#ubuntu-touch 2012-12-04
<dandrader> bregma, cnd do you guys know why Henrik Rydberg appears as a copyright holder of frame and grail in their corresponding debian/copyright files but not in any of the source file headers? Did he start those projects before his involvement with Canonical?
<dandrader> btw, I'm asking this because I'm relicensing from (L)GPL3+ to (L)GPL3
<dandrader> as per Canonical's licensing policy
<bregma> dandrader, yes, those projects were originally written by Henrik Rydberg
<cnd> dandrader: though at this point, I don't believe any of the original code remains
<cnd> I'm pretty sure you can remove his copyright claims and just make it entirely copyright canonical
<dandrader> cnd, yeah,  I was thinking that's likely the case. Anyway, I e-mailed him asking for approval on the related merge proposals
<cnd> if that makes it easier
<cnd> that wouldn't hurt, but he may balk
<cnd> just knowing his personality :)
<dandrader> oh
<dandrader> but good to know that removing his copyright claim is a correct option
<cnd> yeah
#ubuntu-touch 2012-12-05
<dandrader> bregma, would you like to review that or can I just give to the autolanding machinery? https://code.launchpad.net/~dandrader/frame/non_x11_accept/+merge/138159
<bregma> dandrader, I'll just take a look right now
<dandrader> bregma, awesome, thanks!
<bregma> dandrader, are you using constructs like " (void)window_id;" instead of __attribute__((unused)) ?
<dandrader> bregma, yes, so the latter is the C++ way of doing it?
<bregma> the latter is a GCC extension
<bregma> it's used elsewhere in frame but it's not pretty
<bregma> I was just confirming that's what you were doing
<dandrader> ok
<dandrader> bregma, and that one: https://code.launchpad.net/~dandrader/grail/convert_tests/+merge/138253
 * dandrader has a lot of spare time for OIF housekeeping
<bregma> lucky you
<dandrader> well, actually that's not a good thing.
#ubuntu-touch 2012-12-06
<bregma> dandrader, could you take a look at https://code.launchpad.net/~bregma/frame/ftbfs-on-jhbuild/+merge/138519 pretty please
<dandrader> ok
<dandrader> bregma, how do I do an out-of-source build with autoconf+automake?
<dandrader> ok, it's just "../foo/autogen.sh"
<dandrader> bregma, well, if that's how it's done
<dandrader> bregma, with your MP it still fails
<bregma> dandrader, you have to do a "NOCONFIGURE=y ./autogen.sh" in the source directory to prep it, then "../frame/configure" in the build directory
<bregma> I'm not sure why "make distcheck" wasn't failing, it should have
<dandrader> ok. will try that
<bregma> oh, except "make dist" would distribute the include/oif/frame.h generated by configure, which is the wrong thing to do
<dandrader> bregma, well, it still fails
<bregma> hmm, OK
<bregma> back to the drawing board
<dandrader> maybe you have some oif headers in your /usr/include or /usr/local/include
<bregma> yep, that was the problem....  MP is now updated
#ubuntu-touch 2012-12-07
<dandrader> bregma, do you know, out of the top of your head, what situation could make geis_subscription_activate() return failure?
<bregma> grab failure?
<bregma> enable GEIS_DEBUG=3 to get details of the failure, if possible
<dandrader> hmm
<dandrader> bregma, yes, you got it right: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/125128158/compiz.log
<dandrader> that might be enough to fix it: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~dandrader/geis/lp1080386/revision/299
 * bregma looks
<dandrader> yes, tried it out on my test laptop where I hardcoded geis_subscription_activate() to fail and it indeed fixes the bug
<dandrader> will propose it now
<dandrader> we will have to back-port it to quantal
<dandrader> since the bug fix is in geis I removed compiz from the affected projects in the bug report. not sure if it's  the correct procedure though
#ubuntu-touch 2013-12-02
<cwayne> mhall119: hey, the Layouts API docs seem to be missing a lot of images (http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/qml/sdk-1.0/UbuntuUserInterfaceToolkit.ubuntu-layouts5/)
<pr0teus> hey, there's a vmware to test ubuntu-touch?
<mhall119> cwayne: any qdocs that linked to local images aren't working, I have a work item for it, but need to figure out how do make it work across multiple app instances without worrying about getting them out of sync
<mhall119> pr0teus: there's an emulator, but it's not vmware
<cwayne> mhall119: ah, makes sense
<mhall119> pr0teus: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Emulator
<mhall119> cwayne: our internal cloud has a file storage option (Ceph I think) that will likely be used for both imported and community uploaded images
<cwayne> that sounds reasonable :)
<cwayne> pl
<cwayne> oops, wrong window
<pr0teus> mhall119: coldnt find "apt-get install android-emulator" installing android-tools-*
<nhaines> pr0teus: are you running Ubuntu trusty like the page says?
<mhall119> pr0teus: if you're not on Trust, you can download the .deb from Launchpad: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+archive/primary/+files/android-emulator_20131128-0457-0ubuntu1_i386.deb
<mhall119> I did that to install it on Saucy
<mhall119> rsalveti: ^^ any change we can get the android-emulator for Saucy in the SDK PPA?
<mhall119> s/change/chance/
<pr0teus> nhaines: no i'm running 13.04
<pr0teus> mhall119: thanks
<pr0teus> but i'll test 14.04 in vmwware now also =) lets check the changes
<nhaines> pr0teus: remember, an emulator in an emulator is infuriating.  :)  Also, once you get it set up, let it run for a while.  Might take up to 5 minutes for the graphical interface to pop up.  That's normal.
<pr0teus> nhaines: ok =) i'm excited to test, thinking that ubuntu will converge to one user experience in all devices...
<nhaines> It's an exciting future, isn't it?  :)
<pr0teus> nhaines: yup =) but i fear we will be locked to brands =/
<pr0teus> nhaines: right now if you have an ipad and a mac, you should buy an iphone, because they interact awesome
<pr0teus> so in the close future we will be choosing samsung x microsoft x apple
<pr0teus> for our whole environment
<nhaines> Thanks to the need for good MTP support for Ubuntu on phones, Ubuntu 13.10 got actual working MTP support, which means now Android phones work great with it.
<nhaines> As long as Ubuntu and Android stick with standards, it's good for everyone.
<cwayne> right out of the box too!
<pr0teus> nhaines: yep
<pr0teus> nhaines: but i don't see how there brands will interoperate, and that is bad...
<nhaines> The brands are meaningless.  It's the softare on top that matters.
<nhaines> So you pick the mobile operating system you like best, and that's taht.
<pr0teus> i have an ipad, and i'm using 50% of it because the usability with my nix environment isnt that good(no itunes for example)
<pr0teus> brands  = OS
<nhaines> Well, if you buy hardware from a company who doesn't wish to interoperate, it's probably not going to interoperate well.
<pr0teus> true, i just dont want to be locked to a single OS
<nhaines> Luckily, iOS works well standalone and is pretty high quality.  So you should get a lot of use out of your iPad still.
<pr0teus> i want to use my ipad in the same way i should use it in MacOs
<nhaines> Well, Apple actively works against that.
<pr0teus> nhaines: thats what i fear in the future =/
<nhaines> pr0teus: then enjoy your current hardware but don't purchase those products in the future.  :)
<nhaines> By buying Android or Ubuntu products, you support technology that likes working with everything.
<pr0teus> nhaines: yep, but what i should purchage... ? only linux like? or windows like?
<pr0teus> Desktop = Windows and Linux, but for mobile i like  android and iphone as well, tablet i just liked iOS (perhaps ubuntu)
<pr0teus> so i should choose one OS for 3 devices.. (perhaps 4 if SmartTV included)
<nhaines> If you want products that work with any desktop OS, you'd better stick with Android or Ubuntu.
<pr0teus> nhaines: now android or ubuntu seems the best interoperable OS, and hope that canonical will keep it in that way
<pr0teus> but, who knows
<nhaines> If Ubuntu or Canonical doesn't keep it that way, the community can.
<BillyZane> hi
<BillyZane> i have a nexus 5, i know it's not supported yet, but it will be
<BillyZane> i wanted to dual boot and i was wondering about the feature that allows you to connect the phone to a docking station
<BillyZane> what sort of docking station is recommended to utilize this feature?
<nhaines> BillyZane: there is no feature that allows you to connect the phone to a docking station.  So there is no docking station recommended to utilize that feature.
<BillyZane> true
<BillyZane> i think i read online something like...
<nhaines> BillyZane: There's also no way to know what the hardware requirements will be until the feature is designed.  But nothing demoed so far supports docking stations.
<BillyZane> yeah i read something like you have to use a microUSB to HDMI adaptor
<BillyZane> and then you can use a bluetooth keyboard/mouse or possibly usb on the go
<nhaines> No, you have to use an MHL HDMI adapter, on Android hardware that supports MHL.
<BillyZane> ohh
<nhaines> I'm not sure a docking station like that exists.
<BillyZane> this is the one that seems to be recommended
<BillyZane> http://www.amazon.com/SlimPort%C2%AE-SP1002-Connect-connector-Supports/dp/B009UZBLSG
<nhaines> They're all the same.
<BillyZane> hi
<BillyZane> is anyone there
<BillyZane> i was wondering how ubuntu deals with the 2gb ram limit on nexus phones, does it utilize a swap partition?
<dholbach> good morning
<nhaines> dholbach: good morning!  :)
<dholbach> hi nhaines
<nhaines> dholbach: Heute Nacht habe ich einen Buch "Lesebuch fÃ¼r AnfÃ¤nger" gelesen.  Es wÃ¼rde im 1930 herausgegeben.
<nhaines> The entire German text is in Fraktur.  Fun, but slightly challenging.  :)
<dholbach> nhaines, German on its own is challenging already :)
<nhaines> Indeed!  I figure if I can manage that, eventually Javascript should be simple.  ;)
<dholbach> haha :)
<nhaines> dholbach: a friend accuses me of using obsolute German.  My pet name for her 7yo son is "Knabe", and I once asked him, "Bist du munter?"
<nhaines> I had the chance to pick up a huge German-English dictionary at a library for $2.  I thought maybe I'd check the entry for "computer", to see if it was "der Rechner" or "der Computer" and see if maybe it was too dated to help plead my case for dated speech.
<nhaines> There was no entery for "computer".  Or Rechner.  I checked the copyright page, and it was published in 1956.  I decided to leave it on the shelf.  ;)
<dholbach> haha, that makes sense - most people nowadays would say "Computer"
<BillyZane> it's ironic that the computer is what makes the dictionary obsolete. i guess the dictionary didn't see that one coming
<nhaines> BillyZane: I highly suspect that computer:computer::reckon::Rechner, but have been too lazy to research that yet.  :)
<nhaines> dholbach: my friend's son is bilingual and I'm helping him learn to read; I can read in both English and German.  But it's really funny when I write a sentence.  Last was "Der Knabe isst die Cookies", and he has the funniest reactions to the word Knabe.  He thinks it's not a real word.  :)
<BillyZane> what you said made me think about how paper has reigned for thousands of years
<BillyZane> and it's starting to become obsolete in many ways
<dholbach> nhaines, most people nowadays would say "der Junge" instead of "der Knabe", but it would still be understood
<BillyZane> some day, we might even be able to replace paper with something that looks and feels just like it, but is digital
<nhaines> dholbach: yes, I only use Knabe as a Kosename for him.  In English I tend to say "kiddo" or "buddy" or such.  :)
<BillyZane> it's the texture that makes paper great. pencil and ink. and it gets me thinking, is that texture really the best, or are we just really use to it
<nhaines> BillyZane: I have a fountain pen I picked up in Germany, just something a high schooler would get for graduation.  I type 105wpm, but sometimes when I'm writing a speech, article, or story, I just take a notepad and use the fountain pen.  It uses a cartridge although I have an awesome little inkwell, too.
<nhaines> Luckily, the first-class technology in Ubuntu is so efficient that I can sometimes indulge in a little old-fashioned technology as well.
<BillyZane> i was intrigued with fountain pens as well when i was younger. i had a couple of them, they had cartridges as well
<dholbach> nhaines, ah ok :)
<nhaines> dholbach: but since he's just starting to get good at reading, it's fun to occasionally substitue "Knabe" for "Junge" and see his reaction, hehe.
<dholbach> :)
<nhaines> Funnily enough, once he used my laptop and I said, "Okay, start the web browser", and he said "I don't know how," and I just said, "Push past the left side of the screen with the mouse", and he's been able to use Ubuntu intuitively ever since.
<nhaines> I've read to him a lot of Asterix and Smurf comic books.  I often don't know what I'm reading, but I do voices and so forth.
<nhaines> Once, he wanted to play videogames, and I told him only if he did something or other first.  And I started, "Wenn du das tust wollen, zuerst muÃt du..." (if you want to do that, first you must...) and then realized I didn't know the German word for what he must do.
<nhaines> So then I just tried to stall.  It was a race to see if I could remember the verb before I could finish the sentence.
<nhaines> So I added as many conditions as I could think of.  "tonight, before you start, after you eat..." finally I got to the end of the sentence and just said "schlÃ¼mpfen".
<nhaines> He thought this was *really* funny.  I was quite proud of myself.  (Any English speaker, if they remember that the Smurfs use the word "smurf" to substitute for everything.)  :)
<dholbach> nhaines, haha, that's great
<nhaines> dholbach: his mother is an interpreter, so she usually corrects me, but occasionally finds that funny. :)
<nhaines> Not so funny when I mix up mir or mich, and she corrects me, and I say, "oh, das ist Dialekt."
<dholbach> nhaines, yeah, that's not quite easy to learn
<nhaines> dholbach: I actually have the hang of it, mostly.... just some prepositions confound me.  I do like to repeat his errors, though, which his mom really dislikes... but he should learn sooner than later than he shouldn't learn that from me.  ;)  On the other hand, I never use "whom" incorrectly anymore.
<dholbach> :)
<nhaines> Sometimes English speakers ask me if I'm teaching him German, and I always say, "No, he's bilingual and he's helping me practice my German."  And then sometimes we find German speakers and he says, "Er kann auch Deutsch sprechen," and I tell them "Ich tue nur so."
<dholbach> nhaines, sehr gut :)
<nhaines> dholbach: it's fun to say.  :)
<Laney> do we have qt 5.2 packages somewhere?
<seb128> Laney, Mirv has a ppa for those I think
<seb128> Laney, https://launchpad.net/~canonical-qt5-edgers/+archive/qt5-beta2
<Mirv> Laney: the usable one is ppa:canonical-qt5-edgers/qt5-beta2 - as of this morning the core modules are near RC1 and Unity8 starts on device with that PPA again
<Laney> just want to test a bug is fixed, nothing major
<Laney> thanks
<Laney> Mirv: do you have a tag for 'fixed in 5.2' or something?
<Mirv> Laney: no such tag, but the changelogs should mention any LP bugs closed
<Laney> yes, just want to make sure it does get closed
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qtbase-opensource-src/+bug/1256341
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1256341 in qtbase-opensource-src (Ubuntu) "Incorrect timezone displayed in System Settings" [Medium,Triaged]
<lool> mandel: Heya
<mandel> lool, hello!
<lool> mandel: I see ubuntu-download-manager wasn't updated in trusty since the release
<lool> mandel: so I guess it still misses the logging changes you had done in trunk
<lool> mandel: did you or someone else working on it request a landing slot for it?
<mandel> lool, indeed, but I was planning to solve that with didrocks
<lool> mandel: would be good to get an update ASAP, there seem to be many many changes in trunk that will now have to land at once
<mandel> lool, correct, there are code cleanups that have landed, are we having daily releases for trusty?
<mandel> lool, or do I have to fill the spreadsheet etc.. to get it landed?
<lool> mandel: we're still using the spreadsheet while we develop a replacement
<mandel> lool, ok, then trust me I'll make sure we have a new version ASAP
<mandel> lool, specially because I have reduce the mem footprint of the downloaded and I want that to be in the phone
<lool> mandel: #ubuntu-ci-eng is where you'd check with the landing team how to get it in
<lool> mandel: Yeah that sounds good
<lool> mandel: thanks for following up with them then  :-)
<mandel> lool,  sure, not problem, I'll try to make their life as easy as possible
<mandel> lool, any person in particular I can ping?
<lool> mandel: usually each team's techlead has write access to the spreadsheet; in your case that might be ralsina though
<lool> mandel: ralsina certainly used to file landing requests in the past
<mandel> lool, ok, then ralsina it is
<mandel> lool, although the entire team is in an sprint but me, so it will be hard to get his time, nevertheless I'll try
<zbenjamin> kalikiana: ping
<JamesTait> mandel, are you still thinking of adding U1 photos support to gallery-app?
<ogra_> oh that would be so awesome !
<mandel> JamesTait, yes, I am
<mandel> JamesTait, I need time though ;)
<mandel> JamesTait, is probably an xmas project
<JamesTait> mandel, no rush - just wanted to let you know that the API got promoted to v1 now. ;)
<mandel> JamesTait, sweet, I will probaby need to get a cpp lib that those the required operations and then will look at the gallery app
<mandel> :)
<mandel> JamesTait, in the mean time I have done something simpler, added support for eyrie and u1db (http://blog.mikeasoft.com/2013/11/07/eyrie-for-ubuntu-touch/)
<mandel> JamesTait, so that if you tag songs with you ubuntu phone they are stored to later get them in a 'legal way'
<JamesTait> mandel, at some point, when I've got a spare couple of hours, probably one Friday afternoon, I'll be adding the API docs to one.ubuntu.com/developer as well.
<mandel> JamesTait, superb, I would not mind doing a qml plugin for that api
<JamesTait> mandel, that sounds cool. :)
<mandel> JamesTait, and that way people can simply use it
<JamesTait> +1
<JamesTait> I really must get to grips with this new-fangles QML thing. ;)
<mandel> JamesTait, well, I write mostly cpp and then allow people to use it from qml ;)
<mandel> JamesTait, kinda fun :)
<JamesTait> I do occasionally have cause to play around a bit with Vala.
<mandel> JamesTait, the idea is to provide as much funtionality as possible to the QML world.. so right now I'm working on getting an API for the download manager, later upload manager (that is work realted) then the photos api
 * JamesTait nods
<davmor2> Morning all
<davmor2> ogra_: with the  image update, when you have it set to auto download on wifi it shouldn't do that on 3g right?
<ogra_> yeah
<davmor2> ogra_: that'll be a bit broken then
<ogra_> yup, there is system-image 2.0 sitting in -proposed though
<davmor2> ogra_: and does that have a fix for this?
<ogra_> it has a ton of fixes for several things ... i could imagine it does
<ogra_> ask barry once he is around
<davmor2> ogra_: nice will do thanks
<rsalveti> mhall119: we'll be renaming the emulator package and changing the download-image script this week to grab images from system-image
<rsalveti> mhall119: we could integrate it currently at the ppa already, but I'd wait until we land these changes
<rsalveti> which should happen today/tomorrow hopefully
<ogra_> we shouldkonw in 1h of the image builds work
<rsalveti> :-)
<davmor2> rsalveti: If you change the name to "Ni" we get shrubberies
<rsalveti> hahaha
<ogra_> rsalveti, i'm not sure, might be that system-image also needs the new arch added
<rsalveti> that would be nice indeed
<rsalveti> ogra_: right, but stgraber said that adding it there is easy once we have everything available via cdimage
<ogra_> yeah, i wouldnt expect more than changing a config file
<didrocks> hey oSoMoN, do you have more info on bug #1255999 than Friday?
<ubot5> bug 1255999 in ubuntu-keyboard (Ubuntu) "[regression] if switched to non english local, the keyboard does not come up when an input field is focused" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1255999
<oSoMoN> didrocks, IÂ donât
<oSoMoN> didrocks, but tmoenicke was looking at it
<didrocks> tmoenicke: can you enlighten us? ^ ;)
<tmoenicke> yep
 * didrocks listens to tmoenicke :)
<Ursinha> hey guys, I just hit bug 1247401, anything I can do to extract useful info?
<ubot5> bug 1247401 in indicator-datetime (Ubuntu) "Date/Time missing from indicators and welcome screen" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1247401
<seb128> Ursinha, check is the service is running and maybe the corresponding upstart log
<Roger_> hi
<Ursinha> seb128, indicator-datetime-service isn't running
<Roger112112> hi
<seb128> Ursinha, is there anything useful in the upstart log?
<Roger112112> would somebody say me if i would installl ubuntu for phone on a device which was'nt nexus? Sorry for my bad english
<Roger112112> i wish install ubuntu for phone on a galaxy R, is it possible?
<Ursinha> seb128, the only mention I could find in upstart logs is in dbus.log, the last message says: Failed to activate service 'com.canonical.indicator.datetime': timed out
<seb128> Ursinha, is that current trusty? the indicators should be managed by upstart with the changes ted did
<seb128> e.g they should have their own log
<ogra_> seb128, is that already true for all of them ?
<Ursinha> seb128, yes, trusty, r34
<seb128> ogra_, yes
<ogra_> k
<davmor2> Roger112112: there is a list of supported devices on the wiki at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices other wise you would need to port it https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Porting
<seb128> Ursinha, well, in any case it seems like the service had an issue and timeouted, not a lot you can get now, if it happens again it would be useful to get a gdb stacktrace before the timeout
<Ursinha> seb128, it's the first time it happens to me, popey reported the bug a week ago (it seems)
<seb128> rather a month ago, and that issue was fixed since
<Ursinha> no, actually a month ago
<Ursinha> whoa
<ogra_> and he reported it with a lot delay
<ogra_> we all see it randomly since saucy already
<Ursinha> I've been good in finding regressions that were supposed to be fixed...
<ogra_> well, its not a regression
<ogra_> unless yu take the mwc congress demo image as a base for it :)
<Ursinha> ogra_, I said based on "that issue was fixed since"
<ogra_> it always happened randomly for people
<popey> yeah, it's happened on and off all the time
<ogra_> and i am sure i have also seen it recently
<Ursinha> so it was never fixed :)
<popey> i saw it over the weekend
<ogra_> sometihgn was fixed
<ogra_> probably just not enough though :)
<popey> well the bug doesn't suggest it was fixed
<seb128> popey, what bug? yours?
<seb128> popey, you just filed a duplicate and the action happened to the "real" report...
<Ursinha> seb128, that is a duplicate? why isn't that marked as such? what's the "real" report number?
<seb128> Ursinha, popey, ogra_: bug #1239710 was the saucy/trusty issue that got fixed
<ubot5> bug 1239710 in indicator-session (Ubuntu) "indicator-datetime or -session missing ~10% of the time" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1239710
<seb128> Ursinha, dunno, ask bug triagers why launchpad is not in a perfect state, I didn't know about it before you pointed out today
<seb128> Ursinha, I guess the reply is "we don't keep up with reports and not all duplicates are triaged"
 * popey marks as dupe then
<Ursinha> seb128, I found it in the bugs list I created with all packages seeded in touch, actually both bugs are there (I just spotted the one you mentioned)
<Ursinha> seb128, that was an honest question really
<seb128> Ursinha, well, the honest answer is "we don't have enough triager"
<ogra_> seb128, well, i tried to address that with my recent mail discussion :)
<Ursinha> maybe there's something we could do (avengers people and us) to look for bugs before filing new ones, I'm asking to improve things...
<ogra_> seems we all do :)
<MacSlow> Saviq, here's the branch making trouble on jenkins... lp:~macslow/unity8/notification-fullscreen-support
<Roger112112>  thanks davmor 2!
<popey> Ursinha: we frequently discuss bugs in here before filing
<Ursinha> it seems that one slipped, but okay, if that's enough for you who am I to disagree
<seb128> popey, well, it would be useful to check the open bugs as well before filling
<Ursinha> seb128, I'll make a comment in the "real" bug that it still happens in trusty (I assume that's actually Fix Released, and not Fix Committed as the status says?)
<popey> we do that too. clearly I missed it on that one.
<mterry> Cimi, https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/ubuntu-system-settings/welcome-wizard/+merge/186862
<seb128> Ursinha, if you read that, there is already a such comment at the bottom of the bug
<seb128> Ursinha, the issue described there is fixed, there is maybe a second problem leading to the same result
<seb128> Ursinha, we need a new report with a backtrace of the service while it's hanging (before it timeout)
<seb128> Ursinha, for you or the next one who can reproduce
<Ursinha> seb128, can we reuse popey's bug?
<popey> i marked it dupe, feel free to modify it
<seb128> Ursinha, well, the guys on the other bug already opened a new one, if you read the comment at the bottom...
<seb128> use that one rather
<Ursinha> seb128, that doesn't seem to be the same problem, he seems to have more problems and is using saucy
<Ursinha> hence my question
<Ursinha> :)
<Ursinha> but okay
<seb128> Ursinha, ok, well, free free to reuse popey's one
<nocturn> Hi, can anyone tell me if the current version of Ubuntu phone supports activesync?
<cyphermox> nocturn, depending on the level of support of synchronizing to the right databases in syncevolution, you may be able to sync your data. see https://syncevolution.org/
<cyphermox> I'm not at all familiar with the specifics to tell you more though :)
<nocturn> thanks cyphermox
<pitti> ricmm: hey Rick, how are you?
<pitti> ricmm: I'm adding a mock sensor backend to platform-api, as discussed recently with tvoss and kalikiana_; I understand the general API of libubuntu_application_api.so, but how does this provide notifications? i. e. a callback when a sensor value changes?
<pitti> ricmm: oh nevermind, *_set_reading_cb()
<Ursinha> ogra_, I just hit bug 1256496... anything I can do?
<ubot5> bug 1256496 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) ""Apply update failed: No update has been downloaded"" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1256496
<pitti> ricmm: but I'm afraid I still have some architecture questions about platform-api; when would you have a couple of minutes for these?
<ogra_> reboot usually helps
<ogra_> i wonder why system-image 2.0 didnt migrate yet
<ogra_> aha
<ogra_> FTBFS
<ogra_> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/system-image/2.0.1-0ubuntu1/+build/5275242
<ogra_> seems to fail a self test
<ogra_> barry_, any chance we can get that fixed ?
<ogra_> (system-image 2.0 FTBFS)
<barry> ogra_: i'm sure there's a chance ;)  fwiw, that test does not fail locally, only on the buildds, so yay
<ogra_> lovely
<Ursinha> ogra_, man, I believe rebooting will solve the problem but that isn't the point, I was asking if there's any useful data I could collect while the bug is here :)
<ogra_> Ursinha, given that 2.0 is waiting alreaady i dont think so
<ogra_> (it is suppposed to improve that issue)
<Ursinha> ogra_, alright :)
<davmor2> barry: ogra_ told me to ask you about the fact that in settings if I have only auto-download on wifi why it does it on 3g too, and is this fixed in 2.0?
<ogra_> for me it never downloads anything it seems
<ogra_> my phone is pretty rarely on 3G only though ... most of the time its on WLAN and 3G ... (routing through WLAN though)
<barry> davmor2: this is really controlled by ubuntu-download-manager.  system-image keeps a centralized "database" of the settings, but because it never does downloads directly, it relies on udm to make that determination.  si only knows about "manual download" vs "auto download".  i agree this is somewhat unclear on the wiki page
<davmor2> barry: right thanks
<dobey> fginther, cjohnston: can you review/deploy https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/cupstream2distro-config/u1creds-fix/+merge/197264 please?
<fginther> dobey, looking
<cjohnston> fginther: ^ is what I needed to talk to you about I believe
<lool> would someone be able to debug ofono not seeing my SIM card with me?
<lool> story is as follows: I had a prepaid T-Mobile SIM for some weeks/months in the phone; it would attach to the cell network even if I was out of credit; at some point it stopped attaching, but I assumed it had been disabled or something; today I tried putting my own regular SIM in the phone, but that didn't work either
<ogra_> lool, i guess you should wait for awe
<lool> no GSM connection, no data, not getting the unlock SIM button either
<lool> ogra_: Ok
<davmor2> popey, ogra_: can you just try something on r42 open the dialer app move to call log, then press the power button, Now ring the phone does the dialer app appear or does it stay on the lock screen
<lool> or maybe rsalveti
<ogra_> (to not have to re-post the whole again)
<lool> it's ok  :-)
<lool> ogra_: do you know where ofono settings are stored after ofono-setup?
<ogra_> doesnt that do telepathy-ofono ?
<ogra_> i would expect it to happen wherever telepathy usually stores stuff ~/.config perhaps ?
<lool> I see a .local/share/telepathy/mission-control/accounts.cfg
<lool> but nothing in .config
<rsalveti> lool: check /usr/share/ofono/scripts/list-modems
<lool> All I get from oFono is GET_SIM_STATUS request failed
<rsalveti> see what you have in there
<lool> rsalveti: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6509675/
<lool>     Powered = 0
<rsalveti> and yeah, start ofonod with -d
<ogra_> note that we use the ofono.override upstart job by default
<rsalveti> lool: right, rild is not able to see your sim card I'd say
<barry> ogra_: anyway, fwiw: LP: #1256947
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1256947 in system-image (Ubuntu) "FTBFS on buildds" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1256947
<rsalveti> lool: change /etc/init/ofono.override -> ofonod -d -p....
<rsalveti> and reboot
<ogra_> lets hope some buildd admin picks it up then :)
<rsalveti> then check your syslog
<lool> rsalveti: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6509682/
<lool> rsalveti: I've stopped and started ofono, should I reboot?
<rsalveti> lool: better to reboot, as it could also be something with ril
<lool> ok
<rsalveti> but from the ofono side, that basically means rild wasn't able to find your sim card
<lool> it's kind of odd with 2 different SIM cards
<rsalveti> lool: which device? also make sure the pins are all properly in place
<lool> the phone has not been mishandled and it's kind of hard to burm the SIM slot
<lool> rsalveti: Nexus 4
<rsalveti> oh, that's harder to break
<lool> rsalveti: after reboot: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6509689/
<ogra_> its all glass ! its easy to break
 * ogra_ has experience with breaking the N4 if you need help ... or a hammer
<lool> ah crap, what was the rune to enter the android container to run logcat again?
<rsalveti>  /system/bin/logcat
<ogra_> no need to do that in the container
<rsalveti> or lxc-console -nandroid -t0
<rsalveti> but yeah, just run logcat directly
<ogra_> works fine from the ubuntu side
<fginther> dobey, I have some questions for cyphermox on this, I'll get back to you
<lool> complaints about ttyUSB0 there, but not much about RIL
<lool> I/UpstartPropertyWatcher(  702): Property changed: gsm.version.ril-impl=Qualcomm RIL 1.0
<lool> I/UpstartPropertyWatcher(  702): Property changed: rild.libpath=/system/lib/libril-qc-qmi-1.so
<lool> I/UpstartPropertyWatcher(  702): Property changed: init.svc.ril-daemon=running
<lool> I/UpstartPropertyWatcher(  702): Property changed: init.svc.ril-daemon=running
<lool> I/UpstartPropertyWatcher(  702): Property changed: gsm.version.ril-impl=Qualcomm RIL 1.0
<lool> is all I have in fact
<ogra_> you rather want syslog
<rsalveti> right, rild is up, would be interesting to enable debug messages there
<ogra_> grep for ofono when booting with -d added
<rsalveti> ogra_: ofono can't see the sim card (via rild)
<ogra_> oh, sorry, missed the paste above
<rsalveti> lool: did you flash android 4.4?
<lool> rsalveti: no
<lool> rsalveti: should I?
<ogra_> no
<rsalveti> lool: no, that breaks wireless
<lool> rsalveti: actually maybe someone might have
<ogra_> firmware is incompatible
<lool> I lended that phoen for week-end
<lool> for an install party
<rsalveti> right
<ogra_> you will need to flash 4.2 again
<rsalveti> flash android 4.2.2 again
<ogra_> to make it work
<lool> but I had my data on it after the event
<rsalveti> see if radio works, then flash ubuntu
<lool> so I'd be surprized if they flashed 4.4
<lool> well I guess byebye to my data again then  :-)
<lool> rsalveti: any quick way to check it's 4.4 though?
<rsalveti> lool: maybe via bootloader
<lool> just in case the issue is some botched config from weird trusty upgrades
<lool> or similar
<rsalveti> but not sure
<cyphermox> fginther: moo?
<Cimi> seb128, all the current plugins in system settings have a panel?+
<rsalveti> lool: flash 4.2.2 again just to be sure, would also help to know if your sim card works with android
<fginther> cyphermox, regarding https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/cupstream2distro-config/u1creds-fix/+merge/197264.  There is no /debian in lp:ubuntuone-credentials, is that not needed for daily release?
 * ogra_ hands cyphermox some hay
<lool> I have baseband M9615A-CEFWMAZM-2.0.1700.84
<lool> which seems to be 4.4
<ogra_> there you go then
<seb128> Cimi, yes, why ?
<cyphermox> fginther: it is, yes
<seb128> Cimi, that's their UI
<Cimi> seb128, so if I want to write just a backend for the moment?
<cyphermox> fginther: there was another merge request to go with that one that was merging /daily-release into lp:ubuntuone-credentials
<cyphermox> that was being blocked by the merge you're pointing me to
<seb128> Cimi, well, store it with the UI that uses it, e.g wizard
<lool> actually not sure
<fginther> cyphermox, ack, I'll approve then
<cyphermox> this is because cupstream2distro-config is used both for CI and for daily-release
<seb128> Cimi, or said different, making it a wizard cpp plugin
<Cimi> seb128, I'm sure we all have a fronted in the settings
<seb128> you mean?
<Cimi> seb128, a panel
<Cimi> to add/edit users
<Cimi> one day
<seb128> the wizard UI is a standalone app no?
<seb128> not a panel ?
<seb128> it's not on the design document
<seb128> so I would think not on the phone
<seb128> we might have one, one day, but we shouldn't clutter the UI with a non implemented futur option
<Cimi> seb128, on tablet/desktop
<seb128> well, get a design then you can add an icon
<Cimi> seb128, so I'd like to keep it there
<Cimi> seb128, and not show the UI
<seb128> we don't add non working icosn
<seb128> ok, that works for me
<Cimi> seb128, yeah, we on't
<seb128> just hide the icon then ;-)
<Cimi> seb128, so if I remove .settings works?
<seb128> yes
<Cimi> ok
<Cimi> seb128, pushed
<seb128> Cimi, thanks
<davmor2> didrocks: image 42 might have issues with the dialer app on maguro.  If the app isn't open and the phone is in sleep, the phone wakes on receiving a call but the dialer app never fully opens (just the grey holder for it) if the app is open it never appears
<davmor2> didrocks: I'm assuming a regression in unity8
<didrocks> davmor2: can you try with an image before the unity8 version please?
<didrocks> + opening a bug :)
<lool> so for the record, baseband 1700.48 is what android 4.2.2 has
<davmor2> didrocks: will do, isn't that like image 37 ish
<lool> not sure whether it had 4.3 or 4.4 basedband though
<lool> rsalveti: thanks a lot for the debugging, and sorry if it's someone who has flashed 4.4 under me (I hadn't thought of this!)
<ogra_> lool, well, it is a problem ...
<lool> hopefully it's just this and the phone works with android
<ogra_> i wonder if we could tackle it from our side somehow
<davmor2> maybe 35
<lool> ogra_: do we know what the issue is?  userspace ril needs an update for new baseband?
<ogra_> pushing the right FW when we detect something worng etc
<ogra_> lool, no, i have no idea what the exact issue is, but i know that people that did an OTA to android 4.4 seem to all have this issue with touch
<didrocks> sil2100: did you get any bug report retraced for the Hud crasher btw?
<ogra_> so if we could detect the to new version and could push ours that might work around it
<cyphermox> lool: rsalveti: when I said 4.4 breaks wireless I was just saying that after flashing 4.4 I didn't have wireless back in touch, it might be another issue entirely ;)
<lool> cyphermox: I did have *wifi*
<lool> not cell
<cyphermox> ok
<ogra_> cyphermox, that issue even beats android users that roll back to 4.2
<cyphermox> ogra_: ok. I don't know, I consistently have 4.3 flashed if I reflash android
 * ogra_ read about it quite a few times aalready
<cyphermox> alrighty
<ogra_> but it would be nice if we could somehow prevent it
<ogra_> by pushing the right baseband version ir so
<cyphermox> flash the right radio as part of the update yeah
<ogra_> (not sure how that technically works in android)
<cyphermox> but I'd like to assume the radio gets updated in 4.4 because there's some fancy cool new thing we might wanna have too ;)
<ogra_> i guess 4.4 simply ships a new ril
<cyphermox> that's not necessarily wrong, although it might be painful
<ogra_> it will surely be for awe :)
<cyphermox> hehe
<ogra_> if the protocol changed or some such
<lool> rsalveti: Oh wow, guess what, SIM card didn't work under Android 4.2 either
<lool> seems the slot is broken
<lool> (this is my regular SIM card which worked in another N4 minutes ago)
<sil2100> didrocks: no, let me do that now
<rsalveti> lool: =\
<fginther> dobey, the MP is approved, waiting for jenkins to return to deploy it
<labsin> Does anyone know this: http://askubuntu.com/questions/382170
<labsin> http://askubuntu.com/questions/382170/how-to-tell-if-an-app-is-going-to-get-suspended-from-qml
<popey> your app will suspend when the user goes away
<popey> labsin: http://samohtv.wordpress.com/2013/08/15/application-lifecycle-model-policies/
<ogra_> well
<ogra_> when it loses focus i'd say ....
<popey> yeah, i was using his wording from the AU question
<labsin> popey, but I want to set a state before it gets suspended
<labsin> popey, It's for the falling-blocks game. I'd like to pause the game when the user goes away, but I don't know how
<popey> Yes, I understand the use-case.
<popey> the game will naturally pause when you swipe away.
<labsin> popey, I'd like it to be in pause when they get back...
<popey> yeah, not sure how you'd do that, other than some clunky detection of when the time has changed
<labsin> popey, then i'll leave it out
<popey> it may be there is some more sane way to detect it, but I don't know
<popey> I can't think of any other apps which do it currently
<labsin> something else, I can't seem to find the package with the ubuntu-touch icons
<bfiller> Saviq: where does the ApplicationManager class that is referenced in unity8/Components/ApplicationManagerWrapper.qml startApplication() live? can't find it
<ricmm> bfiller: unity-mir
<ricmm> bfiller: what are you looking for?
<bfiller> ricmm: trying to trace how apps are launched from the shell. I found that if you start the app from the command line it launches literally twice as fast as doing it from the shell
<bfiller> ricmm: trying to understand why
<ricmm> bfiller: the shell asks upstart-app-launch to do the launching
<ricmm> command line is of course direct execution
<ricmm> bfiller: so the overhead comes from upstart-app-launch
<bfiller> ricmm: can I run upstart-app-launch directly from the command line? not launching anything when I do it
<ricmm> bfiller: $ start application APP_ID="gallery-app"
<bfiller> ricmm: let me try that, can APP_ID be the desktop file as well?
<ricmm> bfiller: not entirely sure what the limitations are
<ricmm> bfiller: ted should know
<davmor2> didrocks: http://ubuntuone.com/3jZCIkuEROO2T7kHSAdquf I get this from time to time is this going to be the fault of the indicator or something backend telepathy and ofono at a guess?  Note the top message look and acts differently from the lower one
<didrocks> davmor2: wait, ubuntuone is really slow ;)
<bfiller> ricmm: hmmn, can't get it to work with address-book-app using APP_ID="address-book-app" or APP_ID="/usr/share/applications/address-book-app.desktop"
<bfiller> ricmm: works for gallery
<davmor2> didrocks: I blame you wanting app to install on the phone :P
<ricmm> bfiller: because that one is a click package, it needs the full APP_ID
<ricmm> which includes version and what not
<didrocks> davmor2: ah, that one is known
<didrocks> davmor2: it's unity8 ;)
<bfiller> ricmm: address book is not a click
<didrocks> davmor2: well, my 1GB connexion shouldn't bother about installing app ;)
<didrocks> davmor2: if you can find a reliable reproducer for that bug btw, that would be really helpful
<didrocks> davmor2: did you file another one for the call one?
<ricmm> bfiller: works for me
<ricmm> APP_ID="address-book-app"
<davmor2> didrocks: of course it is :)  no got to try and find if it is a regression first, do you happen to have a bug for the messaging one
<ricmm> are you sure it isnt already running? if it is, it wont start it again
<bfiller> ricmm: trying again, just got white screen
<didrocks> davmor2: do you have the bug ref?
<didrocks> yeah, there is one
<davmor2> didrocks: send 10 messages to yourself one of them will turn out like thar
<didrocks> one sec
<davmor2> that even
<didrocks> davmor2: well, it's not reliable, in the way, you know the input and you get that output :p
<didrocks> davmor2: bug #1253810
<ubot5> bug 1253810 in unity8 (Ubuntu) "Messages in Incoming not always display the correct date and content" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1253810
<didrocks> there is a tentative fix, but it's only tentative :p
<davmor2> didrocks: thanks
<ricmm> bfiller: make sure it isnt running
<bfiller> ricmm: working now after reboot
<bfiller> ricmm: didn't show it was running but I guess it was
<didrocks> davmor2: I want my link for the other bug now! Let's trade link! :)
<davmor2> didrocks: I haven't written it till I'm sure that the unity8 is the cause,  I can write one up if you are desperate
<didrocks> davmor2: I'm so sad now! Ok, just paste it once you identify the guilty ;)
<davmor2> didrocks: will do
<pmcgowan> didrocks, when will then new Mir land
<didrocks> pmcgowan: hum, which one?
<ogra_> pmcgowan, last week we had some Mir landings
<pmcgowan> didrocks, I thought it had not landed at all for some time
<pmcgowan> oh
<pmcgowan> looking forward to nexus 10 support
<Saviq> bfiller, unity-mir
<Saviq> bfiller, and qtubuntu for surfaceflinger
<Saviq> bfiller, why?
<didrocks> pmcgowan: it did, look at one of the hundred emails you got on the ubuntu-phone ML while you were eating :p
<pmcgowan> didrocks, awesome
<pmcgowan> thanks
<Saviq> bfiller, apps shouldn't be using it, btw
<didrocks> pmcgowan: yw ;)
<ogra_> pmcgowan, http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/touch-image-stats/20131129.changes btw ...
<ogra_> (from mirserver 10 to 11)
<pmcgowan> ty
<pmcgowan> I have that bookmarked actually, jusyt misunderstood the last mail I read
<ogra_> - graphics: android: 1) change hwc1.1 to make use of sync fences during
<ogra_>       the compositor's gl renderloop. Note that we no longer wait for the
<ogra_>       render to complete, we pass this responsibility to the driver and the
<ogra_>       kernel. 2) support nexus 10. (LP: #1252173) (LP: #1203268)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1252173 in mir (Ubuntu) "mir_demo_client_flicker rendering very slowly on Android" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1252173
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1203268 in mir (Ubuntu) "Mir fails to start on Nexus 10 - std::exception::what: Could not unblank display" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1203268
<Saviq> rsalveti, http://paste.ubuntu.com/6510103/ - download in text should let you get at it
<ogra_> from the changelog of mir 1.2
<ogra_> (0.1.2)
<Saviq> rsalveti, actually http://people.canonical.com/~msawicz/_usr_bin_unity8.32011.crash
<bfiller> Saviq: looking at start up time of apps
<bfiller> Saviq: launching from shell or directly from upstart-app-launch about 80% slower then directly from command line
<ogra_> bfiller, looka at aa-exec
<Saviq> bfiller, interesting
<Saviq> bfiller, but yeah ââ
<ogra_> that was my first area to research, ChickenCutlass asked me to check app launch time too
<Saviq> bfiller, check out the .desktop files in ~/.local/share/applications
<Saviq> bfiller, and compare with and without aa-exec
<bfiller> Saviq, ogra_ : I'll take a look
<mhall119> so my phone was losing app instances & thumbnails a lot again yesterday, and when I checked top I found that 'init' was consuming 60% of my RAM....
<mhall119> does the app lifecycle stuff kill apps when RAM is scarce, rather than swapping them to disk?
<ogra_> mhall119, yes, and the thumbnailing then all goes wrong
<ogra_> i usually end up getting the wrong labels whan that happens
<mhall119> yeah, I've had that happen too
<mhall119> running multiple webbrowser-app instances for webapps seems a quick way to use up enough RAM to trigger this too
<mhall119> but 60% for init? that seems very wrong
<bfiller> Saviq: I was testing with address-book-app which is not a click package. So don't think aa-exec comes into play?
<Saviq> bfiller, right, no it does not
<bfiller> Saviq: does that mean non-click packages are not app-armour protected?
<Saviq> bfiller, yes
<mhall119> at that point I couldn't have more than one app open at a time, whenever I opened another, it killed the first
<Saviq> bfiller, unconfined
<ogra_> mhall119, tell ricmm and tvoss please
<bfiller> Saviq: yup ok, then app armour not the issue. looks like upstart-app-launch add a significant delay
<ogra_> mhall119, they do the lifecycle stuff afaik
<mhall119> ricmm: ping me when you're available please
<mhall119> ogra_: are the also the right people to talk to about user-session init process consuming crazy amounts of RAM?
<mhall119> this wasn't PID 1
<mhall119> it was the init run as phablet
<ogra_> right
<Saviq> bfiller, confirmed
<Saviq> bfiller, I wonder, it might just be the time upstart waits for an app to be considered started
<ogra_> mhall119, it is upstart-app-launch ... but i think thats only fallout
<mhall119> ogra_: what is?
<bfiller> Saviq: could be, do you know what exactly it waits on?
<ogra_> mhall119, platform-api or unity-mir are responsible for the liufecycle stuff i think
<mhall119> ok
 * mhall119 will wait for ricmm's pong
<Saviq> bfiller, no, and actually after trying a few times
<Saviq> bfiller, it's intermittent
<Saviq> bfiller, there's times when it launches as fast as by hand
<Saviq> bfiller, and then it takes 3 seconds
<bfiller> Saviq: interesting, I haven't seen that. Always takes much longer for me
<bfiller> Saviq: really noticeable running on emulator. I've been using address-book-app as my test case
<Saviq> bfiller, just go upstart-app-launch address-book-app; then upstart-app-stop address-book-app a few times
<mhall119> can apps respond to app lifecycle events, like being closed, so they can do clean-up or session saving?
<Saviq> mhall119, they have a grace period when they
<Saviq> 're unfocused
<bfiller> Saviq: I get just a white screen intermittently after running app-launh, app-stop, app-launch
<Saviq> bfiller, yup, seeing that as well - it fails to start like every second time for me
<Saviq> bfiller, it's failing in platform-api
<Saviq> bfiller, not sure yet what's happening
<Saviq> bfiller, when it happens, just do -launch again
<bfiller> Saviq: ok
<Saviq> bfiller, shouldn't impact what you're looking at
<davmor2> didrocks: right it's working in image 35 so I'll write a bug against unity8 lastest in the assumption it is to blame :D
<Saviq> mhall119, past that they're not guaranteed to ever get resumed
<mhall119> Saviq: right, but are they notified somehow?
<mhall119> and is that notification something we can respond to in a qml-only app?
<mhall119> wow, we're on r43 already?  guess we won't be on r100 again on release day :)
<tmoenicke> didrocks: I left a comment: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-keyboard/+bug/1255999
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1255999 in ubuntu-keyboard (Ubuntu) "[regression] if switched to non english local, the keyboard does not come up when an input field is focused" [High,Confirmed]
<Saviq> mhall119, I'm not sure, but folks are already working on this for the SDK
<mhall119> ok, thanks Saviq
<Saviq> mhall119, so there's *something* they know  at least
<didrocks> davmor2: thanks!  please send me an email with this :)
<ogra_> mhall119, i wish we could be at r500 or higher on release day :)
<mhall119> Saviq: when do you think we'll get Unity8 shell rotation?
<mhall119> popey: uDraw (and I assume Graphite) are still not working on devices, do we know the cause yet?
<mhall119> gah, the OSK is letting touch events fall through again!
<mhall119> is this something we can auto-pilot test?
<davmor2> didrocks: email sent https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity8/+bug/1257000 is the annoying bug hopefully :)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1257000 in Unity 8 "Regression: Maguro receiving calls fails to open dailer app" [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> davmor2: perfect!
<didrocks> ogra_: I'm lost, what's the last promoted image?
<didrocks> (and where can I see it)
<didrocks> 32 it seems
<rsalveti> ogra_: we should enable mir by default with nexus 10 then
<rsalveti> if not done already
<rsalveti> Saviq: but there's no core dump in there, right?
<ogra_> rsalveti, well, i'd like to hear back that it actually works ... from someone who has the hw and can touch ~/.display-mir
<rsalveti> I can give it a try later today
<rsalveti> sergiusens: in case you have your nexus 10 in hands easily ^
<rsalveti> need to charge mine
<ogra_> didrocks, i tend to just look at the last line of http://system-image.ubuntu.com/trusty/mako/
<sergiusens> rsalveti, I had it my hands just now
<Cimi> I have one I can try
<didrocks> ogra_: ok, "nice UI" :)
<didrocks> thanks!
<sergiusens> let me get the latest image on
<sergiusens> I have the checking for updates spinner just laughing at me...
<ogra_> laugh back, i'm sure it will like that
<sergiusens> didrocks, ogra_ rsalveti mir works, camera doesn't though
<ogra_> who cares about the camer ... pfft
<ogra_> +a
<rsalveti> sergiusens: hm, in theory it should work, but I believe manta uses camera 2.0
<rsalveti> which might have some incompatibility then
<sergiusens> rsalveti, didn't mako use that too?
<sergiusens> rsalveti, ah, right
<sergiusens> no
<rsalveti> ricmm: mind checking this ^?
<sergiusens> manta uses 2
<sergiusens> rsalveti, also, any idea why these are back? binder: 1912 RLIMIT_NICE not set ?
<sergiusens> rsalveti, was your change reverted?
<rsalveti> sergiusens: iirc only manta was using v2
<sergiusens> rsalveti, yup, I recall gusch having to fiddle with this to get the camera working
<rsalveti> sergiusens: we always had it since we flipped the container
<sergiusens> unflip it then :-P
<ogra_> really ?
<rsalveti> yup, I even have a bug open for it somewhere
<ogra_> the rsyslog snippet should catch it regardless
<rsalveti> bug 1202887
<ogra_> sergiusens, awesome idea !
<ubot5> bug 1202887 in linux-manta (Ubuntu) "'binder: RLIMIT_NICE not set' when using binder from the ubuntu side" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1202887
<sergiusens> rsalveti, there's a unanswered question for you in that bug btw ;-)
<rsalveti> we also had a long discussion over irc and we kind of decided just to ignore it for now, until we decide the default nice value for userspace
<rsalveti> yeah, need to update the bug
<ogra_> i still dont get it
<ogra_> the rsyslog snippet should simply suppress these messages
<rsalveti> right, that should still be in place
<ogra_> unless there was a format change or anything
<ogra_> it is
<ogra_> just checked it
<rsalveti> sergiusens: did you check using syslog or dmesg
<rsalveti> it'll still show via dmesg
<ogra_> right, dmesg will have raw kernel stuff
<ogra_> not going through syslog indeed
<ogra_> but kern.log or syslog shouldnt
<sergiusens> rsalveti, dmesg
<ogra_> yeah, that would actually need a kernel patch
<ogra_> someone should add that to the bug :P
<Saviq> rsalveti, yes there is
<Saviq> rsalveti, pastebin shows it as one line, though
<rsalveti> Saviq: oh, ok, sorry
<rsalveti> let me check it again
 * rsalveti removes the dust from his maguro
<pmcgowan> sergiusens, using the sidestage seems to lock things up
<rsalveti> pmcgowan: ricmm is also at the mir sprint, he should just fix it
<rsalveti> :-)
<pmcgowan> oh wow, I got system settings full screen with the sidestage overlayed
<ogra_> so you cant miss them :)
<pmcgowan> rsalveti, does ricmmjust go to every sprint now :)
<rsalveti> pmcgowan: haha, seems so
<ogra_> smuggling toilet papaer and diapers back home ;)
<ogra_> ... getting rich
<rsalveti> hahah :-)
<sergiusens> pmcgowan, I wasn't aware sidestage was fixed
<sergiusens> pmcgowan, but confirm, it does lock up
<pmcgowan> sergiusens, yeah its half there
<sergiusens> pmcgowan, I meant, "I can confirm" just in case :-)
<pmcgowan> ack
<ogra_> sergiusens, you should have gotten used to pmcgowan living a few weeks in the future ...
<ogra_> pmcgowan, btw, these lottery numbers from next week, can you mail them to me ? :)
<pmcgowan> ogra_, I knew you would say that
<rsalveti> Saviq: also: BFD: Warning: /home/phablet/CoreDump is truncated: expected core file size >= 286961664, found: 61512.
<rsalveti> but yeah, in theory it'd be at glib (via procmaps), but adding it doesn't help
<airking> How stable is the necus 4 version of the ubuntu phone os?
<airking> nexus*
<popey> depends how you define "stable"
<davmor2> pmcgowan: who's best to talk to about the lack of icons on the setting accounts page?  They appear when you are logged into one but not before
<airking> popey: Gooed enough to use daily
<pmcgowan> davmor2, put in a bug for mardy to look at
<popey> airking: many of us use it daily
<davmor2> pmcgowan: thanks
<airking> I need email, text, web, data connection, wifi, phone, and a terminal that I cna ssh with
<popey> airking: try it out â»
<airking> Does it have a contacts list?  and can I import a .csv file from my google contacts?
<shadeslayer_> ogra_: btw I saw that ARM released some mali kernel and user space drivers
<shadeslayer_> http://malideveloper.arm.com/develop-for-mali/drivers/open-source-mali-t6xx-gpu-kernel-device-drivers/
<davmor2> airking: http://sergiusens.github.io/posts/google-contacts-on-ubuntu-touch.html you just do adb shell then the last three commands repeat the last command if you have more than 50 contacts iirc
<airking> how is the battery life on the nexus 4?
<ogra_> shadeslayer_, ... "Note that these components are not a complete driver stack. To build a functional OpenGL ES you need access to the full source code of the Mali GPU DDK, which is provided under the standard ARM commercial licence to all Mali GPU customers."...
<shadeslayer_> yeah :/
<ogra_> shadeslayer_, thats not much different from fglrx or nvidia on x86
<shadeslayer_> though maybe framebuffer is possible now?
<ogra_> and i think that stuff exists since quite a while already
<ogra_> framebuffer might work with the lima drivers
<Ursinha> davmor2, re. bug 1257028, is that a mako?
<ubot5> bug 1257028 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "Accounts page is missing icons until you log into one then that icon shows" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1257028
<shadeslayer_> doesn't, lima is only for Mali 400
<ogra_> ah
 * ogra_ is happy we dont have to wrangle with that stuff in ubuntu touch 
<sergiusens> davmor2, I wrote simpler steps in a new post a while back http://sergiusens.github.io/posts/syncing-contacts-from-google-on-latest-touch-images.html
<Ursinha> davmor2, I can confirm the bug here and unless you have a maguro there's a tool to grab screenshots in phablet-tools :)
<ogra_> lol
<ogra_> ... she said to the maguro tester :P
<Ursinha> oops haha
<sergiusens> mzanetti, Saviq, ogra_ did you solve your session issues with ssh btw?
<ogra_> did we have session issues ?
<ogra_> oh, that quoting stuff
<davmor2> sergiusens: oh nice I'd not seen that one
<davmor2> Ursinha: I'm on maguro
<sergiusens> ogra_, yeah, the one where env vars weren't imported
<ogra_> sergiusens, the issue was that the var they need isnt in /etc/profile.d ...
<davmor2> Ursinha: hence using my camera
<Ursinha> davmor2, ogra_ just told me that :)
<ogra_> but in /etc/envirotment (which we need to clean up until release)
<davmor2> Ursinha: I'm slowly playing catch up
<sergiusens> davmor2, is it just me or did the latest maguro images improve their performance?
 * sergiusens might just be getting used to the slowness
<davmor2> sergiusens: shhh you'll upset it and it'll die
 * ogra_ didnt notice any better performance
<sergiusens> ogra_, as a user it doesn't crawl after an hour at least :-)
<ogra_> ah, i dont thik i used it that long recently
<davmor2> sergiusens: nope running the same for me, but then I've not had a single version on for more than an hour so it's hard to tell
 * ogra_ was verifying all these bugs ... but beyond that i use my mako 
<ogra_> (well, and until i have a kbd again i'm back on my N5)
 * ogra_ goes afk again
<nerochiaro_> thomi: hi, do you know what's the status of this bug ? https://bugs.launchpad.net/autopilot-qt/+bug/1218971
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1218971 in Autopilot Qt Support "QQuickWindowâs contentItem is not accessible" [Medium,In progress]
 * thomi looks
<nerochiaro_> bfiller: I sent you an email with the details of the branch that fixes the notepad tests
<bfiller> nerochiaro_: I saw that. thanks!
<nerochiaro_> bfiller: cc'd didier too as you said he was interested
<nerochiaro_> bfiller: np, hopefully it will work
<thomi> nerochiaro_: mzanetti had a branch, which fails to build today. If he doesn't get to it, I'll eventually get there, but there's many more important things on my TODO list.
<bfiller> nerochiaro_: I'll test it once it builds in jenks
<thomi> nerochiaro_: it's probably very easy tomake it build. If you wanted to take a crack at it I can promise a review....
<nerochiaro_> thomi: i've never touched autopilot except for using it to write tests, i'm not entirely sure where to start. mzanetti told me to ask you
<thomi> nerochiaro_: yeah. that's fair enough :)
<thomi> nerochiaro_: how urgent is it?
<nerochiaro_> thomi: it's blocking some integration tests that i have been waiting to merge since a few weeks
<thomi> nerochiaro_: ok.... I'll do my best to get to it today. can't promise anything though :-/
<nerochiaro_> thomi: thank you !
<nerochiaro_> thomi: i'm on the opposite time zone as you and I'll probably go offline soon. Can you please email me a quick update at the end of your day, regardless if you manage to get to it or not ?
<thomi> nerochiaro_: fix pushed to the MP - it just needed trunk merging.
<thomi> nerochiaro_: can you please test it, and approve the MP if it fixes the issue for you?
<mmcc> ping jdstrand: some of us on ralsina's 'dash ui' team are looking at using the QML WebView Component for some new code, and thus have questions about the current status of oxide...
<jdstrand> mmcc: best to talk with chrisccoulson
<jdstrand> mmcc: I could give a high level overview, but then you would certainly ask followup questions that would need chrisccoulson
<jdstrand> mmcc: :)
#ubuntu-touch 2013-12-03
<sanjay> hello ubuntu i hav one aakash ubisurfer tablet which has 2 gb internal memory and 512 mb ram and kernel version is 3.0.8,, so can i install ubuntu touch on this tablet, sr/mam i know that this tablet is not supporatble for ubntut touch but i want to install it.. if you hav any idea for do this so plz give me some instruction..
<sanjay>  hello ubuntu i hav one aakash ubisurfer tablet which has 2 gb internal memory and 512 mb ram and kernel version is 3.0.8,, so can i install ubuntu touch on this tablet, sr/mam i know that this tablet is not supporatble for ubntut touch but i want to install it.. if you hav any idea for do this so plz give me some instruction..
<Echse27> I know, this question is often requested, but when will the Nexus 5 supported by ubuntutouch?
<mterry> ogra_, lightdm landed in trusty, so https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/session-manager-touch/usc/+merge/193518 is ready for review / landing once approved
<tvoss> pitti, ping
<mterry> I should say, an updated lightdm landed in trusty.  I suppose we've had lightdm itself for a while.  :)
<pitti> hey tvoss, wie gehts?
<Echse27> Wie sieht es denn mittlerweile mit dem Nexus 5 aus?
<dholbach> Echse27, this is an English speaking channel, and AFAIK nobody has started work on a Nexus 5 port yet - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices has a list of ports
<dholbach> ... and good morning
<Echse27> dholbach, ok sorry... are there one ore more devs which want to support the nexus 5 in near future?
<dholbach> Echse27, you could try to bring up the discussion on ubuntu-phone@lists.launchpad.net
<Echse27> dholbach, ok i will try it...
<TheSarge> Hello.
<TheSarge> Verizon sells a cheap tablet with a quad  core processor..  I have one and would like to start  the long road of getting touch to run on it.
<TheSarge> Hoping to find some people to help me here.
<kgunn> TheSarge: there are some instructions here... https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Porting
<kgunn> TheSarge: worth checking here first https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<TheSarge> Yeah only the nexus
<TheSarge> So it's up to me to write the bootstrap and all the drivers for any other device right now?
<ogra_> ugh, no :)
<ogra_> if there is an android port., verizon has to give you the source code ... based on that you can follow the porting guide from the channel topic
<TheSarge> Why didn't you guys go after commercial investment after crowd funding for edge failed? There is obvious demand for it.
<TheSarge> An android port?
<TheSarge> It's an android tablet..
<ogra_> that is happening ... the edge wasnt related to canonical talking to vendors at all
<ogra_> right, thats what i mean, get the source code and you should have something to start from
<ogra_> no need to write drivers or anything
<TheSarge> Sept I'm no developer
<ogra_> then find one with the same hardware ;)
<ogra_> and convince him/her to do it (and help where you can)
<TheSarge> So I need the source for the build of Android that is on my tablet?
<ogra_> right
<ogra_> you at least need the kernel and the binary graphics card drivers ...
<TheSarge> Doubt  Verizon would just hand it to me
<ogra_> they have to
<TheSarge> Haha they didn't use a gpl
<ogra_> they use android
<ogra_> the bits we need are all GPL ... (apart from binary graphics drivers indeed)
<TheSarge> Sure but drivers are their intellectual property
<ogra_> very unlikely
<ogra_> they are most likely the IP of the graphics card manufacturer
<ogra_> and you should be able to worst case just pull them from the tablet
<TheSarge> But cannoical is seeking commercial investments for edge?
<ogra_> no
<ogra_> that wasnt the purpose of the edge
<TheSarge> Oh
<TheSarge> The purpose of edge was for it to exist
<TheSarge> And you need more money
<ogra_> canonical is talking to phoine manufacturers and carriers ... but thats independent from the edge project
<TheSarge> So edge is dead?
<ogra_> the edge was nothing canonical would have made a single cent with
<TheSarge> I know that
<ogra_> imagine it like a club of techical nerds that want the latest and greatest hardware that also supports convergence
<TheSarge> I was just curious if they had completely given up on it now.
<ogra_> yes
<TheSarge> Oh :(
<ogra_> it failed ... now the focus is on getting a "normal" phone and tablet together with a manufacturer
<TheSarge> Well that model of your phone also being your computer while docked at home is too powerful to go away, it will be the future.
<ogra_> oh, sure
<ogra_> but it isnt the focus atm
<TheSarge> It has to go one way or the other..  All the power in the cloud and a shell in your pocket or vice versa.
<ogra_> for 13.10 we made a basic phone OS work ... for 14.04 the focus is on getting better tablet support and to finish the phone OS ...
<TheSarge> Well I remember back in the day when Android just came out and I got it running on an HTC touch
<ogra_> in 14.10 the focus will move to convergence
<TheSarge> Maybe I can get touch working on my phone or tablet
<TheSarge> There isn't even a root method for this tablet yet
<ogra_> btw, if you ask a vendor for kernel or android source ... http://gpl-violations.org/faq/violation-faq.html
<TheSarge> And I see no one working on one at xda or anywhere else
<ogra_> right you would need to have root access or find an exploit yourself
<TheSarge> I will email them tomorrow.
<TheSarge> Yeah well I have no idea how to get root access.
<TheSarge> I'm stuck waiting for someone at xda or something to get interested
<ogra_> well, waiting rarely helps :)
<ogra_> start a thread with a call for help
<TheSarge> . But since Verizon have away millions of these tablets I think it will happen.
<ogra_> and see if someone reacts
<TheSarge> I will
<TheSarge> Maybe I'll just buy a nexus haha
<ogra_> often such branded tablets are even re-branded by the carrier ... it couls be that your tablet even has a port and root exploit already, just under a different name
<ogra_> well yeah, with a nexus you are definitely on the safe side, thats what we focus on with development
<TheSarge> It is re-branded. But I haven't been able to find out the manufacturer.
<ogra_> right, xda should help
<TheSarge> I have been on xda since Android came out lol
<TheSarge> Wonder how much the nexus tablet runs for used online
<TheSarge> And if they will run on Verizons 4g lte network
<ogra_> well, its pretty checp even new
<ogra_> *cheap
<TheSarge> Lots of questions. Here I come Google.
<mterry> mhall119, heyo!  The Mir documentation no longer seems to be auto-updated from trunk.  Is it auto-updating from saucy's branch?
<TheSarge> Which nexus tablet are you guys working with?
<ogra_> the old nexus 7 and the nexus 10
<TheSarge> Hmm ok
<TheSarge> Cdma and gsm models?
<ogra_> gsm only
<kgunn> ogra_: one note on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity8/+bug/1256061
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1256061 in unity8 (Ubuntu) "clock forcefully switches from 24h to 12h AM/PM format once the panel clock is loaded" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<kgunn> i understand the removal of am/pm is on purpose to save "panel real estate"
<ogra_> kgunn, well thats fine with me ... the point is that it is on 24h display before the panel clock starts
<kgunn> right, understood...i just saw you calling that out,  bug  still switching back to 12 hr fmt is still an issue
<ogra_> as soon as the indicator comes up it switches to 12h ... regardless what locale is set
<kgunn> yep
<ogra_> if i am on a 12h clock i'm fine to not see AM/PM
<ogra_> (i know didrocks got pertty confused by it though)
<TheSarge> I found the galaxy 7 for 150 usd new
<TheSarge> But the galaxy 10 is like 300 used haha
<ogra_> well, it has that awesome display ... that costs :)
<TheSarge> Yeah. I'll get one soon.
<ivanka> hey popey - just wanted to say that that wifi fix works perfectly. All tested :-) Cheers!
<TheSarge> I can't stand this crappy ellipsis
<popey> ivanka: huzzah!
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: had to change location. back now
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, I changed location too, working from the public library
<nerochiaro> coworking here
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, for some reason after flashing the latest image I was hit by the no-keyboard bug, I just flashed again with -b, Iâll run your tests now
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: thanks
<ogra_> stgraber, can we please bump the goldfish image to have the same version number as the rest of the images ? after all we want to use it for doing tests so we need to know the version
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, your tests assume that there is at least one image in the gallery, they will fail if there isnât any
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: good point, but that's what the gallery tests seem to do. i'll have another look to make sure that doesn't happen. but it's not the issue i was mentioning yesterday
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, yeah, I know, but IÂ thought Iâd mention it as I just bumped into it, just so you donât forget
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: thanks, it's a good point
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, here the test is failing on self.wait_app_focused("gallery-app")
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: make sure you are running unit8 with testability
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, how do I do that?
<davmor2> Morning all
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: hold on, looking for it
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: python -c "from unity8 import process_helpers as p; p.restart_unity_with_testability()"
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, thanks
<mpt> charles, the design spec was actually internally inconsistent: events tomorrow were "Tomorrow" if they were all-day, but not if they were specific-time. Anyway, fixed now. <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeAndDate?action=diff&rev2=84&rev1=83>
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, ok, now I can reproduce the failure youâre seeing
<oSoMoN> looking at the code to try and understand whatâs going on
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: run the test, when the gallery shows up in picker mode the test should select the first media in the list by clicking on it. but it does not
<trojanvirus> hello
<trojanvirus> is anyone here
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: what happens is: i serve from the local http server a page where you have an input form and an href covering the entire page. clicking on the link will trigger a click on the file selection button in the form. this will trigger the browser to instantiate a ContentPickerDialog, which i turn will immediately ask the content hub to show a picker for images, which is the gallery.
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: and in the gallery i want to select the first media there is, then click the "pick" button
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: and verify that the selected media has been passed to the browser
<trojanvirus> ubuntu touch devolpers ?
<popey> !ask | trojanvirus
<ubot5> trojanvirus: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) See also !patience
<trojanvirus> ok
<trojanvirus> having problem flashing ubuntu touch zip in recovery
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: makes sense ?
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, it does, now all thatâs left is to understand why the selection doesnât work
<nhaines> trojanvirus: now you'll mention which device you have and what command line you're using to flash, and any error messages you receive.
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: yes. i'm quite stuck on that. unrelated: was the change in notes-app committed to make tests more robust by selecting a differnet port if the previous one was stuck
<nerochiaro> ?
<trojanvirus> htc droid dna
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, nope, autolanding repeatedly failed due to tests/infrastructure flakiness: https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/notes-app/robust-test-server/+merge/196174
<oSoMoN> nerochiaro, let me try to top-approve again
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: ah, thanks
<nerochiaro> oSoMoN: i had some notes tests still failing and it seems due to that
<popey> trojanvirus: thats not listed at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<popey> oh, work in progress...
<nhaines> popey: actually, it looks to be.  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices/dlx
<popey> yeah, used wrong search term..
<nhaines> So the real question is: did trojanvirus follow the instructions?  http://people.canonical.com/~rsalveti/dna/dna.txt
<trojanvirus> ylol
<trojanvirus> yes
<nhaines> trojanvirus: this is a lot better, so far, than most people get.  Okay, what error messages do you recieve?
<trojanvirus> i have tryed 2 ways , one was download the parts make my own zip install and 2 was flash each one in recovery
<nhaines> That doesn't really sound like the instructions, which say to flash boot.img and system.img in fastboot, and then sideload the base system in recovery.
<trojanvirus> just in recovery it says install complete please reboot , goto reboot no os is installed
<trojanvirus> i have root and s-off
<nhaines> rsalveti: any ideas?  ^^
<trojanvirus> i
<trojanvirus> wish i had a idea
<trojanvirus> sideload recovery
<nhaines> trojanvirus: unfortunately I dont' have any further suggestions other than to make sure to follow the directions perfectly.  On the other hand, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Emulator always exists....
<ogra_> mterry, soo ... trying your patch on grouper i dont get a session
<mterry> ogra_, I hate grouper
<ogra_> heh
<ogra_> well, tablets are the focus this cycle
 * ogra_ tries another reboot 
<mterry> ogra_, remind me if grouper is supposed to be Mir or SF?
<ogra_> its all Mir now
<ogra_> all nexus devices we support ...
<mterry> ogra_, OK.  I'm in London right now, can borrow a working grouper
<mterry> ogra_, nexus10 was SF I thought?
<ogra_> i suspected that :)
<ogra_> N10 is Mir since today
<mterry> ogra_, oh well. pfft
<ogra_> N7 was Mir since saucy released
<ogra_> (though extremely broken back then)
<mterry> ogra_, my N7 hasn't been working for about that long
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> it started to work with Mir 0.1.2
<mterry> ogra_, where can I see manifest files for latest trusty-proposed touch images?
<ogra_> last week or so ...
 * mterry just wants to see if lightdm made it into an image yet
<ogra_> manifest files themselves are in the respective dirs on http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-touch/daily-preinstalled/
<ogra_> manifest diffs are in http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/touch-image-stats/
<ogra_> and the assignment "cdimage build -> system-image ID" is in http://system-image.ubuntu.com/trusty-proposed/mako/index.json
<ogra_> so i dont see unity8 starting ...
<ogra_> not in ps ...
<mterry> ogra_, OK.  I wasn't sure if the daily-preinstalled was the right place, I thought we made more images a day than are there
<ogra_> i wish we could
<ogra_> but the test run takes 8h
<ogra_> so we need to wait for that long
<mterry> ogra_, do you see unity-system-compositor in ps?
<ogra_> yep
<mterry> ogra_, OK, that's promising...  so I'm guessing unity8 crashed?  the upstart log for it might have clues
<ogra_> not for the last three botts
<ogra_> __pthread_gettid -2
<ogra_> __pthread_gettid -2
<ogra_> __pthread_gettid -2
<ogra_> *boots
<ogra_> hmm
<ogra_> maliit-server.log looks intresting
<ogra_> FATAL: QUbuntu: Could not create application instance
<ogra_> about one per second ...
 * ogra_ does an OTA upgrade of his maguro to test there 
<dholbach> achiang, do you think the wiki.u.c/Nexus7 pages can go?
<ogra_> mterry, hmm, how is unity-system-compositor supposed to know how to run ubuntu-touch-session actually ?
<ogra_> it seems you removed all references to it
<mterry> ogra_, lightdm runs u-t-s.  So lightdm tries to launch u-s-c
<mterry> ogra_, if u-s-c (really our usc-wrapper script) fails, it falls back to SF
<mterry> ogra_, regardless, lightdm then runs u-t-s as the user session
<ogra_> hmmm, i thought your last hack made it use ubuntu-touch-surfaceflinger.desktop ... whcih you remove
<mterry> ogra_, yup, it's removed in favor of proper fallback support I added in lightdm.  So you see the seat=unity;surfaceflinger field in 52-ubuntu-touch.conf?
<mterry> ogra_, that says that if the unity seat fails (i.e. if u-s-c fails), try surfaceflinger
<mterry> ogra_, and the ubuntu-touch session can work in SF mode too
<ogra_> ah, k
<mterry> ogra_, still working on getting this borrowed device flashed and all
<ogra_> yeah, it takes a few centuries
 * ogra_ just had that fun for 2h
<mterry> :(
<ogra_> lets see what maguro thinks meanwhile ...
<mterry> It used to be a lot of work to test this, like 5 packages needed to be rebuilt from branches, so we really have it easy...
 * ogra_ reboots with the packages change
<ogra_> d
<ogra_> yeah
<mterry> :)
<mterry> ogra_, now maguro is also Mir-ified now?
<ogra_> since ages
<ogra_> before saucy released
 * mterry is slow to update his mental model
<ogra_> hmm, nothing on screen yet
<dholbach> barry, can I do anything else to help with https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-system-image/+bug/1256229?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1256229 in Ubuntu system image ""system-image-cli -i" reports old version" [Undecided,New]
<mterry> ogra_, you're making me worried that something broke since yesterday
<ogra_> well, i wonder if i did anything wrong when building the package
<mterry> ogra_, just a straight debuild and install should work
<ogra_> right, thats what i did
<ogra_> bzr merge in a dedicated branch ... and dpkg-buildpackage ...
<mterry> ogra_, it specifies that it needs latest lightdm, so I'm sure you got that
<ogra_> yep
<ogra_> i'm using the image from this morning
<mterry> you would have had to install unity-system-compositor, but again, that's required
<ogra_> http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/touch-image-stats/20131203.1.changes
<ogra_> latest lightdm is in
<ogra_> right, i apt-get installed it before dpkg'ing the new session package
<mterry> ogra_, maybe, just maybe, you are hitting a problem with nested Mir that kdub is looking at.  I didn't hit it in my nested testing, but I did hit it when testing my split branch.  And I wasn't sure why it would have changed.  So maybe it appears sometimes in normal nested mode too
<ogra_> well, what i can see is that unity8 starts ... and then vanishes after a while from the processlist
<ogra_> there is a crash file in /var/crash but that has an ancient timestamp
<mterry> ogra_, probably is restarted several times and then upstart gives up.  That would be consistent with that new nested erro
<ogra_> OH; AH !
<ogra_> __pthread_gettid -2
<ogra_> terminate called after throwing an instance of 'boost::exception_detail::clone_impl<boost::exception_detail::error_info_injector<std::runtime_error> >'
<ogra_>   what():  display factory cannot create fb display
<mterry> But I don't know why it doesn't show up on nexus4 or 10
<ogra_> some more info :)
<mterry> ogra_, that's in unity8.log ?
<ogra_> that boost message usually appears if unity cant connect to the mir socket
<ogra_> yeah
<mterry> ogra_, do you have /tmp/mir_socket?
<ogra_> yes
<ogra_> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# sudo -u phablet -i
<ogra_> initctl: unable to determine sessions
<ogra_> wow
<mterry> huh
 * ogra_ reboots ... thats not right 
 * ogra_ doesnt get it 
<ogra_> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# ls /run/user/
<ogra_> root@ubuntu-phablet:/#
<ogra_> funnily:
<ogra_> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# ps ax|grep user|grep init
<ogra_>  1324 ?        S      0:01 init --user
<mterry> ogra_, that's.  not good?
<ogra_> no, thats not good
<ogra_> there should be a lot of stuff in /run/user
<ogra_> including the mir socket the apps use iirc
<raghu_> hello
<raghu_> any body der?
<raghu_> Please tell if any body know when is ubuntu going to be launched on phones(not nexus 5...I mean common phones)?
<ogra_> nobody can tell
<mterry> raghu_, no word yet
<raghu_> why are they keeping its profile low?
<ogra_> once canonical has a contract with a manufacturer
<ogra_> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# ls /run/user/32011/
<ogra_> dconf       pulse    upstart-dbus-bridge.1526.pid
<ogra_> mir_socket  upstart  upstart-file-bridge.1526.pid
<ogra_> mterry, ^^^
<ogra_> i fear $MIR_SOCKET is not used everywhere yet
<raghu_> ubuntu touch is soon going to rock putting aside android,ios,w8 aside
<ogra_> so unity and apps try to attch to the one in /run/user
<mterry> ogra_, how do you mean?
<raghu_> but they dont know how to market it
<mterry> ogra_, no, that's good
<ogra_> mterry, the above is from a working mako installl without your changes
<mterry> ogra_, the one in /run/user is owned by unity8, the one in /tmp is owned by usc
<ogra_> oh
<mterry> ogra_, with my changes, both should exist and be used by different apps
<mterry>  /tmp by unity8, /run/user by actual apps
<ogra_> did you test on maguro before ?
<mterry> ogra_, no, don't have one
<mterry> ogra_, only N4 and N10
<mterry> so...  mako and manta
<ogra_> i really dont want to sacrifice my daily phone (my mako only runs stable images and has a ton of data)
<mterry> ogra_, yeah, don't do that
<mterry> ogra_, presumably I'm about to reproduce the issue you see on grouper
<ogra_> well, i'd like to see it working once :)
<mterry> ogra_, and then I can work on it from my end
<ogra_> ok
<mterry> ogra_, it's really anti-climactic  :)
<ogra_> heh
<mterry> afk, gone forever to die from pizza overdose
<ogra_> lol
<mterry> guh, nothing is worse than being wrong about the pizza being here
<mterry> ogra_, hmm, OK.  Can reproduce a problem on grouper.  user upstart is running, but no unity8 even tried to start...  or at least, no unity8.log created, which I'm assuming is the same thing?
<ogra_> well, i get the log hre
<ogra_> and one "__pthread_gettid -2" for each start attempt
<mterry> ogra_, that makes sense...
<ogra_> well, apart from the fact that it doesnt print anything else nor does produce a crash file, yeah
<ogra_> i dont really get why /run/user is completely empty
<mterry> Yeah, that is odd.  I'm not seeing that for example
<mterry> on grouper
<mterry> ogra_, you're seeing that on maguro?
<ogra_> yes
 * ogra_ reinstalls ubuntu-touch-session from the archive 
<mterry> why are there always device differences  :(
<ogra_> there shouldnt be
<ogra_> not on upstart level at least
<mterry> ogra_, well, I dunno about /run/user, but unity8 crashing could be Mir+device problems
<ogra_> indeed
<ogra_> but here it looks like the whole upstart setup is broken
<ogra_> i see an "init --user" ... but no /run entries for it
<mterry> ogra_, for sanity, I'm loading today's image on my mako
<ogra_> sigh, and if apport wouldnt pump my load to >10 the device would actually be usable :P
<pitti> "apport: pwning your CPU since 2006!"
<ogra_> pitti, we didnt do underpowered phones in 2006
<pitti> ogra_: (sudo stop apport)
<pitti> ogra_: wasn't me who argued for leaving it on in releases and/or phones :)
<pitti> I know it's super-heavy
<janimo> ogra_, the desktops back then were similar to today's phones though
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> mterry, so re-installing the package from the archive makes everything happy ... /run/user has the expected content etc
 * mterry grumbles
<ogra_> seems we somehow break the upstart session by whatever
<mterry> ogra_, but only on maguro?
<mterry> like, grouper's init wasn't broken as I recall
<ogra_> right, i see /run/user/32011 on grouper
<ogra_> even whith no unity8
 * ogra_ rebuilds the package and tries again on grouper
<ogra_> nope, no go
<mterry> ogra_, OK, just confirmed it works on mako.  So I'm not totally crazy
 * mterry doesn't like how each device breaks in a new way
<mterry> Especially since manta worked
<mterry> Though I tested manta in SF mode
<ogra_> well, i suspect on maguro something dies before it creates /run/user/$UID
<ogra_> most likely due to  breakage with the graphics driver
<ogra_> erm
<mterry> Yeah, I just thought /run/user was created pretty early in sequence.  Like by lightdm/pam
<ogra_> unity-system-compositor --file /tmp/mir_socket --from-dm-fd 8 --to-dm-fd 11 --vt 7
<ogra_> whats that last arg there
<ogra_> we surely dont have a vt7 on phones
<mterry> ogra_, that's expected.  I don't remember exactly how it's used, but usc fakes a VT
<ogra_> (some do, but thats an exception)
<mterry> ogra_, some Mir / X convenience thing
<ogra_> ok
<ogra_> hmm
<ogra_> /usr/share/upstart/sessions/unity8.conf:        MIR_SERVER_FILE=$XDG_RUNTIME_DIR/mir_socket
<ogra_> XDG_RUNTIME_DIR indeed points to /run/user/$UID usually
<ogra_> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# sudo -u phablet -i
<ogra_> initctl: unable to determine sessions
<ogra_> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ env|grep RUNTIME
<ogra_> XDG_RUNTIME_DIR=/run/user/32011
<ogra_> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$
<ogra_> ... which doesnt exist
<mterry> ogra_, so looks good except for it not existing
<ogra_> right
<mterry> ogra_, it looks like on grouper, maliit-server is crashing, but not unity8.  I disabled maliit-server and still have the same problem.  But unity8 isn't leaving a core file, so presumably isn't crashing
<ogra_> i dont get any core files on grouper
<mterry> ogra_, huh, I got one for maliit
<ogra_> i wiped /var/crash before trying with the new package ... no files at all
<achiang> dholbach: re: nexus7 wiki pages, define "go"?
<achiang> dholbach: complete deletion? archive?
<mterry> ogra_, this is weird.  it doesn't crash.  It doesn't exit that I can tell.  But I don't see unity8 in the process.  (using echos in upstart job)
<ogra_> yeah
<mterry> ogra_, the unity8 line is run, but I have no idea what's happening after that
 * ogra_ hacks some "mkdir $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR" into the unity8 job 
<ogra_> hmm, i see two lightdms runnign here
<ogra_> should i ?
<dholbach> achiang, I have no opinion on it yet - I just stumbled over them and wasn't sure if they are still used
<achiang> dholbach: i doubt they are currently useful, my only thought is whether they are historically interesting or not
<ogra_> well, didnt we release that image with precise ?
<ogra_> or was that later
<achiang> i think it was later
<ogra_> k
<ogra_> jodh, xnox ... i fear we need some upstart experts ...
<ogra_> i have a user session running, init --user is actually in the processlist ...
<ogra_> but /run/user is completely empty
<ogra_> (and i get no initctrl info as the phablet user indeed)
<mterry> ogra_, multiple lightdms is normal, as long as they have different arguments
<mterry> ogra_, like --session-child or whateve
<ogra_> nope
<lops> Good morning. Any one knows how I can use a c++ main instead of a qml main? If i try to change the qmlproject, it just assumes my main.cpp is qml code!
<ogra_> ps just shows "lightdm"
<mterry> ogra_, you have two "lightdm" processes?  That's broken
<ogra_> oh, wait
<dholbach> achiang, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Nexus7/Header?action=diff&rev2=7&rev1=5 for now?
<xnox> ogra_: is XDG_RUNTIME_DIR set in the environment?
<ogra_> mterry, no, i'm wrong, one is --session
<mterry> ogra_, phew
<ogra_> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# sudo -u phablet -i
<ogra_> initctl: unable to determine sessions
<ogra_> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ env|grep RUNTIME
<ogra_> XDG_RUNTIME_DIR=/run/user/32011
<ogra_> xnox, ^^^
<ogra_> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ ls /run/user/
<ogra_> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$
<ogra_> whatever is supposed to create that dir doesnt do it ...
<xnox> ogra_: pastebin /proc/self/mountinfo to check if something is mounted over the top of it.
<rsalveti> yeah, in theory it should be a tmpfs
<xnox> ogra_: pam_systemd component of logind from systemd software collection suppose to create it.
<xnox> (unless it's different on touch, i don't think it is, unless lightdm does it?)
<ogra_> 39 18 0:25 / /run/user rw,nosuid,nodev,noexec,relatime - tmpfs none rw,size=102400k,mode=755
<ogra_> all fine
<ogra_> and i can manually create files in there etc
<ogra_> i dont think lightdm *should* create it ... but there were some recent changes to it, probably mterry knows
<mterry> ogra_, I think lightdm creates it via driving pam
<ogra_> hmm, so it works around logind then ?
<ogra_> i would expect it to use the exact same process on desktop and touch nowadays
<mterry> ogra_, no, I don't think so.  logind's pam_systemd is a pam module right?
<mterry> ogra_, it should yes
<ogra_> right
<mterry> ogra_, right, so lightdm doesn't create it itself, but it drives pam, which creates it
<ogra_> and logind operates based on the Seat info, right ?
<ogra_> which we create in lightdm
<mterry> ogra_, maybe yeah.  I'm not 100% on how they interact
<mterry> ogra_, but that sounds right
<achiang> dholbach: +1
<mterry> ogra_, btw, for my grouper problems, I'm getting a debug version of unity8 and introducing a sleep to catch it in gdb
<Ursinha> ogra_, I'm using r42 and the update screen/system seems more buggy than before
<ogra_> wrked fine for me on maguro
<rsalveti> Ursinha: update screen?
<rsalveti> for the system-image updates?
<Ursinha> rsalveti, "About this phone"
<ogra_> ah, i always go to "Updates"
 * ogra_ has actually never tried it from the about dislog 
<ogra_> *dia
<davmor2> ogra_: just admit it you were trying to be hip wid da youff with your dislog "It's dislog not datlog" :D
<ogra_> lol
<rsalveti> Ursinha: what is the issue?
 * ogra_ guesses system-image issues are moot until 2.0 is finally in 
<ogra_> which is stuck since weeks with a buildd issue
<rsalveti> ogra_: right
<Ursinha> ogra_, right, that was I was expecting to hear :)
<Ursinha> so I'll reboot and ignore them for now
<mhall119> mterry: which mir documentation?
<rsalveti> Ursinha: but what is the issue?
<ogra_> rsalveti, "doesn't work"
<ogra_> :P
<rsalveti> oh, that's a simple one
<mterry> mhall119, http://unity.ubuntu.com/mir/using_mir_on_pc.html
<mterry> mhall119, I thought you were involved in setting that up?
<mhall119> mterry: I don't think that was ever automatic
<Ursinha> rsalveti, it says last update was 1969-12-31, it doesn't show the version of the current image being downloaded, the download doesn't progress, it doesn't display the size of the image being downloaded
<Ursinha> yeah, you can summarize as "doesn't work" and that would be accurate
<mterry> mhall119, ah, that would explain that.  The mir folks seemed under the impression that it was
<mterry> mhall119, could it be resync'd easily?
<rsalveti> Ursinha: right :-)
<mhall119> mterry: let me see if I can find out how it was setup
<ogra_> mterry, http://paste.ubuntu.com/6514776/ btw ...
<mterry> ogra_, expected, known race condition that doesn't happen to affect anything
<mterry> thanks though!  :)
<mhall119> mterry: I'm not finding anything to indicate that I set this one up...
<mhall119> I did something similar for autopilot and nux, but I don't think I did for mir
<mterry> mhall119, huh, your name came up, which is why I bugged you about it.  I wonder who did
<jau_> hi
<jau_> ls
<jau_> let me know samsung S duos support ubuntu os
<mhall119> mterry: ah ha! it was thomi
<mhall119> mterry: https://rt.admin.canonical.com/Ticket/Display.html?id=59901
<mterry> mhall119, aha
<mhall119> and it sounds like maybe it was being auto-updated
<mhall119> anyway, that should be enough for you to ask IS to check why it isn't anymore
<mterry> mhall119, interesting.  But I still be against saucy
<mterry> mhall119, OK, thanks
<mhall119> np
<jau_> hello
<mhall119> hi jau_
<barry> dholbach: i know how to fix s-i 2.0's ftbfs, so i should get a new version uploaded fairly soon.  i think the best thing to do is re-test with that version, so probably pull it from -proposed once it's built there.
<dholbach> barry, ok, my grouper is on -proposed, so I'm happy to test it when it arrives
<barry> dholbach: i'll ping you when it's uploaded
 * dholbach hugs barry
<ogra_> urgh
<ogra_> root@ubuntu-phablet:/# ls -l /run/|grep user
<ogra_> drwxr-xr-x 2 root       root         40 Dec  3 15:58 user
<ogra_> hmm, no, thats correct
<ogra_> mterry, so ... adding a hack withe the following to the wrappe gets me at least a working upstart session
<ogra_> mkdir /run/user/32011
<ogra_> chown phablet.phablet /run/user/32011
<ogra_> chmod 0700 /run/user/32011
<ogra_> (in /usr/share/ubuntu-touch-session/usc-wrapper)
<ogra_> mterry, in that session i see mediascanner respawn madly ... as well as maliit-server
<mterry> ogra_, :-/
<ogra_> but with that setup i reliably get an error in unity8.log
<ogra_> __pthread_gettid -2
<ogra_> terminate called after throwing an instance of 'boost::exception_detail::clone_impl<boost::exception_detail::error_info_injector<std::runtime_error> >'
<ogra_>   what():  display factory cannot create fb display
<ogra_> where should the session mir socket live ? i assume it doesnt use the same socket for system and session ?
<mterry> ogra_, see /usr/share/upstart/session/unity8.conf for where we set that up, but it's $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR/mir_socket
<mterry> ogra_, same as it used to be
<ogra_> right, i dont see one there
<ogra_> mterry, lol
<ogra_> ioctl(9, BT819_FIFO_RESET_HIGH, 0xbe880090) = 0
<ogra_> ioctl(9, BT819_FIFO_RESET_HIGH, 0xbe880090) = 0
<ogra_> writev(4, [{"\4", 1}, {"ServiceManager\0", 15}, {"Waiting for service SurfaceFling"..., 39}], 3) = 55
<ogra_> nanosleep({1, 0}, ^CProcess 3058 detached
<ogra_>  <detached ...>
<ogra_> ^^^ strace unity8
<ogra_> so it tries to start SF for whatever reason
<ogra_> thats why i never see a mir socket
<ogra_> (it loops with that message)
<tsdgeos> Kaleo: what's missing for https://code.launchpad.net/~fboucault/qtubuntu/dpr_rebase_qt_5.1/+merge/183500 and https://code.launchpad.net/~fboucault/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/dpr_rebase_qt_5.1/+merge/183762 ?
<mterry> ogra_, odd...  so we must be using the wrong QPA_PLUGIN in that case
<mterry> ogra_, which means unity-system-compositor should have returned an error to lightdm...  but we see u-s-c up
<ogra_> so i would guess we unset/set it wrong later
<mterry> ogra_, but on grouper, we are going down mir path.  I got that far with gdb
<ogra_> mterry, btw, i dont think it is a good idea to source /etc/environment if you just want ANDROID_ROOT=/system set ... there is a lot of unmanaged crap in that file we need to clean up
<ogra_> (like mangling LD_LIBRARY_PATH )
<ogra_> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ env |grep QPA
<ogra_> QT_QPA_PLATFORM=ubuntu
<ogra_> mterry, i think MIR_SOCKET isnt set, where does it get exported ?
<bfiller> xnox: we need some help with libpinyin to fix this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-keyboard/+bug/1255999. Would you be able to help?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1255999 in ubuntu-keyboard (Ubuntu) "[regression] if switched to non english local, the keyboard does not come up when an input field is focused" [High,Confirmed]
<bfiller> xnox: needs fix backported from libpinyin 0.94 or latest libpinyin pulled into archive
<xnox> bfiller: ? hm.
<mterry> ogra_, it gets set by LightDM
<ogra_> hmm
<mterry> when using the unity seat
<ogra_> ok
<ogra_> ioctl(14, 0xc01c6730, 0xbe9c008c)       = 0
<ogra_> writev(15, [{"\6", 1}, {"IMGSRV\0", 7}, {":0: PVRSRVCreateDCSwapChain: Err"..., 50}], 3) = 58
<ogra_> writev(15, [{"\6", 1}, {"IMGSRV\0", 7}, {":0: framebuffer_device_open: Fai"..., 68}], 3) = 76
<ogra_> nanosleep({1, 0}, 0xbe9c0158)
<ogra_> thats what i get when stracing unity8 after exporting the right QT_QPA stuff
<Kaleo> tsdgeos, lots of small things
<Kaleo> tsdgeos, and it's hard to test with other unstable things
<Kaleo> tsdgeos, on the phone
<cwayne_> t1mp, hey, was that tab bar being blanked bug ever looked at?
<Kaleo> tsdgeos, so I have patched the xcb backend to make some of the testing easier
<bfiller> xnox: not sure if you're the right person but was hoping you were as you did the MR for ubuntu-keyboard to use libpinyin4
<xnox> bfiller: i'm not the right person. But do you know which commit fixes it from upstream libpinyin?
<xnox> bfiller: at the moment libpinyin is in sync with debian, i'd rather cherrypick a patch from libpinyin upstream into libpinyin to resolve the issue.
<bfiller> xnox: https://github.com/libpinyin/libpinyin/commit/8abc8cfd97cfe63c8e26e0838d4c825283b30630 (this is also in the bug report)
<t1mp> cwayne_: sec, let me see
<alexk42> hi
<xnox> bfiller: thanks. ah, missed =)
<peenutz12> ok so i just installed touch on my nexus 4 and got what i belive aresome one elses contacts any one elswe?
<t1mp> cwayne_: no, not yet. Until this week I was working on 'critical' bugs. Now I finally have time for the "high" bugs here https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bugs?search=Search&field.assignee=tpeeters
<alexk42> hey xnox--having some trouble getting a startup script to work? I see it listed when I do /sbin/initctl list but it always has a status of stop/waiting and doesn't seem to be executed.
<alexk42> any thoughts on what could be going wrong?
<t1mp> cwayne_: so it is scheduled soon. It is easier for me if you add code there that I can simply copy&paste to reproduce the bug
<cwayne_> t1mp, ah, awesome thanks.  Sorry to bother you, I'd thought i'd read something about it in the landing plan, must've been some other tabbar bug :)
<xnox> bfiller: right, i'll upload that in a second.
<cwayne_> t1mp, it's literally just making a tabbed ui from qtcreator
<bfiller> xnox: that's great, thank you :)
<xnox>  bfiller a request from my side is for ubuntu-keyboard to work on normal amd64 machines =) such that I could use my ubuntu-keyboard on my touchscreen laptop
<xnox> =)))))
<xnox> maybe that will fix it ;-)
<peenutz12> has this happened to any one else? got some one elses contacts in their build  my phone thinks im in london  and im some one named lola any thoughts?
<peenutz12> is the time and date settings on the system implemented yet?
<t1mp> cwayne_: ok. It is in my list of bugs I want to fix this month
<cwayne_> peenutz12, sounds like you're runniing a really old image, how did you install?
<peenutz12> i used the cwm  method
<peenutz12> now im screwed no usb media lol my life sux
<peenutz12> were do i find the newst build i can flash in to my phone?
<lops> hey guys. I made a cpp app but i can't seem to install it on my nexus. I'm getting "dh_make: command not found"
<elfangor> Hi, is enable the writable_image still supported?
<lops> QML apps worked fine tough...
<t1mp> elfangor: works for me. but you have to reboot after touch /userdata/.writable_image
<elfangor> t1mp: ok and you have no problem with apt-get update & upgrade?
<t1mp> elfangor: apt-get install and dpkg -i worked for me. I haven't tried update/upgrade for a while because I get the latest image frequently using phablet-flash
<elfangor> t1mp: i keep earing about that, but is there a way to update your version without losing data? Like message and contacts for example?
<t1mp> elfangor: I think it keeps your data, but I'm not really paying attention to that, I use the phone mainly for running tests
<t1mp> elfangor: there must be some people here who can tell you for sure
<elfangor> t1mp: ok :) Thanks for all the information was really helpfull: i just put my image writable
<lops> Should CTRL+F12 be working in Qt Creator for running cpp apps?
<randomcpp> lops, you have to compile the c++ plugin on armhf
<randomcpp> then you can create a click pkg and send it to your device
<randomcpp> I've made 2 two script that do everything automatically (not published yet, I need to polish them and correct some hardcoded strings..)
<randomcpp> scripts*
<lops> ;_; what did I get myself into
<randomcpp> lol
<randomcpp> they are pretty simple trust me
<lops> i was given a choice of doing this assignment on any  mobile platform. iOS and WP both demand I install their respective OSs..
<lops> I though UT was going to be all fun, sweets and joy
<randomcpp> it's better than working with java and android apps
<ogra_> it is !!!
<randomcpp> at least ut apps don't melt my pc everytime I try them :p
<ogra_> it is so much fun sweets and joy that you go into a constant hangover after a while :)
<lops> it was a shock coming from android TBH.
<lops> android is easy... after a month of learning what goes where
<lops> in contrast, UT gives you way too much freedom and it's easy to get lost. also, not a lot of oficial documentation
<ogra_> well, did you work with android 1.0 ?
<lops> XD no
<lops> you've got a point
<ogra_> see :) ... if you want to compare apples with apples you have to look at android 1.0 vs UT 1.0 ;)
<ogra_> whee !
<ogra_> congrats barry
 * ogra_ sees system-image 2.0 on trusty-changes
<barry> ogra_: \o/
<lops> at least UT is gorgeous. can't wait to see it mature
<randomcpp> what's new? :p
<lops> i can't be the only one that's sick of the monochrome trend
<randomcpp> lops, don't forget to install saucybacon even if you don't cook anything :p
<lops> randomcpp, as soon as i figure out how to install my own app.
<randomcpp> have you created the .click ?
<lops> no
<randomcpp> ok, are you using the c++ extension + tabbed qml template?
<lops> randomcpp, i'm using the default c++ template and then copied my tabbed qml app into it. is that the same?
<randomcpp> almost, do you use qt resources to import the qml files?
<lops> i'm not sure.. i only have qml and cpp code. cpp loads the qml mail
<lops> the rest in defined in the .pro i guess
<randomcpp> how does c++ load qml?
<randomcpp> with a relative url or something like qrc:/.. or :/..
<lops> setMainQmlFile(QStringLiteral("qml/main.qml"));
<randomcpp> ok relative path :D
<randomcpp> then create a directory and put the executable and all qml files
<lops> hah. sorry. please bear with me.
<randomcpp> something like this
<randomcpp> <directory>:
<randomcpp>      <executable>
<randomcpp>        qml/mail.qml (and other qmls)
<randomcpp>       manifest.json
<mterry> tsdgeos, updated
<randomcpp>         <appname>.json
<randomcpp>        <appname>.desktop
<randomcpp> wrong indentation but I think you got the point
<tsdgeos> mterry: okidoki
<lops> manifest and appname are inside executable?
<randomcpp> (the executable must be compiled on armhf if you want it to run on the phone)
<lops> nvm what i just said
<randomcpp> lops http://paste.ubuntu.com/6515430/
<randomcpp> http://notyetthere.org/on-manually-creating-click-packages/#comment-3637
<randomcpp> read this comment if you don't know how to compile on armhf with your pc
<lops> thank you
<randomcpp> np
<randomcpp> if you need more help ask me
<mhall119> fginther: ping
<fginther> mhall119, pong
<mhall119> fginther: hey, are you familiar with the CI setup for the SDK?
<fginther> mhall119, yes
<mhall119> fginther: I'm working on how to let it auto-update the API docs on developer.ubuntu.com
<fginther> mhall119, ahh, not that part, I was thinking of the ubuntu-ui-toolkit
<mhall119> would it be secure if I provided an auth token and script to some part of that process?
<mhall119> fginther: yeah, that's what I need
<fginther> mhall119, we already have projects that update to read-the-docs on a merge
<mhall119> so when ubuntu-ui-toolkit builds a new version, I want it to run a script that updates developer.ubuntu.com, but I need to have it authorized so that it's not abused by somebody else
<mhall119> fginther: right, we'll need to update developer.ubuntu.com/api/ now too
<fginther> mhall119, this should be possible
<fginther> mhall119, Can we pick this up in about an hour?
<mhall119> really my question is whether or not an auth token can be kept secret in the CI process, or would it be visible to too many people
<mhall119> fginther: sure
<mhall119> fginther: just ping me when you're available
<lops> randomcpp, u around? :/ any tips on compiling the app? i'm all set but i don't know how to use g++ beyond basic compilation.
<lops> I tried to teach Qt Creator to use g++ for arm, to no avail
<randomcpp> lops, have you created the armhf trusty/saucy chroot?
<lops> aye.
<randomcpp> ok copy your project somewhere in the chroot
<lops> did it
<randomcpp> maybe under <path to chroot>/home/user
<randomcpp> does your project qmake?
<randomcpp> have you installed ubuntu-sdk in the chroot env.?
<randomcpp> does your project use qmake? **
<lops> ohh. no. ofc he wouldn't find anything qt
<lops> no, i didn't write any make
<randomcpp> then if it uses qmake, just go in the project directory and run 'qmake && make' IIRC
<randomcpp> and you should have your program compiled
<randomcpp> then just copy the executable in the directory as I explained some hours ago :)
<lops> ok. i'll need to install the sdk again though. that should take a while
<lops> can't i copy the sdk to the chroot btw?
<randomcpp> lops, of course you can't
<lops> i excepcted that xD
<randomcpp> the sdk is compiled for x86 (32 or 64 bit)
<lops> yup
<randomcpp> you need armhf binaries
<lops> let us pray the campus connections is benelovant on this mere mortal
<randomcpp> lol
<randomcpp> lops, what are you studying? :)
<lops> IT. my degree is a bit generic. IT engineering
<lops> welp, my nexus left so I'll have to continue tomorrow. as soon as the sdk finishes installing -.-
<randomcpp> lops, ok I should be here tomorrow if you need more help :)
<fginther> mhall119, I'm back
<fginther> mhall119, we can keep the auth token in a file that only jenkins and those with sudo access (the ci team) can read
<Guest23924> hello all......is any version of ubuntu touch available for my huawei y300?
<davmor2> Guest23924: you can check https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices/ if there is nothing there you can look at  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Porting
<Guest23924> thanks....i hope that i find something......
<mhall119> fginther: perfect, thanks, I'll get started on implementing this and will pass you the script and token when it's ready
<fginther> mhall119, you're welcome.
<Guest23924> is more safe ubuntu touch comparing cm 10.2?
<xnox> what do you mean?
<mardy> kenvandine: while you are still there, this one should be quick to review: https://code.launchpad.net/~mardy/ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts/lp1257028/+merge/197472
<kenvandine> mardy, looking
<alexk42> what is the best way to start an app from the command line?
<alexk42> it's a click app
<alexk42> the click app works when tapped on the scrpit, but when I use upstart-app-launch it doesn't seem to start
<alexk42> err screen, not scrpit
<ChickenCutlass> sergiusens, what is the channel I want again.  trust-devel?
<ChickenCutlass> rsalveti, ^^^
<ChickenCutlass> for phablet-flash
<rsalveti> ChickenCutlass: trusty-proposed
<ChickenCutlass> right
<ChickenCutlass> ok thanks
<ChickenCutlass> rsalveti, love my fiber.  10MB/s
<ChickenCutlass> haha
<rsalveti> ChickenCutlass: lol
<ChickenCutlass> rsalveti, I just love downloading shit
<rsalveti> ChickenCutlass: haha, still ~3MB/s here
<ChickenCutlass> rsalveti, that's not bad at all
<rsalveti> yeah, "enough" :-)
<ChickenCutlass> rsalveti, can never be fast enough
<rsalveti> exactly :-)
<ChickenCutlass> rsalveti, the latest image is pretty good on the Nexus 10
<rsalveti> ChickenCutlass: guess it's already using mir by default
<rsalveti> check if you don't have sf running
<ChickenCutlass> sidestage is not great
<ChickenCutlass> rsalveti, I will
<rsalveti> yeah, mostly broken atm
<randomcpp> 3MB/s ? I have 400kb/s there D:
<lops> i only have wifi here, so quit comlaining -.- i'm lucky when I can download at 400k
<randomcpp> at university in some places I get 1mb/s, in others I can't even connect to the wifi sometimes and when I can I get 10~50kb/s
<randomcpp> and IRC doesn't work o.o
<randomcpp> why does battery-indicator show the battery half-full when it says it only has 4% left?
<eraserhd> How do I find the source for an app?
<eraserhd> For example, a core app, like friends-app
<randomcpp> eraserhd, https://launchpad.net/friends-app
<daker> eraserhd: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone-coreapps
<eraserhd> Just got there, I did the usual dumb thing where I ask a question just before I figure out the answer.
<eraserhd> But, thanks!
<lops> in univesity: wifi? downloads at 50KB/s. But if you're a cool kid and bring your own cable, speed is counted in MB
<alexk42> hi there
<alexk42> anyone know how to run a click application from the commandline?
<asomething> alexk42, generally it will be something like: qmlscene --desktop_file_hint=~/.local/share/applications/test.desktop yourfile.qml
<alexk42> uasc
<alexk42> I get an error message saying. qmlscene: could not find a Qt installation of ''
<asomething> on a device or on a desktop?
<alexk42> device
<alexk42> I am adb shelling in, switching to phablet, and then trying to execute it
<asomething> hmm... what does 'qtchooser -list-versions' output?
<pmcgowan> alexk42, how are you switching to phablet?
<alexk42> sudo -i -u phablet
<pmcgowan> ok
<alexk42> qtchooser gives me: qt5, 5, and qt5-arm-linux-gnueabihf
<alexk42> If I pick any of those using -qt=... I get 'QUbuntu: Could not create application instance'
<alexk42> exit
<pmcgowan> alexk42, do you have QT_SELECT set in your env?
<alexk42> no, that's not set
<alexk42> QT_SELECT that is
<pmcgowan> try setting to qt5
<pmcgowan> I cant remember the right way to do this off hand
<alexk42> same thing
<alexk42> can't create application instance
<pmcgowan> sergiusens, any ideas^^
<sergiusens> what device is this?
<alexk42> nexus 7 -- grouper
<sergiusens> mir or no mir?
<alexk42> not sure what mir is.. so i'm guess no?
<sergiusens> alexk42, does pgrep surfaceflinger return anything?
<alexk42> no, it doesn't
<sergiusens> alexk42, you have mir
<alexk42> ok
<sergiusens> pmcgowan, is mir on grouper supposed to be working fine?
<alexk42> I'm running trusty btw
<alexk42> mir
<sergiusens> alexk42, aside from trying to launch an app, have you fiddled with the system? As in enabled writable image or something like that?
<alexk42> it's a writeable image. I've actually been stripping down the environment
<alexk42> sounds like I hacked and slashed too much
<alexk42> I removed most of the core apps
<sergiusens> alexk42, ok; so you might have removed a Qt dep along the way
<alexk42> hmm
<sergiusens> alexk42, that or something related to the session
<alexk42> when I run the hello world application from the Ubuntu SDK on my desktop on the Nexus 7 it comes up fine
<sergiusens> alexk42, I think the sdk launches the app through ssh
<alexk42> yes, but isn't that what I'm essentially doing?
<alexk42> through the command line?
<alexk42> i believe it installed it locallly and executes it via SSH, right?
<sergiusens> alexk42, I don't know what you are doing
<alexk42> sadly, it seems neither do I...
<pmcgowan> alexk42, perhaps reflash and test again prior to making your changes to the image
<sergiusens> alexk42, if your desktop file and it is not a stub you can do "start application APP_ID=[desktopfile name without extension]
<alexk42> tried that as well, just got a white screen on the display
<alexk42> it looks like the process dies
<sergiusens> alexk42, you are entirely sure that the app works when launched from the SDK?
<alexk42> just did it
<sergiusens> alexk42, I don't use the sdk, so can you check if it's using ssh? are you doing adb shell or ssh?
<alexk42> I hit ctrl-f12 from the ubuntu sdk, it ssh'd into the device and it comes up fine on the tablet
<sergiusens> log in from adb and from ssh is different
<alexk42> you think it's not sourcing in the profile?
<sergiusens> alexk42, on the device, run ps -ef |grep qmlscene
<alexk42> when I'm using adb
<alexk42> I see it
<sergiusens> alexk42, how is it launched?
<alexk42> bash -ic source /etc/profile; export DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS=unix:abstract=/tmp/dbus-S92qOnx338; APP_ID=HwTabbed qmlscene /home/phablet/dev_tmp/HwTabbed/HwTabbed.qml --desktop_file_hint=/home/phablet/.local/share/applications/HwTabbed.desktop
<sergiusens> alexk42, so as the phablet user in your adb shell try that
<alexk42> doing that now...
<sergiusens> alexk42, and?
<alexk42> no luck
<alexk42> qmlscene: could not find a Qt installation of ''
<sergiusens> alexk42, how are you shelling in?
<sergiusens> exact steps please
<alexk42> adb shell
<alexk42> sudo -i -u phablet
<alexk42> that's it
<sergiusens> alexk42, can you pastebin the result of running 'env' ?
<alexk42> doing it now
<alexk42> pastebin isn't quite working--I'm getting no data received when I submit
<sergiusens> alexk42, use paste.ubuntu.com
<alexk42> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6516984/
<alexk42> just got it to work!
<alexk42> i had to ad the --qt=qt5 and it fired up
<sergiusens> alexk42, I thought you already tried QT_SELECT=qt5 (?)
<alexk42> I did
<alexk42> not sure what different in those two attempts
<alexk42> thanks for your help sergiusens>
<sergiusens> np; although I'm still not certain what was going on there
<franci> hi, what is the best way to access gps in ubuntu phone from qml?
#ubuntu-touch 2013-12-04
<airking> About to try installing for the first time, wish me luck!
<airking> Wow, adb backup takes quite a while
<airking> almost thought it was broken O.o
<airking> Doing the install now :3
<xnox> airking: btw, adb backup doesn't backup anything marked as "backup ignore" by android apps' xml manifest.
<xnox> airking: for example it doesn't backup Google Authenticator, on the other had titanium backup does backup _everything_
<airking> As long as it grabs pictures and the basics I'm fine
<airking> I'm at "Waiting for install to finish on device", any estimates on how long that takes?
<airking> I ran it under sudo
<airking> It's been like 3-4 minutes
<airking> xnox: How long should I be waiting at "INFO:phablet-flash:Waiting for install to finish on device. Please do not unplug device until phablet-flash finishes.
<airking> it's been like 20 min
<airking> wtf
<airking> I could really use some help here, kind of starting to freak out
<airking> anyone here?
<airking> Help! I got "
<airking> ERROR:phablet-flash:Installation is taking too long or an error occured along the way.
<airking> What do I do?
<airking> no
<airking> wait
<airking> weird
<airking> it worked...
<crocket> Will ubuntu tablets run X11 apps on its screens?
<crocket> Mir and XMir
<airking> So when I go to the messaging app, it says "Voicemmail" at the top
<airking> What is that?
<crocket> Will ubuntu phones and tablets run regular desktop applications on a monitor?
<crocket> those desktop ubuntu binaries?
<dholbach> good morning
<crocket> no one?
<mterry> ogra_, good news, I think I figured out the maguro lightdm issue
<mterry> ogra_, testing now
<ogra_> whee !!!
<mterry> ogra_, it's actually the same issue as we had back when we first enabled lightdm in saucy-touch with maguro.  It just has to be done in a new place in lightdm now that we're taking a different codepath (we need to support maguro's lack of proper VT support)
<mterry> ogra_, also, maguro is really slow!  :(
<ogra_> yeah, not a new issue :)
<ogra_> and yes, we need to support devices without proper VTs ... thats sadly actually the majority of devices out there .... we are just lucky with the nexus devices
<mterry> ogra_, yeah, shouldn't be a problem, just a one line fix to tell logind that we are on VT 0 if we don't have multi-seat-vt support
<mterry> ogra_, meanwhile, ricmm is kindly looking into the crash on grouper.  Which might be the same as the problem on maguro, I'll find out once I get past this lightdm thing
<ogra_> most likely
<ogra_> tegra is very odd regarding VTs
<ogra_> though it acvtually should at least have tty's enabled in the kernel
<mterry> ogra_, I dunno, every time I turn around, some problem is device-specific, I'm leery of saying anything is the same problem  :)
<AlienPenguin> hi all, i am experimenting with ubuntu-touvch on a nexus 4, can anyone point me how to access gps?
<AlienPenguin> is it possible?
<AlienPenguin> what is the device to be used?
<AlienPenguin> also, when screen goes black the ticks in the location checkboxes are cleared, is this normal?
<timppa> AlienPenguin: Have a look at http://qt.developpez.com/doc/5.0-snapshot/qmlmodule-qtlocation5-qtlocation-5/
<timppa> AlienPenguin: You can access GPS from QML, but getting a fix on GPS still takes a lot of time because it's not aGPS
<timppa> AlienPenguin: And please join #ubuntu-app-devel for additional questions.
<AlienPenguin> timppa, i tried importing QtLocation in a QML file but ubuntu-sdk gave me an error, however now i was experimenting directly on the system... do you know wat is the gps device?
<timppa> AlienPenguin: QML is a highlevel stuff, no need to access any specific devices
<AlienPenguin> timppa, i know but i have some apps that already do some lower level stuff and i would like to port them to ubuntu-touch without rewriting them in qml
<timppa> AlienPenguin: Sorry, I don't know, I've only used QML and js
<AlienPenguin> timppa, but did you access gps from qml? i tried importing QtLocation but the qtcreator bundled with the sdk gave me an error
<timppa> AlienPenguin: which error?
<timppa> AlienPenguin: Do you have QtDeclarative* installed?
<AlienPenguin> timppa, i have not installed any other package on the phone, i just flashed the image downloaded from ubuntu website
<timppa> AlienPenguin: Phone does not need any additional packages, but your Ubuntu desktop where you run the SDK
<AlienPenguin> timppa, i simply followed the instructions on the guide
<AlienPenguin> i will check as soon as i can access that system
<AlienPenguin> thanks for the insisght
<AlienPenguin> however i would stiil like to know if i can access GPS at low level :)
<davmor2> Morning all
<timppa> AlienPenguin: It's Linux, everything is possible :)
<AlienPenguin> timppa, sorry i misspelled, i meant "how" not "if" :)
<davmor2> timppa: sudo apt-get install coffee isn't working yet :P
 * ogra_ makes a note to call his next project coffee ...
 * davmor2 shakes fist at ogra_  and mutters some stuff under his breath about German's and accuracy and humour grrrrrrr ;)
 * ogra_ apt-get installs nicotine :P
<ogra_> i really wouldnt mind accompaning coffee in the archive ;)
<timppa> davmor2: isn't java enough? :p
<davmor2> timppa: enough to make me cry :D
<timppa> AlienPenguin: Sorry, cannot help you with that
<timppa> davmor2: :)
<AlienPenguin> does anyone know why the gps/location checkboxes "untick" themselves? every time i go back to the location menu they are unticked
<ogra_> AlienPenguin, a) the integration is not complete for the existing GPS service and b) see https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/client-1311-location-service-assisted-gps
<ogra_> i also doubt you will be able to access any low level stuff from an app due to the app confinement https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/Specifications/ApplicationConfinement
<AlienPenguin> ogra_, i am not looking for a complete agps system (yet :) ) i just want to know if it is working, what device can i access at low -level and, eventually, how to access it with qml/qt framework
<ogra_> it should be QtLocation afaik
<ogra_> (though i guess #ubuntu-app-devel is the better channel for this)
<crvilare> Hi everybody... are there any official papers for Ubuntu touch?
<crvilare> or some presentations from conferences?
<seb128> MacSlow, while you are doing notify-osd hacking, could you look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/notify-osd/+bug/1257717 ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1257717 in notify-osd (Ubuntu) "Invalid g_source_remove use" [Low,Confirmed]
<daker> crvilare: technical ?
<crvilare> daker: technical or research papers
<daker> crvilare: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1LjGf3IQGraQWxdjkIisI4McVi3GmfCTCDg-lLBUtzis/edit#slide=id.g16fe566e3_00
<crvilare> daker: thx... sent a request
<daker> crvilare: recheck now
<crvilare> daker: thx alot
<daker> crvilare: i do have one more doc but in French
<crvilare> daker: may I have access to it too?
<daker> crvilare: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/14GSiGWWjVI7n2o6p4B99UY8XqjSgjYGvSKiGYPURIBA/edit?usp=sharing
<crvilare> daker: Thank you very much
<daker> crvilare: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1Pq1q-vl0t-mcy-hFhl_c5GK-R_aV75kKA6OCW_AjDcA/edit#slide=id.p
<crvilare> daker: thx
<daker> crvilare: yw
<lops> good morning. anyone tried this to create a click package? http://paste.ubuntu.com/6515430/  The --user option is not recognized by pkcon
<daker> lops: i use http://paste.ubuntu.com/6503867/
<gmoore13> I have a generic 7" tablet can anyone point me to directions for installing ubuntu on it
<popey> !devices | gmoore13
<ubot5> gmoore13: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<popey> needs to be on that list
<gmoore13> its not
<ogra_> you could try to do a port yourself ...
<ogra_> but note thats not a trivial task
<gmoore13> ok thanks
<lops> daker, that worked, but my app still doesn't show up in my apps lens
<lops> how can I be sure my click package is even ok?
<ogra_> lops, try searching for it ... that makes the click lens re-read the apps
<lops> nope. won't find it.
<lops> it did say Installed, summary goes here
<lops> but that probably doesn't say anything
<davmor2> who is best to talk to about mediascanner?
<dbarth> hi; quick question, what is the component doing input management for wifi keys?
<popey> davmor2: thostr_
<davmor2> popey: thanks
<popey> or jhodapp
<dbarth> it refreshes its list too fast for me to type my new loonnnnng wep key
<thostr_> davmor2: jamesh or Satoris are actually the best guys to discuss mediascanner with
<davmor2> thostr_: okay thanks
<ogra_> dbarth, there are several pieces involved ... indicator-network, snap-decisions and network-manager on the low level
<lops> is there a way to run a UT touch from the adb shell after pushing the app's files onto the phone?
<daker> lops: what do you mean ? running the app ?
<lops> i'm having problems creating and installing a click package, so I just pushed everything to my tablet and tried ./<appname>
<lops> i just tried that in the tablet's terminal and it seems to work. just need to fixe some bugs now
<lops> daker, i wonder if this method is ok, since my app has cpp, qml, etc? i just need it to work, no need to install it for now ;_;
<daker> lops: is it a compiled app ?
<lops> aye.
<lops> daker, it seems to have been nicely compiled, since it DID run now, for the first time :')
<daker> lops: ok
<lopis> uhm. guys. why was this saying i was banned because of bitcoin activities or wtv?
<mterry> ogra_, so heads up on what ricmm, kdub, and I have been looking into regarding nested mode: maguro's deal is (1) the lightdm fix that I mentioned, a branch is waiting to be reviewed and (2) Mir opening devices twice when it shouldn't, kdub is working on.  grouper's problem is some other android driver issue that we have to work around.  I believe ricmm is looking at that
<mterry> ogra_, so I guess take it off landing plan for now
<timppa> Ubuntu Touch r47 terminal app backspace and enter keys are broken?
<timppa> I can type anything but cannot execute anything
<timppa> Can someone confirm this?
<timppa> Notes and Ã©verything else (so far) seems to work ok
<mterry> tedg, heyo!  The greeter dbus api is about to land in unity8, btw
<mterry> tedg, the one that says which user is selected and whether they are locked
<popey> timppa: confirmed
<timppa> popey: ack
<popey> timppa: want me to file a bug?
<timppa> popey: I need to fly, I can create a bug later or tomorrow, if you can please do
<popey> doing now
<timppa> gr8
<popey> timppa|away: bug 1257791
<ubot5> bug 1257791 in Ubuntu Terminal App "Enter and backspace broken in terminal" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1257791
<pmcgowan> barry, hi, I still get the symptom that a delay after download causes the install to not work, is that fix pending more changes landing?
<barry> pmcgowan: are you on s-i 2.0.2?  note that even image r47 doesn't appear to have it yet
<pmcgowan> barry, guess not then
<pmcgowan> I think then it lands any minute
<barry> pmcgowan: if you have a writable image, you can always download the .debs and install it manually (i *just* did that :)
<pmcgowan> barry, I can wait one more build then, was not sure it was tied to the 2.0
<pmcgowan> thanks
<barry> pmcgowan: right, and remember that once you upgrade to an image with s-i 2.0, it'll take another published image before you see the benefits :)
<pmcgowan> barry, chicken and egg, :)
<lopis> guys, where can I read about policies? i need to read a file, and it fails.
<pmcgowan> lopis, try http://developer.ubuntu.com/publish/apps/security-policy-for-click-packages/
<lopis> pmcgowan, thx
<nic-doffay> robotfuel, got a moment to test a potential fix for that selector bug?
<robotfuel> nic-doffay: sure
<nic-doffay> robotfuel, lp:~nicolas-doffay/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/fix-1231939
<robotfuel> nic-doffay: looking now
<nic-doffay> robotfuel, I tested it with a slowed down qmlscene
<nic-doffay> on the desktop...
<ogra_> mterry, it can stay on the plan, i'll just mark it blocked
<ogra_> (sorry in a meeting)
<tedg> mterry, Woot!  great!
<mterry> tedg, they are both exposed as a property (EntryIsLocked and ActiveEntry)
<mterry> tedg, on com.canonical.UnityGreeter, /list, com.canonical.UnityGreeter.List
<tedg> mterry, Ah, and are the properties in the signal?
<mterry> tedg, signal?
<mterry> tedg, you'll see PropertiesChanged for them
<mterry> tedg, oh
<tedg> mterry, User changed
<tedg> Oh, so the user is a property as well?
<mterry> tedg, I made the user a property too (but still offer old API that had a EntrySelected signal or something like that)
<mterry> tedg, the user is the ActiveEntry property
<mterry> tedg, but if you want to work with unity-greeter too, you should probably stick to old-school user query API
<tedg> mterry, I see.  I am a little worried about a race between the two, but we can use an idle timeout for that.
<mterry> tedg, which is SetActiveEntry, GetActiveEntry, and EntrySelected
<mterry> tedg, true, we don't bundle the changes.   But I didn't think the race would be a problem
<mterry> tedg, you can't get in a bad state via the race, I don't think.  lock change happens first, then user
<tedg> mterry, K, makes sense.
<Pfalzi> Hello i try to install the ubuntu touch on a galaxy nexus but the keys dosnt work?
<ogra_> which keys
<mterry> awe_, heyo!  I'm testing receiving calls when the lightdm unity8-greeter is active (user 'lightdm'), and I don't get a notification like I do in unity8.  Is the user 'phablet' hardcoded anywhere, or is there access to /dev devices that the lightdm user might need?
<mterry> awe_, or maybe I need more of an upstart session than I have
<awe_> mterry, how are you getting call notifications?  Directly from ofono or via telepathy?
<mterry> awe_, I believe via telepathy-ofono, which is not being auto-spawned for lightdm user.  Do you know what spawns it?  I didn't see an upstart job, something must be dbus-starting it?
<ogra_> there si ofono-setup in the ustart sessions iirc
<ogra_> *upstart
<ogra_> (that might trigger it)
<mterry> ogra_, hmm, seems likely
<robotfuel> nic-doffay: I can't get your fix branch to build with dpkg-buildpackage, it's failing tests http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6520692/
<nic-doffay> robotfuel, unrelated to that branch, it's an issue with ubuntu-ui-toolkit trunk unfortunately.
<robotfuel> nic-doffay: I'll disable make check in the rules file :/
<nic-doffay> robotfuel, ok. And ta!
<mterry> tedg, looking at upstart-app-launch, owning com.canonical.UpstartAppLaunch isn't sufficient, eh?  To properly hook the greeter in, I'd need to get involved in the upstart job too...
<mterry> the application-start job
<tedg> mterry, URL Dispatcher?
<mterry> tedg, ah!
<mterry> tedg, let me look at that.  In my head, I was looking at app-launch
<tedg> :-)
 * tedg fixes mterry's head
<ogra_> pictures ! else it didnt happen
<davmor2> greyback: Hey dude, ref bug #1234538  I think I have this issue with the calculator app.  I'm working on the test failures,  I get the following http://ubuntuone.com/5JX9QMe4YKl6naFW7SiWie and any tests fail once this happens
<ubot5> bug 1234538 in unity8 (Ubuntu) "With Mir enabled - Applications randomly failed to start" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1234538
<davmor2> greyback: are there any logs that would be useful to help you?
<greyback> davmor2: the problem is clear to me,  so I'm good. Thanks tho.
<davmor2> greyback: with any luck that will make the dailer app work again too. me crosses my fingers that, that is the case at any rate :)
<greyback> davmor2: yep, me too :D
<Tassadar> does anybody here have, by any chance, working uart console on n4/other nexus device?
<mterry> tsdgeos, I notice that my greeter-dbus-api branch failed in autolanding.  Seemingly still to flaky tests.  I've not seen this error before (the autolanding failure vs CI failure).  There's no retry button, do I set needs-review then approved?
<mhall119> halp!  I have a run-away init process
<mhall119> ogra_: ping
<nemo_> howdy
<mhall119> ogra_: sergiusens: can one of you tell me how to provide useful debugging data around my runaway init process?
 * mhall119 ran ubuntu-bug against upstart
<iBelieve> balloons: ping
<balloons> iBelieve, :-)
<iBelieve> balloons: I need help getting Jenkins to rebuild. I see other branches for File Manager are passing now, so I clicked rebuild (several times with in the last week) on one of my branches that failed, but nothing has happened.
<iBelieve> balloons: the merge request is https://code.launchpad.net/~mdspencer/ubuntu-filemanager-app/improved-file-opening/+merge/196429
<balloons> iBelieve, I have something for you to review actully
<balloons> iBelieve, https://code.launchpad.net/~nskaggs/ubuntu-filemanager-app/debug-ap-tests/+merge/197593
<balloons> iBelieve, rebuilding your stuff in a sec
<iBelieve> balloons: reviewed. Sorry, saw the email come in for it but then totally forgot to review it :(
<balloons> iBelieve, and yes all the tests should be passing.. so let's keep it that way. that mp was to make sure they worked on the phone too. you threw me for a loop with the changes in the wide display vs phone display
<balloons> there's not goto button :-)
<balloons> so I had to make an mp to use the places popover instead depending on the screen
<iBelieve> balloons: that's odd. I through I modified the AP tests to work for both screen sizes
<balloons> iBelieve, I made some changes to stop patching home. so at the start of every test it navigates to a temp folder
<balloons> and works inside of it
<balloons> that navigation logic uses goto or places
<balloons> iBelieve, your branch has conflicts now
<iBelieve> balloons: okay, I'll fix the conflicts.
<balloons> ahh you are removing the file dialog eh?
<iBelieve> balloons: yeah, I see no need for it as desktop file managers don't have one
<sergiusens> mhall119, init ran away or some job that init started?
<crocket> Will ubuntu touch run desktop ubuntu applications on connected monitors?
<crocket> Will it run nongraphical desktop applications in the background and a terminal emulator?
<mhall119> sergiusens: it was init's process
<mhall119> user-session init, not system-level init
<mhall119> sergiusens: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/upstart/+bug/1257880 has everything I knew to gather
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1257880 in upstart (Ubuntu) "Runaway init --user consuming CPU and RAM" [Undecided,New]
<sergiusens> mhall119, oh, and it just disappeared?
<sergiusens> mhall119, seems similar to what I think Ursinha saw
<mhall119> crocket: we'll have to wait and see (or help us build what you want to see)
<mhall119> sergiusens: no, it never disppeared
<mhall119> I was able to gather info via adb shell, reported the bug then rebooted the phone
<mhall119> init never gave up any CPU or RAM before I rebooted, nor did it ever die
<mhall119> ubuntu-bug didn't seem to gather much useful data though
<balloons> iBelieve, looks like your mp is good to go :-)
<iBelieve> balloons: great, now I just need to find someone to review it :)
<nemo_> any of you have experience with forgetting to put your update.zip image on the phone and being unable to push it to the phone?
<nemo_> ive been trying: "adb push /path/to/your/downloaded/saucy-preinstalled-touch-armhf.zip /sdcard/autodeploy.zip" for the last hour
<nemo_> using the correct path of course
<nemo_> is there a way to mount your phone as a removable storage device from the ubuntu recovery
<balloons> nemo_, ubuntu recovery == clockwork recovery. it's certainly possible to do that in twrp, and I believe clockwork
<mhall119> nemo_: you're not actually using "/path/to/your/downloaded/" are you?
<balloons> been awhile
<nemo_> mhall119: im using the correct path, not the example path
<mhall119> ok
<mhall119> does adb give you an error?
<nemo_> yeah, adb said my device was not recognized
<crocket> mhall119, wait and see?
<nemo_> but i used adb to flash the recovery
<nemo_> maybe ill just flash twrp and stop being a stick in the mudd
<mhall119> crocket: the desktop side of things is still being worked out, how it will work when docking a phone even more so
<mhall119> nemo_: if you run "adb devices" does it show your device?
<mhall119> it could just be that you need to adb kill-server && sudo adb start-server
<nemo_> thanks for the input mhall19. ill take a look
<nemo_> it shows that im attached in recovery
<nemo_> -crosses fingers-
<nemo_> pushing the file over to the phone now!
<crocket> mhall119, what about command line programs?
<mhall119> crocket: what about them?
<crocket> Will I be able to execute command line programs in ubuntu touch?
<crocket> I already have "ls" and other desktop command line programs
<mhall119> you already can
<crocket> good
<mhall119> probably every default command-line program in the desktop is on the phone images
<crocket> mhall119, Does ubuntu touch use just plain desktop packages?
<mhall119> for the most part, yes
<mhall119> apps are largely click packages, but the rest of the distro uses the same debs
<mhall119> remember, Ubuntu desktop and Ubuntu phone are literally the *same* OS, currently they have different desktop shells (Unity 7 vs. Unity 8), but in the future even that will be the same
<nemo_> this project is so exciting
<mhall119> I know, right? :)
 * cwayne_ can't wait for unity8 on desktop
<crocket> mhall119, It seems that ubuntu touch is the only mobile OS that comes with linux desktop stacks.
<crocket> android and firefox OS use bionic instead of glibc.
<crocket> mhall119, Can I just install tinc or OpenVPN and run them on ubuntu touch?
<crocket> How do ubuntu mobile devices run X11 applications when connected to monitors?
<dobey> they don't currently, because the convergence feature set is not complete
<mhall119> crocket: I'm not sure what tinc is
<crocket> mhall119, tinc is a VPN program just like OpenVPN.
<crocket> dobey, What do they do?
<mhall119> crocket: eventually X11 apps will run in their own XMir window on top of Mir itself
<crocket> mhall119, Even in ubuntu mobile devices?
<mhall119> but that will only be usable on desktop, as almost every X11-dependent app will be awful on a small touch screen
<mhall119> crocket: in theory on mobile devices, in practice we'll want to avoid that scenario as much as possible for the reason above
<lops> hey, guys, I tried running an app I'm making just via terminal on my nexus 7. it ran just fine, but touch didn't work. do you know any work around?
<mhall119> now, most apps using toolkits like Qt or Gtk should be able to run directly on Mir, without needing the XMir/X11 container
<crocket> mhall119, tablets have large enough screens.
<crocket> mhall119, my ipad is big enough
<mhall119> crocket: my fingers are too big :)
<crocket> I'm really disappointed with apple devices.
<crocket> mhall119, well...
<mhall119> lops: what do you mean touch didn't work?
<crocket> mhall119, if I connect my tablet to a keyboard and a mouse, I want to see a desktop session on its screen.
<lops> well, when I touched with my fingers on the screen, where I places some touchable buttons, nothing happened :P
<mhall119> crocket: and I think that's the plan
<crocket> cool
<mhall119> lops: hmmm, it's likely the process is being suspended when you switch away from the terminal app
<crocket> mhall119, probably a keyboard with a trackpad!
<lops> switch away? :/ i didn't. I think. i was wondering if there was a difference in it being run via terminal
<lops> maybe something else was catching all the touch events
<mhall119> lops: are you running from the terminal app, or using adb over usb?
<lops> the terminal app. I couldn't figure how to run apps from adb or ssh
<lops> I also couldn't figure how to install my .click that I compiled and built with much love.
<mhall119> yeah, so when you open you app, the terminal-app loses focus on the screen, which will cause Ubuntu to pause it's process
<lops> I mean, it installed, but never appeared on my dash
<mhall119> but, since the terminal's process spawn'd your app's process, it could be pausing that too
<lops> that makes sense.
<mhall119> lops: did you publish your .click in the store, or just copy if over to your device?
<lops> because UT would always say only the terminal was openned, ofc.
<lops> I pushed it via adb
<mhall119> lops: you should be able to run (as phablet user) "pkcon install-local $clickpackagefile"
<lops> it's not finished :/ I just wanted to test it. I wish it was easy to test via QTC like QML apps
<lops> mhall119, yes, it installed fine. but nothing happened after that.
<mhall119> lops: you can as phablet user, not root?
<mhall119> lops: see if your app's .desktop file was copied into ~/.local/share/applications/
<lops> mhall119, i can't remember if i tried as phablet. i don't have the nexus atm :/ it's not mine. but I will check that
<mhall119> ok
<lops> mhall119, to run as phablet user, I do #sudo -u phablet <commands> ?
<mhall119> if you ran pkcon as root, it wouldn't put the .desktop file in the right place
<mhall119> lops: I usually "sudo -iu phablet" to get a shell session as phablet
<mhall119> then run any other commands
<lops> ah cool. thx
<lops> i've been using Ubuntu for like 5 years, on and off, but i'm still such a noob x) I love this channel
<mhall119> that's okay, I've been using linux for almost a decade and I'm still a noob too
<lops> this is for a school assignment. the teacher suggested we did a Windows Phone app, but any mobile platform was fine too. I decided to "try" UT
<lops> now i'm neck deep in this, it's way too late to change, and I'm doing so much more than a mobile app rofl. but it's been fun ofc
<crocket> mhall119, When will I see the first ubuntu phones and tablets?
<mhall119> crocket: hopefully next year, but I don't have any knowledge about it that isn't already public
<lops> talking about that. I was thinking the other day how Google has all the big manufacturers binded in a contract that prevents them from selling any phone with modified non-google android phones
<crocket> mhall119, I've used iPhone 4 for 3 years, and I'm running out of patience.
<crocket> The home button of my iPhone is not working well!
<lops> like amazon can never, ever, in the future sell google-android stuff, or have access to google play store
<lops> now... doesn't this mean that no big brand will be interested in the modified android that is Ubuntu Touch? :S
<mhall119> lops: Ubuntu isn't a modified Android, so they can ship it *and* their Google Play approved version of Android
<lops> hm ok. what parts exactly of UT are Android?
<lops> the drivers or so?
<mhall119> there are some kernel patches and drivers
<mhall119> not much left, really
<mhall119> it's certainly not enough to prevent them from shipping Ubuntu and Google Android both
<lops> ok
<lops> that gives me some hope
<lops> because, man, UT is so damn gorgeous.
<daker> lops: see slide 4 https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1LjGf3IQGraQWxdjkIisI4McVi3GmfCTCDg-lLBUtzis/edit?pli=1#slide=id.g16fe566e3_00
<lops> daker, ty. that was helpful
<daker> lops: thanks to rsalveti (for the slides)
<lops> rsalveti, thanks for the slides
<rsalveti> :-)
<cuco> hi all, i installed ubuntu touch on my nexus4, and I dont see where do i enable the wifi. can anyone help me?
<crocket> hmm
<crocket> Is it ok to buy nexus 5 and install ubuntu touch on it?
<lops> depending on what kind of wifi you have, you may be lucky or out of luck :D
<cuco> i installed the devel channel... an oops?
<lops> cuco, you mean there's no wifi in your settings app?
<cuco> lops: I only see "auto join..." I cannot choose the network.
<lops> cuco, so your network doesn't show up? above that auto join stuffis where the networks are listed
 * cuco checks that checkbox on... and still sees nothing
<lops> cuco, is it an adhoc? i tried connecting to my laptop with adhoc and it didnt show up either
<cuco> no. standard wifi crap... worked 5 mins ago on stock :) Maybe I should choose a more conservative channel :)
<lops> I also failed to connect to eduroam on campus, which is wpa enterprise
<lops> you could try copying your profiles from your latop onto UT if you've got ubuntu running on your pc
<lops> but I guess if it doesn't even show up, it could very much be some channel limitations oO
<mhall119> cuco: if you pull down the network indicator from the top, does it list any APs?
<cuco> mhall119: no. tried it already.
<cuco> nice. dialer is not working. lets reflash with "trusty"
<mhall119> is your SSID broadcast or hidden?
<cuco> ssid is not hidden, and I don't see any wifi. at all.
<mhall119> yeah, I'd recommend using the "trust" channel, not the devel ones
 * cuco will be back in 15 mins
<lops> have fun
<mhall119> remember, devel and -proposed mean "Images that haven't passed their automated testing yet"
<mhall119> for a phone especially, you want to only install things that aren't failing to pass tests
<mhall119> I have my N7 tablet on trust-proposed, but my N4 phone is just trust
<cuco> i am probably missing something. i still don't see any networks.
<cuco> well... rild works... but i could not hang up...
<cuco> stable? ok
<crocket> When will I be able to install ubuntu touch on nexus 5?
<ogra_> crocket, that will still take a while ... the android bits we use are still on 4.2
<jevon_>  2 months maybe
<ogra_> (which does not run on N5)
<janimo`> crocket, we need the hammerhead kernel in the archive and a port to 4.4 as ogra said
<janimo`> these are both needed but are independent tasks
<ogra_> janimo`, and sadly also hybris
<ogra_> thats not yet 4.4 either
<janimo`> ogra_, part of the port to 4.4 task
<ogra_> indeed
<janimo`> the hard part of it
<ogra_> heh, yes
<janimo`> ogra_, hammerhead builds from the same sources as mako - once rebased on the kitkat kernel tree, so that should be straightforward
<cuco> which parts of android 4.4 are needed in Ubuntu to be able to run on Nexus5? Lets ignore the kernel, which should "boot".
<ogra_> janimo`, well, i guess we want all trees on the same android version
<cuco> do the drivers available for nexus 5 implement newer HAL api...?
<ogra_> cuco, all the binary blobls ... and the services to use them
<crocket> Can I install ubuntu touch on SGS4 already?
<ogra_> !devices | crocket
<ubot5> crocket: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<cuco> ogra_: nice... interesting... much more then my work :)
<janimo`> ogra_, indeed, we could already try the kitkat branch for mako
<ogra_> crocket, no idea where the port stands yet
<janimo`> even with the 4.2 userland
<ogra_> you mean the kernel ?
<janimo`> ogra_, yes
<ogra_> there aree some firmware issues with mako and 4.4 ...
<ogra_> at least if you want to be able to use ril iirc
<ogra_> the baseband firmware in 4.4 is newer and not backwards compatible
<ogra_> (people that upgraded to 4.4 have known issues running ubuntu touch)
<ogra_> on mako ...
<janimo`> ogra_, even after doing a reflash of 4.2 via fastboot?
<ogra_> no, thats fine
<janimo`> ok
<ogra_> but if you have 4.4 (which many if not most people that would try UT most likely have ... they need to downgrade first
<crocket> huh
<cuco> mmm... i still don't see any wireless networks.
<cuco> i am on stable now... so we have 2 options: 1) I have no idea what I am doing, 2) my device is "different"
<ogra_> cuco, is that a mako ?
<ogra_> (nexus 4)
<cuco> ogra_: yes. nexus44
<ogra_> cuco, and did you have kitkat on it before installing ubuntu ?
<cuco> ogra_: yes.
<ogra_> well, read the lines i wrote above :)
<ogra_> the kitkat firmware is incompatible with the android 4.2 userspace ... which we use in ubuntu touch for the radio
<cuco> so... re-flash the modem...? do you konw what exactly is needed? i sohuld i re-flash all 4.3 and then ubuntu?
<ogra_> thats currently the only way i know about ...
<cuco> that = all 4.3?
<ogra_> going back to the older android (4.2 would likely be better) and then re-installing ubuntu
<ogra_> i havent heard about issues with 4.3 though ... might be fine too
<cuco> ok, testing 4.3 then
<cuco> nice. now i have wireless.
<cuco> how do i add another keyboard layout?
<lops> cuco, there are some instructions in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/ReleaseNotes#Keyboard but I didn't try them myself tbh
<cwayne_> they're a bit out of date though
<cwayne_> you can set the locale from the system-settings app
<nemo_> so so there is no way to just re-flash the radio to get wifi working? you have to install 4.3 android?
<nemo_> finally got the phone up and running and the the wifi news was a bummer
<Guest42302> have they got ubuntu touch to work on the nexus 7 second gen yet?
<bfiller> anyone know where DLOG messages from unity-mir go on the disk?
<nemo_> found the answer for others who were wondering about the wifi problems http://askubuntu.com/questions/380435/wifi-issue-on-nexus-4-16gb
<sergiusens> bfiller, my bet would be ~/.cache/upstart/unity8.log
<bfiller> sergiusens: doesn't seem to be there
<bfiller> sergiusens: I mean the log is there but not the messages is see in the code using DLOG
<sergiusens> got it
<markr_> Hello!
<markr_> I've been trying to install Ubuntu Touch on a Galaxy Nexus, following the instructions here: http://www.ubuntu.com/phone/install
<markr_> On the phone, the message "ROM may flash stock recovery on boot. Fix? THIS CANNOT BE UNDONE." came up, but as per instructions just left it
<markr_> Later I got the message on the computer "ERROR:phablet-flash:Installation is taking too long or an error occured along the way."
<markr_> and the phone hangs with the Google logo when booting
<markr_> I can get into the bootloader as normal by pressing vol up + vol down + power
<markr_> but it never shows up in the list of adb devices
<markr_> so I'm not sure how to proceed
<markr_> Any ideas?
<Guest42302> have they got ubuntu touch to work on the nexus 7 second gen yet?
<popey> Guest42302: not yet
<Guest42302> how close are they to having it be in the pre-release stage?
<Guest42302> Also, can you install the  Ubuntu Core on Nexus 7 [2013]? like they show here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Nexus7
#ubuntu-touch 2013-12-05
<mhall119> Guest42302: the 2013 N7 isn't supported yet, no
<mhall119> I'm not sure if anybody at XDA has built an image for it yet
<Guest42302> ok, thanks
<slide-guy> Hello is there a way to slide in from the side to reveal the launcher with regular ubuntu? does ubuntu touch have an iso i can make a live image with. Using an dell inspiron 15 7000
<mhall119> slide-guy: you can auto-hide the launcher on the desktop,then pressing your mouse pointer against the edge will reveal it
<slide-guy> but I want to use my touch screen :(
<mhall119> slide-guy: Unity 8 (the Ubuntu touch shell) will have an testable session in 14.04's desktop ISO, but it's not there yet
<slide-guy> cool :^)
<mhall119> you can run Unity 8 in a windows right now, on your desktop, but not as the actual shell
<slide-guy> is there a guide?
<mhall119> http://unity.ubuntu.com/getinvolved/development/unity8/ has a guide to getting the code,compiling it and running it
<slide-guy> cool thanks
<mhall119> but if you just want to run it, I think there are packages to install in 13.10
<slide-guy> true
<mhall119> apt-get install unity8, I think that's all you need
<mhall119> might need unity8-private and/or unity8-fake-env
<slide-guy> can I do that in a live environment? I have a 16gb flash drive
<mhall119> join #ubuntu-unity and ask in there for additional help
<slide-guy> k
<mhall119> running it I'm pretty sure
<mhall119> don't know how compiling it would work out though
<crocket> yop
<shuduo> hello, where is right place to report bug for system-settings-touch? there is no 'report a bug' in lp:~system-settings-touch page
<crocket> Will I see an ubuntu phone or tablet by April 2014?
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> didrocks, salut mon ami - do you know when the new ubuntu-system-image is going to land?
<didrocks> dholbach: it should have landed, right? (2.0)
<didrocks> I saw it was stalled in proposed for a long time
<dholbach> didrocks, I couldn't find it in http://people.canonical.com/~j-lallement/touch/changes/
<didrocks> dholbach: still in proposed indeed:  system-image-dbus | 2.0.2-0ubuntu1 | trusty-proposed/universe | all
<didrocks> dholbach: I think we need barry to look at his packages to enter the release pocket :p
<dholbach> ah ok :)
<dholbach> thanks
<dholbach> I'd like to help debug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-system-image/+bug/1256229 - that's why I was asking
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1256229 in Ubuntu system image ""system-image-cli -i" reports old version" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<didrocks> dholbach: yeah, he reuploaded 2.0.2 apparently on Tuesday to fix a FTBFS (and that's why sytem-image was stalled for a week or two in proposed)
<dholbach> it built yesterday, so can it be pulled in for the release now?
<didrocks> autopkgtest for system-image 2.0.2-0ubuntu1: FAIL (Jenkins: public, private)
<dholbach> oh ok
<didrocks> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html
<didrocks> dholbach: we really need to sensibilize people with upload rights to look at -proposed
<didrocks> stuff are stalled for days and days sometimes
<dholbach> didrocks, I don't know ... a short article on packaging.u.c? or is it on a wiki page already?
<didrocks> dholbach: there is this excellent page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ProposedMigration
<dholbach> didrocks, are mails sent out if something gets stuck in proposed?
<didrocks> dholbach: I don't think so
<dholbach> maybe it should be treated like a case of FTBFS
<didrocks> dholbach: for autopkgtests failures, maybe yeah. For the other cases, like "no ready yet on <arch>", maybe that should be after a threshold time
<didrocks> but I'm not a specialist ;)
<dholbach> ok, I hope it's easy to fix, the test suite passed during the build
<dholbach> I'll file a bug about the packaging guide anyway
<dholbach> it'll be good to mention it
<dholbach> and maybe we could have a session at the next UDW
<dholbach> just so new developers know already know about it
<didrocks> yeah ;)
<Luclis> Bonjour ?
<Oria> hi guy's, I'd like to up a problem on my mako. If you have a pin code with more than 4 digits it does'nt work.
<mterry> Oria, we only support 4
<mterry> Oria, oh
<mterry> Oria, you mean with SIM?
<Oria> yes mterry with sim
 * mterry doesn't know much about how we handle SIM
<mterry> Oria, sorry, I'm stuck in a world where PIN means login password, not SIM
<Oria> ok :)
<Luclis> Someone know if I can try it on my computer ?
<Oria> mterry: why to limite
<mterry> Oria, I don't know, I didn't do the SIM pin stuff
<Oria> mterry: Is it possible to make a request to dev? Many people think it's a shame to limit to 4. Make a limit to 6 or more would be better?
<mterry> mzanetti, did you do SIM pin stuff?   ^
<mzanetti> mterry: yes
<Luclis> Oria : maybe it's just a bug ; have you try with another SIM/phone ?
<mzanetti> Oria: for SIM pin there is a fix coming in. for the phone lockscreen (not SIM PIN) it's a design decision to keep it to 4.
<mzanetti> I'm not particularly happy with that
<Oria> Luclis: I don't have another compatible phone or another SIM :)
<Oria> ok mzanetti
<Oria> To design, before security ... I find it illogical finally good in my opinion :)
<mzanetti> Oria: well, if you want more you can use the passphrase one that gives you a full keyboard. but if you want to keep it to simple numbers, it's going to be limited to 4
<raptor67782> hi
<raptor67782> I would like to have  a LINUX phone, I was the home page of ubuntu touch, and it is insanely complicated to install ubuntu.
<raptor67782> Haven't you a cdrom to install Linux directly from Windows 7?
<raptor67782> (on the phone via usb cable)
<pitti> a CD-ROM on a phone!?
<raptor67782> Furthermore, the new phone arent compatible with ubuntu touch.
<pitti> raptor67782: I'm afraid that doesn't work; unfortunately phones are quite a bit harder to install than desktops, but the phablet-flash tool makes this really easy and a single-command issue already?
<raptor67782> no, you dont ujdersndatnd. I plug my phone on my windows ,and put in my cdrom ubuntutouch, and it installs it automatically.
<raptor67782> I havent linux at all.
<pitti> raptor67782: I think the honest answer is "nobody on our side is interested in doing it", and it would be loooots of work for very little gain
<Oria> raptor67782: livecd
<Oria> and phablet-flash
<raptor67782> ah come on. too complicated
<raptor67782> I regret but if users have to go through complicated processes, it will never work to get more interests.
<raptor67782> It should be simple
<pitti> it is simple
<pitti> $ phablet-flash ubuntu-system
<pitti> done
<dadel> raptor67782, why do you want a linux on your phone?
<raptor67782> You have windows xp or 7, you put your cdrom, and you install: SETUP NEXT...
<raptor67782> dadel: linux is the future. Look Steam...
<pitti> raptor67782: I'm afraid the people you are talking to here don't even have windows
 * pitti hasn't had a windows box for 16 years
<dadel> raptor67782, if you want the future now you may do some efforts
<raptor67782> ha ha, really, you havent windows?
<raptor67782> about 80 pct of machines are windows today.
<dadel> you have a computer, you plug you liveCD, you run it, you launch the pitti command and it's done
<pitti> I honestly tried to co-install it on my laptop, but it's way too big, and installing it is a royal pain, so I just gave up
<raptor67782> world wide, about 5 - 10pct are linux
<pitti> raptor67782: sure, I know the numbers; but that doesn't change the reason :)
<dadel> it's not interesting to troll about that raptor67782 if you are happy with your win just stay with it
<pitti> ^ fully agreed
<dadel> i'm sure there are some #windows irc where you will find your happiness
<raptor67782> thank you for your non-help :(
<dadel> lol
<pitti> well, we did tell you what the reason was and how to easily install an Ubuntu phone
<pitti> *shrug*
<raptor67782> Look https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install    I have asked two shops
<raptor67782> selling phones in my town, I printed this page, and they have looked and studied, and even them, have no single idea how to install ubuntutouch. so ...I mean. it means everth
<raptor67782> g
<davmor2> Morning all
<dadel> i think that if you considere too complicated to run a liveCD to do so, you may wait that UbuntuTouch project is more advanced and propose windows installer
<pitti> well, frankly this stuff is meant to be installed by OEMs (i. e. phone producers)
<pitti> I would not ever expect a phone buyer or a shop to install and configure it
<dadel> actually it is intended to linux users and courageous people not everybody
<pitti> at this point this is very much a developer preview
<dadel> the other users will be addressed when the project will be more mature
<raptor67782> I would like a Linux phone. Today, which solution is available?
<dadel> Android
<dadel> is based on a Linux kernel
<raptor67782> Android isnt a real linux
<pitti> jolla
<dadel> it's a Linux kernel
<dadel> there is no real or false Linux
<dadel> there are many distibutions
<dadel> for every need
<dadel> just take the one for you
<raptor67782> Come on. Ubuntu is meant to be the best, so, why still no ubuntu on phones?
<dadel> I think you should see android
<dadel> there is no best
<dadel> i use ubuntu/android/debian/raspbian/redhat
<dadel> it depends on my needs and this is what I like in Linux worldf
<dadel> good luck raptor67782 in your life that seems to be really complicated out of easy ways
<raptor67782> I have an android tablet archos, but I have no idea how to install linux ubuntu on it
<raptor67782> I am not working in informatic. Anytime
<raptor67782> dadel: I do physics. I do regularly schrodinger equations. For me, it is simple, I could laugh trying to solve on. Furhtermore, physics pay well, probably better than a developer ;)
<pitti> there is currently no ubuntu for the archos tablet
<pitti> (only for the n7 and n10, and even these are only developer previews)
<raptor67782> I didn't know, I shall try to sell it on ebay, to buy one compatible with ubuntu. Maybe for next year...
<HCL> can i install ubuntu touch on  my HCL ME U-1
<mzanetti> MacSlow: https://code.launchpad.net/~mzanetti/unity8/lockscreen-default-variable-pinlength/+merge/197848
<mzanetti> MacSlow:  #ubuntu-unity btw?
<MacSlow> mzanetti, on it
<pitti> I'm about to write the first-ever automatic test for platform-api
<pitti> any hints as to what our preferred C++ project test framework is? which of our projects would be a good example?
<pitti> tvoss: ^ I think you might be able to answer this?
<pitti> (it's also my first-ever C++ test, so bear with me..)
<pitti> unless it's ok to write it using python3 unittest, which would make things a lot easier :)
<tvoss> pitti, we use google test all over our projects
<tvoss> pitti, let me find you a good example
 * pitti looks at libgtest-dev
<tvoss> pitti, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/process-cpp/trunk/files/head:/tests/ has got a good overview, including the required CMake stuff
<pitti> tvoss: nice and small, thanks!
<tvoss> pitti, yup :) just let me know if you need anything else
<pitti> tvoss: I guess gtest supports setup/teardown too, but I'll RTFM
<pitti> tvoss: so "gtest" and "these examples" should be fine
<tvoss> pitti, great. For setup/teardown: you probably want TEST_F(Fixture, ...), with you defining the Fixture and per-suite/per-case setup and teardown
<pitti> right
<t1mp> popey: did you say unlocking crashes your phone?
<popey> it did earlier
<t1mp> popey: does that mean it is not recommended for me to upgrade to the latest image now?
<popey> uh, no, it was a one off
<popey> and that wasn't latest, it was #47
<popey> just updated to #48
<t1mp> popey: ah, okay. Then I proceed with installing the new image :) thanks.
<Laney> is there a way to know when the device was asleep?
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Power#Phone asks for it
<ogra_> Laney, powerd communicates through dbus ... might be possible to capture that from there
<Laney> I don't think capturing would work; if necessary, powerd should store it and provide that information
 * Laney will file a bug
<ogra_> no, unity8 should
<Laney> why?
<ogra_> powerd runs as system service ... unity8 needs to handle its dconf settings already (i was told) ... so that info should go there as well i think
<Laney> It sounds weird to do that, but someone can reassign if that is true
<seb128> Laney, ideally that would be a feature we would add to upower?
<ogra_> ++
<pitti> Laney, seb128: upower doesn't do suspend any more
<seb128> pitti, well, it records charge history with state, I'm sure it would be easy to listen to some suspend/resume signals and add those events to the record?
<Laney> upower would be better and could listen to logind's signals
<pitti> yes, you can listen to logind's PrepareForSleep signal, but I doubt that everything on the phone actually uses that
<Laney> but I don't think that works with powerd
<seb128> k
<seb128> so we just can't do that doted line in the graph
<Laney> not yet
<seb128> seems another of those "too much work for the benefit it brings"
<pitti> upower records the charge history, yes, but only if you actually have a battery
<Laney> You just get events either side of the suspend afaict
<seb128> we have more important things to do that make the charge graph indicate sleep times
<Laney> nothing to say 'you were suspended in this period'
<pitti> yeah, it's surprisingly difficult to find out when a machine went to sleep and came back :/
<Laney> yeah, well, just filing bugs for things that we can't do
<pitti> the kernel log obviously has it, but it doesn't send notifications
<Laney> if they get fixed then hey presto we can do them :-)
<seb128> pitti, if you don't have a battery you don't have a charge graph anyway ;-)
<pitti> right
<ogra_> dont we need something that monitors the power button anyway (for a shutdown menu)
<seb128> Laney, right
<seb128> ogra_, well, the device suspends by itself if you don't touch it
<seb128> no need to press a button
<ogra_> oh, roght ... forgot about that
<pitti> seb128, Laney: the charge log already has real-time timestamps, doesn't it? this should have gaps while the device is suspended
<Laney> yes
<Laney> is there a reliable way to work that out from those?
<pitti> for a gap, there are several possibilities: off, suspend, or upower crash :)
<pitti> but on a graph they'd all show as the same time gap?
<seb128> Laney, pitti, upower doesn't do regular recording, it just records changes
<Laney> I seem to get it at the resolution of 1% changes
<seb128> yeah, it writes datas when there is a change
<Laney> let me file a bug for hadess to close ;-)
<seb128> about?
<seb128> I filed half a dozen
<Laney> what pitti said, tracking sleeps
<sticker> anyone get Ubuntu to worm on the note II yet?
 * Laney slithers
<seb128> Laney, k, I didn't file that one ;-)
<seb128> I filed other about stuff like "if you are charging and unplug, you are getting the new status only on next % change"
<seb128> so you might in a wrong state until that 1% is used
<ogra_> !deviced | sticker
<Laney> nod
<ogra_> !devices | sticker
<ubot5> sticker: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<ogra_> (sorry for the typo)
<t1mp> are there specific times when new images are created?
<ogra_> t1mp, not atm, but we're working on that
<t1mp> if I need to get something in an image before tomorrow afternoon (london time), when should it be in a UITK release?
<ogra_> t1mp, if i trigger a build i announce it in #ubuntu-ci-eng (and if it is done as well)
<ogra_> t1mp, best ask in the above channel, the guys there do the testing
<ogra_> (before anything lands)
<t1mp> ogra_: ok, thanks
<ogra_> stgraber, didnt you add a fix for the "not able to make image writable" issue recently ? seems ricmm sees it on his grouper
<stgraber> ogra_: yes, the initrd was changed for that
<ogra_> stgraber, yeah, just found it
<barry> dholbach, didrocks that's right.  there's no indication at all that things are stuck in proposed.  you only find out if you look, and it does not scale to look for everything you upload.  that really needs to be fixed.  an email when migration fails would *really* help
<ogra_> stgraber, so it seems the install ricmm has is actually from the 3rd ... but still seems to have a readonly loop device
<ogra_> mount: cannot remount block device /dev/loop1 read-write, is write-protected
<dholbach> barry, maybe somebody should bring it up on u-devel?
<ogra_> or just in #ubuntu-release ...
<pitti> tvoss: is it some kind of policy to put all tests into <root>/tests/, or could the simulated-sensor test live in src/ubuntu/testbackend/ right next to the implementation?
<ogra_> (wheer the maintainers of that bit of infrastructure live)
<pitti> tvoss: the latter would avoid having to figure out an appropriate LD_LIBRARY_PATH, as cmake already sets an rpath (but that doesn't help us when calling it from another directory)
<tvoss> pitti, not a strict policy, I would call it best practice
<pitti> tvoss: I have my first test working BTW, so gtest/cmake are fine
<pitti> tvoss: ok, thanks
<pitti> tvoss: I can set LD_LIBRARY_PATH it in the CMakeLists.txt for the add_test definition, then calling the test program directly will fail; but not such a big deal, I think
<tvoss> pitti, oh that's great
<pitti> tvoss: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6524971/
<tvoss> pitti, I think that's fine then for setting the LD_LIBRARY_PATH there. Perhaps put a comment in the CMakeLists.txt
<pitti> tvoss: and that first test found the first bug :)
<pitti> tvoss: yes, of course
<pitti> tvoss: I guess usually people should call "ctest" or "make test", which will deal with that
<tvoss> pitti, usually, you just call make test, yeah
<tvoss> pitti, you can try make NightlyMemCheck, too
<pitti> $ make -C obj && (cd obj; ctest --verbose)
<tvoss> pitti, to run everything under valgrind automatically
<pitti> that's my invocation for a turnaround
<pitti> tvoss: ah, nice
<tvoss> pitti, usually I do make && make test or make && make NightlyMemCheck
<pitti> yeah, "make test" is horribly un-verbose
<pitti> it doesn't show me the actual failures
<pitti> tvoss: I guess I need some additional magic for NightlyMemCheck, doesn't exist here
<pitti> but, that's for later
<pitti> let's get these tests written
<tvoss> pitti, +1
<tvoss> pitti, you want include include(CTest) as opposed to enable_testing() in your CMakeLists.txt
<pitti> tvoss: ok; I was following some stackexchange advice
<pitti> tvoss: works fine
<pitti> tvoss: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6525001/ with above change and the LD_LIBRARY_PATH setting
 * pitti wonders if set() will set the environment var, too; would look nicer for multiple tests
<pitti> no, it doesn't; and CTEST_ENVIRONMENT doesn't help either, so go ugliness
<tvoss> pitti, looks good albeit the ugliness. I remember a lengthy cmake mailing list discussion about that specific part
<pitti> tvoss: I was hoping for something like set(ENV{LD_LIBRARY_PATH} ...), but that doesn't work
<pitti> I live too much in a make world..
<tvoss> pitti, the above actually works, but not for ctest iirc
<tvoss> pitti, let me quickly check
<pitti> tvoss: right, only for make
<pitti> tvoss: the other bit of ugliness is that it currently hardcodes the gtest path; but the other alternatives of including huge amounts of boilerplate don't look any better to me..
<tvoss> pitti, yup, agreed. And it will at least fail early and with a sensible error message
<cwayne_> zsombi, ping
<zsombi> cwayne_: pong
<cwayne_> zsombi, is there a plan to let the user choose their app theme from system settings?
<cwayne_> rather than editing an ini file
<zsombi> cwayne_: that's mostly a question to design I think :)
<pitti> tvoss: thanks for the review; I'll commit that to my branch then, and flesh out the tests
<zsombi> cwayne_: settings will anyway edit the ini file :)
<pitti> tvoss: we can discuss the finer details in the MP (I'm a C++ n00b and probably do a lot of things wrong :) )
<cwayne_> zsombi, ah, so there's no plan to move to a gsettings key or something like that?
<zsombi> cwayne_: so if design thinks that it should be there, it's up to seb128 to have it implemented :)
<seb128> zsombi, cwayne_: there is no design for a such feature
<zsombi> cwayne_: yet we do not have such plans, however changing the system theme would also have to have a setting UI element... and as sebq128 says, so far there's no UI element in Settings app
<tvoss> pitti, happy to help :)
<zsombi> cwayne_: however UITK does not provide API yet for that purpose
<cwayne_> zsombi, seb128 ACK, thanks
<zsombi> cwayne_: yw
<pitti> tvoss: argh, not enough; I need to run each test case in a forked subprocess, as with the current sensor API there is no way to "reset" everything (unload the library, free all existing sensors, etc.)
<barry> dholbach: hope my email captured the problem without being too negative ;)
 * barry now goes to fix the bug
<stgraber> ogra_: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6525209/
<nic-doffay> robotfuel, hey got your mail. Here's the MP: https://code.launchpad.net/~nicolas-doffay/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/fix-1231939/+merge/197899
<nic-doffay> literally just proposed it now.
<ogra_> stgraber, yeah, weird, not sure why that doesnt work for ricmm
<ogra_> though he tries to remount /system
<ogra_> to put some changed android binaries in place
<dholbach> barry, yep, thanks!
<stgraber> ogra_: ah yeah, /system is another block device and may suffer from the same problem. I don't think I changed that one in the initrd.
<stgraber> ogra_: I believe I didn't bother since the system.img file has 0 byte free anyway, so it's not like you could write anything to it
<ogra_> ah
<ogra_> ricmm, ^^^
<the__> I've been trying to get a,'My Notebook', to work on a Ubuntu after using it on the window's, without any success, does anyboay know how to...?
<glfados> is there anyway i can compile ubuntu touch image myself?
<stgraber> ricmm: so your best bet is probably to copy system.img somewhere, dd some free space to it, then resize2fs it to get the new extra space, then loop mount it, add your stuff and finally overwrite the original system.img + reboot
<asd__> asd
<ogra_> stgraber, he went for a cdimage image now :)
<ogra_> stgraber, oh, btw, i was told you will fix the isotracker so didrocks' team can trigger image builds, any ETA for that ?
<robotfuel> nic-doffay: re-flashing my phone to test now.
<nic-doffay> robotfuel, cool ta
<nic-doffay> glad to hear it was ok too :P
<stgraber> ogra_: yeah, asac poked me about it, should be done at some point today
<ogra_> perfect, thanks
<stgraber> ogra_: except that even if you have access it apparently won't work
<ogra_> ugh, why
<stgraber> because they're not showing up on the tracker at the moment
<ogra_> whats the way to make them show up ?
<stgraber> there's probably some mismatch between nusakan and the tracker, looking for errors now in the logs
<stgraber> No iso.qa.ubuntu.com product found for ubuntu-touch/daily-preinstalled/trusty-preinstalled-touch-armhf; skipping.
<stgraber> right, so we'll need to tweak that a bit :)
<ogra_> yeah, thats a weird name :)
<stgraber> ogra_: so I'll disable all of the current Ubuntu Touch Preinstalled <device> products on the tracker and add a single "Ubuntu Touch armhf" one and link it with nusakan
<ogra_> yeah
<stgraber> ogra_: so I'll need at least two touch builds to confirm that this works once I've done the changes
<ogra_> stgraber, ok, we'll likely do one in a few hours ... the next probably only tomorrow morning though
<cwayne_> zsombi, so would it be a possibility to switch the theme to at least a gsetting?  It just seems the more 'correct way' of doing things
<zsombi> cwayne_: most probably would... we could have this as future task for theming
<user82> did anyone get the emulator running on ubuntu 13.10? i just downloaded the "android-emulator_20131202-2236-0ubuntu1_i386.deb" package and ran the commands from the wiki. however the screen was black in the emulator
<cwayne_> zsombi, if we could add that as a task that would be perfect, we're trying to minimize copying files into ~ for customization in favor of gsettings keys, this would be a big help for us :)
<ogra_> user82, the first boot takes over 10min
<stgraber> ogra_: so the change I just landed "should" (completely untested and not really testable short of spinning an image) at lesat push the build to the tracker
<user82> ogra_, oh...that might be it ;)
<stgraber> ogra_: once that's done, I'll look at the ACL and trigger of the build from the tracker (that's where we'll need a second build)
<ogra_> user82, subsequent ones are faster
<user82> the terminal did not move and i got impatient..but it sounds like a clue
<ogra_> stgraber, ok, i'll bring that up in the landing team meeting, we can probably spare a build
<user82> ogra_, even after the login already appeared?
<user82> "ubuntu phablet login"
<ogra_> yeah
<user82> allright
<user82> so i log in as "phablet" and keep on waiting?
<zsombi> cwayne_: not sure when are we going to have time for that though...
<user82> yey its up :)
<cwayne_> zsombi, well as always, i'm happy to help with any testing if that helps you guys out at all
<zsombi> cwayne_: thx ;)
<cwayne_> zsombi, thank you :) this was one of our last files copied into ~, will be a big win for us, so again, happy to help :)
<zsombi> cwayne_: any preference on the key?
<cwayne_> zsombi, maybe something like com.ubuntu.touch.app-theme?  I don't have any strong preference
<zsombi> cwayne_: ok, we'll come up with sthing then :)
<cwayne_> zsombi, sounds good to me :D
<zsombi> cwayne_: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1258209
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1258209 in Ubuntu UI Toolkit "[theming] Store theme settings in gsetting" [Wishlist,New]
<asac> stgraber: thanks for checking this out for us
<ogra_> asac, not done yet :)
<barry> dholbach: s-i 2.0.2-0ubuntu2 just uploaded.  it was an out-of-date autopkgtest dep
<asac> ogra_: hence i didnt say "sorting" :)
<ogra_> lol
<ogra_> janimo`, you sole my WI !
<ogra_> *stole
<ogra_> (thanks !!)
<janimo`> ogra_, well, I just want to leave you more time for the hard stuff (cdimage) :)
<ogra_> heh
<tedg> tvoss, Chatting with charles here about whether LTTng in UAL should be enabled by default.  Curious what you think.
<dholbach> barry, *crossing fingers* :)
<tvoss> tedg, charles I would make it a build option, with that we can easily generate instrumented packages if required
<tedg> tvoss, My concern there was that we'd not be able to get data on images then...  only custom stuff.
<tedg> In theory we'd never need timing data.
<tvoss> tedg, alternatively, you could make it a command line option
<tedg> tvoss, Won't the kernel tell me if it's enabled?
<tvoss> tedg, I would need to check that
<tvoss> tedg, a command line option is more explicit and self-documenting though
<tedg> tvoss, Sure, but that doesn't really help the can't use an image problem.
<tvoss> tedg, I think I'm not following :)
<tvoss> tedg, if the kernel does not support it, the call to updating the probe will just fail
<tedg> tvoss, http://twitter.com/tedjgould <- Click on "Follow" ;-)
<tvoss> tedg, so enable in build by default, but make it optional at runtime
<tedg> tvoss, I guess for me, do you see any reason that we'd use the tracing on a production image.  Or is that not a useful requirement.  I'm undecided on that.
<tvoss> tedg, hmmm ... I think it's undecided so far. That being said, I would enable it in the build by default
<tedg> tvoss, Okay, so we'll enable it and I'll look to see what happens at the kernel level.  It might be faster to check there than to do any other command line parsing or environment variables.
<tvoss> tedg, but still: having it in the kernel might not necessary mean: do the actual tracing
<tedg> tvoss, Sure, I'm hoping they'll tell us both.
<tvoss> tedg, I think a command-line flag would be the best approach
<tedg> tvoss, The problem is that we're not running any of the tools directly, but via the upstart jobs.  So I think injecting an environment variable into upstart might be easier.
<tvoss> tedg, cool
<charles> ted, the current MR always enables it; IMO making it optional is a nice middle ground between that and disabling it in production
<charles> I agree about using an env variable even if it's less self-documenting -- it doesn't matter how documenting the command-line args are if we're not always able to get the arg passed in
<mardy> greyback: hi! Any news about bug 1254333?
<ubot5> bug 1254333 in Unity 8 "Sign-on UI makes Unity8 restart" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1254333
<greyback> mardy: hey. I've not been able to look at it this week. I've good idea why it fails, but the fix isn't easy.
<tedg> tvoss, Looking at man lttng-ust and there's a var LTTNG_UST_REGISTER_TIMEOUT.  Seems like we could just set that to zero by default.  And then allow overriding it to something more reasonable if we want to trace.
<tvoss> tedg, makes sense, and people actually use it for that purpose, see http://lists.lttng.org/pipermail/lttng-dev/2013-July/020968.html
<tedg> tvoss, Ha, I was just there :-)
<nic-doffay> robotfuel, could you leave a comment here that the fix works? https://code.launchpad.net/~nicolas-doffay/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/fix-1231939/+merge/197899
<nic-doffay> Wouldn't mind fast tracking it now that the tests have been run.
<robotfuel> nic-doffay: sure I am installing the debs on my phone now.
<nic-doffay> robotfuel, cool
<cjwatson> cwayne_: bug 1253855 - could you please attach the /usr/share/click/hooks/ file and the click package manifest that reproduces this?
<ubot5> bug 1253855 in click (Ubuntu) "unlink_force fails on directories, making it impossible to pass dirs to click hooks" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1253855
<cjwatson> cwayne_: specifically it's not clear to me why the trailing slash is on that path
<cwayne_> cjwatson, sure thing
<cjwatson> thanks
<cwayne_> cjwatson, added.  shall i try it without the trailing slash? ( i think i had tried it previously, but happy to do again to be sure)
<cjwatson> cwayne_: yes, please do, the error shown here is because of the trailing slash
<cwayne_> cjwatson, ok, will remove it from the hook and try it out
<cjwatson> cwayne_: it's perhaps not widely known, but the most important semantic effect of a trailing slash is "even if this is a symbolic link, force it to be treated as a directory anyway"
<cjwatson> I mean, force resolution
<cjwatson> cwayne_: precisely the opposite of what you want here ...
<cwayne_> ah, of course
<cjwatson> http://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/basedefs/V1_chap04.html#tag_04_12
<cjwatson> so if that's a sufficient fix, I can probably strip the trailing slash to be friendly or some such, but you'll be able to move on
<cwayne_> cjwatson, that seems to have done it!
 * cwayne_ feels like an idiot now :P
<cjwatson> ok, cool
<ogra_> ogra@sabre:~$ rmadison kpartx
<ogra_> rmadison: you must have the liburi-perl package installed
<ogra_> to use this script
<ogra_> hmpf ...
<ogra_> why isnt that a hard dep of devscripts (i installed with --no-install-rcommends, but would still expect shipped scripts to work)
<Crimson_Rogue> Hello. Could someone point me to the file that I need to edit for ubuntu-touch to recognize my phone's partitions?
<Crimson_Rogue> hardware/qcom/audio-caf/mm-audio/aenc-qcelp 13/qdsp6/inc/omx_qcelp13_aenc.h:52:34:
<adam__> Hey, quick question. Is there a version of touch out that I can actually modify and use a terminal in?
<adam__> anyone?
<t1mp> adam__: what do you mean? for your phone/tablet?
<t1mp> adam__: ubuntu touch has a terminal app
<t1mp> or you can ssh to your device if that's what you meant
<adam__> oh okay so ssh is enabled by default
<t1mp> adam__: it is on my device. I don't remember that I did anything to enable it
<t1mp> so I think yes :)
<adam__> think it would be advisable to try to install a new window system or will it break the display config or fail due to drivers?
<t1mp> adam__: you want to install ubuntu touch on a device and replace unity8 by something else?
<t1mp> that would be a lot of work
<adam__> wanted to run gnome and use my tablet for configing my Cisco IOS racks
<adam__> for fun... not in live systems
<t1mp> I don't think gtk apps are supported yet
<adam__> hmm
<t1mp> its all qt5 now
<t1mp> for graphics I mean
<adam__> hmm
<adam__> well ty
<t1mp> perhaps you can install a "regular" ubuntu built for ARM?
<adam__> oh? will it install using adb?
<t1mp> adam__: I have no idea, I just saw desktop ubuntu on tablets in youtube videos
<t1mp> adam__: if you can configure the racks in a webbrowser then ubuntu touch will do
<iBelieve> popey: ping
<lotuspsychje> any device working flawless yet with ubuntu touch?
<t1mp> lotuspsychje: these should work quite well https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices#Working_with_phablet-flash
<lotuspsychje> t1mp: tnx lemme see
<lotuspsychje> t1mp: so if i buy a nexus7, touch would work rather good on it?
<t1mp> lotuspsychje: actually that's a good question. Those are the devices that we test on, but there are two versions of nexus 7.
<t1mp> popey: ^ do you know if the new nexus7 is supported?
<lotuspsychje> if the web browsing and terminal work flawless i would buy :p
<popey> t1mp: no.
<dkessel> ogra_, hey... what do you think about these autopilot test startup failures on the emulator? http://paste.ubuntu.com/6526692/
<sergiusens> dkessel, if things are still as they were; autopilot would need some work I think to setup the uinput device
<sergiusens> dkessel, we would also need to peek a bit more inside the emulator and check
<dkessel> sergiusens, well all I have seen is that /dev/uinput is definately missing...
<dkessel> well if someone could look into the problem that would be great. there is currently no way for me to run those autopilot tests in the emulator
<sergiusens> dkessel, it would probably be me
<sergiusens> dkessel, you can subscribe to https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/core-1311-touch-emulator ;
<sergiusens> dkessel, do you have a launchpad id?
<dkessel> sergiusens, sure... and sure
<sergiusens> dkessel, I'll add your name to the last item if you want ;-) (which you already did anyways)
<dkessel> sergiusens, heh. ok do so
<sergiusens> dkessel, can you tell me what your launchpad id is?
<dkessel> sergiusens, id is: d-kessel
<sergiusens> dkessel, ty
#ubuntu-touch 2013-12-06
<omac2> good evening...where are the apis for fileopen/filesave/fileselection dialogs with ubuntu-sdk
<omac2> running with devel on nexus4.  everything phone/SMS text works, but mobile data(3g) still not working out of the box.
<omac2> devel channel image 32's wifi seems to work fine for me, but not the mobile data(3g). 3g icon still flashes on and off and then settles to off.
<omac2> I have had the same mobiled data(3g) buggy behaviour in the saucy stable version and the trusty devel version image 32.
<nlsielicki> hey all. My name's Nick. I'm a student at UW Madison.
<nlsielicki> I'm really sick of all this NSA spying. I'm interested in flashing ubuntu touch to my nexus 4.
<nlsielicki> I'm a CS student and so I'm interested in writing some apps too, could be fun.
<nlsielicki> my question revolves around how featured the phone is yet-- is 3g radio supported on the nexus 4?
<nlsielicki> I need to be sure that basic features like calling, text messaging, and 3g data connectivity is supported.
<nlsielicki> battery life, speed, etc. are less concerning problems.
<crocket> ubuntu touch for the win!!!!
<dholbach> good morning
<Oria> je suis parti sur l'irc #ubuntu-touch/part
<some_dude> Hi there, I've been checking the online spreadsheet that tracks progress of Ubuntu Touch for the Galaxy Nexus (etc). To me, it looks like there's no more progress (and it's still not usable). So, my question: is Ubuntu Touch dead already?
<dholbach> some_dude, not really
<dholbach> some_dude, check http://people.canonical.com/~j-lallement/touch/changes/ for changes which landed
<some_dude> dholbach, thanks, was getting worried seeing all those other phones/OSs coming out recently and Ubuntu not really being launched
<dholbach> some_dude, everybody's putting loads of work into it :)
<some_dude> Ok, cool, I'll stand by... :-)
<ogra_> barry, https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Trusty/view/AutoPkgTest/job/trusty-adt-system-image/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/lastCompletedBuild/console ....
<ogra_> still failing ... (FYI)
<janimo`> ogra_, hey, what was the main blocker to getting the x86 images on cdimage, incomplete as they are?
<janimo`> I only remember the click packages being hardcoded to armhf right now
<ogra_> well, adding x86 support at all to cdimage
<ogra_> (for touch)
<ogra_> it currently only knows about armhf and the android subarches ...
<janimo`> ogra_, oh, I figured that was simple from your conversation with rsalveti back then
<ogra_> it was simple for goldfish, since thats just an armhf subset
<ogra_> s/set/arch/
<janimo`> ogra_, is the ubuntu.zip dependent on whether it runs on goldfish or on actual hw?
<ogra_> no
<ogra_> thats as generic as a rootfs can be
<janimo`> ogra_, ok, I just did not see why golfish mattered for the ubuntu.zips
<ogra_> it isnt over complicated to add publishing support for it ... just needs a bit of work
<ogra_> oh, it didnt
<mterry> pitti, hello!  I love your phonesim-autostart stuff.  Is there a way to simulate receiving a text message?
<pitti> mterry: kind of; you can send one and get it bounced back, sec
<mterry> hmm
<pitti> mterry: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/messaging-app/trunk/view/head:/tests/autopilot/messaging_app/tests/test_messaging.py#L123
<pitti> mterry: sorry, forget about the bouncing, I mixed that up with calls
<pitti> mterry: you can probably copy "def receive_sms()" as it is
<mterry> pitti, that's some black magic.  pointing at js over dbus?
<mterry> pitti, but awesome!
<mterry> pitti, thanks
<shuduo> hello, where is right place to report bug for system-settings-touch? there is no 'report a bug' in lp:~system-settings-touch page[B
<pitti> mterry: yes, that's how to drive a Qt GUI remotely
<pitti> mterry: ofono-phonesim runs on a private D-BUS as nobody, to avoid introducing a security problem
<pitti> mterry: I agree it's ugly, but it's the only way that exists
<mterry> pitti, yar, I noticed it was nobody.  Sure.  Plus, phonesim isn't exactly a common thing
<mterry> pitti, yup, not hating on it, just impressed with its hackery
<pitti> mterry: https://kernel.googlesource.com/pub/scm/network/ofono/phonesim/+/master/doc/scriptable.txt FYI
<pitti> mterry: if we need this outside of messaging-app, it seems we should add that as a convenience script to ofono-phonesim
<pitti> $ ofono-phonesim-receive-sms "sender" "text"
<pitti> or so
<mterry> pitti, just useful for testing greeter right now
<pitti> wrap the ugly innards into a shiny CLI :)
<mterry> not sure it's a widely useful thing
<davmor2> Morning all
<asac> mzanetti: Saviq: there?
<mzanetti> asac: yes
<asac> mzanetti: heard you guys really land regression tests for bugs?
<mzanetti> asac: is that really a question?
<asac> yes :)
<asac> i suspected that noone did it, but heard you guys really do it
<asac> which is great news :P
<mzanetti> yeah, we try as much as we can
<asac> mzanetti: you use qmlttests right? and we cant run that in our infrastructure yet?
<mzanetti> asac: we run qml tests in the upstream merger
<mzanetti> asac: we also use autopilot for integration tests. but we couldn't test everything with autopilot for multiple reasons. So yeah. most of our tests are qmltests with mocked backends
<asac> mzanetti: can i run qmltests against an image if i wanted?
<asac> mzanetti: could we package them so we have them available pre-built?
<mzanetti> asac: well, so the backends are mocked which means it wouldn't reveal any breakage in things like services or such (which is where we use autopilot). But it would still add *a lot* of tests for example for SDK components. So yes, I'd say running them in the release jenkins would make sense
<mzanetti> asac: as regard to packaging: IMHO a massive waste of time
<mzanetti> asac: those tests are build time tests and rely on the source code file structure. So they also do coverage measurements etc which requires source files in place etc
<mzanetti> that said. I'm not entirely sure what would be the best way to run them in the release jenkins. I would need to think a bit about it
<mzanetti> but I'm sure there would be a nice way (although most likely involving tasks to extend those jenkins jobs with some building capabilities etc)
<asac> mzanetti: i was hoping to use them as a second option for UI testing at image level... could qmltests be used that way at all?
<mzanetti> asac: yes. it would be possible
<asac> (e.g. without mocked backend and with maybe just debug symbols)
<mzanetti> asac: so... for qml only applications (or well, applications which are launched using qmlscene) it's a no brainer. Just use it and it'll work
<mzanetti> asac: for applications that have their own c++ main(), that main() would need to be adjusted in a way that it doesn't do much on their own but just call some other function for initialisation, so we could use QT_TEST_MAIN which just calls the same and then we'd be ready to go
<mzanetti> asac: or maybe we could find a way to load the qmltestrunner stuff in the applications main (for example calling it with --test or the like)
<asac> mzanetti: so we could make our framework that folks dont write main, but ubuntu_main and then have a generic main that does the right thing when run in test env?
<mzanetti> asac: so bottom line is: for qmlscene based apps we could just use it right now. for C++ it'd be a little effort to make it happen, but nothing really critical
<mzanetti> yes.. something like that would work
<asac> mzanetti: so question is if upstream would like writing qmlscene more than autopilots :)?
<asac> and if we also maybe fix a feww flakiness problems
<mzanetti> asac: I'm all for it
<mzanetti> a big fat +1000 actually from me
<asac> i still believe autopilot is needed somewhat, but maybe just to test that the mouse pointer etc. thing
<asac> mzanetti: ok i would suggest that we really play this through by maybe adding a trivial UI test this way to one of our apps
<mzanetti> asac: I guess there are things where AP still has good value. especially for full stack integration testing
<asac> and at best for unity
<asac> mzanetti: right, but we should cover the mass of our UI functions in qmltests as far as i understand
<mzanetti> I'd say yes
<asac> and really just see autopilot as a layer that then also tests things from the mouse pointer level
<mzanetti> asac: qmltestrunner supports mouse interaction quite nicely
<asac> mzanetti: hmm. but you said autopilot would test full stack integration... so what can autopilot test that we cant test in qmltests?
<mzanetti> asac: but it injects events directly into the framework, so you'd bypass e.g. X11 (which is actually where a lot of autopilot's flakyness comes from)
<asac> i hoped the diff is minimal
<asac> ah ok... yeah.
<mzanetti> asac: qmltestrunner could not (easily) do things like this: you set an alarm in the clock app, and then connect to the alarm service to check if everything set up in there
<asac> mzanetti: so assuming everyione has great UI testing coverage that we can run against our images ... can you think of a systematic way to understand what exactly we would need to test on top in autopilot to cover the gaps left with just qml?
<asac> mzanetti: ok i see... are we doing that?
<asac> :)
<mzanetti> asac: you could obviously set the alarm in there and then still check if the whole round-trip has been successful, but not easily to IPC to other processes than the tested one
<asac> yeah. wonder how much we use autopilot that way right now
<mzanetti> asac: just saying... that's the difference and that's where autopilot has more possiblities
<asac> somehow feels we are just doing full roundtrip atm
<asac> (in AP)
<mzanetti> asac: yes. see my mail on the phablet mailing list a while back
<mzanetti> lemme search
<asac> maybe autopilot could collaborate with qmltest?
<asac> e.g. drive UI through qmltest, but then also add logic like this on top?
<asac> mzanetti: whats the output format of junit? is that compatible with our autopilot format?
<mzanetti> asac: would need to think more about combining both...
<mzanetti> asac: re output format:
<mzanetti>  -txt                : Output results in Plain Text
<mzanetti>  -xunitxml           : Output results as XML XUnit document
<mzanetti>  -xml                : Output results as XML document
<mzanetti>  -lightxml
<asac> ok. guess AP uses junit?
<mzanetti> I think it's just the same. let me search for a jenkins job with an example
 * asac notes down to talk to bfiller and sergio next
<totos> Hello, I am thinking of buying a Nexus 10, to use it for simple tasks like web browsing and reading books. Is there a nexus 10 that is more stable than the others with the ubuntu touch installed?
<mzanetti> asac: can't find a real xml file as jenkins seems to parse them and just show data in the website: e.g. http://s-jenkins:8080/job/unity-phablet-qmluitests-trusty/596/testReport/
<mzanetti> asac: anyways, that means jenkins is fine with the output format
<totos> I have read on the internet, that nexus exynos plays well with ubuntu touch.
<asac> tdaitx__: nexus exynos? N4?
<asac> totos: ^ ?
<asac> (sorry tdaitx__ )
<totos> asac: Nexus exynos isn't supported for 10 inches? My bad...
<ogra_> nexus 10 is supported ... but it is a lot more buggy than i.e. the nexus 4
<ogra_> we only start to focus on tablets this cycle
<totos> ogra_: so is any installation of ubuntu to nexus 10, that is less buggy than the others?
<ogra_> no, its all the same
<totos> ogra_: nice, thanks.
<t1mp> when I phablet-flash ubuntu-system, without options, I get INFO:phablet-flash:Pushing /home/tim/Downloads/phablet-flash/imageupdates/stable/maguro/version-100.tar.xz to /cache/recovery/
<t1mp> is that correct? that version-100 file has a timestamp of October
<ogra_> t1mp, yes, thats correct ... you are flashing stable/saucy if you dont pick a different channel
<t1mp> normally I use --channel trusty-proposed
<t1mp> ogra_: I guess what I want now is trusty. Is there a way to see which channels are available?
<ogra_> t1mp, --list-channels is in sergios new go based flash tool, but thats not ready yet ...
<ogra_> stable = saucy, stable-proposed = saucy-proposed, devel = trusty, devel-proposed = trusty-proposed.... on release day trusty will become stable and the U release will become devel ...
<t1mp> ogra_: great, thanks :)
<ogra_> i would suggest to stay away from release names and just stick with devel or stable ;) using devel will acutally get you a somewhat rolling release (since the name underneath will just change at release day)
<t1mp> ok
<sasi> hi
<sasi> can any one please guide porting steps of ubuntu-touch on to arm cortex A9 processor
<ogra_> see the channel topic, there is a link to the porting guide
<sasi> Hi orga i didnt found any link to the porting guide can u please post it over here
<cwayne> mardy: ping
<popey> sasi: look in the /topic of this channel
<popey> | Porting guide (advanced) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Porting |
<ogra_> and if you dont typo my nickname i actually get a notification ;)
<sasi> hi popey thanks for your information, i'm new to this.. can you please guide me how to look in /topic of this channel
<sasi> popey: hi popey thanks for your information, i'm new to this.. can you please guide me how to look in /topic of this channel
<popey> sasi: its at the top of your browser window
<sasi> popey: sorry i can't able to find it. i can only see "Status" and "#ubuntu-touch" can you please help me
<popey> i pasted it
<popey> 13:32:10 < popey> | Porting guide (advanced) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Porting |
<popey> that link
<sasi> popey: i am asking about /topic, where can i find this
<popey> sasi: if you're using some kind of web based irc client it should be on screen somewhere in your browser window
<popey> it starts "Ubuntu Touch Support & Discussion... "
<sasi> popey: ok fine thanq
<t1mp> sasi: what happens when you type "/topic" in the same box where you type your chat messages?
<sasi> t1mp: i didnt understood about "/topic" clearly. as i came to know that i am in "Ubuntu Touch Support & Discussion... " i think this indicates "/topic"
<rsalveti> ogra_: janimo`: adding x86 images into cdimage should be easy now, after I added support for goldfish
<janimo`> rsalveti, great
<ogra_> rsalveti, goldfish only affected subarches
<rsalveti> ogra_: right, but I changed that code in a way that it makes way easier to support a new arch
<ogra_> we need to change the toplevel arches and make sure only the zip and tgz are published for it)
<rsalveti> right
<ogra_> it *might* even just work and we could possibly just add i386 to default-arches for touch
<ogra_> since the file schema for zip and tgz should be the same (modulo the arch name) ...
<rsalveti> atm we'd only publish the zip file, right?
<rsalveti> we actually need to change a few things in there, as the piece that generates the zip file is still armhf specific
<rsalveti> we need a x86 compatible updater-script in the zip file
<pitti> is there a standard way to run "make test" or "ctest" during package build?
<pitti> or do I need to put in the full override_dh_auto_test / check for "nocheck" / call ctest dance?
<barry> ogra_: can't that be easily retried?
<barry> ogra_: *can
<ogra_> no idea, ask in #ubuntu-release
<ogra_> rsalveti, oh, right
<ogra_> rsalveti, hmm, the zip *creation* should be arch agnostic ... we just need the other binary ... but then ... we dont have android bits anyway yet, we could just go with the tarball for the start
<rsalveti> ogra_: yeah
<bhalu> how to install ubuntu touch on development arm boards
<bhalu> ?
<mardy> cwayne: pong (I'm on holiday and my VM is not running, but if I can help even like this, I'll help gladly :-) )
<mardy> jdstrand: hi! Any ETA for bug 1245903? I'd a branch which depends on that, waiting to merge
<ubot5> bug 1245903 in apparmor-easyprof-ubuntu (Ubuntu) "Online Accounts applications need a couple of more D-Bus interfaces" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1245903
<cwayne> mardy: ah, sorry to barge in on your holiday!  I just wanted to let you know that I've got click-hooks working for account-plugins :D  and was gonna ask if you'd think it 'd make sense to bundle them with u-s-s-o-a or just create a new package
<mardy> cwayne: they should be bundled
<cwayne> mardy: ack, thanks.  now go enjoy your holiday :)
<bhalu>                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          
<bhalu>                                                                                                                          how to install ubuntu touch on development arm boards
<MacSlow> rsalveti, btw... https://code.launchpad.net/~macslow/unity8/fix-1257312
<kenvandine> mpt, ping
<kenvandine> mpt, looking for some clarification on the background panel spec
<mpt> kenvandine, I just removed the scaled-back v1 design, leaving only the original design behind â¦ Did I over-trim?
<kenvandine>  âSame background for bothâ is set, the welcome screen and home screen thumbnails combined should function as a single tappable button"
<kenvandine> not that
<mpt> ah
<kenvandine> i read that as merging them so you only see one
<kenvandine> if it is set to dupe
<kenvandine> but now i'm not sure that what you meant
<kenvandine> note:  i implemented that last night :)
<mpt> kenvandine, you still see both thumbnails, and theyâre in exactly the same positions as they were before, but they are now inside a single button
<mpt> rather than being in separate adjacent buttons
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> mpt, another question
<kenvandine> on the preview page
<kenvandine> you say to make the page and header transparent
<kenvandine> which makes sense
<kenvandine> but the sdk doesn't give us a clean way of doing that
<kenvandine> and it breaks the visual design guidelines
<kenvandine> but i do think it makes sense for a background preview
<kenvandine> maybe hide the header instead of making it transparent?
<mpt> kenvandine, I wouldnât expect it to be in the SDK or the visual design guidelines, because itâs a one-off.
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> so the sdk doesn't give us a clean way of doing it
<mpt> kenvandine, we could hide the header, but then we would still need something to tell you what the screen is for. :-)
<kenvandine> i have a nasty hack that changes the header to transparent
<kenvandine> but it is tricker to change the header text color
<kenvandine> at least i haven't found a way there
<kenvandine> and i have to be careful to change the background color back after previewing is done
<kenvandine> it's nasty :)
<kenvandine> so if we really want this, i think we need to request it to be added to the sdk
<kenvandine> mpt, i could hide the header
<mpt> Maybe itâs a matter of copying, pasting, and tweaking the header code from the SDK implementation?
<kenvandine> and then add some text
<kenvandine> mpt, yeah... but i worry about maintenance
<kenvandine> as they change API
<kenvandine> etc
<mpt> If youâre using your own copy, any API change is irrelevant, right?
<kenvandine> not completely
<kenvandine> depends on how much i copy
<mpt> The worst that can happen is the visual design of the standard header changes, and youâre still using the previous font size or whatever
<kenvandine> we'd have to have our own PageStack
<mpt> whoa, really?
<kenvandine> i think so
<kenvandine> or maybe Page
<kenvandine> but that is still quite a bit
<mpt> Okay, I think a Page with no header should be part of the SDK, at least
<kenvandine> mpt, how about a popover bubble kind of thing?
<kenvandine> mpt, i think i can make it hide the header pretty easily
<kenvandine> or maybe some text above the buttons?
<mpt> kenvandine, could you hide the header and then put some text in the same position and size that header text would be?
<kenvandine> should be able to
<kenvandine> let me see if i can hide the header in a clean way
<mpt> kenvandine, cool, and maybe add a shadow to the text in case that part of the image happens to be white :-)
<kenvandine> the risk there is the visual might become inconsistent if they change the page component
<mpt> Understood. I think that risk is fine.
<kenvandine> mpt, maybe the header area could have a semitransparent black background?
<kenvandine> with white text?
<kenvandine> so it's easier to read
<mpt> kenvandine, that sounds very similar to the original design. :-D
<kenvandine> and you changed it?
<kenvandine>  :)
<mpt> No, I mean the design that's in the spec now
<mpt> Maybe Iâm misunderstanding what youâre suggesting
<davmor2> n
<kenvandine> well that doesn't have a darker header
<kenvandine> making the header area have a background rectangle of black, with opacity of like 0.5
<kenvandine> and the white text
<kenvandine> you can still see the background through it
<mpt> Itâs kinda hard to tell because of the clouds, but I think it is semitransparent black
<mpt> Anyway, yes, that would be good
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> cool
<mpt> Thanks!
<bhalu> how to install ubuntu touch on  arm dev boards?
<ogra_> you would have to port it
<bhalu> ogra: I mean how to port it?
<ogra_> bhalu, see the channel /topic ... there is a url
<ogra_> (to the porting guide)
<mhall119> kenvandine: are you still working on content hub this cycle?
<kenvandine> mhall119, yes
<mhall119> kenvandine: do we have a roadmap on when features should land?  I want to plan the next app showdown for a time when we have new APIs/services to use
<mhall119> olli_: tvoss: who is going to be working on the push notifications API?
<mpt> charles, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bluetooth?action=diff&rev2=35&rev1=34
<kenvandine> mhall119,    https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0As1Fg7XBGWTjdGUtbm0yQUFFYjE2czNVNlVqbXlfTWc&usp=drive_web#gid=0
<olli_> mhall119, client side?
<kenvandine> mhall119, doesn't have eta's though
<mhall119> olli_: yes
<olli_> mhall119, ricmm or somebody on that team
<olli_> mhall119, that's for the implementation
<olli_> the definition is driven by Chipaca
<mhall119> thanks olli_
<mhall119> ricmm: ping me when you have a minute to talk about push notifications
<ricmm> mhall119: hi
<ricmm> sup?
<pmcgowan> mhall119, what a very well constructed ping
<mhall119> pmcgowan: I wouldn't want to start another long email thread
<mhall119> ricmm: hey, I was wondering if we had a roadmap with delivery dates for the push notifications API
<mhall119> ricmm: I'm starting to plan the next app showdown, and I would like to make it late enough that push notifications are available to start using
<mhall119> alright, one more question, who was working on the sensor service and haptics feedback?
<rickspencer3> mhall119, I think that is ChickenCutlass or his team
<ogra_> mhall119, ChickenCutlass wrote usensord ... just needs to be packaged (which is a bit tricky sine it is in go and one of the first go packages we have at all)
<ogra_> mhall119, https://plus.google.com/109707276156531554811/posts/LAoPzq9DZhG
<mhall119> thanks ogra_, rickspencer3
<mhall119> ChickenCutlass: ping me when you have a few minutes to talk about haptics/sensor service roadmap
<ChickenCutlass> mhall119 ok
<mhall119> ChickenCutlass: hey, so I'm starting to plan the next app showdown, and I'd like to time it so that some of the new APIs are available, do you have a roadmap with delivery dates for the work on sensors and haptics
<mhall119> ?
<pitti> can someone please ack https://code.launchpad.net/~thomas-voss/process-cpp/fix_pkgconfig_setup/+merge/198025 ? (blocking sensor testing)
<door> getting a 'checking for auto-deploy.zip auto deploy.zip not found error
<ChickenCutlass> mhall119 so we are trying to land the new sensor service soon.  Like next week.  It will only have haptics implemented.
<mhall119> kenvandine: got time for a couple questions?
<ChickenCutlass> mhall119 still working out the API
<ChickenCutlass> on the Platform API side
<mhall119> ChickenCutlass: do you think by mid-January the API will be available, even if it's just a first version?
<ChickenCutlass> yes
<mhall119> and will it be available in QML from the start?
<ChickenCutlass> of course
<mhall119> perfect, thanks ChickenCutlass
<ChickenCutlass> mhall119 the API will be much like the android one.
<ChickenCutlass> on / off
<ChickenCutlass> and pattern
<mhall119> cool, let me know when it starts to come together and I'll make sure we get the docs published early on
<ChickenCutlass> ok
<door> sorry to interrupt, but is this the right room to discuss installing Ubuntu onto andriod?
<mhall119> door: depends on what you mean
<mhall119> door: are you talking about installing Ubuntu's phone OS on an Android device?
<kenvandine> mhall119, sure
<door> yes
<mhall119> beuno: do we have an ETA on getting ratings and reviews working in the store and dash?
<door> a Nexus 4
<mhall119> door: then you're in the right place
<mhall119> door: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install has instructions for installing it, it's easy if you have Ubuntu on your desktop/laptop, otherwise it's the same as flashing an Android ROM
<mhall119> kenvandine: so the work that an app would need to tell the Content Hub that it can open, say, a PDF, do you think that will land by mid-January?
<door> has anyone heard of / seen the error E: Can't open /cache/recovery/ubuntu_command ?
<kenvandine> mhall119, yes
<jdstrand> mardy: sorry, I didn't know you were blocked (I knew you wanted the fix of course). I'll prioritize for monday
<mhall119> kenvandine: awesome, thanks!
<kenvandine> np
<beuno> mhall119, I refer you to ralsina
<mhall119> ralsina: do we have an ETA on getting ratings and reviews working in the store and dash?
<jdstrand> mardy: I started what I needed to finish before that upload yesterday and have a good handle on it
 * jdstrand wanders off
<mhall119> kenvandine: also, box2d and it's qml plugin are in the trusty archives now, right?
<kenvandine> yes
<mhall119> what do we need to do to make that part of the platform available to click apps?
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> or, it could be bundled in
<kenvandine> which someone did already
<mhall119> hmmm, bundling might be safer for compatibility
<mhall119> kenvandine: could you put together a .tar.gz that somebody could just download and un-pack into their project folder in order to use it?
<kenvandine> seb128, which screen did you think my margins were too big on?
<kenvandine> mhall119, not sure it's that easy... do you know who it was that had bundled it?
<seb128> kenvandine, the grid
<mhall119> nope
<kenvandine> it uses qmake, and our default project templates don't
<kenvandine> i don't think
<mhall119> kenvandine: it was seagull strike, wasn't it?
<kenvandine> ah, yes
<mhall119> Michael Sheldon then
<seb128> kenvandine, compare http://ubuntuone.com/20q4XFO8ZhvbJpxen4ifoR and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Appearance?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=phone-background-welcome.mockup.png
<kenvandine> maybe we can ask him what he did
<kenvandine> seb128, so margins and spacing?
<mhall119> yeah, I'll do that, thanks kenvandine
<kenvandine> mhall119, np!
<seb128> kenvandine, yes
<kenvandine> seb128, can you try out what i just pushed?
<kenvandine> see if you like that better
<kenvandine> it includes all the other changes we talked about earlier
<seb128> kenvandine, building (u-s-s is slow to build nowadays :/)
<seb128> kenvandine, the spacing between column is still at least double of what it should be...
<seb128> kenvandine, http://ubuntuone.com/1AMoi15hjexkImhM9YW4RY
<kenvandine> -        spacing: units.gu(1)
<kenvandine> +        spacing: units.dp(5)
<kenvandine> seb128, try that in WallpaperGrid.qml
<seb128> kenvandine, that's give me much bigger spaces...
<seb128> which is what you would expect from increasing the spacing
<kenvandine> ?
<kenvandine> no
<kenvandine> dp
<kenvandine> not gu
<Elleo> kenvandine / mhall119: I'm Mike Sheldon, what were you wanting to ask?
<seb128> kenvandine, oh!
<seb128> kenvandine, yeah, that looks better ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, even a bit less is better, e.g 3
<mhall119> Elleo: ah, hello!
<mhall119> Elleo: I was wanting to make it easy for app developers to use Box2d in their apps
<mhall119> Elleo: I was wondering how you bundled it with Seagull Strike, and how it worked with the build process
<seb128> kenvandine, in fact deleting the spacing line makes it about right...
<seb128> kenvandine, though margins are bit small then, you might want margins: 3 * spacing or something
<Elleo> mhall119: I basically just did a quick and dirty bundling of it; built qml-box2d, shove libBox2D and a qmldir definition in my package and set added it to the QML plugin include path from C++
<mhall119> Elleo: how/where did you build it? on an arm device or using cross-compiling?
<Elleo> mhall119: just on-device
<Blackwizard> Hi
<mhall119> Elleo: ok
<Elleo> I do have a scratchbox environment setup for some arm dev, but it targets armv6
<mhall119> Elleo: are the files you used for this available somewhere I can download them?
<Blackwizard> How can I find tablets support ubuntu touch?
<Elleo> mhall119: https://gitorious.org/qml-box2d/qml-box2d/ <-- you'll want the qt5 branch
<Elleo> should build without any real difficulties
<mhall119> Blackwizard: the original Nexus 7 and Nexus 10 are the only officially supported tablets at this time
<mhall119> thanks Elleo!
<kenvandine> seb128, spacing defaults to 0, so that breaks some of the calculations a bit
<Elleo> mhall119: one thing I noticed that might cause you issues is that qmlscene on UT doesn't seem to support custom plugin paths, it's --help claims it has the option, but it then doesn't recognise it when you try to use it
<kenvandine> but i can make it real small :)
<Blackwizard> what about Samsung Note 8
<Elleo> and iirc the .desktop launcher doesn't like environment variables being set in the Exec line
<mhall119> Elleo: using -I ?
<Elleo> yeah
<seb128> kenvandine, well, even at 0 it's more spacing than the mockup, that's weird
<mhall119> hmmm, ok, I'll check on that, thanks again
<Elleo> no problem
<kenvandine> seb128, some of that is the itemWidth i use, to allow room for the border on the current image
<kenvandine> seb128, the design shows that border larger than the thumb
<seb128> kenvandine, I see
<Blackwizard> Does Samsung Note 8 Supports Ubuntu touch?
<kenvandine> seb128, try now :)
<ralsina> mhall119: maybe a week or two. Paul Liu is working on it and ran into some snags.
<seb128> kenvandine, the spacing being previews look fine ;-) the margins on the left/right of the grid should be more though (the mockup has those on the right of the titles)
<davmor2> Blackwizard: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<Blackwizard> tnx
<Blackwizard> :D
<mhall119> ralsina: by mid-January do you think we'll have an API developers can start using?
<mhall119> oh wait, that's R&R, ignore that comment
<ralsina> mhall119: well, the API is there for creating ratings and reviews, what's not done yet is showing/creating them from the dash
<mhall119> thanks ralsina
<ralsina> mhall119: right
<mhall119> alex-abreu: are we still on trach to have a unified HTML5 template & plugin by end of December?
<mhall119> alex-abreu: also, any idea when Ubuntu will be added to http://cordova.apache.org/docs/en/edge/guide_platforms_index.md.html#Platform%20Guides ?
<om26er> when does the next image build ?
<blmvxer> Hello guys, I am running Ubuntu 14.04 Touch on my Nexus 7(2012) and have a craked screen where the upper half is dead. is there anyway to rotate only while being inside an app?
<airking> So I think I got the issue where the battery won't charge on my Nexus 4
<airking> What can be done to fix this?
<cyphermox> airking: does anything show up in dmesg or /var/log/syslog when it's plugged?
<airking> I tried adb devices
<airking> no dice
<airking> let me try again
<airking> nope
<airking> A couple minutes ago, when switching from wall power to pc, I got the little red light to turn on, and the screen light up with the charging logo (battery with lightning bolt), but then I accidentally unplugged the USB, and haven't been able to get that back.
<airking> cyphermox: What else should I try?  Is there anything else I can do?
<airking> ifI hold down voldown+power a little red light comes on
<airking> It's on!
<cyphermox> airking: right, it's just very low battery you need to wait for it to charge
#ubuntu-touch 2013-12-07
<lops> good morning. anyone knows where I can find toolbar icons for ubuntu touch? the oficial list is rather small
<daker> lops: you mean the svg ?
<lops> i don't know if it's SVG or what
<lops> http://design.ubuntu.com/brand/pictograms
<lops> but i was talking about this list
<lops> there are no app icons here, like add, edit, etc, that we see in the examples
<omac> From the browser I can play opus media, http://adequatech.ca/howDareYouDemicatRemix.opus
<omac> but when the ubuntu phone goes into power saving mode, the actual song does some funky sound chunk repetition and then stops playing.
<daker> omac: it has been reported bug 1249586
<ubot5> bug 1249586 in webbrowser-app "music stops on minimizing browser app" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1249586
<omac> thanks.
<omac> playing opus files from browser is very cool.
<lops> the other day someone told me but i forgot. In what directory are apps supposed to be installed in UT?
<grantbow> neither soft keyboard nor usb hardware keyboard allows me to press return on today's grouper daily image. Any suggestions?
<grantbow> fyi,
<grantbow> fyi, 'adb shell' worked around no soft or usb hardware keyboard allowing a return key press
<grantbow> on today's image
<blacksheepharley> once  i setup touch on a galaxy tab, what are the next steps after fixing the display and wifi?
<blacksheepharley> do i setup an account?
<blacksheepharley> i have wifi connected - can i get updates to the last updated version of 2013-04-09/
<blacksheepharley> ?
<Aang> Hello
<Aang> Is there anybody here
<jdorleans> Hey guys, I've been working on a puzzle game for ubuntu touch and I'm facing some issues with animations. The problem seems to occurs when GridView animations (add, move, remove...) play too fast.
<jdorleans> Something like that it is explained here: http://qt-project.org/doc/qt-5.0/qtquick/qml-qtquick2-viewtransition.html#handling-interrupted-animations
<jdorleans> I've been trying to solve that issue, but without success... I'd love any help on that. Is there any QML Ninja could help me ?
<jdorleans> links:
<jdorleans> There is an early presentation of this game here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1-V52DWwYk
<jdorleans> The source code is on GitHub: https://github.com/jdorleans/matching-tux
<lops> guys, I still can't install my cpp app in UT :/ all the files seems to have been installed in the right directories, but nothing appears in the dash
<lops> i ran pkcon install-local as phablet user. what could I possibly be doing wrong?
<lops> also, the app runs OK if I run it via terminal, but touch doesn't work on it (because the terminal keeps the focus)
<randomcpp> hi lops :)
<randomcpp> try rebooting the phone or pkill unity8
<randomcpp> (I suggest the former)
<randomcpp> also, have you created a proper .desktop file for your app?
<j0chn> Hi there
<j0chn> I need some help installin gubuntu touch on my galaxy nexus
<lops> Hi randomcpp :)
<lops> i tried restarting the phone, to no avail. i have a desktop file, not sure it's proper
<lops> but i was hoping that it would at least show up in the dash even if it didn't run or something was missing
<j0chn> My device is detected and I can start installation  with "phablet-flash ubuntu-system --no-backup"
<j0chn> but than the phone is in the bootloader and the terminal is waitin gfor the device
<lops> oh crap. my desktop file has an incorrect exec x_x
<j0chn> and nothuing happens
<untitled1> Hello there I have a Read-Only File system on my Touch and would like to make it so I do not.  I tried s to remount as readable and writable but it will not work.  Any tips ?
<j0chn> it happens with and without sudo
<untitled1> I can not use Apt or well a lot.  error is
<untitled1> $ adb shell  root@ubuntu-phablet:/# sudo mount -o rw,remount / mount: cannot remount block device /dev/root read-write, is write-protected
<untitled1> Here is fdisk  and error http://pastebin.com/RJ4rPFf3
<untitled1> dmesg errors :  [    3.625576] EXT2-fs (loop1): error: couldn't mount because of unsupported optional features (40)
<popey> untitled1: if you make it read/write you will lose the ability to do over the air updates
<popey> adb shell touch /userdata/.writable_image
<popey> thats how you make it RW, then reboot
<untitled1> thanks popey  is there a way to reverse the effect ? just mv   /userdata/.writable_image /userdata/.writable_image.bak    ?
<popey> not sure you can reverse it
<popey> as soon as you make it writable, you lose OTA updates
<popey> so have to reflash to go back
<untitled1> popey:  thanks again,  I guess I will get the scale out and think about the pros and cons.
<untitled1> I want to do some build-deps
<untitled1> for a couple of apps that I am making.
<il-98-ya> hi guys, do you know, when is ubuntu touch will be supported by nexus 7 2013?
<popey> il-98-ya: no, we don't
<il-98-ya> popey, it is very sad news :(
<untitled1> Thanks again popey,  Now I can install cowsay :)
<popey> hah
<popey> il-98-ya: not really. I'm sure someone will port it soon, just not done yet
<il-98-ya> popey, i hope :)
<lops> tis there no way to tell unity to run an app from the terminal?
<popey> lops: you can, yes.
<popey> using upstart... start application APP_ID=<application_id> where application_id is the name of the desktop file without .desktop
<lops> thx popey
<lops> popey, it worked, but the app doesn't open on my phone, unfortunately.
<popey> are you running it as phablet user?
<popey> adb shell
<lops> wait! if I do 'start application APP_ID=mediaplayer-app' it works :O
<popey> sudo -u phablet -i
<lops> so it must be something wrong with my app. fianlly a clue! TT__TT
<lops> thank you popey
<popey> check logs in /home/phablet/.cache/upstart
<lops> ok
<lops> hm, when I create a click package, my manifest and json should have a fuly qualified name? oO
<lops> ok nvm, seems to be a letter case problem :S
<jdorleans> Hi everybody... could you help me on that problem: http://askubuntu.com/questions/387456/puzzle-game-qml-gridview-animation-problems
<lops> ugh, my log says "ERROR: Unable to find keyfile for application "
<lops> what on earth is a keyfile? apps are encrypted?
<lops> Â«Unable to parse App IDÂ» -.-
<popey> lops: what was the app_id you passed?
<lops> start application APP_ID=com.ubuntu.deloper.apps.stockportfolio_0.1
<lops> popey, here (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/TouchTesting) they use the name of the app "filemanager" twice. why?
<lops> like " start application APP_ID=com.ubuntu.filemanager_filemanager_${version} "
<lops> if i try to reapeat the name like that i get "WARNING **: Manifest 'com.ubuntu.developer.lops.stockportfolio' doesn't have the application 'stockportfolio' defined"
<lops> and "Desktop file unable to be found"
<popey> lops: its the desktop file without the .desktop on the end
<lops> without the version number?
<popey> with i think, i dont have my phone with me
<lops> my desktop file only has the app name, without the com.ubuntu.etc stuff.
<CarbonRink> How often is a new release coming out for the Nexus 7?
<CarbonRink> anyone?
<popey> -rw-r--r--  1 phablet phablet  521 Dec  6 11:14 org.sambull.bitcoin-app_bitcoin-app_0.3.2.1.desktop
<popey> lops: thats what a typical .desktop file looks like
<popey> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ start application APP_ID=org.sambull.bitcoin-app_bitcoin-app_0.3.2.1
<popey> application start/running, process 9025
<popey> the app is running
<lops> i see.
<popey> http://popey.com/~alan/phablet/device-2013-12-07-184236.png
<popey> ^^ the app running
<lops> popey, what about the other files in the package? the json, etc?
<lops> should they all be maned like that?
<popey> manifest.json should be called exactly that
<lops> k
<popey> and <appname>.json should be like... ubuntu-clock-app.json
 * popey goes back to decorating xmas tree
<lops> short name then.
<lops> aha, have fun :)
<lops> I should get a christmas tree. my dorm room is so lame
<lops> omg. oh my god. it finally worked. POPEY I LOVE YOU. EVERYONE IN #ubuntu-touch, I LOVE YOU GUYS. I'M LITERALLY CRYING
 * popey hugs lops 
<j0chn> hi there
<j0chn> I have a problem with my galaxy nexus
<j0chn> Today I was abel to connect it to my PC (Ubuntu 12.04) twice.
<j0chn> But suddenly it is not recognized by Ubuntu
<j0chn> USB Debugging is turned on and reseted
<j0chn> I don't know what to do I restarted the PC initialized the nexus
<j0chn> And it already worked but suddenly it does not
<iBelieve> popey: ping
<j0chn> No one?
<j0chn> might it be a problem because i created an android rule?
<iBelieve> j0chn: Is this running Ubuntu Touch or just Android? If its just Android, you'll be better off asking in #ubuntu.
<iBelieve> j0chn: If you're running Ubuntu Touch on your Nexus, you'll get better results asking during the European working day.
<j0chn> it is android 4.3 running on the phone and I want to install ubuntu touch
<j0chn> IBelieve:
<j0chn> I was able to start flashing Ubutnu Touch and got a probem
<j0chn> The Device rebooted to Bootloader and stayed there and the terminal was waiting for my device
<j0chn> The installation how to says to restart flashing with sudo (I did so) but it did not work too
<iBelieve> j0chn: sorry, I'm not familiar with how the installation process works. You could try emailing the ubuntu-phone mailing list (ubuntu-phone@lists.launchpad.net) if you don't get help here today.
<j0chn> Okay. Thank you!
<daker> why do you guys keep breaking my app :(
<daker> (qmlscene:13227): dconf-CRITICAL **: unable to create file '/run/user/32011/dconf/user': Permission denied.  dconf will not work properly.
<uscell> Can anyone here tell me if installing Ubuntu Touch 1.0 is possible on my US Cellular Samsung Galaxy s2?
<popey> !devices | uscell
<ubot5> uscell: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<popey> is it on that list?
<uscell> Samsung Galaxy S2 (GT-I9100) is on the list
<uscell> yall are sure helpful
<uscell> If I could find it on the wiki I wouldnt be here...
<bkc_> hi, anyone have a vagrantfile for the dev-env?
<daker> bkc_: vagrantfile for what ?
<bkc_> for the development environment
<bkc_> i.e. Ubuntu with UbuntuTouch toolchain setup
<daker> bkc_: there is not vagrantfile for that, just instructions http://developer.ubuntu.com/apps/create/get-the-sdk/
<bkc_> :/
<bkc_> not the ubuntu-sdk, the toolchain for building ubuntu-touch images
<bkc_> I can install a VM manually, just wondered if there was one available already
<bkc_> well, never written a vagrantfile before, might as well give it a try
<daker> bkc_: sorry i can't help with that
<lops> hm, anyone knows how to set the mainview to fill the screen? the mainview doesn't have a parent so..
<popey> fill completely? no indicator panel at the top?
<lops> no, no. I was using a fixed with for my main view
<lops> width: units.gu(66)     height: units.gu(106)
<lops> and in the children pages they were using fill parent
<lops> but i want it to just be resolution independent :S
<daker> popey: can you please review "Rad.io" update ?
<popey> sure thing
<popey> daker: approved
<popey> daker: http://popey.com/~alan/phablet/device-2013-12-07-221001.png
<daker> popey: thanks
<popey> clicked by category, holiday, and tried vibe.fm - the non-stop christmas station
<popey> it says "loading playlist"
<popey> thats it
<popey> QSqlDatabasePrivate::database: unable to open database: "out of memory Error opening database"
<popey> daker: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6537556/
<daker> popey: yeah maybe something changed
<daker> (qmlscene:13227): dconf-CRITICAL **: unable to create file '/run/user/32011/dconf/user': Permission denied.  dconf will not work properly.
<daker> the update manager give black screen for me
<lops> sweet, there's a rad.io app?
<daker> lops: not rd.io and not http://www.rad.io :) a smiliar thing
<lops> aha. i see.
<lops> well, makes sense, since r.dio charges for their mobile app
<daker> and the service is limited
<lops> the other day someone on reddit was complaining about the friends app being blue
<daker> hhh
<popey> patches welcome ã
<lops> i can see how some people might dislike it, but i kinda like it. and your rad.io background color too
<daker> popey: they are using qt 5.2 now ?
<popey> daker: not yet
<daker> popey: ok
<daker> i am also seeing : shm_open() failed: Permission non accordÃ©e
<iamsvkris> hey!, i am a newbie in ubuntu app development. I am going through the tutorials in developer.ubuntu.com. The thing is when i created a sample ubuntu-htmui project, no .qml file is being created as explained in the tutorial. Not even app.js file is being created. my qt creater version is 2.8.1 and it is based on qt 5.0.2
<iamsvkris> this screenshot shows my project structure
<iamsvkris> http://imgur.com/oxeBzQ6
<iamsvkris> Somebody please help me!
<lops> didn't try HTML5 yet, but i did find QML to be much easier than HTML. less hassle to code
#ubuntu-touch 2013-12-08
<JamesTait> Is anyone else getting a segfault when launching bitcoin-app from the click store?
<szymon_w> hi! any idea where is data stored for ubuntu one account on UT ? I removed my u1 account through settings/accounts/ubuntuOne/remove and now I can not add it back...
<lops> guy, anyone around? i'm using adb shell and the command "start" is unkown to phablet, but root knows it. Why would that happen? It workd fine a couple hours ago :S
<lops> ugh. was missing the -i from 'sudo -i -u phablet
<FuLgOrE> good morning
<FuLgOrE> I subscribed to the ubuntu touch mail distribution list on launchpad but some thinks don't work. Can anybody tell me, how to reply on mails? Thunderbird guides me to "ubuntu-phone@lists.launchpad.net" but I cannot find my answer on the launchpad webpage. Any ideas what could have happened?
<FuLgOrE> -k+g
<Farid> Hi
<Farid> Is there any ubuntu for COBY MID9042?
<trutzzi> Good morning all!
<trutzzi> I want to know if Ubuntu run on Galaxy S2 ? (ANDROID 4.1.2) ?
<j0chn> Hi there.
<j0chn> I got a problem flashing my phone with ubuntu touch
<j0chn> The phone is in bootload and terminal is waitin gfpr device
<j0chn> The tutorial does not provide any help in this case
<trutzzi> j0chn, what device do you have?
<j0chn> It is a Galaxy Nexus with Android 4.3
<trutzzi> you know if can run on galaxy s2 i9100?
<j0chn> I already had it on i9100 ;)
<trutzzi> tell me more about it
<trutzzi> can make calls, camera work ?
<j0chn> well I just installed and started it. Then I had problem using it and reflashed to android. So I can't do any comments
<trutzzi> and now you try it on nexus?
<j0chn> Yes. Because I like to try new things. But with my i9100 was the problem taht it is my main device. And if I can't handle it I don't want it
<j0chn> And the Nexus is "free" so I want to test it on it because I don't really need it.
<trutzzi> i know what it mine principal phone
<trutzzi> i had try 4.3 on galaxy s2... i was in a trip and have really bugs and problems
<j0chn> Well, you can't tell me what to do when the device is in bootloader and temrinal is waiting fpr deviceáº
<trutzzi> you have clockwise and backup?
<j0chn> Backup: no clockwise = recovrey mode tool ? : twrp
<aquarius> I believe the Ubuntu touch  keyboard is Maliit, yes? Can I customise the layout without recompiling? The base maliit keyboard comes with a bunch of plugins to actually do the hard work, some of which are QML (yay!) and some C++, and I don't know how to find out which Ubuntu is using...
<Ploppz> At what stage of development is ubuntu for phone yet? Release?
<Ploppz> "Developer Preview" it seems
<Ploppz> When will the release be?
<Ploppz> Oh, will there be something similar to WINE to run foreign apps?
<j0chn> hi there
<j0chn> I want to add my google and ubuntuone account on ubuntu touch but every time the login disappears to account overview
<j0chn> is there an users manual ?
<|80N35|> Hello, all ^_^
<|80N35|> I think I may have the wrong device...
<|80N35|> Here's my error:
<|80N35|> INFO:phablet-flash:Device detected as toro
<|80N35|> ERROR:phablet-flash:Unsupported device, autodetect fails device
<|80N35|> Was the eBay listing wrong?
<popey> |80N35|: that's the CMDA version isn't it?
<|80N35|> What do you mean, Sir?
<popey> toro is the CDMA version of the Samsung Galaxy nexus
<popey> maguro is the GSM and HSPA version of the Samsung Galaxy nexus
<|80N35|> Why would it list that as an error?
<popey> we only support the GSM version, not the CDMA version
<|80N35|> So I bought the wrong phone?
<popey> I guess.
<|80N35|> Nice phone...  :)
<|80N35|> Kinda bummed, though.
<Ploppz> I will repeat; I asked earlier when release date of Ubuntu Touch is/what stage of development is it currently at? And will there be something similar to WINE to run foreign programs?
<bkc_> define "foreign apps" ?
<|80N35|> Thanks for the answer, popey.
<popey> Ploppz: its under development
<popey> do you have specific questions about functionality
<popey> ?
<bkc_> popey: "will there be something similar to WINE to run foreign apps?"
<bkc_> not really sure what he means with "foreign apps" though
<popey> indeed
<popey> hence my question â»
<Ploppz> Like apps that are made for andriod and other operating systems
<|80N35|> Take care, everybody.  Thank you, again.
<popey> We dont currently have plans to do that, no.
<Ploppz> Okay. Wondering how the app repo will be (does it work like a repo?)
<popey> there's a store from which you can install apps
<popey> that works already
<popey> we'll add the ability for people to add proprietary paid apps soon, currently only free apps are supported
<Ploppz> Are there a lot of people working on apps? Would be nice to be able to use common apps like facebook, imgur, snapchat...
<popey> there are imgur and facebook webapps
<bkc_> iOS would be next to impossible.. Android might be do-able...
<Ploppz> What do you mean, bkc_ ?
<Ploppz> WINE?
<bkc_> what does wie have to do with it? wine is for Windows-apps...
<Ploppz> Yeah but my wine question then, that's what I'm referring to.
<Ploppz> ANDE
<popey> we could certainly potentially add the ability to run android apps in the future
<bkc_> you'd have to implement the SW-stack for <insert-os-here> similar to what wine does for windows, yes...
<popey> I don't know if that's the direction we want to go in
<Ploppz> Ah, well, ubuntu touch looks rather awesome
<popey> It is. â»
<bkc_> since Androids stack is open source (afaik) it would be fairly easy to implement a java-stack for it... but iOS is closed, hence it would require reverse-enginnering to implement that...
<bkc_> and you'd get bitch-slapped by Apple if you'd release it
<bkc_> not sure how Google stands on terms with UbuntuTouch, so no clue there
<bkc_> anything else (read windows, os x) isn't feasable, since that would require much more than just wine...
<Ploppz> Ah, personally I don't care about iOS :D
<bkc_> neither do I, but you didn't specify ;)
<Ploppz> Well if it's doable I guess, at some time, someone will do it
<bkc_> Android is definitively doable, otherwise the android-simulator wouldn't work ;)
<BillyZane> what's the prospect of having ubuntu touch for nexus 5
<BillyZane> i notice on the nexus status spreadsheet, nexus 5 is not even listed
#ubuntu-touch 2014-12-01
<shiggitay> herro
<shiggitay> rsalveti, r u here
<josePHPagoda> hello everyone!  I'm wondering if there is a way to configure ubuntu to send mouse click events rather than touch screen events?
<RAOF> josePHPagoda: It does (on the desktop). On the phone, no.
<lotuspsychje> RAOF: is there a trick to get it working on older games for desktop?
<RAOF> On the desktop it should just work; on the phone, urgh.
<RAOF> Pointer emulation is hard.
<lotuspsychje> RAOF: it doesnt recognize touch in his older games
<RAOF> On the desktop? Odd.
<lotuspsychje> he's on 14.04 desktop yes
<RAOF> Note: by âon the desktopâ I mean, âIn Xâ.
<RAOF> Hm.
<lotuspsychje> yes, he has lenovo touch laptop
<lotuspsychje> josePHPagoda: you still here mate?
<RAOF> Pointer emulation is working here on my hilariously unconfigured touchscreen.
<lotuspsychje> lol
<RAOF> (Hilariously unconfigured because the input is mapped to the whole of my multi-monitor desktop, not just the actual touch display)
<lotuspsychje> nice
<lotuspsychje> what a world would be without ubuntu :p
<RAOF> In our defence, Windows 8 maps it to the _wrong_ monitor, which is equally hilarious.
<lotuspsychje> josePHPagoda: waky waky, tell RAOF your issue
<lotuspsychje> win8 is such a joke, in every way
<lotuspsychje> i helped more then 30 people with installing ubuntu on eufi machines already
<lotuspsychje> uefi
<josePHPagoda> hi raof
<josePHPagoda> sry, was on the phone
<josePHPagoda> ubuntu won't run on my machine with uefi :(
<josePHPagoda> i have to use the good old bios
<josePHPagoda> lotuspsychje: it's a touch desktop
<josePHPagoda> but yeah, sdl will recognize that the mouse moved
<josePHPagoda> but it doesn't get a mouse click event
<josePHPagoda> which is fine, that's how it should work
<josePHPagoda> but I was hoping there was a way to configure it so that mouse click events are sent instead
<josePHPagoda> RAOF: ^
<RAOF> Ah.
<RAOF> Yeah, the touchscreen driver doesn't do tap-to-click.
<josePHPagoda> i realize that :)
<josePHPagoda> so no way to change it?
<RAOF> It doesn't have code to do tap-to-click.
<RAOF> There's obviously a way to change that - copy the tap-to-click state machine from xf86-input-synaptics - but there's no configuration option you can cheaply twiddle.
<Psykus> tried installing ubuntu touch devel channel to nexus 7 2013, ran the ubuntu-device-flash tool and it downloaded/installed a few things then my device rebooted to the google logo and is just sitting there. any ideas?
<dholbach> good morning
<mihir> dholbach: morning :)
<dholbach> hey mihir
<mihir> hey what's up ?
<dholbach> life's good - just had a nice weekend - how about you?
<shiggitay> hmm I guess Mr rsalveti isn't around :(
<Psykus> so ubuntu touch doesn't work with bluetooth keyboards?
<popey> Psykus: it should, but currently it's limited to only audio device pairing.  I believe that will be changed soon enough
<Psykus> ahh okay. thanks. also looks like they never released a ubuntu desktop build for the 2013 nexus 7, was curious to check that out
<popey> Psykus: yeah, we never did
<Psykus> hope to see some sort of desktop option eventually, I kind of like how you can hop between the two in windows 8
<shiggitay> Help me spread this around: http://www.gofundme.com/shiggity_EL2015
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy Day With(out) Art Day! :-D
<shiggitay> heh
<shiggitay> Happy December too
<popey> dbarth_: I'm getting apparmor denials in twtter webapp...
<popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/9327984/
<popey> dbarth_: ^
<dbarth_> popey: hi
<dbarth_> popey: the app still works?
<popey> yes
<dbarth_> popey: the cpu one is harmless, the qml cache is new
<dbarth_> popey: thanks i'll report the bug to jamie
<popey> kk
<dbarth_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apparmor-easyprof-ubuntu/+bug/1397912
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1397912 in webbrowser-app "[webapp-container] apparmor denies access to QML cache" [Medium,Triaged]
<rsalveti> shiggitay: hey, what's up?
<shiggitay> hey any progress on UT for the N5? I have a devel build installed via MultiROM but it's not really ready for primetime yet
<shiggitay> rsalveti,
<shiggitay> I have no problems with backing up my Android install (on Lollipop now) and reinstalling with UT as the only OS to help test :)
<shiggitay> not now though as I need to get to bed. I work at 3pm US Eastern
<rsalveti> shiggitay: will check later this week, last time I tried it on my n5 was a few weeks ago
<rsalveti> mostly focused on finishing rtm lately
<shiggitay> rtm for what?
<shiggitay> N7/10?
<bzoltan_> mvo: So it seems that your MR should target the https://code.launchpad.net/~oxide-developers/oxide/packaging.vivid
<bzoltan_> mvo:  and not the  lp:oxide
<shiggitay> rsalveti,
<rsalveti> shiggitay: rtm in general, for the devices we support, but as that is mostly done we're starting to get vivid into shape again
<rsalveti> so will give that another try with n5 this week
<shiggitay> okay cool
<shiggitay> thanks.
 * shiggitay goes to bed
<rsalveti> have a good night!
<shiggitay> heh really a nap but thanks :)
 * shiggitay disappears
<rickspencer3> does anyone know if the contacts.db has changed location?
<rickspencer3> I noticed that the last few contacts that I saved are in /home/phablet/.local/share/evolution/addressbook/rick.spencer@canonical.com instead of /home/phablet/.local/share/evolution/addressbook/system
<weeman1337> Hello there, I've a scope dev question! Anyone there who can help?
<rickspencer3> weeman1337, you might try #ubuntu-app-devel
<weeman1337> rickspencer3, I'll try, thanks!
<bzoltan> chrisccoulson: ping
<cwayne> janimo: so i finally got my phone to power on again, still cant get cm i built booted though :/
<jgdx> Is there something wrong with #45? (I've been away for a week, so I'm not quite up to speed).
<jgdx> I'm getting frequent crashes from mediahub, lightdm and the compositor.
<kenvandine> mardy, trust session question
<kenvandine> mardy, how do you get the windowId from the requesting app?  is upstart involved at all?
<mardy> kenvandine: the windowId is the PID
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> cool
<mardy> kenvandine: there are two ways: either the client library calls getpid() and passes that info, or the service-side can ask DBus for it
<kenvandine> got it
<kenvandine> thanks
<kenvandine> so i would actually create the session after the destination app starts right?
<kenvandine> for content-hub
<kenvandine> so essentially after it starts, i would grab the pid and create the session?
<kenvandine> i can't start the app as part of a session?
<rickspencer3> bfiller,  I copied my old contacts.db and photos/ into a newly wiped phone
<rickspencer3> the stuff from system/ worked
<mardy> kenvandine: ah, sorry, I thought you were talking about the starting app
<rickspencer3> but for some reason I had recent contacts.db and photos/  saved in <myemailaddress>.com/
<rickspencer3> so, the contacts saved there aren't showing up in my contacts app
<rickspencer3> thoughts?
<mardy> kenvandine: no, then it works differently: when you create the trusted session, you can create fd's
<kenvandine> so i want to create the session in the service
<kenvandine> which would connect the app requesting the transfer and the app it starts
<mardy> kenvandine: then, if you start a process with the MIR_SOCKET environment variable set to that fd, the new application will be started within the session
<kenvandine> cool!
<kenvandine> so your code doesn't do that :)
<mardy> kenvandine: it does :-)
<kenvandine> oh...
<mardy> kenvandine: see requestSocket() in mir-helper.cpp, and see how the result is used
<mardy> kenvandine: in ui-proxy.cpp
<bfiller> rickspencer3: in a meeting, will ping you when done
<rickspencer3> thanks bfiller
<kenvandine> mardy, does MIR_SOCKET get wiped by upstart?  maybe i need an untrusted helper to start the dest
<mardy> kenvandine: yes, I think you need an untrusted helper
<mardy> kenvandine: in this branch I'm using it: https://code.launchpad.net/~mardy/ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts/click-plugins
<zbenjamin> ogra_: ping, are there any news about gdbserver on the image? Seems it did not get in yet
<ogra_> hmm, i thought it was added to the seeds at some point
<zbenjamin> ogra_: or should a developer make his rootfs writeable and install it manually?
<zbenjamin> ogra_: yeah i think we even created a bug for that
<zbenjamin> but i can not find it anymore
<Kris_> Hello?
<Kris_> is anyone there?
<Kris_> ls -a
<popey> there are 280 odd people here.
<Kris_> oh.....
<Kris_> so do any of you 280 people know how to install Ubuntu touch on a kindle fire?
<popey> !devices | Kris_
<ubot5> Kris_: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<popey> is it in that list?
<Kris_> in the working ports
<Kris_> and what if i want to just install ubuntu
<Kris_> with unity 7
<Kris_> or 8
<Kris_> ?
<ogra_> it will most likely not run unless you write your own free accelerated graphics driver
<Kris_> how would i do that?
<dobey> is kindle fire a tegra machine too?
<Kris_> no
<bfiller> rickspencer3: stuff showing up under .local/share/evolution/addressbook/<emailaddress> would have been stuff you synced with google
<rickspencer3> bfiller, weird, i never synced with google intentionally
<rickspencer3> bfiller, I'll just nuke that stuff and copy the contacts into system/
<bfiller> rickspencer3: is it a gmail address or canonical address?
<rickspencer3> bfiller, it's canonical
<bfiller> rickspencer3: you sure you never created a google online account using your canonical address?
<rickspencer3> bfiller, I am sure that I did
<rickspencer3> to get gmail notifications
<rickspencer3> since I use gmail for my canonical address
<bfiller> rickspencer3: ok, that's probably what the dir was for. if you setup that online account again you should be back to the same state
<rickspencer3> bfiller, ok, will do
<mvo> bzoltan: aha, thanks, I check it out
<bzoltan> mvo:  cool
<rvr> dpm: I thought that X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain was deprecated, but renato tells me it's just for click packages. Can you confirm?
<zoheb> hello
<zoheb> i want to install ubuntu touch on my device
<zoheb> but i dont know if it is listed on supported device
<zoheb> its an indian brand
<bubbasaures> zoheb, The links above list covered devices, easy stuff to find in general.
<zoheb> yup
<zoheb> mine is not listed :(
<bubbasaures> zoheb, Are you aware that this is a development model, it is not really a daily use setup, or only phone use.
<zoheb> yes
<zoheb> my phone is just lying around
<zoheb> its hard heys are not working properly
<bubbasaures> Cool just making sure, bets of luck, all you could do is try to install if you know how to reload the stock image.
<zoheb> its 1 gb ram and dual core device
<zoheb> any ways thanks :)
<dpm> rvr, X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain needs to be removed from the .desktop file if it's a click app, IIRC.
<rvr> dpm: It's not a click app
<dpm> rvr, which app is it?
<rvr> dpm: Mediaplayer
<dpm> rvr, then it should specify X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain
<rvr> dpm: They added support for .desktop localization. And I thought that once localized, X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain should be removed.
<dpm> rvr, let me forward you the e-mail I sent to vrruiz when he asked me the same question
<rvr> dpm: I'm vrruiz :)
<dpm> hahah
<dpm> the man with multiple nicks :)
<dpm> then you should have some mail in your inbox :)
<rvr> Yeah, reading it, thanks :)
<dpm> rvr, if you've got a .deb for the app, I can have a look at it to be certain
<rvr> dpm: Yeah, it's available here https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu-rtm/landing-005
 * dpm looks
<rvr> dpm: I tested it and seems fine. Just ships the flag, and I thought I was being deprecated.
<rvr> in all cases, deb and click
<rvr> The silo needs a langpack update, though. I created the .mo file from the project source.
<rvr> dpm: What I don't understand is why the generated .desktop file don't have the translations. The one generated from sources, have them... Maybe differences between vivid and rtm.
<dpm> rvr, yeah, that puzzles me a bit. I see that the .desktop file in the .deb doesn't have inline translations
<dpm> rvr, so as the package is right now, it definitely needs X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain specified - and the translation included in the mediaplayer-app .mo file in the language packs
<iwan2dualboot> hello. I am wanting to dual boot my pendo pad 7 with ubuntu. Can anyone tell me if this has/or can be done? Any help will be most appreciated.
<popey> doesn't look like anyone has ported to that device iwan2dualboot
<iwan2dualboot> hi popeye. thanks for your reply. Does that mean I shouldnt follow the instructions on the following website https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install?
<iwan2dualboot> hi popey. thanks for your reply. Does that mean I shouldnt follow the instructions on the following website https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install?
<popey> iwan2dualboot: you can
<ogra_> iwan2dualboot, these instructions are only for supported devices ... ubuntu uses the drivers from the android source tree, you would have to port that part to make the generic ubuntu bits work on your device
<popey> the very first line says "arget devices under active development are here."
<popey> so follow that link
<popey> if yours isn't listed then you can't do it
<ogra_> well, you can port ... but thats ratther an advanced task and requires a bit of experience with both, android and ubuntu
<iwan2dualboot> aarrr. damn. Thanks popey and ogra_. Well i guess thats the end of that. No ubuntu for my pad/tablet. : (
<Hakushaku> hey, can somebody help me with instalation ubuntu touch
<Hakushaku> ?
<anpok_> your chances on getting answers are higher if you have more specific questions..
<Hakushaku> im stuck trying to unlock bootloader
<Hakushaku> device is overmav steelcore 10+ i have only recovery when i press vol - and power
<Hakushaku> so on the first place i check the devices
<Hakushaku> adb devices
<Hakushaku> and i get 0123456789ABCDEF device
<Hakushaku> reboot bootlader restar device and now i have 0123456789ABCDEF OFFLINE
<dobey> vol + power is for the google nexus devices
<dobey> if you're in bootloader you need to use fastboot to unlock it, not adb
<Hakushaku> when i try ~sudo fastboot oem unlock
<Hakushaku> i stuck on waiting for answer from device
<davmor2> Hakushaku: you don't need the ~ infront
<dobey> are you trying to port ubuntu to your device?
<dobey> i don't see it listed on !devices
<dobey> err
<dobey> !devices
<ubot5> You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<Hakushaku> i know this is not suported device but i want to try unlock bootloader and i fail
<dobey> yes, but even if you manage to unlock the bootloader, you won't be able to install ubuntu on it, as there is no port for it yet
<dobey> if fastboot oem-unlock doesn't work, i'm not sure what to tell you though. :-/
<genii> Hakushaku: You need to look up a rooting guide specific to your device.
<Hakushaku> it can be some kind missing driver? Other time i try .... yep i know but i stuck ont this allready 3 days
<dobey> http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2353360
<dobey> Hakushaku: ^^ read that
<dobey> appears you have to flash a custom rom from within the recovery mode, to root it
<dobey> i'd be wary of doing that, though, if you want the device to remain usable :)
<Hakushaku> debey i was looking for this file but all filles are die for 10+
<Hakushaku> <dobey> you still here?
<Hakushaku> dobey: you still here?
<dobey> well, we can't help you any further there then
<dobey> you need to find the correct custom rom for your device if you want to root it, i think
<dobey> your best bet is the xda developers forums
#ubuntu-touch 2014-12-02
<dholbach> good morning
<bzoltan> mvo_: I lost the pastebin link to the codelet what you suggested for the qt5-qmake-arm-linux-gnueabih. In my hack I simple listed it in teh frameworks, but I remember your suggestion was more civilized.
<mvo_> bzoltan: no worries, I still have it, thanks
<bzoltan> mvo_: If you post it again I will carry on with the click/oxide stuff ...
<bzoltan> mvo_: and let you suffer from whatever you suffer :D
<mvo_> bzoltan: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/190980713/click_0.4.35-1~0ubuntu1~0trusty1_0.4.35-1~0ubuntu1~0trusty2.diff.gz - but I talk to asac, the mail from Pat sounds urgent enough to justify spending a bit of time on this to unblock you guys
<bzoltan> mvo_:  the story with the China training is that they need a snapshot of a very recent and bugfree Ubuntu SDK tools with qmake support (more simple than cmake) for that i need to release the trunk of our project to the SDK PPA. But i do not want to release my hack.
<bzoltan> mvo_:  err :) that diff from my hack
<mvo_> bzoltan: just to double check (sorry, I'm sure you answered this already but I forgot): qt5-qmake-cross-armhf is only for ubuntu-sdk-15.04+ - correct? it won't be backported to 14.04 and 14.10? or will it?
<ogra_> mvo_, i had to upload livecd-rootfs, you had un-uploaded changes there, hope it was ok to upload them along
<bzoltan> mvo_:  no, it would be too much to SRU the qtbase to Utopic and Trusty
<bzoltan> mvo_:  we have pushed the oxide-qt to the silo13 and expect it to land on vivid as soon as it can be verified -> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/191665109/oxide-qt_1.3.5-0ubuntu1_1.3.5-0ubuntu2.diff.gz
<mvo_> ogra_: yeah, that was fine
<bzoltan> mvo_:  I would like to add the MR to the lp:click with the qt5-qmake support to that silo.
<mvo_> bzoltan: oh? is chriscoulson ok with the idea? if so, great
<mvo_> bzoltan: I thought he had some concerns that these are real dependencies etc
<bzoltan> mvo_: I do not know... he will have the right to say ok/nok once the silo is ready to land
 * mvo_ nods
<bzoltan> mvo_:  this issue is pending for 2 months ... the China training freeze is this week's Friday.
<bzoltan> mvo_:  :) I thought creating a ready to land package will be a good alert :D
<mvo_> bzoltan: heh
<bzoltan> mvo_: are these oxide packages actually ever apt-get installed/upgraded on a real device?
<mvo_> bzoltan: I don't know :) ideally we would make them co-isntallable
<mvo_> bzoltan: and thats probably not too hard, its just takes *time*
<mvo_> bzoltan: I already have a idea how to make it in a simple way
<bzoltan> mvo_:  I would be happy to see an ideal solution to land .. straight after we unblocked the SDK ;)
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Giving Tuesday! :-D
<bzoltan> Hello JamesTait
<bzoltan> mvo_:  so will you create a branch for the native qt5-qmake-cross-armhf or should I do it. I would simple put in the fw the native qt5-qmake-cross-armhf package, what is a less pretty solution.
<mvo_> bzoltan: https://code.launchpad.net/~mvo/click/qt5-qmake-cross-armhf
<bzoltan> mvo_:  thank you
<bzoltan> mvo_:  note that the qt5-qmake-arm-linux-gnueabihf is not just useless on armhf arch, but it does not exist, so attempting to install it will fail
<bzoltan> mvo_: that is why i am not fully happy with my own hack, because I do the same.. I do not know if we will ever support native arrmhf chroots
<bzoltan> mvo_:  but as I see the click code, it knows only the target arch and does nothing with the host arch ... so should we just ignore that problem?
<mvo_> bzoltan: it does not care much about the host arch right now - and yes, it break armhf -> armhf chroots, but we can fix it once we support that
<mvo_> bzoltan: this is mostly to unblock you, its not prefect
<bzoltan> mvo_:  I am happy with it.. we never said that we support armhf based environment for the SDK :D
<mandel> ogra_, are you in image 45 on vivid? does the check for updates in system settings work?
<ogra_> mandel, only RTM on my devices atm ... ask davidcalle
<ogra_> err
<ogra_> ask davmor2
<davmor2> mandel: how are you on 45?
<mandel> davmor2, do you have vivid 45? I'm testing the system image updates and it never stops checking, is get stuck for ever
<mandel> davmor2, well, that is the img number I get from the "About this phone" page
<mandel> davmor2, Ubuntu 15.04 (r45)
<davmor2> mandel: image 39 is the latest devel-proposed image so I don't know if you are on a different channel
<davmor2> mandel: image 40 is building currently
<mandel> davmor2, wtf?? that is weird
<davmor2> ogra_: ^ I'm not dreaming this right
<ogra_> davmor2, mandel,  different arches, different numbers ;)
<ogra_> someone doesnt use mako here ;)
<mandel> I'm sure is 45
<jibel> davmor2, 39 is on mako, 45 on another arch
<davmor2> jibel: yeap solved
<bzoltan> mvo_: how is the click landing procedure? I assume you wish to see cjwatson's nod on that MR  for merging it to thde click/devel branch.
<cjwatson> bzoltan: He should feel free to go ahead without that, since I'm moving out of click development
<bzoltan> cjwatson: Good for you :) bad for us
<cjwatson> There are other members of ~click-hackers if you (plural) want to get a review, and probably a good habit to be in
<bzoltan> cjwatson: good point
<Stskeeps> out of morbid curiousity, do you guys still have surfaceflinger running in some form on your mir images?
<bzoltan> mvo_:  would you take the risk :)  to add me to the ~click-hackers team? I could help with integration and testing as start.
<popey> Stskeeps: no
<Stskeeps> good
<popey> heh
<popey> although I note the binary is still in the image
<popey> I guess so you can switch to it optionally if you want to
<Stskeeps> yeah, always good for testing environment
<mardy> jdstrand: are apparmor denials logged by default, or do I have to do something to enable them?
<jdstrand> mardy: they are logged by default, but two things might affect logging: kernel rate limiting and explicit deny rules
<jdstrand> mardy: when doing policy debugging, I do this: sudo sysctl -w kernel.printk_ratelimit=0
<jdstrand> mardy: you might do a 'grep deny /path/to/profile' to see what explicit denials there are. explicit denials silence logging (if you see 'audit deny', that is an explicit deny that will be logged)
<mardy> jdstrand: oh, and actually I just notice that the problem I'm debugging is unconfined, so I guess I can safely rule apparmor issues out :-)
<jdstrand> heh, yes
<mardy> alan_g: hi! To start a client inside a trusted session, does the client process need to be a fork of the process which created the trusted session?
<barry> mandel: ping
<mandel> barry, pong, yes landing today, testing first in the following silo => https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-004
<alan_g> mardy: no it just needs to use the socket provide by the helper
<mandel> barry, if you can give it a +1 I'll appreciate it :)
<barry> mandel: thanks!  i'll test it
<alan_g> forking is one way to pass it the needed fd - but is hardly a convenient approach if you've any threads running
<mardy> alan_g: I get an error that the connection to Mir server failed; any hints on how to debug it? the MIR_SOCKET is set to "fd://12"
<mandel> but 1396559
<mandel> bug 1396559
<ubot5> Error: Launchpad bug 1396559 could not be found
<aquarius> How do I upgrade the version of Ubuntu running in the emulator I've created?
<alan_g> mardy: how are you passing the fd to the client? Over dbus?
<popey> aquarius: i think the advice I have seen is "destroy it and make it again"
<mardy> alan_g: OK, that might be the issue: I'm not passing it at all :-)
<alan_g> mardy: that would be a good starting point. ;)
<mardy> tedg: is there a way to pass an fd with ubuntu-app-launch? how do you share the fd between the pay-service and the pay-ui?
<mardy> alan_g: thanks! It may be that forking then is the easiest way to get it working...
<aquarius> popey, oh. really? :(
<popey> aquarius: rsalveti may know more
<alan_g> mardy: FWIW system()  also inherits FDs
<tedg> mardy, No, I use dbus to share it. But you could use any socket connection.
<tedg> mardy, Reality is that you need something that is in the same process chain as the final executable, so it's hard to pass through the phases of Upstart.
<nickst> http://payripo.com/?share=7080 If any of you is looking for an online job, this is your website. I've earned like 70 dollars for the last 4 days.
<tedg> mardy, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Pay/Architecture#Trusted_Prompt_Sessions
<mterry> charles, did you ever track down that indicator-power/unity8 freeze?
<mterry> charles, it's blocking my greeter-profiles branch
<mardy> tedg: ah, thanks!
<tedg> mardy, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~indicator-applet-developers/pay-service/trunk.15.04/view/head:/service/mir-connection-demangler.c
<charles> mterry, argh, no I sidetracked myself onto other things. I didn't realize it was blocking you!
<tedg> mardy, Also, make sure to do this. That one line cost me 3 days :-)  http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~indicator-applet-developers/pay-service/trunk.15.04/view/head:/service/mir-connection-demangler.c#L105
<charles> mterry, is the change you made to the indicator profile configuration file not enough to unblock?
<mterry> charles, oh sorry yeah.  My branch to actually enable different indicator profiles can't land if we keep freezing the UI  :)
<mterry> charles, it would be I think, but then we don't get the nice greeter profile for the power indicator
<mterry> But I could move forward at lesat
<mterry> And we'd get greeter profiles for other indicator
<mterry> s
<mterry> So probably a win
<mardy> tedg: however, I think I might be better off without UAL, using just QProcess makes things simpler
<mardy> tedg: QProcess + aa_change_profile
<tedg> mardy, It makes things simpler from the process part, but you need all the cgroups support etc to ensure PIDs don't leak.
<charles> mterry, I'll resume that right now then so we can get you unblocked
<mterry> charles, ok thanks, yeah just fixing the power indicator should be enough for now
<rsalveti> popey: aquarius: right, unfortunately image updates is not yet supported by the emulator
<popey> rsalveti: is it on the roadmap?
<aquarius> rsalveti, so, the way to get a new emulator is to just delete the old one(s) and create a new one from scratch?
<rsalveti> aquarius: yes
<rsalveti> popey: yup
<aquarius> Which channel should I use to have an up-to-date emulator?
<rsalveti> it depends if you want to use vivid or RTM, they are different series
<rsalveti> vivid is the latest, but not necessarily stable
<rsalveti> RTM is more stable in general
<ogra_> right, vivid is develoiper playground
<ogra_> no warranty :)
<aquarius> my options appear to be: devel, devel-proposed, stable, rtm-14.09, rtm-14.09-proposed, and "custom". I'd like to use whatever's going to be most reminiscent of an Ubuntu device which hits the market. :)
<popey> whereas that lengthy warranty on the rtm channel...
<ogra_> :D
<ogra_> aquarius, ubuntu-rtm/devel or ubuntu-rtm/devel-proposed are what you want ...
<aquarius> ogra_, so, I should use "custom" and enter "ubuntu-rtm/devel"?
<ogra_> both should be similarly stable, -propoased has more fixes and a bit less QA
<ogra_> custom ?
<aquarius> ogra_, and if tomorrow some changes have done into ubuntu-rtm/devel, I need to destroy my emulator and re-create it?
<ogra_> yeah, currently you have to
<aquarius> ogra_, the options I have are those above. Is "devel" the same thing as "ubuntu-rtm/devel"?
<ogra_> no, devel is vivid ... ubuntu-rtm/devel is the same as rtm-14.09 (where do these names come from ?)
<aquarius> no idea where they come from -- they're what I get in Ubuntu SDK in the "Create emulator" popup.
<ogra_> oh
<ogra_> no idea about the SDK
<ogra_> i use vi for my apps :P
<ogra_> (and the emulator natively if i need it)
<jgdx> popcorn.gif
<ogra_> silent.wav
<kenvandine> jgdx, did you see my less_flaky branch?  it includes some of the steps to be more inline with the page object model we want and makes some of our really flaky tests less flaky
<kenvandine> jgdx, next i want to prune the autopilot tests of the tests that should be qml tests, then refactor the remaining tests
<jgdx> kenvandine, I just looked at it. Good stuff. :)
<jgdx> right, that would remove 10+ tests right off the bat
<kenvandine> jgdx, at least... i hope :)
<kenvandine> which would reduce the number of tests we need to refactor
<kenvandine> jgdx, but i wanted to do something to make it more reliable... landing that silent mode branch drove me insane...
<kenvandine> every CI run had different failures... crazy!
<jgdx> kenvandine, wut? The one just now? ted's?
<kenvandine> last week
<kenvandine> or week before
<kenvandine> but i was seeing like datetime failures every 3rd CI run, etc
<kenvandine> completely unrelated
<kenvandine> switching to use the go_to_page model helps stabilize that
<kenvandine> jgdx, one thing i've been beating my head against the desk over is test_phone.py
<jgdx> kenvandine, what's happening?
<kenvandine> we have the test case there for dialpad sounds, which is based on SoundBaseTestCase
<kenvandine> not the ofono one
<kenvandine> it passes fine if i run that one test case
<kenvandine> but if i run all the tests in there
<kenvandine> most of them fail
<kenvandine> it's like the setUp and tearDown has issues
<kenvandine> it basically stops getting input
<jgdx> actually, that reminds me of an error I hit a while back
<jgdx> kenvandine, do you get a timeout?
<kenvandine> no obvious timeout
<kenvandine> but i suspect it is
<kenvandine> if i run PhoneSoundTestCase and PhoneTestCase separately they pass 100% of the time
<kenvandine> but if i run test_phone
<jgdx> okay, I found that if I tried to change a readonly interface *something* broke down, and that manifested itself like how you explain
<kenvandine> some random number of the total tests fail every time
<jgdx> kenvandine, could you paste the log for the most common way it fails?
<jgdx> kenvandine, updated my cellular "manual persist" branch btw, addressing your comment.
<kenvandine> jgdx, thx
<kenvandine> i'll get a log in a bit
<kenvandine> i already moved the test out :)
<kenvandine> but i would like to know wtf is up!
<kenvandine> jgdx, http://paste.ubuntu.com/9346242/
<aquarius> mardy, is http://developer.ubuntu.com/apps/platform/guides/online-accounts-developer-guide/ out of date? There doesn't seem to be a Setup element any more
<aquarius> mardy, and when I create an AccountServiceModel, my QML app throws an error: "Error opening accounts DB: unable to open database file. Manager could not be created. DB is locked"
<aquarius> mardy, and applicationId no longer seems to exist on an AccountServiceModel either
<aquarius> dbarth_, do you know about online accounts stuff?
<rickspencer3> hey all, is it possible to take screenshots directly on the phone now, without phablet-screenshot?
<popey> rickspencer3: press vol+ and vol- together
<ogra_> rsalveti, press bpth vol keys
<ogra_> *both
<rickspencer3> thanks popey
<popey> you get a popup unfortunately
<rickspencer3> popey, yeah, so, no way to turn off the volume notification?
<ogra_> you can crop it out with gimp afterwards ... leaves a hole though :P
<rickspencer3> lol
<ogra_> (no, there isnt)
<dbarth_> aquarius: hi; yes i may be able to help
<rickspencer3> I think the idea is that you can share the pic from your phone
<ogra_> there is a bug open for that though
<dbarth_> aquarius: ah, sorry ready the logs
<rickspencer3> thanks ogra
<dbarth_> aquarius: if you are developing an app, the best is too take a look at the slide deck from UOS
<dbarth_> aquarius: https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/presentation/d/1_BnaAASynFES-kwHoiIh2e9V2nBpYak5h_vmLfAbSIA/edit#slide=id.g1877ebb12_6_0
<dbarth_> which contains the latest from mardy on how to use the API and the various configuration files
<bzoltan> ogra_: aquarius: they are the emulator channels. The same as the device channels, but they are i386
<popey> rickspencer3: known bug
<dbarth_> aquarius: more specifically: there is still a setup element; that's what we use to request account creations
<rickspencer3> thanks popey
<dbarth_> aquarius: for another working example, you can look into the reminders app code: it does query the account db, and offers to create accounts if needed
<dbarth_> aquarius: otherwise goes on to request an access token with the evernote api
<aquarius> dbarth_, http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/qml/sdk-14.10/Ubuntu.OnlineAccounts/ does not mention a Setup element?
<aquarius> Chipaca or ralsina_, ping about push message handlers and the network
<mterry> kenvandine, any objection to landing the drop-wizard branch soon?
<kenvandine> mterry, no real objection
<mterry> kenvandine, now you made me worried about your fake objections
<kenvandine> i think we have some wizard related fixes in vivid that we'll land in rtm soon
<kenvandine> so we should land those first
<kenvandine> to ease backporting
<kenvandine> unless the wizard add to unity8 is planned for ota-1 :)
<mterry> kenvandine, I doubt it  :)  -- ok well then.  I guess let me know when I can land
<aquarius> Chipaca, ralsina_, __lucio__, specifically: when a push notification comes in, my app's message handler gets run to process it even if my app isn't running (I think?). Can my handler reply to the network and so my server and my app have a little conversation without user intervention?
<kenvandine> mterry, so after we're done with the backports to rtm
<kenvandine> mterry, i am quite excited about landing that :)
<mterry> kenvandine, that's not in a silo yet?
<__lucio__> aquarius, you have ~10seconds to do whatever permissions the helper gets
<__lucio__> aquarius, then we kill it
<aquarius> __lucio__, ooh. Does "talk to the network" come under the handler's permissions?
<__lucio__> aquarius, not sure. maybe Chipaca can tell you.
<aquarius> __lucio__, what I want to do is talk to a server and say "hey, server, my unique token is XYZ; remember it". But the server doesn't know whether I'm lying about that. So my thought was, the server then sends back a push notification to that token saying "ok, prove you're you: the magic word is 'ahaha'". And then the push helper gets that message and says to the server "the word is 'ahaha'" without telling the use
<aquarius> r or showing any visible notification...
<__lucio__> aquarius, the idea is that the app that sends the token has the login information for the user (or something like that)
<aquarius> __lucio__, sure, but there's nothing stopping you just making a curl request from your desktop to myserver/register?token=ABCDEF
<aquarius> __lucio__, and I'm trying to avoid having the user actually have to *sign up*, because there's no need :)
<__lucio__> aquarius, that token is a) going to be invalid, b) generated in the device or with the users account + device id
<__lucio__> so, if you have the users u1 credentials, it should be ok for you to fake his tokens
<aquarius> __lucio__, the server doesn't *know* that it's invalid, though. I want the server to verify it's valid by sending a push notification to it, and having my app respond to that push notification; make sense?
<__lucio__> aquarius, your server will know as soon as it tries to push the first notifications
<__lucio__> aquarius, push "{}", check for the token to be valid, in the helper ignore it
<aquarius> __lucio__, aha, the push server will tell my server if a token is invalid? nice
<aquarius> I didn't know that :)
<__lucio__> aquarius, we are working on more docs :)
<aquarius> __lucio__, ya, I was just about to note that I didn't know it because the documentation doesn't mention it :P
<__lucio__> Chipaca, ^ something to mention in the docs
<aquarius> Chipaca, yeah: "how does my server verify that a token it's been given is real" would be a good thing to have
<mardy> aquarius: hi! The guide is new and correct but the API reference is way outdated
<mardy> mhall119: is it possible to update our api docs there?
<Chipaca> aquarius: __lucio__: I seem to have missed out on some excitement over dinner; what's going on?
<aquarius> Chipaca, see scrollback :)
<Chipaca> aquarius: i've got a lot of that :) from when?
<mhall119> mardy: which API doc?
<aquarius> Chipaca, summary: I was worried about being told the push token by a client but being lied to, but __lucio__ says that the push server will throw an error if I supply a bad push token with a message, which is lovely but undocumented ;)
<Chipaca> aquarius: well... you could be given somebody else's token, if we're getting mitm'ed somehow i guess?
<aquarius> Chipaca, also, an extra question from above: can my push helper talk to the network? in particular, can my server send a push message to my phone and my push helper on the phone connect back to my server without the user seeing anything and without my app being open?
<Chipaca> aquarius: not at all reliably
<Chipaca> aquarius: and i'd have to check with jamie as to whether it's allowed at all; i think not
<Chipaca> aquarius: if i don't remember wrong, the *only* thing you can have as a push helper is the push helper bits
<aquarius> Chipaca, right, but I am assuming that I'm not given someone else's token, because tokens are secret like passwords, so if someone else gets my token they can already sod me up and I'm not making it any worse. It's more whether I have to verify a token that I'm handed or whether I can just say, well, if you lie to me about what your token is, you don't get any messages, and that's OK
<Chipaca> aquarius: yeah, lying isn't a problem
<Chipaca> unless you're a very unlucky liar :)
<aquarius> Chipaca, I can do a verify dance, where you say "this is my token", and I say "oh really? prove it: I'll push a secret message to that token and you tell me what the secret message is and I'll believe you"
<aquarius> but if I don't have to do that then I won't :)
<Chipaca> aquarius: and if user A can convince you that they're actually user B and you use A's token meaning to talk to B, that's all you
<mardy> mhall119: accounts-qml-module-doc and qml-module-ubuntu-onlineaccounts-client-doc
<Chipaca> aquarius: there's an easier way, i think, that you could do
<Chipaca> aquarius: as a reply to the client telling you their token, you give them a public key
<Chipaca> aquarius: crypt the notification contents with the private key
<aquarius> nah, that's OK -- I don't think I need it
<Chipaca> aquarius: store the public key in one of the package-accessible directories
<mhall119> mardy: are the docs you want in utopic's archive?
<Chipaca> aquarius: the helper can then decrypt
<Chipaca> aquarius: but yeah, it's taking it a bit far :)
<mhall119> qtdeclarative5-online-accounts-client-doc_0.4+14.10.20141006-0ubuntu1
<Chipaca> anyway, i've got to evict somebody from a bathtub
<Chipaca> ttfn!
<aquarius> Chipaca, is there anything I can guarantee about the tokens? like, how long they are, or which characters they contain?
<aquarius> Chipaca, ok cheers :)
<mhall119> mardy: check http://91.189.92.89/api/qml/sdk-14.10/ and if it looks correct I'll publish to production
<mhall119> Chipaca is either a parent, of a very bad landlord
<mhall119> s/of/or/
<davmor2> mhall119: or both
<mhall119> that's one way of describing parenthood :)
<mardy> mhall119: they are correct, please publish :-)
<Chipaca> mhall119: aquarius: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-PFNHQAh5s
<Chipaca> davmor2: ^ also
<Chipaca> anyway
<Chipaca> aquarius: why would you want to know that about a token?
<Chipaca> (i do have a non-question answer, but i need to know :)
<davmor2> Chipaca: man only one hand, you're not strict enough as a landlord, with no hand no damage ;)
<Chipaca> davmor2: i know, but what're you going to do, they're family
<davmor2> Chipaca: hahaha
<dobey> aquarius: u1 auth tokens? they are the same as oauth1.0a tokens.
<beuno> well
<beuno> we changed the length of tokens generated with the 2.0 SSO api from the 1.0 api
<mhall119> mardy: pushed to production
<jgdx> kenvandine, apart from the different error message, that paste describes what happened to me. Not to send you out on a wild-goose chaseâ¦
<kenvandine> yeah... the output isn't really helpful
<kenvandine> i think the "Connection closed" bits are the real problem
<jgdx> kenvandine, check the mock delta and see if anything is not supposed to be touched from a lib point of view
<kenvandine> like dbus getting yanked out from uner it
<kenvandine> what do you mean?
<dobey> beuno: the token, or the secret? or both?
<beuno> dobey, I'm going to say token
<jgdx> kenvandine, in my case I made a change in a modem property that was readonly from ofono and libqofono's POV.
<jgdx> which then caused dbus to just say "nope" to all requests
<kenvandine> i didn't make any changes there...
<kenvandine> in fact, i hadn't made any changes to the mock's at all
<dobey> actually, oauth1.0[a] spec doesn't specify exactly what the contnet of the token would be
<kenvandine> jgdx, does the tests in test_phone work for you on desktop?
<kenvandine> jgdx, i just tried trunk and got the same problem
<dobey> but, as it is used in HTTP request parameters and/or the headers, it has to be ascii, and not contain certain special chars which are used by HTTP in those two instances
<jgdx> kenvandine, hang on
<kenvandine> jgdx, what really drives me nuts is that test_phone.PhoneSoundTestCase passes and test_phone.PhoneTestCase passes
<kenvandine> but test_phone together doesn't
<kenvandine> test_phone.PhoneDualSimTestCase passes too
<dobey> so it's pretty much [a-z0-9]+ most every case
<dobey> not that a random application using u1 auth should care or need to know
<kenvandine> jgdx, it's only a problem when i include PhoneSoundTestCase, which inherits from SoundBaseTestCase, with the ofono based tests
<jgdx> kenvandine, no failures in trunk @1215
<jgdx> or rather, one actually
<jgdx> but that's the one we're seeing on jenkins
<kenvandine> jgdx, ok... fails on my desktop
<kenvandine> well that's annoying :)
<jgdx> have you tried rebuting it
<aquarius> Chipaca, I'd like to know it because I need to store them in a database, probably, and if tomorrow you turn around and make them a 2 kilobyte PGP key or something you'll sod up my DB schema :)
<dobey> aquarius: if your db schema can't deal with arbitrarily long access token strings, then you're schema is already sodded up ;)
<aquarius> dobey, well, perhaps. I'm just trying to get a sense of what the deal is with them; at the moment they're a relatively short string. Are they likely to roughly stay that way?
<dobey> aquarius: i can't say for sure, but i wouldn't expect them to change length often. but i can't guarantee that we don't wake up one day with a fancy security hack and we suddenly have to destroy all existing tokens and generate new ones that are 4096 bytes long. :)
<aquarius> dobey, yeah -- I can understand that, and if that happens then everyone's token gets invalidated, my app breaks, and I fix the server :)
<dobey> aquarius: the trick is to write your app/server to deal with invalid tokens
<Chipaca> aquarius: sorry, was afk. tokens are base64-encoded
<Chipaca> aquarius: your server needs to deal with invalid tokens, btw
<Chipaca> aquarius: our server will say "oi, that token? garbage" (actually more often: unknown). So you nuke it.
<aquarius> yep
<aquarius> invalid ones I don't mind
<dobey> aquarius: if we change token length, all prior tokens will invalidated on our server, and thus be invalid. handle invalid tokens, and if you need to store the token for some reason, don't be dumb and limit possible length of the token string. and you'll be fine :)
<charles> mterry, ping
<mterry> charles, heyo
<charles> mterry, https://code.launchpad.net/~charlesk/indicator-power/show-phone-menu-in-phone-greeter/+merge/243473
<charles> mterry, it doesn't affect the workaround you opted for (and which I agree with), but FYI I tracked down the lockup problem
<mterry> charles, oh nice!
<charles> mterry, it's written up in that MP which I assigned to you for review
<charles> mterry, (as you'd expect, it's just a one-liner in com.canonical.indicator.power switching the phone_greeter's menu)
<charles> mterry, the better news is:
<mterry> charles, ah that's a nice one-liner  :)
<charles> mterry, since nobody else uses com.canonical.indicator.basic, we shouldn't have any subsequent issues in other indicators popping up down the road
<mterry> charles, ok cool
<mterry> charles, so unity8 doesn't seem to handle types it doesn't know well I guess? :)
<charles> mterry, looks like it. I'm not sure it's worth reporting a follow-on bug for that :/
#ubuntu-touch 2014-12-03
<UbUntUToUchLover>  test
<brijithmac> how secure is ububtu touch!?
<lotuspsychje> more secure then android
<nhaines> Specify.
<brijithmac> i am planning to install it in my nexus 7 tablet
<lotuspsychje> its highly recomended to install :p
<nhaines> lotuspsychje: Ubuntu has no encryption or data security.
<brijithmac> :) ok
<brijithmac> what about the stability?
<nhaines> brijithmac: applications are heavily sandboxed, so apps are pretty secure.  But there's no encryption available so a stolen device means free data for the thief.
<nhaines> Do you have the 2012 or 2013 Nexus 7?
<brijithmac> 2012
<lotuspsychje> ouch
<nhaines> brijithmac: then Ubuntu is not available for that device, unfortunately.
<brijithmac> :(
<lotuspsychje> brijithmac: i buyed the 2013 wifi n7 just for ubuntu touch, and works nicely
<brijithmac> wow great! but mine is 2012..
<nhaines> I wouldn't buy a tablet for Ubuntu before there is being sold preinstalled.
<brijithmac> yeah.. good. I am curious about it. so thought of installing it.. :(
<lotuspsychje> brijithmac: maybe check the XDA forums and see if any project got it working anyway maybe
<nhaines> Yes, unfortunately it is a lot of work to support specific hardware, so very few models are supported.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Any news on the ovation image? I have a B&N Nook HD+, and the Ubuntu Touch image on the Ubuntu Touch Devices page has not been updated since May. I am currently running Cyanogenmod.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Also, who is Wesnoth? Is this person the same one who develops the Battle for Wesnoth game? If so, he doesn't mention it on his website.
<UbUntUToUchLover> If he does mention it, I haven't found it, yet.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Sorry if somebody responded. I was accidentally kicked off.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Is there anybody who can help me with my problem?
<UbUntUToUchLover> Any news on the ovation image? I have a B&N Nook HD+, and the Ubuntu Touch image on the Ubuntu Touch Devices page has not been updated since May. For now, I am currently running Cyanogenmod, and although I like the user interface and the billions of Google apps, I am not fond of Android, and would rather have something close to one of my favorite Linux operating systems.
<UbUntUToUchLover> I would also like to know a little more about the person who refers to him/her self as simply "wesnoth", and if it is the same developer of Battle for Wesnoth.
<UbUntUToUchLover>  Is there anyone who can help me?
<nhaines> UbUntUToUchLover: you'll need to use the contact information on the Ubuntu Touch Devices page to get more information.  We don't have anything other than what porters report there.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Hmmm... Well, thanks, anyway. I was just hoping for some answers. After all, I saw how you were talking to someone else about their tablet problems, and thought I might offer mine. Sorry for any problems I might have caused!
<UbUntUToUchLover> I'll keep checking the website. Also, is it possible that I might get some answers from "wesnoth" via IRC?
<mvo> bzoltan: this is something you will like: https://code.launchpad.net/~mvo/click/chroot-15.04-multiarch/+merge/243493  - it should unblock you
<nhaines> UbUntUToUchLover: no problems at all!  Unfortunately, the other person was also using an unsupported tablet.  :)
<nhaines> UbUntUToUchLover: I have no idea who wesnoth is--maybe just a fan of the game?--so I don't have any useful advice other than to check the wiki and any links from there.
<nhaines> And sorry I didn't respond faster.  I'm busy writing a book and every so often I stop being responsible and peek in here.  ;)
<UbUntUToUchLover> No problem. Anyway, I figured as much, but isn't there also talk about an Ubuntu Touch image that is universal to various devices, even those not officially supported, or am I reading the news wrong?
<UbUntUToUchLover> I think there should be one. I like Ubuntu that much. :-)
<nhaines> The main filesystem is basically universal, but there needs to be hardware integration work for each and every single mobile platform before it can function on a platform.  That's because unlike IBM PC-based hardware, every ARM platform boots differently, has different graphics and sound and hardware, and so on.
<nhaines> So for now a truly universal image is unfortunately unpossible.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Hrm. I was afraid you'd tell me that.
<UbUntUToUchLover> If you do enough web searching, you'll eventually find pictures of someone trying it out. I have tried it myself, but it was so buggy, I had to flash Cyanogenmod as quickly as possible!
<nhaines> Yeah, even as much as everyone seems to love the Nexus 5, it's only working because the Nexus 7 2013 model had almost the exact same chipset.
<nhaines> So after a year, it really hasn't gotten any better.  It mostly all works, but no Bluetooth support, which kind of makes it useless for a phone.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Well, some of the problems I've found for this image are differently-sized apps. Some fill the screen and some take up only a third of the screen, as if some of them were made for a phablet instead of a tablet.
<UbUntUToUchLover> The on-screen keyboard was the worst problem. Not only was it off to the side most of the time, my touches would sometimes activate what was BEHIND the keyboard, as if it had virtual holes!
<UbUntUToUchLover> As for what you said about bluetooth, it works for Ubuntu on my Nook, although I haven't officially tested it.
<UbUntUToUchLover> I've done research about this problem, but I'm at my wit's end. That's why when I saw the link to the IRC chat, I logged on as soon as possible. I've been following it ever since.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Anyone else know about the ovation image? I've been discussing it with nhaines, but he's a little busy, right now.
<UbUntUToUchLover> I'll check back later.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Sorry, my IRC client crashed. I've been talking to people on #wesnoth (which is also a freenode channel), but they know nothing about it, either.
<mvo> cjwatson, bzoltan: going further on the chroot creation for 15.04 I think we need to split ubuntu-sdk-libs-dev into -dev and -tools and the later will contain all the native arch tools like cmake,python3. then we install -libs:$targetarch, -libs-dev:$targetarch, -libs-tools:$native-arch - any thoughts or concerns about this approach?
<dholbach> good morning
<bzoltan> mvo: yeps
<bzoltan> mvo:  the oxide in the silo13 is good, the arch specific conflict definition works
<mvo> bzoltan: nice!
<mvo> bzoltan: did you create a chroot? I was running into the problem that it pulled in py3:armhf but we really need py3:amd64 of course (same is going to happen for cmake) - this is why I think we want to split -dev into -dev and -tools so that we have a clean speration here, I prepared this already
<justCarakas> Good morning all :)
<bzoltan> mvo:  python is a troublemaker .. .but the ubuntu-sdk-libs installed without problem
<bzoltan> mvo:  it seems we came to the same conclusion in the same minute :D
<mvo> bzoltan: cool, I update the seeds and generate this new -tools package then
<bzoltan> ogra_:  yes here :)
<ogra_> heh
<ogra_> bzoltan, well, seems mvo is on top of the issue
<bzoltan> ogra_:  is it a custom for -dev packages to pull dev tools?
<mvo> ogra_: what is the issue you see?
<ogra_> no, usuall not
<mvo> ogra_: I am on top of something :) not sure its the same though
<ogra_> mvo, the issue ? that bzoltan pinged me in another channel and started the very same conversation with me :)
<bzoltan> ogra_:  mvo: I am pretty much in the relaxed state of mind and I know what we are doing :)
<ogra_> bzoltan, right, let mvo just handle it then :)
<bzoltan> ogra_: mvo: we split the -lib-dev and make a tools package just for building .. no IDE stuff
<mvo> bzoltan, ogra_: cool, yeah it looks like we are all on the same page
<bzoltan> mvo:  yeps..  you have all rights to fix the seeds, right? Or do you want me to make an MR for it?
<UbUntUToUchLover> Finally got IRC working right. Here's more proof of wesnoth's work, for anybody interested: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2406766&page=5
<mvo> bzoltan: yeah, I have the required privs: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu-touch.vivid/revision/269
<bzoltan> mvo:  hehe :) I see you are already doingit
<bzoltan> mvo:  you just changed between my two F5 hits ...:D cool, thanks
<bzoltan> mvo:  that (ubuntu-html5-theme-examples) is deprecated
<UbUntUToUchLover> There's pictures, links to images, and the little info I know about wesnoth.
<bzoltan> mvo:  and you know what? We could add the new qt5-qmake-arm-linux-gnueabihf to that meta package
<mvo> bzoltan: indeed
<bzoltan> mvo:  so, there will not be need to do other mod in the click than add the ubuntu-sdk-tools in native to the chroot
<mvo> bzoltan: yeah
<mvo> bzoltan: nice that it comes together
<bzoltan> \o/
<bzoltan> mvo:  to be honest I was surprised that this odd conflict definition worked out ... it is actually documented exactly that way in the debian docs
<mardy> marcustomlinson: ping
<marcustomlinson> mardy: pong
<mardy> marcustomlinson: in ubuntu-rtm, we see some requests for authentication coming from scoperunner (with the youtube scope)
<mardy> marcustomlinson: these requests don't have the UI policy set to "no interaction", so they generate a snap decision
<mardy> marcustomlinson: did you say that all the requests from the scope have the no-ui-policy flag set?
<marcustomlinson> mardy: no, I use the default ui policy because of that issue where the scope can't subscribe to a signal that tells it "new token granted"
<marcustomlinson> mardy: so there's no way for a running scope to know that it should ask for the token again
<marcustomlinson> mardy: as far as I see it, if you remove that snap decision fallback, everything will just work (and work better)
<marcustomlinson> mardy: we only expect the UI to show up from the dash process, and scopes show the need for a new token by returning a log-in button
<marcustomlinson> mardy: so I think your change will not effect us
<mardy> marcustomlinson: that will be equivalent to you setting the no-ui-policy
<nhaines> I have a couple built in apps on ubuntu-rtm/14.09 r10 that had icons disappear in the Dash Apps scope at some point.  Does anyone want me to check anything about that before I reset the phone?
<marcustomlinson> mardy: when will this change happen? do you have a branch/silo I can test?
<mardy> marcustomlinson: I think that we will anyway do as you say (remove the snap decision path), but I'd rather have the clients migrate to the no-ui-policy first, so that they can do that at their own pace
<mardy> marcustomlinson: you (the scopes) have a nice fallback on the dash, but I'm afraid that account-polld and sync-monitor are not ready for this change
<mardy> marcustomlinson: so if you set the no-ui-policy bit, that would fix the issue with the scopes, without affecting the other projects (from which I haven't yet seen the snap decision, yet)
<marcustomlinson> mardy: sure I understand. what kind of timeline are we talking here? When will your change happen?
<mardy> marcustomlinson: so, we have a silo ready (#9 on ubuntu-rtm), maybe you could propose a MP for the no-ui-policy and we could add it to the same silo?
<marcustomlinson> mardy: really really not that simple
<marcustomlinson> mardy: I rely on the ui policy at the moment
<mardy> marcustomlinson: but I think we don't see these issues in vivid... do you know why?
<marcustomlinson> mardy: no idea
<dbarth_> marcustomlinson: yes, if that makes sense, i was not seeing so many auth prompts while testing on vivid
<mardy> marcustomlinson: but wait: if you set the no-ui-policy bit, you will get an error, and the scope will generate the "login" result for the dash
<mardy> marcustomlinson: then when the user clicks that, the dash does the auth with the full ui; I think that this is already working, isn't it?
<marcustomlinson> mardy: its complicated to explain it all, but essentially that scope relies on callbacks to get new tokens, it doesn't ask for the token every search like we decided on in Washington
<marcustomlinson> mardy: I need to change the logic in Youtube, Vimeo and SoundCloud scopes
<mardy> marcustomlinson: ah, I see :-/
<mardy> marcustomlinson: can I help somehow?
<marcustomlinson> mardy: I'll work on it today, but I can't guarantee you a speedy delivery
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Make A Gift Day! :-D
<mardy> marcustomlinson: whatever, you rock as usual :-)
<marcustomlinson> :p
<matv1> mardy fyi as you were helpfull on this before, I have reopened https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts/+bug/1389028
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1389028 in ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts (Ubuntu) "u1 account crashes and gets removed when installing app" [Undecided,In progress]
<matv1> mardy i am not sure what we can still do at this point though
<dholbach> pete-woods, do you know if https://code.launchpad.net/~dholbach/cmake-extras/1394648 is getting landed?
<pete-woods> dholbach: Saviq is preparing a landing for some cmake-extras stuff right now
<pete-woods> not sure about that MR
<dholbach> ok...
<Saviq> pete-woods, dholbach, yeah, that's the first that's going in
<Saviq> (well, second, counting the sync from archive first)
<dholbach> thanks
<Saviq> vivid silo 1
<mardy> matv1: weeeird
<pete-woods> Saviq: is this MR already included in the archive sync? https://code.launchpad.net/~mvo/cmake-extras/fix-xgettext/+merge/240092
<Saviq> pete-woods, yes
<matv1> mardy you are telling me :)
<Saviq> pete-woods, this is actually already in the archive for some time now
<pete-woods> Saviq: okay, cool, just wanted to check
<pete-woods> will mark as merged
<Saviq> pete-woods, https://code.launchpad.net/~saviq/cmake-extras/sync-archive/+merge/243505
<Saviq> pete-woods, could get your ACK here then
<Saviq> pete-woods, tx
<Saviq> pete-woods, can I ask, what was the reason to add ALL?
<Saviq> IMO this leads to crappy commits
<Saviq> I'd rather see bug #1359667 fixed and do that there on release
<ubot5> bug 1359667 in CI Train [cu2d] "There should be a hook mechanism available" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1359667
<matv1> mardy I am thinking there may be a more fundamental corruption in the U1 account. So maybe just ditching the entire account might just be a solution.
<pete-woods> Saviq: the people using the macro weren't happy/capable of running cmake targets manually
<Saviq> pete-woods, oh interesting
<matv1> mardy but a) I am not too keen on that and b) that would prevent us from troubleshooting in the future.
<mardy> matv1: it would be interesting to see exactly at what time it's disappearing
<matv1> mardy why?
<mardy> matv1: ok, I watched your video again
<seb128> is the phone (rtm image) supposed to get poll notifications from fb messenger?
<mardy> matv1: the account creation actually failed, but for some reason the U1 account was shown in the UI
<mardy> matv1: I think the U1 account plugin is doing something weird, I'll comment on the bug
<matv1> mardy sorry i do not think that is right
<marcustomlinson> mardy: can I rather leave the ui policy as default? I'd really like the shell to reuse the same method
<mardy> matv1: can you please do this test: create the U1 account, then exit from the system settings, then reopen it and check if the account is still there
<marcustomlinson> mardy: so essentially, from scope its the equivalent of no_ui_policy, and the shell continues to work as is
<matv1> mardy sure give me a minute!
<marcustomlinson> mardy: both shell and scope use the same OnlineAccountClient API you see
<mardy> marcustomlinson: I see... well, I'm not too confident on fixing it on our side right now, I'm afraid it might break some other uses cases
<marcustomlinson> mardy: it kinda over complicates things for us
<mardy> marcustomlinson: can't you add a method which takes a flag for it, and make the current API just wrap it (so that the scopes won't change), and make the dash use the new method?
<mardy> marcustomlinson: I understand that it complicates the things, but I also see it as the right thing to do: the scope doesn't want UI, so it should specify that
<marcustomlinson> mardy: actually I do want UI. you're taking it away fomr me ;)
<marcustomlinson> mardy: the only way to do what you're saying is to construct the OnlineAccountClient class with this flag. Its ugly cause it taints the API from a scope authors pov. "DONT USE THIS!"
<matv1> mardy U1 account is stil there after leaving/restarting system settings. That was as I expected as again: only installing these 2 apps cause U1 account to crash. If i choose any other app, it installs fine.
<matv1> mardy so that must mean that U1 account is registered correctly
<mardy> matv1: no, actually I just saw that later in your video, when you go to the store to install the app, it brings you to the system settings again, and there the U1 account is no longer there
<mardy> matv1: I'll comment on the bug
<mardy> marcustomlinson: no, of course you shouldn't do that. The other option of course is duplicating the OnlineAccountClient library, but let's see what dbarth_ thinks
<matv1> mardy yes but that was caused by trying to install one of the 'bad' apps. If  I had installed any other app, the install would have gone fine and the U1 account would still have been there.
<mardy> matv1: this really cannot depend on the app; it must be just a coincidence
<matv1> mardy i know how weird it sounds believe me
<matv1> but then how am i able to replicate it almost every time
<mardy> dbarth_: so, solving the issue in the scopes is rather tedious; shall I just drop the snap-decision code path in ussoa?
<mardy> matv1: maybe the deletion of the account happens by a background process, and it's not really depending on the app you want to install
<dbarth_> mardy: just reading the logs
<matv1> mardy I can really do this 10 times in a row with either of the 2 apps, and when i do it with any other, the U1 account survives and the app installs. I kid you not. That looks to me like there is a relation
<matv1> mardy anyhow if you need anything else. Even using my U1 creds if needed. let me know. And thnks!
<mardy> matv1: I added a comment; it may be a timing issue. Maybe the account gets deleted after N seconds
<matv1> mardy great! lets hope ubuntuone-credentials can spot something. thnks again.
<ogra-mobile> sil2100, i have a complete internet breakdown over here, sorry for missing the meeting
<ogra-mobile> asac ^^^^
<asac> ogra-mobile: no problem
<asac> ogra-mobile: ping us when back online :)
<ogra-mobile> yeah, will do ... i wish i could get more than edge
<ogra-mobile> my krillin sucks indoors here
<sil2100> Oh my!
<Sujeet_Hinge> hi
<Sujeet_Hinge> any1
<Sujeet_Hinge> ???
<Sujeet_Hinge> wanna know how to installthe latest stable image on ubuntu emulator
<bzoltan> mvo:  could you find somebody to approve the new seeds?
<mvo> bzoltan: see #ubuntu-devel, any archive admin can approve it
<jdstrand> nhaines: fyi, data encryption is being worked on. also, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityAndPrivacySettings/ProtectingUserData
<zyga> beuno: hey
<beuno> zyga, hi
<zyga> beuno: we (the canonical cert team) would like to upload checkbox touch 1.0.1 to the store, it's in the com.canonical namespace, it's an unconfined application
<zyga> beuno: I heard you're the person to talk to
<zyga> beuno: the app works on kryllin and nexus 7 and is all open source and available for general consumption
<zyga> beuno: the app is designed as a post-sales support app for $secret_operator_name
<zyga> beuno: if we release 1.0.1 click package today, could we ask you to look at it and tell us how that works?
<zyga> +
<beuno> well
<beuno> jdstrand would review the app from a security perspective
<zyga> ok
<beuno> and approve it on the store
<beuno> I'm not sure who currently owns the com.canonical namespace
<zyga> ok, one thing, who do I send it to? I cannot upload it as it's com.canonical
<beuno> popey may know
<zyga> to you or jdstrand?
<zyga> ok, we'll release that to launchpad
<popey> mirv or balloons can
<zyga> and I'll send an email out to all three of you, CCing my manager
<zyga> ok
<zyga> thanks!
<zyga> :-)
<popey> actually
<popey> no
<popey> we upload com.ubuntu
<zyga> oh
<popey> one moment
<zyga> do you want us to change the app to .com.ubuntu then?
<popey> wait 1
<zyga> currently we use...
<zyga> ok
<zyga> com.canonical.certification.checkbox-touch
<popey> zyga: looking at my device the only com.canonical packages are scopes and payui, all the rest are com.ubuntu
<zyga> popey: ok, sounds good to me
<zyga> popey: the app is a generic test shell shipping the ubuntu touch test collection so that's even better
<zyga> popey: I'll corret the namespace
<jgdx> mpt, hi, do you know when you'll get a look at bug 1379850? I'm at the point where the spec fails me.
<ubot5> bug 1379850 in Ubuntu UX "[system-settings] should allow switching 2nd SIM to 3G data" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1379850
<zyga> popey: is there a policy that we should adhere to
<zyga> popey: we're okay to make the change but we'd rather do that knowing exactly so that we don't need to undo it later
<popey> zyga: for everyone else it's com.ubuntu.developer.<developername>.<appname>
<popey> we have some which are com.ubuntu.<appname> but those are core / pre-installed apps
<zyga> popey: our app is a team developed app
<zyga> popey: but that's about the <developername>.<appname> or <appname>, I'm more interested in .canonical vs .ubuntu
<popey> i explained canonical vs ubuntu already...
<popey> the only canonical ones are scopes and payui
<popey> the rest are ubuntu
<sergiusens> popey: zyga webapps are com.ubuntu.developer.[web app launchpad team] fwiw
<popey> zyga: whats the team name?
<zyga> popey: checkbox-dev
<zyga> popey: or cert+infra (not sure what's the team name is now)
<popey> will there be more than one checkbox app?
<zyga> popey: the code is owned by checkbox-dev
<zyga> popey: it's not likely, we want to make that app play nice on all devices
<zyga> popey: it will probably drop "touch" some time later
<zyga> popey: and will be used on the desktop as well
<popey> so com.ubuntu.checkbox then is what I'd use.
<zyga> popey: okay, that sounds good to me
<zyga> popey: thanks
<jdstrand> fyi, if it is in com.canonical, we can wave it through
<jdstrand> (ie, unconfined is ok)
<mpt> jgdx, unfortunately itâs #17 on my list at the moment
<jdstrand> the manual review will always be triggered of course, but we can get it in easily
<jgdx> mpt, right, but you're so efficient so that must mean it's done by, what, Friday?
<mpt> jgdx, something like that ;-)
<ogra_> yay
<taiebot> Does login on the here maps web-app work? i have tried few times but it does not seem to work.
<oSoMoN> Mirv, in case you want to rebuild webbrowser-app for Qt 5.4: https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/webbrowser-app/qt54/+merge/243551
<viejotren> Hi, I'm working with ubuntu-sdk and with thje scope template, I did some modifications, such as images, colors and some options, but for some reasons those changes are not displayed, I rebuilt the project already, am i missing something?
<mvo> bzoltan: https://code.launchpad.net/~mvo/click/chroot-15.04-multiarch/+merge/243493 - works for me now
<bzoltan> mvo: I check it in a sec
<mvo> bzoltan: no rush, but if it works I can land it tomorrow morning or later tonight
<bzoltan> mvo:  OK
<mvo> bzoltan: but I'm really happy with the solutionn, feels very clean now
<bzoltan> mvo:  yes it feels better now.
<bzoltan> mvo:  could you please push an other change into the sdk-tools to contain the cross qmake?
<taiebot> Blabble is broken on my phone. Its weird i used to have it installed but no it appears not there. so when i try to install it it fails.
<popey> ogra_: I've been tempted to get a OnePlus phone to try and go through the porting guide steps
<ogra_> popey, oh god
<ogra_> i guess there will be many many roadblocks ...
<ogra_> but doing a port is the only way to get it back in shape
<rodney77> Hi, do you guys have a list of devices that support ubuntu touch? Is it still just nexus devices?
<popey> ogra_: yeah, but at least there's an AOSP build, which helps, and I think it's MKT
<ogra_> ah, if you have an AOSP tree that shouldnt be to hard at least, yeah
<popey> what I don't have is the device â»
<popey> need an invite
<nerochiaro> alesage: hi, any news on how to add code coverage to that branch I mentioned to you yesterday ?
<nerochiaro> alesage: if you find out can you please send me an email ? i won't be online in the next few days
<nerochiaro> thanks
<alesage> nerochiaro, ok--sorry, slipped my mind, will do this week :)
<nerochiaro> alesage: much appreciated
<alesage> nerochiaro, and send a mail/bug
<nhaines> jdstrand: vague, handwavey plans that aren't prioritised doesn't make Ubuntu Touch more secure than Android today, when a novice user has a tablet in his hands and is asking which OS should he flash to be secure.
<lotuspsychje> security is a vague conecept...the moment you get online its a risk
<dobey> that's why i live in a cave and don't use phones or the internet at all
<lotuspsychje> lol
<tester> hi
<jdstrand> nhaines: that was harsh. they aren't vague handwavy plans-- it is something being designed now
<jdstrand> so, no, there is no fs encryption no, but yes, there will be
<nhaines> jdstrand: Features get postponed all the time and who knows when something designed now will see a phone (July?).  I always advise people to make decisions based on features present and not features promised.
<nhaines> So while I'm looking forward to full-device encryption (which will almost certainly be solid and secure), it has to ship before I use it as a feature bulletpoint with users.
#ubuntu-touch 2014-12-04
<jdstrand> nhaines: of course. I was merely stating that the work is planned and current being designed/implemented
<UbUntUToUchLover> 8Hello, everybody! If you have anything about ovation, let me know!
<UbUntUToUchLover> Any word from wesnoth? I'm curious about the ovation image.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Did anybody look at the links I left last night? The Russian one is the one I want to know about
<UbUntUToUchLover>  nhaines: You available? I have a question - What do you use to download Ubuntu apps under Ubuntu Touch? Is it Software Manager?
<UbUntUToUchLover> If it is, then the ovation image has a major drawback - I couldn't download anything!
<UbUntUToUchLover> I mean, it doesn'c have Software Manager.
<UbUntUToUchLover> doesn't
<nhaines> UbUntUToUchLover: you use the Ubuntu App Store.  It's a Unity lens.
<nhaines> It works just like the Application lens in Unity 7 except better.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Hmmm. The ovation image didn't have anything like that. Wesnoth forgot to put that in there.
<nhaines> It may not have existed at the time.
<nhaines> If the main interface has a purple background, then you just search right from the apps lens.  If it's white, you should have a large orange Ubuntu App Store icon available.
<UbUntUToUchLover> I was able to use the "apt-get" command under the terminal app, but it develped initramfs-tools errors.
<nhaines> Yes, the root filesystem is read-only.
<UbUntUToUchLover> So, how do I modify that? Can I change a read-only root filesystem, or is that only for the Ubuntu developers?
<UbUntUToUchLover>  nhaines: I just read what you said a while ago about backgrounds. I remember that wesnoth used the Saucy Salamander 13.10 arm image, specifically saucy-preinstalled-touch-armhf.zip. According to the link, it directs to an image from October 18th, 2013, but the page doesn't exist.
<nhaines> UbUntUToUchLover: probably the old one, then.  No app store.
<nhaines> You can make the root filesystem read/write, and it is only for developers.  I think there's a special file you touch.  I don't remember if there's a phablet-* command for your computer to automate it.  It might have changed in 14.04 or 14.10.
<UbUntUToUchLover> What can I do, then? I'm positive that I can get Ubuntu Touch to work well under my Nook; I'm just not sure how.
<nhaines> UbUntUToUchLover: if you make the system read/write, you can no longer apply updates and have to reflash again if you want updates.
<nhaines> UbUntUToUchLover: unless you're a hardware developer there's not really a lot you can do.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Hmm, what a predicament! Still, I believe I can do it, even though it's still very much in the beta stage. Since some of the Ubuntu Desktop command also work under Ubuntu Touch, is there a command or list of commands I can run from Touch that might fix the initrwamfs-tools problem?
<UbUntUToUchLover> I meant, of course, initramfs-tools.
<UbUntUToUchLover> How about changing it from a laptop? I also have Ubuntu Desktop, so if I hook my Nook with Ubuntu Touch to my laptop that has Ubuntu Desktop, can I be able to fix it using a terminal or GUI program
<UbUntUToUchLover> ?
<nhaines> You can use it as a CLI-only system but you can never run apt-get upgrade because apt-get can't handle the various paritioning and breaks.
<UbUntUToUchLover> What about adb?
<nhaines> That's how you connect to it.  But you're still stuck with Ubuntu 13.10 ARM stuff.
<UbUntUToUchLover> We
<UbUntUToUchLover> Oops.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Well, is there another program I can use? Maybe Android has something that I can use to fix the problem. After all, isn't Ubuntu Touch still Android-based?
<nhaines> Ubuntu Touch has never, ever been Android-based.
<nhaines> A stripped Android kernel with graphics and sound drivers runs in an LXC container that gets booted after Ubuntu boots.
<Elleo> UbUntUToUchLover: you can make the image writable by running "phablet-config writable-image" from your desktop (with the phablet-tools package installed)
<Elleo> UbUntUToUchLover: not 100% certain if it'll work with such an old image though
<nhaines> UbUntUToUchLover: that command creates an empty file on the filesystem.  So if it doesn't work, it's harmless.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Wow! I didn't know that! Thanks, Elleo!
<UTL> Ubuntu Touch Lover. I've switched over to my laptop running Ubuntu Desktop.
<UTL> Say, I know that Linux Mint is based on Ubuntu, somewhat. Is it possible to put Linux Mint on a tablet?
<UTL> I would ask under the Linux Mint channel, but I'm not getting a response.
<nhaines> Presumably, if you had an x86 tablet.
<UTL> Aww, nuts! I was hoping there was an arm port!
<nhaines> There *might* be, but then it would have to be ported specifically to each individual ARM platform.
<UTL> Yeah, as I figured. However, on the Linux Mint Community website, there's a link to a YouTube video where somebody has it on a tablet, but it's a specific type of tablet, and probably not arm-based.
<UTL> Even though Linux Mint is not totally Ubuntu (in fact, I read that they're becoming Debian-only), I thought that anybody here might know if it can be put on a tablet.
<UTL> For anyone interested, here's a link, but I'm still a Ubuntu supporter: http://community.linuxmint.com/idea/view/814
<dholbach> good morning
<oSoMoN> popey, hey, do you still maintain this regular checkout of all apps in the store?
<popey> oSoMoN: yes. http://popey.mooo.com/mirror/clicks/2014/12/2014-12-04-050001/
<oSoMoN> popey, thanks!
<justCarakas> is there going to be a party when there are 1000 clicks
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Cookie Day! :-D
<UbUntUToUchLover> I ran across an idea: Someone managed to flash Ubuntu Touch to a phablet very similar to a Nexus by editing some of the properties of the build.prop file, thus tricking it to flash the mako image. Even though the Nook is far different from a Nexus, is it possible to do this to the Nook, as well?
<popey> sounds likely to fail to me
<UbUntUToUchLover> Yes, but figure this: The Nexus 10 is a ten-inch tablet. The Nook HD+ is usually a nine-inch. I figure the only problems may be that the buttons become unresponsive to some apps.
<ogra_> that build prop thing was most likely the two nexus 7 tablets ... one is called deb, the other is flo and they only differ b an added 3G modem
<UbUntUToUchLover> I'm gonna have to find that link...
<ogra_> in such cases you can indeed just fiddle a bit, all the drivers and the kernel would be the same aynway ... but that wont work if you dont have identical architectures underneath
<ogra_> (like ... 100% identical ...)
<UbUntUToUchLover> Here. It's not the link I remember, but it's similar: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=48884484#post48884484
<UbUntUToUchLover> Nuts! I closed my IRC app again! Sorry if I missed your responses.
<popey> you didnt
<popey> (miss anything)
<UbUntUToUchLover> Unfortunately, I've tried the Ubuntu Dual-Boot app, but no matter what image I chose for the Nook, it always halted with the same error.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Well, this is interesting, but it doesn't solve my problem: http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/try-ubuntu-touch-right-now-ubuntu-computer/
<UbUntUToUchLover> I'm trying it now.
<ogra_> ugh, someone shjould have told him that this is outdated by a year ... http://davidplanella.org/ubuntu-emulator-quickstart-guide/ would have been the better guide
<Riddell> what would it take to make a kubuntu phone image using the same base as ubuntu touch but different UI? is it just like another flavour of ubuntu or is there anything more?
<ogra_> Riddell, you would have to support mir
<ogra_> (or come up with an Xorg layer that can talk to hybris/android HAL)
<popey> or use wayland?
<popey> isn't that what sailfish does? wayland + hybris & HAL?
<ogra_> dunno, perhaps ... oour hybris layer has never been tested with wayland or Xorg i think
<popey> sure, it'd need a fair amount of work I imagine. Fun project if you have time Riddell â»
<Riddell> hmm, sounds a bit scary
<ogra_> and you would indeed need a lot of work to talk to all the sensors etc i guess
<ogra_> there are Qt modules for most of them, but i bet you need a lot new code to make use of the features
<UTL> ogra: You obviously didn't know that this is also UbUntUToUchLover. I am using UTL under Ubuntu desktop. I will check that link you put out here.
<UTL> Seems like I ran across that once before, but since it had nothing to do with my current problem, I ignored it.
<UTL> Thanks anyway, ogra.
<ogra_> Riddell, well, if you have a supported device you can surely try it out
<Riddell> ogra_: like a nexus 5?
<ogra_> heh, well, thats not supported, but runs good enough for such fiddling i guess
<Riddell> what is supported?
<ogra_> mako (N4), flo (the later N7 model) and partially manta (N10)
<ogra_> but all you need for a start is to have a workinng base, a working lxc container and you need to know the UI comes upp with ubuntu ... that should be sufficient for a start
<ogra_> then you need to start replacing bits and pieces of it
<UTL> Ugh! I can't get out on the internet under the Touch Emulator, and the background is messed up. I was hoping to get a better idea of a working Ubuntu Touch image.
<seb128> bzoltan, mvo, hey, is that a known issue http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/click.png (trying to create a touch project on qtcreator on current vivid amd64)
<bzoltan> seb128:  yes, it is a known issue and it is being fxed
<seb128> any workaround meanwhile?
<seb128> or ppa I can opt in?
<bzoltan> seb128:  but the end of that logs is more interesting
<mvo> seb128: use https://code.launchpad.net/~mvo/click/chroot-15.04-multiarch
<seb128> mvo, danke
<mvo> bzoltan: hm, the error looks unfamiliar though
<mvo> seb128: it might be a different error, but the ppa should fix at least one known issue
<seb128> mvo, let me try that
<seb128> mvo, in what ppa is that?
<seb128> http://people.canonical.com/~platform/citrain_dashboard/#?distro=ubuntu&q=click has nothing
<mvo> seb128: I don't think there is a ppa just yet
<mvo> seb128: I meant to put it it into a silo today
<seb128> mvo, k, I'm going to wait then, thanks
 * seb128 wants to play with the sdk but no luck for a week trying to get qtcreator to work :-/
<bzoltan> mvo:  you ain't gonna put that into no silo today :)
<bzoltan> mvo:  feel free to push it to the Dev Tools PPA
<mvo> bzoltan: heh :) indeed
<bzoltan> mvo: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-sdk-team/+archive/ubuntu/tools-development
<mvo> bzoltan: I'm currently not in the team (I unsubscribed because I got all the MP spam from your busy team ;)
<seb128> mardy, hey
<seb128> mardy, valgrind often workaround segfaults but you likely get invalid read or write errors in the log still no?
<mardy> seb128: no, under valgrind it was just working
<seb128> mardy, well, it might still trigger invalid read/write in the valgrid log
<seb128> even if it works
<mardy> seb128: but anyway, I hope I found the issue; I'm just not sure how to fix it... vala ownership is quite complicated
<seb128> that's often the case
<mardy> seb128: nope, valgrind was perfectly happy
<seb128> mardy, maybe larsu or desrt can help with vala questions
 * larsu peeks in
<bzoltan> mvo:  OK, I will push then your branch
<seb128> mvo, bzoltan, same error "failed to write session file: No such file or directory" using the click fix from mvo
<mardy> larsu: hi! So, I have a GLib library with an object which has a method which returns a GHashTable, without incrementing its reference count
<zyga> mvo: hey, long time no see :)
<mardy> larsu: then, in the vala code, I'm instantiating the object, calling the method, then deleting the object, and finally I want to return the GHashtable
<bzoltan> seb128:  could you please pastbenin the full logs. Usually at the bottom you see the real reason.
<zyga> popey: hey, we're ready for the release, what should we submit for security review?
<larsu> mardy: uh oh. Is the method annotated with Returns: (transfer full)?
<mardy> larsu: this currently does not work, because the GHashTable gets deleted when the object is destroyed; how can I tell vala to increse the HT reference count, before deleting the object?
<popey> zyga: you just submit the app like any other. if it needs security review we get notified
<seb128> bzoltan, mvo, http://paste.ubuntu.com/9367159/
<mardy> larsu: the library method is "transfer null", because it doesn't increment the reference count
<zyga> popey: well, wait, I cannot submit anything (com.ubuntu), I can only send it to someone I presume
<mardy> larsu: the vapi file lists it as "unowned"
<zyga> popey: and I was wondering how to attach the source
<mardy> larsu: so, it looks like that everything is working fine if I keep a reference to the object in a private member (that is, if I don't destroy it)
<larsu> mardy: hm, vala should do the right thing in this case. Try casting it with (owned)
<zyga> popey: or should I actually go to developer.ubuntu.com and try to submit it there?
<bzoltan> seb128:  why the armhf at the end?
<larsu> mardy: the hash table, I mean
<popey> zyga: yes, we discussed this yesterday remember
<mardy> larsu: I tried, I get a compiler error; let me paste it...
<popey> zyga: mirv and balloons can upload with that namespace
<seb128> bzoltan, end of what?
<mvo> seb128: hm, anything unusual on your system? do you have /var/lib/schroot/session/ at all?
<zyga> popey: yep, I'm just confused as to how to do that excatly, just send you an email with link to the click file?
<seb128> bzoltan, I just click the "create new kit" in qtcreator, dunno
<mardy> ../common/accounts.vala:27.16-27.49: error: Reference transfer not supported for this expression
<mardy>         return (owned) auth_data.get_parameters();
<mardy> larsu: ^
<mardy>                ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
<seb128> mvo, it's a test box, nothing unsual that I can say
<bzoltan> seb128:  try `sudo click -a armhf -f ubuntu-sdk-15.04 create`
<popey> zyga: yeah, or ping them on irc
<larsu> mardy: bah. Can you assign it to a new variable?
<zyga> popey: ok, that's all I needed, thanks :)
<larsu> mardy: HashTable<> x = (owned) auth_data.get_parameters(I)
<mardy> larsu: if it works, I'm going to kill someone
<seb128> mvo, no /var/lib/schroot/session no
<larsu> mardy: ya, I hate vala's memory managementt. It's all over the place and not documented well
<mardy> larsu: no, I get the same error on that assignment
<mvo> seb128: confusing, if you create that dir, does that help?
<seb128> mvo, what is supposed to create it?
<mardy> larsu: but I don't want to waste your time -- I got a solution anyway, by not destroying the object, I was just curious to see if I could have done better
<larsu> mardy: ya not sure, sorry
<seb128> mvo, started again a kit creation, telling you in 15 minutes
<mardy> larsu: nm, thanks anyway
<mvo> seb128: well, something is supposed to create it
<mvo> bzoltan: if you make me a ubuntu-sdk-team member again I will upload to your ppa
<bzoltan> mvo:  I will add you, but I can do the upload this time.. I started already :)
<mvo> bzoltan: cool, even better
<larsu> mardy: so, desrt says this works: http://paste.fedoraproject.org/156570/17699679/
<mardy> larsu: right, that should work; let me try...
<kissiel> zyga, okay, I've got the package
<zyga> kissiel: let's move there
<zyga> kissiel: oh
<zyga> we're here
<kissiel> :D
<zyga> kissiel: link please :)
<kissiel> zyga, https://www.dropbox.com/s/sq97yacz3ykat89/com.ubuntu.checkbox_1.0.1_armhf.click?dl=0
<zyga> kissiel: ok, getting and testing
<seb128> mardy, you should join #ubuntu-desktop so larsu wouldn't have to proxy the discussion with desrt and you between channels ;-)
<larsu> seb128: thanks :)
<mardy> oh, right
<zyga> Mirv: hey
<zyga> Mirv: we're (kissiel and me) from the hardware cert team
<zyga> Mirv: we've prepared an application that we'd like to upload to the click store
<zyga> Mirv: kissiel sent a link earlier there
<popey> zyga: actually if Mirv uploads it, it'll be "owned" by "Ubuntu Core Apps Developers", right Mirv ?
<zyga> popey: I don't think that's a problem really
<zyga> popey: as long as we can upload it over and over
<zyga> popey: it's all GPL
<popey> ok
<zyga> popey: and we welcome contributors
<zyga> kissiel: it works on my kryllin
<zyga> kissiel: I'll check exportt
<zyga> kissiel: it just crashed
<zyga> kissiel: on startup (resume propmpt)
<kissiel> zyga, oh
<kissiel> zyga, testing
<zyga> kissiel: doesn't crash anymore
<zyga> kissiel: maybe clear .cache
<zyga> kissiel: and try again
<zyga> kissiel: I cannot reproduce that anymore
<zyga> kissiel: I think it's good
<kissiel> zyga, w8, I want to test one more thing
<zyga> kissiel: reports are empty?
<zyga> kissiel: nah just mpt bug
<zyga> kissiel: they are ok
<kissiel> zyga, stable here
<zyga> Mirv: ok, this is good
<zyga> kissiel: upload that to launchpad
<zyga> kissiel: and sign the click package as indicated
<kissiel> zyga, allrighty
<mpt> zyga, are you calling me buggy?
<zyga> mpt: no, where? :-)
<zyga> ah
<zyga> media transfer protocol :)
<zyga> I don't know how I wrote that down as mpt, not mtp
<mpt> Itâs a common mistake ;-)
<UTL> I read somewhere that some Ubuntu Touch images are wrapped around Cyanogenmod. Is that true?
<zyga> balloons: hey
<zyga> balloons: or maybe you
<popey> UTL: i think we switched to AOSP.
<zyga> balloons: do you have a moment to upload our app to the store under com.ubuntu?
<ogra_> UTL, not "wrapped around" no
<UTL> AOSP? I've heard that. What is that?
<ogra_> the free android source
<balloons> zyga, let me look and ensure I can
<zyga> balloons: thanks a lot
<ogra_> but we dont "wrap" around it, you boot into normal ubuntu. like on your desktop ... later there gets an lxc container started in which some android services run ... to give you access to the closed source drivers
<zyga> balloons: https://launchpad.net/checkbox-touch/trunk/1.0.1
<zyga> balloons: that's the click package
<zyga> balloons: it actually works on armhf and x86
<zyga> balloons: so if there's a way to upload it for other arches (emulator) then that's doable as well
<nuclearbob> did ubuntu-device-flash stop supporting --revision?  I'm not sure if this is an ogra_ question or somebody else
<popey> balloons: sounds like he wants one of your patented fat packages â»
<zyga> balloons: it's a pure python/qml app with duplicated libs for all architectures
<popey> nuclearbob: it does still support it, I think you need to add "touch" first
<balloons> zyga, and it's already in the store right?
<ogra_> nuclearbob, more a sergiusens one, but no, it didnt stop supporting --revision
<nuclearbob> popey: I have touch first
<nuclearbob> ogra_, thanks, I'll ask sergiusens
<popey> i still see it in the online help
<balloons> zyga, yes we can make it a fat package.
<zyga> balloons: nope, that's the first upload
<nuclearbob> yeah, me too
<zyga> balloons: great!
<ogra_> would be evil to drop that since QA uses it daily :)
<nuclearbob> but I get unknown flag `revision'
<nuclearbob> ogra_, that's why I'm concerned :)
<balloons> zyga, ahh ok, in that case, let's upload it. I need an icon, description and screenshots as well ideally
<balloons> also a support link or email address
<balloons> brb
<ogra_> nuclearbob, i'm sure davmor2 used it this week :)
<ogra_> (or last at least)
<nuclearbob> maybe davmor2 can tell me what I'm doing wrong.  I've tried it as the last argument, the first argument after touch, and a couple other places
<zyga> kissiel: ^^
<zyga> kissiel: let's make some screenshots please
<zyga> balloons: do you need a given form factor?
<kissiel> zyga, sure
<zyga> kissiel: and the icon
<zyga> balloons: there's an icon in the click file (svg)
<davmor2> nuclearbob: ubuntu-device-flash --channel devel-proposed --revision 39 --wipe this works fine for me if that is the kinda of thing you are doing
<zyga> balloons: we can extract it for you
<zyga> kissiel: I can make screenshots from kryllin
<popey> alan@deep-thought ~> ubuntu-device-flash --channel devel-proposed --revision 40 --wipe
<popey> DEPRECATED: Implicit 'touch' subcommand assumed
<kissiel> zyga, what is preferred? both?
<popey> unknown flag `revision'
<popey> 0.4+15.04.20141125-0ubuntu1 of u-d-f, what version you have davmor2 ?
<zyga> kissiel: don't know
<zyga> kissiel: weird, it just crashed on startup
<zyga> kissiel: where are the logs?
<nuclearbob> davmor2, popey, thanks, I'm using a different channel, but not having any luck with either one.  I'll make sure all my stuff is up to date
<sergiusens> nuclearbob: ubuntu-device-flash --revision ## touch --channel ...
<zyga> kissiel: now it works again
<kissiel> zyga, .cache/upstart
<kissiel> zyga, I had to restart my device one time
<nuclearbob> sergiusens: so --revision comes before --touch ?
<popey> that works
<kissiel> zyga, like previous stuff was not cleared from mem
<sergiusens> nuclearbob: not --touch, touch, a positional command
<nuclearbob> er, yeah, touch, not --touch, sorry
<zyga> kissiel: I don't have that directory
<sergiusens> nuclearbob: I sent an announcement email to ubuntu phone a month ago with this info ;-)
<Mirv> popey: I haven't thought about the ownership part or how the stuff looks that I upload..
<kissiel> zyga, IDK then
<nuclearbob> sergiusens: yeah, I'm sure I read it at the time, but I'm using some ci tools, I'll file an mp with them, thanks
<Mirv> zyga: ok.
<ogra_> sergiusens, we're all old men nowadays ... you have to re-send that once a month for two months at least :P
<UTL> So, if I flash Cyanogenmod/Android first and then flash Ubuntu Touch, it refers to the previous image - or does it come with Android services?
<zyga> Mirv: baloons is helping us now
<Mirv> zyga: so if you need something, give a direct link and I'll look at the upload.
<Mirv> zyga: oh, checkbox is coming to the phone?
<ogra_> UTL, it completely wipes your phone during install
<zyga> Mirv: it is ready now :)
<UTL> I guess that means that it has some services preinstalled.
<zyga> ogra_: is upstart logging disabled on rtm?
<zyga> ogra_: I don't have per-app log files
<zyga> (somehow()
<ogra_> zyga, nope
<Mirv> zyga: cool! :)
<zyga> hmm
 * zyga reboots the phone
<zyga> Mirv: it's also converged so expect to see it on the desktop soon
<ogra_> UTL, no, why would using hardware drivers have anything to do with android services ?
<UTL> Yeah, I guess you're right.
<ogra_> zyga, they should live in ~/.cache/upstart/
<Mirv> zyga: should you get the click package automatically created at jenkins from some code branch? I also prefer fetching .click:s over VPN instead of downloading from random dropbox links :)
<seb128> mvo, where is the list of click chroots stored on disk?
<zyga> ogra_: I'll reboot and see, I didn't have that before
<zyga> Mirv: oh, don't please
<zyga> Mirv: the package is still built manually but we'll get better at it
<zyga> balloons: Mirv: can we agree who's doing the upload
<zyga> not to get two somehow :)
<zyga> Mirv: the signed click package is on https://launchpad.net/checkbox-touch/trunk/1.0.1
<balloons> k, I'm back.
<Mirv> zyga: the second upload would be rejcted :)
<zyga> Mirv: that's good to know, I just don't want to waste anyone's time
<zyga> kissiel: I'm making screenshots now, just one more
<zyga> Mirv, balloons: so who shall upload it?
<Mirv> zyga: I can
<zyga> ok
<zyga> kissiel: ^^
<balloons> k, I'll let it be. Are you making it a fat package?
<zyga> ok 4 screenshots ready
<Mirv> zyga: popey: I haven't seen this error before http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/9367860/
<kissiel> zyga, Mirv : https://www.dropbox.com/s/kr4q9jiaakyies7/checkbox-touch-flo-screens.tar.gz?dl=0
<popey> i suspect datacentre timeouts
<popey> i just had all kinds of timeouts in lp and others
 * Mirv retries
 * zyga tarballs his screenshots
<mvo> seb128: /var/lib/schroot/chroots and /etc/schroot
<seb128> mvo, thanks
<mvo> hey zyga, just saw your earlier message, hello to you as well :)
<seb128> mvo, I wiped out /var/lig/schroot/chroots and it was still telling me the target existed ;-)
<Mirv> balloons: ok, would you like to try from that LP address? I'm just getting that error again and again.
<Mirv> I also have never uploaded such a big .click package, although gallery has been 5MB
<zyga> Mirv: uploading screenshots ...
<zyga> Mirv: perhaps we can trm it down
<zyga> Mirv: to be just armhf
<Mirv> zyga: I'd think the size shouldn't be any problem, but this'd be something else
<zyga> kissiel: ^^ can you try just to see how big it is
<zyga> Mirv: ok
<Mirv> it's 8MB now, not a big leap from gallery's 5MB
<zyga> Mirv: https://www.dropbox.com/s/y2igzd90sa0jbp2/checkbox-screenshots-1.0.1.kryllin.tar.gz?dl=0
<kissiel> zyga, sure, trimming
<kissiel> zyga, Mirv: It's 4.6MiB after trimming
<mvo> seb128: yeah, kill it i /etc/schroot as well
<mvo> seb128: its a bit of a idiosyncrasy of click that it does not make that easier or detect that its only half there
<seb128> mvo, worked, danke
<balloons> Mirv, which address is failing for you?
<zyga> checkbox is breaking the click store :)
<Mirv> balloons: trying to upload the .click from https://launchpad.net/checkbox-touch/trunk/1.0.1
<zyga> darn :)
<zyga> we should add a test for that (head explodes)
<balloons> Mirv, right, yes I have the click from that page
<mvo> seb128: cool and chroot creation works now too? after you created that sessio ndir?
<seb128> mvo, yes
<seb128> mvo, thanks for that as well
<seb128> mvo, still unsure what component is buggy/why that didn't happen automatically though
<balloons> Mirv, so I will create a new application for it and try uploading
<balloons> Mirv, zyga seems to have uploaded into the store fine for me
<Mirv> balloons: right, I don't know how to create new apps since I have always just uploaded updates
<Mirv> balloons: great!
<zyga> balloons: great
<zyga> balloons: fetch screenshots from the two tarballs me and kissiel sent
<zyga> balloons: both on dropbox in the backlog here
<balloons> zyga, can I have a tagline and description from you?
<zyga> balloons: the icon is in the click itself (svg), tell us if you need something else
<zyga> oh
<zyga> hmm
<zyga> =System testing utility for Ubuntu
<zyga> description...
<zyga> hmm
<zyga> kissiel: ^^ any ideas
<bzoltan> mvo:  /build/buildd/click-0.4.35.1~0ubuntu1~0vivid3/click/chroot.py:179:21: W291 trailing whitespace
<kissiel> zyga, System  testing
<mvo> seb128: yeah, no idea, pleae file a bug for click so that it does not get lost
<seb128> mvo, ok, thanks
<bzoltan> mvo: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/191832332/buildlog_ubuntu-vivid-amd64.click_0.4.35.1~0ubuntu1~0vivid3_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<zyga> "Checkbox is a system testing application for the Ubuntu platform. It can be used to verify that the device you are using is functioning correctly. Detailed results of the test can be exported to a report which may be of use for post-sales support"
<zyga> balloons: I don't know if you need any stuff like license, links etc, the code is on lp:checkbox, bugs can be filed on lp:checkbox or lp:checkbox-touch)
<zyga> balloons: the code is GPLv3
<balloons> zyga, so I see you have multi-arch libs in here..
<zyga> balloons: with small bits of LGPLv3
<zyga> balloons: yep
<zyga> balloons: it's a qml + python + multiarch .so click file
<balloons> and tests.. but I don't see a manifest yet. how did you make this?
<zyga> balloons: manifest?
<zyga> kissiel: ^^
<zyga> balloons: click build
<kissiel> balloons, it's there
<zyga> balloons: we have a script that gets the libaries from the ubuntu archive, unpacks them and does click build
<zyga> balloons: we don't compile anything ourselves
<pmcgowan> pitti, hi are you the right person to shepherd the landing to fix https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1337200
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1337200 in upower (Ubuntu RTM) "High CPU due to excessive device changed signals from upower" [High,Confirmed]
<zyga> balloons: the only manifest I can think of is in lp:checkbox in the directory checkbox-touch/
<zyga> balloons: manifest.json
<balloons> also I see click-review fails due to the maintainer email domain @canonical.com
<mvo> bzoltan: sorry for that, please merge again fixed in r552 i my branch
<zyga> balloons: oh
<balloons> zyga, because of how's its built it seems like it will only be recognized as armhf in the store
<zyga> balloons: how should we build it then?
<balloons> there's also quite a bit of stuff that isn't needed in the package, hence my asking
<zyga> balloons: such as/
<pitti> pmcgowan: quite overloaded ATM -- I thought kenvandine was landing this?
<balloons> the readme's, shell and build scripts, tests
<pmcgowan> pitti, ok talking to sil2100  it may be handled
<zyga> balloons: that's true, we don't separate those out (tests), as for build scripts and readmes we could do that but I'm not sure of a good way to do it
<kenvandine> pitti, i'm not that comfortable with powerd and upower... i can take a swing if needed though
<balloons> zyga, does the project build with cmake or qmake?
<pitti> I thought it was all already in a silo?
<zyga> balloons: neither
<zyga> balloons: it's not compiled
<sil2100> kenvandine: hey!
<pmcgowan> kenvandine, seems te silo installs cleanly, what was the concern?
<zyga> balloons: it's just a qml + js + python combo
<sil2100> kenvandine: so, we actually *want* upower and powerd along with this silo ;)
<kenvandine> pitti, i had it in a silo for testing, not necessarily ready to land
<balloons> zyga, but you have.. ohh the compiled code is libpython :-)
<zyga> balloons: our build is 1) get deps from the repo, unpack, 2) click build
<zyga> balloons: it's straight from the archive :)
<sil2100> kenvandine: some of our guys + QA tested it a little bit before and it helps
<kenvandine> i just pulled the vivid packages for that silo, which might include more stuff than we want
<zyga> balloons: no need to build our own fork, the one in the archive is good and has security updates that we can integrate trivially
<balloons> ahh I see the build-me
<kenvandine> i know system-settings in that silo includes lots of stuff
<kenvandine> i can prepare a branch for settings
<zyga> balloons: the release we're trying to get into the store will be merged by tarmac soon, the tag is checkbox-touch-v1.0.1
<zyga> balloons: kissiel can tell you how it was built exactly (we used released components of the test data and plainbox (internal dependency)
<kissiel> balloons, it pretty much takes whole working directory with all necessary libs and runs click build on that directory, it does not cherry-pick files to embedd into click...
<balloons> ok, well we will need to fix the click-review.. the store won't take it as-is. Also I assume you *have* to unconfined? that will force a manual review
<zyga> balloons: if there's a way for us to not include everything (an inclusion manifest) we could do that
<zyga> balloons: other than that, we don't have that much needless stuff there
<balloons> zyga, the thing to do would be to output to a build dir and click build it there. So just copying over the bits needed to run
<zyga> hmm, ok, we can think of doing that
<zyga> balloons: is this a blocker for 1.0.1?
<zyga> balloons: we want to put that into the store and iterate
<zyga> balloons: and catch things like this on the first upload
<balloons> no, the only blocker is the click-review complaints
<zyga> balloons: to know what to change
<zyga> ok
<balloons> kissiel, also so where exactly is the manifest file? I don't see it at all
<zyga> balloons: so what are those? the @canonical email?
<zyga> balloons: checkbox-touch/manifest.json?
<balloons> zyga, yes, security of unconfined and the canonical email much match the namespace
<zyga> balloons: ahh
<balloons>  (Your email domain needs to match the reverse package namespace.)
<zyga> balloons: ok
<zyga> balloons: can we put zkrynicki@ubuntu.com?
<balloons> that should work
<zyga> balloons: we cannot put an @ubuntu team name, can we?
<zyga> balloons: unconfined is how it's meant to be
<kissiel> balloons, whoa, `click contents com.ubuntu.checkbox_1.0.1_armhf.click |grep manifest` returned none o.O
<zyga> balloons: currently we don't use it much but later on some tests will have to
<zyga> kissiel: weird?
<kissiel> zyga, weird indeed
<zyga> balloons: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~checkbox-dev/checkbox/trunk/view/head:/checkbox-touch/manifest.json that's how it is supposed to look like
<balloons> kissiel, heh, good to know I'm not crazy
<balloons> I want to make sure the manifest is correct
<zyga> (we still call it -touch in a few places, mostly not to collide with the desktop-y version
<balloons> so we should update architecture in the manifest to say you support i386 and amd64 also
<zyga> balloons: how should that look like
<balloons>  "architecture": ["armhf", "i386", "amd64"],
<zyga> balloons: ok
<zyga> kissiel: I'll make those changes
<zyga> balloons: so the email and that
 * balloons checking on other thing
<balloons> zyga, I think it would be useful to also thinking about including the extra x-source entry that lists the bzr source and rev number
<zyga> balloons: oh, great
<balloons> not something that has to be done now, just thought
<zyga> balloons: any examples?
<zyga> balloons: sure, I want that
<balloons> zyga, well we actually do it a couple ways.. let me get an example
<balloons> zyga, http://paste.ubuntu.com/9368397/
<zyga> balloons: fantastic, adding
<zyga> balloons: how should vcs-bzr-revno be maintained?
<zyga> balloons: can we use tags there?
<zyga> balloons: or just ints
<zyga> balloons: especially since all our landings to trunk are autmoatic merges so the real revno will be like 123.5.1
<balloons> zyga, also notice we like to include the bzrevno in the version, but not required.     "version": "3.2.@BZR_REVNO@",
<zyga> oh, nice
<zyga> what expands @BZR_REVNO@?
<zyga> click build?
<balloons> zyga, yes it's built with cmake
<zyga> balloons: ah, we don't have cmake
<zyga> balloons: ok, we'll do it once we have cmake
<balloons> right, so that's up to you.. the x-source data is built the same way
<balloons> I think it makes sense at least to denote the click build in the store corresponds to the revision number somewhere.
<zyga> balloons: thanks
<balloons> so however you wish to keep track of it :-)
<zyga> balloons: as long as that data can be a tag, that's okay
<zyga> balloons: we're always tagging releases
<zyga> balloons: and matching tags to builds is easy
<balloons> ok, so let me finish this upload, then we'll need a new click
<sil2100> kenvandine: ok, just give us a sign once you're happy with the system-settings part in the silo ;)
<sil2100> kenvandine: since we're most interested in the powerd parts
<balloons> every upload has to be a newer version number, so keep that in mind. If you fail review, you need a newer version to upload
<kenvandine> sil2100, i just updated the settings branch for that silo
<sil2100> kenvandine: I think you won't be able to rebuild it right now though
<kenvandine> the silo includes a sync of indicator-power too, so we should make sure that doesn't include unwanted bits
<sil2100> Since CI Train is still down
<kenvandine> yeah...
<kenvandine> sil2100, but my MP is updated :)
<sil2100> \o/
<sil2100> Excellent ;)
<sil2100> Thanks
<zyga> balloons: ok
<zyga> balloons: I've got a merge request with the changes we've talked about
<zyga> balloons: https://code.launchpad.net/~zkrynicki/checkbox/checkbox-touch-1.0.2/+merge/243686 a quick sanity check
<bzoltan> mvo: there is an extra chroot thing ... we need 14.09 chroots for the RTM devices
<dobey> balloons: btw, did you somehow manage to get jenkins to build multi-arch clicks or something?
<balloons> dobey, I didn't but it should be trivial to do so. sergiusens even has a script that I believe CI was using for this purpose
<dobey> hmm
<andrew-hqi> hello
<mvo> bzoltan: ok, what kind of libs do hey get?
<bzoltan> mvo:  it is pretty much identical to utopic. Only the source is different.
<mvo> ok
<balloons> dobey, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~sergiusens/uci-engine/click/view/head:/click-builder/click_builder/clickbuilder.py
<zyga> balloons: does that MR look okay?
<zyga> balloons: I wonder what to do with the manifest file
<balloons> zyga, yes it looks fine
<zyga> balloons: ok
<zyga> balloons: anything else or should I hand you another click file :-) ?
<balloons> go for it. But you might want to consider trying to pull only what you need as suggested. Not sure how easy it is to modify the build script
<zyga> balloons: I won't make that change now, not for 1.0.2
<zyga> balloons: we've considered doing cmake based builds and we will but for 1.1
<zyga> balloons: we want to get this to $customers for testing
<balloons> k, then fire away and I'll push the new click
<zyga> kissiel: did you set any special test plan?
<zyga> kissiel: I'll just do ./build-me --provider=...
<zyga> d'oh :)
<kissiel> zyga, just ./build-me --provider, if there's only one TP it will select that one automatically
<kissiel> zyga, does it answer your question?
<zyga> kissiel: yep
<zyga> balloons: ok, tested ok, uploading
<zyga> balloons: ok, ready:
<balloons> just send a link whenev's
<zyga> balloons: https://launchpad.net/checkbox-touch/trunk/1.0.2
<zyga> balloons: just finishing the upload
<zyga> balloons: interesting to see the .multi extension
<zyga> balloons: k
<balloons> it gave you one? excellent
<zyga> balloons: https://launchpad.net/checkbox-touch/trunk/1.0.2/+download/com.ubuntu.checkbox_1.0.2_multi.click
<zyga> balloons: yep, ready and tested
<balloons> this looks better
<zyga> \o/
<zyga> \o\
<zyga>  /o/
<zyga> !o!
<zyga> balloons: so the next thing I expect is the immediate security review
<zyga> balloons: immediate as in it's going to be blocked quicky :)
<balloons> it's pending manual review now
<zyga> balloons: excellent, thank you very much :)
<dobey> sergiusens: any idea when we'll have multi-arch clicks building in jenkins by default?
<bzoltan> mvo: zbenjamin: the Dev Tools PPA is good to go from the point of 15.04 and qmake support. Good job guys, thank you.
<mvo> yay
<zbenjamin> bzoltan: awesome :)
<sergiusens> dobey: no, I'm not involved in that anymore; it's a pure ci story; you may ask Ursinha as she masters the roadmap
 * balloons notes we should get it on the list
<dobey> oh, ok
<Ursinha> haha I wish I "mastered" something
<dobey> yes
<dobey> Ursinha: the scrums?
<Ursinha> dobey: well, yeah :)
<Ursinha> dobey: there is at least one story to build clicks automatically, we can create another one of that's not enough
<balloons> right in this cause, we want to insure the clicks are multi-arch. You could probably just modify the story to include it
<dobey> right
<Ursinha> balloons: no no
<Ursinha> no modifying stories directly :)
<Ursinha> if a story is already there, contact me or ev so we can do that for you
<dobey> Ursinha: it's a choose your own adventure story ;)
<Ursinha> otherwise we'll lose track of the information we already gathered, and that changes the scope of the story
<Ursinha> dobey: hehe
<dobey> Ursinha: i think the problem here is that they really aren't different stories. the underlying technical requirements to fulfill the story might be slightly broader though.
<dobey> Ursinha: from my POV the story is still "i am a developer and want a click package built that is verifiable, repeatable, and to be uploaded to the store"
<dobey> given how the packages are defined, on an underlying technical level, that should inherently mean that it would be a multi-arch fat package if the app contains compiled code
<Ursinha> dobey: we can't have underlying technical requirements, they really have to de explicit in a way we can choose to have first a more basic version of the final solution (multi-arch builds)
<dobey> but i'm not your PM of course :)
<Ursinha> dobey: if that's the case where the very minimum viable thing is multi-arch, then we adapt and explicit the scope
<Ursinha> dobey: PMs don't exist in scrum, really :)
<dobey> Ursinha: the P can be for pseudo if you want :)
<Ursinha> lol
<Ursinha> dobey: what the PM would do?
<dobey> i thought "story" was the same as "user stories" are for design, though
<dobey> Ursinha: i don't know, you're the scrum master, not me :)
<Ursinha> dobey: it's a story that goes into our backlog, it can be a user, a technical or a defect one
<Ursinha> dobey: as I said, a PM doesn't exist on scrum, so I want to understand what kind of input you need
<Ursinha> :)
<dobey> Ursinha: i'm just a developer. i need automated builds of multi-arch click packages :)
<ogra_> well just drop intel
<balloons> :'-(
<ogra_> (everywhere)
<balloons> But I gave away my arm laptop . . .
<ogra_> these ubuntu isos would surely be smaller being armhf only
<zyga> balloons: just one more question, how will we get questions / feedback on the secuirty review
<zyga> balloons: or notification on the actual upload?
<Ursinha> dobey: noted :) (no, seriously, we're dealing with the citrain outage right now but once that is back I'll reach out to you to get more details, does that sound good?)
<balloons> zyga, I will have to let you know since it's under the common namespace
<dobey> ogra_: the "con" in "convergence" isn't short for "contra" :)
<zyga> dobey: hahaha
<dobey> Ursinha: sure
<zyga> dobey: cross build your packages
<zyga> dobey: or build them in a PPA and combine as we do
<zyga> dobey: solves a lot of the problems
<dobey> zyga: eh?
<ogra_> there are armhf tablets, TVs, dishwashers and laptops
<dobey> PPAs don't build clicks :)
 * zyga read a bit of the backlogs
<zyga> dobey: I know
<dobey> ogra_: and x86 too :)
<ogra_> pfft
<zyga> dobey: but you can package your deps as debs and then just unpack them
<ogra_> obsolete arch
<ogra_> :)
<zyga> dobey: look at checkbox the click package
<zyga> dobey: it's all compiled by launchpad
 * dobey builds a powerpc click for ogra
<zyga> dobey: just assembled from .debs and manifest by a shell script anywhere
<zyga> dobey: I bet we're the first click app that does that too :P
<dobey> zyga: sounds like overengineered solution to me :)
<zyga> dobey: so we reuse 99% of the lp workflow
<zyga> dobey: it's just plain easy, fast iteration time
<zyga> dobey: (as the app is python)
<zyga> dobey: anyway, just a thought :)
<zyga> dobey: until there's a widely available click builder
<balloons> dobey, keep in touch on what happens. I'll let you make sure the story gets captured :-) I imagine once click supports it, CI will adopt it
<balloons> which is to say, once click makes it automagical
<dobey> we'll see
 * zyga wonders if anyone wants a ppc click for power 
 * ogra_ fires up unity8 on his G3 iBook
<zyga> er a checkbox click for tower
<zyga> er
<zyga> power
<balloons> zyga, jdstrand needs to ack checkbox since it's unconfined
<zyga> man, I'm tired
<zyga> balloons: yep, we know that
<zyga> balloons: it's mostly the limit of the current SDK
<zyga> balloons: content hub being unfinished etc
<zyga> balloons: we may go down the unconfined path later on
<zyga> balloons: but not for RTM
<dobey> zyga: well, my stuff only veers slightly outside of using what's in the SDK itself. sadly i don't get to write python
<zyga> dobey: well, we really tried not to abandon python :)
<balloons> zyga, I'm saying for the review and upload, he needs to sign off on it. So it will be in review until that happens
<zyga> balloons: understood, thanks
<zyga> jdstrand: please keep me in the loop, if you have any questions I'm here all the time
<dobey> anyway, i should get lunch
<jdstrand> balloons: can you point me to the review?
<balloons> jdstrand, https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/click-apps/1284/
 * zyga sticks around :(
<zyga> :)
<zyga> jdstrand: if you want I can explain why we used unconfined policy
<jdstrand> zyga: this is a multiarch package?
<zyga> jdstrand: yes
<zyga> jdstrand: we take prebuild packages from the ubuntu repository
<zyga> jdstrand: python3.4 and pyotherside
<zyga> jdstrand: and unpack them
<zyga> jdstrand: and libxml IIRC
<zyga> jdstrand: the rest is arch independent
 * zyga checks libxml
<zyga> jdstrand: yep, libxml2 as well
<zyga> jdstrand: the execution starts at qmlscene
<zyga> jdstrand: which loads pyotherside, then python and the rest of our code
<jdstrand> zyga: I commented on the unconfined bit, so you are unblocked there. I'd like someone more familiar with fat packages to review that part
<zyga> jdstrand: ok
<jdstrand> zyga: perhaps beuno knows who could look at that
<zyga> jdstrand: we're not sure if there's any docs really
 * jdstrand hasn't worked with fat packages much yet
<zyga> jdstrand: we rely on a hack in how click works and how app runtime is set up
<beuno> I can do the fat part
<beuno> I've been eating my share of ice cream
<zyga> jdstrand: so lib/$arch is setup at runtime and things just work
<zyga> beuno: thanks!
<beuno> yeah, there's a bug
<beuno> I think, in the review scripts
<jdstrand> beuno: if we can get that package into a state that is correct, I can adjust the tools to verify fat packages properly
<beuno> for mapping multi to multiple arches
<zyga> offtopic, is there any kind of "DLC" supprot planned for the click store? 99% of the changes we'd like to make are to a "DLC" to the app (the actual tests0
<beuno> jdstrand, I think it is, it's just trying to match "multi" to all the arches in the manifest
<jdstrand> cause those checks are pretty ancient and written based on conversations and docs for long ago
<zyga> and that could perhaps speed up the review (no need to do separate security review for a bunch of data files)
<beuno> which is annoying, mxing dpgkisms and our stuff
<beuno> zyga, in ~6 months
<jdstrand> beuno: well, like I said, I'll fix the tests if you verify the package
<zyga> beuno: great, I'd love to beta-test that :)
<beuno> jdstrand, deal.
<zyga> checkbox could download DLC for a particular hardware it runs on for example
<zyga> is there a way to check out click apps on the website somehow? (other than having a device to browse through the store?
<beuno> zyga, not currently
<beuno> zyga, approved and published
<zyga> beuno: awesome news, thanks!
<zyga> \o/
<popey> zyga: http://popey.mooo.com/screenshots/device-2014-12-04-171612.png is that git revision really needed?
<popey> would a YYYYMMDD not be more useful?
<zyga> popey: oh, good idea
<zyga> popey: we're just getting started
<zyga> popey: I'll add that for 1.1
<zyga> thanks!
<zyga> popey: reporeted as https://bugs.launchpad.net/checkbox-touch/+bug/1399282
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1399282 in Checkbox Touch "Include the build date on the welcome screen." [Undecided,New]
<zyga> popey: we'll get it fixed for the next release :)
<zyga> kissiel: re :)
<zyga> kissiel: get it while it's hot
<zyga> kissiel: it's really here
<kissiel> zyga, I know! :) cool! \o/
<dobey> popey: what do you have against arcane hexadecimal strings?!
<popey> dobey: nothing a backspace key can't help
<ogra_> stgraber, do you have an idea why the system-image importer runs so long even if it doesnt import anything ?
<stgraber> ogra_: would have to run in debug mode, but it could be because some servers are not responding and it's hitting http timeout
<ogra_> i'm just noticing that i have a lock at every copy-image run when i try to promote a set ... (5 arches atm)
<ogra_>  5697 ?        S      9:34 /usr/bin/python /srv/system-image.ubuntu.com/bin/import-images
<kenvandine> mterry, what's the status of the wizard silo?  anything blocking that besides the outage?
<mterry> kenvandine, no
<kenvandine> great
<kenvandine> jgdx, can you review this when you get a chance https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/ubuntu-system-settings/brightness_slider_rtm/+merge/241982
<ogra_> stgraber, ok, vivid images promoted, would you mind switching the devel alias to vivid ?
<ogra_> oh, wait, slangasek was the new alias bender for s-i, wasnt he ?
<slangasek> stgraber: I still want us to fix it so that devel and devel-proposed are channels, not aliases, and we get rid of the vivid* channels.  Does changing the devel alias in the short term make this any easier or harder later?
<ogra_> it will at least bring devel back in sync with devel-proposed
<stgraber> slangasek: shouldn't make a difference, we'll need manual surgery in any case.
<ogra_> but big +1 from dropping all distro named channels
<ogra_> s/from/for/
<slangasek> stgraber, ogra_: I'm not in a position to make the alias switch right now; hopefully one of you can do so, given that it's an obviously-correct change
<stgraber> doing it
<stgraber> >>> pub.change_channel_alias("ubuntu-touch/devel", "ubuntu-touch/vivid")
<stgraber> True
<stgraber> will be live by the end of the current import-images run
<ogra_> stgraber, ah, cool, i would have forgotten the ubuntu-touch prefix
 * ogra_ makes a note for next time
<thebishop> hi, i've got a Dell TP713 (very similar to Apple Magic Trackpad).  Is it possible to enable some of the touchscreen multitouch (3-finger pinch, etc) features via the pad?
<matv1> why would some scopes lose their 'favorite' setting after updating?
<kostis> hi
<kostis> somebody?
<kostis> i want to ask something
<matv1> kostis just ask
<matv1> you dont have to ask to ask :)
<kostis> i have samsung galaxy tab s  sm-t805
<kostis> is it possible to install ubunt touch?
<kostis> or ubuntu some edition
<matv1> kostis not without some serious hacking I guess
<kostis> where can i find info about that?
<matv1> kostis your device is not one of the reference devices that are used to develop touch
<kostis> i know that
<matv1> kostis there is a page of ports did you find that?
<kostis> i asked if there is a way to do it
<kostis> send me the link to the ports please
<nhaines> kostis: of course.  You just have to write drivers for all of the hardware in your phone.
<kostis> how to do that?
<kostis> i don't know
<nhaines> If you have to ask, you can't do it.
<matv1> kostis https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<nhaines> It's not impossible, but you have to be a hardware engineer.  If it were easy, well, people probably would have done it by now.  :/
<nhaines> It's not impossible, but you have to be a hardware engineer.  If it were easy, well, people probably would have done it by now.  :/
<nhaines> 15:34 < matv1> kostis https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<kostis> what to do?
<kostis> i opened that page
<kostis> then?
<matv1> kostis you could see if someone else did a port already
<kostis> i can't see anyone
<matv1> scroll down the page
<matv1> but I already looked you version is not there
<kostis> i see it too
<kostis> so what next?
<matv1> kostis learn how to write drivers
<matv1> but like nhaines said
<matv1> its difficult
<matv1> very
<matv1> kostis otherwise you could trade your tablet in for a nexus tablet
<kostis> no thanks
<matv1> kostis ok :)
<matv1> kostis do you know how to program in any language?
<kostis> is there a way to install ubuntu desktop?
<matv1> kostis no not anything serious
#ubuntu-touch 2014-12-05
<RAOF> You (mostly) don't need to write drivers to get Ubuntu Touch working on an Android device; we use the Android kernel and GLES driver stack and such for precisely that reason.
<matv1> RAOF ah yes and libHybris right
<matv1> So does that mean that -as far as the convergence story is concerned- desktop/server are always going to be running on a different kernel version compared to touch devices?
<RAOF> Unless and until embedded manufacturers use an upstream kernel, yes.
<matv1> RAOF interesting. never gave that much thought
<nhaines> RAOF: if the target device runs Android 4.4.
<matv1> nhaines meaning that setting U touch loose on a android 5.0 device will generate all kinds of hardware/driver issues again?
<matv1> but i guess you would solve those through libhybris again. not by directly trying to write (or reverse engineer) a driver
<matv1> if the later is even possible :)
<nhaines> matv1: nah, my Nexus 5 is working great, but I think the Android kernel used by the Ubuntu image is still 4.4.3 or 4.4.4.  :)
<matv1> aha so no kernel change between the two
<Bobby__> Hello all. I am trying to get sound playback working on an Intel Bay Trail tablet. I do not get a sound device with any firmware except for with 5339.B in the Intel ChromiumOS repo. With this firmware I only get static or no sound at all though. I have played with all the alsamixer settings and tried the ASUS t100 state file that is commonly used still with no sound.  What can I do to fix this?
<UTL> I'm baaaaack!
<nhaines> Welcome back!
<UTL> I'm taking notes of my experiences with messing with the Ubuntu Touch ovation image. I found the Russian link where "wesnoth" comments on how to flash Ubuntu Touch on Nook HD+ (Warning: Needs a translator!): http://4pda.ru/forum/index.php?showtopic=511101
<nhaines> Oh, that's great!
<UTL> It even has instructions on how to flash the different components of the image.
<UTL> nhaines: Maybe now you can get an idea of what my problem is. If you have a Nook HD+, maybe you can try it out.
<nhaines> I do not have a Nook HD+, unfortunately.
<UTL> I do because of the many reviews I've read about it. According to what I read, it is (or was) the best inexpensive tablet on the market. If I remember correctly, the only complaints were the Nook firmware, because Barnes & Noble forces you to have an account before you even try to use it.
<UTL> I think that's true of all Nooks.
<UTL> That stinks, because you don't get to try it unless it's on display at Walmart (and when I got it, it wasn't).
<nhaines> Or at a Barnes & Nobel.
<UTL> That's true, too, however I think Barnes & Noble have discarded the Nook for what is called the "Nook by Samsung".
<UTL> I did not see B&N display the Nook HD+, even though they still have accessories for it.
<nhaines> They're getting ready to split into separate companies.
<UTL> Really? I didn't know that!
<nhaines> Yup.  Every publisher that isn't Amazon is doing their best to implode.
<Guest90448> How to develop
<mirza> K
<UTL> I'm looking at the list of Ubuntu IRC channels. Which ones do you think I should contact about my problem with the ovation image?
<mirza> Utl what u means
<popey> UTL: what image?
<UTL> I want to find out more about Ubuntu Touch ovation (Nook HD+).
<popey> UTL: you already know the answer, speak to the person who made the image
<dholbach> good morning
<mirza> dholbach good morning
<nhaines> dholbach: good morning!
<dholbach> hi mirza, nhaines :)
<mirza> The package ovation-preinstalled-touch-16-11-2013.zip utl
<mirza> dholbach can i ask u
<mirza> Is it madness or intelligence
<dholbach> I'm afraid I don't know what you are talking about.
<mirza> Scientists in Korea have been using the virus
<mirza> to cure lung cancer (in mice, at least.) ... non-replicating
<mirza> cells (like neurons) and can create long term changes,
<mirza> positive changes in genes
<mirza> My question is it madness
<mirza> Is we really want vaccine
<mirza> See my question did we really antivirus software cause linux always remain virus free dholbach
<mirza> Whatever we use paid shit windows then pay on the antivirus
<mirza> Why we people no use linux they are too use friendly than windows
<dholbach> I really don't know where you are going with this. All the bits which go into Ubuntu are open source.......
<sergiusens> zbenjamin: fyi https://code.launchpad.net/~sergiusens/goget-ubuntu-touch/locale/+merge/242986
<zbenjamin> sergiusens: ok!
<mirza> Ya i know but why we not get laptop preinstall with ubuntu like apple mac or android or chrome os counterpart
<mirza> When can we esp i get ubuntu touch phone
<dholbach> there are lots of preinstalled options for Ubuntu - Dell for example has been doing this for years
<dholbach> and I'm not sure this is the right place to talk about antivirus etc
<nhaines> The new HP premiere laptop can come with Ubuntu.
<mirza> First dell ar costly and there display ar bad
<mirza> When nhaines
<nhaines> mirza: you can't complain that there are no preinstalled Ubuntu options and then complain that well, there are but you just don't like them.  :)
<nhaines> mirza: http://www8.hp.com/us/en/ads/elitebook-folio-1020/specs.html
<mirza> I luv them ubuntu my fav but new firmware shuck laptop i can duel boot it
<nhaines> I don't know what that means.
<mirza> I wanna duel bool laptop with one media center another ubuntustudio i can find way can u help to figure out it
<mirza> Uefi boot i speaking about
<nhaines> No, I'm heading to bed soon so I can watch the Orion launch but basically you just install both and as long as they both support UEFI boot it just works.
<mirza> It go overmy brain
<nhaines> Install Ubuntu last.  It will handle everything.
<mirza> Where it is dvd download takes time
<mirza> Any magazine offer free dvd with them
<nhaines> dholbach: once after trying to get my friend to give me an address so I could use Google Navigation, I was at a small musical performance with some friends and I was trying to get an address to a restaurant to eat before we all had to drive back.  So my friend said "we'll ask my friend.  She's from around here."
<mirza> H
<nhaines> Then she suggested a Chinese restaurant.  So I said "sounds great.  What are the names of the cross streets?"  And she began "Well, you go down this road south towards this road, then you wait until you see the water tower and you..."
<nhaines> So I turned to my friend, smiling, and cheerfully said "Ich bekomme einfach niemals ein Antwort zu meine Frage."
<nhaines> And my friend said, "Aber meine Freundin Anita spricht perfektes Deutsch" and I said "of course she does."
<nhaines> Anita was Chinese.  :)
<mirza> Moito hipo distroya
<nhaines> But luckily I just explained that directions had been a struggle earlier and we all laughed.
<nhaines> Also by "ein" I mean "kein"
<mirza> Haa haa nhaines
<dholbach> haha :)
<mirza> Just funny
<mirza> I does most funny
<mirza> You know peel have more power than fruit
<nhaines> I suppose that's quite possible.
<mirza> Imagine how
<mirza> Nhaines
<nhaines> Well, I suspect it's usually denser.
<mirza> What
<nhaines> More mass.
<mirza> Not weight of pumkin haa haa blah blah
<mirza> So serious no fun ok
<mirza> Can u name magazine who provide linux cds in there issue
<popey> Linux Voice
<popey> http://www.linuxvoice.com/
<mirza> Does it supplies globally
<popey> join #linuxvoice and ask them where you can get it
<mirza> Is it hosted in this server
<mirza> Popey
<popey> yes
<mirza> Popey i want to transact money overseas what are bitcoin minner who convert bitcoins in to qatar dinnah or rayal and any bank support multicurrency account and some idea on west bank i live in maldives
<popey> I dunno, but that seems a bit offtopic here.
<popey> (Maldives is lovely, I went there for my honeymoon in 2000)
<mirza> Nice for sunnami
<mirza> I hope next time u and ur wife enjoy that
<mirza> Plz we ar living place i need transaction so any help great regarded
<mirza> West bank idea i hear they ar annyomus also save taxes it it true
<mirza> Popey i did not find yearly subscription page
<matv1> on rtm proposed i am getting notifications of system updates when there are none when I run updates in system-settings
<matv1> just me?
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Friday, and happy World Soil Day! :-D
<nhaines> matv1: I never get system update notifications on ubuntu-rtm/14.09.
<matv1> nhaines I am on ubuntu-touch/ubuntu-rtm/14.09-proposed\
<matv1> nhaines but after a reboot it sorted itself out and saw the new image
<nhaines> matv1: I didn't receive updates on that channel either that I noticed.  But then I run Ubuntu intermittently.
<UTL> I decided to join the #ubuntu-ru channel to see if anyone has heard of "wesnoth". I hope somebody there knows English!
<matv1> nhaines It hasnt been there until recently. Its been there over the past few images. i would say like a week. maybe a bit more
<nhaines> I thought I saw someone mentioning it.  Well, I'll just continue to wait.  :)
<oSoMoN> Mirv, re bug #1399597, what do you mean by "it'll be reverted" ?
<ubot5`> bug 1399597 in oxide-qt (Ubuntu) "The last oxide upload breaks autopkgtests" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1399597
<Mirv> oSoMoN: well uploading the previous version with a new version number
<oSoMoN> Mirv, which version? if you mean 1.2.x thatâs a bad idea, itâll break the browser
<Mirv> oSoMoN: the 1.3.5-0ubuntu1 of course. you probably missed the packaging upload from zoltan
<oSoMoN> oh, I guess I did then, let me check the changes
<Mirv> oSoMoN: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/oxide-qt/1.3.5-0ubuntu4
<oSoMoN> ah, right
<oSoMoN> Mirv, ok, fine by me then
<Mirv> so the revert looks like https://launchpadlibrarian.net/191897077/oxide-qt_1.3.5-0ubuntu4_1.3.5-0ubuntu5.diff.gz
<Mirv> oSoMoN: good! :)
<oSoMoN> Mirv, did Chris Coulson review that packaging change before it went through?
<Mirv> oSoMoN: yes, from what I heard
<oSoMoN> yeah, he did indeed
<oSoMoN> https://code.launchpad.net/~bzoltan/oxide/packaging.vivid-improved-conflicts/+merge/243515
<bzoltan> oSoMoN: Mirv. that bug description is very strange and it does not tell what the real problem is ...
<Mirv> bzoltan: the bug is that because of oxide changes installing packages fails, which prevents package promotion. if I would actually understand the problem I could upload a fix instead.
<Mirv> I updated the bug a bit to state that it's package installation problem
<bzoltan> Mirv:  Ok, I check out too the problem ... for the records, I did test the installation of the packages and did not see any problem
<Mirv> bzoltan: yeah I can't hit an error simply installing either of the codecs packages, but somehow the way the test machines install eg unity8 dependencies causes the error
<bzoltan> Mirv:  I repeated the installation tests and absolutely no problem ...
<bzoltan> Mirv:  the problem is that nobody will take this bug  :( and a week effort is just dropped
<Mirv> bzoltan: well we'd need to find someone who understands what's wrong. maybe Chris can take another look?
<Mirv> bzoltan: I'm not sure what's relevant, but qtcreator-plugin-ubuntu recommends ubuntu-sdk, which depends on ubuntu-sdk-libs, which directly depends on oxideqt-codecs-extra, which conflicts with oxideqt-codecs. in the bug, oxideqt-codecs is already installed
<Mirv> oh...
<Mirv> oh, nothing. I don't find anything depending specifically on oxideqt-codecs that could cause the problem, other than apt getting confused
<bzoltan> Mirv:  but why apt is confused there and not confused on click chroot or on my machines (both amd64 and i386 I tested)?
<bzoltan> Mirv:  I think I understand the problem ... if the oxideqt-codes-extra is listed as dependency as a standalone package and the same package is removed in favor of the oxideqt-codecs then apt fails...
<bzoltan> Mirv:  so the oxideqt-codes-extra is listed as package to be installed and to be removed ... and during the apt process it is half installed
<bzoltan> Mirv: I would suggest to fix the  ubuntu-restricted-addons kubuntu-restricted-addons ubuntu-sdk-libs packages  not to single depend on the oxideqt-codecs-extras ... especially the latest one
<bzoltan> mvo_:  are you around?
<oSoMoN> pitti, would you happen to know why permissions on /dev/shm changed between utopic and vivid? (see bug #1396951 for context)
<ubot5`> bug 1396951 in webbrowser-app (Ubuntu) "webbrowser-appâs autopilot tests fail on otto: access to /dev/shm is denied" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1396951
<bzoltan> mvo_:  Mirv: so this line I would change -> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu-touch.vivid/view/head:/sdk-libs#L55
<bzoltan> mvo_: ogra_: I would suggest to remove or change that oxide line in the sdk-libs ^
<ogra_> erm, we need it seeded
<ogra_> else you have no audio or video in the browser
<bzoltan> ogra_: in the sdk-libs<
<ogra_> yes
<ogra_> it is part of the framework
<bzoltan> ogra_: ???
<ogra_> sdk-libs is the package roviding the framework
<ogra_> *pro
<bzoltan> ogra_: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/oxide-qt/+bug/1399597
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1399597 in oxide-qt (Ubuntu) "The last oxide upload breaks autopkgtests with a package installation failure" [Undecided,New]
<ogra_> oxide-codex-extra is essential on the phone ... you cant just make that an "or" dependency
<bzoltan> ogra_:  could it be an codecs|codecs-extras?
<ogra_> https://code.launchpad.net/~bzoltan/oxide/packaging.vivid-improved-conflicts/+merge/243515 is definitely wrong
<pitti> oSoMoN: not really, they should be 1777 and have always been, at least on desktop
<ogra_> might not be the case on touch though
<oSoMoN> pitti, in my vivid chroot theyâre not, and neither are they in the chroots used by the CI infrastructure, any idea what could have caused this change?
<pitti> oSoMoN: what likely changed is that you have a chroot or similar environment  where it's a symlink to /run/shm/, and something doesn't bind-mount/init that dir properly
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/9381650/
<pitti> and I suppose /run/shm is not a mount, and is only 755?
<ogra_> (thats a normal phone though)
<oSoMoN> pitti, precisely, in my utopic chroot it used to be a symlink, but in my vivid chroot itâs not a symlink anymore
<ogra_> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ mount|grep shm
<ogra_> none on /run/shm type tmpfs (rw,nosuid,nodev,relatime)
<oSoMoN> ogra_, Iâm not seeing the issue on my phone on vivid though, it seems itâs only in chroots
<pitti> ogra_: ah, on the phone it certainly has proper permissions, right? (1777)
<ogra_> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ ls -l /run/|grep shm
<ogra_> drwxrwxrwt 2 root       root        160 Nov 13 13:46 shm
<ogra_> yep
<ogra_> but as oSoMoN said, this is on a real phone
<oSoMoN> if it didnât the browser wouldnât run, weâd notice soon enough :)
<pitti> oSoMoN: so perhaps your chroots neither mount /dev/shm from the host nor have a proper /run/shm/
<pitti> ?
<oSoMoN> pitti, thatâs /run/shm in my vivid chroot: drwxrwxrwt  2 root root     40 Dec  5 12:21 /run/shm
<pitti> yeah, chroots and /run is always a complicated matter; Debian changed /dev/shm/ to /run/shm a while ago (https://wiki.debian.org/ReleaseGoals/RunDirectory) and we inherited that
<oSoMoN> and: # mount | grep shm
<oSoMoN> tmpfs on /run/shm type tmpfs (rw,relatime)
<pitti> oSoMoN: that looks ok; is /dev/shm a symlink?
<pitti> phone brb
<oSoMoN> pitti, no, /dev/shm is not a symlink, itâs a plain directory
<oSoMoN> (drwxr-xr-x)
<ogra_> aha
<ogra_> and not 1777
<oSoMoN> yup
<oSoMoN> but I have no idea why it doesnât have the right permissions
<gcollura> does anyone know why I don't get push notifications on vivid? (channel: ubuntu-touch/devel r1)
<oSoMoN> (which is my original question)
<gcollura> I used to get them on rtm. I've also tried to readd my ubuntuone account too
<ogra_> gcollura, you should ... not sure why you dont
<ogra_> Chipaca is your man
<gcollura> I'll wait for Chipaca then :) thanks ogra_
<pitti> ogra_: ah, it should be a symlink
<pitti> err, oSoMoN
<pitti> well, it really shouldn't be, but with Debian's layout it should
<oSoMoN> pitti, do you know what is responsible for creating it in the first place, when creating a chroot?
<pitti> oSoMoN: it depends on how you build it, but I figure somewhere between initscript's postinst and debootstrap; mk-sbuild and friends might also make some adjustments there, and sbuild has its own fstabs
<Mirv> bzoltan: ogra_: so I had this thought http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~timo-jyrinki/ubuntu-seeds/random_guess_at_fixing_lp1399597/revision/272 but I didn't have the idea why it broke up in the first place
<ogra_> Mirv, we need -extras as a hard dep
<ogra_> it needs to be on the image and is a part of the framework
<Mirv> ogra_: so a hard dep where it's listed first wouldn't work?
<ogra_> Mirv, not sure, it might depend on the tool used (apt vs aptitude, metapackage vs task resolve in different orders)  but we need to 100% make sure it ends up on the image and as a dep of sdk-libs which is our framework no matter what you do
<ogra_> i'm not sure if/how well and "or" dep in seeds works
<ogra_> s/and/an/
<Mirv> bzoltan: so what depends on oxideqt-codecs | oxideqt-codecs-extras and could that be changed the other way around?
<phanohanover> Good morning to all!
<phanohanover> To all of dev team: Great job with touch. Keep up the good work. I just installed it and it is promissing! I wish bluetooth would work on my nexus 5 but I guess i'll just wait for it! Thanks to all!
<nhaines> IPv6 is far more secure than IPv4.
<nhaines> Because nobody understands IPv6 addressing so no one can hack you.
<UTL> *sigh!* I'm glad you're happy, phanohanover. I don't have a Nexus anything.
<popey> ogra_: is there a known media playback bug?
<ogra_> popey, in rtm ?
<popey> JoeyChan: you're on mako? Which channel?
<JoeyChan> popey:   ogra_   vivid devel
<popey> ah
<JoeyChan> r44
<JoeyChan> since r37
<ogra_> could be
<ogra_> vivid is not really getting much QA attention ...
<JoeyChan> ok..
<ogra_> so a bug there is surely possible
<ogra_> i *think* it works on #39 which we promoted yesterday
<ogra_> at least on mako flo and krillin ... iirc manta has issues
<JoeyChan> ogra_:   so not sure that the bug will be fixed in vivid ?
<ogra_> not sure there is a bug ... what are you seeing ... on which arch
<ogra_> in general though ... vivid is developer playground, if you want something QAed and stable use rtm
<JoeyChan> i c
<JoeyChan> related to this bug ?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-rtm/+source/unity8/+bug/1389008
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1389008 in ubuntu-touch-session (Ubuntu RTM) "Often fails to connect to Pulseaudio and unity-notifications (results in missing volume notifications and improper volume control)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<ogra_> that bug makes the popup notification for volume control not shown
<ogra_> whats your issue exactly ?
<Mirv> oSoMoN: ogra_: so bzoltan pointed out the Oxide itself is the only one that prefers the non-extras, being the probable cause for the problem. so I'd keep the new Oxide changes but do the following to switch the order: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/9382431/ - does that sound good?
<oSoMoN> Mirv, why would the order matter?
<davmor2> popey: there is a known media playback bug, from image 40 onward the new systemd landed and broke everything hence testing 39 for promotion
<JoeyChan> ogra_:   my issue is simple:   the music-app cannot play music,  the media-player-app said it cannot connect the play backend
<Mirv> oSoMoN: because if apt first considers Oxide's own changes, it installs the oxideqt-codecs. then other packages later on hard depend on oxideqt-codecs-extras, and they conflict with each other and apt probably doesn't find its way out of the situation properly.
<davmor2> popey: oh and new apparmor just incase it isn't systemd's fault
<ogra_> JoeyChan, and on what arch is that ?
<Mirv> oSoMoN: if apt _did_ check the other deps first, it'd be happy with extras being installed. but since it first only checks oxide's deps alone, it already installs the normal codecs packages before considering others' needs.
<Mirv> oSoMoN: well, that's the theory anywya.
<JoeyChan> ogra_:   vivid r44 in my mako
<JoeyChan> devel
<davmor2> ogra_, JoeyChan: it's a known issue
<ogra_> well, then file a bug ...
<ogra_> davmor2, on mako too ?
<ogra_> i thought that was only manta
<davmor2> ogra_: this is the test that failed the sanity on image 40 which caused me to test 39 for promotion
<ogra_> ah
<Mirv> oSoMoN: chris isn't online yet? I'd probably then just upload that to the silo, update the bug and say "please land if ok for everyone"
<davmor2> ogra_: media failed and video in camera failed, not sure what else I got no further
<JoeyChan> davmor2:  also in webbrowser
<davmor2> JoeyChan: they might of added the browser/media hub plugin now
<JoeyChan> lol
<JoeyChan> davmor2:  there's one funny situation that I can play music and video
<JoeyChan> davmor2:  the unity8 crash then reboot itself,   I found everything works fine
<oSoMoN> Mirv, ok, so supposedly it really is a bug in apt, right? Can mvo_ confirm that?
<Mirv> oSoMoN: I think in a sense yet, as apt should be able to recover from that situation (by uninstalling oxideqt-codecs (or not installing it in the first place) and installing oxideqt-codecs-extras)
<Mirv> s/yet/yes/
<oSoMoN> Mirv, if swapping the order fixes the issue, then go for it, but it would be good to get to the bottom of things, we shouldnât have to do this kind of things in the first place
<oSoMoN> Mirv, also, what package depends explicitly on oxideqt-codecs-extras?
<Mirv> oSoMoN: bug updated, it needs to be landed by US people in around 5h if ok.
<Mirv> oSoMoN: ubuntu-sdk-libs requires it, and if you read above ogra_ explains that the images need it as a hard dependency
<Mirv> oSoMoN: you're correct that it'd be nice to understand if apt could be fixed to cope with what the autopkgtest is doing https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/vivid-adt-qtcreator-plugin-ubuntu/lastBuild/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/consoleFull
<oSoMoN> Mirv, right, IÂ know that the images need it, but Iâm not sure I understand why ubuntu-sdk-libs does
<Mirv> oSoMoN: that's the route the images get it, via ubuntu-sdk-libs
<UTL> So close! It's Ubuntu on a non-Nexus tablet, but it's not Ubuntu Touch! http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1074169
<oSoMoN> Mirv, huh, I thought it was in the seed?
<ogra_> oSoMoN, it is in the sdk-libs seed, yes
<ogra_> which is the framework seed
<oSoMoN> ha, ok
<Mirv> oSoMoN: yes that's what the seed is, generates the ubuntu-touch-meta src package :)
<jdstrand> davmor2: I thought I mentioned this before-- the new apparmor doesn't change policy-- it only moves libapparmor1 from /usr/lib to /lib
<davmor2> jdstrand: that is why we are assuming systemd over apparmor
<jgdx> seb128, hey, could you take a quick look at [1] and do a code review when you have a chance? [1] https://code.launchpad.net/~jonas-drange/ubuntu-system-settings/cellular-radio-bug-related-to-1378812/+merge/243804
<seb128> jgdx, hey, ok, did you ping ken about that one as well?
<jgdx> seb128, think he's off today, but I'll shoot him an email.
<seb128> k, thanks
<mterry> bzoltan, your latest upload of oxide-qt is causing some problems (not necessarily oxide-qt's fault, but trying to understand the problem) -- many packages are stuck in vivid-proposed because their build-dependencies pull in both codecs and codecs-extra which fails
<seb128> mterry, that has been discussed on several occasions/channels today from what I saw
<mterry> seb128, OK great
<ogra_> yeah, we need to get rid of codecs again ...
<ogra_> we only use -extra in the framework
<saidinesh5> Elleo: ping
<Elleo> saidinesh5: pong :)
<saidinesh5> Elleo: about the maliit plugin's window position etc...
<saidinesh5> could you give me a quick rundown of what's to be done?
<Elleo> saidinesh5: the way it's currently handled is a bit of a hack; at the moment the ubuntu-keyboard plugin takes a fullscreen surface, draws wherever it likes on that surface and then reports the area that should receive touch events to mir via a dbus channel
<saidinesh5> yeah that's what i noticed .. so was confused what to do
<Elleo> then any other events are just passed on to the application below
<saidinesh5> hmm... is there any neat little wrapper that takes care of this whole dbus thing?
<saidinesh5> i thought maliit by default takes care of this stuff
<saidinesh5> via. setRegion()
<Elleo> saidinesh5: yeah, it should; but at the moment that's handled in the plugin for mir rather than in the maliit server; it's on my TODO list to add a mir backend to maliit so we can get that out of the plugin
<saidinesh5> umm.. i don't mind doing this TODO bit, if you help me out :P
<Elleo> saidinesh5: for the moment it's the ubuntuapplicationapiwrapper.cpp in ubuntu-keyboard that handles it
<saidinesh5> basically i really want to test this plugin on the device
<saidinesh5> Ahh
 * saidinesh5 checks
<Elleo> saidinesh5: if you just grab that and include it in your plugin, you just call a method on that pretty much the same as the maliit setRegion
<saidinesh5> iSee
<saidinesh5> and i have to then create  a fullscreen window again?
<saidinesh5> with transparency and all?
<Elleo> yeah, pretty much
<saidinesh5> Ahh and who reports the orientation changes?
<Elleo> that comes in via the standard maliit channels
<Elleo> so the application will tell you when its orientation has changed, and you have to adapt as needed
<saidinesh5> Ahh
<saidinesh5> how much work is it to actually add a mir backend to maliit itself?
<Elleo> saidinesh5: currently there's an orientationhelper in the keyboard that handles our side of it; but that's going to get much simpler soon when the unity shell rotation stuff lands
<Elleo> saidinesh5: shouldn't be a massive amount of work, but I haven't looked into it in detail yet
<saidinesh5> unity shell rotation?
<Elleo> saidinesh5: yep, instead of apps handling orientation themselves most of the hard work is done for them by unity
<saidinesh5> so then we completely ignore maliit's orientation?
<saidinesh5> Ah
<saidinesh5> interesting
<Elleo> so the keyboard just needs to respond to its window being resized appropriately
<Elleo> without worrying about the actual orientation of anything
<saidinesh5> so basically i don't mind fixing maliit for mir, if it isn't too much work, that way i can just maintain the maliit plugin for skeyer
<saidinesh5> which then works the same everywhere
<Elleo> saidinesh5: well, it's on my todo list anyway; so I could push for it to be included in my next 2 week iteration (starting on the 15th)
<Elleo> saidinesh5: otherwise if you want it before then you're more than welcome to have a go :)
<Elleo> saidinesh5: it should mostly be a matter of duplicating one of the existing plugins and replacing the geometry handling there with what's already in the keyboard's mir wrapper
<Elleo> saidinesh5: but as I say, I haven't looked into it in detail yet, so there might be more complicated things that I'm overlooking
<seb128> mardy, hey, is http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mardy/shotwell/lp1382843/revision/170 good for upload or are you still working on that?
<saidinesh5> aye i m looking into it...
<saidinesh5> hmm.. this is actually quite little amount of stuff
<saidinesh5>     virtual void setupInputPanel(QWindow* window, Maliit::Position position);
<saidinesh5>     virtual void setInputRegion(QWindow* window, const QRegion& region);
<saidinesh5>     virtual void setApplicationWindow(QWindow *window, WId appWindowId);
<saidinesh5> that's about it...
<Elleo> yeah, I suspect it should all be pretty simple; but I wouldn't swear to it ;)
<saidinesh5> heh okay
<saidinesh5> do you have any little test cases for me to test this stuff on?
<saidinesh5> also Elleo setting up a chroot environment on Nexus 7 finally worked. Although i admit, it's a PITA
<Elleo> saidinesh5: not really, the only thing that does anything like this at the moment is the keyboard; quickest test would be to just recompile the keyboard without the call to the wrapper
<Elleo> saidinesh5: ah, good :)
<saidinesh5> and Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhh.. NOW i get it, why my maliit plugin didn't even show up on Nexus 7
<saidinesh5> it was missing the mir connection bit!
<Elleo> yep :)
<Elleo> having that bit of black magic buried in the keyboard plugin has annoyed me for a while, which is why it'll be so good to get it into maliit so no-one else has to care about it in the future
<saidinesh5> Also Elleo is there a problem with Qt's font pointSize etc.. on mir?
<Elleo> I don't know, we tend to do everything in our own grid units
 * saidinesh5 googles
<saidinesh5> umm for that i need to touch ubuntu touch components? to take care of the gridUnits bit...
<Elleo> yeah, so not ideal for a general purpose thing
<Elleo> I'd have thought pointsize stuff should work, but it's not something I've really tried
<saidinesh5> it wasn't working for me..  will have to see again though
<Elleo> if it isn't working I'd definitely recommend filing a bug for it; that's not really my area so I'm not sure what could be going wrong
<Elleo> it's possible Mir doesn't report the dpi to Qt yet or something?
<saidinesh5> not sure... the characters on nexus 7 for the ubuntu touch keyboard are very tiny...
<saidinesh5> realized that when i was using the emulator on the desktop, where they appeared to be their normal size
<saidinesh5> so don't know where exactly the issue is
<sil2100> bfiller: hey! Do you know when Ken will be around today?
<sil2100> bfiller: we're waiting for him to test his silo which we would really badly like to land today still
<ogra_> (so it can get dogfoodin on the WE)
<bfiller> sil2100: he'll be back this afternoon
<ogra_> +g
 * popey wonders why https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone/maillist.html isn't updating
<sil2100> popey: that happens sometimes, sometimes the archive is really REALLY slow
<popey> â¹
<popey> annoying when you want to link to it
<sil2100> popey: there are days where it takes over 4 hours for my landing e-mail to appear...
<sil2100> Yeah
<popey> ok, I'll go and do something else then :D
<ogra_> popey, for me it often helps to switch from thread to date view (at the top)
<popey> will put a brick on F5
<ogra_> might be a coincidence and i'm just lucky though
<sil2100> I thought it helped originally
<sil2100> But then I had another day where I waited 2+ hours and it didn't appear, so I had to share the next day
<sil2100> Kaleo: hey! I'll be publishing your silo with your camera-app changes now, but just wanted to point something out
<sil2100> Kaleo: if you could mention in the changelog whenever you add new package dependencies it would be really useful
<Kaleo> sil2100, good point, thanks
<dobey> Chipaca: the twitter push notification is supposed to play a sound, right? or was that removed?
<ubuntu0001> Can I run synaptic on the current version of ubuntu touch?
<ogra_> no
<ogra_> well, you could set up ssh and run it remotely via ssh ...
<dobey> you can run it
<dobey> but it doesn't make sense to run it
<ubuntu0001> Can I install lxde in the current version of ubuntu touch?
<dobey> install yes
<dobey> make sense to do, no
<dobey> are you trying to run lxde on a phone or something?
<ubuntu0001> Does lxde run in the current version of ubuntu touch?
<ogra_> yeah, would just waste diskspace
 * ogra_ doubts it would run on Mir
<dobey> ogra_: well, if it's gtk3, it would probably run with the mir backend for gtk+, but maybe not behave very nicely
<ogra_> yeah
<ubuntu0001> There are videos on youtube of lxde running smoothly on the older nexus 7
<popey> that was running x
<ogra_> thats like 3 years ao ...
<popey> touch doesn't use x
<ogra_> ago
<ogra_> right, and it was using Xorg
<dobey> ubuntu has armhf builds available
<dobey> so you can take an armhf ISO and run lubuntu if you want probably
<ubuntu0001> why was the ubuntu core project abandoned? It runs beautifully in youtube
<ogra_> it wasnt abandoned ...
<dobey> what are you talking about?
<ogra_> it moved on
<ogra_> what you saw there was just a test system to collect data for the phone OS
<ogra_> it was never intended for anything more than collecting performance and resource data for 6 months
<dobey> so synaptic is gtk+3 it looks like, so it would probably run ok on mir
<ubuntu0001> Can I use the Ubuntu 12 LTS repositories with the 13.04 version of ubuntu?
<ogra_> after that ubuntu-core moved on to actually become a core for all ubuntu
<dobey> but you really shouldn't be installing debs on ubuntu touch
<dobey> ubuntu0001: #ubuntu is the support channel for ubuntu, this channel is specifically about development of ubuntu on phones/tablets
<popey> hmmm https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone/date.html nothing has arrived since yesterday
<Chipaca> gcollura: hey. yes, push is me. what's up?
<Chipaca> dobey: yes, unless you've turned the volume for notifications off
<dobey> Chipaca: uh, "volume for notifications" ?
<Chipaca> dobey: yes
<Chipaca> dobey: I do believe that has not been implemented yet, but we do set the right environ for it :)
<dobey> are you experimenting with quantum computing? because i don't see how i could use a feature that's not yet implemented, unless you managed to break the continuum :)
<dobey> although, in looking for that feature, apparently my phone had the silent mode feature implemented by Erwin Schroedinger, because it was apparently both enabled and not, at the same time
<Chipaca> dobey: there ya go :)
<Chipaca> dobey: silent mode is one way of setting the volume of notifications off :)
<Chipaca> dobey: atm i think it's also the only way
<Chipaca> gcollura: ping?
<Chipaca> gcollura: i'm not working today, and only opened irc by accident, so i'm not going to stick around for long :)
<dobey> Chipaca: right. but the indicator showed silent mode as off (and the call ringtone still played), but when i went into system-settings it was shown as on. :-/
<Chipaca> dobey: the money is in finding how it got into that half-silent state :)
<pmcgowan> there is a fix in flight for that, I think it landed in vivid?
<dobey> Chipaca: probably when i went to the movies and i tried to put it in silent mode, but the switch in the indicator would immediately change back to the off position
<Chipaca> speaking of movies, guardians of the galaxy is starting
<Chipaca> buh bye :)
<dobey> Chipaca: ironically, that is the very movie i went to see when i tried to enable silent mode. :P
<UTL> Say, is there a way to test Ubuntu Touch from an SD card without wiping your device? I wanted to try the ovation image on my Nook HD+ again, but I don't want to lose my Cyanogenmod settings. I could back up the settings (via ADB or Clockworkmod Recovery), but I've had problems restoring them in the past.
<UTL> Anybody available?
<UTL> Hmmm, all out to lunch, eh? Well, I'll check back later.
<UTL> Anybody available now?
<UTL> Hello?
#ubuntu-touch 2014-12-06
<bubbasaures> UTL, There is a dual boot app for a couple of nexus devices, that is what you need an app.
<bubbasaures> it actually is a multiboot you can fill it up with images
<UTL> Uh... Well... I kinda tried that... and it kinda didn't work. Every image I tried didn't work.
<UTL> I don't use a Nexus.
<UTL> bubbasaures: Some people have managed to boot Ubuntu Touch from an SD card without messing up the internal storage on their device. I was wondering how I could do that.
<UTL> I own a Nook HD+, not a Nexus.
<bubbasaures> just info
<bubbasaures> the 2013 nook appears to run google apps, just thought maybe has made a multi boot for more android devices, we never know how far you have researched is all.
<bubbasaures> someone has*
<UTL> I have researched this extensively. I am adamant about getting Ubuntu Touch to work on my Nook HD+, but I've had so many problems in the past, I wanted to test it first before installing for good.
<UTL> You see, there is an image for it (ovation), but it's very buggy.
<UTL> bubbasaures: Like I said, I've tried the Ubuntu Dual-Boot app, but each image I chose didn't install. You see, I had change the build.prop file to fool the app into thinking it was dealing with a Nexus 10, but I don't think I knew what I was doing.
<UTL> nhaines: Are you online, as well?
<bubbasaures> hope you get it figured out, bummer the backup images don't just always reload.
<UTL> Yeah, it is a bummer. Thanks, bubbasaures.
<UTL> Here's some pictures of some of the problems I've been having (second post by "wesnoth"): http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2406766&page=5 Any ideas would be very much appreciated.
<UTL> I mean, the second post on the page.
<UTL> Well, this looks promising: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2406766&page=16 I hope it really is an update. Problem is, it was posted a year and a month ago, while the one on Ubuntu's website has been posted since May.
<UTL> The last posts on the XDA Developers site is from June. Nothing later than that. Nuts!
<jcbjoe_> hello .. is ubuntu-touch ready for the masses yet or is it a no go ?
<UTL> Here we go... Just changed the build.prop on my Nook HD+ so I could get the Ubuntu Dual Boot app. I'm fooling it into thinking it's a Nexus 10 (manta image).
<UTL> Didn't work. It booted into Clockworkmod Recovery, instead.
<UTL> nhaines?
<nhaines> UTL: yes?
<UTL> Hi! Did you get my message about build.prop?
<UTL> nhaines: That was directed towards you.
<UTL> Where does the data for the Ubuntu Dual-Boot app go?
<nhaines> UTL: I did not!
<UTL> Oh. Here, let me run it through again, then...
<nhaines> But unless the partitions on Nexus 10 and Nook HD+ are the same, I expect it not to work.
<UTL> Well, there must be a work-around. Should I repartition, then? If so, how do I do it?
<nhaines> I don't think you can repartition much.  The partition layout is required by the chipset or the board.
<UTL> Hmmm...
<UTL> So far, no good. It reboots into recovery every time.
<UTL> At least it doesn't erase Cyanogenmod, or completely freeze my tablet on the Nook logo.
<UTL> The dualboot.sh command doesn't work at all. I had to download an APK from here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2587723
<UTL> Backing up, just in case. I'm going to try something drastic to my Nook HD+.
<rhinolinux> hello all
<jcbjoe_> hello .. i'm getting a nexus 4 this week and i want to install ubuntu-touch onto it .. the nexus 4 is a supported device and i was wondering can i use it as a daily driver
<popey> you can
<jcbjoe_> cool
<jcbjoe_> popey: if you don't mind 1 last thing .. do i have to install ubuntu lets say in a virtualbox to install ubuntu-touch to the nexus 4 ?
<popey> jcbjoe_: no, but it's easier if you have ubuntu on a machine
<popey> otherwise it's a bit manual
<jcbjoe_> cool popey i will install it in vmware or virtualbox
<jcbjoe_> popey: i'm familiary with linux
<jcbjoe_> will this channell come more to life when i need actual help when i get my nexus 4 when i need to install ubuntu-touch ?
<jcbjoe_> i know i will run into some bumps and hiccups
<popey> jcbjoe_: its way more busy during the working week
<jcbjoe_> ok
<towski> hey, what's the best phone for ubuntu touch
<towski> best - highest spec
<towski> ah I guess probably nexus 10
<towski> oh the 10 is a tablet
<towski> so nexus 7?
<bubbasaures> towski, The effort is getting a phone company to deploy this, seems to be some interest, personally I will wait till than.
<bubbasaures> It's a development still
<towski> right
<towski> it would be nice to have a phone that I could put debian/ubuntu on it
<towski> I guess phones are hard to hack
<towski> I feel like I have no option other than to get an iphone :(
#ubuntu-touch 2014-12-07
<tyrion> towski, an iphone? are you joking?
<towski> well I mean iphones have everything
<towski> except for open source and linux
<towski> well it's either a oneplus or an iphone
<Taconut> Hi! Can I use ubuntu touch like a normal linux computer if I wanT to?
<Taconut> Like install packages, etc
<idler> Hi, has ubuntu acceleration for HW for sansumg galaxy s3 lite  ?
<idler> the silent is the response????
<popey> idler: it's quiet in here on the weekends
<popey> idler: way more busy during the working week
<idler> ok buuuut although imm very idler my time is gold
<idler> ok but
<idler> this is for koalas???
<idler> this chanel is for koalas?
<idler> all very slowly
<popey> idler: as I said, people are here more during the week
<popey> monday through friday from about 08:00 UTC until around 20:00 UTC
<idler> ok ubuntu for phones and tablets is little popular in the world and for this reason in this chanel  cant  give me response
<idler> ubuntu for tablets and phones is a loser???
<popey> idler: we haven't shipped a single device yet, which is one reason why it's not "popular" by any measure
<idler> has ubuntu support of acceleration for hardware in sansumg galaxy s3 lite???
<idler> its the question to hve or not to have
<popey> idler: is it listed here? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices - if not, no, we don't support that device.
<idler> for nexus oof google thre support true???
<popey> We support the devices listed on that page. Nexus 4, Nexus 7 (2013) and Nexus 10. Community porters support the rest.
<idler> ok
<idler> nexus is more universal than sansumg then ....
<UbUntUToUchLover> Hello! I just used the Complete Linux Installer app. Is it possible to get Ubuntu Touch working through this?
<UbUntUToUchLover> Hello? Anybody available?
<UbUntUToUchLover> nhaines? You available?
<UbUntUToUchLover> Just checking. I'm quitting, for now.
<UbUntUToUchLover> Hello?
<UbUntUToUchLover> Good morning! At least, to those who are still experiencing morning!
<UbUntUToUchLover> nhaines: Are you there this lovely morning? :-D
<UbUntUToUchLover> I wanted to tell anybody that was monitoring this channel: I've been testing the Ubuntu Dual-Boot app on my Nook HD+, tricking it by configuring the build.prop so that it thought I was running a Nexus (flo, manta, mako), but every time I rebooted to Ubuntu, it went to recovery, instead.
<UbUntUToUchLover>  I even cleared the EMMC partition, and cleaned the data from my Clockworkmod ROM app, but it still rebooted to recovery! Like a digital clock showing time, while the batteries are out!
<UbUntUToUchLover> Any ideas? I feel so close to a solution, I don't want to give up, yet!
<UbUntUToUchLover> bubbasaures: I know you're online. Can you help me?
<UbUntUToUchLover>  Is anybody here?
<UbUntUToUchLover>  Do I have to use Ubuntu colors to get someone's attention?
<UbUntUToUchLover>  How about now?
<UbUntUToUchLover> Oh, well. I'll stay in touch... No pun intended.
<bubbasaures> UbUntUToUchLover, Outside what I know is all.
<UbUntUToUchLover> bubbasaures: Did you see my messages?
<UbUntUToUchLover> bubbasaures: I've been using the Ubuntu Dual-Boot app to try to get Ubuntu Touch to work on my Nook, but to no avail. I've been tricking the app into thinking I'm using a Nexus by using a build.prop editor.
<cwayne> yeah that won't work, theres no ubuntu port for nook (that i know of at least)
<cwayne> and it's certainly not a supported port if so
<popey> cwayne: ybon was looking for the points of interest scope source if you have it somewhere. he noticed it in the store.
<cwayne> not public yet popey
<cwayne> the source that is
<ybon> popey, cwayne: about this, I noticed scope opens locations in here.com; is there some plan in the future to support some map:// protocol, and let the user chose which will open it?
<ybon> which app* will open it
<popey> cwayne: ybon made our first map app - OSM Touch...
<cwayne> right, osm touch is awesome
<ybon> :)
<cwayne> ybon: i'm not sure about that, but i'm sure you could ship a url-dispatcher hook with osm-touch to do that
<ybon> interesting
<UbUntUToUchLover> cwayne: There IS an image for the Nook HD+ (ovation), but it is so buggy, I've been looking for other methods of putting Ubuntu Touch on my Nook. I love Ubuntu, and I'd want it on every device, if I can - and I believe I can!
<ybon> any idea where I can find documentation about this, cwayne?
<cwayne> UbUntUToUchLover: it's buggy because it's not a supported device probably :P  I know how you feel though, I've been tryin' to get ubuntu running on my oneplus one
<cwayne> ybon: about how to add url-dispatcher bits?
<cwayne> i'm not sure it's well documented, let me try and find an example at least
<ybon> cwayne: yep, and thanks :)
<cwayne> ybon: here's a start: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/URLDispatcher
<ybon> thanks!
<cwayne> ybon: and this MP to the clock app may be helpful as an example: https://code.launchpad.net/~ted/ubuntu-clock-app/url-dispatcher/+merge/201536
<UbUntUToUchLover> cwayne: Thanks, man. I know it's not a supported device, but even so, I believe it can be done. It's just figuring out how that's bugging me.
<cwayne> UbUntUToUchLover: right, but the issue is even if there's a port, the dual boot app won't know about it, as it uses system-image, and afaik nobody's created a system-image server for any community ports other than hammerhead and deb
 * cwayne goes back to being sick, may check in later
<ybon> cwayne: so this means that an app should know about the other app to open some resource in it, right?
<UbUntUToUchLover> cwayne: True. Tricking the Dual Boot app may not be the answer. I need to research even deeper!
<ybon> I mean, I can add an URL dispatcher like "map://" in OSMTouch, but then, as an example, the points of interest scope need to know that protocol has been exposed by OSMTouch, and then (maybe) decide to use it?
<ybon> Also, I wonder how we'll manage when two apps will register URL dispatcher that conflicts
<ybon> (Made an issue on the tracker https://bugs.launchpad.net/osmtouch/+bug/1400132 )
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1400132 in OSMTouch "Add an URL dispatcher" [Undecided,New]
<ybon> popey: a bit off topic, but do you know someone who can be aware of the status of the Ubuntu arabic font project? http://design.canonical.com/2011/01/hebrew-and-arabic-on-track/
<popey> ybon: no idea, but I'd fire a mail a the design team. specifically john.lea@ our company name dot com â»
<ybon> cool, thanks! :)
<UbUntUToUchLover> Any news on ovation? Has it been further modified by anybody?
<UbUntUToUchLover> Just checking. Anyway, go for the orange!
<popey> UbUntUToUchLover: i doubt anyone has touched it other than you
<UbUntUToUchLover> popey: I barely got your message. What did you say?
<UbUntUToUchLover> Sorry. The stupid app crashed.
<UbUntUToUchLover> *
<popey> 19:27:49 < popey> UbUntUToUchLover: i doubt anyone has touched it other than you
<UbUntUToUchLover> I am now UTL2. I'm changing apps.
<UTL2> popey: Here I am. What were we talking about?
<popey> 19:27:49 < popey> UbUntUToUchLover: i doubt anyone has touched it other than you
<UTL2> popey: I saw that. I forgot the subject I was currently talking about. Sorry if I sound like an idiot.
<popey> I give up.
<UTL2> popey: Hey, don't give up, now! We'll just start with what we do know! Like...
<UTL2> For instance, about the Dual Boot app. That's something I've been puzzling over, because I'm forced to use it instead of it's true purpose - to dual-boot from Android to Ubuntu Touch on a Nexus device.
<UTL2> What I mean is, I'm using it on a Nook instead of a Nexus. Interestingly, it downloads and installs, but it reboots into Clockworkmod Recovery.
<UTL2> So I clear the EMMC folder where I think the recovery is stored. Then, I boot CyanogenMod and clear the Clockworkmod ROM app that installed recovery to begin with. After that, I try again. Curiously, the same result happens!
<UTL2> Now it's got me thinking: How do I get rid of recovery, and will this help me be able toboot Ubuntu?
<UTL2> to boot
<UTL> I, UTL2, am also under Ubuntu Desktop.
<UTL> popey: You still there?
<popey> yes
<UTL> popey: Did you get my messages about the app? Do you have any idea if it will work?
<UTL2> Leaving my tablet, for now.
<e960info> hello all , I would like to ask info about lg e960 nexus 4.  does anyone in here use it with ubuntu-touch ?? do you think that a price of about 150euro is ok for a used  phone like a nexus 4 ?? can I run both android and ubuntutouch in a LG nexus 4?? thanks fo ryour reply
<UTL> e960info: All LG Nexus 4s should work. Check if your device is codenamed "mako".
<e960info> can I dual boot cyanomonged and ubuntutouch with a nexus 4? ubuntu touch and android??
<e960info> how is difficult to brick my new used-phone trying to dual boot??
<UTL> e960info: You can get the Ubuntu Dual-Boot app following the directions here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/DualBootInstallation All supported devices should work, and even some devices closely related to Nexuses should work. I wouldn't know about any others.
<UTL> I have a Nook HD+, and the Dual-Boot app didn't work for me. :-(
<popey> The dual boot app is designed for the devices we support, the nexus ones.
<UTL> e960info: I am still experimenting with the app. There may be few devices that you can install Ubuntu Touch on if you change the build.prop file, but I don't recommend this because it could mess up your device - even brick it, if you change too much!
<e960info> so it's better to simply remove android from a nexus 4 and to install ubuntutouch?? in this way it is still possible to crick the phone?? I mean not any dual boot, at the end I donÃ¬t like android, for this reason I want to try to use ubuntutouch
<e960info> which percentage from 1% to 99% have I to brick my nexus 4 e960,mako, phone while installing ubuntu-touch? and may I return to use android if ubuntutouch doesn't work???
<UTL> e960info: Plug your device into a computer. Run "adb shell grep ro.product.device /system/build.prop" from a terminal. Does it return as "mako"?
<Elleo> as far as I'm aware there is only one nexus 4 type
<Elleo> so you'll be fine with anything that's sold as being a nexus 4
<e960info> I'm going to buy such a phone on ebay just now,  I wanted to know some experience from people who are using it.
<Elleo> I don't dual boot, so can't comment on that side of things, but UT runs fine on the nexus 4 in general
<UTL> e960info: Follow the instructions here when you get your Nexus 4, and you will see that it works: http://developer.ubuntu.com/start/ubuntu-for-devices/installing-ubuntu-for-devices/
<UTL> Or, use the Dual Boot link that I gave you earlier. Both work on all Nexus 4s, but only one method keeps the current OS.
<UTL> e960info: I can see that you're worried about bricking. There really is no need to, as long as your device is supported by Ubuntu. If you find that it is not, you can try to flash a different image, but I have no guarantee that it will work properly.
<UTL> e960info: Check to see if your device is here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices Click on the code name for the device you want to know about, and check all the details.
<e960info> I have just bought an LG e960 nexus 4 , thanks for your help. I will have it on 15 of december.  thanks to all developers that are working to give me an opportunity to do not use android.
<UTL> e960info: Glad to help!
 * UTL , now knowing some new IRC commands, uses them.
 * UTL doesn't mean to be a pain. All he wants is some friendly help.
<UTL> inxi
#ubuntu-touch 2015-11-30
<dholbach> good morning
<lpotter> Sleep_Walker: there is an app in ubuntu store called SensorStatus. it has some detailed info on the gps
<Sleep_Walker> lpotter: thanks, I already found that one
<Sleep_Walker> problem is that it seems that GPS is not always working
<Sleep_Walker> I brought it up be enabling it and rebooting phone
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, why do you think the gps is not working?
<tvoss> mpt, o/
<Sleep_Walker> because I can't see any dot on map for really long time, I can't see any data in Sensor Status
<Sleep_Walker> really long time means ~1 hour
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, are you indoors?
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, which device and image are you using?
<tvoss> mpt, is ` an apostrophe?
<Sleep_Walker> Aquaris E4.5, OTA-8, 20151118.2
<lpotter> tvoss: is agps supported?
<Sleep_Walker> I'm not sure which numbers are relevant here
<tvoss> lpotter, sure, depends on the image and device, though
<Sleep_Walker> 20151118-205525
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, do you have an active data connection? is wifi enabled?
<Sleep_Walker> phone was behind the window
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, are you happy to shell into the phone?
<Sleep_Walker> absolutely :)
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, mind running  sudo ubuntu-location-serviced-cli --bus system --test and pastebinning the output?
<mpt> tvoss, no, thatâs a backtick. A typographical apostrophe â is U+2019
 * tvoss searches keyboard
<mpt> tvoss, with the âEnglish (Macintosh)â layout itâs Option + Shift + ]. Not so easy in non-Mac layouts, unfortunately.
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, please note that the test may take some time as it tries to get a gps fix three times from cold start (without aiding data)
<Sleep_Walker> OK
<tvoss> â
<tvoss> mpt, correct?
<Sleep_Walker> I'm preparing WiFi connection to do the test through SSH
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, didn't you have one before?
<Sleep_Walker> my test was yesterday in the evening
<Sleep_Walker> <unimportant>and at that time I was on different network </unimportant>
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, ah okay
<Sleep_Walker> btw. is there something like xdotool for Mir?
<Sleep_Walker> I miss such tool very much
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, nope, on purpose :) That being said, you can certainly come up with your own input method to support the use case
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, on purpose as it leverages a testing api in X. We would rather encourage developers to plug into the input method channels for such use-cases
<Sleep_Walker> I'm still too far from ubuntu sdk and ubuntu touch api so any solution already made could save me time :/
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, nothing available, yet
 * mcphail is giving up on OTA8 and trying rc-proposed
<tvoss> mcphail, which issue(s) are you facing?
<mcphail> tvoss: awful battery life
<tvoss> mcphail, do you use tweakgeek?
<mcphail> tvoss: I did, but I've tried without tweakgeeking anything
<tvoss> mcphail, okay, do you use the music app routinely?
<mcphail> is tweakgeek a problem?
<mcphail> tvoss: not every day. Didn't use it yesterday but still had rapid discharge
<tvoss> mcphail, okay, did you file a bug?
<mcphail> tvoss: I filed a bug against the most frequent finding in my syslog (clock app) in case that was the cause of the battery drain
<tvoss> mcphail, got link?
<mcphail> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-clock-app/+bug/1519543
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1519543 in Ubuntu Clock App "Syslog full of spam from alarm settings - is this draining battery?" [Undecided,New]
<mpt> tvoss, yes, thatâs the one
<tvoss> mpt, :) shift+alt gr+N
<tvoss> mpt, mp is updtaed
<tvoss> updated, even
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, any update from the test?
<Sleep_Walker> sorry, I was out
<Sleep_Walker> let me check
<Sleep_Walker> http://sprunge.us/ZjVL
<Sleep_Walker> tvoss: ^^
<Sleep_Walker> test looks good, it would make sense to tell me which data would be interesting in case of GPS failure so I will collect it next time the problem re-appears
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, you want to hand me the output of 'sudo dmesg', 'sudo /system/bin/logcat', all /var/log/ubuntu-location* files, and which app you used for testing
<Sleep_Walker> OK, I'll prepare script for such case, thanks
<Sleep_Walker> and btw. - I'd love to use Activity Tracker but when I switch the phone off, it stops logging - is there something I could do about that?
<bee_keeper> Hi - anyone here using the telgram app?  I'm able to search and add bots using web interface but not the app - am i missing something?
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, the behavior is intentional, we are evaluating if/how we can support such use cases without causing excessive battery drain
<davmor2> bee_keeper: might not be implemented yet, they went for basic compatibility with the old app, now they can add new features to it with relative ease with the new back end
<davmor2> bee_keeper: you might want to double check though on #ubuntu-telegram
<Sleep_Walker> tvoss: I understand your point, but I somehow miss the freedom of choice in that
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, sure, I can see that point, too. But: integrating both is an art, without impacting the UX for the non-tech-savvy user
<Sleep_Walker> tvoss: there should be switch - Give me full control [on/off] ;)
<mpt> hmm, upower -d is not very grep-friendly
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, sure, what means full control, though ;)
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, so yeah, under investigation, takes time
<bee_keeper> davmor2: ok, thanks
<Sleep_Walker> tvoss: thanks for caring about that
<mpt> Sleep_Walker, see bug 1514329
<ubot5> bug 1514329 in location-service (Ubuntu) "Applications should be able to setup and subscribe to geo fence events" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1514329
<tvoss> mpt, that's not exactly the same :)
<tvoss> mpt, it enables another class of use cases, though
<mpt> tvoss, not necessarily, but âwake me up for a moment when I hit the fenceâ would be
<mpt> And I doubt geofences would be that useful otherwise
<tvoss> mpt, well, activity tracker really is about ongoing monitoring of certain aspects of the system. you could "abuse" geofences to implement that monitoring, but I'm not a fan of that idea :)
<Sleep_Walker> mpt: thanks
<Sleep_Walker> I added myself as affected user
<mpt> tvoss, according to the store description itâs about monitoring your activity, not the systemâs
<tvoss> Sleep_Walker, you are not really affected by that specific bug, but feel free
<tvoss> mpt, sure, that involve's monitoring the system's location for example
<mpt> I donât think a geofence is an abusive way to track the systemâs location :-P
<tvoss> mpt, seriously, you are confusing two concepts here
<pixel_> Saviq, done http://i.imgur.com/kvNKMvO.jpg but now the fake browser's controls are under the top bar, i can't minimize it.
<Saviq> mzanetti, bug #1438465 â?
<ubot5> bug 1438465 in unity8 (Ubuntu) "A window dragged under the panel can't be dragged out again" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1438465
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy Computer Security Day! ð
<pixel_> Saviq, i also get a lot of binding loop detected when i resize the unity8's window file:///home/pixel/unity8a/trunk/qml/Stages/SurfaceContainer.qml:54:5: QML MirSurfaceItem: Binding loop detected for property "surfaceWidth"
<Saviq> pixel_, isn't it maximized, though? if you click on it?
<mzanetti> Saviq, hmm... not sure
<mzanetti> there have been lots of changes lately...
<mzanetti>  yeah... indeed
<mzanetti> so far no issue on the screenshot
<Saviq> pixel_, ah, browser is fullscreen is all
<pixel_> Saviq, if i click on it http://i.imgur.com/lLAFuA4.png
<pixel_> yep, the fake browser is fullscreen
<Saviq> pixel_, you can drag the launcher in, long-press on the browser icon to get "Close"
<Saviq> mzanetti, we should have window controls in panel for fullscreen apps, fwiw â
<mzanetti> Saviq, no
<mzanetti> Saviq, fullscreen on a desktop is fullscreen
<mzanetti> press F11 on firefox
<Saviq> mzanetti, yes, but you can pull the panel n
<Saviq> in
<Saviq> mzanetti, I'm not saying it should be always on screen
<Saviq> but when you pull it down
<mzanetti> pull it down?
<Saviq> mzanetti, when fullscreen, you can still go top-edge-swipe for the panel
<Saviq> mzanetti, we might enable top-edge-push with mouse, too, TBD
<mzanetti> ah, with touch
<mzanetti> Saviq, at least firefox on X11 uses top edge stuff on its own
<Saviq> mzanetti, yeah, we want it to stop, because it's hell inconsistent everywhere
<Saviq> mzanetti, that's what I prototyped and showed off back in Dallas
<Saviq> aanyway, before we get there
<Saviq> since you can get the panel, it'd be nice for the window controls to be there :)
<ogra_> hmm, is it my eayes or did the panel color just chane by a small nuance with todays rc-proposed upgrade ?
<ogra_> *change
<mzanetti> ogra_, it did change
<ogra_> :)
<pixel_> ogra_,  and the orange line is gone
<ogra_> it so minimal that i thought its my brain or so :)
<ogra_> oh, yeah, thats sad, i liked it
<pixel_> ogra, you can add it back :D (1 line of qml)
<ogra_> nah, i'm not *that* attached to it :)
<pixel_> :))
<tvoss> mardy, I'm tempted to drop http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/location-service/15.04/view/head:/src/location_service/com/ubuntu/location/time_based_update_policy.cpp from the default engine configuration
<tvoss> mardy, rationale: I don't think the service is the right place to do the right thing for *all* applications consuming position updates
<tvoss> mardy, we could probably think about providing example code to carry out low-pass filtering on the client side, though
<tvoss> mardy, what do you think?
<elasrofxela> my port finally booting but with no graphics
<elasrofxela> any idea what to do next?
<elasrofxela> https://github.com/alexforsale/ubtouch-dmesg
<mardy> tvoss: it might need some adjustment, but I think that the server side should do that kind of filtering
<tvoss> mardy, I think we are not clever enought for that tbh, we would have to do the heavy lifting of fusing with sensor data
<mardy> tvoss: I cannot imagine the apps being more clever, TBH :-)
<tvoss> mardy, well, not right now, but I'm thinking along the lines of a full-blown navigation app
<mardy> tvoss: what problems do you see with the current code?
<mardy> tvoss: I also see some problems, but I want to see if we find the same ones :-)
<mardy> tvoss: the problem I see is that if the update is coming from the same provider which gave us the last valid update, we should never filter it out
<tvoss> mardy, that's one issue: the other is the timeout parameter, which is notoriously difficult to choose
<mardy> tvoss: so, for example, it's fine to filter out wifi-based results when they are less accurate than the GPS, but if the last update was from the GPS and now we get a more inaccurate update again from the GPS, we should not filter it
<tvoss> mardy, sure, I agree with that
<tvoss> mardy, the other bit is: we really should decrease the accuracy of the last update to age it out
<mardy> tvoss: and if we move this logic to the client, we should also extend our signals to include some info about the source of the update
<tvoss> mardy, and that is something I would like to avoid
<mardy> tvoss: yep
<mardy> tvoss: indeed, I think that if we don't get new updates from the providers, we should still continuing emitting updates to the client, reusing the last known position with decreased accuracy
<mardy> tvoss: BTW, the Qt API allows to specify an update interval; we don't have that in the platform API, do we?
<tvoss> mardy, it's hidden, but we have it
<mardy> tvoss: so, back to the original point: I think that that code needs some improvements, and might need to be moved in the session class, if we find a reason for which different apps would want it to behave differently; but I strongly feel that it should stay in the server side
<tvoss> mardy, okay, so I think a reasonable first step would be to (a.) move to session (not making it configurable right now), (b.) expose enough information to ensure that chains of updates from individual providers are always accepted and propagated
<mardy> tvoss: ok
<tvoss> mardy, (a.) would give us the opportunity to also integrate a timer that samples the reference position at the requested interval (either faster or slower than actual updates)
<mardy> tvoss: indeed, as well as obfuscating the real position to apps that shouldn't be allowed to get an accurate position (in in the future we implement such a policy)
<tvoss> mardy, yup
<tvoss> mardy, sounds good. ssweeny might take that one once he finishes the async provider stuff
<mardy> tvoss: as for (B), after thinking over your suggestion that we should decrease the accuracy of the last update as it ages, I think it might not be needed
<tvoss> mardy, well, if the provider delivers faster than expected interval, we sample at a slower pace
<tvoss> mardy, which we wouldn#t do in the "aging out" scenario
<mardy> tvoss: right
<tvoss> mardy, so I think we want a simple Sampler that is periodically invoked
<mardy> tvoss: maybe, but I wouldn't like a wake-up timer... I mean, we shouldn't cause more wake-ups than now
<mardy> tvoss: just thinking about battery :-)
<vitimiti> I'm trying to build and run the Unity 8 shell following this tutorial over here: https://unity.ubuntu.com/getinvolved/development/unity8/ but I get an initctl error saying the unity8 process is unknown: http://paste.ubuntu.com/13573548/ Somebody knows how to fix this problem?
<tvoss> mardy, well, *if* the session is active, we have to satisfy the client requirement
<tvoss> mardy, in which case we need the sampler
<tvoss> mardy, it obviously shouldn't run if the session is not active
<mardy> tvoss: I mean, suppose that the client wants an update every second, and the GPS gives us an update every 0.97 seconds
<tvoss> mardy, in which case the GPS is running and the additional cost of just having an additional wakeup is moot :)
<mardy> tvoss: OK, s/GPS/wifi or whatever :-)
<tvoss> mardy, still :)
<mardy> tvoss: I mean, we should hand out updates when we have them
<tvoss> mardy, which is not what the client would expect
<tvoss> mardy, *if* we support the frequency flag
<nhaines> Ooh, I just flashed my Nexus 7 with ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/ubuntu-pd.  I like it!  What is it?  :)
<mardy> tvoss: well, the client doesn't really have a say in that, it's just a preference
<tvoss> mardy, that's not what the qt api suggests, though, iirc
<mardy> tvoss: at least the Qt documentation explicitly says that updates could come at any frequency
<tvoss> okay, that's difficult to me, tbh
<tvoss> either we support it, or not :)
<nhaines> Regardless, the Unity 8 theme looks very nice and the window manipulation is nice.  The Browser handling touch and mouse different is perfect and I could completely imagine working with the tablet as an impromptu pocket desktop.  Which also now I think I know what -pd means.
<tvoss> in the sense that: if we support the flag we should implement it such that a developer can rely on the frequency
 * tvoss claps :)
<nhaines> And if *that's* what it is, well, I'm sad that the legacy apps icons are only mockups.  :)  But seriously, there's plenty of polish still needed (as always with these things, that comes last) but it's a giant leap ahead of OTA-8.  Very impressive.
<mardy> tvoss: I think we should take the desired interval from all the connected the clients, and start computing updates at a frequency acceptable to all (the minimum among them, I guess)
<mardy> tvoss: the if the means that we are waking up every second, but we have one client which only cares for updates every 5 seconds, we can let that client skip some updates
<mardy> tvoss: but the main point, is that we should have only one internal timer, and not a timer for each client
<tvoss> mardy, let me think about that. I like the idea of the minimum frequency, which we could also propagate to providers (the gps chipset driver supports setting that value)
<tvoss> mardy, so how would you force propagation of updates at a later point then?
<tvoss> mardy, per session, that is
<mardy> tvoss: actually, something like internal_frequency = max(1sec, max_common_divisor([freq_client1, ..., fre_client_N]))
<tvoss> mardy, okay, so you propose to reuse the tick of the system, and update per client every frequency / internal_frequency tick
<tvoss> correct?
<mardy> tvoss: yes
<tvoss> mardy, where frequency is the client-specific frequency
<mardy> yes, so for every session we store the time of the last update (to that session), and the desired frequency
<mardy> tvoss: if enough time has passed, we deliver the update, otherwise we don't
<tvoss> mardy, that still leaves us with a fuzzy statement to developers, though
<mardy> tvoss: why do you think so? we could still be quite precise with timely delivering updates
<tvoss> mardy, that depends on the setup of all clients
<mardy> tvoss: well, indeed the first update they receive could come anytime within the first second, but any later update would come at regular intervals from the first
<mcphail> My car still can't see my phone via bluetooth, depite running rc-proposed as per https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone/msg16864.html . Is there any way to debug this?
<davmor2> mcphail: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingBluetooth
<mcphail> davmor2: embarrassingly, I just found that link at the bottom of the link I posted ;)
<davmor2> mcphail: yeah I thought it was in there :)
<m0n5t3r_1> does anyone have an idea what this means? (from xsession-errors):
<m0n5t3r_1> upstart: Failed to spawn application-click (com.ubuntu.terminal_terminal_0.7.140) main process: unable to switch security profile: No such file or directory
<ogra_> looks like you are trying to run a click app without having the right environment installed
<m0n5t3r> it started doing this not long ago, then I flashed rc-proposed 191 an hour ago and stuff worked; then after it rebooted itself once or twice it's doing it again
<m0n5t3r> define "the right environment"
<ogra_> it is a phone app
<ogra_> so you need a phone environment
<ogra_> with all the lockdowns and security bits
<m0n5t3r> the only differences from the base thing is /etc/hosts (because no other way to block ads) and /etc/apparmor.d/tunables/global (a line allowing read from /etc/writable/hosts)
<m0n5t3r> it is a bq aquaris phone, so I guess that counts as a phone environment
<ogra_> you cant run click apps on a desktop witout a lot of tinkering with apparmor and friends
<m0n5t3r> not desktop
<m0n5t3r> phone
<ogra_> you said .xsession-errors
<ogra_> there is no X on phoes
<ogra_> *phones
<m0n5t3r> ... but there is an .xsession-errors in /home/phablet
<m0n5t3r> I guess it's a standard thing so unity puts output there
<ogra_> not really
<nhaines> ogra_: do you know what ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed/ubuntu-pd is?  Does it replace ubuntu-touch/rc-proposed on flo? :)  (If not, MultiROM Manager is being weird again.)
<ogra_> no idea where it comes from or why anything would write to it
<ogra_> nhaines, ask sil2100 ... no idea what it is
<nhaines> sil2100!  :)
<ogra_> m0n5t3r, the actual log you are interested in is in ~/.cache/upstart somewhere
<sil2100> nhaines: hey! ubuntu-pd is the pocket-desktop experimentation channel
<ogra_> ignore ~/.xession-errors
<nhaines> sil2100: sounds like just the thing to take up room on my Nexus 7.  Unfortunately, Bluetooth is broken on the N7 (in OTA-8 too, not just the pd channel).  When can I expect Libertine to show?  :)
<sil2100> nhaines: pocket-desktop is nothing more than ubuntu-touch + libertine and puritine
<nhaines> sil2100: Then Unity 8 snuck in some really nice window manipulation stuff when I wasn't looking. :)
<sil2100> nhaines: yeah, the PD effort is being worked on actively ;)
<m0n5t3r> ogra_: nothing useful shows up in any .cache/upstart log
<m0n5t3r> just unity8 saying it started the terminal, and then that the terminal exited
<ogra_> m0n5t3r, and you see that when just tapping on the terminal icon ?
<mcphail> how do I copy/paste from the terminal app?
<m0n5t3r> yup
<ogra_> weird ...
<m0n5t3r> not only the terminal
<m0n5t3r> nothing works apart from the browser
<nhaines> sil2100: it's a giant step up from the rc-proposed stuff.  I was quite pleasantly suprised.  If LibreOffice Writer ran and Bluetooth worked, I could really use my N7 on the go!  :)
<m0n5t3r> I'm guessing something crashes
<ogra_> that sounds like you broke your apparmor installation
<m0n5t3r> gtg, back in a few hours
<ogra_> did you install any debs, make it writable or anything like that ?
<m0n5t3r> nope
<ogra_> wow
<ogra_> out of diskspace ?
<m0n5t3r> just a line in apparmor.d/tunables saying "/etc/writable/hosts r"
<nhaines> sil2100: is there any way I can try out libertine using the -pd channel?
<ogra_> you edited apparmor.d/tunables ??
<ogra_> like ... directly ?
<m0n5t3r> ...
 * mpt turns off Hotspot and the phone restarts
<mpt> Well thatâs weird
<ogra_> thats not the place to make something writable
<m0n5t3r> mount / -o remount,rw; vi tunables, add line, save; mount / -o remount,ro; reboot
<ogra_> yeah, that broke all your apprmor profiles
<nhaines> mpt: that seems like an extremely dramatic way to disable hotspot access.  :)
<m0n5t3r> why?
<sil2100> nhaines: best if you reach out bregma or kgunn regarding the usage of the ubuntu-pd channel, they're the ones working on the libertine/puritine effort
<m0n5t3r> it's correct
<nhaines> sil2100: <3
<sil2100> They would know best regarding that ;)
<ogra_> m0n5t3r, you would have to regenerate them somehow
<m0n5t3r> doesn't it do that on reboot?
<ogra_> m0n5t3r, and hacking apparmor is not the way to make something writable
<m0n5t3r> nope
<m0n5t3r> it is a way to make /etc/writable/hosts readable
<ogra_> you want to edit /etc7system-image/writable-paths
<ogra_> huh ?
<m0n5t3r> really gtg
<ogra_> /etc/hosts is definitely readable
<ogra_> else nothing would work :)
<kgunn> nhaines:
<ogra_> (and is a link to the file in 7etc7writable)
<vishnudev> Hello guys
<kgunn> nhaines: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1gfLy7cBHHwZXD0t74tqYpHvw60W5nc_qJoYUiU4A6mo/edit
<vishnudev> how to install ubuntu touch on nexus 7 2012?
<kgunn> if you want to try
<vishnudev> how to install ubuntu touch on nexus 7 2012?
<nhaines> vishnudev: it is not available for Nexus 7 2012.
<nhaines> kgunn: fantastic!  I'll be playing with this a *lot* before Ubucon Summit and SCALE.
 * popey wonders why his laptop now has ofono installed
<popey> well, failed to install
<nhaines> kgunn: aww, I don't have access to chinstrap.canonical.com.  :)
<kgunn> sorry about that....
<popey> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ofono/+bug/1521199
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1521199 in ofono (Ubuntu) "ofono fails to install on xenail desktop" [Undecided,New]
<vishnudev> nhaines can i build?
<nhaines> vishnudev: no; there are no graphics drivers available for the hardware.
<vishnudev> oh
<vishnudev> but how the old builds working?
<nhaines> Ancient version of Ubuntu with a different kernel.
<vishnudev> till saucy ?
<vishnudev> ok
<ogra_> and the point is they did not really work due to the driver
<ogra_> which is why the device was completely dropped ... the driver issues were not fixable
<nhaines> kgunn: any guesses as to when ubuntu-pd will include puritine?
<kgunn> nhaines: hopefully before years end...if not, early in the new year
<vishnudev> I am trying to isntall the old saucy in my nexus 7 2012
<ogra_> for what ?
<ogra_> nothing will run
<vishnudev> can i just flash saucy-preinstalled-touch-armhf.zip and saucy-preinstalled-touch-armel+grouper.zip
<vishnudev> I just want a device to try developing apps
<ogra_> you surely can ... but you wont be able to install any apps and the majority oif the preinstalled ones are rater in demo state
<nhaines> kgunn: Thanks!  I'll try to bum a puritine click off of someone later, when I'm supposed to be awake.  :)
<vishnudev> hmm
<vishnudev> its really bad
<nhaines> In the meantime, ubuntu-pd is pretty clearly in a development state, but it's a giant leap ahead of the OTA.  It's really impressive.
<nhaines> So good job to all involved!
<vishnudev> I was trying to make a ubuntu touch build for nexus 6
<vishnudev> it failed and now bought a n old nexus 6 2012 in hope of installing ubuntu touch
<vishnudev> :(
<ogra_> nexus 6 ?
<ogra_> you mean 7
<vishnudev> nexus 6
<vishnudev> nexus 7 2012
<ogra_> ah
<ogra_> well, you should have asked here first ...
<ogra_> then you would have been told to buy a 2013 model
<vishnudev> yeah
<ogra_> (which has completely different HW)
<vishnudev> I dint get 2013 here :(
<vishnudev> hm
<dobey> vishnudev: even if you got the old ubuntu image flashed onto a grouper, it would be so unusable that you wouldn't be able to test any apps on it anyway. and you especially couldn't test any new apps which require newer frameworks
<dobey> you could try the x86 emulator instead
<vishnudev> ok
<Elleo> mzanetti: when you get a chance could you test https://code.launchpad.net/~michael-sheldon/ubuntu-keyboard/fix-1451554/+merge/278468 (available in silo 2) and double check it fixes the mouse issues with the OSK in pocket desktop mode?
<mzanetti> Elleo, sure
<Elleo> mzanetti: great, thanks
<popey> awe, one for you? :) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ofono/+bug/1521199
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1521199 in ofono (Ubuntu) "ofono fails to install on xenial desktop" [Undecided,New]
<awe> popey, gee thanks
<popey> :D
<awe> we need to figure out why ofono is being installed by default on the desktop
<awe> boiko, ^^
<popey> i added the aptitude why to it
<popey> it shows why it's installed
<awe> k
<ogra_> is it by default or did popey just install some autopilot
<popey> see bug :)
<awe> it *shouldn't* be default
<awe> it was a telepathy-related lib in the past that caused this
<awe> ( pretty sure )
<ogra_> ah, the indicator
<popey> yeah
<awe> the network indicator?
<awe> pete-woods, ^^
<popey> indicator-network yes
<ogra_> yeah, it is even a direct dep
<ogra_> not a recommends or some such
<pete-woods> awe: network indicator is not included in the desktop
<pete-woods> only on the phone
<pete-woods> but it does, indeed depend on ofono
<awe> pete-woods, are you sure that's true for xenial?
<awe> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ofono/+bug/1521199
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1521199 in ofono (Ubuntu) "ofono fails to install on xenial desktop" [Undecided,New]
<pete-woods> awe: pretty sure? unless it was newly seeded for some reason
<pete-woods> awe: it's not even in main, so if it gets into the desktop image, then that's a problem
<ogra_> i assume popey has ubuntu-sdk-libs installed ... which depends on qtdeclarative5-ubuntu-push-plugin ... which depends on libconnectivity-qt1 which then depends on indicator-network
<popey> i do
<pete-woods> that would make sense
<pete-woods> it's set up not to start on the desktop (in the upstart session config)
<ogra_> well, it might be fine, t7he prob is ofono after all
<popey> jdstrand_, when I run an app on my device via ubuntu-app-launch, I get a message in dmesg which implies the app is unconfined (it should not be) - what does this mean? It's a bit scary. [Mon Nov 30 15:31:32 2015] type=1400 audit(1448897492.317:88): apparmor="STATUS" operation="profile_load" profile="unconfined" name="com.ubuntu.sudoku_sudoku_1.1.392" pid=19539 comm="apparmor_parser"
<tyhicks> popey: that audit message is saying that an unconfined process performed an AppArmor profile load
<popey> tyhicks, not sure I follow :)
<jjohansen> popey: its just logging that a profile got loaded, and the confinement information of the task that loaded the profile
<tyhicks> popey: after the app is running, do a `ps auxZ | grep sudoku` and the first column will be the AppArmor profile that is confining the process
<jjohansen> in this case, it is the apparmor_parser that is unconfined, not the app run via ubuntu-app-launch
<popey> ahh
<popey> makes sense, thanks chaps!
<popey> tedg, is there something like ubuntu-app-launch which shows stats for startup of a specific app. Like, I launch calculator then run this thing which tells me how long it took to start up fully?
<popey> tedg, or is that not measured?
<popey> maybe ubuntu-app-watch with some very verbose option?
<tedg> popey: It's not measured on a live system. You can enable the LTTng tracepoints and figure it out though.
<tedg> popey: But LTTng is blocked by apparmor by default.
<popey> ah okay.
<tedg> popey: So you need to enable it and rebuild the apparmor profiles.
<popey> so on a clean phone - flash - enabled LTTng - rebuild apparmor profiles - install app to be tested - run app...
<popey> and gather data from ?
<popey> (or is this documented somewhere?)
<tedg> popey: http://gould.cx/ted/blog/Measuring_Upstart_App_Launch_using_LTTng
<tedg> Wow, that blog post is almost two years old.
<tedg> They grow up so fast
<popey> oooh!
<popey> thanks tedg
<jdstrand_> popey: to save you some time-- adjust these: /usr/share/apparmor/easyprof/templates/ubuntu/1*/* to change this line: 'deny /{,var/}run/shm/lttng-ust-* r,' to be: '/{,var/}run/shm/lttng-ust-* r,'
<jdstrand_> popey: then run 'sudo aa-clickhook -f'
<mwu> Hi
<mwu> Does anybody know how to disable the smartscopes (Amazon, Weather, etc.) in Ubuntu Touch?
<tedg> BTW, popey I think that brendand was working on something with app startup. Asked me about this recently. You guys might sync.
<davmor2> mwu: just don't use them
<davmor2> mwu: they only search when you are on that scope
<mwu> davmor2: No, I want to remove them completly from the applications menu
<davmor2> mwu: they aren't scopes then, they are apps, just long press them and select uninstall
<popey> jdstrand, tedg thanks!
<mwu> It says that they are installed, but I removed them from the directory /custom/click; but they are still displayed.
<k1l> arent the scopes what make ubuntu touch ubuntu touch?
<popey> mwu, that's not how you remove things usually.
<popey> mwu, "sudo click unregister <click name> <version>" is one way
<mwu> com.ubuntu.weather is hidden for user phablet
<popey> yup, that's it.
<mwu> That's the error message of the command "click unregister com.ubuntu.weather"
<popey> the filesystem is read-only so it's somewhat hard to really actually remove it
<popey> and if you did, it will probably come back in an over the air update
<mwu> popey: You can remount it in read/write mode
<popey> i know :)
<popey> we generally don't recommend users do that
<popey> developers, sure. they break stuff all the time
<mwu> Who creates the file remote-scopes.json?
<mwu> This file contains all the links to the scopes I want to remove.
<popey> mwu, where is that file?
<ogra_> mwu, you get that error when you use popeys command including the sudo ?
<popey> thats not an error, that's normal
<popey> if you click unregister stuff that is in the ro part of the image you get a "hidden" message
<ogra_> ah, k ... it does check for the sudo user ?
<popey> because it cant remove the app (ro)
<popey> dunno what it says without sudo, I only ever run it correctly ;)
<ogra_> i was confused about the user name being mentioned in the error
<popey> mwu, ahh, ./.cache/unity-scopes/remote-scopes.json ?
<mwu>  Yes
<mwu> But you can delete the file without anything getting broken.
<popey> why delete random files?
<ogra_> because nothing breaks :)
 * popey deletes ogra_ 
<popey> \o/ nothing broke
<mwu> Because I want to find out, how I can remove the scopes Amazon, Ebay, Reddit, etc.
 * ogra_ sees the world break 
<popey> ok, so just do as I said, "sudo click unregister foo version"
<mwu> popey: But that doesn't remove the scope. It's still displayed as being installed and you can still start it. I would like to remove it completly
<davmor2> popey: don't delete ogra_ it's breaks my blame script which then default all blame to you instead of ogra_
<ogra_> !
<davmor2> ogra_: I need a backup for when you pretend to be on holiday
<ogra_> well, half of december then
<popey> mwu, sounds like a bug if you remove something and it doesn't get removed, I'd file a bug..
<davmor2> mwu: out of interest why?
<mwu> davmor2: I wan't to remove all things I don't need. I just want a thin smartphone with only email, contacts, calender, instant messaging, browser. Nothing else.
<davmor2> mwu: but unless you use  them they sit there doing nothing, so you can use the very things you want by just putt them in the launcher and ignoring the scopes completely
<davmor2> mwu: you can then unfavourite all the scopes you don't use and you won't see them any more
<jaywink> not everyone wants "amazon" glaring at them when they scroll the scopes list ;) there defo should be a way to remove any preinstalled stuff ;)
<jaywink> that is a huge flaw in many android phones where preinstalled stuff can't be removed
<davmor2> jaywink: but it is only active if you open it, and it isn't actually installed it is a remote scope
<jaywink> it's still there when you view the scopes list
<davmor2> jaywink: yes but unless you click on it it does nothing
<jaywink> allow users to hide it sounds like a good deal to me :)
<davmor2> jaywink: it is hidden unless you open the scopes list to switch scopes
<jaywink> yes, where it annoys me at least, as it does mwu
<jaywink> I personally use the scopes switcher quite a lot to view not often used scopes. It is quicker to have them off and use the switcher than to have them on and scroll one by one
<jaywink> so amazon is glaring at me quite often
<davmor2> jaywink: then file a bug if you haven't
<davmor2> and if there isn't one already
<jaywink> sure, just helping mwu drive the point ;)
<davmor2> jaywink: it isn't though, it is already hidden in the system, it isn't installed so you can't uninstall it, if you hide it and want it later you can't get it back unless there is a hidden section in the scopes manager at which point it would still be listed and have the same effect :D
<popey> jdstrand, click-review is crashing on this click for me... http://paste.ubuntu.com/13579250/ - http://people.canonical.com/~alan/docviewer/com.ubuntu.docviewer_0.3.latest_armhf.click any ideas?
<jaywink> davmor2, why isn't it packaged and installed as normal btw anyway? seems odd to hard code some store like amazon into the operating system
<mwu> Maybe Amazon paid something for that?
<davmor2> mwu: nope
<jaywink> even worse then ;)
<ogra_> well, stop complaining ... file a bug instead ;)
<ogra_> to get it fixed
 * jaywink tries to find the right place all the time .. unless mwu has filed it already
<ogra_> "canonical-system-image" worst case
<ogra_> thats the meta project
<jaywink> ok thanks that sounds like a good place :)
<mwu> OK, now I broke it. Need to restore factory image...
<jaywink> mwu, https://bugs.launchpad.net/canonical-devices-system-image/+bug/1521269 <-- if you want to add yourself as affected
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1521269 in Canonical System Image "Certain built in remote scopes cannot be hidden" [Undecided,New]
<mwu> Thanks for the bug and the description.
<dobey> jaywink: unity-scopes-shell would probably be the best place for "unable to hide remote scopes"
<jaywink> dobey, ah ok, I'll try to move it if I still can
<dobey> and it's not "certain built-in remote scopes" it's just remote scopes
<dobey> they aren't built-in, they are just remote
<jaywink> dobey, well, built-in in the sense that the list is shipped and cannot be changed
<JanC> and I assume they removed all (unwanted) remote scopes that weren't built-in
<m0n5t3r_1> ogra_: all right, back home... so, first up: upstart    2073           phablet    2w      REG      179,7     1344      40738 /home/phablet/.xsession-errors
<m0n5t3r_1> upstart writes to .xsession-errors
<m0n5t3r_1> after I removed that line and rebooted, things started to work again
<m0n5t3r_1> I still don't understand why, though
<dobey> jaywink: the list is not shipped.
<m0n5t3r_1> also, /etc/hosts is definitely not a link to /etc/writable/hosts by default, it's a regular file, and
<m0n5t3r_1> [ 4748.394197] type=1400 audit(1448904742.457:162): apparmor="DENIED" operation="open" profile="webbrowser-app" name="/etc/writable/hosts" pid=11314 comm="WorkerPool/1131" requested_mask="r" denied_mask="r" fsuid=32011 ouid=0
<jaywink> dobey, where does it come from, queried from a server?
<m0n5t3r_1> I guess I'll just copy it to /etc/hosts, it's the easiest (albeit unelegant) route
<jaywink> but anyway, the point is that the user should have the choice
<dobey> that is your position, yes
<mcphail> Well, rc-proposed has been much kinder on my battery than OTA8. Wonder why OTA8 regressed for me?
<taiebot> Hi all i am missing the app text on my phone in the app scope which makes the app scope kind of weird. This is what i have http://i.imgur.com/PFhO5XI.png this is what i should have minus one less icon https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-PImDhABojoM/VlwOTTHxEhI/AAAAAAAAIIo/snSTDzvsD2c/w530-h883-p/screenshot20151130_104953972.png
<pmcgowan> taiebot, fix in progress https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-scope-click/+bug/1519893
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1519893 in unity8 (Ubuntu) "Apps header is lost after changing filters" [High,In progress]
<dobey> i'm confused
<taiebot> pmcgowan has also a bug reported about unity8 kind of rotating or stretching on the phone? I have experienced this twice today. I have not been able to reproduce
<dobey> oh
<dobey> the section title
<dobey> that's probably a unity8 bug
<dobey> oh it is
<dobey> whenever anyone mentions that bug, i always think the header text is missing for some reason
<pmcgowan> yeah albert fixed it
<taiebot> dobey there should be a glossary somewhere
<pmcgowan> taiebot, sounds familiar, which device
<taiebot> pmcgowan nexus 4
<pmcgowan> if I recall its somehow related to the lifecylce management kicking in
<taiebot> pmcgowan I suppose there is a bug report for it. Thanks.
<pmcgowan> I think there was
<taiebot> pmcgowan there was? it s the first time i saw this behaviour and i have been testing "using" this phone extensively what i saw this morning is this http://i.imgur.com/PFhO5XI.png doing almost a 60degree rotation and after stretching halfway across the screen and come back to original position
<pmcgowan> taiebot, is that the right image?
<taiebot> pmcgowan did not have time to take a screenshot
<pmcgowan> ah
<pmcgowan> I have seen when reselecting an app from the spread that it initially paints wrong, maybe what you saw is different
<Timmey> Is it possible to change the mouse pointer speed?
<Nether> hello
#ubuntu-touch 2015-12-01
<zeko> hello is it possible to install ubuntu touch on any prestigio? I own prestigio multiphone 5503 DUO. I gues that now, because I can't see it at list of compatible devices... but still wanted to ask
<zeko> guess*
<zeko> not*
<nhaines> zeko: if it's not listed there, then we don't know about it.
<nhaines> That doesn't mean that it can't be ported, but that's a bit of work.  :)
<zeko> hmm I'm not going to test it out now because it's 3am in my country. But surly would in future. What would you recommend instead of android if it would be to hard to rich ubuntu touch at my phone? archidroid? I still remember nokia N900 with maemo5 it was great to have linux at phone. (yeah I know that even android is linux, but you know it's not the same)
<zeko> reach*
<nhaines> I don't recommend anything but Android or Ubuntu on phones, to be honest.  :)
<nhaines> Your best bet is to buy a retail Ubuntu phone, if you're not a developer.
<zeko> I'm 1st year Computer Science student at an university so maybe an day I'd became.
<nhaines> It's always worth a try!  Once you have some hardware experience, it's easier to understand how everything comes together.
<balkin> can i instal ubuntu touch on oneplus one device?
<Timmey> Good morning :) Is it possible to increase the mouse pointer speed?
<dholbach> good morning
<nhaines> dholbach: good morning!  :)
<dholbach> hi nhaines
<nhaines> dholbach: are you going to make it to Ubucon at SCALE?  :)
<dholbach> yes, very likely :)
<nhaines> \o/
<svij> dholbach: yay ;)
<mcphail> Is there a way to make a video screencapture on an Ubuntu device?
<svij> mcphail: yes, mirscreencast
<mcphail> svij: thanks!
<OerHeks> mcphail, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/ScreenRecording "in theory itâs possible to record a video of your phoneâs screen. In practice, though, it doesnât work for video; the phone is that busy (a) grabbing frames and (b) writing them to the phoneâs storage that you canât actually use it"  but streaming it to your pc works
 * svij only used mirscreencast to stream to his pc during conference talks
<mcphail> OerHeks: yep - trying the latter
<JamesTait> Good morning all! Happy Giving Tuesday, and happy Bifocals at the Monitor Liberation Day! ð
<Sleep_Walker> really, Bifocals at the Monitor Liberation Day, I wouldn't believe it :)
<alexforsale> is android surfaceflinger needed in ubuntu touch?
<alexforsale> in my logcat i got several "I/ServiceManager( 2606): Waiting for service SurfaceFlinger..."
<sturmflut> alexforsale: Ubuntu uses Mir, shouldn't need SurfaceFlinger anymore I think
<sturmflut2> I'm reading through the Ubuntu Touch porting guide. Is it up to date, do we still rely on Android 4.4.2?
<robin-hero> Hey all! Is there any info about OTA-8.5 (hotfix release)?
<sturmflut2> robin-hero: https://launchpad.net/canonical-devices-system-image/ still only lists ww46-2015 and ww02-2016, so only OTA-8 and OTA-9
<lotuspsychje> there might be plans for ota 8.5
<lotuspsychje> ive read it on softpedia
<davmor2> robin-hero: no
<robin-hero> sturmflut2, davmor2 : I've also read about it in sil2100's landing emails
<sil2100> No definite info yet, we'll know after today's meeting in the afternoon/evening
<sil2100> So far I think not all fixes we planned on releasing are ready
<mcphail> What's in the hotfix?
<mcphail> (if it happens)
<davmor2> mcphail: nothing if all the landings don't happen
<mcphail> I'm on rc-proposed as OTA8 was killing my battery, but keen to get back on stable asap...
<alexforsale> https://github.com/alexforsale/ubtouch-dmesg/ all my dmesgs and logcats are here
<alexforsale> can't get graphic :(
<alexforsale> i can only get adb on saucy, no luck on vivid or xenial
<alexforsale> porting ubuntu is hard
<robin-hero> mcphail, I'm also using rc-proposed because of this, so really hope there would be OTA-8.5
<gatobaubau> ogra_, hello :D can you please help me? i can't connect to the phone via ssh
<jgdx> gatobaubau, have you enabled developer mode (System Settings -> About -> Developer mode)?
<gatobaubau> jgdx, yes
<gatobaubau> jdstrand,  ssh phablet@192.168.0.101
<gatobaubau> Permission denied (publickey).
<gatobaubau> jgdx, sshd Dec  1 15:15:14 ubuntu-phablet sshd[10193]: Authentication refused: bad ownership or modes for file /home/phablet/.ssh/authorized_keys
<jgdx> gatobaubau, ls -l .ssh/authorized_keys ?
<gatobaubau> jdstrand, total 4
<gatobaubau> -rw-rw-rw- 1 32011 32011 393 Dec  1 14:36 authorized_keys
<gatobaubau> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ ls -l .ssh/authorized_keys
<gatobaubau> -rw-rw-rw- 1 phablet phablet 393 Dec  1 14:36 .ssh/authorized_keys
<teve> chmod 700 ~/.ssh && chmod 600 ~/.ssh/authorized_keys
<jgdx> ugh
<gatobaubau> why?
<gatobaubau> :(
<gatobaubau> ok
<jgdx> it's readable by all rightn ow
<jgdx> i wouldn't use it either if I was sshd
<gatobaubau> teve, jgdx thanks :>
<gatobaubau> teve, jdstrand same error sh phablet@192.168.0.101
<gatobaubau> Permission denied (publickey).
<gatobaubau> -rw------- 1 phablet phablet 393 Dec  1 14:36 .ssh/authorized_keys
<gatobaubau> Dec  1 15:26:47 ubuntu-phablet unity8: PAM adding faulty module: pam_gnome_keyring.so
<gatobaubau> Dec  1 15:26:47 ubuntu-phablet unity8: PAM unable to dlopen(pam_kwallet.so): /lib/security/pam_kwallet.so: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
<gatobaubau> Dec  1 15:26:47 ubuntu-phablet unity8: PAM adding faulty module: pam_kwallet.so
<gatobaubau> i can't terminal X-(
<jgdx> gatobaubau, (use a pastebin for lines > 2)
<jgdx> gatobaubau, (and I am jgdx, not jdstrâ¦, please mind your  tab completion ;)
<gatobaubau> jgdx, ok, sorry
<jgdx> gatobaubau, you have to see if your key is indeed authorized by the file you just changed ownership on.
<gatobaubau> jgdx, oh.. i have no idea how to do that
<Rikb> cat .ssh/authorized_keys and see if your pubkey is in that list
<jgdx> gatobaubau, I'm pretty sure phablet-shell will do that for you, if you are uncertain.
<gatobaubau> Rikb, jgdx i first tried phablet-shell and it didn't work, then i ssh-keygen and adb push ~/.ssh/id_rsa.pub /home/phablet/.ssh/authorized_keys
<gatobaubau> and yeah.. i can't login
<gatobaubau> never mind. thanks for help
<jgdx> gato_aw, you can't replace authorized_keys with that pubkey, you need to append it (>>)
<jgdx> woops, I need to mind my own tab completion
<gato_aw> no :D
<jgdx> gato_aw, :P sorry
<gato_aw> i changemd my nickname
<jgdx> oh
<jgdx> okay
<jgdx> after you do ssh-keygen, you may need to instruct ssh on the client to use that key. Not sure it automagically do so.
<gato_aw> jgdx, oh, i have no idea how to do that :D
<jgdx> gato_aw, the Internet knows that very well
<gato_aw> jgdx, do i have to modify ~/.ssh/config ?
<gato_aw> oh ok
<jgdx> gato_aw, you could. That would be persistent, but you could also pass -i to ssh I believe.
<jgdx> or -A if you have an agent running, etc etc
<gato_aw> jgdx, i've tried that before  ssh -vvv -i ~/.ssh/id_rsa phablet@192.168.0.101
<gato_aw> doesn't work, thanks for help
<gato_aw> i got to go
<gato_aw> bye all
<dobey> huh
<awe> kyleN, who would be the appropriate person to ping rE: the Videos scope problem I mentioned during out standup?
<kyleN> awe, It was not written by the "hanloon" team. Who is the maintainer?
<awe> I dunno... it's not listed in the UI
<awe> ;)-
<kyleN> awe it does not appear to be installed as a click. hang on
<kyleN> awe source pkg is unity-scope-mediascanner
<kyleN> awe: debian binary pkg is: nity-scope-mediascanner2
<kyleN> well, unity-scope-mediascanner2
<kyleN> awe: bugs here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-scope-mediascanner
<kyleN> actually, that is not the right binary pkg. hang on
<kyleN> correcting the correction: it is the right binary deb. dpkg -L unity-scope-mediascanner2 lists the expected bits for video and music aggs
<awe> thanks kyleN; it looks like that package hasn't changed since Sep, and is included in the stable
<awe> jhodapp, what else could be involved in this?  What does the scope dispatch to again to display the page for the video?
<awe> contenthub?
<jhodapp> awe, I believe so
<awe> I guess I *could* just file a bug against the scope
<jhodapp> awe, I've never looked at the code for this scope before
<awe> well.. as mentioned, I don't see the bug in stable, and there hasn't been an update to the scope since
<awe> so it's probably another component
<awe> or a day 0 bug that's intermittent
<jhodapp> awe, yeah, I'm not seeing it on latest rc-proposed on krillin
<awe> I did yesterday, but it started working OK this morning
<jhodapp> awe, seems like a service thing...you should still file a bug against the scope so that the maintainer double checks this
<awe> will do
<jhodapp> awe, at the very least, we may need some more automated testing around this
<awe> jhodapp, be my guest.  ;D
<jhodapp> awe, :)
<luca__> hi guys, i'm porting ubuntu touch on an android device, though i'm stuck with the installation of the system.img and the ramdisk
<luca__> anyone could help me?
<k1l> is there a daily build.iso for unity8+MIR anywhere available for the desktop? (and is there a channel for that?)
<danielthebague> good evening people having an issue add music to my sd card! getting a libmtp error: Unknown error
<danielthebague> any ideas why?
<OerHeks> k1l, there is a channel #ubuntu-mir > http://launchpad.net/mir https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MirSpec
<k1l> thanks
<ogra_> danielthebague, is you phone screen unlocked when doing that ? it needs to be unlocked to transfer files from/to it
<danielthebague> yes
<danielthebague> unlocked
<ogra_> sounds like a bu you should file then
<ogra_> *bug
<danielthebague> ah ok
<luca__> guys anyone has knowledge about porting? or just installing images on a device?
<sturmflut2> I am having some problems with MTP too lately, krillin OTA-8 and a 15.10 desktop. It sometimes only works after unplugging the USB cable and trying again. Haven't had the time to look into it.
<danielthebague> i had this problem before and i managed to sort it by removing odd characters from music file names
<danielthebague> now it not working at all
<k1l> sturmflut2: any suspicious in the dmesg logs?
<ogra_> sftp://phablet@192.168.2.92/home/phablet ... in Nautilus->"connect to server" (indeed with the right IP) ... works wonders ;)
<danielthebague> ah will try that but i was trying to reorganise music in folders already exsisting on the sd card
<ogra_> well, i have never tried to access the SD this way, but theoretically using the SD path instaed of /home/phablet should work
<onla> Is this the unity 8 irc channel?
<danielthebague> orga:  no permission to access
<danielthebague> ogra_, no permissions to access phone this way
<ogra_> danielthebague, hmm, that indeed onyl works if you have ssh enabled and your key set up
<danielthebague> ogra_,  didn't know ssh was available for ubuntu phone
<onla> Is the work on unity 8 and convergence a waste of time, if Samsung is coming up with foldable phone next month, LG following soon, and then ppl rapidly update their smartphones to these new foldable 8-10" inch screens which already is enough for running normal desktop unity?
<ogra_> it is preinstalled and disabled by default (and only allows key auth, so you need to copy a valid kay over)
<danielthebague> ogra_,  how do you enable it? or should i just google?
<onla> so most people in 2017 run phones with 10" screens in their pockets
<ogra_> danielthebague, http://askubuntu.com/questions/348714/how-can-i-access-my-ubuntu-phone-over-ssh/599041#599041
<danielthebague> was just looking at that
<danielthebague> :)
<k1l> onla: there is still a difference between using a system with touch or mouse+keyboard. and i dont see "everyone having foldable 10" smartphones" in the near future :)
<danielthebague> i think i will file a bug report on the mtp problem anyway, some time later tonight.
<onla> k1l: hmm oke. but it might be a thing everyone just wants. I hope ubuntu could be installed to such phone asap
<danielthebague> just thought i'd find the solution with a google so not sure if i am the only one with problem or if i have a faulty sd card
<onla> Canonical should aim big and try buy them have ship Ubuntu with their foldables and then ubuntu could even challenge android, as these foldables will be another turning point in the history
<danielthebague> ogra_, do you have the link to file the bug report to for the bq aquarius E4.5
<danielthebague> never filed a bug report before so just having a read up on it
<ogra_> danielthebague, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mtp/+filebug ...
<danielthebague> ogra_, thanks
<Tttttttt> Merhaba
<Tttttttt> Gt-s5360
<Tttttttt> Alo
<Tttttttt> Hello
<Tttttttt> Hi
<Tttttttt> Hello
<Tttttttt> GT-S5360
<lotuspsychje> Tttttttt: please no spamming here
<lotuspsychje> Tttttttt: do you have a reql question?
<k1l> Tttttttt: see the devices list for support for your device. if no one made a port for you see the porting guide
<jgdx> kenvandine, could you test the mock server now? I added a main
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> i happen to be using it now, i'll grab the latest :)
<jgdx> :D
<jgdx> dobey, could you do a quick review of https://code.launchpad.net/~jonas-drange/ubuntu-push/lp1515344/+merge/279149 ?
<jgdx> have debs if ya want to test
<dobey> jgdx: +1, but don't top approve yet
<kenvandine> jgdx, works great!
<jgdx> dobey, thanks!
<jgdx> kenvandine, woo \o/
<kenvandine> i'll give your latest revision a review and mark the MR
<jgdx> danke schÃ¶n
<dobey> jgdx: there's an automatic->trunk going through landing right now
<jgdx> dobey, ah, okay. I'll wait until that's done.
<dobey> so having this merge to automatic now would screw things up i think :)
<dobey> i wonder what's needed to get rid of the automatic branch
<dobey> should bug pedronis about that sometime i guess
<sebsebseb> hi
<jgdx> dobey, he said he had a good idea of what needed to be done, so yeah, lets. Maybe something for ota9+1
<sebsebseb> amazing how some new icons can make such a difference,  just updated to latest version
<sebsebseb> not sure what I think of th new icons quite yet too
<sebsebseb> putting a plymouth like screen on it,  wasa probably a good idea though
<danielthebague> ogra_, seems it only when transferring folders on or re-organising folders SD card that there is a bug seems to work ok now won't have to filethe bug report as i can transfer selected files into newly created folders with the SD card
<danielthebague> ogra_, **within the SD card sorry for my inconvienance
<Guest96086> hello i have a samsung note 3 and have gone through all the major 3 commands on terminal
<Guest96086> my phone is currently on reboot mode but i have no idea what to do next
<Guest96086> i also do not have an sd card
<Guest96086> please help
<lotuspsychje> Guest96086: how is this related to ubuntu touch?
<sebsebseb> Guest96086: if your trying to get Ubuntu Touch on that, well it's not reallty going to work
<sebsebseb> has anyone done that unoffial otg hub thing?
<sturmflut2> sebsebseb: Which unofficial OTG hub thing?
<vendorrh> Hello! I am trying to port ubuntu touch to Samsung Galaxy S 10.5(sm-t805), and after adding everything: vendor, device and cm kernel, when the boot.img is created, I receive the error: boot.img too large
<dobey> sturmflut2: i presume he means the convergence demo stuff on mako
<vendorrh> I need extra 3kb in the BoarderConfig.mk
<dobey> vendorrh: you might need to disable some stuff to get a smaller kernel or such. or the device might require repartitioning to be able to use ubuntu on it
<vendorrh> I don't know how to do this
<vendorrh> how can I remove something from the boot.img
<dobey> i don't know how to do it for that device; but changing the linux kernel config to disable currently enabled things which aren't actually needed/useful on the device, and then rebuilding the kernel, should give you a smaller kernel
<vendorrh> I searched all arround
<vendorrh> and I extracted my boot.img and the one from manta example
<dobey> for upstream generic linux, it can be done with "make menuconfig" for example. but sometimes device vendors make changes such that menuconfig and the like no longer are usable
<vendorrh> and are the same
<dobey> the device is not the same
<dobey> you can ask samsung or maybe on xda devs about how to repartition your device, so that you can use the slightly larger boot.img
<vendorrh> k..bat how can I disable stuff?
<dobey> like i said, change the kernel config, and recompile it
<dobey> just make sure you only disable things that are not at all relevant to your device
<vendorrh> I added the kernel in phablet\kernel\samsung\chagalllte\ is this the correct understanding? because in the documentation this part is not so good documented
<dobey> i don't know
<dobey> probably it is correct if that is the device name
<vendorrh> yes the device name is correct bat the location for the kernel is oky like this?
<dobey> that is just the source tree location, iiuc, so should be fine yes
<vendorrh> oky..there are some steps in the documentation which are hard to follow
<vendorrh> I had to do assumptions
<vendorrh> and I am new to this stuff..I am not familiar with ubuntu..I am just a embedded programmer...
<vendorrh> an*
<vendorrh> Should I try an different kernel?
<vendorrh> maybe this will fix the problem?
<dobey> no, there is only one kernel that will work for your device
<dobey> have you never compiled a linux kernel before?
<vendorrh> nop..this time was the first time
<vendorrh> I found differents git repositories
<vendorrh> for the kernel, device and vendor
<vendorrh> all are from the same user
<vendorrh> I how now different kernels
<vendorrh> which I can try :D
<vendorrh> Am I wrong?
<sebsebseb> sturmflut2: a way to get mouse and keyboard working
<dobey> vendorrh: there should only be one kernel tree for the device. like i said, you need to change the kernel config, not the whole kernel, to disable some unnecessary components (if possible). search for how to change the kernel config for your device, or ask on xda developers forum i guess
<vendorrh> Oky thenks :D
<sturmflut2> sebsebseb: Ah, that has been working for a long time I think. You can also attach USB storage devices using an OTG adapter etc.
<sebsebseb> sturmflut2: yep now I got one to
<sebsebseb> sturmflut2: so want to get that thing working :)
<sturmflut2> sebsebseb: I just plugged the OTG adapter into my Aquaris E4.5 with OTA-8, attached an USB hub, attached a mouse to the hub and the phone switched into windowed mode. Seems to work then.
<sebsebseb> sturmflut2: oh, but youtube video says to get the open store
<sebsebseb> and then an app for it
<sebsebseb> maybe I should try without open store and app
<sturmflut2> But there is currently no Ubuntu phone which can do USB and MHL at the same time, so convergence can only be used with Bluetooth devices
<sebsebseb> I got the latest updates
<sebsebseb> what's MHL?
<sebsebseb> sturmflut2: I bought a OTG Hub (and then some other thngs with it to), the other day, since I wanted to try the OTG thing out :) and yep my parcel came today
<sebsebseb> next working day develiery, paid on Sunday, so that was quick d
<sebsebseb> :d
<sturmflut2> sebsebseb: One of the standards used to attach external displays to a mobile device. It re-uses and blocks the USB port, so you can't have an external display and USB devices at the same time
<sebsebseb> sturmflut2: yeah popey said that the screen woudn't work,  but the Meizu MX4 has a nice sized screen anyway :)
<sebsebseb> ,but mouse and keyboard should work
<sturmflut2> Haven't tried the MX4 in a while, mine has a very wonky USB chip
<sebsebseb> a wonky usb chip how so?
<sebsebseb> it's a nice phone, except for how it looks like an iphone hmm
<sebsebseb> ,but I was meant to get gold colour to, but they sent silver
<sebsebseb> silver one really looks  like an iphone
<sturmflut2> It does LTE, which is nice, but doesn't have an SD card and I think quite a number of people are having problems with the USB port
<sebsebseb> LTE that's the network thing I think?  one of htem
<sebsebseb> 4g lte?
<sebsebseb> we are starting to have more 4g in UK, but not sure about LTE
<sturmflut2> Yeah, LTE is 4G
<sebsebseb> oh LTE is just another name for 4G?
<sebsebseb> sturmflut2: so it may work without the open store intersting
<sebsebseb> I'll have to try
<sturmflut2> Technically "4G" is just another name for "LTE" ;)
<sebsebseb> sturmflut2: reak convergence will be good, but in the mean time this OTG thing will be good :)
<sebsebseb> shame there isn't a decent IRC client by the looks of it in the app store
<sebsebseb> well maybe kiwi IRC, but that's a web app to
<sebsebseb> sturmflut2: unforutnatly I lost my E4.5
<sebsebseb> sturmflut2: so when I got spare cash going to buy a new one and the updated one actsaully
<sebsebseb> been holindg that off for months now
<sebsebseb> don't quite have money for that at the moment
<sturmflut2> I was thinking of building one, but there are a number of challenges. In theory it's easy, just a bit of Qt and QML and you have a basic client, but in reality your mobile data connection will regularly disconnect, so it's not going to be very useful. I've tried to use IRC on Android for a while when I was commuting, and it really wasn't much fun.
<sebsebseb> sturmflut2: well I was thinking IRC over wifi mainly
<sturmflut2> That would work much better, but you can't run in the background on the phone, so the connection would also drop very often and have to be re-established when the app gets focus again
<sebsebseb> sturmflut2: it works the mouse :)
<sebsebseb> sturmflut2: haven't done the open store stuff
<sebsebseb> just plugged the stuff in like you said, and yes the mouse works :)
<sebsebseb> altough it took me to the like log out screen on the phone
<sebsebseb> log in screen hmm
<sebsebseb> what's the log in password hmm
<dobey> you don't know the PIN/passphrase you set to unlock your phone?
<sebsebseb> oh my code ok
<sebsebseb> i'll try that
<tvoss> sturmflut2, even if it was running in the background: the phone suspends for very good reasons :)
<tvoss> sturmflut2, also: what happened to the bouncer idea?
<sebsebseb> my code not working
<sturmflut2> tvoss: I've looked into how to integrate ZNC with the Push Notification Service, after that it was a mixture of a lack of time, travel and other priorities
<tvoss> sturmflut2, ah okay, let me know what you find out
<taiebot> Waouh never saw that there was some work on miracast support \o/ . Has it been announced somewhere https://launchpad.net/miracast-service
#ubuntu-touch 2015-12-02
<mcphail> sturmflut2: If you're keen to get a proper IRC app working, the quassel backend runs on the phone (and can keep running in the background). Just needs someone clever to write/port a frontend
<dholbach> good morning
<sturmflut> dholbach: Good morning!
<pstolowski> popey, hey, do you know who has powers to pull a broken package from ubu store?
<pstolowski> popey, ok, nvm, i'm talking to the respective person
<popey> pstolowski, sorry, was afk
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Wednesday, and happy International Day for the Abolition of Slavery! ð
<mtk300> How do I enable multi touch on a screen/touchscreen running ubuntu?
<davmor2> mtk300: it already is that is how pinch to zoom works
<mtk300> davmor2: Then how do I enable pinch/zoom. I only currently have single touch.
<davmor2> mtk300: what device?
<mtk300> davmor2: It is a development setup. I have a 10 inch screen with the n-trig overlay. The processing comes from a raspberry pi running ubuntu.
<davmor2> mtk300: ah then it might be a driver flaw in that case. The driver on my dell xps 13  is working on X server with pinch to zoom, as are all the mobile devices we support
<davmor2> mtk300: not sure who would be best to help you debug it either sorry
<mtk300> davmor2: Thanks anyway.
<jgdx> jhodapp, hey, is there a media hub dbus api unconfined services can use to play sounds?
<jhodapp> jgdx, what do you mean by unconfined in this instance...what are you trying to do?
<jgdx> jhodapp, I want to play a sound from ubuntu-push using media hub
<jhodapp> jgdx, can't you just use the QtMultimedia Audio component?
<jgdx> jhodapp, sure, but it's go
<jgdx> I'd much rather use dbus
<jhodapp> jgdx, that's not currently supported, only qtubuntu-media directly uses the media-hub client library
<jhodapp> jgdx, the plan is to have a platform-api set of calls to do exactly what you want, but nobody has ever created it
<jgdx> jhodapp, right. Okay, I'll go for qtmultimedia.
<jgdx> jhodapp, thanks!
<jhodapp> jgdx, np, good luck
<tvoss> jgdx, why would push play a sound?
<tvoss> jgdx, that's the job of the notifications, isn't it?
<jgdx> tvoss, push code does not make that distinction currently.
<tvoss> jgdx, hmmm, so I got the impression that you are adding that feature to the push daemon on the phone, wondering why
<jgdx> tvoss, no, the feature is there, but it's broken.
<jgdx> tvoss, are you saying I could use a notification api and have it play sounds?
<tvoss> jgdx, hmmm, do you have a link handy?
<jgdx> tvoss, 2 sec
<tvoss> jgdx, well, push used to be responsible for receiving data and handing out data to helpers, that's it
<tvoss> jgdx, the helpers would then translate to notifications, which can also carry sound hints
<tvoss> Saviq, correct me if I'm wrong please ^
<jgdx> oh man I'd love to rip the sound stuff out, if that's the case.
<jgdx> tvoss, here postal has a concept of a Presenter [1], and one of those is "sound" [2]. [1] http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-push-hackers/ubuntu-push/automatic/view/head:/client/service/postal.go#L172 [2] http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-push-hackers/ubuntu-push/automatic/view/head:/sounds/sounds.go#L45
<Saviq> tvoss, jgdx, notifications can play sounds yes
<Saviq> tvoss, it won't be as simple as that, soon, because with the redesign of notifications we'll need a central place where they get stored (across reboots), re-triggered on demand and a few other things, unity8 needs to become just the renderer for whatever the "post office" tells it to display - on the greeter, as a bubble, in the messaging indicator etc.
<Saviq> and yeah, we need to decide on where all the different bits and pieces live - waking the device up, turning the screen on (with{,out} proximity) etc.
<tvoss> Saviq, sure, that's the post office
<tvoss> the central place
<Saviq> yes
<tvoss> but yes, we need to actually write that stuff down
<Saviq> should likely deal with incoming push, too, no need for a separate thing to deal just with push
<tvoss> Saviq, yup
<tvoss> Saviq, push is just one source
<jgdx> what are the time frames here? Should we not invest in fixing push?
<jgdx> tvoss, ^
<jgdx> kenvandine, what's the story on custom notification sounds?
<tvoss> Saviq, I *thought* that push right now would just assemble a notification and hand it over to the notification service, which happens to be implementedby unity, which then plays the sound
<tvoss> kenvandine, jgdx ^
<kenvandine> popey, is there a trick to get music-app to work on the desktop?  it's not finding any of my music in ~/Music
<kenvandine> or anyone :)
<dobey> kenvandine: do you have mediascanner-2.0 running?
<kenvandine> yup
<dobey> kenvandine: is the db corrupt? :)
<kenvandine> i removed it all
<kenvandine> and started over
<kenvandine> just tells me to import music :/
<dobey> huh. i'd expect it should work as long as nothing is wrong with mediascanner, and it scanned your music
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> how can i confirm mediascanner scanned my music?
<dobey> open the db with sqlite3 and check the contents of the tables i guess?
<dobey> is your hdd light going crazy? :)
<kenvandine> ok... that's it
<kenvandine> no music in the db
<kenvandine> but there are pictures
<popey> kenvandine, is your music dir called ~/Music ? and tail the mediascanner log and see if its running or dying
<popey> (It dies under some circumstances, like if you have webm videos on the machine)
<popey> (that bug may be fixed, others may still be apparent)
<kenvandine> popey, it is ~/Music
<kenvandine> log only lists entries in ~/Pictures
<kenvandine> and the process is running
<kenvandine> popey, i do have webm videos somewhere, but it's not dying
<popey> kenvandine, maybe it just hasn't got to your music yet?
<popey> it's not the fastest daemon
<popey> especially when you have 12 years of photos on your machine
<kenvandine> been a few hours :)
<kenvandine> the tail doesn't look active
<kenvandine> and actually... mediascanner-2.0 was running before i even tried running music-app
<kenvandine> not something i just started, i guess it's been running for a while
<popey> I think it uses some xdirs thing in .config to determine what folders to scan
<kenvandine> i'm running vivid+overlay
<popey> so if it's not scanning music that may be why
<kenvandine> XDG_MUSIC_DIR="$HOME/"
<kenvandine> wtf!
<popey> hahaha
 * popey points and laughs
<popey> bet you deleted your ~/Music at some point in the past
<popey> (I did this too)
<popey> and it did the same to me
<kenvandine> years ago it was a symlink
<kenvandine> but i moved that to a regular directory like in natty...
<kenvandine> this has been broken for a really long time :)
<kenvandine> banshee never complained :)
 * kenvandine ducks
<popey> Mono is evil. Etc.
<davmor2> popey: I disagree Stereo is evil particularly if one speaker breaks
<popey> St                        ereo
<kenvandine> haha
<kenvandine> popey, ok... so that worked
<popey> Sweet!
<kenvandine> not playing the music now, but i assume that's because i don't have media-hub installed :)
<kenvandine> installing media-hub didn't fix that... popey, ideas?
<kenvandine> although i have enough working for my current need, importing ringtones in settings :)
<popey> run it from terminal and see what it's doing?
<kenvandine> i am, nothing output that seems to reflect that it's not playing
<kenvandine> it thinks it's playing, just no sound
<kenvandine> ah ha!
<kenvandine> weird, qmlscene was turned all the way down to 0
<kenvandine> anyway... thanks!
<khomfy> hello
<khomfy> is there any possibility to install spideroack on the bq e5 ubuntuphone?
<khomfy> i tryed to install it from the website and the phone says that there is no application that can handle this type of content
<tedg> What is the channel so that I can get the Xenial builds on my mako?
<dobey> devel-proposed
<dobey> but pretty sure it's not working
<tedg> Cool, so confused with all the channel names :-)
<tedg> Eh, I figured it was "mostly broken," but that's okay for now.
<tedg> Not a daily driver thing.
<dobey> i'm not sure it boots yet :)
<tedg> Hmm, devel-proposed didn't require downloading anything. Seems odd it'd be in my cache.
<dobey> ubuntu-touch/devel-proposed/ubuntu would be the full channel name
<jgdx> dobey, I'm trying to land automatic -> vivid-overlay. It seems I have to cherry pick fixes?
<dobey> jgdx: don't do that
<jgdx> the former or the latter?
<dobey> jgdx: do a dual landing
<dobey> jgdx: either
<dobey> land to trunk with dual landing
<jgdx> Wellark, that's just great!
<jgdx> dobey, well*
<sveppir> hi, I just got an ubuntu phone and want to get my hands dirty on some coding.  First thing is the icelandic keyboard that is unusable.  How do I proceed?  I have joined launchapd, but there is no discussion there.  Sorry if this is not the right venue for this type of question.  I'm still trying to figure out where the famous ubuntu community hangs out
<dobey> sveppir: if there's a problem with the icelandic keyboard, i guess you probably need to file a bug at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-keyboard about the issues
<dobey> well, one or more bugs, depending on how many issues there are :)
<sveppir> cool
<sveppir> it just looks randomly generated
<k1l> thats what icelandic looks as a language to me :)
<sveppir> haha, there is still a need for structure at the base of that randomness
<sveppir> Bug has been filed
<sveppir> I wanted to fix it on my phone
<sveppir> got the ubuntu-sdk, branched the keyboard, changed the layout, but am having troubles building it
<sveppir> latest one is : :-1: error: cannot find -lubuntu_application_api
<mcphail> sveppir: I think Elleo makes the keyboard. He may be able to give you more build instructions?
<sveppir> thanks, I'll ping him
<mcphail> sveppir: looks as if he is afk just now. Always best to ask in European office hours - most people are around then
<sveppir> thanks mcphail, I'll check on him tomorrow then
<a10b87a10feea58e> Is this commit going to get merged? http://askubuntu.com/questions/674179/ubuntu-device-flash-fails-on-nexus-7-2013-android-5-0-2-cant-copy-image-to
<a10b87a10feea58e> Hardware: "rev_e" needs it
<dobey> what commit?
<dobey> afaik, compat with android 5 is being worked on. when that compatibility is fixed so should the ability to flash to a device with android 5 already on it
<a10b87a10feea58e> The one in the answer. From Asus
<dobey> if you want an easy workaround, flash android 4.4 onto the device, and then flash ubuntu onto it
<a10b87a10feea58e> Ubuntu uses the original os?
<dobey> oh, though if the hardware changed, then it might indeed require kernel changes
<a10b87a10feea58e> Anyway older kernels can't boot rev e. You need to change one if statement, then its fine
<a10b87a10feea58e> The version changed to 6 for emmc. I don't know anything about emmc but the Asus commit works in android world, so it should in Ubuntu touch
<dobey> no, the change is from 6 to 7
<a10b87a10feea58e> Yeah.
<dobey> ubuntu is built using the stock android kernel, but i don't know when it was last rebuilt for that device.
<dobey> that change seems weird to me too
<a10b87a10feea58e> Which android kernel?
<a10b87a10feea58e> There's loads
<dobey> not the 5.x kernel
<dobey> as i said, compatibility with android 5 is being worked on, afaik
<dobey> but all our images are based on the android 4.4 trees at the moment
<a10b87a10feea58e> That commit won't go straight to 4.4 branch, so that might be an issue. But if you don't change anything from googles flo kernel I think it should be able to boot 5 kernel with 4.4 device
<a10b87a10feea58e> Do you have a gerrit for touch?
<dobey> there are some small changes to the kernel, to enable apparmor and such
<dobey> i don't know, i don't work on the kernel or supporting new devices
<a10b87a10feea58e> Don't blame you, stay as far away as possible
<a10b87a10feea58e> Hard enough in android land, touch is all new to me
<dobey> anyway, i have to go
<a10b87a10feea58e> Thanks anyway
#ubuntu-touch 2015-12-03
<h6w> You probably get asked this question a million times a day, but I've googled for an hour and can't find an answer.   I can only find a 32-bit version for PC.  Is there a 64-bit version, or should I be installing Ubuntu Desktop and then doing apt-get remove ubuntu-desktop; apt-get install ubuntu-touch ??
<h6w> Or is there some issue that's stopping it from working on a 64-bit machine?
<h6w> No answer, so I've posted it as an askubuntu question.  http://askubuntu.com/questions/705293/ubuntu-desktop-next-has-gone-how-do-i-install-64-bit-ubuntu-touch
<lpotter> can't you get a 64bit image here? http://www.ubuntu.com/download/desktop
<lpotter> or you want to install touch on a pc?
<k1l> he got a intel tablet which is a tablet but with PC hardware build in. and now wants the ubuntu-touch running on that, which afaik doesnt work right now.
<sciango> Hi guys, quick question. When creating an app in the Ubuntu SDK that will use GPS, is it better to use QML documentation standards or are there specifics instructions for Ubuntu Touch. I'm trying to RTFM, but I don't know which manual I should start with. If you could point me in the right direction, that would be great.
<lotuspsychje> lol whatsapp blocks links to telegram...
<k1l> well, didnt MS show how to keep your monopoly? :/
<lotuspsychje> k1l: i dont use whatsapp myself mate, just readin the news :p
<k1l> was no judging on the users of whatsapp. but whatsapp got a monopoly on the messengers now imho and seems they want to keep it.
<lotuspsychje> ah ic
<k1l> unfortunately i need to use whatsapp :/
<lotuspsychje> k1l: the too many relatives connected problem heh?
<lotuspsychje> i cant convince my friends to use telegram neither
<k1l> my sportsteam does all the communication and planing about whatsapp groups.
<lotuspsychje> yeah its a pain k1l
<myweeshift> anybody using touch on  nexus 5?
<lotuspsychje> !devices | myweeshift
<ubot5> myweeshift: You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<myweeshift> thanks lotuspsychje, i saw that.
<myweeshift> was wondering if its stable/functional enough to be on my primary/only device for at least a few days to check it out.
<lotuspsychje> myweeshift: touch should work on n5 but with some issues i think
<myweeshift> are some people using touch as their 'daily driver' on mobile?
<lotuspsychje> myweeshift: sure BQ 4.5 here
<myweeshift> nice
<nhaines> No Bluetooth on the N5.  Otherwise, last time I used it, it worked great.
<nhaines> ogra_: I think I heard you were going to be at Ubucon Summit!  :)
<myweeshift> cool. thanks nhaines.  does the install mess with twrp? or can i hopefully get it loaded and then be able to just use nandroid backups to switch at my leisure?
<nhaines> myweeshift: You'll have to flash it manually then.  I used to use MutiROM Manager, but since I upgraded to Android 6.0 it's not compatible.
<myweeshift> im still on 5.1.1 and plan on staying there awhile.  maybe ill check out MultiROM then.
<myweeshift> nice. that looks pretty straight forward.  thanks!
<myweeshift> looks like an easy workaround for 6.0 as well. http://forum.xda-developers.com/google-nexus-5/orig-development/mod-multirom-v24-t2571011/page311
<dholbach> good morning
<rbasak> "Last full charge 95 hours ago"
<rbasak> This battery just won't die!
<Mozz1> Hi All
<sturmflut> Hm, the "good" news is that the krillin/vegetahd kernels ship the MediaTek FM radio driver, the firmware has to be moved to the right place but when you do it the FM radio part comes up and reports itself correctly. I can power up and tune the chip with a single ioctl()
<sturmflut> The bad news is: no audio up til now, and the kernel crashes pretty much all the time once you want to actually do something useful
<mcphail> sturmflut: that's quite cool, though. Thanks for keeping poking at that kernel
<tvoss> sturmflut, you will likely need upper layers of the stack, too, though.
<tvoss> sturmflut, I will see what I can do to get you some more insight
<davmor2> sturmflut: I am assuming that you have the headset plugged in when you test this right?
<davmor2> sturmflut: I discovered when my fm didn't work on an android phone that it only works with a headset plugged in, it uses the ground as an areal and the audio is routed to the headphone jack, might be the case here too
<beni_> hei is there any developer
<beni_> i need help
<beni_> can anyone help me with my ubuntu sdk trouble
<beni_> ??
<beni_> i need help is anyone online
<ogra_> beni_, SDK people are more likely in #ubuntu-app-devel
<sturmflut> davmor2: The kernel crashe was me misunderstanding a parameter (I passed 10630 when I should have passed 1063 instead), the too large value triggers some strange bug in the MediaTek kernel code which then either crashes the kernel by itself or leads to a watchdog rebooting the device
<davmor2> sturmflut: I was meaning more for getting the audio out
<sturmflut> davmor2: AFAICS the output of the FM chip is connected to a regular input of the sound card, and one of the sound card outputs is connected to the input of the FM chip. Audio output is not always routed to the headphone jack, that just seems to be the default because you have to plug in the headphones (antenna) which automatically switches the audio to the headphones. But the Android radio apps can also usually switch to the
<sturmflut> loudspeaker or even record the FM signal
<davmor2> sturmflut: ah true
<sturmflut> When you run "pactl list" on the Aquaris E4.5 you can see "input-fm" and "output-fm_tx"
<sturmflut> I've had no luck switching to input-fm though. I think I've initialized the FM chip correctly, unmuted it and tuned it to a station, but don't hear anything
<sturmflut> Oh Oh, I have a feeling I know what's going on
<tvoss> sturmflut, any progress? :)
<tvoss> sturmflut, anything you want me to look at?
<sturmflut> tvoss: still fighting with the kernel driver, it doesn't crash anymore at least ;)
<studio_> hi
<studio_> i was reading about ota-9 and new kernels. So ota-9 will be based on 16.04, and what kernel version is used for the ubuntu-touch devices?
<pmcgowan> studio_, ota9 is not on 16.04, we won't move there for some time, certainly not until it releases
<studio_> pmcgowan, is this a false message: http://news.softpedia.com/news/ubuntu-touch-ota-9-receives-new-unity-8-next-gen-bluetooth-support-more-496516.shtml ?
<pmcgowan> studio_, no thats all good
<pmcgowan> we update kernels all the time
<ogra_> not to new versions though :)
<pmcgowan> correct
<studio_> i am confused, i thought after i have seen this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ru6cQMEt52s all ubuntu-touch devices will be based on xenial?
<popey> in the future
<popey> not today
<studio_> so in 2016?
<popey> Yes, we'll likely switch to a new release next year sometime.
<studio_> ok
<ssweeny> Before or after vivid goes EOL in January(?) :)
<popey> But we may not switch to a new kernel.
<studio_> so for the nexus it is possible in the moment to install xenial, but not for the bq devices?
<popey> it may be possible on various devices, but we don't recommend it
<studio_> my device is not a, how to say in english, working / productive device, it is just for learning and playing, so what channel i have to use to try xenial?
<popey> devel-proposed I _think_
<studio_> is it the pure ubuntu-channel without the bq apps?
<popey> i expect so, the bq ones have bq in the name
<studio_> cool :) i'll try that on the weekend ...
<studio_> popey, i've seen on the video, that your nexus 7 (arm-based) is working with xmir, is that correct?
<popey> it was, i reflashed it since
<studio_> why?
<popey> i reflash my devices all the time
<studio_> so now all the "programms" are not working anymore on your device? I mean programms, not apps ...
<popey> well, i reflashed it, so they're not installed
<studio_> popey, what exactly do you mean with "reflashed" ?
<popey> wiped / reinstalled
<studio_> with what?
<popey> different channels for testing different things
<studio_> ah, ok, so you are still using ubuntu-touch?
<popey> yes, of course
<studio_> ;) sorry for that question ...
<studio_> what about this: https://github.com/mbgg/linux-mediatek Did someone here had a success to build a working multi-armv7-kernel for the bq devices?
<ogra_> what for would we do that ?
<ogra_> none of the drivers could work with it
<studio_> ogra_, good question, maybe for an real linux kernel? So why mbgg tried to do that? I think mbgg is working for bq, right?
<ogra_> no idea
<ogra_> having a linux kernel will gain you a headless non-networked server ... thats all
<ogra_> none of the devices will work
<studio_> maybe as an iPod-Touch :)
<ogra_> well, without audio drivers and screen
<studio_> without framebuffer and alsa?
<ogra_> well, you might get a framebuffer console to work ... but no touchscreen and yes, no sound without drivers for the chip
<studio_> why mkt do not build blobs for the latest kernel for the devices?
<ogra_> because nobody pays for that
<ogra_> they build blobs for android
<tvoss> ogra_, more precisely: shipping hw that is making them money
<studio_> who need to pay, bq, meizu or canoncial?
<tvoss> and that hw happens to run android :)
<ogra_> right, what tvoss said
<popey> studio_, same with every single other android device manufacturer. No motivation to port to newer kernels if nobody is paying for the work.
<studio_> so again, who needs to pay, to make blobs for the latest linux kernel, bq, meizu or canoncial?
<ogra_> popey, well, its not abotu 2porting to new device kernels" it is about porting to non-android systems ;)
<popey> well it is both
<ogra_> indeed, one bases on the other
<popey> studio_, someone needs to pay developers
<studio_> both= manufactor and canoncial?
<popey> I think you're missing the bigger picture.
<ogra_> studio_, usually a manufacturer has a contract with the chip manufacturer ... and that includes what SW gets provides to the device manufacturer
<ogra_> *provided
<popey> Once devices get more than a couple of years old, they get near-zero revenue from sales of that device, because everyone has moved on to the next generation
<popey> once sales dry up there's little motivation to support that device
<ogra_> years ?
<popey> if that
 * ogra_ would have said months :) 
<popey> heh
<studio_> so, as i understood correct, there will never be an real supported ubuntu-touch device? all is depending from the chip manufactorer?
<k1l> the one who wants the new kernels will have to pay the developer to do that.  at the moment that is neiter meizu, nor bq nor canonical.
<ogra_> yeah, because neither is interested in running a driver less kernel on old hardware :)
<k1l> there are already 3 real supported ubuntu-touch devices
<ogra_> yeah
<studio_> k1l, also (google) nexus is not supported ...
<ogra_> and more to come
<k1l> dont confuse "read support" with "not using drivers that were made for another system"
<k1l> *real
<k1l> studio_: i only mentioned the once that got sold preinstalled
<studio_> k1l, what 3 years old devices are supported?
<k1l> nexus4
<studio_> uname -a ?
<popey> are we going to have this lengthy conversation again?
<popey> Or shall we just stop it now?
<k1l> studio_: why are you hunting about the kernel versions?
<studio_> because i am talking about "support"
<k1l> studio_: i think you got explained lenghtly that your wish to have the latest kernels is not comming true until you pay developers to do the work
<k1l> studio_: no
<k1l> there is suport.
<ogra_> studio_, what is support in your view ?
<studio_> latest kernel, latest bug-fixes
<ogra_> (security and bug fixes at a regular base ... no regressions ... )
<ogra_> latest kernel will bring in new bugs and regressions
<studio_> k1l, what is the release number, including patch version from your kernel on your google device?
<ogra_> (and cause additiojnal costs since all drivers need to be ported)
<popey> studio_, the same version as the last time you asked.
<studio_> popey, i never asked k1l about that!
<ogra_> and you think he runs another kernel than the rest of the world ?
<popey> If k1l is running Ubuntu then it's the same version as the rest of us.
<studio_> popey, i thought an mx4?
<studio_> popey, i thought you got an mx4?
<popey> i have multiple devices
<studio_> so?
<popey> so?
<studio_> uname -a
<popey> Linux ubuntu-phablet 3.4.0-7-mako #1-Ubuntu SMP PREEMPT Thu Sep 3 15:30:20 UTC 2015 armv7l armv7l armv7l GNU/Linux
<popey> thats my nexus 4
<popey> which is currently powered on and attached to my pc
<popey> Linux ubuntu-phablet 3.4.67 #1 SMP PREEMPT Wed Oct 28 09:14:30 UTC 2015 869191d armv7l armv7l armv7l GNU/Linux
<popey> that's my bq
<popey> my mx4 is broken at the moment
<popey> but I know that's 3.10.something
<mcphail> popey: did yo break it with a new kernel? ;p
<popey> Now listen.
<studio_> 3.4 - what is the latest patch? .110?
<popey> I broke it with my bum, sitting on it.
<popey> no idea studio_
<studio_> kernel.org
<mcphail> popey: it might not have broken if your kernel had been fully patched
<tvoss> rofl
<popey> Get back in your box.
<studio_> that is, what i do not understand. my desktop version always get the latest kernel patch, but my ubutu-phone not.
 * mcphail is interrupting an evening of Nordic Noir with Saga Noren for this entertainment...
 * popey googles those
<lotuspsychje> mcphail: any news on your battery drain?
<mcphail> lotuspsychje: no problems since moving to rc-proposed, but my suspicion is it was dekko notifications which caused it. I'm going to reenable those to test
<lotuspsychje> mcphail: ah cool
<k1l> studio_: its 3.4.0-7-mako
<studio_> another question is, why is the kernel in the ubuntu-touch device a monolithic kernel?
<dobey> oh ffs
<tvoss> it can only go south from now on
<dobey> all linux kernels are monolithic kernels
<k1l> studio_: and again: i think you still dont understand that a new kernel will magically solve everything.
<tvoss> studio_, by design and on purpose since version 0.0.1
<tvoss> studio_, you might want to read up the lengthy mal thread between tanenbaum and torvalds on the topic
<k1l> studio_: and your PC comparison doenst work, because you dont have the same driver situation like on the PC. which was explained to you 100 times already?
<dobey> if you want a different kernel, try HURD maybe
<tvoss> dobey, yeah, that would be awesome :)
<studio_> dobey, my,on my desktop, is modular ...
<tvoss> studio_, it's not
<dobey> no, it is monolithic
<lotuspsychje> labyrinth night again..
<studio_> itis not? so why i can losd modules?
<dobey> lotuspsychje: if only i could balance a glass sphere as well as david bowie
<studio_> it is not? so why i can load modules?
<tvoss> no need to repeat your question ;)
<dobey> because you don't understand what "monolithic kernel" means
<dobey> why are you back here trolling again anyway? so you can be banned again?
<mcphail> studio_: running HURD on your phone will give the same experience as running HURD on your desktop, if that's what you want?: nothing will work on either!
<k1l> dobey: ubuntu people are to friendly :(
<studio_> dobey, "monolithic kernel" means, no otion to load modules, all needed modules are compiled direct into the kernel.
<mcphail> studio_: no, lovey, it doesn't
<ogra_> stno such thing on a phone
<dobey> k1l: i know right
<tvoss> studio_, you might want to start digging here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanenbaum%E2%80%93Torvalds_debate
 * mcphail is getting a bit bored of this and his mind is beginning to wander back towards Scandanavians in leather trousers
<lotuspsychje> lol
<tvoss> studio_, the original thread on comp.os.minix is *highly* recommended
 * tvoss is a little scared now
<dobey> ios might be microkernel though? not sure really
<dobey> but linux is definitely a monolithic kernel
<tvoss> dobey, well, that depends how you classify a mach kernel ... admittedly, it *used* to be called a microkernel
<popey> I am pretty sure that's the first time in the near 3 years of this channel existing that anyone has been called "lovey" here.
<popey> Well done mcphail
<tvoss> it's getting cozy I guess
 * ogra_ grins
<mcphail> popey: I have a "thing" for studio_
<k1l> iOS is at best a "hybridkernel" but still based on monol.
<popey> Clearly.
<mcphail> But I'm afraid my love for Saga wins out. See you all in an hour, if studio_ hasn't been banned by then
<dobey> https://i.imgur.com/6bZMF.png
<tvoss> if only irc had inline link preview ;)
<dobey> now i want popcorn
<dobey> tvoss: it does if you write a client that provides that ;)
<tvoss> dobey, obviously ;) my vanilla xchat does not, though. probably should jump over to their irc channel and paste links to stickers requesting the feature
<popey> Time to switch to MS Comic Chat.
<dobey> or just write an irc client in the sdk that works on the phone, and make everyone happy
<tvoss> dobey, fair, and a bouncer that talks to our push infrastructure
<tvoss> or better: adjust a bouncer
<tvoss> popey, admittedly, the idea is quite cool :)
<studio_> maybe it is a beginner question, but where is the differen between a monolithic and an modular kernel? i allways thought android is using an monolithic kernel?
<dobey> android uses linux, so yes it's using a monolithic kernel
<tvoss> studio_, https://www.google.de/?gfe_rd=cr&ei=8qZgVvedKOaI8Qef6Yu4Bw&gws_rd=ssl#safe=off&q=monolithic+vs+microkernel
<dobey> can compile part of the features as loadable modules !+ "modular"
<studio_> so a monolithic kernel can be a modular? sorry i am now confused ...
<dobey> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monolithic_kernel#Loadable_modules
<tvoss> studio_, think about it like this: monolithic kernel = one giant process running your kernel, microkernel = multiple processes taking over kernel tasks
<dobey> since apparently you don't know how to sue a search engine yourself
<studio_> dobey, i have seen that, but i do not understand the different to an modular kernel :(
<dobey> can load modules != modular kernel
<studio_> but monolithic also can load modules
<dobey> anyway, loadable modules on a phone are pointless
<dobey> it's a waste of storage space for no meaningful benefit
<ogra_> well
<ogra_> lots of phones have modules in use
<studio_> dobey, i tried it with nfs, but no succsess
<k1l> studio_: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monolithischer_Kernel
<studio_> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monolithic_kernel
<dobey> if you really want to build all the bits as modules, feel free to recompile your own kernel, break your phone, and not ask for random other people to help fix it when you do
<tvoss> dobey, hah, the joys of freedom :)
<dobey> tvoss: unfortunately, some people don't understand freedom, but think they are entitled to certain things
<studio_> dobey, you can't brake the phone by uplading a kernel and its modules. you need to destroy u-boot.
<k1l> freedom means i dont have to pay others to do my work, right? :)
<tvoss> k1l, of course, and *your* feature request is the center of the universe
<tvoss> ;)
<k1l> check
<tvoss> dobey, yup, I meant to hint at that
<ogra_> feature demand !
<ogra_> pfft ... request :P
<dobey> a hammer works well too
<dobey> or guns. we really like to shoot things over here
 * dobey would really like for this new qt to be unblocked already
<k1l> will the n4 stay the dev phone for the next time?
<k1l> looking at getting a mhl adapter thingy for the "total convergence" :)
<ogra_> given it is the only device that can use external displays ...
<dobey> and that we don't support the nexus5
<dobey> :(
<studio_> ogra_, why? isnt the mx4 supporting mhl?
<ogra_> nope
<studio_> since when?
<ogra_> since forever ?
<popey> nexus 7 also supports it, so one of two devices
<studio_> the specs told mhl is supported?
<k1l> mine n4 had a broken mainboard (from been drowned in a lake, i suppose). but i got a old n4 with a broken screen from a friend and combined them to a working one again :)
<ogra_> frankenphone :)
 * ogra_ has an old n4 like that here too
<sturmflut> studio_: No, some external websites said that. Meizu hasn't had MHL since the original MX I think
<k1l> as long as it worksâ¢
<k1l> maybe the typical rumors pre-release?
<ogra_> yeah
<dobey> at least it should theoretically be possible to get bt working on n5 now
<dobey> since we have bluez5
<studio_> hmm ... http://www.siliconimage.com/Company/News_and_Events/Press_Releases/2014_02_23_-_Silicon_Image_Announces_New_MHL%C2%AE_Smartphone_Reference_Designs_with_MediaTek/
<studio_> i thought that MT6595 can handle mhl ...?
<ogra_> if it is wired up internally and the driver supports it ...
<dobey> chip != phone
<dobey> just like how my i7 cpu can display 4k at 60hz just fine, but the drivers in linux don't do it right
<ogra_> well
<k1l> studio_: the chip can handle it. but what if there is no connector from the chip to the mainboard?
<ogra_> except that your i7 isnt a custom made SoC that was only created for this PC
<dobey> it could be :)
<ogra_> and just happens to use the intel core
<dobey> that soc isn't the whole phone though, just like my intel cpu isn't my whole pc
<sturmflut> k1l, studio_ : The MediaTek chip cannot handle it, we've had this discussion on the ML months ago: https://lists.launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone/msg15154.html
<k1l> sturmflut: oh come on, dont come with facts :)
<k1l> studio_: read that mailinglist post
<sturmflut> To my knowledge there isn't a single MediaTek SoC that has MHL support on chip
<dobey> and no matter which intel chip i shove in this motherboard, 4k@60hz still won't work correctly in linux, because the drivers don't/won't do it correctly
<ogra_> dobey, well, the SoC is 60% of the phone ... compared to your PC it is the CPU, RAM and half your PCI cards :)
<sturmflut> They all require external bridges
<dobey> ogra_: the cpu is pretty much 60% of my PC :)
<ogra_> heh
<sturmflut> Bah, giving up on FM radio for today.
<ogra_> once you are done they shut down the stations
<dobey> well i could compare an Atom instead, which is even more so a SoC design
<ogra_> :)
<dobey> and we all know how the GMA500 turned out
<dobey> aka poulsbo
<ogra_> as good as the SGX :P
<ogra_> given they are the same after all :)
<sturmflut> ogra_: I find it funny that no digital terrestrial broadcast standard has had any success in Germany, yet they want to shut down FM all the time
<ogra_> yeah
<sturmflut> Also we could transmit data between two Ubuntu phones via short-range FM if this works out
<sturmflut> At several kilobits per second
<ogra_> thats indeed true and would be a cool thing
<ogra_> enough to transfer a vcard or a calendar entry ;)
<dobey> you should implement http://bu.mp for ubuntu
<sturmflut> FM is the new NFC ;)
<dobey> another thing that got bought and murdered
<ogra_> didnt smasung do a ripoff ?
<ogra_> *samsung
<dobey> no idea
<dobey> but it was one of the big things of webos, right before HP gave it the axe too
<pmcgowan> did someone says poulsbo
<pmcgowan> makes me sweat still
<ogra_> haha
 * k1l still got a hp touchpad :)
<sturmflut> Well, enough FM and off to celebrating my new membership status
<popey> Hm, anyone know how to get ubuntu-emulator to pass "-no-window" down the stack to qemu?
<popey> seems ubuntu-emulator builds a set of parameters which it gives to the real emulator in /usr/share/android/emulator/out/host/linux-x86/bin/emulator-x86
<taiebot> Hi is it kown that shorts do not work anymore on rc-proposed?
<popey> taiebot, works here
<taiebot> popey Yeah it restarted working just realised i had the message like some channels could not get updated for like two days.
<taiebot> popey  could it be engadget new website?
<popey> taiebot, dunno, i dont have that on my list, can you check the log in ~/.cache/upstart ?
<popey> it typically logs quite nicely
<taiebot> popey i am still getting some errors occurred during the update
<taiebot> popey http://paste.ubuntu.com/13653105/
<popey> thats not the official shorts app
<popey> that's a preview / beta
<taiebot> popey: is it ?
<popey> yup
#ubuntu-touch 2015-12-04
<TheHorribleBear_> anybody has long-time experience with ubuntu touch? I don't like android. I never liked it. The only mobile OS I hate more is iOS. So I want to try Ubuntu Touch (firefox os is dead i think). whats about the bootloader? am I able to install another os too if I want? do i have root? when i program an terminal application for debian, does it run on ubuntu touch then?
<k1l_> bootloader depends on device, but that should be open since they are android devices basically.
<k1l_> so if there is another OS that was build for that device it should be able to be installed.
<k1l_> there are some bq android users who installed ubuntu-touch and vice versa.
<k1l_> you have "root"
<k1l_> ubuntu-touch works with click packages. you can make its system parition rw and use apt-get but that is more a plan b than the ubuntu-touch  smartphone way
<k1l_> TheHorribleBear_: since you got a .at ip take a look at ubuntuusers.de there are some articles in the wiki and some users with phones in the forums.
<TheHorribleBear_> k1l_: yeah but android smartphones normally have a closed bootloader. and whats about updates? is it like on android where you don't get updates if you have a mediatek cpu for instance?
<TheHorribleBear_> ok i will look. thanks
<k1l_> they just shipped OTA update 8 for all ubuntu devices. and OTA9 is scheduled for january iirc
<TheHorribleBear_> k1l_: ok thank you
<TheHorribleBear_> looks like ubuntu touch is a nice and "open" OS
<k1l_> its really open source
<TheHorribleBear_> k1l_: yeah I know. I also like the root rights on ubuntu touch. thats one of the things i hate on android. it feels like a jail
<RMJ> Hi there, anyone know if you can reduce the mic volume? My wife has complained I'm very loud on a call!
<zzarr> hello, do the proposed channel have support for bluetooth?
<zzarr> I read that OTA-9 will have, but it is released 2016-01-22 (yyyy-mm-dd)
<JanC> zzarr: what do you mean with "support for bluetooth"?
<seb128> zzarr, hey, what do you mean "support for bluetooth"? there is bluetooth support for a long time
<JanC> LOL
<seb128> ota9 is going to have bluez5 and some improvements though
<zzarr> QtBluetooth
<RMJ> Bluetooth does work atm but yes it is a bit flaky
<zzarr> I can't load the bluetooth module with "QT += bluetooth" (it works for other platforms like desktop)
<RMJ> Anyone know how to reduce the mic volume?
<dholbach> good morning
<zzarr> good morning
<zzarr> will OTA-9 use Qt 5.5.1?
<zzarr> RMJ, I get this error when I try to use bluetooth "Project ERROR: Unknown module(s) in QT: bluetooth" (when I write "QT += bluetooth" in the .pro file)
<RMJ> I'm using N4, how are you starting bluetooth to see this error?
<zzarr> I tried to install "qtconnectivity5-dev" in the kit, but it have unmet dependencies
<zzarr> ("qtbase5-dev")
<RMJ> The bluetooth sometimes only works after a reboot for me and it does not connect to every BT device I have
<RMJ> oh ok, I'm not that advanced, I'm just using OTA8 as stock
<zzarr> hmm... I think we are talking past each other
<RMJ> It works with a Logitech M557 BT mouse which starts desktop mode
<zzarr> I'm talking about developing  an app using bluetooth, it works on my phone
<RMJ> sry
<zzarr> no problem, thanks for trying to help me :)
<RMJ> np
<RMJ> as ppl have said the next update should be a big improvement for bluetooth on the devices
<zzarr> yes :)
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Friday, and happy World Wildlife Conservation Day! ð
<robin-hero> hey all, I've just read it in the Landing mail there's a new Camera app in the yesterday's image, but this update hasn't arrived for me yet.
<robin-hero> Hey sil2100, I have a question. I there will be an OTA-8.5 update, it will be include all changes which are fix released in ww02-16 buglist or it will be only include the ww50-15 buglist? I hope you are understand me :)
<sil2100> robin-hero: hello! ww50-2015 is the milestone for the OTA-8.5 hotfix release, so not really too many changes but high-importance ones
<sil2100> The list is not complete yet though
<sil2100> So there might be more/less bugs in it when the final release happens
<robin-hero> So wee need to wait the OTA-9 for the "custom ringtone" feature, right?
<mmmcandy> robin-hero, or change to rc-proposed channel
<sil2100> robin-hero: yeah :)
<sil2100> Well, officially we do not recommend the rc-proposed channel end-user phones
<sil2100> Use at your own risk, we had already a few cases where some images didn't boot for various reasons
<robin-hero> mmmcandy, sil2100 I've already use the rc-proposed channel :)
<robin-hero> sil2100, Thanks
<bad> ASSERT: "!isEmpty()" in file /usr/ubuntu-sdk-dev/include/QtCore/qlist.h, line 292
<bad> what can i do against this mistake?
<Guest71231> can anyone help me w?
<Guest71231> ASSERT: "!isEmpty()" in file /usr/ubuntu-sdk-dev/include/QtCore/qlist.h, line 292
<Guest71231> i get this error
<Guest71231> what can i do?
<Guest71231> is there any developer online?
<ogra_> Guest71231, try #ubuntu-app-devel
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/ubuntu-touch-ota-8-5-hotfix-should-arrive-for-all-ubuntu-phone-users-soon-497110.shtml
<jibel> sil2100, ^ it's your fault again :)
<ogra_> we should just switch to 3 week release cycles :P
<sil2100> I... uhh...
 * sil2100 runs away to hide (and have lunch)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/first-night-clock-app-released-for-ubuntu-phones-available-now-for-free-497115.shtml
<lotuspsychje> nice1
<sergiusens> ogra_, are you aware of any bug open for rc-proposed where any app wanting to use location (through network-manager) gets appamor blocked
<sergiusens> ?
<ogra_> sergiusens, nope, i guess tvoss would know though
<sergiusens> maybe jibel ?
<sergiusens> ogra_, how do I go backwards using system-image-cli ?
<ogra_> i dont thik thats possible
<ogra_> you could go to stable
<ogra_> that would go backwards
<ogra_> with --switch
<jibel> sergiusens, I am not aware of such bugs.
<jibel> davmor2, ^ do you know?
<davmor2> nope
<jibel> sergiusens, you get apparmor denials in syslog?
<sergiusens> jibel, davmor2 I updated this morning and now osmtouch, activitytracker and others have a denial on "send" to network manager
<sergiusens> oh, clock also fails
<abeato> Laney, we would like to sync gstreamer in the overlay (1.6), would it be possible to upload designated packages to silo 41?
<davmor2> sergiusens: nothing has changed with network manager or location service till the dbus fix lands and is put into an image
<sergiusens> davmor2, meh; maybe a reboot helps; do you know how to go to revision -1 from system-image-cli? or if not, which one is the stable channel for arale?
<dobey> sergiusens, ogra_: you can also specify a revison to system-image-cli i think
<dobey> sergiusens: -b $NUMBER (but can't do relative numbers i don't think)
<ogra_> hmm, i think you need -b0 then to reset the base and get a full reinstall
<dobey> so if you're on 8, you could do -b 7
<davmor2> sergiusens: just done fresh flashes of latest on arale and krillin and both open clock and correctly ask for location and get one
<sergiusens> dobey, yeah, but I can't do full flash with -b unless it is 0 :-/
<davmor2> sergiusens: yes thanks :)
<Laney> abeato: ok which packages?
<sergiusens> davmor2, right, I'm on a running system for like over 6 months
<sergiusens> davmor2, feels like I'm on Windows and the format days are back :-P
<abeato> Laney, gstreamer1.0, plugins-base, good, bad
<dobey> sergiusens: you mean just use the full size image, rather than reverse applying the xdelta?
<Laney> ugly?
<Laney> you have amr no?
<davmor2> sergiusens: you always have windows or you live in a cave
<abeato> Laney, you are right, for amr
<sergiusens> davmor2, I'm an overgrown hobbit!
<Laney> ok
<Laney> I forgot what the rules are for versioning
<Laney> sil2100: remind me what the right convention for overlay backport versioning is please?
<davmor2> sergiusens: they had windows too :p  might just be a rogue config or something, do you have anything installed from the archive that could affect the system?
<sergiusens> davmor2, so in any case, what is the stable channel for arale? the docs say to use ubuntu-touch/stable/ubuntu
<sergiusens> but that feels outdated
<sil2100> Laney: hey, we use a very simple and no-brainer one usually - just appending ~overlay1/2/3.. to the end
<Laney> ok
<sergiusens> sil2100, which one is the stable channel for arale?
<sil2100> sergiusens: ubuntu-touch/stable/meizu.en
<sergiusens> sil2100, thanks
<sil2100> yw! ;)
<sergiusens> sil2100, the docs need updating btw ;-)
<sil2100> Oh? Let me check :)
<sergiusens> sil2100, oh, nvm there's a ref here https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/start/ubuntu-for-devices/installing-ubuntu-for-devices/ to the list for actual channels
<sergiusens> I wish the code snippet there used a stub --channel though
<test_pt> hey
<test_pt> anyone here?
<davmor2> test_pt: lots
<test_pt> the linux channel is dead :)
<test_pt> hi folks
<test_pt> do you know if it's possible to get ubuntu touch on a cube u30gt-h (rkt 3066) ?
<test_pt> no takers ?
<test_pt> do you know if it's possible to get ubuntu touch on a cube u30gt-h (rkt 3066) ?
<ogra_> !devices
<ubot5> You can find the full list of devices, official images, community images, and works in progress at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<ogra_> if there is no port on that page you would have to attemp a port yourself
<test_pt> Ogra
<test_pt> you're a lifesaver
<test_pt> thanks mate
<ogra_> i guess it it unlikely thouh ... but good luck
<test_pt> damn
<test_pt> not a line ..
<test_pt> pikunto for rkt 3066 exists
<test_pt> and there's a russian port
<test_pt> but I can't understand jack from it ...
<test_pt> google translate sucks on russian
<test_pt> thanks anyway
<test_pt> gonna keep diggin
<abeato> Laney, one issue with plugins-bad and the overlay is that it asks for gtk-3 >= 1.15, while we have 1.14 in the overlay... I changed the dependency to >= 1.14 and it compiled fine, so don't know if that restriction is completely necessary or not
<Laney> 3.15
<Laney> abeato: I'm going to get to it on Monday
<Laney> but you could git blame to find out why it was changed
<abeato> oh, yeah, 3.15 :)
<abeato> Laney, yes, I'll take a look
<sergiusens> davmor2, ogra_ fwiw,  a reboot solved my wonky dbus issue
<ogra_> oh
<ogra_> windows touch :P
<mcphail> Has OTA 8.5 been confirmed?
<davmor2> mcphail: no
<davmor2> mcphail: I'm sure sil2100 will announce it when it is
<sil2100> We're still working on things that need to be done before the date will be known
<mcphail> sil2100: but there is a commitment to have a release before the expected date of OTA9?
<sil2100> mcphail: yes, the whole idea of OTA-8.5 is to release a few important fixes before the end-of-year holidays
<sil2100> Possibly soon
<mcphail> sil2100: davmor2: great. Cheers!
<jarlath> Anyone care to confirm this easy one for me? https://bugs.launchpad.net/dekko/+bug/1522984
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1522984 in Dekko "All downloaded attachments prefixed with long string" [Undecided,New]
<ahayzen> jarlath, yup, i had this earlier today :-)
 * hussi slaps mwenning around a bit with a large fishbot
<mwenning> hussi, what'd I do?
<hussi> i want to install android studio on ubuntu?
<hussi> How to install it?
<hussi> Can you help me?
<mwenning> https://www.linux.com/community/blogs/132-mobile/779326-mobile-development-how-to-install-android-studio-on-ubuntu-version-1404
<hussi> Ok thank you...
<kostkon> hussi, also consider:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-make
 * mwenning has no idea why he has been selected as an android studio expert
<dobey> or why that's asked in this channel
#ubuntu-touch 2015-12-05
<jarlath> ahayzen: thank you!
<scientes> the install doesn't seem to work when firefoxos is installed
<scientes> 2015/12/04 20:24:58 mkdir /root/.cache: permission denied
<scientes> why can't the install be as straight-forward as the firefoxos or flash to stock install--or at least use a script i can read rather than a compiled binary
<scientes> i'm on nexus 4
<maxvanceffer> hi there
<maxvanceffer> I have a problem with click package deployment
<maxvanceffer> i have qmake app
<maxvanceffer> splitted to shared lib and app
<maxvanceffer> click package put lib to /usr/lib/arm-*/qt5
<maxvanceffer> but my app dont's see it
<maxvanceffer> as i managed, event if my lib located inside click package under this path, on device it installed to different folder
<maxvanceffer> hi all
<maxvanceffer> can some body help me with click packaging problem
<maxvanceffer> ???
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: I can't quite make out your problem. Can you rephrase it?
<maxvanceffer> Yes sure
<maxvanceffer> my project consist from C++ shared library, and C++ app. All make config was auto created by Ubuntu touch template using qmake
<maxvanceffer> and when i build my project for device, click put shared library to /usr/lib/linux-*/qt5/ but in fact on device, when installed shared library is located in other path
<maxvanceffer> and my app can not find it
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: OK, first, I don not understand how click can put a library under /usr. Are you sure about that one?
<maxvanceffer> yeap
<maxvanceffer> i opened it data.tar.gz by ark
<maxvanceffer> and checked
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: do you have a copy of the click package?
<maxvanceffer> yes
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: do you mind sharing it so I can look and see what is going on?
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: all the components of a click package should have relative paths, so to have /usr is odd, to say the least
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: to get a good idea of the directory structure, run "dpkg-deb -R packagname.click ." and it will extract in the current directory
<DanChapman> maxvanceffer, try placing the shared lib in /usr/lib/linux-*/ instead. IIRC LD_LIBRARY_PATH is set as the parent directory of the bin directory
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: When the click is installed on the device, that is unpacked under /opt/click.ubuntu.com/package/version
<maxvanceffer> i think i made some mistake in pro file, for INSTALLS
<maxvanceffer> yeas i know that on device root folders a read only
<maxvanceffer> yeas i know that on device root folders is read only
<maxvanceffer> inside my pro file for shared library i can see this TARGET = $$qtLibraryTarget($$TARGET)
<DanChapman> mcphail, /usr is a valid location *inside* a click package so it will get resolved as /opt/click.ubuntu.com/package/version/usr/blah/blah
<maxvanceffer> but i don't know what this command do
<maxvanceffer> yeah but on the device after install shared library can be found in this path
<maxvanceffer> '/opt/click.ubuntu.com/vuk.maxvanceffer/0.3/usr/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/qt5/qml/Vuk'
<maxvanceffer> so i think click making this (install path ) + (some how standart path for library in linux )
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: I'm not sure it goes under that path with the standard template. It should go under /opt/click.ubuntu.com/vuk.maxvanceffer/0.3/usr/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/ only
<maxvanceffer> bwt
<maxvanceffer> this qml plugin
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: have you changed the template or qmake pro file?
<maxvanceffer> yes littel bit
<maxvanceffer> yes little bit
<mcphail> (actually /opt/click.ubuntu.com/vuk.maxvanceffer/0.3/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/ without the usr
<maxvanceffer> but only by commands which i understand ))))
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: that's your problem! Have a look at the Runtime Environment bit of https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/start/platform/guides/app-confinement/ and see the standard paths. You can set additional Qt import paths if you want
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: but if you stick to the template, it should Just Work(tm)
<maxvanceffer> hmmm
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: if you change the install path, you'll need to adjust QML2_IMPORT_PATH accordingly
<maxvanceffer> yeah... but as i can see from docs QML2_IMPORT_PATH must be adjusted coorrectly
<maxvanceffer> but it not
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: it is correct for a standard template/qmake file though
<maxvanceffer> this what see qml engine /opt/click.ubuntu.com/vuk.maxvanceffer/0.3/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/bin,/usr/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/qt5/imports,/custom/usr/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/qt5/qml,/opt/click.ubuntu.com/vuk.maxvanceffer/0.3/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf,/usr/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/qt5/qml
<maxvanceffer> hmmm
<maxvanceffer> stay
<maxvanceffer> engine see right paths
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: you don't have your path in that list at all
<maxvanceffer> but why my say that can not import qml plugin because it not installed
<maxvanceffer> yeah
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: have a close look at that list. None of them match your install location of /opt/click.ubuntu.com/vuk.maxvanceffer/0.3/usr/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf/qt5/qml/Vuk
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: If you have added a /usr subtree, you'll need to add that to the QML2_IMPORT_PATH
<maxvanceffer> but why ? i can not figure out why
<DanChapman> because your plugin needs to be placed in /opt/click.ubuntu.com/vuk.maxvanceffer/0.3/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf
<maxvanceffer> ok, this i understand
<maxvanceffer> i will share pro file for library is this will be halpefully ?
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: you can share it, but I'm hopeless with .pro files ;)
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: that's why I stick with the defaults...
<maxvanceffer> http://pastebin.com/jruC5ppg
<maxvanceffer> ok will try to explain to click that my lib must be placed inside /opt/click.ubuntu.com/vuk.maxvanceffer/0.3/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf
<DanChapman> maxvanceffer, have your checked what the deafult qmake templates do?
<DanChapman> http://paste.ubuntu.com/13701172/ looking at that there are some parts like loading "ubuntu-click" that you are missing
<DanChapman> maxvanceffer, ^^
<maxvanceffer> ))))))))))))))))))))))))
<maxvanceffer> fcuk
<mcphail> maxvanceffer: hand-crafting qmake files for a click package is going to cause you unnecessary pain, I suspect
<maxvanceffer> )))
<maxvanceffer> thx
<mcphail> DanChapman: I think I have tracked down my huge battery drain on OTA8 to dekko notifications :( - Have had to switch them off
<Niju> Hi guys, got my aquaris e4.5 a few days ago (still on first charge woo)
<Niju> have a few questions if anyone is about?
<maxvanceffer> Fixed everything is working out of the boox
<DanChapman> mcphail, eeek, i knew it was pretty broken but I didn't know about battery drain. Good news is i've actually re-done how the notifications work so it should be alot better with the next update.
<mcphail> DanChapman: brilliant!
<mcphail> Niju: ask away. Often not many people here on a Saturday morning, though :)
<Niju> I get that :)
<Niju> Is the terminal app limited in anyway? I tried apt-cache search and couldn't find anything
<mcphail> Niju: not really limited, but apt is not used by default on the phone
<Niju> Ok, so how exactly could I run classic terminal apps on my terminal?  Do I need developer-mode on or something?
<mcphail> Niju: there are various ways. If you're happy to "break" your device you can make the system mount writable and use apt-get as you would on a normal machine. But this is unsupported and may break updates. Other options are to install apps to ~/bin/ or create a chroot
<Niju> I'm happt to 'break' it if there is a way back :)
<mcphail> Niju: you may need to reflash your device if something breaks, but that is generally straightforward. The best advice is the chroot, but I haven't set one up myself. I think ogra_ has one set up and may be able to help if he is around
<Niju> I'm basically looking to get the standard network tools, nmap,netcat,ssh etc.  I have a sailfish Jolla phone as well and the terminal is a bit more straightforward
<OerHeks> Niju, take a read from 4 may and up http://sturmflut.github.io/ nice blog
<OerHeks> ( to restore )
<Niju> thanks OerHeks
<mcphail> Niju: ssh is there by standard. I suspect nmap is as well, but not sure
<Niju> I've been looking for a good UT blog
<mcphail> aah. nmap isn't
<Niju> yeah
<Niju> I could get by with nc/netcat though
<mcphail> nc is certainlyu there - I use it all the time
<Niju> :D
<Niju> so, for other tools etc nmap, adding ppa's etc, this is best done via chroot?
<Niju> Is adding ppa's even possible?
<mcphail> Niju: the phone uses a PPA by default, so yes (if you _really_ want to break things) ;)
<mcphail> Niju: might be wothwhile getting used to it before breaking it, though
<mcphail> Niju: and remember most PPAs don't build ARM packages
<Niju> Yeah, just trying to get an idea of the capabilities
<Niju> I like it so far tho, scopes made much more sense when I tried them
<mcphail> Niju: of ten the safest way is to "apt-get download" a package, "dpkg-deb --extract" it and copy the binary to ~/bin/
<Niju> noted, cheers
 * mcphail does it that way
<Niju> One thing I do miss is real time multi tasking like in sailfish.  Is that in the works for UT at all?
<mcphail> no - it is disabled by default. The phone is capable of multitasking, but it is a design decision to only allow "multitasking" through frameworks like the media-hub to save battery etc
<mcphail> not sure I agree with it, but hey ho
<Niju> That makes sense I suppose, however how will that impact ssh sessions for example?
<mcphail> Niju: if you are ssh'ing from the terminal app, it will be closed. You can install an app called TweakGeek which will allow the terminal sessions to persist
<Niju> Is that in the ubuntu store?
<Niju> I think that might be the app I saw in a YT vid I couldn't remember the name of
<mcphail> Niju: in the open store, rather than the default store. You have to sideload the open store
<mcphail> https://open.uappexplorer.com/
<mcphail> Niju: but tweakgeek tweaks are currently killing my battery, so be wary
<Niju> Hmm, maybe I'll hold off for now then
<mcphail> Niju: you can also activate an ssh server on the phone, and that runs quite ahppily in the background
<mcphail> *happily
<Niju> Ok, last question before I go back to Xenoblade x, what exactly can I do with developer mode on?
<Niju> ah, I might try that then :D
<mcphail> Niju: you need developer mode for adb access
<Niju> ok cool, thanks for answering mcphail
<Niju> :)
<mcphail> Niju: enjoy!
<OerHeks> muka_, fix your connection, please
<scientes> 2015/12/04 20:24:58 mkdir /root/.cache: permission denied
<Mikaela> Do Ubuntu Phones support NFC paying?
<talonz> might be a little early for nfc payments on ubuntu touch just yet Mikaela
<Mikaela> I see
<skywalker> is the Meizu MX4 the only 4G phone out there for Ubuntu Touch?
<dobey> it's the only retail phone that comes with ubuntu on it
<dobey> that has 4g, at the moment
#ubuntu-touch 2015-12-06
<talonz> nexus 4 can use 4g it just needs to be unlocked ... i dont know if it works on ubuntu touch but i can't see why it wouldnt
<dobey> talonz: yes it works. you just have to use the really old radio firmware to get it working.
<dobey> it works on the nexus5 too, but so many other things don't work there :)
<talonz> doanac: yeah i got a nexus 5 and it's a real shame ubuntu touch does not work on it any more the phone is still quite fast
<dobey> eh, ubuntu works as well on it now as it always has
<dobey> it's what i use as a phone
<talonz> i havent been able to get it to run through multirom for months now keep getting stuck at the google logo
<talonz> and alot of others are not having any luck either
<talonz> i keep trying every weekend tho just to see if anythings changed
<dobey> i don't use android at all
<dobey> i only have ubuntu on my n5
<dobey> multirom and the image server where the nexus5 images were being hosted is also pretty outdated. i'm going to try to get my own image server set up soon though
<scientes> what about nexus 4
<ahoneybun> talonz, it does enable the 4G on the N4 as well
<talonz> ahoneybun: thanks i got one ordered just waiting for it to get here
<ahoneybun> np the good thing about the N4 is that it supports the hdmi out with that cable
<ahoneybun> talonz, ^
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/ubuntu-touch-is-being-ported-to-lg-optimus-g-again-497145.shtml
<gkeen_> lotuspsychje: you into ubuntu-touch? do you know when we might get exchangemail support?
<lotuspsychje> gkeen_: not sure we have exchange support
<lotuspsychje> gkeen_: did you try dekko?
<gkeen_> dekko?
<lotuspsychje> its in the software center
<gkeen_> ah no well its an imap client
<gkeen_> i need mail, contacts and calendar support.. for work etc
<lotuspsychje> gkeen_: not sure ubuntu touch supports this mate
<lotuspsychje> gkeen_: cant you link a gmail to your exchange some way?
<lotuspsychje> outlook and gmail got an app on touch
<gkeen_> probably, but still.. cant be that hard to implement.. Firefox OS has had it for years :P
<Nikolay> Hi :)
<MrFastDie> Hey guys! It is possible that the software center is currently not available?
<k1l> MrFastDie: works here from netcologne
<Marezz> Hi everyone
<Marezz> Does ubuntu touch contain systemd?
<k1l> iirc yes
<dobey> contain yes, use as the init system, no
<dobey> the phone images still use upstart
<k1l_> oh ok. thought it was already shifted to systemd
#ubuntu-touch 2016-12-05
<nerdcore> I'm trying to follow these instructions https://devices.ubports.com/#/hammerhead and the files seem to have downloaded OK now but all I get is this: http://nerdcore.net/mike/ubtouch-error-1480902949.txt
<nerdcore> it's been stalled there for over an hour and does not appear to be doing anything more
<nerdcore> Does my device need to be in a specific state (recovery / bootloader) to complete `ubuntu-device-flash`?
<duflu> nerdcore: I have never tried Ubuntu on a hammerhead but being a Nexus device you should not need any preparation other than the normal rooting
<duflu> nerdcore: A Nexus device should only require unlocking before flashing:  https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/phone/devices/installing-ubuntu-for-devices/#unlock-device
<nerdcore> duflu: It's quite unlocked I'm sure. I just replaced CM on it yesterday
<nerdcore> i've replaced recovery a few times as well with clockwork and twrp
<nerdcore> but ubuntu-device-flash just seemed to stall here: http://nerdcore.net/mike/ubtouch-error-1480902949.txt
<nerdcore> I've also just tried building AOSP from source which appears to have worked and now I'm looking to flash it. Should I have the device in the state described here before running ubuntu-device-flash? http://source.android.com/source/running.html#flashing-a-device
<nerdcore> oh i missed that step somehow. Stupid user error. my apologies
<nerdcore> hmm, ubuntu appears to have booted but is asking me a question in a font so small I cannot possibly read it :(
<nerdcore> what does "Boot access possibly lost. Fix?" mean?
<nerdcore> maybe "Root" not "Boot"? really hard to read
<duflu> nerdcore: Don't know sorry
<nerdcore> I selected "Go back" and it rebooted and loaded the OS :)
<nerdcore> Is there a way to import the contacts I dumped from adnroid in VCF format? The Contacts app only offers "import from google" or "import from SIM card"
<nerdcore> oh and Browser seems to crash every time. I'm guessing that's not supposed to happen :/
<Jobo> Hi! It seems like my phone won't turn back on after installing update 35. It started installing and was at the "powered by ubuntu" progress bar screen when I put it in my pocket, and now it won't turn on. iirc if it's run out of battery it would still flash the screen
<Jobo> And I don't recall it being low on battery
<Jobo> Anyone from the company here that saw my message?
<harirama> I dropped my BQ4.5, glass is broken ....
<harirama> grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
<harirama> where would i get a new ubuntu phone?
<harirama> what model would it be?
<Acou_Bass> can you not just repair it?
<harirama> tried to repair it. Got a new glass, had it installed, was the wrong type.
<harirama> so found another bq4.5 secondhand, also dropped that one, glass broken.
<harirama> now i have 2 broken phones.
<mterry> tedg: libertine in the silo doesn't build on any platform.  I guess it's trunk that doesn't build, since the one branch we had is merged already
<mterry> Just a heads up
<dobey> hmm, i guess mesa is still broken :-/
<tedg> mterry: Hmm, we should mention that to ChrisTownsend :-P
<ChrisTownsend> tedg: mterry:  Which silo?
<mterry> ChrisTownsend: silo 2129
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: Ok, thanks
<tedg> ChrisTownsend: 2129, I have my LD_LIBRARY_PATH patch in there, but nothing else.
<mterry> But that's already merged
<mterry> So we're just building trunk
<larryprice> re: libertine - seems there was an update to cmake-extras this weekend that has hidden our `translations` target causing builddeb to fail... i'm looking at it now
<mterry> larryprice, ChrisTownsend: yup, that's the build failure
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: tedg: Ok, it's in the very capable hands of larryprice:)
<tedg> Woot! Larry! Larry! Larry!
<larryprice> mterry, is this libertine from the archives or from a source branch?
 * larryprice has a fix ready, needs to figure out where to put it
<mterry> larryprice: source branch (trunk)
<mterry> larryprice: oh like a silo?  You could put it in our silo (2129) to help our builds, but don't land it from there -- that silo will never land, just for testing
<larryprice> mterry, well if you're just pulling from our source branches, it makes things easier
<mterry> larryprice: what is the schedule for libertine releases to archive?  I was surprised to see things land in trunk but not archive, so you must do manual landings?
<larryprice> mterry, we do dev work on lp:libertine and then manually release lp:libertine/trunk when we have enough changes in place or someone needs something
<mterry> k
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: tedg: Ok, fix has landed in lp:libertine, so you should be able to rebuild libertine now in your silo.
<mterry> ChrisTownsend, larryprice: such quick turnaround without an archive-trunk.  :)  Nice selling point
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: Yep, we have to do some songs and dances, but it makes development agile:)
<dobey> eh, more a sign that we have process problems we need to fix
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: It also helps shake out any regressions before we release into the archive.
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: We have beaten that dead horse into the ground.  It is what it is.
<dobey> sure; just saying that "subverting the process by ignoring it" isn't a good solution to "we have X/Y/Z problems with the process"
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: We don't ignore the process.  We just do it differently than many other projects.  We still use the ci-train and QA for landing releases.  Our development model is just different.  And I think it's a good thing to have the freedom to choose one way or the other.
<taiebot> mm am i the only one experiencing regressions on the telephony side due to the landing of the group chat support?
<pmcgowan> taiebot, I lost some history in a test I just did, guys are looking at it now
<taiebot> pmcgowan: i have just seen you confirming.
<taiebot> https://bugs.launchpad.net/canonical-devices-system-image/+bug/1647024
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1647024 in Canonical System Image "RC proposed multiple regressions on messages contact and phone app" [Critical,Confirmed]
<pmcgowan> my symptoms are a bit different so will need to dig
<taiebot> pmcgowan: i am roaming in a foreign country at the moment maybe that's why initialisation is slow.
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: not quite what i was saying (or trying to say), but eh, not fussed to argue about it either :)
<taiebot> pmcgowan: whaouh did not realise everything is back now... Weird!! i swear i had lost everything just re-opened now app launches fine and i have my messages and my call history back. Wonder what happened, the only stuff i think is i received a phone call last night maybe this re-triggered everything?
<pmcgowan> taiebot, interesting, there was some sort of db schema change, maybe the script finally finsihed? add to the bug
<pmcgowan> bfiller, ^
<bfiller> salem_, ^^^
<taiebot> pmcgowan, bfiller and salem, my messages app was like a first launch, 20 sec to boot and the intro set up displayed. No messages at all and calls history was also blank.
<salem_> taiebot, could you check your $HOME/.cache/upstart/dbus.log  ?
<salem_> taiebot, looks like history-daemon is somehow stuck.
<taiebot> salem_ i have lots of oFonoConnection::inspectHandles contact (2)
<taiebot> i suppose it's normal
<boiko> taiebot: usually it is normal
<taiebot> salem_ i have the debug of saturday which is a little bit more useful i suppose.
<salem_> taiebot, the inspectHandles() is expected. I saw the ones in the bug report. Do you have any other debug?
<salem_> taiebot, can you look into dbus.log for some text like "SQLite" or "database" ?
<mterry> pete-woods: does your silo 2224's libqtdbusmock build if you rebuilt it?  I tried that branch in a separate silo and got a build error around GMock not being found...
<taiebot> salem_ https://paste.ubuntu.com/23584095/
<pete-woods> mterry: it does, yes. there were some changes in cmake-extras recently that means you have to totally rebuild if you have a dirty build tree?
<pete-woods> could possibly be that
<pete-woods> the MR itself only adds two new methods to a dbus stub, shouldn't make gmock dissappear..
<pete-woods> (I hope)
<mterry> pete-woods: yeah I agree it's not your branch, just saying there seems to be a problem with libqtdbusmock trunk
<pete-woods> mterry: oh, trunk doesn't build?
<pete-woods> that does surprise me
<mterry> pete-woods: well it doesn't build with your MP.  And I don't think it's your MP.  So must be trunk
<pete-woods> hmm
<pete-woods> that's not completely true
<salem_> taiebot, thanks. it looks correct. Are you still able to reproduce the issue?
<pete-woods> as that assumes nothing else changed
<mterry> pete-woods: no I'm assuming something else changed
<pete-woods> pretty sure in ubuntu-land the sands shift regularly
<mterry> pete-woods: but they broke your trunk is the point
<pete-woods> right
<pete-woods> yeah, I think gmock broke a lot of trunks recently
<mterry> yup
<pete-woods> but we made a workaround in cmake-extras
<pete-woods> that *should* have fixed it?
 * pete-woods double-checks that it's being used in libqtdbusmock
<taiebot> salem_ my database could have been big i have been using my device for 3 years
<mterry> pete-woods: I'm just saying, try rebuilding your silo package.  I did in a separate silo and it broke
<pete-woods> mterry: I'm being dense here
<pete-woods> it turns out my MR *does* fix the FTBFS
<taiebot> salem_ i am not able to reproduce anymore.
<pete-woods> but I just forgot :$
<pete-woods> you need to make sure cmake-extras is up to date, though
<mterry> pete-woods: I just now, like 30m ago took your silo MP and built in another silo and it broke
<pete-woods> oh
<mterry> Maybe my silo messed it up?  But my first guess is that archive broke you
<pete-woods> then I really don't know what's going on
<pete-woods> ahh
<pete-woods> the cmake-extras fix is only in the stable-overlay for xenial
<pete-woods> maybe that's it?
<mterry> pete-woods: I was seeing ftbfs in xenial and zesty
<mterry> All arches
<mterry> Just try rebuilding the package and see what happens?
<pete-woods> mterry: really don't know what's going on there then
<pete-woods> mterry: yeah, will try and and see
<pete-woods> thanks for the heads up!
<mterry> yw!
<salem_> taiebot, ahh, so you were able to reproduce it only once?
<taiebot> Well  i could downgrade and re-upgrade to see if i can reproduce on upgrade
<taiebot> salem_  I had no messages on saturday and sunday even after reboots
<taiebot> salem_ while i was talking to pmcgowan realised that everything was back.
<taiebot> salwm_ I can downgrade/upgrade to see if i reproduce on upgrade.
<salem_> taiebot, thank you. I don't know if you will be able to downgrade, since the database got already upgraded to work with the most recent version. downgrading the packages may cause some other troubles.
<salem_> taiebot, in case you face this issue again, could you grab dbus.log so we can check?
<salem_> taiebot, also, could you run a command line via adb so I can confirm something?
<taiebot> no problem
<salem_> taiebot, sqlite3 $HOME/.local/share/history-service/history.sqlite "select * from schema_version"
<taiebot> salem_  17 is the ouput
<salem_> taiebot, ok, thanks! so your database got upgraded successfully.
<zeu5> Hi. I'm trying to port to Xiaomi redmi 1s. I build the project for nexus as a part of the guide but can't find the boot.img or recovery.img
<zeu5> Where do i look for what went wrong?
<zeu5> I'm a noob to this so help me out
#ubuntu-touch 2016-12-06
<KrisJace> in the Ubuntu Touch, could the transparency setting be given to users for the onscreen keyboard??
<KrisJace> http://api.sound.com.tw/dev/kris/maliit-concept.jpg
<ashshidiq87> test
<duflu> sil2100: Hey OTA-14 shows 23 bugs fix committed but the project shows 123 fix committed. Update the milestone?
<duflu> I know not all will have made it
<sil2100> duflu: hey, what project you mean?
<duflu> sil2100: The project which contains OTA-14 :)   https://bugs.launchpad.net/canonical-devices-system-image/+bugs?field.searchtext=&orderby=-importance&search=Search&field.status%3Alist=FIXCOMMITTED
<duflu> The project shows 123 fix committed but only 23 are tied to OTA-14?... sounds like a mistake
<duflu> Maybe it's not...
<sil2100> No
<sil2100> https://launchpad.net/canonical-devices-system-image/+milestone/14 <- this is correct
<sil2100> Since this time we prepared OTA-14 snapshot based, so not all committed fixes will be released to stable :)
<sil2100> Usually we take rc-proposed and use that as a candidate, here we picked single fixes and made a release out of that
<duflu> Oh OK. I still bet more than 23 sneak in
<sil2100> I think there might be a bit more, yes
<sil2100> Since we did take the whole unity8 stack
<sil2100> duflu: will try to update that
<duflu> sil2100: Ah, yes exactly. A full stack update will pull in hundreds of changes/fixes :)
<sil2100> duflu: anyway, thanks for mentioning this!
<duflu> sil2100: No problem. I am preparing to end the day at a sane hour, soon...
<KrisJace> http://kriscode.blogspot.tw/2016/12/ubuntu-touch-oosk-qml-hack-for-transparency.html
<harirama> http://www.mibqyyo.com/en-articles/2015/09/16/ubuntu-android-installation-process-for-bq-aquaris-e4-5-and-e5/#/vanilla/discussion/embed/?vanilla_discussion_id=0
<harirama> to launch the download of a file named âSP_Flash_Tool_exe_linux_v5.1424.00.zipâ
<harirama> i cannot find this file ....
<harirama> arghhh
<mimecar> https://storage.googleapis.com/otas/2015/Tablets/Freezer%20FHD/Ubuntu/SP_Flash_Tool_exe_Linux_v5.1612.00.100.zip
<mimecar> that version should work
<mimecar> or you can install ubuntu with flash-tool and ubuntu sdk
<OerHeks> http://www.mibqyyo.com/descargas/2015/05/22/herramienta-flash-tool-ubuntu/
<OerHeks> mimecar, +1 that is the result
<mimecar> there are two ways for ubuntu phone installation
<alex-BDA53832477> Hello. I have issues with setting up a build target in Ubuntu sdk and hoped someone might have a clue how I can get this solved. Particularly, the setup exits with the following message "useradd: group '1026' does not exist
<alex-BDA53832477> error: exit status 6". 1026 is my user id. Help, anyone? :)
<alex-BDA53832477> ok I created a group with id 1026 and now it worked ... never mind ... :)
<harirama> mimecar, OerHeks, tnx! I succeeded. Lalalala super.
<mikeman> whaaadddup!
<mikeman> ubuntu touch to a rooted Nexus 7.... installing from a windows 10 PC. Anybody have a checklist or link?
<dobey> mikeman: nexus 7 2013 (early) ?
<dobey> mikeman: probably best to boot ubuntu off a usb to do the flash, or in a vm. not sure if anyone's done it from the ubuntu-on-windows thing
<mikeman> @dobey, its a little older. I believe its a V2... Ive already rooted it a year ago. btw, my first typo. Its a Nexus 5 rooted. I also have a Nexus 7, but I want Ubuntu touch on the nexus 5
<dobey> mikeman: oh ok. for nexus 5 flash on original android 4.4, boot to welcome screen, reboot to bootloader, and basically follow the instructions on ubports.com for it
<mikeman> so I basically should be searching for creating and booting custom roms then right? From there I can just keep messing with images until I find one that suits my needs?
<mikeman> cuz there are so many different linux flavors i mean
<dobey> not sure what you're asking, flashing ubuntu on the device is a fair bit different from flashing jolla or android or others
<dobey> but https://ubports.com/ has the details for how to flash ubuntu onto a nexus 5
<mikeman> @dobey. Im going to try your USB suggestion with the 2buntu.com tutorial. If its a no go then im just gonna get myself a PI3 for xmas and build. Cheers budz!!!!
<mterry> kgunn: you said silo snap didn't work for you -- on classic or vm?  Works for me in classic, about to try vm
<kgunn> mterry: on classic
<kgunn> lemme try right now...i just removed and reinstalled just in case (as previously i installed on top of another install)
<mterry> hm works for me on vm too
<kgunn> mterry: mterry: yeah so it worked fine this time
<kgunn> so it seems you cannot merely install on top of an existing installed unity8-session snap
<mterry> kgunn: so looks like auto-upload to store is *supposed* to work.  But the uploads keep timing out when LP tries to push them to store
<mterry> https://launchpad.net/~unity-team/+snap/unity8-session-silo/+build/12635 for example
<kgunn> interesting
<dobey> well i know it works for other people building snaps
<dobey> so i presume some odd config issue
<mterry> u8 snap is also huge
<mterry> Might be stressing something
<dobey> true
<kgunn> mterry: so is u-s-s the only app that successfully launches atm?
<kgunn> ...also,i thot we were going to preinstall terminal app?...did i imagine that?
<mterry> kgunn: the terminal *snap* is installed by unity8-install-snap
<mterry> Optimistically assuming that snap launching would work
<kgunn> mterry: so it _should_ be present in my apps scope?
<kgunn> wondering if i'm suffering from early adoption woes'
<mterry> kgunn: if "snap list ubuntu-terminal-app" gives good output, yes
<kgunn> mterry: oh it's definitely not installed...
<kgunn> snap list doesn't show it
<mterry> kgunn: run unity8-install-snap and it should be
<mterry> unity8-snap-install
<mterry> whoops
<kgunn> ah...k
<kgunn> mterry: is the store version still 277 ?
<kgunn> oh must be
<kgunn> cause no ted to upload
<kgunn> assuming he's still the only gatekeeper on that namespace
<mterry> kgunn: yeah... well actually we're digging with some IS / store people.  We're seeing an unexpected timeout when uploading
<dobey> err
<dobey> kgunn: what *is* in your apps scope?
<davmor2> kgunn: iirc it was build automagically when things landed could be dreaming when they said that though :)
<kgunn> dobey: atm, ubuntu-browser, clock, u-s-s, chrome
<davmor2> kgunn: on the snap in the store there are no apps other system settings because you only install unity8 not the other snaps that unity8-session-install installs along side unity8
<dobey> kgunn: is chrome installed as a snap or in a libertine container?
<dobey> well actually i guess clock is a snap
<dobey> kgunn: unity8 snap on classic?
<kgunn> dobey: all of those were/are snaps
<dobey> well u-s-s and webbrowser-app i guess are in the u8 snap itself
<mterry> not webbrowser-app anymore
<dobey> oh it's a snap now?
<mterry> We actually intend to put Firefox in there
<dobey> yikes
<mterry> It does have a snap yeah
<mterry> But some UAL issues prevent us from launching FF yet
<kgunn> mterry: so unity8-snap-install is supposed to run on it's own upon the first install i suppose?
<dobey> doesn't firefox have snaps?
<kgunn> ...i'm just having to run manually as early adopter?
<mterry> kgunn: no the instructions just say to run it
<dobey> i would expect firefox should be a snap
<mterry> dobey: that is the eventual intent yes
<kgunn> mterry: so it does....my bad
<dobey> but anyway, i guess yeah there is some issue with launching snaps from a snap still
<dobey> oh probably the unity8 interface stuff?
<dobey> because it tries to run unity7 snaps with xmir
<dobey> which i guess also still has some problems
<dobey> but the unity8 apps really shouldn't be running under xmir, but there's no official u8 interface yet
<dobey> mterry: maybe would be a good idea to have the terminal app included in the u8 snap until we get the interface bits sorted there?
<dobey> that way devs should at least be able to have a working terminal to debug bits in
<mterry> We could, if dropping to a terminal is a problem for people
<mterry> But I had expected us to be able to launch snaps already  :)  (it's not an interface thing exactly, just UAL stuff that ted's working on)
<dobey> well it's hard to see what's happening on the mir surface when you're over in another vt :)
<dobey> mterry: well, there are multiple issues i guess. sdk apps should not be running under xmir; but i don't know if ted was fixing that to happen for the unity7 interface or not
<dobey> but i do know he was trying to get a snapd .deb built with a unity8 interface for testing
<kgunn> mterry: dobey ok, yeah, now i get all the relevant apps....camera, filebrowser, terminal, calculator etc
<kgunn> fwiw, ubuntu-browser seems upgraded
<kgunn> ....at least it actually attempts to launch (doesn't disappear immediately..but never succeeds)
<mterry> yay
<mterry> sorta
<kgunn> :)
<dobey> cool
<kgunn> mterry: curious, how is it that u-s-s actually launches...but all others fail?
<kgunn> is it b/c it's not really a separate snap
<mterry> kgunn: it is not a snap, it's built in as a legacy app
<kgunn> right
<pmcgowan> kgunn, mterry can we get the latest up on edge then?
<kgunn> unless ted "added" others to his namespace we can't i think....also we really should get mvo to get this uploaded under canonical
<dobey> if uploaded under canonical namespace, rights to the package still needs to be shared to each individual who needs to upload it
#ubuntu-touch 2016-12-07
<cactusdude> is ubuntu touch alive?
<duflu> cactusdude: Yes, but most of the developers are focusing on the desktop side for a while
<cactusdude> why is that? no love for mobile?
<duflu> It's all the same code though, for touch and desktop.
<duflu> Because we are a small number of developers really. We have mobile released but not yet the new desktop released
<duflu> Get everything out there, and iterate
<duflu> Mobile continues to improve at the same time, as desktop gets touch features
<duflu> Also OTA-14 for Ubuntu Touch is due this month still... I think
<duflu> Don't quote me on that. The OTA-14 page shows mid-November as the date still
<duflu> But I spoke to the person in charge of releasing OTA-14 yesterday. It's certainly coming
<cactusdude> That is cool. Hopefully you/they can get the word out there and recruit more developers!
<dobey> cactusdude: if you want more ubuntu phones, tell your telco and/or phone manufacturer
<dobey> we don't make the hardware over here, just the software. porting to new devices also is a lot of work. it's not trivial, because every phone is different.
<dobey> but yes, we all want to see more devices with ubuntu on them
<HendriXXX> Does anyone have statistics, how many active UT- users there are?
* sil2100 changed the topic of #ubuntu-touch to: Home: http://bit.ly/YEqEfo | Install: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install | Porting (advanced) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Porting | Bug filing: http://bit.ly/1aV9AJG | Dashboard: http://bit.ly/12AQV53 | http://www.bq.com/gb/ubuntu.html | https://store.bq.com/en/ubuntu-edition-aquaris-m10 | http://www.ubuntu.com/tablet | OTA-14 phased updates in progress
<Acou_Bass> phased updates in progress? woo! \o/
<Maik_> Is it possible to install Ubuntu touch on a Tablett hat currently runs windows 10 home x32?
<Maik_> *that
<Maik_> Is it possible to install Ubuntu touch on a Tablett that currently runs windows 10 home x32?
<OerHeks> Maik_, if there is a port for it, yes. ( but i doubt you have the BQ m10 ) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<Maik_> OerHeks, thanks, i ll try the desktop version of Ubuntu then, may that ll work.
<OerHeks> Maik_, carefull, if that tablet got 32 bit UEFI, you need to do some stuff to make uefi work
<matv1> hi guys I am getting an update for the uWriter app by costales that fails on a DBusError. it looks like the version try tries to install is the same as the one already installed: 0.22
<matv1> has anyone else seen this happen?
<matv1> is there some corrupt cashing that I can cler maybe?
<matv1> clear
<matv1> on the other hand, I am getting this same error on both my devices. So that sounds like the download itself is corrupt..
<Maik_> Anyway, thanks for the help OerHeks, bye
<NeoTheThird[m]> There's currently no free A-GPS location service for Ubuntu Touch. Anyone here, who has experience with Mozilla Location Service? https://www.bountysource.com/issues/39808752-support-for-mozilla-location-service-a-gps
<brunch875> guys I want to reinstall utouch but I can't find the krillin recovery. If anyone has a link laying around...
<pmcg1> brunch875, on this page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<brunch875> ooh thanks!
<Mister_Q> brunch875 https://github.com/MariusQuabeck/magic-device-tool
<brunch875> Android sailfish... nice... I feel really tempted to try those
<brunch875> Also, I wanted to mention that yesterday I fixed some scope loading issues by deleting ~/.cache, which in turn also deleted the libertine containers... Going to wipe now and see if it unlocks magical superpowers
<matv1> hi all, earlier today I reported this issue to uWriter app but Costales believes its a system issue. Not his app. Could someone assist me in digging a little deeper?
<matv1> https://bugs.launchpad.net/canonical-devices-system-image/+bug/1648070
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1646758 in ubuntu-download-manager (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1648070 Can't update or install apps" [Critical,In progress]
<brunch875> on a related note, I just reflashed rc-proposed and I can't seem to be able to install my old apps
<matv1> oh irc tells me now that its a duplicate of another bug
<Mister_Q> brunch875 known bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1646758
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1646758 in ubuntu-download-manager (Ubuntu) "Can't update or install apps" [Critical,In progress]
 * matv1 reads up on the dupe
<brunch875> ouch, perhaps it wasn't the ideal moment to reflash
<brunch875> I depend on the authenticator app
<matv1> ah it seems a fix is already in the next proposed. All good then
<matv1> thanks pmcg1 :) will any manual cleanup be required of already failed updates or will all that sort itself out?
<pmcg1> matv1, good question, I hope the latter, Elleo could tell us
<Elleo> pmcg1, matv1: all updates should start working correctly after it lands, even ones that had previously failed
<pmcg1> right answer!
<matv1> Elleo Great thank you
<Elleo> no problem :)
<HendriXXX_> Can I change app scope (home screen) wallpaper. Where are wallpapers located?
<dobey> HendriXXX_: no, you cannot. changing the background only affects the lock screen (and background in the open windows overview in later versions)
<HendriXXX_> Ok. Thanks!
<JanC> are the OTA-14 download-servers overloaded or something?
<dobey> it is staged rollout
<dobey> N devices get it first, then another random N, and so on, until all devices get it
<JanC> for some reason the download doesn't start for me
<dobey> you see the update and it's just not downloading?
<JanC> yeah, when I press the download button it doesn't start; trying to figure out where the problem is
<dobey> ok, not sure why that would be
<JanC> internet seems to work fine in the browser, so not a local network/wifi issue I think
<JanC> I guess I'll try later again
<dobey> yeah, i'd say wait a little while, and if it's still being a problem, send a mail to the list
<luxpir> hey - I can't access my Update settings... is there a lock file for that too?
<luxpir> (had similar problem with Dekko and messages before)
<luxpir> anyone in tonight?
<dobey> what device? what do you mean exactly by "can't access" there?
<WizardGed> hey ota-6 is stuck partially downloaded is there a way to delete/reset the software updates app
<luxpir> dobey: aquaris e4.5 (sorry, exact model name escapes me... or is that it)
<luxpir> dobey: I click into settings, then click Updates and no window appears and the settings window closes
<luxpir> similar to when dekko wouldn't open, I could go into .config/[dekkodir] and delete the lock file
<luxpir> but I can't find one for the updates
<dobey> luxpir: do you have a file in /var/crash for ubuntu-system-settings ?
<WizardGed> fixed mine
<WizardGed> deleted my username-hasrun and myusername-has-run-and-location in .config and it reet it suprisingly
<luxpir> not for system settings, dobey
<luxpir> for usr_bin_webapp-container
<luxpir> it's for imgur when I look in the file
<luxpir> WizardGed: both of those are empty files in my system
<dobey> luxpir: that's odd indeed. not sure. kenvandine, jgdx ^^ either of you can help if you're around?
<WizardGed> luxpir i know if you delete both though it will cause the first time install screen to appear and the last screen in it updates to the newest ota
 * kenvandine reads
<kenvandine> luxpir, pastebin the log file, ~/.cache/upstart/application-legacy-ubuntu-system-settings.log
<luxpir> http://paste.ubuntu.com/23595409
<luxpir> (apologies for delay)
<luxpir> WizardGed: cool, that might be a fallback if I've missed kenvandine - thx for conjuring them, dobey
<luxpir> any idea what the thumbnailer service is? there's a lockfile for it in cache
<luxpir> WizardGed: Gah, deleting those both didn't update
<pmcg1> luxpir, thumbnailer service does just that, makes thumbnails from images for the apps like camera, gallery, music, ...
<luxpir> pmcg1: thanks - just can't quite find why my updates page isn't opening in sys settings
<pmcg1> oh hmm
<luxpir> pmcg1: it's messed up
<pmcg1> yeah not sure why kenvandine ^
<luxpir> I can't start the update via the terminal in any way can I?
<pmcg1> luxpir, you can
<pmcg1> using system-image-cli
<pmcg1> luxpir, are you going from the main panel, could try accessing it from the about page, although no idea that would work
<luxpir> about pg not opening either... will check sys img cli
<dobey> luxpir: tried rebooting?
<luxpir> did a restart...
<luxpir> maybe could pwr off
<luxpir> i did some chroot binding stuff a few weeks back w/out fully understanding what i was doing. could that be it?
<dobey> possibly, though i couldn't say what you would have done that might have caused it
<tylnesh> Hello! I've found a bug in the Music player. After I play a few songs (2-5), my bluetooth connection becomes flaky and keeps dropping, until I reboot the phone. I noticed this behaviour with a bluetooth headset and my Pebble.
<tylnesh> Question is, should I run ubuntu-bug on the music app or bluetooth manager?
<Gmiske> hey
<Gmiske> have any body install ubuntu on robin pgone
<Acou_Bass> does anyone else still have problems with the nearby aggregator scope? nothing at all seems to be able to get a location fix in the scope... happened on both ota-13 and the new 14 update
#ubuntu-touch 2016-12-08
<JanC> download of OTA-14 works now
<cc__> hi
<cc__> Is there any good input for ubuntu phone ?
<cc> hello
<cc> any good input method for ubuntu phone?i cant bear the systerm input method
<luxpir> hey, still can't get the updater to run. by any means. can't find any precedent either.
<luxpir> have tried: system-image-cli, deleting wizard-has-run* and rebooting, powering off
<luxpir> and provided logs from .cache/upstart/app-legacy-ubu-sys-settings.log: http://paste.ubuntu.com/23595409
<luxpir> the update screen basically doesn't appear when clicked, taking the system settings window away with it
<luxpir> update: security and privacy settings on the settings screen won't open either. everything else seems to work.
<luxpir> thanks for your help last night dobey kenvandine pmcg1 - if you have any more ideas...
<luxpir> update: oh, now the About screen won't open from settings either, when it did last night
<luxpir> I had also done this in recent weeks: https://askubuntu.com/questions/620740/recommended-way-to-install-regularcli-deb-packages-on-ubuntu-phone#623311 > the bind parts might have messed with things?
<luxpir> upgrading my chroot now, just the ubuntu-system-settings bit
<luxpir> oh i wonder if upgrades to my vivid chroot affected the root system because of the bind mounts?
<luxpir> you can see in the paste logs that qml errors out at times... should i upgrade the chroot's qml packages?
<luxpir> I'll check back in this afternoon - thanks for any tips you can think of
<jamesstanley> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/ReleaseNotes/OTA-14 this page says OTA-14 is not yet released
<jamesstanley> I just noticed the topic of this channel says "phased updated in progress"
<jamesstanley> I currently have OTA-13 on my Nexus 4, if I have an update to install is that ok because of the "phased updates" even though OTA-14 is not yet releaed?
<sil2100> jamesstanley: phased updates mean that it's good to install
<sil2100> jamesstanley: I'll update the OTA-14 release page to include the image numbers in a moment
<sil2100> jamesstanley: phased updates generally means: 'the image is released but it's made available to users in phases'
<jamesstanley> thanks mate :)
* sil2100 changed the topic of #ubuntu-touch to: Home: http://bit.ly/YEqEfo | Install: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Install | Porting (advanced) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Porting | Bug filing: http://bit.ly/1aV9AJG | Dashboard: http://bit.ly/12AQV53 | http://www.bq.com/gb/ubuntu.html | https://store.bq.com/en/ubuntu-edition-aquaris-m10 | http://www.ubuntu.com/tablet | OTA-14 released
<jamesstanley> installing it now
<sil2100> Actually the phased percentage reached 100%, so the update is released now ;)
<jamesstanley> I like that the animated transitions are faster now
<AlanBell> hi, anyone know how to trigger an OTA update from the command line? network indicator isn't working on my phone at the moment and the update list thinks it is offline, but it isn't
<AlanBell> I think an OTA update has a decent chance of fixing whatever is broken, but I can't trigger it
<jgdx> luxpir, hey, around?
<jgdx> AlanBell, $Â system-image-cli
<luxpir> jgdx: here and afk all day!
<jgdx> luxpir, I wonder what's in your /var/log/system-image/client.log ?
<jgdx> luxpir, and what are you using your chroot for? :)
<jgdx> reason I ask is, if you build uss in your chroot and install it on the phoneâ¦
<jgdx> (uss = Ubuntu System Settings)
<tsglove> Good morning all
<jgdx> \o
<jamesstanley> the new update is great actually
<jamesstanley> I used to have a lockup of ~2s when switching to a different app, that is gone now
<jamesstanley> I could tell it was locked up because everything was slightly blurry, as if it's showing a slightly-scaled-up screenshot of the app instead
<zzarr> Hello! What have happened to my phone?
<zzarr> I installed OTA-14 and everything is moving atleast twice as fast :D
<jamesstanley> zzarr: me too :) much better imo
<zzarr> yes :D
<zzarr> I love it
<AlanBell> thanks jgdx, trying that now
<AlanBell> thanks jgdx, it worked! indicator-network is still broken though
<jgdx> AlanBell, great. Any idea why?
<jgdx> or is it just not running?
<jgdx> start indicator-network
<AlanBell> no idea at the moment
<AlanBell> job is already running
<AlanBell> so, in the status bar it just says "indicator-network" with a cog icon
<AlanBell> nothing below it
<AlanBell> and the update manager thinks I am offline (I am not, it connected to wifi just fine)
<jgdx> AlanBell, hm, maybe check ~/.cache/upstart/indicator-network.log
<jgdx> yes, the indicator provides the API we use in System Updates
<AlanBell> indicator-rotation-lock is the same, a placeholder
<jgdx> that's not good
<AlanBell> I have no file ~/.cache/upstart/indicator-network.log but I have ~/.cache/upstart/indicator-network.log.1.gz
<AlanBell> contains 8 lines like this: Debug: Device Added: "/org/freedesktop/NetworkManager/Devices/8" ((null):0, (null))
<AlanBell> well 9 lines, starting at zero
<jgdx> AlanBell, could you stop indicator-network, and re-start it?
<jgdx> hopefully there's some hints in the log after
<AlanBell> ok, that created indicator-network.log with the same 9 lines in it
<davmor2> AlanBell: what did you do?
<AlanBell> davmor2: breaking things is your job really isn't it!
<davmor2> AlanBell: that's right and don't you forget it ;) Have you been tinkering with it in rw mode over leaving it in ro mode?
<AlanBell> davmor2: nope, ro all the way
<jgdx> AlanBell, anything else acting weirdly?
 * AlanBell looks around at 2016 in general
<AlanBell> nope, other than the broken indicators, the phone is the least wierd thing going on at the moment
<AlanBell> ok, after a hard reboot the rotation indicator is now working, but network indicator is still not there
<jgdx> AlanBell, anything in /var/crash? ignore _usr_bin_election.crash
<AlanBell> nothing at all
<jgdx> maybe pete-woods has a theory
<pete-woods> jgdx, AlanBell : this is on a vivid based phone, right?
<pete-woods> Just want to check, as there was an i-n landing to xenial recently
<AlanBell> pete-woods: just updated to OTA14, it was broken on OTA13 since last week, no idea of a cause
<AlanBell> figured I would update to OTA14 to see if it would sort itself out
<pmcgowan> that sounds like the stale lock file problem
<pmcgowan> AlanBell, do you have this file .config/connectivity-service/config.ini.lock
<AlanBell> I do indeed
<pmcgowan> please to delete it
<pmcgowan> and restart
<AlanBell> -rw-r--r-- 1 phablet phablet   0 Nov 29 18:59 config.ini.lock
<AlanBell> yay, thanks pmcgowan \o/
<pmcgowan> great, I hate that bug
<mterry> dobey: does this MP make sense these days? (now that UAL does everything, and the click scope really does all apps, not just clicks): https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/unity-scope-click/allow-legacy/+merge/312383
<mterry> Or are we planning to handle apps a different way?
<dobey> mterry: i don't think so; on classic systems it will show a whole lot of stuff that won't work
<mterry> dobey: I thought UAL was supposed to be able to launch those?  (not very sure on that)
<mterry> dobey: if UAL gives you the app info, it should be able to launch it, right?
<dobey> mterry: no, legacy apps have to specify in the .desktop file that they work under unity8
<dobey> mterry: it doesn't magically run everything under xmir or anything there. the .desktop has to say whether it should
<mterry> dobey: I think it does have some magic there...  but regardless.  I think if it is feeding your scope an app it doesn't know how to handle, that's a UAL-side bug, right?  The scope shouldn't try to second guess UAL (in an ideal world)
<mterry> It seems that UAL is becoming the one-stop shop for launching
<mterry> Rather than merely an information broker
<dobey> mterry: well if that's also the case, then the patch is also still irrelevant, because it doesn't change anything
<mterry> dobey: it changes filtering some apps that don't report an ubuntu lifecycle
<dobey> mterry: but we still have to filter anyway, because we have bits in the scope to be able to hide apps like dialer on tablets without modems and such
<dobey> mterry: what new apps show up with that change?
<mterry> dobey: ok fine, I'm not saying never do intelligent filtering.  But this filtering (lifecycle) is a UAL-side decision is my point
<dobey> which don't support ubuntu lifecycle?
<mterry> dobey: I wrote it to try to get firefox to show up (but a separate UAL bug is stopping it there)
<mterry> UAL apparently knows enough now to try to launch such legacy apps in xmir I believe
<mterry> dobey: also note the pre-req I filed earlier -- the scope is ftbfs right now due to typical gmock stuff
<dobey> mterry: but gtk+ has a mir back-end, so most gtk+ apps don't technically need xmir, but they don't say they don't have X-Ubuntu-Touch=true in their .desktop files, so there is a lot of weirdness there
<dobey> as for firefox, the launching of snaps from the snap is supposed to be fixed i think, so not sure why we wouldn't just stick firefox in its own snap at this point really
<mterry> dobey: this is more of a tedg question I guess, whether UAL proposes to hide that weirdness from upper layers, but I thought that that was a promise it is trying to make
<mterry> dobey: (A) I don't think that snap launching is fixed yet and (B) we want firefox to be a snap, but we want upstream to be controlling that, not us
<luxpir> jgdx: thanks, I'll check there. chroot is so I can run taskwarrior, lynx and potentially mutt (although I have no space for the mailboxes at present) - not following your USS built in chroot + installed on phone point. To do with the mount --bind options I mentioned?
<jgdx> luxpir, I don't think the mounts matter for this issue. Could you remove the QML cache for system settings and try again? rm -r .cache/QML/Apps/ubuntu-system-settings/
<tedg> dobey: It depends on which interfaces their snap asks for nothing about their desktop file there. If the firefox snap asks for unity8, it gets Mir, if it asks for Unity7 it gets X11.
<tedg> mterry: I think that snap launching works now, there are a couple of apps that don't work for me, but I think it's their fault now.
<dobey> tedg: mterry is talking about having firefox as a legacy app, not a snap
<luxpir> jgdx: I do have the client.log you requested earlier if it helps - will try the qml cache
<tedg> mterry: If you know of one, I'd like to know about it.
<tedg> dobey: Oh
<tedg> dobey: We don't need to filter on supporting the lifecycle anymore I think.
<tedg> dobey: I think we can just show all the legacy apps, but that won't be for the U8 snap.
<tedg> dobey: It would only be for a deb based U8.
<luxpir> jgdx: what's that, rm -rf * ?
<jgdx> luxpir, yeah, could you pastebin it?
<dobey> tedg: well it would show whatever legacy apps are included in the u8 snap
<dobey> not sure what's there or not there
<jgdx> luxpir, rm -r is recursive remove, note I did not ask you to do rm -rf * :)
<dobey> but mterry is suggesting we would ship firefox in there until mozilla build their own snaps
<luxpir> jgdx: I kid, thanks :) - oOOOOh that's fixed it
<luxpir> jgdx: OK, what TF was that all about then... cache files for sys settings?
<jgdx> okay, sounds like you updated your system or something---such that uss was installed as a deb?
<jgdx> if uss is installed as a deb, the cache won't be deleted and you'll see random failures
<luxpir> not to my knowledge, unless the mount --binding did something when updating the chroot
<luxpir> (will post a followup to my request to the launchpad list) - whoever you are, jgdx, you deserve a large golden medal
<jgdx> luxpir, i work for canonical and on the system settings app, so no medal needed
<luxpir> that might explain things. still think a medal would be nice. much appreciated. when installing the chroot, I also set up tweakgeek and ut tweak tool... didn't do anything drastic there tho afaik. no idea why that occurred. hopefully this update will 'take back control' of the OTAs/updates?
<tedg> dobey: Nothing is there currently except system settings.
<jgdx> luxpir, yeah, it should. But just make sure your changes to the phone os are minor. I.e. install chroot, but don't do upgrade outside the chroot
<tedg> I'd not like to ship Firefox in the snap. That just seems silly. Use the webbrowser-app, it's already snapped.
<tedg> Someone should get mterry to write  deb2snap tool to make this quick and easy so we'd have a firefox snap.
<mterry> `:)
<luxpir> jgdx: roger that. thx again.
<dobey> or use chromium ;)
<mterry> tedg: I do intend to switch to webbrowser-app now, there was a miscommunication and it was left off the list of snaps we wanted to install
<dobey> oh i guess it's not snapped either
<mterry> dobey: chrome is I believe
<dobey> snap find chrom returns "champ"
<dobey> so if it is, snap find is awful :)
<mterry> dobey: it's edge only, I think it's called chrome-test or something silly
<mterry> dobey: snap find is awful yes
<dobey> oh
<sil2100> Yeah, it's completely useless most of the time I noticed
<matv1> hi all i am trying to  determine if there is any way in which I can force a user-agent with a browser session it the ut browser
<matv1> i am trying to connect to my companies office365 online(arghh the horror) website
<matv1> but it defaults to some really basic non-touch page
<matv1> it seems to be related to the user agent, which needs x11 as displayserver on linux apparently
<matv1> is this correct and if so, how do I do this in our ut browser?
<mterry> tedg: ugh right snapd 2.17 isn't in xenial-updates yet, so the apps don't auto-connect to ubuntu-platform.  That explains some of my app launch failing...
<mterry> Let me try the proposed snap
<pmcgowan> alex-abreu, may know ^
<mterry> matv1: I don't think there's an in-browser way to update the user agent
<mterry> matv1: but webapps can do so
<alex-abreu> pmcgowan, matv1 there are no settings for this afaik, you can only do it by updating the list of system installed overrides
<alex-abreu> matv1, you have to ssh to the device and update the list in /usr/lib/armhf/qt5/qml/Ubuntu/Web/ua-overrides-mobile.js
<pmcgowan> which I recall is just a javascript file on the device
<pmcgowan> aha
<matv1> alex-abreu tha is indeed usefull info. I will try that
<matv1> alex-abreu  could you  possibly point to the basics of changing the user-agent when building a webapp?
<matv1> i have built qml apps but never webapps
<matv1> or is that just inline js ?
<alex-abreu> matv1, sure this is just a command line option for those ... very simple --user-agent-string=''
<matv1> alex-abreu awsum that sounds foolproof :)
<alex-abreu> matv1, yes easy enough :)
 * matv1 cant believe he is contemplating a webapp for ms office 365
<dobey> mterry: looks like your gmock branch has a consistent test failure on all archs and on zesty and xenial
<pareidolia> Can anyone tell me where updates are downloaded to? My download of OTA 14 is completely stuck
<pareidolia> I've got SSH, want to kick it loose
<dobey> pareidolia: you can run "sudo system-image-cli -vvvv" to run the update from ssh, and the -vvvv should give fairly verbose output
<pareidolia> dobey: Awesome! Apparently it was done already
<pareidolia> dobey: It just booted straight into recovery
<pareidolia> This is like christmas already :)
<pareidolia> I hope I can switch off screen wakeup notification now
<dobey> cool
<pareidolia> Task switcher with icons is great
<pareidolia> I always look at icons, been missing that since android took it away
<pareidolia> Still no setting to get a non-mobile user agent in the browser tho
<dobey> what device?
<pareidolia> Meizu Pro 5 / Turbo
<dobey> though i've noticed lots of sites also have turned into sites designed primarily for mobile, regardless of what your user agent is
<pareidolia> I have no problem with responsive scaling
<dobey> no i don't mean they are scaling
<pareidolia> But I use a couple which force a redirect to a wap-era style m.domain.com
<pareidolia> And having the WAP experience on a premium device like this sucks
<dobey> i mean on my 24" 4K monitor in chromium i get a huge site that looks like a phone app
<pareidolia> Example?
<dobey> eh, it's not a WAP experience, it's just that some sites do m.foo instead of responsive layout
<dobey> like twitter
<dobey> the m site isn't WAP-ish (or at least, it shouldn't be)
<dobey> i thought that was supposed to be fixed now in the ubuntu browser anyway
<pareidolia> I meant that as rhetorical hyperbole
<pareidolia> Twitter is the worst
<pareidolia> Why can't I have the normal twitter on this powerhouse of a phone
<dobey> maybe it's not though :-/
<dobey> yeah i don't know what that means
<pareidolia> exaggeration for humorous effect
<pareidolia> Damn. Turning music volume down still kills my ringtone
<pareidolia> I've been missing a whole lot of calls llately lol
<pareidolia> Is there a way to scale the gui elements up when I am running a desktop app with libertine?
<pareidolia> XTerm looks absolutely tiny
<mterry> tedg: you might want to look at running latest silo snap with connected snaps (or snapd 2.17).  I get *some* successful launches (like gallery) but even then, there are two windows -- one just black and one real
<tedg> mterry: Yes, that's because they're unity7 apps, so we're starting Xmir for them.
<tedg> mterry: We should probably filter the MIR envvars to try to get them to be full X.
<mterry> Oh, you put snapd 2.18 in silo, cool
<tedg> Yeah, snapd 2.18+unity8 interface.
<mterry> let me try with snapd 2.18
<tedg> mterry: Okay, heading out for lunch right now, will be delayed in responding :-)
<mterry> tedg: you make it sound like the black window is expected and desired -- surely that's a bug right?
<mterry> tedg: k
<dobey> mterry: i thik it's expected, but obviously not desired (as xmir shouldn't be started for unity8 apps)
<dobey> mterry: ie, xmir is being started, but then the app is being run on mir itself; xmir shouldn't be started there, but that's what the "unity8" plug is for, is my understanding
<mterry> dobey: well they are also unity7 apps and can be launched either way
<mterry> presumably in unity7 mode, we should avoid the dual window
<dobey> mterry: yes, the "dual window" issue is a bug
<dobey> really i don't think we should be using the interface as the means to determine what display backend should be used
<dobey> there is just no good reason for those apps to be running under xmir under unity8
<mterry> pmcgowan: should we be using ubuntucoredev or canonical as the owning account for our snaps?  We currently have a mix (calculator and clock are ubuntucoredev, others are now canonical)
<pmcgowan> mterry, oy no idea
<pmcgowan> probably canonical
<pmcgowan> oh wait
<pmcgowan> mterry, no thats right since calculator and clock are community writtten
<mterry> pmcgowan: right but so are lots of the other apps that are currently canonical (like file manager, terminal -- right?)
<mterry> calendar
<pmcgowan> mterry, we have sortof taken those over
<mterry> k
 * mterry can't keep track
<pmcgowan> yeah
<mterry> well then we got the snaps right!  :)
<dobey> really they should be "ubuntu"
<dobey> the whole "ubuntucoredev" thing is weird
<dobey> because they weren't written by ~ubuntu-core-dev either
<mterry> oy ubuntu-app-platform isn't automatically installed when you install a snap that needs it
 * mterry adds that to unity8-snap-install
<dobey> seems like to me that "canonical" should really be for something like partner repo versus "ubuntu" which is the open archive.
<dobey> but alas
<mterry> Partner repo doesn't make sense in snap world, but I get ya
<dobey> right, wasn't trying to suggest it does; just using it as an example of separate "maybe proprietary stuff here" archive
<mterry> tedg: snapd 2.18 didn't autoconnect platform to apps for me...  But after manually connecting them, I get an error like this for calculator: Dec 08 13:10:31 drumbo audit[12459]: AVC apparmor="DENIED" operation="connect" profile="snap.ubuntu-calculator-app.ubuntu-calculator-app" name="/run/user/1002/snap.unity8-session/mir_socket" pid=12459 comm="qmlscene"
<mterry> requested_mask="wr" denied_mask="wr" fsuid=1002 ouid=1002
<mterry> tedg: so looks like our unity8 interface is not complete maybe (or calculator isn't setting it up right)
<dobey> mterry: but on the other hand, some of it does make sense. do we expect adobe will ship a snap of the flash plug-in for firefox/chromium/whatever to use?
<dobey> (also begs the question of how we will handle general plug-in type stuff in a snaps world)
<tsglove> Hey guys, n00b question on Ubuntu Touch... I want to flash one of my phones to run the latest version (Nexus 6P).    Can I run sms via Signal?  What about Telegram and Whatsapp?   Those are the main apps I would miss
<dobey> mterry: hmm, after installing and connecting the platform snap, i still get the "you need to connect the platform package with your app" error in the log
<dobey> tsglove: telegram is available, whatsapp is not. there's currently no way to change how SMS are handled on the application level; also there isn't a port for the 6P i don't think
<tsglove> dobey, ok... thank you!   Is there a non-Signal app for SMS?
<dobey> tsglove: there is the system provided messaging app that does SMS
<tsglove> dobey, awesome.  Thank you.  I think I'm going to give it a go!  =)
<mterry> dobey: I dunno, I didn't get that anymore after connecting, and graduated to the apparmor error
<mterry> dobey: filed https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/unity8-desktop-session/connect-platform/+merge/312855 to do the connecting for us using our script
<dobey> mterry: ah, no idea. this is on a classic vm
<mterry> I'm on classic too
<dobey> mterry: but you're running the unity8 snap right?
<mterry> yeah
<dobey> yeah, this is just xenial+overlay in a vm
<dobey> not sure if there is a difference there that matters for the platform bit, but eh. just sharing what i'm seeing :)
<HendriXXX> Anyone experiencing mobile connection drops with nexus4? After updating ota14 it just got worse. :(
<tedg> mterry: So I consider the XMir window a bug, but a bug in the app. Basically they're asking for it and then not using it. I think we can make it easier for them to detect that case, but fundamentally, if they lie to use we can't defend against that.
<tedg> mterry: Is the calculator in devmode?
<tedg> mterry: I don't know about 2.18 autoconnecting, I was really just focusing on getting it so that unity8 gets listed in "snap intefaces"
<tedg> interfaces
<mterry> tedg: no
<mterry> (calc not in devmode)
<dobey> mterry: for your gmock branch you changed the ordering of arguments in an ASSERT_GT; either need to change the ordering back or change it to ASSERT_LT
<tedg> mterry: Hmm, yeah, that must be a bug in the interface :-(
<mterry> dobey: guh!  that explains the failure, thanks.  I had tried to do some ordering cleanup as I went, but guess I wasn't very careful.  Will fix
<dobey> tedg: i don't think the app is lying. it's not
<mterry> tedg: does that mean we have to fix snapd again?  :(
<tedg> mterry: Well, I mean I need to fix my branch, I'm not sure that's "fixing snapd" but I'll work on it.
<mterry> tedg: I was just curious if that meant that we need like snapd 2.20 for it to work right or if it's a fix in a project that's more nimble
<mterry> I didn't know if unity8 interface definition lives in snapd or not -- I'm guessing it could live elsewhere since we want those to be user-generatable
<dobey> i think interfaces have to be defined in snapd
<mterry> ChrisTownsend: can you look at https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/unity8-desktop-session/connect-platform/+merge/312855 sometime?  I'd like to land that to make running snaps in u8 easier
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: ok, sure
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: I trust you've tested this?  I don't have a machine available at the moment to test this out.
<mterry> ChrisTownsend: I did yeah
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: Ok, thought so:)  Next question, why is the webbrowser snap treated differently?
<mterry> ChrisTownsend: because it doesn't yet use the ubuntu-app-platform snap
<mterry> ChrisTownsend: so don't want to try to connect it yet
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: Ok, makes sense.
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: I'll approve since I trust you:)
<mterry> I'll test again once silo builds it
<mterry> for double sanity
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: ack
<mterry> ChrisTownsend: any objections to a silo with just this or do you know of anything else that should get thrown in?
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: That one should be fine.  We release unity8-desktop-session like most other packages.
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: There are only two other MP's, one of which is yours.
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: https://code.launchpad.net/unity8-desktop-session/+activereviews
<ChrisTownsend> mterry: And I don't know what nick is doing with that other one.
<mterry> My other branch shouldn't land yet.  OK, just this one
<tedg> mterry: So the interface is in snapd, but my package is not upstream yet. Just a branch. So we can be more agile before it lands.
<mterry> tedg: maybe the unity8/mir_socket interface issue is related to the fact that "snap interfaces" doesn't list unity8 on the left side of the list for me
<mterry> I have 2129's version of snapd
<dobey> mterry: did it restart after installing it?
<mterry> I had rebooted yeah
<tedg> mterry: Yeah, we need to add it to the unity8 snap, but considering it is in devmode it should be fine.
<dobey> hmm
<dobey> ah yeah
<tedg> mterry: I guess perhaps we need to connect it to get the apparmor profile loaded though.
<mterry> tedg: ah yeah in our snapcraft.yaml, we need to expose the unity8 slot at a minimum I guess.  And then connect it to each app.  :-/
<tedg> mterry: I think I set it to autoconnect
<mterry> But still needs to have a slot, which we haven't exposed yet
<tedg> Yeah, trying to get a recent snap in the store now.
<tedg> Can work on improving it next :-)
<mterry> :)
<tedg> This is harder than it should be :-/
<mterry> New frontier!
<mterry> No cowpaths yet
<dobey> but lots of dysentery
<dobey> mterry: i hope jibel won't hate me, but i'm going to land that gmock fix without QA, since it's a tests-only build time change and fixes the FTBFS in zesty.
#ubuntu-touch 2016-12-09
<matv2> mhm is this a regression? bringing up a private browser instance from the regular browser, gives no osk. Not even on touching the addres bar. You cant input adresses.
<matv2> this is on both my devices
<matv2> but both are on rc_proposed.
<matv2> could some one verify if this also snuk into ota14 ?
<matv2> weird thing is: when you swipe out the app spread, and then go back to that private browser instance, one does magically get an osk
<matv2> This suggests that this may not be a browser issue
<matv2> anyoneone can tell me what I should file this against?
<matv2> popey do you perhaps know who the go-to man is for this?
<matv2> or woman :)
<popey> matv2: either oSoMoN or Elleo perhaps.
<popey> or maybe even ahayzen :)
<matv2> ok thanks
<matv2> oSoMoN ^^ would that be a browser issue you think?
<GeertB> Hello!
<matv2> GeertB \o/
<GeertB> I have a question about flashing
<matv2> GeertB just ask :)
<GeertB> I got a TWRP backup for the OnePlus One. I got the v15 working, but when I download v16 in the phone it needs to restart and install
<GeertB> And after restart it opens TWRP
<GeertB> And doesnt flah
<GeertB> Is there a ubuntu touch recovery needed?
<GeertB> Or where does is save the v16 so I can flash it manually
<ahayzen> popey, matv2, it sounds the same as comment #12 in https://bugs.launchpad.net/canonical-devices-system-image/+bug/1506753 ... which was then asked to open a bug in webbrowser-app but i'm not sure i that happened
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1506753 in ubuntu-keyboard (Ubuntu) "keyboard does pop up not after update to r26" [High,Incomplete]
<matv2> GeertB I have no idea about that sorry. is there no info on ubports on that? or maybe their irc channel or the telegram one
<GeertB> I only found this link, what is their irc channel?
<ahayzen> and when we had a look at it, it sounded pretty similar to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qtmir/+bug/1623861 so we wondered if qtubuntu regressed
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1623861 in Canonical System Image "Switching between two windows of the same app using quick swipe from right edge breaks focus" [High,Fix committed]
<ahayzen> Elleo, oSoMoN, did we get any further with that ^^ input bug ?
<matv2> GeertB i think it is just #ubports
<matv2> ahayzen right it is pretty much https://bugs.launchpad.net/canonical-devices-system-image/+bug/1506753/comments/12
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1506753 in ubuntu-keyboard (Ubuntu) "keyboard does pop up not after update to r26" [High,Incomplete]
<matv2> but that comment indeed describes a separate issue
<matv2> the only difference is that he works around it differently
<matv2> And the difference is that the bug is now consistant
<ahayzen> matv2, just of interest what device are you using ?
<matv2> ahayzen I use both the M10 and N4
<ahayzen> ok thanks
<matv2> both on rc_proposed
<matv2> so do you think i should just plus 1 on one of those existing bugs?
<ahayzen> well that bug in incomplete and they were told to open a new one...
<ahayzen> i'm just trying to see if i can see one against the webbrowser
<matv2> ah ok
<ahayzen> if there isn't then probably open one against webbrowser-app as suggested in comment #14
<matv2> ok shall i wait for you to check then
<ahayzen> matv2, i can't seem to find one, i'd open a new bug against webbrowser-app and then comment on the other bug with a link to it, so people know it is linked.
<matv2> ahayzen Right will do that. Thanks for looking
<matv2> ahayzen just out of interest though: were you not able to reproduce this?
<ahayzen> matv2, i need to update my rc-proposed device to check, but IIRC others we able to reproduce easily
<matv2> Wouldnt it have snuk into stable though? with ota 14
<ahayzen> i'm not sure, i'm trying to reproduce on my stable device at the moment
<matv2> cool cause that would be usefull info for the new bug
<Elleo> ahayzen: ah, yeah, I think we decided it was probably Mir focus related, I'll ping some Mir folks again today
<ahayzen> Elleo, thanks :-)
<matv2> Elleo your previous remark was still concerning the vanishing osk right? Maybe I better hold off on a new bug until we know what to file against?
<Elleo> matv2: yep, dednick's going to take a look into it from the Mir side later today :)
<matv2> awsum. If he needs any logs or testing or whatever he can ping me up.
<matv2> though that bug is pretty consistant know. not flaky or anything
<romain44> join #ubuntu-touch
<romain44> Hi! I wish I could get some information about a port on an Archos device
<romain44> I am not working for the company and I wanted to know if I could achieve without their support...
<romain44> Before I loose my time trying it
<romain44> Hum. Is there anyone here?
<romain44> It is the first time I am using freenode. Am i currently in the chat #ubuntu-touch ?
<k1l_> romain44: yes, you are
<pareidolia> Welcome!
<romain44> Thank you. :D
 * romain44 waves all
<romain44> (learning irc also)
<romain44> Unfortunately I must leave to the christmas party of my daughter. But I know it exists and will come back soon
 * romain44 waves all (saying good bye)
<rakete> does anyone else have the problem that the terminal just seems to freeze when starting it on bq aquaris m4.5?
<rakete> before the latest ota update the terminal appeared too large, and also freezed, now after the upgrade it appears correctly sized, but still freezes
<rakete> freeze means I can start it, it appears, but then I can use any of the buttons and no keyboard appears
<rakete> all I can do is close it again
<pmcgowan> rakete, does it prompt for your passcode?
<rakete> pmcgowan: nope, nothing
<dobey> rakete: "m" 4.5?
<rakete> whats it called? the small bq aquaris
<rakete> the first ubuntu phone that was released
<pmcgowan> yep e4.5
<pmcgowan> let me try here
<rakete> ah ok
<dobey> yeah e4.5
<pmcgowan> rakete, you may want to remove its qml cache, thats often an issue
<dobey> they have some mX.X phones too, which aren't supported by ubuntu
<rakete> how? i can ssh into the device
<pmcgowan> hmm
<pmcgowan> you can turn on developer mode and use the tools like phablet-shell or adb shell
<pmcgowan> if you have those
<rakete> mmh
<rakete> well, I meant, I can already ssh into the device
<rakete> but I am quite sure I have never enabled developer mode
<rakete> I have set up so I can ssh into it when I got it
<pmcgowan> rakete, oh ok, then yes, look in .cache/QML
<pmcgowan> and remove the one for terminal
<rakete> that did not fix the problem
<rakete> but, I remember I DID mess with it actually...
<rakete> http://askubuntu.com/questions/556041/why-ubuntu-touch-terminal-cannot-execute-app/621538#621538
<rakete> I did that
<rakete> so, I am going to see if that is the problem
<pmcgowan> rakete, check the syslog for any apparmor issue as well
<plars> sil2100: Hey, I'm planning to reboot heymann for some updates in about 2 hours. Any concern about jobs getting interfered with or anything?
<plars> sil2100: this is the one connected to most of the phones
<rakete> pmcgowan: nothing related to apparmor shows up in /var/log/syslog if I start the terminal
<rakete> and /var/lib/apparmor/profiles/click_com.ubuntu.terminal_terminal_0.7.198 looks like it is the default
<rakete> it actually contains the /** pix, line that I described on askubuntu, so that you can execute all commands from the terminal
<pmcgowan> rakete, last idea is this https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qtbase-opensource-src/+bug/1576989
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1576989 in qtbase-opensource-src (Ubuntu RTM) "stale lock files freeze apps" [High,Confirmed]
<rakete> I removed it to test, then the terminal won't open at all and I do get an apparmor error in syslog
<rakete> pmcgowan: yep, that was it!
<rakete> thanks for the help
<pmcgowan> oh cool
<pmcgowan> bad bug
<rakete> thats also useful to know when it happens for other qt apps
<ouroumov_> Guys I don't know what was done in OTA-14 but congrats to the dev team: My Aquaris E5 now has lower RAM usage and no longer SWAPs.
<ouroumov_> Thanks a lot ^^
<horuxan> hi all
<horuxan> help me please
<horuxan> to port ubuntu touch for moto g titan
<horuxan> xt1079 ?
<jamesc> I have a laptop that converts into a touch tablet. I am a developer how can I help the touch aspect of ubuntu
<pmcgowan> jamesc, there are two related efforts underway - one to provide Unity8 session on the desktop, using a snap package
<pmcgowan> and another to create an all snaps desktop image, using unity8 and all the convergent touch apps
<jamesc> How do I know which one to start. Is the first project add existing functionality to the desktop and the second like a whole mode change?
<jamesc> pmcgowan: do I need the phablet-tools or is that for android?
<dobey> phablet-tools is some some cli tools for ubuntu phones, but some can be used with android too
<pmcgowan> jamesc, the work I am talking about is on amd64 PC targeting convertible laptops
<dobey> jamesc: what is it that you want to accomplish exactly? i presume you have something in mind that you want to work on
<dobey> "ubuntu touch" has always been a misnomer
<jamesc> yes this is what I have. I have an lenovo yoga 700
<jamesc> I think scrolling down a webpage instead of selecting the text would be a small start. Or maybe I need to start smaller depending on how difficult this could be
<dobey> are you talking about firefox under unity7 or something?
<jamesc> firefox yes. I'm using ubuntu 16.04 lts is that Unity7 or 8 ?
<dobey> the "touch" gesture stuff under unity 7 and x11 isn't really what this channel is for (i know, the name is a bit confusing)
<jamesc> sure which channel do you suggest
<dobey> #ubuntu-desktop perhaps, though i don't know if anyone is really working on those bits
<jamesc> I even need to probably disable the keyboard first when its in tent mode. ok thanks
<dobey> this channel is about ubuntu on phones and such, with unity8/mir
#ubuntu-touch 2016-12-10
<Dragonkeeper> is there a commnd i can use to change/set an imei number  (android has this feature)
<Dragonkeeper> anyone alive here?
<LehKeda> hey
<LehKeda> I started porting ubuntu touch to my device , but I have some issues
<LehKeda> first system.img is just about 70MG so is that normal ?
<LehKeda> second boot.img is huge to fit on my boot partition so is there any way to get around this problem ?
<LehKeda> hey
<LehKeda> what is the size of system.img of any regular build ?
<NeKit> LehKeda, not very large
<NeKit> system.img is not to be flashed on /system
<LehKeda_> sorry , I had to re-enter again
<LehKeda_> anyway , where should system.img go ?
<LehKeda_> ?
#ubuntu-touch 2016-12-11
<LehKeda> hey
<LehKeda> I've problem with installing ubuntu-phone after building
<LehKeda> when I run this command ./rootstock-touch-install zesty-preinstalled-touch-armhf.tar.gz system.img it copies for sometime then reboot to recovery
<LehKeda> there is issue with this line adb push $TARPATH /recovery/ >/dev/null 2>&1
<LehKeda> anyidea ?
<muka> I'm trying WifiTransfer but it doesn't work. Can not connect. I'm using nexus 4 (mako).
<muka> how can I make a phone call via adb?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
<SebthreeBQM10HD> test link ota 14 http://google.co.uk
<SebthreeBQM10HD> xchay gnome
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hmm
<SebthreeBQM10HD> http://www.google.co.uk
<SebthreeBQM10HD> i guess in chat links still not clickable then:( but one from topic opended up firefox
<SebthreeBQM10HD> whats new in ota14 i dobt really see anything as such, but i read that this obe is mosyly bug fixes
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
<enthusi_> Hi
<enthusi_> are people in here using Ubuntu phones?
<enthusi_> I am currently on a Samsug S3 mini and need a change
<enthusi_> it seems no such ubuntu phones are readily available these days in DE?
<OerHeks> enthusi, see the topic / devices if yours is supported, i think it is not.
<enthusi> yes, none of those but I consider buying one specifically
<enthusi> but I have no clue which
<enthusi> a ready made ubuntu phone would have been nice but those are sold it it seems
<enthusi> but development is active? its not a sinking ship so to speak? :)
<OerHeks> enthusi, development is active, but growing slow.
<enthusi> yeah, unfortunately
<enthusi> people will shy away because there is no WhatsApp already :)
<enthusi> *sugh*
<enthusi> sigh
<enthusi> do you use it? on what phone if I may ask?
<enthusi> any brand/device you would recommend?
<OerHeks> enthusi, i know, whatsapp and facebook are a * must* .. no, i don't have a capable ubuntu-phone :-(
<SebthreeBQM10HD> enthusi, I have ubuntu phones
<SebthreeBQM10HD> enthusi, plus another type of Linux based phone, that oh can actsually run whatsapp as well
<SebthreeBQM10HD> etc
<SebthreeBQM10HD> actaully make that two for ones that can actsaully run whatsapp but not tried on either
<SebthreeBQM10HD> so why did i lose the background it changed to on ota 14 update on mx 4
<SebthreeBQM10HD> when I put a background
<SebthreeBQM10HD> for log in screen
<SebthreeBQM10HD> changed to a more yellowey one, but then lost that
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and no it's not there as an option in background images
<SebthreeBQM10HD> shame since that was also the like only thing i noticed that was new
<SebthreeBQM10HD> mx 4 had gone from ota 12 to 14
<pgp> hello everybody
<pgp> did someone tried to install ota14 on meizu mx6?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> pgp, no don't think so
<SebthreeBQM10HD> pgp, and that was just a remour or an apparnatly that  they would release a mx 6 ubuntu
<SebthreeBQM10HD> maybe next year i guess
<SebthreeBQM10HD> when already an old phon
<SebthreeBQM10HD> e
<SebthreeBQM10HD> pgp, maybe the software for putting Ubuntu onto a  Meizu MX 4  Android,would mostly work with   a MX 6 as well, or just brick the phone
<pgp> ok thank you! SebthreeBQM10HD
<erik__> hello
<erik__> how can i sync my device on debian?
<erik__> anybody here?
<erik__> hmm, bots only discussion ...
<erik__> bye
<muka> erik__, I use ssh and copy ~ dir
<Acou_Bass> i just run syncthing binary
<Acou_Bass> XD
<Acou_Bass> obviouslydont leave it running all day, just get home, plug phone in to charge, fire up syncthing
<Acou_Bass> leave for 10 minutes, come back its usually done
<Acou_Bass> SebthreeBQM10HD: out of curiosity, which linuxey phones do you have that can run whatsapp?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, the Jolla phone and Samsuing Z1 so the Tizen phone
<SebthreeBQM10HD> not tried on either though yet!
<Acou_Bass> ahh i loved sailfishOS, probably my favourite mobile OS yet
<Acou_Bass> not tried tizen yet ;(
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, yeah salifish can run most andorid apps
<SebthreeBQM10HD> same for tizen I guess
<SebthreeBQM10HD> so sa far as i Know whatsapp should be fine on those
<SebthreeBQM10HD> or fine enough
<Acou_Bass> i used it on a nexus so no alien-dalvik for me but aside from that it was a really nice OS hehe
<SebthreeBQM10HD> yep, but many will use it fr andrid apps or mostly rather than native
<Acou_Bass> i never used android anyway so i dont really miss android apps
<SebthreeBQM10HD> oh what did you use then?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> android has always annyed me  since adverts :d
<Acou_Bass> my first smartphone was an n900
<SebthreeBQM10HD> install some android apps and bang adverts
<Acou_Bass> after that i went to a firefoxOS phone
<SebthreeBQM10HD> not neassiary androids fualt but yeah
<SebthreeBQM10HD> yes I got a firefox os phone as well
<Acou_Bass> then once firefoxOS died i bought a nexus 4 and since then ive been switching between sailfish + ubuntu XD
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I been meaning t possibly buy a nexus 4  from some where
<SebthreeBQM10HD> so can change around oses eaisesr
<Acou_Bass> weirdly theres a (very unofficial, VERY VERY BUGGY) version of sailfishOS for my firefoxOS phone too so i played around on that a bit before i jumped to the nexus
<SebthreeBQM10HD> oh is there?
<Acou_Bass> yeah ZTE open C
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I got the Alcatel something
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, is that the ZTE maybe that they sold directly on ebay ?
<Acou_Bass> yeah it is
<SebthreeBQM10HD> oh missed out on that
<Acou_Bass> or was :P
<SebthreeBQM10HD> didn't know at the time etc
<SebthreeBQM10HD> back then would have thought they just sold in Afria or whatever and that was that
<Acou_Bass> i followed firefoxOS with interest so when my n900 borked (i did the typical yank the USB socket too hard..) it was prmetime to jump ship to firefox
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, anyway Tizen you can have that, just buy it directly from India or something, like I did :)
<Acou_Bass> hehe
<Acou_Bass> how is tizen though? whats app selection like
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I followed it here and there to
<SebthreeBQM10HD> or kind of
<SebthreeBQM10HD> boot 2 geck then changed to firefox os
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I Guess not enough
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, seems I haven't been following Jolla  / Salifish OS enough this year as well as I found out in October!
<Acou_Bass> is tizen still EFL-based?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Tizen is very much like Samsungs Android interface
<SebthreeBQM10HD> you would notice very little differnece, from what I Have seen
<Acou_Bass> ahh
<SebthreeBQM10HD> on smart watches it has a diffenret interface though
<SebthreeBQM10HD> they even had a stand at FOSDEM this year  that I was at for a bit
<Acou_Bass> funn
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, then to install Android apps, you need well first to be logged into your samsung account to use the phone
<Acou_Bass> i really think that was firefoxOS's advantage really, they basically jumped onto a platform with 10000 ready-made 'apps' already made for them XD
<SebthreeBQM10HD> then you can  download an app for running android apps
<Acou_Bass> ahhh cool
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and that app must be installed to run android apps
<Acou_Bass> with a non-jolla phone its a similar thing on sailfish
<SebthreeBQM10HD> salifish  they have android app support
<SebthreeBQM10HD> dont' need to add anything extra
<Acou_Bass> because you cant get the jolla dalvik thing on non-jolla phones youve gotta use some weird hacky 3rd-party method
<SebthreeBQM10HD> maybe not sure
<Acou_Bass> it is true of the nexus at least hehe
<Acou_Bass> its some licensing issue they have, theyre only licensed to release their dalvik thing on their own devices
<Acou_Bass> so 3rd-party ports dont get it
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, well  I read about a index intex whatever the company called
<Acou_Bass> so of course the community hacked their own thing together
<Acou_Bass> oh yeah i saw that
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, Salifhs OS phone that would be sold in India in the summer
<Acou_Bass> aquafish or something
<SebthreeBQM10HD> yep that's the one
<SebthreeBQM10HD> aquafish
<Acou_Bass> the one that had a controversial 3rd page for ads basically :D
<SebthreeBQM10HD> nice newer hardware specs etc :)
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I mean the jolla  phone is alright, but the hardware was already old really, wehn I got mine like three years or so ago
<Acou_Bass> sailfish doesnt really need newer hardware specs TBH - i found it ran like silk on my nexus 4
<Acou_Bass> must be a super lightweight OS
<SebthreeBQM10HD> indeed tjolla phone is basic hardware
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, anyway turns out there was a Jolla C phone as well that I missed it seems hmm
<Acou_Bass> yeahh
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, there's a guy all into Jolla from around here, well he works for them
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, he ports the OS to other devices etc
<Acou_Bass> im just not sure on jolla's future :( they seem to be going down the shitter which is a huge shame
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, so I was doing an event in october
<SebthreeBQM10HD> for Linux Presentation Day :0
<SebthreeBQM10HD> :)
<Acou_Bass> hehe
<SebthreeBQM10HD> but wanted to do mobile as well, not just desktop stuff
<SebthreeBQM10HD> wanted to creative common stuff  to make more intersgin to hoefpully to public as well
<SebthreeBQM10HD> background music,  open movies
<erik__> hello again
<SebthreeBQM10HD> some graphics
<Acou_Bass> yeahh
<SebthreeBQM10HD> so yeah did all that
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, and got in contact with the guy,  and yes he could come along :)
<SebthreeBQM10HD> had mett him about a year or two before at my LUG, and nearly did for a FOSDEM to, but nop9e
<SebthreeBQM10HD> so he meniotend some jolla c in a email wehn I asked what he could bring
<Acou_Bass> theres a LUG in my city but i havent been able to go yet... maybe in the new year
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, but the aquafish has pretty much the same specs according to another guy
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, where is your city ?
<Acou_Bass> manchester UK hehe
<Acou_Bass> manlug :D
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, I  got my jolla on a old version of salifhs still as well since...
<SebthreeBQM10HD> may keep it so
<SebthreeBQM10HD> for ages
<SebthreeBQM10HD> like I am doing with one of my ubuntu phones
<Acou_Bass> oh? whys that
<SebthreeBQM10HD> can show people the past and thep resent then , the changes a bit as well at times if doing that
<Acou_Bass> ahhh true
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, since I thought it might have swapped with that guys jolla phone, that was partly it
<SebthreeBQM10HD> but then didn't do much with it
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I had to factory re set before all that to
<SebthreeBQM10HD> then you get other devices and what not as well
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, I think Salifish OS can currently do a load more than say Ubuntu Touch, with it's ANdroid support
<SebthreeBQM10HD> app support, but
<Acou_Bass> yepp right now it can (and its native apps for the most part are a hell of a lot better too)
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I am more interested in Ubuntu Touch really, where things seem to be going etc
<SebthreeBQM10HD> it's taking time, but yeah
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Ubuntu touch will merge into Ubuntu personal to etc
<Acou_Bass> yeah thats sort of my take on it too - *right now* sailfish is the better OS - but it seems to have stagnated whereas ubuntu touch is going places :D
<SebthreeBQM10HD> same interface Unity 8 and code base with everything with a screen etc.  libertine working nicely on the desktop to for older xorg stuff, not just phone and tablet etc
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, you could say Android is the better OS right now even, if  you want loads of those apps
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and such
<erik__> UT upgrade (13 to 14) isn't working with twrp on the device. why does the upgrade need access to the recovery?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, or Remix OS  based on it
<Acou_Bass> i dont think libertine is going to be around much longer to be honest... once click packages come to the phone there wont really be any need for libertine XD
<SebthreeBQM10HD> but Ubuntu touch is the one that weill interesting stuff is going to happen to it for sure
<Acou_Bass> clicks should support Xmir transparently
<SebthreeBQM10HD> in the next two years or so it seems
<Acou_Bass> at least thats what i was told in here last time i asked about it
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, not everything will be ported to whatever though
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, so for running older programs, libertine has it's use
<Acou_Bass> yeah i suppose anything that people dont make snaps for (i meant snaps, not clicks) XD
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, I am in Engalnd to by the way
<Acou_Bass> ooh? whereabouts
<SebthreeBQM10HD> near  Bristol
<Acou_Bass> ahhh nice ;D
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, so we had a Bristol Linux Presetation Day event in October of this year
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, the 3rd UK  LUG to have one,  the 3rd group in general
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, now this is a nice idea http://linux-presentation-day.org
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I intend to organise two more next year as well
<SebthreeBQM10HD> it's meant to be two per year really for each group
<SebthreeBQM10HD> oh sure there have been similar things like that before, but not quite ike that
<Acou_Bass> ahhh thats awesome
<SebthreeBQM10HD> seems it's going to a bit more global next time as well
<SebthreeBQM10HD> not just euroope :)
<Acou_Bass> so like a cross-country 'LUG' for doing presentations
<Acou_Bass> sweet
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, no it's a way to show the pubic linux
<SebthreeBQM10HD> get  them into it etc
<Acou_Bass> well yeah
<Acou_Bass> but its sort of like an event except lots of them at once.. sort of? XD
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, but desktop linux wel lwe know it's good but
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, but mobile is where it's at a lot now
<SebthreeBQM10HD> desktop comput8ing uhmm not used as much by pe9ple in general
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and Windows 10 kind of works or enough hmm
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and Macs to so
<Acou_Bass> youd be surprised... desktops arent as dead as people think XD and especially not laptops
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, well peole sito n the us iwth phones and such
<SebthreeBQM10HD> not lap tops now or rarely
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass,  many home users rarely use lap tops or desktops now, since mobile phones etc
<Acou_Bass> ehh i suppose
<Acou_Bass> everyone in my house has a laptop each XD
<Acou_Bass> and we are not geeks ;p
<Acou_Bass> well i am
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, what Canonicala re trying to do with convergne is good
<SebthreeBQM10HD> ,but
<Acou_Bass> but mum and dad arent :D
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, how old are you?
<Acou_Bass> mid-20s ;D
<SebthreeBQM10HD> but not every9one will want the same interface on everything etc
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, ok late 20's for me
<Acou_Bass> from what ive seen with my parents, having the same interface on everything is a good thing... my mum can switch between her phone and tablet without even thinking about it because android is android
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, I think how  Ubuntu Touch or perosnal whatever
<Acou_Bass> and she runs gnome on her laptop so its almost similar
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, will be able to run lots of standard xorg programs is a good thing right there
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and easilly, in a graph8ical way, so not there yet
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, lots of great quality standard linux programs :)
<SebthreeBQM10HD> over 20 years wroth really I guess
<Acou_Bass> like i reckon snaps should be able to sort that as long as X apps are made into snaps, but for joe average they probably wont even need to use them if there are enough 'native' touch/convergence apps made
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, however bare in mind, that most of that will not be ported over to  mir or wayland, so yeah libertine has it's purpoouse still
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and xmir
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and yeah
<Acou_Bass> have you ever used gnome on wayland? 'legacy' applications is completely transparent, you dont even know about it
<Acou_Bass> firefox just works without a hitch
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, anyway using having a ubuntu phone or tablet is nice, since it's like a glimpse, a preview of the feuture, what's to come, waht's to come, or kind of thing that is to come, to the desktop as well, etc
<Acou_Bass> wayland is there already, mir isnt sadly, but it will be :D
<SebthreeBQM10HD> nope not used gnome on wayland, but yes that's how it's meant to be, meant to just work, as long as the  graphics card can support it
<SebthreeBQM10HD> otherwise with say fedora 25 they get xorg instead
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I read
<Acou_Bass> yeah they do
<SebthreeBQM10HD> mir is thighed to Ubuntu
<Acou_Bass> but yepp, wayland with gnome just works even with Xorg apps
<SebthreeBQM10HD> no one else wants otu se mir really
<Acou_Bass> theyre right there in the applications menuw here they belong
<SebthreeBQM10HD> did read a nice blog post about mir, and how it could be used by others
<SebthreeBQM10HD> from soimeone from Canonical i think it was
<Acou_Bass> yah
<SebthreeBQM10HD> but pretty much every other distro  will go Wayland not Mir
<SebthreeBQM10HD> they also won't go Unity 8
<SebthreeBQM10HD> or any tiime soon
<SebthreeBQM10HD> technical and political reasons
<Acou_Bass> meh im fine with that
<Acou_Bass> let canonical do their own thing
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I am thinking that to reallly
<SebthreeBQM10HD> plus I lik new stuff
<SebthreeBQM10HD> that can seeen etc
<Acou_Bass> my theory is
<SebthreeBQM10HD> other distros aren't really inovating much like that now so
<Acou_Bass> rather tan us all just going to wayland mindlessly
<Acou_Bass> we get TWO great new display serves
<SebthreeBQM10HD> since they all tend to use pretty much the same thing from upstream so
<Acou_Bass> and the best one will win ;D
<SebthreeBQM10HD> with therir branding changeing and such and that's about it
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, no I think choice is good ;)
<Acou_Bass> if wayland crashes and burns we can all jump ship to mir and port our other DE's to it
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, imagine going to the sweet shop, and all you had, was a Mars bar and a Twixx, how boring ?
<Acou_Bass> if mir crashes and burns we can all  jump to wayland
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, altough on the subject of eating things, there should probably be much less meaty choices, or at a higher price :d,  but that's another topic
<Acou_Bass> i dont thinkmany chocolate bars contain meat anyway
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, they don't, but some will contain gelatine, not what I was getting into though
<Acou_Bass> XD
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass,  meat in general, seems to be cheaper than vegetarian or vegan food at times, that's wrong!
 * SebthreeBQM10HD went veggie for ethical moral reasons :d
<Acou_Bass> yeah well we all have our moral passions, i personally wont use motor vehicles xD but thats just me
<SebthreeBQM10HD> what you don't go in cars ?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> or buses ?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> or planes ?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> or trains
<Acou_Bass> definitely not cars if i can help it (im not saying i NEVER will, but i wont drive one and will avoid when possible)
<Acou_Bass> XD
<SebthreeBQM10HD> whys that ?
<Acou_Bass> because theyre RIDICULOUSLY dangerous for a start
<SebthreeBQM10HD> why you think that?
<Acou_Bass> motor crashes account for nearly all of human deaths (its basically the only un-natural cause of death in the top 5 causes of human deaths...)
<SebthreeBQM10HD> uh my older brother just went some whre he could have walked easy, in the car
<Acou_Bass> y'know behind things like heart disease and certain cancers
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, are you a guy or girl :d ?
<Acou_Bass> i genuinely believe 'car culture' is probably the worst thing to have happened in our modern times, its absolutely terrible
<Acou_Bass> im a guy
<SebthreeBQM10HD> not a worrying girl, oh  h eh :D
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, cars pollut the world
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, it sucks how to do something more proper, usaully havev to travel miles to
<Acou_Bass> honestly the pollution is terrible, yes, but the cultural affects IMO are just as bad
<SebthreeBQM10HD> since how the world is set up
<SebthreeBQM10HD> the cultural effects such as?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and certain people would say tech in genera l is bad, so computers etc to
<Acou_Bass> like i said, thousands of people dying all the time from motor crashes and the rest of the world just shrugging their shoulders going 'oh well, cars are good'
<Acou_Bass> the fact that our cities are built for cars with only a tiny amount of space in the city for other things
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I don't live in a city :)
<SebthreeBQM10HD> but yeah manchester willl be busy
<Acou_Bass> cars make people lazy
<SebthreeBQM10HD> they do yes
<Acou_Bass> its the spacing thing, and the people dying all the time thing that bothers me most
<SebthreeBQM10HD> its annoying how go to travel for miles for lots of things
<Acou_Bass> and instead of actually tackling the problem of cars being dangerous, they tell other members of the public to wear stupid clothing so car drivers can see them better
<SebthreeBQM10HD> so transport
<Acou_Bass> as though thatll fix anything
<Acou_Bass> its disgusting and it wont change until our govt sees the problem and makes changes to our infrastructure to prevent it
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, sure it will :d a nice multi coloured Ubuntu top of some sort
<Acou_Bass> XD
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, with a nice orange Ubuntu cap as well :d
<Acou_Bass> i have an arch linux cycling shirt, does that count?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> maybe
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, I have lots of geek t-shirts now
<SebthreeBQM10HD> since done FOSEM the last six years
<Acou_Bass> i hardly have any, i need to pad my wardrobe out a bit with them
<SebthreeBQM10HD> oh and OGG Camp to, wasn't one this year
<SebthreeBQM10HD> since 2012 for both events
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, intending on going again in Feburaruy, but wil lbe diffenret
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, the project I been invovled with here and there, won't have a stand this time, etc
<Acou_Bass> where is it?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Brussels
<Acou_Bass> ahhh
<SebthreeBQM10HD> or near
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, it's the   llike best open source event in Europe though, or pretty much
<Acou_Bass> yeahh
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, I even got to meet and chat to and shake hands  with Mark Shuttleworth briefly there this year :)
<Acou_Bass> did you show him your ubuntu phone, and make sure hes got one too?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass,  h eh no
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass,  it was after a talk, some guy kept on answering questions inside of speaker
<Acou_Bass> ahh
<SebthreeBQM10HD> then it clicked, oh yeah I recognise that voice, ah right of course it's
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, I had already mettt Richard Stallman for eaxmple and chatted to breifly etc
<SebthreeBQM10HD> tried to get his  signature in not a great way actsaully h  e h
<Acou_Bass> 0,o
<Acou_Bass> whatd you do
<Acou_Bass> hand him a macbook?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> h eh no
<SebthreeBQM10HD> anyway so Mark ok :)
<SebthreeBQM10HD> some other guy went to mark first I think first, same kind of reason
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, but yeah you get to meet some of these interesting peopple at events etc
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Stallman was a specfic talk though that happended in Bath
<SebthreeBQM10HD> two hours of him chatting
<SebthreeBQM10HD> non stop except water brakes and such
<Acou_Bass> did he do Q&A or anything?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> at the end a bit I think so
<SebthreeBQM10HD> stallman
<SebthreeBQM10HD> yes he did
<Acou_Bass> i really think the Q&A format lends itself better for people like stallman who are maybe seen as a bit radical
<SebthreeBQM10HD> soemone asked him a question to do with the bsd slisnce
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and if htat was ok enough to use or not in certain situations
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, Stallman is ok
<Acou_Bass> oh yeah im not saying he isnt :D but y'know to the general public they might see his ideas as crazy, and so a Q&A i think is better for that sort of thing
<Acou_Bass> rather than him just preaching to a crowd
<Acou_Bass> get people to really see how his ideals affect them
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, yes he comes across a bitt crazzy to many it seems, but eh
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, people don't genrally care enough about tech, just want to use something that works etc
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I remember reading the GNU philospey at 17
<SebthreeBQM10HD> thinking like yes
<SebthreeBQM10HD> yes this makes sense
<Acou_Bass> you dont have to convince me of that, i run fully-free distros on my machines except for my PC and my ubuntu phone XD
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and agreeing to most things I had read as well
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, well ther eisn't really a ethical phone os in that sense or enough?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> well there's like a android altenriav thing
<SebthreeBQM10HD> or based
<Acou_Bass> yeah
<Acou_Bass> replicant
<SebthreeBQM10HD> repicant yeah
<Acou_Bass> but even then youre using the baseband blobs
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and there are ubuntu veriosns without the   stuff to
<Acou_Bass> but i suppose thats no different to the nonfree BIOS's
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and to connect to a network you use non free software
<SebthreeBQM10HD> not much choice there it seems
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, not may change bios
<Acou_Bass> my laptop just works with linux-libre, even though its not advertised as such XD i reckon most people would be in a similar boat if they tried it
<SebthreeBQM10HD> linux libre as in a general terem ?
<Acou_Bass> no linux-libre is a build of the linux kernel with zero proprietary blobs in it
<Acou_Bass> it ships on fully-free FSF-approved distros hehe
<SebthreeBQM10HD> oh and  sofftware freedom activist :d Acou_Bass  Ubuntu phone you said! right BAD BOY!  that's not free enough and will tigh people into Canonical
<SebthreeBQM10HD> h eh
<Acou_Bass> meh, its better than android :D
<Acou_Bass> and sailfishOS is very proprietary too
<Acou_Bass> most of the top layer is proprietary
<SebthreeBQM10HD> yes so people say
<SebthreeBQM10HD> that salifish os is actaully quite propritary
<SebthreeBQM10HD> but hey it's linux based and nice os
<Acou_Bass> the day i can run guixSd on my phone i can die happy
<Acou_Bass> thatd be amazing
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, I genreallly prefer to use free software, but will use what works to
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, what annoys me a bit is the whole people who think they need Microsoft OFfice, when don't really
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, or Adoboe photoshop
<SebthreeBQM10HD> or that LInux sucks really since propritary gaming that a bit to
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, oh and my Ubuntu tablet can run Libre Office :)
<Acou_Bass> games are a tricky one to work around... you cant exactly just make a FOSS alternative to call of duty or GTA5 and expect people to switch to it, they expect the real thing hehe
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, it's nice having a stand to help out at FOSDEM, when don't want to go to to many talks
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, but the distro I been invovled wiht didn't get accepted this year as a stand
<SebthreeBQM10HD> so many projects want a stand at FOSDEM you see
<Acou_Bass> i can imagine :O
<SebthreeBQM10HD> double then they can havev
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I think tehy are trying to let projects in that are enwer more now, or had a break
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I see BSD is back for example
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, this is reminding me, but might seei if I can help at the libre office stand maybe :d
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, might bring my Ubuntu tablet along to, so can show people it running libre office :d
<SebthreeBQM10HD> got a contact there or kind of thing
<Acou_Bass> if theres a guixSD stand say hi to those folks :D their distro is amazing
<Acou_Bass> or the nixos :D
<SebthreeBQM10HD> pluss it looked llike a fun one to help out the last few years
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, nixos maybe,  guixSD  no
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, Libre OFfice people are great, I been sent stuff twice now :) for events I had here
<Acou_Bass> hehe
<SebthreeBQM10HD> for free
<Acou_Bass> whats wrong with guix ;D
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, ok I didn't ask for anythig to major like t-shirts, but yes i got more than just stickers  and flyers last time so October :)
<Acou_Bass> XD awesome
<SebthreeBQM10HD> document foundation pin badges in a bag
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and ballons as well :)
<SebthreeBQM10HD> didn't end up using hte ballons, but next time will use some
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, green  libre office ballons with a free pump as well
<SebthreeBQM10HD> a blue free pump
<Acou_Bass> XD
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, there were some issues at the begning of the event etc,  so  dind't really have time to pump up ballons
<SebthreeBQM10HD> but next time well :) I guess
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, may be worth  bringin tablet along to show stuff like libe office
<Acou_Bass> i do want to attend events like this at some point, just not sure if/when ill be able to make my way to them
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, I mean even at FOSDEM, not that many people will have sen it on an Ubuntu tablet for real I expect so
<Acou_Bass> get a nexus 4 and get ubuntu on it, then you can show it on a PHONE:D
<SebthreeBQM10HD> that's not the commerical phone though
<Acou_Bass> hehe true
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, but annoying would hae to take tablet out at air port
<SebthreeBQM10HD> security
<SebthreeBQM10HD> they want those out
<SebthreeBQM10HD> !
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, plus  then do I bother with a bue too thekbyarod with my stand thing or not uh probaboy fi taking it, which one....   you get a load of extra stuff back with
<SebthreeBQM10HD> so don't want to go with too much as well
<Acou_Bass> XD
<Acou_Bass> true
<Acou_Bass> tablets ae good for that
<SebthreeBQM10HD> plus got a gaming tablet device thing to take iwth
<SebthreeBQM10HD> maybe two een
<Acou_Bass> all in one neat little package
<Acou_Bass> alrighty back later, time to eat :D (and cook me a pecan pie for our baking competition next week) WOO
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, I am more a marketing person
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, promotion
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, a baking competion oh ?
<OerHeks> A pie should not survive 7 days
<SebthreeBQM10HD> OerHeks, yeah true I guess
<Acou_Bass> OerHeks: well the competition is tomorrow
<Acou_Bass> yes my work is having a 'great british bake-off' competition
<Acou_Bass> :P
<SebthreeBQM10HD> whaat is your work
<SebthreeBQM10HD> ?
<Acou_Bass> i work at the head office of a sports fashion retailer hehe, not remotely IT-related
<Acou_Bass> :D
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, Sports Direct
<Acou_Bass> no, jd sports SebthreeBQM10HD
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, oh that branded one hmm
<SebthreeBQM10HD> Acou_Bass, but you shoudn't work there, since msot of their customers will come by motor vechiles :d
<LehKeda> can i edit rootstock-touch-install script to fit on my device ?
<Acou_Bass> SebthreeBQM10HD: i dont work on the JD sports part i work on their outdoors divison ;) all tents and bikes and walking gear ;D
<LehKeda> the phone stuck at bootlogo , is there any thing I can do ?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> lenikeda
<SebthreeBQM10HD> lenkeds
<SebthreeBQM10HD> lenkeda when which phone
<LehKeda> I'm porting to new device called samsung galaxy star
<LehKeda> I'm making a new build now with some kernel changes
<SebthreeBQM10HD> oh a port
<LehKeda> is ubuntu recovery is required ? I'm using twrp3.0.2
<SebthreeBQM10HD> well yeah things are likely to go wrong on any port
<SebthreeBQM10HD> there's like one guy doing ubuntu ports
<SebthreeBQM10HD> ubports
<SebthreeBQM10HD> but I think most of us won't know much about porting,  but could be wrong
<SebthreeBQM10HD> anyway I can't help you much either way
<LehKeda> ok , what about recovery ?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> you need developer mode to do ports
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I think
<SebthreeBQM10HD> if that's what you mean
<LehKeda> i mean must i use ubuntu recovery.img to get ubuntu working or any recovery will work ?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> what's the recoveyry image ?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> and I guess that's the thing to try
<LehKeda> afetr building ubuntu phone there are some .img files one of them is recovery.img that's what get loaded when you enter recovery mode
<SebthreeBQM10HD> try tht i don't know though
<LehKeda> ok
<Errmake> hey guys i'm doing a project based on ubuntu touch,I can't find anywhere how ubuntu touch manages processes,energy,storage...
<t-ask> Hi, I have problem playing mp4 mkv videos which I downloaded via youtube-dl. With the newest OTA I can't replay almost all videos anymore. How can I fix this?
