#ubuntu-desktop 2008-04-14
<crevette> hello
<dholbach> good morning
<metalgod> morning
<macogw> would "it uses gio now instead of gnomevfs and includes 3 bug fixes" be a compelling reason to update an app this close to release?
<macogw> twitux 0.61 was released on gnome.org 2 months ago, and it has that plus a few nice new features over 0.60 which is currently in the repos, so i was wondering if it would be updateable or not
<macogw> er 1 month ago. i can do math, i swear
<hggdh> morning all, and a question -- what does a SIGTRAP mean on __kernel_vsyscall?
<macogw> im not sure that's a desktop question O_o
<hggdh> macogw: I know ;-) but since it happened with evolution-data-server...
<macogw> oh
<macogw> man 7 signal says SIGTRAP        5        Core    Trace/breakpoint trap
<hggdh> yes
<hggdh> on a strace?
<hggdh> and causing a kill??
<hggdh> this is bug 216936
 * macogw waits for ubotu
<macogw> oh rihgt
<crevette> bug #216936
<macogw> was just gonna /msg him
<crevette> it is asleep
<crevette> :)
<hggdh> I get timeouts on ubotu
<macogw> im waiting to see if launchpad times out in ff
<macogw> hm...well since it says Trace in the description in man signal, i'm guessing that your killing strace is that...but idk how e-d-s caught it too
<macogw> strace had detached from it already, right?
<hggdh> that's my understanding, but I was not the one stracing it
<macogw> oh
<hggdh> anyway, this is the very first I see on an unhandled SIGTRAP in the kernel
<hggdh> (huh, but still in user space)
<crevette> asac: could you commit the icon face lift for network manager ?
<crevette> ... nm-applet rather
<macogw> crevette: icon face lift?
<macogw> i wanna see!
<crevette> the icons provided by Opensus for instance
<crevette> this is tango styled icons
<proppy> ho
<proppy> Someone knows where the source of libclearlooks.so are ?
<proppy> I can't find them in the source package (gtk2-engines)
<davmor2> cjwatson has just recommend I bring this to you.  I'm part of the testing team and on a fresh install 20080411 I have no deskbar or tracker applet nor do any of the autostart apps work when you plug in a camera/pda etc.  On checking it seems that all the options in System/Prefs/Removable Drives are empty
<Hobbsee> seb128: poke
<Hobbsee> seb128: which place do i pick, or how do i otherwise get, utc time?
<davmor2> Hobbsee: london and -1hr
<davmor2> I think
<seb128> davmor2: deskbar and tracker have been removed in hardy, they were creating issues and slowing down system for no real win
<seb128> davmor2: and the camera autostart is a known issue
<davmor2> seb128: cool np's there then
<seb128> davmor2: dunno about pda
<davmor2> seb128: when I used to plug in a pda for the first time and try to sync it would run palmos devices now it doesn't I think if memory serves it's now in media selector but greyed out
<seb128> Hobbsee: good question and no idea
<seb128> davmor2: pda should still be handled by gnome-volume-manager I think
<davmor2> seb128: okay thanks for the info any idea when the camera thing will get put right?
<seb128> davmor2: whenever somebody figure what is wrong
<seb128> I've started looking at it this morning but my camera seems to have issues
<davmor2> seb128: okay thanks again :)
<seb128> you are welcome
<Hobbsee> seb128: hmm
<pochu> Hobbsee: there's 'date -u'
<cearle> hey all.  I'm wondering which is the best channel/forum to troubleshoot getting my ATI Radeon HD 2600 PRO going properly?
<seb128> cearle: what issue do you have? you can try #ubuntu+1 or #ubuntu
<cearle> seb128, vesa drivers work fine with my ATI card, but I haven't had much success configuring the fgrlx drivers manually or via envy.  I expect the logs will show up something I can't decipher.  Thx!
<seb128> you are welcome
<seb128> maybe try the radeonhd or ati driver on hardy
<mvo> seb128: can nautilus-cd-burner work with mkisofs too (in addition to genisoimage?) - if so, we should add a or-dependency to easy dapper->hardy upgrades
<seb128> mvo: let me check
<seb128> mvo: those are symlinks, right?
<seb128> mvo: no, the patch does a commands replace and not a "try one and fallback to the other one"
<seb128> -        g_ptr_array_add (argv, "mkisofs");
<seb128> +        g_ptr_array_add (argv, "genisoimage");
<seb128> etc
<mvo> seb128: hm, ok
<mvo> seb128: I noticed that a lot of tools support both, but its fine, I will debug it a bit further
<seb128> mvo: why is that an issue? the depends should just trigger the genisoimage install no?
<mvo> seb128: its fine, it seems to be a side effect of a dapper->hardy upgrade without multiverse, then mkisofs becomes obsolete and conflicts with genisoimage
<seb128> ok
<mvo> seb128: but mkisofs has a lot of rdepends and the upgrader can (depending on the packages installed) decide to hold genisoimage back (not install it) and that breaks nautilus-c-b and that u-desktp
<seb128> I see
<seb128> upgrades are fun ;-)
 * mpt scowls at seb128
<seb128> hey mpt
<mpt> That that "Sensible Browser" comes from Debian doesn't make it right :-)
<mpt> Does that mean it's not in upstream gnome-control-center?
<seb128> right, but that's the sort of thing you can have never ending discussion about and where there is no right
<seb128> no, it's not
<seb128> it's a debian and derivative thing
<mpt> So I'd need to talk to the Debian maintainer about fixing it
<mpt> I don't think it's a neverending discussion issue, it's pretty obviously wrong to suggest a program exists when it doesn't.
<seb128> you need to talk to debian changing something they use in a lot of packages and that they consider useful
<seb128> it does exist
<seb128> the sensible browser is "pick the nicer browser installed"
<seb128> it's a complex system where browsers have scores, etc
<mpt> That's not a browser, it's a behavior.
<mpt> And it's a good behavior.
<seb128> that's sort of the debian way to configure the default application
<mpt> It just doesn't need to be visible.
<seb128> it is
<seb128> otherwise how would you say to GNOME to use this setting?
<mpt> You just told me it wasn't!
<seb128> wasn't what?
<mpt> a browser
<seb128> it's the debian logic to select the default browser
<seb128> and the item is to allow people to use this logic
<seb128> otherwise they could not
<mpt> But no human actually wants to use that logic, except when they've just uninstalled the browser that was previously the default.
<mpt> Then gnome-control-center should use that logic to choose a new one, great, and *show me which one it's chosen*.
<seb128> it's not that easy
<seb128> the debian thing is there for historical reasons
<seb128> and was there before the current desktopish system
<mpt> before Gnome, you mean?
<seb128> might be, before the current preferred application selection system rather
<mpt> ok
<mpt> I suppose it gets used by people who don't use Gnome, too
<seb128> that's the debian way to choose a browser for the system
<seb128> which will be respected by command line tools, etc
<seb128> I guess it's not that used by desktop users though
<seb128> we would remove the item and tell to those command line users to just use a custom command and type sensible-browser there
<seb128> but we didn't really get complain about having it as a choice either
<mpt> so sensible-browser is a terminal command too?
<seb128> yes
<mpt> kewl
<mpt> What does it do that xdg-open doesn't?
<seb128> it's integrated to the debian system where xdg-open is not
<seb128> xdg-open is an upstream tool
<seb128> sensible-browser is a debian tool
<seb128> I think nowadays it would make sense to convert the tools to xdg
<seb128> the debian tools are often a way debian found to make things coherent and standard on the distribution when there was not upstream standard
<mpt> fair enough
<mpt> I have no problem with the terminal command still existing (though if it could be replaced by xdg-open, that would be shorter to type!)
<mpt> so, looks like I need to talk with "Marco Cabizza"
<seb128> I don't think so
<seb128> what do you want, getting the entry removed?
<seb128> or having the capplet interacting with the command line debian tools in a clever way?
<mpt> the latter
<mpt> well, both :-)
<seb128> you should better a bug on the bts if you want to talk to the maintainer
<seb128> the package is maintainer by pkg-gnome and has no real active maintainer in debian
<seb128> I'm not sure they will be wanting to spend efforts on that nor remove the entry since on debian there is likely quite some users wanting this one
<seb128> I'm not opposed to just drop the item in ubuntu if you think that's confusing for desktop users
<mpt> Well, what happens currently if you uninstall the browser that was set as the default in Preferred Applications?
 * mpt tries
<mpt> That's interesting, Konqueror is installed but it shows up in Add/Remove Applications as not being installed
<Amaranth> maybe it wants konq-kde4?
 * mpt installs galeon, awwww yeah
<Amaranth> old school
<mpt> represent
<mpt> ok, set as default...
<mpt> uninstalled...
<mpt> and Preferred Apps now says "Custom"
<mpt> still set to galeon, though
<mpt> 15:20:45@~> xdg-open http://example.com/
<mpt> Error showing url: There was an error launching the default action command associated with this location.
<mpt> Well, that's not happy.
<mpt> So if I'd had it set to "Ubuntu Sensible Browser" all the time xdg-open wouldn't have broken, but I wouldn't have been able to tell which browser it was going to fall back on, either.
 * mpt will get help later from someone familiar with reporting Debian bugs
<mpt> Thanks for your info, seb128
<seb128> mpt: you are welcome
 * seb128 grrrr a launchpad edge
<seb128> ah, no, just being confused by the ui again
<mpt> Which bit?
<seb128> somebody asked if bug #195052 is going to be fixed in hardy
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 195052 in inkscape "Latex formula does not work on Ubuntu Hardy" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/195052
<seb128> so I tried to look at the left pane to see if the package is in main or universe
<seb128> but that's an upstream bug and not an ubuntu task
<mpt> right
<seb128> so there is no such information
<mpt> You'll be pleased to know I designed a fix for that yesterday
<seb128> waouh ;-)
<seb128> what does the fix look like? ;-)
<mpt> https://launchpad.canonical.com/BugPageTwoZero?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=package-balloon.jpg (sorry, Canonical-only link)
<mpt> basically you'll be able to hover over any package name in the table
<mpt> and get a tooltip with the package info
<mpt> regardless of what context you're in.
<seb128> ah, good ;-)
<Hobbsee> mpt: can you find us plebs a screenshot?
<mpt> I had just done so
<mpt> It's now attached to bug 152878
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 152878 in malone "Source package details box hampers bug page context-independence" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/152878
<seb128> mpt: thinking about the preferred browser thing, what are the issues you want to forward to debian exactly?
<seb128> mpt: I think discussing dropping the debian sensible-browser use require quite some work, a plan of action and it's not going to be easy, we probably don't want to start on that
<mpt> seb128, (1) When I uninstall the browser that was the preferred browser, xdg-open (and opening Web shortcuts in Nautilus, etc) shouldn't break, but it does.
<Hobbsee> mpt: why do we usually care who it's uploaded by, and who the maintainer is, unless we're actually a part of ubuntu?
<Hobbsee> unless we want to email them
<seb128> mpt: right, those are GNOME bugs rather
<Hobbsee> hmm, maybe it's good enough
<mpt> seb128, (2) choosing the Sensible Browser option avoids that problem, but doing that means I don't actually get to choose which browser I use!
<mpt> So, I should be able to choose which browser I want, and have that automatically fall back to another browser (i.e., whichever sensible-browser would choose for me) when I uninstall the default.
<mpt> If that works, then there's no need for the Sensible Browser option to be shown in the menu at all
<seb128> well, sensible-browser is debian specific and I think we should remove it from the equation
<mpt> which is good, because it's confusing for it to be there.
<mpt> well, ok
<seb128> I argued to keep it only to make happy the debian people use it
<mpt> but there should be *something* that chooses a fallback when I've uninstalled the default.
<seb128> but I guess there is no real need for that on Ubuntu
<seb128> right, I'm thinking about what that something is
<seb128> the issue is that the default is written in the gconf configuration
<seb128> and the capplet is only a way to change this key
<mpt> It might be the sensible-browser code embedded into something else, e.g. xdg-open itself.
<seb128> but if we want to do dynamic adjustment we need something running all the time doing the work
<mpt> Or the uninstall scripts for all browsers.
<seb128> GNOME doesn't use xdg-open
<mpt> heh
<mpt> (There are more worms in this can?)
<mpt> Hobbsee, are you suggesting it should contain *less* information?
<seb128> we need gnome-settings-daemon or something updating the gconf key when the preferred application run away
<Hobbsee> mpt: no, i looked at my original bug
<Hobbsee> i'm assumingit's small enough not to matter :)
<mpt> I was wondering if I'd left out anything important
<mpt> seb128, in other words, it's complicated enough to need a spec, but unimportant enough that any spec likely wouldn't be implemented? :-)
<seb128> mpt: something like that
<seb128> mpt: users don't uninstall their preferred browser every day
<mpt> true, true
<mpt> And I guess even if you ran a user test asking people to change their Web browser, they'd have terrible trouble finding Preferred Applications
<seb128> easy would around would be to display a "there is no preferred browser configured" dialog with a button to open the capplet
<seb128> s/would/work
<seb128> rather than the current error
<mpt> (which may be why Apple gave up on having an Internet control panel, and gave the job of setting default Web browser to every individual browser's Preferences window instead)
<mpt> It's also a little lame that Firefox doesn't have an icon in that menu, but I suppose that's Firefox's fault
<seb128> oh, it doesn't?
<seb128> hum
<andreasn> mpt: I haven't been following the discussion at all. Is firefox missing a icon in a menu or is the firefox app icon missing in a capplet in the GNOME control center?
<mpt> andreasn, Firefox doesn't have an icon in Preferred Applications (in my installation, at least)
<seb128> mpt: ok, it's a trivial fix
<seb128> mpt: /usr/share/gnome-control-center/gnome-default-applions.xml uses "firefox" as icon name and they changed that to firefox-3.0
<andreasn> mpt: it does in mine it seems
<andreasn> ah, firefox3
<seb128> mpt: there is a gnome-control-center upload planned I'll get the fix in the update, thanks for pointing the issue
<mpt> seb128, ahhhh, the same thing happened in my panel -- I had a Firefox launcher, and its icon turned into a big terminal icon
<mpt> when I upgraded
<seb128> mpt: should we remove the ubuntu sensible browser too?
<seb128> hum
<mpt> seb128, sure, that would be great, if it's not much trouble
<seb128> alright
<mpt> People who really want it can still enter it as a custom command, can't they
<mpt> Thank you!
<seb128> mpt: yes they can
<seb128> hey walters
<walters> yo
<seb128> asac, walters: we got some bugs about the metacity behaviour change btw, one user asked on #nautilus why the spatial mode was making the tasklist blink when trying to open an already opened location, and one ubuntu user asked why unminimizing a taskbar item was not working correctly too
<seb128> so the change does has annoying side effects for users
<walters> hm, need more details on the unminimizing
<asac> you think its a regression from the patch?
<seb128> walters: change the tasks list to show the dialog on all the workspaces, and select to unminize on the current one
<walters> the nautilus is a known change, i should have listed it in the bug
<seb128> walters: then minimize something, switch workspace, and click on the tasklist entry
<seb128> it used to unminize and bring you to the corresponding workspace
<seb128> that's what I got from the user bug, I didn't verify
<seb128> asac: yes it's due to the change
<walters> ok i'll follow up on the bug
<seb128> thanks
<walters> this whole thing is such a mess
<walters> here's a random bug from someone complaining that it works the other way under KDE: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=522514
<ubotu> Gnome bug 522514 in gtk "gtk_window_present_with_time on KDE does not move window to current desktop" [Minor,Unconfirmed]
<walters> personally I'd like to change the default workspace count to 1 by default
<seb128> that would not make a really difference
<seb128> people who switch workspace now would also change the setting to have their workspaces
<seb128> but having a standard behaviour between desktops would be nice
<pitti> hi walters, nice to 'see' you again
<mvo> seb128: do you want to take care of http://paste.ubuntu.com/7002/ or should I do? (dapper->hardy)
<pitti> walters: I just did a local dbus-glib rebuild and installed the binaries; the *.h did not change at all, and gnome-panel still works; do you know how this ABI breakage manifests itself?
<seb128> mvo: if that's not too much for you feel free to do it, I'm busy on some other things right now, but I'll do it in a bit otherwise
<walters> pitti: it actually only comes up for applications which try to test for specific errors, via dbus_g_error_has_name; and this is quite rare
<mpt> seb128, I reported bug 217296 based on our discussion
<mvo> pitti: http://paste.ubuntu.com/7003/ - I have seen this in a log from a dapper upgrade, didn't we patch it to not try to reload itself? or am I misremembering something here?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 217296 in gnome-control-center "Uninstalling default browser doesn't fall back to another" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/217296
<pitti> walters: I just wondered why I could not reproduce the .h ordering change
<seb128> mvo: btw could you do the transmission-gtk menu item change and mail the translators, that was mentionned as something to change during the meeting and the sponsoring bug is assigned to you
<seb128> mvo: thanks ;-)
<walters> pitti: it varies by the version of dbus used to compile
<seb128> mpt: thanks
<pitti> mvo: I think we did that for hal
<walters> pitti: and the goal was actually for hardy that they should be the same
<pitti> mvo: but since our dbus never restarts itself, we didn't touch it so far
<pitti> walters: right, I absolutely agree on fixating the ABI
<pitti> walters: I'd just be more comfortable to find a situation where it breaks, so that I can be more confident at the fix (we need to be super-paranoid at this point of the release)
<pitti> walters: ok, thank you; I'll dig a bit deeper
<walters> pitti: if you grep through the sources for anything calling dbus_g_error_get_name or dbus_g_error_has_name you'll find things that would have broken...my intuition (though I haven't checked) is this is includes NetworkManager, the telepathy stack, and PackageKit
<seb128> walters: btw, do you know if the camera plugin action is working on fc9?
<walters> seb128: i don't...honestly I only run stable releases on my main laptop and have a sacrificial rawhide machine where i occasionally test things =)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I'll try pinging davidz about that ;-)
<mpt> "Open with [ gimp.desktop     :^]"
<mpt> What's gimp.desktop?
<mpt> The Launcher for Gimp, I suppose
<mpt> ah, I know how this happened
<mpt> I didn't know where Gimp was in the filesystem, so I dragged Gimp from the Applications menu into the filepicker
<mpt> but instead of selecting Gimp (which would have been useful), it selected the Gimp .desktop file (which wasn't)
<slomo> pedro_: ok, so a fix for the mono-program-segfault-on-exit is found now... how long until it's too late for hardy? ;)
<seb128> slomo: the sooner the better, today or tomorrow would be nice
<pedro_> slomo: great! yeah what seb128 said ;-)
<slomo> seb128: ok, tomorrow is good :)
<seb128> cool
<slomo> seb128: do i need some kind of freeze exception or can i just go ahead and upload?
<seb128> slomo: upload if that's just a bug fix and not a new version
<slomo> seb128: well, either a new version with more fixes or just this single fix ;)
<seb128> and maybe ping pitti to get his opinion ;-)
<slomo> ok
<slomo> pedro_: which is the bugreport for this? :)
<pedro_> slomo: the bug 199496
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 199496 in gtk-sharp2 "Tomboy.exe crashed with SIGSEGV in exit()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/199496
<slomo> thanks#
<pedro_> no problem :-)
<slomo> wtf, did you count the number of duplicates already? :)
<pedro_> hehe there's other reports which i didn't marked as dup of it, because there's some people arguing about getting too much email :-P
<mpt> That sounds bad
<mpt> pedro_, is there a bug reported about that?
<mpt> Launchpad's e-mail behavior shouldn't be discouraging people from marking duplicates
<tedg> mpt: Launchpad's e-mail behavior is a true problem.
<tedg> mpt: Lots of people on the Inkscape list complaining about it with the switch over.
<tedg> mpt: Launchpad needs "server-side" filtering in the form of preferences.
<mpt> tedg, are they complaining about the same problem as pedro_, or a different problem?
<tedg> mpt: If the problem from pedro_ is too much mail, yes.
<mpt> Which message types are they receiving that they don't want to receive?
<tedg> mpt: Many people have made new GMail accounts, set them to get Launchpad mail, and just have them all dead end there.
<tedg> Basically, they'd like to be in the bug control group without receiving all the mails about new bugs and bugs that they're not interested in.
<mpt> aha
<tedg> Or be able to filter it by tag or something.
<tedg> So I could say "I'm interested in filters"
<tedg> And then get info on all the bugs tagged with "filter"
<pedro_> mpt: mm haven't seen one yet, but basically is about "i can't unsubscribe in a easy way"
<mpt> ok, so three issues here
<mpt> (1) can't obviously unsubscribe when your bug was marked as a duplicate
<mpt> (bug 136570, bug 210457, bug 151101)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 136570 in malone "Can't unsubscribe from duplicates if dupe is private" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/136570
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 210457 in malone "unsubscribing from a bug with duplicates would only unsubscribe from one duplicate?" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/210457
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 151101 in malone "Users not properly subscribed to bugs when their bug is marked as duplicate" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/151101
<mpt> (2) can't subscribe to a tag
<mpt> (Bug 151129)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 151129 in malone "Can't subscribe to a tag" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/151129
<tedg> I think you're looking from the positive instead of the negative.  "Ignore all tags except" would probably be more useful.
<mpt> and (3) can't be a bug supervisor without getting mailed about every damn bug report
<mpt> I don't think #3 is reported, actually.
<tedg> It would probably be easier to have an "expert field" where I can put "+filter -ugly +bob +alvin"
<tedg> But that would have to be per-project as different projects use different tags.
<mpt> Well, that's even more complex than subscribing to a tag
<mpt> That's subscribing to a *search* :-)
<tedg> Yes, I guess if you can unsubscribe all, then subscribe back that'd work too.
<tedg> Kind of a "#3 #2 #2" type of thing.
<tedg> In general, I'd say subscribe to inkscape-devel and start a thread that's "What's wrong with Launchpad mail?" -- you'll get some replies :)
<tedg> Personally, I think the e-mails need more information in them.  I'm not sure what yet.
<tedg> I'm thinking perhaps my last comment on the bug.
<tedg> The reality is that when I get the mails, they're very much out of context, so I end up having to review what is going on before I can made a decision about whether the e-mail is useful or not.
<mpt> reported bug 217337
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 217337 in malone "Bug supervisors shouldn't be compulsorily subscribed to all bug reports" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/217337
<slomo> seb128: ok, uploaded it now already... does ubuntu's dak accept changes files with version 1.8? :)
<tedg> mpt: Thanks.
<slomo> ok, it does
<slomo> pitti: please accept gtk# and gnome#, thanks ;)
<seb128> slomo: no idea about the version thing ;-)
<cody-somerville> pedro_, ping. Please don't unassign bugs that I assign to myself. :) (sorry if you're the wrong person).
<pedro_> cody-somerville: context bug 203183 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 203183 in nautilus "Hang on network operations" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/203183
<cody-somerville> Yes.
<pedro_> cody-somerville: ok no problem, will change it to confirmed then since you'll be working on it, i don't like to have a lot of bugs on new status
<cody-somerville> Okay, you could mark it in progress if you'd like
<pedro_> sure, thanks for raising it :-)
<cody-somerville> Thanks :)
 * cody-somerville hugs.
<Amaranth> alex-weej: tempted to set https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/217404 to Won't Fix just because you should know better :P
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 217404 in compiz "Compiz locks up occasionally" [Undecided,New]
<alex-weej> Amaranth: why? :(
<alex-weej> i can't get a trace till i'm back in london!
<alex-weej> i don't have another computer!
<alex-weej> or is it a popular dup? LP didn't suggest one :(
<Amaranth> alex-weej: you just said you can ssh in and kill compiz to 'fix' it
<Amaranth> need you to do that to the ati machine
<alex-weej> ok, will try it tomorrow
<alex-weej> i have been getting this for weeks
<Amaranth> need to attach gdb and see what compiz is doing
<alex-weej> just never bothered to really try and do anything about it till today
<alex-weej> so you've not seen any other reports of this?
<Amaranth> if you try to show me using the nvidia machine it'll end up doing something i can blame the nvidia driver for :P
<alex-weej> i thought maybe some other people may be getting it, as i was getting it on 2 different machines with 2 different drivers and 2 different archs
<alex-weej> ok, well we'll see tomorrow :>
<Amaranth> other people get it but they can't help with it or they have an obvious nvidia bug
<seb128> re
<alex-weej> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/217404
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 217404 in compiz "Compiz locks up occasionally" [Undecided,New]
<Amaranth> I seem to get a lockup about once every other week but usually on pressing alt-sysrq-k to kill X the whole system freezes so I can easily blame nvidia
<alex-weej> Amaranth: ever tried to fix it by killing compiz instead?
<alex-weej> sysrq-k works for me too
<alex-weej> but i don't like losing data :p
<Amaranth> yes, then X is still broken and see above
<alex-weej> oh right sorry i misread
<alex-weej> on ati, i can kill X and get back to work
<alex-weej> at least i think so
<Amaranth> haven't had a lockup killing X could solve since gutsy was in development :)
<Amaranth> well, no, i've had a couple
<alex-weej> though now that i tink about it, i get the evil dotted lines occasionally. my memory sucks, let's try with real evidence rather than my own anecdotes tomorrow
<Amaranth> remember, ati machine
<alex-weej> i'll do both, they crash often enough :p
 * alex-weej swears at depressed Show Desktop button
<alex-weej> do we know what the problem with the show desktop plugin is?
<seb128> cody-somerville: why should be keep bugs without the required informations open? they cluter the list and you can reopen when you debug the issue
<cody-somerville> Because seb128 closed bugs disappear off the list.
<cody-somerville> And a bug is a bug!
<cody-somerville> If you're too lazy to do the legwork yourself, don't close the bug. Just wait. It isn't a race to close as many bugs as possible.
<seb128> cody-somerville: that's not how the bug tracker works, or we would never close bugs and let thousand of "doesn't work" bugs open just because bugs are bugs
<cody-somerville> Some bugs do deserve to be closed.
<seb128> cody-somerville: I'm not lazy, you are just the only one to get the issue
<cody-somerville> I don't think a majority of users use the features extensively as I do
<seb128> and I'm not sure that insulting me is going to lead you somewhere
<cody-somerville> seb128, I'm sorry, that wasn't a person insult.
<seb128> that was
<cody-somerville> *personal
<cody-somerville> Or certainly wasn't intended.
<seb128> calling me lazy must be a joke
<seb128> do you really think I'm slacking the whole week?
<cody-somerville> I used you're in a third person
<cody-somerville> and I have no doubt in my mind that you're equally as busy as I am
<seb128> do you have an idea of how many thousand bugs we have assigned to the desktop components?
 * marnanel does the "omg" linguist hand to forehead gesture
<Amaranth> alex-weej: no idea what the problem is, i can't reproduce easily
<Amaranth> s/easily/at all because i don't use showdesktop/
<alex-weej> i don't wanna lose windows now
<alex-weej> but
<seb128> cody-somerville: this bug is of no use, nobody else complained about it, there is no stacktrace, you have been asked those informations one month ago and didn't reply, I don't know why we should keep this bug on the desktop issues list if it's of no use
<alex-weej> i think you can catalyse it by activating showdesktop, revealing the desktop (so the windows slide off the screen) then while you're in that state, disable show desktop
<alex-weej> all hell breaks loose
<cody-somerville> seb128, Because the issue does occur and I will get around to addressing it. Furthermore, could you please define what the "desktop issues list" is and what puts a bug on or off of it?
<seb128> cody-somerville: the list is all the non closed bugs on any desktop component
<seb128> cody-somerville: I'm changing it back to incomplete because it really lacks informations
<cody-somerville> I don't mind if it is in progress or new or incomplete
<cody-somerville> However, what I was looking to have was the bug assigned to me so that it is on my todo list.
<seb128> alright
<seb128> pitti: around?
<alex-weej> seb128: pulseaudio is default on hardy now, right? well ALSA still isn't using it by default. which is bad.
<alex-weej> basically, if a PA-using app is using sound
<alex-weej> all ALSA apps will fail
<alex-weej> unless you have hw mixing
<alex-weej> we need to enable the alsa plugin for pulse
<alex-weej> and then deal with all the bugs
<alex-weej> or just throw pa out :/
<seb128> alex-weej: I know almost nothing about sound but yes pulseaudio is used by default
<alex-weej> and we're in freezes now daaaamn
<alex-weej> i'm always too slow with this
<ajmitch> sigh, bugs that show up on the first boot after upgrade, but not subsequently
<seb128> hey ajmitch
<seb128> ajmitch: it has been a while, how are you?
<ajmitch> is it a nautilus bug that all the saved network locations I had from gutsy disappeared?
<ajmitch> good, how are you?
<seb128> alex-weej: what applications are broken? it should not be worst than esound was
<seb128> ajmitch: busy but good otherwise, thanks ;-)
<seb128> ajmitch: yes, nautilus switched to gvfs which is a totally new library and so don't know about gnomevfs links and nobody wrote migration code to change to bookmarks or something
<alex-weej> seb128: the difference was esound used ALSA dmix, PA doesn't use dmix
<ajmitch> ugh
<seb128> alex-weej: any reason why it doesn't?
<alex-weej> seb128: maybe it does... but i think lennart would have a lot to say if it did.
<alex-weej> dmix is basically doing what pa is supposed to do
<alex-weej> but pa does it better (apparently)
<alex-weej> let me test...
<ajmitch> oh well, it's better than the first boot after upgrade which I sadly can't reproduce - gnome-settings-daemon failed to start, desktop background was black with no icons. But since I can't reproduce it, I can't really file a bug :(
<alex-weej> seb128: ERROR: from element /pipeline0/alsasink0: Could not open audio device for playback. Device is being used by another application.
<alex-weej> PA definitely hogs the ALSA device
<alex-weej> which is fine, as the intention is that ALSA uses the "pulse" plugin to route ALSA audio via pulse instead
<alex-weej> but we're not doing it
<alex-weej> i will open a report
<seb128> ok
<Amaranth> alex-weej: I'll mark it high and milestone it so someone who knows what is going on looks at it :)
<alex-weej> Amaranth: it's already reported, i'm just cleaning it up now
<alex-weej> one sec
<alex-weej> Amaranth: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/198453
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 198453 in pulseaudio "Default ALSA device must use PulseAudio, otherwise ALSA applications may fail" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<alex-weej> also can you remove the pulseaudio bug-tracker link? that's to do with skype, which is not relevant
<alex-weej> or can i do it?
<alex-weej> i can't see how
<Amaranth> i'll do it
<alex-weej> seriously, this aint the first time i've tried to do it and gotten lost
<alex-weej> is it actually possible for normal peons to do it?
<Amaranth> i dunno
<seb128> alex-weej: you can't delete tasks no, just change them to invalid
<Amaranth> You used to be able to change the project they apply to as well but this one won't let me
<Amaranth> I usually moved them to the 'Obsolete Junk' project so I'd stop getting email :)
<seb128> you can make the task track no watch
<seb128> and then change the settings
<Amaranth> yeah, i changed it to no track but i still can't do anything but change it to invalid
<Amaranth> which is fine here as i'm not getting email for the pulseaudio project
<alex-weej> thanks travis
<alex-weej> i think, in general, we should be paying much attention to that PerfectSetup page
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-04-15
<seb128> pitti: hey
 * pitti hugs seb128 good morning
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> hey Amaranth
<Amaranth> hey seb128
<seb128> pitti: do you have a minute to discuss this camera autoplug action thing?
<pitti> seb128: typing a mail ATM, but sure
<seb128> pitti: so the issue is due to the fact that the gvfs gphoto backend is not used
<seb128> pitti: nautilus relies on finding a DCIM directory on the device to know that photos are there
<seb128> pitti: but if it can't mount it, it doesn't know if the directory is there
<seb128> pitti: we have 2 ways to fix that I think, one is to implement some other logic in nautilus (looking at the device capabiliy fir example), the other one is to use g-v-m again
<seb128> pitti: any opinion on that?
<seb128> pitti: if we use g-v-m we ideally should do some changes to nautilus anyway because at the moment it displays some "start photo manager" button on photo locations which doesn't work when clicked
<Amaranth> hey mvo
<mvo> hey Amaranth!
<seb128> hello mvo
<mvo> hey seb128
 * mvo yawns
<pitti> hey mvo
<mvo> hey pitti
<pitti> seb128: ah, I see; that makes sense
<pitti> seb128: my gut feeling is that we should do the following:
<pitti> - enable f-spot in g-v-m again, since it fits better into the g-v-m hw category of digicams, scanners, and photo cameras
<pitti> - disable the default program setting in the nautilus pane
<pitti> that should be easy, and we know that g-v-m works
<seb128> ok, deal
<pitti> seb128: WDYT?
<pitti> ah
<seb128> can you do the g-v-m part? I'll do the nautilus one
<pitti> sure, absolutely
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<pitti> seb128: shuold we entirely disable the widget? or just the gconf thing?
<seb128> what widget?
<pitti> the nautilus photo program selector
<seb128> pitti: mask the widget for now I would say
<pitti> seb128: sounds good and less confusing
<pitti> seb128: that's hopefully just a tiny patch to the .glade?
<seb128> I didn't look at it yet but yeah, should be trivial
<seb128> hey dholbach
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> hi seb128
<mvo> hey dholbach!
<dholbach> hiya mvo
<Amaranth> hey dholbach
<dholbach> hey Amaranth
<asac> seb128: do you know any french translator?
<seb128> asac: what do you need exactly? I'm an occasional translator and I talk to some of the french team guys by mail or on IRC sometimes
<asac> seb128: french folks are lame confirming suggestsions for firefox-3.0 and xulrunner-1.9
<asac> seb128: its basically going through the untranslated strings and confirming the existing suggestions
<seb128> asac: they refuse to use rosetta to translate it
 * crevette is occasionaly translator as well
<asac> seb128: ? no ... they are just slow ;)
<seb128> they have a "don't translate on rosetta things which have an upstream translation team"
<seb128> I exchanged mail with them some days ago
<asac> https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+lang/fr
<seb128> for firefox3 they say it has an upstream team and they have no reason to fork the work
<crevette> asac, don't forget the icon patch for nm-applet btw
<asac> seb128: we need a bit duplication in order to produce innovation here
<seb128> asac: they refuse to do it, I had the discussion some days ago
<asac> ok
<seb128> they say that leads to work duplication, conflict with upstream, etc
<seb128> I can understand from where they come
<asac> seb128: we import upstream translations
<seb128> we had too many issues with GNOME because ubuntu forks translations
<asac> seb128: its about "confirming" the ones that have ambiguities
<seb128> and ubuntu has less control quality
<seb128> and the ubuntu translation take over the upstream ones
<asac> true
<asac> that needs to be sorted in the long run
<asac> how to properly ensure quality and give back translations
<seb128> well, they sorted it by deciding that ubuntu translators should only touch things which are ubuntu specific
<asac> i think thats not the vision of rosetta ;)
<seb128> and I got the impression that the coordinator would rather quit than sort translations upstream things
<asac> the vision is to take over universe :)
<seb128> right
<seb128> but I don't want to go to the clash with the french team and have them stop doing any rosetta work
<asac> seb128: the launchpad team coordinator?
<asac> seb128: sure
<seb128> yes, for the french team
<asac> ok i understand the french status then ;)
<asac> thanks for clarifying
<seb128> you are welcome
<asac> i think we need to work on procedures that allow us to translate in rosetta
<Amaranth> mvo: bzr-buildpackage keeps failing to apply the patches i added but if i extract the tar.gz myself and run quilt push -a it is fine
<Amaranth> and of course it never says _why_ it failed
<Amaranth> oh, because the file doesn't exist
 * Amaranth stabs bzr
<Amaranth> mvo: no luck on a11y stuff :/
<seb128> asac: epiphany-browser still crash in xulrunner at closing, I'll annoy you again after 8.04 to get that fixed for 8.04.1 ;-)
<seb128> hey pedro_
<pedro_> bonjour seb128
<jcastro> seb128: I still need a desktop session (or two if you want) for openweek.
<seb128> jcastro: when is that?
<seb128> sorry I've been swamped in work recently
<jcastro> it starts on the 28th
<jcastro> yeah, I know how you feel. :D
<jcastro> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOpenWeek/Prep
<jcastro> if you just want to add youself or someone from your team
<jcastro> just add it in
<seb128> ok, will do that
<asac> seb's gone :/
<crevette> I'm sure he'll come back one day :)
<asac> crevette: so what was the applet branch?
<crevette> branch,...
<asac> with the new icons?
<crevette> you mean patch
<crevette> :)
<crevette> :p
<asac> i cannot apply patches anymore nowadays ;)
<crevette> you would have prefered I create a bz branch on lp ?
<asac> crevette: sure. thought i said so ;)
<crevette> I can try tomorrow morning
 * crevette is not a hacker
<seb128> mvo: the codec installer should not ask you if you want to install or remove extra softwares, do you have a bug about that already?
<asac> crevette: bug id at hand?
<seb128> bah, firefox and openoffice are the suck, everything else is nicely translated
<asac> seb128: tell pitti to upload the langpack today not after RC:)
<crevette> asac, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-applet/+bug/210449
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 210449 in network-manager-applet "GNOME icons for nm-applet" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<asac> seb128: i plan to upload manually most important langpacks today
<pitti> asac: tell Rosetta to give me an export today, and tell the buildds to actually work
<seb128> asac: ok, thanks
<asac> no idea if fr is important ;)
<pitti> asac: without buildds, there's nothing we can do, sorry
 * seb128 slaps asac
<seb128> perfect timing from is to move those apparently
<pitti> and even with full buildd power, it takes about a day to build them all
<asac> pitti: hehe :) i think the latest delta already has the proper xpi/
<asac> pitti: yeah. thats ok. we already discussed that ;). ill go the manual way for those on CD at least
<pitti> what's so bad about uploading them post-RC?
<pitti> people who install RC can upgrade immediately
<asac> pitti: no idea ;) ... i would just feel safer to get positive feedback in RC :)
<pitti> and the final will be fine
<seb128> asac: wasn't the startup page also translated? or is that also pending on language packs updates?
<asac> seb128: no thats independent. however it depends on which translation you have in UI :)
<asac> seb128: so yes, if you don't have a translated firefox you won't see your homepage
<seb128> ah, that's a shame
<seb128> it should depend on the locale
<seb128> because I've the translated version installed
<asac> seb128: http://releases.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/firefox/releases/3.0b3/linux-i686/xpi/
<asac> seb128: no it depends on the Accept-Language, which depends on the language displayed in ffox
<seb128> "Firefox prevented this site ..." wth?
<asac> seb128: you have the translated version installed?
<mvo> seb128: I don't think so, what does it ask exactly?
<asac> seb128: you mean "translated desktop" ?
<asac> seb128: sorry the url is old
<seb128> mvo: I'm trying the daily CD, I double clicked on a mp3, got the easy codec install thing, installed the required plugin and then I get this dialog asking if I want to install or remove extra softwares
<asac> its http://releases.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla.org/firefox/releases/3.0b5/linux-i686/xpi/
<asac> (for b5)
<mvo> seb128: oh? hm, could you put a screenshot somewhere? I think I know what it is, but just want to double check
<seb128> asac: I've no been following the changes this cycle so I'll just shut up on that, the localized about ubuntu pages used to be shipped in the same package as the ubuntu documentation
<seb128> mvo: sure
<asac> seb128: it still is. but it always dependened on the locale installed in ffox
<seb128> ok
<seb128> one other reason to prefer epiphany-browser ;-)
<asac> the new solution is even less dependent on language packs because we don't have to patch them anymore :)
<asac> seb128: you can go to preferences -> content -> choose preferred languages for display
<asac> and set fr there
<asac> its just that that is usually the one displayed in UI
 * asac hopes it works at all
 * asac trying
<seb128> re
<seb128> arg pidgin as IRC client
<seb128> did somebody wrote something just before I closed the tab? ;-)
<crevette> no
<crevette> seb128, what about xchat-gnome ?
<seb128> crevette: I've doing CD testing and there is no IRC client installed
<seb128> s/I've/I'm
<crevette> ah
<crevette> there is irssi from what I remember
<crevette> :)
<seb128> and pidgin ;-)
<asac> works for me :)
<seb128> brb, rebooting to the normal system
<seb128> mvo: http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/codecsinstall.png
<seb128> show also a bug between compiz and the screenshoter
<seb128> no decorations
<seb128> asac: btw did you really conflict on j2re1.4-mozilla-plugin or is that a typo in the changelog?
<mpt> My favorite screenshot+compiz bug is where the screenshot window doesn't finish flying away before the screenshot is taken
<asac> seb128: ? am i missing something ?
<Amaranth> mpt: screenshot should wait longer :)
<seb128> asac: the changelog mentions j2re1.4-mozilla-plugin but that's j2re1.4 which creates the issue
<asac> i thought that this is the conflict you wanted me to add :(
<seb128> asac: I told you J2re1.4 no?
<asac> j2re1.4
<asac> j2re1.4-mozilla-plugin
<asac> thats the same?
<asac> i mean ... its certainly the mozilla-plugin that causes this?
<seb128> no
<seb128> I removed j2re1.4 on the boxes where I had the issue
<mvo> asac: I just tried to reproduce the issue you reported with apturl, it seems to work fine for me and does not ask me to enable multiverse
<seb128> I never had the mozilla plugin package installed
<mvo> asac: where do you see this?
<asac> mvo: when install flash through plugin installer wizard in ffox
<mpt> Amaranth, sure, but how is it supposed to know how long to wait? Needs to be an API for it :-)
<asac> seb128: sorry. i don't understand how that can be. what does firefox have to do with plain runtime?
<Amaranth> mpt: It could always size its window to 0,0 instead of closing it
<asac> i saw the backtrace and it happened when initializing the java plugin
<asac> but i can take a look again
<mvo> asac: on a fresh install?
<seb128> asac: well, I've no idea, I just know that uninstalling J2re1.4 fixes the issue
<asac> seb128: that will remove the plugin too
<seb128> asac: easy enough to trigger, install j2re1.4, open epiphany-browser and go to about:plugins
<seb128> asac: I didn't have the plugin installed, I just grepped dpkg.log
<seb128> nothing else has been removed
<asac> bug #214468
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 214468 in xulrunner-1.9 "[removal request] Remove all java 1.4 bits from hardy (Was: Epiphany crashes inside xulrunner when j2re1.4 is installed)" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214468
<mvo> asac: I can not reproduce this here on a fresh install
 * mvo tries harder
<asac> seb128: #133 0xb1377525 in CPluginServiceProvider::QueryService () from /usr/lib/j2se/1.4/jre/plugin/i386/mozilla/libjavaplugin_oji.so
<asac> thats from the stack
<asac> so either the mozilla-plugin is a hoax or ... i don't know :(
<asac> mvo: do you use plugin finder?
<asac> seb128: let me download the j2re package and see if there is such a file in
<seb128> asac: http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?searchon=contents&keywords=libjavaplugin_oji.so&mode=exactfilename&suite=gutsy&arch=any
<asac> seb128: ok sorry.
<seb128> that's alright
<seb128> sorry for not being clear
<mpt> Amaranth, sure, but then there might be (probably should be!) an animation for resizing too
<seb128> asac: maybe you can quickly get a new revision accepted since the other one is not building yet ;-)
<Amaranth> mpt: that's a toolkit thing
<asac> well. it was one of the things where i wouldn't have understood even if you wrote it in bold letters ;) it auto translated to the -plugin package in my head
<seb128> Amaranth: do you know what causes the "no border on screenshots" issue?
<Amaranth> and i'm sure gtk will let you disable it if it ever grows support
<Amaranth> seb128: the screenshot tool doesn't handle a WM that doesn't reparent
<seb128> Amaranth: would that be easy to fix?
<mpt> Amaranth, it could be either, though I agree doing it at the toolkit would look better
<mpt> well
<mpt> Not necessarily look better, but be faster, because the toolkit could be smarter about skipping pixels if it was going too slowly
<Amaranth> seb128: no, the screenshot tool needs to grow support for the other half of the spec :)
<seb128> Amaranth: hum, k, any other nice screenshooter around we could use? ;-)
<Amaranth> mpt: Do you know the technical reason why resizing looks so bad right now?
<Amaranth> mpt: You don't want the WM to do animated resize :P
<Amaranth> seb128: no idea, i take whole screen screenshots and crop them in gimp
<seb128> ok
<asac> seb128: ok building new sources
<asac> seb128: +Conflicts: j2re1.4
<asac> thats right?
<mvo> asac: my bad, have it now
 * asac confused ;)
<asac> mvo: if i press "No" i also get a return code 0
<asac> no idea if you still have that in your mind
<seb128> asac: thanks!
<seb128> asac: yes
<seb128> mvo: did you see my screenshot?
<mpt> Amaranth, no, I thought it was a deliberate (though weird) design choice
<mpt> What's the reason?
<mpt> Every time I resize a window I get a nostalgia rush for the early '90s
<asac> seb128: ok uploaded. can you approve? (http://paste.ubuntu.com/7119/)
<seb128> pitti: ^
<Amaranth> mpt: The jerkiness is caused by a couple things. Main one is that the WM is not the same process as the app and they communicate asynchronously via X. Other one is that resizing is slow :P
<Amaranth> But #1 is a big reason why #2 is true
<mpt> So how will that be fixed?
<Amaranth> in compiz we have outline resize because it beats the hell out of the CPU and GPU doing regular resize and because it causes problems with fglrx+Xgl
<Amaranth> well, Qt fixed it by only using one X window for each window you see on the screen
<Amaranth> instead of separate X windows for every button and etc
<Amaranth> so only one window to keep in sync
<mpt> Did Windows 98 and Mac OS X 10.0 do the same?
<mpt> Or did they just not have a protocol as slow as X?
<Amaranth> no, in those OSes the application draws its own window decoration
<Amaranth> so resize is kept in sync
<mpt> aha
<Amaranth> and in OS X all drawing it locked to vblank
<mpt> vblank?
<Amaranth> s/it/is/
<Amaranth> the refresh rate of your monitor
<Amaranth> 60Hz is 60 fps, etc
<mpt> So could GTK do the same as Qt?
<Amaranth> we can sync to vblank for OpenGL stuff but not for Xv or regular X drawing
<Amaranth> it could but it would be a huge chunk of work
<Amaranth> but the infrastructure is slowly getting into place, it seems
<mvo> asac: both issues are fixed in bzr, I check the race with the first apt-get update now
<asac> mvo: did you look into apturl unnecessary updating caches or something at startup?
<asac> it always does a lot of rumbling ... that i don't really understand :(
<mvo> asac: it has to open the cache, no way around it to check if the package is installed, I can check if I can make it quicker
<asac> mvo: dpkg -l would be really quick
<asac> compared to what we have right now
<asac> seb128: totem 'http://anytime.tv4.se/webtv/metafile.asx?MSG=mc1lSbUlityW0cJiqRrJ(xfyWIKhyDr4FyDJrUewlu8RtZiUhdDWyxd8hFg3ymUtqZas4oE1y6ft2I)1FlATFCALGsAD8kTOICOIvr72a0c!'
<asac> that makes totem hang once the missing codec is installed (and on subsequent startups)
<asac> no idea if you care ;)
<seb128> asac: weird, I get a message saying the ressource is not available
<mvo> asac: time apturl apt:2vcard until the dialog pops up is 1,5s for me - not great, but not that bad either
<mvo> asac: do you see something different?
<asac> seb128: hmmm maybe temporary then
<asac> nevermind
<asac> mvo: i don't mean the time before the dialog popsup, but the time it takes after you confirm before it starts to download and install
<asac> anyway, i think nothing we can fix in hardy. i guess the idea would be to test if its downloadable and only if that fails update cache
<asac> crevette: the nm-applet icons look identical except the connect spinning
<asac> i don't see a difference at least
<asac> seb128: is it consense that we want the new NM icons?
<seb128> asac: I've no been following this issue and didn't try those but I think that people who commented liked those better yes
<seb128> you should ask kwwii and mpt about it rather
<asac> crevette: can you please confirm that the normal icons are not affected by this? that its just the spinner during connect that changed?
<asac> kwwii: mpt can you please give a go for the new NM applet icons?
<kwwii> asac: erm, what exactly does that mean?
<kwwii> I know that NM applet has it's own icons, nothing much more than that
<asac> kwwii: bug 210449
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 210449 in network-manager-applet "GNOME icons for nm-applet" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/210449
<asac> kwwii: i have this request to apply the new, better gnome icons.
<andreasn> the issue is still being discussed with the upstream maintainer I think
<asac> yeah most likely
<dholbach> UI FREEZE! :)
<seb128> dholbach: who cares? ;-)
<andreasn> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=504822
<ubotu> Gnome bug 504822 in nm-applet "Use GNOME updated style for icons" [Enhancement,Unconfirmed]
<asac> dholbach: i think the desktop team meeting back a week or two voted in favour of those icons. but i lost all documentation
<kwwii> asac: lol, looking at a debdiff does not necessarily give me an idea of what the icons look like :p
<asac> kwwii: yeah i know
<seb128> asac: I think you discussed this on this can and kwwii said those were better but I'm not sure either
<asac> kwwii: but UU encoded icons should be readable for artists :)
<seb128> s/can/chan
<seb128> crevette: around?
<asac> kwwii: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=102117
<crevette> seb128, yep
<asac> i think those are the ones ... but i still have to figure out if they are really the ones i have in this patch :)
<kwwii> asac: yeah, found that, checking it out
<mpt> asac, what do you mean by "give a go"?
<crevette> you're lucky I've just arrived
<asac> crevette: can you please verify that only the spinning icon has changed?
<seb128> crevette: can you reply to asac quesiton?
<kwwii> andreasn: I assume you think you should take the new gnome icons, right?
<crevette> ah
<asac> mpt: sign off that we prefer those over the official upstream ones
<kwwii> andreasn: the connecting animation int he current set is simply ugly
<mpt> asac, where are they?
<asac> mpt: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=102117
<crevette> asac, there is more than the spinning if I remember correctly
<crevette> I can't look at the list right now unformtunetely
<asac>  crevette then tell me which. the patch you gave me doesn't change anything else for me
<asac> hmm
<crevette> I should have the file around here (I'm at work on windows)
<andreasn> kwwii: I'm not sure what to do exactly. The current green lights don't give me any clue at all what's happening exactly, but I know it's doing something when it takes a long time...
<asac> crevette: the ones you have me definitly are completely different than the ones in the bug above
<asac> i am lost
<andreasn> kwwii: apart from that, it would make very much sense to use the spinner from the selected icon theme
<asac> andreasn: i think thats beyond the scope what can be done here
<asac> for hardy
<kwwii> andreasn: yeah, ideally that would be best
<mpt> asac, they look good to me
<mpt> well
<mpt> they look like an improvement, anyway :-)
<asac> kwwii: well the spinner should at least give more info than just that something is happening. no idea if users would understand that its actually connecting somewhere
<asac> mpt: yeah :) ... no i just have to figure, why the patch i got doesn't ship those at all
<kwwii> asac: true, it is more than a simple spinner
<kwwii> asac: I think that the gnome icons are a definite improvement (although the wired device icon seems somehow wrong to me)
<andreasn> I don't think it picks up the wired device icon, it takes that from the theme (I think?)
<andreasn> so that tar.gz might be shipping a few too many pixmaps than are actually used
<pitti> asac, seb128: xul looks ok
<seb128> pitti: thanks
<asac> pitti: thanks
<asac> andreasn: yes. thats what i see here. no change for the wired device icon
<asac> andreasn: same goes for wireless signal strength icon
<asac> no change
<asac> no idea if it makes sense to apply something that just changes the spinner ... and that spinner is not even in the upsream bug
<kwwii> I think that changing the spinner is worth it
<kwwii> the current blue gree thingy with the dots makes little snese
<kwwii> of course, if we had 2D system-try-thingy icons it would be even better :-)
<andreasn> mpt: how does other systems solve the lack of feedback during the time it takes to connect to a wireless network?
<mpt> andreasn, OS X slides the Airport icon (and therefore all icons to its left) to the left, shows a scrolling marquee of the network name to the right, then removes the marquee once the connection is finished
<mpt> looks a bit crappy really
<mpt> I don't know what Vista does
<andreasn> marquee?
<asac> kwwii: for me the spinner submitted doesn't really look better
<asac> at least not more meaning full
<mpt> andreasn, copy and paste this into Firefox's URL bar: data:text/html,<marquee width="50" style="font: caption">T-Mobile</marquee>
<kwwii> asac: agreed that it does not present much more information but 1) it looks better and 2) it matches the spinner in nautilus and firefox
<mpt> andreasn, that's about what it looks like
<andreasn> ouch
<andreasn> I didn't know you could do that btw, cool
<asac> kwwii: where do you see that spinner?
<asac> kwwii: just wondere because i didn't have it in the upstrema bug tarball?
<Hobbsee> + blink is worse
<asac> kwwii: if you say thats ok, ill take it now
<andreasn> Hobbsee: thihi
<Hobbsee> andreasn: my myspace page was infintely better, though.
<Hobbsee> i'm still disappointed that it got removed
<kwwii> asac: I looked at the spinner in http://bugzilla.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=102117
<kwwii> the one with the little dots in a circle
<asac> kwwii: what we have for wireless are the nm-stage03-connectionXXXX.png series
<asac> anyway. lets take it hen
<kwwii> I agree :-)
<lapo> hi
<seb128> hey lapo
<asac> mvo: i requested a merge on your https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/app-install-data-ubuntu/ubuntu branch
<asac> i am currently branching the merge source and see if it really works. will let you know asap
<asac> but takes time :(
<asac> mvo: maybe consider to upgrade that to new branch format? (no idea if you already did that?)
<mvo> asac: isn't it the lastest already? when we talked last I ugpraded all that I could get hold off
<asac> hmm
<asac> not sure
<asac> bzr info should show pack-0.92
<asac> i think jazzva told me that the data branch was still "dirstate"
<mvo> hm, bzr upgrade bzr+ssh:// on that branch gave me that its already the latest version
<asac> wierd
<asac> mvo: ok that branch works ... maybe there will be another round of more extensions, but imo its safe to take it now
<asac> (more extensions added ask .desktop)
<mvo> asac: looks good, merging
<asac> thanks
<asac> can you mark the branch as "merged" in "view merge proposal" on launchpad side?
<mvo> asac: I can not see where I can do that in https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/app-install-data-ubuntu/ubuntu
<asac> mvo: you click on the "view proposal details"
<asac> then on the left "mark as merged"
<mvo> aha
<mvo> done
<asac> cool
<asac> now the branch disappeared from yours again
<asac> mvo: i dont see that merge in the last 10 commits?
<asac> already pushed?
<mvo> still pushing
<asac> mvo: you dont give credits in commit message? :-P
<mvo> asac: I use debcommit
<asac> that doesn't give credits?
<asac> hmm ... should include the author (e.g. [ XXXX ]) ... anyway thanks for the upload
<mvo> cheers, the upload has the right credits at least
<wonko69> A strange thing has happend to my desktop. When I switch viewport with CRLT+ALT+left or right arrow key now for no apparent reason it move two viewports over instead of the normal one. I can for the life of me not figure out what is going on.
<mvo> asac: apturl and the enable_section race should be fixed now
<mvo> asac: do you want to give it a test-run first or should I upload straight away (my tests look good)
<asac> mvo: no idea. how can i get a testpackage? is the fix in apturl or synaptic?
<mvo> asac: all apturl, its in
<mvo>   checkout of branch: sftp://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Eubuntu-core-dev/apturl/ubuntu/
<mvo> just run
<mvo> bzr-buildpackage --native in it
<asac> mvo: you ares still using sftp :-P ?
<mvo> dude
<asac> hehe
<mvo> its a really *tiny* package
<mvo> :P
 * asac  branching 
 * asac building
 * asac instlaling
<YokoZar> ï»¿If GDM is off-centered, does that mean it's using the wrong resolution or something else?  I can't even see the language select/restart buttons in the corner
<ajmitch> most likely, I had that yesterday on my laptop because I'd plugged in the 22" lcd screen
<Kargarian>  does anyone know what the screen reoultion should be for displaying X on a 24 inch tv?
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-04-16
<Karger1978> hello
<Karger1978> anyone here
<jayman> i am
<e-uoaphys> is this the gnome/xfce/kde desktop team, or just the gnome team?
<Amaranth> e-uoaphys: gnome
<Amaranth> seeing how the ubuntu desktop is gnome :)
<e-uoaphys> oh
<e-uoaphys> there is no kubuntu-desktop chan tho :(
<Amaranth> try #kubuntu-devel
<Amaranth> the only thing kubuntu has to deal with is the desktop :P
<Amaranth> well, almost the only thing
<e-uoaphys> right on
<e-uoaphys> thx
<dholbach> good morning
<crevette> hello dholbach
<dholbach> hi crevette
<ajmitch> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hi ajmitch - how are you doing?
<ajmitch> good, how are you?
<dholbach> good too - thanks
 * ajmitch is just here due to hitting an annoying bug after a hardy upgrade :)
<dholbach> what happened?
<ajmitch> when I login, the desktop background & icons frequently don't appear
<dholbach> ugh
<ajmitch> I haven't seen anything in ~/.xsession-errors that's useful yet
<dholbach> anything in .xsession-errors?
<dholbach> hm
<ajmitch> just starting up the laptop now to see if it happens again
<ajmitch> however, if I start nautilus, then go to gconf-editor & toggle its 'show desktop' off & then on, it'll appear
<dholbach> sounds like seb128 will be interested to hear it
<ajmitch> haven't filed a bug yet due ot lack of useful info
<ajmitch> and of course, it didn't happen this time...
<crevette> salut les telepathistes
 * ajmitch hates bugs that randomly aren't reproducable
<dholbach> hi Zdra, hi cassidy
<dholbach> hi crevette
<crevette> :)
<dholbach> ajmitch: I know what you mean :/
<ajmitch> and there he is... :)
<crevette> hey
<Zdra> hi dholbach
<cassidy> morning dholbach
<seb128> hello everybody
<ajmitch> hi seb128
<ajmitch> bah, logout, come back in, and it's working fine still
<ajmitch> it's only because I'm trying to reproduce it that it does this to me...
<seb128> what bug?
<ajmitch> 03:09 < ajmitch> when I login, the desktop background & icons frequently don't appear
<ajmitch> 03:11 < ajmitch> however, if I start nautilus, then go to gconf-editor & toggle its 'show desktop' off & then on, it'll appear
<ajmitch> trying to get useful info before I file a bug
<ajmitch> from a gutsy->hardy upgrade
<seb128_> ups, being disconnected
<seb128_> what is the bug?
<ajmitch> 03:17 < ajmitch> 03:09 < ajmitch> when I login, the desktop background & icons frequently don't appear
<ajmitch> 03:17 < ajmitch> 03:11 < ajmitch> however, if I start nautilus, then go to gconf-editor & toggle its 'show desktop' off & then on, it'll appear
<ajmitch> 03:18 < ajmitch> trying to get useful info before I file a bug
<ajmitch> :)
<seb128_> ah
<seb128_> is nautilus running when you don't get the icons?
<ajmitch> I'm trying to reproduce it now so that I can tell you
<ajmitch> but it's misbehaving & giving me a desktop each time, unlike this morning
<seb128_> ok
<seb128_> slomo_: your fix for the crash at exit thing didn't work
<ajmitch> alright, I think I've got it now :)
 * ajmitch put the audio cd back in the drive...
<ajmitch> and yes, nautilus is running
<seb128_> do you get the context menu on the desktop etc?
<ajmitch> no
<seb128_> can you get a nautilus stracktrace?
<ajmitch> no icons, context menu, or desktop wallpaper
<seb128_> and do you have anything about nautilus in .xsession-errors,
<seb128_> ?
<ajmitch> ** (nautilus:13298): WARNING **: Unable to add monitor: Not supported
<ajmitch> is the only thing there
<seb128_> that's normal
<seb128_> hum, k
<ajmitch> I figured as much
<ajmitch> a stacktrace, although nautilus hasn't crashed?
<seb128_> yes
<seb128_> just to know if some thread is stucked on something
<ajmitch> would you like me to kill -11 the running process then?
<seb128_> or attach gdb to it and "thread apply all bt full" and attach that to paste.ubuntu.com
<ajmitch> FWIW, nautilus  13298    ajmitch    3u     unix 0xeebe5380            56278 socket
<ajmitch> stat64("/home/ajmitch/.recently-used.xbel", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644, st_size=118622, ...}) = 0
<ajmitch> read(3, 0x819489c, 4096)                = -1 EAGAIN (Resource temporarily unavailable)
<ajmitch> gettimeofday({1208331188, 315370}, NULL) = 0
<ajmitch> poll( <unfinished ...>
<ajmitch> constantly trying to read from a socket
<seb128_> that is weird
<ajmitch> I noticed that the only time it happened this evening was when I put the audio cd back in
 * ajmitch took it out because rhythmbox was loading every time I logged in
<seb128_> right, known bug
<ajmitch> argh, hit the data cap, downloading -dbg packages at 64kbps is painful
<ajmitch> I've used apport-cli to put in a bug for now, though it didn't appear to attach anything useful :)
 * ajmitch is forced to download at 1% of the usual ADSL speed, so it'll take awhile to get information
<seb128> ajmitch: I think there is some other bug about the same issue
<ajmitch> oh that's good
<seb128> not really
<seb128> those are likely incomplete or already closed
<ajmitch> good that I may be able to shed some light on someone else's problem then?
<seb128> not sure what we can do without a way to trigger the issue, or somebody having the issue debugging the code
<seb128> right
<seb128> though I'm not sure what information would be useful
<ajmitch> knowing what socket it's trying to read may be a help, I guess
<ajmitch> if that's related to the issue
<seb128> the socket reading is normal I think
<seb128> it does that too here
<seb128> what is weird is that it's trying to read the recently-used
<seb128> does it do that in loop too?
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> but I'm not sure if that's just normal behaviour, it's not doing stat on it very often
<ajmitch> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7178/ isn't useful, is it?
<slomo_> seb128: hm? works for me, at least for the crashes i got... are there any current bugreports with backtrace?
<seb128> is that the only thread?
<seb128> and no, you need libglib2.0-0-dbgsym
<slomo_> maybe there's more than one crash
<ajmitch> gdb didn't show any more info, and I'm grabbing libglib2.0-0-dbgsym now
<seb128> slomo_: I still have the bug on my box, what information do you need?
<slomo_> seb128: you have new libgtk2.0-cil and new libgnome2.0-cil? can you reproduce it easily?
<seb128> slomo_: yes, I've the current versions and it happens every time I close f-spot or tomboy
<slomo_> hm hmm
<seb128> dpkg -l libgtk2.0-cil libgnome2.0-cil
<seb128> ii  libgnome2.0-cil      2.20.0-2ubuntu2      CLI binding for GNOME 2.20
<seb128> ii  libgtk2.0-cil        2.12.0-2ubuntu2      CLI binding for the GTK+ toolkit 2.12
<slomo_> let me install f-spot, one moment
<slomo_> yes these are the correct versions
<seb128> slomo_: what is useful for such crashes? the gdb stracktrace from the interpreter?
<slomo_> yes, i can reproduce it with f-spot here
<seb128> ok
<slomo_> so there's more than one crasher on exit *sigh*
<seb128> :-(
<slomo_> i'll care for that
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> do you have any idea about the issue?
<slomo_> not yet
<seb128> you might want to try tomboy too and see if that's the same bug
<slomo_> yes
<ajmitch> seb128: new gdb paste at http://paste.ubuntu.com/7179/
<seb128> ajmitch: ok, it seems to not be stucked on anything then
<slomo_> seb128: looks like the same crash that i fixed
<slomo_> seb128: might be that f-spot does stuff different from my test cases
 * ajmitch is logging out to see if it'll happen again
<ajmitch> or not, I hit logout & it's just not happening...
<ajmitch> hm
<slomo_> seb128: yeah, problem is that f-spot does "exit()" instead of stopping the main loop first
<seb128_> slomo_: ah, so application bug now?
<slomo_> seb128: only f-spot and tomboy?
<seb128_> slomo_: that I noticed, I'm not using other mono applications
<slomo_> seb128: no, the fix in gtk# was not enough... but i see no solution for f-spot's behaviour in gtk#
<slomo_> seb128: it's just that libgnome is very unfriendly to bindings :)
<seb128_> bug #217091
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 217091 in gnome-subtitles "gnome-subtitles.exe crashed on exit (dup-of: 199496)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/217091
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 199496 in gtk-sharp2 "Tomboy.exe crashed with SIGSEGV in exit()" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/199496
<seb128_> slomo_: that one is about gnome-subtitles
<slomo_> is there a pygtk irc channel somewhere?
<slomo_> would be nice to know how they handle that
<seb128_> #pygtk on gimpnet
<slomo_> or maybe no python appliction uses GnomeProgram :)
<slomo_> seb128: tomboy does the same as f-spot *sigh*
<slomo_> might be possible to fix for those two though
<slomo_> yep, f-spot fix is a one-liner
<slomo_> seb128: i'll give you a diff, can you care for the upload? i'm busy with other stuff atm
<slomo_> seb128: http://pastebin.ca/987149
<seb128_> slomo_: ok
<seb128_> slomo_: thanks
<slomo_> that's not the only place where f-spot does things wrong but should be the only one giving that behaviour
<seb128_> bah, pastebin.ca is sloooow
<dholbach> paste.ubuntu.com? :)
<slomo_> hmm
<seb128_> slomo_: the website doesn't want to show your change
<slomo_> i might have a better fix
<seb128_> ok
<slomo_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7180/
<slomo_> that's the old one
<seb128_> thanks
<seb128_> slomo_: the comment before seems to indicate they didn't use this call for a reason
<slomo_> seb128: just the call alone wouldn't exit the application because there are still other threads running, quitting the main loop and exit works in every case
<slomo_> (unless something blocks the main loop which would be a bug)
<seb128_> ok
<slomo_> whatever, i might find a better solution
<ajmitch> argh
<ajmitch> screen #0: dimensions:    1280x800 pixels (289x21 millimeters) resolution:    112x968 dots per inch
<ajmitch> no wonder gdm has 3 inch fonts
<mvo> seb128_: have  you seen reports aobut scrollkeeper crashing with double-linked lists failures?
<seb128_> mvo: look at the scrollkeeper list of bugs, plenty of those
<mvo> I wonder if #218049 might be something like bad memory or so
 * mvo nods
<YokoZar> ajmitch: it seems like there was a regression in the last gdm update
<YokoZar> since that's also when it started being the wrong resolution for me
<seb128_> mvo: I've had no luck to trigger the issue or get an error when running it under valgrind though, I tried again some days ago
<ajmitch> YokoZar: it's an intel driver thing
<ajmitch> bug 107320
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 107320 in xorg-server "Large font in the GDM login text field after installing xserver-xorg-video-intel which report monitor having 289x21 millimiters (dup-of: 151311)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/107320
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 151311 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "DDC report some ridiculous physical screen size (Mostly on Intel driver, and some ATI)" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/151311
<YokoZar> ajmitch: that's odd, I don't have intel video...
<YokoZar> Though I do have the package installed
<ajmitch> yeah, I misspoke, it's really hardware at fault, and newer drivers believing the dimensions passed to it
<mvo> seb128_: ok, thanks
<ajmitch> (from what I've read so far about buggy EDID values)
<dholbach> mvo, seb128_: shall we change the breaks of evolution-data-server on evolution-scalix to a conflicts for hardy? this will fix upgrades and slangasek just removed evo-scalix from hardy
<dholbach> bug 193764
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 193764 in evolution-scalix "evolution-scalix FTBFS with current evolution" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/193764
<seb128_> dholbach: why is the breaks not correct?
<dholbach> see comment 5 on that bug
<dholbach> mvo is the best person to answer
<seb128_> ok
<seb128_> I've no opinion about that, did you try asking gicmo about fixing the build?
<dholbach> seb128_: yes, he was in the bug conversation
<seb128_> anyway feel free to do the change but ask mvo, I think there is a replaces which is required too
<seb128_> not sure if he still has a pending upload for this one
<dholbach> yes, best if mvo does it
<dholbach> thanks guys
<mvo> dholbach: yes
<seb128_> brb, trying gvfs changes
<mvo> seb128_: the breaks implementation is not that great in the resolver, its mostly designed around the case when it can upgrade a package, if it can't it easily falls flat on its face
<lool> seb128: Will you continue sponsoring the cheese upload?
<crevette> hello lool
<lool> Hi crevette
<pcjc2> Hi, I guess people are busy getting last minute fixes for Hardy... I've prepared a couple of patches (epiphany and nautilus) for some annoying usability issues
<seb128> lool: you are welcome to do the upload if you want
<seb128> hey pcjc2
<pcjc2> I'm not a developer
<seb128> pcjc2: what issues do those fix?
<pcjc2> Bug #181128 (marked as fix-comitted, but isn't fixed)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 181128 in epiphany-browser "clicking on a link to a document does not open it" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/181128
<pcjc2> The patch backports changes from epiphany's SVN repository, and "works nicely for me"
<pcjc2> This requires more thought, but I have a fix which works for me... ï»¿bug #217997
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 217997 in nautilus "Incorrect icons displayed for mimetypes installed in hicolor theme only" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/217997
<seb128> pcjc2: are you sure all those changes are required? only one of the commit mention the issue
<pcjc2> The first one mentions that it is part of the right bug#
<pcjc2>  Add a kung fu death grip to keep us alive. Part of bug #513837
<seb128> I doubt we will spend efforts now to fix this issue, that's not the default browser and we got only one bug about that
<seb128> we will likely update to the new bug fix version in hardy-updates rather
<pcjc2> The second (committed right after), adds another, the third is the bugfix. The fourth labeled "Cleanup" was comitted right after, in the same file
<pcjc2> that last one might not be necessary
<pcjc2> sure, the debdiff is there when it is needed. I just wasn't sure how much extra pain was required for hardy-updates CF. getting the fix in before the release
<seb128> it's late now to get changes accepted
<seb128> and I don't think this one is worth going through freeze exception, testing, etc
<pcjc2> The nautilus bug took a little bit of tracking down, there are various similar, but not quite the same bug reports - mostly relating to incomplete icon themes
<seb128> as said it's not the default browser and we got only one bug about it
<pcjc2> seb128: I think I agree with you, given that its not default - I forget that, since its always one of the first apps I install
<seb128> and I don't think many people use the autoopen thing
<seb128> but thanks for your work, we will consider the change
<pcjc2> the symptom is that clicking on a .pdf (something I do regularly as an Engineer surfing for datasheets), the pdf downloads somewhere anonymous, probably with a name like 328784.pdf (whatever it was called on RS / Farnell's server), and you get no notification. It used to just open in evince
<seb128> right, I understand the bug
<seb128> when clicking on a pdf I get the "download or open" dialog
<seb128> not sure what option is the default one
<pcjc2> in Epiphany?
<seb128> anyway as said we will get it to hardy or hardy-updates
<seb128> yes
<pcjc2> Until applying that patch, I got silence from it!
<seb128> that's because you use the preferences option to automatically download and open
<pcjc2> After the patch, I got the download or open dialog
<pcjc2> Ah - its buried somewhere, I'll look for it, thanks
<seb128> it's not, it's on the first tab in the preferences dialog
 * pcjc2 hides
<pcjc2> it would appear that the patch just makes it show the SaveAs / Open dialog and isn't a full fix then.
<seb128> ok, don't bother too much
<seb128> upstream said he would roll a new tarball soon to fix issues
<seb128> and we will get it in hardy or hardy-updates
<pcjc2> thats good to know. I see they dropped Mozillla support in trunk anyway
<seb128> pcjc2: can you send the nautilus patch on the upstream mailing list? I'm not sure it's correct, gtk should be doing the right thing there
<pcjc2> I sent it already
<seb128> ok, I'll read comments there then
<seb128> thanks
<pcjc2> none-so far, I think the majority of bugs I opened on bugzilla.gnome.org are still unconfirmed ;) (Perhaps that says something about me - not sure!)
<seb128> depends of the product, but the nautilus upstream hackers get too many bugs to really read bugzilla
<seb128> they reply on the list usually though
<pcjc2> ok, perhaps I'll take it up there
<seb128> you just say you already did?
<pcjc2> maiiling list
<pcjc2> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=528320
<ubotu> Gnome bug 528320 in View as (Icons or List) "Incorrect icons displayed for apps installing icons in hicolor theme" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> right
<pcjc2> sorry, I'm tired... I see you suggested mailing list above, not bugzilla
<seb128> I specifically asked if you can send it on the mailing list
<seb128> and you said you already did?
<pcjc2> I misread, I will do it now
<seb128> ok, that's alright
<seb128> just send it on the list if you want to get a reply ;-)
<kwwii> seb128: I have a fix for the screensaver (the filename was wrong in the desktop file)
<seb128> kwwii: url?
<kwwii> seb128: http://sinecera.de/human-theme_0.17.dsc
<seb128> kwwii: ok
<seb128> hey pedro_
 * seb128 looks at mvo
<seb128> bug #215839
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 215839 in python-central "hardy upgrade fails with python-central crash and gedit segfault" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/215839
<pedro_> hello seb128
<seb128> mvo: something in the gedit postinst crash, but there is no gedit specific calls there
<seb128> ok, doing some cd testing again
<seb128> could somebody sponsor the human-theme update listed before? dholbach? I'll do it otherwise after this round of testing
<dholbach> kwwii: are all the changes in bzr already?
<kwwii> dholbach: yes
<kwwii> all I did was add "-screensaver" to a file name in the dekstop file for the screensaver
<dholbach> kwwii: OK, uploaded
<dholbach> kwwii: might be sitting in the archive admin's queue now
 * mvo looks back at seb128
<kwwii> dholbach: cool, thanks
<seb128> re
<seb128> did anybody do the sponsoring?
<seb128> pitti: any opinion on http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=526308?
<ubotu> Gnome bug 526308 in programs "nautilus cannot eject ipod while eject(1) does" [Major,New]
<pitti> seb128: icky
<pitti> seb128: I think our eject(1) still has the 'unmount all partitions before' patch, which would make that work
<seb128> pitti: well, I've opened the bug because I've the issue on hardy, I can't eject my ipod from nautilus
<pitti> seb128: I think when I had my father's ipod here, I only ejected from RB
<seb128> pitti: the icon is removed but the ipod is still displaying the "do not unplug" screen
<seb128> right, from rhythmbox works
<pitti> does that make a difference for you?
<pitti> ah
<seb128> gnome-mount -e /dev/sdn doesn't
<pitti> Odd, I had expected RB to use the same call
<seb128> lemme check
<seb128> pitti: execve("/usr/bin/gnome-eject", ["/usr/bin/gnome-eject", "--hal-udi", "/org/freedesktop/Hal/devices/vol"...], [/* 26 vars */]) = 0
<seb128> that's what rhythmbox does
<seb128> pitti: execve("/usr/bin/gnome-mount", ["gnome-mount", "-e", "-b", "-d", "/dev/sdc"], [/* 25 vars */]) = 0
<pitti> hm, gnome-mount -e just calls eject, too
<seb128> that's nautilus
<pitti> so RB calls it on a volume, and nautilus on a drive
<seb128> right
<pitti> seb128: do you get the same when using eject /dev/sdc1 vs. sdc?
<seb128> no
<seb128> sudo eject /dev/sdc works correctly
<seb128> as do sudo eject /dev/sdc<n>
<pitti> seb128: can you strace -e execve -f what RB and nautilus call eject with?
<seb128> that's what I did before
<seb128> ah, eject
<seb128> not gnome-mount
<seb128> ok
<seb128> is gnome-mount calling eject? I though it was using hal for those
<pitti> oh, sorry, misread the code
<pitti> it's only called if the device is in fstab
<seb128> which is not the case
<pitti> right
<seb128> the fstab parsing code seems broken btw
<seb128> strace shows it tries to stat UUID=numbers
<seb128> but that's an another issue
<pitti> argh, I wish dbus-monitor wouldn't be so terribly useless
<pitti> seb128: hal --verbose=yes --daemon=no should display which kind of eject call is done; maybe that gives some enlightenment?
<seb128> trying
<seb128> brb, I managed to put my system in a state where the ipod is no detected, I hope the database didn't get corrupted because I unplugged it incorrectly after the failed eject
<jcastro> seb128: need those desktop topics for openweek rsn!
<seb128> jcastro: I'm pondering passing for this one, just too much to do
<jcastro> seb128: no one else on the -desktop team?
<seb128> well, you asked on the change and nobody stepped so apparently not ;-)
<jcastro> heh
<mvo> pitti: could you have a quick look at #63450 ? my comment 21? it looks like hal restart fails, I wonder if you have a idea about it
 * mvo needs to leave now for ~1h but will read backlog
<pitti> mvo: ok, will have a look at it
<lool> seb128: Do you recall that pygtk python wakeupfd thing?
<lool> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=481569
<ubotu> Gnome bug 481569 in gtk "Calling gobject.threads_init() causes a lot of wakeups" [Normal,Reopened]
<lool> seb128: The patch is now ready, just replace the read(..., 1) with , 0
<lool> seb128: What do you think?
<seb128> lool: it's late for hardy
<seb128> it took us several day to notice the issue previous time
<lool> seb128: It's useful to save power though
<seb128> rather for hardy-updates
<lool> Hmm ok I thought it was safer to have in hardy than in hardy-updates
<seb128> there is very few room for hardy now, every change means new CD builds and do the entire test grid again
<seb128> maybe ask to slangasek if he's ok to get that between the rc and hardy images
<lool> Ok
<seb128> uploads go to hardy-proposed, get testing there and are moved to hardy-updates
<seb128> so it's usually ok to upload such changes to proposed and to give them enough testing before moving to updates
<seb128> we will do that for GNOME 2.22.n updates too
<mvo> pitti: thanks for your thoughts on the acpid thing, I have no idea why hald is hanging with it though, so I'm I can not currently sposnor it
<seb128_> slomo: did you figure a patch for the crash on closing issue?
<slomo> seb128_: not yet, talking with upstream now... the one i gave to you is correct though
<bhale> hi slomo
<slomo> hi bhale
<kwwii> seb128_: have you seen bug #99508
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 99508 in compiz "Window titlebar displayed not right with compiz enabled" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/99508
<kwwii> seb128_: it seems there is an easy fix but it seems so simple I wonder
<seb128_> kwwii: that's rather a question for amaranth or mvo, I don't really know about compiz
<Amaranth> kwwii: please fix it :)
<Amaranth> no more <tint> :)
<kwwii> seb128_: is it too late to add such a fix?
<kwwii> Amaranth: no, it is simpler than that it seems
<Amaranth> oh, change that 0 to a 1 for left_width or whatever
<seb128_> kwwii: there is some room between rc and hardy for easy changes
<kwwii> exactly
<seb128_> but that seems a compiz bug, not a theme one
<Amaranth> seems to fix it here
<Amaranth> seb128_: it's a "wtf is going on here?" bug
<kwwii> seb128_: I'll test the change on my system without the error and if it does not change anything radically I can submit it...I was worried about submitting it and then b0rking everyone's system which works now
<Amaranth> it seems to be a bad interaction between gtk-window-decorator, libmetacity, and the theme
<Amaranth> and no one knows how to fix it anywhere except in the theme
<kwwii> lol, the best reason to get a new theme...otherwise I will end up having to support ubuntulooks
<kwwii> I'll fix it, but not until tomorrow, just got home tonight, need a few hours of private time :-)
<seb128__> re
<seb128__> <seb128_> but that seems a compiz bug, not a theme one
<kwwii> right, but if this fixes it, so be it
<Amaranth> <Amaranth> it seems to be a bad interaction between gtk-window-decorator, libmetacity, and the theme
<Amaranth> <Amaranth> and no one knows how to fix it anywhere except in the theme
<seb128> changing the theme should be no issue
<seb128> bug having compiz guys fixing the bug would be better ;-)
<Amaranth> if there is an easier way to workaround the problem i have no interest in wasting my time
<Amaranth> i could be using that time to read slashdot :P
<kwwii> :-)
<seb128> slomo: your gnome-user-share update in debian is still not good
<seb128> "Syntax error on line 17 of /usr/share/gnome-user-share/dav_user.conf:
<seb128> Invalid command 'TypesConfig', perhaps misspelled or defined by a module not included in the server configuration
<seb128> spawning httpd failed
<seb128> "
<seb128> slomo: and you need to clean the old debian specific autostart on upgrade since that's a conffile
<mvo> seb128: still here?
<seb128> mvo: yes
<mvo> seb128: could you please have a look at the last comment in bug #63450 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 63450 in acpid "acpid install fails (because of hal running)" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/63450
<mvo> looks like something funny with policykit
<seb128> mvo: no idea, is that still the old dbus version running? maybe it doesn't support some new format or something
<mvo> hm, maybe pitti has a idea about #63450 (last comment)
<mvo> seb128: yeah, could be. I wonder if some dependencies needs fixing
<seb128> mvo: I think he's away for the night
<seb128> mvo: well, the issue is not dependencies if that's the case but dbus needing to be restarted and not reloaded
<seb128> but restarting dbus on upgrades is not a good idea usually
<seb128> maybe walters has an idea about the warning ;-)
<mvo> seb128: ok, yeah - if its the dbus restart problem, then there is nothing we can do and we can not apply the patch as it is
<mvo> (nothing we can do for now :)
<mvo> seb128: but thanks for your help, I updated the bug, I think I should leave for bed now
<seb128> mvo: yeah, me too, you are welcome
<pochu> seb128: do you think we will have WebKit in main for Intrepid?
<seb128> pochu: depends on what in GNOME is using it, but that's likely yes
<pochu> seb128: because Liferea has a WebKit backend for some time, and I'll look at it to see if it's feasible a switch to it
<pochu> slomo: ^-- what would you think about that?
<seb128> what does it bring over the current version?
<walters> launchpad is not responding for me
<seb128> walters: weird
<seb128> walters: "Error org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.Failed: Element <standard_system_servicedirs> not allowed inside <busconfig> in configuration file^M" is the warning
<seb128> rather error
<seb128> while reloading the system message bus config
<walters> is this on a major distro upgrade?
<walters> dist-upgrade?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> that's a dapper to hardy upgrade
<walters> yeah, not much we can do about that...the new config file is on disk, the old daemon doesn't grok it
<seb128> oh, no, the error is gutsy to hardy apparently
<walters> you guys might want to look at what fedora is doing with preupgrade, it's generally a much more reliable way of upgrading the OS
<seb128> ok, that's what I though
<seb128> this "doesn't restart dbus" is somewhat annoying
<seb128> walters: right, we are not likely to do major changes before hardy now though ;-)
<walters> yep, i understand
<walters> i'm not sure what the best approach would be; if there is a way to suppress the postinst script on dist-upgrade that might be a workaround
<walters> does the daemon die after that?
<seb128> well, mvo left now, but reading the bug they try to restart hal apparently and hal hangs after this error
<seb128> the easy workaround is to not do the restart in the postinst
<seb128> we should probably just recommend people to restart the box after the upgrade to get everything running correctly anyway
<walters> hm, new hal may need some feature from the newer dbus
<walters> yeah, you've always had to restart anyways though
<walters> glibc
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-04-17
<seb128> pochu: looking for something to do? ;-) the nemiver upstream asked if ubuntu could update to the current version, that should be easy enough, I tried the current debian version and it builds and works correctly on hardy
<seb128> upgrading to current would be nice, maybe building using libgtkhex and the new libgtksourceviewmm too as debian do now
<pochu> Maintainer: Daniel Holbach <daniel.holbach@ubuntu.com>
<pochu> oh :)
 * pochu looks at it anyway ;-)
<seb128> anyway, enough for me today
<Nafallo> night seb128 :-)
<pochu> yes, good night :)
<pochu> hi Nafallo
<seb128> 'night guys
<Nafallo> hi pochu :-)
<seb128> see you tomorrow
<Nafallo> seb128: sure. come to London :-)
<pochu> can I go too? :)
<seb128> Nafallo: see you on IRC rather ;-)
<Nafallo> can't see why not :-)
<seb128> I've enough to do without travelling
<Nafallo> seb128: hehe. wfm :-)
<dholbach> good morning
<dejuren> guys, anyone aware of what's happening with https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtksourceview/+bug/52975 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 52975 in gtksourceview "gedit freeze when browsing a file" [Medium,Confirmed]
<seb128> good morning
<dejuren> seb128: gm. I have a question for you...
<dejuren> seb128: do you know the status of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtksourceview/+bug/52975 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 52975 in gtksourceview "gedit freeze when browsing a file" [Medium,Confirmed]
<seb128> dejuren: nobody seems to be working on this one if that's the question
<dejuren> seb128: OK, the answer is fair, but the bad news are we may escalate this
<seb128> "we"?
<dejuren> support
<dejuren> our customer come with this today
<dholbach> hi seb128
<seb128> hey dholbach
<pitti> seb128: btw, did you notice that gnome-screensaver does not accept passwords after resuming from suspend/hibernate? happens on both my boxes, so I don't think it's a local configuration error
<pitti> seb128: that's something I want to look at next week, unless you know something about that already?
<seb128> pitti: I didn't notice, maybe ted has an idea he's looking at gnome-screensaver nowadays
<seb128> hey pochu
<pochu> morning seb128
<pochu> seb128: regarding nemiver... that will need a freeze exception and I'm not sure it will be granted.
<seb128> pochu: I'm granting it
<seb128> pochu: I'm the one doing the GNOMish exceptions
<seb128> hate hate xulrunner
<pochu> seb128: oh, cool then :-)
<pitti> seb128: xulrunner?
<seb128> pitti: xul1.9, epiphany keeps crashing on closing
<seb128> or hanging with no ui displayed
<seb128> which means clicking on urls just stops working
<seb128> I'm considering installing xul1.8 and rebuilding epiphany with it
<seb128> anyway nothing important everybody uses firefox nowadays anyway ;-)
<pitti> or webkit :)
<seb128> right, that's for next cycle though
<crevette> hello
<crevette> thanks for pushing nemiver seb128
<crevette> :)
<seb128> hey crevette
<pochu> hi crevette
<crevette> hi pochu
<seb128> pochu: do you think you could work on bug #153572 too?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 153572 in gthumb "Merge 2.10.8-1 from debian unstable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/153572
<pochu> seb128: yes. I'll do that today
<seb128> pochu: thanks!
<pochu> or I could get Tormod working on it... "Personally, if I knew, I would have worked on this earlier, but now with Hardy frozen, I am not gonna do that merge if I am not sure my work will be accepted into Hardy."
<pochu> ;)
<seb128> either way having the update available today would be nice so it can still be considered for hardy
<pochu> seb128: there's nemiver 0.5.2 upstream (debian has 0.5.1), I'll update to that one too which fixes an infinite loop
<seb128> pochu: right, thanks
 * ajmitch is saddened to hear seb128 say that epiphany is having problems
<seb128> ajmitch: it's not that bad, mainly crashing when closing
<seb128> I guess I'm the only one opening and closing it all the time rather than adding tabs
 * ajmitch tends to leave it open for a few weeks if possible
 * Amaranth tends to use firefox ;)
<Amaranth> mvo: crap, i completely forgot to commit that rotate bug fix
<Amaranth> done now
<mvo> Amaranth: cool, thanks
<Amaranth> i was waiting to see if a fix for the a11y stuff would come and then forgot the whole thing
<mvo> it seems like the a11y stuff is settled now, but its a bit more than the initial small patch (orca changed are needed as well, right?) - do you think its still feasible to try it for 8.04 ? or is 8.04.1 better?
<mvo> I guess we should put it into the compiz ppa
<pochu> seb128: could you ACK bug 215146?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 215146 in nemiver "[hardy] nemiver needs a version boost" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/215146
<seb128> pochu: just upload
<pochu> ok, uploading
<Amaranth> mvo: i don't think the a11y stuff should go into hardy at all at this point
<Amaranth> maybe 8.04.1 but only if it really works, last i heard it didn't read the first title when you hit alt-tab
<seb128> pitti: ^ nemiver in universe got freeze exception approval if you want to accept the new version just uploaded
<pitti> ok
<pitti> seb128: done
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> thanks pochu too ;-)
<pochu> no probs :)
<mvo> Amaranth: ok, oh well, the first patch looked so encouraging (small, straightforward) :)
<Amaranth> yeah
<Amaranth> small, straightforward, incredibly hacky :)
<mvo> heh :)
<Amaranth> for 8.10 i'm sure we'll have a switcher that actually uses gtk
<Amaranth> I turned iXce on to the idea but if i thought it had a chance of getting accepted I'd probably do it
 * mvo nods
<pedro_> morning
<kwwii> seb128: I updated the human theme to include the change for the compiz bug since it seems like it fixes it for everyone
<kwwii> http://sinecera.de/human-theme_0.18.dsc
<kwwii> dholbach: if you want to look into that, I also commited my changes to bzr
<kwwii> seb128, dholbach: wait on those changes a bit, I might as well fix it in murrine as well
<kwwii> erm, forget that comment :p
<dholbach> kwwii: so the changes are all good now?
<kwwii> dholbach: yes
<dholbach> kwwii: can you make it (LP: #99508)?
<dholbach> only that way the bug will get closed automatically
<kwwii> dholbach: yepp, one second
<kwwii> dholbach: I get that wrong every time I do it :p
<kwwii> dholbach: should be correct now
<dholbach> kwwii: thanks a lot
<kwwii> dholbach: sorry for screwing up, I'll try to remember that in the future
<dholbach> kwwii: don't worry
<dholbach> uploaded :)
<kwwii> :-)
<pochu> seb128: how would you feel if I propose a gtk-vnc new upstream release (0.3.4 to 0.3.5)? It's recommended by Jonh (upstream) and fixes some important bugs in vinagre (bug 206227, bug 207205, bug 212504). There's only API additions (no API removals), and soren has told me he's ok as long as it doesn't break his libvirt stuff. Do you think we should try to get it in or is it too risky?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 207205 in gtk-vnc "vinagre crashed with SIGSEGV in memcpy()" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/207205
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212504 in gtk-vnc "vinagre gets colors wrong viewing macosx desktop on powerpc machine" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212504
<pochu> bug 206227
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 206227 in gtk-vnc "vinagre fails to connect" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/206227
<seb128> pochu: ask pitti maybe, it's not really high risk since that's only vinagre which is using it on the CD, but hardy-updates would be alright too
<pochu> pitti: ^ :)
<pochu> sadly i didn't notice that was released on April 6th...
<pochu> lunch, bbl
<mpt> "Your laptop will not sleep when you shut the lid because a running program has prevented this."
<mpt> gnome-power-manager is just too damn chatty
<andreasn> is that new in 2,22?
<mpt> I don't know, but it might be, because I don't see any Google results for the phrase :-)
<jcastro> mpt: I've noticed the desktop in general getting too chatty with notifications lately.
<jcastro> mpt: I think it would be a good idea to review notifications during UDS or something
<mpt> jcastro, register it and propose it :-)
<jcastro> good idea
<mvo> asac: do you have a opinion on #185209 ? is this something we need to milestone?
<seb128> bug #185209
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 185209 in network-manager "[hardy] Manually Configuring Network Causes Massive, Unreversable, Failure" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/185209
<andreasn> jcastro: speaking of notifications, have you managed to figure out how to actually close banshee when you lose it?
<andreasn> it keeps existing in the notification area and keep on playing
<andreasn> in 1.0 alpha 3 that is
<jcastro> andreasn: that's a design decision
<jcastro> and then it tells you "Banshee hasn't quit, click here" in a notification on top of that.
<andreasn> that's just the first time, right?
<jcastro> yeah
<andreasn> hum, it is kind of weird...
<andreasn> but it's not that big of a issue, I just recall it was possible to disable it when it was a plugin/extension and wondered if it had moved somewhere else
<seb128> use rhythmbox rather ;-)
<jcastro> everyone abuses the notification area. :(
<andreasn> rmbox is just as icky when it comes to doing weird stuff in the notification area
<andreasn> but thanks anyway :)
<andreasn> mpt: http://blogs.gnome.org/hughsie/2008/04/17/223/ <- something for you?
<kwwii> seb128: is it too late to update the gdm theme package?
<seb128> kwwii: ask pitti, I'm not doing approvals and I'm not sure what they will approve between rc and hardy
<crevette> hey guys, form me f-sport crashes each time I want to close it; do you have the same issue ?
<seb128> crevette: yes
<seb128> crevette: bug #199496
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 199496 in gtk-sharp2 "Tomboy.exe crashed with SIGSEGV in exit()" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/199496
<seb128> (wrongly closed)
<crevette> ah okay
<crevette> thanks
<seb128> slomo did upload a fix but that's not enough
<seb128> you are welcome
<crevette> I'm in the process to upload 40MB of backtrace
<crevette> :)
<seb128> due to that one?
<crevette> yep
<crevette> :)=
<crevette> hey no photo apps is trigered when my camera is used in MTP mode
<crevette> pr 17 18:16:21 mushroom kernel: [  556.338025] f-spot[6630]: segfault at b6aca490 eip b6aca490 esp bfcbad8c error 4
<crevette> ah at least it tries
<mpt> andreasn, commented (awaiting moderation)
<seb128> crevette: g-v-m should be used again since this week, did you update yesterday or today?
<crevette> yep
<crevette> it's not   problem I switched back to USB
<seb128> see you later
<andreasn> mpt: thanks!
<slomo> pedro_: ok, which is the new bugreport for the gtk#-crash-on-exit? :)
<slomo> pedro_: i have the real fix now
<pochu> bug #199496
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 199496 in gtk-sharp2 "Tomboy.exe crashed with SIGSEGV in exit()" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/199496
<slomo> thanks
<pochu> hey slomo :)
<slomo> hi :)
<slomo> pochu: where can i upload this? directly to main or what's the current status of things?
<pochu> slomo: yes, to main, but it will need approval from ubuntu-release (e.g. pitti or slangasek)
<pochu> slomo: you can upload it, the queue is on manual right now
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-04-18
<metalgod_> hi ember
<ember> hey metal
<metalgod_> how goes ?
<ember> good, e tu ? :p
<metalgod_> fine :) having fun with some brasero segfaults and then going to some bar
<ember> hmm why don't you go to the bar now and deal later with segfaults ? :o
<metalgod_> nah that way i have to use valgrind and then gdb which is bad
<ember> haha
<ember> good luck
<ember> off to bed
<ember> *
<dholbach> good morning
<crevette> hello gents
<crevette> and ladyes
<crevette> ladies
<crevette> salut seb128
<seb128> lut crevette
<zasf> I'm trying to build gnome-applets from svn
<zasf> I'm using pbuilder but I get some errors I don't understand
<zasf> this is the end of pbuilder build -> http://pastebin.com/m2460e881
<zasf> it seems that INSTALL is missing
<zasf> hum.. I nearly got it
<zasf> I changed a Makefile.am and that's causing problems, but I don't understand what's wrong with it
<seb128> what are you trying to do? that's an ubuntu chan, you likely want to go on gimpnet to ask about gnome svn build questions
<seb128> mvo: do you want a bug about the easy code installation asking if you want to install other softwares?
<zasf> seb128: I thought it was a problem with debian/rules on packaging that's why I asked on #ubuntu-motu and dholdbach redirected me here
<seb128> the packaging is most likely correct, we use it for years now
<seb128> you might just want to run autogen.sh, copy the debian directory and run rebuild
<seb128> debuild
<seb128> if that's do to a quick svn package to try
<seb128> otherwise you can make dist the svn and package that correctly as an update
<seb128> do you really need a packaged version?
<seb128> otherwise just run autogen.sh and make and run the binary in the build dir
<zasf> seb128: thanks, I added DEB_CONFIGURE_SCRIPT := $(CURDIR)/$(DEB_SRCDIR)/autogen.sh to debian/rules
<zasf> and it seems to work
<zasf> I need a package to keep my system clean and do some testing
<seb128> mvo: could you look at bug #218768?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 218768 in gnome-utils "package gnome-utils 2.20.0.1-1ubuntu5 failed to install/upgrade: " [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/218768
<seb128> mvo: the apt.log has some udev volumeid error, not sure if you already know about the issue
<seb128> or that might not be the issue
<mvo> seb128: the terminal log would be best
<mvo> aha
<mvo> I look at it
<mvo> seb128: the crash itself is the scrollkeeper crash, I update and reassign
<seb128> ah, again
<seb128> I didn't spot it while looking at the html thing, I should have changed it to text ;-)
<seb128> yet another duplicate
<mvo> duplicate of #157370 ?
<seb128> mvo: could be, I think most of those bugs are one crasher
<seb128> mvo: when did compiz start changing workspaces when using the mouse middle button on the background?
<mvo> seb128: middle button hold and then move to a direction you mean?
<seb128> not, just normal up,down scrolling
<seb128> when you do when reading a page in firefox ;-)
<seb128> I noticed yesterday because my mouse pointer went out of the application by mistake and it switched to an another workspace
<seb128> while I was just scrolling to read something
<crevette> seb128, ha you didn't noticed
<crevette> :)
<seb128> I think it can be pretty confusing for users
<seb128> s/when you do/what you do
 * seb128 slaps crevette
<seb128> crevette: in a better mood today? ;-)
<crevette> not that bad
<crevette> I need some rest
<seb128> crevette: lucky you, that's almost the weekend
<seb128> good morning dholbach
<crevette> you but I'm not sure I will take some rest
<seb128> you should!
<dholbach> seb128: I was here before... just pressed alt-f4 in the wrong window
<dholbach> seb128: but yeah... good morning France! :)
<crevette> week end is the only time I have to do some hacking
<seb128> dholbach: I didn't say you were not there, we just didn't speak yet ;-)
<seb128> crevette: ah, you are a hacker now ;-)
<crevette> seb128, not really, but I'm using hack to define a whole thing, like opening bug, doing patch, ....
<seb128> kwwii: there is some thread on ubuntu-devel-discuss complain that you ignore bug #211740
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 211740 in ubuntu-gdm-themes "Hardy: Ubuntu login screen art has brightnes increased" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/211740
<seb128> mvo: should bug #174524 be reassigned to the german translations?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 174524 in gnome-app-install "spelling mistake: german title in multimedia installer ("Mulitmedia")" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/174524
<seb128_> re
<seb128_> dsl disconnected again
<seb128_> did somebody wrote something for me?
<seb128_> in which case you should write it again ;-)
<seb128_> I did get anything after <seb128> mvo: should bug #174524 be reassigned to the german translations?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 174524 in gnome-app-install "spelling mistake: german title in multimedia installer ("Mulitmedia")" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/174524
<mvo> seb128_: yeah, that sounds like it
<slomo_> pitti: please accept gtk-sharp2 and gnome-sharp2 :) they finally fix the crash on exit bug for every application
<pitti> yay!
<pitti> slomo_: however, that has to wait until after the RC
 * pitti hugs slomo_
<slomo_> oh
<slomo_> ok :)
<slomo_> np
 * slomo_ hugs pitti 
<seb128__> anybody wanting to check if swfdec-gnome 2.22.2 from debian builds and work correctly on hardy so maybe we can do the update?
<kwwii> seb128__: well, I have an updated version but the bright version was made to make you know who happy
<seb128__> ah ok
<seb128__> just wanted to let you know that some users are complaining about the lack of reply on the bug
<seb128__> so maybe write something there to explain if that will be changed or not and why
<kwwii> can anyone verfiy bug #219020 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 219020 in human-theme "Defaults to Clearlooks Metacity theme for new users instead of Human" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/219020
<kwwii> I cannot reproduce it or understand why it is like this
<kwwii> seb128: can you verify bug #219020?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 219020 in human-theme "Defaults to Clearlooks Metacity theme for new users instead of Human" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/219020
<kwwii> the index.theme file does not use Clearlooks and already has the cursor stuff set so I cannot understand why this is happening
<seb128> kwwii: I think we would have noticed if that was the case
<seb128> dunno either
<kwwii> ok, I'll leave it be for now
<seb128> you can add a comment asking what sort of installation he did, etc and if he has other issues because that works for everybody else
 * Hobbsee waves
<seb128> 'night Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> seb128: oh, is it sleep time?
<seb128> Hobbsee: I though that's why you waved ;-)
<Hobbsee> ah.  no
<Hobbsee> but i'm considering sleep
<zasf> I still need some help with a Makefile.am, it doesn't compile saying "no rule to make target", see http://pastebin.com/m69fffbfa
<zasf> while Makefile.am seems to be ok -> http://pastebin.com/m16668f0e
<zasf> I basically only changed a stupid file name (http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/gnome-applets/trunk/invest-applet/data/art/Makefile.am?view=markup)
<kwwii> erm, pitti, seb128: we should be on version 0.18 of the human theme...I just noticed that we are still on 0.16
<seb128> hardy is frozen for rc still
<kwwii> noticed because of bug #219020
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 219020 in human-theme "Defaults to Clearlooks Metacity theme for new users instead of Human" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/219020
<seb128> ah, the update fixes that? it'll be accepted after rc
<kwwii> seb128: cool :-)
<kwwii> the bug came after I made the packages fixing it, funny enough
<seb128> what is the issue exactly?
<seb128> will be fixed when the update is accepted anyway
<kwwii> hrm, looking back at the 0.16 I can't see the problem either...freaky
<seb128> oh, btw redhat has a nautilus change to fallback to a default background image when the current one is not available, that would allow to drop the one which was still there for upgrade compatibility reasons
<kwwii> interesting idea
<kwwii> tedg: did you see bug #213064
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 213064 in inkscape "Inkscape does not maximize properly" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/213064
<tedg> No, but I'm guessing that's because we don't use GTK for the tool selector.
<tedg> Probably happens on 768 px high screens
<tedg> Which is why the theme would effect whether it happens or not.
<tedg> Are you seeing this on your laptop?
<kwwii> no, that was what made me wonder
<kwwii> I turned on and off all sorts of compiz stuff to test it out too
<kwwii> I would have been much louder if this would have effected me :-/
<kwwii> affected, I guess
<tedg> Heh, I imagine this has to be window management.
<tedg> But, in reality, Inkscape needs to be better at resizing.
<tedg> Or atleast have a way to disable tools that you don't care about.
<kwwii> I have often wished to be able to add or remove tools from the toolbar
<tedg> I have the whole thing planned out in my head, I just need to get around to implementing it...
<kwwii> hehe, the story of my life :D
<Johninky> hello all
<seb128> hi Johninky
<Johninky> hello seb128
<bryyce> seb128: cworth looked at the cairo we have in ubuntu currently and says that version causes certain printers to crash badly; he strongly recommends shipping 1.6.4 and no earlier 1.6.x releases since they've got bad known issues.  .4 is stable though, and is what he's shipping in Fedora
<seb128> bryyce: is cworth on #cairo right now?
<bryyce> yup
<ted1> Ah, is that the Xerox thing he was talking about?
<ted1> It's only a problem if you use fonts and text. :)
<seb128> bryyce: looks like he looked at the version and not the package though ;-)
<bryyce> yeah he was just looking over my shoulder, and didn't notice the ubuntu1 bit.  I showed him the patch so he saw it's the same
<seb128> yes
<seb128> the bug has been noticed by people at the canonical office
<seb128> and I'm the one who sent the bug upstream, and I hang on #cairo to talk about it
<Johninky> ok people we have a large problem here, I have lock my self in the car and drop my key on the outside of the car. Can  anyone help?
<seb128> so I backported the fix when they make it available ;-)
<Johninky> you know that would be pretty stupid of someone to do that right, but for real can you come by Longs on main and let me out.
<Johninky> long johns on main
<seb128> bryyce: ok, seems that the current cairo we have is alright ;-)
<Johninky>  I have a slight problem here i have seem to have lock my self in my car, I know I layed the keys on top and then got in. after I got in the car went click and the doors lock, anyone, anyone please help
<Amaranth> Johninky: You know that isn't possible, right?
<e-uoaphys> heh what a lame joke
<mvo> hey Amaranth
<Amaranth> hey
<Amaranth> you're up late :P
<mvo> doing releases is not good for my sleep pattern
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-04-19
<Johninky> Hey I have a great question, for a change,   is there a countdown timer like for the gadget bar in vista that I can put on my desktop???
<Amaranth> Johninky: This is a development channel
<MacSlow> Anybody tried recording GL-apps under Hardy with xvidcap 1.1.6 yet?
<MacSlow> Were your attempts successful?
<popey> hi MacSlow
<popey> not tried xvidcap 1.1.6 yet
<MacSlow> popey, cheers Alan!
<popey> i have used recordmydesktop and it can _just_ about keep up
<MacSlow> popey, I wanted to make some screencast of some early face-browser code but that was a no go :/
<popey> with xvidcap or rmd?
<MacSlow> xvidcap... just trying out rmd
<MacSlow> never heard of that before
<popey> rmd is good at 3d
<popey> http://popey.com/~alan/mark/ <- example of 3d stuff
<MacSlow> popey, sweet... thanks for this tip -> http://people.ubuntu.com/~mmueller/gdm-face-browser-1.ogg
<MacSlow> popey, got to tweak it  abit though
<popey> ooo MacSlow that's really sweet!
<MacSlow> popey, my first three days of serious coding with clutter
<MacSlow> still much left to do
<popey> looks good
<MacSlow> missing mipmapping support in clutter is currently the nastiest thing... but I think to overcome that with extending ClutterActor a bit
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-04-20
<delta1> hi all...
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-04-14
 * kenvandine_wk learned the difference between a . and ~ in a version :)
<didrocks> seb128: any reason why gnome-user-share is still 2.25.92?
<seb128> didrocks: nobody bothered doing the upgrade I guess
<kenvandine_wk> didrocks: i think it was late for 2.26.0
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: ?
<kenvandine_wk> i don't think the tarball was ready on time
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: we did GNOME updates today still so I don't think it was that late
<didrocks> seb128/kenvandine_wk: do you want I update it (to have a FFe)
<kenvandine_wk> so it wasn't in your queue :)
<kenvandine_wk> oh... not that late
<seb128> it's rather in universe so I don't list it
<kenvandine_wk> i meant last time
<kenvandine_wk> ah
<kenvandine_wk> i looked during the last bump, and it wasn't done
<seb128> it's up for MOTU or whoever cares about it
<seb128> I'm tracking ubuntu-desktop updates
<seb128> didrocks: feel free to do the update, thanks
<didrocks> seb128: ok, doing it now
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> seb128: y/w
<kenvandine_wk> asac: so how is the gwibber review?  what can we do?
<kenvandine_wk> asac: and anything i can do to help?
<superm1> seb128, wanted to ping you re bug 272083. upstream hasn't been responsive looking at the upstream bug report. how do you (and other -desktop) folk feel about pulling in a patch that just fixed it in the glade file?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 272083 in mythbuntu "Zenity windows appear underneath others" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/272083
<asac> kenvandine_wk: well. i think its too late for gwibber. we should file this upstream as lesson learned :)
<asac> for me the UI regressed. also it didnt even start -> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~asac/gwibber/xdg_data_dirs_typo/+merge/5516
<kenvandine_wk> we really want the indicator support though... perhaps we can just back port those changes?
<kenvandine_wk> hehe
<asac> kenvandine_wk: doesnt reawlly speak for the quality and seems liek more testing is needed
<kenvandine_wk> the extra _
<asac> kenvandine_wk: so yeah. if we can come up with a minimal indicator patch that would work
<kenvandine_wk> ok
<kenvandine_wk> asac: i can do that at least
<kenvandine_wk> jorge says there are some pretty important bug fixes too... but i guess we should make them justify bug fixes we pull in
<asac> kenvandine_wk: but that has to be easy to see that its safe ;) ... not sure if there were infrastructure fixes required - which would make this harder to do in a safe fashion
<asac> kenvandine_wk: we can pull in bug fixes after release as SRU
<kenvandine_wk> asac: the MI is easy
<kenvandine_wk> i will get a patch this morning :)
<asac> kenvandine_wk: "easy" always feels risky ;)
<asac> great
<jcastro> kenvandine_wk: that twitter patch needs to go in for sure
<jcastro> it doesn't work otherwise
<kenvandine_wk> good point
<kenvandine_wk> i'll do that separate
<seb128> you guys are still discussing gwibber?
<seb128> I've the impression you are discussing that for weeks now ;-)
<kenvandine_wk> hehe
<kenvandine_wk> it's a mess :/
<seb128> just drop the thing for jaunty if it doesn't work
<seb128> that will teach upstream to ship code which is working maybe next time ;-)
<seb128> superm1: I've no real opinion about that change and it's late for jaunty now, is that creating issues in visible situations?
<jcastro> seb128: well, they did have to wait for the indicator stuff to land
<jcastro> but yeah, it took too long
<kenvandine_wk> jcastro: 2 weeks ago in my ppa :)
<superm1> seb128, for mythbuntu it's making a bad situation, that if you launch mythtv-setup, when it closes, it uses zenity to ask to make some changes, but it comes up behind the application you launched mythtv-setup from, and the application you launched it from is blocked in the UI
<seb128> we shouldn't have pushed the indicator changes if they were too late then
<seb128> superm1: and nobody noticed until today?
<seb128> superm1: how did you do before?
<superm1> seb128, no we knew about it for a while, but we thought it was an xfwm4 bug
<superm1> xfwm4 was doing focus entirely wrong on 8.10, and w/ the update-manager changes they fixed that bug and this showed up w/ higher visibility
<seb128> I'm not familiar enough with the map on focus behaviour to comment and mvo is on holidays still today
<seb128> so ask slangasek or wait for him to come back tomorrow that will not be for rc anyway
<superm1> yeah it's post install that it is a problem, so after RC is fine
<asac> kenvandine_wk: there is supposed to be a twitter fix on trunk too; can you see if we can cherry pick that too?
<kenvandine_wk> asac: already done
<asac> kenvandine_wk: its 285
<asac> ah cool
<asac> kenvandine_wk: do you have your own team or are you in gwibber-team?
<asac> err your own branch i mean
<kenvandine_wk> no... just creating a debdiff
<asac> okay
<asac> kenvandine_wk: isnt it a full source branch? if thats the case cherry picking in bzr directly would make sens
<asac> (imho)
<kenvandine_wk> oh... didn't look
<kenvandine_wk> but i can do that
<kenvandine_wk> actually
<kenvandine_wk> not that simple
<kenvandine_wk> i am having to tweak the patches from bzr
<asac> kenvandine_wk: its bzr merge -c 285
<kenvandine_wk> because of other changes sprinkled in there
<kenvandine_wk> i am pulling bits from 4 revisions
<asac> yeah. still bzr might be smart when merging new upstream and eliminate it
<kenvandine_wk> the twitter one is just one rev
<asac> (not sure if its that smart though ;))
<kenvandine_wk> i had to make manual changes... not just merge related
<asac> kenvandine_wk: yeah one rev is merge -c REVISION
<asac> k
<kenvandine_wk> so is the packaging in bzr?
<asac> what does control suggest ;)?
<kenvandine_wk> yeah... :)
<kenvandine_wk> i hadn't looked there yet
<asac> kenvandine_wk: its https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~gwibber-team/gwibber/packaging
<kenvandine_wk> got it
<asac> fta: can you cut off a stable branch for revision 50 ?
<asac> kenvandine_wk: there is more ...revision 50 is what we have in archive
<kenvandine_wk> ok
<asac> fta: is the python-xdg depend needed for 0.8 or only after that?
<asac> kenvandine_wk: ok revision 51 is what you should start on
<kenvandine_wk> ok
<asac> except that the changelog is bumped there
<asac> which seems to be a mistake
<kenvandine_wk> asac: so why rev 51?
<kenvandine_wk> since rev 50 is existing version in universe?
<asac> kenvandine_wk: i wanted rev 51 for the python-xdg fix
<kenvandine_wk> ah
<kenvandine_wk> ok, so that is real
<asac> kenvandine_wk: well. just cut off rev 50
<asac> and do the python-xdg on that stable branch i would say
<kenvandine_wk> ok
<tedg> pitti: Thanks for sponsoring and uploading the bug fixes on indicator-applet.
<kenvandine_wk> just add the dep?
<pitti> hey tedg; you're welcome
<asac> kenvandine_wk: yeah. bump changelog to next revision and UNRELEASED and commit python-xdg dep
<juanje> hi, guys. Does anyone know if there is any standard for menu entries? some spec, doc, wiki or something?
<juanje> I mean the way of putting the names and descriptions
<dobey> juanje: there's the fd.o desktop and menu specifications
<dobey> desktop file rather
<juanje> dobey: yeah, I know. It is not what I meant.
<dobey> well name should be the name of your app, and description should be a very short (few words) description of what it does
<juanje> I mean the names like: "Description App name"
<juanje> or "App name"
<juanje> or "Description (App name)"
<juanje> dobey: yes, but the problem is that I don't see any standard way to fill the field "Name=" on .desktops
<dobey> name, genericname, and description seem like straightforward descriptions of what they should be, to me
<juanje> some apps put just descriptions
<dobey> juanje: all apps put their name there
<dobey> what apps put descriptions there?
<juanje> others add also a description
<juanje> dobey: let me search one...
<dobey> some put both name and genericname inside name
<dobey> which is wrong really
<dobey> epiphany does that
<dobey> the point of them being separate is to allow whatever is displaying the menus to handle that in some preferred way
<mclasen> them being separate is broken, i18n-wise, though
<juanje> dobey: here some examples:
<juanje> /usr/share/applications/transmission.desktop:Name=Transmission BitTorrent Client
<juanje> /usr/share/applications/tsclient.desktop:Name=Terminal Server Client
<juanje> /usr/share/applications/vino-preferences.desktop:Name=Remote Desktop
<juanje> /usr/share/applications/xsane.desktop:Name=XSane Image scanning program
<juanje> /usr/share/applications/brasero.desktop:Name=Brasero Disc Burner
<juanje> /usr/share/applications/alacarte.desktop:Name=Main Menu
<juanje> some has name, some not
<juanje> some description, some just the description
<juanje> and there are much more
<juanje> all are from the last Jaunty
<dobey> mclasen: not really
<mclasen> yes, it is
<dobey> having N apps all translate the same text N times is broken, i18n-wise
<dobey> for most apps, Name shouldn't be translated at all
<mclasen> if you want to be able to display a combination of name and generic name in the menu, that combination needs to be translated as one
<juanje> dobey: but should be a standard about what to put as Name
<dobey> we shouldn't be putting generic name in anything anyway
<dobey> and name and generic name shouldn't be concatenated
<juanje> somethines devs don't put the app name, others yes
<dobey> juanje: i think you're just confusing some of them because "preferences" items are also in /usr/share/applications
<dobey> so alacarte just says "Main Menu", which it isn't, but which it modifies
<juanje> dobey: not, if you see the apps in the menu you can see they are different
<juanje> my problem is this is very heterogeneous and cofusing for the normal users
<dobey> i didn't say others weren't broken
<dobey> i said for the general case, name is the app's name
<juanje> ok
<juanje> I just need to know if there is any policy or spec about it in Ubuntu
<dobey> or apparently in a lot of cases it is "appname genericname" which is broken
<juanje> ummm
<juanje> so, the normal way should be something like: Name=Epiphany  and GenericName=Web Browser
<tedg> juanje: I'm pretty sure that the accepted standard is to use "Appname Functionality"
<juanje> so you concatenate the names if you whish
<tedg> Whether or not dobey thinks it's broken :)
<dobey> tedg: it's broken
<dobey> the accepted standard is more like 'do whatever the hell you feel like'
<juanje> dobey:  I think it's important and should be fixed...
<juanje> :-/
<dobey> yes it should be fixed
<juanje> the users can get very confused
<dobey> but you'll find people will prefer to pain the shed, rather than fix it
<juanje> and it's madnes for documentation
<juanje> dobey: where you think is the better place to talk that? I mean, to make a spec and trying to do something?
<dobey> i think making another spec would be redundant and pointless
<juanje> I'm working on Guadalinex (a Ubuntu derivative) and we need to fix for us, but we like to help to be fixed upstream (I mean Ubuntu)
<dobey> http://standards.freedesktop.org/desktop-entry-spec/desktop-entry-spec-latest.html#recognized-keys
<dobey> that clearly specifies what name/genericname/comment should be
<juanje> dobey: but there is already a lot of things Ubuntu change on the packages (for example the X-GETTEXT.... on .desktops)
<dobey> sure
<juanje> ummmm
<juanje> so we can change them in the same way, I guess...
<dobey> if you want to maintain additional patches, sure
<dobey> it would be best to get it fixed in proper upstream though
<juanje> yes, of course
<juanje> with official applications from GNOME or others big projects should be easier...
<seb128> juanje: what do you want to add?
<juanje> dobey: ok, thanks, so much for the info. I'll give it a though...
<dobey> filing bugs with patches that are "foo does not adhere to the desktop file standard" are probably a good approach to it
<juanje> seb128: I just like to have standard names for all the menu entries
<seb128> "standard"?
<juanje> not like now
<dobey> seb128: "not a cluster of random different whatever the developer decided to shove in a desktop file"
<juanje> seb128: yes, now there are some like "App_name description", other like "App_name" and other like "Description"
<seb128> the HIG has recommendations and most applications are using those
<juanje> seb128: and which is that recomendation?
<seb128> the appname is there when that's not the standard application to do something
<seb128> gedit is "text editor"
<seb128> for example
<juanje> aha
<dobey> ugh, the HIG is broken
<seb128> but gtkedit would be "gtkedit text editor"
<seb128> so you don't confuse both
<dobey> the gnome hig is
<juanje> ummmm
<seb128> there has been several GNOME discussions about that already
<juanje> seb128: that is confusing for the userws and documentation
<seb128> and how to handle the case where you have several applications for the same function
<dobey> yeah, but GNOME isn't the only thing on the block
<seb128> well there is no easy way around it
<seb128> you don't want to put the application name in each menu entry that's ugly
<juanje> seb128: mostly if yuo don't have the same "official" apps, as the Derivatives cases
<seb128> but when you have several text editors you still want to be able to make the difference
<dobey> well yes
<juanje> seb128: but that is many times useful for documentation purposes
<dobey> you don't want 10 text editors all called "Text Editor"
<dobey> and having "Foo Text Editor" is almost as bad, since it's just blatently redundant
<dobey> and it doesn't fit with the freedesktop spec
<seb128> juanje: what do you suggest changing to make it better?
<juanje> seb128: putting the name somehow
<didrocks> re
<seb128> wb didrocks
<seb128> juanje: in every item? that would look ugly compared to what we have now
<seb128> and titles would be harder to parse
<dobey> no, every item shouldn't have app name as name
<juanje> seb128: "Text edit (Gedit)"
<seb128> that's not nice looking
<mclasen>  eek
<dobey> there needs to be more heuristic evaluation of it
<dobey> ie, only things that are OnlyShowIn should have a generic name as Name
<juanje> seb128: I know it is not the better option, but something must be
<dobey> so gnome-calculator should be Calculator
<seb128> that was discussed somewhere some time ago
<dobey> but epiphany should be Epiphany
<seb128> I think vuntz suggested adding the name if there was several option for the same function
<seb128> I will probably not find the discussion now
<seb128> that was either on the GNOME desktop devel list or the xdg one
<dobey> but having GenericName at all seems pointless and a waste of time
<dobey> it was almost certainly on a gnome list
<juanje> seb128: I said that because on Guadalinex we have thousands of users which use the applications everyday on schools and other centers and they need lots of time to know the name of some application and the documentation, recipes and technical support need to know which app are they running...
<dobey> because the gnome hig differs from the freedesktop spec
<juanje> seb128: It's not easy guess which apps they are running some times... :-/
<dobey> also, having menu names that differ from what's in "About" is annoying
<seb128> http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2008-July/msg00165.html
<tedg> juanje: Depending on how your docs are built, it might be good to pull those from the .desktop files.  So if they change, your documentation gets updated.
<seb128> ^ that was the discussion
<dobey> yes, that was the gnome discussion that only considered gnome :)
<seb128> still it has some suggestions and arguments
<juanje> tedg: when you need to guide to a very end user through menues and options, you need to know...
<seb128> ie useful to read before starting the discussion from scratch
<seb128> juanje: well the documentation should match what you install
<seb128> juanje: read the url I copied there
<juanje> seb128: I'm goint now... But it's not just about the documetnation, also the technical support and more stuff
 * juanje reading....
<seb128> juanje: I don't say there is not a problem, you are arguing the wrong way
<seb128> ie don't try to convince me there is an issue
<seb128> but rather try to find a good solution
<juanje> seb128: What do you mean?
<juanje> ok
<seb128> well you are trying to explain that the current situation is not ideal
<seb128> we know about that, there is just no obvious better way right now
<seb128> but we are open to suggestions
<juanje> seb128: don't get me wrong, I don't try to convince you, I was just asking for a standard or for place to discuss and try to find solution. I haven't the solution at all
<seb128> the xdg list would be a good place to start I guess
<seb128> but such issues have already been discussed
<seb128> so better to come with a good suggestion if you want to get things moving ;-)
<dobey> well, even in the context of only gnome, the result of that discussion isn't the best
<juanje> seb128: In Guadalinex we were changing all the .desktops to fit with "Description (app_name)" for all our defaults apps, but we like to try doing better and working with upstream
<seb128> what are you trying to solve exactly?
<seb128> make the job easier for phone debugging?
<juanje> in part
<juanje> and to have all the entries in the same way
<juanje> no some with names and others without them
<seb128> that doesn't bring any value
<seb128> just makes those look less nice
<juanje> and if the people goes to a forum and somebody says something about one app they know which one is
 * asac runs to get some before before the meeting
<juanje> seb128: well, at least looks more homogeneous...
<seb128> they look less nice too
<seb128> "Text Editor"
<juanje> seb128: I know, it isn't nicer, but less heterogeneous
<seb128> "Image Editor"
<calc> juanje: are you doing it via GenericName (Name) or something else?
<seb128> that's better than
<seb128> "Text Editor (Somename)"
<calc> seb128: not when you have more than one Text Editor installed :)
<seb128> juanje: who cares about heterogeneous, what you aim at is easy to use
<seb128> calc: cf backlog
 * calc looking
<seb128> "Text Editor" is the standard editor
<juanje> seb128: heterogeneous get the users confused...
<seb128> other alternative have the name specified
<seb128> juanje: I fail to see why "Text Editor" would be confusing to users
<juanje> seb128: that not
<dobey> seb128: if you set "Text Editor" to something other than gedit in preferred applications
<seb128> we don't do that
<kenvandine_wk> asac: bug 361120
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 361120 in gwibber "Backport message indicator support from trunk to 0.8" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/361120
<juanje> seb128: to have "Text Editor" and toher entry like "Foo for doing somwthing"
<kenvandine_wk> asac: mind taking a look?
<dobey> seb128: we don't, but if some user does
<kenvandine_wk> asac: none of the source files are in the branch... so i couldn't use bzr-buildpackage... first one i have run into like that
<dobey> oh, i guess 'text editor' was removed from default app preferences
<juanje> seb128: Ok, Ubuntu and GNOME use some apps as defaults, but maybe other derivatives use others apps instead
<dobey> and default app prefs is some awful ui too
<kenvandine_wk> asac: gwibber seems fine
<calc> i stopped reading once seb128 mentioned the the Gnome HIG specifically tells developers to violate the standard
<seb128> (on the phone)
<calc> so this issue is because Gnome is braindamaged once again :\
<calc> imho it should have the correct values in the various areas and detect in the menu display code if it needs to display more such as "Name GenericName" such as for the gtkedit Text Editor case
<calc> but then a lot of what Gnome does seems way out in space :\
<dobey> i don't think i agree with that
<dobey> but the HIG is definitely braindamaged
<calc> dobey: well if you don't want all programs to always display such as Name GenericName then there has to be some sort of autodetection... or violation of the spec
<calc> dobey: which is what i think they ended up saying f*ck the spec instead of doing the autodetection
<calc> of course if you autodetect you also run into the problem of program names in the menu changing if you install more than one of the same type app
<seb128> juanje: if you change "Text Editor" that's your issue as a distributor, you should not be doing that or update your documentation
<dobey> nah, there is a better way to do it
<calc> eg "Text Editor" becomes Gedit Text Editor magically if you install another one (from the user perspective)
<dobey> "Text Editor" should be calling gnome-text-editor
<calc> dobey: ah yea :) well for this one case that is true
<seb128> calc: GNOME doesn't do any autodetection
<dobey> at least, on deb/ubuntu/etc...
<seb128> calc: they just use Name
<calc> seb128: i know.. they tell people to violate the spec instead
<seb128> calc: no they don't
<calc> seb128: did you just say that they tell people to put in Name what they want displayed instead of the actual Name of the app?
<dobey> seb128: yes they do. the HIG specifically says "don't do what the spec says, but do this instead"
<dobey> without mentioning anything about the spec
<calc> "Text Editor" is not the real name of Gedit
<dobey> "text editor" is hardly a sufficient description of gedit anyway
 * calc notes this is one of those things about Gnome that has annoyed him a long time, unless KDE has changed it actually used to use the values correctly
<seb128> calc: KDE allow to customize the format using Name and GenericName I think
<seb128> ie you can use "Name - GenericName"
<seb128> or "Name"
<seb128> or whatever
<calc> yes and so they don't violate the spec either
<calc> gnome decided we'll take the file format for desktop files and then just ignore the rest of the spec
<seb128> who cares about the stupid spec ;-)
<calc> Gnome == MSFT? :)
<juanje> seb128: ummm... But, now, which is used in GNOME for the menus entries? Name or GnericName?
<calc> juanje: Name
<seb128> calc: the spec has been mostly written by GNOME people
<calc> seb128: so even better they are preceding microsoft's OOXML efforts of documenting something that they don't even use properly themselves ;-)
<seb128> calc: there is just a disagrement on the naming, your anti-GNOME comments are not really constructive there
<dobey> seb128: actually, i think it was mostly written by waldo, and the gnome people just made minor changes/patches to it
<calc> seb128: its very clear what is supposed to go into Name otherwise there would be no GenericName field at ALL
<seb128> calc: ok, really constructive trolling, I will just ignore you there I think
<seb128> I'm fine discussion the issue
<seb128> but that's not the chan for trolling
<seb128> discussion -> discussing
<calc> seb128: explain why GenericName exists at all if Gnome supposeldy wrote the spec themselves... when they 1. don't use GenericName, and 2. Stick generic names into Name
<juanje> well people, calm down... please...
<seb128> calc: the spec is not all about Name
<seb128> calc: you focus on one line of the spec
<calc> of course its not, but that is one of the main features of the spec as it is primarily for menu items
<dobey> calc: GenericName shouldn't exist (but neither should it be appended to Name)
<seb128> calc: there is just disagrement on what Name should be
<calc> ok
 * calc notes this also causes Ubuntu to decide it needs to rewrite the Name fields for all OOo packages and properly other distros for other programs since we can't just stick to Name="Real Name" GenericName="what it is"
<calc> s/properly/probably/
<juanje> ummmm.. So the problem here is what the Name field should be?
<calc> since apparently no one can agree (or knows?) what should be in the two fields distributions end up having to hack up the files themselves to make the menu entries look the way they want them to.... EPIC FAIL
<juanje> I thought the rule was follow the spec... and the problem was some apps that were broken that rule... I guess I was wrong...
<calc> the whole concept of this was to make menus less trouble to deal with and it hasn't really acheived... works for the mime half (afaik) but not well for the menus
<mclasen> following the spec to the letter doesn't lead to workable menus
<calc> mclasen: not workable according to the HIG i suppose? It seems to work well for KDE
<juanje> mclasen: so, why the spec then?
<asac> kenvandine_wk: please add LP: #358341 to the twitter changelog entry
<mclasen> but menus are not really a very good solution for the problem in the first place
<juanje> calc: How is KDE doing that?
<seb128> juanje: how you want, they let you pick the field to use and the order
 * asac waits for some dents to arrive to see how well indicate works with gwibber
<kenvandine_wk> asac: ij
<calc> juanje: i don't remember anymore, its been a few years since i maintained KDE
<seb128> juanje: which probably doesn't make your documentation job any easier
<juanje> calc: but they use Name and GenericName?
<calc> juanje: afaik they use them depending on what you set in the config
<calc> juanje: can be Name (GenericName) GenericName (Name) and maybe various other combinations
<calc> some years ago i wrote menu-xdg, back when i still maintained KDE
<asac> kenvandine_wk: to earn extra credits you could refer to the revision you cherry picked/ported either in patch description or in changelog
 * asac still waiting for new dents ;)
<juanje> seb128: ummmm... I don't know...
<kenvandine_wk> asac: pushed changes
<kenvandine_wk> asac: ok, i can add revnos :)
<asac> either URL to revisions or revno + branch reference ;)
 * calc stops discussing something that will never be solved, no point in hoping they start following standards
<asac> kenvandine_wk: bug 359885 and bug 360468 are dupes, right?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 359885 in gwibber "Gwibber is exceeding the Twitter rate limit (HTTP Error 400: Bad request)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/359885
<calc> juanje: basically you will probably need to patch all desktop files you want to change yourself... we already do that in Ubuntu to make the OOo "Name"s generic
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 360468 in gwibber "Gwibber 1.0.2: HTTPError: HTTP Error 401: Unauthorized" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/360468
<juanje> seb128: the problem with the documentation, support and users is that usually people like to have names for calling to the things their use and not all the apps have the same menus, options, configurations and so. And when an user google for a problem on Guadalinex/Ubuntu usually found stuff like "open Gedit and do something" or "run appX" and so on...
<rcmorano> i don't see the bad point in following the [obsolote-or-not]spec
<rcmorano> at least we'd have smth standard...
<rcmorano> not a mess
<asac> kenvandine_wk: hmm first seems to be rate related. so i guess only the 36.. one is dupe
<calc> rcmorano: the spec isn't obsolete its that Gnome just choooses to ignore what those two fields are actually for
<seb128> rcmorano: there is no mess right now, the ubuntu menus are quite easy to use, the entry are described by their function
<calc> rcmorano: which leads to people having to rewrite the desktop files for various apps because they don't like the way they look
<kenvandine_wk> asac: yes, that's right
<calc> rcmorano: in Ubuntu's case if they were done properly we could just use GenericName instead of Name for all apps
<asac> kenvandine_wk: so 359885 is a regression from the the GET/POST fix (of course not easily fixable, so ok imo)
<kenvandine_wk> yeah
<dobey> calc: what would GenericName for gnometris be? :)
<juanje> seb128: I know is a bit uglier to have "GenericName (Name)" or similar, but it is worst to have some in that way, others "Generic Name", others "Name - GnericName", and much muro.. options in the same menu...
<calc> dobey: that one is tough as its already nearly infringing on a trademark
<rcmorano> seb128: not every application uses the same naming style
<dobey> calc: and following the gnome hig would be stupid "Gnometris Tetris" ?
<dobey> heh
<calc> dobey: i think they used the trademark in the genericname field for kde's version at least for a while
<seb128> we can go round for hours on this discussion, I stop there
<asac> kenvandine_wk: when is the indication supposed to happen? only when i get replies?
<seb128> GNOME already had it several times
<rcmorano> so for me it's kinda a mess and an extra job to re-rewrite the names for our distro
<kenvandine_wk> asac: yes
<asac> kenvandine_wk: can you dent me something ;)?
<kenvandine_wk> well
<juanje> seb128: Ok, GNOME menu it's very easy to use and I love that, but there are a lot of not GNOME apps the people install or need, which follow different ways
<kenvandine_wk> do you have python-indicate installed?
<dobey> GNOME having a discussion is only partly useful
<asac> kenvandine_wk: i would think so ;)
<calc> dobey: well putting "Tetris" anywhere in it would be stupid yes... since you don't want to get sued :)
<asac> kenvandine_wk: let me check
<seb128> having "Description - Name" for every entry is just not nice looking and wouldn't be any better
<pitti> I'm off now, for dinner; see you tomorrow!
<kenvandine_wk> oh... i should add that as a recommends
<asac> kenvandine_wk: yes. i mean gwibber appears in the applet.
<kenvandine_wk> pitti: later!
<seb128> pitti: no team meeting for you?
<asac> kenvandine_wk: its just i dont get any messages indicated there
<kenvandine_wk> asac: ok... let me dent you
<rcmorano> why to have "Description - Name" just in some apps ?
<dobey> calc: having the game at all with any name similar to tetris is probably grounds for getting sued
<asac> kenvandine_wk: yeah. once i saw this working, we should add it as recommends
<calc> seb128: if you installed all desktop apps in universe i think your idea of what looks nice vs the way they currently look might change
 * kenvandine_wk does that
<seb128> calc: we optimize for default installation
<calc> seb128: i'd imagine if you did that GenericName - Name (properly done) would look much better
 * asac keeps gwibber in tray (not open) and waits for indication
<dobey> GenericName needs to FOAD
<calc> seb128: aka we don't care about anything other than a very small set of programs
<asac> kenvandine_wk: nope :(
<asac> kenvandine_wk: only got your bubble
<asac> no indication
<seb128> calc: is that new to you?
<Amaranth> I haven't seen any apps in my menus with Generic Name - Name
<calc> seb128: so whether it looks good in the general case... we actually don't care about
<dobey> you don't see people having this discussion in windows
<seb128> calc: that's why we have main and universe
<calc> seb128: no but arguing that it looks good currently is myopic
<kenvandine_wk> asac: humm... it's working for me...
<dobey> "Oh, What should we call Word?" I know "MS Word Word Processor"
<kenvandine_wk> asac: dent me
<asac> kenvandine_wk: define "working" ;)
<asac> kenvandine_wk: ok
<rcmorano> word :>
<juanje> dobey: Not, but people know what is Word, they don't say "Word Processor"...
<rickspencer3> dobey: actually,  you can't call the game Tetris, but you can have the exact same game play and call it something similar, but not exactly "Tetris"
<dobey> juanje: yes. and we're too afraid as a competing OS to suggest that users might quickly discover that "Foo" is the word processor to use
<juanje> dobey: people know apps names, not just functionallities
<calc> dobey: we don't have word :) and generally i think with the name generic name setup it would be done like "Word Processor (AbiWord)\n Word Processor (MS Word)\n Word Processor (OpenOffice.org Writer)"
<rickspencer3> thus the large number of clones
<juanje> unless we would like it
<dobey> calc: we have AbiWord
<calc> dobey: yes... i meant about how it would be displayed
<rcmorano> calc: you just described guadalinex menu entries :]
<dobey> a) GenericName should FOAD and not be in the desktop file at all
<asac> meeting o'clock ?
<asac> @now
<asac> hmm
<kenvandine_wk> asac: humm... perhaps not...
<asac> @time
<dobey> b) Generic Name should be programmatically determined from the Categories in the desktop
<rcmorano> and we may say users feel _pretty_ confortable with that
<asac> kenvandine_wk: i had the same issue with gajim
<asac> kenvandine_wk: it shows up, but never indicates
<rcmorano> dobey: from categories??
<dobey> c) "menu items" should probably be "Name\n<small>$determined_generic_name</small>"
<asac> kenvandine_wk: so now that more apps get this issue, it seems like a indicate bug (e.g. maybe it doesnt like the order we use?)
<dobey> rcmorano: yes, that places where generic name is repeated anyway
<seb128> asac: in half an hour?
<calc> rcmorano: yea he did as well by saying "MS Word Word Processor"
<dobey> GNOME;Internet;WebBrowser
<kenvandine_wk> asac: yeah... that gajim bug showed up with libindicate 0.1.5
<calc> rcmorano: and its actually already displayed in that manner if you enable the option in KDE (for 3.x anyway)
<dobey> for example
<kenvandine_wk> asac: my example python script still works...
 * kenvandine_wk looks at the code
<asac> kenvandine_wk: yeah. the example python code works. only difference i could see in gajim was the order of adding indication and caling "show
<dobey> and yeah, for most use cases, a "menu" is the wrong solution
<asac> "
<rcmorano> i think $determined_generic_name wont mean the same for me and for you
<calc> aren't categories still defined in the spec... so you can't easily generate a genericname out of a short list of categories
<calc> er a userful genericname
<rcmorano> ok, i got it, that would be ok
<asac> kenvandine_wk: i didnt look further, because whole gajim trunk fell apart and i had other things to do.
<kenvandine_wk> asac: oh... interesting
<dobey> calc: apps should specify their categories properly
 * kenvandine_wk tests 
<rcmorano> since categories are already in some specs
<rcmorano> i think
<rcmorano> :>
<dobey> calc: and if new categories need to be added, then they should be added
<dobey> categories are specified in the menu spec, yes
<calc> dobey: with sufficiently expanded list of categories that might work
<rcmorano> anyway getting functionality from categories
<rcmorano> would be problematic
<rcmorano> since you don't know which one is the functionality from all of them
<rcmorano> you just have a way to sort 'em in menus
<juanje> in here: /usr/share/applications/totem.desktop:Categories=GTK;GNOME;AudioVideo;Player;Video;
<juanje> which do you choose?
<juanje> I mean, usually there are a few
<kenvandine_wk> asac: can you dent me again?
<asac> kenvandine_wk: ;)
<asac> done
<dobey> juanje: well, frankly, the spec is broken wrt audio/video player categories i think
<calc> juanje: the list is documented so it should be doable programatically (i think)
<dobey> juanje: so the solution would be to fix the spec, and then fix the totem.desktop :)
<calc> juanje: also it is a hierarchy for the most part
<kenvandine_wk> asac: very weird... i am seeing the replies in trunk... but not in the patched 0.8
<rcmorano> for the most part hehe
<asac> kenvandine_wk: add some printf's to see if the indication is actually added
<asac> maybe some infrastructure code is missing and that code path isnt run or so
<kenvandine_wk> gonna just drop to the debugger :)
<kenvandine_wk> yeah
<asac> kenvandine_wk: whats the best python debugger?
<kenvandine_wk> epdb
<kenvandine_wk> it is in gafton's ppa :)
<juanje> dobey, calc: so that is a start :-)
<juanje> :-P
<dobey> i wonddr if gnome-main-menu is still maintained
<juanje> I really don't dislike the idea of "GenericName - Name" or similar if everybody use as it's defined, but I it's necessary to fix the spec, let's do it
<juanje> if it's broken....
<juanje> it is just a spec
<juanje> we can change it, can't we?
<kenvandine_wk> asac: ... ok... again please?
<kenvandine_wk> there should be a test service out there :)
<kenvandine_wk> like ekiga's echo test
<rcmorano> what's freedesktop for then :P
<rcmorano> gtg
<rcmorano> cya mates :]
<juanje> ok, guys, thanks
<juanje> bye
<kenvandine_wk> asac: nm... i got a way to test
<asac> kenvandine_wk: done. maybe its easier to delete cache of read dents or so and startup will then automatically reindicate stuff?
<asac> ok cool.
<asac> did you remove cache?
<kenvandine_wk> no... just used a different account :)
<asac> hehe ;)
<kenvandine_wk> ok, figured it out... it is never getting into that code
<kenvandine_wk> i must have missed a method
<asac> that makes a bit of sense
<kenvandine_wk> that doesn't explain gajim :)
<asac> (compared to gajim
<asac> lol
<asac> let me start gajim ... maybe it works better today
<rickspencer3> I thought getting Gwibber ready was "easy"
<kenvandine_wk> it is :)
<kenvandine_wk> testing is harder
<asac> 15:58 < asac> kenvandine_wk: "easy" always feels risky ;)
<asac> kenvandine_wk: whats your jabber id?
<rickspencer3> desktop team meeting in 5 minutes
<kenvandine_wk> asac: ken@vandine.org
<asac> kenvandine_wk: ok added you
<calc> hi
<Nafallo> ehrm
<rickspencer3> Team meeting?
<ArneGoetje> hi
 * asac waves
<Nafallo> indication-applet just jumped from the left side of the screen to the right after a reboot...
<rickspencer3> asac ArneGoetje bryce calc seb128
<seb128> hello rickspencer3
<asac> Nafallo: heh. its supposed to be right afaik ;)
<rickspencer3> pitti is off celebrating the inevitable grinding away of his youth
<rickspencer3> :)
<seb128> ;-)
<rickspencer3> kenvandine seems to be missing in action, something I said?
<rickspencer3> tkamppeter: hi
<tkamppeter> rickspencer3: hi
<bryce> morning
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-04-14
<rickspencer3> let's roll
<rickspencer3> actions from previous meeting - nothing to discuss I think, please read the wiki
<rickspencer3> we'll figure out team meeting and cohesiveness issues via the email thread I suspect
<rickspencer3> okay, so kenvandine_wk owns that action item
<rickspencer3> j/k
<kenvandine_wk> hehe
<asac> :)
<Nafallo> asac: doesn't mean it should move on me.
<tkamppeter> bryce, some good news for you: I organized the OpenPrinting Summit in SF last week and my laptop worked perfectly with two projectors!
<kenvandine_wk> i enabled jabber just in time to crash pidgin for the meeting
<bryce> tkamppeter: good to hear :-)
<asac> :)
<rickspencer3> okay, moving on ...
<rickspencer3> -intel
<bryce> shoot me now
<calc> is there a intel gnome screensaver related issue?
<rickspencer3> bryce, you mentioned greedy, but I thought a general discussion might be in order
 * calc waits until after rickspencer3 is done with his issues :)
<rickspencer3> bryce: what's the status and what can we do to help ?
<bryce> there are two major issues
<bryce> first is a freeze that I think I've narrowed to the mesa 7.3 -> 7.4 upgrade
<bryce> which occurred April 3rd, and seems to correlate to when people (i965 users only) started seeing it
 * rickspencer3 nods
<bryce> unfortunately the freeze occurs only after several hours (24 hrs in some cases) use
<asac> would reverting to 7.3 be an option?
<bryce> so we could use help at this time from people with i965 to reproduce the freeze and verify reverting solves it
<bryce> asac: yes
<asac> bryce: what is 7.4 vs. 7.4? how many commits are there?
<rickspencer3> bryce: are there instructions for revering somewhere?
<asac> 7.3 vs. ..
<seb128> in which conditions does it freeze?
<bryce> asac: more likely, I think we'd revert all the -intel changes, since mesa 7.4 also carries unrelated fixes we don't have trouble with
<bryce> asac, a lot, but for -intel it's mostly DRI2 stuff that we don't use by default yet
<asac> hmm
<asac> ok
<bryce> seb128: it is not tied to particular steps to reproduce
<bryce> people use the word "randomly" to describe it, but I hate that word for describing bugs ;-)
<rickspencer3> bryce: does anyone hit the freeze if they've turned off desktop effects? in other words, does turning off desktop effects avoid the problem
<rickspencer3> ?
<bryce> compiz either triggers it or makes it much more likely to be triggered
<asac> bryce: whats the bug number?
<rickspencer3> can we revert to 7.3 in an SRU?
<seb128> well if you don't use compiz you don't use 3d a lot usually
<bryce> bug 359392
<seb128> bug #359392
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 359392 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[i965] X freezes starting on April 3rd" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/359392
<bryce> I'm embarrassed to admit it, but I've never reverted a package to an older version before, so don't actually know the procedure
<bryce> I mean, not in the archive
<seb128> it's easy, bump the version
<rickspencer3> good
<calc> bryce: well assuming no library changes requiring everything above it be recompiled then you just have to bump the version fooreallybar
<seb128> 7.4.is.7.3
<bryce> rickspencer3: for a user to revert to 7.3, you just need to locate the corresponding 7.3 deb on an archive.  there's also links from the bug
<bryce> seb128: ok
<rickspencer3> bryce: ack on the instructions
<rickspencer3> so reverting in an SRU sounds like a possibility
<bryce> so that's the freeze issue
<asac> bryce: so plan is backout intel changes from mesa and getting testing on PPA?
<bryce> the other issue is  a performance regression
<seb128> for what is worth I'm running a igm965 and didn't run into the bug
<superm1> can we not just back out all the way to 7.3 instead of just the intel changes?
<bryce> superm1: for the freeze issue, I think backing out the intel changes would be sufficient
<bryce> however there is another bug superm1 is concerned about which appears to be in some of the other mesa changes
<seb128> I doubt  slangasek will accept downgrading mesa before jaunty now
<rickspencer3> agreed
<rickspencer3> I think anything we do now is SRU
<rickspencer3> (if that's what you meant seb128)
<seb128> SRU means we have some time to isolate the buggy commit or fix the bug
<rickspencer3> right
<rickspencer3> reverting is an option, but we might still find a better solution
<rickspencer3> bryce: do you want to talk about the other issue?
<bryce> I'm waiting on tjaalton for a plan of attack... I'd like to be able to isolate the patch that causes the breakage, and just revert that, if possible
<bryce> rickspencer3: yes
<seb128> I don't think we should start by considering downgrading mesa to 7.3 before spending some extra time on the issue
<bryce> the other issue is a performance regression issue on -intel
<bryce> a lot of people are complaining a lot about this
<seb128> all cards?
<bryce> seems a random assortment, mostly seen with compiz enabled
<asac> bug id?
<bryce> bugs 252094, 359600, 349992
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 252094 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "MASTER: Poor graphics performance on Intel" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/252094
<rickspencer3> bryce: I'm guessing from the Kubuntu bug, that it's more *noticeable* with compiz, but shows up in other areas as well
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 359600 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "Solved slow 2D performances with EXA" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/359600
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 349992 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[945 tiling] Low performance due to no A17 workaround" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/349992
<bryce> one recent suggestion on 359600 is to re-enable the "greedy" migration heuristic (remember that?)
<asac> when did we disable it?
<bryce> several people report it solves the problem on EXA just fine
<seb128> (no?)
<bryce> asac: intrepid (2.4.1 -intel)
<bryce> it was disabled principally due to a crash bug it caused
<asac> bryce: the rational was bugginess?
<bryce> and secondarily because (at the time) it was no longer needed
<asac> ok
<bryce> in recent testing, the _patch_ still causes the crash
<bryce> however if people set the option manually in xorg.conf it works
<asac> how bad is the performance issue? could we do that as a well tested SRU too?
<rickspencer3> asac: it's very bad
<bryce> so not sure what's wrong there; presumably something with the order stuff is done in the patch
<asac> hmm
<bryce> anyway
<asac> bryce: whats that patch about? just flipping the default for the existing greedy option?
<bryce> slangasek reported just this morning that even with the manual settings, it breaks firefox badly
<bryce> (black firefox window where page should be)
<rickspencer3> hmm
<rickspencer3> didn't for me
<rickspencer3> I think I would have noticed that ;)
<bryce> asac: correct, it's pretty minimal
<rickspencer3> still, no easy answer there
<asac> black windows in ffox sounds like a blocker
<bryce> so my question is, should I still pursue this greedy approach?  (It's a complete hack)
<bryce> or should I focus efforts on the freeze + other solutions to perf
<asac> i think we can definitly call for testing if you have it in a ppa
<seb128> I'm not sure what greedy is
<seb128> but that seems to much of a change at this stage
<rickspencer3> asac: he already did, and got back segfault reports
<seb128> too
<asac> but for now i feel like we should take extra care given that slangasek reported black windows in ffox
<rickspencer3> (regerssion)
<bryce> seb128: it prevents pixmaps from being migrated to the back buffer, thus preventing various acceleration algorithms from running
<rickspencer3> seb128: I think we all understand that we are talking SRUs now, right?
<bryce> seb128: in cases where those algorithms are busted, preventing them from running actually makes performance better
<seb128> rickspencer3: right
<bryce> but can cause various other problems
<seb128> rickspencer3: but even for sru, rendering issue and crashes doesn't sound good
<rickspencer3> seb128: agreed
<asac> good so lets put that high on the SRU list and move on
<asac> SRU list == investigate whats going on and come up with a real fix
<rickspencer3> asac: agreed
<seb128> +1
<bryce> alrighty
<rickspencer3> I think bryce was asking if people had thoughts about what to continue to investigate?
<rickspencer3> the greedy hack sounds like a bit of a rat hole to me
<asac> finding the regression window/package
<seb128> I don't know enough about xorg and intel to have an advice there
<seb128> I would spend efforts on the mesa issue first
<rickspencer3> For my part, I talked to Yingying last night, and will be talking to Ken Edwards later today to see if we can get more focus from Intel engineers to help debug these issues for Jaunty SRUs
<seb128> we can probably isolate the buggy change with some work on this one
<bryce> rickspencer3: sounds like I should just proceed with what I've been doing, and not try to cram something in for the release.  Which I'm glad for - shoving something in at this point I worry could risk causing more problems than it solves
<asac> right find the regression window/source ... before we know that we cannot do much about it imo
<rickspencer3> I would like to see them be a bit more hands on helping us with these, but there minds are elsewhere as they are in ship mode with something right now
<bryce> I've documented the greedy workaround in the release notes for now (could use some wordsmithing though)
<rickspencer3> yes
<rickspencer3> I think lost of release notes, and ideally the SRU will be ready ...
<seb128> right, a note about it and work for sru updates later sounds good
<rickspencer3> at or soon after Jaunty is available
<rickspencer3> bryce: thanks for your tireless efforts here
<bryce> yep
<rickspencer3> moving on ...
<rickspencer3> Gwibber
<rickspencer3> saw you guys discussing this morning
<rickspencer3> is this really SRU worthy? Is this the most important thing to be working on right now?
<rickspencer3> heh
<seb128> gwibber is in universe I'm not sure to understand why we spend so much efforts on it
<asac> its a pet project
<rickspencer3> seb128: I think that Mark would like it to have good indicator-applet integration
<kenvandine_wk> i have it fixed now
<rickspencer3> lol
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: we want as many proof points as possible for the indicator stuff
<asac> i think if kenvandine_wk has it fixed it can go in (he did minimal backports of indicate api)
<rickspencer3> how many times have I heard that in my life
<seb128> ok
<rickspencer3> :)
<asac> i still want to check/verify it though
<kenvandine_wk> asac: i will push my branch in a few
<asac> great
<rickspencer3> thanks guys, but remember to keep your eye on the big picture
<kenvandine_wk> twitter shut me down for testing :)
<rickspencer3> Translations
<asac> kenvandine_wk: really?
<kenvandine_wk> refreshed to many times
<rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: where are we at?
<ArneGoetje> final full export from Rosetta for the language-packs is currently running
<ArneGoetje> expect it to be done sometime tomorrow.
<kenvandine_wk> no string changes for gwibber
<rickspencer3> (it's all about Gwibber)
<rickspencer3> jono: are you back?
<seb128> gwibber is in universe so no language pack anyway
<rickspencer3> ok, I think jono is on a call, but I was hoping he could tell us a little about the new role on his team for translations
<rickspencer3> perhaps when he gets off
<jono> rickspencer3, hey
<jono> I am here
<jono> in-between calls :-)
<rickspencer3> kewl
<jono> hi everyone
<ArneGoetje> hi jono
<jono> so David Planella started on my team on Monday
<jono> hey ArneGoetje :-)
<jono> David's role is primary divided into a few areas:
<jono>  * to help grow and extend our extensive translations community
<jono>  * to work with translations teams to help build best practice around great translations
<kenvandine_wk> jono: what is David's irc nick?
<jono>  * to work with upstreams to ensure we can participate as effectively as possible with translations
<jono> kenvandine_wk, dpm
<kenvandine_wk> thx
<jono>  * to provide a resource inside Canonical to report to other teams the status of translations
<rickspencer3> dpm: we;re talking about you
<seb128> who will be in charge of looking at translation template import, doing moderation for those, etc?
<rickspencer3> seb128: still ArneGoetje for the time being, but we haven't finalized that yet
<jono> seb128, rickspencer3 and I are still discussing this
<seb128> ok
<rickspencer3> seb128: are you volunteering?
<rickspencer3> j/k
<seb128> ;-)
<ArneGoetje> seb128: I think this will stay with me for a while, but I'd like to shift this off to some trusted community members if possible.
<jono> it should be stressed that dpm is very much here in a similar vain to the other horsemen - to build buzz, best practise and growth in community
<seb128> no, but I want to know where I can complain when they are stucked ;-)
<jono> not really here to do direct engineering
<seb128> (that happens every cycle since we use rosetta)
<jono> seb128, hehe
<jono> seb128, I think David should be helping to grow community participation there
<rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: right, and hopefully dpm will be helping to speed up that transition
<ArneGoetje> rickspencer3: +1
<rickspencer3> seb128: I think figuring out how to avoid those bottlenecks is part of dpm's charter
<jono> I have to run off to a call now
<jono> anything else before I go?
<jono> rickspencer3, indeed
<rickspencer3> don't think so
<rickspencer3> except that I would encourage dpm to join the discussin in this channel
<jono> yeah, I have asked him to be part of these major channels
<jono> rickspencer3, I think he should be at your team meetings too
<rickspencer3> k
<jono> rickspencer3, I will ask him to
<rickspencer3> thanks jono
<jono> thanks rickspencer3
<jono> bye folks!
<rickspencer3> moving on ...
<seb128> bye jono
<rickspencer3> UDS Topics
<rickspencer3> we need to have a list of UDS topics by eow next week, I think
<rickspencer3> I got a start here:
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UDSKarmic/Prep/Desktop
<rickspencer3> please just add them there, I suppose
<rickspencer3> we can discuss more during the week
<seb128> rickspencer3: do you have a pool of ideas or similar already?
<seb128> or is that the list already on this wikipage?
<rickspencer3> there's a bunch of stuff on the page
<rickspencer3> but it's not done with team or community participation yet, just me putting things there as they came across my desk
<seb128> right, they seem rather categories than specific topics
<rickspencer3> seb128: I'm especially interested in GNOME 3.0
<rickspencer3> could be
<rickspencer3> it's not fleshed out at all, it was just a place to park things so I didn't forget
<rickspencer3> how do you all want to handle getting your topics ready?
<rickspencer3> I think we just need a list of topics, not blueprints, etc...
<seb128> I agree than having topic is better than blueprint, we can use blueprint later to track specific karmic work
<rickspencer3> ok
<asac> i think that depends on personal preference; adding your topics to that wiki pages makes sense to get started
<seb128> let's collect ideas and discuss those during the next meeting?
<rickspencer3> okay
<rickspencer3> ACTION: everyone put UDS topics on the wiki
<asac> rickspencer3: how did you get the headings you already added?
<rickspencer3> everytime someone said "we should discuss foo at UDS" I put off on the list
<asac> rickspencer3: where is the "font" topic ;)?
<rickspencer3> s/oof/foo
<rickspencer3> okay, everytime I remembered to do it :)
<asac> hehe. okay
<calc> asac: its there in a really tiny font ;-)
<asac> lol
<ArneGoetje> asac: which font topic?
<seb128> asac: I'm not sure there is much to discuss there, just make it work? ;-)
<asac> seb128: you won't lead the discussion ;)
<rickspencer3> I would propose that people have a bias for inclusion ... I think it will be easier to remove items than to add them
<seb128> good ;-)
<asac> seb128: i think there are various things to discuss
<rickspencer3> seb128: you'll be leading the GNOME 3.0 topic(s) I hope
<seb128> yes
<rickspencer3> so you'll probably have enough to worry about :)
<rickspencer3> move on?
<asac> ArneGoetje: a few font topics I found as lacking something; you can add your own or we can also have a call ;)
<rickspencer3> Release Bugs/Release Status
<seb128> what about topic which should be worked but are probably candidate for the design team work?
<ArneGoetje> asac: ok
<rickspencer3> seb128: put them on the list
<seb128> alright
<rickspencer3> design will need a lot of help from us, as they seem not to be too sure what UDS is, and what it's for
<rickspencer3> Riddell: bug #355814
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 355814 in kde-l10n-es "[Kubuntu 9.04] Many items are in English while language is set to Spanish" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/355814
<asac> rickspencer3: will design team share track with us again?
<asac> or will they have their own?
<rickspencer3> asac: yes, but we have two rooms this time
<asac> ok great. i found it was quite a tight schedule last time already
<rickspencer3> so basically, I will be track lead for desktop/dx/design
<asac> and now there are probably even more topics
<rickspencer3> seb128: bug #338982
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 338982 in evolution-mapi "evolution crashed with SIGSEGV during MAPI authentication" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/338982
<rickspencer3> (skipping x bugs as we already discussed)
<seb128> rickspencer3: that's an universe package, should it be set as blocker still?
<rickspencer3> seb128: I don't think so
<ArneGoetje> rickspencer3: that bug should have been fixed for some time now. There was a lot of template reshuffling going on regarding KDE translations during the past weeks.
<seb128> having mapi working would be nice for exchange users but I've neither a clue about exchange not access to a server
<seb128> not->nor
<rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: could you please confirm with Riddell
<ArneGoetje> rickspencer3: will do
<rickspencer3> seb128: do you have time to check in and see if it's fixed, will be fixed, if we should be doing something?
<seb128> rickspencer3: I will discuss options with the server team and slangasek, I think fixing that would require an openchange update
<rickspencer3> meantime, not sure why it's a relaase blcoker if it's a universe package
<rickspencer3> seb128: thanks
<rickspencer3> some of our users depend on that, but as a user I always found it not to work too well
<seb128> well, evolution-exchange is the one used by default
<rickspencer3> oh
<seb128> evolution-mapi is the new connector using openchange and supposed to work on exchange 2007
<rickspencer3> I see
<seb128> so it's nothing which was working and got broken, it's new code
<seb128> but I will see if we can get it working, at least in a sru
<rickspencer3> seb128: thanks
<rickspencer3> asac: I see the "homepage is always in English" bug is off the list
<rickspencer3> sweet
<asac> rickspencer3: i fixed all i had
<rickspencer3> bug #353924
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 353924 in ubufox "Offline home page always English (browser language hard-coded to en-US)" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/353924
<rickspencer3> love to see the word "Fix" in the status :)
<asac> yeah i have to close the upstrewm task
<asac> its fix released
<rickspencer3> thanks asac, you finished out Jaunty very strong
<rickspencer3> everybody sent or posted their activity reports, so thanks
<rickspencer3> note that calc is starting his rotation on OEM services on May 1!
<rickspencer3> any other business?
<seb128> no
<rickspencer3> great
<kenvandine_wk> :)
<rickspencer3> bryce: remember that ati and nvidia are working great ...
<rickspencer3> and intel users aren't exactly dropped to a CL :)
<seb128> and intel is working great for some of us too ;-)
<seb128> <- happy intel user since the user switching bug has been fixed
<rickspencer3> so I think all in all we are in good shape for Jaunty
<jcastro> I have 2 intel laptops sitting on my desk if you want me to test anything bryce
<rickspencer3> I have i965, and it works well for me
<rickspencer3> compiz is slow, but that's such not  a deal breaker (plus it goes fast when I enable greedy)
 * calc has 945 and 4500
<bryce> rickspencer3: :-)
<seb128> rickspencer3: slow when doing what?
<rickspencer3> seb128: cover flow is the most noticible
<seb128> I'm only using alt-tab and workspace switching but that's fast here
<bryce> rickspencer3: I'm chatting with kernel team at their meeting regarding sorting out freeze bugs
<rickspencer3> okay
<dpm> rickspencer3: I've just read jono's explanation on my new role earlier on. I basically wanted to say that I'm around, but I haven't got anything to add at this point -other that I'm looking forward to work with you guys and to ask if you've got any questions
 * kenvandine_wk should try user switching again... but has been scared
<rickspencer3> bye bryce!
<bryce> kenvandine_wk: think it should be fixed now
<kenvandine_wk> dpm: great to meet you!
<seb128> bryce: can people still ssh the box when they get the freeze?
<bryce> kenvandine_wk: save your work and try it :-)
<ember> seb128 mind if i take the brasero update?
<rickspencer3> dpm: welcome!
<kenvandine_wk> bryce: i love the confidence
<rickspencer3> meeting adjourned?
<bryce> cya
<seb128> ember: jaunty is frozen so it will probably not be accepted but you can do it
<seb128> rickspencer3: yes
<ember> -proposed then?
<dpm> kenvandine_wk: rickspencer3: thanks!
<rickspencer3> thanks all
<ArneGoetje> thanks
<seb128> ember: correct
<seb128> rickspencer3: thanks
<asac> thx
<kenvandine_wk> oh.. bryce it worked!
<bryce> :-)
<kenvandine_wk> bryce: do have that bug number handy? i want to see what the fix was :)
<seb128> brb
<bryce> I don't remember the bug number offhand, but the fix was reverting a patch... uh
<DBO> is here a good place to mention a couple odd things in the default compiz config?
<kenvandine_wk> bryce: an intel patch or kernel?
<bryce> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/348428
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 348428 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "Switching to another user and then to anything else causes freeze in drm_intel_bo_unreference ()" [High,Fix released]
<bryce> that's it
<DBO> hi bryce =)  you are everywhere
<kenvandine_wk> great
<kenvandine_wk> thx
<bryce> heya DBO
<bryce> DBO, uh lost track of your questions, one sec
<DBO> so I wanted to report that there are some CPU wasters in the default compiz config
<bryce> uh "CPU wasters"?
<DBO> namely the fading windows plugin does the same thing as the animations plugin, so its doubling up the fade code, adds a bit of cpu there
<bryce> <DBO> bryce, I dont know if you remember talking to me or not, but I though I would mention I fixed my render performance issue simply by dropping the up_threshold on the OnDemand governor to 35 from its default
<bryce> <DBO> my battery life shortened by about 10 minutes overall, but the usability difference is huge
<DBO> oh that was something else
<bryce> oh
<DBO> I followed up in ubuntu-x about that
<bryce> ok
<DBO> i wasn't trying to cross channel stalk you =P
<bryce> heh
<DBO> i just came here to say that there are redundant plugins enabled in compiz, and they are causing us to waste CPU resources when we do window fades
<djsiegel> hey DBO!
<DBO> david! you stalker!
<bryce> DBO, have you talked with the compiz maintainers about that?
<djsiegel> hehe
<DBO> bryce, well I used to be a maintainer of beryl... so I have a clue what I am talking about... but basically its a silly default and they never went over their defaults very well
<seb128> DBO: usually "maintainer" there is "package maintainer", ie mvo in this case ;-)
<bryce> DBO, yeah
<DBO> oh the package maintainer
<DBO> sorry, my bad :)
<seb128> mvo is on holidays today but he will be there tomorrow
<bryce> DBO, I'm happy to help if you have a specific change, although I'm fairly swamped up to my eyeballs in X.org package maintenance stuff at the moment
<seb128> or if you have a bug reference let us the number I'll let him know
<DBO> i'll file a bug since he is not here
<bryce> DBO, also it is pretty late for changes to jaunty
<seb128> ok thanks
<seb128> late for jaunty but still good to know and possible to sru
<asac> kenvandine_wk: +    self.add_msg_tab(self.client.responses, _("Replies"), show_icon = "mail-reply-all", add_indicator=True)
<asac> is it right that that is unconditionally True?
<asac> (havent looked in code context)
<kenvandine_wk> yeah
<kenvandine_wk> i think so
<asac> kenvandine_wk: so that code is only run if indicate != None?
<kenvandine_wk> even if add_indicator is True, it won't try to display the indicator of indicate isn't set
<asac> ok
<kenvandine_wk> i think it is run... just doesn't matter
<asac> kenvandine_wk: ok, so that is the code path for "replies" ?
 * kenvandine_wk looks
<asac> kenvandine_wk: also is the "xid == topwindow" thing what we want? did you cherry pick that from trunk?
<kenvandine_wk> i did
<kenvandine_wk> checking to see if it is focused
<asac> kenvandine_wk: ok. you didnt note where you cherry picked that from
<asac> as with anything.
<kenvandine_wk> :)
<kenvandine_wk> i can go back and do that... it was just a pita
<asac> no its fine. just to make it perfect ;)
<asac> kenvandine_wk: you can still add the commit references to the patch doc
<asac> ;)
<asac> unless looking the comit up is the pita
<asac> kenvandine_wk: seems the addition was
<asac> 291.1.1
<asac> kenvandine_wk: think you forgot this hunk then: http://paste.ubuntu.com/150996/
<kenvandine_wk> asac: the is_gwibber_active was revno 294
<asac> kenvandine_wk: err. here it was 291.1.1 ... whats the branch you are looking at?
<kenvandine_wk> trunk
<asac> kenvandine_wk: he. ok 294 is the merge ...t hecommit is 291.1.1
<kenvandine_wk> oh... ok
<kenvandine_wk> how did you see that?
<asac> kenvandine_wk: anyway. the hunk above was forgotten
<asac> kenvandine_wk: bzr log | less ;)
<asac> bzr blame actually
<kenvandine_wk> ah
<kenvandine_wk> i think i might have changed that manually
<kenvandine_wk> one sec
<kenvandine_wk> ok...no i missed that
<kenvandine_wk> what revision was that from?
<asac> kenvandine_wk: bzr diff -c 291.1.1
<kenvandine_wk> ok, fixed... not pushed yet though
<kenvandine_wk> asac: so in my notes for the patch, should i reference 294 or 291.1.1?
<asac> kenvandine_wk: well, best practices would be to have one patch for each revision you backported ;)
<asac> kenvandine_wk: but yes, use 291.1.1
<asac> kenvandine_wk: but also name the branch name you refer to (its not valid across branches)
<kenvandine_wk> i hate patches that patch stuff from other patches...
<asac> kenvandine_wk: if you want to see the global ids you can use bzr log --show-ids
<kenvandine_wk> ok
<asac> personally i use cherry-pick revno XXX from lp:~....
<asac> kenvandine_wk: yeah well. but stacking cherry picks would be much easier to review and track for future
<asac> e.g. find regressions and so on
<kenvandine_wk> ok
<kenvandine_wk> i'll remember that
<asac> in this way there is a single lumped patch and nobody knows how that was produced ;)
<asac> (except kenvandine_wk's black-magic ;))
<asac> anyway. i think with that hunk it should be ok
<asac> i found a different issue though
<asac> but thats also on trunk
<asac> its probably a theoretical issue, but wrong imo:
<asac> so first a message runs this:
<asac>       if hasattr(message, "gId"):
<asac>         message.is_duplicate = message.gId in seen
<asac>         message.first_seen = False
<asac> then in the indicator code it runs:
<asac>        if msg.first_seen and \
<asac>             hasattr(msg, "is_unread") and msg.is_unread and \
<asac>             hasattr(msg, "gId") and msg.gId not in self.indicator_items:
<asac> i think logcally it needs hasattr(msg.first_seen) and ...
<asac> or the first_seen needs to be moved after the "hasattr(msg, "gId")"
<kenvandine_wk> looks like a bug
<kenvandine_wk> but should be harmless
<asac> heh
<asac> yeah throws an uncatched exception
<asac> ;)
<kenvandine_wk> does it?
<kenvandine_wk> it could yes... but i haven't seen it do it
<asac> if you access msg.first_seen without it being defined it throws, right?
<kenvandine_wk> yes
<asac> so given that first_seen only gets defined if hasattr(message, "gId"): the second msg.first_seen can throw
<asac> would only happen if !hasattr(msg, "gId") ... i looked and that seems to be an unlikely event
<kenvandine_wk> right, it's a bug
<asac> think we should check if undefined gId is really unlikely
<kenvandine_wk> always better to check
<huats> hey everyone
<asac> kenvandine_wk: ok suggesting a merge on trunk anyway
<seb128> lut huats
<seb128> huats: how are you?
<huats> seb128: hey
<huats> I am fine!
<huats> thanks !
<seb128> still as busy?
<huats> I tend to survive :)
<huats> and I think am I getting to the end of the "busy" process
<huats> so it is great
<huats> :)
<seb128> cool
<seb128> jaunty is frozen so no need to worry about this one
<huats> the good sign is that I am setting up my new computer to build deb :)
<huats> ok
<didrocks> seb128: huats told me yesterday that he was enjoying the sunshine on the beach :)
<huats> LOL
<seb128> I don't doubt of that
<didrocks> ^^
<seb128> we didn't get the gcalctool stable update in jaunty due to that
<huats> I know toulouse is sunny BUT there is no beach
<huats> seb128: hum I though that robert would do it ...
<seb128> he's on holidays this week
<didrocks> seb128: I could have done it, you knowâ¦
<huats> ok
<huats> seb128: I will prepare it if you want
<huats> so that we can upload it as soon as the freeze is over
<didrocks> (you have 4 packages ready to sponsor, btw)
<seb128> didrocks: it was not especially needed so I let a chance to huats to grab it if he wanted to do an update
<huats> seb128: sure
<seb128> huats: there is no freeze over now
<kenvandine_wk> asac: ok, i pushed changes
<seb128> huats: ie it's a sru or nothing
<huats> seb128: ok
<huats> seb128: so I'll do the sru process...
<seb128> didrocks: right, we are frozen so I need to discuss if those are to upload or to convert in sru uploads
<didrocks> seb128: oki
<seb128> huats: no hurry, we will not have srus accepted before a week I guess
<huats> seb128: I'll do it by the week then
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> looking forward uds? ;-)
<huats> no pb :)
<huats> you have no idea how muh :)
<didrocks> uds \o/
<didrocks> seb128: we have to discuss at uds about the "package locking" for desktop packages
<huats> and I just started to loe football... I would love to see barcelona with their team in the champions league final which is DURING the UDS :)
<huats> s/loe/love/
<seb128> didrocks: right, or maybe before UDS, for sure we want to have a nice summary and an easy way to assign updates next cycle
<seb128> shouldn't be too hard to do
<didrocks> seb128: you know now why huats can't work on ubuntu, he's watching football :)
<huats> didrocks: nope
<seb128> oh, football!
 * seb128 runs the TV on
<didrocks> seb128: yes, we just have to agree on the process :)
 * seb128 turns the TV on
<didrocks> hehe
<huats> ;)
<huats> seb128: I have been experiencing weird stuffs with my computer (fresh jaunty beta install) : a LOT of ext4corrputed FS...
<huats> have you heard something like that ?
<huats> (since the last update seems to be fixed)
<seb128> no, but I stay away from new filesystem usually
<huats> (and it is not an issue with the HD since I changed it)
<huats> ok
<Nafallo> asac, kenvandine_wk: any luck with gajim today?
<Nafallo> asac, kenvandine_wk: I saw you guys working on it, but I didn't have time to join in the conversation unfortunally.
<kenvandine_wk> Nafallo: haven't gotten to it yet
<kenvandine_wk> it was gwibber actually
<kenvandine_wk> but i plan to tonight
<Nafallo> oh. I got lost of hilights on gajim ;-)
<kenvandine_wk> :)
<jcastro> hey Nafallo
<jcastro> I think you should take the pidgin artwork and put it into gajim for us so it looks better
<Nafallo> jcastro: hmm. sounds like karmic. file a wishlist bug please? :-)
<jcastro> oh, yes, karmic for sure.
<rickspencer3> kenvandine_wk: are you *still* working on Gwibber?
<rickspencer3> maybe we should change "Jaunty Jackalope" to "Jaunty Gwibber"
<rickspencer3> :)
<kenvandine_wk> hehee
<kenvandine_wk> no... been done with gwibber for hours now :)
<kenvandine_wk> i am trying to figure out which compiz patch is causing that keybindings bug
<kenvandine_wk> upstream says it is one of our patches
<kenvandine_wk> jcastro: we should do the same for empathy!
<kenvandine_wk> i hate those status icons in empathy
<kenvandine_wk> so far these patches look need to just keep compiz from crashing
<kenvandine_wk> s/need/needed
<rickspencer3> kenvandine_wk: thanks for taking the compiz bug
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-04-15
<asac> kenvandine_wk: can you please subscribe motu-release, and attach the patches we have now to the two bugs and set bug status to New?
<pitti> bryce: reverting entire mesa in a SRU sounds very unlikely to me, since it has a high potential for breaking other systems
<pitti> bryce: (like systems configured for UXA)
<bryce> pitti: we may not need to -- we've had a bit of a brainstorm on #ubuntu-x tonight
<pitti> bryce: ah, nice; just reading backscroll from the meeting
<bryce> pitti: but I will point out that UXA is definitely not a supported option yet
<bryce> or at least, it's not one I am ready to support yet, myself
<pitti> bryce: today I thought about converting your troubleshooting guide to a more end user related document "What can you do on intel driver problems", e. g. collect some workarounds
<pitti> which we could link from the release notes
<bryce> that's a good idea
<pitti> bryce: I'll mail you for review when I'm done
<bryce> thanks
<seb128> mvo: <DBO>	i just came here to say that there are redundant plugins enabled in compiz, and they are causing us to waste CPU resources when we do window fades
<seb128> mvo: ^ that's from yesterday
<seb128> I think he said he would open a bug
<davmor2> mvo: updates seem to be working okay now :)
<mvo> thanks seb128 and davmor2
<tseliot> seb128: what does Gnome do with DPI (in Jaunty)?
<seb128> tseliot: 96 dpi forced
<seb128> by default forced, you can change the value in the appearance capplet
<tseliot> seb128: with a gconf key in libgnome?
<seb128> yes
<tseliot> ok, thanks
<seb128> you're welcome
<seb128> why do you ask? do you have any issue due to that?
<asac> hmm ... i experienced issues shutting down my system (using fusa) ... told me that other users are logged in. known bug?
<tseliot> seb128: no, I don't but the OEM team needs some customisations
<seb128> tseliot: ok, easier way is to unset the key then, but be careful the xrand capplet might still force a 96dpi value when loading configs
<seb128> asac: ck-list-sessions?
<tseliot> seb128: how come?
<seb128> asac: the ck-pam-something might open a ck session for cron job, there is a bug open about that
<seb128> tseliot: bug? I know they use to force 96dpi in hardy when the capplet landed rather than reading the key, I didn't try recently though
<tseliot> seb128: any hints as to where I should look at to force DPI as they used to do in Hardy? libgnome?
<seb128> tseliot: changing the gconf key will change the default value, ie what gnome-settings-daemon apply
<chrisccoulson> asac - bug 287715
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 287715 in consolekit "Trying to shut down or restart falsely suggests others are logged in" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/287715
<asac> chrisccoulson: cool.
<seb128> tseliot:
<seb128> gnome-rr-config.c:     * dpi 96.
<seb128> gnome-rr-config.c:    width_mm = (width / 96.0) * 25.4 + 0.5;
<seb128> gnome-rr-config.c:    height_mm = (height / 96.0) * 25.4 + 0.5;
<seb128> tseliot: that's the revelant xrandr capplet code I think
<tseliot> seb128: great, thanks, this what I was looking for :-)
<Keybuk> seb128: didn't the gnome keyring issue get fixed yet?
<seb128> Keybuk: which one?
<Keybuk> seb128: I have no gnome keyring
<Keybuk> System -> Preferences -> Encryption and Keyrings
<Keybuk> "A supported PGP passphrase caching agent is not running"
<seb128> the gpg agent is seahorse
<seb128> do you have seahorse-plugins installed?
<Keybuk> yes
<Keybuk> seahorse-plugins	2.26.1-0ubuntu1
<seb128> Keybuk: let me try something
<Keybuk> I have a ~/.gnupg/gpg-agent-info-quest file
<seb128> Keybuk: do you have gnupg-agent installed?
<Keybuk> that contains GPG_AGENT_INFO=/tmp/gpg-*/S.gpg-agent:*
<seb128> if you do uninstall it and restart your session
<Keybuk> ah, yes, I do have gpg-agent installed
<seb128> it hijacks seahorse
<Ampelbein> seb128, Keybuk bug 183514
<Keybuk> it's a recommend of gnupg
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 183514 in seahorse-plugins "seahorse-agent stops responding when started with gpg-agent" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/183514
<Keybuk> seb128: should that Recommends be demoted to a Suggests?
<seb128> Keybuk: I'm not sure, it might be useful in non GNOME cases, maybe ask on #ubuntu-devel for opinions
<huats> hello everyone !
<huats> hi seb128
<seb128> perhaps it could be a gnupg-agent | seahorse or something so it doesn't get installed in default ubuntu
<seb128> lut huats
 * Tm_T have noticed that seahorse is happily destroying all gpg settings
<Tm_T> and that is while I don't use seahorse at all, just have it installed (:
<seb128> you should be using it if you have it installed ;-)
<Tm_T> seb128: well, that would mean I have to recreate all my gpg settings and keys and...
<Tm_T> I don't see any reason why I should use it, though, so I keep holding it away from my systems
<seb128> I don't use gpg enough to have an opinion
<seb128> I'm just signing emails and packages to upload
<seb128> and I didn't have to reconfigure anything
<Tm_T> same here, mostly, but also svn
<Tm_T> and ssh
<seb128> seahorse found my gpp key automagically and acts as a gpg agent correctly
<Tm_T> actually ssh (and svn with it)
<seb128> dunno why you think you would have to reconfigure your gpg configuration
<seb128> ssh is managed by gnome-keyring not seahorse
<Tm_T> seb128: seahorse had all empty
<seb128> and there again it uses the system config
<Tm_T> seb128: I don't use gnome (:)
<seb128> you don't have to configure anything, it just lists available keys automatically
<Tm_T> seb128: but it didn't do that
<seb128> you should have opened a bug then describing the issue
<Tm_T> all what it did, was emptied my .gnupg/ dir
<seb128> it deleted your private key?!
<Tm_T> seb128: yes, all of it
<seb128> weird
<Tm_T> indeed
<seb128> first time I read about a such issue
<seb128> and most of the distro team is using it
<seb128> there is no reason it would delete any key
<seb128> I guess it's something else on your install but your blamed it on seahorse
<Tm_T> seb128: also I had many times issues with gnome stuff forcing themselves to be autolaunched in my KDE sessions after install
<seb128> autostart is a freedesktop spec
<seb128> those are not GNOME specific
<Tm_T> seb128: I know, but forcing to autolaunch metacity...
<seb128> nothing force anything
<seb128> again if you have a specific issue you should open a bug
<seb128> some desktops might need an NotShowIn=KDE
<seb128> but we don't use KDE so we will not notice
<Tm_T> aye, I have to see if it reoccurs
<seb128> if you don't open a bug you get what you deserve
<Tm_T> as I have broken hardware now so cannot really try to find and report bugs
<seb128> ok, so you will keep getting GNOME things started on your KDE session
<Tm_T> did yes, until I manually cleaned that stuff from those autorun dirs
<Tm_T> these funny and weird issues occured ~6 months ago I think
<Tm_T> I assume that I had installed some -default-settings type package that did something unexpected back then
<Tm_T> ok, baby woke, will harrass you later (;)
<chrisccoulson> downgrading packages is not really supported is it?
<jpds> !downgrade
<ubottu> Attempting to downgrade to an older Ubuntu version is explicitly not supported, and may break your system.
<chrisccoulson> i was referring about downgrading individual packages, but i think that is not really supported by the package manager anyway
<chrisccoulson> the only reason i ask is becuase someone opened a bug against brasero because it failed to downgrade from 0.9.1 to 0.8.2. It fails because the package was split between these 2 versions, and there are no conflicts/replaces to handle the downgrade
<chrisccoulson> i was just wondering whether to close it
<seb128> yes, close it as invalid, downgrade are not supposed to be working
<chrisccoulson> thanks seb128 - done
<pochu> seb128: thanks for libproxy sponsorship
<Laney> is 2.26.1 finished?
<seb128> Laney: sort of, jaunty is frozen so any other update will have to be a sru after jaunty stable next week
<Laney> frozen for rc?
<seb128> Laney: yes, and between rc and stable we will get only selected bug fixes not new versions
<didrocks> seb128: as it's not in the repos yet, I will make people work on gnome-terminal for tomorrow's lesson :)
<Laney> got it
<Laney> didrocks: And the prize is getting it uploaded? :)
<didrocks> Laney: hum, well, I already prepared it, so, no :p
<Laney> :(
<seb128> didrocks: k
<didrocks> Laney: but it's a good candidate: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-terminal/+bug/361053
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 361053 in gnome-terminal "Please, sponsor gnome-terminal 2.26.1 to jaunty" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<didrocks> you have b-d bumps
<didrocks> not applying patches
<didrocks> and autotool use :)
<didrocks> so, I hope people can learn some stuff from this :-)
<Laney> all in 15 mins? :O
<didrocks> Laney: I think the 15 minutes goal is just a dream :)
<superm1> mvo, ping. i was talking to seb128 about a zenity focus bug yesterday, and he advised I speak with you about it. bug 272083
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 272083 in mythbuntu "Zenity windows appear underneath others" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/272083
<superm1> we (mythbuntu) didn't catch it recently late due to xfwm4 not doing focus right until recently, so we were attributing the "new" focus problem to xfwm4
<mvo> superm1: hello. give me a minute, I check it out when I'm finished with my current task
<superm1> mvo, hi, sure, please treat the ping as asynchronous, i didn't mean to detract you from something else :)
<mvo> superm1: thanks :) np
 * kenvandine_wk heads out for lunch... bbiab
<rickspencer3> vuntz: hi!
<rickspencer3> :)
<vuntz> rickspencer3: doh, you spotted me :-)
<rickspencer3> lol
<l0ser140> somebody knows something about this: i was synchronized evolution using webDAV, I have a login "user@domain.com", but evolution cut off all after @. remains only "user"? need help)
<dobey> l0ser140: #ubuntu would be a better place to ask... this isn't a support channel
<l0ser140> but what it deals with? xD
<dobey> this is a development channel
<l0ser140> ok, thx)
<rickspencer3> bryce: so far Option "EXAOptimizeMigration" "off" seems to be working well
<kenvandine_wk> rickspencer3: is that the 2d performance tweak?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine_wk: it's a suggested option to replace MigrationHeuristic "greedy"
<kenvandine_wk> ah
<rickspencer3> if you have intel graphics and aren't too happy with the perf, you could test it out
<kenvandine_wk> i am very happy with the performance with UXA :)
<rickspencer3> UXA is not crashy for you?
<kenvandine_wk> rock solid
<kenvandine_wk> without it... it sucks..
<rickspencer3> In any case, it would probably help out to test EXA
<kenvandine_wk> i will
<rickspencer3> a comparison would help
<kenvandine_wk> after i finish a few install tests... can't kill X with these VMs running
<rickspencer3-afk> heh
<bryce> rickspencer3-afk: \o/
<rickspencer3-afk> bryce: in general, it seems that compiz "slows down" as I use the computer
<rickspencer3-afk> so I'll let you know in a  few hours
<bryce> ok
<rickspencer3-afk> cover flow is my "test case" :)
<bryce> I've also asked slangasek to re-test, since he's the one that saw the flaw with greedy
<bryce> btw, I have a very strong lead on the freeze issue now too (testing it presently...)
<rickspencer3-afk> !
<bryce> heh, unfortunately, with latest updates now networkmanager is losing its mind
<kenvandine_wk> i need to kill pidgin for a bit.. taking up way to much ram :)
<kenvandine_wk> rickspencer3-afk: did you test UNR on your netbook?
<chrisccoulson> i'm noticing some really odd nautilus behaviour here :/
<seb128> chrisccoulson: which one?
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128. if i have nautilus in icon view, and then zoom in at greater than 100%, i see a lot of white space in the right hand-side of the window, causing the horizontal scroll bar to appear
<seb128> which scrollbar?
<seb128> chrisccoulson: similar to http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=460044
<seb128> ?
<chrisccoulson> the horizontal one at the bottom of the window. it seems to appear for no reason
<ubottu> Gnome bug 460044 in GtkIconView "A way to space out the columns evenly" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> look at the first screenshot
<chrisccoulson> that's quite possibly related, but in this case, nautilus shows the scrollbar
<seb128> are you sure there is not a colum on the left which is not on screen?
<seb128> I get a scrollbar here but I also get a column not on screen
<seb128> but that's buggy indeed, you have lot of spacing on the right which is not useful
<chrisccoulson> there doesn't appear to be any other columns. is there anywhere decent i can upload a screenshot too? it might be easier for me to explain that way
<chrisccoulson> this seems to have only started in the last day or so
<seb128> try downgrading gtk maybe and see if that's still an issue
<chrisccoulson> thanks, i'll try that shortly
<seb128> or nautilus
<seb128> "* Fix icon view RTL layout in compact view" is in the new version
<seb128> which means layout changes, could have some side effects
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - the behaviour breaks between nautilus 2.26.1 and 2.26.2
<chrisccoulson> doesn't seem to be gtk related
<chrisccoulson> i'll open a bug report on the bugzilla
<seb128> right, what I wrote just before
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it seems like that
<chrisccoulson> thanks:)
<pitti> good night everyone
<seb128> 'night pitti
<chrisccoulson> good night pitti
<kenvandine_wk> night!
<seb128> chrisccoulson: you can try undoing the most recent change on http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/nautilus/trunk/libnautilus-private/nautilus-icon-container.c
<seb128> chrisccoulson: when you have a bug open give me the number I will try to ping alex about it tomorrow
<chrisccoulson> thanks, i'll do that
<seb128> in fact there is several recent commits
<chrisccoulson> i'll try and narrow it down this evening if i get the chance
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - gnome bug 579086 for the nautilus issue
<ubottu> Gnome bug 579086 in Views: Icon View "Excessive white-space on right-hand side in icon view since 2.26.2 upgrade" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=579086
<seb128> chrisccoulson: thanks
<chrisccoulson> i'll try and spend some time isolating the commit that broke it shortly, but i need to get my stuff ready for work first
<seb128> chrisccoulson: no hurry, you might want to wait tomorrow to see if alex see the issue directly or need extra infos
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i don't mind doing that
<rickspencer3> kenvandine: I run UNR, but I use desktop mode
<james_w> chrisccoulson: "Low" for that policykit-gnome bug seems almost generous :-)
<chrisccoulson> heh ;)
<chrisccoulson> we need a "very low" ;)
<chrisccoulson> i just had a look at some other policykit-gnome bugs
<chrisccoulson> one of them is actually a common gnome-panel bug that keeps confusing people
<kenvandine> rickspencer3: unr RC won't install on my classmate, but the beta is fine
 * kenvandine filed a bug
<rickspencer3> hmm
<james_w> chrisccoulson: is that the one that I was triaging the other day?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine: I haven't installed it since alpha 5
<chrisccoulson> about the "Set System Time" button doing nothing?
<chrisccoulson> that's a confusing gnome-panel issue
<james_w> chrisccoulson: yeah, right at the end I found those bugs and realised it was probably that, but Mike didn't confirm
<chrisccoulson> it seems most likely the same bug, so I just marked it as a duplicate
<seb128> the "set" button should probably be next to the combo and not close the dialog
<seb128> combo -> spin buttons
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - that might make more sense
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - the current situation is a bit inconsistent. If I open time-admin, I need to be in the admin group to set the time. But any user can do it via the panel. It seems that the policy is different for the 2 separate actions
<seb128> would not be a surprise since they are 2 different softwares
<james_w> yeah, there's a bug on gnome-panel saying it should be one of "auth_admin*"
<seb128> that could make sense
<chrisccoulson> is there any easy way of working out what symbols i'm missing in gdb?
<seb128> use apport-retrace if that's a crash? ;-)
<seb128> or look at the address and the process mapping to see what library matches it
<chrisccoulson> apport's not possible here. it's an abort i'm trying to debug. i'll have a look at the addresses and process mapping though
<chrisccoulson> i'm actually trying to debug a g_critical message in file-roller. I'm running it with G_DEBUG=fatal_criticals to make it abort so I can see where it comes from. is that the best way of doing that?
<seb128> yes
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-04-16
<asac> good morning :)
<AJNpa80> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1127051
<maxb> window level all
<seb128> hello there
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks>  morning seb128 & pitti
<seb128> hello didrocks pitti
<pitti> hey didrocks
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<seb128> chrisccoulson: alex said he thinks he knows what is wrong with your nautilus bug
<seb128> he will have a look today apparently
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson: in fact he just fixed it to svn
<seb128> http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/nautilus?view=revision&revision=15184
<chrisccoulson> thanks, i just noticed the e-mail i got from the bugzilla
<chrisccoulson> i'll test the change later
<mvo> seb128: hm, we do no longer enable 81_gnome-app-install in nautilus for the mime search stuff?
<didrocks> pitti: I added -d to your debclean change in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Bzr (contrary to debian/clean rules, debclean checks by defaut if build-deps are installed)
<pitti> well, that's usually a good idea, isn't it?
<didrocks> pitti: not sure, I often use intrepid to build with pbuilder
<didrocks> pitti: so, I don't have the build-deps installed. And I only use debian/rules clean to update debian/control from debian/control.in :)
<seb128> mvo: no, why?
<mvo> seb128: not having it means we can no longer do mime searches - or was that replaced with some different functionatliy?
<seb128> mvo: basically nobody ported the patch when nautilus has been ported to gio (it was not trivial and I've been too busy to work on that)
<mvo> ok. have a look, I think its a nice feature
<seb128> mvo: the current version can use *kit to install packages if available but since we don't have that installed by default ... any change planned around that for karmic?
<seb128> mvo: gnome-control-center can also installed theme engines if required using that
<mvo> seb128: is it using the dbus desktop api for this? having that would be pretty easy
<seb128> mvo: look at the code or ask to james_w he fixed some bugs about that recently but I think so yes
<mvo> seb128: the problem with PK has not changed, it can not install  packages that require interaction
<seb128> mvo: well, for the gnome-control-center theme engines or nautilus applications cases that should be no issue
<seb128> no?
<james_w> mvo: yeah, it uses dbus
<james_w> session bus
<seb128> hey james_w ;-)
<james_w> hi seb128
<mvo> if it uses the session bus api, then that (currenly) requires the whole gnome PK desktop apps, we should split that
<seb128> mvo: can't we get it installed and used for easy packages and have it bailing an error for debconf cases?
<mvo> its doing that right now (erroring out)
<seb128> mvo: we will not change that for jaunty anyway, we can discuss that at uds (again?) if you want ;-)
<seb128> otherwise I will let you decide if you think that we should get the gnome-app-install patch back
<seb128> it's still there but not applied because the code changed, ie just need somebody adapting it to the new codebase
<mvo> seb128: the g-a-i patch seems to be pretty small, I look into that and if its ok I think its a canidate for jaunty-updates
<mvo> seb128: for karmic we should provide the dbus session api in one way or the other
<seb128> mvo: would be great, thanks ;-)
<pitti> didrocks: I see
<seb128> didrocks: I would argue if that you are running intrepid you can't really test jaunty upgrades though
<huats> hello everyone
<kenvandine_wk> Nafallo: ping
<tseliot> asac: this post suggests that I keep bugging you until 0.7.1 is available (in PPA for hardy in my case): http://blogs.gnome.org/dcbw/2009/04/16/you-will-upgrade-to-networkmanager-071/
<kenvandine_wk> morning rickspencer3
<asac> tseliot: i have the port for hardy somewhere. just need to get it up
<tseliot> asac: great :-)
<rickspencer3> good morning kenvandine_wk, et al
<kenvandine_wk> Nafallo: i did some gajim hacking last night... looks like the indicator stuff isn't what's broken in gajim
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<kenvandine_wk> Nafallo: it never calls the notify method, at least for messages... only seems to for contact_connected and new_mail
<kenvandine_wk> Nafallo: so we also don't get notifications for messages... which we did before
<kenvandine_wk> Nafallo: didn't follow it back far enough to see why not...
<rickspencer3> pitti: is it too late to make a change to Jaunty?
<rickspencer3> just one more package?
<rickspencer3> j/k
<kenvandine_wk> hehe
<pitti> rickspencer3: you have to convince slangasek, but for new packages, definitive "yes"
<pitti> or, if it's universe, convince motu-release :)
 * kenvandine_wk has a laptop with intel that xorg doesn't work in the installer
<rickspencer3> perhaps we could get calc to upload OO 3.0
<kenvandine_wk> s/laptop/netbook
<rickspencer3> I mean 3.1
<rickspencer3> it's only like 50 megs bigger compressed
<pitti> rickspencer3: what did you have for breakfast?
<pitti> I want it too!
 * pitti throws some candies at rickspencer3
<kenvandine_wk> i am terrified of OOo changes
<kenvandine_wk> they are never easy...
<rickspencer3> seriously though, I'm wondering if Hugh's upgrade report may be the norm
<seb128> we should just ship abiword ang gnumeric
<seb128> less issues and CD spaces for translations ;-)
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: oh yeah!
<rickspencer3> seb128: put it on the UDS schedule
<rickspencer3> :)
<kenvandine_wk> rickspencer3: we'll never win that... it is insane
<seb128> rickspencer3: you want to get me into trouble at uds, don't you? ;-)
<rickspencer3> kenvandine_wk: I know, I was joking
<kenvandine_wk> rickspencer3: 3 years ago i tried doing that in foresight... i literally got hate mail about it
<rickspencer3> actually, OO is very important to Ubuntu and our users
<rickspencer3> lol
 * kenvandine_wk likes google docs
<kenvandine_wk> i saw we ship prism wrappers for google docs :-D
<rickspencer3> I think that users expect a bloated and full featured Office-like package
<kenvandine_wk> much easier to maintain... and faster to build :)
<rickspencer3> and without, we wouldn't seem like a real platform
<rickspencer3> :(
<kenvandine_wk> hehe
<kenvandine_wk> true
<rickspencer3> I think it would be sweet if someone did for OO what someone did for Netscape Navigator
<kenvandine_wk> and OOo has gotten better
<kenvandine_wk> isn't novell kind of doing that?
<kenvandine_wk> or is that more out of desparation?
<pitti> yeah, splitting the apps is on the plan
<rickspencer3> well .. they are splitting them to make it all easier to build
<kenvandine_wk> rickspencer3: easier to maintain as well... and easier for distributors
<rickspencer3> but they are not extracting the 10% of the code which is the most valuable and making that lighter and faster
<kenvandine_wk> all and all a win
<kenvandine_wk> rickspencer3: true
<rickspencer3> what Novel is doing is super valuable though
<kenvandine_wk> hey tedg
<tedg> kenvandine_wk: good morning
<mvo> seb128: bug #362307 (includes the patch) - somehow I missed that this got dropped, otherwise I would have tried to get to it earlier
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 362307 in nautilus "does not support g-a-i mime search anymore" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/362307
<seb128> mvo: thanks
<seb128> mvo: that looks fine to me, maybe try asking slangasek if that can go between rc and jaunty?
<rickspencer3> jcastro: 2nd page of digg?
<mvo> seb128: thanks for the review, I will think about but my gut feeling is that its ok to do a sru for it
<seb128> mvo: I've an another sru pending for nautilus but I can get both in the same upload
<mvo> cool, thanks - let me know if I can do anything to make your life easier (like putting it into bzr ;)
<seb128> mvo: yes please commit to bzr so I don't forget about it ;-)
<seb128> the package is already in bzr so you just have to push the change
<mvo> seb128: ok
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> seb128: that's true, just running in VB currently. I will fix this for next session, but still wait for alpha 3 maybe to not having whole day just to set up/fix things
<seb128> didrocks: alpha3? rc is this week you are lagging ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: Really? O_o kidding, I'm talking for next release of course :p
<seb128> well if you test in vm you can probably build in the vm too no?
<seb128> otherwise how do you now it build with current unstable versions?
<didrocks> seb128: I'm thinking about switch to kvm, because VB is not very suited for that.
<didrocks> seb128: pbuilder
<didrocks> and with that, I'm sure to not forget some build-deps
<didrocks> don't be afraid, I also testbuild, testinstall and trying the app before getting some sponsorship :)
<Nafallo> kenvandine_wk: kewl. let's look at it tomorrow when I have a day off :-)
<kenvandine_wk> ok
<kenvandine_wk> Nafallo: i hadn't even noticed i wasn't getting the notifications.. although i only use gajim for testing :)
<Nafallo> kenvandine_wk: I'm getting the usual bubbles for notifications still.
<kenvandine_wk> for messages?
<kenvandine_wk> i get them for new mail and contacts connecting
<kenvandine_wk> not for new messages
<seb128> didrocks: it's just weird that you work on a distribution you don't use
<seb128> didrocks: it's lot of extra work
<didrocks> seb128: the extra work is when running autotools, yes :/
<seb128> didrocks: no, the extra work is all the time, when starting the vm, when trying in the vm rather than normal use, when using pbuilder rather than just building
<seb128> I've been doing cross distro builds, there is a reason why I do so few debian updates nowadays ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: maybe my worflow will change with the time :) I added a hook to push in a local reprepro and just apt-get update in the vm (who is running all the time, when updating/fixing packages).
<didrocks> but I agree that pbuilder is slow :/
<didrocks> but it's great to avoid missing build-deps, it's something I'm quite afraid of (even if I diff the configure files automatically now ;))
<seb128> I'm doing iso testing in kvm, it's nice to do quick testing but it's the same that running the system and doing it normal use testing for a day
<didrocks> seb128: and you switch to the new version from day 1 of open repository ?
<seb128> no, I usually focus on doing srus and stabilizing stable for a month and so
<seb128> then I keep stable but start doing syncs on debian and test those on the current stable
<seb128> in which point I've a mix of stable + updated GNOME
<seb128> and I upgrade when I feel the new version should be somewhat usable (usually around uds)
<huats> seb128: you know with didrocks we have a lot of work methods in common (the vm usage)
<seb128> you can install selected GNOME updates and still keep xorg, linux etc from the stable
<didrocks> ok, seems interesting. I will see which workflow will suit me the best for next release. Everyday is a new experiencing one ;)
<didrocks> seb128: seems to be tricky to define apt priorities for every GNOME package
<seb128> I don't
<seb128> I just install what I need to build the updates I'm working on
<seb128> and dpkg -i those
<didrocks> seb128: yes, but you build most of GNOME package, so, if we want to update GNOME packages too, we will certainly need yours putted in unstable ubuntu release :)
<seb128> I do upload things directly, what reason would I have to keep those locally?
<seb128> but I expect the work for next month will be to sync GNOME 2.26 on debian
<seb128> ie jaunty will have all the requirement to build and test those
<didrocks> seb128: ok, right, I didn't get it, that you only worked SRU for jaunty, thought that you put the new GNOME updates to karmic
<seb128> no
<seb128> I work first on getting some SRU in jaunty to fix issues we will get reported around now and after jaunty
<didrocks> right...
<seb128> let's say from now until 2 weeks after jaunty
<seb128> then I work on bringing the debian and ubuntu 2.26 in sync in karmic
<seb128> that will take some weeks, and since they have 2.26 you can do that on jaunty
<seb128> then I start on 2.27
<didrocks> ok, so, no major prerequiste changes during this time
<seb128> which you can start building and testing on jaunty
<didrocks> ok
<seb128> in this point you have a jaunty + updated GNOME
<seb128> then I upgrade ;-)
<didrocks> understood :-)
<didrocks> keep us in touch for what we can fix/merge from debian after jaunty's release
<didrocks> do we put 2.26.1 to debian SVN alioth?
<didrocks> (push back, removing ubuntu LPI for instance?)
<seb128> debian is getting 2.26.1 right now
<seb128> so we basically get their 2.26 version for things they updated
<seb128> diff with ubunyu
<seb128> ubuntu
<seb128> apply ubuntu changes if required
<pitti> rickspencer3, bryce: FYI, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JauntyJackalope/ReleaseNotes and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReinhardTartler/X/RevertingIntelDriverTo2.4 now have detailled workaround information, warnings, and rollback instructions
<seb128> ask a sync if not
<didrocks> ... what is called merging :)
<seb128> and if there is some changes which would make sense for debian them those to the debian bts
<didrocks> oki
<rickspencer3> pitti: so weird, I was just checking that
<seb128> right, I'm not sure to understand your question so I explain it again ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: you use Mom to get merging status (what packages have been updated) or just ML?
<rickspencer3> pitti: could you please add a section for the freezes?
<seb128> didrocks: usually ml, but that's another case where having a table of versions would be useful
<pitti> rickspencer3: I went through those bugs, but the only non-patchy workaround that I found was to disable DRI
<seb128> didrocks: in fact I've a custom hack to generate a package of packages where the debian version is higher than the ubuntu one
<rickspencer3> pitti: I think folks find that turning off desktop effects works
<pitti> rickspencer3: which is currently covered in the suspend/hibernate hangs
<seb128> a page of packages rather
<pitti> I'll make that more general
<rickspencer3> I'd rather be explicit about the hangs
<didrocks> seb128: a page of packages is more understable than package of package :) Ok, seems where we should give a look at too :)
<didrocks> seb128: thanks for the workflow explanation
<pitti> rickspencer3: updated again
<seb128> you're welcome ;-)
<rickspencer3> pitti: thanks
<rickspencer3> looks good
<rickspencer3> :)
<superm1> mvo, particularly about that zenity thing, the proposed patch just changes focus_on_map in all the glade file to True.  wanted to see if there was opposition to this (http://launchpadlibrarian.net/25534023/zenity-2.26.0-focus.patch) ?
<mvo> superm1: not from me, makes me wonder why it was defaulting to "False" in the first place
<superm1> mvo, well i'd guess oversight;  this emphasis on making sure focus_on_map was doing the right thing is a recentish thing isn't it?
<mvo> superm1: sort of, the fact that it opens in the background is, but unless there is a good reason (taht I don't see) I think focus_on_map should be true
<superm1> mvo, okay. seb128 didn't hae an opinion about this one way or the other either, so since upstream hasn't been responsive on this, i'd like to get this patch in to fix the immediate problem and then repoke upstream
<seb128> what is the bug number again?
<superm1> bug 272083
 * jtholmes is away: for about 3 hours
<seb128> pedro_: hey
<pedro_> salut seb128
<seb128> pedro_: what's going on on bug #338644, still looking upstream for a duplicate? ;-)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 338644 in nautilus "nautilus misarrange the items in the different views" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/338644
<pedro_> seb128: woops don't think so, will take care of that now, thanks for raising it
<pedro_> too many bug mail to catch up :-7
<seb128> pedro_: you're welcome, thanks, I'm cleaning nautilus today ;-)
<seb128> I did gnome-control-center yesterday
<seb128> yeah, I've stopped keeping emails as todolist, too many of those
<seb128> I read those quickly, reply to things easy or important
<seb128> and triage components on launchpad directly otherwis
<seb128> listing bugs which are not known to affect upstream or need to be sent there
<pedro_> yeah that seems the best way to do it, otherwise you keep missing things like that bug
<seb128> pedro_: don't worry that's nothing important, it's just not possible to keep track of everything going on ;-)
<mib_8snagyca> hey is this anygood?
<mib_8snagyca> any1 here?
<mib_8snagyca> fine be that way
<hyperair> some people just can't wait. how stupid.
<seb128> bbl
<pitti> rickspencer3-afk: what you tried to say with the "required:" blueprint whiteboards is better achieved with "Subscribe someone else" -> "Participation essential"
<pitti> rickspencer3-afk: the summit.ubuntu.com planner also has this feature, I'm not sure whether setting this is bidirectional (Keybuk?)
<seb128> pitti: what sort of fixes will be accepted between rc and jaunty?
<pitti> seb128: OMGbreakstheworld, and "tiny patch with zero regression risk"
<pitti> (being considerate with the latter, especially with the ones which can become SRUs)
<seb128> ok, not really learning something there, I think I need to come with specific examples ;-)
<seb128> pitti: http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/libsoup?view=revision&revision=1254 for example
<seb128> pitti: fix some crasher cases in evolution (not so frequent but enough to have upstream asking me if jaunty has the change)
<seb128> I'm fine doing srus, etc
<pitti> seb128: you can try and upload it to the queue, worst case it gets rejected and needs to be turned into an SRU
<seb128> but I'm also fine getting the fix in jaunty and doing less paper work ;-)
<pitti> well, at this point it isn't less paperwork
<nhaines> heh
<pitti> you need a jaunty bug for it and document the fix, sub ubuntu-release, etc.
<seb128> right, I'm just trying to optimize, ie I will not bother going through those rounds if you prefer having an sru direct
<seb128> ok, thanks
<seb128> I will sru
<seb128> do you know if jaunty-proposed is already open for uploads?
<pitti> seb128: sounds good
<pitti> seb128: yes, you can upload to -proposed
<pitti> it won't get accepted until after release, of cousre
<seb128> right
<seb128> just to get things out of my plates
<seb128> ie get bugs in shape and uploads in the queue
<pitti> you can do that, yes
<pitti> ok, early bedtime for me today, to get healthy again
 * pitti waves
<seb128> pitti: 'night
<seb128> pedro_: still looking to bug #320026 too? ;-)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 320026 in nautilus "Thumbnail of jpeg (11 by 3072 pixels) not displayed in Nautilus" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/320026
<pedro_> seb128: yeah!
<seb128> hehe
<pedro_> seb128: let me look into that right now
<seb128> thanks
 * pedro_ kicks his memory
<rickspencer3> pitti - thanks
<kenvandine_wk> rickspencer3: was there a wiki page for documenting our experiences using EXAOptimizeMigration?
<kenvandine_wk> or a bug?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine_wk: there is a bug, I think you can find it in the minutes, otherwise, I'll get it for you in a few
<kenvandine_wk> oh...
<kenvandine_wk> right
<kenvandine_wk> i'll get it
<kenvandine_wk> been stable here... faster than EXA without it... but not as fast as UXA
 * kenvandine_wk comments then goes back to uxa
<rickspencer3> interesting
<kenvandine_wk> uxa is just smoking fast on this box
<rickspencer3> kenvandine_wk: good
<kenvandine_wk> and exa without that option is dog slow...
<seb128> pedro_: could be http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=124936
<ubottu> Gnome bug 124936 in Thumbnails "small images (under 96px) are not thumbnailed" [Minor,New]
<seb128> pedro_: I just ran across it while searching for an another thumbnail issue
 * pedro_ looking
<pedro_> seb128: seems similar but on the test archive they're a couple of images with almost the same size (1103px-11px and 3072x11px)  the first one renders ok and the other doesn't
<pedro_> seb128: maybe it's a library issue, eog is having the same behavior
<seb128> right
<pedro_> or an eog since IIRC it's the one responsible for doing such thumbnails isnt?
<seb128> let's see if upstream figure something
<pedro_> yep
<seb128> I don't think so, I think it's gtk which is used to do those
<seb128> or libgnomeui
<pedro_> will ping claudio for the eog part in case he knows something about it
<seb128> thanks
<pedro_> np
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'm just going through some old gnome-session bugs. If I understand bug 47005 correctly, it's a non-issue now isn't it?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 47005 in gnome-session "'Switch User' button from 'System/Quit' should behave exactly like 'Switch User' from gnome-screensaver" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/47005
<seb128> chrisccoulson: when using fusa you mean? right
<seb128> chrisccoulson: and gnome-screensaver switch to gdm too, right can be closed now
<chrisccoulson> this bug report is when using the session dialog, but i think all buttons do the same thing now - they just take you back to GDM
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'll close that one
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<seb128> you're welcome, thanks for triaging those ;-)
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-04-17
<philsf> I can't make the guest account work from the fusa applet in latest jaunty, how can I debug it, run from command-line?
<chrisccoulson> what's not working exactly? what happens?
<philsf> screen blanks, seems to prepare to open the new session, flickers then returns to the previous open session
<wamcvey> Hey, anyone here actually an Ubuntu desktop developer?
<wamcvey> ok... I'll get less picky... anyone actually here?
<wamcvey> Well... assuming that someone will eventually see what I type into this channel... could the desktop team *please* have someone look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/216550  I would be happy to work with anyone who is interested in actually getting some movement forward on this bug (e.g. assigned to someone would be *great*).
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 216550 in compiz "setting a hotkey for raise/lower window doesn't work" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<wamcvey> just as a bit of context... it's a bug that's been around for over a year now... and reportedly is still an issue in Jaunty.
<pitti> Good morning
<celthunder> pitti, good morning to you too
<Keybuk> pitti: summit gets that information from LP, yes
<pitti> Keybuk: ah, nice
<Keybuk> fiddling in summit doesn't get merged with LP, obviously
<Keybuk> there's no API for blueprints yet
<chrisccoulson> pitti - just saw your comment on bug 346912, and noticed you added a jaunty task
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 346912 in tracker "Tracker index corruption (was Tracker does not stop indexing)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/346912
<chrisccoulson> i've been spending a fair bit of time on #tracker, and I get the impression that the corruption issues require quite big changes to tracker, so it's unlikely to be fixed in Jaunty
<pitti> chrisccoulson: it was already nominated, I just accepted it
<pitti> chrisccoulson: right, that might be; we can still "wontfix" it in jaunty
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ah, ok, i didn't realise
<pitti> there might still be a smaller patch to work around it, though, like deleting the index if corruption is detected, or so?
<chrisccoulson> the corruption issues are not that well understood upstream, but they believe it is down to the general limitations of qdbm, which they are completely dropping in 0.7.x
<chrisccoulson> pitti - the latest version of tracker detects the corruption, and gives the user the option of reindexing
<pitti> oh, we are using that? I thought it used sqlite or so
<pitti> chrisccoulson: where is that option?
<pitti> does it pop up, or do you have to open some menu for that?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it should just happen automatically. but there is already a bug report open for that, because it uses a notification with actions
<kenvandine_wk> is there a way to corrupt it so we can test?
<pitti> ah; so it should be a dialog box
<chrisccoulson> so you get the standard fallback notification with "Ok" and "Cancel" buttons, which do nothing
<chrisccoulson> there's a bug report for that, because "Ok" and "Cancel" just cause the notification to reappear again straight away
<kenvandine_wk> i never saw that in the list of packages to fix
<pitti> chrisccoulson: outh
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine_wk - the notification was added in the upload this week
<pitti> "outch" even
<kenvandine_wk> chrisccoulson: oh... :/
<chrisccoulson> i was going to edit the notifyosd wiki to add it as an application to fix
<chrisccoulson> but i didnt get time
<kenvandine_wk> chrisccoulson: tag the bug "notification"
<chrisccoulson> i'll do that
<kenvandine_wk> thx
<pitti> so, silbs indeed got it
<kenvandine_wk> so it shows up on our radar at least
<pitti> is there a workaround to force reindexing without the dialog}
<pitti> ?
<kenvandine_wk> perhaps not even use a notification... if it is corrupt, there is no other solution
<kenvandine_wk> right?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - perhaps we could just patch it to reindex automatically
<pitti> rm -r .cache/tracker/ or so?
<chrisccoulson> ^^what kenvandine_wk suggested
<pitti> chrisccoulson: right; I guess there's no other choice anyway
<chrisccoulson> once the index is corrupt, there is no other logical way out
<kenvandine_wk> probably dirt easy :_
<kenvandine_wk> :)
<chrisccoulson> i could perhaps look at doing that
<pitti> that would be awesome
<chrisccoulson> but i've got no easy way of triggering database corruption to test:(
<kenvandine_wk> just look at whatever function is called when they act on the notification... and just call that instead of the notification
<kenvandine_wk> chrisccoulson: i guess there is no test suite :/
<chrisccoulson> one of the theories upstream that might be causing corruption is interrupting the indexer whilst it is updating the database
<chrisccoulson> that should be easy, as tracker has no integration with the session manager
<chrisccoulson> so you can trigger that just by logging out
<kenvandine_wk> eww
<kenvandine_wk> but... the db should be getting updated in a transaction, so it would just rollback
<kenvandine_wk> i would think
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine_wk - possibly. i don't know enough about databases to comment though
<chrisccoulson> that might be one of the limitations of qdbm possibly
<chrisccoulson> right, i've got to disappear now to travel home from work. i should be around when i get home though
<kenvandine_wk> thx
<seb128> pitti: how busy are you today? ;-)
<seb128> pitti: I uploaded the gvfs,nautilus change for smb ad to hardy-proposed now
<pitti> currently reviewing unapproved queue, then I need to prep release meeting, and then do the meeting
<seb128> pitti: if you have some time to review the uploads that would be welcome
<pitti> seb128: SRU was also on my list
<seb128> the changes are the same as the ones uploaded to intrepid some months ago
<seb128> so should be no real surprise
<pitti> thanks
<chrisccoulson> pitti - would you mind adding a jaunty target to bug 361205
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 361205 in tracker "corrupt index on tracker" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/361205
<chrisccoulson> that's the one about the fallback notification
<pitti> done
<chrisccoulson> thanks:)
<kenvandine_wk> chrisccoulson: just dropping the index also solves the notification issue... 2 birds, 1 stone... good stuff :)
<kenvandine_wk> chrisccoulson: don't forget to tag it though
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine_wk - no problem:)
<kenvandine_wk> thx
<rickspencer3> ArneGoetje: asac: bryce: calc: kenvandine_wk Riddell seb128 pitti: what's the word on the street regarding the RC?
<kenvandine_wk> rickspencer3: quite positive
<kenvandine_wk> twitter/identi.ca has been going nuts :)
<kenvandine_wk> mostly happy
<seb128> rickspencer3: looks good to me out of all those intel discussions but that's not a stopper and I think I read rather concern on this channel than on other places so let's see ;-)
<asac> rickspencer3: plan to do my first post-RC bug round a bit later ... will report ;)
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> rickspencer3: as usual, tons of uploads in unapproved, trawling through ATM
<seb128> rickspencer3: GNOME wise the amount of bugs is reasonable, nothing urgent or unexpected so far reported
<rickspencer3> seb128: yes, I noticed that we seem to be more concerned about -intel then the bloggers and reviewers
<Riddell> I think intel problems affect qt more than gtk for some reason
<asac> pitti: fta asks whats the policy for bringing ia32libs in sync with RC status.
<pitti> asac: no policy, but sounds like a good idea, if it can be tested with flash and some other usages
<asac> is that a SRU thing or are we doing this a few days before release usually
<asac> fta: can you upload the new package to some PPA so we can test it?
<pitti> ideally we should do it ASAP
<pitti> and since it's universe, it's not bound to CD freezes
<asac> fta: is there a bug we can use to track this roll out?
<asac> otherwise i can open one for you
 * asac on call
<rickspencer3> Riddell: yah, I noticed that the Kubuntu users have slightly worse problems
<pitti> rickspencer3-afk: FYI, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus updated
<chrisccoulson> does notify-osd send out a "closed" signal when it has finished displaying a notification?
<wamcvey> Anyone awake here yet?
<chrisccoulson> nobody ever sleeps here
<fta2> asac, ?
<wamcvey> was here last night and the place was dead quite...
<wamcvey> I was hoping I could nudge someone to take a look at a compiz issue that's been lingering around for over a year and still doesn't have an assigned owner on launchpad.
<chrisccoulson> which issue?
<wamcvey> apparently the issue persists into Jaunty
<wamcvey>  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/216550
<chrisccoulson> have you tested it in jaunty?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 216550 in compiz "setting a hotkey for raise/lower window doesn't work" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<wamcvey> I personally haven't, but one of the followers (David Fox) has confirmed it still exists with Jaunty
<chrisccoulson> i can't help you much further with that as I don't have much knowledge of compiz, and I don't really have time to test it out yet either
<wamcvey> Chris, I understand... I asked over on #ubuntu and that place was a zoo... Was hoping this smaller audience focused on the desktop would have a more likelyhood of finding someone who can at least take ownership of the issue
<mvo> wamcvey: I think this is a side-effect of a bug already filed, give me a minute to find it
<mvo> bug #352656
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 352656 in compiz "Ignores GNOME preferred terminal application setting" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/352656
<mvo> hm, maybe not
<wamcvey> mvo: yeah... doesn't seem like the same issue.
<asac> fta2: ok. so what we want is a ppa upload, with a bug so we can test and sign it off
<tedg> chrisccoulson: Ask on #ayatana, but I'm pretty sure it's supposed to.
<chrisccoulson> tedg - thanks
<pitti> davidbarth, MacSlow: you are 100% sure that the patch in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/notify-osd/+bug/331369/comments/27 fixes the multihead problem? "focus-follow" sounds quite unrelated to that
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 331369 in notify-osd "regression vs. notification-daemon: positioning when multiple screens are available" [Medium,Fix committed]
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i've got a patch for tracker to automatically reindex when the index becomes corrupt
<pitti> chrisccoulson: nice!
<davidbarth> pitti: it does finish the job
<pitti> chrisccoulson: this should make a fine SRU (doesn't affect new installs, since we don't install tracker by default)
<davidbarth> pitti: the patch that is already in the release does fix the main issue
<chrisccoulson> i could do with a guinea pig to try it out on now:)
<davidbarth> pitti: ie the fact that we're now displaying bubbles next to the gnome-panel
<kenvandine_wk> chrisccoulson: i can test that
<pitti> chrisccoulson: put it in the bug and ask silbs to test
<chrisccoulson> thanks:)
<pitti> davidbarth: so you confirm it's the right patch? I was just wondering
<pitti> davidbarth: (this is relative to 0.9.11, I don't upgrade to 0.9.12
<wamcvey> sorry to be repetative... but is there anything more than I can/should do to try and get movement on the bug?
<davidbarth> so 0.9.12 contains the one-liner
<davidbarth> so 0.9.11 is the current version that fixes most of the multihead issue
<davidbarth> the fix is really about enabling the "advanced" focus-follow mode
<davidbarth> strictly speaking it is not a hard requirement for being multi-head compatible
<pitti> davidbarth: ah, ok
<davidbarth> it's just that the bug would be cleanly closed this way
<pitti> davidbarth: the bug is chalked down for ubuntu-9.04
<pitti> I'm fine with that cherrypick
<davidbarth> which means? going in?
<davidbarth> cool
<davidbarth> thanks for our users ;)
 * pitti uploads, thanks for confirming
<wamcvey> Checking over on #compiz-fusion if/when this feature was added into compiz.  (it's still a bug in Ubuntu though but maybe I can solve the problem myself by building my own compiz. bleh)
<asac> what was the trick get keyring unlocked automatically if i use automatic-login?
<asac> nevermind. i made a system connection out of it ;) ... now no keyring hazzles on startup
<chrisccoulson> pitti - my tracker patch seems to work ok
<chrisccoulson> i flipped a few bits in the index to corrupt it ;)
<pitti> \o/
<wamcvey> FYI: regarding ticket https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/216550  , the vigo plugin to compiz (http://www.acc.umu.se/~janlert/vigo/) provides key binding for raise-lower functionality. I'll update the ticket with the info on getting it compiled and installed.
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 216550 in compiz "setting a hotkey for raise/lower window doesn't work" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<pitti> seb128: heh, cjwatson and you are on par on http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/bug-fixing/jaunty-fixes-report.html; but cjwatson has some more fixes in the pipeline; quick, fix something and overtake him :)
<seb128> pitti: we should count jaunty-updates there too ;-)
<pitti> seb128: are you experiencing bug 359392?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 359392 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[i965] X freezes starting on April 3rd" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/359392
<seb128> pitti: no
<pitti> seb128: running with any special xorg.conf options such as greedy or EXAOptimize?
<bryce> seb128: do you run compiz on?
<mvo> seb128: or desktop effects ;)
<seb128> xorg is rocking stable since the fast user switching fix there
<seb128> bryce: yes
<bryce> ok
<seb128> no, stock xorg
<seb128> I've no speed issue and never felt the need to play with options
<seb128> it's on my d630, i965
<seb128> I've virtual section in xorg.conf set from the xrandr capplet
<seb128> but that's all
<seb128> I'm using compiz but nothing fancy there
<seb128> ie I'm only doing alt-tab and workspace switches
<seb128> I'm not using the cube or any other combo
<seb128> pitti: bug sent upstream = triaged for us
<pitti> seb128: right, but the upstream bug is not very useful, it has about zero information
<pitti> we got asked in the release meeting to at least understand it, since it causes a lot of unrelated bug noise in openssh and general confusion
<seb128> pitti: so put it to incomplete if it lacks infos
<seb128> pitti: it's either triaged or incomplete there
<pitti> right, makes sense
<seb128> pitti: I'm not sure to understand the bug description or the issue though
<seb128> are we sure that's something that ever worked
<mvo> seb128: what is the pci id of your vga card?
<YokoZar> Quick "color of the bikeshed" question regarding Wine icon: http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/tango-artists/attachments/20060331/63117187/wine.svg   or http://yokozar.org/blog/content/icons/wine.svg  ?
<chrisccoulson> mmmmm, wine
 * chrisccoulson goes to grab a bottle
<YokoZar> chrisccoulson: are you using "bordeaux"-style glasses or "burgundy"-style (thin or thick)
<chrisccoulson> bordeaux ;)
<chrisccoulson> are your icons intended for any particular theme? or just to ship with wine?
<nhaines> YokoZar: I like the freedesktop.org one the best, but I see that the yokozar one would match some other themes better.  Maybe if the first one had bolder outlines?
<YokoZar> nhaines: tango icons (and they're both tango-compliant) are supposed to have extra highlighting in their smaller sizes (that is, the 1 pixel border/highlight isn't scaled down, but remains at 1 pixel when the image is 22x22 or 48x48)
<nhaines> The first one looks more elegant and the one on your blog looks more... I donno, more like a tango icon.  :)
<YokoZar> nhaines: ironic as the first was submitted to the tango list and the latter is pulled from Ubuntu studio ;)\
<nhaines> hehe
<YokoZar> but it's interesting you think the fatter one looks more elegant
<nhaines> I love the lines in yours, but (purely subjectively) not the wide shape.  :)
<YokoZar> oh
<nhaines> No, I think the thin one looks more elegant.  But I don't like the lines.
<YokoZar> you're mixing them up, hah
<nhaines> I just realized I may have mixed them up.
<nhaines> haha, sorry.  :)
<pitti> rickspencer3: FYI, I added desktop startup speed to the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UDSKarmic/Prep/Desktop brainstorm list
<rickspencer3> sweet
<rickspencer3> I suppose folks might as well go ahead and create blueprints if they wsih
<seb128> pitti: good luck with that
<pitti> seb128: ugh, yeah
<seb128> pitti: I think we spent some time on that for jaunty and will not get much better result without replacing gconf bonobo etc
<seb128> which is GNOME3 tasks upstream already
<pitti> seb128: at least points 3, 4, 5 should be doable, though
<pitti> seb128: ah, gconf will be replaced by dconf in 2.30?
<seb128> pitti: that's the plan
<pitti> nice
<seb128> pitti: desrt is paid to work on that and will be at uds
<pitti> not in 2.28 yet, though?
<pitti> and, will it be any faster? :-)
<seb128> the plan is to have be there but don't expect everything to use it
<seb128> pitti: http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2009-April/msg00028.html
<pitti> ok, so potentially that's something we could help with
<pitti> seb128: thanks
<seb128> "dconf is very efficient. The majority case in accessing settings is reading (think about desktop login: 1000s of settings read, none written)."
<seb128> pitti: ^
<seb128> ups
<seb128> "dconf is very efficient. The majority case in accessing settings is reading (think about desktop login: 1000s of settings read, none written). Reading in dconf is done directly from a memory-mapped file containing the settings in an efficient tree format and doesn't require an extra service to be running. The service is only needed for writes.  Communication occurs over DBus, of course. :) "
<seb128> rather
<seb128> pitti: I think the main offenders in gnome-panel and nautilus are gconf and bonobo
<YokoZar> does dconf mean settings will become cross-desktop eventually?
<seb128> I'm not sure we will benefit from any discussion there, nautilus upstream already said he's happy to work on speed issue if we provide datas of what is slow
<seb128> YokoZar: dunno, depends if other desktops environment are wanting to use it
<YokoZar> seb128: I guess my question then is should there be freedesktop standards for things moving out of gconf and into dconf
<seb128> it will not have GNOME depends
<seb128> the question is not about a standard, it's to know if other desktop which have something working for them are wanting to do the effort to switch
<seb128> and that's not a GNOME question so dunno
<YokoZar> ahh I see
<seb128> pitti: your items there seem rather bugs than things which need discussion
<pitti> seb128: well, it's not immediately clear to me how to keep a gpg agent when not starting seahorse with the sessions
<pitti> since it currently relies on those silly env vars
<seb128> we already start seahorse feature depending on gconf keys
<pitti> YokoZar: with KDE4 just having introduced akonadi, I have only little hope :/
<seb128> I'm not sure that' worth the 1 second difference
<seb128> and anyway that's rather a thing we should submit upstream now and wait for comments
<pitti> seb128: if your budget is really 4 seconds some day, it will
<seb128> rather than a topic discussion for uds
<pitti> (it's a whopping 3 seconds for me)
<pitti> but anyway, it's just a brainstorm list
<pitti> I'm sure there's some more things we can do to speed it up
<seb128> well just saying that I doubt we will have better ideas in a session than right now
<seb128> it just require somebody working on the issue
<YokoZar> speaking of gpg and seahorse... I would like to talk about how we have three separate places where one might look for keyring prompts
<pitti> I just can't commit to us doing 10 manmonths of upstream work, as Keybuk proposed
<pitti> seb128: well, if the solution to seahorse or the xrdb stuff is already entirely clear, then sure
<YokoZar> Applications-> Accessories -> Passwords and Encryption Keys, System->Preferences->Encryption and Keyring, and System->Administratin->Authorizations
<seb128> pitti: well, it has been discussed at one uds and one sprint already
<seb128> pitti: we had discussions, bootcharts and bugs about those issues
<pitti> seb128: what was the approach for seahorse then?
<seb128> pitti: I don't think discussing it again will bring anything new, we just need to do the work
<pitti> right, sorry then; I wasn't aware of those
<seb128> pitti: we have some feature starting conditionally in jaunty, for the gpg agent we don't have a clever solution yet
<seb128> I'm not sure that a round table will bring it one if nobody has a clue on how to do that right now and didn't during previous discussions
<seb128> $ grep enable /etc/xdg/autostart/seahorse-daemon.desktop
<seb128> AutostartCondition=GNOME /apps/seahorse/sharing/sharing_enabled
<YokoZar> We probably should talk about the UI of the key stuff though.  There are 3 different programs with key icons in 3 different menus
<seb128> pitti: ^
<seb128> YokoZar: you wrote that 2 minutes ago already, no need to repeat it again ;-)
<dobey> hmm
<YokoZar> seb128: I meant as a blueprint ;)
<seb128> YokoZar: you can do that, there is lot of discussions about merging capplets, etc, that require upstream work and we don't have so much free cycles for that
<pitti> seb128: well, that's not for GPG, is it? the gpg agent is /etc/X11/Xsession.d/60seahorse-plugins
<dobey> i wonder if there will be more kde art people there this time
<YokoZar> It seems like seahorse should be a capplet itself (or merged into one)
<seb128> pitti: right, as said "some feature", we have no clear idea about this one
<seb128> pitti: I'm happy discussing it again but I feel it's rather a technical issue than a discussion one, ie require work and thinking rather than a discussion
<pitti> seb128: right, that needs to be done before UDS
<asac> what can we do for bug 362836
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 362836 in network-manager-applet ""3G networks detected" notification bubble displays wrong icon" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/362836
<asac> dxteam wants to get that fixed ... would be UI change (even if tiny)
<asac> impact is https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-applet/+bug/362836/comments/5
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 362836 in network-manager-applet ""3G networks detected" notification bubble displays wrong icon" [Low,Triaged]
<asac> pitti: whats your opinion? or should i rather ask in -release?
<pitti> re
<pitti> asac: sorry, got stuck in my mail client
<pitti> asac: erm, now?
<pitti> asac: let's say I'm not exactly fond of that
<pitti> asac: technically possible, if the docteam gives their ack, but I'd rather have a sabdfl exception for that
<pitti> good night everyone
<kenvandine_wk> good night pitti
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-04-18
<chrisccoulson> anyone here noticed evolution-data-server freezing quite frequently?
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-04-19
<defcon> morning
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-04-19
<TheMuso> Hey robert_ancell. How was your trip?
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, hey, it was good
 * TheMuso sighs. More people emailing me about their audio problems, and not either filing a bug, or pointing me to the bug.
 * RAOF enjoys a perk of working from his brother's place - there's an espresso machine, and someone to drive it!
<robert_ancell> pitti, can you look at bug 551460 and let through the queue if looks good
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 551460 in gnome-doc-utils "Update to 0.20.0" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/551460
<TheMuso> RAOF: heh
<robert_ancell> pitti, also, please look at bug 189543
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 189543 in d-feet "d-feet crashed with AttributeError in cursor_changed_handler()" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/189543
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> robert_ancell: gnome-doc-utils isn't in the queue; was it already accepted?
<pitti> robert_ancell: there's no changelog for g-doc-u 0.2.0; would you mind attaching one, for checking FF and regression potential?
<robert_ancell> pitti, couldn't upload g-d-u, is in bzr
<pitti> robert_ancell: oh, 0.19.5 > 0.20.0 is just .po file updates?
<pitti> robert_ancell: ok, will sponsor and shepherd through
<robert_ancell> pitti, just confirming
<robert_ancell> yes
<robert_ancell> The git patch is the important component
<pitti> robert_ancell: ok, thanks
<pitti> robert_ancell: d-feet> three uploads within one hour? :-)
<pitti> anyway, accepted
<robert_ancell> pitti, heh.  I thought I'd see what the other bugs were and added that one, then decided there was a second bug in d-feet to fix :)
<raof> I'd like to get a bunch of X guys and kernel guys in a room at the same time at UDS, because kernel modesetting has moved quite a lot of X into the kernel and we need to work out how best to handle bugs, tracking upstream, etc.  The way to make this happen would be to write a blueprint, yes?
<baptistemm> howdy
<baptistemm> thanks robert_ancell for fixing 189543
<baptistemm> robert_ancell, would you consider fixing previous ubuntu releases?
<robert_ancell> baptistemm, does it affect existing releases?  Isn't apport generally turned off?
<pitti> yes, it shouldn't matter in stables
<baptistemm> yeah, I was trying but nothing appears except in the term in which is started d-feet
<didrocks> good morning
<RAOF> Good morning didrocks.
<didrocks> hey RAOF :)
 * RAOF always expects âmorningâ to tab-autocomplete; it never does :)
<didrocks> ahah
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<pitti> hey RAOF
<RAOF> Howdie pitti
<didrocks> pitti: Guten Morgen pitti. You are well settled in Munich this week?
<pitti> didrocks: no, I'm still in DD; Netti arrived safely, though
<pitti> her first day of the internship today :)
 * pitti looking forward to her call this evening
<didrocks> good luck to her :)
<seb128> hey pitti didrocks
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<didrocks> good morning seb128, enjoyed the week-end?
<seb128> didrocks, yes! you?
<didrocks> seb128: yes, sunny one. I even got sunburned at the restaurant :)
<seb128> like to sit in the sun while eating? ;-)
 * pitti had a great weekend as well
<pitti> nice birthday party, a go-kart race with my family and friends
<pitti> and yesterday was marvellous weather, I walked for two hours
<didrocks> seb128: when you didn't see a real sunny day for a long time. Yes! :)
<huats> morning
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> good morning chrisccoulson & huats
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks, how are you?
<huats> morning chrisccoulson and didrocks
<chrisccoulson> hey huats
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm good, thanks. busy week for me beginning but it will be ok :) and you?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm ok too thanks
<chrisccoulson> still trying to fix gjs, with no success yet
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'm great, thanks! had a marvellous weekend
<chrisccoulson> excellent :)
<seb128> pitti, can we still sneak changes in today?
<seb128> pitti, ted sent updates to fix the messaging menu duplicating items
<pitti> seb128: only very safe and urgent ones, RC builds will start soon
<pitti> please coordinate in #ubuntu-release
<didrocks> pitti: universe isn't in freeze, there is just an archive admin manual push, right?
<seb128> pitti, hum k
<seb128> pitti, and after RC?
<pitti> didrocks: it's also in freeze, but not bound so much by CD builds
<seb128> pitti, what about the lpi change?
<pitti> seb128: possibly; we certainly rebuild CDs again
<pitti> seb128: so it's probably best if you just upload, so that it's in the queue for review
<seb128> ok
<pitti> seb128: lpi change> that'll go in, of course; I think it's a good time to upload it, to have it in the queue now
<pitti> seb128: perhaps you can upload lpi right now?
<didrocks> pitti: ok, will push a nautilus-action update. People pointed that the new release got some regression with a lot of script. Upstream fixed it
<seb128> pitti, uploaded
<tseliot> pitti: do you think my fix for bug #562226 can be included before the final release?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 562226 in jockey "[LUCID] 'Hardware Drivers' showing all drivers as active" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/562226
<pitti> tseliot: if you think that the change is safe, please upload, and we'll review it from the queue
<tseliot> pitti: will do, thanks
<Zdra> How do I know in the code if the indicator applet is on the panel?
<Zdra> I would like to fix rhythmbox made unusable by that indicator patch
<seb128> would be easier for you to make your own build with the configure option set to false for it
<geser> what's the solution to make the binary debs build from gir-repository installable again? they have a versioned depends on gir1.0-gtk-2.0 build from gir-repository but gir1.0-gtk-2.0 got replaced with the one build from gtk+2.0
<seb128> geser, example?
<geser> Package gir1.0-wnck-1.0 version 0.6.5-5ubuntu1 has an unmet dep:
<geser>  Depends: gir1.0-gtk-2.0 (= 0.6.5-5ubuntu1)
<seb128> geser, drop the version from the depends?
<seb128> geser, I can do that if you want
<seb128> let me look
<Zdra> seb128, does that mean there is no way to now at run time? or you just don't know?
<Zdra> seb128, I would like to not have to keep my own build for that detail...
<Zdra> could benefit everyone if I just make it run-time as empathy does
<seb128> Zdra, I don't know and people who know are u.s based and sleeping
<Zdra> ok
<Zdra> seb128, do you have a name I could ping later?
<seb128> ted
<Zdra> thanks :)
<seb128> np
<seb128> you can try asking on #ayatana too
<tseliot> pitti: uploaded
<geser> seb128: looks like removing the gir1.0-gtk-2.0 package from debian/control.in and adding gir1.0-gtk-2.0 to build-depends is enough to fix those broken dependencies
<seb128> geser, I've uploaded a change without gir1.0-gtk-2.0 a minute ago
<geser> ok
<seb128> geser, I didn't do the build-depends change though
<seb128> fixing...
<seb128> geser, thanks for raising the issue and looking at the fix too ;-)
<pitti> tseliot: accepted
<tseliot> pitti: thanks
<seb128> ok, email backlog from the weekend cleaned before lunch
<chrisccoulson> yay seb128 \o/
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, not too bad thanks. how are you?
<ogra> who reverted gcalctool to the sane UI ?
 * ogra wants to know so he can pay that person a beer in bussels
<seb128> ogra, I raised the issue with robert_ancell and he agreed to use the previous one for lucid
<ogra> so two beers then :)
<seb128> ogra, the new one is a rewritte but he didn't get everything he wanted done ready
<seb128> ogra, ;-)
<ogra> really makes my life easier to be able to quickly convert hex to dec. in arm land everything is in hex
<seb128> I like being able to do base conversions in an easy way too
<ogra> well, there is always printf but its way easier to do it in the calculator
<hyperair> seb128: could you take a look at bug #565418, please?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 565418 in nautilus-share "Sync nautilus-share (main) 0.7.2-13 from Debian Unstable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/565418
<hyperair> sync request with two bugfixes
<seb128> ok
<hyperair> thanks
<hyperair> seb128: bug #564506 as well, please. banshee-community-extensions won't build until that is fixed in indicator-application.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 564506 in banshee-community-extensions "libappindicator-cil-dev's .pc file points to the wrong place" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/564506
<lool> Hmm just noticed this today, /usr/bin/gnome-video-thumbnailer: broken symbolic link to `/etc/alternatives/gnome-video-thumbnailer'
<seb128> lool, we dropped those alternatives years ago no?
<seb128> hyperair, the libappindicator you will need slangasek to ack, the binary rename now doesn't seem something that will go in
<lool> I just checked, and the thumbnailing works fine
<lool> seb128: perhaps we failed removing them on upgrade?
<lool> I see /var/lib/dpkg/info/totem.preinst:        update-alternatives --quiet --remove-all gnome-video-thumbnailer || true
<lool> Running this snippet manually fixes it for me
<seb128> lool, it worked for me but I can see that going wrong, I hate alternative for this reason ;-)
<seb128> they keep creating random issues
<ogra> they keep you from getting jobless ... think positive :)
<lool> Same for totem
<lool> so it's a bug in the totem preinst: configure isn't a valid action for preinst, upgrade is
<seb128> hyperair, in fact I can't approve either of those, I'm not in approver for main exceptions
<hyperair> seb128: it's low-impact, at the very east.
<hyperair> least*
<seb128> well, as said I'm the wrong person to talk to
<seb128> try slangasek
<hyperair> okay, thanks
<lool> seb128: I dont feel this is worth a totem upload, but is it ok if I stage it to lp:~ubuntu-desktop/totem/ubuntu ?
<lool> (committed to Debian)
<seb128> lool, yes syre
<seb128> sure
<seb128> lool, thanks
<seb128> lunch time bbl
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: not tested today but with Friday's image, Flash returning "no plugin available" when trying to download one. Known issue?
<asac> didrocks: yes. search for pfs in about:config
<asac> replace 10.04 with 9.10 to get results
<asac> (plugin db needs refresh)
<didrocks> asac: ok, a fix is uploaded for RC? (just wanted to ensure :))
<asac> didrocks: its not an upload. the db is a webservice. we will refresh it before RC, yes.
<didrocks> asac: oh ok, great :)
<didrocks> pitti: if you have a sec at looking the nautilus-actions upload. I guess we should take the new version as it fixes an upstream issue which broke a tons of action scripts
<seb128> didrocks, it's in the queue they will come to it
<seb128> didrocks, it's in universe so no hurry
<pitti> didrocks: yes, we'll get to that; we needed to build the main packages first to kick off CD builds
<seb128> pitti, http://ddebs.ubuntu.com/pool/main/g/glib2.0/
<seb128> pitti, still no glib ddeb :-(
<pitti> WTF
<didrocks> seb128: pitti: thanks
<seb128> pitti, I think either the server collector or the pkgbinary magic is buggy now
<pitti> seb128: but this time we should still have the .ddebs if they were built at all; hang on
<didrocks> seb128: sure, not knowning that the main queue was not acked yet (I didn't have close look at this process previously) :)
<seb128> pitti, http://launchpadlibrarian.net/44409721/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-i386.glib2.0_2.24.0-0ubuntu2_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz suggests they were not
<seb128> didrocks, ? you should have received an email saying that your upload is waiting
<seb128> didrocks, universe changes have until next week to go in I think
<pitti> seb128: uh, the test suite failed on that, is that expected?
<seb128> pitti, where?
<pitti> seb128: in that very build log
<seb128> "dpkg-deb: building package `libglib2.0-0' in `../libglib2.0-0_2.24.0-0ubuntu2_i386.deb'.
<seb128> INFO: Disabling pkgsanitychecks for udeb
<seb128> "
<seb128> wth?
<seb128> pitti, it detects the udeb as not udeb
<seb128> and build a ddeb for the udeb
<seb128> reversed logic somewhere?
<pitti> right, it seems to be a bug in pkg-create-dbgsym itself, not in the ddeb-retriever scripts
<seb128> pitti, the testsuite is racy that's "known"
<seb128> that's why it doesn't break the build
<didrocks> seb128: ok, after RC, changes in universe are still considered. Just what I wanted to know. Thanks :)
<seb128> didrocks, you didn't read the ubuntu-devel-announce emails ;-)
<pitti> seb128: the udeb is ignored in the first invocation, but not in the dh_strip -plibglib2.0-udeb one apparently
<seb128> pitti, do you want me to open a bug about this?
<didrocks> seb128: I read it, but nothing it told about universe :-p
<pitti> seb128: please do; I'm afraid I can't fix it right now
<seb128> pitti, that's ok, totally understable, maybe we will have a chance between rc and luci
<seb128> lucid
<seb128> didrocks, ok, I'm too lazy to look into my emails now but I read one from slangasek I think with freeze lines
<didrocks> seb128: sure, "During the freeze, all uploads to main must be approved by a member of the
<didrocks> release team"
<seb128> didrocks, the one I read had a date for universe which was around one week later
<didrocks> and archives in freeze, but nothing telling the process for universe package (just that you get the mail "waiting") :)
<seb128> i "25 april" or something
<seb128> ie
<didrocks> oh? let me check
<pitti> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2010-April/000705.html
<seb128> that was some days ago but I'm not sure where I read it now
<seb128> pitti, thanks ;-)
<pitti> de rien
<seb128> didrocks, see you don't read u-d-a I knew it :p
<didrocks> ok, I obviously overlooked this one. Thanks pitti & seb128 :)
 * didrocks hides for that one and read
<\vish> seb128: hi.. Bug 513036  and Bug #488784 have been fixed upstream , we need to pick the fixes or...
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 513036 in f-spot "Film strip's highlighted thumbnail is difficult to distinguish" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/513036
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 488784 in f-spot ""Import tags" category sounds like an action" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/488784
<seb128> vish, "or" yes
<seb128> vish, lucid is hard frozen for rc now and we will not do UI or string changes now
<seb128> vish, next cycle
<vish> ah ok. , got it
<vish> seb128: 513036 doesnt need string change
<seb128> I said "UI or string"
<seb128> it's an UI change
<seb128> and not the sort of bugs we fix now anyway
<seb128> we will limit changes to things which break lucid hard or installer bugs
<seb128> we might consider such bug fixes in a stable update if we really want those but that will be after lucid
<vish> seb128: hmm , its a minor change would could that a breaking UI ,just makes the highlight visible , but anyways thanks for clearing that :)
<seb128> stable update anyway
<vish> eerr.. would count that as breaking UI *
<seb128> as said we need to focus on real issues now, not on minor polish changes
<vish> sure , np
<vish> argh! that would be "wouldnt" but bleh..   having more typing errors than usual ;p
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks, it seems asac already answered your question ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: yeah ;)
<seb128> pitti, bug #566602
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 566602 in pkg-create-dbgsym "build debug variant for the udeb and not the library" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/566602
<pitti> seb128: merci
<seb128> pitti, de rien
<vish> chrisccoulson: regarding Bug #549798  , does this refer to the tracker search icon, we get when we "Add to panel" > Search for files , does tracker use a -panel icon and is it just waiting for an icon?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 549798 in ubuntu-mono "tracker needs a monochrome notification icon" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/549798
<chrisccoulson> vish - i really wouldn't worry about that for this cycle
<chrisccoulson> nobody cares about the current version of tracker in the archive ;)
<chrisccoulson> next cycle maybe ;)
<vish> chrisccoulson: nah , not this cycle.. ;)  but i think it wouldnt get fixed unless it is in the right project :)
<chrisccoulson> vish - i think the tray icon would need a new icon name, but nobody will do the work for that with the current version
<vish> chrisccoulson: right., thanks
<glatzor> servus mvo!
<mvo> hey glatzor
<seb128> hey glatzor
<glatzor> hey seb128!
<glatzor> hello mpt
<mpt> Hey glatzor! Long time no see
<glatzor> mpt, indeed. hope you are fine?
<mpt> yep, hard at work designing Ubuntu Software Center v3
<glatzor> mpt, have you already worked on the design of dependency confirmation dialogs?
<glatzor> mpt, e.g. I want to install xterm and it requires the installation of libxterm1 and the removal of the conflicting package uterm
<nigelbabu> The fix for bug 33288 has been comitted upstream.  Is it too late to get it into lucid?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 33288 in poppler "Evince doesn't handle columns properly" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/33288
<glatzor> glatzor, I am currently working on dependency handling inside aptdaemon itself. so software center would not have to care about.
<glatzor> mpt, the new code also takes queued transactions into account
<glatzor> mpt, so I would like to add a confirmation dialog to the aptdaemon gtk widgets.
<glatzor> mpt, sorry I have to leave. See you later!
<mpt> glatzor, ok, I'll mail you about it
<mpt> thanks
<glatzor> thanks
<nigelbabu> didrocks, can you make a call on the poppler bug?
<didrocks> nigelbabu: sure, let me have a look if we want it now are in a SRU
<nigelbabu> you want the commit?
<didrocks> nigelbabu: is it linked in upstream bug?
<nigelbabu> no, upsteam comitted a makeshift patch
<nigelbabu> but didn't close the bug since it can still be improved
<nigelbabu> http://cgit.freedesktop.org/poppler/poppler/commit/?id=9c5612f6e013a8698eff6531ec388a7e6c1fb89a
<didrocks> nigelbabu: looking at it
<nigelbabu> and one more link, the upstream bug http://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3188
<ubottu> Freedesktop bug 3188 in general "Pasting tables cells in strange order" [Normal,New]
<didrocks> (yeah, it's linked from the launchpad bug)
<nigelbabu> oh yeah, sorry.  Forgot that :)
<seb128> rickspencer3, hello
<rickspencer3> good morning seb128
<didrocks> nigelbabu: ok, I'm in favor including that patch. It will be a huge improvment. Looking at upstream comment, it solves most of the cases (there are still corner cases not fixed) and they integrated it but leave the upstream bug opened for further work on those corner cases. Testing it now.
<didrocks> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi didrocks
<nigelbabu> didrocks, if you dont have time, let me know.  I'll get a debdiff for ya :)
<didrocks> nigelbabu: it's ok, should be quickly integrated :)
<nigelbabu> didrocks, awesome.  thank you.  (one patch down, 1800 to go)
<didrocks> nigelbabu: heh :-)
<didrocks> nigelbabu: thanks for pinging people about those ;)
<nigelbabu> didrocks, :)
<pitti> hey rickspencer3, how are you?
<rickspencer3> hi pitti
<rickspencer3> been online 10 minutes, and already super busy :/
<rickspencer3> pitti, how are you?
<seb128> rickspencer3, welcome to monday morning right? ;-)
<nigelbabu> the assigning bugs to Desktop Team is gone right?
<rickspencer3> seb128, exactly!
<seb128> rickspencer3, I sometime start by catching up a bit with emails etc before starting on IRC, after weekend is too crazy otherwise
<seb128> nigelbabu, yes
<didrocks> nigelbabu: well, the code changed a lot from the tip compared to the commit: functions renamed/added/removed. Not sure that including it is safe enough :/
<nigelbabu> seb128, thank you
<pitti> rickspencer3: I'm great, thanks! had a nice weekend with a great birthday party and go-kart race, and a long walk on Sunday
<nigelbabu> didrocks, oh
<nigelbabu> didrocks, holding off till Lucid?
<nigelbabu> grr maverick
<didrocks> nigelbabu: that would be wise, unfortunately (it's not like refreshing the patch is just 10 lines to adapt, we get huge changes to make).
<nigelbabu> didrocks, hm.  Can you comment on the bug about it?  lots of people expecting it.  Also, I'll try to get it into a ppa so people can use it
<didrocks> nigelbabu: (looking at the commit in git, not the patch attached to the bug report of couse)
<didrocks> nigelbabu: sure
<didrocks> nigelbabu: the patch depends maybe on previous commit. Having a simple look first
<nigelbabu> yeah, there is quite a bit of delta between our version and current git code
 * kenvandine is having trouble saying maverick... i keep saying lucid +1 :)
 * nigelbabu too
<pitti> hey kenvandine, how are you?
<kenvandine> good
<kenvandine> testing suspend bugs in gwibber and desktopcouch :)
<kenvandine> fun stuff
<kenvandine> pitti, and you?
<pitti> I'm great, thanks
 * kenvandine is tired... moving furniture and painting all weekend :/
<kenvandine> but our new floors look awesome :-D
<nigelbabu> didrocks, also, metacity has a big with a patch.  bug 111939.  fix in my ppa.  vish is testing now.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 111939 in metacity "Not possible to alt-tab during a drag-and-drop operation" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/111939
<nigelbabu> s/big/bug
<didrocks> nigelbabu: ok, keep me posted. I'm building the other patch
<nigelbabu> didrocks, great :)
<didrocks> nigelbabu: looks good, pushing the plopper change if pitti can give an ack (fixing selection in pdf, bug #33288, fix backported from upstream)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 33288 in poppler "Evince doesn't handle columns properly" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/33288
<nigelbabu> didrocks, woo! you folks rock! :)
<didrocks> nigelbabu: you rock at triaging those patch an particularly noticing upstream commited this one ;)
<nigelbabu> I'm subscribed to a lot of upstream bug reports :)
<didrocks> (I remember to hate this bug in 2007 when making my final internship reportâ¦) and even later for copy/paste everything in pdfâ¦
<nigelbabu> didrocks, no wonder you're so excited at fixing :D
<didrocks> well, TBH, I need it less today than during my studies, but still good to be nice for people needing it :)
<didrocks> (and at our party, we get a lot of complains by not specially skilled people because of that)
<nigelbabu> ah :)
<nigelbabu> didrocks, the metacity patch seems to be not working though fedora seems to have shipped it and its working perfectly there
<didrocks> nigelbabu: well, in any case, the issue is the same in compiz. I would say, don't bother for lucid so (fixing compiz would have been more interesting as it's our default)
<nigelbabu> didrocks, oh okay :)
<pitti> didrocks: not for RC though, unless we need a respin for something else
<didrocks> pitti: ok, keeping it hot for a SRU, so?
<pitti> didrocks: or right after RC
<didrocks> pitti: ok, adding a recall on my TODO. Thanks
<nigelbabu> didrocks, the metacity thing works.  vish was testing with compiz :D
<vish> ;p
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> TBH, not sure if this is that useful as compiz doesn't have that. Maybe good for +1 if not integrated in metacity trunk
<vish> didrocks: it would be worth uploading it for lucid though ;)  hint hint.. LTS
<nigelbabu> its not in metacity trunk :/
<didrocks> nigelbabu: do we have some upstream comment on that?
<didrocks> vish: you have to keep in mind that fixing something can broke something else more importan
<didrocks> t*
<nigelbabu> didrocks, upstream seems to have stopped commenting on this bug
<vish> didrocks: mclasen commented it and mentions it works
<nigelbabu> thought mclasen commented and its shipped in fedora too
<didrocks> vish: nigelbabu: ok, so after RC with the plopper update
<didrocks> nigelbabu: can you ping me on Friday for that ^
<didrocks> I'm building it to ensure having it tested for a few days
<vish> didrocks: and it does work , they have had it for a few releases , and the comment was from mclasen so i guess it is safe :)
<nigelbabu> didrocks, yes.  err.. poppler or metacity
<vish> damn you compiz! ,why wont you work ;p
<mclasen> vish: dangerous assumption :-)
<didrocks> nigelbabu: metacity's one as it's your debdiff (did you attach it in the bug report?)
<nigelbabu> didrocks, attaching.
<didrocks> mclasen: do you think this one can have bad side effects?
<mclasen> I don't know what patch is being discussed
<didrocks> nigelbabu: pointers to fedora's commit?
<nigelbabu> gnome bug 135056
<ubottu> Gnome bug 135056 in general "Alt-Tab doesn't work during drag-and-drop (nor does workspace switch, etc.)" [Normal,New] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=135056
<nigelbabu> mclasen, ^
<nigelbabu> didrocks, hunting
<fta> mvo, hi, what do i need to do to make the ubuntu software center show "chromium" when a user searches for "chrome" or "google chrome"?? (like apt-cache search already does)
<mvo> fta: on a call right now, I can have a look in a bit, could you send me a quikc mail?
<fta> mvo, sure
<nigelbabu> mclasen, do you know at what point fedora integrated the metacity patch?
<nigelbabu> I'm lost in CVS
<mclasen> nigelbabu: not sure, probably F12
<asac> didrocks: so you say the settings package would be neeeded to sort the maximus/focus issue?
<ccheney> bryceh: is there a reason xinerama seems to be enabled at all times now, is it ubuntu specific or was that changed by xorg at some point?
<mclasen> nigelbabu: running the shell here atm, so can't verify if it still works
<nigelbabu> mclasen, ah.  No problem.  I'll hunt through CVS :)
<didrocks> asac: no, from the log, I wasn't convinced it was fixing it. You told me that you wanted to get a try with them IIRC.
<fta> mvo, n-m, just upgraded and it seems to work now (i changed the package description a few days ago in lucid and all ppas)..
<asac> didrocks: i wanted to try, but more for getting this a standalone thing (which i didnt consider high prio)
<asac> didrocks: what the settings package name exactly?
<Nafai> good morning!
<didrocks> asac: ok. For the record, the other bug (not giving focus to the app) isn't a maximus one but a n-l-efl one. I think the two bugs are really linked.
<didrocks> asac: should be ubuntu-netbook-default-settings
<asac> didrocks: what could be the reason for not getting focus? a timestamp thing?
<didrocks> hey Nafai
<Nafai> hey didrocks
<didrocks> asac: didn't investigate but that can be the case, right. Just tested n-l-efl without maximus and seeing that most of the time, the focus wasn't given to the launched app. timestamp can be one of the issue
<asac> interesting. i never saw it without maximus ... let me try again
<nigelbabu> didrocks, I give up.  I can't find a fedora commit (I have no clue how to look)
<didrocks> asac: tried with Friday's iso
<didrocks> nigelbabu: no pb :)
<didrocks> asac: chmod 0 maximus to ensure
<didrocks> (didn't tried that, maybe it was respawn, but not maximized)
<didrocks> asac: confirmed, having it again with no maximus
<asac> didrocks: terminal?
<asac> or what app are you using to check this?
<didrocks> asac: terminal, take screenshot, calculatorâ¦
<asac> ok
<didrocks> gedit as well
<didrocks> (I'm on the 2D session)
<didrocks> maybe it's less noticeable on arm as the CPU is slower
<didrocks> and we have a race somewhereâ¦
<jcastro> kenvandine, I have no agenda or issues, you need me at your call?
<kenvandine> jcastro, nope
<jcastro> I love to be not needed
<kenvandine> :-D
<rickspencer3> ?
<bryceh> ccheney, it's not ubuntu-specific, and not something I've heard before
<ccheney> bryceh: xdpyinfo on all my boxes (2 lucid, 2 karmic) have xinerama in xdpyinfo even though i am not using multiple heads, all of the systems have cards that are capable of doing that though
<ccheney> bryceh: its not a problem except that OOo refuses to full screen on a xinerama setup due to what they claim are bugs
<bryceh> ccheney, I know upstream is in process of getting xinerama working again, on top of xrandr
<ccheney> bryceh: ok
<bryceh> ccheney, what we have in lucid is not capable of this yet, but perhaps some of the underlying work is there and so they're loading the xinerama module now?
<ccheney> bryceh: maybe so, but it also showing up for karmic so not sure about that part
<bryceh> ccheney, anyway, sounds like ooo needs to detect xinerama some different way
<ccheney> bryceh: full screen on OOo worked for slides until compiz also stopped doing its workaround which got me to the point of finding out OOo doesn't enable it due to seeing xinerama
<ccheney> bryceh: how do you detect if xinerama is actually being used instead of just loaded as extension?
<bryceh> dunno
<ccheney> bryceh: ok
<mpt> mvo, will you switch Update Manager back to using aptdaemon for Maverick?
<chrisccoulson> performance really sucks on my laptop at the minute :-/
<james_w> whoah, nautilus just decided to forkbomb me
<james_w> not reproducible now though
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: dpkg fsync()?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - i thought that, but this is sucking even without dpkg. although, when i did an update at the weekend, it did take ages (about 45 minutes), and i couldn't use my laptop at all during that time
<chrisccoulson> the mouse cursor kept stuttering and pausing
<didrocks> urghâ¦
<chrisccoulson> my mouse cursor pauses at even the slightest disk access now (eg, opening gedit or something)
<jpds> chrisccoulson: I have the same issue with postgres and dpkg.
<chrisccoulson> jpds - yeah, dpkg is definately a real bug killer on my laptop at the moment, but i'm not sure it's my only issue
<chrisccoulson> i have to just leave it when i install something now
<chrisccoulson> s/bug/big
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I have the same since a few days ago
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, there's definately something wrong. even pbuilder cleaning up after a build is very painful now :(
<chrisccoulson> i shall try booting an older kernel in a minute
<Sarvatt> 13 minutes 58 seconds to build x11proto-core on a PPA, over 13 of that was just updating the few essential files for the buildd
<pitti> during a make -2 my computer went to load 6.7 and was barely usable
<Sarvatt> (takes about 30 seconds to compile on an atom cpu)
<mvo> mpt yes
<chrisccoulson> i'm glad i'm not the only one with a slow computer now ;)
<chrisccoulson> although that's not good
<chrisccoulson> pitti - here's the output of cat /proc/loadavg for me:
<chrisccoulson> 2.78 4.44 4.33
<pitti> $ cat /proc/loadavg
<pitti> 0.46 0.33 0.27 1/287 3644
<pitti> not sure what the last two are
<pitti> chrisccoulson: but I just went back from dinner, and the computer was idle
<chrisccoulson> pitti - those are the numbers i normally expect to see on mine when working normally
<chrisccoulson> i've never seen 4.33 before
 * jpds found http://www.linuxinsight.com/proc_loadavg.html
<pitti> sudo time dpkg -i /var/cache/apt/archives/openoffice.org-common_1%3a3.2.0-7ubuntu3_all.deb
<pitti> -> 64 s
<pitti> sudo time /home/dchroot/karmic/usr/bin/dpkg -i /var/cache/apt/archives/openoffice.org-common_1%3a3.2.0-7ubuntu3_all.deb
<pitti> -> 21 s
<pitti> seems the fsync stuff takes quite some time, and it bumps the load severely
<chrisccoulson> quite a difference there then
<arand> Regarding Bug #33288, is it possible to still shove the fix there into Lucid, now when it has been pushed into git? And would this be a reasonable changelog for that purpose: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/418707/ ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 33288 in poppler "Evince doesn't handle columns properly" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/33288
<pitti> chrisccoulson: did you only notice it during package updates? or on other occasions?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm noticing mostly in package updates, but my laptop feels generally sluggish any time I try to do any disk access now
<pitti> chrisccoulson: difference> oo.o-common has 5 triggers, so the actual unpack time with karmic dpkg felt like < 10 s
<Sarvatt> pitti: sorry to bug you but do you have any insight on this bug? -dbg and -dbgsym are both broken for the archive xserver's, and only -dbgsym works for mesa - https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pkg-create-dbgsym/+bug/562418
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 562418 in xorg-server "xserver-xorg-core-dbg debug symbols mismatch" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<pitti> Sarvatt: I'll have a look later on (I'm on the phone right now)
 * kenvandine does a little dance... got a patch to desktopcouch that makes it work after suspend and hibernate :-D
<Nafai> yay
<arand> nigelbabu: Ah, just read the backlog, seems like the poppler change was already discussed, would it make much sense for me to make a debdiff proper for Lucid?
<nigelbabu> arand, didrocks is already taking care of it :)
<didrocks> arand: I have a working package, just wait for post-RC to upload it
<arand> didrocks: Ah, okay, great to see the fix in Lucid! As far as I can tell, there haven't been any reports of problems from people using the patch from my ppa (including myself), but then again, I don't know how many that actually is.
<didrocks> arand: a lot of people have been testing that upstream too, so it seems to be good :)
<rickspencer3> bug #465216
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 465216 in desktopcouch "desktopcouch-service crashed with RuntimeError in find_port__linux()" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/465216
<seb128> Sarvatt, pitti: I'm wondering if we should just clean all the -dbg
<seb128> not this cycle though ;-)
<seb128> everybody should be use the dbgsym they are standard
<pitti> good night everyone
<pitti> cu tomorrow
<seb128> 'night pitti
<kenvandine> good night pitti
<chrisccoulson> good night pitti
 * kenvandine lunches
 * Nafai does teh lunch
<didrocks> well, I'll call it day. See you tomorrow
<chrisccoulson> good night didrocks
<didrocks> thanks, you too chrisccoulson
<Nafai> back
<didrocks> waow, we got a very motivated person writing a lot on OneConf blueprint (setting up a wiki page, and so on) from my proposal. I even never speak with him :)
<didrocks> (yeah, I know, I told goodbye but finally was back :))
<seb128> didrocks, good morning
<didrocks> seb128: heh :)
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> if I slept, I should worry about my mind state and tireness for the next 12 hours :)
<kenvandine> :)
<chrisccoulson> good evening everyone
<Nafai> Hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey Nafai, how are you?
<Nafai> Pretty good
<Nafai> You're in the UK, right?
<chrisccoulson> Nafai - i am
<Nafai> still got a lot of ash and stuff in the air where you are?
<chrisccoulson> tbh, i've not really noticed anything different ;)
<chrisccoulson> other than there being no flights anywhere, you can't really tell the difference
<Nafai> huh
<chrisccoulson> and i can't see any ash on my car, but, then again, it's so dirty that you'd never notice it!
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<Nafai> yeah, probably could say the same about mine :)
<kenvandine> mine is covered in pollen
<kenvandine> hate that stuff!
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> mine will probably never get a clean or service again. i'm scrapping it before UDS ;)
<Nafai> I filled up my gas tank for the first time since February this weekend
<Nafai> It's nice to not have to drive every day :)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i've not filled mine up since march. i think i've used about a gallon
<Nafai> kenvandine: allergies?
<kenvandine> Nafai, nah... but it makes such a mess!
 * Nafai nods
<chrisccoulson> i hate pollen because it gives me hay fever ;)
<chrisccoulson> Nafai - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8631144.stm ;)
<chrisccoulson> i'm starting to think i'd have been better off getting a train to UDS
 * Nafai reads
<Nafai> Heck, I'm wondering if I'll even get there
<Nafai> Is there a train that goes over the channel?
<chrisccoulson> Nafai - yeah, but i'd have to get to london first
<chrisccoulson> but that's not a problem really
 * Nafai nods
<czajkowski> chrisccoulson: mailed the travel agent to see what they are advising? I hear the eurostar is rather full at present and the prices have shot up
<jjardon> Do somebody know if there is a PPA with unstable Glib/GTK+ releases?
<raof> Good morning, desktoppers!
<Nafai> Hey raof!
<Nafai> I was going to ask why you became diminutive? :)
<RAOF> Because this particular smuxi backend hasn't been set up correctly.
<RAOF> And the server with my regular smuxi instance is currently in a box, in a shipping container, somewhere between Sydney and Hobart.
<Nafai> I played with smuxi once, looked interesting
<Nafai> Moving to Hobart?
<RAOF> Yup.  Currently sitting in my brother's flat in South Hobart.
<TheMuso> RAOF: Nice to see you have your node connection up and running. Good to hear you won the broadband lottery.
<TheMuso> RAOF: ah right, not your own connection yet.
<RAOF> TheMuso: My node connection should go up next Tuesday.
<TheMuso> RAOF: cool.
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-04-20
<rickspencer3> desktoppers - get your blueprints registered!!
<rickspencer3> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/?searchtext=desktop-maverick
<rickspencer3> should be showing up on that list ^
<TheMuso> Thats on my agenda for this afternoon.
 * rickspencer3 whip cracking noises
<rickspencer3> ;)
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I see you've registered a colour-management spec.  I look forward to working that out - I was going to register one of those, too :)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, please flesh it out :)
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> Good morning pitti
<pitti> hey RAOF< how are you?
<RAOF> Pretty good.
<RAOF> I've got access to an espresso machine at my brother's flat.
<RAOF> This is good :)
<RAOF> Yourself?
<RAOF> I hope that a huge plume of volcanic ash is providing magnificent sunsets/sunrises?
<pitti> so they say, but I didn't actually watch it yesterday
<pitti> too many houses around me
<pitti> but perhaps this evening I should do a bicycle tour uphill, and watch it from there
<pitti> in fact I was on the bike yesterday evening on the way to Taekwondo, but sundown was later on while I was in the gym already
<RAOF> Sounds like a plan to me!
<RAOF> Take a camera :)
<pitti> absolutely
<pitti> today it's cloudy, but forecasts look great from tomorrow on
<TheMuso> I sincerely hope things calm down for UDS.
<RAOF> Maybe there could be a huge plume on Tuesday evening so we can get a nice sunset, and then clear by Wed so that all the flights can be cleared by the time we need to go home? :)
<TheMuso> Yes, but getting there in the first place.
<RAOF> Well, that too.
<RAOF> It looks like it should hopefully be ok to get there.
<TheMuso> yeah
<didrocks> good morning
<RAOF> Morning, didrocks
<didrocks> hey RAOF, how was your day?
 * RAOF has just noticed that he mentally pronounces âdidrocksâ as âdidierocksâ for some reason :)
<didrocks> (it's done on purposer didrocks == Didier Roche) ;)
<RAOF> didrocks: It involved much intel driver madness, a nice lunch, and an espresso machine.  All in all, pretty good.
<didrocks> espresso machine sounds good :)
<seb128> hello there
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> en forme ?
<seb128> bien dormis ?
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you ?
<pitti> bit tired (woke up too early), but fine; thanks! how are you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<seb128> when did you woke up?
<pitti> around 7
<pitti> but I went to bed at 0:30
<seb128> oh, short night then ;-)
<seb128> brb quick session restart after upgrade
<didrocks> seb128: nuit courte Ã©galement, mais bien dormis :) et toi?
<seb128> j'ai bien dormis et 8h ce qui est correct ;-)
<pitti> dormis -> dormant -> sleeping? :-)
<seb128> yes
<seb128> I slept well and 8 hours
<pitti> je parlez francais!
<seb128> so I can't complain ;-)
 * didrocks install French to pitti :)
<seb128> hum, glib 2.25 with gsettings has a tarball
<pitti> seb128: wanting to try new crack? :-)
<didrocks> I guess it's the good time for an upload :-)
<seb128> pitti, wanting new crack in lucid!
 * seb128 ru;-)
<seb128> ups, running and forgetting to type letters ;-)
<pitti> it's just glib, what could possibly go wrong
<seb128> with some luck the update might give us debug symbols too who knows ;-)
<pitti> seb128: (looking at create-dbgsym now)
<pitti> we don't actually treat udebs in any special way
<seb128> ok
<seb128> bah my one liner crash fixers from yesterday have been rejected
<seb128> didn't we use to accept some fixes between rc and stable?
<pitti> yes, we usually did
<baptistemm> bah glib 2.25 is just glib 2.24 but better, right ? :)
<baptistemm> so you have my approval for an upload :)
<RAOF> Oooh!  Oooh!  Can I use that reasoning, too?
 * Ng wonders if the order of Fn-F7 has intentionally changed. The first poke used to extend onto my external monitor, now it mirrors and the second poke extends
<pitti> seb128: argh, I got it, I think
<seb128> pitti, oh?
<pitti> $ echo "libglib2.0-0-refdbg libglib2.0-udeb" | grep -wq 'libglib2.0-0'
<seb128> Ng, they are not meant to have assigned action but to cycle between available configs
<pitti> grep -wq matches "libglib2.0-0" on "libglib2.0-0-refdbg" (which is referenced with -N)
<seb128> oh
<Ng> seb128: what controls the ordering of those configs? It doesn't really matter that it's changed, I'm just curious if this is a deliberate thing or if maybe no ordering is guaranteed and it's going to keep changing on each reboot or something
 * pitti wants grep to understand Perl's "WORD"s
<pitti> anyway, I'll write a test case and figure it out
<seb128> Ng, I'm not sure if xorg returns the info in a deterministic way
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<Ng> fair enough :)
<chrisccoulson> hello everyone
<james_w> morning chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey james_w, how are you?
<james_w> good thanks, you?
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, hello james_w
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti, how are you?
<james_w> hey pitti, how are you?
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson and james_w :)
<james_w> jinx!
<chrisccoulson> james_w - yeah, i'm good too thanks
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks
<james_w> salut didrocks
<pitti> great, thanks! how about you guys?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, good thanks. had quite an early night last night, so i'm quite refreshed today
<pitti> dpkg-deb: Baue Paket Â»libglib2.0-0-dbgsymÂ« in Â»../libglib2.0-0-dbgsym_2.24.0-0ubuntu2_amd64.ddebÂ«.
<pitti> hah
<pitti> seb128: ^
<seb128> pitti, \o/
<pitti> uploaded, will talk to Steve
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<chrisccoulson> hey everyone, firefox 3.6.4 is in the u-m-s PPA now. please test :-)
<chrisccoulson> pitti seb128 didrocks ^^
<seb128> what is u-m-s?
<seb128> can you give the ppa:url there? ;-)
<didrocks> ubuntu-main-sponsor has a ppa?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i can, when my internet catches up ;)
<seb128> didrocks, I think it's rather a ubuntu-mozilla-something
<chrisccoulson> ppa:ubuntu-mozilla-security/pp
<chrisccoulson> a
<chrisccoulson> oops ;)
<didrocks> I was surprised too :)
<seb128> thanks
<chrisccoulson> wow, my internet is going super slow today, it's maxed out by a torrent going at 60kB/s
<pitti> seb128: is glib2.0 in bzr/
<pitti> ?
<seb128> pitti, I don't think so
<pitti> seb128: merci
 * pitti prepares another no-change upload
<seb128> pitti, de rien
<seb128> pitti, danke
 * seb128 refresh sru procedure knowledge and get ready to start on lucid sru uploads
<seb128> since lucid-proposed is supposed to be open let's see how it works today ;-)
<Zdra> does someone knows why I don't get French spell checker in thunderbird on Lucid?
<Zdra> had it on Karmic before the upgrade
<didrocks> seb128: didn't you fix a similar issue recently? ^
<seb128> didrocks, I fixed it for GNOME, I don't know about thunderbird
<seb128> Zdra, is thunderbird-locale-fr installed?
<Zdra> yep
<Zdra> version 1:3.0.4-0ubuntu1
<seb128> ok so I don't know
<seb128> I don't use thunderbird
<seb128> #ubuntu-mozilla might know
<Zdra> I have hunspell-fr installed too
<seb128> does spellchecking works in i.e gedit?
<seb128> bug #
<seb128> 509248
<Zdra> seb128, working in gedit/empathy
<seb128> bug 509248
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 509248 in thunderbird "[PPA] Thunderbird 3 Shows only English dictionary in Spell menu" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/509248
<Zdra> seb128, thanks :)
<seb128> could be the same issue
<seb128> let me know if the workaround described in the bug works for you
<Zdra> seb128, installing manually a thunderbird extention to have the dictionnaire works ;)
<seb128> did you try what was described in the bug?
<seb128> would be useful to get the issue fixed rather than having to install things manually to workaround the bug
<Zdra> seb128, the link works too
<seb128> Zdra, thanks for testing
<Zdra> sudo ln -s /usr/share/myspell/dicts/ /usr/lib/thunderbird-3.0.4/dictionaries
<Zdra> seb128, would be great if you/someone can make an upload to lucid with that fix
<chrisccoulson> can usb-creator only create startup disks for ubuntu?
<seb128> Zdra, I will see what we can do
<chrisccoulson> you want a thunderbird bug fixing?
<chrisccoulson> that one looks pretty trivial actually
<Zdra> trivial to fix, but nasty for users
<pitti> chrisccoulson: usb-creator> question for ev, I think
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i can't seem to make it create a fedora startup disk :(
<chrisccoulson> i wanted to try some things on their latest beta ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: just boot it in kvm?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm trying, but the performance is so bad on my laptop now that it's almost impossible to use
 * hyperair wishes his cpu has kvm support
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh? WDYM with "now"?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - my laptop has sucked really bad since the weekend
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you reboot it since?
<seb128> I got some very slow io issue which went away after reboot
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - several times. my issue seems to fix itself temporarily after a reboot, but then it comes back again
<seb128> chrisccoulson, bug #509248 seems not restricted to ppa build and should be fixed in lucid or lucid updates, can you check with micahg if he's working on it?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 509248 in thunderbird "[PPA] Thunderbird 3 Shows only English dictionary in Spell menu" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/509248
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'll probably just push the fix straight to bzr, as micahg is not around until later anyway
<seb128> chrisccoulson, right, I got it several times too, I reboot my laptop once a day at the moment though and it didn't come back this week yet
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok thanks
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> bryceh, when you start the weekly meeting wikipage could you use the template?
<pitti> oh, need to prep my report, too
<pitti> seb128: you're the team meeting master today, right?
<seb128> pitti, yes, I'm setting the wiki page and about to send the reminder
<seb128> pitti, ok, let's see if I got this contact the team right ;-)
<seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-04-20 online too
<cassidy> seb128, FYI I just release Empathy 2.30.0.2
<seb128> cassidy, I've noticed thanks, too late for lucid but we will get it in a stable update
<cassidy> you're fast :)
<cassidy> I released it like, 5 minutes ago
<didrocks> cassidy: didn't you know? seb128 is behind you ;)
<cassidy> ah!
<seb128> cassidy, I've seen the commit 12 minutes ago on #commits
<cassidy> ahhh :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> I like watching #commits ;-)
 * didrocks joins, can be interesting sometimes to see what should be backported if needed
<seb128> didrocks, do you want to do the empathy update as a sru? no hurry you have a good week before it's going to be reviewed or approved anyway now
<didrocks> seb128: sure, did you previous uploads to -proposed succeeded?
<seb128> didrocks, yes, I did one to try
<seb128> it seems to have worked fine I got the waiting for moderation email
<didrocks> ok, doing it for empathy so before eod :)
<pitti> yep, there are two proposed uploads on https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+queue?queue_state=1
<chrisccoulson> so, the fedora accountsdialog tool is quite nice
<chrisccoulson> and it configures gdm options like auto-login too
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - are people just registering blueprints now? should i create a list of blueprints somewhere first before registering them?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hum, what do you mean by just now?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you didn't get the reminder from rick some days ago about those?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, to reply to the question no need to create a list somewhere, just follow the convention as described on the wikipage in the meeting reminder
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i did. but i wasn't sure whether to register the ones i have or create a list somewhere first
<chrisccoulson> but, that answers my question anyway
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<seb128> yw ;-)
<chrisccoulson> hey Zdra, do you have thunderbird-gnome-support installed?
<chrisccoulson> (just saw your comment on bug 543064)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 543064 in thunderbird "ensure that x-www-browser is used if no http handler is found through gnome integration" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/543064
<Zdra> chrisccoulson, no and I learnt about it 10s earlier from bug 526290
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 526290 in thunderbird "Thunderbird 3 hyperlinks broken" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/526290
<chrisccoulson> Zdra - cool, does it work then?
<Zdra> didn't check yet, let me try
<chrisccoulson> (not having -gnome-support after upgrade is an issue_
<Zdra> chrisccoulson, fixed the issue, yes
<Zdra> \o/
<seb128> cassidy, hey
<seb128> cassidy, how likely is proxy support going to go in next cycle and for which telepathy components? ;-)
<cassidy> it's merged in tp-butterfly but not released yes
<seb128> cassidy, is there anything we can do to help making that happens
<cassidy> we have done lot of work improving libproxy and adding proxy support to gnio
<cassidy> once it's done it should be pretty easy to hook it into Gabble
<staz> seb128: did you update the libproxy version finally or not?
<cassidy> seb128, best to ask to Maiku on #telepathy
<seb128> staz, to 0.3.1 which is what debian has, the newest version broke abi and changed soname
<seb128> cassidy, ok thanks, seems likely to go in next cycle then
<staz> seb128: that should be enought for telepathy-butterfly then
<staz> seb128: do you want me to make a release or will you just merge the patch in the package?
<seb128> staz, good, I was just checking for other protocols since some users are vocal on that bug
<seb128> staz, we are frozen for lucid now, I will consider options for stable updates if we want that after lucid
<cassidy> seb128, like I said...
<seb128> ie in a good week from now
<cassidy> not sure for haze though
<staz> seb128: oh too bad :/
<cassidy> rahh felipe is already pissing me off
<seb128> cassidy, ignore him
<cassidy> that's what I tend to do :)
<seb128> Oh, you know him? ;-)
<cassidy> a bit..
<cassidy> "I don't know who proxies work in libpurple/haze" isn't that clear enough ?
<cassidy> (with s/who/how)
<staz> I was going to make the remark ;)
<staz> (on *how)
<seb128_> vish, hum, what do you mean by banshee is being considered default player for next cycle?
<vish> seb128_: there was a chat here that banshee is being considered, dj_siegel1  and robbie_w or rick,  i guess
<vish> seb128_: something about users testing and discussing in the UDS
<hyperair> there's a blueprint about it too
<seb128_> vish, where, when?
<hyperair> i just don't remember where
<seb128_> we are not going to have this discussion are uds most likely
<hyperair> lucid's UDS highlighted a few blocking issues.
<vish> seb128_: 2days back , let me find the logs
<seb128_> shrug
<seb128_> I guess some lobbying from banshee users again
 * hyperair wonders if there were any more outstanding issues.
<vish> seb128_: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/04/15/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t16:06  .. not much though ;)
<seb128_> we should start by asking if there is any outstanding reason to switch
<seb128_> rhythmbox is as actively worked as banshee nowadays
<seb128_> it got syncing support in git now which was one of the main reason to consider banshee
<tjaalton> does rb support proper syncing with portable players=
<tjaalton> ?
<tjaalton> that's the only usecase of banshee for me
<seb128_> well, "proper", I'm not sure how buggy the new code git is since it's new
<seb128_> +in
<seb128_> but rhythmbox got syncing yes
<seb128_> also rhythmbox is written in a language most people in the desktop team know
<tjaalton> :)
<hyperair> seb128_: by the way, indicator-application is still pending upload.
<seb128_> rather than in one which we might move out of the CD because having it to maintain it for 1 application installed by default is costy
<tjaalton> also, it should use the cover.FOO found on the disk and not fetch some random image from the net
<seb128_> hyperair, can you get ted to merge the change and suggest this for upload?
<tjaalton> but I guess that's filed already
<hyperair> tedg: ^^
<seb128_> tjaalton, rhythmbox? it does that, the provider there were using cut them because it was creating too much load
<kenvandine> seb128_, what do you think about bug 566909
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 566909 in empathy "Offline contacts not showed by default" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/566909
<kenvandine> worth patching and trying to get in post RC?
<tjaalton> seb128_: yes rb, need to check how it works in lucid
<seb128_> kenvandine, is there anything to think?
<seb128_> kenvandine, no
<didrocks> kenvandine: fixed in 2.30.0.2
<seb128_> kenvandine, didrocks did the update for a sru after lucid
<kenvandine> is .2 released yet?
<kenvandine> at!
<kenvandine> great
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128_> tjaalton, device syncing is not in the lucid version though
<tjaalton> seb128_: ok
<tjaalton> my ipod is broken anyway :)
<tedg> hyperair: Which one is missing?  I thought we were on 0ubuntu4, right?
<desrt> hey dudes
<tedg> Ah, I see.  seb128_ can you merge this please?  https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~indicator-applet-developers/indicator-application/lucid/+merge/23591
<desrt> looks like we don't have to cancel UDS :D
<kenvandine> hey desrt
<desrt> *the cloud lifts*
<kenvandine> :)
<didrocks> hey desrt
<desrt> kenvandine, didrocks; hi hi
<ccheney> desrt: no more ash?
<desrt> looks like flights are starting to move
<kenvandine> i read this morning that over half of the .eu flights have resumed
<kenvandine> the UK might not until the end of the week
<ccheney> well i guess as long as there isn't a third eruption
<desrt> in a couple of weeks there will be no problem i'm sure
<kenvandine> ccheney, true :)
<desrt> ccheney: find some wood and knock on it now, plz.
<ccheney> desrt: heh :)
 * kenvandine knocks
<seb128_> hey desrt
 * didrocks still says that he never had a so beautiful weather in Paris since this volcanic cloud is here :)
<desrt> seb128_: hey
<desrt> seb128_: got some good news for you
<desrt> you asked me two questions at last UDS
<desrt> 1) will GVariant be done?    2) will GSettings be done?
<desrt> i tell you today that they're both done and merged :p
<didrocks> (congrats for the gsettings hackfest BTW, nice work ;))
<desrt> ya.  total success.
<kenvandine> desrt, woot!
<desrt> vuntz, mclasen and i were like robots
 * kenvandine high fives desrt
<seb128_> desrt, well done, I need to look how the gconf gsettings backend is working now ;-)
<desrt> seb128_: don't.
<desrt> seb128_: it's not for you.
<seb128_> desrt, I still think having GNOME ported to gsettings in one cycle is very optimistic
<seb128_> desrt, is there any other working backend right now?
<desrt> seb128_: nope :)
<mclasen> seb128_: we can do it if you help...
<desrt> dconf will be along in a week or so
<desrt> seb128_: i think it's well within our capabilities to get the entire live CD ported
<desrt> ie: no gconf in the default install
<desrt> -very- attainable goal for maverick
<seb128_> desrt, you are an optimistic man ;-)
<desrt> seb128_: how long have you known me that you just figure this out now? :)
<seb128_> desrt, did you include proper configuration migration in that estimation ?
<desrt> seb128_: we already have a reasonable story for that
<seb128_> mclasen, let's see
<desrt> mclasen wrote a nice program there
<desrt> it's already merged into gconf git
<seb128> right, I noticed some changes in gconf which is way I wanted to look at the gconf backend ;-)
<desrt> the gconf backend is only a porting tool
<desrt> so that app authors can have their app in a half-using-gconf/half-using-gsettings state and still use it and test it
<desrt> rather than having to hold their breath for the whole port and hoping it works out at the end
<desrt> it's never meant to be deployed
<seb128> ok
<seb128> anyway I want to play with it
<seb128> I doubt landing a new tech and having stable with everything ported to it in one cycle will work though
<seb128> but I'm wanting to be proved wrong
<seb128> you always hit annoying cases on the road or things which don't work well for easy porting and need some slight design changes
<seb128> or bugs, or limitations
<seb128> less than one cycle is very challenging to code through all those roundtrips
<seb128> like it took years to go from libglade to gtkbuilder
<seb128> and there was not so many migration concerns there, just the code changes to port to the new api
<staz> seb128: maybe there wasn't much motiviation from the devs to do it, like gtkbuilder didn't provide enough advantage to make spending time to port it worth
<Nafai> Good morning
<seb128> staz, or lot of people are busy with real life and can't always manage to run current git for all platform and jump on new techs in one cycle
<Nafai> I keep getting left out of the template for the team meeting :(
<seb128> staz, also I'm a bit concerned that one cycle to porting an hundred sofware it's jumping on new techs before having them reasonably tested which complicate any change that would be required
<staz> theses are valid point
<pitti> seb128: would you mind bzr pushing the latest evince update?
<seb128> pitti, done
<chrisccoulson> Zdra - micahg - fixed the thunderbird dictionary issue in bzr now
<chrisccoulson> is thunderbird seeded anywhere?
<pitti> DVD certainly?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks. so, any fixes will have to wait until after RC now?
<pitti> yes
<mandel> aquarius, ping
<aquarius> pong
<mandel> aquarius, got the mono lib for dektopcouch finished, is there anywhere where it can be announced ? your are the media guy ;)
<aquarius> mandel, er...on your blog, and I'll blog about it too? I don't have a masively obvious place for stuff like this. on the DC mailing list as well, of course!
<mandel> aquarius, ok, I'll write some examples and will do... i'd be nice to have a place to do this things..
<aquarius> mandel, I agree :)
<bryceh> rickspencer3, I've got a dentist appt this afternoon so will be attending the morning meeting
<seb128> didrocks, you need to add a debdiff for the update to your sru bug
<pitti> bryceh: uh, good luck
<seb128> didrocks, you might also want to lp close some others bugs
<seb128> bryceh, hey, rickspencer3 is not officially there today but noted ;-)
<seb128> bryceh, btw when you start the wiki page please use the template next time
<didrocks> seb128: the debdiff is pretty big, but that can be added. What do you mean by "you might also want to lp close some others bugs" ?
<seb128> didrocks, the first one listed had an apport looking title but was already listed as closed in 2.30.0.1 not sure why it's in the NEWS again, ignore that comment
<didrocks> seb128: that's why I didn't listed it :)
<seb128> didrocks, I usually filter out documentation, translations and autotools files in a simplified debdiff
<didrocks> haven't*
<seb128> ie debdiff --exclude configure ...
<didrocks> ok, can do
<seb128> and gzip it
<seb128> didrocks, you might also want to set it as wishlist
<seb128> didrocks, oh and next time when it closes an open bug you can use that one for the update rather than opening a new version update bug
<didrocks> seb128: I wasn't sure about the priority, wishlist seems good, will do as well
<didrocks> seb128: oh sweet, I was thinking that wasn't allowed for SRU (it needed its own bug report with the debdiff, and so on for making the paperwork easier). I'll do that next time.
<seb128> didrocks, and for the testcase you can use a "use the new version and make sure it still works correctly" ;-) (SRU usually need a testcase)
 * didrocks updates the bug report now and generates the debdiff
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<seb128> desktop team meeting in 3 minutes
 * kenvandine waves
<seb128> ArneGoetje, ccheney, chrisccoulson, didrocks, kenvandine, Nafai, pitti, Riddell, tseliot: meeting?
<Nafai> o/
<pitti> o/
<chrisccoulson> hey
<ArneGoetje> o/
<chrisccoulson> \o
<chrisccoulson> just to be different ;)
<didrocks> hey o/
<Riddell> hi
<seb128> I hope everybody is doing well
<pitti> lucid! lucid! lucid!
 * tseliot waves
<seb128> rickspencer3 is not available to lead the meeting today so I will do that ;-)
<seb128> so let's get started
<seb128> not outstanding actions
<seb128> no
<seb128> kenvandine, partner update?
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> OLS had a few last minute bug fixes, which have been uploaded and slangesek said he would accept after the RC is done
<kenvandine> pyinotify, ubuntuone-client and desktopcouch
<pitti> will they fix getting mp3s from teh music store by any chance? :-)
 * ccheney here
<kenvandine> nothing else in the pipe
<kenvandine> pitti, hehe... known bug?
 * pitti has "Transferring to your Ubuntu One storage" for half a day now
<kenvandine> the u1-client update includes a fix for a bug that would delete files if there was an interupted download
<kenvandine> pitti, that would be server side... not sure if there is a current known problem
<kenvandine> i'll ask
<kenvandine> :)
<ogra> pitti, are you sure its not already in your music folder ? i had that too but seems that only the store UI wasnt properly updating
<pitti> kenvandine: (anyway, let's discuss that off-meeting)
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, seems good, thanks
<pitti> ogra: yes
<seb128> is gwibber behaving now btw?
<kenvandine> yes... with this desktopcouch update
<seb128> I stopped getting gwibber-service crashes at every login
<kenvandine> desktopcouch was frequently dieing on suspend
<seb128> but I'm not sure if that's just because pitti turned apport off :p
<seb128> ok good
<kenvandine> and desktopcouch wouldn't try to start it again
<kenvandine> this fix makes it start as needed :)
<seb128> nice
<seb128> thanks kenvandine
<seb128> let's get moving
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i had a different issue. it took 2 days for my purchase to be sync'd with U1 ;)
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> Riddell, kubuntu update?
<Riddell> we're all good as far as I can tell
<Riddell> my notes are on my other machine which is currently doing install testing
<Riddell> but we're down to three milestoned bugs
<Riddell> http://tinyurl.com/yjybcx9
<seb128> ok, seems good
<Riddell> of which I'm only worried about 1
<pitti> Riddell: how's kubiquity now? there were still quite a few issues last week?
<seb128> urg, another oem setup issue?
<seb128> and a french hating one!
<pitti> looks good
<Riddell> pitti: still that 1 issue but we have a good track record of sorting out ubiquity issues so I'm confident we'll crack it :)
<pitti> good luck!
<seb128> Riddell, good work!
<seb128> Riddell, thanks ;-)
<seb128> next, release status
<seb128> http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/canonical-desktop-team-ubuntu-10.04.html
<seb128> seems we are mostly good there
<pitti> that generally looks fine
<pitti> today we got two more WIs for fonts, but they are being sorted out
<seb128> ArneGoetje, what is the status on your 2 todo items there?
<pitti> they got FFE approval, and the actual fonts are all settled now I think
<seb128> pitti, is that likely to make any difference on CD space?
<pitti> just needs some langauge-support-* updates
<pitti> seb128: yes, it saved .5 MB in total, I think
<seb128> good ;-)
<seb128> as long as it's going in the good direction
<ArneGoetje> language-support-fonts-ja has just been uploaded with the changes... will upload the fontconfig changes in language-selector later tonight.
<seb128> I would chase anybody trying to get french langpacks out of the CD now :p
<pitti> also, release-wise I'm pretty happy about the bug situation; we got some 12 RC bugs fixed last week, and the remaining 5 are SRUable
<seb128> ArneGoetje, ok, thanks
<pitti> ArneGoetje: sweet
<seb128> pitti, note that I marked my work item for lpi to DONE since I uploaded that yesterday
<pitti> seb128: *nod*
<pitti> FYI, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus got updated yesterday
<pedro_> seb128, pitti that means we can start to update the documentation regarding the -> report a problem item ?
<seb128> right, none of the bugs remaining on this list seem to be too much of an issue for lucid
<seb128> pedro_, yes, it will be in lucid after rc
<pedro_> we mean the qa team
<pedro_> alright i'll work on that, thanks
<pitti> pedro_: I got sign-off from mdke that it doesn't touch the documentation
<seb128> pitti, bugs status look good indeed
<seb128> pitti, it does touch wiki bug triaging documentation
<seb128> pitti, not ubuntu documentation
<pitti> ah
<pitti> pedro_: right, that could need an update then
<pedro_> pitti, sorry i mean the wiki documentation
<pedro_> yeah
<seb128> pitti, anything else to add on the lucid status?
<seb128> seems not, let's get moving
<seb128> great work everything, lucid will be a great Ubuntu milestone!
<seb128> let's keep focussed on testing images until next week and watch for any raising issues but we are in good shapre
<seb128> shape
 * tseliot nods
<seb128> next topic, blueprints
<seb128> I see lot of those registered on https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/?searchtext=desktop-maverick, great
<seb128> let's go quickly through the team member and registered blueprints
<seb128> using the order on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-04-20
<seb128> tseliot, ok, I skip you since you are moving back to oem next cycle
<tseliot> thanks
<seb128> tseliot, it was great to have you in the team this cycle, good work ;-)
<tseliot> it was a pleasure to work with all of you :-)
<seb128> thanks tseliot ;-)
<seb128> ArneGoetje,
<seb128> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-language-selector
<bryceh> tseliot, thanks for all the X help :-)
<ArneGoetje> yes
<seb128> you registered this one
<seb128> seems a good topic for UDS and maverick
<tseliot> :-)
<pitti> tseliot: you did awesome work, thanks again! you'll be missed!
<seb128> it will probably require design recommendation I guess
<seb128> did you talk to anybody about that yet?
<ArneGoetje> seb128: yep
<ArneGoetje> seb128: not yet
<Riddell> yes thanks tseliot
<seb128> ok, let's see if we can get somebody from the design team to help there
<seb128> not now though ;-)
<ArneGoetje> seb128: :)
<seb128> ArneGoetje, do you have any other spec or uds topic?
<ArneGoetje> seb128: not as a feature, no.
<seb128> and as non-feature? ie things that need discussion at uds maybe?
<ArneGoetje> I'm not sure if it needs discussion at UDS, more like debugging... fontconfig needs some love
<ArneGoetje> I think that does not qualify for uds, though
<seb128> right
<Riddell> jonathan thomas might be doing work on language selector's kde frontend if his gsoc project gets approved, might be good to have ArneGoetje and him review that at UDS
<seb128> let's discuss that out of the meeting later
<ArneGoetje> Riddell: +1
<seb128> Riddell, who would mentor the SoC? but yeah, good idea
<ArneGoetje> seb128: ok
<seb128> ArneGoetje, thanks
<seb128> ccheney, hey
<ccheney> seb128: yea
<seb128> ccheney, I see you registered 3 openoffice specs
<ccheney> yes
<ccheney> a general planning one, an packaging optimization one, and one about getting java pulled in by OOo on use
<Riddell> seb128: me but nice to have ArneGoetje for consulting
<seb128> do you think you need sessions for each at uds?
<seb128> Riddell, ok
<ccheney> the general planning one would be good for UDS but i don't know if the other two need to be scheduled
<seb128> ok, that's what I was thinking
<seb128> I will check with rickspencer3
<seb128> ccheney, any other UDS topic you want discussed or anything to add?
<ccheney> i probably need some help with determining how to do the java part but i think just talking with some of you guys about something like packagekit (i guess) should be enough for that
<ccheney> nope that is all
<seb128> ccheney, ok, thanks
<rickspencer3> ccheney, they need blueprints even if sessions don't need to be scheduled
<ccheney> rickspencer3: yea they are already on the blueprint page
<seb128> rickspencer3, hey ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hello
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<seb128> you registered https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-search-and-indexing
<seb128> and https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-user-accounts-dialog
<chrisccoulson> i did :)
<seb128> good desktopish topics ;-)
<chrisccoulson> hopefully :)
<seb128> not sure the second one really require a session or rather offline review, let's talk about that later
<seb128> any other spec or topic you want to bring for uds?
<seb128> I guess you should have some about web browsers
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i wasn't sure about that. it seems to be a case of just speccing out the work items and getting on with it
<chrisccoulson> as long as we all agree to the change ;)
<glatzor> ccheney, I hope to get sessioninstaller ready for maverick: https://edge.launchpad.net/sessioninstaller
<seb128> hey glatzor
<chrisccoulson> that was the other thing i was going to ask about actually
<seb128> glatzor, should that have an uds discussion or blueprint?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, sure, ask ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i wasn't sure whether to register a blueprint for that
<glatzor> ccheney, I will provide the packagekit session api and use aptdaemon as a backend. the final bits required in aptdaemon (dependency handling) will land soon in the main branch
<seb128> chrisccoulson, if you want something discussed register a blueprint
<ccheney> glatzor: ok
<glatzor> sessioninstaller will provide ...
<seb128> chrisccoulson, we can mark it informational after uds if required
<ccheney> glatzor: not sure if i will be actually using packagekit or something else like it since OOo doesn't directly use gtk except as interface wrapper, but will definitely look into that, thanks :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I guess you would need at least one about firefox schedule for next cycle
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, possibly. although it's mostly just tracking upstream releases really
<seb128> chrisccoulson, and maybe one to discuss the default web-browser since chromium seems to get increasing userbase
<chrisccoulson> i need to talk about firefox towards the end of the meeting anyway ;)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i think that's covered by the default app selection one
<seb128> ok
<seb128> sounds good then
<seb128> thanks chrisccoulson
<seb128> didrocks, salut
<didrocks> bonsoir seb128 :)
<seb128> didrocks, so oneconf, quickly, une app selection
<seb128> seems quite good topics for UDS and for maverick work
<didrocks> yeah, should be interesting sessions :)
<seb128> is there anything else you want to add there?
<didrocks> I think it should be enough on my side, I'll fill them with ideas little by little
<seb128> ok, good work, thanks didrocks
<Nafai> And I'll probably help some on quickly and une :)
<didrocks> thanks seb128 :)
<seb128> Nafai, hey
<seb128> since you are there let's look at yours too
<Nafai> Hi :)
<seb128> btw I noticed you were not in the meeting template
<seb128> let's get that fixed for next week
<rickspencer3> I assigned some to Nafai
<Nafai> yeah, thanks
<kenvandine> hey rickspencer3!
<seb128> rickspencer3, thanks
<seb128> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-desktop-for-app-developers
<seb128> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-quickly-widgets
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'm only half in the meeting template too ;)
<seb128> are the ones I see on the list
<seb128> chrisccoulson, Nafai: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/MeetingTemplate btw
<seb128> feel free to fix errors
<Nafai> I'm excited for both of them, particularly the first one
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i should probably add me to it
<seb128> Nafai, seems to be 2 interesting topics indeed
<Nafai> For the first one, I imagine we might want some input from the design team, just because we are working on developer stuff doesn't mean the UI has to be good :)
<seb128> right
<didrocks> seb128: oh btw, can we already ping formally the design team for input? I ping mpt later today for oneconf but he wanted someone assigned by ivanka?
<Nafai> Do we typically involve them at UDS for these things?  Or is that a post-UDS thing?
<seb128> let's see what specs we need design input on and talk to them before uds
<Nafai> cool
<seb128> didrocks, I think we should rather build a list of what we need and talk to rickspencer3 about how to handle that
<didrocks> great :)
<kenvandine> good to at least give them a heads up for the things we might be needing their time for
<seb128> if you need design input please note that for next meeting
<seb128> or in the spec summary
<seb128> so we can build a list of those and coordinate with the design team
<seb128> Nafai, anything else you wanted to add for uds or next cycle topics?
<Nafai> not that I can think of
<seb128> Nafai, ok, thanks
<seb128> Riddell, hey
<Riddell> hi'
<Riddell> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/?searchtext=kubuntu-maverick is our list
<seb128> Riddell, I don't see any spec of ours on https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/?searchtext=desktop-maverick ?
<seb128> oh, they start with kubuntu-, right ;-)
<Riddell> I should also register one on kubuntu council
<seb128> ok
<Riddell> and gsoc projects depending on language selector
<seb128> seems you have a good list of topics and things on track as usual ;-)
<Riddell> glatzor: dantii is coming, I don't know if you want to battle out apt vs aptcc backend for packagekit
<seb128> glatzor, mvo: do we need a session about packages installation from the desktop at uds?
<seb128> Riddell, ok, seems your list is on shape, anything to add?
<seb128> Riddell, thanks ;-)
<seb128> let's keep moving
<seb128> kenvandine, hello
<kenvandine> hey!
<seb128> you registered those
<seb128> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-empathy-indicator
<seb128> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-gwibber-test-suite
<seb128> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-social-api
<seb128> cleaning patches we have and adding testsuites, I like that ;-)
<kenvandine> empathy-indicator wouldn't need a discussion, it is just dropping the empathy patch and creating the service to replace it
<seb128> do you think the first 2 need discussion?
<kenvandine> assuming telepathy is ready for it
<kenvandine> no
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> social-api will though
<seb128> right, I assumed so
<kenvandine> want to extend the usefulness of what we did this cycle
<seb128> can you try to look at what we need from telepathy before UDS?
<kenvandine> yes
<seb128> I know some of the telepathy guys will be there
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> so it's a good opportunity to discuss that directly with them
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> that is all i have
<seb128> ok, looks good
<seb128> thanks kenvandine
<seb128> pitti, no spec for you since you will be on rotation
<pitti> right, I'm lazy this time :)
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> we still like you though
 * pitti hugs the team
 * chrisccoulson hugs puttu
 * chrisccoulson hugs pitti, even
<pitti> chrisccoulson: who's that dude?
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> don't hesitate to stay around while you are rotation!
<chrisccoulson> pitti OOI, where are you rotating too?
<didrocks> pitti is telling us that not being in the desktop team is being lazy? :)
<seb128> ok, so I think we covered everybody but rickspencer3 who is not officially there and me
<seb128> I've https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-overriding-defaults-on-upgrade listed with my name there
<rickspencer3> seb128, could folks please subscribe ivanka to blueprints that need design input?
<seb128> rickspencer3, ok
<rickspencer3> (sorry to interrupt)
<seb128> rickspencer3, you don't, don't worry ;-)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: OEM
<seb128> rickspencer3, want to have a look at your blueprints or were you just passing by quickly?
<seb128> so the overriding defaults is about dealing with user configuration tweaking on update cleanely
<seb128> I also need to register one about gnome3
<kenvandine> wouldn't that be related to oneconf?
<seb128> to discuss what we will want to do exactly for maverik
<rickspencer3> seb128, just checking in when I can
<chrisccoulson> the configuration one is interesting
<Nafai> rickspencer3: Should we indicate in the summary what specifically we need design input for?
 * rickspencer3 turns back to presentation
<rickspencer3> Nafai no, just subscribe for now
<seb128> gnome3 has several aspects, one is porting code to the new apis, ie helping on gconf -> dconf for example
<seb128> one is to know what we want to ship next cycle, what we want to experiment with and what we want to delay
<seb128> I need to check with mvo too if we need one about package installation in the desktop
<didrocks> kenvandine: oneconf is not on update but using multiple machines or reinstalling one. seb128's proposal is more on "updating to find if the user still has the default" (for instance, if you change your theme and choose back the default, you currently aren't considered as having the default setting and won't be migrated)
<chrisccoulson> we definately need something for that, so we can start taking advantage of all the packagekit integration in gnome
<chrisccoulson> i feel like we're missing out a little bit
<seb128> yes
<seb128> I'm just not sure if glatzor and mvo have it all sorted
<seb128> or if that needs discussion
<seb128> what didrocks said about the oneconf, the desktop-maverick-overriding-defaults-on-upgrade one is rather how to deal with things like adding an indicator to the gnome-panel config on upgrade
<seb128> or changing the theme if the user is using the standard one
<seb128> ok
<seb128> so that was about it for me
<Nafai> can someone help me out of meeting about how much detail should be in the spec summaries, etc before UDS?
<seb128> I think I will be busy enough with doing techlead work and looking to GNOME3 desktop changes with robert_ancell
<seb128> Nafai, did you read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/10.10/BlueprintingSchedule about that?
<pitti> Nafai: it should be enough to understand what the session is about and what the goal is
<didrocks> (I still can give an hand there so that you can still focus on your techlead role, as we talked together)
<seb128> Nafai, we can chat after meeting sure
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<Nafai> seb128: I'll re-read that and then ask questions, thanks
<seb128> ok, I think we covered the specs for the team
<seb128> anybody has anything to add about specs or uds topics?
<seb128> before I hand the mic to chrisccoulson about firefox testing
<rickspencer3> seb128, just real quick ...'
<rickspencer3> if you have to choose between making Lucid solid and doing UDS prep
<rickspencer3> choose Lucid
<rickspencer3> ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> rickspencer3, thanks
<seb128> ok, seems there is nothing to add
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you wanted to raise firefox quickly?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, 2 things
<chrisccoulson> so, firefox 3.6.4 is now in the ubuntu-mozilla-security team PPA, and this will become the first security update in lucid
<chrisccoulson> i would appreciate everybody helping out with testing that, and also blogging about it where possible so we can get lots of people involved
<chrisccoulson> it's not a minor update like most point-releases normally are ;)
<seb128> can you give us the ppa:... url again?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it's ppa:ubuntu-mozilla-security/ppa
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> everybody, add that to your sources and install the update
<chrisccoulson> the second issue might be better outside of the meeting actually
<seb128> so we get good testing before it hits lucid-security
<seb128> ok
<seb128> so let's wrap up and discuss the other one
<seb128> anybody having anything to add?
<chrisccoulson> ccheney, you were working on all the backporting efforts to prepare supported releases for the major firefox updates weren't you?
<chrisccoulson> where are we with that now?
<seb128> seems not
<seb128> thanks everybody
<pitti> thanks everyone
<kenvandine> thanks, maverick is gonna be fun :)
<ccheney> chrisccoulson: for epiphany, getting back to it this week as it appears i finally got all the OOo issues resolved for lucid
<didrocks> thanks everyone
<chrisccoulson> ccheney, 3.0 is now officially EOL by mozilla
<ccheney> chrisccoulson: ok
<seb128> kenvandine, yeah, but let's make sure lucid rocks as much it can before that and stay focussed on it for an another week (or a bit extra time for sru polish too)
<chrisccoulson> so, updating hardy to 3.6 is becoming urgent
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> seb128, yeah i think we will be giving lucid lots of attention in the next few weeks
<ccheney> chrisccoulson: yea, will jump over to the ubuntu mozilla channel and see if i can get it finished up
<seb128> I plan to stay on lucid until after uds
<Nafai> chrisccoulson: security update?
<seb128> I need a stable laptop for UDS anyway
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I have 3.6.4+build1+nobinonly-0ubuntu0.10.04.2, is that the latest one?
<seb128> and always good for the first sru rounds
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, that's the latest
<pitti> ah, seems I added that PPA a long time ago, back when asac asked us to
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I didn't notice anything, I guess that's a good sign :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah ;)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - try watching a video in youtube and then killing the plugin-container process
<chrisccoulson> you should get a nice message about flash crashing ;)
<ccheney> yipee!
<chrisccoulson> that's the big change in the latest version (running plugins out-of-process)
<chrisccoulson> but only flash is enabled currently
<seb128> chrisccoulson, pitti: rickspencer3: is the firefox security update in karmic something we should be concerned about now? ie should it be ready and lagging behing on schedule and require actions or something?
<Nafai> chrisccoulson: awesome, that's one of my motivations for using Chromium
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, seems swfdec doesn't work any more
<pitti> chrisccoulson: could be a youtube problem or a ffox problem, not sure
<seb128> pitti, downgrade to lucid firefox and check if it works?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - karmic is not as urgent as hardy, as 3.5 is still supported
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I meant hardy there, autofinger bug ;-)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, i will try and reproduce
<chrisccoulson> heh ;)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's pretty urgent now, as 3.0.x will get no more releases from mozilla
<seb128> hum
<seb128> what is missing for us to be able to do the update in hardy?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, it starts to play for 3 s, then goes away and says "Go upgrade!"
 * pitti downgrades
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - that's what i'm not sure about yet, as i've not been tracking the work that ccheney has been doing
<ccheney> seb128: epiphany for one so we can drop the old xulrunner
<glatzor> ccheney, The PackageKit session API is also provided by KPackageKit on KDE desktops. So this would be quite desktop agnostic.
<ccheney> chrisccoulson: need to coordinate with asac about what else is left other than epiphany
<ccheney> glatzor: ok
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ok, same problem with 3.6.3, so nevermind
<chrisccoulson> ccheney, yeah, no worries. i think micahg has been working on porting stuff as well, so we probably all need to get together at some point
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, thats good ;)
<ccheney> chrisccoulson: epiphany was almost there when i last worked on it, was having some trouble with the way i backported a class with callbacks, after that is fixed it should work (hopefully) epiphany did run but crashed when trying to enter a different url from debian.org
<glatzor> Riddell, Sorry, but I won't be at UDS this time because of my main work. But there isn't any need to battle.
 * Nafai lunches and errands
<chrisccoulson> ccheney, ok, so it seems there is still a bit of work to do. i should be able to free up some time to help out with this now
<ccheney> chrisccoulson: ok, i can get you a copy of the most recent source to have you see if it is obvious how to fix it, i have all the rest of my bits in ppa
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<ccheney> chrisccoulson: someone more familiar with gtk object code could probably fix it fairly quickly, i'm still learning how it works :)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<ccheney> chrisccoulson: will take the rest of the discussion over to mozilla channel
 * kenvandine -> lunch
<seb128> dinner there, bbl
<glatzor> seb128, would be definitely a good idea to have a spec about desktop package installation.
<seb128> glatzor, ok thanks
 * ccheney -> lunch
<didrocks> well, enjoy the evening with my family :) see you tomorrow
 * pitti -> dinner
<jcastro> kenvandine, how stable is the m-i integration in xchat for you?
<jcastro> mine is not very good. :-/
<rickspencer3> jcastro, I have a logged a bug based on a crasher I experienced
 * rickspencer3 looks
<rickspencer3> oops
 * rickspencer3 has to pay attention here
<crimsun> mvo: I'm not sure what you'd like me to do in bug 567148; it seems like an archive admin decision.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 567148 in esound "moving libesd-alsa0 to universe may cause upgrade calculation failure" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/567148
<baptistemm_> james_w, hi
<james_w> hi baptistemm
<kenvandine> jcastro, well.. it just crashed for me
<jcastro> kenvandine, when you select on the person who messaged you?
<kenvandine> just now yes
<baptistemm_> james_w, is there a way with bzr bd to use a svn revision instead a released tarball
<kenvandine> but i have only had it crash like twice
<kenvandine> but it happened just now when you highlighted me :)
<james_w> baptistemm_: yes, but currently you have to create the tarball yourself
<james_w> baptistemm_: then you can just pass that to merge-upstream
<baptistemm_> okay, let use that :)
<james_w> baptistemm_: we need a hook point for running autofoo or whatever to do it more elegantly than that
<mvo> crimsun: i just recorded it for now, i will sub ubuntu-archive
<crimsun> mvo: ok, thanks for the clarification.
<mvo> thank you
<seb128> mvo, still there?
<seb128> rodrigo__, hey
<mvo> seb128: sort of
<mvo> yes
<seb128> mvo, did you read my questions from the meeting before?
<mvo> seb128: no
<seb128> mvo, do we need a session about making easy to install packages in the desktop at uds?
<mvo> seb128: session-installer?
<seb128> mvo, dunno what session installer is
<mvo> seb128: a packagekit like api?
<mvo> seb128: yeah, we should talk aobut it
<seb128> mvo, we current have things g_spawning synaptic or gnome-app-install
<mvo> yeah
<seb128> mvo, it seems suboptimal compared to what upstream GNOME is doing
<mvo> we need a dbus api
<seb128> right
<mvo> compatible to packagekit
<seb128> right
<mvo> :)
<seb128> I was not sure if that was solved issue waiting on glatzor's work to land
<seb128> or if that still needs a session
<seb128> so you say we can use an uds session?
<seb128> do you have a blueprint already about this on launchpad?
<glatzor> seb128, lp:sessioninstaller
<mvo> no, but glatzor has some code
<mvo> (code > blueprint)
 * mvo hugs g'hawk-eye'latzor
<seb128> mvo, well blueprint = required for uds scheduling
<glatzor> seb128, mvo you can already run sessioninstaller and use the test.py for a first impression
<seb128> glatzor, nice, thank you
<glatzor> seb128, you have to call python core.py in the sessioninstaller to run the daemon from the source code directory
<glatzor> seb128, mvo, currently it makes use of synaptic for the installation
<glatzor> seb128, mvo! see you guys! nice evening
<mvo> you too glatzor
<seb128> glatzor, thanks, you too
 * mvo waves
 * glatzor makes winke winke
 * Nafai stretches
<Technoviking> btw, Wil Wheaton (Star Trek fame) says kudos for Simple Scan, It worked where OSX failed:)
<asac> seb128: heya ... any gnome batches planned till final? ;)
<seb128> asac, hey
<seb128> asac, no
<seb128> asac, .1 is too late for lucid and will be sru-ed
<asac> good :)
<seb128> asac, I think out of maybe some small fixes on applications we are set for lucid
<seb128> ie no platform or gtk upload before lucid
<asac> seb128: yeah. if you see any armel ftbfs in main when uploading after or for RC, ping us directly so we dont loose half a day ;)
<seb128> ok
<asac> if possible. thanks!!!
<seb128> is armel on shape right now?
<seb128> or do you need help looking to some build issues?
<asac> main is clean
<seb128> ok, good
<asac> universe could be better, but MOTU is still working on requeueing builds
<seb128> I was asking for desktop, I don't intend to work on universe build issues ;-)
<asac> based on some graphs they made, so it will go down a bittoo still
<asac> seb128: libgphoto2 upload will happen
<seb128> iz pitti bog ;-)
<asac> thats the only ftbfs ... locks up somewhere in doxygen generating images
<asac> we will disable graphviz on armel and seems to be fine (just verifying)
<seb128> ok, good
<rodrigo__> seb128, ping
<chrisccoulson> asac - i have an armel gjs build failure ;)
<seb128> rodrigo_, hey
<rodrigo_> seb128, so, you were looking for me earlier on?
<seb128> rodrigo_, just reading you gsettings g-c-c email
<rodrigo_> seb128, ah, agreed on it?
<seb128> rodrigo_, desrt recommended against using the gconf gsettings backend
<rodrigo_> seb128, oh yes, it is for testing now, as I understood from mclasen's mail
<seb128> he said that was something to use by hackers while porting not something to use
<rodrigo_> yeah, right
<seb128> I think we should also sort the other refactoring going on
<rodrigo_> sorry, that's what I meant, sorry I wasn't clear enough
<seb128> rather that start working on codebases that will change
<rodrigo_> the extensible shell you mean?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> + cleaning in capplets we might want to drop or simplify
<rodrigo_> yes, thomas just answered that
<seb128> ok, I did read replies on the list
<rodrigo_> yeah, sounds good
<mclasen> rodrigo_: the gconf  backend is to get you off the ground wrt to porting, but not something that we want to use in the next stable release
<seb128> "didn't"
<rodrigo_> mclasen, yes, that's what I understood, sorry if my mail wasn't clear :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok, so sorry about the gconf gsettings confusion, my comment was mainly a suggestion to start looking to land other refactoring first maybe to avoid working on a codebase that will change and do the work again later
<rodrigo_> seb128, yeah, answering now to Thomas's mail with your suggestions
<seb128> ok, good, thanks
<TheMuso> Good morning.
<rickspencer3> Hi TheMuso
<Nafai> Good morning TheMuso
<RAOF> Good morning all.
<TheMuso> Morning RAOF.
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-04-21
<bryceh> rickspencer3, you abouts?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, we've got a bit of a conundrum with one of our bugs
<rickspencer3> bryceh, yeah
<rickspencer3> 'sup?
<rickspencer3> I should have a good connection between here and home
<bryceh> rickspencer3, the background is that glx 1.4 was backported by debian from xserver 1.8, however we've found it is buggy
<RAOF> And seriously - bug #565981 - buggy.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 565981 in xorg-server "[KMS] gem objects not deallocated" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/565981
 * rickspencer3 looks
<bryceh> rickspencer3, you might remember the issue of Clutter not working, that needed an xserver fix a few weeks ago
<bryceh> rickspencer3, it turns out the fix we incorporated causes the memory leak issue that RAOF just mentioned
<rickspencer3> yup
<bryceh> Sarvatt's been banging his head all over this issue.  We're not finding a suitable solution
<rickspencer3> fudge
<rickspencer3> so we revert the change, and UNE breaks
<rickspencer3> we don't revert the change, everything breaks?
<bryceh> what we're considering is dropping both that fix, and the Debian glx backport stuff
<rickspencer3> what is the impact of the leak?
<bryceh> well, that's why I wanted to raise this with you before we did anything
<bryceh> the leak seems to be encountered pretty widespreadedly
<rickspencer3> so the clutter bug was caused by backported code?
<bryceh> yes
<rickspencer3> so you are consider going all the way back to what, glx 1.3?
<rickspencer3> fuuuuuuuudge
<RAOF> No; 1.2.
<rickspencer3> 1.2
<rickspencer3> ack
<RAOF> 1.3 would be ok, because that's what clutter seems to use.
<rickspencer3> whatever
<rickspencer3> the point is, roll way back
<rickspencer3> ?
<RAOF> To the glx version (but not the code) we had in Karmic, yes.
<rickspencer3> bryceh, why did we go to glx 1.4 to begin with?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, debian had incorporated it into their packaging
<bryceh> rickspencer3, so we essentially just inherited it
<rickspencer3> ok
<bryceh> rickspencer3, however jcristau just mentioned that they're going to drop it in Debian due to these problems
<rickspencer3> so did any new and important functionality or bug fixes come with it?
<rickspencer3> ah
<bryceh> I'm not sure.  What I'm wondering mainly is if it'd negatively impact clutter
<rickspencer3> okay, so the 1.2 version has been around a while, and is generally considered good?
<RAOF> Yes.
<bryceh> i.e. has clutter come to depend on having glx 1.3 / 1.4, and if so will we cause more problems if we remove it than we're solving?
<rickspencer3> ah
<rickspencer3> I don't know
<rickspencer3> I would only be able to ask njpatel that question
<RAOF> Apparently clutter only started using glx 1.3/1.4 in clutter 1.2, which we pulled in relatively recently.
<bryceh> so, to the best of our knowledge, backing out these patches seems to be the right thing to do, but we don't want to decide this unilaterally and fsck up the clutter folks
<rickspencer3> will this make my saurbraughten run slower?
<rickspencer3> yeah, so njpatel and didrocks need to be consulted
<rickspencer3> can you guys set up something that can be installed and tested in the meantime?
<RAOF> Sarvatt's already got a package in the x-testing PPA dropping the glx 1.4 backport.
<rickspencer3> bryceh, I agree with your concern, that there is some little thing in clutter that depends on 1.3 functionality
<rickspencer3> RAOF, can you please run UNE on it
<rickspencer3> and see how the launcher works?
<rickspencer3> also try some of the clutter based games?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, do you know which gnome-games rock clutter the mostest?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, quadrapassel
<robert_ancell> lots of bug reports on that one...
<rickspencer3> RAOF, can you run that as well?
<RAOF> Yup.
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, well, we're looking for apps that we can run to validate that clutter still works
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, it does like to break :)
<Sarvatt> clutter apps shouldn't be affected, it picks which mode to use.. I just looked at netbook-launcher and it's using glx 1.2 functions for the only things not abstracted behind clutter so it's fine, its the apps that call glx 1.3 functions directly that would be a problem (but it's an application bug if it does anyway as the warning will say)
<RAOF> Sarvatt: But we haven't tested clutter's glx 1.2 pathways as much recently.  So while clutter apps *shouldn't* be affectedâ¦ :)
<RAOF> UNE & quadrapassel seem to work fine with nvidia-current; I'll test moovida too.
 * RAOF kills X to check on intel, too.
<Sarvatt> RAOF: nvidia doesn't use the server's GLX anyway...
<rickspencer3_> Sarvatt, where would you predict to see any regressions?
<jjardon> Dou you know any PPA with unstable Glib/GTK+ packages?
<rickspencer3_> RAOF, Sarvatt, bryce says that code that calls glx uses /usr/lib/libclutter-glx-0.8.so
<rickspencer3_> is it possible to generate a list of code that calls this?
<rickspencer3_> maybe packages that have a dependency?
<bryceh> on lucid - /usr/lib/libclutter-glx-1.0.so.0
<bryceh> and /usr/lib/libglitz-glx.so.1
<rickspencer3_> shall I ask slangasek in #ubuntu-devel?
<rickspencer3_> (for some reason it seems like he would know)
<RAOF> http://pastebin.ca/1870751 is the rdepends of libclutter-1.0-0, which contains libclutter-glx
<bryceh> he'd probably know
<bryceh> $ nm /usr/lib/libclutter-glx-1.0.so.0.200.4
<bryceh> nm: /usr/lib/libclutter-glx-1.0.so.0.200.4: no symbols
<bryceh> hmm, I know there's a way to view the symbols of a library, but old age has made me forget
<RAOF> From memory it's a magic objdump invocation.
<rickspencer3_> RAOF that looks like a tractable list
<bryceh> ahaa  /usr/lib/xorg/modules/extensions/libglx.so
<rickspencer3_> RAOF, can you please start to tick these off and make sure they don't break if we roll back?
<RAOF> So; UNE, moovida, quadrapassel all work fine on nvidia-current & -intel.
<rickspencer3_> good start
<rickspencer3_> so long as qudrapassel works, SHIP!
<bryceh> hehe
<RAOF> Incidentally, moovida is pretty cool :)
<rickspencer3_> yes it is
<rickspencer3_> RAOF, don't bother with moblin stuff
<RAOF> Ok.
<rickspencer3_> RAOF, is there way to see what out of this list has not been updated since we were on 1.2?
<RAOF> Checking the changelogs would be possible.
<RAOF> That's not necessarily enough, though; the libclutter codepaths will be different for the GLX 1.2 case, so we could hit bugs there without any client code changes.
<rickspencer3_> RAOF, right, there are two classes of problems:
<rickspencer3_> 1. bugs caused by 1.2 api calls, that is, bugs in glx 1.2
<rickspencer3_> 2. apps that depend on version 1.3 api calls
<rickspencer3_> just looking for apps that haven't changed since 1.2 is insufficient for case #1
<RAOF> But sufficient for case 2, yeah.
<rickspencer3_> and just smoke testing isn't sufficient for case #2 (as perhaps you won't exercise the code paths that make the 1.3 calls
<rickspencer3_> because we are so short of time, we can't use the "upload and see who complains" QA message for this :/
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> A large part of the libclutter-1.0-0 rdepends list is language bindings with no in-archive users.
<rickspencer3_> interesting
<rickspencer3_> just sitting there waiting to be used
<rickspencer3_> training pulling in soon, see you guys tomorrow
<RAOF> Have fun!
<rickspencer3_> RAOF, do you overlap with didrocks at all?
<RAOF> Yes, in the late afternoon.
<rickspencer3_> RAOF, great
<rickspencer3_> thanks
<Sarvatt> ahh sorry, went to dinner there and just got back. clutter really is the only place I'd expect any kind of regressions (not that 1.2 isn't a regression already because it expects features from xserver 1.8). RAOF did you try running these apps with LIBGL_ALWAYS_INDIRECT=1 when you checked? also dont know if you caught my message but nvidia bypasses the server libglx anyway so it wouldnt be any different there
<RAOF> Sarvatt: Of course!  I should have expected nvidia to use its own stack :)
<RAOF> Sarvatt: I haven't been testing with LIBGL_ALWAYS_INDIRECT=1; should I have?
<Sarvatt> you want to run through the server glx since KMS drivers supported glx 1.3+ before anyway
 * RAOF should obviously have read the patch a little more carefully
<RAOF> So this is going to affect a significantly smaller fraction of our users then.
<RAOF> Ok.  gnome-shell is an unhappy camper.
<RAOF> â¦as is netbook-launcher.
<Sarvatt> yeah netbook-launcher is all kinds of messed up here
<RAOF> It looks like font rendering is broken in the GLX 1.2 pathway.
<Sarvatt> it uses -efi
<Sarvatt> doesn't it?
<RAOF> Sarvatt: Which one?  netbook-launcher, or netbook-launcher-efl?
<Sarvatt> it uses low graphics mode when i launch it with LIBGL_ALWAYS_INDIRECT=1 here
<RAOF> Nah; loads fine here.
<RAOF> But text is rendered as small white squares.
<Sarvatt> oh ok theres a seperate low quality mode for 3D?
<RAOF> For non-3D?  Yes.
<Sarvatt> yeah its the same here, white box fonts
<RAOF> netbook-launcher-efl
<Sarvatt> i dont have -efl installed
<Sarvatt> (netbook-launcher:2653): libnetbook-launcher-DEBUG: CONFIG: Low graphics mode: True
<Sarvatt> (netbook-launcher:2653): libnetbook-launcher-DEBUG: CONFIG: Low graphics mode: False
<Sarvatt> first with indirect
<Sarvatt> it plain doesn't work in direct mode here
<Sarvatt> screens all garbled
<jjardon> RAOF, You should try: swell foop (It uses clutter+seed(js))
<Sarvatt> LIBGL_ALWAYS_INDIRECT=1 swell-foop
<Sarvatt> Segmentation fault
<Sarvatt> :)
<RAOF> So, this looks both better and worse than we thought it was.
<RAOF> Sarvatt: What crazy X server are you using?  LIBGL_ALWAYS_INDIRECT=1 swell-foop doesn't segfault here (although it also doesn't render anything, either)
<bryceh> RAOF, it's past EOD for me, anything else I can help with on this bug before I go?
<RAOF> I don't think so.
<bryceh> ok, I'll try checking in again in several hours, so drop me a note if something needs sponsored or whatever
<RAOF> Thanks.
<RAOF> Sarvatt: So I think this puts the kybosh on just removing the GLX 1.4 backport.
<Sarvatt> without downgrading to a stable clutter you mean?
<RAOF> Yes.
<RAOF> That would mean *at least* a bunch of rebuilds; clutter 1.2 has new API, and netbook-launcher at least hits that when you try to downgrade clutter.
<Sarvatt> i'm using lucid + x-updates xserver on intel btw, it does segfault every time
<RAOF> I'm using lucid + x-updates xserver on intel, it segfaults none of the time :/
<Sarvatt> 945?
<Sarvatt> oh
<Sarvatt> my driconf settings for mesa were retained on the downgrade, I forgot about that
<RAOF> GM45
<RAOF> It crashes on quit, if that's any consolation :)
<Sarvatt> yep GLXBadContextTag
<RAOF> No GLX cleanup for you!
<Sarvatt> how are you supposed to gdb that sucker?
<RAOF> Run with --sync and break in gdk_x_error?
<Sarvatt> nah attached to the pid, i was trying to launch it directly from gdb
<RAOF> Ah.  It's all âI'm running your runtime in my runtime, dawgâ
<Sarvatt> darn forgot mesa symbols in the archive are messed up
<RAOF> Anyway.  That's not exactly a critical bug.
<RAOF> What was wrong with your master-fixes backport patch, apart from it being a code refactor?
<RAOF> Sarvatt: LIBGL_ALWAYS_INDIRECT might have other side-effects besides dropping down to GLX 1.2, right?
<Sarvatt> yep
<Sarvatt> sorry, afk a few
<RAOF> Would booting with i915.modeset=0 exercise the glx 1.2 codepaths?
<RAOF> Ok.
<RAOF> I'll give that a try anyway.
<Sarvatt> no unless you were on ATI
<Sarvatt> doh
<lifeless> so whats the glx story - is there a bug I can read?
<Sarvatt> lifeless: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/565981
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 565981 in xorg-server "[KMS] gem objects not deallocated" [Critical,Confirmed]
<lifeless> Sarvatt: thanks
<Sarvatt> ati and intel are getting memory leaks on the order of 1.5gb or so a day currently
<TheMuso> Ouch.
<lifeless> wow
<lifeless> I won't reboot for a bit then
<Sarvatt> you should reboot, often if you are using KMS :)
<Sarvatt> its been this way for almost a month now
<lifeless> Sarvatt:  13:14:34 up 15 days,  1:27, 11 users,  load average: 0.09, 0.13, 0.09
<Sarvatt> cat /sys/kernel/debug/dri/0/gem_objects ?
<lifeless> still got 1/2GB unallocated
<lifeless> 1190 objects
<lifeless> 69578752 object bytes
<lifeless> 5 pinned
<lifeless> 13725696 pin bytes
<lifeless> 29446144 gtt bytes
<lifeless> 234881024 gtt total
<RAOF> That's the nice thing about 8GB laptops; you can have X silently consuming 6.9 GiB of memory and not notice.
<rickspencer3> I'm confused ... how long has this leak been in the distro and why hasn't it been driving people insane?
<Sarvatt> nice, can you give me some more details on your setup? what GPU, do you view a lot of flash sites on it?
<lifeless> Sarvatt: sure
<Sarvatt> looks like a intel 965+?
<lifeless> gimme a sec, phone call
<rickspencer3> it seems a widespread bug of this magnitude would drive people crazy and we would be getting a crush of feedback
<lifeless> i7 64-bit
<RAOF> rickspencer3: We possibly are, but distributed against all sorts of other packages.
<RAOF> This memory is not accounted for anywhere that's particularly user-visible.
<Sarvatt> its very hard to notice
<rickspencer3> so if it's "very hard to notice" we should be careful about acting in haste
<Sarvatt> RAOF: lifeless isn't hitting it here for some reason
<rickspencer3> I would prefer to see a root cause analysis that identifies the code defect(s) causing this
<rickspencer3> and see that fixed in an SRU
<rickspencer3> instead of turning knobs all over the place at this point in the cycle hoping something works
<lifeless> Sarvatt:  00:02.0 VGA compatible controller [0300]: Intel Corporation Core Processor Integrated Graphics Controller [8086:0046] (rev 02)
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, RAOF do you both agree that the roll back to 1.2 is off the table?
<RAOF> Yes.
<lifeless> Sarvatt: (II) Module intel: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
<lifeless>         compiled for 1.7.5, module version = 2.9.1
<lifeless> Linux lifeless-64 2.6.32-17-generic #26-Ubuntu SMP Sat Mar 20 02:23:45 UTC 2010 x86_64 GNU/Linux
<lifeless> Sarvatt: anything else you want to know ?
<Sarvatt> lifeless: oh you haven't upgraded to the broken packages yet is why
<Sarvatt> they came on march 31st
<lifeless> Sarvatt: thats why I said 'I won't reboot for a while' :P
<rickspencer3> RAOF, bryceh, Sarvatt, what do you guys think of release noting the problem, and getting cracking with the debugger?
<Sarvatt> (or haven't rebooted into them, sorry) yeah I see what you mean :)
<RAOF> It's not too bad as long as you kill X every day or so.  Releasenoting might be appropriate.
<rickspencer3> RAOF, there is only so far we can unwind
<rickspencer3> I would like to see an SRU ready for this before we ship, if possible
<rickspencer3> RAOF, do you feel you have the skills to snorkly into the code and find the leak?
<rickspencer3> snorkle, even?
<RAOF> I'd quite like to snorkly :)
<rickspencer3> RAOF, we'll talk about that at UDS ;)
<RAOF> Yes; I'll ask someone if I hit something incomprehensible.
<rickspencer3> desktop-maverick-xorg-snorkly
<rickspencer3> ok
<RAOF> Snork!  Snork!
<RAOF> And I'd love to do some code-diving.
<rickspencer3> RAOF, can you please respond to bryceh's email with the new information
<rickspencer3> ?
<rickspencer3> ^the late question mark reveals that I didn't really mean that as a question ;)
<Sarvatt> i'll try to dig into it more, yeah. spent all day trying to backport the upstream fix since the one we are carrying that is the cause of this is the root of the problem but haven't had any luck with that
<rickspencer3> fruedian irc
<RAOF> rickspencer3: :)
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, upstream fix to the leak, you mean?
<rickspencer3> I didn't quite grock what you said there
<Sarvatt> well, there was the bug where closing clutter apps crashed the server, during the course of the bug report a patch was posted that applies to xserver 1.7 that we picked up and is causing these memory leaks, and they decided to go another route to fix the bug instead of what we used
<Sarvatt> but the fix that they used applies to xserver master which is drastically different than what we have
<rickspencer3> I see
<Sarvatt> and its not something they would bring to the xserver release we are using because upstream does not have these glx 1.4 enablement patches in xserver 1.7 branch in the first place that brought up the problem
<rickspencer3> so the fixed the bug in a fundamental way in their "tip" (of xorg-xserver)?
<rickspencer3> and due tot he delta between Ubuntu and the tip, that patch couldn't just apply cleanly, so now we're a bit on our own?
<Sarvatt> yeah, exactly
<Sarvatt> debian is affected as well and they are dropping the patches, we inherited them from them
<rickspencer3> yeah
<rickspencer3> ok, so root cause analysis next, and get an SRU ready?
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, sound right?
<Sarvatt> the backport also touches a significant amount of code and would be risky to SRU, which is why I believed dropping the glx patches would be the better route, but indeed it's bringing up problems with clutter 1.2
<Sarvatt> so trying to fix the patch would probably be the best route
<Sarvatt> (and SRUing it like you said)
<rickspencer3> RAOF, do you agree, root cause analysis then prepare an SRU?
<RAOF> Yes.
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> of course, it's a moot decision until bryceh weighs in ;)
<RAOF> Again, that's the least terrible of our options :)
<Sarvatt> rickspencer3: you are using intel right? can you do a cat /sys/kernel/debug/dri/0/gem_objects and paste the first two lines?
<rickspencer3> yup
<rickspencer3> 1247 objects
<rickspencer3> 278298624 object bytes
<rickspencer3> rick@rick-desktop:~$ uptime
<rickspencer3>  20:34:56 up 40 min,  3 users,  load average: 0.66, 1.11, 1.21
<Sarvatt> how long since you rebooted last?
<Sarvatt> ah, was going to say..
<rickspencer3> (always one step ahead)
<rickspencer3> *cough*
<Sarvatt> you didn't seem affected but yeah you are :)
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, well, I ran my UNE netbook all day for the last two days
<Sarvatt> do you have swap?
<rickspencer3> but I guess I shut it down a bit
<rickspencer3> you mean a swap partition, then yes
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, I'm not denying the existence of the bug
<Sarvatt> if you turn off your swap you will be frozen after a day because of the leak, I guarantee it :)
<rickspencer3> that would suck
<rickspencer3> indeed
<rickspencer3> I'm not denying the severity of the bug
<rickspencer3> I think we are all in agreement that a methodical approach to fixing it is our best bet now
<Sarvatt> watch that gem_objects size there, it wraps around to a negative number around 3GB memory used
<rickspencer3> I would very much like to see an SRU ready on day zero
<Sarvatt> doing everything I can to work on it here, just found out the cause yesterday
<rickspencer3> yeah
<rickspencer3> hopefully the code defect is not too hard to identify
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, can people who are getting kicked hard by this bug downgrad to glx 1.2 themselves until we get it fixed?
<Sarvatt> yes I posted a PPA for that on the bug report
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> that's good
<Sarvatt> it's in x-updates, also I am putting xserver 1.8 in xorg-edgers with the fixes
<rickspencer3> by "the fixes" you mean the rolled back glx?
<Sarvatt> no xserver 1.8 is fine with glx 1.4
<rickspencer3> I see
<rickspencer3> so another option is for users to basically update to the tip of xserver
<Sarvatt> it's a major change that requires rebuilding all of the X related packages though
<rickspencer3> so two things to try
<RAOF> xserver 1.8 has refactored the way that GLX resources are disposed of; they're now handled as regular X resources and cleaned up there.
<Sarvatt> nah, I wouldn't call it the tip, master is the tip and xserver 1.8 is the most recent stable release. xserver master is too cracky even for xorg-edgers crack :)
<rickspencer3> hehe
<rickspencer3> the crack for the crack
<Sarvatt> I have to rebuild all of the video and input drivers weekly for alot of the cycle if i follow master
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, RAOF thanks!
<rickspencer3> I
<rickspencer3> 've got to go
<rickspencer3> ttyt
<Sarvatt> no worries, take care
<RAOF> Have fun getting home.  Hope it doesn't take too long!
<RAOF> Or, in fact, hope you *are* home now :)
<rickspencer3> RAOF, I am home!
 * Sarvatt hopes these ash clouds go away in time for UDS
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, yes!!
<rickspencer3> ok, g'night
<Sarvatt> they're talking about it taking 2 weeks to get everyone who is stranded now home, can't afford to get stuck
<TheMuso> Sarvatt: For people like RAOF and myself who have to come/go home on long haul flights, this is being watched with some attention, at least by me.
<Sarvatt> how long is your flight?
<RAOF> In total?  About 28 hours.
<RAOF> But that isn't all in the air.
<Sarvatt> fun!
<Sarvatt> at least your flights do go through iceland though? :)
<TheMuso> Sarvatt: I think you meant don't.
<RAOF> I presume you mean âdon'tâ there :).  No.  But they do go through Heathrow.
<Sarvatt> yeah, sorry
<Sarvatt> yeah thats the airport with the 2 week backlog I was reading about
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti, how are you?
<pitti> bonjour didrocks! I'm good, thanks! how about you?
 * pitti takes a stab at bug 566046
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 566046 in gnome-keyring "the login password is stored in the user's keyring" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/566046
<didrocks> I'm fine too, thanks ;)
<didrocks> oh, that one, upstream didn't reply?
<RAOF> didrocks: Good morning!
<pitti> didrocks: right
<pitti> hey RAOF
<RAOF> Howdie pitti
<didrocks> good morning RAOF
<seb128> hello there
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<pitti> seb128: has there been any previous investigation on bug 566046?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 566046 in gnome-keyring "the login password is stored in the user's keyring" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/566046
<pitti> seb128: I wanted to take a stab at this today
<seb128> hey pitti, not that I know out of mdeslaur who said he looked a bit to the code without finding the issue
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks
<mvo> dear launchpad, please do not oops when I try to add a bug comment, love Michael
<RAOF> Ok.  That's enough diving throug X for one day.  See y'all tomorrow :)
<didrocks> good evening RAOF
<pitti> seb128: do you know whether there is a CLI tool to dump the keyring?
<seb128> pitti, not that I know about no
<huats> morning
<seb128> lut huats
<huats> hello seb128
<seb128> huats, ca va ?
<huats> seb128, yes !
<huats> et toi seb128 ?
<seb128> huats, ca va merci
<huats> :)
<james_w> huats \o/
<huats> hello james_w !
<huats> how are you ?
<huats> it's been a long time :)
<james_w> good thanks, how are you?
<huats> great thanks !
<huats> a really happy  young father :)
<james_w> glad to hear it :-)
<chrisccoulson> is anyone here on i386 and using the flash plugin installed from the archive?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: on my netbook
<chrisccoulson> pitti - do you know if it is using nspluginwrapper?
<pitti> it's a clean install from yesterday
<chrisccoulson> or is that just used for the amd64 version?
 * pitti boots
<pitti> I thought it's just needed on amd64?
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: are you still working on bug 555870?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 555870 in gnome-screensaver "Gamma values are not being set properly after a second fade out resulting in a black screen" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/555870
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i think so. i just wanted to make sure we weren't using it on all archs ;)
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, no, because i've got no idea what is going on now ;)
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, if you can recreate it, please provide a xtrace log from the actual gnome-screensaver process
<kklimonda> damn.. ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: nspluginwrapper isn't installed here
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> we're unsure if the issue with test-fade is a red herring or not
<chrisccoulson> thanks pitti
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, i'm good thanks. how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, no nspluginwrapper on i386 here either, I'm running the security ppa version which works fine btw
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thank you
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - excellent. i suppose i need to actually test the flash player with nspluginwrapper on amd64 ;)
<chrisccoulson> i'm using the 64-bit plugin here
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: I can get you all xtraces you want if you think it will help :)
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: would you rather get it attached to the bug report or pasted somewhere http://pastebin.com/U231nmDq ? :)
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, attached to the bug would be good
<kklimonda> ok
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: btw, sometimes I get a slightly less faded desktop instead of the pitch black one :)
<seb128> tseliot, hey, what is the package which has the nvidia display configuration tool?
<tseliot> seb128: nvidia-settings, why?
<seb128> tseliot, thanks, looking where to reassign bug #528756
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 528756 in gnome-control-center "Ubuntu forgets my screen resolution settings every time I reboot" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/528756
<seb128> tseliot, where the user is using the nvidia tool to change the configuration
<tseliot> seb128: right, that's a bug that I fixed in Lucid
<seb128> tseliot, ok, feel free to close it then ;-)
<tseliot> sure
<c_korn> can someone please confirm an odd issue with gnome-panel ? first do this steps: http://pastebin.com/SfLG5Abs then do a killall gnome-panel and after it has restarted I see that one starter has been cloned and replaced another starter. e.g. I have two canonical starters but the starter for launchpad is gone.
<c_korn> s/this/these/
<c_korn> I use lucid of course. http://pastebin.com/nhbdg14W
<pitti> I sometimes get that on login, but restarting the panel usually fixes it
<pitti> it's an indicator-applet bug apparently :/
<c_korn> so I should file a bug against indicator-applet instead of gnome-panel ?
<c_korn> it is annoying that I always lose my urls this way :/
<seb128> c_korn, you get the issue if you restart gnome-panel properly too?
<c_korn> the better question acutally is: how can I find out that it really is an indicator-applet ?
<c_korn> seb128: I get the issue also when I only restart.
<seb128> well is the issue a display one and happening randomly?
<seb128> or does it break your launchers?
<c_korn> no, it is happening reliably always
<seb128> pitti, oh? how did we figure it was an indicator issue?
<pitti> well, I only ever see it happen for the indicator applets
<seb128> I don't think it's the same issue pitti was mentioning which is a display one and randomly happening
<c_korn> it is not a display issue. one starter just gets replaced by another, completely.
<seb128> pitti, it's mostly happening for the notification area from bugs we received
<pitti> sometimes the session one is missing completely, or only 1/4 drawn, sometimes the nm-applet is missing/looking like the keyboard indicator
<seb128> c_korn, right, not the bug pitti was mentioning then
<seb128> pitti, nm or keyboard don't use indicators
<pitti> ok, misunderstood that then, sorry
<pitti> ok; itz gtk bug then?
<c_korn> how can I restart gnome-panel properly actually ?
<pitti> alt+f2 killall gnome-panel
<pitti> it'll restart itself
<pitti> (well, gnome-session will, but same result)
<c_korn> that is what I do currently.
<seb128> c_korn, gnome-panel --replace
<c_korn> ok, now I could not reproduce it. so maybe gnome-panel does not get closed properly. let me restart...
<c_korn> hm, now I cannot reproduce it anymore. I need to find out what triggered it.
<pitti> seb128: hm, so I stopped the user password from getting into the keyring, and now also have code to remove it during upgrades
<pitti> seb128: however, this potentially breaks this "user.keystore" keyring, but I have NFC what this actually is or how to use it
<pitti> it's empty everywhere, and seahorse doesn't have an option to fill it either
<pitti> seb128: I dumped my thoughts on the upstream bug and also mailed Stef
<chrisccoulson> pitti - if you have some spare time today, could you please look at bug 567819?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 567819 in xulrunner-1.9.1 "Please remove xulrunner-1.9.1 source, binaries and remaining rdepends from Lucid" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/567819
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yay! will do
<pitti> right after lunch
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks :)
<seb128> pitti, ok thanks, I'm not sure what it's used for either let's see if Stef replies, I already dropped him an email about the bug yesterday
<seb128> pitti, you can perhaps upload your change to the ubuntu-desktop ppa to get testing?
<pitti> seb128: can do; it's in bzr now
<pitti> seb128: done
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks for doing the removals :)
<pitti> no problem
<pitti> the cleaner the better :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - did you ever figure out the gnome-appearance-properties DND crash?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, depends on what you call figure out, it's a lack of proper locking issue and having gtk used out of the main process there
<seb128> I didn't work on a fix though since I'm not sure how to fix that
<chrisccoulson> i'll have a look at that this afternoon then
<seb128> excellent, thanks
<seb128> that one is collecting zillion of duplicates for cycles ;-)
<seb128> and the stacktraces are random in pango calls so the retracers autoduping doesn't work
<seb128> pitti, btw speaking of retracer, was there any discussion in the past about updating the bug title after retracing?
<seb128> pitti, the crash in somewhere() is often wrong or misleading because it comes from the non debug stacktrace
<seb128> tedg, hey
<tedg> Morning seb128
<seb128> tedg, pitti: should we drop fast-user-switch-applet in lucid?
<seb128> bug #563922
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 563922 in fast-user-switch-applet "Can't install on AMD 64 Lucid beta" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/563922
<seb128> I don't think it's of any use now right?
<seb128> ie gdm has its own f-u-s-a and we have indicator-session
<tedg> seb128: Yeah, but we get it for free from the gdm source package, right?
<tedg> seb128: Oh, we still have the old FUSA and the GDM one?
<seb128> tedg, yes, that's the old source in universe
<tedg> seb128: Oh, my.  Yeah, does that work anywhere?  It won't work with the new GDM.
<seb128> tedg, well I doubt it since it depends on gdm but gdm conflicts on it
<seb128> since gdm has the new fusa version now
<tedg> seb128: I'd make the new GDM FUSA "replaces" on it.
<seb128> tedg, I was just double checking there was not an out of GNOME scenario I was missing there
<tedg> seb128: Ah, not that I know of.
<seb128> ok, what I though but better to check
<seb128> tedg, thanks
<rickspencer3> pitti, hi
<rickspencer3> about bug #565981
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 565981 in xorg-server "[KMS] gem objects not deallocated" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/565981
<seb128> rickspencer3, hey
<rickspencer3> hi seb128, good morning
<rickspencer3> didrocks, hi
<didrocks> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> didrocks, I didn't understand what happened to bug #565981 ...
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 565981 in xorg-server "[KMS] gem objects not deallocated" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/565981
<rickspencer3> were  you saying that there were no issues from rolling back to glx 1.2?
<rickspencer3> (it was hard to piece together from the emails what is happening, and the bug wasn't updated)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: I wasn't answering towards the bug, but more on rolling back on 1.2. I told that I looked through the code and played for a couple of hours with netbook-launcher using glx 1.2 and didn't notice any particular issue
<rickspencer3> so you didn't see the "no text drawn" issue that RAOF saw?
<rickspencer3> that's very odd
<didrocks> no, on two of my hardwares
<didrocks> njpatel told that he would test too
<didrocks> I added the ppa mentioned in the email, dist-upgrade, and restart X
<rickspencer3> weird
<didrocks> I guess further testing on other device/graphic card is needed
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi pitti
<pitti> seb128: sounds fine to remove
<rickspencer3> pitti, I wanted to sync with you about this bug because I made decisions while you were asleep, and thought you better check on them ;)
<seb128> pitti, ok, good
<pitti> rickspencer3: oh, so that's why the computer gets slower and slower over time?
<rickspencer3> pitti, most likely, yes
<seb128> pitti, indeed
<rickspencer3> so, on the table is to roll back to glx 1.2 before release
<rickspencer3> but RAOF found this caused some apps, such netbook-launcher, to not paint text
<rickspencer3> !!
<rickspencer3> but didrocks did not see this effect
<rickspencer3> so I told them:
<didrocks> right, that's weird ::
<rickspencer3> 1. RAOF should dive into the code and do a root cause analysis
<rickspencer3> 2. get an SRU ready that fixes the memory leak in the patch of glx
<rickspencer3> pitti, but as tech lead, I see this as your call, really
<rickspencer3> that's why I wanted to sync with you
<pitti> rickspencer3: SRU for fixing the leak would be very much appreciated, of course
<rickspencer3> pitti, right
<pitti> I think this stuff is too brittle to downgrade to an older glx
<rickspencer3> so take that option off the table, even if testing shows it works?
<pitti> and since the bug says that with latest trunk the problem doesn't occur any more, it seems at least principally feasible
<rickspencer3> pitti, well, the latest trunk is way different than Lucid xserver
<rickspencer3> so they fixed the initial problem much differently
<pitti> rickspencer3: hm, Sarvatt just mentioned to drop the two 1.4 enablement patches, not to downgrade glx entirely?
<rickspencer3> pitti, that's basically rolling back to 1.2
<rickspencer3> (as I understand it)
<rickspencer3> pitti, but even if we do roll back the patches, would we do that in an SRU, or try to make it into final?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - so, i've found one easy-to-fix locking issue in gnome-appearance-properties which could cause that crash
<chrisccoulson> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi chrisccoulson
<pitti> rickspencer3: ah, so the one in x-updates was confirmed to work
<pitti> rickspencer3: hm, right now I can't do that decision objectively, I think; I know too little about the impact of rolling back the 1.4 glx patches, I'm afraid
 * pitti researches history
<rickspencer3> pitti, ok
<rickspencer3> it'
<rickspencer3> s a pretty serious bug, I hate to ship with it
<rickspencer3> but it doesn't cause data loss, so I am inclined to
<rickspencer3> not act in haste, and wait until we have deep understanding of the cause and the fix
<ogra> rickspencer3, the gem objects one ?
<ogra> i'm hit pretty hard by it
<rickspencer3> ogra, yes
<ogra> ogra@osiris:~$ cat /sys/kernel/debug/dri/0/gem_objects|grep "object bytes"
<ogra> -169566208 object bytes
<rickspencer3> ogra, I'm very sorry
<ogra> seems it just overflowed
<rickspencer3> ah, integer math wrapping, sweet
<ogra> rickspencer3, heh, no need to be sorry
<ogra> i'm happy there is an identified root cause to my desktop getting mad :)
<pitti> rickspencer3: I can't see in the changelog where the glx 1.4 enablement patches landed
<pitti> probably in 2:1.7.3.901-1 from December
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt ^ ?
<pitti> rickspencer3: did you already discuss which apps/parts use 1.4?
<rickspencer3> pitti, yes
<rickspencer3> in some depth
<rickspencer3> RAOF ran an rdepends and then tested all the apps there
<rickspencer3> he found an issue with UNE, where it wouldn't display text
<rickspencer3> but no one else is seeing that, and njpatel thinks he just needed to reboot, that it was a font caching issue
 * pitti just dislikes disabling features post-release
<rickspencer3> pitti, are you referring to glx?
<pitti> rickspencer3: so, perhaps we can do a call for testing and collect result on a wiki page
<rickspencer3> ok
<pitti> and then, based on the feedback, check on Friday how much and what kind of feedback we got
<rickspencer3> pitti, I don't there is a feature regression if we remove the patches
<pitti> rickspencer3: right, it could at most be a performance regression
<pitti> but certainly not relative to karmic, anyway
<rickspencer3> hardly a performance enhancement atm :)
<rickspencer3> hehe
<pitti> heh, yes
 * pitti feels urged to fix that in final, since the patch was just introduced a few days ago
<pitti> and it's such a nasty issue
<rickspencer3> pitti, ok, do it!
<rickspencer3> I suspect rolling back all the patches will work
<rickspencer3> and it's basically a roll back to a "lost known good"
<rickspencer3> it's not moving forward to crack
<rickspencer3> ogra, can you help test a fix for the gem bug?
<ogra> rickspencer3, it might take quite long to reproduce, it only kicks in if the counter filled up here
<ogra> which is takeing about 24h
<ogra> *taking
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<ogra> rickspencer3, but indeed i'm happy to
<rickspencer3> can you play saurbraughten for an hour or so? maybe that will do it? ;)
<ogra> i need to restart X anyway, all my chromium tabs OOMed
<seb128> pitti, rolling back the change which made xorg crash when closing a clutter dialog?
<rickspencer3> seb128, yes
<pitti> robbiew: well, that, and the two changes which needed that 114 patch in the first place
<pitti> sorry, seb128 ^
<seb128> I'm not sure I would prefer crashy xorg to sluggish one
<pitti> seb128: rolling back 114 alone would be crashy, AFAIUI
<ogra> rickspencer3,  though i think if we see the gem_objects not climb as mad that would already be kind of a proof
<pitti> but not 114 together with the two glx 1.4 patches
<seb128> pitti, oh ok
<seb128> pitti, when have the 2 glx ones be added?
<pitti> seb128: not entirely clear to me, but I think somewhere around December/January; pretty early
<rickspencer3> seb128, basically, as I understand it, it's rolling back to karmic glx
<seb128> so it means it's not really a known to be good combinaison
<seb128> karmic glx but non karmic stack around it
<seb128> ie something we never tested
<rickspencer3> seb128, correct
<seb128> ogra, well you don't need to wait for the crash to watch the counter
<seb128> rickspencer3, tricky one indeed :-(
<rickspencer3> I think we move back to 1.2, it will be easier to move forward with patches in SRUs
<rickspencer3> but that's a hunch
<ogra> seb128, thats what i meant above :)
<seb128> I can help testing candidate packages there but I've no really opinion on which way is the best one, I don't know enough about the changes and the issue
<pitti> what I don't really understand is that 03_fedora_glx_versioning.diff and 04_fedora_glx14-swrast.diff basically do nothing else than changing "1.2" to "1.4", but do not add any actual functionality
<seb128> rickspencer3, we need to test 1.2 on lucid though to know how it behaves
<rickspencer3> seb128, right
<seb128> since that's not something we ever tested
<rickspencer3> that's what we have started
<pitti> i. e. rolling back doesn't remove any API, just goes back to announcing "glx version: 1.2"
<rickspencer3> and what pitti suggested
<seb128> ok good
<seb128> +1 from me then
<rickspencer3> test it until Friday, and then decide
<rickspencer3> ^pitti's plan
<seb128> pitti, is there anything which decide what to do at runtime based on the version announced?
<pitti> seb128: I don't know, I just asked the same question a few minutes ago
<seb128> I guess it's rather an #ubuntu-x discussion
<pitti> I'll send a call for testing and set up a wiki page; that can't hurt either way, and let's see how much feedback we get until Friday
<seb128> ok
<didrocks> I'm running it on my two machines since this morning FYI
<seb128> the issue is that I don't really know on what to test glx
<seb128> games?
<pitti> I get it by merely using compiz, firefox, and terminals
<didrocks> I tried mostly  netbook-launcher/compiz/gnome-shell
<seb128> well not checking if gems are leaked
<seb128> but test if downgrading to 1.2s till behave correctly
<pitti> right
<seb128> ie no rendering issue, not 15 times slower
<seb128> no crash
<rickspencer3> seb128, so RAOF pasted in a list of redpends directly on glx last night
<rickspencer3> and then, anything that uses clutter
<rickspencer3> for clutter, it works fine with 1.2, apparantly
<rickspencer3> but we should confirm that apps that use clutter continue to do so
<seb128> right
<rickspencer3> for direct glx clients, we need to confirm that none of them depend on features or bugs in a version later than 1.2
<seb128> do you still have the list somewhere?
<seb128> I close IRC at night so I don't have scrollback with it
<rickspencer3> seb128, I can get it
<rickspencer3> hold on
<asac> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/04/20/%23ubuntu-desktop.txt
<asac> or the date adjusted
<kenvandine> does this effect certain hardware or anyone?
<rickspencer3_> http://pastebin.ca/1870751
<rickspencer3> seb128, ^
<pitti> kenvandine: intel and ati, AFAICS
<kenvandine> ok, so any intel
<seb128> rickspencer3, thanks
<rickspencer3> oops
<rickspencer3> seb seems gone
<seb128> rickspencer3: right, I was going to say, it's empty
<seb128> not a lot to test ;-)
<rickspencer3_> apt-cache rdepends libglitz-glx1
<seb128> f-spot
<rickspencer3> hmm
<seb128> that's a short list ;-)
<rickspencer3> that's not qutie the list
<rickspencer3> oh well
<rickspencer3> seb128, in any case, RAOF went over the apps in some detail last night
<seb128> I'm always concerned about things we don't have direcly shipped
<seb128> like ie games or google earth or whatever users can be running
<rickspencer3> right
<rickspencer3> but what can we do?
<rickspencer3> anyway, those will be in Universe and can be updated more easily
<seb128> I guess that best way forward is to test without those changes on what we can
<rickspencer3> yeah
<rickspencer3> RAOF already tested the apps that we can know about
<seb128> and deal with issue with third party applications in a SRU later if any get raised
<rickspencer3> and confirmed there were no issues
<seb128> let's make the default installation work fine
<rickspencer3> yes
<seb128> and deal with corner cases as they come if there is any issue
 * chrisccoulson wonders if the bug you're talking about is the reason for my laptop being virtually unusable atm
<seb128> chrisccoulson, could well be, you can try the ppa to make sure ;-)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: if restarting X helps, then most likely
<chrisccoulson> ok, i will try that in a bit
<pitti> chrisccoulson: cat /sys/kernel/debug/dri/0/gem_objects
<chrisccoulson> pitti - "1174454272 object bytes"?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: right, overflow
<chrisccoulson> excellent
<pitti> oops, the - wasn't part of the output
<pitti> but still a lot
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it's quite a big number
<rickspencer3> well, you need to pair that with uptime
<rickspencer3> at least it's easy to repro the bug
<ogra> it will overflow at some point
<rickspencer3> ;)
<rickspencer3> ogra, right
<ogra> i'm seeing that here every second day
 * rickspencer3 recalls from 2nd day of c programming class
<ogra> which is definately a bug in itself, the variable is to small
<ogra> beyond the uncontrolled growth
<rickspencer3> ogra, I can imagine when the functionality was written
<ogra> heh, indeed
<rickspencer3> "it will be hundreds of years before anyone has gigs of memory, and who needs more than 100 megs, anyway?"
<chrisccoulson> my issues go away for a bit after a reboot, but then my laptop just starts swapping uncontrollably
<rickspencer3> "just use a small in"
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Testing/GEMLeak   <- first cut
<rickspencer3> ;)
<ogra> 640k are enough
<didrocks> some told that with less ;)
<didrocks> ogra: yes ;)
<rickspencer3> "there is no way anyone will be using this software in year 2000"
<ogra> chrisccoulson, heh, lucky you, you got swap ...
 * ogra doesnt want to wear out his SSD
<rickspencer3> pitti, you just gave me an excuse to play saurbraten this morning?
<rickspencer3> sweeet~
<pitti> rickspencer3: go, go, go!
<rickspencer3> I"m going
<chrisccoulson> ogra - and i get lots of hung task warnings in dmesg too (but i'm not sure if that's related to the excessive swapping)
 * pitti apt-get install extremetuxracer
<ogra> chrisccoulson, yeah, thats your kernel babbling about OOM
<ogra> chrisccoulson, it gets funny if you use chromium ... tabs die randomly at some point and in the end all your screen is full with sad faces
 * kenvandine reboots with new xorg
<chrisccoulson> lol
 * kenvandine thinks lucid boots too fast
<kenvandine> doesn't give me time to refill my coffee :)
<kenvandine> pitti, did your songs ever download?
<pitti> kenvandine: it said "there was a problem" this morning and offered me a retry button. but didn't help, timing out again
<kenvandine> ok
<pitti> u-devel@ mail is out
<rickspencer3> pitti, think someone can gin up a quick repro script?
<rickspencer3> like does running glx-gears cause the leak?
<pitti> rickspencer3: there's one in the bug, but I think that's not the main point of testing
<pitti> we know that it fixes the leak
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> good point
<pitti> we need to find out about functional/performance regressions
<rickspencer3> well, UNE seems to be working fine on my netbook
<pitti> rickspencer3: but the eog loop was a good start, I think
<rickspencer3> I'll use it for a couple of hours later though
<pitti> didrocks, kenvandine: I added a "desktop" field, please update
<kenvandine> ok
<didrocks> oki
 * kenvandine will test on his netbook too
<didrocks> the issue is that I have the same chipset on both netbook and my laptop is a nvidia :/
<didrocks> not good for wide testing
<kenvandine> i am sure my netbook is a different chip
<kenvandine> not sure which yet though :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: exotic hardware? ;)
<kenvandine> no
<kenvandine> intel classmate
<kenvandine> but different than my laptop
<rodrigo_> hmm, the indicator applet seems to capture IM messages from empathy, but it doesn't open the IM window?
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, it should if you click on it
<seb128> rodrigo_, right, that's empathy behaviour, it doesn't do auto-opening
<seb128> rodrigo_, upstream version makes the notification icon flash but you have to click on it too
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, hmm, but it also shows an item under Chat for users that come online
<rodrigo_> so I have to check all the time if it's a new message
<seb128> rodrigo_, that one just stay a few seconds and go away
<seb128> wait 5 seconds
<kenvandine> and it won't so a time next to them
<seb128> if it stays it's a message ;-)
<rodrigo_> seb128, and if it's a real IM message, it stays there until I open it?
<rodrigo_> ah, ok
<seb128> yes
<seb128> you can also turn the indicator off in the empathy preferences if you don't like it
<rodrigo_> I like it, just got a bit confused
<rodrigo_> I think I missed a message or 2 yesterday
<seb128> I still think it could be better and be flashing a few times on message income
<rodrigo_> yes
<rodrigo_> or at least show a different icon than an envelope
<rodrigo_> it shows green also when I get new mail, which is every 10 mins :D
<seb128> right
<Nafai> Morning guys, grabbing breakfast and then I'll be right back
<didrocks> good morning Nafai
<rickspencer3> pitti, fwiw, saurbraten seems to work fine on my 965
<rickspencer3> I'll test desktop and UNE more this afternoon
<didrocks> rickspencer3: I guess you have to ensure in completing all levels :)
<rickspencer3> uh
<rickspencer3> yeah, I'm not that good
<rickspencer3> ;)
<didrocks> heh
<rickspencer3> rick@rick-desktop:~$ glxgears
<rickspencer3> 2995 frames in 5.0 seconds
<rickspencer3> does that seem like decent throughput?
<pitti> yes, I think so; I get a couple of 100 :)
<kenvandine> better than me :)
<kenvandine> i get 2645
<rickspencer3> pitti, I'll use my UNE netbook for some programming later today
<pitti> oh, windowed I get 2470
<rickspencer3> do some real usage
<pitti> thanks
<seb128> 2225 frames in 5.0 seconds
<seb128> there
<pitti> I have the update running on netbook and laptop now
<pitti> argh, silly fishbones, they cost me 10 fish!
<pitti> erm
<pitti> I mean, tuxracer still works fine :)
<kenvandine> hehe
<rickspencer3> pitti, so:
<rickspencer3> rick@rick-desktop:~$ glxgears -fullscreen
<rickspencer3> 271 frames in 5.0 seconds
<rickspencer3> seems reasonable based on what you said?
<pitti> sounds fine
<pitti> rickspencer3: did you get more with the lucid X.org?
<rickspencer3> I dunno
<rickspencer3> I don't much care, tbh
<rickspencer3> ;)
<Nafai> Hey didrocks
<kenvandine> sauerbraten and tuxracer are fine
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, maybe we need to test sauerbraten in multi-player mode?
<kenvandine> hehe
 * kenvandine had never played sauerbraten before
<kenvandine> looks kid of fun :)
<kenvandine> s/kid/like/
<pitti> kenvandine: and it apparently causes immediate grammatical distortions :)
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> indeed
<rickspencer3> seb128, do you have that BBC doesn't work in Totem bug # handy?
<seb128> rickspencer3, hum, let me look to it, I closed it a few days ago because it was working but it's down ago now :-(
<rickspencer3> well, it wasn't quite working apparantly
<seb128> rickspencer3, bug #528728
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 528728 in totem "Totem BBC plugin cannot connect" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/528728
<rickspencer3> I just got an email from BBC, and it seems that totem isn't displaying the full list
<seb128> rickspencer3, well it was displaying something
<rickspencer3> right
<seb128> rickspencer3, not I get a "fail to connect" again
<rickspencer3> just the first entry
<rickspencer3> maybe I should just open another bug
<seb128> rickspencer3, no please reopen this one
<seb128> rickspencer3, they blame it on the client side?
<rickspencer3> seb128, yes
<rickspencer3> they can view the feed in a web page
<seb128> I get a can't connect to server there again
<seb128> I very doubt it's a client side issue
<rickspencer3> I think there are two issues
<rickspencer3> seb128, let me just forward you the email for now
<seb128> rickspencer3, ok thanks
<seb128> "We have some downstream (from this service) connectivity problems which are hampering our ability to diagnose what looks like a probable server misconfiguration. I can connect intermittently to the service (stock Karmic) from my home box but it's very flaky."
<seb128> rickspencer3, ^ I think that's still an issue
<seb128> we might have a client side issue added to that too
<seb128> though our code didn't change since it was written
<rickspencer3> so I think they addressed the server side, and there is probably some xml parsing
<rickspencer3> problems
<rickspencer3> it could be bad xml, or a bug in totem
<rickspencer3> I think totem gets the list of programs, but then doesn't display them all
<rickspencer3> it sounds like a separate issue to me
<seb128> right
<seb128> rickspencer3, I don't get this parsing bug on lucid, I've a list of several screens of content now
<rickspencer3> hmm
<rickspencer3> kewl
<seb128> rickspencer3, I will test a bit a different time until tomorrow and reply to the mail later
<rickspencer3> seb128, well, prioritize appropriately
<rickspencer3> thanks seb128
<seb128> np
<seb128> thank you for contacting them, it's good they fixed the server ;-)
<zyga> has anyone heard of http://www.synaptics.com/solutions/technology/gestures/touchpad-linux
<zyga> to quote: "Synaptics Gesture Suite Linux (SGS-L) provides users with a powerful and intuitive way to be more productive and interactive with their Linux based notebook systems. SGS-L was developed from analyzing the most common workflows, from entertainment activities such as viewing photos and listening to music, to productivity activities such as accessing emails and presentations. The result is an enhanced usability model that makes it intuitive
<zyga> for consumers to easily understand and discover features, resulting in a better user experience." ... "Supported Linux operating systems include Fedora, Millos Linpus, Red Flag, SLED 11 (SuSE), Ubuntu, and Xandros. SGS-L includes a wide range of pointing enhancements and gestures including two-finger scrolling, PinchZoom, TwistRotate, PivotRotateâ¢, three-finger flick, three-finger press, Momentumâ¢ and ChiralScrollâ¢"
<matumba> hey, i added the ppa for the gem leak fix but after a reboot glxinfo still says "GLX version 1.4" - any ideas?
<lool> pitti: Ah!  I was a victim of that slowness of xorg which you posted about and was searching for it all over the place
<lool> I think it interfered with other issues I was seeing https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/549428
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 549428 in linux "Triggers permanent high i/o load after upgrade" [Undecided,New]
<Nafai> lunching
<pitti> Taekwondo time, good night everyone!
<didrocks> enjoy pitti
<james_w> http://jameswestby.net/scratch/offline-lp.ogv <- fun evening hacking outcode
<Nafai> james_w: Cool, local caching of Launchpad info?
<james_w> yeah
<bryceh> james_w, bjf has done work along those lines, caching lp info into a couchdb
<james_w> that's exactly what this is
<didrocks> james_w: sweet!
<bjf> james_w: https://chinstrap.canonical.com/~bradf/hwdb/
<bjf> james_w, look at the Reports, these were generated from processing couchdb data obtained from LP
<bjf> james_w, you can click on the individual bar graphs to "drill down"
<bjf> james_w, once you get to a table of bugs, owner, and titles, you can click on one and it will take you to LP
<james_w> so you are using it as it is quicker to cache it all upfront and then query the faster store?
<bjf> james_w, partly yes, also that I can perform other queries faster
<bjf> correlating the vendors and tags can be tough with just LP
<bjf> james_w, the other thing I _really_ like about couchdb is how easy it is to replicate the database so it's easy to share with others
<james_w> yeah
<bryceh> bjf, james_w, this caching of lp is something I'm *quite* interested in myself, as many of my scripts take forever to run
<bryceh> I've been too slammed with X to look into this myself, but if you two sync'd efforts up, it's something I'd be quite interested in looking at using as well
<mvo> didrocks: still here?
<didrocks> mvo: yes
<mvo> didrocks: silly question, what stuff is in ubuntu-netbook that is not in ubuntu-desktop (or vice versa). i ask because of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LucidLynx/ReleaseManifest
<mvo> didrocks: and it says there that netbook gets 18m of support
<mvo> didrocks: is that just the small bits like netbook-launcher?
<mvo> instead of the panel?
<didrocks> mvo: right: netbook-launcher, clutk, liblauncher and clutter I would say
<mvo> didrocks: thanks, that is enough
<didrocks> (also n-l-efl by extension)
<mvo> didrocks: as info
<mvo> n-l-efl?
<mvo> efl?
<didrocks> netbook-launcher-efl (the "2D one")
<mvo> aha
<mvo> thanks
<didrocks> you're welcome :)
<Sarvatt> Regarding the GLX version downgrade possibility I should probably clear up something. KMS users will be unaffected since clients will still be 1.4, non KMS intel users will be unaffected since they have DRI2 without KMS (and still having 1.4), proprietary driver users will be unaffected since they don't user the server's libglx. the main concerns would be non KMS ATI and other fringe drivers like savage that had problems already which is w
<Sarvatt> hy I believed it was the sanest option. To test you want to abuse compiz as much as possible, browsing some flash heavy sites or flicker pages with huge images for instance and watch /sys/kernel/debug/dri/0/gem_objects while doing it to see if the number goes down to sane levels properly or steadily increases with no shrinking. if the gem object size listed there is over 1GB you for sure have problems
<Keybuk> Sarvatt: I was doing that earlier
<Keybuk> -1512136704 object bytes
<Keybuk> confused me ;-)
<Sarvatt> yeah you wrapped around to negatives, multi gigs of memory lost :(
<Keybuk> this is on i915 with KMS
<Sarvatt> thats with the stock lucid packages right?
<Keybuk> yes
<rickspencer3> pitti, glx 1.2 did not fix the bug for you?
<rickspencer3> oh, never mind
<rickspencer3> I see it says (testing)
<Keybuk> ah sorry, I misinterpreted - somehow I'd got the impression you didn't think Intel was affected
<Keybuk> I shall shut up and test the downgrade
<bjf> bryceh, was thinking of it more last night and am starting to implement it now
<bjf> bryceh, I figure if I can handle the 10K of 'linux' package bugs, it will work for any others :-)
<rickspencer3> I wish glx really did install memory on your system
<Keybuk> you know what's really funny?
<Keybuk> my laptop had got so slow, I actually ordered more memory for it this week <g>
<kenvandine> Keybuk, lol
<kenvandine> i just thought evolution was dragging me down again :)
<Keybuk> I was blaming evolution, chromium and docky
<Keybuk> well, my object bytes isn't negative after rebooting ;-)
<Sarvatt> bonus! clutter apps now work with swrast disabling glx 1.4 reporting in the server
<Sarvatt> with stock lucid xserver using software rasterizer - failed to create drawable Failed to initialise clutter: Unable to select the newly created GLX context and the apps silently fail to load (widely reported bug against all clutter based apps right now)
<Sarvatt> and with the x-updates version they now work fine
<Sarvatt> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server/+bug/561734
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 561734 in gnome-games "quadrapassel doesn't start: Failed to initialise clutter: Unable to select the newly created GLX context" [Medium,Confirmed]
<Sarvatt> easy to verify as well anywhere, running LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=1 quadrapassel with the lucid xserver fails and with x-updates it does not
<leftyfb> Ok, so you guys are removing one of the most valuable features of a desktop ... the notification area. So tell me this, where would something like the Dropbox item go? or ksplice? or gSTM?
<james_w> bryceh, bjf: this is what I am working towards: http://jameswestby.net/scratch/offline-lp.ogv
<james_w> err, make that http://jameswestby.net/scratch/offline-lp2.ogv
<TheMuso> Good morning.
<Nafai> Hey TheMuso
<rickspencer3> RAOF, hi
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Good morning.
<rickspencer3> RAOF, so, the did you see the glx 1.2 feedback, plans today?
<RAOF> My email is on it's way to me now.
<RAOF> I saw didrocks feedback from yesterday before I shut down, but haven't seen anything newer.
<RAOF> I've got an idea of how the 114 patch is causing the leak, too.
<rickspencer3> sweet
<Keybuk> hmm
<Keybuk> so I'm running the backported packages
<Keybuk> but I think there's still a leak
<rickspencer3> oh?
<RAOF> Keybuk: Your running the X server from x-testing with the GLX 1.4 backport dropped?
<Keybuk> RAOF: as far as I know
<RAOF> s/your/you're/-
<Keybuk> the number of GEM objects has increased from ~270 to over 400 so far
<Keybuk> closing apps isn't making it go down
<rickspencer3> urk
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-04-22
<Keybuk> server glx version string: 1.2
<Keybuk> client glx version string: 1.4
<Keybuk> GLX version: 1.2
<Keybuk> OpenGL version string: 1.4 Mesa 7.7.1
<Keybuk> fwiw
<RAOF> Ok.
<rickspencer3> my count is over 1300
<rickspencer3> but it goes up and down
<RAOF> Mine is ~2200 but again goes both up and down
<Keybuk> at the point mine was ~2200, the bytes counter had overflowed to be negative
<rickspencer3> I just played sourbraten, and my byte count and object count both went down
<Keybuk> it's certainly not as *bad*
<Keybuk> will run it for a few more hours and see if still goes up
<rickspencer3> though I don't know for a fact that saurbraten uses glx, I just like it
<Keybuk> or maybe it just climbs and plateaus around here
 * Keybuk fires up hulu-desktop
<rickspencer3> well, first of all, I think I just got paid to play tetris
<rickspencer3> second of all, the bytes and object counts seemed similar before and after, though the deallocation was not immediate
<asac> hmm. i remember to read something about some i8xx graphics drivers causing problems a few days ago. was that resolved?
<rickspencer3> asac, not really
<rickspencer3> well, in what sense do you mean "resolved"?
<asac> is that the chip a mini 9 might have?
<rickspencer3> asac, I would presume the mini 9 has 945, but don't know for sure
<RAOF> asac: No; the 8xx chips are old.
<asac> well. just wonder if something got blacklisted, because someone complains about a changed UNE experience since a few days ago.
<asac> and i thought maybe its because its now falling back to -efl
<asac> bug 568096
<rickspencer3> ah
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 568096 in netbook-launcher "UNE desktop fonts and icon sizes have changed" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/568096
<asac> bug 568084
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 568084 in netbook-launcher "Administration is listed before Preferences" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/568084
<asac> bug 568073
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 568073 in netbook-launcher "Categories scrolling is different" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/568073
<asac> i reassigned them to netbook-launcher, but now i realized that a fallback to -efl might cause that confusion
<rickspencer3> asac, this is mattgriffin, right?
<asac> yes ;)
<rickspencer3> I just asked him to do lspci | grep VGA
<asac> so its Intel Corporation Mobile 945GME Express Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 03)
<asac> he pasted it to me now ;)
<rickspencer3> asac, yeah
<asac> ok so nothing changed on that front i guess?
<rickspencer3> no, that is not blacklisted
<asac> too bad ;)
<rickspencer3> and it is working for me
<asac> would be an easy explain
<rickspencer3> maybe he just logged into an efi session by accident?
<rickspencer3> efl, I mean
<asac> yeah maybe :)
<asac> asked him
<asac> he uses "Session: Ubuntu Netbook Edition" ... so probably not
<asac> ok seems he just needed a reboot. maybe his graphics driver was in bad state after upgrade or something. i asked him to come back if he can reproduce this
<rickspencer3> asac, yeah
<rickspencer3> if there is a problem in our detection code, we'll let didrocks know
<rickspencer3> this is the first I have heard of such an issue
<asac> right. didnt hear either. lets really see
<rickspencer3> I'll chalk it up to to a fluke, but keep my eye on it
<rickspencer3> RAOF so my objects and bytes seem to go up and down quite a bit, with no very clear relationship to apps I am running, or when I run them at least
<rickspencer3> RAOF, ping
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Pong
<rickspencer3> RAOF, so, what is your conclusion regarding glx testing?
<rickspencer3> is the leak mitigated, fixed, not affected?
<RAOF> rickspencer3: The leak is certainly affected by dropping the glx patches; it looks very much like it fixes it.
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> and have you concluded that your "no fonts" issue is or is not impacted by rolling back to glx 1.2?
<rickspencer3> RAOF, ^ ?
<RAOF> I'm less certain there.
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> njpatel thinks that you had a font caching issue
<rickspencer3> and that a reboot would fix it
<rickspencer3> RAOF, in any case, do you think we should roll back to glx 1.2 for release?
<RAOF> The gem testing page has only a single comment from a non-DRI2 driver, which is I think where the problems would be.
<rickspencer3> you mean where the corruption that you saw would be?
<rickspencer3> RAOF, are you still seeing the problem?
<RAOF> Yes, but only with LIBGL_ALWAYS_INDIRECT=1, which could be skewing the results.
<rickspencer3> ?
<Nafai> rickspencer3: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-bluetooth/+bug/558841/comments/15
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 558841 in gnome-bluetooth "bluetooth "devices" menu item not working in bluetooth indicator" [Medium,In progress]
<rickspencer3> Nice Nafai, keep going!
<rickspencer3> really getting there
<Nafai> yeah
<Nafai> learned a lot the last few days :)
<rickspencer3> good
<rickspencer3> on the job training ;)
<Nafai> definitely.  in this job, I imagine if you aren't getting it at some point, you aren't doing something right :)
<rickspencer3> :)
<rickspencer3> hi RAOF, bryceh, Sarvatt
<RAOF> Yo.
<rickspencer3> Looks like on the Gem Leak testing page, someone had an issue with nouveau
<rickspencer3> "gem leal" sounds so classy
<bryceh> rickspencer3, hey
<rickspencer3> hey bryceh
<rickspencer3> bryceh, do you have the capability to test nouveau ?
<bryceh> were we not expecting it to hit nouveau?  I assumed it was applicable to all open drivers
<RAOF> I was rather expecting nouveau's lack of 3D to help it avoid leaks in DRI2 :)
<bryceh> ah true
<rickspencer3> bryceh, they say they still had the leak *after* applying the PPA
<bryceh> oh
<rickspencer3> so it could be a regression or such
<bryceh> well, it's certainly possible they're seeing some unrelated bug.
<rickspencer3> or that
<rickspencer3> they are the only ones who reported on nouveau so far
<rickspencer3> is there any one else who try to reproduce it?
<RAOF> Or that they're using xorg-edgers to get 3D, and the x-updates xserver doesn't have a higher version number than the server in edgers.
<bryceh> it's not unusual for when a given bug gets high profile, that people with similar but unrelated issues glom onto it
<rickspencer3> bryceh, right
<bryceh> heh, this is why I like to always include a ContactInfo column in testing tables like this
<rickspencer3> so does someone we know who can give us reliable info have nvidia and can test with nouveau?
<RAOF> I'll disable nvidia on my testing laptop and give it a whirl.
<rickspencer3> bryceh, they put their name their
<rickspencer3> thanks RAOF
<rickspencer3> RAOF, can you include those results on the wiki please?
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Certainly.
<rickspencer3> thanks man
<rickspencer3> thanks guys
<rickspencer3> if Sarvatt shows up at all, tell him I owe him a beer for sure!
<Sarvatt> Ahh I'm here! I was off testing a nouveau machine out and adding my results to the page
<Sarvatt> the situation is much better with the PPA xserver on nouveau, clutter apps no longer fail to start entirely like they were before
<Sarvatt> bug 561734
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 561734 in gnome-games "quadrapassel doesn't start: Failed to initialise clutter: Unable to select the newly created GLX context" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/561734
<RAOF> I should try that with my locally patched xserver, too.
<Sarvatt> they wont work, it's only fixed by going back to glx 1.2
<RAOF> We could probably fix them by dropping the âbackport glx 1.4 to swrastâ patch, I'd wager.
 * Sarvatt nods
<Keybuk> RAOF: just had an X lock-up with the PPA packages
<RAOF> I take it this was not a regular occurance pre-PPA? :/
<RAOF> Keybuk: Doing anything in particular?
<Keybuk> hasn't happened in recent memory pre-PPA
<Keybuk> I had clicked a link in chromium
<RAOF> Got any logs?  /var/log/Xorg.0.log.old should be the previous log; dmesg can also be instructive.
<Keybuk> just checking now
<Keybuk> nothing obvious in Xorg.0.log.old
<Keybuk> last thing printed is about mode lines
<Keybuk> kernl.log has nothing before my Emergency Sync
<RAOF> Hm.  Did only X die, dropping you back at gdm, or did everything freeze (or equivalent)
<Keybuk> everything froze, only SysRq worked
<Keybuk> felt like a pipe underrun
<RAOF> You've got an intel card, don't you; 965 from memory?
<Keybuk> correct
<RAOF> The mouse froze, too?
<Keybuk> no
<Keybuk> sorry
<Keybuk> 945
<Keybuk> yes, mouse froze
<Keybuk> and couldn't VT switch
<RAOF> Ok.
<RAOF> I'll look over the patches we dropped in the PPA packages.  I don't think there'll be anything obvious, though :(
<Keybuk> 40-xserver-xorg-video-intel.rules:#SUBSYSTEM=="drm", ACTION=="change", ENV{ERROR}=="1", RUN+="/usr/share/apport/apport-gpu-error-intel.py"
<Keybuk> is commented out?
<Keybuk> upstart/udev logs suggest I had those change events just before reboot
<RAOF> Hm.  I thought that i915 would also complain in dmesg when that happened.
<RAOF> We disabled that reporting earlier; we'd got lots of data and not much to actually do with it.  It was also hard to assign duplicates.
<RAOF> Maybe you could uncomment in the hope that this'll happen again and we'll get some logs
<Keybuk> yeah, done that
<RAOF> Given that the driver couldn't reset the gpu we'll hopefully get useful logs.
<RAOF> You also were still seeing a possible gem objects leak, even with the PPA xserver?
<Keybuk> yes
<Keybuk> I'm logging the gem_objects file every couple of seconds
<Keybuk> and after a few hours usage, will plot
<Keybuk> see whether I'm imagining it or not
<RAOF> Ok.
<Keybuk> so far, it looks like it's just going up and down
<Keybuk> and not increasing in any kind of fashion over time
<WyGuy> I Am having trouble with my laptop
<WyGuy> can anyone help
<rickspencer3> Keybuk, you're bumming me out here
<rickspencer3> I have i965 and haven't seen issues since like Alpha 1
<rickspencer3> I have this dream where I am running, and xorg-xserver is chasing me ..
<rickspencer3> but I can never quite run fast enough
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> pitti: Goooood morning
<pitti> hey RAOF! how are you?
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Testing/GEMLeak looks good, no regressions so far
<RAOF> Yeah.  And I've managed to convince myself that we're testing the right codepaths, too.
<pitti> this *sniff* really makes lucid fun again
<pitti> no more 1-minute shutdowns, the weird keyboard behaviour in sudo'ed gnome-terminals has gone, and everthing is fast and snappy again
<RAOF> I've also got a package in the (other) x-testing PPA that I'm pretty sure fixes the memory leak without reverting the GLX 1.4 backport.  I'll leave that off the GEMLeak page until we've got more testing of the reverted packages; reverting the GLX patches is safer.
<pitti> RAOF: oh, you rock
<RAOF> I'm just reading X server code to convince myself that the patch I've picked will work everywhere :)
<RAOF> Ok.  I'm off for a walk while it's still light.
<ogra> yay, my gem objects count isnt gone negative yet
<ogra> looks like a massive improvement
 * ogra will monitor it over the rest of the day but getting up and still having a positive value is a good sign
<pitti> it's pure â¥
<baptistemm> hello
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti
<dpm> morning all
<didrocks> hey dpm
<dpm> pitti, I've got a general question on post-release updates and GNOME. Are GNOME .1 releases only packaged and uploaded on a needed basis? I.e. are we going to see some 2.30.1 modules in Lucid?
<dpm> heya didrocks, how are you?
<pitti> dpm: yes, we'll upload some .1 and .2
<pitti> but not all of them
<pitti> dpm: and good morning!
<dpm> pitti, yes, of course, good morning! :)
<dpm> pitti, thanks
<seb128> hello there
<didrocks> hey seb128 ;)
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, how are you?
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<didrocks> I'm fine thanks. Still trying to update my book in the evening and a lot of screens to update :/
<seb128> pitti, guten tag
<pitti> seb128: FYI, the keyring stuff is all sorted and uploaded for final
<seb128> pitti, yeah, I was going to hug you for that one
<seb128> just reading my bug email, Stef replied to me yesterday
<pitti> yes, to me too
<seb128> I'm out of internet for some days though so didn't read the reply yesterday
<pitti> seb128: oh, your internet connection is broken?
<pitti> who am I talking to right now then? ;-)
<seb128> changing dsl subscription
<seb128> they cut my line but didn't set the new one
<pitti> eww
<seb128> I'm working from my parents' now
<pitti> 3G for the win?
<pitti> ah, I see
<seb128> going to my parents for the win :p
<seb128> they have nice working dsl and space where I can work
<mvo> seb128: I just ran into a case where on hardy -> lucid gdm would restart (or get restarted by libc6). not fun, debugging now
<seb128> mvo, ok
<chrisccoulson> hello everyone
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hjey didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm fine, thanks, you?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm not too bad, but i've got a headache for the 3rd day in a row :(
<didrocks> urgh, medecines don't help? :/
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson; oh, hope you'll get better soon
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: do you have uber-urgent things to do today? perhaps take off some hours, enjoy the sun for a walk?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i need to start looking at updating firefox in hardy
<pitti> chrisccoulson: still, that certainly can wait until tomorrow?
<huats> morning
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, possibly. i'd like to make a bit of a start today though :)
<chrisccoulson> i'll probably take a long lunch break ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: well, your decision of course; just take care of yourself, please ;)
<didrocks> hey huats
<huats> hello didrocks
 * didrocks -> out for an hour. Have to buy some stuffs :)
<pitti> mmm, stuffs
<didrocks> pitti: birthday present to be precise ;)
<pitti> didrocks: ooh, happy birthday! *hug*
<didrocks> not for me :-)
<pitti> ah, you mean for someone else
 * pitti hugs you anyway
<didrocks> I don't buy present to myself ;)
 * didrocks hugs pitti
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
 * didrocks hugs seb128
<RAOF> Hugs all round!
<pitti> didrocks: I sometimes do
 * pitti hugs seb128 and RAOF, too
 * RAOF hugs all comers
 * didrocks hugs RAOF too
<didrocks> pitti: oh really? well, that's better than bad surprise :)
<pitti> didrocks: well, sometimes I say "I have always wanted this, so let's get it now" :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - can you recreate the gnome-appearance-properties crash? i couldn't recreate it yesterday to test if my patch works
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yes, with the steps I described on the upstream bug, did I give you the upstream bug number?
<seb128> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=614256
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - you did, but i still couldn't make it crash
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ^
<ubottu> Gnome bug 614256 in Appearance "crashes when installing icon themes by dnd" [Normal,New]
<seb128> well let's say it's crash half of the time
<seb128> but I get the valgrind errors almost every time
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm happy to try your patch there
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - please do :) http://paste.ubuntu.com/420307/
<chrisccoulson> i found locking issues in a few places which could cause that crash
<seb128> how did you found those, I'm just being curious on how to debug such issues
<seb128> by reading the code?
<seb128> the game is to have all gtk calls in g_t_e g_t_l section?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, that's basically what you need to do. functions that are triggered from gtk events are already inside the lock though, so it's not as obvious
<seb128> (it's building)
<seb128> pitti, btw about fast-user-switch-applet will you clean it next time you do cleaning there or should I?
<pitti> seb128: oh, please go ahead
<seb128> pitti, ok
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - if the patch doesn't work, i've found something else to try too
<seb128> chrisccoulson, it's rather than the bug doesn't work now
<chrisccoulson> heh ;)
<seb128> I've no crash on error
<seb128> *shrug*, it's always like that when you want to test a change
<chrisccoulson> i'll try a bit more here and see if i can make it crash
<seb128> I'm building the upstream tarball now just to see if I get it again with this one
<seb128> when I opened the bug GNOME bug I was getting the error every time and the crash every second time without valgrind
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, sorry but I don't get the bug now
<seb128> I didn't get it either previous cycles when I tried
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - ok, no worries
<seb128> it must depends of the lune phases or something
<seb128> chrisccoulson, still add your patch to the upstream bug, let get it in .1 if we can and in the first sru round and see if that works for users
<vish> seb128: hi.. i think the Bug #493762 was confused for Bug #403691 , 493762 is about the shortcuts in the menu dropdown the "Crtl+A" and those shortcuts... which upstream is implementing in clearlooks , hylke just closed upstream bug since gtk devs didnt like the idea
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 493762 in hundredpapercuts "Hide or deemphasize shortcut keys in menus" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/493762
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 403691 in hundredpapercuts "Underline under accelerator characters in buttons and menu bar should only show when Alt is pressed" [Low,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/403691
<seb128> vish, ok if you say so, I don't really see the point or care to be honest but if gtk guys said they would not do the change we will not change gtk either
<vish> seb128: yup , i was asking before i can mark it invalid instead ;)
<seb128> vish, do whatever you think is correct with the bug ;-)
<vish> thanks :)
<seb128> pitti, I've subscribed you to some gdm locale issues cf LANGUAGE being set because I think you have a clue about that, feel free to ignore those bugs if you don't though
<pitti> seb128: thanks, I'll have a look
<seb128> pitti, + one crasher svu reported in one of your xkb changes we will want to fix in a sru I think
<seb128> pitti, but not hurry for those anyway it's sru material not for lucid now
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<desrt> *yawn* good morning
<seb128> hey desrt!
<desrt> seb128: how's the cycle turning out?
<desrt> describe your current state of mind:
<desrt>  [ ] relaxed
<desrt>  [ ] average
<desrt>  [ ] omg!
<seb128> lol
<james_w>  [ ] all of the above
<desrt> lol was not an option :p
<seb128> I think it's mostly relaxed now ;-)
<desrt> oh.  that's good news for this cycle, then :)
<seb128> lucid seems mostly good
<desrt> really happy to hear that
<seb128> still some issues and will be better after some GNOME stable updates and sru updates
<seb128> but it's a decent shape
<desrt> so i may as well install the release candidate on production machines and just upgrade it when the real one is available?
<seb128> yes
<desrt> awesome
 * desrt finds himself more in [x] omg territory
<desrt> seb128: i think you were a little bit too negative about all-of-gnome-porting-to-GSettings
<desrt> because judging by the volume of bugs that i'm currently receiving, it feels like that's pretty much what's happening :p
<seb128> desrt, you mean too many people doing porting before the thing has settled? ;-)
<desrt> i just like to think of it as lots of people porting :)
<desrt> the settling won't change much
<desrt> backend api only, really
<seb128> ok, happy to do that
<seb128> I didn't have too much doubt on people being active on porting btw
<didrocks> desrt: so, for people waiting to port the backend, they should still wait a little? (looking at the desktopcouch backend)
<desrt> didrocks: yes.  definitely.
<seb128> I just say there is lot to port and some things will be less trivial and doing everything will let little time for debugging
<desrt> didrocks: but uh.. it doesn't really work like that?
<desrt> you should really not be writing a backend almost ever
<desrt> at least not for the purposes of storing user settings
<desrt> seb128: oh btw... about the login settings and default settings and stuff
<desrt> g_settings_new_with_context (..., "login-screen");
<desrt> or "defaults"
<didrocks> desrt: well, rodrigo seemed to be interested (see d-d-l)
<rickspencer3> good morning all
<desrt> hi rick
<rickspencer3> pitti, RC today?
<rickspencer3> hi desrt
<pitti> good morning rickspencer3
<pitti> rickspencer3: yes, looks good; all but one test case done
<rickspencer3> good afternoon pitti
<rickspencer3> pitti, nice
<pitti> and unapproved is huge, time to review/flush it :)
<rickspencer3> pitti, GEM Leak?
<pitti> rickspencer3: not uploaded yet, but testing feedback is very promising
<rickspencer3> good
<pitti> some 20 people have tested, and there was only one problem reported by lool which is under investigation
<rickspencer3> did anyone figure out Keybuk's issue?
<pitti> ?
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi seb128
<seb128> keybuk's issue?
<seb128> we are not on the same timezone that you guys, dunno about this one
<rickspencer3> Keybuk was having hideous memory leak and even a freeze
<rickspencer3> with his i965
<seb128> k, same card there works just great
<rickspencer3> which is quite odd
<rickspencer3> seb128, right, same with me
<ogra> seb128, there are different revs of the 965
 * ogra has a rev 03 for example
<seb128> ogra, right
<seb128> ogra, I was just pointing it's not happening for every intel 965 users
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> surely not for me
<didrocks> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> rickspencer3: you mean with ~xup2?
<rickspencer3> Hiya didrocks
<rickspencer3> pitti, er
<rickspencer3> I mean Keybuk installed the PPA, and reports that after that he still has memory leaks, and instability on top of that
<pitti> darn
<rickspencer3> I asked RAOF to try to get to the bottom of it yesterday, but not sure what the status is
<seb128> he got a fixed patch uploaded to the ppa apparently but I guess that's sru material for after lucid?
<rickspencer3> pitti, did you see that RAOF has also fixed the leak in the patches?
<rickspencer3> seb128, right
<pitti> rickspencer3: I did
<pitti> I already hugged him for that :)
<rickspencer3> I'm thinking that rolling back for release is the safest bet, but then we have RAOF's fix that we can SRU if needed
<seb128> rickspencer3, did keybuk reboot or just restarted xorg?
<rickspencer3> (assuming Keybuck's issue is a fluke)
<rickspencer3> seb128, dunno
<seb128> it's a bit hard to have an opinion with the informations we have I guess
<rickspencer3> yes
<rickspencer3> since RAOF didn't mention Keybuk's issue in his status mail, I am going to be hopefully optimistic ;)
<kenvandine> i haven't seen any stability issues and my laptop hasn't gotten slower :)
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, are you also i956?
<kenvandine> no
<kenvandine> GM45 and 945GME
<kenvandine> i hadn't noticed it on my netbook actually
<kenvandine> but my laptop was noticable
<didrocks> james_w: for the issue of having debian/ directory removed at first merge-upstream use, do you prefer existing branch or command to create them? (I've just done a short testcase)
<james_w> didrocks: I don't mind
<seb128> pitti, you are sure there is nothing in the xorg stack still use libhal for device detection?
<didrocks> james_w: ok, filling a bug report now with a testcase so
<seb128> bug #558451 collects quite some duplicates, most happening on usb devices disconnection
<james_w> if you have minimal commands that is usually more useful
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 558451 in gdm "gdm-session-worker crashed with SIGSEGV in filter_func()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/558451
<james_w> but knowing real branches can be useful for actually testing that you fixed the whole problem :-)
<pitti> seb128: pretty sure, yes; why?
<pitti> seb128: perhaps libgnomevfs sets up some monitoring by itself?
<seb128> pitti, "why" -> because I don't like gdm crashing it means you loose the running sessions so I would like to figure what is going there but I don't read much from the stacktrace
<pitti> seb128: right, I know that "why" :)
<pitti> seb128: I didn't see your next IRC comment when I asked
<seb128> ok ;-)
<pitti> gdm has no hal code whatsoever
<pitti> sudo dpkg -P libhal1 -> that's just 5 remaining deps on my system
<seb128> pitti, I'm wondering if we can consider that there is 2 issues there, one being libhal being used for some reason, one being that it crashes
<pitti> libgnomevfs2-0, libgnome-pilot2, gimp, and hal itself
<seb128> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/43235039/gdb-gdm-session-worker.txt
<pitti> seb128: the first is quite clear though -- gdm needs to stop using libgnome
<seb128> pitti,
<seb128> $ ldd /usr/lib/gdm/gdm-session-worker | grep libgnome
<seb128> $
<pitti> it doesn't look like a call, but like a dbus signal callback?
<seb128> pitti, right, my gut feeling is that the issue is with something xorg input detection code
<seb128> "gdm crashed while installing virtualbox-ose packages"
<seb128> is the description on this bug
<seb128> virtualbox-ose?
<pitti> seb128: hm, g-s-w doesn't link against hal either
<pitti> weird
<pitti> how could it ever crash in libhal then?
<pitti> seb128: sorry, have a confcall now, bbl
<seb128> as said the stacktrace makes no sense to me
<seb128> pitti, no need to be sorry, thanks for the quick chat that was useful ;-)
<pitti> ok, so it's a mystery
<seb128> I will try to see if there is a common pattern between those bugs
<seb128> like using all virtualbox or something
<chrisccoulson> seb128 / pitti - it is pam_usb.so which is using HAL
<chrisccoulson> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/43439314/ProcMaps.txt
<seb128> chrisccoulson, what would we do without you
<chrisccoulson> (i don't even have that on my system)
<chrisccoulson> heh ;)
<seb128> me neither
<seb128> libpam-usb
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that does seem to pull in libhal1
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks, reassigning there
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks a lot ;-)
<didrocks> james_w: bug #568440, tell me if I need to push a branch or not :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 568440 in udd "First merge-upstream command try to remove debian/ directory in previously merging branch" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/568440
<james_w> didrocks: thanks, I'll take a look
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - you're welcome :)
<james_w> didrocks: that should be sufficient for investigation, thanks. And sorry for not believing you :-
<james_w> )
<didrocks> james_w: no pb, sorry for being so long to give you a good and easy testcase :)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, is there any way of telling an application at runtime to load its gtkbuilder UI files from somewhere else?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I think g-c-c has hacks for that
<seb128>     if (g_file_test (GNOMECC_UI_DIR "/gnome-default-applications-properties.ui", G_FILE_TEST_EXISTS) != FALSE) {
<seb128>         builder_result = gtk_builder_add_from_file (builder, GNOMECC_UI_DIR "/gnome-default-applications-properties.ui", NULL);
<seb128>     }
<seb128>     else {
<seb128>         builder_result = gtk_builder_add_from_file (builder, "./gnome-default-applications-properties.ui", NULL);
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ^
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks, will look at that
<seb128> I guess if that's for local hacking you can just hack the gtk_builder_add_from_file call
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i think hacking the gtk_builder_add_from_file call will be easiest for now
<chrisccoulson> cool, my locking changes don'e seem to have broken anything anyway
<pitti> re
<pitti> chrisccoulson: pam_usb??
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti
<pitti> ok, that explains it, thanks a lot!
<pitti> sounds like a cool package, but hal??
<Nafai> Good morning #ubuntu-desktop!
<kenvandine> hey nafa
<kenvandine> hey Nafai
<qense> I got a bug report against Nautilus Actions complaining that you cannot press "Choose" if you want to pick the directory you're currently in. Is that an issue with the way nautilus-actions uses the file chooser, or is it a problem with the file chooser?
<seb128> qense, what ubuntu version?
<seb128> qense, this issue should be fixed in lucid gtk
<qense> seb128: lucid, nautilus-actions is 2.30.2
<seb128> ok so I don't know
<seb128> it works now in file-roller for example
<seb128> would need a code example to know about your particular case
<seb128> Nafai, kenvandine: hey
<qense> All I can give you is the bug number: bug 568014
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 568014 in nautilus-actions "nautilus actions: Issues with the export assistant" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/568014
<qense> I'll take a look in the code myself.
<Nafai> Hi kenvandine, seb128
<seb128> qense, ok thanks
<didrocks> hey kenvandine, Nafai
<qense> seb128: The file chooser is defined in the UI file at <http://git.gnome.org/browse/nautilus-actions/tree/src/nact/nact-assistant-export.ui>, if you're interested. I read <http://git.gnome.org/browse/nautilus-actions/tree/src/nact/nact-assistant-export.c> quickly and it seems that the code only searches the selection.
<didrocks> pitti: now that RC is out, do we consider the poppler change for final or as an SRU?
<pitti> didrocks: "the poppler change"?
<didrocks> pitti: we discussed it at the beginning of the week: bug #33288
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 33288 in poppler "Evince doesn't handle columns properly" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/33288
<seb128> didrocks, sru
<seb128> it doesn't seem anything important for lucid CDs and is non trivial change
<didrocks> seb128: ok, I'll push it to -proposed
<seb128> it requires testing and not rushing
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> thanks :)
<pitti> didrocks: ugh, http://launchpadlibrarian.net/39815138/rough_poppler_0.12.4-0ubuntu1.1.debdiff ?
<pitti> didrocks: yes, SRU please
<pitti> wow, a 5-digit bug
<didrocks> pitti: I've a slightely different version that I backed out some days before (see comments), but yeah, it's quite huge
<didrocks> and yeah, closing a 5-digit bug is good for the mind :)
<chrisccoulson> mclasen - there?
<seb128> pitti, bug #559847, do you think it's worth getting in your gdm sru if you get the other xsession include change too?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 559847 in gdm "Please support /etc/X11/Xreset.d" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/559847
<didrocks> Xreset.d?
<pitti> seb128: looks easy enough, although it smells a bit FFish
<seb128> didrocks, read the bug?
<didrocks> seb128: reading, but LP was slow to draw the page :)
<didrocks> didn't know about that trick :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I think you should just add your patch upstream with the open question, mclasen doesn't maintain g-c-c anyway so he will probably not decide on it
<seb128> I'm not sure why it could not been done in an g_idle though
<seb128> seems easier to do that fighting with getting lock right
<jcastro> seb128, kenvandine: sometime early in M can we have someone look at the original Tomboy patch for app indicators and make sure it works, clean it up, etc. I would like to resubmit that upstream early.
<jcastro> qense, you might be interested in this ^^
<seb128> jcastro, sure, seems a job for whoever worked on the change or talked to upstream, who was that?
<kenvandine> jcastro, yeah... I think it is more up to the DX guys
<jcastro> seb128, DBO iirc.
<kenvandine> jcastro, like supporting the pins?
<kenvandine> yeah, DBO did it
<jcastro> but maybe qense might be able to help?
<kenvandine> i worked on it too
<jcastro> this would make him 3 for 3!
<kenvandine> jcastro, wasn't the hold up supporting the pins?
<qense> jcastro: It sounds like a good idea to make the applications that couldn't use the indicators this cycle use it very early in the Maverick cycle so we can improve them and get them perfect.
<qense> kenvandine, jcastro: indeed it was
<seb128> kenvandine, I doubt dxteam will have time for application changes though
<jcastro> kenvandine, also, I talked to sandy and he's cool with us putting it in maverick as is so we can try it.
<kenvandine> seb128, but to support some notion of pinning
<jcastro> qense, yep
<seb128> kenvandine, they will be busy enough on the stack and on the new indicators
<kenvandine> seb128, ido will need changes
<seb128> right, that's the stack
<kenvandine> seb128, indeed... but this might be related
<jcastro> kenvandine, what I was thinking is get it in very early, and then see how we feel about the non-pins.
<kenvandine> we need to find out their plans
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i'll add the patch that i have so far, but i could probably keep going forever ;)
<kenvandine> jcastro, i am actually ok without the pins :)
<seb128> well jcastro seems to want to get what we had re-submitted
<qense> I could help with Tomboy, I'm one of the few people that ever worked with the C# bindings for AppInd, so I've got some experience.
<seb128> not to get pins done
<chrisccoulson> the IO is done in a thread so the UI stays responsive
<chrisccoulson> but it's weird that the progress dialog is updated from the IO thread
<chrisccoulson> anyway, i'll put that to one side for now
<seb128> chrisccoulson, right
<jcastro> kenvandine, right, I am ok without the pins too. If we get it in early we'll know for sure if we care about pins or not.
<seb128> chrisccoulson, seems reasonable, thanks for looking at it
<qense> Aren't the pins just checkboxes with a fancy icon?
<kenvandine> jcastro, but didn't sandy say he wouldn't take the patch without it?
<kenvandine> qense, essentially, yes
<jcastro> kenvandine, all we need to ensure is that it falls back for systems without the app indicators
 * Nafai is a smart alec: http://twitter.com/travisbhartwell/status/12647279520
<jcastro> kenvandine, initially, but this is my second try
<kenvandine> Nafai, long walk :)
<qense> jcastro: For that I would have to get the fallbacks working properly in C#.
<Nafai> kenvandine: indeed :)
<kenvandine> jcastro, ok, well i am fine with getting it back into M :)
<chrisccoulson> lol @ Nafai
<jcastro> kenvandine, and what I want to say is "ken and I thought we would miss the pins, but you know what, it's so much better this way."
<qense> That could get tricky, but I've still got a branch somewhere on my system with a start of a fix for that.
<jcastro> kenvandine, good with the bad, etc.
<kenvandine> jcastro, indeed... at first i was annoyed without the pins
<jcastro> qense, ok, so for M we need to prioritize c# fallbacks. We'll bring that up at UDS.
<kenvandine> brb... i am trying to figure out why suspend isn't working here... sick of not being able to sleep the laptop!
<jcastro> kenvandine, if it ends up everyone misses the pins then we just go back to lucid behavior. I want to try though.
<qense> jcastro: There are two problems: GAPI in the current GTK# is incomplete, lacking the essential virtual method support, and the way the library swaps strings and enums around breaks the bindings.
<jcastro> and if people love the pins it will force us to look at other ways of solving Tomboy's problem
<qense> jcastro: Would using checkboxes instead of the pins be acceptable?
<jcastro> I think we should holistically look at the entire workflow for using tomboy
<qense> I would find that a bit unclear.
<seb128> kenvandine, what laptop model do you have?
<qense> We could, but isn't the way Tomboy works more something for the Tomboy team? ;)
<jcastro> qense, yeah but we can help them there I think.
<seb128> kenvandine, dell studio?
<jcastro> qense, the onus will be on me to communicate that with sandy.
<qense> jcastro: Fortunately you're good at communicating with upstreams -- you've already infiltrated the GNOME board! -- so that'll probably work out just fine.
<qense> I just don't think we should spend talking half the AppInd session about Tomboy. :)
<arand> didrocks: In the debdiff for Bug #33288 there's a lot of comment gtk-doc version changes, since not mentioned in the changelog, is that proper for a SRU?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 33288 in poppler "Evince doesn't handle columns properly" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/33288
<didrocks> arand: hum, let me check, maybe building the package generated it without I noticed
<didrocks> arand: argh, bummer, building the package build the doc and the clean rule doesn't clean it
<didrocks> so, reject the package to -proposed so that I can reupload a clean one
<arand> didrocks: Um, I'm not an SRU/reviewer.
<arand> didrocks: Just peeked at the debdiff since I follow the bug (the earlier proposed debdiffs were mine).
<didrocks> arand: oh ok, and you cleaned the gtk-doc each time? that should be something we fix in debian/rules itself and see if upstream can ship and uptodate doc package. Well in any case, fixing it now
<arand> didrocks: I don't think I did anything in particular, I did the patches (many in my case), dch -i and debuild -S...
<didrocks> arand: yeah, but you didn't debuild (without -S) to build it, right?
<arand> didrocks: Nope, I tested that in pbuilder... Hmm let's see...
<seb128> didrocks, I tend to not double build things but build, rm and dpkg-source -x
<seb128> didrocks, you often get noise in the diff.gz otherwise
<seb128> didrocks, or get the debian dir in bzr and bzr-buildpackage ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: oh, really? so, even for anything not in bzr, you debuild, copy your change elsewhere ; rm ; push back your changes and debuild -S ?
<arand> didrocks: what pbuilder spat out seems to also have nothing but the changelog and patch in the debdiff..
<seb128> didrocks, why copying?
<seb128> didrocks, debuild does create the diff.gz and .dsc
<seb128> didrocks, I just dpkg-source -x *.dsc
<seb128> rm and dpkg-source
<didrocks> seb128: oh ok, I'm so used to debuild -S :)
<didrocks> arand: well, strange, maybe it's conditionnaly triggered if you have gnome-doc-utils or gtk-doc-tools as I've on my laptop
<seb128> didrocks, I agree that non buggy clean target is better though so feel free to fix such bugs ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I added that on my TODO :)
<didrocks> seb128: can you reject a package from -proposed so that I can upload a clean one,
<didrocks> ?
<seb128> didrocks, I prefer to let the sru team do that
<seb128> well I probably can yes, let me have a look
<didrocks> so that I can repush without annoying more people :)
<seb128> didrocks, done, let me know if you receive the rejected email
<didrocks> seb128: I confirm you have the power :)
<didrocks> seb128: rock, pushing the new one now. rock ;)
<didrocks> arand: thanks for the notice!
<arand> didrocks: Glad to help :)
<arand> didrocks: btw, I tried installing t pbuilder spat out seems to also have nothing but
<didrocks> arand: "it" being gtk-doc-tools and gnome-doc-utils?
<arand> didrocks: btw, I tried installing gtk-doc-tools, and from the debuild -S I still seem to get a clean debdiff...
<arand> Yea, misspaste there, bothering that middle-mouse-paste doesn't work through virtual machines...
<didrocks> arand: yeah, as told previously, I runned debuild first
<didrocks> (not debuild -S)
<arand> didrocks: ah, right, yea, misread that...
<fredp> tedg: hi! I was reading the lwn article on appindicators (<http://lwn.net/Articles/384274/>) and was reminded of <http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2010-February/msg00051.html>, did you get feedback from gnome-shell developers?  (the thing is the release team meets in ~2 weeks and that's most certainly a blocker, so any update would be welcomed)
<tedg> fredp: Nope, they've been silent on the issue.
<fredp> (mmm, not really a surprise), so I think you should engage them into a discussion, I don't know of difficult would be to add a proof of concept "appindicator area" in javascript, but it sure would be nice.
<fredp> (and I do realize the ubuntu calendar makes it hard to concentrate on this right now :/ )
<kenvandine> seb128, T400
<kenvandine> suspend works from gdm, but not from a logged in session
<kenvandine> it appears to be network related
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> pm-suspend.log  says suspend worked, but the sleep light keeps blinking
<kenvandine> works fine from in gdm though... so it is something that gets setup at login
<kenvandine> apw spent a bunch of time messing with it a while back with no luck
<fredp> tedg: ^^^
<tedg> fredp: Heh, I think that *you* should engage them in a conversation :)
<fredp> tedg: that's politics, and hard :)
 * Nafai lunches a little early today
<tedg> fredp: And it's not a fight I want to have.  I posed it to the desktop list, and then got flamed by every redhat employee on the list.  It's no fun.
<pitti> I'm off for an hour, back later
<mclasen> fredp: in what way do you think it is a blocker ?
<fredp> mclasen: it's a blocker for considering libappindicator as an acceptable external dep.
<mclasen> tedg: you did not get flamed. you got some initial api review, and then you retracted into your cave...
<fredp> and as I see how similar some goals are, in appindicator and gnome-shell status zone, I'd like to see people working together.
<tedg> mclasen: Hmm, I guess we have different impressions of what happened then.  Perhaps it depends on which side you were on.
<mclasen> tedg: might well be. in either case, it is pretty clear by now that you are intent on doing your own thing...
<tedg> mclasen: Sure, whatever.  The way it was setup is that by doing nothing, it would be rejected.  So of course, nothing was done.  Which would always be the case when that's how the decisions was set up.
<mclasen> tedg: you mean you set it up that way by not following up  ?
<mclasen> thats certainly the impression I got...
<fredp> bye.
<tedg> mclasen: What e-mail wasn't followed up on?  The only question was to use GtkActions, which I'm perfectly happy to do, and said as much.
<tedg> mclasen: But, at the time, is also after API freeze...
 * kenvandine -> lunch
<pitti> re
 * didrocks goes off after dinner, Julie's birthday anniversary, don't want to work this evening :)
<pitti> seb128: http://ddebs.ubuntu.com/pool/main/g/glib2.0/ *grin*
<seb128> didrocks, enjoy!
<didrocks> seb128: thanks (yeah, still triaging bug mails ;))
<seb128> didrocks, joyeux anniversaire de ma part Ã©galement
<seb128> pitti, don't go to oem, we need you there ;-)
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<didrocks> seb128: je transmets, elle te dit "merci mÃªme si je te connais pas" :)
<didrocks> (x2) ;)
<seb128> lol
 * pitti hugs back seb128 and bows to the new tech lead
<seb128> I still have to figure if that techlead thing is good curse ;-)
<Nafai> yawns
<bryceh> Nafai, morning
<Nafai> Hey :)  Afternoon here.  Just woke up from my customary lunch-time nap.  Wish I would stop having insomnia at night
<pitti> good night everyone
<seb128> you too pitti!
<seb128> pedro_, hey
<pedro_> seb128, hey hey
<seb128> pedro_, btw fast-user-switch-applet got dropped from lucid since it doesn't work with the new gdm and is replaced by the gdm one and indicator-session
<seb128> pedro_, not sure if you have tools to clean bugs on such cases or just let those open in launchpad
<pedro_> seb128, ok, well ~70 bugs open is not too much so i'll clean that. Better to give a response to the reporters instead of leaving those just laying around
<pedro_> seb128, thanks for the info ;-)
<seb128> pedro_, you're welcome, thanks
<dobey> hey seb
<seb128> hey dobey
<dobey> seb128: can you answer anything about dev membership application process, or should i find someone else to bug?
<seb128> dobey, you should better try with dholbach or persia I guess
<dobey> seb128: ok, thanks
<seb128> I've not been following what happens there closely
<seb128> np
<dobey> ok. i know there were some changes to the process, and reading the wiki is confusing me, so i wanted to poke for some clarification :)
<bryceh> seb128, you moved 566683 to xorg-server but this is not correct
<bryceh> seb128, with kernel modesetting, resolution and output selection is done by the kernel, not X any longer
<bryceh> seb128, so all these types of bugs you should be assigning to linux, not X
<rickspencer3> bryceh, you don't have to sound so happy about that ;)
<bryceh> rickspencer3, heh
<seb128> bryceh, oh ok, thanks for letting me know, I usually try to move those one steps closer from where the issue is but I don't know enough the graphical stack to aim right ;-)
<seb128> bryceh, but noted for next time
<bryceh> seb128, thanks
<seb128> I guess it's the same when people reassign the other way and know xorg and not GNOME
<seb128> they pick a random source ;-)
<bryceh> yeah with our move to KMS, 90% of X issues being reported really are kernel drm bugs, so it seems we've turned into launchpad ping pong players ;-)
<bryceh> seb128, yeah it's true
<seb128> I was a bit happier about bugs being assigned to xorg to be honest :p
<seb128> at least those get replies
<seb128> I never get any reply on the linux bugs I file usually
<seb128> it feels like pushing those to null
<bryceh> I suppose that's kind of a compliment
<seb128> it is ;-)
<bryceh> well I do try to handle even bugs that are kernel bugs if I'm not 100% sure, and then hand them over when there's a patch available
<bryceh> however with how limited our X manpower is, seems better to focus on issues that really are in X components
<seb128> bryceh, oh sure, I just wish the kernel team was responsive on some issues sometime but I guess they have the same manpower issue than every team there
<bryceh> yep
<bryceh> seb128, if it's an issue you think should get prioritization, what I've been doing is ping JFo, which seems to work effectively
<seb128> thanks for the hint, I don't have a specific issue right know but it's good to know ;-)
<bryceh> seb128, I just wish we didn't get so many bug reports in general.  Makes it hard to think.  Some days I feel like I'm just looking at bug report after bug report without finding any that I can actually *do* something about
<bryceh> seb128, btw are you able to convert bug reports into questions in launchpad?  Lately when I've tried it I just get launchpad OOPSes
<seb128> bryceh, I did convert some today yes
<bryceh> hmm
<bryceh> will have to try again
<seb128> I spent 2 days doing bug reading and cleaning now
<bryceh> seb128, have you ever looked into if bugs put to answers actually get adequate follow up?
<seb128> I need a break tomorrow, I will do some sru for a change ;-)
<seb128> bryceh, no, I tend to use the "convert to question" when the bug are "things are not working, can you explain what to do"
<seb128> I've enough bugs I don't follow up on already, I can't be bothered to know if questions get answered or not, would be interesting to know but I can't help triaging those
<bryceh> I don't know if it's the same in gnome, but with X we get a *ton* of bug reports which really aren't high enough quality to be able to work on easily, but are probably really a bug somewhere, but the user needs a lot of handholding in order to make a proper bug report about it.  So I have wondered if sending to answers would accomplish that or if it'd just be dumping the bug
<seb128> I think it's mostly dumping the bug
<bryceh> mm
<seb128> but my view is that if the bug is a common on or an another one if will come as a proper bug soon enough
<bryceh> ok, probably better to just close bugs as invalid then with directions on how to make better bug reports
<seb128> common one
<seb128> we can't deal with every weird issue happening to one user anyway
<bryceh> yeah
<seb128> well closing as invalid tend to create conflicts with some users who don't agree their issue is invalid
<seb128> at least converting to a question avoid that and let a chance for somebody on the answer tracker to pick the case
<seb128> I guess most don't get far but at least some users get help there
<bryceh> hmm, interesting
<bryceh> probably easier for peer-help on gnome bugs than on X though
<bryceh> but might be worth experimenting with
<seb128> well at least you have proper documentation so you can close bugs with an url to how to open a proper bug
<seb128> you = xorg team
 * bryceh nods
<seb128> we should try to get that but it's harder for GNOME, too many different components
<seb128> it's nice that we have ubuntu-bug symptoms now though
<seb128> we can at least close the "I don't get sound" bugs opened on totem or rhythmbox with a "could you run ubuntu-bug audio and open a new bug using it"
<bryceh> seb128, have you found many people use that to report bugs?  I've not seen much evidence X reporters have been using it
<bryceh> ah I see
<bryceh> interesting
<seb128> no, we don't but it's pretty easy to close the bug and tell them to reopen one with the command
<seb128> which will land on the right source with all the useful logs
<seb128> we are using it quite a lot for the storage symptom and it working well
<seb128> it has udisks gvfs udev logs which is often enough to see where it's buggy
<asac> bug 558651
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 558651 in gvfs "gvfs-afc-volume-monitor tries to launch two simultanious events when usb drive inserted" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/558651
<seb128> asac, typically a bug which should be opened using the storage symptom indeed ;-)
<asac> heh
<seb128> I closed it asking for that now
<asac> gvfs-afc-volume-monitor ... where is that?
<seb128> there is no reason the afc backends trigger on those
<seb128> the gvfs backend used for iphone devices
<seb128> I'm wondering if that usb drive has a similar usb id or something
<asac> good question.
<asac> seb128: should that bug be opened when the drive is plugged in?
<seb128> asac, the storage symptom ask you to remove the device then click a button then connect the device
<seb128> asac, and it gets the udev log of what happens when you connect it
<asac> hmm
<asac> lets see
<seb128> it's made of awesome, pitti wrote it ;-)
<seb128> you can pick the first case
<seb128> device not mounting
<seb128> it will provide the logs we need
<asac> lets hope that really gives more info.
<seb128> well it will give udev udisks and gvfs logs for sure
<asac> hmm
<seb128> which will be enough to match the device id to the afc ones
<asac> ok
<asac> seb128: what package is afc stuff in?
<seb128> asac, usbmuxd: /lib/udev/rules.d/85-usbmuxd.rules
<seb128> if you want to see the ids
<asac> seb128: where is the mapping to afc done?
<asac> guess it just matches two rules and hence we get that dialog?
<seb128> asac, see the rules I just copied
<seb128> well an usb device should not considered by the afc backend at all
<seb128> the udev rules set USBMUX_SUPPORTED for devices which match
<seb128> and gvfs use that to say it's an iphone like device and mount it with afc
<seb128> you might get 2 events yes
<seb128> or you might get one player and one camera mount
<seb128> since iphone have both a multimedia player and a camera
<asac> hmm.
<asac> the bug says it "fails due to pending operation" ... then "two nautilus windows open"
<seb128> asac, the afc backend should be ignore that device to start
<seb128> be ignoring
<seb128> asac, so I would want to look first at why it doesn't
<seb128> asac, I would not be surprised that it does timeout because it init an afc device dialog and your device is not one and doesn't reply
<asac> seb128: i still dont see where and how that backend is hooked up. the .rules only calls usbmuxd
<seb128> asac, gvfs monitors connecteds devices
<seb128> asac, and route those through the volume monitor, gphoto monitor or afc monitor according to the type of device
<seb128> asac, the afc backend should only kick in if the USBMUX_SUPPORTED property is set in udev
<asac> seb128: afc stands for?
<seb128> asac, I'm not sure, apple something
<seb128> asac, "Apple File Communication Protocol (AFC). " says google
<seb128> asac, it's the protocol they set up for iphones
<seb128> asac, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Filing_Protocol
<seb128> asac, hum, maybe not that wikipedia page no ;-)
<bryceh> seb128, huh, still getting lp oopses on trying to convert bugs to questions
<seb128> bryceh, do you have a bug example? does it depends of the text you put in the entry when converting?
<james_w> what's the oops number?
<bryceh> sorry, I cleared it already
 * bryceh tries again
<bryceh> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-ati/+bug/568111/+create-question
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 568111 in xserver-xorg-video-ati "Xorg freeze dell vostro 1000 lucid daily build ATI Radeon Xpress 200" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<bryceh>  (Error ID: OOPS-1573EC1257)
<ubottu> https://lp-oops.canonical.com/oops.py/?oopsid=1573EC1257
<seb128> bryceh, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-ati/+bug/568111
<seb128> worked for me
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 568111 in xserver-xorg-video-ati "Xorg freeze dell vostro 1000 lucid daily build ATI Radeon Xpress 200" [Undecided,Invalid]
<seb128> bryceh, could depend of the text you enter maybe? I didn't put any there
<james_w> looks like some inefficient SQL that makes a lot of queries and so could well be a non-deterministic timeout depending on the cumulative time
<TheMuso> Good morning.
<Nafai> Morning TheMuso
<RAOF> Good morning gentlemen
<Nafai> Hey RAOF
<RAOF> I appear to have managed to use up my brother's internet bandwidth allocation :(
 * RAOF hugs the unshaped mirror.internode.on.net
<Nafai> uh oh
<Nafai> I can't imagine having to worry about a bandwidth allocation
<bryceh> aha
<bryceh> seb128, yeah if I give no text it goes to a question
<bryceh> *sigh*
 * bryceh wanders off to file a launchpad bug report
<RAOF> I generally purchase a plan sufficient for my needs :)
<RAOF> bryceh: Good morning.
<bryceh> hi RAOF, how goes?
<RAOF> Apart from this internet now being sloooooow, well.
<TheMuso> Nafai: Thats how it has been for many years in Australia.
<Nafai> So I hear
<RAOF> Now that I've sucked Alexander's internet dry, I guess I'll be working somewhere else today.  My internet gets turned on Tuesday.
<TheMuso> RAOF: he probably hates you right about now.
<TheMuso> :)
<RAOF> He didn't even have a working computer this month!
<RAOF> But I have managed to get him capped just as the fixed computer arrives, so yes.  It's only 3 days until rollover date, though.
<RAOF> He can suck it up!
<TheMuso> Thats not too bad.
<TheMuso> If he is on a new plan, the shaping is 128kbps now anyway.
<Nafai> up or down?
<TheMuso> Nafai: down
<Nafai> man, I'm spoiled, I guess
<TheMuso> Nafai: We are a fair way away from the rest of the western world, and need to pay for our pipes somehow.
<Nafai> true
<TheMuso> Nafai: There are many people in Australia 8who can barely get any form of broadband at all.
<TheMuso> Wireless is their only option, which is not cheap, and quotas are pittifully small.
<Nafai> I've got this "Internet World" poster above my desktop, showing major connections between cities, and the one between Sydney (I guess) and the US is a huge arc
<TheMuso> heh
<RAOF> That's a cool picture
<TheMuso> We recently had another pipe between Australia and Guam come online, however the company who funded it is now owned by I think our forth largest ISP's parent company.
<TheMuso> So its likely it will be reserved for that ISP's customers.
<TheMuso> and will cost more for other ISPs to use it.
<Nafai> of course
<Nafai> telestra?  I think that's the one I've seen aussies complain about :)
<TheMuso> Telstra, yes.
<TheMuso> My dealings with them have been quite ok actually. As long as you don't have to speak to anyone on the phone, they have reliable infrastructure.
<TheMuso> brb got to hang out some washing (laundry for you overseas folks.)
<rickspencer3> Hi RAOF
<rickspencer3> TheMuso,
<rickspencer3> Nafa
<rickspencer3> Nafai, even
<Nafai> hey :)
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Good morning
<rickspencer3> I kind of think of you guys + robert_ancell as the "afternoon people" now
<rickspencer3> RAOF, pitti wanted to roll back glx before release, right?
<rickspencer3> not wait for an SRU
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-04-23
<RAOF> My mail's still downloading (see above discussion about internet caps) so I might not be entirely up to date, but yes.  Roll-back post RC.
<rickspencer3> hehe
<RAOF> C'mon internode.  Process that âPlease give me more bandwidthâ paymentâ¦
<TheMuso> It takes up to 90 minutes to do it afaik.
<RAOF> TheMuso: Yeah.
<TheMuso> RAOF: you should have speed again... :p
<bryceh> pitti, glx revert xserver package is uploaded for your review
<bryceh> pitti, I have a few other severe xserver bug fixes, but I decided not to include them in this upload so we could focus on getting this one in asap
<bryceh> pitti, for the others, I'm still waiting on a few test results but the fixes look worth including as SRUs at least
<bryceh> pitti, if you'd like me to include the fixes together with this upload, let me know and I'll rejigger them in
<bryceh> (the other two bugs are 539772 and 553647)
<jjardon> Hello! Can everyone add new blueprints for maverick?
<jjardon> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/?searchtext=desktop-maverick
<RAOF> I'm off to collect the keys to our new home! (and have lunch ;)).
<TheMuso> RAOF: have fun.
<TheMuso> c
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> Good morning!
<pitti> bryceh, RAOF: ah, I was going to start a discussion about rolling back vs. RAOF's patch now, but seems you guys beat me to it :) my gut feeling is that we should upload the rollback to final and RAOF's real fix to -proposed; WDYT?
<pitti> bryceh: two bugs> hm, there's zero margin for error now, so I'd rather have them in the first SRU upload (which will be pretty early, I figure?)
<RAOF> I think that's the right idea; the rollback is safer and we want to be really sure about the fix, because if it's incomplete it'll mean X crashes.
<pitti> RAOF: oh, new home?
<RAOF> pitti: Yah!
<pitti> RAOF: agreed, thanks
<pitti> new release, new house, that fits!
<pitti> bryceh: I added a lucid task to 553647
<RAOF> Our first very own house.  It'll be awesome.
<pitti> bryceh: your X upload also included bug 519049; how sure are you about this?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 519049 in xorg-server ""xauth generate" with large timeout triggers assertion" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/519049
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> hey didrocks
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti, how are you?
<pitti> didrocks: tres bien, merci! et toi?
<didrocks> pitti: very good French. Sorry that I can't do the same in German ;) I'm fine, thanks!
<seb128> hey hey there
<pitti> bonjour Monsieur Bacher!
<seb128> pitti, guten tag!
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, bonne soirÃ©e ?
<didrocks> seb128: Ã§a va, c'Ã©tait sympa merci! :)
 * seb128 has slept well and ready for a good work day
<didrocks> seb128: et toi?
<seb128> nickel
<didrocks> heh
<didrocks> ubuntuone synchronize nothing hereâ¦ u1sdtool hangs too. Let's hop logout/login will fix thisâ¦
<didrocks> (having the same thing on my netbook isn't a very good sign)
<huats> Hello everyone
<vish> seb128: hi.. could we get an update for Humanity , it seems broken for kde users Bug #566996 , the symlinks are causing a problem there
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 566996 in humanity-icon-theme "Humanity in KDE does not display volume icons." [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/566996
<vish> SRU update rather ;)
<qense> hyperair, seb128: Thank you for the fix for Indicator Application. It has finally landed today!
<hyperair> \o/
<hyperair> finally!
<seb128> qense, np, thanks the people who did the work I just uploaded ;-)
<pitti> ccheney: wrt. https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-openoffice, there's a WI for "check status of OpenOffice.org translations:
<pitti> ccheney: is that still actually relevant?
<pitti> didrocks: is the remaining task on https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-quickly still relevant?
<pitti> didrocks: also, would you mind having a look at https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-quickly-templates and either dropping the WIs there or moving them to a maverick spec?
<milanbv> what's the way to get a bugfix release uploaded, now that we're in freeze? waiting for a SRU after Lucid is out?
<milanbv> (that's for system-tools-backends 2.10.0, fixing a few crashers and bad bugs)
<pitti> chrisccoulson_, asac: bug 443147 is marked for final, is that still realistic? or should we move to SRU?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 443147 in firefox "Firefox on ARM inappropriately adds scroll bars to many frames and images" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/443147
<chrisccoulson_> pitti - there is a workaround already in bzr, but i wasn't planning to do another upload before the 3.6.4 release in May (the lucid branch is already tracking the 3.6.4 update)
<chrisccoulson_> i don't know if asac wants to upload that before final though
<pitti> chrisccoulson_: ok, let's wait for him to answer then; thanks!
<didrocks> pitti: sorry, was eating :) All my WI are finished. I'll put rick's ones to DROP
<pitti> didrocks: were were also some from Shane?
<didrocks> pitti: right, updating the status for him too
<didrocks> DROPPED is valid, right?
<pitti> didrocks: thanks; yes, DROPPED is the new preferred status name for "dropped, not moved"
<didrocks> ok, thanks :)
<pitti> Riddell: would you mind updating https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus for Kubuntu? Thanks!
<Riddell> pitti: will do
<asac> chrisccoulson_: i asked you to upload a cherry-pick
<asac> just wasnt sure something else should be there
<asac> please go ahead
<chrisccoulson_> asac - ok, i can do that. the only issue is though that the lucid branch is already updated to 3.6.4
<asac> chrisccoulson_: right thtas why cherry-pick
<asac> branch last upload
<asac> cherry pick my commit
<asac> release
<asac> merge that branch into the .head again
<chrisccoulson_> asac - ok, i will do that this afternoon. did you see my other question in #ubuntu-mozillateam earlier? i have a fix for the hardy dailies to push, and wasn't sure if i have to start a new version number in the changelog now (i assume that the answer is yes)
<asac> chrisccoulson_: where would you commit that to?
<asac> to .head? or do we have stable branches?
<chrisccoulson_> asac - to .head for now. the only stable branch for 3.6 currently is lucid
<chrisccoulson_> (and that would fix the dailies wouldn't it?)
<asac> chrisccoulson_: yes. the top most commit is stil UNRELEASED? then just commit there
<asac> chrisccoulson_: just dont include it in the cherry pick release for the armel issue
<asac> chrisccoulson_: i think we should get the armel fix up asap ... btw. otherwise slangasek will be really unhappy
<chrisccoulson_> asac - that was the issue. the last commit changed it from UNRELEASED to lucid, and i wasn't sure if that was intentional or not (and if i need to start a new version number to push my commit)
<asac> chrisccoulson_: i did that?
<asac> wow
<chrisccoulson_> asac - you did ;)
<asac> thats a bug ... just flip back to UNRELEASED on next commit ;)
<asac> i didnt do a release commit i hope ;)
<chrisccoulson_> asac - i was thinking about that, then i remembered what you said about the dailies breaking ;)
<asac> no thats fine
<chrisccoulson_> so i wasn't sure if i'd break them
<asac> just UNRELEASED ... all should be ok
<chrisccoulson_> ok, i'll flip it back to UNRELEASED then
<chrisccoulson_> thanks
<asac> great
<kenvandine> pitti, can you think of anything in a gnome session that might be preventing my laptop from suspending?
<kenvandine> i can suspend from gdm, and from logged into kde
<kenvandine> but not logged into gnome
<pitti> does it lock screen?
<kenvandine> and tested with a new user and with a reinstall
<kenvandine> lock screen works..
<kenvandine> the symptom is this
<pitti> gnome-session has a concept of "inhibiting suspend", yes
<kenvandine> it turns on the blinking sleep light
<pitti> chrisccoulson_: ^ I think you know much more about thsi
<kenvandine> and everything appears to go to sleep
<kenvandine> but the display goes black but doesn't really turn off
<kenvandine> and it never goes to a full sleep
<pitti> kenvandine: do you get any error in /var/log/pm-suspend.log?
<kenvandine> the pm-suspend.log makes it look like sleep completed
<chrisccoulson_> hmmm, if something is inhibiting suspend, then gnome-session will show a dialog
<kenvandine> a while back apw spent hours on this thing trying to figure it out
<chrisccoulson_> (and indicator-session bypasses the gnome-session mechanism anyway)
<kenvandine> but at the time we didn't realize suspend worked outside of gnome
<pitti> kenvandine: does "sudo pm-suspend" within a gnome terminal work?
<kenvandine> nope
<kenvandine> same thing
<kenvandine> it is very strange
<pitti> ah, then it's not gnome
<kenvandine> yeah
<pitti> kenvandine: try something like
<kenvandine> i read some stuff that made it sound like network-manager might not be able to release the interfaces
<pitti> sudo PM_DEBUG=true pm-suspend 2>&1 | tee /tmp/out
<kenvandine> but i removed the modules and all
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> brb
 * kenvandine thinks it is really weird that it works in kde and gdm
<kenvandine> brb
<kenvandine> damn /tmp cleaning :)
 * kenvandine tries again
<popey> kenvandine: good work on making gwibber less crashy
<nigelbabu> didrocks: reminding you about bug 111939 now that we're post RC
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 111939 in metacity "Not possible to alt-tab during a drag-and-drop operation" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/111939
<didrocks> nigelbabu: yeah, I read it again yesterday and think we should wait for maverick. Compiz is the main wm in any case and there is the same issue
<nigelbabu> didrocks: sure, no problem.
<didrocks> nigelbabu: thanks for the notice :)
<nigelbabu> In the meantime, I'll try to get it into metacity trunk
<didrocks> nigelbabu: yeah, that would be awesome :)
<kenvandine> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/421032/
<kenvandine> pitti, chrisccoulson_: ^^
<kenvandine> one thing to note, running pm-suspend myself the screen never clears, i can still see everything
<pitti> kenvandine: that's expected
<kenvandine> but suspend from the session menu does clear the screen
<kenvandine> ok
<pitti> hm, that looks weird
<pitti> (way too short, and it doesn't do any action)
<kenvandine> there is much more in /var/log/pm-suspend.log
<pitti> ah, right
 * kenvandine pastes
<pitti> please put that somewhere
<pitti> the >& logging probably stopped at the exec
<chrisccoulson_> asac - ok, firefox is uploaded now
<kenvandine> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/421034/
<kenvandine> there might be more than one suspend in there
<kenvandine> this behavior started in karmic right before the sprint in dublin
<kenvandine> so been quite a while :)
<kenvandine> we had chalked it up to bios or hardware...
<kenvandine> but now that i know it works outside of gnome... i am determined to get suspend working again!
<kenvandine> good morning rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi kenvandine
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi pitti
<kenvandine> pitti, this sure is verbose... but i am not seeing anything that looks like it failed
<didrocks> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> asac, chrisccoulson_: that's the weirdest bug I've ever seen -- different optimize flags cause *scroll bars* to appear??
<seb128> hello rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi seb128
<didrocks> rickspencer3: not on #quickly? ;) just to tell you that I'm planning to release Quickly 0.4.1. No last-minute thing to put into the trunk for you?
<rickspencer3> hi didrocks, I just joined
<rickspencer3> I don't have as many channels autojoin on my netbook
<didrocks> I would thought #quickly was #1 for you (kidding) ;)
<chrisccoulson_> pitti - yeah, that is pretty weird indeed
<pitti> chrisccoulson_: this makes me a bit nervous about breaking other stuff, though
<pitti> I mean ffox has never been tested with a global -O2 on any platform, has it?
<chrisccoulson_> pitti - i think asac has tested that though (i haven't, as i don't have the hardware available)
<chrisccoulson_> it's also only -O2 on armel
<pitti> right, it's a no-op on !armel, but I'm still worried :)
<rickspencer3> pitti, did I get the rolled back glx when I did a dist-upgrade last night?
<pitti> rickspencer3: it's not accepted yet; the currently pending upload has an extra bug fix which I'm not sure about; I pinged bryceh about it
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> I thought bryceh said he was going to do a clean upload of just the rollback
<rickspencer3> oh well
<ogra> pitti, we often see such issues in armel ... different optimization often exposes toolchain issues
<kenvandine> pitti, chrisccoulson_: any ideas from that log?
<pitti> kenvandine: (will have a look later on)
<kenvandine> looks to me like everything worked, at least from the log
<kenvandine> pitti, ok
<pitti> kenvandine: yes, it goes all the way to echo mem > /sys/power/state
<pitti> kenvandine: if you do echo mem | sudo tee /sys/power/state, does it suspend?
<pitti> that's the bare-metal suspend command, straight to the kernel
<kenvandine> i'll try... i assume it does since it works from kde and gdm
<pitti> kenvandine: you can do sudo dmesg -c, then that command, and afterwards check with dmesg if there's any error from the kernel
<kenvandine> ok
<pitti> kenvandine: well, it's apparently what pm-suspend tries as well
<didrocks> james_w: I'll need some help with a bzr merge if you're around
<asac> chrisccoulson_: pitti: i had a test build with that change in a native ppa
<asac> it was based on ffox 3.6.4 prerelease though ... so we cant just copy it
<asac> chrisccoulson_: pitti: if it feels better we can prepare the release in native ppa and copy over once everything is built ;)
<asac> that would reduce the risk of bustage due to build failures etc.
<pitti> asac: no, that's fine (accepted)
<james_w> didrocks: mais oui
<asac> pitti: thanks.
<pitti> asac: I was just concerned about -O2 breaking ffox on armel
<didrocks> james_w: :) so, I'm trying to merge lp:~quickly/quickly/quickly-po in lp:quickly
<james_w> didrocks: the former is a rosetta export branch?
<didrocks> james_w: exactly, and the previous export branch didn't have a data/templates/ubuntu-application/help/po (creating in lp:quickly), and so, created itself the directory
<didrocks> james_w: which results in data/templates/ubuntu-application and data/templates/ubuntu-application.moved directory
<james_w> erk
<james_w> double erk
<james_w> or not
<james_w> what did you change in lp:quickly?
<james_w> did that add data/templates/ubuntu-application, is that unversioned in your local copy, or has it been there since before lp:~quickly/quickly/quickly-po branched?
<didrocks> james_w: I've added a po template for tutorials, hence the directory creation
<didrocks> james_w: data/templates/ubuntu-application should have been there even before the creation of the export branch, let me check
<james_w> ah, ok, so you added it after branching?
<didrocks> james_w: no, but it was data/templates/ubuntu-project which moved to data/templates/ubuntu-application
<didrocks> (with bzr mv)
<james_w> ah, ok
<didrocks> james_w: but as LP po export added it manuallyâ¦
<james_w> that's a legitimate conflict then
<didrocks> it created it in the export branch
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> I'm not surprised by the conflict, but how to resolve it properly :)
<didrocks> I was thinking doing that:
<james_w> right :-)
<didrocks> bzr mv data/templates/ubuntu-application/help/po/* data/templates/ubuntu-application.moved/help/po
<didrocks> then, rm -rf data/templates/ubuntu-application
<didrocks> and mv data/templates/ubuntu-application.moved data/templates/ubuntu-application
<didrocks> but then, bzr st told me that I removed all commands in ubuntu-application and that I've unknown file corresponding to every files in ubuntu-application
<james_w> right, after bzr mkdir -p data/templates/ubuntu-application.moved/help/po
<didrocks> so, I guess, I have ubuntu-application with the id of the export po branch (the one created recently) :)
<james_w> try bzr mv --after data/templates/ubuntu-application.moved data/templates/ubuntu-application
<didrocks> oh, --after?
<james_w> "I've already moved it on disk, just mark it as moved in bzr st"
<didrocks> ok, let me try that :)
<didrocks> james_w: you rock! ;)
<kenvandine> pitti, that doesn't work either... apparently this is some sign that i should switch to kde :-D
<james_w> didrocks: sweet
<pitti> kenvandine: what does dmesg say?
<didrocks> james_w: thanks a lot :)
<kenvandine> nothing..
<kenvandine> it logs nothing on the way down
<pitti> strange
<james_w> didrocks: np
<kenvandine> it immediate stops
<kenvandine> immediately
<kenvandine> pitti, there must be some device or something that is keeping it from going down... something that is tweaked by logging into gnome
<kenvandine> i tried switching to metacity, etc
<kenvandine> turned off bluetooth and all
<pitti> sudo stop network-manager, too?
<kenvandine> yeah
<pitti> kenvandine: sudo killall udisks-daemon upowerd ?
<kenvandine> didn't do that
 * kenvandine tries
<kenvandine> sigh...
<kenvandine> pitti, nope, that didn't help
<kenvandine> very puzzling...
<jcastro> kenvandine: hey I can consistently crash the xchat m-i plugin
<kenvandine> jcastro, steps to repro?
<jcastro> when someone messages you, click on the envelope and then on their name
<kenvandine> can't repro it reliably
<jcastro> then xchat disappears
<jcastro> qense: you said you were seeing this too?
<kenvandine> it has happened to me a couple times
<kenvandine> but very rare
<kenvandine> jcastro, file a bug please
<qense> jcastro: please ping me and I can test it!
<jcastro> kenvandine: file a bug on which component?
<kenvandine> xchat-indicator
<kenvandine> jcastro, highlight me again
<jcastro> kenvandine: hi2u
<kenvandine> ok, worked... i hadn't tested since i reinstalled lucid last night
<kenvandine> get the bug filed and i will look at the crash report
<qense> I have stopped using the XChat indicator because it used to crash, but I haven't tested it a long time.
<qense> XChat GNOME, to be precise.
<kenvandine> qense, that is what i am using too
<hyperair> irssi ftw
<kenvandine> jcastro, you using xchat or xchat-gnome?
<jcastro> -gnome
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> same here
<hyperair> irssi + messaging indicator would be really cool
<hyperair> does the messaging indicator have perl bindings?
<kenvandine> nope
<jcastro> hyperair: I know dude, especially if we could pipe it through ssh so I can run my screen remote ...
<qense> Messaging indicator integration for irssi in byobu!
<jcastro> qense: YES
<hyperair> jcastro: absolutely!
<qense> That would be fun: porting the whole indicator-* stack to screen...
<ccheney> pitti: i think david wants to talk about that in the session, i didn't add it myself
<ccheney> pitti: oh nm i see lucid, no thats not relevant for lucid
<jcastro> kenvandine: apport didn't fire off or anything, is there anything I should look for for the report?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xchat-gnome/+bug/565061
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Ubuntu: list index out of range (https://launchpad.net/bugs/565061)
<qense> jcastro: Apport was disabled by a recent update, did you renable it?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, dang it. my crash report was private
<rickspencer3> fixed now
<qense> failed retrace
<rickspencer3> jcastro, does that look like your xchat crash?
<jcastro> yes
<jcastro> it does
 * kenvandine wonders why that didn't show up in the "me" folder in evo... damn procmailrc ... 
<rickspencer3> anyway, may as well reuse that report rather than create a new one
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, can you repro that reliably too?
<kenvandine> yeah
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, no
<jcastro> kenvandine: it doesn't happen every time
<rickspencer3> it's just intermitten enough that I keep using it
<jcastro> right
<jcastro> kenvandine: ok so I should turn on apport and if it happens again put it in this report?
<kenvandine> jcastro, it is probably the same as what rickspencer3 reported
<jcastro> yeah I am just wondering if more info is better. apport is a black box to me.
<kenvandine> jcastro, perhaps
<rickspencer3> pitti, fyi, for release meeting, edubuntu logo was done and sent a while ago, not sure when exactly
 * rickspencer3 saw it as an open action on the email
<pitti> rickspencer3: right, it's already in the upload queue
<rickspencer3> :)
<pitti> thanks for the heads-up
<seb128> pitti, the meeting is at 17h local right?
<pitti> seb128: right
<seb128> ok
<pitti> seb128: oh, do you want to be the desktop representative today? :-)
 * seb128 grabs the laptop and will seat outside in the sun a bit to read email and join the meeting
<seb128> pitti, I didn't prepare but I will watch
<pitti> (our plate is pretty clean, should be easy for us)
<pitti> seb128: that's fine; I updated the ReleaseStatus page
<pitti> seb128, rickspencer3: I have to leave after the meeting; in case bryceh wakes up later, would you mind discussing his current upload with him? there's an extra bug fix which I'm not sure about, thus I didn't accept it yet
<pitti> so if he's 100% confident in this, it's fine to accept
<rickspencer3> pitti, will do
<pitti> but it might not have been intended, since the upload encompasses two changelog records
<seb128> pitti, ok
<pitti> cheers
<rickspencer3> I'm a bit concerned as well, as he said he wanted to do quite the opposite (have a clean upload for glx issue)
<pitti> I'm invited at my parent's for dinner, since I'll be away for the next 3 weeks
<rickspencer3> "concerned" might be a tad strong
<seb128> pitti, enjoy
<pitti> rickspencer3: right, which made me consider that it was an accident
<rickspencer3> pitti, you need a netbook to take with you to dinner
<seb128> pitti, I'm in my parents' garden right now with the laptop, splendid weather
<rickspencer3> just put it next to your plate
<pitti> rickspencer3: it's already stowed away in my luggage :)
<rickspencer3> with headphones and  mic it will be like your parents aren't even there, perfect
 * pitti has the mobile with him, of course :)
<pitti> lol
<rickspencer3> :)
<kenvandine> pitti, just confirmed... the exact same suspend problem on my wife's laptop
<kenvandine> but my netbook suspends fine
<vish> seb128: hmm , i may have missed your reply earlier [had to reboot].. when would be a right time to request the Humanity update for [KDE problem] ?
<kenvandine> her hardware is completely different
<kenvandine> intel white box laptop
<seb128> vish, next cycle?
<pitti> kenvandine: curious
<kenvandine> i have a thinkpad
<kenvandine> different video and network
<pitti> kenvandine: is that a regression from the glx rollback?
<seb128> vish, I'm not the one to talk to to get an exception now
<kenvandine> no
<seb128> vish, try talking to pitti or slangasek
<kenvandine> this has been a problem for me since early in the karmic cycle, even after several reinstalls
<pitti> vish: "request"?
<vish> ah , ok.. :)
<kenvandine> for her suspend was fine until i installed lucid
<seb128> kenvandine, did it work if you turn off the social from the start cracks?
<kenvandine> and actually... it is a regression for her in lucid
<vish> pitti:  Bug #566996
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 566996 in humanity-icon-theme "Humanity in KDE does not display volume icons." [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/566996
<kenvandine> at first it did suspend, but wouldn't resume
<seb128> just trying to figure what you might set up and other people not
<kenvandine> nvidia bug
<kenvandine> but since that was fixed, it doesn't suspend completely just like mine
<vish> pitti: the volume icon is not displayed in KDE :s , it was a hack i had done so that the icon isnt blurry in gtk widgets , ut it turns out to be a problem in kubuntu
<kenvandine> seb128, it doesn't work for a new user... which doesn't have gwibber running
<pitti> vish: if it's an 100% risk free and small fix, please get it uploaded for lucid, we are revieing the queue very often
<pitti> vish: if not, -> SRU
<seb128> vish, did you fix it in a way which doesn't create the gtk issue again
<seb128> ?
<vish> yup , no problems now
<kenvandine> seb128, did you read back to where suspend works in gdm and in kde?
<vish> neither for kde or gtk
<kenvandine> but not from a logged in gnome session
<kenvandine> seb128, any guesses?
<seb128> kenvandine, yes I read that and no, no guess, I would try starting a failsafe GNOME and try there
<kenvandine> i did
<kenvandine> fails too
<seb128> or turn off everything in the session and add things back
<seb128> weird
<kenvandine> i did that too
<seb128> did you try to start a non gnome session
<kenvandine> unchecked everything in the startup
<seb128> and start gnome-panel etc there?
<kenvandine> no... let me try that
<vish> pitti: the fix is small and uploaded and ready in lp:~ubuntu-art-pkg/humanity/release
 * kenvandine tries with something lighter than kde
<kenvandine> :)
<vish> pitti: i need to subscribe the release team or the Main sponsors to the bug?
<pitti> vish: sponsors primarily
<vish> neat thanks..
<maxb> I need help figuring out where to search for or report a vaguely desktoppish bug: On Lucid, the tickmarks in on/off context menu items appear white-on-light-grey, and so pretty much invisible.
<kenvandine> seb128, i can suspend from a full  gnome-session if i start it without gdm
<kenvandine> it seems to be related to logging in via gdm
<kenvandine> perhaps consolekit?
<pitti> that wouldn't stop the kernel from suspending with echo mem>, though
<kenvandine> or something related to disk access
<kenvandine> so starting with startx, i can't access usb sticks, dvd, etc
<pitti> kenvandine: if you log into an xterm session, does it work then?
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> oh
<pitti> kenvandine: oh, then you can't access /dev/drm either
<kenvandine> with gdm
<pitti> so it might be device permissions indeed
<kenvandine> i have no /dev/drm
<pitti> /dev/dri/card0, sorry
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> let me login to an xterm session with gdm
<kenvandine> brb
<kenvandine> pitti, suspend did work logged in from gdm with an xterm session
<pitti> fun
<pitti> kenvandine: try xterm session, then run compiz, and try again?
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> suspend did work with compiz running in my gnome-session started with startx
<kenvandine> still try?
<pitti> hm; well, sure
<kenvandine> brb
<pitti> if for nothing else, you'll need it to sensibly start more terminals and apps :)
<kenvandine> pitti, this is fun... suspend works fine if i login from gdm with the xterm session and run gnome-session
<kenvandine> but it doesn't work if i login with a gnome session from gdm...
<kenvandine> very strange
<Nafai> morning everyone
<kenvandine> good morning Nafai
<kenvandine> pitti, confirmed the same thing does work on my wife's laptop too... very weird
<Sarvatt> ** (gnome-settings-daemon:1658): WARNING **: /usr/lib/gnome-settings-daemon-2.0/libmedia-keys.so: undefined symbol: notify_notification_show
<Sarvatt> ^ wasn't that fixed a few months ago? seems it crept back in
<seb128> Sarvatt, ldd -r it?
<seb128> oh right, I get it there too
<chrisccoulson_> hmmmm
<Sarvatt> http://pastebin.com/G3CZztN8
<seb128> Sarvatt, do you notice any bug due to it?
<chrisccoulson_> when did that start?
<Sarvatt> just the media keys plugin not being loaded going by xsession-errors, I dont use it
<seb128> chrisccoulson_, not sure, g-s-d didn't change for a while
<Sarvatt> seb128	chrisccoulson, you add LIBNOTIFY_LDFLAGS use	10:09
<Sarvatt> seb128	and configure.ac uses _LIB	10:09
<Sarvatt> seb128	and not _LDFLAGS	10:09
<Sarvatt> (irc log from 2010-01-29
<chrisccoulson_> i thought i'd fixed that already
<chrisccoulson_> oh, i see
<chrisccoulson_> it misses LIBNOTIFY_LIBS entirely
<chrisccoulson_> :(
<didrocks> babel-fr is getting crazy in lucidâ¦
<Sarvatt> i only noticed because I was trying to track down why indicator-applet is failing to start and indicator-applet-session is showing double icons some boots, don
<Sarvatt> don't know how long the error has been around
<chrisccoulson_> seb128 - are we ok to upload a fix for this now, or should we do a SRU?
<pitti> chrisccoulson_: since when was it broken?
<pitti> it would essentially mean to re-enable a feature, right?
<seb128> chrisccoulson_, I think it should be ok for upload now
<pitti> (the actual patch is probably quite small)
<pitti> yes, please upload it now and test thoroughly
<seb128> what does it break?
<seb128> I still get sound key bubbles etc
<chrisccoulson_> pitti - it must have been broken for a while now (probably since the last update. i remember we had some difficulty with the patch then)
<pitti> it probably breaks the entire media keys plugin?
<chrisccoulson_> seb128 - yeah, it WFM too, but in Sarvatt's case it's not working at all
<pitti> like launching a web browser, etc/
<chrisccoulson_> pitti - yeah, if the symbols aren't resolved then the whole plugin fails to load (which breaks volume keys etc)
<seb128> it's weird I get the ldd -r errors too
<seb128> but volume keys are working
<pitti> is that in .xsession-errors?
<chrisccoulson_> me too
<pitti> grep symbol /home/martin/.xsession-errors -> nothing
<seb128> same here
<seb128> but ldd -r on the .so -> errors
<chrisccoulson_> yeah, same here. it's definately not linking with libnotify
<chrisccoulson_> but, that's an easy fix
<pitti> ldd /usr/lib/gnome-settings-daemon-2.0/libmedia-keys.so |grep noti -> empty, yes
<seb128> if you can get it uploaded today please do
<seb128> pitti, -r
<seb128> ldd -r
<seb128> ups
<seb128> I misread what you said
<pitti> undefined symbol: gnome_settings_plugin_get_type(/usr/lib/gnome-settings-daemon-2.0/libmedia-keys.so)
<pitti> ?
<Sarvatt> http://sarvatt.com/downloads/xsessions-errors.txt
<pitti> seb128: (I get the missing notify bits, too)
<seb128> ok
<chrisccoulson_> do we need to report a bug for it?
<seb128> pitti, anyway don't delay your weekend on this
<chrisccoulson_> (i'm just building it now to test)
<seb128> chrisccoulson_, don't bother I would say if you get a fix upload
<seb128> and ping slangasek about it
<pitti> ok, so I'm off for some 3 hours for dinner at my parent's
<pitti> when I'm back, I'll have another look at IRC and the queue
<chrisccoulson_> have fun pitti :)
<pitti> thanks
<seb128> pitti, enjoy
<pitti> chrisccoulson_: thanks for working on this issue
 * pitti hugs you all
<pitti> seb128: see, that's the TB job: tell everyone what to do, have them work on Friday nights, and yourself are slacking off
<seb128> ;-)
 * pitti feels guilty
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<desrt> uh.
<desrt> where are my getties?
<pitti> s/TB/TL/, I mean
 * chrisccoulson_ hugs pitti
<seb128> pitti, don't worry they don't listen to you :p
<desrt> please don't tell me they're gone in order to make bootup faster...
<chrisccoulson_> Sarvatt, OOI, do you have the xrandr plugin loaded in g-s-d?
<chrisccoulson_> that's the other plugin that links with libnotify, which is why it's working for me and seb128
<chrisccoulson_> (because libnotify is already in memory)
<chrisccoulson_> i suspect if i turn off that plugin that media-keys will fail too
<Sarvatt> ah hah thats why I see it then, yeah it's disabled
<chrisccoulson_> Sarvatt - ok, that makes sense now :)
<chrisccoulson_> seb128 - ok, fix pushed to bzr now. would you mind sponsoring? :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson_, I can do that!
<chrisccoulson_> seb128 - thanks
<bryceh> pitti, you had a question about the xserver upload?
<rickspencer3> bryceh, pitti is out atm
<seb128> bryceh, he said there is another change in there
<seb128> bryceh, out of the glx one
<seb128> bryceh, he was not sure if that was wanted
<bryceh> the only other change is that it drops a duplicate patch
<bryceh> which is fine
<seb128> ok, I guess that's the one he was not sure about
<seb128> can you clarify that with slangasek?
<kenvandine> pitti, seb128: so i found the suspend problem... it fails to suspend if you have an SD card mounted :)
<chrisccoulson_> hmmm, i wish xchat would pick up the theme again after reloading g-s-d
<kenvandine> I have had this SD card in this laptop since I bought it
<seb128> kenvandine, weird bug
<bryceh> hrm
<kenvandine> very weird... and a pain to narrow down :)
<kenvandine> seb128, ideas what that should be filed against?
<kenvandine> i assume the kernel
<seb128> bryceh, pitti said the changelog has 2 new entries in this upload
<seb128> bryceh, that's about what I know about his concern though
<seb128> he was not sure the previous one was an intended change too
<bryceh> seb128, I'll doublecheck
<seb128> kenvandine, not really no, you can try there
<kenvandine> now i am annoyed to think that i haven't been able to suspend for 8 months because I had this silly SD card in my laptop :)
<bryceh> seb128, I only see one changelog entry for the 23rd, and then the previous is from the 15th
<seb128> bryceh, check with slangasek I would say, I assume they have some queue diff, maybe that got the debdiff buggy for some reason
<seb128> chrisccoulson, seems you dropped a tap to click change too?
<bryceh> seb128, looks like he's not around
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, it was commented in the serie and you dropped the change too now, ok
<seb128> confusing debdiff
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - oh, perhaps the branch was slightly out of sync with the archive?
<kenvandine> very old bug, bug 295354
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 295354 in linux "sdhci: suspend problems with mounted partition" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/295354
<chrisccoulson> i didn't intentionally make any other changes
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, uploaded
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks
<seb128> bryceh, ok, so you uploaded xorg-server ubuntu7
<seb128> lucid current has ubuntu5
<seb128> bryceh, was the ubuntu6 change on purpose in that upload too?
<seb128> it's not there http://launchpadlibrarian.net/45056000/xorg-server_1.7.6-2ubuntu7_source.changes
<seb128> bryceh, ie you have 2 revisions but listed one in the .changes only, forgot to -vubuntu5 on build?
<bryceh> mm, did that one just not get uploaded maybe?
<seb128> bryceh, https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server
<seb128> bryceh, it was not no
<seb128> so pitti wanted to double check what was going on
<seb128> ie is it intended to go in lucid
<bryceh> seb128, so want me to exclude that and redo the packaging?
<seb128> or a revision leftover
<seb128> rather confirm that you want that one in lucid
<seb128> and that it was not a revision uploaded by error
<seb128> ie that you based your recent change on the right one
<seb128> and not on a local testversion with a revision not meant to go in lucid
<bryceh> I can exclude it if it is causing confusion, but it's a valid fix for a serious issue that should be in ubuntu
<bryceh> well, serious for people who have the issue
<seb128> ok thanks
<seb128> bryceh, thanks, I clarified with slangasek, or rather let him a message to read about it, that it was a wanted change and can be accepted when he wants
<bryceh> alright
<Sarvatt> bryceh: I wouldn't include the xauth commit for now, it's not something affecting a large number of users and did you notice it's undergoing heavy revision to meet upstream's standards? http://lists.x.org/archives/xorg-devel/2010-April/006992.html
<bryceh> Sarvatt, yes I know it's being worked on upstream
<milanbv> chrisccoulson: sorry for raising this again, but what should we do to for the system-tools-backends 2.10.0?
<milanbv> wait for a SRU?
<milanbv> do you want me to package it?
<chrisccoulson> milanbv - is there a bug for it?
<chrisccoulson> (i don't  really have time to work on that atm)
<milanbv> chrisccoulson: yeah, there are a few bugs
<milanbv> do you mean a bug "Update stb to 2.10.0"?
<milanbv> no, but I can create it
<milanbv> disregarding crowded agenda issues, what would be the best procedure?
<bryceh> Sarvatt, I've uploaded an xserver with that xauth change xcluded for the archive admins to choose from.  I think it's fine but no skin off my nose if it's left out.
<ccheney> seb128: are we skipping the dictionary transition intentionally? aiui enchant is still using the old locations from a year ago?
<bryceh> Sarvatt, it can be sru'd later when the patch is finalized
<seb128> ccheney, no it's just that nobody has been watching what debian was doing
<seb128> ccheney, I noticed some days ago when talking to the debian maintainer about the openoffice.org-dictionnaries change I did and sent back there
<seb128> ccheney, it seems late to change enchant now so that will be next cycle
<seb128> would have been nice if you could have watched those dictionnaries changes in debian earlier
<seb128> so we could have adapted for lucid
<seb128> the debian maintainer said it had been announced on debian list and in openoffice changes for a while
<Sarvatt> bryceh: yeah we have that major EXA fix to SRU too
<Sarvatt> where people using noscript in firefox with compositing enabled is crashing the server
 * bryceh nods
<bryceh> Sarvatt, yeah I asked pitti if I should include that in this upload but didn't hear from him so just left it out
<bryceh> it looks like something which would be fine to roll out as an sru, since it doesn't prevent install or boot
<bryceh> Sarvatt, if you spot any other xserver patches let me know, I'm building a todo list
<Sarvatt> bryceh: there is another important one that could use a round through -proposed testing because it is a pretty significant change, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server/+bug/553647
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 553647 in xorg-server "xserver crash (repeatable, triggered by drawing circle/ellipse e.g. in xfig)" [High,Triaged]
<bryceh> Sarvatt, heh yep that's the other one on my todo list ;-)
<bryceh> #539772 and #553647
<bryceh> there might be one or two more that are nearly ready
<Nafai> lunching
<ccheney> seb128: yea it was done in karmic release cycle for Debian but was too late for karmic, i got all the dictionaries updated for lucid a while back except for the bug you updated for, i'm not sure what all applications need changes but thought those would have filtered in semi-automatically
<ccheney> the Debian guy (rene) plans to drop the compat symlinks in the near future, probably early in maverick cycle
<seb128> right
<seb128> he was unhappy that we didn't sync the enchant change
<ccheney> i guess the enchant change must have been late for it not to have been in testing
<seb128> it's in testing but we have ubuntu changes to enchant
<ccheney> i can't get to the packages.qa.d.o page to check
<ccheney> oh ok
<seb128> and we don't review changes to merge every week in the second half of the cycle
<seb128> anyway dinner time
<seb128> bbl
<ccheney> yea, so thats why i mentioned it must have been late, i think the initial changes for dictionaries were before lucid so it was either stuck or not done until later for enchant
<ccheney> ok ttyl :)
 * ccheney will do another openoffice.org-dictionaries update to add the remaining compat symlinks needed until dictionary transition is complete for Ubuntu
 * desrt adds another process to slow down the GNOME login process
<Nafai> Question.  bratsche came up with a patch for gtk that fixed the gnome bluetooth bug as reported.  But, in the process, I discovered another bug (the Visible menu item isn't showing up).  Should I file a new one for that and work on that and have bratsche's gtk changes be the fix for the original one?
<rickspencer3> Nafai I would suggest logging a new bug
<rickspencer3> then attach bratche's patch to the original bug, and your patch to the new one
<Nafai> k, that's what I think
<rickspencer3> thanks man
<Nafai> np
<rickspencer3> Nafai could you please make sure the bug comments are up to date on the BT one?
<Nafai> sure thing, I'll do that and then open the new bug
<bratsche> Nafai: So that gtk patch definitely helped/fixed the issue?
<Nafai> bratsche: yes, indeed
<bratsche> Nice!
<Nafai> yes, much thanks
<bratsche> So I need to work that into a gtk patch that's upstreamable then.
<bratsche> I'll have to do that on Monday though, I'm leaving for a symphony rehearsal in about an hour.
<Nafai> yeah, should I just comment that it works and re-assign the bug to you?
<bratsche> Add a gtk+ component to the bug in launchpad and assign that to me.  If there's no more work to do on it then I guess close the gnome-bluetooth part of the bug.
<Nafai> (new to launchpad), so "also affects project" and add gt+?
<Nafai> gtk+
<bratsche> Also affects distribution
<bratsche> Then I think it's gtk+ or gtk+2.0 or something like that.
<Nafai> ok
<bratsche> "Also affects project" is intended for upstream projects listed in Launchpad, which gtk+ isn't.  "Also affects distribution" lets you file a bug against Ubuntu's gtk+ package.
<Nafai> ah, I was thinking distribution as in "lucid"
<Nafai> makes sense
<Nafai> thanks
<seb128> bratsche, Nafai: no please don't do that
<Nafai> Looks like dbarth already re-classified it as gtk+
<seb128> bratsche, Nafai: reassigning the bug rather than adding an another task, having a second task means you keep spamming the first one subscribers
<seb128> Nafai, right, I told him to do so
<seb128> Nafai, you can let the bug in this state, I will do a SRU upload after lucid with some other changes
<seb128> I will probably wait for bratsche to come with an upstream approved change though
<seb128> would be nice to fix the scrolling in the same upload
<Nafai> ok
<Nafai> comment that it is fixed and leave as-is?
<Nafai> s/fixed/fixed with the gtk change
<seb128> yes
<seb128> next part is up to bratsche to get a chance upstream
<seb128> then I will backport to lucid
<seb128> thank you for your work on this!
<Nafai> ok, thanks for helping me learn the process :)
<bratsche> Me too. :)
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, the xchat-indicator bug is weird... sometimes it is getting added to the hash table a second time, i think
<kenvandine> but it checks to see if it is there before adding it... very strange
<kenvandine> i have reproduced it though, and got some debugging code in
<kenvandine> will try to fix it over the weekend
<rickspencer3> thanks kenvandine
<rickspencer3> this is a plugin in universe, right?
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> i gotta head out to take my son to t-ball practice now, bbiab
<rickspencer3> bye kenvandine
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, let me know if you want any help with that ;)
<chrisccoulson> that one is annoying ;)
<kenvandine> :)
 * didrocks waves goodnight and enjoy your week-end
<bratsche> Later didrocks!
<kklimonda>  /quit maintenance
<kklimonda> hmm
<pitti> kenvandine: SD card mounted? that's .. awesome; some USB port doesn't suspend then?
<pitti> bryceh: seems all sorted out now? the other bug fix was intended?
<bryceh> pitti, yes it was intended
<bryceh> I'd assumed it was already uploaded (I'd already committed it to git as released), but I have no .upload file so have no proof I uploaded it
<pitti> bryceh: ok, thanks; just wanted to ensure it was intended, and not an "oops" :)
<bryceh> pitti, well good catch
 * pitti waves goodbye then, have a good weekend everyone!
<bryceh> cya
<Nafai> bye pitti!
<cj> sshaw, everybody.  everybody, sshaw.
<sshaw> is this the right channel to get some help with packages a desktop package on ubuntu
<cj> sshaw: it's EOD on friday ;)
<sshaw> :(
<sshaw> not for me :)
<Nafai> Hey sshaw
<sshaw> Nafai: hi
<sshaw> how goes it?
<Nafai> Hi from a bit north of you :)
<Nafai> good
<sshaw> I'm not sure how far north?
<sshaw> I knew you were in utah, but that's about it
<Nafai> Pleasant Grove
<sshaw> oh, so not too far north
<sshaw> what are you doing again for canonical?
<Nafai> desktop software engineer
<sshaw> ah very cool
<Nafai> working with these guys.  a little development, a little packaging, a lot of fun :)
<sshaw> what aspect of the desktop?
 * sshaw is still trying to learn ubuntu packaging
<Nafai> right now, une (ubuntu netbook edition) and programmer oriented tools
<sshaw> cool
<sshaw> I imagine that the programmer oriented tools would be pretty cool
<Nafai> yeah, it will be fun, haven't really started that, since I just started at the beginning of the month
<Nafai> will get into it for the next dev cycle
<sshaw> cool
<sshaw> maybe you can help me out with my problem then
<sshaw> it has to do with gnome and packaging if you are up for it
<Nafai> I'm pretty new to some of it, for sure the person to help you would be seb128, but I imagine he's gone/asleep, he's in France.  He's our gnome packager dude
<Nafai> What's up though?
<sshaw> ah cool
<sshaw> I'm getting an error when trying to run debuild with a package that has schema stuff in it
<sshaw> I added a Build-Depends for libgconf2-dev, but it still fails
<Nafai> could you pastebin the error?
<sshaw> http://paste2.org/p/790302
<Nafai> hrm
<Nafai> sounds like an autoconf thingy
 * Nafai looks at something
<sshaw> I'm thinking its a build dependency issue.  I was getting the same thing on fedora until I added gconf2-devel
<sshaw> maybe macros provided by that package?
<Nafai> probably
<Nafai> let me look at a similar package here
<Nafai> could you pastebin your debian/control file?
<sshaw> I added libgconf-dev, but no such luck
<sshaw> yeah, one sec
<sshaw> http://paste2.org/p/790308
<Nafai> so I'm still new to this so I'm trying to figure it out
<sshaw> that makes 2 of us :)
<Nafai> could you pastebin for me the contents of the gconf2-devel package?
<Nafai> (in fedora)
<sshaw> probably not :(
<cj> rpm -ql ?
<sshaw> I don't have a fedora install handy
<cj> ah...
<cj> moment...
<sshaw> for some reason its GConf2-devel on fedora
<sshaw> this is on openSUSE http://paste2.org/p/790323
 * cj asked a fedora-using friend for the list
 * sshaw is too lazy to pull up his vm of fedora :)
<sshaw> the case still applies to openSUSE though, so that should work as well
 * cj would need to build a fedora vm from scratch
<sshaw> brb
<Nafai> ok, looking
<Nafai> weird
<sshaw> back
<Nafai> so that autoconf macro is indeed in libgconf2-dev (in /usr/share/aclocal/gconf-2.m4)
<Nafai> and if this worked for fedora without making any source changes, I'm a bit confused
<Nafai> actually, are you just building this on a local Ubuntu system?
<sshaw> yeah
<sshaw> debuild
<Nafai> do you have that package installed?
<sshaw> yeah
<Nafai> weird
<sshaw> I might need to do an autoreconf
<Nafai> Is the directory clean before you try to build?
<Nafai> probably, actually
<sshaw> not sure how to do that in ubuntu though
<Nafai> (Just learning about autoconf foo)
<sshaw> I imagine in the rules file?
<Nafai> the autoreconf?
<sshaw> Nafai: john jolly gave a presentation on it called the dark arts of autotools
<cj> to clean the package, run 'fakeroot debian/rules clean'
<Nafai> sshaw: Was it at UTOS a couple years ago?
 * cj is an autotools hero (or so it's said)
<Nafai> I may have actually been at that presentation, I just haven't used it since then :)
<sshaw> Nafai: yeah
<sshaw> I think so at least
<Nafai> Novell dude, right?
<sshaw> cj: then you are my hero :)
<sshaw> yup
<cj> oh, good.  you know where to find me ;)
<cj> have you run pbuilder-satisfydepends?
 * cj reads backlog
<cj> 22:25 <wakko666> the reference points you want are:
<cj> 22:25 <wakko666> http://koji.fedoraproject.org/koji/packageinfo?packageID=1043
<cj> 22:25 <wakko666> http://cvs.fedoraproject.org/viewvc/rpms/GConf2/
<cj> 22:26 <wakko666> koji has the complete file list for each build
<cj> 22:26 <wakko666> fedora cvs has the spec files and patches for each release
<cj> 22:26 <wakko666> for koji:  click a build, then click the "info" link on the package.
<cj> 22:27 <wakko666> are you going to be at LinuxFest this weekend?
<sshaw> yup
<cj> oh... last for me ;)
<sshaw> that's where I stole their packages from... actually easier to just grab the .src.rpm file tbh
<sshaw> :(
<sshaw> have to run.  I have computational theory studying calling my name
<cj> what's the current problem?
<cj> :)
<sshaw> cj: perhaps on monday :)
<cj> okay.  later, then.
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-04-24
<cj> heh, looks like at-spi2-atk is not ready for production.  cspi/Makfile is missing from configure.ac's AC_CONFIG_FILES(), and cspi is missing from Makefile.am's SUBDIRS
<eeejay> cj at-spi2 doesn't have cspi
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, xchat-indicator is fixed, just needs a sponsor to upload :)
<rickspencer3>  kenvandine nice!!!
<rickspencer3> g'night
 * hyperair wonders why gdm requires its own pulseaudio server
<RAOF> hyperair: Because it's not run as the user who hasn't yet logged in?
<RAOF> One pulseaudio server per user.
<hyperair> RAOF: ah yeah i forgot.
<hyperair> RAOF: looks like the 01Pulseaudio hook i did made some false assumptions
<rickspencer3> nice to see some more fixed bugs in my mail this morning!
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, didrocks sweeeet! you guys rock
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-04-25
<RAOF> Good morning all.
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-04-18
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: Yo yo, dude!  When you're awake and available I'd like to ask things about your system re compiz freezes.
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, I certainly meant to turn off python-gtkspell in g-p-e; I just see that I have the change locally in bzr, but didn't upload it, apparently it didn't build or so
<pitti> +DEB_DH_BUILDDEB_ARGS = -Npython-gtkspell
<TheMuso> Hey pitti, how was your weekend?
<pitti> TheMuso: quite nice indeed, thanks! how are you?
<pitti> hey Sweetshark
<TheMuso> pitti: Well thanks.
<pitti> Sweetshark: sponsoring bug 753584 ? that's already marked as fixed, is that wrong?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 753584 in hundredpapercuts "New Libre office icons are used in the launcher but not in Nautilus / Dash search results" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/753584
<pitti> DBO: can I assign bug 758154 to you? what's your launchpad ID? (It's impossible to search for "Jason Smith", and DBO doesn't return results)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 758154 in bamf "bamfdaemon crashed with SIGABRT in dbus_g_connection_register_g_object()" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/758154
<DBO> pitti, jassmith
<DBO> pitti, that should be fixed also
<DBO> whats the most recent report?
<pitti> DBO: cheers
<pitti> DBO: 2011-04-13, bamfdaemon 0.2.86-0ubuntu1
<pitti> we have ubuntu3
<DBO> too old
<DBO> fix is newer than that
<pitti> DBO: we got fixes for bug 761372 and bug 754225 since then
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 761372 in unity "compiz assert failure: *** glibc detected *** compiz: double free or corruption (out): 0x0a1c5a38 ***" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/761372
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 754225 in bamf "bamfdaemon crashed with SIGABRT in dbus_g_connection_register_g_object()" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/754225
<pitti> ah, dupe of 754225
<pitti> DBO: yay, closing then
<DBO> yeah
<DBO> bamf should never crash
<DBO> ever
<DBO> because I programmed it, therefor it has no bugs (I believe this to be true)
<pitti> must have been an apport bug then, clearly!
<pitti> DBO: yay retroactive bug fixing
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<pitti> Sweetshark: so LibO ready to go?
<didrocks> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> didrocks: I'm great, thanks! how about you?
<didrocks> pitti: I'm fine as well, still a very nice weather for a couple of weeks already ;)
<Sweetshark> pitti: yes, take it from chinstrap.
<Sweetshark> pitti: hmm, I will still have to generate a l10n dsc ...
<Sweetshark> anyway, LibO can be sponsored already.
<mvo> glatzor: I see nice fixes in your branch, should I wait for more or upload now?
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> Sweetshark: uploaded, thanks
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<pitti> I'm great, thanks!
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, good thanks. a bit tired though. we had quite a long day visiting family yesterday
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm fine thanks! Still on the week-end bug mail though ;)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: UBUNTU_MENUPROXY= firefox
<pitti> that doesn't seem to work?
<pitti> (I really need the ffox menu, but it isn't displayed at all right now)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - no, that's an appmenu-gtk thing ;)
<chrisccoulson> for firefox, you need to turn off the extension. i didn't provide any other way to disable it
<pitti> ah, thanks
<chrisccoulson> how come the menu isn't displayed?
<pitti> about:extensions doesn't work; can I get to that in any other way?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I don't know
<chrisccoulson> hmmm :/
<pitti> it sometimes does that after unity crashes, but this time it didn't, I think
<chrisccoulson> did you try restarting unity-panel-service?
<chrisccoulson> these cases should be fixed now :(
<pitti> doesn't seem to help
<pitti> I don't even see close/min/max buttons
<chrisccoulson> oh
<chrisccoulson> i've seen that before too. it seems something in unity gets messed up :/
<chrisccoulson> if you drag it from the panel and un-maximize it, it doesn't get any window border does it?
<pitti> drag from the panel?
<pitti> if I press alt+f10, it does get borders
<chrisccoulson> is the firefox window maximized?
<Sweetshark> \o/ beautiful LibreOffice icons on the desktop ...
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes
<cdbs> Sweetshark: thanks to vish :)
<rodrigo_> morning
<didrocks> hey rodrigo_
<seb128> hey desktopers
<rodrigo_> hi didrocks, seb128
<seb128> hey didrocks, rodrigo_
<seb128> how are you?
<rodrigo_> seb128, a bit sleepy still :)  and you, had a good weekend?
<seb128> yes, a quite relaxing one ;-)
<rodrigo_> good :)
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> seb128: I'm great, thanks! had a nice weekend?
<pitti> ah, you said
<pitti> I spent the Sunday with packing boxes again :)
<seb128> pitti, indeed, a quite relaxing one ;-)
<seb128> pitti, when do you move?
<pitti> seb128: April 30
<seb128> end of the month?
<seb128> ok
<seb128> it's getting close!
<pitti> yeah
<rodrigo_> pitti, oh, where do you move to?
<seb128> you will barely have time to unpack before going to UDS
<pitti> we'll arrive in Augsburg at Sat evening, and on Sun morning I'll hop into the train to Budapest
<pitti> seb128: right, but over Easter weekend is bad, and we need to clear the old flat by mid-May
<TheMuso> pitti: Oh wow you're moving!
<TheMuso> Hope it goes well, I've been through it a few times myself.
<pitti> heh; will be my 4th time as well
<seb128> pitti, isn't eastern next weekend and the 30 the one after that?
<pitti> right
<TheMuso> Easter is next week end, at least for us in Australia...
<seb128> then uds a week after that as well?
<pitti> I'm not quite sure why UDS and sprint are so early this cycle
<rodrigo_> no Thursday/Friday easter holiday?
<pitti> UDS is back-to-back with the release
<pitti> we won't have any time for merging etc.
<pitti> rodrigo_: Fri/Mon are holidays here
<rodrigo_> pitti, ah, thought Spain was the only one having that :)
<rodrigo_> Thu/Fri and Mon here
<TheMuso> In New South Wales this year, its Friday, Monday, and Tuesday, because of Anzac Day on Monday.
<TheMuso> Not sure about other states.
<RAOF> You softies.
<Sweetshark> cdbs, vish: indeed. Many thanks your way for that.
<RAOF> We don't get Tuesday in Tasmania :)
<TheMuso> RAOF: Ah that sucks.
<didrocks> RAOF: we don't get Friday neither here! Just Monday
<RAOF> didrocks: Sucks even more!
<didrocks> yeah :-)
<TheMuso> A 5 days, its just starting to get long enough that by the end, the desire to return to work las lessened. :p
<TheMuso> At 5 days
<TheMuso> s/las/has/
<rodrigo_> :)
<Sweetshark> didrocks: In germany, a lot of public holidays depend on the region. The historically catholic regions get quite a few more. Which is pretty annoying, but probably not worth another 30 years of war ...
<pitti> in fact, I heard that Augsburg even has one extra holiday, on top of the already numerous Bavarian holidays..
 * pitti will become an even bigger slacker
<TheMuso> heh
 * Sweetshark notes that the "dance prohibition" over easter is still legally in place in Hamburg, even though some radio station make to whole weekend to one big party.
<xclaesse> rodrigo_, any reason why Empathy3 is not build with webkit in gnome3 ppa?
<rodrigo_> xclaesse, hmm, no, no idea, maybe because it needs a newer webkit, like epiphany
<rodrigo_> ricotz should know better
<rodrigo_> but I guess it's because of that
<xclaesse> rodrigo_, it build fine here
<rodrigo_> let me see the branch...
<xclaesse> ah, non, actually it fails because of webkit, sorry
<xclaesse> /usr/include/webkit-3.0/webkit/webkitapplicationcache.h:28:1: error: function declaration isn't a prototype
<rodrigo_> xclaesse, ah, so it needs a newer version, right?
<xclaesse> webkit header seems broken
<rodrigo_> ah
<xclaesse> WEBKIT_API unsigned long long
<xclaesse> webkit_application_cache_get_maximum_size(); --> missing a void
<rodrigo_> is that fixed upstream?
<xclaesse> I've no idea
<rodrigo_> ok, I'll have a look later
<xclaesse> rodrigo_, FYI, I added that (void) and now empathy master builds fine with webkit
<xclaesse> so the fix for the ppa is trivial
<xclaesse> just need to get it upstream
<didrocks> Amaranth: http://lwn.net/Articles/438844/, FYI a long press is also valid
<rodrigo_> xclaesse, ok
<tjaalton> hmm, am I right that the wider grab area of the windows is the reason for bug 762335
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 762335 in compiz "if window is touching the edge, compiz thinks it's on both desktops" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/762335
<RAOF> I guess that fsck.btrfs being run on every boot is a bug which I should file :/
<tjaalton> also, if you have two overlapping windows and move the cursor slowly over the border of the top window, it'll start "flashing" the focus between the windows
<tjaalton> trying to find if that's filed already
<tjaalton> a big minus to the "borderless" windows from here :/
<rodrigo_> xclaesse, can you provide a merge proposal with that fix in for our gnome3 package branch then?
<xclaesse> rodrigo_, I don't even have the source code of webkit
<xclaesse> just patched in /usr/include manually :P
<rodrigo_> xclaesse, ok
<pitti> seb128: right, but over Easter weekend is bad, and we need to clear the old flat by mid-Maydata/incomplete-language-support-gnome.note.in ?
<seb128> pitti, right, I see
<pitti> rodrigo_: do you think that you can fix bug 649809 this week? (as it's currently marked RC for natty)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 649809 in gnome-settings-daemon "the session settings manager can try starting before the login screen one exits" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/649809
<pitti> rodrigo_: or asked the other way around, how many people does that actually affect? should it actually be a release blocker?
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes, I'm working on it, reviewing again and again the culprit patch, so yes, I hope to have it fixed very soon
<pitti> rodrigo_: ok, keeping it on the list then; thanks!
<rodrigo_> pitti, only a couple of people are affected, afaik from the bug's comments
<pitti> rodrigo_: I'll downgrade it to medium then (i. e. target of opportunity, SRUable, but doesn't block the release)
<seb128> rodrigo_, pitti: I don't think it's a blocker, fixing it at least in a SRU would be nice
<pitti> I agree
<seb128> pitti, it seemed a race on modern hardware and having no g-s-d is suboptimal and people get modern hardware over time so it feeled like worth targetting
<seb128> but seems to turn out it's not only a race, like seems to affect only some users
<rodrigo_> yes, the upstream fix seems to work for most people
<rodrigo_> but anyway, hope to have it fixed today or tomorrow
<rodrigo_> just need to review for the 100th time the patch and find the spot :)
<bigon> pitti: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=619257 << any clue why you have added python-apt-dbg in the build-dep?
<ubot2> Debian bug 619257 in pygobject "pygobject: [patch] fix test suite run during build" [Normal,Fixed]
<didrocks> pitti: thanks for the FFe/UIe hack (even if it's reverting back :/)
<pitti> bigon: we also run the tests in the -dbg build directory
<pitti> bigon: and something in the dependencies uses apt apparetnly
<bigon> ah ok
<pitti> it's weird indeed, but I haven't examined this very deeply
<pitti> just got the exception which complained about the missing module
<bigon> I've been asked about this by the debian python team
<pitti> well, if it gets in the way, just drop it; right now failed tests don't cause an FTBFS
<pitti> or drop it temporarily until the 2.7 transition has settled down?
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, bug 438868 has regressed in natty with a recent compiz or unity change
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 438868 in kile "Numerous applications have focus issues after emerging from a screensaver or suspend" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/438868
<chrisccoulson> firefox seems to be unusable again after the screensaver activates
<bigon> pitti: mmm the pkg also build fine without the python-apt
<pitti> bigon: did you get test case failures?
<bigon> I did a 'grep -i apt' in the buildlog an I saw nothing
<pitti> bigon: I mean any test failures in the -dbg builds which don't happen in the non-dbg ones?
<pitti> I didn't really expect it either, I just got a crash on something which p-apt provided
<pitti> but maybe that got fixed in the meantime
<rodrigo_> hmm, danilo reports that webkit 1.3.13.orig.tar.gz is different in Debian than in Ubuntu
<asac> what is strange that after upgrading to natty if feels like my thinkpad backlight at max level isn't as bright as it was before
<asac> is there a setting i can tweak/fix to get that corrected? or is that just my memory playing games with me?
<ogra_> apt-get remove LCD-sunglass ?
<asac> lol
 * asac checks if he has a *sunglass* package
<ogra_> heh
<asac> nope
<asac> not there
 * asac gets something to clean the screen ... maybe its just dirty
<asac> but it definitly was far dirtier in the past
<ogra_> probably it was less opaque dirt back then ;)
<pitti> Sweetshark: do you have a lo-l10n upload available? that'll be the last step for bug 740815
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740815 in xulrunner-2.0 "[FFe] Updates to enable us to drop xulrunner from main" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740815
 * pitti watches chrisccoulson smile
<asac> yay, xul out of main ;)
<Sweetshark> pitti: I have a dsc and it is still building in pbuilder.
<pitti> ah, thanks
<Sweetshark> the only thing changed in l10n is adding icelandic. So the risk would be pretty low. I will copy it to chintrap now ...
<chrisccoulson> awesome, is it gone now then? :)
 * rodrigo_ -> lunch
<ogra_> seb128, is there a reason why nothing in gconf ships a trigger for update-gconf-defaults ? seems a lot cleaner than having to call that from postinst scripts when adding gconf overrides
<seb128> ogra_, it was done before dpkg triggers and nobody added it since and gconf is deprecated
<seb128> but feel free to do a patch for it next cycle
<ogra_> ah, unity-2d uses it all over the place still
<ogra_> well, if its dead i wont bother :)
<seb128> we will aim at moving gconf out of the CD next cycle
<ogra_> just struck me that a trigger is saner than a maintainer script
<seb128> well it's not like what we have was not working
<ogra_> indeed
<fagan> got a small bug in the sound indicator for banshee and rhythmbox
<fagan> im playing a song in rb and the current song is being displayed as if it was playing banshee and the previous song is in rb
<fagan> ill get a screen
<fagan> http://ubuntuone.com/p/nKb/
<fagan> kenvandine: ^
<Sweetshark> pitti: hold it with the l10n upload, I fubared that maybe.
<pitti> Sweetshark: ok
<pitti> Sweetshark: well, hopefully not the "bar" part :)
<Sweetshark> pitti: there is hope still
<Sweetshark> ;)
<Sweetshark> pitti: what do I need to do to see LibreOffice private bugs? It is really annoying to get public bug that apport identifies as dupes of a private one, resulting in a "this is a dupe of bug foo, here is the link that you arent allowed to open" mail, leaving me fappergasted with a "wtf? I wanna have a look at the stacktrace!"
<didrocks> pitti: can you have a look at bug #748676? The code change isn't risky
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 748676 in unity "UIFe: Unity Dash button does not give adequate feedback" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/748676
<seb128> mterry, hi
<seb128> mterry, bug #752959 seems to be something quite some users run into, can you try to make it next on your todolist?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 752959 in libdbusmenu "gimp-2.6 crashed with SIGSEGV in g_variant_is_object_path()" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/752959
<pitti> didrocks: Mark already kind of signed it off, so that's fine
<didrocks> pitti: ok, I added the ubuntu-doc team then. Thanks
<kenvandine> how do folks feel about completely removing gir1.2-indicate-gtk-0.5 at this point in the cycle?  it has no rdepends and having it installed completely breaks anything that uses gir1.2-indicate-0.5
<kenvandine> and not simple to fix
<kenvandine> they share a namespace
<kenvandine> seb128, pitti: ^^
<seb128> kenvandine, I'm fine dropping it
<seb128> seems like it's not usuable now so nobody should be relying on it
<kenvandine> right
<kenvandine> and it has no rdepends...
<pitti> kenvandine: I see no problem with dropping it
<kenvandine> i have a fix for libindicate's broken vapi file, i'll upload that today and add a Replaces/Breaks
<kenvandine> pitti, it's an odd case, it adds a couple functions for libindicate, but no objects you would ever use
<kenvandine> so it can't be used on it's own
<aquarius>  I've just upgraded, and I get "Update standard folders to current language?" which seems to want to move my Desktop folder to Downloads. What's that all about? I haven't changed my language, and I don't think I wat my Desktop folder moved
<seb128> aquarius, seems mdz got it as well, do you have right now?
<fagan> kenvandine: did you get my ping earlier about the sound menu?
<kenvandine> fagan, no...
<kenvandine> what's up?
<aquarius> seb128, I do have it right now; I have carefully not closed the window in case anyone had questions about it :)
<fagan> kenvandine: Im getting a weird issue when I play songs in rb
<fagan> ill show you a screen
<fagan> kenvandine: http://ubuntuone.com/p/nKb/
<seb128> aquarius, what do you have in .config/user-dirs.locale
<seb128> ?
<fagan> kenvandine: it puts the currently playing song in banshee and the previous song in rb
<fagan> so its a little bit of a funny bug
<aquarius> seb128, en_US
<aquarius> seb128, which is annoying, since I shouldn't have :)
<seb128> aquarius, env | grep LC_
<aquarius> seb128, also note that on my machine that's ~/Applications/Settings/user-dirs.locale (because I've set my xdg folders differently).
<aquarius> seb128, LC_MESSAGES=en_GB.utf8
<seb128> ok
<seb128> so you did change your locale ;-)
<seb128> g_build_filename (g_get_user_config_dir (),
<seb128> 			       "user-dirs.locale", NULL);
<seb128> aquarius, ^ that should handle your dir fine
<seb128> (that's what the code do)
<kenvandine> fagan, weird!  file a bug on that and point me at it
<kenvandine> please
<fagan> kenvandine: kk
<seb128> aquarius, what do you have in user-dirs.dirs?
<kenvandine> so white wedding was the previous song?
<fagan> kenvandine: oh crap I mean the other way around
<kenvandine> ok
<fagan> it fleetwood mac was the previous
<kenvandine> just describe it in the bug :)
<fagan> yeah
<kenvandine> and banshee isn't even running right?
<fagan> kenvandine: correct
<aquarius> seb128, user-dirs.dirs is http://paste.ubuntu.com/595521/
<aquarius> seb128, it is quite possible that I did change my locale in the past and did it wrong (or did it right but only did half the work) but if I did it was *ages* ago. :)
<aquarius> blimey, there's a lot of stuff in ~/.config which needs bugs filing about not hardcoding ~/.config as the path. :-)
<fagan> kenvandine: and this is in natty with all updates install btw
<fagan> Bug #764657
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 764657 in indicator-sound "rhythmbox is displaying the current song in banshee's indicator and the previous song in its indicator" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/764657
<seb128> aquarius, ok, so upstream doesn't have a en_GB locale and we got one recently from the launchpad translation export
<seb128> aquarius, which explain why you just go the dialog
<seb128> aquarius, it detected a locale mismatch with the config and what you use and found a translation for the new one so asked if you want to use that
<aquarius> seb128, OK. I mean, I'm happy, I can deal with it. What's more concerning is that my dad would have no idea what it means, and that the dialog says "You have logged in in a new language" which suggests that I changed something, when I didn't.
<aquarius> seb128, I think this is bug https://launchpad.net/bugs/209513
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 209513 in xdg-user-dirs "After upgrade, "Update standard folders to current language" threatens to rename your home folder" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> aquarius, right that dialog is suboptimal, especially if you consider en_US and en_GB which are not very different language
<seb128> aquarius, it's meant to be a "first login is in english because your language is not on the CD, you install the langpack, restart the session and it asks if you want those folders in your locale"
<aquarius> seb128, yeah, that was my thought. The dialog is all "you changed something and it's broken things" and I'm all "I didn't change anything! don't move my desktop folder!", which is why I thought I'd mention it :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> aquarius, the wording is confusing, is that an old install upgraded?
<aquarius> seb128, yep. this machine was originally hardy, when I bought it, and has been upgraded through all the releases up to the very latest :)
<seb128> aquarius, did you close the dialog btw? or can you screenshot it?
<seb128> aquarius, I think what it tries to tell you is that it will rename the "download" dir from desktop (which we used to set it to) to downloads
<GunnarHj> pitti: Hi Martin,
<GunnarHj> pitti: Thanks for fixing the guest-session code I proposed. Stupid of me to miss filenames starting with dots. :(
<GunnarHj> pitti: The idea struck me when writing a help doc: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-doc/gnome-user-docs/natty/view/head:/gnome-help/C/shell-guest-session.page
<pitti> hey GunnarHj; no probl3em
<aquarius> seb128, dialog screenshot at http://ubuntuone.com/p/nLD/
<seb128> aquarius, right, it's a confusing dialog
<seb128> aquarius, it wants to makes you download location point to Downloads rather than Desktop
<aquarius> seb128, yeah, that's what I think it's doing. However, I like my downloads going onto my desktop, so I'm OK with saying "Keep Old Names", except...will this screw up a future upgrade? Will I get asked many times to rename it until I give in? It's worrying :)
<seb128> aquarius, so in summary "that dialog sucks we know but it shouldn't show for lot of users"
<seb128> aquarius, you can click "keep it", it will update the stored locale do be en_GB and will not display it until next time you change locale ;-)
<aquarius> seb128, ok. I think the bug report covers most of the issues, so I'll affects-me-too the bug and leave it at that
<seb128> aquarius, thanks
<aquarius> seb128, cheers for helping with my confusion :)
<seb128> yw ;-)
<mterry> seb128, whoah, sorry for late reply to your ping about bug 752959 (using a different computer today and not used to notifications).  I can look at it
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 752959 in libdbusmenu "gimp-2.6 crashed with SIGSEGV in g_variant_is_object_path()" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/752959
<seb128> mterry, no worry, I can understand you have enough of my ping by now and put me in your ignore list :p
<seb128> did you check if ted if he has any idea about this one?
<seb128> tedg, ^
 * tedg was glad mterry was looking at that one ;-)
<seb128> mterry, one bug said it stopped happening after uninstalling the overlay scrollbars but that seems a bit weird, I still added the info to the bug in case
<tedg> The only thing I could think of is that we're not getting the XID of the window and thus making a bad path.
<tedg> Perhaps we need to handle that.
<seb128> tedg, ^ if you didn't read the scrollbar comment
<seb128> not sure if the scrollbars could mess on what has the focus
<tedg> Yeah, we should just disable those ;-)
<seb128> or on what xid you get
<tedg> It shouldn't... as we're just asking GTK for the info.
<tedg> It might be a race of some sort that's getting adjusted.
<chrisccoulson> mvo, if i want to install a handler for a particular mimetype (say, a browser plugin), can I do this with sessioninstaller?
<ogra_> chrisccoulson, so you dont want to switch to dillo as default in oneric ? why is that ?
<chrisccoulson> ogra_, NO :)
<chrisccoulson> heh ;)
<ogra_> :)
<chrisccoulson> ogra_ - you saw my response then?
<ogra_> yep, indeed
<mvo> chrisccoulson: yeah, that should work
<chrisccoulson> mvo - cool, thanks!
<Sweetshark> pitti: I might have found the issue in l10n. pbuilding now to confirm
<Sweetshark> dillo sucks. lynx is the one true browser!
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> Sweetshark, you should come to the default browser session at UDS then
<chrisccoulson> perhaps we will have lynx as default ;)
<asac> i guess the fact that i see the tray symbol of twinkle floating below the global menubar is by-design?
<nessita> hi seb128! in bug #761731 I think you missed the fact that the scroll bar is indeed required, see how the "Show me my Ubuntu One folder" is not complete in the screenshot
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 761731 in ubuntuone-control-panel "displays scrollbars by default when not required" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/761731
<seb128> nessita, hey, sorry if the "not required" was not rightly worded but the dialog takes half of the vertical screen space so I would rather like to see the dialog taking a few extra pixels and not having a scrollbar ;-)
<nessita> seb128: I see. The problem is that once you install the package, you will get more stuff there, and we want to avoid resizing the contents, so we need to save that space beforehand
<nessita> seb128: not sure if my explanation makes sense :-/
<seb128> nessita, well it seems that with 15 extra pixels you would have no scrollbar displayed but they would still display later if required, anyway it's a detail
<seb128> nessita, the first time I had a lot of empty space, like half the scrollarea widget but it didn't happen again when I tried again for the screeenshot
<nessita> seb128: right, but that is highly dependent on the font (size, dpi) you're using, so we should not rely on that...
<nessita> seb128: we have another bug reporting that some of the widgets are not properly drawn in the services tab, see bug #750309
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 750309 in ubuntuone-control-panel "Services tab layout doesn't work right" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/750309
<nessita> seb128: maybe that was the issue you are referrring to?
<seb128> nessita, no, but it seems like it's doing some show,hide on start, I can see the scrollbar being half scrolled for a one second and then it switches to the normal position
<seb128> nessita, but don't worry about it, just close my bug
<nessita> seb128: ok! /me loves closing bugs :-P
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> chrisccoulson: i think we need to revisit galeon, actually
<desrt> chrisccoulson: it's really a great browser
<chrisccoulson> desrt, we don't even have that in the archive any more ;)
<desrt> chrisccoulson: and with the increased testing that it would get, i'm sure it would improve quite a lot!
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> :)
<desrt> chrisccoulson: i didn't know that "in the archive" was a requirement
 * desrt walks away mumbling... fascists...
<chrisccoulson> desrt, it definitely wouldn't be difficult for us to support. it doesn't seem to have had a release for over 4 years, which means that it is zero maintenance :)
<desrt> no need to worry about the security update policy
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> so, midori, anyone?
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<gord> no Mosaic fans?
<desrt> NCSA A-OK!
 * desrt now knows what posterboard he needs to get printed to bring to the session
<chrisccoulson> i think there will be a lot of suggestions at the session ;)
<chrisccoulson> desrt - are you going to be at UDS?
<desrt> yup, times two.
<asac> chrisccoulson: default browser session again?
<chrisccoulson> asac - https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-desktop/2011-April/002885.html
<asac> chrisccoulson: what are the odds that ffox gets demoted? anyone important really pushing for chromium still?
<chrisccoulson> i just posted quite a lengthy reply
<chrisccoulson> asac - there isn't really anyone pushing atm
<desrt> i'll be in the session arguing for firefox
<desrt> google already controls enough of my life :)
<asac> bah
<chrisccoulson> asac - https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-desktop/2011-April/002988.html was my response
<chrisccoulson> desrt, \o/
<asac> lets hope that was ok ;) ... otherwise you should hide at UDS ;)
<desrt> i really intend to bring up the topic of which software is developed by a better process
<desrt> and by better i do mean 'more in line with how we all wish the world could be'
<desrt> the mozilla guys are doing it absolutely right
<asac> firefox user-experience wins all pitches for everony seriously looking still ... ;)
<asac> yeah
<asac> chrisccoulson: good!
<seb128> pitti, did you decide on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/zsh/+bug/762286
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 762286 in zsh "Please merge zsh 4.3.11-4 from Debian" [Wishlist,New]
<seb128> ?
<seb128> it's in the sponsoring queue and I'm not sure what to do with it
<pitti> no strong opinion, but should be ok to upload; the PPA built, and Daniel tested it a bit
<seb128> pitti, it migrated to testing in debian as well
<seb128> pitti, ok, let's upload then, thanks
<pitti> ah, good
<seb128> pitti, what about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/+source/ubuntu-sso-client/+bug/709494
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 709494 in ubuntu-sso-client/stable-1-0 "[SRU] Missing user's name field" [High,Fix committed]
<kenvandine> pitti, i've uploaded libindicate, would be great to get that pushed through
<pitti> kenvandine: done
<kenvandine> pitti, thx
<rickspencer3> bryceh, I'm interested in the status of the i915 external monitor bug, when you get back
<tkamppeter> pitti, around?
<pitti> tkamppeter: hello again
<bryceh> rickspencer3, pete's bug or another?
<rickspencer3> bryceh, silbs' actually
<chrisccoulson> pitti, it seems that icedtea-web is build-depending on xulrunner-dev again btw
<pitti> without an alternative? *sigh*
<pitti> sorry, need to go, time for sports; see you tomorrow!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I thought that already was fixed?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, it looks like it got dropped though :(
<pitti> chrisccoulson: see #devel
 * pitti runs
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks
<bryceh> rickspencer3, looks like we needed some data captured before/after the blank screen, which we're still waiting on from silbs, but another reporter who thinks they have the same problem gave the files so we sent those upstream.
<rickspencer3> urk
<rickspencer3> bryceh, given where we are in the cycle, is this something we can fix in an SRU?
 * rickspencer3 shivers
<bryceh> and it turned out the other person's data was useless anyway (same data before and after, which sounds not right)
<rickspencer3> bryceh, so you need silbs to respond?
<rickspencer3> I can ping her if you want
<rickspencer3> she can't be the only one having this issue
<bryceh> rickspencer3, the bug is going to be a kernel issue, so will require a kernel patch, and so it falls into kernel team policies as far as getting an SRU in
<rickspencer3> bryceh, ack
<rickspencer3> so, if didn't SRU we'd need to put a special kernel in a PPA?
<rickspencer3> ouch
<rickspencer3> bryceh, want me to ask silbs to grab the info you need?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, I haven't seen that many blank screen arrandale bugs that match what she's seeing; blank screen bugs *tend* to be fairly hardware specific though
<rickspencer3> bryceh, interesting
<rickspencer3> well, it's only when she's trying to use an external monitor
<bryceh> rickspencer3, yes; I assumed from mdz's post that he was going to help gather it but no recent reply from him - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libdrm/+bug/747205/comments/34
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 747205 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[arrandale] Black screen on all outputs when external VGA is connected" [Medium,Confirmed]
<rickspencer3> affects 7 people and 3 dupes :/
<bryceh> rickspencer3, ah yes and of course no sooner did I say that previous line than I spot two other similar bugs
<rickspencer3> :)
<mdz> bryceh, how can I help with 747205
<bryceh> mdz, can you collect the files mentioned in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libdrm/+bug/747205/comments/34 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 747205 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[arrandale] Black screen on all outputs when external VGA is connected" [Medium,Confirmed]
<bryceh> mdz, another reporter provided the files but they weren't usable (and we'd rather have authentic data from the original reporter anyway)
<mdz> bryceh, ok, can do
<bryceh> rickspencer3, hmm I'm wondering if this is a recent kernel regression, because like I said I hadn't been seeing these types of bugs for a while and now a bunch seem to have sprung up
<rickspencer3> bryceh, only in i915?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, guess today I'll investigate these reports
<bryceh> rickspencer3, arrandale
<rickspencer3> dang it
<rickspencer3> ok bryceh, I guess we'll have to start thinking about kernel SRUs to pick up fixes
<bryceh> from what I can tell silbs' system is arrandale not i915?
<rickspencer3> would be great to know specifically what is going on
<bryceh> rickspencer3, yeah
<rickspencer3> bryceh, ooh, I dunno, I thought it was i915 based on what lspci said
<rickspencer3> but looking at the bug
<bryceh> rickspencer3, wish we had someone on the kernel side dedicated to graphics...  I feel like I'm just a pinch hitter sometimes with KMS bugs now days
<rickspencer3> bryceh, well, it would be good to get to the bottom of this for a next step, anyway
<bryceh> rickspencer3, we've been having a LOT of problems relating to arrandale this cycle... previously it was freezes
<bryceh> we'd assumed sandybridge would be the problematic one, and a few of us X guys got ahold of SB systems to prepare for that
<rickspencer3> bryceh, well, there seem to be enough dupes that you should be able to get to the bottom of this, and we can start planning a fix :/
<rickspencer3> I think the computers work other than the lack of the external monitor
<rickspencer3> at least I hope so
 * rickspencer3 steps away
<bryceh> rickspencer3, yep will do.  I'll go through the other reports today and see if I can find an active tester to help us.  And see what other info is at hand.
<rickspencer3> thanks man
<chrisccoulson> note to self - don't open my daughters bedroom door to check she's asleep after she's only been quiet for a couple of minutes
<nessita> hello crowd, any idea why aptdaemon is failing when requesting an install with NameError: global name 'trans' is not defined? full trace https://pastebin.canonical.com/46282/
<tremolux> chrisccoulson: haha  :)
<chrisccoulson> hi tremolux :)
<tremolux> chrisccoulson: howdy!
<chrisccoulson> my daughter is going crazy tonight, she just doesn't want to go to sleep
<tremolux> chrisccoulson: how old is she now?
<chrisccoulson> tremolux, she's 17 months old now
<tremolux> chrisccoulson: heh, both my kids were like that too when they were little  :)  that's why your comment hit home
<tremolux> chrisccoulson: time to read her another story sounds like  ;)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<fagan> ronoc: hey, I filed that bug about the sound menu do you need any more info from me?
<fagan> About it displaying in both the rb and banshee slots to be more exact
<ronoc> fagan, yeah, looks odd. the sound service for each player makes sure to its own instance of the particular mpris object
<ronoc> fagan, i can't reproduce it, can you each time ?
<fagan> ronoc: its happening every time for me
<fagan> but its only for rb not for banshee
<didrocks> good night everyone
<fagan> so it might be something to do with rb
<ronoc> fagan, right so banshee is not running, you start rb and then the bug can be seen ?
<fagan> ronoc: give me a sec and ill do it
<ronoc> i'll try also
 * fagan just made sure both were down
<ronoc> fagan, I can't reproduce it so can't kenvandine
<fagan> ronoc: yep I just got it there
<fagan> first song
<ronoc> weird
<fagan> played with rb and its displayed in banshee's slot
<kenvandine> fagan, and haven't seen it since?
<fagan> kenvandine: I just reproduced it
<fagan> again
<kenvandine> oh... interesting
<kenvandine> wonder why we can't
<ronoc> kenvandine, fagan rb version ?
<kenvandine> 0.13.3-0ubuntu5
<fagan> Rhythmbox 0.13.3
<fagan> (from the about box)
<ronoc> yup
<fagan> 0.13.3-0ubuntu5
<ronoc> banshee 2.0.0-1ubuntu2
<fagan> same
<kenvandine> same here
<fagan> AMD64?
<kenvandine> ys
<ronoc> no
<ronoc> x86
<fagan> any place I can poke to get whats going on?
<ronoc> how about dfeet
<ronoc> can you open up dfeet and take a look at the mpris metadata property
<kenvandine> ronoc, how about i hold off a few minutes on this distro patch
<ronoc> on the banshee interface
<kenvandine> in case you come up with something for this bug
<ronoc> kenvandine, sounds good, but I'm not working all night :)
<kenvandine> ronoc, understand :)
<fagan> well im going to head off in 10 minutes myself just wanted to check if there was anything needed for the bug
<kenvandine> ronoc, i am ready to upload with this patch, so just give me the word :)
<ronoc> kenvandine, cool
<ronoc> fagan, grand
<ronoc> fagan, do you know about dfeet
<fagan> not particularly :)
<kenvandine> d-feet is extremely useful
<ronoc>  fagan, okay apt-get install d-feet
<kenvandine> :)
<fagan> got it already
<ronoc> cool
<ronoc> fagan, so while you can see the bug
<fagan> so you just put in the address of the dbus server and can listen to it?
<ronoc> fagan, open d-feet, go the banshee mpris name
<ronoc> click on the session tab
<ronoc> session bus tab rather
<ronoc> see it ?
<fagan> yep I see the list
<fagan> banshee isnt on the list just rb
<ronoc> quel, go to org.mpris.Mediaplayer2.Banshee ?
<ronoc> huh
<ronoc> oh
<fagan> I mean im playing the song in rb
<ronoc> oh of course sorry
<ronoc> wtf
<fagan> and the bug is still happening so shouldnt it have banshee and rb there if its putting it into both slots?
<ronoc> fagan, do you use banshee at all ? i.e. do you have the sound menu integration turned on in banshee ?
<fagan> yep im on the default ubuntu except that im using rb
<ronoc> fagan, so you use banshee at all ?
<fagan> so I have the menu integration turned on and it works like normal if banshee is on
<kenvandine> ronoc,  plus it is giving him player controls for banshee
<ronoc> do even
<fagan> ooooh interesting
<fagan> so its just displaying the song info in the banshee slot
<fagan> the controls still work for banshee
<ronoc> kenvandine, well that was mpt's instruction, he wants the players controls for banshee exposed even when the player is not running
<ronoc> oh sorry i get it
<kenvandine> oh yeah
<kenvandine> but if he didn't have the extension it wouldn't right?
<ronoc> don't know. must test. I can't see how it should happen
<fagan> oooh and if I play a song in banshee it keeps the slot but rb still trys to display the currently playing song in banshee's one and the previous in rb's slot
<kenvandine> oh this is interesting
<ronoc> kenvandine, can you reproduce this at all ?
<kenvandine> ronoc, so if banshee is running and rb isn't, i don't see player controls for rb
<fagan> then if I kill banshee rb takes back the slot
<kenvandine> but if banshee isn't running and rb is i do see player controls for banshee?
<ronoc> kenvandine, yeah that is correct
<fagan> yeah thats correct
<kenvandine> ronoc, ok... that is a bit odd feeling
<fagan> it is slightly but thats mpt's design
<ronoc> banshee being the default player gets special privileges
<kenvandine> i see
<ronoc> hyperair, likes this :)
<kenvandine> i thought we displayed those regardless
 * kenvandine doesn't usually have more than one installed
<fagan> kenvandine: well I like rb more so I have both
<kenvandine> fagan, are you playing a playlist?
<kenvandine> or can you repro it just by hitting next?
 * ronoc has 6 players in his menu
<fagan> kenvandine: nope
<fagan> I dont use playlists
<kenvandine> ok
<fagan> I just hit random
<fagan> it is an interesting one
<fagan> ronoc: so is there a place I should be looking for in d-feet?
<fagan> I have the mpris one for rb open
<kenvandine> ok, i can't reproduce...
<kenvandine> crazy
<ronoc> fagan, well not really since banshee is not running
<fagan> kenvandine: must be something on my install
<kenvandine> funny, "Crazy" by aerosmith is my current track too :)
 * ronoc goes back to trying to reproduce
<fagan> kenvandine: my one was "here I go again" from whitesnake
<fagan> :)
<kenvandine> :)
<JFo> a bug for you: bug 764141
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 764141 in nautilus "[Natty-Beta2] Ubuntu doesn't recognize USB Music player, mounts it as a disk and treats it like one." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/764141
 * JFo puts a bow on it ;-)
<fagan> JFo: nice present
<JFo> fagan, :-)
<JFo> I have many to give (I wish I could give them ;))
<seb128> JFo, by putting the version in the title you don't win points to get your bug read ;-)
<fagan> hehe
<JFo> fagan, I am mainly interested in whether this is something for you guys to look at, I don't want it to sit and be missed.
<JFo> seb128, I didn't do that, must have been the reporter :)
<fagan> JFo: Im on the u1 team im just here to cause trouble
<seb128> JFo, it's like to sit there though
<JFo> fagan, I can appreciate that :-)
<seb128> likely
<JFo> seb128, I'm ok with that. I just want to make sure I know where bugs would be most able to be worked when they are not pure kernel
<fagan> brb just restarting just to check if it goes away
<seb128> JFo, onthose media player misdetected as a player media-player-info is correct as a first guess
<JFo> seb128, Sarvatt beat me to it :)
<JFo> but thank you, I will definitely make a note of that
<kenvandine> ronoc, any luck?
<ronoc> kenvandine, nope
<ronoc> kenvandine, i gotta go soon
<kenvandine> ok, i'll proceed then :)
<ronoc> kenvandine, cool
<kenvandine> have a good night ronoc
<fagan> ronoc: close the bug
<ronoc> fagan, really ?
<ronoc> fagan, what was the issue ?
<seb128> JFo, getting an udevadm info --export-db log is usually useful there as well
<fagan> must have been something with an update and me not restarting or something
<ronoc> kenvandine, thanks, you too
<fagan> ronoc: its gone after the restart
<JFo> seb128, will request that
<ronoc> fagan, grand, take it easy, talk soon
<seb128> JFo, thanks
<fagan> ronoc: night night
<fagan> :)
<ronoc> later guys
<JFo> seb128, my pleasure
<JFo> :)
 * fagan tries one more thing 
<seb128> JFo, though your bug already have a udevdb.txt so that might not be needed there
<seb128> JFo, I guess apport collect those infos for linux bugs
<seb128> JFo, if you need someone to ping about that sort of issues it's usually pitti's land
<JFo> yep, it does... was checking that myself. too much to keep track of sometimes :)
<JFo> seb, thanks for the info
<seb128> JFo, yw
<xclaesse> rodrigo_, remember the build issue for empathy with webkit?
<xclaesse> it is already fixed in upstream with git commit 8dd756f90c0140f620f02164da9e04354a6d0ec9
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - you've been busy with bug triaging haven't you? ;)
<chrisccoulson> i just noticed all the recent e-mails in my inbox have your name on them
<chrisccoulson> want to triage some firefox bugs? :P
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you better start triaging galeon bugs instead of trolling me
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> i'll buy you beer at UDS ;)
<seb128> you will see when it's going to be default next cycle :p
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<seb128> \o/
<chrisccoulson> i thought we had already agreed that lynx will be the default?
<chrisccoulson> there's no point in having the session - it's already decided now ;)
<seb128> don't confuse me with those server hippies :p
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> chrisccoulson, it's not really "triaging" btw, I just opened the gedit list and figured there was a stack of bugs untriaged I could care less about there
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<seb128> so I go through and set the setting to low with a stock reply to either get a stacktrace or send the bug upstream or add info basically
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you watch all desktop bugs still?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i still watch quite a few desktop packages. but, "watch" normally means that i scan my inbox occasionally and delete anything i've not been assigned too ;)
<chrisccoulson> maaan, firefox 6 is way to stable. it should be more broken than this :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, 6? they skipped 5?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, seems your approch to desktop bugs is similar to mine nowadays ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - 5 is on the way ;)
<seb128> "go over the titles, read a few if the title seems interting, mark as read"
<seb128> interting -> interesting
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's my approach :)
<seb128> that's how I end up opening the gedit (or $component) every now and then and figure the list start by 60 untriaged bugs, then I spend half an hour going through and setting priorities to low to every that don't seem something important and stock reply a few on the way
<seb128> we need a bug "right, that's a bug but it's minor and we will not work on it so please hide if from my list"
<seb128> we need a "button"
<seb128> rather ;-)
<mterry> tedg, guh, I'm interested in you taking a look at bug 752959 for me.  I've been staring at server.c in dbusmenu, trying to see how we could end up calling bus_get_cb with a bogus user_data, but I can't see it
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 752959 in libdbusmenu "gimp-2.6 crashed with SIGSEGV in g_variant_is_object_path()" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/752959
<desrt> man that GVariant stuff is so buggy
<seb128> oh, a desrt!
<desrt> hi seb :)
<seb128> hey desrt ;-)
<desrt> going insane yet?
<desrt> aside from all of the 'unity sux!!' bugs it actually seems like a fairly quiet cycle...
<seb128> well it has been different for sure this cycle
<seb128> but I can't say it has been a quiet cycle, it has been as busy as usual or busier with different upstream ;-)
<desrt> ya.. i guess from my gnome perspective it just seems quiet
<desrt> oneric is sure to be more fun from the gnome side
<seb128> indeed, for some definition of fun
<desrt> :)
<seb128> I would say "interesting" rather
<desrt> robert said that you guys are planning to phase out the gnome3 ppa
<seb128> did he?
<desrt> ya
<desrt> sort of makes sense, i guess
<seb128> I didn't talk to him for like 2 weeks
<desrt> as you start merging stuff into oneric...
<seb128> you mean next cycle?
<desrt> yes
<seb128> yeah, makes sense
<seb128> we want to land GNOME3 next cycle
<desrt> i started a new ppa for 'upstream gnome' packages
<seb128> I'm not fully happy about it
<desrt> pure shell experience, etc.
<seb128> but I don't see a better realistic way
<seb128> desrt, you did?
<desrt> ya
<seb128> I'm wondering how many ppa we will get duplicates for that
<desrt> got a bleeding edge glib in there right now which is serving me nicely
<seb128> there is a "gnome-remix" one as well
<desrt> (which i actually need for the work i'm doing at the moment)
<desrt> interesting.
<desrt> i don't know how much effort i plan to put in... just have glib/gtk so far
<seb128> I wish those people would work on the GNOME3 though
<seb128> they seem to mostly duplicate it for no reason
<desrt> ya... i've heard that there are a few that are almost straight copies
<desrt> anyway... robert mentioned that he might want to try to setup some recipies for daily builds
<seb128> brave man
<desrt> maybe i should call the ppa 'grumpy' :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> let's try to get GNOME3 properly in
<desrt> you have some gripes about gnome3 itself, don't you?
<seb128> I will already be happy if users are fine with that
<seb128> I can see them complaining a lot though
<desrt> new control centre, etc.
<seb128> yes
<seb128> which is what makes me a bit nervous
<desrt> ya... it's pretty rough at the moment
<seb128> I can see users not agreeing with the dropping of some of the options
<desrt> i mean... this is gnome and we're used to having no options
<desrt> but this is a bit ridiculous :)
<seb128> or with the "just use gnome-tweak"
<seb128> I'm wondering if we will need to step up to put back some features back in the distro in one way or the other
<tedg> mterry, I agree with your assessment, I don't see anything either.  Looking at some of the dups...
<tedg> mterry, I think that bug 738568 is not referencing the server before getting the bus.
<tedg> mterry, But I'm not sure it's the same.
<tedg> mterry, I'll get that one.
<bigon> pitti: around?
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-04-19
<RAOF> *Chromium-browser bundles a mesa fork?*
<kklimonda> RAOF: ? :D
<kklimonda> that would be funny
<RAOF> Well, it does.  I presume we don't use it, though.
 * TheMuso sighs. Thats just poor form.
<TheMuso> I hope we don't use it, but I wouldn't be surprised if we do.
<TheMuso> No we don't.
<TheMuso> The build deps for chromium browser show that it depends on mesa for building/running.
<rickspencer3> maybe chromium should keep their own kernel in /opt as well?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, hey, you might know this ... is there a stored parsing of the desktopfiles anywhere?
<rickspencer3> like in a database or something?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, like a cache?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, well, a cached copy of a data structure, yeah
<robert_ancell> bamf loads information from .desktop files for running processes, but I don't think it's generic
<rickspencer3> so bamf parses every .desktop file each time?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, just the first time a process starts
<rickspencer3> well, sure
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, what devilish scheme do you have...
<rickspencer3> but really?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I'm thinking about making an application launcer app
<rickspencer3> you stick it on the launcher ...
<rickspencer3> you activate it with meta #
<rickspencer3> then you get a list of categories ...
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, right, so you want a list of the available applications
<rickspencer3> then, etc...
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I think I need a datastructure that stores applications by category
<rickspencer3> so I could go:
<rickspencer3> for cat in categories:
<rickspencer3>     for app in cat:
<rickspencer3>         print app["name"]
<rickspencer3> for example
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, so desktop-file-utils is the package that is run when an application is installed/removed.  It runs update-desktop-database which builds a mime table.  But I think thats all you get
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, yeah, I think you have to build your own database on startup
<rickspencer3> weak!
<robert_ancell> RAOF, ^^ is that how docky does it?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, not docky, the quick launcher app which name escapes me right now
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Dunno, but taht's how Do does it :)
<rickspencer3> I bet there is some hideous dbus programming that I could that is even worse than parsing the files meself
<robert_ancell> Do.  Yeah that name just has too many letters for me to remember
<RAOF> :P
<rickspencer3> :)
<RAOF> rickspencer3: I don't think there's anything on the other end of a dbus connection that would help.  Unless I finish the expose-Do-over-dbus and you wanted to query Do's universe :)
<rickspencer3> step 1: make desktop.py module :/
<rickspencer3> RAOF, yeah, I was being a smart ass
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, the parsing is quite simple.  GKeyFile actually already has a bunch of Desktop file specific defines etc
<robert_ancell> it's just the startup time cost and technically having to monitor the directory which is the pain
<rickspencer3> just pointing out that if we did provide a convenience like this for app developers, it would be hidden behind some hideous undocumented dbus goo
<robert_ancell> heh, totally
<RAOF> Isn't there already a .desktop file specific API?  From memory there is in GTK#.
<rickspencer3> aaaah
<rickspencer3> noooooo
<robert_ancell> RAOF, I guess they made their own one
<RAOF> Or maybe that's just GKeyFile.
<walters> rickspencer3: the menu system is more insane than just parsing .desktop files; you probably want gnome-menus
<walters> which i have actually been hacking up all weekend
<rickspencer3> oh?
<rickspencer3> gnome-menus does look promising
<rickspencer3> but who is this vuntz character?
<rickspencer3> I've heard he's scary ;)
<rickspencer3> walters, are there .menu files lying around in Ubuntu that I can mooch from?
<walters> chrome probably has a mesa fork for doing GL from a renderer thread
<walters> the same reason they fork webkit
<walters> partially to turn random system calls like gettimeofday() into proxy requests
<walters> rickspencer3: the default is applications.menu
<chrisccoulson> hi RAOF!
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: Hello, my favourite compiz-hanging man!
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> compiz loves me!
<broder> hey RAOF: are you planning to do another multihead session at budapest?
<RAOF> broder: I wasn't planning on it, unless you think it'd be useful.  I was planning on implementing what we decided upon in Orlando in O, though, 'cause we'll have the new control centre.
<broder> we probably don't need a full session. mostly i still want to try and convince people that we should try to only clone projectors and extend monitors
 * RAOF goes to drop off his car for servicing.
<johan> robert_ancell: hi, around?
<robert_ancell> johan, hello
<johan> robert_ancell: hi, I wondering what needs to be done to get a patch included in the latest pygtk release into natty?
<johan> well, pygobject actually
<robert_ancell> johan, you need a freeze exception, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess#Milestone%20freeze%20Exceptions%20%28like%20BetaFreeze%29
<johan> robert_ancell: it's an ABI break, an application working in pre-natty won't work in natty, so it's pretty serious
<robert_ancell> johan, is there a bug open?
<johan> robert_ancell: the upstream bug is https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=646437
<ubot2> Gnome bug 646437 in gobject ""metaclass hackery" no longer works with PyGObject-2.28" [Major,Resolved: fixed]
<johan> do I need to open one in launchpad?
<robert_ancell> johan, yes please, and link it to the upstream.  Do you have a fixed package?
<johan> robert_ancell: nope, not that good at packaging
<robert_ancell> johan, ok, please open a bug with the rationale as to why it needs fixing in natty, and I'll do an updated package
<johan> robert_ancell: will do, should I subscribe you to the bug?
<robert_ancell> johan, just post it here
<johan> robert_ancell: here it is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pygobject/+bug/765398
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 765398 in pygobject "PyGObject 2.28.3 breaks ABI" [Undecided,New]
<johan> not sure how to link it to natty, my launchpad foo is not great today
<robert_ancell> johan, thanks
<bryceh> rickspencer3, around?
<rickspencer3> hi bryceh
<rickspencer3> s'up?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, heya... well I've been poking into this arrandale black screen bug most of the day today
 * rickspencer3  braces
<bryceh> rickspencer3, well, Arrandale is a subset of "Ironlake", and I found there's a bunch of Ironlake-specific kernel patches that have been proposed to send upstream but are not yet in any upstream trees
<rickspencer3> bryceh, may I presume this is in drivers, and upstream is the kernel?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, I went through all of the similar bug reports I could find - there's a bunch against arrandale - however many of them have subtly different symptoms
<bryceh> rickspencer3, correct; specifically the patches I'm wondering about are in "intel-drm-next-proposed", c.f. http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/intel-gfx/2011-April/010071.html
<rickspencer3> bryceh, so, what do you propose?
<bryceh> hmm
<bryceh> rickspencer3, well what I'd really like is if a kernel guy could spin up a build of the above git branch that we could have people test
<rickspencer3> bryceh, and if it works, keep it in a PPA, or SRU?
<bryceh> I'd like to send the bug reports upstream but have a sense upstream will simply ask that we have reporters test that intel-drm-next-proposed tree
<bryceh> rickspencer3, ideally an SRU to the kernel
<rickspencer3> bryceh, sounds good
<rickspencer3> can you please synch with some in the kernel team tomorrow?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, fwiw I read through all the patches in that proposed branch, but didn't spot one that was an obvious fix (although a lot of this code is a bit deep to me)
<bryceh> rickspencer3, will do
<rickspencer3> bryceh, it sounds like a bit of a long shot, tbh
<rickspencer3> but, worth a try
<bryceh> yeah fraid it may be so
<bryceh> it appears to me that given the amount of upstream churn around Ironlake, this may still be an area Intel is still in process of development on
<bryceh> er, grammar not my strong point be
<rickspencer3> riiight
<rickspencer3> well, it is what it is
<rickspencer3> bryceh, thanks for checking it out
<rickspencer3> can you please update the bug report?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, sure
<rickspencer3> I'm being summoned by swmbo
<rickspencer3> "dinner time" ;)
<bryceh> rickspencer3, fwiw I found that RedHat pretty much has as many bug reports about ext monitor problems on Arrandale as we do, if not more
<bryceh> (none of which have anything useful on them though unfortunately)
<rickspencer3> bryceh, well, at least we're chasing external monitor bugs, and not hard GPU freezes
 * rickspencer3 recalls Jaunty
<bryceh> heh, actually I had been chasing gpu freezes prior to this
<bryceh> rickspencer3, but yeah, the time invested in apport toolage since jaunty seems to be paying off
 * kenvandine hugs apport
<JanC> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/765422 --> one more compiz bug...
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 765422 in unity "apps started fullscreen in unity can never unfullscreen" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<RAOF> Excellent.  I seem to have reproduced chrisccoulson's compiz hang locally.  *Finally*!
<TheMuso> I don't envy you guys trying to sort out compiz issues.
<TheMuso> I do sympathize however.
<pitti> Good morning
<tjaalton> are these 'flash makes X crash' actually compiz hangs or what?
<tjaalton> reproducible on both ati and intel, it seems
<tjaalton> fullscreen flash
<RAOF> tjaalton: Bug report?  Are they holdovers from when there was a broken ia32-libs?
<RAOF> This one is *probably* intel missing a vblank interrupt and so never waking compiz up.
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I reapplied your changes to icedtea-web and uploaded
<tjaalton> RAOF: bug 764650 is with ati, bug 764456 is intel (though it's not clear it was fullscreen)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 764650 in xorg "Flash video with hardware acceleration causes X crash with radeon driver" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/764650
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 764456 in xorg-server "X crashes frequently with flash video playback" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/764456
<tjaalton> and I've witnessed flash hanging here, when the kids play with my laptop
<tjaalton> (intel 964)
<tjaalton> *965
<RAOF> That ati one *clearly* isn't a compiz problem, 'cause they're using kwin :)
<tjaalton> oh, bah :)
<tjaalton> wasn't paying attention there, maybe dmesg will have something interesting then
<RAOF> Gah!  That intel one looks like the record extension crash.
<RAOF> And, no, they're not compiz-caused.
<tjaalton> good
<tjaalton> there's a master bug for the record extension crash?
<tjaalton> looks like i've missed that completely
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> hey didrocks
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti, how are you?
<pitti> I'm great, thanks! how do you feel?
<RAOF> tjaalton: I don't think there is a master bug for the record extension crash.
<tjaalton> RAOF: just a normal bug then?-)
<RAOF> Uuummmâ¦
<tjaalton> if not, i could try to reproduce it and get a backtrace
<didrocks> pitti: I'm fine, thanks! Latest unity release this morning normally :)
<pitti> wohoo
<didrocks> hey RAOF, tjaalton
<pitti> out of interest, why today and not Thu?
<pitti> to have some leeway for regressions?
<tjaalton> didrocks: howdy
<didrocks> pitti: exactly. In addition, the whole team is in some kind of mini sprint in London from today until Thursday, so not really available
<didrocks> (but mini sprint not for that release)
<pitti> ah
<RAOF> didrocks: Heeeeelo.
<didrocks> RAOF: did you finally find the annoying freeze issues (after we sanitized a little bit compiz and unity)
<RAOF> didrocks: No, but I *do* have a system currently frozen the way chrisccoulson's system freezes that I'm attaching all sorts of gdb probes to :)
<didrocks> RAOF: "nice" :-)
<Sweetshark> Morning all!
<RAOF> But first, time for Â¾ of an hour of running around!
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark
<pitti> morning Sweetshark, wie gehts?
<didrocks> RAOF: enjoy :)
<Sweetshark> pitti: gut! libreoffice-l10n finally builds, dsc is on chinstrap.
<pitti> yippie
<pitti> Sweetshark: uploaded, thanks!
<Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: xulrunner-dev should be kickable then ..
<pitti> indeed
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'm great, thanks!
<robert_ancell> pitti, hey, you're the pygobject expert right?  What do you think about bug 765398?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 765398 in pygobject "PyGObject 2.28.3 breaks ABI" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/765398
<pitti> hey robert_ancell
<pitti> robert_ancell: right, I think we should do that, I read about it last night
<pitti> robert_ancell: want me to do that or do you want to?
<robert_ancell> pitti, you do it, I'm about to go and I think you'll know if there are side-effect better
<pitti> robert_ancell: ok, will do
<pitti> robert_ancell: two quick questions, if you still have a minute?
<robert_ancell> sure
<pitti> robert_ancell: the login oneiric meeting is in a couple of hours, in the middle of your night; will you actually join there, or did you brief someone else?
<robert_ancell> I'll be there, what is it done with?  I'm trying to find details now
<pitti> robert_ancell: other question, would you have some time to fix bug 760978? needs an upstream fix to actually add real translations to the .desktop file; some work, but not tricky
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 760978 in shotwell "Shotwell's desktop file contains English translations for all languages and cannot be translated" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/760978
<pitti> robert_ancell: standard phone call, not mumble I'm afraid :/
<robert_ancell> ok, will look at shotwell issue tomorrow
<pitti> robert_ancell: cheers
<chrisccoulson> nice, the latest firefox 6 nightly has a nice addition to the tabbar, borrowed from chrome :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: 6? what happened with 5?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - http://mozilla.github.com/process-releases/draft/development_specifics/ :)
<chrisccoulson> basically, mozilla-central has already closed for firefox 5, which is now being developed on the mozilla-aurora branch
<robert_ancell> ok, gtg, be back for meeting
<chrisccoulson> and mozilla-central is now on firefox 6 already ;)
<didrocks> pitti: I was supposed to join this meeting (was in the first couple of emails about it), did I miss something or I didn't receive anything? (I don't mind either way, more time for other things)
<pitti> didrocks: please do
<pitti> didrocks: 1400 CEST, Jason's conf line
<didrocks> pitti: ok thanks :)
<pitti> (if you are interested)
<didrocks> (fun that I was just thinking about it when I woke up this morning)
<didrocks> it == this topic
<seb128> hey didrocks pitti
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson robert_ancell
<pitti> hey seb128
<seb128> what meeting?
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, how are you?
<seb128> pitti, desktop meeting reminder!
<pitti> seb128: oh, thanks! I honestly forgot it today
<seb128> chrisccoulson, not sure yet, I would guess fine but I'm not awake enough yet to be sure ;-)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> pitti, ;-)
<rodrigo_> morning
<didrocks> pitti: because you dishonestly forget sometimes? :p
<didrocks> hey rodrigo_
<pitti> hey rodrigo_
<pitti> didrocks: 'zactly!
<didrocks> heh
<rodrigo_> hi didrocks, pitti
 * Sweetshark gets confused by all the talk about meetings.
<Sweetshark> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-04-19 <- but we have a meeting today?
<pitti> Sweetshark: yes, we will; need to send out the reminder
<bigon> pitti: mmmh we'll have to switch all the pkg (pygtk,...) to dh_python2 at once I think
<pitti> bigon: doesn't the extra library search path work?
<pitti> it does here
<bigon> pitti: I'm converting pygtk to dh_python2
<pitti> yay
<bigon> and it seems that I also have to convert python-gtkglext1
<pitti> bigon: you mean once you convert pygtk, the pygobject supplied search path stops working?
<bigon> pitti: 10:23 < bigon> hi, I've a "conflict" between dh_python2 and pusupport
<bigon> 10:24 < bigon> pysupport is putting some empty __init__.py file /var/lib/python-support/ and that prevent my module to work
<bigon> 10:28 < POX> packages that share a namespace have to use the same helper
<bigon> 10:28 < POX> you can use dh_python2 in all of them or dh_pysupport in all of them
<bigon> 10:30 < bigon> oh ok
<pitti> darn; it worked with just pygobject, but I haven't tried intermediate states; but anyway, it's just 5 packages or so
<bigon> pitti: http://pastebin.com/MrNDh5TE
<bigon> this is on natty
<rodrigo_> robert_ancell, ping
<pitti> I just don't understand why it works ATM, when pygobject uses dh_python2 and nothing else
<pitti> pygobject also ships e. g. /usr/lib/pyshared/python2.7/gtk-2.0/gio/_gio.so
<pitti> and yet I can use both that and stuff from /var/lib//python-support/python2.7/gtk-2.0/
<bigon> I tried yesterday evening on my machine at home (with python-gtkglext1 installed) let me try if it's not installed
<bigon> svn://svn.debian.org/svn/pkg-gnome/desktop/unstable/pygtk/ << could you look if it's ok?
 * pitti shakes fist at utterly broken websvn
 * bigon hope the debian team will migrate t git some day
<pitti> want me to look at some commit in particular?
<pitti> r27665?
<bigon> yes please
<pitti> bigon: looks fine to me
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i'm still getting "Error: uncaught exception: aPlacesNode must have _DOMElement set" in my error console in firefox :(
<chrisccoulson> i'm convinced that's my fault ;)
<primes2h> tkamppeter_: seb12
<primes2h> tkamppeter_: seb128: for some reason patch for bug #759811 is not applied.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 759811 in system-config-printer "gtkbuilder files incorrectly listed in the POTFILES.in and so are not translated" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/759811
<primes2h> I tried to build it locally
<primes2h> and strings in ui/ are not in the pot file
<bigon> pitti: if python-gtkglext1 is not installed it seems to work
<primes2h> There are more than 200 strings missing
<primes2h> 543 here now, should be more than 700 https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/system-config-printer/
<primes2h> seb128: tkamppeter_: btw, hello ;-)
<seb128> dpm, ^ can you reupload the template I gave you the other day?
<seb128> primes2h, thanks
<primes2h> seb128: you're welcome.
<dpm> seb128, primes2h, done, but unless fixed in the source package, the next package upload will override this manual upload again
<dpm> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/system-config-printer/+imports?field.filter_status=all&field.filter_extension=pot
<seb128> dpm, I've a package fixed building locally
<dpm> seb128, ok, cool
<seb128> dpm, http://ubuntuone.com/p/nSG/
<seb128> dpm, can you upload that one for me as well?
<seb128> dpm, the "Drop To Add Application" string was no in the previous version because the source was missing from the POTFILES.in, I will email the translators to tell them about it
<seb128> dpm, oh, that's an updated unity template in case that's not clear ;-)
<dpm> seb128, no worries, it was clear from the file name :) I've just uploaded it. Thanks for taking of the translators heads up
<seb128> dpm, yw ;-)
<tkamppeter> primes2h, hi
<seb128> tkamppeter, pitti: is there a vcs for system-config-printer?
<pitti> I don't think there is
<tkamppeter> seb128, only upstream GIT, no VCS for the packaging.
<seb128> I'm a fix for the template issue, should I just upload?
<seb128> (just add an includeof the langpack.mk rule)
<tkamppeter> seb128, simply upload it, I have no other fixes for s-c-p in the queue currently.
<seb128> tkamppeter, ok thanks
<seb128> pitti, what should we do for bugs like bug #763956
<seb128> ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 763956 in libimobiledevice "Please sync libimobildevice 1.1.0-3 from Debian experimental" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/763956
<seb128> i.e sync requests acked
<pitti> seb128: how do you mean? an archive admin needs to sync it
<seb128> pitti, can I sync it or will that bypass the queue and the review?
<pitti> seb128: yes and yes
<seb128> pitti, so you are basically saying it's fine to bypass the freeze review? ;-)
<pitti> right, that's what's happening with syncs
<rodrigo_> lucazade, around?
<pitti> but it already was reviewed and acked, so it's fine
<seb128> that's why I was not sure if I should do it or do a fakesync so it goes in the queue
<seb128> pitti, ok, thanks
<lucazade> rodrigo_ hi!
<rodrigo_> hi lucazade, I think I might have a fix for that g-s-d issue, so do you fancy some building/testing?
<lucazade> rodrigo_ of course, ready to test!
<rodrigo_> lucazade, ok, so -> bzr get lp:~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gnome-settings-daemon/really-fix-649809
<rodrigo_> lucazade, build it (bzr bd -- -b) and install and just do a quick test, no need for gdb/etc
<lucazade> rodrigo_ ok
<pitti> didrocks: do you know who would be most appropriate to check/fix bug 760111 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 760111 in zeitgeist "zeitgeist-daemon crashed with OSError in makedirs(): [Errno 13] Permission denied: '/home/ubuntu/.local/share/zeitgeist'" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/760111
<seb128> kamstrup, ^
<didrocks> pitti: kamstrup right
<pitti> ah, thanks
<pitti> this looks like an odd interaction on/from the live system, /home/ubuntu is the live fs user
<pitti> just not sure why it'd be an EPERM, as this seems to happen right in the live system
<didrocks> I would think that if zeitgeist-daemon can't write in ~/.local/share/, it won't be the only one crashing :)
<pitti> there's certainly something odd happening there
<lucazade> rodrigo_ built, restarting now and doing some trials
<rodrigo_> lucazade, ok
 * rodrigo_ crosses fingers and starts eating his nails
<lucazade> rodrigo_ no luck :(
<lucazade> ** (gnome-settings-daemon:1526): WARNING **: xsettings manager already running; retrying again
<rodrigo_> :(
<lucazade> ** (gnome-settings-daemon:1526): WARNING **: You can only run one xsettings manager at a time; exiting
<lucazade> ** (gnome-settings-daemon:1526): WARNING **: Unable to start xsettings manager: Could not initialize xsettings manager.
<seb128> rodrigo_, stop spending time on that for now maybe
<seb128> seems like it's costing time over what it's worth
<rodrigo_> seb128, well, now it's a personal thing :-)
<rodrigo_> but yes, I'll move to other bugs and have a look at idle times
<seb128> it's weird that some people like lucazade seem to have it a consistant way
<rodrigo_> yes
<seb128> where nobody else here is getting it
<lucazade> rodrigo_ I'm here when you want
<seb128> it has to be some customization those users do
<rodrigo_> it's in xrandr plugin, so maybe something related to the graphics driver?
<seb128> would be useful to figure what
<lucazade> seb128 no customizations
<rodrigo_> lucazade, what video driver do you have?
<seb128> is it?
<lucazade> virtualbox and nvidia
<rodrigo_> lucazade, the backtrace from lucazade seems to imply that -> http://paste.ubuntu.com/594064/
<seb128> seems a virtualbox issue
<seb128> most people reporting it use virtualbox...
<lucazade> it happens also with proprietary nvidia
<rodrigo_> I have also nvidia and have been testing on virtualbox
<lucazade> anyway I'll not change session and can live with it :P
<rodrigo_> lucazade, on your normal machine (no virtualbox), it doesn't happen, right?
<lucazade> yes
<rodrigo_> yes, it happens, or yes, it doesn't happen?
<lucazade> yes, it happens also on physical machine
<rodrigo_> hmm
<rodrigo_> lucazade, anyway, I'll ping you if I need more testing, but for now I'm going to fix other bugs in my list for a while
<lucazade> haven't tried it for a while on physical machine, to be honest.. last time it was present
<lucazade> ok
<seb128> is virtualbox an install or iso testing?
<rodrigo_> lucazade, oh, last time maybe it didn't have the upstream fix that fixed it for mostly everyone?
<rodrigo_> seb128, for me it's an install, and no problem at all, after 100s of tries
<seb128> yeah, I never got here in kvm or real installs and I do start ubuntu a lot
<lucazade> rodrigo_ don't remember which version was
<rodrigo_> lucazade, ok, when you have time, please test the latest natty package, just to confirm it only happens on virtualbox for you, ok?
<lucazade> rodrigo_ ok i'll confirm if it only happens on vbox
<rodrigo_> lucazade, ok thanks
<rodrigo_> hmm, before I move to another bug, just a quick thing
<rodrigo_> if I call gconf_client_remove_dir, all notifications set for that dir are disabled
<rodrigo_> so maybe calling gconf_client_notify_remove after that is wrong, and thus makes the extra gconf loop the backtrace shows?
<rodrigo_> the API docs say nothing, and also I guess it would affect more people if that was the case
<rodrigo_> or maybe it's just too slow only in some situations
<xclaesse> rodrigo_, remember the build issue for empathy with webkit?
<xclaesse>  it is already fixed in upstream with git commit 8dd756f90c0140f620f02164da9e04354a6d0ec9
<xclaesse> (don't know if you've seen my message yesterday)
<rodrigo_> xclaesse, yes, I'm about to submit a branch with that
<rodrigo_> xclaesse, yes, saw your message
<xclaesse> good
<xclaesse> thx
<rodrigo_> xclaesse, as soon as I have that, I'll submit a new empathy with webkit support to the PPA
<seiflotfy> pitti, the bug is ver tricky
<seiflotfy> and we are looking into a way to fix it
<seiflotfy> pitti, i think this bug will affect other things that try to write to an encrypted ~/.local/share
<didrocks> pitti: btw, thinking about it, would the lazy load will workaround it for us? (did you try on a recent daily?)
<pitti> seiflotfy: uh, how can it be encrypted on a live CD?
<pitti> didrocks: which lazy load?
<didrocks> pitti: so, since last Thursday (just after beta2), the places are loaded only on demand
<didrocks> (not at session startup as before)
<pitti> didrocks: oh, I haven't noticed a change, which I guess is good :)
<didrocks> pitti: heh, there was one fixed very early on Friday :p
<didrocks> but we are still slowing down the startup by /etc/xdg/autostart/zeitgeist-datahub.desktop
<didrocks> which starts zeitgeist
<didrocks> not sure if we should add the delay key or if we consider it's too late and for O
<seiflotfy> didrocks, why r u starting datahub
<pitti> didrocks: that's not dbus activated?
<didrocks> seiflotfy: not sure, it's the debian package
<seiflotfy> didrocks, when zeitgeist starts it also starts the datahub
<pitti> I don't know what it's doing, but if we delay it by 30 seconds, it'll miss events in the first 30 s?
<didrocks> seiflotfy: ^^
<seiflotfy> didrocks, not it wont
<didrocks> seiflotfy: we have nothing starting zg at startup
<seiflotfy> didrocks, ah i see
<seiflotfy> hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
<didrocks> pitti: the zg daemon is dbus activated, not sure about the datahub as it changed recently
<seiflotfy> didrocks, the datahub is activated by zg daemon
<seiflotfy> i see the problem
<didrocks> seiflotfy: right, but as we don't start it now until a place load request happens
<didrocks> we would miss all events until then I guess
<pitti> seiflotfy: so if zg-daemon is triggered on demand via dbus, and lazy-loaded the first time you open places, datahub would not run for a fair while and thus miss all events until you open teh places page; did I understand that right?
<pitti> but datahub is not python, but C
<pitti> so should be a lot faster to startup?
<pitti> or does datahub trigger zg-daemon as well?
<pitti> ok, merely starting a guest session, without opening places, launches zeitgeist-datahub and zg-daemon
<pitti> so whatever you changed doesn't buy anything ATM
<didrocks> pitti: it does at least for xapian and internal caching (I won 9s on the 31s to load my desktop session)
<pitti> didrocks: ah, just because it starts slightly later now?
<seb128> pitti, right
<pitti> also good
<didrocks> maybe that influences as well :)
<seb128> didrocks, not sure how you won that btw ;-)
<didrocks> but well, not the whole zg won
<pitti> as long as unity itself is already usable, it can go on churn in the background
<seb128> on the 10v ssd it won 3s on 16 seconds
<didrocks> seb128: slow harddrive help seems :)
<didrocks> it*
<pitti> ok, quick lunch before the confcall
<seb128> pitti, enjoy
<seb128> the delay key should probably be added back to the eds calendar reminder autostart btw
<seb128> it seems it got dropped when we switched from our distro version to the upstream one
<seiflotfy> pitti, true
<seiflotfy> datahub is vala
<seb128> rodrigo_, is your g-s-d pulseaudio fix something that we should try to get in natty?
<seb128> rodrigo_, did you get someone upstream to review it?
<rodrigo_> seb128, I'm pinging hadess now
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok, let me know how it goes
<rodrigo_> seb128, it indeed fixes the crash, but want to get his approval 1st
<seb128> we have until tomorrow to upload it
<seb128> today and tomorrow that's it
<seb128> so no hurry
<rodrigo_> ah ok, will get it reviewed today
<seb128> rodrigo_, thanks
<seb128> dpm, https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/unity/+imports lists your upload as "needs review"
<seb128> is that normal?
<Sweetshark> pitti: bug 765010 is meh.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 765010 in libreoffice "LibreOffice StartCenterâs desktop file has an empty value for Name[en]" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/765010
 * Sweetshark is guilty.
<dpm> seb128, that's normal. They all start with 'needs review', then the approver script changes status to 'approved' and then the importer script changes status to 'imported'. Only new templates need to be set as 'approved' manually (i.e. it does not make a difference if I approve unity.pot manually)
<rodrigo_> ok, lunch time, bbl
 * nessita reboots after update
<seb128> dpm, ok thanks
<seb128> robert_ancell, gcalctool get quite some segfault in currency_get_value() bug reports
<seb128> ie bug #760536
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 760536 in gcalctool "gcalctool crashed with SIGSEGV in currency_get_value()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/760536
<robert_ancell> seb128, are they the latest? I fixed some bugs recently
<seb128> robert_ancell, that one is
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, will look at it tomorrow
<seb128> thanks
<chrisccoulson> hi robert_ancell. aren't you normally asleep at this time?
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, shh, you're waking me up!
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> that was seb128 ;)
<seb128> heh
<seb128> robert_ancell talks in his sleep, not my fault!
<pitti> Sweetshark: indeed, and it doesn't just affect [en], I see it in [de] as well
<Sweetshark> pitti: yes, Im already working on it.
<pitti> Sweetshark: thanks
<pitti> Sweetshark: out of interest, what happened there? build script for msgmerge changed?
<Sweetshark> pitti: no, I added the traslations deep in some dark perl voodoo in the LO build. And now it seems to create one additional Name[en]= entry although it has no translations for the string at all
<pitti> Sweetshark: how come that it also fails in German then?
<Sweetshark> pitti: dunno. the /usr/share/applications/libreoffice-startcenter.desktop looks good to me for "[de]".
<Sweetshark> or does "Name[de]" fall back to "Name[en]" and not "Name"?
<pitti> no, it doesn't
<pitti> Sweetshark: if I press win+a, I get a LibO icon without a name in the second row
<pitti> ... which is the start center apparently
<pitti> you don't?
<Sweetshark> pitti: Im on an english UI.
<pitti> seb128: if you press win+a and look at the second row ('installed apps'), do you see a libo icon without a name?
<seb128> ues
<seb128> yes
<pitti> oui
<pitti> I knew that our dear Monsieur would be faithful to his mother tongue!
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> it's happening in french just to be clear :p
<pitti> aka "stop the presses!"
<seb128> deleting the "Name[en]=" fixes it
<seb128> it seems that one breaks the parsing
<pitti> *nod*
<seb128> nautilus displays the filename rather than any key when it's there
<pitti> >>> d=xdg.DesktopEntry.DesktopEntry('/usr/share/applications/libreoffice-startcenter.desktop')
<pitti> >>> d.getName()
<pitti> u''
<seb128> yeah, the Name[en]= confuses it
 * Sweetshark lunches and then find out what the heck adds the Name[en]= line.
<pitti> Sweetshark: feel free to toss a bazaar.lp.net link to the commit that introduced it, we might spot something :)
<Sweetshark> somewhere in those awefull perlscripts, there is some evil.
<Sweetshark> pitti: http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=commit;h=fb422d2a8b282dba296a004d98b6d55b301769bf
<Sweetshark> beware patch of patches ahead
<pitti> ugh yeah; /me sings Katie Melua's "A Moment of Madness" â© âª â«
<pitti> Sweetshark: "en-US" vs. "zh_CN" looks inconsistent
<mterry> seb128, got more bugs you want eyes on?
<seb128> mterry, let me check my bug lists
<seb128> mterry, do you want to do the glib update?
<mterry> seb128, oh, sure
<seb128> it seems like https://bugs.launchpad.net/glib/+bug/743459 is https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=646843 which is fixed in the new version
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 743459 in glib2.0 "empathy crashed with SIGABRT in __kernel_vsyscall()" [Medium,Fix committed]
<seb128> kklimonda, should glibmm be updated to the stable version? can it be synced on debian?
<mterry> seb128, oh wait, glib2.0 intentionally isn't in ubuntu-desktop package set
<mterry> seb128, so maybe someone else should do that one
<seb128> mterry, I can upload for you
<mterry> seb128, k
<seb128> the packaging is in the team vcs
<mterry> yar
<seb128> mterry, did you start yet?
<mterry> seb128, yeah
<seb128> mterry, ok
<stgraber> didrocks: ping
<didrocks> stgraber: OTP, will be back later
<didrocks> stgraber: meanwhile, try my package in the ppa :-)
<stgraber> didrocks: ok, I just updated bug 746028 with some ls of my updated VM :) Ping me when you're available for some more debugging.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 746028 in gnome-settings-daemon "Edubuntu: Wallpapers are not updated on upgrade to Natty" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/746028
<stgraber> didrocks: (it seems like the cache has been rebuilt but with the wrong content, as in, old wallpaper)
<didrocks> stgraber: can you try to open it with eog to confirm the cache is old?
 * highvoltage previewed it in nautilus last week and saw that the image in the cache directory was old
<stgraber> didrocks: confirmed, it's the old wallpaper in stgraber's cache and the new one in stgraber1's cache
<stgraber> didrocks: want them attached to the bug report ?
<didrocks> stgraber: no need, it's just a resized image, let's discuss that for a common debugging session after my phone call :)
<stgraber> didrocks: ok, just ping me (I have an idea of what "might" be wrong with the cache ;))
<didrocks> sure :)
<Sweetshark> pitti: got it.
<rodrigo_> seb128, hadess approved the patch, so submitting my branch in a second
<seb128> rodrigo_, thanks
<pitti> Sweetshark: yay you
<Sweetshark> pitti: I added a string to translate for the unity quicklist stuff. there is no such entry in the startcenter template, thus the script barfs out the nonsense at the end.
<rodrigo_> seb128, https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gnome-settings-daemon/fix-750334/+merge/58311
<seb128> rodrigo_, thanks
<rodrigo_> seb128, oh, just remembered about this one: https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/maverick/json-glib/fix-756426/+merge/57474 <- did you solve your build problem?
<rodrigo_> hmm, what does this mean: 'dpkg-checkbuilddeps: Build conflicts: gir-repository-dev' if I already have that package installed?
<pitti> rodrigo_: you need to uninstall it
<pitti> (also in general; gir-repository was a bad hack and should be history now)
<rodrigo_> pitti, ah, ok
<rodrigo_> one of these days I should really do a clean install on this machine, as I've been updating since karmic
<rodrigo_> although, well, it seems to work so not sure it's worth the clean install
<seb128> rodrigo_, it's a build conflicts, not a build-depends ;-)
<rodrigo_> seb128, yeah, now I know :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, yeah, I fixed my machine issues but I focussed on natty but I will upload later if the pilot of the day don't do it
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, no hurry, just wanted to make sure it didn't get lost
<rodrigo_> xclaesse, building now the webkit package, will submit as soon as it builds ok
<chrisccoulson> pitti - what's the absolute last day for uploads? i need to do another firefox upload :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I think tomorrow; on Thursday you'll need a very good rationale already, as we'll need to sort them out over the long weekend
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks. i should be able to do it today anyway
<seb128> rodrigo_, is there any chance you could update the g-s-d patch to be the upstream commit?
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes
<seb128> rodrigo_, so it would have some context, like the description and the id
<seb128> rodrigo_, thanks
<rodrigo_> seb128, pushed
<seb128> rodrigo_, thanks
<seb128> session restart brb
<pitti> argh, the launcher appearing on the side is a nuisance
<pitti> it keeps popping up when I try to copy&paste somethign from a full screen app
<seb128> right, I switched back to the edge config
<seb128> though I didn't hit so much issues in normal use
<seb128> but I tend to put my mouse out of the way when using the keyboard and out of the way is often a border
<pitti> seb128: back to corner config you mean? I just did the same
<seb128> yes
<mterry> seb128: OK, finally pushed the glib2.0 bzr update (had some computer issues :)).  Can you push onward to main?
<seb128> mterry, doing that now
<seb128> mterry, if you want bugs there is an appmenu one about virtualbox not working which say bzr-visualize has similar issues
<seb128> though it might be a libindicate-qt issue since the comments indicate those are qt applications
<pitti> lamalex: hey Alex, how are you?
<pitti> lamalex: you have a work item "Ensure video source is decent, and if not, perhaps disable it until we have something nice" for packageselection-desktop-n-application-selection; is that still relevant?
<lamalex> jcastro asked me that a bit ago. there are a couple of patches in banshee's bugzilla but they're awaiting merge and were deferred for 2.0. will hopefully make it into 2. whatever is next
<jcastro> yeah that should be deferred
<pitti> ok, doing that; thanks
<mterry> seb128, link me
<mterry> i suppose i can search it
<pitti> rodrigo_: gdm user switching and tomboy applet deprecation on upgrade> hm, didn't I see an uplaod which fixes that recently?
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes
<rodrigo_> pitti, did I forget something?
<pitti> rodrigo_: awesome; I'll close the WIs then
<pitti> rodrigo_: just to set the WIs to done, don't worry
<seb128> mterry, 641209
<rodrigo_> pitti, ah, forgot that, yes
<pitti> seb128: postponing "provide GTK3 variant of appmenu-gtk" FYI
<seb128> pitti, ok
<pitti> jasoncwarner, Sweetshark, bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, seb128, tkamppeter: meeting reminder in 5 mins
<rodrigo_> pitti, thanks :)
<chrisccoulson> w00t
<cyphermox> ok
<rodrigo_> building webkit package takes ages
<pitti> jasoncwarner, Sweetshark, bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, seb128, tkamppeter: meeting time
<seb128> hey
<chrisccoulson> hi!
<tremolux> \o
<pitti> welcome everyone
<rodrigo_> hi! :)
<didrocks> hey
<Sweetsha1k> Oo._ touchdown.
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-04-19
<Riddell> hi
<pitti> let's try to make this quick, as we are all knee-deep in bug fixing
<pitti> tremolux, didrocks: thanks for the unity/s-c reports on the wiki! anything we need to discuss there?
<seb128> mterry, (ignore the glib rejected email, I screwed the upload once and reuploaded)
<didrocks> pitti: nothing more
<kenvandine> pitti, nothing to report on partner update... and i am on the phone :)
<tremolux> pitti: I don't think so unless any questions  :)
<pitti> kenvandine: hah, that woudl have been my next question
<pitti> no news is good news at this point :)
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> if we had news, we are in trouble
<rodrigo_> :)
<pitti> quick update about release status
<pitti> we are cleaning up the last couple of WIs, but nothign serious any more ("talk to Debian", "test stuff", etc.)
<pitti> almost there
<pitti> and last week we fixed about 8 or 9 RC bugs!
<pitti> and some more this week, so we have 5 left on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus
<pitti> I just have two questions here
<pitti> bug 727410
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 727410 in gnome-session "unity used instead of metacity when logging in as a user via ltsp" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/727410
<pitti> erm, ignore that, fixed!
<pitti> so we only have 4 left!
<didrocks> yeah :)
<pitti> and they are all fixable in SRUs as well
<rodrigo_> pitti, about #649809, we agreed on not being RC, right?
<pitti> any other OMGkittenkiller you guys are aware of which we need to discuss?
<tremolux> pitti: oh, and bug 723911 was already deferred  ;)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 723911 in software-center "deauthorize does not remove sources.list" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/723911
<pitti> rodrigo_: right, target of opportunity, and SRUable
<pitti> tremolux: right
<rodrigo_> ok
<pitti> so I think by and large we are in good shape
<pitti> nothing else from my side, AOB?
 * pitti ^5s the team for having a smooth landing next week
<Riddell> I am going on rotation next cycle to work with bzr, volunteers to look after Kubuntu welcome :)
<pitti> ooh, enjoy the rotation
<pitti> they can certainly need some help from someone with a strong distro perspective!
<pitti> Riddell: do you expect larger structural changes next cycle in Kubuntu, or will that be by and large a bug fix/maintenance release then?
<Riddell> pitti: a load of KDE source packages will be changing due to upstream moving to git
<Riddell> kdepim moves to akonadi fully
<Riddell> that's about it
<pitti> thanks
<pitti> so, shortest meeting evar
<chrisccoulson> who's volunteering for KDE then? ;)
<mterry> :)
<Riddell> chrisccoulson: you know you want to.  our browser takes an hour to package for a new release.  your life would be so much easier
<chrisccoulson> mterry, didn't you mean:
<chrisccoulson> o/
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<chrisccoulson> Riddell, would you mind if i switched kubuntu to firefox by default? after all, we agreed yesterday that ubuntu would be switching to lynx by default ;)
<chrisccoulson> (or galeon. it depends on who wins at UDS)
<Riddell> chrisccoulson: that's fine, just port firefox to qt and kdelibs first
<hyperair> lynx!
<hyperair> oh lol
<pitti> hyperair: hey, that's a concession to usability; my initial proposal was wget -O-
<hyperair> pitti: not netcat? =(
<chrisccoulson> i guess that the default browser may be settled over a game of mao at UDS ;)
<chrisccoulson> desrt would like that!
<chrisccoulson> chromebug is definitely my friend today
<mdeslaur> from a security point of vue, I recommended not having a browser at all. It's all about the apps now anyway, right? :)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<mdeslaur> oh, and if we could get rid of the kernel also, that would reduce the CVE count considerably. Thanks.
<desrt> oo
<nessita> mvo: hey there, quick question re software center: does this report makes sense to you? bug #751747 I don't think is a ussoc report (ussoc does not ask for address)
 * desrt has to remember to bring the cards
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 751747 in ubuntu-sso-client "Ubuntu Single Sign On Does Not Remember Details" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/751747
 * desrt entering the game.  introducing new rule.
<mvo> nessita: thanks, I moved it to software-center-agent for now, it probably needs to go to cannical-payment-provider or somesuch, but I will take it from here :)
<Sweetsha1k> pitti: http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=commit;h=76b0b21953dee320d4eb4da29f617b5147d73267 <- this should fix bug 765010. I will build that tonight.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 765010 in libreoffice "LibreOffice StartCenterâs desktop file has an empty value for Name[en]" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/765010
<nessita> mvo: thanks!
<mvo> (and yes, I agree very much with this bug)
<mvo> yw
 * mvo heads out for dinner now
<desrt> pitti: learn curl
<thisfred> tedg: I have a question about the unity launcher progress bars: is it intentional that they disappear when clicking the launcher?
<thisfred> (this is what happens for the ubuntuone one, and I'm pretty sure we don't hide it ourselves)
<tedg> thisfred, That's not a tedg thing.  Perhaps a DBO one?
<thisfred> tedg: Oh, sorry. Anyway, jason helped me figure it out.
<seb128> pitti, tseliot: is there any way to not suggest the nvidia driver for some card series?
<mterry> tedg, does no one listen to the dbusmenu ItemsPropertiesUpdated signal?
<mterry> tedg, oh, hah!  it was a typo....  interesting.  dbusmenu was listening for ItemPropertiesUpdated (with no s)
<tseliot> seb128: we can only remove the single modaliases for the cards
<seb128> tedg, btw I saw that you had a merge request for the gimp libdbusmenu segfault issue, is that a fix or a guess try?
<seb128> tseliot, ok, because we have 728745 about geforce 7300 and 7400 cards not working with using on nvidia, nouveau works for those though
<seb128> tseliot, I was wondering if we should tell jockey to not suggest nvidia for those
<tseliot> bug #728745
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 728745 in unity "[nvidia, 7300, 7400] display freeze when using unity desktop" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/728745
<tseliot> seb128: if you ask the affected users to post the output of this command, I can blacklist those cards: lspci -n | grep 300
<seb128> tseliot, thanks, do you think it's right?
<seb128> tseliot, the other option would be to declare that unity doesn't work on those machines and let them get the nvidia drivers and run classic GNOME...
<tedg> seb128, I think that it should fix it.
<seb128> tedg, did you get a review? did you ask kenvandine to distro patch it?
<tedg> mterry, My first deja dup backup just completed!  Woot!
<tedg> seb128, I haven't checked yet, sorry.
<seb128> no worry
 * tedg bitches about tele-sprints
<seb128> yeah, you get the sprint part but not the bar drinking in the evening
<seb128> that's no fun ;-)
<didrocks> latest unity release before natty done \o/
<seb128> didrocks, you shouldn't say that...
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> well you didn't say "upload"
<didrocks> seb128: well, I'll backport every commit needed, but that will be the last release :-)
<tedg> seb128, The nice part is you can drink *during* the sprint more easily ;-)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> tedg, lol
<didrocks> tedg: I was planning for a video conference, having a poster of the beach behind me ;)
<seb128> mterry, did you find things to do?
<seb128> otherwise DBO might need some help
<seb128> he keeps claiming that he will work on launcher matching issue but seems that's not going to happen so maybe we should try to help there ;-)
<kklimonda> seb128: glibmm2.4 or glibmm3.0?
<seb128> kklimonda, 2.27.92 to 2.28
<tseliot> seb128: I don't think nouveau has the same level of power management of nvidia. I guess blacklisting the driver and card in unity would be safer
<seb128> tseliot, ok
<seb128> didrocks, ^ it might be a distro patch to add tomorrow
<didrocks> tseliot: the blacklist only happens on pcid
<chrisccoulson> pitti - firefox is in the queue now
<didrocks> so if it doesn't work on neither nvidia nor nouveau, we can do that
<didrocks> seb128: ^^
<chrisccoulson> it has a nice autoscroll fix which fixes an annoying bug too :)
<chrisccoulson> (will hopefully please popey) ;)
<didrocks> pitti: bamf/nux/unity in the queue btw :)
<seb128> didrocks, well, those cards don't work with nvidia and unity so choices are to either block nvidia in jockey or unity, ie we either recommend nvidia and classic or nouveau and unity
<tseliot> didrocks: do you know where is the code that deals with the blacklist? Maybe I can make it check the driver too
<didrocks> tseliot: it's in nux, but it's really late now to add that
<didrocks> seb128: as we blacklist the card, it won't work with nouveau + unity
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<seb128> didrocks, right, but how likely is it that people will just install nvidia and get no desktop?
<popey> \o/ chrisccoulson
<kklimonda> seb128: yes, it can be synced from debian.
<seb128> kklimonda, want to open a bug with the diff for r-t review?
<didrocks> seb128: if we still want people to get it with nouveau (I don't mean we want), we can do that in jockey rather
<kklimonda> seb128: sure
<seb128> kklimonda, thanks
<didrocks> either way, I don't mind, let's see tomorrow, do we have the pcid # ?
<didrocks> (I've aready added some ati card, that can be handle in a couple of minutes)
<tseliot> didrocks: ok, let's talk again tomorrow then
<didrocks> tseliot: right ;)
<didrocks> it's not 8pm and I can wave good evening, how come! ;)
<didrocks> see you tomorrow guys
<tseliot> bye
<mterry> tedg, https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/dbusmenu/641209/+merge/58364
<seb128> seems another fix to get in natty ;-)
<mterry> seb128, yeah.  I'll pull from trunk once merged
<mterry> (meaning, I'll distro-pull from trunk)
<kklimonda> seb128: done, bug 766320
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 766320 in glibmm2.4 "FFe: Sync glibmm2.4 2.28.0-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/766320
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> tedg, mterry: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libdbusmenu/+bug/752959 updated with the valgrind error
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 752959 in libdbusmenu "gimp-2.6 crashed with SIGSEGV in g_variant_is_object_path()" [High,Incomplete]
<seb128> tedg, I'm testing your vcs fix next
<chrisccoulson> seb128, are there any bugs you want me to look at?
<seb128> bah, why do people ask those questions when I've no bug handy to dispatch ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, not especially but I will have a look
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh yes, I've one!
<seb128> bug #743176
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 743176 in gnome-utils "Pink layer on taken screenshots (gnome-screenshot)" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/743176
<seb128> if you want to give it a try ;-)
<chrisccoulson> thanks, i'll take a look
<chrisccoulson> brb, just moving downstairs :)
<czajkowski> chrisccoulson: did you get pics of the rugby!
<seb128> tedg, the fix in your merge request seem to fix it, at least I didn't get errors in valgrind in some tries where it happened regularly on previous ones
<tedg> seb128, Yeah, I was looking at the valgrind log.  Seems related.
<seb128> can you make sure kenvandine knows about the fix and backport it? maybe sync with mterry to get the typo fix he did in the same upload
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey again, i've some other bug suggestion for you ;-)
<tedg> seb128, Yup.
<seb128> tedg, thanks
<chrisccoulson> seb128, excellent :)
<chrisccoulson> czajkowski, rugby?
<kenvandine> tedg, just shout :)
<tedg> YUP!
<mterry> seb128, where's this fix for the valgrind issue?  I'm curious now
<seb128> mterry, on the bug
<seb128> oh the fix
<seb128> mterry, https://code.launchpad.net/~ted/dbusmenu/lp738568/+merge/58200
<seb128> mterry, you can maybe review it ;-)
<mterry> ah, the other one
<mterry> tedg, heh, nice fix, even if we don't know why.  Good idea  :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, bug #765736 if you feel like doing some dx work
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 765736 in unity "Thunderbird won't stay in launcher and no quicklist" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/765736
<seb128> or bug #752743
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 752743 in unity "thunderbird disappears from the launcher after restarting my computer" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/752743
<seb128> it's likely the same
<seb128> the first one explain how it happens once you install italian translations which is a clue ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, since I know you care about tb ;-)
<seb128> with some luck fixing that one would fix other issues
<seb128> like eclipse or emacs not sticking in the launcher
<chrisccoulson> interesting, i've not seen the issue with tb before ;)
<seb128> DBO, ^ btw if you have suggestions for chrisccoulson please let him know
<czajkowski> chrisccoulson: wrong chris sorry
<DBO> I'll work on them shortly
<seb128> chrisccoulson, the bug claims it start when you install the italian translations, I'm wondering if the translations are broken or if there is some matching on a coded name that break when the name is ttranslated
<DBO> I got a thing in 20 minutes
<seb128> DBO, you say that for 3 weeks
<DBO> so I have to go get ready
<DBO> seb128, stop giving me more important things to do
<chrisccoulson> czajkowski, heh, no worries ;)
<chrisccoulson> you had me confused there
<chrisccoulson> :P
<seb128> DBO, well it's fine you have other things to do but don't keep a lock on things you have no time to work on
<seb128> DBO, it's like the libreoffice issue, Sweetshark had to drop the .desktop from libreoffice
<tedg> mterry, It seems that with your patch we should change server.c as well.  I can make the change, do you agree?
<mterry> tedg, ah yeah, I didn't think to search for other typos
<seb128> mterry, other bug if you want to investigate is that icons showing are not respected for qt applications
<seb128> like if you run qtcreator the menus have no icon in qtcreator but they do in the indicator-appmenu
<seb128> or you can check why some menus have a trailing separator in mumble as well ;-)
<seb128> random suggestions if you needs ideas ;-)
<mterry> seb128, ok
<seb128> otherwise I don't have specific bugs
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - ok, 2 of the upstream commits fix the screenshot issue
<chrisccoulson> i'll upload that now
<pitti> tkamppeter: hey
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<pitti> tkamppeter: you ask about bug 710881?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 710881 in cups "cups: Test Page /usr/lib/cups/filter/bannertops failed, test page and banner pages do not get printed" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/710881
<tkamppeter> It is about bug 710881, buildds is eliminating my fix.
<pitti> tkamppeter: yeah, we optimize PNG files during build, in pkgbinarymangler
<tkamppeter> pitti, see the last comment.
<pitti> we can disable it for a particular file if necessary
<pitti> I'll have a look tomorrow morning
<tkamppeter> pitti, so a PNG which is representable as 8-bit/pixel colormap will be converted from 8-bit/color (=32bit/pixel) RGBA?
<tkamppeter> pitti, this is exactly undoing my fix.
<pitti> tkamppeter: it uses the smallest possible format which doens't lose information
<pitti> /usr/share/cups/doc-root/images/cups.png: PNG image data, 128 x 128, 8-bit colormap, non-interlaced
<pitti> which is apparently that
<tkamppeter> pitti, this pkgbinarymangler should not touch any of the files in /usr/share/cups/doc-root/images/, as these files are used by bannertops and the libpng bug does not allow any of them being 8bit/pixel colormap.
<pitti> tkamppeter: so it's a colormap, not RGBA
<pitti> so that each pixel just uses 1 byte
<tkamppeter> pitti, and it must be RGBA.
<pitti> as it only uses 2 colors, that kind of makes sense from optipng's view
<pitti> tkamppeter: there's a bug in libpng for that? eog displays it just fine
<tkamppeter> This "each pixel is one byte" format hits a bug in libpng, causing a crash of the calling program.
<tkamppeter> pitti, perhaps it also depends on the way how the libpng functions are called.
<pitti> tkamppeter: I suppose your debian/rules workaround can go as well
<pitti> ./doc/images/cups.png: PNG image data, 128 x 128, 8-bit/color RGBA, non-interlaced
<pitti> yep, it's correct in the source
<pitti> tkamppeter: ah, I see the crash with /usr/lib/cups/filter/bannertops 1 1 1 1 "PageSize=A4" < /usr/share/cups/data/testprint  > /tmp/x
<tkamppeter> The space advantage for the files in /usr/share/cups/doc-root/images/ is very small, as these files are already very small. The advantage can even be zero, taking into account the cluster size of a hard disk.
<tkamppeter> pitti, and the crash goes away if you do the conversion to RGBA.
<pitti> yes, I'm not worried about that; we just do it by default for all packages now, as it saves us quite a large portion of CD space
<pitti> tkamppeter: it's already RGBA in the source
<pitti> tkamppeter: I'll revert your convert call and blacklist it from optipng instead
<tkamppeter> pitti, OK, thanks, can you do that for Natty?
<pitti> sure
<tkamppeter> pitti, thank you very much.
<pitti> sorry for the trouble
<tkamppeter> pitti, and when the "convert" call in debian/rules is actually not needed, you can remove the BuildDepend on ImageMagick again.
<pitti> tkamppeter: yes, I just revert r961
<tkamppeter> pitti, now I know why Mike Sweet never hit this bug, he never had an 8-bit/pixel colormap file.
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks, the guy who assigned the bug to himself was stalling for weeks and added a comment saying it was not working for him then
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - ok, that's uploaded now
<silver1882> I rebuilt my kernel a while back to make ubuntu load faster and it works great.  Is there any way of having ubuntu use those setting whenever there is a kernel update?
<pitti> tkamppeter: uploaded
<mterry> tedg, oh nice, about deja dup!  :)  (I missed it when you mentioned it earlier today)
<cyphermox> what's the process for having an application whitelisted for unity's systray? or more precisely, where should I file a bug?
<DBO> chrisccoulson, are you still poking at bamf
<chrisccoulson> DBO, not yet, i've been looking at other things first
<DBO> okay
<DBO> let me know when you start
<DBO> I'd love to pair program that
<chrisccoulson> sure, no problem
<DBO> it would help us both I think
<DBO> chrisccoulson, if I am not around for whatever reason, do feel free to start without me :)
<pitti> good night everyone
<seb128> 'night pitti
<bcurtiswx> nite pitti
<seb128> cyphermox, unity or talk to didrocks when he's online
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks for backporting those fixes to natty ;-)Ã 
<seb128> ;-)
<kenvandine> np!
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i take it there's a bit of version skew on armel. all my builds are failing!
<seb128> yeah, same here
<seb128> it's ogra_'s fault
 * kenvandine glares at ogra_
<chrisccoulson> lol
<kenvandine> :-D
<chrisccoulson> 1 less beer for ogra_ at UDS!
 * kenvandine just likes it when it isn' this fault
 * bcurtiswx starts a Ken's fault list 
<seb128> oh, that one is easy
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> it's normally my fault isn't it?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, don't get me started on you ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<bcurtiswx> i'll manage to get enough beer in seb128 to get some good stories out of him.... maybe :P
<seb128> don't try that trick on kenvandine jcastro or chrisccoulson
<jcastro> heh
<seb128> you will get bankrupted before getting something ;-)
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> hey jcastro!
<bcurtiswx> so jcastro's room is the midnight hangout?
<bcurtiswx> :) j/k
<mterry> Riddell, heyo -- I just fixed icons showing up in the appmenu for Qt applications when they weren't supposed to (like qtcreator).  Any chance of a quick distro patch?  https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/libdbusmenu-qt/dont-show-more-icons-than-desired/+merge/58387
<kklimonda> seb128: hey, any idea who could I ask for some help with Vte? I have an ancient application (from the DOS era) that I have to make display some extended characters in terminal, and I can't figure out how to do that. It's a mess of weird encodings, and I don't even have source code to it (not that it would help me, as the bastard has been written in clipper..)
<kklimonda> seb128: eventually how hard would that be to create a borderless window in the specified location on the screen, that can't be moved or resized?
<chrisccoulson> wtf
<kklimonda> the second option is the last resort, but I may have to resort to it, if everything else fails.. blah.
<chrisccoulson> WM_CLASS is translated in thunderbird
<chrisccoulson> DBO^^ ;)
<DBO> hola!
<chrisccoulson> that might be why it breaks for italian users
<DBO> why in th ehell would wm_class be translated in thunderbird?
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure, i think i will just remove that misfeature ;)
<DBO> that would be incredibly helpful
<seb128> kklimonda, try behdad on #gnome-hackers
<seb128> chrisccoulson, DBO: see I pinged chrisccoulson for a reason ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i get WM_CLASS=Thunderbird for english locale, and WM_CLASS="Mozilla Thunderbird" for italian
<DBO> is thunderbird the only one we are worried about?
<chrisccoulson> i need to check if this is an issue in Firefox too
<kklimonda> seb128: thanks
<DBO> seb128, do you have a list of bamf things you want me to look at
<DBO> or should I just shotgun through my bugs
<seb128> DBO, go through your bugs if you want
<seb128> but those I noticed where the tb issue chrisccoulson is on
<seb128> bug #757011
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 757011 in unity "Keep in launcher option for Emacs does not save over restarts" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/757011
 * tedg thinks DBO should just take a shotgun *to* his bug ;-)
<seb128> bug #757011
<seb128> ug #704046
<DBO> tedg, do you have a ping on the word shotgun?
<seb128> bug #704046
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 704046 in unity-2d "[launcher] can't add java programs as favorites" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/704046
<DBO> java is the devils toy
<seb128> bug #704046
<tedg> Yes
<seb128> oh come on, why copy can't work right
<seb128> DBO, well in any case we got some bugs with vlc but those are not confirmed, people who have it don't have it every time, otherwise emacs and eclipse are popular ones, then java and python software run from a command line, then the tb issue
<seb128> DBO, oh and libreoffice...
<seb128> but we workarounded this one by dropping a .desktop
<DBO> seb128, okay, tackling in that order
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> you still can get fixes tomorrow
<seb128> then it's likely to be sru updates rather, which is fine as well for those
<seb128> it's nice that we ran out of the crasher class ;-)
<DBO> i agree
<DBO> okay
<DBO> gwibber is SLOW
<chrisccoulson> DBO - this is broken in firefox too
<chrisccoulson> ^^asac
<chrisccoulson> i wonder if that's your issue ;)
<DBO> chrisccoulson, why would they do that?
<chrisccoulson> DBO - i'm not sure. they just get the name from the branding, and the branding is translated
<chrisccoulson> i guess no one ever picked it up before ;)
<DBO> firefox should need this anyhow
 * DBO goes to find out why
<DBO> chrisccoulson, can you confirm for me that thunderbird's binary is thunderbird-bin?
<chrisccoulson> DBO, yeah, it is
<DBO> una-momento
<chrisccoulson> is that the issue?
<DBO> yeah
<rodrigo_> can someone please sponsor this -> https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/webkit/fix-header/+merge/58395 ?
<DBO> I dont have the suffix deletion crap
<DBO> I can add it
<DBO> hold on
<DBO> chrisccoulson, am I crazy or is there no easy way to copy a UTF8 string in glib?
<chrisccoulson> i've never tried to do it in glib before. i'm too used to mozilla, where there are string classes for doing this sort of thing already :)
<DBO> sorry I meant to say get a substring
<tedg> DBO, g_strdup
<DBO> tedg, I meant for a substring :/
<tedg> DBO, g_strstr
<DBO> that doesn't work for utf8
<chrisccoulson> i'm used to things like https://developer.mozilla.org/En/Mozilla_internal_string_guide#Substrings_.28string_fragments.29 ;)
<tedg> DBO, Really?
<DBO> also that actually doesn't do what I want either
<DBO> I need to make a copy of hte fragment
<tedg> DBO, There is g_utf8_strrchr  ;-)
<DBO> the problem is I want to basically chop the end of the string off
<DBO> btw this is academic now
<DBO> I found another way
<DBO> chrisccoulson, can you confirm if rev 401 fixes firefox/thunderbird for you
<DBO> without a patch to them of course
<chrisccoulson> DBO, sure, just grabbing that now
<chrisccoulson> brb, session restart
<chrisccoulson> DBO - hmm, it still doesn't seem to match :/
<DBO> seriously?
<chrisccoulson> trim_exec_string seems to return the right string though ("thunderbird")
<chrisccoulson> yeah, the icon in my launcher doesn't have the same visible name as the desktop file
<chrisccoulson> (Mozilla Thunderbird as opposed to Thunderbird Mail/News)
<DBO> what do you mean by that?
<DBO> what about firefox?
<DBO> chrisccoulson, it works for me after making sure bamfdaemon has been restarted
<chrisccoulson> DBO - should i expect it to work if i launch it from a terminal too?
<DBO> works here
<DBO> chrisccoulson, make sure you have your locally built bamfdaemon running
<chrisccoulson> ok, it is working now. i'm not sure what happened there, i got my session in to a right mess ;)
<DBO> chrisccoulson, okay awesome
<DBO> want to move on to the next bamf issue with me?
<chrisccoulson> DBO - thanks for fixing it :)
<chrisccoulson> oh, there's another issue?
<DBO> emacs and eclipse I hear are problems
<DBO> dear god
<DBO> installing eclipse installs everything
<DBO> EVERYTHING
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> i already have it installed here ;)
<DBO> can you pastebin its .desktop file for me
<DBO> and a ps -ef  from when it is running
<DBO> (so I can see its exec string)
<DBO> while mine downloads
<chrisccoulson> DBO, http://paste.ubuntu.com/596298/
<chrisccoulson> DBO - /usr/bin/eclipse is just a shell script that starts java btw
<DBO> yeah I know
<DBO> thats the skanky part of it
<chrisccoulson> hmm, that seems to work here already though
<DBO> does it now...
<DBO> okay
<DBO> shall we move on to emacs
<chrisccoulson> DBO - that's working too, although i've just thought of a case where that might not work
<DBO> yeah?
<chrisccoulson> emacs is an alternative for editor, so if you use update-alternatives to configure emacs as /usr/bin/editor, then it doesn't work (because the exec name doesn't match)
<chrisccoulson> i just tried that here
<chrisccoulson> perhaps you need to follow symlinks in bamf?
<DBO> whoa whoa whoa
<DBO> symlinks
<DBO> wtf is that shit
<chrisccoulson> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 24 2011-04-19 23:23 /usr/bin/editor -> /etc/alternatives/editor
<chrisccoulson> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 16 2011-04-19 23:23 /etc/alternatives/editor -> /usr/bin/emacs23
<DBO> its symlinks all the way down!
<chrisccoulson> so, if you launch "emacs23", then it works
<chrisccoulson> but if you launch "editor", then it fails
<DBO> yeah I think I know a better way to solve this...
<chrisccoulson> now it's time for me to configure my editor back to vi again ;)
<Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: thats the spirit!
<Sweetshark> :wq!
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
 * Sweetshark goes back to lurking.
<DBO> mmmm
<DBO> this is crap
<DBO> always following symlinks is probably not a good solution
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i've seen issues like the one in bug 766630 with other apps before. has anyone else had that problem?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 766630 in firefox "firefox have a "gap" between tabs and the panel " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/766630
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-04-20
<jasoncwarner> robert_ancell TheMuso RAOF bryceh https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-04-19 Meeting time!
<TheMuso> Hey.
<bryceh> hi
<jasoncwarner> morning everyone...hope everyone is enjoying these last few weeks before the release ;)
<TheMuso> Yeah.
<TheMuso> Just over a week now till the release.
<RAOF> Morning.
<jasoncwarner> Alright, lets get to it!
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] X Update
<RAOF> One broad class of compiz freezes fixed.
 * DBO pokes RAOF
<RAOF> But bug #740126 has a different cause, seems to be intel-specific, and I'm working on it.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740126 in unity "compiz hangs randomly several times per day" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740126
<RAOF> Apart from that, there seems to be an Xserver crasher still lurking around, possibly associated with fullscreen flash.
<jasoncwarner> ah flash...
<jasoncwarner> ok...thanks, RAOF
<RAOF> Bug #764456 is an exemplar of that; the server dies in CallCallbacks.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 764456 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "X crashes frequently with flash video playback" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/764456
<RAOF> bryceh: Anything you want to add?
<bryceh> been focusing on the Arrandale external monitor issues this week, there's about a dozen bug reports notably 747205 as the primary.  I suspect there are at least 3 distinct bugs that are getting mixed up.
<bryceh> of the three, the primary issue might be a DPMS issue in the kernel; possibly this can be worked around int he X driver; I have a patched driver in my ppa I'm having folks test
<bryceh> last week I worked on gpu lockup bugs for -intel and did some testing for unity/-ati corruption issues, but haven't nailed down any noteworthy fixes there.
 * robert_ancell loves the random X crash
 * jasoncwarner agrees with robert_ancell
<RAOF> Jay pinged me about that; I've filed a bug upstream about misrendering on r300g
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Lies!  X crashes are myths perpetrated by evil aarvarks!
<jasoncwarner> Ok...anything else of note?
<jasoncwarner> or, moving on to [TOPIC] AOB ;)
<bryceh> I also wrote a GUI tool called xdiagnose to help people turn on debugging in the kernel
<bryceh> anyway, guess nothing else of note.  lamenting loss of wayland, etc.
<robert_ancell> loss of wayland?
<RAOF> bryceh: We should discuss what to do with that at a session of UDS.
<jasoncwarner> yes, I think so...
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Linking cairo with libGL causes a significant memory use increase for people with nvidia's libGL.
<bryceh> RAOF, *shrug*
<RAOF> (On the order of 5MiB per process linking to cairo on x86-64, apparently up to 20MiB/process on i386)
<TheMuso> Youch.
<RAOF> bryceh: Well, we *will* want to have wayland in the archive - even in main - in the not too distant future.  Even if we just decieded to say âsucks to be you, nvidia usersâ, we should probably decide that :)
<bryceh> RAOF, to be honest I'm kinda worn out... was a lot of work and is kind of a let down that it all ended up for naught
<jasoncwarner> bryceh: might feel like that now, but we'll be using that soon enough!
<bryceh> anyway, I suppose if/when people start caring about wayland, the work can be undertaken again
<jasoncwarner> just a stumbling block ;)
<jasoncwarner> Anyway...sounds like we are about done...so thanks everyone...appreciate it!
<bryceh> thanks
<TheMuso> Thanks.
<RAOF> Ta.
<chrisccoulson> is everyone looking forward to UDS?
<DBO> i dont want to go to hungary
<desrt> is it because of the new constitution?
<RAOF> I always look forward to UDS.
<TheMuso> Me too.
<broder> I'm excited. I haven't gotten a chance to go to Europe in years
<chrisccoulson> i have to make sure i don't let my daughter find my passport!
<chrisccoulson> she's already hidden it in the bin once already ;)
<chrisccoulson> i don't want her to do that just before UDS :)
<DBO> chrisccoulson, high shelves
<chrisccoulson> DBO - yeah, it's on a high shelf now :)
<DBO> altitude is the natural enemy of children
<DBO> if you cant go for altitude, go for weight
<DBO> dude budapest is like 1.7 million people... thats like twice as many as detroit... but probably a whole lot cleaner
<lifeless> RAOF: hey, around ?
<lifeless> RAOF: my dad has this happening -
<lifeless> Error mounting location: DBus error org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Message did not receive a reply (timeout by message bus)
<lifeless> RAOF: I've seen a few inconclusive bugs/forum posts
<lifeless> he's running maverick; are you interested in more data / helping get him functional ?
<RAOF> lifeless: I've seen something like the reverse of that when unmounting twice quickly enough that the first hasn't gone through before the second is triggered.
<RAOF> But more context would be good - what's your dad doing to get that message?
<lifeless> gvfs-mount ssh://10.0.0.16
<lifeless> or via the GUI connect-to-server
<lifeless> originally only the gui failed, so I got him running gvfs-mount as a (fugly) workaround
<lifeless> dbus-monitor didn't show anything obviously bogus to me [but I don't practice enough to be sure whats good/bad]
<RAOF> I think that's a reasonably common gvfs error mode that gvfs has terrible reporting for.
<RAOF> I don't really have any suggestions on how to proceed, though.
<RAOF> It's not something that I'm particularly familiar with; robert_ancell might know more :)
<robert_ancell> unfortunately I don't know enough about gvfs to say
<lifeless> so, if network connectivity is up
<lifeless> and the machine on the other end is ubuntu
<lifeless> and ssh <host> works
<lifeless> htf does one debug this?
 * RAOF is clueless
<GunnarHj> kees: Pls see bug 766672. Were Martin's changes intended for Maverick?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 766672 in language-selector "package language-selector-common 0.6.8 failed to install/upgrade: sub-processo script post-installation instalado retornou estado de saÃ­da de erro 2" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/766672
<lifeless> RAOF: robert_ancell: also worth noting is that it returns effectively instantly when it fails
<lifeless> not some arbitrary point later
<RAOF> I win at reading the entrails of X.
<cyphermox> RAOF, what does it tell you? ;)
<RAOF> That if I cast 0xb78f660 to a DrawablePtr then I've found the drawable compiz is waiting on.
<TheMuso> RAOF, bryceh, seems that with newer kernels/x bits on my ThinkPad, I can leave NVIDIA Optimus enabled in the BIOS, and natty now comes up and uses the intel controller only. So I can leave optimus turned on now for whenever I use windows.
<RAOF> That's pretty nice.
<TheMuso> Yeah it is.
<lifeless> RAOF: robert_ancell: so, should I file a bug? Minimally the inability to debug network share access seems uhm important ?
<RAOF> lifeless: Please do file a bug.  I'm not sure who we've got who'll be particularly good at looking at it, though.
<lifeless> RAOF: I'll pop round to his place in a bit and ubuntu-bug it up there
<robert_ancell> lifeless, :P
<robert_ancell> lifeless, oh I thought you meant my place, but of course you're not in this neighborhood now!
<lifeless> robert_ancell: indeed ;)
<lifeless> robert_ancell: Would be happy to drop in some day but needs a little more coord :>
<bryceh> TheMuso, good to hear
<bryceh> ok, /me -> EOD.  time to go play in the garage
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> robert_ancell: btw, the gtk-doc upload keeps being in the queue; TBH I'm quite nervous about breaking package builds with a new version at this point
<robert_ancell> pitti, should I make a package with just the patch? It completely breaks distcheck at the moment
<pitti> distcheck of gtk-doc?
<pitti> I am looking forward to getting out of tree builds fixed, I painfully remember the workarounds I had to do in udev and other places
<pitti> but it changes quite a bit more, too
<GunnarHj> pitti: Good morning, Martin! Can you please upload a backports update due to yesterday's security update? I suppose it's pretty urgent. https://code.launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/ubuntu/maverick/language-selector/backports-sec-update/+merge/58417
<Sweetshark> Morning all!
<pitti> robert_ancell: that patch is the main change of that version, so I think if we take it we can just as well take 1.17 completely
<pitti> GunnarHj: ah, yes
<pitti> Sweetshark: guten Morgen!
<robert_ancell> pitti, well, if we deliver 1.16 any project that uses gtk-doc.make and doesn't have it checked in is going to fail make dist :(
<pitti> GunnarHj: you apparently have a conflict in debian/changelog, but I'll sort it out during merging
<pitti> robert_ancell: that bug is ages old, though; why do
<pitti> ... did it suddenly become worse?
<GunnarHj> pitti: I saw that bzr believes it's a conflict, but...
<robert_ancell> pitti, I don't know how no-one noticed it! It's only occurred in 1.16 right?
<pitti> robert_ancell: I first noticed it maybe two years ago
<pitti> I don't think that ever worked right
<pitti> it's great to see it fixed, though; less crappy workarounds in udev, pygobject and friends
<robert_ancell> hmm, but it was working for me previously, so from my experience it has got worse
<pitti> there was a previous failed attempt to fix it, so perhaps that made it worse
<pitti> robert_ancell: do you have time to try and build udev, pygobject, and perhaps a GNOME library against the new version and debdiff the binaries to check that doc files are still where they belong?
<robert_ancell> pitti, ok, will do
<pitti> thanks; that
<pitti> darn
<pitti> .. that'll give me a lot more confidence in it
 * pitti needs to get used to this laptop keyboard again
<Sweetshark> pitti: there is a nice little libreoffice-3.3.2-1ubuntu4.dsc on chinstrap fixing bug 765010.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 765010 in libreoffice "LibreOffice StartCenterâs desktop file has an empty value for Name[en]" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/765010
<didrocks> good morning
<robert_ancell> pitti, pygobject and udev seem identical
<pitti> nice
<pitti> well, they both have workarounds to copy the full source tree into the source dir because of that :)
<pitti> robert_ancell: ok, accepting
<pitti> looking forward to trying it
<Sweetshark> didrocks: good morning ...
<Sweetshark> ... traitor! ;)
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark, pitti, robert_ancell!
<didrocks> Sweetshark: ahah :-)
<robert_ancell> debdiff is very odd when it returns nothing.  Makes you wonder if it's done anything!
<didrocks> Sweetshark: sorry, LaTeX only annoys me when I need to upgrade with latex-full :-)
<robert_ancell> didrocks, morning!
<pitti> robert_ancell: it should at least report some noise in the control files?
<pitti> robert_ancell: and it says "file list identical" usually
<robert_ancell> pitti, should it?  I'll double check
<didrocks> Sweetshark: TBH, the first version of my book (in 2006), was in gOOo, but it couldn't handle the number of images and I had to split it two files :/
<pitti> robert_ancell: LP queue page timed out again, so not too late to hold it back :)
<Sweetshark> didrocks: how did was it not able to handle the images? crashes? or hangs and mindboggling slowness?
<didrocks> mindboggling slownessâ¦ 500 pages, 250 images (most of them < 100x100px)
<Sweetshark> didrocks: there is a solution to that: http://wiki.services.openoffice.org/wiki/Documentation/OOoAuthors_User_Manual/Writer_Guide/Working_with_Master_Documents something that works in OOo/LO better than on MS Office \o/.
<Sweetshark> (I learned about that rather late too, unfortunately).
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<robert_ancell> pitti, hey, how much longer before no more uploads?  I'm fixing up a few gcalctool bugs, should I upload now, or can I wait another 24 hours?
<pitti> robert_ancell: gcalctool should be okay tomorrow, too
<robert_ancell> pitti, can you check my debdiff logic.  I compile once with my gtk-doc package, and once with the current natty one.  Then debdiffed like this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/596430/
<Sweetshark> pitti: but the LO fix should be uploaded today, right?
 * Sweetshark looks nervous.
<pitti> robert_ancell: that looks fine
<pitti> Sweetshark: would be better, as it takes ages on arm
<pitti> and we should have room for another emergency upload if that one fails
<Sweetshark> pitti: well, its on chinstrap already
<seb128> hey desktopers
 * Sweetshark waves at seb128.
<seb128> hey pitti Sweetshark
<seb128> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> seb128, hello
<pitti> Sweetshark: oh, want me to upload, or do you want to do more changes?
<Sweetshark> pitti: upload please!
<pitti> yippie!
<pitti> Sweetshark: would you mind uploading the debian.tar.gz, too? :-)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, have you seen something like bug 766630 before?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 766630 in firefox "firefox have a "gap" between tabs and the panel " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/766630
<chrisccoulson> i've seen it before, but not for a while
<chrisccoulson> but someone reported that yesterday
 * Sweetshark grumbles.
<Sweetshark> pitti: yes, beacuse you asked so nicely ;)
 * pitti bats eyelashes
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: yeah, seems to be a compiz bug. I've reproduced it sometimes, smspillaz can't reproduce it
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, thanks. is there a master bug already?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: there is one in compiz, I can find it later
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
<didrocks> my computer is in a pain with all the rebuilds right now :)
 * Sweetshark just had Jehovas wittnesses at the door.
<chrisccoulson> Sweetshark, you answered the door?
<chrisccoulson> i always leave it to jo to answer the door in the daytime :)
<chrisccoulson> (for that reason)
<pitti> Sweetshark: "Ich habe auf Euch gewartet!!!"
 * pitti remembers Michael Mittermeier
<Sweetshark> What a disappointment: a) I was expecting a Notebook delivery. b) I wasnt playing Iron Maiden at maximum volume.
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i had to use google translate there ;)
<pitti> Sweetshark: thanks, it just looks a lot more beautiful with a debian tarball! that talked me into uploading it
<Sweetshark> pitti: *hrhr*
<pitti> chrisccoulson: it's a German comedian, there was an act where he describes what he does with Jehova's witnesses at the door
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - any more bugs you want me to look at today?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, not right know but I'm doing my daily bug review so I will tell you if I find something ;-)
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
<chrisccoulson> i will carry on hacking on my new firefox extension for now :)
<rodrigo__> morning
<pitti> hey rodrigo_
 * pitti assigns 58 bugs to rodrigo_, now that he's part of desktop team for real
<pitti> *cough* I meant "great that it worked out!"
 * pitti hugs rodrigo_
<seb128> did it?
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<didrocks> morning rodrigo_
<rodrigo_> hey pitti, official now?
<rodrigo_> hi seb128, didrocks
<seb128> rodrigo_, congrats ;-)
<rodrigo_> cool!!
 * rodrigo_ stops working and goes out to celebrate :D
 * pitti is quite pleased with https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus#rcbugs now
 * didrocks hugs rodrigo_, welcome! :)
<rodrigo_> thanks didrocks
<Sweetshark> rodrigo_: welcome!
<rodrigo_> thanks Sweetshark and seb128
<rodrigo_> so to celebrate, can someone sponsor this -> https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/webkit/fix-header/+merge/58395 please?
<pitti> rodrigo_: oh, sure
<didrocks> pitti: (btw, nux waiting, nux waiting, nux waitingâ¦ it's kind, it won't bite :-))</whispering>
<pitti> didrocks: already processing the queue
<rodrigo_> pitti, it's not critical, but needed for empathy in the gnome3 ppa, so can it go in?
<pitti> rodrigo_: looks ok to me
<didrocks> pitti: you're too fast! :-)
<rodrigo_> ok
<pitti> and still time to build on arm
<rodrigo_> when's the final timeline?
<pitti> "The Unapproved queue is empty." yay
<pitti> rodrigo_: practically, tomorrow; today for large pacakges like LibO/webkit
<pitti> Easter holidays get in the way..
<rodrigo_> pitti, ah cool, because I found a bug in evo-couchdb yesterday with jono, so I'm working on a fix
<rodrigo_> hopefully will get it done today
<pitti> rodrigo_: gosh, it complains about () and wants (void)?
<pitti> how stupid is that..
<rodrigo_> pitti, that's for stuff compiled with --strict
<pitti> right
<rodrigo_> yeah, quite dumb indeed
<pitti> I still think these should be synonyms
<rodrigo_> yes
<pitti> oh, btw
<pitti> rodrigo_: you aren't in ~ubuntu-desktop yet?
<rodrigo_> pitti, I was, but then I was removed because of the process to accept people
<rodrigo_> someone complained when I started the rotation
<rodrigo_> that I hadn't followed the process to be accepted
<pitti> rodrigo_: who except seb128 and me sponsored your work?
<pitti> we need to find three people
<pitti> I'll send an invite to the list
<rodrigo_> hmm
<rodrigo_> dholbach a couple of times iirc
<rodrigo_> pitti, ah, and kenvandine, although that was before my rotation
<pitti> rotation doesn't matter
<rodrigo_> ok then
<rodrigo_> pitti, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RodrigoMoya/PerPackageUploadApplication
<rodrigo_> if that's useful
<seb128> didrocks, pitti: so you do you have any opinion on those geforce cards not working with unity and nvidia but "working" with nouveau
<seb128> it's likely users will go and activate nvidia and get no desktop
<rodrigo_> btw, can I propose this -> http://git.gnome.org/browse/couchdb-glib/commit/?id=f8765589465b16610e73fb37906716bade83efe6 for upload?
<didrocks> right, I think we should blacklist them in jockey then
<glatzor> morning mvo seb128  and pitti
<seb128> do we consider nouveau to be solid enough and that they should use?
<seb128> or should we send them to classic?
<seb128> hey glatzor
<rodrigo_> it's not critical neither, but it removes a lot of warnings in the logs that people send
<pitti> glatzor: Servus!
<pitti> seb128: 2D yes, but on nvidia you currently get classic by default, don't you?
<seb128> rodrigo_, seems fine to me
<mvo> hey glatzor
<seb128> pitti, do you?
<glatzor> mvo, it seems that the forzen_status context manager is still called in the forked child process if we just use os._exit. Very strange behavior
<pitti> I don't think we should install nouveau-3d by default yet
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, and since I have upload rights, I just dput and it will get reviewed, right? or do I need a merge proposal?
<mvo> glatzor: oh, that is indeed puzzling, no atexit should be called for _exit()
<seb128> pitti, well, whatever you get by default manage to run unity but nvidia gives you a frozen desktop on geforce 7300 and 7400 cards
<pitti> seb128: classic for natty IMHO
<seb128> pitti, so people get unity working, install nvidia, restart and get no desktop
<pitti> feh
<glatzor> mvo, but this only happens if you send a ctrl+c to the forked client
<didrocks> pitti: we can only blacklist by pcid right now, not pcid + driver
<pitti> didrocks: oh, bummer; the nux testing tool doesn't check the driver?
<didrocks> pitti: right, only pcids
<didrocks> and I don't feel we should change that now
<pitti> door bell, brb
<pitti> didrocks: but I still think blacklisting is safer at this point
<didrocks> so "sorry" for people wanting to try with nouveau?
<seb128> didrocks, you just hate users admit it ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: damned, my secret!! :-)
<mvo> seb128: nowdays it works ok-ish for my 8400, but its not that smooth and I get a crash every now and then
<seb128> didrocks, tseliot's point that the nouveau driver is not very efficient and will lead to other issues
<didrocks> seb128: do you have the pcid btw?
<didrocks> yeah, I see a lot of people using it, but they get artifacts and such
<tseliot> yep
<glatzor> mvo, you can reproduce by adding a import pdb; pdb; pdb.set_trace() in the finally statement of the frozen_status  method , and abort an installation with Crtl c
<seb128> didrocks, we should probably recommend unity only when it will give a solid experience
<tseliot> seb128, didrocks: I really think the check should be in either unity or nux, so that users can still use nvidia with the classic desktop or with unity 2d
<seb128> didrocks, #728745, it has some, like the apport infos has
<seb128> "nVidia Corporation G72M [GeForce Go 7400] [10de:01d8] "
<didrocks> ok, looking to add it
<seb128> we can ask for lspci infos from other commenters
<didrocks> seb128: can you handle that? I'm chasing a bugs in theme with unity
<seb128> didrocks, yes
<didrocks> adding 10de:01d8 meanwhile
<didrocks> seb128: thanks :)
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> it will blacklist unity and compiz FYI
<pitti> re
<pitti> didrocks: is the blacklist in the code, or in any text file?
<seb128> didrocks, the --unity and --compiz part of the helper don't have different lists?
<didrocks> pitti: it's in the code unfortunately
<pitti> didrocks: can it be ignored with an environment variable or a command line optino? (that might also be useful for people testing drivers in a PPA, etc.)
<didrocks> seb128: no, despite my repeated demands
<pitti> note that a full option is not required, just a very small "optino" one!
<didrocks> pitti: can add that
<rodrigo_> hmm
<rodrigo_> Changes file must be signed with a valid GPG signature: Verification failed 3 times: ["(7, 9, u'No public key')", "(7, 9, u'No public key')", "(7, 9, u'No public key')"] : Permission denied.
<rodrigo_> Note: This error might indicate a problem with your passive_ftp setting.
<rodrigo_>       Please consult dput.cf(5) for details on this configuration option.
<pitti> rodrigo_: argh, that again?
<pitti> rodrigo_: just ignore it, it'll work anyway
<rodrigo_> again? it's the 1st time I see it
<rodrigo_> ah ok
<rodrigo_> pitti, I ran dput twice, so there are 2 identical uploads, can you remove one of them?
<pitti> rodrigo_: yes, no problem
<pitti> rodrigo_: yeah, it has haunted people in the last couple of weeks
<rodrigo_> also, can someone please merge this -> https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/couchdb-glib/remove-warnings/+merge/58453 ?
<rodrigo_> pitti, well, haven't used dput myself much in the last couple of weeks, that's why I didn't see it, I guess :)
<pitti> rodrigo_: isn't that the very one you just uploaded?
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes
<pitti> rodrigo_: done
<rodrigo_> thanks
<huats> seb128, I was wondering where to find some updates to do )
<huats> :)
<huats> well may be not for natty, it is too late I assume
<huats> but I'd like to work again for oneiric...
<huats> and the page versions.html gave me a 404
<huats> so it is not used anymore ?
<pitti> bonjour huats
<pitti> huats: it just moved to http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html
<huats> hey pitti !
<huats> thanks for the info
<pitti> we'll have plenty of work to do for O :)
<huats> pitti, I know there is
<huats> and I'll do my best to help again
<huats> :)
<seb128> hey huats, yeah new url is in the topic, we moved there like in start of the cycle, you have been away from packaging for a while ;-)
<huats> seb128, you know I have been away :)
<seb128> huats, it's getting close from natty, hard freeze is tomorrow, so not really the best time for updates though, maybe universe ones
<huats> that was my idea (to not work on natty because of the hard freeze)
<huats> but to start update my tools :) to be able to work quite soon on oneiric
<huats> I'll give a look on universe
<pitti> huats: sounds awesome! you have some more time to spend on FOSS stuff again?
<pitti> huats: if you are interested, there's still plenty of work to do on the gnome 3 PPA
<pitti> which isn't bound by the natty freeze
<pitti> huats: it's kind of a staging area for oneiric anyway, but should also be useful for natty users who want to try it
<huats> let's say that I have spent sometime working on FOSS but I couldn't find time to work on ubuntu desktop :)
<huats> pitti, and yes I should be able to find some more time in the next months !
<pitti> tres bien!
<huats> indeed the gnome3 ppa is something quite interesting too
<huats> pitti, I'll give a look right now
<seb128> mvo, have you seen bugs about http://paste.ubuntu.com/596474/ or similar before?
<seb128> the error in english says that broken packages are in "keep in state" mode
<rodrigo_> huats, we have lots of things todo in the gnome3 ppa, like packaging e-d-s, evolution, gnome-panel, the new network manager, etc, so feel free to do it :)
<huats> rodrigo_, I'll give a look quite soon
<huats> rodrigo_, how do you coordonate inside the team ? (well if there is coordination :))
<mvo> seb128: what bug is that?
<seb128> mvo, it's happening on my box, it's not a bug (yet)
<mvo> in what context did it happen?
<mvo> it usually mean that the poor reslver is confused
<seb128> mvo, it seems that's when clicking a binary for upgrade in  update-manager
<mvo> ok
<seb128> like I click on of the firefox-... which should make firefox to be checked as well
<seb128> like firefox-branding
<seb128> but instead of checking firefox as to upgrade as well it triggers apport
<seb128> mvo, it's my way to select updates I want to do first, I tend to unselect all, click a few I want to try without waiting for other download, install those and then upgrade the remaining
<seb128> mvo, bug #752104
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 752104 in update-manager "update-manager crashed with SystemError in mark_install(): E:Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/752104
<mvo> seb128: right, I suspect its just confused over one dependency somewhere or a inconsitent archive
<seb128> I'm not the only one ;-)
<seb128> mvo, well I'm my system in that buggy state if you want, but it's easy to trigger with a natty box from yesterday where you didn't upgrade firefox yet
<seb128> clicking on firefox select the other depends as it should
<rodrigo_> huats, there's a mailing list https://edge.launchpad.net/~gnome3-team
<huats> rodrigo_, yeah I have seen that :)
<rodrigo_> huats, also, there are branches -> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~gnome3-team
<rodrigo_> huats, so, if you start working on something, just tell the list, and propose a branch merge
<rodrigo_> that's all :)
<huats> rodrigo_, ok that is way to coordonate :)
<huats> rodrigo_, thanks for letting me know
<rodrigo_> huats, for the stuff we don't have branches yet (e-d-s, evo, etc), just branch from the ubuntu-desktop branch and we'll push that to a gnome3-team branch
<huats> ok
<rodrigo_> huats, well, to be honest, we haven't used the list much to tell what we were working on :)
<huats> (I have seen that since I gave a look at the archives since :) )
<huats> rodrigo_, I don't know if you used the url I mentioned (andthat I was looking) but it worked quite well in the past in the desktop team
<huats> may be having smething similar might be a good idea :)
<rodrigo_> huats, hmm, which url?
<huats> rodrigo_, http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html
<rodrigo_> ah yes, we use that
<rodrigo_> robert_ancell changed it to show the 3.0 versions
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, if you feel like it might be worth trying to clean some of the unity or indicator warnings spamming .xsession-errors
<chrisccoulson> sure, i can look at that
<huats> rodrigo_, do you have the url for the 3.0 ppa ?
<rodrigo_> huats, https://edge.launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+archive/gnome3
<huats> no I might misunderstood you, but I thought you mention that robert  set up a web page like the one I just  showed you but focussed on the gnome3 ppa
<huats> and I was asking if you have that ur l :)
<huats> (or may be I should ask robert directly :))
<rodrigo_> huats, no, it's the same page, but it shows the 3.0 versions also
<huats> rodrigo_, pfff I think I might need some sleep : I just realized the 2 versions separated by a / :)
<rodrigo_> huats, see the Ubuntu and Upstream columns
<rodrigo_> huats, heh
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, other goal for you, can you make unity print the g_debug output in a log rather than spamming .xsession-errors?
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<mvo> seb128: hm, not on my (slightly outdated box, will try on a second one in a bit, just finishing some code)
<huats> rodrigo_, thanks
<didrocks> seb128: I thought you told that you would tackle it some weeks ago?
<huats> Ineed to go right now, but I'll come back later and try to start workng on something
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, you know how it goes ;-)
<didrocks> :-)
<seb128> didrocks, well it's stable time now I would turn debug off by default
<seb128> but anyway let's see if chrisccoulson can help there
<didrocks> yeah, I've other more important things to fix now
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: WDYT about turning off apport by default tomorrow?
<pitti> do you still depend on it for tracking down stuff?
<seb128> pitti, the later the better this cycle
<seb128> pitti, I want to see what segfaults are still there in the new unity
<seb128> but one day should be enough
<didrocks> pitti: sounds good to me, most of people reporting stacktrace now are using the "light" report, so we get unuseful stacktrace thoughâ¦
<pitti> oh, they do? why
<pitti> ah, I think it sometimes displays vastly inflated numbers for the size of the full one
<pitti> I saw it display "130 MB" or so, but it's counting uncompressed size
<pitti> the core dump usually melts down to more like 5
<seb128> because people judge they don't have enough upload for those
<pitti> meh; let's hope it's usually enough to at least identify it as a dupe
<pitti> most of the time when I tried to report one, I already got several existing ones with teh same title
<pitti> sorry about that; need to fix for o
<seb128> no worry
<didrocks> pitti:  no worry, but yeah, being more incitating on the "full" version can be nice :)
<seb128> I've restarted the amd64 retracer
<seb128> it had a lock and a log with no error but not updated since 3am this night
<seb128> not sure why it stopped, let's see if just removing the lock is enough
<abhinav-> pitti: Hi, smb approved this proposal yesterday, I made a few small changes again today. is it too late for natty now ? https://code.launchpad.net/~er-abhinav-upadhyay/ubuntu/natty/tomboy/patch-757635/+merge/58303
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah, ok, so if you have time try to clean warnings and errors in the bug, those might point real issues and maybe for bonus point make unity g_debug calls log into a unity.log
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<fta> pitti, most people don't upload full report for chromium because of the announced size, which is always wrong, stuff like 230MB, 370MB, ...
<pitti> fta: same problem I guess
<chrisccoulson> heh, my ~/.xsession-errors is 150kB, and i restarted my session less than 1 hour ago
<fta> pitti, yep, that was just a +1 :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: (nautilus:1700): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: g_value_get_object: assertion `G_VALUE_HOLDS_OBJECT (value)' failed
<pitti> ?
<pitti> 800 kB/2 hours
<chrisccoulson> pitti - mostly "(xchat-gnome:3012): Gdk-CRITICAL **: _gdk_pixmap_new: assertion `(width != 0) && (height != 0)' failed"
<chrisccoulson> and some similar ones from nm-applet too
<chrisccoulson> brb
<seb128> the spamming is mostly that here:
<seb128> (<unknown>:8523): GLib-GObject-WARNING **: invalid (NULL) pointer instance
<seb128> (<unknown>:8523): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: g_signal_handler_disconnect: assertion `G_TYPE_CHECK_INSTANCE (instance)' failed
<pitti> didrocks: did a test install in kvm (for testing another bug), and now got the dialog about "you can't run unity blabla" (but not on the live system); so that works as it should, nice!
<didrocks> pitti: excellent! thanks for confirming :)
<pitti> seb128: hm, seems that everyone got a different spam source now :/
<didrocks> seb128: pitti: on bug #728745 seems people are trying nvidia with nouveau when the other driver doesn't work. Hoping that the environment variable to set won't upset them :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 728745 in unity "[nvidia, 7300, 7400] display freeze when using unity desktop" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/728745
<seb128> pitti, yeah... :-(
<seb128> didrocks, well those are technical users, most users which a frozen session will not know what to do
<seb128> they will just think their install and screwed and reinstall
<seb128> or install another os
<didrocks> ok, let's put them in the classic "no effect" then
<seb128> didrocks, bug #764379 might be in a similar case
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 764379 in nvidia-graphics-drivers "Partial screen corruption and poor performance on GeForce 6150" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/764379
<seb128> didrocks, though nouveau doesn't work for that one
<didrocks> seb128: blacklisting then
<didrocks> UNITY_BLACKLIST_DISABLE is a good env name for you?
<seb128> didrocks, we should maybe tag those card specific issues in some way and do a sru a bit later
<pitti> didrocks: UNITY_DONT_CHECK ?
<pitti> or UNITY_FORCE_START to avoid a negation?
<seb128> I was going to suggest something around pitti's suggestion
<didrocks> pitti: it's not FORCE_START, it's just for the blacklist
<didrocks> you want to totally disable the checking?
<pitti> didrocks: you don't?
<pitti> might be interesting for testing
<didrocks> I was just disabling the blacklist
<pitti> didrocks: but really, doens't matter much either way
<didrocks> hum, checking on gnome-session
<pitti> it's a secret option only which should only come up in bug reports
<didrocks> don't remember if I added that ;)
<seb128> well the check tools is only used by gnome-session?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah
<seb128> i.e those people can tweak their .session?
<didrocks> exactly
<seb128> if they want to skip the checking
<didrocks> (until the next gnome-session update)
<didrocks> seb128: wait, on bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nux/+bug/728745, rereading it, isn't the xorg freeze?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 728745 in nux "[nvidia, 7300, 7400] display freeze when using unity desktop" [High,Fix committed]
<didrocks> seb128: people don't report that freeze from the start of the session
<seb128> didrocks, seems like that when unity start it screw things
<didrocks> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nux/+bug/728745/comments/7
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 728745 in nux "[nvidia, 7300, 7400] display freeze when using unity desktop" [High,Fix committed]
<seb128> didrocks, it doesn't render things as it should or doesn't react to clicks
<didrocks> seems like after a grab rather
<didrocks> seb128: there is the xorg (which is in fact a kernel) freeze as well
<seb128> well it doesn't happen in a constant way?
<seb128> but anyway feel free to do what you judge best for the bug
<didrocks> I'm afraid we are rushing on blacklisting card we shouldn't
<seb128> even if it's unity making xorg lock it's still a broken unity session imho
<seb128> ok, got to go, food is ready and i've a call at 2
<didrocks> seb128: it happens here to, (once a day), and for chrisccoulson as well
<seb128> brb
<didrocks> if we were going to blacklist our cardsâ¦ ;)
<seb128> didrocks, well that bug seems it happen on login every time
<didrocks> seb128: not from comment 7, I asked for more info
<seb128> ok thanks
<rodrigo_> hmm, huats sent a request for joining gnome3-team
<rodrigo_> seb128, pitti: I assume yo know him well right?
<rodrigo_> so can I just accept him?
<seb128> rodrigo_, yes
<rodrigo_> ok
<seb128> he has been an active contributor for some years and used to help on GNOME updates
<rodrigo_> oh, I can't accept people it seems
<seb128> he has been less around recently and busy with other things but it's fine to add him to the team
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, that's what I thought, just wanted to confirm
<rodrigo_> seb128, can you accept him -> https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+member/christophe.sauthier please?
<huats> rodrigo_,  and seb128 thanks :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, huats: done
<seb128> doh 20 members pending
<rodrigo_> huats, nah, you need to send us some French wine or food :)
<seb128> do we know any of the others?
<rodrigo_> seb128, who are they?
<seb128> rodrigo_, list on https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+members
<didrocks> rodrigo_: and he's french, that's a ack on its own :)
 * huats needs to run give a prensentation on the "Ubuntu community"
<seb128> rodrigo_, but the names don't ring any bell
<rodrigo_> didrocks, well, I thought that before meeting you, so now I'm more careful with French people :)
<huats> rodrigo_, please remind me that before we met :)
<huats> (about food and wine)
<huats> :)
<rodrigo_> huats, :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: ok, where is your application for ~ubuntu-desktop already? :-)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, :)
<rodrigo_> seb128, JC Hulce is one of the guys from the gnome remix. we told him to send some merge proposals first
<seb128> rodrigo_, I guess I should go through the list and add a comment for each saying that
<rodrigo_> seb128, Jeremy Bicha has sent a few merge proposals, not sure if we should accept him for now
<rodrigo_> seb128, no idea about the others
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, let me know if you know of anyone that should be acked
<seb128> I didn't watch the ppa a lot recently but I will catch up once natty is wrapped
<rodrigo_> seb128, not really, no idea who they are
<chrisccoulson> hmmmm, is xchat still working?
<chrisccoulson> seems to be
<chrisccoulson> nice :)
<chrisccoulson> and no critical errors
<TheMuso> pitti: hrm ok you filled powerpc alternate, but we need to decide what to cull from powerpc desktop as its oversized. I can't make up my mind as to what we can cull, as we are at the point where functionality will have to be culled. The question is what.
<mvo> chrisccoulson: do you mind if I upload  http://paste.ubuntu.com/596518/ ? helps the upgader and should do no harm
<chrisccoulson> mvo - sure, that's fine
<chrisccoulson> i'll push it to bzr too
<chrisccoulson> (or you could propose a merge) :)
<chrisccoulson> lp:~mozillateam/nss/nss.head, i think
<mvo> chrisccoulson: sure, will do that
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
<mvo> https://code.launchpad.net/~mvo/nss/nss.mvo/+merge/58479 fyi, uploaded now, its waiting in the queue
<pitti> TheMuso: TBH, at that point I'd just declare it done and document that you need a DVD or an USB stick
<dpm> hey seb128, what was the context of the "Drop To Add Application" string in unity? Is it to drop an application icon to the launcher?
<TheMuso> pitti: Right, DVD it will have to be then, due to powerpc not being able to boot from USB.
<seb128> dpm, yes, do a dnd from the dash to the launcher
<TheMuso> pitti: Whats the task for release notes? There is a bug against ubuntu-meta for this, so I want to make sure its mentioned.
<seb128> dpm, ie in the application view for example
<seb128> dpm, it display it as a tooltip while you dnd over the launcher
<pitti> TheMuso: feel free to directly add it to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NattyNarwhal/TechnicalOverview
<TheMuso> Ok will take care of that tomorrow. Thanks.
<pitti> TheMuso: thanks; good night!
<dpm> thanks seb128
<seb128> dpm, sorry I didn't send the email about it yesterday I was waiting the template import which has been taking a while, seems someone beat me to it today
<dpm> seb128, yeah, no worries, all is good :)
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<didrocks> seb128: you imported the pot yourself on Monday, isn't it?
<seb128> didrocks, unity?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I remember we discussed this
<seb128> didrocks, dpm did yesterday but the launchpad side takes a while to process uploads
<didrocks> ok
<seb128> didrocks, it's in now and already translated in frencg
<didrocks> ok, nice :)
<seb128> in french
<mterry> Riddell, ping
<Riddell> hi mterry
<Riddell> oh aye, you had a dbusmenu patch
<Riddell> mterry: have you run it by agateau?
<mterry> Riddell, nope.  shall I jump in the kubuntu channel?
<Riddell> can do
<seb128> he's off this week
<seb128> he = agateau
<Riddell> oh ok, thanks for letting us know seb128
<Riddell> mterry: in that case I'll just upload it and hope you know what you're doing :)
<Riddell> it looks sensible to me
<mterry> Riddell, :)
<mterry> seb128, I'm testing the keyring patch, hopefully won't blow up in my face and I'll upload
<seb128> mterry, oh nice, did you get upstream to review it?
<mterry> seb128, oh, I assumed that guy was upstream.  :)  Let me look at his history again
<seb128> mterry, "that guy"? I didn't read the bug for a while
<mterry> yeah, upstream Stef provided a new patch
<seb128> ok, Stef is upstream ;-)
<mterry> seb128, oh sorry  :)  I thought you were subscribed
<seb128> sorry I was a bit out of context for this one
<mterry> seb128, yeah, he provided a new patch
<seb128> yeah, seems like I'm subscribed to gnome-keyring but not the lib
<mterry> I can't reproduce, but as long as it doesn't crash for me, I think it's fine to put in, since it came from upstream
<seb128> right
<seb128> quite some users get it
<seb128> the retracer run into 2-3 of those a day
<seb128> natty starts feeling pretty solid, I don't find new bugs that really need to be worked by reading daily reports
<pitti> great to hear!
<mterry> seb128, hahah.   now I get a different assert  ;)
<seb128> mterry, :-(
<Sweetshark> seb128: I still have bug 746375, which is not easy to reproduce. I will release a ppa version for that and ask the guys if it is gone. And I have bug 754562 which unfortunately will require some heavylifting in the code -> risk of regressions, release to ppa
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 746375 in libreoffice "soffice.bin crashed with SIGSEGV in uno_type_sequence_construct()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/746375
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 754562 in libreoffice "soffice.bin crashed with SIGSEGV in g_hash_table_lookup()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/754562
<mterry> seb128, oh my mistake.  Same assert.  Which isn't much better
 * Sweetshark lunches.
<mterry> seb128, but I can reproduce now.  Using gvfs-mount on the command line over and over gets it pretty fast
<seb128> mterry, ok well at least being able to trigger it will be useful
<seb128> Sweetshark, right, you better target a sru for those, the sru updates get at least one week of testing before going to updates
<seb128> pedro_, hey
<pedro_> hello seb128
<seb128> pedro_, how are you?
<pedro_> seb128, i'm good, thanks.  what about you?
<seb128> pedro_, I'm fine thanks ;-)
<pedro_> seb128, finally a week with no kernel testing, so time to catch up with some desktop bugs ;-)
<seb128> pedro_, we are getting close from natty, is there any desktop bug you can think about that need to be worked and didn't yet?
<pedro_> evolution is a mess...
<seb128> nothing new there
<pedro_> m there's a couple of minor annoyances like bug 740104
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740104 in compiz "Windows appear in the window list on adjacent workspaces" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740104
<pedro_> but looks like that's being tracked already, but haven't seen any progress yet
<pedro_> that'd be nice to fix though, is pretty confusing
<seb128> it's a compiz bug yeah, not sure if smspillaz can work on it
<seb128> pedro_, but it's in classic GNOME only right?
<pitti> the shadow spillover isn't, though
<pedro_> seb128, yeah on classic, since it's related to the window list
<pedro_> bug 753369 is also something that's affecting lot of users
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 753369 in compiz "compiz artifacts in chromium, xchat, opera... you name it" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/753369
<seb128> that one is assigned and being worked
<pedro_> the others are being tracked already, so nothing on the top of my head atm
<pedro_> besides the ones already mentioned
<seb128> ok
<seb128> pedro_, there is a brasero one easy to trigger if you want to check upstream, try to run it twice
<seb128> pedro_, it's one of the recent bugs which have the same titles, they are not duplicates though so don't close it if you triage it ;-)
<pedro_> seb128, ok i'll have a look ;-)
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> ok, nothing special in today retracing, unity is table
<pedro_> you're welcome monsieur
<seb128> stable
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - so, i figured out why nm-applet spams xsession-errors (which seems to be one of the biggest offenders for me)
<chrisccoulson> but i'm not sure what to do about it. it's a broken theme (bug 767186)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 767186 in ubuntu-mono "nm-signal-* icons break nm-applet" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/767186
<seb128> chrisccoulson, can you talk to sladen about the issue see if he can get it fixed for natty or in a sru?
<seb128> he's maintaining ubuntu-mono
 * ogra_ hopes we advance one day to ubuntu-stereo
<chrisccoulson> ogra_, lol ;)
<chrisccoulson> do you want to bring the tumbleweed, or shall i? ;)
<ogra_> that probably requires a dual-core sladen though :P
<chrisccoulson> heh:)
<ogra_> yeah, sorry, couldnt resist that one :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you get such warnings?
<seb128> (<unknown>:8523): GLib-GObject-WARNING **: invalid cast from `(null)' to `BamfView'
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - no, i don't have any of those
<chrisccoulson> "unknown" - that's useful :)
<seb128> that's unity
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you don't have those either?
<seb128> (<unknown>:1657): GLib-GObject-WARNING **: instance of invalid non-instantiatable type `(null)'
<seb128> (<unknown>:1657): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: g_signal_handler_disconnect: assertion `G_TYPE_CHECK_INSTANCE (instance)' failed
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i've got those
<seb128> can you check on that next?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, sure
<seb128> I think I got the bamf ones after play a bit adding launcher by dragging those from the dash and deleting those
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - do you get these from nautilus too: (nautilus:8232): GConf-CRITICAL **: gconf_value_free: assertion `value != NULL' failed ?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> would be nice to debug as well
<seb128>     203 (<unknown>:8523): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: g_signal_handler_disconnect: assertion `G_TYPE_CHECK_INSTANCE (instance)' failed
<seb128>     219 ** (process:1683): DEBUG: zeitgeist-datahub.vala:174: Inserting 1 events
<seb128>      22 (<unknown>:8493): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: g_signal_handler_disconnect: assertion `G_TYPE_CHECK_INSTANCE (instance)' failed
<seb128>     328 (<unknown>:8523): GLib-GObject-WARNING **: invalid cast from `BamfWindow' to `BamfApplication'
<seb128>     168 (<unknown>:8523): GLib-GObject-WARNING **: invalid (NULL) pointer instance
<seb128> quite some spamming
<seb128> (the first number are the counts)
<seb128> go unity :p
<seb128> nautilus is first spammer though it seems
<chrisccoulson> ah, debugging unity sucks. there are some gdbus related errors first, and i'm not sure how i can skip those and catch the ones that happen more often :/
<chrisccoulson> if i do G_DEBUG=fatal_criticals, it will abort on the less interesting errors first
<seb128> try to break on the function from the other ones, with some luck it's not hit a lot before
<seb128> or try the test-panel binary in the vcs
<seb128> it's handy since it let you run a standalone unity-panel service
<seb128> which loads indicators etc which seem to be what create most of the warnings
<mpt> hey and471
<and471> hey mpt
<GunnarHj> pitti: It looks like you in effect redid the l-s backports merge this morning. For next time I'll try to figure out the proper way to do it. Bazaar Explorer tells you that the branches diverged (which is true)...
<GunnarHj> pitti: Thanks for your patience!
<mpt> pitti (or anyone), what's the package that does the "Install Multimedia Plugins" process?
<pitti> GunnarHj: not really, I merged and just updated teh changelog
<pitti> GunnarHj: there's no need to copy the previous changelog entry, as the locale handlnig didn't actually changed in this version; you just merged the security fix
<pitti> mpt: I believe it's gnome-codec-install
<mpt> thanks pitti
<seb128> mpt, gnome-codec-install iirc
<seb128> oh, pitti replied already
<GunnarHj> pitti: Yeah, it's the "merge the security fix" part, i.e. merge particular revisions only, that I need to learn. Or have I got it wrong completely?
<pitti> GunnarHj: no, the actual code chagnes/merge were quite perfect
<pitti> GunnarHj: just the changelog was a bit fiddly; partly because bzr likes to mess up changelogs, and partly because you described the changes of the original backport instead of the changes _since_ the previous -backports version
<pitti> GunnarHj: i. e. conceptually what you do is to merge *from* -updates *into* -backports; you don't re-do the backport from scratch on a new -updates base
<pitti> as for how to read/write the changelog
<GunnarHj> pitti: You are right about how I did it conceptually. Reason: Bazaar Explorer complained...
<GunnarHj> pitti: Maybe the problem simply is that these defensive backports updates are urgent, and for that reason I haven't really taken the time to figure out how to do it the proper way. Will be better next time. ;-)
<pitti> GunnarHj: ideally you would just check out lp:ubuntu/maverick-backports/language-selector, and then run bzr merge lp:ubuntu/maverick-security/language-selector
<pitti> that's how it's meant to work in the new world order
<GunnarHj> pitti: I see. That's what I'll try first next time, then.
<mvo> so sometimes pressing super in unity does not give me shortcuts for the 1-n keys, the numbers are not highlighted n the launcher, only "s", "a", "f". and super-1 does not launch my terminal. any idea what that could be? this is a upgrade from today with nouveau
<didrocks> mvo: can you check you only have one compiz process running?
<didrocks> james_w: hey, I think you won't update bzr builder into natty anymore (and we will keep a broken "bzr: ERROR: Unable to determine the previous upload for --package-merge.") for some branches, isn't it?
<james_w> hi didrocks
<james_w> jelmer was going to get it in to Debian so we could sync
<mvo> didrocks: sure, just did that, just one compiz
<didrocks> james_w: excellent! :-) I still keep a trunk branch meanwhile ;)
<didrocks> mvo: humâ¦ weird  :/
<james_w> didrocks, yeah, hopefully we can have it in tomorrow, but you'll be building many packages before then I expect :-)
<didrocks> mvo: the weird thing is that the shortcuts (keybinding don't work)
<didrocks> james_w: well, just the two latest, hopefully, no worry for now :-)
<mvo> didrocks: well, super-s super-a work
<didrocks> mvo: the code is really stupid in that area, so there is really something not attributing them :/
<dbarth> Cimi: are you really, really sure you want to make this change now?
<mvo> didrocks: no worries, I will ignore it for now, let me know if I can do anyhting to help with this
<Cimi_> dbarth: which change?
<didrocks> mvo: I think this will certainly end up with printf at UDS :)
<mvo> ahah
<lucazade> rodrigo_ : ping
<rodrigo_> lucazade, pong
<Sweetshark> pitti: ping?
<lucazade> i've tried the issue of gnome-settings-daemon with a physical installation and it is not present (only in virtuabox)
<lucazade> installed from scratch and with all updates
<rodrigo_> lucazade, ok, good to know that the bug's severity is lower then
<lucazade> rodrigo_ it seems related to vbox video drivers
<lucazade> ok just to let you know
<rodrigo_> lucazade, yes, xrandr plugin, not sure though what makes the indicator patch raise the bug though
<lucazade> rodrigo_ mystery !
<rodrigo_> lucazade, yeah :)
<dbarth> Cimi: the merge prop. tedg is talking about
<Cimi> dbarth: it's a feature requested by mark and rick
<pitti> Sweetshark: (on phone); just ask your question, I'll respond later
<Sweetshark> pitti: I tought I gave you a upload without regenerating control (and ending up with a LO-l10n control file), but it seems now that was a false alarm.
<pitti> Sweetshark: at least it built the expected packages :)
<pitti> I haven't restarted unity yet to check whether the bug is fixed, though
 * Sweetshark drops his heartrate below 150 again.
<Sweetshark> pitti: Well, it did with my locally build *.deb
<Sweetshark> hmmm, I think I found a good way to reproduce a unity crash: Run claws-mail, minimize it, run "DISPLAY=:0 unity" on a vt -> uunity crashes
<seb128_> well why would you run unity if it's already running?
<seb128_> btw no need to set DISPLAY the unity wrapper will do that for you
<dbarth> Cimi: where is the branch proposal?
<Cimi> dbarth: https://code.launchpad.net/~cimi/ayatana-scrollbar/hide-thumb-on-selection/+merge/58296
<Cimi> dbarth: and I need the new blacklist
<rodrigo_> ok, going out for a bit. Will be on national holidays till Tuesday, but will check mail so if there's anything you want from me, please send mail
<rodrigo_> have a nice week
<seb128> rodrigo_, slacker!!!
<seb128> rodrigo_, sorry... enjoy ;-)
<seb128> still one day before the long weekend here
<pitti> rodrigo_: enjoy!
<jcastro> hey seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/687567
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 687567 in unity "Global menu causes white "flashes" when scrubbing/moving with mouse fast over menus" [High,Confirmed]
<seb128> hey jcastro
<seb128> yes?
<jcastro> sorry wrong bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/askubuntu-lens/+bug/758839
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 758839 in gwibber/unity-lens-gwibber "Lens doesn't start on login" [High,Confirmed]
<jcastro> so there's an issue with python lenses not loaded on login
<seb128> the first one is a compiz setting to tweak, someone pinged didrocks about that today iirc but not sure if that's happening for natty
<jcastro> and DX is sprinting now or something, I would like to escalate this bug (or whatever process)
<didrocks> it's not happening in natty, it's sent to backlog
<jcastro> (the first bug was just cruft from my buffer, I mean to talk about lenses)
<didrocks> jcastro: I tried, but it won't be fixed for natty, maybe a 0 day SRU
<dbarth> jcastro: what's up?
<jcastro> oh ok, SRU would be fine
<seb128> didrocks, well johnlea comment #20 suggested to disable the option in compiz as a workaround for this cycle
<jcastro> dbarth: I am concerned that we talked to people to make lenses, and none of the python ones work
<didrocks> seb128: right, but as told this will impact all the other fading effect
<didrocks> seb128: and won't upgrade beta users, so we will still have those things
<seb128> didrocks, ok, could you maybe add a comment on the bug saying so?
<didrocks> seb128: it's sent to backlog, isn't it?
<seb128> jcastro, we need kamstrup de look at your issue basically, talk to njpatel
<didrocks> I pinged them for that already and kamstrup is aware of it
<kees> okay, when I hit super, I get the app-search window thing (what's this called?). but clicking any of the top row doesn't do anything.
<didrocks> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/687567/comments/19
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 687567 in unity "Global menu causes white "flashes" when scrubbing/moving with mouse fast over menus" [High,Confirmed]
<didrocks> it's on the bug report
<jcastro> kees: that's the dash
<didrocks> bug then,John commented, not sure he's aware that it won't work on upgrade
<kees> jcastro: "dash"! okay, thanks.
<kees> jcastro: any idea why the top row of buttons don't do anything?
<jcastro> that sounds like a bug
<seb128> didrocks, I don't even know what that means, users don't know the unity team process, especially that the workaround suggested by john was a compiz one
<seb128> kees, "dash"
<seb128> kees, do you have unity-place-applications installed?
<didrocks> seb128: see the comment
<seb128> didrocks, right and in comment #20 johnlea replied saying to do it anyway
<kees> seb128: I do not; how did that happen, I wonder. :P
<didrocks> seb128: go for it if you want, I prefer to fix an intellihide for now
<seb128> kees, you use command line tools that don't handle recommends correctly?
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> kees, bug #759262 on the topic, at least update-manager should ensure those are installed
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 759262 in update-manager "Important Unity components not installed after update-manager -d upgrade" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/759262
<kees> seb128: nope, I instlal recommends. I think the problem is that if a package is already installed and its recommends change, apt doesn't do it. not sure.
<kees> but yup, installing that makes the top line of the dash work.
<kees> jcastro: and "dock" or "launcher" for the left edge dingus?
<seb128> kees, mvo claims it should but also says that if the recommends are not installable it just skip those and doesn't suggest them later on
<kees> seb128: ah, I bet that's what happened.
<kees> seb128: actually, I lied, it still doesn't work. do I have restart unity after installing that?
<seb128> kees, not sure I never tried to start without them
<seb128> but doesn't hurt to alt-f2 unity if you don't mess your applications to be shuffled around
<seb128> compiz is not great at keeping things where they are on restart
<jcastro> kees: it's "launcher"
<kees> jcastro: cool
<jcastro> kees: http://askubuntu.com/questions/10228/whats-the-right-terminology-for-unitys-ui-elements/19166#19166
<kees> jcastro: well hey, look at that. nice. :)
<didrocks> seb128: are you uploading compiz?
<seb128> didrocks, no, I've no clue what setting to change and how and where
<seb128> didrocks, we can do it in a sru later on
<didrocks> seb128: still won't upgrade people, so worthless
<seb128> didrocks, I don't feel like tweakings settings I don't understand just before the freeze but I might check with smspillaz tomorrow
<seb128> didrocks, it's the first impression you get on new installs
<didrocks> seb128: same for me, hence the fact I didn't change
<seb128> well I know on my nb it's very noticable
<didrocks> seb128: I don't get it, I can't tell
<seb128> oh, I do it
<seb128> I will show you at UDS ;-)
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> I don't have it either on my nvidia, nor intel card
<seb128> weird, but at least it's not everybody getting it
<didrocks> seb128: if we tweak the settings, the fade will disappear from all the change, hence the fact I don't want to change it in a rush (especially when we decided to push it back)
<nessita> seb128: thanks for the upload! you rock :-)
<seb128> nessita, yw ;-)
<mterry> tremolux, heyo!  Does software center have plans to keep track of installed applications?
<mterry> tremolux, (in the sense that it could install them again on a fresh install)
<tremolux> mterry: heyo back!
<tremolux> mterry: I think that is the purpose of OneConf, and we have very regretfully unable to give it the attention it deserves during Natty
<tremolux> mterry: or, one purpose of OneConf, with didrock's plugin functionality for s-c
<didrocks> right, I just have been able to update to the new s-c API
<didrocks> nothing moreâ¦
<mterry> tremolux, ah, interesting.  I remember discussions about oneconf, but didn't know that angle
<tremolux> mterry: I assume you are talking about a recent post about Deja Dup in the Oneiric discussions
<mterry> tremolux, yeah
<didrocks> mterry: it's in universe, you can install it (using desktopcouch, which should change for next cycle)
<pitti> good night everyone
<tremolux> 'night pitti!
<tremolux> mterry, didrocks: it has such nice potential, hopefully we can really do it up for Oneiric
<kenvandine> good night pitti
<didrocks> good night pitti
<didrocks> tremolux: yeah, I agree, just need some time allocated to it :)
<tremolux> didrocks: indeed!  :)
<tremolux> mterry: I wonder if you might make such a plugin for Deja Dup
<tremolux> mterry: I think that would TOTALLY ROCK (tm)
<mterry> tremolux, a plugin that interfaced with software-center?
<mterry> or oneconf?
<didrocks> mterry: oneconf is a plugin to s-c
<didrocks> mterry: so, ideally, we can use the same backend service
<didrocks> (it's dbus-activated)
<didrocks> and just write the DÃ©jÃ -Dup plugin
<tremolux> mterry, didrocks: bbl, my family is clamoring for me to go have lunch (kids are off school this week)  :)
<didrocks> tremolux: enjoy
<tremolux> thx!  :)
 * didrocks waves good evening
 * highvoltage waves back
<highvoltage> ah I see I kind of misunderstood that one
<seb128> pitti, bououh
<seb128> tedg, mterry: users comment on the emacs bug saying it still get the menus stripped when started from the dash
<mterry> seb128, indeed, or if you start it with the command "emacs23"
<mterry> because that gives it a different window class
 * mterry works on a patch
<mterry> tedg, https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/appmenu-gtk/emacs23/+merge/58556
<tedg> mterry, Are you going to distro patch that?
<mterry> tedg, yea
<mterry> tedg, I'm having problems uploading?  Something about "no public key" gpg error when I try to upload...  Can you distro patch it for me for today?
<mterry> tedg, oh, nm
<mterry> tedg, it apparently went through, but still gave me the error on the console
<tedg> mterry, Oh, good, because I can't :-)
 * mterry should still probably figure out what the problem was
<chrisccoulson> mterry, another case which will fail for emacs is if you set it as the alternative for /usr/bin/editor ;)
<mterry> chrisccoulson, guh!
<chrisccoulson> but, i don't think there's any way around that with the current blacklist implementation
<chrisccoulson> (you certainly don't want to blacklist editor, as that could be anything)
<mterry> chrisccoulson, good point...   I suppose maybe we should set the env var UBUNTU_MENUPROXY emacs-side
<chrisccoulson> yeah, possibly
<mterry> oneiric
<chrisccoulson> what's the actual issue with emacs?
<mterry> chrisccoulson, menus that get added dynamically (like, based on the type of file opened) by plugins don't show up
<mterry> chrisccoulson, (they don't show because the menu isn't filled out) and emacs only fills them out when it receives an actual X button press to the menu, so it's hard to fake it and trick it into filling it out early
<chrisccoulson> i'm sure the bookmarks menus in firefox work in the same way (they are only populated when you open the menu), but that's working :/
<mterry> chrisccoulson, depends on how it gets populated.  appmenu has some tricks for it (fakes a gtk activation signal), but emacs was looking for a very low-level X event that we don't want to be faking for all apps
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok. that's probably why it works in firefox :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~chrisccoulson/unity/lp767642/revision/1169 ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, \o/
<chrisccoulson> so, that one, plus the nautilus issue (which i will look at now), and the nm-applet errors are the bulk of what is in my xsession-errors
<chrisccoulson> (and xchat-gnome too, but i fixed that one already)
<chrisccoulson> i hope the icon theme gets fixed, because nm-applet probably is the worst offender for me :)
<Sarvatt> now thats odd..You received this email because you are an admin of the GNOME3 Team team via the Ubuntu Desktop team.
 * Sarvatt isn't in either
<chrisccoulson> Sarvatt - are you subscribed to the ubuntu-desktop list?
<Sarvatt> ah yeah, the mail went to my launchpad folder and threw me off
<Sarvatt> (not the ubuntu-desktop list one)
<cyphermox> chrisccoulson, I agree for the nm-applet errors, it's really annoying
<cyphermox> I trying to mess with the icons myself but it's taking me forever
<chrisccoulson> cyphermox, yeah, i'm not that familiar with theming. i'm not sure if you can just edit the width attribute in the svg ;)
<Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: were is that chat on bug 740815 from?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740815 in xulrunner-2.0 "[FFe] Updates to enable us to drop xulrunner from main" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740815
<chrisccoulson> Sweetshark, that's from #ubuntu-devel a little while ago
<chrisccoulson> cyphermox, oh, editing the width attrbiute doesn't work ;)
<chrisccoulson> that just chops off the edge of the icon :(
<cyphermox> yeah
<cyphermox> you need to adjust everything in like, inkscape
<cyphermox> I'll get started on this, maybe we can have it ready soon enough
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-04-21
<raining_> Hi, everyone
<raining_> I need some help for my skype
<raining_> I use ubuntu 10.10 x86_64
<raining_> and I installed ibus-qt4
<raining_> but I cannot use ibus for skype
<raining_> pls give the solution
<TheMuso> raining_: Please go to #ubuntu for support.
<raining_> ok thanks
<RAOF> So, I have this theory I want to test.  The only problem is that it requries a kernel recompilation.
<RAOF> We would be so much more productive with infinite computation resources :)
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> hey pitti, how are you? Still packing? :)
<pitti> didrocks: yeah, still quite a lot to do
<didrocks> pitti: good luck :)
<smspillaz> morning everyone
<pitti> didrocks: thanks
<pitti> hey smspillaz
<smspillaz> heya :)
<didrocks> hey smspillaz
<Sweetshark> Good Morning, Desktopers!
<pitti> hey Sweetshark
<mvo> didrocks: eh, I just had a notification appear on top of my screensaver â¦ is that a known issue?
<mvo> good morning btw :)
<mvo> (with compiz of course)
<didrocks> mvo: hey, not it's not known :/
<didrocks> smspillaz: maybe a regression from your restack branch? ^^
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark
<smspillaz> didrocks: likely not
<smspillaz> mvo: stacking issues are known, but they are difficult to debug
<mvo> I had that a while ago (weeks?) but then it went away
<smspillaz> didrocks: I doubt the restack branch would do it
<mvo> right, I'm worried about notification as they may lead to information discoulusre :/
<mvo> (from IM for example)
<didrocks> smspillaz: can you have a look with mvo? Still looking at incoming bugs
<smspillaz> mvo: if you could find a way to get compiz into the state there that happens then I can look into it for you
<smspillaz> mvo: I'm aware of the security risks here, but this is partly due to the fact that the screensaver model on linux is completely broken anyhow
<mvo> I can try to reproduce now, its on this machine soI will be on and off irc
<mvo> smspillaz: I remember we had similar issue back in the old days and solved it with some slegdehammer approach (but I may be wrong its a long time ago). something like "strcmp(w.name, "gnome-screensaver") ;)
<smspillaz> indeed
<smspillaz> we could have something like that
<mvo> (truely ugly though)
<smspillaz> right
<smspillaz> IMO, we should kill gnome-screensaer and move screensaver handling into the window manager
 * mvo scratches head - of course, now its no longer reproducable
<mvo> fine with me
<RAOF> smspillaz: Orâ¦ move both into the compositor, and have it be the display server? :P
<smspillaz> RAOF: sounds like an amazing idea!
<smspillaz> mvo: indeed, it's a very difficult thing to reproduce
<smspillaz> mvo: which sucks, because it makes my life that much harder :)
<smspillaz> RAOF: not having the screensaver and window manager be the same thing is insane
<smspillaz> RAOF: the way the gnome-screensaver ensures that it is on-top of everything is right now is to flood us with restack requests
<smspillaz> it's more cpu taxing for you screensaver to be on than off
<smspillaz> even if it is just "blank"
<vish> pitti, didrocks: is making changes like Bug 760656 appropriate for an SRU? â¦ seems like a very odd choice deciding to change the branding after release.. :s  why not just upload the change now?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 760656 in unity "Launcher: Background lighting and border is displayed for Workspaces, Apps, Files, Trash (should be turned off)" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/760656
<vish> btw, hi.. ;)
 * Sweetshark remembers something ...
<didrocks> vish: no, don't know why sladen is telling thatâ¦
<didrocks> vish: I already told him it was way too late and risky
<didrocks> vish: anyway, I didn't set it to the upstream 3.8.12 milestone which makes the authority or SRU on purpose
<vish> didrocks: hmm.. yea, either we do it now or we postpone for O..
<didrocks> vish: even now, we are in hard freeze today
 * vish nods
<didrocks> vish: and I had a quick look at this part of code one week ago, I already told sladen the amount of change was too high (in addition to another UI freeze breakageâ¦)
<didrocks> seems it doesn't worth it
<vish> hmm..
<fta2> seems under unity, the "API mismatch" after an nvidia driver update no longer triggers the please restart thingy like it used to
<didrocks> fta2: oh really? next time I saw that (one week ago?), it was working
<didrocks> previous*
<fta2> didrocks, my 2 desktops were both sluggish, the logs show tons of NVRM warnings
<Sweetshark> vish: I just updated your email in the copyright file ...
<didrocks> fta2: not sure it's under unity, let's try to touch the file
<fta2> didrocks, happened on my 2 main desktops running natty/unity
<didrocks> fta2: touching /var/run/reboot-required worked
<didrocks> fta2: so, shouldn't be unity related, maybe the package didn't touch it
<fta2> maybe that file hasn't been touched then, too late to check, i rebooted both
<didrocks> pitti: thanks for accepting unity (I guess it's you as it wasn't acked yesterday evening ;))
<vish> Sweetshark: awesome thanks :)
<pitti> didrocks: yes, did a queue run this morning
<pitti> "last call for train to natty; please get seated, doors closing"
<didrocks> pitti: not sure if you want to track this one: bug #767613
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 767613 in unity "unity does not start with nvidia173.14.30" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/767613
<pitti> didrocks: would be interesting to see if it also happens with nvidia-current
<didrocks> pitti: apart from that (this seems a nvidia regression), all unity land should be done by now
<didrocks> pitti: well, let me reboot :)
<didrocks> if you don't see me back, call the police!
<pitti> didrocks: oh, you get that, too?
<pitti> I just asked on the bug
<didrocks> pitti: I just updated my machine with nvidia 270
 * pitti throws a tracking transponder onto didrocks' back
<didrocks> fta2: confirmed, the package doesn't touch the file btw
<didrocks> pitti: heh ;)
<seb128> hey desktopers
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<pitti> seb128: formally rodrigo_ just got his third +1 on the desktop list; but do you want to follow up as well?
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
<seb128> pitti, I was going to yes
<pitti> seb128: I'm fine, thanks! hurt my toe in the soccer game yesterday, but that'll pass
<seb128> utch
<pitti> didrocks: he's alive!
<didrocks> pitti: \o/
<didrocks> pitti: I don't have the same card, but at least, not all nvidia revisions regressed ;)
<seb128> pitti, done
<seb128> doh
<pitti> seb128: yay
<seb128> oh, really done with an email subscribed to the list this time :p
<didrocks> seb128: oh got puzzled by sending from the wrong adress to ubuntu-desktop ML? :)
<seb128> I hacked my @ubuntu.com to @canonical.com yesterday to reply to an email
<didrocks> seb128: how hacked? :-)
<seb128> seems people tend to send me email on that one using seb128 rather than my name
<seb128> well edited the account and changed my email
<seb128> I should add some extra dumb accounts for the variants I don't use but people write to
<seb128> I tend to use seb128 at ubuntu and s.b at canonical
<seb128> but people write to seb128 at canonical for some reason
<seb128> well anyway boring email story :p
 * cdbs has a dream to work one day for canonical, though he already is contracted for unity :)
<pitti> vish: yes, such things really shouln't be changed post release
<aquarius> hm. I keep getting GPU crashes (I think that's what they are), and then when I reboot the machine to get my display back, I ge tthe "System program problems detected" dialog. When I say "yes, report the problem", I get *another* crash dialog saying "apport-gpu-error-intel.py closed unexpectedly". I think this means that the program trying to diagnose the crash is itself crashing?
<aquarius> So I have two questions: how do I diagnose and report the GPU crash, and am I correct in my assumptions? :)
<seb128> aquarius, hey, do you confuse us with #ubuntu-x? ;-)
<aquarius> seb128, well, I think this is more an apport problem; once I've got apport able to report the actual gpu bug, I will then go and whine at the X people about not making my GPU hang in the first place. But if I whine at them now they'll say "file a bug" and I'll say "I can't, apport won't let me" :)
<mvo> pitti: could you have a quick look at http://paste.ubuntu.com/596843/ and apply upstream if it makes sense? just look at software-center and gir and this is the first bit I stumbled on
<seb128> aquarius, no, it seems that the apport-gpu-error-intel.py code shipped with the xorg packages is buggy
<pitti> mvo: oh, absolutely
<aquarius> seb128, oh, they own the apport-gpu thing? right, cool, I'll go talk to them about it :)
<seb128> aquarius, yes
<mvo> thanks!
<seb128> mvo, you want to use gtk3
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> mvo: it's already fixed in GTK3
<pitti> right, if you start porting now, do use gir1.2-gtk-3.0
<pitti> it's a lot more stable, and in oneiric we'll use that anyway
<mvo> ok
<mvo> I don't really want to start now, just play with it to get a feeling for the task at hand
<pitti> mvo: anyway, http://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?h=gtk-2-24&id=baf8bf967dfcde1b101d513c5102872a9b0ac571
<mvo> cool, thanks
 * mvo switches to gtk3 
<pitti> mvo: it currently looks ugly due to missing theme, but for porting it's still better
<pitti> there's some things which are principally broken in gtk2 and can't be fixed easily
<pitti> such as menu popups
<mvo> ok
<mvo> it currently segfaults for me a lot, but I guess that is because of leaking import pygtk/import gtk somewhere
<pitti> mvo: you know about the porting guide, btw?
<pitti> right
<mvo> the gtk2 -> gtk3 one?
<pitti> that, too, but I meant the pygtk -> pygi one
<pitti> https://live.gnome.org/PyGObject/IntrospectionPorting
<pitti> I recycled my UDW talk to this
<seb128> didrocks, no luck for those nvidia crash since pitti turned apport off yesterday, we will need to get someone to manually turn it on again
<mvo> aha, nice
<didrocks> seb128: right, anyway, I have something online within the day to get it manually reported
<mvo> I was usuing the talk and the gir s far, nice to see it in one good page
<seb128> didrocks, ok
<pitti> mvo: so pygi-convert left some imports which are pulling in gtk?
<pitti> mvo: one thing that's currently missing from that is appindicator -> gi.r.AppIndicator; do you use that?
<didrocks> pitti: seb128: can you force bug #768178 to be retraced please? (it's the nvidia issue)
<seb128> didrocks, ok
<didrocks> thanks :)
<seb128> didrocks, do you know what architecture it is?
<didrocks> i686 ?, asking (he's on #ayatana)
<seb128> didrocks, if you have access to the bug it's in the tag
<seb128> need-<arch>-retrace
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, i386
<seb128> didrocks, retraced
<didrocks> seb128: thanks! rock :)
<seb128> yw
<seb128> didrocks, retracing worked, i.e the stacktrace has symbols etc
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, seeing, that, I'm attaching to the other bug
<mvo> pitti: yeah, it looks like it, I don't use appindicator. one I had to manually kill is gtkspell, there seems to be no gir yet
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<chrisccoulson> nice day outside :)
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm fine thanks, the bug rush is mostly behind now (let's cross fingers ;))
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<didrocks> and you?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, good thanks. just looking at a bug someone reported this morning against my firefox extension
<chrisccoulson> i think it's the first real bug!
<chrisccoulson> how dare they ;)
<chrisccoulson> bug 767966 (quite bad) :(
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 767966 in firefox "globalmenu extension pollutes main window javascript scope" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/767966
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: how come??? :-)
<chrisccoulson> i should definitely get that one fixed before people start complaining i break their other extensions ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: heh, of course, everyone will blame you (or rather unity :p)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: FYI, I tried again firefox4 and LPâ¦ still not a joy :/
<chrisccoulson> it's normally me who gets the blame isn't it?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, that sucks. however, they are planning to completely rewrite the drawing code in a future firefox version ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: well, as it's in "unity", it's "unity broke xxxx" (we get a non negligeable of such reports ;))
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hope it will be done, I would prefer using our defaults ;)
<micahg> chrisccoulson: are you still planning another upload to natty?  I was going to stage the security update later today (could hold off till tomorrow)
<chrisccoulson> micahg - there won't be another upload (too late)
<micahg> chrisccoulson: :(, SRU?
<chrisccoulson> and we'll need to fix bug 767966 in the next update
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 767966 in firefox "globalmenu extension pollutes main window javascript scope" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/767966
<micahg> chrisccoulson: k, well, if you get the SRU team ACK, feel free to commit
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, http://is.gd/YubTDn ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh nice, hopes the ball won't be dropped since :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i fixed the nautilus errors btw ;)
<chrisccoulson> https://code.launchpad.net/~chrisccoulson/ubuntuone-client/lp767825/+merge/58594
<chrisccoulson> simples :)
<seb128> bah, u1 again!
<chrisccoulson> yep
<seb128> get didrocks to get the unity fix in for the next upload, likely to be a SRU since I'm not sure we want uploads to clean log spamming today
<didrocks> seb128: this is a workaround, not a fix, Jason was relunctant to integrate it
<didrocks> I asked him to look at it
<chrisccoulson> why is it a workaround?
<seb128> ok
<chrisccoulson> the issue is that the menuitems don't exist if the menu was never opened
<didrocks> and asked him to answer, but seems the info was lost
<chrisccoulson> so i just add a check for that
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: look at the fixme you removed :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, but the fixme seemed to be describing the issue that my change fixes
<chrisccoulson> (ie, there are invalid pointers, because no menuitems exist)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: the ref should be destroyed before if they are invalid, I think that was Jason's point
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: discuss that with him once he's back online. Anyway, will be in a SRU
<Sweetshark> hmm: I get "start: Job failed to start" from the recent apport update ...
<ogra_> Sweetshark, its probably already in easter holiday mood :)
<mvo> seb128: are you happy with me doing #760707 as a SRU?
<seb128> mvo, yes, we will not get imports and translations before the langpack exports anyway
<seb128> brb
<seb128> re
<seb128> mvo, so patch piloting today? ;-)
<mvo> seb128: yeah
<mvo> seb128: I disagree about the importance too btw ;) for the i18n issue, but *shrug*
<seb128> mvo, yeah, my triaging scripts default to low and an overwrite those by hand usually when needed, I disagree with it as well so feel free to fix it ;-)
<mvo> awsome!
 * mvo sets it to whishlist
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you worked with Jason on the thunderbird fix not kept in the launcher, isn't it?
<mvo> just kidding, medium
<seb128> mvo, lol
<seb128> didrocks, you want to ruin his day saying the fix doesn't work? :-)
<seb128> mvo, thanks
<didrocks> seb128: that's my greatest sadic pleasure, you know that!</kidding> :-)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you should follow up on bug #765736
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 765736 in unity "Thunderbird won't stay in launcher and no quicklist" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/765736
<seb128> bug #768243 as well btw
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 768243 in unity "tvtime and some other applications can't be added in unity launcher" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/768243
<seb128> didrocks, you marked miro as a duplicate you are sure it's the same issue?
<didrocks> seb128: not sure, I was infering as it wasn't working before the fix, and I installed it to test the fix
<didrocks> (and it works)
<didrocks> btw, time to uninstall it, I don't use that :)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I got quite some craps installed for testing purpose
<didrocks> seb128: such a sacrifice! :-)
<didrocks> anyway, need to reinstall my box once the first testing iso are published
<didrocks> cleanswap will be needed here
<seb128> sometimes I wonder if installing the new version would be easier than upgrading
<seb128> less to download if you have the iso ;-)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, hmmm, will have another look in a bit. it certainly worked for me after applying the fix (and i tried with italian too)
<mterry> seb128, so in this last-minute rundown to 11.04, what's the best use of my time?  Continue working on bugs for maybe SRUs, do ISO testing, upgrading testing?
<seb128> hey mterry
<mterry> seb128, hi@
<seb128> mterry, I think we are good for natty
<mterry> ! even
<ubot2> Factoid 'even' not found
<mterry> seb128, so confident!  ;)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> I didn't say we are gold ;-)
<seb128> but remaining issues can be sorted in sru
<mterry> seb128, OK so blueprint prep and such?
<seb128> I've no specific issue on my list but I might bounce a few bug worth fixing in srus on your list if I cross some
<mterry> seb128, k
<seb128> so meanwhile you can do upgrade and iso testing, bug triage, blueprints start on merges for next cycle
<seb128> whatever you prefer ;-)
<seb128> I think current iso have ubiquity issues
<pitti> chrisccoulson: lol @ https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=647959
<seb128> so maybe wait the next round for that
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 647959 in CA Certificates "Add Honest Achmed's root certificate" [Normal,Resolved: invalid]
<didrocks> hey mterry
<didrocks> zomg, pitti told "lol". /me shocked
<mterry> didrocks, hello!
<pitti> hey mterry
<pitti> didrocks: this bug really deserves it, have a look :)
<seb128> kenvandine, mterry: why you guys write softwares that have several desktop entries?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - lol, where did you find that?
<chrisccoulson> :-D
<seb128> like deja-dup has 2 icons in a dash search
<seb128> gwibber has 3
<kenvandine> :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: it made it all the way up to heise.de
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<kenvandine> seb128, with the dash that does make it more cluttered...
<didrocks> pitti: excellent, I really like "Honest Achmed is at least more honest than Comodo."
<kenvandine> we wanted them to be pretty separated, considering we want you to be able to configure the service with the client running
<seb128> pitti, do you think trivial bug fixes to not spam .xsession-errors with warning are worth an upload or are SRU material rather?
<pitti> seb128: bring 'em on
<mterry> seb128, well...  deja-dup-preferences was written as a separate app from the main deja-dup executable.  And so it needs its own .desktop file to be recognized by unity at all
<pitti> seb128: well, for today it's fine anyway; probably not over Easter holidays any more
<seb128> mterry, is there any usecase to call it out of the deja-dup ui?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, dobey: can we get the nautilus gconf spamming fix uploaded?
<mterry> seb128, it would be nice if unity let you say, "these two .desktop files are part of the same app" and join them
<kenvandine> mterry, but not if you want them launchable independent of each other
<Sweetshark> pitti: ooold, that was on heise yesterday already
<pitti> Sweetshark: I know, but still funny ;)
<seb128> mterry, well either they are useful and should each be listed or not, I would tend to think that the preference dialog being a different binary is not something the user need to care about
<mterry> kenvandine, well, even if they were launchable separate, it would be nice if you could tell unity to display them under the same "app"
<kenvandine> if we get multiple actions in unity
<mterry> seb128, I agree!  But unity doesn't let you hide such technical details.  It will show different execs as different entries
<seb128> mterry, NoDisplay=true?
<mterry> seb128, I don't think that works once it's running...  You are talking about from the Applications Lens?  I thought you were talking Launcher
<Sweetshark> pitti: I esp. like the "once we are too big to fail, we wont have to justify ourselves anyway" part
<seb128> mterry, what is the point in having a .desktop for it anyway? rather than just calling the command from the deja-dup ui?
<pitti> Sweetshark: it's not funny because it's so true :-(
<Sweetshark> yep
<mterry> seb128, that was a baby step towards the more dramatic UI overhaul in Oneiric.  The idea is that backup features could be seen as just a feature of the OS, and so should have an entry in your system settings.
<mterry> seb128, in Oneiric it only lives in system settings
<dobey> seb128: what nautilus gconf spamming fix?
<seb128> mterry, ok
<seb128> dobey, bug #767825
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 767825 in ubuntuone-client "nautilus plugin spamming ~/.xsession-errors" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/767825
<mterry> seb128, the application lens hides that a bit because it doesn't represent categories very well.  so you just see two entries
<seb128> dobey, see chrisccoulson's merge request
<seb128> mterry, right, makes sense, you can see natty is close I'm spending time playing with things ;-)
<mterry> heh
<dobey> seb128, chrisccoulson: is that an issue on maverick as well?
<seb128> dobey, dunno but it's one of the spammers in natty
<seb128> so it would be nice to get it in
<seb128> dobey, I would say that if nobody complained in 10.10 yet we can do without fixing it there
<seb128> but I don't think it was doing that previous cycle, I think I would have noticed
<dobey> that's odd, because that code has changed very little.
<dobey> chrisccoulson: anyway, can you also make a branch against lp:ubuntuone-client/stable-1-6 with that change, and propose merging it into stable-1-6 as well; since that's the stable branch we're using for 11.04
<chrisccoulson> dobey, sure, can do
<dobey> cheers
<dobey> ah crap
<dobey> chrisccoulson: btw, do i need to do the upload to ubuntu for that patch, or do you have privs to do it?
<chrisccoulson> dobey, i'm not sure i can upload it
<chrisccoulson> 1 second, i'll just check
<dobey> ok
<chrisccoulson> no, it doesn't look like i can upload that
<dobey> ok
<chrisccoulson> dobey, https://code.launchpad.net/~chrisccoulson/ubuntuone-client/lp767825-stable-1-6/+merge/58684
<seb128> DBO, chrisccoulson: did you guys look at bug #757011?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 757011 in unity "Keep in launcher option for Emacs does not save over restarts" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/757011
<dobey> chrisccoulson: thanks
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - when i tried it the other night, the launcher matching was working ok (I didn't see any issue with emacs)
<chrisccoulson> i'll have a look again in a bit
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how, weird, it doesn't work here if I run emacs for the run a command or command line, it only works if I run it from the application place, which use gio on the .desktop which work...until you try to start it again by clicking the launcher icon
<seb128> chrisccoulson, emacs23 there btw
<dobey> seb128: ubuntuone-client is in the upload queue with chrisccoulson's fix
<seb128> dobey, thanks!
<seb128> pitti, ^
<pitti> cheers
<pitti> seb128: did cyphermox mess with your nm-applet, too? :-)
<seb128> pitti, no, but docking and undocking my laptop switches between wifi and eth, the dhcp gives me a new ip and irc reconnect...
<seb128> (I've been testing an unity bug)
<cyphermox> seb128, I so need to figure out if this can be fixed somehow
<seb128> should be stable now ;-)
<cyphermox> like, keepalive and stuff in some way to have irc stay online as much as possible, if your IP doesn't change too much
<hosk> i don't get the unity panel, unity --reset produces http://pastebin.com/bH5SR8Ur , im in virtualbox, i have 3d accel enabled and the latest vb-guest additions, any thoughts or tips on how to search for a bug report that might already be filed?
<hosk> preliminary research says it's unsupported GL, i'll see if i can install other drivers
<fagan> em does apt.ubuntu.com know about natty yet?
<fagan> its saying im not running ubuntu
<fagan> :/
<fagan> (and it links from developer.ubuntu.com so it would be nice if our own links worked in our own distro)
<hosk> guess i am already running all add'l drivers i can, i feel like i've seen others running unity panel in it
<hosk> maybe i need specifically the OSE version of guest additions
<chrisccoulson> oh, uploads are still being accepted for natty?
<davmor2> pitti: Yay my sansa fuse is showing up as a music player again thanks dude :)
<chrisccoulson> fagan, which browser are you using?
<pitti> davmor2: yippie
<fagan> chrisccoulson: chrome
<fagan> ahhhhh
<fagan> thats why
<chrisccoulson> yep
<fagan> chrisccoulson: ooooh it doesnt work in firefox either on my machine
<fagan> weird
<chrisccoulson> fagan - that's bug 709125. it needs a server-side fix though
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 709125 in apturlredirector "User agent doesn't include Ubuntu in it so apt.ubuntu.com doesn't work" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/709125
<fagan> chrisccoulson: ah ok
<chrisccoulson> firefox sends out a X-Ubuntu header when accessing apt.ubuntu.com now
<fagan> chrisccoulson: thats cool I was just wondering
<chrisccoulson> i've still got no idea who really maintains apt.ubuntu.com. we should get them to fix it :)
<fagan> I get why we moved from apturl but its good anyway
<fagan> chrisccoulson: id say ask on rt
<davmor2> the snap to grid doesn't work with Control Centre.  It you snapping it to the left you lose the one side and to the right it snaps back to the middle of to screen.
<fagan> chrisccoulson: if we are going to link it on our developer website we kinda have to be able to use it :)
<fagan> apturl at least worked for the ubuntu people everyone else got something weird but it worked
<hosk> Window manager warning: Received a _NET_WM_MOVERESIZE message for 0x4401449 (hosk@hosk-); these messages lack timestamps and therefore suck.
<hosk> i was generally just entertained by this message
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i guess i'm going to have to downgrade to firefox 4 for a bit :(
<hosk> i can't unity --replace because gnome-panel is all up in my junk
<didrocks> pitti: around? got a jockey question :)
<pitti> didrocks: spotty
<didrocks> pitti: well, we were discussing about blacklisting the nvidia driver 173 as we get one crash since the update and not sure if other cards work with it
<didrocks> pitti: but we will rather add this support to the test tool it seems
<chrisccoulson> BINGO!
<chrisccoulson> i think i've just cracked an annoying firefox bug
<chrisccoulson> damn you firefox sync
<didrocks> pitti: do you know who will be there tomorrow to eventually acked the new nux upload?
<pitti> didrocks: I think it depends on whether the driver is generally broken (then we'll disable it in jockey) or just in rare cases for unity (then we can check in the test tool)
<pitti> didrocks: the american folks at least, i. e. skaet
<didrocks> pitti: the thing is that we don't really know, and nobody tested it
<didrocks> pitti: so blacklisting until the SRU seems the safest
<pitti> didrocks: ok
<didrocks> skaet: ready to ack an nux upload for blacklisting this case tomorrow?
<pitti> didrocks: did you talk to tseliot about it already?
<didrocks> pitti: this morning, right, but didn't think to ask if he tested it with unity (compiz alone works)
<pitti> oh, interesting
<pitti> didrocks: then we probably should also keep it for Kubuntu and classic users?
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, the unity test tool to only blacklist it in the unity case sounds good
<didrocks> pitti: FYI, we are headed to a 0-day SRU to either blacklist the driver or fix the issue (and profit)
<didrocks> as people need an internet connection to install the driver, there is a high chance they install the update as well
<pitti> didrocks: yes, they'll install from natty-updates right away, unless they are using a DVD source
<didrocks> pitti: so, seems quite safe to head for a 0-day SRU
<pitti> didrocks: yes, I agree
<didrocks> pitti: ok, let's go to that road then! Thanks for the feedback :)
<skaet> pitti, didrocks,  just back from lunch and read through the backscroll,  yup, on standby for that blacklist update (and SRU path).
<didrocks> nice :)
<flacoste> hey folks, just a big thank you for your work on Natty, i've really enjoyed my 2.5 weeks with it so far
<flacoste> works like a charm
<pitti> kenvandine: why does it read the entire whitelist and then return true? it would be easier to return true right away?
<kenvandine> i was keeping the diff small :)
<kenvandine> i could change that though
<pitti> kenvandine: it's an one-line change either way?
<pitti> not a biggie, though
<pitti> anyway, gotta run, have a nice Easter holidays everyone!
<kenvandine> i guess it would still be one line
<mvo> bye pitti
<sabdfl> you guys have done a brilliant job with some really tough stretch goals this cycle
<kenvandine> sabdfl, thx :)
<sabdfl> thank you!
<kenvandine> it's been fun though!
<sabdfl> heh
<kenvandine> sort of... hehe
<sabdfl> hopefully, calmer fun in oneiric
<kenvandine> indeed
<sabdfl> now we have the foundations in place we are going to rock the planet
<kenvandine> looking forward to that!
<sabdfl> i'd like to see ubuntu go viral in 11.10 and 12.04, where people just start "doing it" on all their spare and primary computers
<sabdfl> i think we can pull that off
<kenvandine> that would be sweet
<kenvandine> charging forward in fixing bug #1
<ubot2> kenvandine: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1 (Not reporting large bug)
<kenvandine> ha, funny... ubot2 refuses to talk about bug #1
<ubot2> kenvandine: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1 (Not reporting large bug)
<sabdfl> ubot2, you're a wimp
<ubot2> Factoid "you're a wimp" not found
<sabdfl> exactly
<kenvandine> :-D
<JFo> sabdfl, I may have an O song mashup for your enjoyment in Budapest :-)
<JFo> working on finishing it now
<chrisccoulson> pitti - there?
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, nope, he is gone
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, yeah, i thought so. i thought i would just try my luck anyway ;)
 * bjf -> lunch
<dobey> JFo: i'm sure i will be astonished by said mashup :)
<kenvandine> JFo, looking forward to hearing it!
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-04-22
<micahg> ricotz: hi, PM?
<ricotz> micahg, hi, sure
<didrocks> good morning
<cdbs> didrocks: good morning
<didrocks> hey cdbs :)
<cdbs> didrocks: unity-preferences seems to be crashing somewhat often
<cdbs> (didn't crash in my case, but it seems so, from the crash bugs outta there)
<cdbs> didrocks: I guess I understood how its crashing, /me works on a fix
<didrocks> cdbs: yeah, I saw that, seems to be a gsettings issue :/
<didrocks> cdbs: oh really? nice
<cdbs> didrocks: yes, maybe gsettings isn't returning a value which we are expecting
<cdbs> didrocks: but that's just a guess
<didrocks> cdbs: I can have a look, please focus on bug triage right now ;)
<cdbs> didrocks: both :) It takes a long time to bzr branch
<cdbs> okay I'll triage it for now
<didrocks> gsettings is crashing if the schema isn't installed, I'm wondering if that's not the case there
<cdbs> lp timeouts :(
<didrocks> cdbs: also, the crash has been reported just once until now
<didrocks> cdbs: this crash is a gsettings one FYI, we will poke desrt at UDS
<chrisccoulson> it's quiet in here today ;)
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks!
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson!
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm fine, thanks. Taking advantage of the quietness to see what unity bugs should be fixed as a 0day SRU or not
<didrocks> and you?
<chrisccoulson> i'm pretty tired today. i've been up for most of the night with my sick and very grumpy daughter :(
<chrisccoulson> i didn't realise kids got ill so often ;)
<huats> morning
<cdbs> didrocks: back, as for the 'we will poke desrt at UDS' part, 'we' isn't true, I won't be there :(
<didrocks> cdbs: s/we/I then :-)
<cdbs> .w 25
<cdbs> oops
<om26er> Is seb128 on vacation(s) ?
<didrocks> om26er: yeah, he pretends he's french but he takes german vacation! :-)
<om26er> there is a bug in papyon that we might need to get in before release, bug 768974
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 768974 in papyon "papyon doesn't answer server's pings" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/768974
<om26er> didrocks, I could work on the backport in the weekend if its not too late in the cycle
<om26er> or will this be SRU?
<didrocks> om26er: it's too late for the release
<om26er> 0day SRU then, didrocks ?
<didrocks> om26er: yeah, 0day SRU or short SRU :-)
<om26er> didrocks, alright, thx :)
<didrocks> yw ;)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, good morning, what's the work on the street?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine ^ ?
 * rickspencer3 thinks about who is still around today
<didrocks> rickspencer3: hey, word is nice! nothing scary for now :-)
<kenvandine> hey rickspencer3
<kenvandine> good morning
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, everything is rocking!
<rickspencer3> nice
<didrocks> rickspencer3: dbarth and I retargeted most of bugs today to get a realistic list for a 0 day SRU and a futur one :-)
<rickspencer3> thanks didrocks
<rickspencer3> didrocks, did the blacklist for the scrollbars make it into Ubuntu yesterday?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: yeah, it did (kenvandine uploaded it)
<kenvandine> rickspencer3 there was an updated blacklist
<kenvandine> but it didn't include ubiquity
<didrocks> kenvandine: oh?
<rickspencer3> didrocks, kenvandine said that the scrollbars were still in ubiquity, I thought ubiquity was going to get black listed
<kenvandine> no, i never heard ubiquity was supposed to be blacklisted
<kenvandine> there was a fix from ev related to scrollbars
<kenvandine> in ubiquity
<kenvandine>   * Don't ever show scrollbars in the slideshow.  The window growing
<kenvandine>     slightly is not ideal, but still better than this. See LP 529201
<kenvandine>     for details.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 529201 in ubiquity "ubiquity shows scrollbar in installation slideshow" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/529201
<kenvandine> from the changelog
<kenvandine> uploaded yesterday
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, so there are no scrollbars in Ubiquity, then?
<kenvandine> there are
<kenvandine> just in different places :)
<kenvandine> but they worked fine for me
<kenvandine> keyboard selector
<kenvandine> i think that is the only one actually
<didrocks> kenvandine: there were possible the login selection as well, but I didn't see that from last install
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> i'll take another pass to double check
<rickspencer3> thanks guys
<rickspencer3> didrocks, kenvandine we have RC ISOs, to test, so far as I can tell
<rickspencer3> so we'll have a couple of days to watch for any non-SRUable problems
<rickspencer3> am I understanding that correctly?
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, you are correct
<didrocks> seems correct to me :-)
<mterry> The nightly images seem solid
<kenvandine> mterry, see any scrollbar issues in the installer?
<mterry> kenvandine, no I didn't
 * mterry notices that his xchat notifications aren't coming through
<rickspencer3> mterry, good news about the images!
<rickspencer3> those could be what we release, although I hear through the grapevine that docs and language packs may be updated
<rickspencer3> I don't know if that's real though
<dobey> yay, then we can all upgrade to 11.10 and suffer another 6 months of daily updates :)
<didrocks> dobey: s/suffer/enjoy :-)
<kenvandine> yeah, what didrocks said!
<kenvandine> that's the spirit :)
<didrocks> let's cross fingers that's the final image though :-)
<mterry> dobey, I *love* daily updates.  They are crack to me
<didrocks> mterry: that's why you are doing daily backup ;-)
<kenvandine> gotta feed that addiction!
<mterry> didrocks, heh
<kenvandine> haha
 * kenvandine is ready to push the first pass at image uploading to gwibber trunk 
<kenvandine> let there be crack!
<dobey> mterry: do you have a Cirrus Logic video card or somethng? :)
<dobey> or Trident maybe?
<mterry> dobey, I don't get that.  :)
<kenvandine> mterry, you have to learn to "speak dobey"
<dobey> mterry: too old school for you?
<kenvandine> :)
<dobey> since nvidia/ati/intel seem to break every time the kernel or Xorg change, it seems :)
<mterry> dobey, I live in the now, the freshest bits possible.  I don't get references older than a week
<rickspencer3> seriously, could you imagine if you desktop only update once every six months?
<rickspencer3> what would that even be like
<rickspencer3> ?
<mterry> Ah, well, I just learn to love X breaks.  They are an opportunity to yell at bryceh
<dobey> haha
<kenvandine> ah, the monday morning Xorg breakage... love it
<kenvandine> only happened to me once all cycle though... because i have intel goodness :)
<mterry> rickspencer3, jarring probably.  :)  It must be fun to update from one LTS to another.  All sorts of goodies
<rickspencer3> oh my
 * rickspencer3 boggles
<kenvandine> mterry, that would be like christmas
<rickspencer3> imagine going 10.04 -> 12.04 on the desktop
<kenvandine> imagine the upgrade from lucid?
<kenvandine> yeah :)
<mterry> "A backup program that makes coffee for me too?  Love it!"
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, btw, your "gimme all the images from my feeds" code you have me is working great
<kenvandine> great
<rickspencer3> I'd love it if I could go images = gwibber.get_images() ;)
<kenvandine> i have a branch that posts uploads to imageshack :)
<kenvandine> going to add other places too
<kenvandine> and let you configure which one to use
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, nice
<kenvandine> and it lets you drop an image on the gwibber launcher and it uploads and creates a tweet
<kenvandine> :)
<rickspencer3> I'd love to replace my imgur code with U1, actually
<kenvandine> U1 will be one of the choices, i think
<rickspencer3> I upload to imgure because it gives me back a url that I can tweet right away
<kenvandine> i just need to sort out knowing you are capable of using it and all
<rickspencer3> I'd love to do that iwth U1 isntead
<kenvandine> which i am sure isn't hard
<kenvandine> right
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, sounds like gwibber will handle the posting for me?
<kenvandine> maybe
<rickspencer3> there will be an api for tweeting images?
<mterry> kenvandine, knowing you can use U1?  I have some code in Deja Dup that might help, maybe.  Though it's in vala
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, yes
<kenvandine> mterry, good reference though :)
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, there will be an optional arg to Send
<kenvandine> for attachment
<kenvandine> if you include an attachment we'll handle uploading to the configured service and inserting the url in the post
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, can I just include image= in whatever call I make to do a tweet?
<kenvandine> perhaps
 * rickspencer3 likes *easy* APIs
<kenvandine> we'll discuss the API at UDS
<rickspencer3> sounds good
<kenvandine> i want it to be dirt easy :)
<kenvandine> and i don't want you to have to tell the API it is an image or video...
<rickspencer3> I prefer APIs where I don't have to assemble a collection of objects together to do something simple
<kenvandine> i want gwibber to figure out the type of media and do the right thing
<rickspencer3> *cough* TreeView *cough*
<kenvandine> i just want you to pass a uri to the media you want to include
<dobey> kenvandine: should be pretty easy to do a u1 image poster plug-in for gwibber, in 11.10
<rickspencer3> dobey, that would be sweet!
<kenvandine> dobey, i would thinks so.. aq and i spent some time a while back drafting an API for that
<dobey> actually, it's pretty easy to do in 11.04 even, if you don't mind having the files locally and on the server
<kenvandine> dobey, the important thing is getting the url to the image fast
<kenvandine> even if it isn't done syncing :)
<mterry> kenvandine, run /usr/lib/ubuntuone-client/ubuntuone-login then search in d-feet for com.ubuntuone.Credentials.  That's the API to tell if Ubuntu One is running and if they are logged in
<kenvandine> cool
 * kenvandine thinks it is pretty slick to drag an image from the files/folders lens and drop it on the gwibber launcher to post :)
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, no, you need the syncing done
<dobey> kenvandine: yeah. but with a client lib to use the REST API instead, you can just throw it on the server, get the URI, and bypass the syncdaemon bits, and not have to have the folder synchronized to the local machine
<rickspencer3> you don't want to tweet a link that is busted
<rickspencer3> dobey, is there sample code for that?
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, in theory it would only be busted for a matter of seconds
<dobey> rickspencer3: not yet, since it doesn't so much exist yet :)
<rickspencer3> dobey, can you hack photobomb to replace imgur with U1?
<kenvandine> we don't want to block the UI waiting for a file to sync
<rickspencer3> oh
<rickspencer3> n,
<rickspencer3> nm
<rickspencer3> I thought you said it would be easy to do in 11.04
<kenvandine> not that hard...
<kenvandine> but easier in 11.10
<kenvandine> in 11.04 you copy a file to a share and call the API to get a link for it
<dobey> yeah, in 11.04 you have to use syncdaemon and have a synchronized folder
<rickspencer3> oh
<kenvandine> i have code to do that already
<rickspencer3> so, that sounds a bit hard to program
<kenvandine> somewhere
<kenvandine> which is why it isn't merged anywhere :)
<kenvandine> not good enough
<rickspencer3> like, how would you know what folders the user is syncing, etc...
<dobey> rickspencer3: well you'd make a folder.
<dobey> rickspencer3: like we do for music store.
<kenvandine> that is what i did
<rickspencer3> like I say "sounds hard to program"
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, exactly :)
<rickspencer3> that should all be hidden in an API
<kenvandine> so if U1 is up to the job in time to get it in gwibber, i'll make it happen :)
<dobey> that's what gwibber is for
<kenvandine> dobey, i want an easy API too :)
<kenvandine> don't make me do all the work for you :)
<rickspencer3> gwibber is only use case for that
<rickspencer3> a nice feature in LO would be to "send with link" for example
<dobey> i mean, os.makedirs() is not that hard to call in python
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, i'll look at your imgur code as an example and add that as a second image uploader :)
<kenvandine> dobey, but it means you have to understand how U1 works to use the API
<kenvandine> we don't want developers to have to know that
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, don't worry, the API should be nice in 11.10
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, humm, the imgur API limits might hurt for gwibber :/
<kenvandine> 50 uploads per hour for anonymous
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, then get an api key ;)
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, that is with an api key :)
<rickspencer3> oh
<rickspencer3> oops
<kenvandine> but 50 per hour for the key
<kenvandine> so they count it like facebook does
<rickspencer3> except they tell you what the limits are ;)
<kenvandine> but... if we auth users with their own accounts the limits are per user
<kenvandine> indeed!
<kenvandine> i am sure imageshack has limits too
<kenvandine> humm
<didrocks> kenvandine: can you try to enable/disable a plugin in ccsm?
<didrocks> kenvandine: and tell me if unity still crashes?
<kenvandine> didrocks, sure... i love crashing unity :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: heh, not as much as gwibber :p
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> ok, i enabled and disable the water effect
<kenvandine> not crash
<didrocks> \o/
<kenvandine> oh... scratch that
<didrocks> oh?
<didrocks> :/
<kenvandine> unity didn't crash
<kenvandine> but my panel is now just artifacts
<kenvandine> black with blue dots
<didrocks> yeah, got that with one plugin as well
<kenvandine> the launcher seems fine
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> unity never crashed, launcher works and stuff
<didrocks> kenvandine: thanks for confirming, at least, the crash is gone :)
<kenvandine> np
<kenvandine> weird though... why only the panel?
<didrocks> kenvandine: the launcher is repainted completely
<kenvandine> ah
<didrocks> seems not the panel
 * kenvandine kills it
<kenvandine> doesn't fix it... weird
<kenvandine> brb
<didrocks> oh?
<didrocks> it fixed it for me
<kenvandine> not here
<kenvandine> panel restarts but still looks the same
<kenvandine> i know it restarts too, i can see everything shift up and then back down
<didrocks> hum, interesting
<didrocks> seems like an old panel would still be around
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, do you know anything about language packs?
<kenvandine> anyone around that knows about language packs?
<dobey> kenvandine: i think everyone is looking for eggs for some reason
<dobey> never was sure what eggs had to do with zombies though.
<mterry> kenvandine, I know a very little, but I am around.
<kenvandine> skaet, maybe mterry can be more informative?
<mterry> kenvandine, ?
<mterry> oh
<mterry> ahem, just got disconnected
<skaet> mterry,  trying to track down what happened to the language pack updates that pitti was looking at yesterday.   Do you know the names of some of them?
<mterry> skaet, nope, sorry.  :-/
<mterry> I'm not aware of any last minute changes he was planning
<skaet> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/04/21/%23ubuntu-release.txt around 8:00 for the conversation.
<skaet> mterry ^
<mterry> skaet, well, yah, looks like nothing got through.  might be uploaded and not approved...  You want to know the names?  like language-pack-de for example?
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, what do you need to know?
<skaet> mterry,  yeah,  I just want a definite name to see if I can hunt it down in the system.
<mterry> skaet, well, that is an example source package name.  language-pack-de, language-pack-es, etc are what I expect him to upload
<skaet> mterry,  thanks - will look explicitly for -de, -es and see if I can find signs anywhere.
<Tareq> hello there, can anyone tell me, if i can install gnome3 on my lucid?
 * skaet not finding signs,   will dig into it later tonight.
<charlie-tca> Tareq: you can install from a ppa, after installing, it can not be removed and the system restored without a reinstall
<Tareq> oops, then I shouldn't install I guess :(
<mterry> Tareq, also, the PPA isn't for Lucid, but Maverick
<mterry> Or rather, Natty
<Tareq> yeah, I guessed it, that's why asking here without adding the repo :)
<charlie-tca> ooops, missed that part, too.
<Tareq> so I shouldn't install it on lucid, I don't want mess up with my development environment :(
<charlie-tca> yup
<Tareq> thanks charlie-tca and mterry :)
<charlie-tca> You are welcome
<Budd> Somehow, my ssh-agent carries a bunch of keys that I didn't explicitly add. Once I add three of my own, ssh logins fail due to too many key failures.
<Budd> Also ssh-add -D only erases the keys I added; the others remain. What gives?
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-04-23
<GalAnonim> hello folks
<highvoltage> hey GalAnonim
<mainerror> o/
<mw007> hello all, i'm trying to install gnome3 on 11.04. Are there install instructions anywhere? I can't find the ppa for it..
<mainerror> mw007, there you go http://askubuntu.com/questions/22946/how-do-i-install-the-latest-version-of-gnome-3
<mw007> mainerror: thank you very much :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-04-24
<mw007> mainerror: worked like a charm, but the theme seems a bit messed up (looks like an old gnome theme). Is there anyway to get the nice-looking default theme that was on the gnome3 test disk?
<mainerror> mw007, I'm sorry I can't help with Gnome 3 issues. You might find an answer on Ask Ubuntu.
<mw007> mainerror: awesome, thanks :)
<mainerror> I'm a happy Unity user ;)
<mw007> mainerror: I haven't tried that yet. And I didn't see it in the desktop list when I logged in. I'll try it out :)
<mw007> mainerror: I can just run sudo apt-get install unity?
<mainerror> hold on a second, what Ubuntu version were you using? 11.04?
<mw007> yep :)
<mainerror> then it is installed by default, if you system provides 3D acceleration then Unity is default, if not then the classic Gnome 2.x look will load
<mw007> odd, a search for it is saying it's not installed. I wonder if I did something wrong during the dist-upgrade today. Sorry, I'm a converted arch user, and haven't quite gotten the concept of big releases lol
<mainerror> don't worry we were all new at some point ;)
<mainerror> a dist-upgrade you say, I have to admit that I have no experience with that since I always go with a fresh install
<mw007> yea, i used the gui to upgrade. Everything went smoothly, or so I thought. I'm going back through and seeing what I can find. Unity is definitely not installed unfortunately
<mw007> Thanks for the help! I'll see if I can find something in the forums :)
<mainerror> mw007, make sure search for an answer on Ask Ubuntu as well, chances are good to find an answer, if not then you can just ask ;)
<mainerror> time to get some sleep, night all
<mw007> nite man, thanks again!
<mainerror> you're welcome
<imachine_> hello
<imachine_> anyone using the gnome3 shell yet?
<imcx2> is everyone asleep? ;)
<hyperair> what's the correct package to be filing bugs regarding the overlay scroll bar?
<hyperair> nevermind, i think i see it
<imachine_> happy easter everyone
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-04-16
<RAOF> Morning all
<Sarvatt> RAOF: morning!
<Sarvatt> RAOF: btw, did you see s2tc was in precise? yay for libtxn-dxtc0 being installable :)
<RAOF> No, I missed that.
<Sarvatt> not sure if s2tc works with civ5 though
<RAOF> I guess I can test that :)
<pitti> Good morning
<jbicha> pitti: I don't think libpng-dev is in unstable yet
<pitti> jbicha: but libpng12-dev Provides: it
<pitti> jbicha: Ubuntu buildds can resolve this, but indeed I'm not fully sure about Debian's
<pitti> I better change it to libpng-dev | libpng12-dev
<jbicha> pitti: oh, I didn't realize that, I think I've reverted the libpng-dev change in Ubuntu a couple times
<pitti> no need for that
<pitti> jbicha: I changed it in svn, thanks
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti, how are you?
 * pitti fights with gtk+3.0 stopping to build because configure.ac cannot find cairo-pdf.h any more; WTH
<pitti> didrocks: quite fine, thanks! I had a nice weekend, how about you?
<didrocks> pitti: the week-end was nice again, although rainy, so didn't really achieve a lot.
<didrocks> pitti: ok, two things:
<didrocks> - c-p-m broke the ABI (so some plugins in c-p-e doesn't work)
<didrocks> -> I'll rebuild c-p-e
<pitti> ack
<didrocks> - the branch with the design change has a fix
<didrocks> I'm building it right now and keep you up to date, Tim tripled check it as well as there are tests
<didrocks> pitti: you did see that one, isn't it? (sent a notice on Friday evening) ^
<pitti> bug 959339 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 959339 in unity "Launcher, Alt-Tab - clicking on launcher item or selecting a app in Alt-Tab raises all app windows, not just most recently focused" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/959339
<didrocks> right
<pitti> didrocks: did that change recently?
<didrocks> pitti: that changed on purpose on the beginning of the cycle
<didrocks> pitti: and alt-tab always had this behavior
<didrocks> 8 months ago, I tried to convince design that the alt-tab behavior (raising all windows) isn't logical
<pitti> so how can it be a surprising critical regression  now?
<pitti> I agree that it should only focus per-window, not per-app
<didrocks> it's not a "regression" as I told them
<didrocks> as it was on purpose and a "design decision"
<didrocks> that's what they told me 8 months ago :)
<didrocks> and suddenly "omg, we can't release without that"
<didrocks> so, I'm just pushing because I'm convinced the current behavior is wrong as well
<didrocks> as I was 8 months ago :)
<pitti> anyway, the bug description seems fine to fix
<pitti> I guess I don't want to know how many thousand LOC that changes? :-)
<didrocks> pitti: it's quite descent https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity/3v1n0-quick-alt+tab-fixes/+merge/102028
<didrocks> pitti: if you remove the test part
<pitti> hm, that has other, unrelated, changes in it, right?
<didrocks> the first bug is the same
<didrocks> just the original one
<didrocks> but design likes to open multiplesâ¦
<didrocks> the other one yeah
<didrocks> and unfortunaly, despite me asking to only have that changes, it's mixed and was what was tested
<didrocks> and nobody is around upstream
<RAOF> robert_ancell: You around?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yup
<didrocks> pitti: so, I tried the branch in multiple configurations: one monitor, multimonitor, with one launcher, with one launcher on each monitor and all the intended behavior happened as well. same with alt-tab. I tried to trick it for 10 minutes
<didrocks> pitti: on the other bug, let me reread it because I don't see any difference
<didrocks> pitti: for alt-tab and from what I see, there is really no difference, it appears on the monitor which has the mouse pointer
<didrocks> which was already the case before
<didrocks> pitti: I see no change in the commit related to that, apart from the additional test which tests this behavior
<didrocks> pitti: so, what do you think we should be doing? either updating now, are waiting for Marco to come (which can be only this evening as he's studying)
<pitti> didrocks: if you are ok with the changes, please get them uploaded (-proposed)
<didrocks> pitti: ok, doing now
<pitti> didrocks: the other changes I referred to don't look harmful, I just noticed when reading the patch
<robert_ancell> has anyone had any trouble compiling gtk?
<pitti> robert_ancell: if you refer to what I said above, that was my fault
<pitti> my new glib upload broke the .pc, I reuploaded with a fixed patch
<robert_ancell> I've updated the new gtk and compiled it here, but it seems to log out all my sessions when I do.  I can't work out why
<pitti> I bzr push --overwrire
<didrocks> pitti: ah I got the change
<pitti> robert_ancell: oh, I'm working on gtk 3.4.1, you too?
<robert_ancell> pitti, yeah
<pitti> robert_ancell: see the pad and bzr commit
<didrocks> pitti: so, mouse on monitor A, alt-tab to focus an application on monitor B, alt-tab -> shows on monitor B
<didrocks> before, it was only where the mouse was
<didrocks> but if you move the mouse, then, it will again the monitor where you moved the mouse
<pitti> robert_ancell: haven't tested yet, still building locally (built in my PPA)
<pitti> robert_ancell: can you compare your changes to what's currently in bzr?
<pitti> robert_ancell: you mean _compiling_ logs you out of your session?
<pitti> robert_ancell: somethign during the test suite, I suppose?
<robert_ancell> pitti, yes
<pitti> well, I'll see ;)
<robert_ancell> pitti, that's what I was thinking, but I'm not seeing any smoking gun
<robert_ancell> pitti, and so I compiled it from a text terminal thinking it was something X related, but it still happened there and logged out both my text terminal and restarted lightdm
<robert_ancell> I don't even know what could do that
<pitti> talking to ConsoleKit perhaps?
<pitti> or the tests do somethign like killall gnome-session?
<pitti> or the equivalent on the session bus?
<robert_ancell> pitti, yeah, CK was my guess to
<robert_ancell> pitti, git_gtkcellrenderer_grabbing_modifier.patch wasn't actually applied in 3.4.1 (the patch name is misleading)
<robert_ancell> i.e. the upstream bug is still open and doesn't have the patch applied
<pitti> hm, it said it could be reverse-applied, checking
<robert_ancell> pitti, and there's a few version changes in debian/control you missed - I'll commit those
<pitti> robert_ancell: thanks; I diffed configure.ac against 3.4.0, those were the ones that I saw; but it could miss some updates from previous versions
<robert_ancell> pitti, everyone always forgets about updating the -dev package dependencies too :)
<pitti> ah, those; argh
<robert_ancell> pitti, ok pushed those.  Good luck with the compile!
<pitti> robert_ancell: erk, I get the same logoutt
<robert_ancell> pitti, yay, at least my computer is not completely broken!
<pitti> so, building in screen now :)
<rickspencer3> phew
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hey pitti, robert_ancell, didrocks what's the word on the street for Precise?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, it's 10 flavours or awesome?
<robert_ancell> of awesome
<rickspencer3> hehe
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, wfm
<rickspencer3> any known serious issues on the desktop? how does the last Unity upload look?
<pitti> holding up fine hehr
<pitti> here
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, btw, the lightdm greeter for 12.04 is really really nice!
<didrocks> rickspencer3: looked good. We have an incoming build with a late design change, but apart from that, no crashers, nothing ;)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, not that I know of.  There's some niggling issues for people doing complex login stuff, but I think we've got most of them under control m=now
<rickspencer3> hmmm, maybe we should disable logging in as a simplification for 12.10 ... would for sure reduce our bug count
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, well, I'm a supporter :)
<pitti> rickspencer3: logging != login :)
<rickspencer3> sorry, I just spent 2 hours getting through my inbox, now I'm all snarky
<pitti> disabling login would indeed solve most bugs, yes
<rickspencer3> ok, I'll look for that blueprint early in the week for UDS
<robert_ancell> later all
<pitti> robert_ancell: cu
<rickspencer3> by robert_ancell
<pitti> robert_ancell: I restored that patch, btw
<rickspencer3> didrocks, no crashers? that is good news indeed!
<didrocks> rickspencer3: well, not "no" none, just "no crasher that are widespread" ;)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, fair enough ;)
<kelemengabor> chrisccoulson: hi, could you please update the FF and TB desktop file translations? We have quite a few new translations for the keywords: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Wanted/FirefoxDesktop https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Wanted/ThunderbirdDesktop
<seb128> hey
<pitti> hey seb128, ca va?
<seb128> pitti, salut!
<didrocks> salut seb128 :)
<seb128> oui, bien, et yoi ?
<seb128> toi
<pitti> seb128: had a nice weekend?
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> pitti, yes, nothing special, the weather is not so great, but still relaxing ;-)
<seb128> you?
<pitti> seb128: I did some 3.4.1 stuff this morning, please check pad/bzr/unapproved before starting
<seb128> I see you guys already have some hours behind you
<seb128> unity upload in, glib in the queue
<seb128> pitti, did you start on gtk yet?
<pitti> seb128: quite fine; we had our first BBQ this year
<pitti> seb128: yes, currently building locally, and in bzr
<seb128> oh, I guess your weather is better than ours :p
<pitti> seb128: it was rather chilly indeed, but we already invited all the guests
<seb128> we had 15Â°C grey and windy here
<pitti> seb128: but at least dry; on Sunday it was quite horrific
<pitti> nice day to stay at home and do nothing
<pitti> I played two TIE fighter tours :)
<seb128> hehe
<pitti> and did some readingf
<pitti> seb128: I still have nautilus-sendto on my list
<pitti> otherwise I think we need to wait for new tarballs to come int
<seb128> pitti, I think the newer revision required the new eds on gsettings
<pitti> there might still be some "extra" stuff on versinos.html, haven't checked yet
<pitti> seb128: -sendto?
<seb128> yes
<pitti> ok
<didrocks> confirming sucky weather here as well :)
<seb128> pitti, http://git.gnome.org/browse/nautilus-sendto/commit/?id=76ca02055a515f99c5acafebe3a090dd78984d53
<seb128> didrocks, ahah, for once you got it as well :p
<didrocks> seb128: indeed ;)
<seb128> pitti, I had the discussion with bigon when he updated for Debian
<pitti> seb128: ok, so let's just skip that then, shall we?
<seb128> pitti, wfm
<seb128> pitti, otherwise yes, from the ftp list emails we are good to wait for tarballs after gtk
<seb128> pitti, thanks for doing glib,gtk btw ;-)
<pitti> de rien
<seb128> pitti, do you plan to include mvo's patch?
<pitti> seb128: yes, I did
<pitti> seb128: g-screensaver and gdk-pixbuf are also waiting in unapproved
<seb128> pitti, btw one of the gedit guys commented on the bug saying he doesn't like the patch, not sure if you saw
<pitti> yes, I did see it
<seb128> pitti, excellent
<pitti> I still think it's better than crashing
<pitti> seb128: and somehow I need to fix a bug now, without -proposed :)
<seb128> right, well he points that it could create cyclic references and the apps,pygobject should be fixed anyway
<pitti> nothing to be fixed in pygobject
<pitti> seb128: well, I can take it out again if you prefer
<seb128> pitti, you should have done gdk-pixbuf without syncing, that would have counted for one ;-)
<pitti> seb128: no, it's through -proposed
<seb128> pitti, no, that's fine, I agree for precise it's a good solution, let the GTK guys argue on how differently it should be done
<pitti> seb128: it's a --no-lp sync (i. e. real upload), as I uplaoded at the same time
<seb128> ok
<seb128> pitti, do you know if somebody testing the nautilus 12.04 LTS wrapping?
<seb128> pitti, I finished by letting the "wrap after '.' if not followed by a digit" (i.e just dropping the 3 digits special case, and fixing their macro which was buggy)
<pitti> meh, gtk 3.4.1's test suite is really really evil
<pitti> it even kills your session AND screen if you build in screen
<pitti> seb128: it's easy to test by booting today's live image or upgrading yesterday's
<pitti> seb128: haven't heard of a confirmation yet
<pitti> seb128: thanks for this
<seb128> yw
<seb128> pitti, it kills your session? wth?
<pitti> seb128: robert's too
<pitti> something in the test suite
<seb128> it's the third time this month somebody tells me that a testsuite close the session
<pitti> I built it in a PPA, that works fine
<seb128> I blame xorg or something in the stack
<seb128> charles had the same issue with libindicator
<seb128> pitti, do you know what is closed,how?
<pitti> I don't know yet
<seb128> like segv of gnome-session or xorg? oom?
<pitti> no crash at all
<seb128> ok, let me know if you figure
<seb128> I don't get the issue here
<pitti> I thought it's talking to ConsoleKit or gnome-session on the session dbus or what not
<seb128> hum
<seb128> would the session go away if the session bus was taken down?
<pitti> that shouldn't kill screen, though
<pitti> it's a bit mysterious
<pitti> finally got it to build now, after the 10th try :)
 * pitti installs and tests
<seb128> yes, I'm somewhat glad you get it :p
<seb128> will be easier to get to the bottom for it, I didn't manage to IRC debug it with the people who reported it before
<pitti> seb128: we could perhaps update transmission still, by way of merging with Debian?
<pitti> you backported half the fixes already anyway
<seb128> pitti, let me check the trac logs, I mentioned it to charles and we said it was safer to backport those fixes
<pitti> ok
<pitti> seb128: do you have anything else for gtk?
<pitti> otherwise I'll upload now, works fine here
<seb128> pitti, one sec
<seb128> hum
<seb128> andyrocks filed https://code.launchpad.net/~andyrock/gtk/fix-781931/+merge/102036
<seb128> which is a fix for bug #781931
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 781931 in unity "New windows are moved to front but don't take focus" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/781931
<seb128> but in fact I'm unsure if that's a bug in gtk
<seb128> I would prefer to have upstream's opinion first I think
<pitti> the upstream bug task is marked "invalid", hm
<pitti> seb128: ok, we can SRU this, too
<seb128> pitti, I will check with andyrock, I think the logic is part of the "don't steal focus"
<seb128> there is probably another bug in unity for not using correctly timestamps
<pitti> seb128: ok, let me know when you are done with your checks, then I'll upload
<seb128> pitti, I think I'm good, you can upload
<seb128> thanks!
<seb128> pitti, ok, transmissions vcs logs seems fine, if you want to resync on Debian I will not stop you ;-)
<bigon> 10:07 < seb128> pitti, I had the discussion with bigon when he updated for Debian << Re nst: the completion seems to work with eds 3.2.2
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128. i'm good thanks, although, i had quite a busy weekend. how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti
<pitti> bonjour bigon
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks
<bigon> hello :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I hope busy and good as well ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i managed to drink some beers
<seb128> bigon, hey, ok, thanks. Didn't you say completion stopped working after you did the update by then?
<didrocks> ogra_: hey ;)
<bigon> the next day after rebooting it was working... something wierd with eds maybe
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i'm trying to decide on a new phone, and thinking about one of these: http://www.htc.com/uk/smartphones/htc-one-x/
<didrocks> ogra_: compiz-plugins-extra is now FTBFS on arm, I think it's due to the opengl compiz/c-p-m versions: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/102097096/buildlog_ubuntu-precise-armhf.compiz-plugins-extra_0.9.7.0~bzr9-0ubuntu5_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<didrocks> ogra_: it's in universe, but maybe can be quickly fixed by anyone on the linaro team?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, they look nice ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i quite like it. i'm a bit concerned about the lack of removable battery though
<chrisccoulson> seems they are going the way of the iphone ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, way for a galaxy sIII ;-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, a few people have said that too. but this does look really nice :)
<seb128> seems they should be announced soon
<seb128> pitti, if you want to go for the new transmission let me know I've a patch I wanted to add to it if we do an upload
<pitti> seb128: ok; I'm not working on it right now (low prio, and doing patch piloting); perhaps just commit it to Debian?
<seb128> pitti, transmission is not pkg-gnome maintained
<seb128> pitti, I will get it upstream through charles
<pitti> oh, I seee
 * Sweetshark considers buying a bumpersticker saying: "I survived Hackfest 2012."
<pitti> hey Sweetshark, wie gehts?
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark ;)
<ogra_> didrocks, hmm, i dont see it running quilt in the log
<didrocks> ogra_: compiz-plugins-extra?
<ogra_> the link you posted above
<didrocks> ogra_: I didn't see you proposing patches for it, only compiz and c-p-m
<ogra_> oh, wait
<ogra_> -extra
<didrocks> yeah
 * ogra_ isnt fully awake :P
<ogra_> i'll see if i can catch alf or rsalveti
<ogra_> i dont think any of these plugins can run anyway yet... but i also dont like to release with FTBFS packages
<Sweetshark> pitti, didrocks: great really. Just a bit tired after four days of nonstop hackfest work (even though I didnt get to much done myself).
<didrocks> ogra_: yeah we can maybe deactivate the arm buildâ¦ not sure
<ogra_> thats a very last resort ...
<Sweetshark> pitti, didrocks: but I spread some knowledge about how to binary bisect LibreOffice regressions, and there is a video made about that now: http://www.youtube-nocookie.com/v/SA88flop4MM?version=3&hl=de_DE
<didrocks> ogra_: nobody really cares about -extra TBH
<ogra_> right
<ogra_> but lets see what alf says ... we can always do an upload that disabled the arch
<ogra_> well, not always but surely still this week
<ogra_> *disables
<didrocks> ogra_: yeah ;)
<didrocks> ogra_: keep me posted!
<didrocks> I have no strong feeling either way
<ogra_> will do, thanks for the heads up !
<lifeless> win 66
<kelemengabor> chrisccoulson: hi, did you see my request earlier today? any comment on that?
<chrisccoulson> kelemengabor, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/thunderbird/thunderbird-trunk.head/revision/567
<kelemengabor> oh, great, thanks :)
<pitti> dpm: will the LP guys do an one-off full export tomorrow?
<pitti> dpm: I just set the "request full export" checkbox
<dpm> pitti, yes, I haven't arranged it yet, but will talk to them as discussed
<seb128> hum
<seb128> does anyone else have no nm-applet indicator showing in their panel for some days?
<pitti> WFM
<seb128> in fact it's not running for me, wth
<pitti> didrocks, seb128: FYI, the publisher is broken for the next couple of hours, infinity fixed it but it needs some time to catch up
<pitti> so pending-sru and the like won't update
<seb128> ok
<didrocks> thanks for the notice :)
<pitti> seb128: hm, still no new 3.4.1 tarballs..
 * didrocks looks at fredp
<seb128> pitti, yeah, side effect of having most of the maintainers U.S based nowadays
<dupondje> Anyone could get a look @ https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/819994 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 819994 in gtk+3.0 "String length of items seems limited (system settings label get truncated)" [Low,Triaged]
<dupondje> Seems a long standing bug, that really kills the layout ;)
<seb128> dupondje, like most long standing bugs it's hard to fix
<seb128> that's why it's still not addressed
<seb128> if you have suggestions on how to do it you are welcome to propose a patch on describe your idea on the bug ;-)
<dupondje> :) Well my idea is that it really should be fixed, cause now it looks really dirty.
<dupondje> Can look at the code, but I don't think my knowledge is good enough to fix it :(
<seb128> dupondje, well it looks fine in the default install on most locales
<seb128> but yeah it's an annoying issue
<dupondje> If you set text size in 'Universal Access' to Bigger
<dupondje> and then look at the system settings screen
<dupondje> :P
<seb128> dupondje, "if"... yes, I know, I use a bigger size here ;-)
<dupondje> Set it to 'smaller' now it looks fine :D
<seb128> dupondje, well I know all that and I agree it's an issue, it's just not a trivial one
<seb128> having a non fixed geometry for the grid would trigger other layout issues
<seb128> that's why upstream forced it this way
<dupondje> to bad
<seb128> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/932409/
<seb128> retracers 13 to 16 top bugs
<seb128> just for info ;-)
<didrocks> thanks seb128 :)
 * didrocks rushes
<seb128> unity-2d for the loose
<seb128> they have 4 hot bugs there
<didrocks> waow, the first compiz one is at rank 20 (the one before was c-p-e)
<seb128> the numbers seem low somehow
<pitti> seb128: ahh, thanks; the first gvfs one is a dupe, marking so
<didrocks> well, a little bit before or after, depends on how you count equals number :)
<seb128> I hate that libx11 XAllocID bug :-(
<pitti> the apport one, too
<seb128> didrocks, pitti: btw some GNOME tarballs start coming, I put them on the "to claim" on the etherpad
<didrocks> seb128: thanks :)
<pitti> ah, morning in Boston :)
<seb128> pitti, in fact rather late european dude so far it seems, vuntz and fpeters ;-)
<seb128> they probably slept until 11am, had breakfast and just started :p
<pitti> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/101559847/CrashReports.txt
<pitti> urgh, someone's kernel is really crashy
<seb128> is that didrock's? ;-)
<pitti> heh, no :)
<seb128> the kernel doesn't like io load for him or something
<pitti> I'll take the first two then
<seb128> pitti, danke
<pitti> I'll just keep grabbing two until end-of-queu :)
<seb128> I will grab gnome-panel ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: the 2d guys are looking at the crashers right now, there are 2 of them in fact (one was already on track)
<seb128> didrocks, great, thanks
<pitti> grabbing devhelp
<pitti> seb128: gimme more tarballs!
<seb128> lol
<pitti> oh, gtksourceview
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> pitti is hungry today! ;-)
<pitti> well, new tarballs which just update two po files are no real challenge :)
<pitti> update, build, test, upload cycle is 5 mintues
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> boring is good at this point of the cycle :p
<pitti> doing gtksourceview in Debian
 * didrocks would lilke boring
<didrocks> like*
<pitti> you get the 13317 stuff :)
<pitti> err
<pitti> 31337
<pitti> *blush*
<didrocks> pitti: ok, that's some way of sending it :)
<didrocks> selling*
<seb128> pitti, should all upgrades target proposed or still only the ones which would create installability issues?
<pitti> seb128: I'm just always using -proposed now
<seb128> ok
<pitti> I just got a gnome-desktop FTBFS
<pitti> as gtk3 is behind on armhf
<pitti> it doesn't hurt, and keeps uninstallability away
<seb128> right
<seb128> tjaalton, "Just realised this patch is crap.", first time you have to deal with Bastien? ;-)
<pitti> argh
<pitti> c'mon gtk3, build on armel
 * pitti feeds the hamsters
<pitti> oh, I supposed that would be the publisher being broken
<seb128> it would help if we didn't build gtk 3 times, I will suggest we drop the static build next cycle
<pitti> it's built
<pitti> it just doesn't publish
<pitti> cf. what I said earlier about the publisher
<seb128> oh, that's infinity's bug from this morning?
<seb128> yeah, I've read that
<tjaalton> seb128: yeah, well his patch isn't much better either though :)
 * pitti sings the "gimme gimme gimme more" song
<seb128> pitti, just gnome-desktop-schemas and gnome-settings-daemon are coming, they just got git tagged
<seb128> pitti, and you got mousetweak meanwhile
<pitti> doing
<tjaalton> seb128: since we tested that approach, and '..is_screen_tablet = 0' on touchscreens
<tjaalton> so maybe there's another bug lurking somewhere then
 * didrocks doesn't need caffein thanks to the dx team ;)
<seb128> tjaalton, you won the right to argue with him then, good luck ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, you probably need rather some cold water and yoga moves ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: I'm practicing, practicing *a lot*
<didrocks> guns are allowed in the US, right? :p
<tjaalton> seb128: right, thanks :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, more so in texas than california
<didrocks> kenvandine: argh, what a pity!
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> what a pity that tedg just missed my stab at texas :)
<tedg> Heh, I couldn't imagine you doing something like that kenvandine.
<kenvandine> good morning tedg
<pitti> seb128: do you also get a lot of glib schema spewage about the shotwell schemas now?
<pitti> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/932482/
<seb128> pitti, oh, f***, I forgot about that
<seb128> pitti, it's your glib update
<seb128> I blame it on desrt
<seb128> I saw it saturday
<seb128> it's http://git.gnome.org/browse/glib/commit/?id=6560b37450cd19c4a7c7b690e279fe97b7bfdcaa
<pitti> well, it says "warning", but it doesn't look pretty
<seb128> right
<seb128> that's stupid thing to add in a stable update, I wanted to revert it
<seb128> we will obviously not fix those now
<pitti> indeed, why is that in .1?
<seb128> dunno, ask desrt
<seb128> but yeah it's boggus
<seb128> sorry I forgot about that this morning
<pitti> that's something for the start of a cycle
<pitti> seb128: np, it's my fault in the end
<seb128> yes
<pitti> I guess we'll revert it
<seb128> do you want to revert it?
<seb128> yes please
<mbiebl> seb128, pitti: would probably makes sense though to do a MBF to get such applications fixed (and track the progress)
<mbiebl> severity wishlist, or so
<seb128> mbiebl, "MBF"?
<mbiebl> mass bug filing
<seb128> mbiebl, well, we are hard frozen and release is less than 2 weeks away, as pitti said I think it's a start of next cycle priority rather ;-)
<mbiebl> sure, sure
<seb128> but yeah, something to do then for sure
<mbiebl> I was more thinking about filing those in Debian :-)
<Laney> just put it in and users will file bugs for you :-)
<mbiebl> Laney: stuff like that is easy to automate
<Laney> mbiebl: yeah, wasn't being entirely serious :P
<kelemengabor> looks like bug 978153 was not fixed, could someone reopen it?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 978153 in ubuntu-translations "Strings in wacom tablet section are not marked fot translation" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/978153
<kelemengabor> or is it better to file a new one?
<seb128> kelemengabor, how not fixed?
<kelemengabor> seb128: strings are not present in the current template
<kelemengabor> I have linked searches in a comment
<seb128> grrrrrrrr
<seb128> kelemengabor, I'm fixing it manually
<seb128> it's just not listed in the POTFILES.in
<seb128> builds should really warn on that ;-)
<kelemengabor> thanks!
<seb128> yw
<seb128> kelemengabor, thanks for pointing it!
<seb128> kelemengabor, and thanks for all the work you do on translations issues
<pitti> seb128: quiesced glib uploaded
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<seb128> desrt, hey
<seb128> desrt, had a good w.e?
<pitti> desrt: good morning
<didrocks> desrt: you should run, people are waiting for you :p
<desrt> didrocks: i notice this...
<desrt> pitti, seb128: hi
<pitti> jbicha: http://packages.qa.debian.org/a/anjuta-extras.html doesn't have a newer anjuta?
<pitti> jbicha: (I saw your sync request in the pad)
<desrt> seb128: good enough.  i managed to not even check my email during the weekend.  not something i've been able to do in a long time.
<didrocks> desrt: liar! :)
<didrocks> desrt: you answer to Julie :)
<didrocks> answered*
<desrt> crap.
<desrt> that's true :p
<seb128> desrt, that's lying, didrocks said you replied to icons stuff
<seb128> desrt, ;-)
<desrt> well
<desrt> it was like... sunday night
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> hem ;)
<desrt> I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM
<desrt> I CAN QUIT ANY TIME I WANT
 * pitti chuckles
<seb128> desrt, I will spare you the "put output noise in a stable serie" rant for today :p
<pitti> desrt: here, take a gummy bear
<jbicha> pitti: never mind, anjuta-extras was synced a while ago, thanks
<desrt> seb128: output noise?
<desrt> like some stray g_print()s?
<seb128> desrt, could you look at the dconf bug from friday again today? Thomas emailed me saying the think we under-estimate the bug and it's impossible to create any db without segfault
<seb128> desrt, like http://git.gnome.org/browse/glib/commit/?h=glib-2-32&id=6560b37450cd19c4a7c7b690e279fe97b7bfdcaa
<pitti> desrt: I just reverted http://git.gnome.org/browse/glib/commit/?id=6560b374 for our packages
<desrt> oh
<desrt> let me guess
<desrt> glib had not branched for stable yet?
<seb128> desrt, no
<desrt> so that was a mistake
<desrt> that was only intended for 3.5 series
<seb128> desrt, is there any other "surprised" in there due to that? i.e stuff that was meant for master and got included in 3.4.1?
<desrt> i thought we had branched already
<seb128> -d
<desrt> let me check :)
<seb128> desrt, thanks ;-)
<desrt> seb128: so there is one issue that i guess you may want to know about
<desrt> 2.32.1 contains a last-minute fix from will for macos that accidentally breaks linux if gnustep is installed
<seb128> desrt, ok, that's a non issue for us, the builders don't have so much cruft installed
<seb128> desrt, but thanks for the notice
<desrt> just something to know incase you have gnustep installed and try a local build :)
<seb128> right
<pitti> didrocks: want to move unity to release yourself, or wnat me to?
<seb128> desrt, so, did you read my dconf bug ping before?
<didrocks> pitti: I'll move move move ;)
<desrt> seb128: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=674172 for that one, btw
<ubot2> Gnome bug 674172 in build "glib-2.32.1 misdetects GNUstep as Cocoa" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> desrt, could you check on the bug they are not doing anything wrong and that there is not a real situation issue behind, Thomas seems pretty sure the issue is not the one you pointed and is happening not only in corrupted db or empty ones cases
<seb128> desrt, in any case they are failing to set up things, they just run into the segfault it seems so even if it's user errors helping them to figure what they do wrong would be good
<desrt> who is this guy?!
<seb128> desrt, one of the google sysadmins
<desrt> he's doing it _so_ _very_ _wrong_
<desrt> and this really is the same bug as upstream
<seb128> desrt, can you help him to get it right? ;-)
<desrt> ya.  posting a link to the docs :p
<seb128> desrt, thanks ;-)
<desrt> i think he was at this page because he clearly copy/pasted some of it
<desrt> but i think he didn't bother to continue reading :p
<jbicha> seb128: could you add http://paste.ubuntu.com/932545/ to gsettings-desktop-schemas.gsettings-override
<seb128> jbicha, urg
<seb128> jbicha, feel free to do it ;-)
<seb128> jbicha, I didn't really start on the update so you can steal it from me ;-)
<jbicha> seb128: ok, thanks
<seb128> desrt, so, I'm playing with dconf just to see
<seb128> desrt, with a /etc/dconf/db/local.d/desrt which has
<seb128> "[ca/desrt/debug]
<seb128> user='ryan'"
<seb128> sudo dconf update
<seb128> "dconf read /ca/desrt/debug" should return something?
<desrt> that should create a /etc/dconf/db/local
<desrt> non-empty
<seb128> yes, it does
<seb128> but the read returns nothing
<desrt> did you also create the profile file?
<seb128> yes
<desrt> erm
<seb128> it works if I put the system-db before the user-db
<desrt> i think you want dconf read /ca/desrt/debug/user
<seb128> it's like it was checking the user first and not going further
<desrt> because there is no /ca/desrt/debug
<seb128> doh, that's how I'm awake today :p
<seb128> desrt, so ok, works as it should
<desrt> :)
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<desrt> there _is_ a bug there
<desrt> 'list' doesn't work with system databases
<desrt> so if you dconf dump /ca/desrt/debug/ then it won't work
<glatzor> mvo, abend!
<desrt> it's one of the many many 'known issues' that i plan to fix with time
 * desrt has been working a bit on the dconf-engine code in the slowdown of the past few days
<seb128> desrt, that's what I tried before in fact
<desrt> seb128: makes sense
<seb128> desrt, anyway I checked, custom dbs work, locking works
<desrt> dump works by list() all keys and then check their values
<desrt> so if they don't show in list() you get no output
<desrt> seb128: ya.  the reporter is just doing it wrong
<seb128> desrt, it sucks a bit that the code just doesn't bail out of zero byte files rather than segfaulting
<desrt> seb128: so i go back to my original statement about that bug: we should not crash in that case
<desrt> seb128: but obviously we can't expect it to work, either
<seb128> desrt, I agree with you ;-)
<seb128> well, handling corrupted files is not easy
<seb128> handling empty file should be easy to bail out with an error message
<desrt> ya...
<desrt> gvdb is actually safe against most things, i think
<seb128> like "check your config, that's empty"
<desrt> i didn't give it really really good fuzz testing or anything
<desrt> maybe i should
<desrt> oooo
<desrt> that's what i'll tell olli
<desrt> "develop a testsuite for dconf"
<desrt> managers LOVE to hear that sort of thing
<desrt> will be approved for sure :)
<janimo`> didrocks, does unity/compiz has some GPU whitelist or blacklist?
<didrocks> janimo`: there is a blacklist, yeah
<janimo`> didrocks, if there's a new closed source drier in use besides nvidia or ati does it need to be mentioned somewhere explicitly?
<didrocks> janimo`: the blacklist is by card, not by driver, so if a new card isn't working and still report 3D acceleration and working in unity, yes it needs to be blacklisted
<janimo`> didrocks, ok thanks. I am trying to run it on a PVR based card liek the ones in OMAP4 but this is x86, just wanted to see if there's any prerequisite besides just figuring out why it crashes
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, all the posts from facebook on my feed don't have titles (with the persons name)
<seb128> I hate etherpad
<didrocks> janimo`: you can try to run /usr/lib/nux/unity_support_test -p to get more info :)
<seb128> why does it keep wanting me to reconnect
<didrocks> janimo`: you will see if it's theorically supported or not :)
<janimo`> didrocks, thanks, will try. I forgot that one :)
<seb128> pitti, gnome-control-center up to claim ;-)
<kelemengabor1> seb128: I'd also like to see bug #441986 fixed - the "Examples" link translation on the installer desktop. Can we have a nonlangpackdeadline rebuild with translations for it?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 441986 in example-content "Live CD "Examples" desktop item translations depended on having the PO files" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/441986
<janimo`> didrocks, all green, so reasons for hoping :)
<seb128> kelemengabor1, I will do one
<kelemengabor1> seb128: if I submit a branch for its upstream project with the exported translations, like: https://code.launchpad.net/~kelemeng/example-content/bug441986, is that useful?
<kelemengabor1> (say yes, and I hit you with two more :P)
<seb128> kelemengabor1, not sure, I would rather do what I did for the other ones I uploaded, ask an .po export to launchpad and cp them
<seb128> did somebody put gnome-control-center under the etherpad "being worked" or was it me just adding it to the wrong section?
<didrocks> didn't touch
<seb128> I moved it to "to claim" because there was no name and I think I had did put it at the wrong place before
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> not me
<kelemengabor1> seb128: okay, so do it in downstream. But would you consider such merge proposals helpful (less gruntwork?) or it is simpler if I just ask here to do an upload for update-notifier (bug #562900) and update-manager (bug #628157)?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 562900 in update-notifier "Please include translations from Launchpad in the package" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/562900
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 628157 in ubuntu-translations "10.04 -> 10.10: Untranslated string: Upgrading Ubuntu to version 10.10" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/628157
<seb128> kelemengabor1, I let mvo handle those
<seb128> mvo, ^
<kelemengabor1> :)
<seb128> kelemengabor1, well update-notifier and update-manager have a shared setup between upstream and ubuntu I think
<seb128> kelemengabor1, not sure that's the case for example-content, and I've no idea how that works, so I will just do it like I know how to do it
<seb128> I should learn from pitti or mvo how to do the upstream shared export thing at some point though
<didrocks> desrt: Julie will start working on the dconf icon btw, hold on your release if you planned any  :)
<desrt> nothing planned so far :)
 * desrt has only one patch for a possible release
 * desrt is wondering if it's really worth it...
<glatzor> mvo, I finally found the reason for lp#659438
<seb128> bug #659438
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 659438 in aptdaemon "Installation/Removal fails because of package which could not be located (failure in apt.Cache.required_download)" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/659438
<seb128> glatzor, hey
<glatzor> hello seb128 how are you?
<seb128> glatzor, I'm good thanks, how are you?
<pitti> nessita, dobey: bug 334757 says it fixes something in UbuntuOne, but I can't really tell what; do you happen to know?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 334757 in kdebindings "update-notifier-kde.py crashed with SIGSEGV in QSocketNotifier::setEnabled()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/334757
<dobey> pitti: yes, sometimes ubuntu-sso-client will crash with that error as it's a problem in pyqt which is being used. alecu has tested the fix and his test script is not reproducing the crash any longer
<pitti> dobey: ah, awesome!
<pitti> dobey: thanks
<dobey> pitti: so as he mentioned on the bug it gets the +1 from us :)
<pitti> dobey: copied to precise then
<pitti> seb128: uploaded g-c-c; I'm done with gnome stuff today
<dobey> pitti: cool. thanks
<pitti> time for some errands and sport, and I have a TB night shift ahead of me
<seb128> pitti, thanks, seem they are done for now as well, I can pick the next shift, I've been mostly been dealing with w.e catchup and other bugs so far today
<seb128> didrocks, do you know how to fakesync?
<seb128> didrocks, dget http://incoming.debian.org/totem-pl-parser_3.4.1-1.dsc if you do ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: oh? already here, yes doing :)
<seb128> didrocks, thanks ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: or we can wait tomorrow morning to have a real sync
<didrocks> seb128: will add on my list ;)
<didrocks> (seems better)
<seb128> didrocks, works for me
<didrocks> seb128: doing gnome-system-log just for doing it
<didrocks> seb128: it contains your two fixes and that's it :)
<seb128> didrocks, \o/ me :p
<didrocks> heh
<seb128> kelemengabor1, still around?
<kelemengabor1> seb128: yes
<seb128> kelemengabor1, can you do your example-content merge proposal after all? ;-)
<kelemengabor1> sure, for which branch, upstream or ubuntu?
<seb128> kelemengabor1, upstream
<kelemengabor1> seb128: bug 441986 is ready
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 441986 in example-content "Live CD "Examples" desktop item translations depended on having the PO files" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/441986
<seb128> kelemengabor1, thanks
 * didrocks will do some exercice and dinner, see you tomorrow guys
<xichael> "missing operating system" is all i get when i try to boot from usb. i've used the Universal USB Installer from pendrivelinux.com to load 11.10 Desktop onto the drive. any ideas what's wrong?
<Darxus> xichael: I think you got the wrong channel.  #ubuntu might be better.
<xichael> thanks, i'll try there
<pgraner> bryceh, can we get someone to look at: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server/+bug/973297
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 973297 in linux "Xorg recognizes Logitech Headset USB dongle as input device then segfaults" [Medium,Confirmed]
<bryceh> pgraner, yes
<pgraner> bryceh, I have a box that I can do it at will with and the same headset if it helps
<bryceh> looks like a job for cnd, but let me study a few minutes
<cnd> pgraner, bryceh: I've seen a fix go by upstream for that issue
<cnd> we should get it when we update to the latest xorg-server point release
<cnd> the point release was just released this weekend
<bryceh> cnd, excellent thanks.
<pgraner> bryceh, cool, can you get the bug up to speed wrt status, and targeting?
<bryceh> pgraner, yes; looking for the patch first tho
<cnd> hmm... doesn't look like it made it into the point release
<cnd> I'll add a link to the patch
<bryceh> cnd, thanks, yeah didn't spot it there either
<cnd> oh, I don't think peter has picked it up yet
<bryceh> cnd, pgraner ok bug looks good now.  the patch looks pretty obvious to me; should we put it in a ppa to get some testing, or roll it in now, or wait 'til we pull the point release?
<cnd> bryceh, I'm actually not 100% sure that patch will fix things
<cnd> pgraner, I put some instructions in the bug for getting an evemu device property file
<cnd> please follow up and then we can be sure
<bryceh> cnd, alright then let's do a ppa
<cnd> bryceh, I can probably test and confirm on my own if I have the evemu file
<bryceh> cnd, alright.  I can set up a ppa for this; extra testing can't hurt.
<cnd> sure
<cnd> bryceh, this signal safe logging work has put me a bit behind on other work :(
<cnd> but I think I'm almost done with it
<bryceh> headset fix -> ppa:bryce/lp973297
<desrt> seb128: looks like our dconf issue sorted itself out...
<seb128> desrt, right, I just commented on the bug
<desrt> seb128: thomas too.  seems he is happy with the result now.
<desrt> (after first accusing us of being a bunch of idiots and failing to understand the problem as he explained it)
<seb128> desrt, right, I read that, it was 3 hours ago
<desrt> ah.  did not notice your comment after that.
<seb128> desrt, well he put a small rant about documentation still ;-)
<seb128> desrt, well, when I said "just" it's a minute ago or so
<desrt> seb128: ya.  docs could be better.
<seb128> desrt, is the wiki you pointed to somewhere in the GNOME sysadmin guide?
<desrt> we have a sysadmin guide?
<desrt> (read: no.  probably not)
<seb128> desrt, I guess you could put the wiki url in the manpage or the help output
<seb128> desrt, http://library.gnome.org/admin/system-admin-guide/stable/
<seb128> desrt, but I guess it's old and not updated, it still covers gconf
<chrisccoulson> ooh, car is going to be finished on friday :)
<desrt> seb128: my guess as well
<desrt> we could use some new mallard sysadmin stuff :)
<desrt> chrisccoulson: what happened to it?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you get used to the one you got in exchange?
<seb128> desrt, well at least perhaps drop the url in the manpage or in the help output?
<seb128> url -> the wiki one
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i'm used to it now. but, as much as i like having a brand new hire car, i would like my own back now :)
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> desrt, somebody drove in to the back of my car when i was queued at traffic lights on easter monday
<xclaesse> hmmm, git says perl: warning: Setting locale failed.
<xclaesse> that's new since today upgrade in precise
<xclaesse> is that known, any workaround?
<seb128> do you get the same issue on other commands?
<seb128> is your locale correctly set?
<pitti> seb128: still busy :)
<seb128> pitti, yeah, almost done, I will stop after vinagre
<pitti> seb128: I'll look at gvfs and librsvg in Debian
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> argh, we again have an ubuntu delta there, will check
<seb128> pitti, I tried to sort by priority order on the etherpad
<pitti> I think librsvg wasn't necessary
<seb128> like the bottom of the list are non seeded,universe
<dobey> btw, is everything supposed to be uploaded to proposed from now on for precise, and copied after approval from there?
<pitti> dobey: yes, safer that way
<pitti> dobey: well, not necessary for arch: all packages
<pitti> but for arch:any ones
<dobey> i don't see how that distinction matters, but ok :)
<pitti> dobey: there is just one build for arch:all (on i386), you can't get arch skew there
<seb128> dobey, there is no out-of sync between archs for those
<dobey> pitti: oh true. but if you upload something that's broken, it will be broken everywhere, while arch:any might only get broken on one arch. so the "safer" metric seems vague :)
<pitti> dobey: we use -proposed to avoid temporary uninstallability and arch skew
<seb128> dobey, you don't want anything broken in proposed either :p
<pitti> dobey: yes, if the package itself breaks, that won't help of course :)
<dobey> seb128: indeed. but we don't always get what we want. there's even a rolling stones song about it :P
<pitti> meh, our librsvg delta is sufficiently large at this point (and also mostly irrelevant) that I'd rather not re-sync now
 * pitti wishes people would check Debian first before diverting away
<seb128> pitti, we haven't be in sync since january on it, list most of GNOME we just updated before Debian
<seb128> pitti, i.e https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/librsvg/+changelog no recent merge,sync
<pitti> seb128: right, but e. g. debian's rsvg compat changes would have been nice to get
<pitti> and our rather pointless dh_python2 transition was unnecessary
<seb128> pitti, well, they updated end of march
<pitti> anyway, no big deal
<seb128> right
<pitti> we can sync again in Q
<seb128> pitti, the issue is really not "pointless diff" is "do updates in Debian"
<pitti> speaking of which, will we ever get a name for it?
<seb128> and the issue is that it's slower and most people don't have access to Debian here
<seb128> that's a sabdfl's question ;-)
<bryceh> duh, it's named 'q-series'
<bryceh> ;-)
<pitti> Quarrelling Quail!
<mlankhorst> and fixed ipv6 on this host again, huzzah
<micahg> pitti: does the new librsvg upload actually add back an rsvg-convert compat layer?
<pitti> micahg: no, it doesn't; see above, I think it's a bit late for larger packaging changes like that
<pitti> it also took a few rounds to get right in debian
<micahg> pitti: the final diff was actually minimal...anyways, '- Rename rsvg.1 to rsvg-convert.1 and update for rsvg-convert's options' prompted the question
<pitti> yes, they updated the manpage to match what -bin actually ships
<micahg> wait, so we are shipping rsvg-convert? (that's what that line implies)
<pitti> no, we don't; we just ship rsvg, what's upstream
<pitti> but previous versions still had a manpage for the (nonexisting) rsvg-convert
<micahg> so the changelog is backwards?
<pitti> err, sorry; rsvg-convet is the new tool, rsvg the old one
 * micahg is very confused
<pitti> rsvg was the python compat wrapper aroud rsvg-convert
<pitti> but was dropped this cycle
<seb128> pitti, still there?
<pitti> seb128: yes
<seb128> oh yes
<seb128> pitti, retracers are sick
<seb128> 04/16/12 20:47:10: retracing #981509 (left in pool: 230)
<seb128> 04/16/12 20:47:21: retracing #981509 failed with status: 99
<seb128> 04/16/12 20:47:21: transient error reported; halting
<seb128>  
<seb128> the i386 keeps doing that
<pitti> urgh
<micahg> pitti: ok, got it now, for some reason I thought it was the other way, thanks
<seb128> pitti, no lock, it just exit, retry, exit, retry
<pitti> that usually happens with HTTPError and friends, from launchpadlib
<seb128> pitti, it's doing that since "04/14/12 11:17:16: retracing #981509 failed with status: 99"
<seb128> that's why the summary I did this morning has so "low" counts, I should have checked further :-(
<pitti> ok, excellent thing to do tomorrow after the 3.4.1 rush
<seb128> pitti, well, it's happening always on the same bug
<seb128> to the i386 retracer only
<pitti> you could temporarily untag this perhaps?
<seb128> pitti, should I untag that bug meanwhile?
<pitti> the bug itself might cause a HTTPError
<seb128> pitti, yes
<pitti> yes, it's most certainly that
<pitti> amd64 uses the very same code and cookie
<pitti> probably that bug triggers a LP oops
<seb128> nothing special I can see from the web version
<seb128> pitti, ok, it's retracing happily again, so probably something about that bug
<pitti> ok, so let it catch up over the night, and I'll investigate that bug more closely tomorrow
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> good night everyone!
<bkerensa> pitti: gnight
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-04-17
<pitti> Good morning
<robert_ancell> pitti, hey, do you understand how the documentation translations works with ubuntu?
<pitti> robert_ancell: not differently than in upstream
<pitti> robert_ancell: except that we can pull updated po files from LP
<pitti> i. e. you can do an export for the package, stuff it in as a patch, and thus get updated translations during biuld
<robert_ancell> pitti, we have long standing bug 543282 where simple-scan help is not translatable
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 543282 in simple-scan "Documentation cannot be translated" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/543282
<robert_ancell> pitti, so is it just because there are no .po files there currently?
<pitti> robert_ancell: how is the documentation build? Doesn't it take some C (locale, not programming language) input file and use some yelp-tools or similar to generate per-language docs?
<robert_ancell> pitti, yeah, it's just standard yelp tools, like gcalctool and most other GNOME projects
<pitti> robert_ancell: so step 1 would be to ensure that your package builds a current .pot during build
<robert_ancell> pitti, so it doesn't do that, and no other GNOME package does afaict
<pitti> robert_ancell: I suppose the .pot (i. e. the domain) for the help is different than the runtime domain
<pitti> robert_ancell: in fact, most gnome packages do, by way of cdbs gnome.mk
<pitti> or dh_translations
<pitti> robert_ancell: but yes, the immediate cause of non-translated docs are certainly missing po files, provided that the build system is set up to use them if they are present
<pitti> robert_ancell: reviewing your 3.4.1 uploads, thanks
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> hey didrocks
<robert_ancell> pitti, yes, please have a close look at the vte one.  It has the most changes, but they seem ok
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti :)
<pitti> robert_ancell: hm, we usually upload to -proposed nwo
<robert_ancell> pitti, last I asked it was back to precise!
<pitti> robert_ancell: for most packages it's harmless enough, but for vte I'd prefer proposed as it has more potential for archive breakage
<robert_ancell> ok
<robert_ancell> feel free to kick it back then
<pitti> robert_ancell: that only lasted for two days until LP was fixed
<pitti> robert_ancell: vte seems reasonable, assuming that you tested with gnome-terminal
<pitti> robert_ancell: I'll reject it, and let you reupload to -proposed, and then accept it right away
<robert_ancell> pitti, yes, been running it for a few hours
<pitti> robert_ancell: (I trust that the diff is going to be the same)
 * robert_ancell looks devious
<pitti> robert_ancell: accepted the others
<pitti> I updated the pad
<pitti> so that leaves brasero, yelp, cheese
<pitti> err, brasero is in
<pitti> robert_ancell: are you still working on updates? If so, can you please claim them in the pad?
<pitti> I'll take some others then
<robert_ancell> pitti, nope, I'm done for the day
<didrocks> pitti: I'm testing a fix for the software-center animation icon issue (just get it few minutes ago). if that fixes it for me, what do you think about sneaking this other fix as well (one line fix, making the workspace section keys of the overlay translated): http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity/trunk/revision/2283
<pitti> didrocks: LGTM
<didrocks> pitti: thanks, building and trying on both my laptop and netbook the fix
<rickspencer3> hey didrocks
<rickspencer3> didrocks, what do you think is less risky, reverting or moving forward with Jay's fix?
<didrocks> bonjour rickspencer3 ;)
<rickspencer3> I'm a bit worried about piling regression on top of regression
<didrocks> rickspencer3: the fix doesn't look worrying. As I have one hw which can shows the issues, I can test it, and as well on my laptop. Reverting the issue make revert other memleak fixes and is less tested. So I propose to pick the fix, push into -proposed, having some confirmations all is fine, and go with it if so
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hey pitti
<rickspencer3> didrocks, ok, let me know when it's built in proposed, and I'll update my netbook
<didrocks> rickspencer3: will do :) building locally right now and ensuring everything is fine first :)
<robert_ancell> pitti, oh, did you solve that gtk+ issue?
<pitti> robert_ancell: if you mean the "kills session during build", no
<robert_ancell> pitti, doing gnome-games update right now
<robert_ancell> pitti, hey, do you follow the valac packaging?
<pitti> not closely, why?
<robert_ancell> pitti, it's just that apt-get install valac installs the 0.14 version, when it really should do the 0.16 version.  I don't know how we're supposed to handle the packaging correctly - currently valac is build from the 0.14 source package
<didrocks> rickspencer3: pitti: ok, I've done 10 installs/uninstalls in a row without any issue. You have to move the mouse on low configuration to trigger a refresh to get the animation, but it's not a new issue. Will publish it to -proposed.
<rickspencer3> hey didrocks
<rickspencer3> let me know when it's built and I'll install and test
<rickspencer3> didrocks, I'll run through the unity tests to make sure I don't hit any other issues
<didrocks> rickspencer3: ok, the change is just in functions that are called by software-center installing the application FYI
<didrocks> (dbus triggered)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, you don't know how many times in my life I have heard "there is no way this could affect code outside of foo"
<rickspencer3> ;)
<rickspencer3> fortunately, we have a good set of tests to run through , so regressions should show up quickly
<didrocks> rickspencer3: I didn't tell there is no way, I just told "the functions that were touched are only called in that case" :p
<rickspencer3> lol
<didrocks> ah pitti beats me at totem-pl-parser while I was looking at unity :)
<pitti> heh
<seb128> hey
<didrocks> hey seb128
<seb128> hey didrocks
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> oh, a pitti!
<seb128> pitti, it's meeting reminder day! ;-)
<pitti> http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/bug-fixing/canonical-desktop-team-precise-fixes-report.html
 * pitti ^5s seb128
<pitti> seb128: oh, thanks
<seb128> pitti, how are you? I hope the 3am uploads are delayed approval and just not you going to be at 3am to start again at 6am ;-)
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<pitti> seb128: nah, I went to bed at 0:30
<pitti> and got up again at 7:15
<seb128> pitti, tie! good, don't touch anything out of proposed now ;-)
<pitti> I was just awake
<pitti> seb128: hehe, same for you!
<seb128> deal!
<pitti> seb128: I need to do an apport and kerneloops upload to disable for the final release, as well as langpacks, but none touch bugs, so you are safe
<pitti> seb128: I have a better idea
<pitti> we merge ourselves into ~ubuntu-desktop-bug-rockers
<pitti> and then beat the didrocks team with a whopping 670 bugs!!
<pitti> take that, didrocks!
<seb128> we would kick didrocks's butt like that :p
<seb128> pitti, "left in pool: 0"
<seb128> nice the retracers managed to catch up during the night
<pitti> seb128: yeah, I happened to look at the retracer this morning at exactly the time when it was down to 5, and saw it grind down to 0 in 10 seconds
<didrocks> yeah yeah yeah ;)
<pitti> I seem to have a knack for good timing today
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> /msg didrocks for ten beer we add you to the team and we'll break the 1.000 mark
<didrocks> pitti: ten beers, are you cheap like that? ;)
<mvo> didrocks: when I have a self-build unity, is it enough to just run "./unity --replace" from ./build ?
<pitti> hey mvo
<didrocks> mvo: no, you would need to install it
<mvo> :(
<didrocks> mvo: sudo make install then
<didrocks> mvo: but!
<mvo> how do people test?
<didrocks> mvo: I did sudo unity --disto
<didrocks> distro*
<didrocks> to remove all the locally installed thingy
<pitti> hm, nobody came up with a way to run unity from the build tree?
<seb128> oh, mvo is back
<seb128> mvo, hey, how are you?
<pitti> that's like the first thing I always do when working on a source
<didrocks> pitti: not possible with compiz :/
<mvo> hello, I'm good, thanks!
<pitti> it sucks to not be able to do that
<didrocks> pitti: I meant, some work on compiz refactoring is needed
<pitti> didrocks: well, with some $COMPIZ_PLUGIN_PATH magic or what not
<pitti> of course it often needs some LD_LIBRARY_PATH and similar effort
<didrocks> there is a way to get it in ~/compiz-1, but you still need to have your images installed
<didrocks> (and the gsettings key andâ¦)
<mvo> didrocks: its a core chang to the launcher for the s-c integration, still needs a full install?
<didrocks> mvo: what you are testing?
<mvo> didrocks: unity launcher integration issu(es)
<didrocks> mvo: don't start frightning me with changes in the s-c integration, we just got a fix
<didrocks> mvo: you mean, the issue on intel, like your session being screwed?
<didrocks> (all display not working)
<mvo> didrocks: no, much simpler, just that the signal handler does not track success vs failure of the install and adds the launcher unconditionally
<mvo> didrocks: even on error or cancel
<mvo> didrocks: tiny chnage
<didrocks> mvo: ok, not the same issue then. SRU for that one ;)
<didrocks> mvo: you need to make install I'm afraid
<mvo> didrocks: ok, so could I just copy the one "launcher" binary easily?
<seb128> mvo, you can probably sudo cp unityshell.so over the system version and restart compiz
<didrocks> seb128: mvo: no
<didrocks> that doesn't work
<seb128> didrocks, ?
<didrocks> mvo: you will need to symlink /usr/local/share/unity so /usr/share/unity if you do that
<seb128> didrocks, the code is not in the unity binary?
<didrocks> as unity will look for assets in /usr/local/
<seb128> didrocks, well when I say "system version" it's the /usr one, the one shipped by the package
<didrocks> that's why I did sudo unity --distro which is easier to revert to the distro state
<seb128> that's how I would do it anyway
<seb128> just copy over the distro .so
<seb128> and install --reinstall unity when done
<mvo> didrocks: can I give it a build prefix?
<didrocks> seb128: still, if you compile, but default PREFIX=/usr/local and unityshell plugin will look at this one
<didrocks> seb128: wherever it is
<didrocks> mvo: -DCMAKE_PREFIX_PATH=/usr should work
<didrocks> (last time I checked, but compiz is doing some override in its cmake file and it changed a lot in the precise cycle)
<mvo> didrocks: thanks a bunch
<didrocks> mvo: btw, the shell binary is libunityshell.so FYI :)
<mvo> didrocks: I really haven't moved with the recent c++ goodness, but seeing that you can (apparently) almost have inline callbacks in SoftwareCenterLancherIcon.cpp (to connect to the finished sigal) is pretty cool
<mvo> my patch build!
 * mvo uploads it
<didrocks> sure sure, upload :p
<didrocks> mvo: indeed, you can have inline callbacks, this is nice ;)
<mvo> didrocks: that is c++0x, right? the lambda stuff?
<didrocks> mvo: right, lambdas are part of c++0x, look as wel as the Ptr:: template, it's great to have ref that are not weaks ;)
<mvo> didrocks: nice, I think I need to do a bit more c++ again (boy, I never thought that I would say this ;)
<didrocks> mvo: bored with python? ;)
<mvo> didrocks: I still love it, but its a bit on the slow side
<mvo> didrocks: I have a branch for you guys for the USC stuff
<didrocks> mvo: please propose against lp:unity, it will be reviewed :)
<didrocks> (we mandate tests btw)
<Sweetshark> moin!
<dpm> pitti, I've just noticed that yesterday's language pack export is a full one, as it picked up your "full export" request. I'd still like to request one today, as it's the deadline expected by translators, but we can use the one from yesterday for testing or as a fallback if something goes wrong.
<dpm> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+language-packs
<dpm> (assuming it got exported correctly :)
<dpm> brb
<pitti> dpm: yes, I agree
<pitti> dpm: I ticked "request full export" again
<dpm> ok, cool
<pitti> kamstrup: hey
<pitti> kamstrup: are you still interested in gnome bug 667244?
<ubot2> Gnome bug 667244 in introspection "Arrays of variants passed from C to Python always marshal to empty arrays" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=667244
<pitti> kamstrup: if you are, and you want to update the patches to current git, I can promise you a timely review
<Sweetshark> pitti: any hints on bug 919659. oneiric without updates and 3.4.6-0ubuntu1~ppa1 => no bug, oneiric with all updates installed and 3.4.6-0ubuntu1~ppa1 => bug, oneiric reenabling the update repositories in the sources.list one by one from bottom up => no bug
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 919659 in libreoffice "Can't open/save document or spreadsheet with password" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/919659
<Sweetshark> pitti: seems some other package fubared their maintainer script slightly
<kamstrup> pitti: yeah, still interested, i'll see if I can find some time to forward port them
<pitti> Sweetshark: with "... and 3.4.6..." you mean "updated from oneiric-proposed to precise plus that PPA?
<Sweetshark> pitti: nope, on oneiric only. I dont see this on precise.
<pitti> Sweetshark: I did a glimpse on the bug trail, but it's too long to read and understand quickly
<pitti> Sweetshark: what does password decryption have to do with maintscripts?
<pitti> Sweetshark: could be that some libnss version in oneiric-updates causes this?
<pitti> hm, libnss3/libnspr4 are unchanged in oneiric-updates
<pitti> you should ask for comparing the package versions of all dependencies
<pitti> "dpkg -l" output before/after
<pitti> didrocks: unity ready to copy, want to or shall I?
<Sweetshark> pitti: yes, libnss or some related security package. or some different package (maybe firefox/thunderbird) doing some registration stuff or somesuch against libnss on update.
<didrocks> pitti: I have an available slot to do it today :)
<didrocks> today/now ;)
<ochosi> hi everyone, i have a quick question wrt gtk-themes not showing up in unity's theme selector, already tried the -design channel, where could i ask?
<ochosi> *else
<pitti> seb128: btw, orca has a lot of changes, I'm not comfortable with uploading 3.4.1 without proper testing; so I think I'll leave that to TheMuso and an SRU
<pitti> ah, gnome-user-docs finally syncs at last
 * pitti does
<seb128> pitti, ok, works for me
<pitti> seb128: do you still see anything urgent? versions.html looks quite fine here
<Sweetshark> pitti: would it be possible to SRU libreoffice 3.4.6 as is as a) the bug also shows in the current 3.4.4 in oneiric and b) likely is not caused by libreoffice itself and would need fixing elsewhere?
<seb128> pitti, no, I don't think anything this week was "urgent" in any case, just "bonus"
<seb128> pitti, I think we are good
<pitti> Sweetshark: sure; however, even 3.4.5 didn't make it out of -proposed yet
<Sweetshark> pitti: yes, because of that.
<pitti> Sweetshark: bug 915223 is v-failed
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 915223 in libreoffice "Update LibreOffice on oneiric to 3.4.5" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/915223
<Sweetshark> bug 915223 is not a regression 3.4.4 -> 3.4.5 -- it is a regression injected somewhere else and also affects 3.4.4
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 915223 in libreoffice "Update LibreOffice on oneiric to 3.4.5" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/915223
<Sweetshark> pitti: arggh. no thats not quite true. I see no bug report for 3.4.4. So: 3.4.4 with or without updates -> no bug, 3.4.5/6 without updates -> no bug, 3.4.5/6 with updates -> bug.
<Sweetshark> *sigh*
<pitti> ok, so it's a regression after all
<Sweetshark> yeah. I should just have been quicker with the 3.4.5 update. than it would be the trouble of the guy who did the changes causing it.
<didrocks> Sweetshark: btw, did you see my ping last week about the libroffice quicklist bug not being translated?
<Sweetshark> didrocks: known issue
<didrocks> Sweetshark: do you see any way to get it fixed? what we did at the time was setting up a wiki page for firefox as it wasn't using some po files
<didrocks> pitti: you were reminded of the meeting and the report page, do you desperatly want another reminder (and a hug) or I deleted your email without noticing? ;)
<pitti> didrocks: argh, forgot; doing now
<chrisccoulson> oh, my. i've just a second delivery of beer to my house. except, i didn't order this one :/
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: did you have to pay for it? :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i think it's probably a gift from someone
<didrocks> or firefox submitting twice :p
<Sweetshark> didrocks: the stuff is in, but the patch needs a fix
<chrisccoulson> it has one of these in it: http://www.brewdog.com/product/tactical-nuclear-penguin
<chrisccoulson> someone obviously knows what i like! :)
<didrocks> Sweetshark: so, it's under work? :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: heh, great ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you maybe got some firefox users thanking you for all the work you do? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, they're from my parents ;)
<chrisccoulson> i just phoned them
<seb128> lol
<seb128> there go the happy user theory :p
<chrisccoulson> seb128, https://twitter.com/#!/chrisccoulson/status/192209221775917056/photo/1 ;)
<chrisccoulson> right, now to go back to looking at scrollbars
<seb128> chrisccoulson, now is not beer'o'clock yet!
<chrisccoulson> heh
<seb128> though you might need one if you start looking at the scrollbars
<chrisccoulson> yes, this could drive me to drink
<seb128> oh!
<seb128> hum, no, ignore me ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, pitti, others: retracers dups list since yesterday (I ran it again due to the i386 backlog since it was broken between saturday and yesterday evening):
<seb128> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/933854/
<didrocks> looking :)
<seb128> ups, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/933856/
<seb128> well same list mostly
<didrocks> yeah, seems mostly the same
<seb128> in fact it's the same, I though I had copied the wrong one first but no :p
<seb128> the top is similar to yesterday's as well
<didrocks> heh :)
<seb128> i.e no "surprise"
<didrocks> good good!
<seb128> it's a bit surprising to see openbox in there ;-)
<didrocks> indeed, it's maybe the new hype, we should tell it to the omgubuntu people :)
<ogra_> didrocks, FYI c-p-e did build now
<ogra_> (on arm that is)
<didrocks> ogra_: oh? didn't notice
<ogra_> ricardo just disabled all GL plugins in the arm builds :)
<didrocks> ogra_: ahah, quite radical ;)
<didrocks> ogra_: ah, it's not uploaded
<ogra_> it is
<didrocks> I thought it was :)
<ogra_> last night
 * didrocks refreshes launchpad
<didrocks> ah, here we got
<didrocks> go*
<didrocks> ogra_: looks fine to me, good move :)
<ogra_> :)
<ogra_> i doubt anyone will notice though ...
<didrocks> ogra_: I doubt as well, but a lot of people noticed on i386 and am64 when the ABI break :)
<didrocks> ogra_: can you pull the change in the vcs?
<didrocks> ogra_: lp:~compiz/compizfusion-plugins-extra/ubuntu
<ogra_> is c-p-e also maintained the same way ?
<ogra_> k
<didrocks> it is for simplicity
<didrocks> as we need to rebuild it at each ABI break, easier for tracking
<ogra_> yup
<didrocks> thanks :)
<pitti> seb128: argh at the nautilus xcb_io thingy
<seb128> pitti, the _XAllocID one?
<seb128> yes, hate it, I get a least one dup a day in my mailbox
<pitti> yes; this seems to be a multi-thread race
<seb128> not sure
<seb128> it happens with i.e apport, update-notifier, gnome-control-center
<seb128> looking at my firefox awesome bar list when typing _XAllocID
<didrocks> some people should really not file bugs when they are drunk: bug #981308
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 981308 in oneconf "oneconf-service crashed with OSError in save_json_file_update(): [Errno 2] No such file or directory" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/981308
<didrocks> it's interesting that this can crash though:
<didrocks> new_file = file_uri + '.new'
<didrocks> with open(new_file, 'w') as f:
<didrocks>     json.dump(content, f)
<didrocks> os.rename(new_file, file_uri)
<didrocks> mvo: pitti: do you have any idea what can happen that json doesn't give any error and os.rename still raise an OSError? ^
<pitti> didrocks: the directory might not be writable?
<didrocks> pitti: in that case, json.dump will error first, isn't it?
<pitti> didrocks: oh, no, "no such file or dir"
<pitti> didrocks: perhaps file_uri is an actual URI?
<pitti> you can't rename something to file:///foo or http:/// foo
<pitti> didrocks: i. e. the name might have a slash in it? what is file_url?
<didrocks> pitti: it shouldn't, it should be /home/user/.cache/oneconf/<id>/<something>
<pitti> ok, then the name is misleading
<pitti> didrocks: but I'd say theh directory of file_uri does not exist
<didrocks> yeah, I need to rename it
<pitti> it's the "90% likely" explanation
<pitti> oh, wait
<didrocks> pitti: file_uri is what it will be written to, right?
<pitti> I disreagarded the first line
<pitti> i. e. new_file =
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> it's just dumping and renaming
<pitti> didrocks: could file_uri be a dangling symlink?
<didrocks> pitti: shouldn't as I created it in the first place the same way
<pitti> that or some other process removing the file in between are the only off-hand explanations that I have
<pitti> didrocks: then I'm afraid this needs an strace
<didrocks> yeah
<pitti> but no dupes, so most likely hard to find out
<didrocks> right
<pitti> and given the tone of the description the reporter might not be too keen on running strace
<pitti> or figuring out what happened
<didrocks> pitti: that's one of my concern :)
<didrocks> I'll ask him if he can reproduce and run strace if he can
<didrocks> then incomplete and we'll see ;)
<pitti> good luck
<didrocks> heh ;)
<seb128> Sweetshark, hi, I assigned you bug #926940, it's a trivial 1 liner fix to a .desktop, would be nice to get in the next upload
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 926940 in libreoffice "Visio files not associated with LibreOffice Draw" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/926940
<seb128> jbicha, pitti, dpm: is the ubuntu desktop guide supposed to be translated through langpacks? or does it need an export and upload?
<seb128> i.e an import from the po in a source package because it builds localized xml
<matanya> yohoo
<matanya> is here the place to wonder how chooses what gets to be default app in the desktop?
<dpm> hi seb128, no, it's not supposed to be translatable, but thanks for checking it out!
<dpm> we disabled it in Launchpad a while ago
<seb128> dpm, how so it's not supposed to be translatable?
<seb128> dpm, you mean our desktop documentation is english only?
<seb128> dpm, how broken is that?!
<dpm> seb128, ah, wait, we're talking of different things, I think :)
<seb128> dpm, I'm talking about what you get if you run "help" from the dash
<dpm> ah, that's the ubuntu-docs package, which is indeed translated
<seb128> dpm, well not here, I was trying to figure how to debug ;-)
<dpm> generally the docs team (I think mdke) takes care of the uploads, but I think the final upload hasn't happened yet
<pitti> seb128: I think it's more complicated -- in general, the translated help is built during package build
<seb128> dpm, like if that was supposed to be in langpacks or we lack an upload with exported translations
<pitti> seb128: but we strip out translated help and stuff them into the langpacksc
<seb128> pitti, ok, so we need an upload with an export
<seb128> ?
<pitti> seb128: yes, I guess so
<seb128> pitti, thanks ;-)
<seb128> jbicha, hey, do you know if that's planned? ^
<dpm> yes, but I would have thought the docs team would have taken care of it last week, it seems it hasn't happened yet:
<dpm> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-docs/+publishinghistory
<dpm> which means if language packs are exported today, there is probably no time to get the ubuntu-docs translations imported into LP and exported into the final language packs
<dpm> hm :/
<seb128> dpm, thanks, I will follow up with jbicha
<seb128> :-(
<dpm> I'd like to release language packs very shortly after release, which will contain the translations, but it would have been nice to include them into the final images
<pitti> bbiab
<dpm> seb128, if you follow up with jbicha, and you guys do the upload, let me know. Perhaps we can get LP to prioritize the translations exports and get them there on time, but it might be quite tricky
<seb128> dpm, thanks
<seb128> hum
<seb128> dpm, pitti:
<seb128> $ dpkg -L language-pack-fr-base | grep ubuntu-docs
<seb128> /usr/share/locale-langpack/fr/LC_MESSAGES/kubuntu-docs-directory.mo
<seb128> /usr/share/locale-langpack/fr/LC_MESSAGES/kubuntu-docs-kubuntu-docs.mo
<seb128> $
<seb128> that seems buggy
<jbicha> I don't have direct upload rights for ubuntu-docs
<seb128> jbicha, hey, do you know what's the deal with translations there? are they supposed to come as translated xml in langpacks or...?
<seb128> well I don't think my issue is lack of uploads
<jbicha> they're part of the lang packs
<seb128> like the 12.04.3 upload is recent enough
<seb128> jbicha, how are they named?
<seb128> jbicha, I don't find them in my langpacks
<seb128> hum
<jbicha> they should be in /usr/share/help/fr/ubuntu-help
<seb128> so /usr/share/help-langpack/de/ubuntu-help/about-this-guide.page
<seb128> why don't we get the same for french
<jbicha> seb128: oh you're German today?
<seb128> jbicha, no, but I've one for de and not one for fr!
<jbicha> maybe you should be!
<seb128> I blame it on pitti
<seb128> yeah, I can feel a trap there ;-)
<seb128> jbicha, how much did pitti and mvo pay you? ;-)
<jbicha> dpm: what is involved in doing the ubuntu-docs upload for translations? will LP automatically merge in the latest translations or do they have to be manually injected into the package before upload?
<mvo> dpm: hi, I'm sure I asked this before, but https://translations.launchpad.net/ddtp-ubuntu/+imports shows a bunch of files in "needs-review" state, who does the review and when?
<matanya> is here the place to wonder who chooses what gets to be default app in the desktop?
<seb128> matanya, sort of, we usually use the mailing list for discussion, it's less restricted fir participants than IRC (like you don't need to be online at the time it's discussed), we discuss it at the ubuntu developer submit as well
<seb128> matanya, why?
<dpm> hey mvo, looking...
<matanya> I though to suggest clementine for default music-player
<matanya> *thought
<Laney> hoho
<matanya> seb128: just not sure where or to whom
<ogra_> matanya, note that for such a change you need to take a ton of things into account (is the toolkit it uses on the CD already, if not, weher does the space for the toolkit come from, does it work with the sound-indicator menu, if not, who will implement that function, is it integrated with the ubuntu musoc store ... etc etc)
<seb128> matanya, emails https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-desktop/ with a rational of why you think we should use it, what pro it has, how active are upstream, if they are willing to support it in Ubuntu, etc
<matanya> well, all is answered, as far as I know
<matanya> can I share some thought here?
<seb128> where?
<ogra_> so its not a "oh, lets switch to that shiny app because its cool" thing, but a lot of stuff that has to be taken into account for such a switcdh
<seb128> sure
<seb128> to start clementine is written in Qt right?
<seb128> which means look and feel different from our other apps
<seb128> that's not a blocker but something to thing about
<mlankhorst> clementine <3
<ogra_> is it Qt ? i thought it was efl
<dpm> mvo, in principle, if there is a template for the translations, LP will import them directly and you shouldn't worry about them. Right now the overall imports queue is quite full, so it might take a while to import them. Did you do a manual upload of translations, or did you commit them to the branch?
<matanya> well, it is in the sources already, very mature, supports many music sources, works with the sound indicator
<matanya> even has a scope for use in the unity-shell
<seb128> right, all of that banshee and rhythmbox have as well ;-)
<seb128> and they use our standard toolkit
<ogra_> i didnt mean to disappoint you with my words above ... there are just many things to think about before doing a switch :)
<matanya> and they are much heavier and bloated
<matanya> not to mention banshee uses mono
<ogra_> so you will firstly need a mail discussion (or show up at the developer summit in person or remotely), other people might bring up other issues etc
<seb128> matanya, did you try rhythmbox? it might have defaults but bloated is not one
<ogra_> banshee is out
<seb128> matanya, it's written in C and quite efficient
<matanya> it took about 3.5 minutes to open on my 11.10, and drank 3.5gig of ram
<seb128> matanya, well anyway that's why those discussions are better on list and with a strong argumentation rational on what we would win
<matanya> I see your point
<matanya> though no dought qt isn't a good Idea
<dobey> oh not another default music player argument
<mvo> dpm: commited them to a branch
<mvo> dpm: how long is long? hours? days?
<tjaalton> how can I make g_debug() messages shown on the terminal or a logfile? G_DEBUG=foo doesn't seem to cut it
<matanya> dobey: don't worry, I'm done
<seb128> tjaalton, G_DEBUG_MESSAGES=all ...
<tjaalton> seb128: ahh, thanks
<dpm> mvo, I'd say a couple of days with the current state of the queue. Let me pm you the same info I gave Riddell earlier on
<seb128> tjaalton, or "all" -> "domain"
<seb128> dpm, jbicha: I need help to understand that ubuntu-docs langpack magic
<seb128> dpm, jbicha: where,how "/usr/share/help-langpack/<locale>/ubuntu-help/about-this-guide.page" are built?
<dpm> seb128, I don't know much about how the package is built, only the overall process:
<dpm> 1. Translations need to be exported
<dpm> 2. The package gets uploaded and built with the po files
<dpm> 3. Launchpad imports the translated xml files
<seb128> ok, so they are built from the source and collected on the builders
<seb128> so the source needs an export from launchpad
<dpm> 4. Language pack export picks up the translated xml files
 * jbicha heading out for 15 minutes
<seb128> jbicha, stay here!!! ;-)
<dpm> 5. Langpack-o-matick produces the language packs containing the translated xml files
<seb128> dpm, ok, I think I got it, it's all based on the source to build with updated translations
<seb128> so we need an upload with a current export
<seb128> so the updated xml go through the system
<seb128> upload = package upload and build, which generates the translated xmls, which are sent through the archive
<tjaalton> seb128: doesn't seem to work either, and google didn't give any hits about it
<seb128> tjaalton, what are you trying to do?
<seb128> tjaalton, is that g-s-d?
<tjaalton> seb128: see the messages from g-s-d
<tjaalton> but wait
<seb128> tjaalton, G_MESSAGES_DEBUG=all gnome-settings-daemon --debug ?
<tjaalton> ahah :)
<tjaalton> there we go
<tjaalton> thanks
<seb128> tjaalton, yw
<dpm> seb128, also if you are working on the upload and want to bypass waiting for LP to give you the PO files, you can fetch them from the automatic exports branch: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-doc/ubuntu-docs/precise-translations - the only caveat is that you'll need to put them in the right place in the source tree for the package (which you'd also have to do if you were exporting a translations tarball from LP anyway)
<seb128> dpm, well, I'm trying to get a reply to one of the ubuntu-docs guys, I get they have an auto export configured in some way?
<seb128> dpm, i.e a script or something that do that for them
<dpm> that's the one ^, I worked with them to set it up
<seb128> dpm, well I would like to avoid the "you need to put them in the right place of the source tree"
<seb128> why can't we just bzr merge ;-)
<seb128> like lightdm and other project have translation automerged by a bot or launchpad it seems
<seb128> but I guess that's a question for next cycle
<dpm> seb128, yeah, unfortunately it cannot be easily solved, as it follows the gnome-doc-utils layout (a folder per locale), which is different than standard gettext (flat layout, all locales in one folder). Launchpad only supports the latter.
<seb128> dpm, oh ok, that makes sense, I got the picture, thanks ;-)
<dpm> np ;-)
<seb128> dpm, thanks for all the details, I will try to pick it up from there
<dpm> excellent, thanks seb128
<seb128> jbicha, wb!
<jbicha> seb128: hi, so I'm going to try to export the ubuntu-docs translations into the ubuntu-docs branch, then I'll just need someone to upload the new package
<seb128> jbicha, you know how to do that?
<seb128> jbicha, I've an export of each locally I was just looking at it
<seb128> jbicha, can you merge in https://code.launchpad.net/~giuseppeterrasi/ubuntu-docs/fixlink/+merge/99265 while you are at it?
<jbicha> seb128: I believe you just copy the fr.po and so on into the ubuntu-help/fr/ folder
<jbicha> seb128: I can't merge that in at the moment because it would break the string freeze, it is a candidate for the SRU we'll be doing though
<seb128> jbicha, ok
<seb128> jbicha, so basically
<seb128> bzr branch lp:~ubuntu-core-doc/ubuntu-docs/precise-translations
<seb128> bzr branch lp:ubuntu-docs
<seb128> ls ubuntu-docs/ubuntu-help > list
<seb128> for locale in $(cat list); do cp precise-translations/ubuntu-help/$locale.po ubuntu-docs/ubuntu-help/$locale; done
<seb128> with list edited to remove makefile.am, etc
<seb128> jbicha, ^ that seems to work
<jbicha> ok, my bash scripting is a bit rusty but that sounds about right
<seb128> jbicha, if you want to do that, I don't have commit right
<seb128> or do you want me to publish the diff?
<seb128> I don't fancy to push an ubuntu-docs vcs copy it's not small but I can put a diff online
<jbicha> seb128: sure I'll upload your diff
<sil2100> Hi!
<seb128> sil2100, hey
<seb128> jbicha, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/ubuntu-docs.diff.gz
<seb128> jbicha, it's to gunzip and patch -0 < ubuntu-docs.diff from the ubuntu-docs dir
<seb128> jbicha, of course it would be too easy if translations were not buggy and breaking build after that :-(
<seb128> tjaalton, you can probably use i.e G_DEBUG_MESSAGES=wacom to filter to wacom debug messages
<tjaalton> seb128: tried that, but couldn't figure out what to use there
<seb128> tjaalton, well =<plugin_name> should work for gsd
<tjaalton> output looks the same
<tjaalton> even without the env variable
<seb128> tjaalton, --debug do a setenv G_DEBUG_MESSAGES
<seb128> iirc
<seb128> jbicha, ok, so el it sl are buggy, also Makefile.am had a HELP_LINGUAS = ... en_UK ... which should be en_GB
<seb128> jbicha, I did bzr revert the el one to build, doing the same on it and sl didn't work, I had to copy the versions from your previous upload (I just wanted a build done)
<seb128> jbicha, you maybe want to complete HELP_LINGUAS as well, it lists only 28 locales and there are about 50 now, I think it might mean the other ones are not built as they should
<jbicha> the only language in the Makefile.am that didn't build for me were en_UK (fixed now) and zh_TW (which I just fixed)
<seb128> jbicha, weird
<jbicha> el and sl are out of date in your diff then?
<seb128> jbicha, I just did bzr bd lp:ubuntu-docs with my diff applied
<seb128> jbicha, no, the diff was the full update
<seb128> jbicha, with the diff I did hit the issues I listed
<seb128> jbicha, they I locally hacked around them
<seb128> jbicha,
<seb128> $ dpkg -c ubuntu-docs_12.04.4_all.deb | grep help/id
<seb128> $
<seb128> so yeah, all the locales not listed in HELP_LINGUAS are not built
<seb128> I hate LINGUAS
<seb128> or how to maintain a separate list of the locales rather than just using all the .po in the dir
<jbicha> several of those other languages are very incomplete but I guess a bit of translation is better than none at all?
<jbicha> maybe it'll encourage people that speak that language to help out
<seb128> yes
<seb128> jbicha, well, fr lacks 400 strings...
<seb128> so it's not like all listed ones were great
<seb128> though the french guys were discussing how to "merge" the gnome-user-guide translations in ubuntu-docs since some are common
<seb128> dpm, ^ that's probably something we should look at automate next cycle
<dpm> seb128, I know, we've been discussing it on the mailing list. I think the ubuntu-docs tree simply needs a script to fetch the gnome-user-guide translations and merge them
<seb128> pitti, meeting time in case somebody has a topic, if you want to use your ping alias ;-)
<pitti> yep, indeed
<pitti> jasoncwarner, Sweetshark, bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, seb128, tkamppeter, pedro_, desrt, agateau: anything to discuss at the meeting?
<didrocks> nothing for me
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-04-17
<pitti> nothing here
<kenvandine> pitti, nothing here
<jbicha> seb128: hmm, you're right, the build does stop at el; I was just doing autogen.sh; make which worked though
<seb128> nothing from me either
<seb128> jbicha, ok, so I had only those 3 which is a good news :p
<seb128> stupid shell question, how do I change '\n' to ' ' in a file? like I can to concatenate lines
<chrisccoulson> oh, fantastic. my esta doesn't expire until august
<seb128> chrisccoulson, lucky you, mine experied in january, need to pay :p
<Laney> I wonder if I need another one if it turns out my passport is lost ...
<seb128> Laney, yes
<Laney> bah
 * Laney needs to look harder
<seb128> Laney, you need new one if you change address, passport, or any of the infos "linked" to the esta
<seb128> Laney, well I would say that if you lost your passport you have another issue ;-)
<seb128> can you get a new one on short delay?
<Laney> yes, there's a one week service
<seb128> oh, lucky you
<Laney> which I will invoke if I do not find it before, say, Friday
<seb128> in France you are screwed if that happens
<seb128> it takes like over a month and no short line
<seb128> unping for the shell question
<seb128> tr '\n' ' ' for the win
<chrisccoulson> nice! i'm not sure you can even do that with sed, can you?
<seb128> jbicha, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/934150/
<seb128> jbicha, that's the new language list I'm testing
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm not sure, you can do anything with sed if you know enough magic :p
<seb128> but I don't
<seb128> I tend to | in awk and tr
<chrisccoulson> wow, https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=733892#c28 is crazy
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 733892 in Widget "crash aswJsFlt.dll (Avast) and Ant extension" [Critical,New: ]
<seb128> chrisccoulson, lol
<seb128> they patch binaries?
<seb128> inline?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, apparently some anti-virus vendors do
<seb128> utch
<seb128> jbicha, good news is that none of the new locales create build issues
<jbicha> seb128: yeah I've added all of those now too, and am trying to fix the remaining build issues
<jbicha> seb128: any idea about what this means? http://paste.ubuntu.com/934171/
<desrt> jbicha: maybe missing encoding header in the .po file?
<seb128> jbicha, no, seems to be an invalid char somewhere in that file?
<seb128> jbicha, ok, found it
<seb128> jbicha, I think I found both, test building
<seb128> jbicha, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/934217/
<seb128> jbicha, those are the fixes
<seb128> micahg, hi, could you look at bug #956124?
<ubot2> seb128: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/956124)
<seb128> bug #956124
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 956124 in blueman "nautilus-sendto crashed with SIGSEGV in g_return_if_fail_warning()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/956124
<seb128> micahg, since you are the one who uploaded the new version
<seb128> i.e the closer from a maintainer in Ubuntu for it ;-)
<micahg> hmm...blueman seems very overreaching, I'm tempted to just add a NotShowIn: GNOME; Unity to it
<seb128> micahg, that will not fix that
<seb128> micahg, it installs a buggy .so in nautilus-sendto's directory
<seb128> which makes it segfault for all users who have blueman installed
<seb128> micahg, I'm tempted to make a Conflicts blueman on nautilus-sendto :p
<micahg> oh, wow, didn't notice that, yeah :)
 * micahg checks the new Debian version to see if it still does that
<micahg> the version in Debian does not, I"m quite confused, let me look into this
<micahg> ah, there's a configure flag for it, I can just disable it
<micahg> seb128: ok, I'll should be able to fix this later today, I think the answer will be just to not install those files (Debian doesn't seem to in any event)
<seb128> micahg, ok, thanks
<jbicha> seb128: did you want to do the ubuntu-docs upload? rev. 130 has the latest fixes in it
<seb128> jbicha, I can do
<mterry> seb128, whoops, missed the meeting.  Was there anything discussed?
<seb128> mterry, hey, no, there was no agenda so no meeting
<seb128> jbicha, you can change UNRELEASED to precise and debcommit -r push (I don't have commit rights to that vcs)
<jbicha> I hope the extra translated screenshots for ubuntu-docs don't cause a problem
<pitti> good night everyone
<pitti> good night everyone
<ogra_> pitti, a repititive night to you too :)
<mvo> glatzor: hi, re your python-apt branch
<glatzor> servus mvo!
<mvo> hey glatzor
<seb128> mterry, hey
<mterry> seb128, saw the crasher you assigned
<seb128> mterry, heh, you are quick to pick emails up, I just wanted to ask if that you have time for it ... it's SRU material, no hurry, but feel free to bounce back if you have too much to do already
<mterry> seb128, you're French, eh?  Do you have any layout issues in precise?  Bug 960096 seems to be rearing again for French users
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 960096 in libxklavier "Live session started with wrong layout" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/960096
<seb128> mterry, no, you must confuse me with somebody else, I'm german, did you mean didrocks?
<seb128> mterry, (reading the bug)
<mterry> seb128, wait, don't you live in France?
<seb128> mterry, depends when in time
<seb128> ;-)
 * mterry didn't mean to open a can of worms.  ;)
<seb128> mterry, joke aside that bug is confusing and seems to mix several issues, liveCD and installed,upgraded system
<mterry> seb128, yup!  And it's been fixed several times
<seb128> mterry, my user account is fucked keyboard wise, I keep it broken for debugging but I don't know if that's your issue
<mterry> seb128, but I do get some odd behavior on latest live cds with french
<seb128> mterry, for me it's stucked in french
<seb128> like using the indicator or keybindings to change to a us or de layout doesn't work
<seb128> but setxkbmap de or us works
<seb128> the indicator never "apply" any change
<mterry> seb128, interesting, that's not far off from what I'm seeing on livecd
<seb128> like the label will change to "us" but they actual layout will still be fr
<mterry> seb128, oh goodness, you could throw a stone from your house and hit Germany
<seb128> dholbach had the same issue with "no" on her gf account it seems
<seb128> mterry, ;-)
 * mterry moves his mental model of seb128 from "Frenchy" to "Very German Frenchy"
<seb128> damn you google, showing people where I live on your maps! ;-)
<seb128> mterry, so back to this bug, I've this weird layout issue that I intend to try debug at some point, not sure it's the same bug that the one you pointed though
<mterry> seb128, not sure either, but description sounds the same (label changes, but layout doesn't)
<seb128> mterry, oh, and you won a second g-s-d power segfault bug, same as the other one, would be nice to fix in GNOME 3.4.2 and a SRU but feel free to ignore it
<seb128> mterry, let me know if I can help debugging the layout stuff
<mterry> seb128, but I'm having a hard time with the layouts because I don't know what they are supposed to behave exactly.  :)
<seb128> you can click "display layout map" in the indicator
<mterry> seb128, yeah, but there are four characters per key.  most of them look the same as english, but how do I get third and fourth character?
<seb128> but french is basically doing a<->q z<->w
<seb128> urg
<seb128> in practice you don't need to go further than the second char, but I think the layout displayed in the chart has extra ones
<seb128> mterry, so for non number keys you care usually about the 2 on the left and you get the second (bottom left) one using shift+key
<mterry> seb128, is it common for caps lock to be a layout switcher for french users?
<mterry> seb128, a/q is a good tell though, i see that now
<seb128> mterry, aq zw and m being next to "l" are the most useful ones
<mterry> seb128, alright, well, I'm going to dig into this layout stuff over the g-s-d ones because this will affect the CD
<seb128> if you don't get into , . :
<seb128> mterry, right, as said I don't think we would upload the gsd stuff before SRU anyway
<seb128> mterry, if zou qre in the
<seb128> ups
<seb128> mterry, if you are in the same broken state that my user account you can "setxkbmap us" from it
<seb128> to have an usable keyboard
<seb128> then try to change to french
<seb128> and see if "q" does print a "a" or a "q"
<seb128> setxkbmap changes the layout but it's still broken
<seb128> i.e it wont let you change back to fr
<mterry> k
<seb128> it might be easier to debug than to fight an azerty layout ;-)
<seb128> mterry, it's very strange though, my issue seems to be config specific, like it happens only to my main account on that box and it happen always
<mterry> seb128, in livecd, user gets stuck with us layout and can't change out of it
<seb128> mterry, does "setxkbmap fr" works?
<mterry> seb128, yes
<seb128> ok, same as me
<mterry> seb128, do you use autologin?
<seb128> mterry, no, I use ecryptfs on that account
<mterry> seb128, ok, this is the third distinct flaw in this same bug then.  ah well
<mterry> seb128, what is the output of: gsettings get org.gnome.libgnomekbd.keyboard layouts
<seb128> ['fr\toss', 'de', 'gb']
 * mterry has a guess that the variant is confusing things
 * mterry reboots
<mterry> scratch that, middle of long download
<Darxus> What's a good version for a ppa package of gtk for precise with wayland enabled?  3.4.1-0ubuntu0~wayland1?
<seb128> Darxus, you usually want a version newer than the archive one so people using your ppa get the update
<seb128> Darxus, i.e 3.4.1-0ubuntu1.0~wayland1 or something like that
<ayan> does anyone know where the default gsettings property for brasero plugins is initialized?
<seb128> Darxus, dpkg --compare-version 2 gt 1; echo $?
<seb128> ayan, hey, I doubt we have any brasero hacker here
<Darxus> seb128: Ah, I didn't realize 3.4.1 had been packaged, thanks.
<seb128> Darxus, yw
<Darxus> And I just got the freaking thing building with the 3.4.0 packaging :P
<mterry> seb128, if you want your system to be temporarily sane, remove French (Alternate) with just French
<mterry> seb128, the variant seems to cause it.  Affects unity-greeter and the session itself
<seb128> mterry, thanks for the hint, I didn't realize my second user account fr was "fr" and not "fr oss"
<Darxus> dpkg-source: error: can't build with source format '3.0 (quilt)': no upstream tarball found at ../gtk+3.0_3.4.1-0ubuntu1.orig.tar.{bz2,gz,lzma,xz}
<Darxus> Why is it looking for that, instead of ../gtk+3.0_3.4.1.orig.tar.xz, which is there?
<micahg> Darxus: you can't use - in the Debian part of the revision
<micahg> s/revision/version
<Darxus> micahg: I don't understand how your statement relates to my problem.  I'd like it to ignore the "-" and everything after it when looking for the orig tarball, sounds like you're saying that's what it should do.
<micahg> Darxus: what's your version in the changelog?
<Darxus> 3.4.1-0ubuntu1-wayland1
<micahg> Darxus: right, that second - should be a +
<Darxus> Ohh, I should take out the second dash?
<Darxus> Thanks.
<mterry> RAOF, you around?
<mterry> RAOF, looking at some odd errors with X layout maps
<mterry> RAOF, specifically, getting "key types not defined" when trying to have xkbfile extension use the "fr oss" layout
<mterry> (or anyone here that knows X well)
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-04-18
<RAOF> Whoops, just missed mterry.
<jbicha> wow, my terminal crashed in the middle of my build :(
<robert_ancell> jbicha, gtk3?
<jbicha> robert_ancell: no I was just building gnome-shell
<desrt> RAOF: hey!
<RAOF> desrt: Yo!
<RAOF> Oh, wow.  That router really wanted a reboot.
<desrt> RAOF: i just discovered something cool from wikipedia
<desrt> RAOF: you're one of the few non-canadians who is likely to understand me when i say "i didn't pay my bill, so they cut off my hydro."
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> It's no longer called the hydro in Tassie, though; it got the three-part split a decade ago or so.
<desrt> they still use the name here
<desrt> even though it's 75% untrue these days
<RAOF> What was called the HEC is now Transend, Aurora, and... some other company, which actually owns the dams.
<desrt> ah.  like that.
<RAOF> Yeah.
<desrt> i thought you meant three sources
<RAOF> Oh, no.
<desrt> like hydro/nuclear/coal
<desrt> which is sort of how the situation is in ontario
<RAOF> As far as I know, it's still almost all hydro, with a peaking gas plant at Bell Bay, and a connection to the national grid via a submarine cable to Victoria.
<RAOF> Which means that there's coal/wind/solar in there, too, but in aggregate :)
<desrt> most of canada is hydro
<desrt> but ontario has a lot of nuclear
<desrt> we're just about done with the coal, fortunately
<desrt> but ya... gas as well
<pitti> Good morning
<desrt> pitti: good morning
<RAOF> Hey pitti
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> hey didrocks
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti, how are you?
<pitti> quite fine, thanks! yourself?
<didrocks> I'm fine as well ;) grey weather outside, still rainy and it seems it will become worse in the follow hours. All good reasons to stay home :)
<BigWhale> Good Morning.
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<pitti> quite fine, thanks! how are you?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, good thanks
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson!
<Sweetshark> moin!
<pitti> Sweetshark: oh hai!
<didrocks> hi Sweetshark
<Sweetshark> pitti, didrocks, seb128: https://launchpad.net/~bjoern-michaelsen/+archive/libreoffice-precisetest-20120327/+sourcepub/2385065/+listing-archive-extra <- this should fix one bug you nagged me about (didrocks: quicklists, pitti: -kde/-gnome suggests, seb128: visio mime for LibreOffice Draw)
<dpm> hey pitti, good morning. You've probably seen it, but the full langpack export finished this morning \o/ have you had a look whether the ubuntu-docs xml translations are there?
<dpm> Otherwise I can have a look at it myself
<Sweetshark> dpm: oh, you were interested in that too: l10n for quicklists is "fix commited"
<pitti> dpm: yes, I saw; I started the build some 15 minutes ago
<pitti> dpm: ubutu-docs xml trnaslations are not in teh LP export, langapck-o-matic downloads them directly from LP (see my mail replies to mdke)
<pitti> (argh typing!)
<dpm> ah, gotcha, good to know, thanks pitti!
<pitti> Sweetshark: great, thanks! this should probably become an SRU at this point, given the build times, but as this is going to -proposed anyway, we could still consider moving it into final
 * dpm hugs Sweetshark
<dpm> that's awesome, thanks for getting this in, that will make non-English users happy!
<pitti> micahg: o/
<micahg> pitti: so, there's a sendto feature for blueman that we decided to disable as it's breaking nautilus-sendto, the problem is that the flag isn't recognized when passed through DEB_CONFIGURE_EXTRA_FLAGS, it looks like the feature is written improperly in .ac, but I'm not sure offhand how to regenerate configure with CDBS without dh-autoreconf which just seems to do everything twice
<micahg> AC_ARG_ENABLE(sendto,
<micahg> [  --enable-sendto=[yes/no] Enable nautilus-sendto plugin build],,have_nst=no)
<micahg> oops, was originally yes at the end
<Sweetshark> pitti: right. I will make that an 3.5.2-2ubuntu2 for proposed.
<pitti> micahg: a mere DEB_CONFIGURE_EXTRA_FLAGS = --disable-sendto doesn't work then?
<micahg> nope
<pitti> micahg: err, --enable-sendto=no
<pitti> that's odd
<micahg> well, in theory from what I read, both should work, but neither does
<pitti> micahg: so, if you patch the configure.ac, including /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/autoreconf.mk ought to be sufficient
<micahg> if I read the docs correctly (which is a big if at this hour), the last option to AC_ARG_ENABLE is the ELSE clause (i.e. no feature)
<pitti> and adding dh-autoreconf build dep
<micahg> pitti: it includes gnome.mk
<pitti> sure, but gnome.mk doesn't include autoreconf
<micahg> I tried with dh-autoreconf but not with that and fixing the ELSE clause to no
 * micahg tries now
 * pitti has a closer look at the autoconf bit
<micahg> Nautilus sendto plugin enabled: yes
<pitti> argh
<pitti> micahg:
<pitti> have_nst=yes
<pitti> AC_ARG_ENABLE(sendto,
<pitti> [  --enable-sendto=[yes/no] Enable nautilus-sendto plugin build],,have_nst=yes)
<pitti> micahg: there is nothing that ever sets this to "no" :)
<micahg> right, so I changed the final bit to no instead of yes, but I think I just wanted to no in the middle there
<pitti> so your patch seems correct
<micahg> pitti: it generates as this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/935105/
<Sweetshark> hmmmm, "wc -l debian/patches/series == 38" -- some upstreaming checking for q is in order.
<micahg> which seems to tell me I did it backwards
<micahg> Nautilus sendto plugin enabled: no \o/
<micahg> I did do it backwards :)
<pitti> ok, I tried something shorter, but that didn't quite work; /me tests teh proper approach
<micahg> pitti: I've got the patch now, I just hope it doesn't break something for Xubuntu or Lubuntu now :)
<micahg> pitti: thanks
<pitti> micahg: http://paste.ubuntu.com/935110/ confirmed to work in all three cases here
<pitti> I tried [  --enable-sendto=[yes/no] Enable nautilus-sendto plugin build],have_nst=$enable_val,have_nst=yes)
<pitti> but that's not quite correct
<pitti> as enable_val is "" for --disable-sendto
<micahg> pitti: I did this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/935105/
<micahg> oops, that's the old one
<micahg> http://paste.ubuntu.com/935111/
<seb128> hey
<pitti> micahg: does that really work with --enable-sendto ?
<pitti> hey seb128
<didrocks> salut seb128 :)
<didrocks> seb128: happy thursdsay \o/
<pitti> seb128: do you happen to have another bug to fix?
<seb128> hey pitti didrocks, how are you?
<micahg> yes, I have--enable-sendto=no set right now
<didrocks> seb128: I'm fine, it's thursday ;)
<didrocks> you?
<pitti> micahg: I think that would break with --enable-sendto (i. e. not enable it)
<seb128> pitti, no bug no, why?
<pitti> didrocks: did you move to Australia recently?
<pitti> seb128: I have one I'd like to fix, but can't ruin the stats
<seb128> didrocks, did you swap friday this week?
<seb128> pitti, use proposed? ;-)
<pitti> I guess I could do that, yes
<didrocks> pitti: just kidding with seb128, as I shifted my easter monday holiday with this friday and when I was the only one here working on friday, he was gladly telling "it's friday for me on thursday" :)
<didrocks> so, revenge ;)
<didrocks> seb128: yeah!
<micahg> pitti: you are correct
 * micahg looks at how other flags work
<pitti> micahg: http://paste.ubuntu.com/935110/ is the standard approach
<pitti> the "else" part is right, it's meant to default to "yes"
<pitti> but it fails to consider the value when disabling it
<didrocks> ok, in fact, only sudo was dropping all the env for pbuilder, no black magic here :)
<seb128> didrocks, ;-)
<seb128> pitti, don't bother about the stats anyway, just upload where it's right, we can say that in spirit we tied ;-)
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<pitti> seb128: nah, I'll use -proposed
<pitti> then we can even build apport already, and publication will be faster
<Sweetshark> seb128: bug 926940 is fix commited
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 926940 in mime-support "Visio files not associated with LibreOffice Draw" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/926940
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey, thanks!
<micahg> pitti: I'm just tempted to default to no and be done with it ;)
<pitti> micahg: that's not upstreamable, though; above fix is
<pitti> but if you aren't concerned about that, pretty much any hack will do
<pitti> micahg: you could even choose to simply not install the extension, i. e. change debian/*.install ?
<pitti> that should avoid the autoreconfiscation, too
<micahg> there is no .install, but I can rm the files I guess
<pitti> ah, single-binary
 * micahg files  a bug against blueman for the flag issue
<lifeless> micahg: speaking of bluetooth
<lifeless> micahg: and I'm being totally opportunistic
<lifeless> micahg: why do I have two bluetooth indicators, with different content?
<micahg> lifeless: no idea, I don't even use it, I'd suggest speaking to cyphermox
<pitti> did you guys see that we have shiny new i386 and amd64 buildds?
<pitti> https://launchpad.net/builders
<pitti> they are now super-fast
<seb128> \o/
<pitti> now powerpc sucks even more, relatively speaking :)
<pitti> Sweetshark will be happy with his next LibO upload
<Sweetshark> hrhr, if i386/amd64 and powerpc/arm grow even further apart, we will run into the uploading while building scenario even more often (not that it didnt happen before).
<micahg> well, ~4.5 hrs for i386/amd64
<micahg> well, powerpc is still faster than arm*, but the queue for it will be further behind
<pitti> didrocks, seb128: do you happen to know about these lightdm-set-defaults additions? http://launchpadlibrarian.net/102448032/lightdm_1.2.0-0ubuntu2_1.2.1-0ubuntu1.diff.gz
<pitti> they formally need a FFE
<pitti> if not, I'll mail robert
<seb128> pitti, it's an utility that can be used to change the config
<seb128> pitti, https://code.launchpad.net/~mfisch/lightdm/set-defaults-work/+merge/102196 is the work that landed
<didrocks> pitti: they are called by helper in postinst normally
<pitti> seb128: yes, I know
<pitti> so that wasn't tied to a bug
<seb128> pitti, yeah, robert_ancell is usually overlooking processes and paperwork ;-)
<pitti> seb128: look at https://launchpad.net/builders :)
<seb128> pitti, nice ;-)
<seb128> pitti, 04/17/12 11:56:52: retracing #983892 failed with status: -11
<seb128> pitti, do you know what status: -11 means?
<pitti> argh, that again?
<pitti> segfault
<pitti> I guess you have a core file now
<seb128> hum
<pitti> I usually just remove and restart
<seb128> there is a "core" in the userdir yes
<seb128> pitti, ok
<seb128> should I rm the core file as well?
<pitti> as you wish
<pitti> we'll get a new one soon enough :)
<seb128> ok, too late if you wanted it
<pitti> oh, and I was _so_ keen on debugging python on lucid now!!!
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> 04/18/12 10:31:33: retracing #984064 (left in pool: 216)
<seb128> *shrug*
<seb128> 216 bugs in the backlog
<pitti> in 24 hours, wowo
<pitti> s/o$//
<seb128> pitti, well I already rmmed a lock file yesterday for a -11 error so maybe it's > a day
<seb128> i.e it was maybe not an empty pool when it stopped
<seb128> pitti, are the retracers supposed to close the bugs when retracing fail or only if retracing fail && some_other_condition?
<pitti> seb128: retrace fail && useless stack trace
<pitti> err
<pitti> I mean retrace fail (== useless stack trace) and outdated packages
 * pitti -> lunch, bbl
<seb128> pitti, enjoy
<seb128> I tend to be annoyed by "useless stacktrace && !outdated packages" I guess
<seb128> i.e corrupted dumps
<seb128> they are useless still be kept open
<Sweetshark> ricotz: you are on http://planet.documentfoundation.org btw
<ricotz> Sweetshark, hey, nice ;)
<Sweetshark> ricotz: and on http://voices.canonical.com/ for completeness sake ;)
<ricotz> hehe
<seb128> Sweetshark, how is the debian,ubuntu relationship going for libreoffice nowadays? is rene still an Ubuntu hater? ;-)
<Sweetshark> 13:08  * _rene_ thinks committing unity files upstream is the "something wrong" here
<Sweetshark> 13:08 <@_rene_> *hides*
<Sweetshark> ^- thats a few minutes ago on libreoffice-dev. Still, I personally can work with _rene_ quite well, although he might still have a lot of reservations against ubuntu.
<seb128> that's something at least ;-)
<jbicha> good morning
<didrocks> hey jbicha
<didrocks> how are you?
<seb128> jbicha, hey
<seb128> jbicha, good job getting the ubuntu-docs update in ;-)
<jbicha> seb128: does it work for you in French?
<seb128> jbicha, local build worked, I can't tell for the archive until we get new langpacks
 * pitti sighs at more crashes in the retracer, restarting
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<kelemengabor> Sweetshark: hi, thanks for your work on reenabling the LO quicklists, however there is a tiny one liner bug left. could you please take a look at bug #774020?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 774020 in libreoffice "Menu of Draw in zh_TW translation is not included in Natty" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/774020
<kelemengabor> I still see it here: http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=blob;f=patches/ubuntu-quicklists.diff;h=a0fba1d9243b03fe0833341f06348e78de56b1c1;hb=06d44513521f9db4417cd317e8266d8e1069aa2e#l210
<Sweetshark> kelemengabor: i see a tranlation for zh_TW in line 265 for draw. What do I misunderstand? *confused*
<kklimonda> hmm, is overrides the only way to configure unity-greeter? can't we use /etc/dconf/db ?
<kelemengabor> Sweetshark: I have linked line 210 for zn_CN, which should be zh_CN
<seb128> kklimonda, nothing block you do use a db, that's a sysadmin stuff usually though
 * desrt yawns
<seb128> desrt, hey
<desrt> hi
<seb128> desrt, how are you?
<seb128> desrt, not to cold?
<desrt> pre-coffee :)
<desrt> yourself?
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<desrt> cold?
<seb128> desrt, we are pretty hard frozen by now
<seb128> it's cold around :p
<desrt> oh :)
<desrt> i'm enjoying the cold
<desrt> it's a nice lul
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> i noticed you assigned more examples of that weird error-case gsettings (possibly threading) issue
<kklimonda> seb128: aren't overrides are distro stuff though, being in /usr/share and requiring a call to glib-compie-schemas afair?
<kelemengabor> Sweetshark: oh, sorry, I think this is another bug :\
<seb128> desrt, yeah, I was unsure if you want to know about them as well, or if you receive emails about bugs you are just subscribed to, or if you want them just opened on bugzilla
<seb128> desrt, I decided I would assign them to you just to get your comments, feel free to unassign ;-)
<desrt> seb128: i'm really not sure what the issue is in this case
<desrt> seb128: nah.  i don't mind having it assigned.  i'm really curious about what the issue is
<desrt> just don't expect a fast fix :)
<seb128> kklimonda, they are, what are you trying to do?
<desrt> do you figure that there's any chance that this is another one of those weird logout issues?
<seb128> desrt, oh, they are stoppers in no way, they just seemed to be maybe real bugs so I wanted you to see them in case they are just another yet stupid distro upgrade race issue or something
<seb128> desrt, could be yes
<desrt> seb128: after poking at it a bit, it's the only explanation i could come up with
<kklimonda> seb128: well, I just got a bug email from lightdm about disabling start-up sound (I'm subscribed to a bunch of "new" packages like lightdm/unity-greeter so I can see what's going on with them ;))
<seb128> desrt, I hate logout issues, I really want to get a way to see what bugs happen on logout ;-)
<kklimonda> seb128: and someone has suggested creating an .override file to do that
<desrt> seb128: that would probably not be too difficult
<desrt> seb128: i suggest talking to pitti about it :)
<desrt> (actually, maybe it is difficult -- it is rather unlikely that logout-time crashes are handled right away so, by the time apport is doing its thing, it's probably no longer logout time)
<seb128> kklimonda, just edit the etc config?
<seb128> desrt, well then "not current session"
<seb128> like compare the report time with the login time or something
<desrt> ya.  that would probably work fairly well
<desrt> although i guess it could also give some false positives
<seb128> we should maybe wipe the reports on login
<desrt> well
<desrt> this is a bug
<desrt> so i'm happy we know about it :)
<kklimonda> seb128: ok, I'm a bit confused - why does unity-greeter has etc config and ships with the gsettings schema?
<seb128> kklimonda, that option seems to be in gsettings
<desrt> kklimonda: the file in /etc is old
<desrt> it's no longer used
<seb128> kklimonda, what are you trying to do? just a local change for your user? just set the key for in the etc db or for the lightdm user?
<desrt> kklimonda: this confused me quite a lot at one point as well
<desrt> kklimonda: the settings are actually stored in a normal dconf db in the lightdm homedir
<seb128> jbicha, you should probably open a ffe bug where we can have that discussion for the record in any case
<kklimonda> seb128: well, the current example is disabling start-up sound that unity-greeter is apparently playing, but I'm trying to wrap my mind around an entire concept :)
<Sweetshark> kelemengabor: do you have a bug# for zn_CN
<Sweetshark> ?
<kelemengabor> Sweetshark: no, I have looked for it, but nothing
<kelemengabor> should I file one?
<kklimonda> seb128: it doesn't help that a lot of lightdm settings (like disabling user list or enabling "others" login) are not in gsettings, but in the old good .conf file
<seb128> kklimonda, lightdm != unity-greeter
<alf_> Hi! How is gtk-window-decorator started by unity? With the arm gles2 compiz/unity packages, I need to run it manually to get any decorations and I am trying to figure out what is wrong.
<kklimonda> seb128: I know, but they use vastly different configuration mechanisms and I can imagine that at some point in the future sssd will gain an ability to sync dconf/gsettings with LDAP to ease deployments (or someone creates a different solution to this problem), but  we'll be stuck with old good puppet to configure lightdm ;)
<alf_> ogra_: ^^
<alf_> ogra_: (two lines up)
<seb128> alf_, try #ubuntu-unity
<Sweetshark> kelemengabor: that would be great
<Sweetshark> kelemengabor: bug 774020 can be assumed fixed than?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 774020 in libreoffice "Menu of Draw in zh_TW translation is not included in Natty" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/774020
<ogra_> alf_, i think its related to /x-window-manager
<seb128> kklimonda, I would be reluctant to make lightdm use gsettings
<kelemengabor> Sweetshark: yes, the Draw file has no zn_TW entry anymore
<kklimonda> seb128: it's already linking against the entire glib stack, isn't it?
<alf_> seb128: thanks
<kklimonda> I guess the argument against it is to make lightdm more desktop-agnostic
<seb128> kklimonda, yeah, it's stupid, ignore that, I still hate how non-robust gsettings is against i.e schemas install issues
<seb128> like the last thing I want is the login manager to fail starting because it doesn't find a schemas telling if it should play the login sound
<kklimonda> *nods* that's a good argument, but isn't it the case already now that unity-greeter is using gsettings?
<kklimonda> unless lightdm can work in a fallback mode without unity-greeter?
<seb128> which is why I say "it's stupid, ignore that" ;-)
<kklimonda> ah, right :)
<seb128> well without unity-greeter lightdm would send you in failsafe mode to fix your config
<seb128> or should
<ogra_> which is funny given that we dont actually *have* a config anymore and xorg should sutodetect the world :)
<ogra_> *auto...
<kelemengabor> Sweetshark: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/984893
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 984893 in libreoffice "Typo in LO Base desktop file: zn_Cn" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> ogra_, well you can have a broken config
<seb128> ogra_, which means fixing it is basically removing the broken config ;-)
 * cyphermox <3 readu
<cyphermox> gah
<ogra_> seb128, sure, but that usually doesnt refer to xorg itself
<seb128> cyphermox, hey, how are you?
<cyphermox> hey
<cyphermox> not too bad
<ogra_> seb128, i.e. if my lightdm config is broken the failsafe doesnt offer me to fix that but it wants to fix xorg
<seb128> ogra_, it should offer you that, that was the plan
<seb128> ogra_, I guess some workitems didn't get done this cycle
<ogra_> yeah, i definitely didnt see such an option in my broken setups
<Sweetshark> kelemengabor: fix committed
<pitti> seb128: logout crashes> do we still get that many? I was hoping the fix that we put into apport would get rid of many of those
<seb128> pitti, the issue is that it's hard to do which ones are logout issues and not
<kelemengabor> Sweetshark: thanks!
<seb128> pitti, I got one for sure yesterday from an oneiric to precise update, evince exited on missing gschemas key because it was running during the update and schemas changed under it, the user got apport to trigger after the first login into precise after reboot
<seb128> pitti, it took some pingpong and look at timestamp to figure the issue happened during the upgrade before reboot, he got the prompt after reboot and login in the updated system
<seb128> pitti, what was the hack done in apport again? maybe it doesn't work as it should?
<pitti> seb128: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~apport-hackers/apport/trunk/view/head:/apport/hookutils.py#L814
<pitti> oh, wait
<pitti> we only use that to determine whether or not to attach ~/.xsession-errors
<pitti> we don't actually prevent them from being sent
<pitti> mostly because service processes (plumbing, gvfs, and the like) are not directly attached to the session
<seb128> pitti, ok, that makes sense
<seb128> pitti, I wish reports would have the "current login time" as well as report['Date']
<pitti> I don't think we have found a real solution for "is this happening at logout" yet
<seb128> pitti, report['Date'] is the date where the issue happened or when ubuntu-bug was run?
<Darxus> I think you folks are likely to be interested in this, apparently the Ubuntu specific modifications to GTK+ are incompatible with Wayland:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/984914
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 984914 in gtk+3.0 "Ubuntu modifications to GTK+ incompatabile with Wayland" [Undecided,New]
<pitti> seb128: the latter
<pitti> seb128: we can find out about the former, though, maybe that makes more sense
<seb128> Darxus, not for precise
<seb128> Darxus, maybe next cycle
<pitti> seb128: wait, hang on, I tell rubbish
<pitti> seb128: yes, Date is the time the crash  happened, sorry
<seb128> pitti, from the evince report I was talking about I had the impression Date was the issue time
<seb128> pitti, ok, that matches that specific case I looked at today
<seb128> so I would just need the "current login" time
<Darxus> seb128: Yeah I know it's not getting enabled in Precise, just seemed like something somebody would want to fix eventually.
<seb128> like when running ubuntu-bug, look at ck current login and compare to the report date
<pitti> seb128: you mean the time when apport-bug runs?
<pitti> seb128: that's precisely what in_session_of_problem() gives you
<seb128> pitti, is that somewhere in the report? or is that just used for the .xsession-errors logic?
<pitti> seb128: so for desktop apps, you indirectly know by "does this bug have a xsession-errors attachment"
<seb128> pitti, I don't see that actual info being printed
<pitti> seb128: no, it's not a separate field
<seb128> pitti, well, "doesn't have a xsession-errors" can also mean "the xsession-error log had nothing matching the filter regexp"
<pitti> seb128: if a bug has an .xsession-errors, then it's not a "crash at logout", barring weird bugs
<pitti> seb128: right, that too
<seb128> so you are back to be unsure
<seb128> pitti, could we just append session_start_time to the infos?
<pitti> seb128: would it be enough to have a boolean flag? InSessionOfProblem: Yes
<pitti> or so?
<pitti> I guess that's what you are actually looking out for, and improves both privacy and also the legibility of reports?
<seb128> pitti, concrete example: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evince/+bug/983697
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 983697 in evince "evince crashed with signal 5 in g_settings_get_value()" [Low,Invalid]
<seb128> pitti, yes, a boolean would work for me
<seb128> pitti, and yes, either to have apport to do the timestamp checks and the logic than having to do it manually, even if that's easy maths ;-)
<seb128> either->easier
<pitti> seb128: so that, or an extra tag, or so
<pitti> seb128: how woudl that help in that particular case?
<seb128> pitti, I just need the info, I'm not picking about how it's exposed
<pitti> seb128: it wasn't the session that was closing?
<pitti> seb128: but I actually thought we reject crashes if the binary changes between the crash and the reporting time
<pitti> ah, I guess here it crashed when the new binary already was in place, darn
<seb128> no we don't
<seb128> right
<pitti> so we'd need to find out at crash time if the binary is the same as it was when the program started
<pitti> i. e. program start time >= mtime(ExecutablePath)
<seb128> pitti, good point, that wouldn't give me the exact info I need, but at least I could see "none of the dup happened in the current session"
<seb128> pitti, which is a good clue it might be a logout issue
<pitti> program start time shoudl be somewhere in /proc, hang on
<pitti> ah, I could use the time of the /proc/pid/exe symlink
<pitti> and compare that to the mtime of the executable path
<seb128> pitti, that's another issue but a frequent one, in fact it's a more interesting one
<pitti> i. e. crash right after upgrade
<seb128> pitti, we often have the case with g-s-d or unity where new report come from the fixed version
<Darxus> Can anybody give me a summary of what I'm getting into by disabling the patches in the precise gtk package?  The ubuntu specific stuff?  What depends on that, Unity?
<seb128> pitti, because people didn't restart for 3 days
<seb128> so they still have the old buggy version loaded
<seb128> which is often giving us some wth, does the fix doesn't work?
 * pitti files that as a bug; then we have something to report to when asking for an SRU
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<seb128> Darxus, lot of trouble
<seb128> Darxus, do you disable all the patches?
<seb128> Darxus, you will basically break unity, appmenu, overlayscrollbar
<Darxus> seb128: I did in the last one I built, with the 3.4.1 packaging and gtk master.
<Darxus> seb128: Thanks, that's exactly what I was looking for.  Anything else?
<seb128> Darxus, the sound indicator
<seb128> Darxus, software-center
<seb128> Darxus, scrolling in gwibber
<seb128> Darxus, like some other stuff as well
<seb128> Darxus, i.e "don't do that"'
<Darxus> Thanks.
<Darxus> Eh, do you have any better suggestions for creating a package that allows gtk apps to work through wayland?
<seb128> Darxus, what ubuntu patch breaks wayland support exactly?
<Darxus> I'm not sure.
<jbicha> Darxus: you really ought to start with the current Ubuntu packaging instead of starting from fresh, it'll make your life a lot easier
<seb128> start by figuring that?
<pitti> seb128: bug 984944, I subbed you
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 984944 in apport "Reject crashes that happen right after upgrade" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/984944
<seb128> pitti, danke!
<Darxus> jbicha: I'm planning to - the problem is that segfaults due to bug 983697.  Which is why I'm asking about disabling the ubuntu patches.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 983697 in evince "evince crashed with signal 5 in g_settings_get_value()" [Low,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/983697
<seb128> Darxus, try export LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=0
<Darxus> seb128: Cool, thanks.
<seb128> Darxus, that disable the overlay scrollbars
<seb128> Darxus, no need to drop any patch for that
<seb128> Darxus, the patch checks for the variable
<Darxus> I'll give that a try tonight, thanks.
<seb128> it should be a no-op if it's set to 0
<pitti> shoudln't it be enough to sudo dpkg -P liboverlay-scrollbar3-0.2-0 ?
<pitti> ah, right, that variable should work, too
<seb128> grrr, some days launchpad is a piece of crap, especially when trying to reassing bugs
<seb128> like I tried to put "ayatana-scrollbar" upstream comment, failed, I added "liboverlay-scrollbar" ubuntu package and it reassigned to "ubuntu" no package
<ogra_> lovely
<mhr3> seb128, you're the stacktrace man :) can i somehow get the fully symbolic trace from addresses returned by the standard backtrace() call?
<seb128> pitti, ^
<seb128> mhr3, I doubt the addresses are enough to give you those infos
<seb128> but pitti knows better about that
<seb128> he looked to signatures stuff for the client side dup detection
<mhr3> ok
 * mhr3 waits for pitti's response
<mhr3> i think something could be skipped in such trace (if compiler inlines stuff) but otherwise it should be possible to get a nice trace imo
<seb128> mhr3, why just not use the standard tools,workflow?
<pitti> mhr3: in theory yes, but in practice there is no tool to do it
<pitti> mhr3: so you are much better off with a core dump
<mhr3> seb128, it's an issue i'm unable to reproduce in gdb... i guess timing matters
<seb128> mhr3, just ulimit -c and gdb the dump?
<pitti> right, what seb128 says
<pitti> no need to actually run the process under gdb
<pitti> "ulimit -c unlimited"
<pitti> gdb /path/to/process core
<mhr3> but it doesn't crash
<seb128> make it to so? :p
<seb128> or you want the stacktrace every time you use some function?
<mhr3> i want it when g_log logs the ref problem
<seb128> mhr3, do a code check and abort() when that happens?
<pitti> so if the first time is enough, change it g_error and it will SIGABRT
<pitti> or call abort() yourself
<mhr3> unfortunately there are many errors before that
<mhr3> ones i dont particularly care about
<seb128> mhr3, can't you regexp match the error in the code and abort() on the specific match?
<seb128> like parse the error string
<Darxus> seb128: My packages that are just the Ubuntu package plus the two necessary patch sets works with export LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=0 :)  Thanks.
<mhr3> hmm, maybe
<mhr3> thx seb128, pitti
<seb128> Darxus, yw
<seb128> mhr3, yw
<pitti> mhr3: I haven't played with backtrace_symbols(), but that might help you?
<mhr3> pitti, that's actually what i was using, but it's not overly useful
<mhr3> like:
<mhr3> 9: /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libdbus-1.so.3(+0xb47a) [0x7ffff1b6047a]
<mhr3> 10: /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libdbus-1.so.3(dbus_connection_dispatch+0x9a) [0x7ffff1b6370a]
<mhr3> 11: /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libatspi.so.0(+0xa955) [0x7fffd5aed955]
<mhr3> 12: /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libglib-2.0.so.0(g_main_context_dispatch+0x16a) [0x7ffff5a2bc9a]
<pitti> you only know the function names, not the precise location in the fuction, yes
<pitti> mhr3: another hack: you could call gdb to create a core dump of yourself repeatedly, and name it with the timestamp or so
<pitti> there's even a /usr/bin/gcore convenience wrapper
<mhr3> now that sounds interesting
<mhr3> i wonder if i could just synchronously call gcore by the process i want to core dump :)
<mhr3> ah, requires root :/
<pitti> or PR_SET_DUMPABLE
<pitti> err, no, not that one
<mhr3> SET_PTRACER?
<pitti> mhr3: you can temporarily disable it globally in /etc/sysctl.d/10-ptrace.conf
<mhr3> right
<pitti> then any gdb can attach to any of your processes
<seb128> desrt, could you look at bug #858390? it's getting some duplicates
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 858390 in d-conf "nautilus crashed on startup in dconf_engine_refresh_user()" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/858390
<desrt> seb128: hm
<desrt> seb128: the duplicates started to increase just after i did some refactoring in that area
<desrt> suspicious!
<seb128> desrt, I've asked for an updated stacktrace next time we get a duplicate
<desrt> crashing with SIGBUS.  fascinating.
<desrt> that's almost certainly due to hitting the shm area
<desrt> is it always nautilus?
<desrt> ie: do we see this same SIGBUS-in-dconf code situation in anything other than nautilus?
<desrt> also: can we tell if maybe these users are on NFS?  this is more or less exactly the situation i'd expect to see because of XDG_RUNTIME_DIR not being set
<seb128> desrt, one of the dups is gsd, so "no"
<desrt> seb128: that was the other issue, no?
<seb128> desrt, we can ask them...
<seb128> desrt, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/d-conf/+bug/870800
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 870800 in d-conf "gnome-settings-daemon crashed on system start indconf_engine_refresh_user() (dup-of: 858390)" [Medium,New]
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 858390 in d-conf "nautilus crashed on startup in dconf_engine_refresh_user()" [Medium,Triaged]
<desrt> ah.  go figure.
<desrt> seb128: any way i could get my hands on some core?
<seb128> desrt, not easily, maybe ask those users if one get the issue in a realiable way and could add one?
<seb128> desrt, the other option that could work would be to put the bug "fix released", I think apport would "freak out" on the next duplicate, saying it's a regression and keeping it in state
<seb128> pitti, ^ is that correct?
<desrt> seb128: seems a rather indirect way of doing that...
<seb128> desrt, yeah, I don't have a good reply though, out of asking the users
<pitti> we don't usually expose the core dumps, indeed
<pitti> we keep them in crashes which failed retracing
<desrt> is it a case of not exposing them or them actually being deleted entirely?
<pitti> the latter
<desrt> privacy concerns, i guess
<pitti> if you know the URL, you can still get them, but there's no way except DB hackery to find out
<pitti> yes, we don't know what stuff might hide in them
<desrt> hmm
<desrt> seems like the worst of both worlds
<desrt> private data is kept around forever
<desrt> ....but you can't make productive use of it
<pitti> oh, they will get cleaned up after a few days
<desrt> ah
<pitti> LP's garbage collector
<pitti> but not immediately
<desrt> gotcha
<mterry> bryceh, heyo.  Do you know much about xkb maps and me getting a "key types not defined" error when trying to have xkbfile X extension use the "fr oss" layout?
<bryceh> mterry, hyea
<bryceh> mterry, yeah yeah I tinker with such bugs from time to time.  tell me more
<pitti> good night everyone!
<seb128> pitti, 'night
 * bryceh pulls up fr oss
<mterry> bryceh, let me get the bug
<didrocks> see you pitti
<mterry> bryceh, bug 960096 (look at my last few comments -- much of the bug deals with some other flaws)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 960096 in libxklavier "Live session started with wrong layout" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/960096
<mterry> pitti, bye!
<bryceh> mterry, ok so sounds like just a missing keyboard symbol in that key map?  should be a straightforward error if we know what the missing symbol(s) are
<bryceh> mterry, /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/fr is the symbol map (search on xkb_symbols "oss")
<mterry> bryceh, how do I get a smaller test case than "running X with fr/oss as default"?  Like, I tried running xkbcomp  /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/fr but it didn't error out
<bryceh> right, that just compiles them
<mterry> bryceh, OK.  So what's my next step?
 * mterry is lost at the X barrier
<rickspencer3> hey all, what's the word on the street for Precise? ready to ship?
<bryceh> mterry, I've found  an upstream patch to the fr oss layout that we may be missing.  Reviewing...
<ogra_> rickspencer3, "all, broken, we'll delay for 6 months"
<ogra_> :)
<bryceh> mterry, something with the space character
<rickspencer3> ogra_, so we'll have 2 12.10's?
<ogra_> indeed 12.10LTS and 12.10 :)
<kenvandine> :)
<bryceh> mterry, ok so next steps... are you able to reproduce this bug yourself?  If so let me paste you the current mainline version of fr to test.  if that works, could short circuit some debugging work.
<mterry> bryceh, yes, I can reproduce
<bryceh> mterry, ok, here's the fr file - http://paste.ubuntu.com/935651/ - copy to /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/fr
<bryceh> you'll need to regen your xkb cache; easiest way is just restart X
<mterry> bryceh, OK.  Will be back after trying
<mterry> bryceh, no good
<bryceh> ok, too bad, that would have been an easy fix :-)
<mterry> agreed  :)
<bryceh> mterry, ok so can you describe to me the steps to reproduce?
<bryceh> does it happen immediately after setting the layout in the keyboard preferences capplet to fr oss?
<mterry> bryceh, um, I haven't tried, I've had my layout like that for a little while for testing
<mterry> bryceh, but if you have fr/oss as your first layout
<mterry> bryceh, and start a session, you'll end up with 'us'
<bryceh> ok, I can give that a try
<bryceh> also, there are a set of standard log files we need for xkb bugs, but this bug report is missing them; perhaps easiest solution is to file a new bug against xorg, but if you'd rather stick with this bug report, would you mind manually collecting them?
<bryceh> setxkbmap -print
<bryceh> xkbcomp :0 -w0 -
<bryceh> locale
<mterry> bryceh, I can file a new bug.  would prefer to keep this new flaw separate from that previous bug
 * mterry runs ubuntu-bug
<bryceh> mterry, sounds good
<bryceh> 'ubuntu-bug xorg' should do it
<bryceh> mterry, there's a bug, or I guess class of bugs, which has been around as long as I can remember, where gnome tries to set the layout, and X barfs, and the user gets a quite unhelpful error message.  bug #524406 is an example.  If you see "Error activating XKB configuration." that's one of the symptoms.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 524406 in libxklavier "Frequent "Error activating XKB configuration"" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524406
<seb128> mterry, if you need a xkb master you can try to ping svu on #gnome-hackers when he's online (he's the libgnomekbd, libxklavier upstream)
<mterry> bryceh, I don't get a user-visible error
<mterry> bryceh, bug 985065
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 985065 in xorg "Can't use fr/oss keyboard layout by default" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/985065
<bryceh> seb128, I'll get in contact with svu about this once we have it characterized
<seb128> bryceh, ok, good
<bryceh> mterry, ok I'm reproducing here.  let me dick around with it a bit this morning and get back to you.
<mterry> bryceh, ok, thanks!
 * didrocks waves good evening
<Sweetshark> pitti: ping?
<Darxus> Is there a way to get notified any time a new gtk package is released?
<desrt> Darxus: there are release announcements posted to various lists
<desrt> including an automated announcement posted to the ftp-release-list@gnome.org
<desrt> that's probably the most reliable one to follow
<desrt> seb128: so we get some comfirmation that ecryptfs may be to blame here
<desrt> for the dconf issue
<Darxus> desrt: Sorry, I meant Ubuntu packages.
<desrt> Darxus: apt-get upgrade? :)
<Darxus> Heh.  So there's no way to just get an email any time the "latest upload" field on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0 changes?
<kklimonda> Darxus: you could filter through the precise-changes ML
<Darxus> kklimonda: Thanks.
<jbicha> Darxus: you can for Debian packages but I don't know if there's an automated way for Ubuntu packages
<Darxus> I don't suppose there's an lp bzr repo containing the latest gtk source package I could set up a build recipe against?
<jbicha> there is, & you could subscribe to email notifications of that
<Darxus> Ooh.
<Darxus> Where?
<jbicha> you can just click the code tab at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0
<jbicha> but for Desktop packages, see the ~ubuntu-desktop branches, ie https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gtk/ubuntugtk3
<jbicha> just click Subscribe yourself in the top right
<Darxus> Ah, that's what I was looking for, thanks.
<jbicha> the ubuntu-desktop branches are usually packaging only which makes bzr pull faster
<jbicha> there's some docs for it at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Bzr
<Darxus> Thanks.
<Darxus> It'll be nice to automate my builds with the wayland backend enabled.
<jbicha> if it works well, I'd imagine we'd build with wayland support for 12.10
<Darxus> jbicha: Thanks, I hope so.  By that time, 3.6.0 will be released, so the patches I'm using will be included.  Just need to add --enable-wayland-backend --enable-x11-backend and the libxkb and libwayland dependencies.
<Darxus> I'm hoping coordinating mutually compatible versions of wayland, gtk, and qt won't be too exiciting :/
<Darxus> Seems like a build recipe using that doesn't grab the upstream tarball.  How would I make it do that?
<micahg> Darxus: use the lp:ubuntu/gtk+3.0 branch instead
<Darxus> micahg: But that one hasn't been updated since 2011-07-20?
<micahg> meh, http://package-import.ubuntu.com/status/gtk+3.0.html#2011-07-25%2009:43:52.029711
<Darxus> Imports broke?
<micahg> yeah
<Darxus> Should I file a bug?
<micahg> sure, against the udd project if there isn't one already for that type
<Darxus> Right, thanks.
<Darxus> micahg: How did you find that page?  I don't see it linked from https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/gtk+3.0/precise
<micahg> http://package-import.ubuntu.com/status/ + CTRL+F :)
<Darxus> Ah, thanks.
<kklimonda> micahg: don't those get stalled from time to time?
<micahg> kklimonda: well, when they're stalled, they're usually restarted
<seb128> lol
<seb128> the kernel team now has a "bot-stop-nagging" tag
<seb128> or how to stack hacks on hacks
<seb128> "If you want this bot to quit automatically requesting kernel tests, add a tag named: bot-stop-nagging."
<seb128> can they made that the default? :p
<seb128> make
<seb128> then maybe just drop the stupid nag bot and be back to sanity ;-)
<micahg> seb128: that was created at the last UDS
<bryceh> seb128, I've been using a similar tag on the xorg bugbot, but treat it's use as an indicator of bugginess in the bot, and try to minimize its presence...
<seb128> micahg, the stupid bot or the tag to prevent the bot?
<micahg> seb128: tag to prevent the bot :)
<jbicha> Sweetshark: is there a LibreOffice backports PPA?
<seb128> micahg, bryceh: their bot just made me not want to ever report a kernel bug again
<cyphermox> seb128: you're not alone
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/978622 is a good example of why
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 978622 in linux "every app becomes unresponsive when nautilus is copying files" [Medium,Confirmed]
<micahg> well, they've gone from 10k+ bugs to < 6k
<seb128> "nice reporter" follow by 2 different bug similar "can you test with new kernel" comments, followed by a reply, followed by another same automatic bot reply, followed by a "it seems an upstream issue report it to them yourself"
<seb128> micahg, I suprised they didn't went to 0
<bryceh> yeah I  hate the "report it upstream yourself" responses
 * micahg doesn't like those comments in general unless it's untestable by a triager, which unfortunately is the case for most kernel bugs
<seb128> micahg, it's easy enough to write a bot just closing bugs if you don't want to deal with them
<bryceh> seb128, indeed it's an 8 line script. easy
<seb128> ;-)
<bryceh> I think it's sort of a failing in launchpad that it doesn't allow for better tracking of what was tested
<seb128> well, it's not a question of what was tested
<seb128> it's that they upload a kernel every 2 weeks and never look at your bugs
<seb128> but add a bot comment with every upload
<seb128> so on a cycle you get to fight with a bot which sets your bug to incomplete 10 times at least
<seb128> no wonder that at the end it wins
<seb128> when you reopened the bug 5 times saying "yes it's an issue" you still nobody else than the bot setting to incomplete communicated with you, you go wth and give up on trying to ever report a kernel bug again
<seb128> you still-> with still
<bryceh> seb128, well what I mean is that launchpad ought to distinguish that the bug is against an out of date version, rather than using a bot to post comments
<bryceh> so, the idea would  be if you look at a bug you filed a month ago, it should indicate that the bug's against an out of date version
<seb128> bryceh, well that wouldn't help there
<bryceh> seb128, sure it would
<seb128> it's easy to figure that the bug was reported against an outdated version
<seb128> the issue is that they send a bug putting the bug incomplete on you to get ride of your bug rather than trying to read it
<bryceh> seb128, ah but that's not clear to the reporter that it's blocked because of that (else why bother with the bot comments?)
<bryceh> anyway, not like we'll get launchpad to implement new features any time soon.
<seb128> right
<seb128> at the end it's a manpower,number of bugs issue
<bryceh> seb128, and also anyway, I completely agree it's quite annoying as implemented.  I grit my teeth whenever I get that after filing a bug
<bryceh> but with the kernel they get so many bug reports that your bug report is going in a black hole, bot or no
<seb128> I would just prefer to have my bug ignored until read than having to fight with a bot
<seb128> like once every cycle would be fine
<bryceh> usually have to catch a kernel engineer's attention too
<seb128> I'm fine revisit my open bugs every 6 months
 * bryceh nods
<bryceh> yeah that's sort of the level I try with my bugbot; try to have no more than one bugbot question per bug, per year
<seb128> one comment a cycle is a good goal I think
<seb128> it's fair enough to ask when a new Ubuntu version is out to retest
<seb128> I should try reporting a firefox bug to see how that goes ;-)
<seb128> firefox doesn't bug enough, I didn't get to do that for a while!
<bryceh> I try to couple it to a significant change, like after we've uploaded a new X stack, or if a fix went in that we expect to solve a *lot* of bug reports.  Seems like with the kernel they re-ask a bit too aggressively
<seb128> right
<Amaranth> bryceh: Sadly with the kernel hibernate and suspend bugs can be "fixed" with something as simple as a recompile sometimes so it makes sense to try to get constant testing as new versions are put out
<Amaranth> Just as an example of a class of kernel bugs
<bryceh> true, and we have some like that in X, like proprietary drivers especially
<bryceh> but in such cases I try to target the bot to just that specific class of bug, and give some targeted message relevant to the type of bug.  I think that goes over better with the reporters than a generic "new version.  please retest"
<bryceh> mterry, btw if you're still abouts think I got a handle on the keyboard bug
<mterry> bryceh, oooh!
<bryceh> looks like 'udevadm  trigger --subsystem-match=input --action=change' does the trick
<bryceh> try that
<bryceh> +sudo
<mterry> bryceh, I see your comment.  I got debug comments by changing the code  :-/
<mterry> bryceh, this is after I login?
<bryceh> mterry, aha! no wonder I couldn't figure out how to turn that on :-)
<bryceh> mterry, yep, from just a gnome-terminal window or whatever
 * bryceh retests too
<mterry> bryceh, hmm.   i didn't logout and in again, but was my layout supposed to instantly change?
<bryceh> mterry, it did for me.
<bryceh> although I'd run a few other things prior to that, so it could be a combination.  retesting
<bryceh> nope, that's all that it takes for em
<mterry> hm
<bryceh> mterry, well let me backup
<mterry> can't log out, becasue I'm in the middle of an upload
<bryceh> I found that running sudo dpkg-reconfigure keyboard-config made my keyboard work right.  Someone had suggested it on the previous bug.  But it only persists one session.
<bryceh> mterry, so looking at the keyboard-configuration scripts and readmes, I saw
<bryceh> blah blah the
<bryceh> changes will become visible to X only if
<bryceh> udevadm trigger --subsystem-match=input --action=change
<mterry> I've still got upstream's fr symbols file if that matters...
<bryceh> mterry, shouldn't.
<bryceh> mterry, anyway, I *think* maybe what's needed is to add the above udev call to the gnome keyboard tool.  once your upload's done if you could test it, that'd help.  I'll poke further in a little bit.
<mterry> bryceh, which keyboard tool?
<bryceh> mterry, in the hud type "keyboard layout"
<bryceh> don't think it has a separate executable anymore
<bryceh> guessing the backend code is in gnome-settings-daemon or somesuch
<mterry> bryceh, but this happens if you just change the gsettings key and reboot
<mterry> bryceh, and the trigger stuff would happen each boot right?   Or are you saying when lightdm changes the layout via libxklavier, it should also issue a trigger?
<bryceh> mterry, I need to dig a bit more but yes, I suspect that we need this call added to the startup code "somewhere" to kick it into action
<bryceh> mterry, we might want to run  this by cjwatson for sanity check before we change anything
<mterry> yar
<seb128> mterry, hey
<seb128> mterry, (now is time to run for you ;-)
<seb128> dammit! ;-)
<mterry> seb128, :)
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> mterry, you working on indicator-datetime in the past, do you know how it's computing the timezone for a location you add?
<seb128> mterry, i.e http://geoname-lookup.ubuntu.com/?query=new%20york&release=precises&lang=fr_FR.UTF-8 returns geolocation infos
<seb128> name, coordinates
<mterry> seb128, should get that from the server
<seb128> but not times
<seb128> mterry, do you know if I can query that from the website?
<mterry> seb128, oh right.  it looks it up on a map it has
<mterry> seb128, maps the coords to the same map you click on
<seb128> mterry, it's placing "new york" in africa for some users
<mterry> seb128, seems bad
<seb128> right
<seb128> we are trying to figure why
<seb128> and why it happens only to some users (locales?)
<mterry> oh really?  locale...  shouldn't affect it
<mterry> might affect response from server?
<seb128> mterry, right, that's why we are trying to figure, thanks
<kenvandine> mterry, so if seb128 disconnects network it works
<kenvandine> just getting it from the local cache
<seb128> mterry, like the cached value give me the right time
<kenvandine> when online it sets his timezone to africa
<seb128> 'Africa/Abidjan New York'
<seb128> in the gsettings key
<kenvandine> not just for new york either, someone else reported it for barcelona
<seb128> kenvandine, barcelona is in africa seen from the U.S it's an understable mistake :p
 * seb128 hides
<kenvandine> mterry, for users that can reproduce the bug, it is consistent
<kenvandine> but others can't :/
<kenvandine> hehe
<mterry> hmm
<mterry> Have to reboot to test bryceh's thing.  Hold on
<seb128> mterry, unping, ted figured it out, it's you U.S guys hating use europeans
<mterry> seb128, oh nice!  what was the deal?
<seb128> mterry, aka atof not liking being giving a "." instead or a ","
<mterry> seb128, hah!
<seb128> the decimal separator
<mterry> seb128, everyone needs to just speak swahili and we'd all be happier
<micahg> is that a locale specific thing?
<mterry> bryceh, your udevadm line didn't change anything for me after a fresh reboot
<seb128> micahg, not one locale, but yes, some locales use "," as a decimal separator
<seb128> like in most european country you write 45,3 not 45.3
<mterry> So adorable!  /me tousles seb128's hair
<seb128> heh
<seb128> mterry, you realized that it's the second french hater bug we are discussing in 2 days? I wonder what is going on there!
<seb128> mterry, btw having to run that udev command seems weird, like why would it be needed for some variants of keyboard only?
<jbicha> seb128: does your ubuntu-docs work?
<mterry> seb128, you're barely french, why do you care?
<seb128> jbicha, oh, good question, I need to upgrade, I will tell you that in a bit
<mterry> seb128, agreed...
<seb128> jbicha, yes, the updated langpacks works ;-)
<Laney> can we get apport to attach sources.list to upgrade failure bugs or to indicate if any third-party repositories are in use?
<seb128> mterry, https://code.launchpad.net/~ted/indicator-datetime/lp773987/+merge/102591 is the datetime fix in case you were curious about the details
<seb128> Laney, that's to discuss with pitti but I guess we can easily do it if we decide it's not a privacy issue
<seb128> Laney, but users might have private ppas in there
<seb128> Laney, so maybe a "ppa in use" flag or something would be better
<Laney> it could have a heuristic to filter out common private repo patterns, but that could never catch all private repos I guess
<mterry> seb128, awesome.  nice catch tedg!
<seb128> Laney, what issue do you try to solve?
<seb128> Laney, we should rather signal if local installed packages were non official versions
<Laney> yeah
<seb128> Laney, isn't the dist-upgrade disabling ppas for upgrades anyway?
<Laney> there's a bad mono upgrade failure that seems to still exist in some PPA/unofficial package
<Laney> maybe it's not dist-upgrade
<Laney> well, u-m upgrade
<jbicha> seb128: cool! so there's help for the French after all
<jbicha> perhaps the upgrader should ppa-purge instead of just disabling ppa's
<Laney> I thought apport did indicate unofficial packages but perhaps it doesn't know that in upgrade scenarios
<seb128> Laney, well it does prevent you to report against an unofficial version and it will indicator changed content from the binary (i.e files which don't match the md5sum)
<seb128> Laney, it will probably not warn after upgrade since the new version which failed to install is the official one though
<Laney> right, it reports that the old version failed to upgrade
<Laney> but it doesn't catch that this is due to a bug that exists in the unofficial new version
<Sweetshark> jbicha: https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ppa description needs some updating.
<Sweetshark> jbicha: it was needed for the f**^&*ed up 3.4 release ...
<jbicha> Sweetshark: is that going to have stable releases, like for 12.04 users can they add that and they'll get LO 3.5 when it's ready?
<jbicha> the idea I had in mind was kinda like the firefox-stable PPA before everyone got the latest Firefox releases
<Sweetshark> jbicha: ? ubuntu 12.04 will have LibreOffice 3.5
<jbicha> I meant LO 3.6
<Sweetshark> jbicha: there will be a libreoffice-3-5 ppa, which will get 3.5.X updates before they are SRUed. http://sweetshark.livejournal.com/10977.html
<Sweetshark> jbicha: i will primarily care about 3.6 on ubuntu p+1, but if ricotz continues to backport as fast as he does now, there shouldnt be an issue.
<micahg> Sweetshark: might I suggest a stable and oldstable vs versioned PPAs so they can be reused
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-04-19
<bryceh> jeez, mterri gave me a loose strand of yarn from a sweater...
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> robert_ancell: FYI, #u-release wanted an FFE bug for your lightdm upload; it looks good otherwise
<pitti> Sweetshark: pong
<robert_ancell> pitti, ah, ok
<pitti> Laney: it already indicates if there are third-party packages installed
<pitti> not third-party sources, though, I believe
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
 * BigWhale opens one eye.
<didrocks> hey pitti!
<BigWhale> Morning.
<didrocks> morning BigWhale
<didrocks> and a first kernel panic of the day
<rickspencer3> didrocks, kernel panic? what are you doing?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: nothing, it's happening to me approximately every 2 days when my disk is writing a lot
<didrocks> rickspencer3: I pinged apw, but as I have no info on disk after rebootâ¦
<RAOF> didrocks: Boo.  That's the one on your nvidia machine, then?
<didrocks> RAOF: yeah
<tjaalton> could be related to the latest update, which upstream admits is buggy
<tjaalton> nvidia blob update that is
<RAOF> Nah; this has been going on for quite some time, right didrocks?
<didrocks> ah? I get it for the past month and half approx, does it make sense?
<tjaalton> oh ok, then it's not that
<rickspencer3> hey didrocks did those last unity regressions get sorted to your satisfaction?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: it did for me indeed. There are some other perf issues that have a fix pending, but it's only when the dash is opened. The safer at this stage is a SRU IMHO. I plan to get every fixes merges for next Thursday, to push in -proposed by then
<rickspencer3> didrocks, thanks for the update
<didrocks> yw :)
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<Sweetshark> chrisccoulson, everyone: g'mornin'
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<didrocks> good morning chrisccoulson, Sweetshark
<Sweetshark> pitti: bug 984942 is evil.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 984942 in libreoffice "LO help appears partially untranslated (dup-of: 957589)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/984942
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 957589 in libreoffice "LibreOffice ignores localized help" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/957589
<chrisccoulson> hey Sweetshark, pitti, didrocks
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i'm thinking about tackling a 5-digit bug today!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: go!
<pitti> Sweetshark: urgh, didn't we have a similar issue in Calc the other day?
<pitti> Sweetshark: is the corresponding libo-help-XX actually installed?
<pitti> Gabor confirmed, I think he checked that
<Sweetshark> pitti: it only happens when you have libo-help-en-US installed too. If you uninstall -en-US it works fine.
<Sweetshark> pitti: I suspect it to be a secret plot by the french in this channel to break the english monopoly.
<didrocks> damned, we have to do something else now :)
<didrocks> jibel: hey, is jenkins down? :)
<didrocks> ah no, it's up again, I think the 404 error was either in my cache from yesterday or a hickup
<seb128> hey
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> pitti, how are you?
<dupondje> please join a private chan for this ... :)
<seb128> heh
<pitti> seb128: quite fine, thanks; feeling my muscles from TKD training :)
<pitti> today I'm glad to have a desk job
<seb128> hehe, I guess it's a good thing, some exercice ;-)
<seb128> was tkd intense yesterday?
<pitti> yeah, quite
<rickspencer3> pitti, so, I just used another login account on my system, when I came back to this account, my trackpad was not working
<rickspencer3> trackpad works in lightdm and in guest session, though
<rickspencer3> I plugging in a mouse, also works
<rickspencer3> pitti, any suggestions on how to get debug info?
<seb128> rickspencer3, it was working before changing ussers?
<seb128> rickspencer3, hey btw ;-)
<rickspencer3> hi seb128 ;)
<rickspencer3> yes, it wasw working before changing users
<rickspencer3> seb128, oh, the buttons work, just not the pointing
<pitti> rickspencer3: do you see it in "xinput"?
<pitti> ah, you would then, if the buttons work
<RAOF> rickspencer3: âsynclient -lâ lists a bunch of potentially interesting info.
<pitti> rickspencer3: hm, I'm afraid I have no off-hand idea; I don't know how input devices work at that level
<pitti> ... but RAOF would! ;-)
 * RAOF wonders why his TouchpadOff variable is 2
<pitti> rickspencer3: a low-level test whether the kernel sees events is:
<rickspencer3> RAOF, http://paste.ubuntu.com/936598/
<pitti> check /dev/input/by-id/ for which event number your touchpad is
<pitti> and then run sudo /lib/udev/keymap -i input/eventX
<pitti> (with replacing X)
<pitti> and then move the touchpad and see whether you get some output
<pitti> I get tons of "(no scan code received)  key code: reserved" with each movement here
<rickspencer3> pitti, how do I find the "id" of the touchpad?
<rickspencer3> or just use tab?
<pitti> rickspencer3: as I said, you need to look into /dev/input/by-id/ and guess
<pitti> oh, the touchpad might not be there, hang on
<RAOF> rickspencer3: You can use âxinput listâ to find the id of your trackpad, then âxinput list-props $IDâ to list the properties of it; one of which will be it's /dev/input/event? node.
<pitti> rickspencer3: udevadm info --export-db | grep -B3 ID_INPUT_TOUCHPAD
<pitti> if that e. g. says DEVNAME=/dev/input/event11
<pitti> then use "keymap -i input/event11"
<pitti> rickspencer3: if you press buttons, you should see "scan code: 0x90001   key code: 110"
<pitti> and if you move mouse, "no scan code received"
<rickspencer3> pitti, is "keymap" a program name?
<pitti> "and then run sudo /lib/udev/keymap -i input/eventX"
<pitti> sorry for abbreviating
<rickspencer3> pitti, I assume this means I should be using event6 ?
<rickspencer3> E: DEVPATH=/devices/platform/i8042/serio1/input/input6/event6
<rickspencer3> E: ID_INPUT=1
<rickspencer3> E: ID_INPUT.tags=inspiron_1011
<rickspencer3> E: ID_INPUT_TOUCHPAD=1
<pitti> rickspencer3: correct
<pitti> sudo /lib/udev/keymap -i input/event6
<rickspencer3> pitti, ok, it's not registering any events, though the buttons are working
<pitti> rickspencer3: not even for buttons?
<rickspencer3> so, I presume the buttons are separate from the trackpad
<pitti> that's weird
<RAOF> rickspencer3: What does âxinput list-props $IDâ (with ID gathered from xinput list) show?
<rickspencer3> weird, I tried all the #s from 1 and the buttons never showed up
<rickspencer3> RAOF, sorry, I'm not sure where you want me to find $ID
<RAOF> run âxinput listâ, that'll spit out a list of all the input devices X thinks you have, and their IDs as seen by X.
<RAOF> For example, http://paste2.org/p/1985724 is mine.
<RAOF> And my trackpad has ID 12.
<RAOF> (I could also use âSynPS/2 Synaptics TouchPadâ as the ID, but the number is substantially easier to get past the shell âº)
<rickspencer3> RAOF, ok, there is a lot of output, hold on
<Laney> pitti: Could you take a look at bug #968845 quickly please and see if you think it'd be appropriate to add a quirk to pm-utils for it?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 968845 in xserver-xorg-input-synaptics "bcm5974 touchpad doesn't work after S3 on MacBookAir" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/968845
<RAOF> Laney: Didn't that get fixed in the xserver yet?
<rickspencer3> RAOF, http://paste.ubuntu.com/936607/
<RAOF> Laney: Ah, sorry.  Wrong context :)
<Laney> nein :P
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Hm.  Nothing seems suspicious there.
 * rickspencer3 ponders
<rickspencer3> RAOF, well, I have that info saved
<rickspencer3> I haven't updated in days
<rickspencer3> I'll see if I can make a reproducer for this
<rickspencer3> if so, I'll log a bug and subscribe you
<RAOF> Thanks.
<rickspencer3> otherwise, I'll assume this all happened in a dream
<pitti> Laney: if it's confirmed to work (i. e. the module or X.org don't act up on module removal/readdition), it sounds fine to me
<pitti> Laney: but it should have a proper upstream kernel bug report, as it's just a workaround
<Laney> well, they 'act up' in that some options are reset
<Laney> i.e. horizontal scrolling
<Laney> but it's better than the alternative which is the primary button being pressed all of the time
<Laney> I'm hoping Chase will handle a proper fix at some point :-)
<RAOF> I'm not sure, but that might be a part of his input fixes on the xorg mailing list at the moment.
<bryceh> rickspencer3, MacbookPro?
<rickspencer3> bryceh, dell mini 10v
<chrisccoulson> nice: https://twitter.com/#!/hsivonen/status/192898790078943232 :)
<bryceh> rickspencer3, I don't think you're alone, we've had other similar reports (usually correlated to S3 rather than logout/login).  Most reports are MacBookPro.
<rickspencer3> bryceh, hmmm, sounds kernelly
<rickspencer3> ^incisive technical analysis
<rickspencer3> bryceh, ok, I'll work on seeing if I can make a reproducer
<rickspencer3> bryceh, and data I can get you while I still have the issue?
<RAOF> But it's only *your* user where it's broken, right?
<mpt> cyphermox, you're the person to ask about NetworkManager, right?
<RAOF> I think bryceh is talking about bug #968845 which Laney brought up.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 968845 in xserver-xorg-input-synaptics "bcm5974 touchpad doesn't work after S3 on MacBookAir" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/968845
<bryceh> rickspencer3, I've seen the symptom after s3 on one dell laptop but not my 10v
<bryceh> rickspencer3, dmesg and lsmod, although I am doubtful either provide any useful data.
<rickspencer3> bryceh, this looks like the last mention of my touchpad in dmesg
<rickspencer3> http://paste.ubuntu.com/936623/
<bryceh> yeah, no error messages.  you're probably right that it's a kernel bug.  a bisection search might be called for.
<pitti> didrocks: nice response in bug 983254
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 983254 in nux "Unity use ibus explicitly, make it impossible to use other input method" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/983254
<pitti> didrocks: but I have the feeling there's little point in trying to further it..
<bryceh> nite
<pitti> bryceh: sleep well
<didrocks> pitti: thanks! yeah, I agree this won't change anything now on. Hence that's why I told that I made my point and will stop on it :)
<seb128> didrocks, hey
<seb128> didrocks, happy friday! ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: I didn't dare making that joke, but as you do it! Happy Friday! :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, you have some way before using that joke as much as I did in the easter week :p
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, indeed, I'm in debt ;)
<seb128> pitti, btw mhr3 blames part of the dash opening slowness on you :p
<seb128> pitti, seems the slowest part for the app lens is gnome-menus reading .desktop files
<mhr3> yep, it's like 300ms on a warm system, i dont even want to know how much is it for cold start
<seb128> on you or on vuntz ;-)
<didrocks> that's probably why with all my read issues on my hd, it's really aweful
<didrocks> I don't remember, vuntz didn't like the one file trigger idea, isn't it?
<seb128> I'm not sure now
<didrocks> should we add back a work item for next cycle to reapply what pitti did on the new gnome-menus?
<seb128> he didn't like the keyfile based file
<seb128> it was supposed to be redone with gvariant iirc
<didrocks> hum, that would work, mapping it
<pitti> didrocks: s/reapply/rework from scratch/, the old approach doesn't work any more
<pitti> and not in python-gmenu
<didrocks> pitti: oh, is it that different?
<seb128> but from the gnome-menus changelog we dropped the patch because it didn't apply with the GNOME3 refactoring
<seb128> and we judged by then that without menus it was "less useful"
<pitti> it remains to be seen whether a gvariant is really that much faster than reading a text file, but the implementation doesn't matter much I guess
<seb128> right
<seb128> I don't remember now if vuntz said that would work well with the new gnome-menus for some reason
<seb128> or if that's just that the patch needed to be refactored
<vuntz> seb128: the patch would have to live in glib/gio now
<seb128> vuntz, oh, dropping it on desrt! I see ;-)
<vuntz> seb128: since gnome-menus now just does "g_desktop_app_info_new_from_filename (path)"  (more or less)
<vuntz> (and then rely on the GDesktopAppInfo API)
<seb128> ok, that was probably the reason we dropped it rather than trying to "port it", I didn't remember the details
<seb128> that's a bit tricky :-(
<seb128> vuntz, hey btw, how are you? ;-)
<vuntz> good!
<vuntz> I just had some early lunch (I missed breakfast), so now  things are nearly perfect ;-)
<vuntz> how are things in germany? :-)
<seb128> vuntz, you mean in alsace?
<seb128> good ;-)
<seb128> I had a late breakfast rather than an early lunch :p
<vuntz> late breakfast is a good approach too :-)
<Sweetshark> seb128: could you forward me your mail to ubuntu-desktop about libreoffice integration tests, so that I can reply to directly (I am subscribed digest only)?
<seb128> Sweetshark, I can try, I'm not sure thunderbird do proper "bouncing", if that doesn't work you might want to try pitti, I'm sure mutt does ;-)
<pitti> yes, can do
<pitti> Sweetshark: you have it
<seb128> pitti, danke
<kenvandine> good morning all!
<seb128> kenvandine, hey, it's a middle of night ken!
<seb128> kenvandine, having sleeping troubles?
<kenvandine> nah, just getting a couple hours of work in before the kids get up :)
<seb128> kenvandine, isn't like 6am for you?
<seb128> kenvandine, what a brave man ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks for getting the datetime fix in!
<kenvandine> seb128, thx for testing it!
<didrocks> hey kenvandine, you should grab a coffee :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, on my second cup :)
<didrocks> heh ;)
<Sweetshark> pitti, seb128: thanks a lot
<jasoncwarner_> hey didrocks I was just about to go to bed when I saw this... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/985539
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 985539 in unity "Awkward graphic glitches in Compiz" [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> looking
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: you saw it, you mean, you reproduce the issue?
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: no, sorry, saw the bug report
<didrocks> or just saw the bug?
<jasoncwarner_> yeah
<jasoncwarner_> wasn't sure if real or if others were seeing for some reason...
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: well, we didn't hear anything like that lately, so it seems to be an isolated issue.
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: we can still poke the opengl guys on it
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: that is what I was hoping for
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: but at least, it's not a widespread issue
<jasoncwarner_> (both of those, thanks)
<jasoncwarner_> yes, good.. :)
<didrocks> you can go to bed :)
<kklimonda> seb128: wrt bug 951000 it seems to be some weird issue with apparmor - there are a lot of appamor messages in dmesg when I login as guest.. unfortunately by disabling apparmor *once* I've apparently fixed the issue and now I can't debug it any further :(
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 951000 in lightdm "disable guest session screen lock using gsettings" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/951000
<kklimonda> dbus-daemon gets a lot of denied_mask="r" on /proc/[pid]/cmdline
<seb128> kklimonda, weird
<seb128> kklimonda, did you try to reboot to see if it still happens after restart?
<kklimonda> seb128: yeah, it doesn't
<seb128> ok, weird, I guess you can close the bug
<seb128> not a lot we can do if it stopped happening
<kklimonda> seb128: it's like disabling apparmor let lightdm write something somewhere which has fixed the issue
<seb128> I will try on a new install later today when I do iso testing
<kklimonda> unfortunately there is nothing in the audit.. really weird
<kklimonda> (nothing that would suggest that apparmor is denying writing to files)
<kklimonda> seb128: actually now that I checked "gsettings get org.gnome.desktop.screensaver lock-enabled" returns true but the "lock session" menu entry is gone, ctrl+alt+L doesn't work and the related "Lock & Brightness" options are disabled..
<kklimonda> switching between guest and "user" session doesn't look the screen so it seems to be working fine
<kklimonda> lock*
<rickspencer3> jasoncwarner_, hey, still around? I heard something about a new sound theme earlier this cycle, did anything come of that?
<seb128> rickspencer3, I can reply to that if you want ;-)
<rickspencer3> seb128, yes please
<rickspencer3> ;)
<seb128> rickspencer3, it was too late for precise
<rickspencer3> thanks seb128
<didrocks> hum thunder and rain, I'm sure it's seb128's fault :)
<seb128> didrocks, no rain here! ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: see, your fault, you send it to me! :)
<seb128> didrocks, I like to share!
<didrocks> yeah, sometimes you can keep that for you :p
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> does anyone know about at-spi-bus-launcher and what it's useful for?
<seb128> ok
<seb128> dunno about at-spi but I opened bug #985640 and assigned to TheMuso
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 985640 in unity-greeter "use wrong path for at-spi-bus-launcher command" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/985640
<cyphermox> mpt: yes, I'm the perso to ask about NetworkManager, how can I help you?
<mpt> :-)
<mpt> cyphermox, did awe ask you about WEP recently?
<cyphermox> he asked about WEP passphrases or something like that
<cyphermox> or do you mean WPS?
<mpt> WEP passphrases, yes
<cyphermox> that should work fine
<cyphermox> it's a little weird looking though
<cyphermox> I think the problem lies in the detection of what a user might want to fill in based on the configuration of the AP, I think in all cases it turns out asking you to enter a WEP hex key, rather than a passphrase when you could enter the passphrase; but both are available in UI
<cyphermox> mpt: unfortunately I don't have a spare AP here in the office but I can muck with this some more later tonight
<cyphermox> I opted to not bring a wireless router today ;)
<cyphermox> nevermind that, there was one in the lab
<mpt> cyphermox, ok, if he asked about it then I don't need to :-)
<cyphermox> mpt: that weird WEP thing I noticed a few weeks ago, it's my mistake to not think more about it and file a bug, but I was helping a friend fix her wifi :)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, bug 945987 sucks :(
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 945987 in rhythmbox "No Settings are available in "Preferred format", only preset defaults are used" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/945987
<cyphermox> mpt: right, the detection is probably broken, but creating the wifi network manually works. just tested here and I can totally reproduce that issue
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah, ronoc is looking at it
<ronoc> seb128, the line input bug or the encoding profile  ?
<ronoc> well i'm on both today
<seb128> ronoc, the profile one
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how did you notice?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i just tried ripping a CD with rhythmbox ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, like do you do encoding? or did that got some user ranting on forums or twitter?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, ok
<seb128> so bug #973491 wth
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 973491 in nautilus "nautilus popup menu highlighting using copy and paste incorrect" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/973491
<seb128> does anyone has a clue what component could be buggy there?
<seb128> nautilus context menu items like "paste" are sometime displayed as unactive but yet still active, if they are rendered as unactive but you can select them and they work
<seb128> kenvandine, desrt, mterry: ^ any clue?
<seb128> same happen without appmenu, ie unset UBUNTU_MENUPROXY
<kenvandine> humm
<seb128> demo on https://launchpadlibrarian.net/100170099/nautilus_bug.ogv
<mterry> seb128, maybe an issue with the new 'unfocused window' support in compiz/light-themes?
<mterry> but that would be the whole popup
<mterry> not just one item
<seb128> right, I somewhat doubt it
<seb128> the first report is also from february and I think that compiz,theme change landed after that
<seb128> let me check the timing
<kenvandine> it was late
<kenvandine> so it looks like the new window getting focus after having the copy in the clipboard works
<bdrung> hi, some indicators crashed with an update. can someone tell me how to launch them again?
<mterry> Seems like theme has to be involved somewhere though...  nautilus isn't doing custom popup drawing.  (is it?!)
<kenvandine> so maybe it is a signal getting lost
<seb128> kenvandine, well, the menu is active, you can select it
<seb128> mterry, I'm not sure...
<kenvandine> seb128, try changing the theme
<seb128> bdrung, unity? which indicators?
<kenvandine> or without compiz
<kenvandine> to rule those out
<seb128> kenvandine, one report says it happens with unity2d
<bdrung> seb128: unity + compiz. the indicators for messages and system
<seb128> bdrung, try restarting unity-panel-service
<seb128> but it's weird, they should autoreload on issues
<kenvandine> i just reproduced it with adwaita
<mterry> I don't get the paste bug myself.  :-/
<mterry> kenvandine, nice
<seb128> mterry, I get it every second try
<seb128> nautilus --quit and do what is on the video is enough for me
<bdrung> seb128: http://paste.debian.net/163824/
<seb128> 933744 states "this seems to happen on occasion in both unity (3d) & unity-2d"
<seb128> bdrung, is it one running?
<seb128> "(unity-panel-service:4640): Indicator-Appmenu-CRITICAL **: Unable to claim the name com.canonical.AppMenu.Registrar"
<seb128> suggests there is
<bdrung> yes, it's running, but killall told me it's not.
<mterry> Nope, quiting nautilus doesn't give it to me...
<seb128> bdrung, kill -9 id
<ogra_> or pkill
<bdrung> yes, kill -9 helped. it automatically relaunched it.
<bdrung> thanks. all indicators are back.
<seb128> cool
<kenvandine> i reproduced it in unity 2d as well
<kenvandine> so not theme or compiz
<seb128> mterry, I need to open the context menu first
 * kenvandine has to head out to lunch now, i get to have lunch with my son today :)
<kenvandine> bbl
<seb128> mterry, like nautilus; click on an empty part of the background to open the menu, then right click on an icon, copy, and try to paste
<seb128> kenvandine, have fun, ttyl ;-)
<mterry> seb128, yup, did that several times
<seb128> mterry, ok, you got lucky then :p or it's a timing thing ...
<mterry> oh
<mterry> wait
<mterry> i didn't do the pointless right click on empty first
<mterry> I always went straight for the copy
<seb128> mterry, that's the key part!
<seb128> ;-)
<mterry> doh
<mterry> yeah...
<mterry> like the first context menu is 'locking in' the gray status for paste or something
<mterry> I wonder if nautilus does do custom menu items
 * seb128 does a build from upstream tarball without patch 
<seb128> mterry, what do you mean "custom menu items"?
<seb128> they use gtkuimanager I think
<mterry> seb128, bummer.  Like if they used menu items that had custom draw methods or something
<seb128> I doubt it
 * mterry never underestimates the nautilus developers' love of writing code
<seb128> it happens with the upstream tarball
<seb128> so not a local patch
<mterry> rickspencer3, didrocks: quickly minus pygame just landed in precise
<didrocks> mterry: awesome \o/
<rickspencer3> mterry, does this mean I can uninstall desktopcouch now?
<mterry> rickspencer3, quickly doesn't need it anymore, yeah
<rickspencer3> sweet!
<rickspencer3> thanks mterry
<rickspencer3> I still think my pygame sprite library is pretty sweet
<rickspencer3> I'll put it in another package
<rickspencer3> and it can continue to get zero usage from there
 * mterry pats rickspencer3 on the back
<seb128> kenvandine, mterry: nothing like pinging upstream ;-) cosimoc has the issue on fedora and thinks it might be
<seb128> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=672046
<ubot2> Gnome bug 672046 in GtkStyleContext "Text-shadow in breadcrumbs needs attention" [Minor,New]
<mterry> seb128, nice
<didrocks> see you guys, have a good Friday and week-end! (tomorrow is off for me)
<pitti> godo nighth everyone
<pitti> (erk typing)
<seb128> pitti, iz beer'o'clock?
<chrisccoulson> you don't need to realize a widget in gtk3 for it to have a GtkStyleContext, do you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good question for #gtk+ on irc.gnome.org
<seb128> chrisccoulson, what are you looking at?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, it's ok. i think i figured it out already
<seb128> ok
<chrisccoulson> i'm reviewing the theme integration part of the gtk3 port of firefox
<kenvandine> yay... gtk3 port of firefox!
<seb128> \o/
<seb128> when does it land? :p
 * kenvandine leaks to omg
<kenvandine> wait 3 minutes for them to post an article :)
<seb128> kenvandine, he said we would have firefox on gtk3 in precise right? ;-)
<kenvandine> that is what i told omg
<kenvandine> :-p
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> it's nothing to get excited about ;)
<chrisccoulson> the patches have been there on bugzilla for ages now, and i've been assigned reviews to some of them for quite a while now
<chrisccoulson> just taking the opportunity to clear those :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, that means you clear backlog, soon you will look at g-s-d start time issues ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, don't forget to email the desktop list about your chromium by default topic for UDS ;-)
<kenvandine> which will get ported to gtk3 first... firefox or chromium
<kenvandine> it's a race!
 * kenvandine is actually kind of liking epiphany again, epiphany by default!
<seb128> kenvandine, I'm waiting for somebody to suggest midori now
<seb128> ;-)
<kenvandine> :-D
<cyphermox> well, of course we should be using midori by default
<seb128> see!
<seb128> cyphermox, hey ;-) how are you?
<cyphermox> not too bad
<cyphermox> and you?
<kenvandine> lynx!
<seb128> cyphermox, I'm good thanks
<kenvandine> the security team would love that
<kenvandine> :)
<cyphermox> I think we should switch default browsers every release to really make the security team love us
<kenvandine> indeed
<dobey> athena ftw
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, it won't be chromium. they're dropping gtk entirely ;)
<chrisccoulson> and moving to their new aura toolkit across all platforms
<cyphermox> I'm keeping suggesting w3m as default browser for the W release
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, ugh... lets make it look more foreign
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: so they can be as poorly integrated with Linux as Firefox? ;)
<jbicha> epiphany-browser ftw
<jbicha> lol
<jbicha> or just use epiphany
<kenvandine> jbicha, i just realized, as annoying as it is to have the name clash, i've never actually even looked at what epiphany is
<kenvandine> just bitch and moan about having to install epiphany-browser
<kenvandine> oh, that is chromium isn't it?
<kklimonda> kenvandine: a boulder dash clone ;)
<kklimonda> which I've discovered by installing it by accident - probably the way everyone else does ;)
<dobey> chrisccoulson: so chrome then. clearly we need another widget set in the default install.
<kenvandine> dobey, yeah, we don't have enough yet
<kklimonda> *sighs*
<jbicha> can't we just use a Dash lens to browse the web?
 * dobey ports ubuntuone to fltk
<kklimonda> dobey: you've already portet it to Qt, stop the madness before it's too late ;)
<bcurtiswx> oh thunderbird why must you lie to me and show 2 unanswered emails when I'm pretty sure i've read them all :(
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, is that for a gmail account?
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, IDK it just shows 2 on the unity dock icon nothing in the app itself though
<kenvandine> i think that is a gmail problem... i can't ever have zero unread messages in my gmail, even in the web ui
<bcurtiswx> the web UI shows 0 for me..
<kenvandine> if i mark all as read, gmail still says there are 2 unread
<kenvandine> been that way for years
<kenvandine> drives me nuts
<kenvandine> and if you filter on unread it finds none
<kenvandine> that is probably chrisccoulson's fault then :)
<bcurtiswx> so I should hire a team of people with pitchforms and firesticks to march towards his home?
<bcurtiswx> pitchforks*
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, you would get pretty wet
<kenvandine> :)
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, ferry's aren't _THAT_ expensive...
<bcurtiswx> OK, gotta head out then bowling later, nite all
<kenvandine> later
<kenvandine> have fun
<chrisccoulson> dobey, you don't want another widget set in the default install? everybody loves chrome, don't they? ;)
<dobey> chrisccoulson: i'm trying to diversify our profile. i'll make sure we use at least 5 in u1 for 12.10 :)
<chrisccoulson> mmm, beer
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, i'll have a tasty one tonight in your honor :)
<Ursinha> hey guys, I was wondering if I was on crack when I saw some unity configuration options in All Settings->Appearance
<kenvandine> Ursinha, not on crack :)
<Ursinha> because I can't see it anymore
<Ursinha> maybe I'm on crack now? :)
<kenvandine> i still see them
<Ursinha> hm
<kenvandine> bottom of the panel on the "Look" tab there is launcher icon size
<kenvandine> a slider
<kenvandine> and on the "Behavior" tab
<kenvandine> there is autohide
<Ursinha> that on Appearance, right?
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> not seeing that?
<Ursinha> no
<Ursinha> I saw that when I installed
<Ursinha> but now -- after a couple of unity --replace s -- it's not there anymore
<kenvandine> odd
<kenvandine> maybe those are only displayed when you are running unity and it doesn't realize you are running unity now?
<kenvandine> Ursinha, try a logout and back in and see
<kenvandine> could be a bug there
<Ursinha> yes, I think it's a bug
<Ursinha> will do that, a moment
<kenvandine> i guess it would make sense for them to only be displayed in unity, so it must be that
<Ursinha> kenvandine, there you go, logged in with another user and a fresh logged unity displayed the options there
<Ursinha> but once I unity --replace, it's still unity, right?
<kenvandine> Ursinha, i would think it should be
<kenvandine> i just confirmed it isn't there in a gnome classic session
<Ursinha> I'll file a bug
<Ursinha> right
<kenvandine> and the launcher size slider isn't there in unity-2d
<Ursinha> I'll file a bug then
<kenvandine> thx
<Ursinha> thanks for your help kenvandine !
<kenvandine> np
<kenvandine> thx for finding bugs!
<Ursinha> :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-04-20
<pitti> Good morning
<thumper> I've just done a fresh install of precise on my server
<thumper> (hard disk failure)
<thumper> but I want to set a static IP address
<thumper> yes... still IPv4
<thumper> what is the minimal bits I need to change?
<pitti> thumper: hey
<pitti> thumper: ah, you've come to the right place for UI-less servers ;-)
<pitti> thumper: more seriously, do you want to edit conffiles or do you have GNOME/network-manager on this box?
<thumper> pitti: hey... I have it running unity :)
<pitti> oh, heh: )
<thumper> pitti: it is a desktop
<thumper> but I treat it as a server
<thumper> :)
<thumper> my media server
<pitti> so, network indicator -> edit connections -> cable based -> add
<thumper> add, not edit?
<pitti> create a new connection, siwtch to the "IPv4 settings" tab, change from "DHCP" to "Manual", and enter teh data
<pitti> thumper: if you have an existing connection, sure, editing will do
<thumper> when I just tried this, it wouldn't allow me to save
<pitti> I don't have any (using Wifi)
<thumper> ah... hang on, that time save enabled...
<thumper> lets see if it works
<pitti> thumper: the save button only becomes active if you add an IP
<pitti> (or switch to "Auto")
<thumper> ideally I didn't want to specify dns
<thumper> but it seems without it...
<thumper> it won't find anything :)
<pitti> for more flexibility you can also just edit /etc/network/interfaces
<pitti> something like
<pitti> auto eth0
<pitti> iface eth0 inet dhcp
<pitti> that should suffice
<pitti> err, no, not "dhcp", but "static"
<pitti> and add "address" and "netmask", see man interfaces
<BigWhale> Morning.
<thumper> way... adding the DNS servers made it happy :)
<thumper> now to install sshd
<Sweetshark> Morning everyone!
<pitti> hey Sweetshark
<pitti> RAOF: hey Chris, how are you?
<RAOF> Good!
<RAOF> I think I may be closing in on why two-finger scrolling sometimes stops working until you reload psmouse.
<pitti> RAOF: are you up for some SRU training wrt. handling kernel uploads? There's something I want to try
<pitti> (not necessarily right now, in a few hours is fine as well)
<RAOF> Yeah, I can do that.
<RAOF> You know I can't copy to -updates due to LP bugs, though, right?
<pitti> RAOF: why not?
<pitti> permission issues?
<RAOF> Because the copy times out.
<pitti> RAOF: ah, not any more
<RAOF> Ooooh!
<pitti> there is never a reason to go to cocoplum any more to release SRUs
<pitti> RAOF: sru-release was changed from the synchronous copyPackage (which often timed out) to the async syncPackage()
<RAOF> pitti: That's not quite true though, right?  There's the handful of packages which still need manual tweaking with shell access to do (debian-installer & update-manager are the ones I remember offhand)?
<pitti> RAOF: so you can release kernels just as any other SRU, except that most kernels also go to -security and thus you need the -s flag
<pitti> RAOF: right, that's correct
<RAOF> Good, just keeping up :)
<pitti> RAOF: releaseing kernels is easy now, though
<pitti> RAOF: copying kernels to -proposed which do NOT  bump API (i. e. don't require a new linux-meta) is also easy
<pitti> just run the copy-package script on pending-sru.html, and you are good
<pitti> RAOF: the tricky part is copying kernel abi bumps, as the new packages routinely land in universe and need to be promoted
<RAOF> Yay bugs.
<RAOF> I have the permissions to fix that up though, don't I?
<pitti> RAOF: I usually run copy-proposed-kernel, then ssh cocoplum and move them to main
<pitti> but I wanted to try something
<pitti> RAOF: do you have a bookmark for "pending kernel SRU tasks"?
<pitti> https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-sru/+assignedbugs?field.status%3Alist=CONFIRMED&field.status%3Alist=TRIAGED&field.status%3Alist=INPROGRESS&field.status%3Alist=FIXCOMMITTED&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITH_RESPONSE&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITHOUT_RESPONSE
<pitti> RAOF: we just have one task right now
<RAOF> I do not, but there's the "open bugs" button on the pending-sru page, rigth?
<pitti> RAOF: that doesn't help for the kernel tasks
<pitti> the kernel SRU workflow is a bit different; we don't actually run sru-accept for kernels
<pitti> RAOF: so I would like to run that one task with you, and try something
<RAOF> Ok.
<pitti> let's switch to /msg to not spam the channel
<micahg> pitti: what's the proper upstream name for gsettings-desktop-schemas (Capitalization wise)
<pitti> micahg: hm, I think it's just that
 * micahg was going to use GSettings desktop schemas (not sure about the last 2 words, but the first is like that in the README
<pitti> micahg: looks fine
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<pitti> hey tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> pitti, did you get mail from OdyX?
<pitti> tkamppeter: yes, I added him to the project last night and told him, he just pinged bck
<tkamppeter> pitti, OdyX has uploaded a new cups-filters package to Debian as it seems that Debian has no libtiff5 any more.
<tkamppeter> pitti, up to nowthere is no new commit by OdyX.
<pitti> tkamppeter: yes, he said he'd push "later tonight"
<seb128> hey
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> pitti, guten tag! wie geht's?
<seb128> pitti, happy friday ;-)
<pitti> je suis bien, merci!
<pitti> and to you
<pitti> I need to file the release team report, stuck in bug triage..
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<seb128> well, now is a good time for bug triage
<seb128> I've been triaged mostly this week, iso testing as well today I guess
<pitti> right
<pitti> I spent all day on hackign pygobject yesterday, that was a nice diversion
 * pitti sighs at http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-precise/canonical-desktop-team.html and will just do a mass dropping
<seb128> seems RAOF own most of the remining ones
<seb128> 5 todo and 1 in progress
<pitti> there are about 30 left
<seb128> and Luke has 6
<seb128> pitti, well most of others are 1 by people and mostly not-so-precise-related items
<seb128> like rickspencer3 has 2
<seb128> rickspencer3, update your work items! ;-)
<seb128> pitti, I just handled my 2 remaining ones
<pitti> thanks
<pitti> [mvo] backport apt-clone to lucid (lp:~mvo/apt-clone/lucid-backport): INPROGRESS
<pitti> mvo: ^ this looks DONE? or is there more to it?
<mvo> pitti: uh, last time I looked at this  iirc there was a missing dh_python2 in lucid
<micahg> missing as in has not been backported yet?
<mvo> iirc yes
<micahg> this is true :)
<micahg> Bug #788524
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 788524 in python-defaults "backport dh_python2 to lucid (and maverick if appropriate)" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/788524
<mvo> ok
<pitti> mvo: ah, ok
<seb128> mvo, hey, how are you?
<mvo> hey seb128
<mvo> good, busy, good, release time!
<mvo> pitti: I guess I could simply convert, let me look at the code again
<seb128> mvo, ;-) for me release time is quiet time ;-)
<seb128> they wouldn't let me get fixes in now, so I can sleep :p
<pitti> mvo: I'm fine with "postponed", too, I'm just running through the remaining ones to check that we don't drop something urgent/important
<mvo> seb128: haha
<pitti> -proposed is wide open!
<mvo> pitti: ok, if you have it in front of you, just set it to postponed, otherwise I will do that
<mvo> (but need to hunt the blueprint first ;)
<pitti> mvo: doing
<pitti> mvo: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-p-lts-upgrades FYI
<mvo> ta
 * pitti hugs apt
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<BigWhale> How can this make it into Ubuntu? https://github.com/engla/keybinder/tree/keybinder-3.0
<BigWhale> keybinder that is now included is Gtk2 only
<RAOF> BigWhale: You know, the ideal way to get that into Ubuntu is to have GTK suck it up.
<RAOF> BigWhale: It's *still* stupid that GTK doesn't have an API for that :)
<BigWhale> I know.
<BigWhale> :/
<RAOF> Just as long as we're on the same page :)
<RAOF> Incidentally, I didn't know that code had got itself libraryised.
<RAOF> I should probably rip out the copy in Do an depend on that instead.
<RAOF> Oh.  GPL?  Really?
<BigWhale> I never bothered to research a bit more into this. If I did, I'd probably repackage keybinder for Precise ... Crap.
<RAOF> Oooh, there's exactly one rdepend of the existing libkeybinder0.
<BigWhale> RAOF, what is it?
<RAOF> BigWhale: The xfce volume daemon.
<RAOF> (As in: sound volume)
<BigWhale> oh
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, good thanks. although, my daughter is not too well today
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh? she got a cold or something?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, she's just got a cold
<chrisccoulson> https://twitter.com/#!/chrisccoulson/status/193067610122887168/photo/1/large ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I should subscribe to twitter and follow you ;-)
<RAOF> Good to see that the prime directive of the internet is still in effect :)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<seb128> hey RAOF, how are you?
<RAOF> Hey seb128.  Good!
<chrisccoulson> seb128, you like cats don't you?
<chrisccoulson> https://twitter.com/#!/chrisccoulson/status/193268814723547136
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I love cats!
<seb128> lol
<seb128> nice picture ;-)
<chrisccoulson> it seems one of ours decided to sleep in a an old flower pot ;)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> oh
<chrisccoulson> i've just noticed from that photo that he's lost his collar!
<chrisccoulson> gah
<chrisccoulson> he keeps doing that
<seb128> why do you put him a collar?
<chrisccoulson> so people don't think he's a stray. and the bell also frightens the birds away, to stop him from sneaking up on them ;)
<chrisccoulson> we end up with dead brids all over the garden when he hasn't got a collar on ;)
<seb128> poor cat, can't even get a bird for lunch?
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> we do feed him
<seb128> ;-)
<ogra_> is didrocks on vacation today ?
 * ogra_ has a compiz change he would need to upload, but there are un-uploaded changes in the branch 
<pitti> ogra_: yes
<ogra_> k :(
<seb128> pitti, he swapper his easter monday for today
<seb128> swapped
<seb128> ups
<seb128> ogra_, ^
<pitti> ITYM ogra
<seb128> pitti, indeed ;-)
<ogra_> well, thanks, i'll talk to the release team if monday is still ok for a 0 day SRU
<ogra_> i just dont want to upload stuff he didnt nod off
<seb128> ogra_, yeah, you will be up for a rant again about wth you guys are doing coming so late in the cycle with non working stuff
<ogra_> seb128, it would have worked without that werid branch stuff :P
<seb128> lol
<seb128> it would have worked if had landed 3 months earlier
<ogra_> well, i was promised that patch for opening of precise ...
<ogra_> somehow there was some kind of a slight slowdown :)
<ogra_> (though i also was promised the same patch for the opening of oneiric ... dunno what made me hope for it to be ready when 12.04 opens :P )
<Chipaca> anybody here able to give a hand with an issue i'm seeing in a scope?
<vuntz> chrisccoulson: hey, just wondering if you updated the patch in https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=608402 to fix my comments?
<ubot2> Gnome bug 608402 in general "Add support for delaying autostart applications" [Enhancement,New]
<tkamppeter> pitti, I got a fix for bug 980673 in cups-filters.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 980673 in cups-filters "pdftopdf crashed with SIGSEGV" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/980673
<tkamppeter> pitti, probably now it should go as SRU. I will put cups-filters 1.0.17 onto the Debian BZR, can the SRU also be 1.0.17 or should it have the fix in debian/patches (1.0.17 differs from 1.0.16 only by this patch)?
<pitti> tkamppeter: no, it can also be 1.0.17
<pitti> tkamppeter: right, just upload to -proposed
<tkamppeter> pitti, OK, it is on its way now.
<tkamppeter> pitti, fix for bug 980673 is uploaded to -proposed for an SRU now. It is also committed to the Debian BZR.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 980673 in cups-filters "pdftopdf crashed with SIGSEGV" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/980673
<desrt> happy friday
<seb128> desrt, hey, happy friday! how are you?
<desrt> us usual, i'll be able to tell after coffee :)
<seb128> ;-)
<nessita> hello everyone! would you please remind me which is the proper channel to report unity issues?
<kenvandine> nessita, #ubuntu-unity
<nessita> kenvandine: thanks!
<kenvandine> anytime!
<dobey> dpm: ping
<dobey> dpm: n/m
<desrt> mterry: apparently you've been naughty?
<seb128> desrt, is that the autostart delay stuff?
<desrt> yes
<seb128> desrt, it was a "let's assume GNOME doesn't have reason to reject that simple patch and not go through a temporary name and transition"
<seb128> if you want the reason to use X-GNOME-
<seb128> but the patch has been sitting in bugzilla and never went it
<mterry> desrt, hello.  I have?!
<seb128> mterry, in fact chrisccoulson had
<seb128> desrt, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=608402 for the record
<ubot2> Gnome bug 608402 in general "Add support for delaying autostart applications" [Enhancement,New]
<mterry> phew  :)
<seb128> or vuntz had
<seb128> desrt, "Vincent Untz [gnome-session developer] 2010-01-29 01:03:03 UTC
<seb128> Please prefix the key name with X-GNOME"
 * mterry doesn't want to ruin his Christmas haul
<desrt> seb128: on the assumption that the patch would go upstream that makes sense
<seb128> desrt, I think it's not fair to blame us to do what upstream asked on the bug review
<desrt> seb128: nobody is blaming
<seb128> desrt, "<mclasen_> what I most strongly dislike is the use of X-GNOME for something that is not, in fact, a gnome thing"
<seb128> desrt, but well, let's not argue on details ;-)
<desrt> well, that part is true :)
<desrt> it's clear what happened, though
<seb128> ...
<desrt> you took the patch on assumption that it would one day make it upstream
<seb128> I think they is no bad willing there
<desrt> it never did
<desrt> i agree
<seb128> there
<vuntz> for reference, it would help to have the latest version of the patch in the bug :-)
<seb128> vuntz, I can do that ;-)
<vuntz> since the X-GNOME thing was requested in the last review, and there's no patch uploaded after that
<vuntz> bonus point if everything mentioned in the review is fixed
<desrt> then the solution is that gnome takes the patch and everyone is happy
<seb128> right
<seb128> well mclasen didn't seem so happy about GNOME taking that patch
<desrt> seb128: i'm not thrilled about the approach myself
<seb128> better suggestions that work today or would work with reasonable efforts are welcome ;-)
 * vuntz is not thrilled but doesn't care enough to argue against or for :-)
<desrt> seb128: 'take the patch' ;)
<seb128> "let's do nothing until we fix that will in 3 years" not so good ;-)
<seb128> will->well
<dpm> dobey, sorry, I was on the phone. Is there anything I can still help with?
<dpm> if it's the bug with untranslated Yes/No/Cancel, I'm talking about it with mandel
<dobey> dpm: it was that bug, yes
<dpm> ok
<seb128> vuntz, I've attached the current version, chrisccoulson should still update it to address your review comments though ;-)
<chrisccoulson> hi!
<chrisccoulson> oh, that one again ;)
<chrisccoulson> perhaps i should do non-firefox desktop work for a cycle :)
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, when we switch to midori you can :)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<dobey> kenvandine: what, are we going to just ship elementary now?
<kenvandine> :)
<desrt> seb128: (looking over bug mails) the nfs/ecryptfs homedir thing is what causes the crashes in refresh()
<desrt> seb128: the segv one is the one that i think is happening on logout
<seb128> desrt, did I comment asking on the wrong one? ;-)
<desrt> seb128: i already asked it on the other one
<desrt> and the reporter confirmed that they have ecryptfs
<seb128> desrt, oh ok, I got confused, thanks ;-)
<seb128> desrt, how does ecryptfs lead to that issue?
<desrt> seb128: mmap on ecryptfs seems unreliable
<seb128> hum
<seb128> never got an issue here
<desrt> for the same reason that it's unreliable on nfs, i guess
<desrt> ya... not will-always-fail
<desrt> just not totally reliable
<desrt> enough that we get a few bugs about it...
<seb128> ok, I'm a bit surprised still, but if you are confident it's that ;-)
<desrt> anyway... it's sort of an interesting point.  we may want to treat fuse-based filesystems in the same way we will treat nfs file systems (ie: don't trust that they will work properly)
<desrt> well
<desrt> i guessed, and had my guess confirmed
<desrt> so i'm not sure, but i'm fairly happy with that explanation
<desrt> the fix to this problem is very very simple: we really need XDG_RUNTIME_DIR
<seb128> that's not a "fix" for ecryptfs not being reliable
<seb128> I'm not sure I want to store my datas on a non reliable fs
<seb128> i.e that raise questions out of that bug ;-)
<seb128> it's a bit of a disturbing situation
<desrt> it's not the data that's the problem
<desrt> it's the shm file (ie: a one-byte signaling mechanism we use for synchronising the service and the apps)
<seb128> well, how many programs will have the same issue
<desrt> anything that tries to create shared memory handles using the home directory as a backing store?
<desrt> this is exactly the reason that XDG_RUNTIME_DIR was invented and why we are trying to use it for all things like this
<seb128> ok
<desrt> we need a reliable local native fs (like ext3, ext4, btrfs, tmpfs, etc)
<desrt> not 'fake' filesystems like ecryptfs/fuse or nfs
<seb128> I'm still unsure why shm file on ecryptfs are unreliable
<seb128> and why we think that's ok ;-)
<desrt> because it's impossible for it to be 100% perfect
<desrt> the hardware doesn't notify the kernel on every single write
<desrt> so the data can't be pushed down into userspace on every single write either
<desrt> also: it has the classical use-after-delete thing going on
<desrt> and the underlying file in the unecrypted filesystem disappears
<desrt> if the data gets pushed out of the cache in the meantime then when it comes time to refetch the backing store, it's already gone
<seb128> hum, alright
<seb128> but yeah, agreed, we really need the xdg_runtime_dir next cycle
<desrt> it seems a few things are starting to use it
<seb128> udisks2 do user mounts there right?
<pitti> no, I don't think it does
<pitti> NEWS:       Avoid using $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR/media for now
<pitti> NEWS:       Use /run/media/$USER for mounting
<pitti> NEWS:       Prefer mounting in /run/user/$USER/media instead of /media
<seb128> pitti, ok, ok
<seb128> "This is because of security concerns - it is way too dangerous to let a system-daemon such as udisks manage directories in a user-controlled location such as $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR. So now udisks2 is using /run/media/$USER instead, see http://cgit.freedesktop.org/udisks/commit/?id=aa02e5fc53efdeaf66047d2ad437ed543178965b"
<seb128> that's from the corresponding gvfs commit
<tkamppeter> pitti, the pdftopdf bug is verified ...
<pitti> tkamppeter: with the packages from -proposed?
<tkamppeter> pitti, I think so.
<pitti> tkamppeter: cool, I'll copy it into precise release then
<tkamppeter> pitti, can you have a look at bug 982675?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 982675 in cups-filters "pdftops crashed with SIGABRT in __libc_message()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/982675
<tkamppeter> pitti, there happens a segfault and I do not understand why. There is a call 'numvalues = sscanf(resolution, "%dx%d", &xres, &yres)' with xres and yres being integer variables and resolution being a static char[128] array containing "4800CQ". The sscanf should set xres to 4800, numvalues to 1 and leave yres untouched.
<pitti> tkamppeter: it's not a segfault, it's an assertion failure
<pitti> looks like double-free
<pitti> sscanf (string=0x7fff072e67a0 "4800CQ", format=0x7f509f1c168b "%dx%d", args=0x7fff072e2168) at iovsscanf.c:45
<pitti> now, that indeed does not match
<tkamppeter> pitti, but also strange, why should this simple sscanf cause a double free?
<pitti> well, something went wrong in memory management, not necessraily double free
<pitti> tkamppeter: but yes, sscanf should just stop scanning at the 'x'
<tkamppeter> The "4800" matches the first %d, so it should go into xres then the "CQ" does not match "x" which should make sscanf stop, wuith the counter on 1 and yres untouched.
<pitti> yes, indeed
<tkamppeter> pitti, so it is not a bug of cups-filters. To which package I should assign that?
<pitti> tkamppeter: well, it most likely is
<pitti> there might be some memory corruption happening before this
<pitti> which just blows up in sscanf
<tkamppeter> pitti, but the traceback shows that the input parameters are still OK.
<pitti> right, but memory state might not be
<pitti> tkamppeter: you could write a small C program with just this sscanf and see whether it works
<pitti> tkamppeter: or disable parts of the code until you don't get the crash any more, and then see what causes it
<pitti> good night everyone, have a nice weekend!
<seb128> pitti, 'night
<seb128>  5539 seb128    20   0 1308m 551m  36m S    2 15.9  65:50.91 firefox
<seb128> could firefox stop being a dog? ;-)
<jbicha> mterry: any idea why I only get a while circle instead of the Kubuntu logo for the KDE session in unity-greeter?
<jbicha> *white
<mterry> jbicha, there is a kde_badge.png installed...
<jbicha> yes, how long has that badge been there, because I've always seen the white circle instead
<mterry> jbicha, for quite a while.  hold on, let me see what the kde session is called, maybe there's a mismatch
<mterry> jbicha, what do you have in your /usr/share/xsessions/ ?
<jbicha> kde-plasma.desktop
<mterry> jbicha, ah...  that's why.  unity-greeter is expecting just kde
<mterry> jbicha, did that change or is unity-greeter just being dumb?
<jbicha> we should probably ask in #kubuntu-devel or something to make sure, I don't use the kubuntu-desktop metapackage but pick and choose parts of KDE
<mterry> jbicha, seems kde.desktop doesn't exist in oneiric or precise.  I'll patch to add kde-plasma
<jbicha> mterry: thanks
<jbicha> I just renamed kde-plasma.desktop to kde.desktop to test it, & the logo looks nice
<mterry> seb128, are we done with uploads?
<mterry> pitti, ^  I'm not clear on when the no-respin cutoff is
<jbicha> mterry: is Kubuntu the only official Ubuntu flavor that's not using lightdm for 12.04?
<desrt> seb128: i'm done with hud-service scoring bugs
<mterry> jbicha, I don't know
<desrt> it's impossible to make everyone happy
<kenvandine> desrt, if it makes you feel better, i am happy :)
<desrt> and users expecting to type 2 letters "sh" to match "show only glyphs..." without wanting to type the extra 'o' is pretty.... low on my pity list :p
<desrt> kenvandine: it does :D
<kenvandine> glad to help :)
<desrt> kenvandine: as the distro packager of this stuff maybe you can comment on the bug that you feel that the current algorithms are producing good results for 99% of cases and that it's not worth risking the change at this point
<kenvandine> desrt, actually i haven't really looked very closely at the relevance of the results, i've just been trying hard to remember to attempt to use the hud :)
<kenvandine> hard to teach an old dog new tricks :)
<kenvandine> i do feel it is too late to risk change...
<desrt> kenvandine: your "i am happy" comment no longer makes me feel better :p
<desrt> you're only happy because you never use it :)
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> i use it at least a couple times per day :)
<kenvandine> just not really looking closely at the scoring
<kenvandine> it just seems to work :)
<seb128> desrt, heh, that description is not an accurate one ;-)
<seb128> desrt, I would have closed it otherwise :p
<seb128> desrt, it does match "indicator > shutdown" before "view > show", when "sh" is an exact mathing of 2 letters for each ;-)
<desrt> huh?
<desrt> quoting you: "sh" lists "Device > Shutdown" first and then "View > Show only
<seb128> desrt, oh, just read your comment, the different is the trailing string length
<desrt> glyphs..." from gucharmap
<desrt> ya
<seb128> right
<seb128> *Sh*utdown
<desrt> we had to do that for "savE" to come before "save as" and "save all documents"
<seb128> *Show*
<seb128> ups
<seb128> *Sh*ow
<desrt> "only glyphs..."
<seb128> like they both have a perfect start match
<desrt> there is a penalty for the extra words
<desrt> that's what makes "save" match "save" better than "save as"
 * desrt loves the ambiguity in that sentence
<seb128> desrt, ok, fair enough, I was unsure if the "extra char" penalty was on a word or on the sentend
<seb128> sentence
<desrt> seb128: it used to be only on the word
<seb128> desrt, in fact I was close to just mark the bug fix released before john came with an example
<desrt> i had to add it for extra words as well, for the 'save as' case
<seb128> desrt, works for me, I did assing to you to have your opinion but I didn't suspect that it was a tradeoff situation
<seb128> i.e that "fixing" it would break other cases
<seb128> doh
<seb128> didn't->did
<seb128> and you can tell it's friday night and I just came back from dinner with a drink ;-)
<desrt> :)
<seb128> that said time to call it a week!
<desrt> seb128: see you monday
<desrt> good w/e
<seb128> desrt, don't work to much it's friday afternoon, and have a good w.e ;-)
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<chrisccoulson> mmmm, beer
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, show off :)
<chrisccoulson> it seems that everyone got me beer for my birthday
<BigWhale> chrisccoulson, my brother got 30 different brand of beers for his 30th birthday.
<BigWhale> not sure what the rules were for drinking it
<bryceh> BigWhale, "None must remain by the end of today"?
<chrisccoulson> BigWhale, yeah, i got quite a few different beers, but all from the same brewery
<chrisccoulson> and they're all really nice :)
<BigWhale> I find it somewhat fascinating how man managed to turn almost every plant into an alcoholic drink and if that didn't work, man smoked it.
<dobey> BigWhale: you left out direct injection
<BigWhale> dobey, :))
<dobey> i love how a disproportionate number of questions on askubuntu, are not questions at all
<bryceh> dobey, isn't the rule that 90% of anything is bullpucky?
<dobey> heh
<kenvandine> BigWhale, ok, keybinder-3.0 packaged, i'll upload to the ppa as soon as i test it in pbuilder
<BigWhale> kenvandine, Awesome!
<kenvandine> BigWhale, keybinder-3.0 uploaded to the ppa
<BigWhale> \o/
<BigWhale> the amount of beers I'll be buying at UDS will probably account for a record of some sort
<kenvandine> i'll settle for just a couple :)
<kenvandine> BigWhale, it is completely untested, so let me know if it doesn't work :)
<BigWhale> ok, sure
<popey> kenvandine: we'll need to do as we did in florida, find a local store and buy a few cases
<kenvandine> popey, we always do :)
<popey> heh
<JanC> ah well, we only have somewhere between 2000 and 4000 different beers here in Belgium...  ;)
<JanC> and I'm pretty sure I drank/sampled at least > 1000 of them  :P
<kenvandine> JanC, that is awesome :)
<JanC> this just reminds me I should go to the "Hopduvel" again some day...
<JanC> (which is sort of a beer warehouse in Ghent)
<JanC> http://www.dehopduvel.be/engels/bieren.html
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-04-21
<sam___> Hi there, I'm running 12.04 on my laptop, and it won't let me run Unity-3D, 2D is fine, but just loads 2D if 3D is selected. GPU is Nvidia 555M, and I was told this might be blacklisted? Is there a way to get around/fix this?
<shnatsel> Hello!
<shnatsel> I'm working on prioritizing processes for resource allocation on Ubuntu desktop. I need to find out what does oneconf-service do to assign it a priority (niceness). Any leads?
<shnatsel> I've checked manpages.ubuntu.com for relevant manpages, checked LP project for FAQs or questions, looked in the source code for comments... nothing seems to describe what does the service process do.
<shnatsel> oneconf-service is using 50mb memory even though I never ever use oneconf o_O
<Laney> pitti: hey. I was just looking at cooking the workaround patch for bug #968845, but it's not clear to me why we're putting the hook in pm-utils and not x-x-i-s. Can you enlighten me? If it's to go in pm-utils then I need more guidance as I don't see where to put it with the package's layout.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 968845 in xserver-xorg-input-synaptics "bcm5974 touchpad doesn't work after S3 on MacBookAir" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/968845
<JanC> hm, does anybody know if removal of alternative keyboard layouts from a user's config is a known/fixed bug in a 11.10 -> 12.04 upgrade or do I need to test that?
<JanC> eh, wait, not removal
<JanC> but they aren't shown in the keyboard indicator here?  :-/
<jbicha> JanC: alternate keyboard layouts show in the indicator here
<JanC> weird
<JanC> hm, so if I change something about the config, they show up
<JanC> I wonder if this is related to having to restart unity earlier...
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-04-22
<Jacky> 1
<RAOF> Morning, all?
<TheMuso> Morning RAOF.
 * bryceh waves
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-04-15
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel, bon week-end?
<jibel> salut didrocks , trÃ¨s bon week-end. Enfin l'Ã©tÃ©, on a pu faire un peu de voile et toi ?
<didrocks> jibel: pareil, 2 jours magnifiques, pas mal de ballades Ã  l'extÃ©rieur :)
<Laney> morning
<seb128> hey desktopers
<seb128> Laney, hey, had a good W.E ?
<Laney> hey seb128, not too bad thanks - mainly did a lot of riding :-)
<Laney> you?
<seb128> quite good, thanks
<seb128> the weather was really nice this W.E, enjoyed being outside
<Laney> yes it was, was nice
<Laney> hopefully this is spring finally
<chrisccoulson> good morning
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, Laney
<darkxst> seb128, are there plans to use the normal region dialog or are just going to stick with the language selector
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, good thanks
<darkxst> seb128, as in next cycle with 3.8
<chrisccoulson> how about you?
<seb128> darkxst, there are been plan to use the region dialog for like 5 cycles
<chrisccoulson> i managed to finally get my car washed this weekend!
<seb128> but it's quite some work and there is always other priorities
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I should wash my car as well, I was thinking about it yesterday but just got lazy :p
 * didrocks is happy to have no car to wash :)
<Laney> pfft, cars
<Laney> one of my bikes got a flat this weekend though :p
<mlankhorst> pfft bikes
<didrocks> Laney: pfff, your *own* bikes ;)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, we actually had rain showers for most of the day, so it was quite difficult to wash ;)
 * mlankhorst was on a horsiee
<Laney> ALERT! MLANKHORST IS NOT DUTCH!
<mlankhorst> nah, I'm seriously considering biking 19 km to get to those lessons :P
<mlankhorst> instead of taking a car
<darkxst> seb128, any ideas on how to deal with installing languages?
<BigWhale> Greetings.
<mlankhorst> as long as the wind isn't strong doing 19 km both ways should be doable
<seb128> darkxst, in the region capplet? logic need to be added there, it's not done yet which is one of the reasons why we didn't change
<BigWhale> I have a suggestion for Unity Next ... We need a key-combo that will fire 4 terminals and tile them on screen in each corner... SUPER-CTRL-G for God Mode or something like that... :>
<mlankhorst> goedendag laney
<Laney> O_O
 * mlankhorst grins
<darkxst> seb128, yes in the region capplet
<darkxst> maybe I could look into it, but I have no idea how to install packages from C
<seb128> using the packagekit api
<darkxst> oh right, I though that was missing on ubuntu
<seb128> it's not
<seb128> we use aptd but it implements compatible interfaces
<darkxst> seb128, ok
<xclaesse> seb128, Saturday I made some video call attemps on my mother's computer and I had some empathy-call crashes. Apport probably sent them to launchpad, but how could I see them now?
<darkxst> seb128, should I merge this into the other glxinfo patch or keep as a seperate patch? https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-control-center/commit/?id=dfe066cdac94acb44539fc37c5912ac764f7f8c3&h=gnome-3-8
<darkxst> (for 3.6)
<seb128> darkxst, you can merge it in the same patch
<seb128> xclaesse, let me look
<xclaesse> wtf unity... it start poping notification with "merry christmas" and "happy birthday"
<xclaesse> months old messages from facebook
<xclaesse> and no notification on fb page
<seb128> likely a bug with "friends", check with kenvandine when he's online
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/friends/+bug/1079865
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1079865 in Friends "limit notifications at statup." [Medium,Fix committed]
<xclaesse> it decided to replay 6months of fb events it seems
<darkxst> seb128, can't actually build it here, it fails with an unrelated issue, probably due to ppa's and what not
<darkxst> but have added a debdiff to bug 1168612, pretty confident that will work well
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1168612 in gnome-control-center "display graphics info for nvidia blob" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1168612
<seb128> xclaesse, your empathy-call segfaults, on what ubuntu version was that?
<xclaesse> seb128, raring
<seb128> it's the empathy-call binary that segfaulted?
<xclaesse> seb128, yes empathy-call
<ritz__> seb128 morning
<seb128> ritz__, hey
<Laney> heh, receiving a new message on facebook appears to have kicked friends into spamming me
<seb128> kenvandine, mterry, cyphermox: hey western desktopers ;-) had a good w.e ?
<mterry> seb128, yeah, still recovering  :)
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> and you?
<seb128> mterry, recovering from all the parties ? ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, excellent, thanks, spring is finally there
<mterry> seb128, it was a friend's bachelor party
<seb128> though I've a start of a cold :/
<seb128> mterry, I see ;-)
<kenvandine> i'm recovering from yard work... ran a chipper all day yesterday clearing out part of my backyard...
<kenvandine> i am hurting today!
<kenvandine> mterry, cool!
<seb128> hehe
<kenvandine> seb128, bummer
<seb128> kenvandine, better now that for the rally
<seb128> but I hope to get over it before it gets too strong
<seb128> I've been getting some extra sleep and orange juice and vitamines ;-)
<kenvandine> good
<kenvandine> don't bring it to the sprint :)
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> mterry, will we have an unity landing today? I was reading about the nice performance work from Trevinho and I hope that makes it to raring ;-)
<seb128> cyphermox, libcolumbus seems set up to land the wrong serie, trunk got uploaded instead of 0.4 today
<mterry> seb128, I was just looking into that myself.  let me get back to you
<kenvandine> mterry, i hope so... it has my fix for unity-scope-gdrive :)
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<mterry> seb128, kenvandine: looks like the last test failure might be a fluke; rerunning tests to see
<seb128> mterry, it seems like hud ran into issues on nvidia from what I saw
<seb128> which happens sometimes
<mterry> seb128, intel was actually the blocker this time
<seb128> not sure why, if that's an hud bug?
<seb128> was it?
<mterry> had 20 failures
<mterry> seb128, I believe 16 is the limit
<seb128> mterry, http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Raring/view/Unity/job/cu2d-unity-raring-2.2check/18/console
<seb128> says "Tests for card 'nvidia' failed!"
<seb128> mterry, where do you see the intel issue?
<seb128> mterry, http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/ps-generic-autopilot-release-testing/64/testReport/ has 9 failures on inel
<seb128> intel
<seb128> 17 on nvidia
 * seb128 still having an hard time to navigate jenkins :/
<mterry> seb128, hmm, I was looking at http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/ps-generic-autopilot-release-testing/67/
<seb128> mterry, that one is a run from "cu2d-100scopes-experimental-2.2check "
<seb128> according to the summary
<mterry> seb128, yup, I see that now  :(  thanks
<seb128> yw
<seb128> the "jobs consolidation" make things a bit harder to browse
<seb128> you have all the runs listed mixed
<mterry> yah, easy for me to get confused
<seb128> I set my "jenkins" startpage to http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Raring/view/Unity/
<seb128> (I'm just interested in raring atm)
<seb128> mterry, let's see how the retry goes in any case ;-)
<mterry> seb128, yeah, we're only 1 over the failure limit.  if some of these are flaky tests, we might be OK in the rerun.  I've asked sil2100 about the failures anyway
<seb128> mterry, ok, let's see, I would just have forced the publishing :p
<mterry> seb128, tsk!
<seb128> mterry, for one little test... :p
 * seb128 hides in shame
<seb128> ;-)
<mterry> :)
<didrocks> mterry: btw, for the job consolidation, as seb128 noticed, always start from the -check console job to know which runs corresponds to what
<mterry> didrocks, yeah
<mterry> I got lazy
<mterry> :)
<didrocks> mterry: well, I really think we'll need soon a dashboard
<cyphermox> seb128: ugh.
<didrocks> the jenkins UI itself is not enough
<cyphermox> seb128: ok, libcolumbus was already migrated but the rev isn't on the jenkins server
<cyphermox> dah, I completely forgot to pull this stuff and rebuild the branches :/
<cyphermox> didrocks: ^ going to fix this now
<didrocks> cyphermox: thanks!
<cyphermox> seb128: you had the libcolumbus package rejected?
<Laney> I rejected it after spotting the error
<seb128> cyphermox, what Laney said
<cyphermox> Laney: thanks
<Laney> np
<Laney> cyphermox: is it that cu2d is releasing from the wrong branch?
<cyphermox> yeah, the code was changed in the config, but not applied to the jenkins jobs
<Laney> ah
<cyphermox> totally my fault, fginther proposed the changes and I didn't clue in that it would need an update
<Laney> I thought while looking at that that it would be nice to have a list of all the projects under cu2d and the branch they're releasing from
<Laney> so you know what to propose to for distro at any point
<Laney> either that or make sure that all of the branches are done at feature freeze time
<cyphermox> yeah
<cyphermox> perhaps we could fix the automatic upload message to say where it comes from
<didrocks> Laney: lp:cupstream2distro-config
<cyphermox> (e.g. the branch)
<didrocks> Laney: you have stacks/<release>/<stackname>
<didrocks> Laney: everything is described here
<Laney> didrocks: yeah, so parsing that to a webpage
<didrocks> Laney: you have that in jenkins
<didrocks> Laney: the pages like the one seb128 showed below ^
<cyphermox> didrocks: any reason (weirdly) how the cupstream2distro-config branch on jenkisn should be left behind? just making sure :)
<seb128> cyphermox, btw, are we aiming at getting https://code.launchpad.net/~jpakkane/libcolumbus/lessfuzz-test/+merge/158595 in raring?
<didrocks> cyphermox: left behind?
<didrocks> cyphermox: you have to deploy the jenkins jobs
<cyphermox> it's at rev 184 ;)
<cyphermox> we're at 195
<cyphermox> just making sure I can update it too
<didrocks> cyphermox: no reason to leave it behind :)
<cyphermox> ack
<cyphermox> seb128: sure, why not
<didrocks> cyphermox: but TBH, it just needs to be refreshed when we change stack dependencies
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> might as well pull it anyway...
<seb128> cyphermox, seems there is an unity-lens-applications side as well (and should be mp against trunk as well)
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks
<cyphermox> mterry: are you reviewing https://code.launchpad.net/~jpakkane/unity-lens-applications/lessfuzz-test ?
<mterry> cyphermox, not yet
<cyphermox> (goes with the libcolumbus one i'm reviewing)
<mterry> cyphermox, I don't generally look at those reviews
<cyphermox> oh
<cyphermox> ok I'll do it
<mterry> cyphermox, I didn't mean to sound like I didn't want to do it at all, just saying such reviews aren't normally on my radar
<cyphermox> mterry: I understood, I just parsed it as "unity" :)
<cyphermox> but I mean, it's all the same bug really so I'll review it too
<cyphermox> didrocks: btw, unity-lens-application doesn't have a feature branch
<mterry> cyphermox, ok.  I will say one thing, that maybe continuing to search packagename or execname would still be useful/expected-by-users?
<didrocks> cyphermox: check with mterry and bregma who are in charge of unity :)
<didrocks> cyphermox: but if you are getting it in ula
<didrocks> cyphermox: it's good, it will be both raring and s, without having 2MP
<didrocks> what you will need in libcolumbus to not loose it when upgrading
<cyphermox> mterry: where do you see that?
<cyphermox> seems to me like just style changes except for that setSubstringmode()
<mterry> cyphermox, in the lessfuzz-test merge, they comment out a block of code
<mterry> cyphermox, they also add /* and */
<cyphermox> right, I see now
<mterry> cyphermox, I can understand summary being confusing for users
<cyphermox> I agree with keeping the match on exec
<mterry> cyphermox, but I'm just thinking of things like deja-dup, which only expose the string "Backup" but users might search for deja
<mterry> cyphermox, cool
<cyphermox> in french, you're likely to type the exec name to get to an app, whose name might be translated and quite different
<cyphermox> or, our usual test case for fuzzy-matching being 'gcal' ;)
<cyphermox> I wonder if these commented out parts aren't "experimentation" rather than actual expected code changed
<seb128> desrt, do you know when are the GUADEC core days?
 * Laney wrote a quick script to generate http://people.canonical.com/~laney/cu2d-branches.txt
 * Laney goes for a very late lunch(!)
<seb128> Laney, enjoy
<chrisccoulson> pitti, ah, i see you got a response from the "sudo is awesome" troll. apparently you don't understand the issues ;)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<didrocks> Laney: your script is a little bit buggy :)
<Laney> yeah?
<didrocks> Laney: I don't see any of the lenses
<didrocks> campo is definitively not part of what we land
<Laney> yeah I didn't know how to tell where they were
<didrocks> as signon and so on
<Laney> it just gets the branch from the config file
<didrocks> there is even not unity
<didrocks> Laney: if there is no target_branch parameter, it's trunk (lp:project_name)
<Laney> ah daily_release : False I can certainly check that one
<Laney> okies
<didrocks> yep
<Laney> didrocks: try that?
<didrocks> Laney: way better after a quick look :)
<didrocks> Laney: this is raring only, isn't it?
<didrocks> not head
<Laney> yes
<Laney> it could be extended to head if that's useful
<Laney> but I was mainly interested in which branch I need to look in for raring
<didrocks> Laney: Vcs-bzr should be up to date FYI
<Laney> yeah but I can't get to that from the queue :(
<didrocks> cyphermox: I changed the tasks for https://bugs.launchpad.net/libcolumbus/+bug/1159812 FYI
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1159812 in unity-lens-applications (Ubuntu) "search in application lens is innacurate" [Medium,Confirmed]
<didrocks> it was affecting unity
<didrocks> not ula or libcolumbus
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> ah
<seb128> mterry, jenkins hates us
<seb128> nvidia is green this time
<seb128> but intel is all fail
<seb128> and ati is still running so I guess it will be like intel
<seb128> sil2100, ^
<seb128> http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/ps-generic-autopilot-release-testing/label=autopilot-intel/
<mterry> seb128, :
<mterry> :( I mean
<mterry> seb128, sil2100: perma-link http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/ps-generic-autopilot-release-testing/68/
<mterry> both ati and intel are blown up
<Laney> probably better to give public links ;-)
<Laney> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/PS/job/ps-generic-autopilot-release-testing/68/
<seb128> Laney, yeah, sorry
<seb128> mterry, should we just kick another retry?
<mterry> seb128, uh, I'm not certain why the two machines failed...
<mterry> seb128, I guess retry and if same thing happens, then we escalate
<seb128> wfm
<mterry> seb128, restarted
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<seb128> jbicha, hey
<jbicha> seb128: hi
<seb128> jbicha, did you include the fix for bug #1124356 in your gnome-sudoku upload?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1124356 in GNOME Games "gnome-sudoku crashed with NotImplementedError in __init__(): Setting properties of type 'GdkEventMask' is not implemented" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1124356
<jasoncwarner__> hey dpm and mhall119, how goes the developer.ubuntu.com tutorial update to match the new SDK?
<jbicha> seb128: uh, no, that hasn't been merged upstream yet
<seb128> jbicha, :-(
<seb128> jbicha, does sudoku even start for you?
<dpm> jasoncwarner__, we'll be trying to get the update in today
<jasoncwarner__> dpm great, thanks!
<jbicha> seb128: um no :(
<jbicha> it used to though
<seb128> jbicha, can you get the fix in? it was in the queue bug got rejected in favor of your upload
<jbicha> seb128: yes
<seb128> jbicha, thanks
<jbicha> I don't think upstream splitting the games has been good for them being maintained :(
<seb128> not really no :/
<jbicha> I have to basically email or ping somebody directly to get patches reviewed
<Laney> This is your opportunity to become a gnome maintainer!
<seb128> mterry, those buggy runs have weird network/dbus issues
<seb128> mterry, e.g http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/ps-generic-autopilot-release-testing/label=autopilot-intel/68/artifact/results/testresults/unity-result.xml
<seb128> it has some "13:54:07.455 ERROR proxies:410 - Introspect error on :1.23:/com/canonical/Unity/Debug: dbus.exceptions.DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken."
<seb128> and some "Cannot connect to destination (ecx.images-amazon.com)"
<tiheum> Hi all documentation team members! We have a last-minute request form Mark concerning the BFB icon: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/1169238. The UI freeze exception has not been accepted yet but it could impact the Ubuntu documentation. Is there anybody to contact in your team  in a such case?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1169238 in Unity "[UIFe] BFB icon swirl should run clockwise not anti-clockwise" [Undecided,Triaged]
<dpm> jasoncwarner, actually, it'll take more time than expected. I'll get it done tomorrow first thing in the morning (re: the SDK tutorial update)
<jbicha> tiheum: try pinging #ubuntu-doc
<jasoncwarner> thanks dpm
<tiheum> jbicha: thanks
 * didrocks waves good evening
<seb128> mterry, http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/ps-generic-autopilot-release-testing/69/
<seb128> mterry, \o/ \o/ \o/
<seb128> mterry, ;-)
<seb128> mterry, seems it's up to you to hack my packaging diffs to use dh-translations
<mterry> seb128, published
<mterry> seb128, thanks!
 * seb128 hugs mterry
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yeah, I promise I'll read what polkit and sudo do!
<seb128> oh, a pitti
<pitti> bonsoir seb128, Ã§a va?
<pitti> seb128: I'm just here for the TB meeting
<seb128> pitti, salut, oui et toi ?
<seb128> pitti, bon anniversaire (avec un jour de retard)
<seb128> pitti, Ã§a va ? tu Ã©tais en vacances aujourd'hui ?
<pitti> seb128: merci beaucoup !
<pitti> seb128: oui, Netti et moi avons Ã©tÃ© Ã  Stuttgart
<pitti> seb128: we watched the musical "Mamma Mia!" and did some sightseeing
<pitti> and enjoyed the marvellous spring weather
<seb128> nice
<seb128> it's spring like here as well
<seb128> and I managed to get a cold for it :-(
<pitti> urgh, poor you
<pitti> it's 25 degrees here
<pitti> seb128: better go to bed early?
<seb128> pitti, yeah, I will go soon, I did get some extra sleep yesterday and somewhat managing to fight the cold half back so far
<seb128> it's warm in there as well
<pitti> seb128: then get well soon!
<seb128> pitti, thanks ;-)
<pitti> bonne nuit tout le monde !
<pitti> seb128: comment dis-tu "get well soon" Ã  franÃ§ais ?
<seb128> pitti, "soigne-toi bien" I would say
<pitti> apparemment, google ne le sais pas
<pitti> "sait"
<seb128> which is more of "take care"
<seb128> or "get better soon" if you want to literal
<seb128> -soon
<pitti> soigner == to care, selon leo
<pitti> seb128: so, "Gute Besserung!"
 * pitti waves good night
<seb128> pitti, night ;-)
<robert_ancell> mterry, should that slot code be pushed to the stable 1.6 branch? Is this a new problem?
<robert_ancell> Laney, hey, do you need any help/info for the logind support in LightDM? Did you see the branch from bug 1152185?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1152185 in Light Display Manager "Can't shut down the computer from the greeter using systemd-logind" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1152185
<Laney> robert_ancell: I did - do you think they should go together or can be separate?
<Laney> I'll have a look at the guy's branch tomorrow
<robert_ancell> Laney, it will have to merge with the tests in the first branch, the names are slightly different but the layout is much the same
 * Laney nods
<Laney> will check on it tomorrow
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-04-16
<mterry> robert_ancell, it's not a new problem; it's not a problem for any consumers right now.  But it is a problem for unity/phablet, which is how I ran into it
<mterry> robert_ancell, so I'd say it's good for 1.6 -- it seems bad to have public headers with symbols that might cause build failures
<robert_ancell> mterry, ok, cool - can you do a MP for it?
<mterry> robert_ancell, sure
<robert_ancell> thomi, hey, should Jenkins work for branches, e.g. lp:lightdm/1.6?
<thomi> robert_ancell: I can make it work, but by default, no
<robert_ancell> thomi, yeah, if you could enable that it would be handy - if possible for lp:lightdm/1.0, lp:lightdm/1.2, lp:lightdm/1.4, lp:lightdm/1.6,
<thomi> robert_ancell: OK, I'll add them to the list. Won't be going until tomorrow though, since I don't have authority to re-deploy the CI jobs on jenkins
<robert_ancell> thomi, that's fine
<thomi> robert_ancell: should they all build with the same packaging branch as trunk?
<thomi> oh crap, I just realised we'll need separate packaging branches for each anyway
<robert_ancell> thomi, no
<thomi> or the versions will get screwed up
<robert_ancell> thomi, does unity or other projects use branches with CI?
<thomi> robert_ancell: only ones that are being actively developed
<thomi> backports are usually merged manually
<thomi> at least, that was the case last time I looked, let me see...
<robert_ancell> thomi, yeah, this would be backports. It's a nice-to-have but not as important as trunk
<robert_ancell> 1.6 is in raring and we could expect a few point releases based on previous times. 1.2 is in precise and could have some backports. The others are very unlikely to have any changes
<thomi> robert_ancell: ok - I'll talk to Francis tomorrow and see if he has a nice solution for this.
<thomi> this is why inline packaging makes our lives easier :)
<robert_ancell> thomi, yeah :)
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti. How are you?
<pitti> didrocks: trÃ¨s bien, merci! j'aime le soleil
<didrocks> hÃ©hÃ©, pareil ici :)
<pitti> I had a really nice weekend
<pitti> didrocks: how are you?
<didrocks> pitti: I'm good, thanks! Having some sun as well, and soon back on the balcony :)
<pitti> we did that the first time yesterday
<didrocks> sweet, I did the same for a couple of hours. I think I'll work a little bit longer today from it
<BigWhale> Good morning all.
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel, Ã§a va?
<jibel> salut didrocks ! Ãa va bien et toi ?
<didrocks> jibel: Ã§a va bien :)
<jibel> didrocks, super, une bonne journÃ©e en perspective alors :)
<seb128> hey desktopers
<didrocks> salut seb128!
<seb128> lut didrocks ;-)
<Laney> hey
<seb128> Laney, good morning u.k ;-)
<Laney> sun!
<seb128> here too ;-)
<seb128> Laney, do you have any luck reviewing the unity updates? ;-)
<Laney> doing it atm
 * didrocks was wondering the same thing :)
<Laney> take a while having to manually get from the ppas
<Laney> s/ppas/ppa/
<pitti> bonjour seb18
<pitti> hey Laney
<Laney> hey pitti
<Laney> how are you?
<pitti> Laney: I had a great long weekend, thanks! how about yourself?
<seb128> pitti, salut, Ã§a va ?
<Laney> good! been enjoying the sun which has finally arrived
<pitti> seb128: Ã§a va trÃ¨s bien
<pitti> seb128: feeling better today?
<pitti> Laney: +1000
<seb128> pitti, not really yet, but not worth either
<pitti> "worse"?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> :p
<seb128> so maybe I'm a bit knocked out after all :p
<Laney> gruh
<seb128> Laney, gruh?
<Laney> I can't get the version of compiz that was uploaded because a new one has gone to the PPA and the old dcs now 404s
<Laney> dsc
<Laney> the diff is just changelog though so doesn't matter in this case
<seb128> Laney, commits are on https://code.launchpad.net/~compiz-team/compiz/0.9.9
<Laney> yeah
<seb128> Laney, should be http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~compiz-team/compiz/0.9.9/revision/3648 only
<Laney> it would be ideal to get the actual source package though
<seb128> take the current one, it should be identical
<seb128> but yeah
<seb128> that sucks a bit
<Laney> is, but for a no-change changelog
<Laney> which isn't pushed to the branch yet
<didrocks> right, as the tests didn't finish
<Laney> not worried about that per se, just that LP makes it annoying to get the source of copies from the queue
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> if it was making that easy, it would be easy as well to avoid "rereupload"
<didrocks> without putting a bunch of custom codeâ¦
<Laney> seems like .dscs are actually removed more aggressively than we thought too
<Laney> at least it seems the .15 one is now gone
<didrocks> Laney: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/137427712/unity_7.0.0daily13.04.15-0ubuntu1.dsc ?
<Laney> can you find that out without knowing it beforehand?
<Laney> I got the URL from https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-unity/+archive/daily-build/+packages and changed 16 to 15 :P
<didrocks> Laney: I'm looking at superseeded packages
<didrocks> going through the list
<Laney> ah! yes!
<seb128> Laney, you can't just change version numbers in the url like that, the random digits in the middle change as well
<Laney> actually my problem was that I put ~13.04 on the url
<Laney> which was added between 15 and 16
<didrocks> Laney: on the ~ stuff: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DailyRelease/FAQ#modification_for_maintenance_branch
 * Laney nods
<chrisccoulson> good morning
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson!
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm ok, thanks! Yourself?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, tired. i've just power walked back from the garage after taking my car there ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: is the garage far away?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, it's not that far away. a couple of miles according to google maps ;)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, not too bad thanks
<chrisccoulson> annoyed that i got a puncture this morning though ;)
<seb128> what for?
<seb128> puncture, garage ... busy morning!
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i dropped my daughter off at pre-school this morning, and noticed on the way home that the car was really stiff to turn right
<chrisccoulson> so i got out and noticed the nail sticking out of the front nearside tyre :(
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well, at least it's not raining ;-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's a good thing. especially as i didn't have my coat
<chrisccoulson> it's quite warm this morning :)
<chrisccoulson> i probably could have walked to my daughters pre-school, but i don't think she'd like to walk the 3 miles
<seb128> well, just carry her on your back ;-)
<didrocks> extra exercise!
<BigWhale> Well, when I was her age ...
<BigWhale> ;)
<seb128> new unity in \o/
<seb128> Laney, thanks for the reviews ;-)
 * Laney wipes sweat from brow
<czajkowski> hmm on latest update I seem to have lost sound any reason as to why
<seb128> bug?
<seb128> what did you upgrade? does it come back after a reboot?
<czajkowski> seb128: morning just run updates this morning and about to do a reboot, that daft red triangle still is showing saying I  have updates, but I've run it mannualy and there are no more updates fr me
<czajkowski> rebooting now
<seb128> k
<czajkowski> seb128: ah we have sound again sorry for noise
<seb128> czajkowski, no problem, sorry you had to reboot to get it back
 * xnox unity is just like James Bond now! http://youtu.be/gkNeQdLg6Nc
<xnox> tiheum: are you going to change the software updater icons direction as well to be clockwise to match the dash icon direction?
<xclaesse> would be nice if the empathy icon in unity's dash could add in its context menu the conversations where I have a message
<xclaesse> I get the "1" unread message sticker on the icon, but clicking the icon presents the chatroom window instead of the private chat window where I received the msg
<xclaesse> empathy's icon is on the dash left/bottom of my screen, and I have to go top/right (the exact opposite) to open the messages indicator and click the converstaion
<xclaesse> also, clicking the conversation in the indicator (top/right) sometimes opens the chat window in background
<xclaesse> so I have to alt-tab to get it
<BigWhale> When I create a new .desktop entry in ./local/... what do I have to do for Dash to recognize it?
<seb128> xclaesse, dash->launcher (the dash is the grid with the search entry you get when clicking on the ubuntu icon)
<seb128> xclaesse, that's in raring? the focus issues are supposed to be fixed with the recent fixes from Trevinho :/
<seb128> xclaesse, but yeah, having the messages listed in the launcher list would be nice
<xclaesse> seb128, I don't understand what you mean with dash->launcher, what should I find there?
<Trevinho> xclaesse: yeah, focus issue is fixed here
<xclaesse> seb128, it is raring, yes
<xclaesse> updated this morning
<seb128> xclaesse, you wrote "the empathy icon in unity's dash ", you meant "launcher"
<xclaesse> but did not restart session, so maybe I'm still running old version
<seb128> xclaesse, the dash in the search ui and doesn't have a context menu
<xclaesse> seb128, ah ok
<seb128> in->is
<xclaesse> yeah, was speaking about the launcher in the left panel
<Trevinho> seb128: ah... focus issue can't be fixed if indicator-messages in raring is not updated...
<seb128> xclaesse, sorry for the confusion, I'm just trying to point the right vocabulary so we avoid confusions in the futur ;-)
<xclaesse> ok :)
<seb128> Trevinho, what do you mean "not updated"?
<Trevinho> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-messages/+bug/811461 this doesn't seem to have landed
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 811461 in indicator-messages (Ubuntu) "overlaped windows are not showed after clicking on item in message menu" [Low,In progress]
<seb128> Trevinho, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-messages/12.10.6daily13.04.09-0ubuntu1
<Trevinho> seb128: ah ok... so it was just a not-released bug by bot..
<seb128> Trevinho, yeah, it seems like the bot doesn't handle well having several bugs linked to a commit maybe?
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, maybe...
<seb128> xclaesse, summary: the focus issues should be fixed if you upgrade to the current version and restart your session
<seb128> xclaesse, the launcher list would be nice to have, agreed
 * Sweetshark dances to the left.
 * Sweetshark dances to the right.
<xclaesse> seb128, good. I'll let you know if still happens after restart then :)
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey
<seb128> Sweetshark, what is the dancing for? ;-)
<ogra_> timewarp !
 * Sweetshark seems to have found at least a hotfix for bug 1064962/bug 1085169.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1064962 in libreoffice (Ubuntu Quantal) "[SRU] Global menubar items do not work when opening a document directly from nautilus with no LibreOffice instance running" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1064962
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1085169 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "LibreOffice Menus Stop Working even with libreoffice>=1:3.6.2~rc2-0ubuntu4 and indicator-appmenu>=12.10.3-0ubuntu2.1" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1085169
<Sweetshark> Every problem in computing can be solved with an additional layer of abstraction. Except the problem of too many layers of abstractions.
<Sweetshark> If I ever go on a rampage, it will be because someone yet again thought it would be a bright idea to use lots of needless and stacked observer-pattern and threading ...
<pitti> cyphermox: hey Mathiey
<pitti> cyphermox: "Mathieu"
<pitti> cyphermox: could you please give me a quick guidance when to commit to NM's "ubuntu" and "ubuntu.raring" branches?
<pitti> cyphermox: I committed test changes to ubuntu, and merged them into ubuntu-raring this morning for an upload
<pitti> cyphermox: but ubuntu has two changes which aren't in ubuntu.raring yet, but ubuntu.raring also has changes which aren't in ubuntu
<pitti> and of course a diverging changelog
<pitti> so that's quite confusing
<cyphermox> pitti: there shouldn't be bits in ubuntu.raring that aren't in the archive
<didrocks> hey kenvandine
<cyphermox> ubuntu.raring is the correct branch for raring, the other one is stuff I was preparing for S
<didrocks> kenvandine: how are you?
<kenvandine> hey didrocks
<kenvandine> good
<kenvandine> and you?
<didrocks> kenvandine: I'm ok :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: I think you saw that friends had the publish failing? (probably due to a bad launchpad connection at the time of the publish)
<kenvandine> yeah, i was going to retry it
<didrocks> kenvandine: I think you just need to retry it, yeah
<didrocks> kenvandine: ah, also, FYI Mirv bootstrapped the sdk package and I put under daily for S
<didrocks> (I hoped we would have it for raring, but wellâ¦)
<kenvandine> better not to i think :)
<kenvandine> thanks!
<didrocks> yw ;)
<kenvandine> i had proposed a branch weeks ago adding it, but never got merged
<kenvandine> that was before reorg of the stacks, so wouldn't apply anymore
<didrocks> kenvandine: urgh?
<didrocks> kenvandine: but the commit bootstrap was missing, and the package wasn't ready
<didrocks> it was native, and so on
<kenvandine> maybe that never got merged either...
<kenvandine> share-app is ready for cu2d :)
<kenvandine> and merged
<kenvandine> i need to get it setup in jenkins
<didrocks> kenvandine: sweet, please go ahead
<kenvandine> i wish we could do that ourselves
<didrocks> kenvandine: you could do it :)
<didrocks> why can't you?
<kenvandine> oh, i can?
<kenvandine> i thought i had to ask someone to setup the views?
<didrocks> kenvandine: yeah, for the view, as per the doc, but that's just a UI thing
<didrocks> kenvandine: you can deploy all the rest
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> the rest is done :)
<didrocks> and have it daily releasing :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: I deployed all the stacks
<didrocks> kenvandine: even empty
<kenvandine> didrocks, i'm working on unity-lens-people now, but there is a bit of an issue
<kenvandine> it requires the phablet branches of libunity and unity
<didrocks> kenvandine: https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/d/18lpjwbYyT-d86utOaiMAd4PcC3EWrTqrvUUV5V86uww/edit is telling to put share-app in the app stack
<didrocks> kenvandine: so no views to deal with, the stack already exists :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: you just need to file the autopilot/test parts :)
<kenvandine> oh right... then it should be there
<didrocks> kenvandine: oh? no way to have them running with unity compiz?
<didrocks> no renderer?
<kenvandine> nope
<didrocks> ok, so prepare it
<didrocks> and put it aside, we'll land it when we'll land unity phablet
<didrocks> (mid june)
<kenvandine> yeah
<didrocks> kenvandine: don't forget the spreadsheet for https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuDk72Lpx8U5dFVVX1BOYm1qdUtyX2xUNmdwWlhTS0E#gid=0 :)
<didrocks> (for share-app)
<kenvandine> what do i need to do on the spreadsheet?
<kenvandine> mark it as done?
<didrocks> kenvandine: filing all the columns?
<kenvandine> oh, that was a different document :)
<kenvandine> hehe
<didrocks> ;)
<pitti> cyphermox: right, but there are bits in the ubuntu branch which aren't in raring
<cyphermox> such as?
<cyphermox> there really shouldn't be... and doesn't seem to be from what I see in the branch right now..
<didrocks> cyphermox: hey, HUD still have some failures on some archs. do you mind looking at it? sil2100 is really busy with other autopilot work and fixing stacks binaries to install for tests AFAIK
<mlankhorst> brrr
<mlankhorst> enough x for now
<ogra_> moving on to y ?
<mlankhorst> seems more likely to be called mir
<ogra_> :)
<cyphermox> didrocks: yeah
<didrocks> cyphermox: good luck ;)
 * sil2100 is still lunching right now
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, hi
<mlankhorst> heya
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, is there any progress on bug 1068994, bug 1015183, https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=56578?
<ubot2> Freedesktop bug 56578 in Server/Input/Core "race condition with active/passive grabs when opening menus with touch" [Normal,Assigned]
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1068994 in OEM Priority Project raring "button1 gets stuck after a while" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1068994
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1015183 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "Inconsistent mouse events for Acer T231H multitouch monitor" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1015183
<mlankhorst> tkamppeter: yeah I've been playing around with it this week
<mlankhorst> down to 1 xserver crash :p
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, I have a Lenovo Thinkpad Twist for some time, which generally works well (it's a Thinkpad), but in its tablet mode the touchscreen easily loses sensitivity for clicks, probably due to mentioned bugs.
<mlankhorst> tkamppeter: right now I'm down to a single corruption bug :/
<mlankhorst> very easy to trigger too
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, I have tried the patch mentioned in comment #17 of the Freedesktop bug, but the problem does not go away with it. Perhaps it survives some more clicks but not more.
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, do you have any PPA, test package, ... for me to test?
<mlankhorst> no, I just know that any corruption I was having on my macbook pro multitouch touchpad was fixed by it, but that the tegra is still breaking horribly
<mlankhorst> no fun to test on tegra, too :S
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, would be great if you could upload this patch state already, so that if you do not succeed the N7 in time that at least all the users of Intel-based convertibles and tablets have their touch fixed.
<mlankhorst> I'm fairly sure it suffers from the same problem on intel, just don't have the hw to trigger it
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, if you need someone to test on an Intel convertible, please make packages available to me and I test on the Twist.
<mlankhorst> hm ok I'll make a diff :/
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, a diff to the current xorg-server package?
<mlankhorst> tkamppeter: it requires canonical-x/x-staging enabled, and unity from that ppa too (which is slightly older, so needs pinning)
<dednick> tsdgeos: it seems that one of the chewieui indicators is crashing if i dont call start on the plugin: (
<mlankhorst> tkamppeter: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5713363/ diff to the xserver in 1.14
<dednick> tsdgeos: and there is a bit of a bug in the menuContent which cause it to be called earlier than it is with my
<dednick> branch
<mlankhorst> tkamppeter: maybe also add http://lists.x.org/archives/xorg-devel/2013-April/035878.html -- but honestly unsure about that one :P
<cyphermox> seb128: hey
<seb128> cyphermox, hey
<cyphermox> seb128: do you know what's up with https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/indicator-session/lp-861171/+merge/137085 ?
<tsdgeos> dednick: :-S
<dednick> tsdgeos: indeed
<cyphermox> just checking to make sure I'm not forgetting some reviews that could be done :)
<seb128> cyphermox, not for raring for sure, I guess it can still be useful for the greeter mode so would be good to land early in S
<cyphermox> ok, then I'll reject this one, and we can file it again for trunk if it's not
<seb128> hum
<seb128> ok
<mlankhorst> oh, valgrind can be a gdbserver too, nice
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, thanks for the patch, but the xorg-server package is only 1.13. Is there a 1.14 package for applying the patch somewhere?
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, sorry, have seen your x-staging PPA thingy only now. Is that 1.14?
<mlankhorst> canonical-x/x-staging is
<seb128> Sweetshark, qengho, didrocks, Laney, kenvandine, mlankhorst, cyphermox, mterry, robru, tkamppeter, attente, desrt: hey, it's meeting time
<qengho> yay!
<didrocks> hey
<kenvandine> hey hey hey
<seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2013-04-16
<Sweetshark> o/
<mterry> hi
<seb128> I hope everybody is fine
<seb128> let's get started
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey
<cyphermox> hey
<Sweetshark> seb128: working on bug 1085169, 4.0.2 is in raring EOF
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1085169 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "LibreOffice Menus Stop Working even with libreoffice>=1:3.6.2~rc2-0ubuntu4 and indicator-appmenu>=12.10.3-0ubuntu2.1" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1085169
<Sweetshark> seb128: s/working on/have a hotfix, looking for a clean fix/
<seb128> Sweetshark, good work on 4.0.2
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
<seb128> qengho, hey
<qengho> - testing specialty hardware.
<qengho> - chromium-browser release, several days behind.  Security update, also fixing build size, nss dynamic-loading breakage on ARMHF, new breakage on lucid in link-time file-descriptor exhaustion. More cross-compiling work.
<qengho> Only the f-d exhaustion is a unsolved problem.
<qengho> EOF.
<pitti> c'est l'heure du glace !
<qengho> Yum.
<seb128> pitti, non, c'est l'heure du weekly meeting :-(
<seb128> pitti, enjoy!
<mlankhorst> c'est l'heure de la bierre!
<pitti> seb128: already done :)
<seb128> qengho, thanks
<seb128> didrocks, hey
<didrocks> hey!
<didrocks> * some processes work on cupstream2distro and update to better work between a R and S series (even landing in another ppa)
<didrocks> * some daily release general maintenance
<didrocks> * touch apps in raring discussion, some clarification with what we are going to land when and how
<didrocks> * help on touch apps bootstrap
<didrocks> ..
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<seb128> Laney, hey
<Laney> \o
<Laney> A lot of release work reviewing the queue and FFes, and discussions around uploads.
<Laney> â¢ Some help with outstanding transitions to get proposed in a good shape
<Laney> â¢ Finished the first cut of porting indicator-session to logind; try it out at ppa:laney/experimental or get the code from lp:~laney/indicator-session/logind-port
<Laney> â¢ Now working on porting lightdm. A contributor (Peter de Ridder) did a lot of the work and Robert also did some for shutdown/reboot. lp:~laney/lightdm/logind
<Laney> ..
<desrt> seb128: i have to leave this room in 25 minutes
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> desrt, ok, you're up then ;-)
<desrt> so i spent the entire week at desktop summit
<desrt> got a whole lot agreed between us, gnome, kde
<desrt> and we'll have a lot of concrete deliverables to show for it
<desrt> the big ones are that we have a spec for using dbus to launch applications so we can have applications as dbus services
<desrt> which will make quite a lot of things very much nicer -- including starting apps for things like receiving push notifications, etc.
<desrt> we also agreed on a spec for caching/indexing desktop files
<desrt> so this will vastly reduce the amount of seeking done when unity starts up and needs to read them all in
<seb128> years after the first version from pitti ;-)
<desrt> also reduces memory consumption since it will now be possible to use the things directly out of the mmap cache, without copying... so everyone shares
<desrt> also got agreement on some minor things like a spec for figuring out the size of the trash in an efficient way
<desrt> so we can give "your trash is getting too big.  empty it?" warnings
<desrt> also got stefw to agree to add a accountsservice feature for storing arbitrary data (so we can drop our patches to add custom fields)
<qengho> desrt: (some facility for automatic purging after some age would be good too.)
<desrt> also got lennart to agree on adding a timestamped version of the suspend API in systemd so we can get the double-suspend issue in logind fixed up properly
<seb128> qengho, gnome-settings-daemon does that
<desrt> also got lennart to agree to some changes to the kdbus API he's working on to make it possible for me to implement it :)
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> and some changes for the nss-myhostname in order to allow us to drop /etc/hosts
<desrt> those are the major things that i remember.  probably about 100 other things
<desrt> i guess the big important thing here is that we've sort of revived the xdg process for getting things done
<seb128> did you see that slangasek disagree libnss-myhostname ?
<desrt> and we will be paying attention on the ML and updating specs much better now than we used to
<seb128> +with
<desrt> no.  i didn't see that.
<desrt> what's the issue?
<seb128> he doesn't like having a nss module for that
<desrt> i guessed as much.  why? :)
<seb128> he thinks that whatever is changing the hostname should update /etc/hosts as well
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libnss-myhostname/+bug/1162478/comments/6
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1162478 in libnss-myhostname (Ubuntu) "[FFe] [MIR] libnss-myhostname" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> directly
<desrt> i think /etc should be empty by default :)
<seb128> desrt, anyway, not a topic for this meeting
<desrt> right
<desrt> i'll talk to him
<seb128> thanks for the detailed summary
<desrt> EOF from me
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<kenvandine>  * Fixed OSK handling during login in signon-ui
<kenvandine>  * Rebased no-widgets work in signon-ui on trunk
<kenvandine>  * Generalized script for adding online accounts in the touch images
<kenvandine>  * Fixed autopilot tests in share-app
<kenvandine>  * Packaging updates to share-app for daily releases
<kenvandine>  * Code review and some cleanup of unity-lens-people
<kenvandine>  /EOF
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<seb128> mlankhorst, hey
<mlankhorst> I finished support for nouveau mir, which works for me with some pending kernel patches. I'm having less success with the touch bug tkamppeter mentioned earlier, rebuilding things like xserver on arm is no fun, constantly running into limits or lack of open source video drivers. ;( Did a few more video card tests of mesa for the FFe today.
<mlankhorst> EOD
<seb128> mlankhorst, @nouveau/Mir: great ;-)
<seb128> mlankhorst, thanks
<seb128> cyphermox, hey
<cyphermox> hey!
<cyphermox> so not lots to say; I was doing more work on hud/libhud-qt and testing this on touch, making sure we really could build it from the trunk branch
<mlankhorst> (grab http://cgit.freedesktop.org/~mlankhorst/linux/log/?h=for-airlied-next if you have radeon/nouveau and want to keep the scanout buffer vram instead of main memory)
<cyphermox> turns out it wasn't so obvious and that ate away at my time quite fast
<cyphermox> hud sitll has some tests failing
<cyphermox> EOF
<robru> cyphermox, hud is so broken on my system... :-/
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks
<cyphermox> robru: touch hud ;)
<seb128> mterry, hey
<mterry> Hi
<mterry> - Helped daily-release effort with a bunch of fixes and config changes
<mterry> - Worked on LightDM branch for Unity Next
<mterry> - Tested mesa SRU for 12.04
<mterry> EOF
<mterry> Which doesn't seem like much
<mterry> But there's a lot in that first item
<didrocks> robru: you should ping ted for more help ;)
<didrocks> mterry: FYI, tomorrow, the daily release will have the mirrored bfb icon
<mterry> Also, dodged bombs
<didrocks> mterry: so we really need it to land before final freeze :)
<cyphermox> yay
<mterry> didrocks, mirrord bfb icon?  ok
<didrocks> mterry: we had some autopilot issues, seb128, sil2100 and I looked at them
<didrocks> so hopefully, it will be merged by tomorrow and more stable
<seb128> mterry, oh, right, not a good day for Boston, I didn't even ask if you are alright ... I guess you are since you are there ;-)
<mterry> didrocks, nvidia bailed last night, but hopefully will work tomorrow
<didrocks> seb128: you didn't check that he was online? bad bad seb :p
<mterry> seb128, yeah, everyone I know is ok
<seb128> mterry, good to read
<didrocks> mterry: we know, we spent 2 hours connected ;)
<robru> mterry, glad to hear that
<didrocks> (for nvidia)
<mterry> didrocks, right
<seb128> mterry, those failing run have things blocking and the screensaver kicking in and everything going wrong then
<seb128> mterry, sil2100 did a few fixes, let's see if that helps
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<seb128> robru, hey
<robru> Friends:
<robru> * Simplified a community-contributed patch to help support Sohu in Friends, added test coverage as well (not a full Sohu plugin, just a minor architectural change necessary to support it).
<robru> * Started work on Sphinx support for pretty documentation of Friends
<robru> * Fix an off-by-one error preventing you from tweeting exactly 140 chars.
<robru> * Resolve t.co links
<robru> * Change binding of Esc key in friends-app (but toolkit bug prevents it from being perfect, filed bug upstream)
<robru> * Fix some data missing from retweets.
<robru> * Limit notification spam on Friends first run.
<robru> * Fixed a custom debugging tool I wrote for Friends that bitrotted slightly.
<robru> * Sooooo much bug triage... we have been flooded with duplicate bug reports since our MIR was approved ;-)
<robru> Other things:
<robru> * Fix s/pointing_device/mouse/g in webbrowser-app autopilot tests.
<robru> * Enabled autolanding of webbrowser-app
<robru> * Pushed approximately ONE MEEEEELLION Quantal SRUs for webapps stack.
<robru> * Started launchpad recipe for daily snapshots of lp:emacs ;-)
<robru> EOF
<kenvandine> oh yeah... those webapps SRUs... painful!
<seb128> you guys should get the webapps autolanding done, would spare work over time ;-)
<seb128> robru, thanks
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<kenvandine> seb128, oh yeah!
<tkamppeter>  - Investigating and fixing bugs for the Raring release
<tkamppeter>  - cups-filters 1.0.34 released: Fixed duplex printing with multiple copies, to not have the first page of the second copy on the back of the last page of the first copy.
<tkamppeter>  - CUPS USB backend: Quirk rules to make 6 additional USB printers work
<tkamppeter>  - CUPS: Added fix for web administration interface
<tkamppeter>  - system-config-printer: Fixed presentation of remote CUPS servers under the dtected network printers
<tkamppeter>  - Testing tablet mode on Lenovo Thinkpad Twist with mlankhorst, suffering mouse-button-stuck-down bug 1068994.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1068994 in OEM Priority Project raring "button1 gets stuck after a while" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1068994
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<seb128> attente, hey
<attente> seb128, hey
<attente> spent the last week patching packages and uploading them to ppa:attente/indicator-keyboard
<attente> on-going: trying to get the dynamically generated icons to appear properly in the indicator and menu
<attente> the ppa is here for anyone who wants to try it (icons still broken): https://launchpad.net/~attente/+archive/indicator-keyboard
<attente> EOF
<seb128> I will try the ppa in the next days and let you know how that goes
<attente> thanks seb128
<seb128> attente, thanks (and good luck with the dynamic icons)
<seb128> did I forgot anyone this week? ;-)
<seb128> otherwise it's my turn
<seb128> * Investigated some raring translations issues (templates missing/outdated, code bugs)
<seb128> * Updated fluendo mp3 codecs to the partner archive for raring (support gstreamer 1.0)
<seb128> * Helped investigating/fixing some of the universe ftbfs issues
<seb128> * Patch pilot half-day
<seb128> * Raring updates and bugs fixing
<seb128> </summary>
<seb128>  
<Laney> are we getting a universe fluendo for 1.0?
<seb128> ok, any other topic ?
<seb128> Laney, nothing blocking it I guess? the source is available, anyone can do the update
<Laney> fair enough
<seb128> Laney, it might be worth pinging slomo to know if that's planned for debian?
<didrocks> mterry: kenvandine: robru: cyphermox: reminder that all touch stack should be in daily release, with autopilot tests for those having some running by EOW ;)
<didrocks> mterry: kenvandine: robru: cyphermox: also, we are near hard freeze, I think we should go to force manual publishing from now on. There is a little configuration to add to the scripts + redeploy every raring stack. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DailyRelease/MovingNewRelease#Final_Freeze_of_a_release
<didrocks> end of announces ;)
<kenvandine> didrocks, indeed... i am not going to get unity-lens-people in though
<kenvandine> because of the unity depends
<mterry> didrocks, OK, I can propose a big manual mode for raring suite
<didrocks> mterry: would be perfect!
<didrocks> mterry: there is only one that I deployed until now, the one I bootstrapped as an example :)
<mterry> didrocks, autopilot for touch stack is a problem.  I'd heard that a branch had been written for adding the missing deps, but I don't see that in the config trunk
<mterry> didrocks, should I write that too?
<didrocks> mterry: it's not lp:autopilot?
<didrocks> mterry: IIRC, this is is bootstrapped in head/misc
<mterry> didrocks, no, I mean, the cu2d-config is missing the full set of deps introduced by, say, mediaplayer-app-autopilot
<mterry> So the job fails
<Laney> seb128: did you have to do much porting to the gcc proxy patch? have you tested it?
<didrocks> mterry: ah, sil2100 is working on it
<mterry> OK, couldn't remember who was
<didrocks> mterry: was supposed to be done by yesterday
<didrocks> but the branch proposed this morning has an issue
<seb128> Laney, I didn't have to do "much", but I fixed some bugs on the way, and yes, tested it with manual/auto/none and manual by letting some fields empty etc
<didrocks> the ffmepg one we are discussing on the touch stack
<Laney> alright
<sil2100> mterry: https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/cupstream2distro-config/stack_package_dependency_additions/+merge/159110
<mterry> didrocks, We will also have autopilot failures until we can add the daily-next PPA to the CI job.  Because hud2 is in daily-next, but hud1 is in phablet-ppa
<mterry> didrocks, so CI can't approve my branches that move to hud2
<seb128> Laney, 90% of the code is untouched compared to what we have before, it's just plugged at difference places
<sil2100> mterry: but we're discussing the -ffmpeg issue
<mterry> didrocks, but autopilot will fail because it uses hud2
<mterry> didrocks, fginther is working on it
<Laney> seb128: I'll let it through because it would be bad if we didn't have this feature but it is quite late (not blaming you)
<didrocks> mterry: CI should use the same ppa and don't have another configuration
<didrocks> mterry: that's what I told fginther some days ago
<mterry> didrocks, you and I are on the same page
<seb128> Laney, yeah, sorry about that, I almost let it slip but I figured it wouldn't be nice and finally took some time to update that patch today
<seb128> Laney, but not for next cycle, I'm not taking an update with patches commented
<didrocks> mterry: ok, so autopilot is getting fix for hud2 as we speak?
<Laney> indeed
<seb128> we will just block until the porting is done ;-)
<Laney> or at least take it with work items to port them ...
<mterry> didrocks, I have a bunch of merges for some of the apps, but they all can't be approved because CI fails (it doesn't use the PPA with hud2)
<mterry> I had these last week, but have been waiting for CI to clear
<didrocks> mterry: oh excellent news (and not excellent to have to wait :/) ;)
<didrocks> fginther: any ETA for using the right ppa? ^
<seb128> not sure if we officially ended the meeting, but let's wrap and just continue those discussions as informal ones
 * fginther fells the heat
<seb128> thanks everyone
 * fginther *feels* the heat
<mterry> fginther, sorry, don't mean to put this on you
<didrocks> fginther: and again, we really need to talk about streamling the CI to have less options and easier to read configuration file :)
<didrocks> seb128: thanks ;)
<fginther> didrocks, I hope to have it working by eod
<didrocks> fginther: great! keep us posted
<didrocks> mterry: so tomorrow we can try to big merge (tm)
<didrocks> mterry: and start a stack?
<fginther> didrocks, and yes, the configs are a mess, too many special cases we're supporting right now
<didrocks> to see if autopilot behavesâ¦
<didrocks> fginther: yeah, I'm sure we can put that in code, like all the "collect coverity files"
<mterry> didrocks, start a stack?
<fginther> didrocks, but I would definately appreciate other improvements we can discuss
<mterry> didrocks, sure
<didrocks> mterry: yeah, like starting autopilot on the apps stack and see :p
<didrocks> fginther: sweet, let's plan that for the sprint
<didrocks> fginther: a fresh eye with someone not in the process can help :)
<mterry> didrocks, ok
 * didrocks waves good evening
<mhr3> cyphermox, ping?
<ogra_> chrisccoulson, do you still plan a chromium upload before final freeze ?
<ogra_> qengho, ^^^
<qengho> ogra_: if possible.  There's a security update coming in a few days after that.  You're asking because of ARMHF support, yes?
<ogra_> well, armhf is fine ... but i had someone ask why we disabled webrtc after 22
<ogra_> would be nice to switch that back on i guess
<qengho> hrm. I think that was before my time.  I'll check on it, ogra_.
<ogra_> thx ... if its just a flag we should re-enable it
<ogra_> else dont bother :)
<seb128> mterry, do we have some sort of autolanding for update-manager? or should I just commit/push like in old times?
<mterry> seb128, I committed, pushed, and uploaded to raring
<mterry> seb128, no autolanding yet
<seb128> mterry, oh, so you are my personal autolander? nice! ;-)
<mterry> seb128, :)
<qengho> Does the Compose key work for anyone with Raring right now?
<qengho> Settings' kb map shows it, and I see Multi events.
<sarnold> Ã¤â¸
<qengho> Just no interpretation.
<qengho> :(
<sarnold> of course I'm several days behind on updates..
<qengho> Me too.
<qengho> I have no idea where to start debugging Compose events.  :(  X itself?
<robru> qengho, sÂ£â¬ms fine tÅ¯ mÃ¦
<bryce> qengho, Compose key really isn't handled by X.  I'd suggest starting with console-setup.
<bschaefer> qengho, for raring on unity, Nux will be handing the compose keys
<popey> bschaefer: is there a tool which allows you to see what window has focus when nux is involved? xdotool doesn't work once you use nux..
<bschaefer> popey, hmm well do you mean X focus? Cause Nux doesn't like to focus the right window for x...
<popey> well, i dont mean "x focus", I mean "focus is lost, how can I see what has it"
<popey> i mean, really, it seems to be a bug in nux, where the dash loses focus sometimes
<bschaefer> oo right, well those bugs are always tricky hmm I usually have to put in print statements in unityshell.cpp to see who has it
<popey> bug 1169454
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1169454 in unity (Ubuntu) "Dash loses focus when navigating via keyboard" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1169454
<popey> ahh
<popey> shame
<bschaefer> yeeah, there could be a better way, buts its just the way i've used. hmm
<bschaefer> popey, does the dash still have focus X wise? And the focus is just lost with the dash widget?
 * bschaefer hasn't seen that bug
<popey> well, when i run xdotool it claims that no process is associated with the window which has focus
<popey> xdotool getwindowpid `xdotool getactivewindow`
<popey> for example
<bschaefer> o really? Does it give you any sort of XID?
<bschaefer> that you can run throug xwininfo?
<bschaefer> xwininfo -id
<popey> it does give an id, but then the getwindowpid complains that no process is associated
<bschaefer> very strange, let me see if I can repro that bug
<bschaefer> popey, are you using the 100 scopes?
<popey> no
<popey> default raring
<popey> no PPAs
<bschaefer> odd, well I should make sure im fully updated. Ill move that bug up to High to see if anyone else can repro that
<popey> ok
<popey> i mentioned a couple of possible dupes
<popey> so possibly others have already produced it
<bschaefer> cause that seems like a very annoying bug, and if you don't a cursor..something else must of stolen it...I wonder what...
<bschaefer> cool, ill take a look through the bugs to see
<popey> to be clear, the mouse cursor doesn't disappear
<popey> just the highlight
<bschaefer> o, it must have just been hard to see in the video
<popey> yeah, i mis-spoke too
<bschaefer> no worries, I thought I saw it missing in the video :)
<bschaefer> oo this one has a wwaay easier way to repro something similar
<bschaefer> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1124484
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1124484 in unity (Ubuntu) "Dash loses keyboard focus during search" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<bschaefer> popey, also Trevinho just reproed it :)
<popey> heh
<Trevinho> popey: is that appening during the model update or such?
<Trevinho> popey: I mean, with results coming...
<popey> yeah, thats it
<popey> i think so Trevinho
<popey> i found it easy to reproduce just after boot up
<popey> harder the 2nd/3rd time after it happened, to get a video
<Trevinho> popey: mh... intresting yeah
<Trevinho> popey: have you ever noticed this before raring?
<bschaefer> seem like hitting Esc is an easy way to repro as well, but that could be different
<popey> Trevinho: hard to say, i can boot into precise here to try to
<bschaefer> type: "up", press down once, hit esc, key focus lost
<Trevinho> popey: ok, no worry... Just to know, as it seems quite easy to reproduce now
<popey> yeah, steve's is a much better bug report
<popey> feel free to mark dupe â»
<popey> as it likely is
 * bschaefer can only repro it when hitting esc :(
<bschaefer> Trevinho, do you think its a repro of the other one?
<Trevinho> bschaefer: no, I think it's a different thing...
<bschaefer> Trevinho, alright, well Ill triage that other bug, as i can repro it very easily
<Trevinho> bschaefer: i fixed that one for some keystrokes some cycles ago (for meta keys), but that seems another one
<Trevinho> let me check better
<bschaefer> possibly the Esc was missed?
<bschaefer> seems like we set keyboard focus to NULL in nux, and we should be setting it to the search bar
<Trevinho> bschaefer: ah, mh... not sure, probably these two very similar bugs when it comes to the result, but the cause can be different
<Trevinho> bschaefer: so.. for now let's keep them split
<bschaefer> Trevinho, agree
 * bschaefer already triaged it :)
<popey> thanks for looking chaps, much appreciated
<bschaefer> np, thanks for bringing it up :)
<Trevinho> popey: also if you want to test, this is about one report you did... https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/bamf/fix-chromeless-matching-for-webapps
<Trevinho> popey: unfortunately there's still some icons "flickering", but we can't avoid that since the webapps are slow to be recognized
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-04-17
<pitti> Good morning
<creftos> hey so I'm having issues seeing local java applets in my web browsers. It says that my security settings don't allow me to see them. How do I fix this?
<czajkowski> aloha
<jibel> good morning
<czajkowski> good start to tje day. machine refises to boot up and goes into grub menu
<czajkowski> hmmI seem to have some wrongly spelled quantal packages also causing issue http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5715247/
 * didrocks jibel merci d'avoir regardÃ© pour le CDU, Ã§a aurait pris Ã  jcollado la matinÃ©e pour voir que c'Ã©tait Ã§a, et pas leur utilisation de cobbler, etc.
<didrocks> czajkowski: fresh install or upgrade?
<czajkowski> didrocks: been running raring for the last 2 months
<czajkowski> did and update last night and shut down the machine and couldn't boot it up this morning
<didrocks> czajkowski: did you look at what you upgraded yesterday?
<didrocks> czajkowski: like apt logs
<czajkowski> didrocks: in theory I did but it was close to 12when I did the update. it'd been working fine and was only a small update :/
<czajkowski> so cant say what for sure
<czajkowski> sorry
<didrocks> czajkowski: I guess you tried different kernels?
<czajkowski> I went to the first one down for recovery and was then able to reboot it
<seb128> hey desktopers
<seb128> hey didrocks czajkowski
<didrocks> czajkowski: maybe something for #ubuntu-kernel then?
<czajkowski> seb128: ello ello
<didrocks> salut seb128
<czajkowski> didrocks: yeah just about to do another reboot here and then join
<czajkowski> other than that I do love raring
<didrocks> :)
<czajkowski> except that annoying red triangle that appears and tells me I've updates, when I don't
<czajkowski> but it's pretty reponsve and pretty :)
<czajkowski> *responsive
<didrocks> seb128: how is your cold?
<seb128> didrocks, slightly better I think, but always hard to say in the morning, waiting a bit to be sure ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: take some honey :)
<seb128> but I had a good night, went to bed at like 23:45 and slept until 8:40
<seb128> didrocks, yeah :)
<didrocks> waow, long night :)
<seb128> indeed, that was needed to fight the cold it seems
<didrocks> heh ;)
<seb128> didrocks, and you, how are you today?
<didrocks> seb128: better than UTAH/the datacenter
<didrocks> seb128: the CDU (switch to reboot the machines) seem to be dead
<didrocks> seems*
<seb128> oh, not cool
<seb128> so need to wait for the U.S to wake up?
<didrocks> so nothing can work until someone is getting in place
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> but in addition to that, the only guy who can get there is next to where the bombing was
<didrocks> and apparently, he couldn't drive yesterday
<seb128> wouldn't be murphy's law if that was not the case...
<didrocks> yeahâ¦
<didrocks> as we are close to finale freezeâ¦
<seb128> the universe doesn't want the swirl to turn in the right direction :p
<czajkowski> seb128: didrocks when I start up I'm brought to http://ubuntuone.com/1REKSBU0jU7XITkpfBK0RQ  is that a -desktop or a -kernel issue?
<didrocks> seb128: hehe, it seems so
<seb128> czajkowski, option c), -foundation, #ubuntu-devel
<seb128> it's a cjwatson type of issue
<czajkowski> ahh good
<czajkowski> he pokes re lp enough it's only fair :)
<czajkowski> also reboot doesn't work :/
<czajkowski> just hangs
<seb128> but you usually get that menu if the previous boot didn't success
<czajkowski> well it hung on restart so had to power it down manually.
<seb128> did you try booting an old kernel?
<seb128> (sorry just joined in the middle of the discussion)
<didrocks> 09:23:13   didrocks | czajkowski: I guess you tried different kernels?
<didrocks> 09:24:09 czajkowski | I went to the first one down for recovery and was then able to reboot it
<didrocks> seb128: ^
<seb128> czajkowski, ok, so it's normal you get the grub menu
<seb128> that's because you had a boot that didn't go through
<seb128> it's to help the users who don't know how to display the grub menu
<seb128> so talk to -kernel I guess
<seb128> seems like a bug in the most recent kernel
<didrocks> 09:24:36   didrocks | czajkowski: maybe something for #ubuntu-kernel then?
<didrocks> :p
<didrocks> coherent speech at least on #ubuntu-desktop! :-)
 * didrocks hugs seb128
 * czajkowski hugs didrocks and seb128 thanks folks 
<didrocks> yw czajkowski ;)
 * seb128 hugs didrocks czajkowski
<seb128> yw!
<czajkowski> with 8 days to go, it'd be nice if it just did waht it was doing all along and just work :)
<seb128> czajkowski, when was your previous update/reboot before that one?
<seb128> I don't think we got a kernel upload this week
<seb128> so that's a bit weird
<czajkowski> seb128: last night was the last round of updates I did and just shut it down as it didnt ask for a reboot and then this morning it went a bit  nuts
<czajkowski> but now I know how to get around it and online it's ok
<veebers> didrocks: ping
<didrocks> veebers: pong
<veebers> didrocks: hello o/ FYI (i've also emailed you :-) ) there appears to be a recurring issue with Utah that is effecting the daily release jobs (as well as others)
<didrocks> veebers: hem, see #qa, I've already had a look this morning seeing no email and failing jobs :)
<didrocks> veebers: the CDU is dead, there was nobody in the US time being able to look at it (from #qa)?
<czajkowski> didrocks: seb128 one final question, any idea why it's pulling in incorrectly named quantal packages, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5715247/  don't mind the book one at the end
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<didrocks> veebers: as it seems we are now bound to wait something in lexigton to wake up
<veebers> didrocks: oh d'oh my bad, I didn't see that.
<didrocks>  As noted in the bug we've observed the install working as expected (including the reboot) but still get this error reported back.
<didrocks> oh? really?
<didrocks> not what jibel saw ^
<didrocks> jibel: bug #1169851
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1169851 in UTAH "Timeout for System Started " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1169851
<seb128> pitti, salut, ca va ?
<pitti> seb128: Ã§a va bien ! mieux que NetworkManager :)
<seb128> czajkowski, grep thebookofgimp /etc/apt/* -r ?
<veebers> didrocks: That was yesterday when thomi experienced the same/similar bug. So that might not be 99% accurate now
<seb128> pitti, tu as cassÃ© network-manager?
<czajkowski> seb128: the book is just one of the commercial apps I test that I've had a refund on
<veebers> hmm, looks like my internet is lagging too :-P
<pitti> seb128: oui, avec des nouvelles tests :)
<robru> didrocks, hey
<seb128> czajkowski, well, it seems like the repository for it changed or something
<didrocks> veebers: maybe it was once, as jean-bapstiste did retry manually to reboot
<didrocks> hey robru!
<thomi> veebers: didrocks, it still happened, as of a few hours ago
<pitti> seb128: (nouveaux?)
<seb128> pitti, nouveaux
<seb128> un test
<pitti> alors masculine
<seb128> oui ;-)
<robru> didrocks, I should inform you, I am off friday for a wedding (and also leaving early thursday). so wednesday is my only day to get some autolanding stuff done
<veebers> thomi: ah, you'll see that I fired off and email except didrocks was already onto it
<robru> didrocks, but I'm really struggling with it :-/
<jibel> veebers, morning, that's the problem with the CDU
<thomi> cool
<thomi> sounds like I owe didrocks a beer :)
<didrocks> thomi: not fixed, and direct the beer to jibel :)
<didrocks> robru: oh? did you try to ask other for helps? Especially upstream as they know qmlâ¦
<veebers> jibel: ah ok. I'll alter the bug and mark it as invalid. Sorry for the extra email :-\
<didrocks> robru: if you are just waiting for me, yeah, loosing a day everytime to force and back, not handyâ¦
<jibel> veebers, UTAH times out because fence_cdu failed to contact the power device
<veebers> jibel: ah I see. makes sense
<didrocks> robru: so you should investigate and try to look at what it is yourself, and not wait :p (sorry, but this is way more important than friends as a priority, what I told since a month and half :/)
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, I have added comments with my results (and a patch) to the bugs about the touch click problem.
<didrocks> for*
<robru> didrocks, I haven't asked much from cyphermox or mterry, no. just some ps guys like gusch and jhodapp. usually they're good but still many problems plague me...
<didrocks> robru: it's the import right? you don't reproduce this issue in a pbuilder?
<robru> didrocks, well I haven't tried a pbuilder for a couple days so I don't remember exactly, but for the most part I'm not usually able to run these at all locally, I am just relying on jenkins to test build for me. that's obviously very slow, long delay in the feedback loop
<didrocks> robru: indeed, I think focusing on why it's not running locally for you should be #1 as you will need it at any further point
<didrocks> robru: and a pbuilder to setup it not that complex, even with a ppa
<didrocks> robru: ok, one sec, grabbing the branch
<didrocks> robru: does upstream ack that we can have those tests run during package build?
<didrocks> in a chroot
<robru> didrocks, are we talking about camera-app? gusch just said right there that it should run, didn't he? talking about the deps.
<didrocks> robru: I didn't see him talking that the tests runs without a X display
<robru> didrocks, oh, that I don't know
<didrocks> robru: you should have asked many moons ago IMHO :)
 * didrocks tries to build in his pbuilder, now that he added the ppa
<robru> didrocks, before 1hr ago I didn't even know that headless was even a concern.
<didrocks> robru: I think you really should focus less on friends, which is not our team's priority, and more on packaging/integration, and how things are built (even the basics) as it's our main job
<robru> didrocks, so I can build camera-app, and it can even install, but it still complains about libhud. I have that package installed from the PPA, i have no idea what's going on here.
<didrocks> robru: oh, so you mean different issues than the pbuilder one? or the same?
<didrocks> (complaining about import?)
<robru> yeah, it can't import HUD
<didrocks> ah, so this is different
<didrocks> HUD 1 vs 2 issue?
<robru> didrocks, I guess so.
<didrocks> robru: so, that's a different issue, mterry and cyphermox saw that, and indeed, ted moved to HUD 2 and the apps are still using HUD 1. mterry and cyphermox ported some apps to HUD 2
<robru> didrocks, http://paste.ubuntu.com/5715338/ they both look like 0.1 to me, but it can't find itself
<didrocks> robru: did you look what version libhud-qt installed?
<robru> didrocks, same, 0.1
<Laney> morning!
<seb128> Laney, good morning!
<desrt> good morning, all
<seb128> desrt, hey, how are you?
<desrt> i'm awesome
<seb128> desrt, when do you fly to the gtk hackfest?
<desrt> tomorrow
<desrt> the accountsservice stuff is almost done now, btw
<seb128> nice
<desrt> the ICE trains in this country are awesome for getting hacking done on
<seb128> nice seats and power ? ;-)
<desrt> it's already storing values properly -- just need to add some polkit now
<desrt> ya
<desrt> and tables
<desrt> even in 2nd class
<seb128> mvo, hey
<mvo> hey seb128
<seb128> mvo, wie gehts?
 * desrt is nearby mvo (ish)
<mvo> gut, danke! nice weather for a start :)
<mvo> desrt: near as in "europe" or near as in really near ;) ?
<desrt> FRA
<desrt> aka: my favourite place on earth
<seb128> mvo, quick question for you, when you update update-notifier translations, is that by asking a po export to launchpad and copying those over in the po dir? or is there a smarter/vcs integrated way?
<mvo> desrt: haha, just a stop-over?
<mvo> seb128: I don't think I have a smarter way for u-n, I did do some LP i18n export branches but iirc not for u-n
<seb128> mvo, ok, good enough, I master the rename and cp commands :p
<seb128> mvo, danke
<mvo> haha
<mvo> your welcome
<seb128> mvo, how is uni? having fun there?
<mvo> yeah, its not bad. currently a bit crowded, term just started
<seb128> packed with young and crazy students? ;-)
<seb128> they are not getting on your nerves too much? :p
<desrt> mvo: no.  departing from here.
<desrt> mvo: took the train in from nÃ¼enburg
<mvo> seb128: no, its fun, they are keen to try out new stuff
<mvo> desrt: did you visit suse^Wnovel^Wwhats-it-called-today?
<desrt> mvo: yes
<pitti> hmm, le pain noir est prÃªt
<pitti> didrocks: ^ c'est encore le vrai pain !
<didrocks> pitti: pfffff
 * didrocks doesn't want to speak to pitti anymore, it's not Friday! No trolling :p
 * pitti donne une accolade Ã  didrocks
<pitti> didrocks: SCNR :)
 * didrocks hugs pitti back
<GunnarHj> seb128: ping
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey
<GunnarHj> seb128: Hello Seb! Any chance that you can add a couple of lines to my PPU application?
<seb128> GunnarHj, oh, right, sure, will do
<seb128> it's still on my todo but I didn't get to it yet
<GunnarHj> seb128: Thanks! I don't know; maybe the endorsements by Laney and pitti are sufficient, but they ask for at least 3...
<seb128> GunnarHj, I will add one, no worry, when is the meeting?
<GunnarHj> seb128: Monday
<seb128> ok, good
<seb128> will have it done today, that should be fine
<GunnarHj> seb128: Great, thanks again. :)
<darkxst> GunnarHj, I take it nothing ever happened with upstreaming g-c-c region stuff? we really need something for ubuntu gnome
<chrisccoulson> that's better
<seb128> chrisccoulson, what?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, my connection has been slow all morning
<chrisccoulson> just rebooted my openreach modem and it seems to have fixed it
<chrisccoulson> was getting less than 1MB/s!
<chrisccoulson> it's back up to 75MB/s now though
<Nafallo> what time do mterry usually arrive? :-)
<GunnarHj> darkxst: We have added a patch to g-c-c that ought to make region fully functional in Ubuntu GNOME.
<darkxst> GunnarHj, yes I reworked your patch
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Ok?
<darkxst> GunnarHj, but we have no way to install language packs
<GunnarHj> darkxst: True. That's why language-selector is still in use in Ubuntu instead of Region & Language.
<darkxst> GunnarHj, and its kind of a mess really, for example why patch accountservives to use language "en_US" instead of what gnome uses?
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Because it's Ubuntu. language-selector is still the Ubuntu UI, there is a language chooser in lightdm-gtk-greeter, language-selector will be used by Xubuntu and Lubuntu also when Ubuntu standard has switched to region...  accountsservice carries code that is shared by all those.
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Now it's possible to just switch from language-selector to region and back without problem.
<darkxst> GunnarHj, its took quite some work to get those patches back in order, but I think they are ok now
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Back in order? Maybe I'd better take a look? ;-)
<darkxst> GunnarHj, sure, quite some code moved in to gnome-desktop
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Are you using separate versions of some packages in Ubuntu GNOME 13.04?
<darkxst> GunnarHj, 3.8
<seb128> dpm, hey, do you know how the ubuntu-docs template is updated by any chance?
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Aha, that explains a lot...
<darkxst> GunnarHj, see gnome-desktop package on gnome3 ppa, and g-c-c on staging
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Thanks for the tip; will take a look.
<seb128> I can see GNOME 3.8 taking a loooong time to land in Ubuntu :p
<dpm> hi seb128, the docs team have got a script to do it, I think, there was an e-mail on ubuntu-doc recently explaining the process. Let me see if I can find it
<darkxst> seb128, if that happens, what on earth will we do?
<seb128> darkxst, "we"?
<darkxst> although I do agree there are lots of invasive changes in there
<darkxst> ubuntu GNOME
<seb128> darkxst, keep using our working versions?
<darkxst> lol, we can't do a 3rd release with 3.6
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Without having seen it, I get a feeling that Ubuntu GNOME need to make a choice. Ubuntu or GNOME. ;-)=
<seb128> darkxst, is ubuntu GNOME mission to ship the latest crack even if it's broken, or to ship a good usable GNOME?
<ogra_> what a question ...
<ogra_> latest crack indeed !
<darkxst> seb128, usable GNOME (except for staging ppa)
<seb128> darkxst, ok, so help to get those issues sorted out, even if it takes yet another cycle...
<dpm> seb128, hm. I don't know how the docs team updates the template. Here's the process of doing an upload with translations, but it does not describe how to update the template: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-doc/2013-April/017219.html.
<dpm> There is old info on how to build it, but I don't think it's up-to-date (I believe they're not using xml2po anymore): https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/Translation
<seb128> dpm, thanks
<seb128> dpm, https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-doc/2013-April/017178.html suggests "make pot"
<dpm> ah, nice
<seb128> dpm, shrug
<seb128> dpm, what is less nice is that the template we have is outdated by ~1700 strings
<seb128> dpm, the yelp start page gives me a "what's new in 12.10" in fr here
 * seb128 uploads an updated template
<darkxst> seb128, yes that is half the reason I am looking into this
<darkxst> but our users want 3.8 now, not in a years time!
<seb128> users want everything, they want perfect software for yesterday without helping or paying anything ;-)
<ogra_> you expect that you will need two release cycles to fix it ?
<seb128> ogra_, well 3.8 is out, if we miss 13.10 that will be a year after their release that it goes in an Ubuntu release
<seb128> we will update gtk and apps for sure
<seb128> the tricky bits are gnome-settings-daemon/gnome-control-center
 * ogra_ votes for dropping the latter ... (until they allow me smaller fonts again !)
<ogra_> (yeah yeah, i know its not friday :P )
<darkxst> seb128, yes I am well aware of that, there is also the logind stuff but I guess that is going to land in S?
<seb128> yes, logind is mostly sorted
<seb128> it was almost ready to land for R, will land early S
<darkxst> seb128, so really the worst bit is g-s-d then? since ubuntu could just keep using language-selector for g-c-c (and the other custom panels such as background)
<seb128> darkxst, g-c-c is problematic, they made extra changes that should make harder to have standalone panels from what I saw ... was that fixed in the ppa?
<seb128> darkxst, we also have other patches that will need rebasing, or we need to fork more panels (like to add unity launcher controls to the display panel)
<darkxst> oh right, yes dynamic panel are gone/broken
<darkxst> ^dynamically loaded
<seb128> so you guys didn't fix that in the ppa?
<seb128> well, I guess that's going to be on the blocker list
<darkxst> no, not really a priority
<seb128> we will need to see how many blockers there are like that
<seb128> and see what we can do with the resources we have
<seb128> but I foresee that g-c-c 3.8 will not be an easy one
<darkxst> seb128, pretty sure you could still add custom panels at build time, this more effects like desktop files showing up in g-c-c
<seb128> well, that would requiring merging the sources?
<darkxst> maybe just a small patch to check XDG_DESKTOP?
<darkxst> I believe it was removed because they has issues scanning the .desktop files
<dpm> seb128, hm, that's a bit strange. Generally the docs team are good in terms of updating the template. I know bkerensa did an upload of ubuntu docs with translations very recently, and so if I understand it correctly, and if the template wasn't up to date, essentially he re-uploaded old translations
<seb128> dpm, it seems like he did...
<seb128> darkxst, no, they changed the build to statically link panels into the g-c-c binary to improve start time
<seb128> dpm, in any case the current templace has "What's new in Ubuntu 12.10?" in it
<darkxst> yes, but it was because it took too long to scan the .desktop files, atleast that is what I thought
<seb128> dpm, after running make pot mine has 13.04
<seb128> darkxst, well, whatever the reason that makes much harder to load our external panels
<seb128> so we need to sort that out
<dpm> seb128, let me send an e-mail to the docs team mailing list
<seb128> dpm, about what?
<dpm> about them updating the template in LP
<seb128> dpm, I'm doing it
<dpm> seb128, ok, cool, thanks
<seb128> dpm, I will email translators/doc lists once the upload is done
<dpm> ok
<darkxst> seb128, ok
<darkxst> seb128, maybe I can follow that up with hadess and rtcm
<seb128> what follow up?
<darkxst> an easier way to load external panels
<seb128> you can try, good luck
<seb128> there has been several discussions on the upstream list about that
<seb128> they just don't approve of external panels and don't want to support the usecase
<seb128> they want to control the design and the user experience and to have things done upstream or not
<darkxst> hmm right
<ricotz> seb128, the panels are statically linked to one g-c-c binary
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Had a look, and get the idea.
<ricotz> seb128, reverting that would be quite some patching and i wouldnt recommend that :\
<ricotz> seb128, i just added a patch for the ubuntu-online-account integration
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Didn't you patch gnome-languages.c instead of gdm-languages.c?
<ricotz> seb128, which is quite invasive due it is written in vala
<GunnarHj> darkxst: (The forwards, as you mentioned, haven't made it into GNOME yet.)
<seb128> ricotz, what would you recommend doing instead of reverting?
<ricotz> seb128, adding patches for custom panels
<seb128> Laney, can you approve http://launchpadlibrarian.net/137618272/ubuntu-docs_13.04.2_source.changes for me? I want to email translators/documentation team about it but I need it in and imported first
<ricotz> seb128, or maintain a separate app for ubuntu specific settings
<seb128> ricotz, what would the patches do?
<seb128> ricotz, we don't plan to have 2 system settings app, that would be ridiculous
<ricotz> seb128, adding the actual panel to be statically linked like the upstream ones
<seb128> like merge them in the same source?
<ricotz> yes
<ricotz> https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+archive/gnome3-staging/+files/gnome-control-center_3.8.1-0ubuntu1%7Eraring1.debian.tar.gz
<ricotz> seb128, the mentioned panel is credentials_panel.patch
<ricotz> seb128, maintaining them in a separate git branch would be quite clean imo
<seb128> ricotz, none of those are maintained in git to start
<seb128> ricotz, then I don't want to merge activity-log-manager and ubuntu-online-account and indicator-datetime and old appaerance capplet and deja-dup in a same source
<seb128> that's just plainly stupid
<darkxst> GunnarHj, yes basically, for those bits that moved
<ricotz> seb128, ok, git submodules are a nice way to join 3rd party repositories
<ricotz> seb128, but of course bzr is the ubuntu way
<seb128> ricotz, right, but we don't use git, and I don't want to merge all those sources in a tarball
<seb128> even if we were using git
<darkxst> ricotz, oh, I had another patch to fix langugage selection in user panel, but hadn't uploaded it yet ;(
<ricotz> seb128, ok, then maybe it is possible to add some loader infrastructure without touching all panels (which would be needed when reverting)
<ricotz> darkxst, i see
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Didn't see it, but that's good. Especially the utf8 -> UTF-8 is crucial.
<ricotz> seb128, but it seems either way it is quite some work
<GunnarHj> darkxst: I thought I made Ubuntu GNOME a favour by writing that patch, btw. ;-)
<seb128> ricotz, hey, maybe
<seb128> I didn't look to it yet
<ricotz> seb128, i guess the plan of forking g-c-c is off table (ubuntu-control-center)
<darkxst> GunnarHj, sure, it was a great start!
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Didn't you go for 3.8, though.
<GunnarHj> know ^
<seb128> ricotz, no, but that wouldn't help you much if we need different versions of e.g gnome-desktop
<ricotz> seb128, yeah, absolutely
<GunnarHj> darkxst: But how do you deal with language installation?
<darkxst> GunnarHj, that is the big problem
<darkxst> GunnarHj, tempted to make a native sub-panel to do it, but I am not a design guy
<darkxst> and have no idea, how it would work well
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Last cycle I was of the opinion that Ubuntu GNOME ought to stick with language-selector. Basically I haven't changed my mind.
<ricotz> seb128, so carrying g-c-c panel patches which might link to external widget libs could be an option too, meaning having a minimal patch and the actual gui and logic is provided by an external library
<seb128> ricotz, could be I guess
<darkxst> GunnarHj, how about making language-selector more native? with the new egg-list boxes etc?
<darkxst> s/more/look more/
<ricotz> seb128, alright, bbl
<GunnarHj> darkxst: I'm not a design guy either. ;-)
<GunnarHj> darkxst: And since l-s is planned to be replaced by region, noone is interested in putting too much work into it.
<darkxst> GunnarHj, I like the look of region panel, way better than l-s!
<GunnarHj> darkxst: Me too.
<GunnarHj> darkxst: But l-s has the installation part. Functionality vs. look.
<GunnarHj> darkxst: I tend to think it's more important that it works than that is looks good. ;-)
<darkxst> GunnarHj, yes working is important!
<czajkowski> mterry: ello you about?
<mterry> czajkowski, hello
<darkxst> anyway I am off to bed, havent had enough sleep this week
<czajkowski> mterry: you may be able to help me.  http://ubuntuone.com/3tFMGqECQ36kCd8F4cPoka
<czajkowski> mterry: I keep having that red triangle appear and tell me there are updates, yet when I click show updates, the pop up box appears saying software is up to date.
<seb128> czajkowski, what if you run "sudo apt-get -f install" on a command line?
<seb128> czajkowski, and "sudo apt-get dist-upgrade"?
<czajkowski> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5715805/
<mterry> what seb128 said
<seb128> hum
<seb128> dunno then
<seb128> czajkowski, is that raring?
<czajkowski> czajkowski@sheldon:~$ sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
<czajkowski> Reading package lists... Done
<czajkowski> Building dependency tree
<czajkowski> Reading state information... Done
<czajkowski> Calculating upgrade... Done
<czajkowski> 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
<czajkowski> eep sorry paste
<czajkowski> yes raring
<seb128> weird
<mterry> czajkowski, so software updater is right here.  The bug seems to be with the red triangle
<seb128> I wonder where that red triangle is coming from
<mterry> czajkowski, which i believe is from update-notifier
<czajkowski> seb128: no idea but wish ir would feck off :)
<seb128> is that update-notified?
<seb128> czajkowski, can you stop update-notifier if it's running and "update-notifier --debug-updates" and copy the log?
<mterry> seb128, yeah
<seb128> czajkowski, is there any message/error in the menu displayed if you click on the red triangle?
<czajkowski> seb128: let me get that
<czajkowski> seb128: mterry http://ubuntuone.com/0BPQa3o8o19USyFNpYq2rZ
<seb128> czajkowski, oh, that might be due to error you showed me this morning from your sudo apt-get update
<czajkowski> seb128: nope had the red triangle fo the last week
<seb128> e.g http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5715247/
<czajkowski> just it's not been bugging me as much as today
<mterry> czajkowski, your apt-get update doesn't work?
<mterry> czajkowski, your apt-get update doesn't work?
<czajkowski> it does
<seb128> mterry, ^ cf pastebin I just copied
<czajkowski> the private ppa in that pastebin can be ignored as I was doing online service testing and the app had a refund just not gone in and removed it
<mterry> czajkowski, seb128: that typo got fixed?
<czajkowski> mterry: the quantal one , nope
<mterry> czajkowski, I'm guessing that update-notifier has noticed apt-get update hasn't finished successfully in a while and is warning you about it, but when it launches software-updater, it skips the update phase
<czajkowski> nods
<mterry> czajkowski, I'm assuming when it launches it, you never see it update?
<mterry> czajkowski, vs what you see if you launch it manually?
<mvo> czajkowski: the 401 is the problem, it will notice that it did not update successfully for some time
<czajkowski> I've never seen it launch
<mvo> and warns about it
<czajkowski> I run it manually
<mvo> apt-get update you mean?
<mterry> czajkowski, ah
<czajkowski> yes
<czajkowski> really am sorry for all the confuion today with my machine
<mterry> czajkowski, well, if you want to fix the 401, fix the typo in your sources.list
<czajkowski> :/
<mterry> czajkowski, but I guess this message is expected then
<mvo> thats fine, it will still notice that it wasn't able to successfully apt-get update since some time and warns about it
<mterry> czajkowski, the qunatal -> quantal typo
<mvo> its not smart enough to know that its not a important repo
<czajkowski> mterry: yeah but I've no idea where that came from  but I guess I can just edit that right ?
<mterry> czajkowski, yeah.  or delete the files
<mterry> czajkowski, the file will be in /etc/apt/sources.list.d somewhere
<czajkowski> nods
<czajkowski> will do that then
<czajkowski> cheers and really sorry for the noise
<mterry> czajkowski, no worries!  thanks for sharing your horse face background with us!  :)
<czajkowski> mterry: oh he;s the best of an unusal bunch, I change it on a monday, I've a folder of desktop images, Some are a bit more unual than others :)
<mterry> :)
<Laney> seb128: you want to email them about it /after/ it's in? how would it affect their work?
<seb128> Laney, I wanted to include a link to some updated strings
<seb128> Laney, but to have the link I need the template to be imported by launchpad
<Laney> new strings or broken old ones?
<seb128> Laney, define new?
<Laney> previously untranslated
<seb128> the current english text says "What's new in Ubuntu 13.04"
<seb128> and the template still has "What's new in Ubuntu 12.10"
<seb128> so translations have on their startpage "what's new in 12.10"
<Laney> I can't find the real changes amongst all of the linebreak alterations
<seb128> Laney, well, I just ran "make pot"
<Laney> sure, just saying it's a hard diff to review in that sense
<seb128> the one I was after is 12.10->13.04
<Laney> seems reasonable
<seb128> Laney, well, the template was oudated and not reflecting the content, I just ran the command to update it
<seb128> I'm not sure why it leads to linebreak diff
<Laney> can you push to bzr?
<Laney> probably be easier to see it there
<seb128> Laney, I can't
<Laney> even a branch in ~seb128?
<seb128> Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-docs/updated-pot/+merge/159364
<Laney> aha
<Laney> so the change was made but just not updates in the template
<seb128> Laney, sorry, got disconnected from wiki (and xchat followed nm and disconnected as well)
<seb128> Laney, did you have extra questions?
<Laney> I'm building it now to see what happens to the translations
<seb128> Laney, what do you mean "to the translations"?
<seb128> Laney, you will have less translations but you will have the current content
<seb128> Laney, instead of having pages translated with the wrong content (like saying 12.10)
<seb128> Laney, are you trying to argue that we better ship the 12.10 documentation translated than the 13.04 slightly less translated? ;-)
<Laney> yes, I want to see how many strings are broken
<seb128> too many, but is that going to make a difference?
<seb128> we can't ship 13.04 with the documentation start page saying "what's new in 12.10" ...
<seb128> if we are going to do that we can as well drop the documentation from the CD
<Laney> I agree - I just want to see how much of an effort they're going to have to go to
<seb128> if the answer is "quite some", what does it change?
<chrisccoulson> ooh, http://status.xilo.net/issue/bt-21cn-and-fttc-packet-lossthroughput/
<seb128> what's plan B?
<chrisccoulson> i guess that was my issue earlier
<Laney> I'm not pushing back, don't worry
<seb128> Laney, well, you are delaying so it means the decision depends on factor you need to evaluate
<seb128> Laney, I'm just trying to understand what are our options, from what I see which ship translated but outdated/incorrect versions or we ship the current one which might not be fully translated, both suck...
<Laney> there we go, accepted
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> np
<Laney> would it be possible for them to do the translations upstream? It doesn't seem optimal for us to have to upload to the archive to get the new template in
<seb128> I don't know
<seb128> it seems to import from trunk
<seb128> but I couldn't commit there
<seb128> so I went for what I had access to
<seb128> I'm also not sure how things are working when translations are shared between a project and Ubuntu package
<seb128> if that's not the case we can upload the pot manually
<seb128> but with the current setup they use I didn't have that option either
<seb128> we need dpm back on translations to sort those stuff for us :p
<Laney> ah yeah it does import them
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> I'm not even sure the upload worked for that
<seb128> we might need somebody from the doc team to merge my merge request
<seb128> jbicha, hey
<Laney> I don't know what sharing means in this context
<Laney> but yeah I think merging it would have had the same effect even if uploading turns out to work
<seb128> it means that Ubuntu direct use the translations from the upstream project afaik
<dpm> seb128, Laney, I suggested the docs team a while ago to use translation sharing between the upstream docs project in LP and the source package, but they didn't seem too keen to do it. I'm not sure if they ever set it up. As per the template on the source package, it can be updated without a package upload by uploading the .pot file to the source package in LP.
<mlankhorst> oh dear, the more I look at valgrind the more awesome things I find I can do with it
 * dpm looks at ubuntu-docs to remind himself how everything works
<Laney> dpm: It says it does that
<Laney> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/raring/+source/ubuntu-docs
<dpm> ah, nice
<Laney> "This source package is sharing translations"
<seb128> dpm, I don't find the "upload a template" button and I think that's because sharing is on
<Laney> so what does that mean? Does it mean that the package we just uploaded will have its .pot imported there and then synced with upstream even if it's not merged there?
<dpm> seb128, it should work nevertheless, as there is always the case that upstream and the source package diverge, but let me check
<seb128> dpm, ok, https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/raring/+source/ubuntu-docs/+pots/ubuntu-help/+upload works it seems
<dpm> Laney, let me check the setup and try to answer your question in a minute
<Laney> ok
<dpm> seb128, yes, that's what I was expecting
<seb128> dpm, https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/raring/+source/ubuntu-docs/+imports lists it
<Laney> so anyway, we'll still need another upload to incorporate the actual translations
<Laney> should be fine for SRU I hope
<seb128> right
<jbicha> hi
<seb128> I wonder why the upload from jbicha had an outdated template :/
<seb128> jbicha, hey
<seb128> jbicha, something got screwed up with ubuntu-docs, the template was outdated which means translations are broken
<jbicha> I guess I forgot how to generate the .pot becuase I did try running make pot multiple times which apparently didn't do anything
<seb128> hum
<seb128> I did run make pot
<seb128> and it worked
<Laney> It seems right in seb's branch anyway
<seb128> (you need to run autogen.sh first to get a Makefile)
<Laney> could you merge that so we don't stay out of sync between archive and upstream?
<dpm> seb128, Laney, so the template uploaded on https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/raring/+source/ubuntu-docs/+imports will become the current one for the source package translation in LP. If the template was up-to-date in the upstream project, and if translators translated there, its translations will be shared with the source package and will appear there too.
<seb128> dpm, Laney, jbicha: ok, seems like my template got imported
<dpm> but translators tend to focus on the source package translations rather than upstream
<seb128> we went from 39 untranslated strings to 130 in french
<seb128> I will email the translators list about it
<jbicha> $ make pot
<jbicha> make: Nothing to be done for `pot'.
<seb128> oh
<seb128> timestamp issue
<seb128> you need to rm the current one
<seb128> I'm not sure why but the pot in there has a timestamp newer than the subdirs
<dpm> jbicha, seb128, is the .pot template in the trunk branch up-to-date too?
<seb128> dpm, it will be if somebody merges my merge request, I don't have commit access
<jbicha> seb128: thanks that works
<dpm> ah, gotcha
<seb128> jbicha, great
<Laney> dpm: what happens if the upstream branch doesn't get merged before some translations happen on the source package?
<Laney> does it get reconciled correctly?
<dpm> Laney, yes, that's not a problem. Translations are stored on the database. If the source package template is the latest and has, say 1 string more than the outdated upstream template (i.e. not yet merged), Launchpad will store the translation in the database, and when the upstream template gets merged and updated, then LP will fill in the upstream translation from the database
<Laney> rocking
<pitti> c'est l'heure du glace!
<ogra_> i scream !
<didrocks> pitti: non, c'est l'heure de la course!
<jbicha> seb128: I've pushed your mp
<Laney> thanks for your translations lesson dpm!
<seb128> jbicha, thanks
<dpm> Laney, no worries, helped me remind myself how everything works too :)
<seb128> pitti, bonne glace !
<jbicha> cyphermox: can we get network-manager-openvpn and -vpnc upgraded to 0.9.8 too?
<jbicha> specifically it looks like gnome-control-center 3.8 needs those versions so we'd have to maintain those packages in the gnome3-staging ppa otherwise
<pitti> seb128: merci, c'Ã©tait bien
<seb128> pitti, quel parfum tu a pris ?
<pitti> seb128: one banana, one <invoking google translate>
<pitti> seb128: ... babeurre-cassis
<seb128> yummy
 * seb128 wants
<pitti> didrocks: nous avons marchÃ© avec la glace :)
<cyphermox> jbicha: if you want to update them, feel free
<cyphermox> at least n-m-openvpn needs a UI FE though
<pitti> cyphermox: good morning
<cyphermox> pitti: hey
<mterry> kenvandine, was your recent patch to compiz aimed at raring?  I believe you should file against lp:compiz/raring, unless didrocks can correct me
<cyphermox> jbicha: do you know why a specific version is needed? it seems very weird to me given the actual changes, perhaps it's just a matter of one specific patch, which we possibly already ahve
<kenvandine> looks like /raring was abandoned
<mterry> kenvandine, it's intentionally sparse
<kenvandine> mterry, 0.9.9 branch has the recent package updates
<mterry> kenvandine, oh then maybe didrocks switched the daily-release config.  At one point, it was /raring
<kenvandine> last commit to the raring branch was 2013-03-29
<kenvandine> i initially started on that branch until i noticed none of the recent changes where there :)
<mterry> kenvandine, OK well, you're more up to date than me it seems  :)
<kenvandine> mterry, thanks for mentioning it though :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, let me know if the 0.9.9 branch is wrong
<pitti> cyphermox: ah, first success! https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/raring-adt-network-manager/107/
<seb128> pitti, btw, were you supposed to upload a dia update with the patch for the desrt's glib changes?
<seb128> pitti, there are a few segfault in the dia list in raring, I'm wondering if that's still an issue
<cyphermox> pitti: I'm somewhat concerned by the errors and warnings
<pitti> seb128: I tried, but what initially looked like a 3 minute job quickly turned into an hour-long backporting exercise after which everything was broken
<seb128> pitti, oh ok
<pitti> cyphermox: yes, apparently some leaked objects after shutting down NM; that's TBI
<seb128> pitti, did you try desrt's patch from bugzilla or the upstream commit?
<pitti> seb128: I didn't try the upstream commit
<seb128> k
<pitti> so I stopped that back then and forgot since
<seb128> I though the patch from desrt would apply to the package without issue
<seb128> it's just moving a bunch of lines from one place to another iirc
<seb128> "just"
<seb128> pitti, ok, no worry, thanks!
<pitti> perhaps the upstream patch is simpler
<seb128> I doubt it, desrt said his patch was just moving a block of text from one source to another
<seb128> the upstream one seems to be some refactoring
<didrocks> pitti: courrir avec une glace, c'est moi pratique :)
<dpm> seb128, I've noticed my keyboard indicator appears untranslated, and then I've realized it's not set up for translations. Before I file a bug, am I looking at the right package? -> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/raring/+source/indicator-keyboard/+imports
<didrocks> kenvandine: mterry: 0.9.9 is the "raring" branch, duflu switched to it after more or less checking it was target :)
<seb128> dpm, we don't have a keyboard indicator?
<seb128> dpm, well, the one in ubuntu is coming from gnome-settings-daemon, I've no clue about that indicator-keyboard source, let me check
<Laney> that's attente's ppa package
<seb128> that's what I was thinking
<seb128> but I wonder if he really has an issue with the ppa
<Laney> I think so anyway: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-keyboard
<seb128> or if he has an issue with g-s-d's indicator but mis-indentified the source
<Laney> well, could be that, I just mean that URL
<seb128> yup, issue with g-s-d
 * seb128 looks at it
<seb128> dpm, wb
<dpm> :)
<seb128> dpm, I was saying
<jbicha> cyphermox: I can package them but since I don't use vpn I can't fully test or write the UI part of the FFE
<seb128> <seb128> dpm, well, the one in ubuntu is coming from gnome-settings-daemon, I've no clue about that indicator-keyboard source, let me check
<dpm> gotcha
<seb128> dpm, I found the error
<seb128> dpm, fix uploaded
<dpm> thanks seb128
<seb128> dpm, will be in the next langpack export
<dpm> ok, we'll have to make the next one a full one as well
<jbicha> cyphermox: I only learned there was a problem from http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2136335
<attente> if it's an issue with what i'm working on, i haven't done any localization yet
<seb128> attente, no, it was an issue with the raring gnome-settings-daemon patch
<seb128> dpm, the good news is that it was just a source file missing from POTFILES.in, so strings missing from the template, but those strings were in quantal so launchpad restored the translations already
<seb128> dpm, just checking in the web ui
<seb128> checked*
<dpm> seb128, you're right, I can see them in the gnome-settings-daemon template. Good news indeed.
<seb128> tedg, hey
<tedg> seb128, Howdy
<seb128> tedg, we have an issue with ubuntu-geoip after applying the proxy patch
<tedg> Oh, what's that?
<seb128> tedg, https://errors.ubuntu.com/problem/4bdb09680c6558238a04b34e9e18f96bb7877e8f
<seb128> tedg, seems to hit a bug in libproxy
<dpm> hey chrisccoulson, where does the Firefox .desktop file live? I've noticed that it includes a new string to translate "Open a New Private Window". It might be too late to get the translations in, but we can perhaps point translators to it for the next release
<seb128> tedg, launchpad's bug stacktrace is https://launchpadlibrarian.net/134636789/Stacktrace.txt
<tedg> seb128, Hmm, are other libsoup-gnome packages effected?
<seb128> tedg, not that I can see
<seb128> but maybe we just didn't notice
<chrisccoulson> dpm, https://code.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-trunk.head
<dpm> Sweetshark, for LO, do you think there is a way we can make the quicklist entries translatable? I.e. "New Document"
<xnox> seb128: online-accounts sip setup does not work.
<seb128> tedg, we didn't update libsoup this cycle so not likely a new bug in there
<dpm> great, thanks chrisccoulson
<seb128> xnox, talk to kenvandine ;-)
<xnox> kenvandine: online accounts SIP thing does not work for me and thus I can't use ekiga nor empathy to make a SIP call =)
<seb128> dpm, Sweetshark: that's going to be like for firefox, collecting translations on a wiki and merge them back by hand in the .desktop
<kenvandine> xnox, :(
<tedg> seb128, So this is probably coming from people that have a particular proxy setup...
<seb128> xnox, you can probably call empathy-accounts?
<tedg> That's gonna suck to find.
<seb128> tedg, :-(
<seb128> tedg, it seems quite frequent
<kenvandine> xnox, got a bug report?
<seb128> tedg, so the setup shouldn't be that exotic...
<dpm> seb128, Sweetshark, that'd be a way to do it, but I think there was an issue with LO which made it difficult to just merge in the translations, which is why we haven't done it until now. But I cannot quite remember what it was, I'm sure Sweetshark knows more
<xnox> kenvandine: not now, on the call using skype instead ;-)
<kenvandine> xnox, please file one and we'll find someone to look at it
<tedg> No useful information on the bugs.
<seb128> tedg, did you check the launchpad dups?
<tedg> seb128, Can we grab proxy info in an apport hook, or is that too much?
<tedg> seb128, Yeah, just went through them.
<seb128> ok
<seb128> tedg, hum, not sure if people consider their proxy infos as private info
<seb128> we can ask what sort of proxy they use...
 * tedg doesn't know either.
<seb128> on the launchpad bug
<tedg> Yup, I'll try that first.
<Sweetshark> dpm: seems to me they are already translatable: https://translations.documentfoundation.org/en_ZA/libo_ui/sysui/desktop/share.po/translate/#filter=incomplete&unit=29114532
<dpm> Sweetshark, does that mean that they can be translated upstream and that the translations will be used in Ubuntu?
<dpm> It surprises me that they're appearing untranslated for Catalan
<dpm> and it seems they are translated upstream: https://translations.documentfoundation.org/ca/libo_ui/sysui/desktop/share.po/translate/#filter=incomplete&unit=29114532
<Sweetshark> dpm: yes, it should work that way, maybe the translation stuff is broken, it needed some ugly hacks on top of an ugly perl script to add the unity entries to the desktop files.
<Sweetshark> dpm: yep. seems that perl script is broken.
<seb128> tedg, thanks
<seb128> tedg, I'm pondering if we should revert proxy support meanwhile...
<tedg> seb128, If it is for people with particular proxies, we could just block the crash reporter.  They wouldn't loose data, they never had it.
<dpm> Sweetshark, gotcha. Do you think you could look into it, or do you want me to file a bug?
<tedg> seb128, At least then for those that had proxies that work, they'd get the feature.
<seb128> tedg, ok, fair enough
<seb128> tedg, if we are sure that only proxy users hit the bug ;-)
<tedg> seb128, Sure, sure.
<dpm> chrisccoulson, ah, it seems we've already got some translations for the "New Private Window" Firefox quicklist entry. Do you think you could merge the translations marked in yellow on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Wanted/FirefoxDesktop ?
<Sweetshark> dpm: better file a bug please, Im taking a quick look now, but it might be nontrivial (or ugly) to fix.
<dpm> Sweetshark, no worries. Do you want me to add any particular information to the bug (e.g. the name of that perl script or something)?
<Sweetshark> dpm: the perl script is at sysui/desktop/share/translate.pl if some volunteer wants to beat me to it, that would be highly welcome ;)
<Sweetshark> dpm: fwiw, there still is some UnityQuicklist specialcasing in there: https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/gitweb?p=core.git;a=blob;f=sysui/desktop/share/translate.pl;h=48742b7f1e6d9417a25e71de80543ef2c357be01;hb=a43cc9ec8dde4f311bcf8ff96e6a26d56b2abdcf#l54
<jbicha> cyphermox: hmm, upgrading the vpn plugins to 0.9.8 still didn't work http://paste.ubuntu.com/5716395/
<dpm> thanks Sweetshark, filed bug 1170035 for it
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1170035 in Ubuntu Translations "Translations for LibreOffice QuickList entries are not loaded" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1170035
<cyphermox> jbicha: sorry, I'm busy with other stuff, I can't look at this right now
<jbicha> cyphermox: thanks, since the quickfix of trying 0.9.8 didn't work I guess this will have to wait for next cycle then, I'm going to follow up with GNOME
<robru> pitti, any chance you're still around?
 * didrocks waves good evening!
<seb128> tedg, do you know what makes gio-networking use libproxy?
<seb128> tedg, this bug, the procmaps indicates libproxy is being used, but if I look a /proc/`pidof ubuntu-geoip-provider`/maps that's not the case for me
<seb128> tedg, with libproxy1-plugin-gsettings libproxy1-plugin-networkmanager installed
<seb128> it seems like those should be loaded
<seb128> tedg, I tried with DESKTOP_SESSION=gnome exported as well (and in a GNOME session) since libproxy seems to check for that variable to define when gsettings should be used
<seb128> but still no difference...
<evfool> hi all, who is familiar with the empathy ubuntu online accounts integration? I have a 100% reproducible bug on all raring installs causing only facebook and google IM to work, can not add other accounts, and I would like to help fix it, or do it myself, but I'm stuck with gdb
<rickspencer3> kenvandine ?
<kenvandine> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, are you the online accounts guy? ^
<kenvandine> evfool, hey
 * rickspencer3 is wildly out of date for these things :/
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> yeah, i can help with that
<kenvandine> evfool, what is happening?
<evfool> kenvandine: when trying to add any account (except for facebook and google, which seem to have a web view for auth) with simple text fields for authentication, only the cancel and done buttons appear
<evfool> libempathy seems to get stuck when checking for the account readyness
<evfool> in empathy_account_settings_check_readyness from empathy-account-settings.c
<evfool> and the account widget is not displayed until the account is not ready
 * kenvandine tries
<kenvandine> evfool, i reproduced it with the yahoo provider here
<kenvandine> and also tried on quantal
<kenvandine> works on quantal, with the done button
<evfool> kenvandine: I can repro now with all other providers too, on raring, and I too had it working on quantal
<kenvandine> evfool, is there a bug # for this?
<evfool> kenvandine: bug 1147639 is for IRC, but I guess it's a more generic issue affecting more providers, only the reporter reported it with IRC
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1147639 in empathy (Ubuntu) "Cannot add IRC account details" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1147639
<kenvandine> evfool, i haven't tried the irc plugin, but for yahoo i do get the entries for username and password
<kenvandine> evfool, i get them for irc too
<kenvandine> oh, irc works for me
<kenvandine> but yahoo doesn't
<seb128> why do we always have bug starting to be pointed before the hard freeze day? ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, :)
<kenvandine> salut works too
<kenvandine> yahoo is the only one that isn't working for me
<kenvandine> that i've tried
<kenvandine> seb128, is this why you were asking about libproxy?
<kenvandine> Apr 17 14:36:36 trabajo kernel: [105502.427260] type=1400 audit(1366223796.011:51): apparmor="DENIED" operation="file_mmap" parent=1 profile="/usr/lib/telepathy/telepathy-*" name="/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libproxy/0.4.11/modules/pacrunner_webkit.so" pid=3044 comm="telepathy-gabbl" requested_mask="m" denied_mask="m" fsuid=1000 ouid=0
<tedg> seb128, No, I'm not too familiar with how all that fits together.  Though, I'm guessing that is going to have to change if I start picking up networking pieces :-/
<evfool> kenvandine: strange: GaduGadu, Zephyr,  Groupwise, ICQ, Mxit, AIM, Salut, Sametime, IRC, MySpace, jabber, SIP, Yahoo, Yahoo JP all show the same symptoms for me: only cancel and done button shown
<kenvandine> i get the entries for those
<kenvandine> on both my raring machines
<evfool> but Yahoo was the first I did see this with: I have seen the textboxes once, and never since
<evfool> I have tried clearing libaccounts-glib .config, .share, and other, but no help
<kenvandine> AIM works for me too
<kenvandine> evfool, what do you have in ~/.mission-control/accounts ?
<kenvandine> evfool, to be sure, try it in a guest session
<evfool> I'll try with a fresh testdrive, maybe by getting the latest trunk from lp:ubuntu/empathy and building it I did mess something
<kenvandine> rule out telepathy trying to migrate accounts verses creating
<kenvandine> it shouldn't touch empathy at all
<seb128> kenvandine, no, I'm not asking about that apparmor warning (but thanks for pointing it), I'm asking because ubuntu-geoip is having a segfault in libproxy's code which is one of the most reported raring issue on the daily view
<kenvandine> oh, yeah it does
<kenvandine> the  account plugins for some of those come from empathy sources
<seb128> kenvandine, I tried to reproduce it but I see that libproxy is not in the maps for the process and I'm wondering why (I'm setting up proxy settings and they are being used afaik since ubuntu-geoip displays a connection failed warning when they are buggy)
<evfool> kenvandine: I have no .mission-control
<kenvandine> evfool, ok
<kenvandine> seb128, maybe apparmor is keeping it from loading?
<seb128> kenvandine, I doubt it, ubuntu-geoip doesn't have a profile and I don't see anything in the logs about that
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> kenvandine, but libproxy checks that CURRENT_DESTKOP=gnome in its gnome integration code
<seb128> which seems buggy since we introduced =ubuntu
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> but I tried in a GNOME session and with the env changed and I still don't have libproxis in the maps
<kenvandine> weird
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> wth
<seb128> they are loaded now
<seb128> so maybe it's the env issue and I got that wrong earlier
<seb128> weird
<seb128> kenvandine, grep libproxy /proc/`pidof ubuntu-geoip-provider`/maps
<seb128> kenvandine, does that list stuff for you?
<kenvandine> seb128, yes
<seb128> hum, k
<seb128> kenvandine, you use gnome-shell, admit :p
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> nope :)
<kenvandine> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5716729/
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<jbicha> echo $CURRENT_GNOME is blank here
<seb128> jbicha, you mean $CURRENT_DESKTOP right? and I meant $DESKTOP_SESSION before ;-)
<jbicha> oh ok
<evfool> kenvandine: in a guest  session, I do have the other providers working, yahoo is shown at first, but have the same issue after
<kenvandine> evfool, ok, thanks
<evfool> kenvandine: any ideas for workarounds?
<kenvandine> evfool, sorry, no i don't
<kenvandine> i need to talk to mardy tomorrow
<kenvandine> i can't see where this is blocking
<evfool> kenvandine: that's the strange thing, I have filled it with debug logging and the line it doesn't get past is if (priv->ready) in  empathy_account_settings_check_readyness from empathy-account-settings.c, so absolutely strange :)
<evfool> kenvandine: should I report then a separate bug for the yahoo provider?
<kenvandine> that is the only one i can see a problem with
<kenvandine> so maybe that is different
<evfool> kenvandine: thanks, I have reported bug 1170083 for empathy in ubuntu, let me know if I can help you with anything else
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1170083 in empathy (Ubuntu) "Can not add Yahoo account on fresh raring installs" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1170083
<kenvandine> evfool, thx
<xnox> kenvandine: bug 1170095
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1170095 in empathy (Ubuntu) "cannot setup sip account" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1170095
<kenvandine> xnox, interesting
<xnox> kenvandine: I hope, it's a UI bug that simply the actual form is not visible =)
<kenvandine> that looks like bug 1147639 evfool was asking about
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1147639 in empathy (Ubuntu) "Cannot add IRC account details" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1147639
<kenvandine> xnox, well i see the entries on that
<kenvandine> so i can't reproduce it... which is strange
 * xnox logs into guest account.
<xnox> kenvandine: jabber aim salut yahoo do not work.
<xnox> and sip.
<xnox> other online accounts work.
<xnox> (so the "empathy classics" do not work I guess....)
<xnox> there are two core dumps generated as well, uploading.
<xnox> kenvandine: do you monitor gnome-control-center crashes on errors.ubuntu.com and/or bug reports? as that's where it will be bucketed against.....
<xnox> hmm.. ubuntu-bug *.crash doesn't do anything for me.
<kenvandine> xnox,  evfool couldn't get those to work either
<kenvandine> but the UI loads on both of my raring boxes here
 * kenvandine wonders why... 
<xnox> kenvandine: do you want screenshots of the tread traceback?
<kenvandine> the yahoo one doesn't work though
<kenvandine> can you just add it to bug?
<kenvandine> the traceback
<kenvandine> xnox, do you have account-plugin-sip installed?
<xnox> kenvandine: I've attched .crash file. Download it, run ubuntu-bug *.crash and click show details to view the stacktraces etc.
<xnox> kenvandine: yes.
<kenvandine> i was just wondering if it was showing up even without being installed
<xnox> kenvandine: top crasher on errors =)
<kenvandine>  empathy_account_widget_apply_and_log_in () from /usr/lib/empathy/libempathy-gtk-3.6.4.so
<kenvandine> sounds to me like that should come after filling in the entries...
<kenvandine> weird
<mterry> robru, poke about camera-app
<robru> mterry, hey
<mterry> robru, so I'll start a branch for moving camera-app to daily-release in jenkins and point you at it, so you can see what needs to be done for one of these things
<mterry> but...
<robru> mterry, yeah, I did that once for webbrowser-app already, but didrocks was telling me what to do so closely that I didn't really understand what I was doing
<mterry> robru, I notice that a couple fixes could be made to camera-app's control file.  It should probably be "i386 amd64 armhf" for arches, since that's all qtdeclarative supports
<mterry> robru, and the autopilot package probably shouldn't depend on python-support.  I saw another autopilot package do that needlessly
<robru> mterry, ok I can fix those
<robru> mterry, I'm just running the autopilot tests locally and they're brutalizing my laptop... mouse and keyboard focus are flailing around... very difficult to type this message ;-)
<mterry> robru, heh, I don't bother trying anything when autopilot is running
<robru> oh... pointing device failures.
<mterry> good coffee break time
<robru> mterry, ok, did you see my latest MP with HUD? I'll add some more fixes onto that.
<mterry> sure
<xnox> kenvandine: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/137648234/stacktraces.log
<xnox> kenvandine: https://errors.ubuntu.com/?release=Ubuntu%2013.04&package=gnome-control-center&period=month shows plenty of crashes inside the empathy.so et al
<xnox> the fact that it fails to retrace is sad.
<mterry> robru, have you fixed up qtubuntu-camera and qtubuntu-camera-fake yet?
<mterry> robru, in the sense of updating their packaging and such
<robru> mterry, -fake is definitely good, qtubuntu-camera I'm not so sure. my fixes were merged, but I wasn't sure how to actually test it locally, so that's unclear to me
<mterry> fair enough
<mterry> robru, I'll move them to daily release at the same time
<robru> (though camera-app is finally working locally, so I guess if it's using qtubuntu-camera then that works
<robru> but -fake is *definitely* working, because when I start camera-app I can see the photo that -fake supplies.
<mterry> cyphermox, are indicators on raring OK?
<robru> mterry, ooooh, got the autopilot tests to pass too ;-)
<mterry> robru, https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/cupstream2distro-config/move-camera/+merge/159494 for example
<mterry> robru, two things I did there
<robru> mterry, you might need to be a bit more careful about saying "camera-app and friends" ;-)
<mterry> robru, 1) moved from old config under phablet/ to head/.  This involved adding a little bit to camera-app, which I copied from similar mediaplayer-app
<mterry> robru, heh
<mterry> robru, I cargo-culted that bit because I know that camera-app needs very similar handling to mediaplayer-app
<mterry> robru, 2) near the top, I modified a few test_parameter fields
<mterry> robru, those tell daily-release which autopilot tests to run during the daily release check
<mterry> robru, it needs to know which package to install and which autopilot suite to run.  It *also* needs to know every package that will be installed as a result of installing the autopilot package, for a sanity check
<robru> mterry, https://code.launchpad.net/~robru/cupstream2distro-config/webbrowser-app/+merge/157917 this is the one I did already, but it is 100% cargo cult, I have no idea what any of it means
<mterry> robru, so I added the ones that are new (mediaplayer-app already overlapped almost everything else)
<robru> mterry, not even cargo cult, I was video chatting with didier and he was literally telling me what to type ;-)
<mterry> robru, heh
<mterry> robru, well, let's look at the qtubuntu-camera segment from my merge here
<mterry> robru, the ci: bits are predictably for CI.
<mterry> robru, we are setting a few values to False.  These are local overrides for the global settings at the top of the file
<robru> mterry, what, template: False?
<mterry> robru, we're basically saying, qtubuntu-camera is armhf only, just test CI for armhf
<robru> what even is a template?
<robru> mterry, oh, there's more False's under ci:
<mterry> robru, no, I'm looking at "quantal-i386: False" in qtubuntu-camera
<robru> ok
<mterry> robru, I actually don't know what the template bit is
<mterry> robru, so that explains the ci: overrides
<mterry> robru, for autolanding, I don't know why it cares about the architectures
<mterry> robru, but apparently it does, so we disable them there too
<mterry> robru, I cargo culted that
<mterry> robru, the hooks line adds various PPAs for when we build it
<mterry> robru, most are just needed for quantal
<robru> ok
<mterry> robru, for camera-app, that "template: False" line (which I don't understand) is right under the "generic-mediumtests:" line.  generic-mediumtests is the name for the autopilot test
<robru> mterry, wait, why are we autolanding into quantal? don't we need SRUs for that?
<mterry> robru, so adding that line to the configuration: bit means that in addition to the build tests that CI does, we also want to do an autopilot test for any camera-app merges
<robru> mterry, so it just tests it on quantal?
<mterry> robru, no?
<mterry> robru, I wasn't responding to your quantal question
<robru> I'm confused ;-)
<mterry> robru, I don't know the default platform for the "generic-mediumtests" test, but I assume raring
<mterry> robru, I moved to the camera-app stanza.  And was explaining what the "generic-mediumtests" line was doing
<robru> mterry, is this file just arbitrary YAML or is it's structure more rigid than that?
<mterry> robru, the three lines below that: aggregate_tests, archive_artifacts, and publish_junit are just cargo culted by me; not sure precisely what they mean, but obviously have to do with gathering test results
<mterry> robru, don't know the format
<kenvandine> xnox, do you have telepathy-sip installed?
<xnox> kenvandine: probably not, one sec.
<cyphermox> mterry: tbh I don't know what to think of all these failed tests
<cyphermox> http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/ps-generic-autopilot-release-testing/91/testReport/
<mterry> robru, to go back to your quantal question, we are not auto-pushing to quantal.  autolanding here refers to merging into trunk.  Again, I don't think autolanding really uses architectures or platforms, I think that section is bogus.  But it was in the phablet/ part, so I kept it when moving over
<kenvandine> that's it!
<cyphermox> at this point I don't feel like this stuff should be landing when any tests fail, at this point in the release
<mterry> cyphermox, :(
<robru> ooooooOOOOOOOOooooooooooh, auto-merging-into-trunk
<xnox> kenvandine: there is no such package......
<cyphermox> mterry: this is sickening
<xnox> do you mean telepathy-rakia?
<kenvandine> xnox, evfool: if you have an account plugin installed but not the telepathy provider plugin installed
<kenvandine> it doesn't load
<mterry> cyphermox, but certainly nothing has landed that would affect unity stack (i.e. my stack ran clean, but stopped publish because of indicators; I can manual publish, eh?)
<kenvandine> telepathy-sofiasip
<xnox> kenvandine: clearly there are undeclared dependencies.....
<cyphermox> I don't think so, let me just double check
<kenvandine> xnox, ^^
<robru> cyphermox, 29 failures out of 1500? that doesn't seem so bad to me...
<cyphermox> robru: bah, nothing should fail
<xnox> kenvandine: telepathy-sofiasip is already the newest version.
<robru> cyphermox, well, yeah, but I would be more worried if it was 29 failures out of 30 ;-)
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> maybe that isn't it
<kenvandine> if i remove telepathy-sofiasip but not account-plugin-sip
<kenvandine> and try to add a sip account
<cyphermox> robru: it's still a failure; and as such it's code that is known to be buggy: either the code itself is buggy or the tests are buggy
<kenvandine> it doesn't load the login page
<kenvandine> but if i have them both, it does
<cyphermox> I don't like releasing code that I know is buggy; no matter the point in a release schedule :)
<xnox> kenvandine: to me it looks the same both times, as per screenshot on the bug report.
<xnox> hm..... maybe I should restart/kill gnome-control-center.....
<kenvandine> xnox, without telepathy-sofiasip, it did just finally show
<kenvandine> after a couple minutes
<mterry> cyphermox, you could restart the build?  maybe a fluke
<robru> cyphermox, it's all about context though. if all 29 failures were only introduced recently, then I would say "yeah, revert that, don't release stuff that's introducing new failures", but if these have just been failing all along, well, you can't just not release it. the new stuff probably has less failures than the old stuff. all you can do is work towards fixing as many failures as you have time for.
<kenvandine> but with it installed, it shows right away
<kenvandine> a couple being at least 3 minutes
<cyphermox> mterry: yeah, perhaps that's what I'll do
<xnox> kenvandine: true.
<xnox> kenvandine: just switch back to that window and it has it.
<xnox> let me install it again.
<cyphermox> the changes wouldn't affect unity adversely no; there only things I see are basically some bamf window matching for webapps, libappindicator packaging changes (dropping a clean rule) and  unity-lens-applications
<cyphermox> for some reason changelog entries are being doubled >.<'
<kenvandine> xnox, i need to run out for a bit... i'll debug more later tonight
<cyphermox> mterry: wanna review a quick fix for libappindicator?
<mterry> cyphermox, I was hoping you'd ask
<cyphermox> https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/libappindicator/changelog-fix/+merge/159498
<cyphermox> I mean ... teh yuck... ^
<cyphermox> robru: the problem I have with the tests is that there is only limited things we can do, they fail randomly
<cyphermox> and lots of people have tried to fix them
<robru> cyphermox, oh, that's the sign of a poorly-isolated testsuite then... failures introduced by environmental factors that aren't mocked properly.
<cyphermox> but the fact that there are these failing tests means we keep having to have someone look at whether it's a genuine failure, every time
<cyphermox> I think next, I'll just axe through them without mercy, if it can be done
<robru> cyphermox, NO MERCY!!
<robru> ;-)
<cyphermox> hehe
 * cyphermox puts on a viking hat
<cyphermox> oh crap
<cyphermox> mterry: where you restarting unity or something?
<cyphermox> I didn't think to check if some other jobs were running before starting the indicators tests again
<mterry> cyphermox, no
<mterry> cyphermox, I'm about to manual publish unity
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> then it's fine I guess
<cyphermox> brb, going to go make dishes disappear
<xnox> kenvandine: updated bug title and description bug 1170095
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1170095 in empathy (Ubuntu) "sip account setup page takes 50 seconds to display" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1170095
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-04-18
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> robru: I am now
<robru> pitti, haha. i can't remember why I wanted to talk to you
<pitti> robru: ah, if only we had a way to relay messages to absent people :)
<robru> pitti, one day we will! I'm sure of it!
<robru> pitti, I must have seen your name associated with some random project or other that I had a passing interest in. have you worked on any notable side-projects in the last day or two?
<pitti> robru: network-manager, some discussions about python-dbusmock, langpack maintenance, jhbuild maintenance, some systemd bug fixing, fatrace enhancements
<robru> pitti, hmmmmmm, not ringing any bells. I'll try to email you next time I think of it ;-)
<pitti> robru: or just ask your question on IRC; I read backscroll
<robru> pitti, good point ;-)
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel!
<jibel> salut didrocks !
<seb128> hey desktopers
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks
<Laney> heya
<didrocks> hey Laney!
<Laney> guten morgen didrocks! wie gehts?
<darkxst> pitti, have you had a chance to look into the retracer yet/
<pitti> ah no, we even disabled LP crashes for raring now
<didrocks> Laney: Es geht mir gut, and und Sie?
<didrocks> -and
<pitti> bonjour didrocks et seb128
<didrocks> salut pitti!
<Laney> sehr gut, danke
<darkxst> pitti, we are still getting them
<darkxst> and have a rather large list of unusable crash reports
<seb128> Laney, pitti: good morning!
 * pitti hugs mvo
<seb128> mvo \o/
<didrocks> hey mvo!
<mvo> seb128, pitti: good morning!
<mvo> hey didrocks
<mvo> woah, what a nice hello I get :)
<seb128> mvo, good to see you are still hanging around, we miss you here ;-)
 * mvo hugs seb128
<pitti> mvo: want us to spoil your welcome with some ridiculously hard apt bugs? :-)
<mvo> I knew it!
<mvo> which one?
 * seb128 hugs mvo back
<mvo> (of the many)
 * pitti ponders
<mvo> ;)
 * mvo runs away screaming
<pitti> mvo: oh, oh! how about this terribly inconsistent --auto-remove vs. autoremove?
<pitti> that'll keep you busy blueprinting, testing, and implementing for 3 months!
 * pitti hugs mvo, j/k of course
<mvo> like that you can spell it with or without the "--" :P
 * mvo thinks we should remove options if we can
<seb128> mvo, is there an official way to ask "when was the last update done"?
<seb128> mvo, like an api in aptd or something? or that's basically "check the timestamp of some apt file"?
<mvo> seb128: as in successful apt-get update run or apt-get {dist-,}upgrade
<seb128> mvo, last time upgrades have been applied, so the later
<mvo> seb128: currently its the timestamp, a api would be good I suppose
<mvo> seb128: /var/log/apt/history.log is probably the best bet
<seb128> mvo, danke
<mvo> yw
<seb128> mvo, I'm trying to figure what we need to build https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AboutThisDevice#Phone
<seb128> mvo, though what "update" means will likely change on device where we will deploy base images rather than package
<seb128> mvo, but I'm looking at how we get those infos nowadays just for documentation purpose
<mvo> seb128: I would say use the history file, that is the best way right now
<seb128> mvo, thanks
<darkxst> seb128, is there a bug/blueprint somewhere tracking what needs to be done to land 3.8 components?
<seb128> no, but we should probably do that
<seb128> I will file one
<darkxst> seb128, ok, seem like a good idea
<seb128> right
<didrocks> TheMuso: hey, quite a few people are complaining since latest pulseaudio update that it's taking a big chunk of their CPU. I wonder if the inotify patch doesn't go crazy if /run/ isn't present or anythingâ¦
<didrocks> TheMuso: heard about it?
<seb128> didrocks, can you mention it n #ubuntu-devel? I think diwic made the patch?
<didrocks> yeah, it did
<didrocks> he*
<seb128> he's not on -desktop
<didrocks> seb128: let's move the discussion there, then, thanks!
<seb128> didrocks, thank you for pointing it ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, got feedback from the french forum? ;-)
<ricotz> didrocks, hey, i am complaining too then ;)
<didrocks> seb128: exactly, and quite an important one, so not just one isolated caseâ¦
<seb128> ricotz, do you get the issue?
<ricotz> seb128, yes
<seb128> ricotz, good, you can help diwic to debug then maybe? ;-)
<ricotz> i already reverted the upgrade since it would drain my battery ;)
<xclaesse> seb128, is it known that after suspend/resume or external monitor connect/disconnect (not sure what triggers it exactly) sometimes the windows are moved to different workspaces?
<seb128> xclaesse, that was supposed to be fixed in recent compiz updates, when did you restart your session last?
<xclaesse> 11:45:49 up 2 days uptime
<xclaesse> 2 days, 15:55 even
<seb128> xclaesse,
<seb128> compiz (1:0.9.9~daily13.04.10-0ubuntu1) raring; urgency=low
<seb128>   [ Steve Langasek ]
<seb128>   * Adding/Removing an external monitor causes open windows to move to
<seb128>     another workspace (LP: #763148)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 763148 in Compiz Core "Adding/Removing an external monitor causes open windows to move to another workspace" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/763148
<xclaesse> ok, I'll restart and let you know if it happens again then.
<xclaesse> thanks
<seb128> thanks
 * Laney installs a logind-using lightdm
 * Laney reboots without remembering to actually install it *ahem*
<pitti> Laney: nice!
<Laney> not so - it crashes :P
<pitti> Laney: so you can now shutdown from the login screen?
<Laney> in theory though
<Laney> you should be able to do all of that
<pitti> I also saw a patch on the bug that should provide logind based user switching
<Laney> yeah, and robert landed shutdown/reboot in trunk
<pitti> great, so it sounds things will come together nicely
<pitti> I currently plan to do the switch on the sprint
<pitti> when we have Robert, you, stgraber, slangasek, and me together to deal with any remaining fallout
<Laney> yay, should be exciting
<Laney> I'll hopefully stop it crashing today ...
<stgraber> considering it'll be the first week of the S cycle, I doubt we'll break too many machines ;)
<ritz_> cyphermox ping
<psivaa> seb128: didrocks: Just reported bug 1170338 that's impacting VM installations with today's images and with updated packages.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1170338 in compiz (Ubuntu) "Launcher and systems indicator icons do not appear on VMs with raring desktop installations" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1170338
<didrocks> psivaa: hey, instead of attaching the crash, can you report the bug with apport-bug -c <crash file>?
<didrocks> psivaa: so that we can get a retraced stacktrace
<didrocks> psivaa: FYI, there is a new version of compiz/unity now
<didrocks> psivaa: so upgrading to those and restarting the session would be great :)
<psivaa> didrocks: as i said in the bug, this bug was reported after updating with the latest packages
<didrocks> psivaa: you meant 20130418 desktop image
<psivaa> didrocks: yes, i installed that image, then did a dist-upgrade and reported the bug after that
<didrocks> ok, what version of unity is it? (all packages were not acked at the same time)
<psivaa> 13.04.18~13.04-oubuntu1
<psivaa> didrocks: ^
<didrocks> Laney: waiting for your nux branch btw :p
<didrocks> psivaa: ok, and nux?
<didrocks> I think it should be the latest as well
<didrocks> interesting
<didrocks> psivaa: I don't have any vm off hand, I'll try with tomorrow's image, weird you see that on vm and not on hwâ¦
<psivaa> didrocks: yes, i tried it with hw and it did not occur, also i only tried with i386 as of now, will try with amd64 in a bit
<didrocks> psivaa: you don't have any other .crash file in /var/crash/ ?
<didrocks> psivaa: also, if you see that, try starting a terminal and type "unity"
<didrocks> psivaa: to ensure you see the same, that would be useful info :)
<psivaa> didrocks: there is no crash file in /var/crash
<didrocks> interestingâ¦
<psivaa> *no other crash files other than that is attached to the bug, but that crash occurred before updating the system
<didrocks> psivaa: and the indicator processes are running?
<didrocks> psivaa: as well as unity-panel-service?
<Laney> didrocks: https://code.launchpad.net/~laney/nux/remove-unneeded-changelog-entry/+merge/159590
<Laney> maybe it should have been against lp:nux/raring? But I don't see that in the config and the branches have the same commits anyway
<didrocks> Laney: approved :)
<didrocks> Laney: no, they didn't diverge yet
<Laney> cheers
<didrocks> AFAIK
<Laney> no, looks not
<Laney> will it get pushed to both then?
<psivaa> didrocks: unable to locate unity-panel-service ??
<psivaa> and unable to locate nux
<didrocks> ?
<didrocks> psivaa: what do you mean by "locate"
<seb128> those are not commands/not in the standard path
<didrocks> Laney: no idea, I hope that the guy who will diverge will make sure that branches are synchronized first :)
<Laney> heh
<psivaa> didrocks: sorry when i run apt-cache policy nux i get 'unable to locate package nux'
<didrocks> there is no nux package
<didrocks> libnux-4.0-0
<didrocks> is the package name
<didrocks> psivaa: and I'm asking if the process unity-panel-service and the indicators one are running (on your system)
<psivaa> didrocks: ahh sorry,  4.0.1daily13.04.17~13.04-0ubuntu1 is the installed version
<didrocks> ok, at least, latest on everything :)
<seb128> didrocks, psivaa: yep, confirmed
<seb128> the libgl1-mesa-dri update breaks unity (segfault) in virtualbox
<seb128> tjaalton, ^
<seb128> bryce, ^
<psivaa> seb128: thanks :)
<didrocks> mlankhorst: so, in the future, do you mind ensuring that mesa is not breaking unity in a vm? :)
<seb128> psivaa, you can install https://launchpad.net/~mlankhorst/+archive/ppa/+files/libgl1-mesa-dri_9.1.1-0ubuntu3%7Eppa1_i386.deb if you need a working vm, that fixes the issue
<seb128> psivaa, that's in the raring queue and should get it when an archive admin reviews it
<mlankhorst> didrocks: the breakage was specifically due to a rebase of a size reduction hack for mesa, I'm more curious why it wasn't hit before
<tjaalton> huh, it was tested on kvm, but not virtualbox
<mlankhorst> tjaalton: it only happens on i386 llvmpipe or nouveau
<mlankhorst> and even for nouveau only < nvc0
<psivaa> seb128: yes, it's working now with that deb installation on kvm, thanks
<seb128> psivaa, yw
<tjaalton> ok so it was probably on amd64 then
<seb128> tjaalton, it happens in Xephyr with software rendering forced as well
<seb128> so not specific to virtualbox
<mlankhorst> still i386 specific..
<seb128> right
<seb128> but my point was that we should test on i386 and amd64
<seb128> especially for an upload the day before hard freeze :p
<seb128> that ffe has been coming for a while
<seb128> it's a been disconcerting that nobody tested on i386 vm during that time
<tjaalton> yes, shame on us :)
<dobey> tedg: is indicator-datetime still your baby?
<seb128> tjaalton, sorry, I'm not wanting to point finger, just to make sure next time we do test on those target so we don't run into a breakage again ;-)
<tedg> dobey, No, not really.  It's the indicator team's.
<tedg> dobey, I think that charles touched it last.
<seb128> dobey, charles has been looking at it most recently
<dobey> ah ok
<tjaalton> seb128: we'll just upload it earlier and not wait for upstream indefinitely
<tjaalton> that was the original mistake
<tjaalton> would've caught this issue a month earlier
<tjaalton> or two
<seb128> but you would have broken unity performances  on some intel cards...
<tjaalton> well, the current version just reverts the commit which caused that.. dunno why it didn't occur to me earlier to do that
<mlankhorst> idle hope that upstream would fix it..
<tjaalton> turns out to be kinda hard I guess. such is life when you're after a few fps on some games :)
<dobey> charles: bug #1170366 for you :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1170366 in indicator-datetime (Ubuntu) "Broken handling of All-Day events" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1170366
<Laney> pitti: Phew - I got it to stop crashing and show me a greeter
<Laney> shutdown/reboot don't seem to work just yet though - will work on that next
<Laney> also, do you think we should be opening a CK session if logind is running or not?
<Laney> brb, lunch
<pitti> Laney: if you care about running that on raring, then it may make sense, yes
<pitti> Laney: we won't need that any more in squishy
<kenvandine> hehe... squishy
<kenvandine> pitti, i think you should get to name at least one release :)
<pitti> well, it gets high time to announce the new name..
<davmor2> kenvandine: next time P comes around I think we have Powerhungry Pitti :)
<davmor2> I mean by then Ubuntu will be using so little power someone needs to use it :)
<pitti> lol
<pitti> I'm practicing my pushups! :-)
<kenvandine> hehe
<davmor2> pitti: :)
<davmor2> pitti: is squid the animal to your squishy?
<pitti> that has a certain ring to it
<pitti> "adapts to all your needs and forms"
<xclaesse> seb128, windows changing of workspace happened again
<davmor2> pitti: tentacles in many pies
<seb128> xclaesse, try asking slangasek/smspillaz on #ubuntu-unity
<xclaesse> seb128, laptop was docked with external monitor, then I suspend it, undock while suspended, then wakeup without external monitors => firefox got moved to first workspace
<xclaesse> but it seems thta other windows stayed on their workspace
<seb128> where was it before? on a position that still exist?
<seb128> if it was on the screen that got removed it's normal that it gets moved on somewhere visible
<xclaesse> yep, I configured compiz to have 8 workspaces horizontally
<xclaesse> when I have external monitor, the laptop monitor is disabled
<xclaesse> so I never use dual screen
<Dark_light> who's the mesa maintaner that's working on mesa for 13.08 ?
<mitya57> Dark_light: 13.08?
<mitya57> Dark_light: I believe mesa is maintained by #ubuntu-x team
<Dark_light> humm ok I've been told to look for him here I'll try there, thanks!
<jbicha> seb128: hey I missed the gnome 3.8 conversation yesterday
<seb128> jbicha, hey
<jbicha> I think the stuff in the GNOME3 PPA for raring should be fairly safe to land in S next month
<seb128> jbicha, is that the gnome3 or the staging ppa?
<jbicha> there's a few bugs with GTK 3.8, Software Center, and Nautilus desktop handling but those shouldn't be too bad
<jbicha> just the regular gnome3 PPA
<jbicha> staging is for stuff that needs more work
<jbicha> that would give us a split 3.6/3.8 foundation but it's worked pretty well so far
<jbicha> personally I usually run Raring+gnome3 PPA but without the staging PPA
<seb128> jbicha, it would help if those had vcs-es and merge requests
<seb128> jbicha, I don't want to repeat what happened this cycle, we regressed on gnome-control-center and nautilus and then everybody moved to work on the ppa and let the regressions in raring
<seb128> jbicha, I just fixed the system proxy stuff tuesday we would have released with that broken otherwise
<jbicha> merge requests against what?
<seb128> the official packaging vcs-es
<seb128> like a nautilus-3-8 packaging vcs than we could bzr merge on lp:~ubuntu-desktop/nautilus/ubuntu
<seb128> rather than having to try to figure out what changed and copy stuff overs by hand
<jbicha> yeah we could do bzr branches
<seb128> it would make easier to see the history of the work that happened on the vcs
<seb128> some people tend to not properly list their changes in the changelog there ;-)
<seb128> (ricotz to not list anyone :p)
<jbicha> ricotz has been doing better with that for the gnome3 ppas for several weeks now
<seb128> good to read
<seb128> like the nautilus 3.8 changelog doesn't mention the patch to restore the "create document" submenu that you said would not work in the new version
<seb128> it means that either the change is not included in the ppa at all, or it got commented out, it got updated
<seb128> but I can't get that information easily atm :/
<seb128> jbicha, well, in any case agreed, 90% of the ppa should be fine
<seb128> the most problematic one will be nautilus
<seb128> (and g-s-d/g-c-c but they are not in that ppa yet)
<seb128> what about gtk and software-center?
<jbicha> yes nautilus needs more work, if you would look at the debian/changelog you'd see that the last version in common is 1:3.6.3-0ubuntu5
<jbicha> we have to continually rebase against current Ubuntu and we hadn't done that recently for nautilus (but I did do it for gnome-control-center this week)
<seb128> right
<seb128> the rebasing would be easier with a packaging vcs ;-)
<seb128> it would just be to merge the new revision from the ubuntu serie
<jbicha> the merging gets complicated when patches get rebased so I'm not sure it would be smooth
<seb128> anyway, I told earlier to darkxst that I would register a blueprint for GNOME 3.8
<seb128> and start listing known issues for the updates
<jbicha> there's bug 1163886 that we haven't figured out yet, someone mentioned yesterday that it worked if they ran usc with sudo
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1163886 in software-center (Ubuntu) "software-center crashed with signal 5 with the GNOME3 PPA on 13.04" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1163886
<seb128> do you know of any component that will need lot of work
<seb128> out of nautilus/g-c-c/g-s-d?
<jbicha> g-c-c needs Canonical expertise to figure out how to get external panels working again
<seb128> yeah
<jbicha> power management is broken but 2/3 of the problem will be solved by logind
<seb128> going to be a lot of fun rebasing patches we had for e.g adding unity launcher controls to the display capplet I guess
<jbicha> there's quite a few other patches that need to be rebased (they're listed in d/changelog)
<seb128> right
<seb128> I'm a bit concerned about stuff moving to gnome-shell as well
<seb128> like https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=691202
<ubot2> Gnome bug 691202 in power "power: Drop explicit screen locking on suspend" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<seb128> or media keys handling
<darkxst> seb128, does unit use the OSD's?
<seb128> "OSD"?
<seb128> we have notify-osd
<seb128> if you are speaking about libnotify notification service
<darkxst> ok so you don't use the ones that were removed from g-s-d
<seb128> you mean?
<seb128> the service is what displays the messages on screen
<seb128> e.g the rendering
<seb128> oh
<jbicha> g-s-d did some extra media keys refactoring for 3.7.92 so the ppa is still on 3.7.91
<darkxst> yes
<seb128> you mean the popups for media keys/volume/screen etc ?
<darkxst> yes
<seb128> we sort of use g-s-d
<seb128> we patch the g-s-d code to send synchronous notifications to notify-osd
<darkxst> ok
<darkxst> I probably should go to bed, (like 2hrs ago)
<darkxst> seb128, just cc me on the blueprint whenever you make it
 * didrocks waves good evening
<tedg> Hey attente, larsu was saying that indicator-keyboard has the manifest for indicator-ng in it.  But I can't find it.  Can you give me a pointer?
<attente> tedg, sorry, i don't understand what you mean by manifest
<attente> is it the .indicator file?
<tedg> attente, yes
<attente> it's generated from data/Makefile.am
<tedg> Ah, I see.  Thanks!
<desrt> mterry, larsu: just about to leave montrÃ©al.  flight is a bit (20mins) late
<desrt> i'll text when i land
<mterry> desrt, k
<TheMuso> didrocks: No, your comment is the first I've heard about it.
<TheMuso> didrocks: Ah, seems David has fixed it.
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-04-19
<pitti> Good morning
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel, joyeux vendredi! :)
<jibel> Salut didrocks
<ritz> seb128 morning
<seb128> hey desktopers
<seb128> happy friday
<seb128> ritz, hi
<ritz> you are up early
<seb128> it's in fact quite late compared to other europeans there ;-)
<ritz> haha, is cyphermox on vacation ?
<seb128> no
<seb128> he should be around in ~5 hours
<ritz> aah, thanks
<ritz> my bad, I thought he was working from Europe
<didrocks> salut seb128, happy Friday!
<seb128> didrocks, lut, to you too!
<ritz> didrocks, hi, I believe you own a wetab. Have you tried ubuntu touch on it ?
<didrocks> ritz: hey! No I didn't TBH. My wetab didn't boot for a long time.
<didrocks> ritz: TBH, I doubt this will work as long as we have that many dependencies on android stack
<ritz> oh, android 4.2 works fine on it
<ritz> atleast, android x86
<ritz> and if I remember correctly, we do plan to port mir to support non android based driver
<chrisccoulson> good morning
<chrisccoulson> happy friday!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good morning and happy friday to you too !
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how are you ?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, good thanks. and you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks, weather is finally set on sunny for some days and sticking to it
<seb128> and it's friday
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, it rained pretty much the whole day here yesterday ;)
<didrocks> happy Friday chrisccoulson!
<chrisccoulson> but at least it's not snowing now :)
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks
<didrocks> seb128: ah, so you stole my sun! :)
<seb128> didrocks, and I'm pround of it :p
<seb128> \o/
<didrocks> snif! so sad :)
<chrisccoulson> hah
<didrocks> seb128: I know you are bored, care looking at https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/mediaplayer-app/dailyrelease/+merge/159759 quickly? ;)
<seb128> didrocks, looking
<didrocks> thanks!
<seb128> didrocks, hum, how does that stuff work again? I should you need a bootstrap r<...> in the changelog ... what's the marker?
<didrocks> seb128: the marker is below, in the previous commit
<didrocks> seb128: the only part missing was to put an upstream-downstream changelog
<seb128> didrocks, oh, ok, the diff cuts too short to see that
<didrocks> the package is already in split mode
<didrocks> yeah ;)
<seb128> bah
<Laney> morning
<seb128> didrocks, I approved but can't change the status
<seb128> didrocks, I'm not in the right team I guess
<didrocks> seb128: ok, I'll do it :)
<seb128> Laney, hey, happy friday!
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> seb128: thanks to you!
<Laney> happy friday to you too!
<didrocks> seb128: just to give you some contextâ¦
<didrocks> happy friday Laney!
<didrocks> seb128: https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/cu2d-media-head-1.1prepare-mediaplayer-app/5/console
<didrocks> seb128: here is what happens, because I dch "bug balablabla first"
<didrocks> to it change native to nativeubuntu1
<didrocks> and then, when I finally dch -v "" before the last commitâ¦
<didrocks> seb128: I prefer to keep it that way so that we are asking ourself "did I put it in split mode"?
<didrocks> but it seems that mterry & cyphermox missed that steps in at least 3 projects ;)
<seb128> didrocks, I see
<seb128> shrug, users really hate bug #1067876
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1067876 in openSUSE "Missing "Safely Remove Drive" option from Quicklists. Only have "Eject"." [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1067876
<ogra_> luckily its in opensuse :P
<seb128> haha
<ogra_> why does lp not pick the ubuntu task ... /me shakes head
<ogra_> (or the bot .... )
<seb128> ubot2, you are not so clever it seems...
<ubot2> seb128: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<didrocks> it agrees
<seb128> ogra_, ^ that's why :p
<ogra_> lol
<didrocks> oh no, it's raining!
 * didrocks puts all the blame on seb128
<didrocks> no balconey today! :)
<seb128> didrocks, :/
<seb128> blue sky and sun here
<didrocks> that's unusual :)
<seb128> yep
 * Laney yodels for pitti
<Laney> ... does org.freedesktop.login1.Manager.PowerOff work for you?
<pitti> ici il pleut aussi :(
<pitti> Laney: it usually does, I just wouldn't like to try it right now when I have two VMs and a langpack build running
<Laney> I tried it in a VM ;-)
<Laney> here it seems to try to call the systemd unit for some reason?
<pitti> hm, that should fail and fall back to "shutdown -h"
<pitti> oh, wait
<pitti> is that because of our systemd shim?
<pitti> does that offer these APIs, but not implement them?
<Laney> ah, maybe
<Laney> how do I get logs out of logind?
<pitti> Laney: kill it, and start it in a shell
<Laney> ah ok
<Laney> aha!
<pitti> Laney: what does it stumble on?
<desrt> good morning, all
<desrt> larsu: if you're awake yet, stay inside
<desrt> there's cops all over the place and the transit is shutdown.  the news is telling everyone to stay inside
<desrt> they killed one of the guys and they're trying to catch the other and he's somewhere around here
<Laney> pitti: Going to test http://paste.ubuntu.com/5721208/ now
<didrocks> desrt: seems you have animated neighborhood
<pitti> Laney: ooh
<desrt> didrocks: i'm at mterry's house :)
<pitti> Laney: good catch
<didrocks> desrt: ah, that explains :)
<desrt> didrocks: it's the boston marathon explosion stuff...
<desrt> the guy is on a rampage now, apparently
<didrocks> desrt: yeah, once you told you are at mterry's, I made the connection :)
<didrocks> well, unsurprisinglyâ¦
 * desrt wanted to go out and get some coffee :p
<didrocks> desrt: or you can wake up mterry and ask him to make you a coffee, while staying inside :)
<desrt> pish.  it's not even 7am here
 * desrt is still on slightly european time
<desrt> i can do some hacking for what is hopefully the short time before this wraps up
<didrocks> desrt: he has the opportunity to luckily works for a long day, don't make him miss that :)
<desrt> didrocks: and i'm supposed to be on the other side of one of the streets that they shut down by 10am :)
<didrocks> desrt: well, I think that everybody will understand if you can't get there on time :p
 * desrt doesn't suspect many other people will be there on time if he's not...
<Laney> and we have shutdown
<Laney> pitti: seems to work
<pitti> and looks straightforward
<Laney> yep
<pitti> can this still land in raring, or do we put that patch into a bug report for squishy?
<Laney> it doesn't seem necessary for raring I suppose
<Laney> i-session is still using CK for example
<pitti> I have a local git here, based on mbiebl's local "notetaking" git, but neither is sufficiently official to stage the fix there
<pitti> ok, bug report it is then
<larsu> desrt: morning
<desrt> larsu: reading the news it seems that the 'heat' of the chase has moved on now to watertown
<desrt> transit is still down, but i want a coffee :p
<larsu> come to my place, people seem to be awake here ;)
<desrt> might do
<desrt> was thinking the starbucks in central square
<larsu> ya, we could do that as well
<pitti> hey larsu
<larsu> pitti: hi! Wie geht's?
<pitti> larsu: prima, danke! (fortunately) the worst thing here is the rainy weather
<desrt> larsu: about reading to head out.  meet you at 'the spot'?
<larsu> desrt: need a bit longer
<larsu> desrt: like 20 min
<larsu> we can meet at the starbucks if that's too late for you
<desrt> ya.  it's not too much further, so let's just meet there
<desrt> ciao
<Laney> Ah, I thought I had inexplicably broken lightdm-gtk-greeter, but it was always broken
<Laney> I think that's better ...
<pitti> cyphermox: FYI, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/0.9.8.0-0ubuntu6 brings back the dnsmasq test (both test cases)
<cyphermox> ok, you fixed it?
<pitti> yes
<pitti> (changelog has details what I changed)
<cyphermox> isn't it beyond late to be uploading that?
<pitti> *shrug* it just changes autopkgtests; there's no change that affects the build or install of that package
<pitti> I asked the release team this morning, and they were fine with it
<cyphermox> ok :)
<pitti> but I expect to do further tests in the ubuntu branch only
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> cool!
<pitti> I'm currently running them against upstream trunk (fails ATM)
<pitti> and I'll add rfkill and sleep tests
<pitti> cyphermox: did you ever see that nm-dhcp-helper ? I guess that's a new thing upstream, or was it there before and we replaced it?
<cyphermox> nah, I hadn't seen that
<cyphermox> well
<cyphermox> I saw it upstream, AFAIK it's for handling hooks for dhcp
<pitti> ah, it was previously called nm-dhcp-client.action
<cyphermox> ah
<pitti> I'm getting something really strange here
<pitti> do we use /usr/lib/NetworkManager/nm-dhcp-client.action ?
<cyphermox> yes, it gets started by dhclient
<pitti> ok, thanks
<cyphermox> see src/dhcp-manager/nm-dhcp-dhclient.c
<pitti> ok, that's a mystery for Monday
<pitti> good night everyone, enjoy the weekend!
<jasoncwarner__> hey TheMuso seb128 , do you guys know if audio broke today? I updated, rebooted and now I have no sound. in my audio settings I have simply 'dummy output'
<seb128> jasoncwarner__, what version of pulseaudio do you have? (dpkg -l | grep pulseaudio)
<jasoncwarner__> hey seb128
<seb128> jasoncwarner__, that's the current version (0ubuntu6)
<seb128> jasoncwarner__, does it make a difference if you pulseaudio --kill ?
<jasoncwarner__> seb128: I'll give that a shot
<jasoncwarner__> seb128: no, seems to kill it, restart it and still no sound
<seb128> jasoncwarner__, did you try to reboot?
<jasoncwarner__> after the kill?
<jasoncwarner__> no, I'll do it
<seb128> no, just since the issue started
<seb128> sorry for the lame suggestion
<jasoncwarner__> seb128: doing it now
<jasoncwarner__> seb128: one sec
<seb128> but I've the feeling it's one of those where we will spend 25 min to debug without finding anything obvious
<seb128> and where a reboot will fix it
<jasoncwarner__> seb128: still broken
<seb128> jasoncwarner__, tried booting a previous kernel?
<Laney> jasoncwarner__: I'd say diwic would be your best bet at a knowledgable pulseaudio person
<mlankhorst> jasoncwarner__: lsof /dev/snd/*
<dobey> jasoncwarner__: what sound card do you have? i noticed that the one that's part of my nvidia gt 520 card for hdmi output is gone after latest kernel update (though i also switched to lowlatency kernel at the same time)
<desrt> larsu: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=697601
<ubot2> Gnome bug 697601 in gio "reduce GMenuModel D-Bus traffic" [Normal,New]
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-04-20
<purezen> Hey guys..!! I wanted to know if the updates enabling Hardware Video Acceleration via UVD on ATI Radeon HD 4000 through MESA have arrived on Ubuntu 12.10 x64 yet..?
<Sarvatt> apw: finally, a working pidgin on 13.04 - https://launchpad.net/~sarvatt/+archive/sru1
<Sarvatt> the backport from that bug seems to work, ~50 startups so far without having to kill it
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-04-14
<pitti> Good morning
<mlankhorst> Hello, world!\n
<RAOF> mlankhorst: Yo! Whatup!
<mlankhorst> nothing much, kernel is a pain :P
<RAOF> Hurray! :)
<RAOF> In other pain points: looks like helgrind doesn't understand C++11 very well.
<Ads20000> Hello, I installed Ubuntu GNOME on my Trusty installation on my Ubuntu desktop because Unity wasn't working and I noticed that the GNOME 3 PPA that claims to have the 3.12 packages for Trusty doesn't. Any chance I could help (or at the very least join the GNOME 3 team)? Thanks :)
<Ads20000> (considering that Debian Experimental has the 3.12 packages - all I would need to do would be to move them over to Ubuntu and test them - should be fairly stable considering they've basically already been tested upstream...)
<Laney> salut tout le monde
<didrocks> bonjour Laney, comment vas-tu?
<didrocks> bon week-end ? :)
<didrocks> (you are starting to regret, right? :p)
 * Laney summons all the knowledge of french
<Laney> trÃ¨s bien!
<didrocks> heh ;)
<didrocks> \o/
<Laney> et toi?
<didrocks> trÃ¨s bien aussi ;)
<didrocks> a lot of people this week-end at home
<didrocks> (we were 7 sleeping at my home). And it was kind of geeky
<didrocks> really nice to have seb128 around for some days as well
<Laney> wow
<Laney> the others were free software people?
<didrocks> yeah ;)
<didrocks> ubuntu-fr/gnome
<didrocks> we were at jdll: http://www.jdll.org/
<didrocks> which is a FLOSS "public oriented" conference + booth
<Laney> oh cool
<Laney> did anyone give a talk?
<didrocks> not this year
<didrocks> not a lot of people are coming, I became lazy and didn't submit
<didrocks> it was more an excuse to hang out with people you know well more or less ;)
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<seb128> didrocks, !!! ;-)
<didrocks> hey seb128! long time no see :)
<Laney> ola seb128
<seb128> indeed!
<seb128> hey Laney
<seb128> how are you?
<Laney> Â¿cÃ³mo estÃ¡s?
<Laney> pretty good thanks
<Laney> the sun has come!
<Laney> did you have a nice weekend?
<seb128> excellent
<seb128> Lyon is great, and stay at didrock's is awesome ;-)
<seb128> I managed to do some 13.10 -> 14.04 upgrade for people who paid me back with beers at the conf as well
<Laney> who needs a salary?
<seb128> haha
<Laney> :P
<seb128> speaking of which
<seb128> mvo, mmmmmvvvvvooooooo
<seb128> you have bogs!
<mvo> seb128: hm?
<didrocks> mvo: bugs coming from Lyon, they are good bugs! :)
<Laney> some of the finest tasting bugs in all of france
<mvo> didrocks, seb128: *cough* beer bugs?
<seb128> mvo, one of the 13.10 -> 14.04 had dist-upgrader getting down with an utf error while trying to desactivate the ppas
<mvo> seb128: aha! what is the bugnumber?
<seb128> let me find it back
<didrocks> Laney: that's the spirit! ;)
<seb128> mvo, the bt matched https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-release-upgrader/+bug/1278280
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1278280 in ubuntu-release-upgrader (Ubuntu) "ubuntu-release-upgrader crashes with DistUpgrade/sourceslist.py", line 416, in save : UnicodeEncodeError: 'ascii' codec can't encode characters in position 97-114: ordinal not in range(128)" [High,Confirmed]
<seb128> mvo, well, apparently bdmurray fixed it in trusty,, but I guess we should SRU the fix to saucy, since people upgrading run the saucy version?
<seb128> mvo, or is the dist-upgrader updating itself on start?
<mvo> seb128: thanks, infinity made me work for him, once I finished that I will look at this
<seb128> mvo, danke
<mvo> seb128: hm, during a saucy->trusty upgrade the trusty version of the upgrader is used
<seb128> ok, I was unsure
<seb128> so the bug is not fixed
<seb128> well, people said that on the report as well/reopened it
<mvo> yeah, looks like the fix is either not working or not "enough"
 * mvo nods
<seb128> mvo, the other smaller issue is that g-c-c/g-s-d are not uninstalled on upgrades
<seb128> not sure if we have a way to say "clean those if nothing depends on them"
<mvo> seb128: aha, yeah, you mentioned that and I failed to do it, sorry
<seb128> they are only needed if you have gdm/GNOME installed
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> that's really a detail
<seb128> it's a bit of disk space
<didrocks> I guess it's just a question of being puzzled on the dash
<didrocks> but yeah, as seb128 a detail
<mvo> seb128: it should be very simple, I put it on my list
<seb128> mvo, danke
<didrocks> said*
<mvo> didrocks: very simple (hopefully) - u-r-u will just mark it as auto-installed and the cleanup will automatically  clean it
<didrocks> ah nice ;)
<jibel> seb128, salut, could someone have a look at bug 1303516
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1303516 in graphite2 (Ubuntu Trusty) "ubiquity crashed with SIGSEGV in _int_malloc()" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1303516
<jibel> ?
<seb128> jibel, salut, I'm going to have a look/forward upstream, I don't think we have anyone knowing that stack though
<jibel> seb128, I understand. It is not nice to see the installer crash on 1rst screen though
<seb128> indeed not
<seb128> is there an easier way to reproduce that booting an iso and running the installed in an env that is not set up for debug?
<jibel> seb128, you can reproduce it directly on your machine. Install ubiquity-frontend-gtk and start ubiquity --greeter
<seb128> jibel, thanks, that's going to make debugging easier
<jibel> seb128, it will change the configuration of your locale/keyboard so be ready to revert to something you can use
<seb128> k, I should be able to manage ;-)
<seb128> thanks for the notice though
<jibel> :)
<xnox> jibel: yeah, all python people are in montreal at the moment...
<tjaalton> unity --reset is apparently deprecated, but manpage still has it?
<seb128> tjaalton, we welcome patches ;-)
<jibel> xnox, do you mean they'll do a brainstorm session on this crash ? ;)
<tjaalton> seb128: as always.. :)
<tjaalton> just wondering what the replacement might be
<seb128> tjaalton, not sure why they dropped it, maybe we should just add it back
<seb128> I had to google for the gsettings reset command this w.e
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, hi
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, I will report the bug at freedesktop.org now, as product I have chosen "xorg which is the component which I have to choose?
<mlankhorst> server
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, "Server/Input/Core"?
<seb128> Trevinho, hey, did you see https://code.launchpad.net/~beidl/unity/unity-lockscreen-gestures/+merge/215569 ?
<mlankhorst> yeah
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, you tell you have seen something in my log files. Can you tell me which log files? From which bug and which attachment there?
<mlankhorst>  /var/log/Xorg.0.log iirc
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, thanks, bug submitted as https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=77426
<ubot2> Freedesktop bug 77426 in Server/Input/Core "Several touch screen issues, I do not know whether all are caused by X or not" [Normal,New]
<mlankhorst> tkamppeter: can you look in Xorg.0.log ?
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, will do, I am simply reproducing the problems, so that appropriate errors will get there.
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, /var/log/Xorg.0.log attached to the bug.
<mlankhorst> tkamppeter: odd, I thought I saw mentions of BUG_WARN_MSG(!(event->device_event.flags & TOUCH_POINTER_EMULATED), "Non-emulating touch event\n"); in a touch bug report :/
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, any other log needed? Or are all my observations bugs in the appropriate apps?
<mlankhorst> not sure yet..
<didrocks> hum, I wonder if the notify-osd didn't regress
<didrocks> I plugged back to 2 monitors
<didrocks> ah no
<didrocks> the behavior is just different from what I expected :)
<didrocks> (it's only on the monitor which has the focused app, like when typing, not where the mouse is)
<seb128> didrocks, right
<didrocks> making sense :)
<seb128> didrocks, before this cycle it was always on the primary monitor
<didrocks> yeah, I was expecting that we went the "where the mouse is" proposal
<seb128> but yeah, the new behaviour makes more sense
<didrocks> but I prefer the real behavior actually
<seb128> same here, sometime the cursor end up on the other screen while you are just using the keyboard
<om26er_> question: why are apport dialog' not disabled before the release ?
<om26er_> they seem to appear all the times, puts a bad impression on the release.
<seb128> om26er_, wrong channel for that question
<seb128> try to ask ev on #ubuntu-devel
<om26er_> hmm, I thought it affecting the desktop experience ;) will try there.
<seb128> om26er_, what sort of issues do you have? they shouldn't be that frequent, it might because you work in qa and trigger bugs often, that's less of an issue for normal users
<om26er_> seb128, I have not enabled anything, whenever I log in I am greeted with apport 'report a problem'
<om26er_> and they are like 3 dialogs one over the other
<seb128> om26er_, can you ls /var/crash and share the details/bug numbers?
<om26er_> seb128, ok, lightdm,unity-greeter and gvfsd-mtp look interesting one's
<om26er_> I'll report that by clearing everything there and reboot .
<seb128> om26er_, ok
<seb128> om26er_, the bottom line is that if we don't collect reports, we don't know what to fix
<seb128> om26er_, the best solution is to fix the bugs so apport stops prompting, not to keep the bugs and just don't tell the user about those
<seb128> especially for user apps, when they close it's better to tell the user what happened
<om26er_> seb128, sure, I was expecting the report a problem thing to be disabled because it has haunted people in the past (talking askubuntu etc)
<seb128> but yeah, the tradeoff is the quality perception
<seb128> we disable the reports to launchpad
<seb128> not the errors collecting
<seb128> not that other OSes do the same
<seb128> for what it's worth I don't see apport more than 1 a week on my system (out of some issues with dev tools, like system-dbus-image hitting exceptions when I run autopilot tests)
<seb128> so your 3 prompts at every login means your machine has specific issues
<om26er_> brb
 * seb128 removes ubiquity
<seb128> Laney, thanks for taking on that bug, best is probably to report it to upstream harfbuzz
<seb128> I think it's a good starting point
<Laney> yeah it's hard
<Laney> valgrind doesn't work properly on it
<Laney> is that language Thai?
<seb128> Laney, not sure, did you figure it out?
<Laney> nope
<Laney> reporting it upstream
<seb128> Laney, it tries to apply a "mm" keyboard layout, which is "Burmese" in /usr/share/X11/xkb/rules/evdev.xml
<seb128> Laney, so yeah, looks like Thai could be right
<Laney> why not burmese?
<Laney> looks like that
<seb128> is that a locale?
<seb128> I didn't find a language-pack-gnome-mm :p
<seb128> oh, it's "my"
<Laney> yeah, myanmar
<seb128> Gtk:ERROR:/build/buildd/gtk+3.0-3.10.8/./gtk/gtktextsegment.c:195:_gtk_char_segment_new: assertion failed: (gtk_text_byte_begins_utf8_char (text))
<seb128> gedit doesn't like ubiquity/ubiquity/my.po
<seb128> I've that by selecting text in there
<seb128> could be a better/easier testcase than ubiquity
<seb128> if that's the same issue/underlining bug
<Laney> can't make that one happen
<seb128> Laney, weird, happens every time for me, I just left click on the top of the file and move a bit the cursor over the text to select/deselect it
<Laney> nope
<seb128> k
<seb128> well, I'm going to report that on gtk since that's where the error is from the backtrace
<Trevinho> Laney: hey, I've just noticed that a fix that was merged some weeks ago (https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/alpha-windows-shadows-fix/+merge/213352) got deleted by the last merge... I guess there's nothing to do but an SRU, right? :(
<Laney> Probably best, I guess you're going to do an early SRU
<Laney> how did that happen?
<seb128> Trevinho, hey, did you see my ping earlier?
<Trevinho> Laney: well, one of the branches for fixing the lockscreen (not mine) was probably not well merged with trunk
<Trevinho> seb128: ops, no
<seb128> Trevinho, hey, did you see https://code.launchpad.net/~beidl/unity/unity-lockscreen-gestures/+merge/215569 ?
<seb128> Trevinho, I want to land that today, it's a security issue/should be fixed for release
<seb128> Trevinho, can you review that change?
<Trevinho> seb128: yes, I will check that today...
<Trevinho> seb128: ok
<Trevinho> seb128: any other high-prio thing you can land today?
<seb128> Trevinho, thanks, if you can do now/not to late that would be nice, they might not wait too much
<seb128> Trevinho, I doubt it, I'm already going to be happy if we manage to get that in, not sure if they plan to respin isos again
 * Trevinho if his shoulder strain make him write...
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> what did you do?
<Trevinho> seb128: no idea... during the night something weird happened... Maybe I just slept in the wrong position, no ieda... this morning I wasn't able to move in bed as well :o
<seb128> urg
<seb128> Trevinho, get better!
<beidl> Trevinho, wouldn't it be better if hiding the launchers parent window would be taken out for now? it causes the icons as well as the hint shadow not to show up in autohide mode.
<Trevinho> it's simliar to the stiff neck, but in the shoujlders...
<beidl> Trevinho, get well soon!
<Trevinho> beidl: mh, hint shadow? it was showing when I proposed it... hmmhm let me check
<beidl> Trevinho when you drag the mouse pointer to the left edge in autohide
<Trevinho> beidl: right it is now showing now, but couldn't that after the last change you proposed?
<Trevinho> beidl: not point anything, I just recall it was working :)
<beidl> Trevinho that change was just for allowing the launcher-drag-in-animation to work when using the 4 finger gesture
<Trevinho> beidl: let me see
<qengho> Hi all. I have a new chromium-browser, which is in universe. What are the chances I can get it into 14.04?
<qengho> Many CVEs fixed, as usual.
<Laney> qengho: It's on mythbuntu and kylin. Go check in #ubuntu-release
<seb128> qengho, hey, did you hear about issues where chromium was opening a new instance with your session every time you click on an url to open it?
<seb128> qengho, rather than opening a tab in the current instance
<seb128> qengho, the new version from your ppa seems also quite slow (well, I didn't upgrade it since I installed it a week ago so maybe that's resolved since)
<qengho> seb128: Was this my testing PPA?
<seb128> yes
<qengho> seb128: I had the testing version use a temporary directory, instead of clobbering a profile you might value. That would explain xdg-open starting new windows.
<seb128> qengho, k, so should not happen with the archive upload? good!
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<didrocks> oh phew!
<didrocks> thanks qengho, seb128 :)
<seb128> yw!
<qengho> didrocks, seb128, I'd be happy if you try the version in my update-staging PPA to verify it's gone.  https://launchpad.net/~canonical-chromium-builds/+archive/stage
<seb128> qengho, let me try that version
<Malsasa> Hello. My HUD on Ubuntu 12.04 doesn't work anymore. When I tap ALT, Unity opens menu of focused app. Not the HUD anymore. I can't do ALT+TAB switcher at all. Any idea for me? Thank you.
<mvo_> seb128: no luck so far reproducing the utf8 bug you mentioned earlier
<seb128> mvo_, we didn't have luck reproducing it either at the install party, we tried to get debug output but couldn't get it again
<seb128> mvo_, did you try to put non ascii chars in a sources.list.d source that is going to be commented?
<seb128> mvo_, or maybe rather than "non ascii" using "non utf8 valid"?
<mvo_> seb128: yeah, I tried a bunch of different things, I will try harder
<seb128> mvo_, don't spend too much effort on it, e.u.c doesn't have it ranked in the top issues so it might not be that important
<rickspencer3> seb128, jasoncwarner what's the word on the street? everything getting settled for releasing 14.04 this week?
<seb128> rickspencer3, hey, things look alright I think, still a few issues/things we would like to land but that's usual
<rickspencer3> seb128 coolio
<rickspencer3> seb128, the desktop feels very solid to me
<rickspencer3> I've got it on 2 very different computers, and it's working really well
<seb128> thanks, I'm quite happy with the state of things as well
<seb128> we still have stuff to fix/polish to make it even better, but that's always the case
<seb128> we have SRUs for that as well ;-)
<seb128> rickspencer3, Didier, I and others were at a small opensource event in Lyon this w.e, we did some 13.10 -> 14.04 upgrade for users who had brought their laptops, things went smoothly in most case and we only had happy users ;-)
<rickspencer3> \o/
 * rickspencer3 fumes about not being invited
<seb128> sorry about that, next time ;-)
<rickspencer3> :)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: come to Lyon! it will be easier :)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, sounds good, I can live there as did your belle-soeur
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> seb128: see, management tracks their employees! Time to go on strike! ;)
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, just make sure don't give him my room though!
 * seb128 was first to claim it
<didrocks> heh :)
<seb128> didrocks, is it sunny enough today to use a strike day?
 * seb128 looks outside
<seb128> seems like it could be one of those days :p
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, but it's a little bit too late now :p
<didrocks> better to start in the morning
<didrocks> and tomorrow is sunny as well
 * seb128 notes that down
<didrocks> let's do from torromow untilâ¦ thursday :p
<didrocks> well, you have your friday off
<seb128> it let me time to do a banner on how the NSA^Rick spies on us
<didrocks> Mr "I claim to be French but in fact, I'm half-German" :)
<seb128> oh, that's right ;-)
<seb128> "good friday" is good ;-)
<didrocks> yeah yeahâ¦
 * didrocks starts doing a second strike banner
<seb128> :-(
<Laney> four day weekend this week :-)
<seb128> didrocks, come to Metz and claim it's a day off for you! ;-)
<didrocks> Laney: you are German as well?
<Laney> Wenn ich weniger arbeiten mÃ¼ss, JA!
<didrocks> :)
<Trevinho> beidl: that shadow thing is not related to the window not being shown it seems...
<Laney> Sweetshark: libreoffice autopkgtest went boom
<beidl> Trevinho, how did you test? I removed every _parent->ShowWindow() call and it works.
<Trevinho> beidl: or, wait... sorry I didn't install correctly the plugin :(
<beidl> Trevinho classic :D also, when minimizing a window, the corresponding icon should pop up for a second and hide again. Reverting the launcher window hide fixes that as well.
<beidl> * parent_->ShowWindow rather
<tkamppeter> seb128, I have a problem with bug 1306344. One could solve it by installing the hplip-gui binary package. Could we ship Trusty with this package? Or do we still have the problem that dependencies make Trusty too big then?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1306344 in hplip (Ubuntu) "hp-setup crashes when adding new printer because hp-sendfax is not found" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1306344
<Trevinho> beidl: yeah, the same for urgent icons
<Trevinho> beidl: ok, +1 on reverting that
<Trevinho> beidl: do you want to do a branch for that or should I do?
<beidl> Trevinho I could push it to the branch related to showing the switcher on lock screen using gestures
<Trevinho> beidl: it actually saves us a lot of redraws, but the fix should probably add more edge-cases than the real gain
<Trevinho> beidl: ok
<beidl> Trevinho: I figured that, but I guess thats SRU material until all edge cases are found
<Trevinho> it's weird btw I was pretty sure I tested these cases... :o
<tkamppeter> seb128, would be great if we could ship hplip-gui as in Trusty + 1 we could lift the awkward binary package splitting then.
<seb128> tkamppeter, it's late now to do changes for trusty...
<tkamppeter> seb128, or should I then make an SRU which makes hplip pulling in hplip-gui?
<seb128> tkamppeter, try asking on #ubuntu-release if they would be ok with that
<Sweetshark> Laney: thx checking
<Laney> Looks like some kind of test problem rather than an actual issue
<Laney> sadly
<seb128> bregma, hey
<bregma> seb128, yo
<seb128> bregma, could you get https://code.launchpad.net/~beidl/unity/unity-lockscreen-gestures/+merge/215569 reviewed?
<seb128> bregma, that seems like a release blocker
<bregma> already working on it
<seb128> bregma, I tried to put it in a silo to get testing/an head start, but ppc64el build fails in tests :/
<Trevinho> seb128: what failure? there are some tests that seems to fail there
<bregma> ppc64el has been misbehaving in tests lately, usually it succeeds when you rerun just that build
<bregma> roll the dice on that one
<seb128> cjwatson retried it for me
<seb128> same issue
<seb128> Trevinho, https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/landing-008/+build/5908000/+files/buildlog_ubuntu-trusty-ppc64el.unity_7.2.0%2B14.04.20140414-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<Sweetshark> Laney: sadly? of course, hickups shouldnt happen, but I much prefer this to the tests pointing to an actual problem at this point of the cycle ;)
<seb128> us
<bregma> previously it was one of the tests that ran a fake D-Bus service, and the service failed to start for some reason (not logged)
<Trevinho> seb128: lp lost something?
<seb128> Trevinho, the build has been restarted, which wiped the log, let's see
<bregma> Trevinho, yes, it lost the diff for the MP, beidl had to cancel it and submit a new MP
<Trevinho> oh, ok
<bregma> â_â
<Sweetshark> Laney: hmm, even the log says "dsc0t-junit-subsequentcheck PASS" at the end, so putting that in the https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQsLL60iOaDgX0D1th2iRRsIHBYgs-WUEgVR-ChlEae4ftxU8sweA bucket for now ...
<Malsasa> Hello. My HUD on Ubuntu 12.04 doesn't work anymore. When I tap ALT, Unity opens menu of focused app, not the HUD. Any idea for me? My complete quesion was here http://askubuntu.com/questions/447587/alt-key-for-hud-doesnt-work. Thank you.
<Laney> Sweetshark: are you looking at the same thing as me? https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Trusty/view/AutoPkgTest/job/trusty-adt-libreoffice/336/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/consoleFull
<beidl> when I noticed launchpad not scanning my branch for 24 hours, I was all like "zomg, I accidentally the whole thing"
<bregma> beidl, I just assumed my browser was broken
<bregma> because why should it be any different?
<Sweetshark> Laney: hmmm, no. Did I end up in a 'last successful artifacts' thing or somesuch. Indeed that doesnt look good -- seems like "something" deleted/modified/whatever the copy of the source in /tmp, while the tests where running on it ...
<Sweetshark> Laney: there is one very weird line 512 in the syslog ...
<beidl> bregma, I had connection issues with my ISP that day, might be an incomplete push that caused that error
<Laney> Sweetshark: mmm, that's in the passing one too
<Laney> seb128: looks like it worked that time, but they are going to slip the other fix in to this upload
<seb128> Laney, great
<Sweetshark> Laney: when Im finished with this bug, I will run that in a local VM to see whats going on.
<Laney> re-siloing appreciated
<bregma> seb128, I'm going to add another (approved) MP to the Unity silo, if you don't mind, now that ppc64el has successfully built
<Laney> just said that ;-)
<beidl> Trevinho, the remaining nasty bug that I could think of is the launcher not reappearing if a edge-hit causes the launcher to hide.
<seb128> bregma, sure, the silo is all yours ;-)
<bregma> party on
<seb128> bregma, I just started it to have an head start
<mvo_> seb128: it was gnome-settings-daemon and gnome-control-center, correct?
<mvo_> seb128: that should be autoremoved if possible?
<seb128> mvo_, yes
<mvo_> thanks
<Trevinho> beidl: yeah, that's indeed a bug we should check... you say the one on dnd, right?
<beidl> Trevinho: exactly
<Trevinho> seb128: but... is it just me or since last few updates the indicator-sound is not showing up?
<Trevinho> seb128: and loading it with indicator-tool brings me an empty indicator
<seb128> Trevinho, just you
<Trevinho> larsu: ^ any idea how debug that?
<seb128> Trevinho, what theme do you use?
<Trevinho> seb128: ambiance
<seb128> Trevinho, what do you have in .cache/upstart/indicator-sound-service.log and unity-panel-service.log?
<Trevinho> seb128: ok checking... fyi the service runs btw
<seb128> can you open the menu?
<Trevinho> seb128: on indicator-sound.log (process:22071): GLib-CRITICAL **: g_variant_get_uint32: assertion 'g_variant_is_of_type (value, G_VARIANT_TYPE_UINT32)' faile
<Trevinho> seb128: nope
<seb128> like if you click on another indicator and do left/right?
<seb128> Trevinho, if you do system-settings -> sound, is the "show" checkbox at the bottom checkeD?
<Trevinho> seb128: ops... :D
<seb128> ;-)
<Trevinho> seb128: how did it gets clicked :P
<Trevinho> seb128: maybe just a wrong action I hope
<seb128> Trevinho, the option is age old but we had a bug that it was not respected in 13.10
<Trevinho> seb128: ah... ok. sorry for bothering
<seb128> so maybe you had it from while back and it started working again when we fixed the bug
<Trevinho> and thanks...
<Trevinho> mh, might be
<seb128> Trevinho, no worry, with all the pinging I did in your direction recently you can ping me for a while before we are even ;-)
<Trevinho> seb128: oh, no worries... I will take few days :D
<seb128> hehe
<Trevinho> mlankhorst:
<Trevinho> hey
<Trevinho> just for information... is there any plan for the future of 14.04 to support DRI3 drivers?
<larsu> Trevinho: your issue seems resolved now?
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, sorry for the ping :/ i've been just too worried, and it was my fault :(
<seb128> larsu, ^
<Trevinho> seb128: that was for a free ping_count-- for you :D (sorry!)
<seb128> haha
<seb128> ;-)
<larsu> Trevinho: no worries
<larsu> seb128: thanks :)
<seb128> yw!
<beidl> Trevinho, had to leave my laptop, but a wild guess: maybe the hide animation has to be reversed as soon as DnD is stopped
<Trevinho> beidl: mh, it might be the case... I need to look further on it
<seb128> qengho, new chromium from your stage ppa seems fine to me
<qengho> seb128: thank you.
<seb128> yw!
<ali1234> tedg: now that we implemented upstart indicators in xfce, we need a way to blacklist them
<ali1234> specifically appmenu, since it doesn't work, and if the backend is started it steals all your menus whether the indicator is visible or not
<ali1234> also -session since it also doesn't work
<tedg> ali1234, Well appmenu isn't a service, you can just avoid loading the .so
<ali1234> apparently you can't
<seb128> Trevinho, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/172796846/buildlog_ubuntu-trusty-ppc64el.unity_7.2.0%2B14.04.20140414.1-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
 * tedg is really sure about this :-)
<seb128> Trevinho, the pp64el issue
<ali1234> if it is installed, it steals the menus, regardless of whether you actually want it loaded or not
<seb128> bregma, that one ^ needs a retry as well
<qengho> seb128: I don't know what then next step is.  infinit-y seemed to say "sounds like a good idea". Should I do something else?
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah that's the same that shown up also last time...
<seb128> qengho, get it uploaded
<Trevinho> seb128: and really I've not much clue what might be other than a timing issue
<Trevinho> seb128: mhr3 fixed these tests some time ago
<ali1234> tedg: so what steps must we take to "avoid" loading the .so?
<tedg> ali1234, So that's not an upstart thing, that's in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/80appmenu
<tedg> ali1234, You need an attente
 * mhr3 hides
<qengho> seb128: yeah, but by whom?
<tedg> ali1234, I'm guessing that script needs to be smarter, it's only checking to see if the file exists. Which is clearly not enough.
<qengho> I made noise in #ubuntu-release already.
<ali1234> it used to be that it wouldn't do anything if UBUNTU_MENUPROXY was not set
<seb128> qengho, your usual sponsors? I can do it if you want
<ali1234> well, i'm fairly sure we don't set that in xfce...
<tedg> ali1234, It's set by lightdm using that script. All the scripts in that directory run before the user session.
<ali1234> if it's not a service, how does it get the menus?
<qengho> seb128: yes, please. I think CCC is busy with other stuff.
<tedg> ali1234, All GTK programs load a GTK module, that hides and exports the menus.
<ali1234> exports them where?
<tedg> ali1234, On the other side of things the .so implemented everything needed to recieve the menus. It's a little different from the others in that the process loading it does a lot more.
<ali1234> via what mechanism is the menu transfered from the application to the thing that runs in the panel?
<tedg> dbus
<ali1234> so there is a service that listens on dbus then?
<tedg> Yes, who ever loads the .so
<ali1234> so in other words it is a service...
<tedg> Yes, but no one of the indicator services
<tedg> not
<ali1234> so it's more like the mpris stuff? where each app exports it's own menus, and then the indicator goes and finds them all?
<mhr3> seb128, Trevinho, weird: (test-gtest-service:19151): GLib-GIO-WARNING **: Error releasing name com.canonical.Unity.Scope.testscope1.T29883340183229126: Timeout was reached
<qengho> seb128: Also, if you want me to not have to bother you for this, you may endorse my PPU application in the next 30 hours.  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ChadMiller/DeveloperApplication
<mhr3> seb128, dbus blew up?
<seb128> mhr3, that could be, not sure
<seb128> qengho, noted down
<seb128> qengho, the version to sponsor is from your ppa?
<Trevinho> mhr3: fyi the tests just seems to be unstable... sometime the go, some others don't
<seb128> qengho, 34.0.1847.116-0ubuntu1~pkg1006  is the correct version? you keep the ~pkg for archive uploads?
<ali1234> tedg: the problem here is that by making everything work off an environment variable set by lightdm, you are asking lightdm to predict the future
<mhr3> Trevinho, everywhere? or a particular arch?
<qengho> seb128: yes. It takes hours to rebuild.  I like uploading exactly what people have tested.
<ali1234> there is no way it can know if the user is going to load indicator-appmenu or not
<seb128> qengho, k
<tedg> ali1234, Are you underestimating the abilities of LightDM? ;-)
<tedg> ali1234, I think that the script should probably just set the variable based on which desktop is being loaded.
<ali1234> tedg: it doesn't have permission to access the settings file
<ali1234> so even if it was able to parse xfce settings, it still would not work
<tedg> Sure but you could force it into the upstart environment table if it was enabled.
<tedg> Heck, we should just do thatâ¦
<ali1234> yeah, or we could add more crap to accounts service...
<tedg> Then it could use dconf
<ali1234> a larger problem is we allow the user to toggle on/off indicators at run time
<seb128> qengho, hum, do you usually ppa source copy?
<tedg> Yeah, and the Upstart job could just set the variable based on a setting.
<tedg> It would run on desktop-start, but could be run anytime as needed.
<seb128> Laney, there? to upload chromium from https://launchpad.net/~canonical-chromium-builds/+archive/stage/+packages to trusty do you think we can just ppa source copy it?
<Trevinho> mhr3: only on ppc64el
<tedg> Would be nice to get another thing out of Xsession
<ali1234> sounds more sensible
<tedg> We need it to die sooner rather than later.
<Laney> seb128: is that what they normally do?
<seb128> Laney, no idea
<seb128> chrisccoulson, there? how do you sponsor chromium uploads usually?
<ali1234> at the moment appmenu doesn't even work in xfce - it crashes both the app and the desktop
<Laney> Looks like it
<ali1234> so it doesn't really matter how it gets fixed
<mhr3> Trevinho, then i'll say that dbus on ppc64 is broken :)
<ali1234> (in the short term)
<ali1234> some people are trying to make it work though
<mhr3> Trevinho, or something dbus related, but clearly not my code ;P
<Laney> not clearly
<Laney> you should try to reproduce on the porter machine first
<seb128> Laney, "copy-package --ppa=canonical-chromium-builds --ppa-name=stage -s trusty --to-primary --to-suite trusty-proposed chromium-browser" ?
<Laney> seb128: include binaries
<seb128> Laney, k
<qengho> seb128: I see uploads pretty quickly. It has to be something like that.
<seb128> qengho, it's chrisccoulson who usually sponsor those right?
<qengho> seb128: yes.
<seb128> k
<seb128> he doesn't seem to be around
<seb128> let's try that ppa copy then
<Laney> I looked at https://launchpad.net/~canonical-chromium-builds/+archive/stage/+build/5815872 which is a copy from the ppa with binaries
<seb128> k, it makes sense if the ppa is configured for security updates
<qengho> seb128: et merci beaucoup.
<seb128> qengho, de rien ! ;-)
<ali1234> tedg: i'm looking on a saucy machine and there is no 80appmenu
<tedg> ali1234, Correct, it changed with teh change from appmenu-gtk to unity-gtk-module
<ali1234> i also don't see the string "MENUPROXY" anywhere in /etc
<ali1234> i just installed it on trusty and that file still doesn't exist
<seb128> bregma, Trevinho: the unity in the silo looks fine to me (just from basic user testing), I'm calling it a day in a bit but feel free to publish/nag #ubuntu-release when you feel it's ready
<Trevinho> seb128: thanks
<seb128> yw!
<ali1234> so which package does /etc/X11/Xsession.d/80appmenu belong to?
<ali1234> unity-gtk-module isn't a package
<ali1234> unity-gtk(2|3)-module neither contain 80appmenu
<tedg> Wait, I had it backwards :-/
<ali1234> appmenu-gtk also isn't a package
<tedg> That's an appmenu-gtk thing, it is just left over on this machine.
 * tedg hates on /etc for a moment
<ali1234> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/874943 <- lol
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 874943 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Appmenu stays visible behind gnome-shell panel" [Undecided,New]
<ali1234> same bug, except 2.5 years old
<tedg> ali1234, So yes, we already moved it to an Upstart job, unity-gtk-module
<ali1234> so how do we kick it out of xubuntu then?
<tedg> ali1234, That job should be smarter
<dobey> appmenu-gtk - Export GTK menus over DBus
<dobey> appmenu-gtk3 - Export GTK menus over DBus
<dobey> ali1234: ^^ those look like packages to me
<ali1234> !info apmenu-gtk trusty
<ubot2> 'trusty' is not a valid distribution:
<tedg> dobey, Those are probably left over if you've upgraded
<ali1234> whoops, well, they don't exist here in my package manager
<ali1234> bbiab
<tedg> ali1234, So I'd say check something in the pre-start of that job, what exactly is something you'll need to talk with attente about.
<dobey> oh
<dobey> ugh, something causing extremely slow rendering issues in current trusty :(
<dobey> or maybe i just need a reboot
<tedg> Yup, seems to be after about an hour for me.
<ali1234> i still don;t get it. that job doesn't do anything unless UBUNTU_MENUPROXY is already set
<ali1234> why is this even in unity-gtk-module anyway?
<sarnold> when scrolling the list of online accounts in the unity control center, more than one provider is selected at once; any guesses where I should file the bug? unity? gtk? unity-control-center?
<sarnold> (I suspect it is only a visual glitch)
<beidl> Trevinho: found the issue and fixed it. where to push? :)
<Trevinho> beidl: cool! :) new branch please
<beidl> Trevinho: based on trunk?
<Trevinho> beidl: yes, or your previous branch is fine anyway... as it will be trunk soon
<beidl> perfect
<Trevinho> beidl: or just set it as a prerequisite on the merge-proposal
<Trevinho> beidl: so it won't show the diff of that
<beidl> Trevinho: if the launcher hides, and I drag the icon away *without* dropping it, should the launcher reappear? currently the launcher reappears only after a new drag start.
<Trevinho> beidl: yes, the launcher should hide only if you try to pass over it.. (in multi-monitor you want to move on the other screen for example)
<xclaesse> I'm writing a gtk app, basically a GtkStack and GtkListBox, the background is all black with ubuntu theme
<xclaesse> is there known ubuntu gtk theme issues?
<beidl> Trevinho: is there an event that gets emitted whenever the mouse is moved? all dnd related events except resets won't get called as soon as the launcher is hidden
<Trevinho> beidl: mh, right... In theory the dnd collection window might get that, but it's also hidden as soon as it gets something
<Trevinho> beidl: so... mhmh, a possibility might make that to show up again in that case
<Trevinho> beidl: calling collect on it should be enough
<beidl> Trevinho: what needs to happen is reversing the animation and setting the DND_PUSHED_OFF quirk to false. currently that only happens when dnd is either complete or aborted
<beidl> Trevinho: but if the launcher should reappear as soon as mouse.x >= geometry.width
<beidl> Trevinho: I'd need to find out where to do that. I assume RenderArgs isn't going to get called if the launcher is hidden, right?
<Trevinho> beidl: it depeneds, it might... it gets called each redraw... so since the basewindow is always there it happens also if not shown
<Trevinho> beidl: that's why I added that change that you reverted... As I didn't want to spend cycles when not needed, it should be done more carefully
<beidl> Trevinho: yeah, those stupid corner cases :)
<Trevinho> beidl: indeed... unfortunately there are so many that is quite easy to hit one :o
<beidl> Trevinho: I'd basically have the UnityScreen inform the launcher about every single mouse movement. I'm not sure if that's worth it.
<Trevinho> beidl: mh, it's probably better to avoid that
<beidl> Trevinho: should I keep it the way it is now? only make the launcher reappear on DND ending?
<Trevinho> beidl: ok, that's enough for now... if there aren't cleaner solution it's already an improvement :)
<ali1234> tedg, attente: i opened bug 1307657 re appmenus.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1307657 in unity-gtk-module (Ubuntu) "UBUNTU_MENUPROXY should not be set in Xfce" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1307657
 * tedg commented
<ali1234> thanks
<beidl> Trevinho: do you think there's still enough time to fix bug 1163041 ? :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1163041 in unity (Ubuntu) "Inconsistent behaviour with minimized Trash windows" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1163041
<Trevinho> beidl: I hope so
<Trevinho> beidl: it's on my list
<Trevinho> beidl: we can make as sru, as the pieces area ll there, we only have to fix unity
<beidl> Trevinho: how would you go about fixing it? actually make a trash/device window "fly" into its corresponding launcher window on minimize?
<beidl> launcher icon*
<Trevinho> beidl: I'm about to go now, but I can explain this with some more details tomorrow (or later) if you want
<beidl> Trevinho: great! :)
<beidl> Trevinho: my quassel is always-on anyways :D
<Trevinho> beidl: btw basically we should make nautilus a case of Application that has sub-windows, and these might be detached from the main app if are "special"
<beidl> Trevinho: ok, makes sense
<Trevinho> beidl: this is an old diff I did to begin on that... but just to give the idea http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/7251294/
<beidl> Trevinho: looking into it
<Trevinho> beidl: see if you can get what I meant.. Need to go now
<beidl> Trevinho: alright, have a nice day!
<Trevinho> beidl: thanks ;)
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-04-15
<mlankhorst> morning
<mlankhorst> Trevinho: probably in the backport stack?
<mlankhorst> the kernel that trusty uses by default doesn't support dri3 render nodes yet
<Laney> hey hey hey
<mvo> hey seb128 and Laney!
<mvo> and good morning jodh
<jodh> mvo: morning!
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<seb128> hey mvo, Laney, jodh, how are you?
<didrocks> good morning Laney, mvo, seb128!
<seb128> lut didrocks!
<jodh> seb128: Ã§a va bien merci. Et toi?
<seb128> jodh, Ã§a va bien Ã©galement, merci ;-)
<mvo> hey didrocks
<Laney> very good!
<seb128> great ;-)
<seb128> did anybody else got amazon added to their launcher for them with recent updates?
<Laney> might have done actually
<Laney> I think there was a session migration script for webapps
<seb128> not nice webapps!
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> run that script and it gets added
<seb128> bah
<Laney> /usr/share/session-migration/scripts/install-default-webapps-in-launcher.py
<seb128> when did that get added?
<Laney> april 03 apparently
<Laney> or that's when I got it
<seb128> I wonder why it just happened this morning for me
<seb128> I've been updating/restarting daily
<Laney> it gets re-run if the file is updated i think
<Laney> that could have happened
<seb128> I don't have that file though
<seb128> so not likely due to it
<dpm> morning desktop folks. I've noticed that on my desktop the time and date settings dialog now appears untranslated. Anyone else having this issue?
<seb128> dpm, hey, no, wfm
<seb128> dpm, are the other settings pages showing translated for you?
<dpm> seb128, yes all the others appear translated
<seb128> dpm, when did the issue start?
<dpm> and the time & date thing has been translated for ages, just noticed over the weekend that it's back to English
<dpm> I don't know when it started, I just noticed it last Saturday
<seb128> dpm, https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/trusty/+source/unity-control-center/+pots/unity-control-center/ca/+translate?start=0&batch=10&show=untranslated&field.alternative_language=&field.alternative_language-empty-marker=1&old_show=all suggests your translations are incomplete
<seb128> dpm, looks like appareance is also mostly untranslated
<dpm> yeah, appearance is known
<dpm> but are the time & date settings now there?
<dpm> wtf Launchpad
<seb128> dpm, those were in different domain until january when we introduced unity-control-center
<seb128> dpm, we merged those panels in u-c-c
<seb128> where they were external sources with g-c-c
<dpm> ah, I missed that, bummer, that won't make it to the final langpack
<dpm> seb128, anyway, thanks for the help figuring out!
<seb128> dpm, yw
<seb128> dpm, I even sent https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-translators/2014-February/006410.html
<dpm> seb128, that's fine, my mistake
<seb128> dpm, but yeah, not easy to keep track of those issues, and we use enough english that we barely notice english strings in normal course of action
<seb128> that happens to me as well :/
<Laney> alex_abreu: hey, can you think of a way to have the webapps migration script not add amazon again if the user already removed it before?
<mvo> Laney: changelogs.u.c is updating again
<mvo> Laney: and the underlying issue is hopefully fixed as well (no default socket timeout in the extractor)
<Laney> mvo: nice
<Laney> was it hung?
<mvo> Laney: yeah, I couldn't do a strace, but lsof showed a open https connection to lp so I strongly assume that the connection got stale and it never recovered from that
<Laney> nod
<Laney> thanks for fixing!
<mvo> no problem, thanks for letting me know about the problem in the first place
<Laney> It was because apt was spewing those 'changelog not found' messages to me
<mvo> :) I wonder if its worthwhile to add a nagios check or something - I will do that when it hangs the next time (I hope there is no next time and the fix is good)
<Laney> Just snapped the lid off my kettle
 * Laney fails
 * Laney becomes tea deprived
<mlankhorst> mmm tea
<Laney> post me some
<seb128> Laney, backup plan: water in a pot on the stove
<Laney> nah you can kind of wedge the lid back on
<Laney> pretty dodgy but it works well enough
<Laney> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Morphy-Richards-43827-Accents-Traditional/dp/B007Y51OLI/ref=sr_1_4?s=kitchen-appliances&ie=UTF8&qid=1397554371&sr=1-4 ordered that beauty to replace it
<seb128> doh
<seb128> that's an expensive kettle!
<Laney> gotta pay the price for style :P
<seb128> ;-)
<knome> a real tea addict would just put the extra money on more tea
<mvo> Laney: i got one similar to http://www.amazon.co.uk/Russell-Hobbs-18365-Glass-Kettle/dp/B007NHJFMC/ref=sr_1_2?s=kitchen&ie=UTF8&qid=1397556049&sr=1-2&keywords=kettle+temperature+hobbs - for the green tea that needs exact tempertures :)
<Laney> mvo: hahaha
 * mvo goes and gets some lunch (with tea)
<Laney> I saw one with a programmable display and decided that would be too much
<mvo> hehe
<Laney> but black tea is all I have, and that's fine at 100Â°
<seb128> tea addicts...
<seb128> mvo, don't listen to Laney, he's the sort of person that put milk in their tea
<Laney> mmmmmm
 * seb128 wonders how much of an offense that is for mvo ;-)
<dpm> seb128, shall I remove gnome-control-center-2.0 from the list of translatable templates? -> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/trusty/+source/gnome-control-center/+pots/gnome-control-center-2.0/ca/+translate?show=untranslated
<seb128> dpm, I don't think so, it's still using by Ubuntu GNOME
<seb128> dpm, what would be the consequences?
<dpm> seb128, it would not be included in langpacks. So if it's still used by Ubuntu GNOME, I'll leave it there. Another option (if it hasn't got any Ubuntu-specific strings) would be to demote it to universe, don't strip out the translations and just ship the upstream ones in the package, without langpack
<seb128> dpm, it still has quite some Ubuntu patches, let's keep them in the langpacks for the LTS
<seb128> we can sort it out better next cycle
<dpm> ok
<mvo> seb128: ;) I like milk in a black tea, but for green tea its like putting coca-cola into red-wine
<mhr3> mvo, you're just old, cola with red-wine is perfectly normal :P
<larsu> mvo: I've actually seen someone drink coke/wine recently. (not kidding)
<Laney> me too
<Laney> grim
 * larsu hates milk in any tea
<larsu> destroys all the taste for me
<mvo> *cough*
<mvo> *COUGH*
 * mvo drops dead in shock
<mhr3> mvo, according to wikipedia it has become an icon of basque culture :)
<mvo> lol, seriously?
<mhr3> so stop offending basks!
 * mvo hides
 * mhr3 probably didn't spell that right
 * Sweetshark hates his life right now ...
<amigamagic> I'm on xubuntu 14.04. Until now (2-3 days) I had no update notifications. I noticed that there is this bug still open and maybe it affects the 14.04 release too: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-notifier/+bug/1246364
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1246364 in update-notifier (Ubuntu) "update-notifier does not show a tray icon in xubuntu 13.10" [Low,Confirmed]
<pitti> didrocks: https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone/msg07656.html â *hug*
 * didrocks hugs pitti back
<amigamagic> a "sudo apt-get upgrade" shows me that there are upgrades I could do, but I have no graphical notification of this
<amigamagic> is it normal?
<om26er> bug 1308002 anyone else saw that ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1308002 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "Screen quickly autolocks again after unlocking " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1308002
<Laney> om26er: it's unity, what version of that do you have?
<om26er> Laney, 7.2.0+14.04.20140411-0ubuntu1
<om26er> there seems to be a pending update but the changelog didn't suggest if that fixed this bug. I am updating
<om26er> also bug 1308005 as well.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1308005 in unity (Ubuntu) "[regression] no way to close tall windows as they appear below top panel" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1308005
<amigamagic> om26er, I tried to reproduce that bug but to me lightdm works well
<Laney> have you restarted your session recently?
<Laney> double locking was supposed to be fixed with 0410-0ubuntu1
<om26er> Laney, I always restart, I have a friend with the same issue as well.
<om26er> amigamagic, Laney let me try a few times to see if I can give you guys the exact steps to reproduce this bug
<Laney> reassign it to unity please
<amigamagic> Laney, do you know something of the bug 1246364 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1246364 in update-notifier (Ubuntu) "update-notifier does not show a tray icon in xubuntu 13.10" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1246364
<Laney> no
<amigamagic> I'm on 14.04 and I don't see update notifications anywhere, but I see other notifications, like when the lan is unplugged and similar
<amigamagic> the xubuntu dev guys suggested me to ask here
<Laney> amigamagic: I guess it's because auto-launch went away, you might want to talk to bdmurray as he made that change back then
<Laney> Actually, it looks like Noskcaj had some input so talk to him first
<seb128> larsu, it's not nice to troll didrocks like that!
<didrocks> HUM?
<didrocks> oh
<didrocks> didn't see it
<didrocks> bad larsu
<seb128> <larsu> mvo: I've actually seen someone drink coke/wine recently. (not kidding)
<amigamagic> Laney, thanks
<didrocks> it wasn't really drinking
<didrocks> it was tasting
<didrocks> on desrt arguing I should try it
<seb128> didrocks, though he was not at the same table so he might not be speaking about the same night ;-)
<didrocks> but then, I let that to attente :p
<didrocks> can be another night with desrt trolling French :p
<larsu> :P
<mvo> seb128: LOL
<didrocks> mvo: and yeahâ¦ it's worse than the worst thing you can even imagine
<attente> lol
<didrocks> ever*
<mvo> evar!!!
<didrocks> I expect it to be bad
<larsu> didrocks: you did drink it to taste it ;)
<mvo> (except for green tea with milk maybe)
<didrocks> but really not *that* bad
<seb128> mvo, I've a photo to prove it, it happened in London at the team dinner, I can show you in Malta if you want ;-)
<didrocks> rohâ¦ that photo, again!
<seb128> mvo, good that you are back, you missed on things while you were not there ;-)
<mvo> hahahahaa
<mvo> totally!
<seb128> hehe
<didrocks> mvo: just to sum up: never trust desrt
<larsu> what is this technology where you have to be in the same physical location as someone else to show them a photo?
<didrocks> 1. he's making your code segfault is the schema isn't compiled for gsettings
<didrocks> 2. he's making you trying coke + wine
<mvo> didrocks: so he tricked you into it?
<larsu> canadian bastard
<didrocks> mvo: well, for him, it's really something that is drinkable
<didrocks> at least, attente drink the whole glass
<mvo> larsu: old style tech I guess :P
<didrocks> (it was for him first)
<larsu> ya :)
<seb128> larsu, technology is not the issue, but I post it on the internet the NSA is going to see it!
<seb128> I wouldn't do that to didrocks
<larsu> didrocks: you should have sat at our table. No crazy experiments there
<didrocks> yeah, I don't want that photo to be public :p
<larsu> seb128: they already saw it.
<didrocks> larsu: a sane table!
<mvo> didrocks: I think seb128 already printed t-shirts with the photo
<didrocks> tsssss
<seb128> mvo, susssh, you are spoiling the surprise for the next event
<didrocks> the photo is like the drink
<didrocks> it's worse than what you can ever think about it :)
<mvo> :P
<seb128> lol
<seb128> didrocks, well at least people can't troll you about enjoying the drink ;-)
<didrocks> indeed :p
<didrocks> I clearly showed I hate it
<didrocks> maybe a little bit too muchâ¦ :p
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> didrocks: in fairness, attente didn't like the wine.  after the coke, he did.
 * desrt did the appropriate thing to the situation
<didrocks> desrt: if that makes your soul feel better to believe it! :)
<desrt> so i woke up to this, this morning http://imgur.com/a/5RGHr
<didrocks> waow
<larsu> morning desrt
<larsu> you should move to a warmer country
<desrt> morning :)
<didrocks> I have sun glasses and nearly dying of the hot temperature on my balconneeâ¦
<Laney> is a bustle log useful for "application results are never returned from the dash?"
<Laney> "?
<seb128> Laney, check with mhr3 but probably
<Laney> cheers
<Laney> I'll file it and it can be closed if that's not helpful
<alex_abreu> Laney, yes :)
<Laney> O RLY?
 * Laney tries to remember how he phrased the question
<Laney> oh good, in that way :)
<attente> hi, i installed xubuntu-desktop, is there a way to get back lightdm and unity-greeter (and plymouth?) back to running as default?
<cking> xnox, is the installer issue on the NVME still work-in-progress?
<seb128> xclaesse, hey, I guess you didn't have any slot to look at https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=662672 ... do you have any debugging hint/start point to suggest if we want to try to help debugging?
<ubot2> Gnome bug 662672 in Chat "wrong count of unread messages and text missing" [Normal,New]
<larsu> mpt: re https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-sound/+bug/1080076/comments/5
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1080076 in The Sound Menu "Music titles in SoundMenu too small" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<larsu> mpt: what do you mean by "caption font size"? The same size as other menu items?
<larsu> that's what it seems to be for me right now
<xnox> cking: i need to talk to you about it so. So NVME 1.0 spec & devices do not export EIU-64, and UEFI 2.4a adds support to address NVME 1.1 devices using EIU-64 addressing.
<xnox> cking: there is no upstream support for that yet, and i've started on a kernel patch to update headers to export 1.1 EIU-64 devices.
<xnox> cking: i have a few userspace utils that we can check if we can find any devices that are 1.1 compatible already.
<xnox> cking: that should sort out the efibootmgr, once we figure out (and it's an sru candidate as per hwe policies)
<cking> ok, I can check the kit here if you give me instructions
<xnox> cking: the bit that ubiquity picks the wrong drive to install bootloader on, is probably not going to be fixed for 14.04.0
<xnox> cking: but we've had a few known bugs about that.
<cking> ok, but we do have a workaround on that, e.g. manually tweaking the bootloader options at install time, so it's not so bad
<davmor2> tseliot: Hey dude I open additional drivers, I see Nouveau selected.  I pick any of the Nvidia options and I get the orange bar of the application installing but once it finishes the install it is still on Nouveau I can't switch it.  This is on an encrypted LVM install
<xnox> cking: right, also efibootmgr -g should force GPT addressing, and that doesn't seem to do it.
<cking> xnox, ok, well, it sounds like you have a handle on the issues in hand, I won't distract you
<xnox> cking: i'm also a bit busy with release atm.
<xnox> cking: i'll come back to you about it later.
<cking> indeed
<cking> ack
<tseliot> davmor2: what does this command say? "ubuntu-drivers debug"
<xnox> cking: imho efibootmanager should support pure(long) ACPI addressing of the devices (regardless as to what it is, e.g. devices not yet defined by the spec at all) but i was failing to work it out using edk2 firmware in qemu.
<davmor2> tseliot: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/7255290
<cking> xnox, well, it would be reasonable I guess for the long devices addresses to be supported, but hey, that's life I guess
<tseliot> davmor2: apparently the driver was not installed. Maybe apt failed?
<xnox> cking: there is no indication anybody else has that on linux. For best results (e.g. both 1.0 and 1.1) i'd recommend to have boot partition on a "normal" drive, e.g. small ssd or spinny hdd.
<davmor2> tseliot: let me try it from the cli and see what happens
<tseliot> ok
<xnox> cking: the server cd should install fine now, btw. Can you test it?
<cking> xnox, i'll go do that right away
<xnox> cking: if you haven't already, that is. Please.
<xnox> cking: ack, thanks.
<cking> xnox, today's daily iso will do?
<xnox> cking: that's the one! =)
<xnox> cking: Release Candidate and all that.
<davmor2> tseliot: okay so it installs fine via the cli,  I then installed the updates version from the Additional drivers page and that went without a hitch, so I'm going to do another install now and see if I can install them then from additional drivers.  If I can't I can only assume that it might be an issue install some of the libxxxx32's maybe.
<tseliot> davmor2: does it work if you uninstall the driver (with sudo apt-get --purge remove) and then call "ubuntu-drivers autoinstall"?
<mhr3> Laney, bustle logs are always good :)
<seb128> attente, you can probably uninstall the xubuntu settings binary
<Laney> mhr3: ok, hope the bug is useful for you then
<seb128> mhr3, especially when they prove you have bugs in your code ;-)
<Laney> I've been sitting in silence because I was too lazy to launch spotify another way :)
 * mvo is away for some minutes
<davmor2> tseliot: I need to test a new install anyway I'm running through the iso testing, I don't want to get hooked up on one  install for a day debugging ;)
<mhr3> seb128, how dare you?! :P
<tseliot> davmor2: even better then
<seb128> mhr3, I know you!
 * Laney lunch
<mhr3> seb128, but iirc there's already a bug opened for it
<mhr3> maybe even opened by me
<seb128> Laney, mpt: removing the screen slider from the indicator-power seems like a poor move, having a way to adjust your screen easily is really handy
<seb128> mhr3, how come you didn't fix it yet? ;-)
<mhr3> seb128, eehm, <excuse/> :)
<seb128> lol
<tkamppeter> qengho, tabs of Chromium are working now, Chromium menu and options in print dialog not.
<qengho> tkamppeter: How's the menu for mouse click first, or second?
<qengho> tkamppeter: touch support is new and has at least 3 bugs I'm working on.
<Laney> seb128: I expected to see one of the ones in u-s-s removed
<qengho> tkamppeter: bug workaround: Don't use that newfangled touchscreen. :)
<tkamppeter> qengho, if I open the menu by clicking with the mouse I can continue operating the menu via touch screen, but not completely, I can only open sub menus and clcik on entries but entries never get executed. Clicking entries with the mouse executes the entries.
<qengho> tkamppeter: I can reproduce. Thank you.
<tkamppeter> qengho, when opening the menu by tapping on the touch screen, it is completely dead for touch, operation only possible by mouse or keyboard.
<seb128> Laney, that would make more sense to me, waiting for mpt to comment back still
<tkamppeter> jasoncwarner, hi
<davmor2> tseliot: working fine now on the new install so maybe it was just an issue with the network I'll keep an eye on it though
<tseliot> davmor2: ok, thanks
<ChickenCutlass> please help -- latest chromium is broken
<pmcgowan> qengho, having trouble with chromium, no plugins anymore, cant do hangouts
<qengho> pmcgowan: do you have the latest talk plugin? It changed from NPAPI (which is dying) to PPAPI about 2 months ago.
<pmcgowan> qengho, I just downloaded per google redirect, installed and still nothing
<pmcgowan> it was working yesterday
<pmcgowan> I had the latest plugin already, but tried reinstalling
<ChickenCutlass> qengho, me too -- every plugin is broken
<pmcgowan> well they are gone acc to tools
<rsalveti> pmcgowan: had that issue before
<pmcgowan> rsalveti, please share how you fixed it
<mpt> larsu, menu items by default use the label size, i.e. the same size as a checkbox label or a text field label
<rsalveti> pmcgowan: but it worked after I killed every chromium process I had running
<pmcgowan> rsalveti,right, as they run background, let me try that
<rsalveti> pmcgowan: ubuntu keeps a few for webapps and such
<rsalveti> pmcgowan: it seems it only really upgrades itself once started from scratch
<qengho> seb128, infinity: Losing the chromium API that is going away in a few weeks is surprising a lot of people. Is it a good idea to give people the extra time to fix plugins? I don't want to break things *after* release either, but maybe it will be fewer broken things in a month. I can kill features in Cr and re-gain NPAPI temporarily.
<qengho> I can prepare a band-aid chromium-browser and have it built in 6 hours.
<pmcgowan> rsalveti, I swear I rebooted though, trying now
<rsalveti> pmcgowan: hm, reboot in theory should have fixed it
<seb128> qengho, that might be a better topic for #ubuntu-release, I don't know enough about the subject to tell what's right, but it seems late to land a new chromium for release (especially since it's on some flavor images)
<mdeslaur> qengho: this is an upstream change?
<mdeslaur> qengho: we probably shouldn't deviate from upstream
<qengho> mdeslaur: it's compile-time config.
<mdeslaur> qengho: what's the default in the same version of chrome?
<pmcgowan> rsalveti, ChickenCutlass reboot fixed it
<pmcgowan> must need 2 ;)
<ChickenCutlass> pmcgowan, ok, I will try
<rsalveti> pmcgowan: I don't reboot :P
<qengho> mdeslaur: Chrome ships with a flash player and talk plugin already installed, which we can't do.
<mpt> larsu, by âthe caption sizeâ I mean the size thatâs used, for example, in System Settings > âSecurity & Privacyâ > âDiagnosticsâ below the checkboxes
<mpt> seb128, (a) if automatic brightness adjustment was implemented youâd need to change it much less often, and (b) it might reappear in an indicator redesign
<seb128> mpt, k, I'm unsure about (a), I hate that option/disable it/tweak manually on android, but maybe that's me (or it's the android stack not working good enough to give the results I want)
<mdeslaur> qengho: oooh, right
<seb128> mpt, it's a bit of a shame that we drop the option before having the automatic mode though, it seems backward
<Laney> We do have that now
<Laney> don't we?
<Laney> mterry hooked the key up in unity
<seb128> mpt, it's what we get most user flacks from "drop the option, because some futur design is going to resolve the problem, but let them without solution in between"
<seb128> Laney, I don't think the backend is doing the adjustments, or at least not in smart ways
<Laney> It does do something
<Laney> Don't know what algorithm it's using though
<seb128> like not respecting curves adjusted around your manually selected value
<Laney> but it does respond to light level changes in some way
<seb128> I think it's just adjusting according to the sensor value
<seb128> in a dumb way
<seb128> well, anyway, as said I don't believe in auto adjust
<mpt> Whoâs assigned to it?
<seb128> what is right on a screen depends on your eyes
<seb128> different people have different preferences/sensibility to light
<Laney> Actually it does something smart
<Laney> maybe not the full design yet but it's not as dumb as you make out
<Laney> (from looking at the code)
<seb128> k, could be
<seb128> well, bottom line is that I don't believe in that option working for everyone
<seb128> as said it doesn't work for me on android
<Laney> That's fair enough
<Laney> The change is there to be accepted or not :-)
<seb128> the default values hurt my eyes at night
<seb128> I keep changing it manually
<seb128> I would be in favor of having the option easily available in the indicator
<seb128> mpt, is that something you could be convinced about?
<mpt> seb128, I am already convinced of it. I do not think, though (and neither does Shruti), that it belongs in the battery menu in particular.
<seb128> mpt, well, until we have a better place/replacement we could keep it therE?
<Laney> ok I got stuck in the update panel again
<seb128> :/
<seb128> is there any stdout/err output?
<pmcgowan> qengho, so is the current downloadable google talk plugin using ppapi ?
<qengho> pmcgowan: yes.
<mpt> seb128, this is not an #ubuntu-desktop topic ;-) But Iâll discuss it with Shruti again
<seb128> mpt, thanks
<seb128> mpt, what would be the right place to discuss the topic?
<pmcgowan> qengho, thats good then we can also download it for Oxide
<pmcgowan> once PPAPI works there
<chrisccoulson> pmcgowan, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~oxide-developers/oxide/oxide.trunk/revision/506 ;)
<mpt> seb128, #ubuntu-design or #ubuntu-touch
<pmcgowan> chrisccoulson, aha speaking of which
<chrisccoulson> although, i tried it with oSoMoN earlier, and it crashed
<pmcgowan> progress though
<chrisccoulson> but, it's getting there
<chrisccoulson> yeah
<seb128> mpt, ok, noted
<seb128> mpt, we tend to not be strict about channels we use, maybe we should try to make more efforts, sorry about that
<seb128> oh, it's meeting time!
<Sweetshark> o/
<seb128> qengho, Sweetshark, mlankhorst, Laney, tkamppeter, desrt, attente, larsu, kenvandine, hey
<desrt> mmmmmmmmeeting
 * kenvandine waves
 * larsu made it \o/
<seb128> ok, let's see how everybody is feeling about the coming release and get started
<seb128> larsu, ;-)
<seb128> qengho, hey, ready to start?
<qengho> in-progress: fixing bugs that are raised by touch and high-dpi support or phasing out NPAPI.
<qengho> EOF.  I'm feeling really good about everything in general. Frustrated by chromium, though.
<qengho> It's a really nice release.
<seb128> qengho, is there any known performances issue on the new release? it feels quite slow for me
<seb128> like slow to start, lag in keyboard input on gmail, etc
<qengho> seb128: I don't know of anything specific. There are no benchmarks I've seen.
<seb128> k
<seb128> I'm going to keep an eye on it/check with a new profile in case
<seb128> good version otherwise I agree
<seb128> nice we got the update in for the release
<seb128> qengho, thanks
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey, your turn
<qengho> I mean the distro is great, not cr exactly.
<Sweetshark> - chasing bug 1296715 up the stack
<Sweetshark> -- no joy in the dbus-export code
<Sweetshark> -- no joy in the vcl Menu code (the toolkit we are piggybacking upon)
<Sweetshark> -- no joy in vcl SalMenu -- the internal menu abstraction
<Sweetshark> -- no joy in toolkits VCLXMenu -- the UNO wrapper around vcl
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1296715 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "Menu items are greyed out in Libreoffice menu." [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1296715
<Sweetshark> -- no joy in frameworks MenuBarWrapper/MenuBarFactory/MenuBarManager/ToolbarsMenuController and friends -- the (new) generic UI dispatch abstraction
<seb128> qengho, that as well ;-)
<Sweetshark> -- now at sfx2 SfxDispatchController -- the (old) generic UI dispatch abstraction
<Sweetshark> --- still suspecting something 'optimized' for invisible menubars there (which we are ambivalent about because we hide the original toolbar to show our own)
<Sweetshark> --- a huge pain to debug, an old menu is replaced by a new one, which is initially populated wrong, but updating correctly
<Sweetshark> --- friends dont let friends use callbacks
<Sweetshark> - application to renew my the Document Foundation membership ;)
<Sweetshark> - some board work
<Sweetshark> - libreoffice-4.2.3~rc3-0ubuntu2 for bug 1300283
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1300283 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "LibreOffice does not start in a KDE 4 session" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1300283
<Sweetshark> EOF
<Sweetshark> libreoffice in trusty: calc regression are under control, libreoffice-kde is still not as good as it should be. Otherwise Im not too worried.
<seb128> Sweetshark, those menu debugging seems like lot of "fun" :/
<Sweetshark> seb128: yes, leaky abstractions are way cool.
<seb128> Sweetshark, is there anything others can do to help you there? or does it look like a libreoffice issue that need to be sorted out on your side?
<Sweetshark> seb128: nope, its all inside LibreOffice.
<seb128> ok
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
<seb128> mlankhorst, hey, your turn
<Sweetshark> seb128: If anyone is volunteering to tear down two or three layers of abstraction in LO, Im not protesting though ...
<seb128> Sweetshark, you can always try, I doubt anyone is going to step up for that one though...
 * Sweetshark needs to make someone drunk on the next sprint.
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> mlankhorst, not there?
<seb128> Laney, your turn I guess then
<Laney> â¢ Make gnome-screensaver support replacement on the bus, to swap back and forth between it and Unity. Unity was trying to run `killall gnome-screensaver'(!!!)
<Laney> â¢ Fix default size of gnome-disks to not be off-screen
<Laney> â¢ Verify gdk-pixbuf SRU that could have caused segfaults in PâT upgrades
<Laney> â¢ Test/unblock webkitgtk final
<Laney> â¢ Many queue reviews and discussions, find & fix some bugs in the queued uploads
<Laney> â¢ Final freeze, extend generate-freeze-block to be able to output blocks for packages that a flavour seeds in common with other flavours, for touch shared components. This was instead of a blanket block. VELOCITY.
<Laney> â¢ Add symbols file to gsettings-qt (it currently has improper depends), need to propose this still
<Laney> â¢ Fix bamf matching with python3 scripts (l-s getting the wrong icon)
<Laney> â¢ Make indicator-power not show a slider per the new design
<Laney> â¢ Fix u-s-s tests - along the way make click updates in u-s-s work again. The tests found a bug, but they weren't being run.
<Laney> â (four day weekend this week!)
<seb128> (oh, right, 4 days w.e! ;-)
<seb128> Laney, thanks, nice list
<didrocks> (4 days w.e should be forbidden)
<seb128> Laney, from your release team side how is the release looking so far? anything worrying you?
<Laney> didrocks: are you sure that you're french?
<seb128> didrocks, you are still welcome to come visit and claim you are living in the good part of France and having friday off ;-)
<didrocks> Laney: yeah, but I don't have 4 days ;) seb128 is lying again this year and say he has that :p
<Laney> seb128: oh yeah, that reminds me
<Laney> I spent a few hours looking at a graphite2/harfbuzz memory corruption issue in the installer
<Laney> we released saucy with this problem already
<seb128> oh ok
<Laney> Not worried about anything in the sense of not being able to release though
<seb128> great
<Laney> but jibel always finds bugs that make me sad
<seb128> we can SRU all those issues that we didn't manage to fix for releae
<Laney> then some lockscreen issues to clean up
<seb128> to get a solid .1
<Laney> and little niggles
<Laney> and bigger ones like the IM stack
<Laney> = instant messaging not input methods
<Laney> but I think we have our top brains on that :P
<seb128> larsu \o/
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey, your turn
<tkamppeter> - CUPS: Packaged 1.7.2 which got released upstream on our Final Freeze day. This version contains lots of bug fixes, including a security fix and CUPS daemon crashers.
<tkamppeter> - foomatic-db: Another last-minute snapshot adding the Brother HL-2135.
<tkamppeter> - Last-minute touch screen tests before release, reporting all remaining problems on the Lenovo Thinkpad Twist, mainly with Chromium.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<desrt> hi seb128 !!
<seb128> t
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<seb128> desrt, hey, your turn ineed
<seb128> indeed
<desrt> last night was the first night of passover, so i participated (for the first time) in a traditional jewish seder
<desrt> i also changed all of my passwords
<desrt> aside from the usual bugfixing, i mostly spent last week with the new mimeapps.list spec
<desrt> argued over the finer points of details in the spec and implemented it in GIO (which is now reviewed and merged)
<seb128> nice
<desrt> i plan to spend the time before the gtk hackfest to finish off the backlog from the freedesktop summit (namely: dbus-based startup notification and desktop file index)
<seb128> I guess the new version is on freedesktop.org?
<desrt> after the hackfest i'll switch back to more gnomety stuff
<seb128> new version of the spec
<desrt> seb128: it is... but it has an outstanding patch still
<desrt> arguing over it on the list, of course :)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> when is the GTK hackfest?
<desrt> end of month
<desrt> by 'gnomey stuff' i mean gmainloop hacking...
<desrt> so really, gliby stuff :)
<seb128> k
<desrt> the new spec is pretty nice
<desrt> and the merge of it into glib was actually a net decrease in lines of code
 * desrt is pretty pumped about that
<seb128> that's always a win!
<seb128> do we need to change anything on our side/in other pieces of the stack?
<desrt> yes
<seb128> or is that just new niceties we can benefit from if we want?
<desrt> we should rename /usr/share/applications/defaults.list to mimeapps.list
<desrt> since the old name is now deprecated
<desrt> (it was never specified anywhere -- and it doesn't appear in the new spec, either)
<desrt> desktop-file-utils and ubuntukylin-default-settings install this
<seb128> right
<seb128> that's something for next cycle
<desrt> yup
<desrt> we can also rename it gnome-mimeapps.list, fwiw
<desrt> since this file was never understood by anything other than GIO
<seb128> k
<larsu> and then we can have a separate one for unity \o/
<desrt> (kde used some priority based scheme where desktop files say "i'm priority 10" and such.... but now we agree on the new mechanism)
<desrt> ya... unity-mimeapps, kde-mimeapps... go crazy :p
<larsu> we'll need the same for gsettings defaults of course ;)
<desrt> uh... 'todo' :)
<larsu> but we already discussed that
<desrt> and clarification: this is not based on the library doing the reading, or even the app, but on XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP
<desrt> so even if we have a gio-using app inside of a KDE desktop, it will use the kde defaults
<desrt> (or qt-using app inside of gnome or unity...)
<seb128> great
<desrt> nothing more to say :)
<seb128> desrt, thanks for the summary!
<seb128> attente, there? I'm unsure in what tz you are atm ;-)
<seb128> guess not
<seb128> larsu, your turn
<larsu> k
<larsu> * brought indicator-telepathy into shape (as good as possible): - fixed some minor issues that caused warnings / criticals - inform the messaging menu about empathy's initial status (lp #1103438) - remove sources when a connection dies (lp #1302930) - messaging menu didn't remove messages when an application unreffed its MessagingMenuApp instance
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1103438 in telepathy-indicator (Ubuntu) "Online Status in indicator does not reflect empathy's online status" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1103438
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1302930 in indicator-messages (Ubuntu) "Every message gets new list item on empathy indicator" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1302930
<larsu> * triaged all sound and messaging menu bugs. I think we're looking fairly good for the LTS.
<larsu> * reviewed desrt's mimetype gio patches
<larsu> woah. what happened to the formatting
<desrt> larsu: irssi happened
<larsu> I also started working on the empathy -1 unread bug
<larsu> not much progress
<larsu> desrt: used to work
<larsu> (every wekk)
<larsu> *week
<larsu> eof
<seb128> larsu, thanks
<seb128> larsu, let me know if you need help testing the indicator-messages fixes
<larsu> sure thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, your turn
<Laney> first ice cream van of the year!
<kenvandine> a couple minor fixes in system-settings
<kenvandine> doc fixes in content-hub
<desrt> Laney: we had that last week
 * Laney runs to mum "can I have an ice cream pleeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaassssssssssseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee"
<desrt> Laney: now we have snow :p
<seb128> Laney, haha
<Laney> oh crap
<Laney> go away van!
 * Laney sorry kenvandine :P
<kenvandine> spent some time helping a customer get started using content-hub
<kenvandine> Laney, no worries
<kenvandine> that's all i have
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<kenvandine> excited for the release :)
<seb128> same here
<seb128> ok, my turn
<seb128> â¢ desktop updates (glibmm, gtk3)
<seb128> â¢ refreshed packages that don't use langpacks with launchpad exports (language-selector, xdg-user-dirs)
<seb128> â¢ quite some testing of the new lockscreen after hitting issues, got debug infos, tested new versions/fixes ... seems to be in good shape now
<seb128> â¢ trusty bug fixes (unity-control-center, indicator-power/ubiquity, pidgin, language-selector)
<seb128> â¢ trusty bugs triage/listing candidates for SRUs
<seb128> â¢ organized train landing (indicators mostly)
<seb128> â¢ some sponsoring
<seb128> </week>
<seb128> I think that's all
<seb128> did I forgot anyone?
<seb128> is there any other comment/question?
<desrt> seb128: did you eat any meat today?
<brookswarner> seb128 - I'd like to introduce KombuchaKip from Sustaining Team
<seb128> we should be set up for release now, if anyone has fixes please line those up for SRUs
<seb128> desrt, yes, I had some beef for lunch!
<seb128> brookswarner, hey, sure!
<seb128> go ahead
<brookswarner> thanks Seb
<brookswarner> HI All.  I've hired a new desktop focused engineer for Sustaining engineering team
<desrt> (what is sustaining team?)
<brookswarner> he's in the channel as Kombuchakip2 (typically know as KombuchaKip)
<brookswarner> Sustaining is L3/bug fix from CDO team
<mlankhorst> seb128: oops I'm there :P
<desrt> brookswarner: can you expand once more? :)
<seb128> mlankhorst, wait your turn now please
<Laney> Is that people who fix bugs escalated by customers? :)
<brookswarner> sure - we do Ubuntu Advantage support for paying customers
<desrt> right
<brookswarner> so Kip's focus will be responding to desktop bugs that UA customers file
<brookswarner> and working with your team to help close them and improve desktop experience for all
<seb128> great
<seb128> KombuchaKip2, welcome on board!
<desrt> KombuchaKip2: hey.  welcome.
<Laney> all these warners :P
<brookswarner> answer your questions desrt?
<desrt> KombuchaKip2: feel free to ping me about any issues related to dconf/gsettings/glib type stuff... a lot of the sort of people who tend to get UA tend to have some interesting usecases there :)
<desrt> brookswarner: yup.   thanks.
<seb128> KombuchaKip2, this channel is usually quite active (mostly during european/USA working hours though), so feel free to join any time if you have questions or need anything
<brookswarner> LOL...yes we've tripled the "warner's" in canonical in the past quarter
<brookswarner> thanks Seb et all
<Sweetshark> KombuchaKip2: welcome!
<Laney> thanks brookswarner
<desrt> brookswarner: the new guy is pretty quiet, eh? :)
<seb128> brookswarner, thanks
<seb128> mlankhorst, ok, your turn since you seem to be back
<mlankhorst> debugging some vdpau corruption on nouveau, interacting with upstream of kernel, uploaded xorg-server 1.15.1 to fix some sna corruption and small bugs, deferred a mesa vdpau fix for the first mesa sru
<mlankhorst> ^D
<seb128> mlankhorst, thanks
<seb128> ok, any other topic?
<Sweetshark> KombuchaKip2: that 'remove three layers of abstraction in LibreOffice' from 40 minutes ago is still open for takers ;)
<seb128> haha
<desrt> seb128: make tomorrow a veggie day :)
<seb128> Sweetshark, way to not scare away the new comer :p
<Sweetshark> seb128: *hrhr*
<seb128> desrt, thanks, I'm going to think about it
<seb128> desrt, friday is also supposed to be one, it's good friday
<desrt> ah.  right.
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> short week -- everyone work 25% harder!!
<seb128> ok, seems like it's a wrap then
<seb128> thanks you everyone!
<seb128> desrt, yeah, don't say that too much, didrocks is going to complain again that they have to work in Lyon on good friday
<desrt> there's an event in lyon this week?
<seb128> no, but that day is only an holiday for the ex-German part of France
<seb128> ;-)
<Laney> it's called "go to work as normal"
<desrt> ahh.  interesting.
<desrt> i thought they scheduled a sprint week on the week with good friday :p
<seb128> no ;-)
<desrt> btw: if you've never done a seder before, you should
<desrt> what a trip
<desrt> by the end of the night you end up drunk and confused, and leaning slightly to the left
<desrt> but your hands are quite clean
 * seb128 is ready the wikipedia page, there are quite some steps listed in there
<seb128> ready->reading
<desrt> noteworthy points from the page: "There is an obligation to drink four cups of wine during the Seder"
<KombuchaKip2> Hey folks. Sorry about my connectivity issue. My client is being a pain in the butt and was temporarily blocked by freenode because it was being naughty.
<desrt> KombuchaKip2: welcome :)
<KombuchaKip2> desrt: =)
<Sweetshark> seb128: you know though that you will have to speak german with very hard consonants on good friday though for the day off, dont you?
<desrt> is good friday not being a holiday in france some kind of a nod toward secularism, or... ?
<seb128> Sweetshark, you wish!
<Sweetshark> seb128: jawohl, ich wish! ;)
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> desrt, it's a good question, I'm unsure about that
<seb128> some days google annoys me
<seb128> Laney, mvo: since I clicked on your amazon/kettle urls, this morning, I keep getting ads to buy one of those
<chrisccoulson> hi desktop!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
<Laney> seb128: haha
<Laney> "drink more tea"
<KombuchaKip2> desrt: Veggie day yea!
<mvo> tea++
<mvo> veggie day++
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, not too bad thanks
<chrisccoulson> mvo, steak day++
<chrisccoulson> :)
<mvo> hey chrisccoulson
<mvo> steak day-- ;)
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<mvo> good! thanks, how are you?
<mvo> different timezone right now?
<chrisccoulson> mvo, pretty good thanks. although, quite tired
 * Sweetshark is needs to take revenge on the bavarians someday for them having 4 more holidays than us hanseatic guys ...
<Sweetshark> (each year)
<desrt> bavarians!!
<desrt> those guys never have veggie days :(
<Sweetshark> desrt: yeah, and a "big beer" is honestly a big beer there ...
<pmcgowan> qengho, does flash work with the v34 chromium?
<Trevinho> attente: hey, I was looking at your proposal... But I was wonding: what about moving the whole thing inside a LockScreenAccelerators class, that is generated just once by LockScreenController and that the relevant LockScreenShield will pass the events to?
<beidl> Trevinho: hey! :) just read mail, I'll look into it in a few minutes
<Trevinho> beidl: hey, sorry I spammed the MR a bit :P
<beidl> Trevinho: no problem haha
<beidl> Trevinho: is that patch based on my dnd branch or trunk?
<Trevinho> beidl: on trunk
<beidl> Trevinho: I see, it made sense to me to do "resetting" stuff in one method, but fixing the problem in there is nice too :D
<Trevinho> beidl: yeah, of course... I've tested the patch I linked it seems to work to me, but let me know if I missed something
<Trevinho> beidl: anyway, just pick the one way you prefer more and use in your branch ;)
<beidl> Trevinho: thanks! :D
<beidl> Trevinho: alright, that patch certainly looks cleaner.
<beidl> Trevinho: I'll probably change something up so that, if the launcher was dragged out (by the 4 finger gesture), and DND hides the launcher, make the launcher reappear automatically after DND stopped
<kenvandine> woot... click updates in system-settings!  so nice to see that landed :)
<czajkowski> kenvandine: aloha:)
<kenvandine> hey czajkowski
<beidl> Trevinho: so I just noticed a problem where, if the edge is hit and the launcher is in the process of hiding, and you pull the pointer away very fast, the launcher stays there (half hidden) until dnd stops
<beidl> Trevinho: pushed, those 2 added lines shouldn't screw up anything (tm)
<Saviq> pmcgowan, bregma, here's the log for building qtbase https://launchpadlibrarian.net/172399928/buildlog_ubuntu-trusty-amd64.qtbase-opensource-src_5.2.1%2Bdfsg-1ubuntu14_UPLOADING.txt.gz
<Saviq> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/7257618/ excerpts - config options and config summary
<Saviq> Xi2 ................ yes
<pmcgowan> yes
<pmcgowan> that should be good
<Saviq> Xi ................. no
<Saviq> not sure we need both or one is good enough
<bregma> XI2 is all you need
<pmcgowan> I was reading this thread https://www.bountysource.com/issues/1354081-desktop-linux-version-lacks-touch-support
<pmcgowan> seems the build system lacked the proper configuration or something
<bregma> technically you need XI2.2 for proper MT support, XI2.1 doesn't have it
<bregma> we actually distropatched XI2.2 into XI2.1 for a couple of releases
<pmcgowan> bregma, so do we think Qt is doing the right thing?
<Saviq> bregma, what does `QT_XCB_DEBUG_XINPUT_DEVICES=anything qmlscene` say for you?
<Saviq> bregma, you could also try `QT_XCB_DEBUG_XINPUT=anything qmlscene foo.qml` and see if input actually goes through xinput or not
<Saviq> bregma, i.e. see https://codereview.qt-project.org/#change,74357
<Saviq> from olli_'s https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1307701/comments/4 comment...
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1307701 in unity (Ubuntu) "Unity does not get touch events when SDK apps running" [High,Confirmed]
<Saviq> it would sound to me like Qt apps grab all touches as soon as one is detected... which would be rather bad to do
<Saviq> OTOH that's ~what we're dealing with for touch apps, too, you either have to buffer events until you're sure it's not a three-finger event, or have a way to cancel the whole touchpoint, which requires support in the toolkit (which no one has)
<Saviq> two single-touch apps would expose this behaviour as well, as soon as you touched one, you couldn't interact with the other one
<Saviq> but that'd be really weird if Qt did that...
<bregma> well, the XI2.2 API has touch-reject
<bregma> I know we supported it in geis, although no one ever used it because it's a stupid API design
<bregma> touch-reject, I mean, geis is a beautiful API design :)
<bregma> the whole XI2.2 MT design hinged on everyone receiving events until either a touch was accepted or rejected
<Saviq> bregma, have a better design? before we implement a similar mechanism in Mir? ;)
 * bregma is having nightmarish flashbacks
<bregma> Saviq, there are two alternatives: the accept/reject model and the combinatoric model, they both have their drawbacks and problems
<Saviq> bregma, "combinatoric"?
<bregma> yeah, everyone ends up getting everything, you end up with a lot of memory and a lot processing, eventually we rejected that model
<bregma> but it eliminated all the roundtripping and required client feedback of the accept-reject model
<pmcgowan> bregma, so what did we patch in qt4 in the past for multi-touch support
<pmcgowan> Saviq, bregma I lost the train of thought on our current issue
<bregma> pmcgowan, I don;t believe we patched anything in qt4 in the past
<Saviq> pmcgowan, there isn't any atm, I asked bregma to see if the MT device he has shows up with QT_XCB_DEBUG_XINPUT_DEVICES=anything and QT_XCB_DEBUG_XINPUT=anything to see actual input
<bregma> I'm looking at the Qt5 code right now, trying to figure out how it's using the XI2 MT support without calling XIGrabTouchBegin()
<bregma> I can't test on my devices right now because the one I have left is busy generating some performance data for another bug
<Saviq> pmcgowan, but my suspicion would be that we do actually get input through that, but then it sounds like it'd grab all input once it accepts a touch point... which would be rather bad
<pmcgowan> bregma, ok, will leave you to it, internet thinks we patched qt back in the day
<bregma> we patched X11 back in the day, certainly
<bregma> ah, I see: Qt grabs all MT events from X11 indiscrimiately using XISelectEvents, instead of for a window using XIGrabTouchBegin() like a good citizen
<bregma> so, once it's focused, it will grab other window's touch events
<bregma> really, that sounds like a bug in XInput, I'll need to dig deeper
 * bregma has gotten way too rusty on all this stuff
<Saviq> bregma, this only shows how big multitouch use is under X...
<pmcgowan> s
<Trevinho> beidl: cool, checking that sortly, thanks
<Trevinho> shortly*
<beidl> Trevinho: stupid me, yeah, SetHidden is redundant
<Trevinho> beidl: no worries..
<beidl> Trevinho: it doesn't happen often that I get to hack on other peoples code. :)
<Trevinho> beidl: yeah, I understand, but it seems you're doing it pretty well
<Trevinho> beidl: and approved! :)
<beidl> Trevinho: \o/
<beidl> Trevinho: I've been a linux/foss guy for quite a while now and I figured, if I really want to do that as a living in the future, I might as well start early instead of only working on code as part of homework.
<bregma> beidl, you are welcome to keep on hacking on our code as long as you want
<beidl> *for a living
<beidl> bregma: yay!
<bregma> we'll let yuo know when you've gone to far and have to start paying :)
<bregma> j/k
<beidl> bregma: "[MP] Rename Unity to Beidl-DE"
<bregma> don't wake the lawyers
<beidl> I'll probably work on bigger stuff as soon as I've finished my finals, so there's nothing to worry about for the moment :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-04-16
<mlankhorst> Hello, world!\n
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<mlankhorst> hai
<Laney> yo
<mvo> hey seb128
<seb128> mvo, hey ;-) wie gehts?
<mvo> and good morning mlankhorst and Laney
<seb128> same!
<mvo> seb128: good, thanks. looking at upgrade bugs
<mvo> that is medium fun but important :)
 * mvo makes up for it by drinking huge amounts of tea
<mvo> (to add fun ot it I mean)
<Laney> never upload chromium
<Laney> to be more precise, don't subscribe to its bugs
<seb128> Laney, living the life of the maintainer of a popular (and buggy) application? ;-)
<Laney> a maintainer who has an overused "mark all as read" button :P
<seb128> lol
<mvo> haha - or a worn out "d" key
<Laney> I've got a script which subscribes me to bug mail for packages I upload
<Laney> which is fine most of the time, but not when I upload chromium just to change a recommends to a suggests
<mvo> *cough*
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<pitti> hey mvo
<pitti> morning Laney
<pitti> hey mlankhorst!
<mvo> hey pitti
<Laney> guten morgen pitti
<pitti> I should check this channel more often :)
<mvo> its good fun here
<Laney> was ist los?
<seb128> pitti, guten tag! wie gehts?
<mlankhorst> hai
<pitti> seb128: mediocre, caught a cold :(
<seb128> pitti, :-(
<seb128> pitti, get better! I hope it's over for the easter w.e
<pitti> but yesterday was fun, we went to the Munich theater to see the West Side Story (my wife's bday present)
<mvo> pitti: oh, get well!
<seb128> pitti, oh, nice
<pitti> I hadn't seen that before
<pitti> with an original NY theater cast
<seb128> didrocks, see, pitti seems to like croissants au chocolat, he +1ed my post!
<pitti> seb128: oui, je les aime !
<didrocks> yeah, I had to reflect reality and just answered!
<seb128> pitti, moi aussi, mais le pauvre Didier ne connaÃ®t pas les croissants au chocolat
<didrocks> it's clearly a German thing
<seb128> he says that they don't have those in Lyon
<pitti> comment est-ce c'est possible ?
<pitti> "que"
<didrocks> seb128: we have french cuisine in Lyon!
<didrocks> only things on THE list :)
<seb128> pitti, je ne sais pas non plus, dommage pour eux :/
<pitti> seb128: mais du gÃ¢teau de rhubarbe est encore mieux :)
<didrocks> rhubarbeâ¦ pas trÃ¨s fan ici
<seb128> gÃ¢teau ou tarte ?
<seb128> tarte Ã  la rhubarbe !
<pitti> seb128: ma femme a fait le tarte pour mon anniversaire, yummy
<seb128> pitti, une tarte Ã  quoi ? Ã  la rhubarbe ?
<seb128> c'est pas encore la saison, si ?
<pitti> oui
<pitti> seb128: non, nous pouvons acheter de la rhubarbe dans nos "market"
<pitti> seb128: de avril Ã  juin
<pitti> seb128: c'Ã©tait un printemps tÃ´t :)
<seb128> pitti, tu as raison ;-)
<didrocks> dbarth: I think alex_abreu, Laney and you talked about the migration script which readded the amazon entry in launcher if people have removed it. Is that fixed now?
<Laney> don't think so, but alex_abreu said he thought he knew what to do
<dbarth> what's the bug num. for that one?
<Laney> Don't know, I asked him on irc yesterday
<dbarth> hmm ok
<didrocks> Laney: dbarth: this needs to be fixed before we release trusty though
<didrocks> (and should go on -updates)
<dbarth> and the issue is that the amazon launcher comes back
<Laney> yup
 * didrocks can already imagine the bad PR with "Canonical forces amazon in the launcher where I removed it"
<didrocks> the solution is really easy
<dbarth> oh no, please ;)
<didrocks> just put back the script to the older name
<dbarth> right
<didrocks> so, people transitionned are already transitionned
<didrocks> for the new part of the script
<didrocks> brings a second script with a new name
<didrocks> but don't mix both in the same script
<dbarth> hmm, taking a look
<Laney> what changed?
<didrocks> so people on past LTS won't get it added
<didrocks> Laney: the name of the script
<didrocks> so never seen -> executed
<Laney> I mean in the script
<didrocks> Laney: I didn't check yet
<Laney> okay
<didrocks> was hoping to bring the topic and having people with more knowledge knowing :)
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/webapps-applications/2.4.17+14.04.20140411-0ubuntu1
<Laney> well, then we could take the opportunity to do my fix from yesterday
<seb128>   * Update session migration script to remove all the cruft
<seb128>     ~/.local/share/applications by supported webapps
<Laney> and avoid having that grimy dependency on libunity-core-whateveritis
<dbarth> yup
<dbarth> Laney: this one landed i think
<Laney> I know
<Laney> I suggested an IMO nicer fix to check that at runtime instead
<dbarth> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/webapps-applications/+bug/1308076
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1308076 in webapps-applications (Ubuntu) "/usr/share/session-migration/scripts/install-default-webapps-in-launcher-and-cleanup-local.py:5:g_settings_set_property:object_set_property:g_object_new_internal:g_object_new_valist:g_object_new" [High,Fix released]
<dbarth> ah i see
<seb128> Laney, can you handle that/make sure the fix land?
<Laney> can do
<dbarth> well, so you want to change robru's fix with another one?
<Laney> dunno
<dbarth> i don't mind, that's packaging black magic to me
<dbarth> as long as it covers more bases
<Laney> I like it more, but who knows
<Laney> he said he thought it was still technical debt, not sure I agree
<Laney> anyways we can do the first fix I guess
<dbarth> and so the first fix landed afaict
<Laney> unrenaming the script
<Laney> and doing the new part in a second one
<dbarth> yeah, marked as landed in citrain
<dbarth> ok
<dbarth> now on to the amazon one
<Laney> I wonder if I should rename the "new" script
<Laney> install-... isn't what it does now
<Laney> Will do, it shouldn't be bad to run it an extra time
<didrocks> dbarth: btw, not sure it was discussed, but this is now broken with the new webapps: http://developer.ubuntu.com/web/tutorial/
<didrocks> dbarth: if a website is setting a userscript on their site to show a webapps, from what I heard (didn't try myself), it won't be shown
<Laney> didrocks: a bad exit code means a script will be re-run the next time, yes ?
<Laney> but no error or anything like that
<didrocks> Laney: right
<Laney> ok
<didrocks>         g_printerr("Exited with an error\nstdout: %s\nstderr: %s\n", stdout, stderr);
<didrocks> in logs
<Laney> It's "the schema isn't installed, don't do anything but try again next time"
<Laney> == sys.exit(1)
<didrocks> sounds good :)
<Laney> cheers
<Laney> seb128: dbarth: https://code.launchpad.net/~laney/webapps-applications/dont-readd-launcher-icon/+merge/216057 please to review
<Laney> I just copied the old script back
<Laney> and removed that part of the new one
<dbarth> uh, faster
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> ?
<didrocks> (looks like from what you tell is the right strategy to me)
<seb128> Laney, didrocks, dbarth: looks fine to me as well
<Laney> I saw that you suggested this runtime check too
<Laney> on the original bug report
<Laney> ;-)
<dbarth> yup +1
<dbarth> adding a silo request
<Laney> ok well if you want to get it trained into the queue then there's a minor chance of it being accepted
<Laney> otherwise 0-day sru which is fine
<Sweetshark> *grumble* *grumble* fscking logscreen forces me to kill my debugging session and loose a trillion carefully planted breakpoints. A logscreen that lets me Alt-Tab though apps (which are not shown of course), but not unlock the screen is ... not helpful.
<Laney> Sweetshark: what unity version is running? can you reproduce it?
<dbarth> thanks Laney
<Laney> np
<Sweetshark> unity 7.2.0+14.04.20140404-0ubunt(here the terminal ran out of chars)
<Laney> Try upgrading ;-)
<Sweetshark> Laney: I have no welldefined reproduction scenario, but its not the first time this happened.
<Laney> Lots of issues like that were fixed in >> 0404
<Laney> man that chromium notifications indicator is ugly
<seb128> Laney, getting used to be the chromium maintainer? ;-)
<qengho> Laney: :(
 * Laney hugs qengho 
<Laney> qengho: Is the indicator an upstream thing or something you've done?
<Laney> Sorry for sounding mean :(
<qengho> Laney: It's not me. Don't feel bad for that.
<Laney> In that case I don't know what a Chromium notification is or why I need an indicator for it the whole time :-)
<qengho> Laney: Can you show me a screenshot?
<Laney> qengho: http://ubuntuone.com/0Ejd0uop0SwgC8HLiR7hUL
<Laney> (I'll miss being able to do that)
<seb128> Laney, how did you activate that?
<Laney> I have no idea
<Laney> not on purpose
<Laney> Maybe it was when I got a notification on Twitter (I'm using tweetdeck inside chromium)
<qengho> Laney: I have honestly never seen that. I have seen little pop-up windows in bottom-right corner, and I was going to agree they're ugly.
<Laney> Someone send me a tweet :-)
 * Laney posts something controversial
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> I guess seb128 already did on g+
<seb128> roh
 * Laney doesn't have seb128 there :-o
<didrocks> Laney: you are just missing some fake photos :p
<Laney> it's like the moon landing right
<seb128> didrocks, you are loosing on that post, we are 3 to say "yummy" and you are alone to say "fake"
<Laney> he just faked it up in a studio
<didrocks> seb128: hum, that's not what Julie is saying
<didrocks> Laney: exactly!
<seb128> didrocks, you both are counting for 1 :p
<didrocks> roh
<seb128> didrocks, I don't want to say anything but Julie just admitted on the same post that you eat cat food
<didrocks> seb128: I saw that, but it seems you don't understand irony :p
<didrocks> bad for you ;)
<seb128> tssss
<Laney> didrocks / seb128: want to check landing-004 doesn't re-add icons for you?
<seb128> didrocks, btw I saw Julie (the real one on TV, with a "e" in the name :p) cooking some of those pink stuff on TV yesterday
<seb128> Laney, on it
<didrocks> seb128: ahah ;)
<rickspencer3> seb128, what's the word on the street regarding trusty? everything looking good?
<seb128> rickspencer3, there were some rounds of bugfixes/respin since yesterday (mostly langpack install issues), but things look under control/good
<Laney> Still another go around for that problem
<Laney> OEM installs getting the wrong language settings
 * seb128 test Laney's migration script fix, session restart, brb
<Laney> Seems to be under control though
<rickspencer3> well, tomorrow is release day ...
<Laney> Yup, fix is uploaded
<rickspencer3> Laney, seb128 so sounds like one last respin for desktop today?
<Laney> AIUI, but I'm not in the room
<seb128> rickspencer3, hopefully one and we are good yes
<rickspencer3> nice
<Laney> other than that it's pretty good I think
<seb128> Laney, no icon added after a session restart
<Laney> cool
<Laney> thanks for checking
<Laney> new kettle!
<seb128> yw
 * Laney MPs a gsettings-qt symbols file
<Laney> dbarth: do you want to check 004?
<Laney> I'd like to publish it quickly so it has a chance of going in
<Laney> doing this now ;-)
<dbarth> Laney: sure
<dbarth> just doing now (removed amazon first)
<Laney> I think you might get it readded if you installed in the 5 days since the script was renamed
<Laney> but that's probably acceptable
<dbarth> just re-starting my session to make sure
<didrocks> Laney: yeah, it's the "risk" of running a development release :)
<didrocks> (seems acceptable if we only had those kind of issues :p)
<dbarth> Laney: ok, that's a land then
<dbarth> landing
<dbarth> well, anyway
<Laney> dbarth: thanks, already pressed the button ;-)
<Laney> cheers for checking
<dbarth> see that
<Laney> on that note, going to lunch
<dbarth> Laney: the icing on the cake is that i don't even have to ping the release team about the unapproved queue ;)
<Laney> will walk to the cafe in the sun, nice day for it :-)
<dbarth> Laney: yup, enjoy
<didrocks> Laney: don't take any croissant please!
<Sweetshark> Laney: FWIW libreoffice autopkgtest magically self healed: https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Trusty/view/AutoPkgTest/job/trusty-adt-libreoffice/
<Laney> Sweetshark: witchcraft?
<seb128> time for some exercice, bbiab
<Sweetshark> Laney: "any sufficiently advanced technology is indistingushable from magic"
<Sweetshark> Laney: teaches you something about how advanced LibreOffice is ;)
<alex_abreu> Laney, didrocks https://code.launchpad.net/~abreu-alexandre/webapps-applications/dont-forcefully-add-amazon-webapp/+merge/216100
<Laney> alex_abreu: thanks - we already uploaded something similar to that earlier to try and get it into the release
<Laney> check the trusty-proposed branch
<Laney> but in that one we restored the old script to add the launcher entry too
<alex_abreu> Laney, yeah sorry for the delay, was busy w/ other things
<Laney> you think that's not needed?
<alex_abreu> Laney, mmmh yeah yours is better actually
<Laney> ok
<alex_abreu> Laney, why do you remove libunity-core ?
<Laney> added a runtime check for it instead
<alex_abreu> Laney, the SettingsSchemaSource ?
<Laney> y
<Laney> a
<alex_abreu> ok +1
<Laney> avoids having that fugly dependency
<Laney> :)
<alex_abreu> agree
<Laney> wowzers, my PC's locked up hard
<Laney> all I did was try the G+ webapp
<Laney> twice now
<Laney> someone else want to try this?
<Laney> using nouveau if that helps
<Laney> mlankhorst: maybe you
<Laney> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7261615 http://paste.ubuntu.com/7261622
<mlankhorst> card's dead
<mlankhorst> oh looks like fun corruption
<mlankhorst> and a newer card than I have :P
<Laney> card specific?
<mlankhorst> no idea
<Laney> launch the G+ webapp and use it a bit
<Laney> eventually (< 1 min) it locks my system up
<mlankhorst> looks like the real fun is in 'Unknown handle 0x0000001f' which means that the kernel disagrees with userspace about whether some buffers are valid or not
<mlankhorst> Laney: can I run it from the command line?
<Laney> Exec=unity-webapps-runner -n 'R29vZ2xlUGx1cw==' -d 'plus.google.com' --store-session-cookies %u
<Laney> that's what the desktop file runs
<mlankhorst> no crash yet
<Laney> I never managed to get signed in
<Laney> time to expense a new card!
<mlankhorst> just as i finished typing it..
<mlankhorst> :/
<Laney> you got it?
<xclaesse> what's the facebookmessenger app that keep coming back into my launchers
<mlankhorst> Laney: yeah after i hit enter on 'no crash yet'
<Laney> well, that's promising
<Laney> as in, if anyone in the team can fix it :P
<mlankhorst> no! It's downright terrible..
<qengho> xclaesse: Hrm.   $ grep face ~/.config/autostart/*
<xclaesse> qengho, nothing
<qengho> xclaesse: How often does it "keep coming back"?
<xclaesse> that app seems completely useless, it just dispaly the same facebook than I have in firefox already
<xclaesse> qengho, literraly every time I'm not looking
<qengho> Oh, a web-app maybe?
<xclaesse> ah ok, each time I reload facebook tab in firefox
<xclaesse> that facebook icon appear in the launchers
<Laney> uh, yeah, that happens here too
<Laney> also for other webapps
<Laney> alex_abreu: do you know about this?
<mlankhorst> Laney: bleh I suspect something that valgrind will turn up anyway
 * qengho thinks hard about Valgrind on GPUs.
<alex_abreu> Laney, mmmh no
<mlankhorst> qengho: no it's a handle issue, some handle is annotated by userspace but the handle is invalid :P
<Laney> alex_abreu: ok, I'll file it, which package is the firefox webapps integration?
<alex_abreu> Laney, unity-firefox-extension
<Laney> ty
<seb128> Laney, xclaesse, alex_abreu: I guess that's how I got the amazon icon back on my launcher the other day btw
<seb128> Laney, since I didn't have webapps-applications-common installed
<Laney> maybe
<Laney> I can't trigger it with amazon but could be
<seb128> Laney, I had it after visiting your kettle stuff I think
<Laney> try again?
<seb128> yeah, I couldn't reproduce
<Laney> I guess you can do with facebook or g+ though
<seb128> but I can't reproduce on fb either
<Laney> huh
<seb128> no
<seb128> it seems to depends of the url
<seb128> or how you access the site
<seb128> not sure
<Laney> I just go to facebook.com in firefox
<Laney> not logged in if that makes a difference
<seb128> yeah, can't reproduce...
<Laney> oh well
<seb128> that made amazon listed first in my dash as most recently used though
<seb128> (trying on amazon)
<mlankhorst> Laney: yeah freed memory use in egl_gallium, probably the cause of this bug :P
<Laney> that's usually inadvisable
<mlankhorst> can't look further, no debug symbols yet
<mlankhorst> ok tomorrow :P
<Laney> bug #1308625
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1308625 in unity-firefox-extension (Ubuntu) "Visiting a website with a webapp re-adds the launcher icon every time" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1308625
<Laney> I don't remember what, if anything, I picked when it asks you if you want to 'install' the site
<Laney> or how to get that choice back
<seb128> Laney, I can confirm your issue btw
<Laney> which one?
<seb128> Laney, I had the webapp integration disable, I did that ages ago, I didn't remember it
<seb128> Laney, fb adding itself to the launcher
<Laney> ah
<Laney> you mean you had the extension off?
<seb128> yes
<Laney> nod
 * Laney adds that to the bug
<Laney> everyone must disable it or we'd certainly have heard about this by now, you'd think
<Laney> ...
<Laney> or keep the icon there I guess
<seb128> or don't use fb :p
<Laney> yeah it is pretty niche
<seb128> our devel release userbase is for sure not the same set than the ones who are going to run the stable version
<Laney> I don't use it on that machine or I'd have noticed sooner
<seb128> hum, visiting g+ adds googledocs to the launcher
<seb128> dbarth, alex_abreu, are you looking at those issue?
<seb128> that seems like a potential release blocker to me
<dbarth> seb128: same as amazon, or is that a new one?
<dbarth> seb128: hmm no, ok ,taking a look
<seb128> dbarth, https://launchpad.net/bugs/1308625
<seb128> dbarth, it's happening with facebook, g+ at least
<ubot2> seb128: Error: Could not gather data from Launchpad for bug #1308625 (https://launchpad.net/bugs/1308625). The error has been logged
<Laney> good old LP going down
<dbarth> yeah,seems so
<dbarth> release time, not a good time for being launchpad
<seb128> dbarth, well, basically is "enable webapp integration in firefox, visit facebook -> get an icon for fb in the launcher"
<dbarth> right
<seb128> dbarth, if you unpin it, the icon comes back every time you visit the site
<Laney> remove facebook first if it's already there
<dbarth> ok, checking in a guest session; any particular rev. of the firefox ext?
<seb128> same on g+ (it doesn't even add the right site there, you get a gdrive launcher)
<seb128> dbarth, trusty
<seb128> current trusty versions
<Laney> I get the G+ one
<seb128> could be random on google sites?
<Laney> shrug
<seb128> oh, I don't have unity-webapps-googleplus in fact
<Laney> I'll let these guys debug it now :)
<seb128> yeah
<Laney> xclaesse: thanks for reporting
<seb128> dbarth, alex_abreu: let us know what you figure out
<seb128> xclaesse, thanks!
<seb128> shrug, does the same on launchpad
<seb128> do we enable that integration by default?
 * seb128 boots test box
<Laney> I don't see it there either
<Laney> wonder why
<Laney> I probably said 'never' ages ago
<seb128> Laney, we don't install any of the unity-webapps-* by default in trusty
<Laney> yeah I checked I have these ones installed though
<seb128> that's likely why nobody ran into the issue
<seb128> same here
<seb128> so either we tried that
<seb128> or they were installed in older releases
<Laney> I had it installed as far back as my apt/dpkg logs go
<Laney> 2013-05-16
<Laney> could have done it manually though
<Laney> or that's what the install prompt does/did
<alex_abreu> Laney, seb128 ok a fix is on the way
<Laney> this guy is fast
<alex_abreu> Laney, seb128 https://code.launchpad.net/~abreu-alexandre/unity-firefox-extension/fix-launcher-pin-on-reload/+merge/216148
<Laney> ty, building that
<Laney> alex_abreu: yep, no new icon, thanks
<seb128> dbarth, can you organize a landing for that fix?
<alex_abreu> Laney, ok great, ...
<Laney> should get it reviewed
<Laney> it's not obvious why it's right to me
<seb128> yeah, to me neither
<seb128> we should also check that they still get added on first use/when they should
<seb128> rsalveti, hum, committing to trunks/uploading of projects without asking for review or even pinging on IRC now? :-(
<rsalveti> seb128: packaging changes, and just adding |
<rsalveti> for the x86 emulator
<rsalveti> not changing anything else
<seb128> yeah, packaging changes can be buggy
<rsalveti> that was the direction I took with the landing team for that sort of changes
<rsalveti> seb128: right, I'm a core-dev
<rsalveti> I could just upload it by hand as well
<seb128> and asking is also explaining to others what you commit to their trunk and why :p
<seb128> rsalveti, the fact that you can do it doesn't make it right though
<rsalveti> I just did the sync so the trunk is also in sync with the archive
<seb128> rsalveti, yeah, my problem is not with the way the landing is done
<rsalveti> right, but it doesn't mean I need to ping someone before doing it
<seb128> is about committing changes to project you don't usually contribute to without even bothering give a notice/ping on IRC
<alex_abreu> seb128, Laney I did test that & other use cases
<rsalveti> well, I didn't change the code, and check the review, it's minimal
<rsalveti> landing for this is a huge pita
<rsalveti> for a minor packaging change
<seb128> rsalveti, let's agree to disagree, it feels wrong in principle to me but maybe that's just me being old school
<rsalveti> well, the old school way would be me uploading it directly
<rsalveti> and not pushing to trunk
<seb128> rsalveti, yeah, as said my issue is not with the way it landed, it's about doing changes on packages actively maintained by somebody else without asking/let a fyi first
<rsalveti> but then someone from the landing team would need to do that later on
<Laney> alex_abreu: I mean I can't tell what that realInit call is for and if it was ever useful
<Laney> but maybe nobody else exists who knows this code anyway
<rsalveti> seb128: asking for changes when minimal?
<rsalveti> this is not debian
<seb128> rsalveti, I soviet Debian you would get list flamed for uploading a package without talking to the maintainer :p
<seb128> I->in*
<rsalveti> right, but that's why I'm not doing that there
<rsalveti> :-)
<seb128> haha, fair enough
<rsalveti> seb128: but I'll ping you next time if you prefer that, np with that
<seb128> rsalveti, well as said, no big deal, it's maybe me but I try to ping/let a quick fyi before uploading a package if it's usually actively maintained by somebody/a team in Ubuntu
<alex_abreu> Laney, yeah, I asked for a review, ... the thing is that it is a left over from the past. The extension was much simplified & now only takes care of very little
<seb128> rsalveti, thanks
<seb128> rsalveti, like if you had asked "ok if I upload a small control fix for the emulator" I would have said "yes, no problem, go for it" and we would have spared that discussion ;-)
<seb128> anyway moving on
<seb128> rsalveti, thanks for the fix btw ;-)
<rsalveti> seb128: np, I thought it was fine because I had that discussion with the landing team before doing such changes
<rsalveti> so I had their 'ack'
<rsalveti> but anyway, pinging you next time :-)
<seb128> rsalveti, it's not their project :p
<rsalveti> fair enough
<rsalveti> :-)
<seb128> but yeah, enough discussion about a minor detail
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<seb128> rsalveti, btw another approach is to email ubuntu-devel@ saying "I"m going to go through the package that have that depends to add an alternative, let me know if you are in this case and have an issue with an upload"
<rsalveti> sure
<seb128> rsalveti, that way you don't have to ping individual projects and you let everyone know waht's going on
<seb128> </discussion>
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> bregma, Trevinho, ChrisTownsend: is anyone looking at why compiz is making update-manager not resizable? that's a regression from this cycle and quite annoying, if you try to see the details of an upgrade you have like 1 line of content and can't change the height to see more
<Trevinho> seb128: I will
<Trevinho> seb128: it's resizable btw... but the hints gets updated with some delay
<seb128> Trevinho, you should share some of the bug with your team ;-)
<Trevinho> seb128: playing with the window size gets the power back
<Trevinho> seb128: hehe, of course, just that I know where to put the hands
<seb128> Trevinho, not it's not resizable for me, I don't have the cursor changing on borders
<seb128> no*
<bregma> Trevinho, same thing happens with the apport dialog, btw, I used to be able to resize it now it's fixed size and I can't see most stack dumps... maybe those windows have something in common>?
<Trevinho> bregma: might be... as I ignored one event that I thought it was duplicated, while it might not be the case
 * Laney is off
<Laney> seb128: do you think we need to insert some stuff in the release notes?
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TrustyTahr/ReleaseNotes#Desktop looks bare
<seb128> Laney, we should
<seb128> bregma, can you get an unity7 section in ^
<Laney> that's for known issues
 * bregma looks
<Laney> there's an 'updated packages' section for good stuff
<Laney> known issues could be e.g. the grab lockscreen bug
<Laney> probably others too, need to think
<Laney> will be back later / tomorrow morning to work on that a bit
<Laney> but now I have to go: https://twitter.com/DepotNottingham/status/456410825117671424/photo/1
<Laney> :-)
<seb128> Laney, I guess that be filed tomorrow morning still?
<seb128> Laney, happy climbing ;-)
<Laney> sorry?
<seb128> that can be*
<seb128> Laney, the release notes
<Laney> I think we'll have the morning to work on it
<seb128> ok
<seb128> so good
<seb128> let's do that then
<Laney> but you could verify with ubuntu-release
<Laney> i'm not doing that stuff
<seb128> right, but I think I'm going to call it a day soon as well
<Laney> nod
<seb128> let's see, I might be back later in front of the TV to write some stuff
<seb128> otherwise it's going to be for tomorrow
<Laney> we have our .nz overnight guy who might have time ;-)
<seb128> oh, that's right!
<seb128> I'm going to drop an email to robert_ancell
<Laney> our man in the land of the upside down
<Laney> ok, back later
<Laney> bye!
<seb128> have fun, ttyl!
<qengho> robru, did you have any trouble with smuxi and the notifications menu?
<robru> qengho, notifications *menu* seems fine for me, the problem I'm having is that I can't get it to make an audible beep on notifications. And yet it makes the beep in gnome-shell, so it seems more like a unity issue...
<qengho> robru: say my name. I'll get a screenshot.
<robru> qengho, ok
<qengho> robru: Hrm, again?
<robru> qengho, qengho, qengho !
<qengho> robru: thanks.  http://i.imgur.com/RM2nQ45.png
<robru> qengho, nope, never saw that
<qengho> robru: do you use many workspaces?
<robru> qengho, nope, just the one (but two screens though)
<qengho> robru: I just discovered I get no notification menu update if smuxi is focused, even if it's in a different channel than focused one.
<qengho> I don't know if focus/visibility is different.
<robru> qengho, right, if the window is focused then smuxi assumes you're paying attention and doesn't do any notification
<robru> qengho, actually what's annoying me about smuxi now is the when I wake up each morning and it tells me I have x pings in a given channel, but then I have to scrollllll so far through the scrollback to find them. I might give quassel another try because it has that special notification area that just shows all your pings at once...
<qengho> What's the best way to bisect this menu problem? Before we added DBus security, I'd have just snooped it.  Is that still easiest?
<robru> qengho, I don't know much about dbus personally ;-)
<qengho> robru: lucky.
<seb128> qengho, what's the issue?
<qengho> seb128, I want to find the problem with my IRC notifications.   http://i.imgur.com/RM2nQ45.png
<qengho> seb128: I suspect the client is doing something wrong.
<seb128> qengho, that seems like an indicator-messages issue, larsu can probably help you if you ping him during european work hours
<seb128> or client issue, but larsu knows the api/can help you debugging
<qengho> seb128: thx.
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, jasoncwarner, hey is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-screensaver/+bug/1308572 on your radar at all?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1308572 in gnome-screensaver (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu 14.04: security problem in the lock screen" [Undecided,New]
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, I hadn't seen it but bregma should be looking at that (it's all in unity now)
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, ok, thanks
<jasoncwarner> Trevinho: can you take a look at the bug rickspencer3 mentioned above?
<Trevinho> jasoncwarner, rickspencer3: ok... I'm moving the bug to unity btw
<Laney> beat you :)
<Trevinho> Laney: oh :)
<bschaefer> Trevinho, just bumped the prio...
<jasoncwarner> Thanks Trevinho IMO this should be top of our list right now. Thanks!
<bschaefer> hopefully didn't step on anyones toes
<bschaefer> Trevinho, i can take a look as well
<Trevinho> jasoncwarner: I can't reproduce btw...
<bschaefer> Trevinho, i can
<Trevinho> bschaefer: ok, cool
<bschaefer> Trevinho, just type an incorrect password
<bschaefer> Trevinho, and just hold enter down
<Trevinho> bschaefer: yeah, but it goes well here
 * bschaefer assumes it the TextEntry being popped off the queue
<rickspencer3> just hold down enter
<rickspencer3> you don't even need to put a password in
<bschaefer> yeah just did that as well
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: yes, I'm trying but I can't :)
<Trevinho> lucky me :P
<bschaefer> Trevinho, did you accidentally fix it :)?
<bschaefer> Trevinho, what unity branch are you running? Im a bit behind trunk
<bschaefer> i think
<Trevinho> bschaefer: mh, I think no... I'm on trunk + hacks now...
<rickspencer3> to repro I just cntrl-l and hold down the shift key until it crashes
<rickspencer3> then I am into Unity
<bschaefer> Trevinho, yeah i've a crash dealing with a lockscreen tooltip...hopefully thats not where im crashing
<rickspencer3> I guess we need to fix either the crasher or make it so that unity doesn't comeback when it crashes
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, well you can always restart unity in a tty...
<bschaefer> to get around the lock screen (idk if thats been fixed)
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: well, it should come up locked if it crashes in such state
<rickspencer3> bschaefer, do you not need a password for the 'puter to log in to do taht?
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, right, but the first step is to get it into a shippable state
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, yeah, so its not as critical
<bschaefer> Trevinho, was that bit fixed? When you restart unity, if in lockscreen, to show the lockscreen still?
<Trevinho> bschaefer: sorry? We don't have that yet
<bschaefer> Trevinho, shoots
<bschaefer> Trevinho, thats half the fix for this bug
 * bschaefer will focus on the crash it self
<Trevinho> bschaefer: it would be trivial to achieve though... Just touching/removing a cache file when entering/exiting the lockscreen so that when loading unity we check if locking or not
<bschaefer> Trevinho, we can do that for now
<bschaefer> or possibly the way to do it :)
<bschaefer> so anytime we setup unity and the lockscreen controller, check if that file exists, if so, then lock the screen
<Trevinho> exactly
<bschaefer> Trevinho, that should be a really quick way around the current security issue (though crashes are bad bad BAD!!!)
<Trevinho> bschaefer: I can do it, if you move on the crash
<bschaefer> Trevinho, sounds good
<rickspencer3> bschaefer, right, the crash should be fixed, but it seems like that method is necessary anyway
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, yeah, ... hopefully we can get that landed asap to fix the release...
<rickspencer3> groovy
<rickspencer3> bschaefer, Trevinho will it help if I ask for status every 5 minutes
<rickspencer3> ?
<rickspencer3> j/k
<bschaefer> haha
<bschaefer> it motivates Trevinho
<Laney> you need to juju deploy a status pinger to all the manager nodes
<bschaefer> Trevinho, ill set up a new bug for you :)
<rsalveti> crap, just tried to reproduce and now unity is gone
<rsalveti> but at least it returned locked
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: eheh :)
<bschaefer> Trevinho, actually ill turn that current bug into the main problem you're looking at and ill make a new bug for the crash
<Trevinho> bschaefer: ok, if you've the bt to attach is better to go with a new
<bschaefer> Trevinho, i dont, gdb doesn't like my laptop due to schemas :(
<bschaefer> ill give it a go though
<bschaefer> Trevinho, if you cant reproduce the crash, you can always restart unity from a tty to test that fix :)
<Trevinho> bschaefer: indeed
<bschaefer> Trevinho, also try unpluging your extra monitor :)
<Trevinho> bschaefer: or, also from main view
<bschaefer> Trevinho, couldn't get the crash with a second monitor, with 1 i can
<bschaefer> Trevinho, or that ;)
<Trevinho> bschaefer: ah so maybe it's why I can't reproduce it, I'm two monitors
<bschaefer> Trevinho, yeah
<bschaefer> Trevinho, you always do :)
<bschaefer> Trevinho, but cool, got the stack trace
<bschaefer> Trevinho, interesting: http://paste.ubuntu.com/7263684/
<bschaefer> looks like an issue with future (some message hanging aroud) and calling a glib signal
<jasoncwarner> Hey robert_ancell could you help test the fix that Trevinho is working on when he's done?
<Trevinho> bschaefer: I'd avoid the problem from the root btw, by avoiding to emit too many signals when enter is pressed, and if we didn't get anything back yet
<Trevinho> bschaefer: basically unless we don't have a reply, we should avoid to send anything
<bschaefer> Trevinho, cool, andyrock said he'll take a look
<bschaefer> Trevinho, yeah
<bschaefer> Trevinho, andyrock said he knew whats causing it, so with that fix + your fix (should be a yay!)
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner, sure
<jasoncwarner> Thanks robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, let me know when you have a branch to test
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: indeed
<xnox> Hey, i have a solution to respawning compiz locked again, using upstart.
<xnox> so when compiz crash, instead of just respawning compiz we add a second job to respawn compiz and lock the screen.
<xnox> this should protect from any crashes caused to lock screen WM.
<xnox> (in the x11 world)
<dobey> except for the ones that introduce an infinite loop you can't break out of because compiz crashing results in the screen being locked, when you try to unlock it :)
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, robert_ancell, jasoncwarner I should be able to test as well
<rickspencer3> just let me know if you want any help
<andyrock> rickspencer3, https://code.launchpad.net/~andyrock/unity/fix-1308572/+merge/216216
<rickspencer3> and, nice
<rickspencer3> andy, I guess that fixes the crash, right?
<andyrock> sorry about that that... but sometimes nux is just stupid
<andyrock> rickspencer3, yep
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, testing it right now :)
<rickspencer3> nice
<jasoncwarner> nice andyrock fingers crossed ;)
<andyrock> can we get it in for the final image?
<Sweetshark> jasoncwarner: thanks for the quick approval ;)
<jasoncwarner> np Sweetshark
<jasoncwarner> andyrock I think we are going to hold up image for this fix
<jasoncwarner> infinity fyi, fix is coming...testing to commence.
<bschaefer> jasoncwarner, we still need Trevinho fix :)
<jasoncwarner> bschaefer: yeah
<rickspencer3> excellent work guys
<Sweetshark> desrt: wasnt it you saying: I wont support the lib on a bazillion platforms. Sit down and take a look at this in amazement: http://www.openbsd.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb/src/lib/libssl/src/apps/asn1pars.c?rev=1.15
<Trevinho> rickspencer3, jasoncwarner, robert_ancell: this is the other: https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/relocks-on-crashes/+merge/216221
 * bschaefer needs a faster computer...
<Trevinho> bschaefer: ^
<bschaefer> Trevinho, awesome
<infinity> jasoncwarner: Shiny.  Whatever fix occurs for the rexec issue, do let's make sure it doesn't do anything silly like lock after login or other such failure modes one might think about. :)
<rickspencer3> andyrock, we should work hard to get this fix and the fix that protects against other crashes as well ready today/tonight so that we can respin and get it into the final image
 * bschaefer gets that compiling
<desrt> Sweetshark: beautiful
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, bschaefer, andyrock great work guys!
<desrt> Sweetshark: and not too dissimilar to a mess that i had to recently unravel
<infinity> Trevinho: OnUnlockedSCreen with a capital C? :)
<Trevinho> infinity: yeah I've fixwed that locally, pusjhing in a sec
<infinity> Trevinho: Is there a cleanup here, or if I crash my laptop while locked, will a reboot lead to login->lock->login?
 * Trevinho has evidently typo issues :P
<Trevinho> infinity: I was thinking that just now...
<Sweetshark> desrt: I assume so. Its been a while since I last dared to look at our main().
<Trevinho> infinity: mh, no.. so maybe it's better to save in temp... at that point
<Trevinho> also if temp can be configured not to be cleaned up..
<Sweetshark> desrt: slightly unnerving that there is still a comment saying "/* hmm... this is a little evil but it works */" in openssls main ...
<infinity> Trevinho: /tmp is usually not the right answer, security-wise, cause then you need to get all mktemp-happy and audit that whole mess.  User's ~/.cache or whatever is less error-prone.
<infinity> Trevinho: Especially if you're relying on it being a well-known-name on restart.
<bschaefer> andyrock, woot no crash!
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, andyrock branch works for me, and is approved (off to test Trevinho)
<andyrock> nice!
<Trevinho> infinity: yeah, I would prefer to avoid that... Mh, so... The only thing we can do is probably adding it to the startup script
<chrisccoulson> oh, I was just about to ask the same question as infinity (about cleaning up on crash)
<infinity> Trevinho: Yeah, cleaning the semaphore in /usr/share/upstart/sessions/unity7.conf would likely do the right thing.
<chrisccoulson> wouldn't /run/user be a better place?
<chrisccoulson> (rather than /tmp or ~/.cache)
<Trevinho> chrisccoulson: mh, oh, right... that might be probably better
<infinity> chrisccoulson: Oh, indeed, I keep forgetting we have that.
<infinity> That would solve needing to clean the semaphore on system restart.
<Trevinho> right
 * Trevinho moves there
<bschaefer> nice :)
<jasoncwarner> bschaefer andyrock nice. looks like #1 is all set ?
<bschaefer> jasoncwarner, yup, and Trevinho is hammering out the finishing details on #2
<jasoncwarner> awesome, great work everyone! thanks for jumping on this.
<bschaefer> Trevinho, nice :)
<bschaefer> Trevinho, working here for the #2 case
<jasoncwarner> bschaefer Trevinho already?
<jasoncwarner> what kind of black magic is this?
<thumper> o/
<Trevinho> jasoncwarner: now should be done
<thumper> sometimes I miss you guys
<bschaefer> thumper, :)
 * bschaefer has done nothing
<bschaefer> but tested
<bschaefer> haha
<jasoncwarner> thumper: you should always miss those guys ;)
 * thumper is feeling nostalgic
<Trevinho> thumper: <3
<Trevinho> :D
<thumper> jasoncwarner: how goes the home gym purchase?
<jasoncwarner> thumper: slow...have to slowly convince the wife it's a good idea (aka, her idea)
<thumper> haha
<jasoncwarner> robert_ancell: , seems both should be fixed. mind looping in and helping to verify?
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner, still compiling the first one...
<bschaefer> https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/relocks-on-crashes/+merge/216221
<jasoncwarner> infinity: FYI, looks like #1 and #2 are both fixed. bschaefer verified, looping in more people to test
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, i was lucky to have half compiled unity branches :)
<bschaefer> jasoncwarner, always a good idea
<robert_ancell> bschaefer, I was wondering what you had!
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, haha
 * bschaefer reboots
<Trevinho> chrisccoulson: the runtime dir is cleaned up also on login/logout, right?
<chrisccoulson> Trevinho, that's a good question. does upstart manage this?
<wgrant> I wouldn't expect it to be, but does it matter?
<wgrant> The main case we care about is system crash, when /run will obviously be wiped.
<wgrant> The screen won't be locked during logout.
<Trevinho> chrisccoulson, wgrant: well probably it won't happne if you're also logged in a nother tty or ssh...
<wgrant> Right, that's why I doubt it happens at all.
<Trevinho> wgrant: I care about it because if in that case an user goes to tty1, then kills gnome-session at next login it will get a double lock screen
<Trevinho> wgrant: both lightdm and unity lockscreen
<Trevinho> wgrant: cleaning it up on unity destruction should help, but not if there's another crash there (hard killing the session?)
<wgrant> Trevinho: Well, if they kill gnome-session then they deserve what they get? :)
<infinity> Yeah, that's a weird case to cater to.
<Trevinho> wgrant: eheh ok :)
<infinity> Real users have machines crash.
<apw> just deleteing the marker on unlock should be enough no?  worst case they get relocked, and when they unlock it gets removed and they are good
<wgrant> It seems most important to fail as safely as we can.
<infinity> They don't kill random processes.
 * Trevinho tries to things to corner cases as well
<Trevinho> think*
<apw> if they randomly kill compiz and survive that, they get locked, and can unlock
<bschaefer> well it'll only happen if they were in the lockscreen
<bschaefer> that file is only generated when in the lockscreen
<infinity> Right.
<infinity> So, /run/user is absolutely the right thing here, since it also can't go wrong if your /home goes readonly, etc.
<Trevinho> apw: it depends how they kill it, since on sigterm it will gets cleared
<bschaefer> the only edge cause i can think of is restarting while in the lockscreen
<infinity> The only weird failure mode is if you actually start randomly killing processes for kicks, and then you get two login screens (maybe), not world-ending.
<bschaefer> which putting it in /run/user will fix that
<jasoncwarner> hey all, robotfuel is going to test the fixes as well. robert_ancell is probably still compiling unity. robert_ancell and robotfuel could you let me know when/what you find?
<wgrant> bschaefer: Reboot while locked is handled by /run clearing on reboot
<bschaefer> infinity, well unity-greeter shouldn't start up?
<robert_ancell> will do. I'm at 60% at the moment
<bschaefer> wgrant, cool, were there any other edge cases?
<infinity> bschaefer: Depends on when you went r/o. ;)
<bschaefer> infinity, right... lockscreens are interesting haha
<infinity> Anyhow, it seems the advantages of /run wildly outweight the potential benefits of ~/.cache
<infinity> outweigh, too.
<Trevinho> bschaefer: if you want to do a new test, btw... I've pushed the cleaned up version
<bschaefer> Trevinho, sweet, will do!
<bschaefer> bregma, yay you've returned!
<olli_> Trevinho, robert_ancell, everyone else thx for your help
<Trevinho> olli_: np ;)
<olli_> Trevinho, let me know if you want me to test something
<Trevinho> olli_: the branches are lp:~3v1n0/unity/relocks-on-crashes and lp:~andyrock/unity/fix-1308572
<bschaefer> Trevinho, \o/
<bschaefer> Trevinho, works now on a reboot :)
<bschaefer> Trevinho, we need to get a silo for test, not sure if bregma has resolved his internet issues
<olli_> Trevinho, do we have .debs?
<olli_> ah
<olli_> happy to give the silo a spin
<Trevinho> olli_: eh, not yet I believe... bregma will set it up in minutes I guess
<bschaefer> olli_, i've tested both branches, and confirmed them working
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, is also testing
<olli_> bschaefer, alrighty
<robert_ancell> 72%...
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, you should always have a nice (~5GB) unity build ready to compile a new unity branch! (joking)
<robert_ancell> bschaefer, heh :) I guess it's nice to have a complete build from scratch to be 100% sure everything is working
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, this is very true!
<bschaefer> Trevinho, bregma wanted either you or I to poke robru to get a silo
<bschaefer> Trevinho, it makes it easier for others to test as well, from a ppa
<bschaefer> Trevinho, code looks good as well, branch approved
<Trevinho> bschaefer: cool
<robru> bschaefer, i'm back now, silos for all!
<bschaefer> robru, \o/
<bschaefer> robru, would you be able to place these two branch in them, and start the build?
<bschaefer> lp:~3v1n0/unity/relocks-on-crashes and lp:~andyrock/unity/fix-1308572
<robru> bschaefer, got some branches for something? I hope you're not wanting to land something in desktop trusty...
<robru> bschaefer, yeah I can help you with that. you know bout the spreadsheet right?
<jasoncwarner> robru: yes, they do and yes, they shoudl ;)
<Trevinho> robru: we have
<bschaefer> robru, we are un fortunately, critical security issues
<bschaefer> robru, yeah, but i don't think i hvae the power!
<jasoncwarner> robru: these are critical security things in the lockscreen.
<Laney> Yeah XDG_RUNTIME_DIR is what you want
<robru> jasoncwarner, ok ok I'm on it
<Laney> It lives as long as the user is logged in somewhere
<bschaefer> robru, then you very much!
<bschaefer> thank*
<Laney> and will be cleared on a reboot or full logout
<robru> bschaefer, do you have merges for those branches? I need merges
<bschaefer> robru, yeah let me get them
<bschaefer> https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/relocks-on-crashes/+merge/216221
<bschaefer> https://code.launchpad.net/~andyrock/unity/fix-1308572/+merge/216216
<bschaefer> robru, ^
<robru> bschaefer, thanks.
<bschaefer> robru, thank you :)
<robru> bschaefer, jasoncwarner Trevinho : ok, got those building in silo 8: https://ci-train.ubuntu.com/job/landing-008-1-build/44/console
<bschaefer> sweet
<robru> jasoncwarner, is the release team aware of this?
<Trevinho> olli_: then, if you want to test they will be there in some minutes ^
<jasoncwarner> robru: infinity is looped in
<robru> jasoncwarner, ok great, so when I ask him to accept it he won't be surprised ;-)
<wgrant> We're all eagerly awaiting it.
<jasoncwarner> robru: shouldn't be ;) robert_ancell and robotfuel are also testing when they can. robert_ancell is trying to build unity...probably at 78% right now ;)
<robert_ancell> 79
<robotfuel> I am compiling as well
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: unrelated, but why we don't get the PropertyChanged signal from lightdm https://code.launchpad.net/~andyrock/unity/lp-1281058/+merge/215331/comments/513206 ?
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: if you want to speed things up (and you're not building the debs), just build things inside build/plugins/unityshell and build/UnityCore
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, I guess it was never implemented - please file a bug
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: ok, fine... Also, I've noticed that when the unity_Greeter is already there (i.e. you call .Lock on display manager, then you move with ctrl+alt+fX to the prev session, you unlock and back in, then again you recall .Lock), then unity don't get the Locked signal
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: thus we don't lock...
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: gdbus monitor said it's not sent to anyone...
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, this is Locked from logind?
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: yes
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, interesting. Please file a bug and we can make a test for that and check it does the right thing
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: ok, in lightdm or what?
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, yes, put it in lightdm
<jasoncwarner> hi everyone. I have to step out for about 15 minutes, just fyi.
<olli_> Trevinho, is it done?
<Trevinho> olli_: still building at https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/landing-008/
<Trevinho> olli_: amd64 is doing the pkgs btw, so it's matter of few minutes
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: here you are some details
<Trevinho> https://bugs.launchpad.net/lightdm/+bug/1308789
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1308789 in Light Display Manager "logind Locked signal is not emitted when (unity_)greeter is already running" [Undecided,New]
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, thanks
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: same happens with g-s (double checked now), so it's not unity fault (and it would be weird as we don't get the signals)
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: the only thing that I see differnt with g-s is that I also get /org/freedesktop/login1/session/c2: org.freedesktop.DBus.Properties.PropertiesChanged ('org.freedesktop.login1.Session', @a{sv} {}, ['IdleHint', 'IdleSinceHint', 'IdleSinceHintMonotonic']), do you know what is that related to?
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, I think that's the same as the idle that comes from gnome-screensaver. Though I don't know if anything populates it
<Trevinho> jasoncwarner, olli_: packages are finally at https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/landing-008/+packages for your tests
<olli_> bschaefer, Trevinho, robert_ancell, robotfuel, do we have a testplan we are using to validate this one
<Trevinho> Trevinho: there are actually two fixes in there
<Trevinho> err self-ping
<Trevinho> olli_:  there are actually two fixes in there
<Trevinho> olli_: the first one is: it should not crash when keeping enter pressed in the lockscreen
<Trevinho> olli_: then, the other fix is about making sure that if unity crashed when in lockscreen, then it relocks when run
<Trevinho> olli_: so for this one, just run your normal session, lock it
<Trevinho> olli_: go to tty1 and do something like killall -9 compiz (the -9 is important, otherwise it will not be like a crash)
<olli_> k
<Trevinho> olli_: go back to tty7 and unity should be reloading, but locked
<olli_> Trevinho, try sleep 5; killall -9 compiz
<olli_> and go to 7 to watch
<robert_ancell> andyrock, bschaefer, also confirm lp:~andyrock/unity/fix-1308572 fixes the crash
<olli_> didn't recover for me
<Trevinho> olli_: further test would be doing the same, but after killing it, reboot... And not-experiencing the 2nd lock after lightdm (quite unlikely as it's ensured by the kernel, but... just to be sure)
<Trevinho> olli_: oh, yeah indeed.. you can just run a sleep 5 && killall -9 compiz, then Super+L
<Trevinho> olli_: weird I didn't mention that since it's the way i tested it :D
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, does https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/landing-008/+packages contain both lp:~andyrock/unity/fix-1308572 and lp:~3v1n0/unity/relocks-on-crashes? Do you want confirmation on the latter?
<olli_> Trevinho, I kicked it off on tty1
<olli_> and it the lockscreen didn't come back
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: yes it has both
<Trevinho> olli_: you mean, once you're back on tty7 that unity is running normally?
<olli_> no, it's not
<olli_> Trevinho, go to tty1
<olli_> sleep 5; killall -9 compiz
<olli_> in a clean / newly started session
<olli_> that works as expected
<olli_> however, if you do it a 2nd time without login in I don't get the lockscreen
<olli_> iow, compiz can't crash multiple consecutive times
<Trevinho> olli_: that's because it doesn't get reloaded twice maybe? :o that should be upstart doing it... mhmh
<olli_> Trevinho, even when I log in between the 2 tries I am not getting the lock screen on the 2nd try
<Trevinho> olli_: let me test, but I think it's not unity's fault, mostly it doesn't get reloaded more than a certain limit I think
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner, ^
<robru> uh, guys? I just tried silo 8 in a VM... after installing the updated unity, it doesn't restart after a crash, locked or not, killall -9 makes it go away permanently.
<jasoncwarner> not quite out of the woods yet?
<robru> jasoncwarner, gonna test more
<olli_> jasoncwarner, I think the security issue is fixed
<Trevinho> robru: this is just weird, since we didn't change anything that should be related to that :o mhmh
<olli_> i.e. can't crash Unity anymore by keep pushing Enter
<robru> olli_, yeah, I couldn't reproduce the Enter key crash in an unpatched VM either.
<jasoncwarner> olli_: acked
<olli_> jasoncwarner, what's left is that 2 consecutive crashes of Unity while being locked doesn't bring UNity back
<jasoncwarner> olli_: ok, thanks for the clarification
<olli_> so, you can argue whether the latter is a ship stopper still
<olli_> I think we need to keep pushing atm
<olli_> but got to be aware that the security aspect is solved
<olli_> robru, interesting, did you keep pushing Enter for like 30sec?
<robru> olli_, ok, just confirmed, same. the first killall makes unity come back locked, second killall makes unity not come back.
<wgrant> I've seen thatbefore thischange
<Trevinho> olli_: I think this problem isn't a new thing btw... I don't use unity run by upstart much, but I noticed it doesn't restart always...
<robru> olli_, i held down the enter key for one full minute.
<wgrant> I could only crash it maybe 2 or 3 times before it stopped autorestarting.
<wgrant> But the Enter crash is reliable within 30s or so
<olli_> robru, that makes for sucky repro testing ;)
<robru> I'm testing in a VM, it's quite slow, I guess it's a race condition or something.
<olli_> let me try the 2 consecutive crash thing on this machine real quick, this is unpatched
<olli_> brb
<infinity> robru: That's not a new behaviour.  We saw the same pre-patch when reproducing the crash in the first place.
<robru> when you guys hold down enter, do you see the lock screen check and recheck rapidly? because it seemed to only do it quite slowly for me
<infinity> robru: (ie: it's not a regression that you can't keep crashing it forever)
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, olli_, do we strictly need the "keep lock on unity crash" fix? Note that killing gnome-screensaver would break the lock in the existing case
<robru> infinity, ok
<infinity> robert_ancell: That's the fix that matters.
<wgrant> Killing gnome-screensaver would break it, but gnome-screensaver is simpler, well-tested code.
<wgrant> There will be other crashers.
<infinity> robert_ancell: The crash isn't the security bug, the fact that it's unlocked after a crash is.
<wgrant> We need to prevent the crashers from becoming security bugs in the first place.
<olli> infinity, and that seems to be fixed - sorry I dropped just when you started
<robert_ancell> sure, it just feels like this is a bit of an enhancement over the status quo rather than a fix. Though of course the likelihood of unity crashing is higher than gnome-screensaver.
<robotfuel> killall compiz unlocks the screen.
<olli> robotfuel, under which circumstances?
<infinity> robert_ancell: Enhancement is to be encouraged. :P
<wgrant> A non-crash exit should unlock the screen.
<robert_ancell> infinity, this close to release? :)
<robotfuel> olli: wait for the screen to to dim and lock, switch terminals to tty1 login and type killall compiz
<infinity> robert_ancell: For a security hole?  Yes.
<olli> robotfuel, will try
<wgrant> robotfuel: The crash case is the interesting one; killall will send SIGTERM for a clean shutdown by default.
<infinity> robotfuel: A sigkill isn't a security hole.
<wgrant> unity should be cleaning up on SIGTERM.
<olli> Trevinho, ^ what robotfuel says
<infinity> Or term.
<wgrant> SIGKILL or SIGSEGV should both work fine for reproducing this.
<infinity> olli: A TERM isn't a crash.
<apw> don't we send a SIGTERM to unlock, isn't that normal
<wgrant> But SIGSERGV isn't the interesting one.
<jasoncwarner> infinity: I think what robert_ancell is asking, if I read it right, is would we stop the release for the same behavior in gnome-screensaver (which, I believe, has done this for quite some time as well). again, if I read that right
<wgrant> SIGSEGV *is* the interesting one.
<olli> infinity, ah, didn't get that robotfuel missed -9
<infinity> jasoncwarner: If there was any evidence that gnome-screensaver had crashed at some point in the last 7 years, sure.
<infinity> jasoncwarner: Turns out that compiz and unity do a lot.
<jasoncwarner> infinity: maybe I'm misunderstanding. perhaps someone could rephrase the current issue? As I understand it, the security hole is fixed....but....
<jasoncwarner> olli ^
<olli> jasoncwarner, I think infinity is arguing that killall -9 is not valid
<olli> SIGKILL vs SIGSEGV
<robru> jasoncwarner, infinity ok guys, well, the package as built in silo 8 contains the behavior that unity restarts locked after a crash, I guess that is what we desire? let me know if you want me to hit 'publish'
<Trevinho> wgrant, robert_ancell: gnome-screensaver? it's not anymroe in trusty (unless you don't have some a11y settings on)...
<Trevinho> wgrant: unity *does* cleanup in SIGTERM
<wgrant> I know, and I know.
<infinity> Trevinho: Right.  Which it should.
<wgrant> gnome-screensaver's reliability is important, because it's what we have to measure against.
<infinity> Trevinho: The point is that people were (incorrectly) using TERM to fake a "crash". :)
<wgrant> The point is that SIGKILL, SIGABRT, SIGSEGV are all good for testing
<wgrant> SIGTERM is not.
<Trevinho> infinity: ah, indeed... but SIGKILL is fine, sin't it?
<wgrant> Yes.
<jasoncwarner> thanks olli
<Trevinho> wgrant: I underlined that on the test-case I wrote above... :)
<infinity> robru: That is what we want, yes.  Both the lock-on-crash and, optionally (but highly desired) the fix for the crash itself.
<olli> infinity, I tested with killall -9
<robru> i was also testing with -9
<olli> and couldn't get into unity
<olli> now doing a -11 also doesn't get me into unity
<olli> even though it takes way longer for compiz to die
<olli> back to the lockscreen though
<wgrant> That's correct.
<wgrant> -11 will invoke aport, so it will coredump.
<wgrant> == slow
<olli> alrighty, so do we have agreement that the security issue is sufficiently addressed?
<olli> infinity, ^
<wgrant> Have we etseted that edge cases such as system crashes while locked don't require double login?
<wgrant> But it sounds like it works, and the code looks fine.
<Trevinho> wgrant: it needs if you use your tty powers... :/
<Trevinho> wgrant: not if you reboot
<olli> I think once we agree that the sec issue is addressed I'd do some more general testing
<wgrant> We just need to make sure it's not regressing anything, given how late this is.
<olli> just to make sure we didn't catch a nasty regression
<olli> ack
<wgrant> Right.
<robru> ok guys here's the thing
<robotfuel> I did some guest session test, but multiple user tests might be interesting.
<wgrant> Trevinho: Right, but we can't really avoid that, and it's not a normal user case.
<wgrant> Power failures are a normal user case :)
<robru> so doing killall -9 makes it relaunch locked the first time, but then the second time it doesn't relaunch at all. that's supposedly expected
<wgrant> Right
<robru> but eg I was testing this with a terminal open
<Trevinho> wgrant: yeah, indeed :)
<robru> and when "unity doesn't relaunch", it leaves the terminal open
<infinity> Okay, has anyone also done a fresh reboot with this unity to make sure it doesn't do anything silly on first login?
<wgrant> The failure to restart the second time is not a regression
<wgrant> It is a security vuln, but that's probably harder.
<infinity> I see no way from the code that it would, but.
<olli> infinity, I did
<infinity> olli: Thanks.
<robru> can't type in it, but I can copy & paste with the mouse in the terminal. so effectively I have access to the terminal to issue commands in a limited way. still seems like a security hole to me
<olli> will do again just to be sure
<robru> eg if i'm an attacker and i have the ability to take down compiz, all i have to do is do it twice...
<wgrant> It would be nice to track down the double restart issue
<olli> Trevinho, ^
<Trevinho> this thing about "unity doesn't relaunch" I think it's something related to wront config from gnome-session/upstart since it doens't seem to be managed by upstart at pstree level, but maybe it's just because upstart runs throught g-s?
<wgrant> But I don't think it's absolutely essential, as it requires a triggerable crash to exploit, and is possibly awkward to fix now.
<wgrant> But it should certainly be investigated.
<robru> ok
<robru> well I'm happy to publish this unity then, do we all agree it's a good idea?
 * Trevinho abstains, but would say +1 :P
<infinity> robru: Do it.
<robru> ok
<wgrant> Agrred.
<robotfuel> robru: +1
<robru> oh lol, still building on armhf and powerpc...
<olli> Trevinho, why, just because it's like... 2am
<Trevinho> :)
<jasoncwarner> powerpc? did someone say powerpc? don't even get me started.....
<olli> robru, can yuou pls update the bug with your latest finding re terminal
<robru> olli, sure
<olli> jasoncwarner, I'll update the incident report to document the decision
<jasoncwarner> thanks olli
<olli> infinity, is there anything else left to do?
<olli> for today
<olli> I think we need to follow up on the double crash
<olli> asap
<infinity> jasoncwarner: I'll hook you up with (much) faster ppc buildds after release.
<jasoncwarner> infinity: :)
<jasoncwarner> Trevinho andyrock robotfuel robert_ancell robru infinity thank you all for working this so late in the game (and day for some!).
<jasoncwarner> awesome to see how people rallied around it....not that we like seeing it b/c of a bug, obviously ;)
<Trevinho> jasoncwarner: np, it's mostly my normal work time :)
<jasoncwarner> Trevinho: ah, to be young again ;)
<jasoncwarner> or...perhaps....not old :)
<Trevinho> jasoncwarner: not that young... unfortunately :/ but time is not my friend
<jasoncwarner> Trevinho: :) indeed!
<robru> jasoncwarner, hah, not even 5PM here ;-)
<robru> jasoncwarner, but you know that!
<robru> olli, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1308572/comments/6
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1308572 in unity (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu 14.04: security problem in the lock screen" [Critical,In progress]
<olli> thx robru
<robru> you're welcome
<olli> robru, can you pls ping me once you have hit release
<robru> olli, sure
<olli> thx
<infinity> robru: That ppc build should be done in ~5m or so.  Sorry, if I'd known the build was in flight earlier, I would have aimed it at sagari.
<robru> infinity, no worries.
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-04-17
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: about unity not being reloaded... It's weird that pstree shows it as a child of gnome-session instead of init, I thought it was reloaded by upstart actually... but it doesn't seem the case..
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: looking better I found why
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: /usr/share/gnome-session/sessions/ubuntu.session contains the word compiz
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: but... /usr/share/upstart/sessions/unity7.conf has a "raw grep" for compiz on that file
<Trevinho> thus we're still running unity7 via gs!
<Trevinho> when moving to upstart (i.e. removing that compiz check), then all goes as it should using upstart, and thus killing unity reloads it forever
<Trevinho> olli: ^
<olli> Trevinho, what does that mean
<Trevinho> olli: that we are currently (for a mistake I think) running unity7 via gnome-session, and this leads not to get the respawns on compiz crashes
<olli> Trevinho, ok
<Trevinho> for some reason it has been working for long time, then a change on the ubuntu.session file in gnome-session caused this to change
<olli> Trevinho, might be good to update the bug with that finding
<Trevinho> I think we should SRU the thing at this point :/
<olli> and then I think you can call it a day
<olli> yeah, this is SRY material
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: what's the compiz mention in RequiredComponents actually does? Launch it if it's not there? or what? As the unity upstart file was checking if compiz was mentioned there (as exec file I think)
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, I'm not 100% sure but it used to launch them
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, our required component list should probably be blank since we use upstart but there's some side effects probably
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: yeah... so what we should fix is unity at this point, making it to run with upstart in any case... then if this fails for some reason will g-s do that
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: if g-s doesn't arrive first of it...
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, yeah, they're both trying to keep the process alive
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: yes, but g-s seems not to be reliable as upstart is
<robert_ancell> g-s must die :)
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: and I will help to do that :)
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: as for its removal btw, (related to the ML), unity needs to also update its session managements... As we rely on it for events right now (mostly for the power-button press thing)
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, yes, we will probably find lots of things relying on these sorts of interfaces when we remove them (found a bunch of them in unity-greeter)
<infinity> robru: Should be able to hit it now.
<robru> infinity, ok, published
<infinity> \o/
<robru> olli, hit publish, should be in proposed soon
<infinity> robru: Accepted, thanks.
<robru> infinity, thank you
<Trevinho> robru: FYI I've all prepared to get the fix to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1308800 as well
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1308800 in Unity "Unity doesn't respawn all the times on crashes" [Critical,In progress]
<robru> Trevinho, what? are you saying I have to build that in a new silo in time for release as well? infinity ^^ ??
<Trevinho> robru: I was wondering of SRUing it at this point
<Trevinho> robru: unfortunately I noticed it just an ~ hour ago
<robru> Trevinho, I'm not building it without an ack from management because this is just too close to the deadline for me. i'm literally having anxiety attacks about this.
<Trevinho> robru: well, you don't need to build the fix... you can just test it by your own
<Trevinho> robru: it's just about modifing a conf file
<Trevinho> or two if you prefer
<robru> Trevinho, but still, the package would need to be rebuilt in order to get this in the release right now
<olli> robru, that's an SRY
<Trevinho> robru: yep... that's why I said of SRUing it, but it's up to release team... as it still might be important
<olli> Trevinho, let's play safe
<robru> olli, yeah
<robru> olli, unity *just* hit release pocket btw
<olli> robru, saw that, thx
<rickspencer3> olli, I just did a dist-upgrade, got a new lib-unity-core, restarted, and def. can't repro the crasher in the greater
<kieppie> I'm wondering if it's possible to extend my dektop over network to my TV or something via DLNA - i.e. use my 'DLNA renderer' in a similar manner as simply plugging in my HDMI cable
<Laney> morning
<apw> Laney, moin
<Laney> hey apw
<Laney> how's life in the seat of power?
<Laney> assuming you are there :P
<seb128> hey Laney apw
<Laney> hey seb128, how goes?
<seb128> looks like there was some unity lock screen fun yesterday evening
<seb128> Laney, good! you? how was tha clown climbing? :p
<Laney> was good!
<apw> "fun" indded :)
<mlankhorst> morning
<mlankhorst> yeah Laney, so far I just saw a fixed issue
<Laney> hmm?
<mlankhorst> worst case is that you're hitting it :P
<Laney> well you got it too
<Laney> so can try the patch?
<mlankhorst> I guess the fix is not in 10.1.0 yet, might be in 10.1.1
<Laney> those mutual conflicts are annoying
<Laney> another affect is that it means liboxideqtcode0's changelog in /usr/share/doc is a broken symlink
<Laney> if you have -extra installed
<mlankhorst> yeah
<Laney> effect
<Laney> grr
<mhr3> seb128, ping? some time ago you reported that apps don't show up properly, right? do you remember against what did you open it?
<seb128> mhr3, hey
<seb128> mhr3, bug #1223933 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1223933 in libunity "sometimes the dash home list "no result matching your query" string" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1223933
<mlankhorst> Laney: suspecting https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=75279 -- will be fixed in 10.1.1 though :P
<ubot2> Freedesktop bug 75279 in Driver/nouveau "XCloseDisplay() takes one minute around nouveau_dri.so, freezing Firefox startup" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<Laney> mlankhorst: can/will you try it?
<mlankhorst> yeah
<Laney> mhr3: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1308037 was my one from the other day
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1308037 in unity (Ubuntu) "No results from application lens" [Undecided,New]
<mhr3> seb128, Laney, thx
<seb128> mhr3, yw!
<Laney> someone commented with a possible dupe in that one too
<Laney> so there's three for you :P
<seb128> mhr3, since you are looking at bugs, could you add bug #1194465 to your list/ping whoever is working on that?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1194465 in unity-scope-gdrive (Ubuntu) "scope-runner-dbus.py crashed with SIGSEGV in auth_session_remote_object_destroyed_cb()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1194465
<seb128> mhr3, is that a signon/mardy thing?
<mhr3> seb128, yep
<seb128> mhr3, can you reassign/ping him or should I do it?
<mhr3> seb128, feel free to
<mhr3> seb128, it's been a while anyway really touched that
<mhr3> davidcalle, even you did ;)
<seb128> mhr3, would be good for you to refresh your knowledge of that code then ;-)
<mhr3> seb128, there's no refresh, i never touched it :)
<Laney> fresh
<seb128> mhr3, opportunity to learn then!
<seb128> mhr3, stop being that lazy ;-)
<mhr3> seb128, it's called delegating :)
<seb128> lol
<Laney> http://shop.canonical.com/product_info.php?products_id=1128
<Laney> looks beardy
<mlankhorst> [ 4883.702555] nouveau E[   PFIFO][0000:01:00.0] read fault at 0x00134f5000 [PAGE_NOT_PRESENT] from PGRAPH/DISPATCH on channel 0x005f72f000 [memcheck-amd64-[18054]]
<mlankhorst> progress, I guess :P
<mlankhorst> now a different crash :s
<mlankhorst> ok got it
<mlankhorst> Laney: it's an entry level issue, you should be able to fix it. :D
<Laney> Â¬_Â¬
<mlankhorst> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-nouveau/+bug/1300411
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1300411 in xserver-xorg-video-nouveau (Ubuntu) "Xorg crashed with SIGSEGV in pushbuf_flush()" [Medium,New]
<seb128> xclaesse, hey, could you have a look to https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=662672#c9 ?
<ubot2> Gnome bug 662672 in Chat "wrong count of unread messages and text missing" [Normal,New]
<mvo> mpt: hi, there is a certain chance that the apt-get update progressbar jumps around might get solved by fixing apt
<mvo> mpt: (I thought you might want to hear about this as iirc its one of the things that look unpolished)
<mpt> mvo, as I understand it, any repository referred to in sources.list can itself refer to any number of other repositories, correct?
<mvo> mpt: I don't think this is the case (unless I misunderstand something). there will be a bunch of files that get download and before the Release file is parsed what files is a bit uncertain, but once the Release file is fetched apt has a pretty good idea what needs to be fetched, it was just not making good use of that information :/
<mpt> mvo, oh, excellent! So we need to use an indeterminate progress bar only while reading the Release file. Then we can allocate ~5% of the determinate bar to reading the sources, ~45% to downloading packages, and  and ~50% to installing packages.
<mvo> mpt: yeah, that is the plan, adding a state "gathering data" or something for the very early fetching and once the release file is there, the data should be pretty accurate (modulo corner cases like right now we don't have the size of the translations file in our release file, but that is a bug that will get fixed)
<rickspencer3> seb128, jasoncwarner what's the word on the street? how does the release look today?
<seb128> rickspencer3, hey, looking good (finger crossed that there isn't another screenlock issue or similar)
<rickspencer3> seb128, for sure!
<seb128> ogra_, stop trolling on the desktop list!
<ogra_> seb128, lol
<ogra_> well, tomorrow is a holiday here ... so its "kind of friday" :)
<seb128> ogra_, what people are saying is that they don't want to have a non-good-enough-to-get-work-done solution pushed on them over what they have it's working
<seb128> ogra_, like "don't force a metro UI on my windows, I need to get work done"
<seb128> ogra_, nobody said we don't want system-images, but we don't want them today if it means you can't install e.g the gimp anymore because it has no click and there are no solution to install debs
<seb128> ogra_, the day we can switch without undermining our desktop experience we should/are going to do it
<ogra_> seb128, well, IMHo we need to start from the bottom ... not at the UI level
<seb128> right
<seb128> but we need to swap the pieces only when they are ready
<seb128> not say "ok, no libreoffice or gimp for you anymore for the next 1.5 years until we reach feature parity"
<ogra_> which is why i point out that we should first get the plumbing layer ready while unity8 desktop development should be done in parallel ... but only land when its done
<seb128> right
<ogra_> we just need to re-package them as click ;)
<seb128> nobody argued against that
<ogra_> will make the tablet people happy too ;)
<seb128> we need to get click working on the desktop unity first
<ogra_> indeed
<rickspencer3> seb128, and desktop team, I hope it's not premature to say congrats on 14.04
<seb128> ogra_, oh, and I don't believe that you not going to be online at some point tomorrow, to read reviews and troll a bit
<rickspencer3> I've been using is since October, of course, but ...
<seb128> rickspencer3, thanks ;-)
<rickspencer3> it's been working really well
<ogra_> seb128, lol
<seb128> ;-)
<tseliot> seb128: hi, do we map the touchscreen input onto a display output (in 14.04)? If so, what part of the desktop deals with it?
<seb128> rickspencer3, yep, we are quite happy with how this cycle went as well
<ogra_> yeah, you guys did an awesome job
<ogra_> !!
<rickspencer3> that's great
<tseliot> seb128: I'm asking because of bug #1287341
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1287341 in unity-settings-daemon (Ubuntu) "Touchscreen controls both screens in dual-monitor setup" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1287341
<seb128> tseliot, I don't think we map those no
<seb128> tseliot, that bug/the upstream one referenced basically have the context
<seb128> tseliot, bregma said the kernel doesn't provide us enough info to do clever matching
<seb128> Laney, so, release notes ... seems like neither robert_ancell nor bregma edited them. I think I'm going to have a look after lunch, just checking if you started thinking about those to not dup work
<tseliot> seb128: ok, I'll look into this issue. Maybe I'll work on a fix myself
<Laney> seb128: just loaded that
<seb128> tseliot, that would be great
<seb128> Laney, ok, let me know if you start on it/what sections you add
<seb128> bregma might still want to add the notes for unity
<seb128> quite some features to cover there ;-)
<Laney> It's got a little paragraph
<seb128> but first lunch
<seb128> bbiab
<apw> Laney, let me know when you are done with the release notes ...
<Laney> apw: sec
<apw> Laney, don't rush, just bored of hitting refresh :)
<Laney> apw: ok, there you go
<Laney> seb128: added a couple of bugs, but couldn't think of that many
<seb128> Laney, you just edited known issue, not "what changed"?
<Laney> yep
<Laney> what do you want to put in there?
<seb128> ok, I'm going to try to complete the what changed
<Laney> type ahead find in nautilus
<Laney> $updates to things
<seb128> need to look at what we did
<Laney> could add libreoffice
<seb128> but stuff like traditional menus for defaults apps, improved settings
<seb128> libreoffice
<seb128> unity has a ton of stuff
<Laney> there's already a unity section
<seb128> I should look at the top 10 trusty features websites featured
<seb128> cool
<seb128> hum, who added it?
<Laney> not sure, I edited it a little bit
<Laney> hoping bregma can do it properly
<seb128> we can probably add some stuff, like new decorations with live resizing, smaller launcher icons configuration from settings
 * Laney is adding some features atm
<seb128> yeah, same here
<Laney> I didn't know what was worth adding
<Laney> like what's too minor, I thought live resizing would be not important enough
<Laney> don't write over my lock :P
<Laney> maybe wait until I'm done otherwise it's likely we will write the same thing
<seb128> sure
<Laney> bah, someone else edited it meanwhile
<seb128> Laney, https://plus.google.com/+System76/posts/68DEWHK9Sba
<seb128> Laney, use that maybe?
<Laney> asac!
<asac> Laney: did i cause a conflict?
<Laney> no but you did break the lock
<Laney> in that sense every edit is a conflict
<asac> ?
<asac> hmmmmmmmm
<asac> Laney: you can just kill my changes if thats easier
<Laney> it's ok
<asac> sorry
<asac> Laney: i will leave it alone for a while now.
<Laney> moin wasn't too bad about it
<Laney> it merged the changes and showed me the bits that i'd edited
<asac> nice
<asac> yeah think the doc is long enough that conflicts shouldnt be too hard
<seb128> Laney, bregma: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-doc/ubuntu-docs/trusty/view/head:/ubuntu-help/C/whats-new.page can also be used as inspiration
<Laney> yeah
<seb128> Laney, do you know if we aim the notes to 13.10 updaters or 12.04 ones?
<Laney> I'm done for now
<Laney> I think it's for this release, there's more marketing stuff for LTS upgraders
<seb128> k
<Laney> I made sections for LO and Xorg
<Laney> if Sweetshark and mlankhorst want to fill those in if they have anything to put
<seb128> that would be nice
<seb128> Sweetshark, libreoffice 4.2 marketing speech on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TrustyTahr/ReleaseNotes ? ;-)
<Laney> Just put a few bullets, don't make it really long
<seb128> yeah, I was mostly joking with "marketing speech" ;-)
<Laney> :P
 * seb128 notes don't joke too much with Sweetshark he's able to write a book on libreoffice awesomeness
<mlankhorst> not much for xorg tbh
<Laney> /mesa/drivers/whatever
<mlankhorst> 'tries to break less in optimus configs, probably'
<seb128> that's a good one
<seb128> didn't you get support for dri3 and stuff?
<Laney> any hybrid graphics things?
<mlankhorst> the kernel doesn't support it yet, I think.
<Laney> is is that what optimus is
<mlankhorst> and from what I read on the mailing list some of it is still sketchy
<Laney> ALL the is
<mlankhorst> optimus = driving your intel card from your nvidia card
<Laney> well, delete the section if you don't have anything interesting to put
<Laney> if you know any bugs that you want the 2 people who read release notes to be aware of then put them in the bottom bit
 * Laney lunches
<mlankhorst> no I fixed most of them before release, I guess nouveau webapps counts :P
<mlankhorst> but not worth putting in release notes
<Sweetshark> seb128: argh.
 * Sweetshark starts the bullshit bingo generator.
<Sweetshark> seb128: thats still news against 13.10 only, not LTS->LTS, right?
<seb128> Sweetshark, correct
<Trevinho> Laney: when back could you update the Unity part on the release note to include something liike http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/7267693/ ?
<seb128> Trevinho, it's a wiki, just edit it?
<Trevinho> seb128: it's immutable to me :(
<seb128> Trevinho, are you logged in?
<Trevinho> seb128: I guess they locked it for release
<Trevinho> seb128: yep
<seb128> no they didn't
<seb128> you might need to be an ubuntu member or something
<seb128> you are not member?
<Trevinho> seb128: oh, well now I can go in :o
<Trevinho> seb128: I do
<seb128> go in = edit?
<Trevinho> weird, it was immutable before...
<seb128> weird
<seb128> well, as long as it's back ;-)
<Trevinho> seb128: well, it still is, unless I don't edit manually the URL...
<Trevinho> seb128: it turns out that SSO was messed, :)
<Trevinho> seb128: that text looks fine to you, btw?
<seb128> Trevinho, yes, that looks fine to me
<seb128> Trevinho, note that is already an Unity section with some of those items,so just update that
<Trevinho> seb128: yes, I read it but it was a little too concise... :)
<seb128> Trevinho, right, I'm just trying to make sure you saw it and don't duplicate (e.g update/delete the previous content)
<Sweetshark> seb128: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TrustyTahr/ReleaseNotes#Ubuntu_Desktop_Features <- better?
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> I don't think all of those things need to be listed
<Laney> lemme edit a bit
<Laney> what is a 'windows disposition layout'?
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
<seb128> Sweetshark, "falt icon theme" ... ?
<seb128> Sweetshark, is that supposed to be "flat" or?
<Sweetshark> seb128: eh, falt -> flat
<seb128> k
<seb128> I was wondering if that was some tech word I didn't know
<seb128> Sweetshark, be careful if you edit, Laney comment suggested he's doing that as well
<Sweetshark> seb128: grumble, page is immutable anyway
<seb128> though he was speaking about unity
<seb128> so maybe no conflict
<Sweetshark> ah, no. I had a magically disappearing login.
<Laney> it's better to just wait
<Sweetshark> interesting.
<Sweetshark> Laney: will do.
<Laney> it tells you if someone's editing the page when you go in there
<Laney> Sweetshark: gogogo
<Laney> well, if this ever saves
 * Laney stares at the wiki
<tedg> And the wiki stares back at Laney.
<jdstrand> bregma: hey, chrisccoulson wants to fix bug #1307709
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1307709 in Oxide "webbrowser-app does not start in Unity 8 preview session" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1307709
<Laney> it's bored its way into my soul
 * tedg wonders who will blink first
<jdstrand> bregma: but he gets a black screen on starting unity8
<jdstrand> chrisccoulson, bregma: discuss amongst yourselves :)
<Laney> hahah I love the list of spreadsheet functions
<asac> i dont understand this bug
<asac> i was old it was tested yesteday
<ogra_> asac, seems the desktop session doesnt use the unit8 upstart job
<asac> ok seems its an old bug actually
<asac> so guess desktop testers hav alreayd worked around this
<asac> ogra_: sure, i know that. but its not a regression from our upload last night
<ogra_> asac, definitely not
<asac> but multiple people confirmed yuesterday
<asac> that the oxide landing desktop plan was good
<asac> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Process/Merges/TestPlan/webapp-container
<asac> "restart your browser
<asac> "
<qengho> larsu: My messaging indicator is full. I suspect the client is dumb. Have any debugging advice, to make sure?  http://i.imgur.com/RM2nQ45.png
<larsu> robru: stop bothering qengho so much!
<qengho> I KNOW, RIGHT?
<larsu> haha
<larsu> I recently fixed a bug which had this symptom
<larsu> does smuxy offer messaging menu integration as a plugin?
<larsu> and you turned it off and on a lot?
<larsu> (while talking to robru?)
<chrisccoulson> jdstrand, bregma, NM, I got it to display by undocking my laptop and then restarting
<bregma> chrisccoulson, one of either Mir or unity8 does not yet support multimonitor configurations
<bregma> I dunno which, gonne need fixing this cycle
<chrisccoulson> bregma, heh, i guessed :)
 * bregma is going to be busier than ever
<chrisccoulson> also, it doesn't like my touchpad. when i touch my touchpad, the cursor wanders towards the top left of the screen
<qengho> larsu: There is, AFAIK, no plugin here, and I certainly wasn't toggling anything. It's full now, just as a matter of course.
 * Sweetshark wouldnt have thought that tedg reads german philosophers ...
<tedg> Sweetshark, I am the Ã¼ber-Texan
<Sweetshark> lol
<Sweetshark> sounds great. after all everything is bigger in Texas ;)
<tedg> Yes, except our Eiffel Tower, but it has a cowboy hat on top to make up for it.
<larsu> qengho: okay probably the client is buggy then. Can you call ListSources() on it's com.canonical.indicator.messages.application bus interface and paste the result?
<Sweetshark> tedg: well, its been 138 years since the tallest building of the world stood in my hometown, so I guess we are out of the race already for a long time ..
<tedg> Sweetshark, Clearly the solution is that the building needs a cowboy hat on top!
<Sweetshark> tedg: That might raise some conflict. The building is a church, and while the spire is still standing the rest of it was bombed away by cowboys in operation gomorrah.
<Sweetshark> tedg: But in general, that would indeed be the obvious solution.
<tedg> Sweetshark, So you're saying what should happen here is that Texas should give an epic cowboy hat as a sign of peace and understanding, so that they'd feel compelled to put it on.
<Sweetshark> tedg: that would work. ;)
<chrisccoulson> bregma, how do I run a terminal in the unity8 preview?
<ogra_> chrisccoulson, using the terminal app ?
<ogra_> (or isnt that available)
<chrisccoulson> ogra_, where's that installed from?
<chrisccoulson> nothing shows up in the session and I didn't find anything in the archive
<ogra_> usually from the appstore ...
<ogra_> search for terminal in the apps scope
<tedg> I don't think click is on the desktop image
<tedg> chrisccoulson, Just a sec, let me find the apps PPA
<tedg> chrisccoulson, ppa:ubuntu-touch-coreapps-drivers/daily
<chrisccoulson> tedg, thanks
<tedg> chrisccoulson, There's a metapackage touch-coreapps
<bregma> chrisccoulson, try clicking on the "Terminal" app, the latest update should launch OK
<chrisccoulson> bregma, yeah, i need to install it first :)
<bregma> chrisccoulson, also, you need to do what tedg suggests
<chrisccoulson> bregma, i can't scroll the list of apps btw
 * tedg finds that installing apps is just a gateway drug to using them
<bregma> chrisccoulson, it sounds like you need to invest in a nice touchscreen
<bregma> all the cool kids are doing it
<pmcgowan> bregma, does it not work with mouse events?
<chrisccoulson> bregma, or canonical needs to invest in one for me ;)
<chrisccoulson> pmcgowan, no, it's pretty broken here with a mouse
<chrisccoulson> and my cursor doesn't stay still when i tap the touchpad either
<pmcgowan> thats seems like a problem
<chrisccoulson> it's virtually unusable here :/
<bregma> I use a mouse here because I can't stand trackpads, and I have no problems using a mouse
<pmcgowan> ok good
<pmcgowan> will load it up in a bit and see
<bregma> the touchscreen on this test system is too flaky to rely on it, too
<chrisccoulson> oh, the terminal only opens in the sidestage, giving my about 29 characters of width :/
<chrisccoulson> i'm going to cry in a minute
<chrisccoulson> can i make that wider?
<pmcgowan> dont think so
<chrisccoulson> i can't use a 29 character width terminal that I can't scroll :(
<chrisccoulson> and tmux doesn't work in it either, so i can't even run that and drop to a tty to debug oxide :/
<bregma> chrisccoulson, edit /usr/share/applications/com.ubuntu.terminal_terminal.desktop and remove the line X-Ubuntu-StageHint=SideStage
<bregma> after that, things work swimmingly
<bregma> I don't know why someone thinks terminal in a side stage is a good idea, perhaps they need to be thrashed
<chrisccoulson> ah, thanks. will give that a try
<bregma> they must be beaten about the head and shoulders with a blunt object until they confess to their conspiracy of progressive obstructionism
 * bregma is done rambling for the nonce
<chrisccoulson> aha, now I can't type anything in to it. i seem to get a random character every few keypresses
<tedg> bregma, I think you should submit a patch ;-)
<chrisccoulson> is there any way to switch between apps?
<chrisccoulson> without a touch device?
<olli> chrisccoulson, you pull the screen to the right with the mouse
<olli> similar to the swipe on the phone/tablet
<olli> that'll get you to the app scope
<olli> and you can switch to another app from there
<chrisccoulson> olli, it doesn't do anything here
<bregma> chrisccoulson, are yuo using a mouse or a trackpad?  Edge swipes are impossible with a track pad.
<bregma> well, difficult
<chrisccoulson> bregma, yeah, i've tried a mouse too
<bregma> I have separate buttons on mine, so I can get edge swipes to work using two hands, but my other machine has a clickpad and it's nigh-on impossible
<chrisccoulson> in fact, i wonder if this has just frozen
<chrisccoulson> i don't even get the odd random character on the terminal like i did before
<bregma> that sounds ominous
<bregma> can you pull down indicators?
<chrisccoulson> no
<bregma> hashtag sadface
<chrisccoulson> i just killed the terminal app, and the screen hasn't updated
<chrisccoulson> so it seems pretty dead
<bregma> that sounds like the shell is hung
<bregma> if you can;t switch to a VT, you'll want to reboot
<chrisccoulson> i can switch to a VT. i killed the user init, which seems to have done the trick
<chrisccoulson> although, it's left most processes running
<chrisccoulson> i think i'm going to need to reboot :/
<Laney> you might be able to loginctl kill-session
<bregma> or service lightdm restart
<tedg> chrisccoulson, If you send sigterm to Upstart it'll bring down all it's children and shutdown.
<bregma> it appears there are many ways to skin a cat
<chrisccoulson> ok, i think we have success
<chrisccoulson> oh, maybe not
<chrisccoulson> i can reproduce the crash i was looking for, and can now switch back to the terminal (the swipe seems to work now i've restarted)
<chrisccoulson> but i can no longer get keyboard input in the terminal to debug it
<bregma> hey tedg I'm trying to run Qt Creator in my Unity 8 Desktop Preview session but it apparent fails because its subprocesses are not allowed to connect or something, what's the best approach to analysing that problem
<bregma> ?
<pmcgowan> bregma, how can that work?
<tedg> bregma, Uhm, I'm not sure analysis is needed. Fixing is :-)
<pmcgowan> wow
<tedg> bregma, We need to get cgroups working for apps and all that contained. And then for QtCreator they really need to use Mir trusted sessions, but those don't really exist yet.
<tedg> It's a manpower issue really.
<bregma> well, it starts OK but you can't do much yet
<tedg> bregma, So the solution is convince management we need to work on all the pieces there :-)
<tedg> I can map it out, but it's a non-trivial amount of work.
<bregma> tedg, can you map it out and send me the map, so we can at least see the lay of the land over the next cycles?
 * bregma wonders how well emacs will run under unity 8....
<tedg> bregma, Uhm, sure. I think the big question early on is whether we're going to do the work to get cgroups working under Upstart or wait until we move to systemd for that.
<tedg> I figured we'd have that discussion in Malta.
<tedg> The trusted session stuff is ongoing, it's needed for lots of things. Online accounts and Pay just to mention two.
<bregma> tedg, yes, discuss it there but we need to plan an agenda before we arrive
<tedg> Getting QtCreator to use it is a larger question, and something I have less visibility into.
<tedg> bregma, Well, I think it depends a lot one which of the "systemd now" vs. "systemd later" camps wins.
<bregma> well, I have a fullscreen green screen terminal, vim, and the autotools so I'm good to use Unity 8 full time as my development environment but the weaker among you will have to wait for an IDE or whatever it is kids use these days
<tedg> If we're doing systemd in the short term, clearly that's the right choice. But I'm not clear on what the timeline is there yet.
<bregma> tedg, I just want to know how many ducks I have before trying to put them all in a row
<Laney> mlankhorst: did you fix that entry level bug? :P
<mlankhorst> Laney: nope, but I did get nouveau to spew some useful debugfs info now
<tedg> bregma, I think those are the three basic rocks. Of course there are details within them.
<mlankhorst> Laney: fun part of that bug: every time I try it I get a different type of crash :(
<mlankhorst> but this might be nvc0 screwiness, do you encounter the same crash every time you try it?
<Laney> Rather not crash my system right now :(
<mlankhorst> tomorrow's fine too, just ping me please ;P
<WIlli-Smith> Hi guys, I need your help, how can I edit welcome message in terminal (Ctrl+Alt+F1), Is there any file to edit? Thanks
<mlankhorst> afk, grabbing some food
<kenvandine> Laney, have you see bug 1309015 ?  i'm wondering if your fix for bug 1306569 might have exposed this
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1309015 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "Settings crashed on updates page" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1309015
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1306569 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "Can't update clicks from store with u-s-s #287 on mako" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1306569
<kenvandine> Laney, i think it crashes when that signal should be getting emitted
<kenvandine> of course getting a retrace would be useful
<Laney> kenvandine: I saw it come in but haven't looked at it
<Laney> gatox: can you look?
<Laney> kenvandine: I don't really know the code there
<kenvandine> understand
<kenvandine> i'm just suspecting the previous bug was keeping us from hitting this crasher
<kenvandine> so fixing that might have uncovered that
<Laney> likely, click updates were quite nonfunctional before
<kenvandine> indeed
<Laney> kenvandine: maybe retrace it and assign it to gatox
<Laney> if you are able
<gatox> Laney, does this happen on the desktop too?
<kenvandine> sure
<gatox> Laney, my problem is that in the desktop i can only test it using a mock server.. i don't have a device
<Laney> I don't know how to meaningfully run the updates panel on the desktop
<kenvandine> i started to look at it, but not familiar with that code at all
<kenvandine> gatox, i hit it when i think the popover should have been fired
<kenvandine> gatox, i think it might happen when there are both click updates and system updates
<kenvandine> and it auto downloads the system update
<Trevinho> Laney: we've some important fixes to land which are ready since some days... I would have loved to do an SRU on day-0 (today), but it seems not doable, so for when can we prepare the first one?
<Trevinho> seb128: also ^
<gatox> kenvandine, i'll take a look at the code, but the auto download and some other things can not be properly reproduce on desktop
<Laney> Trevinho: you can upload it whenever and it'll get reviewed whenever ;-)
<kenvandine> gatox, yeah... not easy to confirm a fix
<Laney> Probably Tuesday at the earliest now
<Laney> make sure you have a proper SRU bug attached to it
<Laney> gatox: you should get hold of a device if you can
<Laney> speak to thostr
<Trevinho> Laney: yes, what's the plan I mean? We prepare SRU builds on CI-train as always?
<Laney> I don't know how that works
<Laney> maybe a CI train person can tell you
<Trevinho> ok
<Trevinho> Laney: this is another quite high btw https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1308850 (with the classic one-liner fix)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1308850 in Unity "Dash is visible on top of the lockscreen after screen monitor auto locks" [High,In progress]
<Laney> Maybe some SRU team people will be around tomorrow or so to help with processing stuff
<gatox> Laney, i already did, but i don't think that is going to be happen for now
<Laney> the release team kind of hands over to them after the thing is out
<Laney> there's overlap in personnel, of course
<didrocks> Laney: if you review the scope click in unapproved (just to not have it laying there for weeks) I'll answer to Trevinho! Deal? :p
 * didrocks starts a black trade market
<Trevinho> ahah ;D
 * Laney runs
<didrocks> Laney: not fast enough, caught you! :)
<didrocks> Trevinho: joke apart, just do as usual, but ensure you have bug fixes only and attach a SRU bug to it
<didrocks> Trevinho: I would advise to not diverge your branches until you introduce the first feature which will go to U
<didrocks> (we will ensure things going to trusty-updates will be copied of u)
<didrocks> and the train is looking at trusty-updates as the final destination
<didrocks> making sense?
<Trevinho> didrocks: yes, we actually prefer not to use a different branch from trunk for the next weeks since we mostly have bug-fix only things
<Trevinho> didrocks: also if they won't be all 1-line fixes, I tell you :P
<Trevinho> didrocks: but the LTS deserves them
<didrocks> Trevinho: only fixes ;)
<Trevinho> didrocks: fixes they are... :)
<seb128> Trevinho, you can land a SRU whenever you get it ready
<seb128> not sure when it's going to be reviewed/approved in the queue then
<Trevinho> seb128: ok, but now that we've the CI-train, do we need to prepare the packages on the PPA, then request the SRU with them and when approved we can upload it?
<Trevinho> seb128: or what? As before we had a different way to deploy stuff and distro was taking care of the upload as well
<Laney> The train can upload the SRU, that's what didrocks just said
<Laney> so just do it as new-normal
<bregma> Trevinho, uploads are automatic but the SRUs will still need review in the queue before it can migrate out of the -proposed pocket
<bregma> as I understand it
<Trevinho> bregma: yeah, that's the same I got
<Laney> yep
<Laney> they often don't have the fastest turnaround so there might be increased silo pressure ...
<Laney> we'll see
<bregma> once we shift aways from landing everything in trunk, it gets murkier
<didrocks> Laney: I can do the double copy trick
<didrocks> let's see how it goes
<Laney> these updates sound important enough to be done quickly anyway
<didrocks> yeah
<bregma> either we'd need to do old-fasioned dput upploads or ci-train would need to evolve
<Laney> ci bullet train
<bregma> one bullet
<Laney> nah, ci tgv
<Trevinho> lol
<Laney> then i'd get to hear their cool jingle every day
<didrocks> ta ta' TA
<ogra_> didrocks, can you record that ? i want that as my alarm sound for the landing meeting :)
<didrocks> ogra_: ahah, sure!
<davmor2> mvo_: oh I like apt list I'll keep that :)
<mvo_> davmor2: :) great to hear
<mvo_> davmor2: I hope I can smugle in tab completion via a SRU for apt and its new commands
<davmor2> mvo_: let me file a bug to say it's missing then it's not a feature it's a bug fix right :D
<mvo_> davmor2: haha, true!
<davmor2> mvo_: pressie https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apt/+bug/1309141
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1309141 in apt (Ubuntu) "Apt is missing tab complete on things like list search etc" [Undecided,New]
<mvo_> davmor2: very nice, thank you
<sarnold> Sweetshark: the trusty release notes say libreoffice now has "document search for left-to-right languages " -- should that be right-to-left? searching in ltr languages seems like something that would have worked two decades ago :)
<Laney> haha! seb128 did one more upload than me this cycle
<stgraber> Laney: where are the stats again? I thought I had bookmarked that one. (expecting to be pretty far behind this cycle... didn't upload much)
<Laney> oh I was querying UDD
<stgraber> ah ok, I remember someone had a fancy page with graphs at one point
<Laney> but you're right, there are some graphs
<Laney> tumbleweed made it
<Laney> stgraber: http://people.ubuntuwire.org/~stefanor/ubuntu-activity/
<stgraber> that's the one
<Laney> xnox uploaded a lot
<stgraber> oh yeah, he probably should be top uploader or something considering he's twice in the top10 :)
<Laney> indeed
<sarnold> :)
<xnox> =) stgraber, Laney, and all of us have a few things in the "daily release" slice of the pie as well.
<Laney> yeah that's harder to get data out of
<stgraber> xnox: that's what you get for changing your name ;)
<xnox> stgraber: i know. =) i've tried bribing stefanor, but alas he didn't twiddle the script for the name change.
<xnox> mvo is quite high up, given how little time he invested =)
<sarnold> hunh, which dialog box did I just interact with?
<Laney> I suck at sql
<Laney> was trying to make a combined xnox report but I can't get the results to merge
<sarnold> it popped up and stole focus just as I hit <enter> in irc...
<Laney> erk
<Laney> ah there, I had group by wrong
<Laney> http://udd.debian.org/~laney/xnox.txt
<xnox> Laney: nice =)
<sarnold> .. now if only we could get Dimitri and Dmitrijs to work together, just imagine what we could do..
<Sweetshark> sarnold: thanks, fixed
<sarnold> Sweetshark: thanks :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-04-18
<kieppie> howdy. anyone home?
<kieppie> hello?
<attente> Trevinho: hi, thanks for the first review. i made the fixes you suggested except for removing the goto's. i'm hoping we can keep them as they are since removing them would end up duplicating the same code another ~5 or so times
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-04-19
<xnox> what's the gnome/gtk plan for U.U.? 3.12?
 * xnox wants new gnome-terminal =)
<xnox> although it looks like gnome-terminal might compile just fine on top of 3.10.
<xnox> nah, needs vte3 from experimental =(
<Laney> Not unless the bash/new tab thing has been resolved
<Laney> you were going to talk to doko about that :-)
<xnox> Laney: not sure i'm on the ball about that one. What's up with bash/new-tab?
<Laney> we discussed it at the sprint
<Laney> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=706065
<ubot2> Debian bug 706065 in libvte-2.90-common "libvte-2.90-common: /etc/profile.d/vte.sh is not sourced by interactive shells" [Normal,Open]
<Laney> see the blocking bug
<xnox> Laney: oh yeah, that.
<xnox> i was meant to NMU to debian that.
<xnox> will poke doko about it, once we are all back at work.
<Laney> ex-ce-llent
<Mirv> I guess this Easter gets spent in getting 14.04 to do what I want :)
<Mirv> bug #1280665 here, luckily there's a patch for that
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1280665 in libsdl1.2 (Ubuntu) "libsdl1.2 always uses backingstore which causes tearing in modern X servers" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1280665
<Mirv> it seems useful to upgrade a completely non-work machine, different use cases and different bugs
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-04-20
<jinal> Hello .. Where can I get more information about the Gnome3 PPAs? Specifically, ppa:gnome3-team/gnome3 says it has Gnome 3.12 packages for Trusty , but I only see a handful of packages. Is it being worked on in the staging ppa?
<jinal> What is the latest stable (tested) version of Gnome i can get on UbuntuGnome 14.04 LTS and using which PPA?
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-04-13
<larsu> good morning!
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<didrocks> re seb128
<seb128> hey didrocks :-)
<willcooke> morning
<didrocks> happy Monday willcooke!
<FJKong> seb128: hey seb
<FJKong> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntukylin/+bug/1380981  which team maintain this ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1380981 in Ubuntu Kylin "In UEFI mode, default langauge in Ubiquity language chooser is not Simplified Chinese" [Critical,New]
<willcooke> Cr crashing on startup again :/
 * willcooke runs in debug mode
<willcooke> hey FJKong, didrocks
<FJKong> willcooke: morning
<didrocks> FJKong: foundation team is maintaining ubiquity, you should poke cyphermox I guess
<FJKong> didrocks: ok thanks
<willcooke> didrocks, I caught a sigsegv in Cr start up in gdb - what do I do now?  Just type "bt"?
<darkxst> willcooke, "t a a bt" is usually the best
<didrocks> willcooke: thread apply all
<didrocks> and then bt full
<didrocks> which is "t a a bt" equivalent (but easier to remember IMHO with the full semantic)
<willcooke> thx didrocks
<darkxst> didrocks, I find that theory to fall over, since sometimes you need 2-3 letters to disambiguate the commands ;(
<darkxst> and I don't really wanna be typing the full things
<seb128> FJKong, hey, what didrocks said
<FJKong> seb128: yp I will ping him
<willcooke> didrocks, how do I save this to a file to upload to LP?
<didrocks> willcooke: before typing bt full:
<didrocks> set logging on
<didrocks> bt full
<didrocks> set logging off
<didrocks> -> this will save in gdb.txt in your current dir
<willcooke> didrocks, can I do that "bt full" after I've done a "t a a bt" - will all the information still be correct?
<didrocks> willcooke: sure, it will keep the same state
<willcooke> didrocks, great, thanks very much
<didrocks> yw!
<seb128> bah
 * seb128 gives the look to https://launchpadlibrarian.net/202763833/buildlog_ubuntu-vivid-amd64.xdg-user-dirs_0.15-2ubuntu3_BUILDING.txt.gz
<seb128> it's building locally and in a pbuilder
<seb128> no f clue what's wrong :-/
 * didrocks is having "fun" as well with python_distutils & python3
<Laney> seb128: fails for me in sbuild
<Laney> indeed there is no po/aa.po
<seb128> Laney, shrug
<seb128> but it's in the launchpad_translation_export patch
<seb128> and it's there when I apt-get source
 * seb128 doesn't get it
<Laney> haha
<Laney> that patch is bugged
<seb128> ?
<seb128> wfm
<Laney> http://paste.ubuntu.com/10814554/
<didrocks> yeah, no aa.po in the patch
<seb128> ?
<Laney> no po/
<didrocks> seb128: some are in the <root>/
<seb128> $ patch -p1 < debian/patches/launchpad_translation_export.patch
<seb128> patching file aa.po
<Laney> not po/aa.po
<didrocks> xdg-user-dirs-0.15/aa.po
<seb128> grumpf
<seb128> why does it build in a pbuilder?
<seb128> or locally
<Laney> nfi
<Laney> but mv *.po po/ makes it build for me
<seb128> thanks, let me fix that
<seb128> apt-get source xdg-user-dirs
<seb128> cd xdg-user-dirs-0.15
<seb128> $ ls po
<seb128> aa.po               en_CA.po           kk.po           quot.sed
<seb128> go figure...
<seb128> grrrr
<seb128> k, that's the old version because I don't have a deb-src for proposed
<seb128> Laney, didrocks, thanks
<Laney> haha
<didrocks> ahah, no worry! :)
<Laney> bad release team for approving that
<didrocks> those guysâ¦
<Laney> cowboys
<willcooke> Working at home for years, yet only today do I consider slicing my sandwich diagonally
<willcooke> It's the future.
<willcooke> (abuse of position) qengho, I just logged this:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/chromium-browser/+bug/1443395
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1443395 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "Chromium crashes on start up when opening second profile" [Undecided,New]
<davmor2> willcooke: what you need good sir is a sandwich toaster it cuts it like that automagically and turns the contents of the sandwich into molten Lava ;)
<willcooke> davmor2, Ohhhhh!  I loves me a toasted sandwhich!  I don't think I'd be able to stop eating them
<willcooke> *sandwich
<willcooke> As I've always said, if you want your sandwich to be taken seriously it really needs to slightly resemble a shell
<qengho> willcooke: eh? Weird.Are any processes eating CPU time then?
<willcooke> qengho, strangely - gnome keyring (which I saw another report about)
<qengho> qengho: ah ah ah. I know what that is.
<willcooke> qengho, once I've got over that initial issue - it seems to be fine all day, then switch off and back on - and /sometimes/ the problem comes back
<qengho> willcooke: Cr wants to cache all the keys to use in auth. Know the pop-up name, address, password form completion? It doesn't ask gnome-keyring for a match on every form key-press. It constructs a list at startup. The IO is too hard on gnome-keyring. I'll try to back it off.
<willcooke> ah, nice one!
<willcooke> thx qengho
<seb128> willcooke, qengho, that's https://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=98601 right?
<willcooke> hrm, could be
<qengho> Yes, that's the one, seb128.
<seb128> k
<desrt> willcooke: new launch today, btw :)
<willcooke> desrt, ooooh!!  Feed?
 * willcooke googles
<desrt> it's at 16h30 EST if the weather holds out
<flexiondotorg> Does, what will become Unity 8, require a compositor?
<desrt> flexiondotorg: it has its own compositor built-in
<desrt> there is no uncomposited mode under mir
<seb128> hey desrt
<flexiondotorg> desrt, OK. Understood.
<desrt> hi seb :)
<flexiondotorg> desrt, Does it has a software compositor fallback or require a GPU?
<desrt> i'm sure it would be able to use llvmpipe
<flexiondotorg> desrt, Thanks.
<seb128> bug #1118903
<ubot5> bug 1118903 in Mir "[enhancement] Mir lacks a software rendering backend" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1118903
<flexiondotorg> seb128, Thanks.
<seb128> yw!
<seb128> hey pitti, had a good trip? didn't wake up too early?
<ogra_> melatonin FTW !
<pitti> bonjour tout le monde !
<pitti> hey seb128
<didrocks> mterry is closing a Quickly blueprint for 13.04
<didrocks> bonjour pitti !
<pitti> seb128: well, I woke up several times on Sunday and stopped sleeping at 4:30, today at 5:15, so progress!
<pitti> bonjour didrocks !
<pitti> alors, beaucoup de temps pour du travail et courier
<seb128> pitti, c'est tÃ´t ! :-(
<didrocks> en parlant de courir, c'est l'heure !
<pitti> didrocks: :) enjoy!
<didrocks> pitti: thanks, hope the coffee will keep you awake :)
<seb128> didrocks, enjoy
<pitti> didrocks: je ne bois pas du cafÃ© :)
<pitti> didrocks: mais je me sense d'accord
<seb128> kenvandine, do you have any clue about the issue with the updates panel loading?
<seb128> or just doing random debug poking to try to get some idea about it?
<kenvandine> seb128, i have a branch that seems to randomly fix it :)
<kenvandine> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/ubuntu-system-settings/lp1438633/view/head:/plugins/about/PageComponent.qml
<seb128> kenvandine, doing what? having a sleep(1) in the loader? ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, i can't reproduce it with that
<kenvandine> no...
<kenvandine> just setting a variable from the getByName call
<kenvandine> instead of doing it inline
<seb128> kenvandine, I saw that diff, it's what made me ping you
<kenvandine> i was just doing that to get some debug output
<seb128> but I didn't see  a change, just console.warn calls
<kenvandine> and now i can't reproduce it :/
<seb128> right
<seb128> maybe timing
<kenvandine> i reverted it
<kenvandine> and reproduced it again
<seb128> like you slowed down things?
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> must be racy
<willcooke> Guess what this is:  http://i.imgur.com/ffoKyoT.png
<willcooke> popey, ^^
<willcooke> anyone ^^^
<Laney> places where your stolen garden gnome has been photographed
<willcooke> The garden gnomes bit is correct
<popey> :)
<willcooke> I hacked up a script which took the city date from the directory and geo coded it and stuck it on a map
<willcooke> Poor show Kazakh Ubuntu fans - apply for more jobs at Canonical
<qengho> We need more Africans.
<willcooke> yes
<desrt> nearly all of our africans are europeans
<Laney> the #1 guy is african, it's all good
<desrt> (Canaries and RÃ©union)
<didrocks> nobody react to have been treated of gnome? :p
 * desrt has no objection to being called a gnome :)
<willcooke> :D
<seb128> cyphermox, hey
<cyphermox> hey!
<cyphermox> seb128: how are you?
<seb128> cyphermox, did you see my mention that the nm-applet segfault seems not fixed?
<cyphermox> I did
<seb128> cyphermox, I'm good, thanks! How are you?
<cyphermox> not too bad
<cyphermox> i thought I had answered it was going to take more work, it should have been fine
<seb128> cyphermox, should upstream it, maybe they have a clue about the issue and fix it (then we can backport the patch)
<cyphermox> yeah, should be upstreamed
<seb128> cyphermox, can you do it? ;-)
<cyphermox> ...
<seb128> lol
<cyphermox> I guess I can spend the extra 2 minutes to do it, yes ;)
<cyphermox> where is that bug again?
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks, it's more that you know upstream/n-m better so you might be more suited to deal with followups than me
<seb128> cyphermox, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-applet/+bug/1418260
<ubot5> Error: ubuntu bug 1418260 not found
<cyphermox> ta
<seb128> cyphermox, https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1181128 is a fedora equivalent if you want to show upstream that it's not Ubuntu specific
<ubot5> bugzilla.redhat.com bug 1181128 in network-manager-applet "[abrt] network-manager-applet: add_menu_item(): nm-applet killed by SIGSEGV" [Unspecified,New]
<seb128> cyphermox, yw!
<seb128> happyaron, what's the status on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ibus/+bug/1439202 ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1439202 in ibus (Ubuntu) "/usr/lib/ibus/ibus-ui-gtk3:11:XKeysymToKeycode:keybinding_manager_bind:panel_keybinding_manager_bind:panel_bind_switch_shortcut:panel_construct" [High,Confirmed]
<seb128> ted, hey, do you have any idea what https://errors.ubuntu.com/problem/45a450ff9d534458de5666d47abe150801af4041 is about?
<seb128> indicator-session-unknown-user-error in upstart, seems like a weird report
<seb128> is that a recoverable error or something?
<ted> seb128, Give me a minute, OTP.
<seb128> ted, sure, no hurry
<Laney> desrt: dconf-editor's COPYING says LGPL 2.1 but about says GPL 2+ --- who wins? :)
<Laney> hi, btw!
<seb128> TheMuso, hey, could you look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/1425447 (not sure if you saw the bug assignment/comments)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1425447 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "pulseaudio crashed with SIGABRT in core_free() at login" [High,Confirmed]
<ted> seb128, Yeah, seems to be a recoverable error, I think that charles_ made it.
<ted> seb128, Seems like were getting a uid of zero in there...
<ted> charles_, An instance: https://errors.ubuntu.com/oops/a0a947c0-e1d6-11e4-9f12-fa163e75317b
<seb128> indeed
 * charles_ looks
<seb128> charles_, ted, bug #1443502 (not sure why e.u.c thinks it's an "upstart" bug?)
<ubot5> bug 1443502 in upstart (Ubuntu) "indicator-session-unknown-user-error" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1443502
<ted> seb128, It's probably because it happens when i-session is shutting down, so by the time apport gets to getting the PID information it is no longer existing, so it reports on the parent.
<seb128> k
<seb128> charles, ted, oh, another one for you (and then I stop the nagging for today ;-) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-sound/+bug/1432446 ... seems like the handling of missing session bus is incomplete
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1432446 in indicator-sound (Ubuntu) "indicator-sound-service crashed with signal 5 in indicator_sound_service_construct()" [Medium,Confirmed]
<desrt> Laney: uhm... about, i guess
<desrt> Laney: COPYING is probably because dconf itself was lgpl and i forgot to change that
<Laney> ya, figured
<Laney> merci
 * Laney loves writing debian/copyright
<ted> seb128, I think that charles already has that on his TODO
<seb128> k
<seb128> larsu, Laney, was the "gedit underline errors" issues supposed to be fixed? it does underline those in light grey here, it's almost not visible
<Laney> yes, works here
<seb128> I wonder if I need a session restart?
<seb128> brb
<Laney> do you have the latest light-themes?
<charles> seb128, ted, ack, I even got a card for it added to this sprint
<seb128> charles, great, thanks
<charles> (as of about 30 minutes ago)
<seb128> Laney, larsu, sorry, seems like I didn't get the ubuntu-themes update when I updated earlier for some reason
<Laney> at least it's an easy fix :P
<seb128> ;-)
<Laney> unpacking ubuntu-docs always kills my SSD
<happyaron> seb128: is looking at it now
<seb128> happyaron, thanks
<happyaron> seb128: possibly it will be tomorrow to give a treatment..
<seb128> happyaron, sure, that's not an issue
<didrocks> see you tomorrow guys
<larsu> seb128: sorry was out for early dinner and looking at an appartment. Seems the issue solved itself though?
<seb128> larsu, it is yes, thanks
<larsu> :)
<desrt> damnit
<desrt> another scrub :(
<desrt> evil weather
<TheMuso> seb128: I have asked upstream about whether those crashers already are patched post 6.0. If I'm told they are not, I will be filing them upstream and tagging he launchpad bugs appropriately.
<TheMuso> ugy, I wish my client would not tab complete if the person wasn't online. :S
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-04-14
<larsu> good morning!
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> hey didrocks & desktopers
<didrocks> re seb128
<willcooke> morning
<didrocks> good morning willcooke
<larsu> hi willcooke!
<seb128> willcooke, hey
<darkxst> hey seb128 didrocks
<darkxst> user-setup package is forked in ubuntu?
<didrocks> darkxst: hey, what do you mean by forked? version is 1.48ubuntu3, so yeah, not in sync with debian
<didrocks> (only used in xubuntu apparently)
<darkxst> didrocks, it is setting gdm Auto login
<darkxst> and TimedLogin which we don't want
<darkxst> but that code seems non-existant in debian
<seb128> hey
<darkxst> bug 1412791
<ubot5> bug 1412791 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "automatic login configured in ubiquity cannot be disabled by gnome-control-center" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1412791
<didrocks>     - Add preseedable passwd/auto-login question; if set to true, configure
<didrocks>       gdm, kdm, lxdm, and lightdm for automatic login.  Add
<didrocks>       passwd/auto-login-backup question which backs up the previous contents
<didrocks>       of the files as well.
<didrocks> darkxst: ^
<darkxst> didrocks lp:~darkxst/user-setup/noTimedLogin
<didrocks> darkxst: sounds better for the foundation team to have a look, they did all changes to it and own ubiquity
<didrocks> so I guess they would have a better knowledge of the impacts
<didrocks> also, referencing the bug in the changelog + MP would help them
<didrocks> (even if it seems you are the only one impacted as the change is in a gdm section, better to double check with them for unseen impacts)
<darkxst> didrocks, this is why I am condfused, that code does not exist in the debian package there is nothing setting AutoLogin there
<didrocks> darkxst: it's been a long time I didn't use DI, but I'm not even sure they have an option for setting autologin during install
<darkxst> and debian changelog doesnt have any notable changes apart from a few fixes and translations
<darkxst> (since 1.48)
<didrocks> my bet is that this change is only for ubiquity
<didrocks> but I may be wrong
<didrocks> (maybe maas as well?)
<darkxst> didrocks, but then why is ubuntu patching upstream code if its not a fork?
<darkxst> I suppose I should ask cjwatson
<didrocks> right
<Laney> hullo
<Laney> bloody suspend failures
<darkxst> hey Laney
<Laney> resume*
<didrocks> morning Laney
<Laney> hi darkxst didrocks
<Laney> what's upski
<darkxst> Laney, just silly installer bugs
<willcooke> supposed to be getting upgraded to fibre today - so might disappear offline for a while at some point.
<seb128> hey Laney
<willcooke> That said, I'm dealing with Open Reach, so it's equally likely that nothing will happen at all
<didrocks> willcooke: well, when I switched recently, got some surprised (like not plug the day it should have been, and "magically" fixed without any interventions and things like that
<didrocks> willcooke: btw, before you disappear, meeting reminder email? :)
<seb128> didrocks is not forgetting about business :-)
<didrocks> never *ever*
<willcooke> :D:D
<larsu> didrocks: maybe we should start writing reminder emails for the reminder emails?
<larsu> I can remind you about doing that every Tuesday morning if you wish
<didrocks> inception!
<larsu> not deep enough yet
<didrocks> larsu: TBH, for a while, I was always reminding seb128 about the reminder email
<didrocks> so we went already there :p
<larsu> I might forget reminding you though... seb128, do you mind reminding me?
<larsu> (about reminding didrocks to remind willcooke to send the meeting reminder to us all)
<didrocks> larsu: be careful to not create deadlocks though!
<willcooke> seb128, I'll write a script to email you a reminder
<larsu> didrocks: HAHA
<Laney> we need a 7 person chain
<larsu> willcooke: wait..........
<willcooke> ????
<Laney> "good morning, remember to remind <person> tomorrow"
 * larsu has a feelin we're circular now
<larsu> Laney: $PERSON
<didrocks> yeah, I bet we should change our dependency strategy
<larsu> what is this? html?
<Laney> %s, person
<didrocks> and for tests, we need to add mocks
<larsu> Laney: that's good as well :)
<didrocks> so time for dependency injection
 * davmor2 remembers to remind Laney tomorrow no idea of what but I'll remind him damn it
<Laney> remind me to finish that last bit of easter egg
<Laney> HAHA as if i'll need reminding
<larsu> lol
<willcooke> seb128, guess what...
<willcooke> I have a meeting with the browser folk at 15030 UTC
<willcooke> to talk about stuff from the product sprint in LDN the other week
<willcooke> I can probably manage to run an IRC meeting and do a hangout at the same time though.
<willcooke> just fyi
<seb128> willcooke, I'm happy to lead the meeting
<seb128> you can still be around and ask questions and stuff as well
<willcooke> seb128, let's see how it goes...
<willcooke> thx
<seb128> but at least if you need to focus on your hangout it doesn't create gaps on IRC
<seb128> yw
<Laney> seb128 / larsu: I see unity-greeter in the upload queue ;-)
<seb128> Laney, great!
<Laney> thanks for reminding!
<larsu> \o/
<seb128> yw!
<ochosi> hey guys
<ochosi> so did you resolve that menu-shadow problem in gtk3 in the end?
<larsu> ochosi: yep, thanks to Laney :)
<ochosi> good :)
<Laney> so shady
<Laney> nice and cool under those menus now
<ochosi> haha
<ochosi> yeah, "summer is coming" ;)
<bregma> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1443774 sound like a GTK+ bug, ja?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1443774 in unity (Ubuntu) "Horizontal scrolling is backwards" [Undecided,New]
<larsu> bregma: that's probably an issue with gtk's natural scrolling
<larsu> and I guess this is the fix? https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?id=f34ecab28f94bd36dc8201b4f81c6b290806195e
<larsu> hm probably not, we already have that fix
<larsu> ah it is that commit, but it breaks it
<happyaron> willcooke: sent you my updates just now
<seb128> happyaron, hey, how is that ibus issue going?
<willcooke> thx happyaron
<happyaron> seb128: seems something wrong in glib, there's many crash in ibus that trace down to glib...
<happyaron> seb128: atm working on striping python2 from its dependency, and will come back to that crash later
<seb128> happyaron, python2 is not a priority for vivid, we should rather focus on the segfaults
<seb128> happyaron, are you sure it's not just incorrect glib use in ibus?
<happyaron> not very sure yet
<happyaron> well, doko kicked me on that python2 issue earlier, and it's easy to fix, doing testing right now
<seb128> k
<davmor2> why is menus being displayed with Alt Gr  how are you meant to get special characters now?
<ogra_> you press prt-scrn with your right big toe while pressing AltGr with your left index finger ... then you cast the maic spell and it will appear
<ogra_> *magic
<davmor2> ogra_: no you don't now I'm going to have to beat you
<ogra_> did you try ?
<davmor2> ogra_: yes
<ogra_> probably you didnt pronounce the spell in the right tune
<davmor2> ogra_: I'm still closing the gnome-screenshot widows
<pitti> Good morning!
<didrocks> hey pitti :)
<didrocks> slept longer today?
<pitti> didrocks: 5:30, was quite okay
<pitti> like my normal time at home :)
<didrocks> heh, in a way, indeed :)
<seb128> pitti, hey, happy birthday!
<pitti> seb128: merci beaucoup !
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: my parents gave me a tandem parachute jump; apparently 35 is enough :-P
<didrocks> waow, sounds nice (and scary)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> do you plan to do it?
 * seb128 is not sure he would
<Laney> hey pitti, happy birthday!
<Laney> that sounds like fun
<pitti> Laney: thanks! I'm sure it will be, after I made it through the door :)
<Laney> being strapped to an expert should be quite reassuring :P
<pitti> I might need a motivational push to jump out of a perfectly working plane, but I'm looking forward to it -- it's going to be exciting
<larsu> pitti: happy birthday!
<pitti> larsu: danke!
 * ogra_ hugs pitti 
<ogra_> HAPPY BÃÃÃRSDAI !!
<pitti> hey ogra_, danke!
<mdeslaur> pitti: happy birthday! :)
<willcooke> I'm going to have to go 3g until I can fix it
<willcooke> oops, seb128 ^^
<seb128> willcooke, no worry
<pitti> mdeslaur: merci !
<seb128> bah, hidpi is annoying
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1443767
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1443767 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "The installation window was not shown completely with vivid-desktop-amd64-20150408 on hidpi laptop" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> scaling kicks in on a "2560x1440" monitor
<seb128> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/203188946/301.jpg that looks wrong
<ogra_> seb128, well, does that monitor actually run at that resolution ?
 * ogra_ highly doubts it
<seb128> ogra_, seems so
<seb128> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/203214891/2560x1440.jpg
<ogra_> wow
<Laney> that sucks
<davmor2> ogra_: ha figured it out thanks pipe symbol.  After the reboot from the update the keyboard was set to us layout even though the only option was en_GB D'oh
<davmor2> ogra_: now AltGr is working again
<willcooke> seb128, am I really here?
<Laney> that's a deep question
<seb128> willcooke, yes
<didrocks> hard to answer, indeedâ¦ :)
<willcooke> progress
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> hum, it's meeting time?
<didrocks> yep!
<seb128> attente, desrt, dgadomski, didrocks, FJKong, larsu, qengho, Sweet5hark, hey
<seb128> #startmeeting
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Apr 14 15:32:05 2015 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
<seb128> not forgetting the bot this time!
 * Sweet5hark reporting in
<dgadomski> hey o/
<attente> hi
<seb128> let's get started
<seb128> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: attente
<seb128> attente, hey
<willcooke> qengho, can you come to the oxide meeting?
<qengho> yes. I thought I was in it!
<willcooke> qengho, will send you a HI link
<willcooke> HO
<willcooke> qengho, oh - I see you :)
<attente> trying to write a service that should allow us to switch between input method frameworks without restarting the session
<attente> gtk already includes some support, but not sure if it'll work under unity8 since we don't have u-s-d there
<attente> for qt4 and qt5, we'll have to write a proxy input method plugin to forward to the active framework
<qengho> willcooke: I have two invitations. Wrong one.
<seb128> attente, hum, did you talk to anyone about the service?
<seb128> it might be a good idea to have other people participating to the conversation so we do something that is futur proof
<attente> seb128: not yet, but i'm pretty sure we're going to need it at some point if we want to be able to switch between maliit and ibus/fcitx
<attente> especially because of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/maliit-framework/+bug/1245925
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1245925 in maliit-framework (Ubuntu) "Troublesome export in /etc/profile.d/maliit-framework.sh" [Undecided,Triaged]
<seb128> attente, right, just saying that we should have the conversaiton in front
<seb128> otherwise we risk having a design that doesn't accomodate all needs and to have to throw away and start again
<seb128> which would be a waste
<seb128> anyway, let's get moving
<seb128> attente, thanks
<seb128> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: desrt
<attente> sure
<seb128> desrt, hey
<desrt> hey
<seb128> desrt, weekly summary?
<desrt> had a pretty unproductive week -- spent some time at the doctor
<desrt> but i managed to get to the bottom of the text/plain fallback class of bugs
<desrt> currently rewriting a bit of the code there to avoid some extra memory allocations (and get rid of the remaining leak)
<desrt> should be done today
<desrt> also continued work on the no-polling-with-inotify-missing-files stuff
<desrt> still not feeling 100%, but am quite a bit better, so hopefully next week will be a bit more productive :p
<desrt> (end)
<seb128> desrt, hope you recover fully soon!:
<seb128> desrt, is the mimetype fix something we might be able to backport to vivid/for stable?
<desrt> yes
<seb128> great
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<seb128> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: dgadomski
<seb128> dgadomski, hey
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> * bug #445333 fixed, the user is super happy! Thanks! Side note - the bug has been out there since 2009 :)
<ubot5> bug 445333 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu Trusty) "remember password on printing to windows printers does not work" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/445333
<dgadomski> * SRU complete, bug #1020210 fixed for precise
<ubot5> bug 1020210 in eglibc "Race condition using ATOMIC_FASTBINS in _int_free causes crash or heap corruption" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1020210
<dgadomski> * there is a user experiencing weird Evolution crashes related to some specific content, although there are no crashdumps after them. Looks like Evolution is not using any non-standard, so I am expecting crashdumps from apport to be present in /var/crash. Is that right?
<seb128> dgadomski, sorry it took a while on that gtk/printer bug, thanks for the work and persevering to get it SRUed
<dgadomski> seb128: it was quite a change for SRU, so I'm happy that it got through at all :)
<seb128> dgadomski, apport should trigger yes, not sure why it doesn't ... if the user can reproduce get him to use gdb?
<dgadomski> seb128: I asked him to do that, waiting for feedback
<seb128> k
<seb128> dgadomski, thanks
<dgadomski> and one more thing:
<dgadomski> * a problem related to printing from Evince. User's setup: remote cups printer connected to a prorietary Unix server, Ubuntu workstation. The problem is about sending username to cups. The username is not used for authentication, the user just needs it to be printed on every sheet to identify who the printout belongs to. So it works as expected for any other gtk3 application (e.g. gedit, evolution), but fails for Evince. I will take a lo
<dgadomski> ok into the code to check out how it does handle printing. Ccan you recommend anybody that has the knowledge in the Evince area? Just in case.
<seb128> sure :-)
<seb128> nobody specific for that issue
<seb128> just ask on the channel I think, a bunch of us can help you
<dgadomski> seb128: great, thanks, I'll file a bug for discussion as soon as I will get an overview of what is going on there
<dgadomski> that's it from me, thanks
<seb128> thanks dgadomski
<seb128> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, hey
<didrocks> hey
<didrocks> ubuntu make:
<didrocks>  - default install path discussions
<didrocks>  - last turn of bug triaging before vivid release, nothing big needing a last minute upload
<didrocks> systemd:
<didrocks>  - systemd fsckd discussion (again) on the upstream ML. Will be kicked off soon, so prepared for this and sanitize the set of patchs in few ones, adapt to v219 and add the last patch which has never been peer-reviewed upstream changing the way fsckd/fsck/plymouth connect to each other (fewer messages and socket chains)
<didrocks>  - add some more fixes to have systemd autopkgtest being independent of lightdm failures (fix flacky tests). Ensure that fsck autopkgtests still work with this.
<didrocks>  - xdiagnose fix to ensure people shooting in their feet by removing the display manager but still booting to graphical target gets a system booting (bug #1441883)
<ubot5> bug 1441883 in xdiagnose (Ubuntu) "15.04 Vivid Vervet won't boot after uninstalling lightdm" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1441883
<didrocks> misc:
<didrocks>  - port gconf (debian scripts), webapps-applications and xdiagnose to python3
<didrocks>  - wrote some thoughts about converged desktop
<didrocks>  - help/discuss/sponsor larsu's work on gtk3/g-t handling backward compatible (thanks!)
<didrocks>  - patch pilot followup with sponsorees
<didrocks> .
<seb128> didrocks, sorry about how the systemd/fsckd thing went :-/
<desrt> :(
<didrocks> seb128: well, seeing how another thread on fsck is happening on systemd, I feel not alone at least
<seb128> yeah
 * larsu met the systemd guys on a bridge yesterday
<larsu> like, all of the rh ones
<didrocks> and I avoided harsh words on my thread, contrary to the other ones :)
<larsu> should've said something :)
<desrt> larsu: or pushed them in the water :)
<didrocks> larsu: well, seems they made their mind, no worry
<seb128> didrocks, staying class for the win :-)
<larsu> desrt: that's mean (and impossible)
<didrocks> but yeah "fsck is a thing of a past", not sure I agree with this
<didrocks> the*
<larsu> because btrfs!!!!!1!
<seb128> larsu, should have told them to proxy buy you a beer for poor didrocks!
<larsu> seb128: haha yeah
<didrocks> ;)
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> anyway
<seb128> didrocks, thanks!
<didrocks> yw!
<larsu> seb128: just met them while walking the other direction and said hi real quick
<Sweet5hark> hrhr
<seb128> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: FJKong
<seb128> FJKong, hey
<FJKong> hey
<FJKong> * sogou IM new version realease testing, core dump file analyzing
<FJKong> * learn sample of vala-sqlite for create a scope
<FJKong> * track with bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntukylin/+bug/1380981
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1380981 in Ubuntu Kylin "In UEFI mode, default langauge in Ubiquity language chooser is not Simplified Chinese" [Critical,New]
<FJKong> * go to visa office  submit the material and interview
<FJKong> * Beijing Office Gathering - Invited by Jon
<FJKong> .
<FJKong> EOF
<seb128> FJKong, thanks
<seb128> #topic larsu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: larsu
<seb128> larsu, hey
<larsu> hi
<larsu> not a lot from me. Worked on gtk and theming bugs this week
<larsu> and plan to do that for the rest of the week as well
<larsu> (including some triage)
<larsu> like the --class thing,gedit underlines, long discussion about horizontal scrolling, etc
<larsu> also some flight booking and sneezing (got sick again :( )
<larsu> fin.
<seb128> I saw you triaged some gtk buygs, thanks for doing that ;-)
<seb128> hope you shake out the bugs before London!
<larsu> seb128: got distracted right after I started unfortunately
<seb128> larsu, thanks
<larsu> seb128: but got to close upstream ones as well in the procrss
<seb128> good :-)
<seb128> ok, next is...
<seb128> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: qengho
<seb128> qengho, hey, there or in that meeting?
<qengho> Both.
<qengho> - in progress: updating flash player for PES, merging two packages.
<qengho> - in progress: convergence mobile-desktop handoff and SNNS file parsing.
<qengho> - stalled: chromium update for precise
<qengho> EOF
<seb128> qengho, thanks
<seb128> #topic Sweet5hark
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Sweet5hark
<seb128> Sweet5hark, hey
<Sweet5hark> heya
<Sweet5hark> - snappy stuff -- FWIW, I think I need some talk time about that in London ;)
<Sweet5hark> - backport verification
<Sweet5hark> - prepared LibreOffice 4.3.7~rc1 for PPA
<Sweet5hark> - upstream refactoring for the next release, killed 1000 LOC convulted C++ production code so far (out of a 5100 LOC file), not quite there yet with adding 1000 LOC of test code in return ...
<Sweet5hark> - quarterly reports, annual reports, budgeting (ugh)
<Sweet5hark> EOF
<seb128> re. snappy, London is going to be a good time to talk about, I think it's going to be a topic for several discussions
<seb128> Sweet5hark, thanks
<Sweet5hark> seb128: great!
<seb128> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: seb128
<seb128> â¢ helped to SRU a unity-control-center fix to trusty
<seb128> â¢ changed unity-settings-daemon to not do hidpi scaling on the greeter, unity-greeter is having issue with that that needs to be resolved first
<seb128> â¢ reviewed/landed vivid fixes to unity-control-center
<seb128> â¢ sponsored libreoffice update
<seb128> â¢ backported gnome-font-viewer segfault bugfix
<seb128> â¢ change bluez to restart the bluetoothd service on errors
<seb128> â¢ updated translations in xdg-user-dirs and language-selector for vivid
<seb128> â¢ ubuntu-system-settings
<seb128> â looked a bit at some issue with the clicks listed in storage and upgrades
<seb128> â fixed issue where the discharge graph would start with a spike
<seb128> â investigated a bit wrong optionselector value in the lock settings
<seb128> â¢ some discussions about hidpi issues in ubiquity
<seb128> â¢ tried to debug data not working on the phone, turned out to be a sim issue (android having the same problems/giving as few feedback on it than we do) :-(
<seb128> â¢ quite some bugs triage (launchpad & e.u.c) for vivid, pinged people about some issues, looked at some other myself as well
<seb128> </week>
<seb128> ok, so I think that's it for people here, summaries from others now!
<seb128> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: robert_ancell
<seb128> Worked on:
<seb128> - Fix gnome-calculator FTBFS
<seb128> - Investigate snappy framework for XMir
<seb128> - Investigate DRI3 enablement for Intel driver
<seb128> - Simple Scan 3.16.1.1, 3.14.3 releases and SRUs
<seb128> - Unity Greeter 15.04.4 release
<seb128> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: TheMuso
<seb128> * Took some errors.ubuntu.com bug reports/crashers for pulseaudio upstream, and getting them looked into. Bug reports in the upstrea tracker will be added to the lp bugs once it has been determined that we do not yet have a fix that we can cherry pick from upstream.
<seb128> * Discussion with unity 7 team about some classes relating to some dash widgets, and private classes needing to be exposed publically for a11y improvement work.
<seb128> * Started looking into the best way to make sed classes be publically available for improving dash filter settings a11y.
<seb128> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Laney
<seb128> â¢ Very many queue reviews and FFe reviews
<seb128> â¢ Patch pilot, some random extra sponsoring too (adwaita-icon-theme
<seb128> upgrade robustification, an update to Debian for seb)
<seb128>  
<seb128> (hum, client seems to not like the copy spam ... let's try again)
<seb128> Laney still
<seb128> â¢ Updates: cairo  gtk+3.0 gvfs gtksourceview3
<seb128> â package new dconf and dconf-editor in exp for syncing in W
<seb128> â¢ Shadows fix in ubuntu-themes (& land this), thanks to ochosi
<seb128> â¢ Pick some stuff from the FTBFS and rls-v bug lists to fix before release - next up: proposed-migration.
<seb128> â
<seb128> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: tkamppeter
<seb128> - cups-filters: Solved the problem of the frequent crashes of cups-browsed
<seb128> - cups-filters: Upstream release of 1.0.68, especially containing the crash fix.
<seb128> - ghostscript: Applied an upstream bug fix of Ghostscript taking too long when printing DjVu files out of evince.
<seb128> - Organizational stuff for trip to Desktop Sprint and OpenPrinting Summit
<seb128> - Bugs.
<seb128> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: happyaron
<seb128> * Released sogoupinyin/1.2.0.0048
<seb128> * Ubuntu Kylin RC preparation, bug fixings and uploads
<seb128> * Kubuntu fcitx default for zh_* locales
<seb128> * Sogou Wubi preparation,
<seb128> * Contacts and preparation of Ubuntu Phone's sogoupinyin
<seb128> * Working on 1439202 and 1440391
<seb128> #topic other topics
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: other topics
<seb128> ok, updates spam done
<seb128> do we have any other topic?
<seb128> did I forget anyone?
<Laney> I made it back!
<didrocks> Laney: too late, your report was copied already :)
<larsu> Laney: a minute too late!
<Laney> oh, well, hi ;-)
<didrocks> with the unicode character, all fine!
<seb128> hey Laney
<seb128> Laney, any comment/other topic? ;-)
<Laney> nein
<seb128> ok, seems not
<Laney> final freeze is tomorrow though
<seb128> it's a wrap then, thanks everyone
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Apr 14 16:04:54 2015 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2015/ubuntu-desktop.2015-04-14-15.32.moin.txt
<seb128> oh, right
<seb128> I'm sure we forgot to fix things
<seb128> going to need some SRUs
<didrocks> thanks!
<Laney> ya like that hidpi bug
<Laney> but that needs fixes on the image
<Laney> ho hum
<Sweet5hark> oh, heh: forget the 4.4.2-0ubuntu1 bump for LibreOffice on vivid -- which was just as much work for you as for me though ...
<Sweet5hark> seb128: ^^
<seb128> Sweet5hark, :-)
<willcooke> yahhh!
<willcooke> making progress on the broadband front - I have a pppoe connection at last
<willcooke> although it seems I'm being throttled to 8mbps still, considering my sync speed is 70mbps that is rather annoying
<willcooke> latency is way down though
<willcooke> spoke too soon
<desrt> willcooke: daily launch reminder :)
<willcooke> desrt, thx!  How's the weather looking?
<desrt> 60% go
<willcooke> just off conf call in time then
<willcooke> woo
<willcooke> fingers crossed the lightning holds off
<desrt> still ~35mins to go
<willcooke> desrt, wooooaahhh
<willcooke> desrt, that was weird
<willcooke> I had the video stream open in a tab somewhere and then music just started playing out of nowhere :)
 * desrt is on nasa.tv
<willcooke> same feed as:  http://www.spacex.com/webcast/
<willcooke> I expect
<desrt> minus the groove
<willcooke> :) much more grown up
<willcooke> remind me again how nmcli is nicer than ifup
<desrt> it is? :)
<willcooke> it is not
<desrt> do you know about nmtui?
<willcooke> I do now
 * willcooke googles
<desrt> it's a reasonable compromise
<willcooke> desrt, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHIo6qwJarI
<qengho> http://livestream.com/spacex/events/3959775 ?
<willcooke> qengho, http://www.spacex.com/webcast/
<willcooke> quick!
<willcooke> 10
<willcooke> 9
<willcooke> 8
<willcooke> 87
<willcooke> gooooooo!
 * qengho counts 4 minutes now to hear the rumble.
<willcooke> :) awesome
<qengho> I miss Shuttle and its boom-boom pass overhead, but at least something new will be landing here again soon.
<desrt> ya.... now we wait to see if they can actually land it
<desrt> the real exciting part :)
<willcooke> the nasa tv feed is much more reliable
<sarnold> the youtube stream was more reeliable for me than either the nasatv or spacex feed.. https://youtu.be/csVpa25iqH0
<willcooke> thx sarnold, that is much better for me too
<duflu> desrt: Is there a function to query the active GDK backend?
<duflu> (ie. to avoid calling X11 functions that may crash if inactive)
<desrt> there may be more than one
<desrt> but in general you are probably interested in whether some particular window, screen or display is associated with a given backend
<desrt> you can just use gobject rtti for that
<desrt> like GDK_IS_X11_WINDOW() GDK_IS_X11_SCREEN() GDK_IS_X11_DISPLAY() on the object in question
<duflu> desrt: Kay, thanks. Might try
<willcooke> noooo - no landing
<qengho> Can't we pirate it somehow?!
<desrt> note that those are only available if X11 support was built, so strictly you should also #ifdef GDK_WINDOWING_X11
<desrt> willcooke: where do you get your info?
<willcooke> desrt, the man on the video told me
<desrt> ah. difference between spacex and nasa streams, i guess
<desrt> spacex stream was super unreliable for me :(
<CrazyLemon> landing failed ... just fyi
<willcooke> :(
<desrt> ya
<desrt> "Ascent successful. Dragon enroute to Space Station. Rocket landed on droneship, but too hard for survival."
<duflu> desrt: No problem. I'm in that #ifdef already :S
<willcooke> maybe next time.  g'night all
<desrt> willcooke: g'night
<qengho> FYI, the rocket hit the ship too hard again.
<duflu> desrt: Now I'm trying to build GTK minus X. Gets stuck on silly include lookups which apparently only work with the X11 backend enabled. Have you tried such a thing?
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-04-15
<tjaalton> what's up with bluez 5, why hasn't it made it in the distro yet?
<tjaalton> I know it has been discussed somewhere, just can't remember where..
<tjaalton> ah, 1162781
<didrocks> good morning
<larsu> good morning!
<willcooke> o/
<didrocks> morning willcooke
<willcooke> 65 Mbps this morning \o/
<willcooke> Hopefully it will be more stable today, but we shall see....
<willcooke> and then on Friday I've got my second line getting upgraded too
<didrocks> why do you have 2 lines, isn't one fiber enough ?
<willcooke> it was too slow in the olden days
<willcooke> plus I wanted a back up
<willcooke> it's not much more cost, maybe 20 quid a month
<willcooke> so I think I'll keep it for now
<didrocks> oh waow, indeed, quite cheap
<didrocks> what site are you using to measure your connexion speed btw? Most of ISP are usually "optimizing" path to speednet and such
<willcooke> http://speedof.me/
<didrocks> interesting, didn't know that one
<seb128> hey didrocks, willcook, desktopers
<didrocks> 281Mbps in download and 450Mbs in upload
<didrocks> re seb128
<seb128> didrocks, did you close IRC to optimize benchmarks? ;-)
<seb128> "let's not waste those 15 bytes/s" :p
<didrocks> seb128: no, I switched to rj45 instead of wifi
<didrocks> and seems we don't handle that well for opened appsâ¦
<seb128> ah, ip change :-)
<seb128> well "we" being the tcp protocol I guess
<didrocks> seb128: it's the same public ip though
<didrocks> a port change yeah
<didrocks> IIRC there is a protocol for the router to define this switch
<Laney> yo
<willcooke> morning Laney
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> howdy willcooke et seb128
<Laney> doing good!
 * Laney opens the window, a sure sign of a nice day
<Laney> you?
<seb128> same here :-)
<seb128> feels like summer!
 * larsu waves to Laney and willcooke
<larsu> sun is here now as well
<darkxst> hey seb128 Laney larsu
<seb128> hey darkxst
<darkxst> how can it be summer in bother hemispheres?
<larsu> "morning" darkxst
<darkxst> oh and hey didrocks!
<darkxst> larsu, its "evening" here! only didrocks seems to have worked that out though ;)
<larsu> darkxst: I know, that's why I put the quotes ;)
<Laney> greetings
<larsu> Laney: just a heads up, we'll need another gtk upload this week. mclasen hasn't made up his mind yesterday though. I'll annoy him again today
<larsu> this is about horizontal scrolling being broken as of 3.14.12
<Laney> i saw that bug
<Laney> might have to go to sru, we'll see
<larsu> :(
<Laney> want to take https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1444174 upstream?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1444174 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "gtk fails to build if mir backend enabled with x11 backend disabled" [Undecided,In progress]
<larsu> sure
<Laney> thx
<larsu> weird patch...
<Laney> that variable should be called something like need_gio_unix
<larsu> that, or a dependency on gio-unix-2.0 should be declared somewhere
<larsu> I can't compile at all with those configure options. "No GDK backends selected"
<larsu> oh wait. Missed a call to autogen.sh
<larsu> mir only landed in the 3.16 cycle? Interesting...
<Laney> we have this huge patch to backport it all
<larsu> hm, added on May 20 2014
<larsu> that's before 3.14, no?
<larsu> apparently not :)
<larsu> I get a different error though. Is the mir client library api stable?
<larsu> too many arguments to function 'mir_surface_set_event_handler'
<larsu> mir-backend-unmerged.patch?
<Laney> time to give it to attente ...
<larsu> even mir-backend.patch looks different from what is in gtk master
<larsu> *sigh*
<seb128> larsu, bug #1443774 is the gtk issue you were discussing yesterday right? do we have another bug we already use for the issue?
<ubot5> bug 1443774 in unity (Ubuntu) "Horizontal scrolling is backwards" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1443774
<seb128> to dup that one
<larsu> seb128: not that I'm aware of. It's the one bregma linked to yesterday as well
<larsu> seb128: the commit that breaks stuff is due to this upstream bug: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=737175
<ubot5> Gnome bug 737175 in Widget: GtkRange "most horizontal sliders are inverted when scrolled with mouse wheel" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<seb128> k
<larsu> which I can't reproduce
<seb128> larsu, I reassigned to gtk/assigned to you, feel free to unassign if that's incorrect
<larsu> but I guess this is where the confusion comes from
<larsu> seb128: that's good. I plan on nagging mclasen about it again today
<seb128> thanks
<larsu> or do you prefer a downstream patch for the release?
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey, what's the status of https://code.launchpad.net/~philpem/ubuntu/utopic/ptouch-driver/fix-for-1342979/+merge/255190 ? still wanting to do an upload for vivid?
<attente> larsu, Laney: https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?id=61f3399f980288a9a9e4b03b50dd147a8af55a8d and http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mir-team/mir/development-branch/revision/2442/include/client/mir_toolkit/mir_surface.h?
<larsu> attente: I have the same problem on master
<larsu> attente: oh, I need the mir fix as well?
<attente> larsu: yeah, i was building against the trunk of mir
<attente> there was an api change at revision 2442
<larsu> this is the saddest statement I've read all week :(
<attente> larsu: http://thenicestplaceontheinter.net/
<larsu> hehe :)
<attente> larsu: maybe just revert 61f3399f980288a9a9e4b03b50dd147a8af55a8d to get it working with stable mir
<larsu> attente: good idea. let's see if I hit the same compile error to reproduce that bug
<larsu> indeed. awesome, thanks.
<larsu> attente: can we just push mir-related changes or should I go through bz as well?
<tkamppeter> seb128, the first patch he offered was not a complete fix and then he came with a lot of patches. So the full change is of large impact, but as it concerns only the support for Brother label printers and cannot break anything in the system, like general printing or support for other printers, I could even have a look and try to get it uploaded today.
<attente> larsu: i think we have free reign to push as long as we only touch gdk/mir
<larsu> attente: ah, this touches configure.ac though
<attente> larsu: what's the change?
<larsu> attente: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/203284535/fix-1444174.patch
<larsu> I think I'll just push it
<larsu> it's insanely simple
 * larsu makes tea before
<Laney> good idea
<Laney> it's a big event
<attente> oh, right, that's duflu's patch
<larsu> Laney: indeed. Gotta be prepared
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<willcooke> Laney, msm says that pub is a goodun
<didrocks> compiz crash
<willcooke> seb128, dgadomski is coming to the sprint \o/
<didrocks> and now, no media keys after session restart
 * didrocks unlogs and relogs
<seb128> willcooke, oh, good news, thanks for that!
<willcooke> nw
<Laney> willcooke: woot
<larsu> didrocks: this happens to me after a dist-upgrade sometimes (but goes away after a relogin)
<Laney> camra know what they're talking about
<didrocks> larsu: didn't dist-upgrade today
<didrocks> larsu: the no media keys is there for a while, it's a race apparently
<larsu> another reason for not allowing upgrades in a session
<larsu> oh, interesting
<didrocks> yeah, so not linked to upgrade in all cases
<seb128> yeah, I sometime get the no multimedia keys and it's not an update thing
<pitti> Good morning
<larsu> morning pitti! How's the sprint going?
<pitti> larsu: fast! :-)
<pitti> larsu: mopping up quite a bit of test/boot/ddebs stuff, going well!
<larsu> nice!
<seb128> hey pitti, wie gehts?
<pitti> seb128: hey Seb, gut, danke!
<pitti> hectic as usual on a sprint
<seb128> I can imagine
<willcooke> ETOOHOT
<seb128> indeed!
<Laney> it's only 15 here
<Laney> london apparently is 25
<larsu> wait, already we complain about heat?
<Laney> welcome to the UK
<larsu> let's wait a few weeks please between ETOOCOLD and ETOOHOT
<willcooke> My thermostat says it's 27
<seb128> today is no-pants-day!
<willcooke> Ahh, working from home
<seb128> :-)
<Laney> dear lord
<willcooke> http://imgur.com/wOn9Kkh
<seb128> lol
<seb128> I was pondering opening that image or not
<seb128> some things can't be unseen :p
<Laney> it's pretty extreme
<willcooke> I've got lots more like that, I'll be happy to share ;)
<Laney> you should have it constantly updating
<tkamppeter> seb128, I have uploaded a new ptouch-driver package to Vivid now containing all changes from Phil Pemberton. It is a larger patch but it only affects Brother laser printers, no regression risk for anything else.
<sarnold> desrt, qengho, http://spaceflightnow.com/2015/04/15/new-longer-video-shows-falcon-demise/
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-04-16
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> hey didrocks&desktopers
<didrocks> re seb128
<larsu> morning!
<seb128> hey larsu willcooke
<willcooke> morning gents
<didrocks> hey larsu, willcooke!
<larsu> hi didrocks, seb128, willcooke (alphabetically)
<didrocks> was clearly the preference order, I know it! :)
 * larsu provides no further comment
<TheMuso> Hey folks. :)
<larsu> morning TheMuso!
<didrocks> hey TheMuso
<seb128> hey TheMuso
<willcooke> g'night TheMuso
<TheMuso> willcooke: Later. :)
 * Laney joins the hello fest
<willcooke> what up Laney
<didrocks> hey hey Laney
<Laney> tkamppeter: please could you commit that ptouch-driver update to debian git too?
<willcooke> FJKong, ping.  Are you still around?
<FJKong> willcooke: here
<willcooke> FJKong, can you join #community on Canonical server quickly?
<FJKong> willcooke: no problem
<willcooke> by which I mean, it won't take long, not that you need to join quickly
<Laney> this is intriguing...
<willcooke> Laney, feel free to join as well :)  Just talking about release events for NUDT
<Laney> haha
<Laney> you deflated the excitement
<willcooke> There is also the secret agenda items about how we can prevent the community from knowing about what internal development work we're doing
<willcooke> but, oh know, I've said too much already
<willcooke> *no
 * Laney flashes the men in black thing
<willcooke> Phew - good job didrocks didnt hear that
<didrocks> what? my compiz crashed because you remotely asked it for? :p
 * didrocks is intriguated as well nowâ¦
<willcooke> I'm pulling your leg didrocks ;)
<willcooke> I assume that translates perfectly
<didrocks> willcooke: heh, I know about this expression (but yeah, no litteral translations in french) :)
<didrocks> willcooke: but not worry, I'll still double check on http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/04/16/%23ubuntu-desktop.html :p
<didrocks> (once it's refreshed)
<didrocks> bash-completion isn't installed on the ubuntu core image -> /me sads
<didrocks> sad*
<Laney> good job we have a massive archi... wait
<didrocks> hum, do we have a good client to read markdown docs?
<didrocks> (this first giving a name starting with "e****" goes out :p)
<Laney> that is what I use :(
<Laney> on the extremely rare occasions that I write anything for the website
<larsu> didrocks: isn't markdown supposed to be readable in plain text?
<larsu> I thought that's the whole point of it
<didrocks> larsu: yeah, but formatting!
<Laney> I guess to check you got the syntax right?
<Laney> use pandoc to convert it to html or something
<didrocks> oh, nice idea
<larsu> didrocks: pass it through a converter and look at it in a browser?
<larsu> there's also something converting it to troff. man!!!
<didrocks> ahah
<didrocks> thanks guys, I will go that road!
<larsu> if you're editing, I hear gnome-builder is really nice for that (split pane life preview thing)
<larsu> I think I would find that annoying though... too many things moving on the screen and all
<didrocks> yeah, I have atom.io as well
<didrocks> but this is kind heavy for just reading
<didrocks> converting is the way then!
<larsu> Laney: did you see my mr for vanvugt's gtk patch?
<Laney> larsu: yes, thanks - was hoping you and mclasen would agree on a patch for that scrolling problem so we can fix that too
<larsu> Laney: I pinged him yesterday and he said he'd put it on his list. didn't sound very convincing
<larsu> I have a patch that fixes it if you want that for now
<larsu> it's a one-liner
 * larsu grabs something to eat
<Laney> larsu: Don't know, can wait for review
<larsu> ok
<willcooke> lolz - email from a recruitment company, would we like them to find us some Sharepoint consultants?
<willcooke> Think we're probably ok thx
<ogra_> dont say no  ! as long as they wor for free :)
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> They could sweep up round the office or something
<larsu> Laney: any idea why bug #1408721 happened? According to the changelog, we only started installing settings.ini with that release
<ubot5> bug 1408721 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "package libgtk-3-0 3.14.6-0ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite shared '/etc/gtk-3.0/settings.ini', which is different from other instances of package libgtk-3-0:i386" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1408721
 * larsu wonders if that file is necessary at all...
<davmor2> willcooke: imagine this if you will, coffee magically appears in your cup......now you want one sharepoint monkey right
<willcooke> davmor2, lol :)
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> hey pitti! wie gehts?
<willcooke> hey pitti
<pitti> hey seb128, willcooke!
<pitti> gut, danke!
<pitti> und Euch?
<seb128> larsu, that error message suggests that the content of the file is different between the i386 and amd64 binaries?
<didrocks> good morning pitti!
<seb128> pitti, auch gut, danke :-)
<larsu> hi pitti!
<larsu> seb128: not sure how that could happen. That file gets copied over from the debian directory into the shared package
<seb128> larsu, yeah, me neither...
<larsu> I wonder why it's not in -common
<nonyab> How can i make transfer my ubuntu on laptop with all my settings and apps to flashdrive for a portability so i can use it any where please
<nonyab> kinda like casper xp does in windoz
<willcooke> nonyab, hi there!  This is mostly a development channel, you are best to ask in #ubuntu for support type questions
<willcooke> nonyab, lots of folk in there will be able to help you
<nonyab> thanx willcooke
<Laney> larsu: Can't think how that can be our bug - probably only if they've installed a non-Ubuntu (self built or PPA) package which stole our version namespace
<larsu> Laney: so... close it?
<Laney> did
<Laney> well, Incomplete
<larsu> oh thanks :)
<larsu> Laney: oh, thanks for nagging on the --class bug again :)
<Laney> he sounded open to doing something ...
<larsu> ya
<larsu> I wonder why he cares so much about something that he considers (for good reason) to be deprecated
<larsu> it's not like this patch will be a huge maintenance burden
<larsu> it does change behavior though, so ...
<larsu> didn't we decide to disable deprecation warnings for the release?
<seb128> larsu, nobody did the change I guess :-(
<seb128> we still can today?
<larsu> do you want to?
 * larsu thinks we should and can prepare  a patch
<seb128> yes, please
<larsu> seb128: (sorry, was out in the sun) Where's the packaging branch for glib?
<larsu> lp:~ubuntu-desktop/glib/ubuntu is ooooold
<seb128> larsu, we don't have one I guess
<seb128> which tends to be the cases for packages we can often sync from Debian
<seb128> case
<larsu> ah, ok
<larsu> desrt: G_PARAM_DEPRECATED says it only issues warnings when run with G_ENABLE_DIAGNOSTIC, but nothing other than signal.c looks at that env varâ¦
<larsu> oh I'm blind, it does look at it, but the logic is inverted from what the docs say
<larsu> seb128: I've attached a patch to bug #1430307
<ubot5> bug 1430307 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu) "Deprecation warning should be turned off for release" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1430307
<larsu> but I guess this is something for Laney rather
<seb128> larsu, thanks, and yeah, but if Laney doesn't want to deal with it I can have a look as well
<Laney> No I don't
<larsu> uh oh
<larsu> want to keep the warnings on?
<Laney> Don't want to block it
<Laney> Last cycle it was meant to be one time only
<Laney> And it came via upstream then which made it more palatable
<Laney> But you do it if you want
<didrocks> seb128: larsu: I'm happy to have a look as well :)
<didrocks> you know my opinion on this :p
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> Laney just hates on our users :p
<didrocks> yeah, and developers should use G_ENABLE_DIAGNOSTIC=1 anyway (but we should made it maybe a little bit more clear)
<larsu> Laney: right. But shit didn't get fixed last cycle...
<larsu> spewing warnings doesn't help 99.999% of the people seeing them
<larsu> and we'll get more bugs
<Laney> Then get it fixed upstream for everyone
<didrocks> even crazy security geeks like mdeslaur agrees! That should make you think about it Laney ;)
<Laney> I'm not interested in rehashing 6 month old arguments BTW
<seb128> yeah, let's agree to disagree
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> seb128: want to sponsor it or should I? (I'm about to leave, not sure if it will be ok by tomorrow with finale finale finale freeze)
 * larsu carefully steps back from the keyboard and puts some money aside for Laney's beer in London
<seb128> I understand Laney's fundamental position, in practice I think disabling those is a real world compromise which makes things better for our users though
<seb128> didrocks, I can do it
<mdeslaur> didrocks: lol :)
<didrocks> good!
<didrocks> mdeslaur: ;)
<didrocks> (and yeah, larsu spot it on)
 * didrocks copies and pastes the exact sentence for the next 6 months
<seb128> larsu, let me know when you have a patch and where, I can sponsor it
<larsu> seb128: it's attached on the bug
<seb128> oh right, sorry, lost track ;-)
<larsu> no worries :)
<didrocks> seb128: see this guy, he's even not attaching a debdiff!
<larsu> the fuck if I know how that works
<didrocks> larsu: didn't you provide some in the past? :)
<larsu> didrocks: I did, but always forget ;)
<didrocks> seb128: germany is clearly not what it used to beâ¦
<didrocks> :)
<seb128> good that we have a team week next week
<seb128> we can remind larsu of things
<didrocks> exactly!
 * didrocks hugs larsu
<larsu> haa
 * larsu hugs EVERYONE
<seb128>  /me hugs larsu back
<seb128> ups
<seb128> larsu, didrocks, Laney, uploaded
<didrocks>  /msg larsu see how seb128 doesn't know how to use IRC after 14 years?
<didrocks> seb128: \o/
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> :p
<didrocks> it's like Friday in the air!
<larsu> seb128: thanks!
<larsu> didrocks: LOL
<Laney> seb128: did you see my link to the commit from last time?
<Laney> oh, WTF, someone accepted it already
<Laney> whatever
<larsu> :(
<didrocks> Laney: maybe we should ask for prioritizing having logs on those accepts/deny on launchpad side now that the buttons are client-side and not anymore on the serverâ¦
<seb128> Laney, I saw it/your comment, but I though it was just arguing in favor of pushing to commit that upstream, not something needed on our side for the upload
<didrocks> even not for pointing guilt, but at least, to know who to talk to
<Laney> seb128: I linked to how desrt did it last time which was different
<seb128> Laney, right, nothing in your comment suggested you though that was better though
<seb128> I've no strong opinion on one way or the other
<seb128> I'm happy to replace it by desrt's version if you prefer though
<seb128> -though
<Laney> Nope, up to your judgement
<seb128> trusting larsu
<larsu> it amounts to the same, no? The only difference is that with desrt's patch you can also do G_DISABLE_DIAGNOSTICS=Laney and they'll be turned on
 * larsu doesn't care either way
<seb128> if nobody cares then it's good enough like that
<Laney> Correct
<Laney> I'm going early
<Laney> bye
 * desrt blinks
<ogra_> disco !
<desrt> untz untz
<seb128> Laney, have a good evening!
<didrocks> vuntz vuntz
<didrocks> see you Laney!
 * didrocks waves good evening as well
<willcooke> l8r chaps
<mitya57> desrt: what do you think about gnome #746592?
<ubot5> Gnome bug 746592 in gsettings "Support for per-session overrides" [Normal,New] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=746592
<desrt> interesting
<mitya57> I think that is the same as our lp: #1222053
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1222053 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu) "per-session gsettings overrides" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1222053
<mitya57> (but with patches)
<desrt> but problematic...
<mitya57> --verbose please :)
<desrt> there is no support for fallbacks here
<desrt> like if XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP is MATE:GNOME or something
<desrt> and then we find the MATE file first, which has one single mate-specific override
<desrt> we won't go on to find the gnome overrides after that
<mitya57> According the the patch description we will...
<desrt> the way i read it it adds the compiled schema it finds first, by priority order of the xdg_current_desktops
<mitya57> so yes, it is .../mate, then .../gnome, and finally the default directory
<mitya57> Is that wrong?
<desrt> the problem is what happens when you find mate
<mitya57> Oh, I see what you mean
<desrt> like imagine gnome has 10 overrides, but then mate has 1 override on top of it
<desrt> you'll get the one, but miss the 10, even though you list MATE:GNOME in the variable
<mitya57> Yes, I got it, and that sounds fixable
<mitya57> Will you comment on that patch, or should I?
<desrt> it's actually a very difficult problem
<desrt> i'll comment
<mitya57> OK
<desrt> the trouble is that you need to figure out what schema content gets included in each file
<desrt> and there is not great support fort his level of granularity in the current compiler
<desrt> particularly when schemas refer to each other
<mitya57> Hm, yes, it may be troublesome
<mitya57> desrt: Thanks for commenting!
<desrt> sorry to rain on your parade :(
<mitya57> Well, this is a wishlist for me, not something very important :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-04-17
<didrocks> good morning
<willcooke> o/
<seb128> hey willcooke
<didrocks> good morning willcooke
<Laney> OHO
<didrocks> santa claus!
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<seb128> oh, he got presents for us?!
 * didrocks hopes so
<Laney> coal for didrocks
 * Laney switch back to upstart last night ;-)
<didrocks> but I've been so kind!
<didrocks> life is unfair
<larsu> morning!
<seb128> hey larsu
<willcooke> is anyone using plain X chat 2.8.8?
<seb128> willcooke, no, xchat-gnome here
<seb128> why?
<willcooke> There's a really weird thing going on with the topic field
<willcooke> If I drag a window over the top of it
<willcooke> I can see through the window's title bar and read the text underneath
<willcooke> but only on the topic field
<willcooke> ?!?!?!
<willcooke> oh, and the channel list
<willcooke> doesn't matter, just strange is all
<seb128> weird indeed
<willcooke> errr
<willcooke> it gets more strange...
<willcooke> it only happens on my laptop screen, not on my external monitor
<larsu> use xchat-gnome? :P
<willcooke> :)
<davmor2> use irssi
<larsu> weechat!
<willcooke> You guys and your crackpot IRC clients
<davmor2> smuxi
<davmor2> willcooke: I'm using xchat
<davmor2> I just don't have multimonitors
<willcooke> ba
<Laney> ba black sheep
<davmor2> have you any wool
<Laney> lots actually
<darkxst> willcooke, nope, fine here, but GNOME, so different compositor
<willcooke> thx darkxst, I'll show bregma next week if I can reproduce it
<davmor2> willcooke: what are you testing xchat on?  If it is unity 7 on vivid then I might be able to get an hdmi lead and chuck it into this monitor from my laptop
<willcooke> davmor2, don't worry about it - it's not worth spending time on
 * Laney has added some topics to 'Agenda' on the sprint spreadsheet
<willcooke> thx Laney
<Laney> I wonder if I have one of those apple vga dongle thingies
<Laney> would be useful to project ting
<Laney> actually found one, still in its packet
 * willcooke -> haircut
<darkxst> Laney, if you need apples, have a big tree of them ;)
<darkxst> well atleast the ones that are left after the european wasp invasion
<Laney> those mean wasps
<darkxst> yeh! I was quite surpised they can eat an entire apple (Except the skin) in 1 day
<darkxst> multi-threaded of course as well, so many apples per day
 * willcooke <- haircut
<davmor2> willcooke and a haircut doesn't sound right......No I'm sure it's Shave and a Haircut 2 bits :D
<willcooke> Nooooooo
 * didrocks will be in no haircut mode for once
<didrocks> brace yourself!
<davmor2> didrocks: if your hair isn't cut surely the hair will brace people against the wall and they won't need to brace themselves ;)
<willcooke> http://www.independent.co.uk/migration_catalog/article5199891.ece/alternates/w620/Old%20English%20Sheepdog%20.jpeg
<didrocks> davmor2: ahah
<didrocks> willcooke: I should have bet as I was 90% sure it was this kind of dog before opening the imageâ¦
<willcooke> :D:D
<willcooke> excellent
<didrocks> it's not *that* bad
<davmor2> hey desktop guys there seems to be some real issue in oem mode on desktop.  There is no prepare for end user script that I can find, after cd eject enter key does nothing, there is no sound in the ubiquity installer part, there is no listing for my AP in nm but it was discovered no issues in the installer, volume is on in desktop for oem
<davmor2> the list goes on
<didrocks> davmor2: are you sure most of them are specific to oem mode?
<didrocks> davmor2: the cd eject enter key is something that cyphermox was looking at (related to systemd)
<davmor2> didrocks: the missing prepare for end user is definitely oem
<didrocks> I guess the ubiquity/nm issues should be directed to the foundation team
<didrocks> only the user prepare one seems oemish
<didrocks> (and that's foundation team as well)
<davmor2> didrocks: I don't want to restart till I get some feedback for logs and stuff though  I'm assuming most of the issues priory to oem desktop are general issues
<didrocks> davmor2: basically all installer issues is for cyphermox (lucky him) :p
<davmor2> didrocks: I know right :)  He gets all the bestest things
<didrocks> heh
<didrocks> but yeah, I guess the other are impacting normal images as well (some are known and being worked on)
<didrocks> ogra_: stupid question, but by reading the snappy ML, I found your message on https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/snappy-devel/2015-February/000281.html
<didrocks> ogra_: seems your sudo question is now fixed, right? (as there is a needs-root or whatever yaml content)
<didrocks> however, I was wondering what is the node-snapper?
<ogra_> didrocks, might be, i had to move back to phone stuff and havent touched snappy in a while ...
<ogra_> i know there is a bug for the sudo case though
<didrocks> ogra_: and this node-snapper? was it just a package you started to look at and transform it for vim? or another magical tools I didn't find doc on yet? :p
<ogra_> node-snapper is a tool to provide you an arch specific tarball (or two) with a nodejs interpreter and all needed nodejs modules to put in a snap package
<didrocks> interesting (not sure why you needed that for vim though?)
<ogra_> https://ograblog.wordpress.com/2015/02/21/meet-node-snapper-a-helper-to-easily-create-snap-packages-of-your-node-js-projects/
<ogra_> well, you can easily hack it to pull any other binary package into such a tarball :)
<didrocks> ah ok, you just switch nodejs to vim
<ogra_> and drop the npm logic ...
<ogra_> (since vim doesnt need nodejs modules most of the time :) )
<didrocks> ogra_: you always need npm though! :p
<didrocks> ogra_: thanks for the answers ;)
<ogra_> happy to help ...
<ogra_> btw, i think mterrys new tool is better for general deb conversion to snap ... node-snapper is pretty specific for the nodejs case
<didrocks> ogra_: yeah, I'm reading that as well to get a sense of state of the art and see how we can help (but without participating to initial conversations, hard to cachup)
<didrocks> catchup*
<ogra_> there is no "initial conversation"
<ogra_> there is just  "we all scratch our itches" currently
<didrocks> ogra_: well, quite a lot of tools and messages on the ML, so interesting to see where this is going and how we can see the bigger picture
<didrocks> aka "avoid having to run xorg in a priviledge snap"
<ogra_> right, i just mean we will probably see ten more such implementations until something official comes around
<didrocks> yep
<ogra_> we neeed some generic way though ... everyone knows that i think
<didrocks> interesting thing about the LD_PRELOAD story btwâ¦
<didrocks> I was really against before the issues with LD_LIBRARY_PATH
<ogra_> LD_LIBRARY_PATH works fine for less complex stuff (like node snapper)
<ogra_> i wouldnt want to roll a unity8 snap with Mir inside using that though :)
<didrocks> everything that doesn't use RPATHâ¦
<didrocks> heh
<didrocks> yeah
<ogra_> (which is essentially what mterry tires to do there)
<didrocks> yep, for a couple of months already
<didrocks> ogra_: ok, I just saw libsnappypreload's code
<didrocks> it'sâ¦ interesting :p
<seb128> kenvandine, touch channel is a bit crazy, moving here
<kenvandine> seb128, :)
<seb128> kenvandine, yeah, I confirmed that the ListItem onClicked: doesn't trigger when we hit the issue
<kenvandine> seb128, you mean confirmed outside of autopilot?
<seb128> I added a code snippet the change the page title to "clicked" in the onClicked handler, doesn't change when I hit the bug
<seb128> with autopilot
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> I can't reproduce the issue with a manual tap
<seb128> I do tap correctly :p
<seb128> seems like autopilot sometime doesn't
<kenvandine> grrr
<seb128> indeed :-/
<seb128> is there a way to dump events log?
<seb128> to see if it triggers a dnd or something
<kenvandine> seb128, can you ping the qa guys with what you've figured out?
<kenvandine> not sure
<seb128> kenvandine, who are the qa guys?
<kenvandine> see if they have ideas why we don't always get onClicked
<kenvandine> they have a vanguard in #ubuntu-quality
<kenvandine> i think
<kenvandine> someone that should be able to help with autopilot issues
<kenvandine> seb128, so i bet missing that onClicked happens elsewhere too, which causes these flaky problems
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, moving to the next channel :p
<kenvandine> seb128, it was awesome that you figured that out!
<seb128> kenvandine, :-)
<kenvandine> i'm a bit distracted by another meeting right now though, but i'll try to follow along :)
<seb128> kenvandine, do we have a bug about those issues?
<kenvandine> not sure, we have in the past ;)
<kenvandine> but flakyness comes and goes :/
<kenvandine> and likely not the same issue
<seb128> right
<seb128> let's see, waiting for a reply but I'm going to open one in a bit
<pitti> oh, I forgot to say good morning earlier, so:
<pitti> good morning!
<didrocks> good morning pitti :)
<pitti> bonjour didrocks :)
<larsu> hi pitti!
<pitti> didrocks: c'est presque le fin de la semaine pour toi, non ? :-)
 * pitti tips hat towards larsu
<didrocks> pitti: presque, en effet ! et toi, tu as le temps pour une glace avant de venir Ã  Londres ? :)
<pitti> didrocks: je ne crois pas Ã§a, je m'en vais Ã  15:30
<didrocks> ah en effet, ce sera Ã  l'arrivÃ©e alors :)
<Laney> bonjour petit chat
<pitti> didrocks: mais je peux manger de la glace Ã  Londres !
<didrocks> pitti: il fera beau en plus !
<didrocks> Laney: a wise man said one day "nage, nage petit poisson"
<Laney> the small animal zoo
<seb128> hey pitti
<cyphermox> hey pitti, how are you on this fine morning?
<willcooke> quittin' time - see you guys next week \o/
<willcooke> I'll just leave this here from mterry:  https://github.com/mikix/deb2snap
<willcooke> seb128, when you're back ^^^^
<willcooke> tata
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-04-18
<hikiko> hi
<pitti> Good morning
<darkxst> hey seb128, I will deal with the grilo-plugins soon, too sick with flu to much the last couple of days
<darkxst> but do see my last comment, perhaps stay with .17 and revert the standalone apple plugin
<Laney> morning
<darkxst> hey Laney
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> Laney, hey, had a good w.e?
<seb128> darkxst, k, no worry, we might miss release though which is slightly annoying
<seb128> need to go back to enforce ffes next cycle to avoid such issues
<Laney> yes thanks, hung out with henry who can talk a bit now!
<Laney> and did some digging at the allotment and planted strawberries
<Laney> you?
<Laney> good travel?
<darkxst> seb128, it was an honest mistake on my part...
<andyrock> morning all
<seb128> Laney, yeah, good w.e, visiter city park on saturday before flying on the afternoon, flight was ok (full so I could only get a sit in the middle, and sound was cuting every 30s on the av system in my seat)
<seb128> hey andyrock
<Laney> night flight?
<seb128> darkxst, no worry, it's just that I usually check on -changes/uploads, I guess I assumed that was a bugfix upload
<Laney> did you sleep?
<Laney> hi andyrock and darkxst
<darkxst> does anyone still use thunderbird? is it hanging constantly for anyone else?
<seb128> Laney, 4:30pm, and not really a bit too early for that, snoozeed for an hour or so ... but we didn't have crazy late night during the week so I was not super tired
<Laney> nod
<seb128> I managed to stay up until 11pm yesterday
<darkxst> seb128, it was meant to be a stable update, but on looking into it further, they backported some pretty invasive changes
<seb128> tennis on TV helped :p
<Laney> looking forward to hear the crazy decisions from that meeting :P
<seb128> darkxst, I use tb, no hang here
<darkxst> seb128, w/ LDAP?
<seb128> darkxst, and yeah, having to change the .install should have hinted you that there was some refactoring
<seb128> no ldap no
<seb128> just imap
<darkxst> seb128, thats part of the problem, I prepared the packaging moons ago
<seb128> Laney, no crazy decision don't worry, the planning makes mostly sense imho
<darkxst> let me try disable LDAP and see if that helps, though it only started hanging 2 weeks ago
<seb128> Laney, summary is "more phone work for the phone team", "more snappy work for the snappy team" and desktop to get an unity8 session by next cycle but no speak of making it default before 17.04 or later
<seb128> lot of time spent trying to figure out how to not hate gcc as much
<Laney> the compiler?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> they are really screwed by the C++ ABI change from previous cycle
<seb128> and they don't know how they can handle it without invalidating devices or part of the store
<seb128> the current store doesn't support having several versions of a same application
<Laney> roh
<seb128> which they could fix, but the store team has no resources/interest to work on the non snappy part atm
<Laney> so you can't build an old version and a new one
<seb128> no
<Laney> :(
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> spent a good part of the week trying to figure that out
<seb128> discussion included rebuilding with the old abi in a xenial overlay (but that one was discarded)
<seb128> ABI changes really suck
<seb128> direct result is that they are probably not going to update to xenial before a while
<seb128> probably not next cycle
<Laney> if you don't control all the dependencies
<Laney> does snappy fix this problem?
<Laney> probably not for the compiler
<seb128> no
<seb128> right, not for the compiler
<seb128> it would fix it for random libs
<seb128> since you would just bandle the version you need
<seb128> but if it's an interface with the system then if ABI change you are screwed
<Laney> click has the same though, the problem is in the base system
<seb128> right
<seb128> hopefully gcc doesn't do that again any time soon
<seb128> but yeah, really sucks
<seb128> they are now talking about shipping a container with the old stack on the image or similar solutions
<Laney> build the old library without a -dev package or something?
<Laney> or symbol problems maybe
<flexiondotorg> Morning.
<flexiondotorg> This bugs has been getting referenced more and more in recent weeks - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/1522922
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1522922 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) "Screen flickering in Intel i915 driver" [High,Triaged]
<flexiondotorg> Which team can I follow up with?
<Laney> #ubuntu-x
<flexiondotorg> I have a computer that is affected.
<flexiondotorg> Laney, ty
<seb128> Laney, anyway, no crazy plans, phone team needs to deliver device updates for partner so there are on a sensible roadmap for those and are stuggling on the side to see how they can deal with xenial and snappy but don't want to put things at risk so those are delayed work
<seb128> desktop is more of "need to get ready for converge/new stack/etc by the next LTS"
<seb128> so should be reasonable
<seb128> Laney, oh, are you in London?
<seb128> I almost forgot that it was 16.04 week!
<Laney> nah
<Laney> I'm going down tomorrow
<seb128> ah ok
<seb128> I'm coming on thursday for the day only
<Laney> so I heard
<Laney> and I'm suspicious as to why :P
 * Laney is a paranoid person
<seb128> lol
<Laney> it'll be good to have you there for release day ;-)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> I think willcooke wanted to do 1 day at the office
<seb128> so syncing with release is a good opportunity to do that
<seb128> speaking of release I wonder what to do with the hud & g-s rename items next
<seb128> Laney, do you have other desktop release issues that you know of?
<seb128> I guess Sweet5hark missed the slot for his bugfix libreoffice upload :-/
<Laney> You can upload and leave it in the queue
<Laney> or maybe block in proposed to get the builds done
<seb128> yeah, I'm unsure, if gets nacked and that it turns out we need another g-s or unity upload to fix some other issues it's complicating things then
<Laney> Libreoffice
<seb128> ah, right
<seb128> yeah, I was thinking that
<Laney> build times aren't a problem for the others so much
<Laney> + silo
<seb128> but Sweet5hark didn't come back since thursday
<seb128> so wondering if he found some issue with the update
<seb128> Sweet5hark, hey? ;-)
<seb128> Laney, I think you didn't explicitely reply, but are you aware of any realease issue we should be looking at?
<seb128> I tried to keep an eye on IRC/emails/etc during the sprint but I was not always online and I might have missed things
<Laney> hmm, not right now
<Laney> I'm looking at g-cal 3.20.1 and then the sponsor queue
<seb128> k
<Sweet5hark> heya all.
<Laney> iso / upgrade testing I guess is always helpful ;-)
<Laney> hi Sweet5hark
<Sweet5hark> seb128: well, I removed one of the patches and it build fine. I havent smoketested it yet. I decided not doing this in a rush as most of the crashers where crash-on-exit so no loss of data.
<Sweet5hark> seb128: so, just keeping this ready -to-go in case the situation changes.
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark
<seb128> Laney, yeah, I started doing some iso testing
<seb128> looks mostly good so far
<seb128> Sweet5hark, k, SRU it is then I guess
<Sweet5hark> seb128: yep
<darkxst> ``pand
<Laney> nice password
<darkxst> gah! how does slack input end up in IRC?
<darkxst> Laney, not password!
<Laney> sure sure :)
<darkxst> would
<darkxst> I really set my password as the most annoying person on slack, that he is trying to help, so he gets the benefit of doubt
 * Laney joined that slack thing
<Laney> now I can picture while I IRC
<Fudge> what slack thing?
<ogra_`> Laney, http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/slack-webapp_0.1_all.deb if youi dont want to search the tab all the time in your browser ;)
<Laney> ogra_`: hrhr
<Laney> I closed the tab already and will probably never open it again
<ogra_`> (also brings an icon for the launcher)
<ogra_`> haha
<Laney> do you have some team in there?
 * ogra_` really tired it for a while ... 
<ogra_`> only the community team that jorge maintains
<ogra_`> ( "warthogs" community team actually ... )
<ogra_`> but i'm to old school i guess ... really cant let xchat go
<Fudge> irssi is awesome
<davmor2> ogra_`: try hexchat at least it has developers ;)
<ogra_`> davmor2, thats what i'm using on my xenial laptop now ... since xchat is gone from the archive
<davmor2> seb128, Laney: in gnome-software can you actually find cli apps?
 * ogra_` thinks only if they have a .desktop file 
<ogra_`> (htop does for example)
<Laney> Correct
<davmor2> ogra_`: yeah that's what I'm thinking it mean about 50% of our archive vanishes
<ogra_`> davmor2, not much different to ubuntu-software though
<ogra_`> that also only indexed .desktop files
<davmor2> ogra_`: type in pass in software center and gnome software you'll see the difference right there, USC shows terminal based apps with a default icon but gnome-software just shows none
<Laney> It is intentional
<davmor2> Laney: awesome thanks
<Laney> You can install those things another way - gnome-software is trying to show more relevant and better things to people
<davmor2> Laney: indeed thanks
<Laney> np!
<davmor2> Laney: plus if you know how to use the command line you'll most likely use apt anyway
 * Laney puts Ultravox on loud
<Laney> apt or synaptic both are still there, yeah
<davmor2> Laney: OHhhhhhhhh Vienna
<Laney> DANCINGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG
<Laney> WITH TEARS IN MY EYESSSS
<Laney> (ode to software-center)
<davmor2> weeping for the memory of a life on by
<davmor2> gone even
<desrt> happy monday, desktop
<Laney> hi desrt!
<desrt> morning Laney
<desrt> good weekend?
<Laney> how goes?
<Laney> yeah!
<desrt> i'm sore :p
<Laney> visited henry
<Laney> he thinks my name is "ears"
<desrt> :)
<Laney> and points to his ears
<Laney> when people ask who I am
<desrt> curious
<Laney> I guess Iain and Ears are kind of similar
<desrt> ah.  that's a good theory.
<Laney> care to elaborate on your soreness?!?!?!
<desrt> lots of ingress this weekend :p
<Laney> neat
<Laney> impressed you are keeping this up
<desrt> probably biked and walked 30km each
<desrt> actually, according to my fitbit, walked closer to 50
<desrt> Laney: it's a wonderful sickness to have :)
<desrt> explored this gigantic bird sanctuary area that juts out of toronto into lake ontario
<desrt> absolutely beautiful
<Laney> nice
<Laney> guess it's a good time of year for that
<desrt> the best
<dobey> Trevinho: huh. I am certainly not seeing a GtkMenuBar in the windows where this happens. and the menus aren't arranged as a single drop down.
<Trevinho> dobey: you refer to missing menus?
<dobey> Trevinho: yes
<Trevinho> dobey: I see... menus are there though, in terms of exported stuff I think.. have you tried to use HUD or to launch the script I posted in the bug?
<dobey> Trevinho: yes, the menus are there and exported; they just aren't visible in the title bar. if i use Alt+f it will pop up the file menu in most apps, and i can navigate the rest of the menus with arrow keys for example
<dobey> Trevinho: i didn't see any script, but admittedly i didn't look much beyond clicking the "me too" thing at the top :)
<Trevinho> dobey: I've lots of problems in reproducing the issue... I mean, I never got that. But from what I see I've the feeling that it's something up to gtk menu model at libappmenu level. It's like it doesn't load the menus. NOthing changed there (at least since vivid/wily), but I think that there's a race
<seb128> hey desrt
<Trevinho> dobey: as an experiment, you could try to do this: add the wily version of gtk some where, edit unity-panel-service.conf upstart job so that it exports the LD_LIBRARY_PATH to where the old libgtk is, and try to see if using that it will work
<desrt> g'morning, seb
<Trevinho> so we can figure out where the bug is, but I've like the impression is somewhat gtk related.
<seb128> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> hey seb128!
<dobey> Trevinho: it does indeed seem gtk+ related
<dobey> Trevinho: hmm, restarting unity-panel-service did resolve the issue in the current session, at least temporarily
<Trevinho> dobey: yeah, it's a known workaround
<Trevinho> dobey: I've been tempted also to just add a "sleep" to the unity-panel-service.conf. to see if something changes
<Trevinho> not that i'd love that, but...
<dobey> that killed my rhythmbox and empathy though :-/
<Trevinho> weird...
<dobey> i guess because they were started from the indicators
<Trevinho> Or, maybe because you launched them trhough messaging indicators'
<Trevinho> eh, that's the thing
<Trevinho> although it shouldn't do that,
<dobey> but still
<Trevinho> not sure what they use to launch, but I guess not gappcontext at this point
<attente> Laney: can we do another release today?
<desrt> attente: good morning :)
<xnox> can anybody explain how to run a headless (no display :0, no vt7) lightdm vncserver?
<Laney> attente: it's pretty late, but maybe
<Laney> I'd file bugs for things you fixed and then they can become SRU bugs if necessary
<desrt> zomg
<desrt> i just upgraded my system and firefox is installed
<desrt> what happened?!
<seb128> upgraded from what to what?
<Laney> debian?
<desrt> iceweasel
<seb128> oh
<Laney> the rename happened a while ago
<seb128> lol
<Laney> I think
<ximion> jup
 * desrt feels the stupid in the world decrease by a single notch
 * desrt sheds a tear for the weasel
<seb128> andyrock, hey
<seb128> andyrock, is there anything in unity's stack that use "gnome-software.desktop"?
<seb128> or org.gnome.Software.desktop rather
<andyrock> We use org.gnome.software.desktop
<seb128> seems it's used in tests
<andyrock> In the settimgs schema
<seb128> right
<andyrock> And in the tests
<seb128> I was wondering if there is any code path also depending on the name
<seb128> we are going to need to rename it
<andyrock> Not that i remember
<seb128> k, thanks
<andyrock> *can
<seb128> so should be a "simple" sed in unity source
<andyrock> I ll check better
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> maybe we just rename this for everyone
<Laney> it's the same forked thing for all flavours anyway
<seb128> yeah, that's one option
<seb128> some flavors might like better the upstream name
<Laney> multiple desktop files are annoying
<Laney> like we have to remember to X-AppStream-Ignore one of them otherwise you're going to get it two times
<seb128> right
<Laney> brb
<Laney> night
<Laney> see you from the train / office
<seb128> Laney, 'night, have a good trip tomorrow!
<jcastro> ais gnome-software supposed to show snaps yet?
<xclaesse> are there known issues with samba share on ubuntu 16.04? if I simply share a folder from nautilus, my windows machine on the same network won't see it
<ogra_> jcastro, it does here
<ogra_> hmm, though i installed the clock app and calculator from the cmdline ... not sure it would have shown them before
<ogra_> (it definitely shows them now and knows they are installed)
<seb128> xclaesse, no, but I don't know how much testing that gets so I wouldn't be surprised if it had issues...
<seb128> jcastro, check with attente, proper support is not in the archive but he mentioned earlier than the archive version might list those
<attente> the archive version shows snaps, but has no support for them otherwise
<jcastro> are snaps in a specific section or something? I can't seem to find them
<attente> you'd have to search explicitly for them
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-04-19
<hikiko> Hello
<pitti> GOod morning
<Sweet5hark> moin!
<pitti> hey Sweet5hark, wie geths?
<Sweet5hark> pitti: all well here, just started writing a leak-detector for smart-pointers in LO which is fun ...
<pitti> Sweet5hark: uh, and getting a bazillion hits? :-)
<Sweet5hark> pitti: https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=99352 <- in the range 100-1000 for the unitttests existing right now.
<ubot5`> bugs.documentfoundation.org bug 99352 in graphics stack "Some VclPtrs leak past DeInitVCL" [Normal,New]
<Sweet5hark> pitti: next step is to make the smart ptr remember which line of code it was last set with a clang plugin, so it will spill out "leaked VclPtr to a bar of a foo-type, pointer was created at foo.c:123 and last set at bar.c:345"
<Sweet5hark> pitti: that should make hunting them quite easy
<Sweet5hark> also I need to find out why some VclPtrs have a vptr to NULL -- that seems ... unhealty.
<Sweet5hark> pitti: how about you? how are things going?
<pitti> Sweet5hark: the release front is surprisingly quiet
<pitti> SUSPICIOUS!
<pitti> well, I did work on some major installer bug yesterday, but no nightshifts and no panic mode
<pitti> something is wrong
<Sweet5hark> urgh, "something is wrong" is the triage stage Im usually quite nervous about shortly before release ;)
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark pitti
<pitti> bonjour seb128 !
<pitti> seb128: comment vas-tu ? jetlag getting better?
<seb128> whatlag?
<pitti> (you don't do this jetlag thing anyway, right?)
<seb128> Ã§a va bien :-)
 * pitti te donne une accolade
<seb128> yeah, I slept from 11pm to 7am the first night in the U.S
<seb128> and 11pm to 9am on the night back
<seb128> I was feeling slightly sleepy in the afternoon though
 * seb128 donne une accolade Ã  pitti en retour
<Sweet5hark> seb128: heya
<RAOF> ls
<RAOF> Also, hello!
<RAOF> And good night!
<seb128> RAOF, hey, and good night ;-)
<alexarnaud> hello all!
<darkxst> seb128, do you use lightning (calendar) in tb? that seems to be causing my hangs
<seb128> darkxst, no
<seb128> the hang issue is known iirc
<seb128> or I think it was listed as something to sort out if we opted for that option when we evaluated calendaring solutions
<seb128> cf email on desktop list from midcycle
<darkxst> seb128, but its weird I never had a problem until this month! and nothing in the mozilla stack has changed
<seb128> no idea what's the issue then...
<darkxst> maybe I should just migrate to gnome-calendar
<seb128> darkxst, btw we are going to rename gnome-software from Software to "Ubuntu Software", how much of an issue is it for Ubuntu GNOME?
<seb128> we could do a "add another .desktop and play with ShowIn" but that would require to change unity config/tests and migrate configs
<darkxst> seb128, I would prefer to keep it just "Software" so it fits in with the rest of the default apps
<seb128> lol, what I though
<seb128> would be too easy if things would work for everyone
<seb128> need to check with the unity team and release team now :-/
<darkxst> seb128, why is so hard to add an extra .desktop file?
<seb128> it's not hard
<seb128> but the unity launcher config has the current name
<seb128> so we need to migrate user config now
<seb128> if we change it
<seb128> also unity source/tests use the current name
<seb128> so we need a new unity landing to change those
<seb128> which just editing the Name= of the current .desktop would be a trivial change
<darkxst> seb128, I see, why is this all landing so late?
<seb128> darkxst, because non-technical part of Ubuntu/Canonical feedback loop is less tight
<seb128> so it took them a while to realize that the name/store presentation changed in a way which make brand recognition harder to our current users
<seb128> like people look for the ubuntu software center/store
<seb128> and don't find it
<darkxst> and our users are going to look for GNOME software, not ubuntu software (maybe)
<seb128> yeah, depends what "brand" they recognize more
<seb128> like if they consider themself Ubuntu users or GNOME ones
<darkxst> well that depends on context, at the level of the appstore, I suspect most would say GNOME
<seb128> k, I would say Ubuntu
<seb128> especially because the store is a frontend to the ubuntu archive
<seb128> + partner/myapps/etc
<seb128> also until now you were using software-center as well no?
<darkxst> seb128, yes
<darkxst> but then our users have been waiting quite a while with an expected switch to GNOME software
<darkxst> and tbh I doubt they mostly know where the packages come from!
<darkxst> just like there is a lot of unfounded hate, on social media towards ubuntu flavours, because users assume its all Canonicals doing'
<darkxst> which of course it isnt, but that is the users percepentions
<darkxst> perceptions
<seb128> yeah, but I think those discussions/views are quite tech user centrics
<seb128> the vast majority of users out there don't even know what a desktop environment is
<seb128> or what Unity or GNOME are
<seb128> but you could argue that those just use Ubuntu Desktop and not the GNOME remix
<darkxst> seb128, I doubt we get many fresh newbies, with no tech knowledge, that go oh hey I can download an image an break my computer
<Laney> hello
<seb128> hey Laney
 * pitti purrs at Laney
<darkxst> most, if not all users I have interacted with have generally used some other Linux distro before
<pitti> no meeow today?
<Laney> I'm in London now
<seb128> pitti, London doesn't give Laney a meeowing mood
<Laney> no meowing from here
<seb128> see :p
<Laney> it is an omionous place
<pitti> Laney: oh, you're at the release sprint? nice
<seb128> speaking of release
<seb128> Laney, I'm going to sponsor the g-s update from attente, then doing another one for rename
<seb128> Laney, I'm leaning toward adding an ubuntu-software.desktop now
<seb128> hum
<seb128> would that create issues with dbus activation or whatsoever that would expect .desktop to match dbus name
<seb128> shrug, in fact attente's ppa didn't back out the changes we didn't want to land from the look of it...
<seb128> attente, hey, let me know when start your day, ^
<Laney> I don't know, I told you that I prefer just renaming the whole thing
<seb128> k, need to go for some erands and lunch
<seb128> going to upload gnome-software a bit after I'm back, I still have some testing to do and wanted to include some of the fixes from attente but the version in his ppa has more changes that wanted, need to check with him before upload
<seb128> bbiab
<Laney> happyaron: here?
<happyaron> yep
<Laney> hi
<Laney> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/254480825/ubuntukylin-theme_1.5.3_1.5.4.diff.gz
<Laney> can you fix the changelog please?
<Laney> you need a space after "LP:"
<Laney> make sure Launchpad-Bugs-Fixed is in the _source.changes you get
<Laney> wait
<Laney> was it you that uploaded it?
<happyaron> I think that's led by I generated them on a Debian box
<Laney> then set DEB_VENDOR=Ubuntu before building
<Laney> but I think you need the space anyway
<happyaron> ok
<happyaron> should I re-upload?
<Laney> yes please
<happyaron> ok
<attente> seb128: hey
<attente> seb128: i didn't back out the changes, i simply disabled the plugin
<seb128> attente, hey, oh ok, unsure how -release feel about that
<attente> seb128: ok, i'll remove it
<seb128> Laney, g-s bugfix update, fine if that includes the new backend as disabled or would you prefer that as not part of the change?
<seb128> attente, wait for ^ maybe
<Laney> I feel fine about it
<attente> seb128: have you tried the private ppa?
<seb128> attente, yes, mostly works for me
<seb128> attente, is that normal that if you auth in software-properties then g-s asks again to auth?
<seb128> jibel pointed that out
<seb128> also he had a crash when trying to do a review and seems the list is not refreshed after snap installs
<attente> seb128: oh no... we shouldn't be using auth in software-properties at all any more
<seb128> attente, k, so just delete that one from the ppa?
<seb128> jibel, ^
<attente> yeah
<seb128> good
<seb128> attente, I didn't get the error 500 so far
<attente> ok, so i can delete that, fix the re-prompt on cancel
<seb128> also it's confusing that search for "calc" doesn't find ubuntu-calculator-app
<seb128> but that's a snap/store issue
<attente> yeah
<seb128> "snap find calc" doesn't work either
<attente> i guess it's doing some prefix based search
<attente> i should delete the reviews button for those
<attente> because it seems to not work for some reason
<seb128> right
<seb128> better to not have it than having it buggy
<seb128> we can re-enable as we fix
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> Trevinho, you didn't revert that "numlock is on" warning in the unity lock screen right?
<seb128> Trevinho, andyrock, is any of you looking at this missing menus issue?
<Trevinho> seb128: no, no revert
<Trevinho> seb128: as for the menus... I do.
<seb128> k
<seb128> Trevinho, the no revert makes me sad
<seb128> I'm considering maintaining my ppa forked version :p
<Trevinho> But I can't reproduce. As said yesterday I believe that there's something related with gtk
<seb128> it's really annoying/disturbing to be warned about something normal
<Trevinho> seb128: well, it's a light warning
<seb128> I don't see it as light
<seb128> see I never have heavy ones
<Trevinho> Trevinho: we didn't talk about that later... You're right.
<seb128> it's just a warning
<seb128> but that discuss can wait for next week
<Trevinho> I mean I thought you were ok at the end
<seb128> did we ever get design input on that?
<seb128> well, let's see release feedback
<seb128> it just feels buggy and I don't get used to it
<Trevinho> Not really.
<seb128> every time I unlock I'm like "wth is it warning me about my config being right"
<Trevinho> I would love to find a way to detect the presence of a numeric keypad
<seb128> like a numpad typing number
<seb128> yeah, you can't though
<seb128> seems we don't get proper info
<seb128> oh well, let's see if I can convince you over beer next week :p
<Trevinho> USD does some euristics to figure out the machine type, but nothing really reliable
<seb128> Trevinho, on the menu issue, seems we have active people on the bug, I know remote debugging through questions is not easy but do you think we can get somewhere with that?
<Trevinho> Ok.. I think it would be easy in Prague :-D
<seb128> Trevinho, well in my case it's a docked laptop with an external keyboard
<Trevinho> Oh, yeah... Same I do
<seb128> Trevinho, so, the menu issue ... if you think it might be a gtk issue did you try to get input from desrt?
 * desrt scrolls
<desrt> good morning, seb :)
<seb128> hey desrt, how are you?
<desrt> pretty good
<desrt> it's starting to get pretty awesome here
<seb128> desrt, we are speaking about unity-panel/indicator-appmenu not displaying the exported menus sometimes on xenial
<desrt> it's bamf!
<seb128> Trevinho thinks it might be a regression in gtk 3.16->3.18
<seb128> the menus are correctly exported/matched since hud lists those
<desrt> this is a pretty easy theory to test
<desrt> oh.  looks like the HUD tested it for us :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> Trevinho, around?
<desrt> i seriously doubt that a gtk regression is to blame here
<desrt> i'd also like to know what "sometimes" means
<seb128> we should get that discussion moving, release is thursday
<seb128> desrt, bug #1532226
<ubot5`> bug 1532226 in unity (Ubuntu) "No menu bar in gtk apps on fresh boot" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1532226
<seb128> desrt, some users have it on boot, restarting the unity-panel-service seems to "fix" it
<seb128> I wish kamstrump joined IRC for debugging rather just commenting on the bug...
<desrt> "notable exception firefox" implies that dbusmenu is working well but gmenumodel is screwed
<chrisccoulson> someone's still using firefox?
<desrt> chrisccoulson: hi :)
<chrisccoulson> hi :)
<larsu> chrisccoulson: your irc client apparently still notifies you when someone mentions it :P
<larsu> hi all!
<seb128> desrt, I guess Trevinho is having lunch, let's wait for him to be back
<seb128> attente, good news is that your fixes from earlier today (theme, leaks) is in xenial
<attente> seb128: great, thank you
<seb128> thank *you*!
<desrt> :)
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> I installed the gnome-calendar update in g-s which had 6 upgrades listed
<seb128> now it tells me "system is uptodate"
<seb128> and all content vanished
<seb128> like no apps on the "all" tab
<seb128> categories empty
<seb128> andyrock, around? what do you work on? (asking because I've some bugs to nag you about, but only if you are not busy on more important things)
<andyrock> Hey
<andyrock> Working on a bug about not restoring correctly
<andyrock> Right now in a train XD
<andyrock> seb128: but which bugs?
<Trevinho> seb128: ok, here I am
<seb128> andyrock, if you click "install" in gnome-software and deny auth the unity launcher gets an "installing" icon anyway and there is no way to remove until out of restarting unity
<seb128> which is a bit annoying
<seb128> Trevinho, great! can you summarize the appmenu issue for desrt?
<Trevinho> desrt: so, basically unity-gtk-modue does its job and properly exports al the menus... They have been properly exported and in fact both HUD and a raw script (such as https://gist.github.com/3v1n0/58c13a8bac4008a82cd66084fc71c95a) can see them
<Trevinho> desrt: however it looks like that gtk at libappmenu level doesn't get them
<Trevinho> or well, it gets them when restarting unity-panel-service... So delaying unity-panel-service to start also is a workaround (I guess, as I can't try that directly)
<Trevinho> I was also curious whether using older gtk (wily version, let's say) for u-p-s would work (just to see if that's the cause). But I can't reproduce this, so I can't do too many experiments.
<seb128> Trevinho, is there anything that makes you think that could be due to gtk? also saw desrt's comment that one of the reporters says that firefox is working which suggests dbusmenu is but gmenumodel not?
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, libdbusmenu based apps (qt, xul and such) are working fine
<Trevinho> seb128: the problem is with gdbusmenumodel... But the gio side is fine I think. Since things are well exported. The problem seems to be gtk not reloading the menus when the model changes or something like that.
<seb128> andyrock, bug #1553165 (assigned to you on march 04th, but seems like you didnt see it? or just ignored me? :p)
<ubot5`> bug 1553165 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "unity launcher items stay as "installing" on errors" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1553165
<andyrock> Ops sorry
<andyrock> I missed it
<andyrock> I ll take a look as soon as possible
<Trevinho> seb128: as libappmenu uses gtk_menu_new_from_model, then it's all managed like if we had a gtkmenu...
<Trevinho> seb128: and that menu is actually empty it seems
<seb128> andyrock, thanks
<seb128> tjaalton, is there anyone you could nag upstream intel to review the patch on https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=88584? unsure if it works/makes sense but that bug is annoying and I would be glad to see it fixed in xenial if we can :p
<ubot5`> Freedesktop bug 88584 in Driver/intel "[ilk] Font and screen corruption in GTK+ applications" [Major,New]
<seb128> Trevinho, did we do much changes on the appmenu side this cycle?
<Trevinho> seb128: no, nothing
<Trevinho> seb128: it all appened in the previous two cycles
<seb128> but the bug started in xenial?
<Trevinho> yes
<seb128> k, thanks for the summary
<seb128> seems we lost desrt meanwhile
<Trevinho> Well... we have a change in xenial cycle... But...
<seb128> at some point we should be able to have both around! :p
<Trevinho> Mh, it seems so
<Trevinho> however, well... Actually something changed in bamf, so let me try something
<seb128> Trevinho, is that bamf change you are trying giving anything?
<Trevinho> seb128: well, I'm experimenting something, to verify wether the fact that bamf is not there could cause the problem, but... It would be very weird
<Trevinho> I'll ask to test something in the bug report too
<seb128> k
<desrt> seb128: still here :)
<seb128> Trevinho, can desrt help you there?
<seb128> desrt, do you know of anything that changed on the gtk side that could lead to menus not updating when the model change?
<desrt> nothing that wouldn't also impact dbusmenu in a similar way
<desrt> does anyone have a machine that has the problem?  i tried a VM but i can't reproduce.
<Trevinho> Another possibility could be: ups starts when the window hints aren't set, then it can't get the dbus address.. BUt this would be weird since it should be done before mapping
 * Trevinho neither... I tried yesterday in a new install too
<seb128> can you log that?
<desrt> (beta2, fwiw)
<seb128> I can't either
<desrt> Trevinho: ya.  this is the only thing i could think of
<desrt> like if the order of realize/set-property/map got changed
<desrt> but that would impact the hud as well
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah I could add some logging to ups... But the fact that there's no one here able to redpduce and thus a way to get quick feedback doesn't help
<desrt> iirc both sources are querying the info out of bamf
<Trevinho> desrt: well, true...
<desrt> so either bamf has the property or not
<desrt> (and obviously it has it)
 * desrt reads some hud source
<Trevinho> there's also another issue related to this though... seb128 try to enable auto-login. I don't get menubar removed
<seb128> I've autologin on my travel inspiron
<Trevinho> and also fonts aren't properly set
<seb128> no menubar issue
<seb128> I used all of previous week while traveling
<Trevinho> seb128: ah... Mh, my VM has problems instead
<Trevinho> like if unity-settings-daemon isn't properly setting stuff, but it's indeed there
<desrt> hud is indeed querying bamf
<desrt> although in a different way
<desrt> the panel sometimes gets itself into a state, on login, that it cannot display menus from any apps
<desrt> even if the apps are restarted
<desrt> but restarting the panel fixes this state
<desrt> this basically has to be an issue in libappmenu, panel service, unity
<desrt> or an extremely convoluted issue in the way the panel is communicating with bamf
<desrt> it's extremely difficult to imagine this problem being as a result of a change on the app side
<Trevinho> desrt: I think ups is fine, so is unity...
<Trevinho> desrt: I bet for libappmenu
<desrt> ya.  me too.
<desrt> this will be awesome
<desrt> of course, as you suggest, the problem may come from gtk vs. gmenumodel changes in the libappmenu side
<willcooke> it's meeting time
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Apr 19 15:32:10 2016 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic:
<Trevinho> desrt: I wanted to ask some reproducers to install somehwere wily's gtk lib and add an LD_LIBRARY_PATH in unity-panel-service.conf upstart job to override the default one and see if there's some regression in there...
<willcooke> Roll call: andyrock, attente, desrt, fjkong, happyaron (out), hikiko (maybe out), laney (sprint), qengho, seb128, sweet5hark, themuso (out), tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<desrt> Trevinho: let's chat after
<seb128> hey!
<desrt> hi willcooke :)
<willcooke> desrt, Trevinho  - will try and keep this quick
<andyrock> hey!
<desrt> back in UK?
<Trevinho> o/
<willcooke> yes
<willcooke> and the sun is shining
<willcooke> let's rock through this as quickly as we can
<willcooke> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: andyrock
<andyrock> hey
<andyrock> 1. Completed hud branches, dealed a bit with FFe etc until Trevinho got it
<andyrock> 2. Fixed a crash in dash on theme change
<andyrock> 3. Fix unity script crash
<andyrock> 4. Reviews
<andyrock> 5. Start working on a bug with gnome-terminal that fails to restore to the correct size after maximization
<andyrock> \eof
<andyrock> and moved to lappland before the sprint
<andyrock> :D
<willcooke> thanks andyrock.  As soon as I get final confirmation on the HUD invocation keys I will let you know
<andyrock> cool
<willcooke> say hi to Santa from us.  I assume he works at an ice cream stand for the summer
<willcooke> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: attente
<desrt> willcooke: santa belongs to canada :p
<willcooke> :D
<attente> hey, not much, just some gnome-software work
<willcooke> lol
<willcooke> not much
<desrt> hahahah
<willcooke> :)
<attente> :)
<desrt> "living under a giant /frozen/ rock for the last week"
<willcooke> Huge thanks to attente for spending much of his weekend on g-s
 * desrt couldn't get attente to come out and play this weekend, even
<willcooke> next week
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> attente - if you need things/people - let me know
<attente> yep, of course :)
<willcooke> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: desrt
<desrt> trying to figure out this libappmenu issue... it more or less has to be on the unity-panel-service side... pretty sure it's no change in gio or libappmenu since there are no changes there in a year, so leaning toward a gtk change impacting the weird stuff that libappmenu does to it now
<desrt> just about to jump into that now
<desrt> eof
<willcooke> thanks desrt
<willcooke> #topic FJKong_
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: FJKong_
<FJKong_> hi
<FJKong_> last update:
<FJKong_> coding and testing skin for new feature
<FJKong_> half day for going to Embassy of Czech handing material
<FJKong_> one day holiday
<FJKong_> this update:
<FJKong_> unpack skin file with patching libpng
<FJKong_> coding on qt/qml to change each frame after another
<FJKong_> eof
<willcooke> thanks FJKong_ - when do you arrive in Prague?
<FJKong_> 24
<willcooke> safe travels
<FJKong_> thanks
<willcooke> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: happyaron
<willcooke> 1. apng in libpng for Fanjun
<willcooke> 2. slideshow for kylin
<willcooke> 3. prepare sogoupinyin release that aligns with 16.04 release
<willcooke> 4. sponsor uploads
<willcooke> #topic hikiko
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: hikiko
<willcooke> - ezoom: still fighting with the redraws and damages :/ although I fixed several problems I still see visual artifacts on unity because parts of it don't update correctly. I'm working on them. The compiz and nux parts are here:
<willcooke>  |-- https://code.launchpad.net/~hikiko/compiz/compiz.EZ
<willcooke>  |-- https://code.launchpad.net/~hikiko/nux/nux.EZ
<willcooke> - u8: went to the first kpi meeting, got a brief look at some u8 branches, set up virtual manager to install u8 before Prague.
<willcooke> #topic larsu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: larsu
<willcooke> oops
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> #topic Laney
<seb128> lol
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: Laney
<willcooke> Laney, do you want to say anything or just be left in peace?
<larsu> * installed fedora
<willcooke> lol
 * willcooke sets a 15 second time out...
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: qengho
<Sweet5hark> larsu: Fedoras are only for the top of your head ...
 * larsu nods
<larsu> Sweet5hark: I already wondered why nothing worked anymore!
<willcooke> no qengho ?
 * willcooke starts counting again ....
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> â¢ 3 days planning sprint in SLC + travel
<seb128> â¢ gnome-software sponsoring + renaming request/discussions
<seb128> â¢ sponsored accountsservice fix for auth dialog displaying in locked sessions
<seb128> â¢ uploaded some launchpad translations updates for package not using langpacks
<seb128> â¢ backported a gnome-calendar "can't reopen dialog" fix
<seb128> â¢ cleaned out old unity-control-center buggy migration script
<seb128> â¢ landed some themes tweaks
<seb128> â¢ backported a rhythmbox segfault fix
<seb128> + launchpad bugs review/tried to stay on top of release issues
<seb128> </week>
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<Laney> willcooke: here if you want
<willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: Sweet5hark
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: Laney
<Laney> I didn't prepare anything
<Laney> but mainly worked on g-s more
<Laney> apt backend, bug fixes and stuff
<Laney> did an upload or two for attente
<Laney> and I did some other gnome uploads that were pending
<Laney> glib-networking and something else,
<seb128> gvfs? ;-)
<Laney> oh I helped Trevinho with landing his hud things
<seb128> you did gnome-calendar
<Laney> and did some releas-y stuff
<Trevinho> eh, in fact... libnwck either :)
 * seb128 hugs Laney
<Laney> like pushing back on some freeze exceptions (sorry )
<Laney> and finally uploaded a new appstream from ximion
<seb128> hope you guys are having some laught about it at least ;-)Ã 
<Laney> and sponsored some of the backlog
<Laney> a few new packages got appstream because of that
<Laney> END!
<willcooke> thanks Laney, see you Thursday
 * Trevinho loves this "and" prefixed bullet list :-D
<Laney> oh wait
<Laney> I broke featured apps in the latest upload
<Laney> because I didn't install the generated featured.ini
<Laney> need to upload one more to fix that
<Laney> real end
<Sweet5hark> - some crash-on-exit fixes
<Sweet5hark> - wrote a (primitive so far) leak detector for LibreOffice UI-Toolkit smart pointers: https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=99352 -- yielded already some fixes
<Sweet5hark> - reviewed and approved The Document Founation annual report to authorities
<Sweet5hark> - budgeting decisions at The Document Foundation
<Sweet5hark> - took part/led a job interview for a candidate at TDF
<Sweet5hark> - some snappy aftermath
<Sweet5hark> - (also was at the "we were all fired" 5 year anniversary dinner of the good ol' Sun/Oracle OpenOffice crew)
<Sweet5hark> EOF
<ubot5`> bugs.documentfoundation.org bug 99352 in graphics stack "Some VclPtrs leak past DeInitVCL" [Normal,New]
<Laney> write only irc
<Sweet5hark> whops
<Laney> :P
<qengho> willcooke: I'm here. Didn't hear beep.
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: qengho
<qengho> Hey!
<qengho> - working on new chromium security update, v50.
<qengho> - still working on chromium snap. currently on fonts access from inside snap.
<qengho> EOF
<willcooke> thanks qengho
<willcooke> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: TheMuso
<willcooke> Not much this week other than testing accessibility relatedf cuntionality in the installer for Ubuntu and mate flavours. mate is not working properly, requires investivation, will likely need SRUing for .1. I also found a bug when using Orca with unity and suspending... The screen is not being locked, will file a bug in the morning for this one.
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2016: A last adjustment in student selection
<tkamppeter> - OpenPrinting Summit preparations
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<tkamppeter> Next week I will be on the OpenPrinting Summit at HP in Boise, ID.
<willcooke> thanks tkamppeter, have a great time
<willcooke> sorry we will miss you
<tkamppeter> Thanks.
<willcooke> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: Trevinho
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed regression in BAMF (thanks to unit tests for catching it)
<Trevinho> Â· New compiz, unity, bamf, hud landing to get window actions available in HUD
<Trevinho> Â· Studing issues causing weird menu behaviors in xenial
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed some notify-osd issues in handling replacement and appending
<Trevinho> Â· Spent some time in setting up new laptop
<Trevinho> Â· Changed the way the HUD manages the windows, reducing a lot the memory footprint (my new 32GB of RAM doesn't stop me doing this :-])
<Trevinho>  /EOF
<tkamppeter> willcooke, Sprint without long beards.
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho
<willcooke> #topic willcooke
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: willcooke
<willcooke> * Chasing my tail
<willcooke> * Branch for terminal notebook colours
<willcooke> * Fixed calendar theme bugs
<willcooke> * Went to SLC
<willcooke> #topic any other business
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-04-19 | Current topic: any other business
<willcooke> ZOMG - Thursday
<willcooke> I'll be heading to London to "help" Laney and co.  Seb will be there as well
<willcooke> so won't be any meetings on Thursday
<willcooke> Please take some time on Friday to do your lightning talk slides if you need them
<willcooke> desktoppers ^
<willcooke> Anyone got any bugs they think need to be critically fixed before release that aren't generally being worked on?
<willcooke> IMO we've got the big ones on the lsit
<willcooke> list
<Trevinho> I think so
<willcooke> ok, then let's wrap
<willcooke> good luck everyone
<seb128> thanks!
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> wait
<seb128> willcooke, oh, and slides is a good plane activity :p
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> ISO TESTING!
<willcooke> Need moar halp
<seb128> upgrades as well
<desrt> i just did some testing.  unfortunately everything worked properly.
<desrt> pah
<Trevinho> yeah, it's soo bad when it happens
<willcooke> yeah, please everyone, plan on doing so VM installs and upgrades on Thursday if you're not working on bugs
<Trevinho> :)
<willcooke> I will send an email on this topic later on ^  It's really rather important
<willcooke> and I think that really is it
<willcooke> going once....
<willcooke> twice
<willcooke> thrice
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Apr 19 15:58:12 2016 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2016/ubuntu-desktop.2016-04-19-15.32.moin.txt
<willcooke> thanks all
<Sweet5hark> willcooke: (I guess its ok that I threw in my copypasta in Laneys #topic)
<willcooke> yeah
<Laney> if you're happy with it counting as my work
<attente> Laney for new LO maintainer
<Sweet5hark> whats that dust cloud were Laney was a sec ago?
<Trevinho> willcooke: about iso testing... Just tried to run a daily in vmware, but no luck :o. I get a crash on X starting during the installer
<seb128> attente, Laney, desrt, would having an ubuntu-software.desktop (or com.Canonical.Software.desktop) in Untiy instead of org.gnome.Software.desktop create any issue (due to desktop name not matching the dbus one)?
<desrt> there are a couple of intersecting issues there
<willcooke> Trevinho, erk.  Hopefully that's something odd with your set up - works for me in Vbox
<desrt> if you have DBusActivatable=true (and you do) then ya... it's a total non-starter
 * willcooke downloads ISO again 
<Trevinho> willcooke: I think it coudl be related to their "autoinst.iso"...
 * Trevinho goes in the manual way
<desrt> the bus name, by definition, is the same as the desktop file name
<seb128> desrt, what would happen?
<seb128> we have an autostart .desktop starting the service with the session
<desrt> seb128: a dbus message would be sent to something that lacks a .service file and it would be dropped on the floor
<seb128> so it's not getting dbus activated afaik
<seb128> .service?
<seb128> it's not systemd handled
<desrt> seb128: doesn't matter if the process is already running or not.  the thing gets started by sending a Activate message to the bus name that matches the desktop file
<desrt> seb128: it's dbus-handled
<desrt> you're thinking .unit perhaps?
<Trevinho> willcooke: mh, I think there's a crash somewhere could be related to vmwgfx though...
<seb128> well, I just didn't keep up with that
<seb128> in my world the autostart .desktop calls the Exec it has
<desrt> right
<desrt> but we're talking about the applications/ .desktop file, right?
<Trevinho> willcooke: and I've a long time running installation in vmware which has xenial in it... it works fine. But running a new instance with the daily iso seems to crash
<seb128> desrt, well, gnome-software acts as a service
<Trevinho> ouch, it's a compiz crash
<seb128> desrt, /etc/xdg/autostart/gnome-software-service.desktop
<desrt> which file, specifically, did you want to rename?
<seb128> $ grep Exec /etc/xdg/autostart/gnome-software-service.desktop
<seb128> Exec=/usr/bin/gnome-software --gapplication-service
<seb128> org.gnome.Software.desktop
<seb128> or rather I want to make it NotShowIn=Unity
<desrt> the one that you find in /usr/share/applications, right?
<seb128> and have a com.canonical.UbuntuSoftware.desktop
<seb128> that is OnlyShowIn=Unity
<seb128> yes
<desrt> why do you want to do that?
<seb128> because we want different Name= in GNOME and Unity
<desrt> my brain hurts
<seb128> ?
<desrt> will we also have a different name in the title bar of the app?
<seb128> yes
<desrt> okay
<seb128> "Ubuntu Software" vs "Software"
<desrt> if you want to do this, you're going to need to make 3 new copies of things
<desrt> because there are three files here
<desrt> the autostart file, the dbus service file, and the applications/ desktop file
<desrt> this is where the new gapplication appid flag can come in useful
<desrt> of course, there is another option....
<desrt> just drop DBusActivatable=true and call the desktop file whatever you want
<desrt> the only thing you have to worry about in this case is window-matching logic (ie: bamf stuff)
<desrt> but you can probably fix that with a wmclass hint
<desrt> ...but that might not work if the service was already running
<desrt> what you're trying to do is very ugly :p
<seb128> :-/
<desrt> one more idea
<desrt> do we munge XDG_DATA_DIRS by desktop?
 * desrt already nuked her vm
<desrt> honestly, if you're gonna give the app a split personality, i think you ought to go all the way
<desrt> two completely separate app ids
<seb128> yeah, we have /usr/share/ubuntu in front of XDG_DATA_DIRS
<desrt> if that's only for unity then that's your ticket
<desrt> just drop a separate org.gnome.Software.desktop in /usr/share/unity/applications/ with the name you like
<desrt> and it will be taken instead of the GNOME one
<Trevinho> seb128: do you know how can I add debug symbols to a crash with no symbols from cli? I mean, after installing the symbols from ddebs
<seb128> Trevinho, you can "symbol-file /path/to/symbol"
<seb128> but that unload the other ones
<desrt> seb128: otherwise i can probably walk you through figuring out the personality-split proceedure, but i still recommend against it
<seb128> desrt, does the dbus activation thing care about OnlyShowIn?
<desrt> no
<seb128> ok
<desrt> this is a dbus .service file in /usr/share/dbus-1/
<seb128> hum, ignore that
<seb128> if I click on ubuntu-software.desktop in the dash it's going to try to dbus activate that name
<seb128> I'm going to go with
<seb128> " just drop DBusActivatable=true and call the desktop file whatever you want
<seb128>  the only thing you have to worry about in this case is window-matching logic (ie: bamf stuff)"
<desrt> dbus activation is not really a big problem here because there are a half-dozen ways to work around that part of the problem... your issue comes from app matching and the fact that this thing is xdg-autostarted
<desrt> for example, i have no idea if bamf will gate window matching vs. desktop files based on OnlyShowIn
<desrt> i suspect it won't
<desrt> so you might end up with the gnome-software desktop file being shown in the launcher if someone starts it from the dash... and then if someone makes that one a favourite then you'll have gnome-software from then.... or maybe making it a favourite will fail... or... or...
<desrt> and the best part: it will probably be semi-random
<seb128> Trevinho, ^ do you know if that's likely to go fine with bamf?
<desrt> i'm reading bamf source today anyway... let me take a look at this :p
<Trevinho> Mh, I'm not fully into the topic, but we ignore certain .desktop files if have a NotShowIn or OnlyShowIn... I mean we try to avoid to use them for launched apps
<desrt> this is true.
<desrt> that info ends up in the index as well
<desrt> NotShowIn is not handled though
<desrt> only OnlyShowIn
 * desrt cries
 * Laney also
 * Trevinho clean tears
<desrt> the handling is also broken
<desrt> it won't properly treat XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP with : in them
<Trevinho> desrt: yeah, true
<desrt> on balance, i'd say that this is not something we can rely on
<desrt> good news is that gnome-session properly handles OnlyShowIn/NotShowIn for autostart files
<desrt> so you have three viable options:
<desrt> 1) don't do it
<desrt> 2) do it by putting the new desktop file with the same name into /usr/share/ubuntu
<desrt> 3) do it by splitting the app completely, with two separate app ids
<desrt> "completely" here meaning xdg autostart, dbus service file both giving a new appid
<seb128> desrt, I like the usr/share/ubuntu option ;-)
<desrt> i thought you might :)
<seb128> thanks for the suggestion!
<desrt> there is one nice aspect to the 'new appid' idea though -- it would let you gate behaviour changes within the app (such as which name it uses in its titlebar) based on its own appid
<desrt> rather than indirectly via envvars or whatever you're planning on
 * desrt goes to lunch and then an appointment. bbiab.
<flocculant> seb128: sorry to but in and ask but I'll go ahead anyway ... re the above on Ubuntu Software and the other name - is the name for other still staying as Software ?
<flocculant> s/but/butt
<flocculant> or indeed anyone else able to answer that :)
<seb128> flocculant, yes
<flocculant> seb128: thanks :)
<seb128> yw
<Laney> attente: uuuuuummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
<attente> ?
<Laney> where is d7dc006 ?
<attente> Laney: i might've forgotten to push it
<Laney> I can see it but it's not in the branch
<Laney> don't even know how that happens
<Laney> laney@nightingale (ubuntu-xenialâ1|â¦)> git branch --contains d7dc006                                                                                                       ~/dev/gnome/gnome-software
<Laney> laney@nightingale (ubuntu-xenialâ1|â¦)>                                                                                                                                     ~/dev/gnome/gnome-software
<Laney> laney@nightingale (ubuntu-xenialâ1|â¦)> git show d7dc006                                                                                                                    ~/dev/gnome/gnome-software
<Laney> commit d7dc006d041906445c531c78285373b093d82d4b
<attente> Laney: it should be there
<Laney> Author: William Hua <william.hua@canonical.com>
<seb128> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-software/commit/?h=wip/iainl/ubuntu-xenial&id=d7dc006d041906445c531c78285373b093d82d4b ?
<Laney> HOW CAN THIS BE
<Laney> TELL ME GIT
<attente> what
<attente> that shouldn't be on your branch
<Laney> it should if your changelog isn't lies
<attente> Laney: did you fetch?
<Laney> yes that's why git show works
<davmor2> Laney: you're a GIT......what do you mean that's not what you meant??
<attente> Laney: ok.. i remember what happened. i did that on your branch, made a release, fast-forwarded my branch then reset your branch back without that last commit to do the private release...
<Trevinho> seb128, Laney: do you know how to manually launch the installer  session in a live? As it's crashing here in vmware... I'd like to understand what happens
<Trevinho> well, compiz crashes :o
<Trevinho> but I believe it's something down in the stack
<Laney> Trevinho: Look at what the .desktop file does
<Laney> something like ubiquity gtk_ui
<Trevinho> Laney: I mean the one that is launched with no unity, eh...
<Laney> Trevinho: that doesn't use compiz
<Trevinho> Laney: that's what I thought, but I get a compiz crash in /var/crash
<Trevinho> Laney: in order: the UI starts, then X crashes -> black screen -> compiz crash is there
<Trevinho> maybe it uses it only as WM?
<Laney> Trevinho: It uses metacity
<Laney> but I think it's supposed to try to go back to the full live session if the installer only one fails
<Laney> attente: what's the best way for me to do a release?
<Laney> I need to fix the featured.ini thing
<Laney> commit on top of gnome-3-20
<Laney> might be easier for you to do that?
<attente> Laney: i can do it, just add it on your branch
<attente> then i'll cherry-pick ^ on top
<Laney> okay, I put it there
<attente> and the changelog won't lie any more
 * willcooke -> dinner.  bbl
<attente> ok, i'll upload it to a ppa
<Laney> attente: It's ok to just push it, I'll make a tarball from that and upload
<attente> Laney: ok
<attente> Laney: pushed
<Laney> thx
<attente> Laney: (is there some command you're using to generate the version string?)
<Laney> attente: nope
<seb128> Laney, attente, you already rolled tarball?
<Laney> yes
<seb128> k, no buggy
<seb128> no biggy
<seb128> that warning is a bit annoying
<seb128> 		g_warning ("Failed to get changelog for %s version %s from changelogs.ubuntu.com: %s", binary_source, update_version, soup_status_get_phrase (status_code));
<seb128> would be nice to demote to a g_log
<seb128> but not a release issue in any way
<Laney> attente: https://paste.ubuntu.com/15934139/
<Laney> are those src/ changes expected by you?
<Laney> wait
<Laney> +	if (g_strcmp0 (gs_app_get_management_plugin (app), "snappy") == 0) {
<Laney> +		self->enable_reviews = FALSE;
<Laney> +		gtk_widget_set_visible (self->button_review, FALSE);
<Laney> +	} else {
<Laney> +		/* show review widgets if we have plugins that provide them */
<Laney> +		self->enable_reviews =
<Laney> +			gs_plugin_loader_get_plugin_supported (self->plugin_loader,
<Laney> +							       "gs_plugin_review_submit");
<Laney> you should use that quirk instead of that pls
<attente> Laney: the quirk isn't available in our version of appstream-glib
<Laney> #define it in gs-app.h
<Laney> not going to block the release
<Laney> but for next time
<Laney> attente: so are those changes good?
<attente> Laney: i don't know why that svg is there
<Laney> that's the awesome rebranding
<Laney> AWESOME
<Laney> just look at the src/ bits
<attente> hahah
<attente> why do i have to login to download from ubuntu's paste bin...
<attente> Laney: yeah. src/ changes are ok
<Laney> sweet
<attente> Laney: ahhhhh.. it's actually defined in gnome-software master
<Laney> attente: yep you can cherry-pick that
<Laney> he probably added it when adding the quirk?
<attente> yeah
<attente> bless hughsie for thinking of us :)
<Laney> :3
<tjaalton> seb128: trying..
<tjaalton> ..to poke ickle
<Trevinho> ouch... Just noticed that menus are missing the shadows in xenial :/
<Trevinho> desrt, seb128: I was thinking it could be caused by the way we run bamf nowadays (it's dbus-activated, but also using upstart)... But it doesn't seem to be the problem: in a clean session, with no bamf  or unity running, by launcing indicator-loader3 with libappmenu.so correctly loads the indicator entries (thus it causes bamf to run via upstart)
<willcooke> seb128, I enabled proposed and update (dist-upgrade) Software is still called Software
<willcooke> maybe I'm too early
<Laney> Install ubuntu-software, then restart your session
<willcooke> ohhh
<willcooke> that would make more sense
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<willcooke> nope, doesn't show up yet
<willcooke> mirrors
<willcooke> I bet
<willcooke> nope
<Laney> It'd be good to wait until ubuntu-desktop is updated anyway
<Laney> then you can test the upgrade path that users will get
<willcooke> Laney, ack
<ogra_> do we have a bug open for the constantly stuck white shadow in gtk apps ?
 * ogra_ would like to subscribe to it 
<ogra_> this is what i mean ... http://i.imgur.com/dCgFE2K.png ... (it usually stays stuck like that until i scroll again)
<willcooke> ogra_, not see a stuck one before
<ogra_> i see it constantly about 50 times a day ... might be an evo bug though ...
<ogra_> since 15.10 already btw
<ogra_> lol
<ogra_> and i actually only noticed when looking at the screenshot that my evolution isnt translated at all !
<ogra_> (i'mm using it since friday evening that way and totally didnt notice that after the release upgrade)
<willcooke> gotta go. night all
<willcooke> ogra_, please log a bug when you get a chance
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-04-20
<hikiko> Hi
<andyrock> morning all
<pitti> Good morning
<willcooke> morning all
<willcooke> so yeah: https://bugs.launchpad.net/oem-priority/+bug/1564156
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1564156 in System76 "xenial: invalid opcode when using llvmpipe" [Critical,Triaged]
<willcooke> looks like an llvm issue
<willcooke> according to what I read on the bug
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> could well be
<seb128> tjaalton, ^ do you know about that?
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> oh, tjaalton already commented
<happyaron> morning willcooke seb128 pitti
<willcooke> hey happyaron
<willcooke> morning pitti
<pitti> hey willcooke
<seb128> hey happyaron
<seb128> salut pitti
 * happyaron struggling with gcc-5 again
<seb128> what's the issue?
<happyaron> that sogoupinyin again, the library they provided to us needs porting
<happyaron> something they need to run on RHEL 4.x or higher
<willcooke> anyone seeing black corners again?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1508357
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1508357 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu Wily) "Tooltips have a black squares outside of its rounded corners" [Medium,Fix committed]
<willcooke> Trevinho, seb128 ^
 * willcooke upgrades some machines
<seb128> willcooke, I don't, but those don't state their desktop env
<seb128> that could be an issue on !Unity
<seb128> like xfce or such
<willcooke> I'm gonna assume unity
<willcooke> but yeah, good point
<willcooke> I'll see if I can re-create
<seb128> can't see it then and I would be surprised
<seb128> but please check
<seb128> seems to work fine on my machines
<willcooke> cool
<willcooke> lemme check
<willcooke> Laney, larsu - did you guys have any thoughts on the terminal tab issues and linked branch:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-themes/+bug/762349
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 762349 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu Xenial) "Difficult to distinguish which tab is selected" [High,In progress]
<seb128> andyrock, Trevinho, thanks for https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/unity/properly-remove-software-launcher-icon/+merge/292340
<seb128> one liner
<andyrock> Np
<seb128> andyrock, shame that you didn't notice the email when I assigned the bug to you would have been an easy fix to get in the release :-/
<seb128> andyrock, do you filter assigned email? Just trying to figure out how to avoid this to happen again next time
<larsu> willcooke: I unfortunately don't have the time to test this right now (not even a xenial machine *ducks*),  but it looks good to me from a quick read
<willcooke> thanks larsu
<willcooke> it's not really pretty, but it does the job
<larsu> willcooke: someone will read this in 5 years and grudgingly remove the "should be fixed by 3.20" lines :P
<willcooke> :D
<larsu> good work!
<Laney> hiya
 * larsu waves to Laney
<seb128> willcooke, let's discuss landing that tomorrow in London, I doubt release team wants to spend energy today on theming, they are dealing with oem mode issues and we still have the menus to fix and the llvm thing
<seb128> oh, hey Laney!
<Laney> willcooke: no, not yet, probably stable update I'm afraid
<Laney> hey larsu and seb128
<willcooke> Laney, no worries
<andyrock> Seb128 i do
<seb128> andyrock, so it's a one off I guess, let's rediscuss if we get the issue again :-)
<seb128> happyaron, can you do https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/xenial/+source/gnome-software/+pots/gnome-software/zh_CN/61/+translate ?
<happyaron> sure
<seb128> thanks
<happyaron> done
<willcooke> ha!
<seb128> happyaron, thanks
<seb128> willcooke, oh? got the bug?
<willcooke> seb128, oh, no ignore me
<seb128> lol
<willcooke> just in general
 * seb128 adds willcooke spam filters
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> :-)
 * willcooke smashes his head in to the trackpad on his test laptop
<willcooke> this stupid thing is getting worse
<willcooke> it used to go for a few hours without breaking, now it's minutes
<davmor2> willcooke: well it will if you keep smashing your head against it
<seb128> get an external mouse or pad
<willcooke> yeah
<seb128> mine is mostly working on the inspiron
<seb128> though it has a tendency to jump to far left and 30% height
<duflu> willcooke: U8 or U7?
<duflu> Other?
<seb128> U7
<willcooke> duflu, it's a hardware thing
<willcooke> totally unrelated to me taking it apart, mind
<seb128> like I use it and when I try to click it goes to the launcher and click my nautilus icon (which happens to be in this spot)
<duflu> X230? :)
<davmor2> willcooke: yeah, yeah, we'll believe billions wouldn't
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> duflu, it's a Dell Inspiron
<duflu> Which is code for a piece of plastic with indeterminate contents
<duflu> Sometimes good, sometimes bad
<davmor2> willcooke: I'd say buy a new trackpad and replace it but by the sound of it you taking it apart broke it, so that wouldn't help, oh wait no we were believing you right ;)
<willcooke> :)
<tjaalton> seb128: the llvm issue is misdetecting skylake features, 3.9 fixes that and now "something" needs to be backported..
<seb128> "fun"
<seb128> willcooke, ^
<tjaalton> yeah it's not just a cherry-pick
<seb128> :-/
<tjaalton> trying to figure out a minimal set of stuff
<seb128> did much change between our version and 3.9?
<tjaalton> 3.9 isn't released yet
<tjaalton> and yes
<seb128> didrocks, salut, si t'as 30s, tu traduirais comment "Ubuntu Software" ... "Logiciels d'Ubuntu"?
<seb128> didrocks, GNOME translated "GNOME Software" as "Logiciels de GNOME" for reference
<duflu> On the topic of Dell Inspirons, if anyone has a spare Pineview system (Intel N450 etc) then please let us know in #ubuntu-mir
<seb128> what generation of hardware is that?
<seb128> I don't think I've one of those bug asking in case
<duflu> seb128: ~January 2010
<seb128> was that the dell mini 10?
<duflu> seb128: Yes, white and black
<duflu> IIRC
<seb128> some of us had one of those
<seb128> I can get access to mine but not this week
<duflu> seb128: OK, I'll keep it in mind, thanks.
<seb128> yw
 * duflu bought one in 2010
 * duflu also returned one in 2010
<didrocks> seb128: salut! Hum, I would say "Logiciels d'Ubuntu" or "Logiciels sous Ubuntu" (I don't like any of those)
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, I don't like it either...
<seb128> I think I'm going to go with the first one just to be consistent with the GNOME translation
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> hum
<didrocks> or maybe remove the "d'"
<didrocks> "Logiciels Ubuntu" makes sense as well, it's softwares that are part of the repo
<seb128> Logiciels Ubuntu?
<didrocks> yeah, it's plural, so it's not the Ubuntu sofware itself
<didrocks> it's softwares that are part of Ubuntu
<didrocks> (to my mind)
<didrocks> thoughts?
<seb128> right, it's the softwares that are part of Ubuntu
<seb128> I wonder if we should just do a different translation
<seb128> like "LogithÃ¨que Ubuntu"
<didrocks> I always secretly hated the term LogithÃ¨que :)
<seb128> haha
<didrocks> but it's better than "Logiciels d'Ubuntu"
<seb128> no good option!
<didrocks> yeah ;)
<didrocks> so either LogithÃ¨que or Logiciels Ubuntu IMHO
<seb128> "logiciels pas cher" :p
<didrocks> rohhhh ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, merci pour les suggestions
<didrocks> seb128: de rien, bon courage ! :)
<seb128> 'ci
<darkxst> hey didrocks seb128
<seb128> hey darkxst
 * pitti aime le mot "logithÃ¨que"
<seb128> thanks for fixing grilo-plugins!
<seb128> pitti, :-)
<darkxst> seb128, np, we can look at getting the lua into -base next cycle
<didrocks> hey darkxst!
<seb128> right
<larsu> seb128, didrocks: hi! How is âUbuntu Software Centerâ translated into French?
<larsu> could just keep thatâ¦
<didrocks> it's "Ubuntu Software Center" :)
<didrocks> I'm pretty sure it used to be LogithÃ¨que Ubuntu at some point
<didrocks> maybe it's the move to universe which makes it untranslated for now
<larsu> haha trÃ¨s bien
<seb128> right, I'm looking at fixing that now
<seb128> larsu, logithÃ¨que is a "software center"
<seb128> but GNOME Software is software not software center
 * larsu likes French
<seb128> stupid naming if you ask me :-/
<larsu> right
<pitti> yeah, gedit and gtk is gnome software too, no? :-)
<larsu> seb128: yeah... it's consitent with âFilesâ and âNotesâ and such
<seb128> is Software having a plural?
<larsu> hey pitti! Ã§a va?
<seb128> which isn't it "Softwares"?
<larsu> nope
<seb128> no plural?
<pitti> seb128: not in English
<seb128> 1 software, 2 software?
<larsu> yes. It's one of those words like sheep
<pitti> larsu: geht super, danke! und bei Dir, was macht der rote HUt?
<seb128> k
 * larsu forgets the correct term
<larsu> pitti: immer noch nicht angekommen!
<larsu> pitti: aber macht viel SpaÃ soweit :)
<pitti> seb128: it's uncountable, like water or advice
<seb128> doesn't make sense to me
<seb128> I can count gedit + file-roller
<seb128> that's 2 :p
<pitti> 2 projects, or 2 pieces of software
<seb128> oh well, languages... ;-)
<pitti> like two bottles of water
<seb128> in french those are countable
<seb128> 2 logiciels
<pitti> at least Germans often say "advices" (and I think I saw you use that too)
<pitti> that's not a thing either
<seb128> but yeah, no point arguing, it's that way just need to remember it
<seb128> right, we do that too
<pitti> les languages sont tous trÃ¨s Ã©trange :)
<pitti> les langues, dÃ©solÃ©
<seb128> en effet
<seb128> pitti, larsu, btw Software is not translated in german?
<seb128> the german translated translated the title "Ubuntu Software"
<seb128> e.g same as english
<seb128> german translators*
<pitti> everyone says "software" here, yes
<seb128> k
<pitti> seb128: ce matin, J'ai fait une installation par franÃ§ais :)
<seb128> tu as compris toutes les instructions ? ;-)
<larsu> yep, just "Die Software"
<larsu> also not countable
<pitti> non, je n'avais comprendre rien, donc il Ã©tait vrai franÃ§ais :)
<pitti> (just kidding)
<seb128> hehe
<pitti> "il Ã©tait" â "c'Ã©tait", non
<pitti> et comprendre â compris
<seb128> oui
<seb128> "je n'avais rien compris, donc c'Ã©tait du vrai (or "vraiment du") franÃ§ais"
<pitti> seb128: merci
<seb128> de rien!
<willcooke> Nooooooooooooo
<willcooke> why didn't I see this sooner
<willcooke> super-tab is great
<Laney> attente: could you file / find some bugs for important (to be fixed in sru) known issues in gnome-software and then list them under https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseNotes#Known_issues please?
<Laney> others in general can do that too for their stuff
<willcooke> desktoppers ^
<hikiko> Trevinho, when you have some time (probably after the release) could you get a look at the shadows review? :) (tx, just reminding I know you are busy atm)
<attente> Laney: ok. i was also looking at the way the apt plugin was reloading the db yesterday. i think it's failing here: https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-software/tree/src/plugins/gs-plugin-apt.cc?h=wip/iainl/ubuntu-xenial#n382
<attente> which is causing the plugin to refresh with no apps
<Laney> 'k
<attente> Laney: but i'm not sure what's going on there. i think fixing this would prevent the problem of gnome software wiping away all of the apps
<Laney> Probably talk to the apt people
<Laney> does updates_changed make add_upates get called?
<attente> indirectly by refreshing the various shells
<Laney> maybe a mitigation is to not unload until the new one has succeeded
<Laney> or make loading happen in-place
<Trevinho> willcooke: mh I guess I should add the menu issue there...
<willcooke> Trevinho, yes pls.
<Trevinho> and the restart unity-panel-service workaround
<Trevinho> hikiko: yes, I was working on that. Not only on the review (which I did directly on code).
<Trevinho> hikiko: we'll SRU it
<willcooke> I should update it and remove the HUD hotkey while it's still pending a decision
<Laney> Only bugs that someone's quite likely to experience, no need to add every thing there
<Laney> (not saying if these things are such bugs)
<willcooke> ack, thanks Laney
<willcooke> I've commented out the HUD changes for now
<hikiko> Trevinho, what do you mean directly on code?
<Trevinho> hikiko: that I've fixed some things and improved others in a branch
<Trevinho> hikiko: which.. I've here stacked
<hikiko> is there a bug you fixed?
<hikiko> I've tested it and it looked ok :s
<hikiko> I've even tested the edge case of the shaped blob (that changes the window shape in real time)
<hikiko> and looked fine
 * Sweet5hark1 read the backlog and now know 50% more french again.
<attente> Laney: ok. i think i figured out a half-fix
<attente> Laney: the problem seems to be that libapt's _error stores some errors from the initial run. this causes subsequent runs to fail even though they haven't really
<attente> seb128, Laney: also want to know your opinions on changing the Updates to do an unsafe apt upgrade instead of a safe
<attente> linux packages don't seem to be upgraded on safe upgrade
<Laney> attente: do you know how to clear the state?
<Laney> annnnnnnnnd uuuuuummmmmmmmm
<attente> Laney: yeah, it seems to be ok now
<Laney> ok nice
<attente> but yeah. unsafe apt upgrade? because otherwise the updates stay on the list even after trying to install them :/
<Laney> you do a full upgrade instead of upgrading each GsApp?
<attente> only for the system upgrades item
<attente> or for the update all button
<Laney> probably fine
<Laney> check what update-manager does?
<attente> Laney: it's hard to tell from looking at the code, but my hunch is that it does an unsafe one itself where it only ever adds and tries to avoid removing. there's this function saveDistUpgrade
<attente> Laney: https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/wily/update-manager/wily/view/head:/UpdateManager/Core/MyCache.py#L156
<Laney> attente: looks like it works it out itself
<desrt> good morning peeps
<attente> hey desrt
<desrt> attente: did you sleep? :)
<attente> desrt: eh. not really my thing
<Laney> attente: you working on anything more?
<Laney> I could try to slide this in
<attente> Laney: i just uploaded to my ppa
<attente> i think that's going to be it
<Laney> ok
<Laney> link?
<Laney> you should talk to hughsie about that flag
<attente> Laney: https://launchpad.net/~attente/+archive/ubuntu/gnome-software
<Laney> thx
<attente> yeah, i will
<attente> Laney: let me just test a few things
<attente> Laney: before you take that
<seb128> Laney, you try to get that update still in release?
<Laney> yes
<attente> Laney: whoops. i forgot to mention the QUIRK_NON_REVIEWABLE in the changelog
<attente> Laney: let me do a quick fix for that
<Laney> noh well[B[Bnever mind
<Laney> dawhfroaihfa
<Laney> stupid wifi
<Laney> attente: I already copied it to the xenial queue
<Laney> just add it for the next one
<attente> Laney: oh. ok
<seb128> Laney, can you add that to rules? http://paste.ubuntu.com/15946787/
<seb128> oh, you already did an upload
<seb128> so guess for the next one
<Laney> wow
<Laney> is this because no langpack export with that string?
<Laney> attente: got a bzr branch with that upload?
<attente> Laney: i'll push it
<Laney> mmmmmmmmmmerci
<Laney> then go file some bugs and release note them please
<seb128> Laney, right, just injecting some translations in the .desktop after it's stripped so we have those on the iso
<Laney> so it looks like we know about the problems
<seb128> easier than patching langpacks
<seb128> I didn't bother doing de/it/pt because those use "Ubuntu Software" as translations
<seb128> we didn't get one for "ru" yet though
<seb128> which is why I was delaying a bit, but es/fr/zh_CN are probably a good set in additions to the previously mentioned ones
<attente> ok. i feel a bit better with this upload now that that apt db reload works
<seb128> yeah, good job!
<attente> can't seem to log into wiki.ubuntu.com...
<attente> oh. nvm, it did work
<attente> but i don't have permissions to edit i guess...
<attente> willcooke: you're able to edit the release notes, right? who did you talk to to get access?
<willcooke> attente, dunno
<seb128> Laney, ^ is the wiki restricted?
<willcooke> attente, sorry - in a meeting
<seb128> willcooke, thanks for confirming the tooltip bug thing
<willcooke> attente, if you want me to edit it let me know
<willcooke> seb128, nw
<seb128> willcooke, the SdoC is in 1h right?
 * seb128 has a doubt
<willcooke> seb128, yeah - although I don't know if it will happen
<seb128> k
<willcooke> like, I don't know if we've got things to say
<seb128> just checking that I'm not late (again)
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> well, there are probably going to be questions about whether the 500 error thing is resolved
<seb128> and if snaps persist after reboot
<willcooke> yeah, fair
<attente> yeah. i guess i should test that out now with the new snapd
<Laney> attente: I think you need to be in some team
<Laney> attente: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-etherpad that one
<attente> hmm... still immutable
<seb128> Laney, just curious but what is the grilo landing about?
<seb128> seems late for a version upgrade and there is no even a bug reference
<Laney> There was a sponsorship request for it and it contained bugfixes and syncs don't usually have Launchpad bug references
<seb128> k
<seb128> Laney, attente, so, if I do an upload for g-s/translations, should I include other fixes? or just go for that and we can maybe do yet another one with fixes after if needed?
<attente> do we even have time for more fixes?
<seb128> well I guess it depends of how big the change is and how important the fix is and if we respin
<seb128> we can get bugfixes uploads in
<attente> it might be good to have a rollback version anyways in case new fixes cause newer bugs
<Laney> Image builds are going to happen momentarily, but you can put things in the queue
<seb128> attente, if there are proper bug references the update can be turned into a 0day SRU
<seb128> so it's not wasted
<attente> ok
<attente> popey: thanks!
<popey> np
<seb128> popey, what did you do? ;-)
<attente> popey: how long does it take before i can start editing usually?
<seb128> oh, and hey!
<seb128> oh, wiki edit
<Laney> By the way, something needs to be done about the update notification from gnome-software
<Laney> After you read the text you have no idea where to go
<Laney> and it seems to show up more often than it might?
<seb128> it seems to show everytime the apt status change
<seb128> like I had a stack of updates, install one, it notifies
<seb128> I wonder if we should just turn off that notification
<Laney> Need it for firmware and/or snappy
<seb128> well, as you say the notification doesn't help you much
<seb128> my reflex as an old ubuntu user would be start update-manager
<Laney> That doesn't mean that turning it off is the correct solution
<seb128> we autospawn update-manager
<seb128> I would say we should be consistent and autostart g-s when there is a snap of firmware update
<Laney> Don't know
<Laney> I'm not trying to design a solution right now
<Laney> Just raising it as something to think about
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> +1
<seb128> we need to fix it in a SRU anyway
<seb128> going to have a stack of those for .1 in any case
 * seb128 noticed that nautilus' bookmark menu is/stays empty
<seb128> as does gedit recently used
 * seb128 wonders if that's an appmenu issue
<seb128> Trevinho, hey!
<Trevinho> seb128: hey
<seb128> Trevinho, do you have any idea about ^
<Trevinho> seb128: not sure it can be app menu there
<Trevinho> seb128: are those menu items in the quicklist, or you mean the app ones?
<seb128> Trevinho, the appmenu
<Trevinho> seb128: they work without ups, right?
<seb128> Trevinho, I'm trying to figure that out, how do I turn off appmenu nowadays :p
<seb128> Trevinho, anyway, I don't want to distract you from the missing menu bug, is that getting anywhere? what did you try since yesterday? did you comment on the bug asking for more details?
<Trevinho> seb128: no, I didn't write yet. I've been doing some experiments with bamf and libappmenu, but still I can't get anywhere
<Trevinho> seb128: I should probably generate a binary of ups with some debug statements and get to try it
<seb128> Trevinho, yes please
<seb128> Trevinho, seems like it's not an appmenu issue, same with local menus, unping ;-)
<Trevinho> seb128: ah, ok... Your stuff then :)
<willcooke> seb128, attente - quick stand up:  https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/canonical.com/sdoc?authuser=0
<seb128> willcooke, I'm there
<jcastro> none of the snappy packages I've installed show up in my dash, they have .desktop files but I am unsure if unity is aware of their existance
<seb128> jcastro, do they have one in /Var/lib/snapd/desktop?
<seb128> V->v
<Laney> VvVvVvVvVvVvVvVvV
<jcastro> seb128: yep
<seb128> jcastro, weird, unity should list it then
<seb128> did you restart your session since the snappy->snapd thing?
<seb128> the env is set at login and changed
<seb128> is /var/lib/snapd/desktop in your XDG_DATA_DIRS?
<jcastro> ah, I restarted unity but didn't log out and back in, checking now
<seb128> that's session by an Xsession.d script
<seb128> so only at login
<seb128> you might still have the old name then
<jcastro> XDG_DATA_DIRS=/usr/share/ubuntu:/usr/share/gnome:/usr/local/share/:/usr/share/:/var/lib/snappy/desktop
<jcastro> yep
<jcastro> I do
<seb128> there you go
<seb128> try after a session restart
<jcastro> ack, thanks.
<seb128> yw!
<jcastro> and that works, thanks.
<seb128> yw!
<seb128> :-)
<popey> oooh, that helps me too, thanks seb128
<seb128> popey, yw
<willcooke> Trevinho, desrt - did you guys get anywhere with the missing menus?
<Trevinho> willcooke: no, all that I can do is request more debugging bits
<seb128> please do...
<seb128> you already said, but meanwhile we are sitting blocked :-/
<seb128> we have kamstrump on the bug we could email him asking he can join IRC and help debugging maybe
<seb128> Trevinho, want me to email him?
<willcooke> seb128, please do
<seb128> willcooke, k
<willcooke> I've pinged him on Hangouts as well
<willcooke> but don't know if he reads that
<seb128> oh ok
<willcooke> email anyways
<seb128> yeah
<willcooke> might be better
<attente> willcooke: can you update the xenial release notes under Desktop (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseNotes) with this: https://paste.fedoraproject.org/357820/
<Trevinho> seb128: I'm preparing together with other stuff
<attente> i can't seem to edit it still
<willcooke> attente, on it
<seb128> Trevinho, willcooke, email sent
<attente> willcooke: thanks!
<seb128> attente found a pastebin which let you copy without having to u2f log in :p
<attente> seb128: haha
<Trevinho> seb128: thanks, there are other tech guys also having that, but I've not direct contact with them
<seb128> Trevinho, launchpad has this "contact user" feature :p
<seb128> attente, willcooke, Laney, we should probably write something about the fact that g-s doesn't use package descriptions nor their translations
<willcooke> attente, done
<willcooke> do we have a bug number for that?  I can't find one
<seb128> willcooke, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1559338
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1559338 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Doesn't seem to use deb package descriptions?" [High,Invalid]
<seb128> it's invalid there because it's a server side/indexer issue afaik
<attente> ok. is there anything we can do for an sru on the client side?
<attente> *need to do
<seb128> not afaik
<seb128> needs to be fixed on the server
<seb128> the good news it means fixing is also going to make the release iso work
<attente> that is nice. i don't really understand why that info doesn't come from libapt though
<seb128> yeah, me neither
<seb128> there are probably good reasons
<seb128> I just don't understand the architecture enough to know them
<attente> it's ok seb128. me neither :P
<seb128> :-)
<willcooke> seb128, attente  - added that one
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<willcooke> Trevinho, I just can't make this thing break - I've reboot like 50 times now
<seb128> yeah, me neither
<seb128> I think it's a timing issue so if your machine doesn't get it it realiably doesn't
<seb128> like could need a slow hdd
<ximion> attente: for the "where does the long description come from" issue: GNOME Software will ignore anything w/o long description, therefore we must put it into the AppStream metadata - previously, GS did read package descriptions, but it doesn't do that anymore
<ximion> as a consequence of this change, GS doesn't know anymore whether the description is from the package manager or AppStream itself, so it can't simply override them
<ximion> and that's why things are this way ;-)
<ximion> other distribution's package descriptions being bad and/or untranslated plays a major role here ;-)
<attente> ximion: could we provide multiple descriptions and just use the highest quality one?
<ximion> attente: that would require an architectural change in GS *and* appstream-glib
 * ximion doesn't think it's worth it, better work on getting more stuff to ship metainfo files
<seb128> we have some thousands packages with a verbose/useful description
<seb128> and translators spent years of work translating those
<ximion> making the metadata generator read more translations is also the easier fix
<Laney> It's supposed to use descriptions if there's no AppStream one, this is simplly a bug if it's not
<Laney> Including translated ones
<Laney> No need to use emotional pressure
<seb128> I didn't understand the conversation then
<Laney> Me neither.
<ximion> Laney: no, it isn't - it's a deliberate design decision by hughsie to ignore stuff w/o metainfo files in new releases of GS (was even announced on his blogpost)
<Laney> No.
<ximion> the way he detects this is by stuff having a long description or not
<Laney> *you* added the code to use descriptions to the generator
<ximion> Laney: yes, to work around that limitation in GS - we had a brief chat about this, and he wanted things that way
<ximion> and I didn't disagree
<Laney> Don't know what you're talking about then
<Laney> We do use package descriptions
<ximion> on the generator side, yes
<ximion> which should be fine, but apparently it isn't working properly (?)
<Laney> Not with translations it seems
<ximion> oh, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1559338 is realtively old...
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1559338 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Doesn't seem to use deb package descriptions?" [High,Invalid]
<ximion> that stuff is at least fixed here
<Laney> It definitely does miss some translations
<Laney> Can't imagine it is hard to fix
<seb128> Laney, it's not only translations
<seb128> e.G xchat-gnome has no description in g-s and has one in s-c
<seb128> or vlc
<seb128> just taking random examples
<ximion> indeed, long descriptions are missing: http://appstream.ubuntu.com/xenial/universe/metainfo/vlc.html
<seb128> well in any case if that's a bug it's ok, we have it on the release notes and it can be worked on after release
<attente> ximion: it's not really clear to me why that would require an architectural change to appstream-glib. wouldn't we just need to override the description with a higher quality setting when refining it via the apt plugin?
<attente> or is the appstream metadata already the highest quality setting?
<ximion> attente: uhh, I have no idea how that is implemented in GS, actually - but since the AppStream plugin will run first and set a highest-quality description, we'd need to drop the descriptions from AppSteeam metadata (which are from packages), and also stop stuff from being ignored, and we would need to carry a quality rating for descriptions, which AFAIR doesn't exist yet
<ximion> AppStream descriptions always have the highest quality rating
<ximion> seb128: this is definitely not intended
<ximion> my guess is that VLC is a cached app and just needs to be reprocessed
<ximion> (to get descriptions set)
<seb128> k, time for some exercice, bbl
<willcooke> ex er size?  What is this?  Sounds dangerous
 * willcooke remembers the days of lunch hours 
<willcooke> maybe I will pop out for a bit after dinner
<willcooke> that sounds like a good idea
 * TheMuso tries to exercise every morning of the working week at least.
<TheMuso> I find it makes a difference mentally with getting things done.
<davmor2> willcooke: Lunch Hourssss oh yeah that's them things you had in school for food right?
<willcooke> :D
<davmor2> willcooke: I drove a Lorry before this I have no concept of a lunch hour, 30 minutes fries my head :D
<willcooke> When I used to work for BHS mending POS equipment lunch was a Big Mac while driving down the motorway.  My van was literally knee deep in rubbish
<willcooke> eeeee, but they were 'appier times
<TheMuso> lol
<willcooke> right, bed time
<willcooke> London tomorrow
<willcooke> g'night
<willcooke> see ya next week TheMuso
<willcooke> \o/
<TheMuso> Will do. :)
<a1fa> hello, what is the command to reset unity config?
<a1fa> 15.10 to 16.04 and i am not able to log in to unity
<a1fa> looks like update didnt complete
<a1fa> re running it
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-04-21
<hikiko> Hi
<halivingston> hey folks, I just tried the "alleged" final ISO and tried running the desktop under Microsoft HyperV and it installs fine, but on login after you enter your credentials the background just stays there and nothing happens ... but my CPU usage on HyperV Manager says 10%
<halivingston> do you know if you guys tested this scenario? It used to work in beta2.
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> pitti, isn't bug #1572863 a feature? what language did you pick? I though didrocks changed seeded complete support for the main locales with the goal to get ride of the "incomplete" dialog on login
<ubot5`> bug 1572863 in language-selector (Ubuntu) "no "incomplete language support" note in offline xenial install" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1572863
<seb128> changes*
<pitti> seb128: no, check-language-support still gives me two metric tons of dictionaries and stuff, I only have the langpacks installed
<willcooke> morning all
<seb128> weird
<seb128> hey willcooke
<pitti> seb128: well, maybe that is by design now, but that's not what the ISO test case says
<pitti> and I'd like to have German spell checking :)
<seb128> pitti, hunspell-de-* are on the iso
<seb128> as is hyphen-de
<willcooke> desktoppers - ISO test please:  http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/359/builds
<willcooke> desktoppers - for desktop a quick smoke test.  Also look at flavours which don't have as many test runs
<davmor2> willcooke: I done broked it already :(
<davmor2> http://people.canonical.com/~davmor2/desktop-screenshots/wifi-broken.png
<willcooke> noooo
<willcooke> driver issue?
<willcooke> or more wide than that?
<seb128> davmor2, move out of the wood back to civilization?
<seb128> joke aside can you apport report a  bug against network-manager?
<seb128> so we get logs&co
<seb128> davmor2, is that reproducible? when did that start?
<davmor2> seb128: yeap I'm just looking into causes as it works in the oem installer part
<seb128> davmor2, is that an issue in the live session or installed system? does your wifi card requires a firmware?
<davmor2> seb128: intel wifi no driver, it works in live session, it works in the oem installer part so you can download updates, but it doesn't work in the installed end user session on first boot, if you reboot it then does
<davmor2> seb128: hence diggind into it as there are so many different bits to enable and not enable it in and it is finding out if it is every install or what
<davmor2> it doesn't help that the connect to network page has suddenly disappeared from ubiquity either though
<Laney> No need to go on about that bug every 2 minutes, it's known
<seb128> darkxst, rather asking here
<seb128> is the GNOME iso supposed to boot to a "get me started" with no installer reference?
<darkxst> seb128, it should boot to the ubiquity greeter screen
<seb128> I typed ubiquity but it has no result
<seb128> the live session?
<seb128> first item
<seb128> I usually boot to live and run ubiquity from there
<seb128> it feels nicer to have a session to play with while installing
<darkxst> oh in the live session, ubuiqity is in the panel on left in overview
<seb128> which is hidden by default
<seb128> that's quite un-intuitive
<seb128> but ok
<seb128> imho you should not display the "how to get started" on the iso
<seb128> it's more likely than people want to play with things or install
<seb128> rather than watch introduction video and read help
<darkxst> searching for ubiquity (or install) should also work?
<seb128> not in the tutorial app which is maximized
<seb128> like my default reflexe was to try to use what pop in front of my screen
<darkxst> oh I see, right
<darkxst> interesting the GCI kids all loved the tutorial app! it probably doesnt need to be on the live session though
<darkxst> or maybe would be better if it wasnt maximised?
<darkxst> I wonder if we could do a simple popup/notification "Press <super/win> key to get started"
<seb128> darkxst, unsure, but closing/not maximizing doesn't help either since your desktop is empty
<seb128> like there is nowhere obvious on screen that you can hit the activity corner to get the dash
<seb128> so if you are not a GNOME user you get to sit down there watching tutorial or an empty desktop
<seb128> oh well, I guess most of users are GNOME users and now where to go ;-)
<darkxst> well there is a slight learning curve compared to a traditional DE
<darkxst> and yet even windows users just go and click on "Activities" not try and press <super> which even opens the menu on windows (maybe they don't know that either though!)
<seb128> darkxst, good work, Ubuntu GNOME looks good ;-)
<seb128> just did an i386 installation
<seb128> worked great
<darkxst> seb128, thanks, should be a very solid release
<Laney> mark them as ready!
<darkxst> Laney, ok, I just finished smoketesting the last images, look good here also
<Laney> :3
<seb128> mdeslaur, lol, I didn't see that this trusty samba update was 4.1 to 4.3 serie, fun one!
<mdeslaur> seb128: yeah, the fix was over 400 commits, no hope to backport it into 4.1
<seb128> urg
<mdeslaur> everyone else updates to either 4.2 or 4.3 too
<mdeslaur> s/updates/updated/
<seb128> that's quite annoying what happens
<seb128> its means security update disrupt your working infra
<seb128> but I guess no choice there...
<mdeslaur> yeah, we didn't really have a choice
<mdeslaur> this is the perfect example of why we usually backport fixes instead of upgrading versions
<seb128> right
<seb128> especially on something complex/interacting with other systems like samba
<a1fa> whats with unity mouse acceleration? i dont know if i should open up a bug report or not
<a1fa> but disabling mouse acceleration in the mouse setting should disable the mouse acceleration
<a1fa> i shouldnt have to use xinput
<a1fa> xinput --set-prop 8 "Device Accel Velocity Scaling" 1
<a1fa> and why does launchpad no longer allow you to report a bug ;(
<seb128> Trevinho smells
<Trevinho> mh
<seb128> Trevinho, sorry, I made the mistake to let my laptop unlocked
<seb128> somebody used the opportunity
<Trevinho> seb128: yess, yesss......
<Trevinho> :)
<willcooke> :D
<seb128> cyphermox, did you look at the missing "connect to wifi" page in ubiquity?
<cyphermox> started looking yeah
<cyphermox> you still have nm-applet, and it's too late for fix now.
<seb128> still looking? did you figure you somebody
<seb128> Laney is starting as well and just said he was sure he would duplicate work with somebody
<seb128> seems like he's right :p
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> just don't want to dup too much work
<seb128> how much did you look?
<seb128> should we stop?
<cyphermox> no, please keep at it
<seb128> k
<cyphermox> I only just got up minutes ago, and jumped right in a meeting
<seb128> k
<cyphermox> all I did was yesterday try to add printfs and such to find out if it was being started at all, but I didn't see any hints
<cyphermox> I don't know why it's unhappy
<Laney> cyphermox: I found the problem
<Laney> stand by
<seb128> happyaron, e.u.c daily xenial view has some youker-assistant reports about import error due to missing lxml
<seb128> is anyone looking at that?
<Laney> pitti: do you know things about dbus-python?
<pitti> Laney: that's a trick question :)
<Laney> The wifi bug is because we ask for a property called 'state'
<Laney> but it's actually called 'State'
<Laney> apparently dbus-python handled uppercasing in trusty but not in xenial
<Laney> ???????????????????
<pitti> oh, did that change between 1.0 and 1.2?
<pitti> oh, wow
<Laney> I'm asking if it is known and/or deliberate :)
<pitti> not to me, at least; so far whenever I used properties I just spelled them right
<Laney> haha
<pitti> so, single-character fix?
<seb128> yep
<Laney> well
<Laney> I'm worried that it might be a problem elsewhere
 * seb128 saw a wifi screen on Laney's screen
<pitti> well done -- can't possibly get smaller for an SRU :)
<cyphermox> Laney: definitely sounds like it could be a problem elsewhere
<cyphermox> Laney: nice catch
<Laney> this instance is obviously trivial to fix
<Laney> but if other things expected the old behaviour...
<Laney> I don't see any in ubiquity though
<pitti> do we know, was this still working in wily?
<pitti> ah, nevermind
<pitti>  dbus-python | 1.2.0-2build2  | trusty  | source
<pitti>  dbus-python | 1.2.0-2build2  | vivid   | source
<pitti>  dbus-python | 1.2.0-2build3  | wily    | source
<pitti>  dbus-python | 1.2.0-3        | xenial  | source
<Laney> haha
<pitti> it's not like this actually changed much
 * Laney didn't look there
<Laney> did we switch py2->3?
<pitti> and http://launchpadlibrarian.net/234773210/dbus-python_1.2.0-2build4_1.2.0-3.diff.gz has no code changes at all
<Laney> hmm, nope, I was reproducing on python3
<Laney> umm, not reproducing
<Laney> dbus change?
<pitti> more probable, yes
<seb128> nothing obvious in the commits log or bugzilla*
<pitti> but that means it would affect dbus-glib, gdbus etc. too
<pitti> Laney: did that affect wily already?
<pitti> I suppose not
<seb128> I think not
<Laney> yes
<pitti> then we at least don't look at the 1.6 -> 1.10 changes, only at 1.10.0 to 1.10.6
<seb128> it does?
<Laney> I used d-feet and it works
<Laney> yes to my previous question
<pitti> $ busctl introspect org.freedesktop.NetworkManager /org/freedesktop/NetworkManager | grep State
<pitti> .State                              property  u           70                                       emits-change
<pitti> that says it's "State", not "state" ??
<Laney> State is the right name
<pitti> oh, what you said, sorry
<Laney> but on old dbus you could do Get(iface, 'state')
<Laney> and it worked
 * Laney goes to ask smcv
<pitti> Laney: that should be simple enough to test with dbus-send on a trusty VM?
<Laney> that's what I just did
<Laney> I'll just fix ubiquity, but want to confirm that this was intentional
<Laney> cyphermox: can haz bug number?
<cyphermox> not sure, too many tabs
<cyphermox> Bug 1572793
<ubot5`> bug 1572793 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Ubiquity no longer prompts to join available WiFi networks" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1572793
<Laney> ta
<pitti> if we all think very hard, can we flip that one bit on our released image?
<Laney> I can go and sed them
<cyphermox> pitti: you don't want to respin? :)
<Laney> don't worry
<cyphermox> Laney: live binary sed at download-time, everywhere
<cyphermox> oh, the NSA could help there.
<pitti> cyphermox: no, just direct some strategic solar radiation on the world's mirrors :)
<cyphermox> you mean bit-flipping using a magnifying glass?
<pitti> whatever helps :)
<cyphermox> I thought that's what "stategic solar radiation" meant, at least if you apply the same logic to ants.
<pitti> strategically aimed/placed at that bit, I meant
<pitti> anyway, 16.04.1 it is
<cyphermox> yep
<seb128> charles, tedg, did any of you had a chance to look at the geoclue issue?
 * tedg has not
<seb128> :-(
<Laney> cyphermox: for your reviewing pleasure
<cyphermox> SHIP IT!
<cyphermox> :)
<Laney> might be a good idea for someone other than me to test
<cyphermox> yep I will in a second
<pitti> i. e. this is boot life session, change that s to an S (or install -proposed package), run ubiquity, right?
<Laney> sure
<Laney> not that there is any package yet
<pitti> right, but that change is simple to apply inline on a running system
<Laney> yep, just saying so that you don't go looking
<cyphermox> davmor2: ok, that other bug is as I said, in the oem-config, after we get back to a "real" session, wpasupplicant has been killed.
<cyphermox> no supplicant = no wifi
<davmor2> cyphermox: \o/
<davmor2> cyphermox: so that is a fixable thing right?
<cyphermox> davmor2: yeah, given enough eyes, all bugs are shallow
<cyphermox> given enough hammers, anyone can fix systemd units.
<davmor2> cyphermox: I have hammers it how I break things :)
<pitti> (needs really big mallets, though)
<cyphermox> but I think maybe I'd just make things reboot rather than trying to get to a session straight out of the oem wizards
<cyphermox> perhaps all we need is for wpasupplicant to ship a unit, so that things don't get killed off if it's running already
<cyphermox> oh, except it does
<cyphermox> and the busname looks wrong.
<pitti> I have fi.epitest.hostap.WPASupplicant and fi.w1.wpa_supplicant1
<cyphermox> [Service]
<cyphermox> Type=dbus
<cyphermox> BusName=fi.epitest.hostap.WPASupplicant
<cyphermox> ExecStart=/sbin/wpa_supplicant -u -s -O /run/wpa_supplicant
<cyphermox> it should be fi.w1 ^
<cyphermox> where do you have both pitti?
<pitti> /usr/share/dbus-1/system-services/fi.epitest.hostap.WPASupplicant.service and /usr/share/dbus-1/system-services/fi.w1.wpa_supplicant1.service
<cyphermox> right
<pitti> and tab-completing "busctl introspect fi.<tab>"
<cyphermox> I'm looking at wpa_supplicant.service under /lib/systemd/system
<pitti> right
<pitti> that name does exist, but there's another one, not sure which is the "right" one
<seb128> https://blog.mozilla.org/futurereleases/2016/04/21/firefox-default-browser-for-linux-users-ubuntu-new-snap-format-coming-soon/
<cyphermox> fi.w1... seems to me like the right one. that's where we talk to wpa from NM, in any case
<pitti> cyphermox:  nice catch; then it should (re)start on demand again
<pitti> so is /usr/share/dbus-1/system-services/fi.epitest.hostap.WPASupplicant.service entirely obsolete then?
<cyphermox> maybe, lemme see if it's not really used only for hostap
<pitti> oh, or maybe it actually does listen to both names
<pitti> the old name for backwards compat reasons
<cyphermox> yep
<cyphermox> for some reason upstream only ships the old name as a systemd unit?!
<tedg> seb128: So apparently we want to SRU unity8-policy-kit, which is a new package and on CI-Train. I don't know how all those work together.
<tedg> seb128: I don't think I can make an SRU bug until the package exists, no?
<seb128> tedg, you can open a bug against "ubuntu" and reference it to the changelog, the important bit is to have a page for the testing/tracking, no to have the right component/autoclosing on upload
<tedg> seb128: Okay, will do
<tedg> Thanks!
<seb128> tedg, yw!
<seb128> tedg, what was the review url you pinged me about the other day?
<seb128> I can have a look now
<tedg> seb128: Cool, it is the packaging for this package: https://code.launchpad.net/~ted/unity8-policy-kit/initial-work/+merge/291371
<seb128> tedg, charles, any chance I can one of you to look at this geoclue issue in exchange? :p
<tedg> seb128: Heh, probably not today as we're both doing time critical things today, but I should be free tomorrow.
<seb128> sounds like a good friday afternoon thing ;-)
<seb128> thanks!
<tedg> Oh, now that we have a VPN I wonder if I can test being in the UK....
<cyphermox> pitti: this didn't look to have worked :/
 * tedg starts substituting all his 'z' and 's's
<charles> seb128, as tedg said, today doesn't look good
<seb128> charles, I think you are in Prague next week? I can nag you in person there :p
<tedg> seb128: Heh, don't let him change his timezone without a fix!
<seb128> tedg, right!
<seb128> tedg, " This package provides a service for the Pay Service" ?!
<seb128> tedg, did you copy/paste the description from the pay-service and didn't change it?
<tedg> Oops, copy paste :-)
<seb128> tedg, also policykit / policykit-gnome ... can you do "unity8-policykit" for consistency? (without the "-")
<seb128> (I guess it's a bit more annoying because it would mean renaming the launchpad project)
<tedg> Yeah, though we could make the deb and the LP project be different.
<seb128> would be confusing as well
<seb128> like users would try to go from the package to the launchpad page using the name and get a not found
<tedg> Heh, I'd like to see a user figure out there's an issue with the policykit agent :-)
<seb128> tedg, copyright should be updated to -2016 (nitpick)
<tedg> More worried about Ubuntu Devs
<seb128> right, those are your users as well :p
<tedg> Heh
<tedg> seb128: Copyright and description updated. What do you want to do with the package name?
<tedg> We're gonna have to rebuild, so we could change the LP project as well.
<davmor2> willcooke, pitti, cyphermox: do we know what is happening with this now?
<seb128> tedg, if you rename can you make it policykit-unity8? consistent with -gnome/-kde/...
<seb128> tedg, but yeah renaming is better if that's not too much work
<willcooke> davmor2, "this"?
<cyphermox> davmor2: what's "this" ?
<davmor2> willcooke, cyphermox: the wifi issues
<willcooke> davmor2, yes!
<cyphermox> in part, yeah
<cyphermox> my idea for wpasupplicant doesn't seem to work though
<tedg> seb128: K, I'll just make a new LP project and kill the old one.
<davmor2> no don't say that
<seb128> tedg, thanks
<seb128> tedg, the packaging/license/etc looks fine otherwise
<tedg> seb128: Cool, thanks!
<seb128> yw!
<willcooke> congratulations desktoppers
<Trevinho> Yay!
 * Trevinho takes drinks out from the fridge
<willcooke> \o/
<seb128> thanks!
<seb128> well done team!
<seb128> and other teams as well ;-)
<davmor2> \o/
 * pitti goes and grabs a xerus ice cream
<pitti> ... for purely medical reasons, of course!
<ximion> congrats to the successful release! :)
<ximion> and I must say, GNOME Software / Ubuntu Software is working well here :)
<jcastro> it is quite nice
<tedg> seb128: So we have the branch to add a libpam-cgfs dep for UAL so that it gets pulled in for unity8, but that then fails on vivid because there is no libpam-cgfs. Is there a way to write that dep so that it'll work on vivid and xenial?
<andyrock> \o/
<willcooke> out
<Laney> in ou tin
<flocculant> attente: when you're about - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1551707/comments/3
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1551707 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Installing local debs gives an error dialog" [High,Fix released]
<flocculant> if it is in fact different I'll report it - unless it gets reported in the meantime
<attente> flocculant: hey, i'm not sure what's going on there, i just tried it with some other debs, but maybe there's some deps missing that would cause the error message...
<flocculant> attente: could be - if I try with gdebi - it wants to get 2 dependencies
<attente> flocculant: ok, yeah. so i'm not sure what to do there. on the one hand it sounds like erroring out is the right thing to do if we can't install the deb due to missing deps, on the other, maybe we could be better about looking for those deps
<flocculant> I'd have to assume that the second would be the way to go :)
<flocculant> but no coder here ;)
<flocculant> attente: mmm - so I installed the deps that gdebi needed, but it still fails with software
<attente> flocculant: oh... really?
<flocculant> yea
<flocculant> just going to look in a clean install
<attente> flocculant: ok, i'll look into it
<attente> flocculant: not sure that will change much
<flocculant> well - this install has been kicked about all over the place for the last 2 or 3 months - so I prefer to check :)
<attente> flocculant: sure, be my guest :) i'm not expecting anything different though...
<flocculant> attente: well the issue is 'slightly' different on that - doesn't install, but don't get the error popup
<attente> flocculant: it actually doesn't install? or is it just the button that isn't updating properly?
<attente> that second one is a known issue
<attente> do you see the progress bar at all for installation on the button?
<flocculant> attente: it doesn't install - I saw the progress bar - which I would think finished much too quickly to have been the install
<attente> ok. did it pop up a dialog asking you to authenticate with user password?
<flocculant> no
<attente> flocculant: can you link to the deb? i want to try that specific one
<flocculant> https://www.google.com/chrome/browser/desktop/ 64 bit
<flocculant> locally I needed to install libappindicator1 and libindicator7 to allow gdebi to install it
<flocculant> attente: also I'm using xubuntu - not that it should make any difference
<attente> flocculant: yeah, i can reproduce with that deb
<flocculant> attente: ok cheers :)
<flocculant> attente: you need anything from me at all now?
<attente> flocculant: nope. i see the error message too :)
<attente> GDBus.Error:org.debian.apt.TransactionFailed: error-unreadable-package-file: [Invalid UTF-8]
<flocculant> okey doke - I shall wander off into the void again then :)
<flocculant> thanks for looking
<attente> flocculant: nooo not the void! :P
<attente> flocculant: thanks for letting me know :)
<flocculant> welcome :)
<flocculant> nice to actually have some idea of who to tell to be honest - this is a rather useful channel for a flavour's qa to idle in :)
<attente> hehe, indeed!
<TheMuso> Holy crap! Just discovered that systemctl can use policykit so you don't have to run it with sudo. Wow thats awesome! :)
<TheMuso> Although you do have to autnehticate every time.
<TheMuso> Still, useful to know.
 * Laney can't remember if polkit has caching
<Laney> but I thought that the gnome agent did
<Laney> could be just making that up though
<TheMuso> Seems not for systemctl at least.
<TheMuso> The GNOME agent may, but this was under Unity.
<Laney> that's the gnome one
<Laney> Just checked, doesn't here
<TheMuso> Ah ok.
<Laney> still, cool of systemd to use that
<TheMuso> Indeed.
<TheMuso> I discovered it totally by accident, calling systemctl to work with a service without using sudo.
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-04-22
<JanC> seems like upgrades to 16.04 don't install the breeze theme for LibreOffice?
<hikiko> Hi
<pitti> Good morning
 * ricotz welcomes yakkety
<pitti> my dictionary fails on that -- I suppose that's just some made-up and phonetically nice word, yes?
<pitti> a yak alliteration
<ricotz> haven't investigated it yet ;)
<flocculant> pitti: "just catching up on everything...nothing important "
<pitti> flocculant: that's what "yakkety" means?
<flocculant> and some really old song that infinity remembers :p
<flocculant> yup
 * pitti still votes for rolling in between LTSes :)
<ricotz> ah, so still a placeholder?
<flocculant> I said it to tsimon in xubuntu-offtopic when I failed to come up with a yy name for me to use :)
<pitti> no, that adjective is settled -- https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/yakkety
<flocculant> ricotz: yea :)
<ricotz> pitti, I see
<flocculant> pitti: LOL
<ricotz> "Yakkety yakkety yakkety yakkety yakkety yakkety yakkety yakkety yak. Naturally ð"
<ricotz> by quoting http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/1496
 * flocculant is prescient ... "<flocculant> it's still on the w spec for someone to copy to the yakkity yak one" from weeks ago :p
<pitti> we all pretty much agreed on the yak :)
<pitti> but I suppose there's no adjective sufficiently close to shaving that starts with y :)
<ricotz> heh
 * Sweet5hark takes out the papers and the trash!
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark
<pitti> bonjour seb128 ! wie gehts/
<seb128> salut pitti! sehr gut, danke! und dir?
<pitti> seb128: prima, danke!
 * pitti feels very yakkety
<seb128> was a name announced?
<pitti> seb128: yes, although a lot less funny post than usual: http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/1496
<seb128> lol
<seb128> no fun, infity/the guys at the office had it right :p
<seb128> it's not usual that Mark picks something suggested by others!
<Sweet5hark> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6-2eXjx-h0 looping here
<pitti> seb128: I guess the yak was pretty much without alternative anyway
<seb128> yeah, but "yakkety" could have been changed ;-)
 * seb128 is facing the dilemna about what to do with his laptop
<seb128> I guess I'm going to stick to the LTS until .1
<seb128> or at least a bit to get some SRUs going
<pitti> VMs FTW!
<willcooke> morning seb128 pitti
<pitti> hey willcooke
<larsu> morning! Congrats on the release!
<pitti> hey larsu, thanks!
<seb128> hey willcooke, had a good trip back yesterday?
<seb128> hey larsu, thanks!
<larsu> also, yakkety yak is a *perfect* ubuntu name
<seb128> pitti, right, but you don't end up using VMs much, you just spawn them for quick testing
<seb128> ;-)
<willcooke> seb128, met an old school friend after the office, so didnt get home till late
<seb128> pitti, I can as well build/test apps on xenial and downgrade back then
<pitti> seb128: yeah, but that seems alright for you for doing yakkety stuff until .1?
<Sweet5hark> FWIW, me does all testing on VMs (and building on pbuilders) ... -- currently having 11 VMs (sized for LibreOffice) which brings the 512GB SDD to its limits sometimes ...
<seb128> willcooke, oh ok, nice, at least you celebrated xenial :-)
<willcooke> seb128, :)
<larsu> Sweet5hark: I hope some of those are nested... :P
<larsu> that's where the fun comes in
<seb128> pitti, I usually don't even bother doing VM, I do my merges on n-1 and test there and then downgrade, at least for GNOME apps and such, like if it's the same upstream version and just merges not a lot can go wrong
<pitti> n-1?
 * flexiondotorg fears the Yak shaving jokes.
<willcooke> morning Sweet5hark larsu
<willcooke> flexiondotorg, :)  I can't work out if that's real or epic troll
<flexiondotorg> willcooke, I hope a troll.
<flexiondotorg> Youthful Yucatan anyone?
<flexiondotorg> Has the advantage it's a squirrel, so no artwork changes.
<willcooke> :D
<flexiondotorg> And no last minute scramble with the design team ;-)
<seb128> pitti, yak-1 = xenial :p
<Sweet5hark> larsu: precise64, trusty64, vivid64, wily64, xenial64, ooo33, aoo411, debian, snappy, vagrant_default..., allsnaps. I guess some could be cleaned up by now ...
 * larsu is impressed
<flexiondotorg> willcooke, not a troll. Syncs have started to yakkety.
 * Sweet5hark needs to add yakety yak to technical.dic. Totally a technical term right now.
<ara> willcooke, seb128: hello!
<ara> willcooke, seb128: did we remove browsing files using BT in xenial on purpose?
<seb128> hey ara
<seb128> ara, removed from where compared to what?
<ara> seb128, if you open set up a mobile device over BT, you no longer have the option to browse the files in the phone
<ara> seb128, you are able to send or receive files, but not browse the contents
<seb128> ara, was that working and in what ubuntu version? 14.04? 15.10?
<seb128> ara, and what were you using to browse them, nautilus?
<seb128> ara, please provide some details
<ara> seb128, 14.04 for sure, no sure about wily sorry
<ara> seb128, using the indicator
<seb128> the indicator is only a menu
<seb128> it never provided some "browsing UI"
<seb128> so I guess it was calling from some external program
<ara> hey chih
<seb128> hey chih
<ara> seb128, chih is the one reporting this issue, he will be able to give you more details
<chih> hello seb128
<seb128> ara, thanks
<seb128> chih, what did you use to browse those shares with? nautilus
<seb128> is that using obex?
<chih> seb128, using obex is fine. it is through gui tool that has issues
<seb128> what gui?
<chih> seb128, bluetooth-setting?
<seb128> bluetooth-setting is not a thing
<seb128> we don't have such codebase/app/project
<seb128> nor ever did
<chih> seb128, right. need to be more precise. hold on.
<seb128> can you just describe/screenshot/screencast what you did on 14.04?
<seb128> did you use to browse your phone with nautilus over obex?
<seb128> is that what this is about?
<chih> seb128, unity-control-center bluetooth
<seb128> that's the config panel
<seb128> it allows to pair device
<seb128> it never had a file browser included
<chih> seb128, we used another pc to file browsing
<seb128> ok, that's getting nowhere
<seb128> please provide a screencast of what you are doing on the old Ubuntu
<seb128> or tell me what application is used for browsing
<chih> seb128, sure. we should have prepared for this
<seb128> or is the app that secret that nobody wants to share its name? ;-)
<chih> seb128, let us find it out for you.
<seb128> thanks
<chih> seb128, sure
<seb128> chih, ara, I expect you are using nautilus and being bitten by http://www.hadess.net/2011/11/obexftp-in-gnome-non-update.html / https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=745621
<ubot5`> Gnome bug 745621 in [obsolete] obexftp backend "remove obsolete obexftp code" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<chih> seb128, need to go attend a call now. i am having another team member check with you on this issue.
<seb128> k
<kristinchuang> seb128: ping
<seb128> lol
<seb128> hey kristinchuang ;-)
<kristinchuang> seb128: hello :)
<kristinchuang> seb128: I'm here to provide some info on debugging the BT browsing function :)
<seb128> kristinchuang, can you screenshot/screencast what you used to do which worked? or give me the name of the application doing the browsing (is that nautilus?)
<kristinchuang> seb128: do you mean the application that's supposed to be doing the actual browsing (i.e. showing all the files to be browsed)? Yes that's nautilus
<seb128> k
<seb128> thanks, that's all I wanted
<kristinchuang> seb128: but I haven't been able to reach the step where nautilus is launched though
<seb128> kristinchuang, so I think your issue is https://git.gnome.org/browse/gvfs/commit/?id=606ef241fb8677528bd5d5526854658f0f298a2c
<seb128> see http://www.hadess.net/2011/11/obexftp-in-gnome-non-update.html
<seb128> and https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=757901
<ubot5`> Gnome bug 757901 in [obsolete] obexftp backend "Resurrect obexftp backend" [Normal,New]
<seb128> basically that feature was buggy and non maintained and didn't work with bluez5
<seb128> so they removed it
<kristinchuang> seb128: I see......thanks! Let me go get engineers involved first and get back to you later :D
<seb128> kristinchuang, yw!
<seb128> kristinchuang, sorry but it's not going to be an easy fix
<kristinchuang> seb128: :D oops so this means that there's no confirmed schedule for the resurrection yet right?
<seb128> kristinchuang, correct, nobody seems to work on it
<seb128> there is a patch on the bug I pointed out
<seb128> but it got one review and has been sitting there since
<kristinchuang> seb128: ok got it. Thanks for the info!
<seb128> yw!
<Laney> meow
 * Laney is running yakkety
<Laney> it's reaalllly stable
<willcooke> :D
<pitti> hey Laney
<Laney> hey pitti!
<pitti> Laney: ooh, any kool new features yet? :-)
<Laney> shiny png transition to get your teeth into :P
<pitti> Laney: oh, that actually has new packages already?
 * pitti had assumed it would need a new toolchain first
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/yakkety/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=
<Laney> soon
<pitti> then I guess I'll do my traditional debhelper merge today :)
<Laney> yeah, you can put stuff in the queue
<pitti> Laney: but still working on charming up lxd workers, so that we can move armhf to scalingstack
<Laney> w00t
<pitti> finally, some actual development after this crazy week :)
<pitti> Laney: put more eggs into that brittle basket :-P
<seb128> hey Laney
<seb128> Laney is the opposite of me :p
 * seb128 sticks to the LTS and intend to SRU strongly in the next weeks
<seb128> no yak to shave here!
<seb128> willcooke, btw any though as what as a team we should focus on in the next weeks? unsure if we should have a team focus or just let people go crazy on what they prefer doing ;-)
<seb128> Laney, where did you guys go to eat btw?
<Laney> seb128: the diner place
<willcooke> seb128, not sure I follow you.  Sprint next week where I we can discuss goals etc - or do you mean something else?
<Laney> pitti: charming> where's juju involved in that part?
<Laney> using juju to manage lxd?
<pitti> Laney: we need autopkgtest-cloud-worker to be able to start workers with an lxd configuration
<seb128> Laney, the one place where you can get dinner in London? ;-)
 * seb128 hides
<Laney> one n!
<pitti> Laney: hand it a list of "architecture IP #workers"
<Laney> the place up the road
<Laney> where we got a free meal
<seb128> oh, I see!
<seb128> fancy
<seb128> :-)
<Laney> I had an "american breakfast"
<Laney> was good
<seb128> was the free meal coupon still valid?
<pitti> Laney: and it sets up the correspondig remotes, uses a different worker.conf, and call lxd on these remotes instead of ssh/nova
<seb128> oh
<seb128> that one
<seb128> gotcha
<pitti> Laney: I also want to create a separate machine/service for the lxd controllers; the nova autopkgtest-worker service/machine is loaded enough already
<pitti> (controller, just one for now)
<seb128> willcooke, no, I was just wondering how we put the balance between LTS work/stabilization/SRU and new yakky crazyness, but I guess that's a good topic for next week
<pitti> Laney, seb128: you guys are back home now?
<seb128> pitti, I am
<Laney> pitti: ah right, I just thought you would teach the existing one how to do lxd too
<seb128> was only in London for one day
<Laney> pitti: nope, but I'm going to head back in the day today
<pitti> Laney: yeah, it's the same charm, but it needed some extension for all this
<pitti> Laney: just boring plumbing for the most part, but it needed to be done :)
 * pitti still needs some time to train his fingers to write juju-1 instead of juju, argh
<Laney> hehe
<Laney> alias juju=juju-1 :P
<willcooke> seb128, gotya.  There are a couple of clear issues in X that need sorting around g-s and the missing menus issue which we should get on, but I think we can afford a day of playing :)
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> well, playing is fine
<seb128> I guess people who update still have the LTS in a vm and can work on SRUs there
<Laney> that stuff is going to be fixable in both
<seb128> yeah, it's just that we have a big stack of things worth SRUing and probably more are going to be reported
<willcooke> I think over the next, say, 6 weeks, we'll spot the really common issues
<seb128> maybe se should a sub/virtualteam focussed on .1
<seb128> we did that after some previous LTSes (precise(iirc?) had a formal virtual team with explicit goal to work on .1)
<seb128> +get
<willcooke> and get people from kernel, etc etc as part of that team?
<seb128> yes, we have 1/2 person of each team, kernel/foundation/desktop/qa
<seb128> had*
<willcooke> davmor2, jibel - how would you guys be fixed for some additional 16.04 QA over the next couple of months?
<willcooke> and then maybe CC cyphermox and/or xnox? ^
<willcooke> or pitti?
 * willcooke volunteers all the people 
<seb128> :-)
<willcooke> I'll speak to Steve of course
<seb128> yeah, let's see, I don't know if that's compatible with the objective/focus for next cycle
<seb128> e.g if we can manage to officially redirect that bunch of people to the .1
<seb128> but it would be nice if we could :-)
<willcooke> worth exploring for sure
<willcooke> I think NM will need some love
<seb128> for sure
<willcooke> xorg / fglrx
<willcooke> ubiquity
<willcooke> snapd
<willcooke> ;)
<seb128> :-)
<willcooke> maybe bluez?  Seems ok so far, but OEM might want some work of theirs SRUing?
<seb128> yeah, let's see what's the feedback/reports in the next weeks or so
<willcooke> sounds like a good plan
<davmor2> willcooke: No but what I would suggest is we start 16.04.1 testing earlier maybe instead
<willcooke> :)
<davmor2> willcooke: so I think that cyphermox and co are well aware of the issues as they currently stand, But I would suggest that a month before 16.04.1 we start looking at it weekly till the end and ensure the issue that currently stand are resolved and that no new ones have arrived but maybe discuss a time frame around that when he is online, Also I would assume by then the majority of the user issue would be
<davmor2> resolved by your team for any major niggles in the system itself that none of us have happen to trip over
<davmor2> willcooke: also jibel is off today and might have a differing opinion so maybe re-discuss on Monday
<willcooke> thanks davmor2
 * willcooke begins backing up
<andyrock> good morning all
<willcooke> hey andyrock
<seb128> hey andyrock, how are you?
<andyrock> seb128: lunch time with Trevinho
<andyrock> XD
<seb128> andyrock, Trevinho, are you guys taking the day to enjoy Prague?
<seb128> have fun there!
<andyrock> Just a little bit
<andyrock> :)
<andyrock> I worked this morning during the travel Marco swapped the day
<seb128> k
<seb128> say hey to Trevinho ;-)
<seb128> willcooke, Laney, attente, reading the g+ post from hughsie about the number of users hiting their firmware server since yesterday, did we talk to them/ask if them if they are fine having our user hammering their resources?
<seb128> he doesn't complain about it in the post/sounds positive about it but I wonder if that might become an issue as more users upgrade
<attente> seb128: maybe canonical can offer resources for that?
<attente> it would be a nice gesture
<seb128> attente, is that a "no" then? e.g we didn't discuss the topic at all with them?
<seb128> or you don't know
<seb128> ?
<seb128> but yeah, offer resources
<attente> seb128: that's a no, i didn't even anticipate that problem :)
<seb128> or have our own server
<desrt> good morning ubuntu
<desrt> how's the hangover? :)
<seb128> I don't know how comfortable we have having all our desktop install "dialing" into a third party infra daily
<seb128> we are*
<desrt> seb128: based on the 'enthusiastic' response we've received every time we try anything of the sort, i'm going to go with 'not' :)
<seb128> hey desrt! doing good, back to business, some crazy distroer even dealing with yaks ;-)
<seb128> desrt, yeah, me too...
 * desrt eats a chocolatine with powdered sugar on top
 * desrt is conflicted
<seb128> that sounds wrong
<seb128> shound be icing
<seb128> should
<desrt> i already told the guy at the counter that he's lucky that no french person is in here
<seb128> lol
<pitti> hey desrt!
<desrt> hello pitti :)
<desrt> i'm coming to visit your country soon
 * desrt will spend 2 hours there on sunday :)
<pitti> desrt: that stretches the meaning of "visit" quite a bit :)
<desrt> i also have a short vacation there during may :p
<desrt> pitti: what are you up to lately?
<pitti> desrt: fun with the release up to last night, and opening yakkety right now :)
<desrt> oh seriously
<desrt> we actually called it that?
<pitti> desrt: apparently so
<pitti> yodelling yak would have been fun :)
<desrt> awesome.  just awesome.
<seb128> desrt, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/yakkety
<desrt> finally a release name that i can get behind!
<seb128> pitti, desrt, google insist on it being written "yakety", did we typo that?
<desrt> ya.  i was noticing that and wondering if this is part of mark's plan to convince the word to spell this word differently
<desrt> i'm sure the spelling was carefully considered and that there is a good reason for it..... but what? :)
<pitti> seb128: dictionary wise neither is a real word :)
<desrt> maybe it's to avoid infringing copyright on the song title :p
<desrt> ...or to make it easier to search for *our* yakkety yak
<desrt> but mostly i just see a million google results pages "...did you mean 'yakety'?"
<seb128> pitti, well, http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/yak has "yackety-yak"
<desrt> we're already 3rd hit on yakkety, so i guess this will go fairly well, in fact
<seb128> :-)
 * desrt is particularly enjoying her morning caffeine buzz today
<desrt> i wonder if these people are on to something with the sugar on the chocolatines
<seb128> are you sure it was sugar? :p
<desrt> lol
 * qengho afk lunch
 * Sweet5hark feels sorry for the folks watching the social media accounts for this company: http://yakketyyakllc.com/social-media-marketing/ 
<ogra_> the company might like us now though :)
<ogra_> free ads ! :)
<attente> seb128: hughsie said that the fwupd servers are at 3% load, but if it ever gets really bad, he would update the cache time and ask us to cherry pick that
<seb128> attente, ok, willcooke emailed him as well
<willcooke> he just replied, it's not a problem.  But we should get our own servers up I think.  We can start that next week
<seb128> yes
<seb128> dpm, pitti, what is defining what goes in -gnome langpacks?
<seb128> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/249587950/ubuntu-xenial-translations.tar.gz has evolution-3.18.po
<seb128> but they are missing from the langpacks in xenial
<seb128> well the .mo are
<pitti> seb128: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-langpack/langpack-o-matic/main/view/head:/lib/pkg_classify.py, but that's fairly unrelated
<pitti> as that just decides between -gnome and main
<pitti> if it's missing entirely, there's a different problem
<seb128> seems to be
<pitti> WARNING: unknown translation domain: evolution-3.18
<pitti> hm, missing from mapping.txt?
<seb128> http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?searchon=contents&keywords=evolution-3.18.mo&mode=filename&suite=xenial&arch=any
<seb128> weird
<pitti> seb128: if you have it downloaded already, mind checking?
<seb128> 3 langpacks have one
<pitti> seb128: I guess those are obsolete ones which fell under the 5% treshold
<seb128> likely
<pitti> langpack@snakefruit:/srv/language-packs.ubuntu.com/xenial$ find -name evolution-3.18*
<pitti> -> nothing
<seb128> let me check for the mapping.txt
<pitti> e-d-s-3.18 seems fine
<pitti> seb128: or it's another bug with multiple domains from one package (sil2100 fixed that some weeks ago, but perhaps not completely)
<seb128> did we rebuild xenial langpacks with that fix applied?
<pitti> yes
<sil2100> hmm
<seb128> pitti, the mapping has
<seb128> evolution evolution-3.18
<seb128> evolution-data-server evolution-data-server-3.18
<seb128> evolution-indicator evolution-indicator
<pitti> ok, that looks fine
<pitti> but sorry, no steam today any more to debug this still, and need to run in about 10 minutes anyway
<pitti> bug report appreciated
<seb128> pitti, we have bug #1545212 opened on february
<ubot5> bug 1545212 in langpack-o-matic "Evolution 3.18.4 package does not include translations" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1545212
<seb128> shrug, I reassigned back then but forgot to follow up
<pitti> ah, thanks
<seb128> np, thanks for the replies
<xclaesse> wow, totem 3.18 is a MASSIVE perf regression o_O
<xclaesse> it can't even play a 640x480 mp4 smoothly anymore
<xclaesse> on my older laptop connected on my tv
<xclaesse> with gst-play and vlc the video play fine
<seb128> xclaesse, :-(
<xclaesse> but with totem I get like 10fps, it's impossible to watch
<seb128> xclaesse, does it work better if you use the old totem version?
<xclaesse> on my newer x230 laptop totem runs fine though
<seb128> could also be something in gstreamer stack that changelog
<xclaesse> seb128, was working just fine on 14.04
<seb128> gst-play and totem might use different pipelines/elements
<xclaesse> I suspect clutter/cogl, tbh, but with no proof atm
<seb128> pitti, where did you see that "WARNING: unknown translation domain: evolution-3.18" warning?
<seb128> xclaesse, could be yes
<Laney> Well, yes, it was known that firmware updates are going to use the LVFS. That's a goal of the service.
 * seb128 googles LVFS and finds "Linux Vendor Firmware Service"
<Laney> It's the work that superm1 was enabling
<seb128> just curious but is it owned by hughsie himself?
<seb128> or on some fdo or such infra?
<Laney> I think it's on a RedHat machine, but you could go ask him
 * superm1 pokes in
<superm1> openshift IIRC
 * seb128 googles openshift as well :p
<seb128> oh, a RH thing
<superm1> when i talked to hughsie, he was confident he could handle the load from this getting into distros
<superm1> but willing to expand out to a mirroring system if need be
<seb128> well anyway, I've no clue if we are fine using that or if we want our how mirror/server, willcooke is going to investigate
<Laney> Call it the Ubuntu Firmware Service while you're at it
<superm1> something that could be explored is just mirroring metadata (and metadata signature) somewhere else ubuntuey and still pulling firmware from his service instead
<seb128> Laney, :-p
<seb128> I've a feeling you don't like the idea how having a mirror
<superm1> the metadata and firmware can realistically be hosted in separate places.  authenticity is verified for them separately on each of them
<seb128> yeah, unsure if that's needed
<seb128> it just feels suboptimal to rely on an external service we have no garantee about
<jcastro> anyone have a link to the server side component he's using?
<seb128> jcastro, https://github.com/hughsie/lvfs-website I guess
<superm1> Yeah that's his site.
<seb128> Laney, are you back home btw? had a good train back?
<Laney> seb128: yeah, train was mostly non eventful
<Laney> I found a cool turkish place quite near to st pancras and had some lunch there
<Laney> bÃ¶rek
<seb128> that looks good
 * seb128 starts being hundry and wouldn't say no to some bÃ¶rek
 * desrt looks that up
<desrt> mmm.  now i'm hungry too.  thanks :p
<Laney> after I wrote that I found the second half of my bÃ¶rek in my bag and ate it
<Laney> :D
<seb128> have a good w.e everyone, see you on sunday!
<dobey> hrmm, i wonder why sometimes my volume control keybindings just stop working
<dobey> so weird
<JanC> I wonder why gnome-terminal breaks dead keys in xenial (also weird)
<JanC> breaks dead keys & compose
<qengho> JanC: My compose works in gnome-terminal, FWIW.
<JanC> hm
<JanC> qengho: do you have customized compose keys (in ~/.XCompose)?
<qengho> JanC: No.
<JanC> roxterm doesn't have the bug, so seems like it's in gnome-terminal and not libvte
<qengho> JanC: Compare your environments between terminal emulators too. Is LANG the same?
<JanC> $LANG shouldn't influence keyboard layout
<qengho> JanC: Yes, but (I think) LANG should influence what compose mappings are loaded.
<JanC> it really shouldn't  :)
<JanC> $LANG seems to be the same everywhere though
<qengho> Ooh, that's the encoding, not the locale. Sorry, JanC.
<JanC> hm, nautilus has the same problem
<JanC> so, seems like the bug is related to the xim input module
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-04-23
<chilipalmer> I have a fesh install of Ubuntu 16.04LTS. Everything seems to be working perfectly. I do see one small problem. When I open the new software store, I get the search panel, with three buttons above it: All, Installed, and Updates. The rest of the window is blank. Other than that, the application seems to work properly. Did I miss something or have I run into a bug of some sort?
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-04-24
<BigWhale> Greetings ...
<BigWhale> It seems that 16.04 live cd doesn't boot with Nvidia GTX 970. Unity keeps core dumping. :(
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-04-18
<pitti> Good morning everyone
<pitti> I hope you had some nice Easter holidays
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
<seb128> how was your w.e?
<pitti> seb128: it was great, thanks! four day visit to Dresden again
<pitti> had some nice bday celebrations on Friday, and our traditional big family hike on Sunday was mostly sunny too
<seb128> ah nice
<pitti> you too I hope, all things considered?
<seb128> no trip to France for us this time that was not very pratical this year
<seb128> but oh well, next year :-)
<seb128> yeah, everything fine
<seb128> we mostly had a relaxing w.e, we went to watch a movie, a friend invited us for dinner on sunday, otherwise mostly relaxing
<seb128> and some tennis playing in between since we didn't have much of the forecasted rain ;-)
<willcooke> morning seb128 pitti
<seb128> hey willcooke, how are you?
<willcooke> meh, ya know
<pitti> hey willcooke!
<Laney> morning
<pitti> hey Laney, how are you? enjoyed the Easter holidays?
<didrocks> hey guys (sorry, was deep into some travis machinery)
<davmor2> morning all
<Laney> hey pitti
<Laney> pitti: not bad, was in london on friday after the release so we took some time to be tourists
<Laney> galleries, parks, coffee shops, book shops
<Laney> then just mainly relaxed and did gardening for the other 3 days
<Laney> happy birthday for friday :-)
<Laney> hey didrocks hey davmor2
<Laney> you ok?
<pitti> Laney: thanks
<davmor2> Laney: I'm in a better place
<didrocks> quite lonely on Friday here, the rest of the week-end was ok, thanks
<davmor2> Laney: had a nice weekend
<Laney> davmor2: better like... telford?
<Laney> didrocks: :(
<Laney> sorry there was no 4 day weekend for you!
<didrocks> well, that's the way to remember Seb's house isn't really in France :)
<davmor2> Laney: yeah yeah something like that I was in shrewsbury in a caravan park for four days
<davmor2> Laney: it was heaven
<seb128> hey Laney!
<seb128> oh, I forgot about pitti's birthday? :-(
<seb128> pitti, sorry, happy birthday a bit late then!
<Laney> hey seb128
<pitti> seb128: merci beaucoup !
<TheMuso> Hey EU folks. :)
<seb128> hey TheMuso, how are you?
<TheMuso> seb128: Hey there, I'm pretty well thanks. Yourself?
<seb128> I'm good thanks!
<seb128> had a nice long w.e
<Laney> hey TheMuso
<Laney> looks like gtk themes are messed up in firefox 52
<Laney> at least on zesty
<Laney> at least with ambiance ;-)
<Laney> at least on my machine, ok!
<Trevinho> Laney: you're the bug, you know :-)
 * Laney attaches debugger to self
<Mirv> hmm, on another thought, I think I was here even before 2012 so no particular reason why I wouldn't stay here :)
<Sweetshark> moin
<pitti> Sweetshark: "good" morning
<Sweetshark> "snap election" in the UK announced in 20 minutes? I guess thats why the GBP is in free fall. I already wondered ...
<Sweetshark> pitti: heya ;)
<flexiondotorg> Morning desktopers
<andyrock> morning
<sil2100> Mirv: that's the spirit! ;)
<chrisccoulson> hey Sweetshark
<Laney> k, it's broken in a vm too
<Laney> adwaita mostly works tho
<xnox> seb128, i want to discuss gnome desktop too =)
<xnox> Sweetshark, you say free fall.... and I see it jumping +0.85% against USD and +0.64% against EUR
<xnox> still down compared with like a year and two years ago, but daily is looking good.
<jbicha> good morning
<xnox> Sweetshark, well, it first tanked before 11am and then surged up. Go figure.
<Laney> hi jbicha
* Topic unset by motie on #ubuntu-desktop
<Sweetshark> xnox: yeah. the drop was about the 'surprise' no10 announce when the contents where still unknown.
<Sweetshark> s/where/were/
<flexiondotorg> jbicha Morning
<jbicha> does anyone here have a keyboard with a calculator key with Ubuntu Unity 17.04?
<jbicha> https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/unity-settings-daemon/fix-calculator-key/+merge/322673
<jbicha> https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/2721
<Trevinho> jbicha: I should have one...
<Trevinho> but well, it's just about fake it otherwise
<Trevinho> Laney: if i'd like to try landing something how it works now? Since we don't have A yet?
<Trevinho> hi willcooke
<willcooke> hey Trevinho
<willcooke> seb128, I'm back from the passport office already \o/
<simosx> The new NetworkManager has a "MAC address spoofing" feature to protect the privacy when connecting to public WiFis (https://blogs.gnome.org/thaller/2016/08/26/mac-address-spoofing-in-networkmanager-1-4-0/). Ubuntu 17.04 has this new NetworkManager. However, some USB WiFi adapters fail to work (cannot have their MAC addr changed), and affects users.
<simosx> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1681513
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1681513 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu 17.04: New privacy feature in NetworkManager stops some USB WiFi adapters from working (mac address randomization)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<simosx> Upstream just changed the default recently, "Update-2017-01-25: with 1.6 release and newer, the default value changed from âpermanentâ to âpreserveâ [commit],[bug]" but this needs to pass to the Ubuntu 17.04 NetworkManager package.
<seb128> willcooke, wb!
<seb128> simosx, hey, thanks for the info
<seb128> happyaron, ^
<jbicha> Trevinho: thanks, otherwise, we can just have one of the guys affected verify it when it's accepted into -proposed
<jbicha> thanks!
<Laney> Why not just set the launch calculator shortcut to a different keybinding?
<Laney> Renaming desktop files is totally awesome and risk free.
<Laney> Trevinho: Upload it to zesty
<Laney> or if it's not for SRU, then wait
<jbicha> Laney: he already pushed it to zesty/unapproved
<Laney> That's fine.
<Laney> I was responding to the question.
<Trevinho> Laney: ok, I've SRU material... then it's fine.
<Laney> Yeah, it should get copied over once the next release exists
<seb128> brb, going back from coffee place
<andyrock> are we going to get the pre-meeting?
 * Laney is
<ryanleesipes> 30 min to meeting, right willcooke ?
<willcooke> ryanleesipes, yeah
<ryanleesipes> Good deal.
<Laney> my firefox froze
<Laney> the whole browser
<Laney> MOZILLAAAAAAAAAA
<Laney> now I think compiz is crashing when force quitting it
<Laney> TREVINHOOOOOOOOOOO
<Laney> oh no, the whole machine is down
<Laney> wtf
<davmor2> Laney: I'm betting on systemd-udevd
<jbicha> Laney: if you get tired of Unity crashing, you could switch to GNOME to get some variety in your crashes :|
<Laney> I'm guessing it was OOMing or something
<Laney> Apr 18 16:09:36 raleigh.local kernel: kernel BUG at /build/linux-dfiP6t/linux-4.10.0/include/linux/swapops.h:129!
<Laney> Apr 18 16:09:36 raleigh.local kernel: invalid opcode: 0000 [#1] SMP
<gQuigs> Laney: oh, you have that fun bug to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1674838
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1674838 in linux (Ubuntu) "kernel BUG at /build/linux-7LGLH_/linux-4.10.0/include/linux/swapops.h:129" [Medium,Confirmed]
<mhall119> willcooke: I'm here watching if you need me
<willcooke> hey mhall119
 * isantop waves hi to mhall119 
<mhall119> o/
<jbicha> o/
<Laney> gQuigs: yeah, thx, I heard some other people talking about that one too
<willcooke> hey jbicha
<willcooke> Let's use the meeting bot to keep notes...
<seb128> ok, it's meeting time!
<seb128> how do we handle that one? ;-)
<willcooke> #startmeeting GNOME as the desktop
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Apr 18 15:30:42 2017 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: None | GNOME as the desktop Meeting | Current topic:
<willcooke> Who is interesting in getting involved in the meeting?
<andyrock> hey
<flexiondotorg> o/
<jbicha> o/
<Trevinho> Hola
 * kenvandine waves
<isantop> willcooke: There are a bunch of System76 people who are interested
<seb128> yeah, let's maybe that with a round of "raise your hand" for those who have things they want to say/discuss
<seb128> ?
 * Laney is here
<seb128> that feels like the sort of meeting that is going to get out of hands :p
<andyrock> o/
<ryanleesipes> Hehe
<seb128> _o/
<ryanleesipes> SYSTEM76 sound off!
<isantop> o/
<mhall119> o/
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> that's a lot of people :p
<seb128> everybody get a one line summary of what topic you want to discuss?
<ryanleesipes> o/
<mhall119> I'll be brief :)
<seb128> let's give us 3 min to write that
<seb128> then we go round pasting those
<seb128> then we can find out common points
<seb128> or organize
<seb128> wdyt?
<willcooke> +1
<alex285> is the meeting done, or starting?
<willcooke> alex285, starting
<alex285> awesome thanks!
<ahayzen> o/
<mhall119> seb128: ready for us to paste them?
<seb128> if you want
<mhall119> With both my Community Council and Community Manager hats on, I just wanted to let everybody know that they can contact me directly at mhall119@ubuntu.com if they have any questions or concerns (non-technical ones, for technical talk to the desktop team) during the transition from Unity.
<ryanleesipes> Do we have an Etherpad or something?
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> no, we have a bot that record
<ryanleesipes> That would be better for collecting questions/comments
<seb128> but feel free to start one
<mhall119> ryanleesipes: the meetingology bot will record stuff and generate meeting minutes
<Trevinho> Etherpad done: http://pad.ubuntu.com/n08SOl5xiA
<cimi> cimi hi guys
<tkamppeter> hi
<seb128> jbicha, andyrock, isantop, ryanleesipes, ahayzen, feel free to paste your summary when you have it
<ryanleesipes> https://etherpad.gnome.org/p/ubuntu-desktop-meeting
<ryanleesipes> Oh nevermind
<ryanleesipes> lol Trevinho
<ogra_> w3m is the only way forward anyway :) everything else is bloat (SCNR)
<ryanleesipes> Use the top one, not mind
<ogra_> err
<ogra_> s&/w3m/wmx/ (damn)
<mhall119> seb128: can you tell meetingology about hte etherpad link?
 * mhall119 has forgotten meetingology syntax already
<isantop> I'm personally concerned about the out-of-box experience GNOME delivers by default.
<ryanleesipes> Albeit I can't get into the Ubuntu etherpad
<seb128> mhall119, no, willcooke is the one who started the meeting/control the bot
<seb128> also no idea how to do that?
<seb128> link ...?
<mhall119> #link maybe
<seb128> willcooke, ^
<willcooke> #link http://pad.ubuntu.com/n08SOl5xiA
<mhall119> or LINK:
<Trevinho> LINK: http://pad.ubuntu.com/n08SOl5xiA
<seb128> jbicha, andyrock, isantop, ryanleesipes, ahayzen, no topics from you then?
 * Trevinho fails
<ryanleesipes> Either you have not been granted access to this resource or your entitlement has timed out. Please try again.
<willcooke> maybe....
<willcooke> #topic Etherpad here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/n08SOl5xiA
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: None | GNOME as the desktop Meeting | Current topic: Etherpad here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/n08SOl5xiA
<jbicha> well, I'd like to follow up on isantop's topic
<seb128> isantop, sorry, just saw your line from earlier
<mhall119> willcooke: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology for reference
<ahayzen> seb128, are we putting in the etherpad or here ... ?
<jbicha> also I assume it's ok now to drop Unity-specific patches that hold GNOME back? My specific example is Shotwell which is held at a git snapshot for a year because no one has stepped up to rewrite its UOA code.
<gQuigs> ryanleesipes: looks like a timeout, login and log back in to Ubuntu SSO (login.ubuntu.com)
<seb128> ahayzen, either work
<seb128> just pick one
<seb128> so we can get moving
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> so mine
<seb128> want to discuss goals/how we move z+1 to GNOME and re-active the channel/sync up the work between us; don't want to discuss today the technical details/choices of components/etc
<willcooke> +1 on avoiding technical topics for now
<willcooke> My topics:
<willcooke> How should the Ubuntu GNOME team and the Ubuntu Desktop team resolve conflicts?
<willcooke> Expected timescales to see GNOME become the default shell
<seb128> the details should be done in a meeting properly scheduled where we have the people we need, etc
<ryanleesipes> I still can't get in
<mhall119> where will technical topics be discussed? later IRC meetings or mailinglist?
<ryanleesipes> I'll just ask my questions in here, and perhaps someone else can plug them into Etherpad
<mhall119> ryanleesipes: PM me your LP nick
<seb128> we are going to have another meeting
<seb128> but mailing list is always fine for questions if anyone has some
<ryanleesipes> It's just ryanleesipes mhall119
<seb128> or for raising topics
<jackpot51> mhall119: jackpot51 on the pad pls
<mhall119> ryanleesipes: you should have etherpad access now, might need to log out and back in
<ryanleesipes> I got in
<mhall119> jackpot51: also added, if anyone else needs access to the etherpad please PM me your launchpad nick
<seb128> k, let's see we have enough topics to touch a few of those
<seb128> willcooke, how do you want to process?
<ryanleesipes> Alright, I'm in
<willcooke> I'll go through the pad one by one and set the topic, starting at the top...
<seb128> hum
<flexiondotorg> My questions: Will AppMenu and Indicator continue to be supported?
<willcooke> actually, let's start with...
<k1l> what is the goal of the "new" gnome desktop: ship a vanilla gnome-shell or keep the workflow/look at the old unity way (with extensions or maybe patches for globalmenu)?
<willcooke> #topic Dropping Unity specific patches
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: None | GNOME as the desktop Meeting | Current topic: Dropping Unity specific patches
<willcooke> jbicha, want to kick that off?
<seb128> let's start with this one because it leads to how we set up collaboration I think
<jbicha> How are we handling Unity-specific patches?
<seb128> or organize the work
<jbicha> do we just keep them if they aren't holding us back?
<seb128> yes please
<seb128> well no
<seb128> my stand would be that we should go through the packages and remove patches that we feel like are not needed anymore
<seb128> but we shouldn't do that as individuals
<seb128> like I would try to suggest we set up a per-review rule
<seb128> and use the channel to request reviews
<mhall119> is there a definitive list of these packages/patches?
<seb128> so nobody takes an unilateral decision
<seb128> and we resume team work/channel activity
<seb128> jbicha, wdyt?
<seb128> it's probably fine to drop patches for uoa/menubars/csd etc, but maybe not some others like typeahead in nautilus
<seb128> if we just go "open gate mode" it's going to be cahotic at best
<jbicha> so, what I hear you saying is case-by-case but let's discuss when we do it to make sure there's concensus
<seb128> what do others thing?
<seb128> think
<jbicha> ironically, typeahead is probably the first to go as we've already discussed :|
<seb128> yeah, maybe not the best example
<Laney> nautilus isn't a good example because we already separately discussed dropping that
<seb128> finne
<Laney> don't know what would be atm
<Laney> maybe something
<gQuigs> are we ok with breakage on Unity to get Gnome working better?
<seb128> please don't nitpick on stupid examples
<mhall119> seb128: would it be easier to start with "no patches" and go through them to add back in ones you want to keep, or start with "all patches" and go through them to see which ones to drop?
<Laney> hey
<seb128> it's just the first one I had coming
<ryanleesipes> Agree with mhall119
<ryanleesipes> on starting with no patches
<Laney> I'm sure there will be some things to keep
<mhall119> ryanleesipes: that was a question, you can't agree with it :-P
<Laney> looking at gtk there are some
<ryanleesipes> I can
<ryanleesipes> It's my right
<seb128> keeping unity working in universe is a good point
<seb128> we are not going to keep intrusive UI patches for apps I think
<Trevinho> there are some unity patches though, that might be convenient to keep (if not causing too much hassle) for people who wants to stick to unity7 on 18.04 I think
<seb128> but we should probably keep the patches that don't cost much like if we have gtk changes to make appmenu work
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> don't know about that
<flexiondotorg> Keeping patches has the advantage that it helps identify what we might desire to upstream.
<Laney> we might end up creating a crappy experience
<seb128> k
<seb128> maybe let's stay our of technical details today?
<ryanleesipes> Will anyone be maintaining Unity7?
<Trevinho> like there are patches for headerbar to make them to work well when maximized in unity, they shouldn't create problems
<seb128> like just agree on big lines
<seb128> like need-peer-reviews to drop patches
<mhall119> ok, so can we get an action item assigned to somebody to start on a list of patches to keep/remove?
<seb128> no single person who go and clean/upload by themself
<Trevinho> ryanleesipes: as xenial is there for a while, I think it will need some basic support.
<seb128> +1 or -1?
<mhall119> then everyone else can +/-1 them
<seb128> no
<mhall119> +1 on working together to decide
<seb128> do you plan to work on updating packages?
<Trevinho> ryanleesipes: so, mostly high-prio bug fixes...
<seb128> just curious
<mhall119> me? no, you've seen what I do to .deb packages
<mhall119> nobdoy wants that :)
<seb128> k, you just seem to have strong preferences on how we organize ourselves
<seb128> so I was wondering :p
<mhall119> but I'd like to see someone take an action item to start a document or something for tracking that work
<mhall119> for visibility
<Laney> we have versions.html, just file a bug when you update a package and get a review on there?
<seb128> +1
<jbicha> seb128: I think we're in agreement with your general idea for peer review for dropping Unity-ish patches
<Laney> although that might not have proper visibility of what needs doing
<seb128> I would vote for normal mps (if vcs) or debdiff
<willcooke> I think it's too early to list out which specifics we want to work on, we need to agree the right processes today and then the specifics can come later
<seb128> and get a peer review
<Laney> more so if we go to 3.26 ;-)
<seb128> using the channel to request for reviews
<seb128> willcooke, +1
<mhall119> +1 willcooke
<seb128> which is also why I said let's stay out of technical discussions today
<seb128> like on wheter we keep supporting unity in universe
<seb128> or specifics about patches
<Laney> file bug / merge proposal, get review, upload
<seb128> +1
<flexiondotorg> +1 "using the channel to request for reviews"
<seb128> ^ agreement on that?
<jbicha> next topic?
<willcooke> Ok
<willcooke> So we're agreed that we will use LP reviews and the IRC channel to request reviews and discuss it there.
<willcooke> So I'd like to move on to....
<willcooke> #topic timescales
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: None | GNOME as the desktop Meeting | Current topic: timescales
<willcooke> How does end of April for the seeds to be updated sound?
<seb128> I think step 1 is to update the seed to put GNOME on the iso instead of unity
<seb128> that sounds a good target to me
<Laney> Two things
<mhall119> seb128: are you talking zesty+1?
<seb128> we don't need technical details of leaf packages at first
<jbicha> willcooke: unless we are ok with the seeds including universe packages, that won't actually be possible that quick
<seb128> or maybe just gdm vs lightdm
<Laney> 1. I made a PPA https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ubuntu/ubuntu-desktop-gnome
<Laney> this lets us 1) break shit and not care that much
<Laney> 2) include universe packages
<seb128> Laney, do we build an iso using the ppa?
<seb128> or what does it do?
<Laney> if we upload the seed there and have a look
<Laney> you don't (well, you could)
<Laney> but I think that it would be good to do some iterations there first
<Laney> unless you want to go full on "move fast and break things"
<seb128> I wouldn't mind doing that
<seb128> but what sort of changes do you expect in the ppa.?
<gQuigs> 1) drop packages that are not going to be updated from CD (unity8, ubuntu web browser), but leave unity mostly intact?
<seb128> is that to test the patches drops?
<seb128> or the seed changes?
<seb128> or...?
<Laney> ubuntu-settings, the seeds, packages with dropped patches
<seb128> hum
<seb128> I don't have a srong opinion either way
<seb128> others, wdyt?
<seb128> ppa is fine to me
<Laney> and we might find random upgrade problems before hitting the archive with them
<jbicha> what's the proposal again?
<mhall119> sounds safer to me, since people have gotten used to devel releases not massively breaking on them in recent years
<seb128> using ppa vs destabilizing the archive for a bit
<Laney> just test updating the ubuntu-meta + minimal set in a ppa before 'the switch'
<attente> how will unity7 in universe still work if the patches are dropped?
<ogra_> degraded ?
<seb128> that's a topic we didn't touch yet
<flexiondotorg> Laney are you proposing iso build that include this PPA in the short term?
<seb128> and probably worth another meeting
<mhall119> unity7 would still work, but apps won't integrate as well into it
<gQuigs> can't we have both Unity and Gnome on the CD for at least a little bit during development (or am I missing what this conversation is about)
<Laney> flexiondotorg: nah, mainly for upgrading
<Trevinho> attente: I guess we can keep the most important ones
<flexiondotorg> OK
<seb128> jbicha, do you have a list of packages that need MIRed?
<Trevinho> attente: but, integration is not much important
<Trevinho> I'd try to keep them unless they don't create troubles for merging though
<gQuigs> just like we had both Unity7 and 8 on Zesty image - I'm not saying we have to ship it, but for iterating to a new package set it makes it easier, right/
<jbicha> seb128: not yet, but I can propose a partial list of MIR needs to our mailing list
<seb128> jbicha, that would be nice
<Laney> guess we'd need to have an initial proposal for leaf packages first
<jbicha> there are several choices that will need to be discussed there (keeping shotwell for instance)
<seb128> let's not discuss apps selection in a first round
<seb128> first we get a working GNOME session with our apps
<seb128> then we discuss inside the session
<seb128> +1/-1?
<Laney> that's fine, just saying that it impacts how many MIRs need to be done and when
<flexiondotorg> +1
<jbicha> yes, we can try to get a working GNOME session first then worry about the specific apps after
<gQuigs> +1
<seb128> Laney, yeah, good point
<Laney> best to keep it lower at the start
<seb128> let's see we do another meeting next week to discuss again
<seb128> jbicha, can you do the required-minimal-MIR-set for then?
<seb128> and let's use the ppa meanwhile
<seb128> since archive is not open yet and we didn't figure out the details
<seb128> let's say*
<seb128> so it gives us
<jbicha> seb128: yes you can assign me to propose an initial MIR list this week
<seb128> - using peer review&channel to sync work
<willcooke> thanks jbicha
<seb128> - initial MIR list to be built by jbicha
<seb128> - use the ppa from Laney to start
<seb128> - another meeting next week when we review the MIR list and discuss some first tech details
<Laney> yeah feel free to upload there often
<seb128> is that a good summary?
<willcooke> seb128, +1 and captured in the pad
<seb128> anything people disagree with?
<seb128> great
<Laney> I have a second thing for this topic
 * seb128 listens
<Laney> what do you think about doing one of the early distro milestones
<Laney> like say alpha 2?
<flexiondotorg> +1
<seb128> what's the point over testing dailys?
<Laney> people will actually do it
<seb128> they can actually test dailys as well
<flexiondotorg> Get community testing around a known release.
<Laney> I am aware they can
<willcooke> It gives us a nice clear goal to work towards
<seb128> but if you think it helps we can do it
<Laney> but I've been observing milestones for a while and I know that people test the named ones and don't really test the daily ones
<mhall119> we can do a coordinated public push for testing, either around a specific milestone or a specific daily
<Laney> and it's a deadline
<flocculant> Laney: I would concur - Xubuntu sees exactly that
<seb128> when is a2 likely to be?
<Laney> and the 'press' might care (if you care about that)
<jbicha> last cycle there was only 1 Alpha and that worked well
<seb128> do we have a schedule yet?
<Laney> nope
 * mhall119 volunteers to help spread the call for testing in the community
<jbicha> we don't even have a name yet! ;)
<Laney> but you can look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ZestyZapus/ReleaseSchedule for an idea
<willcooke> "end of June" for A1
<seb128> k, seems people are mostly in favor of it
<Laney> or https://wiki.ubuntu.com/YakketyYak/ReleaseSchedule might be easier to compare
<jbicha> (Zesty Alpha 1 didn't happen)
<willcooke> "end of July" for A2
<seb128> so let's call that a decision
<mhall119> Laney is right, the tech press will pickup and talk about the first milestone release with GNOME as the default
<seb128> what's the goal?
<seb128> I think we want to give it testing
<Laney> jbicha: sure, but it will do if a flavour volunteers to do it
<seb128> not press coverage yet at this point
<mhall119> lots of eyeballs and bug reports
<Laney> the timing for Z A1 sucked royally
<seb128> having "it's still a rough experience" press isn't going to help
<mhall119> seb128: we can message it as "first access, help us find all the bugs so we can fix them before release"
<gQuigs> likely it will be advertised whenever gnome lands as the default in the nighties anyway, right?
<seb128> I guess so
<mhall119> gQuigs: nightlies don't usually get much attention
<gQuigs> but the headline will be, first nightly with Gnome Shell as the default,  we should expect attention then too
<mhall119> if you want to get a bunch of people testing and filing bugs, a milestone will help you
<gQuigs> not saying to not do the alpha
<ryanleesipes> We'll give nightlies attention
<ryanleesipes> We already build them on the imaging server everyday
<ryanleesipes> We can test them on hardware.
<mhall119> ryanleesipes: well I know S76 will, I meant the wider press/community
<seb128> k, so decision is to use alpha (2) milestone points to do a call for testing?
<seb128> willcooke, Laney, ^
<mhall119> +1 from me
<jackpot51> I don't think the "wider press/community" is here...
<Laney> That's cool for me
<willcooke> +1
<seb128> k, let's move on then
<Laney> actually the main benefit for myself is the deadline :P
<flexiondotorg> +1 Alpha 2 milestone
<seb128> I believe we are working steadly without those
<seb128> but if you guys see value in it that's fine to me
<Laney> ok...
<seb128> let's see how it goes
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> next topic?
<willcooke> just looking at the questions.....
<seb128> one thing we should discuss is the topics we want to put on the agenda for next week's meeting
<seb128> and also decide on a slot for that meeting
<willcooke> I'm skipping over the technical questions in that list, but happy to discuss after the meeting
<seb128> I think one thing we need to discuss earlier is gdm vs lightdm because that''s needed for the iso
<ryanleesipes> Just for the record, what is considered technical willcooke?
<mhall119> are launchpad blueprints still used to plan and track work each release?
<jbicha> seb128: mailing list for gdm discussion?
<alex285> can we do questions after the meeting? because to be honest i;m not really following :/
<willcooke> Let me speak to Robert re: lightdm and see what he can make next week and I'll put the word round
<seb128> jbicha, list for discussions and trying to get to a conclusion during the meeting maybe?
<seb128> willcooke, Laney ^ wdyt?
<Laney> sure
<Laney> I don't really understand what there is to discuss atm so someone who knows the issues should start it
<Laney> (re the display manager)
<seb128> I'm not sure
<seb128> lightdm vs gdm seems one to me
<jackpot51> What issues are there with GDM?
<Laney> just that one
<seb128> not sure how much gnome-shell relies on gdm and if lightdm can provide the same features
<Laney> exactly
<jbicha> right, we can't make a decision today without Robert's input anyway
<seb128> that's probably one for robert_ancell
<seb128> jackpot51, it's a complexe codebase and we like lightdm
<mhall119> IIRC, lightdm had some work to add features a customer wanted, so it might impact commercial engagements within canonical
<willcooke> Can someone kick that off on the mailing list, and I'll speak to Robert and ask him to comment there
<gQuigs> ^^
<seb128> I can do that
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<jackpot51> The lock screen is a bit broken in ubuntu-gnome in lightdm, I think
<seb128> that could maybe be fixed
<seb128> lightdm has guest session as well that we like
<jackpot51> That appears to be the only issue
<Laney> I would think our default position should be the upstream one (i.e. gdm), but let's see what the issues are
<seb128> there is work either way, but we need robert_ancell for that discussion
<Laney> we'd want to re-develop the guest session feature there
<Laney> ya
<gQuigs> just curious, how much does dropping lightdm affect other flavors?
<Laney> let's do that
<ryanleesipes> Why ship it when that is part of GNOME's effort? It'll only create problems in the future
<andyrock> i can take a look to the lokscreen issue in case
<jackpot51> Who uses the guest session feature?
<gQuigs> will investiage that, and the enterprise changes for the ML
<seb128> we created lightdm for a reason and that reason might still be partially true
<gQuigs> jackpot51: I love the guest session feature
<seb128> anyway that's not a topic of today
<seb128> another topic?
<Laney> I'm sure it is
<Laney> gdm keeps a session running afaik ;-)
<jackpot51> We could solve this by having a "guest" user added to the system...
<seb128> oh right, o_gra complained about that some days ago
<Laney> just referring to the 'light' part
<willcooke> Ok, so we'll follow up on the ML for lightdm / gdm discussions
<Laney> anyway, that's for the thread
<seb128> moving on
<willcooke> Next topic...
<seb128> next?
<willcooke> jbicha would like to talk about...
<willcooke> #topic Out Of Box
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: None | GNOME as the desktop Meeting | Current topic: Out Of Box
<jbicha> I have read thousands of comments in the past 2 weeks. Some people like GNOME. Some think it could be a lot better if there were a few tweaks (like shipping a left-hand Dock like Unity). Some hate GNOME.
<jbicha> I think we could reach some of the 3rd group if we can help out the 2nd group.
<seb128> that might be a topic for the better organized meeting when we have robert, tim, etc
<jbicha> But the GNOME design and Shell maintainers aren't really interested in adding the option of an always visible dock.
<seb128> is there extensions we can point users to for that?
<jbicha> â¦ok, it's a controversial topic but a lot of people wondering what Ubuntu's approach will be
<gQuigs> Dash to dock (using it now)
<mhall119> multiple
<seb128> we don't know yet :p
<seb128> afaik, step 1 is to go vanilla GNOME
<seb128> step 2 is to read feedback from our users
<seb128> step 3 is to see where we go from there
<seb128> willcooke, right?
<Laney> if we wanted to, is it hard to seed extensions?
<willcooke> well....
<Laney> is it a gsettings override or what?
<seb128> jbicha, ^ do you know?
<jbicha> we actually already have feedback from people who have tried Ubuntu GNOME
<willcooke> I'm very interested in gathering evidence to support the argument for pre-installed extensions.
<flexiondotorg> seb128 What do you think step 1 and 2 will both be in the 17.10 dev cycle?
<k1l> there are extensions already packaged to debian/ubuntu
<seb128> jbicha, are those people who want GNOME or who want Ubuntu?
<mhall119> seb128: well part of that will depend on what Canonical is willing to invest, shipping extensions by default means you're responsible for keeping them working
<gQuigs> Laney: I don't think so, it's just a package
<Trevinho> And.... Not break the experience for ubuntu gnome users, by injecting extensions there too maybe
<Laney> I know you can package them
<jackpot51> mhall119: Both
<jbicha> hmm, I think it's just an enabled-extensions gsettings key which could work for a new default install but might not work as well for upgrades
<seb128> mhall119, do you have an answer to that?
<gQuigs> Laney: many are already packaged
<Laney> I know
<mhall119> seb128: no, that's something Will probably needs to get an official answer on internally
<mhall119> if he doesn't already know, he might
<gQuigs> oh, sorry
<alex285> regarding extensions it would be super great if you could talk with GNOME people and we could had them included inside G-C-C, as plugin at least
<Laney> but never mind, jbicha answered
<mhall119> seb128: I just don't want to set the expectation that it's an option if it's not
<ogra_> well ... you will likely also not go with the default settings of these extensiona
<ogra_> *extensions
<jbicha> org.gnome.shell enabled-extensions
<Laney> k, that's easy enough
<ogra_> so there is more
<gQuigs> ogra_: very true
<Laney> I'm guessing most of them will also be gsettings for configuration
<k_alam> @alex285 It has been discussed before.....they don't want anything extra in gcc
<meetingology> k_alam: Error: "alex285" is not a valid command.
<ogra_> Laney, yeah
<Laney> we know how to do that for default / new installs, it's trivial
<seb128> jbicha, imho it's too early to know where we go on that
<Laney> so not a big worry technically
<Laney> more of a policy thing
<jbicha> yes, the good extensions use gsettings for their settings
<ogra_> and we only want good extensions anyway ;)
<jbicha> ok, we can push that decision off to later
<Laney> Probably nto that controversial to go vanilla by default
<seb128> I would start by that
<mhall119> jbicha: does Ubuntu GNOME currently ship any extensions by default?
<jackpot51> dash to dock does not use gsettings
<Laney> but maybe it's an interesting thing to talk about how we'd make any future decision now
<seb128> and adjust if we feel it's needed
<mhall119> or is it vanilla GNOME shell?
<ogra_> jackpot51, well, thats surely fixable
<isantop> mhall119: It's very vanilla
<willcooke> As jbicha commented, lots of people have expressed an desire for particular extensions.  So I will gather up all of those comments and try to come to a conclusion about what people want.  Then I will report back here and we can discuss further
<Source0f1> Regarding extensions, I think user-friendliness is different than user-familiarity or user-preference, yeah?
<jbicha> mhall119: no, Ubuntu GNOME historically was quite close to vanilla GNOME, but we weren't aiming for the millions of Ubuntu users either
<Trevinho> in case I guess we can also develop or contribute to extensions... but it's all dependent on how we want Ubuntu desktop to differ from vanilla, as said above.
<Trevinho> so the tech point is not really a problem here.
<Laney> nod
<Laney> ok, so willcooke nicely volunteered to wade into the world of internet comments
<mhall119> he'll be missed
<mhall119> :)
<seb128> thanks willcooke
<jbicha> I think one important point is that we have an opportunity to make more a break with the past now; for instance if we add a left Dock for 18.04, users might be unhappy about us removing it later
<seb128> imho in any case we need to get the session working first to get a feel how it is to use
<Laney> yeh
<jbicha> next topic?
<Trevinho> jbicha: is also true that.... Users might be unhappy because we remove it...
<Laney> and they need to be able to try it to know what they don't like
<jbicha> yes, that reasoning works both ways
<mhall119> so is the decision to get a working vanilla GNOME shell first, and they decide where to go from there?
<jbicha> we can always make changes after 17.10 before 18.04 too
<Laney> indeed
<mhall119> jbicha: good point
<willcooke> #topic Any Other Business
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: None | GNOME as the desktop Meeting | Current topic: Any Other Business
<Laney> k, so I just want to mention the gnome-initial-setup thing they have
<Laney> I installed ubuntu-gnome-desktop in a VM and got that on first login after rebooting
<mhall119> can the desktop team get in touch with the docs team? This change is going to require more than the normal amount of updates for them and they're already understaffed
<Laney> we might want to think about how much we want to use that
<Laney> and how it interacts with upgrades and the installer
<Laney> not necessarily something to discuss now, but worth thinking about for the next time maybe
 * willcooke adds it to the "next meeting" section
 * Laney put it in there already
<seb128> I don't know enough about that topic to have an opinion
<Laney> right, that's why I mention it early
<seb128> I also don't know much about ubiquity-oem
<seb128> can they do the same things?
<seb128> like pre-seeding configs
<seb128> etc
<seb128> ?
<flexiondotorg> Given the tight time scales, what theme will be default at this stage?
<Laney> I mean historically we've not had a new user welcome thing at all
<seb128> also changing might impact oem workflows
<seb128> so we should check with our oem team
<ogra_> is ubiquity actually still a thing in 18.04 ?
<aquarius_> (worth also discussing with the mate team their experiences with first-time-setup stuff as well; historically new user welcome screens were a bit of a no-no, but mate seem to have had quite some success with theirs, so could be re-visit-able)
<ogra_> (i thought subiquity will be the replacement ... i'D expect it to grow GUI features within the next year)
<seb128> ogra_, what is replacing it you think?
<seb128> k
<jackpot51> ubiquity should definitely remain
<ogra_> but thats a question for foundations
<seb128> I didn't read anything about that yet
<jackpot51> Why would ubiquity be replaced?
<Laney> kkkk, that's not something for now!
<seb128> indeed not
<gQuigs> I though subiquity was just server's ubiquity..  but no idea what the vision for it actually is
<willcooke> ryanleesipes, would be good to get your feedback on that in the near future ^
<seb128> not in our hands and not for today
<seb128> we are over the hour, should we wrap? we have enough for today
<seb128> we can discuss/reply to questions after the meeting still
<seb128> if some people want to stick around for a bit
<willcooke> Re: Themes.  What do Ambiance and Radiance look like today on GNOME shell?
<ryanleesipes> hey willcooke sounds good, jackpot51 works with it more than I do (he is a 76er)
<flexiondotorg> There has been talk of dropping aptdaemon for PackageKit on the ML. Is this still achievable in the 17.10 dev cycle given the extra work?
<dmj_s76> oem install and firstboot working well for s76 is kinda critical
<seb128> willcooke, good question...
<Laney> flexiondotorg: I think we should do that
<seb128> flexiondotorg, patches are welcome :-)
<jbicha> willcooke: the Ubuntu themes don't look that great on GNOME
<seb128> :-(
<mhall119> willcooke had a question about resolving conflicts between the two teams
<Laney> there's a problem with black corners
<aquarius_> themes: they don't look great. I had to switch to adwaita because ambience didn't work all that well.
<seb128> what conflicts?
<seb128> aquarius_, do you have specifics/reported bugs?
<mhall119> any potential conflicts, the question was how they would be resolved
<seb128> discussion until consensus?
<seb128> is there any other way? :p
<mhall119> someone has to own decision making at some point
<seb128> any team has disagreement
<seb128> that's nothing new
<Trevinho> It's also to be considered that ambiance/radiance have some stuff that is made for unity... So if we don't want the hassle of keeping the compatibility for both, we should probably rebase new themes on them and update the css to get them working nicely in shell
<seb128> I don't think there is a change there
<aquarius_> themes: windows didn't have borders, making it impossible to see where one ended and another began, and no drop shadows. However, that may be because I installed just gnome-shell at first, and not ubuntu-gnome-desktop^. (Which is why I didn't report it.)
<jbicha> mhall119: I don't think we have trouble making decisions; we just aren't ready to make many decisions today in this meeting
<seb128> we had some in the Ubuntu Desktop team
<alex285> take into account that if you are going to do a new theme, you will need two themes. one for GTK3 one for GTK4 ..and ofc the GTK2
<Trevinho> without touching what we've now (if not breaking unity7 experience for universe users is wanted)
<seb128> GTK4 is post next-LTS
<mhall119> jbicha: seb128: ok
<Source0f1> Theme and brand mark play a part in marketing and product recognition. Would be good if new desktop look could still include Ubuntu logo and theme colors, in some way.
<ogra_> it surely will
<alex285> seb128:  but there will be apps that use GTK4, even installed as flatpak that lots Ubuntu users will do
<Trevinho> Source0f1: agree
<jbicha> seb128: nautilus 3.26 might use gtk4, so I'd push that to let's look at gtk4 several months from now
<Trevinho> I think also reusing some of the SURU work could be nice..
<ryanleesipes> That touches are my question
<Source0f1> Still want people to know it's Ubuntu: user-friendly, reliable, etc. :)
<Trevinho> If there's resources for some tuning in that sense
<seb128> jbicha, can they mix gtk3 and gtk4 libs in a same process?
<mhall119> alex285: IIRC the flatpak'd apps will include the theme they use, so that should be out of our hands anyway
<seb128> that's going to be fun
<ryanleesipes> Is Ubuntu proper going to engage with GNOME's Flatpak effort at all?
<seb128> jbicha, imho it's not realistic to tackle before the LTS
<seb128> we might need to stay on 3.24 then
<alex285> mhall119: that is not correct. Flatpak will have access to /usr/share/themes
<mhall119> oh
<mhall119> ?
<ryanleesipes> ^
<ryanleesipes> It's in a patch
<jackpot51> Do we even know if GTK4 themes will be incompatible with GTK3?
<jbicha> seb128: if we use Adwaita, it's not a problem, but Nautilus doesn't have to be the same version as the rest of GNOME
<dednick> @Trevinho: do we have any designers left to maintain suru?
<meetingology> dednick: Error: "Trevinho:" is not a valid command.
<jbicha> csoriano knows the risk of using gtk4 for Ubuntu
<dednick> Trevinho: do we have any designers left to maintain suru?
<seb128> jbicha, is that even realistic?
<alex285> mhall119:   https://github.com/flatpak/flatpak/issues/114
<jbicha> seb128: ?
<Trevinho> dednick: not sure, but still, the suru guidelines are there, so creating a gtk theme inspired on that, is still feasible
<Trevinho> dednick: of course, we'd miss resouces, and... Well, for that it could be  a problem.
<seb128> jbicha, are they/we going to have gtk3/4 versions of all libs in the archive next cycle?
<seb128> like librsvg
<dednick> just dont want a theme looking half like suru, half like another i mean.
<seb128> GTK4 is a complexe topic
<Trevinho> yeah, sure... but that would be the same for any other theme that is not maintened by someone
<seb128> if the GTK3 transition is any indication that's going to take several cycles to go through
<jbicha> I don't believe librsvg uses gtk
<seb128> not a topic for this cycle or next
<willcooke> We have more than enough to be getting on with before the next meeting, so I think we should wrap this meeting.  Carry on the discussions afterwards, but we have enough to do for the next week now
<jackpot51> https://blogs.gnome.org/desrt/2016/06/13/gtk-4-0-is-not-gtk-4/
<jackpot51> The changes will be slower than you think
<jbicha> seb128: all I'm saying is let's wait until later to decide about gtk4 instead of making a decision today
<seb128> +1
<willcooke> jbicha, +1
<flexiondotorg> +1
<willcooke> oki, ending here since that is an agreement
<willcooke> #endmeeting
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Apr 18 16:45:15 2017 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2017/ubuntu-desktop.2017-04-18-15.30.moin.txt
<Laney> It'll be driven by a real world situation anyway
<Laney> and that's a better place from which to make a decision
<Laney> imho
<seb128> jbicha, replace librsvg by libgnome-desktop in my question if you want
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> but imho we are going to realize that this transition is complexe
<seb128> if anybody has doubt about that
<jbicha> willcooke: thanks for leading the meeting
<seb128> thanks everyone
<seb128> good discussions
<seb128> and decisions
<alex285> so 17.10 will include GNOME by default, is that correct?
<willcooke> alex285, yes
<alex285> and people can give a test since the alpha?
<willcooke> yes
<mhall119> usual caveat that plans and reality aren't always on the same schedule
<alex285> willcooke: will Ubuntu follow GNOME release schedule? 17.10 wll have 326?
<alex285> os not discussed yet?
<alex285> or*
<jackpot51> Is there a decision on the name of zesty  + 1 ?
<isantop> No
<seb128> GNOME version is tbd
<jbicha> jackpot51: just watch http://markshuttleworth.com/
<seb128> step 1 is to go with the current version
<seb128> without unity patches
<seb128> then we can discuss what we update and not
<jackpot51> seb128: +1
<jbicha> the last 2 cycles we haven't really made a hard decision about GNOME version until after GNOME Freeze
<seb128> we should probably do that
<seb128> especially if GTK4 depends might come in the equation mid-cycle
<jbicha> because there can be really big changes up until that point!
<pipedream> way behind but 18:22 < gQuigs> Dash to dock (using it now)
<mhall119> willcooke: seb128: will a summary or minutes of this meeting be send to the mailing list?
<pipedream> dash2dock +1
<seb128> is that needed?
<seb128> that was more a work-sync meeting for people involved
<seb128> not one for announcements or news
<mhall119> well the announcement went there, so I would assume a summary would too
<gQuigs> mhall119: it gets added the desktop team meetings page
<seb128> we have logs as every week
<ogra_> well, you made a ML announcement ... at least a link to the irc logs
<seb128> shrug
<willcooke> mhall119, would you take care of that for us?
<mhall119> happy to
<willcooke> I summarised the main points at the end of the pad (decisions etc)
<ryanleesipes> GTK4 is too far to worry about.
<mhall119> thanks willcooke
<gQuigs> alright, so not super useful in this case - http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2017/ubuntu-desktop.2017-04-18-15.30.html
<seb128> ryanleesipes, jbicha suggests that's not true and that nautilus might start using it this cycle, but yeah we should stay out of it until properly figured out
<ryanleesipes> Based on my conversations, it seems like some of the questions/concerns would likely be addressed via a conversation with some upstream contributors.
<ogra_> gQuigs, yeah, rather:  https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2017/04/18/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t15:30
<pipedream> willcooke: moar extensions https://paste.ubuntu.com/24408562/
<willcooke> thanks pipedream
<ogra_> pipedream, bah, no workspace-grid :P
<seb128> reading questions from the pad
<ogra_> (teh workspace handling of default gnome is rather awful for someone used to unity7 on a laptop with lots of workspaces)
<seb128> ryanleesipes, the flatpak topic isn't discussed, our desktop is still based on deb and ubuntu is still pushing for snaps but I guess that's a topic we might have to look at maybe
<seb128> ryanleesipes, I don't see us taking on flatpaks before the LTS
<jbicha> ogra_: Unity disables the workspace switcher by default, right? if so, it makes sense to punt Better Workspaces to an extension a user can install after
<seb128> tkamppeter, re printing, that's your domain, it would be welcome if you could play with the current GNOME settings and see if you think they can replace system-config-printer or if we still need it
<seb128> tkamppeter, google cloud print is going to come from gnome-online-account
<ogra_> jbicha, totally +1 ... i just dont want to be tied to a long stripe if i enable them :) (though i personally knwo how to change it, but many peole using thenm in rowas might not)
<ogra_> *rows
<willcooke> Trevinho, re your question about usings snaps for the shell - not at this point.  Lets get it working on debs first.
<seb128> andyrock, hidpi, I read on some GNOME blog that non-int scaling factor is coming I think?
<jbicha> seb128: my understanding is that non-int scaling is a GNOME 3.26 goal
<willcooke> jbicha, re: email client - my 2 cents - yes, I think we should.  I get the impression that lots of people still like to work on email "offline".  Happy to gather evidence to support this argument though.
 * Laney thinks so too
<willcooke> For people interested in the theme discussions - please log bugs for current problems with Ambiance / Radiance.  (*nudge* aquarius_)
<aruiz> jbicha, seb128 non-int scaling is most def going to be there for 3.26
<aquarius_> I don't know if I can (now that I've installed ubutnu-gnome-desktop) but I'll try
<willcooke> ncie, thanks aruiz.  (Also hi!!)
<willcooke> *nice
<aruiz> hi!
<aruiz> willcooke, we're also trying to solve the screen sharing problem for 3.26 in Wayland, we are working on Pinos+some shell capabilities to solve that this will give us pretty much 0 regressions wrt X, help is welcome there, but we're not 100% sure we're going to make it on that one
<aruiz> but fractional scaling and scale factor per display should be there for Wayland by 3.26
<willcooke> aruiz, ack.  I'll add it to the list.  I think the first big stone is probably guest session in gdm (or not, as the case maybe), and then see how much time we've got left.
<Source0f1> Has it been decided about Xorg/Wayland as default in 17.10 and beyond?
<seb128> aruiz, hey, and thanks ;-)
<willcooke> Source0f1, it'll be Wayland, and xwayland
<jbicha> willcooke: ok well the follow-up is which email client? evo integrates better with GNOME and thunderbird will have a tough time with Mozilla changes next year
<aruiz> seb128, you're welcome :-)
<seb128> jbicha, is evo well maintained nowadays or still down to 1 rh maintainer?
<Source0f1> Cool, thanks for the info willcooke.
<jbicha> seb128: more than one person is making commits https://git.gnome.org/browse/evolution/log/
* willcooke changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment
<jbicha> it's another question to discuss on the list
<willcooke> jbicha, added
<andyrock> seb128: nice, didn't know
<aruiz> jbicha, seb128 Evo is maintained mostly by Milan Chra, Tomas Popela is mostly working on the WebKit composer, but he does not do general maintenance
<tkamppeter> seb128, OK, I will have a look. What do I have to do to fire up the GNOME settings app?
<jbicha> tkamppeter: do you have gnome-shell installed? because it's probably best to log in to GNOME
<tkamppeter> seb128, will gnome-online-account support both sides of Google Cloud Print, once sharing the local printers into the user's Google account, and second, using the printers in the user's Google account when printing from an application?
<tkamppeter> jbicha,
<tkamppeter> jbicha, I am installing it now ...
<jbicha> you can run gnome-control-center outside of GNOME but it might not be fully functional without gnome-settings-daemon running
<tkamppeter> OK.
<tkamppeter> jbicha, with gnome-shell installed I can simply log out and log in again with GNOME?
<chrisccoulson> rather than asking "which email client?", isn't a better question "do we need an email client in the default install?" ;)
<jbicha> tkamppeter: yes
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, that's where we started :)
<jbicha> chrisccoulson: do you want to bring that up on the ubuntu-desktop list?
<jbicha> or I can, and you can comment
<willcooke> dinner time, night all
<howefield> 3/exit
<ovitters> can I be added to http://pad.ubuntu.com/n08SOl5xiA user: ovitters  asked in privmsg but no response yet
<flocculant> ovitters: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-etherpad - Join that team
<ovitters> flocculant: thanks! done
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Do you know if GNOME intentionally has dropped the GUI for setting a compose key? (bug #1683898)
<ubot5> bug 1683898 in gnome-user-docs (Ubuntu) "Compose key section needs to be updated" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1683898
<jbicha> GunnarHj: it's in Tweak Tool>Typing; I don't know if it's "intentional" as much as it didn't fit in to the GNOME 3.24 redesign
<jbicha> but you can ping GNOME about it if you're interested
<jbicha> #gnome-hackers or #control-center on irc.gnome.org
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Thanks for the tips; maybe I will. How could another option in that long list not fit the design? :( GNOME makes typing harder in various ways: Actively hides certain keyboard layouts, only IBus, and now this.)
<jbicha> GunnarHj: it might just have been lack of time with the 3.24 release schedule
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Let's hope so. ;)
<jbicha> and it's also different from all the other lines in the new Keyboard panel so it might need Design attention
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Ok, I'm not on Ubuntu GNOME right now, so can't see what you just said.
<robert_ancell> jbicha, does ubuntu GNOME handle mailto: links to gmail by default?
<robert_ancell> (and other web email providers)
<jbicha> robert_ancell: no
<jbicha> but you can set Firefox>Preferences>Applications>mailto to Gmail or Yahoo! Mail
<jbicha> for chromium, I guess there's an extension for that
<ovitters> GunnarHj: gnome-tweak-tool should be installed by default btw
<GunnarHj> ovitters: Thanks for letting me know; I'm not so familiar with Ubuntu GNOME yet.
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-04-19
<duflu> Trevinho: How are you feeling now?
<willcooke> night all
<willcooke> err
<willcooke> morning all
<seb128> hey willcooke, how is australia? ;-)
<willcooke> :DD
<Laney> morning
 * willcooke wishes he was still asleep 
<duflu> Morning willcooke, Laney, seb128.... Australia is fine, until North Korea gets an ICBM
<willcooke> duflu, you should be able to deploy the "giant tennis racket" defences
<duflu> If that's a popular culture reference you should know I am neither cultured nor popular
 * duflu shrugs
<willcooke> I imagine that North Korea's missiles could be repelled by with an ACME style system
<duflu> Ooh
<duflu> ACME-style, not ACME Style System (copyright some fashionista)
<TheMuso> The concern with tennis racket defences is whether the Au eastern and western states end up playing tennis with sed ICBM. :p
<willcooke> http://weknowmemes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/kim-jong-un-acme-meme.jpg
<willcooke> etc
<davmor2> Morning all
<duflu> Morning davmor2
<willcooke> Very exciting to see traffic on the desktop mailing list again :)
<duflu> And a strange observation: I think #ubuntu-touch is now more populated than ever
<TheMuso> lol
<TheMuso> Interesting indeed.
<Laney> welp
<Laney> that's pagerduty satisfied again
<Laney> a harsh master
<chrisccoulson> good morning desktop team
<willcooke> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi willcooke :)
<Trevinho> duflu: oh, very well now thanks for asking
<Trevinho> duflu: the infection was fixed in couple of days of antibiotics
<Trevinho> btw, hi europe :-)
<seb128> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> hey seb128
<seb128> had a good day?
<chrisccoulson> does gnome-shell have a way to alt-tab between windows only on the current workspace?
<ogra_> i think there is an extension :)
<chrisccoulson> multi-monitor/workspaces is quite sucky compared to unity tbh. In the activities view, the workspace switcher only shows previews for the primary monitor
<chrisccoulson> unity showed previews for both monitors
<chrisccoulson> And I do most of my work on my external panel, which has to be the secondary screen in gnome shell
<chrisccoulson> I can't make my external panel the primary screen, as it's positioned physically to the right of my laptop panel which means I can't reveal the dock on it (i'm using the dashtodock extension) and the activities button is hard to hit (unity had a barrier between screens for this reason)
<chrisccoulson> And the out-of-the-box setting of only having workspaces on the primary monitor isn't great
<chrisccoulson> I'm glad that can be turned off
<chrisccoulson> Sorry, I'll quit moaning now ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, that's good feedback don't be sorry :-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, I don't know if the theme was discussed yet? Please tell me we're going to fix Ambiance to work nicely? ;)
<seb128> it was discussed during the meeting yesterday
<seb128> it's a known problem and needs to be sorted out
<seb128> unsure who&when though
<ogra_> chrisccoulson, the workspace grid extension might help
<ogra_> (to get the workspaces elsewhere and also not in one vertical column)
<chrisccoulson> ogra_, thanks, I might give that a try
<jbicha> good morning
<willcooke> hey jbicha
<flocculant> willcooke: re all the changes - you planning to have some meeting with flavours - for bits that affect them (of the top of my head from Xubuntu pov, lightdm and indicators do (but no dev so don't ask me more ...))
<flocculant> obviously waiting for the chaff to settle out :)
<jbicha> flocculant: it's on our to-do list to discuss lightdm on the ubuntu-desktop list
<flocculant> jbicha: ack seen all that :)
<willcooke> flocculant, yeah for sure.  Like you say, once things are settled and we know what's changing.  We certainly dont want to make things hard for you guys.
<willcooke> flocculant, but feel free to ping in here with any questions any time
<willcooke> the answer might be "dunno" but dont let that stop you :)_
<flocculant> willcooke: yea will do - I'm not shy :p
<willcooke> :)
<flocculant> 2 of our dev's are in channel too - though timezones for one and work for the other ;)
<flocculant> I did relay pad url etc to us
<jbicha> willcooke: I'm surprised you brought up Nylas; the more email clients people suggest, the stronger the no-email-client argument becomes if there isn't concensus on which email client to include
<flocculant> willcooke: I'm not sure how other flavours would be affected of course and no idea of they're idling - just thought I'd mention flavours :)
 * acheronUK 'idles'
<jbicha> willcooke: do you use Nylas?
<willcooke> jbicha, I use web mail.  But it seems to be one of the more active clients right now.
<jbicha> I just installed it but I don't feel like setting up a Nylas account just so I can run the app
<willcooke> fair criticism
<jdstrand> seb128: hey, are you using any sort of tagging for gnome/wayland issues? I've collected a few and wanted to make sure they showed up on your radar
<jbicha> I suggest just using the tag 'wayland'
 * jdstrand nods
<seb128> jdstrand, hey, no sorry I've not been switching focus on playing with new things yet, busy with 17.04 and planning still, you seem quite eager to start on the next cycle though :-) ... I was going to suggest asking jbicha but he just replied ;-)
<jdstrand> seb128: well, I'm assigned some snappy work wrt wayland, so yes, I'm using it :)
<willcooke> jdstrand, are you working on Wayland interfaces already?  That was something I want to get kicked off and was just ponder who could work on that
<Trevinho> willcooke:  I can have a look to those too, if needed.
<willcooke> jdstrand, as in.. if you are, do you need some help?
<jdstrand> willcooke: I am working on waland and basic gnome3, yes. not portals
<jdstrand> (like how we have x11 and unity7, I'd like wayland and gnome)
<jdstrand> going to put plasma in there too
<jdstrand> Trevinho: I can ping you on the PR
<willcooke> jdstrand, yeah, I was thinking the same re: unity7 etc.  So, you want some help?
<jdstrand> willcooke: the thing I could use help with is XDG_RUNTIME_DIR and this forum topic: https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/wayland-dconf-and-xdg-runtime-dir/186
<jdstrand> basically, for dconf, it was decided to set XDG_RUNTIME_DIR to /run/user/<uid>/snap.$SNAP_NAME
<willcooke> Trevinho, thanks for offering, you want to pitch in on that then? ^
<Trevinho> willcooke: I can... I'm currently workking in the snap preload to remove some of the desktop-qt* stuff... So that there's path redirection instead of using env variables for everything... And that should be eventually be part of the desktop parts.
<jdstrand> that works for dconf because it was coded that way, but allison[m] decided that wasn't the best course after all, and looking at wayland, I agree. wayland puts a socket in /run/user/<uid> so snaps can't find it. even with desktop part shenanigans to find it, then the client code puts another socket in /run/user/<uid>/snap.$SNAP_NAME
<Trevinho> so, this is different, but related
<jdstrand> so then wayland the server can't find it
<jdstrand> so really, XDG_RUNTIME_DIR needs to be /run/user/<uid> and we should use per-snap bind mounts
<jdstrand> similar to what flatpak does
<Trevinho> jdstrand: using snapcraft-preload, couldn't be a better solution?
<Trevinho> jdstrand: so, that we redirect what we need to the proper path in that case
<Trevinho> or.... Well, not sure... as I guess we won't have access to that anyway... But, if we grant access to /run/user/<uid>/wayland-soket only, then we can just allow accessing to that
<jdstrand> Trevinho: well, maybe. I mean we already do a per-snap /tmp, we could do a per-snap XDG_RUNTIME_DIR. the thing with the preload plugin is it will mean every desktop snap to be used on gnome/wayland needs to use it
<jdstrand> I figured that preload was a 'only if you need it' type of thing
<jdstrand> actually, that won't work anyway
<jdstrand> well, it depends
<jdstrand> there is finding the wayland socket in /run/user/uid
<Trevinho> jdstrand: well... as desktop-<part> are "optional", but withouth them things won't work....
<jdstrand> but there is also putting the client side in the same dir as the server socket
<Trevinho> I was thinking to use the preload by default in desktop parts soon... But need to finish some stuff on them
<jdstrand> otherwise wayland can't find it
<Trevinho> anyway... Sure, this is just partially related.
<jdstrand> that's a lot of conditional logic
<jdstrand> cause some sockets should go in SNAP_DATA, but these must be in XDG_RUNTIME_DIR
<jdstrand> also, recent versions of preload broke a python snap of mine (I haven't looked into it-- I'm fetching a particular git commit now)
<jdstrand> so I'm somewhat concerned about that
<jdstrand> let me add my wayland findings to that forum post, then the conversation can be brought up there
<Trevinho> jdstrand: oh, what broke your script? Let me know, as I could be the cause too :-)
<Trevinho> jdstrand: and I've a rewrite in c++ in progress of it... And some other changes.
<jdstrand> Trevinho: all of a sudden things were racy and the tool would sometimes segfault. https://code.launchpad.net/~myapps-reviewers/review-tools/+git/review-tools
<jdstrand> Trevinho: this is the workaround: https://git.launchpad.net/review-tools/commit/?id=5446aecf89902f70e62acd72197313c303066b65
<Trevinho> jdstrand: did you try to go back in revision?
<Trevinho> ah i see
<jdstrand> Trevinho: (don't worry about the build-packages part, that is a separate thing)
<jdstrand> Trevinho: if you build with master, then install the snap and then do 'snap-review ./review-tools*.snap' (or any other snap) you can see what I mean
<Trevinho> ok, I'll check that tomorrow
<Trevinho> jdstrand: any way to reproduce?
<Trevinho> ok
<jdstrand> do it over and over again. it usually segfaults. it sometimes doesn't
<jdstrand> Trevinho: if you are building on amd64, make sure the build-packages is uncommented like in that commit
<Trevinho> jdstrand: fun that probably one of the commits causing issues, is the one that allows it to run X11 apps...
<Trevinho> ouch, debugging under snap isn't the funniest things to setup :-)
<jdstrand> Trevinho: for context, it is using preload for python3-magic and finding various magic files
<Trevinho> ack
<Trevinho> jdstrand: related and urelated... But do you have any clue, why if I "access" or "stat" a .dotted file/folder in my home that is indeed not readable under snap, these don't return -1?
<Trevinho> jdstrand: it's something I'm doing in still in preload, at a certain point my app tries to access to ~/.ssh (that for some missing features points to my /home/user/.ssh) and... at that point if I access that path, it won't return -1. Although it's not readable, of course
<Trevinho> in fact in the very same scenario, C++'s std::ifstream (pathname).good () returns false.
<seb128> Trevinho, the preload thing is a hack and feels wrong to me, big -1 on using that for desktop part imho
<jdstrand> Trevinho: yes. let me get the bug number
<Trevinho> seb128: it's really the only way we have to ensure we access to the proper paths...
<Trevinho> seb128: env vars don't cover all the things
<jdstrand> Trevinho: https://bugs.launchpad.net/apparmor/+bug/1655435
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1655435 in AppArmor "stat() unconditionally allowed via apparmor_inode_getattr()" [Undecided,Triaged]
<Trevinho> seb128: and if we're not going to proper bind mounts, ever... there's no other ways to cover many cases
<seb128> Trevinho, you can make code rellocatable as well
<Trevinho> seb128: what you mean?
<seb128> Trevinho, it's a big hammer, might be needed in some cases but shouldn't be default imho
<seb128> Trevinho, code can be made to look at proper env variable or such if needed
<Trevinho> seb128: well, the way preloads work is that... If the path the apps tries to point exists, and it's readable... then it uses it. Otherwise it looks under $SNAP... This is not wrong imho
<Trevinho> seb128: sure, but so many tools won't do that
<Trevinho> seb128: so... basically it's conservative in the way it does...
<seb128> still it's hacking and creates lot of un-necessary syscalls
<seb128> hackish
<Trevinho> this is true...
<Trevinho> but... That's where we are
<Trevinho> seb128: the hack of using a /snap/<name>/current prefix for building is even worse imho...
<seb128> it's not an hack
<seb128> it has no side effect
<Trevinho> seb128: as for example, it doesn't work in sub-libs...
<Trevinho> seb128: and it doesn't work in non-ubuntu env
<seb128> why not?
<Trevinho> as /snap is not there in non-ubuntu
<seb128> right, I pointed that on the list several time
<Trevinho> it might be in /var/snapd/...
<seb128> we should have a /run stable entry point
<seb128> so we could use that one as prefix
<seb128> that symlink to the real dir
<Trevinho> seb128: anyway the main issue of it, is that... if you include a lib that has plugins... you need to rebuild all with that prefix. And it's not nice.
<seb128> building on hacks is not nice either...
<pitti> xnox: "gnome-terminal -x mutt" :)
<Trevinho> seb128: there was some discussion in https://github.com/nextcloud/client_theming/pull/77#issuecomment-284541717 too
<Trevinho> seb128: well, it depends.. If in future we'll going to have proper bind mounts, then it would make the transition easier..
<Trevinho> in general I noticed more reliability on preload than using the desktop launchers... Considering that it has not the problem of the first-slow-startup
<Trevinho> anyway... I can just add dependent parts that uses it optionally... It's not that I want to push it, but in general I find it to be more reliable than other things
<Trevinho> Well, since when I made it working with X :-)
<Trevinho> Anyway, time to go for me...
<Trevinho> See you tomorow.
<jdstrand> willcooke, seb128, Trevinho: fyi, https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/wayland-dconf-and-xdg-runtime-dir/186/4
<jdstrand> bye Trevinho :)
<seb128> Trevinho, night
<xnox> pitti, what is mutt?
<ogra_> xnox, evolution without toolkit ;)
<pitti> xnox: vim's best friend :)
<pitti> (actually it says the other way round, but I consider a friendship relation as symmetric)
<jdstrand> willcooke, Trevinho, seb128, allison[m]: ah, https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/wayland-dconf-and-xdg-runtime-dir/186/5
<seb128> jbicha, kenvandine, I changed the "approved" column on the MIR_List wiki to "-" for things that were in main before, like as "not applicable"
<seb128> those just need to be moved back
<kenvandine> seb128, thx
<jbicha> seb128: cool, I asked earlier in #ubuntu-hardened about that but didn't get a response yet how those would be handled
<seb128> k
<seb128> in the past we just re-promoted things
<seb128> but doesn't hurt to ask
<seb128> jbicha, some of the packages names in that table start with a "-", does it mean something or just formatting inconsistency?
<seb128> like "- gnome-settings-daemon "
<kenvandine> no
<kenvandine> i think that's is nesting it under something else that depends on it
<seb128> vs "gnome-control-center "
<kenvandine> at least i suspect
<seb128> oh
<jbicha> it's undocumented nesting
<kenvandine> like mozjs is under gjs
<seb128> g-s-d depends on g-c-c?
<seb128> the other way around sorry
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> k
<seb128> thanks :-)
<seb128> that makes sense
<seb128> there is probably more of that to add then
<jbicha> gnome-shell depends on everything else in group 1 though
<kenvandine> jbicha, what exactly is Old MIR?
<seb128> like gnome-characters uses js stuff
<kenvandine> just it had a MIR that was never approved?
<kenvandine> oh, at least a couple were
<jbicha> kenvandine: it was previously in main with an approved MIR
<kenvandine> so then approved should be a "-"
<jbicha> some stuff has always been in Ubuntu so it never had a MIR
<kenvandine> yeah
<jbicha> kenvandine: yes
<alexarnaud> Hello all :) !
 * kenvandine edits
<alexarnaud> https://code.launchpad.net/~ksamak/compiz/ezoom_focus_tracking/+merge/321643
<alexarnaud> andyrock: Do you wait something more for the this MR ?
<andyrock> andyrock: I need to take another look but not sure I can't right now
<alexarnaud> andyrock: OK, when you think you could take a look to that? We wait the merge of this to paid ksamak and we are going to improve focus tracking often so we wouldn't increase the size of the MR each month.
<alexarnaud> :)
<andyrock> alexarnaud: I'll try to review today/tomorro
<andyrock> *it
<andyrock> I guess Trevinho can take a look too
<alexarnaud> Great,
<andyrock> but merging will require time
<alexarnaud> andyrock: I know that, we have take time to develop and test this code also. I'm using this code everyday to use my computer.
<alexarnaud> It will make Ubuntu more accessible for low-vision persons.
<andyrock> I know but we also need to make sure that this does not conflict with unity
<willcooke> kenvandine, installing Ubuntu GNOME here, I just saw Brasero whizz past.  That's one for the "should we / shouldn't we" list. :)
<willcooke> cc: seb128 jbicha ^
<jbicha> willcooke: what version are you installing?
<willcooke> jbicha, installing ubuntu-gnome-desktop on a 17.04 machine
<kenvandine> willcooke, we should be looking at zesty
<kenvandine> could be quite a delta
<willcooke> is it dropped from there already?
<kenvandine> haven't checked yet
<jbicha> in 17.04 I split Brasero's Nautilus extension out of Brasero and only the Nautilus extension is installed by default in new installs
<willcooke> ahh
<willcooke> yeah, looking more closely its not installed
<willcooke> sorry
<jbicha> it has some nice integration but you don't have to deal with brasero's outdated and poorly maintained main UI
<jbicha> you can right click on an ISO to use it to burn a CD/DVD
<willcooke> ooh, nice
<seb128> kenvandine, 17.04 is zesty no?
<kenvandine> oh whoops :)
<kenvandine> confused with 16.05 :)
<seb128> also I don't think we want to start from Ubuntu GNOME
<kenvandine> 04
<seb128> we probably want to start by switching the desktop and keeping our apps selection
<kenvandine> yeah, i'm installing zesty in a VM now
<kenvandine> and will start by installing gnome-shell
<seb128> then we can review the diffs and see what we want to bring in
<kenvandine> and build from there
<seb128> good plan
<seb128> did you read the meeting log yesterday?
<seb128> La_ney set up a ppa
<kenvandine> seb128, i was quieting listening :)
<jbicha> I have a wishlist bug for that to be integrated into Nautilus directly https://bugzilla.gnome.org/772495
<ubot5> Gnome bug 772495 in File and Folder Operations "Add support for writing disk image to CD/DVD, etc." [Enhancement,New]
<ogra_> seb128, do you think someone from the desktop team might be able to give a statement on https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/integrate-snapd-xdg-open-into-snapd-repository/100/55 ? (robert did already but i dont think he researched what is there already and has not seen the hack around logind to work around it in the new proposal)
<seb128> ogra_, robert_ancell already commented, maybe asking him to update according to the new content?
<ogra_> seb128, well, any comment would be fine so snapd doesnt hack around logind/polkit
<ogra_> i simple am not heard by the decision maker
<seb128> I don't understand what those have to do with url handling
<ogra_> (and i think morphis gave up too)
<seb128> well it's typical discussion
<seb128> everybody agrees but Gustavo doesn't and he's not going to move
<seb128> so people just give up and go do something else
<ogra_> seb128, snaps run inside the core snap ... to hand out the url request to xdg-open on the running desktop we have a dbus service sitting in the session currently that the snap can hand the url to
<seb128> yeah, I'm pretty well aware of how the current implementation works
<seb128> and it's the logical thing to do
<ogra_> what gistavo wants is to not use dbus, instead fish the session address out of logind via some env inspection of processes in proc and then force call xdg-open directly
<seb128> the service should just be shipped with snapd to avoid the depends issue
<seb128> that seems hackish and likely to bite back
<ogra_> what i'm trying to do is to convince him to keep the (rather sane in that light) current implementation
<seb128> +1
<ogra_> but i'm unheard or turned down ... so i'd like to have someone comment that he considers more compenent than me ;)
<ogra_> and yes, robert commented but pretty high up in the thread
<ogra_> it evolved since
<seb128> we can do that I guess
<ogra_> thanks :)
<seb128> yw
<willcooke> night all
<chrisccoulson> Heh, I found something I like in gnome shell that isn't in unity
<chrisccoulson> night mode is pretty cool
<ryanleesipes> chrisccoulson: right?
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-04-20
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: so https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/615/appindicator-support/ seems to work well for appindicators here, not sure for electron apps though
<Trevinho> Mmh, not sure how I will able to live with all this wasted space though... http://imgur.com/eLZO2Rs.png
<ochosi> Trevinho: sorry to hijack, but what's the plan with indicators in the post-unity world? will you still maintain/use them? we in xubuntu always found them useful and ship them in our default install, but we probably can't maintain them (no manpower)
<Trevinho> ochosi: eh.... good question :-)
<Trevinho> ochosi: I think we need to figure that out in next week meeting
<ochosi> i see
<ochosi> just as my 2 cents, i would love it if they survived
<ochosi> or maybe you can generalize them somehow and get them into other distros as well
<ochosi> but anyway, i'll try to follow your meeting or ask again in 2 weeks
<duflu> $ reboot
<flexiondotorg> Morning desktopers
<flexiondotorg> Trevinho Morning. Nice find.
<flexiondotorg> I'll give it a test.
<flexiondotorg> Trevinho also:
<flexiondotorg> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/04/plotinus-hud-menu-search-gtk3-apps
<flexiondotorg> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/04/global-menu-for-gnome-extension-development
<Trevinho> ochosi: I guess we need to support app-indicators, though... So an extension like the one above could be in.
<flexiondotorg> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/04/adwaita-theme-smaller-title-bars
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: nice.... I guess we need to define what in and what out... That global menu ext doesn't look to be the nicest, but... We can hack it in case. But still, unless we don't have a proper plan...
<flexiondotorg> All ideas right now, but useful references.
<duflu_> flexiondotorg, the smaller titlebars would appear to undo Gnome's touch-ability...
<duflu_> Depends if that's something you want.
<duflu_> Windows 10 is in the same boat - touch friendly (too big) or not
<flexiondotorg> duflu_ Adwaita is still there for those with touch displays :-)
<duflu_> flexiondotorg: So where's that desktop slider? :)
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<duflu> Morning seb128
<seb128> hey duflu flexiondotorg Trevinho
<Trevinho> morning seb128
<Trevinho> hei duflu
<duflu> Hi Trevinho. I hope you are at least by the pool/beach
<Trevinho> duflu: in fact unity8 had  a pretty nice design to support that.... We can push upstream to do something like we were doing, so changing the theme state depending on the UX jurney
<flexiondotorg> Morning seb128. How's things?
<seb128> flexiondotorg, good! you?
<flexiondotorg> Not bad. Up late SRU'ing Ubuntu MATE bugs ;-)
<duflu> Trevinho, or volcano, or...
<Trevinho> duflu: no... Just normal coworking space today
<duflu> Sure, let's call the pool bar "coworking space"
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: I guess we've to SRU that issue too for compiz...
<Trevinho> duflu: see... Just some jungle in the back...  https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/vxkHqYEi/20170420_153722_HDR.jpg
<duflu> oic
<flexiondotorg> Trevinho Would be most appreciated.
<muktupavels> Trevinho: can you review few compiz merge proposals?
<muktupavels> https://code.launchpad.net/~muktupavels/compiz/lp1530277/+merge/321647
<muktupavels> https://code.launchpad.net/~muktupavels/compiz/require-libmetacity-3-22/+merge/322370
<muktupavels> https://code.launchpad.net/~muktupavels/compiz/fix-initial-server-frame-position/+merge/322817
<Laney> morning
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> I'm ok, went climbing for the first time again last night
<Laney> after the shoulder injury
<Laney> wasn't toooo bad
<Laney> then we went to folk club and saw a cool band!
<Laney> was a guest night
<Laney> what about you?
<seb128> sounds like a nice evening
<seb128> I'm good, didn't do anything special yesterday evening though, just watched some tv and read
<seb128> today is sunny though and I've tennis at 5pm
<Laney> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SUnnQ4Ki0R8 this band
<seb128> nice music
<Trevinho> hey Laney
<Laney> hi Trevinho
<Laney> you good?
<duflu> Morning Laney
<Trevinho> hey Laney yeah... all good. last night went to a couple of bars... Made some new friends :-)
<Trevinho> Laney: nice music indeed, tho
<Laney> bad head today?
<Laney> hey duflu
<Laney> what's up?
<Laney> Trevinho: this one is nice too https://youtu.be/FpJqv4b398o
 * Laney got gnome-shell to build in jhbuild finally /o\
 * Laney stabs libtool
<Trevinho> Laney: "bad head" was for me me? :-)
<Laney> yep
<Trevinho> Laney: no, no... alllllright
<Trevinho> but last night I also got up to watch Champions League... Which here is at 2:45 :|
<flexiondotorg> Morning Laney muktupavels
<Trevinho> Almost slept the final part
<Laney> /o\
<Laney> hi flexiondotorg
<muktupavels> hi flexiondotorg
<duflu> What is "a Champions League"?
 * duflu ducks
<ahayzen> Hi, anyone else noticed with Ubuntu GNOME 17.04, after clicking shutdown the dialog that has three options (cancel, restart, power off). It takes *two* clicks to select any of the buttons? And Esc doesn't work until you click somewhere in the dialog, seems focus is not been given to the dialog?  Anyone know which project I should report against ?
<flexiondotorg> jbicha ^
<Laney> I'd start with gnome-shell. It can be reassigned if necessary.
<flexiondotorg> Laney, have you seen that MAC randomisation in Network Manager is creating havoc?
<flexiondotorg> Not just Ubuntu.
<flexiondotorg> This has been an issue in every distro shipping Network Manager 1.4
<flexiondotorg> Here is the LP bug - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1681513
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1681513 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu 17.04: New privacy feature in NetworkManager stops some WiFi adapters from working (mac address randomization)" [High,Confirmed]
<flexiondotorg> I've had loads of reports of wifi being completely broken :-(
<flexiondotorg> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=836351
<ubot5> Debian bug 836351 in network-manager "new mac address randomization breaks WiFi with various drivers" [Grave,Fixed]
<Laney> Nope
<Laney> I don't know a single solitary thing about that feature
<Laney> The Debian bug is fixed though?
<ahayzen> Laney, thanks, i've reported bug 1684510 for now
<ubot5> bug 1684510 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Focus is not given to shutdown dialog, resulting in cancel, restart and poweroff requiring two clicks" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1684510
<Laney> ahayzen: cool beans
<flexiondotorg> Laney Well is was fixed in nm 1.4 in Debian by cherry picking some commits. But the change logs don't say what.
<flexiondotorg> They are now using nm 1.6.
<Laney> flexiondotorg: Presumably the diff would
 * Laney feeds alioth some more hamsters
<Laney> https://anonscm.debian.org/git/pkg-utopia/network-manager.git/commit/?id=0bb216356b69f2df305b921c9e38a0a2bb502c4d
<duflu> Boo. The Pinebook specs just got refreshed/finalized and they changed IPS LCD to a TN LCD
<Laney> I think we have these patches.
<duflu> Or maybe everyone just incorrectly assumed it was IPS when writing about it months ago
<Laney> flexiondotorg: If those patches are already in 1.4.4, which it looks like they are, then I guess it didn't fully fix the bug? Try c_yphermox maybe. Not sure who's maintaining NM currently :/
<Trevinho> muktupavels: so, if you want SRU them too, we need a bug for those fix branches
<Trevinho> muktupavels: if not... well, I need to wait before landing them
<muktupavels> Trevinho: I dont want to SRU them, just get review.
<Trevinho> muktupavels: well, this at least https://code.launchpad.net/~muktupavels/compiz/fix-initial-server-frame-position/+merge/322817 is going to be SRUed probably, even to Xenial, so...
<Trevinho> please open a bug at least for that :-)
<muktupavels> Trevinho: I don't like to open/write bug reports... maybe flexiondotorg can do that as that affects also MATE.
<flexiondotorg> Sure, I'll take a look a bit later...
<flexiondotorg> I'll create an SRU bug for https://code.launchpad.net/~muktupavels/compiz/fix-initial-server-frame-position/+merge/322817
<flexiondotorg> muktupavels Question for you.
<flexiondotorg> If the upstream MATE team were interested in making Metacity a first class citizen in MATE, would you welcome that?
<muktupavels> yes, why not?
<flexiondotorg> Something we discussed in the team is updating mate-settings-daemon so it fully supports Metacity.
<flexiondotorg> With a potential goal of dropping Marco and using Metacity as the default WM in MATE.
<Trevinho> muktupavels: well, I don't like that too... But you know, it's part of being a developer :-D
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: nobody will drop me! ð
<Trevinho> and... I'm not sure if I like or hate the fact that a project has my name... As I get pinged all the time you upload something... xD
<flexiondotorg> muktupavels Just wanted to check that you don't see any potential issue with maintaining Metacity if it were to be the default WM in MATE too?
<muktupavels> flexiondotorg: what issues? there might be more theme related changes - I want animation support for window decorations with GTK+...
<muktupavels> if Metacity works for MATE then use it. :)
<flexiondotorg> Excellent. Thanks muktupavels I'll let the team know you've agreed and we'll work on this :-)
<muktupavels> gtk+ required version is not problem, right? At some point I will probably try to port it to GTK+ 4...
<flexiondotorg> muktupavels Ahh, that might be an issue.
<muktupavels> flexiondotorg: currenlty I have 3.19.8 as required version in configure.ac
<flexiondotorg> So MATE support GTK 3.14 to GTK 3.22.
<flexiondotorg> And, as a project, we're hoping to stay on GTK 3.22 for a good while.
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: if you can make https://bugs.launchpad.net/compiz/+bug/1530277 also SRU friendly would be nice :-)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1530277 in Compiz "gtk-window-decorator incorrectly draws the title bar if GDK_SCALE is set" [Undecided,New]
<muktupavels> gtk+ 4 is not ready and probably it will take some time...
<flexiondotorg> I don't see why Metacity moving to GTK4+ would be a problem for MATE though.
<muktupavels> why 3.14 is supported version?
<flexiondotorg> Some distros have it that really want MATE.
<muktupavels> they want newest MATE but use old gtk+?
<flexiondotorg> Apparently.
<muktupavels> that part I will never understand...
<flexiondotorg> We review the supported versions every few months and drop support for older releases.
<flexiondotorg> I think we will soon require 3.22
<muktupavels> ok, then gtk+ should not be problem. :)
<muktupavels> metacity going to gtk+ 4 would also require gtk-window-decorator to do same...
<Trevinho> When your car insurance company sends you the docs throught a link that points to an owncloud instance.... how's that? :-)
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: anyway, i trust you'll do the bug for that MP and I'm adding it to the SRU silo
<duflu> muktupavels: Last time I looked at that it had GTK-2 dependencies still. Did someone get it to 3 at least?
<duflu> I vaguely recall reading someone did it
<muktupavels> dufu: gtk-window-decorator use gtk+ 3...
<duflu> Cool
<duflu> But not any more
<muktupavels> ?
<flexiondotorg> Trevinho Next on my list is those bugs.
<flexiondotorg> duflu If you referring to MATE, it is GTK3 only now.
<duflu> No, I meant gtk-window-decorator. But I'm recalling the state of the code from 2012
<Laney> A golden year
<Laney> I keep copies of 2012 code in my code cellar
<Laney> 2016... not so much
<davmor2> Laney: why would gnome-software tell me vim is installed when running it in terminal says it isn't?
<Laney> dunno
<Laney> what happens when you press launch?
<davmor2> nothing
<Laney> is gvim?
<davmor2> Laney: imgur.com/a/UBkmH
<davmor2> Laney: I'm thinking it is vim-tiny that is install but gnome-software is just lumping them all together
<Laney> vim's desktop file is in a different package to vim itself
<Laney> presumably that thing is installed
<davmor2> Laney: right but if you search for vim that is the only file so far
<muktupavels> Trevinho: fix initial server position commit also brings in metacity required version changes... that is most likely not wanted for SRU...
<Laney> I'm aware that that is what you are seeing
<Laney> what I am saying is an explanation of why that might be.
<davmor2> Laney: yeap I'm just saying the thing sucks don't worry ;)  So I see neovim, gvim and that icon for vim itself.  So I'm assuming all terminal apps are hidden unless they have a launcher attached to them
<Laney> Only desktop applications are shown
<Laney> please just file a bug :-)
<seb128> Laney, flexiondotorg, on that n-m issue we maybe need https://cgit.freedesktop.org/NetworkManager/NetworkManager/commit/?h=nm-1-4&id=cb18faf2df6b556cf2837001c62efbb5fbe2066b ?
<willcooke> Hello from London
<seb128> hey willcooke
<willcooke> coming late to the party, is that n-m issue about MAC addresses changing?
<willcooke> Seems like a bad default to me if it is.
<Laney> Why's that?
<Laney> seb128: Don't know. That looks more like a problem with users changing the setting to me, but it could be.
<willcooke> Constantly changing MAC address makes for very difficult management on a network where IP addresses are reserved by MAC
<willcooke> like at my house ;)
<willcooke> and other networks I've managed during my life
<Laney> I thought it just did it while scanning.
<davmor2> hey willcooke
<Laney> that's what the iOS stuff does anyway
<Laney> and I thought this was more or less the same thing
<Laney> Something on radio 4 about peeling mushrooms
<Laney> I've never even heard of such a thing
<seb128> https://cooking.stackexchange.com/questions/51917/why-should-or-shouldnt-i-peel-mushrooms
<Laney> amazing
<Laney> I didn't even know they could be peeled
<Laney> would have thought that it would just make them break up into bits
<Laney> what a world we live in today
<seb128> I'm always unsure if they should be peeled or not, way they are too muddy I usually do that...
<seb128> lol
<seb128> way->when
<Laney> going to try this next time
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> Trevinho, some SRU team members re-enforced recently that they would like SRU verification to include the package version/revision you tested and how you tested it, they might not like your "I'm running fixed version for some weeks in my trusty machine."
<Trevinho> seb128: oh.... well, it's clear what's the version.. But ok, I was lazy to copy&paste
<Trevinho> :-)
<Trevinho> seb128: where's that policy though?
 * Trevinho checks wiki..
<Trevinho> and it has not much infos, like a pattern to follow... At this point having a template would be better
<seb128> Trevinho, I think I read that on some ubuntu-devel@ recent discussion
<Trevinho> ok, I see the 3rd
<Trevinho> 3d
<jbicha> the mac randomization is a useful feature but one problem is that there is no easy way to turn it off if it causes problems so I filed https://bugzilla.gnome.org/781295
<ubot5> Gnome bug 781295 in Network "network: Allow configuring random MAC addresses" [Enhancement,New]
<jbicha> Windows 10 has that feature
<jbicha> and good morning
<seb128> Trevinho, https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2017-March/039745.html is the email I was thinking about for SRUs details
<seb128> "When marking "verification-done", please describe what packages were
<seb128> tested and what versions. "
<seb128> oh, I see that you replied but your email didn't reach the list
<Laney> I think it'd be fair enough to ask rbasak (or someone) to update the wiki and/or messages from the tools if they decided to make that policy
 * Laney checks the ubuntu-devel moderation queue
<Laney> [1/60] ============= ubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com =====================
<Laney> :(
<seb128> Laney, that's sort of what I just asked in my reply :-) (or maybe that was not clear from what I wrote, is that what you say?)
<Laney> so much spam
<Laney> no I didn't see any reply yet
<seb128> I just sent it like 10 minutes ago
<Laney> cool
<Laney> From:     marco.trevisan@canonical.com
<Laney> Subject:  Re: SRU quality and preventing regressions
<Laney> found!
<Trevinho> You guys ban me?
 * Trevinho at dinner... Checking later
<Laney> seb128: ok, saw it now, that's what I meant :-)
<Laney> Trevinho: go away!
<seb128> Laney, :-)
<seb128> Trevinho, enjoy dinner
<Laney> don't check later, check tmoorrow
<seb128> Trevinho, you hit moderation queue, probably because you used @canonical rather than @ubuntu?
<kenvandine> jbicha, do you have bzr branches for ubuntu GNOME packages?  Like gnome-shell?
<seb128> Laney, k, he just replied saying he's going to jfdi :)
<Laney> nice
<jbicha> kenvandine: not pushed publicly any more, I was waiting for Debian pkg-gnome to convert from svn to git to use their branches
<kenvandine> jbicha, ok, thanks
<Laney> bahaha
<kenvandine> i'm going to push some branches to ~ubuntu-desktop for now
<Laney> that's one of those endless topics
<kenvandine> Laney, yes... i heard :)
<Laney> we kept trying to organise a pkg-gnome sprint to do this (amongst other things) but it never managed to quite happen yet
<Laney> 2017: Year of the pkg-gnome git conversion!
<kenvandine> Laney, maybe our next sprint
<kenvandine> lol
<kenvandine> Laney, we might have the proper motivation now
<Laney> if we get some pkg-gnome guys along, then could be
<jbicha> I think the pkg-gnome team is getting more interested in doing it this year
<seb128> is there different options on how they can do it?
<seb128> ik gbp style or not
<seb128> I've no idea about git workflows, but we should maybe have somebody from our side who take interest, look at options and what would be best for us and try to participate in the discussions
<seb128> unsure who would be interested in anyone
<seb128> if
<jbicha> well, basic default gbp style is different from dep14 and there's a couple places where dep14 gives options
<jbicha> an example dep14 tree is at https://anonscm.debian.org/git/pkg-gnome/gnome-games.git/
<seb128> is that what they lean toward atm?
<seb128> I wonder if that's a case of "we are just going to have to play by the rules they come with"
<jbicha> there's the question of whether it should be as Perfect as possible or if we should Get It Done and adapt things later
<seb128> or if we should try to have a say/figure out what works best for us
<jbicha> seb128: ask in #debian-gnome what they think about dep14 :)
<Laney> I think that we should be a part of they.
<Laney> and I already am to some extent :)
<jbicha> when it was mentioned several weeks ago, nothing in pkg-gnome git was using dep14 yet really, but I converted my new packages over to it now
<seb128> Laney, right, I agree with that, still it might be better to have one person looking at the issue than having a bunch of us joining now to ask stupid question and trying to join the discussion with slightly different opinions
<seb128> that might be less constructive
<jbicha> there's only a few heavy contributors to pkg-gnome so you just have to get them to agree with the plan, everyone else can adapt
<seb128> I guess what I'm saying is "can we try to be pro-active to increase the chances to have a resulting workflow we are happy with"? They might pick something that most of our team find too tedious and which is going to mean less of us might want to work there
<jbicha> my opinion is that it can't be worse than svn
<seb128> we don't work in svn here
<seb128> we have our own debian/ based vcs in bzr
<seb128> anyway, not something we are going to sort out today and I need to move location, bbiab
<jbicha> the git branches will have the full source but probably not full upstream commit history
<Laney> soz, someone came to the door
<Laney> I think most of the reasonable options are good and much better than SVN
<Laney> and I expect to be helping out, especially if I can get to something like Debcamp/Debconf
<ads20000> Would it be possible for Ubuntu Software to have a download link for Snaps which downloads the .snap and .assert for people to install Snaps offline?
<ads20000> See https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/install-snap-files-offline/302/
<ads20000> One could just use `snap download hello-world` but it would be better if there was a GUI to do this, would be even better if Ubuntu Software could handle installing at the other end (somehow installing the .snap and .assert) Deb-style
<Laney> Seems niche and confusing
<ads20000> Which is why I would prefer a third-party like uAppExplorer allow for downloading `.assert` files, but @ogra_ said it should be the software center app
<dobey> i would expect that such a feature would not be implemented. and even if it were, the assertions have to be added in a non-obvious order
<dobey> the snappy/server folks are quite against things other than snapd talking to the server
<ryanleesipes> willcooke: Is 18.04 still going to be Snap-based?
<willcooke> ryanleesipes, I think you're combining a couple of things there.  Classic Ubuntu desktop will be deb based.  I expect that we will be shipping some apps as snaps though.  But the main distro will still be deb based
<Laney> nighty night
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-04-21
<robert_ancell> jbicha, can you confirm for bug 1672424 you were trying with non-absolute paths and you already have g-s running?
<ubot5> bug 1672424 in gnome-software (Ubuntu Zesty) "Installing .debs from the command line fails for non-absolute paths" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1672424
<sarnold> that's annoying that rather than give an error message like "No such file or directory" which is a fairly clear indicator, it gives "this file type is not supported", which means nearly nothing. :(
<robert_ancell> sarnold, agreed, the error message is also terrible.
<robert_ancell> Will fix that too
<robert_ancell> It's because it passes the filename to all the plugins and none of them handle it. It never actually checks if the file exists.
<jbicha> robert_ancell: good morning
<robert_ancell> jbicha, hi
<sarnold> oh so it's not like there's a simple fopen() call with the results, but a potentially undertemined number of error messages from a pile of modules, all with different errors...
<robert_ancell> sarnold, luckily in this case they don't return errors, they just don't make use of the filename
<jbicha> uh, it failed for me when I ran with an absolute path or with ./itch_23.4.0_amd64.deb
<jbicha> switcheroo-control is in zesty now so I didn't use that as a test case
<jbicha> but I get different behavior if I try to open it directly from Firefox like LP: #1682819
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1682819 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Pressing Install in Software Center does nothing when installing deb file" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1682819
<jbicha> GNOME Software opens with the package description but the Install button does nothing
<robert_ancell> jbicha, ok, so there is at least two bugs here then
<jbicha> https://itch.io/app/ was what I was using
<robert_ancell> trying that now
<jbicha> yes
<jbicha> I got several confirmations of both these bugs in the past week
<jbicha> this and networking issues were the 2 biggest problems I've heard about from 17.04 so I appreciate you looking into it
<jbicha> oh, I read the test case again
<jbicha> if I use the absolute file name, I get the package description page with the useless Install button
<robert_ancell> jbicha, with itch?
<jbicha> yes
<robert_ancell> OK, I see that with itch too now
<jbicha> oh, it's not morning any more where you are
<robert_ancell> jbicha, nope, 14:17 :)
<robert_ancell> About the time I end up with a bunch of questions and no-one is online anymore!
<jbicha> ok, I finally added a world clock for NZ, let's see if that helps me get the time right
<duflu> Is Artful Aardvark for real for a placeholder name?
<sarnold> sure looks real http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/artful/
<duflu> I've been fooled before. Although that was just in conversation people using false codenames
<Laney> hey
<davmor2> Morning all
<didrocks> morning Laney, davmor2
<willcooke> what ho
<Laney> hi davmor2 didrocks willcooke
<davmor2> tally ho pip pip willcooke
<davmor2> morning didrocks Laney how are you guys
<seb128> hey there, I'm around but need to change location so back online in 10min or so
<davmor2> quick everyone hide and get ready to rah seb128 when he comes back :D
 * willcooke puts a lampshade on his head
<Laney> davmor2: yeah ok
<Laney> went round to a friend for dinner last night and got a puncture on the way /o\
<Laney> took a detour through wollaton park to see if there were any fawns kicking about
<Laney> there were LOADS!
<Laney> but the path is spiky :(
<davmor2> Laney: wompwompwomp.com
<Laney> is that like the sad trombone
<davmor2> Laney: html5 sad trombone no flash required
<Laney> :D
<Laney> anyway, said friend had a puncture repair kit and i managed to fix it
<Laney> then we had enchiladas
<Laney> so all was well
<seb128> back
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> how's it going
<seb128> good, it's friday!
<Laney> oh yeah
<Laney> I forgot
<seb128> I played tennis yesterday early evening, then we went to a nice italian place and watched the last round of political interviews before the elections
<seb128> and you?
<Trevinho> ah hey guys
<seb128> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> seb128: is elections going to be mad like usual nowadays?
<Laney> I made a youtube video of a traffic light last night
<Laney> peak cycle campaigning
<Sweetshark> moin
<seb128> what's wrong with the light? never green for bikes?
<Sweetshark> seb128: counting on you guys (wrt elections)
<seb128> Trevinho, dunno yeah, we have 4 people close enough that they can qualify for the second round (only 2 to remain)
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey, how are you?
<Trevinho> yeah, I know a little the process
<Laney> yeah it didn't change if you were on a bike
<Laney> but they fixed it after I complained!
<Laney> my video is rotated though and I don't know how to fix that
<Laney> guessing I have to use another program to do that
 * Laney later on
<Sweetshark> seb128: mostly fine ;) -- still defragmenting my life, which actually is getting a much more enjoyable experience than I originally thought ...
<seb128> ah, glad to see that you find some positive
<seb128> sorry that you got hit by those changes
<seb128> Sweetshark, do you already have ideas what you want to do next?
<Sweetshark> change isnt bad, the swiftness of it all was a bit of a surprise.
<Sweetshark> seb128: ideas: yes. considering lots of options right now. Have not yet locked in on one option over all the others yet as "the one Thing" though.
<seb128> Sweetshark, k, good luck in any case and I hope you find something you like!
<Sweetshark> seb128: so: still open to suggestions ;)
<Sweetshark> seb128: thanks
<jbicha> morning :|
<seb128> hey jbicha, happy friday
<andyrock> hey all
<darkxst> hey seb128
<seb128> hey andyrock darkxst
<darkxst> tracker is pretty integral to the gnome-shell experience
<darkxst> and I suspect its going to be really hard to benchmark performance
<darkxst> how big is you home folder? kind of thing
<jbicha> it doesn't index your home folder recursively by default
<jbicha> but if you have a very large music library in Music/ or videos in Videos/
<seb128> so how is the nautilus recursive search working?
<darkxst> tracker indexes a subset of the folder
<seb128> darkxst, I think you overplay how essential tracker is to gnome-shell and that we will find out that things work mostly fine without the indexer being active
<seb128> or you are saying that out of the box GNOME experience is crap until tracker has indexed
<seb128> does it index on battery?
<jbicha> seb128: he's right about those specific apps being absolutely useless without a tracker index
<seb128> yeah, but we don't plan to use any of those apps so far
<seb128> at least not music/photos
<seb128> we have rhythmbox&shotwell
<seb128> we said first step is to change desktop and keep our app selection
<seb128> we can rediscuss tracker in context of changing apps when we get resources to look at those changes
<jbicha> sure, I agree that Music & Photos aren't ideal
<seb128> which we are not going to have in a first wave
<darkxst> seb128, I supsect it would keep indexing on battery, but your not likely to pull a shitload of new files to index, while on battery?
<seb128> well maybe my first login is on battery
<darkxst> so its not actually gonna do much in that case
<jbicha> for a typical user, the indexing should be very quick and have very little performance impact
<darkxst> seb128, isnt there a warning to not upgrade on battery?
<seb128> typical users might have more music and videos that you think
<seb128> or photos
<seb128> darkxst, yes, you upgrade on power, when upgrade is down the system reboot
<darkxst> but really a one time hit, to index that content is not a concern?
<seb128> so you might just decide to stop and pick up your laptop/first boot next day in the train
<seb128> disk content change, it's not a one time hit
<seb128> you might use nautilus on battery
<darkxst> seb128,  feels like your picking obscure corner cases here!
<seb128> is it going to go through indexing the dirs you try to "typeahead" in?
<darkxst> nautilus search provider calls in the already indexed files
<seb128> so it does go through a full disk index at some point?
<seb128> or it just has incomplete results?
<darkxst> the type in search box in nautilus at some point will just revert to old school recursive search which is far less efficient than tracker
<jbicha> tracker's used by virtually every distro
<jbicha> while it has a few bugs and some people strongly don't like it, it doesn't seem to be a problem for most people
<seb128> doesn't mean it doesn't have drawbacks
<jbicha> reminds me a bit of systemd
<seb128> good luck working without an init systemd ;-)
<darkxst> seb128, no it doesnt just smash the file system, it uses inotify events to index changed files
<seb128> inotify has its limitations
<andyrock> do you know if it's possible to download the dell xps13 9360 sputnik iso?
<seb128> which is more the issue than tracker
<jbicha> inotify is on https://wiki.gnome.org/BastienNocera/KernelWishlist
<darkxst> well maybe, but zeitgeist musht be much the same
<darkxst> and you were happy to use that?
<seb128> it doesn't use inotify
<seb128> ?
<seb128> we just push infos from apps
<seb128> like nautilus or gtk fileselector when you open a file
<seb128> which is also a sucking experience since it only knows about things you opened
<seb128> or downloaded
<seb128> but at least it has no i/o impact
<seb128> nor battery
<darkxst> if battery is your main concern, Im that can be resolved
<darkxst> to not index on battery
<seb128> read p_itti's comment on the bug mentioned on the list, it summarize also my opinion
<seb128> anyway that discussion went wrong
<seb128> it's something we should look at
<seb128> we just don't have the resources to commit to look at it or maintain tracker atm
<seb128> so that's probably for later and somebody is going to need to commit to do the work
<seb128> need to go for lunch, bbiab
<seb128> back
<seb128> I might have missed some backlog, I dropped from IRC during lunch
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<kenvandine> wasn't mutter in main before?
<kenvandine> from the old unity based on mutter
<kenvandine> before precise...
<seb128> jbicha, darkxst, don't take what I wrote as a firm no against tracker, we are just not going to change everything at once without proper planning and ressources handling, that's on the backlog of tech discussions to have but dunno what priority it has and when we are going to get to it
<seb128> hey kenvandine
<darkxst> seb128, have you tried Ubuntu GNOME?
<seb128> kenvandine, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/<source>/+publishinghistory is your friend
<kenvandine> ah
<kenvandine> i've been using rmadison :)
<seb128> that lists only active series right?
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> darkxst, trying yes, using no
<seb128> darkxst, like on a test machine with a vanilla image to play a bit, not real day use with datas and my normal user profile
<darkxst> well use it then!
<seb128> and?
<kenvandine> ah, indeed maverick and natty had mutter in main :)
<seb128> darkxst, what do you expect me to notice/get out of it?
<seb128> darkxst, if that's about tracker it probably feels fine on my config
<darkxst> seb128, I meant Ubuntu GNOME in general
<seb128> doesn't mean power usage isn't going to increase by e.g 7% which wouldn't be easily noticable without proper benchmark, I'm also not using a rotational disk
<seb128> darkxst, again why do you ask? just so I get a feel for it?
<kenvandine> seb128, We only need 4 MIRs for a basic working gnome-shell in main
<seb128> kenvandine, woot
<seb128> gjs being on the list though :-/
<darkxst> seb128, I ask because regular use would be easier to benchmark
<kenvandine> gjs, mozjs38, caribou, and gnome-shell
<darkxst> even if its a rough metric
<seb128> mozjs
<kenvandine> seb128, i didn't say they are simple ones :)
<darkxst> I get ~5hrs on my laptop
<seb128> I wonder if we should get in touch with the onboard guys
<kenvandine> seb128, however... i think a very important one, but not required for basic usage would be chrome-gnome-shell
<seb128> darkxst, not sure what we argue over
<kenvandine> it doesn't bundle the browser extensions, but provides the host dbus service to install shell extensions after being prompted in the browser to install the browser extension
<kenvandine> without it, shell extensions will be a pain for users
<kenvandine> but security might not like it...
<kenvandine> personally i'd rank it as pretty important, but we can run the shell without it :)
<seb128> darkxst, my point is that landing new techs should not be a "let's land unprepared and figure out later (or not if we lack resources)", we need to do a proper job upfront looking at what is needed, the cost&benefit and have plan which includes proper resourcing to deal with the work&maintainance
<jbicha> seb128: bug 1672465 is a particular concern for onboard for us
<ubot5> bug 1672465 in Onboard "Onboard doesn't work in Wayland" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1672465
<jbicha> also onboard can't fully integrate with the Activities Overview search or the GNOME password prompts I believe; it uses the much more limited caribou in those cases I think
<kenvandine> jbicha, i noticed the shell provides it's own OSK, but i think it's only used in the shell's search
<jbicha> you'll probably want to install gnome-shell-extension-onboard to give it a try
<kenvandine> jbicha, is that right?
<seb128> jbicha, k, using caribou is fine, the onboard time just did good work for us for years so I don't want to stab them in the back
<jbicha> like to unlock your keyring
<seb128> time->team
<seb128> I want to give them a chance to make a case for their project
<jbicha> I think Caribou is likely not fine; it has far fewer features and keyboard layout support than Onboard
<kenvandine> the shell is using libcaribou
<darkxst> seb128, but you are creating extra work transitioning from a working Ubuntu GNOME to a Ubuntu with GNOME
<seb128> darkxst, we can't replace the desktop and all the apps and techs while dealing with testing&quality with a couple of engineers in one cycle
<seb128> just too much work
<seb128> what do you propose to do?
<seb128> give up on testing&knowing what we ship?
<darkxst> seb128, switch to Ubuntu GNOME
<darkxst> ]
<seb128> yeah, that's basically replacing the whole product and apps without giving us time to get familiar with what we ship
<seb128> that doesn't seem like a smart move
<seb128> we are going to get there, just not on day 1
<seb128> transitions need proper planning
<seb128> feel free to keep Ubuntu GNOME for an extra cycle if you think it's better while we work our way out on how to get there
<seb128> ?
<kenvandine> jbicha, hmmm... gdm3 hasn't been in main before
<kenvandine> it's not the same source as gdm
<jbicha> kenvandine: what do you mean it's not the same?
<seb128> kenvandine, it's the same project, just a source rename in Debian
<seb128> doesn't need a new MIR
<jbicha> mterry: what process are we going to use for stuff at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/GNOME/MIR_List that had been in main before at one point?
<darkxst> seb128, yes its a different product, but its all there in both debian and Ubuntu GNOME
<kenvandine> ah... great
<seb128> darkxst, yeah, it's there and the corresponding teams who built it know what they did, great for them, we (as Ubuntu Desktop) don't as much so we need time to ramp up there ... does that make sense?
<seb128> darkxst, I'm not sure what you are trying to argue for
<mterry> jbicha: I usually like to give them a quick once over because, I mean, their situation may have changed, we may now have a duplicate feature/library in main, etc.  In theory it's a rubber stamp, so maybe don't fill a full MIR bug out, but it'd be good to file a bare MIR and note that it used to be in
<seb128> darkxst, you want us to take a product we don't know and give official support&security updates for it without knowing if we have the resources to honor that commitment?
<seb128> darkxst, or if some of the changes are going to create issues for our oem partners
<darkxst> seb128, right you might need to hire a couple of extra people ;)
<seb128> that's not an option I've control on...
<seb128> would be nice though :-)
<seb128> we just fired a bunch of people so I'm unsure that's going to work out
<jbicha> kenvandine: Debian experimental svn's gnome-shell packaging has demoted gir1.2-telepathylogger-0.2 to Suggests since gnome 3.24 only optionally uses it
<kenvandine> cool
<jbicha> so I'm going to drop it from the MIR list
<kenvandine> i'll drop it from the build depends so we don't link to it
<darkxst> that was a partially sarcastic comment, but probably you are moving to a product (gnome-shell) that I am am the only one in the ubuntu world that understands
<darkxst> that should be your biggest issue, not nitpicks like tracker
<willcooke> jbicha, FYI - I'm following up on your libcolumbus question to devel
<kenvandine> willcooke, libcolumbus?  didn't jhodapp do some work on that?
<darkxst> willcooke, GPL3 will also be an issue lightdm, assuming the CLA was to be dropped
<Menzador> darkxst: Lol, pick me, until recently I spent a good week and a half on Ubuntu GNOME Zesty devel branch :)
<jbicha> willcooke: thanks, it's a really nice feature so I'd love to see it used more
<jhodapp> kenvandine, I didn't do work on it, but I have used it
<darkxst> Menzador, SonikAmerica, how was it?
<Menzador> darkxst: Nice and polished. I wish it had *all* of 3.24, but what we had was well done and fairly seamlessly integrated... no real issues at all
<Menzador> I even added a gazillion shell extensions... thankful for Google Chrome integration :)
<Menzador> Can't wait to see what 17.10 brings
<seb128> darkxst, so you sort of backup what I said? it's more important that we get some engineers familiar with the gnome-shell code first which should be the priority before other changes?
<Menzador> ^ in addition, I understand the latest GNOME Builder app makes it easier to contribute specifically to GNOME
<darkxst> seb128, regardless you will need engineers that can read both C and javascript!)
<seb128> darkxst, I think we should be good with those, at least robert/laney/ken and probably others I forgot to list
<darkxst> its a somewhat unique JS though
<kenvandine> hey jhodapp!
<xnox> willcooke, our theme needs a lot of fixing for gnome-shell =/
<jhodapp> heya
<kenvandine> xnox, it does
<kenvandine> i guess we should start filing bugs against our theme
<kenvandine> seb128, do we even have anyone to work on our themes?
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks for voluntering!
<seb128> :-)
 * kenvandine runs for cover
<seb128> willcooke said he would try to figure out who design-team looks like and if they can help us
<kenvandine> i'm not opposed... however not my area of expertise
<seb128> Laney and flexiondotorg know their way around
<willcooke> I poked design this morning, they're looking in to it
<kenvandine> cool
<seb128> but I don't think we have anyone who like that enough to want to be official maintainer
<kenvandine> i can't imagine fixing it up is a huge thing... just it looks very bad right now
<jbicha> seb128: Ken's response sounds like a strong volunteering to me ;)
<seb128> :-)
<kenvandine> *strong*
<kenvandine> lol
<kenvandine> more than others i guess
<jbicha> well, comparatively :)
<seb128> I guess we should file bugs to start
<seb128> and maybe a few people can mp some fixes
<kenvandine> yeah, i'll start doing that with screenshots
<seb128> not perfect but it's a start
<kenvandine> the corners are bugging me more than anything
<jbicha> +1 to getting Design to handle it since I think they would have more freedom to change things
<seb128> there you go, you have one things you can start with :-)
<seb128> yeah, if design could do that it would be ideal
<kenvandine> it's weird, gnome-terminal doesn't have the problems with the corners up top
<kenvandine> but gedit does
<willcooke> kenvandine, in the tabs?
<willcooke> notebook tabs
<seb128> oh, I almost forgot that willcooke was our theme maintainer
 * willcooke hides
<seb128> :-)
<kenvandine> willcooke, i'll file that one too
<kenvandine> willcooke, what about the tabs?
<willcooke> kenvandine, well, terminal has (or had) it's own notebook implementation, so the theme fixes to make the terminal tabs different colours was specific to Terminal, so that might be why Terminal looks OK and Gedit doesnt
<Laney> It's the window border
<Laney> and terminal has black corners for me
<kenvandine> Laney, not for me... gedit has them though
<Laney> ok
<Laney> don't know what to say to that :)
<kenvandine> willcooke, so what's wrong with the tabs in gedit?  is it that they are hard to tell which is the focused tab?
<willcooke> kenvandine, yeah
<kenvandine> Laney, indeed... however i will say the corners don't look great in terminal... but they are kind of rounded without the dark back square in it
<kenvandine> willcooke, got it
<kenvandine> willcooke, do we want to use a specific tag for bugs related to our transition to gnome?
<willcooke> sounds wise to me
<jbicha> maybe just target stuff to Artful? because I'm guessing there are a lot of bugs we want to fix
<kenvandine> jibel, indeed, but i think it would still be good to add a tag
<kenvandine> it won't be long and we'll have lots of artful bugs
<jibel> jbicha, ^
<kenvandine> i'll use gnome-17.10
<kenvandine> willcooke, seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/light-themes/+bugs?field.tag=gnome-17.10
<willcooke> thanks kenvandine
<Trevinho> ah, I forgot to say... But weekend time here... So have a nice one guys
<Trevinho> It will be national holidays Tue here too...
<Trevinho> So I might get Monday off too. But not sure yet :-).
<Trevinho> Moving few days to seaside though...
<Trevinho> willcooke: ^
<seb128> Trevinho, have a nice w.e!
<Trevinho> seb128: you too!
<seb128> Trevinho, take some pictures for us
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, I've too many to share already :-)
<Laney> nighty night
<willcooke> have a good one Trevinho
<oSoMoN> have a good week-end everyone
<willcooke> Night all, happy weekend
<HappyMan> hey guys, i'm on 16.04 and my pulseaudio can't get high-prio scheduling from rtkit... it says "permission denied". any pointers for where i could start looking?
<sarnold> do you see any DENIED messages in dmesg or auditd logs that might point out insufficient apparmor policy?
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-04-22
<HappyMan> sarnold: not that I can see, no :(
<HappyMan> hm, dbus-monitor is showing me that it's polkit denying access for some reason
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-04-23
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Are you around?
<jbicha> GunnarHj: good evening
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Hi!
<GunnarHj> jbicha: I'm hesitating as regards the docs.
<GunnarHj> jbicha: After I had replied on the docs list, I took a look at gnome-user-docs, and I saw nothing that would help us maintain publishing or customization.
<GunnarHj> jbicha: An alternative to switch to gnome-user-docs would be to copy all the .page files into the ubuntu-docs trunk, make the most obvious adjustments (and keep track of which those adjustments are).
<jbicha> I'm thinking you'd want to still identify as "gnome-help" so that we don't have to patch everything that links to help:gnome-help
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Not sure I understand the significance of what you just wrote. Can you elaborate?
<jbicha> GunnarHj: several apps link to the GNOME help, like nautilus: https://git.gnome.org/browse/nautilus/tree/src/nautilus-application.c#n778
<jbicha> we patched some (but not all of them) to show help:ubuntu-help instead when run in Unity but that won't work any more
<jbicha> if gnome-user-docs and ubuntu-docs are basically the same except that the Ubuntu version is a bit better for Ubuntu users, then I don't think it is useful to have both in Ubuntu
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Ok, that makes sense. We should probably not have both.
<jbicha> the URI is set based on the install location, so to use help:gnome-help, you'd install to /usr/share/help/LANG/gnome-help/ instead of /ubuntu-help/
<jbicha> GunnarHj: have you looked at gnome-getting-started-docs? it's part of gnome-help too
<jbicha> because it has videos, we split it into separate packages so that users only need the versions for their installed languages
<GunnarHj> jbicha: No, I don't recall I've seen gnome-getting-started-docs. Is there a web version of it?
<jbicha> GunnarHj: yes, it's the Getting Started section at the top of https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/stable/
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Ok... Is the .page files for that included in the gnome-user-docs package?
<jbicha> (but the version on the website looks a bit old)
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Or is it a separate package? (Suppose the latter.)
<jbicha> it's a separate package but it embeds itself into gnome-help
<jbicha> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-getting-started-docs/tree/
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Ok, there are quite a few things I'm not enough familiar with yet. My main concerns are 1. Ubuntu customization and 2. Publishing (branding)
<jbicha> I don't think publishing to help.ubuntu.com will be a problem
<jbicha> Ubuntu customization can be handled a few different ways depending on how much you need to do
<GunnarHj> jbicha: It needs to be dealt with somehow, and code for doing it is handy available in the ubuntu-docs package currently. Maybe that code can be copied, though...
<jbicha> sure
<GunnarHj> jbicha: I don't know yet how much customization would be needed. Currently there are a couple of obvious things, but to some extent it depends on some decisions which have not been made yet. Currently we have a pretty well working workflow with the docs for Ubuntu, and I think we should try to preserve it as much as possible to not alienate the community.
<GunnarHj> jbicha: One thing which would complicate any customization is the translations. I have no idea yet how to handle that.
<jbicha> I didn't understand the part in your email talking about translations, but I guess you can talk with seb128 about that later
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Yes, seb128 needs to be involved in that. My idea is to not use pkgstriptranslations when building, even if that's standard for main packages.
<jbicha> oh, I guess it depends on how concerned we are about disk space
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Precisely.
<jbicha> the gnome-getting-started pkg is way too large to not be split into the language packs though (~116MB)
<GunnarHj> jbicha: But splitting it the way it's currently done would not be a problem. I just want to avoid the language packs.
<jbicha> oh, maybe you could make a bunch of binary packages like the getting-started pkg does so it has the advantage of less disk space used but you should be able to update it on its own schedule
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Right, that would be an option.
<a1fa> gnome is so terrible
<a1fa> even after million and one extensions to make it look like unity
<a1fa> kde is.. so gross too
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-04-16
<jibel> duflu, hi
<duflu> Hello hikiko
<duflu> Hello jibel :)
<duflu> Autocomplete fail
<jibel> duflu, I frequently get bug 1748450 when I resume from suspend
<ubot5`> bug 1748450 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu Bionic) "gnome-shell crashed with SIGTRAP in _g_log_abort() from g_log_default_handler() from default_log_handler(message="Connection to xwayland lost") from g_logv() from g_log() from <bug 1505409>" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1748450
<jibel> duflu, is there anything I can do to debug it further?
<duflu> jibel, I put a status update in the master bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1505409
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1505409 in GNOME Shell "gnome-shell crashed with SIGTRAP in x_io_error() from _XIOError() from _XEventsQueued() from XPending() from gdk_check_xpending() ["Connection to xwayland lost"]" [Critical,Confirmed]
<jibel> I saw your comment. is there anything I can do to help?
<duflu> jibel, not sure. My mind is on the gjs major leak and crashes today
<duflu> jibel, maybe... can we ensure crash reports get the _old_ Xorg log from when they happened rather when they were reported? That would help, but might be hard
<duflu> jibel, if the problem is Xwayland bouncing itself on an "X error" then gnome-shell will crash and Xwayland would live on. If we could turn X errors into crashes for Xwayland, and not try to recover from them, then I think that would help
<duflu> Then we'll actually get useful crash reports about the root cause, somewhere in Xwayland
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<Nafallo> morning o/
<didrocks> good morning
<oSoMoN> hey Nafallo, salut didrocks
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN, Nafallo, didrocks
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN, duflu
<willcooke> morning
<didrocks> hey willcooke!
<Laney> URGH I'M SICK
<Laney> HI
<didrocks> :( Laney
<didrocks> stayed at home this week-end?
<Laney> hey didrocks
<Laney> nah, did lots of stuff!
<Laney> including the 5k run ;-)
<duflu> Morning willcooke and Laney
<duflu> willcooke, here's the main (unchanged, mature) leak fix: https://bugs.launchpad.net/gnome-shell/+bug/1672297 But upstream are apparently working on additional fixes, even over the weekend. None of them have landed though.
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1672297 in gjs (Ubuntu Bionic) "gnome-shell uses lots of memory, and grows over time" [Critical,In progress]
<didrocks> Laney: nice ;) but urgh being sick now
<Laney> indeed
<Laney> anyway how are you?
<Laney> and hey duflu
<willcooke> thx duflu
<willcooke> bad luck Laney
<willcooke> I painted the bathroom.  I ache all over now
<didrocks> Laney: I plan to restart doing some exercise today :)
<seb128> duflu, hey, I read your concerns about the gjs update, can you made a summary of the problems?
<duflu> seb128, it's all fine now I understand the bugs. They have fixes coming and no revert is required
<seb128> duflu, great, thx
<duflu> I was just stressed and annoyed I have to squash 200+ bug emails in the morning
<duflu> But they're fully triaged now
<duflu> I *had*
<seb128> urg, that seems a lot
<duflu> Yeah I guess someone wrote news about a final beta :)
<seb128> how did we end up with that number? we don't get quite that many reports on other days
<seb128> haha
<seb128> I'm just through emails, I didn't do launchpad backlog yet
<duflu> seb128, that number is hidden in (bugs_opened - bugs_closed)... I only report the final number each week, which is tiny
<duflu> Also I can't report the opened/closed numbers without trawling my emails
<seb128> well I do go through 'most recently changed bugs in main" daily
<seb128> so I've an idea about how many bugs are "active" on a daily basis
<seb128> that number just seemed high compared to the activity we had previous week
<seb128> btw did you figure out the "can't be retraced" issue?
<seb128> is/was that just dbgsym missing or lagging behind?
<duflu> seb128, yes the hint was in errors.ubuntu.com which told me the name of the missing binary
<duflu> It was just a glib2.0 upgrade
<duflu> Once everyone upgrades they will be retraceable again
<nhaines> Hi everyone!  I was asked to ping someone in here about updating the example-content package for bionic.  A merge request is here: https://code.launchpad.net/~nhaines/example-content/bionic-fcs/+merge/343295
<duflu> seb128, interesting that ubuntu-bug reports don't tell you the binary name, only "??"
<seb128> hey nhaines
<nhaines> seb128: hey  :)
<seb128> duflu, you mean? do you have an example?
<seb128> willcooke, ^ interested in the example-content update, seems like your sort of job? ;)
 * willcooke reads
<willcooke> ack, I can review, but I can't merge
<willcooke> I usually bribe L_aney
<duflu> seb128, for example, bug 1764173, bug 1764059, bug 1764050
<ubot5`> Error: Launchpad bug 1764173 could not be found
<ubot5`> Error: Launchpad bug 1764059 could not be found
<ubot5`> Error: Launchpad bug 1764050 could not be found
<willcooke> ooh, nice one mardy
<duflu> (private)
<didrocks> briber!
<seb128> duflu, ah, apport is just using gdb afaik, so probably at this level. At least we have the procmaps and the addresses can be matched
<seb128> but yeah, procmaps in the first one is
<seb128> 7f012e0bb000-7f012e1ce000 r-xp 00000000 08:01 15335474                   /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libglib-2.0.so.0.5600.0 (deleted)
<duflu> seb128, yeah it's all fine
<seb128> so basically the process was using old glib, glib got updated, lib removed from disk
<seb128> so the dump is pointing to a missing lib
<seb128> right
<duflu> That kind of problem with ?? probably happens all the time. It's only an emergency when it happens with duplicates of a massively-duplicated crash
<seb128> yeah, it's often during unstable cycles when components are moving often
<seb128> ideally apport/retracers would be able to fetch the dbgsym corresponding to the version in use and not to the current one
<willcooke> didrocks, looks like you are in the right team for the FCS merge.  I've checked the content and it's fine, and the licence looks correct, but I can't merge it, can you?
<willcooke> didrocks should change his nick to z_didrocks
<willcooke> :)
 * didrocks would even love zzzzz_didrocks :)
 * didrocks does
<didrocks> willcooke: I guess you want an upload in addition to the merge?
<duflu> seb128, would you be able to help sponsor this patch? https://launchpad.net/bugs/1672297
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1672297 in gjs (Ubuntu Bionic) "gnome-shell uses lots of memory, and grows over time" [Critical,In progress]
<seb128> duflu, I can have a look, do you know what's blocking them to land in upstream master? is there any disagreement on the solution?
<duflu> seb128, no disagreement, just apathy. The fix I picked is dated March
<duflu> and hasn't needed changing since
<seb128> k, we should at least get Trevinho to review/ack that
<seb128> Trevinho, ^ what do you think about including the changes in https://launchpadlibrarian.net/365705963/gjs_1.52.1-1ubuntu1.debdiff ?
<seb128> jbicha, darkxst, ^ would you be interested in having that in debian/sync over?
<duflu> Wrong timezone? :)
<willcooke> didrocks, yes please
<didrocks> willcooke: and done!
<willcooke> thank you didrocks!  (cc nhaines)
<seb128> duflu, backlog for later!
<nhaines> seb128, willcooke, didrocks: thanks!  :D
<didrocks> yw ;)
<seb128> oSoMoN, chromium osk & vaapi, is any of those likely for 18.04 at this point? or rather .1/SRU now?
<seb128> oSoMoN, I'm asking because I'm moving items to a new ".1" column on the trello board
<seb128> andyrock, hey, can you proposed package updates for the gnome-calendar & gtk segfault fixes you made recently?
<oSoMoN> seb128, I need to add latest developments on the card, not happening for 18.04 indeed
<seb128> oSoMoN, I move them to .1 then,t hx
<oSoMoN> cheers
<darkxst> seb128, maybe, but probably not in time for final freeze, they still seem rather experimental and haven't had an upstream review
<darkxst> what are the performance effects of spamming the GC?
<seb128> duflu, ^
<duflu> darkxst, over the past few weeks no performance hit has been noticed
<seb128> duflu, darkxst, we should at least get the cairo issue/revert in and sycned, I tend to agree that the other changes are more SRU material at this point where they have time to be properly tested
<duflu> seb128, the main leak fix is not SRU material, it's much more important than the cairo fix
<duflu> willcooke, seb128, if you guys ^ want to wait for upstream before committing to any leak fixes then your decision. I was doing it because both willcooke and community members asked for it
<duflu> It's certainly a bigger deal than that cairo crash
<seb128> duflu, I don't think wes hould wait for upstream, but I also think such changes can have side effect and a week before release is late to land them
<seb128> it gives little margin to gauge the impact and decide to revert if needed
<duflu> seb128, I would agree but CPU concerns are moot if your system is slowing down and crashing from memory exhaustion. So fixing that is more important than performance concerns (which are presently zero).
<duflu> seb128, also I only chose the one leak fix that is several weeks mature. I ignored the others
<darkxst> seb128, duflu I am fine with cairo patch
<duflu> darkxst, that's lower priority. Please forget it for now
<seb128> duflu, right, it's just going against the rules of lowering the complexicity of changes as we get closed from release
<seb128> duflu, it's lower priority but it's easier to review/approve
<darkxst> duflu I have not seen any major leaks here, under "normal use"
<darkxst> yes gnome-shell is using a but more memory
<duflu> darkxst, seriously. Please read the bug and OMG too.
<seb128> the reports make it clear there are users that see leak issues
<duflu> I can leak 1MB per second
<seb128> it's difficult to estimate how many users are impacted though
<seb128> it depends how you use the shell also
<duflu> seb128, all users
<darkxst> duflu, under normal use? or spamming functions that are knowm to build up in GC?
<duflu> seb128, you can measure the impact within 2 seconds of login
<seb128> by doing specific steps
<duflu> By measuring memory usage, and doing nothing. It's huge
<seb128> I'm not denying that
<seb128> but I never had to close a session due to those leak eithers
<seb128> (I do turn my computer off at night though, so I don't have sessions ongoing for days)
<seb128> I'm just trying to ponderate the impact
<seb128> yes it's an issue
<seb128> yes it bites lot of users
<duflu> seb128, don't shoot the messenger. If you're going to argue about the issue then please do so with the users who are passionate about the bug report.
<darkxst> is gjs not running GJS under memory pressure?
<seb128> but it's not a stopper for every single user
<darkxst> s/GJS/GC/
<duflu> darkxst, GJS isn't EVER running GC for many classes of object. EVER
<seb128> duflu, I'm not arguing against the issue or shooting the messenger, I just think you overstate the proper by making it sounds like it makes GNOME unusable for everyone
<duflu> seb128, please tell the users that. In the bug
<duflu> seb128, please also tell OMGubuntu who continue to write about it
<seb128> shrug
<duflu> I didn't ask to own this bug
<seb128> I'm not denying it's an important issue
<duflu> In the mornings I get abused by users for not having fixed it and in the evening I get questioned for trying to fix it.
<duflu> I'm going to EOD in a sec
<darkxst> duflu, it may not trigger GC for certain objects but they would get cleaned up next time it runs
<duflu> darkxst, no they don't. EVER
<duflu> That's the bug
<duflu> GJS simply doesn't work for GObject even when the JS and GObject is perfect
<duflu> I know. I found it hard to believe but it explains everything, and the fix provides a noticeable impact as soon as you log in
<seb128> duflu, don't take it that personal, I was not questioning your work or position
<duflu> seb128, also willcooke specifically asked me to get it done this week
<seb128> duflu, I'm just saying that by release/freeze rules it's difficult to get a "non trivial" change like that approved that late
<seb128> we need confidence it can't create new problems
<duflu> I know. I was waiting and hoping upstream would land something by now
<darkxst> and the fix is hacky at best, lets spam GC so gobjects get deleted on at a time? anyway I do have time to look through the patches tonight, but will try and do a proper review tomorrow. I would however be hesistant to upload those changes days before final freeze, even too ubuntu.
<seb128> I asked Trevinho to follow up on some of his similar fixes weeks ago that didn't happen either
<seb128> we are stucked in a non optimal situation now
<seb128> it's getting late but at the same time we need to do something :/
<duflu> darkxst, OK. Please direct reviews here: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gjs/merge_requests/114
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 114 in gjs "Queue a GC when a toggle reference goes from >1 to 1" (comments: 15) [Opened]
<seb128> duflu, thanks for the work you put into those fixes and sorry if it sounded like I was questioning what you did, I was not
<seb128> duflu, I hope you are still able to enjoy your evening after that discussion :/
<duflu> seb128, yeah I reduced my VAAPI fix to a one liner. Now uploading
<darkxst> duflu, I am not an upstream maintainer, but have done a lot of work on gjs over the years
<duflu> darkxst, still that's the place to add any thoughts
<duflu> seb128, willcooke specifically requested that leak fix. So I suggest you just decide with him
<seb128> duflu, I'm going to talk to him, but I'm not deciding anything here
<seb128> duflu, I'm not in the release team and it's not in my power to decide if that can go in
<seb128> duflu, I'm just used to work with them and I know it's going to require to be convincing to upload a behaviour change to the gc that late
<seb128> so I'm trying to see what we can do and have the arguments we need ready for that discussion
<seb128> duflu, anyway you did your side of the work so don't worry too much
<willcooke> didrocks, jamiebennett tested the data collection this morning and his monitor which is connected via usb c wasn't picked up.
 * Laney cries at the remaining volume_key failure
<Laney> helps if you spell DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS right
<jbicha> seb128: fyi, I have mutter and gnome-shell 3.28.1 tarballs, waiting for Tre_vinho to gather the extra patches for them he wants later today
<jbicha> good morning
<seb128> jbicha, hey, nice
<k_alam> jbicha: [ftbfs] https://code.launchpad.net/~khurshid-alam/indicator-sound/lp-1737834/+merge/343023
<k_alam> and this: https://code.launchpad.net/~khurshid-alam/indicator-sound/lp-1700680/+merge/343022
<jbicha> k_alam: please subscribe ubuntu-sponsors to bugs with stuff that needs sponsoring
<jbicha> your 1700680 merge has an obvious typo (the package is named -schemas instead of -schema). I haven't investigated but I suspect that fix is wrong anyway
<jbicha> Ubuntu Touch hasn't been supported in Ubuntu for a year so I suggest looking whether that support can be dropped from indicator-sound instead
<jbicha> anyway, you already pinged Tre_vinho about indicator-sound so I'll let him take care of the reviews there
<k_alam> jbicha: Ah right...I will rectify it.....But that package provide com.ubuntu.AccountsService.Sound interface along with various com.ubuntu.touch interfaces. Touch related things can be dropped.
<jbicha> please investigate what com.ubuntu.AcccountsService.Sound does and if it's still needed
<jbicha> k_alam: for bug 1741027 Please add FFe explanation so that the Release Team can review. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<ubot5`> bug 1741027 in unity-control-center (Ubuntu) "[FFE] screen sharing panels abort using an unexistant vino gsettings key" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1741027
<ricotz> hey desktopers
<k_alam> jbicha: alright.
<ricotz> jbicha, hi, I noticed a problem with vte2.91 in ubuntu, the revert-pcre2.patch reverts some unrelated g-i annotation changes and therefore breaking the gir/vapi compared to upstream in unnecessary ways
<jbicha> ricotz: could you talk to Egmont about that? he is part of vte upstream and he did the latest pcre patch update
<ricotz> jbicha, could you point me to an irc channel?
<didrocks> willcooke: was he running on wayland by any chance?
<didrocks> willcooke: remember that we only supports Xorg for getting monitor info
<jbicha> ricotz: I've always just used email or bug reports with Egmont
<ricotz> jbicha, I see
<Laney> Status: successful
<Laney> YEAH
<jbicha> ð
<Laney> tests needed a writable home ð
<Laney> /root existed which is why it worked when I ran as root
<jbicha> ok, we have a few other packages like that
<jbicha> Laney: oh I did that actually but the tests still didn't pass when I tried https://salsa.debian.org/utopia-team/volume-key/commit/42207b3dbc
<jbicha> I guess you had some other fixes too though?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> I fixed the actual bug first
<jbicha> :)
<Laney> you know about debian/clean?
<Wimpress> oSoMoN: Which source repo is the Chromium snapcraft.yaml in?
<jbicha> Laney: yes, for some reason we don't use it as often
<Laney> royal we?
<Laney> I mean, that's a weird sentence construction when talking about one of your own commits
<jbicha> I copied that home thing from other GNOME packages
<jbicha> I guess debian/clean is uhÂ â¦ cleaner
<Laney> you could save an override
<Laney> now I get to fight with pagure
<jbicha> you have upload rights to that salsa repo so feel free to make the clean change there :)
<ricotz> jbicha, https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/ubuntu/staging/+sourcepub/8991295/+listing-archive-extra
<Laney> laney@bionic (masterâ1|â¦)> git push ssh://git@pagure.io/forks/laney/volume_key.git                                                                                                                ~/dev/canonical/random/volume_key
<Laney> git@pagure.io: Permission denied (publickey).
<Laney> this thing :|
<Laney> oh it has a separate SSH key configuration to the thing that I filled in when I made the account
<jbicha> ricotz: ok, yes, please ask Egmont about vte since he was the one that did that part recently
<ricotz> will do
<Laney> jibel: yo, would you be able to test https://launchpad.net/~laney/+archive/ubuntu/ppa/+build/14767038 with your encrypted usb key pls?
<Laney> amazingly I don't seem to have a usb key :/
<Laney> so the patch I made to fix the tests is not tested in actual use
<didrocks> first communitheme interview posted! Just as 5 of themâ¦ like, a week then ;)
<willcooke> didrocks, yay
<didrocks> willcooke: so "known", didn't get the time to inspect what to do yet on the wayland session
<jibel> Laney, what do you want me to test exactly?
<willcooke> didrocks, ack thanks
<jibel> Laney, just install the package and check if I can still access my encrypted drive?
<seb128> jbicha, I don't think we really replied to that the other time, but are we sure a ffe is not needed to remove packages?
<jbicha> seb128: you're the Archive Admin, you tell me :) It is very common for AAs to remove packages at the very last moment
<jbicha> I emailed ubuntu-devel because I expect this particular one to be a bit annoying for some people (I haven't gotten much hate mail yet from Debian though)
<jbicha> gksu was already unseeded at Feature Freeze until a ffe managed to (accidentally) get it back in the Kylin install
<seb128> sysadmins or such might still use it
<seb128> I don't like to remove thing just before release like that
<seb128> you might screw people
<seb128> removals should be done early in the cycle/by ff imho
<seb128> not that I care especially about gksu
<seb128> just I don't like the idea to do changes without letting some time for users to give feedback/adjust to the change
<jbicha> seb128: I don't disagree with you about the ideal of doing removals by say, FF. That just isn't the way AAs do their job
<jbicha> they want until the end of the cycle to get around to processing removal bugs that were filed months sooner
<seb128> well some packages are buggy and need to be removed for valid reasons
<jbicha> *wait*
<seb128> your seem to be more "want to kill cruft"'
<seb128> andyrock, hey, I see you reply to emails ... did you see my IRC ping earlier?
<andyrock> seb128: nope
<andyrock> looking for it
<andyrock> seb128: kk I'll try to do that by the end of today
<andyrock> debdiff right?
<seb128> andyrock, yes, thx
<Laney> jibel: yeah
<seb128> tjaalton, hey, could you have a look at / upstream https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server/+bug/1754693 ?
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1754693 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "Xwayland crashed with SIGABRT in st_renderbuffer_delete()" [High,Confirmed]
<ricotz> is there a schedule for the bionic point releases already? I am curious about the date for 18.04.1
<seb128> ricotz, that's a question for -release more than desktop, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BionicBeaver/ReleaseSchedule doesn't have it so I expect it's not decided yet
<seb128> ricotz, it's probably somewhere in July
<seb128> willcooke, Laney might know?
<Laney> umm
<ricotz> seb128, thanks, judging from the past it might be July 19th
<didrocks> if you have access to some hardware with nvidia, I would be interested into you running xrand on your machine (wich some connected monitors) and print the output
<didrocks> jibel: maybe? ^
<jibel> didrocks, intel or amd here
<didrocks> ok, thanks :)
<Laney> didrocks: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/xQr7tN4DKQ/
<didrocks> Laney: thanks! That's what I expected :)
<seb128> didrocks, is it different from intel machines?
<seb128> jibel, did you look at the keyboard selection bug in ubiquity yet?
<didrocks> seb128: it's not, but for the selected element, there are multiple frequencies support (where I have a duplicated line here), so my regexp needs more work
<seb128> ah ok
<didrocks> I was a little bit restrictive, let me ensure it's better supported + tested
<seb128> is that the usb-c monitor not listed issue?
<didrocks> yeah
<seb128> great
<seb128> thx
<didrocks> Laney: do you have any tool to select the freq? like, can you get 1920x1080@50hz?
<Laney> uh
<didrocks> (for DVI-I)
<Laney> don't know
<Laney> I just use g-c-c
<Laney> some nvidia tool exists doesn't it?
<didrocks> I think the syntax would be: 1920x1080     60.00  59.94    50.00*+    60.05    60.00    50.04
<didrocks> but unsure
<didrocks> yeah, nvidia-config or such?
<didrocks> or nvidia-settings
<Laney> dunno
<Laney> I'm not on that computer, it is remote to me
<Laney> so can't check
<Laney> ts_eliot could probably help you
<didrocks> hum, good idea, tseliot: do you know in case you have multiple freqs available for a given resolution what is the xrandr syntax if you don't select the first one?
<didrocks> like instead of    1920x1080     60.00*+  59.94    50.00    60.05    60.00    50.04
<didrocks> what is the output if I select 1920x1080@50.00
<didrocks> I don't see anything in g-c-c to select the freqâ¦
<Laney> I don't think I've ever done that
 * didrocks tried some naÃ¯ve xrandr command and needed to reset it via g-c-c :p
<didrocks> me neither ;)
<didrocks> I would like to avoid betting on a syntax
<tseliot> didrocks: the rate followed by "+" is the preferred one. I think that's the one that is applied if you don't specify it
<didrocks> ah, I get it!
<didrocks> was able to reproduce it :)
<didrocks> so, you can have:
<didrocks>    1366x768      60.02 +
<didrocks> but selected is:
<didrocks>    1280x720      60.00    59.99    59.86*   59.74
 * didrocks reverts, it's too blurry to cope with it :)
<didrocks> I have what I needed, thanks tseliot
<Laney> this sounds unfun
<Laney> no good API to get this stuff?
<didrocks> Laney: note that I found
<didrocks> not*
<tseliot> didrocks: np
<Laney> :(
<Laney> what does g-c-c do?
<didrocks> Laney: oh, btw, g-c-c enable you to select the rate if you onlly have one monitor
<didrocks> just noticed that
<didrocks> well, only if you manually set a refresh rate which isn't the preferred one
<oSoMoN> Wimpress, sorry I was out for a while, dunno if your question was answered, in case it wasn't: https://code.launchpad.net/~chromium-team/chromium-browser/+git/snappy-packaging
<Wimpress> oSoMoN: Thanks.
<Wimpress> In a meeting but I have some questions for you. I'll be in touch tomorrow.
<oSoMoN> sure
<Trevinho> Morning
<Laney> this cold sucks
 * Laney is leaking everywhere
<Laney> hey Trevinho!
<Laney> how's it going?
<Trevinho> Hi Laney
<didrocks> poor Laney, get some hot drink!
<tjaalton> seb128: ok, moved it to mesa for now
<didrocks> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> Good... You?
<Laney> good
<Trevinho> Didrocks hey
<Laney> are you on your phone or something?
 * Laney doesn't believe you are typing these words manually :P
<seb128> tjaalton, thx
<Trevinho> Laney: switching between the two
<xclaesse> is it known that ssh-agent is broken in 18.04 ?
<xclaesse> anyone knows how to fix it ?
<Laney> works fine here, so it's not broken
<Laney> jibel: did you get to try volume-key?
<Laney> If we can upload this then hopefully the MIR will go through
<Trevinho> Laney: can you please publish https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3223 ?
<Laney> Trevinho: looks like it needs a bit of a review, so can't do right now
<Trevinho> Laney: mh, ok seb128 already review part of the code so could also do it if has time? :)
<didrocks> jdstrand: hey, do you have any idea when you will be able to review my apparmor fix for evince?
<jbicha> Trevinho: sorry to ping again, but you're going to be giving me patches to apply against mutter & gnome-shell 3.28.1, right?
<Trevinho> jbicha: yeah, I'll do it later today
<Trevinho> I'll prepare PR for salsa and one for ~ubuntu-team
<jbicha> we don't use ubuntu-team so umâ¦
<Trevinho> didrocks: can you reabase https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/70 again (Or add the flag to allow project devs to edit the branch)?
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 70 in gnome-shell "ui: Theme lookup should respect XDG_DATA_DIRS" (comments: 10) [Opened]
 * Trevinho loves his bot
<didrocks> Trevinho: I don't think you can allow editafter the fact (and I think I did)
<didrocks> Trevinho: rebased
<Trevinho> ah ok
<Trevinho> thakns
<Trevinho> thanks*
<didrocks> thanks Trevinho :)
<Trevinho> :)
<jibel> willcooke, FYI the job which promotes the images has been fixed and 20180916 is now in current
<jibel> 20180416 :)
<willcooke> thanks jibel
<Laney> We can sync volume-key once LP picks it up and j_ibel or someone gives the thumbs up that I didn't break it
 * Laney is uploading to Debian
<Laney> I forgot to actually say "run the tests fatally" in the changelog
<Laney> #oops
<sarnold> oh swet
<sarnold> sweet, too. :) thanks Laney
<Laney> sarnold: sweat would be OK too
<Laney> :-)
<sarnold> :D
<Laney> you had to set --pinentry-mode=loopback basically
<Trevinho> jbicha: mhmh
<Trevinho> marco@tricky:/data/GNOME/mutter (debian/master):â $ gbp pq export
<Trevinho> gbp:info: Generating patches from git (debian/master..patch-queue/debian/master)
<Trevinho> gbp:error: patch-queue/debian/master not a valid tree-ish
<Trevinho> nm I wanted to import and actually picked the wrong bash completion
<oSoMoN> good night everyone
<seb128> LocutusOfBorg, could you commit your gtk 3ubuntu1 update to the vcs?
<seb128> 'night desktopers
<jbicha> ximion: hi, I guess we want https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/gnome-software/commit/e52d2fa5 in bionic and it should be harmless?
<jbicha> and I'm assuming the other icon sizes won't work until appstream.ubuntu.com gets a newer asgen?
<ximion> yes and yes
<ximion> the 128x128px version should work though
<ximion> the change is completely harmless
<ximion> for the asgen update we are battling a very weird crash when the garbage collector marks a memory region, that appears to only happen on Ubuntu at the moment
<ximion> jbicha: ^
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-04-17
<Trevinho> jbicha: here's https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/mutter/merge_requests/1
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 1 in mutter "debian/patches: import upstream (proposed) fixes" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<Trevinho> jbicha: I've updated the patch, also I've removed the patch numbers (thanks for the empty-line trick)
<jbicha> I didn't mind the patch numbers. There's a gbp.conf option to not use patch numbers if we wanted to do that for the whole Debian GNOME team
<Trevinho> jbicha: thanks
<Trevinho> juliank: ah, what's the item to set?
<jbicha> hmm, your changelog feels redundant
<jbicha> theme-make-more-awesome.patch:
<jbicha> - theme: make more awesome
<jbicha> maybe next time we'll do better but it will work this time
<duflu> Trevinho, you might find this fun to test. Although it will be a while before I finish it (incomplete hybrid support). https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/73
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 73 in mutter "WIP: backends/native: CRTCs now hold references to front buffers" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<Trevinho> duflu: pretty nice
<duflu> Trevinho, you still in Mexico?
<Trevinho> jbicha: mh I agree... Maybe I could have mentioned the bug title but rewording everything was annoying
<Trevinho> duflu: guess  https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/oJ7YOvsj/irccloudcapture1865929949.jpg
<duflu> You might be in a Mexican restaurant
<Trevinho> jbicha: anyway before the dinner break I was cleaning a g-s patch, then I'll finish the g-s branch too
<Trevinho> Trevinho: right... Well Mexican in CDMX
<Trevinho> duflu: ^
 * Trevinho almost never eats food that is not local... 
<duflu> Heh. I was wondering what Ciudad meant since Odesza's last album :)
<Trevinho> That's why I travel ð
<Trevinho> Otherwise I couldn't try other cultures specialities
 * duflu gives Trevinho a soundtrack: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUn64eKKQg0
 * Trevinho listens 
<Trevinho> duflu: ah, about the gjs patch, I've given it a look, but I've not debugged enough to be relevant to be fair...
<Trevinho> But later if you want we can discuss more
<duflu> Trevinho, I was about to upload just the regression fix
<duflu> -upload +attach
<duflu> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gjs/+bug/1763878
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1763878 in gjs (Ubuntu) "[regression] Many programs crashing at exit with assert failure: ../../../../src/cairo-hash.c:217: _cairo_hash_table_destroy: Assertion `hash_table->live_entries == 0' failed. Called from cairo_debug_reset_static_data()" [High,In progress]
<Trevinho> duflu: what's the thing? you're not too confident with the memleak patch?
<duflu> Trevinho, I am confident in the memleak patch. But a couple of our people argued (yesterday in this channel) against fixing it because they fear some kind of worse regression. I would like to fix the leak and doubt any regression could be as bad
<Trevinho> duflu: yeah I read a bit of that discussion
<duflu> I did the second patch to appease them. I don't agree with it, but am getting on with my day
<Trevinho> to me it could not lead to regressions like that to be fair
<duflu> Any regression is possible. But the likelihood of one as bad or worse is low. I think they gauged the severity of the leak being fixed incorrectly
<jibel> Laney, I tried volume-key and it works
<duflu> Morning jibel
<duflu> and morning seb128
<jibel> good morning duflu
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Hi didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Hey oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<didrocks> hey oSoMoN
<Trevinho> hey europe
<jibel> morning Trevinho and all
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, jibel
<oSoMoN> hey Trevinho, are you back on the old continent?
<Trevinho> No, no... :)
<didrocks> hey jibel, Trevinho
<Trevinho> hi didrocks
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: I was greeting europe, not that I'm in EU :-D
<oSoMoN> heh
<oSoMoN> still enjoying the mexican sun then?
<oSoMoN> although that's moonlight at that time of the day I guess
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: well yeah... although I'm in CDMX so tempereature are changing a lot.... like 28Â° max and 13Â° min
<Trevinho> but it's really a beatiful place where to stay, unexpected.
<seb128> hey desktopers duflu didrocks Trevinho oSoMoN jibel, how afre you today?
<willcooke> morning
<Trevinho> all good :), my today is still your yesterday though :-D
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<willcooke> seb128, you want me to send the meeting reminder? I've got the page open
<duflu> seb128, going well. Almost 2 days in a row :)
<didrocks> hey hey seb128
<didrocks> and willcooke
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<oSoMoN> hey willcooke
<seb128> hey willcooke
<seb128> willcooke, as you want, I can also do it
<seb128> duflu, great! what did you get resolved today? ;)
<duflu> seb128, I /didn't/ get 200+ emails. So I /did/ get back to trying to fix vaapi
<seb128> ah, nice
<seb128> we should lock launchpad down for new reports one day a week :p
<oSoMoN> great idea :)
<oSoMoN> the bugfree day
<duflu> seb128, I call it night time and weekends. Just log off :)
<seb128> but then next work day you spend a full morning dealing with that backlog
<duflu> Only as much as you're willing to subscribe to bug mail
<seb128> right, I don't
<seb128> but I go through the list of "bugs in main most recently changed" almost daily
<seb128> duflu, I'm nagging gst-vaapi upstream for review of your change btw
<duflu> seb128, no hurry. It doesn't provide the visible benefit I hoped for. It does only close a bug on paper
<seb128> duflu, basically "vaSyncSurface is just a kernel ioctl (intel's driver)..  I wonder if it is a kernel bug, rather than gstvaapi one" is their comment
<duflu> In fact, I've now hacked up a Mesa build that eliminates all the blocking there too, and still the video stutters
<Laney> moin
<oSoMoN> hey laney
<duflu> Hey Laney
<Laney> hey oSoMoN duflu
<Laney> what's crackin
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> not that great, was up in the night with this cold /o\
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> take it easy/get some rest today
<seb128> LocutusOfBorg, thanks for the gtk vcs update!
<Laney> ya
<Laney> what about you?
<LocutusOfBorg> sorry for not doing it before!
<seb128> np!
<Laney> oops I forgot to vote in the 1 candidate DPL election
<seb128> Laney, cold is better, weather is sunny and spring like, I managed to sleep from 1am to 7am without interruption ... things are looking good so far :)
<Laney> yeah!
<seb128> didrocks, seems like bug #1759540 has been approved so we should be able to seed gnome-initial-setup now?
<ubot5`> bug 1759540 in ubuntu-report (Ubuntu) "[MIR] ubuntu-report: send telemetry data to ubuntu server" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1759540
<seb128> willcooke, ^
<willcooke> woot
<didrocks> seb128: was it? Michael isn't part of the mir-team
<didrocks> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mir/+members#active
<didrocks> I think the initial MIR reviewer should give his ack (doko)
<Trevinho> didrocks: any clue why this https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/2/ doesn't show the diff or commits?
<seb128> ah ok, I wonder why doko bounced to him for review
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 2 in gnome-shell "Volume slider overdrive" (comments: 12) [Opened]
<didrocks> seb128: only on the Golang side I think
<didrocks> Trevinho: waow, no idea why it did it after the rebase, maybe ask Carlos?
<Trevinho> didrocks: try to rebase and force push once you've time
<seb128> doko, can you look again at that MIR, it's blocking a late feature that needs to land from landing/getting tested (first login wizard to enable livepatch and system metrics)
<didrocks> Trevinho: will try
<seb128> Trevinho, jbicha, what's the status of the gnome-shell patches & update ?
<Trevinho> seb128: mutter should be uploaded (not sure, but merged to salsa)
<Trevinho> seb128: g-s, I'm finishing the branch now
<seb128> Trevinho, thx, it's not but I guess jbicha might wait to sync from Debian where he uploaded
<Nafallo> morning o/
<oSoMoN> hey Nafallo
<seb128> hey Nafallo, how are you?
<seb128> jibel, salut, on that xwayland segfault on greeter use, do you get any coredump/report in /var/crash? did you try to attach gdb to the Xwayland process from a vt (or ssh from another machine if the keybinding get stucked when the shell stops in gdb)?
<Nafallo> seb128: been better to be honest ;-)
<Nafallo> seb128: had a crash again, so screwed up my knee properly.
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> crash? with the bike?
<jibel> seb128, I don't get any wayland crash, always gnome-shell
<Nafallo> electrical unicycle. a defect one that doesn't like when you try and slow down.
<Nafallo> if you go to fast, it cuts out instead of bring down the speed slowly.
<Nafallo> I won't use that one again.
<seb128> jibel, but that bug is gnome-shell having issues because xwayland is crashing. Can you try to attach gdb to the Xwayland process from a vt (sudo gdb -p `pidof Xwayland` then 'c' to unblock it) and trigger the bug and see what gdb tells you?
<seb128> jibel, that might have to be done on the greeter owned Xwayland
<seb128> Nafallo, :-(
<seb128> technology fail
<jibel> seb128, I'll try that but later today. It's on my main machine that I can easily reproduce
<jibel> seb128, did you finally understand the problem with orca?
<seb128> jibel, no, I still need to debug more, even if I start it manually it doesn't make any sound :/
<seb128> started with debug mode it doesn't print any debug output
<seb128> it seems to "hang"
<GunnarHj> Hi seb128, can you possibly shed some light on bug #1764161. What am I missing?
<ubot5`> bug 1764161 in Ubuntu Translations "Translation template for ibus is missing some strings" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1764161
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey, it's on my list yes, sorry I'm just too busy to respond to everything within the hour :/
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, thanks.
<seb128> jibel, did you get anywhere with ubiquity/keyboard. or did cyphermox said he would have a look?
<seb128> GunnarHj, np
<seb128> GunnarHj, from your comment I understand that you handled the immediate issue from updating the template on launchpad so there is no hurry, right?
<GunnarHj> seb128: True.
<seb128> good
<jibel> seb128, I understand the cause of the issue but not how to make ubiquity set the right layout. in 17.10 console-setup introduced keyboard-configuration/xkb-keymap which is set to 'us' and ubiquity uses this value to initialize the UI even if locale and k-c/layout are set to a non-us layout
<jibel> cyphermox, ^ your help is welcome
<seb128> jibel, can you write that in the bug report?
<jibel> seb128, sure
<seb128> jibel, 'ci
<Trevinho> seb128: https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/gnome-shell/bionic-patches-picks/+merge/343423
<seb128> Trevinho, great, thx!
<seb128> jbicha, ^
<seb128> night Trevinho
<Trevinho> thanks... leaving now
<seb128> :)
<jdstrand> didrocks: re evince> I was going to do an upload, but it might not make it for release (depends on what the release team says)
<didrocks> jdstrand: let's hope so, it's ready for a week and it gives a bad first impression for people trying out communitheme
<xclaesse> Do we know why ssh-agent is broken in 18.04 ?
<oSoMoN> xclaesse, it works here, do you have a bug report with details?
<xclaesse> didn't report yet, but happens on both laptops I upgraded
<xclaesse> I'll report then
 * xclaesse never knows how to report stuff with launchpad :(
<oSoMoN> xclaesse, run "ubuntu-bug openssh-client"
<seb128> or gnome-keyring
<seb128> ok, already meeting time!
<jbicha> o/
<kenvandine> o/
<seb128> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Apr 17 13:31:04 2018 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic:
<oSoMoN> o/
<seb128> Roll call: andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu (out), jbicha, jamesh (out), jibel/heber, kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<didrocks> hey
<andyrock> o/
<kenvandine> \o
<jibel> o/
<seb128> k, let's get started
<seb128> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: andyrock
<seb128> andyrock, hey
<andyrock> hey
<andyrock> Completed:
<andyrock> - LP: #1759468
<andyrock> - LP: #1763446
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1759468 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "gnome-control-center (11) gtk_style_context_clear_property_cache â gtk_css_widget_node_update_style â gtk_css_node_ensure_style â gtk_css_node_ensure_style â gtk_css_node_validate_internal" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1759468
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1763446 in software-properties (Ubuntu) "LIvepatch says I need to sign in after completing Ubuntu Welcome" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1763446
<andyrock> On-review:
<andyrock> - Updated fix for LP: #1761841 (need some help to sponsor it)
<andyrock> - Fixed LP: #1757058 (merged upstream, waiting for the debdiff to be sponsored)
<andyrock> - Updated protobuf debdiff for LP: #1735160
<andyrock> - Proposed fix for LP: #1764474
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1761841 in update-notifier (Ubuntu) "[UIFe] Notification for livepatch are not shown." [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1761841
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1757058 in gnome-calendar (Ubuntu) "gnome-calendar (11) gtk_image_reset â gtk_image_clear â update_weather â g_closure_invoke â signal_emit_unlocked_R" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1757058
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1735160 in py-macaroon-bakery (Ubuntu Artful) "[SRU] Please backport python3-macaroonbakery 0.0.6-1 [universe] from bionic" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1735160
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1764474 in software-properties (Ubuntu) "software-properties-gtk should not store the goa account-id used for livepatch in the keyring." [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1764474
<andyrock> WIP:
<andyrock> - LP: #1764723
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1764723 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu) "gnome-initial-setup says that Livepatch is "all set" even if enabling is still in progress." [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1764723
<andyrock> No rls bug for me
<andyrock> EOW
<seb128> thx andyrock
<seb128> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: dgadomski
<dgadomski> hey
<seb128> dgadomski, hey
<dgadomski> sadly, nothing desktop-related to share this week
<dgadomski> eof
<seb128> no problem, thx dgadomski
<seb128> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, hey
<didrocks> Telemetry:
<didrocks>  * MIR review for gnome-initial-setup https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-initial-setup/+bug/1761389
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1761389 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu) "[MIR] gnome-initial-setup" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<didrocks>  * Some changes to sysmetrics packaging after MIR review: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-report/1.0.6
<didrocks> GNOME Shell:
<didrocks>  * Updated and fixed https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/70. Finally merged!
<didrocks> Communitheme:
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 70 in gnome-shell "ui: Theme lookup should respect XDG_DATA_DIRS" (comments: 11) [Merged]
<didrocks>  * Gtk2 snap support fix https://github.com/ubuntu/communitheme-snap-helpers/pull/3.
<ubot5-ng> ubuntu bug (Pull request) 3 in communitheme-snap-helpers "Ensure GTK2 application are themed" (comments: 3) [Closed]
<didrocks>  * Evince (and potentially other apparmor protected apps) fix: https://salsa.debian.org/apparmor-team/apparmor/merge_requests/5
<didrocks>  * Snap support discussion on https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/snap-using-themes-in-other-snaps/4946. This followed up in integrating communitheme to gtk-common-themes: https://github.com/snapcrafters/gtk-common-themes/pull/3, and adding it to communitheme CI (after fighting some snapcraft bugs): https://github.com/ubuntu/communitheme-snap-helpers/commit/c64a9f6d1ef3279de10dc102e9a9fddbf408363d. Basically
<ubot5-ng> AppArmor bug (Merge request) 5 in apparmor "Support communitheme snap" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<didrocks> any PR or release on communitheme will also created a corresponding gtk-common-themes snap in the same snap branch. Message on PR updated. Generated separated credentials for gtk-common-theme (separation of concerns) and updated all communitheme projects with those.
<ubot5-ng> snapcrafters bug (Pull request) 3 in gtk-common-themes "Add communitheme" (comments: 4) [Closed]
<didrocks>  * Fix snap CI to support out of organization branch: https://github.com/ubuntu/communitheme-snap-helpers/pull/5
<ubot5-ng> ubuntu bug (Pull request) 5 in communitheme-snap-helpers "Don't fail CI when source repo isn't under ubuntu/ namespace" (comments: 1) [Closed]
<didrocks>  * Preparing some interviews with core communitheme team (currently under publication)
<didrocks>  * Follow up with community on the hub/twitter after blog post about snap support
<didrocks> no rls bug for me.
<didrocks> .
<seb128> thx didrocks
<seb128> #topic duflu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: duflu
<seb128> * Totem performance, back under investigation (https://trello.com/c/7zeMdP0S)
<seb128>   - Tracked down a new gstreamer-vaapi performance bug, unique to X sessions (https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=795195)
<seb128>     . Fixed; patch awaiting review. Although fixing that bug wasn't enough to solve the stuttering. It's likely a prerequisite to fix it still.
<seb128>   - Also tracked down a strange CPU% hardware regression (https://github.com/intel/intel-vaapi-driver/
<ubot5`> Gnome bug 795195 in gstreamer-vaapi "gst_vaapi_texture_glx_put_surface_unlocked is blocked 75-80% of the time" [Normal,New]
<ubot5-ng> bugzilla.gnome.org bug 795195 in gstreamer-vaapi "gst_vaapi_texture_glx_put_surface_unlocked is blocked 75-80% of the time" [Normal, New] - Assigned to gstreamer-bugs
<seb128> issues/379)
<ubot5`> bug 795195 in Launchpad itself "Tooltip for "Unmute bug mail" says "Mute this bug..."" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/795195
<seb128> * GJS:
<seb128>   - A large GJS crash regression occurred this week (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gjs/+bug/1763878) - HELP: Needs sponsorship.
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1763878 in gjs (Ubuntu) "[regression] Many programs crashing at exit with assert failure: ../../../../src/cairo-hash.c:217: _cairo_hash_table_destroy: Assertion `hash_table->live_entries == 0' failed. Called from cairo_debug_reset_static_data()" [High,In progress]
<seb128>   - Gnome Shell's big leak also has a patch awaiting sponsorship (https://launchpad.net/bugs/1672297)
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1672297 in gjs (Ubuntu Bionic) "gnome-shell uses lots of memory, and grows over time" [Critical,In progress]
<seb128> * Gnome Shell performance:
<seb128>   - My big, never before seen branch: Refreshed and published it this week (https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/73). It got put on hold back in February because it's Wayland-specific and not finished yet (only missing/untested hybrid support). But it is exciting because it shows Wayland performance finally meeting and overtaking Xorg.
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 73 in mutter "WIP: backends/native: CRTCs now hold references to front buffers" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<seb128> * Crashes not getting reported:
<seb128>   - Needs some discussion: https://launchpad.net/bugs/994921
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 994921 in apport (Ubuntu Quantal) "'ubuntu-bug /var/crash/app.crash' (and even more so, 'apport-cli -c /var/crash/app.crash') should still allow manual bug filing in stable releases" [Medium,Won't fix]
<seb128> * Libinput:
<seb128>   - Revisited Apple Magic Trackpad support at the request of upstream (https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=103572)
<ubot5`> Freedesktop bug 103572 in libinput "Libinput: 1.9+: Apple Magic Trackpad stutters, is unresponsive" [Normal,Needinfo]
<seb128> * Daily bug management across gnome-shell, mutter, gdm3, ubuntu-themes, bluez, pulseaudio, dkms, wayland, totem, mpv, libinput.
<ubot5-ng> bugs.freedesktop.org bug 103572 in libinput "Libinput: 1.9+: Apple Magic Trackpad stutters, is unresponsive" [Normal, Needinfo] - Assigned to wayland-bugs
<ubot5`> bug 82077 in GNOME media utilities "duplicate for #103572 [apport] gnome-volume-control crashed with SIGSEGV in g_type_class_meta_marshal() " [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/82077
<seb128>   - Looking good again
<seb128> (should be enough to digest it ;)
<seb128> #topic jbicha
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: jbicha
<seb128> jbicha, hey
<jbicha> â¢ Lots of GNOME 3.28.1 uploads, gtk 3.22.30, interesting gnome-control-center cherry-pick
<xclaesse> oSoMoN_: reported here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openssh/+bug/1764743
<jbicha> â¢ Added (or modified) AppStream metadata for several apps to ensure ubuntu-desktop can't be accidentally removed by gnome-software while running the Ubuntu session
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1764743 in openssh (Ubuntu) "ssh asks for passphrase" [Undecided,New]
<jbicha> â¢ Adjusted the Amazon .desktop so that our asgen was happy enough to show it in gnome-software's Installed list
<jbicha> â¢ Dropped unused Python2 libraries for command-not-found and software-properties
<jbicha> â¢ Made software-properties run its build time tests
<jbicha> â¢ Filed bug 1762889 and did follow-up analysis
<ubot5`> bug 1762889 in pkgbinarymangler (Ubuntu) "dh_translations doesn't strip .desktop files when more than 1 pot target with meson" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1762889
<jbicha> â¢ Prepared bug 1740618 and emailed ubuntu-devel. Only blocker now is Kylin.
<ubot5`> bug 1740618 in umit (Ubuntu) "Remove gksu from Ubuntu" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1740618
<jbicha> â¢ Will sync mutter 3.28.1 with proposed-upstream patches later today. Reviewing gnome-shell 3.28.1 now. Thanks Trevinho for preparing the patches for bionic.
<jbicha> â¢ My only rls bug is bug 1761554. I talked to GNOME, didn't get much response except that I managed to help fix the bug in Fedora 28 ð upstream suggests a problem in ibus or im-config but I don't know
<ubot5`> bug 1761554 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu Bionic) "[bionic] Extended characters in GNOME screen keyboard don't get entered" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1761554
<jbicha> ð
<seb128> jbicha, I can try having a look/testing that OSK/IM bug, to see if I can figure out something
<seb128> thanks jbicha
<seb128> #topic jibel/heber
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: jibel/heber
<seb128> jibel, heber, hey
<jibel> - Continued triaging of upgrade and installer bugs
<jibel> - Fixed promotion of images from pending to current + testing infrastructure
<jibel> - maintenance
<jibel> - Milestone bugs:
<jibel> - Bug 1741690: Seb and Laney have been working on this still but debugging is
<ubot5`> bug 1741690 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Bionic) "You can't enable the Orca screen reader until after you click "Try Ubuntu" on Ubuntu bionic" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1741690
<jibel> - still ongoing.
<jibel> - Bug 1758647: Slow progress, need help from Foundations
<ubot5`> bug 1758647 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Bionic) "ubiquity doesn't preselect the right default keyboard layout" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1758647
<jibel> - Update and fix ubuntu system tests jobs
<jibel> - Review and fix ubiquity jobs
<jibel> eof
<seb128> I'm still poking at the screenreader one
<seb128> and I emailed foundations about the keyboard/console-setup issue
<seb128> thx jibel!
<seb128> #topic kenvandine
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: kenvandine
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<kenvandine> * Got some feedback on the desktop helpers PR to LD_PRELOAD bindtextdomain to get fully translated gtk dialogs, which I need to take care of.  https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/pull/106
<kenvandine> * XDG User Dirs fix for transltated user dirs has been merged https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/pull/103
<kenvandine> * Published gtk-common-themes to the edge channel in the snap store.  didrocks has added communitheme to it and setup automated builds when communitheme changes.
<kenvandine> * Working on generating desktop-preinstalled images
<ubot5-ng> ubuntu bug (Pull request) 106 in snapcraft-desktop-helpers "LD_PRELOAD bindtextdomain to load translations from multiple paths" (comments: 0) [Open]
<kenvandine> * No assigned rls bugs
<ubot5-ng> ubuntu bug (Pull request) 103 in snapcraft-desktop-helpers "If the user-dirs.* exists in the $REALHOME, link them into the snap's XDG_CONFIG_HOME." (comments: 12) [Closed]
<kenvandine> â¾
<seb128> thx kenvandine
<seb128> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: Laney
<seb128> Laney, hey
<Laney> hi
<Laney> â¢ release: reviewing FFes, reviewing uploads in the queue, lots
<Laney> â¢ fixed volume-key (that was my rls bug) after a bit of a struggle, now waiting in queue and needs the MIR approving / libblockdev-crypto2 adding to udisks / promoting
<Laney> â¢ had a bit of a look at ubiquity re the orca problem, shared some thoughts
<Laney> â¢ tried to fix some FTBFS from the rebuild test
<Laney> â¢ tried to update appstream-generator to the new stuff which is supposed to find more packages. needed to backport a whole stack of stuff to xenial for that... and then it crashes! worked with ximion a bit on that a bit but it's still broken
<Laney> â¢ new glib release
<Laney> â¢ some reviews / discussions on Gunnar's dh_translations patch
<Laney> ð·
<seb128> thanks Laney
<seb128> #topic oSoMoN
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: oSoMoN
<seb128> oSoMoN, hey
<oSoMoN> hi
<oSoMoN> â¢ firefox
<oSoMoN>     â tested https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1454131, cannot reproduce
<ubot5`> Mozilla bug 1454131 in Untriaged "[snap] No icon in Dock or Activities" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<ubot5-ng> bugzilla.mozilla.org bug 1454131 in Untriaged "[snap] No icon in Dock or Activities" [Normal, Unconfirmed] - Assigned to nobody
<ubot5`> Error: Launchpad bug 1454131 could not be found
<oSoMoN> â¢ chromium
<oSoMoN>   â filed https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=831495, it is the most reported crash in chromium on Ubuntu
<oSoMoN>   â filed and fixed bug #1763829, but there is a store issue that's preventing publication of the packages, Jamie just identified it and a fix is awaiting deployment
<ubot5`> bug 1763829 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "[snap] chromium won't start after logging in to google account" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1763829
<oSoMoN>   â testing a fix for bug #1763662 (an upstream change caused the regression and was reverted afterwards, but the 65 and 66 branches still have the faulty code and require explicitly passing a build flag)
<ubot5`> bug 1763662 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "H264 missing from WebRTC (regression)" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1763662
<oSoMoN> â¢ libreoffice
<oSoMoN>   â libreoffice 6.0.3 was published to bionic
<oSoMoN> â¢ snaps
<oSoMoN>   â successfully tested ibus 1.5.11-1ubuntu2.1 in xenial-proposed (bug #1761585), subsequently promoted to xenial-updates, snaps will need to be rebuilt against it for the harmless denial to go away
<ubot5`> bug 1761585 in ibus (Ubuntu) "ibus_bus_init does an unconditional call to chmod on $HOME/.config/ibus/bus" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1761585
<oSoMoN>   â tested and reviewed again https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/pull/103
<ubot5-ng> ubuntu bug (Pull request) 103 in snapcraft-desktop-helpers "If the user-dirs.* exists in the $REALHOME, link them into the snap's XDG_CONFIG_HOME." (comments: 12) [Closed]
<oSoMoN>   â tested and reviewed https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/pull/106
<ubot5-ng> ubuntu bug (Pull request) 106 in snapcraft-desktop-helpers "LD_PRELOAD bindtextdomain to load translations from multiple paths" (comments: 0) [Open]
<oSoMoN>   â continued looking into IMEs in snaps
<oSoMoN>     â£ successfully tested desktop-gtk2 snap (hexchat)
<oSoMoN>     â£ submitted https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/pull/108 and tested with desktop-gtk2 (hexchat), desktop-gtk3 (chromium), desktop-qt5 (musescore)
<oSoMoN>   â created https://trello.com/c/iOMMKdy7/322-snap-that-provides-a-content-interface-for-chromium-ffmpeg-extras to backlog, to be worked on post 18.04
<oSoMoN>   â fixed my 0ad/trunk snap
<ubot5-ng> ubuntu bug (Pull request) 108 in snapcraft-desktop-helpers "Move ibus socket path handling to the common launcher exports, so that Qt apps also pick it up." (comments: 2) [Closed]
<oSoMoN> â¢ other: preparing talk for UbuCon Europe, next week in GijÃ³n (Spain)
<oSoMoN> ð
<seb128> enjoy UbuCon oSoMoN! (and good luck for the talk there!)
<oSoMoN> thanks
<seb128> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> â¢ got yet-another-cold and had some not-so-productive work days due to it :/
<seb128> â¢ looked at some outdated translations template issues in launchpad
<seb128> â¢ spent more time debugging orca/screen reading not working in ubiquity-dm, didn't get it to work properly yet
<seb128> â¢ code reviews (u-s-d monitors.xml migration from Trevinh_o, update-notifier jobs-fix from andyroc_k, dh_translations changes from Lane_y/Gunna_r)
<seb128> â¢ sponsoring (gtk+ segfault fix from andyroc_k)
<seb128> â¢ daily incoming-bugs triaging & trello reviews/updates
<seb128> â¢ bionic milestoned bugs
<seb128> â bug #1735929, the updated versions/fixes are in bionic now
<ubot5`> bug 1735929 in dconf (Ubuntu Bionic) "security problems with incorrect permissions for ubuntu 17.10" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1735929
<seb128> â bug #1726143, no change this week, we don't try to install the invalid package anymore and we are not likely to do extra work on that at this point, maybe for SRU
<ubot5`> bug 1726143 in nautilus-share (Ubuntu Bionic) "Automatic installation of samba fails with "could not find package libpam-smbpass"" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1726143
<seb128> </week>
<seb128> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Released 1.20.3, to get bug fixes available for Debian Unstable.
<tkamppeter> - dhelp, doc-rfc: Replaced use of pstotext which is unmaintained for years and broke with current Ghostscript by ps2txt which is part of Ghostscript. pstotext can now get removed from the distro. Reported this also to Debian. At least dhelp got fixed there now. The problem got discovered because the upload of Poppler triggers the autopkgtest of doc-rfc which used pstotext and this failed.
<tkamppeter> - cups-browsed: Working on a way to recover queues creted by cups-browsed when they get removed or overwritten by external processes.
<tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2018: Received the slots from Google for the Linux Foundation (13 from the 19 asked for). Selected the students getting into these slots. There will be 6 working for OpenPrinting.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<seb128> thanks tkamppeter
<seb128> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: Trevinho
<seb128> (long list coming)
<seb128> Â· Nautilus recent search provider, fixed as upstream required:
<seb128>   - https://gitlab.gnome.org/3v1n0/nautilus/commits/recent-search-provider
<seb128> Â· Nautilus recent manager updater, fixed as per upstream review:
<seb128>   - https://gitlab.gnome.org/3v1n0/nautilus/commits/recent-manager-update
<seb128> Â· Nautilus, ported the said patches to Ubuntu, fixed others,
<seb128>   readded missing:
<seb128>   -
<seb128> https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/nautilus/recent-files-patches-update/+merge/343140
<seb128> Â· mutter, reproposed some Jonas fixes updating code:
<seb128>   - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/81
<seb128> Â· mutter, selected a list of fixes to include in ubuntu and debian:
<seb128>   - https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/mutter/merge_requests/1
<seb128> Â· gnome-shell, updated proposed patches:
<seb128>   - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/3
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 81 in mutter "Move MetaOutput::crtc field into private struct and add ref-chain" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<seb128>   - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/4
<seb128>   - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/8
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 1 in mutter "debian/patches: import upstream (proposed) fixes" (comments: 4) [Merged]
<seb128>   And merged:
<ubot5-ng> seb128: Error: GNOME: Impossible to get infos for GNOME/gnome-shell issue (Merge request) 3: 'dict' object has no attribute 'username'
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 4 in gnome-shell "Javascript invalid access fixes" (comments: 14) [Opened]
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 8 in gnome-shell "Repositioned window in activities" (comments: 8) [1. Bug, Opened]
<seb128>   - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/7
<seb128> Â· gnome-shell, fixed a texture cache crash:
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 7 in gnome-shell "Workspace Thumbnails set proper porthole" (comments: 2) [1. Bug, Merged]
<seb128>   - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/79
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 79 in gnome-shell "St cache texture destroy fixes" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<seb128> Â· gnome-shell, various upstream reviews (!42, !67, !77, !52, !47)
<seb128> Â· gnome-shell, prepared a list of fixes to backport to ubuntu and
<seb128>   prepared a branch with all the fixes:
<seb128>   -
<seb128> https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/gnome-shell/bionic-patches-picks/+merge/343423
<seb128> Â· Unity, updated favorites migration script and landed:
<seb128>   -
<seb128> https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/migrate-gnome-desktop-files-update/+merge/343245
<seb128> Â· Unity-settings-daemon: moved monitors.xml to unity-monitors.xml and
<seb128>   added migration script.
<seb128>   -
<seb128> https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity-settings-daemon/use-and-migrate-unity-monitors-xml/+merge/343230
<seb128>   - Please DEVS, neeeds publishing!
<seb128>     https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3223
<seb128> Â· Theme fixes:
<seb128>   -
<seb128> https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu-themes/backdrop-links-opacity/+merge/342973
<seb128>   -
<seb128> https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu-themes/appmenu-no-icon-shadow/+merge/342972
<seb128>   -
<seb128> https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu-themes/builder-fixes/+merge/342964
<seb128>   -
<seb128> https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu-themes/theme-colors-definitions/+merge/342965
<seb128> Â· Bionic bugs update:
<seb128>   - Bug #1724439, patches updated and backported to ubuntu (see above)
<ubot5`> bug 1724439 in mutter (Ubuntu Bionic) "gnome-shell crashed with SIGSEGV in meta_window_get_monitor() from ffi_call_unix64() from ffi_call() from gjs_invoke_c_function() from function_call()" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1724439
<seb128>   - Bug #1747566, patches updated and backported to ubuntu (see above)
<ubot5`> bug 1747566 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "syslog fills with messages: Object ..., has been already finalized. Impossible to get any property from it. ... (stack trace in tweener.js)" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1747566
<seb128>   - Bug #1754445, added to the bionic list, wrote patch and included
<ubot5`> bug 1754445 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "gnome-shell crashed with SIGSEGV in cogl_object_unref() from iter_remove_or_steal() from g_hash_table_iter_remove() from st_texture_cache_evict_icons() from on_icon_theme_changed()" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1754445
<seb128>   - Bug #1756826, next in my list
<ubot5`> bug 1756826 in nautilus (Ubuntu Bionic) "hangs when locate search provider matches a lot of files" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1756826
<seb128> (the bot is not always making those easier to read)
<seb128> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<seb128> - Discussions with design about future Snap banner format
<seb128> - Reviewed KDE Discover snap interface support
<seb128> - Released snapd-glib 1.39
<seb128> - Released second iteration of gnome-initial-setup Ubuntu changes
<seb128> - Working on third iteration of gnome-initial-setup Ubuntu changes
<seb128> - Released GNOME Software paid snap support to bionic
<seb128> - Gave desktop requirements for v2 API on snap store details
<seb128> #topic http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bu
<seb128> the list is short enough this week \o/
<kenvandine> great
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> the url-dispatcher is not new, I should get it out of the list, let's skip it
<seb128> subiquity is not for us
<seb128> nor laptop mode tools
<seb128> well, unknown section is nothing for us in summary
<seb128> desktop
<seb128> bug #1762152
<ubot5`> bug 1762152 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "Network Manager is unable to connect to Wifi. Ask password and then loop forever" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1762152
<seb128> that's one report and it points to rand-mac config we have
<jbicha> wait, that's a very strange theory in that bug
<Laney> it's not ight
<Laney> it probably just worked because of restarting NM
<seb128> right
<seb128> and it's only one report
<seb128> I feel like it's not a release issue at this point
<willcooke> +1
<Laney> I think this is notfixing, it's not even clear what the problem is
<seb128> -notfixing?
<jbicha> yes
<seb128> seems like agreement
<Laney> might want to leave a quick triage comment too
<seb128> done
<seb128> bug #1763763
<ubot5`> bug 1763763 in nautilus (Ubuntu) "Duplicate apps in Open With Other Application" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1763763
<seb128> I'm going to have a look to that but I don't think it's a release issue
<seb128> wdyt?
<willcooke> I'd agree its not a release issue
<seb128> -notfixing?
<seb128> done that
<willcooke> ta, jbicha feel free to work on it though I'd say
<seb128> I said I would, I know what to do
<seb128> but it might be a SRU
<willcooke> ok, even better
<seb128> bug #1577885
<ubot5`> bug 1577885 in systemd (Ubuntu) "120sec delay during shutdown or reboot with still mounted cifs (via Wifi)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1577885
<jbicha> this one is also a bit strange because I think "Make available to other users" is the default, that's how it works here at least
<willcooke> yeah, I foudn the same
<jbicha> but I'm on bionic not xenial if that matters
<willcooke> *found
<seb128> I tagged that one because it sounded like investigating if possible
<seb128> but at this point we are too busy and that doesn't sound like a release blocker
<seb128> -notfixing?
<jbicha> +1
<willcooke> I can set up a CIFS server and test, but yeah -notfixcing
<seb128> k, good review
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html seems mostly on shape, some unassigned items but I'm going to deal with those
<seb128> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-04-17 | Current topic: AOB
<seb128> other topics?
<willcooke> nope
<seb128> seems not? efficient one this week, thanks everyone!
<willcooke> thanks!
<oSoMoN> short and sweet
<jibel> french efficiency ;)
<willcooke> *cough*
 * willcooke takes the hint
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Apr 17 14:00:01 2018 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2018/ubuntu-desktop.2018-04-17-13.31.moin.txt
 * didrocks doesn't know what to say more on that
<seb128> :)
<kenvandine> lol
<didrocks> I'm happy the remark was logged in the minutes though :p
<didrocks> *ackward music*
<jbicha> is that the French elevator music again?
 * didrocks has it in his head now :p
<Laney> there's only one french tune worth knowing
<cyphermox> jibel: sorry, what about the keyboard? is there a bug open?
<seb128> cyphermox, see your emails :) bug #1758647
<ubot5`> bug 1758647 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Bionic) "ubiquity doesn't preselect the right default keyboard layout" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1758647
<didrocks> Laney: ta da da
<Laney> :>
<cyphermox> I'm not exactly watching email; I'm neck deep in netplan
<Laney> oh
<Laney> in that case...
<Laney> cyphermox: we're waiting for you on the volume-key MIR too; the package in bionic unapproved is intended to be acceptable (i.e. it runs the tests fatally)
<cyphermox> cool
<seb128> cyphermox, k, well summary is that the keyboard selected is always qwerty and not changing when you pick another language on the first screen of ubiquity, that seems to be a regression following the console-setup update in 17.10 which added "keyboard-configuration/xkb-keymap"
<cyphermox> it's not
<seb128> ah, good
<seb128> but it's still buggy :p
<cyphermox> that's quite possible
<cyphermox> there are other locale-related issues
<cyphermox> it might be that this is just another symptom
<seb128> do you think you have slots to debug those?
<cyphermox> afaik sil2100 and/or infinity were looking into this
<cyphermox> I might be able to have a quick look in a few hours
<sil2100> Let's not duplicate work on this for now
<sil2100> There's already me and Colin debugging it
<sil2100> (I have some leads now at least)
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> why are you guys never commenting on launchpad or letting others known about work you are doing?
<seb128> could somebody re-assign bug #1758647 and add a comment stating that?
<ubot5`> bug 1758647 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Bionic) "ubiquity doesn't preselect the right default keyboard layout" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1758647
<sil2100> eh, it's not what we're working on then
<seb128> and it's too late to not duplicate work, but yeah let's not dup more
<sil2100> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/debian-installer/+bug/1754646
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1754646 in debian-installer (Ubuntu Bionic) "Texts in the dialogues are faulty on alternate installer" [Critical,In progress]
<sil2100> This is the only locale thing I'm investigating, not sure if it's actually related
<seb128> seems different
<seb128> the other one seems rather console-setup related
<sil2100> Right now it's more like something causing libtextwrap going highwire
<sil2100> (since both the text and newt plugins are using textwrap which is choking on multibyte characters due to some problems in getting the right locale)
<sil2100> Not sure if that could cause issues anywhere besides debian-installer
<seb128> I doubt that cause that keyboard selection bug in any case
<jibel> I tihnk it's different the keyboard bug started in 17.10; the broken dialogs in 18.04
<cyphermox> Laney: mir approved
<Laney> thx â¥
<cyphermox> sil2100: seb128: console-setup and keyboard-configuration are both in the same package.
<cyphermox> if something got borked, it's not at all unlikely it also presents as wrongly picking default kbd
<cyphermox> admittedly, it's different if textwrap is what busted
<seb128> k, well let's see
<seb128> but the fact that the issue didn't start on the same cycle suggest they have not the same cause
<seb128> jibel, did you have a chance to look at if you can get a backtrace of xwayland?
<jibel> seb128, let me do that now
<seb128> jibel, thx
<cyphermox> seb128: ok, I think this is debconf breakage; I'll have a look in a bit
<seb128> cyphermox, thx!
<jbicha> seb128: I made some progress on the osk issues
<jbicha> firefox doesn't like me today though
<jbicha> https://paste.debian.net/1020754/
<jbicha> ok, firefox was sort of my fault ( I had bad advice for dealing with the osk bug)
<jbicha> but this osk has multiple bugs, which is part of why this will be complicated to fix :(
<jbicha> ok, I left some comments at https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/issues/109
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug 109 in gnome-shell "Extended characters in OSK don't get entered" (comments: 16) [Opened]
<ubot5`> Error: Gnome bug 109 could not be found
<jbicha> speaking of mozilla, mozjs52 no longer builds from source because icu was updated (newer than in Debian unstable). Would it be acceptable to build with the embedded icu instead?
<jbicha> if we end up SRUing mozjs60 (or later) to bionic, we may be forced to use the embedded icu then anyway
<jbicha> doko: ^ fyi, since you updated bionic's icu in November
<jbicha> we actually build artful's mozjs52 with the embedded icu because of the problem matching the system icu with what we need for mozilla stuff
<seb128> jbicha, k
<jbicha> seb128: you changed your mind on the gjs upload then?
<seb128> jbicha, I didn't make my mind yesterday, I was just pointing out that it's late for such changes
<seb128> but the bug/duflu/trevinh_o/willcook_e managed to convince me it's probably a win deal
<seb128> duflu and Trevinho are pretty confident it's not going to create issues and improve the situation
<seb128> and I trust them at this point and we still have a few days to test thing and revert if needed
<seb128> jbicha, wdyt?
<jbicha> I don't know enough about gjs to have much of an opinion
<seb128> let's see how it goes, hopefully it's the right move
<jbicha> darkxst didn't like it though ð
<seb128> he didn't seem to understand the issue, he was arguing it's a non issue were the bug/our users feedback show it's quite a major one
<seb128> if he has a better suggestion or a concrete reason we shouldn't use the patch I'm open to change it
<seb128> were->where
<seb128> jibel, did you manage to get that stacktrace?
<Laney> seb128: this "to be upstreamed" patch in udisks2, was it done?
<Laney> they all looked like they could go into debian so I was going to do that
<Laney> (I'll probably do that upload tomorrow)
<jibel> seb128, nope. I've got the hang on resume once, but no crash and no trace
<seb128> jibel, :/ you had gdb attached to xwayland? it didn't stop?
<seb128> jibel, did you attach the gdm user one or the session one?
<seb128> Laney, the srcdir one? not yet but I should do that, thanks for the reminder, I try to do it tomorrow
<Trevinho> Morning
<jbicha> Trevinho: your merge proposal was complicated ð
<Trevinho> jbicha: I know.... Well in gitlab could be easier to see
<jbicha> that's not the complicated part
<Trevinho> jbicha: ah I saw part of the email
<jbicha> it's the large number of patches and the need to skim over upstream comments and bug reports scattered across Launchpad, bugzilla and gitlab
<Trevinho> well I'm not expecting many changes on .2/3
<jbicha> ok, I pushed to bzr. Could you make one more change: could you separate the patches applied to git master in debian/patches/series
<Trevinho> Yeah I wanted to do that
<jbicha> that way it might be easier for the lucky person who gets to package newer gnome-shell releases
<Trevinho> Plus another one is needed as per the mutter change
<Trevinho> For us, using the sala branch over bzr would make things easier
<jbicha> well we did that for mutter but the mutter patches weren't as many and didn't take as long to look over
<jbicha> bzr and git weren't the problem for me at least here
<jbicha> seb128: see bug 1759540
<ubot5`> bug 1759540 in ubuntu-report (Ubuntu) "[MIR] ubuntu-report: send telemetry data to ubuntu server" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1759540
<jbicha> willcooke: ^
<oSoMoN> gânight all
<willcooke> evening
<sarnold> willcooke: I'm used to you *leaving* at about this time, not arriving :)
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> jbicha, I saw, thanks
<GunnarHj> Hi jbicha, time for a no-change rebuild of ibus? Please see the latest two comments on bug #1764161 for an explanation.
<ubot5`> bug 1764161 in Ubuntu Translations "Translation template for ibus is missing some strings" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1764161
<seb128> GunnarHj, you never stop do you? ;)
<GunnarHj> seb128: I'll stop at final freeze. :) But that one proved to be more urgent to deal with than I thought this morning.
<seb128> GunnarHj, I said I would look at it
<seb128> GunnarHj, I think it just needs to depends on dh-translations and have ",translations" added to the dh line from debian/rules
<jbicha> GunnarHj: did you get a chance to look at bug 1761554 yet?
<ubot5`> bug 1761554 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu Bionic) "[bionic] Extended characters in GNOME screen keyboard don't get entered" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1761554
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, I tested with the depend, but not with ",translations". Will do. Thanks.
<GunnarHj> B
<GunnarHj> jbicha: No. Too much translation stuff.
<jbicha> this is a translation stuff :)
<jbicha> but it can be SRU'd if it doesn't get done this week
<seb128> we are going to need to fix a lot through SRUs :/
<GunnarHj> jbicha: I'd call it encoding. :) (May give it a try tomorrow, but I share the feeling that many SRUs will be needed.)
<GunnarHj> seb128: ",translations" was it. :)
<seb128> GunnarHj, right, that was dropped by happyaron in xenial without explanation, I just did an upload with it
<seb128> and updated the bug
<seb128> sorry you spent some hours on it, I said I would have a look but day has been busy
<seb128> but I knew where to poke
<GunnarHj> seb128: Oh, then my patch isn't so useful... ;)
<seb128> GunnarHj, sorry :/
<GunnarHj> np
<GunnarHj> seb128: I played with cdbs instead of dh-translation with the thought that it might be possible to upstream. But maybe the delta is so big anyway so it doesn't matter much.
<seb128> GunnarHj, yeah, it doesn't look like we are going to get ibus in sync soon
<jbicha> if Debian didn't mind the debian/patches/ubuntu.series hack, it would be possible to sync ibus packaging
<jbicha> the trick for dh_translations is to build-depend on gnome-pkg-tools and use --with gnome
<GunnarHj> jbicha: For dh_translations on non-GNOME packages, build-depend on cdbs and --with translations may be more suitable.
<GunnarHj> jbicha: I wrote a couple of comments on the screen keyboard bug.
<jbicha> GunnarHj: no, build-depends on cdbs is unnecessary, you can build-depend on dh-translations directly
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Yes, but not if you want to be in sync with Debian.
<jbicha> the only reason I mentioned --with gnome is because Ubuntu's dh_gnome is modified to run dh_translations and so it is a hack if you want a package
<jbicha> to be translatable
<GunnarHj> I see.
<GunnarHj> So build-dep on cdbs + --with gnome ought to be possible to get accepted in Debian then.
<jbicha> I think it's a bit wrong for a package to use dh but depend on cdbs
<jbicha> it confuses some tools that try to guess what Debian buildsystem is being used
<GunnarHj> Ok, you know a lot more about the topic than me..
<jbicha> build-dep on gnome-pkg-tools is required for --with gnome to work
<jbicha> ignore cdbs :)
<GunnarHj> Have already forgotten all about it.
<jbicha> GunnarHj: are you using Xorg or Wayland?
<jbicha> anyway if you're using Xorg, you're probably seeing https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/issues/135
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Right now I'm testing on 17.10 on Wayland.
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug 135 in gnome-shell "OSK: [Xorg] Unable to type capital letters" (comments: 6) [Opened]
<ubot5`> Error: Gnome bug 135 could not be found
<jbicha> GNOME 3.28's on screen keyboard is completely different than what was in 3.26 (caribou isn't used any more)
<GunnarHj> Oh. I'd better switch to bionic for further testing then.
<jbicha> xorg has that extra bug, but there is a small proposed patch, let me try out the patchâ¦
<GunnarHj> jbicha: If the issue you see is 18.04 specific, can it possibly be related to the latest glibc? See bug #1754646.
<ubot5`> bug 1754646 in Ubuntu Translations "Texts in the dialogues are faulty on alternate installer" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1754646
<GunnarHj> If I understand it correctly, a couple of rebuilds solve the issue with that installer.
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-04-18
<jbicha> Trevinho: were you going to reorder the gnome-shell patch series or should I do that?
<jbicha> there is a gnome-3-28 branch in upstream gnome now (HEAD points to 3.28.1)
<Trevinho> jbicha: you mean for ubuntu or debian?
<jbicha> reordering for Ubuntu. the gnome-3-28 branch is in gnome git
<Trevinho> jbicha:  reordering how, sorry, I don't understand what's wrong
<jbicha> Trevinho: it's not wrong, I just thought it would be helpful to sort the patches in debian/patches/series so it was easier to see there which patches are already applied in git master
<jbicha> I thought we discussed that earlier. That's why I hadn't uploaded to bionic yet. https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2018/04/17/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t18:23
<Trevinho> jbicha: ah, ok... how you want them to be separated? Want me commenting them?
<Trevinho> It's already defined in Origin: tag though
<duflu> Afternoon thumper
<duflu> Evening Trevinho
<duflu> And hi jbicha
<Trevinho> hey duflu
<thumper> o/ duflu
<thumper> and Trevinho
<Trevinho> hey thumper
<Trevinho> :)
<Trevinho> duflu: woudl be the case to include also https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/commit/2d80fd02e76bbe17dc52072299dda92ab88c99c0 ?
<duflu> Trevinho, that would certainly fix our #1 crasher bug 1748450
<ubot5`> bug 1748450 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu Bionic) "gnome-shell crashed with SIGTRAP in _g_log_abort() from g_log_default_handler() from default_log_handler(message="Connection to xwayland lost") from g_logv() from g_log() from <bug 1505409>" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1748450
<Trevinho> duflu: well, or at least would make us understand what's leading it
<Trevinho> I'm including it let's see
<duflu> Trevinho, it doesn't help to solve the problem, but it will silence the huge amount of crash reports. I think it's a good small step, yes
<duflu> Although some people will report bugs without debug info then... saying "my shell just vanished"
<duflu> We still have the problem of Xwayland failing and no crash reports for it.
<Trevinho> that's a thing that whoopsie should handle though
<duflu> But silencing those crash dialogs in 18.04 would be excellent
<duflu> Trevinho, no Xwayland fails without crashing, and triggers a crash in gnome-shell only. It's an Xwayland issue that never leaves a core/crash file
<Trevinho> duflu, jbicha: https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/mutter/merge_requests/2/diffs
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 2 in mutter "debian/patches: handle xwayland crashes better" (comments: 0) [Opened]
 * Trevinho loves salsa
<Trevinho> can't wait to have the same way of working with patches in ubuntu too... Well, I'm doing it already but still need to handle with bzr eventually. But still better way
<duflu> Trevinho, I feel conflicted about letting gnome-shell just exit. It will result in some people logging bug reports that we can't diagnose, but those will be orders of magnitude fewer than what we see now
<duflu> So short term for 18.04, it's a good idea. Slightly beyond that, it's going to keep hurting us if nobody fixes Xwayland
<jibel> seb128, hi
<jibel> seb128, to answer your question from yesterday evening, it's attached xwayland of the gdm user
<jibel> +to
<Trevinho> duflu: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/73 I missed this in the g-s patches, you wanted to include it?
<ubot5-ng> GNOME bug (Merge request) 73 in gnome-shell "js/ui: Choose some actors to cache on the GPU" (comments: 1) [Opened]
<duflu> Trevinho, yes, if possible. I am answering your question on it now
<Trevinho> duflu: is there an ubuntu bug for that?
<duflu> Lemme check
<duflu> Trevinho, yes the merge request links to two upstream bugs, and one of them links to LP too
<Trevinho> duflu: ok
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey duflu Trevinho jibel
<seb128> lut didrocks
<Trevinho> hey seb128
<duflu> Hello seb128
<seb128> jibel, weird that it doesn't catch an error :/
<didrocks> hey seb128, Trevinho, duflu
<Trevinho> hi didrocks
<duflu> Hi didrocks
<Trevinho> duflu: I've added that in https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/gnome-shell/bionic-patches-picks-reorder/+merge/343479
<duflu> Trevinho, thanks. Are we getting 3.28.1 too?
<Trevinho> duflu: that's based on 3.28.1
<duflu> OK
<koza> willcooke, hey, sadly i need to skip our morning mtg today
<willcooke> morning koza, no worries.  I dont have anythng anyway.  duflu you want to meet anyway?
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<willcooke> hi didrocks, how goes?
<willcooke> (he asks him knowingly)
<duflu> willcooke, Nope.
<seb128> hey willcooke koza, nothing from me either on the bluetooth front
<duflu> I'll do an update post-release
<didrocks> willcooke: lalala :)
<duflu> It might be a single bugfix, or it might be 5.49
 * didrocks does good use of his time, grepping for copyrights and filing up debian/copyright (which will be out of date in few weeks, like all packages in distro :p)
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> hey oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<Laney> yo
<oSoMoN> hey Laney
<didrocks> hey Laney
<duflu> Hi Laney
<duflu> willcooke, Sorry, it's an awkward time of day. Either like today, the question is asked when I am afk doing pre-meeting prep, or like other weeks we decide to cancel only minutes before you log on
 * didrocks uploads to a ppa for test build in a clean env
<seb128>  hey Laney oSoMoN
<Laney> hey oSoMoN didrocks duflu seb128!!!
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<didrocks> seb128: willcooke: ok, vendored ubuntu-report uploaded and waiting now in UNAPPROVED. (I still did a little extra to use distro deps for the golang source bindings which stays in universe). More info on bug #1764961 and https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-report/+bug/1759540/comments/10 (commented on the MIR)
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1759540 in ubuntu-report (Ubuntu) "[MIR] ubuntu-report: send telemetry data to ubuntu server" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<ubot5`> bug 1764961 in ubuntu-report (Ubuntu) "Use vendor dependencies" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1764961
<willcooke> \m/
<seb128> didrocks, great, thanks!
<didrocks> yw :)
<seb128> didrocks, "Note thus that "golang-github-ubuntu-ubuntu-report-dev" should still be kept in main."
<seb128> didrocks, you meant "universe" there?
<didrocks> oupsss, where?
<didrocks> I wrote that 3 times ;)
<didrocks> ok, not the ones in the package and comments
<didrocks> ah, in the MIR comment
<didrocks> commented, thanks seb128!
<seb128> np!
<duflu> Oh, I did get credited in the gstreamer-vaapi git log even though they didn't use my original patch. That's nice.
 * duflu relearns from his own code
<seb128> :/
<didrocks> seb128: gnome-initial-setup wasn't promoted? Should I? (as ubuntu-report is still in main)
<didrocks> at least, even if the MIR team doesn't get back to us on the final changes for u-r, we'll have g-i-s tested in tomorrow's iso
<seb128> didrocks, wfm
<seb128> thx
<didrocks> ok, doing it
<didrocks> yw ;)
<Laney> andyrock: those xdg autostart files - don't we need to stop the path units when the user logs out?
<Laney> or otherwise they could be started in default.target and the corresponding units made to cleanly exit if they can't run?
 * duflu wanders into the night
<andyrock> Laney: mmm how?
<andyrock> Laney: I mean how to stop when the user logs out?
<Laney> I don't know :(
<andyrock> mmm let me take a look
<Laney> we get that with graphical-session.target, but I'm not sure how to do it without that
<Laney> apart from something watching the XDG session or gnome-session
<jbicha> Trevinho: you're not still around now, right?
<Wimpress> tseliot: It appears that Ubuntu flavours (MATE, Budgie, Kubuntu, Xubuntu have been tested) all boot to a black screen on hybrid graphics laptops with nvidia 390 drivers installed on 18.04.
<Wimpress> This doesn't affect Ubuntu proper with GNOME.
<tseliot> Wimpress: is the nvidia-prime package installed?
<Wimpress> What information do you required to investigate this?
<Wimpress> On Ubuntu MATE yes.
<Wimpress> I have an OEM with 2 laptop models that are affected.
<Wimpress> So we can gather useful information.
<Wimpress> What do you need.
<tseliot> Wimpress: I'm going to need /var/log/gpu-manager.log, /var/log/Xorg.0.log, dmesg output
<Wimpress> OK.
<Wimpress> I'll raise a new bug a gather some debug.
<tseliot> Wimpress: thanks
<Wimpress> tseliot: Let me introduce mwilson-e
<Wimpress> He runs Entroware, an OEM that sells Ubuntu laptops.
<Wimpress> mwilson-e: Is going to collect the debug you've requested and attach to this bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers-390/+bug/1764005
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1764005 in nvidia-prime (Ubuntu) "Black-screen on boot with nvidia 390 for Budgie, MATE, Xubuntu, Kubuntu" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<tseliot> Wimpress: ok
<Wimpress> tseliot: Mike has two laptop models to test against so if you need more info he can provide it.
<Wimpress> I'll do the same for the XPS 15 9550.
<tseliot> Wimpress: that's good. I'll wait for mwilson-e to attach the logs for now
<mwilson-e> Nice to meet you. Working on gathering all the logs now.
<Wimpress> Sure, will be a little while since he is going to be thorough :-)
<andyrock> Laney: stopping the services on logout does not seems easy
<andyrock> seb128: ^^^
<andyrock> Laney: seb128 I would drop the upload of update-notifier for the moment, I'll try to find a way to show livepatch notification without this
<Laney> maybe it doesn't matter that much???
<Laney> what's the impact - ugly failures?
<Laney> andyrock: sorry for not thinking of that before
<andyrock> Laney: so all the other services are not effected because there is a GFileMonitor fallback
<andyrock> we can do the same
<Laney> there's a service running all the time?
<andyrock> yeah
<andyrock> update-notifier
<Laney> oh right
<Laney> well then that could watch logind and stop the path units too
<Laney> but just doing the file monitor directly might be simpler
<Laney> andyrock: ok, I'll reject, ping me for a re-review if you want
<andyrock> Laney: thx
<seb128> andyrock, k
<Wimpress> tseliot: See https://pad.lv/1764005 - I've added logs and details I what I experience on the XPS 15 9550.
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1764005 in nvidia-prime (Ubuntu) "Black-screen on boot with nvidia 390 for Budgie, MATE, Xubuntu, Kubuntu" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<willcooke> gedit fans - is the right click menu using a strange font for you?
<willcooke> looks like its monospace condensed or something
<mdeslaur> willcooke: mine is on artful
<willcooke> mdeslaur, is funny?
<willcooke> yeah,
<mdeslaur> willcooke: yeah, like you said, it's a small monospace
<willcooke> thanks mdeslaur
<willcooke> Trevinho, any ideas on that one?
<willcooke> Can't belive I haven't noticed it before
<Wimpress> willcooke: That content menu font issue is an upstream bug.
<Wimpress> Affects all gtk3 editors with context menus.
<willcooke> ah ha! thanks Wimpress
<willcooke> Wimpress, this doesn't change my mind about gedit though, before you start on that one ;)
<Wimpress> tseliot: You'll find more debug from mwilson-e in https://pad.lv/1764005
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1764005 in nvidia-prime (Ubuntu) "Black-screen on boot with nvidia 390 for Budgie, MATE, Xubuntu, Kubuntu" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<tseliot> Wimpress: that's a lot of logs, thanks!
<Wimpress> Most welcome :-)
<Wimpress> tseliot: I've also just discovered `ubuntu-drivers autoinstall` fails.
<Wimpress> I'll raise a bug for that too.
<tseliot> Wimpress: that would be very welcome. Thanks
<mwilson-e> tseliot: If you need any others, just let me know.
<andyrock> seb128: I guess we need to add dh-migrations as a dep in software-properties
<andyrock> ?
<andyrock> otherwise we can just drop the migration script
<tseliot> mwilson-e: maybe the output of "journalctl --since=today" would help, as I don't see anything suspicious in the logs
<mwilson-e> tseliot: I'll get that now, any particular distro?
<tseliot> mwilson-e: just one that fails would be fine. I'm looking for clues
<didrocks> andyrock: man dh_migrations ;)
<didrocks> it tells you what to do in term of deps, files and debian/rules ;)
<didrocks> (waow 2012â¦ 6 years ago)
<jibel> seb128, I just got a gnome-shell crash with gdb attached to xwayland. What do you need now?
<Wimpress> tseliot: https://pad.lv/1765053
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1765053 in ubuntu-drivers-common (Ubuntu) "ubuntu-drivers autoinstall fails to install nvidia 390 drivers" [Undecided,New]
<mwilson-e> tseliot: Just posted the requested log to the bug report.
<tseliot> Wimpress, mwilson-e: thanks
<seb128> andyrock, indeed, I'm fixing that
<andyrock> seb128: thx!
<seb128> jibel, what is gdb telling you, did it stop?
<seb128> andyrock, np, sorry for not spotting that before upload
<jibel> seb128, nothing, it just stopped. I dumped a core of the process just in case
<seb128> jibel, can you make a photo? ;)
<seb128> like it stopped giving you back a prompt where you can type "bt"?
<jibel> yes
<jibel> which I did https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/wHWtZsKwts/
<jibel> not really exciting trace
<seb128> hum
<seb128> did it indicate a sigsegv before?
<seb128> the bt looks like it's active/waiting for events
<seb128> not that it hit a bug
<jibel> no, really nothing. It just stopped and gave me a prompt
<seb128> weird
<seb128> and if you do "c" it resumes?
<jibel> yes
<jibel> I'll keep it attached and try again
<seb128> and you got the gnome-shell issue as well?
<jibel> yes, g-s crashed and apport generated a crash file
<jibel> it's uploading
<seb128> k, let's see what it gives us
<Wimpress> Trevinho: Please can you take a look at this - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-sound/+bug/1737834
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1737834 in indicator-sound (Ubuntu) "[FTBFS] indicator-sound fails to build, test failures" [High,Confirmed]
<Wimpress> Is that merge proposal OK with you?
<mwilson-e> tseliot: Not sure if it helps you but if I install Ubuntu MATE BETA 2, not the daily, and install the nvidia driver it works fine. But once the `ubuntu-driver-common` package is upgraded the problem then presents itself.
<seb128> Wimpress, Trevinho, disabling tests doesn't seem the right way out no
<tseliot> mwilson-e: what version of ubuntu-drivers-common does Ubuntu MATE BETA 2 ship with?
<Wimpress> seb128: OK, thanks.
<seb128> np
<mwilson-e> tseliot: It ships with 1:0.5
<mwilson-e> the upgrade to 1:0.5.1 kills it
<tseliot> mwilson-e: do things work if you boot the system with the "nogpumanager" parameter?
<mwilson-e> tseliot: Just tested on two machines, the nogpumanager param does not work.
<tseliot> mwilson-e: remove /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/11-nvidia-prime.conf first, then boot with "nogpumanager"
<mwilson-e> tseliot: That works, but in the nvidia-settings application many of the options are gone. only PRIME profiles, Application Profiles, and nvidia-settings Configuration tabs are displayed
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, when you have a minute: https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/evince/snap-allow-printing/+merge/343521
<oSoMoN> seb128, kenvandine: thanks for the endorsement! one to goâ¦
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, happy too!
<tseliot> mwilson-e: that was just to find what was causing the problem. Can you post your /var/log/Xorg.0.log please?
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, i just reviewed it, i think we need avahi-observe too
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, ack, adding it
<mwilson-e> tseliot: added it to the bug report.
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, updated
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, we should request auto-connection of the cups-control plug once this is merged and published in the store, I'm happy to create the request on the forum if you let me know when to do it
<seb128> oSoMoN, yw, should be easy to get the 3rd one :)
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, yeah
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, merged and the snap is building now
<tseliot> mwilson-e: thanks
<mwilson-e> tseliot: No problem, if you need anything else, just ask.
<seb128> hum
<seb128> is the trello board having background textures on most of the card now for some reason? or is it me/my browser being buggy?
<kenvandine> seb128, i saw the same too
<kenvandine> it looks very 1990s :)
<Laney> that's one of the powerups
<seb128> kenvandine, it looks like it's proportional to the time they haven't been updated maybe
<Laney> card aging
<kenvandine> lol
<Laney> someone must have put that on
<kenvandine> you're right
<kenvandine> sounds like a trick from seb128 to keep us on our toes
<seb128> lol
<seb128> Trevinho did it
<seb128> he activated "Card Aging"
<seb128> Trevinho, please don't do such changes to the board without discussing them here first
<oSoMoN> next step: make the cards <blink> to remind us to update them :)
<kenvandine> :-p
<didrocks> :p
<seb128> which remind me, some people still didn't update their inprogress card, I should do another follow up
<GunnarHj> Hi jbicha, did you see my docs idea about the screen keyboard?
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey, I saw your comment but I don't really know what different it makes to set that IM variable to ibus or not, I agree it's late to change it though so probably best as a SRU
<seb128> kenvandine
<seb128> kenvandine, jamesh, jibel, you are basically the ones who still have in-progress cards in the trello board that didn't get updated
<seb128> could you please review your cards?
<GunnarHj> seb128: We can do that as an SRU, but it still doesn't help on Xorg AFAIU.
<GunnarHj> seb128: So the very latest idea is to inform the users in the desktop guide about what they need to do to make it work.
<seb128> well, or to fix it for xorg in a SRU as well
<GunnarHj> seb128: Sure, if that is at all possible. I didn't get that impression from the comments on the upstream issue.
<seb128> bugs are always possible to fix, might not be trivial though :/
<seb128> the cycle has been too busy for me to look at OSK issues but we should make sure it works good enough by .1
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, so then I'll wait with that docs text. Plan A: Fix it, also on Xorg as an SRU and plan B: inform the users with a docs SRU.
<seb128> GunnarHj, what are the main issues in your opinion? (I didn't follow much, capital letter and special chars can't be inputed?)
<GunnarHj> seb128: That's it. Bad enough IMO.
<seb128> yeah...
<seb128> andyrock, Laney, since the update-notified upload has been rejected I uncommited the change and push --overwrite the vcs without those to not confuse the next uploader, unsure if that's the right thing to do in those case (it makes the status of the merge mp wrong/confusing)
<andyrock> seb128: thanks
<andyrock> I was already working on an alternate fix
<andyrock> let me "rebase"
<Laney> I usually try to not push the tag until it's accepted
<Laney> that is easier with git than bzr, but still can be done
<Laney> biggest risk is forgetting
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, evince has built, i've tested it
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, in stable now
<seb128> Laney, right...
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, excellent, thanks, I'll write the auto-connection request
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, cool
<Laney> anyway, thx, probably not that much chance somebody did pull in the meantime
<andyrock> apart from me
<andyrock> :D
<seb128> right
<seb128> haha
<Laney> poor andyrock
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/auto-connecting-the-cups-control-interface-for-the-evince-snap/5033
<jbicha> GunnarHj: I'm not really a fan of the docs idea. I agree we need to understand more what the purpose of GTK_IM_MODULE is
<jbicha> GunnarHj: on GNOME/Ubuntu on Wayland, it's my understanding that ibus is the only supported input method so if we could skip that variable when run in those sessions I think the regression potential is limited
<jbicha> we'll need to open a Debian bug because Debian has the same problem (ibus there recommends im-config but I think ibus isn't installed by default there)
<seb128> jbicha, but it means =ibus or empty leads to different components to be used?
<seb128> so it's a codepath/feature/behaviour change
<seb128> and we didn't test much the other one, so seems a risky change that late, especially without someone in the team who understands the difference
<jbicha> I agree with not rushing it in now while we don't fully understand what's going on and Debian hasn't made the suggested change either
<GunnarHj> jbicha, seb128: My gut feeling is that if IBus works on GNOME without that var being set, it probably would work for us too. But still...
<jbicha> interestingly, there is a proposed simple patch to get the screen keyboard working in the Xorg session with GNOME 3.26 (17.10) but it may be a lot more complicated with current GNOME
<andyrock> seb128: the fix is almost ready. it's quite small
<andyrock> just giving a final test
<tseliot> mwilson-e: I'm going to need the output of these two commands too, please: uname -r , dkms status
<seb128> andyrock, great!
<mwilson-e> tseliot: 4.15.0-15-generic
<mwilson-e> tseliot: nvidia, 390.48, 4.15.0-15-generic, x86_64: installed
<tseliot> mwilson-e: the weird thing is that, when you disabled gpu-manager, the X log showed an actual error, and the driver wasn't really working
<GunnarHj> jbicha: I don't think either that Debian installs any IM stuff by default. So in their case, with GNOME on Wayland, the screen keyboard works until they install IBus which pulls im-config?
<andyrock> seb128: can I drop the UIFe status from the bug?
<mwilson-e> tseliot: Do you want me to run those commands with gpumanager disabled?
<jbicha> GunnarHj: I'd have to try again. My initial testing was broken because the screen keyboard didn't work how I expected (I filed bugs)
<tseliot> mwilson-e: it wouldn't change the output of those commands
<Laney> seb128: you skipped a version in software-properties, did you want to fix that?
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Ok.
<Laney> also it's not control.in :p
<mwilson-e> tseliot: I see, are there any other logs that I can provide?
<andyrock> seb128: https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/update-notifier/fix-1761841-v2/+merge/343540
<tseliot> mwilson-e: I might need you to test packages from a PPA. Not sure if today or tomorrow
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, thx
<mwilson-e> tseliot: no problem
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, i'm going to request it for gedit as well
 * Laney just got the meaning of azzar1 for the first time
<andyrock> azzarONE
<andyrock> :D
<Laney> mind is blown
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, with a bit of copy and paste from your request :)
<andyrock> they usually call me azzarONE in USA
<andyrock> at least in the airports
<jbicha> where does the rock come from?
<Laney> you can smell what Andrea is cooking
<seb128> andyrock, thanks, I'm getting ready for sport so I might not get to it before later this evening, but it's on my list
<seb128> Laney, ups, can do but ^
<seb128> if somebody wants to fix it for me please do, otherwise I can do when I'm back in the evening
<seb128> andyrock, UIFe drop is fine I believe yes
<Laney> ok
<andyrock> jbicha: from a mistake :D
<andyrock> I was young and wanted to copy didrocks
<andyrock> but I forgot the final 's'
<andyrock> :D
<Laney> andyrock: this monitor_files function is :(
<oSoMoN> did_rocks is a model for the new generation!
<andyrock> Laney: you mean the existing one or my changes?
<Laney> the one that was already there
<jbicha> everyone wants to be like didrocks
<andyrock> I agree that update-notifiers needs some love
<andyrock> next-cycle-love
<Laney> there's some weird indirection between the file monitor cb and a timer
<Laney> and it leaks all over the place
<didrocks> \o/
<Laney> andyrock: might want to add some error checking around the atoi thing, you get a 0 outputted if the file contains weird contents
<Laney> (minor)
<tseliot> mwilson-e: can you add this PPA, and when they packages build, upgrade the xserver, please? https://launchpad.net/~albertomilone/+archive/ubuntu/xtesting
<mwilson-e> tseliot: Just tested that package and it does not fix the issue.
<tseliot> mwilson-e: did you reboot? Did you boot without "nogpumanager"?
<mwilson-e> tseliot: yes I did reboot, this was also done on a fresh install with only the nvidia drivers installed.
<tseliot> mwilson-e: ok, I'll install one of those distros, and I'll see if I can reproduce the problem here
<mwilson-e> tseliot: Just so you know, I tested this on Ubuntu MATE daily.
<tseliot> mwilson-e: ok, I'll go with that then, thanks
<Trevinho> seb128: eh, see... the aging is what you want in fact :-D
<Trevinho> I was trying some power-ups and I forgot to disable sorry
<Trevinho> jbicha: about not adding that patch, both me and duflu are fine with that... Upstream wasn't keen, but in the new PRs there's no sign of that
<jbicha> Trevinho: I guess you're getting close to being on Robert's timezone :)
<andyrock> Laney: can you open a bug about that?
<andyrock> if you got spare time
<andyrock> I guess not
<willcooke> night all
<oSoMoN> good night all
<robert_ancell> andyrock, how did you make https://gitlab.gnome.org/azzaronea/gnome-initial-setup ? I didn't think we could do that until GNOME/gnome-initial-setup existed.
<robert_ancell> I'm trying to work out how we push to the Community/Ubuntu/gnome-initial-setup so we can all commit
<andyrock> robert_ancell: I just created a project called gnome-initial-setup
<andyrock> it's not a fork of the main one
<andyrock> I mean it's a fork but it has not been created with the fork button
<robert_ancell> ah
<jbicha> robert_ancell: the very rough concensus was that we should use a LP ubuntu-desktop git repo for that next month
<jbicha> there are 3 logical places for hosting and we have advocates for all 3 ð
<robert_ancell> jbicha, for packaging or working on branches?
<jbicha> it's the same thing here isn't it?
<robert_ancell> not necessarily... The branches should be close to upstream as that's where we're trying to get them. The packaging doesn't go upstream, so it doesn't matter so much where it lives.
<jbicha> ok I see, maybe it makes sense for those to be separate commits and it wouldn't hurt to have that in GNOME gitlab
<jbicha> it just makes things a bit complex as we need 3 different remotes to handle gnome-initial-setup then ð
<jbicha> I can deal with that workflow; it's just going to be a bit of a learning curve for some on our team I suppose
<jbicha> but I guess we almost do that with gnome-software already except 1 of the 3 is bzr
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: hey could you please publish https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3223 ?
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, done
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: thanks
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: if you've some time also https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/gnome-shell/bionic-patches-add-gpu-cached-texture/+merge/343565 would need merging
<Trevinho> (and sponsoring)
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, not sure if I'll find time to look at that today and I'm on holiday from tomorrow
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: ah ok, no worries... In case I'll ask other dev :)
<jbicha> robert_ancell: sorry to second guess you, but I'm surprised you removed the gnome-getting-started-docs popup part at the end of gnome-initial-setup
<robert_ancell> jbicha, design asked to remove it
<jbicha> ok
<jbicha> robert_ancell: on the Ready to go screen (software) panel in your proposed ubuntu4, I see back and forward arrows but they aren't active here
<jbicha> it was working in the ubuntu3 version
<robert_ancell> jbicha, what do you mean "aren't active"?
<jbicha> they are greyed out: I only see one page worth of snap apps on that panel
<robert_ancell> jbicha, oh, right. Yes, there's more shown on a page, so they all fit into one page. I haven't asked design what we should do, we might as well hide them I guess.
<robert_ancell> jbicha, I updated the git branch to disable them when there's one page
<robert_ancell> andyrock, I moved the branch to https://gitlab.gnome.org/Community/Ubuntu/gnome-initial-setup so feel free to merge in your GOA changes when you're happy with them.
<jbicha> robert_ancell: hey, another nitpick. In the Google Doc it says "approximate location you chose" but in Github, it says "approximate location you choose" (note final word)
<jbicha> I like the "chose" tense better, what do you think?
<robert_ancell> jbicha, I changed it to match https://github.com/CanonicalLtd/desktop-design/issues/66#issuecomment-377261986
<ubot5-ng> CanonicalLtd bug 66 in desktop-design "Visual design for first-login window" (comments: 19) [Open] - Assigned to lyubomir-popov (lyubomir)
<ubot5`> Error: Could not gather data from Launchpad for bug #66 (https://launchpad.net/bugs/66). The error has been logged
<robert_ancell> I thought chose sounded better too, but file it with the designers
<jbicha> I guess I'll open a new issue there and they can complain at me if they want all this stuff in one issue instead
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-04-19
<duflu> Trevinho, jbicha, nice work, thanks. You got out a lot more 3.28.1 than I even expected
<Trevinho> duflu: :)
<Trevinho> duflu: missing only your patch now, but there's a new iteration I pushed
<duflu> Trevinho, performance improvements can wait. We'll still be adding to that list for months
<duflu> Stability is more important
<duflu> I've been knowingly working on 18.10 for a while now, not 18.04 :)
<duflu> Trevinho, jbicha, this is odd: bug 1765261
<ubot5`> bug 1765261 in gdm3 (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu 18.04 login screen rejects a valid password on first attempt. Always works on the second attempt" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1765261
<robert_ancell> RIP gksu
<duflu> robert_ancell, did something replace it? Is that because of Wayland policy?
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<duflu> Hi seb128
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you?
<duflu> seb128, going OK, you?
<seb128> I'm good!
<duflu> Good. And with that I will run away to check the mail and feed water the citrus
<seb128> duflu, we managed to land the gjs changes as you probably saw :)
<duflu> Yeah, thanks seb128
<seb128> thank you for getting those fixes ready for upload!
<seb128> enjoy the watering :)
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<seb128> salut oSoMoN, en forme ?
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, oui la forme, et toi?
<seb128> oSoMoN, je pourrais dormir plus mais sinon Ã§a va, il fait beau et chaud :)
<seb128> yesterday was tennis night, was really nice to play again
<seb128> I could play much since the beginning of the year, between travels, crappy weather and colds&co
<seb128> couldn't*
<oSoMoN> yeah, sports is good, I should do more of it
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<didrocks> hey seb128, oSoMoN
<seb128> lut didrocks
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<didrocks> duflu: first results from the french users are really promising!
<didrocks> still some leaks ofc, but way lower memory usage
<duflu> didrocks, seb128 upstream landed the same fix a couple of minutes ago
<seb128> \o/
<didrocks> duflu: it's hard to believe though, a lot of people says their RAM consumption even at boot are divided by 2
<didrocks> too good to be real? just a placebo effect?
<duflu> didrocks, yeah just log in and measure, and it's much better
<didrocks> nice!
<didrocks> good work again :)
<seb128> duflu, https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gjs/commit/a6b6fc13 sounds like it could improve things as well, but that's for SRU at this point
<duflu> seb128, yeah there are a couple more such fixes there
<oSoMoN> didrocks, when IÂ booted my laptop this morning I was greeted by the initial setup GUI, which looks pretty good, and was mostly translated to French, so all good
<didrocks> oSoMoN: heh, the UI part is all Robert's :)
<oSoMoN> the last screen to choose to send the data or not, though, said something like "send data to Canonical occasionally", which made it sound like it's not a one-off, is that correct?
<didrocks> yeah, I think this is for popcon
<oSoMoN> ah, right, popcon
<didrocks> but I'm not even sure if this enables by g-i-s, I didn't follow that
<didrocks> I know it was discussed and robert said he will have a look
<seb128> didrocks, oSoMoN, the "ocassionally" has been dropped in the version that is in the queue
<didrocks> ah ok :)
<oSoMoN> ok, problem solved then
<didrocks> replaced by "every 10 seconds", ofc? ;)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> ++                    <property name="label" translatable="yes">Yes, send system info to Canonical</property>
<seb128> right, the change is there
<didrocks> amazing that it's already mostly in French
<seb128> we might add that back/enable popcon for .1
<didrocks> yeah, we would need a g-c-c change then
<didrocks> to enable/disable it afterwards
<seb128> right, that's why it was postponed to .1
<seb128> just enabling popcon was not difficult
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> I guess same with whoopsie?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> you guys don't expect things to be calm again after next week :p
<oSoMoN> didrocks, I thought the French translations were your doing, now I'm disappointed :)
<seb128> sounds like road to .1 is going to be busy
<didrocks> oSoMoN: oh, I can gladly take all the credits if that makes you feel better :)
<seb128> oSoMoN, be nice to didrocks, you still need a +1 for your ubuntu-desktop application :)
<didrocks> yeah, I wonder if my past unity-2d experience is something worth mentionning
<didrocks> it's been a long time I didn't sponsor you
<didrocks> but I'm definitively +1 with your past work
<seb128> you worked with him on some gdm issues previous cycle?
<didrocks> yeah, that's one data point, but correct, that's good enough entries to vote
<didrocks> I'll do that later today
<oSoMoN> cheers!
 * didrocks fixesâ¦ hemâ¦ ubuntu-report autopkgtests :p
<seb128> :)
<didrocks> (readding vendoring, which I explicitely removed from autopkgtests because of previous strategy and didn't think to delete the rm -rf â¦)
<didrocks> now that my autopkgtests vm is ready, let me first get the failure
<didrocks> then ensure it fixes it
 * oSoMoN will change his nick to olirocks as a token of admiration
<didrocks> ahah ;)
<didrocks> I hope there is no expiration period :p
<seb128> duflu, your gdm/password rejected on first try issue sounds weird, did it start with gnome-shell 3.28.1? Maybe a regression?
<duflu> seb128, yeah it started today
<seb128> duflu, do you get also the issue if you wait a bit/type slowly? there was that issue about key repeating themself under wayland when the system is busy
<duflu> seb128, that might be a factor. If I took the time to log in to ssh first to debug the problem it suddenly didn't happen
<duflu> Although restarting graphical.target I was able to reproduce it again
<didrocks> seb128: not only on wayland, I triggered the repeating key on X as well
<seb128> I wonder if you could type the password, ctrl-C it and select "log with another user" and ctrl-V to see if it's correct
<duflu> Is that even possible?
<duflu> Or would you be pasting dots?
<seb128> I wonder
<seb128> otherwise I guess that needs to patch the gdm code to not show * :p
<seb128> didrocks, weird, I though that was a wayland specific issue
<didrocks> seb128: I thought as well, but I got it 3 times in the past 2 weeks on my X session
<didrocks> especially when my machine is swapping
<seb128> is that a new issue as well?
<didrocks> I don't know if it's new, or just happens so rarely that we didn't notice it
<didrocks> (on X)
<didrocks> but not a high prio, it's really happened 3 times to me
<seb128> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=777693#c10 is the issue I was thinking about
<ubot5`> Gnome bug 777693 in general "Input event (e. g. typing on keyboard) is sent repeatedly during high load" [Normal,Needinfo]
<ubot5-ng> bugzilla.gnome.org bug 777693 in general "Input event (e. g. typing on keyboard) is sent repeatedly during high load" [Normal, Needinfo] - Assigned to gnome-shell-maint
<ubot5`> bug 777693 in PernillaSYS "Crash-bug when trying to view registrations if none of the users conferences is locked" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/777693
<seb128> which is specific to wayland
<seb128> but there might be other issues with similar effects
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, basically the exact same effect
<didrocks> you press for a short while, under load, keys is repeated
<didrocks> (and double checked that I was on X)
<seb128> didrocks, it's not on the lock screen/greeter that you see the pb? since the greeter/gdm is always under wayland
<didrocks> seb128: no, really the user session
<seb128> :/
<didrocks> yep :/
<didrocks> I knowâ¦
<seb128> I wonder if there is some regression in 3.28
<seb128> we didn't get reports about such issues in 17.10
<didrocks> well, we were under wayland
<didrocks> this issue existed on 17.10
<seb128> k
<didrocks> (but, I was only testing it with wayland)
<seb128> probably worth reporting upstream then
<didrocks> yeah, the thing is that it's quite vague
<didrocks> "under loadâ¦"
<seb128> the only reports I find there are wayland specific
<didrocks> but it's something that Fedora has
<seb128> e.g https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=776639
<ubot5`> Gnome bug 776639 in keyboard "Key Presses Repeated, Lost or Out of Order Wayland" [Major,New]
<ubot5-ng> bugzilla.gnome.org bug 776639 in keyboard "Key Presses Repeated, Lost or Out of Order Wayland" [Major, New] - Assigned to gnome-shell-maint
<ubot5`> bug 776639 in postgresql-8.4 (Ubuntu) "package postgresql-8.4 8.4.8-0ubuntu0.10.04 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/776639
<didrocks> ah, you meant, the Xorg one?
<seb128> yes
<didrocks> yeah, I'll report it, unsure against what (and if it will be looked, as it's not wayland), but let's try
<seb128> gnome-shell I guess? they can reassign if needed
<seb128> thx
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> I would need to see if that happens in apps
<didrocks> or only in G-S UI
<didrocks> I don't remember TBH
<jibel> seb128, could you re-paste the last version of your patch for orca?
<seb128> jibel, that isn't working
<seb128> jibel, but http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/ubiquity-screen-reader.patch (that one has extra print() statements for debugging)
<jibel> seb128, I know it is not working, but I'd like to check something
<jibel> thanks
<seb128> yw
<seb128> k, I'm moving back to my desktop, I had my morning coffee, trying to be back online before u.k joins :)
<seb128> brb
<willcooke> too late sucker
<willcooke> Morning Frenchies
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<willcooke> and Aussie
<willcooke> s
<willcooke> how goes didrocks?
<dupondje> Thanks for mutter 3.28.1 :D
<didrocks> willcooke: it's sunny and not too warm yet! Good day for exercising abit
<didrocks> and you?
<jibel> Morning willcooke
<willcooke> Sunny here too!
<didrocks> even there ;)
<willcooke> I hope it stays nice at the weekend and I can get out of the house and do some excercise
<willcooke> yes!  even here on the island
<willcooke> People are a bit scared
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mutter/+bug/1757401 is fixed for me now!
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1757401 in mutter (Ubuntu) "hybrid GPU: one screen stays black in mutter 3.28" [High,Fix released]
<didrocks> especially for multiple continous days
<didrocks> dupondje: nice!
<willcooke> woot, thanks for the report dupondje
<Laney> morning
<willcooke> hi Laney
<willcooke> It's summer again!
<didrocks> hey Mr Laney
<seb128> (back)
<willcooke> you were a few seconds too late seb128, we beat you :)
<seb128> DOH
<didrocks> 09:52:17       <-- | seb128 (~seb128@ubuntu/member/seb128) a quittÃ© (Quit: Ex-Chat)
<didrocks> 09:52:40 willcooke | too late sucker
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> so didn't run fast enough at *all*
<Laney> FAIL
<seb128> hey Laney!
<seb128> half victory :p
<Laney> hey willcooke didrocks seb128
<Laney> nope
<Laney> well I can't see your join message
<seb128> willcooke, the frenches will get you, don't worry!
<Laney> but your first real message was after I said hi :P
<seb128> :-(
 * Laney was tying in sweet peas
<Laney> AND
<Laney> i'm wearing shorts
<Laney> #summer
<seb128> k, you win today
<seb128> #summer feels good
 * seb128 went to tennis yesterday, that was greeeaaaaatttt
 * seb128 recommends it
<Laney> too much time on the ground
<seb128> kenvandine, ubuntu-desktop@ moderation queue got some build failure email from launchpad, in case you didn't see/receive it by some other way
<seb128> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/366205059/buildlog_snap_ubuntu_bionic_amd64_gnome-3-28-1804_BUILDING.txt.gz
<seb128> looks like a snapcraft issue though
<seb128> "  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/snapcraft/cli/env.py", line 17, in <module>
<seb128>     from distutils import util
<seb128> ImportError: cannot import name 'util'"
<didrocks> it's the remaining bug I didn't have time to file yet
<didrocks> got it with communitheme
<seb128> I guess Ken fixed it already?
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/snapcraft/2.41+18.04.2
<didrocks> oh nice! :) I never dare hijacking their upload/release process (but I think he didn't)
<Laney> interesting files in the diff ;-)
<didrocks> I guess he didn't released it the way the snapcraft team is doing it :p
<seb128> right
 * didrocks notes Laney release team habits: clicking on the diff
<seb128> looks like the fix worked, https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+snap/gnome-3-28-1804/ has a successful build
<seb128> nice to see we finally got core 18 working/usable!
<duflu> Morning willcooke, jibel, Laney
<didrocks> yeah!
 * didrocks can't wait to see it moved, and have applications snaps connecting to the theme snap
<Laney> hey duflu
<seb128> jibel, did you figure out something new/more about the screen reader? how much do you think it's a blocker knowing that live session has screen reading working (assuming someone that needs the reader can easily boot to it, which might be not true if the isolinux menu isn't accessible and there is no screnereading in maybe-ubiquity)
<jibel> seb128, nothing new yet. Without this, blind users cannot boot to the live session.
<seb128> it doesn't boot after a timeout?
<seb128> :/
<jibel> no
<jibel> ubiquity-dm waits forever
<seb128> I got sidetracked helped other work to land in the past days but I go back to screenreader in the afternoo
<seb128> one heavy hammer would be to make ubiquity-dm just start orca
<seb128> it's a bit more ram usage
<seb128> but it's not going to speak unless the gsettings is on
<seb128> then we just need to figure out why it's not outputting anything, but I think that might have to do with starting speech-dispatcher as well, I got it working the other day like that
<seb128> I try that again with a fresh boot in a bit
<seb128> my theory is that starting speech-dispatch and orca from ubiquity-dm is good
<jibel> seb128, I am not even sure the a11y menus in syslinux are still working. There is lot of code that rely on a11y-profile-manager
<seb128> as said it just creates a bit more memory usage, which is suboptimal but should be fine
<seb128> I didn't even know we had menus for a11y in syslinux
<jibel> I got it working by starting from a tty
<jibel> just an export display + launch orca
<seb128> what other features are missing/not working?
<seb128> weird, I did that the other day and it would speak anything
<seb128> I tried to -d and the log was empty
<jibel> seb128, braille, osk, ...
<jibel> but the most important is the screen reader IMHO
<seb128> a11y-profile-manager was added in recent cycles
<seb128> reverting those commits might not be too difficult
<seb128> I don't remember why I disacarded that previous cycle when I looked in N-Y
<seb128> I think that's because some of the old code was relying on indicators/unity anyway and we can't really go back to what it was doing
<seb128> anyway I'm confident we can fix the screen reader case at least
<jibel> me too
<seb128> osk should be easy, that's handled by the shell itself in 3.28
<seb128> so the keybinding for that should just work?
<didrocks> wayland session doesn't work properly anymore with communitheme, unsure what GNOME update broke it (it worked when I released it) :/
<seb128> :/
 * didrocks tests some theory
<didrocks> it's even worst, first login doesn't work, second does
<jibel> seb128, I confirm Orca is not started when selected from syslinux (or add access=v3 to the boot command line)
<didrocks> and XDG_DATA_DIRS are different between loginsâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, :/
<seb128> what's the difference?
<seb128> jibel, are those access= parameters documented somewhere?
<jibel> seb128, I don't know any place where it's documented. Just press F5 in the boot menu
<seb128> right
<jibel> otherwise it's in casper
<seb128> I'm going to review all those options while I'm at it I think
<jibel> there is a casper-bottom script for a11y
<seb128> thx for the pointer
<didrocks> seb128: ok, after some testing, it seems that in wayland, if you now set XDG_DATA_DIRS, it doesn't append the rest of the session anymore
<jibel> which uses the profile manager
<didrocks> but
<didrocks> on the second login, you have everything added
<didrocks> really weird :/
<seb128> :/
<seb128> didrocks, bug #1764355 seems a bit similar
<ubot5`> bug 1764355 in gnome-session (Ubuntu) "XDG_CONFIG_DIRS keeps getting expanded every login" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1764355
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I have repetitions as wellâ¦
<seb128> I saw it reported recently but didn't have time to investigate
<seb128> sounds like maybe something to investigate for release
<didrocks> need to bisect gnome-session maybe
<seb128> you are debugging it?
<didrocks> yeah, I think I own it now :p
<seb128> thx!
<didrocks> let's see first if I can find what/when it was working
 * didrocks starts with gnome-session
<Laney> gnome-session has a thing in /etc/profile.d to set up the XDG dirs
<seb128> blame it on doookooo :)
<didrocks> ah?
<seb128> I don't think our side of things changed much
<seb128> but I'm just guessing, not based on fact
<seb128> :p
<didrocks> yeah, let's starts with gnome-session
<didrocks> and see
<seb128> k, I don't think it makes sense to start debugging those installer/a11y issues to stop in the middle for lunch so I'm going to step out for errands/early lunch now and then sit down looking at thise issues once I'm back and have a solid debugging afternoon
<seb128> good luck didrocks
<didrocks> seb128: are you thinking of something else as you mention foundation?
<seb128> didrocks, no, just profile.d is a lower level afaik
<didrocks> it's coming from -common
<didrocks> at least, the xdg- one
<seb128> I don't mean the script, but profile.d handling by the system
<seb128> but no, I don't have real reasons to believe it's not our issue at this point
<seb128> I was half trolling
<didrocks> yeah, let's see :)
<seb128> could be systemd/bash/whatever handles those though
<didrocks> (only half- ;))
<seb128> good luck with the debugging :)
<seb128> (yeah ;)
<didrocks> thx!
<didrocks> if only we had days of isosâ¦
<mvo> kenvandine, seb128 hey, you guys asked for a stable core18, we did some work on this in hte last few days and we are pushing new versions into edge, if you could test with your snaps if this is all working we can promote to beta/candidate/stable
<didrocks> nope, reverting gnome-session isn't itâ¦
<didrocks> ah, better, now I constantly have login not working
<didrocks> ok, so confirming that first time in the session script, XDG_DATA_DIRS is empty
<didrocks> second time, it has /usr/shareâ¦
<didrocks> (before starting gnome-session)
<willcooke> mvo, thanks!  Ken mentioned yesterday that he had snaps built on it
<didrocks> (on wayland only)
<didrocks> so I guess the /etc/X11/Xsession.d hides that bug forus
<didrocks> for us*
<mvo> willcooke: do you know which snaps those are? I am writing a mail now too so that this does not get lost in irc but if you know I can test the new core18 with those right away
<didrocks> ah, 3rd login: XDG_DATA_DIRS empty again
<willcooke> mvo:
<willcooke> <kenvandine> i have a build of gnome-calculator that uses gnome-3-28-1804 and core18
<willcooke> <kenvandine> all working
<willcooke> that was yesterday at 1515 my time
<didrocks> seb128: Laney: do you know if we have anything lazying tearing down our session and maybe gdm picks it up?
<mvo> willcooke: ok, I try that one
<mvo> willcooke: thank you
<willcooke> mvo, looks like it's in edge
<willcooke> and beta
<willcooke> the edge one will be the CI build from last night
<mvo> willcooke: ta
<willcooke> ha, I was replying to a forum post about clicking and just as I was about to hit reply duflu beat me to it :)
<duflu> Heh.
 * duflu closes mail for the day
<willcooke> thx duflu
<willcooke> duflu, what's your reading on the feedback so far?  Seems that it's not worse, but there are still a few leaks, which we expected
<duflu> willcooke, yeah it's exactly as expected. Measurably better but we still need to get the other fixes as they land
<willcooke> hm, having said that, just rebooted my 18.04 box and it wont log in.  Prolly unrealted, will debug
<willcooke> and I cant get to a vty either. grrr
<duflu> willcooke, bug 1765261 ?
<ubot5`> bug 1765261 in gdm3 (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu 18.04 login screen rejects a valid password on first attempt. Always works on the second attempt" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1765261
<willcooke> duflu, hm, I think this is a different one.  It's just locked up now
<duflu> willcooke, hit Cancel?
<willcooke> I cant, mouse wont move
<willcooke> maybe I can ssh in
<didrocks> seb128: Laney: so, I think what happens in the "working" case is that the previous session isn't closed and envs are picked up from it
<didrocks> seb128: Laney: I did multiple tests, but noticed that if I logout/login right away, sometimes I am in the working state (old vars picked up), sometimes not.
<didrocks> with more testing, I noticed that if I wait for more than a minute, logged in, logout and log in again, I'm in a clean session (no older env vars picked up)
<didrocks> so, my bet is that the lazy loading of things, like gnome-software is the impact for delaying session close
<didrocks> and so, repeated env vars (picked up by old session) is due to that session not being closed yet (because you just logged off and in again after a short session)
<didrocks> so, this is one bug
<willcooke> duflu, killed gnome-shell & gdm and the mouse started responding again
<willcooke> and it logged in fine this time
<didrocks> the second one, which I'm looking, is why now the env vars don't complete anymore under wayland in the "no previous session case"
<willcooke> duflu, meh, probably just one of those things
<didrocks> maybe actually that never worked before in the wayland case and I always had a session hanging due to the first bug ^
<didrocks> (which seems the most likely)
<Laney> didrocks: you should be able to close a session and see what processes are still running
<Laney> e.g. loginctl session-status $session
<didrocks> Laney: well, you need to be logged in for this
<didrocks> so, need to create another user :p
<Laney> sure
<didrocks> I'll first take a lunch break, but I think this is the case
<didrocks> and regardless of that, XDG_CONFIG_DIRS shouldn't happen itself if already there, I'll modify this
<willcooke> enjoy your baguette didrocks ;P
<didrocks> willcooke: and *fromage*
<willcooke> lololol
<Laney> wish my monitor didn't stop sending audio when it DPMS powers off :(
<didrocks> we need at least fixing /etc/profile.d/apps-bin-path.sh and /etc/profile.d/xdg_dirs_desktop_session.sh
 * didrocks really goes now
<kenvandine[m][m]> mvo: I tested it with gnome-calculator and the new platform snap
<willcooke> morning kenvandine[m][m]
<kenvandine[m][m]> gnome-3-28-1804 is in edge but gnome-calculator is just a local build
<kenvandine[m][m]> willcooke: good morning
<seb128> hey kenvandinemm
<seb128> those [] are annoying to type :p
<seb128> Laney, thanks for upstreaming that udisks fix, I had that on my list for today ... sorry for being too slow, but I'm not going to complain about one less thing to do, you win a free beer :)
<Laney> seb128: it's OK, I just wanted to get that uploaded and liked to have that task squared off before then
<Laney> also you sounded like you wanted to be in orca mode :-)
<seb128> I do indeed, that's higher priority for the release
<seb128> so thanks :)
<Laney> the main reason for uploading is the volume-key thing
<seb128> right, I guessed, thanks for sorting that one as well!
<mwilson-e> didrocks: Hello, I work for Entroware, a computer manufacturer that ships Ubuntu machines and I was wondering if you would accept a change to the OEM collection section of ubuntu-report to /sys/class/dmi/id/sys_vendor from the chassis_vendor?  It seems like that would be more appropriate and this is how we set ours. I would appreciate any feedback you can give on this.
<seb128> seems like our release issues list is getting in shape
<mwilson-e> didrocks: Hello, I work for Entroware, a computer manufacturer that ships Ubuntu machines and I was wondering if you would accept a change to the OEM collection section of ubuntu-report to /sys/class/dmi/id/sys_vendor from the chassis_vendor.  It seems like that would be more appropriate and this is how we set ours. I would appreciate any feedback you can give on this.
<seb128> mwilson-e, hey, we saw what you posted, didrocks is currently away but he's probably going to reply to you once he's back which is probably in less than an hour
<seb128> just stay here for a bit if you can
<seb128> otherwise I suggest to retry later or email
<mwilson-e> seb128: Ah, my irc client messed up before so I had to reconnect and did not know if it sent. Cheers for letting me know.
<seb128> np
<mvo> kenvandine[m][m]: you tested and things are ok?
<kenvandine[m][m]> mvo: yesterday I did and it seemed ok
<kenvandine[m][m]> mvo: I can test the latest in a few minutes
<mvo> kenvandine[m][m]: yeah, please check hte latest version in edge of core18
<mvo> kenvandine[m][m]: but no rush
<didrocks> mwilson-e: hey! I referenced on https://wiki.debian.org/HowToIdentifyADevice/System, section "/sys" which list chassis_vendor, so I think more standard than sys_vendor
<didrocks> also, a lot of hw seems to only have chassis_* populated and not sys_*
<didrocks> for instance: https://natalian.org/2015/02/18/Archlinux_on_a_Lenovo_X1C3/
<didrocks> this is why I preferred that one over the other one
<didrocks> I wonder if we shouldn't do a try/catch (like if chassis_vendor is empty, try sys_vendor)
<didrocks> (note that most stack exchange answers list chassis_vendor)
<mwilson-e> didrocks: Would it be possible to do a try catch if sys_vendor is empty? Our chassis_vendor value is set to "Notebook" which is a default from our partners and used by multiple OEMs so this may be confusing.
<mwilson-e> We set the OEM values for System Information in the type 1 section which is referenced here in the SMBIOS spec
<mwilson-e> https://www.dmtf.org/sites/default/files/standards/documents/DSP0134_2.7.1.pdf
<mwilson-e> This is under section 7.2
<mwilson-e> and the type 1 manufacturer is mapped to sys_vendor
<mwilson-e> All this information can also be seen here together. `sudo dmidecode -t 1`
<didrocks> mwilson-e: ok, so you would be in favor of removing chassis_vendor and replacing it with sys_vendor, correct?
<mwilson-e> didrocks: Yeah, no problem. Ill sort that for you ASAP.
<didrocks> mwilson-e: oh, you are contributing the fix? Even better :)
<didrocks> ensure all tests still run :)
<didrocks> (and please, change struct field name thus)
<didrocks> mwilson-e: another note: final freeze is tonight, so if you want that to be included in the final iso, you will need to convince the release team on #ubuntu-release (and open a bug on launchpad about it)
<didrocks> mwilson-e: if you need help with the test side (there are filesystem mocks in testdata/), do not hesitate to ask
<didrocks> I'm using also golden files for generated json, so running the tests with -update to update them (and then, look that the diff is what you expect ;))
<didrocks> (also, is it the right time for me to request a powerful system machine to ensure that it works on it in the future to be shipped at home? or too soon? ;))
<mwilson-e> Would it be possble for you to make the change in order to get this fixed quicker? My experience is limited this process.
<didrocks> mwilson-e: so, do you mind opening the bug and talk to the release team?
<didrocks> bug on launchpad against ubuntu-report package please
<mwilson-e> Also if you need a system, just shoot me an email at mwilson @ entroware . com and I will see what I can do.
<mwilson-e> didrocks: will do, cheers.
<didrocks> mwilson-e: excellent! Please past the bug link here so that I can reference it
<mwilson-e> didrocks: the LP number is 1765400
<didrocks> mwilson-e: perfect, thanks! I'll keep you posted. The fix is building in Travis right now :)
<didrocks> then, I'll update the package
<mwilson-e> didrocks: Cheers. I really appreciate you taking the time to change this.
<didrocks> no worry, thanks for explaining and pointing to the spec (better than relying on some wiki and stackoverflow) :)
<kenvandine> mvo, sorry, the edge channel of gnome-calculator comes from upstream master which hasn't been updated yet for the new content interface
<kenvandine> i put it in the beta channel for now
<kenvandine> willcooke, mvo: https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/auto-connection-for-gnome-3-28-1804-content-interface/5043
<didrocks> kenvandine: does it has the theme plugs as well?
<kenvandine> didrocks, no, i'll add those seperately
<didrocks> or you onlly put the platform snap in the beta channel and not gnome-calculator yet?
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> think about the sound-theme as well!
<kenvandine> the platform is in stable
<didrocks> sound-themes* even IIRC
<kenvandine> didrocks, will do, gnome-calculator probably doesn't need the sound themes though
<didrocks> yep
 * kenvandine contemplates updating primary desktop to bionic
<mvo> kenvandine: cool, thank you
<kenvandine> mvo, it's great to see how small you got core18
<kenvandine> that's tiny
<mvo> kenvandine yeah, its cool. it will most likely grow a bit again when we make it bootable but hopefully not much
<oSoMoN> thanks didrocks for the endorsement!
<seb128> oSoMoN, congrats!
<didrocks> very well deserved oSoMoN :)
<willcooke> woot, well done oSoMoN
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, congrats!
<oSoMoN> thanks guys
<didrocks> tjaalton: hey! to fix bug #1764355, I will need to do a xorg upload, I was planning to build on tsimonq2's commit that was merged but not released 2 weeks ago, do you have time to review/merge mine: https://salsa.debian.org/xorg-team/xorg/merge_requests/3 ?
<ubot5`> bug 1764355 in gnome-session (Ubuntu) "Visual Studio Code, Slack and other electrons apps crash due to XDG_CONFIG_DIRS keeps getting expanded every login" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1764355
<ubot5-ng> X Strike Force bug (Merge request) 3 in xorg "Protect against multipleadditions of the same paths to XDG_CONFIG_DIRS" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<didrocks> tjaalton: and tested it in a vm and confirm the fix for XDG_DATA_DIRS on Xorg
<tjaalton> didrocks: sure
<didrocks> tjaalton: just pushed the same logic for xdg_data_dir and we are on par with my fixes on gnome-session
<didrocks> tjaalton: ah, too quick to review, you want another MR for XDG_DATA_DIR?
<tjaalton> ah, yes
<didrocks> tjaalton: https://salsa.debian.org/xorg-team/xorg/merge_requests/4
<ubot5-ng> X Strike Force bug (Merge request) 4 in xorg "Protect duplication in XDG_DATA_DIRS" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<didrocks> tjaalton: just did 10 logout/logins in a raw and with this Xorg fix + gnome-session one, no more duplication \o/
<tjaalton> cool
<didrocks> tjaalton: thanks for merging, should I upload or you will?
<tjaalton> i'll upload after this call
<didrocks> perfect, many thanks!
<tjaalton> np
<didrocks> gnome-session uploaded, that + xorg fix mainly bug #1764355. I still have snapd to fix in a similar way + communitheme snap to adapt now
<ubot5`> bug 1764355 in gnome-session (Ubuntu) "Visual Studio Code, Slack and other electrons apps crash due to XDG_CONFIG_DIRS keeps getting expanded every login" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1764355
<seb128> didrocks, good job!
<didrocks> seb128: good finding on that bug, I'm sure Jamie's crash he mentioned to me some days ago was due to this and not wayland nor communitheme nor snap related :p
<seb128> didrocks, what was the issue with the theme?
<didrocks> willcooke: FYI ^
<didrocks> well, there are basically 2 bugs
<didrocks> one is that the session isn't closing
<tseliot> Wimpress, mwilson-e: I managed to debug LP: #1764005. I hope to upload the fix by tomorrow.
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1764005 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-390 (Ubuntu) "Black-screen on boot with nvidia 390 for Budgie, MATE, Xubuntu, Kubuntu" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1764005
<didrocks> but when it's closed, XDG_DATA_DIRS with communitheme doesn't include defaults
<didrocks> (it works with the Xorg scripts which unconditionally adds the path, not the wayland case)
<seb128> ah, so that never worked/wasn't a regression?
<didrocks> so log in first, get the paths added, logout and login again in wayland works
<didrocks> well, that's tricky, the fundamental issue is that we don't shut down the session completely
<didrocks> this still needs to be debug (but anyway, those protections are needed)
<didrocks> so I fix the urgent part
<Wimpress> tseliot: Nice! I'll test when it's available.
<didrocks> but in testing, you are generally logged in, you logout and login again
<didrocks> so I didn't see the issue in the wayland case :p
<tseliot> Wimpress: great, thanks
<willcooke> didrocks, \m/
<willcooke> great work
<didrocks> still needs to have snapd with a similar fix
<seb128> right
<didrocks> (their duplication detection assumes snap* is always the last element of the stringâ¦)
<didrocks> and so, communitheme, as I changed XDG_DATA_DIRS while starting gnome-session
<didrocks> on Xorg -> Xsession.d -> my script changing XDG_DATA_DIRS -> gnome-session, OK
<didrocks> on Wayland -> my script changing XDG_DATA_DIRS -> gnome-session -> profiles.d seeing "oh XDG_DATA_DIRS is already set, do nothing" -> KO
<didrocks> the snap part is easy to fix :)
<didrocks> for snapd, we'll see
<didrocks> then, we can have a look at what process hangs the session
<seb128> right
<didrocks> I bet it's the delayed gnome-software scan
<didrocks> (which would be way we never saw that corner case before bionic)
<didrocks> why*
<willcooke> didrocks, do you think that is in any way realted to: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1505409
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1505409 in GNOME Shell "gnome-shell crashed with SIGTRAP in x_io_error() from _XIOError() from _XEventsQueued() from XPending() from gdk_check_xpending() ["Connection to xwayland lost"]" [Critical,Confirmed]
<didrocks> willcooke: I don't think, gnome-session wouldn't even start
<didrocks> oupss
<didrocks> gnome-shell wouldn't even start, I meant
<didrocks> (like, not even trying)
<seb128> did we delay gnome-software?
<seb128> I though we didn't
<seb128> or is that an upstream change?
<didrocks> oh, I thought we did? I based that on conversations here
<didrocks> I thought it was the general agreement
<didrocks> ok, so don't know at all what hangs the session before we look into it
<seb128> Laney oppposed it from what I followed
<didrocks> ok, I missed it
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1756379
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1756379 in gnome-software (Ubuntu Bionic) "Delay start of gnome-software service" [Medium,Triaged]
<seb128> not closed
<Laney> I don't think that would make complete sense anyway
<Laney> xdg-started stuff is started by gnome-session
<seb128> kenvandine, willcooke, ^ that's a milestone bug assigned to robert, I guess he didn't did status update for those in his summary and we didn't think about checking/nagging the people who sent summaries
<Laney> and this closes when the session closes
<seb128> right, anyway that's easy to investigate when things will be less crazy later
<didrocks> mvo: hey, this is your side of the fix for duplication env variable: https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/5075 :)
<ubot5-ng> snapcore bug (Pull request) 5075 in snapd "snap/env: fix env duplication logic" (comments: 0) [Open]
<mvo> didrocks: thank you! how urgent is this? omg important for the release?
<didrocks> mvo: not urgent on that part, it's not like the other env variables which makes electron apps crashing after multiple logout/login :)
<didrocks> mvo: as long as it's in the next release and SRUed, it's all good :)
<seb128> jibel, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/ubiquity-screen-reader.patch makes the screenreader work/start with ctrl-S
<jibel> seb128, what's the difference with the patch you posted this morning?
<seb128> jibel, refresh
<seb128> jibel, but basically I went to the old codebase, making ubiquity handle the keybinding rather than trying to make it react to gsettings
<mvo> didrocks: yeah, that should be fine
<jibel> seb128, yes, it makes sense. Do you understand why the signal approach does not work?
<seb128> no :/
<seb128> the dbus environment is correct
<seb128> I don't know how to debug that further
<jibel> and the signal propagates over the bus, and everything is talking over the same bus
<jibel> it just doesn't really make sense that the callback is not called
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> Laney said it was be some dbus checks on uid/context
<seb128> but I don't know how to debug that
<seb128> anyway the old code works, so we can go back to that
<seb128> I just need to tweak/unset the GNOME keybinding so they don't conflict
<seb128> and I'm going to look if there are other a11y things easy to restore/fix which are not working since the indicator changes
<seb128> so I'm going to merge request that tomorrow morning
<Laney> don't you want to do this from ubiquity-dm if it's only for this part?
<seb128> you mean "this"?
<Laney> that change
<Laney> start orca or whatever
<seb128> well, I went the easy way
<seb128> went back to the code that existed in trusty and worked
<seb128> undoing the a11y-indicator thing from Luke
<seb128> I guess that could be done in ubiquity-dm, it's just new code to write so more work
<Laney> ok, I thought you said that screen reading works in the normal live session
<seb128> it does
<seb128> but it would work as well if ubiquity was handling the keybinding
<seb128> but yeah, I guess I can add the key listener to ubiquity-dm and see if that works
<Laney> if you have to mess with keybindings it might have an impact on the rest of the session
<seb128> true
<seb128> well it's easy enough to add that code to -dm and see how it goes
<seb128> I need to go and pick the kid but I try that a bit later
<seb128> Laney, thanks for the input :)
<Laney> no worries, good luck!
<seb128> thx
<willcooke> andyrock, hey!  Was the g-i-s livepatch supposed to sign you in to snapd as well?
<willcooke> or were we waiting for a g-o-a integration from snapd?
<GunnarHj> sil2100: Looks like the langpack export was successful. Your ball now. :)
<sil2100> GunnarHj: I already poked new langpacks and the uploads have been made like some 30 mins ago
<GunnarHj> sil2100: Ah, great. I didn't even look. ;)
<sil2100> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/bionic/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text= <- they're in the queue, let me approve ;)
 * sil2100 is mass-approving
<sil2100> GunnarHj: ok, all langpacks approved from the bionic queue, they should start building soon
<GunnarHj> sil2100: Thanks. Will check it out later.
<GunnarHj> Btw, you will request an extra delta export, right? Asking because I just said so in a comment at bug #1765440.
<ubot5`> bug 1765440 in Ubuntu Translations "Translation missing for GNOME Calculator" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1765440
<sil2100> GunnarHj: by extra you mean before final release?
<willcooke> thanks a lot GunnarHj sil2100
<sil2100> Or should I request a delta export now?
<sil2100> (I think we're still not in translation freeze, right?)
<GunnarHj> sil2100: Yes, before release. (Translation freeze happens in 4.5 hours.) Unsure about the most suitable time to do it. Think Martin used to do it around Monday before release.
<GunnarHj> np willcooke
<GunnarHj> sil2100: It may be important to change "Language pack base" at https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/bionic/+language-packs before that export.
<sil2100> Ok, yeah, I'll try to remember it
<sil2100> I guess I'll switch it now that the new base-packs are uploaded
<willcooke> night gang
<oSoMoN> good night
<teeramisu> xorg.conf missing under 18.04 is it known issue or something changed about xorg.conf?
<tjaalton> teeramisu: there hasn't been one by default since 8.04 or so
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-04-20
<Trevinho> c-lobrano: hey, about the pngs, how did you generate those?
<Trevinho> duflu: hey, could you review some theme MPs I've?
<Trevinho> otherwise I'm self-approving as they're there since some time xD
<duflu> Trevinho, I'll try to have a look today
<Trevinho> hey btw :)
<duflu> Trevinho, btw if you're marking bugs Fix Released then it's best to include the changelog entry showing where it's fixed. Or a comment mentioning where
<Trevinho> duflu: for some of them they where already mentioned (I closed the upstream bug only)
<Trevinho> while for one I didn't really know when xD
<Trevinho> duflu: as for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-themes/+bug/1762465 I should only change the code involving selection and mouse hover, right?
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1762465 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "Nautilus sidebar theming is confusing" [Medium,Confirmed]
<duflu> Trevinho, not mouse hover. I think the goal is to make the label backgrounds always match the icon backgrounds
<duflu> Because they look like tabs
<duflu> which is incorrect
<Trevinho> mh, I think is too late for such change. it might break screenshots or such
<Trevinho> I'm fine with changing the hover effect, but that was approved by design
<duflu> Trevinho, yeah I understand
<Trevinho> I'll revisit it a bit, but not everything probably
<duflu> I know it's too late to change 18.04, but suspect we'll hear a few duplicate bug reports after release so think about it for 18.10
<duflu> Trevinho, heh. I noticed bionic felt smoother... didn't know you got the master clock change in
<tjaalton> is it a known bug where some gtk windows seem as somewhat transparent, and when they're moved the contents get messy
<tjaalton> gedit for one
<tjaalton> I just upgraded and rebooted, thought this would've been fixed but no
<tjaalton> hm, doesn't happen on my laptop
<tjaalton> huh, it's some user setting messing things up
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> Good morning
<jibel> salut didrocks
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppesr
<oSoMoN> desktoppers*
<oSoMoN> and happy Friday!
<didrocks> hey jibel, oSoMoN!
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, jib
<oSoMoN> jibel*
<oSoMoN> slow fingers todayâ¦
<duflu> tjaalton, yeah Saviq reported that bug. Lemme find it
<duflu> tjaalton, bug 1760818
<ubot5`> bug 1760818 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "gedit and gnome-calculator transparency/graphics corruption issue" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1760818
<tjaalton> ooh, thanks
<duflu> Morning didrocks, jibel, oSoMoN
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<jibel> During the 1st run wizard I tried to setup livepatch but I couldn't authenticate. It kept asking for the 2nd factor. Is it a known issue?
<seb128> not reported on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-initial-setup/+bugs at least
<seb128> and andyrock is off today
<seb128> if that helps to feel better about the issue only canonical accounts are configured to use 2fa so it's not going to hit "normal users"
<seb128> but the code is supposed to handle the 2fa, unsure why it doesn't work for you
<jibel> and the only message is a successful authentication
<jibel> didrocks, where do you store the telemetry data?
<seb128> :/
<seb128> is there anything interesting in the journal? warnings/errors?
<jibel> no
<jibel> didrocks, I've this message for my gpu "couldn't get GPU info: couldn't find any line matching ^.* 0300: (.*) \\(rev .*\\)$"
<didrocks> jibel: ~/.cache/ubuntu-report/ubuntu.18.04
<didrocks> if it's ignore, you shouldn't have the field
<didrocks> the question is what is your lspci -n output?
<c-lobrano> Trevinho: hi :), no I didn't generate the .pngs, Mads did that, but I said it won't probably been able to generate the svg from there :(
<c-lobrano> and, good morning to all :)
<didrocks> hey c-lobrano!
<c-lobrano> hi didrocks :)
<jibel> didrocks, I filed bug 1765614
<ubot5`> bug 1765614 in ubuntu-report (Ubuntu) "Incorrect regex for GPU info" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1765614
<didrocks> jibel: ah perfect! I guess that will wait for a SRU, correct?
<didrocks> I'll add a test case for this in the tests as well
<jibel> didrocks, sure it can wait
<didrocks> jibel: thanks for debugging!
<duflu> Morning seb128
<seb128> Hey duflu, how are you?
<seb128> I spent more time on ubiquity and understand things even less :/
<seb128> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-installer/ubiquity/trunk/view/head:/ubiquity/frontend/gtk_ui.py#L736
<seb128> the gtk frontend does set some gsettings using the python bindings
<duflu> seb128, I'm not feeling great today, but I think I am making some real progress on totem performance. Only a day after I said I was giving up
<duflu> You seb128?
<seb128> duflu, I'm tired, stayed up too late looking at ubiquity :/
<seb128> the frontend does gsettings call to disable e.g screensaver or power management from gsd
<seb128> but the code is root
<seb128> and those services are user ones
<seb128> so I don't understand how that can work
<didrocks> seb128: check for the euid to get under what user this part of code is running: print(os.geteuid())
<seb128> also if I gsettings get they seem to have the correct value
<didrocks> as ubiquity is doing a lot of raise/drop priviledges
<seb128> but like I use the session 15s/try activate the screen reader
<seb128> and they all are back to the default value
<seb128> not the ones set from ubiquity
<didrocks> hum
<didrocks> are they delayed keys by any chance?
<seb128> delayed?
<didrocks> (and not committed for any reason?)
<didrocks> seb128: https://developer.gnome.org/gio/stable/GSettings.html#g-settings-delay
<seb128> there is no mention of "delay" in the file
<seb128> didrocks, code is like https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-installer/ubiquity/trunk/view/head:/ubiquity/frontend/gtk_ui.py#L589
<seb128> I also don't understand why those previous/etc checks
<seb128> if the function is disable why not just set to false?
<didrocks> yeah, this looks cryptic :/
<didrocks> can you attach some dbus monitor, or maybe a shell watching for the key?
<didrocks> to see when it's set/unset
<seb128> yeah, I can try
<seb128> that diff http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/fMSsYjYWDv/ is
<seb128> - boot in installer mode
<seb128> - go to a vt
<seb128> - gsettings list-recursively > boot
<seb128> - go back to vt1/ubiquity
<seb128> - super,alt,s to try to activate the screen reader
<seb128> - back to vt, gsettings list-recursively > screen
<seb128> diff the 2 files
<didrocks> so, all keys are set to what you expect, correct?
<didrocks> shortcuts, toolkit-accessibility to trueâ¦
<seb128> well it's resetting all the changes ubiquity is doing
<jibel> org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.media-keys screenreader should still be ''
<jibel> it's disabled explicitly in ubiquity
<jibel> same for the terminal
<seb128> well, that's what that diff is
<seb128> all the things ubiquity set are reverted to their default
<jibel> yeah, is gnome-shell resetting the keys somehow?
<didrocks> ahhhhhhhh, got you know
<didrocks> now*
<jibel> seb128, at the end of run in bin/ubiquity-dm there is this
<jibel>             for gs_schema, gs_key, gs_value in gsettings_keys:
<jibel>                 subprocess.call(
<jibel>                     ['gsettings', 'reset', gs_schema, gs_key],
<seb128> that's after the greeter exit though
<jibel> the other reset is in unset() of gsettings.py but it is never called
<Nafallo> morning
<seb128> jibel, didrocks, it's not ubiquity, in fact those get reset on first gsettings write
<seb128> I did a gsettings set of the screen-reader key manually
<seb128> and everything did reset
<didrocks> hey Nafallo
<didrocks> humâ¦ this is weird
<didrocks> so
<didrocks> better doing your gsettings set manually
<seb128> hey Nafallo
<didrocks> you should maybe try a dconf dump?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> I tried to strings ~/.config/dconf/user
<seb128> the changes are in the db
<didrocks> similar :)
<didrocks> in the db before being reverted?
<seb128> at least it references the keys that are modified
<seb128> yes
<didrocks> even more surprisingâ¦
<seb128> I though that maybe it has in memory status not commited on disk or something
<seb128> but no :/
<didrocks> yeah, exactlyâ¦
<didrocks> hence my question on dconf dump
<didrocks> brrrr
<seb128> also there are 2 dconf-service active for the user with different dbus session address
<seb128> but I tried to kill the 2 and it's not making a difference
<didrocks> can you try gsettings set on something completely unrelated to GNOME?
<didrocks> like a key for one of our service
<didrocks> to see if that still reverts
<seb128> let me see
<didrocks> can be something listening on GNOME schemas and reverting on any :change
<willcooke> morning all
<willcooke> how is it Friday already?
<seb128> hey willcooke
<seb128> puzzling friday it is
<seb128> trying to understand the ubiquity ways
<willcooke> jibel, have you test UEFI installs recently?
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<Nafallo> hi willcooke
<willcooke> jibel, ignore, this laptop is in UEFI mode, and works fine
<seb128> didrocks, it's any key, I tried settings com.ubuntu.update-notifier something
<seb128> didrocks, it doesn't revert if I kill dconf-service :/
<seb128> and let a new one be spawned
<didrocks> well, that makes sense at least
<Laney> moin
<didrocks> you have the two trying to write, and one with the old memory mapping
<didrocks> hey Laney
<didrocks> so, the question is why 2 are launched I guess
<teeramisu> Hello, 12 days ago I created Bug 1762200, nobody answered yet. I think it's important before final release. can you take a look at this?
<ubot5`> bug 1762200 in xorg (Ubuntu) "[xorg.conf missing]nvidia detects 2 screen but there is no 2 screen" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1762200
<didrocks> or do you only have an old one? You told that 2 were running, but that was maybe after you set the key already?
<didrocks> (so maybe 2 session bus or address?)
<seb128> it doesn't make sense
<didrocks> seb128: why? my guess is that:
<seb128> the second one from the env is a sudo process on a gsettings set command to set volumes-visible
<seb128> I guess the ubiquity code is just fucked
<seb128> it try to do set with the wrong context
<seb128> already in the existant code
<didrocks> seb128: look at /proc/$pid/environ for the 2 dconf process
<seb128> I did
<didrocks> to see what env is incorrect and why a second is spawn
<didrocks> same?
<seb128> no, what I just wrote
<seb128> there is the normal one
<seb128> and one resulting from a sudo gsettings set on that nautilus key
<didrocks> but env variables are exactly the same in the 2?
<didrocks> (which was my question)
<seb128> no, the normal has the right address
<seb128> the run/uid from the user
<seb128> the other one has a random long checksum
<seb128> let me pastebin those
<didrocks> yeah, have you tried to simply remove the code where ubiquity spawn that second process? (from line 406 in bin/ubiquity-dm)
<seb128> http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/bNQRS6MMmt/
<seb128> vs
<seb128> http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/rY8Tyk89St/
<seb128> SUDO_COMMAND=/usr/bin/gsettings set org.gnome.nautilus.desktop volumes-visible false
<seb128> DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS=unix:abstract=/tmp/dbus-B1qg1YXAql,guid=24adb17fe5a37f790451a8405ad99f91
<didrocks> indeed, different session bus
<didrocks> yeah, so I think what happens:
<didrocks> - gsettings from ubiquity contact one of the 2, it writes the settings -> ok
<seb128> good idea for the ubiquity-dm dconf spawn
<didrocks> - something else set a key outside, contact the first one -> it doesn't have the new key -> write what he has in memory
<seb128> right
<jibel> willcooke, morning, yes on a real laptop and it worked why?
<seb128> the second one shouldn't exist
<didrocks> I'm worrying that actually ubiquity-dm is trying to only contact dconf-write on this "private bus"
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> but worth a try
<jibel> willcooke, the only thing that doesn't work is users installing in bios mode on uefi hardware
<seb128> the only code that writes that key is https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-installer/ubiquity/trunk/view/head:/ubiquity/frontend/gtk_ui.py#L636
<jibel> well, "only" ...
<didrocks> seb128: oh, it seems ubiquity tries to reuse the session bus
<didrocks> so, it's weird it's setting a new one
<seb128> didrocks, I'm going to check some uid checks as well, thanks for the help, I'm coming back once I get a bit more debug info/context
<didrocks> do you have the process hanging around?
<seb128> no, I just closed, I need to reboot
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, just try to check ubiquity proc environ
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> next time :)
<seb128> I'm going to add debug prints and restart
<didrocks> line 398 FYI
<Laney> this sounds like fun
<seb128> thx
<seb128> Laney, it is :p
<seb128> k, on that note I'm moving back to my desk, no point starting a new debug session from here and my battery is almost empty
<seb128> be back in 10 min or so
<willcooke> jibel, I saw someone on the hub saying it was broken, but in my testing it wasn't.  What's the use case for bios mode on UEFI?  Is that something people actually need to do, or are they holding it wrong?
<jibel> willcooke, they don't need to and there is a warning when they try to do so but if they continue grub installation fails
<willcooke> jibel, not a release blocker then?
<jibel> willcooke, IIRC there is a bug report to completely block this path because it cannot work
<jibel> willcooke, no
<willcooke> jibel, thx
<juliank> who fixed google calendar online account integration? thanks for that. it's so useful to see my meetings again in shell :)
<jibel> willcooke, this post https://community.ubuntu.com/t/grub-efi-amd64-signed-failed-to-install/5274 ?
<jibel> there is not much info
<jibel> I'll check anyway to make sure nothing broke
<willcooke> jibel, yeah that's the one.  It's fine, I just tested it, it worked
<willcooke> it = normal install on UEFI
<seb128> back
<GunnarHj> Good morning all!
<seb128> hey GunnarHj
<seb128> how are you?
<GunnarHj> A question, since I'd like to understand: The seeded snaps, are they on the ISO?
<seb128> yes
<Laney> seb128: have you seen that misc.py only looks at PKEXEC_UID and gsettings.py only looks at SUDO_USER?
<Laney> hey GunnarHj
<didrocks> hey GunnarHj
<GunnarHj> seb128: The purpose is not ISO space optimizing, I suppose. ;)
<seb128> GunnarHj, no, it's to get on with modern technologies
<seb128> Laney, no, I didn't, in fact I didn't notice before now that gsettings.py was changing user/using sudo, that explains things
<Laney> that part seems unusual to say the least
<Laney> I'd think that dropping privs alone should be enough
<seb128> yeah
<Laney> but misc.py needs to use SUDO_UID too otherwise it doesn't work from the live session
<Laney> that desktop file uses sudo not pkexec
<Laney> well or change that part I guess
<juliank> Is it intentional that gnome-initial-setup runs after initial install and relogin?
<seb128> I wonder if we could just        misc.drop_privileges_save() and use the gsettings binding rather than the wrapper?
<seb128> juliank, what do you mean "and relogin"?
<juliank> seb128: Installed upgrades, logged out, and back in again.
<seb128> you go in 2 sessions in a row?
<seb128> got it*
<juliank> Ran through gnome-initial-setup, it picked up my current keymap and deleted the others.
<juliank> apart from that it did not seem harmful
<Laney> seb128: probably apart from keeping the API
<Laney> like this one lets you just try setting keys on schemas that aren't installed
<Laney> gsettings is a bit opinionated about you trying that :-)
<seb128> haha
<seb128> juliank, you had a screen about locale/keyboard?
<didrocks> "a bit"
<seb128> juliank, what session do you use?
<GunnarHj> juliank: Thought that the keymap part of gnome-initial-setup was hidden.
<jibel> I didn't see any locale/keyboard page when I upgraded this morning
<seb128> they are not displayed in Ubuntu sessions
<seb128> but maybe juliank is using a GNOME session
<juliank> oh yes I am
<Laney> are we supposed to show g-i-s there?
 * juliank thinks it makes sense on first install, but not on upgrades
<seb128> robert didn't change the behaviour for !Ubuntu
<seb128> well, even on first install
<seb128> I guess it could be called upstream experience :p
<juliank> well upgrades would be fine too if it did not delete additional keymaps
<Laney> it needs integrating with the upstream install experience then
<seb128> I don't have really an opinion on that, out of that fact that it duplicates ubiquity questions
<Laney> I have an opinion that it shouldn't be run
<seb128> sounds fair enough
<seb128> we need to fix that then
<GunnarHj> Laney, seb128: Selecting language from g-i-s won't reasonably not work well, if the code hasn't been tweaked similar to g-c-c.
<Laney> now you have to break the upstream g-i-s experience :/
<seb128> well we don't have the installer side so it's broken anyway on Ubuntu
<Laney> If someone's using our g-i-s package
<jibel> sil2100, kbd pre-selection is fixed on today's iso. Thanks!
<seb128> Laney, you mean?
<Laney> We remove the desktop file or whatever
<seb128> it is in any case, it duplicates ubiquity questions
<Laney> Some derivative that is using g-i-s gets that update
<Laney> oh look, their gis is now broken
<didrocks> as we have per-session XDG_CONFIG_DIRS, we can maybe ship the autostart there? (but it means, shipping for xorg, wayland, communitheme xorg, communitheme wayland)
<Laney> it's about turning it off for other sessions though
<Laney> Basically it's taking a package which was working if you wanted to use it and making it not work
<Laney> Can't see another way though
<seb128> well, hypotetical derivative needs an override then, that's part of being a derivate to need to adapt
<seb128> for what it's worth I don't know of any using it atm
<seb128> so I don't think it's a big deal
<Laney> ok, Ubuntu archive Ubuntu packages to do whatever we want with
<seb128> for what it's worth I don't think it is/was in a working state
<seb128> as GunnarHj said that needs at least to be made to work with how we do translations
<seb128> anyway, I agree it's suboptimal
<seb128> and wrong in theory
<seb128> I'm just saying that in practice it shouldn't be a disaster
<Laney> juliank: would you mind filing a bug please?
<Laney> I'll probably get this too if I restart but I didn't yet
<seb128> Laney, so going back to ubiquity, I'm a bit lost
<Laney> sure
<seb128> Laney, you think that gsettings.py is doing something wrong with SUDO handling?
<Laney> In the ubiquity-dm session as far as I know ubiquity is started via pkexec
<Laney> in the *live* session it is started by sudo
<Laney> you get PKEXEC_* variables in the first case and SUDO_* ones in the second
<Laney> which tell you which user you came from
<Laney> that's what ubiquity is using to know who to drop back down to
<seb128> I'm in ubiquity-only and I dump the env from gtk_ui.py around the gsettings calls to disable screensaver
<Laney> but the code is checking different ones in different places
<seb128> and the env has SUDO_USER=ubuntu
<seb128> and no PK env
<Laney> so if it's using SUDO then the misc.drop_all_privileges thing doesn't work
<seb128> it doesn't make sense why it's not creating issues in other places if that's the case :/
<juliank> Laney: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-initial-setup/+bug/1765644
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1765644 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu) "After install, runs in gnome session after logging in again, deletes alternate keymaps" [Undecided,New]
<juliank> the title is too long
<Laney> thx
<juliank> I must say I liked the experience of g-i-s
<seb128> Laney, http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/vn4tKc9S73/ is a print(os.environ) after         self.disable_screen_reader() in gtk_ui.py
<juliank> apart from that thing
<seb128> juliank, we don't intend to use it
<juliank> it looked nice
<juliank> :)
<seb128> at least not this cycle
<seb128> we built on it for the ubuntu welcome wizard in ubuntu session
<seb128> we are going to look at include some of the upstream screens next though
<seb128> like online accounts config
<juliank> that one seemed actually useful
<juliank> keyboard setting not so much :)
<juliank> though just having a Welcome screen is kind of nice too :)
<seb128> Laney, oh, there is a PKEXEC_UID as well which I didn't notice earlier, I guess pkexec just set SUDO_USER as well
<seb128> k, I think I'm going to do the same as yesterday, early lunch and then I try to rip off that sudo use see if it's really needed
<Laney> alright
<Laney> how do you get a tty from the only ubiquity sessions?
<Laney> thought that was fixed
<seb128> it is
<Laney> oh yeah
<seb128> I can switch to a vt using the normal ctrl-alt-fn
<Laney> it just takes like 10 seconds
<seb128> right
<Laney> seb128: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/TBPv8pD254/ that's what I can see from /proc/ubi/environ
<jibel> bug 1765651 should probably be fixed for the release ?
<ubot5`> bug 1765651 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu) "Do not run gnome-initial-setup during OEM preparation stage" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1765651
<Laney> probably fixing julian_k's would fix that too
<Laney> IMHO they could be nominated / assigned but it's not really up to me :-)
<jibel> seb128, willcooke ^^ WDYT?
<jibel> didrocks, I think telemetry data should include information about OEM installation and the end user setup. For example if I do an OEM install in English and the end user setup in French, it just tells me the installation is in english not the settings selected by the end user.
<willcooke> jibel, yeah, sounds sensible
<tseliot> Wimpress, mwilson-e: can you test the new nvidia-prime, please? (when it's built) https://launchpad.net/~albertomilone/+archive/ubuntu/deleteme-nvidia
<mwilson-e> tseliot: Will do.
<tseliot> thanks
<mwilson-e> tseliot: Tested on 1 unit so far with MATE and it works. :D
<tseliot> mwilson-e: that's good. I can't reproduce the problem here either with the new package
<tseliot> I suppose all the other Ubuntu flavours use lightdm, that's why it was failing
<Wimpress> tseliot: Sure thing.
<tseliot> thanks
<Wimpress> tseliot: I'm encountering some issues here.
<Wimpress> I've purged all *nivia* paackages from the system.
<Wimpress> *nvidia packages
<Wimpress> Which also mean nvidia-prime is not installed. But your testing ppa is enabled.
<Wimpress> Ah, found the issue.
<Wimpress> I still had the graphics-drivers PPA enabled.
<tseliot> Wimpress: issues with nvidia-prime?
<Wimpress> I'm retesting again now.
<Wimpress> I purge all nvidia packages, which means nvidia-prime is not installed and rebooted.
<Wimpress> Install nvidia 390 drivers via Additional Drivers UI. Rebooted.
<Wimpress> The display manager still works, but nvidia-prime was not installed and libnvidia-compute-390:i386 is a broken package.
<tseliot> did you purge libnvidia-compute-390:i386 manually before reinstalling?
<Wimpress> Yep
<tseliot> neither ginggs nor I managed to reproduce that
<tseliot> maybe try reinstalling libnvidia-compute-390:i386
<Wimpress> I'm going to test again and make sure no cached packages exist.
<didrocks> jibel: good point! g-i-s is runing after the OEM welcome user session, correct?
<didrocks> jibel: so, using the current user language can be an option, no?
<didrocks> (current == session)
<didrocks> the location isn't an issue I guess as we are taking the user's session one
<jibel> didrocks, yes it does. current user settings would work
<jibel> didrocks, I reported bug 1765672
<ubot5`> bug 1765672 in ubuntu-report (Ubuntu) "Add information about OEM installation and end user setup" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1765672
<seb128> jibel, Laney, robert_ancell is off next week so better not count on him to fix those issues before release
<ricotz> hey desktopers
<seb128> hey ricotz
<ricotz> is someone able to test a firefox package on s390x?
<ricotz> seb128, hey
<seb128> ricotz, try asking xnox maybe
<seb128> Laney, right, your pastebin env is similar to the one I pastebined a bit earlier
<Laney> wb seb128
<Laney> yes no SUDO stuff there
<seb128> thx
<seb128> oh, that's a difference
<ricotz> xnox, hi, would you like to test a firefox 60 beta build for s390x? available in https://launchpad.net/%7Emozillateam/+archive/ubuntu/firefox-next
<seb128> Laney, http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/vn4tKc9S73/ was mine from the gtk_ui code with a print(os.environ)
<seb128> that has PKEXEC_UID but also SUDO_USER
<didrocks> jibel: many thanks! I'll move them to github as a reminder and this starts to build a list for the first update :)
<didrocks> jibel: so, just to sum up, TZ shouldn't be an issue, correct? Only language
<didrocks> (you used TZ as well in the bug report)
<jibel> didrocks, TZ too. The end user selects his own TZ
<jibel> didrocks, and maybe screen resolution too
<didrocks> jibel: well, TZ and screen resolutions are taken during the session
<didrocks> so it's already the end user selection if g-i-s runs after oem-setup second stage
<didrocks> The only part which are OEM (taken from the install) is what is under the "Install" section
<jibel> didrocks, it's fine then
<didrocks> Install has Media, Type, PartitionMethod, DownloadUpdates, Language, Minimal, RestrictiedAddons,Stages
<didrocks> I think only Language should be moved out to session, indeed
<jibel> right, looking at the data file, only the language
<didrocks> (I guess we can even remove it from ubiquity in the long term)
<didrocks> yep, thanks for confirming!
<jbicha> juliank: yes, it's intentional that gnome-initial-setup runs for upgraders who have never run it before. Ubuntu GNOME included g-i-s in 17.04 & vanilla-gnome-desktop still pulls it in
<juliank> jbicha: well you want to talk to Laney then so he does not disable it?
<juliank> or somebody else
<jbicha> juliank: do you want to file a bug upstream about your particular issue (the keymap thing not that it runs on upgrades)
<juliank> yes I can do that in an hour or so
 * juliank goes on lunch walk
<jibel> if I want to restart the wizard what do I reset?
<jbicha> juliank: hmm, Fedora 28 doesn't show the keyboard page for existing users, we could possibly do that too but we'd have to take their patch and rewrite our vendor.conf
<jbicha> jibel:    rm ~/.config/gnome-initial-setup-done
<jbicha> (g-i-s-done is an empty file)
<jibel> jbicha, thanks
<jbicha> it won't ask you about livepatch if you've already configured that
<jibel> I cannot configure it anyway. It fails on 2FA
<jbicha> oSoMoN: congratulations ð
<didrocks> worth checking livepatch is set immediately
<didrocks> so that the report reports the enablement status :)
<didrocks> I thought we want as well to show the report on upgrade, having a non versioned g-i-s-done stamp file will need to be revisited
<jbicha> didrocks: oh if we want to ensure it runs for upgraders, even for those who installed g-i-s before (like those upgrading from UG 17.04), maybe we need to adjust that stamp file name *now*
<didrocks> jbicha: oh correctâ¦
<didrocks> well, it's for .1 maybe at this stage
<didrocks> but still worth considering
<jbicha> it might be awkward to actually fix that for .1 â¦
<didrocks> willcooke: seb128: thoughts? ^
<seb128> I don't think many users installed g-i-s
<jbicha> currently implementation is just an empty file ~/.config/gnome-initial-setup-done so it doesn't tell you what GNOME or Ubuntu version was used
<seb128> so I don't think it matters much
<didrocks> jbicha: was it installed by default on UB?
<didrocks> UG*
<seb128> I don't think many people installed UG
<seb128> and those likely want to use a GNOME session not an Ubuntu one
<didrocks> ok, so not having them ~ not important
<seb128> and the wizard is not displayed there
<jbicha> didrocks: just for 17.04; it wasn't even pacakged for xenial
<didrocks> seb128: +1
<didrocks> ok, so sounds we can keep it like that
<seb128> wfm
<didrocks> and then, for next cycle, let's put the version in the file
<didrocks> (instead of piling up a lot of empty timestamp files)
<Laney> you won't be able to use the AutostartCondition then
<didrocks> we can even have different behaviors between "was it already displayed before on a previous release or not?"
<didrocks> correct
<didrocks> you feel piling empty files are better thus?
<didrocks> don't really like it, but yeah, AutostartCondition worths itâ¦
<Laney> why piling?
<Laney> clean up the old ones
<didrocks> shared home between install? :p
<didrocks> otherwise, you will keep flip-flap
<didrocks> (I know, something people shouldn't do)
<Laney> come on
<Laney> most applications don't have forwards compatibility in their databases
<didrocks> we can give it a try and see if we have angry feedbacks ;)
<jibel> didrocks, bug 1765693
<ubot5`> bug 1765693 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "[telemetry] Record OEM installation mode" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1765693
<didrocks> jibel: thanks! :)
<didrocks> waow, you even list the debconf key
<didrocks> royal bug report! :)
 * didrocks feels like upgraded to 1st class now
<oSoMoN> thanks jbicha
<juliank> jbicha: that sounds good to me
<juliank> but I have not looked at the patch
<juliank> The live patch stuff only shows up in the Ubuntu session, right?
<juliank> I was like, "just because I want GNOME does not mean I don't want livepatch", but it actually makes no sense; as you'd login to an ubuntu session first thing after install
<jbicha> juliank: we're interested in trying to merge the GNOME and Ubuntu versions of gnome-initial-setup a bit more in the future
<jbicha> mpt: I filed some first-login-window bugs. Who can I ping for them to get looked at sooner? https://github.com/CanonicalLtd/desktop-design/issues/101 102 105
<ubot5-ng> CanonicalLtd bug 101 in desktop-design "First login: What's new: wording suggestions" (comments: 2) [Open]
<ubot5`> Error: Launchpad bug 101 could not be found
<jdstrand> didrocks: you probably noticed, but if not, apparmor with your communitheme patch is now in bionic
<Wimpress> tseliot: OK, I have mostly good news :-)
<jdstrand> didrocks: if you need it for other releases, please comment in the bug
<Wimpress> Installing the nvidia drivers via the Addition Drivers UI or via `apt install nvidia-driver-390 results in a successful install, nvidia is enabled and lightdm works.
<Wimpress> However, I still experience https://pad.lv/1765053 when installing via `ubuntu-drivers autoinstall`
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1765053 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-390 (Ubuntu) "Errors were encountered while processing: /tmp/apt-dpkg-install-x8YVfC/03-libnvidia-compute-390_390.48-0ubuntu2_i386.deb" [High,In progress]
<didrocks> jdstrand: I did notice! I just made people eagerly waiting for it aware about it! Many thanks :) This is only needed starting from 18.04, all good!
<jdstrand> didrocks: thanks for the patch. glad we squeezed it in
<jibel> uh, looks like we have a problem when users upgrade with an encrypted swpa
<jibel> swap*
<jibel> system hangs on boot when it tries to activate it
<seb128> urg :/
<willcooke> jibel, swap file? rather than partition?
<jibel> swap partition
<jibel> I cannot even enter recovery mode
<seb128> do you know why? sounds line something foundations might understand better than us
<jibel> not yet, I'll file a bug once I've enough info, and indeed it's a foundations thing
<jbicha> jibel: bug 1736072 was in my history
<ubot5`> bug 1736072 in systemd (Ubuntu) "Encrypted swap does not work" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1736072
<jibel> jbicha, it's very similar but this bug report is really confusing, talking about ubiquity. In my case it's an upgrade from xenial with an encrypted home. I'll file a separate report and they can always duplicate
<Wimpress> didrocks: Do you have a few minutes to discuss ubuntu-report?
<seb128> Wimpress, don't ask to ask just ask?
<Wimpress> I know people are busy :-)
<Wimpress> Too British.
<oSoMoN> please excuse me for begging your pardon :)
<kenvandine> lol
<Wimpress> didrocks: ubuntu-report send is only executed via the GNOME first run wizard, correct?
<seb128> Wimpress, atm yes, but there is a cli utility and the api can be used by derivates who want to
<tseliot> Wimpress: I'm not sure about that, to be honest
<didrocks> Wimpress: so yes, you can either use the C lib or the Go one or the CLI
<didrocks> but current integration is via GNOME first run wizard
<didrocks> you have man pages on the CLI (automatically generated)
<didrocks> the Go API if available at https://godoc.org/github.com/ubuntu/ubuntu-report/pkg/sysmetrics
<didrocks> and the C is at https://godoc.org/github.com/ubuntu/ubuntu-report/pkg/sysmetrics/C
<didrocks> check the README.md of the project: https://github.com/ubuntu/ubuntu-report
<Wimpress> I just wanted to confirm that no reports are being sent via Ubiquity.
<didrocks> nope!
<didrocks> you will have it writing a file
<didrocks> as /var/log/installer/telemetry
<didrocks> but it's not used by anything
<Wimpress> It is therefore the responsibility of each flavour to instruct users to submit, or not, their reports as the first run wizard does in Ubuntu.
<didrocks> exactly!
<Wimpress> Thanks.
<didrocks> Wimpress: upgrade will also flesh out a file
<didrocks> in /var/log/upgrade/telemetry
<Wimpress> Should flavours send reports to the same URL as Ubuntu?
<didrocks> but same than ubiquity, it won't be used
<didrocks> I think they should
<didrocks> there is the current running session sent as info
<didrocks> but you can't really say something is xubuntu, ubuntu or ubuntu-mate
<Wimpress> And install media, which includes the flavour.
<didrocks> (well, we report the install media)
<didrocks> yes
<didrocks> but then, what would be about ubuntu-mate where I install ubuntu-desktop? :p
<didrocks> or the contrary
<didrocks> this is why current session is the best IMHO
<didrocks> (and no different URL)
<didrocks> making sense?
<Wimpress> So perhaps sending to the same URL as Ubuntu is fine?
<didrocks> yep!
<Wimpress> Cool.
<Wimpress> Well add something to Welcome to facilitate this.
<didrocks> Wimpress: excellent! Do not hesitate if you have any integration question
<didrocks> do you plan to use the API or wrapping the CLI?
<Wimpress> Just the cli for now. Simplest thing possible.
<didrocks> yeah, so look at the various command in the manpages to automate it
<Wimpress> Well put a similar UI to GNOME first run in front of it.
<didrocks> (they are in the README)
<Wimpress> Yep, I've read it ð
<didrocks> \o/ at least, it's been useful for one person! :)
<didrocks> basically, I guess, you will do:
<didrocks> $ ubuntu show <- get the json from here
<didrocks> $ ubuntu send yes|no
<didrocks> (no is the optout message, yes is to send the previous report)
<kenvandine> jibel, irt bug 1765651
<ubot5`> bug 1765651 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu Bionic) "Do not run gnome-initial-setup during OEM preparation stage" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1765651
<kenvandine> jibel, do you know how to detect if we're in the OEM preparation stage?
<kenvandine> or anyone ^^
<didrocks> probably some env var? /me doesn't know much about OEM
<jibel> kenvandine, let me check
<jibel> kenvandine, if really you want to be sure, current user is 'oem', set to log in automatically and /home/oem/Desktop/oem-config-prepare-gtk.desktop exists
<jibel> this user is removed on first boot after the system is prepared
<jibel> i'll document the bug report
<kenvandine> oh... probably just check if the current user is oem
<kenvandine> we should never want to run in that case
<Laney> can't the file be touched for the oem user?
<jibel> well if your username is 'oem' then you won't see the initial setup :)
<jibel> right we could do that too in the ubiquity hook
<jibel> much simpler actually
<kenvandine> jibel, that's probably the best fix
<jibel> moving to ubiquity then
<kenvandine> jibel, great!
<Laney> yes in plugininstall.py when it sets up the oem user
<jibel> unrelated to the original bug I reported but slightly worrying for the initial setup https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cryptsetup/+bug/1765724/comments/3
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1765724 in cryptsetup (Ubuntu) "Xenial -> Bionic - System fails to boot after upgrade - <email address hidden> fails to start" [Critical,New]
<seb128> ok, I give up trying to understand why gsettings changes signal don't work in ubiquity
<didrocks> seb128: fresh brain on Monday might help :)
<seb128> didrocks, Laney, jibel, the keys unsettings themself I explained, the wrapper does that
<seb128>     subp = subprocess.Popen(
<seb128>         ['sudo', '-H', '-u', user, 'gsettings', 'get', schema, key],
<seb128>         stdout=subprocess.PIPE, stderr=subprocess.PIPE,
<seb128> or sudo empty the env so the DBUS_ADDRESS... is not set and a new bus is spawned
<seb128> adding '-E' to the arguments fix that part
<seb128> fixes
<didrocks> making sense
<seb128> no extra dconf-service anymore
<seb128> no key unset
<didrocks> so, at least, no double service, which is a win :)
<seb128> but I can't get the gsettings changed signal to work
<seb128> without or without dropping priviledge
<seb128> the dbus env is correct
<seb128> the gsettings api documentation states "Note that settings only emits this signal if you have read key at least once while a signal handler was already connected for key ."
<seb128> which I though could have been the issue
<seb128> but I added a get_boolean() call to the code after the connect, no luck
<didrocks> yeah, I was going to mention that
<didrocks> that would have been my bet for that issue :/
<seb128> that's my current patch
<seb128> http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/ubiquity-screen-reader.patch
<jibel> Laney, do we care if the owner is root?
<didrocks> seb128: I should be free on Monday for a peer looking into that issue if you want
<Laney> want me to look in a bit?
<didrocks> I would say, still get that in
<Laney> jibel: umm, probably, can't you use 'install'?
<seb128> didrocks, Laney, help would be welcome if you guys have some idea, as said my current work is on there ^
<didrocks> seb128: I'll go off in the next minutes, hence proposing looking at that together at that time (but still push your changes, they are valid)
<seb128> didrocks, I'm at least going to proposed the '-E' use
<seb128> let's see on monday
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, the -E is safe and needed anyway
<seb128> maybe Laney pokes a bit still today and figure out something
<didrocks> to connect to the right bus
<seb128> I'm pondering cleaning the ubiquity-dm dbus activation/dconf-service code
<seb128> I wonder if that could be useful for any other derivative
<didrocks> seb128: the impact is on flavorsâ¦
<seb128> probably not, but there is no need to change that at this point
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> correct :/
<didrocks> if we avoid for us spawning it that way, I don't think it worths touching
<didrocks> (that way == -E)
<seb128> right
<didrocks> I don't spot anything on the connect change signal from your diffâ¦
<seb128> anything wrong you mean?
<didrocks> yeah, sorry
<seb128> thx for looking
<seb128> as said let's forget about it for this week
<seb128> maybe Laney sees something
<seb128> otherwise new round on monday
<didrocks> yeah, let's do this! :)
<seb128> thx didrocks!
<seb128> at least we explained the dconf unset thing
<didrocks> yw, and nice hunting, even if not yet completely resolved ;)
<didrocks> yep
<seb128> thx
<didrocks> happy the theory was correct :)
<seb128> :)
<didrocks> seb128: just, ubiquity-dm is using the glib mainloop, correct?
<didrocks> to deliver signalsâ¦
<didrocks> I guess so, just asking ;)
<seb128> good question
<Laney> you mean ubiquity itself?
<Laney> it's gtk ...
<didrocks> Laney: well, the code is in ubiquity-dm which launch ubiquity UI as a subprocess, no?
<seb128> the callback is in gtk_ui.py
<didrocks> ah no, that part of the code is in gtk_ui.py
<didrocks> yep
<seb128> which is the frontend
<didrocks> ok, so obviously not it
<didrocks> well, let's sleep on that
<didrocks> and enjoy the week-end and park+sun :)
<seb128> right
<seb128> thx, same to you!
<didrocks> see you on Monday guys!
<didrocks> thx :)
<seb128> shrug, just did a nautilus upload that got rejected
<seb128> jbicha, you forgot to commit/push your recent changes to the vcs :/
<seb128> ok, I guess one less fix uploaded to bionic then, I need to step out, maybe later
<seb128> jbicha, if you fix the vcs I can retry to include those, I uncommited/force pushed back
<jbicha> seb128: pushed now. Sorry about that. I seem to be having lots more trouble remembering to push to bzr these days :|
<seb128> jbicha, thx
<seb128> k have a good w.e desktopers
<seb128> I'm out for a bit, might deal with a bit of backlog still later
<oSoMoN> have a good one seb128 !
<Laney> this is some weird shit
<Laney> I tried making the GSettings an instance variable in case it was going out of scope
<Laney> NOPE
<Laney> I made it so that gsettings.py wasn't making a new dconf-service process spawn (hacking DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS in the child processes)
<Laney> NOPE
<Trevinho> Laney: looser :-D
<Laney> the GSettings isn't getting connected to the right dconf daemon somehow
<Laney> this is some messed up stuff
<Laney> if you make it write then the callback is called
<Laney> but then there's an error that it can't commit the change "the connection is closed"
<Trevinho> you need to define the runtime dir too
 * Laney slaps Trevinho 
<Trevinho> at least, not sure what you're trying though
<Laney> why
<Laney> dbus and dconf is already running
<Laney> I just want to get on the existing ones
<Trevinho> ah, yeah I mean the standard ones'
<Trevinho> ?
<Laney> probably XDG_RUNTIME_DIR isn't set
<Laney> but I don't need to spawn anything new, and DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS is ok
<Laney> arghghghgh
<Laney> this is the wurst
<Laney> the bockwurst
<Laney> I'm going
<Laney> we're off to a pizza place for a friend's birthday
<Laney> #trevinhocompliant
<Trevinho> ahha
<Trevinho> No, when it involves friends it's always ok
<Trevinho> I even eat that horrible pizza with you guys in holland
<oSoMoN> it's 5 past beer, I'm off to a micro-brewery
<oSoMoN> have a good week-end everyone!
<willcooke> righty ho, time for something else.  Happy weekend all
<teeramisu> Hello, is this bug? should i report bug? https://gist.github.com/Parduk/790a233bbfa3b1f807c772089a671f85
<jbicha> teeramisu: do not use sudo to run gnome-control-center
<teeramisu> jbicha: so its not bug right?
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-04-21
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Still there?
<jbicha> yes
<GunnarHj> jbicha: This is not so good:
<GunnarHj> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-translators/2018-April/007490.html
<jbicha> it's fully translated in Czech at least :)
<GunnarHj> Yeah.. That translator has made a great work this cycle.
<GunnarHj> Those strings were made available only a few days ago, right?
<jbicha> probably
<jbicha> I think last LTS we did a complciated translation export and bundling to help an app be better translated. Seb would know more about that
<jbicha> are the latest translations downloaded and installed at the end of the ubiquity install?
<GunnarHj> Probably, if you install with an internet connection.
<GunnarHj> So an early langpack update will probably help.
<jbicha> it's a unique app because it should only show up for most users once immediately after first boot and login
<GunnarHj> Right. But OTOH it's part of the first impression.
<GunnarHj> I think that X-Ubuntu-Use-Langpack: yes should have been added to d/control some time ago, so the template and upstream translations had been added to LP earlier.
<jbicha> we added that header at the same time as we filed the MIR (April 6)
<jbicha> sorry that this was a very late feature :(
<jbicha> we used almost none of the GNOME strings in the Ubuntu session implementation
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Ah, you did that? Ok. Then I think that the mistake was to not change the template priority. A new template get priority 0 by default...
<GunnarHj> Anyway, let's see what happens this weekend, and talk with Seb and others on Monday about the options.
<jbicha> Robert took care of it. I thought of it at almost the same time though. It didn't actually get into main until yesterday!
<jbicha> ok, have a good weekend
<GunnarHj> The same to you!
<jader[m]> Hello
<d-fence_X3TD1P> https://www.youtube.com/user/l0de/live IS POPPIN HOT RIGHT NOW STILL GOING!! CALL 315-505-4666. IRC.EFNET.ORG #lrh
<d-fence_X3TD1P> https://www.youtube.com/user/l0de/live IS POPPIN HOT RIGHT NOW STILL GOING!! CALL 315-505-4666. IRC.EFNET.ORG #lrh
<d-fence_X3TD1P> https://www.youtube.com/user/l0de/live IS POPPIN HOT RIGHT NOW STILL GOING!! CALL 315-505-4666. IRC.EFNET.ORG #lrh
<d-fence_X3TD1P> https://www.youtube.com/user/l0de/live IS POPPIN HOT RIGHT NOW STILL GOING!! CALL 315-505-4666. IRC.EFNET.ORG #lrh
<d-fence_X3TD1P> mgedmin otno[m] jjohansen mcs_ marlinc shiznix ogra_ icey plars Trevinho unicyn[m] mpt tseliot vila cpaelzer hikiko djinni` ochosi czajkowski mdeslaur hyperair niko mwilson-e unnamed23423 c-lobrano bdrung ubot9 JanC hggdh veebers sabdfl Tm_T tjaalton davmor2 isantop ratliff jamesh douglassoares[m] DalekSec tsimonq2 ubuntu456[m] chiluk Hanma[m] chrisgovella[m] alatiera j1mc ulfo[m] rambo666[m] blackfire[m] Kazhnuz RA xcl
<teeramisu> i just wondering, linux 4.15 reached eol. will you upgrade kernel for ubuntu 18.04?
<tjaalton> teeramisu: no
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-04-15
<GunnarHj> Good morning seb128!
<GunnarHj> seb128: Unless it's too late, the fix of bug #1823778 is now complete and uploadable.
<ubot5`> bug 1823778 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu Bionic) "Unable to set Serbian as Language" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1823778
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<jibel> morning all
<didrocks> salut jibel
<duflu> Morning jibel
<seb128> hey GunnarHj, it's a bit late for release but we can upload and see, if they don't let in then it auto turns into a SRU
<seb128> hey duflu
<seb128> lut didrocks jibel
<seb128> did you guys had a good w.e?
<didrocks> salut seb128 ! Bof, gastro, toujours l'angine, petite forme quoi
<didrocks> et toi ?
<seb128> :(
<seb128> ici Ã§a va, un lÃ©ger mal de gorge mais c'est tout
<duflu> Hi seb128
<Laney> hi
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you? had a good w.e?
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> yeah not bad, lazy one going to the pub with friends and then doing some garden stuff on sunday
<Laney> you?
<seb128> I'm good, we had diner/played board games with friends on saturday evening, otherwise relaxing w.e just walking around a bit in the city and taking it easy
<seb128> now debugging gst autopkgtest unhappiness on i386 *g*
<didrocks> hey Laney
<Laney> yep saw that stuff
<Laney> yo didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> still sick, starting to be long :/
<Laney> :(
<Laney> any progress?
<duflu> Morning Laney
<didrocks> Laney: will go back to the doctor this afternoon, but yeah, no progress, even a little bit worse during nights
<Laney> hey duflu, are you well?
 * Laney hugs didrocks 
 * didrocks hugs Laney back (carefully to avoid flu-or-whatever passing)
<duflu> Hi Laney. Back problems again. I may yet have to invest in an even more expensive chair
<duflu> You Laney?
<Laney> yeah I'm alright
 * Laney donates to the #ubuntu-desktop health clinic
<seb128> the tooth is fixed?
<Laney> seems so
<seb128> great :)
<Laney> :>
<willcooke> morning all
<seb128> hey willcooke, how is London?
<willcooke> hi seb128 - on the train still.  The sun is out though, so it's looking pretty good.  How are you doing?  Good weekend?
<seb128> willcooke, I'm good, yes pretty nice. Diner/board game with friends on saturday evening, otherwise mostly relaxed/enjoyed the sunny weather (though it was cold, almost 0Â°C at night, brrrr)
<seb128> you?
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<willcooke> Golf on Saturday, ground was frozen first thing and then it hailed!
<willcooke> morning didrocks
<didrocks> Laney: are you heading to London as well?
<Laney> yeah tomorrow
<Laney> got some Things To Doâ¢
<willcooke> morning Laney
<Laney> yo willcooke
<Laney> what up
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<willcooke> afternoon duflu
<willcooke> duflu, have you seen anything like what's reported in this bug?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg/+bug/1824661
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1824661 in Ubuntu "Nvidia issues with 19.04 and XPS 15 9750 GTX 1050 Ti Mobile: Boots to blank screen that flashes a couple times. Can't get to tty." [Undecided,Incomplete]
<willcooke> Feels like a lot of the "odd" problems we get with nv are related to these mobile chips
<duflu> willcooke, yeah there's always a few bugs like that around. But I can't assume which one it is till the feedback is received
<duflu> willcooke, now added to this list: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm3/+bugs?field.tag=nvidia
<willcooke> thanks duflu
<willcooke> oh, now the page loads, I see you had already commented on the bug, thanks a lot duflu
<willcooke> meh, something odd happening with this wifi.  All Google links are coming back with broken certs
<willcooke> Seems IRC is still working
<andyrock> morning all!
<seb128> good morning andyrock!
<duflu> Morning andyrock
<didrocks> hey andyrock
<sparkiegeek> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CosmicCuttlefish/ReleaseNotes#Upgrading_from_Ubuntu_18.04 suggests that "Software & updates" (software-properties-gtk) is in System Settings (gnome-control-center) - but ISTM that's not true for Bionic
<sparkiegeek> shouldn't the instructions be something like Super-A software-properties ?
<sparkiegeek> or even Alt-F2 software-properties-gtk
<GunnarHj> seb128, Laney: Yeah, an early SRU of that Serbian fix would be nice. My primary hope is to fix the bionic SRU (also MP) ASAP. I put it in a PPA if that helps: https://launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/+archive/ubuntu/gnome-control-center
<Laney> 'k, I'll get to it when I get a chance (feel free to ping if it's too long)
<GunnarHj> Laney: Such a ping won't be needed, will it? ;)
 * willcooke -> office at last
<Laney> GunnarHj: wouldn't be unheard of :<
<GunnarHj> Laney: I added some verbal explanation to the MP.
<Laney> Ta.
<seb128> GunnarHj, looking at the code seems ok but I need to test it ... btw what is upstream doing in that regard?
<GunnarHj> seb128: Upstream pretends that modifiers don't exist. https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-desktop/issues/50
<gitbot> GNOME issue 50 in gnome-desktop "Display locale @modifiers properly" [5. Libgnome-Desktop, Bugzilla, Opened]
<GunnarHj> seb128: Btw, it's in a PPA if you want to test. https://launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/+archive/ubuntu/gnome-control-center
<seb128> GunnarHj, thx
<seb128> willcooke, andyrock, so the g-i-s fix works, good job! (it's not really nice, on the inspiron it spins for like 1m30 or something, but that's not our fault)
<seb128> (tested today's daily)
<willcooke> seb128, did some testing here, the spinner doesn't spin for me, but it does work - the page reloads and the apps appear
<willcooke> andyrock is going to see why it's not spinning.  It is for him :)
<seb128> it is for me as well
<seb128> on the inspiron
<seb128> I hope it does spin not so long on a less low-spec machine though, it really looks buggy otherwise :/
<seb128> it takes less time for a full OS to boot than for the snapd service to get ready, that's a bit ridiculous
<willcooke> On a vbox vm it loads in about 30 seconds or so
<willcooke> could be because I'm in the office though
<willcooke> I will try from the train on the way home
<seb128> it shouldn't have to do with internet/the env
<seb128> it's mostly snapd doing its things which takes time
<didrocks> I guess a good fallback would be "if not after xxx seconds, offline answer"
<didrocks> but ideally, that would be in snapd itself
<seb128> well, it does spin only for a limited time
<seb128> and you can do "finish" any time if you wish
<seb128> there is not much more we can from the UI side, it's really the service delay with is the issue for the user experience...
<popey> is there some way to launch gnome-initial-setup other than deleting the .config file for it?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, hence the service could by itself have a SLA and in that case send back a default list
<didrocks> popey: I don't think so (from --help)
<popey> hm
<didrocks> popey: /usr/libexec/gnome-initial-setup --existing-user
<didrocks> I'm wrong, just run it, the check is only in the autostart file
<popey> great! Thanks
<didrocks> yw!
<popey> we have updated the ubuntu-firstrun category in the store, but I'm not seeing that reflected in g-i-s
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, ideally snapd would just handle the queries from early boot without having to wait for the snaps to be in place etc
<popey> I only see 9 applications in the list.
<seb128> popey, you don't see the right apps, or you see the right ones but would just wish it would display more entries?
<didrocks> yep ;)
<popey> there's not enough in the list, some are missing that I know should be there
<seb128> popey, can you do the same query from the snap command line?
<popey> yes
<popey> curl -s -H 'X-Ubuntu-Series: 16' "https://api.snapcraft.io/api/v1/snaps/search?confinement=strict,classic&scope=wide&arch=wide&x=$(date +%s)&fields=package_name&section=ubuntu-firstrun" | jq
<seb128> and it's fine there?
<seb128> do you have the same ones missing the UI every time (which ones?) or does it change?
<popey> looks same every time I launch
<willcooke> remember its hiding ones you already have installed
<popey> oh!
<popey> I didn't know that.
 * willcooke -> meeting
<popey> I'll start a clean VM and test it.
<sparkiegeek> hmm, after upgrading (from Bionic) to Disco, I hit an issue where Bluetooth failed to establish a connection to my headset. in dmesg, I see https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/y95cN8nHPX/
<sparkiegeek> note that my bluetooth adapter is USB, and I had it plugged in to a hub built in to my keyboard
<sparkiegeek> I have subsequently tried it in a different USB port, and got success
<sparkiegeek> but this is a regression, since (with workarounds) I had it working just fine via the keyboard in Bionic
<seb128> sparkiegeek, hey, what do you mean "with workarounds"
<seb128> 'hci0: corrupted ACL packet" does look like a kernel/drive issue more than a desktop one though
<seb128> tseliot, hey, is https://community.ubuntu.com/t/ubuntu-19-04-and-nvidia-settings/10580 something you saw?
<seb128> seems like it was also reported as bug #1822937 on launchpad
<ubot5`> bug 1822937 in nvidia-settings (Ubuntu) "NVIDIA settings won't write to /etc/xorg" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1822937
<tseliot> seb128: maybe there is something wrong with the polkit dependency, or maybe they are using a version of nvidia-settings that is not from the archive
<tseliot> I can have a look later this week
<seb128> tseliot, k, let me ask on the post to start
<andyrock> seb128: I found the problem with livepatch indicator (the one about the fact that it fails to go from the warning state to the ok state)
<seb128> andyrock, oh, nice
<andyrock> seb128: basically there is an undocumented state in livepatch ("applying")
<andyrock> the fix should be quick
<andyrock> so if the state == "applying" reschedule the check (like we do for "needs-check" and "unapplied")
<andyrock> I'll open a bug and propose a fix, sorry about that!
<seb128> andyrock, no worry, good that you figured it out, at least it was not wasted time :)
<andyrock> seb128: should I open a bug? that indicator is not displayed in disco and not yet released in bionic
<andyrock> seb128: wdyt?
<seb128> andyrock, don't bother, just do a mp
<andyrock> kk
<seb128> andyrock, I will reupload to bionic SRU with the fix included
<willcooke> anyone know if one can "arrange" the icons on the desktop any more?
<willcooke> on D
<willcooke> report from a user who upgraded said that his desktop icons all got moved (which is entirely unexpected) - but I dont see an easy way to have them arrange themselves in a grid without dragging each icon
<willcooke> s/is entirely/is not entirely
<Laney> don't think so
<Laney> https://gitlab.gnome.org/World/ShellExtensions/desktop-icons/issues/98 probably
<gitbot> Shell extensions issue 98 in desktop-icons "Rearrange / Sort icons" [Opened]
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<Laney> Quality Bug Report
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> This one might evolve in to something more useful: https://gitlab.gnome.org/World/ShellExtensions/desktop-icons/issues/95
<gitbot> Shell extensions issue 95 in desktop-icons "Icon placement setting" [Opened]
<willcooke> hi CadBane
<willcooke> CadBane, so yeah, looks like an "arrange" feature is missing from the extension which provides icons on the desktop at the moment.  There are a couple of bugs open upstream which look to cover that feature, so likely this is something which will come in time. In the meantime I'm afraid it looks like the only option is drag them to where you want them.
<willcooke> I'm going to subscribe to those two bugs and keep an eye on it
<seb128> right, the new code is not having all the options/features nautilus had (some by 'design'/choice to not make the code more complex and difficult to maintain that needed)
<seb128> I guess we are going to schedule work/improvements according to the feedback we get
<tseliot> Laney: when you suggested that I add the casper-bottom script to ORDER, what did you mean by ORDER?
<Laney> tseliot: when you break=bottom, look in /scripts/casper-bottom/, it's there
<Laney> I don't know what it does or if that is even required
<Laney> it's generated somehow, so hacking it is only for testing
<Laney> if it is even needed for that
<tseliot> Laney: oh, I didn't notice. I'll try that. Thanks
<Laney> there's no mention of that filename in casper
<Trevinho> Morning!
<Laney> so I dunno where it comes from
<Laney> it's all a mystery
<Laney> hi Trevinho, how's it going?
<Trevinho> Laney: hey. all good.. intense weekend.
<Trevinho> you?
<Laney> doing what? or... don't we want to know? ð
<Laney> i'm alright
<Laney> feeling stupid though, not been able to make progress on the casper bug I was trying to work out (but cyphermox is looking too, so that's nice)
<Laney> gtg for a bit, see you later or from the office tomorrow
<willcooke> see you Laney
 * willcooke -> train.  bbl
<Trevinho> Laney: ahahaha, no, tranquilo! xD
<Trevinho> well, mostly because of hiking the Teothiuacan pyramids
<willcooke>  /me -> car -> home bbiab
<sparkiegeek> seb128: sorry, IRC notifications screwed up - "with workarounds" is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/1822073
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1822073 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "Bluetooth headset profile forgotten after disconnection" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<sparkiegeek> seb128: and agree it's likely not a desktop bug
<sparkiegeek> anyway, EOD
<willcooke> night all, see you tomorrow.  Train in again tomorrow
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-04-16
<didrocks> good morning
<Trevinho> hi, morning seb128 and didrocks
<didrocks> hey Trevinho
<seb128> hey Trevinho, didrocks, duflu, & other desktopers
<seb128> Trevinho, what are you hacking on this week? ;)
<Laney> moin
<didrocks> re seb128, hey Laney
<didrocks> Laney: on the road? :)
<seb128> hey Laney, that's early for you!
<seb128> on your way to London?
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> not happy with this time of day
<Trevinho> seb128: I pushed the summary just now
<seb128> yeah, it's on the early side
<seb128> Trevinho, thx
<Trevinho> seb128: I also forgot to mention yesterday (well your yestarday) if you could publish https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3702
<seb128> Trevinho, sure
<Trevinho> ta
<duflu> Morning didrocks, Trevinho, seb128, Laney
<didrocks> hey duflu
<didrocks> We should change the gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock maintainer, too many emails ;)
<seb128> :-)
<willcooke> morning all
<marcustomlinson> morning!
<willcooke> hi marcustomlinson
<seb128> hey willcooke, still in London?
<seb128> hey marcustomlinson
<marcustomlinson> hi! \o
<willcooke> hi seb128, on the train still.  Delays at St Pancras because of damage to the overhead cables
<willcooke> new day, different reason
<seb128> hehe
<willcooke> what's the release-notes package called in launchpad? The one which we are suppose to "also affects"?
<willcooke> morning jibel, looks like OEM did some good testing :)
<willcooke> release notes; looks like ubuntu-release-notes
 * willcooke . . o O ( Google first, ask later )
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<xnox> project, not package =)
<duflu> And morning marcustomlinson
<willcooke> thx
<didrocks> hey willcooke, marcustomlinson!
<marcustomlinson> morning duflu and didrocks
<willcooke> hi didrocks, afternoon duflu
<jibel> willcooke, yes, they did, some issues with nvidia but nothing new
<willcooke> jibel, gotya, thx
<duflu> Oh, morning jibel
<duflu> seb128, btw I created a bugzilla tracker that works instead of landing on Gitlab. For example: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1734095
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1734095 in GNOME Shell "Software & Updates not showing authorization popup [gnome-shell[N]: pushModal: invocation of begin_modal failed]" [High,Confirmed]
<duflu> Same display name "GNOME Shell" but different project name "gnome-shell-legacy-bugs"
<seb128> duflu, well done!
<seb128> duflu, btw good job getting another performance fix merged upstream :)
<seb128> one at the time we are getting there
<willcooke> woot
<duflu> seb128, yeah it's kind of good, but as usual least important first. That's a bug no one was provably hitting
<duflu> Which is why no bug is declared fixed
<seb128> well, still it's less things pending, and eventually the more useful ones end up landing
<duflu> But if you want to add triple/quad buffering later then it's absolutely required
<seb128> k
<seb128> well in any case one less that you need to keep rebasing, so it's a win :-)
<willcooke_> desktoppers:  do you want to do a team meeting today?
<willcooke_> seb128, ^ wdyt?
<willcooke_> There is one bug in D incoming that we should look at
<willcooke_> other than that, I think we're ok
<seb128> willcooke_, I'm around and fine having one, it gives a sync point, if there isn't much to discuss than it takes 10 min max and we wrap?
<willcooke_> sounds good.  I will most likely chair, but in case something happens, I'll ping you
<seb128> k, no need to ping
<seb128> if you are not around at the time of the meeting I handle it
<seb128> ok?
<willcooke_> thanks seb128
<willcooke_> In the meantime, we should probably find an assignee for this:
<willcooke_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1824874
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1824874 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "undismissable, unclickable authentication dialog left on screen after policykit authentication [pushModal: invocation of begin_modal failed]" [High,New]
<willcooke_> well, decide if we want to accept it first
<willcooke_> duflu you looked at that quickly, is it a widespread problem?  I dont think I've seen it
 * willcooke_ -> going underground 
<seb128> willcooke_, the upstream report is years old, we have one report on launchpad and no steps to trigger, no debug log ... doesn't seem like one we can do much about or that is really worrying
<willcooke_> seb128, wfm
<willcooke_> I will try and reproduce it quickly this morning
<seb128> k
<duflu> Yeah it's presently only v_orlon, but there are hints of similar errors in the past
<seb128> k
<duflu> I wonder if this is a factor: InstallationMedia: Ubuntu 10.04.1 LTS "Lucid Lynx" - Release amd64 (20100816.1)
<duflu> Something upgradey?
<duflu> (that's a word now)
<seb128> not likely
<duflu> Well if it's only affecting one person, that's a mathematical fact already :)
<seb128> it was a one time thing for him
<seb128> he also said that his gnome-shell unlock prompt took a while to display
<seb128> but he has like 300 notifications, I couldn't reproduce with a notify-send loop though (but my testcase had no icons or anything fancy for those, maybe that's a difference)
<duflu> A more common bug report is that unlocking takes a lot more time for one of {Wayland,Xorg}. Can't remember which or where the bug was
<tseliot> Laney, seb128: my fix solves LP: #1824177 . How can I proceed? Shall I upload a new casper myself, or shall I just attach a debdiff?
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1824177 in casper (Ubuntu) "dmesg spammed with nvidia-nvlink messages during install" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1824177
<Laney> Upload it (and reply to cyphermox?)
<tseliot> oh, I hadn't seen his reply
<willcooke> seb128, all of a sudden the gsettings key for fractional scaling isnt working.
<dupondje> Somebody around here with Gnome on Wayland and Telegram on 19.04 ? :)
<seb128> willcooke, how so?
<seb128> willcooke, or is your screen resolution too low to use it?
<seb128> dupondje, Laney perhaps
<seb128> dupondje, but best to ask directly your question...
<dupondje> Well got a reproducable crasher here of gnome-shell :(
<seb128> dupondje, 'good', bug number?
<willcooke> seb128, $ gsettings set org.gnome.mutter experimental-features "['x11-randr-fraction-scaling']"
<dupondje> Take a screenshot of a part of the screen, right click inside telegram -> boom
<willcooke> seb128, expected value:
<dupondje> seb128: guess gnome-shell bug?
<seb128> dupondje, likely, do you have an apport file in /var/crash? did you submit it?
<willcooke> seb128, ignore, finger trouble.
<seb128> willcooke, :)
<willcooke> sorry
<seb128> no worry, better this way :)
<willcooke> I tested it like 5 times before I pinged
<seb128> than having a real regression
<seb128> haha
<willcooke> ohhhhhhh
<willcooke> haha
<willcooke> I know
<seb128> ?
<willcooke> I copied from the web page, and the quotes are not real quotes :)
<seb128> DOH
<seb128> we should fix that :)
<willcooke> I changed the text to a block and added a note about the quotes
<willcooke> I've pinned that post as well
<seb128> great
<dupondje> https://errors.ubuntu.com/oops/340cdc5e-603e-11e9-a481-fa163e102db1 there :)
<willcooke> seb128,  infinity is syncing Pulse Audio from Debian to fix https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/1824103
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1824103 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "aplay record file failed always." [Critical,Incomplete]
<seb128> willcooke, +1, makes sense
<willcooke> slight change of plan, it's proving very hard to sync, so he's going to take the fixes
<willcooke> we can look at updating properly next cycle
<willcooke> I wonder if there are still a load of old phone patches in there
<willcooke> no, doesnt look likeit
<Laney> merge
<Laney> that is a proper update
<Laney> just to be clear
<seb128> willcooke, Laney, if we are still fixing packages, should we get that gedit segfault fix from andyrock in? that's in the top 3 reports for e.u.c on weekly view for some time
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2019-04-16
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Apr 16 13:30:21 2019 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2019-04-16 | Current topic:
<willcooke> Roll call: andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu (out), jamesh (out), jibel, kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter (out), trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<kenvandine> o/
<seb128> _o/
<Trevinho> o/
<willcooke> Let's make this quick if we can...
<kenvandine> oSoMoN is out too
<didrocks> hey
<willcooke> BB incoming, clear
<willcooke> BB tracking:
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mutter/+bug/1814169
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1814169 in mutter (Ubuntu Cosmic) "Mutter upsteam bug: cannot overwrite workspaces layout" [Undecided,New]
<willcooke> assign Trevinho?
<Trevinho> Ok
<willcooke> thanks!
<seb128> (unsure it's rls material, but ok if Trevinho takes it, easier than arguing ;)
<willcooke> It got assigned somehow
<willcooke> *targetted
<Laney> duflu did it
<Laney> we should probably gently suggest not to do that
<Trevinho> anyway looks more like something I can propose upstream and see... More than rls for bionic
<seb128> I will remind him
<willcooke> Do we really want to rls target it?
<seb128> just delete the cosmic/bionic lines
<seb128> I will remind Daniel about the process
<willcooke> done
<willcooke> moving on
<seb128> thx
<willcooke> CC incoming has quite a few new ones
<willcooke> well, not new, the ftbfs ones
<seb128> didn't we say we would notfixing them?
<seb128> I'm doing that, feel free to skip those
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-bluetooth/+bug/1777062
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1777062 in gnome-bluetooth (Ubuntu Bionic) "Logitech M535 mouse only pairs successfully after 4-5 tries" [Undecided,In progress]
<willcooke> seb128, you ok to take that one for C?
<willcooke> or remove C
<seb128> I guess I can do a C upload
<seb128> can still be useful to some
<willcooke> thx
<willcooke> Moving on to DD incoming I think
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1824874
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1824874 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "undismissable, unclickable authentication dialog left on screen after policykit authentication [pushModal: invocation of begin_modal failed]" [High,New]
<willcooke> from this morning
<willcooke> probably too late now
<seb128> I vote -1, it's a one time report from 1 user (even if it's Steve) without debug info
<Trevinho> I noticed it, done some debugging... but... not sure. maybe for later
<seb128> I doubt it's a new issue, Daniel found warnings similar to the ones from the journal from 2015
<willcooke> notfixing
<seb128> +1
<seb128> dear launchpad, please stop being a piece of c*
<seb128> (timeouting)
<willcooke> k, I think thats all the rls bugs we need to talk about this time
<seb128> ah, better :p
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2019-04-16 | Current topic: AOB
<willcooke> Anyone got anything?
<didrocks> nothing for me
<willcooke> 1 min timeout
<seb128> one comment, please review the trello board and clean your card out from the 19.04 list as appropriate
<seb128> at this point they are either done, not going to happen or for next cycle
<seb128> the SRUs can go on the next cycle board
<seb128> so the board should be clean by eow
<seb128> I'm going to chasse down and nag people who don't clean it, but you get negative karma point if I need to do that :p
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> (I already did a good round of update on friday)
<seb128> np
<seb128> that's it from me :)
<willcooke> anyone else.... 30 seconds
<kenvandine> disco!
<kenvandine> that is all :)
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Apr 16 13:47:24 2019 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2019/ubuntu-desktop.2019-04-16-13.30.moin.txt
<willcooke> thanks all
<Trevinho> thanks...
<didrocks> thx
 * Trevinho hides in his timezone again 
<seb128> Trevinho, how is it going? what time is it for you, too early to wake up? ;)
<Trevinho> seb128: good... It's 8.48
<seb128> k, a bit early for you
<Trevinho> but... yeah doable for the meeting. I can just go for another quick nap ð
<seb128> :)
<Trevinho> seb128: ah thanks for publishing the silo I see it's released already now...
<seb128> Trevinho, np!
<seb128> Laney, unping about gedit, willcook_e was nice enough to give me a status update saying it was discussed in London :-)
<Laney> didn't see a ping, sorry
<Laney> thought he just asked me irl
<Laney> oh right, it got merged in my eyes with the meeting roll call
<seb128> nw
 * seb128 goes for some sport, bbiab
<andyrock> Laney: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gedit/+bug/1822753
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1822753 in gedit (Ubuntu) "/usr/bin/gedit:11:gedit_metadata_manager_set:gedit_document_set_metadata:save_metadata:gedit_document_dispose:g_object_unref" [Undecided,In progress]
<Laney> ð
<didrocks> zfsHEADExploding :p
<didrocks> so many cases for grub + our advanced zfs usage (/boot in separate partition, zfs, non zfs, persistent, â¦), crazyâ¦
<didrocks> and ofc, /etc/fstab which can be in other partitions, andâ¦ andâ¦ and snapshot which aren't actually mountpoints :p
<Laney> going to upload https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/ubuntu/+source/gnome-initial-setup/+git/gnome-initial-setup/+merge/366123 unless any objections
<Laney> the huge spinner looks really stupid
<Wimpress> Afternoon desktoppers
<Wimpress> I've been running some ISO tests.
<Wimpress> Looking good. One questions.
<Wimpress> I've installed on a VirtualBox guest and selected "install third-party drivers"
<Wimpress> The Vbox guest additions/drivers were not installed.
<Wimpress> Is that a bug I should file?
<willcooke> jibel, still around? ^
<sil2100> cyphermox: ^
<cyphermox> ok
<willcooke> Wimpress, can you get us some logs?  I dont have vmware here
<willcooke> Wimpress, a log with the box checked and one without would be good
<cyphermox> virtualbox
<willcooke> oh
<cyphermox> but it doesn't matter ;P
 * willcooke gets his bigger glasses
<willcooke> Wimpress, do you mean vmware or virtualbox?
<popey> i have just done that install in virtualbox, which log file?
<Wimpress> VirtualBox
<willcooke> hold on, that's not a thing
<willcooke> we did vmware
<popey> wat
<infinity> Was there reason to believe vbox guest stuff was meant to be auto-installed?
<Wimpress> infinity: Only because the nvidia driver install uses `ubuntu-drivers`.
<Wimpress> And ubuntu-drivers services VirtualBox guest driver installation.
<cyphermox> virtualbox-guest-dkms does have modaliases, if the hardware shows up I'd guess it should be picked up
<Wimpress> I just assumed that because `ubuntu-drivers` is the means to install nvidia and vbox drivers, it would have worked for vbox via Ubiquity.
<cyphermox> depends what ubuntu-drivers really does, but I don't think jibel's changes would really break that
<cyphermox> hrm
<popey> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/3vTZYwsF/This%20is%20what%20you%20get
<cyphermox> virtualbox-guest-dkms is in multiverse though
<cyphermox> popey: thanks
<willcooke> we're installing vms here
<willcooke> VMs
<willcooke> not VMS
<popey> is there a log I can provide from my existing virtual machine?
<popey> or should I just, you know, file a bug in full 800x600
<cyphermox> willcooke: VMS, new architecture coming up circa 1990
<cyphermox> popey: I'd like to see /run/ubuntu-drivers.autoinstall tbh :)
<popey> that file doesn't exist (on an installed system)
<cyphermox> ah, indeed it would not
<cyphermox> that would only exist somewhere during the install
<cyphermox> I'll install virtualbox here
<jibel> as cyphermox said, vbox driver would install automatically wuth ubuntu-drivers if they were not in multiverse
<willcooke> I installed without the 3rd party and ubuntu-drivers shows the vbox stuff as available but not installed.  It also shows as proprietary - so that's fine.  vmware tools is not shown on my list.
<cyphermox> jibel: well, non-free is enabled by default though, isn't it?
<jibel> multiverse is not in /etc/apt/sources.list in the live sessiobn
<cyphermox> oh
<jibel> at least not on ubuntu
<cyphermox> well, yeah, that changes everything
<popey> can we just move it to main
<popey> (I kid, I kid) ;)
<cyphermox> how could non-free ever have worked then?
<jibel> can you use another VM tech ;)
<popey> VirtualBox is stupidly popular.
<cyphermox> no kidding
<infinity> If people expect this to work form the installer, they need to file an MIR and get it in restricted.
<infinity> This is kinda the definition of restricted.
<jibel> yup
<cyphermox> yeah.
<willcooke> ok, so not a bug then.  Thanks everyone
<infinity> Right, ENOBUG.  Carrying on.
<Laney> kenvandine: can you teach me how to do that snap change when you get back please?
<Laney> would be interested in de-bus-factoring a bit
<Laney> I assume it's revert 5bc6ae4f5e6fd88053584e9f6bdca3d34a36e937, but then ... ?
<kenvandine> i could do that
<kenvandine> or
<kenvandine> snapcraft release gtk-common-themes 1198 stable
<Laney> you need the repo to match, no?
<kenvandine> i'm also going to revert it in git and let it rebuild :)
<Laney> would seem s-m-r-t
<kenvandine> but this is more friendly to store as well
<kenvandine> so it doesn't have to update devices  in the field to a new revision
<Laney> ok
<Laney> who can do that snapcraft stuff?
<kenvandine> Laney: any collaborator on the snap or someone with the canonical credential
<kenvandine> for themes it's oSoMoN, didrocks and myself
<kenvandine> james too
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> we should talk about this I think
<kenvandine> Laney: sadly we can't have a team
<Laney> yeah, I remember that
<Laney> but maybe we should ensure every ~ubuntu-desktop is in there or something
<Laney> for all the seeded snaps, dunno
<kenvandine> i had added laney and seb128  to all at one point
<kenvandine> but gtk-common-themes came much later
<kenvandine> and i added those involved in theme stuff
<kenvandine> Laney: i just sent you an invitation
<Laney> thx
<Laney> let's come back to this at next sprint or something
<Laney> seb128 would probably appreciate that too
<kenvandine> Laney: looking at some of the others you never accepted them :)
<Laney> nod, I remember getting the emails
<willcooke> kenvandine, is there a way from the snapd cli that I can get snapd to tell me what base the gtk-common-themes snap is using?
<Laney> I think I was put off by the amount of clicking :P
<Laney> if those links will work forever then I'll click them if/when I need it ;-)
<willcooke> kenvandine, we're good
<kenvandine> :)
 * Laney tries one of them
<Laney> yeah seems to
<kenvandine> less /snap/gtk-common-themes/current/meta/snap.yaml
<kenvandine> willcooke: ^^
<kenvandine> and look for base:
<Laney> pub time
<kenvandine> if that isn't there at all, it's core
<willcooke> kenvandine, going afk.  Will be on telegram if you need anything
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-04-17
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: hey can you please review https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/restrictions-on-screenshots-and-videos-in-snap-listings/3087/26?u=kenvandine
<kenvandine> And comment
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, ok
 * duflu waves to kenvandine and robert_ancell
<kenvandine> Hey duflu
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<duflu> It's slightly suspicious that the memory overhead of an Ubuntu session (with 3 extensions) is 48MB higher than vanilla gnome-shell
<duflu> Or maybe higher. That's without a working ubuntu-dock
<jibel> hi all
<duflu> Hi jibel
<didrocks> salut jibel
<seb128> duflu, why do you find that weird? it's not that much overhead is it?
<seb128> (good morning desktopers)
<didrocks> hey seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks, Ã§a va mieux ?
<didrocks> seb128: je commence vraiment Ã  m'en sortir, oui, merci :) et toi/HÃ©lÃ¨ne ?
<seb128> HÃ©lÃ¨ne a un rhume/nez bouchÃ© etc, j'imagine que je suis le suivant :p (j'ai le nez un peu chargÃ© mais pas encore tournÃ© en rhume, je vais essaye de me reposer et faire des tisanes, citron, etc)
<didrocks> argh, ouais, c'est parti pour une petite cure :)
<duflu> Morning seb128. Yeah 48MB is a lot of memory. It's even a big relative increase (+27%)
<seb128> duflu, k, well a GNOME session take over 1G on my machine, so to me it's a 4.8% or less increase...
<duflu> seb128, I mean RSS, not VSIZE :)
<duflu> Should have clarified that
<seb128> duflu, well, thunderbird takes over 200M, e-d-s takes like 100M, gnome-software 80M
<duflu> Last I checked, all that vsize wasn't real memory. It was virtual address space reserved by PulseAudio(!) and graphics stuff. That would be worth revisiting
<seb128> those 48M are not tiny but small compared to other things we have imho
<seb128> is the desktop icons extension the main offender?
<seb128> (I would expect so since that's what does the most objects handling/rendering)
<Laney> moin
<duflu> seb128, it's certainly got some big leaks I am looking at
<duflu> Morning Laney
<didrocks> hey Laney
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you? had a nice London pub&diner evening yesterday?
<seb128> how is disco looking from the office? ;)
<didrocks> no a11y on gdm after installing with a11y enabled, I guess this is known?
<didrocks> (I guess not new)
<seb128> duflu, those leaks are more problematic than the default overhead the extensiosn had imhp
<seb128> imho
<duflu> seb128, yeah which is why it has taken most of the week for me
<seb128> didrocks, that's an issue since we switched to GNOME in 17.10 yes
<duflu> And I just remembered the week ends tomorrow
<Laney> hi duflu didrocks seb128
<seb128> didrocks, afaik at least
<didrocks> yeah, I was wondering if you know the bug # for it
<didrocks> I wouldn't be surprised it's since 17.10
<Laney> seb128: looks OK, which means something bad is going to be discovered today :>
 * duflu offers Laney a blindfold
<didrocks> well, already a respin today, so redoing the tests :p
<Laney> not sure about the dinner, it was a plate of mushrooms with cheese melted on
<Laney> weird
<seb128> didrocks, bug #1796275 is one for example
<ubot5`> bug 1796275 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Disco) "Screen reader is not auto-enabled on first login if enabled when installing" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1796275
<seb128> Laney, where was that?
<Laney> it was called TAP I think
<Laney> we tried to go to this place willcooke had some vouchers for but it was full, that was next door
<seb128> I don't think I tried that one
<seb128> ah ok
<Laney> honest burgers
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, which isn't exactly the remaining bug, as the session itself is good, just not gdm. Let me annotate the description
<seb128> didrocks, or maybe it's worth a new report
<didrocks> ok, let me open a new one
<seb128> ah, honest burgers, I know that one :)
<seb128> didrocks, thx
<didrocks> at worst another dup :p
<seb128> Laney, there is a new one just next to the london bridge station right?
<Laney> seb128: we tried to go near southwark station, that was the closest but I think they have a few yeah
<didrocks> seb128: bug #1825112 if you want to triage
<ubot5`> bug 1825112 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Screen reader isn't actived on gdm if installed with a11y enabled" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1825112
<seb128> didrocks, thx
<didrocks> hum, the g-i-s spinner doesn't spin
<didrocks> so, we are back to "application looks like it's stuck"
<seb128> willcooke had that issue the other day I think
<seb128> it worked for me/others
<seb128> so it's a big/some cases, not all the time
<seb128> (unless the upload from yesterday regressed, I didn't test it yet)
<didrocks> I did several installs, would be good to confirm if the resize change didn't impact it
<didrocks> let me open a bug just in case, not attaching it
<Laney> would be good for someone to look into that, it was happening before the upload even
<Laney> but not in any of the tests I did for it
<Laney> so a bit random, which I don't understand
<didrocks> yeah, would be good to know if it's a 100% hit now
<seb128> or a race and your machine/VM happens to have the speed to hit it
<didrocks> yep
<seb128> do you have any warning in the journal?
<didrocks> I have another install in progress, will look afterward
<willcooke> morning desktoppers.  Happy Disco-1
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<willcooke> hi didrocks, how goes?
<didrocks> feeling better than previous days, yourself?
<didrocks> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-initial-setup/+bug/1825116
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1825116 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu) "spinner waiting for snapd content is frozen" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> willcooke, ^ that looks similar to the one you had the other day I think? did you show it to andy?
<didrocks> like if some blocking call was done in the UI thread?
<didrocks> let's wait for someone else to confirm or not
<willcooke> seb128, didrocks - Yeah I saw it, andyrock and Laney were looking at that yesterday I think
<didrocks> seb128: hum, on your "code copying the settigns is in casper", but this is only for the live session, not the install one where it's ubiquity doing it, no?
<didrocks> settings*
<seb128> didrocks, I would have referenced to the code bug see #ubuntu-devel :p
<didrocks> ahah :)
<didrocks> ah, I guess I understand what you mean
<didrocks> the casper script does the change on the live
<didrocks> for gdm and user session
<didrocks> and as it's what we copy on disk with ubiquity
<didrocks> the install machine has the same setting activated
<seb128> right
<didrocks> ok, I was hesitating as it's mostly gsettings if we had more hooks in ubiquity when hesitating between ubiquity vs casper to file it
<seb128> didrocks, well, it's ubiquity-hook/30accessibility
<seb128> copy_orca_config() does
<seb128> 		cp -r /home/$USERNAME/.local/share/orca /target/home/$TARGET_USERNAME/.local/share
<seb128> 		cp -r /home/$USERNAME/.local/share/orca /target/var/lib/lightdm/.local/share
<seb128> maybe just adding a line with /target/var/lib/gdm(3?) would be enough
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, could be
<didrocks> don't know if there are more gsettings fun needed
<seb128> didrocks, there is probably some to do in casper-a11y-enable as well, it does e.g
<seb128> 			$DO_CHROOT dconf compile /tmp/lightdm.dconf /tmp/casper-a11y-dconf-lightdm.d
<seb128> 			mv $CHROOT_DIR/tmp/lightdm.dconf $CHRO
<seb128> anyway, I play with that
<seb128> but it's too late now to change casper, so it's for next cycle
<seb128> oh, line cut
<seb128> 			mv $CHROOT_DIR/tmp/lightdm.dconf $CHROOT_DIR/var/lib/lightdm/.config/dconf/user
<seb128> so there is a dconf db for lightdm
<seb128> basically we need to do the same for gdm I think
<seb128> I might still poke at it today while it's fresh
<seb128> and we land that directly after disco
<didrocks> yeah, I guess too late for disco anyway and not new. But good if you have time to have a look so that we land it shortly after disco
<didrocks> but yeah dconf db is needed I guess
<Laney> spinner> We didn't actually see it in any of our tests, would be ideal if someone who does could investigate IMHO
<Laney> I've got a screencast of it working in a test install I just did if that's helpful
<seb128> Laney, do you or Andy have any hint of what could be one of the cause code wise/where to poke for someone able to trigger it?
<willcooke> I'll reinstall my test machine in a mo
<willcooke> (10 mins out)
<willcooke> it might be a one off
<Laney> not so much, something something icon theme / librsvg / gdk-pixbuf / try another application like gtk3-widget-factory / check with a different theme
<Laney> https://drive.google.com/file/d/14EpoPYXmj2V-8_F-II1oHteQM683cdwb/view?usp=sharing
<Laney> I uploaded that to Google Drive using gvfs from nautilus
<Laney> what a world
<willcooke> \o/
 * willcooke packs up to get off the train.  bbib
<pieq> tjaalton, hi!
<pieq> tjaalton, jibel told me to get in touch with you regarding an issue with Precision device and the latest 19.04 image
<pieq> tjaalton, https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/p/2bXr2r6k4P/
<tjaalton> pieq: you filed a bug about it earlier, nouveau got disabled and then later re-enabled, so the bug is also reopened
<tjaalton> use nomodeset
<pieq> tjaalton, ok, so for this device we'll use the "safe graphics" option
<tjaalton> yes
<tjaalton> or, nouveau.modeset=0
<tjaalton> since it's a hybrid
<tjaalton> would still use i915
<willcooke> jibel, have you tested/are you able to test nvidia drivers on a secureboot system?
<jibel> pieq, ^
<pieq> willcooke, so... install image, activate proprietary drivers and make sure they install properly?
<willcooke> pieq, yeah, on a machine using secure boot
<willcooke> pieq, and, if you happen to have a machine that uses broadcom wifi, that too, again on secure boot
<pieq> willcooke, I will check nvidia, but for broadcom wifi I don't have any handy now and I have to eod soon :S
<willcooke> pieq, ack, thx
<pieq> willcooke, should I install the 3rd party drivers (nvidia) at install time, or install without, then add them in the Software Update tool?
<willcooke> pieq, yeah check the 3rd party box in the installer
<pieq> willcooke, ok
<willcooke> infinity, sil2100 - FYI ^ pieq is testing nvidia on a secure boot system now ^
<pieq> willcooke, installation going on. One thing I noticed is that when you check "install 3rd party drivers" and click "Continue", it takes *forever* before going to the actual install screen (with the slides)
<pieq> willcooke, I was worried, but then I checked in /var/log/syslog and noticed the system was DLing nvidia-* packages and doing additional stuff
<willcooke> pieq, known issue: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-release-upgrader/+bug/1824905
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1824905 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Provide user feedback when running ubuntu-drivers [was:Long pause when selecting 3rd party drivers during install]" [Medium,Triaged]
<pieq> willcooke, so it might be useful to add some kind of visual feedback for average users
<pieq> willcooke, haha ok :D
<willcooke> glad we're finding the same things :)
<pieq> willcooke, should I add the syslog of my install to that issue?
<pieq> cause it's like... 4-5 minutes gap
<willcooke> pieq, sure, thanks
<pieq> willcooke, looks all good!
<pieq> willcooke, I ever threw in a little full disk encryption
<willcooke> pieq, merci!
<pieq> and everything works and the nvidia prime profile is selected
<pieq> willcooke, de rien !
<willcooke> see you next week pieq
<pieq> the MOK key enrolling process on a Dell BIOS is very... interesting. It couldn't be less appealing.
<willcooke> The big blue box of doom?
<pieq> I don't know how it looks on other devices
<pieq> willcooke, the bbbd indeed :D
<willcooke> :D
<pieq> on a UHD screen it looks every scarier
<Laney> we got a machine with the broken spinner now
<Laney> andyrock is looking at it
<clobrano> hello everyone 0/
<Laney> yeah it's to do with VMs disabling animations
<Laney> i.e. https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gtk-perl-list//2014-December/msg00009.html
<clobrano> didrocks:  thanks for the note on my wiki page! it's awesome
<willcooke> Laney, just FYI in case I'm not around when you get back... elmo's bug... if he blows away his config things work.  So not a release blocker for sure.  He's going to bisect his config and see if he can work out which bit it is.
<Laney> cool
<Laney> could be an extension if any were in use, they are often to blame
<seb128> willcooke, speaking of elmo, could you remind him he was supposed to give us details on a libimobiledevice fix he backported locally to get his iphone correctly working (so we can consider doing a proper SRU for the fix if needed). Also maybe you have access to some extra iOS devices at the office, would be good to just check how are things on Disco with those (access to photo, apps, etc)
<willcooke> seb128, good call - will do that now
<willcooke> (once I'm out this meeting)
<didrocks> clobrano: yw ;)
<willcooke> seb128, good news.  He plugged his phone in and it worked
<willcooke> on D
<seb128> willcooke, good :)
<seb128> willcooke, still worth asking if he remembers the change he backported at the time in case it's something he needs for bionic, if he doesn't then no worry, I just delete that from my list of things to keep checking every now and then until they are resolved
<willcooke> seb128, will do
<sil2100> Trevinho[3v1n0]: hey! You might not know the answer to my question but Lan_ey told me to try poking you anyway (since foss_freedom seems to be not around):
<sil2100> Trevinho[3v1n0]: I'm reviewing budgie-desktop's SRU for bionic that fixes the breakage with the new bionic-proposed mutter - there's a animations.patch there for dealing with that
<sil2100> Trevinho[3v1n0]: what I'm wondering about is if this change requires the new mutter or will that work for both new and old mutter? Since they didn't bump the mutter dependency, wanted to know if that's good or not
<sil2100> Trevinho[3v1n0]: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/419571229/budgie-desktop_10.4+git20171031.10.g9f71bb8-1.2ubuntu1.1_10.4+git20171031.10.g9f71bb8-1.2ubuntu1.2.diff.gz <- patch animations.patch I suppose?
<sil2100> fossfreedom: ^
<sil2100> Trevinho: ^
<Trevinho> sil2100: hey
<andyrock> good morning!
<Trevinho> sil2100: it will work in both, it's just queuing a redraw, which... while might cause some more operations, won't ever cause a problem per se
<sil2100> Trevinho: thanks!
<sil2100> fossfreedom: ^ nvm anymore, ignore my ping here
<Laney> ð¯
<didrocks> awk awk awk, funny for some definition of fun :p
<didrocks> especially as scalar arrays are not really supported for assignement
<Laney> awk?!?!?!
<didrocks> yeah, for zfs grub menu generation
<Laney> :-O
<didrocks> multiple datasets on multiple pools, for multiple machine-id which can have multiple snapshot/filesystem
<didrocks> you can see where arrays of arrays start :)
<didrocks> and as we want to upstream those (it can work without zsys), to upstream zfs/grub, better to use shell+awk than something like python/go
<didrocks> but sometimes, it's a little bit of a PITA with such complex datastructures
<bcurtiswx> anyone else have this issue: clicking an icon in the favorites bar (mines on left side)  (i'm using chrome for example) repeatedly with the window open (full screen)causes the bar to expand and push the window to the right
<bcurtiswx> well, can't reproduce, so nvm for now
<sarnold> bcurtiswx: you didn't miss anything while you were gone
<bcurtiswx> sarnold: ty
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-04-18
<Trevinho> duflu: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/216 is tracked by any ubuntu bug?
<gitbot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 216 in mutter "cogl-winsys-glx: Fix frame notification race/leak [performance]" [1. Bug, 5. Cogl, Merged]
<duflu> Trevinho, no it was found in an experimental branch which never survived :)
<duflu> Not relevant to reality, yet
<Trevinho> duflu: ok, any bug you know has been fixed in between git log b2d0184c6...3.32.1
 * duflu searches
<Trevinho> maybe https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/issues/542 is tracked?
<gitbot> GNOME issue 542 in mutter "Crash with additional GPU-less KMS display device" [1. Crash, 5. Backend: Native, Closed]
 * duflu searches more
<duflu> Trevinho, only in gnome-shell. I have been monitoring git and updating bugs already... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=fixed-in-3.32.1
<duflu> Nothing in mutter I know of
<Trevinho> ok, good that was the only one I knew too
<duflu> Trevinho, AFAIK no Ubuntu users are using devices like that in #542, yet
<Trevinho> new 3.32.1 g-s stack is finally out, debian packaging ready... I'll prepare ubuntu ones once Laney will upload those :P
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey trevinho
<Trevinho> hi seb128
<seb128> trevinho, SRU a this point, you can already prepare them, L_aney is going to need something to review if you want him to upload :)
<seb128> trevinho, how are you?
<Trevinho> seb128: see #debian-gnome, is already there for review
<seb128> ah, I misread what you wrote
<Trevinho> seb128: as per SRU stuff, it's going to be easy, but I want debian to be relased first so I can merge with the debian tag
<seb128> you will prepare the Ubuntu ones once the Debian ones are uploaded
<Trevinho> I'm good, though :)
<seb128> is that to avoid having to rebase in the Debian side change?
<Trevinho> just back from awesome tacos... And actually about to sleep :P
<seb128> :)
<seb128> have a good night!
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, I'd prefer to have debian set
<Trevinho> however let's hope we can avoid to have this problems soon if we get salsa for us too
<seb128> right
<seb128> you can merge from the commit you think is going to be tagged
<seb128> but you can also go to bed and see if your uploads getting sponsored during the day :)
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> Hi all
<didrocks> salut jibel
<duflu> Morning didrocks and jibel
<seb128> (back)
<seb128> lut didrocks jibel
<seb128> tseliot, did you get a chance to test bug #1822937?
<ubot5`> bug 1822937 in nvidia-settings (Ubuntu) "NVIDIA settings won't write to /etc/xorg" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1822937
<didrocks> hey duflu, seb128
<willcooke> Good morning disco desktoppers
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<Laney> moin
<seb128> hey willcooke, Laney
<seb128> happy disco day!
<willcooke> hi didrocks seb128
<didrocks> hey Laney
<seb128> willcooke, bug #1825230 is one for you :p
<ubot5`> bug 1825230 in ubuntu-wallpapers (Ubuntu) "She should work at Canonical" [Wishlist,Opinion] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1825230
<willcooke> :DD
<tseliot> seb128: no, not yet
<seb128> tseliot, k, I wonder if that's a missing depends on the screen extra package, the bt on the bug has a dbus error due to that one missing
<tseliot> seb128: nvidia-settings (at least the one in the archive) had Depends: pkg-config, screen-resolution-extra (>= 0.12)
<seb128> tseliot, k, let's see the dpkg output from that user then
<tseliot> ok
<seb128> andyrock, hey, are you still looking for bugs to poke at and are you busy enough atm? ;)
<seb128> andyrock, bug #1825153 do you plan to do something about it
<ubot5`> bug 1825153 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu) "Spinner in "apps" page keeps spinning if there is no connectivity" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1825153
<seb128> Laney, andyrock, didrocks, or should we reassign to gtk with a "spinner don't animate in a VM" description
<Laney> that's not the bug I commented on yesterday
<Laney> but maybe
<seb128> sorry I meant bug #1825116
<ubot5`> bug 1825116 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu) "spinner waiting for snapd content is frozen" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1825116
<seb128> picked the wrong one in the bug list, the title was close enough that it confused me
<seb128> Laney, ^ I meant
<Laney> certainly not g-i-s
<seb128> I reassign to gtk then
<Laney> probably not going to be a quick hack for andyrock though
<seb128> no, I think if GTK upstream decided to turn those off rather than fix the animations to not suck that's probably because it's not easy
<seb128> which makes me think it's probably not something we are going to do either (unless we decide it's important enough, but I don't think that's the case atm)
<Laney> right
<seb128> reassigned/retitled at least
<seb128> thx for the input :)
<didrocks> seb128: I think upstream gtk makes sense as well. Sounds wrong to turn in particular the spinner animation off
<didrocks> as you are supposed to tell "we are doing work, it didn't hang"
<didrocks> so maybe reducing the animation tick rate
<didrocks> for VM, but not disabling it
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, well my take from the discussion/fact that they that is that they have code issues that makes non trivial to workaround way
<seb128> and it's probably a known bug upstream, I'm having a look
<didrocks> yeah, probably known, still worth checking, thx!
<seb128> basically https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gtk/issues/408
<gitbot> GNOME issue 408 in gtk "GtkSpinner animation eats too much CPU" [Css, Gtkspinner, Other Widgets, Performance, Bugzilla, Opened]
<didrocks> :(
<seb128> andyrock, the bug poking I had in mind is low priority, it's https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1801912
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1735071 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1801912 Ctrl + F search disengages immediately after CTRL + F pressed" [Low,Confirmed]
<seb128> seems another IM related GTK_IM_MODULE=xim workarounds it
<seb128> file-roller has a similar issue (but not under wayland)
<tseliot> seb128: I can reproduce the problem here. Something is definitely broken
<andyrock> seb128: hey! I'll take a look :)
<seb128> andyrock, thx
<seb128> tseliot, ah, good :)
 * duflu falls off chair
<duflu> That's me done till Tuesday ish
<duflu> Night
<marcustomlinson> Loving 19.04 guys. Good job! The slickest release yet
<seb128> marcustomlinson, thx :)
<willcooke> Well done everyone!
<seb128> thx willcooke
<seb128> indeed, well done team, smooth cycle and solid result!
<didrocks> ;)
<ricotz> \o/
<cyphermox> \o/
<andyrock> seb128: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-software/merge_requests/199
<gitbot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 199 in gnome-software "shell: Don't progate CTRL+F key pressed event" [Opened]
<andyrock> this should be enough to fix the ctrl+f issue
<seb128> andyrock, woot, do you understand why using xim made it work? (also it works on fedora today, but that might be due to the fact they use wayland/wayland-im)
<andyrock> no tbh but stopping the event shoudl be the right thing to do
<andyrock> likely it was just a typo
<seb128> k
<seb128> file-roller doesn't use GDK_EVENT so probably not the same bug :/
<seb128> (bug #1825085)
<ubot5`> bug 1825085 in file-roller (Ubuntu) "[Ubuntu 18.10] Ctrl+F search does not work" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1825085
<Trevinho> hello
<didrocks> hello and goodbye Trevinho ;)
<Trevinho> oh, EU time is over :)
<Trevinho> bye didrocks
<didrocks> see you tomorrow! ;)
<Trevinho> ah I thought was holidays in FR
<Laney> bye
<Laney> see you TUESDAY!
<seb128> cyphermox, bug #1825206 claims to be a SRU regression
<ubot5`> bug 1825206 in netplan.io (Ubuntu) "No wifi adapter present in Gnome after upgrade to 0.96-0ubuntu0.18.10.2" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1825206
<seb128> sorry I meant that to be on devel
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-04-19
<jibel> good morning
<sarnold> Fri 19 03:41:33
<sarnold> very early morning indeed
<pieq_> jibel, what are you doing here so early!?
<jibel> pieq, hi, some stuff to finish before leaving for taipei tomorrow
<pieq> jibel, for a minute I actually thought you were already in UTC+8 timezone, cause it's 12:20PM here :D
<pieq> jibel, good luck and bon voyage !
<jibel> it's 6:30 it's fine, I've been up for more than one hour, spring, birds, dawn, everything is quiet :)
<jibel> thank you
<didrocks> good morning
<andyrock> morning all!
<didrocks> hey andyrock
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-04-20
<gpothier> Hi, could someone help with building Nautilus from the git repo? I get a failed (5/17 nautilus)
<gpothier> *TEST, I get a failed TEST (5/17 nautilus)
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-04-21
<Croran> Are there really people who like GNOME better than Unity? If so, why?
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-04-13
<pieq> Morning!
<pieq> hey, does anyone know how to check snap store logs? I'm trying to install a device firmware update, but it doesn't work (I click Update, it seems to be installing something, then it's back to "Update" and if I reboot my device to check, the firmware is still the old version)
<pieq> ha. after another reboot, my device's firmware is now being updated.
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> salut didrocks 
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers
<kenvandine> good morning
<hellsworth> hi kenvandine , did you have a nice weekend?
<kenvandine> hellsworth: i did, and you?
<hellsworth> it was pretty alright :)
<hellsworth> lots of sleeping and drinking tea 
<hellsworth> and snow
<GunnarHj> Good morning hellsworth! the libreoffice arm64 tests are disinclined to pass for libxml2. Can you please take a look, maybe retry?
<GunnarHj> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html#libxml2
<hellsworth> definitely thanks GunnarHj 
<hellsworth> yeah this uicheck-sw fails due to timeouts all the time..
<hellsworth> kenvandine: could you please restart this autopkgtest: https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/request.cgi?release=focal&arch=arm64&package=libreoffice&trigger=libxml2%2F2.9.10%2Bdfsg-5
<kenvandine> hellsworth: done
<hellsworth> thanks
<GunnarHj> hellsworth, kenvandine: Thanks for the retry. Keeping my fingers crossed.
<kenvandine> hellsworth: i updated gnome-2048 to use the gnome-3-34 extension (plus a few tweaks) and reduced the size from 64M to 13M
<kenvandine> hellsworth: did run into one minor issue in the build snap and filed an issue for it
<kenvandine> good morning robert_ancell 
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, hi
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-04-14
<callmepk> good morning all
<duflu> Hi callmepk 
<callmepk> Hi duflu 
<pieq> Morning everyone!
<GunnarHj> Hi robert_ancell! Are you going to work on bug #1867548 very soon? Or is my idea mentioned in comment #7 an option?
<ubot5> bug 1867548 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu Focal) "Right Alt key is suddenly switched off after invoking Settings - Keyboard Shortcuts in Focal" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1867548
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, it's on my list of things to look at but I don't have any experience in that panel. Is this something that was introduced in a commit in gnome-control-center? Can you link to that in the issue if so - then we can ask the person who made the change to fix it.
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Yes, it was introduced through a g-c-c commit a few months ago. It's all explained in the patch I proposed, including a link to the commit I would like to see reversed:
<GunnarHj> https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/gnome-control-center/-/blob/479356ab7c521841c3131c571bfc3384aff2a705/debian/patches/0027-temporarily-revert-alt-char-key.patch
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, I saw that, but the upstream issue doesn't have a link to the commit(s) https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-control-center/issues/918
<gitbot> GNOME issue 918 in gnome-control-center "Right Alt key is suddenly switched off after invoking Settings - Keyboard Shortcuts in 3.35" [6. Component: Keyboard, Opened]
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Now it has. :)
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, thanks
<hellsworth> kenvandine: re the build snap clutter issue, i submitted a pr. please see if it fixes your issue. if you already did that before opening the issue then we can go ahead and merge :)
<hellsworth> thanks for finding that!
<sa-ghosts> there is a Gnome 3.36 bug (it's also related to another bug) that affect people with 1366x786 screens.
<sa-ghosts> here are the links:
<sa-ghosts> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/-/issues/2237
<sa-ghosts> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/-/issues/2234
<sa-ghosts> you could see in the first link it affect gnome in a small way (by changing the dash size)
<sa-ghosts> but in ubuntu 20.04 it causes a more sever affect and that is when you tap out of the appfolder all the icons become very small and if you redo it again it may cause a session crash.
<sa-ghosts> I don't know if you already know this but just to be sure I posted it here.
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<jibel> salut oSoMoN 
<oSoMoN> salut jibel 
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> salut didrocks 
<didrocks> salut jibel 
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks 
<didrocks> bon week-end oSoMoN ?
<seb128> gooood morning desktopers
<didrocks> salut seb128, bon week-end ?
<seb128> lut didrocks, ouais et toi ? 
<didrocks> Ã§a va
<jibel> salut seb128 
<seb128> lut jibel, comment Ã§a va ? vous avez passÃ© un bon w.e?
<oSoMoN> didrocks, oui, trÃ¨s bon, merci
<oSoMoN> salut seb128 
<jibel> Ã§a va, je ne vois plus trop les diffÃ©rences entre la semaine et le w-e, mais il est passÃ© 
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, comment Ã§a va ?
<didrocks> jamesh: oh, you wrote your action in typescript! I was expecting you to use python. Cool to see what you have done with the very complete documentation available on this :)
<oSoMoN> seb128, bien, merci
<didrocks> (and with great tests, very cool)
<jamesh> didrocks: mostly because that's what Github's most complete template project uses: https://github.com/actions/typescript-action
<jamesh> didrocks: Python wasn't really an option: you can use it in Docker based actions, but I can't run snapd inside of Docker.
<jamesh> A nodejs action also starts faster
<didrocks> jamesh: ah :) indeed, snapd in Docker, I should have thought about it as a limiting factor. I looked a week ago at the github action documentation itself again (more on a consumer side) and it didnât evolve much from when I started to migrate zsys CI to it (meaning: very lacking in term of events and the objects that are sent back to you)
 * didrocks still hope that one day, we can use github packages (local containers) in github CI, which, weirdly, isnât the case yet
<jamesh> Having a template project with a test suite and linter already set up is great if you're just learning (or relearning) the language
<didrocks> indeed
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN, jibel, didrocks, seb128 
<duflu> Afternoon everyone else
<didrocks> hey duflu 
<snowdin> oSoMon: are you the maintainer of the firefox-trunk PPA? 
<snowdin> I have a few bugs to report, can I DM you?
<marcustomlinson> morning oSoMoN jibel didrocks seb128 jamesh
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson 
<duflu> Hi marcustomlinson 
<jamesh> hi marcustomlinson 
<jibel> morning marcustomlinson 
<seb128> hey duflu, marcustomlinson, how are you? had a good w.e?
<marcustomlinson> seb128: yeah good thanks, w.e. was nice. how are you?
<seb128> marcustomlinson, good as well, w.e was nice enough, would have been better if we were not locked down and isolated, was a bit weird to just be us on sunday
<duflu> seb128, only scratched the surface on many jobs at home. Need more long weekends. I think there's another one in a couple of weeks :)
<seb128> :-)
<Laney> moin
<oSoMoN> hey duflu, marcustomlinson, Laney 
<duflu> Morning Laney
<Laney> yo ho oSoMoN duflu 
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you? had a good w.e?
<Laney> hey seb128 
<Laney> yes it was actually very welcome to have 4 days off
<seb128> great
<Laney> might have to do that again after the release :-)
<tintou> Good morning there, I've seen that `ubuntu-system-service` is still a recommended dependency of gnome-control-center but the patch to use it is no more included in focal, is there any specific reason to keep it there? Also, is there anything else that is setting the system-wide proxy configuration?
<Laney> I guess not
<seb128> we have a todo to port/fix that patch
<seb128> but meanwhile probably not indeed
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master 9ef6522 Iain Lane debian/ control control.in * control: Stop recommending ubuntu-system-service * https://deb.li/ijvh4
<Laney> there we go
<RikMills> morning
<RikMills> any more definite ubiquity uploads planned?
<Laney> yes
<seb128> jamesh, kenvandine, robert_ancell, do you know what's the status of the https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/1:11.1-1ubuntu7.5 SRU? It's in proposed since december and now blocking other fixes the OEM team needs, can we get it moved to updates so the next SRU can be accepted?
<RikMills> Laney: ok. I will ask what I should have. likely to be before final freeze? I have some cosmetic bugs to fix for KDE, but little time to work on them
<Laney> RikMills: Definitely, we would try to avoid uploading the installer after final freeze unless it's actually broken
<jamesh> seb128: I think it was waiting on jdstrand to sign of on it again
<RikMills> Laney: ok. thanks. I know where I stand then. worst case could be getting them in for point release if any other fixes are required for that
<seb128> jdstrand, ^
<Laney> definitely, SRU is just fine
<mantas-baltix> hi
<mantas-baltix> I've updated and fixed lots of snap store translations five days ago, but I don't see new translations in latest snap-store 20200413.ac9047f from latest/beta channel :(
<mantas-baltix> Could someone fix this ? Which launchpad translation is used for official snap-store build, used in Ubuntu 20.04 daily?
<seb128> mantas-baltix, hey, we need an export of translations and import, I will make sure that happens before focal is out
<duflu> seb128, releasing 7.5 will also close these: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bugs?field.tag=update-reverted
<mantas-baltix> seb128, it would be nice to see translated snap-store before Ubuntu 20.04 :) I still don't sure which launchpad translation is used for official snap-store build, used in Ubuntu 20.04 daily :(
<seb128> duflu, right
<seb128> mantas-baltix, https://translations.launchpad.net/snap-store
<mantas-baltix> But not all strings are included at https://translations.launchpad.net/snap-store/trunk/+pots/snap-store/lt/+translate :(
<mantas-baltix> seb128, it seems all Snap-store interface strings ar at https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/focal/+source/gnome-software/+pots/gnome-software/lt/+translate
<seb128> mantas-baltix, can you give an example?
<seb128> one string that is missing
<mantas-baltix> seb128, lots of strings, see bug #1872364 and bug #1870777
<ubot5> bug 1872364 in snap-store "Launchpad translations are not exported back to the snap package" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1872364
<ubot5> bug 1870777 in snap-store "Make new Snap-related strings translatable on Launchpad" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1870777
<seb128> mantas-baltix, I'm asking for one example to be able to check with one, others will probably be the same issue
<seb128> oh well, I will check the bugs later
<RikMills> can I update the ubiquity .po files directly in a merge, or do they need some regeneration by something?
<RikMills> I just want to remove 'KDE PIM suite' from being mentioned on the software selection page
<seb128> rikMills, you don't need to bother updating the .po, when the template will be updated launchpad will stop exporting the translations and next translation update will be without those, meanwhile it doesn't create issue to have strings in .po which aren't used in the UI
<mantas-baltix> seb128, for example search for "snap" at https://translations.launchpad.net/snap-store and you find only one string, but at https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/focal/+source/gnome-software/+pots/gnome-software/lt/+translate?search=snap&show=all&direction=backwards&start=30 I find 36 string, for example "You donât need an account to install
<mantas-baltix> public snaps"
<RikMills> seb128: I am not taling about removing a used string. it needs keeping but altering
<RikMills> *talking
<seb128> rikMills, ah, don't do that now :p
<RikMills> seb128: I can't really leaving it telling users that some software will be installed, when it will not
<RikMills> well, I can, but that is bad bad
<seb128> what's the string you want to change and from what to what?
<seb128> is that in the slides?
<RikMills> no, in the main ubi software selection page
<RikMills> debian/ubiquity.templates: Web browser, utilities, office software, KDE PIM suite plus additional internet applications and media players.
<RikMills> need to remove 'KDE PIM suite '
<RikMills> in all the .po, it is either not translated, or very obvious what has to go as 'kde pim' is still there 
<seb128> RikMills, so yes, you can patch the .po in source, launchpad will import the new string/translations
<seb128> looks like it should be fine
<seb128> it's always a tricky business to change translations like that though, some locales have forms changing according to the number of objects listed
<seb128> so you mean introduce a translation error by doing such changes
<seb128> it seems rather low risk there though
<seb128> so hopefully no translator comes back angry at you :)
<RikMills> seb128: thanks. that is most critical thing I have. yes, slight error here are better IMO than giving users false info
<Wimpress> Morning desktoppers
<RikMills> o/
<duflu> Morning Wimpress 
 * duflu finishes reviewing 181 bugs and falls off chair
<duflu> Though it was a 4 day weekend so per day that's fewer than last week
<seb128> duflu, good job, enjoy your evening!
 * duflu closes email so he can't see any more
<duflu> Oh we have Xorg 1.20.8
<seb128> yes, that migrated out of proposed a bit earlier
 * duflu closes another performance bug
<duflu> seb128, that's the Xwayland runs at 58 FPS issue. Nice to see it fixed
<duflu> I though we'd have to wait till 20.10
<tjaalton> ;)
<duflu> ð
<tjaalton> haha
<duflu> I also thought.
<seb128> duflu, :-)
<xnox> seb128:  Laney: can you please review https://code.launchpad.net/~xnox/debian-cd/drop-integrity-check-menu-entry/+merge/381966 and https://code.launchpad.net/~xnox/debian-cd/no-try-only-do-in-grub/+merge/381967 ?
<Laney> Later probably, trying to finish wrestling with ubiquity atm
<xnox> Laney:  yes ubiquity wresting is the best, and probably more urgent =)
<Laney> currently yak shaving tbh
<Laney> need to get hold of this 'swtpm' thing to test with an emulated tpm
<jdstrand> seb128, jamesh: oh! that was waiting on me? ok, sure, I'll test that
<seb128> jdstrand, hey, thank you!
 * Laney writes a weekly summary
<Laney> 'scuse the delay
<seb128> kenvandine, hey, how are you? had a nice w.e?
<tjaalton> oSoMoN: hi, have you seen bugs about firefox webgl being broken?
<oSoMoN> tjaalton, yes, I'm looking into that right now (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/1872586)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1872586 in firefox (Ubuntu) "firefox won't display WEBGL web page in 20.04 ok in 19.10" [Undecided,New]
<tjaalton> oSoMoN: it's a bug in libdrm :)
<kenvandine> hey seb128, i did
<kenvandine> seb128: and you?
<tjaalton> and I have a fix
<oSoMoN> tjaalton, that's very good news :)
<tjaalton> was a regression there, it can't find the driver
<tjaalton> I'll move the bug
<oSoMoN> thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, I had, thanks!
<seb128> kenvandine, can you tell me the difference between the snap-store and snap-store-3-36 branches?
<kenvandine> snap-store was the 3.34.x 
<kenvandine> snap-store-3-36 is the update to 3.36
<kenvandine> which is what's in focal now
<kenvandine> soon to be pushed to snap-store
<seb128> seems backward
<kenvandine> snap-store is where we are keeping the latest supported version
<kenvandine> snap-store-VERSION is working branches
<kenvandine> usually short lived
<seb128> so snap-store is stable, not trunk
<seb128> ?
<kenvandine> yes
<seb128> backward compared to GNOME
<kenvandine> ah
<seb128> it got me confused
<kenvandine> sorry
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> when to you plan to update snap-store?
<kenvandine> probably this week
<seb128> I'm asking because we ship buggy translations because we asked people to translated 'snap-store'
<seb128> not -3.36
<kenvandine> ah
<seb128> annoying :-/
<kenvandine> maybe we can flip it for the future
<seb128> I'm wondering how to fix the situations without waiting for you to land 3.36 to the non versioned branch
<kenvandine> when robert rebases on ubuntu-master he's been creating these branches
<marcustomlinson> oh dang, monday update
<kenvandine> seb128: actually
<kenvandine> i can push it to snap-store now :)
<kenvandine> just not release to the stable channel until i'm sure
<seb128> kenvandine, that would help, thanks
<kenvandine> it's close enough
<kenvandine> sure
<seb128> kenvandine, then we need to do a new translation export and include it in the snap recipe
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey Heather
<seb128> exactly in time for the meeting!
<oSoMoN> good morning hellsworth 
<hellsworth> yep that was on purpose
<hellsworth> just rolled out of bed :)
<seb128> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-04-14
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Apr 14 13:30:55 2020 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-04-14 | Current topic:
<didrocks> hey
<jibel> hola
<seb128> Roll call:  didrocks, duflu (out), heather, jamesh (out), jibel, kenvandine, laney, marcustomlinson, oSoMoN, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out), callmepk
<marcustomlinson> \o
<hellsworth> o/
<oSoMoN> ð°/
<callmepk> o/
<kenvandine> \o
<seb128> I hope everyone had a good Easter w.e!
<seb128> let's get started
<GunnarHj> O/ (I have an AOB thing.)
<seb128> #topic rls-bb-bug
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-04-14 | Current topic: rls-bb-bug
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey, stick around for a bit then :)
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> desktop free
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> no unassigned one
<seb128> #topic rls-ee-bug
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-04-14 | Current topic: rls-ee-bug
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ee-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> desktop free
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ee-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> no unassigned there either, nice
<seb128> #topic rls-ff-bug
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-04-14 | Current topic: rls-ff-bug
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ff-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> let's do that :p
<seb128> bug #1745345
<ubot5> bug 1745345 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "Xorg assert failure: Xorg: /usr/include/xorg/privates.h:122: dixGetPrivateAddr: Assertion `key->initialized' failed." [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1745345
<hellsworth> are we identifying what we can get done before the freeze?
<hellsworth> or still picking the ones we want to be in by ff release?
<seb128> the later one
<seb128> if things don't make it to release they will be SRUed
<seb128> same as we still review bb and ee lists
<hellsworth> yep ok thanks
<seb128> that xorg one seems not new, comment #48 point to fixes that landed
<seb128> I don't think it has enough data to be nominate for rls-ff atm, I vote -1
<hellsworth> yep so -1
<jibel> yeah -1 and re-verifying it ATM
<seb128> thanks jibel
<seb128> bug #1862553
<ubot5> bug 1862553 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in cc_panel_get_title_widget()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1862553
<seb128> I tagged this one, from the description it happens when trying to enable livepatch
<seb128> we want to feature livepatch so it sucks when that experience is buggy
<seb128> also it has some duplicates 
<seb128> I do vote +1 in case it's not obvious :p
<hellsworth> +1
<oSoMoN> +1
<didrocks> yeah, a good test case. +1
<seb128> kenvandine, do you think Robert can take on this one?
<kenvandine> seb128: sure
<seb128> thx
<seb128> (I'm skipping the assigned one that we fail to untag/target previous week)
<seb128> bug #1869571	
<ubot5> bug 1869571 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Vertical dual monitor setup with main monitor on bottom causes overview to only use one eigth of screen" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1869571
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, if the problem happens to be in the livepatch integration in software-properties, IÂ can look into that
<kenvandine> oSoMoN: ok
<seb128> oSoMoN, kenvandine, I think it's a bug in the online account panel in g-c-c, we had a similar one in the past than andyrock fixed
<seb128> I emailed Robert asking for input and pointing to the old patch/commit, let's see
<seb128> so
<hellsworth> +1 on the dual monitor one
<seb128> I don't know how common are vertical stacking of monitors
<seb128> but it has already 8 users subscribed and some duplicates
<hellsworth> +1 but low priority?
<seb128> it's pretty annoying visually and not obvious what the issue is
<seb128> I vote +1
<seb128> medium probably
<didrocks> sounds about right
<seb128> thx
<seb128> (I need to clean out the list, quite some items from previous week that got acted on but not removed from the list)
<seb128> bug #1872103	
<ubot5> bug 1872103 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) " After update to 6.4.2.2: Split database only accessible while running in Safe Mode" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1872103
<seb128> that's a report about 18.04 + ppa
<seb128> does it happen in focal proper?
<hellsworth> ok so this one i haven't tried to reproduce. need to setup a database on a separate system so didn't spend the time yet
<Trevinho> yeah, I untagged some of them
<seb128> I don't really understand the impact but it doesn't look rls material at this point to me?
<oSoMoN> yeah, that would be the first thing to find out
<seb128> k, let's untag for now, please tag it back if it turns out to be an issue on focal and you believe it's important enough to be rls tracked
<oSoMoN> if it does impact focal and is a regression IÂ would say it's rls material
<hellsworth> ok
<seb128> bug #1868666
<ubot5> bug 1868666 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "gnome-shell crashes when resuming from lock screen [st_widget_remove_accessible_state: assertion 'ST_IS_WIDGET (widget)' failed]" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1868666
<seb128> it's incomplete an another leftover it looks like
<didrocks> I got some hang yesterday, not a crash though, same thing in the journal
<seb128> tagging notifxing
<didrocks> unsure if this is the same trigger though
<seb128> didrocks, might be worth reporting with the journal snippet?
<seb128> bug #1867763
<ubot5> bug 1867763 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "gnome-shell crashed with SIGABRT: assertion failure in st_bin_destroy: assertion failed: (priv->child == NULL)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1867763
<didrocks> seb128: could do, unfortunately killing it didnât create a core dump that could be retraced to attach :/
<didrocks> (then the experience is horrible: you log back from gdm in the session and the Shell drops you again in lockscreen immediately)
<hellsworth> +1 on the sigabrt one
<hellsworth> didrocks: i saw that yesterday in a vm too. i have only seen it in a vm though
<seb128> it's easy to trigger here
<didrocks> hellsworth: real metal here :)
<didrocks> sounds like the sigarbrt has some dups, so yeah +1
<seb128> in fact already assigned to Daniel but on one component only
<hellsworth> interesting..
<seb128> I will tide it up also
<seb128> thx
<hellsworth> didrocks: oh sorry, i saw the issue you mentioned about being dropped back to the login screen. i've only seen that on a vm.
<seb128> bug #1870627
<ubot5> bug 1870627 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "Cannot change symbols in charts in LibreOffice Calc 6.4" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1870627
<hellsworth> yeah that happens but only on kubuntu
<seb128> missing recommends/depends?
<hellsworth> i can check that
<seb128> also the submitter mentions he reported it upstream, would be nice to get the reference
<hellsworth> i looked upstream for a bug and couldn't find one. i'll ask him for a link
<seb128> I would vote -1, would be nice to fix in a SRU/in the next upload, but if it's not happening in Ubuntu and only a graphical preference I don't think it's rls
<hellsworth> sgtm
<seb128> bug #1870736	
<ubot5> bug 1870736 in mutter (Ubuntu) "Screen scaling 125% gives 200% (nvidia)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1870736
<seb128> Trevinho, any idea what's going on there?
<Trevinho> seb128 I think is just the driver not handling xrandr properly 
<seb128> Trevinho, ok, so not on our side?
<seb128> any way to confirm that easily?
<Trevinho> I don't think so, I mean all the other drivers are working fine
<Trevinho> I'm quite sure something broke at nvidia level there
<seb128> do you have any xrand command line that could be used to test if that's actually an xrand problem?
<seb128> if so could you comment that on the bug?
<Trevinho> yeah, I will write in the bug
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> bug #1871351
<ubot5> bug 1871351 in gnome-settings-daemon (Ubuntu) "Review the vino/screen sharing situation" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1871351
<seb128> I will take this one, but I patched g-s-d to restore vino's service handling so that's probably good enough for release at this point
<seb128> bug #1871644	
<ubot5> bug 1871644 in firefox (Ubuntu) "Top corners of Firefox windows have weird black protrusions from the rounded edges" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1871644
<oSoMoN> that's a known upstream bug
<oSoMoN> and affects only wayland
<seb128> doesn't seem rls material to me
<oSoMoN> yep, -1Â from me too
<hellsworth> -1
<seb128> that's it for incoming I think
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ff-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> bug #1791405
<ubot5> bug 1791405 in bluez (Ubuntu Focal) "bluetooth always in discoverable mode (security issue)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1791405
<seb128> unsure why Daniel edited this one and why it targets focal, I will just drop the target
<didrocks> yeah, bluez task should be removed, no?
<seb128> maybe, I think there is still a potential problem/fix to be done in the bluez side
<seb128> which gnome-bluetooth workarounded/fixes in the GNOME case
<seb128> I'm not wanting to enter a bug status fight with Daniel over it :p
<Laney> assign him then ;-)
<didrocks> :)
<seb128> haha
<seb128> anyway, untargetted for now with a comment
<seb128> the second one is assigned to me, just not on the g-c-c component, will fix
<seb128> bug #1867908
<ubot5> bug 1867908 in wpa (Ubuntu Focal) "Fix RTM NEW/DELLINK IFLA_IFNAME copy for maximum ifname length" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1867908
<seb128> leftover I think, I said I would upload and forget, will do that
<seb128> and that's it for bugs
<seb128> sorry that some noise was left on the list, we will do better next week, I will tide things up after the meeting
<seb128> #topic update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-04-14 | Current topic: update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<seb128> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<seb128> kenvandine, snapd-glib 1.57 fails to build on armhf, that's also blocking gnome-software, I expected to see Robert follow up on that after upload but that's stuck for some time now, do you know what's the status?
<seb128> remmina is blocked by riscv but wgrant said earlier than he expect the libsecret stack to be good by eod so probably fine
<seb128> pango is waiting for tests to be completed
<seb128> and hplip is another riscv one
<kenvandine> seb128: i don't know
<Laney> we shouldn't have things blocked like that by riscv64
<seb128> kenvandine, can you check with him?
<kenvandine> yup
<Laney> we attempted to set the setting in proposed-migration to fix that but it didn't work
<seb128> :(
<Laney> if anyone has some time to read its code and work out why not that would be very helpful
<seb128> do you have a pointer to the code/where to start?
<seb128> in case someone is wanting to try to dive in
<Laney> well, is anyone?
<seb128> I've a feeling everyone is busy and that's probably a no :-/
<Laney> look in https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-release/britney/+git/britney2-ubuntu/tree/britney.py and work out why, if the arch is in break_arches, you would still get that excuse output
<Laney> right
<Laney> "would anyone like to look at XXX" doesn't really work
 * Laney shouldn't have asked it in that way, sorry
<seb128> I will try to have a look, who knows, fresh eyes or luck maybe :p
<seb128> ok, that's it for that section
<seb128> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-04-14 | Current topic: AOB
<seb128> GunnarHj, you are up :)
<GunnarHj> Thanks..
<RikMills> seb128: ok, proposed my ubiquity merge
<GunnarHj> Bug #1867548 is still open. I talked with Robert this morning, and he asked (on the upstream issue) for input from Bastien, who wrote the code, and whose only reaction was that he doesn't use the feature (aka doesn't want to spend more work on it).
<GunnarHj> My suggestion on the matter is in comment #7 on the Ubuntu bug. The feature is new and of moderate importance, but the bug is bad, which I think justifies my proposal to drop the feature for now.
<GunnarHj> Possibly Robert will fix it before final freeze, so this is to prepare the team for the case he doesn't.
<ubot5> bug 1867548 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu Focal) "Right Alt key is suddenly switched off after invoking Settings - Keyboard Shortcuts in Focal" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1867548
<seb128> GunnarHj, I emailed Robert about that one and the dynamic layout yesterday and he said he would have a look
 * RikMills notices meeting. shuts up
<GunnarHj> seb128: He said that to me to, but also that he isn't familiar with that part of g-c-c.
<seb128> GunnarHj, it has only one duplicate and 2 affected users so while it would be good to fix I'm also not convinced it's our top priority atm, can be a SRU
<GunnarHj> seb128: It affect quite a few users - those who use "English (US)", "Russian", "Chinese"... Not sure that the numbers of affected users in the dev cycle is a good measure...
<seb128> GunnarHj, so there is no 'Alternate Characters Key' defined by default?
<seb128> and it got set the first time you open the settings?
<seb128> I don't even understand what 'alternate characters key' is...
<seb128> GunnarHj, I don't think we need to hold the team/meeting on that, let's keep discussing after wrapping
<seb128>  
<GunnarHj> seb128: Not as dconf setting. For those who use kb layouts with 3:rd level symbols it's defined via the layout. Yes, it's set behind the scenes once you open the Keyboard panel.
<seb128> any other topic?
<kenvandine> RC week, yay!
<kenvandine> that is all from me :)
<seb128> indeed :p
<seb128> time to look at your assigneed rls bugs and do something about those!
<seb128> Wimpress, we could use that weekly discourse post that usually goes out on monday :)
<kenvandine> seb128: the snap-store branch is now the 3.36 base
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks!
<kenvandine> Tuesday, it's the new Monday
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> at least this week
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> indeed
<kenvandine> it was really quiet yesterday
<seb128> ok, let's wrap on that note :)
<seb128> thanks team!
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Apr 14 14:21:43 2020 UTC.  
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2020/ubuntu-desktop.2020-04-14-13.30.moin.txt
<didrocks> thanks!
<marcustomlinson> thanks
<hellsworth> thanks!
 * Laney cries at launchpad timeouts
<marcustomlinson> indeed
<seb128> GunnarHj, I don't really understand the issue, is that key unset for those locales or set to something else? can't we just add the 'unset' option to the list and make the default to not change the config?
<seb128> Laney, I mentioned that on #launchpad before the meeting and they killed the gc job hopping it would be better
<Laney> yeah I saw
<Laney> hopefully will clear up
<seb128> it was mostly fine during my editing in the meeting
<seb128> but maybe I got lucky
<Laney> getting 503s now
<GunnarHj> seb128: Yes, something like that. But to me it's not a "just" thing.
<seb128> Laney, :-(
<GunnarHj> seb128: For those layouts the key is unset, i.e. it works the same way as <Left Alt> by default.
<GunnarHj> seb128: And those users, who usually use <Right Alt> instead of <Left Alt> finds that the key suddenly does not work as intended.
<seb128> GunnarHj, do you know how to query what 'alternate character key' is? and what right click is doing?
<seb128> just for testing/debugging
<seb128> also how to unset it from a command line aftet g-c-c screwed it?
<GunnarHj> seb128: What happens is that 'lv3:ralt_switch' is added to xkb-options without the user asking for it.
<GunnarHj> $ gsettings get org.gnome.desktop.input-sources xkb-options
<GunnarHj> ['grp_led:scroll', 'lv3:ralt_switch']
<GunnarHj> The safest way to reverse it (without touching the other values in the list) is to use Tweaks.
<seb128> GunnarHj, k, thanks, I will poke at it tomorrow if Robert doesn't pick it up before
<seb128> GunnarHj, thanks
<GunnarHj> seb128: yw
<seb128> clobrano, looks like you are good to go for the yaru bugfix update, got the r-t and documentation acks now :)
<oSoMoN> seb128, gvfs still needs merging, right?
<seb128> oSoMoN, correct
<oSoMoN> IÂ didn't have time for it last week, but I'll get to it today
<seb128> great, thanks!
<oSoMoN> I will need sponsorship to upload
<kenvandine> oSoMoN: i can sponsor if you need
<oSoMoN> thanks, I'll ping you when IÂ have a package ready
<kenvandine> hellsworth: thanks for the libinput fix, building the sdk snap for candidate now
<seb128> oSoMoN, it's time you apply for coredev :)
<oSoMoN> seb128, one application at a time (mozilla packageset is pending review by the board next week)
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> oSoMoN, good to see that you managed to get Chris to comment on that one :-)
<clobrano> seb128, awesome, thanks
<kenvandine> hellsworth: i just ran into an issue building gnome-3-34-1804-sdk
<hellsworth> oh?
<kenvandine> clutter fails to build because pango pkgconfig file says it requires a newer glib
<kenvandine> Package 'pango' requires 'glib-2.0 >= 2.59.2' but version of glib-2.0 is 2.56.4
<kenvandine> that is during the clutter part
<kenvandine> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/474565298/buildlog_snap_ubuntu_bionic_amd64_gnome-3-34-1804-sdk_BUILDING.txt.gz
<hellsworth> now that's interesting. why haven't we hit that before?
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> it's finding the wrong glib
<kenvandine> the build snap builds glib-2-62
<kenvandine> so maybe libinput-dev brought in glib deb?
<kenvandine> sigh... 
<hellsworth> ho hum
<hellsworth> i guess need to build libinput-dev then
<kenvandine> yeah
<hellsworth> let me look into that in a bit. need to get a LO build going first
<kenvandine> ok
 * kenvandine reopens bug
<clobrano> didrocks, seb128: Yaru 20.04.5 PR ready https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/pull/2148
<gitbot> ubuntu issue (Pull request) 2148 in yaru "update changelog for release 20.04.5" [Open]
<hellsworth> yup thanks
<kenvandine> hellsworth: actually, this still doesn't make sense
<kenvandine> you added libinput-dev to stage-packages
<kenvandine> it was already in build-packages
<hellsworth> right. it was in build-packages not stage packages
<hellsworth> you said you needed it to be staged
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> we need that staged
<kenvandine> so this change shouldn't have caused this build failure
<hellsworth> oh yeah. it shouldn't have affected the build at all
<hellsworth> strange
<hellsworth> why would building clutter trigger a pango dependency error? pango was already built.
<kenvandine> clutter build is reading the variables from pango's pkgconfig
<hellsworth> let's see if it fails in the same way with your current rebuild
<kenvandine> because it build deps on pango
<kenvandine> pango says it needs glib
<kenvandine> hellsworth: this is my current rebuild
<kenvandine> it built successfully not long ago
<hellsworth> but i see you have current builds going for .. oh wait those are arms
<kenvandine> right
<kenvandine> it makes me think maybe the latest snapcraft release?
<hellsworth> but the last passing build of gnome-3-34-1804-sdk was built with snapcraft 3.11, no?
<kenvandine> when did that land in candidate?
<kenvandine> we build with snapcraft from candidate
<kenvandine> it was last built on 3/25
<hellsworth> yeah i'm pretty sure it was still in candidate then
<kenvandine> yeah it was
<hellsworth> let me do a local build with --debug and try poking around
<kenvandine> ok
<hellsworth> and the failed buidl was with snapcraft in stable, correct?
<didrocks> clobrano: excellent! Iâll give it a try tomorrow and release :)
<seb128> diddledan, clobrano, thanks!
 * diddledan usurps all your tabs
<seb128> lol
<seb128> didrocks left meanwhile
<seb128> diddledan, sorry :)
<diddledan> :-p
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/gvfs/-/commits/ubuntu/master/ should be ready for upload
<kenvandine> oSoMoN: uploaded
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, thanks!
<bittin> Hello, any desktop meeting today?
<luna-> Any Ubuntu Desktop and Ubuntu Women Meetings tonight?
<Laney> desktop meeting was a few hours ago
<luna-> Laney: alright any log?
<Laney> yes on irclogs.ubuntu.com
<luna-> Laney: thanks :)
<Laney> xnox: will look at your debian-cd merges first thing tomorrow
<xnox> Laney:  cool!
<xnox> Laney:  do you want a sample image built with them committed?
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: good morning
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, hi
<robert_ancell> Has anyone else had Firefox stop working with WebGL? (https://webglreport.com/)
<robert_ancell> On focal.
<Wimpress> robert_ancell: Yes. 
<Wimpress> I'm using the snap.
<robert_ancell> Wimpress, I'm using the deb
<Wimpress> Eeek. Then something is very broken somewhere.
<Wimpress> Also, o/
<Wimpress> :-)
<Wimpress> How are you?
<robert_ancell> Wimpress, good, yourself?
<Wimpress> Yep, basic survival accomplished.
<robert_ancell> Success.
<robert_ancell> Wimpress, oh, I have a question you might know. Was Raspberry Pi / Raspbian considered for a snapcraft.io landing page, e.g. https://snapcraft.io/install/go/debian
<robert_ancell> It would be essentially the same instructions as Debian, but with RPi branding. I think RPi users in general won't know it's Debian.
<Wimpress> Yeah, we should address that.
 * Wimpress adds TODO
<robert_ancell> ok, I was about to file an issue for it, do you still want that or have you got it?
<Wimpress> Yeah, please do file an issue again the site.
<Wimpress> There might have been reasons in the past.
<Wimpress> But we can over come that.
<robert_ancell> For context, I'm working on a project that I want to target RPi users (https://snapcraft.io/elf)
<Wimpress> :-D
<tjaalton> robert_ancell: webgl will get fixed once libdrm goes through proposed
<Wimpress> Thanks tjaalton 
<robert_ancell> tjaalton, ah cool. I figured it would be something like that. Thanks!
<tjaalton> I hit that myself and then noticed it was filed upstream..
<robert_ancell> Wimpress, https://github.com/canonical-web-and-design/snapcraft.io/issues/2667
<gitbot> canonical-web-and-design issue 2667 in snapcraft.io "No landing page for Raspberry Pi" [Open]
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-04-15
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/fprintd-async 039362a Marco Trevisan * pushed 1123 commits (first 5 follow) * https://deb.li/8BFe
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/fprintd-async 6e16cd8 Robert Ancell debian/ (25 files in 2 dirs) * https://deb.li/3NON0
<KGB-0> * debian/patches/0003-info-overview-Use-the-Ubuntu-logo-prominently.patch:
<KGB-0>   - Fix Ubuntu logo not showing in about panel (LP: #1864577)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1864577 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu Focal) "Ubuntu logo is not displayed in the 'About' Pane" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1864577
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/fprintd-async 34443ac Sebastien Bacher (31 files in 10 dirs) * https://deb.li/R27z
<KGB-0> Merge branch 'upstream/latest' of salsa.debian.org:gnome-team/gnome-control-center into upstream/latest
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/fprintd-async 7eb491e Sebastien Bacher (40 files in 12 dirs) * Merge remote-tracking branch 'salsa/debian/master' into ubuntu/master * https://deb.li/3zcVs
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/fprintd-async aadd4c4 Sebastien Bacher debian/changelog * upload to focal * https://deb.li/33Fdv
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/fprintd-async 0182db4 Robert Ancell (19 files in 2 dirs) * New upstream version 3.36.0 * https://deb.li/iOBgn
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/fprintd-async 039362a Marco Trevisan . * branch deleted
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master Marco Trevisan * [open] merge request !15: debian/patches: user-panel: Don't wait for fprintd on initialization and don't limit enroll stages * https://deb.li/U2Dg
<sa-ghosts> Wimpress, can we get an easy way to switch between 24h time and 12 am/pm time in ubuntu-mate?
<sa-ghosts> for 20.10 ofc
<sa-ghosts> or even 21.04
<sa-ghosts> sorry, I didn't know about the #ubuntu-mate channel 
<KGB-2> gnome-shell signed tags 28584b3 Marco Trevisan ubuntu/3.36.1-5ubuntu1 * gnome-shell Debian release 3.36.1-5ubuntu1 * https://deb.li/3eXJF
<KGB-2> gnome-shell ubuntu/master a0d1ea0 Marco Trevisan * pushed 46 commits (first 5 follow) * https://deb.li/3kBK7
<KGB-2> gnome-shell ubuntu/master ec852ab DuÅ¡an Kazik po/sk.po * Update Slovak translation * https://deb.li/rKI4
<KGB-2> gnome-shell ubuntu/master f21a0ff Florian MÃ¼llner NEWS meson.build * Bump version to 3.34.4 * https://deb.li/3fGiD
<KGB-2> gnome-shell ubuntu/master 6b784e0 Simon McVittie (465 files in 41 dirs) * Merge tag 'debian/3.34.3-1' into debian/unstable * https://deb.li/i7Oad
<KGB-2> gnome-shell ubuntu/master 1cdc9cb Simon McVittie debian/ changelog gbp.conf * d/gbp.conf: Switch to debian/unstable branch * https://deb.li/pXuV
<KGB-2> gnome-shell ubuntu/master 8d74b71 Simon McVittie (5 files in 3 dirs) * New upstream version 3.34.4 * https://deb.li/MLAj
<jibel> morning all
<duflu> Hi jibel 
<jibel> hi duflu 
<seb128> goood morning desktopers
<jibel> salut seb128 
<seb128> lut jibel, comment Ã§a va aujourd'hui ?
<jibel> seb128, Ã§a va bien et toi? beau temps pour aller Ã  la plage :)
<seb128> Ã§a va, le manque d'exercice commence Ã  devenir un peu pÃ©nible
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> lut didrocks, comment Ã§a va chez toi ? ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: Ã§a va ? Et toi ?
<seb128> Ã§a va, juste un peu en manque de mouvement !
<jibel> c'est vrai qu'on commence Ã  faire un peu de gras
<jibel> salut didrocks 
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<oSoMoN> salut jibel, didrocks 
<jibel> bonjour oSoMoN 
<didrocks> hello jibel, oSoMoN 
<jibel> didrocks, I verified that snapshots are taken only once per u-u run and the check on the pid works fine. I don't know why you had 2 at the same time. 
<didrocks> this is annoying, maybe uu crashed and relaunched? weird
<jibel> didrocks, you'd see that in unattended-upgrades-dpkg.log
<didrocks> ah, interesting, boot the vm
<didrocks> I donât have those logs
<didrocks> just /var/log/unattended-upgrades/unattended-upgrades-shutdown.log which is empty
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, en forme aujourd'hui ?
<seb128> didrocks, jibel, I think u-u does split the upgrade in smaller sets instead of applying the stack of updates in one go, but I don't know if it does exit and start again when doing that
<didrocks> seb128: it doesnât from what we were told, and there is no hook. This is why we had the 20 minutes grace period that we narrowed down to checking the pid file, still taking into account if u-u doesnât remove it, to check if it still exists
<jibel> seb128, right, and we want to avoid taking a snapshot for each slice of updates. The process is the same apparently but didrocks had a case where he had 2 snapshots at the same time
<seb128> k
<didrocks> (spoiler alert: u-u doesnât remove all temporary files and when asking the answer was "you are not supposed to look at them"
<didrocks> when I got 2 snapshots at the same second, there was only one transaction (from dpkg log)
<didrocks> this is why this is puzzling
<didrocks> I think letâs keep a look
<jibel> didrocks, https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/fCmj3hn63S/ is the log for this morning. There are many updates but only 1 snapshot
<duflu> Morning seb128, didrocks, oSoMoN 
<seb128> duflu, hey, how are you today?
<jibel> this morning and previous days
<didrocks> hey duflu 
<duflu> seb128, busy but feeling good. I just separated that Xorg crash into a new bug for focal. And populated Trello with everything on the horizon (now more stressed)
<didrocks> jibel: ack, so worked as expected
<duflu> How are you seb128 ?
<jibel> yup
<seb128> duflu, I'm good thanks, I will have a look to trello in a bit, we didn't keep up with updating it as much as we should have recently
<duflu> Yeah I noticed that when I was the only person touching cards some days
<duflu> And other days I was one of the people not updating cards
<seb128> duflu, I assigned some of the gnome-shell issues previous week and this week while we were reviewing the rls-ff-incoming bugs, Marco took his share but he needs some help ... do assignement on launchpad reach you correctly or do you prefer also cards to be created for those?
<duflu> seb128, I put those in Trello today :)
<duflu> Yes I do get the Launchpad emails too
<seb128> k
<seb128> duflu, bug #1869571 might be a good one to start with
<ubot5> bug 1869571 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Vertical dual monitor setup with main monitor on bottom causes overview to only use one eighth of screen" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1869571
<seb128> it got oem tagged now
<duflu> seb128, yes but I will avoid putting it in progress till more cards already started are off the list
<seb128> duflu, I would say this one is more important than plymouth not showing on nvidia (which is only cosmetics for some seconds at boot) if you could trade those (unless you started enough work on the plymouth/nvidia one that you prefer to finish rather go back to it later)
<duflu> Yeah they are started
<duflu> I would waste time if I stopped and had to relearn where I was
<seb128> k, fair enough, I let you work in order then :)
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, la forme, et toi?
<oSoMoN> hey duflu 
<marcustomlinson> morning desktoppers
<didrocks999> hey marcustomlinson 
<oSoMoN> good morning marcustomlinson 
<marcustomlinson> hey didrocks999 .999999999999 and oSoMoN
<didrocks999> :p
<seb128> oSoMoN, Ã§a va, j'ai bien dormi, par contre je manque d'exercice et j'aime pas Ã§a :-/
<seb128> hey marcustomlinson
<duflu> Hi marcustomlinson 
<marcustomlinson> hi seb128 and duflu
<Laney> morning
<didrocks> hey Laney 
<Laney> moin didrocks 
<Laney> you good?
<Laney> immediate agenda: look at xnox's stuff, figure out the BREAK_ARCHES thing in proposed-migration to unblock various things, do queue reviews
<didrocks> Iâm good, thanks! you?
<marcustomlinson> hey Laney
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you today?
<Laney> hey marcustomlinson seb128 
<Laney> yeah good, back in shorts today!
<Laney> I think I'll be happier at work once this release is done
<Laney> might need another 4 day weekend after that, that was good
<Laney> how's it going there?
<seb128> bah, one day I will unmap ctrl-R for reconnecting to the server 
<Laney> didn't see anything, quits/joins are off :p
<Laney> that sounds like a weird thing to have on an easy shortcut
<Laney> seb128: Wimpress: whoever else cares: btw I got vorlon to make a 20.04.1 milestone
<Laney> might want to go through the rls bugs at some point and target those
<seb128> Laney, ah, nice one
<seb128> yes
<jibel> Laney, thanks for noticing the s, fixed
<Laney> jibel: was hoping it wasn't a typo in code somewhere :O
<jibel> it was unfortunately
<Laney> suspected it might have been, as that stuff was c+ped
<Laney> oh well, bug found bug squashed
<didrocks> fortunately, people who have installed it beforehand and who wonât switch to a server-style type wonât notice, but meh :p
<didrocks> thanks Laney 
<marcustomlinson> Laney: hey man, sorry to bug you with this again. the fun hasn't ended: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/1872958
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1872958 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "ubuntu-software keeps being replaced by snap-store" [Critical,In progress]
<marcustomlinson> Could you have a look at the MPs for u-m and u-r-u when you have a chance? It's relatively straightforward
<Laney> marcustomlinson: hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
<Laney> I feel like we could be more general here
<marcustomlinson> ok
<Laney> let me think
 * Laney swooshes wise beard
<Laney> marcustomlinson: something like https://gist.github.com/iainlane/10465ca8f5ddb1c90950ed836f9cf778 - would that work or am I missing something? (quite possible)
<marcustomlinson> Laney: ah
<marcustomlinson> though art smart
<marcustomlinson> let me try that
 * marcustomlinson can't spell thou
<Laney> yeah I sort of feel like we'll end up chasing down a rabbit hole if we start trying to list relationships that already exist in the archive and we should be able to use apt to figure it out
<Laney> hopefully that's right
<marcustomlinson> Laney: yeah your code looks good. just wanted to make absolutely sure. manual testing and autopkgtests are good. pushed
 * marcustomlinson is still amazed at how fast Laney wrote that code...
<seb128> kenvandine, hey, any idea why I can't push to https://code.launchpad.net/snap-store ?
<seb128> the project maintainer is ~ubuntu-desktop
<seb128> so anyone from the team should be able to push no?
<seb128> shrug
<kenvandine> seb128: code isn't hosted on LP
<seb128> I forgot again that it's maintain in gitlab
<seb128> maintained
<kenvandine> i thought i added a link to that
<seb128> I just read the note I made you add last time :p
<seb128> yeah, I just read it :p
<seb128> ignore me
<kenvandine> lol
<kenvandine> there is a mirror on LP
<kenvandine> for builds
<seb128> kenvandine, is it fine it I commit a translation template in po/?
<kenvandine> yes!
<seb128> thx
<Laney> marcustomlinson: 10x engineer innit
<marcustomlinson> Software Engineer X
<Laney> might ask Brian to review this branch now though
<Laney> "why yes, that code I wrote looks great, ship it"
<seb128> kenvandine, do you know how often it usually takes for the git mirror on launchpad to catch up new commits?
<kenvandine> seb128: i think 5 hours
<seb128> kenvandine, bah, patience! thanks
<kenvandine> i can trigger it manually :)
<seb128> please
<seb128> how do you do that? maybe I can do myself?
<didrocks> yeah, itâs between 5 to 6 hours
<kenvandine> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/snap-store/+git/snap-store
<kenvandine> i clicked it
<kenvandine> but it was actually going to run in 12 minutes :)
<seb128> thx
<seb128> didrocks, Wimpress, what was the plan for the pop-icon/gtk-theme packages, should we regularly update with what is in their ppa?
<seb128> like now before focal release?
<oSoMoN> chrisccoulson, ricotz: FYI https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/firefox/firefox.focal/revision/1373
<oSoMoN> I'll apply this change to the thunderbird packaging branches, too
<Laney> Wimpress: Confirm that having "Ubuntu" booting to maybe-ubiquity and not "Try" / "Install" on grub (EFI) boot is the desired behaviour of the ISO please
<Laney> xnox has a MP doing that and I'm ready to merge it
<Laney> maybe confirm by voting approve on https://code.launchpad.net/~xnox/debian-cd/no-try-only-do-in-grub/+merge/381967
<kenvandine> seb128: bug 1870777
<ubot5> bug 1870777 in snap-store "Make new Snap-related strings translatable on Launchpad" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1870777
<kenvandine> seb128: that made me realize we have strings provided by snapd-glib
<kenvandine> so we need the same sort of translation export for snapd-glib
<kenvandine> seb128: but maybe that's what you were working on?
<seb128> kenvandine, I'm working on fixing the snap-store translations state
<seb128> the template on https://translations.launchpad.net/snap-store was outdated
<seb128> snapd-glib you build from source?
<kenvandine> yes
<seb128> I need to check the status of the upstream project translations
<kenvandine> but we should be able to do the same sort of thing for those translations
<seb128> well, no need
<seb128> if upstream has the translations they should be installed by the part build?
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> true
<seb128> I will check that though
<kenvandine> maybe they aren't translated yet
<kenvandine> thanks!
<seb128> speaking of
<seb128> did you talk to Robert about fixing the build?
<seb128> armhf build
<kenvandine> ugh, sorry i forgot
<kenvandine> i got distracted with the appstream issue :)
<seb128> we really need that build to be fixed
<kenvandine> which had me super stressed and up half the night :)
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> i'll will email him now :)
<seb128> it's annoying that he didn't track that by himself :/
<seb128> thx
<kenvandine> i've been pushing him really hard on snap-store related stuff
<kenvandine> but yeah
<seb128> also do you know if he's likely to have slots for the g-c-c bugs assigned to him tomorrow? freeze is coming
<kenvandine> i'll talk to him about that too
<seb128> thx, can you drop me an email or ask him to drop me one
<kenvandine> so looking at update_excuses, snapd-glib seems to be only missing riscv64
<seb128> I will try to pick the g-c-c changes tomorrow if he doesn't
<seb128> oh, armhf built
<seb128> I guess something else got fixed
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/snapd-glib/1.57-0ubuntu1/+build/19128842
<seb128> it built on the 10th
<seb128> when other archs built on the 6th
<Wimpress> Laney: Yes, EFI booting should always boot to maybe-ubquity. 
<Wimpress> Agreed with design and foundations last week.
<Wimpress> Laney, I've added to the merge-proposal.
<Laney> ta
<diddledan> kenvandine, any chance we can get gtk2-common-themes snap released into i386?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, is https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/commit/?id=925d7d794e4d4ada393d070c5fa4560cd22d62a9 what you mean regarding the ubuntu-software package?
<robert_ancell> i.e. that binary package is dead, and should now be empty?
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: oh great
<kenvandine> diddledan: not super excited about that.  As Ubuntu isn't supporting i386 anymore
<kenvandine> diddledan: if we did, what happens when we really can't support it anymore?
<kenvandine> i'd rather never turn it on than take it away from someone in 6 months or a year
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: btw... the missing icons thing i think might be caused by Yaru app icons aren't in gtk-common-themes
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: it's possible it isn't as bad as it looks... just need a rebuild of gtk-common-themes
<kenvandine> which i'm doing now
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, oh great = that is what we should do? I noticed that the snap-store deb only has the new branding on the beta channel. So I wasn't seeing the double icons here until I switched to that.
<diddledan> well 18.04 supports i386 and we've got at least another 3 years of that release being active. then there's other distributions than ubuntu to consider
<kenvandine> true
<robert_ancell> seb128, do you know about the riscv64 build-failure for snapd-glib. Is that a required architecture?
<diddledan> .. wait, riscv, robert_ancell?! :-o
<diddledan> that's .. omg.
<seb128> robert_ancell, don't worry about it, it shouldn't be a blocker and ubuntu-release is working on fixing the migration tools
<sarnold> robert_ancell: probably best to treat it as supported, xnox said the other day when I added it to the security team faq that it ought to be lisetd as fully supported
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, cool.
<robert_ancell> sarnold, in this case it seems the tests are timing out after 30s, which is not long enough. Is there a way to increase that?
<robert_ancell> hmm, or is this meson doing this?
<robert_ancell> aha, it is meson.
<kenvandine> diddledan: i'll think about it
<ogra> hrm ... snap-store segfaults for me on 16.04 Unity when clicking the updates button (it shows three updates in the tab)
<ogra> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/BfP52NJ399/
<ogra> (trying the new beta here)
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you see my snapd-glib email? would have been nice to add the dh-translations/--with translations change to the upload you just did, otherwise the lib is basically untranslated
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, I thought I'd add those to a second release. The first fix is a no-brainer.
<seb128> robert_ancell, k, the translation one is probably trivial as well but another upload is cheap enough
<seb128> on that note calling it a day!
<robert_ancell> seb128, night!
<seb128> thx :-)
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: confirmed, my fix in gtk-common-themes fixes snap-store :)
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, nice!
<kenvandine> looks much better now
<kenvandine> gtk-common-themes had been stripping out icons in the apps dir to save space
<kenvandine> most apps don't need app icons within the snap... but snap-store does :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-04-16
<callmepk> Good Morning
<duflu> Hi callmepk 
<callmepk> Hi duflu
<KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master d1a1f5c Robert Ancell debian/ changelog patches/series patches/0027-window-Stop-using-HdyLeaflet.patch patches/0028-applications-Fix-only-connected-snap-interfaces-show.patch * https://deb.li/3kM6M
<KGB-2> * debian/patches/0027-window-Stop-using-HdyLeaflet.patch:
<KGB-2>   - Disable adaptive layouts, theres some bugs and they're not required on
<KGB-2>     desktop (LP: #1871195)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1871195 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "The adaptive layouts aren't working properly" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1871195
<KGB-2> * debian/patches/0028-applications-Fix-only-connected-snap-interfaces-show.patch:
<KGB-2>   - Fix disconnected snap interfaces not showing (LP: #1870600)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1870600 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "permissions pane only shows currently-connected snap interfaces" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1870600
<KGB-2> gnome-control-center Robert Ancell 155549 * commented merge request !14 * https://deb.li/dcZc
<KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master 5d361e4 Robert Ancell debian/ (5 files in 2 dirs) * https://deb.li/3PVIl
<KGB-2> * debian/patches/0029-applications-Use-new-snapd-glib-API-for-labelling-Sn.patch:
<KGB-2> * debian/control:
<KGB-2>   - Use shared names for snap interfaces, fixing some interfaces that don't
<KGB-2>     have labels.
<KGB-2> gnome-control-center Gunnar Hjalmarsson 155563 * commented merge request !14 * https://deb.li/3ZBHh
<jibel> hi $world
<duflu> Hello jibel 
<jibel> good morning duflu 
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> hi didrocks 
<duflu> biab
<didrocks> hey duflu 
<seb128> goood morning desktopers
<callmepk> Hi seb128 
<didrocks> salut seb128 
<KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master Gunnar Hjalmarsson * [update] merge request !14: Revert the "Alternate Characters Key" commit temporarily * https://deb.li/3ryUn
<Trevinho> hi seb128 maybe you can help to get https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/shell-extensions/gnome-shell-extension-desktop-icons/-/merge_requests/6  in debian? :)
<seb128> hey callmepk, lut didrocks, Trevinho
<seb128> Trevinho, up early or really late? and sure let me have a look
<Trevinho> mh late xD 
 * seb128 hugs Trevinho, brave man, getting the work done
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<KGB-2> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master Gunnar Hjalmarsson * [update] merge request !14: Revert the "Alternate Characters Key" commit temporarily * https://deb.li/3ryUn
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, comment Ã§a va ?
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, peu dormi mais Ã§a va, et toi?
<seb128> je manque un peu de sommeil aussi, mais Ã§a va sinon
<duflu> Morning seb128, Trevinho and oSoMoN 
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you?
<duflu> seb128, doing relatively well considering a short sleep. You?
<oSoMoN> hey duflu 
<duflu> Oh, same
<oSoMoN> we're all in the same boat it seems :)
<marcustomlinson> good morning callmepk duflu jibel didrocks seb128 Trevinho oSoMoN
<marcustomlinson> :)
<jibel> salut marcustomlinson 
<oSoMoN> hey marcustomlinson 
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson 
<seb128> hey marcustomlinson, how are you?
<marcustomlinson> seb128: tiiiiiired. you? ;)
<seb128> a bit tired, just lockdown and streched work hours, not comparable to your tired :p
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Still there?
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, in a meeting but here.
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Ok. I messed it up when trying to squash, but at least I think I rebased the MR so it's merge'able.
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, cool, thanks!
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Will you merge/upload later?
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, I asked seb128 to have a look at it, he's planning on doing a g-c-c upload
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, did you update the changelog?
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Yes.
<seb128> robert_ancell, GunnarHj, it's on my list for this morning
<GunnarHj> seb128: Great! Sorry, but squashing isn't my thing...
<seb128> GunnarHj, neither mine to be honest :)
<Laney> moin
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey seb128 
<Laney> not bad
<didrocks> hey Laney 
<Laney> sunny again!
<Laney> you?
<Laney> hey didrocks 
<seb128> alright, a bit tired but it's almost freeze and then one day to w.e :)
<duflu> Hi marcustomlinson and Laney
<marcustomlinson> hey Laney
<Laney> gude daye duflue ande marcustomlinsone
<jibel> Laney, FYI i'll have another upload of ubiquity after I'm done with bug 1856422
<ubot5> bug 1856422 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "always call mokutil with --timeout -1 when enrolling dkms keys" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1856422
<Laney> jibel: ok, you should sync up with xnox I think for the kernel stuff
<jibel> Laney, also I suppoed you noticed but just to be sure I assigned bug 1873146 to you
<ubot5> bug 1873146 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Focal) "Install Ubuntu 20.04 LTS without network connection on Dell XPS 13 7390 crashed" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1873146
<jibel> suppose*
<Laney> yes, thanks boss!
<xnox> Laney:  i think after livecd-rootfs migrates, and we respin we are actually done for the .0 release.
<xnox> Laney: there is no stray kernels left, and we only ever installs hwe one.
<Laney> oh
<xnox> Laney:  installing oem kernel for the qemu-oem doesn't work.
<Laney> I thought you were still going to fix the oem case anyway
<xnox> i can push it for review, but we don't need it do we? unless there is network and ubuntu-drivers detects oem meta packages over the network?
<Laney> well as soon as we get a new meta pkg which wants it (could happen at any time) we'll need it to work then
<Laney> like pushing new isos
<Laney> not to mention we were going to get QA people to test the oem-qemu-meta case to see if we had any issues to fix
<seb128> is anyone wanting to have a look to merge gsettings-desktop-schemas ? we are still on 3.35.91 which is probably be ok functionally but still isn't great
<xnox> Laney:  hm, true
<KGB-1> gnome-control-center Sebastien Bacher 155620 * commented merge request !14 * https://deb.li/38xLi
<KGB-1> gnome-control-center Sebastien Bacher 155628 * commented merge request !15 * https://deb.li/iOJ2x
<Laney> jibel: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-installer/ubiquity/+git/ubiquity/+merge/382411 should fix that
<KGB-1> gnome-control-center signed tags 2befd84 Sebastien Bacher ubuntu/1%3.36.1-1ubuntu5 * gnome-control-center Debian release 1:3.36.1-1ubuntu5 * https://deb.li/ikxr1
<KGB-1> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master d958ca9 Sebastien Bacher * pushed 13 commits (first 5 follow) * https://deb.li/7Vij
<KGB-1> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master 479356a Gunnar Hjalmarsson debian/patches/ series 0027-temporarily-revert-alt-char-key.patch * Revert the "Alternate Characters Key" commit temporarily * https://deb.li/3rxcR
<KGB-1> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master 039362a Marco Trevisan (TreviÃ±o) debian/patches/ (5 files) * https://deb.li/aMhD
<KGB-1> debian/patches: user-panel: Don't wait for fprintd on initialization and don't limit enroll stages
<KGB-1> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master 51a0825 Gunnar Hjalmarsson debian/ (8 files in 2 dirs) * Rebase to resolve conflict * https://deb.li/3MDyz
<KGB-1> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master e8d24d6 Gunnar Hjalmarsson debian/changelog * Update changelog * https://deb.li/IZ2l
<KGB-1> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master e160c5a Robert Ancell debian/ (5 files in 2 dirs) * https://deb.li/3e8GI
<KGB-1> * debian/patches/0029-applications-Use-new-snapd-glib-API-for-labelling-Sn.patch:
<KGB-1> * debian/control:
<KGB-1>   - Use shared names for snap interfaces, fixing some interfaces that don't
<KGB-1>     have labels.
<KGB-1> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master Sebastien Bacher * [merge] merge request !14: Revert the "Alternate Characters Key" commit temporarily * https://deb.li/3ryUn
<KGB-1> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master Sebastien Bacher * [merge] merge request !15: debian/patches: user-panel: Don't wait for fprintd on initialization and don't limit enroll stages * https://deb.li/U2Dg
<marcustomlinson> Laney: here are the follow-up update-manager fixes you asked for: https://code.launchpad.net/~marcustomlinson/update-manager/update-manager/+merge/382410
<Laney> nice one
<Laney> i'll look later on
<oSoMoN> seb128, I'll do gsettings-desktop-schemas if no one has taken it yet
<seb128> oSoMoN, thanks!
<Wimpress> GunnarHj: Do you know who I can talk to on the docs team about landing a couple of new pages for 20.04?
<Laney> fprintd delta :(
<GunnarHj> Wimpress: Probably me. But that sounds terribly late. The desktop guide is translated also...
<GunnarHj> Wimpress: Is it the desktop guide you meant?
<Wimpress> GunnarHj: We want to land a couple of pages in help.ubuntu.com
<Wimpress> Specifically help.ubuntu.com/rst
<Wimpress> help.ubuntu.com/bitlocker
<Wimpress> We have the content, which has just been post on Discourse
<Wimpress> igordhossegor: Let me introduce you to GunnarHj 
<Wimpress> GunnarHj: May be able to offer assistance landing the RST and Bitlocker pages you've written in help.ubuntu.com
<GunnarHj> Wimpress: help.ubuntu.com consists of two parts: The official desktop and installation docs, and the community help wiki with pages on various topics contributed by the community. Do you possibly have the wiki (help.ubuntu.com/community) in mind?
<igordhossegor> hi gunnarhj: nice to meet you
<igordhossegor> these would be official desktop and installation docs
<igordhossegor> help.ubuntu.com/bitlocker and help.ubuntu.com/rst
<igordhossegor> i have the content (currently topics on ubuntu discourse), but i dont know how to add these pages to the official documentation
<igordhossegor> GunnarHj ^
<GunnarHj> igordhossegor: I can probably help there. But let's first decide on a proper location for those pages given the structure of help.ubuntu.com.
<igordhossegor> unfortunately those two paths are hard-coded into the ubuntu installer
<igordhossegor> i am not sure we can change those
<igordhossegor> wimpress: the installer paths are done, correct?
<seb128> Laney, oh come on :/
<Laney> what
<seb128> <Laney> fprintd delta :(
<Laney> ok
<GunnarHj> igordhossegor: You mentioned installation - there is https://help.ubuntu.com/lts/installation-guide/index.html - could such a page (for 20.04) be a proper place to link from?
<seb128> Laney, https://salsa.debian.org/debian/fprintd/-/merge_requests/1 is going to Debian, I'm just confortable getting https://salsa.debian.org/debian/fprintd/-/commit/120fbfa9 that late in focal which is staged in the Vcs, and we discussed that yesterday on #debian-gnome
<Wimpress> GunnarHj: Those URLs I provided and that igordhossegor are requesting a baked into the installer.
<seb128> Laney, *not* confortable, sorry
<Wimpress> So, if those URLs are not somewhere we can land the actual docs, they will require redirects.
<seb128> Laney, sorry I just found the comment negative/assuming we are adding delta, which is sometime deserved but not in that case
<GunnarHj> Wimpress: Ok... In that case it's not difficult to upload them to those locations - no symlinks needed. But how will people find them?
<igordhossegor> GunnarHj, they will primarly find them from the installer
<igordhossegor> during the installation wizard process
<igordhossegor> we can then in future do a different structure and then make sure they are linked/redirected
<seb128> GunnarHj, https://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/rst.png
<seb128> (sorry Laney for the nickname reference)
<igordhossegor> the pages are currently:
<igordhossegor> rst:
<igordhossegor> https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/ubuntu-installation-on-computers-with-intel-r-rst-enabled/15347
<igordhossegor> bitlocker:
<igordhossegor> https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/ubuntu-installation-on-computers-running-windows-and-bitlocker-turned-on/15338
<GunnarHj> I see. Sure, pass them to me, and I can commit them to the bzr branch we are using for the purpose. Then a cron job will publish them at noon UTC tomorrow.
<seb128> GunnarHj, the screenshot is from the installer, which basically redirect you to the documentation
<seb128> so users should come from here, not from the website/googling
<GunnarHj> seb128: I think I have got that now. :)
<seb128> :-)
<igordhossegor> GunnarHj what format do you need the files?
<igordhossegor> what's the on the discourse good enough - or you need Google Docs or zip file with text and images?
<GunnarHj> igordhossegor: I'm thinking... Do you really want the pages converted to static html, or would redirects to the current discourse pages be better?
<igordhossegor> the redirects can be a short term solution
<Wimpress> GunnarHj: Appreciate your help on this! Thank you :-)
<igordhossegor> but it would be better to have them as static ones for consistency purposes
<GunnarHj> Wimpress: np
<igordhossegor> we can always link to discourse if people want to comment/ask questions
<igordhossegor> just let me know the best format to send you the material
<GunnarHj> igordhossegor: Ok. I think the easiest way is that I simply save those pages to disk using Firefox and then upload them. A detail... They are HTML pages, but the URL:s don't have .html extensions. Will that be a problem?
<GunnarHj> igordhossegor: Maybe I can make e.g. help.ubuntu.com/bitlocker a directory and name the page index.html ...
<igordhossegor> GunnarHj that might not work ... but you can make them as static pages (bitlocker.html and rst.html)
<igordhossegor> we can then ask IS for additional redirects
<igordhossegor> that will be the easy part
<igordhossegor> when you save the files using firefox, there's a lot of discourse related stuff in there
<igordhossegor> best if i just send you the text + images and then you can use them as you best see fit
<igordhossegor> GunnarHj i've saved my google doc drafts as html files (zipped)
<igordhossegor> so they have everything - text and images
<igordhossegor> that's probably the best source, so let me know how you want to grab them
<igordhossegor> alternatively, i can give you access to the two google docs and you can download them yourself (as html)
<GunnarHj> igordhossegor: Yeah, if you don't want the discourse stuff included, that's probably best. Is there a simple URL from where I can get them?
<GunnarHj> igordhossegor: Btw, I can make redirects if needed, so we don't need to involve IS for that.
<igordhossegor> i will share the urls via dm
<GunnarHj> Ok.
<kenvandine> clobrano: I think Yaru's CI is publishing automated builds for gtk-common-themes to the edge channel, which are broken
<GunnarHj> igordhossegor: Ok, I pushed the files. I'm trying with my 'index.html in directories' idea; it should work on the web server. Let's check tomorrow afternoon.
<GunnarHj> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-doc/help.ubuntu.com/help.ubuntu.com/revision/56
<GunnarHj> So we simply have a Bazaar branch, which means that if/when you want to make changes, you can always submit a merge request.
<igordhossegor> GunnarHj sounds good
<fossfreedom> Hi all - quick question hopefully.  I'm on yesterdays Ubuntu Budgie Live ISO - I ran the software updater and it wants to remove gnome-software.  Can I ask why?
<GunnarHj> fossfreedom: Probably because it wants to replace it with the snap version of the same application.
<fossfreedom> umm .... oh dear.
<fossfreedom> Can we some how say "dont replace with the snap" ?
<kenvandine> fossfreedom: you can just install gnome-software again
<fossfreedom> If we wanted the snap we would have seeded it.  End users have reported that the snap is broken under UB - totally transparent
<Laney> the latest update-manager will probably fix that
<fossfreedom> ah - good.  thx.  I'll double check on todays ISO in a couple of hours
<Laney> might not though, if you only recommend it
<fossfreedom> ... checking our seeds ...
<Laney> upgrading to a depends will fix that
<fossfreedom> damn - its a recommendation
<marcustomlinson> Laney and/or Wimpress I wonder if you could weigh in on this? https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/atk/-/issues/18
<marcustomlinson> I'm in over my head here
<KGB-1> gnome-control-center Marco Trevisan 155703 * commented merge request !15 * https://deb.li/lqw2
<marcustomlinson> hoping maybe it rang any bells with you guys. Could the infinite loop be ubiquity's fault? dunno
<Laney> ubiquity *itself* is a gtknotebook
<marcustomlinson> ah
<Laney> oh man, this looks rough
<Laney> xnox: kenvandine: I'm starting iso builds now
<kenvandine> awesome, thanks
<Laney> amd64 only, don't want to have to wait for the arm64 to finish
<Laney> it goes
<seb128> marcustomlinson, you should probably indicate on the upstream report that downgrade to 3.34.1 doesn't show the issue
<seb128> can help them to understand it as well
<seb128> marcustomlinson, also you didn't mention the version you are using/report the bug against
<marcustomlinson> seb128: good point
<hellsworth> good late morning folks
<didrocks> hey hellsworth 
<Trevinho> seb thanks for all those debian (and ubuntu for fprintd) sponors :)
<Laney> sil2100: just checking if you were still planning to review marcustomlinso___n's update-manager branch or want me to?
<sil2100> Laney: I did!
<sil2100> And I merged it + released
<Laney> ah
<Laney> sorry I missed it
<sil2100> Only had nitpicks there, so nothing really terrible
<Laney> thanks for that
<Laney> oh yeah 21 minutes ago in the queue!
 * Laney looks
<sil2100> So I just merged and sponsored
<Laney> ah yay remmina went in after I did the britney fix
<Laney> would have been difficult for anyone not me or p_itti to fix that one probably
<Laney> so good job nobody else took it up
<chudak> Hello all
<chudak> Have a problem and need your help
<chudak> I installed 20.04 beta and then tried adding and switching desktops from gnome to unity 
<chudak> And now see some odd behavior with settings etc.
<chudak> When I check 
<chudak> DESKTOP_SESSION=unity
<chudak> But 
<chudak> ls /usr/bin/*session
<chudak> /usr/bin/dbus-run-session  /usr/bin/gnome-session  /usr/bin/gnome-session-custom-session
<chudak> That looks incorrect to me, but I am hesitant to make any changes and hope someone expert here can help with exact steps how to fix it 
<chudak> thanks in advance 
<sarnold> chudak: what exactly is incorrect?
<seb128> Laney, wooot, well done on fixing britney!
<seb128> I failed to look at that one, but as you said that would probably have been waster time, I didn't have days to invest learning my way there
<seb128> kenvandine, Wimpress, didn't you guys said that you would add gamemode to ubuntu-desktop as a recommends on friday? 
<kenvandine> i think Wimpress said something about that
<KGB-0> mutter ubuntu/master 6661980 Marco Trevisan (TreviÃ±o) debian/patches/ series monitor-config-manager-Fallback-to-closed-laptop-lid-conf.patch * d/p: Fallback to closed laptop lid configuration if no other available * https://deb.li/x4q2
<KGB-0> mutter ubuntu/master 2c4a6fe Marco Trevisan (TreviÃ±o) debian/patches/x11-Add-support-for-fractional-scaling-using-Randr.patch * xrandr-scaling: Don't override non-fractionally scaled monitors scaling * https://deb.li/3lLwC
<KGB-0> mutter Iain Lane 155778 * commented commit 6661980 * https://deb.li/uDD
<seb128> kenvandine, I don't remember who was supposed to do the vcs change but you said in the hangout on thursday that you would upload ubuntu-desktop in friday while everyone else was off for the long w.e
<seb128> kenvandine, Wimpress, anyway, it's getting late so if we want that in we should sort if you
<seb128> out
<seb128> Laney, how is the ubuntu-desktop set defined for upload rights? like what is needed for a new package to be defined as being in that set?
<kenvandine> seb128: oh right, Wimpress was going to prepare it and leave it for me to sponsor
<kenvandine> i actually uploaded ubuntu-meta this week too!
<seb128> right, I saw the email title on -changes and assumed it was the change
<seb128> but was suprised it's still not on the ISO
<seb128> so I went to check and saw it was another change you uploaded, so I wondered if you left that out on purpose
<KGB-0> mutter signed tags 60325d3 Marco Trevisan ubuntu/3.36.1-3ubuntu2 * mutter Debian release 3.36.1-3ubuntu2 * https://deb.li/Mwfi
<KGB-0> mutter ubuntu/master 141ed15 Marco Trevisan (TreviÃ±o) debian/changelog * Update changelog * https://deb.li/i4I3h
<KGB-0> mutter ubuntu/master ddbb0c4 Marco Trevisan (TreviÃ±o) debian/changelog * Finalise changelog * https://deb.li/7wmN
<Laney> seb128: there's a script that the DMB runs
<seb128> Laney, should things like yaru-theme be there? should that be automatic?
<Laney> https://code.launchpad.net/~developer-membership-board/+junk/packageset
<Laney> I dunno, ask them to re-run it (or run it yourself and see what it would do)
<seb128> k
<Laney> make that https://code.launchpad.net/~developer-membership-board/+git/packageset
<Laney> probably though
<Laney> it's like expand the desktop seed and remove things that are in core
<seb128> Laney, thanks, I don't have much clue about how sets works since I never had to deal with those :p
<seb128> trying the script
<seb128> it's unclear to me if the set is a reflection of the seeds though
<seb128> (update-germinate taking time)
<Laney> it's supposed to be
<seb128> k
<KGB-0> gnome-control-center ubuntu/master Marco Trevisan * [open] merge request !16: debian/patches: Disable dock in all monitors when choosing a specific one * https://deb.li/79V
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey, thanks for the fixes! I got g-c-c uploaded today :)
<robert_ancell> seb128, thanks for taking care of that :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, only https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1862553 missing which might be important, I need to test if it impact any livepatch enablement or just some
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1862553 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in cc_panel_get_title_widget()" [High,Confirmed]
<seb128> if you can poke to that today we might be able to still get that in tomorrow
<robert_ancell> ok, will do
<seb128> thx
<seb128> robert_ancell, do you know where the alert sound is used in GNOME?
<robert_ancell> seb128, no, I don't know if it's used much at all.
<seb128> changing it in g-c-c doesn't make it change on a g-t command line when doing tab completion for me and I can't find another place
<seb128> seems a weird setting to have in the UI if it isn't used :/
<seb128> I was trying to test bug #1871320 but rather minor
<ubot5> bug 1871320 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Switching alert sound will not take effect unless you switch to Default alert first" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1871320
<seb128> k, on that note calling it a day, it's late enough
<seb128> see you tomorrow
<chudak> on 20.04 gnome desktop - how to show top bar on all desktops with multi monitors ?  Thanks !
<chudak> anyone ^ ?
<sarnold> you may have success in #ubuntu+1
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-04-17
<callmepk> good morning
<duflu> Oops. Morning callmepk 
<callmepk> Hi duflu
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<callmepk> hi oSoMoN 
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN 
<duflu> And hi seb128 
<duflu> Back later...
<seb128> hey duflu, and see you later :)
<oSoMoN> hey callmepk, duflu 
<oSoMoN> salut seb128 
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, hey callmepk
<seb128> how are you?
<oSoMoN> I'm good, had a good and uninterrupted night of sleep \o/
<oSoMoN> how are you yourself?
<seb128> I'm good, up too early to my taste though :-)
<seb128> but it's friday, hopefully more sleep tomorrow
<callmepk> hi seb128 
<jibel> hi all
<oSoMoN> salut jibel 
<jibel> bonjour oSoMoN 
<seb128> lut jibel, comment Ã§a va ?
<jibel> seb128, Ã§a  va bien, merci.
<duflu> Hi jibel 
<jibel> morning duflu 
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Hi didrocks 
<didrocks> hey duflu 
<seb128> lut didrocks
<didrocks> salut seb128, Ã§a va ?
<seb128> didrocks, ouais, un peu fatiguÃ©, rÃ©veillÃ© avant 7h par le petit qui a fait un cauchemard :p
<seb128> et toi ?
<didrocks> seb128: rÃ©veillÃ© Ã  5h, mais sinon, Ã§a va
<seb128> tu 'gagnes' :p
<didrocks> faÃ§on de parler
<seb128> question for the python people on the channel
<seb128> https://git.launchpad.net/software-properties/tree/softwareproperties/gtk/LivepatchPage.py#n38
<seb128> why is the 
<seb128> STRING = _()...
<seb128> then later
<seb128> https://git.launchpad.net/software-properties/tree/softwareproperties/gtk/LivepatchPage.py#n276
<seb128> print(STRING)
<seb128> not working?
<seb128> (there is an parathensis error on l42 which makes it use the wrong string, it should give the version without the substitution to gettext, but fixing that isn't enough)
<seb128> jamesh, ^ seems like the kind of problem you might have a clue about?
 * jamesh looks
<jamesh> what error are you getting?
<jamesh> I don't see any print() calls in that code
<jibel> it looks correct, how do you  run this code?
<marcustomlinson> good morning callmepk duflu oSoMoN seb128 jibel didrocks jamesh
<duflu> Hi marcustomlinson 
<marcustomlinson> happy friday :)
<jibel> Bonjour marcustomlinson 
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson 
<jibel> seb128, oops got a crash of g-c-c when I clicked on "connect to"
<seb128> jamesh, jibel, sorry it was maybe not clear
<seb128> https://git.launchpad.net/software-properties/tree/softwareproperties/gtk/LivepatchPage.py#n276
<seb128>  error_message=self.GENERIC_ERR_MSG
<seb128> that displays in english and doesn't fetch the gettext translation
<seb128> if I replace it by
<seb128> error_message=_('Canonical Livepatch has experienced an internal error.'
<seb128>         ' Please refer to {} for further information.').format(COMMON_ISSUE_URL)
<seb128> it works
<seb128> (which is the same string as the const)
<jibel> g-c-c crash https://errors.ubuntu.com/bucket/?id=/usr/bin/gnome-control-center%3A11%3Acc_panel_get_title_widget%3Aactivate_panel%3Aset_active_panel_from_id%3Alaunch_panel_activated%3Ag_closure_invoke
<seb128> it's bug #1873272
<ubot5> bug 1873272 in software-properties (Ubuntu) "Error in livepatch is not translated" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1873272
<seb128> jibel, the gcc bug is bug #1862553 which we discussed/assigned during the team meeting this week
<ubot5> bug 1862553 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in cc_panel_get_title_widget()" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1862553
<seb128> the livepatch one
<jamesh> seb128: the code as written would try to look up "Canonical Livepatch has experienced an internal error. Please refer to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/Livepatch#CommonIssues for further information." in the message catalogue, which doesn't match any tagged string constant
<jamesh> so you'd get the english version
<jamesh> moving the format() call outside of _() means you'd be looking up the string without the URL substituted
<seb128> jamesh, see what I wrote earlier
<seb128>  (there is an parathensis error on l42 which makes it use the wrong string, it should give the version without the substitution to gettext, but fixing that isn't enough)
<seb128> also I fixed that in the paste I just did
<jamesh> seb128: is there a translation in the message catalogue?
<seb128> moving a ) before the .format
<seb128> yes
<seb128> as said, if I do 
<seb128>  if I replace it by
<seb128>  error_message=_('Canonical Livepatch has experienced an internal error.'
<seb128>          ' Please refer to {} for further information.').format(COMMON_ISSUE_URL)
<seb128>  it works
<seb128>  (which is the same string as the const)
<seb128> I've the UI displayed in french in the GUI then
<seb128> changing             self._trigger_ui_update(skip=True, error_message=self.GENERIC_ERR_MSG) I meant
<seb128> there is something about using the const that is wrong
<jamesh> seb128: the code as written in that branch is wrong
<seb128> I wonder if that's because it does the query at object creation and the domain is not set or something?
<jamesh> seb128: your change is what it should be doing
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, good morning marcustomlinson, hey jamesh 
<seb128> jamesh, the change works, I don't understand why having it the way it's now isn't equivalent
<seb128> is that because it does the call to gettext too early with the variable assignement at the beginning of the class?
<jamesh> seb128: the _() call serves two purposes: (1) it is something that the xgettext tool recognises to extract string constants from source code to create the message catalogue
<seb128> right
<jamesh> and (2) at runtime convert an english string to the equivalent native language string
<seb128> right :)
<jamesh> as written, for (1) the call recognises the string "... Please refer to {} for further information"
<jamesh> but for (2) it is looking up the string "... Please refer to http://... for further information"
<seb128> sorry I'm not being clear
<jamesh> because there is a format() call within the _() invocation
<seb128> let me try a pastebin
<jamesh> and that doesn't match anything in the catalogue
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN, Ã§a va ?
<seb128> jamesh, https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/vbmFxZtYDk/
<seb128> jamesh, the wrong parameter/string being passed to gettext I fixed and is ortogonal, it's just not enough to have the code working
<seb128> jamesh, the pastebin is a summary of the thing that is confusing me
<seb128> jamesh, I guess in the first case it might do the translate fetch when creating the object which might be before the gettext init/domain is set?
<seb128> where in the second case it does it when the function is called?
<jamesh> seb128: ohh.  This would be an ordering issue with the bindtextdomain call
<seb128> so in the first case the fetch is not done at the call time?
<jamesh> The class statement is executed before gettext is configured
<seb128> right, that's what I guess
<jamesh> so there is no message catalogue to look up
<seb128> right
<seb128> what would be the 'right' fix?
<jamesh> Fixing this would either involve delaying import of the module until after gettext is set up, or not using module or class level attributes that are evaluated at module import time
<seb128> let me try if moving the constants defintion to the init is enough
<seb128> if not I will go for the simple fix
<jamesh> that would be enough
<seb128> ok, let me do that then
<seb128> jamesh, thanks! and sorry for not being clear with the question, the {} / ) issue which added on top did make it even more confusing
<seb128> jibel, 'connect to', where was that? you were were setting up livepatch or hit the issue from another workflow?
<jamesh> seb128: an alternative would be to edit https://git.launchpad.net/software-properties/tree/software-properties-gtk -- move softwareproperties import to below the textdomain() call
<jamesh> or move the textdomain() call up higher
<seb128> right
<seb128> that feels unclear having some code moved before the imports though
<seb128> I will go for just moving the const to the init
<seb128> jamesh, thanks again!
<jamesh> seb128: Are you sure that's the only problem string though?
<seb128> you are never sure, we didn't get other reports and there is no other gettext calls made in a class directly from what I can see
<seb128> you would just move the gettext/textdomain() init before the import?
<seb128> didrocks, is there a particul process for yaru-theme uploads? Trevinho asking me to sponsor his fix from https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/commits/master , I can just do the normal 'manual' package build/dput right?
<didrocks> seb128: just ensure that you push the tag to the upstream repo, but then yes. gbp builpackage -S + dput
<seb128> didrocks, thx
<didrocks> the tag is already pushed by Trevinho 
<didrocks> so just upload to ubuntu
<seb128> didrocks, thx
<Laney> hey
<didrocks> morning Laney 
<marcustomlinson> hey Laney
<seb128> hey Laney, marcustomlinson, happy friday!
<duflu> Hi Laney
<Laney> moin didrocks marcustomlinson seb128 duflu 
<Laney> happy final freeze friday
<duflu> fff
<seb128> indeed!
<duflu> or fffff
<Laney> fÂ³ / fâµ
<duflu> Alliteration for human beings
 * Laney waits impatiently for ISOs
<Laney> weeee my wish is granted
<seb128> :)
<seb128> popey, https://bugs.mojang.com/browse/MCL-13512 should probably be reopened, it would be best if they moved to a non years-old-legacy Depends still
<Laney> marcustomlinson: looks like you got some replies on the atk bug!
<marcustomlinson> yeah good stuff
<xnox> I rebooted
<xnox> My desktop locks up.
<xnox> I see black screen, mouse pointer, cannot get to VT or anything.
<duflu> xnox, nvidia? fractional scaling?
<duflu> And I was about to EOW :/
<xnox> Should be non-nvidia but I do have it. And have highdpi infinity screen.
<xnox> I am in emergency target now, let me check what's up
<duflu> infinity sounds very high
<xnox> Meh, it's 2015 infinity
<xnox> Old kernel booted fine
 * duflu nods
<xnox> Anyway, let me apply all updates, if still broken something is really and.
<xnox> *bad
<duflu> Covering my eyes now
<popey> seb128 looks like debian are on it
<Laney> ok that was disturbing
<Laney> in the middle of a dist-upgrade and everything died
<Laney> a whole load of
<Laney> Apr 17 12:32:39 raleigh systemd[1]: wpa_supplicant.service: Unexpected error response from GetNameOwner(): Connection terminated
<Laney> Apr 17 12:32:39 raleigh systemd[1]: udisks2.service: Unexpected error response from GetNameOwner(): Connection terminated
<Laney> from various things
<Laney> which sounds like the system bus went away?
<seb128> Laney, bug #1871538
<ubot5> bug 1871538 in dbus (Ubuntu Focal) "dbus timeout-ed during an upgrade, taking services down including gdm" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1871538
<seb128> disturbing bug, also unsure how to debug it :/
<seb128> popey, right, I asked because I was suprised to see a comment on the Debian BTS that the upstream request to use a non transitional package had been closed
<seb128> good they followed up now though
<Laney> sounds right
<Laney> any idea what happened?
<seb128> no :-(
<Laney> I did some dbus reloads and systemd re-execs in a loop, didn't trigger it
<seb128> I didn't see an obvious clue in the journal
<Laney> no
<Laney> it looks like they restarted ok
<Laney> ah
<Laney> maybe
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> so if you reload the dbus configuration and the systemd one at the same time, this happens
<Laney> meh that only worked once
<Laney> oho, ok, put them both in a loop and then you'll probably get it
<seb128> systemd bug?
<Laney> dunno
<Laney> that seems likely, if it's losing the connection to the system bus when it shouldn't
<Laney> I should stop doing this on my host
<marcustomlinson> seb128: do you remember why we upgraded atk to 2.35? Did something else require it?
<marcustomlinson> kenvandine and I are wondering if we could temporarily downgrade to 2.34 again for focal until that segfault issue is resolved
<seb128> marcustomlinson, we follow GNOME every cycle
<seb128> it's a GNOME component
<seb128> version downgrades suck, can't you just revert the one problematic commit?
<kenvandine> We worry that any patch to fix this issue wouldn't have enough time for testing
<seb128> I would still revert the commit
<seb128> rather than play weird 3.35.is.3.34 update
<kenvandine> I hate those versions
<seb128> since it's a well identified commit
<marcustomlinson> it is?
<marcustomlinson> I mean it may well be, I'll look
<kenvandine> I didn't think it was
<seb128> 'Of particular interest is the introduction of the atk_socket_component_real_get_extents() function, and the NEWS entry: "Make AtkSocket get_extents return parent extents by default (MR!23)"."
<seb128> is a misleading comment then
<seb128> it sounded like !23 was the obvious candidate
<marcustomlinson> sorry, though I think you are right
<marcustomlinson> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/atk/-/commit/71ecedd9f1d12ad74f660a7b2827e5574ca7e510
<Laney> agreed
<seb128> I would start by trying to revert that one
<Laney> I'm going to add that as a release blocker on our cool new wiki post
<marcustomlinson> this may take a while I've not touched this project before
<marcustomlinson> I mean the packaging
<marcustomlinson> what branch do I work on? focal-proposed?
<seb128> marcustomlinson, apt-get source atk1.0
<seb128> there is no ubuntu branch
<seb128> also I would ask on the upstream bug if they think it's safe to revert
<Laney> I'd make a branch if it were me
<seb128> I've no real knowledge of the a11y stack, I'm not sure the feature/version you want to revert isn't providing something that at-spi or other component might use
<seb128> (I would probably personnally feel better try to go the fix way and try the patch draft upstream provided)
<seb128> at least start by getting feedback on that, if it works we might have a proper fix tested by monday
<seb128> marcustomlinson, if you want to follow Laney's lead, the vcs in Debian is https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/atk
<seb128> unsure if you have an account on salsa yet
<seb128> might be a good opportunity to get one otherwise :)
<Laney> wait a second, I'll just make the branch, that'll be easier
<seb128> thx
<KGB-0> atk ubuntu/master 75979e0 Sebastien Bacher debian/ (5 files in 2 dirs) * Import Debian changes 2.35.1-1ubuntu1 * https://deb.li/LW7I
<KGB-0> atk ubuntu/master 472cb96 Iain Lane debian/ control control.in gbp.conf * control, gbp.conf: Update for ubuntu/master branch * https://deb.li/3qqVA
<Laney> there
<seb128> bah, why did we fail to update/merge 2.36? 
<seb128> arg, version was still have 2.34 as the stable serie so it's in the yellow section :(
<Laney> annoying
<Laney> can be SRUed though
<marcustomlinson> Samuel says reverting that commit will be fine
<seb128> great
<marcustomlinson> this one: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/atk/-/commit/71ecedd9f1d12ad74f660a7b2827e5574ca7e510
<Laney> I suggest doing that and then testing the proposed patch, giving feedback on that and hopefully later we can replace the revert with a fix
<marcustomlinson> If I confirm it to work could I just ask you Laney to do the revert and publish etc
<marcustomlinson> I'm sorry, sounds awfully lazy but it will certainly take much longer for me
<marcustomlinson> I'll test this now
<jibel> seb128, bug 1873454 is surely something to fix for the release. It's a g-c-c crash when a user tries to register his U1 account in software-properties to use livepatch.
<ubot5> bug 1873454 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "/usr/bin/gnome-control-center:11:cc_panel_get_title_widget:activate_panel:set_active_panel_from_id:launch_panel_activated:g_closure_invoke" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1873454
<marcustomlinson> that patch is not a patch for this issue
<marcustomlinson> it's a "it's sorta kinda like this"
<Laney> yeah sure
<Laney> lunch now
<marcustomlinson> seb128: I have an account on salsa but it's appended with "-guest"
<marcustomlinson> don't remember why
<marcustomlinson> oh right coz I'm not a Debian Developer
<seb128> jibel, right, we said that during the weekly meeting 
<seb128> marcustomlinson, correct :)
<seb128> jibel, did you see my comment/question this morning?
<seb128> jibel, https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2020/04/17/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t07:22
<jibel> seb128, no, I missed it sorry
<seb128> np
<seb128> but your description seems to confirm it's a dup
<seb128> also Robert proposed https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-control-center/-/merge_requests/746 earlier today but he didn''t make it clear if that was a fix for this issue, I'm going to test that next
<jibel> yes, it's the same case than comment 8. I duplicated the report created from errors.u.c
<seb128> thx
<marcustomlinson> Laney: reverting that commit resolves the crash without any regression as far as I can see - took the screenreader for a spin on a couple other apps too.
<marcustomlinson> The commit is: 4b5ed8630c5ae9ef37884c4199da8463b7e5a127
<marcustomlinson> Laney: and for the changelog, the bug is (LP: #1870508)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1870508 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "ubiquity crashed with SIGSEGV in g_type_check_instance_is_a()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1870508
<marcustomlinson> that's the only changes needed
<KGB-1> mutter debian/master Marco Trevisan * [open] merge request !60: d/p: Fallback to closed laptop lid configuration if no other available * https://deb.li/Nf8d
<marcustomlinson> seb128: thanks for pointing out my own reference to the problematic commit (facepalm). I blame lockdown
<seb128> marcustomlinson, no problem, glad that you figured it out, nice to hit friday afternoon with problems solved :)
<marcustomlinson> digging out what the heck was happening fried my brain
<KGB-1> mutter debian/master Marco Trevisan * [update] merge request !60: d/p: Fallback to closed laptop lid configuration if no other available * https://deb.li/Nf8d
<KGB-1> mutter Marco Trevisan 155899 * commented commit 6661980 * https://deb.li/ig0tV
<KGB-1> atk ubuntu/master 3138b37 Iain Lane debian/patches/ atk_requires_glib series Revert-atksocket-make-get_extents-return-parent-extents-b.patch * Revert "atksocket: make get_extents return parent extents by default" * https://deb.li/3zfce
<KGB-1> atk ubuntu/master 9466ac0 Iain Lane debian/changelog * Update changelog * https://deb.li/33HhI
<KGB-1> atk ubuntu/master 558773e Iain Lane debian/changelog * Finalise changelog * https://deb.li/iO9yA
<marcustomlinson> thanks Laney
<Eickmeyer> kenvandine: Can we talk about https://gitlab.gnome.org/Community/Ubuntu/gtk-common-themes/-/issues/13 ? It's directly affecting Ubuntu Studio at this point.
<Laney> np marcustomlinson
<Laney> would appreciate it if you could check out any patches that get proposed
<marcustomlinson> sure
<KGB-2> atk signed tags 1976303 Iain Lane ubuntu/2.35.1-1ubuntu2 * atk1.0 Debian release 2.35.1-1ubuntu2 * https://deb.li/M0Ig
<kenvandine> Eickmeyer:  we really wanted to hold off on adding more themes because the auto theme installation work is coming real soon
<Eickmeyer> kenvandine: Unfortunately, because of the lack of that theme, people are installing snap-store and it's unusable.
<kenvandine> i see
<Eickmeyer> https://bugs.launchpad.net/snap-store/+bug/1867417
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1867417 in snap-store "snap-store launches without theme (transparent) when using non standard themes" [Undecided,New]
<kenvandine> Eickmeyer: i'd be interested in seeing how much bigger that would make the snap
<kenvandine> Eickmeyer: any chance you could prepare a PR adding it?  It should be trivial to follow one of the other examples
<Eickmeyer> Well, it's the default theme we've been carrying in Ubuntu Studio for a year now.
<Eickmeyer> I could look into it, but I honestly lack the know-how.
<kenvandine> understood
<kenvandine> Eickmeyer: can you provide a link to the git source for the theme?
<Eickmeyer> kenvandine: https://github.com/nana-4/materia-theme
<kenvandine> Eickmeyer: i can probably take a stab at it tonight
<Eickmeyer> kenvandine: I'd appreciate it. :)
<hellsworth> morning folks
<seb128> hey hellsworth, how are you? happy friday!
<hellsworth> i am ok.. tired from a baby up for a few hours again teething but coffee is slowly waking me up :)
<hellsworth> happy friday indeed
<marcustomlinson> hey hellsworth
<hellsworth> hey marcustomlinson how's it going?
<marcustomlinson> hellsworth: meh. also tired :P
<hellsworth> most importantly.. how's Isla :)
<marcustomlinson> she's doing great :) her sleep is starting to stretch at night which is helping a bit
<hellsworth> oh horray for that!
<marcustomlinson> how's your little one doing?
<hellsworth> she has teeth coming in.. so last night she was up from 1:30-5. it was rough. wants to be held for hours. and then she finally went to sleep and woke up at the usual 7:30
<hellsworth> i'll be glad when all the teeth are in
<hellsworth> and when daycare is open again
<hellsworth> i dream of daycare..
<marcustomlinson> ok yeah...
<marcustomlinson> /s/ok/oh
<didrocks> hey hellsworth :)
<hellsworth> hi there didrocks 
<didrocks> good luck with the teeth
<hellsworth> i'll take all the luck i can get :)
<didrocks> heh
<didrocks> spoiler alert: it takes time though :p
<hellsworth> i know.. i asked the pediatrician when it will stop and she looked at me and kind of laughed and said not for a long time
<didrocks> roh :)
<kenvandine> Eickmeyer: can you test a channel of gtk-common-themes for me?
<Eickmeyer> kenvandine: Sure. What channel?
<kenvandine> Eickmeyer: snap refresh --channel-=latest/stable/materia gtk-common-themes
<Eickmeyer> I'll get on it. :)
<kenvandine> Eickmeyer: snap refresh --channel=latest/stable/materia gtk-common-themes
<kenvandine> typo the first time :)
<Eickmeyer> Heh
<kenvandine> Eickmeyer: i added all the variants for both gtk3 and gtk2
<kenvandine> Eickmeyer: if snap-store has a background process running you'll need to kill it first
<kenvandine> killall snap-store
<Eickmeyer> kenvandine: Looks good!
<kenvandine> great
<GunnarHj> igordhossegor: I see that someone arranged with a redirect for bitlocker and rst after all. Do you know how that happened? I would like to know, because I fear that the bzr branch we use for maintaining help.ubuntu.com is no longer in sync with what's actually on the web server.
<igordhossegor> GunnarHJ i asked IS yesterday
<igordhossegor> for the redirect before we talked
<igordhossegor> i can ask them to remove the server redirect and then you can do the one you want
<igordhossegor> GunnarHj i asked IS to remove the redirects
<igordhossegor> after that it should work fine 
<igordhossegor> (for how you are going to do it - with html pages and the redirects you can make)
<GunnarHj> igordhossegor: Ok.. I don't have any own preferences. But I pushed the files to the branch yesterday, and it ought to work without redirects. My only concern atm is that some IS guy bypassed the branch.
<Eickmeyer> kenvandine: I have confirmation from others that it fixes the transparency issue.
<kenvandine> Eickmeyer: ok, i'll have that in the candidate channel today and probably stable by monday 
<Eickmeyer> Perfect. Thanks! :)
<Laney> :( adding gamemode after final freeze
<seb128> indeed :-/ 
<marcustomlinson> good night all, have a great we
<oSoMoN> have a good one marcustomlinson 
<chudak> Happy Friday all !
<chudak> Trying again -  on 20.04 gnome desktop - how to show top bar on all desktops with multi monitors ?  Thanks !
<kenvandine> Eickmeyer: it's in candidate now
<Eickmeyer> kenvandine: Thanks!
<oSoMoN> have a good week-end everyone!
<hellsworth> you too!
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-04-18
<ogra> hmm, is it expected that the snap-store snap never stops once you started it ? after closing the gui i still see it sitting in my processlist and it doesnt seem to go away on its own until i kill it manually
<ahayzen[m]> ogra, probably related to https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-software/-/issues/942
<ogra> ahayzen[m], aha, thanks !
<ahayzen[m]> Would be good to fix as software is usually one of the highest memory using processes that is always running :-/
<chudak> hi all, this must be easy, but I lost the option to "Always on Visible Workspace" on windows located on 2d and 3d screen, any clues appreciated 
