I'm just looking at the /etc/ca-certificates.conf diff
<Laney> ...is this a good change?
<mdeslaur> let me look at the latest nss database to see if it got reverted by mozilla
<Laney> FB works properly in Firefox for me
<Laney> I noticed because it got broken in webkit
<Laney> e.g. try epiphany
<mdeslaur> Laney: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=787705
<ubot5> Debian bug 787705 in ca-certificates "ca-certificates: Missing GTE_CyberTrust_Global_Root.crt" [Important,Open]
<mdeslaur> Laney: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=750457
<ubot5> Gnome bug 750457 in network "Improperly-rejected TLS certificate chains on facebook.com" [Major,New]
<Laney> ah, nice find!
<Laney> mdeslaur: fedora's added some certs back - do you think we could do the same? https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/CA-Certificates#Reason_for_Modifications
<mdeslaur> Laney: I think that would be reasonable, until there's a fix for glib-networking
<mdeslaur> Laney: could you please file a bug against ca-certificates, and assign it to me? I'll take a look later on this week
<Laney> 'kay, thanks
<anpok> Laney: can you have a look at the ci log here: https://ci-train.ubuntu.com/job/ubuntu-landing-004-1-build/233/console
<anpok> this is the refresh-mir MP in the mir-0.14.0 silo
<Laney> erm
<Laney> what is this?
<Laney> We don't upload gtk like that - the train has mangled the upstream version
<Laney> and there is some problem with connecting to gnome.org but it would have broken anyway
<anpok> Laney: so I have to provide a source package to the ppa to land it together with mir?
<Laney> anpok: right, do it as a source package
<Laney> do you want me to upload it?
<anpok> that would be awesome
<Laney> which silo?
<anpok> https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-004
<Laney> one minute
<Laney> anpok: I should make the build-dep be used everywhere, yes?
<anpok> hm?
<Laney> -               libmirclient-dev (>= 0.11.0) [amd64 arm64 armhf i386],
<Laney> +               libmirclient-dev (>= 0.13.3),
<anpok> yes
<anpok> not sure whether 0.13.3 already lifted the architecture restriction
<Laney> it's uploaded
<Laney> you probably need to reconfigure the silo
<anpok> Laney: how can I get that package for wily also in vivid on the ppa?
<Laney> vivid has gtk 3.14
<anpok> this would be for landing in the stable phone overlay.. hmm
<anpok> so we would have to backport the mir patches to 3.14 instead?
<Laney> probably, doesn't seem too smart to do a major version upgrade
<Laney> Maybe they would apply without too much trouble?
<anpok> hm there is mir-backend patch
<anpok> but the new one fails to apply cleanly on top of it
<mhall119> seb128: what's the most recent Unity 8 based desktop image available?
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-06-30
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<larsu> anyone know what /usr/lib/icon-naming-utils/icon-name-mapping is from?
<larsu> or even what it is supposed to do?
<larsu> wow. this is old.
<seb128> larsu, dpkg -S tell you "what ... is from"
<larsu> seb128: it wasn't installed
<larsu> icon-naming-utils
<seb128> it is now?
<seb128> k
<larsu> it is used in the rules file of humanity
<seb128> larsu, http://packages.ubuntu.com/ replies to that question
<larsu> but has no dep...
<seb128> larsu, http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?searchon=contents&keywords=icon-name-mapping&mode=exactfilename&suite=trusty&arch=any
<larsu> ah cool
<seb128> larsu, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-art-pkg/humanity/release/view/head:/debian/control
<seb128> larsu, it does build-depends on  icon-naming-utils
<seb128> ?
<larsu> seb128: s/control/rules. I should learn to speak debian more fluently :P
<seb128> ?
<larsu> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-art-pkg/humanity/release/view/head:/debian/rules
<seb128> right
<seb128> but depends/build-depends are in control
<seb128> not rules
<larsu> seb128: I always get those two files mixed up
<seb128> ah, I see
<larsu> seb128: icon-name-mapping is used in rules, but there's no dep on icon-naming-utils
<seb128> larsu, there is a buil-depends
<seb128> depends are runtime things
<seb128> buil-depends are build-time ones
<seb128> rules is package build = build-time = build-depends
<larsu> oh right, thanks seb128
<seb128> yw!
<larsu> I was looking in proper depends because I thought dh_install is called then
<larsu> but thinking about that, it doesn't make a lot of sense :)
 * larsu still thinks that call is not necessary
<seb128> larsu, we can drop it if not needed
<larsu> finding that out right now
<pitti> bonjour mes amis !
 * pitti waves to larsu and seb128
<seb128> hey pitti! Ã§a va bien ?
<larsu> ah bonjour pitti!
<pitti> seb128: oui, je vais bien, merci ! j'aime l'Ã©tÃ© !
<pitti> j'ai vu "Spamalot" Ã  Munich samedi, c'Ã©tait drÃ´le !
<seb128> ah, Ã§a me rappelle des souvenirs :-)
<pitti> seb128: oui, nous avons le vu Ã  LondrÃ¨s, il y a quelques ans
<seb128> voilÃ 
<pitti> avec tous l'Ã©qupipe de platform
<seb128> pitti, moi aussi j'aime l'Ã©tÃ© mais pas quand il est trop chaud, ils ont prÃ©vu > 30Â°C aujourd'hui, c'est trop pour travailler
<pitti> seb128: ah, il fait encore bien dans ma chambre
<seb128> ici aussi Ã§a va le matin, mais il fait trop chaud l'aprÃ¨s-midi
 * seb128 bets that larsu wishes that he had took french classes instead of spanish ones :p
 * larsu understands most of that
<pitti> seb128: I usually close the windows around 10 when it's getting warm, and put down the shades on the south side, that helps quite a lot
<seb128> yeah, trying to do the same ;-)
<seb128> pitti, btw do you take summer holidays?
<larsu> hm, humanity seems to be the only icon theme that has <context>/<size> directories instead of <size>/<context>
<pitti> seb128: oui, 3Ã¨me semaine de julliet; nous allons vÃ©lo Ã  la riviÃ©re "Lech"
<seb128> larsu, is that what is creating the issue? or are you trying to make it more standard now?
<pitti> seb128: nous encore avons des vacances en mars, alors nous pouvons prendre seulment une semaine cet Ã©tÃ©
<pitti> seb128: "avons eu" (non?)
<seb128> pitti, "avons eu" oui
<larsu> une semaine n'est pas enough!
<seb128> pitti, amusez vous bien quand mÃªme pendant cette semaine :-)
<pitti> larsu: mais oui, Ã§a suffit pour moi
<larsu> seb128: it's not causing the issue, no. It just makes it harder to rearrange stuff
<larsu> maybe I should just continue hacking index.theme
<larsu> *sigh*
<seb128> yeah, we don't have major issues, if another hack is enough to get us going let's do that
<larsu> seb128: I'm afraid it pop up again some time ... but then, changing a lot of stuff might also break things
<seb128> yeah, let's see next time it bites us
<seb128> we might have the convergence/new theme by then
<larsu> hah
<seb128> we didn't have issues with humanity for years
<seb128> until GTK decided to do non backward compatible changes, which hopefully doesn't happen every cycle...
<larsu> there's a spec for a reason - gtk is simply following it now
<seb128> I object, it's still breaking backward compat but let's agree to disagree on that
<larsu> it is, I agree, and it's frustrating
<seb128> every backward incompatible change is removing credibility to the platform
<seb128> the appdevs hate having their apps start to bug when they didn't change anything
<larsu> humanity isn't the only icon theme out there, though
<larsu> probably this change was made for some other theme that did things according to spec
<Laney> yoooooooo
<larsu> yo Laney
<larsu> sup?
<Laney> it is hot!
 * Laney has been out watering the plants
<Laney> how's it going?
<larsu> sitting in a cafe enjoying the sun
<seb128> hey Laney
<larsu> and not enjoying reading icon theme spec
<Laney> hrhr
<larsu> what's the reason for having a separate package for humanity icons but not for mono/mobile/suru?
<seb128> larsu, license/copyright owners
<seb128> humanity is a community theme
<seb128> the other ones are Canonical work
<larsu> interesting
<larsu> thanks
<seb128> yw
<Sweet5hark1> sweetmorn everyone!
<pitti> hey Sweet5hark1, wie gehts?
<larsu> hi Sweet5hark1
 * Sweet5hark1 has #achievementunlocked: finally seemed to have untrained myself from typing apt-get instead of just plain apt ...
<Sweet5hark1> pitti, larsu: heya, finally great weather here in the north too ;)
<Laney> apt build-dep # nooooo!
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark1
<Sweet5hark1> Laney: hrhr
 * Laney eyes udev postinst
<Laney> oh, there
<Laney> it took ~60s (both in lxc and on bare metal)
<Laney> ah, "systemd-udevd.service: Watchdog timeout (limit 1min)!"
<darkxst> hey seb128 Laney, any thoughts on what to do with the schemas that moved from g-s-d into gsettings-desktop-schemas? reverting them will break the migration code for GNOME. port u-s-d to use the new ones?  Not entirely sure its an exactly 1:1 mapping though
<darkxst> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/1468943/comments/1
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1468943 in gnome-settings-daemon (Ubuntu) "Update to 3.16" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<seb128> not really sorry
<larsu> bah. gsettings schemas are API :/
<darkxst> larsu, mutter uses them directly for wayland/libinput I think
<Laney> darkxst: can we cherry-pick the new stuff into usd/ucc?
<larsu> darkxst: my point was that settings keys shouldn't be moved in minor releases
<darkxst> larsu, this is 3.14->3.16
<darkxst> g-s-d has not been updated yet
<larsu> which is a minor release....
<darkxst> Laney, probably not directly, the new stuff is accomadation the changes in mutter, that now handles input settings
<Laney> then you could move them to a com.ubuntu name and do a migration in usd
<Laney> if you want
<darkxst> larsu, keys get added every cycles
<seb128> having key addes is fine
<seb128> having them removed/moved/renamed is not
<larsu> ya...
<darkxst> they were only added in gsettings
<darkxst> and if it wasnt for the migration code, code just revert them back as usual in g-s-d
<mdeslaur> Laney: why did you mark the ca-certificates bug as invalid?
<Laney> mdeslaur: I filed it twice due to a timeout, that's not the one you were assigned to
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ca-certificates/+bug/1469803
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1469803 in ca-certificates (Ubuntu) "Connecting to some sites via glib-networking is broken due to removed certificates" [Undecided,New]
<mdeslaur> oh! I see
<mdeslaur> thanks
<Laney> np!
 * seb128 indicates bug #1453549 to Laney
<ubot5> bug 1453549 in shotwell (Ubuntu) "Cannot publish to Facebook" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1453549
<Laney> ya
<Laney> are you referring to my comment on the wk2 bug?
<seb128> yes
<Laney> okey dokey
<seb128> yorba needs to update their facebook key/settings
<seb128> but they seem to be mia on shotwell
<seb128> like that topic got emails on the upstream list and several active bzg bugs
<seb128> but nobody is responding
<Laney> annoying
<seb128> indeed
<Laney> if there is a fix in their thing on facebook there's not a lot we can do
<seb128> right
<Laney> lemme make a note to check on it in a couple of weeks
<Laney> can maybe pull some strings to get someone active on it
<seb128> I'm checking weekly, but if you have people you can ping please do that ;-)
<Laney> not really, probably larsu does more
<Laney> right I'm doing a lunchtime sun ride to the cafe then going to find a park/library to work in
<Laney> biab!
<seb128> Laney, enjoy!
<larsu> tedg: was just asked about libappindicator reviews. Who's maintaining that these days?
 * larsu hopes it's not larsu 
<mitya57> tedg: I would like to get reviews on two libappindicator MPs by albertsmuktupavels
<mitya57> While I have rights to merge/upload it myself, it would be nice to get it reviewed by someone else
<mitya57> tedg: corrected: two by albertsmuktupavels and one by /me :)
<Laney> ah!
 * Laney has found a shady place
<tedg> mitya57, Let me look
<Laney> spiky tree is spiky
<Laney> stupid nature
<larsu> Laney: this is why we make chairs out of them before sitting on them :P
<qengho> Laney: In my co-working group, in the park a few weeks ago, Nature waited until we were complacent and busy and then deployed the swarm of caterpillars. It was super effective. Beware.
<Laney> I am using my powers of reasoning to fashion a pillow out of a jumper
<Laney> Ah crap. Blowtorch?
<qengho> Retreat and showers.
<anpok_> Laney: i made a new patch that incorporates most of the gtk+3.16 changes
<anpok_> but not the ones related to a gl context..
<anpok_> do you know a good way to test that package on a wily system?
<Laney> hi anpok_
<anpok_> hi
<Laney> patch for what?
<Laney> gtk 3.14?
<anpok_> gtk+3.14
<anpok_> yes
<Laney> just install it and downgrade your gtk, taking out any apps that require the new one
<larsu> "just"
<Laney> mir hackers are hardcore folk
<Laney> or fix mir to work in VMs :) :) :)
 * Laney runs
<seb128> Laney, it does work in vm
 * seb128 has unity8 session working on ubuntu personal with virt-manager
<Laney> then try it in a vm?
<seb128> http://unity.ubuntu.com/mir/setup_kvm_for_mir.html
<seb128> trying what?
<seb128> I lack context
<Laney> I don't know  why you would ask about running it on wily otherwise
<Laney> mir backend update for 3.14
<seb128> did we mix versions there?
<seb128> anpok_, did you mean trunk to 3.16?
<Laney> that is already done
<Laney> it i s for the overlay ppa
<seb128> why not for distro?
<Laney> are they SRUing the new mir?
<seb128> ok, I'm confused
<seb128> if we speak trunk to 3.16 it's not SRU but wily?
<Laney> API break in overlay ppa
<Laney> ->  need to update gtk
<seb128> ah ok
<Laney> same for wily but that is done already and for a different gtk series
<seb128> that's the context I was missing ;-)
<seb128> k
<Laney> anpok_: why not use a VM?
<seb128> I'm still interested to see a gtk-mir backend update in wily
<seb128> Laney, vm for what?
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-004/+packages
<Laney> your dreams have come true
<Laney> for testing the overlay ppa update...
<seb128> Laney, vivid-overlay is the base for our current devices and the pocket pc work
<seb128> so I guess we need to update gtk with mir there
<seb128> or the gtk-mir backend
<Laney> I know...
<Laney> I'm saying why not use a VM to check it works
<Laney> instead of downgrading a wily system
<seb128> ah, I see
<seb128> Laney, thanks for the gtk update in that ppa ;-)
<Laney> attente did it really
<Laney> but thanks for the thanks :P
<seb128> :-)
 * Laney  screams at deleting double  spaces all the time
<seb128> is that issue specific to your xps? could be an hardware issue?
<seb128> I didn't see others complain about that
<Laney> it's bios
<seb128> but maybe not many people got the newest revision
<anpok_> Laney: sure .. vm it will be..
<Laney> check the thread i linked to in that mail
<Laney> http://en.community.dell.com/support-forums/laptop/f/3518/t/19626873?pi239031352=4
 * Laney has emailed superm1,  waiting  to hear back again
<Laney> I prepared my meeting notes a whole hour early by mistake!
<seb128> Laney, it's the sun getting to you!
<Laney> hehe
<seb128> Trevinho, hey, you typoed a "t" at the start of the modline on https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity-settings-daemon/automount-monitor-lockscreen/+merge/259514 , can you fix?
<Trevinho> ouch, sure
<seb128> thanks
<Trevinho> seb128: done, overwritten though
<seb128> Trevinho, that's ok, thanks
<larsu> *cough* *cough*
<seb128> oh it's meeting time
<Laney> ohhhh
<seb128> attente, desrt(?), dgadomski, FJKong, happyaron, Laney, larsu, qengho, Sweet5hark, tkamppeter, hey
<seb128> #startmeeting
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jun 30 15:31:36 2015 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
<dgadomski> o/
<seb128> ok, let's get started
<seb128> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: attente
<seb128> attente, hey
<attente> hi
<qengho> YAY
<attente> revisions to apparmor kernel patch for dconf again, waiting for review
<attente> merge the gtk-mir wip branch into upstream master and backport those patches to the ubuntu gtk package
<attente> debugging a weird issue where the backend is sending mouse release events immediately after mouse press events, only affects our package
<attente> (eof)
<seb128> thanks for updating our gtk versions/backporting the fixes from trunk!
<attente> np! but this mouse event bug is pretty bad...
<seb128> yeah, I guess it's next to debug?
<attente> yeah. it's basically making it impossible to click anything other than the menus
<seb128> right
<seb128> attente, thanks
<seb128> I guess no desrt (I think he said he was off monday/tuesday)
<seb128> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: dgadomski
<seb128> dgadomski, hey
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> There were no desktop issues reported to me lately, so this week I was busy with non-desktop stuff.
<dgadomski> That's it, thanks.
<seb128> dgadomski, thanks
<seb128> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: FJKong
<Laney> we fixed all the bugs \m/
<seb128> FJKong, hey
<FJKong> hi
<FJKong> 1 continue working on fixing lacking status bar image
<FJKong> 2 add input tip to sogou Shuang Pin Im
<FJKong> 3 get feek back from community: sometimes input window shows abnormal
<FJKong> 4 one day holiday
<FJKong> eof
<seb128> FJKong, thanks
<seb128> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: happyaron
<seb128> happyaron, hey
<seb128> no happyaron?
<seb128> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Laney
<seb128> Laney, hey
<Laney> hi
<Laney> â¢ Worked  more on e-d-s and gstreamer transitions, these are both (still?) blocked on Canonical people helping me out :)
<Laney> â https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qtorganizer5-eds/+bug/1469208
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1469208 in qtorganizer5-eds (Ubuntu) "Recurrence test fails with e-d-s 3.16" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> â email with jhodapp about updating gst-bad, says he will get it scheduled
<Laney> â¢ Start looking at webkitgtk2 transition for main
<Laney> â Ported shotwell
<Laney> â Ported apturl (simple)
<Laney> â Look at evolution (argh)
<Laney> â Some other apps have WIP ports upstream
<Laney> â¢ Update glib2.0 (in progress, gio/tests/appmonitor fails, desrtttttt)
<Laney> â¢ Check/upload gtk3.16 mir backend refresh
<Laney> â¢ Work with seb128 to get poppler/wps/proj migrated & do some final updates
<Laney> â¢ Fix chromium autopkgtest & sikuli to get this migrated and unblock glib -> gtk which were waiting on it
<Laney> â
<Laney> actually I take it all back
<Laney> 4e7d22e268a4e06beb1c09585a48288c31004da5 is the first bad commit
<Laney> commit 4e7d22e268a4e06beb1c09585a48288c31004da5
<Laney> Author: Matthias Clasen <mclasen@redhat.com>
<qengho> Thanks laney!
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<qengho> That sikuli thing is bothering me. There has to be a way to detect the require jar files at package time, instead of keeping them in a script.
<seb128> unsure what the commits are about
<qengho> It will break again.
<Laney> the one that broke glib's test
<seb128> oh, the failed appmonitor test
<seb128> k
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> #topic larsu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: larsu
<larsu> ey that's me
<seb128> larsu, hey
<larsu> had a very short week due to two days off
<larsu> worked on those 1000 little theming and icon bugs that people pinged me with in the last couple of weeks
<larsu> expect big MRs this week (maybe I should separate them a bit?)
<seb128> yeah, regular landing of small bits seems better than batching a big stack
<larsu> lots of very small bits though
<larsu> but I agree
<larsu> will do that
<larsu> otherwise the usual: Bugs.
<larsu> </larsu>
<seb128> larsu, thanks
<seb128> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: qengho
<seb128> qengho, hey
<qengho> * Commercial PES/OEM support.
<qengho> * Getting chromium-browser widevine plugin supported if installed manually or Google Chrome installed.
<qengho> * Reviewed NaCl patches for contributor. Might get that working, and packaged before 15.10!
<qengho> * Un-blacklisting all GPU in chromium, but setting the preference to default to Off. Might need to get apport pattern if errors.u.c spikes again.
<qengho> * chromium-browser release tomorrow, with ^fixes.
<qengho> EOF
<seb128> qengho, at the meeting a week ago you said "I'll ask you to sponsor today." about the new version, what happened to that?
<qengho> Laney fixed the test problem, and commercial folks wanted widevine support included.
<seb128> he did fixed it some days after since you didn't give news about your upload and didn't respond to ping
<seb128> oh, well
<seb128> qengho, thanks
<seb128> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: seb128
<seb128> ok, my turn ;-)
<seb128> â¢ snappy fun still ongoing
<seb128> â debugging unity8/mir not starting, after 2 days trying to figure out what's going between lightdm/usc/unity8 (and trying to get help from people knowing those component better) figured out that usc is waiting on vt8 and that lightdm doesn't do the switch, when doing it manually unity8 starts!
<seb128> â noticed then that unity8 regressed in wily and that the desktop session shows the phone greeter now, tracked down the issue to a recent landing and reported bug/pinged unity team
<seb128> â updated livecd-rootfs to write a /e/d/locales config on desktop-next
<seb128> â¢ reviewed some u-s-s and u-s-d merge requests
<seb128> â¢ some NEW reviews & archive admin commands for Laney
<seb128> </week>
<seb128> mostly still trying to get snappy personal working, but getting there
<seb128> #topic Sweet5hark1
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Sweet5hark1
<Laney> my favourite script runner
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, hey
<Sweet5hark1> - bumped prereleases ppa from 5.0~rc1 to ~rc2
<Sweet5hark1> - merged from Debian (ongoing)
<Sweet5hark1> - discussed/provided support for LibreOfficeKit on Ubuntu touch
<Sweet5hark1> - some upstream refactoring/test adding (finally blogged on that: https://skyfromme.wordpress.com/2015/06/26/i-would-kill-500-lines-and-i-would-kill-500-more/ )
<Sweet5hark1> - bumped LibreOffice fresh ppa to 4.4.4 (rc2 and rc3, which is final)
<Sweet5hark1> - some LTS patch backporting
<Sweet5hark1> - some GSOC mentoring
<Sweet5hark1> - usual foundation and ESC tasks: some conf orga, major release prep, grants and budgeting
<Sweet5hark1> - most importantly: made the LibreOffice build system default to colored output on an interactive shell *cough*
<Sweet5hark1> EOF
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, thanks
<seb128> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: tkamppeter
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<tkamppeter> - Made ippusbxd (IPP-over-USB daemon) getting started and keep running in systemd environment.
<tkamppeter> - Worked on finding out how to reliably stop ippusbxd when the printer is turned off or disconnected.
<tkamppeter> - Added functionality to try always to use the same port for ippusbxd and change only if the desired port is already taken by something else.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<seb128> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: robert_ancell
<seb128> - Updated version tracker to current wily package versions.
<seb128> - Made a GNOME version page (http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/gnome.html). This makes it easier to see a similar / simpler set of packages to update (the other lists have too many packages).
<seb128> - Open bugs for all GNOME packages we have yet to update to 3.16 (particularly so we can note why we haven't updated them in the case of difficult transitions)
<seb128> - Updated various wily packages to latest stable versions.
<pitti> tkamppeter: stop stuff when printer is turned off> udev rules?
<seb128> #topic other topics
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: other topics
<seb128> did I forget anyone? do we have other topics?
<Laney> help welcome on wk2 ;-)
<Laney> not sure we will get there this cycle
<seb128> is debian doing that transition as well?
<seb128> do we have any insensitive to go ahead with that now?
<Laney> not actively
<Laney> the old version doesn't get updates any more
<seb128> I would rather postpone the work if it's not really needed
<Laney> not even the webkit level of security support
<Laney> staying on an ancient version forever doesn't seem great
<seb128> yeah, I'm not saying forever, but we could let others do the heavy lifting by postponing by one cycle
<seb128> well, if we have the spare resources to do it and people want to work on it I'm not against it either
<Laney> ya I was doing stuff which nobody started on
<seb128> k
<seb128> if anybody feels like helping on that please do ;-)
<Laney> and I think I will not do evolution, that looks hadrd
<seb128> anything else?
<Laney> -> probably not make 15.10
<seb128> it means transition in a lts cycle though :-/
<Laney> ya
<seb128> k, I guess we can wrap the meeting
<seb128> thanks everyone
<Laney> thanks!
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316"
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jun 30 15:58:11 2015 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2015/ubuntu-desktop.2015-06-30-15.31.moin.txt
<attente> thanks
 * Laney fixed the test
<seb128> does anyone know how to upload a refresh from lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu-touch.wily to the archive?
<seb128> I'm having issues building that and need to go for some erands before shop closed
<seb128> if somebody can do that for me while I'm away I might be able to retry a desktop-next build when I'm back
<seb128> otherwise no worry, it's going to be for tomorrow
 * seb128 bbiab
<Laney> seb128: what's the issue?
<seb128> Laney, I think me not knowing how those stuff works anymore :p
<Laney> get ubuntu-touch-meta, run ./update, build pkg & upload
<Laney> this wifi tethering is destroying my battery
<seb128> ah ok, I tried to get the package from the archive and apply the diff I commited
 * Laney should have  brought a  cable
 * ogra_ pokes Laney 
<seb128> ok, well maybe I've a look later but need to go now
<seb128> maybe ogra_ can sponsor it for me, that's the drop from cloud-init :p
<Laney> can look anyway, let me file this testfix first
<ogra_> "read the changelog and verify the changes very carefully before dput"
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> bbiab
<Laney> ogra_: HAHA you and your old ways
<ogra_> lol
<Laney> if no bug report -> upload was fine
<ogra_> yeah, phone kind of weaned me from cowboy style :P
<hallyn> unity on my wily system sudenly gives me a blank screen.  known problem?
<seb128> back
<seb128> hallyn, no
<seb128> hallyn, anything interesting in the logs? does a guest session works?
<seb128> Laney, thanks for the upload!
<seb128> (crazy country where most shops close at 6pm and where you can get vegetable&co only until 7pm)
<hallyn> seb128: which logs?
<seb128> hallyn, .xsession-errors ~/.cache/upstart/gnome-session*|unity*
<ogra_> seb128, and you cant even phone the shop from your car anymore so they stay open longer for you now ...
<seb128> ogra_, :-)
<hallyn> seb128: http://people.canonical.com/~serge/gnome-session-Unity.log.1.gz , though it seems old.  also http://paste.ubuntu.com/11800186/
<seb128> hallyn, 1.gz has wrong permission and is a rotated log, can you delete ~/.xsession-errors and .cache/upstart and try to log in and see what logs you get?
<hallyn> seb128: http://people.canonical.com/~serge/unitylogs.tgz
<seb128> hallyn, looks like unity plugin is not in your compiz config
<seb128> hallyn, try to "dconf reset -f /org/compiz"
 * hallyn tries
<hallyn> nope, same thing :(
<hallyn> seb128: i should point out that whil i was using unity for the last two weeks until this morning, 'unity' seemed to have gotten uninstalled in my latest apt-get update
<hallyn> i had to apt-get install it.  is there something else i should perhaps be installing?
<hallyn> i don't see a 'unity-panel' command
<hallyn> maybei should just take the chance to install unity8
<hallyn> or will that mess up
<hallyn> my x+lightdm s that i can no longer run other window managers if/when unity has a problem?
<EphraimMB> Can you please show me a screenshot of what unity 8 looks like right now?
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-07-01
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<larsu> morning!
<larsu> I have the feeling it is going to be hot here today
<anpok_> Laney: i have an updated mir patch for gtk+-3.14 .. seem to work fine .. should I create an MP? and if so against which branch?
<pitti> bonjour seb128 !
<seb128> hey pitti
<pitti> hallo larsu, guten Morgen!
<seb128> wie gehts?
<pitti> seb128: prima, danke!
<pitti> we are getting a new stove and oven right now :)
<larsu> bonjour pitti!
<larsu> oooh fancy
<seb128> who need that when you can cook outside by letting stuff in the sun for an hour :p
<pitti> our old oven broke down, so we bought a new one; and while we were at it, a new induction stove
<seb128> nice
<pitti> seb128: haha
<seb128> 33Â°C forecasted today here, that's too much
<pitti> I saw/used an induction stove at a friend's a while ago, it's quite a bit faster
<seb128> still better than Paris
<seb128> 39Â°C there
<seb128> yeah, we use induction here
<seb128> it's great
<pitti> seb128: but good reminder, /me closes the shutters
<seb128> don't use it at max power though
<seb128> easy to burn things otherwise
<seb128> also if the bottom of the pan is not thick enough it can be damaged
<pitti> yeah, we'll need some time to get used to it
<larsu> burnt food for the next couple of weeks at pitti's house :P
<pitti> we bought new jars last Saturday already (the pans and the pressure cooker fortunately already work)
<seb128> jars?
<seb128> aren't those for storing already cooked things?
<pitti> seb128: err, "pots", I figure
<happyaron> seb128: sorry was at some medical emergency, will make yesterday on holidayu
<seb128> happyaron, hey, no worry ... I hope you are fine?
<seb128> pitti, ah, I see :-)
<happyaron> seb128: it's not me, a friend of mine
<seb128> oh ok
<happyaron> but he lives very near to me, so I went to help
<happyaron> ty
<seb128> yw!
<willcooke> let's try this again...
<willcooke> Morning all!
<larsu> morning willcooke! How's life?
<willcooke> hey larsu - pretty good thanks!  Tired, the usual....
<willcooke> ;)
<Laney> yo!
<willcooke> morning Laney
<seb128> hey willcooke, wb!
<larsu> bonjour Laney
<Laney> oh willcooke is here
 * Laney looks busy
<Laney> hey larsu!
<Laney> anpok_: we don't have an RTM branch, just push it somewhere and give me the address please
<Laney> I will update Vcs-Bzr to lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gtk/ubuntugtk3vivid-overlay or something and push there
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<anpok_> Laney: ok
<Laney> s/RTM/overlay/
<Laney> hey seb128, doing good thanks!
<Laney> spent some time in the pub garden last night
<Laney> make the most of it
<Laney> also I ripped my trousers in the middle of climbing /o\
<seb128> :-/
<Laney> was stretching
<Laney> then this rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrip sound
<Laney> hope nobody noticed
<seb128> haha
<Laney> how are you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<seb128> getting really what shapes to be a warm day
<seb128> do you say warm or hot, or does any work?
<Laney> hot is hotter than warm
<Laney> but it is fine in this context
<seb128> k, so getting ready for an hot day ;-)
<anpok_> Laney: https://code.launchpad.net/~andreas-pokorny/gtk/gtk-3-14-13-mir-0-14-0
<Laney> ty
<seb128> larsu, Laney, if you extract a file from an archive using file-rolling, the summary dialog has buttons with "cut borders", like it has an outline on some sides only ... any idea if that's a gtk/file-roller/theme issue?
<seb128> or where to file it
<larsu> seb128: probably theme. Let me chewck
<larsu> how do you even get the "summary dialog"?
<seb128> larsu, open a .tar.gz, select a file in it, click extract
<seb128> extract it somewhere
<larsu> tht doesn't show me a dialog at all
<larsu> ah wait, it does
 * larsu was dragging-and-dropping
<larsu> ya, theme issue
 * larsu puts it on the list
<seb128> want a bug report?
<larsu> every app uses the "linked" class differently :/
<larsu> seb128: yes please
<larsu> and in fact, we don't even want "linked" there on unity
<seb128> larsu, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-themes/+bug/1470434
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1470434 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "wrong buttons borders in file-rollect extract dialog" [Undecided,New]
<larsu> thanks!
<seb128> yw!
<Laney> larsu: want to review https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=751737 ? :)
<ubot5> Gnome bug 751737 in gio "gio/tests/appmonitor test fails in 2.45.3" [Normal,New]
<Laney> mcl<tab>. is offline
<larsu> Laney: sure (I think mcl<tab> is at the west coast hackfest)
<Laney> ah, that is now?
<Laney> https://wiki.gnome.org/Hackfests/WestCoastSummit2015 indeed
<larsu> yes: https://blogs.gnome.org/mclasen/2015/06/30/westcoast-summit-2015/
<larsu> hm, that patch does more than move the delete_app() call
<Laney> ya
<Laney> his original commit was kind of weird/incomplete
<larsu> ah I see. That function is not even used as a source anymore...
<larsu> Laney: why the check for g_main_loop_is_running()? Did not having it cause problems?
<larsu> ah, maybe I should read the bug report, not the commit message :D
<Laney> not sure if that is strictly necessary tbh
<larsu> I don't think it is, but it also doesn't harm
<larsu> Laney: makes sense to me. Testing it now
<larsu> do you have push rights?
<Laney> nope
<larsu> ok will push it right away then (if it works ;) )
<larsu> do you need it only on master?
<Laney> ya, this is just broken with 2.45.3
<larsu> done
<larsu> thanks!
<Laney> thank you!
<Laney> what's this document portal stuff?
<larsu> err, what?
<larsu> (clearly I wouldn't know)
<Laney> was just reading hackfest reports
<Laney> https://wiki.gnome.org/Projects/SandboxedApps/DocumentPortal
<Laney> they are making evince use it
<larsu> oh neat
<seb128> seems like the equivalent of our trusted helpers?
<seb128> content-hub like
<Laney> what's going to provide the service in gnome?
<Laney> is unity(7) and/or content-hub going to have to implement it?
<seb128> it's only if you want to use sandboxing right?
<seb128> or asked differently, is that codepath optional in evince or mandatory?
<seb128> I guess it's going to be optional at least for a while
<seb128> unity7 is not likely to ever be a confined environment
<seb128> under unity8 it's going to be "more fun"
<Laney> yeah they clearly can't require sandboxing right away
<Laney> but you might say that the shell or something has to implement this API anyway
 * Laney knows nothing
<larsu> if only freedesktop was still what it used to be
<larsu> and canonical gave a shit about it...
<seb128> yeah, but it's not :-/
<seb128> I'm curious if any other desktop/project is going to implement a document portal, out of GNOME
<larsu> probably elementary - they're at the hackfest as well
<larsu> would be bad if they used fdo namespace with *no* other env
<seb128> they tend to do it...
<seb128> not because they want, just because often there is no traction from other desktops on the specs/topics
<larsu> really? For the notification stuff, we used org.gtk
<larsu> (for that reason...)
<larsu> ah, yeah that might be
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> I don't really consider elementary as a "mainstream" desktop/OS
<seb128> but it's true they are around ;-)
<larsu> endless is as well
<larsu> and they definitely want confined apps asap
<seb128> who/what is endless?
<seb128> oh, the ones who did the kickstarter for that living room computer?
<larsu> yes
<larsu> they use the full gnome stack as well
<Laney> anpok_: what did you base this branch on?
<Laney> anpok_: I can't merge it into lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gtk/ubuntugtk3vivid
<seb128> ogra_, do you know how/where is the initrd from snappy core built/what it includes?
<ogra_> seb128, i think it simply runs update-initramfs during live build
<anpok_> Laney: uh .. an arbitrry 3.14 branch .. i did not see ubuntugtk3vivid
<anpok_> argh.. that would have been closer..
<Laney> apt-cache showsrc gtk+3.0 | grep Vcs- # for future reference :)
<Laney> (on the right release)
<seb128> ogra_, thanks, I'm trying to figure out why booting by disk LABEL doesn't work on desktop-next
<seb128> I was wondering if it could be some fs/ext support missing in the initramfs
<ogra_> seb128, do you have initramfs-tools-ubuntu-core in your image ?
<ogra_> that ships the script that does the mounting
<ogra_> if you can mount by uuid the fs support should be there
<ogra_> are the partitions actually having labels ?
<ogra_> (probably a u-d-f issue)
<seb128> ogra_, the partitions have the label according to blkid
<ogra_> k
<seb128> we do have initramfs-tools-ubuntu-core
<ogra_> yeah, i see it at http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-desktop-next/daily-preinstalled/current/wily-preinstalled-desktop-next-amd64.manifest
<ogra_> and if you manually point to the label on the grub cmdline it doesnt work ?
<seb128> ogra_, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/shot0001.png
<seb128> ogra_, how do I do that?
<seb128> ogra_, if I boot with "root=/dev/vda4" it works
<seb128> root=LABEL=system-b doesn't
<ogra_> no
<ogra_> that cant
<seb128> why not?
<seb128> system-b is the label for vda4
<ogra_> root=/dev/disk/by-label/system-a
<ogra_> thats what the arm installs use
<seb128> why?
<seb128> LABEL= is supported by grub
<ogra_> dunno, because it works ?
<seb128> well, LABEL should also work
<ogra_> might be an issue with the mount script ... try if that path works
<seb128> k
<seb128> ogra_, no, doesn't work
<Laney> anpok_: are you rebasing or should I try to do it?
<ogra_> wow
<ogra_> it definitely should
<ogra_> sounds like a udev issue then
<seb128> why udev?
<seb128> could also that whatever is needed kernel side to handle the labels is not loaded?
<ogra_> because udev creates these symlinks ...
<ogra_>  /dev/disk/by-label/system-a should always be available
<ogra_> and be a link to the actual partition
<ogra_> lets move over to #snappy
<seb128> ogra_, I need to go for lunch but let's do that once I'm back yeah
<ogra_> k
<seb128> mvo_, that ubuntu-snappy upload is not happy
<seb128> britney stops it because it makes ubuntu-desktop-next uninstallable
<anpok_> Laney: i am just resending
<anpok_> Laney: same branch now with sanity
<seb128> mvo_, it wants system-image-cli >= 3.0, but that conflicts with system-image-snappy-cli/common ... are those deprecated?
<mvo_> seb128: h, yeah, both are
<seb128> mvo_, can you update the touch seed? ;-)
<mvo_> seb128: sure, I thought it was pulled in via dependencies :/
<seb128> mvo_, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu-touch.wily/view/head:/desktop#L61
<seb128> mvo_, thanks
<seb128> mvo_, sorry I would do it, but my systems are in middle of debugging snappy grub/label boot issues and some other fun with systemd
<Laney> anpok_: thanks, will try in a second
<darkxst> gnome-online-accounts was ported to webkit2gtk, what are chances of getting that MIR'd?
<darkxst> g-o-a is already stuck in proposed after sync from debian
<darkxst> and we need the update for g-c-c 3.16
<Laney> darkxst: We can't have two webkits in main
<Laney> I started doing a little bit of work on this transition
<darkxst> I saw a huge list of deps still using webkit1
<Laney> well, actually, we can't have two on the image really
<Laney> maybe can have it in main for building purposes or something
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/webkitgtk/+bug/1469221
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1469221 in Shotwell "Move to webkit2gtk in main" [Medium,Confirmed]
<darkxst> g-o-a shouldnt be seed on the ubuntu images?
<Laney> I just checked main, not seed
<Laney> check if the bits of g-o-a which need wk2 can be demoted, then it only needs to be in main for building and you can ask the MIR team if that is okay
<darkxst> Laney, ok, will do
<desrt> moin
<willcooke> howdy desrt
<desrt> hey willcooke
<Laney> hey desrt
<Laney> settled in?
<desrt> not even close :)
<Laney> desk area unpackaged at least :)
<desrt> most of the _stuff_ is moved, but not all
<Laney> unpacked
<desrt> nope
<desrt> no furniture moved at all yet, in fact
<desrt> getting an elevator booking around here is like pulling teeth :)
<larsu> hi desrt!
<desrt> hey
<larsu> merging Laney's patches while you're away :)
<desrt> cool
<desrt> thanks :)
<desrt> somewhat ironically, today is going to be a slow day
<desrt> but it's a holiday :)
 * desrt is probably going to just try to relax, maybe do some shopping
<desrt> clean up a bit....
<Laney> wow
<Laney> there's a storm moving through
<Laney> super loud thunder
<willcooke> woo
<willcooke> hope it comes here
<willcooke> outside thermostat says it's 40
<willcooke> which I think must be lies
<willcooke> could do with a storm
<chrisccoulson> willcooke, you won't be able to do a hangout from the Ubuntu browser yet because it doesn't yet use the media device permissions API provided by Oxide
<chrisccoulson> I think that's being worked on. Other than that, it should work fine
<willcooke> sweet! thanks chrisccoulson
<mhall119> willcooke: welcome back
<mhall119> willcooke: what's the latest testable image for Unity 8 desktop?
<seb128> mhall119, we already covered that, either take a vivid one or take a wily desktop and install unity8-desktop-session-mir
<mhall119> seb128: where is the vivid one?
<mhall119> and is it deb, click, or snappy based?
<seb128> deb
<seb128> unsure if we stored a vivid one somewhere
<seb128> otherwise I guess "just take a wily desktop and install the mir session"
<Laney> we did, it's on cdimage.ubuntu.com under ubuntu-desktop-next somewhere
<seb128> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-desktop-next/backup-20150422/
<seb128> Laney, mhall119 ^
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> np
<mhall119> seb128: I'd like to have something I can boot from USB on another laptop
<mhall119> Laney: anything more recent than that?
<seb128> mhall119, no
<seb128> we switched the image for snappy personal
<mhall119> seb128: is there a schedule for having a live snappy personal image?
<seb128> "when it's ready"
<seb128> the debian way ;-)
<mhall119> I'd like to try it on my wife's touch-screen laptop, but I havne't convinced her to let me install Ubuntu on it yet, let along wily
<seb128> mhall119, you can use ud-f from wily and build an image, it's working if you do some manual tweaks, I'm aiming to have it to boot to a desktop without tweak by the end of the week
<mhall119> seb128: that would be awesome, guess I need to take the plunge and put wily on my laptop
<seb128> mhall119, what are you looking at doing?
<seb128> mhall119, unity8 didn't change much since vivid
<mhall119> seb128: I want to try it on a different laptop that has a touch screen
<mhall119> seb128: I also want to try making a snappy app for a desktop app
<seb128> mhall119, no need of wily if you want to try a snappy image...
<seb128> you can build one from vivid, just get goget-ubuntu-touch from wily or from the snappy ppa
<mhall119> oh, so I can build a wily-based snappy image from a vivid host?
<mhall119> where do I get the goget-ubuntu-touch command from?
<pitti> mhall119: that's a source package name, not a command; you probably want the ubuntu-device-flash binary package/command?
<mhall119> seb128: what PPA should I use for that?
<seb128> mhall119, I'm unsure the ppa is updated yet, check with sergiusen or get the deb from wily
<Laney> anpok_: it's built in the silo now
<Laney> is that everything?
<anpok_> Laney: thank you!
<seb128> mvo_, shrug, seems like ubuntu-snappy still doesn't migrate, or publisher takes a while...
 * seb128 is pondering reverting the livecd-rootfs clickpkg->snappypkg changes to be able to have an iso build to test
<Laney> skipped: ubuntu-snappy (6 <- 199) got: 51+0: a-51 * amd64: ubuntu-desktop-next
<seb128> Laney, right, that was what we discussed around 3 hours ago with mvo
<Laney> ah right
<seb128> ubuntu-desktop-next was depending on system-image-snappy-cli which is deprecated
<Laney> there's a fixed touch-meta though
<seb128> mvo changed the seed and updated ubuntu-desktop-next
<seb128> right
<Laney> which doesn't go in ...
<seb128> which doesn't migrate
<seb128> but I don't understand why
<Laney> well let's look at it!
<seb128> I can't read those britney output
<seb128> they don't make any sense to me
<mitya57> tedg, hi, you now got a reply to your review on https://code.launchpad.net/~albertsmuktupavels/libappindicator/create-as-service/+merge/263108
<mvo_> seb128: I think germinate needs to run so that system-image-snappy-cli vanishes from the ubuntu-core seed
<seb128> mvo_, is that something happening automagically or...
<seb128> Laney, ^
<mvo_> seb128: yes, will happen by itself
<seb128> mvo_, when?
<Laney> nein, germinate doesn't affect migration
<Laney> http://paste.ubuntu.com/11805416/
<Laney> that is what is needed
 * Laney adds it
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> it's really non obvious to figure out those things
<seb128> Laney, how do you determine that was what is needed?
<seb128> can you tell from the log? or did you do manual poking?
<Laney> seb128: the log was telling us that they both couldn't go in by themselves
<Laney> but if you tried to install them manually at the same time it was fine
<seb128> right, without telling why
<Laney> so 'easy' is the way to say 'try putting these things in as a transaction'
<seb128> I wish the tools was clever enough to try to resolve such loops by itself
<Laney> it does have an autohinter that usually resolves transitions
<Laney> but it's a hard problem in general
<seb128> yeah, I imagine
<seb128> so we need to wait next publisher to see if your hint is enough?
<Laney> next proposed-migration run
<Laney> which is happening now
<seb128> k
<seb128> let's see :-)
<seb128> Laney, danke
<mitya57> thanks tedg!
<Laney> Copying: ubuntu-snappy/1.3ubuntu1
<Laney> Copying: ubuntu-touch-meta/1.232
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> no problemo
 * Laney is enjoying having the fan on
<seb128> hum
<seb128> "Ubuntu Desktop (Unity 8) amd64 (re-building)"
<seb128> Laney, did you trigger a rebuild?
<Laney> no
<seb128> I wonder if that's a wrong status/due to the build fail from yesterday
 * seb128 tries a new rebuild
 * willcooke -> EOD
<willcooke> I might go and sit in the kids paddling pool
<willcooke> o/
<seb128> bah, it seems to not work
<seb128> retrying on i386 works
<seb128> I guess the amd64 build is stuck on the "rebuild" status due to the previous built that failed
<seb128> Laney, can you retry the amd64 from the command line?
<Laney> shouldn't get stuck, check with stgraber why it did?
<seb128> alright
<Laney> better to fix it, but after that I can retry sure
<Laney> ;-)
<Laney> ah there's a "cancel" thing too
<Laney> for the stuck re-build state
<seb128> let's see if stgraber replies before trying that
<seb128> in case the stuck state is useful for debug
<Laney> indeed
<Laney> something weird is going on here
<Laney> in the last 10 minutes wasps keep coming in and then leaving again
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/210446892/buildlog_ubuntu_wily_i386_ubuntu-desktop-next_BUILDING.txt.gz
<seb128> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<seb128>  system-image-snappy-cli : Conflicts: system-image-cli but 3.0.1-0ubuntu1 is to be installed
<seb128> why does it still try to install snappy-cli?
<ogra_> because something else still depends on it
<seb128> hum, I wonder if that's settings
<ogra_> rdepends only shows ubuntu-snappy though
<seb128> shrug, I don't get it :-/
<Laney> this might be where you need to wait for germinate
<seb128> when it germanite kicking in?
<seb128> germinate
<ogra_> when the publisher runs
<Laney> laney@snakefruit:~$ /srv/ubuntu-archive/bin/chdist apt-cache wily-proposed-amd64 show system-image-cli | grep Task
<Laney> Task: ubuntu-desktop-next, ubuntu-touch
<seb128> k, but we had a publisher since the promotion now...
<seb128> well, let's see tomorrow morning if things are sorted out
<Laney> it might be two cycles if it runs on the starting input or in parallel or something
<seb128> k
<ogra_> hmpf ...
<ogra_> 21572 ogra      20   0 9865100 5,912g  71088 S  13,3 38,2 814:32.15 evolution
<ogra_> 10513 ogra      20   0 4235248 2,550g  64936 S  11,0 16,5 766:57.26 firefox
<ogra_> long running processes ... :P
 * ogra_ didnt actually know top knows "g" for RES
 * Laney is off to assemble a fancy dress costume
 * Laney pats ogra_ 
<Laney> bye!
<ogra_> heh, bye
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-07-02
<hallyn> oh!  so i installed unity8 just to see what it would do - it started fine and i had a panel onthe side with 3 icons, but it wouldn't start any applications, and notification bar didn't respond to anything
<hallyn> (meanwhile, unity7 still won't start anything for me either)
<RAOF> hallyn: Would you like me to say âHm, that's oddâ?
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> Because that is a service that I can provide.
 * RAOF doesn't routinely run unity8 because it bails on multi-head and doesn't like dvorak.
<hallyn> RAOF: if you wouldn't mind, that'd be great, thx :)
<RAOF> Hm, that's odd.
<RAOF> Got any logs? :)
<RAOF> ~/.cache/upstart would contain your winners, obviously.
<hallyn> http://paste.ubuntu.com/11808246/ and http://paste.ubuntu.com/11808247/ are unity8-dash.log.1 and unity8.log.1
<lifeless> RAOF: you have multiple heads?
<RAOF> lifeless: Yeah.
<RAOF> Tasmanian :P
<lifeless> funny, you looked normal last time I saw you :)
<RAOF> Well, whatever had pid 2297 is a bit unhappy.
<RAOF> (It's having its connection denied)
<RAOF> And then unity-system-compositor dies at 1435721937.135599, but U8 apparently doesn't notice?
<hallyn> would be nice if /proc/pid/cmdline showed up inthe denied logs :)  but i do start some things from upstart user jobs, maybe that's the problem
<hallyn> though, "not luanched by upstart", maybe not
<hallyn> oh well - it did give me a pretty screen :)  just couldn't do anything
 * hallyn out - gnight
<RAOF> Oh /var/log/lightdm/unity-system-compositor might say something else, given that it's clearly going away.
<RAOF> But that might be after you try to quit or something.
<Noskcaj> Is anything going to break if i merge gnome-keyring from debian? (switches from gpg-agent to pinentry-gnome3)
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> Noskcaj, unsure, what's the motivation for the change?
<Noskcaj> gpg-agent doesn't work properly, so it gets dropped
<Noskcaj> pinetree replaces the missing features, and is wanted by upstream IIRC. Downside is pinetree-gnome3 might not be wanted everywhere
<Noskcaj> See http://metadata.ftp-master.debian.org/changelogs/main/g/gnome-keyring/unstable_changelog and the 2 bugs in the most recent entry
<Noskcaj> Changing the dep to pinentry-gtk2 | pinentry-gnome3 might be more suitable here
<pitti> hey seb128!
<seb128> hey pitti, wie gehts?
<seb128> Noskcaj, we don't want new gtk2 depends... what doesn't work in gpg-agent?
<pitti> seb128: prima, danke! had some nice basketball games yesterday evening
<larsu> hi pitti
 * larsu has the feeling it will get very hot here today as well
 * pitti winkt larsu
<Noskcaj> seb128, From my understanding, gnome-keyring hijacks gpg-agent, and as a result removes features
<Noskcaj> See https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=760102 and https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=787786
<ubot5> Debian bug 760102 in gnome-keyring "gnome-keyring: please build with --disable-gpg-agent" [Important,Fixed]
<ubot5> Debian bug 787786 in gnome-keyring "gnome-keyring: please introduce a dependency on pinentry-gnome3" [Wishlist,Fixed]
<seb128> Noskcaj, right, that's a known issue ... so the new version disable the keyring code?
<Noskcaj> yes
<Noskcaj> The only functionality lost is then re-gained by adding the dep on pinentry
<Noskcaj> An alt dep on pinentry-gtk2 could allow the ubuntu-mate guys to not pull in the gnome3 part if they want that
<seb128> Noskcaj, did you check that pinentry-gnome3 works under unity? what does it look like UI wise?
<Noskcaj> seb128, I've got no unity install. I can test under xfce, but it's CSD stuff is pretty good nowdays
<seb128> so pinentry-gnome3 is using csd?
<Noskcaj> no idea
<Noskcaj> i'm installing it now to see
<seb128> Noskcaj, also you should get an unity install, how can you test Ubuntu GNOME packages updates without one?
<Noskcaj> seb128, reading changelogs then getting other people to check stuff for me
<Noskcaj> My current PC setup is too shitty to have an install. I might be able to get something working when my internet becomes ok in a few weeks
<willcooke> morning all
<Laney> ahoy
<Laney> Noskcaj: I think we should, but when I tried it didn't work properly
<seb128> hey willcooke, Laney, how is uk?
<Laney> toasty
<Laney> wasn't a great night of sleep!
<willcooke> what he said
<seb128> same here :-/
<Laney> we had the fan on by the bed
<Laney> but it gave me weird dreams
<willcooke> The thermostat downstairs said is was 33 at midnight :/
<Laney> like at 3am I got paranoid that the noise of the fan would mean that I couldn't hear anybody breaking in downstairs
<Laney> so went to check
<Laney> WEIRD
<willcooke> :D
<Noskcaj> 33 celcius?
<willcooke> yah
<Noskcaj> crap
<willcooke> :(
<willcooke> but luckily, that's summer over and done with now
 * Noskcaj only just remembered it's not winter everywhere
<willcooke> hehe
<Laney> yah gets back to more normal weather from here http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/ng5
<seb128> 30Â°C is normal summer no?
<seb128> oh man, you are back to 20Â°C, I wouldn't say no to that
<seb128> being able to sleep without feeling like you are slowly boiled is nice
<Laney> I guess we get it once per year probably
<Laney> otherwise... http://www.holiday-weather.com/nottingham/averages/
<seb128> lovely weather you get :-)
 * seb128 doesn't like hot summer days
<seb128> shrug, 30Â°C in the room, night didn't cool much down
<Laney> the summer ones seem low to me
<Laney> but I believe the data!
<seb128> and it's already sunny/warm enough that I had to close the windows
<seb128> it's going to be a long day
<Laney> :\
<Laney> what's the forecast for you?
<seb128> Laney, http://www.bbc.com/weather/2747373
<seb128> in fact they changed, looks like it's getting lower today
<seb128> it was 33Â°C yesterday and they still had 30Â°C for today
<seb128> they revisited that to 26Â°C now
<Laney> nice
<seb128> yeah, 26Â°C is about right :-)
<Laney> seb128: did you see the image build failure?
<seb128> Laney, yeah, see wily-changes
<seb128> I just uploaded what I think should be enough to fix it
<Laney> ok, not on that list so I didn't see it, checked livecd-rootfs
<seb128> Laney, basically it's because click is still being pulled in
<seb128> and I think it's due to u-s-s
<seb128> I added a | ubuntu-snappy-cli
<darkxst> Laney, seb128 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-online-accounts/+bug/1466290/comments/3
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1466290 in gnome-online-accounts (Ubuntu) "Update to 3.16" [Undecided,Fix released]
<darkxst> following on from last nights discussion that bits that need webkit2gtk-4.0 can only be demoted to universe if g-c-c is also
<darkxst> (thats assuming we can have the new webkit in main for builds only)
<Laney> darkxst: can g-c-c binary go to universe and source stay in main as well?
<darkxst> Laney, yes, I guess only the shared-data binary needs to be in main?
<darkxst> well not guess, more fact!
<Laney> I suppose so
<darkxst> that is the only reason that g-c-c is still in main
<Laney> seems easier to keep it there
<Laney> go ahead and ask the mir team what they think imho
<ogra_> or the MIR team ... :P
<Laney> mIr TeAm
<ogra_> haha
<Laney> ogra_: is there a way to get ./update to work with proposed?
<ogra_> Laney, nope, i dont think so
<ogra_> and you wouldnt really want that
<Laney> what if you need to update a seed for a transition?
<ogra_> i guess you can only do the meta upload after the transition then
<Laney> the transition doesn't happen because of the meta
<Laney> :/
<ogra_> hmm, drop it from the seed, do the transition, re-add it ?
<Laney> this is weird
<darkxst> Laney, ok, will do
<ogra_> Laney, well, probably cjwatson has an idea for you
<darkxst> where is didrocks?
<Laney> on hols
<Laney> ogra_: I read the code and found a way
<ogra_> cool
<Laney> add dists: wily wily-proposed
<Laney> fyi
<Laney> well, it's not finished yet, but looks promising so far
<ogra_> just dont make it permanent ;)
<Laney> don't actually know what the problem is with that
<Laney> but whatevs
<darkxst> Laney, infinity is MIR team also? or should I just subscibe the MIR team to the bug report?
<Laney> darkxst: launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mir/+members but subscribing them is best
<Laney> bah
<Laney> pitti: any clue why the udisks2 autopkgtest is flapping between pass and fail?
<seb128> Laney, can you kick an desktop-next amd64 rebuild for me?
<seb128> Laney, stgraber didn't reply and doing cancel on the tracker doesn't work
<pitti> Laney: test_force_removal() is apparently racy; I don't get that locally, so at some point I need to debug that on the production VMs
<Laney> seb128: cancelled the builds manually, try again?
<Laney> pitti: the previous runs had other tests failing
<seb128> Laney, danke, the iso tracker was not in "re-building" anymore so I guess that worked, waiting a few minutes to see the builder side
<pitti> Laney: well, same :)
<Laney> fair
<Laney> we'll get lucky and have both arches passing at the same time soon :P
<seb128> Laney, worked, thanks
<Laney> ah, the magic pitti touch!
<seb128> Laney, I was speaking about desktop-next ;-)
<Laney> seb128: I know, he fixed https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/wily-adt-udisks2/
<Laney> my two retries didn't work
<seb128> ah ok
<desrt> good morning
<greyback> seb128: hey, do you have any tips on figuring out a packaging conflict in a crossbuilding chroot
<greyback>  libconnectivity-qt1-dev:armhf : Depends: libconnectivity-qt1:armhf (= 0.5.1+15.04.20150618.1-0ubuntu1) but it is not going to be installed
<greyback> that is breaking my crosssbuilding unity8
<seb128> greyback, hey, usually try to apt-get install those at the same time and see what it does
<seb128> e.g apt-get install libconnectivity-qt1-dev:armhf libconnectivity-qt1:armhf
<greyback> seb128: hmm, it just worked
<seb128> weird
<seb128> it didn't remove anything?
<greyback> no nothing
<seb128> what command were you using before?
<seb128> there are maybe more packages needed that create the issue?
<greyback> apt-get build-dep -aarmhf unity8
<seb128> does that work now?
<greyback> it does, but removes libconnectivity-qt1 & its -dev
<seb128> well, are those still used/needed?
<greyback> seb128: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11809786/ is what I get
<seb128> unsure how to read that
<seb128> validate it?
<greyback> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11809789/ - I just get into a loop of removing one thing to install another
<greyback> I'll have to go through those 1 by 1 to try see where the conflict is
<greyback> like i'm ping-ponging between libandroid-properties1 and libandroid-properties1:armhf
<seb128> try installing those together?
<seb128> to see what issue it has with it
<greyback> seb128: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11809793/ does that make sense to you?
<greyback> libandroid-properties1:armhf depending on libandroid-properties1 ?
<seb128> that seems weird
<seb128> but the same package on different archs should be co-installable
<greyback> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<greyback>  libandroid-properties1 : Conflicts: libandroid-properties1:armhf but 0.1.0+git20131207+e452e83-0ubuntu39 is to be installed
<greyback>  libandroid-properties1:armhf : Conflicts: libandroid-properties1 but 0.1.0+git20131207+e452e83-0ubuntu39 is to be installed
<greyback> E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages.
<greyback> seems not
<seb128> unsure what's going on :-/
<seb128> xnox or Laney might know better
<greyback> me neither. Will keep diggin
<greyback> thanks for the help
<seb128> yw, sorry to not be able to resolve it
<xnox> seb128: greyback: you shall not mix & match different versions of a packages across multiple architectures.
<xnox> specifically looks like :i386 / :amd64 version is installed and of a different versions from :armhf one.
<greyback> xnox: I can only see the same version of the packages for both arches however
<greyback> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11809967/
<hallyn> RAOF: fwiw, /var/log/lightdm/unity-system-compositor.log:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/11810250/   ("pause" is all that's reall ythere afaict)
<seb128> hallyn, what are you trying to do?
<hallyn> seb128: i was logging into unity8
<hallyn> (see backscroll from about 10 hrs ago)
<hallyn> bc unity7 isn't working either
<seb128> hallyn, did you reset your compiz config for unity7?
<hallyn> nope
<seb128> is guest session working?
<hallyn> (there was something I'd been asked to reset, but I forget what it was)
<hallyn> Hm.  queue up the things to try and I'll try themwhen I can shut down my work for a bit :)  i'll try guest session, how do i reset compiz config?
<seb128> dconf reset -f /org/compiz/
<hallyn> ah, ok, yes i think i'd been asked to do that last week
<hallyn> (for fixing unity7)
<hallyn> will try both, thx
<seb128> what distro serie are you using and what did you do around the time unity stop working?
<hallyn> seb128: ubuntu wily;  i did an upgrade.  'Ubuntu' disappeared from my options in the wm list.
<hallyn> so i apt-get installed unity again,
<hallyn> it showed back up, but only gvies me a blank screen now.  loffice eventually starts up.  no panel, shortcuts don't work (can't ctrl-alt-t)
<seb128> don't use dist-upgrade and say "yes" when it wants to remove important packages
<seb128> it might be worth checkijg dpkg.log to see if there are other packages that got uninstalled that you didn't reinstall
<hallyn> "don't use dist-upgrade"  ?
<seb128> that quoting only part of what I wrote
<seb128> but yeah, if you use "dist-upgrade" read the output and what it wants to remove before hitting "y"
<seb128> especially in unstable cycles
<seb128> though such issues shouldn't happen with proposed and britney nowadays
<hallyn> why on earth would it decide to remove unity...
<hallyn> i did in fact do "apt-get -y dist-upgrade", perhaps foolhardy, but i'm not sure i'll concede that it *should* be foolhardy
<hallyn> but i would've said yes anyway bc i don't kow the current structure of all the desktop packaging - no idea what i actually need :)
<hallyn> i mean, i need qtile, wmii, i3, awesome, dwm....
<hallyn> d'oh!
<seb128> usually if the "remove" section contains unity or a stack of things that sound like useful, there is an issue
<seb128> if it's an old soname from a lib it's probably ok
<seb128> well in any case check dpkg.log
<seb128> in case other things sound like things to reinstall
<hallyn> yeah i see unity there, removed along with ubuntu-desktop on june 26
<Laney> you can probably apt-get install ubuntu-desktop ubuntu-desktop^
<Laney> see if anything comes back
<hallyn> but that'll only install thunderbird which i don't want :)  or is ubuntu-desktop not purely virtual?
<Laney> it's a meta package
<hallyn> libmetacity-private2 had been removed...
<hallyn> so no, everything except thunderbird that still is valid was re-installed, so that's not the problem now.  will try guest session later.  thx
<seb128> Laney, can you stop the amd64 next build status for me?
<Laney> grr
<Laney> this self service thing isn't working out very well
<seb128> no it's not :-/
 * Laney tries ;-)
<Laney> bah
<Laney> let's just ping him every time
<Laney> cancelled!
<ogra_> Laney, just give seb128 your ssh key
 * ogra_ likes pragmatic solutions
<seb128> lol
<larsu> haha nice
<larsu> just paste it in here, what could go wrong!
<Laney> good idea, here goes
<Laney> -----BEGIN RSA PRIVATE KEY-----
<ogra_> :D
<ogra_> see, *thats* how we do it among friends :)
<willcooke> :D
 * willcooke remembers the time seb128 told us all his password
<ogra_> ..." you find my ssh key under the doormat" ...
<seb128> O_o
<davmor2> willcooke: was it hunter2 all the cool kids use that....still so glad that irc hashes out passwords thanks again for that ogra_ :)
<willcooke> :)
<ogra_> davmor2, no it was *********
<Laney> hunter2
<davmor2> Laney: http://bash.org/?244321
 * ogra_ likes the conclusion :)
<larsu> awesome
 * willcooke -> EOD
 * Laney too
<Laney> it's just started raining :(
 * Laney ttyl!
 * qengho afk. first aid.
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-07-03
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> desrt: LP:# 1401488 is really really annoying me. :(
<pitti> bonjour seb128, Ã§a va ?
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey pitti, wie gehts
<pitti> seb128: trÃ¨s bien, merci ! je suis allÃ© courier, avant la pluie
<larsu> morning :)
<pitti> guten Morgen larsu!
<larsu> here comes my daily french reading comprehension practice
<larsu> hi pitti :)
 * pitti is grateful for a little rain and thunder, going to be 32 degrees again later on
<larsu> oh? Sun and sun, with a bit of sun here
<pitti> larsu: oui, on parle franÃ§ais ici !
<pitti> larsu: http://www.wetteronline.de/wetter/augsburg :)
<larsu> wow, enjoy!
<pitti> just a small little band of clouds over Germany, and we have it! muhaha!
<larsu> indeed :D
<larsu> uh oh: http://www.wetteronline.de/wetter/berlin
<pitti> but yeah, otherwise sun, sun, sun
<larsu> 37 on Sunday
 * larsu makes more ice cubes for tea
<pitti> ok, plan for the weekend:
<pitti> - get ice cream
<pitti> - get more
<pitti> - bring out the hammock
<larsu> I think you forgot some additional ice cream
<pitti> true that!
<larsu> hammock sounds awesome, though
<larsu> I need to get one
<pitti> I got one last year
<pitti> as a bday gift from a friend
<pitti> I bought a sack of cement and a second post to actually install it, but now it's working nicely :)
<seb128> it's too warm out there!
<Laney> gotta get down
<Laney> it's friiiiday
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> yo seb128
<Laney> i'm SUPER! (but tired)
<Laney> how about you?
<Laney> looking forward to the w.e.?
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<seb128> unsure, I wished that snappy personal image was working
<seb128> so I would rather look forward another work day :p
<seb128> but I guess w.e is going to do as well
<Laney> :/
<Laney> do you know what work is left?
<seb128> well, getting the thing to work
<seb128> image is back to build
<seb128> but now u-d-f fails on "failed to find user uid/gid" when trying to build an image
<willcooke> mornin'
<seb128> hey willcooke
<seb128> Laney, what about you? having any plans for the w.e?
<Laney> :|
<Laney> yeah I'm going to a murder mystery weekend!
<Laney> got to dress up in fancy dress though, which I am not really looking forward to
 * ogra_ hopes it is an airconditioned murder mystery 
<Laney> only up to 24Â° here, also rain
<seb128> Laney, make sure to take some selfies from yourself in that fancy dress ;-)
<seb128> how many people are going to be there?
<Laney> our group is like 10 people but there are others too
<willcooke> What would people say if I asked to move the weekly meeting forwards to 30 mins later?
<willcooke> permanently
<Laney> I would say doesn't that start to get late for CET people?
<seb128> willcooke, people are going to be grumpy
<seb128> better half an hour earlier
<seb128> like now it ends after 6pm
<willcooke> I could do an hour earlier
<seb128> if you move it you get close from 7pm, and sometime people need to go at 6:30pm
<seb128> an hour earlier is probably better
<seb128> check if it's not too early for the us side of the team
<willcooke> oh, wait
<willcooke> no I can
<willcooke> *cant
<willcooke> oki, will ask olli to move his meeting
<Laney> moving 12 people might be tough :P
<Laney> I guess looking for the same time another day would be easiest for you
<willcooke> Hopefully olli can move his meeting by 30 mins or so
<willcooke> or I could do an IRC meeting and a HO at the same time - which is probably do-able
<willcooke> but sub-optimal
<Laney> seems better, ours is long established :)
<willcooke> indeed
<larsu> "long established" :D
<larsu> hi Laney, willcooke!
<willcooke> hey larsu
<Laney> it's worn an ass groove
<Laney> hey larsu
<Laney> what's going on?
<larsu> heat
<larsu> not much else I think
<larsu> well. Almost weekend.
<larsu> for you?
<Laney> tea
<Laney> I just found a bit of my fancy dress costume
 * Laney telegrams you a preview
<larsu> I have tea as well but find it hard to enjoy when it's hot
<larsu> should make iced tea again
<larsu> Laney: georgous!
<willcooke> Laney, I say!
<larsu> *gorgeous
<Laney> it's really hard to keep it in
<larsu> ya, you look like you're squinting quite a bit
<larsu> makes you look a tad older, which goes nicely with the monocle
<Laney> adds to the look!
<seb128> larsu, Laney; any chance we see some of those themes fixes land today?
<larsu> yes. totally
 * larsu stops slacking
<Laney> assuming they are ready
 * Laney whips larsu 
<larsu> ouch
<seb128> lol
<seb128> don't do that!
<Laney> this has become a bit kinky
 * Laney goes to look at a debian/rules file to calm down
<larsu> lol
<Noskcaj> seb128, Laney: So was there a final decision on gnome-keyring?
<Laney> Noskcaj: I have a merge, didn't test if it works yet
<Laney> last time I tried it I couldn't get the pinentry dialog to come up at all
<Laney> which is a bit poor
<Noskcaj> I couldn't get the pinentry-gnome3 to open as a gui either, but i think that's user error
<seb128> sounds like a blocker to me
<seb128> users shouldn't have to do anything, things should "just work"
<Laney> yes no shit
<Laney> I'm saying it should be fixed
 * Laney tries the debian pkg though
<Laney> I just did some local config hax
<seb128> Laney, right, I was replying to Noskcaj, not to you ;-)
<Laney> oh ok!
<Noskcaj> Is debuild requiring manual password entry for signing you too? It's saying "gpg: gpg-agent is not available in this session"
<Laney> I have no $GPG_AGENT_INFO, hmm
<Laney> upstart job isn't starting it
<Laney> huh, that's a bad bug
<Laney> the job breaks if you don't have "enable-ssh-support" in there
<Laney> yeah this works now
<anpok_> pitti: could you upload systemd-220 to https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-047
<pitti> anpok_: hey
<pitti> anpok_: do you have some details about that? which version? which patch? to which release? what's that about?
<pitti> anpok_: systemd 220 doesn't exist in any ubuntu release (vivid has 219, wily has 221)
<anpok_> oh i didnt notice wily already going to 220
<anpok_> 221 i mean
<anpok_> i thought 220 is the first one that has the udevd with the backported touch screen patches
<pitti> anpok_: I did backport them while we had 220, but they are included in 221 indeed
<anpok_> do you know of any api or abi changes in libudev between 220 and 221?
<pitti> anpok_: no, 221 sohuld work fine on vivid (no API changes), let me check the build deps
<pitti>  sbuild-build-depends-systemd-dummy : Depends: libcap-dev (>= 1:2.24-9~) but it is not going to be installed
<pitti> ah, that was for the move into /lib, but it's mostly just a precaution
<pitti> so, I can prepare a source that builds in vivid, and upload it to that PPA if you need that
<pitti> anpok_: but you must never land that in vivid-updates, as it will break the udeb; overlay PPA is fine
<pitti> (well, the train doesn't land in vivid-updates anyway, I figure)
<pitti> anpok_: oh wait, this will also change the network interface naming, and a couple of other things; so a straight backport will never be able to land
<pitti> so I guess just adding your patches to the vivid version is better
<anpok_> i thought the silo is configured to go into the vivid stable phone overlay
<pitti> right; but the different network interface names need to be handled in various places, so we can't just use the wily version as-is
<anpok_> ok
<pitti> e. g. bug 1467640
<ubot5> bug 1467640 in ofono (Ubuntu) "No mobile data connection for mako on wily" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1467640
<anpok_> ouch
<pitti> so, backporting your patches to vivid is safer
<seb128> Laney, I just did a livecd-rootfs upload, can you kick a desktop-next image rebuild when that migrates out of proposed (like in 45 minutes I guess)?
<seb128> I can technically do it, but I'm about to go for lunch and I would like to come back on a build image rather than kicking the job in and have to wait then
<seb128> well, if you are around/not a lunch yet
<seb128> otherwise I just do it once I'm back
<Laney> k
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> xnox: how can I see which upstart config files are being used for a job?
<Laney> something is overriding 'start on' for gpg-agent on my system and I don't know how to find out what it is
<Laney> nothing in ~/.config/upstart/
<xnox> Laney: for a user session?
<Laney> ohhhh
<Laney> ~/.init/
<xnox> i don't think we have something like systemctl dump/cat
<Laney> I obviously knew about this at one point in time
<pitti> "systemctl cat foo" shows foo.service plus drop-ins, whereever htey are
<pitti> oh, you mean for upstart, sorry
 * pitti STFU
<Laney> indeed
<Laney> it seems like cat does show the filenames, which is what I want to do for upstart
<Laney> I guess "there is no way"?
<xnox> Laney: yeah full paths have ~/.init ~/.config/upstart, well XDG_CONFIG_HOME/upstart, XDG_CONFIG_DIRS/upstart (all transveresed), and /usr/share/upstart/sessions/ or so
<Laney> (which is okay, since I just found it)
<Laney> man, this random job must have been in use for years
<Laney> Mar 5 2013
<Laney> haha
<xnox> yeap
 * Laney burns it with fire and acid and bees
<xnox> Laney: i want to transition to gpg2 by default, with gtk3+ (based on keyring support libraries) gpg2-agent in ubunut
<xnox> what do you think? it also means disabling gpg support in the keyring, which has been dropped upstream now.
<Laney> yes I am working on the pinentry-gnome3 thing now
<Laney> no opinion on gpg2 atm
<Laney> except that it requires the agent which is slightly better for the pinentry situation
<Laney> I think we can move to pinentry-gnome3 on gpg1 though no?
<Laney> ah, the job needs a tweak to start after dbus
<Laney> that explains EVERYTHING!
<anpok_> pitti: ok just sent you a backported patch
<anpok_> or do you need it in a different form? mp somewhere?
<pitti> anpok_: that's fine; that includes everything? (IIRC this landed as 3 or so patches upstream)
<Laney> xnox: mail ubuntu-devel about the switch I think - I don't know enough about gpg vs gpg2 to have useful input atm
<Laney> in the meantime I'm going to mail ubuntu-desktop about pinentry-gnome3
 * Laney PPAifies
<anpok_> pitti: yeash squashedn + added stuff that was added later on..
<anpok_> *squashed them
<pitti> anpok_: cool, thanks
<Laney> hmm, how can I express this starting condition for gpg-agent?
<Laney> start on starting xsession-init and started dbus-only-if-we-have-pinentry-gnome3
<Laney> have a dummy pinentry-gnome3 job maybe
<Laney> which is start on started dbus
<Laney> no that doesn't work, maybe "no-pinentry-gnome3 or started dbus"
<pitti> anpok_: seems a bit unusual to land this in the overlay PPA instead of a proper SRU, but I uploaded it now
<anpok_> hm sru for vivid would be better if we also plan to bump the used mir version
 * seb128 back from lunch
<seb128> bah livecd-rootfs was slow to migrate
<seb128> Laney, I'm going to retry the build once rmadison says it's ok
<seb128> we are back is slow publishing days
<Laney> ya I was watching it
<Laney> not sure what the reason is
<seb128> like I uploaded that livecd-rootfs over 1h30 ago
<seb128> and it has no autopkgtests or anything to slow it down
<desrt> good morning, desktop!
<Laney> heeeeeeeeeeeeeeey desrt
<willcooke> yo desrt
 * desrt is back
<desrt> new place is mostly set up... at least enough for working
<desrt> but cardboard boxes EVERYWHERE
<seb128> hey desrt, how are you?
<desrt> i'm okay
<desrt> still floating in outerspace a bit
<pitti> desrt: learn from the masters: http://xkcd.com/1077/
<desrt> pitti:  ya.  seems about right :)
<jibel> after a month you move the box to the trash and call it done. Learned from experience ;)
<pitti> jibel, the master of moving
<pitti> we have a saying 'moving three times is like burning down once'
<larsu> pitti: in German?
 * larsu is unaware
<pitti> larsu: "Dreimal umgezogen ist wie einmal abgebrannt"
<larsu> never heard that :)
<larsu> probably just not a thing in Berlin
<larsu> we don't move to stay in old contracts ;)
<pitti> haha
 * ogra_ hasnt heard that either ... 
 * Sweet5hark now has mental images of larsu being bunkered in in his appartment defiantly waving a "stop gentrification naow!" flags.
<seb128> pitti, hey, how does one tell why systemd is in "maintenance" status?
<pitti> seb128: start with "systemctl --failed"?
<seb128> the normal output stops on "tmpfs: No value for mount option 'none'"
<pitti> seb128: you mean "systemctl status" says it's in degraded mode?
<pitti> seb128: oh, you mean you don't even get to normal getty/ssh?
<seb128> pitti, no, it says "State: maintenance"
<seb128> emergency target is active
<pitti> ah, the emerg shell
<seb128> right
<pitti> systemctl --failed still sounds god
<pitti> good
<seb128> list 1 job that doesn't seem relevant
<pitti> which one?
<pitti> seb128: otherwise, pasting the journal would be helpful (or you check it yourself -- try "journalctl -p warning" to reduce it
<pitti> or even journalctl -p err
<seb128> pitti, var-lib-NetworkManager.mount
<seb128> well it's a mount
<seb128> so maybe it fails everything else
<pitti> right, so a mount that's in /etc/fstab which isn't "nofail"
<pitti> that's fatal
<pitti> (you can mark it "nofail" if you don't need it, but one can't generally guess automatically)
<seb128> so I guess it has to do with the "tmpfs: No value for mount option 'none'"
<seb128> images were working this morning
<seb128> wth
 * pitti blames the heat
<seb128> I built a new snappy image and same issue
<seb128> I don't get it
<seb128> it's also crazyness that any fstab line failing let you without a system booting :-/
<seb128> things feel like a lot more fragile since we are on systemd
<pitti> seb128: well, it was crazy *not* to do it
<pitti> we haven't noticed security relevant bugs for years because of that
<seb128> because some random /my/mp3/mount is having an issue doesn't mean I don't want my system to boot anymore
<pitti> it's really not okay to just silently not mount stuff, like /home on NFS, or a big partition and instead filling your small one, etc.
<pitti> for nonessential stuff there has always been fail/nofail
<seb128> k, I've no clue how to fix that "tmpfs: No value for mount option 'none'"
 * seb128 google
<pitti> seb128: what's the fstab line for that NetworkManager mount?
<seb128> "tmpfs /var/lib/NetworkManager tmpfs none 0 0"
<pitti> "none" doesn't seem documented in mount(8), so I guess util-linux doesn't understand this
<seb128> I guess the "none" is buggy
<pitti> try "defaults"?
<seb128> pitti, works btter after fixing that line, thanks
<pitti> great; so now the task is to figure out what broke this?
<seb128> I still think it's crazy that a typo in a writable-path mount bricks your system
<seb128> me :p
<seb128> dunno why it worked this morning
<pitti> so you'd rather have that silently broken?
<seb128> I did that writable-path change on wednesdat
<seb128> well the job could be in a failed state
<seb128> without letting the box without even a vt you can log into to debug
<seb128> good that I know how to add systemd.debug-shell in grub
<pitti> well, with a lot of fstab failures you don't get very far in the first place
<seb128> but normal sysadmin can get well screwed
<pitti> err, you should have an emergency shell, didn't you get one?
<seb128> no
<pitti> then *that* is the bug
<seb128> it hangs on the "tmpfs: No value for mount option 'none'"
<seb128> I had to systemd.debug-shell and vt9
<pitti> seb128: right, that totally should be fixed
<pitti> the idea is that it throws you into an emergency shell, or into friendly-recovery
<pitti> (presumably the latter if you have it installed, but at least the emerg shell)
<seb128> friendly-recovery is installed but doesn't work
<seb128> maybe that' the issue
<pitti> seb128: mind filing a bug? I'd like to get to that (but not right now)
<seb128> e.G picking "recovery" from grub leads to a normal boot
<seb128> pitti, sure can do, note that it's on the snappy personal image so it might be an issue there, I'm going to look a bit more before reporting it
<pitti> seb128: I suppose we don't want f-r on a snappy image as you can't really do much there anyway (except for screwing up more)?
<pitti> seb128: I get the same on a cloud image
<pitti> seb128: sorry for misunderstanding the bug then, I had assumed you got into a shell (similar to what happens if fsck fails, etc.)
<seb128> pitti, no worry, sorry for ranting a bit rather than describing it well
<seb128> pitti, "the same" being friendly-recovery doing a normal boot?
 * pitti hugs seb128, merci dieu c'est vendredi
<pitti> seb128: right, it also just hangs here
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> where should I report the bug?
<pitti> I suppose because I disabled the emergency shell becuase of friendly-recovery, but that doesn't get invoked in that case
<pitti> seb128: just systemd
<seb128> k
<seb128> pitti, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/systemd/+bug/1471258
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1471258 in systemd (Ubuntu) "Invalid fstab entry leads to an hanging system rather than a debug command line" [Undecided,New]
<pitti> seb128: cheers
<seb128> Laney, you like that panel, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/181103194/u-c-c-sharing-panel.png ?
<Laney> I didn't look at that
<Laney> do I want to? :)
<seb128> unsure, you commented saying to land it...
<Laney> who approved the merge proposal?
<Laney> if you think it's crap then don't make it approved
<seb128> " Robert Ancell on 2015-07-02 "
<seb128> I didn't
<Laney> you have the power to unapprove it
<Laney> is it the same as gnome has?
<seb128> I don't think I feel strongly enough to argue
<seb128> no
<seb128> https://blogs.gnome.org/mclasen/files/2013/01/settings-sharing-screen.png
<seb128> is the GNOME one
<seb128> which is a subscreen of https://blogs.gnome.org/thos/files/2013/04/Sharing-Settings.png
<seb128> I'm just unsure having a full panel about "screen sharing" makes sense
<seb128> it's pushing the feature a bit too much in front imho
<seb128> which is why I asked for mpt to comment from a design perspective on the mp...
<pitti> happy weekend everyone!
<larsu> pitti: enjoy!
<seb128> pitti, have fun!
<ogra_> get some icecream !
<ogra_> (and an ubuntu fan )
<Laney> seb128: you could set it back to needs review and re-ping mpt, looks like it just fell through the cracks
<Laney> bye pitti1
<Laney> !
<seb128> mpt, robert_ancell added the screenshots you asked for on https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/unity-control-center/screen-sharing/+merge/226771 , in case you feel like having a look to that one again
<Laney> that uninstalled case isn't the best
<seb128> indeed not, but I guess it's not the standard case
<seb128> I'm more annoyed at having "screen sharing" as a main item in the settings
<seb128> it feels like it's not a setting that you want to access often/is important enough to have it there
<Laney> many things like that already, but I don't like arguments along those lines :)
<seb128> yeah, "we have those that suck" is not a case to add more ;-)
<Laney> but I also don't see a good top level item to put it under
<seb128> we could make a sharing panel like GNOME and list different items including that one in it, but that's more work and I'm unsure that's something we want to spend work on
<Laney> robert_ancell loves that kind of work ;)
<Laney> larsu: you got a theme branch for me?
<seb128> yeah, I'm just unsure that's what we should spend our resources on
 * Laney has to leave in 50 mins or so
<larsu> Laney: I moved my working hours towards the evening because it was unbearably hot. You'll have it first thing on Monday
<Laney> okay!
<larsu> we also never landed the scrollabr restyling, did we?
<Laney> I thought it broke something
<Laney> but I forgot what
<larsu> ok I'll give it another spin
<Laney> seb128: do you remember?
<larsu> nautilus sidebar?
<larsu> ah no, that's broken without it as well
<Laney> something to do with progress bars?
 * Laney searches logs
<seb128> yes
<seb128> the content of the bars
<seb128> like the color inside
<larsu> backgrounds of troughs, indeed
<larsu> thanks seb128
<seb128> thanks to Laney who remembered it was those ;-)
<Laney> ty
<seb128> yeah, those theming tweak having been pending for a while
<larsu> thanks Laney :)
<seb128> would be good to have them landing
 * larsu nods
<seb128> Laney, larsu, would one of you be interested looking at bug #1454950 next week?
<ubot5> bug 1454950 in gnome-settings-daemon "It needs to press touchpad hotkey twice to re-enable touchpad" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1454950
<seb128> it's coming from the oem team and has some details on the issue/buggy code, it's also a but that still happen on upstream it seems
<larsu> yep!
<seb128> larsu, thanks :-)
<Laney> I don't seem to have a button to do that
<Laney> can you do it from software?
<Laney> well, nm if larsu is gonig to look :P
<seb128> Laney, I guess you can edit the code the change what key does that
<seb128> those haskell packages are crazyness
<seb128> it feels like half of the uploads are for ghc abi changes
<seb128> half of the ubuntu uploads I mean
<Laney> Climate scientists announced today that a landmark study into the leading causes of CO2 emissions has discovered that Haskell rebuilds in Ubuntu and Debian rank in the top spot ahead of transport, heavy industry and power generation.
<seb128> lol
<larsu> haha :D
<seb128> I hope we have users of those packages
<larsu> actually bitcoin miners are starting to get there: http://motherboard.vice.com/read/bitcoin-is-unsustainable
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> so much energy wasted :-/
<larsu> ya...
<larsu> we should solve problems in this order: (1) cheap renewable energy (2) cryptocurrencies
<Laney> seb128: can we subscribe desktop-bugs to libgom please?
<Laney> going to be a bd/d of grilo-plugins soon
<Sweet5hark> Laney: Climate scientists clearly havent discovered: http://tinderbox.libreoffice.org/MASTER/status.html yet then ...
<larsu> Sweet5hark: man, that took long this time :P
<larsu> a full 10 minutes after Laney first mentioned the topic
<Laney> haha
<Laney> too busy watching libreoffice build to read IRC
<seb128> Laney, you got team admin, feel free to do it
<Laney> :)
<Laney> oh
<Laney> wait
<Laney> POWER?!?!?!?!?!
<seb128> :-)
 * Sweet5hark is in meeting and was sniped into another conversation along too.
<Laney> [MIR] xmonad
<Laney> Desktop team will maintain.
<Laney> right, got to go solve the murder
<Laney> byeeeeeee, happy weekend!
<larsu> have fun!!
<willcooke> happy weekend all
<Noskcaj> Laney, gpg from the ppa is working fine for me now. No visible bugs
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-07-04
<Noskcaj> I'm trying to merge deja-dup, should it still depend on g-c-c? debian dropped the b-dep because upstream gnome doesn't want 3rd party things in the control center
<Noskcaj> darkxst, ^
<darkxst> Noskcaj, leave it for now, I am going to drop the external panels stuff (and libgnome-control-center) from g-c-c, we can drop it then and seed deja-dup-preferences
<Noskcaj> ok. I'm just finishing up the merge, hopefully nothing is too broken
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-07-04
<hikiko> hi
<hikiko> hello
<hikiko> (back)
<andyrock> good morning all
<Laney> morning!
<pitti> hey Laney!
<Laney> hey pitti
<Laney> how are you?
<pitti> Laney: quite fine, thanks! a bit tired, long soccer evenings :)
<Laney> ohhh I heard a little bit about this
<pitti> but had a nice and relaxing weekend
<pitti> (other than Saturday night, of course)
<pitti> Laney: how about yourself?
<Laney> very good
<Laney> just waiting for the first talk of debconf proper to start ;-)
<pitti> yay
<pitti> Laney: flight went okay?
<didrocks> good morning Laney, pitti!
<Laney> quite fine
<Laney> I even managed to get a little bit of sleep
<Laney> xnox managed to get himself delayed by a day though
<Laney> we went up table mountain yesterday
<Laney> the views & walking were great
<pitti> nice
<didrocks> sounds fun!
<pitti> we tried last May when I was there, but it was so windy that nobody was allowed up there
<pitti> bonjour didrocks ! Ã§a va ?
<didrocks> pitti: Ã§a va Ã§a va. Par contre, j'ai entendu des cris dehors en fin de journÃ©e par 4 fois, je me demandais s'il y avait le feu :-)
<didrocks> </fin de mauvaise foi> ;)
<didrocks> how are you?
<pitti> didrocks: seulement une autre semaine, puis la folie termine :-)
 * pitti te donne une accolade
<pitti> didrocks: ici on se reveille avec les oiseaux, ils commencent changer Ã  4h..
<pitti> "chanter"
 * didrocks donne une accolade en retour Ã  pitti :)
<didrocks> pitti: oui, pareil ici, les oiseaux nous rÃ©veillent le matin, c'est toujours agrÃ©able :)
<pitti> didrocks: boire une biÃ¨re pour chaque "goal", c'Ã©tait de travail dur hier soir :-)
<didrocks> j'imagine ! pour cela que seb n'est toujours pas rÃ©veillÃ© je pense :-)
<pitti> haha
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<davidcalle> bregma: willcooke: hey hey, question: Do X on mir apps share the same X, or are they siloed? Can the X on Mir foo snap spy on other X apps? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8aAU_Eh_x0
<willcooke> davidcalle, AIUI each legacy app would have it's own Xmir instance.
<willcooke> davidcalle, I dont know how big an Xmir is, I guess a few hundred meg at least, so maybe that would change in the future - but then the security story would suck, so maybe not.  Anyway, bregma will know for sure
<seb128> xmir is probably not that big
<seb128> like xorg packages are few mbs
<seb128> I would rather say in the 10-30M range for the xorg stack
<willcooke> oh, nice.  In which case 1 xmir per app sounds reasonable
<davidcalle> Oh, interesting
<seb128> the xmir deb is less than 900k
<seb128> but unsure if it brings depends in etc
<seb128> so likely under the 10M number
<seb128> in any case it's probably not tht much to copy
<pitti> bonjour seb128 ! trop de biÃ¨re hier soir ? :-)
<seb128> pitti, salut ! un peu ;-) je suis en France cette semaine donc j'ai des horaires dÃ©calÃ©es
<hikiko> seb128, ping :)
<seb128> hey hikiko, how are you?
<hikiko> good :) you?
<seb128> good as well
<seb128> thanks
<hikiko> seb128, if you have a moment can you help me find out what I did wrong with my ppa (or create a new from scratch, whatever is faster)?
<seb128> sure,what's the issue?
<hikiko> here's what I did:
<hikiko> well the issue is
<hikiko> I apt-get update
<hikiko> and there aren't any new packages there was only a compiz one although I pushed nux, compiz, unity
<hikiko> and then I can't start u7
<hikiko> (which is normal I guess)
<hikiko> I suppose I've done something wrong with the versions
<hikiko> https://ufuntu.wordpress.com/2016/06/10/creating-an-ubuntu-desktop-ppa/ here are the steps I followed to create the ppa
<hikiko> https://launchpad.net/~hikiko/+archive/ubuntu/lowgfx
<hikiko> and here's the ppa
<hikiko> +I don't know how to push new changes to the ppa :)
<seb128> the 3 packages are there
<hikiko> yes
<hikiko> but I had a vm
<hikiko> and installed the ppa
<hikiko> and then ran apt-get update/upgrade
<hikiko> and only compiz updated
<hikiko> not nux, compiz and unity as they should
<seb128> you are sure you don't have unity?
<seb128> can you do "dpkg -l | grep unity"?
<hikiko> yes, give me a moment to start the vm
<hikiko> ouch found a million packages :)
<seb128> dpkg -l | grep "unity "
<seb128> ?
<hikiko> let me pastebin
<hikiko> ah ok sec
<hikiko> ii  unity                                      7.5.0+16.10.20160606.2-0ubuntu5                     amd64        Interface designed for efficiency of space and interaction.
<seb128> so you have the ppa version
<hikiko> yep :s
<hikiko> so the problem is in the ppa?
<seb128> seems so
<seb128> try looking at your unity log
<seb128> in .cache/upstart/unity7
<seb128> need to go for a small erand, back in 10 min or so
<hikiko> sure seb128, btw I don't see anything unusual there, thanks a lot! I'll investigate :)
<ksamak> Trevinho: seen the 0.9.13.0 release, i'll get to work again on packaging for debian today!
<hikiko> Trevinho, ping :)
<hikiko> (we all want you for something today)
<Trevinho> hikiko: hi
<Trevinho> ksamak: cool
<seb128> hey Trevinho
<hikiko> Trevinho, I wanted to ask you if you agree to SRU compiz as it is without the lgfx option and put the current u7 branches (you review) to my ppa as they are (with the new MPs). I was thinking that this is the easiest since we are going to do the .profile solution afterwards, because we won't change anything to u7 and then I'll have to delete the 10 lines that set the settings in UnityScreen constructor and put them in the .profile
<ksamak> Trevinho: so it's a 0.9.13.0 , not a 0.9.12.3 ?
<seb128> Trevinho, how are you? sorry for the game :-/
<hikiko> it seems to be the faster to me
<ksamak> seb128: aaahhh... i lost
<seb128> ksamak, ?
<hikiko> by "we won't change anything to u7" I mean the trunk (official release) I'll only change the ppa
<ksamak> seb128: http://losethegame.com/
<seb128> hikiko, there is no error in the unity log? did you try to start ccsm to see if the unity plugin is activated?
<hikiko> unityshell is not activated
<hikiko> and there's no error
<seb128> does it work if you try to activate it?
<hikiko> it's weird it seems activated and I can't uncheck it
<seb128> weird
<seb128> hikiko, it's good optimization, it doesn't even display the ui anymore ;-)
<hikiko> lol
<hikiko> well if I select in advanced automatic plugin sorting I am able to check and uncheck the unityshell
<hikiko> progress
<hikiko> (but still makes no difference)
<Trevinho> seb128: hey... I'm ok.. Well, it was sad. I mean, we never felt (as a nation) so connected with this national team which for the first time was considered nothing and actually played well. We could have continued the game for days without getting one more goal. Germany won just because of luck at the end. But it has been a nice jurney.
<Trevinho> hikiko: as for the profile thing, I've already prepared one. I want now to fix the unity7.conf upstart job and I think we can go with that
<hikiko> so Trevinho what do you suggest? that we use the proper solution directly in the trunk?
<seb128> Trevinho, right, though Germany deserved to win, they score one goal and you have free-penalty-gift
<Trevinho> Yes, we can't release to SRU something without it hitting trunk before
<hikiko> (I have no objections if we can do that quickly)
<hikiko> Trevinho, also, will I be able to modify the lowgfx profile? I think there are a few more changes we can do like in the showdesktop plugin
<Trevinho> seb128: well, they deserved... But really they did nothing a part that lucky goal. We made a trap, and they couldn't do anything
<hikiko> (+thanks you work on that! :D)
<Trevinho> seb128: the penalty... Well, if a player uses hands in that way... At those levels... wow :-D
<ogra_> Trevinho, well, you have to admit that they copied the italian style perfectly :)
<Trevinho> ogra_: I agree, not that perfectly, but that's the way to play...
<ogra_> heh
<seb128> Trevinho, he had the hands in the air to show he wasn't making a fault
<Trevinho> ogra_: although I was expecting more from the world champions... Or we've been stronger than i thought, or germany isn't that great :-P
<seb128> Trevinho, it was not a wanted move toward the ball
<seb128> France made one of those yesterday and referee said it was not voluntar and said to keep playing
<Trevinho> seb128: it's fault. I'm a referee. And if you've to control hands also if you don't try to cath the ball. Having hands in the wrong position to block the space, is a fault.
<ogra_> seb128, he enlarged the body surface, so the penalty was okayish
<Trevinho> seb128: it has not to be. Also if you cover the space, it's fault.
<hikiko> lol, football... :D
<Trevinho> seb128: as ogra_ says.
<ogra_> seb128, i think the refree actually has some wiggle room there to decide it wasnt fault though ...
<seb128> right
* Trevinho changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> anyway, touch match
<seb128> and sucking penalties
<seb128> how to miss 7 of those
<Trevinho> Tired players
<ogra_> well
<Trevinho> really, everybody ran like crazy during the match
<ogra_> your most awake player missed most spectacular
<Trevinho> All the attackers were defending too
<Trevinho> ogra_: yeah... He tried to troll your great GK, he failed.... :-(
<ogra_> heh, yeah
<Trevinho> but it's something you've to do in the field... As if it works, then you're the hero
<seb128> if it doesn't you are the zero though ;-)
<ogra_> what i found worse was that the in-game penalty didnt get repeated ... he clearly stopped when running which isnt allowed anymore
<Trevinho> A risk you have to deal with
<Trevinho> ogra_: I think it's allowed now
<ogra_> not for this euro afaik
<Trevinho> ogra_: you can't block your self, but you can slow down the run
<Trevinho> somewhat a tricky thing though.
<ogra_> (though i dont know the rules, only what the commenters say)
<Trevinho> I've seen examples of what is allowed and what not, and.... I hardly see the differences sometimes
<ogra_> heh, yeah
<Trevinho> commenters aren't really very aware of things..
<Trevinho> Even ours were claming some off-sides that were really not there
<ogra_> yeah
<hikiko> Trevinho...
<Trevinho> (now you've to touch the ball, unless you don't interfere with a defensor... for example)
<Trevinho> hikiko: yeah? :)
<ogra_> lol
<hikiko> Trevinho, 1- will we merge the profile to trunk so all changes will be there
<Trevinho> hikiko: yes
<hikiko> 2- will I be able to make some changes afterwards
<hikiko> becasue I want to change the showdesktop plugin as well
<hikiko> and maybe a few more things
<Trevinho> what in showdesktop?
<Trevinho> the fading?
<hikiko> the durations
<hikiko> yep
<hikiko> there's fade there too
<Trevinho> hikiko: mh, are we using that plugin or is it something in unity itself? Since I don't remember if showdesktop plugin is enabled
<Trevinho> (it isn't here=
<hikiko> it's in compiz
<hikiko> oh wait the profile will only contain the unity settings?
<Trevinho> hikiko: mh, it is, but I think it's not used by unity profile
<Trevinho> hikiko: confirmed... fade there is in unityshell
<hikiko> yes
<Trevinho> hikiko: I think you can proposse a change to that quite quickly, providing a ccsm option for unityshell, isn't it?
<hikiko> yep
<hikiko> like for the others
<Trevinho> hikiko: if you can by 3-4 hours, then do that and I'll include the change in the unity-lowgfx profile
<hikiko> sure
<Trevinho> hikiko: this is what I've set so far http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/18440832/
<Trevinho> hikiko: if there's anything else that you suggest or that I missed, let me know...
<hikiko> sure I'll push that change and get a look to the other plugins
<happyaron> seb128: mind to subscribe desktop-bugs to network-manager-openvpn?
<Trevinho> seb128: since Laney is at debconf, can you ack some compiz pkg changes (well, just adding files, nothing related to control files
<seb128> happyaron, can do
<seb128> Trevinho, yeah, you can just ask on the channel, Laney might be online at time as well, see happyaron is ;-)
<seb128> but yeah I can
<Trevinho> ta
<Trevinho> hikiko: https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/compiz/unity-lowgfx-profile/+merge/299029
<hikiko> Trevinho, I think it's safe to remove the fade as well
<hikiko> it's for the fading windows
<Trevinho> hikiko: nope, it handles the dark windows when they're blocked
<Trevinho> hikiko: but I've rmoved the animation
<Trevinho> hikiko: it would be trivial to move it to unity, but for now this is enough I think
<hikiko> mmm :) ok! then next fix will be an option to disable the fade of the fading windows, I didn't know that it's used somewhere
<hikiko> because when I disabled it I had no issues :)
<hikiko> Trevinho, we don't need to move it I think, I'll just add an option there too
<Trevinho> hikiko: no, no... I've disabled the animation alread
<Trevinho> [fade]
<Trevinho> s0_fade_mode = 1
<Trevinho> s0_fade_time = 1
<hikiko> oh :) yeah
<Trevinho> if theres' some optimization to do, feel free... but this is already enough
<hikiko> ok
<hikiko> yep
<hikiko> we need 1 step
<hikiko> :D
<Trevinho> hikiko: ok, go for that, but the showdesktop in unity has more prio
<hikiko> Trevinho, can I top apprive it?
<Trevinho> hikiko: if you think so, sure
<Trevinho> I'd like to have a silo ppa ready by today
<Trevinho> as it takes still couple of days to land
<Trevinho> plus the SRU
<hikiko> we add any other options later let's just have those and I ll send you the showdesktop in a while
<hikiko> approved
<ksamak> Trevinho: i let you (or someone) review the size modifier for switcher feat. tell me what you guys think about it.
<ksamak> it addresses visual impairement. some people need really big printouts, obviously.
<hikiko> Trevinho, I think it's worth changing the opacity too
<hikiko> because we skip the blending calculations
<hikiko> (for transparency)
<Trevinho> hikiko: which setting is it?
<hikiko> let me see
 * Trevinho at lunch, I'll check that layer
<hikiko> window_opacity
<Trevinho> Later*
<hikiko> I'll set it to 1
<Trevinho> In fade plugin?
<hikiko> no no in showdesktop
<Trevinho> Showdesktop plugin is not used. It's done in unity
<hikiko> are you sure?
<hikiko> I've just changed the settings
<hikiko> and they work
<Trevinho> Weird. It's disabled in both profiles
<hikiko> ew
<hikiko> I disabled it and got a different effect no idea why it was enabled in both my computers
<hikiko> alright let me disable the unity fade too... I had just put an option to the showdesktop plugin \m/
<Laney> hi again!
<desrt> happy monday!
<desrt> irccloud hashes Trevinho and hikiko to the same colour, which is a particularly awful pairing to do that to
<Trevinho> I've the same for you (desrt) and Laney
<hikiko> when will you switch to a normal and configurable client like hexchat or at least irssi? :p
<desrt> ya.  larsu mentioned this.
<Trevinho> Hey Laney, how is SA?
<desrt> i switched *from* irssi :)
<Trevinho> Need to build a cli UI for irccloud
<hikiko> and you see the results :)
<hikiko> desrt, it's time to go back!
<hikiko> :p
<hikiko> happy monday btw
<desrt> i'd prefer that one of you just change your nick
<Laney> what up
<desrt> we would save some time that way :)
<Laney> it's sunny Trevinho
<Laney> and most plesant
<Laney> pleasant
<desrt> perfect
<desrt> thanks
<desrt_> :D
<desrt> ugh.  same colour as laney.
<Laney> i've had this nickname on IRC for 21 years
<Laney> cold dead hands etc
<desrt> you're old.
<hikiko> Trevinho, I think I've fixed it it's *much* faster
 * desrt tries to think back
<desrt> i think i've had this one closer to 18....
<hikiko> but better get a look :)
 * desrt is old too
<hikiko> I am uploading..
<Laney> \o/
<desrt> hikiko: you'll be happy to know that i recently signed up for gmail
 * desrt is clearly not afraid of changing her online service arrangements
<hikiko> Trevinho, I think that when the desktop appears there's still some fade :s it's very quick though
<hikiko> desrt, why would I be happy?
<Trevinho> hikiko: Yes, but I think that's done inside unityshell plugin.
<hikiko> I don't even sync my contacts to google :) +I don't even login to the apps on my phone
<desrt> hikiko: your encouragements to change my services to better things :)
<Trevinho> I can check that later
<hikiko> Trevinho, yeah I've done the change there
<hikiko> :)
<hikiko> enjoy your lunch anyway
<seb128> hey desrt Laney
<seb128> how are you? had a good w.e?
<hikiko> Trevinho, here: https://code.launchpad.net/~hikiko/unity/unity.showdesktop/+merge/299036
<seb128> is desrt to debconf as well?
<desrt> no.  i took a pass.
<seb128> Laney, how was the flight? and how is s-a and debconf?
<desrt> but i will travel to europe soon (next week)
<seb128> k
<seb128> it's only happy_aron and l_aney from our team?
<hikiko> seb128, yes
<seb128> which would make sense, nobody else from the team uploads to Debian I think?
<hikiko> there should be a debconf for those who download from Debian too...
<desrt> there is.  it's called diversity sponsorship.
<seb128> lol
<hikiko> lol
<desrt> seriously... their explicit intent there is to attract people like downstream distributors
<seb128> "they should give you free holidays in addition of the free OS"
<seb128> ;-)
<hikiko> :D
<seb128> right, contributors/integrators, not users
<desrt> either way... ubuntu, as a project, is definitely a downloader of debian :)
<seb128> yeah, I think it makes sense to have Ubuntu distro people there
<desrt> i met a lot of tails people in 2015 (first year of diversity sponsorship)
<seb128> I would probably have joined if it was not so much travel
<desrt> was really cool to talk to a debian derivative about an upstream desktop at the debian conference
<seb128> :-)
<desrt> same........
<hikiko> I've never been to any open source conference tbh (apart from the local fosscomms and our ubuntu conferences), it sounds cool :)
<desrt> you should do FOSDEM next year
<desrt> or GUADEC this year :)
<hikiko> you have to be a gnome developer I guess
<Laney> seb128: good, got some sleep on the flight so wasn't too dead on saturday
<desrt> the U in GUADEC seems to be pretty explicit about that not being true :)
<desrt> but uh... seeing as you aren't a user, either... ;)
<hikiko> hahaha
<desrt> GUHADEC   (gnome users, haters, and developers...)
<ogra_> the potential that it could turn him into one should be enough of a reason ;
<ogra_> ;)
<hikiko> I am not a hater either!
<hikiko> her*
<ogra_> oops
<desrt> haters gonna hate.... (and then deny hatin')
<ogra_> hikiko, lol, damn .. you are eleni ... i didnt remember your nick :P
<hikiko> :D
<davmor2> desrt: if it helps I hate all you devs that's why I break your stuff ;)
<davmor2> desrt: just ask ogra_ and willcooke they'll confirm it :)
<desrt> ogra_: better not to assume, as a general rule...
<ogra_> desrt, what now ?
<desrt> ogra_: best not to assume the gender of the person you are speaking to if you don't know them
<hikiko> I don't mind :)
<ogra_> desrt, no, m'am :)
<hikiko> hahahaha
 * desrt .... lets that one slide :p
<ogra_> davmor2, i approve everything, always :)
<davmor2> ogra_: and that's why it breaks and then I hate you for it breaking :P
<ogra_> davmor2, lies, you love me for breaking things ... ;)
<davmor2> ogra_: no I don't it's my job to break things you take away all my fun by breaking before I see it :P
<davmor2> ogra_: but I do love you for adding bugs to keep me happy :)
<ogra_> :)
<hikiko> Trevinho, (for later) the branch works and there's no fade :) I just had animation and fade windows enabled and didn't realize it was coming by there, you can review it when you come back :)
<hikiko> so next step: fade windows!
<hikiko> going for lunch too:)
 * qengho Zzz.
<alexarnaud> Dear all
<alexarnaud> willcooke: Will you send me an answer about Compiz accessibility?
<willcooke> alexarnaud, as I said in my email, once the current project is complete
<alexarnaud> willcooke: OK, so I forgot the email so. I've remember you have seen your boos and after you will send us a reply. So as I remember I've not received an email after that. So if the answer if no, I note that in my head and I will no disturb you about this subject. Thanks :)
<happyaron> seb128: mind to subscribe it? needed for nm-openvpn's MIR
<seb128> happyaron, desktop-bugs is subscribed
<seb128> thanks for doing the MIR work
<seb128> it's the team we usually for those so it should be good enough
<happyaron> ok, didn't see the team subscription just now
<happyaron> ty!
<seb128> I just did it ;-)
<seb128> thanks the reminder
<seb128> yw!
<Trevinho> hikiko: so.. here's the new branch, it applies the low_gfx to more animations https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/lowgfx-mode-less-effects/+merge/299059
<Trevinho> hikiko: please review it
<ksamak> Trevinho: there's also a new branch here, easy to test and review ;D  https://code.launchpad.net/~ksamak/compiz/switcher_add_size_multiplier
<Trevinho> ksamak: ok, thanks
<willcooke>  night all
<hikiko> Trevinho, the only part I didn't understand is the nux::Animator, why you had to use it in standalone previews...
<hikiko> I'll look at it tomorrow
<hikiko> it's already top approved by andyrock anyway :)
<Trevinho> hikiko: because without that no animation events are triggered
<hikiko> that in standalone?
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-07-05
<qengho> fg
<qengho> So, I'm flipping chromium to use more recent debhelper, which REALLY wants me to use dh_strip differently and make dbgsym packages. I'm trying to figure those out. How do those workk with PPAs?
<qengho> Should I kill the old -dbg packages immediately? Is that a requirement?
 * qengho lunch
<hikiko> Hi
<robert_ancell> qengho, I'm pretty sure -dbg is dead now that Debian has started using -dbgsym
<RAOF> qengho: I believe that PPAs get dbgsym packages built for them (or possibly you can opt-in for them?)
<qengho> RAOF: PPAs don't have it by default, but an owner can turn it on in PPA +edit.
<qengho> RAOF: I keep wanting to type "ROUS". :(
<ROUS> Hah! ROUS is already registered :)
<pitti> Good morning
<Laney> ahoy
<willcooke> Trevinho, hikiko - morning.  Is there a way to force U7 in to low gfx mode?  So we don't rely on it detecting missing features?
<willcooke> morning Laney
<didrocks> hey Laney, willcooke, pitti :)
<hikiko> yes
<hikiko> willcooke, you do this:
<willcooke> morning didrocks
<hikiko> export LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=1
<hikiko> and you start u7 from that terminal
<hikiko> or!
<pitti> hey Laney and willcooke, bonjour didrocks ! how are you guys?
<hikiko> you run ccsm
<hikiko> and in unityshell plugin settings
 * pitti waves to hikiko too
<hikiko> you select the low gfx mode
<hikiko> hi pitti didrocks Laney :D
<hikiko> willcooke, last option in General unityshell
<hikiko> but if you want to check the new features, better open a terminal and run:
<hikiko> export LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=1
<hikiko> unity --replace ccp&
<hikiko> I don't know if they are merged already though
<Laney> hey pitti willcooke didrocks hikiko!
<Laney> the dream team
<Laney> today it is raining
<hikiko> how is south africa?
<Laney> but I'm grrrrrrrrreat!
<hikiko> do you have winter there?
<Laney> "winter"
<Laney> you'd think it was the worst weather on earth from what people were saying before we came
<Laney> but yesterday it was 23
<hikiko> lol
<willcooke> thanks hikiko, perfect
<Laney> cheese and wine party last night
<pitti> Laney: just as Europe starts getting real summer..
<Laney> me and ximion plotted the new appstream generator
<pitti> Laney: ooh, nice! any SA specialities?
<Laney> lots!
<Laney> import regulations meant that you couldn't really bring cheese in
<Laney> so it was mostly SA stuff
<Laney> salty stuff, soft stuff, hard stuff, herby stuff
<Laney> biltong-y things from various animals
<pitti> they have a quarantine on food?
<Laney> and some shady home brewed spirits from attendees
<Laney> :)
<pitti> haha
<pitti> Laney: Salmiaki again? I still remember that from last year
<Laney> didn't see that this time sadly
<pitti> maybe better
<Laney> there were 3 homebrewed bottles of rakia
<Laney> labelled 30%, 50%, 70%
<pitti> "so, we have this really complicated bug in the appstream gen... ah screw it, more salmiakki!"
 * Laney only tried the middle one which was hardcore enough for me
<Laney> it's "how could you do this for PPAs / bikesheds?"
<pitti> Laney: the 70% is the one you need several mugs for to carry it around, right?
<Laney> mugs of painkillers for the next day
<Laney> pitti: so, summer you say?
<Laney> http://www.bbc.com/weather/ng5 h[D"mm"
<Laney> oops
<didrocks> Laney: was it as good as cheese and wine from last year? :)
<Laney> didrocks: not as late, not as much headache the next morning :)
<Laney> but no didrocks, so obviously it was way worse
<didrocks> :p
<Trevinho> Morning
<Trevinho> willcooke: forcing the low gfx mode... Easy.
<hikiko> willcooke, also if you need the lowgfx from the beginning maybe ctrl+alt+f1, login, export LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=1, systemctl restart lightdm.service
<Trevinho> willcooke: I wanted to write it in the mail, but with the landing PPA, just add this
<Trevinho> cat ~/.config/upstart/pre-unity7.conf
<Trevinho> start on starting unity7
<Trevinho> stop on desktop-end
<Trevinho> pre-start script
<Trevinho>  initctl set-env -g UNITY_LOW_GFX_MODE=1
<Trevinho> end script
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho
<Trevinho> or setting LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=1 should be the same
<andyrock> morning all
<hikiko> Trevinho, andyrock https://code.launchpad.net/~hikiko/unity/unity.disable-shadows-lowgfx/+merge/299111
<hikiko> good morning andyrock
<hikiko> I disabled the shadows in low gfx
<hikiko> ...
<hikiko> you renamed the GetLowGfxMode()?
<hikiko> :/
<hikiko> I have to merge it to Trevinho's branch I guess?
<andyrock> hikiko: yep
<hikiko> okie
<andyrock> do we really need to disable them
<andyrock> ?
<hikiko> well, we skip filling the shadow textures
<hikiko> I don't know
<hikiko> I'd disable them in low gfx
<andyrock> oki
<hikiko> andyrock, we can always make it configurable later
<seb128> good morning desktopers (sorry a bit late, did some offline work and then had to go for some errands)
<willcooke> morning seb128
<seb128> hey willcooke
<pitti> bonjour seb128 !
<seb128> salut pitti
<seb128> how are things around?
<pitti> seb128: quite well, thanks! I'm slowly understanding NM config :)
<seb128> our new NM maintainer!
<pitti> user, my friend, user! :-)
<seb128> lol
<Trevinho> hikiko: I'm not sure disabling them all is fine. In my unity low gfx branch I've already reduced them a lot.
<Trevinho> hikiko: have you tired the ppa?
<hikiko> Trevinho, why not completely remove them?
<hikiko> It doesn't look bad without
<Trevinho> hikiko: it's hard to discern windows
<Trevinho> As we've no borders
<Trevinho> I've reduced them a lot... It shouldn't be expensive
<hikiko> ok
<seb128> hey Trevinho hikiko
<hikiko> hi seb128
<Trevinho> seb128: hi Sebastian!
<seb128> Trevinho, *ien*
<seb128> ;-)
<Trevinho> seb128: ups, sorry :-P
<seb128> no worry!
<alexarnaud> Dear seb128, Trevinho, willcooke, didrocks and all :) !
<seb128> lut alexarnaud
<Trevinho> alexarnaud: hey
<didrocks> hey alexarnaud
<ksamak> alexarnaud: hoy XD
<Trevinho> seb128, Laney: if you want check the deb changes and publish, feel free https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/1619 ;-)
<seb128> Trevinho, you removed gnome-settings-daemon as an alternative in the upstart job, is that wanted? it's not documented in the changelog
<Trevinho> seb128: mh, it's not needed for ages...
<Trevinho> seb128: there's even an upstart job for it AFAIK
<seb128> Trevinho, yeah, I'm not saying it's an issue, I just don't like unrelated changes to be sneaked in without being mentioned in the changelog
<seb128> anyway not a blocked for landing
<seb128> but you are going to need to do without that one in the SRU or at least explain in the changelog that it's wanted and the rational
<seb128> Trevinho, should I press publish then?
<Trevinho> seb128: mh, yeah... changelog is sometimes too short for infos :-)
<seb128> there is no limitations there
<Trevinho> seb128: if you believe so... :-)
<seb128> Trevinho, k, publishing pressed
<willcooke>  Trevinho can I find out if low gfx mode is on by doing a "echo $UNITY_LOW_GFX_MODE"
<Trevinho> willcooke: what you mean=?
<Trevinho> willcooke: but... No, in case it's set you can't get by that if done with auto-detection
<seb128> vag
<seb128> bah
<willcooke> Trevinho, how can I find out if Unity has decided to enable low gfx mode if I haven't forced it
<Trevinho> willcooke: it's $COMPIZ_CONFIG_PROFILE=ubuntu-lowgfx
<willcooke> nice one, thanks Trevinho
<seb128> why does it say publishing failed?
<Trevinho> seb128: mh
<Trevinho> let me check
<seb128> https://ci-train.ubuntu.com/job/ubuntu-landing-002-2-publish/2/console
<seb128> says success
<Trevinho> seb128: maybe because Automated Signoff 	Failed
<seb128> ah
<seb128>  2016-07-05 13:42:38 +0200 (britney-bot) britney_signoff: Failed
<Trevinho> seb128: https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/static/britney/ticket-1619/landing-002-yakkety/excuses.html
<seb128> it's stll building on armhf
<seb128> did you just retry it?
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> it landed anyway
<Trevinho> mh, no I didn't retry
<seb128> it's on yakkety-changes
<Trevinho> seb128: maybe it has to publish debs ?
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/7.5.0+16.10.20160705.4-0ubuntu1
<seb128> dunno but it's retrying build
<seb128> so let's see
<Trevinho> willcooke: do you want me to prepare a ppa too?
<Trevinho> willcooke: for xenial, I mean... although it's coming in https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-063/+packages
<Trevinho> but it might be temporary
<willcooke> Trevinho, I can wait
<willcooke> I can test on a Y VM
<Trevinho> willcooke: ok good
<Trevinho> willcooke: the xenial ppa should be reeady though
<willcooke> thx Trevinho
<Trevinho> willcooke: if you don't want me to do a copy of it
<Trevinho> but that should last for the whole SRU process, so not just few days
<willcooke> sounds good
<willcooke> doh.  I installed lubuntu
<seb128> snap version?
<willcooke> nah, for my vm to test the speed ups
<seb128> oh, k
<Trevinho> willcooke: sru packages should be built for xenial too
<willcooke> Trevinho, that was quick, thanks
<willcooke> bah, looks like 16.10 daily is broken.  segfault in dpkg I think
<willcooke> seb128, anything I should do before blowing it away and trying again? ^  (I can't seem to get to vty1)
<seb128> willcooke, hum, I don't know sorry
<willcooke> seb128, np
<seb128> there was a buggy dpkg uploaded yesterday but it was fixed in the morning
<seb128> unsure if that's the bug you are seeing
<Trevinho> willcooke: are you going to test the xenial SRU silo or should I?
<willcooke> Trevinho, just about to test on a VM, but if you would test as well that would be good
<seb128> I'm going to give it a try as well
<willcooke> Trevinho, with your upstart script I still couldn't force low_gfx mode
<seb128> Trevinho, the armhf build retry on yakkety worked!
<Trevinho> willcooke: you speak of Xenial or yakkety?
<Trevinho> seb128: nice
<willcooke> Trevinho, Xenial
<Trevinho> willcooke: Mh, weird it didn't work... What you get in upstart unity7. Log?
<willcooke> Trevinho, just updating this machine, sec
<willcooke> hm, that said - I'm not seeing blur behind the dash, so maybe it is working
<seb128> what made you say it's not working? expecting greater difference?
<willcooke> seb128, when I echo $COMPIZ_CONFIG_PROFILE it says "ubuntu" not "ubuntu-lowgfx"
<seb128> where/how did you change/set it?
<seb128> or I guess you are trying in a vm and you expect it to autowork?
<Trevinho> mhmh
<willcooke> via the upstart script T_revinho posted (at 09:13 BST)
<seb128> what vm/do you have 3d there?
<Trevinho> willcooke: is it running? Add an echo on it to verify
<willcooke> seb128, it's a virtualbox vm
<willcooke> Trevinho, sorry, does not compute.  Add the echo where?
<Trevinho> willcooke: to the upstart job you added in ~/.config/upstart
<willcooke> Trevinho, yeah, but where in there?  just inside the script section?  And where does it get logged to?
<Trevinho> willcooke: yes, inside the script. output will go in ~/.cache/upstart/name-of-the-conf-file.log
<willcooke> Trevinho, oki, done.  Can I just restart lightdm to make it run?
<willcooke> ls
<willcooke> oops
<Trevinho> willcooke: restarting lightdm is saner as a test
 * Trevinho tries this in his 2nd laptop too
<willcooke> Trevinho, oki, I see the output in the log
<willcooke> s/output/echo
<willcooke> but
<Trevinho> willcooke: anything from unity7.log instead?
<willcooke> Trevinho, nothing about low gfx - and just in case I'm making things very confusing for you, I haven *not* install the silo yet - I want to do some benchmarking first
<seb128> confusing
<seb128> it's normal the profile says "ubuntu" if you don't have the silo
<seb128> the lowgfx profile is a new one added in that silo
<willcooke> there we go
<seb128> current archive version turns off some effects but doesn't have a special profile
<willcooke> so my original question remains then :)  How can I tell if non-silo Unity has decided to enable low gfx mode or not?
<seb128> just benchmark what you see and try upgrade ;-)
<seb128> ah
<seb128> unsure if we write that info anywhere
<seb128> Trevinho probably knows if we do though
<willcooke> so probably looking at the dash blur is as good as anything then?
<seb128> yes
<willcooke> cool, thanks seb128
<seb128> yw!
<Trevinho> willcooke: the profile that has been chosen is visible in the unity7.log or in the variable
<Trevinho> willcooke: also the unity7.log will show the unity support test results
<Trevinho> anyway, SRU ppa works fine in my testing machine too, so... I'd approve that and go through the process
<seb128> Trevinho, the question was if/how we can tell if the current xenial version is optimizing for lowgfx
<seb128> no specific profile there
<Trevinho> seb128: if there are animations or shadows, then it's using the old one
<Trevinho> shadows on windows..
<Trevinho> the one in the panel is still the same
<Trevinho> or the switcher detail...
<seb128> Trevinho, "old one"?
<Trevinho> seb128: the one not optimized :)
<seb128> k
<seb128> I think you don't understand the question
<seb128> though the question is probably not important
<seb128> it was basically "if I use current trusty/xenial there are some lowgfx optimization done, how can one tell if that kicked in or not"
<willcooke> installed!
<willcooke> feels snappier
<Trevinho> seb128: eh, there's no programmatic way, you can tell that by the fact that dash and other views are opaque and not blurred
<desrt> willcooke: placebo effect =)
<seb128> Trevinho, thanks for confirming, that's what we assumed ;-)
<Trevinho> yeah, sorry... I misread the questions :)
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> Trevinho, willcooke, it feels nicer here, still slower than native rendering but at least you don't have the skipping frames feeling
<seb128> opening the dash is nicer
<seb128> before you could see like 10 steps jumping
<seb128> now there is no lag
<muktupavels> Trevinho: https://code.launchpad.net/~albertsmuktupavels/compiz/lp1530277/+merge/299156
<seb128> hikiko, Trevinho, good work!
<Trevinho> yeah, animations are off now
<Trevinho> muktupavels: does that needs a FIXME comment to? I mean, isn't this a way to say that there's no support for scaling yet?
<Trevinho> seb128, willcooke: if you want to see how real sw rendering works there you can instead export the LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=1 var
<muktupavels> Trevinho: well this does require more work to add full HiDPI support, but it will be enough to get Metacity themes working.
<Trevinho> muktupavels: ok, add some comments about that then
<muktupavels> what do you want to see in comment? Mutter and Metacity use same thing, that line will remain there... So fixme comment sound wrong - it will not get removed.
<Trevinho> seb128, willcooke: also for resizing I've moved back to the rectangle mode... I've tried the normal mode here, and it's still quite fast, but maybe it's better to be conservative, and in case people could use the normal one. What you think?
<muktupavels> Trevinho: gtk-window-decorator probably will need something similar to this - https://git.gnome.org/browse/metacity/commit/?id=e6cf7fd3f8edd74eadf38ff0ccf326817605850c
<muktupavels> Trevinho: same or similar commant like in this commit -https://git.gnome.org/browse/metacity/commit/?id=a1b96fd6a8ff7187297f6ae2051b33cdb176c5d4 ?
<seb128> Trevinho, yeah, I saw that, real time resizing isn't too laggy here but is a bit so unsure, looks fine with the rectangle one
<Trevinho> seb128: here too isn't laggy... But not sure that's because I've powerful machines
<seb128> mine is a 6 years old i5
<seb128> which is quite slow for nowadays standards
<seb128> but it's not a netbook
<seb128> hum
<seb128> Trevinho, willcooke, unsure if that's a regression or a problem in my vm but I activated the workspaces in u-c-c appaerance and I don't get the icon in the launcher nor extra workspace when trying to ctrl-alt-direction
<Trevinho> mmhmh
<Trevinho> seb128: in low-gfx mode?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> could be a bug not having to do with the profile
<seb128> it's a vm so I didn't try the high-gfx mode
<willcooke> sorry, was in a meeting, reading
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, I guess it has to do with profile...
 * Trevinho prepares a patch for UCC
<Trevinho> it has to read the profile in use
<Trevinho> I didn't think about that....
<Trevinho> So, yeah.. i guess we need to read the env, and fallback to unity if not defined
 * Trevinho tried that only from ccsm -_-
<seb128> we can't have workspace in lowgfx?
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, but ucc is changing the setttings in the wrong profile
<Trevinho> seb128: I wonder you can't change also the launcher size from ccsm
<seb128> going to some errands, back in half an hour
<seb128> Trevinho, can't you change it in the current profile?
<seb128> I guess that's your patch you want to do?
<seb128> get the current profile and write there
<seb128> btw that's what we said during the call
<Trevinho> seb128: yes
<seb128> having different profile leads to that class of issues
<willcooke> Trevinho, @ rectangle - +1 to keep it like that
<Trevinho> I know
<willcooke> i.e. keep rectangle mode on in low gfx
<Trevinho> seb128: of course we could keep track of the previous profile and sync in case, but imho it's too hassle
<Trevinho> seb128: fixing ucc is easy though
<seb128> right
<seb128> unity tweaks as well? ;-)
<seb128> dunno what they are doing
<seb128> anyway need to jump out for a bit
<seb128> brb
<Trevinho> seb128: once you're back... fix for that is in https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/1635 (see related MP)
<Trevinho> seb128: ah, please fix commit message on https://code.launchpad.net/~lathiat/unity-control-center/lp1304388/+merge/297137, I've not the powers
<Trevinho> seb128: prepared also the SRU branch (after syncing and creating a 16.04 branch, that you should mark as default for the milestone): https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity-control-center/x-sru3/+merge/299174
<seb128> Trevinho, back, looking
<seb128> hum?
<willcooke> ding ding
<willcooke> meeting time
<qengho> oh hai
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jul  5 15:30:45 2016 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic:
<willcooke> Roll call:  andyrock (out), attente, desrt,  dgadomski, fjkong, happyaron (conference), hikiko, laney (conference), qengho, seb128, sweet5hark, themuso (out), tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<Trevinho> o/
<Sweet5hark> aye
<FJKong> hey
<dgadomski> hey
<willcooke> I have andyrock's notes so lets' start
<willcooke> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: andyrock
<willcooke> # DONE:
<willcooke> |-- [BUG:1595698] Panel requires click+hold on secondary monitor to access menus
<willcooke> |-- [BUG:1578792] nautilus/files doesn't show up in the launcher when unpinned
<willcooke> |-- Fix Unity Compile Failure with pch disabled
<willcooke> |-- [BUG:1597706] Unity shell not drawn if show desktop is activated
<willcooke> and a window is in fullscreen mode
<willcooke> # WIP:
<willcooke> |-- [BUG:1575452] Copy/move dialog cannot be switched to
<willcooke> # OTHERS:
<willcooke> |-- Bug triaging
<willcooke> |-- Code reviews
<willcooke> [BUG:1599133] Blinking file manager icon when opening a device/volume window .
<willcooke> done ^
<willcooke> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: attente
<attente> finished the menu patches and submitted them upstream for review
<attente> doing some patch review of anpok's gtk-mir patches
<attente> (eof)
<willcooke> nicely done attente, thanks!
<willcooke> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: desrt
<willcooke> desrt, we'll come back round
<willcooke> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: FJKong
<FJKong> hi
<FJKong> finish some translation bug for MeiZu phone and still on processing bug#1588646 bug 1588675 1588660
<willcooke> oops, I missed you dgadomski, will come back
<ubot5> bug 1588675 in Canonical System Image ""Search location" and" Location " is not translated into Chinese." [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1588675
<FJKong> review bug#1534492 Can't use fcitx for Chinese with QtCreator Edit
<FJKong> tracing sogou IM indicator loading crash
<FJKong> of
<FJKong> e
<willcooke> thanks FJKong, did your phone arrive from Boston?
<FJKong> not yet
<FJKong> I send email to Nancy
<willcooke> oki thanks, let me know if it's still not there
<FJKong> ok
<willcooke> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: dgadomski
<dgadomski> hey, this week in the desktop area it's just:
<dgadomski> * found a bug #1598183, reported upstream, working on fixing it
<dgadomski> eof
<ubot5> bug 1598183 in gvfs "Operation not permitted while writing to symlinked fuse locations" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1598183
<willcooke> thanks dgadomski
<willcooke> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: happyaron
<willcooke> Are you around happyaron?  I am assuming not
<willcooke> 30s timeout...
<willcooke> #topic hikiko
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: hikiko
<willcooke> * fixes for low gfx mode
<willcooke> * reviews for low gfx mode
<willcooke> * oem documents
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: Laney
<willcooke> are you around Laney ?
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: qengho
<qengho> Hi hi hi!
<qengho> - Cr deb housekeeping:
<qengho> -- Syncing much of Debian's Cr package to Ubuntu. Use more system libs, gold lin
<qengho> ker, maybe not component build any more.
<qengho> -- debhelper compat update and move to dbgsym packages, killing dbg.
<qengho> - Finish debugging RPi Cr SEGV crash.
<qengho> - Finish Cr snap package.
<qengho> EOF
<willcooke> thanks qengho
<qengho> :)
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> can I pretend to not be around like everybody else? :-p
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> â¢ some xenial SRUs for .1 (update-notifier, gnome-menus, sponsored gtk+, reviewed unity-settings-daemon)
<seb128> â¢ interviews
<seb128> â¢ debugged snappy/gtk (cleaned up the common launcher) & qt (icons & menus missing) issues with d_idrocks
<seb128> â¢ started on the unity8 MIRs (building list, triaged it, pinged some people, filed some bugs)
<seb128> some more snapping debugging/experimenting
<seb128> that took most of my start of week but I didn't note down specifics, sorry
<seb128> looking at gvfs and xim
<seb128> </week>
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: Sweet5hark
<Sweet5hark> - more snap work: l10n, moved to plugins
<Sweet5hark> - security: CVE-2016-4324 was a pain
<Sweet5hark> - getting rcs in share for yakkety
<Sweet5hark> EOF
<willcooke> thanks Sweet5hark
<willcooke> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: TheMuso
<willcooke> * Upgraded to yakkety.
<willcooke> * Built and installed latest snapd from xenial-proposed for yakkety... Why is snapd not being updated for yakkety in lockstep with xenial?
<willcooke> * Finally got my first slightly complicated snap working, after a little help from reading other snaps and a derp on my part... Now onto another slightly complicated one, that will use the new optical-drive plug.
<willcooke> * Prepped to get PulseAudio 9.0 into yakkety, just waiting for the latest NMU version to appear in the debian archive before I can merge and upload.
<willcooke> * Snaps completed so far: flac (not uploaded anywhere yet), vorbis-tools (slightly complicated, but all seems ok so far).
<willcooke> * Next snaps on my agenda: cdparanoia (CD ripping library and tools)
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<seb128> TheMuso, "Why is snapd not being updated for yakkety in lockstep with xenial?" ... wdym? it is
<seb128> it's blocked in yakkety-proposed though
<seb128> you should know about proposed by now ;-)
<willcooke> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: Trevinho
<Trevinho> Â· Released compiz 0.9.13
<Trevinho> Â· Using triggers noawait in bamf
<Trevinho> Â· Created unity-lowgfx compiz config profile
<Trevinho> Â· Rewritten compiz damage code to use C++ vectors
<Trevinho> Â· Improved unity_support_test to consider llvmpipe as software rendering
<Trevinho> Â· Updated unity7 upstart job to use appropriate profile depending on graphic support
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed unity-control-center to change settings in current compiz profile
<Trevinho> Â· Landed (almost) new compiz, bamf, nux and unity
<Trevinho> Â· Created xenial branches for Nux, Compiz and UCC
<Trevinho> Â· Prepared SRU branches and landing silo for BAMF, compiz, libunity, unity, unity-control-center, unity-lens-applications and nux
<Trevinho> Â· Various reviews for unity and compiz
<Trevinho>   /EOF
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho :)
<willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<willcooke> - Landed Ubuntu review / snap authentication upstream
<willcooke> - Worked on paid snap support
<willcooke> - General GNOME Software fixes
<willcooke> - snapd bug filing and attempting to fix issues myself
<willcooke> - Prep for snap sprint
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-07-05 | Current topic: AOB
<willcooke> Not sure what happened to tkamppeter or desrt today - please let me have your updates by email.
<willcooke> let's wrap.
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Football (soccer) Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | tag "euro2016" for football flames
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jul  5 15:46:58 2016 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2016/ubuntu-desktop.2016-07-05-15.30.moin.txt
<seb128> or happyaron or Laney
 * Trevinho can go to the beach now :-P
<seb128> those people are conf not sending their summary!
<tkamppeter> Sorry, here I am:
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Started work on a new filter for text-only printers, in C (to be able to read the PPD) and with more useful PPD options.
<tkamppeter> - Printer Drivers as Snaps: Hangout meeting with Gustavo Niemeyer, Zygmunt Krynicki, Jamie Strandboge about how to snap printer drivers. Conclusion: Snap CUPS first and let driver snaps be plug-ins for the CUPS snap. Possible side effect CUPS as snapped core system component can lead others to snap other core system components and make distros totally modular.
<tkamppeter> - LSB SRU for Epsin printer drivers made it into Xenial. Finally.
<tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2016: Guide students through their projects
<tkamppeter> - Bugs
<tkamppeter> willcooke, will send it to you by e-mail, too.
<willcooke> tkamppeter, no worries - thats fine, thanks1
<seb128> Trevinho, ok, branches reviewed/acked
<seb128> on that note going for some exercice
<seb128> I'm going to be around a bit more later
<seb128> have a nice evening those who call it a day meanwhile
<Trevinho> seb128: danke
<willcooke> night
<TheMuso> seb128: Ugh you're right, I do know about proposed, totally forgot to look there...
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-07-06
<qengho> Zaoshanghao, good morning, everyone.
<hikiko> Hi
<qengho> hikiko: hi ki ko
<hikiko> hi qengho
<pitti> Good mornning
<hikiko> good morning pitti
<Trevinho> Morning
<willcooke> hey Trevinho
<andyrock> morning all
<seb128> hey andyrock, how are you?
<andyrock> hey seb128 trying to finish the branch of the copy dialog by the end of the day :D
<andyrock> you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<hikiko> Trevinho, since I accidentally fixed compiz's show desktop too I did an MP here: https://code.launchpad.net/~hikiko/compiz/compiz.shodesktop-skip-anim-option/+merge/299276 maybe people who use compiz on mate or other DEs want to skip the fade in showdesktop :)
<willcooke> seb128, I'm trying to rebuild u-c-c, but I don't want to make a whole .deb package, just a binary so I can test a patch.
<willcooke> when I run autogen and then make it's looking in /usr/local/share/foo for the ui instead of /usr/share/foo
<seb128> right
<willcooke> I had a look at the rules file, but I can't work out how to tweak that at build time
<seb128> --prefix=/usr
<willcooke> hm, I tried that and it didnt work
<seb128> ?
<willcooke> seb128, do that with ./configure --prefix=/usr right?
<seb128> correct
<willcooke> I'll try again
<Trevinho> seb128: hey
<Trevinho> seb128: can you publish this too https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/1614 ?
 * Trevinho fixes the bugs in the mean time
<Trevinho> hikiko: ok thanks.
<seb128> Trevinho, you ignored my comment about the upstart job and g-s-d, let's see if the SRU team blocks the SRU due to it
<Trevinho> seb128: I didn't ignore...
<seb128> well I said that it needs to go or to be documented in the changelog
<Trevinho> seb128: I really hope not... They're generally good people :-P
<seb128> it's still there and still undocumented
<seb128> well, if they do their work they should
<seb128> their job is to catch undocumented changes
<seb128> because those have no business being in a SRU
<seb128> they are more often than not errors
<seb128> they can't mind read that you wanted to remove that alternative and why
<seb128> and you didn't asset the potential impact
<seb128> anyway pressing the button, let's see
<willcooke> seb128, grr - make clean
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> willcooke, ;-)
<seb128> willcooke, working now?
<willcooke> better
<willcooke> but
<willcooke> Failed to look up menu_file for "/usr/etc/xdg/menus/unitycc.menu"
<seb128> lol
<Trevinho> seb128: triggering a rebuild because of that .... Mh, ok
<Trevinho> seb128: I'll add itt
<seb128> Trevinho, I published
<seb128> so too late for this round
<Trevinho> seb128: ah ok.
<seb128> sorry, you didn't seem open to do the change
<seb128> let's see what SRU team says
<seb128> willcooke, --sysconfdir=/etc
<seb128> willcooke, unsure why you don't simply build the package which use all the right flags/options
<seb128> easier than building 10 times and poking for what to do manually
<willcooke> but then I have to do the install / remove dance
<seb128> ?
<willcooke> I have to install the .deb right?
<willcooke> oh
<seb128> why would you?
<willcooke> maybe I dont
<willcooke> because the binaries will still be there right?
<seb128> to build the deb it does a source build
<seb128> yes
<seb128> also you can ctrl-C before the end of the build
<seb128> just let it do the configure for you
<seb128> then ctrl-C and do make
<seb128> at least you get all the flags set up for you
<willcooke> ah, interesting
<willcooke> oki, I'll read up on that.  It's been a long while.  I remember something about fakeroot and that's abou tit
<willcooke> about it
<seb128> sudo apt-get install debscripts
<seb128> sudo apt-get build-dep unity-control-center
<seb128> sorry
<seb128> sudo apt-get install devscripts
<seb128> was a typo
<seb128> if you use the vcs you can install bzr-buildpackage and bzr bd
<seb128> if you get the source just use "debuild"
<seb128> in the srcdir
<willcooke> woo! thanks seb128
<seb128> yw
<seb128> works now?
<willcooke> building
<willcooke> if this doesnt work though, I give up :)
<willcooke> I tried just commenting out the xml, but that didnt work
<willcooke> needs a change in corresponding panel code too
<willcooke> which I think is just a couple of lines commented out
<willcooke> line 1010 in cc-power-panel.c
<willcooke> and 1011
<willcooke> booo
<willcooke> but at least it built ok :)
<seb128> willcooke, it doesn't load the panel .so from the local build
<willcooke> ahhhhh
<seb128> you need to copy panel/power/.libs/libpower.so over the system one
<seb128> dpkg -S libpower.so
<willcooke> hidden directories, of course :)
<flexiondotorg> willcooke, I've rounded up all the duplicates for LP: #1585863
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1585863 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "WiFi malfunction after suspend & resume stress" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1585863
<flexiondotorg> And have seen this LP: #1589557
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1589557 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "[SRU]upstream stable point release 1.2.2" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1589557
<flexiondotorg> It that SRU intended as the actual solution?
<popey> willcooke: maybe worth keeping an eye on https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=764841 - GNOME Maps uses a tile provider which is changing T&C, so we may get an update from them which changes to a different tile set
<ubot5> Gnome bug 764841 in general "Stop Using MapQuest Tile Server" [Normal,New]
<popey> because AIUI (I think) GNOME Maps will break on Monday.
<willcooke> flexiondotorg, I think that wifi/resume issue was fixed in upstream 1.2.2, so SRUing the new version is the intended fix.  But happyaron should comment further
<willcooke> popey, thanks.  We get gnome-maps from Debian, so we might need to resync
<flexiondotorg> willcooke, Thanks.
<willcooke> flexiondotorg, did I understand the question correctly?
<flexiondotorg> Yep :-)
<willcooke> \o/
<flexiondotorg> There is so much mis-information flying around about the Network Manager issues in "the community".
<flexiondotorg> I'm just trying to get a handle on the main issues and the road to solutions.
<flexiondotorg> Basically, trying to quite down the peanut gallery.
<willcooke> thank you flexiondotorg
<flexiondotorg> s/quite/quiet/
<willcooke> seb128, sucess - of sorts
<willcooke> now meeting, then try again
<willcooke> and make it a bit tidier
<seb128> willcooke, working but not really as you wanted??
<willcooke> seb128, working, but I might have found an easier way
<seb128> k, good
<seb128> popey, gnome-maps is a direct sync from debian and in universe/not something we maintain, any reason it should be a concern for us?
<popey> Only that AIUI it will break on monday. So expect bug reports in launchpad if they haven't already been reported
<seb128> k
<seb128> well, we are not subscribed to that component
<seb128> so I guess it can go to the launchpad spam box :p
<seb128> but thanks for pointing it out
<seb128> also it's likely that Debian fixes it and than we get a direct sync
<popey> wouldn't that need an SRU?
<seb128> if that has users who care on stable series I guess
<seb128> unsure how used that app is
<seb128> I never tried it nor saw it mentioned on this channel before today
<Trevinho> seb128: I don't see anything changed on that silo, is publication pending or what?
<Trevinho> seb128: ah.
<Trevinho>  Publish failed: bamf has merges in bad states.
<Trevinho> libunity has merges in bad states.
<Trevinho> unity has merges in bad states.
<Trevinho> unity-lens-applications has merges in bad states
<seb128> I pressed the button
<seb128> didn't check the logs
<seb128> so it failed? what is bad state?
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, not approved :)
<Trevinho> seb128: andyrock is on them, once he ACK'ed I ping you again
<seb128> k
<seb128> you can maybe fix the upstart job, or at least the commit msg ;-)
<andyrock> seb128 Trevinho done
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> does anyone know how we start a Mir session exactly? I. e. the parts between lightdm and running the session leader?
<pitti> I suppose we don't have any Xsession.d equivalent there
<Trevinho> pitti: mh, you want the clean way then?
<pitti> is that just calling the equivalent of /usr/share/xsessions/my_DE.desktop?
<pitti> which then starts the session leader, and as  soon as that stops teh session is gone?
<pitti> Trevinho: just interested in how it works today, and how it's meant to work (they might not necessarily be the same, yes: :) )
<Trevinho> pitti: AFAIK using unity-system-compositor you need to pass to it the FDs of lightdm for securty purposes
<Trevinho> So you launch that trhough lightdm, but I'm not that aware of the internals
<seb128> pitti, you would need robert_ancell for somebody who masters the details
<Trevinho> Saviq knows that better for sure ^
<seb128> or maybe mterry
<pitti> so apparently if gdm wants to start a wayland session, the only thing it does is to run the corresponding .desktop from /usr/share/wayland-sessions/
<Trevinho> yeah, these too
<pitti> Trevinho: not interested in the details, just how a "session" is defined from the POV of the DM
<pitti> for X it's currently "run the Exec= from the session .desktop through Xsession.d/" (or very similar)
<Trevinho> pitti: looking at unity8-desktop-session should help you
<Trevinho> we've /usr/share/lightdm/sessions/unity8.desktop
<Trevinho> with X-LightDM-Session-Type=mir and Exec=lightdm-unity8-session
<pitti> ah, so lightdm-unity8-session is the "session leader" shell script
<Trevinho> where lightdm-unity8-session is just a script that calls lightdm-session with some qt/mir related enviromnet var sets
<Trevinho> yes
<Saviq> pitti, yeah and lightdm has dedicated code paths for mir to make sure it sets up unity-system-compositor
<pitti> so lightdm doesn't really need to know about Mir, the only interface is the unity8.desktop, and no Xsession.d/
<pitti> I'm glad the Xsession.d/ shell script madness is gone :)
<pitti> thanks Saviq and Trevinho!
<Trevinho> yeah, I think upstart/systemd usage is the future for that
<pitti> that's what I'm currently discussing with upstream, yes
<pitti> cleaning up my initial prototype
<pitti> and I was wondering what to replace the Xsession.d wrapper with
<pitti> I think we mostly just want to put that into the .desktop Exec= instead
<Trevinho> I guess just having a trigger for events, then it's up to scripts..
<Trevinho> yeah
<willcooke> Laney, seb128 - any chance of a review and merge of this this week? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-themes/+bug/1594816
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1594816 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "GtkSwitch button background overflows the border" [Medium,Confirmed]
<seb128> willcooke, let's see if Laney replies, I can have a look tomorrow otherwise
<seb128> it's simple enough that I can probably approve it if needed
<willcooke> thanks seb128.  I guess this is tricky because it won't go in to 16.10 because of Gtk versions
<seb128> but by css foo is weak, Laney probably has a much better understanding of the theme by now
<seb128> well, Gtk isn't update
<seb128> so we can land it now
<willcooke> ah
<seb128> even if it gets changed later
<seb128> *updated
<willcooke> seb128, also I did only need to change the power.ui file to get rid of the "when power is critically low" issue:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-control-center/+bug/1599264
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1599264 in unity-control-center (Ubuntu) ""When power is critically low" setting does nothing" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> willcooke, do you want that in the .1?
<willcooke> seb128, hmmmmmmm
<seb128> willcooke, Trevinho is having a u-c-c update with the compiz lowgfx changeset
<seb128> so we need to merge them/respin
<willcooke> Yeah, I think so, but it's a UI change - so might need special exceptions?
<seb128> if you want it included
<willcooke> seb128, I'd be +1, what do you think?
<seb128> yeah, good point
<seb128> well if the settings is not working should be fine for a SRU
<seb128> but we should talk to the documentation team
<willcooke> I'll ask for a UI freeze exception anyway
<seb128> is that setting documented there?
<seb128> k
<willcooke> asked in #ubuntu-doc
<seb128> k, let me know if you get a reply
<willcooke> seb128, would you mind testing that real quick?
<seb128> the .ui change?
<willcooke> yeah, just apply the patch and see if it's gone
<seb128> can do
<seb128> did you see the upstream commit I pointed yesterday evening when we discussed it?
<seb128> they removed a bit of backend code which isn't needed without the ui as well
<seb128> we might want to do the same
<willcooke> ah, no, I missed that
<willcooke> lemme see
<seb128> I think I pointed one?
 * seb128 looks at log
<seb128> oh, I pointed to the bugzilla bug
<seb128> same
<willcooke> yeah
<willcooke> so I could remove the same bits and add another patch, is that OK?
<willcooke> or should we sync from u/s
<willcooke> hrm, this one is waaay different to anything we have: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=303524&action=diff
<willcooke> hrm, seb128 I'm out of my depth patching cc-power-panel.c
<ricotz> hey desktopers
<ricotz> willcooke, hi, do you mind a pm?
<seb128> willcooke, I guess it's just a matter of removing the callback for the UI bit ... where is your .ui change?
<willcooke> ricotz, sure
<willcooke> seb128, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/271261080/powerui.patch
<willcooke> is that what you meant?
<willcooke> I think I've found the bit in cc-power-panel.c
<seb128> willcooke, the .ui change looks fine ... k, let me know if you need help with the .c
<willcooke> seb128, looks like we're a little way behind with out fork, but I think I got it now
<seb128> yeah, we are way behind
<seb128> which was sort of why we forked, they redesign the UI and we didn't want the new look
<willcooke> doesnt matter too much though I think, as long as it works, it's not something we need to keep on the cutting edge with
<willcooke> ahh
<willcooke> I see
<desrt> good morning people
<seb128> hey desrt, wb!
<seb128> how are you?
<seb128> how was Canada day?
<desrt> i'm not sure
<desrt> probably pretty good, though :)
<seb128> that was not monday?
 * seb128 is unsure
<desrt> no.  friday was the holiday
<desrt> which, indeed, is odd
<desrt> normally they make it on monday, but i guess because it was natively on friday, which already made it a 3-day weekend, they just left it there
<seb128> ah ok
<desrt> that entire long weekend was the pride parades, anyway
<desrt> which i mostly stayed home for
 * desrt hasn't been feeling 100% lately
<seb128> k
<seb128> oh :-/ hope you are going to feel better soon!
<desrt> i should be.  i think the problem has been identified :)
<seb128> good :-)
<willcooke> seb128, I'm down a rabbit hole now with u-c-c :( - I think I do need to build and install a .deb because I'm trying to copy libs around to test and getting it very wrong
<willcooke> once I do a debuild - what's the next step to get a .deb I can install?
<seb128> what lib? how wrong?
<seb128> debuild procudes a deb
<didrocks> (if the build succeed :p)
<willcooke> seb128, @ libs - I think I need to copy new ones in to the right place after I made changes to the power panel C code
<willcooke> seb128, and wrong - like I might have deleted the proper ones and replaced them with garbage
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> willcooke, well, the panel is libpower.so
<willcooke> I was getting warnings from libunity-control-center.so.1.0.0
<willcooke> so I tried to copy that over as well
<seb128> and now?
<seb128> you get an error?
<willcooke> well, I'm getting some warnings which I think are related to the changes
<willcooke> it's not building a deb because:
<willcooke> oh, it's trying to sign it as you
<seb128> that's not an error
<seb128> it should still produce the deb
<seb128> in the maindir, like outside the srcdir
<seb128> or in build-area/
<willcooke> ohhhhhhhh
<willcooke> thanks
<seb128> yw
<willcooke> wooo
<willcooke> warnings gone
<seb128> woot
<flocculant> willcooke: or are they ...
<flocculant> just thought I would throw that in there :p
<willcooke> gee, thanks pal
<Sweet5hark1> ricotz: thanks for your enthusiasm on updating https://git.launchpad.net/~libreoffice/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/commit/?h=ubuntu-yakkety-5.2&id=97262150e06b39605a4a63b6921a4010371da6ad
<Sweet5hark1> ricotz: a few things though:
<Sweet5hark1> ricotz: a/ please dont push changes I wrote onto the branch. All changes I push to lp are already locally commited in git, so when you recreate those changes with a newly created commit, that just creates conflicts. Also, if I have pushed something to lp, but not to the git repo, there is a good chance that there either is a problem with the change or it wasnt tested yet. As such please assume it to be _intentionally_ not pushed yet --
<Sweet5hark1> ricotz: b/ Also, if you push changes written by others, please use --author to properly mark them for git blame etc. If you do changes inspired by someone, but which are not verbatim their work, it might be better to just name/thank the author in the commit message.
<Sweet5hark1> ricotz: I also noted you asked upstream about rc2. Thats good in general as upstream should stick to its schedule unless there are good reasons. However, please refrain from creating tarballs from upstream tags for Ubuntu unless I am very late with that (read: like half a week). If you create the tarballs, that is not helping, because it actually creates _more_ work for me to diff/check/verify those against some I independantly created
<Sweet5hark1> ricotz: if you want to help with the upstream tarballs, as cloph said upstream: the best way is to get into reviewing the outstanding patches that still block the tag. Alternatively, if you want to help with the Ubuntu tarballs, recreating them and verifying that there is no diff to when I upload isnt corrupted (and thus has no diff beyond e.g. fetch.log) would help too.
<Sweet5hark1> ricotz: but -- as said in the opening, your work is much welcome, but keep in mind that packaging LibreOffice is and should be a rather slow business: Its like navigating an oil tanker. --- If you prefer something moving faster, upstream _development_ (not releng) might be something for you, and I most happily would give you an intro on how to get started ;)
<willcooke> seb128, pour vous?  https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubuntu-themes/gtkswitchoverflow/+merge/298028
<ricotz> Sweet5hark1, hi, thanks for the flaming and not answering to my previous messages -- I noted your complaints, but slow as in weeks-later is not helping, and you not pushing your changes is not unusual, just rebase the branch as you wish
<seb128> sorry can't read you, hate that bug
<ricotz> Sweet5hark1, I simply asked for an eta for the new tag nothing more
<seb128> http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/bug.png
<seb128> I can see notifications with text though :p
<seb128> need to reboot but I was testing something in a snap env and didn't want to close it
<seb128> back
<seb128> willcooke, +1
<Sweet5hark1> ricotz: yes, In general I need to change my unhelpful custom of pushing only rarely now that I am not alone there. But that is not what is happened here: https://launchpad.net/~bjoern-michaelsen/+archive/ubuntu/libreoffice-staging/+sourcepub/6496156/+listing-archive-extra ftbfs, so I didnt commit/push before investigating that. So umm, taking changes from someone elses private ppa that apparently broke and pushing it to the branch with
<ricotz> Sweet5hark1, the way I did it you can easily see what I changed and you can simply rebase to your local branch by skipping the squashed commit
<seb128> going for some exercice, bbiab
<jbicha> popey: Ubuntu GNOME 15.10 and 16.04 ships gnome-maps
<popey> jbicha: i thought they might
<ricotz> Sweet5hark1, why didn't you rebase it?
<ricotz> Sweet5hark1, also a transitional package for libreoffice-gtk might be wise to ease updating
<Sweet5hark1> ricotz: rebase your changes on top of mine? because that would then create a different branch and thus require a forced push, "changing history"/diverted history. One should _never_ force push to a public branch.
<ricotz> Sweet5hark1, as you said there are like 2 people working on it, so just do it
<ricotz> Sweet5hark1, rebasing public branch is done all the time or over the places
<Sweet5hark1> ricotz: rebasing published branches might be done. however, its never done in sane places.
<ricotz> Sweet5hark1, dont call this branch a sane place ;P
<Sweet5hark1> ricotz: for the next time, a workable solution, if you urgently want to have something to be included in the packaging branches is that you push to a different named branch (e.g. "feature/$something"). It can then be easily cherry-picked/merged/whatever in the ubuntu-yakkety-5.2 branch. (thats a bit like a "github pull request" -- just without the nice web-UI).
<ricotz> Sweet5hark1, I am aware of what git is capable
<ricotz> Sweet5hark1, and again there were weeks between your upload/changes and me pushing this
<Sweet5hark1> ricotz: yes, I wanted to squeeze in a rc1 release on friday. but the CVE nonsense pointlessly ate too much time.
<ricotz> Sweet5hark1, https://paste.debian.net/plain/777801
<Sweet5hark1> ricotz: thx, willdo tomorrow.
<willcooke> night all
<tjaalton> anyone know if unity7 has some autoscaling applied with intel driver? because there's no scaling with the modesetting driver
<Trevinho> tjaalton: there's no autoscaling by default
<Trevinho> tjaalton: there's a branch that does that which we'll likely merge soon, though
<tjaalton> Trevinho: ok, somehow it does scale with intel.. even on xenial
<Trevinho> tjaalton: gdk might apply that automatically, but..... it shouldn't
<tjaalton> alright
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-07-07
<qengho> fg
<qengho> damn
<sarnold> gotta admit it worked though, now irc is foreground :)
<qengho> Next I'll be using "wall" instead of irc.
<sarnold> hehe
<qengho> My PPA fails to build at dependency-installation time, and I can't understand why. Help?
<qengho> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/271223373/buildlog_ubuntu-yakkety-i386.chromium-browser_51.0.2704.79-0ubuntu2.1258_BUILDING.txt.gz
<qengho> "Depends: libpng12-dev but it is not going to be installed". Well, okay then.
<RAOF> qengho: I suspect you want libpng-
<RAOF> qengho: I suspect you want libpng-dev, if Chromium can build against it.
<qengho> RAOF: Earlier I had  libpng12-dev | libpng16-dev  . Grr, okay.
<RAOF> I don't think that'd work, either. I don't think the build-depend resolver is smart enough to take anything but the first alternative unless it's already installed.
 * qengho boggles.
<Laney> moin moin moin
<TheMuso> Hey Laney , willcooke. :)
<willcooke> morning Laney TheMuso
<Laney> oh, hi TheMuso
<willcooke> Laney, thanks for the merge of #1594816
<Laney> I'm in your hemisphere
<willcooke> already?
<Laney> willcooke: np
<Laney> already what?
<willcooke> already home
<didrocks> brain hemisphere maybe? :)
<willcooke> or visiting Nigeria on the way home perhaps
<Laney> not your hemisphere
<willcooke> ohh
<willcooke> TheMuso's
<Laney> yeah!
<willcooke> as you were
<TheMuso> lol
<didrocks> ah, it's a different you than the other "you"
<didrocks> confusing Laney :)
<didrocks> hey btw guys!
<Trevinho> morning
<TheMuso> Laney: Enjoy your time in this part of the world. No idea where you are, but I'm guessing its cooler than what you are used to atm.
<Laney> TheMuso: I'm in CPT for debconf :)
<Laney> It's actually pretty nice
<Laney> we got 23 one day
<TheMuso> Oh right.
<Trevinho> Laney: y
<Trevinho> hi*
<Trevinho> seb128: hey, can you re-hit the publish button on https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/1614 (or Laney)?
<Laney> hi Trevinho
<Trevinho> Laney: is debconf still going?
<Laney> yep
<seb128> hey Laney Trevinho TheMuso
<seb128> Laney, I saw you had long sleaves on that photo ;-)
<seb128> Trevinho, done
<Trevinho> seb128: thanks
<Trevinho> seb128: how are you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks!
<davmor2> seb128: that is to protect his arms against the blistering sun
<seb128> how are you?
<seb128> you are up on normal european time now? ;-)
<Trevinho> allright, re-organizing a "mini-sprint" with andyrock :-D
<seb128> haha
<Trevinho> Well, trying to be a good guy :-P
<seb128> where this time?
<seb128> :-)
<Laney> I was trying to load that
<Laney> but lag
<Trevinho> at my place, so Florence and somewhere around it.
<seb128> Trevinho, going to watch the game tonight? so you can see how to play Germany :-)
<Trevinho> seb128: sure, but it's hard to watch a match hoping that both would lose :-D
<seb128> lol
 * TheMuso -> EOD - Later folks.
<seb128> is anyone using gdm here?
<seb128> night TheMuso
<andyrock> morning
<tjaalton> seb128, willcooke: debian will soon switch all gen4+ intel to use modesetting instead of intel ddx driver. we'll follow soon after
<seb128> hey andyrock, how are you?
<tjaalton> intel driver will have a minimal xorg.conf that can be copied to /etc/X11 if someone wants to continue using it because of a bug in modeset/glamor or otherwise
<seb128> k
<seb128> so it doesn't change much for users in practice?
<seb128> just tech changes?
<tjaalton> no
<tjaalton> hopefully _less_ bugs
<seb128> k, good
<andyrock> seb128: bad
<andyrock> you know Trevinho....
<andyrock> XD
<willcooke> seb128, Laney - is it worth sruing this to 16.04.1?  I can do the paperwork if you think it is.  It would be "nice" but not super important
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-themes/+bug/1594816
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1594816 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "GtkSwitch button background overflows the border" [Medium,Fix released]
<seb128> lol
<seb128> going for some small errands, back in ~1h
<seb128> willcooke, could be, unsure if we have a bit more to bundle with it though, which would be better
<Laney> willcooke: I wouldn't just for that personally, but rather bundle it up if other things come along
<Laney> up to you though
<Laney> could make a merge proposal to make it less likely to get missed at that point
<Laney> lp:~ubuntu-art-pkg/ubuntu-themes/16.04
<dpm> willcooke, ubuntu software has not been working for me for a while (whenever I do a search or click on one of the featured apps, I end up with a blank screen with a spinning logo). Do you happen to know if this a known bug/is there a fix or workaround?
<seb128> dpm, not known afaik/not workaround that I know about ... does it list things in the installed/to update sections and in the categories or do you get content only on the main screen?
<dpm> thanks seb128, I get content only on the main screen. Either clicking on a tab at the top, on an app on the main screen or searching for an app gets me the blank screen
<seb128> does it work in a guest session?
<seb128> just asking in case, but I don't think there is much user specific state
 * dpm tries and hopes he can log back in
<dpm> seb128, heh, strangely enough the guest session does not work, I cannot log into it
<dpm> it takes me to logdm with only my user listed
<dpm> err *lightdm
<seb128> hum
<seb128> did you turn it off in your lightdm config?
<seb128> the greeter is not listing guest as an option?
<dpm> I don't even know you could do this, so I guess the answer is "no"
<dpm> exactly, guest is not listed as an optin in the greeter
<willcooke> Laney, thanks, done.
<seb128> dpm, is that on xenial or yakkety?
<dpm> xenial, with proposed enabled
<seb128> dpm, you don't have any guest config in /etc/lightdm/...?
<dpm> let me check
<seb128> dpm, otherwise for the gnome-software issue, do you get any warning/error/buggy source if you sudo apt update?
<seb128> could be a buggy/unsigned repo created issue
<seb128> like spotify or chrome (used?) to do that
<dpm> seb128, http://paste.ubuntu.com/18700521/ for lightdm, let me start g-s from cli
<dpm> seb128, actually 'ubuntu-software' from cli launches the app but returns immediately with no terminal output
<seb128> dpm, it's in the session as a service
<seb128> you need to stop the current one to get the full output
<Sweet5hark> whops, notebook seems to have rebooted out of the blue ... (overheating?)
<seb128> but check if apt update works
<dpm> ok
<Sweet5hark> ahhh, journalctl shows all the fine logs ... from the reboot onwards, which isnt helping at all.
<Sweet5hark> *grumble*
<dpm> seb128, any particular process I should look for? 'killall ubuntu-software' does not find anything
<seb128> dpm, gnome-software it's called
<seb128> but try to apt update thing first
<dpm> seb128, actually, killing gnome-software made it all work
<seb128> :-/
<seb128> dunno what the issue was then
<seb128> check if journalctl or syslog has some errors maybe
<dpm> ok, in any case, that unblocked me, thanks!
<willcooke> turn it off and back on again \o/
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<dpm> that bug where the store icons for snaps are not shown in g-s, I guess is still needs to land?
<willcooke> dpm, I can't remember exactly where that's at, I think it was pending a change in the store
<willcooke> but it's certainly on the list of things to fix
<dpm> thanks, just double-checking, g-s on my system mades me unsure of whether things break or they're still pending a fix
<seb128> dpm, willcooke, unsure about the icon, I think the store guys said it should work but attente had issues, unsure if he debugged more/filed a bug on the store or snapd
<dpm> seb128, is bug 1588266 the one?
<ubot5> bug 1588266 in snapd (Ubuntu) "Almost no info about Krita snap in Ubuntu Software" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1588266
<seb128> no
<dpm> I see it refers to another bug marked as invalid
<seb128> well it has things that snapd doesn't provide
<seb128> like screenshots or license
<seb128> but icons is supposed to work as you just said
<seb128> it's just that attente said it was not working
<seb128> unsure if that got resolved
<seb128> attente, did you end up looking more into it/filing a bug?
<willcooke> I'll pick it up with Robert
<seb128> willcooke, best to check if attente did something about it first though?
<seb128> no point asking robert to re-investigate something which somebody in the team already debugged
<attente> seb128: wasn't it an issue with the snaps themselves? that they were built with an older snapcraft?
<seb128> that's what the store guys said
<seb128> but we didn't find a snap that works
<seb128> which is suspicious
<seb128> but if you didn't debug more let's do what willcooke suggested and ask robert_ancell to have a look
<attente> it's definitely snapd not giving an appropriate icon uri
<attente> all of them just return "icon":""
<a1fa> andyrock: you around ?
<andyrock> a1fa: yep?
<dpm> attente, seb128, from reading that bug, I think what they mentioned was that the apps hadn't been targetted to the '16' series, which is why they didn't return an icon. I can confirm though, that the apps that I've uploaded are definitely targetted to the 16 series, and still the icon is not showing up in g-s
<attente> dpm: which snap(s) did you upload? i'll check it now
<dpm> attente, notes, ubuntu-clock-app
<attente> dpm: yeah. snapd is still not returning an icon uri there
<dpm> attente, and is the series correct?
<attente> dpm: how do i check that?
<dpm> attente, well, I hoped you or the store guys could confirm that, I've no idea how to do that. I can confirm from looking at the store web UI that these two apps are for Ubuntu series: 16 :)
<dpm> well, it says "Supported releases16"
<dpm> it might be worth updating the bug, as I've got the impression the store guys think this is fixed on their side
<a1fa> andyrock: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1581912
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1581912 in unity (Ubuntu) "Specific NVIDIA driver settings in xorg.conf will cause issues with Unity Panel" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> dpm, attente, right, that's what I was saying. we need somebody to investigate if that's true, snaps might not done what the store expect, or we might talk to the store the wrong way or their might still be a bug
<seb128> attente is asking on #snappy, let's move there/wait for Chipaca to reply
<a1fa> andyrock: this one is so annoying.. stuff gets tucked under the unity top panel, and its hard to get it out from there
<a1fa> andyrock: oh. and its only present if unity launcher is on the bottom
<a1fa> andyrock: if unity launcher is on the left, then maybe 5px are cut off because of the panel
<a1fa> andyrock: instead of ~32
<a1fa> so in both cases, its a bug :) launcher on the bottom -- pannel eats about 32 pixels from the top.. launcher on the left, panel eats ~5pxs
<a1fa> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/259612604/Screenshot%20from%202016-05-14%2022-59-12.png
<a1fa> i posted a screenshot too
<dpm> seb128, I think you looked at fonts a bit for the desktop launchers. Does a particular font need to be shipped to work on a snap? Context: I'm upstreaming a snap, and upstream have explicitly set (and want) the app's font to be Liberation Sans, but it ends up being another font
<dpm> I'm wondering if I need to specifically ship the package that contains Liberation Sans
<seb128> yes
<seb128> you should side-package it
<didrocks> dpm: we symlink and enable any fonts that you ship in your snap
<didrocks> so as seb128 told (I guess he meant "stage-packages" it)
<dpm> thanks guys
<seb128> didrocks, yes, sorry ;-)
<willcooke> Laney, deleted that mess of an MP for 16.04 and made a new one: https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubuntu-themes/gtkswitchoverflow-1604/+merge/299431
<Laney> willcooke: okay (I get emailed) - you could have pushed over the old branch and it would have been updated, but thanks!
<attente> didrocks: hey, can you rename this project on github? https://github.com/ubuntu-core/snap-desktop-links -> snapd-xdg-open
<Laney> ximion is starting his appstream talk now if you want to knon what that is
<Laney> https://debconf16.debconf.org/schedule/venue/1/
<willcooke> ooh, thanks Laney
<pitti> seb128: zeitgeist was removed from Debian (Debian bug 813582); do we plan to keep it?
<ubot5> Debian bug 813582 in ftp.debian.org "RM: libzeitgeist -- RoQA; obsoleted, unused, abandoned, superseeded" [Normal,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/813582
<willcooke> hm, video feed died
<willcooke> back
<seb128> pitti, v1 vs v2?
<pitti> seb128: oh, right; libzeitgeist got removed, zeitgeist is still there
<seb128> k
<didrocks> attente: done!
<attente> didrocks: thanks!
<didrocks> yw :)
<pitti> seb128: and there are still three scropes that build against the old lib
<pitti> seb128: ok, these are certainly crufty, but I'll keep it for now as we have rdepends
<pitti> sorry, missed 1 vs 2.
<seb128> (sorry otp)
<willcooke> Laney, is this talk going to be recorded?  Would like to point m_vo and robert_ancell at it later
<mdeslaur> hrm, compiz is segfaulting since I updated my yakkety vm this morning. Is that a known issue?
<seb128> back
<willcooke> ruh roh - hikiko, Trevinho  --^
<seb128> pitti, no worry, but yeah we still use it for the unity/dash recently used, GNOME never really used it I think so maybe Debian doesn't need it
<willcooke> Laney, I can see yoouuuuuu!
<seb128> mdeslaur, I don't think so, could be an issue in the lowgfx mode, can you get a backtrace?
<seb128> Trevinho, willcooke, ^ that might put the SRU at risk :-/
<willcooke> seb128, yeah. :((
<hikiko> mdeslaur: "known" i ve seen some bug reports and I am looking for invalid memory access with valgrind
<mdeslaur> bug 1599890
<ubot5> bug 1599890 in compiz (Ubuntu) "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in ccsObjectGetInterface_()" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1599890
<hikiko> No willcooke seb128
<willcooke> hopefully hikiko can track it down and fix it quickly
<hikiko> There was a bug report
<hikiko> It's not the low gfx
<hikiko> I am looking for it
<hikiko> The report was from before
<Laney> willcooke: they all end up here http://meetings-archive.debian.net/Public/debian-meetings/2016/debconf16/
<seb128> well, mdeslaur issue started with today's update he said
<seb128> so maybe a different one
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<Laney> after several hours
<Laney> transcoding and shizzle
<mdeslaur> let me paste my update log to the bug
<hikiko> thanks mdeslaur I will look at it tomorrow
<Trevinho> Mmm it does not look related to the last updates or at least in the SRU
<mdeslaur> hrm, let me install a fresh vm, maybe something got borked during the upgrade
<Trevinho> Ok let me know
<seb128> Trevinho, hikiko, could be in the profile switch?
<Trevinho> seb128: there's no profile switch at runtime
<seb128> mdeslaur, when do it segfault, on session start? could you install the dbgsym to get a dbg bt?
<hikiko> seb128: I have to check with valgrind but sounds highly impossible
<mdeslaur> seb128: when I login, yes
<hikiko> Mmm
<mdeslaur> let me install a clean vm first, just to see
<seb128> mdeslaur, keep the one that segfault though, maybe you can also try a guest session with it?
 * mdeslaur tries guest session
<mdeslaur> tyhicks just hit the compiz segfault after updating his vm too
<hikiko> When did you update?
<mdeslaur> seb128: guest session fails also
<hikiko> Great :-/
<seb128> mdeslaur, can you get a dbg bt?
<mdeslaur> yeah, one sec
<mdeslaur> seb128: so I install the dbgsym packages, then login...can I get them attached to the same bug then?
<seb128> unsure
<mdeslaur> k, let me see and perhaps file another bug
<hikiko> Thanks mdeslaur
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> and dup the non dbg one
<seb128> thanks
<mdeslaur> argh, apport opened the existing bug
<seb128> :-/
<mdeslaur> ok, bug 1599900
<ubot5> bug 1599900 in compiz (Ubuntu) "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in ccsObjectGetInterface_()" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1599900
<seb128> Trevinho, hikiko, ^
<Laney> nice bug number
<hikiko> Mmm no much info in stacktrace, I'll look at it tomorrow, thanks seb128 and mdeslaur
<seb128> mdeslaur, does it work better if you don't use the lowgfx profile?
<mdeslaur> seb128: how do I do that?
<seb128> mdeslaur, e.g edit /usr/share/upstart/sessions/unity7.conf
<seb128> change the compiz_profile="ubuntu-lowgfx"
<seb128> or comment those 3 lines
<hikiko> seb128 are we sure he is using that? Vmware has 3d acceleration by default
<mdeslaur> I'm using kvm, no 3d here
<hikiko> Oh
<seb128> hikiko, no, no idea ... but what he said
<davmor2> mdeslaur: what gpu did you set?
<hikiko> Sounds a lot like lowgfx problem then
<mdeslaur> I tried both vmvga and qxl
<mdeslaur> seb128: it works without lowgfx
<seb128> k
<davmor2> mdeslaur: if you use vmware or qxl you get better
<seb128> hikiko, highly impossible and yet seems to be the case
<hikiko> I said the profile
<seb128> mdeslaur, thanks for reporting
<mdeslaur> my vms may have a bunch of custom settings for compiz
<davmor2> mdeslaur: only issue is vmware isn't available on uefi installs so I use qxl
<seb128> mdeslaur, but guest session wouldn't have those?
<seb128> mdeslaur, or did you customize system defaults in some ways?
<seb128> also you said tyhicks has the issue as well?
<hikiko> It can't be the profile seb128 but maybe something else in tr
<mdeslaur> oh, true...let me look and make sure
<hikiko> Trevinho's branch
<seb128> could be
<seb128> willcooke and I tested the lowgfx xenial SRU ppa version and didn't get that issue
<willcooke> ya
<willcooke> and sverdy did too
<tyhicks> seb128: I hit the issue, as well, but mdeslaur and I are running identically configured VMs (part of the security team's testing infrastructure)
<mdeslaur> seb128: the only thing I do that would apply to the guest user is removing animation and fade from /etc/compizconfig/unity.ini
<hikiko> I said that the profile sounds highly impossible. I'll check this last branch that was merged and I didn't review it
<mdeslaur> but the unity session works, the lowgfx one doesn't
<hikiko> Wait the fade is removed ?
<hikiko> It shouldn't
<hikiko> The fade plugin
<mdeslaur> hikiko: I do that when my script installs the vm, the default doesn't
<mdeslaur> let me try with a new vm not installed from my script
<hikiko> And when you do that you have no crash?
<mdeslaur> oh, good question
<mdeslaur> let me add it back and see the regular session crashes
<hikiko> I'm going to install a yaketty vm
<mdeslaur> adding it back didn't change anything
<hikiko> Well since many people have that can't be the settings or the vm it's something in this last branch
<seb128> going for some exercice, bbiab
<ogra_> warming up fo the game ?
<ogra_> :)
<willcooke> :)
 * ogra_ noticed seb128 took off tomorrow for weeping too :P 
<davmor2> ogra_: yeah you Germans and your weeping ;)
<ogra_> lol
<davmor2> ogra_: the only person who wins in this match is seb128 right he can fly either flag with a quick hop over the river right :)
<willcooke> mdeslaur, I just tried downloading a Y desktop image but dpkg is seg faulting (known issue) - when did you download your iso?
<willcooke> or, how did you install it?
<willcooke> ah, so the install gets so far, then this: http://imgur.com/MzDmaFU
<willcooke> then you reboot and log in and it just get's stuck after the log in prompt
<willcooke> hikiko, same for you right? ^
<hikiko> yes willcooke
<mdeslaur> willcooke: I am seeing this on a vm I updated, not a clean install
<mdeslaur> willcooke: my clean install seems to be stuck
<willcooke> mdeslaur, ah, kk
<mdeslaur> willcooke: so I guess I'm also hitting the dpkg issue
<hikiko> mdeslaur, still here?
<mdeslaur> hikiko: yep
<hikiko> could you tell us if you were using any other repos apart from the default?
<hikiko> for example proposed?
<mdeslaur> just the default, no proposed
<hikiko> thanks a lot
<mdeslaur> np
<hikiko> and were did you see it's a segfault?
<hikiko> or you said crash?
<hikiko> mdeslaur, :)
<mdeslaur> from the title the apport dialog showed me
<hikiko> I see :)
<mdeslaur> why?
<hikiko> and mdeslaur you were in u7 you upgraded from there and you saw the segfault?
<hikiko> and all the other times you try to login you only see the background?
<mdeslaur> my upgrade script booted the vm, sshed in, dist apt-get dist-upgrade, then shut down the vm
<mdeslaur> the next time I booted the vm and logged in I got the compiz segfault
<hikiko> what happens if you login to lightdm then press ctrl alt f1 and write: DISPLAY=:0 unity --replace ccp&
<mdeslaur> after the segfault?
<hikiko> wait right now you login and you immediately see an error?
<hikiko> or you login and you only see the background?
<mdeslaur> now I just get a blank screen
<mdeslaur> right, the background
<hikiko> ok then could you:
<hikiko> ctrl+alt+f1
<hikiko> login
<mdeslaur> hold on, I need to turn the lowgfx thing back on
<hikiko> systemctl restart lightdm.service
<hikiko> no worries
<hikiko> I got the issue without lowgfx
<hikiko> but no segfault
<hikiko> that's why I am trying to see
<hikiko> if the segfault was caused once after the upgrade and was a consequence of the bug which is elsewhere
<hikiko> you shouldn't have marco's changes
<hikiko> so the low gfx branch is not probably the problem
<hikiko> our changes are in proposed
<hikiko> so if you can do this:
<hikiko> ctrl+alt+f1
<willcooke> FWIW - I can't get an xfce session to start either, but MATE does.
<mdeslaur> I don't see a compiz package in yakkety-proposed
<hikiko> the latest changes are in unity
<hikiko> and since it's a compiz plugin
<hikiko> if it has an invalid mem access
<hikiko> the segfault will appear in compiz
<mdeslaur> no unity package in yakkety-proposed either
<hikiko> mmm
<hikiko> but you had the animations enabled in lowgfx right?
<mdeslaur> I didn't touch the lowgfx profile, so whatever was the default there is what I had
<hikiko> if you do apt-cache show unity | grep -i version
<hikiko> what's the 1st line?
<hikiko> Version: ...?
<mdeslaur> 7.5.0+16.10.20160705.4-0ubuntu1
<mdeslaur> (btw, the systemctl restart lightdm.service didn't help)
<hikiko> we have the same
<hikiko> no no after that
<hikiko> you login
<mdeslaur> "DISPLAY=:0 unity --replace ccp&" did work though
<hikiko> and you press ctrl+alt+f1
<hikiko> yep
<hikiko> same in me
<hikiko> and no segfault
<hikiko> so I believe the problem is the initialization
<hikiko> and because you upgraded from u7
<hikiko> something broke and caused the segfault
<hikiko> (just a theory though, I ll debug further)
<hikiko> anyway we have to fix our unity init :p
<hikiko> mdeslaur, thank you, we ll debug it :)
<seb128> calling it a day and week, having tomorrow off, have a nice friday&w.e everyone
<mdeslaur> I rebooted, and hit the background only session again
<willcooke> cya seb128
<willcooke> night all
<robert_ancell> desrt, are you running GDM atm?
<robert_ancell> or anyone else?
<desrt> gdm3
<desrt> i'm just about to head out to dinner though.  quick question?
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-07-08
<qengho> Good morning.
<hikiko> hi
<ricotz> Sweet5hark1, hi, rc2 is built and ready here
<pitti> Good morning
<qengho> hi
<willcooke> morning
<Laney> meow
<willcooke> hi Laney, how goes?
<Laney> hi willcooke
<Laney> I used the juicer thing to make beetroot juice
<Laney> and now I have purple hands
<willcooke> Thanks Obama
<Laney> THANKS LEAVE
<willcooke> :D:D:D
<xnox> mvo, desrt - what's the copyright on friendly-recovery?
<Laney> but, done some hacking on the new appstream generator
<Laney> which is working so far
<willcooke> nice!
<willcooke> morning xnox, watched your talk yesterday, very good
<xnox> all canonical? canonical & desrt? canonical & collabora? mvo / desrt / canonical?
<xnox> willcooke, oh gosh, please no =) i don't think it was good at all...
<mvo> xnox: definitely canonical for my contributions but the initial work was done by desrt so he own copyright (he knows the details)
<xnox> well their copyright.
<xnox> ok.
<xnox> desrt, i'll update the debian/copyright for now to say Canonical & Allison Ryan Lortie
<xnox> well it has "2007 Ryan Lortie <desrt@desrt.ca>" currently
<Laney> I wonder if xnox is audible on the stream
<xnox> lol
<Trevinho> Good mornig!
<Trevinho> morning*
<willcooke> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> seb is still drunk because of the last night match!?
<Trevinho> hi willcooke
<andyrock> hey all
<willcooke> ha!
<willcooke> he booked a day off
<willcooke> probably to get over his hang over
<xnox> hehe
<Trevinho> Eh, this French people...
<hikiko> Trevinho, ping
<Trevinho> hey hikiko
<hikiko> hi
<hikiko> I wanted to ask you 2 things on unity_support_test
<Trevinho> hikiko: sure
<hikiko> first, I think that this return 2 should be put back: https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~hikiko/nux/nux.ust/revision/880?start_revid=880 because we return 2 when no tests are executed (when we print something and exit)
<hikiko> and the other question is here:
<hikiko> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~hikiko/nux/nux.ust/revision/881 I am not sure I understand it, did you blacklist the UNITY_LOW_GFX_MODE env var? shouldn't we remove this line?
<Trevinho> return 2... Yeah, it was something I was wondering too. But I ddin't consider that an error if requested by the user. Only when providing wrong args
<Trevinho> hikiko: no, as I wanted a way to force this method without using the LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE env, and that was the same for unity
<hikiko> should I put it back?
<Trevinho> hikiko: if you wan to, but I don't see that an issue
<Trevinho> hikiko: at least, there's no scenario where I think it could cause us troubles, but if you think it more consistent...
<hikiko> yeah, I don't think that either but I'll just put it back for consistency
<hikiko> so Trevinho you wanted to blacklist the UNITY_LOW_GFX.. to force software rendering?
<Trevinho> I wanted to be able to test this scenario for unity, without having to force software libgl for the rest of things
<Trevinho> hikiko: so yes
<hikiko> right, I was just wondering...
<hikiko> Trevinho, did you see the bug that mdeslaur was talking about yesterday?
<hikiko> in Y you can't start u7 in lowgfx, you login to lightdm and then compiz doesn't start
<hikiko> and I reproduced it on a vm
<hikiko> and I could start u7 manually from tty 1
<hikiko> do you have any idea what could be wrong? it's after we merged our changes
<hikiko> I wonder if it's possible that something lowgfx related causes the problem?
<Trevinho> hikiko: mh, it seems like some compiz part has not landed
<hikiko> heh :D
<hikiko> there were some installation problems too maybe that daily build was broken
<hikiko> Trevinho, so, we just wait for the next release?
<Trevinho> hikiko: mh, so it seems... Like if there was no compiz with unity-lowgfx.ini file
<Trevinho> hikiko: let's see in next daily
<hikiko> ok :) thanks Trevinho !
<hikiko> Trevinho, also here's the branch with the "fix", just change 0 to 2 :p  https://code.launchpad.net/~hikiko/nux/nux.revert-retval/+merge/299517
<Trevinho>  seeen
<desrt> xnox: drop middle name plz :)
<desrt> xnox: and at the time it would have been me personally (no company)
<xnox> desrt, ok.
<a1fa> andyrock: ;)
<a1fa> This bug was fixed in the package unity - 7.5.0+16.10.20160602-0ubuntu1
<a1fa> is this going to make it into 16.04?
<a1fa> andyrock: i will buy you a beer if you give me an update on these two bugs 1581910 | 1581912
<ubot5> bug 1581910 in unity-settings-daemon (Ubuntu) "Decreasing mouse speed does not disable total mouse acceleration" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1581910
<a1fa> and 1581912
<a1fa> bug 1581912
<ubot5> bug 1581912 in unity (Ubuntu) "Specific NVIDIA driver settings in xorg.conf will cause issues with Unity Panel" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1581912
<a1fa> thank you ubot ;)
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-07-03
<duflu> Does anyone know if there is a particular date for 16.10 EOL in "July 2017"?
<jbicha> duflu: https://motd.ubuntu.com/ :)
<jbicha> I'd expect an ubuntu-announce email for that
<duflu> jbicha, thanks. If verified then this needs updating: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases  and maybe  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/YakketyYak/ReleaseNotes
<jbicha> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-motd/ubuntu-motd/trunk/revision/15
<duflu> Yeah, thanks. Although I just remembered there's no point directing users to the Releases page till after moves into EOL
<duflu> RAOF: Do you have any experience or knowledge as to why rendering in Gnome Shell is higher CPU (for both shell and app) than Weston?
<duflu> Or is that just uninteresting -- Weston is much simpler and obviously more optimized
<RAOF> duflu: dunno.
<RAOF> But Shell has more levels of abstraction.
<duflu> Doesn't matter... Some profiling should provide solid answers as to where the extra CPU is going
<RAOF> And an X server connection (still)
<RAOF> Unless that particular wart is done
<RAOF> Yeah, profile ð
<duflu> I realised I was asking the wrong question. It's not interesting that Weston is more efficient than Gnome Shell. It's interesting that hardware acceleration claims to be working but actually results in higher CPU than software decoding
<RAOF> SW decoding for what?
<RAOF> vainfo may be of interest
<duflu> RAOF: vainfo reports everything is OK. Seems I have just shell/rendering problems
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<duflu> Morning seb128
<seb128> hey duflu! how are you? had a good w.e and start of week?
<duflu> seb128, yeah going OK. How was your weekend?
<jamesh> hi seb128
<seb128> quite uneventfull, we had some rainy days and I mostly relaxed and did nothing
<seb128> hey jamesh, how are things down there? ;-)
<duflu> Sounds nice actually
<jamesh> wet
<jamesh> (not right this minute though)
<jamesh> So, I'm wondering if there is any reason snapd couldn't support polkit authorisation for operations where you don't need to authenticate to the store
<seb128> jamesh, do you have specific actions in mind? like installing a local snap or removing one?
<jamesh> seb128: basically anything that you'd need to use "sudo snapd command" for currently if you don't have a store macaroon
<jamesh> so installing and removing snaps
<jamesh> if we had that, gnome-software could delay asking for store auth until the user tried to pay for a snap
<seb128> jamesh, that's worth raising for discussion on the forum if you think that would be a better solution
<seb128> jamesh, I just saw that Laney added you to the n-m portal trello card, you are looking to that one?
<jamesh> seb128: that's what I'm looking at next, yeah.
<seb128> cool
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<seb128> jamesh, oh, I see that you commented on the post from robert about the polkit thing, good
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, how are you? had a good w.e?
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, yeah I had a good week-end, with the right balance of getting some rest and activities. How about you?
<seb128> oSoMoN, w.e was good, didn't do much but that was good :-)
<oSoMoN> not doing much is good indeed
<seb128> oSoMoN, so the libreoffice build issue is a buildd/kernel problem?
<oSoMoN> seb128, IÂ think so, although I launched another build over the week-end, which ran with an updated kernel that presumably has a fix, but it failed in the same way
<oSoMoN> maybe the kernel fix is incomplete
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> we should perhaps talk to the kernel team about that
<oSoMoN> yes, Iâll talk to them this morning
<seb128> thanks
<willcooke> morning all
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<willcooke> ar'noon
<oSoMoN> good morning willcooke
<seb128> duflu, that pulseaudio xenial SRU segfault, do we have any concrete data telling us that it's not important, or is that comment based on the number of reports? I mean it's an issue if users get in a state their experience with the system is impacted, like audio cut or they need to restart their session to get it working again, less so if it's just the service segfaulting and restarting
<seb128> hey willcooke, did you have a good w.e and recovered from that London week?
<duflu> seb128, yes the links I provided are concrete. And the bug exists in zesty and artful already without people actively complaining
<willcooke> morning seb128 - still tired :)
<duflu> seb128, I mean nobody noticed it in usage. Only errors.ubuntu.com noticed it
<duflu> There are other crashes orders of magnitude more common and people generally don't seem to report those either.
<seb128> duflu, it's difficult to say, all users don't report bugs and maybe some "my sound stop working when I do <...>" reports are due to it but we just not have a way to make that link
<seb128> duflu, I mean you are probably right, but it's always tricky to rule out a real issue for sure
<seb128> duflu, it might be good to at least report the segfault upstream in any case
<duflu> seb128, across all distros the crash you refer to has happened 383 times, out of 30000+ pulseaudio crashes
<duflu> It's tiny
<duflu> (in the past year)
<duflu> It's roughly 1% of all pulseaudio crashes
<seb128> yeah, at the same time it has not been in xenial which is the distro serie which has the most users, it already picked 12 from the SRU
<seb128> but yeah, it's probably still going to be on the low side of the scale
<duflu> seb128, OK then, consider just xenial: It's 12 out of almost 40000 xenial pulseaudio crashes
<seb128> well, you count reports on a longer time to a version shipped to more users
<seb128> but yeah, I'm not arguing with you that it's not low
<seb128> anyway, let's see what the SRU team says
<seb128> they tend to not like regression, even small/non important ones
<duflu> seb128, If you just narrow it down to 1:8.0-0ubuntu3.3 then there are still other crashes much more common than the one you're talking about
<seb128> right
<seb128> duflu, what about reporting upstream, do you think that might be useful?
<seb128> or do you think they are not going to be able to do much about it without an actual description of the problem or of how to trigger it?
<duflu> seb128, perhaps. But we haven't paid enough attention to the dozens/hundreds of more common crashes. I would focus on those first
<duflu> dozens in crashes. hundreds in user-reported
<seb128> right, except that it would probably help the SRU team to feel more confortable about the update
<seb128> they tend to not be comfortable with any regression, even small ones
<duflu> seb128, in fact I've probably received more than 12 comments from users pointing out the new version fixed their systems :)
<seb128> which is understandable, you never know if it's not going to impact some production system even if it's a corner case and only impacting specific setups
<duflu> seb128, yeah as I mentioned I totally understand that. But it's a net positive benefit to keep. I understand the usual policy would actually prefer zero regressions, but that's a net negative benefit
<seb128> I think opening a bug upstream and then arguing that we did what we think it reasonable should be something the SRU team can listen to
<seb128> I can forward the bug if you prefer
<duflu> seb128, yeah that's easy. I just feel like I'm wasting time doing so though, since it's not actually as big a deal as other bugs we ignore
<duflu> I'll look at it now...
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> I think it's going to waste less time than arguing with the SRU team would cost us if we don't
<duflu> Yeah I know. There just isn't any team arguing that "you're ignoring 99% of the real problem"
<duflu> seb128, seems I found upstream reports/fixes, will link them
<seb128> oh, great
<seb128> easy fix that might be included in the SRU if the SRU team asks us to add that regression fix?
<duflu> seb128, well the fix doesn't exist in artful or zesty yet
<oSoMoN> chrisccoulson, have you had a chance to start validating the chromium-browser update in https://launchpad.net/~canonical-chromium-builds/+archive/ubuntu/stage/+packages ?
<duflu> So technically they should come first
<seb128> right
<duflu> seb128: Ha. Yes, that crash can only occur on a bluetooth audio system that's working. Hence didn't occur before :)
<seb128> that sort of verify the fix :p
<seb128> "see, bluetooth work good enough now that we hit bugs in the blutooth code"
<duflu> Yes, weirdly, that crash verifies the improved behaviour
<davidcalle> Laney: hi (and hi everyone else too :)), I'm posting your "welcome" blog post on insights, would you have an alternative title to make it more descriptive?
<oSoMoN> davidcalle, La_ney is off this week
<oSoMoN> hi, btw :)
<davidcalle> Oh!
<seb128> what o_SoMoN said
<seb128> hey davidcalle :-)
<davidcalle> willcooke (willcook_e), any suggestion? I would go for "Switching from Unity to Gnome-Shell: first challenges"
<willcooke> davidcalle, wfm :)
<davidcalle> Yay :)
<davidcalle> Hey seb128 and oSoMoN ;)
<willcooke> davidcalle, there is another laney blog post already, which I will add to co-schedule today
<davidcalle> +1, thanks!
<andyrock> good morning!
<seb128> hey andyrock, how are you? had a good w.e?
<andyrock> hey seb128 I went to the beach
<andyrock> what about you?
<seb128> ah, nice
<seb128> it was grey cold and rainy here
<oSoMoN> hey andyrock
<seb128> I didn't do much, went to have a look at some shops to find a table to put outside in summer and otherwise just stayed home and didn't do much
<Trevinho> hey guys
<seb128> good morning Maaarrccooo
<seb128> Trevinho, how are you? had a good w.e?
<Trevinho> seb128: I'm good... Yeah, i had a good one... You saw the pictures, isn't it? :-)
<Trevinho> seb128: how about yourself?
<seb128> Trevinho, yeah, I saw that, seems you always have crazy weekends :-)
<seb128> Trevinho, w.e was good as I was writing on the line just before your hello :-)
<Trevinho> seb128: ahah, recently it happens... But just unplanned things that I join at the last moment
<seb128> well, seems you have fun in any case
<seb128> way to go!
<seb128> hum
<seb128> does anyone know why the daily iso are not getting promoted to current?
<seb128> I always forgot what those tests are and where are the logs
<seb128> jibel, hey, you probably know the details ^?
<jibel> seb128, automated promotion is blocked due to bug 1700557. I'll promote it manually
<ubot5> bug 1700557 in linux (Ubuntu) "VM doesn't boot after installation until an input event is received" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1700557
<seb128> jibel, was that the issue you were looking at when you had that packages list diff where none seemed like a candidate for the issue? did you manage to find one that would create the issue on updating?
<seb128> jibel, thanks
<jibel> seb128, yeah but the package list is unrelated
<jibel> seb128, it's a really weird issue
<jibel> seb128, it seems to depend on the order of installation of the packages
<seb128> weird
<jibel> seb128, and it happens very early in the boot process. the boot order is involved, it's like the system is blocked on the lack of entropy
<seb128> going to be a fun one to debug :-/
<duflu> OK, I think Tuesday I'll get back into Pulse. But only because GStreamer make me want to violently break things
<duflu> Fix one bug and you just hit a bunch more, in a mountain of plugins
<seb128> :-(
<duflu> seb128: It's fine. Another day. I just had to give it a few days analysis to assess the situation
<seb128> in any case it sounds like you should think about calling it a day and get dinner at this time!
<duflu> seb128, indeed. I was waiting for a clean context switch opportunity
<duflu> Although separating all the decode bugs from the display bugs, I might be able to actually close some
<oSoMoN> seb128, while IÂ work to resolve the i386 LO build failures, an updated amd64 snap (5.3.4, strict confinement) is available for testing at https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/+snap/libreoffice/+build/52056
<oSoMoN> and anyone else interested in giving it a try, feedback welcome ^
<duflu> Trevinho, the new battery icons are now design approved. Do we have to wait on some other review for visual things?
<Trevinho> duflu: I guess, no... I'll check that shortly
<duflu> Kay, night
<jibel> seb128, build 20170703 have been promoted to current
<seb128> jibel, thanks!
<seb128> oSoMoN, great, I had that on my list for today
<ricotz> oSoMoN, hi, jfyi, more logs regarding the i386 ftbfs -- https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/ubuntu/ppa/+packages
<oSoMoN> ricotz, yeah, Iâm getting the same failures in another PPA and when building an i386 snap too
<jbicha> didrocks: hi, could you promote the xwayland binary to main to unblock gnome-session from -proposed?
<didrocks> jbicha: sure, let me look at the bug report about xwayland dep first
<didrocks> why 3.24.1-0ubuntu7 and 3.24.1-0ubuntu8 have the same changelog?
<didrocks> amd64 failed for -0ubuntu7. Normally, we do upload -0ubuntu8 with the additional fix + -v<olderversion> to include both
<didrocks> (xwayland promoted)
<jbicha> didrocks: they aren't the same changelog
<jbicha> thanks
<seb128> jbicha, why was the arch any/all change needed?
<jbicha> dpkg-gencontrol: error: the Depends field contains an arch-specific dependency but the package is architecture all
<jbicha> in Debian, it's gnome-session-bin that depends on xwayland but that's not really right (at least for Ubuntu flavors)
<seb128> does it depends on it for technical reasons?
<seb128> like what happens if xwayland is not installed?
<didrocks> no wayland session available
<didrocks> in gdm it doesn't list it
<didrocks> in lightdm, it does list it but doesn't start
<seb128> I guess there is no issue worth discussing there and I will just stop asking questions and let people deal with work :p
<seb128> thanks didrocks, jbicha
<jbicha> np
<seb128> the first question was because I was unsure if an arch all package could depends on "binary" which is arch specific if the arch is not coded
<seb128> like libraries or built code is not fine
<seb128> but if it's just depending on "xwayland" for example I was curious if that was allowed or not
<seb128> that might have to do with the [linux] arch use though
<jibel> didrocks, there are 2 issues with the migration script after an upgrade from a default installation: 1. amazon is gone. 2. system settings is kept to unity-control-center which is correct but should probably be migrated to gnome-control-center
<didrocks> jibel: amazon is gone? you had amazon in the old launcher but it didn't transition to the new desktop version from Lane_y?
<jibel> didrocks,yes
<didrocks> jibel: on the second one, good idea, we should transition from u-c-c to g-c-c
<jbicha> seb128: oh, that's probably it then; I just copied the [linux-any] from Debian, but I guess Ubuntu could drop it
<seb128> jbicha, I don't think it matters much either way, I was mostly curious
<seb128> it's not  a case we hit often
<didrocks> jibel: let me have a look, I did the amazon thingy on purpose and tested it, probably another issue after it then
<didrocks> thanks for testing :)
<jibel> didrocks, right, that's why i checked amazon :)
<seb128> didrocks, does amazon requires to pull in a new package?
<jbicha> seb128: thanks for thinking about it more, I didn't understand why I hadn't seen that kind of error more often
<didrocks> seb128: the package is pulled normally, no?
<jibel> seb128, what's the name of the package?
<seb128> didrocks, I didn't try upgrades or looked at what pulled it in
<didrocks> jibel: did you try an upgrade?
<didrocks> or did you try to have the unity session
<didrocks> make some tweaks
<jibel> didrocks, it's an upgrade from 17.04
<didrocks> and transition to GNOME?
<didrocks> ahah
<didrocks> maybe seb128 is right, and Lane_y didn't make it pulled on upgrade
<didrocks> let me look
<jbicha> ubuntu-desktop Recommends: ubuntu-web-launchers
<seb128> jibel, ^ I guess jbicha is saying it's this binary
<jibel> it's installed
<jbicha> jibel: when you say it's gone, you just mean the side-launcher shortcut is gone (GNOME calls their side dock the "dash"), not the app itself right?
<jibel> after an upgrade
<jibel> jbicha, it is not in the favorite apps after an upgrade
<jbicha> the .desktop may have been renamed?
<jibel> but it was before
<didrocks> jibel: seb128: I think I know what happens
<didrocks> you upgrade, the old package is removed
<jibel> it's com.canonical.launcher.amazon.desktop
<didrocks> so no more .desktop corresponding to old name
<seb128> unity removes it
<jibel> same than in didrocks' script
<didrocks> unity removes it
<seb128> :-)
<didrocks> and migrationâ¦ without it
<jibel> ah
<didrocks> :p
<jibel> didrocks, do you want bug reports so you can come back to it later?
<didrocks> argh @laney to rename the .desktop
<didrocks> jibel: please file it, yeah
<jibel> okay
<didrocks> at least so that we can double check
<seb128> do we rename for a technical reason?
<didrocks> I guess it was in the "let's follow the GNOME scheme"
<seb128> and GNOME issues :p
<didrocks> so, symlinks?
<andyrock> mpt: hey! please can you let me know when the design is ready, otherwise i'm blocked
<seb128> guess so,  same hack as for others
<seb128> compat
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> then, once all G-S, we won't have that issue
<didrocks> as it doesn't check for .desktop existence
<seb128> right
<jbicha> I don't like those compat symlinks, can't we just use the old name for the .desktop?
<seb128> it means gnome-shell lists inexistant/not working entries?
<didrocks> in the gsettings key, it does, right
<seb128> but filter them away from the rendering then?
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> no "?"
<seb128> I see
<jbicha> seb128: that's useful for Ubiquity in particular
<didrocks> I guess let's add the compat symlink and we can remove post-LTS
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> jbicha, what's the issue with ubiquity?
<jbicha> we want it to be a "favorite", at least in the live image
<mpt> andyrock, understood, sorry for the blockage. Iâm working on it today.
<andyrock> np! I've other stuff to work on :D
<didrocks> well, unity had that, and checking for the .desktop made sense
<seb128> jbicha, right, well it was like that under unity
<jbicha> although maybe we just hack that in the live CD for gnome-shell actually
<seb128> I guess they are pro and co for each way
<jbicha> it's useful if we don't install an email client by default ;)
<seb128> the current way means your config doesn't match what you see, and that the shell does extra work checking for items to discart at every start
<didrocks> yeah, I guess none has the perfect solution
<seb128> but that's trivial work so no big deal
<seb128> jbicha, I fail to see why?
<seb128> what do email clients have to do with that?!
<jbicha> When you install thunderbird, it will show as a favorite. When you uninstall it, Thunderbird won't show up as a favorite
<jibel> didrocks, bug 1702089 and bug 1702091
<ubot5> bug 1702089 in gnome-session (Ubuntu) "Amazon removed from the favorite apps after an upgrade from 17.04 to artful" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1702089
<ubot5> bug 1702091 in gnome-session (Ubuntu) "upgrade to artful: Migrate unity-control-center to gnome-control-center " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1702091
<didrocks> jibel: thanks a lot! I'll reassign to the correct component
<seb128> jbicha, that sounds like the issue Didier reported, under Unity installing something from gnome-software would add the something icon to the launcher/favorites
<seb128> which is currently missing under GNOME
<didrocks> yep, I don't see why some apps would be different
<didrocks> cleaning up makes sense, the only issue is those use case: transitions to new names without having the possibility to delay it
<seb128> renaming .desktop is just wrong and creating issues
<seb128> it's not the only one
<seb128> we talked the other days about mimetype associations as well
<didrocks> yeah, it's complex and not well-supported for sure
<seb128> oh well, it's done now
<seb128> thanks GNOME
<didrocks> (TBH, that one isn't really GNOME's fault :p)
<seb128> right
 * didrocks tests quickly the symlink
<seb128> it was just L_aney being overzealous and copying them
<jbicha> didrocks: I'm not sure using a symlink like that is a good idea
<didrocks> jbicha: it's what we did for quite some desktop file AFAIK
<didrocks> and what we discussed here ^
<didrocks> the only issue is duplication in the dash/app search, but I guess it's the pain of this transition
<jbicha> didrocks: that's not how we did it for other apps
<jbicha> and yes, duplication in the Activities Overview is a bug
<didrocks> any suggestions thus?
<jbicha> if you want to see how we did it for other apps, look at the gedit packaging for instance
<jbicha> my #1 recommendation is that since we control the .desktop filename for this app is to just go back to the old name
<didrocks> could have been more explicit before the upload btw
<didrocks> rather than venting afterwards :p
<didrocks> I don't see a OnlyShowIn in the .desktop
<jbicha> GNOME changed .desktop names primarily to help with Flatpak integration or something but I don't think anyone wants to Flatpak this
<jbicha> it adds a NoDisplay=true
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> doesn't help the unity case though
<didrocks> OR
<didrocks> we need another transition file to keep unity
<jbicha> the compat thing we use for gedit and others is broken too but different
<didrocks> which isn't ideal
<didrocks> so you trade a symlink for 2 transitions
<jbicha> I'm sorry you felt I was venting
<jbicha> I'm not sure I could have given good feedback before I knew what you were doing ;)
<didrocks> 14:37:09      didrocks | so, symlinks?
<didrocks> a symlink is a symlink :p
<didrocks> 14:37:18        seb128 | guess so,  same hack as for others
<jbicha> yes, sorry
<didrocks> any reason the NoDisplay=true is on the new desktop name?
<didrocks> I guess just to avoid having that migration script running
<jbicha> that's one of the issues I have with the compat hack! ;)
<didrocks> so, it means: migration script in unity session + additional desktop instead of symlink with NoDisplay=true
<didrocks> could do
<didrocks> just a little bit more involved
<jbicha> ok, but why?
<didrocks> well, if we are going to migrate everything at some point, let's not add another one to migrate
<jbicha> why do we need to use a different name for the .desktop in artful than we used in zesty?
<didrocks> that was a question for L_aney I gues
<didrocks> guess*
<didrocks> he did that name change
<didrocks> without considering backward compat apparently
<didrocks> seb128: thoughts? we could do that (double migration) or just go back to older name ^
<didrocks> I'm fine with either
<seb128> there is no hurry, maybe wait next week for Iain to be back so we can check if he had a reason for the rename or if he feels strongly about it?
<didrocks> then, if one day we migrate and handle desktop name properly, we migrate everything in batch (including mimetypes)
<didrocks> ok
<jbicha> didrocks: there's more discussion about the compat issues at LP: #1662296
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1662296 in unity (Ubuntu) "Remap renamed .desktop files" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1662296
<didrocks> so, we keep the symlink for now?
<jbicha> I'm fine with waiting until he gets back
<didrocks> jbicha: yeah, I have that bug opened in a tab
<jbicha> it was too complicated for me to do everything La_ney suggested, all I did was point out some issues I had with the current implementation :(
<didrocks> I guess at some point we'll just have to be able to do that in a performant way. Implementations need to be decided
<didrocks> not a fan with a .d/ checking for more
<seb128> jbicha, what do you think about building a gnome-control-center-faces from g-c-c?
<rbasak> My system seems to have switched to GNOME smoothly. Good job!
<rbasak> One minor issue: I had to remove xserver-xorg-input-synaptics manually. With it installed (as it was by default from Unity previously) the mouse was a little broken.
<rbasak> Known issue?
<jbicha> rbasak: yes, LP: #1686081 there was talk about fixing Unity to work with libinput and backporting that to xenial
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1686081 in xorg (Ubuntu) "If -synaptics is installed, GNOME Mouse & Touchpad Settings doesn't work" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1686081
<seb128> jbicha, fixing unity is another issue of having synaptic not removed on upgrade
<rbasak> jbicha: thanks, though I'd s/18.04/17.10/ in most of that, since it'll happen to all users upgrading from 17.04 to Artful as I understand it?
<seb128> jbicha, we could remove synaptic and make the unity config dialog useless
<rbasak> (sort of a higher level bug I mean - not that it happens, but that it is triggered on the specific default upgrade case)
<seb128> rbasak, it's something we know about and will resolve before 17.10 one way or another
<rbasak> Thanks :)
<seb128> yw
<seb128> good to know that things mostly worked for you though :-)
<seb128> did you have a chance to use a bit GNOME yet? how does it feel?
<jbicha> GNOME (or at least the former gnome-control-center maintainer) wishes that distros would just remove synaptics completely
<rbasak> It seems straightforward enough
<jbicha> not sure how much of a problem that is for other desktops
<rbasak> (never used recent GNOME)
<seb128> things you like or find weird? (always good to get some feedback from unity users upgrading)
<tjaalton> jbicha: I think most have migrated to libinput by now
<tjaalton> if not all
<oSoMoN> seb128, if you don't object to it Iâm going to push that LOÂ 5.3.4 snap to the store (beta channel) and write about it to get some community testing. It'll be amd64 and armhf only for now, until the i386 build issue is resolved
<rbasak> The Mouse & Touchpad settings appears with a shortened height until it gets refreshed somehow. Papercut level.
<seb128> jbicha, typical GNOME :-)
<tjaalton> seb128: well, libinput upstream did port the other desktop capplets tho
<tjaalton> just not unity, for some reason ;)
<seb128> oSoMoN, sure, go ahead, and thanks for the reminder I'm going to test your new snap now (well, time to install it etc)
<rbasak> Going from "Test Your Settings" back to the actual settings themselves is confusing. I press the back button expecting it to take me there and instead I get the settings menu.
<jbicha> rbasak: there's an overhaul of g-c-c scheduled for 3.26 so that height bug may be obsolete then
<oSoMoN> seb128, cheers
<rbasak> I'm being told about an XPS 13 9360 update, but nothing seems to happen when I click Update.
<tjaalton> rbasak: if it's a bios update then something might happen when you reboot
<rbasak> tjaalton: I've rebooted since; nothing happened that I saw. The update still shows as available (AIUI).
<tjaalton> ah
<rbasak> But even if it did, the UI should tell me I need to reboot :)
<tjaalton> right
<rbasak> I was a bit surprised to find that the power button suspends; I was expecting a menu. I can get used to that though :)
<seb128> you are not the first to say that
<rbasak> Just did some Googling to figure out that I have dynamic workspaces. I can get used to that now that I understand that they're there :)
<rbasak> That's everything from the last half hour or so :)
 * rbasak resumes regular work
<seb128> thanks for the feedback
<jbicha> rbasak: you can make them static in Tweak Tool ( sudo apt install gnome-tweak-tool )
<seb128> I wonder if the power button behaviour is worth arguing upstream for
<rbasak> jbicha: I found that in my Googling, but I prefer to be minimal in what I tweak, so I don't want to install no tweak tool :)
<jbicha> hmm, ok
<jbicha> most GNOME distros include it by default (Fedora doesn't but RHEL does!)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> seems reverse :-)
<jbicha> Fedora tries to follow the GNOME definitions of what should be in GNOME
<jbicha> RHEL cares more about pleasing their customers ;)
<seb128> I though they would care also about looking polished
<jbicha> ugh, I don't think GNOME Classic's theme is very polished personally
<seb128> "here is a toolbox you might need to unscrew you because our settings don't let you configure what you need" is not the best message to send to your users
<jbicha> because GNOME developers don't use GNOME Classic so Classic is basically in maintenance mode for years
<seb128> you have a point there
<andyrock> seb128: do we have a list of extension that we are going to include in 17.10?
<seb128> andyrock, we didn't decide on that yet, the ones we asked about in the survey are listed on https://insights.ubuntu.com/2017/06/12/ubuntu-desktop-gnome-extensions-poll-results/
<Beret> rbasak, you're going to have install the tweak-tool at least in the short term
<Beret> until the default extensions are installed and our settings are tweaked the way we want them
<Beret> at least if you liked a majority of the defaults in unity
<gQuigs> is the tweak tool the only way to manage the extensions?
<Beret> I don't use that to manage extensions
<Beret> I just use a web browser for that
<Beret> the tweak tool let's you mess with some settings (like date format) that are not found by default in configuration
<rbasak> Beret: I'm going to try and ride the defaults as they change. Let's see how I manage :)
<Trevinho> anyone know what changed in artful so that now I need to explicitly build-dep on dbus-x11 in u7?
<Trevinho> it wasn't needed last friday or yesterday... I think
<willcooke> I was talking to flexiondotorg about shipping tweak tool by default last week actually.  My initial thought was "no way", but there is some really useful stuff in there.  IMO it's analogous to ccsm (perhaps less dangerous) so I'd still say don't ship by default, and we can change the settings we need without it.
<jbicha> some of that useful stuff is stuff that we had in unity-control-center
<jbicha> Trevinho: see https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2016/08/msg00554.html
<jbicha> Trevinho: unity recommends unity-session which depends on gnome-session-bin which depends on dbus-x11 though
<Trevinho> jbicha: yeah, but we use it for running the tests...
<jbicha> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=835887
<ubot5> Debian bug 835887 in src:gnome-session "gnome-session: don't run dbus-launch if XDG_RUNTIME_DIR/bus is available" [Normal,Open]
<Trevinho> jbicha: I've adeded it to build deps anyway
<Trevinho> not directly though
<Trevinho> I guess gio does it
<jbicha> so I don't know if GNOME or Unity actually runs without dbus-x11 installed since it's kind of hard to run things without gnome-sesion-bin
<Trevinho> I've not checked
<Trevinho> gnome-shell runs withouth for sure, at least... without having it running
<jbicha> the test probably needs to be fixed to not require dbus-x11?
<jbicha> the only other thing in main that depends on dbus-x11 is ubiquity but I was hesitant to push there because it's hard for me to tell if ubiquity works fine without it
<oSoMoN> seb128, willcooke: https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/call-for-testing-libreoffice-5-3-4-snap/1205
<oSoMoN> (will now re-post to g+)
<willcooke> oSoMoN, great!
<oSoMoN> https://plus.google.com/100486649727917304321/posts/g2zWPFx75DW
 * willcooke shares
<willcooke> sharing is caring, etc.
<willcooke> ;)
<oSoMoN> :)
<Trevinho> seb128: once this has been approved (if you care) by britney please publish it https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2843 :-)
<willcooke> night all
<oSoMoN> nighty night
<seb128> Trevinho, k, done now
<Trevinho> seb128: thanks
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-07-04
<jamesh> robert_ancell: do you think there is much chance of convincing niemeyer to consider polkit?
<robert_ancell> jamesh, I gave up
<robert_ancell> jamesh, I think the current solution is workable. Unfortunately Polkit doesn't fit well into the snap architecture - it's very much designed from the ground up.
<robert_ancell> When I patched it the first time there weren't good D-Bus libraries available
<jamesh> robert_ancell: in the desktop sprint thread on the forum, I suggested adding this as something the client would have to opt in to
<robert_ancell> jamesh, the snapd client?
<jamesh> so it wouldn't conflict with any existing use cases
<robert_ancell> or snapd itself?
<jamesh> yeah.  so the client would send something like "Authorization: polkit" in the request headers
<robert_ancell> oh, I see
<jamesh> and snapd would only make the polkit CheckAuthorization request in that case.
<jamesh> otherwise, the existing logic would run its course.
<jamesh> something like this could also be used to determine whether to do interactive polkit auth or not
<jamesh> "Authorization: polkit; interactive=1" maybe
<robert_ancell> I remember thinking at the time it was first proposed that there would be some ambiguity in snapd if Polkit was available or not. But now I think about it if snap detects that Polkit is there (i.e. checks D-Bus) then it should use it (or any other mechanism) to after it checks for roto
<robert_ancell> root
<robert_ancell> jamesh, I think that will get shot down because you need both the Macaroon (store credentials) and Polkit.
<robert_ancell> I don't agree with the use of the Macaroon for both store credentials and local access, but niemeyer seems to like that idea
<jamesh> I think it is crazy that we're relying on access tokens that can be passed between security principals without snapd even noticing
<robert_ancell> jamesh, yes
<jamesh> and that the command line tool is effectively storing root access credentials in the user's home directory
<robert_ancell> jamesh, I think it's worth you continuing to raise these issues. You might have better terminology to describe them
<robert_ancell> It's perhaps best to focus on that particular issue and leave the minor issues for now.
<robert_ancell> The solution there might be to tie the Macaroon to a user account, but I don't know enough to say if that's sufficient
<jamesh> robert_ancell: thinking about it some more, if we ever upgrade to a current version of polkit, it wouldn't be too difficult to write a policy that grants access without a password if the user presents a valid store macaroon
<jamesh> since the policies are arbitrary JavaScript functions
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers!
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> TheMuso, hello. May I join ~ubuntu-audio-dev ?
<jibel> morning
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN, didrocks, jibel
<didrocks> hey duflu, morning jibel
<didrocks> jibel: any thoughts on checkbox-converged? is it even used nowdays? (by you or certification team?)
<didrocks> it's bringing up the whole Qt/QML stack on the iso for it
<duflu> and morning seb128
<duflu> and other random Europeans
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey duflu
<jibel> didrocks, no idea if it's still used for anything. I'll ask jerry or chris
<didrocks> jibel: thanks! Keep me posted :)
<duflu> jibel, unless you want to upset him; "Gerry" :)
<pitti> mvo: good morning! thanks for insisting on https://github.com/cockpit-project/cockpit/pull/7131, updated now; mind having another look?
<pitti> err
<pitti> mvo: sorry, I meant our mvo (we have one too!)
<pitti> mvo: so... Good morning! wie gehts? :-)
<didrocks> sounds like he has more characters in his nickname, has he got promoted? :)
 * pitti dit bonjour aux amis franÃ§ais
 * didrocks dit bonjour Ã©galement Ã  pitti
<pitti> didrocks: no, Michael Vogt and Marius Vollmer are both "mvo"; I thought I was in the cockpit channel
<didrocks> pitti: oh, someone using a different nickname between IRC and github? (his nickname there is mvollmer apparently), scandalous! :)
<pitti> didrocks: heh yes, he's mvollmer on freenode, but mvo on internal IRC
<didrocks> sounds like a trap just targeted at you! :)
<andyrock> good morning
<didrocks> hey andyrock
<duflu> koza, Debian has caught up as of 2 days ago, and is apparently using their preferred DEP-14 layout. Maybe we should switch to that... https://anonscm.debian.org/git/pkg-bluetooth/bluez.git/
<didrocks> +1
<seb128> hey andyrock
<seb128> salut pitti, comment Ã§a va ?
<pitti> seb128: Ã§a va bien, merci ! la derniÃ¨re semaine Ã  Karlsruhe avec mon Ã©quipe Ã©tait grande
<jibel> duflu, I don't understand, why would I upset him?
<seb128> pitti, ah c'est bien pour toi alors !
<jibel> bonjour pitti
<pitti> seb128: we got a lot of stuff done, and finished the week with an electrical go-kart race
<duflu> jibel, it's Gerry as in Gerrard :)
<pitti> bonjour jibel, Ã§a va ?
<duflu> I think mainly Americans assume "Jerry"
<jibel> duflu, no it's Jerry from CE. We are not talking about the same person
<duflu> jibel, Oh... OK. You mentioned Qt :)
<jibel> yeah np :)
<seb128> didrocks, do you think we should go through seed changes and refresh the packages once, or just tweak&rebuild?
<jibel> pitti, Ã§a va bien, happy to work on desktop again :)
<seb128> didrocks, also I was checking with will for a11y-profile-manager yesterday, you think as well that it's fine to nuke it? (you removed unity-accessibility-profiles but there is a gnome variant which we could swap for if we wanted to keep it)
<didrocks> seb128: I was thinking something a little bit more incremental, in case we notice huge regression on an ISO (we have time until FF), wdyt?
<seb128> didrocks, wfm, I had changes I wanted to do and that would have done if I knew you were going to do an upload
<pitti> jibel: nice! so you're becoming a gnome guy at last? :)
<seb128> anyway no big deal, I should probably just have stacked in the vcs
<seb128> didrocks, let me know before your do another upload, just in case I want to sneak those in ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: sorry, yeah, I bzr update first to see if anyone stacked anything, but I would really be in favor of small increments in case something goes wrong
<didrocks> sure :)
<didrocks> seb128: next one is checkbox-converged for the Qt5 stack IMHO
<seb128> didrocks, and for a11y-profile-manager you think it's useless?
<didrocks> once we know from jibel is good for removal
<seb128> I don't know enough about it to be sure
<seb128> it's not unity specific
<seb128> and there is a gnome profile/binary
<seb128> but we don't have a maintainer for it and I'm not sure what it brings
<didrocks> I did remove the binary packages, one was an indicator, the other for unity. and yeah, for the remaining profile, without maintainerâ¦ I would think it's better to take what upstream brings us on that front and retweak
<seb128> k, let's call it a decision, makes things easier, I was investigating on that yesterday
<seb128> if somebody ask I tell them you tool the decision :p
<didrocks> heh, sure :)
<didrocks> just went the pragmatic approach
<didrocks> I didn't remove the rest as I was less sure
<seb128> right, we can iterate
<seb128> we are not going to see the status until gdm is in anyway
<didrocks> eactly
<seb128> or rather unity-greeter out
<didrocks> exactly*
<didrocks> yeah, quite equivalent :)
<seb128> I wonder if it's about time where we nag the security team for a pre-emptive ack to unblock us
<didrocks> I would be in favor of that
<seb128> like ack with the understanding that we are going to address their review issues when they get the review done
<didrocks> as we did for big part of the stack
<seb128> k, let's talk to them about that once they are up
<didrocks> good plan
<seb128> didrocks, do you have any idea how alsa-base get on the iso?
<seb128> I think I'm missing something obvious
<didrocks> seb128: I'm surprise, it's not from the manifest
<didrocks> let me start yesterday's iso
<didrocks> (manifest of germinate-outputs)
<willcooke> morning
<seb128> hey willcooke, how are you today?
<jamesh> hi willcooke
<seb128> hey jamesh
<jamesh> I'm hopeful that we'll be able to convince the snappy folks to add polkit support to snapd: https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/should-we-use-polkit-for-local-auth/1206
<jamesh> If we manage that, the user experience for gnome-software should improve
<seb128> Gustavo doesn't seem close from convinced yet
<seb128> let's see if the new round of arguments from robert and you is enough
<jamesh> yep, but I'm hopeful I can change his mind
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<seb128> jamesh, great, I hope it works out :-)
<jamesh> seb128: one thing I don't like about the current system is that it is the equivalent of storing the root password in a file in the user's home directory
<seb128> yeah
<didrocks> seb128: found it at lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/platform.artful
<didrocks> desktop-common: * alsa-base # needed for proper hardware detection (hotplug/blacklist.d, modprobe.d)
<seb128> didrocks, oh, platform seed, thanks
<didrocks> seb128: sounds like we shouldn't remove it though? But I don't know enough about alsa
<seb128> didrocks, not sure, jbicha asked on some trello card about it, Debian removed that package as "ROM; No longer needed, obsolete"
<seb128> not sure who would have a better clue though
<seb128> pitti, do you have any idea if alsa-base is something that might still have some use for some users/configs?
<pitti> seb128: I don't know for sure; but the modprobe.d scripts might still be relevant
<pitti> and the apport hook of course
<koza> duflu, interesiting, reading
<duflu> koza, also http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep14/
<didrocks> seb128: sounds weird to me to have ubuntu-image on the iso, wdyt?
<duflu> (seems Ubuntu's pulseaudio code is already kept in debian git)
<didrocks> (dep of livecd-rootfs)
<koza> duflu, thanks, good stuff
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<jibel> didrocks, I don't see ubuntu-image on the iso. On which image do you see it?
<seb128> didrocks, weird indeed, do you have the commit/reason why it was added?
<didrocks> jibel: I guess it's only in the live
<didrocks> ah, it's not on the live
<didrocks> interesting, it's in the all germinate output though
<didrocks> I don't know which log file we should base on thus
<didrocks> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/ubuntu.artful/desktop only contains the desktop seed (and not desktop-common and such)
<didrocks> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/ubuntu.artful/all has more than what we ship
<didrocks> unsure there is a file corresponding to the manifest or we need to look at the manifest, and then dig into those file to find what's pulling something in
<didrocks> (all is then clearly "all seeds"
<didrocks> )
<didrocks> talking about spring/summer cleaning: "Source only movements to main": unity
<didrocks> seb128: any idea why? ^
 * didrocks wonders if we have one binary package from unity in main
 * didrocks checks
<didrocks> libunity-core-6.0-9
<didrocks> oh unity-schemas as well is still in main
<didrocks> even unity-services
<didrocks> hum
<didrocks> let's see why
<didrocks> none are on the iso, let's try to demote them and see what's trying to pull them in (I guess something in supported)?
<seb128> didrocks, no idea, yeah, let's see
<didrocks> I just checked all rdepends, nothing in main (for libunity-core, schemas, servicesâ¦)
<didrocks> no build-rdepends either for the -dev
<didrocks> so yeah, let's go empiric
<didrocks> (done, let's look at next publisher cycle)
<didrocks> oh nice, we got the +1 for removing checkbox-converged from the iso
<seb128> where?
<didrocks> email from the cert team (jibel sent one)
<didrocks> should we kick off a build first with the current changes first?
<didrocks> to have a checkpoint, wdyt?
<seb128> k, I guess I was not Cced
 * didrocks looks
<seb128> I would remove checkbox while we are at it
<didrocks> nope
<seb128> I think that's likely going to be the biggest impact
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> so, no iso first?
<didrocks> we do that in the some round?
<seb128> as you prefer
<didrocks> (I'm fine with it)
<seb128> I would drop checkbox
<didrocks> ok
<seb128> and trigger an iso build later
<seb128> or even wait tomorrow
<seb128> depending how eager you are to see the result
<didrocks> anything else you want to change in the seed?
<seb128> let me have a look
<didrocks> as you told you had waiting changes :)
<didrocks> yep
<seb128> I was unsure about adium-theme-ubuntu
<seb128> well, it's not coming from the seed anyway
<seb128> so let's ignore that
 * seb128 reads his tomboy note
<didrocks> I have no opinion on the empathy <-> adium, but I think it's not quite right to install things preemtively for a small part of our audience
<didrocks> (at worst, we should tweak the empathy deps/recommends)
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> let's keep those for the next round
<seb128> in fact most of mines are depends from other packages and not seed
<seb128> the seed ones are alsa-base which I'm unsure about
<seb128> and app-install-data-partner which I'm also unsure about
<jibel> didrocks, so we have a GO to remove checkbox-converged
<didrocks> jibel: yeah, we are discussing it here ^ it's nice! :)
<jibel> well, what you said higher :)
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> seb128: yeah unsure if alsa-base is a safe oneâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, the other ones I had on my lsit you handled in your previous upload
<seb128> so it's good
<seb128> thanks for checking :-)
<didrocks> seb128: hum, /usr/share/app-install/channels/xenial-partner.eula is empty, let me check artful
<seb128> also I'm unsure where that's being used
<seb128> was it a software-center thing?
<seb128> but better to check with L_aney, he knows better those stack I think
<didrocks> it was a way to type/search for a package, get it even if you didn't add the partner repo yet IIRC
<didrocks> seb128: mind adding it to the trello card so that we check with Lane_y?
<seb128> didrocks, done
<didrocks> thx!
<didrocks> uploading the seed with checkbox-converged remove
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> I guess that should remove a lot of qml*
<didrocks> not Qt5 though
<didrocks> (hud/greeter)
<seb128> right
<didrocks> ah, we start to see some movement thanks to the seed changes: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.html
<didrocks> (we'll need to discuss whoopsie at some point)
<didrocks> can't wait to see the greeter off, pulling indicators (and thus, the hud), then ubuntu-app-launch, then up to some zeitgeist libsâ¦
<didrocks> (that's the reason why I don't demote binary only changes, so that we remember about those source/bin packages which are still in main and shouldn't)
<seb128> well demoting binaries is often done in case where the source is to stay in main
<seb128> is whoopsie having a standalone config dialog?
<didrocks> no, it was part of activity-log-manager
<didrocks> whoopsie-preferences is only a dbus service
<seb128> right
<oSoMoN> oh, new battery icons, nice!
<oSoMoN> thanks Daniel
 * willcooke upgrades
<willcooke> woo!
<willcooke> humm, looks ok at the login screen, but still squished in the session
<willcooke> oSoMoN, do you see the same? ^
<oSoMoN> willcooke, I didnât pay attention to it until now, so dunno at the login screen, but it looks good in my session
<oSoMoN> willcooke, this is how it looks here: http://people.canonical.com/~osomon/battery.png
<willcooke> kk, same here
<willcooke> but different on the login screen
<willcooke> I'll see what's going on and log a bug
<oSoMoN> dunno if itâs supposed to look different, but itâs a net improvement over what there was before
<willcooke> that icon looks a bit horizontally squashed to me
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> humm, another bug perhaps...
<willcooke> Plug in the power, get the charging battery icon, unplug the power - still have the charging icon
<didrocks> willcooke: login screen, as in using gdm ofc?
<willcooke> ahh, yes, I'm still on lightdm here
<willcooke> didrocks, ^
<didrocks> makes sense IMHO, may not be a symbolic icon
 * didrocks demotes ubuntu-defaults-builder (sorry pitti) and removes it from supported seed, as it's what pulling unity source (due to a dep on unity-common which is now a virtual package)
<didrocks> interesting side-effect about Provides:. I bet the package can't be built anyway (it was using unity-common for the schema)
<didrocks> with that, I think unity source package won't be willing again to be pulled to main
<pitti> didrocks: oh, yes please -- this hasn't really been supported for ages
<didrocks> waow, effect of removing unity demotion + latest changes: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.html
 * didrocks demotes more and more
<didrocks> this is demotion day
<didrocks> and ubuntu-ui-toolkit is on the list \o/
<muktupavels> Trevinho: https://code.launchpad.net/~muktupavels/compiz/motif-wm-hints/+merge/326777
<Trevinho> muktupavels, flexiondotorg: is that somethiong we want in xenial too?
<Trevinho> muktupavels: so bad I did a landing yesterday :-(
<muktupavels> trevinho: https://askubuntu.com/questions/928226/xprop-fails-to-undecorate-window
<Trevinho> muktupavels: what is the standard by the way?
<muktupavels> ?
<Trevinho> muktupavels: also why not using XA_CARDINAL instead of anytype?
<muktupavels> Trevinho: I used it because it is used in metacity
<Trevinho> mh, I see... ok fine
<Trevinho> muktupavels: can you please open a bug?
<muktupavels> Trevinho: ok
<Trevinho> ta
<jbicha> didrocks: Independence Day ;)
<mitya57> didrocks, thanks for checkbox-converged and ui-toolkit demotion! :)
<didrocks> jbicha: ahah, good matching :)
<didrocks> mitya57: yw!
 * willcooke offers jbicha a cup of tea 
<muktupavels> Trevinho: https://bugs.launchpad.net/compiz/+bug/1702297
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1702297 in Compiz "Compiz ignores _MOTIF_WM_HINTS set from xprop" [Undecided,New]
<Trevinho> muktupavels: thanks
<Trevinho> muktupavels: sru compliant, awesome
<didrocks> willcooke: would you dare offering milk/cream with it though? :p
<jbicha> willcooke: uh, thanks I guess ;)
<willcooke> :D
<GunnarHj> Hi willcooke, I asked about an ISO size matter the other day:
<GunnarHj> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-desktop/2017-June/005028.html
<GunnarHj> jbicha, who has reviewed, deferred it to the team. Would be great if a decision could be made on today's meeting ( off meeting is fine for me too ;) ).
<seb128> lol
<seb128> hey GunnarHj
<GunnarHj> seb128: Hi Seb!
<didrocks> I think no decision should be made before we finish the transition
<didrocks> (meaning gdm on the iso, no more big cleanup possible)
<didrocks> so that we know where we stand with
<seb128> didrocks, it's a bit orthogonal discussions though?
<seb128> I mean it's going to be "is it ok to take a 90M hit to get those packages"
<didrocks> well, depends if we want to go back to a reasonable iso size
<didrocks> yeah, that as well
<didrocks> I guess we can talk about it right now anyway, I doubt other than the ones present are interested in it, wdyt?
<willcooke> +1 talk now works for me
<seb128> we are not going to fix on a 700M cd, so being 1.5 instead or 1.6 or 1.7 instead of 1.8 isn't changing the outcome much I think
<didrocks> (a little bit ironic we just, we just removed 60+ packages of the iso)
<seb128> now seems fine to me
<seb128> 60Mb or packages?
<seb128> or 60 binaries?
<willcooke> so, taking the amd64 iso as an example:  we're at 1.5GB
<didrocks> seb128: binaries
<seb128> k
<willcooke> Trusty was 1GB
<seb128> warty was under 600M :p
<willcooke> So we've already grown 500MB in the last 3 years, right?
<jbicha> seb128: you really should upgrade soon ;)
<jbicha> (lol)
<seb128> haha
<didrocks> jbicha: shhh, he has still 2 menu entries in gnome-panel, don't shock him with the 3rd one upgrading to hoary :p
<willcooke> didrocks, any guesses as to where we'll be when the transition is done?
<willcooke> is this a net zero increase (i.e. we dropped the same as we'd add)
<didrocks> willcooke: back to our discussion, depends on the security team and kenvandine to be done with lightdm -> gdm
<didrocks> then, add a week for the final cleaning
<jbicha> I don't think demoting lightdm will save us much iso space, but it will make the manifest make more sense without indicator packages
<seb128> willcooke, I would guess we win some space but not so much, still over 1.3G
<didrocks> jbicha: it will
<didrocks> jbicha: pulling indicator, hence qt5, hence ubuntu-app-launch, hence zeitgeist
<jbicha> oh ok
<seb128> the biggest win is probably when we get qt out the iso
<didrocks> not enormous, but will still count :)
<jbicha> nautilus and totem-plugins still depend on zg
<didrocks> yeah, I guess we can drop them or handling them smartly
<seb128> discussion is drifting
<didrocks> but that's why we need some time to do a second round of cleaning, once the manifest will be easier to read :)
<didrocks> anyway
<GunnarHj> One problem with keeping things like this pending is that it makes progress of related work harder.
<willcooke> either way, I think an extra 60MB is ok
<didrocks> back to language, yeah
<didrocks> did anyone test the additional size?
<jbicha> I just have to figure out how to get tracker in without seb noticing ;)
<willcooke> :D
<didrocks> that's round 0 when making this kind of proposal
<didrocks> jbicha: ahah :p
<seb128> didrocks, GunnarHj has numbers in his emails
<didrocks> ah, not the MP, numbers
 * didrocks reopen the email
<seb128> but it's installed sizes
<seb128> so not iso
<didrocks> GunnarHj: do you have the deb size?
<didrocks> as we approximate deb size with iso size
<jbicha> didrocks: I asked jibel about that last week and he said installed-size was a better estimate?
<didrocks> but yeah, I think we should stick to the principle I raised in that email a year and half ago, meaning: offline installation possible, without any further question
<seb128> those debs at 10M each for well translated languages
<seb128> for 7 languages = 70M
<didrocks> jbicha: hum? I'm surprised, we always used deb size as it's squashfs compression, so similar to ar
<seb128> gnome-getting-started-docs*
<seb128> it's the same order anyway
<seb128> 70M deb vs 80M installed
<didrocks> sounds ok to me
<jbicha> I guess those videos are already compressed and those are the biggest part of updating the proposal?
<didrocks> the video is only present once, correct?
<didrocks> then + subtitle
 * didrocks wget
<jbicha> the video itself can be translated https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/stable/figures/gnome-task-switching.webm.fr
<didrocks> indeed, some are even
<didrocks> that's different from what I saw on latest fedora's on bochecha's latptop
<didrocks> but ok, so the size is coming from the videos
<seb128> which is why I guess those locales are taking 10M deb
<seb128> where others are hundred of kbs
<GunnarHj> seb128: So it is.
<didrocks> 11M on the video directory
<didrocks> (french)
<seb128> is that video that useful?
<didrocks> anyway, I think it makes sense to add them for the languages we claim complete default support.
<didrocks> seb128: fedora starts the page presenting them by default
<seb128> what page?
<didrocks> like showing how to reach for the dash
<didrocks> gnome-help with the introduction to G-S
<seb128> ah
<jbicha> seb128: when GNOME Initial Setup completes, it opens the Getting Started page with the videos right there
<seb128> do they auto open yelp on first loggin?
<didrocks> however, *if* we tweak the default experience via extensions (which isn't discussed yet), we may have some discrepancies there
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, first user login after install
<seb128> I see
<didrocks> only 3 videos are shown though
<seb128> good point about extensions
<didrocks> then, you have to go to subpages to see others
<jbicha> I'm hoping jackpot_51 will send his email to the list this week about adding Initial Setup (I pinged him a couple days ago but it's holiday today)
<seb128> anyway, going back to the topic, I'm a bit torned
<seb128> 100M is not a trivial hit for the iso
<seb128> it's easy to dismiss medium-sized addition like that
<seb128> but you do that a few time and your iso is 1.7G instead of 1.1G and I think it has an impact
<willcooke> 1.5GB seems like a good max. size to me
<seb128> slows down downloads, installs, has cost on mirrors, etc
<willcooke> so if it's net cost zero - +1
<seb128> +1 for me as well if we win enough to make for the cost of the suggestion addition
<seb128> -0.3 otherwise
<willcooke> :D
<didrocks> (mod(2))
<seb128> I'm in favor of having the languages install work offline and without post install nagging though
<seb128> so if we are over I might suggest we do something about the video
<seb128> maybe re-encode at lower definition
<willcooke> what codec does it use?  x264?
<seb128> I wonder if we could have a look at re-encoding and how much we would trade off on size vs quality
<didrocks> webm
<willcooke> kk
<GunnarHj> seb128: That aspect is even more important now, when we no longer will have language-selector-gnome to get the rest....
<didrocks> would be hard to get better compression/size rate
<seb128> well, we could lower quality or resolution
<seb128> maybe
<didrocks> 854Â xÂ 480, it's not much already :/
<seb128> I didn't look at it
<didrocks> and using the On2 extension
<willcooke> didrocks, webm vp8 or 9? Do you know?
<didrocks> worth a try, but unsure how much smaller they can be
<didrocks> vp8
<didrocks> could try with 9
<seb128> 10M is not that big for a video I guess
 * willcooke fires up handbrake
<didrocks> it's 10M for ~5:30min
<seb128> GunnarHj, hold on, why don't we have language-selector-gnome?
<GunnarHj> seb128: That was my assumption. Since g-c-c includes language handling.
<jbicha> we just need to fix LP: #1631750 first
<seb128> that's a topic we didn't really look at yet
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1631750 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Language installation doesn't work in Ubuntu GNOME 16.10 Settings app" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1631750
<didrocks> willcooke: compress the french ones please, it's the deciding factor as you know :p
<seb128> we could decide to disable that panel
<seb128> or improve it
<seb128> or have both
<willcooke> didrocks, mais oui
<GunnarHj> seb128, jbicha: Indeed there are issues that must be resolved. Maybe I jumped at conclusion.
<seb128> GunnarHj, having main languages complete on the iso isn't good enough/a justification for not having support for other locales
<seb128> so we need to fix the langpack installation situation in any case
<GunnarHj> seb128: Very true. So a possible dropping of language-selector-gnome will need to be carefully considered anyway.
<seb128> right
<seb128> jbicha, btw did you see my comment yesterday about -faces?
<seb128> oSoMoN, I played a bit with libreoffice 5.3.4 snap, works nicely, well done!
<didrocks> I don't feel we came to the bottom on this TBH, should we separate the -frami discussion?
<seb128> didrocks, -frami?
<seb128> video size?
<didrocks> seb128: top part of the email
<didrocks> there are 2 things:
<didrocks> - dictionary for -de
<didrocks> - videos/welcoming thing
<didrocks> description of the -frami ones are:
<seb128> ah, -frami are the de dicts
<didrocks>  This package contains a enhanced version by Franz Michael Baumann with
<didrocks>  some words missing in the base dictionary or not (yet) belonging to the
<didrocks>  "core" German words.
<seb128> GunnarHj, do you know why those dicts are so much bigger?
<jbicha> seb128: I guess we should so we can drop unity-control-center source from main
<seb128> jbicha, k, I was mostly asking you in case you had objections to add a binary to g-c-c
<didrocks> +1 (that's the last thing keeping u-c-c in main AFAIK)
<seb128> like it's extra divergence from Debian
<GunnarHj> language-selector has pulled -frami for several cycles, since it's my understanding that German users prefer it. No, I can't tell offhand why it's so much bigger.
<didrocks> GunnarHj: a *lot* of new words :p Ok, maybe that was my bad when seeding the dicts for -de and I didn't notice the difference
<jbicha> seb128: we already diverge there because we can't have both -control-centers install the same files so it's ok with me
<seb128> jbicha, ok, I'm going to do those  changes then
<seb128> so we can demote u-c-c
<jbicha> thanks
<seb128> didrocks, ^ fyi
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, looks good, want me to deal with this?
<seb128> didrocks, no, it's fine, I started yesterday with the packaging changes
<didrocks> good :)
<seb128> but thanks for asking :-)
<seb128> so going back to the iso topic
<didrocks> seb128: I didn't demote the other binaries as a reminder for this
<didrocks> (from u-c-c)
<seb128> good
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> so, shipping the -frami ones? I don't have any opinion, just that we should fix the seed or language-selector
<seb128> I don't feel like arguing against what german teams though was best for their locale
<seb128> so +1 for that even if it's a small size hit
<didrocks> agreed
<seb128> good, seems we have one decision
<didrocks> and nowâ¦ videos! :)
<seb128> then for the gnome documentation
<seb128> I think the offline install/popup-less experience is worth it
<seb128> so we should include what is needed
<seb128> but then we should maybe look at what we can do to spare some size
<seb128> like I don't know how much we need those videos on the iso
<seb128> especially if we end up having a dock which is different from what the video describes
<jbicha> without language-selector-gnome, I don't think we'd have a popup
<didrocks> the video doesn't invalide the dash to dock, but yeah, the workflow would be different from what we may want to promote
<jbicha> GNOME Software can do langpack stuff but it'll need a bunch of work there LP: #1678670
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1678670 in langpack-o-matic "Add appstream metadata to language packs" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1678670
<seb128> jbicha, it feels like "nothing is going to prompt you to install support for your locale" which is a regression we need to fix
<seb128> it's not acceptable for not-installed-by-default locales to not prompt the users
<jbicha> seb128: I believe it will install the support when you choose the locale in gnome-control-center
<seb128> it's just resulting to non translated desktops for those users
<jbicha> it should work in Ubuntu GNOME 16.04 (packagekit 1.0 regressed that)
<seb128> jbicha, then you expect users to open g-c-c and navigate it in a language they don't understand
<seb128> which has some issues
<jbicha> hmm?
<seb128> - they are not going to know they can do that
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Only newly installed languages. Languages which were incompletely installed by the installer won't be prompted for additions, if I understand it correctly.
<seb128> - they might not find it
<seb128> - they might not understand the language of the UI to get where they need
<jbicha> how are they going to set their computer to a different locale?
<seb128> "different"?
<seb128> you select your language in ubiquity
<seb128> if you do an offline greek install
<seb128> then reboot
<seb128> and connect to wifi
<jbicha> ok, yes I don't think GNOME handles that very well
<seb128> with language-selector your get prompted to install the support for your locale
<jbicha> we could fix GNOME Software to do that, or we could keep that part of language-selector-gnome
<seb128> right
<seb128> I'm going to create a card about that
<jbicha> but ideally we wouldn't have its control-center panel since the GNOME ones works fine
<seb128> indeed
<didrocks> dialog + opening g-c-c panel otherwise? (but it's work)
<seb128> g-c-c panel doesn't know about langpacks though
<seb128> it has no UI to communicate that a language is configured but misses debs to work
<seb128> afaik
<jbicha> seb128: it might in 16.04?
<seb128> we are probably going to need work on that panel anyway
<jbicha> I don't know
<seb128> needs testing
<seb128> I'm going to create a card to investigate the topic
<jbicha> the panel is broken right now :(
<seb128> right
<GunnarHj> seb128: Please let me know where that card is. I'm a bit interested. :)
<seb128> we already have a card in the trello board about that
<seb128> GunnarHj, the url of the trello board is in the topic
<didrocks> GunnarHj: on your MP, you should do something like that rather than duplicating the package names: http://paste.ubuntu.com/25018466/
<didrocks> GunnarHj: I did spent quite some time to get those loops working correctly to avoid all those duplication, per language, so feel free to continue on that path please ;)
<didrocks> (I can add that as a reminder on the MP)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Thanks, I'll take a look at the trello board later.
<seb128> we covered quite some topics now
<seb128> didrocks, what's your conclusion on the iso size/languages support suggested changes?
<oSoMoN> seb128, ack, glad to know that you didnât find any obvious issue with it :) letâs see if my call for testing gets us some useful feedback
<seb128> willcooke, ^ yours?
<GunnarHj> didrocks: Thanks for the tip. I did use that technique for some of the packages, but not all.. Will take another look.
<didrocks> GunnarHj: just wrote a reminder :)
<didrocks> seb128: well, -frami is a no brainer. I'm with you on the video, concerned about size AND consistency if we add extensions
<didrocks> sounds like Will is trying to reencode with vp9
<willcooke> nearly done
<didrocks> let's see what that gives
<willcooke> it's smaller
<willcooke> one sec
<didrocks> as long as it's not bigger on the insideâ¦ :)
<seb128> didrocks, I see what you did there
<seb128> :p
<didrocks> ;)
<seb128> jbicha, btw do you plan to push forward on some of those suggested additions to the default install? the discussions seem to have stalled
<seb128> oSoMoN, btw did you get any reply for kernel team about the issue that hits the libreoffice i386 builds?
<jbicha> seb128: yes, it's in my backlog so it may take some time before it's done
<didrocks> so, the iso jibel kicked after the removal of quite some packages still boot \o/
<seb128> jbicha, no worry, I just wanted to check and to make sure you know that the questions on the list were not pushing against having some in, we just need to make sure we look at them properly before integrating them
<didrocks> (not that much of a surprise TBH ;))
<willcooke> didrocks, seb128 - vp9 is approx 1/2 the size
<willcooke> looks the same quality to me
<seb128> that's a good win
<willcooke> on a very quick inspection
<didrocks> waow
<didrocks> totem opens them without any additional codec install?
<willcooke> http://paste.ubuntu.com/25018555/
<didrocks> looks promising!
<willcooke> didrocks, works here, but I need to test in a virgin machine
<didrocks> willcooke: you may have your contribution to upstream :)
<jbicha> willcooke: https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-getting-started-docs/tree/animation (specifically line 39 of gnomerender.py)
<jbicha> that directory is not shipped in the tarball but I'm thinking that maybe it should be (as "real" source)
<seb128> didrocks, iso went down by 22M today, a good start
<didrocks> yep! :)
<seb128> and hud is out
<didrocks> seb128: I know, I demoted quite some packages while you were away (the component-mismatch list was long)
<didrocks> and unity source isn't in main anymore as well, which was the "main" motivation
<seb128> good work!
<didrocks> thx
<didrocks> jbicha: I guess having blender in main just for rendering the videos would be overkill for most distros :p
<jbicha> didrocks: build-dependencies don't have to be in main :)
<jbicha> I think Ubuntu's "main" is pretty unique among distros
<didrocks> should we build thus from source?
<jbicha> I don't know if other distros would want to rebuild the videos from source, but I think Debian would
<jbicha> the package isn't updated very often
<didrocks> I guess there is a headless mode for blender, so compatible with buildds?
<didrocks> ah, the main build-deps thing was when I was away from distro, that makes sense now (thanks seb for the pointer)
<willcooke> didrocks, seb128  - confirmed they play on a virgin Artful desktop
<willcooke> via totem
<seb128> \o/
<didrocks> excellent!
<willcooke> I'd want to do some tweaking of the bitrates still really
<willcooke> that was the deafults
<willcooke> defaults
<didrocks> willcooke: once you are done, are you ok proposing it to GNOME yourself or need us?
<willcooke> didrocks, let's see how I get on
<didrocks> oki :)
<willcooke> I'll create a card
<seb128> thanks didrocks, willcooke
<didrocks> I guess it's hard to debate if we win half the size against those vids, wdyt?
<seb128> so I guess we are +1 on the changes suggested by GunnarHj then?
<didrocks> yep :)
<didrocks> at least, to me
<seb128> me too
<didrocks> and if we add dash to dock-like experience, I think we can create one based on the main one
<seb128> didrocks, do you want to reply on the list for the record or should I?
<didrocks> or tweak it
<didrocks> seb128: feel free
<seb128> k
<seb128> yeah, let's see what we need to do after we decide on extensions
<GunnarHj> Thanks guys; I'll go back and complete the MP accordingly.
<didrocks> excellent
<seb128> yw, thanks everyone for the discussion
<didrocks> thanks guys
<seb128> GunnarHj, and thanks for nagging us about giving a reply :-)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Always at your service. :)
<seb128> GunnarHj, oh, while you are around, we got an artful translations export on launchpad yesterday, I'm going to have a look to do a langpacks build tomorrow
<seb128> just as a fyi
<seb128> jbicha, ^
<seb128> you might be interested as well
<seb128> the exports includes gnome-shell, I checked
<seb128> (I approved the template a few days ago, we got translations imported correctly)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Sounds good. Btw, is ubuntu-help gone now?
<seb128> I didn't look
<seb128> tarball is big and I'm on limited bandwith atm, I can check later
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: you also want http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~compiz-team/compiz/0.9.13/revision/4119 for xenial?
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok. We'd better make sure it didn't include something from an older build of ubuntu-docs, since we handle the docs outside of the language packs now.
<seb128> GunnarHj, it wouldn't hurt much, just waste some space right?
<seb128> but I'm going to keep an eye open for that, thanks for the comment
<GunnarHj> seb128: Only spece waste, yes.
<GunnarHj> s/spece/space/
<jbicha> it looks like Qt was added to Ubuntu's default install for 11.10, 6 years ago
<ogra_> yeah, just shortly before we planned to switch to unity8 and mir by default :P
<jbicha> I think it was added for the Ubuntu One client
<jbicha> Fedora actually includes Qt in their default GNOME install (for adwaita-qt)
<willcooke> desktoppers - seb128 is going to run the meeting today, it's my lad's birthday so I'm cooking.  (thanks seb128)
<seb128> yw!
<xclaesse> jbicha, Ubuntu Online Account uses qt too IIRC
 * Trevinho worried for will's lad :-D
<willcooke> :DD
<didrocks> :)
<seb128> you might that some pints is not a proper dinner?
<Trevinho> aahhaha
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> (might->mean)
 * Trevinho remembers desktoppers the unmeeting ;-)
<seb128> Trevinho, sorry I'm working for a coffee place atm, I should try to organize better for those :-/
 * Trevinho is in a coworking too
<Trevinho> but well... I did it in the road, so who cares :-D
<seb128> haha
<andyrock> I'm watching the last 10km of tdf
<andyrock> so 10 minutes
<seb128> k, meeting time
<seb128> going to be a short list today
<seb128> #startmeeting
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jul  4 15:30:33 2017 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
<oSoMoN> o/
<jbicha> o/
<seb128> Roll call: andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks (out), duflu (out), jbicha, jamesh, jibel/heber, kenvandine (out), laney (out), oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<andyrock> o/
<seb128> k, let's get started
<seb128> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: andyrock
<seb128> andyrock, hey
<andyrock> # Review https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/compiz/grid-lowgfx-fixes/+merge/326487
<andyrock> # Review https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/compiz/move-lowgfx-fixes/+merge/326451/+index?ss=1
<andyrock> # Review https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/compiz/resize-lowgfx-fixes/+merge/326491
<andyrock> # Review https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/compiz/support-desktop-average-colors/+merge/326573
<andyrock> # Review https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/compiz-average-color/+merge/326571
<andyrock> # Update software-properties-gtk design for livepatch following mtp's design
<andyrock> # Studying and veryifing proposal for Livepatch Auth API (understanding macaroons, if all we need is there, etc.)
<andyrock> # Looking at dash-to-dock code/issues/etc.
<andyrock> # Blocked on update-manager waiting for design
<andyrock> # EOW
<seb128> good busy week andyrock :-)
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: dgadomski
<seb128> dgadomski, hey
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> * still working on finding a way to disable WiFi Direct on intel 8260 (iwlwifi)
<dgadomski> * working on bug #1701073
<dgadomski> * working on bug #1700827
<ubot5> bug 1701073 in samba (Ubuntu Zesty) "CVE-2017-2619 regression breaks symlinks to directories" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1701073
<ubot5> bug 1700827 in pcp (Ubuntu) "MIR -- pcp package" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1700827
<dgadomski> eof
<seb128> thanks dgadomski
<seb128> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: didrocks
<seb128> * Went back from Bosch's workshop after half a day of snap/snapcraft presentation & tutorials
<seb128> * Review & merge desktop helper PR
<seb128> * Ensure we don't have any migration scripts for unity running anymore (removed the nautilus one we don't need)
<seb128> * Transition launcher icons from unity to gnome-shell (one time, only if default) and renamed amazon icon. Trying to keep into consideration people staying in unity session which shouldn't be impacted by that script
<seb128> * Fixed some transition followup on dist-upgrade (amazon icon and u-c-c to g-c-c)
<seb128> * Some AA work (NEWed some mate packages, demotions based on component-mismatches for cleaning up unity stack and ensure most of the components are in universe)
<seb128> * Worked on an incoming set of 3 posts on classic snaps (using ubuntu-make as an example)
<seb128> * Various discussions on snap themes, mimetype & desktop renamesâ¦
<seb128> #topic duflu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: duflu
<seb128> * Video acceleration:
<seb128>   - I've been diving deep into the VA-API failures in Wayland sessions: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1698287
<seb128>   - Prototyped some upstream fixes this week for the Wayland-specific VAAPI issues:
<seb128>     . mpv - https://github.com/mpv-player/mpv/pull/4556
<seb128>     . totem/gstreamer-vaapi - https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=783169
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1698287 in gstreamer-vaapi (Ubuntu) "VA-API fails to initialize in a Gnome Shell Wayland session" [Medium,In progress]
<seb128>   - Though still experiencing corruption and high CPU in gstreamer-clutter (totem): https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1701463
<ubot5> Gnome bug 783169 in gstreamer-vaapi "Don't try to load vaapi and fail" [Normal,New]
<seb128> * PulseAudio:
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1701463 in Clutter GStreamer Bindings "gst-vaapi+Wayland = rendering corruption in totem (but not in gst-play-1.0)" [Medium,Confirmed]
<seb128>   - Finally completed SRU release to xenial (pulseaudio 1:8.0-0ubuntu3.3), although it did get stuck loosely on a regression that already existed in zesty and artful: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1690028
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1690028 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "pulseaudio crashed with SIGABRT in device_start_waiting_for_profiles() from pa_bluetooth_transport_set_state() from endpoint_set_configuration() from endpoint_handler() from _dbus_object_tree_dispatch_and_unlock()" [High,Confirmed]
<seb128>   - Started planning an update for artful (more news next week).
<seb128> * Gnome Shell graphical bugs:
<seb128>   - Completed and released new battery icons (with design's blessing), to support Gnome Shell's strictly square proportions: https://launchpad.net/bugs/1693155
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1693155 in Ubuntu UX "Distorted blurry battery indicator in gnome-shell (using ubuntu-mono icons at default low-DPI scale 1.0)" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<seb128>   - You will notice a visual change at low DPI, but it's the best we can do without hacking upstream gnome-shell to support rectangular icons (which is probably possible but hasn't yet been attempted by anyone).
<seb128> * Daily bug maintenance across gnome-shell, bluez, pulseaudio and mir.
<seb128>   - Piles of automatic bug expiries from the May efforts started this week (in bluez)!
<seb128> #topic jbicha
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: jbicha
<seb128> jbicha, hey
<jbicha> â¢ Fixed serious GDM bug for Ubuntu 17.10 and Debian (LP: #1701243)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1701243 in gdm3 (Ubuntu) "GDM does not work if gnome-session is not installed" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1701243
<jbicha> â¢ Verified the gnome-software SRUs
<jbicha> â¢ Backported commits to fix gnome-contacts FTBFS with vala 0.36
<jbicha> â¢ Gave a push to removing the old webkitgtk from Debian by filing bugs and raising severity of existing bugs.
<jbicha> The removal will take several weeks but it's doable by 18.04 LTS, maybe even 17.10. Arch Linux already did it. Fedora 27 (~November) is doing it too.
<jbicha> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?users=pkg-webkit-maintainers@lists.alioth.debian.org;tag=webkit1
<jbicha> â¢ Tried the preview of Pop!_OS, surprised to see a re-themed Ubuntu GNOME 17.04
<jbicha> eow
<seb128> thanks jbicha
<seb128> #topic jamesh
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: jamesh
<seb128> gnome-software:
<seb128> * rebased patches on new ubuntu-master branch, which is now based on
<seb128> gnome-software 3.25.x.
<seb128> * (re)started discussion about snapd directly using polkit.  This
<seb128> would give a better experience for installing/removing snaps on the
<seb128> desktop, and would likely improve security overall.  Main blocker is
<seb128> convincing niemeyer :-)
<seb128>  Up next is looking at captive portal handling in network-manager.
<seb128> #topic jibel/heber
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: jibel/heber
<seb128> jibel, heber, hey
<heber> Hey guys! QA updates:
<heber> * Tested upgrades to artful and migration script.
<heber> * Writing automated upgrade tests for the migration to gnome-shell
<heber> * Update utah to be able to setup autopkg test before running tests.
<heber> * Update CI to include Run tests after Smoke jobs.
<heber> EOF
<seb128> heber, are those tests run daily on on package updates somewhere?
<seb128> or on*
<seb128> if so is there a page we can look at to see the results of the day?
<heber> seb128, the idea is to start with jobs after a new image is available on pending
<seb128> sounds good, I guess that's not done yet?
<heber> the results will be available in grafana dashboard. But that work is not ready yet
<seb128> k
<seb128> thanks heber
<seb128> #topic oSoMoN
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: oSoMoN
<seb128> oSoMoN, hey
<oSoMoN> hey there
<oSoMoN> â¢ discussed possible xenial SRU for bug #1585863, concluded that we need more evidence that the bug isn't fixed by 1.2.6
<ubot5> bug 1585863 in OEM Priority Project xenial "WiFi malfunction after suspend & resume stress - sudo wpa_cli scan required to fix it." [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1585863
<oSoMoN> â¢ contributed a minor patch to snapcraft-desktop-helpers
<oSoMoN> â¢ filed bug #1700953, this is blocking packaging of libreoffice 5.4 (unless we revert a couple of upstream commits to relax the dependency on cppunit), need to follow up
<ubot5> bug 1700953 in cppunit (Ubuntu) "Sync cppunit 1.14.0-1 (universe) from Debian experimental (main)" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1700953
<oSoMoN> â¢ chromium 59.0.3071.109 was published to all supported releases (thanks chris_ccoulson!)
<oSoMoN> â¢ updated chromium beta to 60.0.3112.50
<oSoMoN> â¢ published libreoffice 5.3.4.2 to the snap store (beta channel), amd64 and armhf, and blogged about it: https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/call-for-testing-libreoffice-5-3-4-snap/1205 , https://plus.google.com/100486649727917304321/posts/g2zWPFx75DW
<oSoMoN> â¢ continued investigating libreoffice i386 FTBFS (bug #1700692)
<ubot5> bug 1700692 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "FTBFS on i386: dbaccess_RowSetClones unit test segfaults" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1700692
<oSoMoN> ^D
<seb128> thanks oSoMoN
<seb128> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: seb128
<seb128> â¢ reviewed u-c-c/lowgfx changes from Marco
<seb128> â¢ tested the libreoffice snap update, good work Olivier!
<seb128> â¢ hacked some local snap examples to demo the issues we are having with the content interface and wrote corresponding forum posts
<seb128> â¢ artful daily iso/install testing
<seb128> â¢ discussions about desktop topics (artful iso, language packages, snaps themes, pulseaudio SRU regression, desktop files renames, ...)
<seb128> â¢ tested the gnome-software xenial SRU candidate
<seb128> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: tkamppeter
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<seb128> no tkamppeter?
<seb128> k, let's move on
<seb128> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Trevinho
<seb128> Trevinho, hey Marco!
<Trevinho> 17/27
<Trevinho> Â· Finished some missing fixes in UCC for lowgfx support
<Trevinho> Â· Landed the fixes above, duflu's theme fixes, and other compiz fixes
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed lowgfx issues in compiz (move, grid and resize plugins)
<Trevinho> Â· Prepared backports to xenial for Unity, UCC, Nux, Compiz
<Trevinho> Â· Attended the Ubuntu On Air meeting for the Testing days about GNOME
<Trevinho>   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMOwozLBdXI
<Trevinho> Â· Moved back to Torino
<Trevinho> Â· Did something else I don't remember
<Trevinho> Â· Attended the unmeeting ALONE (I hate you guys -_- :-D)!
<Trevinho> ð
<seb128> 17 what?
<Trevinho> it's the year/week... I forgot to trim :-)
<tkamppeter> Hi
<seb128> ah
<seb128> thanks for doing that Ubuntu On Air and sorry we didn't have more people joining
<seb128> we do better next time
<seb128> and sorry for the unmeeting
<seb128> on that one also we do better next time :p
<seb128> thanks Trevinho
<Trevinho> :)
<seb128> hey tkamppeter
<seb128> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Released 1.14.1 with all the crash and stability fixes on cups-browsed (got uploaded into Debian today), worked on configurable naming of local queues created by cups-browsed, got some patches for cups-browsed to improve on handling of description and location info of remote printers.
<tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2017: Student project coordination and mentoring. Especially discussed implementation of flattening filled PDF forms in the pdftopdf filter. All students show very good progress.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<seb128> thanks tkamppeter
<seb128> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: robert_ancell
<seb128> - At Snappy sprint
<seb128> - Swap day
<seb128> - Following up with Snappy tasks back home
<seb128> #topic aob
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: aob
<seb128> did I forget anyone? any other topic?
<seb128> seems not I guess, let's wrap then
<seb128> good efficient meeting, thanks everyone
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jul  4 15:49:10 2017 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2017/ubuntu-desktop.2017-07-04-15.30.moin.txt
<oSoMoN> thanks seb128
<seb128> yw!
<seb128> oSoMoN, sorry I dropped offline for a bit and I didn't see if you saw my question/replied earlier, did you manage to get anyone replying to you about the kernel/builder issue that makes libreoffice i386 not build?
<oSoMoN> seb128, I talked to the kernel team and smb said Â«  That kernel version replaced the fix with the current upstream approach. That should fix the currently known real use-cases but showed some failures with some test cases. However upstream decided that they want to see real use-cases. So behavior is probably not back to how it was before but might need convincing arguments for upstream that something breaking is a le
<oSoMoN> git use. Â»
<oSoMoN> so I need to make a case for the LO build upstream
<seb128> k :-/
<oSoMoN> seb128, Iâll talk to the kernel folks again to devise the best approach to make that case
<seb128> oSoMoN, sounds good, let me know how it goes, I'm trying to lurk on their channel and follow discussions (if you talk to them on IRC)
<oSoMoN> seb128, yes, I talked to them on #ubuntu-kernel yesterday
<seb128> good
<oSoMoN> seb128, discussing the issue further on #ubuntu-kernel, in case you hadnât seen
<seb128> oSoMoN, thanks
 * oSoMoN EOD
<oSoMoN> have a good evening everyone
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-07-05
<jamesh> robert_ancell: I've updated the two gnome-software patches I made to work against ubuntu-master.  They're available here to pull: https://code.launchpad.net/~jamesh/gnome-software/+git/gnome-software
<robert_ancell> jamesh, you should just propose them upstream - we're not using Launchpad for G-S development
<robert_ancell> The upstream branches are wip/ubuntu-3-xx
<robert_ancell> where xx is 20, 22 and 24
<robert_ancell> But first they should go into master, or be rejected as an Ubuntu specific patch
<jamesh> robert_ancell: okay.  The pick-launch-app branch depends on unreleased snapd-glib changes, and I'm not at all sure about the UI parts of the classic-snap-install branch.
<robert_ancell> jamesh, I want to run the UI parts against Richard upstream in case they need modifying. Once that's settled we can backport as we see fit (i.e. we don't need upstreams approval to backport into the wip/ubuntu-xx branches)
<robert_ancell> jamesh, I'm waiting for https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3542 to be accepted before making the next snapd-glib release. I don't want to release and have the name change on me...
<robert_ancell> I was expecting this to have been landed during the sprint, but yeah...
<robert_ancell> Actually I think I'll just disable that change and do the release to unblock you.
<jamesh> robert_ancell: fyi: the algorithm I used for picking a launch app is to favour apps with desktop files, and to favour the app whose name matches the snap
<robert_ancell> jamesh, I think that's the best we can do at the moment
<jamesh> it also uses the desktop file to launch the app if available, so we don't need to guess whether it is graphical in that case.
<robert_ancell> Thanks!
<robert_ancell> jamesh, let me know when you've opened bz bugs / subscribe me and I'll review there.
<robert_ancell> jamesh, do you have GNOME git commit access?
<jamesh> probably not any more.  I did have CVS commit access years ago ...
<robert_ancell> ok, I'll push them if they look good
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers!
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN, seb128
<oSoMoN> hey duflu, seb128
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> hey duflu oSoMoN didrocks, how are you today?
<duflu> seb128, good, you?
<seb128> I'm well thanks
<didrocks> hey seb128, duflu!
<didrocks> seb128: so, the remaining qt components packages are still pulled on the live by fcitx
<didrocks> (looking at binary component-mismatches to see if we missed anything)
 * didrocks wonders why we have the syslinux theme packages seeded in supported-development-desktop, but no post xenial packag and no comment why
<didrocks>   add syslinux-themes-ubuntu-oneiric alongside ubuntu-defaults-builder to support building images for older releases
<didrocks> ah
<didrocks> and as I removed yesterday ubuntu-defaults-builderâ¦ I guess we can unseed those
<seb128> yes, makes sense
<seb128> we have a trello card abou tfcitx
<seb128> my gut feeling is that we should go back to ibus for all locales
<didrocks> would +1 on this, this is what is supported upstream
<seb128> but I don't know enough about the differences to be confident it's the right choice, we did add fcitx because some people were convinced it's better for chinese users
<didrocks> and well, I can grab the maintainer personnally over an orange juice if needed of the chinese variant :p
<seb128> haha
<didrocks> (and a native speaker tester as well for mandarin)
<didrocks> how would we take that decision?
<seb128> good question
<seb128> I guess we should take some input from the oem team before deciding
<seb128> there was some push for fcitx from commercial deals at the time
<didrocks> good point
<flexiondotorg> Morning oSoMoN dupondje seb128 didrocks
<didrocks> hey flexiondotorg
<flexiondotorg> Oops, I meant duflu, not dup_ondje. Sorry for the ping.
<willcooke> morning all
<seb128> hey flexiondotorg willcooke, how is u.k today?
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<willcooke> sunny again!
<oSoMoN> hey flexiondotorg, willcooke
<willcooke> morning oSoMoN
<willcooke> desktoppers: I'm verifying this on Y now:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/lightdm/+bug/1630156
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1630156 in OEM Priority Project "No password needed to Log in after cancel the password and then reset again" [Low,Triaged]
<seb128> willcooke, verifying as reproducing
<willcooke> checking the fix works
<seb128> ah
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> ah, I didn't notice it was blocked on the yakkety SRU to be verified
<willcooke> jibel, something just crossed my mind for a test case...  we found that usb modeswitch broke a little while ago and "some" USB 3G modems stopped being able to be switched in to modem mode instead of "cdrom" mode.  Do you have such a device and could we add a test case for it?  Could be part of ISO tracker?
<jibel> willcooke, I don't have such device but we can add it to the test cases as an optional test
<willcooke> jibel, thanks.  I used to have one, it's probably in the bottom of my "box of things".  I'll go looking for it later
<jibel> I stopped using this kind of device long time ago and use my phone instead
<jibel> as access point
<didrocks> ahah, qtdeclarative5-examples was what is making 20+ Qt packages in main
 * didrocks continues his demotion journey
<andyrock> morning!
<seb128> hey andyrock, how are you?
<oSoMoN> good morning andyrock
<andyrock> hey oSoMoN
<andyrock> hey seb128 good you?
<seb128> andyrock, good as well!
<seb128> k, going for an early lunch, bbiab
<oSoMoN> bon appÃ©tit seb128
<seb128> 'ci
<jbicha> btw, this was the trick I used to get fcitx on the Ubuntu GNOME iso but without Qt: https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-gnome-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu-gnome.artful/view/head:/live#L62
<didrocks> oh, interesting, thanks jbicha!
<didrocks> I don't know if there are many Qt extensions that people want though
<jbicha> in Artful, we now have an Addonsâ Input Sources category in GNOME Software so someone could add appstream metadata for the different Fcitx frontends/components
<didrocks> but what happens if they add a Qt module without the corresponding package?
<didrocks> is it installed?
<jbicha> but then we also get the issue we were discussing with GunnarHJ yesterday where language-selector pulls in fcitx (with Qt) for simplified Chinese
<jbicha> we could have Qt recommend fcitx support, but I'm not sure whether that's a good idea
<jbicha> part of my proposal for LP: #1585903 was to have gtk2 recommend ibus and the Ubuntu gtk2 themeâ¦
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1585903 in Ubuntu GNOME "Make it possible to remove gtk2" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1585903
<didrocks> yeah, tricky
<jbicha> the gtk2 part makes sense to me, having Qt recommend fcitx is a bit more questionable to me
<jbicha> Fedora installs Qt by default because they wanted to ensure that Qt theming (with Adwaita) would be great when installing a Qt app
<didrocks> hum, just to get the qt gtk engine installed by default I guess
<jbicha> yes
<jbicha> we might have done the same thing in Ubuntu GNOME (which defaulted to Adwaita) once the 2nd required package for that to work was packaged
<seb128> Trevinho, I verified that u-c-c yakkery SRU so it should unblock your landing for tomorrow
<Trevinho> seb128: thanks
<seb128> Trevinho, yw!
<seb128> bah, every cycle firefox gets stucked in devel-proposed for most of the cycle due to build issues on "side" archs :-/
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I guess those armhf and ppc64el build issues are not something you are currently looking at?
<flexiondotorg> Hi Desktopers
<flexiondotorg> I was just asked what will happen to user running Ubuntu GNOME 17.04 when they upgrade to 17.10?
<flexiondotorg> Will they get GNOME with the Ubuntu bits or stick with vanilla GNOME?
<seb128> hey flexiondotorg
<seb128> flexiondotorg, I think Ubuntu GNOME said they would prefer their users to get the Ubuntu session
<seb128> but jbicha can probably give you a better answer
<flexiondotorg> Thanks
<seb128> yw
<chrisccoulson> seb128, I'm not looking at those issues
<seb128> chrisccoulson, what I though, I start wondering if we should just stop building firefox on those archs, unsure it has any users there and it's creating work and issues every cycle ... do you see any value in keeping them? do they allow to find bugs that might impact other archs for example?
<chrisccoulson> I've never really seen value in building firefox on those architectures
<seb128> k, thanks
<seb128> on that note I'm going off IRC for a bit, moving back from the coffee place I was working from this afternoon
<seb128> bbiab
<seb128> k, back but on&off from IRC, I'm still going to look at the backlog and do a few things in between non computer work
<oSoMoN> seb128, FYI:Â some slow progress on the LO x86 crash, it seems it might be a JDK bug in some x86 specific code, the kernel folks are looking into it
<chrisccoulson> seb128, I should do what you do and find random places to work from :)
 * kenvandine just freed up 457G of space with a rm -rf phablet 
 * kenvandine hopes anything interesting in there has been pushed to bzr somewhere
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-07-06
<jibel> morning
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<jibel> bonjour oSoMoN
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning jibel, oSoMoN, didrocks
<jibel> hi duflu
<didrocks> hey duflu, jibel
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> jibel, oSoMoN, didrocks, lut les frenchies
<seb128> hey duflu
<seb128> how is everyone today?
<didrocks> rebonjour seb128!
<jamesh> hi seb128
<duflu> seb128, going OK (modulo a serious sinus headache)
<duflu> How are you seb128?
<jibel> hi seb128, doing well. how are you?
<seb128> hey jamesh
<seb128> jibel, I'm good thanks
<willcooke> morning all
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<willcooke> morning didrocks, how's it going?
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, more suggestions of thunder storms tonight!  fingers crossed
<didrocks> willcooke: good good, but getting hot again :/ yourself?
<seb128> hey willcooke, how are you?
<willcooke> didrocks, much cooler today, and cloudy.  Yesterday was hot, hopefully today will be a bit cooler.
<willcooke> hey seb128, good!  The kids all slept right through the night, but I still feel tired :D
<willcooke> not as tired as you I expect
<seb128> lucky you :p
<seb128> I got pulled out of bed at 6am today
<seb128> one of those days...
<willcooke> heh
<willcooke> only another 18 years to go
<seb128> haha
<seb128> on the positive side I was done with emails backlog&such at 7
<willcooke> hah
<willcooke> seb128, let me fix that for you... in 3,2,1..
 * seb128 puts the finger over the delete key
<seb128> k, I'm reading, send away!
<seb128> ready*
<willcooke> sec
<chrisccoulson> willcooke, yeah, I hope so :)
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, before your time?  http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-40516754
<willcooke> seb128, didrocks - did you see:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm3/+bug/1686393
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1686393 in gdm3 (Ubuntu) "[MIR] gdm3" [High,Confirmed]
<willcooke> we're unblocked
<didrocks> nice! do you know if kenvandine[m][m] did the seemless transition from lightdm to gdm?
<didrocks> (not really clear on the trello card)
<seb128> he mentioned being working on him when I talked to him on friday
<seb128> or monday it was
<seb128> then he was off for 4th of july
<seb128> him->it
<didrocks> ok, so let's wait for him. I don't think we should seed it with the prompt before this is and the session transition is done
<didrocks> hopefully, he's already done on that, as it could be done in parallel than the MIR :)
<didrocks> (I can give a hand if needed on this)
 * didrocks tries to go for a run before it's getting to warm. Couldn't run at all this week
<seb128> didrocks, enjoy
<seb128> didrocks, he mentioned that he had things mostly working but was having issues with debconf
<didrocks> seb128: 27Â°C, will be 31Â°C very soon. I'll "try" to enjoy :)
<seb128> so let's see when he gets online
<willcooke> I think he got it done, one sec
<didrocks> yeah ;)
<didrocks> there are two things:
<didrocks> - silent debconf
<didrocks> - session mapping (even for encrypted ones)
<didrocks> drive*
<willcooke> meh, cant find it - but I've a feeling it's either done or nearly done
<didrocks> great! Will be nice to switch it today to see the result on tomorrow's iso
<didrocks> and continue on demotion/unseeding
 * didrocks really goes now
<seb128> brb, restarting IRC with vpn
<seb128> still a bit sad to see lightdm being replaced
<seb128> oh well
<seb128> didrocks, enjoy
<didrocks> thx
<seb128> oSoMoN, so that kernel issue is mostly understood and in the hands of the kernel team now? or do they still want a testcase?
<oSoMoN> seb128, itâs in their hands, and it appears there's already some work upstream to fix that
<seb128> oSoMoN, great news :-)
<oSoMoN> so hopefully within a few days we should have an updated kernel in proposed that unblocks us
<ricotz> seb128, oSoMoN, hey :), note this fixed kernel needs to be in builder vm
<seb128> of course
<oSoMoN> ricotz, yes indeed, but once itâs in proposed we will be able to test it and validate whether it fixes the crash
<ricotz> right, I assumed this kernel needs to be transitioned from proposed to be picked up by the builder-vm
<oSoMoN> and itâs not just the build that fails, itâs also the app itself that crashes on x86 under certain circumstances when the JVM is enabled
<ricotz> I know
<ricotz> fingers crossed this get fixed soon :)
<oSoMoN> yup
<chrisccoulson> willcooke, I'm old enough to remember grotbags :)
<willcooke> :)
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, hey :), https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rustc/+bug/1701556
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1701556 in rustc (Ubuntu) "Backport rustc 1.17 and cargo 0.18 to 14.04/16.04 and 17.04" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> ricotz, he's off for the rest of the week
<ricotz> seb128, hi, I see
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, yeah, I'm aware of that. I just need somewhere I can prepare the transition (it needs to be updated to 1.16 / 0.17 first, and then eventually binary copied to the security PPA)
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, ok, I already monkey-updated/patched cargo to 1.19 to get nightly builds on artful
<oSoMoN> seb128, chrisccoulson: FYI the chromium 59 update is crashing at startup for a number of users, details in bug #1702407
<ubot5> bug 1702407 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "Startup crash after upgrading to 59.0.3071.109 on xenial" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1702407
<seb128> urg
<oSoMoN> Iâm actively looking into it
<seb128> thanks oSoMoN
<seb128> bah
<seb128> jbicha, could you push your most recent gnome-control-center revision to the vcs?
<seb128> brb
<Trevinho> andyrock: good luck https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity/x-sru5/+merge/326916 :)
<Trevinho> andyrock: and... i'd need some help to update the bugs to be SRU friendly too
<seb128> hey andyrock Trevinho
<Trevinho> hi seb128
 * Trevinho feels dirty: just used some browser macros to do launchpad actions instead of using APIs :|
<andyrock> Trevinho: kk
<andyrock> and hey
<duflu> Awesome. In figuring out initialization failures I seem to have also found the cause of video corruption elsewhere.
<duflu> Time for a celebratory meal
<Trevinho> dupondje: yeah
<Trevinho> err sorruy, duflu*
<GunnarHj> didrocks: Hi Didier! Thanks for approving 'your' part of the MP. As regards usb-langsupport, and even if you tried to explain it on the MP, I still don't understand the purpose well enough to formulate a proper question. Hence it would be good if you could post to the -devel ML about it.
<didrocks> GunnarHj: yw! yeah, I'll check first on next team meeting if anyone has any use of it. I'm almost sure even QA don't try it
<didrocks> we'll can kick it off anytime on the -devel ML, I can handle that next week. But yeah, let's not block on that
<GunnarHj> didrocks: Ok, thanks!
<didrocks> yw, thanks for working on this! :)
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Hi Jeremy! Ready to approve the rest of the MP, including the sync of fonts with pkg_depends, and merge it?
<GunnarHj> https://code.launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu.artful_lang-support/+merge/326261
<andyrock> Trevinho: do you have a ppa for the sru? on bileto?
<andyrock> found it sorry
<Trevinho> andyrock: yeah. it's there thanks
<andyrock> still building unity
<Trevinho> andyrock: yep
<Trevinho> as i forgot to do it before lunchj
<Trevinho> andyrock: I've packages but.... I guess you can wait a sec
<andyrock> yeah otherwise I can build it too
<Trevinho> it's already at the test stage
<andyrock> but I didn't want to build compiz+nux+etc.
<Trevinho> will finish in 5 minutes amx
<Trevinho> max*
<Trevinho> yeah..
 * Trevinho prepares a unity7 snap :)
 * Trevinho jokes, but not so much
<Trevinho> would perfect for classic
<didrocks> Trevinho: you can read my "trip" to classic snap with ubuntu make :)
<didrocks> (part 1 published on planet ubuntu, you can read the rest on github until published if you want)
<Trevinho> didrocks: I will, although I already have some experiencve with it, but interesting indeed
<didrocks> there are some interesting thinking I guess on 14.04 & 17.04 snaps ;)
<didrocks> (part 3)
<Trevinho> andyrock: ok packages are there https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/2841/+build/12858897
<Trevinho> didrocks: where's the rest of the story in gh?
<didrocks> Trevinho: https://github.com/didrocks/website/tree/master/content/blog
<didrocks> (static websites ftw!)
<jibel> didrocks, did you do the change to migrate u-c-c to g-c-c?
<jibel> didrocks, the key is unity-control-center.desktop not ubuntu-control-center.desktop
<didrocks> jibel: argh, probably typoed, sorry :/
<jibel> np
<Trevinho> didrocks: thanks :)
<didrocks> jibel: doing it right now
<jibel> thanks
<didrocks> jibel: ofc, same scripts, so people who already migrated won't see that change
<kenvandine> cyphermox_, the security team ack'd bug 1686393 so i reassigned it back to you
<ubot5> bug 1686393 in gdm3 (Ubuntu) "[MIR] gdm3" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1686393
<Trevinho> didrocks: it looks like I'm able also to run snapcraft to build classic inside a scrhoot now... but I had to bind mount manually the core, once I bind mounted the snap dir from host
<didrocks> kenvandine: why is it reassigned back to cyphermox_, he did +1 if security was happy about it, isn't it? Isn't that just a question
<didrocks> of us promoting it?
<kenvandine> oh, maybe he did
<didrocks> that's the normal procedure
<didrocks> so, now, it's up to us to seed it if the migration is handled :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, i'd still prefer cyphermox_  mark it fix committed :)
<kenvandine> i'll go ahead and update the seed
<didrocks> kenvandine: well, technically I can as he's on holidays :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: all the transition is done?
<kenvandine> yeah
<didrocks> I think it will be good to get an image tomorrow with that done so that we can move it forward
<kenvandine> not uploaded yet
<didrocks> nice!
<kenvandine> i can do that today
<didrocks> jibel: uploaded
<didrocks> (sorry again)
<didrocks> kenvandine: just being curious, how did you handle the "I install gdm after the fact and have lightdm, but want a debconf prompt"?
 * didrocks is interested :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, it's a combination of postint in ubuntu-session and gdm
<didrocks> interesting :)
<kenvandine> ubuntu-session checks to see if any user on the system uses the ubuntu session
<didrocks> I guess if current user session is ubuntu-session as we discussedâ¦
<kenvandine> not just current, any user
<didrocks> yep, what I did propose on the card IIRC
<kenvandine> yup
<didrocks> still some false positive
<kenvandine> if any use it, we touch a file
<didrocks> but couldn't come up with anything else
<didrocks> and then debconf script check that file
<kenvandine> i think it was laney that suggested we do it in ubuntu-session
<didrocks> and don't show the question, correct?
<kenvandine> yeah
<didrocks> yeah, I didn't suggest package, I still wonder about order, did you force anything on gdm?
<didrocks> to see "we need ubuntu-session postinst before gdm"
<kenvandine> gdm will prompt in the case ubuntu-session didn't flag it
<kenvandine> yes
 * didrocks is eager to test :)
<kenvandine> made gdm depend on ubuntu-session
<didrocks> sounds exciting
<kenvandine> :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: want me to promote gdm so that it's done, and you can upload/update the seeds?
<kenvandine> i'm going to do one more round of tests in a VM today before i upload it
<kenvandine> didrocks, please do
<didrocks> let's gooooooooooo
<kenvandine> woot
<willcooke> \o/
<didrocks> *DONE* next publisher cycle would have it
 * kenvandine merges gnome-session branch again :)
<willcooke> nice, exciting times ahead
<didrocks> kenvandine: I guess as you are going to test that will be fine, but wait for rmadison to show gdm3 in main before uploading, or there is a race and we'll need to repromote it twice (once in proposed, once in the release pocket)
<kenvandine> didrocks, ok
<didrocks> kenvandine: who did just push for a u-c-c rename? I wonder :)
<kenvandine> i wonder
<Trevinho> didrocks: on Fixing by using snap internal dependencies, actually the best solution is just to use snapcraft-preload so far IMHO :)
<Trevinho> as you don't have to worry about all the env variables
<didrocks> Trevinho: got a load of issues with it some months ago
<didrocks> I didn't really retry since then
<Trevinho> didrocks: oh, like? I'd like to address those
<didrocks> Trevinho: gettext not looking at the right paths and such, I guess that were uncovered syscalls
<didrocks> kenvandine: I promoted at the right moment! Already in main :)
<Trevinho> didrocks: might be... for qt apps for example it worked like a charm https://github.com/nextcloud/client_theming/blob/master/linux/snap/snapcraft.yaml
<kenvandine> i saw that :)
<Trevinho> didrocks: it used not to work in X some months ago though, but I've fixed it
<didrocks> kenvandine: can't wait to see the remaining indicators off the live :)
<didrocks> Trevinho: probably at that time, TBH, I didn't retry since
<Trevinho> give that a look, it helps a lot.
<didrocks> Trevinho: if we are pretty confident about it, why not having the desktop helper removing some variables override and using this?
<Trevinho> actually I would love to do a snapcraft part using that for desktop, but...
<Trevinho> didrocks: I wanted to, but seb128 isn't much confident on that since it increases the syscall's amount.
<didrocks> Trevinho: I guess you are looking at a relative path, and if not found, the system one?
<Trevinho> which is true, but in my benchmarks it wasn't really something noticeable
<didrocks> we already have a lot of -1 open() calls when stracingâ¦ (even due to those env variables)
<didrocks> Trevinho: could we add 2 paths, like relative snap one, then another one (like the platform snap one) before it defaults to system ones?
<Trevinho> didrocks: yep.. . That's the plan
<Trevinho> didrocks: but there is a bug in apparmor which gives some false positive
<Trevinho> didrocks: see https://bugs.launchpad.net/apparmor/+bug/1655435
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1655435 in AppArmor "stat() unconditionally allowed via apparmor_inode_getattr()" [Undecided,Triaged]
<Trevinho> didrocks: so due to that in some cases we can't be as efficent as we could be, as we get that snapcraft can stat something that it can't actually open
<Trevinho> didrocks: but in any case I think that the overhead of that tool isn't really much, and I've rewritten it to C++(14) also so it's really easy to maintain avoiding issues
<didrocks> oh yeah, will be good to get it fixed before switching it on, indeed
<seb128> I really dislike that preload hack
<seb128> hope that doesn't become default or standard
<seb128> it's such a hack
<didrocks> not as much as env variables?
<didrocks> quite some hack level to me, no?
<didrocks> same*
<seb128> I feel like intercepting syscalls is lower level and has more potential for real bugs
<seb128> when env can't not really be harmful
<Trevinho> mh, yeah... but also very controllable.
<seb128> also env is well defined
<Trevinho> I mean we know what's happening
<Trevinho> the problem with env's is that there are too many
<Trevinho> and out of our control
<seb128> where when you start derailing syscalls you might impact things you didn't think about
<Trevinho> fixing 1 instead of 1000
<seb128> I'm reading to bet that you are going to hit weird cases you didn't think about with the syscall hacking
<Trevinho> It's true... It's just that it's a different path we can follow, allowing both the cases.. I'm not in the idea of setting is as default, but adding something like desktop-gtk3-preload as option
<Trevinho> then we see
<didrocks> hum, adding a part will add confusion
<didrocks> it's either we replace or we don't IMHO
<didrocks> but don't give too much options that developers won't care/just get confused with IMHO
<seb128> I guess my main issue is that it's an hack on low level stack and those might bite you back one day since they are doing undocumented things
 * didrocks would like /usr to be really /usr in snaps
<seb128> where the env thing is an hack
<seb128> but those env variables are documented
<seb128> and there is little risk that they fire back
<seb128> don't mess up with libc level also :p
<seb128> yeah, /usr to be at the correct place would make things easier
<seb128> Trevinho is laaaate
<didrocks> but he was preload*ed* :)
<jbicha> didrocks: can I go ahead and replace unity-greeter/lightdm with gdm3 in ubuntu-desktop?
<jbicha> I just merged Gunnar's language MP
<seb128> jbicha, no
<didrocks> jbicha: kenvandine is doing a last round of testing and doing it
<seb128> jbicha, doesn't seem polite to hijack the transition from somebody who is doing it and testing to upload instead of them
<kenvandine> jbicha, i need to upload gnome-session and gdm first
<seb128> also Ken said he was testing and would upload, see backlog
<kenvandine> i guess it doesn't have to be first...
<kenvandine> but i was going to
<jbicha> sorry, I didn't see the backlog
<jbicha> didrocks: did we want to do Gunnar's language changes now or should we just do one thing at a time?
<didrocks> jbicha: hum, I would like to have an image with gdm first if possible
<didrocks> and that one on the next one
<didrocks> so that we can see additional packages and such
<didrocks> making sense?
<seb128> jbicha, in case you didn't read backlog, can you push your g-c-c changes to the vcs
<jbicha> didrocks: that's fine, I'll revert Gunnar's changes for now then
<didrocks> thx!
<jbicha> seb128: done, thanks
<seb128> jbicha, thank you
<Trevinho> seb128, didrocks : so... ./plugins/xsettings/gsd-xsettings-manager.c... by migrating first and patching this code to use a different key we can fix things I think
<Trevinho> it's thing I should have had in the past actually... but it should work
<Trevinho> i'll check it later
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> Trevinho: excellent! Please once you do it, add me to the card so that I handle the pre-migration stuff
<didrocks> hum, that will be interesting with the wayland sessionâ¦
<didrocks> as the migration script can run twice, we'll seeÂ¿
<Trevinho> didrocks: nope, as that only uses xsettings to inform gtk
<didrocks> yeah, but I mean, migration-wise
<Trevinho> ah
<Trevinho> ok
<didrocks> the migation is per session
<didrocks> I'll deal with it
<jbicha> seb128: your g-c-c upload is a bit broken
<seb128> jbicha, because of the missing C/R/P?
<seb128> or something else?
<jbicha> yes and it's missing the final 's' from gnome-control-center-face.install
<jbicha> faces
<seb128> ?
<seb128> facess?
<jbicha> the package is gnome-control-center-faces but you have a gnome-control-center-face.install
<seb128> ah, the filename
<seb128> doh
<seb128> thanks for spotting that
<seb128> I was already commiting a fix for the C/R/P
<seb128> going to rename as well
<didrocks> and then, u-c-c off main! :)
<didrocks> this is the big package archive gambling this week :)
<seb128> :-)
<jbicha> seb128: are you going to have u-c-c-faces be a transitional package?
<seb128> jbicha, new revision uploaded, hopefully better
<seb128> no
<seb128> why?
<seb128> g-c-c-faces provides it
<jbicha> I'm not sure when transitional packages are required, but I think it might be better to have it than not
<seb128> so just going to drop it from u-c-c
<seb128> Provides should work fine as long as we don't have versioned depends on it
<jbicha> provides alone does not ensure the upgrade happens
<seb128> which I don't think we have
<seb128> right
<seb128> but g-c-c recommends g-c-c-faces
<seb128> that should work
<seb128> if it turns out to be problematic for some reason we can add back a transitional
<seb128> but the case is easy enough that I think it should work
<seb128> it gets trickier when you have several solutions apt can choose to a problem
<jbicha> ok, I was just wondering
<seb128> but I don't think it's complex enough to be an issue in that case
<seb128> well, it's always difficult to say
<seb128> so let's see what upgrade tests say
<kenvandine> i think dropping unity-greeter will allow demoting all the indicators
<seb128> that's what we think as well
<didrocks> and another part of Qt
<seb128> :-)
<didrocks> (not all, due to fcitx)
<didrocks> so yeah, that's why I'm eager to see that effect :)
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, seb128, jbicha: seed updated
<kenvandine> remember, you can't blame me if we don't have images tomorrow :-D
<didrocks> ohhhhh /me removes all his premade jokes in his note
<kenvandine> lol
<seb128> \o/
<seb128> didrocks, oh, and thanks for the binNEW reviews
<didrocks> yw ;)
<seb128> jbicha, GunnarHj, didrocks, I rolled artful langpacks today and upgraded now, gnome-shell is correctly translated in french now
<didrocks> nice!
<jbicha> seb128: thanks!
<seb128> yw!
<jbicha> I guess we need to add X-Ubuntu-Use-Langpack to all the Unity packages or something?
<seb128> that would be nice
<jbicha> seb128: please subscribe the Desktop bug teams to https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/spice-vdagent/ for LP: #1200296
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1200296 in ubuntu-meta (Ubuntu) "[MIR] spice-vdagent" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1200296
<seb128>  jbicha, done
<jbicha> pitti: did you see that were pinged on https://bugzilla.gnome.org/690866 ?
<ubot5> Gnome bug 690866 in gnome-session "Integrate better with systemd" [Normal,New]
<willcooke> night all
<ahayzen> Hi, I've been trying wayland on Ubuntu GNOME 17.04, and I've found that QtCreator crashes when trying to open a file dialog, this appears to be fixed upstream in Qt and in Fedora 25. Any chance this can be patched in Ubuntu as well ? I've reported bug 1702741 to track it.
<ubot5> bug 1702741 in qtcreator (Ubuntu) "QtCreator crashes when opening a filechooser under wayland" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1702741
<jbicha> ahayzen: oh maybe that's what I saw months ago with LP: #1657924
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1657924 in virtualbox (Ubuntu) "Clicking the file chooser button crashes VirtualBox on Zesty" [Medium,Expired] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1657924
<ahayzen> jbicha, could be related
<jbicha> VBox is the only Qt app I use
<jbicha> hmm, it was fixed in Debian in January :|
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-07-07
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu, how is it going?
<oSoMoN> âlut seb128
 * oSoMoN â school
<duflu> oSoMoN, sorry, too much going on.... Good, you?
<jibel> morning
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> lut oSoMoN didrocks jibel
<seb128> hey duflu
<seb128> happy friday!
<seb128> how is everyone today?
<didrocks> happy friday guys!
<duflu> Morning seb128, happy Friday
<didrocks> good, will suffer from warm weather for a couple of days and looks better after that :)
<duflu> + didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu ;)
<seb128> nice
<jibel> duflu, was it you who filed a bug because you cannot log into the unity session after logging into the gnome session?
<duflu> jibel, yeah. Not sure if it's now fixed?
<jibel> duflu, no it is not, do you have the bug #?
<duflu> Actually can't log into any session (on the second attempt)
<duflu> jibel, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lightdm/+bug/1700485
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1700485 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "Second login always fails. I have to reboot between logins" [High,New]
<jibel> I can log into gnome several times but cannot open a unity session
<jibel> thanks
<duflu> jibel, I think that was a differnt bug
<duflu> jbicha had a fix, I think?
 * duflu looks
<jibel> duflu, right, and I'm using gdm not lightdm
<duflu> I can't find the second bug I mentioned
<duflu> I think it was Xwayland failing to start
<duflu> Might be (should be) closed already
<duflu> On a slightly related note, this looks neglected: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg/+bugs?orderby=-id&start=0
<duflu> (also server failures should be logged against xorg-server :)
<duflu> Does anyone have any opinions on the preparation of this?  https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-audio-dev/pulseaudio/commit/?h=ubuntu
<willcooke> morning all, happy Friday!
<seb128> hey willcooke, happy friday!
<willcooke> hey seb128!  Late night or early morning?
<willcooke> :)_
<jibel> or both ;)
<willcooke> lol
<seb128> lol but sort of true ... :p
<seb128> late night was my doing, I decided to use a bit the time where everything is quiet to get some work and other things done (and watched some tennis on TV)
<willcooke> Wimbledon?
<seb128> then also had an early morning, but that one was not my choice :p
<seb128> yes
<seb128> going to be through for Andy this year :p
<willcooke> ha, yeah
<willcooke> he's had his turn
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<willcooke> morning didrocks, thanks for the email - that's great - perfect solution I think.  Sorry for being lazy :)
<didrocks> willcooke: no worry! I *think* that's the user story which makes sense regarding to our past upgrade story
<willcooke> It's a tricky one, right?  Because we need people to move to the new shell, otherwise what's the point.  But also - we don't want to freak people out and leave them stranded with something they can't (or won't use).  So I think your solution is the right one
<oSoMoN> duflu, same here, too much going onâ¦ but Iâm doing good otherwise :)
<didrocks> seb128: while I'm touching u-c-c, I noticed you didn't remove unity-control-center-faces, doing it as g-c-c-faces provides the exact same one + tweaking the dep, alright?
<seb128> didrocks, k, it was on my list for today but if you are at it feel free to do that as well
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I'm adding the additional recommends on deja-dup at the same time
<seb128> great,thanks
<seb128> let me know if you want me to approve the mp
<seb128> unsure if we still go through landings for u-c-c?
<didrocks> hum, I was going to push directly as it's only small packaging change, wdyt?
<seb128> wfm
<seb128> 2 different commits for deja-dup and faces though please :p
<didrocks> (deja-dup building FYI)
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> already that :)
<seb128> great :-)
<didrocks> seb128: just pushed it if you want to have a look
<seb128> didrocks, looks good!
<didrocks> seb128: all archs are built for deja-dup new package. So, it's in NEW when you get a chanceâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, already done
<seb128> do you have something that push notifications for you?
<seb128> or did you hit refresh every 10s?
<seb128> (I was doing that waiting for the arm64 debs to hit the queue, build was done when I looked at it but the debs were not there yet)
<didrocks> seb128: I had the web page with all arch builds opened
<didrocks> :)
<seb128> it auto refreshes?
<didrocks> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/deja-dup/34.4-0ubuntu3
<didrocks> yeah, the arch part does
<seb128> oh ok, nice
<seb128> good to now
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yw, thanks for your review!
 * didrocks pushes u-c-c thus
<didrocks> once publish, I'll demote u-c-c source and binaries
<seb128> \o/
<didrocks> (all the rest still on the page are already demoted if their are source + bins)
<seb128> now if only we had working iso builds :p
<jibel> i pinged the release team
<jibel> sil2100, ^ any chance to have a look today or you prefer to wait for infinity ?
<jibel> sil2100, today's isos fail in the same way than yesterday
<seb128> jibel, can you remind me where are the logs for the iso build?
<jibel> seb128, https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/cd-build-logs/ubuntu/artful/
<jibel> and the error
<jibel> E: No packages found
<jibel> dpkg-deb: error: error reading archive magic version number from file /srv/cdimage.ubuntu.com/ftp/: Is a directory
<jibel> duflu, bu 1702861
<jibel> bug 1702861
<ubot5> bug 1702861 in gnome-session (Ubuntu) "unity session sometimes fail to start" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1702861
<jibel> I didn't find any useful data
<jibel> where are gdm logs? (anything more verbose than the line in the journal)
<seb128> jibel, you really meant "unity" in that report?
<jibel> seb128, yes
<seb128> no such issue with the GNOME session?
<jibel> seb128, no it works fine
<jibel> seb128, but frequently unity fails
<seb128> unsure for the gdm logs
<jibel> seb128, I've both session installed + gdm and all updates applied
<seb128> I would expect them to be in the journal
<jibel> yeah but the only line I've in the journal is
<jibel> juil. 07 10:56:02 ubuntu gdm3[855]: GdmDisplay: display lasted 0,497889 seconds
<jibel> not very useful
<jibel> and /var/log/gdm3 is empty
<duflu> jibel, I found some critical assertions in my logs of bug 1700485. Not sure if they are fatal though
<ubot5> bug 1700485 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "Second login always fails. I have to reboot between logins" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1700485
<duflu> Probably not related, but just as problematic: gnome-shell's top crash seems to be caused by Xwayland dying (which is also fatal for gnome-shell on Wayland): https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1505409
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1505409 in GNOME Shell "gnome-shell crashed with SIGTRAP in x_io_error() from _XIOError() from _XEventsQueued() from XPending() from gdk_check_xpending() ["Connection to xwayland lost"]" [Critical,Confirmed]
<jibel> I've dbus errors in xsession-errors
<jibel> dbus-update-activation-environment: error: unable to connect to D-Bus: Failed to connect to socket /run/user/1000/bus: Connection refused
<jibel> Failed to connect to bus: Connexion refusÃ©e
<seb128> is that after login in a session and out?
<jibel> not sure. They don't change when a login fails so it might be unrelated
<jibel> (they = the log files)
<seb128> jibel, try maybe to edit /etc/gdm3/custom.conf and un-comment the debug enable=true
<seb128> not sure if that's the same issue but I see something to duflu on my testing vm which is still on lightdm
<seb128> login into GNOME works fine
<seb128> log out and trying to log in again fails
<jibel> ok
<jibel> seb128, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-session/+bug/1702861/+attachment/4910785/+files/journal_debug.log
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1702861 in gnome-session (Ubuntu) "unity session sometimes fail to start" [Undecided,New]
<jibel> there are dbus errors
<jibel> and this
<jibel> 1000 juil. 07 11:41:06 ubuntu gdm-password][10736]: GdmSessionWorker: jumping to VT 1
<jibel> 1001 juil. 07 11:41:06 ubuntu gdm-password][10736]: GdmSessionWorker: couldn't finalize jump to VT 1: Appel systÃ¨me interrompu
<seb128> seems the debug option works :-)
<seb128> it's not due to the login manager at least on my vm
<seb128> I get the same issue if I "startx -- :1"
<seb128> first time works
<seb128> if I close and retry session fails to open
<seb128> seems dbus is failing for some reason
<duflu> OK, I give up. Birthday presents to wrap, and dinner to cook
<duflu> o/
 * jibel relocates biab
<seb128> ah
<seb128> my intuition was good
<seb128> downgrading gnome-session to 3.24.1-0ubuntu4 fixes it
<seb128> it's a side effect of https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-session/3.24.1-0ubuntu5
<seb128> "  * Backport patches from 3.25.3 to kill D-Bus clients on log out."
<seb128> jbicha, ^
<seb128> jibel, ^ unsure if that's your issue as well but might well be
<seb128> jibel, would be interesting to know if your unity issue is also happening on a fresh boot
<jibel> seb128, let me try
<jbicha> seb128: could you talk to halfline about that issue then, he was thinking about pushing the gnome-session workaround to Fedora 25; it's already part of Fedora 26 which will release in a few days
<seb128> woot, indicators are off the iso
<seb128> not indicator-application though
<seb128> hey jbicha
<seb128> jbicha, I commented on the bugzilla saying that
<jbicha> I guess libappindicator3-1 shouldn't recommend indicator-application then
<jbicha> seb128: your comment says "unable to log into GNOME again", but I thought it was Unity that had the problem?
<seb128> jbicha, I didn't try unity, I'm saying that issue with a stock artful install and GNOME
<seb128> saying->seeing
<jbicha> I can definitely log out and log back in here (that is part of the test case for the GOA bug)
<didrocks> we should do those "suggests" for indicator-application and indicator-messages if we can't swap off the deps, indeed
<seb128> jbicha, well, I can't, so there is a bug that doesn't impact all users that doesn't mean it's not a bug :p
<seb128> didrocks, yeah
<seb128> hum, something has been pulling kerneloops-applet on the iso recently
<seb128> do we want that on?
<didrocks> I don't think we want multiple crash report experience, do we?
<jbicha> seb128: yes, we just have to figure out what's different about your system than mine ;)
<didrocks> also, i wonder if the recommends from gdm3 to xserver-xephyr has any use
<seb128> didrocks, right, I'!u
<didrocks> (I thought that would have been analyzed for the MIR)
<seb128> didrocks, right, I'm unsure what's the status today of kerneloops though, are those handled by apport?
<seb128> or just not handled?
<seb128> did the MIR review got done?
<seb128> security basically waived it in
<didrocks> well, when writing it, the reporter should look at depends/recommends
<seb128> and ken wanted to bounce back to Mathieu but I don't think that was done at the end?
<didrocks> seb128: unsure about kerneloops
<didrocks> no, because for me he did +1 and push that to security
<didrocks> (the MIR team does a pass first, to ensure that security only has to review the code)
<jibel> seb128, new image http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/20170707.1/
<didrocks> kenvandine: you didn't handle the Ubuntu GNOME -> ubuntu transition if I'm correct, right?
<seb128> jibel, right, I saw, that's part of what we are discussing (indicators are off, nice!)
<didrocks> kenvandine: iirc, I added that to your card as the ubuntu GNOME team asked to transition to the ubuntu session
<seb128> and you can blame didrocks for the iso not building after all :p
<didrocks> heh :)
<didrocks> only people doing things break things I guess :p
<seb128> yeah, I was thinking that as typing :-)
<seb128> true statement
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
 * didrocks hugs seb128 back
<didrocks> hum, I don't find interesting references to xephyr on gdm3's changelog
<seb128> good work, quite some cleanup got done this week and things went without issues for the most parts
<didrocks> thx ;)
 * didrocks looks at the debian package, just in case
<seb128> I don't really see why xephyr would be useful there...
<didrocks> neither do I
<jbicha> didrocks: kenvandine: let's save the Ubuntu GNOME transition for next week, I want to discuss that with darkxst first
<seb128> jbicha, that "system" is a daily artful install a bit less than a week old with no tweaking
<didrocks> jbicha: ok :)
<seb128> jbicha, so pretty much as stock as you can get, it's in virtualbox if that makes a difference (but shouldn't for dbus)
<jbicha> ok
<seb128> anyway, let's see if upstream has some debug hints
<didrocks> # Use Xephyr if it is available.  It works better than Xnest since Xephyr
<didrocks> # supports the Xserver extensions, even if on a remote machine.
 * didrocks reboots quickly
<jibel> seb128, I cannot reproduce on a fresh boot, but as soon as I login/logout from gnome, I cannot log into unity anymore but can still log into gnome
<jibel> didrocks, too much clean up bug 1702892 ?
<ubot5> bug 1702892 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Ubiquity does not use the Ubuntu font" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1702892
<didrocks> jibel: interesting, I wonder if ubiquity doesn't use unity-settings-daemon and we don't have anything running in the ubiquity session anymore
<didrocks> jibel: that would my only explanation, nothing for fonts have been demoted
<didrocks> jibel: if you run the live session, and then, ubiquity, is it fine?
<jibel> didrocks, and the installer fails to start
<didrocks> any logs?
<jibel> didrocks, yes, 1 min
<jibel> didrocks, http://paste.ubuntu.com/25039048/ and for bonus points a segfault o fupdate-notifier
<didrocks> hum, doesn't really help, mind trying live session & ubiquity?
<didrocks> I wonder if Gdk.Cursor is using some xsettings set by g-s-d/u-s-d and none of them are running, hence this no font/segfault
<didrocks> xnox: does it make sense to you? ^
<jibel> didrocks, that's what I did
<didrocks> ah, and the segfault is there?
<jibel> yes
<didrocks> and non ubuntu font either?
<jibel> didrocks, but that's 2 issues, 1 ubquity failing and 2. update-notifier crash
<didrocks> in the live session, like apps
<jibel> hm apport-gtk crashes to
<jibel> to*
<jibel> too*
<didrocks> I guess all comes from the same issue
<didrocks> (at least, the crashes)
<xnox> didrocks, ubiquity should start a settings-daemon and it has complex heuristics as to which daemons to start. let me check the code.
<didrocks> GDK can't get cursor
<didrocks> for whatever reason
<didrocks> I wonder why this happens though
<jbicha> oSoMoN: fyi for the LO i386 issue https://lwn.net/Articles/727206/
<xnox> didrocks, hm, so it should be activating gsd, but in the usd code path we have an extra signalwatcher and ubiquity-dm waits for the xsettings plugin to be activated before proceeding with the rest of the setup.
<jibel> didrocks, syslog attached to bug 1702894
<ubot5> bug 1702894 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "artful desktop 20170707.1 - ubiquity fails to start" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1702894
<didrocks> jibel: thx! do you mind making the manifest diff as you did the other day?
<didrocks> I'm starting a vm
<xnox> imho all o fthis should go / shouldn't be necessory and simply normal gdm should auto-launch gnome-shell with ubiquity in it =/
<didrocks> xnox: well, seems to be in the session as well from what jibel says, so could be unrelated
<didrocks> the "gdk can't get a cursor" sounds weird though
<xnox> does gds still have plugins, or a way to wait for gds to fully initialise and e.g. create xsettings stuff /me wonders
<jibel> didrocks, sure, will do
<didrocks> jibel: thx!
<didrocks> xnox: I guess in the live session, it is already fully started
<didrocks> maybe though we are in a wayland session by defaultâ¦
<didrocks> now that gdm is default
 * didrocks waits for a long build to finish and then spawn a vm
<jbicha> we aren't defaulting to Wayland yet anywhere
<didrocks> gdm has some heuristic I was told
<didrocks> but worth checking
<jbicha> oh, gdm3 does default to Wayland but the actual sessions should still be X by default, hmm
<didrocks> let's check on the live first
<jbicha> we haven't stopped the Ubuntu GNOME daily iso builds yet so you could check if things are working there
<andyrock> mpt: any news on the design?
<jibel> didrocks, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1702892/+attachment/4910862/+files/20170705-20170707.1-manifest.diff
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1702892 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Ubiquity does not use the Ubuntu font" [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> jibel: nothing too crazy or unexpected at first look, same for you?
<oSoMoN> jbicha, thanks for the link
<seb128> jibel, when did that issue start?
<seb128> I guess today and didrocks is already looking at it
<jibel> seb128, with latest image. and it's issues (1. font in ubiquity-dm  2. ubiquity fails to start from the live session)
<seb128> let me know people if you need more eyes to look at that
<didrocks> seb128: I would like a second opinion (didn't start the vm yet) on the live diff and error reported
 * xnox hasn't touched ubiquity in a long time, nor gdm3 ever =/
<jibel> seb128, second bug is bug 1702894
<ubot5> bug 1702894 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "artful desktop 20170707.1 - ubiquity fails to start" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1702894
<didrocks> jibel: so you confirm the font is only ubiquity-dm related, correct?
<didrocks> like if you open gedit or so in live
<didrocks> you have the ubuntu font?
<seb128> didrocks, I don't see anything obvious in the manifest diff indeed
<didrocks> seb128: the crash looks weird, can't get a GDK Cursor
<didrocks> my theory on the font is that g-s-d isn't started by ubiquity for $reasons
<seb128> didrocks, I would guess "ubiquity doesn't work under wayland" :p
<didrocks> and for the crash, wayland yeah
<didrocks> (so, due to gdm being too smart and autologin in wayland)
<didrocks> I guess xprop doesn't report anything on wayland?
<seb128> to know if you are under wayland you mean?
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> (I wouldn't trust env variable as we can have some scripts settings them unconditionnaly)
<seb128> loginctl show-session should tell you
<jibel> didrocks, yes it's only in dm
<jibel> didrocks, the live session is fine
<seb128> or echo $XDG_SESSION_TYPE
<didrocks> ok, will give it a try once the current build is done
<seb128> I'm downloading the daily, a few more minutes
<didrocks> confirmed
<didrocks> ubiquity crashes only under wayland
<didrocks> (tried on an old installation, switched session
<didrocks> )
<didrocks> wayland -> crash, x -> works
<didrocks> jibel: seb128: xnox: ^
<didrocks> on the font in ubiquity-dm, I bet g-s-d isn't started and we don't have u-s-d anymoreâ¦
<seb128> confirmed that daily iso boot to wayland
<didrocks> so, not a cleaning issue, upstream code issue and gdm transition :p
<didrocks> anyway, I think we should force X for now
<seb128> loginctrl show-session says type=wayland
<didrocks> seb128: what's the session name?
<didrocks> I guess we'll need to poke in gdm smartness
<didrocks> seb128: and do you mind looking/starting g-s-d in ubiquity-dm?
<didrocks> for the font issue
<seb128> DESKTOP_SESSION=ubuntu-wayland
<seb128> sure, can look to that
<didrocks> interesting, I guess it prefers /usr/share/wayland-sessions/ if it finds anything?
<seb128> I guess
<didrocks> oh we didn't set any default in casperâ¦
<xnox> didrocks, g-s-d is started in ubiquity-dm. but in u-s-d codepath there is an extra wait for the xsettings plugin to be started before proceeding.
<didrocks> that should have been part of the gdm transition card
<didrocks> xnox: ah, that's the issueâ¦
<didrocks> but
<xnox> didrocks, imho it looks like we are not waiting for enough of g-s-d to be running before proceeding to create things.
<didrocks> IIRC, once it starts, it refreshes the windows?
<xnox> or e.g. u-s-d != g-s-d in some other way.
<didrocks> like in gtk, it's the themes and such
<xnox> but not text, i would not think.
<didrocks> I thought there were a signalling mecanism
<didrocks> hum
<didrocks> yeah
<seb128> easy way to know your session is a wayland one, alt-f2 "r"
<seb128> that gives you an error under wayland
<xnox> there are a lot of hacks to change language on the fly in ubiquity.
<didrocks> seb128: "r"?
<xnox> reload?!
<seb128> yes
<seb128> it's an hack telling gnome-shell to restart
<didrocks> interesting
<didrocks> nice trick seb128 :)
<didrocks> xnox: do you think you will have time to work on this ubiquity thingy? (I think your analyze is correct)
<xnox> no
<xnox> i do not work on ubiquity.
<seb128> who does?
<xnox> desktop team?
<xnox> =)
<seb128> good one :p
<didrocks> sounds like the same story than software-center, update-manager and all this :p
<xnox> honestly none of us touched gsd or gdm code paths.
<xnox> it was always gnome team, which i guess now is desktop team.
<xnox> e.g. laney would often propose fixes for integration updates like that.
<seb128> I'm having a look
<seb128> it might be easy
<xnox> ideally we should not have ubiquity-dm at all
<didrocks> I'm looking at the casper/set default gdm session
<xnox> and just do casper override or some such to have default session started normally with gdm, in the installer mode.
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> quite agree on that one
<didrocks> xnox: do you mind dumping the u-s-d hacks/xsettings sync notes on jibel's bug
<xnox> which one? the does not start - or the font one?
<didrocks> font one
<didrocks> the "does not start" should be separated
<didrocks> like "get ubiquity to work under wayland"
<didrocks> and "casper set default session to X for now"
<didrocks> jibel: FYI ^
<didrocks> reboots & back
<xnox> done
<seb128> xnox, is it normal that I can't go to a vt in ubiquity-dm mode?
<xnox> seb128, yes.
<xnox> seb128, that would also be fixed iff we switch to gdm3 launching ubiquity in installer mode.
<xnox> basically systemd thinks one is not booted yet, and currently ttys are not started by systemd as they are ordered to be _after_ ubiquity
<xnox> i send a patch for that by at the p itti did not take it =(
<xnox> if you boot with debug-ubiquity option
<xnox> ctlr-alt-t should start gnome terminal for you....
<seb128> thanks
<xnox> or e.g. modify ubiquity-dm to launch gnome-terminal process for you in addition to others
<xnox> might be quicker to do that.
<xnox> (just like it e.g. launches g-s-d et al)
<seb128> ah
<seb128> xnox, didrocks, that's not the ubiquity-dm issue
<didrocks> hum?
<seb128> g-s-d got split in different binaries
<seb128> so there is gnome-settings-daemon binary anymore
<xnox> oh, wrong path in ubiquity-dm?
<seb128> since https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/3.23.3-0ubuntu1
<didrocks> ahhhhhhh, so it's working due to dbus call on the session
<xnox> instead of repeating ourselves in ubiquity-dm.... we really should look into launching normal session of gdm3 in installer mode without ubiquity-dm
<didrocks> but not ubiquity which expects the binary?
<seb128> no
<seb128> each binary has an autostart desktop
<seb128> so they start in the session
<seb128> but yeah, same result
<didrocks> (btw, confirmed we don't set a default session in gdm casper script)
<seb128> ubiquity-dm does
<seb128>                 gsd = '/usr/lib/gnome-settings-daemon/gnome-settings-daemon'
<seb128>                 elif osextras.find_on_path(gsd):
<didrocks> making sense, so just reintroducing that new package split on live would work
<seb128> jbicha, did you look at updating ubiquity for the new g-s-d?
<jbicha> well, obviously it worked somehow for Ubuntu GNOME 17.04
<jbicha> no
<didrocks> I guess you don't use ubuntu fonts for ubuntu GNOME?
<jbicha> no
<seb128> jbicha, it worked fully or you didn't get the right font used in install only mode and didn't notice?
<didrocks> seb128: I think for casper, instead of setting a default session, I could use WaylandEnable=false, which "should" pick the X session
<didrocks> sounds like a more flexible approach to me, but needs testing
<seb128> right
<didrocks> (at worst, we fix it on monday if we notice we are still using wayland despite this)
<didrocks> ok, doing this
 * didrocks opens a bug for refering that, as different from ubiquity
<jbicha> yeah, I guess it used the wrong font but it's difficult for me to notice a detail like that :)
<seb128> hehe
<didrocks> jibel: seb128: xnox: casper "fix" uploaded to force a X session (I referenced bug #1702904). So next image should force-start the X session making ubiquity not crashing under live
<ubot5> bug 1702904 in casper (Ubuntu) "Ubiquity is crashing under wayland" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1702904
<seb128> great
<didrocks> however ubiquity not working with wayland is concerning long-term
<didrocks> seb128: are you handling the g-s-d binary so that we can check the font is loaded on ubiquity-dm
<didrocks> (and just because I had to say it: "NOT related to any iso cleanup I did" :p)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> I can have a look if you want
<seb128> at least put a patch up for testing
<didrocks> yep
<seb128> ok
<didrocks> I hope that option (still on custom.conf) is working
<didrocks> we'll see at next iso build ;)
<didrocks> otherwise, we'll force the default session, but meh
<didrocks> meanwhile, I can finally demote u-c-c source AND binary
<seb128> :-)
<kenvandine> i hope we're going to continue to use the ubuntu font
<seb128> kenvandine, we should!
<kenvandine> we totally should!
<kenvandine> it's still my favorite font :)
<didrocks> interesting, thunderbird-gnome-support is an empty package to pull libmessaging-menu, libunity9 deps
<didrocks> so, it should mean the deps are optional to thunderbird despite being linked against them? Interesting :)
 * didrocks will give it a try
<seb128> jibel, xnox, jbicha, that trivial diff fixes the font issue https://launchpadlibrarian.net/327300814/ubiquity.patch , I'm not making a proper merge request because I want to have a look to what other gsd binaries might need to be started as well
<seb128> on that note going for some exercice
<seb128> be back later to finish a few things and deal with backlog
<willcooke> Does U1 "work" in GNOME Online Accounts?
<andyrock> i don't think so
<andyrock> i guess it's not supported at all
<andyrock> at least it was not supported
<willcooke> I /think/ we need that then, what do you think?
<willcooke> trying to think where it's used
<willcooke> could be used for GNOME Software, and Live Patch in 18.04
<willcooke> but I can't think of other places its needed
<willcooke> In fact, it's pretty broken in Xenial anyway
<andyrock> adding support should not be that difficult
<willcooke> thanks andyrock - I've added a Trello card to get input from Laney and seb128
<willcooke> jbicha, I tried to build the gnome-getting-started-docs project with the vp9 changes, but I can't work out how it's supposed to render those files.  Any ideas how it's supposed to work?  np if not, I'll keep plugging away
<willcooke> doh
<willcooke> fixed
<willcooke> well, I think so, it's doing things now
<jbicha> moving Unity to GOA is a bit complicated
<jbicha> UOA doesn't support Ubuntu SSO (or Ubuntu One) and it's probably not worth trying to enable that just for 16.04
<willcooke> yeah, but potentially is for B, right?
<willcooke> jbicha, comment here if you like:  https://trello.com/c/2cMgendl
<jbicha> UOA won't exist in B
<willcooke> I mean G-O-A
<willcooke> sorry
<willcooke> adding support for U1 to G-o-a for B
<jbicha> I was getting confused by the terms you were using :)
<jbicha> yes, that could be useful
<jbicha> I believe GOA is 2 parts: the goa source package and the UI in g-c-c
<jbicha> g-c-c has diverged enough from u-c-c that it might be a pain to try to copy/merge current g-c-c code to u-c-c
<Trevinho> seb128: I don't know if you saw them arleady but i've 2 ucc branches with some fixes I forgot to land :|
<Trevinho> and the SRU branch too might need your approval
<willcooke> jbicha, ack, thx.  Should be fairly straight forward for us to write a new thing for g-o-a
 * oSoMoN EOW
<oSoMoN> have a great week-end everyone!
<willcooke> happy weekend all o/
<seb128> have a nice w.e everyone
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-07-08
<immu> hello i am on 17.10 and if use Winkey+L system won't lock
<immu> does any know how to stop my microphone-inbuilt levels getting reduced automatically to lower levels?????????
<jbicha> immu: the default is Ctrl+Alt+L but you can change it in Settings>Keyboard
<immu> jbicha, thanks buddy again :)
<immu> can you advise me on the microphone levels also ? and can i remap my keyboard to winkey+L
<immu> !fstab
<ubot5> The /etc/fstab file indicates how drive partitions are to be used or otherwise integrated into the file system. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Fstab and http://www.pclosmag.com/html/Issues/200709/page07.html and !Partitions
<jbicha> yes you can change the keyboard setting. It might not work in Wayland but Wayland isn't the default yet
<immu> for 17.10 dev builds many things are not allowed?
<immu> which can be done on a normal release build?
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-02
<handsome_feng> Hi, could someone here handle my request? Thanks! https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/670540
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: Hello :)
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: It would probably be better for you to ask in #launchpad.
<tsimonq2> iirc wgrant is in Australia, so there's a possibility that he is lurking.
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2: Oh, Thank you for your important information!
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: No problem, have a great day :)
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2: you too :)
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<jibel> Good morning
<duflu> Hi jibel
<ricotz> hey desktopers
<duflu> Hi ricotz
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<jibel> didrocks, hi, I'm reviewing bug 1778697. How do you set apport to never report report errors from g-c-c?
<ubot5> bug 1778697 in update-notifier (Ubuntu Bionic) "update-notifier always present apport-gtk UI on crashes, even on autoreport mode" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1778697
<jibel> didrocks, in privacy I've auto or manual
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/1:3.28.1-0ubuntu1.18.04.2
<didrocks> jibel: that should be in the g-c-c sru, you should have a secondary dialog with an option box and checkbox, you don't see this?
<didrocks> hey seb128
<jibel> didrocks, well, I tried update-notifier alone, there is no mention of it depending on the newer version of g-c-c
<jibel> didrocks, also when set to manual with current version of g-c-c I don't get any dialog and the crash is not uploaded automatically
<didrocks> jibel: ah, right, I was assuming newer g-c-c would be released in -updates already as I've uploaded it some time ago
<didrocks> jibel: well, you know about crash not being uploaded with what we found on Thursdayâ¦
<didrocks> which will be in newer apport
<didrocks> so, unfortunately, we can also check the status right now, as the existing API is lying
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> 'can't?
<seb128> didrocks, g-c-c is 6 days old on the SRU page so I guess it's going to be aged enough only today, also it's not verified yet
<didrocks> seb128: no, we can check the status reported by whoopsie API
<didrocks> isntead of automatically reporting bugs
<didrocks> the status will say that it's set to automatically upload even if it won't do it
<didrocks> g-c-c has been uploaded way more than 6 days ago, that's why I didn't track if it was releasde or not in -ugdates
<didrocks> updates*
<seb128> ah, I see
<seb128> delay to have it reviewed/accepted
<didrocks> yeah
<seb128> also nevermind the +not comment, the syntax construction was looking weird to me "unfortunatly, we can, as the it's lying"
<seb128> the unfortatly and lying bits made it sounds like the middle part should be negactive as well
<didrocks> yeahn, sorry, I'm doing 2 things at the same time, looking at why apport autopkgtests are failing when passing locallyâ¦
<jibel> didrocks, there is something weird going on with g-c-c from proposed
<didrocks> this whole stack is a PITA :/
<seb128> shame that you touched it enough to be the new maintainer :p
 * seb128 hides
<didrocks> clearly not
<didrocks> I would just rewrite the whole 3 things in one if that was the case :p
<seb128> haha
<jibel> didrocks, set reporting to auto, close the dialog and minimize g-c-c, generate a crash (sh -c 'kill -SEGV $$'), restore g-c-c, reporting is set to never
<didrocks> jibel: this isn't related to the crash, but whoopsie give an invalid signal to g-c-c before stopping
<didrocks> if you just close g-c-c
<didrocks> (without keeping it on that page)
<didrocks> restart it
<didrocks> it will always reflect the correct value
<didrocks> but whoopse-preferences is a activated dbus service
<didrocks> which close on idle
<didrocks> in a minute
<didrocks> and send this invalid signal before shutting down
<didrocks> that's next to fix on my list :/
<ricotz> hi :), is there some hold up in processing gnome stable updates?
<didrocks> jibel: most of users will just tweaks the options, close the window anyway, so, shouldn't be noticeable
<seb128> hey ricotz, doesn't look like it, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/bionic/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=gnome ?
<ricotz> I am wondering because vala is still at 0.40.4 (latest 0.40.7), an update is also wanted for bionic, while it is synced from debian I already tried to ask there
<seb128> ricotz, do you have a specific one in mind?
<didrocks> Ran 29 tests in 81.807s
<didrocks> OK
<didrocks> :/
<didrocks> in a vmâ¦
<ricotz> seb128, hi :), "hold up" as in not picking up upstream releases
<seb128> ricotz, same old lack of resources/help needed, if you are interested why not contributing that SRU?
<ricotz> seb128, I am kind of busy with other things and vala upstream itself, and my membership request for gnome on debian salsa wasn't processed
<seb128> ricotz, k, well I guess welcome to the club :)
<ricotz> I see, j_bicha was picking them up pretty fast, I guess he is taking some break
<seb128> yeah, he has not been around recently
<ricotz> ok
<seb128> and none of us has the free cycles to work on those updates
<seb128> especially the ones which don't have specific reported issues our customers/users are asking to see resolved
<ricotz> toolchain updates are kind of important ;)
<seb128> vala typically is not really user facing
<jibel> didrocks, another issue, I've reporting set to never and got a crash dialog
<seb128> yes, they are, as is other work
<seb128> ricotz, sorry, I just don't have a good answer for you, we have too much to do and not enough people
<ricotz> seb128, ok, I see that
<ricotz> will have to try more on the debian side first anyway
<ricotz> seb128, thanks
<seb128> yw!
<didrocks> jibel: with latest update-notifier?
<jibel> didrocks, yes
<didrocks> ah, that one is more annoyingâ¦
<didrocks> I've tested is a lot on Friday
<didrocks> it*
<didrocks> and didn't get into that situation
<didrocks> so, when you have g-c-c, set to never report crash, install the new update-notifier, ensure that version is running (logout/login)
<didrocks> you still get an UI?
<jibel> didrocks, I killed u-n and started it manually
<didrocks> :( I did try this more than once before uploading u-n :/
<didrocks> the auto use-case is fixed by apport
<didrocks> the never use-case is fixed by u-n
<jibel> didrocks, I'll approve g-c-c because it's behaving correctly and whoopsie is stopped/started according to the reporting mode.
<willcooke> morning
<didrocks> jibel: yeah, I guess it's the only piece working currently of the stack :/
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<jibel> bonjour willcooke
<seb128> hey willcooke, how are you?
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<Laney> morning
<duflu> And morning Laney
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<seb128> had a good trip back? did you recover from the crazy week?
<willcooke> seb128, good thanks!  The sun is still shining.  How is your cold?
<didrocks> hey Laney
<seb128> willcooke, not great, I've been feeling tired whole w.e and the cought has been quite annoying since yesterday and woke me up a bunch of time during the night :/
<seb128> but otherwise it's sunny here as well!
<Laney> hey duflu seb128 didrocks willcooke
<Laney> seb128: delayed by like 2.5 hours but otherwise was alright, managed to make a quick change at st pancras
<seb128> italians, always laaaate :)
<Laney> back at like 1am, then I got up at 7.45 to go do the parkrun /o\
<Laney> heh
<Laney> the pilot blamed the londons
<Laney> london air traffic controllers*
<seb128> lol
<Laney> https://nats.aero/blog/2018/06/final-excds-transition/
<Laney> LocutusOfBorg: thx for sponsoring gtk - can you make sure that the branches are updated please?
 * didrocks understands now the apport autopkgtests failure
<didrocks> and why it's passing locally
<didrocks> so, basically, I have to really acknoledge this time that you can't disable apport if you don't have whoopsie installed
<didrocks> (which was already the case, disabling apport was made by a whoopsie configuration file)
<didrocks> (that whoopsie wasn't even creating/readingâ¦) :/
<didrocks> and you was setting apport to "never" but whoopsie was still uploading your traces (and automatically)
<didrocks> I guess this is ok, let me try then to ack that, people can still disable apport anyway without whoopsie install by uninstalling it
<didrocks> seb128: making sense to you? ^
<didrocks> seb128: that can be summarized as https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~didrocks/apport/whoopsie-auto-ui/revision/3208 (see commit message as well)
 * didrocks tests that in autopkgtests suite now
<didrocks> (which doesn't have whoopsie installed, that's why it was passing locally)
<seb128> didrocks, reading
<seb128> wfm
<didrocks> let me confirm that autopkgtests pass with it :)
<didrocks> I'll do a followup upload
<didrocks> meanwhile j_ibel found the issue in u-n (grrrr crash report spawing after 5 minutes or moreâ¦ I probably haven't waited enough in the "never" case :/)
<Trevinho> morning
<didrocks> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> hi didrocks
<Trevinho> thanks for the SRU
<didrocks> yw ;)
<didrocks> thanks for making them
<andyrock> morning
<didrocks> hey andyrock!
<andyrock> seb128: I got a fix for https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/issues/109
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue 109 in gnome-shell "Extended characters in OSK don't get entered" (comments: 16) [Opened]
<andyrock> at least a way to fix it
<andyrock> working on a clean MP
<didrocks> Ran 29 tests in 12.114s
<didrocks> seb128: ok, autopkgtests fixed, mind commenting on https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/apport/whoopsie-auto-ui/+merge/348479 as there is an additional commit since you approved?
<seb128> andyrock, hey, happy monday! great :)
<seb128> hey Trevinho, how are you?
<Trevinho> hi seb128 all good, sun sprint is continuing for two days more here :)
<seb128> didrocks, done
<Trevinho> seb128: you?
<didrocks> seb128: thanks!
<seb128> Trevinho, I'm ok, got a cold after coming back which is has been kicking my ass a bit :l/
<Trevinho> damn...
<Trevinho> I've also a cold :-(
<Trevinho> now it's 30ish
<seb128> blocked nosed at first and it turned into caughing this w.e which made my night a bit difficult
<didrocks> get better before you come to GUADEC! :)
<seb128> should be fine by then
<didrocks> 38Â°C yesterday here :(
<Trevinho> yesterday pool was a must :)
<seb128> hehe
<didrocks> apport 2.20.10-0ubuntu5 uploaded
<seb128> \o/
<didrocks> hoping that one will pass proposed, once there, we can envision SRUing
<didrocks> j_ibel confirms the u-n scheduler is weird, sometimes you get a crash and nothing happens even after 8 minutesâ¦
<didrocks> so I guess that's why my tests were skewed, he found the issue (no absolute path to call systemctl)
<didrocks> I don't think it's worth fixing update-notifier scheduler (which seems stuck in some cases) as we'll move in cosmic to systemd user session hopefully?
<seb128> I'm not sure to understand what bit is buggy and why
<seb128> no absolute path means it fails to find the command?
<seb128> then it shouldn't work at all?
<didrocks> right, but it's a call to systemctl
<didrocks> to check if the service is up or not
<seb128> that sounds like worth fixing in the LTS, it's a nicer experience if you get the report dialog without delay
<didrocks> hum
<didrocks> no, we didn't find a fix for that
<seb128> that doesn't need to be you fixing it though
<seb128> just report it and give me the bug number
<didrocks> just so that "never" really works (fixing the previous patch)
<didrocks> ok
<seb128> thx
<didrocks> by default, there is a 3 minutes delay
<didrocks> (from the start)
<didrocks> I guess to accumulate the "crashes" dialog if multiple happens
<seb128> that's to not load the system on login?
<didrocks> maybeâ¦ but it's still the case way even after the first 3 minutes
<didrocks> basically, the whole concept of "show the crash dialog" immediately to explain why something doesn't work was never behaving like that :p
<seb128> that stack could really do with a good review/bug fixing round
<didrocks> clearly
<didrocks> too many projects interleaving
<seb128> I'm going to have a look to those 3 minutes thing
<didrocks> update-notifier/apport/whoopsie/whoopsie-preferences
<seb128> that must have been done for a reason
<didrocks> seb128: changing the timer will be easy, the issue is that sometimes, it's stuck and miss the window
<didrocks> and you have to create a new inotify in /var/crash to "unstuck" it
<seb128> let's get that reported and the foundations list
<didrocks> (which was why I thought my patch was working)
<didrocks> yes
<jibel> didrocks, i'll file the bug
<didrocks> thanks jibel!
 * didrocks uploads u-n fix in cosmic and bionic
<duflu> Trevinho, thinking about patching mutter!117 ?
<LocutusOfBorg> Laney, I already asked @tsimonq2 to do it :)
<Laney> LocutusOfBorg: if he could have pushed then he could probably have uploaded no?
<Laney> or you didn't work from a branch to sponsor it for some reason?
<LocutusOfBorg> not sure if he has access, let me push them
<Laney> ta
<duflu> Ugh, multiple branch dependencies in a system that can't handle single branch dependencies
 * duflu gives up and goes to dinner
<LocutusOfBorg> done! @tsimonq2 please comment if you have write access
<Laney> LocutusOfBorg: ~ubuntu-desktop is an uploading team
<LocutusOfBorg> so Laney he can't unless somebody PPU it for him
<Laney> more or less
<willcooke> Should this bug be fixe released for Bionic now?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1765261
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1765261 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu Bionic) "[regression] Ubuntu 18.04 login screen rejects a valid password on first attempt (if starting with Shift key). Usually works on the second attempt" [High,Fix committed]
<Laney> in proposed
<Laney> (which is Fix Committed in SRU speak)
<willcooke> Laney, ah thanks
<Trevinho> LocutusOfBorg: you should push the bzr tags on the lp: branches for gtk
<LocutusOfBorg> Trevinho, ack!
<Trevinho> LocutusOfBorg: good, I've fixed them while creating the git branches, but better to fix bzr too
<LocutusOfBorg> I think I did it
<LocutusOfBorg> please let me know if I made any mistake
<LocutusOfBorg> (I ran bzr tag and push)
<Laney> going to move Trevinho's branches from https://code.launchpad.net/~canonical-desktop-team/+git to ~ubuntu-desktop, then we can start using them
<Laney> unless anybody wants to tell me not to
<Laney> didrocks: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
<Trevinho> once done that, lp branches should probably be edited to remove the whole content addoing a file that says where code is now?
<Laney> yep
<Laney> sounds like hard work though ._.
<Trevinho> I can script that if you want, then you push it
<Trevinho> no... few lines, you know :)
<Laney> this guy loves shell scripting
<didrocks> Laney: please go ahead :)
<Laney> will do
<Laney> thx!
<didrocks> Laney: wait, I can push it
<Laney> this is a lot of clicking though, I should write an API script for that
<didrocks> Laney: I have some "finalise changelog" commit
<Laney> you can change the owner
<Laney> e.g. on https://code.launchpad.net/~canonical-desktop-team/ubuntu/+source/gnome-calculator/+git/gnome-calculator/+editV
<Laney> https://code.launchpad.net/~canonical-desktop-team/ubuntu/+source/gnome-calculator/+git/gnome-calculator/+edit
 * Laney was going to do that
<didrocks> Laney: ah, I let you do that, I change the remote meanwhile to push latest commits
<Laney> ok
<didrocks> sounds like there are branches where we already have history though there
<Trevinho> ah, also I've to change them to point to ubuntu/master
<Trevinho> didrocks: yeah, some like gdm3 needs to be merged with current ones
<Trevinho> so don't move the ones we 've already
<Trevinho> ye
<Trevinho> t*
<Laney> ye those are for merging
<didrocks> Laney: so, for g-s, I've already pushed it a long time ago, that one doesn't need to be move thus
<didrocks> even if I'm surprised it's been reprocessed with new commits an hour ago by Trevinho, reimporting
<Trevinho> didrocks: it's just an automated script doing that
<didrocks> Trevinho: please exclude the ones we already migrated :p
<Laney> shell? session? screensaver? software?
<didrocks> Laney: Shell
<Laney> thx
<Trevinho> was this btw https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/p/KRxTXHVsdf/
<didrocks> I hope somebody is checking the result makes sense before moving the ownership
<Trevinho> didrocks: and I'm not excluding per se, since for these I'll just merge them with current, so we'll preserve history and that's it.
<Laney> not individually no
<didrocks> Trevinho: remerge gnome shell? why?
<Trevinho> didrocks: gnome-shell no
<didrocks> ok
<Trevinho> didrocks: it was just a for which caused it to be pushed again :)
<didrocks> Laney: ok, you will be responsible if weird debian/control* :p
<Laney> :/
<Laney> Trevinho: done, ones left need merging
<Laney> it would be good if we could get ~ubuntu-desktop emails working
<Laney> so people see MPs coming in
<Laney> they probably get eaten by the mailing list now?
<seb128> they do in the moderation queue
<seb128> do->go
<seb128> I'm  unsure if we want to "spam" the list with them
<Laney> well if the list is dead we could use it now for code review stuff
<seb128> though that now the list has been superseeded by the hub for real human discussions we could
<Laney> I always feel a bit ð when someone pings about a thing and it was proposed to ~ubuntu-desktop some time before
<Laney> so doing that gets my vote
<Laney> If you can whitelist by header, "X-Launchpad-Notification-Type: code-review" would be a good one
<Laney> so we don't get bug spam since people sometimes subscribe the team to bugs
<seb128> right let me see
<Laney> ð
<Laney> which is called "Person Raising Both Hands in Celebration"
<Laney> GNOME is teaching me Semantic Emoji
<seb128> haha
<ricotz> seb128, would you be available to upload a vala package?
<ricotz> what is the preferred version suffix for syncs from debian git?
<ricotz> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ricotz/ubuntu/
<ricotz> based on https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/vala
<xnox> Laney, willcooke, seb128 - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/1779569
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1779569 in ubuntu-meta (Ubuntu) "ð looks odd in thunderbird, chrome/chromium, okish in firefox" [Undecided,New]
<xnox> input appreciated as to, where/how is this to fix. I fear there is "browser engines" in the way
<xnox> works fine in gnome-terminal, gedit, hexchat, etc.
<Laney> It sounds like a duplicate of the listed bug, which is supposedly fixed in thunderbird 60 (not out yet afaics).
<Laney> snapd.service just blocked startup on a VM for 3min 1.756s
<willcooke> night all
<seb128> Laney, sounds like something worth reporting to the snapd team, what other services were blocked?
<tsimonq2> Laney, LocutusOfBorg: Thanks.
<Laney> seb128: GDM didn't come up until it finally came alive
<Laney> will do
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-03
<gf2> Hello. I am just learning about triaging tickets. The ubuntu-bugs team sent me to this IRC channel for my question. I have an older ticket that the reporter says is still a problem.  I found an upstream bug (   https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=202257     ). It is an older bug that has a long history and was re-opened by the gnome team, in May 2017 and is still open. But now I read about the migration from bugzilla.gnome
<gf2> .org to GitLab  that may have happened last month.  Does anyone know if  *ALL* the old tickets have been migrated to the GitLab?  Should I get registered there and submit a new ticket? I searched the GitLab (using ticket number or ticket title) but did not find any matching ticket.
<ubot5> Gnome bug 202257 in Mailer "Configurable folder tree sorting" [Enhancement,Reopened]
<willcooke> morning
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<duflu> Predictably quiet
<jibel> Good morning everyone
<duflu> Morning jibel
<jibel> hi duflu
<Laney> hey
<seb128> hey Laney
<seb128> & willcooke duflu jibel
<duflu> Hi Laney, seb128
<seb128> how is everyone today?
<duflu> So so today seb128. You?
<seb128> oh? what's up?
<seb128> I'm better, getting over that cold
<seb128> though I've been woken up at 6am, the kid decided it was enough sleep and it was time to start playing
<seb128> which is ok, early start means I can go play some tennis after work :)
<duflu> seb128, headache today. But at least like you I managed exercise yesterday
<seb128> how is the weather in your part of the world now?
<seb128> here it's nice and summer-y :)
<Laney> hey seb128 duflu
<Laney> I'm good, just been out watering /o\
<Laney> the bill is going to be big this time
<seb128> seems it's a dry year here as well, I saw that as a title on the frontpage of a newspaper when I stopped for coffee earlier
<duflu> seb128, weekly average probably 7-18 degrees, and 50% sun
<duflu> Some colder and some warmer
<seb128> k, it's definitively better here atm :p (normal, summer is starting ;)
 * Laney wants raiiiiiiinnnnnnn
<willcooke> Laney, I concur.  Keeping the turf alive is getting silly now
 * Laney wilts at willcooke 
<Laney> trying to keep the allotment going is a pain in the bum
<seb128> happyaron, hey, do you know if anyone is working on getting the ibus / pkg-ime-devel@lists.alioth.debian.org situation resolved in Debian?
<seb128> it's a bit stupid what is happening, a good part of the ibus stack has been removed from testing because the alioth email used for the maintainer is now invalid
<seb128> (just got some GNOME people pinging me asking about that)
<Trevinho> hi folks
<Trevinho> Question for mutter in the LTS... So far we're just using debian packages, do we want to create a fork for that for when debian won't be using 3.28 anymore as base? Or should we still work on salsa branch for that?
<Laney> Once we're not syncing we'll need a branch
<seb128> hey Trevinho!
<Trevinho> hi seb128
<seb128> I guess L_aney answered to your question
<didrocks> good afternoon!
<seb128> hey didrocks, where are you? how is travelling going?
<seb128> I forgot to ask when you started your trip yesterday
<seb128> I just know you have a 3h connection in the middle :)
<didrocks> seb128: I'm currently in Madrid
<didrocks> actually, first flight was late
<seb128> ah ok
<seb128> when is the next leg?
<didrocks> 15h45
<didrocks> during the team meeting
<hggdh> hi, it is probable you already know, but... relaying from -bugs:
<hggdh> 11:27 <gf2> Hi Everyone, I asked Carlos Soriano of the Gnome team if the Evolution old bug  tickets were migrated from gnome bugzilla to GitLab last month. Per an email from him, he says that Evolution decided not to move. So, for  Evolution upstream tickets, continue to use the Gnome Bugzilla site.  Please  pass this information on to whoever is appropriate on the bug team, in  case anyone is
<hggdh> wondering about upstream bugs reports for the Evolu
<hggdh> 11:27 <gf2> tion package.
<seb128> hggdh, thanks
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jul  3 13:30:02 2018 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic:
<willcooke> Roll call: andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks (out), duflu (out), jbicha (out?), jamesh (out), jibel/heber, kenvandine, laney,seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<andyrock> o/
<Laney> |o|
<Trevinho> o/
<willcooke> Laney is a tie fighter today
<kenvandine> \o
<seb128> hey
<alexm_> ho
<jibel> o/
<willcooke> I've got didiers report, so we have enough people to start I think
<willcooke> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: andyrock
<andyrock> -Gnome-Shell
<andyrock>  - Keybindings:
<andyrock>    - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/issues/373
<andyrock>    - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/issues/372
<andyrock>  - OSK:
<andyrock>    - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/issues/109
<andyrock>    - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/issues/171
<andyrock>    - Extended key not activated if mouse is never released
<andyrock>  - Gnome-Software:
<andyrock>    - Review https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-software/merge_requests/56
<andyrock> - Sun Sprint! :D
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue 373 in gnome-shell "Some keybindings should discard auto-repeat events" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue 372 in gnome-shell "Keeping Alt+Space pressed shows the window menu and then minimizes the window" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue 109 in gnome-shell "Extended characters in OSK don't get entered" (comments: 16) [Opened]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue 171 in gnome-shell "On screen keyboard closes itself while browsing the language menu" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 56 in gnome-software "gs-shell: Remove app menu" (comments: 2) [Opened]
<andyrock> eow
<willcooke> thanks andyrock!  Busy busy busy
<willcooke> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: didrocks
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: dgadomski
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> looking into some problems in PAM-GDM interaction after migrating setup from Xenial to Bionic, no lp bug for that one yet
<dgadomski> eof
<willcooke> thanks dgadomski
<willcooke> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: didrocks
<willcooke> * .1 work (apport/whoopsie/update-notifier)
<willcooke>   - found a new issue that even if apport was in autosend or never send mode, it still triggers the UI. Fixing involved and update-notifier patch as well as apport.
<willcooke>   - incrementally fixed apport and update-notifier after an issue found by j_ibel (thanks!)
<willcooke>   - upload apport with new UI and behavior in cosmic, update-notifier fixes in both cosmic and -proposed. Next plan is to backport apport fixes in -proposed once we got enough feedback for cosmic + email maintainers.
<willcooke>   - the apport MP still needs to be reviewed upstream: https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/apport/whoopsie-auto-ui/+merge/348479
<willcooke> * Telemetry:
<willcooke>   - discuss latest metrics and review with j_ibel
<willcooke> * Communitheme:
<willcooke>   - have a strategy (package-based) for 18.10
<willcooke>   - propose and discuss merging all sources into a single one: https://community.ubuntu.com/t/merging-repositories-into-a-single-one/6769
<willcooke>   - remove symbolic icons from appmenu: https://github.com/ubuntu/gnome-shell-communitheme/pull/218
<gitlab-bot> ubuntu issue (Pull request) 218 in gnome-shell-communitheme "Don't use symbolic icons for appmenu" (comments: 2) [Closed]
<willcooke>   - continuing following up upstream discussions and giving advice
<willcooke> * GUADEC:
<willcooke>   - outline and prepare slide for "Unity to GNOME Shell" presentation
<willcooke>   - prepare the trip
<willcooke> #topic duflu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: duflu
<willcooke> * Gnome Shell: Great progress this week. Authored and updated:
<willcooke>   - Performance: Implemented hardware presentation timing for Wayland sessions: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/144
<willcooke>   - Performance: Fixed related docs: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/143
<willcooke>   - Performance: Completed tangential fix to unblock other performance branches: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/142
<willcooke>   - Performance: Significantly reduced missed frames and stutter for Xorg: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/145 (and Wayland when combined with 144)
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 144 in mutter "renderer-native: Implement FrameInfo for KMS [performance]" (comments: 2) [Opened]
<willcooke>   - Visual correctness & performance: Zoom and general rendering fix: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/117
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 143 in mutter "Fix docs for cogl_frame_info_get_frame_counter" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<willcooke>   - Unfortunately I am now responsible for a quarter of mutter merge requests and none of them are progressing at the moment. I think because several Gnome people have been and will be traveling for a while.
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 142 in mutter "clutter-text: Avoid clipping the wrong framebuffer" (comments: 5) [Opened]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 145 in mutter "WIP: clutter-stage-cogl: Avoid missed frames & stutter [performance]" (comments: 8) [Opened]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 117 in mutter "clutter: Fix offscreen-effect painting of clones [performance]" (comments: 19) [Opened]
<willcooke> * HELP wanted with some blockages:
<willcooke>   - GJS update awaiting Debian packaging: https://launchpad.net/bugs/1778660
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1778660 in gjs (Ubuntu) "Upgrade gjs to version 1.53.3" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<willcooke>   - (blocked and fixed by the above) Gnome Shell leaks fix: https://launchpad.net/bugs/1672297
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1672297 in gjs (Ubuntu Bionic) "gnome-shell uses lots of memory, and grows over time" [Critical,In progress]
<willcooke>   - [MIR] libsoxr pending desktop team approval: https://launchpad.net/bugs/1702558
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1702558 in libsoxr (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libsoxr" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<willcooke>   - (blocked by the above) PulseAudio 12.0 major upgrade: https://launchpad.net/bugs/1778178
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1778178 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "Upgrade to PulseAudio 12.0" [Wishlist,In progress]
<willcooke>   - BlueZ SRU for bionic awaiting sponsorship: https://launchpad.net/bugs/1759628
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1759628 in Suse " bluez regression: Bluetooth audio fails to reconnect after resume " [Medium,Fix released]
<willcooke> * Daily bug management across gnome-shell, mutter, gdm3, ubuntu-themes, bluez, pulseaudio, dkms, wayland, totem, mpv, libinput.
<willcooke>   - Mostly good steady progress.
<willcooke>   - https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vRDHPxGBHqM6XkT_S8ggtYfD0xchKSUD_z9PopNVE3G1rU05fVSnxDGcDsEstl7gu7N-tzCU6mLUp2V/pubchart?oid=254968654&format=interactive
<willcooke> #topic jbicha
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: jbicha
<willcooke> jbicha, around?
<willcooke> I'll assume not, and move on.  Can come back
<willcooke> #topic jamesh
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: jamesh
<willcooke> snapd/portals:
<willcooke> - On the question of what to do with systems with old
<willcooke> xdg-desktop-portal versions, there seems to be agreement on using an
<willcooke> RPM spec file dependency check on OpenSUSE, so hopefully we can get
<willcooke> the document portal activation branch merged this week.
<willcooke> - There's a new mutter in bionic-proposed now, which fixes portals on
<willcooke> Wayland sessions (thanks Trevinho!)
<willcooke> - Still need to look at back porting
<willcooke> xdg-desktop-portal/xdg-desktop-portal-gtk to xenial.
<willcooke> - While enough is in place for file open/save support, there are
<willcooke> problems with some of the other portals that I documented here:
<willcooke> https://github.com/flatpak/xdg-desktop-portal/issues/196 -- I hope to
<gitlab-bot> flatpak issue 196 in xdg-desktop-portal "Improve snap package support " (comments: 0) [Open]
<willcooke> discuss further with the portal developers at GUADEC
<willcooke> snapd/snap-uri-handler:
<willcooke> - I got a review from Gustavo on this, so I don't forsee much hold up
<willcooke> from the snapd team.
<willcooke> - We still need to finalise the package name for the gnome-software
<willcooke> snap and get it published to the stable channel before merging this
<willcooke> change.
<willcooke> - There is also the open issue that a host system provided
<willcooke> gnome-software can claim to support snap:// URIs even when the plugin
<willcooke> is not present:
<willcooke> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-software/issues/405 -- this could
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue 405 in gnome-software "gnome-software's desktop file advertises support for URI schemes it may not be able to handle" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<willcooke> lead to uncertain behaviour on some non-Ubuntu distros
<willcooke> - A Fedora dev also requested that we instead try to install the
<willcooke> plugin for the host system gnome-software.  That's going to be a
<willcooke> policy decision though.
<willcooke> snapd/other:
<willcooke> - Based on review comments for other proposals, I made a branch fixing
<willcooke> similar issues in other tests I'd written:
<willcooke> https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/5413 -- unfortunately this
<gitlab-bot> snapcore issue (Pull request) 5413 in snapd "tests: purge packages installed by accounts, calendar, and contacts interface tests" (comments: 5) [Open]
<willcooke> seems to trigger problems on Arch.  The remaining issues are really in
<willcooke> the snapd test infrastructure and don't directly benefit desktop
<willcooke> tasks, so I'm not sure how much effort is worth spending on it.
<willcooke> #topic jibel / heber
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: jibel / heber
<jibel> - SRU verification of gnome-control-center and update-notifier in Bionic.
<jibel> - Finished work on the dashboard
<jibel> - Verification of grub and efi fixes in cosmic and validation of the image.
<jibel> - Fixing automated desktop ISO tests that broke after image builds have been fixed.
<jibel> - Adding jenkins jobs for snap bluez tests on desktop
<jibel> done
<willcooke> thanks jibel
<willcooke> #topic kenvandine
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: kenvandine
<willcooke> kenvandine, around still?
<kenvandine> * More progress on the snap-only branch of gnome-software, just need to nail down the branding/rename.
<kenvandine> * Fixed desktop helpers crash when using LD_PRELOAD of bindtextdomain in a classic snap
<kenvandine> * Updated gnome-contacts snap to use strict confinement, still waiting for snapd with the required interfaces land.
<kenvandine> * Preparing for GUADEC, leaving today
<kenvandine> â¾
<willcooke> thanks kenvandine
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: Laney
<Laney> second
<Laney> tomboy is crashing when I paste an emoji
<willcooke> heh
<Laney> ok
<Laney> â¢ ð ð
<Laney> â¢ Been submitting MRs to gnome for systemd stuff, got some initial reviews https://wiki.gnome.org/Initiatives/SystemdUser
<Laney> â¢ Helped T_revinho with his git stuff, moved the branches to ~ubuntu-desktop, need to look at the ones to merge
<Laney> â¢ Wrote a MP for gnome-shell to expose versioned directories for "stylesheetName" themes https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/133
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 133 in gnome-shell "theme: Search in versioned directories" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<Laney> â¢ Backported libsoup2.4 CVE fix to Debian & cosmic
<Laney> â¢ Updated gjs in Debian, just about to sync
<Laney> â¢ I promised to look again at https://trello.com/c/x71lwFJG/138-track-rls-bug-numbers a week after filing, no movement
<Laney> â¢ no rls bugs
<Laney> ð½
<willcooke> top emoji work there. 10/10
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> â¢ travelled back from the sun-sprint and some post sprint catching up
<seb128> â¢ uploaded the oem fix for https://launchpad.net/bugs/1683445 to cosmic and bionic (xenial coming next)
<seb128> â¢ cleaned up the sponsoring queue a bit
<seb128> â¢ reviewed the work/plans for .1 and cosmic, we are having a slow start on the new cycle work due to the focus on .1 (which was not unexpected, but we should start transitionning now)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1683445 in OEM Priority Project "E6430 brightness control not working" [Critical,Confirmed]
<seb128> â¢ reviewed the changes Didier has been making on the apport stack, good work Didier!
<seb128> â¢ reverted some libayatana use to unblock transitions in cosmic since that library is not MIRed yet
<seb128> â¢ debugged n-m-applet failing to build in cosmic, it's due to the n-m changes to drop some of the old libs, looking at resolving that next
<seb128> </week>
<seb128> Laney, sorry that the trello board card didn't move Laney
<seb128> it feels like we are not keeping up with work atm, summer is tough :/
<seb128> (also I'm travelling on thursday for GUADEC)
<seb128> that's it from me :p
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Let generated PPD files contain all needed info about the stacking order (face-up/face-down) of the output trays to print in the correct order (first to last or last to first). Made sure that output order option settings are followed.
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Started on looking into pdftopdf not doing anything (like copies) twice when called both on a client and on a server (remote CUPS queue showing as IPP printers).
<tkamppeter> - CUPS: Reported PPD generator changes of cups-filters as feature request to CUPS.
<tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2018: Mentoring of the students on Common Print Dialog Backends and printer auto-selection by job.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<willcooke> thanks tkamppeter
<willcooke> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: Trevinho
<Trevinho> Â· Some mutter and compiz upstream reviews
<Trevinho> Â· Refactored, improved and pushed some fixes on mutter and g-s causing crashes
<Trevinho>   - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/81
<Trevinho>   - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/84
<Trevinho>   - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/82
<Trevinho> Â· Pushed some refactories to g-s and mutter
<Trevinho>   - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/3
<Trevinho>   - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/147
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 81 in mutter "Move MetaOutput::crtc field into private struct and add ref-chain" (comments: 1) [Merged]
<Trevinho> Â· Created a script for generating git (gbp) repositories for ubuntu desktop packages,
<Trevinho>   and pushing them to launchpad (thanks Laney for imports, didrocks for documenting the process)
<Trevinho>   - https://git.launchpad.net/~canonical-desktop-team/+git/ubuntu-desktop-gbp-importer?h=master
<Trevinho>   - https://community.ubuntu.com/t/desktop-deb-packages-migration-to-git/5746/8?u=3v1n0
<Trevinho>   - https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+git
<Trevinho> Â· Telegram snap:
<Trevinho>   - fixed upstream bug causing build issues
<Trevinho>   - updated my PR for upstreaming it:
<Trevinho>     + https://github.com/telegramdesktop/tdesktop/pull/4505
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 84 in mutter "window: Return -1 if meta_window_get_monitor is called on an unmanaged window" (comments: 1) [Merged]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 82 in gnome-shell "Support unmanaged windows monitor index (negative)" (comments: 6) [Merged]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 3 in gnome-shell "st-icon: Create shadow pipeline at paint time" (comments: 11) [Merged]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 147 in mutter "Tests: fix make run-tests when builddir != srcdir" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<gitlab-bot> telegramdesktop issue (Pull request) 4505 in tdesktop "Snap packaging support" (comments: 10) [Open]
<Laney> pushed fixes causing crashes?!?!?!?!?
<Laney> job security
<Trevinho> aaha, yeah... you know xD
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho
<Trevinho> Ah... Made some pizza xD
<willcooke> Ken do you have a report from RObert?
<willcooke> kenvandine, ^
<kenvandine> no...
<seb128> :-(
<Laney> tsk
<willcooke> He's normally good, maybe travelling already?
<willcooke> #topic rls-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: rls-bugs
<kenvandine> maybe
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glib2.0/+bug/1773334
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1773334 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu 18.04 mounted network shares not appearing under devices in file manager" [High,Triaged]
<willcooke> Is this the one we keep skipping?
<Laney> don't think so, it was only tagged recently
<Laney> I would say notfixing and we get it by the stable update in due course though
<seb128> +1
<willcooke> done
<willcooke> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-release-upgrader/+bug/1778817
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1778817 in ubuntu-release-upgrader (Ubuntu Bionic) "release upgrade from xenial to bionic desktop: screen locks itself, password to unlock fails" [Critical,Triaged]
<willcooke> We need to fix that one, who can we assign?
<seb128> I looked at that earlier, I'm not convinced it's a confirmed issue
<seb128> also I don't why it targets bionic
<seb128> if the issue is xenial updates the fix should be able xenial?
<seb128> able->about
<willcooke> heh good point
<willcooke> jibel, could you look at recreating it as a first step?
<seb128> +1 for that
<jibel> willcooke, I tried, I could unlock every time. I think it's a timing issue
<jibel> I'll try again
<willcooke> kk, thanks
<Laney> This is also why every sensible screensaver spawns a fresh helper process to handle the authentication through PAM. compiz (unity), apparently, does not.
<Laney> that is the most slangasekish line ever
<seb128> lol
<Laney> jibel: I think the point is that it's supposed to not lock
<jibel> Laney, yes and it locks
<Laney> so you reproduced it...
<jibel> the lock part not the fail to unlock part
<Laney> don't think that matters if the point is the first half
<willcooke> I would have thought the screen locking was desirable.  If you start and upgrade and go off for lunch, you would expect the machine to lock
<willcooke> anyway, jibel if you can comment on the bug thats a good starting point
<willcooke> next
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1779051
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1779051 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu Bionic) "/usr/bin/gnome-control-center:11:gtk_container_remove:update_output_settings:on_amplify_changed:g_closure_invoke:signal_emit_unlocked_R" [Medium,Triaged]
<Laney> no, because you are doing open heart surgery on the system while it is conscious and it can forget how to unlock itself quite easily
<Laney> that is what happens in that bug
<willcooke> fair
<willcooke> kk
<Trevinho> Yeah, I think it's not a policy problem, more a bug that what the policy says it's not respected
<Trevinho> Unity checks on pam only, not sure what happens
<Trevinho> another option would be setting the gnome lockdown options in gsettings to force it
<Trevinho> but, not the nicest way
<seb128> let's not discuss the bugs details in the meeting
<willcooke> jibel is going to take another look
<Laney> The point of my comments was about who should get assigned.
<Trevinho> willcooke: 1779051 seems that is already addressed, no?
 * Laney shrugs
<Trevinho> https://git.launchpad.net/~canonical-desktop-team/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/commit/?id=924f74683e778dc967377811e414df3106015919
<seb128> Trevinho, not SRUed to bionic yet
<willcooke> Trevinho, yeah looks like it, although I think it needs SRUing
<Trevinho> ah, ok... yep, agree
<willcooke> I'll assign it to Robert
<seb128> I don't know what to do with those
<seb128> I would assign to Robert
<willcooke> done
<seb128> but he's going to do his usually disagreeing about being assigned or ignore it/unassign himself at some point
<seb128> but oh well
<seb128> we can have another disucssion when that happens
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1714989
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1714989 in gjs (Ubuntu) "gnome-shell crashed with SIGSEGV in g_type_check_instance_cast() from st_label_set_text() from ffi_call_unix64()" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> that has been fixed/SRUed
<seb128> unsure why it's on the list
<Laney> it's fix committed
<Laney> but has a New gjs task
<Laney> that might be in need of closing
<willcooke> Trevinho, that one is with you please ^
<Trevinho> soo.. the gjs task would be nice to fix, at least for C
<Trevinho> but not strictly needed for that crash now
<Trevinho> might be needed for others though
<seb128> so let's invalid on this bug
<Trevinho> So, shell side we're all set
<seb128> it's difficult enough to read like that
<Trevinho> I mean, invalid for bionic maybe
<Trevinho> not for C
<seb128> right
<seb128> please do that
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho
<willcooke> k, I think that's the end of the list
<willcooke> seb128, Laney - did I miss any?
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock/+bug/1730765
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1730765 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu) "Mounted external devices do not appear in dock" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<Laney> for c
<willcooke> at this point, I dont think we have time.  I'm ok to bump it.  I would like some other changes to the dock too, so I think bundle them up for next cycle
<Laney> go for it
<willcooke> done
<Laney> EOL
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2018-07-03 | Current topic: AOB
<willcooke> Please could someone write a summary of sun sprint for me?  With pictures.
<willcooke> No rush, but would be a good blog post
<Trevinho> oh... ok :)
<willcooke> :) thanks Trevinho
<seb128> served with a tequilla next to the pool? ;)
<seb128> lol
<willcooke> Any other business?
<Trevinho> Laney: want to make your blog cool? :-D
<Laney> ok, I'll copy and paste your text in there :-)
<willcooke> Didnt someone want to talk about Nautilus?
<Laney> we should probably talk about gnome updates at some point
<seb128> there was some community hub discussions about it where Didier pointed people here
<Laney> like if other people need to pick those up more
<seb128> is that what you refering to?
<willcooke> seb128, yeah.  Oh, I think you replied there already.  But anyway, I dont think we should move until the "desktop" feature appears elsewhere
<seb128> right
<willcooke> Laney, can you talk about GNOME updates in person at GUADEC and then we can discuss in the meeting next time?
<seb128> we are a bit under the water atm
<seb128> we also said we would enable tracker this cycle
<seb128> but that doesn't look on the path to happen
<seb128> we should probably have included that as a feature in the planning
<Laney> you think that's a lot of work?
<seb128> we are already behind on features we signed for and that's not account work for the desktop feature, or GNOME updates, or tracker
<seb128> not especially, but it needs someone to step up to push that forward
<Trevinho> Ah.. .one thing we said at sun sprint... To ask upstream to take maintenance of the gnome-3-28 branches when they don't care anymore... So we can do SRUs and keep them updated too
<Trevinho> as they won't care anymore at some point, while we'll still do
<seb128> like the tracker MIR is blocked on someone to report about the crash reports situation
<seb128> Trevinho, that sounds like a good topic for GUADEC
<Trevinho> yep
<Trevinho> not sure how to get this exposed to all the upstreams we care though xD
<seb128> well, we can at least speak to a key ones
<seb128> I don't expect us to do much on most components
<Trevinho> Yeah, for sure nautilus, mutter+shell, gnome-software
<seb128> gnome-shell stack and gnome-control-center/nautilus mostly
<seb128> + gnome-software yes
<Trevinho> ah and g-c-c yep
<willcooke> anything more that needs the meeting for?
<willcooke> erm
<willcooke> English fail
<willcooke> Anything more to talk about in the meeting?
<seb128> that should be enough for this week imho
<willcooke> yeah same
<willcooke> carry on after if needed
<seb128> +1
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jul  3 14:14:54 2018 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2018/ubuntu-desktop.2018-07-03-13.30.moin.txt
<willcooke> thanks all
<seb128> thanks!
<seb128> Laney, willcooke, jibel, I commented on bug #1778817, the gnome-session-inhibit command works on xenial, to me it looks like the issue is on the foundations/u-r-u side
<ubot5> bug 1778817 in ubuntu-release-upgrader (Ubuntu Bionic) "release upgrade from xenial to bionic desktop: screen locks itself, password to unlock fails" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1778817
<seb128> I don't know how that one works, could be another ubiquity like "wrong env" issue
<seb128> like not managging to talk to the correct session because the uid, dbus env or something is not right
<Laney> thx
<Laney> I don't think there's a compiz task there anyway is there?
<Laney> unless we are really going to fix that thing Steve pointed out
<Laney> seems unlikely to me
<seb128> right
<seb128> I was looking at it from the perspective of "is gnome-session-inhibit not working"
<seb128> in which case it would be our issue
<Laney> k
<abeato> cyphermox, hey, is https://salsa.debian.org/cyphermox-guest/modemmanager.git the official ubuntu repo for MM?
<cyphermox> abeato: I don't know, I haven't touched ModemManager or NetworkManager in quite a while
<cyphermox> I suggest you ask jbicha if there's code anywhere else, but that repo is for debian
<jbicha> I don't have any other code for MM
<abeato> cyphermox, jbicha understood, thanks. what I wnated to know is if there was an equivalent of git+ssh://git.launchpad.net/network-manager for MM, and it looks like no
<Laney> abeato: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager looks good
<Laney> ermmm
<Laney> https://git.launchpad.net/network-manager/log/?h=cosmic
<Laney> no tag, but nearly there :-)
<abeato> Laney, thanks, was thinking about MM here, nothing in https://code.launchpad.net/modemmanager/+git
<Laney> ah, sorry, my brain didn't read that right!
<abeato> :)
<Laney> I would look at repos in the form of https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/modemmanager/+git
<Laney> looks like git-ubuntu ones
<Laney> you could try if you wanted some fun
<abeato> ah, yeah, that url contains some repos
<abeato> (well, branches)
<Laney> I don't think git-ubuntu's branches share objects with upstream git repos though; more of a reconstruction of what's been in Ubuntu (AIUI)
<Laney> but depending on what you want, might be OK
<abeato> I think they are useful as a base for a snap
<tsimonq2> Is the server-side code for ubuntu-report anywhere?
<tsimonq2> Lubuntu's going to use Calamares with 18.10 and we'll have some different install options to go along with that. Depending how flexible things are, we'll either need to special-case upstream or fork.
<tsimonq2> Kubuntu could use Calamares soon as well.
<willcooke> tsimonq2, not that I know of, but I don't think it's a secret.  However, why not all use the same backend?
<willcooke> i.e. why do you feel that lubuntu needs to use it's own database?
<willcooke> Is your thinking that the current backend might not be able to accept the data you want to throw at it?
<tsimonq2> willcooke: Correct.
<willcooke> got ya
<willcooke> I know it's running postgres with the JSON "thingy" so that it, as I understand it, just stores the JSON blob as is
<willcooke> and then you can use the JSON query interface to pull data out again
<willcooke> jibel knows the most about this right now
<willcooke> but he's EOD
<tsimonq2> Ah, OK.
<tsimonq2> Do you know his UTC offhand?
<willcooke> tsimonq2, would you drop me an email and we can follow up there?
<tsimonq2> s/offhand/offset/
<willcooke> tsimonq2, -1
<tsimonq2> willcooke: Sure.
<willcooke> +1
<willcooke> oh, except its summer time, so probably +2
<willcooke> tsimonq2, I'd love to be able to all contribute to the same database, so very keen for us to try and accommodate you there first if we can
<willcooke> plus one less database to admin :)
<tsimonq2> willcooke: Right, and I wanted to make sure things were flexible here. :)
<tsimonq2> We do share some common installer options, but Calamares adds some.
<willcooke> if you have some specific metrics that you'd like to get at, we can look at extending ubuntu-report too, add a special run mode or whatever
<tsimonq2> Yeah, some specific metrics would be good. I'll be happy to contribute code upstream though.
<willcooke> woot
<tsimonq2> willcooke: Hm, you don't seem to have a public LP email. What can I use?
<willcooke> so yeah, if you dont mind, drop me an email and I'll get the right people on the thread
<willcooke> or
<willcooke> actually
<willcooke> Community Hub might be better
<tsimonq2> Sure.
<tsimonq2> One thing though; I'm not exactly sure *what* we'd like to extend it to yet (there's some details I still need to work out) but I know that things will need to be extended in the future.
<tsimonq2> So would you like to have a discussion about extending things now, or wait until I'm absolutely sure I know what I'm looking at?
<willcooke> tsimonq2, I dont think there's any harm in us having a theoretical "How can we add more metrics / flexibility" to ubuntu-report and the backend / frontend reporting interface
<willcooke> conversation
<willcooke> now
<willcooke> then we can solve that, and get in to the specifics later
<willcooke> if that works for you
<willcooke> In other news, all the players in the world cup should be utterly ashamed of themselves for cheating all the time.
 * willcooke is getting angry watching this match 
<tsimonq2> willcooke: Sure.
<tsimonq2> hehe
<tsimonq2> willcooke: https://community.ubuntu.com/t/extending-ubuntu-report/6851
<willcooke> penalty!
<popey> :)
<tsimonq2> Â¯\_(ã)_/Â¯
<willcooke> thanks tsimonq2, will ask jibel and didrocks to reply tomorrow
<tsimonq2> Thanks willcooke.
<willcooke> get in!
<willcooke> night
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-04
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, hi, you can find a tarball for thunderbird 52.9.0 here https://launchpad.net/%7Emozillateam/+archive/ubuntu/ppa/+packages
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<jibel> hi seb128
<seb128> lut jibel
<seb128> jibel, thanks for the testing on bug #1778817
<ubot5> bug 1778817 in ubuntu-release-upgrader (Ubuntu Bionic) "release upgrade from xenial to bionic desktop: screen locks itself, password to unlock fails" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1778817
<duflu> Morning seb128, jibel. Anyone feel the need for a BT meeting?
<seb128> duflu, hey, I don't, I'm currently looking at your bionic SRU but that's the only bluetooth thing I've been dealing with recently. do you?
<duflu> seb128, no, nothing. I guess you could count the PulseAudio12 update too
<duflu> Almost nothing
<seb128> I need to look at that MIR
<seb128> it's on my todo as well :)
<duflu> I could drop the prereq but it's been requested since last year
<seb128> let's skip the bluetooth hangout then, willcooke is having computer issues apparently so he's not around
<seb128> seems like we don't like full disks
<seb128> duflu, the update can stay in proposed for a bit while the MIR is sorted out, let's try to move forward and get the issue resolved rather than workaround around
<jibel> Hi duflu , I've nothing for the meeting.
<jibel> seb128, I'm trying to reproduce the 1st part of the bug now.
<seb128> k
<duflu> Hmm, mutter's timing is still terrible. Even complex animations render in under 3ms and I can't get it to run faster than 43 FPS
<Laney> moin
<duflu> Morning Laney
<willcooke> BOOOOOOOOOOOM
<willcooke> Fixed
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<willcooke> afternoon duflu
<seb128> hey Laney willcooke
<willcooke> We need to look in to how we can make things less bad when you run out of disk space
<seb128> willcooke, rm ~/Videos/somepornmovies? ;)
<willcooke> I won't delete my porn for anyone
<willcooke> So, fun story
<willcooke> I had a Raspberry Pi which was running some house services stop working yesterday
<willcooke> Couldnt get the thing to boot at all, so I took the SD card out and tried to mount it here
<willcooke> The thing was screwed
<willcooke> I used disktest to recover some files which was very slow, so after the football finished I just left it running over night
<willcooke> This was an 8GB SD Card
<willcooke> testdisk must have got in to some strange loop
<willcooke> the recovered folder (after I delete a 14GB postfix spool file) is......
<willcooke> (still counting)
<alexarnaud> Morning willcooke seb128 andyrock jbicha Trevinho duflu and all
<willcooke> ((I think there must be some horrible recursive directory in itself thing going on)
<willcooke> )
<willcooke> 26 GB
<willcooke> so 40GB of files on an 8GB SD card
<willcooke> ?!
<willcooke> anyway, left it running over night, came down this morning, couldn't unlock my machine
<willcooke> couldnt switch to a different vt
<duflu> A couple of users report their disks get filled with gigabytes of gnome-shell logging. I can't reproduce it myself
<willcooke> could get it to boot in to single user mode
<willcooke> and it wouldn't boot normally, lots of errors about things not starting
<willcooke> as you might expect
<willcooke> so I had to boot of a USB stick in to live mode and delete a few files,
<willcooke> then everything came back to life
<willcooke> It's totally my fault that the disk filled up
<willcooke> but I think we need to try and make it more tolerant to such situations
<willcooke> for the list next cycle.
<willcooke> THE END
<willcooke> didrocks, you missed my exciting story
<jibel> is anyone else seeing a snapd timeout on boot of bionic ?
<didrocks> willcooke: the one you started on telegram about full disk?
<jibel> didrocks, hi, I'm reviewing the sru of ubuntu-report. Where is the report stored again?
<willcooke> jibel, yes, but I put that down to disk being full.  Seems ok now
<willcooke> didrocks, yeah
<seb128> I didn't for snapd
<jibel> willcooke, I'm seeing it on a fresh installation
<willcooke> jibel, yeah seems to be working ok now
<seb128> lut didrocks
<willcooke> jibel, I'll fire up a VM
<willcooke> jibel, in fact, I will install my other laptop with the iso I just downloaded
<seb128> willcooke, disk full handling was something we worked on the past, but another of those topics were we don't have regular testing and that we regressed of the cycles
<duflu> willcooke, don't need to fix everything, but making the machine boot and the GUI not freeze would itself be a significant challenge. People write new code that isn't tolerant of it all the time. Even writing a log message to the disk could hang everything if done wrong
<willcooke> duflu, yeah I expect fixing everything would be impossible, but we should be able to make it better.  Not being able to get to a shell if your disk is full SUCKS
<duflu> Yeah, people report all sorts of failures (in bug reports) when it happens to them
<willcooke> I'm sure we used to do something which would stop you being able to fill your disk more than 95%
<didrocks> salut seb128
<Laney> willcooke: you're probably thinking of the ext4 reserved block count
<Laney> root can write to that though
<Laney> moin didrocks
<didrocks> hey Laney
<jibel> willcooke, by default there is 5% of  the blocks reserved for privileged processes
<jibel> tune2fs -l <dev> will tell you how much on your system
<seb128> willcooke, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BootLoginWithFullFilesystem
<seb128> is what we did in the past
<seb128> so I think it's one of those polish feature that would be nice to work on
<seb128> we need to debug what components are having issues
<Laney> yeh, that would be a nice task to do
<willcooke> ah yeah, this process had to run as root
<willcooke> I've added it to the list for next cycle anyway
<seb128> good
<seb128> like that spec ^ mentions
<seb128> At boot time, check whether /tmp has at least 1Mby free. (This should be done after filesystems are mounted and after /tmp has been cleaned.)
<seb128> If not, mount a 1Mby tmpfs over /tmp.
<seb128> I bet we lost some of those things over time
<willcooke> jibel, just booted a newly installed machine, snapd seems to be running ok
<seb128> changing to systemd etc
<Laney> that's going to touch foundations areas too
<seb128> likely
<Laney> which is a gentle way of me suggesting it for brussels :-)
<seb128> willcooke, the fact that you said you couldn't get to grub sounds weird though
<seb128> Laney, yeah, that's probably the right venue to discuss topics for next cycle
<willcooke> I looked at the Brussels spreadsheet yesterday to see if I could add sessions, but not yet it seems.  Laney, if I forget can you try and remember?
<seb128> willcook_e said he's putting it on the list
<willcooke> I put it on the product roadmap list
<seb128> willcooke, just put a google calendar reminder?
<seb128> like for before Brussel with "add fulldisk boot to the agenda"
<seb128> computers are good at those reminders :p
<jibel> willcooke, and it booted reasonably fast?
<willcooke> seb128, done
<willcooke> jibel, yeah, seems fine
<willcooke> jibel, I'll upgrade everything and try again
<seb128> willcooke, :)
<willcooke> didrocks, jibel - can you take a look at this post and see if we can help lubuntu & kubuntu with using ubuntu-report? https://community.ubuntu.com/t/extending-ubuntu-report/6851
<willcooke> seb128, fyi ^
<jibel> willcooke, which image did you use?
<jibel> daily or release?
<willcooke> jibel, release
 * willcooke downloads daily
<jibel> willcooke, I had this issue with the daily image
<didrocks> willcooke: I'm in the board meeting, is it something to be done today?
<seb128> willcooke, I saw that discussion yesterday evening, thanks for the ping though :)
<willcooke> jibel, will try again.  Yesterday Mark Murphy pinged to stay he couldnt get networking in a vm on the daily image too, but said he would try some stuff and report back, but didnt
<willcooke> didrocks, whenever you get time
<willcooke> I dont think there is an immediate rush
<didrocks> sure
<willcooke> jibel, this one?  http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xenial/daily-live/current/xenial-desktop-amd64.iso
<willcooke> didrocks, merci
<duflu> jibel, are the daily images installing yet? Last I tested 20180627 which was "current" it would crash on both systems I tried
<duflu> (a long way into installation)
<seb128> duflu, bionic or cosmic?
<duflu> seb128, cosmic daily
<seb128> duflu, they are talking about bionic there
<duflu> ok
<jibel> duflu, yes
<seb128> but cosmic should work
<seb128> do you have a report of the problem you hit?
<duflu> seb128, no, it was late at night and I had too many things to deal with
<jibel> seb128, it was a problem with missing efi files
<seb128> k, no worry
<seb128> seems like it's known anyway from what jibel just said
<jibel> then grub failing to remove some files
<duflu> That was a different bug with efi. I'm talking about a new issue after the fix
<seb128> jibel, "was" so it's fixed now?
<seb128> ah
<duflu> Nevermind. When I get time I'll try fresher images
<jibel> duflu, there was a dependency issue with grub that the installation fail. It's fixed now but if there is anything else please file a report and i'll have a look
<willcooke> <seb128> willcooke, the fact that you said you couldn't get to grub sounds weird though
<willcooke> I think that is probably because my laptop starting thinking the shift key was stuck and ignored it
<willcooke> but I couldnt fix it by powering off and back on
<willcooke> I'd still say it's a laptop issue rather than a software issue.  I'll play around when I get time
<seb128> k, that would make sense
<seb128> it's likely that the ENOSPACE issue start with gdm/login manager
<seb128> as that was the case in the gutsi time when we first looked at it
<seb128> probably similar reason, some auth file that needs to be written on disk and can't
<ricotz> hey desktopers
<seb128> hey ricotz
<ricotz> there seems to be some delay regarding libreoffice updates
<willcooke> gah. stupid idiot.  I downloaded the xenial image.
<ricotz> is there a need for a prepared libreoffice 6.0.5 package?
<ricotz> see https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ubuntu/ppa/+packages
<seb128> ricotz, right, our maintainer is on paternity leave and we don't have enough resources to have backup maintainers :/ I guess any help on getting the updates ready will make the work easier once he's back
<ricotz> seb128, so you want to wait for him to come back before pushing an update?
<seb128> "want" is a bit strong
<ricotz> I have pushed the relevant changes to the packaging branches so it is there to be picked up
<seb128> I don't think we have a choice
<ricotz> ok
<seb128> ricotz, I just looked at our calendar, Olivier is supposed to be back tomorrow
<ricotz> (libreoffice 6.1 rc will be available this week which is the target series for cosmic)
<seb128> so not long to wait
<ricotz> ah good then
<seb128> then I guess he's going to have some backlog so unsure what his priorities are, but I guess getting libreoffice updated is going to be on his list
<ricotz> alrighty
<willcooke> woo.  Hard lock up
<willcooke> (while still scanning that SD card)
<willcooke> jamesh, ace job on the snap themes howto
<jamesh> willcooke: hopefully we can cut down on the boilerplate once templates are a thing
<jamesh> willcooke: is the screenshot I added to the blog draft okay?  It's hard to do something that doesn't just look like a file chooser
<willcooke> jamesh, where am I looking?
<jamesh> willcooke: the "Support for XDG Desktop Portals" section
<jamesh> the 18.04.1 blog draft
<willcooke> ah, got ya. yeah, that'll do nicely, thanks
<willcooke> oh, jibel I forgot - installed daily and it seems fine.  What should I be looking for?
<jibel> willcooke, is there any timeout for snapd in the journal?
<jibel> willcooke, is it with bionic daily?
<jibel> willcooke, this is the image I tried http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/bionic/daily-live/pending/
<willcooke> jibel, http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/bionic/daily-live/current/bionic-desktop-amd64.iso
<willcooke> will retry with pending
<jibel> willcooke, it shouldn't make any difference.
<jibel> willcooke, I'll have a look on my system
<willcooke> I see snapd starting
<willcooke> no obvious problems
<willcooke> jibel, you want this log somewhere?
<jibel> willcooke, yes please to compare with my boot. journalctl -b -o short-monotonic in a pastebin will be fine
<willcooke> jibel, https://pastebin.com/eK0bDcsR
<jibel> willcooke, thanks
<jibel> seb128, no way to reproduce the screen lock during upgrade issue with 16.04 to 18.04. I tried with the garphical and text upgrader with a user or root and the screen lock is always inhibited. I'm wondering if I experienced it with 17.10 instead. I'll try that to confirm
<Laney> nothing like a good tidy up rebase session
<Laney> rearranged the stuff so there's all mergable things and then one small switchover commit
 * Laney proposed
<Laney> s
<seb128> jibel, thanks for testing
<seb128> do we have people around who are still on bionic and have livepatch enabled? do you see sometime notifications about livepatch updates?
<willcooke> o/
<willcooke> and no
<Laney> I just enabled it
<Laney> and it did Jul 04 15:09:00 nightingale canonical-livepatch[12007]: Applied patch version 40.7 to 4.15.0-23.25-generic
<Laney> but I didn't get a notification, should I have?
<Laney> oops I forgot to eat lunch, back soon
<seb128> andyrock, ^
<seb128> bug #1780093
<ubot5> bug 1780093 in update-notifier (Ubuntu) "Livepatch notifier didn't trigger when a livepatch was applied" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1780093
<seb128> Laney, oh, and thanks for testing and enjoy your lunch :)
<Laney> was a good lunch
<Laney> oh MY
<Laney> I just learned about edit-and-execute-command
<Laney> type a command and then hit ctrl-x ctrl-e in bash
<Laney> probably one of those things that everyone knows about apart from me :-)
<Laney> that and 'fc'
<willcooke> oooooh
<willcooke> nice
<willcooke> Laney, your snapd blocking issue could be related to waiting for entropy
<willcooke> m_vo is on the case, natch
<Laney> o rly
<Laney> seb128: did you want to try merging the latest gvfs upload(s) into git?
<Laney> only noticed because it broke my hint :-)
<Laney> been trying to push things through proposed on the side today
<Laney> k, everything systemd --user is merge proposed now
<Laney> early start for the train tomorrow, so o/
<Laney> will try to be online from it
<seb128> Laney, yeah, I noticed after doing the changes, but I wanted to get that SRU out today
<seb128> I plan to read the git documentation from Didier while travelling tomorrow
<seb128> then I can have a look to put that new knowledge in use
<seb128> but feel free to merge that one for me if you need to pile up other changes, I'm sure I can find another one to do :)
<seb128> Laney, well done, enjoy your evening and safe travel tomorrow
 * seb128 has a plane at 7:45, going to be an early start so I'm going to wrap now as well
<willcooke> night all, safe travels tomorrow
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-05
<Laney> morning
<Laney> not on proper train wifi so probs not going to last for long
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers!
<didrocks> good morning
<kenvandine> ditto
<kenvandine> :)
<Laney> wb oSoMoN!!!!!
<oSoMoN> thanks
<Laney> how's it all going?
<Laney> hey didrocks kenvandine
<Laney> did you find somewhere to work from?
<oSoMoN> didrocks, kenvandine, Laney : are you all in AlmerÃ­a yet?
<kenvandine> oSoMoN!
<kenvandine> didrocks, Trevinho and I are in almeria
<Laney> I'm on the train
<Laney> in UK
<Laney> somewhere near Loughborough
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, did you see the email about fcitx in snaps?
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, sorry to jump right to work :)
<Laney> try pronouncing that one if you're american :-)
<kenvandine> Laney, lol, not even going to try
<kenvandine> hey willcooke
<willcooke> morning kenvandine!
<willcooke> Sleepy much?
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, yeah I saw the e-mail, there's a trello card so I'll add a reminder to it
<oSoMoN> https://trello.com/c/KSLXgc5E/70-add-fcitx-support-to-desktop-snaps
<oSoMoN> good morning willcooke
<willcooke> Morning oSoMoN, how's life papa?
<willcooke> welcome back!
<kenvandine> willcooke, bright eyed!
<didrocks> hey Laney, welcome back oSoMoN!
<oSoMoN> willcooke, life's good and busy :)
<oSoMoN> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> willcooke: well, the changes they are making needs to be communicated so that the web team knows :)
<didrocks> willcooke: I guess you are going to liase with them?
<Laney> wish this train had curtains
 * Laney squints
<Laney> especially as I'm trying to do indentation fixes :P
<willcooke> Can GNOME Shell be made to do 1/4 screen window tiling?
<willcooke> Google says the numpad can do it, but it doesnt wor
<willcooke> k
<willcooke> could be a wayland thing
<Laney> It's planned, but as far as I know not actually in yet
<willcooke> ack, thx Laney
<Laney> they call it "quarter tiling"
<willcooke> makes sense
<willcooke> This suggests it was being worked on 2 years ago: https://www.reddit.com/r/gnome/comments/40ba3i/gnome_320_quarter_tiling_is_here_o/
<willcooke> but then this suggests its not in yet
<willcooke> https://plus.google.com/+WorldofGnomeOrg/posts/VKBdZcp54QE
<willcooke> meh
<willcooke> something to ask about at GUADEC
<youpi> Trevinho, andyrock: hello, are there news about the compiz merge requests?
<jibel> willcooke, bug 1779961 is probably the cause of the slow boot I was seeing yesterday with bionic
<ubot5> bug 1779827 in linux (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1779961 failure to boot with linux-image-4.15.0-24-generic" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1779827
<willcooke> jibel, ah ha!  cc Laney ^
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<willcooke> hey seb128!  Catching up on emai today? :)
<willcooke> how was your journey
<Laney> willcooke: jibel: thx
<willcooke> Any ideas when we started accepting reviews via u-s-c?
<willcooke> 2009?
<seb128> willcooke, I've a queue of things to reply to, use a bit of the time plane for that
<Laney> this interwebs sux
<Laney> can't push to gitlab
<Laney> can't even load gitlab half the time
<oSoMoN> hey seb
<oSoMoN> darn, he left and tab completion sucks
<Laney> better connection using my 4g modem on the plane than I had in the airport
<Laney> ._.
<xnox> lolz
<seb128> hey oSoMoN, sorry I was at lunch. How are you?  not too much backlog coming back? ;)
<oSoMoN> seb128, hey! there's backlog, but it looks manageable so far
<seb128> good to read :)
<seb128> and how is sleep level?
<oSoMoN> chaotic, but that was expected :)
<seb128> yeah, sadly that seems a standard option which is part of the deal
<willcooke> A drunk baby is a sleepy baby
<willcooke> night all
<oSoMoN> good evening everyone
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-06
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<willcooke> ahoy
<willcooke> happy Friday desktoppers
<duflu> Hi willcooke
<oSoMoN> hey willcooke
<oSoMoN> happy Friday
 * tsimonq2 waves
<tsimonq2> oSoMoN: Hey, I know this would be out of the norm but would you consider syncing libreoffice from Experimental? Lubuntu and Kubuntu want to start using the KDE 5 port that's now included in this.
<tsimonq2> It also solves bug 1757746, which I'd personally like to see solved. :)
<ubot5> bug 1757746 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "Please port your package away from Qt 4" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1757746
<oSoMoN> tsimonq2, libreoffice packaging diverged between debian and ubuntu, so technically that wouldn't be a sync
<tsimonq2> oSoMoN: Ah, gotcha. Then let me rephrase as asking for 6.1.0~rc1. :)
<oSoMoN> yeah, we can certainly consider that, given that the release of 6.1.0 is scheduled in a month from now
<tsimonq2> If there's anything I can do to help, don't hesitate to let me know :)
<oSoMoN> I need to update LO to 6.0.5 anyway, so I'll see if the relevant packaging changes in the 6.1 branch can be backported there
<tsimonq2> There's a lot of changes in porting to KDE 5... I doubt it's doable.
<oSoMoN> tsimonq2, I'm just back from an extended paternity leave so I've got quite a few things to catch up with, but I'll get to it
<tsimonq2> oSoMoN: No problem at all, thanks :)
<duflu> Hola seb128
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey duflu, happy friday! how are you?
<duflu> seb128, going crazy. Chasing a mutter bug through a mutter bug through a Mesa/Xorg bug. Trying to find something that can be fixed without it being broken by other things
<duflu> You seb128?
<duflu> On the upside I have finally got gnome-shell using 100% of my CPU. One of the bugs was limiting it to about 50%
<seb128> sounds like a full friday
<oSoMoN> hey seb128
<oSoMoN> how is GUADEC going?
<seb128> the conference is just starting but the social part was already nice
<seb128> catching up with people and meeting new ones
<Trevinho> youpi: hey, I saw your pings... Quite busy with GUADEC now, me and andyrock will try, but time is quite low these days. maybe muktupavels could give a check too (and you his stuff too)... So we've a first pass review.
<seb128> some nice/useful discussions yesterday around power consumption, fingerprint auth
<oSoMoN> cool
<seb128> youpi, Trevinho and andyrock are quite busy and we didn't account for compiz reviews/work for them this cycle so finding other reviews/maintainers for compiz woud be better
<youpi> o
<youpi> k
<duflu> OK! Great things coming next week. But I must be disciplined and not try to do them all on a Friday night. Early start tomorrow.
<duflu> Bye all
<mitya57> Trevinho: hi! tsimonq2 synced new compiz from Debian which has many packaging changes (see https://launchpadlibrarian.net/368652601/compiz_1%3A0.9.13.1+18.04.20180302-0ubuntu1_1%3A0.9.13.1+18.04.20180302-1.diff.gz).
<mitya57> Will it be OK if I submit (most of) them as a merge proposal to lp:compiz, so that the next upload does not revert them?
<seb128> mitya57, tsimonq2, what was the rational to drop the mutliarching from the control?
<mitya57> seb128: https://salsa.debian.org/compiz-team/compiz/commit/4b4cfd7f03efb7512a6af1e6752f17207d160322
<mitya57> I think there was some mistake, Multi-Arch: same *is* allowed in Debian.
<seb128> mitya57, right, they are not supported in Debian but are in Ubuntu, which is why we had a delta?
<seb128> also that commit is old, not sure it's still true
<seb128> in any case that delta seems like it should still be there
<mitya57> seb128: I will review the Debian changes one by one, and decide which to commit and which to revert.
<seb128> thx
<seb128> tsimonq2, please add the delta back
<seb128> (need to drop from IRC, bbl)
<willcooke> night all
<oSoMoN> have a great week-end desktoppers
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-07
<happyaron> seb128: should be in the process of changing to PTS address
<seb128> hey happyaron, great
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-08
<newbii> Help please!! I have a big problem with my bionic beaver installed about a week ago. All was fine, but now it does not want to start. when I press the start button the screen become black and after some time i see the messages. it stops at the step "Started GNOME display manager" and does not move any more. Please help me if you can.--
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-07-01
<didrocks> good morning
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, Ã§a va?
<didrocks> oSoMoN: il faut chauddddddddddddddâ¦ mais sinon Ã§a va
<oSoMoN> pareil ici
<didrocks> Ã§a descend Ã  combien la nuit ?
<oSoMoN> enfin cette nuit Ã§a a rafraÃ®chi un peu, mais il va encore faire trÃ¨s chaud dans la journÃ©e
<oSoMoN> cette nuit câest descendu Ã  21Â°C, câest bien
<didrocks> ah oui, pas mal
<didrocks> encore que 24Â°C cette nuit ici :(
<duflu> Morning didrocks and oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> good afternoon duflu
<didrocks> hey duflu
<ideopathic> I'm doing a clean install of Ubuntu 18.04LTS Desktop.  After running the updates, the graphics environment hangs on the purple screen.. it looks like the ubuntu logo is starting to fade in....
<duflu> ideopathic, Sounds like a virtual machine bug we have in progress. Is it a VM?
<ideopathic> duflu: yes it is a vm (VMware Fusion)
<duflu> ideopathic, Then it is bug 1832138. You can avoid it by installing 18.04.2 instead. Or see the workaround in the bug
<ubot5> bug 1832138 in linux (Ubuntu Bionic) "Login screen never appears on vmwgfx using bionic kernel 4.15" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1832138
<duflu> 18.04.2: http://releases.ubuntu.com/18.04/
<ideopathic> Thank you!
<lis> happy monday, everyone
<didrocks> hey lis
<duflu> Hi lis
<marcustomlinson> good morning!
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson
<pieq> Morning desktoppers!
<pieq> I was playing with a laptop using a touchscreen over the weekend and found out Firefox does not enable touchscreen behaviour by default, but Chromium/Chrome does (on 19.04 at least). I was wondering where I should address this... Launchpad? Bugzilla?
<lis> didrocks, duflu, other 'd' nicks: hello :D
<duflu> Hi marcustomlinson and pieq
<duflu> pieq, I'm sure there are multiple bug reports but for now we already have bug 1312376
<ubot5> bug 1312376 in firefox (Ubuntu) "touch screen in browser not scrolling" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1312376
<Laney> hoi
<duflu> hi Laney
<seb128> hey there, good morning desktopers
<willcooke> morning all
<pieq> duflu, oh, thanks for pointing this out, I'll check
<duflu> I'm really surprised I can't find more duplicates
<duflu> Morning seb128 and willcooke
<seb128> hey duflu willcooke
<didrocks> hey seb128, Laney, willcooke
<pieq> duflu, yes... I fixed my issues in 5 minutes thanks to the amazing Arch Linux wiki, but it would be nice to have this as a default
<duflu> Yes..
<pieq> I'll comment on this issue
 * duflu waits
<seb128> lut didrocks, en forme ?
<seb128> Ã§a va mieux la chaleur ?
<pieq> 46 Â°C in Lyon last Friday, I guess it can hardly get worse? :)
<seb128> yet people keep claiming it's not in the south :p
<Laney> hey duflu seb128 willcooke pieq didrocks
<pieq> duflu, seems it's not enabled by default because of some issues with xinput2 on some devices. See last comment on https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1268599
<ubot5> Mozilla bug 1268599 in User events and focus handling "touch screen drag and scroll on linux does not work even with gtk3 in ubuntu 16.04" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> hey Laney, had a good w.e?
<willcooke> we had summer on Saturday
<Laney> seb128: had family visiting, enjoyed the sun, went out for a curry, pretty good!
<Laney> you?
<seb128> Laney, nice :)
<willcooke> seb128, a Brazilian blog got in touch over the weekend to ask how they can contribute to translating the extensions we're shipping.  Can you point me in the right direction?  Should it be done in Launchpad or upstream? https://twitter.com/blogdiolinux/status/1145018685867876353
<seb128> saturday was too hot to be much outside, we went to the library in the morning and stayed inside in the afternoon. We tried to put a small pool on the terrasse while doing a bbq but we had to retreat inside was still too warm at 6pm
<seb128> sunday was nicer, we went to the beach :)
<seb128> (oh and we cooked shrimp curry ;)
<Laney> :>
<willcooke> nice
<seb128> willcooke, mp translations update to https://github.com/micheleg/dash-to-dock
<seb128> willcooke, https://github.com/micheleg/dash-to-dock/pull/905 if they need an example
<gitbot> micheleg issue (Pull request) 905 in dash-to-dock "Update tr.po" [Closed]
<willcooke> perfect, thanks seb128
<seb128> np
<seb128> willcooke, they might also want https://github.com/ubuntu/gnome-shell-extension-appindicator and https://gitlab.gnome.org/World/ShellExtensions/desktop-icons
<didrocks> seb128: horrible. it didn't get lower than 24Â°C since Friday at night
<didrocks> so it's already 29 inside
<seb128> :(
<seb128> find a place with A/C and go work there!
<didrocks> yeah, but libraries are closed
<willcooke> This is the week of the year where I think about buying an A/C unit
<seb128> no coffee place with wifi and A/C
<seb128> macdonalds? ;)
<didrocks> yeah :(
<willcooke> hah.
<willcooke> I would love to have a picture of didrocks eating a Big Mac
<didrocks> swimming pools :)
<willcooke> for bribery purposes
<didrocks> sure, and give that to "Notre Maison"
<jibel> I work from the beach ;)
<Trevinho> morning folks
<willcooke> :)
<didrocks> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> hi didrocks
<didrocks> anyway, last days of terrible heat
<willcooke> speaking of pools, hi Trevinho
<duflu> Hi Trevinho
<didrocks> tonight, at 5am, it will be 20Â°C
<Trevinho> haha
<Trevinho> hi duflu  and willcooke
<duflu> You just assume Marco is near a pool?
<seb128> willcooke, I've a picture of Didier enjoying a glass of wine & coke at a team diner, we could exchange pictures :)
<didrocks> which will help getting to something livable :)
<willcooke> duflu, he was in a pool not very long ago
<seb128> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> duflu: I was yesterday, you miss the "fun" in telegram...
<didrocks> seb128: nobody can proove there was coke inside, it could have been just very bad wine
<seb128> *g*
<Trevinho> it's just under my eyes now :P
<duflu> I mean, I always assume Marco is near a pool
<duflu> or the ocean
 * duflu wonders if Lenovo makes floaties
<willcooke> :)
<ricotz> hello desktopers! :)
<willcooke> hey ricotz!
 * ricotz welcomes the 32bit decision :)
<willcooke> :) as do we
<ricotz> oSoMoN, hi, please see PM
<ricotz> hey willcooke
<Laney> Trevinho: do you have an example application/snap for that libnotify SNAP thing?
<oSoMoN> Laney, I can reproduce the kopano-webapp autopkgtest failure locally with a qemu runner, looking into it
<Laney> oSoMoN: ð
<Laney> but also ð« at the problem in the first place
<Laney> I did a minimal bit of poking but it was hard for me to get any useful errors not knowing Selenium at all
<Laney> did half wonder if it was going to be a permissions thing that's happening with the snap and the test running as root ð¤·
 * Laney goes to eat sandwich
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey, could you SRU your patch from bug #1778946 to bionic?
<ubot5> bug 1778946 in ppp (Debian) "No dns resolution after closing a vpn/pptp connection" [Unknown,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1778946
<didrocks> if it's 30 inside your house, clap your hands <CLAP> <CLAP>â¦
<didrocks> if it's 30 inside your house, clap your hands <CLAP> <CLAP>â¦
<didrocks> lalalala lalalalalala lalalalalla lalala <CLAP> <CLAP>
 * didrocks is singing too many english songs to Martin
<oSoMoN> <CLAP> <CLAP> (only 28.1Â°C inside here, but I sympathise)
<didrocks> 28.1 is fresher than what I had this morning despite having all my windows opened from 1am to 9am every night :p I'm almost chilling :)
<didrocks> oSoMoN: is it supposed to get better for you as well tonight?
<oSoMoN> nope, tonight will actually be hotter than last night, but with all windows open all night long IÂ managed to get the house down to 26Â°C in the morning, that's quite good
<didrocks> yeah, not terrible
<willcooke> night all o/
<robert_ancell> Wimpress, where are the KDE snapcraft.yaml files stored?
<robert_ancell> Or does anyone know a KDE snap that has the snapcraft.yaml in their main repo.
<robert_ancell> My ~ubuntu-core-dev membership almost expired because Gmail didn't think that was an important message :/
<Wimpress> robert_ancell: I believe they are in the upstream projects.
<robert_ancell> Wimpress, they don't seem to be (e.g. kcalc). I think I found them once before but no Googling is helping me.
<robert_ancell> I ended up looking at the GIMP YAML (was looking for common-id format).
<Wimpress> Ah, OK.
<Wimpress> So what you're saying is we need documentation for that?
<robert_ancell> Wimpress, I particularly wanted to point at a real world case (filed MRs against VLC and Visual Studio Code who aren't setting this).
<robert_ancell> And you always have more confidence that something shipping is correct over documentation :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-07-02
<jamesh> robert_ancell: I've got the appstream-metadata interface PR passing CI.  Will hopefully have the packagekit one up soon
<jamesh> if you've got any comments on it, that'd be helpful
<robert_ancell> Nice!
<robert_ancell> PR link?
<jamesh> https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/7042
<gitbot> snapcore issue (Pull request) 7042 in snapd "interfaces: add an interface granting access to AppStream metadata" [Open]
<jamesh> Took a little bit of wrangling to get the snap-update-ns AppArmor policies to allow creating the mount points, but seems to be working correctly now
<jamesh> it was necessary to mount /var/lib/apt/lists too, since the AppStream files in /var/lib/app-info/yaml are just symlinks
<robert_ancell> Clever sandbox :)
<jamesh> the symlinks are absolute too, so it probably wouldn't be sufficient to just use system-files interface and access them under /var/lib/snapd/hostfs
<didrocks> good morning
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<duflu> Hi didrocks, oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN, hey duflu
<pieq> Morning!
<jibel> RAOF, hi, has the SRU exception for nvidia drivers been approved?
<jibel> Salut pieq
<didrocks> salut pieq
<RAOF> jibel: I believe so, yes. Hm. I should update the wiki page, shouldn't I!
<pieq> Stupid question of the day: in what project(s) can I discuss the default settings for timezone and formats in Ubuntu? I install Ubuntu in English from Taiwan, and even though the language is properly set to English, the format is set to Chinese, so all the numbers and dates are in Chinese, which don't make sense at all... so I would like to check if someone has had the issue before and discuss defaults
<jibel> RAOF, thanks.
<jibel> tseliot, ^ FYI, the SRU exception for nvidia drivers has been accepted.
<duflu> Hi pieq, jibel, RAOF, world
<lis> hi duflu, world
<duflu> Hi lis
<tseliot> jibel: excellent! :)
<RAOF> Hey lis!
<willcooke> morning all
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<marcustomlinson> morning didrocks oSoMoN duflu lis tseliot RAOF willcooke :)
<duflu> Morning willcooke and marcustomlinson
<duflu> \o
<duflu>     o/
<oSoMoN> good morning willcooke, marcustomlinson
<marcustomlinson> \o\
<marcustomlinson> /o/
<oSoMoN> |o|
<seb128> hey there, good morning desktopers!
<duflu> ðº
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<duflu> Morning seb128
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, hey duflu, how are you today?
<duflu> seb128, going OK. You?
<Wimpress> o/
<duflu> Hi Wimpress
<seb128> I'm good!
<seb128> enjoy nice summer weather without overheat anymore
<oSoMoN> tired but fine, night was too short
<oSoMoN> hey Wimpress
<Laney> hey ho
<duflu> Morning Laney
<seb128> hey Laney! how are you today?
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson, seb128, Wimpress, Laney
<seb128> lut didrocks, en forme ?
<didrocks> il fait plus frais, donc c'est mieux :)
<marcustomlinson> hey Wimpress Laney seb128
<seb128> didrocks, cool!
<seb128> marcustomlinson, Wimpress, hey
<Trevinho> morning!
<Laney> hey duflu seb128 didrocks marcustomlinson Trevinho
<Laney> seb128: good, nice and sunny!
<tseliot> marcustomlinson: good morning to you, and good morning everybody :)
<duflu> Hi Trevinho
<Laney> laney@nightingale> man snapcraft                                                                                                                                                                                                  ~
<Laney> No manual entry for snapcraft
<Laney> :(
<Laney> zsh: command not found: snapcraft
<Laney> oh
<seb128> hey Trevinho
<Laney> still doesn't have one tho
<oSoMoN> morning Laney, Trevinho, tseliot
<Laney> ahoy there oSoMoN!
<tseliot> hey oSoMoN
<Trevinho> hi duflu, Laney, seb, tseliot and oSoMoN
<duflu> Morning tseliot
<tseliot> hey Trevinho, duflu
<duflu> I think we're going for some kind of record
<seb128> Trevinho, duflu, that bug/commit might be another one worth trying to get to bionic with some futur SRU? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1831161 /
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1831161 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "App-switcher icons too small with hidpi monitor and 1.25 scaling" [Low,Triaged]
<seb128> it's only a few lines removed from altTab.js
<seb128> do we keep a 'would be nice to SRU back to bionic' list somehow?
<duflu> seb128, not that I can think of. Some kind of "low-hanging-fruit" tag
<seb128> I'm not using an hidpi with scaling config, does anyone do? did you notice that issue/found it annoying?
<duflu> I suspect it's one of those things not immediately obvious as a bug
<duflu> So I wasn't worrying about it
<duflu> If you're looking that closely at the shell you could exert some opinion at many things being too big or too small
<seb128> right
<seb128> it's always nice to add some polish to the LTS, but it's a balance to find, we don't want to spend too much efforts backporting every fix either
<duflu> I still can't see it as a bug even in the screenshot in the upstream bug
<duflu> The reporter also says the icons are too small when they're much bigger than the size he uses in the launcher
<duflu> So yes, we'll get the change, but I wouldn't make it a priority
<seb128> duflu, well the issue is not so much the icons than the label from what I understood, as showned on the screenshot from https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/issues/1370
<gitbot> GNOME issue 1370 in gnome-shell "App-switcher icon size is too small in hidpi monitor, many short app names truncated" [Closed]
<duflu> seb128, on that note the same bug in the app grid is still unresolved. I proposed a fix years ago :(
<seb128> indeed, I though there was some movement previous cycle but it still didn't land :-/
<seb128> maybe now is the right time of the cycle for a nag
<seb128> oh, there was a new iteration pushed a month ago
<seb128> where verdre asked for some testing
<seb128> duflu, you could maybe give it a try, that might help to get things moving?
<duflu> seb128, I will try to remember to do that too. I have my own backlog of unfinished gnome-shell stuff
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey, thanks for working on those autopkgtest fixes. Could you merge propose the code change so it can be reviewed using the standard tools (launchpad)?
<tkamppeter> seb128, I wanted to do so but there is again no link to merge-propose.
<seb128> also that "stop the mainloop after 300s" looks like a workaround, do we know why those are sitting there for so long?
<seb128> tkamppeter, please ask on #launchpad so we can figure out what we are doing wrong and fix it
<tkamppeter> Yes, because we used old API functions on a network-manager with new API. There we always got the hang. After I did the API adaptation the hang never showed again.
<tkamppeter> But I saw from the hang how bad debuggability is that for being more future-proof I added the timers.
<tkamppeter> Now I get only failures when I run the script 20-30 times and one of the starts gives me a timeout of the AP not being ready.
<seb128> do you know why the AP is failing to be ready?
<seb128> anyway, please start by asking on #launchpad about how to mp those changes/why that's not available
<seb128> then we can discuss the solution in the review :)
<seb128> tkamppeter, ^
<tkamppeter> OK, I have added some ideas to the Trello card.
<tkamppeter> seb128, I will ask on #launchpad now.
<seb128> Colin to the rescue as usual :-)
<seb128> for those wondering, pushing to ~user/+git/project is wrong/makes a personal namespace and isn't mergable back to the project, you need to push to ~user/project instead
<Laney> +git is like +junk
<Laney> I think they decided that +junk was a bit of a mean thing to call random code :-)
<tkamppeter> seb128, merge proposal is up now.
<tkamppeter> seb128, Laney, LP should get easy ways for cloning and merging as GitHub/GitLab has.
<seb128> thx tkamppeter
<Laney> I'll write some review comments there
<seb128> thx
<RAOF> Trevinho: you had a reproducer (and fix?) for the CLion Gnome Shell hang, right? Might want to tell duflu about it on bug #1834583 ð
<ubot5> bug 1834583 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "GNOME Shell hangs when closing a Java dialog; hung in g_private_get() from thread_memory_from_self() from g_slice_free_chain_with_offset() from g_list_free() from stack_do_window_deletions() from stack_ensure_sorted() from get_default_focus_window()" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1834583
<jibel> how do I disable automated package updates on a desktop?
<seb128> index update? or installation of security updates?
<jibel> any
<seb128> https://linuxconfig.org/disable-automatic-updates-on-ubuntu-18-04-bionic-beaver-linux has some content
<jibel> I don't want to run unattended-upgrades and don't want to see the softwareupdate popup
<seb128> which suggests editing the apt.conf
<seb128> but otherwise uninstall unattendeed-upgrades I would say
<seb128> and set software-properties to never
<jibel> thanks I'll try the apt way
<seb128> np
<seb128> also maybe comment on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-properties/+bug/1834226
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1834226 in software-properties (Ubuntu) "update-notifier doesn't respect "automatically check for updates: Never"" [High,New]
<seb128> foundations is trying to bail out of it blaming packagekit
<seb128> but I think that's wrong and the issue is more unattended-upgrade
<seb128> rbalint, ^ is editing the apt config the right way to disable unattended-upgrade?
<seb128> ok, it's meeting time!
<seb128> #startmeeting Desktop Team Meeting - 2019-07-02
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jul  2 13:31:07 2019 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Meeting - 2019-07-02 | Current topic:
<seb128> Roll call: didrocks, duflu (out), jamesh (out), jibel, kenvandine, laney, marcustomlinson, oSoMoN, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<marcustomlinson> present
<kenvandine> \o
<oSoMoN> o/
<didrocks> hey
<seb128> yet another meeting where we don't have Will and where the rls bugs summary was sent late, sorry about that!
<seb128> let's try to do our best still :)
<seb128> #topic rls-bb-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Meeting - 2019-07-02 | Current topic: rls-bb-bugs
<seb128> (I'm going to stop mentioning the bugs we have been ignoring for some weeks this time)
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> no desktop entry
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> nothing to discuss on that one either
<tseliot> o/
<seb128> #topic rls-cc-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Meeting - 2019-07-02 | Current topic: rls-cc-bugs
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-cc-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> no desktop entry
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-cc-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> nothing to discuss
<seb128> #topic rls-dd-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Meeting - 2019-07-02 | Current topic: rls-dd-bugs
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> no desktop entry
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> same as bionic, old items / things that don't need to be sorted out now
<seb128> #topic rls-ee-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Meeting - 2019-07-02 | Current topic: rls-ee-bugs
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ee-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> still no desktop
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ee-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> bugs assigned there
<seb128> k, that was an easy round
<seb128> #topic update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Meeting - 2019-07-02 | Current topic: update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<seb128> Laney, hey :)
<Laney> yo
<Laney> nothing to note, that gdm I think is to be handled in britney
<Laney> others already in progress from last week
<seb128> thanks Laney
<seb128> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Meeting - 2019-07-02 | Current topic: AOB
<seb128> other topics?
<seb128> tkamppeter, what's the status of the n-m bionic SRU?
<kenvandine> tkamppeter: have you been able to reproduce it yourself yet?
<tkamppeter> I have looked into it and as the problem does not occur with current Ubuntu I assume that it got somewhere fixed upstream and so I am trying to contact upstream about it.
<tkamppeter> #nm seems not to work, even with thaller present I got no answer at all.
<tkamppeter> I tried also the ML but also no answer.
<tkamppeter> I do not want to redo a fix from scratch which upstream has perhaps already done.
<seb128> did you manage to reproduce?
<seb128> git bisect time? ;)
<tkamppeter> No, I was more occupied with the autopkg stuff of eoan.
<seb128> ok, let's see what's the status next week then, hopefully it moves before the next meeting
<seb128> thx tkamppeter
<seb128> other topics?
<Laney> yeah
<kenvandine> if you can find the relevent code you could look at what's changed there
<Laney> those ones we keep ignoring
<Laney> why do we do that and can we stop?
<seb128> we can probably delete those lines from the bug
<seb128> it's not even clear those components need fixing
<seb128> wdyt?
<Laney> probably, that's the closest we can get to -notfixing with megabugs like that
<seb128> to me it looks like cyphermox was a bit trigger happy to add the targets
<Laney> which seems true otherwise they would have been assigned
<Laney> so +1
<seb128> thx, I will try to do that again, I started by launchpad keeps timeouting or failed to load the ajax and opened subpages
<seb128> which was too annoying to deal with so I close the page...
<seb128> thx for raising it Laney!
<seb128> other topics?
<seb128> seems not, then it's a wrap
<seb128> thanks everyone!
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jul  2 13:47:09 2019 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2019/ubuntu-desktop.2019-07-02-13.31.moin.txt
<didrocks> thx
<seb128> oSoMoN, bug #1800260 is a bit puzzling O_o
<ubot5> bug 1800260 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "[snap] with CSD and Yaru, background color of the header bar is incorrect" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1800260
<oSoMoN> seb128, yes, very puzzling
<seb128> it reads the right css which works with the deb but not the snap in devmode?
<marcustomlinson> thx
<oSoMoN> indeed
<seb128> weird
<oSoMoN> I was going to ask didrocks for help as he understands better the theming engine, but I got distracted by other priorities
<oSoMoN> didrocks, when you have a moment (doesn't have to be now, not even today), can we chat about that?
<seb128> sorry I'm only commenting now, the post was there this morning when I had a look to discourse... ;-)
<didrocks> oSoMoN: sure
<oSoMoN> thx, just let me know when it works best for you
<oSoMoN> seb128, no worries, now is as good as any other time
<seb128> (probably use the channel for the chat, Marco/Iain/other might have some clue also about the topic as well)
<seb128> unless you use more direct bandwith and an hangout or such, which is also fine :)
<oSoMoN> sure
<cyphermox> seb128: what but was I pinged about?
<seb128> cyphermox, that japenese ERA bugs keeps coming up in our weekly meeting every week because you targetted e.G poppler-data that we own and it's tagged rls-bb-incoming but there is no upstream fix and we don't know about the topic so we don't know what to do from those items
<seb128> cyphermox, we decided we will just delete those target lines until it's clear we need to act on those packages now
<seb128> cyphermox, those 'collections' bugs are a bit annoying to deal with, especially with SRUs since it's not obvious then which line the verifications tags apply to, the testcase, etc
<cyphermox> why couldn't you just ignore that bug for the time being?
<cyphermox> anyway, whatever, this is fine
<seb128> cyphermox, we sort of doing that but it's on rls-nn-incomings reports so it's adding some noise to our weekly reviews, but no big deal
<seb128> cyphermox, sorry I didn't mean to ping you, should have added a _ in your irc name :)
<cyphermox> np
<seb128> cyphermox, how are you otherwise? no heat wave in canada? ;)
<cyphermox> heh, yeah, somewhat of one
<cyphermox> it's not terrible, nothing you wouldn't expect this time of the year
<cyphermox> let's just say good central a/c was a criteria I used to pick my next appartment
<seb128> :)
<cyphermox> also, very much looking forward to going in the spa for a bit later ;)
<cyphermox> you? I'm assuming you're asking because it's a big heat wave in Europe?
<cyphermox> my brother is in Switzerland this week and seemed to say so
<seb128> cyphermox, yeah, it was around 38Â°C for a week or so, it's cooling down again since yesterday now though, which is nice :)
<seb128> we are not so used to heat hear, A/C is not that common
<cyphermox> yeah
<cyphermox> I know weather is less extreme usually
<cyphermox> no 20cm of snow to offset the week-long 35+ dC in summer ;)
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> easy shell escaping diff, could someone just +1/-1? https://people.canonical.com/~seb128/gconf.debdiff
<oSoMoN> seb128, that's one old bug! LGTM, do you need anything else than an informal +1 ?
<seb128> oSoMoN, no, just wanted sanity check that I'm not doing something stupid, you never know with shell :p
<seb128> thx
<oSoMoN> well I didn't actually test it, but it looks sound
<Laney> I mean it looks sane
<Laney> you could run 'shellcheck' on it
<seb128> ah, I didn't know about that tool, it's happy with the script
<seb128> thx oSoMoN Laney
 * oSoMoN goes to a school parents meetup, have a good evening everyone
 * Laney slaps oSoMoN for quitting too fast
 * teward drags Laney in front of a tribunal for reasons
 * tsimonq2 yeets teward into /dev/null for reasons
 * teward is already there
 * teward drags tsimonq2 with him into the oblivion
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-07-03
<didrocks> good morning
 * tsimonq2 waves to didrocks 
<didrocks> hey tsimonq2
<tsimonq2> didrocks: I hope it's a bit cooler today :)
<didrocks> tsimonq2: yeah, I succeed at having 25.8Â°C only this morning (with everything still opened during the evening), however, we are up to 29Â°C inside in the evening as outside, it's still up to 32-33 and walls are warmedâ¦ But it's way better already, thanks! :)
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<Wimpress> o/
<didrocks> hey Wimpress
<oSoMoN> hey Wimpress
<tsimonq2> didrocks: Uff, after doing the conversion to US temps, that doesn't sound pleasant! I'm glad it's getting better
<tsimonq2> o/ oSoMoN and Wimpress
<tsimonq2> (And with that, I think it's bedtime.)
<didrocks> tsimonq2: yeah, it wasn't ;) have a good night!
<tsimonq2> Thanks :)
<oSoMoN> good night tsimonq2 !
<duflu> Hi didrocks, oSoMoN, Wimpress
<didrocks> hey duflu
<amurray> hey desktoppers - any idea whether bolt 0.8 will make it for eoan? https://twitter.com/gicmo/status/1139520601503260674 - IOMMU support sounds nice for extra sekurity :)
<oSoMoN> hi duflu
<duflu> amurray, looks like it's missing from Debian too. I guess start with a bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bolt/+filebug
<amurray> duflu: ok will do
<amurray> duflu: LP #1835166
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1835166 in bolt (Ubuntu Eoan) "Update bolt to latest 0.8 release for eoan" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1835166
<marcustomlinson> good wednesday everybody
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson
<oSoMoN> marcustomlinson, look, Howard's being eaten!
<marcustomlinson> :D
<duflu> marcustomlinson, Good Wednesday sir
<willcooke> morning gang
<duflu> Zoinks. Morning willcooke
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<willcooke> Can someone take a quick look at https://discourse.ubuntu.com and see if they can see the Eoan wallpaper comp post pinned somewhere?  I can't see it, but perhaps that's because I posted it?
 * willcooke throws duflu a snack 
<willcooke> hi didrocks
<marcustomlinson> willcooke: morning. yeah it's pinned top right
<willcooke> marcustomlinson, does it say "Latest" top right too?
<willcooke> ahhh
<willcooke> I think I posted it without a category somehow
<duflu> Looks like it
<marcustomlinson> willcooke: https://imgur.com/iGS8FSR
<willcooke> marcustomlinson, thanks
<willcooke> yeah, I did, I missed the category.
<willcooke>  Durr
<willcooke> Fixed now
<oSoMoN> good morning willcooke
<willcooke> hi oSoMoN
<duflu> willcooke, I feel in the past there's been a lack of colour options in wallpapers. I mean some years if you want something blueish or greenish or pinkish then there will be none that match. I wonder if there's a way to achieve some colour balance...
<duflu> At least the primary colours
<willcooke> duflu, ooh, interesting.  Could be a fun addition to the wallpaper chooser, to select an image by colour.  But we could also add a new "bonus points" idea to the comp, to say something along the lines of "have fun with colour; try and theme your image around a single colour"
<duflu> willcooke, I don't know the answer. Maybe it's a lack of submissions or maybe the final selection doesn't cover enough of the gamut
<duflu> Still, we're doing far better than the default Windows 10 wallpapers
<duflu> There's plenty of photographers and artists out there. So maybe the issue is that they don't know the competition exists. In fact, this is the first year I've ever seen a link to it before it closed
<willcooke> We did pretty well last year with press/blog coverage.  A few places have picked it up again this year.  I wonder if OMG have...
<willcooke> ... nope
 * willcooke pings Joey
<Laney> AVAST!
<duflu> Hi Laney
<duflu> Yar
<duflu> I guess breaking out of the bubble of people already involved in Ubuntu that closely and making it more widely known might help. Somehow
<duflu> Because I think most of our users would be outside of that
<seb128> hey, good morning and happy mid-week-day desktopers :)
<duflu> Hi seb128
<willcooke> hi seb128
<didrocks> hey seb128
<seb128> hey duflu willcooke didrocks, how are you today?
<duflu> seb128, feeling good. You?
<didrocks> good, the temperature is cooler :)
<seb128> I'm good thx!
<Laney> hey duflu seb128 didrocks
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<didrocks> hey Laney
<seb128> amurray, hey, I've bolt 0.8 package update started on my disk from 2 days ago :)
<seb128> just as a fyi
<Laney> yeah not bad
<seb128> but I'm not member of pkg-freedesktop in Debian
<seb128> I requested to be added but the team doesn't seem to be active in reviewing requests
<seb128> Debian -> salsa
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, en forme ?
 * duflu goes back to read what the new features are
<oSoMoN> Ã§a va :)
<oSoMoN> good morning Laney
<Laney> ahoy oSoMoN
<Laney> ah bollox, my gnome-desktop3/bionic was bad
<Laney> bet I forgot to commit that symbols change
<Laney> ah /o\ the opposite problem
<Trevinho> morning folks
<didrocks> hey Trevinho
<duflu> Morning Trevinho
<Trevinho> hi duflu and didrocks
<Laney> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> hi head-hunter Laney!
 * Laney hires Trevinho 
<seb128> hey Trevinho, how are you?
<Trevinho> TrevinhoÂ²
<Trevinho> hi seb128, all good... Last Night thumper just arrived here with family to spend some days at the countryhouse
<Trevinho> you?
<oSoMoN> morning Trevinho
<Trevinho> hi oSoMoN
<seb128> Trevinho, I'm good!
<lis> morning peeps :)
<lis> Trevinho: i was finally in your country!
<Trevinho> lis: hey!
<Trevinho> lis: great, did you enjoy? Where did you go?
<lis> sicily.  was pretty interesting there.  saw some beautiful things.
<Trevinho> lis: ah, you can't be amazed by sicily... And its food <3
<Trevinho> what part?
<lis> ya... i thought i'd get sick of eating pasta every day but uh... even after i got home i was still having pasta cravings ð¤£
<lis> all over the place.  we landed in palermo but drove all around the island and i flew home from catania
<Laney> :D
<lis> roads were completely awful lol
<lis> stayed in trapani and ragusa
<Trevinho> lis: yeah... That's a problem with the regional government, so money flow there, and we don't know where it goes (actually we know, but... hard to track). Anyways, the beauty of the contrasts :P
<Trevinho> lis: ah, ragusa and those areas are amazing... Went to Siracusa too?
<oSoMoN> morning lis
<duflu> Huh. Launchpad git doesn't tell you about conflicts?
<duflu> It does for bzr
<duflu> Maybe I am spoiled by gitlab and remember incorrectly. Maybe you always had to manually rebase to find out
<duflu> Laney, btw next update please consider https://code.launchpad.net/~vanvugt/ubuntu/+source/mutter/+git/mutter/+merge/368536
<Laney> duflu: right. If Trevinho thinks it's good maybe he could say so on the MR?
<amurray> seb128: awesome - thanks
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey, there are newer hplip versions in Debian, could you have a look if we should sync that update?
<seb128> kenvandine, there have also newer flatpak and xdg portals that might be worth looking at
<kenvandine> i'm sure ahayzen will be pinging me about those :)
<seb128> Laney, do you remember the history/context for http://launchpadlibrarian.net/295402361/libpcap_1.8.1-3_1.8.1-3ubuntu1.diff.gz ? was that sent to upstream/debian? we still have it as our only distro diff on that package, would be nice to get back in sync
<seb128> kenvandine,  :)
<Laney> seb128: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=846241
<ubot5> Debian bug 846241 in libpcap0.8 "Upstream commit d81eb812e679d3f2b4f025cc729b415203889377 breaks bustle" [Normal,Fixed]
<seb128> Laney, ah, thx, I wonder why I didn't see it
<Laney> there's nothing get back in sync with though, unless you like versions which are only in experimental
<seb128> the world is only in experimental since they are frozen...
<Laney> that was not the case on 2018-11-04
<Laney> and even if it was, that fact alone is not enough to make everything in experimental OK to sync automatically
<seb128> sure, I didn't say it was
<Laney> ok
<seb128> this cycle is better that next for pulling updated versions though so I'm looking at what we should take on
<seb128> that one feels like one we should have for the LTS
<Laney> I have no idea about libpacp version 1.9.0
<seb128> I will check with security team before syncing was
<Laney> if you worked out somehow tha tthis is a good version
<seb128> Laney, thx!
<Laney> then feel free to do it
<seb128> sorry for overlooking the BTS bug
<seb128> the patch/changelog has no reference and the bug title commit id got me confused
<seb128> thx for the reply :)
<oSoMoN> marcustomlinson, looks like all the libreoffice SRUs are through, well done!
<marcustomlinson> yeah eventually :P
<marcustomlinson> thanks oSoMoN
<ahayzen[m]> kenvandine, :-) i was going to file a syncrequest for 1.4.2 of flatpak later today, but if you could do before that'd be awesome :-) And xdg-desktop-portal still looks the same as when we discussed before (updated but with pipewire disabled, so probably a good point to sync)
<kenvandine> ahayzen[m]: i can do a sync on those
<kenvandine> as long as pipewire is still disabled ;)
<ahayzen[m]> awesome thanks! :-)
<kenvandine> so flatpak and xdg-desktop-portal?
<kenvandine> what about xdg-desktop-portal-gtk?
<ahayzen[m]> and probably xdg-desktop-portal-gtk ?
<GunnarHj> Hi desktoppers!
<GunnarHj> Anybody who is in the mood to sponsor bug #1728012? Debian fix backported to bionic. Small debdiff - fixes an ugly regression.
<ubot5> bug 1728012 in sane-backends (Ubuntu Bionic) "Many 3rd party scanner drivers are broken by a sane change" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1728012
<ahayzen[m]> is there any plan long term about pipewire ? i saw it has a MIR filed, is it just waiting on security review etc before it can be in main ? Or is it also deemed too unstable/intrusive to be used in the next LTS ?
<seb128> ahayzen[m], we didn't discuss much, but imho it's too new for the next LTS
<seb128> no way at least for it to replace pulseaudio by then
<seb128> if it's on the side for some other feature who knows...
<ahayzen[m]> right i suspected that :-)
<oSoMoN> didrocks, seb128:Â I need an archive admin to accept the NEW firefox-geckodriver package (see bug #1831204 for details), if you don't mind
<ubot5> bug 1831204 in firefox (Ubuntu) "Package geckodriver" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1831204
<seb128> oSoMoN, let me look
<oSoMoN> that's fast, thanks :)
<seb128> oSoMoN, looks fine, easy binary, NEWed now
<oSoMoN> cheers!
<seb128> yw!
<didrocks> seems like I was beaten up :)
<Laney> haha
<Laney> didrocks: "beaten up" means something that I don't think you mean in english (maybe only british english?)
<Laney> unless you do mean that... in which case HUGS!
<didrocks> Laney: well, if you look at me, you can maybe think that I'm accurate (I fall down today when running again) :p
<Laney> oh no :(
<Laney> definitely hugs then
 * didrocks hugs back
<Laney> is it bad?
<didrocks> more impressive than bad, but yeah, bleeding from both arms, hands and knees
<didrocks> the worst is that it's the 3rd time I'm falling at the exact same spotâ¦
<Laney> ð­
<Laney> in the park?
<didrocks> (in course of many years)
<didrocks> yeah, near the lake, there are roots that are really small
<oSoMoN> FTR, I didn't beat didrocks up, I'm not that kind of person
<oSoMoN> and sorry to hear that didrocks, sounds like extreme running!
<didrocks> oSoMoN: rather extreme "being distracted" ;)
<willcooke> Can haz Hexchat
<teward> willcooke: it's already in the repos I believe.
<willcooke> teward, yeah, I had to install a new hdd today, so I just restored my hexchat config :)  It's taken me alllllllll day
<willcooke> and with that... away
<willcooke> night all
<oSoMoN> good night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-07-04
<jamesh> robert_ancell: https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/7054 <- here's the PackageKit support PR
<gitbot> snapcore issue (Pull request) 7054 in snapd "interfaces: add an interface that grants access to the PackageKit service" [Open]
<robert_ancell> jamesh, nice!
<jamesh> robert_ancell: do you plan on implementing the PackageKit session interface in snap-store?
<robert_ancell> jamesh, as opposed to using a library?
<jamesh> that is, claiming org.freedesktop.PackageKit on the session bus?
<jamesh> From a confinement position, I don't think it matters if it is as a library or from scratch
<robert_ancell> jamesh, I hadn't considered that, but I guess probably yes.
<jamesh> robert_ancell: I think the standard "dbus" snapd interface is probably best for that rather than trying to cram it into this one
<jamesh> since that will eventually allow bus activation
<robert_ancell> jamesh, agreed. Since a PK interface user won't specifically need to register that.
<jamesh> [once my yak shaving expedition winds to a close]
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers!
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> afternoon duflu
<didrocks> good morning
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<duflu> Hi didrocks
<didrocks> hey oSoMoN, duflu
<willcooke> morning all
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<Laney> hey
<seb128> goooood morning desktopers!
<didrocks> hey Laney, seb128
<duflu> Morning willcooke, Laney and seb128
<seb128> hey didrocks, how are you? did you recover a bit from falling yesterday?
<seb128> hey duflu
<duflu> :-o
<didrocks> seb128: a little bit, but it's still hurting
<duflu> How are you seb128?
<seb128> didrocks, :-(
<seb128> duflu, I'm good!
<Laney> hey didrocks duflu seb128
<seb128> hye Laney, how are you?
<oSoMoN> good morning willcooke, Laney, seb128
<seb128> lut oSoMoN! Ã§a va comment ?
<oSoMoN> Ã§a va bien, merci!
<Laney> seb128: yeah good, climbing then folk club last night, was nice - and it's sunny this morning
<Laney> moved some of the house plants outside for their summer holiday
<Laney> hey oSoMoN
<seb128> sounds fun ;-)
<Laney> saw your chromium fix, nice one
<Trevinho> morning guyzzz
<oSoMoN> yeah, not sure why this didn't work without that patch in qemu but it did in e.g. virtualbox, but the patch is fine and I spent too much time investigating the issue already. And it will prevent similar issues with other packages that run selenium/chromedriver tests
<oSoMoN> buon giorno Trevinho
<Trevinho> bunjourn oSoMoN
<duflu> Morning Trevinho
<Trevinho> bonjour*
<Laney> BUNJUN MARCO
<duflu> Murning Marco
<Trevinho> bejump
<Trevinho> Laney: !
<seb128> bonjouno Trevinho!
<Trevinho> heya seb128
<cpaelzer> oSoMoN: any patch that I need for qemu in the package?
<oSoMoN> cpaelzer, nope, I patched chromedriver in the chromium snap, nothing on the qemu side
<oSoMoN> (that's bug #1834052 for some context)
<ubot5> bug 1834052 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "autopkgtest failures: Chromium-Related in Tests" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1834052
<cpaelzer> ok, thanks
<cpaelzer> just didn't want to miss anything :-)
 * Laney patches cpaelzer to run 2.4% more efficiently and 3.93% cooler
<cpaelzer> wth, thanks I guess?
<Laney> you're welcome!
<oSoMoN> jamesh, what's the latest status on https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/firefox-removable-media-interface-auto-connect-request/5929/10 ?
<seb128> hum, new bolt has an option to install tests
<seb128> I wonder if it's worth installing them in a new binary/making maybe an autopkgtest (though no need to have them installed for that)
 * Laney likes doing that
<seb128> the tests also use umockdev to emulate things and bolt itself has few rdepends, mostly glib/udev so I'm not sure that would test much
<Laney> Simon put them in the -dev package for something recently, until the next soname change that would mean a trip through NEW anyway
<Laney> that was ok I thought
<seb128> Laney, they are basically the same tests as in the source, you think there is value in having them in a binary rather than unpacking the source?
<oSoMoN> jamesh, I see that xdg-desktop-portal is still not installed by default in bionic, is there a plan to change that?
<jamesh> oSoMoN: I think we still need to update ubuntu-desktop dependencies, yeah.
<seb128> (well they need to be built, but bolt is small so that's not resource expensive to unpack/build/make check)
<Laney> yes of course
<jamesh> oSoMoN: I'm sorry this has taken so long
<Laney> you test the thing that is being built and distributed
<seb128> fair point
<Laney> rather than additionally testing the toolchain
<seb128> Laney, thx for the input
<oSoMoN> jamesh, no worries, just trying to figure out what's missing at this point
<seb128> let me add that
<seb128> and go through NEW :p
<Laney> you can put it in the -dev if you want
<seb128> (bolt isn't split, I don't want them installed in the main binary)
<seb128> I would if bolt had one :)
<Laney> https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/gnome-desktop/commit/82cab2e95483079f31e14bab865b2631df0595ab
<Laney> oh how do you build against it?
<seb128> you don't
<seb128> bolt is a dbus service
<Laney> ok so you use gbdus-codegen or something
<seb128> no convenient library/api provided
<seb128> right
<Laney> -tests package sounds good to me then!
<oSoMoN> jamesh, what else do I need to make the document portal work in an existing snap (chromium), apart from installing xdg-desktop-portal{,-gtk} on the host system?
<seb128> Laney, thx, useful conversation!
<jamesh> oSoMoN: for file open/save, setting GTK_USE_PORTAL=1 in the environment will do (e.g. using the environment stanza in snapcraft.yaml)
<oSoMoN> ack
<jamesh> it will probably also handle opening mime associations too, provided it doesn't match the .desktop files provided by the base snap
<jamesh> for a web browser, the xdg-open.desktop file probably won't cause problems
<jamesh> for some reason core18 includes a vim.desktop that might
<oSoMoN> jamesh, I'm running the chromium snap in a bionic VM with xdg-desktop-portal-gtk installed, and with GTK_USE_PORTAL=1, but the file open dialog won't let me browse to /media, what am I missing?
<oSoMoN> could this be specific to chromium because of the way they instantiate the file open dialog?
<jamesh> oSoMoN: I'd forgotten about that: the other half of the problem is that the app must use the GtkFileChooserNative API to present the file chooser
<oSoMoN> aha
<jamesh> or if it is using Qt, I think there is a QPA plugin that does the right thing
<jamesh> I needed to port gedit to the new API to get things working there
<jamesh> how difficult the port is depends on what file chooser features are being used
<oSoMoN> that's the chromium implementation: https://cs.chromium.org/chromium/src/chrome/browser/ui/libgtkui/select_file_dialog_impl_gtk.cc
 * jamesh looks
<jamesh> oSoMoN: from a quick look, the main things that aren't portable to GtkFileChooserNative are previews and custom filters
<jamesh> Anything that relies on the application controlling an already displayed file chooser is off the table
<jamesh> the custom filter could probably be replaced by providing multiple globs for both upper and lower case
<jamesh> or even translate to file_extension="jpeg" to "*.[Jj][Pp][Ee][Gg]"
<Laney> I think you can still supply previews, but they may or may not be actually rendered and may cause a non-native dialog to be shown instead of the native one
<jamesh> I think you're right, yeah
<jamesh> looks like the preview widget will be ignored and you'd never see the update-preview signal if portals are being used
<jamesh> but in fallback mode it should work like before
<oSoMoN> jamesh, Laney: thanks for the analysis, I could probably give a go at porting the implementation to GtkFileChooserNative, not sure whether upstream would accept it though, if it degrades the existing UX
<jamesh> oSoMoN: so it sounds like it should be possible to port chromium forward without loss of functionality.  The custom filter => glob pattern change is probably the most complex, but you could probably start with a simple glob
<jamesh> oSoMoN: presumably if Chromium is updated, that will percolate through to all the Electron apps eventually too
<oSoMoN> that sounds like a good idea then
<jamesh> yeah.  This definitely sounds like something that should happen
<jamesh> oSoMoN: the only other complication with porting is that GtkFileChooserNative is not a GtkWindow (or even a GtkWidget)
<juliank> What would people think if we'd show debconf questions from daemons in modal gnome-shell dialogs rather than these debconf-communicate windows?
<jamesh> it subclasses GtkNativeDialog instead, which has its own show/hide/destroy methods
<oSoMoN> jamesh, thanks, I filed https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=981309 to request comments from upstream before IÂ embark on porting the existing code
<jamesh> oSoMoN: cool.  If you do start on the port and have any more questions, I'll help any way I can.
<willcooke> does anyone know, off hand, the difference between date_last_updated and date_last_message in the LP API?
<willcooke> they can be different
<Laney> I would guess the last comment vs any update in the activity log
<willcooke> where activity could be someone assigning the bug for example?
<Laney> right, if you stick +activity on the end of a bug URL you can see it
<willcooke> ah nice one
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<willcooke> I think last_updated is probably what I need
<Laney> is that right?
<willcooke> (also: no more dupes in the output)
<Laney> win
<willcooke> well, I think someone could assign the bug to themselves, but not actually comment on it
<Laney> I mean my guess
<willcooke> ah right
<willcooke> testing...
<willcooke> yeah, looks like iot
<willcooke> it
<Laney> ð¥ for me
<willcooke> :)
<Laney> fml
<willcooke> oh?? what happened?
<Laney> different thing
<Laney> but thanks for your concern!
<Laney> laney@raleigh> dpkg --compare-versions 1.14.5-0~ubuntu18.04.1 '>=' 1.14.5 || echo no                                                                                                                                              ~
<Laney> no
<Laney> messed up a version number a bit but thought it would be ok
<willcooke> heh
<Laney> turns out it's bloody not
<willcooke> oh, thats odd
<Laney> you'd think the first one would be >= the second wouldn't you
<jamesh> "~" means before
<Laney> yes
<Laney> and 0 is basically ignored, that's what the problem is
<jamesh> So would 1.14.5 and 1.14.5-0 compare equal?
<Laney> laney@raleigh> dpkg --compare-versions 1.14.5 = 1.14.5-0 && echo yes                                                                                                                                                              ~
<Laney> yes
<willcooke> https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/testing-the-new-rls-bugs-output/11672
<willcooke> desktoppers ^  see what you think
<willcooke> sleepy face = > 7 days
<willcooke> sunglasses < 7 days
<willcooke> since it was updated that is
<willcooke> thinking about adding a tally for how many bugs people have?  Also, what about @ing people?  Too invasive?
<Laney> +1 for @ing
<Laney> I think the idea is to reply each time with a status update, so that would be helpful as a reminder
<didrocks> maybe @ing when the bugs goes from sunglasses to sleepy?
<Laney> if you're saying that sunglasses don't need reporting on then leave them out completely
<Laney> (disagree, if this is being posted on Monday morning then that's 6 days since the meeting)
<didrocks> hum, I'm a poller, but some people are pinger-needed
<didrocks> puller*
<Laney> the script broke the Ã± in TreviÃ±o
<didrocks> outrageous
<willcooke> urgh. utf8 time
<Trevinho> arggggggggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhh
<Trevinho> how dareeeee
<willcooke> :D
<Trevinho> ehhehe :)
<Trevinho> I'm not sure in how many sites I found out that I couldn't login with TreviÃ±o but I was able with Trevio xD
<Laney> does that last activity thing only count activity from the assigned person?
<Trevinho> I keep it for making sure utf is always well supported :P
<willcooke> Laney, no it just looks at the last update time
<Laney> also does it include comments?
<willcooke> yeah
<Laney> ok
<willcooke> adding a comment changes the update time. hmmm.. well I think it does, I will check
<Laney> they don't appear in +activity, that's why I'm asking
<Laney> but it looks good, nice work
<willcooke> thx :)
<Laney> if you're posting manually, can they be wiki posts then?
<willcooke> I'll look in to that, I /think/ so
<Laney> le win
<willcooke> bah, no "make wiki" button?!
<willcooke> I'll have to read up
<Laney> https://meta.discourse.org/t/how-to-create-a-wiki-post/30802
<Laney> if you're a moderator
<willcooke> yeah, that's the button which is missing
<willcooke> yet I have admin powers
<Laney> :'(
<willcooke> booo...  http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-tracking.json
<willcooke> no unicode in there ^
<jibel> could anyone with a machine with an nvme drive boot the latest eoan live cd and tell if he sees the corresponding devices in /dev/ ?
<seb128> (not me, I don't have a machine with nvme drivers)
<seb128> drives
<jibel> it's weird I see them with 18.04.2 but not Eoan
<jibel> question 2: Could someone do an installation of Eoan on a real machine with UEFI?
<jibel> the important part is uefi. In my case it fails to create the esp
<willcooke> jibel, sure thing, gimme a little while though
<jibel> willcooke, I'm using today's build
<willcooke> downloading
<willcooke> jibel, I wont be able to do an install (without a lot a faff) so let me see if I can at least see the devices first
<jibel> i'll try to reproduce in a vm
<jibel> (the uefi issue)
<willcooke> Laney, confirming - it _does_ include comments ð
<willcooke> jibel, right, going to test that UEFI thing, brb
<willcooke> brb
<oSoMoN> marcustomlinson, https://blog.documentfoundation.org/blog/2019/07/04/tdf-announces-libreoffice-625/
<marcustomlinson> oSoMoN: building in my ppa at the moment
<oSoMoN> ah, I knew you'd be on top of it already :)
<marcustomlinson> :)
<willcooke> nighty night all
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, are you still getting any issues with snap-store?
<marcustomlinson> morning robert_ancell :)
<robert_ancell> marcustomlinson, hi!
<marcustomlinson> robert_ancell: could you trigger this for me? :) https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=eoan&arch=amd64&package=libreoffice&ppa=marcustomlinson/libreoffice&trigger=libreoffice/1:6.2.5-0ubuntu1
<robert_ancell> marcustomlinson, done. I thought I might have to click something but it looks like just following the link did it.
<marcustomlinson> yeah looks good thanks!
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-07-05
<JonHanDin> Hello Desktopers, Just a quick question... I like my bash scripts (they just make life easier);  one i cant get my head around... I'm forever using Files to explore some sftp and samba share through the UI... Am i just being lazy or is there a way to call a windows from a tmerinal commmand? Many thanks
<JonHanDin> apologies, i reaslise this is for #ubuntu
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<marcustomlinson> morning oSoMoN and didrocks
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson
<oSoMoN> morning marcustomlinson
<ricotz> good morning all :)
<marcustomlinson> hey ricotz
<ricotz> marcustomlinson, hi
<oSoMoN> good morning ricotz
<marcustomlinson> ricotz: will test libreoffice 6.2.5 in eoan soon, should push to archive later this morning
<ricotz> marcustomlinson, thanks, I pick it up for the backports then
<willcooke> morning all
<Trevinho> morning!
<didrocks> hey willcooke, Trevinho
<Laney> hi there
<didrocks> hey Laney
<Laney> hey didrocks, happy friday :>
<Laney> you good?
<didrocks> I'm ok, you? :)
<didrocks> and happy friday too
<Laney> yeah not bad
<Laney> went out for dosa last night
<Laney> yum yum
<didrocks> nice
<marcustomlinson> morning willcooke Trevinho and Laney
<Laney> hey marcustomlinson
<Laney> what's the news
<marcustomlinson> newly received or noteworthy information, especially about recent events.
<willcooke> lol
<marcustomlinson> :) all good Laney, yourself?
<Laney> alexa tomlinson
<Laney> tell me a rude joke
<Laney> (all good in this hood)
<marcustomlinson> Sandpaper Sally
<marcustomlinson> jamesh knows not to ask me for rude jokes
<jamesh> Surely moving to Ireland has tempered your jokes a bit though?
<marcustomlinson> Ireland?????
<jamesh> Scotland
<jamesh> same thing
<jamesh> somewhere up north
<marcustomlinson> Yer bum's oot the windae
<willcooke> XD
<jamesh> they all sound the same
<marcustomlinson> What time is it there in New Zealand anyway?
<willcooke> ha
<jamesh> NZ and Australian accents are completely different
<jamesh> :-)
<marcustomlinson> jamesh: https://youtu.be/f2gii2nenUg
<jamesh> marcustomlinson: see? totally different.
<Laney> didrocks: can you add me to the ubuntu team on github pls? (assuming you are an admin there)
<didrocks> 2nd requests in a day, that's trendy it seems :)
<didrocks> hum, toomanyLaneys on github
<Laney> iainlane
<Laney> not sure I'll use it actually
<Laney> I was going to start a repo for 'useful scripts' with one I just wrote
<Laney> but I should probably not be lazy and contribute it to ubuntu-dev-tools instead
<Laney> /o\
<didrocks> Laney: invited
<Laney> merci
<didrocks> de rien :)
<Laney> https://github.com/ubuntu/ubuntu-scripts
<Trevinho> the project should be /ubuntu/THE-scripts :P
<Laney> ZE
<Trevinho> better indeed
<didrocks> fortunately, you can rename projects :)
<Laney> bet Trevinho has some scripts lying around
<Trevinho> mh, yeah... but recently I'm just writing all oneline in bash :P
<Trevinho> so mostly lost in my bash_history
<Laney> ð±
<Laney> I did that make-sru-tasks thing in lp-shell about 5 times
<Laney> figured the 6th makes it worth writing a script
<Nafallo> Trevinho: Telehouse East?
<Trevinho> haha
<Trevinho> Nafallo: ehm?
<Nafallo> it's a data center, called THE :-P
<Laney> :>
<Nafallo> https://goo.gl/maps/RFfgyPWqVuJk4NDJ8
<Trevinho> ahhh :)
<Laney> didrocks: any chance I can be an owner so that I can build a snap of this or is that reserved?
<didrocks> Laney: do you need to be owner to build snaps?
<Laney> via BSI, yeah
<Laney> that's what Colin just told me in #launchpad anyway
<didrocks> waow, surprising
<didrocks> but sure, let me change this
<Laney> thx
<didrocks> Laney: done
<Laney> nice one ð
<willcooke> happy weekend all, night
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-06-29
<callmepk> good morning
<pieq> Morning everyone! Hey callmepk !
<callmepk> hi pieq
<duflu> Hi callmepk and pieq 
<callmepk> hi duflu 
<pieq> duflu, you're a star, I saw the Phoronix article about your 4k fix for Gnome, and your praise on Reddit, ahah
<pieq> duflu, (and so now I know you have a 4k screen, too!)
<pieq> duflu, what scaling do you use? I've been quite disappointed with all the tests I've done: even at 200% (i.e. integer scaling), applications like Telegram and such are blurry
<pieq> duflu, the only thing I found was to stay at 100%, and pump the font scaling to 1.5 in GNOME Tweaks
<pieq> (and icons, and cursor)
<duflu> pieq, it's still pretty slow for me, but that's good because it provides a convenient test environment. I use 200% integer scaling, not fractional. But I also use very few apps so don't depend on anything that doesn't support it
<pieq> duflu, xorg or wayland?
<pieq> duflu, what IRC client do you use? I found out that hexchat did not support scaling at all (= blurry window and fonts)
<duflu> pieq, both actually. My main focal desktop is Xorg and my groovy dev machine is usually with Wayland. They have identical hardware
<duflu> pieq, actually HexChat supports 200% kind of, fine. Maybe it just doesn't support fractional
<duflu> super sharp, not blurry
<pieq> duflu, I wanted to use Polari, but then I'm facing this issue: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/polari/-/issues/118
<pieq> duflu, OK then it's weird, cause when I enable 200% on wayland, a lot of apps are blurry... I'm not sure what I've done wrong.
<duflu> pieq, Wayland scaling is different to Xorg, and fractional scaling is different to integer, and there are TWO separate implementations of fractional scaling
<duflu> pieq, HexChat is very sharp at 200% in Xorg with fractional scaling off
<duflu> pieq, you can also do fine adjustments in Gnome Tweaks > Fonts
<pieq> duflu, but "200%" scaling on Wayland is an integer scaling, right? So I should get sharp stuff for this...
<pieq> duflu, I'm not near my home desktop right now, I'll keep investigating later
<duflu> pieq, depends on the app, and Wayland will do it differently to Xorg
<pieq> duflu, what size is your screen? Mine is 27"
<duflu> Yep, 27" 3840x2160
<pieq> argh... that's too complicated (I mean the fact that different apps react differently, and the xorg/wayland thing)
<duflu> Yeah there are too many combinations
<duflu> It's a mess
<pieq> I wish we could agree upon something to use, and use it. I hope the Xorg â Wayland transition doesn't take 12 years like the Python 2 â Python 3 transition!
<duflu> pieq, actually everyone other than Ubuntu and Nvidia have transitioned
<duflu> so people are trying
<duflu> It's taking a few years for the major web browsers though
<pieq> duflu, yeah, I like how there is a dedicated workflow for Firefox on Wayland when using Fedora. I wish we had something like that in place with Ubuntu
<duflu> pieq, env MOZ_ENABLE_WAYLAND=1
<duflu> or in your /etc/environment
<pieq> duflu, yeah that's what I ended up doing
<pieq> created different desktop launchers
<pieq> and faced the super annoying issue with GNOME only showing the first 12 chars in the overview, so all my launchers are like "Firefo..." and I never know which one to run :D
<luna_> watching Wimpress and sil code the Rhino :P
<luna_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4k8LqEUxlM
<luna_> missed it live yesterday but woke up early due to the lightning strikes here in Stockholm this morning
<seb128> goood morning desktopers
<duflu> Hi seb128 
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you? had a good w.e?
<duflu> seb128, it went fast but at least I got a few things done. Been raining lots here. You?
<duflu> Good to see the post-focal bug expiries are now starting
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<seb128> hey oSoMoN, wb, did you have a good week of vac?
<seb128> duflu, w.e was nice, a bit windy and rainy but we still managed to walk around a bit
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, yeah, quite relaxing, thanks!
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN 
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<marcustomlinson> morning desktoppers
<oSoMoN> good morning marcustomlinson 
<marcustomlinson> hey oSoMoN how was your week off?
<oSoMoN> pretty good, I spent all the time with friends and family, and slept a lot more than usual
<marcustomlinson> sounds excellent
<duflu> Hi marcustomlinson 
<marcustomlinson> hey duflu
<seb128> hey marcustomlinson, wb, did you have a good of vac?
<seb128> oSoMoN, sleep sounds nice! I see that you had the laptop with you at the end :p
<marcustomlinson> seb128: was very nice thanks! lockdown eased enough for us to visit my parents a couple times. hit the beach too. nice and relaxing.
<oSoMoN> seb128, I did, and IÂ don't regret it, I poked at the nodejs/firefox update throughout the week and now I'm less stressed about it
<seb128> oSoMoN, as long as you managed to get pulled too much into work mode and properly relaxed still I guess that's fine :)
<ricotz> hey desktopers!
<Laney> guten morgen
<duflu> Hi ricotz and Laney 
<Laney> howdy duflu 
<seb128> hey ricotz, Laney, how are you? had a good w.e?
<Laney> moin seb128 
<Laney> yeah was alright, not super nice weather but not as bad as the forecast had predicted
<Laney> did some playing with networking, trying to get things in a better order before i get a new connection on friday
<Laney> hope you did too!
<Laney> why no sound? oh, I restarted, and therefore Pulseaudio forgot which output I had selected before
<Laney> :| :| :| :| :|
<seb128> w.e was alright, weather was not great but nice enough that we could go to the playground and have some fun there yesterday
<jibel> welcome to the club of PA lovers
<seb128> @sound bugs :-(
<seb128> would probably be useful to report those issues upstream
<seb128> we currently fail at deal with audio issue, it would increase chances to have someone looking at the problem
<seb128> Laney, is than hdmi that you use?
<jibel> yeah but the stack is complex and between the kernel, alsa, pa and the shell it's hard to determine where the problem is
<seb128> well, you can always take a guess, if you are wrong they will just close the bug telling you to go to $otherplace
<seb128> they might help you to figure out what the right component is :)
<duflu> "shotgunning" as my former Texan manager would say
<duflu> Which I think refers to spraying multiple locations simultaneously
<Laney> seb128: it's a usb device which gets preferred, kind of like that hdmi bug though
<Laney> because it's plugged into a usb hub on the monitor
<Laney> so it appears on the bus quite late on I guess
<seb128> Laney, https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/pulseaudio/pulseaudio/-/issues/886 ?
<seb128> bug #1877194
<ubot5> bug 1877194 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "switch-on-connect mistakes startup for USB hotplug" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1877194
<Laney> yeah probably
<Laney> I could try moving it out of the monitor to see if that makes a difference
<Laney> but then need to find a longer cable
<Laney> so not for now
<seb128> I guess it's the same issue than the HDMi one at the end, pulseaudio is not smart enough to remember your device preferences
<seb128> ideally it would have a ranking of priority and default to the one available according to the ranking
<Laney> it's doing switch-on-connect when it's not really on-connect, so yeah
<Laney> let me make a debug log and reboot
<Laney> systemctl --user --global --full edit pulseaudio!
<seb128> I don't know if it's possible to tell whether the device is showing because it has been physically connected or just picked by the usb system
<Laney> not sure what you mean
<Laney> if this comes up as a hotplug-switch to the usb audio device, that will be the bug
<seb128> I mean, does the kernel / udev gives us enough information to know why the add event has been generated?
<seb128> like can we tell appart from the OS side whether it's just the usb subsystem picking up a device already connected or if there has been a physical connect ?
<Laney> udevadm settle?
<Laney> anyway, not sure there's much value in us debating the bug in here
<Laney> I will just reply on there
<seb128> right, I was just thinking about it, sorry for the noise
<seb128> thx
<Laney> ok, reproduced without the monitor's hub in the way, better :>
<Laney> enough fiddling with that for today
<jibel> xnox, ubiquity 20.10.6 is blocked in proposed on a dependency issue. Something from d-i. Did you have a look? 
<jibel> current images are not installable with 20.10.5
<jibel> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html#ubiquity
<xnox> jibel:  interesting.
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/main-menu/+publishinghistory that has been deleted 'component of d-i which is not supported post-focal'
<seb128> someone didn't do their job of checking rdepends before deleting components from the archive
<xnox> jibel:  uploading fix.
<xnox> seb128:  it's hard to check udeb reverse-deps, no?
<jibel> xnox, thanks
<seb128> xnox, I don't know how to do that, but the fact that it's not trivial doesn't mean it shouldn't be done ... anyway, problem fixed so thanks
<Laney> something weird with arch:all packages in the new proposed-migration :(
 * Laney is trying to fix
<seb128> Laney, how is the new proposed migration going? aiming at landing it this week? any outcome of the entries that create problems to the by team report?
<Laney> what entries?
<Laney> yes this week ideally
<Laney> ah found the problem It hink
<Laney> thanks evolution for notifying me about an event 1 minute before it ends :>
<seb128> Laney, sorry, didn't see you reply, the bug ones that are leading to a #0, you said you were discussion in Debian to move them in a place where they don't confuse the current parser
<Laney> seb128: ah, I had that, it's not going to change right away so things need to handle the current format for now
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-06-30
<callmepk> good morning
<duflu> Hi callmepk 
<callmepk> hey duflu 
<seb128> goood morning desktopers
<duflu> Hi seb128 
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN 
<seb128> hey duflun lut oSoMoNn how are you today?
<oSoMoN> hey duflu, seb128 
<oSoMoN> I'm good, how are you?
<seb128> duflu, you had quite some upstream fixes landing recently, nice to see :)
<seb128> I'm alright!
<duflu> seb128, yes, a few small ones. I'm not sure what the winning formula is when others wait months or years
<seb128> small are easier to review and have less potential to strart an argument on alternatives ways to fix right?
<duflu> seb128, no the others are also small. I think it's just the interest of the reviewer. Lack or reviewers and lack of interest
<duflu> That's worse than I expected the current 'iris' mesa driver is 33% slower than the 'i965' driver it replaced
<tjaalton> duflu: where?
<tjaalton> ah, found the bug report
<tjaalton> maybe I should merge mesa
<seb128> RAOF, if you are not eod yet, any chance you review some of the desktop updates in the focal SRU queue?
<marcustomlinson> morning desktoppers
<oSoMoN> morning marcustomlinson 
<duflu> tjaalton, back :) Good morning
<duflu> Also good morning marcustomlinson 
<marcustomlinson> hey oSoMoN and duflu
<Laney> \o\
<tjaalton> duflu: you'll get mesa 20.1.2 in no time
<seb128> hey marcustomlinson, Laney, how is the island today?
<Laney> grey
<duflu> tjaalton, is that known to improve things?
<duflu> Hi Laney
<Laney> moin seb128 
<Laney> salut duflu 
<tjaalton> duflu: dunno, but that's what they'd ask to test with I bet
<duflu> I guess I was heading in that direction anyway
<marcustomlinson> hey Laney and seb128. Island weather as usual of course :)
<marcustomlinson> (an island in the Bermuda Triangle that is)
<Laney> not the weather you need to be worried about these days ...
<Laney> ð
<marcustomlinson> Oh you mean the English ;)
<seb128> :p
<seb128> jamesh, weekly summary reminder :)
<jamesh> seb128: on it.  Was just finishing off a code review
<seb128> jamesh, :-)
<tjaalton> oh sweet, mesa is syncable
 * duflu tries building master
<jibel> xnox, ubiquity is still stuck in proposed due to old udebs not being built anymore
<xnox> jibel:  AA needs to clean that up
<xnox> Laney:  your debian-cd/ubuntu-cdimage stuff is really good. it means i can locally sign CDs again, with gpg2, without doing hacks of forcing it to look for gpg1.
<Laney> xnox: cool, thanks for the feedback
<Laney> I was quite pleased to find --homedir, and ashamed I didn't know about it before :>
<Laney> I had all the --no-default-keyring stuff hardwired into my fingers
<xnox> yeah, it is nice.
<ogra> humm ... how do i make this go away ? https://imgur.com/a/u7ZXxxv ... i as greeted with it this morning when unlocking my laptop
<ogra> (seems like a gvfsd password prompt ... clicking either button does nothing and i can not move the window either )
<seb128> unsure what prompted the dialog
<seb128> bug it sounds like bug #1882481
<ubot5> bug 1824874 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1882481 undismissable, unclickable authentication dialog left on screen (top-left corner) after policykit authentication [pushModal: invocation of begin_modal failed]" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1824874
<ogra> yeah, despite being a different prompt it sounds the same
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers
<kenvandine> good morning hellsworth 
<oSoMoN> good morning hellsworth 
<hellsworth> hi guys :)
<seb128> hey Heather, Ken, USers, how are you?
<hellsworth> tired but making coffee :)
<hellsworth> how are you seb128 ?
<seb128> I'm alright!
<seb128> oh, meeting time
<seb128> I guess it's for me to chair?
<seb128> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-06-
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jun 30 13:30:59 2020 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-06- | Current topic:
<seb128> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-06-30
<meetingology> seb128: Error: Can't start another meeting, one is in progress.
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jun 30 13:31:06 2020 UTC.  
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2020/ubuntu-desktop.2020-06-30-13.30.moin.txt
<seb128> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-06-30
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jun 30 13:31:09 2020 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-06-30 | Current topic:
<seb128> sorry :p
<marcustomlinson> :)
<seb128> Roll call:  didrocks (out), duflu (out), hellsworth, jamesh (out), jibel, kenvandine, laney, marcustomlinson, oSoMoN, tkamppeter, trevinho (out), robert_ancell (out)
<oSoMoN> \o
<Laney> greetings
<marcustomlinson> \o
<jibel> ~o~
<seb128> I hope you are all doing fine today!
<hellsworth> o|
<seb128> let's get started
<seb128> #topic rls-bb-bug
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-06-30 | Current topic: rls-bb-bug
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> no desktop section
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> only assigned ones
<seb128> #topic rls-ff-bug
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-06-30 | Current topic: rls-ff-bug
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ff-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> the issues on there need cleaning out still :/ but nothing to review
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ff-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> that's in shape :)
<seb128> #topic rls-gg-bug
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-06-30 | Current topic: rls-gg-bug
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-gg-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> bug #1865226 we agreed to take iirc
<ubot5> bug 1865226 in gdm3 (Ubuntu) "gdm-smartcard pam config needs to be updated for Ubuntu and installed" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1865226
<seb128> I'm going to accept nomination and assign to Marco? (or myself tbd)
<seb128> the mysql lib sounds like something we should check
<seb128> but probably not rls target, what do other think?
<oSoMoN> probably not
<Laney> hmm
<seb128> sorry, got sidetracked checking the rdepends
<seb128> unsure why gnome-control-center is in minimal?
<seb128> but probably not something we need to debug during the meeting
<seb128> anyone in favor or rls nomination?
<seb128> if not I suggest we wontfix and move on for now
<seb128> seems not, let's move on then
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-gg-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> those are assigned
<seb128> #topic update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-06-30 | Current topic: update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<seb128> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<seb128> bbswitch / dkms we discussed previous week and is being worked on
<seb128> wslu callmepk has been iterating some MPs
<seb128> xorg-server needs work, tjaalton is that something you / foundation are tracking?
<seb128> tbd I will ask for a badtest on i386
<seb128> tracker needs a retry
<seb128> udisks2 I uploaded a fix (hopefully it works)
<seb128> others are new
<seb128> that's it
<seb128> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-06-30 | Current topic: AOB
<seb128> any other topic?
<Laney> yeah, the focal stuff
<Laney> why do we keep skipping over some items week on week?
<seb128> because we (collectively) fail to go clean those items
<Laney> they should be notfixing or what?
<Laney> I can go do it
<seb128> thx
<Laney> is that a yes?
<seb128> the ones assigned to Marco I think he said to track them
<seb128> so I think those nominated
<seb128> and the other ones wontfixing iirc
<Laney> ok
<seb128> k, anything else?
<seb128> Laney, thanks!
<Laney> also we should figure out how to start tracking actual work on rls bugs again, not sure at all how much progress is being made on them
<Laney> I reassigned that minimal bug, it's coming from net-snmp
<Laney> end of comments
<seb128> Laney, right, what's the status of the KPI?
<Laney> there will be a place to put them which is public
<Laney> did I sign up to create a metric?
<seb128> I don't think you did
<seb128> in fact I though about it some days ago and I wanted to have a look myself maybe
<seb128> but I didn't pay much attention and was unsure if the public place was ready yet or not
<Laney> okey
<seb128> doesn't need to a topic for the meeting though
<seb128> let's wrap there, we can continue to chat after :)
<seb128> thanks everyone!
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jun 30 13:53:14 2020 UTC.  
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2020/ubuntu-desktop.2020-06-30-13.31.moin.txt
<Laney> nah but getting the data working is possible to do without that (or use the private one meanwhile)
<Laney> thx
<kenvandine> :)
<oSoMoN> thanks
<seb128> Laney, did you intend to have a look? if not I'm happy to poke at those metrics
<seb128> (just checking I didn't accidentally step on your feet)
<Laney> not right away, feel free
<seb128> thx
<seb128> k, so other stupid question from me for the day
<Laney> we could have a metrics hack day once this works though, that would be fun
<seb128> that would be nice yeah
<seb128> @question, how is desktop-minimal defined?
<seb128> I guess it makes sense to have g-c-c in there since desktop without settings isn't a great experience
<Laney> technically it is a seed
<Laney> policy I don't know
<Laney> but yes I would say g-c-c should be there
<Laney> ok second half of lunch now, back soon
<seb128> Laney, enjoy!
<seb128> Laney, and thx for reassigning the net-snmp bug
<tjaalton> seb128: yes, there are some new failures which need to be resolved
<seb128> tjaalton, thanks
<seb128> jibel, ubiquity migrated bt
<seb128> w
<jibel> k, I'll try it
<seb128> Laney, k, I finally got back to fix the by team report for the new britney, I had postponed because the bugs are done in the template which isn't as easy than hacking python :p
<seb128> Laney, https://people.canonical.com/~seb128/report.html if you want to see the output generated with your current yaml and the code I pushed
<Laney> seb128: looks good
<Laney> works with both the new and the old one?
<Laney> well the URL needs to change I guess
<Laney> or path or whatever it uses
<seb128> Laney, yes, works with the old one
<seb128> Laney, what do you mean? the yaml location is going to change once the new code land?
<Laney> it's .xz
<seb128> ah ok, I though that was a temp think during your testing
<seb128> I will fix that
<seb128> Laney, do you it makes thanks to to a try/except with the new url and fallback or do we just change to be .xz when you land the update?
<Laney> falling back sounds nice to me
<Laney> one less thing to remember to change
<seb128> Laney, k, pushed some more commits with the code simplication your suggested and the url fallbacking (I tried the xz read by setting your page as an url and it works)
<Laney> seb128: you don't have to read() on the xz one?
<Laney> if that works it can probably be dropped from the other one too, I guess the for loop works on the response object directly
<Laney> and I don't like catching bare exceptions
<Laney> other than that looks good!
<seb128> Laney, k, I need to step out for diner but will do those tweaks later, thanks for the reviews!
<oSoMoN> ricotz, FYI, bug #1885743 will delay a bit the firefox 78.0 update (just the time needed to rebuild the packages and validate them)
<ubot5> bug 1885743 in firefox (Ubuntu) "Search plugins need to be updated for browser.search.modernConfig=true" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1885743
<ricotz> oSoMoN, :(
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-07-01
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<seb128> goood morning desktopers
<ricotz> oSoMoN, seb128, hey
<seb128> hey ricotz, how are you today?
<ricotz> oSoMoN, this is fun https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1649558
<ubot5> Mozilla bug 1649558 in Search "Turn off search modernisation for 78 release" [S4,Assigned]
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, en forme aujourd'hui ?
<ricotz> seb128, very good, hoping you too :)
<seb128> I'm alright thanks :)
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN, seb128, ricotz
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, hey ricotz & duflu 
<oSoMoN> ricotz, dâoh
<ricotz> oSoMoN, and they finally bumped it :\ https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/focal/+source/rustc/+bug/1876942
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1876942 in rustc (Ubuntu) "rustc 1.43 and cargo 0.44 required by firefox 79" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<ricotz> oSoMoN, you can remove the eoan task from that bug
<oSoMoN> done
<marcustomlinson> morning oSoMoN seb128 ricotz
<marcustomlinson> and duflu :)
<duflu> Hi marcustomlinson 
<seb128> hey duflu, marcustomlinson, how are you?
<marcustomlinson> seb128: pretty good thanks, you?
<seb128> I'm alright thanks
<Laney> morning!
<duflu> Hi Laney
<oSoMoN> good morning Laney 
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<marcustomlinson> morning Laney
<Laney> moin duflu oSoMoN seb128 marcustomlinson!
<Laney> doing alrighttttttt
<Laney> how's it going?
<oSoMoN> I'm a bit annoyed at having to do multiple builds and then re-validating them all for the firefox 78 release, but otherwise good
<seb128> going fine today!
<seb128> Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-archive-scripts/verdict-not-package/+merge/386000 is hopefully good now
<seb128> Laney, I tested with the old excuse, new one and with a file parameter on a local downloaded one
<Laney> nice, ship it
 * Laney pats oSoMoN :(
<seb128> Laney, could you give me an approved on the mp before I merge? so it doesn't look like I just went ahead without waiting for an ack
<Laney> done
<seb128> thx
<seb128> not really an ubuntu question but does anyone know in libreoffice calc how to a
<seb128> value = A1*B1+A2*B2+....+AN*BN
<seb128> (without using an intermediate column to store the An*Bn
<duflu> seb128, SUMPRODUCT ?
<Laney> sounds like SUMPRODUCT(A1:AN, B1:BN) indeed
<seb128> duflu, thanks, sounds like it yes
<seb128> now it gives me an Err:501 for some reason :/
<seb128> ah
<seb128> needed a ';' not ','
<seb128> it was a 508 not 
<seb128> 501
<seb128> (I wonder if that has to do with ',' being the decimal separator in french, probably)
 * seb128 didn't do any of those office stuff for years :p
<duflu> seb128, semicolon
<duflu> Oh you said that
<seb128> :)
<jibel> xnox, mwhudson could you have a look at bug 1885414 ?  
<ubot5> bug 1885414 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "ubiquity: bootloader failed on /dev/vda, ubuntu-mate groovy 2020-06-28" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1885414
<mwhudson> err
<mwhudson> what's going on there
<mwhudson> did we start seeding shim-signed?
<mwhudson> yes but a while ago: https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/+git/ubuntu/commit/?id=8ce8f842a0c396a0f8f4ac6c7b1c3bcc810f1e37
<mwhudson> jibel: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/5N9hWBQyPJ/ might fix it, but too late for me to test now
<jibel> mwhudson, i'll test it
<luna_> oSoMoN: any plans on making a deb package of todays Thunderbird release?
<luna_> https://archive.mozilla.org/pub/thunderbird/releases/68.10.0/ 
<luna_> also 70 released on Monday or Tuesday evening next week
<oSoMoN> luna_, yes, I'm working on it
<jibel> mwhudson, the fix works
<luna_> oSoMoN: nice 
<luna_> oSoMoN: ping me when there is a .deb i can test :)
<luna_> will however be in an IBM course for some hours now
<oSoMoN> luna_, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/thunderbird/1:68.10.0+build1-0ubuntu1
<oSoMoN> backports for all stable Ubuntu releases will follow shortly
<mwhudson> jibel: hooray
 * mwhudson goes to bed
<luna_> oSoMoN: nice
<luna_> watching an IBM course on Docker and Kubernetes but will update and test when its done in an hour
<luna_> oSoMoN: thanks waiting for the builds
<GunnarHj> Hi seb128, do you possibly have time to sponsor bug #1885914?
<ubot5> bug 1885914 in ibus (Ubuntu Focal) "Drop obsolete Unicode patch" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1885914
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey, sure, let me add it that to my backlog for today
<GunnarHj> seb128: Great, TIA!
<luna_> there we go
<luna_> new TB
<seb128> GunnarHj, uploaded
<seb128> luna_, you seem to really care about that update :) it's not even set on https://www.thunderbird.net/en-US/ yet
<seb128> https://www.thunderbird.net/en-US/thunderbird/68.10.0/releasenotes/ has almost no change
<luna_> seb128: yeah more changes next week tbh
<GunnarHj> Thanks seb128
<luna_> update went good
<oSoMoN> ricotz, what do you think of bug #1885903 ? the patch looks safe to drop to me
<ubot5> bug 1885903 in firefox (Ubuntu) "Unnecessary patch to cleanup old distributions" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1885903
<oSoMoN> seb128, how do I answer https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/librsvg/+bug/1884326/comments/2 ? Do we consider librsvg a core GNOME component?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1884326 in librsvg (Ubuntu Focal) "SRU the current 2.48.7 stable update" [High,Incomplete]
<oSoMoN> it is a direct dependency of gnome-shell, but it's not listed as a direct dependency of gnome-core
<seb128> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/librsvg states
<seb128> 'Librsvg is part of the GNOME platform.  Inside GNOME,
<seb128> librsvg takes multiple roles:'
<seb128> it doesn't matter much though, it's a bugfix update and we would like to update it as a SRU
<seb128> do you want me to reply to Brian on the bug?
<seb128> Laney, do you know what GNOME calls 'core' nowadays and what the standing exception is meant to cover? I've to admit it's unclear to me where librsvg stands in that regard
<Laney> seb128: I think the up to date definitions for gnome are in buildstream now: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-build-meta/-/tree/master/elements
<oSoMoN> seb128, I'll reply, thanks
<seb128> Laney, thx
<seb128> oSoMoN, thx
<Laney> the wording of the exception doesn't work properly with that
<Laney> some things are in sdk/ that should be covered by it
<Laney> e.g. dconf gjs glib gtk
<seb128> hum, I wonder if we should try to get it revisited
<seb128> or redefine what it should cover
<Laney> did someone push back on it?
<seb128> bdmurray pushed back on librsvg
<oSoMoN> Laney, yes for a librsvg SRU, see my message here 19mins ago
<Laney> ah right
<Laney> he was looking at the gnome-core package, that's a new thing to me
<Laney> something like
<Laney>   - all of core
<Laney>   - things in core-deps / sdk which are hosted under gitlab.gnome.org:GNOME/*
<Laney> ?
<Laney> and world ...
<Laney> anything hosted under GNOME on gitlab?
<seb128> GNOME category hosted would be nice
<seb128> but I guess we should raise that to the SRU team
<Laney> yeah
<seb128> I will put that on my backlog (unless someone wants to own it)
<seb128> need to step out for a bit, bbl
<Laney> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME there's some kind of weird stuff in there
<Laney> so I guess it should be core / core-deps / world / sdk / sdk-deps and hosted in there ...?
<luna_> Updating to Ubuntu 20.06 now 
<luna_> updated
<mwhudson> jibel: https://code.launchpad.net/~mwhudson/ubiquity/+git/ubiquity/+merge/386704
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-07-02
<callmepk> good morning
<jibel> morning all
<seb128> goood morning desktopers
<jibel> salut seb128 
<duflu> Hi jibel and seb128 
<jibel> hi duflu 
<seb128> lut jibel, oSoMoN, duflu
<seb128> how is desktop land going today?
<jibel> going quietly
<jibel> seb128, I've a request for you. 
<jibel> seb128, when you have time could you review https://github.com/ubuntu/kstore
<jibel> and if everything is alright, upload it to the archive. 
<seb128> jibel, I don't have access
<jibel> really
<jibel> let me check
<seb128> well, I imagine, I get an error page
<seb128> or you typoed the url?
<jibel> i thought it was public but probably did a mistake
<jibel> seb128, can you try again
<seb128> jibel, works now! I will review in a bit
<jibel> thanks. I don't know the process to have a new package in the archive, let me know if there is paper work.
<seb128> no paper work, someone with upload rights upload, then it's in the queue for an archive admin to review
<seb128> jibel, not a blocked but since you are on dh 13 you can remove debian/compat and Build-Depends on 'debhelper-compat (= 12),
<seb128> '
<seb128> =13
<seb128> that's the new way, one less file
<seb128> jibel, k, the package looks fine to upload to me
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, jibel 
<seb128> ideally someone who has upload rights does that so I can NEW (since we are not supposed to review things we upload ourselves)
<seb128> oSoMoN are you motu to do that? otherwise I guess let's wait for Laney
<oSoMoN> no, not a MOTU
<seb128> you should :p
<oSoMoN> I knew you would say that :)
<seb128> but L_aney it is then I guess for that one
<seb128> :p
<seb128> and on that note I'm stepping out for morning errands
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN 
<oSoMoN> hey duflu 
<jibel> seb128, thanks for the review, I'll fix dh version
<jibel> hi oSoMoN 
<marcustomlinson> morning desktoppers
<Laney> moin
<oSoMoN> good morning marcustomlinson, Laney 
<Laney> what up oSoMoN 
<oSoMoN> I'm good, firefox and thunderbird updates are ready, can resume other tasks
<oSoMoN> how are you yourself?
<Laney> doing good!
<Laney> got my last long weekend coming up
<Laney> then I have to remember how to work 5 days in a row
<marcustomlinson> worst
<duflu> Morning marcustomlinson and Laney
<Laney> wurst
<Laney> peace duflu 
<marcustomlinson> hiya oSoMoN duflu Laney
<seb128> hey marcustomlinson, Laney, how are you today?
<marcustomlinson> seb128: yeah ok, you?
<seb128> marcustomlinson, I wish I had an 'office day' away from noise and distractions but otherwise fine :p
<jibel> can someone upload https://github.com/ubuntu/kstore to the archive?
<jibel> Laney, ^ 
<seb128> duflu, seems like the launchpad post LTS bugs activity is finally starting to lower (at least until .1 arrives)!
<duflu> seb128, yeah I hope to see more expired bugs soon
<duflu> Though many already moved to the generic Ubuntu component so they weren't being counted already
<Laney> hello marcustomlinson seb128 jibel 
<Laney> jibel: I could, but wouldn't it be better to get a pam-ish review from someone who knows it like vorlon on the upstream part?
<seb128> cpaelzer, thanks for the ping on the pipewire MIR, it makes sense to get that going, I reassigned to ubuntu-security
<jibel> Laney, okay, i'll ask him to do a review before the upload
<Laney> thanks
<Laney> just seems to make sense to me to do it this way around, otherwise I am happy to help with button pushing
<jibel> yeah, we'll need a MIR afterwards, which will require a review again anyway
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center signed tags 8fd791d Sebastien Bacher ubuntu/1%3.36.3-0ubuntu1 * gnome-control-center Debian release 1:3.36.3-0ubuntu1 * https://deb.li/B99y
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/focal 26713c8 Sebastien Bacher * pushed 34 commits (first 5 follow) * https://deb.li/30U74
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/focal 4f53ea3 Yi-Jyun Pan po/zh_TW.po * Update Chinese (Taiwan) translation * https://deb.li/3ri1n
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/focal fdbbc2f Marco Trevisan (TreviÃ±o) debian/patches/0031-fingerprint-dialog-Don-t-limit-the-number-of-maximum.patch * account-fingerprint: Don't make flowbox children selectable * https://deb.li/asFs
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/focal 88bd021 sicklylife po/ja.po * Update Japanese translation * https://deb.li/3M7TU
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/focal 5596d65 sicklylife po/ja.po * Update Japanese translation * https://deb.li/dUbV
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/focal 24e5469 Jordi Mas po/ca.po * Update Catalan translation * https://deb.li/31fUg
<cpaelzer> seb128: yw
<KGB-2> gnome-control-center signed tags 99ecffa Sebastien Bacher ubuntu/1%3.36.3-1ubuntu2 * gnome-control-center Debian release 1:3.36.3-1ubuntu2 * https://deb.li/zOeR
<KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master 8d18617 Sebastien Bacher debian/ changelog patches/series patches/git-sound-profile.patch * https://deb.li/3vc2v
<KGB-2> * debian/patches/git-sound-profile.patch:
<KGB-2>   - sound: Stop non-interactive profile changes from triggering
<KGB-2>     changed events, fix selection issues (lp: #1885673)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1885673 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "won't auto-select input when headset is plugged and selected in pop-up window" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1885673
<KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master 9fcce04 Sebastien Bacher debian/changelog * upload to Ubuntu * https://deb.li/hcIE
<Laney> woohoo!
<seb128> :)
<KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/focal 8d18617 Sebastien Bacher debian/ changelog patches/series patches/git-sound-profile.patch * https://deb.li/3vc2v
<KGB-2> * debian/patches/git-sound-profile.patch:
<KGB-2>   - sound: Stop non-interactive profile changes from triggering
<KGB-2>     changed events, fix selection issues (lp: #1885673)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1885673 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "won't auto-select input when headset is plugged and selected in pop-up window" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1885673
<KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/focal 9fcce04 Sebastien Bacher debian/changelog * upload to Ubuntu * https://deb.li/hcIE
<KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/focal 10f0ecd Sebastien Bacher debian/ changelog patches/series patches/git-sound-profile.patch * Merge branch 'ubuntu/master' into ubuntu/focal * https://deb.li/3CXie
<seb128> wooot, udisks and new util-linux finally migrated :)
<seb128> oh, and whatever gcc installability issue was on i386 seems to have resolved, glade test retry didn't fail
<seb128> tjaalton, which means xorg-server should be ready to migrate in the next publisher :)
<tjaalton> oh nice
<luna_> Is there an Ubuntu translators meeting today or is that still not a thing anymore?
<luna_> also hellsworth new Libreoffice dropped today
<luna_> will be decided in 27 minutes if there is a translators meeting today or not
<seb128> luna_, you are on the wrong channel?
<seb128> it's desktop here, we don't have translator meeting and never had
<jibel> xnox, in BIOS mode, the graphical boot menu is gone and it's now the same text menu than in UEFI mode. Is it on purpose?
<jibel> today's build of groovy
<luna_> seb128: my Google calendar says there was one https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Meetings?action=show&redirect=TranslatingUbuntu%2FEvents%2FMeetings but yeah not been any since 2010 so guess its cancelled today too 
<luna_> but yeah its in #ubuntu-translators so yeah sorry
<seb128> :-)
<luna_> so would guess its cancelled today too as it has not been run in 10 years 
<seb128> indeed, it's likely
<seb128> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages is looking good now :)
<oSoMoN> except for bbswitch, yeah :)
<luna_> got moved to next week instead
<luna_> gonna join a Firefox and Fenix meeting and work night now however *poof*
<xnox> jibel:  https://code.launchpad.net/~xnox/debian-cd/cd-boot-images-amd64/+merge/386094 & https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/groovy-to-use-grub2-for-booting-installer-media-in-any-modes-on-all-architectures/16871
<xnox> jibel:  yes
<oSoMoN> ricotz, when you have a moment, can you please comment on bug #1885903 ?
<ubot5> bug 1885903 in firefox (Ubuntu) "Unnecessary patch to cleanup old distributions" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1885903
<Laney> ok, see you monday!
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-07-03
<jamesh> hmm. the gnome-3-34-1804 snap contains static libraries :-(
<callmepk> good morning
<marcustomlinson> jamesh: yeah thatâs wrong. pretty sure we explicitly unstaged *.a
<jamesh> marcustomlinson: I filed https://gitlab.gnome.org/Community/Ubuntu/gnome-sdk/-/issues/3 about it
<jamesh> marcustomlinson: they represent about 10% of the uncompressed size of the snap.  I don't know how much they increase the compressed size though.
<marcustomlinson> something from this list is pulling in static libs then: https://gitlab.gnome.org/Community/Ubuntu/gnome-sdk/-/blob/gnome-3-34-1804/snapcraft.yaml#L53
<duflu> Belated morning jamesh, callmepk, marcustomlinson
<marcustomlinson> morning duflu
<jamesh> hi duflu 
<jamesh> marcustomlinson: snap/manifest.yaml inside the snap shows the expanded list.  Haven't spotted an obvious culprit yet
<marcustomlinson> jamesh: oh the fix for that may only be in candidate
<marcustomlinson> I think ken wanted it to stew there for a bit
<jamesh> marcustomlinson: ah.  That makes things easier
<marcustomlinson> yeah this is why I was confused, because we fixed this precise issue 2 weeks ago :P
<jamesh> marcustomlinson: I was investigating https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/trouble-with-the-gnome-3-34-extension-possible-version-mismatch-between-the-libgtk-3-so-0-and-libpango/18618 and was confused about why tab completion was showing .a files :-)
<marcustomlinson> :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-07-05
<Spock_ncc1701> Hi guys, what are the criteria to open the captive portal browser? I have a captive portal that does not causes the browser window to open
<luna_> Watching this weeks Rolling Rhino stream now 
