#ubuntu-desktop 2008-12-16
<crevette> salut seb128
<seb128> lut crevette
<crevette> alors bien rentrÃ© ?
<crevette> pas trop fatiguÃ© par le decalage horaire ?
<seb128> j'suis rentrÃ©, pas fatiguÃ© non
<pedro_> bonjour seb128!
<seb128> hey pedro_
<pedro_> seb128: still jet lagged?
 * pedro_ feeling in a weird timezone
<seb128> pedro_: still? I've not been jet lagged
<pedro_> lucky...
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> pedro_: how many timezones difference do you have?
<seb128> pedro_: btw apport catch crashes not abort for example, I just reopened some of the crash bugs you closed
<seb128> pedro_: you need to ask for a gdb log in those cases
<pedro_> seb128: should be like 5 hours ahead of difference, so i'm waking up at like 4 am now eeek
<seb128> urg
<pedro_> seb128: alright, will do it
<seb128> I managed to go to bed to normal european time and sleep for 11 hours
<seb128> so all good for me ;-)
<mvo> pedro_: hey! I had a similar experience today, woke up at 5am, sucks
<pedro_> mvo: hello!, it sucks quite a lot indeed.. but seb128 seems to be inmune, we need to stole his secret
<seb128> lol
<pedro_> s/inmune/immune
<seb128> I woke up at 11:45 this morning ;-)
<seb128> and went to bed a bit before 1'o'clock
<mvo> seb128: 11:45 ;) ?
<seb128> mvo: yeah, a man need to get lunch ;-)
<seb128> and sleeping in the morning is what holidays are for too ;-)
<pedro_> mvo: are you involved with the update-manager product at the GNOME Bugzilla?
<pedro_> i've seen a couple of emails at the bugsquad mailing list regarding that product
<mvo> pedro_: michiels set it up a long time ago, but it is no longer really used
<pedro_> mvo: are you ok to close it then since launchpad is being used instead?
<mvo> pedro_: yes, that should be fine
<pedro_> mvo: I'll let upstream know, thanks you ;-)
<mvo> thanks pedro_
<mvo> awalton__: hey! did you already submit the ubuntu notification theme to upstream?
<seb128> pitti: the retracers are stopped since before uds right?
<pitti> seb128: hm, wasn't actually aware of that
<pitti> maybe they ran out of memory again?
<seb128> pitti: well, there is no screen running on ronne
<pitti> seb128: ah, was probably rebooted then
<seb128> pitti: so somebody destroyed those, I though you said before uds that you were taking those down to work on it or something
<seb128> pitti: weird, the uptime indicates there was no recent reboot
<pitti> seb128: no, I never kill the screen sessions
<seb128> ok, so somebody took those down and there has been no retracing for 2 weeks now
<renkertd> i have a problem
<renkertd> i get this message when i sign in and put in password under the ubuntu 8.10 desktop : GDM could not write to your authorization file
<renkertd> i can get into the system using he ctl alt F! key and can sign in
<rickspencer3> calling it day
<rickspencer3> see you all tomorrow
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-12-17
<crevette> hello gents
<seb128> is there anybody wanting to package libproxy? it's required to update libsoup and some other GNOME things
<crevette> hello
<seb128> lut crevette
<norsetto> hi seb128
<seb128> hey norsetto, how are you?
<norsetto> seb128: pretty fine thx, and you?
<seb128> good thanks
<lool> seb128: Hey
<seb128> lut lool
<lool> seb128: What do you think of pushing cheese as an intrepid SRU?
<lool> Is it too late for GNOME 2.24.2 updates?
<seb128> doit!
<seb128> no it's not
<lool> Erf
<seb128> it can probably wait for new year now, not sure if anybody will process srus before that anyway
<lool> Ok
<lool> seb128: Does it need a SRU bug?
<seb128> lool: yes
<seb128> ls
<lool> seb128: #309039
<seb128> lool: thanks
<crevette> seb128: can I help you for something I have 1 hour free (perhaps)
<crevette> (notice for later: have a day off, doesn't me you'll free time when you have a 3 months old baby)
<seb128> crevette: can try to do the nautilus-cd-burner or gnome-media update if you want
<crevette> oky docky
<crevette> seb128: if I got that right, n-c-b shouldn't depend on eel now
<crevette> as there won't be new release
<seb128> crevette: right, not sure if that's true yet though
<seb128> crevette: you can also try the totem-pl-parser, totem or deskbar-applet updates if you want
<seb128> or gnome-games
<seb128> everything else is probably blocked until new year, we don't want too many breakages before everybody runs away for holidays
<seb128> speaking about running I've to go now
<crevette> seb128: at least we can keep dependency on libeel until it is removed from archives right ?
<seb128> bbl
<seb128> crevette: correct
<crevette> thanks
<crevette> see you later
<seb128> crevette: I did the nautilus update but it's crashy so that will probably wait until new year too
<seb128> cheers
<seb128> bbl
<crevette> okay
<norsetto> what, totem-pl-parser needs updating again!?
<pochu> fta, asac: hey folks, could you have a look at bug 309108, comment 2? I've prepared an update for liferea, but I'm not sure if that change (comment 2) is correct
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 309108 in liferea "New upstream bugfix release 1.4.23" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/309108
<pochu> TIA :-)
<fta> looking..
<fta> pochu, it is needed, but it can be done differently
<pochu> fta: how?
<fta> by telling liferea to load only xul 1.9.0.* and not 1.9*
<fta> hold on
<fta> pochu, like this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/87290/
<fta> pochu, it should even be sent upstream
<dobey> just build it with gtkhtml2! :)
<pochu> dobey: liferea 1.5.x only support webkit now :)
<pochu> fta: thanks, looking
<dobey> :(
<pochu> dobey: any problems with webkit? :)
<dobey> unfortunately, yes
<dobey> and having to have N browsers installed to use my desktop, also sucks :)
<pochu> heh
<pochu> I thought webkit was a bit like gtkhmtl, but a lot heavier :)
<pochu> i.e. a renderer
<dobey> it's a bit like firefox, but doesn't provide it's own gui, really
<dobey> well, it provides a test gui
<dobey> but it's very simplistic
<dobey> it's like firefox, without the chrome :)
<pochu> the google chrome?
<dobey> i've done too much work on web stuff to appreciate all the fandom around webkit
<dobey> and i've seen too much of its own code
<fta> pochu, not google chrome ;) the mozilla chrome, ie, the part of firefox that specifies the ui. gecko (~ xulrunner) + some chrome + some stuff = firefox
<fta> pochu, google chrome is chromium + some stuff, chromium is based on webkit
<seb128> hey fta pochu
<pochu> oh my god, this is too complicated!
<pochu> hey hey seb128 :)
<pochu> seb128: how was UDS?
<dobey> yes, yes it is
<seb128> pochu: do you want to package libproxy for debian and ubuntu?
<seb128> pochu: good!
<seb128> pochu: it's required for GNOME 2.25
<fta> pochu, i have a package of chromium in my ppa. sort of.
<fta> seb128, hi
<pochu> seb128: I don't have a proxy :-) but I can package it. The problem will be with testing it!
<seb128> pochu: that's what unstable distros are for, testing
<pochu> seb128: but I usually like to test things before they are uploaded ;)
<seb128> pochu: if that's buggy people will complain soon enough ;-)
<pochu> you know, I once uploaded a broken package :P
<pochu> hehe
<seb128> pochu: well, it's not used a lot yet so you can't break a lot
<pochu> right
<pochu> seb128: I think I'll package it in pkg-gnome, but not maintain it myself
<pochu> i.e. put the team in Maintainer:
<seb128> pochu: ok
<dobey> seb128: oh, btw. is there a page on the ubuntu wiki that describes the process for getting a new package into ubuntu?
<pochu> seb128: I'll see if I can have a look at it tonight
<pochu> after I'm done with liferea :)
<seb128> pochu: thanks
<dobey> seb128: i'd like to get pynetworkmanager in for jaunty :)
<pochu> dobey: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<dobey> pochu: thanks!
<pochu> you're welcome!
<seb128> pochu has been faster than me apparently ;-)
<fta> hm, file-roller can't open .rar anymore, it's no longer registered
<fta> i still have unrar installed
<seb128> fta: it's not listed in the nautilus context menu?
<fta> i fact, *.rar is fine, *.r\d+ is not. regression in nautilus ?
<fta> in
<fta> only the rar file has the correct icon, the other parts have the default icon
<seb128> fta: are you sure that ever worked? you can open a .rar if you don't have the first chunk?
<fta> sure
<fta> i always select one file at random
<seb128> well, nautilus stopped using mimetype magic to open files it uses the filenames now
<seb128> it avoid all sort of annoying bugs or the warnings about the mimetype not matching the name
<seb128> and shared-mime-info probably doesn't have those listed
<fta> seb128, seems fine now. i just restarted nautilus
<seb128> weird
<pochu> aha!
<pochu> fta: your patch was perfectly
<pochu> without it I get the abort if I install xulrunner-1.9.1, with it liferea runs
<pochu> fta: thanks :-)
<fta> :)
<seb128> fta: want to do the cairo 1.8.6 update btw?
<seb128> somebody did a cairo sru for the printing issue btw so no real hurry getting a new version in intrepid
<pochu> asac: I'd appreciate if you could look at sponsoring bug 309108 :-)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 309108 in liferea "New upstream bugfix release 1.4.23" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/309108
<fta> seb128, yep, i have a patch from mozilla to add
<fta> mozilla bug 467874
<ubottu> Mozilla bug 467874 in GFX: Thebes "cairo calls FT_Done_Face on FT_Faces for unscaled_fonts created from_face" [Critical,Resolved: fixed] http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=467874
<fta> freedesktop bug 18862
<ubottu> Freedesktop bug 18862 in freetype font backend "cairo calls FT_Done_Face on FT_Faces for unscaled_fonts created from_face" [Critical,New] http://bugzilla.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18862
<seb128> ok
<pochu> fta: I'll look at forwarding your patch from bug 238958 too
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 238958 in liferea "always present window on current workspace if tray icon is clicked" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/238958
<fta> pochu, this one is weird. it worked for me for a while, it's broken again
<seb128> fta: the change is not in 1.8.6?
<fta> seb128, apparently not
<seb128> ok
<pochu> fta: it works fine for me in a jaunty vm
<fta> pochu, i suspect a problem in gtk as some other apps are impacted too
<fta> Jazzva, ^^
<pochu> fta: I can't reproduce it in Debian unstable/experimental
<pochu> I thought it could be due to me having metacity 2.22, so I'm gonna test with metacity 2.24
<pochu> fta: I mean, without the patch, liferea works properly
<fta> as i said, it's currently broken for me in jaunty
<Jazzva> I had been experiencing the same before, I'm unsure now, as I haven't used it in a while. I'll retest to see if I can reproduce it
<Jazzva> Weird, when I use metacity I can't get liferea to the current workspace at all, if it's visible on the other workspace. It also gets minimized on the other workspace.
<Jazzva> When I use compiz, liferea will go to systray on the first click, and then appear on the active workspace on the second click..
<pochu> bah
<pochu> I forgot ember's patch for integrating liferea with launchpad
 * pochu adds that patch
<fta> Jazzva, same for me (metacity)
<fta> but i wonder why no one else complained
<Jazzva> something similar is happening with rhythmbox... When it's visible on some other workspace, clicking on tray icon doesn't do anything...
<fta> and with deluge
<Jazzva> with compiz it's the same as with liferea - two clicks and it's on the visible workspace
<fta> but not with xchat
<Jazzva> right
<dobey> does anyone know anything about seahorse/gpg stuff?
<Jazzva> pidgin behaves like rhythmbox, too. except that with compiz it will move me to the ws where pidgin chat window is.
<pochu> dobey: something, but not much :)
<dobey> i can't seem to get it to cache my passphrase any more. and the settings dialog just says "<i>The thing we need, isn't running.</i>" in a very unhelpful manner
<pochu> what version?
<dobey> pochu: intrepid
<dobey> pochu: 2.24.2-0ubuntu1 for seahorse bits
<dobey> libgpgme11 is 1.16-2ubuntu1
<pochu> dobey: is the seahorse agent running?
<dobey> pochu: yes, seahorse-agent and seahorse-daemon are both alive it seems
<pochu> dobey: I know some people have had problems with seahorse-agent and gnome-keyring and that stuff, as the agent was moved, but I can't find yours, sorry
<pochu> ember: hey, liferea fails to build with your launchpad integration patch:
<dobey> i don't know
<dobey> it was working great until like last week
<dobey> i think i installed some update and it broke :(
<pochu> dobey: check /var/log/dpkg.log, perhaps you can see if you updated something related
<pochu> ember: http://emilio.pozuelo.org/~deb/liferea_1.4.23-0ubuntu1.dsc, try to build it please :)
<dobey> searching doesn't show anything obvious :(
<mvo> there is also /var/log/apt/term.log and the synaptic log under File/History that update-manager uses too (both easier to read than dpkg.log)
<mvo> not sure if that is helpful (if dpkg.log contains nothing useful)
<crevette_> hello
<woodenfox> Anyone here?
<pochu> dunno
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-12-18
<hggdh> that was a marvelous answer, pochu ;-)
<pochu> hehe
<pochu> I hope it didn't sound too bad :)
<hggdh> no, it did not (at least to me)
<ember> pochu the patch ftbfs or doesn't apply?
<pochu> ember: ftbfs.
<ember> with undef ?
<pochu> ember: sorry?
<ember> pochu the error of the ftbfs?
<hggdh> calc, ping
<ember> well pochu that ftbfs is due to the autoconf patch
<ember> the autoconf patch didn't catch up the launchpad-integration on configure.in and it needs
<pochu> ember: oh, right
<pochu> ember: sorry about that
<pochu> I'll try to fix it tomorrow if I have time
<ember> np, thanks
<pochu> gtg to bed, too late here
 * pochu waves good night :)
<ember> good night
<calc> hggdh: hi
<calc> hggdh: whats up?
<calc> hggdh: i'm at a loco meeting so didn't see your message earlier
<hggdh> calc, np -- it was about bug 303528
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 303528 in evolution "Message Filters targeting IMAP folders point to local@local" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/303528
<hggdh> but I cleared it up with slangasek -- I was indeed marking wrong
<calc> hggdh: oh ok
<calc> hggdh: i wasn't sure after hearing that apparently ubuntu desktop team uses fixed committed differently
<hggdh> yes, we do
<rlaager> So, Fix Committed is upstream or for the package (but not released)?
<hggdh> that was my understanding and this was how we always did. But... work has had me out for a while. I will check out with seb tomorrow
<hggdh> FWIW, we should have 2.24.2.1 soon out, perhaps before end of next week
<hggdh> (I mean upstream)
<hggdh> rlaager, correct
<rlaager> hggdh: I was asking which of those two options.
<hggdh> both... if it is for the upstream task, then fix commited is when they commit to SVN (or whatever); if it is for an Ubuntu task, only when it is in a local
<hggdh> SCCS, or in -proposed
<hggdh> although I personally do not see how 'fix committed' can ever be used for an upstream task. Ah well
<duanedesign> A feature request that is asking for a different arrow  icon depending on whether or not a CD is in the  drive.Would the appropriatte package be nautilus or  human-theme. Is nautilus capable of changing the icon based on the status?
<dobey> a different arrow icon? you mean a different icon that also means "eject the drive tray"?
<duanedesign> the person who submitted the bug was requesting the ejevt icon be different depending on whether or not a cd was in the drive
<dobey> what would the icon be for no disc in the drive?
<dobey> it's not like the button on the hardware has a different icon based on whether or not there is a disc there or not
<jmarsden> dobey: You could have an arrow over a disc-like thing when there is a disk in the drive, and a plain arrow when the drive is empty?
<dobey> it's always the same |> icon
<dobey> jmarsden: i really don't think it makes sense to do that
<jmarsden> dobey: It is the same now, there is a request to change that ;)
<duanedesign> In Intrepid the icon to the left changes from a cd drive to a cd standing up. The orange arrow does not.  I suggested modifying the icon that already changes.
<jmarsden> Then add a comment to the bug report explaining your reasoning.
<dobey> i know what it is now, and i know what the request is
<dobey> what bug?
<duanedesign> I already had it changed to wishlist
<jmarsden> bug 309146
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 309146 in nautilus "change eject icon on CD / DVD drive when no media present" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/309146
<duanedesign> I am half wanting to know for the report and half because I am new to triage and am trying to learn as much as possible:)
<duanedesign> thats it
<dobey> sh, erll
<dobey> err
<dobey> ah, well
 * dobey is perhaps "a little more knowledgeable" in the area of icon themes and such
<duanedesign> cool thank you
<duanedesign> I noticed while testing this that the text also changes to the CD's name (in addition to the icon on the left)
<dobey> sort of
<dobey> it's not necessarily that it "changes"
<dobey> it's more like "the mounted volume appears" and "the drive disappears"
<duanedesign> ohhhh
<duanedesign> ;)
<duanedesign>  thank you again for the help.
<dobey> sure
<pochu> mvo: thanks for the upload! :)
<mvo> pochu:  thanks for the update :)
<mvo> ember: I be happy to sponsor tomboy and brasero when the milestone freeze is over
<mvo> s/I be/I will e/
<mvo> njpatel: hi, netbook-launcher in jaunty probably needs a libgnomeui-2.0 pkgconfig check/addition in jaunty somehwere (just FYI, not urgent or anything)
<Flegel> hi all ! =) can you help me with pam ?
<njpatel> mvo: Okay thanks, I'll add it to the todo :-)
 * mvo hugs pedro_ (just because)
 * pedro_ hugs mvo back
<crevette> salut seb128
<crevette> ca va bien ?
<seb128> lut crevette
<seb128> oui, et toi?
<crevette> ouep, day off encore aujourdhui
<crevette> :)
<crevette> okay let continue in english
<crevette> I've packaged nautilus-cd-burner but It FTBFS
<crevette> I did a patch
<seb128> what error?
<crevette> it uses a non existant gtk function
<seb128> which one?
<crevette> gtk_dialog_message instead of _new if I recall
<crevette> let me find that
<seb128> ah ok, did you ping upstream about that?
<crevette> yeap it was already fixed
<crevette> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=564889
<seb128> ok, so just backport the change
<ubottu> Gnome bug 564889 in cd-burner "n-c-b failed to build" [Major,Resolved: notabug]
<seb128> rebooting
<seb128> re
<seb128> crevette: so what is the issue after backporting the change?
<crevette> seb128: no one
<crevette> it works fine
<seb128> cool
<seb128> ready to be sponsored now then?
<crevette> however I have 2 questions
<crevette> now ncb create a menu in Applications-> System
<crevette> *creates*
<crevette> do we keep it ?
<seb128> what does it do? run nautilus-cd-burner?
<crevette> yep
<seb128> I would say it should be moved to video and sound or accessories
<crevette> I've suggested Accesories
<crevette> to myself only
<crevette> :)
<seb128> I would say that too
<seb128> we have brasero in video and sound though
<crevette> okay
<crevette> ah
<crevette> true
<seb128> well, we install brasero by default
<seb128> I would say we don't need to duplicate the feature so maybe don't list the nautilus-cd-burner entry by default
<crevette> seb128: yeah but ncb should have removed its entrey form the panel Raccourcis
<crevette> in my build it doens't seems to e removed, perhaps it is due to a patch in panel
<seb128> the menu is a gnome-panel one
<seb128> we didn't package the new version yet
<seb128> it's still available in nautilus and used when double clicking on an iso for example
<seb128> you can move it to accessories for now we will figure later what to do
<crevette> yep
<crevette> let's do that
<crevette> I do a patch right now, I've some free time
 * mvo waves to seb128
<seb128> hey mvo!
<mvo> seb128: something in the pkgconfig files changes it seems, some of the uploads needed a libgnomeui-dev b-d that was not needed before (just fyi)
<mvo> I haven't really digged into it
<seb128> mvo: GNOME is trying to reduce the number of libraries used, they are basically stopping using libgnome and libgnomeui when they can
<seb128> mvo: it's possible that some packages which use libgnomeui didn't claim the depends correctly and were working because other libs triggered the depends which they stop doing
<seb128> mvo: those should be fixed and depends directly on the libs they use
<vuntz> crevette: ncb will be removed upstream from the menu. I was just waiting that it gets a desktop file for the standard menu, and it got one now, iirc
<crevette> thanks my vuntzounet
<crevette> :)
<crevette> vuntz: I thought I was laready removed
<seb128> we will not get the new gnome-panel this year anyway so no hurry ;-)
<seb128> the warning about abi breakage doesn't seem somebody to upload the day before everybody runs in holidays
<vuntz> seb128: I wonder how many things can be impacted by the change
<vuntz> we fixed 3 issues in gnome, iirc. But they were all errors inside the modules (either they were not checking for libgnomeui in configure, or they were missing some include)
<vuntz> fwiw, I have a plan in case the change is too painful
<seb128> vuntz: speaking about the libgnomeui depends or the gnome-panel changes?
<vuntz> seb128: gnome-panel change
<vuntz> did libgnomeui have a change?
<seb128> vuntz: no, but what mvo mentionned before, gnome-desktop stopped depending on it which breaks some software which are using libgnomeui but not pkg-config-ing it
<vuntz> yeah
<vuntz> so, same issue for libpanel-applet
<seb128> let's fix the applications
<seb128> things which use a lib but doesn't pkg-config it correctly are buggy and should be fixed anyway
<vuntz> would be interesting to see the applications depending on gnome-desktop. I wonder what they use in there
<seb128> that's not really a breakage
<crevette> seb128: you can get the ncb files from https://edge.launchpad.net/~bmillemathias/+archive/
 * vuntz is planning to deprecate GnomeDesktopItem so we can remove it in a few cycles
<seb128> vuntz: compiz deskbar-applet eel2 eog epiphany-browser gnome-applets gnome-control-center gnome-desktop gnome-panel gnome-python-desktop gnome-screensaver gnome-settings-daemon gnome-utils nautilus trackers
<seb128> vuntz: that's what is using gnome-desktop in main
<seb128> vuntz: avant-window-navigator awn-extras-applets epiphany-browser galeon gnome-desktop-sharp2 gnome-launch-box gnome-main-menu go-home-applet icewm nautilus-open-terminal netbook-launcher quick-lounge-applet
<seb128> vuntz: and that's in universe
<vuntz> seb128: using rdepends?
<seb128> vuntz: using build-depends
<vuntz> oh, build-depends
<vuntz> cool
<seb128> vuntz: deskbar-applet does
<seb128> name=desktop.get_localestring(gnomedesktop.KEY_NAME),
<seb128> icon=desktop.get_string(gnomedesktop.KEY_ICON),
<seb128> for example
<vuntz> bah
<vuntz> maybe I'll make patches
<seb128> maybe they fixed it already, I've 2.25.1 there
<vuntz> how was uds, btw?
<seb128> good!
<seb128> as usual
<seb128> not so many interesting desktop sessions to be honest
<seb128> but was nice to see everybody again
<seb128> and lot of interesting discussions out of sessions
<vuntz> cool
<seb128> want to come to the next one? ;-)
<vuntz> don't know if I'll have time, if it makes sense, if people will want me, etc. Too early to guess :-)
<andreasn> where is it?
<andreasn> france?
<crevette> andreasn: in your living room :)
<andreasn> oh, with the cats and stuff
<andreasn> sure, works for me. Need to clean up a bit first though
<crevette> France would be nice, I might come
<andreasn> I better do that anyway, people coming over tomorrow
<seb128> andreasn: no, I would say spain but some people say catalonia is not spain
<seb128> vuntz: gnome-utils uses gnome_desktop_item_launch_on_screen()
<crevette> arfg
<crevette> as usual
<vuntz> andreasn: I have to blog about you!
<andreasn> vuntz: why?
<crevette> vuntz: its gf is pregnant ?
<vuntz> andreasn: you'll see :-)
<andreasn> I'll blog about you!
<andreasn> I have some really cool vuntz quotes that are actually real
<vuntz> I have some really cool andreasn quotes that are actually real
<seb128> vuntz: most of the gnome-desktop uses are light, I guess it'll be easy to replace those by something else
<andreasn> "every day, my first thought is that I'm just so greater than everybody on earth" - Vincent
<seb128> vuntz: I can make a list of everything using GnomeDesktopItem if you want
<vuntz> seb128: well, if you have really nothing to do, feel free to do so :-)
<seb128> vuntz: well, it's only doing an apt-get source on the list I gave you and grep
<vuntz> sure
<vuntz> actually, it'd be nice to be able to do so for any library
<vuntz> "analyze-libusage libwnck", eg
<seb128> vuntz: only 9 in main for this one
<seb128> and that's counting libwnck itself so rather 8
<vuntz> seb128: yep, but it'd be interesting to see what API are used, so that I can know if it's okay to remove an API, eg
<seb128> right
<seb128> doing "in what source is this api used" should be easy
<seb128> vuntz: there is 64 source files listing GnomeDesktopItem in ubuntu
<seb128> vuntz: which means 17 sources packages
<seb128> that's not too many changes to do
<seb128> gnome-python-desktop should probably not count since it's only wrapping it
<seb128> vuntz: the main offender seems to be libslab ;-)
<vuntz> seb128: heh
<seb128> vuntz: gnome-applets only use gnome_desktop_item_launch_on_screen() twice for example, should be easy to change
<vuntz> "kill it!" would be my way to go ;-)
<seb128>   if ((ditem = gnome_desktop_item_new_from_basename ("gnome-volume-control.desktop", 0, NULL))) {
<seb128>     gnome_desktop_item_set_launch_time (ditem, gtk_get_current_event_time ());
<seb128>     gnome_desktop_item_launch_on_screen (ditem, NULL,
<seb128> for example
<seb128> and same in the multiload applet
<dobey> hmm
<gicmo> seb128!!
<seb128> gicmo: !!
<seb128> how are you?
<gicmo> pretty good, how about you?
<seb128> gicmo: got a cold but otherwise good
<seb128> I blame the airplane, etc
<crevette> seb128: does going in nautilus preferenes makes it crash
<crevette> or anyone with latest jaunty
<seb128> crevette: no
<seb128> crevette: stacktrace?
<lapo> hi
<pochu> seb128: hey
<seb128> hello pochu
<gicmo> servus glatzor
<pochu> seb128: I think I have a libproxy package ready :)
<seb128> pochu: I've just seen you are working on libproxy on #gnome-debian ;-)
<seb128> cool
<gicmo> anybody going to package me the linux-iphone stuff?
<gicmo> ;-)
<pochu> seb128: I'm not sure of the plugins split though... I've put the networkmanager, gnome, kde, webkit and xulrunner plugins all in the same binary
<seb128> ah right, that too, maybe pochu wants to have a look too ;-)
<gicmo> http://matt.colyer.name/projects/iphone-linux/
<pochu> so it depends on a lot of libs
<seb128> pochu: I'll have a look later and let you know what I think
<pochu> seb128: cool, thanks :-)
<seb128> pochu: could be worth asking on #gnome-debian too what people think about that
<pochu> yeah, gonna do
<glatzor> servus gicmo
<pochu> can't has iphone :(
<pochu>  configure.ac |   11 ++++++-----
<pochu> ^-- I think that's my record with a configure patch :)
<pochu> and it was already fixed in trunk...
<gicmo> ups
<norsetto> pochu, good luck with your DD application, you deserve it ;-)
<asac> at some point in gnome i was able to see all the windows filesystem
<asac> s
<asac> that seems to be gone
<asac> when was that feature dumped?
<gicmo> asac, maybe with the transition from gnome-vfs to gvfs
<asac> hmm
<dobey> able to see in what sense?
<dobey> smb shares? or local vfat/ntfs partitions?
<gicmo> dobey, no matter what, my answer still applies ;-)
<asac> ntfs
<asac> but i think i found it
<dobey> gicmo: i don't think local partitions have anything to do with gnome-vfs/gvfs switch :)
<dobey> i can see them just fine in intrepid
<asac> applets should definitly never allow users to remove from panel if they are locked from panel
<asac> thats for sure
<gicmo> dobey, sure they do... we redid the whole volume monitoring
<asac> my mother removed her gnome menu ... thats messy ... and should never happen ;)
<dobey> yeah that's probably true
<dobey> gicmo: yes, but hal still enumerates them as disks. we didn't get rid of hal yet :)
<gicmo> dobey, well but we hide "system" partitions and have other magic in it
<dobey> my xp ntfs partition shows up just fine under computer:///
<gicmo> dobey, mount it somewhere special and its gone
<dobey> gicmo: as in mount -t ntfs /dev/hda /mnt/blah?
<dobey> sure
<dobey> but if i double-click it in computer it mounts and i can browse just fine
<dobey> my shared vfat partition though, doesn't show up in computer:/// because i mount it in /etc/fstab in /mnt/media, for example
<gicmo> yep
<dobey> because having to mount manually every time i reboot is a pain in the ass
<gicmo> totally meant that
<dobey> but i bookmarked my shared partition, so it doesn't really matter either way :)
<pochu> norsetto: thanks! I'm waiting to be asigned an AM... luckily I'm patient :-)
<norsetto> pochu: yeah, I'm afraid that's the most required qualification for an applicant ;-)
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-12-19
<pochu> good night folks
<didrocks> plop crevette
<crevette> salut didrocks
<crevette> ho ho ho
<cj> pitti: ping?
<cj> I see there are no gtkglarea items in the TODO list...
<cj> :)
<cj> is it always this quiet in here?
<dobey> boo!
<cj> whee!
<cj> rickspencer3: ohai! :)
<rickspencer3> cj: Hi
<cj> rickspencer3: it looks like we're in the same geographical area :)
<cj> I used to live down on 35th & 57th
<cj> crazy weather, eh?
<rickspencer3> cj: weird
<rickspencer3> this weather is nuts
<rickspencer3> You used to live like 4 blocks from here?
<cj> rickspencer3: used to, yep.  back in late 2000 - late 2001 or so
<rickspencer3> oh
<rickspencer3> I lived here then too
<cj> a couple of my brothers and some friends were renting a place on 57th.  It was the first place I lived after moving out of my parents' place :)
<rickspencer3> heh
<rickspencer3> I actually lived in Ravenna that year
<cj> you've been in the Briant area for a while, eh?
<cj> don't suppose you know Andy Stoller and crew?
<cj> Bryant?  I don't remember :)
<rickspencer3> can't I say I knew Andy
<rickspencer3> sorry
<cj> np.  just curious.
<cj> so... I want that OpenGL position.  Anything you guys need done along those lines?
<rickspencer3> cj: I pinged you privately
<cj> hokay
<rickspencer3> I'm happy to discuss with you
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-12-20
<johnc4510> anyone around to answer a question about your team meetings for the Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter?
<johnc4510> This team has meetings scheduled for December 25, 2008 and January 1, 2008. Is this correct? Those are holiday dates and I wasn't sure.
<cj> haha
<bluesmoke> Nice, desktop team meetings on christmas _and_ new years :P
<bluesmoke> johnc4510: They're usually only around on weekdays
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-12-14
<mdeslaur> asac: I've added a patch to fix bug #496206
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 496206 in modemmanager "Analog USB modem isn't closed when probing fails" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/496206
<CTho> pitti: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sudo/+bug/194472/comments/28 it was renamed from "pwstars" to "pwfeedback"
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 194472 in sudo "Entering password in Terminal gives no visual feedback" [Unknown,Fix released]
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti
<pitti> didrocks: gconf sponsoring>  seems done now?
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, now bug #496301 needs love :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 496301 in ubuntu-netbook-remix-default-settings "Add Ubuntu Netbook Edition session" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/496301
<pitti> didrocks: need those sponsored?
<didrocks> pitti: when you have some time, yes. no hurry though :)
<didrocks> trying to grab some coffee, bbl
<pitti> didrocks: followed up, first two debdiffs are incomplete
<pitti> didrocks: unr-d-s isn't in bzr?
<didrocks> pitti: there is no svn-bzr tag in control file
<didrocks> pitti: you are talking about autostart desktop file? You want to handle them in /usr instead avec /etc (as others in etc/xdg/autostart?)
<pitti> didrocks: well, I suggested considering it
<pitti> didrocks: for this we'll need maintainer scripts either way, since they are currently in /etc
<pitti> and need to be moved away from there
<didrocks> pitti: I guess we can declare those file as not being conffiles (it make little sense for autostart desktop file to be conffiles)
<pitti> didrocks: that was my question; can we put them into /usr/share/autostart/ from now on?
<pitti> (or the equivalent UNE-only subpath)
<pitti> unr-d-s sponsored
<didrocks> pitti: we can, I need to change my patch in gconf and we can tell that they are there. (but what about existing files in /etc/xdg/autostart, we kept them there?)
<didrocks> pitti: thanks
<didrocks> pitti: so, using http://standards.freedesktop.org/autostart-spec/autostart-spec-latest.html, we can try to tweak everytime XDG_CONFIG_DIR to include a new /usr/share/xdg/autostart path and move every .desktop file there? (it would require a lot of changes in gnome-session-properties too)
<didrocks> XDG_CONFIG_DIRS*
<pitti> that woudl be weird
<pitti> didrocks: /usr/share/autostart/ should already be supported (and has been for a long time)
<didrocks> pitti: or we can add a new cdbs/dh tool to automatically tell that desktop autostart file in /etc/xdg/autostart and /etc/xdg/xdg-session aren't conffiles?
<pitti> if that's deprecated, then ignore me
<pitti> no, files in /etc shipped in a .deb are conffiles
<didrocks> but we can still say "this file in /etc/...." isn't a conffile, right?
<pitti> no, we shouldn't (and I don't think we can)
<didrocks> oh right, bad memory so :)
<didrocks> pitti: ok, I'm adding the code this evening for the conffile move. For the moment, I just propose to keep them in /etc/xdg/xdg-session/autostart if you agree (to not add another rule different from thoses in /etc/xdg/autostart). I've some ideas on lucid+1 for better session management, we can maybe discuss again about that at next UDS. Do you agree?
<fagan> kenvandine: you around?
<pitti> didrocks: sounds fine
<baptistemm> hello
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> good morning chrisccoulson, baptistemm
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<didrocks> fine thanks, and you? You was able to get some sleep this week-end? ;)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, i slept a little :)
<chrisccoulson> and i even managed to do a couple of merges last night ;)
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti, how are you?
<seb128> good morning desktopland
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, how are you?
<seb128> hello chrisccoulson, good, thank you
<seb128> what about you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, good thanks. we had some visitors all weekend
<seb128> so your plan to get some sleep failed this weekend?
<chrisccoulson> i got a reasonable amount of sleep ;)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - any chance we could have liboobs and gnome-system-tools in the desktop package set?
<didrocks> lut seb128 :)
<seb128> 'lu didrocks
<seb128> ca va?
<didrocks> seb128: Ã§a va bien, derniÃ¨re semaine Ã  DS \o/ et toi?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I don't think we can define them individually; I guess they are also used in xubuntu and other places
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> ca va bien, derniÃ¨re semaine Ã  Canonical pour 2009 ;-)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, ok. i wasn't aware of that
<didrocks> :-)
<seb128> hey pitti
<seb128> didrocks, pitti: how are you?
 * seb128 clean his inbox and curses the spammers
<pitti> seb128: pretty good, had a relaxing weekend (big family event, 50th bday of my mother-in-law)
<seb128> nice! ;-)
<seb128> pitti, bug #496025 is probably for you
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 496025 in cheese "Web cam not detected by cheese on Dell Mini 10v" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/496025
<seb128> pitti, oh, it's fixed in git
<seb128> it has been ported to gudev
<pitti> seb128: right, I saw the bug
<pitti> oh, nice!
 * seb128 comment on the bug
<pitti> it seems to miss a dependency right now
<seb128> yes
<seb128> do you want me to do a git snapshot rather?
<tjaalton> pitti: could you sync xserver-xorg-input-evdev from experimental, thanks. new upstream version, should fix some crashes
<pitti> tjaalton: done
<seb128> didrocks, yet another gconf path? :-(
<seb128> and additional Xsession.d file?
<didrocks> seb128: yes, for une session as we discussed before (populating ENV_MANDATORY_PATH)
<tjaalton> pitti: great, thx
<seb128> didrocks, alright...
<seb128> I'm trying to reduce the number of things to Xsession.d
<seb128> not to add new ones, but I guess it will not impact on speed a lot
<didrocks> seb128: I understand, but I guess it was better than patching gconf code to behave depending on GDMSESSION variable, isn't?
<seb128> yes probably
<seb128> though I'm not even sure having the variable depending on the session is correct
<seb128> there is no real reason GNOME should behave differently if started with gdm or not
<didrocks> seb128: the idea is more "you want the "Y" session with those autostart files and those gconf settings"
<seb128> well I'm not convinced that GNOME should have different settings depending on how it's started
<seb128> out of UNE which is not a GNOME session
<didrocks> that can be used in gnome-stracciatella too (instead of patching applications to tell "start only if you have this GDMSESSION variable")
<seb128> I guess not too many users will fiddle with that
<seb128> still can be pretty confusing to have GNOME configuration changing under your feet for no apparent reason just because you started it differently
<didrocks> I totally agree with that, it will be very little used. Not a lot of users will use that
<asac> pitti: we added two packages to the desktop seed for armel on friday ... what are the steps to do now? upload meta package and then promotion or v.v.
 * asac thought that the meta package gets automatically uploaded when seed changes
<seb128> yeah, I'm done with weekend email backlog before lunch
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - \o/
<pitti> asac: no, you need to do that manually
<pitti> asac: download, ./update, edit changelog, upload
<asac> ok. guess we have to wait for promotion first.
<seb128> mvo, hey, is software-center known to not start on alpha1?
<mvo> seb128: no, I uploaded some changes today, it might be failing because of that?
<mvo> seb128: what is the error?
<seb128> mvo, no, that's a stock alpha1 install
<seb128> no upgrade yet
<mvo> oh
<seb128> mvo, http://paste.ubuntu.com/341180/
<mvo> seb128: right, silly mistake, but fixed
<seb128> ok thanks
<seb128> I just reinstalled the mini with fresh alpha and I wanted to use software-center to install bootchart
<mvo> seb128: let me know if you still have issues after a update
<seb128> but that's a fail there ;-)
<seb128> mvo, ok, upgrading now
 * mvo nods
<mvo> thanks
<seb128> mvo, works now, thanks
<mvo> cool
<mvo> thanks
<mpt> mvo, http://paste.ubuntu.com/341199/
<mvo> mpt: did you update to the latest aptdaemon in lucid?
<mpt> mvo, no, this is on 9.10
<mpt> mvo, "trunk won't work on 9.10 from now on" is quite acceptable as an answer :-)
<mvo> mpt: oh, ok - hm, then I think I need to upload a atdaemon for karmic into the software-center ppa
<mpt> I can install alpha 1 on my other partition
<mvo> mpt: I uploaded it to ppa:software-store-developers/ppa
<mvo> mpt: I let you know when it build
<mpt> thanks mvo
<mvo> mpt: in a few minutes "sudo add-apt-repository ppa:software-store-developers/ppa; sudo apt-get update" should work
 * mvo is still waiting for the "accepted" mail
<fagan> mvo: the software store ppa doesnt have an amd64 build in lucid
<seb128> pitti, kenvandine can't upload new sources
<seb128> pitti, ie the indicator needs sponsoring
<seb128> (I can do it if you want)
<kenvandine> did you guys finish reviewing the changes?
<seb128> I just read a reply from pitti on the ubuntu-archive list
<seb128> saying to upload
<kenvandine> ah... ok... damn evolution message threading :)
<kenvandine> seb128, sponsoring would be great :)
<kenvandine> thx
<fagan> oh kenvandine is the rgba stuff from the desktop teams ppa causing some stuff to crash in lucid?
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> the same error you sent to the list
<fagan> Oh cool
<kenvandine> fagan, thx for testing
<kenvandine> hopefully we will get a fix this week
 * kenvandine glares at bratsche
<kenvandine> who isn't around :)
<seb128> note that I'm on vac after this week
<fagan> mail the list and ill test it when you have it uploaded
<seb128> so it's probably this week or next year
<seb128> upload to lucid I mean
<seb128> kenvandine, the new indicator-session failed to build btw
<seb128> basically none of the thing you updated made it to lucid yet
<seb128> do you need some help to sort that?
<mvo> fagan: thanks, I think jcastro might have a idea why
<kenvandine> seb128, yeah... well it is weird
<kenvandine> it can't install libindicator0
<kenvandine> which is available in lucid
<seb128> right the binary went to universe
<kenvandine> oh!
<seb128> I've promoted it now
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> that will fix it :)
<seb128> I will retry builds after next publisher run
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> kenvandine, when you get new binaries please tell us what should go to main now that you upload
<seb128> that will smooth such issues
<seb128> I used to tweak those while doing the sponsoring
<kenvandine> ok, i had mentioned it because it went into NEW
<seb128> ok, I didn't read about it
<kenvandine> hey rickspencer3!
<seb128> next time feel free to ping me about it
<kenvandine> sure
<seb128> hello rickspencer3
<seb128> I will retry indicator-messages and indicator-session
<kenvandine> thx
<rickspencer3> good morning
<seb128> will that be enough for lucid to upgrade?
<fagan> morning rickspencer3
<seb128> or do we need the new source too?
<kenvandine> do we manually need to retry those builds?
<kenvandine> they will work
<rickspencer3> hi fagan
<seb128> yes
<kenvandine> they built file in pbuilder and for karmic in the ppa
<seb128> kenvandine, the system depwait when a build depends is not available
<seb128> but in this case the -dev was, but the lib was in universe
<kenvandine> seb128, yeah i got a bunch of the FTBS emails over the weekend
<seb128> and main builders can't use universe
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> someone must have been retrying them over the weekend
<seb128> it's possible
<seb128> some of the buildd admins kick rebuild for installability issues
<didrocks> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> hey rickspencer3, good morning kenvandine
<pitti> kenvandine, seb128: I retried them this morning upon geser's request; I didn't check
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I've promoted the binary now
<seb128> will retry after next publisher
<rickspencer3> hi didrocks
<geser> pitti, seb128: sorry for any trouble, I did check them in my builder if they build but didn't check the compontents
<seb128> geser, don't worry that's minor trouble
<seb128> pitti, is the guest session working in lucid for you?
<pitti> seb128: no, the X server crashes
<pitti> I guess for you too?
<seb128> pitti, yes
<seb128> pitti, I just wanted to check if somebody else had the issue too, thanks
<mpt> mvo, the PPA version of aptdaemon Breaks the Karmic version of software-center, and the PPA doesn't include a new version of software-center itself
<mpt> mvo, so it's probably just easier for me to install Lucid :-)
<mvo> mpt: hm, ok
<mvo> mpt: I uploaded a software-center snapshot there now too :)
<mpt> thanks mvo!
<mvo> mpt: its still a good idea to run lucid, but at least you should be able to test it under both systems (and I'm sure other will use the ppa too :)
<seb128> kenvandine, new indicator-messages and session built now
<seb128> on i386 at least
<kenvandine> seb128, excellent, thx!
<seb128> they will be in the next publisher run
<baptistemm> hi there
<seb128> hey baptistemm
<baptistemm> how safe it is to switch to lucid? no big breakage ?
<baptistemm> salut seb128
<baptistemm> I didn't had time to work on nautilus SRU
<baptistemm> :/
<seb128> don't bother with that one, I'm not even sure there is changes worth a sru there
<seb128> I did the lucid update
<seb128> lucid, still early unstable, works fine now but there is rough edges and things might break on the way
<baptistemm> seb128, okay as usual for a dev version
<and471> could someone take a screenshot of a new mail notification from evolution? (with notify-osd installed)
<seb128> can't you do that?
<mvo> hey and471!
<and471> mvo, hullo
<and471> seb128, I have been trying to configure evolution but it is annoying me
<and471> mvo: once my exams are over, I have some interesting changes for the css / html we are using :-)
<mac_v> and471: the new mail notification? in lucid or larmic?
<mac_v> karmic*
<and471> mac_v, I prefer in larmic please :-)
<and471> mac_v, it doesn't really matter I am joking
<mac_v> and471: all it will say is "N new mail"
<and471> just need to know what it looks like so I can nick the layout for thunderbird :-)
<and471> mac_v, no summary of the message or subject?
<mac_v> nope
<and471> mac_v, oh :-)
<and471> mac_v, well that was easy :-)
<mac_v> and471: also N will most probably be wrong when mails arrives in several folders
<and471> thanks
<mac_v> np
<and471> back to revision :-)
<and471> :-(
<rickspencer3> seb128, when a user does a fresh install, and tries to play an mp3 in rhythm box, does rhythm box prompt to install codecs? and if so, what package does it suggest?
<seb128> rickspencer3, it should yes, right now I think all the availables choices
<seb128> ie typically gst-plugins-ugly and gst-ffmpeg
<rickspencer3> seb128, what about *-restricted-extras?
<seb128> how is that used by gstreamer to play anything?
<rickspencer3> I dunno
<rickspencer3> I assumed it had codecs that gstreamer needed
<seb128> well the depends system will pull in libraries used by the codecs
<rickspencer3> at least, when I install it, I can play mp3s in rhythm box
<seb128> it's not so crude
<seb128> gstreamer reports what elements are missing exactly
<seb128> and we install the packages which provide those
<seb128> that's not specific to mp3 or mpeg or anything
<seb128> it should work with any format or codec
<fagan> mvo: is there any plans to sort programs in the installed programs section of the software center by when they were installed?
<fagan> I think it would be useful
<mvo> fagan: not currently, but I'm sure mpt is interessted in this isea
<mvo> idea
<mvo> fagan: we currently have not very good support for the notion of when it got installed though
<mvo> but we are working on it
<pitti> good night everyone!
<chrisccoulson> 'night pitti
<gabaug> Keybuk: is HAL going to be completely removed for Lucid?
<Keybuk> it's already removed from the CD
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<seb128> hi chrisccoulson
<seb128> how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, not too bad thanks, but it's been a long day today
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> good thanks
<seb128> the day has been busy too there
<seb128> I'm just back from sport and dinner
<geser> seb128: could you please also give-back indicator-applet as you(?) promoted the missing lib to main. thanks
<seb128> geser, will do
<seb128> geser, done now
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i will have a couple of packages ready for sponsoring shortly (if you have time)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, which ones?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - liboobs and gnome-system-tools
<seb128> ok
<seb128> you can't upload those?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - it doesn't look like it (http://paste.ubuntu.com/341448/)
<seb128> could you try asking to cjwatson on #ubuntu-devel?
<seb128> if he knows why you can't upload those
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ?
<seb128> kenvandine, do you know if pitti did the new indicator-application sponsoring?
<kenvandine> seb128, i don't think he did
<seb128> hum k
<seb128> let me look at that now
<kenvandine> seb128, i thought you were :)
<seb128> I asked pitti if he was going to do it or if I should
<seb128> and he didn't reply
<seb128> and I forgot about it
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - sorry, i had to disappear quickly there;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh no problem don't worry
<seb128> I was just not sure you did read my lines since I didn't highlight you
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i just read them now
<seb128> I tend to miss things people write due to that sometime ;-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i sometimes miss things too ;)
<seb128> kenvandine, is indicator-application of any use right now in lucid?
<kenvandine> yes
<seb128> like anything using it or activating it in the default install?
<kenvandine> yeah, rhythmbox
<seb128> well the ppa version, not the lucid one
<chrisccoulson> another indicator?
<kenvandine> i will upload the patch after indicator-application lands
<seb128> it will autoactivate?
<kenvandine> yes
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I'm pondering doing the newing now or waiting for pitti to do it tomorrow
<kenvandine> i didn't want yet another thing to be in depwait :)
<kenvandine> tomorrow is fine
<seb128> pitti did review the updated bzr right?
<kenvandine> i just have to get rb uploaded by wed
<kenvandine> yes
<seb128> ok, let me new that now
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> did pitti said anything about mir?
<seb128> say
<seb128> like should it be sent to universe, mired, etc
<seb128> or should we send it direct to main and do paper work later?
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey
<kenvandine> seb128, he didn't actually
<kenvandine> send it to universe
<seb128> ok
<seb128> we can as well wait tomorrow morning european time
<kenvandine> i'll address the mir tomorrow
<seb128> feel free to upload rhythmbox
<seb128> we will get things sorted before you are up tomorrow
<kenvandine> well that would depend on stuff in universe then :)
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> I guess it can build without it
<kenvandine> will do
<kenvandine> no, it adds the build-depends
<seb128> ok good
<kenvandine> but atleast it will be uploaded :)
<seb128> right and if it will build as soon as we sort the newing, etc
<seb128> I will suggest to pitti to promote directly and do the paper work later
<seb128> is anybody wanting to do the evolution-data-server, evolution, evolution-exchange updates?
<seb128> bonus for rebasing on debian, evolution-data-server should be trivial to rebase
<seb128> evolution-exchange too
<seb128> robert_ancell, ^? ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, when do you think that your updates will be ready for upload?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - liboobs is in bzr and ready to go
<kenvandine> seb128, uploaded rhythmbox
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
 * kenvandine heads down to spend some time with the family, good night folks!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, sponsoring that now
<chrisccoulson> g-s-t is in bzr too, but i'm just checking the build log here
<seb128> kenvandine, have fun, see you tomorrow
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok
<robert_ancell> seb128, what am I looking at?
<seb128> robert_ancell, a screen?
<robert_ancell> seb128, my screen starts at "kenvandine, is indicator-application of any use right now in lucid?"
<seb128> robert_ancell, oh, the lines just before
<seb128> the "is there anybody wanting to rebase and update evo"
<seb128> in case you would be interested ;-)
<robert_ancell> *cough* hell no
<seb128> ok, was worth a try ;-)
<robert_ancell> I'm sorry, I'm in OEM this cycle
<seb128> yeah sure
<seb128> doesn't hurt to ask
<seb128> you did some complicates ones recently
<seb128> so I was not sure how you were balancing your load
<seb128> and using you 20% desktop too
<seb128> but fair enough ;-)
<chrisccoulson> is evo a big task then?
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<robert_ancell> I'm trying to do more OEM and less desktop.
<seb128> no, e-d-s is probably half an hour work
<seb128> evolution-exchange like a few minutes I would say
<robert_ancell> seb128, I was looking at gnome-panel yesterday.  there's some odd blocking that goes on
<seb128> evo is probably easy to update but might be harder to rebase
<seb128> it's just that I'm trying to finish lot of things before end of year
<seb128> and I still want to look at nautilus start this week
<seb128> so I was trying to figure if somebody was interested by those
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i think g-s-t is ready to go now as well
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok cool
<chrisccoulson> that ones a bit more complicated :)
<chrisccoulson> the indicator applets showing "No indicators" is expected at the moment is it?
<seb128> which one?
<seb128> tedg, ^
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - both of them show that at the moment
<Sarvatt> ohh *thats* why I have that extra panel space all of the sudden :D
<chrisccoulson> Sarvatt - extra panel space?
<chrisccoulson> the text takes up more space here ;)
<tedg> seb128: chrisccoulson: Hmm, that'd be a surprise.
<chrisccoulson> i'm confused by all this indicator stuff
<chrisccoulson> the package names are all too similar ;)
<tedg> You could look at /usr/lib/indicators/3/ and see if there is any *.so in there.
<chrisccoulson> tedg - yeah, there are 2 so files in there
<tedg> Hmm, that's odd.
<chrisccoulson> libmessaging.so and libsession.so
<chrisccoulson> slangasek is seeing the same issue too
<tedg> chrisccoulson: What is the version on teh about dialog of indicator-applet?
<Sarvatt> the "no indicators" words are the same color as my panel, just looked blank
<chrisccoulson> tedg - 0.1
<tedg> chrisccoulson: Hmm, that's the problem.  It should be 0.3.0 :)
<tedg> I wonder if that didn't get into Lucid.
<seb128> tedg, you screwed the packaging there...
<tedg> seb128: ?
<seb128> tedg, it did but things build in order and I just kicked this back some hours ago
<chrisccoulson> i might be using an out-of-date mirror perhaps
<seb128> tedg, if some component update breaks the indicator it should have Breaks
<seb128> use Breaks: indicator-applet (<< 0.3)
<seb128> otherwise you get what you have now
<tedg> seb128: Oh, okay.  I didn't know about Breaks
<tedg> That actually solves a bunch of problems.
<seb128> you can use Conflicts too
<seb128> but Breaks is the correct on there
<Sarvatt> is fsck on boot causing a failsafe x start 100% of the time for anyone else?
<seb128> kenvandine, ^ the Breaks comment might be useful for you too
<seb128> Sarvatt, dunno I don't have fsck running that often
<seb128> never got xorg failing due to it though
<Sarvatt> sudo tune2fs -C 100 /dev/sda1 then reboot puts me in failsafe 100% of the time here
<Sarvatt> and failsafe is using vesa which doesnt work with KMS for me
<seb128> I think #ubuntu-x was discussing vesa and kms before
<seb128> oh I see you discussed that there
<Sarvatt> yeah we're talking about it in there, i switched it to fbdev which works with KMS but fbdev doesnt work for some people, just seems like a gdm init problem outside of the whole vesa thing so I was asking in here
<seb128> not idea about that right now, it would require some debugging
<Sarvatt> I get this from the gdm log when it starts after the fsck http://paste.ubuntu.com/341495/
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-12-15
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> gabaug: hal> not completely removed from the archive, of course; there are still many rdepends (KDE is the biggest one)
<didrocks> hello pitti :)
<didrocks> how are you?
<pitti> bonjour didrocks! I'm great, thanks!
<pitti> it's just effing cold outside :-(
<pitti> we have snow since Saturday
<didrocks> same here. Snow in Paris on Sunday! :) The only counter-part is that I've waited for my bus yesterday evening for 40 min in the cold :/
<didrocks> netvertheless, I had the time to resubmit a new patch to bug #496301. If you have some time today... we will get an une desktop session :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 496301 in ubuntu-netbook-remix-default-settings "Add Ubuntu Netbook Edition session" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/496301
<didrocks> hope it's good this time :)
<bryce> heya guys
<didrocks> hey bryce
<didrocks> you were on vacations, weren't you?
<bryce> yes, for 1 week
<pitti> hey bryce, good morning
<pitti> or, evening
<pitti> enjoyed your time off?
<bryce> unfortunately had a cold and was sick for most of it, so not so much :-/
<pitti> ugh, what a bad timing :(
<pitti> I usually don't mind so much having a cold when working, but during holidays it sucks
<bryce> with remainder, did xmas decoration/shopping/partying/etc.
<bryce> yeah, wasn't too bad of a cold, but made me too tired to do anything productive
<bryce> pitti, looks like xserver 1.7 is all in; still awaiting the new -wacom to get into debian
<pitti> bryce: yeah, I'm totally happy that we could push that into alpha1!
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<seb128> hey
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<seb128> hello chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> how are you today?
<seb128> good I think
<seb128> let me go through another round of coffee before confirming ;-)
<seb128> how are you?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm ok. quite tired though, as i ended up having quite a late night last night
<chrisccoulson> coffee sounds like a good idea :)
<didrocks> salut seb128, Ã§a va?
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks, how are you?
<seb128> lut didrocks
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: the weather is cold, but I'm fine, thanks :-) and you? tired apparently?
<chrisccoulson> heh, yeah. the weather is starting to turn cold here too
<chrisccoulson> snow forecast this week (hopefully)
<seb128> oh, pitti starts rocking early in the day, thanks for the indicator-application newing and the sru review
<pitti> seb128: bonjour
<seb128> hey pitti
<pitti> seb128: I source/binary-NEWed it into main
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> I was going to ask about main next
<pitti> packaging is fine now, and a MIR wouldn't give us additional information really *shrug*
<seb128> dunno if you read backlog from yesterday or not
<pitti> "yet another indicator"
<pitti> I'm rather interested in how it affects startup speed :)
<seb128> right, new package, like no security record, upstream tracker to watch or debian packaging, etc
<seb128> I'm about to do daily charts
<seb128> the mini just finished upgrade
<pitti> after today's dist-upgrade, the message and user indicator just say "no notifications" (literally, in the panel), hmm
<seb128> pitti, you got indicator-applet 0.3?
<seb128> kenvandine and tedg don't know about Breaks apparently
<pitti> seb128: no, I don't have that yet, I just NEWed it
<seb128> at least tedg didn't before I explained yesterday
<pitti> oh, sorry, no; I NEWed i-application
<pitti> I have i-applet 0.2.0
<seb128> indicator-applet is an upgrade"
<seb128> it was about to build when I went to bed
<seb128> pitti, what arch?
<pitti> amd64
<seb128> the amd64 built finished 4 hours ago
<seb128> weird
<seb128> did you just upgrade?
<seb128> do you use a mirror?
 * pitti upgrades again
<pitti> no, this morning, and I'm using archive.u.c.
 * pitti got up two hours ago already, though
<seb128> 4 hours ago, with publishing etc it might have been one round after your upgrade
<pitti> right, there it comes
<pitti> merci
<seb128> de rien ;-)
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti - do you want me to look at the g-p-m update (or do you plan to look at it today)?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: please go ahead if you want
<chrisccoulson> pitti - cool, i'll take that one then
<pitti> thanks!
<seb128> urg, ctrl-w on the wrong screen agai
<seb128> +n
<seb128> note to self, the focus is not always on the screen you look at
<pitti> haha, trapped in dual-screen? :-)
<seb128> I'm wondering if I should unset ctrl-w in xchat-gnome
<seb128> pitti, yes, I've IRC on one screen and webbrowser on the other
<seb128> and I keep closing IRC tabs instead of firefox ones
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good work on the gnome-python-extras update ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i should probably not do disruptive updates late at night next time ;)
<chrisccoulson> it turned in to quite a late one in the end
 * seb128__ kicks his dsl line today
<seb128> re
<seb128> Keybuk, it's weird, your bootchart are over 2 seconds off compared to mines there
<seb128> and I reinstalled my box with alpha1 yesterday and upgraded
<seb128> so I should have no custom changes
<seb128> the mark is around 18s there
<seb128> and yours is over 20s
<pitti> wow, seems the new kernel reduced boot time quite a bit
<Keybuk> seb128: which are yours?
<Keybuk> pitti: yeah I'm hoping it will
<seb128> Keybuk, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/bootchart/seb128-dellmini-lucid-20091215-1.png
<pitti> 4.2 vs. 2.8 seconds
<seb128> Keybuk, see the xorg activity
<seb128> it takes some 1.5 seconds and 3 seconds for you
<Keybuk> seb128: yours has -8 :-)
<Keybuk> -8 is full of patchy goodness
<Keybuk> including patches to the i915 driver
<Keybuk> mine from yesterday still have -7
<Keybuk> http://people.canonical.com/~scott/daily-bootcharts/20091214-max.png
<Keybuk> (and on a completely different mini)
<Keybuk> http://people.canonical.com/~scott/daily-bootcharts/20091214-ratchet.png
<seb128> I think my charts were already under 20 seconds yesterday
<seb128> but I wiped those in the reinstall now
<Keybuk> depends when yesterday
<Keybuk> live fs builds are basically over night
<seb128> ok
<Keybuk> so yesterday's charts were really "the night before's" distro
<seb128> it might be it then
<seb128> where is your current guess-time btw?
<Keybuk> there isn't a current one
<seb128> your desktop count seems different from the ones I get with the version you gave me some time ago
<Keybuk> I merged all that code back into bootchart
<seb128> guess-time give me desktop times between 10.3 and 10.8
<seb128> and your marks are over 11 seconds
<Keybuk> right, the current code is a bit more strict
<Keybuk> http://people.canonical.com/~scott/make-bootchart
<Keybuk> ^ that's a good script ;)
<seb128> thanks
<Keybuk> it'll output the times on stdout in the order total, time-to-kernel, time-to-x, etc.
<Keybuk> desktop is the total minus time to gdm-session-worker starting, etc.
<Keybuk> you can also do NO_PRUNE=1 make-bootchart ...
<Keybuk> to get much more detail
<seb128> Keybuk, for CHART_TGZ do?
<seb128> should that be with a "in ...;"
<seb128> ?
<Keybuk> that's the argument on the command-line
<Keybuk> for FOO means "for each argument"
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> (I hate touchpads)
<seb128> (keep clicking without wanting to while typing)
<tseliot> seb128: you can disable clicks when typing
<seb128> tseliot, that option is on by default in karmic and lucid
<seb128> but that seems to be a fail for me on the mini10v
<seb128> dunno if I let my hands laying around for a second after typing or something
<seb128> or if that's buggy
<tseliot> seb128: are you saying that you can still click when typing?
<seb128> no, I'm saying I keep having jumping cursor
<seb128> random selections
<hyperair> syndaemon was configured with too long a delay in karmic iirc.
<seb128> and I'm only using the keyboard, I've an external mouse
<seb128> ie I must be touching the touchpad with my palms or something
<hyperair> when you pause typing for a while and then shift a little, you could accidentally trigger the touchpad
 * hyperair has the same issue
<seb128> yes
<seb128> or when I place my hands over the keyboard before starting typing
<seb128> I touch the touchpad on the way
<hyperair> the delay is half a second, which is too short.
<seb128> and it mess cursor before I start typing
 * seb128 wants the option to disable touchpad back
<tseliot> seb128: that can be done
<hyperair> isn't there a hardware button to disable it?
 * hyperair has some fn key for it
<tseliot> yes, on some laptops
<hyperair> hmm not all eh
<tseliot> seb128: if that change is welcome I'll do it
<seb128> tseliot, that would be great
<Keybuk> tjaalton: any idea when that xkbcomp patch will be fixed?
<seb128> Keybuk, seems you are almost on target for the non desktop part of boot now
<seb128> 18 seconds, 11 being desktop
<tseliot> seb128: ok then
<seb128> which means you use 7 seconds with a 6 seconds target?
<seb128> tseliot, thanks
<tseliot> what happened to the xkbcomp patch?
<Keybuk> it's broken and tjaalton disabled it
<Keybuk> seb128: right, though that's without a splash screen
<Keybuk> which will add time
<seb128> good point
<Keybuk> you might think that having it disabled at the moment is deliberate to prove just how much boot time having a splash screen adds ;)
<tseliot> Keybuk: let me check, I think I can adapt it to the new X
<Keybuk> tseliot: if you can, that would be awesome
<tjaalton> yep, it's quite big and I don't have much time this week
<tjaalton> tseliot: enable it & build, see how it fails
<tseliot> tjaalton: I've applied the patch and it fails to patch configure.ac (which is trivial to fix) and xkb/ddxLoad.c (only two hunks)
<tjaalton> tseliot: uh, it should apply, just fails to build
<tjaalton> right, applies here
<tseliot> tjaalton: do you have a link to that patch? (in case I'm using the wrong one)
<tjaalton> tseliot: yes, git clone git://git.debian.org/git/pkg-xorg/xserver/xorg-server :)
<tjaalton> or apt-get source
<tjaalton> it hasn't changed since bryce updated it to apply
<tseliot> ah, right you only removed the patch from the series file
<tjaalton> yes
<tjaalton> but you have commit rights, fix it in git
<tjaalton> hmm, seems that you don't
<tseliot> I don't
<tjaalton> create an account on alioth, and we'll sort it out
<tjaalton> (.debian.org)
<tseliot> ok
<Keybuk> seb128: ugh, dkms screwed up the boot totally
<Keybuk> 4s :-/
<Keybuk> and do you know what it took that 4s to do?
<Keybuk> figure out that it had *nothing* to do
<seb128> :-(
<tseliot> tjaalton: when I click on the URL to activate my account I get an error: "Error Could Not Get User"
<seb128> Keybuk, btw do you know if the gdm to gnome-session 0.8 seconds are due to the udev-acl.ck?
<seb128> the bar for that process seems to just fit in the gap between those
<Keybuk> seb128: yes, likely
<tjaalton> tseliot: filled all the mandatory fields?
<seb128> Keybuk, is that something you plan to look at?
<tjaalton> tseliot: -> #u-x
<tseliot> tjaalton: username and password were the only fields that I could see
<tseliot> ok
<Keybuk> seb128: it's not directly on my list, pitti might want to though
<seb128> pitti, ^
<Keybuk> it's the ck bit
<seb128> it's almost a quarter of our login budget
<pitti> seb128: haven't looked at this one yet; mind adding a work item for me? (sorry, busy ATM)
<seb128> a fifth to be exact
<seb128> pitti, ok, will do
<sabdfl> Keybuk: is there an equivalent of ureadahead for the post-login pieces?
<Keybuk> sabdfl: ureadahead covers them
<Keybuk> if you mean things like gnome-panel
<sabdfl> assuming the same person logs in
<Keybuk> of course
<Keybuk> there is that assumption
<tseliot> Keybuk: I have fixed the xkbcomp patch
<Keybuk> tseliot: \o/
<tseliot> :-)
<Keybuk> pitti: I have fixed dkms ;)
<Keybuk> I copied the logic from update-initramfs into it
<pitti> yay you
<Keybuk> module package postinst will rebuild the module for the "right" kernel version
<Keybuk> installing a newer kernel later will rebuild the modules
<Keybuk> if you boot an older kernel, you probably won't have the newer module, but that's probably *right*
<Keybuk> (one assumes you're booting the older kernel because you had a problem)
<tseliot> what if you don't have a module for the old kernel?
<Keybuk> tseliot: then you didn't have a module for the old kernel before either
<Keybuk> so it will work just as well as the last time you used that kernel :p
<tseliot> Keybuk: right but the module should me built on boot in that case
<Keybuk> no it shouldn't
<Keybuk> your booting an old kernel
<Keybuk> things should not be rebuilt for it
<Keybuk> because it might be that very thing that broke
<Keybuk> the only reason to ever keep an old kernel around is to be able to go back to *something that worked*
<tseliot> ok good point
<Keybuk> tseliot: fixed xkbcomp patch => can you upload or do you need someone else to?
<tjaalton> I can do that
<Keybuk> please do
<Keybuk> I'm eager to get a "perfect bootchart" of the current set of updates
<Keybuk> before I ruin it by turning plymouth on :p
<tjaalton> hehe
<tseliot> Keybuk: sure, I'll push changes
<tseliot> pitti: do you think we can discuss the nvidia name schemes at the desktop meeting?
<pitti> tseliot: sure, if you think you can benefit from more input
<tseliot> pitti: yes, I would like to discuss that and an idea that superm1 and Sarvatt had about reducing the number of packages that each nvidia source package generates
<tjaalton> which one was that?
<Keybuk> tjaalton, tseliot: did you upload that new xkbcomp patch yet?
<tjaalton> Keybuk: on the way
<tseliot> Keybuk: tjaalton will do that for me
<Keybuk> </nag> :D
<Keybuk> AWTY!
<tseliot> tjaalton: basically they suggested that we have something like nvidia-190 (which includes glx, kernel-source, vdpau), modaliases and nvidia-190-dev
<tjaalton> tseliot: they all are needed anyway=
<tjaalton> ?
<tseliot> tjaalton: the first two are always installed
<tjaalton> and what occured to me was that the "current" source package can be just "nvidia-graphics-drivers" without any version
<tseliot> yes, that's a separate part of the plan
<tjaalton> that way there's no need to shove all the bugs to a new version
<tjaalton> yes, but that would still build nvidia-XXX
<tseliot> ???
<tjaalton> binary package
<tseliot> aah, you were referring to the source package
<tjaalton> as a bug triager the only benefit to rename the package to something that doesn't change is that the bugs are always filed to the same package
<tjaalton> right
 * tseliot nods
<tjaalton> doesn't matter what binaries it produces
<tseliot> yes and I was thinking about not needing the package to be in NEW when nvidia bumps the release number
<tjaalton> and I can't see a way to make upgrades robust enough without having the major version in the binary name
<tjaalton> that too
<tseliot> which I'm sure the archive admins will appreciate
<tjaalton> unless of course, the package is removed on upgrade :)
<tjaalton> since I went through a bunch of crashers and some of them occured during a dist-upgrade
<tseliot> tjaalton: what if the version in written in the modalias file?
<tseliot> and we use nvidia-common to handle the transition
<tseliot> (with update manager)
<tjaalton> it was just an idea, probably too radical anyway ;)
<tseliot> we can discuss it at the desktop meeting
<tjaalton> when was that?
<tjaalton> Keybuk: "no" ;)
<tseliot> tjaalton: today at 17:30 CET
<Keybuk> tjaalton: hmm?
<tseliot> I assume that we're in the same time zone
<tjaalton> Keybuk: thin Homer (S.)
<tjaalton> thinK
<tjaalton> tseliot: nope, EEST here ;)
<tseliot> d'oh
<tjaalton> oh wait, that summer time
<tjaalton> anyway, 18:30
<seb128> tjaalton, 16:30 utc
<tjaalton> yep
 * tseliot uses google calendar so that he doesn't have to deal with time zones
<Keybuk> that works up until the point you realise that google calendar doesn't deal with time zones either
<tseliot> Keybuk: ???
<Keybuk> tseliot: it gets daylight savings time very horribly wrong
<pitti> actually that seems to work quite well nowadays
<tseliot> it has always worked for me but I have used it only since I joined Canonical
<pitti> either that, or Rick uses CET for all his calendaring activity :)
<tseliot> heh
<tjaalton> Keybuk: uploaded
<Keybuk> \o/.
<Keybuk> I shall have lunch while that builds
<chrisccoulson1> whoa, only 6 people in here?
<chrisccoulson1> ah
<pitti> seb128: do you have a minute to check out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Developers ?
<pitti> seb128: that's the proposed policy for adding new ubuntu-desktop members, similar to what you wrote by email the other day
<seb128> pitti, ok looking
<seb128> pitti, looks great, thank you for writting it and keeping paperwork level low there ;-)
<pitti> yay
<pitti> seb128: are you still actually using https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/TODO ?
<seb128> pitti, no
<pitti> seb128: I'm inclined to drop that and remove TODO and WeeklyTodo (which is a nonexisting page) from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam
<pitti> we have versions.html now
<seb128> right
<seb128> I use the title urls
<seb128> versions and milestoned bug tasks
<kwwii> mvo: hey, I am trying to get charlines computer up to the latest usable software-center (the one with all the apps)
<kwwii> mvo: I added the ppa to her sources and updated but it still seems the same, does she need to use the daily-build?
<kwwii> mvo: erm, ignore that
<kwwii> sorry
<pitti> tseliot, ArneGoetje, bryce, ccheney, Riddell, kenvandine, seb128: please add your weekly report to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-12-15 ; thanks!
<kenvandine> pitti, will do
<tseliot> sure
<seb128> oh wiki page is there now ;-)
<pitti> just created it
<Riddell> pitti: activity report?
<pitti> right
<seb128> pitti, no rickspencer3 today?
<pitti> seb128: he'll be in a meeting at that time
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
 * fake_rickspencer makes whip cracking noises
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<kenvandine> hehe
<fake_rickspencer> you will all get a payrise, btw
<seb128> kenvandine, is rb supposed to install the indicator-application binary?
<seb128> pitti, ;-)
<rickspencer3> :)
<seb128> I'm supposed to have my weekly call with rick before meeting
<kenvandine> seb128, you mean as a dep?
<seb128> I wonder if that will skip too
<kenvandine> libappindicator?
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> seb128: should be fine
<seb128> kenvandine, well I just upgraded, the new lib got installed
<pitti> seb128: I'm doing the meeting so that you can have your call :)
<rickspencer3> pitti, thank you for covering for me this morning
<seb128> and now I've no indicator icon nor notification
<rickspencer3> you are truly the best
<pitti> rickspencer3: no problem :)
<kenvandine> seb128, humm
<seb128> kenvandine, I reboot if that makes a difference
 * rickspencer3 has meetings all during today
<seb128> rickspencer3, our weekly call is still on?
<rickspencer3> ^sympathy is not inappropriate at this time
<kenvandine> well, the indicator-applet will need to restart if that service just got installed
<rickspencer3> seb128, yes, that is one of the meetings ;)
 * seb128 hugs rickspencer3
<seb128> ok, good
<kenvandine> seb128, let me know how it goes :)
<seb128> kenvandine, I rebooted
<kenvandine> oh, no luck?
<kenvandine> seb128, so when you start rb it should add an icon to the right of the indicator-applet
<kenvandine> which has a menu when you click on it, play, next, prev, quit
<seb128> no icon
<kenvandine> what version of indicator-applet?
<seb128> you are sure that the indicator-application binary is not required?
<seb128> 0.3
<kenvandine> hummm... it is actually
 * kenvandine looks to see what is wrong
<kenvandine> so you didn't get indicator-application installed?
<seb128> I got the lib
<seb128> not the binary
<seb128> dunno if that's what is expected
<seb128> if the binary is of any use there
<kenvandine> it is, the service itself is in that package
<kenvandine> ok, i'll fix it
<seb128> ok so you need a depends or recommends somewhere
<seb128> and fallback is not working
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> ok
 * kenvandine wonders why the folks testing on karmic from the ppa didn't catch this
<kenvandine> :/
<seb128> kenvandine, did you read my comment about breaks too?
<seb128> the one I let yesterday
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> ok good
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> np
<czajkowski> kenvandine: mind if I ask you something in pm?
<kenvandine> sure
<Keybuk>  1749 scott     20   0  594m 2264 1448 R   40  0.1 100:33.56 pulseaudio
<Keybuk> *hate*
 * Amaranth wonders what these 'exe' processes are
<Amaranth> oh, silly chrome
<seb128> kenvandine, is fixing the indicator-application thing blocking or anything now?
<seb128> ie, do you need sponsoring or do you want to discuss where to put the recommends?
<kenvandine> perms to upload :)
<seb128> just ping on the channel when you need sponsoring
<seb128> especially for things which are broken
<kenvandine> one min, on phone
<seb128> what needs sponsoring? the indicator-application bzr?
<seb128> ok
<czajkowski> mvo: aloha, do you happen to know of a bug, where on karmic, the software center is missing,  but the add/remove functionality is back ??
<rickspencer3> pitti, kenvandine, seb128 can you guys discuss some ways of marking bugs as "blockers" or similar?
<rickspencer3> the idea being that we can identify bug_tasks that are blocking packages from getting integrated before the release?
<rickspencer3> for instance ... gtk?
<bryce> rickspencer3, you thinking like a tag?
<rickspencer3> bryce, right, I think you might already have such a thing, right?
<rickspencer3> bryce, sorry I couldn't get the wiki set up for you yesterday
<kenvandine> bryce, i think just release tags
<kenvandine> so we can tag bugs as release blockers
<kenvandine> i think we have those already
<kenvandine> seb128, yeah indicator-application needs sponsoring
<kenvandine> i asked pitti in a PM to give perms to ubuntu-desktop, but he seems busy atm
<rickspencer3> what I would like is to be able to dynamically generate a list of bug_tasks that are keeping packages from getting uploaded to lucid
<rickspencer3> it should be a short list ;)
<kenvandine> seb128, i just made it a Depends, i don't think it is really optional
<kenvandine> seb128, if you would rather it be a Recommends I can drop it down to that
<kenvandine> seb128, and i subscribed you to a rb bug i filed for the lack of a fallback to the status icon
<kenvandine> and assigned it to bratsche :)
<pitti> re
<bryce> rickspencer3, I don't have a tag for this, but if there was a specific tag for such bugs it'd be easy to create a query.  The trick would be to ensure people set the tags where applicable
<seb128> kenvandine, sorry I was away
<seb128> kenvandine, I've no strong opinion Depends or Recommends
<seb128> theorically it's a Recommends since the lib is a depends but you can uninstall the service and use fallback
<seb128> like rhythmbox depends on the lib
<bryce> rickspencer3, kenvandine: or if release tags were used, a report could be made of those as well, however I guess we wouldn't be able to distinguish between "normal" release blockers, and these
<seb128> but if you just dislike indicators you can remove the binary
 * pitti rings the bell
<pitti> Desktop Team Meeting
<pitti> tseliot, ArneGoetje, bryce, ccheney, Riddell, kenvandine, seb128: here?
<Riddell> oh aye
 * kenvandine waves
<bryce> heya
<seb128> pitti, there
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-12-15
<kenvandine> seb128, i'll change it to a recommends
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<pitti> welcome to the "Christmas" meeting edition
<seb128> kenvandine, let me know when you commit so I can sponsor
<pitti> = Outstanding actions from last meeting =
 * Riddell strings up some sparkly lights around the channel
 * pitti lights three candles
<pitti> = Outstanding actions from last meeting =
<pitti> ArneGoetje to talk to Robert about scanner failure in simple-scan
<pitti> ArneGoetje: I noticed you talking to Robert; what was the result?
<pitti> Everyone to add their conference interests
<pitti> seems that nobody did this, so
<Riddell> I did!
 * pitti hands Riddell a gold start
<pitti> star, sorry
<ArneGoetje> pitti: problem solved
<pitti> Robert did, too
 * tseliot1 missed the beginning of the meeting because of some weird issue with freenode
<pitti> ArneGoetje: sweet!
<pitti> tseliot1: not much lost
<pitti> so, let's just carry this forward, I'll mail the team (better than IRC)
<pitti> ACTION: pitti to send reminder about conference attendence
<kenvandine> tseliot1, freenode has been having issues :)
<pitti> I'll set up a wiki page again
<pitti> = Partner Update =
<kenvandine> ok
 * pitti bows to kenvandine
<tseliot> ok
<kenvandine> a bunch of DX uploads last thursday
<kenvandine> start of the weekly releases from DX for lucid
<kenvandine> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopExperienceTeam/LucidWeeklyReleases
<kenvandine> for info
<kenvandine> all the application-indicator related packages are also uploaded to a ppa for karmic
<kenvandine> for use by upstream projects that want to port their application to use the app indicator
<kenvandine> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopExperienceTeam/ApplicationIndicators
<kenvandine> for information on that
<kenvandine> rhythmbox has been ported already
<kenvandine> more to come
<pitti> what does that mean exactly? (didn't try it yet)
<kenvandine> thanks everyone for testing the gtk patches for cs-deco and rgba
<seb128> what should we do with those?
<pitti> app menus now moving to panel?
<seb128> what should we do with bugs about those?
<kenvandine> pitti, no
<seb128> rather
<seb128> do you want a team subscribed?
<seb128> a tag?
<kenvandine> pitti, moving apps from status icons to indicators
<kenvandine> so they all behave the same
<pitti> aah
<pitti> nice
<seb128> I expect somebody will want to track bugs due to those changes
<kenvandine> left click does the same thing
<kenvandine> etc
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> upstream dx task?
<kenvandine> seb128, assign all those bugs to me
<kenvandine> i will redirect them to dx :)
<seb128> I would prefer a way which allow to query those
<seb128> so anybody can know where we stand
<kenvandine> i will talk to dbarth about a tag to use
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> I will assign to you meanwhile
 * kenvandine will email the desktop list
<kenvandine> that is all i have
 * kenvandine hands mic back to pitti
<pitti> thanks Ken; questions anyone?
<pitti> = Kubuntu Update =
<Riddell> * alpha 1 out in typically alpha 1 shape
<pitti> ladies and gentlemen, the famours Mr. Riddell
<Riddell> * qt and kdelibs built on arm now, packages higher up the stack are getting done
<Riddell> * polkit-qt-1 just gone into archive
<pitti> yay
<Riddell> * KDE SC 4.4 beta 2 due to be tagged tomorrow, no rest for us!
<pitti> Riddell: does "arm" also mean "other ports" like ppc?
<pitti> polkit-qt-1> !
<pitti> great to see
<asac> \o/
<pitti> Riddell: do you know how many apps need to be ported for this?
<Riddell> pitti: I've not checked those, it's hard enough making sure arm works
<Riddell> pitti: kpackagekit is the main user and it has a version due which uses polkit-1
<pitti> Riddell: ports> nevermidn, was just curious
<pitti> Riddell: ah, that was 0.5, which is already out for a while, right?
<Riddell> yes
<Riddell> pitti: other KDE bits should just work, they all use KAuth API
<pitti> shouldn't be too hard either way
<pitti> rocking
<pitti> Riddell: any RC bugs which should be on the release radar? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus is suspiciously free of KDE bugs
<pitti> (not that I'm complaining)
<Riddell> pitti: there's probably a bunch that should be tagged, alpha 1 wasn't exactly bug free
<Riddell> you may action me for that :)
<pitti> it's a recurring task anyway :)
<pitti> thanks for the update, great progress
<pitti> ccheney: AYT?
<pitti> ok, let's skip this
<pitti> = All -- Setting goals for next cycle =
<pitti> not sure whether you got mail from allhands.c.c (I didn't)
<pitti> but the system shuold be open for entering your goals for the next cycle
<seb128> didn't either
<kenvandine> no mail :/
<tseliot> +1
<ArneGoetje> +1
<pitti> that needs to be done by Mid-January, so the free days should be good for some reflections about your next plans :)
<seb128> those plans are for lucid no?
<seb128> ie this cycle?
<pitti> well, not exactly
<pitti> for the next "Canonical" period
<pitti> they don't align
<seb128> right, but that pretty much cover lucid
<pitti> right
<seb128> oh
<pitti> half lucid, half maniac
<seb128> I usually make those goal match the ubuntu cycle
<ArneGoetje> pitti: maniac?
<pitti> 10.10 will be "Maniac Mansion", won't it? :-)
<seb128> pitti likes to play guessing next version names
<seb128> ;-)
<ArneGoetje> LOL
<kenvandine> hehe... maniac :)
<pitti> mumbling monkey, whatever
<kenvandine> we could have fun with that
<pitti> = Release Bugs/Release Status =
<kenvandine> our next crack release :)
<pitti> alpha-1 went out reasonably well, not much to say here
<pitti> someone has some specific concerns here?
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus has a few bugs only so far
<pitti> = Nvidia packages name schemes  =
<pitti> tseliot: floor's your's
<tseliot> ok
<tseliot> actually there are 2 ideas I would like to discuss with you
<tseliot> the 1st idea is to reduce the number of binary packages that the nvidia source generates
<tseliot> the 2nd idea is about changing name schemes
<tseliot> let's begin with the former
<pitti> like integrating vdpau etc. into the main package?
<tseliot> currently one source package generates a few binaries
<tseliot> yep
<tseliot> nvidia-185-kernel-source
<tseliot> nvidia-185-libvdpau
<tseliot> nvidia-185-libvdpau-dev
<tseliot> nvidia-185-modaliases
<tseliot> nvidia-glx-185
<tseliot> nvidia-glx-185-dev
<pitti> and perhaps merging all the -dev?
<tseliot> now, after the cure we would get something like this
<tseliot> nvidia-190 (contains glx, kernel-source, vdpau)
<tseliot> nvidia-190-modaliases
<tseliot> nvidia-190-dev
<tseliot> and vdpau-dev in Lucid lives in a separate source
<tseliot> named libvdpau
<pitti> is vdpau backwards compatible with older driver versions?
<tseliot> superm1 worked on libvdpau
<tseliot> pitti: older driver versions don't support vdpau AFAIK
<tjaalton> it's split now
<tseliot> therefore this won't be an issue
<tjaalton> libvdpau has all the common bits
<pitti> sweet
<tseliot> tjaalton: right, as I said above
<pitti> from my naive view, it seems that there's about zero reason to install e. g. kernel-source without the glx bits
<tseliot> having fewer binary packages should help us a bit with dependency problems
<tjaalton> the drivers then ship the support for the lib
<tseliot> pitti: exactly
<bryce> probably was like that for historical reasons mostly
<tseliot> right
<tseliot> yes, this is correct
<tseliot> we inherited that from the old days of the l-r-m
<pitti> so, that seems settled?
<tseliot> I think we all agree
<tseliot> the next point will be a bit more controversial ;)
<tseliot> shall I proceed?
<pitti> go ahead
<tseliot> ok
<tseliot> we discussed this at the UDS without coming to an agreement
<tseliot> the idea was to put the latest nvidia driver
<tseliot> i.e. the one which supports vdpau and has all the new features
<tseliot> in one source package
<tseliot> which doesn't contain the version of the driver in its name
<tseliot> something like nvidia-graphics-driver-current
<pitti> this is pretty much what we had earlier, isn't it?
<tseliot> which in turn would generate nvidia-current, nvidia-current-modaliases nvidia-current-dev
<tseliot> yep
<pitti> with -legacy, etc.
<tseliot> right
<pitti> and we abandoned it due to insurmountable upgrade issues
<tseliot> yes, I thought so
<tseliot> but I think we would have to use nvidia-common either way
<tseliot> in dist-upgrades
<tseliot> and changing the names would save us from having new source packages every time nvidia bumps the version of a driver
<tseliot> which in turn would mean that we won't have to put the new source in NEW
<tseliot> i.e. less work for archive admins
<pitti> hm, I think we should take a step back here
<tseliot> and easier bug tracking
<tseliot> ok
<pitti> and define what the behaviour on upgrades should be
<pitti> do we prefer (1) upgrading to the latest driver or (2) staying with the current version if it is still supported?
<pitti> (1) -> potentially better performance, but also total breakdown if your card isn't supported any more
<pitti> well, that can probably be alleviated with the changes we put into X
<pitti> (like fallback to nouveau)
<tseliot> when dist-upgrading through update manager we would ask nvidia-common to make a choice
<pitti> (2) -> safe approach, but needs special handling for obsoleted versions
<pitti> tseliot: I'd actually think that this would make bug triage harder, since you'd mix different versions into the same lists?
<pitti> bry... ugh, netsplit again?
<tseliot> obsolete drivers should be removed as we cannot guarantee compatibility with the kernel and with X
<kenvandine> yeah... freenode has been really sucking since last night
<tseliot> pitti: the same source will have different versions in lucid and lucid+1 though
<pitti> tseliot: so, I take it you favor the -current approach?
<tseliot> pitti: yes. If we need to check the version of the driver (for dist-upgrades) we can always use the modaliases (which is what nvidia-common does)
<seb128> note to self, focus is not always on the screen you use
<seb128> (ie ctrl-R is reconnect on IRC)
<pitti> tseliot: how would you name the older versions, still keeping the number?
<tseliot> pitti: yes, maybe
<tseliot> or we could use -legacy and something else
<pitti> so, my gut feeling is that this approach is more aggressive, but potentially more beneficial wrt. performance
<tseliot> avoiding names which are confusing ;)
<tjaalton> the drivers then ship the support for the lib
<pitti> I think it needs to go along with more robust driver detection
<tjaalton> oops
<pitti> i. e. not putting "nvidia" into xorg.conf any more, but autodetect it instead
 * tseliot nods
<pitti> to at least have a safety net for apt-get dist-upgrade, etc.
<pitti> but that's on the plan anyway, right?
<tseliot> yes, I guess so. I think bryce will work on that
<tseliot> I'll deal with the alternatives stuff soon
<pitti> tseliot: well, I think bryce and you should have consensus on this; you are the best persons to make the decision eventually
<pitti> but we should revist the reasons why we used a number-based schema in the past
<tseliot> ok, I think bryce agrees with this change but we can double check it when he's back
<pitti> archive NEW is really a no-op here, it's almost zero work
<tjaalton> the fallbacks don't work if there is an xorg.conf
<tjaalton> that could be fixed, though
<pitti> tjaalton: that would be the other fallback (bulletproof-x, vesa, etc.)?
<tseliot> tjaalton: yes, I guess so
<bryce__> sorry, freenode fell over, what'd I miss?
<tseliot> bryce or bryce__: are you ok with changing nvidia's name schemes?
<bryce__> regarding moving to something like nvidia-common - I favor this idea, it simplifies several things we currently have to fuss about with each time the number changes
<tjaalton> pitti: yes, server autodetection. uses different codepath if xorg.conf exists
<bryce__> tseliot, yup
<tseliot> bryce__: nvidia-current, nvidia-legacy (or nvidia-173), etc.
<pitti> bryce__: we discussed the change from version-based to "-current" naming schema for nvidia
<tjaalton> tseliot: uh, no legacy mess again :)
<tjaalton> could it be just nvidia-foo without -current?
<tseliot> tjaalton: or nvidia-current and nvidia-173 and nvidia-96
<pitti> so, at this point I feel we should move it to mail or after meeting, since it becomes a bit too technical now
<tseliot> ok
<bryce__> sounds good
<pitti> thanks for the heads-up
<pitti> bryce__: I can send you scrollback if you need
<bryce__>  nvidia-current and nvidia-173 and nvidia-96 would be fine; I'm open to alternate ideas to using numbers as well
<bryce__> pitti, thanks!
<pitti> anyway, it's the end of the agenda
<pitti> = AOB =
<pitti> ?
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> rick wanted me to bring up tracking of blocking bugs, perhaps using release tags
<kenvandine> everyone agree with that?
<kenvandine> i think that is just what we have always done :)
<pitti> blocking what eexactly?
<pitti> release tasks/milestones are for release blockers
<kenvandine> release blockers, so we can quickly see what bugs need to be addressed
<pitti> but I thought he had something special in mind
<pitti> like "this bug blocks the adoption of package foo"?
<bryce__> pitti, that's what I gathered as well
<kenvandine> like the immediate need is a way to see things like the broken rgba patch for gtk
<pitti> hm, that's a rather intricate concept
<kenvandine> visibility for stuff that won't land until they are fixed
<kenvandine> pitti, probably just the release milestones
<bryce__> it sounded like he wanted a way to flag bugs on packages that should go in but haven't yet, from other general release bug tasks
<pitti> couldn't we just use an early milestone and track it on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus ?
<kenvandine> sigh... another netsplit
<kenvandine> pitti, yeah
<kenvandine> that is what i am thinking
<kenvandine> he just wanted us to all agree on a method
<pitti> -ENOSEB
<kenvandine> so anyone against?
<pitti> meh, this is really ugly
<pitti> kenvandine: it seems straightforward, and in line what we already do, and should work AFAICS?
<kenvandine> yeah, seb128 you ok with using release milestones for blockers like rick mentioned?
<pitti> kenvandine: you could also create  milestones on the ayatana project
<kenvandine> and track them on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus
<pitti> seb128: wb
<kenvandine> and there he is again :)
<pitti> seb128: I wanted to ask you whether you have similar situations
<pitti> like, you need a bug fixed before we can add package foo
<seb128> re
<seb128> sorry, split
<seb128> I'm out of context I think
<seb128> right, that happens
<pitti> seb128: there's a bug report which you need fixed before we can upload/enable a package foo
<pitti> any particular way to track/mark/tag it?
<seb128> not right now
<seb128> that doesn't happen often
<seb128> upstream roll tarballs when they are confident the code is ready for users
<pitti> we were proposing to just using an early milestone and tracking it on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus
<kenvandine> pitti, i think tracking this at the lucid milestone level is fine
<seb128> hum
<seb128> works for me I guess
<kenvandine> i think alpha-2 is fine
<kenvandine> nothing more granular
<pitti> ok, great
<kenvandine> imho
<pitti> kenvandine: well, if you need more granularity, create ayatana milestones :)
<kenvandine> at least all the bugs are easy to find and rick can quickly see what is outstanding
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> sure
<pitti> or the good old IRC poke "*nnng* need this now"
<bryce__> wee freenode
<pitti> ok, we are done anyway, and with half of the team constantly appearing and disappearing it's no fun
<pitti> == end meeting ==
<pitti> thanks everyone!
<kenvandine> ok, thanks all :)
<ArneGoetje> thanks
<seb128> ok, thank you
<bryce__> thanks
<seb128> I've things I want to discuss but I can do that out of meeting
<seb128> it doesn't really require full team
<pitti> bryce__, tseliot: so, as I said the two of you should eventually decide whether or not to rename the packages to -current/-legacy
<pitti> I'm just concerned about reintroducing the upgrade problems which made us use version-based packages in the first place..
<pitti> bryce__: (there wasn't much new input in the discussion, I think)
<bryce__> pitti, well the thinking was we could retain the numbers for the legacy drivers, and just move the latest one to nvidia-current
 * tseliot nods
<bryce__> that'd solve 95% of the issues we care about, without opening the old -legacy can of worms
<bryce__> and we'll have to rename -190 to -195 or whatever anyway, so switching to -current instead shouldn't be any more work than we'd already be doing anyway
<tseliot> right
<bryce__> and then in theory we'd never need to do renames again, unless nvidia spawns another legacy driver
<tseliot> and I wanted to discuss this today because I'm working on the new packages
<tseliot> and that would be just an additional nvidia-whatever_version package
<bryce__> tseliot, what were the arguments against this rename?  I forget who raised issues at UDS
<tseliot> bryce__: I *think* it was pitti
<tseliot> the argument was how are dist-upgrade going to work?
<bryce__> ok
<pitti> bryce__: automatically upgrading users to a potentially unsupported driver, and mixing major versions in bugs
<bryce__> but really that would be of no greater difficulty than what we already have going from -190 to -200 or whatever, yeah?
<tseliot> my reply was that we'll have to use nvidia common to make the right choice about drivers in dist-upgrades either way
<bryce__> pitti, ah right mixing major versions for bug reports
<tseliot> that's the point on which I have more doubts
<bryce__> on that point, I tend to feel with -nvidia that the differences from one major version to another are not as significant as with other software.  -185 to -190 is sort of like a 0.18.5 to 0.19.0 in a normal project
<bryce__> in other words, a lot of bugs that affect -185 still are there in -190
<tseliot> true :-/
<bryce__> I fussed with doing scripts to have people re-test and re-file bugs when we went from -170 to -180 or some such, and it worked but mostly all the same bugs were there, and was a collosal time suck for everyone
<bryce__> on the plus side, it made the bug reports shorter (at expense of some history), but we ended up with just as many bugs if not more
<bryce__> also, using source package renames to indicate version changes doesn't seem like the right way to do things in launchpad...  with -intel for instance we keep track of versions on the drivers without changing the source package name; seems we ought to be able to track -nvidia versions just the same
<tseliot> if bryce__ says so (and he did much more bug triaging that I did with nvidia), I have no further doubts on this
<tseliot> pitti: ^^
<pitti> fair enough
<pitti> bryce__: if we get the x.org driver autodetection patches, then apt-get dist-upgrading to a driver which doesn't support your card will at least not be the end of the world
<tseliot> bryce__: do the autodetection patches use the nvidia modaliases?
<tseliot> if not we could make it do so
<Keybuk> pitti: if only we had X hotplug drivers ;)
<bryce__> for evidence you can make it out on http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Graphs/totals.svg - there is a small yellow blotch on the left for -177 which I closed out with a script, but you can see the -180 bugs start coming in at the same time, and soon we had just as many bugs (and today about 4x as many as we used to
<Keybuk> it could listen in on graphics and drm subsystem events as well as input
<Keybuk> and then you could hotplug graphics cards
<Keybuk> (or switch between drivers by using ACTION=change)
<tseliot> Keybuk: if the kernel supported that
<Keybuk> it does
<Keybuk> it's X that doesn't
<tseliot> oh
<pitti> bryce__, tseliot: I updated https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-12-15 with a short summary; please feel free to elaborate/correct me
<bryce__> pitti, thanks
<tseliot> pitti: perfect. Thanks a lot
<seb128> kenvandine, the rhythmbox application indicator not good
<seb128> for one thing I've a not found icon
<seb128> and for the other thing I'm unable to open rhythmbox because I closed it minimized previous run
<seb128> and I don't know how to un-iconify it from there
 * seb128 opens bugs
<seb128> mvo, xapian is weird ;-) synaptic doesn't find "indicator-application" when typing "indicator-applicatio"
<seb128> or anything before you enter the entire word
<seb128> once you type the "n" it's listed
<jcastro> kenvandine: is the rb-indicator thing supposed to work in lucid yet or not?
<jcastro> I get no icon at all
<kenvandine> jcastro, there was a missing dep
<kenvandine> fix is uploaded
<kenvandine> you need indicator-application
<seb128> kenvandine, did you get what I wrote before?
<seb128> kenvandine, I get no icon either
<kenvandine> now i did
<seb128> or a broken icon
<kenvandine> the icon thing we know about
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> hidden i hadn't seen
<seb128> I opened a bug
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> it's not specific to upgrade
<seb128> if you have the gconf key to hide on close
<kenvandine> yeah, i can see that
<kenvandine> that should be an easy fix
 * kenvandine will try to fix it without waiting for cody :)
<rickspencer3> desktop team below the trendline!!
<rickspencer3> yeah
<bryce__> I had a productive day yesterday :-)
<rickspencer3> thanks bryce__
<rickspencer3> does this mean you have extra capacity and I can assign you more work?
<rickspencer3> j/k
<bryce__> :-P
<jcastro> do people typically try to get ahead before a long break so they don't get hosed when they come back?
<jcastro> because that's what I am trying to do
<rickspencer3> just make sure loose ends are tied up and you've done all the things you told people  you would do
<rickspencer3> getting ahead is for suckers
<rickspencer3> "work is infinite, time is finite, etc..."
<rickspencer3> jcastro, ^
<jcastro> I see
<kenvandine> seb128, i have a fix for the hidden thing... just not sure what mpt would think :)
<dobey> time is an illusion
<jcastro> kenvandine: is rhythmbox app indicator in lucid supposed to work yet or not?
<seb128> kenvandine, display an extra item in the menu for it?
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> jcastro, it does if you install indicator-application
<kenvandine> same as what the icon did before
<seb128> jcastro, will be installed for you after next publishing I guess
<seb128> if the update is not published yet
<seb128> jcastro, and yes, it "works"
<seb128> ie it has a broken icon and don't allow you to unhide rhythmbox
<seb128> if you are one of those who map close to hide in the notification...
<kenvandine> seb128, should i upload this fix?
<seb128> kenvandine, yes
 * kenvandine thinks this is critical :)
<seb128> kenvandine, we can tweak later
<jcastro> hah, mine starts minimized, so I can't unhide rb.
<kenvandine> jcastro, exactly :)
<seb128> jcastro, dito
<kenvandine> i have a fix
<jcastro> and the icon fix is cody's todo right?
<seb128> kenvandine, is there a bug for the broken icon btw?
<kenvandine> not sure, jcastro ^^?
<kenvandine> i will take a quick look at the icon
<seb128> rickspencer3, btw it made me think about a question I had for the meeting
<seb128> rickspencer3, do we have a policy for adding work items?
<seb128> would doing that break the trend estimation?
<seb128> like I could add a bunch of items for login speed
<seb128> things we figured are slowing boot on the way
<jcastro> I don't think there's a bug for the icon
<jcastro> seb128: kenvandine: I file file a bug on it now
<seb128> jcastro, thank you, do you know where to file it?
<seb128> is that a client or server issue?
<jcastro> I was going to file it under rhythmbox(ubuntu) and tag it
<seb128> ok
<seb128> maybe subscribe ted to it
<seb128> in case that's a libdbusmenu thing
<jcastro> I was going to sub cody to it, he wrote the patch and was aware it was broken
<jcastro> but then he left for a sprint
<seb128> jcastro, ok
<dobey> hrmm
<dobey> how do i tell bzr builddeb which e-mail to sign the packages with?
<rickspencer3> dobey, I don't much abotu this, but I suspect you want DEBMAIL=
<jcastro> seb128: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox/+bug/497095
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 497095 in rhythmbox "App indicator icon is broken" [High,Triaged]
<seb128> jcastro, thanks
<seb128> rickspencer3, so you are around and just ignore my questions ;-)
<dobey> rickspencer3: want it where? i usually just pass -k to debbuild
<seb128> -- -option
<dobey> ah
<jcastro> seb128: the planet is netsplitting so I am missing all sorts of parts of the conversation
<rickspencer3> hi seb128
<seb128> jcastro, right I noticed
<seb128> hey rickspencer3 ;-)
<rickspencer3> yes you are in my /ignore list
<dobey> or not
<seb128> rickspencer3, didn't get my question 10 minutes ago?
<rickspencer3> actually, no
<dobey> bzr did not like me doing -- -k 'email'
<dobey> "No such file or directory: email"
<seb128> dobey, bzr-buildpackage -- option
<rickspencer3> for some reason my irc client shows everyone disconnected from the channel and then reconnected it
<seb128> it's the key number usually
<seb128> not the email
<rickspencer3> and then it scrolled your question off the top of the list
<rickspencer3> <seb128> rickspencer3, btw it made me think about a question I had for the meeting
<rickspencer3>  rickspencer3, do we have a policy for adding work items?
<seb128> rickspencer3, that's ok ;-)
<dobey> seb128: i only have one key
<seb128> dobey, it should use the email in the changelog then, and your key should have that email
<dobey> seb128: but i sign packages with different e-mail addresses depending
<dobey> seb128: my key does have that e-mail, but dpkg always fails unless i pass -k
<seb128> dobey, well I use bzr-buildpackage -- option
<seb128> and that works there
<seb128> I do sponsoring this way
<chrisccoulson> dobey - setting DEBSIGN_KEYID=key_id in ~/.devscripts should work also, if you want to use 1 key to sign packages
<dobey> and bzr-buildpackage gives me the same error
<seb128> did you try without the space?
<seb128> before the email
<dobey> chrisccoulson: i only HAVE 1 key
<dobey> oh right
<chrisccoulson> dobey - then defining it in ~/.devscripts is probably what you want ;)
<chrisccoulson> you won't have to pass -k every time then
<dobey> oh that's evil
<dobey> bzr-builddeb stripped the quotes
<seb128> the number of key is not revelant
<seb128> it's just trying to match changelog and key
<seb128> if it fails you can specify the key number you use
<dobey> seb128: but it's failing
<seb128> or an email
<dobey> seb128: no idea why it's failing, it just always does... it shouldn't
<seb128> having only one key doesn't prevent you to specify that's the one you want
<seb128> because it doesn't find a key matching the changelog entry?
<seb128> if you specify you want to use your only key number if will do it
<seb128> I'm doing that when sponsoring for example
<dobey> huh
<dobey> for some reason it still failed when i passed the email with -k
<seb128> what error do you get?
<dobey> but it works when i do debuild -S -k elsewhere
<seb128> you can use debsign after build
<dobey> it says secret key not available
<dobey> which makes no sense to me
<seb128> bzr-buildpackage --source
<seb128> and design .changes ...
<seb128> try unsetting GPG_AGENT_INFO
<seb128> in case that would be the agent breaking things
<cj> is there anything special I need to do in order to do audio over HDMI?
<dobey> for some reason it doesn't like "Name <email>" but "email" is fine
<dobey> i guess debsign is looking it up wrong
<seb128> ok
<seb128> dinner time there
<seb128> bbl
<dobey> bon appetit seb128
<dobey> thanks
<seb128> rickspencer3, so did you get the work item question?
<rickspencer3> seb128, yes, i was waiting for you guys to finish
<rickspencer3> so, I don't have a policy
<seb128> should we be adding items or not?
<rickspencer3> I think if you are doing the work, you should add it to the work item list
<seb128> I think the trend line will not update
<seb128> ok
<rickspencer3> and I trust your judgment regarding whether you should be doing the work in the first place
<seb128> right, my concern was rather the trend impact
<rickspencer3> seb128, ah yes
<seb128> since the line is based on initial count
<rickspencer3> in that case, my policy is that you should add work items
<seb128> and will not change with count updates
<rickspencer3> seb128, right, but that's ok
<seb128> ok thanks
<rickspencer3> if we didn't account for all of our work, then we should see that for what it is
<rickspencer3> thanks seb128
<seb128> ;-)
<dobey> jpds: are you around?
<seb128> I don't plan to add many items anyway
<seb128> just some granularity to login tasks
<pitti> kenvandine: indicator-application upload should work for you now
<kenvandine> thx
 * pitti waves good night
<baptistemm_> pitti, is it safe to remove hal in lucid system?
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm_ - i don't think that anything depends on it by default anymore
<chrisccoulson> so you should be ok to remove it now
<baptistemm_> okay, just sound-juicer depends on it
<baptistemm_> I asked because I feared some deps were missing
<chrisccoulson> that's not on the default install is it?
<baptistemm_> perhaps not but I upgraded from some versions so I cary some old packages
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm_ - yeah, sound-juicer is not on the default install, but is pulled in by one of the gnome desktop meta-packages
<baptistemm_> hey, I have weird notifcation bubbles
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm_ - that's normal ;)
<baptistemm_> ah okay
 * baptistemm_ just upgraded to lucid
<chrisccoulson> notify-osd is running in debug mode for the development period
<baptistemm_> so wireframes are normal
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm_ - are you running lucid on real hardware?
<baptistemm_> yep
<chrisccoulson> you have a spare machine then, or do you use it on your production machine?
<baptistemm_> I that sound crazy
<baptistemm_> no no I just have a laptop and nothing else
<chrisccoulson> i only have one computer here, so i have to stick with karmic, or risk being told off by my girlfriend ;)
<chrisccoulson> i really need to invest in some new hardware
<baptistemm_> I don't have enough space to have another computer
<bryce__> only one computer?
 * bryce__ boggles
<chrisccoulson> heh, me neither, but i would just remove some furniture from our spare bedroom and convert it to office space instead
<chrisccoulson> bryce - yeah, only one computer here :(
<chrisccoulson> i can't really justify buying another at the moment ;)
<chrisccoulson> and my employer is too tight to give me a laptop too
<bryce> I have 8 just here in the room I'm in currently
<baptistemm_> I had had an office space which is now my son room
<bryce> not counting ones in various state of disassembly ;-)
<chrisccoulson> bryce - i bet it must get warm in there!
<baptistemm_> and what about global warming !!!!
<bryce> yep, but rarely do I have more than 3 on at once
<chrisccoulson> i would have them all on at once!
<chrisccoulson> :)
<bryce> baptistemm, I justify it figuring if it helps me more quickly eliminate one power saving bug that is affecting all of ubuntu than it more than pays for itself ;-)
 * didrocks tries to restart hoping the nvidia binary driver stuff had been fixed with the 8 bryce's computers :)
<baptistemm_> chrisccoulson, whaaaat you have a child with your gf, you're not married !!!
 * baptistemm_ is just kidding
 * baptistemm_ is in the same situation
<chrisccoulson> heh, yeah, marriage is far too expensive :P
<chrisccoulson> and i don't like spending money
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<baptistemm_> same thing
<baptistemm_> and girls are becoming dead-crazing with marriage
<baptistemm_> s/crazing/crazy/
<dobey> marriage is cheap
<dobey> weddings are expensive
 * baptistemm_ is pllainning some free time during christmas week for ubuntu and gnome hacking
<chrisccoulson> dobey - yeah, that's what i meant
 * baptistemm_ is  confused about marriage and wedding 
<bryce> weddings don't have to be expensive ;-)
<dobey> they don't have to be
<chrisccoulson> one of our friends spent Â£20000 on their wedding ceremony, which is just crazy
<bryce> baptistemm, wedding is the ceremony where you become married
<chrisccoulson> that's basically a nice car :)
<dobey> but the bride and her mother generally want them to be
<rickspencer3> bryce, here is the promised JSON format for bughugger
<rickspencer3> please note that I haven't actually implemented using this spec yet
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bughugger/JSONformat
<bryce> got it
<rickspencer3> could you please let me know when you get around to doing it so I can hook it all up?
<rickspencer3> it shouldn't take me long to implement, but will be waaay easier with some data
<bryce> rickspencer3, sure.  I'm in the middle of redoing the signal handling code so we can get apport handling X crashes again with xserver 1.7.  Probably won't be until tomorrow that I get a chance to hammer on arsenal some more
<rickspencer3> bryce, understood
<rickspencer3> that is appropriate privatization, thanks for letting me know
<chrisccoulson> bah, freenode fail
<TheMuso> Freenode has been failing a fair bit lately it seems. :)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it's been terrible all day
<bryce> -christel- [Global Notice] Hi all, as the europeans among us are already aware from earlier, we are experiencing heavy DDoS directed at several locations. For further information please /mode yournick +w or join #freenode. Thank you for your patience.
<chrisccoulson> i thought that maybe my employer was blocking me from accessing it ;)
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, welcome back
<chrisccoulson> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, hey
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, good.  trying to get everything done before the holidays though :)
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell - when do you finish for the holiday?
<rickspencer3> hi robert_ancell
<rickspencer3> is TheMuso here as well?
<robert_ancell> I'm off from Thursday next week
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell - still a few more days left yet then ;) i'm off from thursday next week too, but a lot of my colleagues finish this week
<chrisccoulson> i should have saved some vacation ;)
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Yes.
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, quiet offices can be good :)
<rickspencer3> hi TheMuso, welcome back
<rickspencer3> can we start the Eastern Edition like 5 minutes late?
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Sure, and thanks.
<rickspencer3> for no better idea than I started brewing some coffee and I want to go get it :/
<rickspencer3> ^worse excuse ever
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3 - that's a good excuse really. you should never let coffee go cold ;)
<rickspencer3> well ... to make your friends wait for you while you go brew coffee is probably a pretty common thing in Seattle
<TheMuso> And if I could indulge all of you in here to please read this, and take action as suggested, to protest against the Australian government's net filter legislation being planned. http://bethesignal.org/blog/2009/12/15/black-out-your-avatar-to-protest-nocleanfeed/
<rickspencer3> but not sure how it plays in au
<TheMuso> I am not going to spam this everywhere, but thought I'd bring it up with my team mates at least. If you read planet Ubuntu, you should also have seen it there.
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, we're pretty laid back in au
<rickspencer3> hehe
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, TheMuso, ready?
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-12-15
<robert_ancell> go!
<rickspencer3> this should be quite fast
<rickspencer3> so, let's get those conference interests updated
<rickspencer3> actually, I suppose TheMuso wasn't here for this
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, please add your conference attendance plans as per the wiki
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, same for you, though I suppose it's a bitter pill hearing about this from now ;)
<rickspencer3> next up was the partner update, mostly Ux was covered
<rickspencer3> the key thing to be aware there is that weekly releases are every Thursday, just like in Karmic and also that the client side deco work is still hitting some pretty significant bugs, so seb128 is holding the line on letting those get uploaded
<TheMuso> ok
<rickspencer3> Kubuntu status seems to be par for the course
<rickspencer3> release status only looked at work this week, not bugs
<rickspencer3> our burndown chart looks good, we are under the trend line
<robert_ancell> but christmas is coming...
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, yup
<rickspencer3> I expect we will be well above the trend line when we get back from break ;)
<rickspencer3> there as an xorg discussion regarding nvidia
<rickspencer3> since i wasn't at the main meeting, I missed the discussion, so if you are interested, please look at the wiki and at logs
<TheMuso> hrm ok will do.
 * TheMuso is interested since he uses NVIDIA hardware.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, I'll paste the notes, hold on
<rickspencer3> Currently the source produces a lot of different binaries, mainly for historical reasons. They will be changed to just produce three packages (nvidia-190, nvidia-190-modaliases, nvidia-190-dev). libvdpau will become a version-independent separate source.
<rickspencer3> There was some discussion about going back from version number based package names to -current/-legacy (or a mix). Both approaches have their pros and cons, but it was determined that fixed package names are easier to maintain (both the packages themselves as well as the bug reports). nvidia-common needs to be used during upgrades either way, and with the planned X.org autodetection changes, apt-get dist-upgrade'ing into a new dr
<rickspencer3> iver version which does not support your card any more should not be the end of the world any more.
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, we need to meet this week for performance review
<rickspencer3> are you available this morning?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, sure
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, we need to meet also, can we use our regularly scheduled call tomorrow morning?
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: That was my plan, so yes thats fine.
<rickspencer3> great
<rickspencer3> any other business?
<robert_ancell> no
<TheMuso> no
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> great
 * rickspencer3 taps gavel
<seb128> hello robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey, in meeting
<seb128> ok
<seb128> robert_ancell, there is no hurry I just wanted to ask if,when you think you will look at gnome-panel speed issues
<seb128> just to not dup work before looking at those
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, been looking at them. lets discuss in 10 mins ok?
<seb128> I'm not having lot of luck on nautilus so far and I might have a look at gnome-panel for a change
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok
 * seb128 goes back to some nautilus strace reading
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, here's what I am trying to do, and maybe you can help
<rickspencer3> essentially, I want to build TreeViews that have columns typed appropriately BUT ...
<rickspencer3> I don't know what the columns will be at  design time, I need to discover them at run time
<robert_ancell> seb128, http://paste.ubuntu.com/342197/
<rickspencer3> but TreeView ListStores are instantiated with a series of types as arguments, not as a list
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, so you want the columns to be visible but filled with data at a later point?
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you figure anything using those?
<robert_ancell> (and the type of data is not known until a later point)
<seb128> robert_ancell, I did something similar for nautilus
<seb128> (ie following federico blog)
<robert_ancell> seb128, the things that stand out is - the widgets are being loaded in series which seems inefficient
<robert_ancell> seb128, some, especially indicator-applet take a long time for the binary to load (and it is started last)
<seb128> right, the indicator applet issue is known
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, this is a modified federico patch, and I updated his time plotter
<seb128> they have to optimize their code
<seb128> I stopped using the plotter
<seb128> I read strace logs now...
<robert_ancell> seb128, also connecting to gnome-session is really expensive
<robert_ancell> seb128, man, you're in deep
<seb128> heh
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, you there?
<seb128> you mean reading .ICEauthority etc?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, yeah, was just waiting for you to finish up with seb128
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, so ...
<seb128> rickspencer3, that could be a long discussion, you guys just cut me there
<rickspencer3> ?
<seb128> rickspencer3, the login speed discussion could take a while
<rickspencer3> seb128, ok
<seb128> ie don't bother waiting for it to be done
<seb128> there is no hurry there
<robert_ancell> seb128, gnome_client_connect()
<seb128> we can move to query if that flood the channel
<rickspencer3> may I go on? I think robert_ancell may be able to help me rather more quickly
<seb128> sure
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, yeah, I can do both
 * rickspencer3 picks robert_ancell'
<rickspencer3> s gtk brain
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, heh, you have the apostrophe/enter problem too
<rickspencer3> ok, so robert_ancell the issue is that I don't know how many columns or the types needed at run time
<rickspencer3> so, I handle it like this currently: col_types = [gobject.TYPE_STRING for i in xrange(col_count)]
<rickspencer3>         col_types[len(self.keys)] = gobject.TYPE_PYOBJECT
<rickspencer3>         self.list_store = gtk.ListStore(*col_types)
<rickspencer3> I guess I could iterate the col_types, check it against the some hint list passed in, and then change the type before passing the pointer to the list_store
<rickspencer3> so like
<rickspencer3> for col_type in col_types:
<rickspencer3>  if matches some test:
<rickspencer3>    col_type = new_type
<rickspencer3> thoughts?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, right, I think you really need to implement a new TreeModel
<rickspencer3> you mean derive from ListStore?
<rickspencer3> what would that buy me?
<rickspencer3> just cleaner code?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, so your saying what you do currently is make a model with essentially void pointers and lots of columns and hope the user doesn't dynamically add too many columns
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, well neither ListStore or TreeStore allow dynamic changing of columsn
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, the user can't add columns
<rickspencer3> the problem is just setting up the column types when I don't know them at design time
<rickspencer3> I infer the columns from the data that the TreeView is trying to present
<rickspencer3> so I can just use TYPE_STRING, except then numbers don't sort correctly
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, do you have an example program?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, yes, this is the dictionary_grid widget in Quidgets
<rickspencer3> however, after explaining it to you, I think I may have hit upon a solution (in classic problem solving style)
 * rickspencer3 tries
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I am on track to solving this problem ... BUT
<rickspencer3> man I hate gtk TreeViews
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, yeah, they're a bit of a mess...
<rickspencer3> they are just so rigid
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, so looking at dictionary_grid.py, I'm not sure of the problem, you create the list_store in __reset_model() and you have the dictionary at that point so you can work out what the coulmns need to be by scanning the dictionary (though it may be inconsistent)
<rickspencer3> to make this robust I will need to store the array of goject types for the columns, and then test each value and cast it as appropriate
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, right, that's essentially what I am doing
<rickspencer3> by default, they will be strings, unless the key is named by a conventional name, like "id"
<robert_ancell> seb128, so I will look at the gnome-panel stuff again today but don't let that stop you working on it.  Just email me if you make any progress
<seb128> robert_ancell, I'm not likely going to look at it this week
<rickspencer3> and I will allow the consumer to pass in "type hints" to tell the grid what types to use for certain columns
<rickspencer3> *sigh*
<seb128> but maybe a bit during holidays if I'm bored
<robert_ancell> seb128, _really_ bored
<seb128> robert_ancell, I've been stracing nautiilus a lot for a week
<robert_ancell> seb128, anything low hanging?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, that's the problem with dynamic languages - it's hard to not treat the data all as strings
<seb128> not really
<seb128> I've found one thing that alex fixed quickly this week
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, well ... this is an API issue
<seb128> .gtk-bookmarks was rewritten 5 times at login
<rickspencer3> if I were doing this in C I would have the same issue
<robert_ancell> seb128, so I'm thinking with gnome-panel we should at least be able to start all the applet processes at the same time but I don't think it's going to be a simple patch
<seb128> otherwise it's hard to find slow code, alex is writting good code and has been cleaning nautilus regularly with gvfs, etc migrations
<seb128> I'm not sure it's going to help much
<seb128> those are starting in 3 seconds on my laptop and it's 2 years old now...
<seb128> the mini is very cpu limited
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, I'm thinking there's not much more that 0.5-1 second to gain from all this
<seb128> the cpu is at 100% during whole loading
<seb128> we need to do less, not to shuffle when
<seb128> nautilus is though, like one my laptop one full second is ld loading
<seb128> 70 libs to load = 1 second
<robert_ancell> seb128, the other thing is the panel keeps getting laid out by gtk while loading - it should only do that at the end.  But that looks really hard to modify in the existing code
<seb128> 1 second is icon caches loading
<seb128> 1 second is fontconfig
<seb128> then you get mimetype database loading
<seb128> some icons reading
<seb128> gtk pixbuf loaders init
<seb128> pango init
<seb128> translations opening
<seb128> there is not much to reduce that I can find so far
<seb128> out of reducing our number of installed themes, fonts, etc
<dtchen> seb128: I take it those actions are all user-specific?
<robert_ancell> seb128, I'm really surprised how inefficient the kernel is at loading libraries.  I don't get why it takes so long
<seb128> dtchen, not really but disk is not the limiting part there, ie preloading is already done
<dtchen> seb128: ah, cpu-bound
<robert_ancell> (or ld if that is the slow part of loading libs)
<seb128> yes
<seb128> the mini has a ssd drive
<seb128> disk is really not an issue
<seb128> robert_ancell, dunno what is the slow part, I just strace and look to it
<seb128> ie
<seb128> $ echo 3 | sudo tee /proc/sys/vm/drop_caches
<seb128> and strace -tt nautilus
<seb128> it takes almost one second on cold cache with my hdd
<seb128> it takes some 0.3 seconds on mini ssd
<seb128> robert_ancell, one other thing is x11, libice reads .ICEauthority twice
<robert_ancell> seb128, well it might have changed in 0.1s :)
<seb128> one for xsmp one for ice
<seb128> but the second loading is actual quick since it's in cache
<seb128> but the first read takes some 0.5 seconds
<seb128> robert_ancell, see http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/nautilus
<seb128> robert_ancell, those are notes from me reading through nautilus strace on the mini at login
<robert_ancell> seb128, right
<seb128> ie I changed the .desktop to run it under strace
<seb128> so I've login cache conditions etc
<robert_ancell> ah good idea
<seb128> another thing taking half of a second is the wallpaper
<seb128> but I don't see a way around it, it needs to load and display an image
<seb128> and that takes a bit of time
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, you could cache the image in a decompressed format I guess?
<seb128> robert_ancell, right, that would be nice
<seb128> I'm wondering if nautilus does that already
<robert_ancell> seb128, I don't think so
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, so I have run time col type setting basically working
<chrisccoulson> if xsplash comes back, is there any chance that backround pixmap created by xsplash could be used as the wallpaper? (or is that even possible?)
<chrisccoulson> that would save on reading image / sending to server etc
<rickspencer3> so now I'll program in some robustness by trying to detect the type and cast values passed in as the correct type at runtime
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, cool, committed?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, in the bughugger code, but not in Quidgets yet
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, ok
<rickspencer3> let me add it to Quidgets, will take 5 mins
<seb128> chrisccoulson, that's a good question and I don't know
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, it was just a thought. i'm not sure how easy that would be to do though
<chrisccoulson> but re-using server-side pixmaps must save a little bit of time :)
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, pushed, not that I don't have the tests written yet
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, pulling
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, makes sense
<seb128> chrisccoulson, right
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, the hinting is a bit annoying from an API point of view but there's no schemas to get this info from couch right?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, this is dictionary_grid, the backing store is just a dict
<rickspencer3> the hinting is annoying, but that's because TreeView is annoying
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, right, so the CouchGrid will be simpler to use
<rickspencer3> I could use test() to infer the types
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, not really, the APIs will be similar, just some extra stuff for CouchGrid
<rickspencer3> the hinting is optional though
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, the thing is, the user can add a list of dictionaries, and then add new rows too
<rickspencer3> there is no way to guarantee that every value for each key will always be the same type
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, yeah, but in normal use it will be
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, so you are saying, infer the type from the first row of values passed in, and then just be robust against the cases where that assumption is violated?
<rickspencer3> I can keep the hinting for the rare case where an override is needed
<rickspencer3> I could extend that logic to filters as well
<rickspencer3> the other option is to go the rails route
<rickspencer3> use naming conventions
<rickspencer3> so id is always an int unless overriden, etc...
<rickspencer3> anything that ends with count, etc..
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, well, no I'm more saying there's not a good match between user expectations and what the API can handle.  The user could be thinking "column x is all integers - it should automatically treat them like integers" but there's no scalable way to do that automatically
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, convention over configuration can
<rickspencer3> that's scalable and can set expecations
<rickspencer3> than the hinting can be used to override the conventions (like when ID is a string)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, right, I haven't used rails so I'm still a little unsettled by this convention stuff :)
<rickspencer3> mmm
<rickspencer3> well, if robert_ancell finds it unsettling, it must be good stuff ... so that's decided
<robert_ancell> lol
<rickspencer3> so if it ends in "count" I can make it an int
<rickspencer3> if it is "price" or "cost" I can make it a float
<rickspencer3> then when rows are added, I iterate through each and ensure it is a type that will be accepted by the column so the user doesn't get those pesky errors from the TreeView
<rickspencer3> I should support checkboxes in the views too
<rickspencer3> and all this will have to be modified so that it can be translated, I suppose
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-12-16
<ccheney> pitti: sorry about earlier, i'm off until jan 4
<ccheney> pitti: wrt the xulrunner status i have the wiki page up to date with what is currently using it on for the various releases
<asac> ccheney: you are off?
<asac> gtk ;)
<ccheney> asac: yea
<asac> have a great vac then ;)
<asac> if you need some action we should start backporting stuff ;)
<ccheney> do we need to put the new firefox in before converting the packages over, or what is the next step?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Usually the keyboard module in the kernel has an option to allow you to revert the fn functinoality, and I even think this is adjustable in the keyboard prefs.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, yes, I figured it was configurable but if it is the default then it's only a feature for advanced users
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: I agree with you there. I know on my MacBook Pro, I have to change it, as I prefer to use brightness/volume etc with the fn key, because I am less likely to use them than I am using a function key proper.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, yes, I'm very surprised my laptop has "disable wifi" on the p
<robert_ancell> F2 key - that seems way to easy to bump
 * TheMuso nods.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, I just screwed up a package version, is 2.28.0-0ubuntu6netbook2 greater than 2.28.0-0ubuntu6netbook1ubuntu2?
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, 2.28.0-0ubuntu6netbook2 is greater than 2.28.0-0ubuntu6netbook1ubuntu2?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, thanks :)
<kenvandine> np
<kenvandine> dpkg --compare-versions
<kenvandine> :)
<robert_ancell> dch keeps confusing me
<kenvandine> me too
<kenvandine> :)
<didrocks> pitti: lool sponsored my work on une session if you didn't notice. Sorry for the conffile mess up, it was the first time I moved a conffile and I didn't thought about existing "non standard" configuration. It's in my mind now ;)
<seb128> hey there!
<didrocks> salut seb128, il n'y a personne pour le moment ;) Ã§a va ?
<seb128> salut didrocks, oui, et toi ?
<didrocks> Ã§a va, plus que 2 jours et des poussiÃ¨res \o/
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> how are you?
<didrocks> morning chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128 / didrocks
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm good thanks, just got some coffee :)
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> still a bit sleepy but good thanks
<chrisccoulson> pitti - would you mind me doing a karmic SRU for bug 428884, in gnome-screensaver? it seems that users are becoming a bit unhappy that it doesn't work properly now
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 428884 in gnome-screensaver "gnome-screensaver-command --poke no longer inhibits screensaver" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/428884
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur: i just saw bug 450934 - that's not really a bug there
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 450934 in gnome-screensaver "Mandatory idle_delay is not honored in Karmic" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/450934
<chrisccoulson> that gconf key is not used by gnome-screensaver any more
<chrisccoulson> it uses the idle delay set by a key owned by gnome-session
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur - the correct key is actually /desktop/gnome/session/idle_delay
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - are you looking forward to the festive break?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: maybe we should ask upstream to remove this key from the schema, so.
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yes, very much!
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, possibly
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - do you finish this week?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you take holidays for the end of year?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yes, friday after work until next year
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i've used all my holiday already, so I'm working up until christmas eve ;)
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> good luck with that
<chrisccoulson> but i will probably be the only one here ;)
<seb128> I might be around every now and then
<seb128> I'm not planning any travelling or anything
<seb128> so I will probably be bored by moments or be wanting to do some hacking
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - that's probably how i will spend the time between christmas and new year ;)
<didrocks> seb128: won't you plan some video games on the wii too? (btw, did you buy zelda?) ;)
<seb128> didrocks, I will probably, not yet, I'm not decided on what game to get
<didrocks> ok :)
<seb128> didrocks, what about you?
<chrisccoulson> you have a wii?
<seb128> anything planed for holidays?
<didrocks> seb128: going to my parents' home (in Alpes), rest, video games, ski and a little hacking too :)
<seb128> cool
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yes, what about you?
<didrocks> but rest mainly, before working hard on January ^^
<seb128> do you play video games sometime?
<seb128> I've to admit I don't play often
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i got one for my girlfriend, but she never uses it
<seb128> I'm too busy during the week and weekend are short
<chrisccoulson> and i've not used it either, due to lack of time ;)
<seb128> too many things to do, like sleeping
<didrocks> (same for me, only playing during holidays)
<seb128> but during a 2 weeks break I will probably manage to play a game
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you know, you have to train at wii sport (tennis especially) to enter the seb128's challenge at next UDS :)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> i can imagine if i practise tennis in my small lounge, then i will probably break something ;)
<seb128> I've learnt to not play against vuntz after midnight when you had some drinks
<didrocks> hehe :)
<seb128> he's not drinking and that's not a fair game there ;-)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<didrocks> I totally agree, that's not fair :)
<seb128> I managed to do better at tetris at least
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> sure, I'll have to train a lot those 3 weeks too :-)
<seb128> what game do you play usually during holidays ?
<seb128> the mario kart?
<seb128> is that fun in solo mode too?
<didrocks> I've finished mario kart and I don't play too much online. solo mode is great, but I prefer when you can get some people home :)
<seb128> right
<chrisccoulson> we've got mario kart, but i've not played it yet
<seb128> that's like wii sport
<didrocks> and my girlfriend don't like video games anymore, so...
<didrocks> seb128: exactly, that's why I'm not good at tennis :p
<seb128> didrocks, lol, "anymore"
<didrocks> yes, she played a lot when she was younger... but no more nowdays
<seb128> you are too good and doesn't let other people win? ;-)
<didrocks> well, now, I'm playing to RPG or ARPG like zelda, final fantasy, kingdom hearts...
<vuntz> seb128: pff
<vuntz> seb128: this had nothing to do with the time or drinks
<didrocks> seb128: the only sport I'm good at wii sport is golf ;) I don't play too much with the other games
<vuntz> seb128: we can have a game whenever you want ;-)
<Keybuk> tjaalton, tseliot: that xkbcomp patch made all the difference! :)
<seb128> vuntz, ok, next time I will be ready for you :-)
<Keybuk> X.org today 1.39s
<Keybuk> (budget 2s)
<seb128> yeah, extra time for desktop login! ;-)
<tjaalton> Keybuk: really? how much exactly?
<tseliot> Keybuk: great news :-) and it was just a two lines fix
<didrocks> seb128: I'm afraid that's rather 0.61s more for plymounth :)
<didrocks> plymouth*
 * seb128 kicks didrocks
<tjaalton> meh, I want the X25-M G2 already..
<didrocks> hey, that hurts :-)
<Keybuk> didrocks: one of the main reasons plymouth isn't going in yet is because I want the boot time fixed ;)
<Keybuk> so plymouth can be forbidden from increasing it
<didrocks> seb128: Ctrl+w again on the wrong screen? :)
<didrocks> Keybuk: oh, ok :)
<seb128> indeed
<tjaalton> Keybuk: that time could maybe shrink even more, by disabling the record extension which is broken, and not letting evdev grab bogus devices
<Keybuk> tjaalton: Do. It.
<tjaalton> hehe
<Keybuk> if you want to shove something in a PPA for me to test, I have hardware to spare <g>
<tjaalton> ok then
<tjaalton> you can probably change 65-xorg-evdev.rules by hand. for testing it should be enough to match only INPUT_MOUSE and INPUT_KEYBOARD (and not subsystem "input")
<mac_v> anyone know if MacSlow is on vacation?
<tjaalton> Keybuk: xserver uploaded to my ppa: https://edge.launchpad.net/~tjaalton/+archive/ppa
<tjaalton> will take a while to build
<Keybuk> ok
<tjaalton> looks like RECORD is being fixed upstream, and could get in a 1.7.x, but at least the server won't spend time disabling it :)
<tseliot> mac_v: yes, he's on holiday today
<mac_v> tseliot: ah , thanks..
<seb128> mvo, hi
<seb128> mvo, did you read my xapian comment yesterday?
<Keybuk> tjaalton: the evdev change didn't seem to make a difference
<mvo> hey seb128
<mvo> seb128: no, sorry - was that on irc?
<seb128> mvo, yes
<seb128> mvo, indicator-application want exact string matching to work
<Keybuk> tjaalton: then again, it doesn't look like I have any other input devices on here for it to affect
<seb128> mvo, ie typing "indicator-applicatio" doesn't list it
<seb128> mvo, or indicator-appli
<seb128> or whatever which is not the exact name
<Keybuk> actually, scratch that, there's loads from things like the webcam and lid switch
<Keybuk> it could have made a difference
<Keybuk> http://people.canonical.com/~scott/tmp/ratchet-lucid-20091216-5.png
<Keybuk> only 1.28s to start X
<mvo> seb128: indicator-application is not showing up at all for me currently
<seb128> mvo, did you type "indicator-application"?
<seb128> mvo, weird it's there for over a day in lucid
<tjaalton> Keybuk: ok, so another 0.1s
 * mvo checks if his apt-xapian-index is up-to-date
<bryce> tjaalton, disabling extensions probably has negligible impact
<mvo> seb128: thanks, I have it now (a-x-i was not updated, that is part of the spec but not implemented yet)
<Keybuk> tjaalton: yeah, that's a win
<Keybuk> every tenth counts
<mvo> seb128: hm, I get it with indicator-app, but its very low ranked
<Keybuk> if we fix ten things that each take 0.1s, that's 1s
<seb128> mvo, do you get the issue?
<seb128> mvo, indicator-appli is empty therze
<seb128> there
<seb128> like nothing in the list
<mvo> seb128: yeah, I have that too, I suspect its the "-" in the name, I think I need to handle it secial
<bryce> tjaalton, from what I can tell, the biggest win would come from improving whatever happens right before the EDID probing
 * mvo scratches his head
<tseliot> Keybuk: if you want to disable the record extension without rebuilding X you can put something like this in xorg.conf: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/342590/
<Keybuk> I don't have an xorg.conf ;)
<Keybuk> your xorg-server has built now
<tseliot> good
<tseliot> bryce: do you mean in the kernel or in X?
<bryce> X
<tjaalton> bryce: the edid trickery in drm probably made it fast on intel, the driver is done after 0.635s, but then it sits idle for 0.8s and there's the message about RECORD being disabled due to it being broken
<tjaalton> so I don't know if disabling it helps at all, but we'll see
<bryce> tjaalton, I think it's going to be negligible
<tjaalton> bryce: yep, could be
<bryce> I didn't play with RECORD, but I didn't find that flipping extensions off made much difference
<tjaalton> but in this case it seems like the server is doing something and figuring out that the extension is broken, and disables it
<bryce> also I think having an xorg.conf present slows things down, so disabling them by adding an xorg.conf actually makes boots take longer
<tjaalton> that's why I think it _might_ have an impact
<bryce> but I didn't test that exhaustively
<bryce> tjaalton, is RECORD broken on the test hardware?
<tjaalton> bryce: it's broken in 1.7
<bryce> it seems to be present and working on my test box and loading it takes a negligible amount of boot time
<bryce> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/342594/
<tjaalton> scroll down :)
<tjaalton> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/342595/
<bryce> tjaalton, ah
<bryce> [    1.042708] (II) Initializing built-in extension DAMAGE
<bryce> record: RECORD extension enabled at configure time.
<bryce> record: This extension is known to be broken, disabling extension now..
<bryce> record: http://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=20500
<bryce> [    1.073194] (II) AIGLX: enabled GLX_MESA_copy_sub_buffer
<ubottu> Freedesktop bug 20500 in Server/general "Record extension not sending event" [Normal,New]
<tjaalton> ok, so in your case it didn't spend much time on that
<bryce> 0.03 sec
<tjaalton> maybe it was the AIGLX init that took time here
<bryce> is it "broken but needs fixed" or "broken and should just be removed" ?
<tjaalton> the former
<tjaalton> patches available on that bug
<tjaalton> not yet in master
<bryce> if the former, then counting boot benefit from disabling it is just cheating.  ;-)
<tjaalton> right, I mentioned that earlier :)
<Keybuk> tjaalton: can't see any difference in the record patch
<Keybuk> likely lost in the noise
<tjaalton> Keybuk: yeah
<mvo> seb128: its defenitely something odd with xapian, it breaks the query into two sub-queries
<mvo> seb128: thanks for letting me know
<seb128> mvo, np, do you want a bug report?
<mvo> seb128: no, I work on it now
<seb128> mvo, ok thanks
<huats> morning everyone !
<chrisccoulson> good morning huats
<qense> The 'DesktopTeam/TODO' page linked to from the /topic of this channel doesn't exist. This probably doesn't mean there isn't anything to do, does it?
<seb128> no, it means that was not uptodate and has been cleaned
<seb128> the todolists are the other topic urls
<seb128> updates and milestoned bugs
<qense> ah, I see
<qense> shouldn't the page be created though? It could point to those other two pages.
<seb128> ups
* seb128 changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to #ubuntu-desktop - home of the Desktop team - http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop/ | If you want to help out, check out https://launchpad.net/~desktop-bugs/+bugs?field.milestone%3Alist=21439 or http://piware.de/workitems/desktop/lucid/versions.html | For support please join #ubuntu
<seb128> qense, better?
<qense> yep
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: ah! thanks for the hint, for some reason that slipped my mind.
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur - you're welcome :)
<mdeslaur> asac: would you like me to post my modemmanager patch to the networkmanager-list, or are you going to take a look at it?
<asac> mdeslaur: did you poke me about that before ?;)
<asac> bug id?
<mdeslaur> asac: bug #496206
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 496206 in modemmanager "Analog USB modem isn't closed when probing fails" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/496206
<asac> mdeslaur: thx
<mdeslaur> asac: yes, I poked you about it before, but wasn't sure if you're still doing NM stuff
<asac> mdeslaur: you didnt tell me you submitted a patch ;)
<asac> i need pings or bug assignments t;)
<mdeslaur> asac: you must have missed it :)
<asac> mdeslaur: so ... haveÅt looked at code, but why is that +CGMM already in the mm log you attached
<mdeslaur> because in my case ATI is successful, so it's getting the CGMM from the code a few lines below my patch
 * asac updates his mm branch ;)
<mdeslaur> once CGMM fails in my logs, task_priv->probe_state == PROBE_STATE_LAST
<mdeslaur> the code is slightly confusing, as task_priv->probe_state is tracking the _next_ probe that should be done, not the probe that just completed
<mdeslaur> so PROBE_STATE_CGMM should try CGMM, not assume that CGMM failed
<milanbv> mpt: would you help me phrasing some strings for the gnome-system-tools? I know you're interested in them
<chrisccoulson> hey milanbv
<milanbv> hi!
<chrisccoulson> i don't often see you on here!
<milanbv> no, I guess I should add this channel to my favorite
<chrisccoulson> did you see we've got g-s-t 2.29.1 now ;)
<milanbv> yeah, nice:!
<milanbv> hope people won't spot to many bugs - that's a work in progress
<asac> mdeslaur: yeah. i will commit that later today. currently thinking if this whole code should be cleaned up ;)
<chrisccoulson> milanbv - we want users to spot bugs at this stage of the cycle though ;)
<mdeslaur> asac: yeah, it's kind of ugly that it's all in there twice
<mdeslaur> thanks asac
<asac> i mean ... we already set the cmd in handle_probe_response
<milanbv> yeah, but better if there aren't
<milanbv> so could you help me with those strings?
<milanbv> I'm writing the descriptions for the user profiles that will be shown in the next version
<asac> mdeslaur: its even in there three time ;)
<asac> mdeslaur: check handle_probe_response ;)
<mdeslaur> asac: wow :)
<asac> that already sets the cmd
<asac> but then that gets ignored in the real_  thing and it does its own calc
<asac> etc.
<milanbv> I'm not very good at finding nice formulations in English, and we have to keep it as simple as possible
<milanbv> http://paste.ubuntu.com/342698/
<mpt> milanbv, sure
<mpt> (sorry, I was in a meeting)
<milanbv> hi!
<mpt> milanbv, where exactly would these appear?
<milanbv> I think it would be nice if we collaborated more closely for the new GUI
<milanbv> in a new dialog allowing to choose the account types of an user
<milanbv> are you using Lucid?
<mpt> milanbv, no, I'm on 9.10
<milanbv> wait a minute
<seb128> vuntz, hey, do you think you could review https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=520226?
<seb128> vuntz, it already sort of got reviewed, not sure what is missing for commit
<milanbv> mpt: see http://nalimilan.perso.neuf.fr/transfert/Capture.png
<milanbv> with pretty stupid descriptions, they were here for tests
<mpt> milanbv, often it's tiny things that show the need for big changes
<mpt> milanbv, in that screenshot I see the sentence "Use the advanced settings dialog to tune them."
<mpt> milanbv, how do I get to the advanced settings dialog from there?
<milanbv> you can't
<milanbv> that's why I needed you ;-)
<milanbv> but that description is already in the C code - the others are in a config file that is not yet committed
<milanbv> (I think you can actually install the Lucid version in Karmic, if you want to see it in action)
<mpt> milanbv, so, what are three possible ways of making tuning those settings easier?
<milanbv> I'm not sure we want to make settings this easier
<milanbv> most users should not see this profile at all, if they don't tweak the settings manually
<milanbv> (I want to hide that choice if it's not currently selected)
<mpt> milanbv, ok then, easier for someone who has already opened this dialog
<milanbv> I guess, yes
<milanbv> (BTW, I wrote some explanation of the new UI, including a link the original mockups, at http://mail.gnome.org/archives/usability/2009-December/msg00000.html)
<milanbv> have you seen the draft descriptions I pasted?
<mpt> milanbv, so while you're thinking about that, here's another awkwardness: Those draft descriptions heavily use generalities -- "uncommon tasks", "most common tasks", "such as".
<milanbv> yes
<milanbv> hard to define precisely what people are allowed to do with admin rights...
<mpt> milanbv, those two things combined tell me that the configurable list of actual actions should be presented in the same window as the basic choice.
<mpt> (actual actions -> actual permissions)
<milanbv> you mean, in a new tab?
<milanbv> the problem is, I don't think most people should ever have to look at them
<milanbv> which is why I moved them to an advanced tab
<mpt> milanbv, but you're having trouble explaining what each account type is for, precisely because you're not showing what they can actually do.
<mpt> milanbv, I suggest something like this: http://imgur.com/WzGaf
<mpt> milanbv, where the checked status of the checkboxes (and *maybe* the sensitivity of the list as a whole) changes depending on the choice from the initial menu.
<milanbv> hm, privileges defined as groups in our privileges table don't really define what you can do - because being member of the admin group allows many PolicyKit actions
<mpt> milanbv, I have another meeting now, back shortly
<milanbv> OK
<mvo> seb128: do you mind if I take bug #487249 ? or is there something controversila about it
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 487249 in cheese "Enable "Wide mode" by default" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/487249
<seb128> mvo, I was about to close that one and look to the git gudev port too
<seb128> mvo, I'm doing sponsoring this afternoon
<seb128> mvo, any particular reason you looked at it?
<mvo> seb128: sponsoring hour
<seb128> ok
<mvo> seb128: it seems to be trivial, if you don't mind I upload it now
<seb128> ok thanks
<qense> When are bugs assigned to ubuntu-desktop? I can't find guidelines for that.
<seb128> mvo, btw I wanted to discuss compiz with Amaranth and you at some point too
<seb128> mvo, he did split compiz in some 27 binaries or something
<mvo> seb128: hu???
<seb128> qense, we tend to assign desktop bugs to the list
<seb128> mvo, he said he splitted every option in its own binary I think
<seb128> mvo, I'm not sure I like it over having just a -universe with things we don't want by default
<seb128> and drop buggy options we don't want to support on the way
 * mvo checks bzr
<seb128> mvo, I don't think he pushed to the ubuntu bzr I told him to put on hold until we discuss it
<seb128> but perhaps in his ppa or something
<mvo> seb128: ok, thanks. I was not aware of this change
<mvo> seb128: when he is back I'm happy to discuss it
<seb128> ok good
<seb128> mvo, what is your gut feeling about it?
<seb128> the multiscreen doesn't suit me
<mvo> seb128: splitting every plugin is overdoing it
<seb128> I keep having focus on the screen I'm not looking at ;-)
<seb128> mvo, ok, my feeling too
<mvo> seb128: I want to know some more first :)
<milanbv> seb128: any chance somebody review #393854 for Lucid?
<mpt> milanbv, I don't understand how that "because" works in your last statement. Is it possible to tell what a member of the admin group is allowed to do?
<milanbv> not from users-admin - it depends on what the PolicyKit policy allows members of the admin group to do
<seb128> who asked about desktop-bugs assigned before?
<seb128> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/~desktop-bugs/+packagebugs
<seb128> is the desktop packages list
<qense> I did
<seb128> or https://bugs.launchpad.net/~desktop-bugs/+packagebugs
<seb128> qense, ^
<milanbv> so basically, this includes installing/upgrading, erasing partitions...
<seb128> we tend to assign teams for things there but that's not a requirement
<qense> you assign all triaged bugs of packages on those pages to desktop-bugs?
<milanbv> mpt: actually, I think our privileges table is kind of messy, because we're currently not 100% PolicyKit, since we're still using Unix groups for some actions
<seb128> qense, we tend to do it but maybe we should revisit that
<seb128> it has no real interest nowadays I think
<mpt> milanbv, if there was an "Advanced" tab for anything, I think it would be for that, i.e. putting the account into those various system Unix groups
<milanbv> that's mostly what it does
<milanbv> (plus setting shell, home dir, UID...)
<qense> seb128: ok, thanks for your help
<seb128> milanbv, could you give that bug reference again? I close the tab by mistake before looking at it now
<milanbv> seb128: #393854
<seb128> bug #393854
<seb128> no bot?
<milanbv> when people seek to change their account type, the only question I think we must answer is "what of those 3 types should I choose"?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 393854 in gdm "Update PAM policy to allow password-less logins set up via users-admin" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/393854
<milanbv> this choice is really simple: user with restricted rights for "strangers", desktop user for most people, admin for the user that usually configures the computer
<seb128> milanbv, I will try to get an opinion from somebody in the security team about that
<milanbv> OK, thanks
<seb128> I've ignored it so far because I'm not sure about it
<milanbv> I don't think that's really a problem, GDM upstream uses this config file too
<seb128> well the config file is not so much, but the group adding I'm not sure it's gdm's job
<milanbv> seb128: we can do this basically anywhere, but logically we can only be sure when installing GDM that the system supports this feature
<milanbv> which in turn leads to enabling the checkbox in users-admin
<seb128> I'm still not sure I like the idea of no password but shrugh
<seb128> let's see what security guys say
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi seb128
<seb128> vuntz, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=357934, want to review that one? ;-)
<ubottu> Gnome bug 357934 in Panel "Drag and drop of Bookmarks from Places menu copies entire directory" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> vuntz, it's a fairly trivial change
<milanbv> mpt: I have to go soon
<milanbv> do you think you'll be able to read the design document by Clasen & McCann on the mail I posted (and even to install the development package)?
<milanbv> then we could discuss more deeply what we should do
<seb128> ok, I managed to unactivate ctrl-w now
<seb128> should make me stop to close this tab ;-)
<didrocks> :-)
<Krzysztof> seriously, what's going on with freenode lately?
<mpt> mvo, is the software-center PPA kept up to date automatically?
<mpt> mvo, and if it isn't, what should I do to get bzr trunk running again? (No such file or directory: '/usr/share/app-install/desktop/software-center.menu')
<mvo> mpt: its not kept automatically, I uploaded a new version now for the ppa, there is a "daily" ppa that jcastro manages too
<fagan> mpt: I mentioned to mvo that it would be nice to list the installed software section by the most recently installed software what do you think?
<Krzysztof> chrisccoulson, can you take a look at bug 457123 ? I need someone to upload it :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 457123 in transmission "Transmission doesn't prevent suspend when torrent is active" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/457123
<chrisccoulson> hi Krzysztof - i'll take a look at that as long as i'm permitted to upload to karmic
<chrisccoulson> (i think i can)
<seb128> asac, hey
<seb128> asac, are you still going to look at the gnome-bluetooth update?
<asac> hmm. thought baptistemm did that
<asac> baptistemm: whats the status?
<seb128> asac, he's waiting for sponsoring for a while now, it on you
<baptistemm> waiting for a review
<seb128> if I understand things correctly
<asac> oh
<asac> let me poke that a bit
<baptistemm> I wonder if any 2.28.x release was issued in-between
<seb128> well there is a 2.29 version now
<asac> thats lucid
<asac> so yeah
<seb128> well I was not aiming at sruing
<seb128> so we want 2.29 yes
<asac> let me do this, the next update is probably just a new tarball
<asac> doesnt need review/poking
<seb128> ok thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, did you start on the libgksu change to get it in lucid? I'm about to sponsor it now
<seb128> just asking in case before duping work
<kenvandine> seb128, you can do it :)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I'm not sure you can upload it anyway
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> I've not figured how sets work exactly
<seb128> but I think gksu is rather a platform bit
<jcastro_> seb128: do you know if transmission's systray icon off by default is upstream behavior or do we do that?
<seb128> jcastro_, let me check
<seb128> jcastro_, seems upstream behaviour
<jcastro_> ok thanks!
<unit3> Quick Q: what desktop app keeps creating the ~/Photos directory, which I don't need or want on my work desktop. ;)
<bryce> unit3, this is the development channel, you probably want #ubuntu
<bryce> (and sorry, I don't know)
<unit3> well, I just figured the dev team would know. but I'll try #ubuntu. :)
<seb128> xdg-user-dirs-update could be
<seb128> those are in .config
<seb128> user-dirs.dirs
<seb128> but the photo default is not on the desktop but in your user dir
<unit3> I see an entry in there for it, but running " xdg-user-dirs-update" doesn't create it.
<unit3> well, actually, user-dirs.dirs says: XDG_PICTURES_DIR="$HOME/"
<unit3> not XDG_PICTURES_DIR="$HOME/Photos"
<seb128> ok, so I don't know either
<seb128> could be the photo application you are using
<unit3> ok, well, thanks anyway. I'll ask in #ubuntu.
<unit3> I'm not using one. I don't do photo editing on my work desktop.
<unit3> hence the annoyance and ~/Photos showing up all the time. ;)
<seb128> bryce, hey
<seb128> bryce, how do you manage patches for xorg?
<seb128> bryce, do you uncheck the patch box for things you reviewed?
<seb128> your summary is handy but there is quite some things there which are pending upstream review, etc
<seb128> and since launchpad doesn't have patch status to express those, I'm not sure what to do to filter those out
<seb128> or do you just class by most recents and assume you reviewed everything old?
<seb128> bryce, sorry the question was not clear, it's rather "how do you manage bug reports which have a patch attachment"
<bryce> seb128, yes for patches that I review and determine to be not viable, I uncheck the checkbox
<bryce> in general my workflow tries to result in getting the bug off the list, so that could be accepting the patch and uploading it, or rejecting it and unmarking it, or closing the bug report as out of date / invalid
<seb128> bryce, what do you do for valid patches where you would like an upstream review before uploading?
<seb128> keep those on the list?
<bryce> yes that's what I've done so far, since I usually want to follow up on those as part of my next day's patch review process
<seb128> ok, thanks
<seb128> we need patch status on launchpad ;-)
<bryce> brb (baby)
<seb128> bah, submittodebian is broken in lucid
<seb128> it assumes that everything is in bzr
<chrisccoulson> good evening everyone
<rickspencer3_> hi chrisccoulson
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi rickspencer3_
<seb128> had a good day?
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, yeah, my day wasn't too bad
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - did you have a good day too?
<seb128> quite ok thanks
<seb128> I've not spent the day reading strace logs so that was good
<seb128> I managed to clean the sponsoring queue a bit
<seb128> getting some fixes in lucid
<seb128> and I used bryce's list of bugs with patches to review some bugs too
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i saw you reviewed quite a few bugs with patches today
<seb128> I strace nautilus a bit too, to see how much time it was spending in the /usr/lib/nautilus .so loading
<chrisccoulson> what were the results like?
<seb128> everything is done is less that 0.05 seconds
<seb128> out of brasero
<chrisccoulson> that's not too bad then
<seb128> which takes 3 seconds on my laptop and one of the mini config
<chrisccoulson> that's quite a long time :-/
<seb128> yes
<chrisccoulson> any idea what it's doing when it loads?
<seb128> it's running lot of commands
<seb128> like dvd+rw-info --version
<seb128> genisofs --version
<seb128> wodim --version
<chrisccoulson> hmmmm, they could probably deferred couldn't they?
<seb128> seems to get the version of everything it knows by running those
<seb128> yes, I opened a bug upstream about that
<seb128> (in fact I already did that some days ago before looking at times)
<seb128> (I already spotted the execve in the strace)
<seb128> but it's good that out of brasero other things are quick
<seb128> or not if you consider that we have to get better and that's not going to be on those
<chrisccoulson> i'll hopefully get some time to look at g-s-d again soon
<chrisccoulson> over the christmas break :)
<chrisccoulson> hi mclasen - i had a look at your patches at https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=24493 , and i have a question
<ubottu> Freedesktop bug 24493 in Daemon "a better shutdown api" [Normal,New]
<chrisccoulson> how are translations of the strings in the inhibitors handled?
<chrisccoulson> ie, say, one session registers an inhibitor and passes a string in one language. how is that presented to another session in a different language?
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-12-17
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, is there a way to set the master volume/mute from the command line, i.e. exactly like if I had used the multimedia keys to do it?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Either the amixer command if you want something scriptable, or the alsamixer ncurses app.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, will that work reliably and will it behave the same as the multimedia keys?  I have a fullscreen app that is capturing all the key events and I want a way to keep the audio buttons working
<robert_ancell> hmm "amixer sset Master toggle works", what about volume...
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: I don't know amixer's flags very well atm, as I haven't yet really had to work with it.
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> asac, lool: I just filed bug 497672 which is really just red tape (it's a trivial package MIR); do you have a minute to ack it?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 497672 in pm-utils-powersave-policy "[MIR] pm-utils-powersave-policy" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/497672
<seb128> good morning there
<seb128> hi chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<lool> pitti: approved
<pitti> lool: cheers
<pitti> seb128, chrisccoulson: good morning
<seb128> hey lool pitti
<chrisccoulson> good morning pitti
<seb128> chrisccoulson: tired by good otherwise thanks
<seb128> you?
<lool> Hey seb128, pitti, chrisccoulson  :)
<didrocks> godd morning pitti, seb128, chrisccoulson, lool :)
<seb128> I went to bed at 3am again yesterday
<lool> It's snowing nicely here
<didrocks> good*
<seb128> but tomorrow holidays!
<seb128> hey didrocks
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<pitti> seb128: ugh
<lool> seb128: Same here :)
<didrocks> lool: I'm stuck at Velizy because of the snow apparentely :/
<lool> morning didrocks :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i'm quite tired too. spent most of last night trying to get my broadband working, after it decided it no longer wanted to connect
<pitti> lool: ice-cold here, too *shiver*
<chrisccoulson> hey lool and didrocks :)
<lool> pitti: That's because your window is open!!
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i just had to scrape ice off my car
<chrisccoulson> although it's probably still colder where you are ;)
<pitti> lool: s/here/out there/ :-)
<seb128> ice on the car there too
<seb128> - 6Â°C
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure it was that cold here
<chrisccoulson> i'm hoping it snows later (after I get home though)
<seb128> snow for the weekend would be good
<bryce> relatively warm here (I've got windows open due to excess heat from computers)
<pitti> seb128: we do :) http://www.intermobil.org/doris/net/kfz/kfz_cam_anzeige.xml?Back=../kfz/kfz_cam_auswahl.xml&OID=15308
<seb128> pitti, oh, nice!
<seb128> pitti, did you have snow yesterday already?
<baptistemm> hello
<chrisccoulson> bryce - do you have all 8 computers on?
<baptistemm> good morning
<seb128> lut baptistemm
<pitti> seb128: we had some last weekend, but that one is fresh from last night
<chrisccoulson> good morning baptistemm
<bryce> 5
<pitti> hm, my laptop hardly produces any heat..
<seb128> pitti, ok, so it didn't fit well for your vac day
<bryce> testing patch to reenable apport on xserver :-)
<seb128> but winter only starts ;-)
<pitti> seb128: oh, it did; in the morning I went for some christmas shopping, and house cleaning
<pitti> bryce: yay!
<pitti> bryce: I think I'll enable apport by default again after that; it's time
<seb128> no it's not?
<seb128> wait for after holidays break
<chrisccoulson> pitti - will you be building a snowman this evening? :)
<seb128> no point to stack hundred of crashers while everybody isa way
<pitti> seb128: ah, ok
<seb128> well my opinion but I've mostly given up on reading bugs now anyway so I don't care a lot
<seb128> I just feel that will add useless noise since nobody is around to do something of those
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I can't, my grandpa celebrates his bday
<pitti> seb128: true that, I didn't consider that
<pitti> tseliot: do you know whether PowerMizer is enabled by default in the latest nvidia drivers, or if not, how to do that?
<pitti> http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=110949 has some suggestion, but I'm not sure whether that's the official way
<pitti> ah, http://forums.opensuse.org/hardware/410089-nvidia-powermizer-how-tweak.html has some more details
<tseliot> pitti: I spoke with Nvidia about this as I wanted to automatically configure that in Jockey but this is what they told me: https://pastebin.canonical.com/25863/
<pitti> tseliot: right, I was wondering what to add to the jockey handler
 * pitti has a work item for this
<pitti> tseliot: oh, great
<pitti> so if that's already enabled by default, then no reason to change it
<tseliot> pitti: you have one less work item now ;)
<tseliot> right
<pitti> tseliot: can we add a dependency to acpid to nvidia-glx?
<pitti> tseliot: acpi-support will disappear at some point, and you can uninstall it, so we shouldn't take it for granted that it's there
<pitti> tseliot, bryce, tjaalton: I have a work item "test wacom" for desktop-lucid-xorg-halsectomy, but I don't actually have such a device; do you have one? would you take the WI?
<pitti> if there's any udev rule writing/translation involved, I can do that of course
<tseliot> pitti: sure, I can add that dependency
<tseliot> pitti: I have a wacom tablet here
<lool> pitti: Are the pm-utils-powersave-policy scripts run on boot as well?
<pitti> lool: dk-power runs them when it starts, i. e. on desktop startup
<lool> Ok
<pitti> i. e. well after ureadahead and daemon startup
<lool> I wasn't sure what was reading these on startup
<tseliot> pitti: ^^
<pitti> tseliot: ok to hand this WI off to you then?
<tseliot> pitti: where's the blueprint? I would like to have a look at it
<pitti> tseliot: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-xorg-halsectomy
<tseliot> pitti: ok, I'll test wacom
<pitti> tseliot: cheers; please ping me if it doesn't work
<seb128> vuntz_, hey
<tseliot> pitti: sure
<seb128> vuntz_, did you see my pings yesterday?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - do we still want HAL support in gnome-power-manager? upstream provide a build option to enable HAL support now, and it is disabled by default
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I think we still need it for now, for backlight
<pitti> many cards/drivers don't have xbacklight support yet
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i thought so. thanks
<pitti> so we keep it as build option
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I think for lucid final we'll install hal by default and make it d-bus activated
<pitti> then we just need to fix gpm to not trigger hal on startup, only when xbacklight is not available
<chrisccoulson> i'll hopefully finish that later. i have to re-write the notify-osd patch, as the notify code in g-p-m changed a lot
<pitti> oh, again?
 * baptistemm removed hal after upgrade to lucid
<baptistemm> perhaps I made a mistake
<pitti> baptistemm: what's broken now?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, it's using the g-s-d style notifications now
<baptistemm> It removed sound-juicer but that was expected. I admit I didn't check what is broken
<baptistemm> as I don''t know what is backlight I didn't notice if it is broken or not :)
<pitti> baptistemm: being able to change the backlight brightness with the Fn hotkeys
<baptistemm> ha okay, I'll check
<pitti> baptistemm: in general, if you didn't notice a change (except perhaps slightly faster boot), that's a good sign :)
<tjaalton> pitti: you had an intel where it no longer worked, right?
<pitti> tjaalton: correct
<pitti> well, the hotkeys do work
<pitti> since they are hardwired
<pitti> but I don't get notifications for it any more
<pitti> (not that I'd care much..)
<tjaalton> my thinkpad works fine, don't know if it's different then
<tjaalton> notifications and all
<baptistemm> I do have a thinkpad t61 + intel 945, so we have the same hardware to test with ?
<baptistemm> :)
<tjaalton> mine is a X61 with 965, but close enough I think
<tjaalton> the notifications are butt-ugly though, but I think that's on purpose :)
<Krwlng> hi
<mvo_> seb128: the problem with the "-" seems to be harden than expceted, maybe a bug is a good idea
<seb128> mvo_, ok, will open one
<mvo_> seb128: sorry for that, its a xapian thing
<seb128> mvo_, or if it's too low priority and bug is only noise let's forget about it
<seb128> it's a detail
<mvo_> yeah, still :)
<mvo_> should work!
<seb128> ok, will open a bug
<seb128> then you can do what you want from it ;-)
 * seb128 hugs mvo_
<mvo_> thanks, target, milestone, set priority to high
<mvo_> and assign to you :P
<seb128> lol
<mvo_> no, just kidding :)
<seb128> do you want a cookie and tea too?
<mvo_> please :)
<seb128> ;-)
 * mvo_ hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs mvo_
<seb128> mvo_, apt-xapian-index source?
<mvo_> software-center I think
<seb128> I was having the issue in synaptic
<seb128> but as you want
<mvo_> I may need to put some code there too for the indexing, but I think the tricky bit is the query
<mvo_> right, synaptic is using the same QueryParser as s-c
<seb128> mvo_, bug #497708
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 497708 in software-center "xapian query doesn't handle the "-" chars correctly" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/497708
<asac> pitti: i will do it when arriving at home
<asac> so in 1.5h
 * asac on vac ... but not really (today)
<pitti> asac: lool already did it, but thanks
<pitti> I need to disappear for some 2 hours for an appointment
<seb128> pitti, see you later
<kenvandine> later pitti
<cassidy> any reason why humanity-icon-theme only ships svg of some size instead of a scalable version in svg and all the size in png as gnome-icon-theme does?
<seb128> cassidy, I think that's wanted yet, mac_v might know why
<seb128> mvo_, when installing binary-gui which depends on binary software install has 2 binary-gui lines, is that expected or is that buggy?
<seb128> I would expect to have each line name reflecting the binary installed
<mvo_> seb128: that sounds like a bug - that is s-c ?
<seb128> or at least the second one to be binary-gui (binary)
<seb128> mvo_, yes
<mvo_> seb128: what is the package name?
<mac_v> cassidy: we just havent done the icons in all sizes , we have mostly done icons in the sizes they are used and the rest of the sizes are low in the TODO list
<mvo_> binary-gui?
<seb128> mvo_, I installed oprofile-gui
<seb128> which depends on oprofile
<seb128> and I got 2 oprofile-gui lines
 * mvo_ tries
<mvo_> yep
<mvo_> same here
<mvo_> nice catch!
<mac_v> cassidy: but , we want to do them for sure :) ... any reason for the doubt?
<seb128> mvo_, want a bug?
<mvo_> seb128: maybe later, i hope I can fix it directly
<mvo_> seb128: but its fine for now, I can reproduce it
<cassidy> mac_v, I changed some code in Empathy and now one icon is much bigger than before and noticed it was only in 48
<mac_v> cassidy: which icon is misbehaving?
<seb128> mvo_, ok thanks
<cassidy> mac_v, audio-input-microphone.svg
<chrisccoulson1> yay, it's snowing outside!
<mac_v> hmm ,
<seb128> chrisccoulson1, bah, lucky you ;-)
<chrisccoulson1> seb128 - it's only snowed a little so far
<baptistemm> yeah lucky one.
<mac_v> cassidy: but the 48px icons are all set as scalable in humanity , even if we dont have the smaller size the app should be able to scale it down.. BTW , which size is required?
<chrisccoulson1> i don't want much more, else it will take me ages to get home ;)
<baptistemm> I wish I could do a snowman :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson1, good reason to leave work early to avoid too much snow? ;-)
<cassidy> mac_v, GTK_ICON_SIZE_MENU  but maybe that's my code which is bugged and don't rescale properly
<chrisccoulson1> seb128 - i don't think my employer is flexible enough to let me do that ;)
<mvo_> seb128: let me know how oprofile is
<seb128> mvo_, I will, interested in optimizing your code too? ;-)
<seb128> mvo_, seems you are good at that, software-center rocks
<mvo_> with everybody else doing it, I don't want to stay behind ;)
<seb128> it's fast even on the mini config
<mvo_> bÃ¤h, I can not reproduce it anymore (the oprofile one) now that I turned on debugging
<seb128> (which is not the case of update-manager which blocks for long enough at start to have the compiz thing painting it)
<mvo_> seb128: nice! I guess the indexing during pkg install is pretty slow
<mvo_> seb128: yeah, u-m needs some love too
<seb128> mvo_, btw I've the same on uninstall, ie remove oprofile
<seb128> ie will have a line named oprofile for oprofile-gui too
<mvo_> *grr* now it always works
<mvo_> a minute ago it didn't
<seb128> lol
<mvo_> so even with package in lucid on the mini its still fast?
<mvo_> thats great to hear :)
<seb128> mvo_, yes
<seb128> good work ;-)
<mvo_> cool
 * mvo_ is happy
<seb128> btw count is weird too
<seb128> on start the status bar states "2230 application available"
<seb128> click on a category and then back to start screen
<seb128> and the count is 43153 now ;-)
<mvo_> if you do it again, does it multiple by factor 20 again ;) ?
<seb128> no, it stays on 43153
<mvo_> I can reproduce that too, but for me its "just" 32104
<mac_v> cassidy: i'm not sure whats wrong in empathy, but ideally the app should be able to scale the icon , some icon themes only have 128px scalable icons , the problem would arise there too , but the icons we'll get them done in time :)
<mvo_> you got apparently some more repos enabled
<seb128> yes
<seb128> I might still have karmic-updates, etc
 * seb128 stops playing with software-center now
<seb128> mvo_, I've bounced enough issues your way for today I think ;-)
<seb128> mvo_, the frame around screenshots is wrong too sometime
<seb128> anyway enough s-c bugging for now
<mvo_> seb128: wrong in what way? in the details view?
<seb128> mvo_, no, open gcalctool
<seb128> and look at the screenshot
<seb128> in s-c I mean, not the software
<mvo_> right, you mean that it got this extra lines on the bottom?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> the frame doesn't match the screenshot
<seb128> there is a blank area too
<seb128> it looks weird
<mvo_> yeah
<cassidy> mac_v, got it, I fixed scaling in Empathy :)
<mac_v> neat :)
<mvo_> seb128: thanks, it was a race. fixed in trunk
<seb128> mvo_, did I already say that you rock today? ;-)
<mvo_> seb128: I think so, I still like to hear :)
 * mvo_ is happy
<seb128> ;-)
<mvo_> mpt: for software-center, what should the initial status bar say "2000 applications available" (so it counts just the applications) or "22000 software items available" ?
<mvo_> seb128: count issue is now fixed as well I think
<fagan> kenvandine: is the rgba in lucid going to be fixed this week?
<seb128> mvo_, excellent ;-)
<seb128> fagan, then is no rgba in lucid, it's in a ppa so far
<seb128> then -> there
<fagan> seb128: thats what I was asking aboyt
<fagan> *about
<seb128> it's not likley now no
<seb128> likely
<seb128> can't typo today!
<fagan> I just wanted to know so I can test
<seb128> week is almost over and there is still known crashers
<seb128> gksu has been fixed though
<seb128> but totem crashes
<seb128> and some other issues
<fagan> gksu is a pain when its not working
<tseliot> rickspencer3: ping
<rickspencer3> hi tseliot
<mpt> mvo_, "The status bar text should be of the form â29 079 items availableâ." <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter#lobby>
<rickspencer3> ooh call time
<tseliot> right
<mvo_> mpt: ok, thanks
<pitti> so long, good night everyone
<seb128> 'night pitti
 * Amaranth looks around
<seb128> hey Amaranth
<seb128> how are you?
<Amaranth> howdy
<Amaranth> doing good, slept in on my day off :)
<Amaranth> you?
<seb128> good, thanks
<seb128> I asked mvo_ what he though about the compiz split
<seb128> he seems to think some 27 binaries is overdoing it too
<mvo_> is it really 27?
<seb128> what would you think about dropping everything buggy or useless and putting everything else not used by default in one extra binary?
<Amaranth> mvo_: well there are something like 70 plugins if we were to split them all
<Amaranth> I didn't plan on doing that though, just compiz-plugins and plugins-main while dropping the excess (minimize vs animation, plane vs wall, etc) and the buggy/crazy
<seb128> heh
<seb128> you told me you did it a week ago or so
<seb128> don't make me grep for logs ;-)
<Amaranth> Right, I told you I split compiz-plugins
<Amaranth> Then you said to drop the ones we didn't want
<seb128> do you have those changes somewhere?
<seb128> well that's my opinion
<Amaranth> I agree with it :)
<seb128> I'm open to discuss if you disagree
<seb128> good ;-)
 * mvo_ needs to leave for dinner now, sorry for that
<seb128> mvo_, enjoy
<Amaranth> I was just going to get rid of options for the plugins that were crazy/broken but getting read of whole plugins never occured to me
<Amaranth> But I guess we can split each one into "stuff we use" and "stuff we don't use" instead
<Amaranth> But you have to tell me how to name them :)
 * Ng notes it's almost christmas and the snow plugin is deprecated ;(
<seb128> well I would do 3 categories
<seb128> things which are known to be buggy and should not be used, which we would just stop shipping
<Amaranth> s/deprecated/removed from karmic/
<seb128> things we install by default
<seb128> things we ship in universe
<Amaranth> seb128: Right and I've got compiz-plugins as the name for the parts we use, what do we name the other one?
<seb128> -universe
<seb128> ?
<seb128> since extras, etc is already used
<Amaranth> Rather unimaginative but alright ;)
<Amaranth> btw, why does it matter that the binary is in universe when the source comes from main?
<seb128> I'm not really an imaginative person indeed
<seb128> it doesn't
<seb128> let's use -wedontcare
<seb128> ;-)
<Amaranth> hehe
<seb128> or -crackaddict
<Ng> -unsupported? :)
<Amaranth> I like -blingtastic
<Amaranth> Ng: Already taken by upstream
<Ng> -unsupporteder ;)
<Amaranth> compiz had a thing sort of like gstreamer's good, bad, and ugly
<Amaranth> main, extra, unsupported
<Amaranth> Ng: Unsupported part 2: This time it's serious
<Ng> this time seb means it
 * Amaranth wonders why launchpad keeps telling him he uploaded compiz
 * mpt blinks at apturl: "Package mencoder is virtual."
<mpt> What's that supposed to mean?
<Amaranth> It means several packages have a Provides for mencoder but there is no package named mencoder
<mpt> thanks Amaranth
<mpt> Amaranth, but now I've uninstalled ttf-larabie-deco, apt:ttf-larabie-deco gives me "Package 'ttf-larabie-deco' is virtual." too. So either ttf-larabie-deco is provided by some other package (I don't think so), or that's not what "is virtual" means, or there's a bug in apturl.
<Amaranth> mpt: I guess the last one
<mpt> woot
<Amaranth> mpt: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-binary.html section 3.6 explains what a virtual package is
<Amaranth> so it'd have to be a bug in apturl
<mpt> thanks
<mpt> I was just looking at that same page earlier today
<Amaranth> mencoder does not appear to be virtual either...
<Amaranth> james_w: according to your email I should be able to do `bzr branch lp:ubuntu/compiz` and get a branch to work on but instead I get this: bzr: ERROR: Invalid url supplied to transport: "lp:ubuntu/compiz": compiz in ubuntu has no default branch.
<Amaranth> seb128: on bug 356702 upstream actually completely failed to understand the problem but decided it was a dupe of a known libwnck (not compiz) bug instead
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 356702 in compiz "tooltips stick when they shouldn't" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/356702
<rickspencer3> msg eeejay_away hi
<Amaranth> oops :)
<Amaranth> I have a feeling the problem is libwnck isn't getting mouse events during the viewport change animation so doesn't know the mouse left and gets into a weird state
<mpt> mvo_, are URLs of the form "apt+http://launchpad.net/~mvo/ppa?package=2vcard" actually supposed to be implemented at the moment? Firefox gives me an error when I try to open one, and won't let me set up apturl to handle it.
<mpt> ("Firefox doesn't know how to open this address, because the protocol (apt+http) isn't associated with any program.")
<james_w> Amaranth: compiz hasn't been imported yet
<Amaranth> james_w: ah, that explains it then
<mac_v> Amaranth: hi.. what happened to the show desktop plugin in Lucid? , has it been removed?
<Amaranth> mac_v: that's in plugins-extra, you need to install it
<mac_v> ah...
<mac_v> Amaranth: is this due to the new split?
<Amaranth> no, we just don't use any plugins from that package so don't install it
<mac_v> oh , ok
<baptistemm> hi pitti
<baptistemm> backlight is working
<baptistemm> hmm actually hal was not removed, ...
<baptistemm> ah, I'm just wrong. hal is removed, but libhal and mibhal-storage are still installed
<chrisccoulson> hi awe - i just replied to your mail
<chrisccoulson> (sorry, I only just got in from work)
<awe> chrisccoulson, thanks!
<chrisccoulson> hey jcastro
<chrisccoulson> i just replied to the tracker bug you opened :)
<chrisccoulson> i'm going to work on updating to the latest version of tracker over the next couple of weeks, so I don't think anyone should spend any effort porting it to use the new application indicator yet
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<seb128> hello chrisccoulson
<seb128> jcastro, there?
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<jcastro> seb128: yeah
<seb128> good thanks
<seb128> you?
<seb128> did you manage to go back from work?
<seb128> jcastro, thanks for bug flooding us ;-)
<jcastro> seb128: hey I just work here!
<jcastro> chrisccoulson: great, that's why we filed them all, to be aware of issues like that
<seb128> jcastro, heh, joke aside would be nice to put an useful url in the bugs
<seb128> but that might be late now
<seb128> like a tutorial
<seb128> or a blog post explaining the thing
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i got back from work (just now)
<jcastro> seb128: I am going to add a URL to the porting guide to the URL that it's currently pointing to
<seb128> because the tarball page is of no real use...
<chrisccoulson> the weather is not too bad though - most of the snow has gone now. it's just very icy
<jcastro> yeah I only realized that after I had sent the mail
<jcastro> seb128: but don't worry I am working on it now!
<seb128> jcastro, good ;-)
<seb128> jcastro, I just though you had documentation ready etc
<jcastro> I do
<seb128> so I was a bit disappointed when I clicked on the url
<jcastro> I have it all ready
<jcastro> I just didn't link
<seb128> I actually wanted to have a look at those
<jcastro> it will be fixed in a minute
<seb128> ok good
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> you rock!
 * seb128 hugs jcastro
<jcastro> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopExperienceTeam/ApplicationIndicators
<seb128> that's useful!
<jcastro> even got you a porting guide in 3 languages!
<seb128> one thing
<seb128> would be nice to have a configure example too
<seb128> in the C case
<seb128> there is quite some people who don't like autotools and just want to copy those things
<jcastro> ok
<jcastro> https://edge.launchpad.net/indicator-application
<jcastro> how's this for discoverability now?
<seb128> jcastro, that's much better now ;-)
<seb128> thanks!
<kenvandine> seb128, i have the tomboy patch with appindicator support
<kenvandine> it will be dep wait for the new binary packages to get NEWed... can i upload?
<seb128> kenvandine, you got the bindings in lucid already?
<kenvandine> uploaded
<seb128> new-ed?
<kenvandine> but will need to be NEWed
<kenvandine> not yuet
<kenvandine> yet
<seb128> hum
<seb128> I would wait
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> will do
<seb128> or you will block tomboy until those are newed
<kenvandine> i will push the bzr branch though
<seb128> which might not be before a week with people on holidays etc
<seb128> who sponsored those?
<seb128> is that a new source?
<kenvandine> no, not new
<kenvandine> they are in indicator-application
<seb128> hum
<kenvandine> i had pitti look over the packaging a bit this morning
<seb128> I can probably binary new those tonight
<seb128> upload tomboy
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> cool!
<seb128> I though that was a new source
<seb128> I'm not sure I like having binding built from the new source
<seb128> but that's not a discussion for now ;-)
<kenvandine> hehe... ok
<kenvandine> well the bindings got added to the upstream source
<kenvandine> so they are all in one place
<kenvandine> much better that what happened with libindicate
<kenvandine> what a pain
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I'm happy that pygtk is not in gtk source for example ;-)
<seb128> jcastro, tedg: that document lacks instruction on what to do
<seb128> like what should be done with the software we patch
<seb128> it has examples for new code
<seb128> it doesn't say if we should have fallback for standard notification area use
<seb128> it doesn't say if menus should be reorganized or if currents ones should be used
<seb128> is that something you plan to work on documenting too?
<tedg> seb128: Yes, but we need to finish things like fallbacks in the library.
<tedg> seb128: mpt has also written some design guidelines.
<tedg> seb128: I'm not sure why they didn't get in.
<seb128> is it worth to start on porting applications now?
<seb128> implementing code for things the library will do seems suboptimal
<tedg> seb128: I would say yes, as for most apps the library will take care of all the fallbacks.
<seb128> well, you recommend not having fallback for now then?
<seb128> until the library get that done
<tedg> Yes.
<seb128> ok thanks
<robert_ancell> grr, is bzr down
<robert_ancell> seb128, who can do SRUs?  I did a proper SRU for gcalctool but no-one has sponsored it (bug  483730).  I
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 483730 in gcalctool "gnome-calculator not giving expected results: 2e-2 is not 0.02 ..." [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/483730
<robert_ancell> 'd like to release 5.28.2 to karmic
<TheMuso> /c/c
<seb128> robert_ancell, you should subscribe sponsors if you want sponsoring
<seb128> you didn't there
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you try? you might be able now
<seb128> gcalctool is in the desktop set
<seb128> or it should
<robert_ancell> seb128, ah, ok
 * robert_ancell looks up SRU documentation
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell - i just sponsored a karmic SRU for transmission, and that uploaded ok
<seb128> robert_ancell, you apparently subscribed the sru team to the bug
<seb128> which should be subscribed after upload
<seb128> they do review not uploads
<seb128> and they work in reverse I think
<seb128> ie notice things in the queue and go the bug
<robert_ancell> seb128, so they take it out of proposed and into karmic?
<seb128> which explain why nobody commented on that bug
<seb128> yes
<seb128> it's the same as hard freeze
<seb128> you need an archive admin to wave uploads through from the queue
<seb128> the sru team do the debdiff review and accept the updates
<robert_ancell> seb128, hmm, I also want to make a karmic bzr branch to practise that but bzr/lp seems down at the moment
<seb128> right
<seb128> cf #ubuntu-devel
<seb128> or #launchpad topic...
<robert_ancell> I'm putting together a proposal for bzr in oem - what do you guys see as the big advantages over the previous system?
<seb128> review are much easier
<seb128> when you ask somebody to fix something you can review the new commit
<seb128> rather than diffing diffs than you download from somewhere
<seb128> you can also see history of changes
<seb128> it allow stacking work without uploading
<seb128> or you can start working on something and not conflict with other people because everybody works in his corner
<seb128> it makes easier to have somebody else looking at your changes
<seb128> or fixing those
<robert_ancell> seb128, was there a reason why we went with only the debian/ dir in bzr - was that to keep merging with debian easier?
<seb128> it's mainly due to me saying no to full source
<seb128> the main concern was speed issues
<seb128> like bzr get from nautilus taking 25 minutes
<seb128> where apt-get takes 1 minute to download the tarball
<seb128> but bzr got much better since
<robert_ancell> seb128, right, I wonder if that is fixed with bzr 2
<robert_ancell> is debian moving to drop dpatch and use git instead?
<seb128> I think we should use full source now
<seb128> not sure
<seb128> their new source format has quilt builtin
<seb128> but they can use git too I think
<seb128> not sure what people will do
<seb128> Debian doesn't enforce such decisions
<seb128> it's up to people to decide
<robert_ancell> bzr is back!
<seb128> good ;-)
<seb128> using full source will make cherry picking and merges easier too
<seb128> though merges don't have often things out of the debian dir
<robert_ancell> seb128, right, so I'm wondering if I should recommend to oem to go straight to full source and we'll start doing that in lucid+1
<seb128> right
<seb128> I'm not opposed to do it in lucid
<seb128> you could use gdm as an example
<seb128> or gcalctool
<robert_ancell> I'm using gcalctool as an example :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> did you read james_w's email?
<robert_ancell> seb128, don't know the email, did he send it today?
<seb128> robert_ancell, no, yesterday your time I think
<seb128> one day ago on ubuntu-devel list
 * robert_ancell looking
<robert_ancell> ah yes
<seb128> kenvandine, still there?
<kenvandine> seb128, yeah
<seb128> kenvandine, I'm not sure about your libindicate-cil-dev
<kenvandine> ?
<seb128> looking to the other .pc for sharp things I've installed
<seb128> which is a good list of those
<seb128> they all put the .pc in the -cil
<seb128> ie they don't have an extra -dev binary
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> weird... it does seem like a waste to have the binary for one file
<kenvandine> but it seems weird to include a pkgconfig file in a lib?
<seb128> well I've 21 example on my box
<seb128> and they are all consitant
<seb128> I would say the mono packager decide on that in Debian
<kenvandine> ok... then i'll whack that then :)
<seb128> the mono packagers rather
<seb128> you might want to ask a mono guy
<seb128> ie directhex on #ubuntu-devel for example
<kenvandine> i looked, it does seem consistent
<Laney> we just changed that
<seb128> kenvandine, http://pkg-mono.alioth.debian.org/cli-policy/ch-mono.html
<Laney> this is a new policy, http://wiki.debian.org/Teams/DebianMonoGroup/Mono-devTransition
<seb128> Laney, what did you decide on?
<seb128> the page has a list but no details about the transition
<Laney> yeah, I don't know if it's written down
<Laney> -dev containing the pc file and a ${binary:Version} dep on the lib basically
<seb128> so what should be done?
<seb128> kenvandine, ^
<seb128> you are leading innovation apparently there ;-)
<Laney> it's to help for transitions
<kenvandine> hehe
<seb128> Laney, thank you
<kenvandine> seb128, it's what other distros do :)
<Laney> np
<kenvandine> ok, so we can leave as is
<kenvandine> thx Laney
<Laney> there is a little gotcha with tomboy packaging and mono 2.4.3 btw
<Laney> you might want to grab the change from tomboy -3 that we just uploaded to debian
<Laney> unless you like 8mb more of deps :)
 * kenvandine needs to jet for a bit
<kenvandine> eww
<kenvandine> Laney, i'll look
<seb128> kenvandine, I will new your binaries to main now
<seb128> have fun
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> see you tomorrow ;-)
<seb128> I'm probably off to bed soon after that
<seb128> kenvandine, hum, the dev should be arch all I guess
<seb128> since it has only the .pc which is txt
<seb128> to fix in a next upload
<Laney> don't forget the replaces too
<Laney> if you are moving from non -dev to having one
<seb128> Laney, it's a new package in this case
<seb128> the new indicator thing
<seb128> but thanks
<Laney> okey dokey
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-12-18
<mac_v> Amaranth: hi... is it a known Lucid bug that the system starts without an window manager? i'm having to reload compiz every time i boot up...
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> baptistemm: backlight working> great!
<pitti> baptistemm: libhal* doesn't matter
<baptistemm> pitti, okay nice
<baptistemm> I don't recall what is my hardware but I can provide it to you it you care
<pitti> baptistemm: wouldn't be of much help to me, I think
<baptistemm> I was able to change the backlight and I had the notification working aslo
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> good morning chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> I'm great, thank you! how about you?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm good too thanks. only half a day at work to go before the weekend starts :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: when will you start into holidays?
<chrisccoulson> i start on christmas eve. i used all my holiday allowance up this year already ;)
<chrisccoulson> when do you start?
<pitti> on the 24th
<chrisccoulson> pitti - so, you'll still be around next week then ;)
<chrisccoulson> i've heard it's going to be fairly quiet in here
<pitti> right, sounds great for getting stuff done :)
<seb128> hey there
<seb128> I'm a bit late today but with a new screen
<baptistemm> Santa was coming earlier this year ? :)
<seb128> right
<seb128> brb need to reboot to try something
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<mvo> come back seb!
<mvo> seb128: what did you got?
<Ng> mdz: fwiw, you asked yesterday if anyone else was getting "cannot remove.... modules.*map" from update-initramfs. just did my morning updates and ntfs-3g tripped the update-initramfs trigger and I got that message
<Ng> hmm, that was supposed to go to #ubuntu-devel, my bad
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<pitti> seb128: how's the new screen working then?
<pitti> seb128: (FTR, I fixed the lucid chroots, and committed an ubuntu-fat-chroot fix to divert update-alternatives, to permanently fix the dist-upgrade problem0
<seb128> hey mvo chrisccoulson pitti
<seb128> mvo, got a 24" flat screen
<mvo> seb128: nice! what did you have before?
<pitti> sweet
<seb128> mvo, got a 24" flat screen to replace a 19" one
<mvo> sweet
<seb128> I like it ;-)
<mvo> what model/brand is it?
<seb128> it's much better than using laptop + 19" that I was doing this week
<seb128> I've space and no screen confusion ;-)
<seb128> Iiayama prolite e2407hds
<mpt> mvo, hi, did you see my question about apt+http: yesterday?
<mvo> mpt: no, sorry
<seb128> pitti, (thanks)
<mvo> mpt: but apt+http is something we do not really support for security reasons, it lets you add any repository
<mvo> mpt: and that is not something we want to make too easy (especially triggering it from a website)
<mpt> mvo, I thought we had a whitelist for that. Or am I confusing it with something else?
<mvo> oh, hold on
<mvo> we solved the whitelist with a different mechanism (the channel= parameter to apturl)
<mvo> (unless I'm confused which is quite possible, but not that likely)
<mpt> mvo, the channel= parameter isn't described in the man page, so I haven't included it in <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter#apturl> yet. Is it documented anywhere?
<mvo> mpt: could you please paste again what you asked yesterday? I don't have logs it seems
<pitti> mvo: (irclogs.ubuntu.com FTW :) )
<mpt> <mpt> mvo_, are URLs of the form "apt+http://launchpad.net/~mvo/ppa?package=2vcard" actually supposed to be implemented at the moment? Firefox gives me an error when I try to open one, and won't let me set up apturl to handle it.
<mpt> <mpt> ("Firefox doesn't know how to open this address, because the protocol (apt+http) isn't associated with any program.")
<mpt> that's all :-)
<mvo> mpt: ok, thanks. I look at the code in some minutes (need to finish some apt coding first) and come back with answer from code (and not memory)
<mpt> ok, thanks
<mpt> This apturl replacement is turning out to be ever so slightly more complex than I thought it would be :-)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - will you have time to review any SRU's today?
<pitti> I counter the question with: did you upload anythign which should be processed soon?
<pitti> I can make some time, yes
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i uploaded transmission a couple of days agoand robert_ancell uploaded a gcalctool update as well
<chrisccoulson> oops, there was meant to be a carriage return somewhere in there
<mvo> mpt: ok, so the README has a tiny bit of information about channel, that is the mechanism used for adding trusted third parties (like partner or in the future other repos). the apt+http stuff is disabled in the source
<mvo> mpt: I'm updating the man-page now
<mpt> mvo, can you send me the diff so I can design the replacement? :-)
<mvo> http://paste.ubuntu.com/343732/
<mpt> thanks mvo (and "Avaialble" should be "Available")
<mvo> mpt: thanks, fixed
<mpt> mvo, if you have a few spare minutes, could you have a quick look at the "Custom package lists" and "Launching and navigating from apt: links" sections to check that they make sense? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter#custom-list
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks for processing the transmission SRU :)
<pitti> Riddell: would you mind adding some kubuntu status to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus ?
<mac_v> tedg: hi... hope UX folks would consider Bug 498182 ;) .. this menu isnt a single one as the previous items :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 498182 in indicator-application "Indicator-application does not support vertical panels" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/498182
<dobey> pitti: around? :)
<tedg> mac_v: It's not going to be a huge priority as vertical panels aren't in default setups.
<mac_v> tedg: yeah , i know but atleast hope its not a "wont fix" like the rest ;)
<dobey> it's a trivial fix though
<Amaranth> mac_v: starting without a WM is certainly not supposed to happen (works fine here)
<Amaranth> mac_v: file a bug against gnome-session, I guess
<mac_v> tedg: it took quite a while for me to realize that rhythmbox was being sent there...
<tedg> mac_v: Not a "wont fix" but may end up being a "dont' have time to fix" :)
<mac_v> Amaranth: gnome-session? it happens everytime for me :(
<Amaranth> right, gnome-session in responsible for starting a WM
<Amaranth> you wouldn't blame a WM for nothing telling it to start, would you? :)
<mac_v> Amaranth: hehe  , nope.. ;) .. i thought it was a side effect of moving plugins to the -extra package , and that it was not starting since ,certain plugins are missing
<Amaranth> no no, compiz will start no matter how badly its configuration is screwed up as long as you don't manage to crash it
<mac_v> ah , ok
<mac_v> tedg:  "dont' have time to fix" :( .. dobey mentions its a simple fix , damn if only i knew how , i'd submit a patch :/
<dobey> mac_v: look at the source in gnome-panel for the menu applet thingy
<dobey> mac_v: i think it just rotates the whole menu bar
<dobey> mac_v: but you need to rotate a different direction depending on which side the panel is on
<mac_v> dobey: ah , right the gnome-menu... will check it out :)  thanks
<kenvandine> mac_v, PANEL_ORIENTATION_LEFT and PANEL_ORIENTATION_RIGHT in panel-menu-bar.c
<kenvandine> not sure how trival it is to add that to indicator-applet, but i would imagine easy
<mac_v> cool , will test/try it out ...
<pitti> dobey: hi
<dobey> pitti: hey. care to poke at a couple SRUs for me? haven't seen any activity on them in a few days, and was wondering how to push them along and get them through
<pitti> dobey: we by and large need someone to confirm that the package still works and fixes the bug
<dobey> pitti: hrmm, ok
<pitti> feel free to ask in the bugs, of course
<mvo> its snowing!
 * mvo feels like christmas already
<pitti> snowing here since yesterday, too; everything is bright white
<rickspencer3> good morning pitti, I hope you are enjoying the snow
<rickspencer3> seb128, pitti, Riddell, bryce_, etc... shall we cancel the team meeting for next Tuesday? Not many of us will be here I think
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> rickspencer3: I'm enjoying it from inside :)
<Riddell> rickspencer3: aren't you on holiday anyway?
<pitti> rickspencer3: meeting> makes sense, I think
 * pitti looks forward to having three quiet days to get stuff done
<rickspencer3> Riddell, yes, today is my last non-holiday day, but I thought you guyses might want to meet anyway
<kenvandine> pitti, it should be snowing here in about an hour
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, if you were writing some code with Quidgets, and you were going to make a function call that brought up a dialog to collect a string as input from a user ...
<rickspencer3> what would you expect that function call to be named?
<rickspencer3> pitti, seb128, eeejay, didrocks, anybody? ^
 * rickspencer3 practices participatory design ;)
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> perhaps something that starts with raise_
<kenvandine> nah
<pitti> rickspencer3: how many similar things do you have? (a yes/no dialog, info/error messages, etc.)
<kenvandine> sounds like exception handling
<pitti> sounds very similar to standard message box use cases
<rickspencer3> pitti, yes, I'm thinking you'll be able to get:L string, number, date, yes/no
<rickspencer3> yes, and also just show a message box
<pitti> http://library.gnome.org/devel/gtk/unstable/GtkMessageDialog.html is already quite nice -- it allows you to specify arbitrary buttons, etc.
<rickspencer3> pitti, nah, it's too hard
<rickspencer3> it should be:
<rickspencer3> response, input = somefunction(a couple of params)
<rickspencer3> so I need to wrap up messagedialog
<pitti> so I'd like to see an equivalent gtk_input_dialog(InputDialog.DATE, "when is your birthday?", InputDialog.OK | InputDialog.Cancel)
<rickspencer3> (not that I'll take away message dialog)
<rickspencer3> right
<pitti> but I wouldn't do an int_input_dialog, date_input_dialog, etc.
<rickspencer3> pitti, why not?
<pitti> since these might get different arguments and thus are harder to remember/error prone
<rickspencer3> oh, I see
<pitti> maybe it's just me, but I usually don't like to encode data types in function arguments
<rickspencer3> no, they should all have the exact same arguments
<pitti> but of course this is all bikeshedding, I don't have a scientific argument :)
<rickspencer3> pitti, mmm
<pitti> rickspencer3: in the general case you might want "any string"
<rickspencer3> pitti, I was asking for bikeshedding, I'm building a bike shed ;)
<pitti> but you might hand over a type flag, a regexp, etc.
<rickspencer3> but I think, perhaps, pitti you are rather more systematic than the user I am targetting
<pitti> one day I might need a message box which lets me enter [a-z_]\w+
<rickspencer3> pitti, right, at which point you can write that yourself ;)
<pitti> but of couse this might be a little too complex
<rickspencer3> I'm thinking of someone who is new pygtk and is used to alert("boo");
<pitti> rickspencer3: ah, for date you actually want to show a calendar applet, and no input line
<rickspencer3> yes
<rickspencer3> here's what I'll do, I think
<rickspencer3> you can go:
<pitti> right, that should be a different function, since it looks totally different
<rickspencer3> result, date = quidgets.prompt.date_prompt()
<pitti> input_string(title, text), input_date(title, text), etc.
<rickspencer3> ^notice that I am handling the run(), etc... for the programmer
<pitti> s/string/line/ perhaps, too
<rickspencer3> pitti, what do you think of a prompt namespace in the library?
<pitti> rickspencer3: no firm opinion, I think
<pitti> just that I don't like prompt.date_prompt()
<pitti> either prompt.date() or .date_prompt()
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<pitti> (namespace name duplication)
<rickspencer3> pitti, , right
<rickspencer3> let me start with that
<rickspencer3> I'll start with string, data, yes/no
<rickspencer3> s/data/date
<pitti> incidentally, in apport I have something similar for hooks
<pitti> python -c 'import apport.ui; help(apport.ui.HookUI)'
<didrocks> prompt.date() seems good to me :)
<seb128> hum
<seb128> tedg, hey
<seb128> tedg, so the rhythmbox icon issue is that the icon is in an app dir
<seb128> which works when the code is running from the application side...
<seb128> but the applet doesn't look in the /usr/share/rhythmbox dir
<tedg> seb128: Yes, so we need to allow apps to specify those directories.
<seb128> right
<tedg> seb128: And then we have to remove and add them appropriately (which is the harder part)
<seb128> the code to show play, stop button seems to doesn't work either
<seb128> your example is not clear
<seb128> should apps use set_icon
<seb128> or set_attention_icon?
<seb128> you use the second in your example
<tedg> They're different icons.  One is for attention, the other is the standard case.
<seb128> but I would think the first is the one to use
<seb128> what is attention?
<seb128> the api is not clear about that
<seb128> the rhythmbox code set that one
<seb128> to play or pause
<seb128> which are in the standard dir
<seb128> but that doesn't work
<seb128> but maybe it's never is the attention status
<seb128> ?
<seb128> rickspencer3, hey
<seb128> rickspencer3, I'm on vac next week
<seb128> so no meeting for me in any case
<seb128> (to reply to earlier question, sorry I was not in front on the computer running IRC)
<tedg> seb128: http://people.canonical.com/~ted/libappindicator/current/AppIndicator.html#AppIndicator--attention-icon-name
<rickspencer3> hi seb128
<seb128> tedg, when should attention be used?
<tedg> seb128: When you want to show that icon :)
<seb128> tedg, the attention icon is used for the attention status...great
<seb128> I wouldn't have guessed from the name
<seb128> well, why should I set that rather than just change the icon?
<seb128> what is asking for attention?
<jcastro> tedg: shall I assign the bug to you? It would be a shame to be on holiday with a broken rhythmbox icon
<seb128> do you have a concrete example?
<tedg> seb128: Because KDE people like it that way :)
<seb128> tedg, sorry but it's not clear to me still
<seb128> I don't understand when I'm supposed to set the attention status
<tedg> seb128: I'm not a fan of it, but I think it's a convinience thing.  Like you can just set the state and not worry about icons.
<seb128> well
<tedg> seb128: Like Evolution saying it has new mail.
<seb128> the rhythmbox change sets the attention icon to play and pause
<seb128> but that doesn't work
<seb128> the icon never change
<seb128> I'm not sure if that's a stack bug
<seb128> or if the attention status is a special case to trigger
<seb128> and how to trigger it
<seb128> I can do play and pause and still get the no found icon
<seb128> the play and pause icons are standard dir ones
<seb128> ie not in the rhythmbox dir
<tedg> seb128: I'm not sure.  Are you talking about the icons in the menu now?
<seb128> no
<seb128> I was trying to understand the rhythmbox change
<seb128> ie does set the status icon
<kenvandine> tedg, when there is a song change or state change, it changes the icon
<seb128> and the api is not clear about when that should happen
<seb128> and the actual icon is never displayed
<seb128> I'm trying to understand why
<seb128> also the padding makes icons look weird
<kenvandine> seb128, i tried changing every place that set the icon to use a common one that should be found and it still never set it
<seb128> not sure if that's a bug
<seb128> kenvandine, it works if I copy the /usr/share/rhythmbox/icons/hicolor/scalable/status/rhythmbox-notplaying.svg
<kenvandine> seb128, but using the same icon in a python example works
<seb128> to /usr/share/libindicator/icons/hicolor/scalable/status/
<kenvandine> oh really?
<kenvandine> humm
<seb128> it's just that the code runs under the wrong namespace
<seb128> ie doesn't find custom rhythmbox icons
<kenvandine> in fact, in a python example i set it to the rhythmbox icon
<kenvandine> and it worked
<kenvandine> which i thought was weird
<kenvandine> just passed "rhythmbox" as icon-name
<kenvandine> so i suspect in the rhythmbox case, it is because it is setting attention
<kenvandine> maybe that only uses icons in /usr/share/libindicator/icons/hicolor/scalable/status/ ?
<kenvandine> try making it not set attention and see if it works
<seb128> kenvandine, try sudo cp /usr/share/rhythmbox/icons/hicolor/scalable/status/rhythmbox-notplaying.svg /usr/share/libindicator/icons/hicolor/scalable/status/ and run it
<seb128> it works there
<seb128> it = rhythmbox
<seb128> the patch uses rhythmbox-notplaying naming
<seb128> not rhythmbox
<kenvandine> yeah, i am just wondering if it wasn't setting attention if it would find it
<seb128> not
<seb128> it's in /usr/share/rhythmbox
<seb128> not /usr/share/icons...
<seb128> the applet doesn't use custom rhythmbox directory...
<seb128> anyway I need to run for some errands now
<seb128> be back later!
<kenvandine> i see
<seb128> we can change the icon to use rhythmbox for now
<seb128> that one would like work
<seb128> likely
<kenvandine> i tried that and it didn't
<seb128> weird
<kenvandine> in rb
<kenvandine> but it does in my example
<seb128> so maybe it only uses /usr/share/libindicator/icons
<seb128> for some reason
<kenvandine> which is why i suspect it is related to attention
<seb128> tomboy works though
<seb128> it must be a rhythmbox issue
<seb128> could be
<seb128> I will play with that when I'm back
<seb128> bbl
<kenvandine> tedg, if i do indicator.set_status(appindicator.STATUS_ATTENTION)
<kenvandine> then
<kenvandine> indicator.get_icon()
<kenvandine> i should get the icon i used in indicator.set_attention_icon ?
<tedg> kenvandine: No.  The icons are kept distinct
<tedg> kenvandine: The only place it should be different is the panel (not sure if it works or not)
<kenvandine> tedg, well it isn't changing the icon in the panel :)
<kenvandine> so if i set_status to STATUS_ATTENTION it should change the icon?
<tedg> kenvandine: Yes.
<kenvandine> ok... not working :)
<tedg> kenvandine: :-/
<kenvandine> and should set_icon change the icon ?
<pitti> dobey: please notice that testing PPAs doesn't count for SRUs; you have to test the packages in -proposed
<dobey> pitti: ok, they are the exact same packages... only difference is the ~ppa1~series at the end :)
<pitti> right, but they will/might get built in a different environment
<pitti> (different toolchain, etc.)
<pitti> that's not very important for testing that the bugs are fixed
<pitti> but we still need a general test of the -proposed binaries to check for misbuilds
<dobey> ok
<dobey> well, i guess they need to be uploaded to proposed then. i'm not sure how to do that myself, or if i can
<pitti> no, you'll need a sponsor
<pitti> dobey: btw, that's the reason why "update to 1.0.1" bugs are rather useless for SRUs
<pitti> since they aren't reported by someone who is actually affected by them
<pitti> and the SRU policy mandates to use the actual, real bugs instead
<dobey> pitti: this is another reason that launchpad needs bug dependencies
<pitti> well, they might be useful indeed
<pitti> but not really important
<pitti> we don't really want to update karmic to 1.0.1
<pitti> what we really want is to fix a bug
<dobey> well, we want to fix 20 bugs
<pitti> and we upload 1.0.1 as a means to that
<dobey> but i don't want to do 20 separate updates when they're all fixed already in the code
<pitti> no, sure
<pitti> I mean conceptually, not technically
<pitti> from an user's POV, I filed a bug, and a month later I get a followup "please test karmic-proposed"
<dobey> yes, sure. and i don't want users to think their bug is somehow less important than this other one, where we decided to put the SRU request
<pitti> right, exactly my point
<dobey> and i don't want to go through every bug and duplicate the same SRU request
<pitti> a separate "SRU request" bug is useless
<pitti> it wouldn't be the same, though
<pitti> if you fix 20 bugs, there are 20 different test cases and 20 different solutiosn
<pitti> and the changelog needs to mention 20 bugs and descriptions
<pitti> etc.
<dobey> the changelog does mention them all
<dobey> i don't see how the SRU request wouldn't be the same for all the bugs
<dobey> but how do i get it into -proposed in the first place?
<asac> mdeslaur: i cannot find your mm bug id
<asac> is that filed against mm at all
<asac> ?
<pitti> dobey: normal sponsoring, just like any other package; shall I upload something for you?
<pitti> dobey: (sorry, I'm lagged; release meeting going on)
<dobey> pitti: well i guess ubuntuone-storage-protocol and ubuntuone-client need uploading to -proposed. if i've done something wrong and need to make changes to the packaging, for that to happen, please let me know and i'll fix it asap. thanks :)
<pitti> dobey: .dsc url?
<pitti> (or PPA, or whereever I can get the source from)
<dobey> lp:~ubuntuone-control-tower/ubuntu/karmic/ubuntuone-storage-protocol/karmic
<dobey> lp:~ubuntuone-control-tower/ubuntu/karmic/ubuntuone-client/karmic
<dobey> pitti: ^ there :)
<dobey> i gotta get lunch now. but i'll be back soon
<pitti> dobey: can you please fix s/karmic/karmic-proposed/ in changelog?
<pitti> (I can't commit to those branches)
<didrocks> pitti: not sure to be able to debug the netbook-launcher thing until the nvidia priopriotary driver working with Xorg 1.7 makes it in lucid (I have another error as 3D acceleration isn't available)
<pitti> didrocks: njpatel said he has an idea
<pitti> didrocks: oh, you figure it's graphics driver related?
<didrocks> pitti: Can't confirm. Only that I have another error not being able to get 3D acceleration
<didrocks> if njpatel has an idea, great :)
<njpatel> pitti: didrocks: off the cuff it looks like we're not reading something properly and trying to set a NULL pointer to the ClutterText's "text" property. However, I need to make sure
<pitti> dobey: u-s-p uploaded with that karmic-proposed change
<pitti> dobey: a lot of those changes aren't really SRU matter, btw (like "Fix for running on python < 2.6.3" or "Distinguish auth errors from other errors" or "Create a POT during the build", and the like)
<pitti> dobey: next time, please don't add changes which potentially destabilize things and aren't SRU matter
<pitti> it's causing you and me extra work, and makes verification much harder
<tedg> I can't seem to make this bug public.  I thought since I filled it...  bug 498189
<ubottu> Bug 498189 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/498189 is private
<tedg> Can someone check to see if it's just me :)
<pitti> tedg: I can see it, and you are subscribed, so you should be able to, too
<pitti> if not, that's an LP bug
<pitti> tedg: are you logged in?
<tedg> pitti: yeah, cause I can see the bug...
<pitti> oh, I misread
<pitti> I can make it public (just did so)
<tedg> Hmm, cool.  Thank pitti!  That's the important thing :)
<pitti> tedg: made private again for your testing
<pitti> oh
<pitti> tedg: do you get an error message?
<tedg> Hmm, I just noticed as it loaded the icon came up and disappeared.  I wonder if it's an Epiphany bug.
<pitti> anyway, I made it public again
<tedg> Ah, it is an Epiphany bug.  I can't make it private again either.
<tedg> Thanks for the help pitti
<dobey> pitti: the "distinguish auth errors" issue is most certanily an sru issue. and most all the fixes are well tested already, by thousands of users using our beta ppa
<asac> dobey: how did you get those stats ;)?
<asac> "thousands" ;)
<dobey> asac: i think < 10% of ubuntuone users using the beta PPA is a pretty safe estimate
 * pitti had rather estimated that < 1% of users even know what a PPA is..
<asac> haha
<asac> dobey: how so? did you install that somehoe automatically?
<dobey> asac: the install instructions on the ubuntu one web site are "click here and this will add the PPA, and then click here, and it will install the software"
<dobey> pitti: u1 users, not ubuntu users :)
<pitti> right, for ubuntu users in general the percentage is probably more like 0.1% :) (which would be some 10.000)
<pitti> but anyway, I uploaded both packages
<pitti> I just need you to do the changelog fix in bzr
<asac> ah right. you shipped this ugly package installing the ppa etc.
<dobey> yeah i will
<pitti> good night everyone
<chrisccoulson> good night pitti
<chrisccoulson> have a good weekend
<pitti> bye chrisccoulson, have anice weekend!
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - you there? i'm just going through my bug mail and saw you opened a gnome-session bug
<didrocks> have a nice weekend pitti :)
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: hi.. yup
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - you're restoring from a saved session which seems to be broken
<chrisccoulson> when did this start happening?
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - WARNING: Could not launch application '108f965d3aada14f25125765658777116800000018040038.desktop': Unable to start application: Failed to execute child process "/usr/bin/compiz.real" (No such file or directory)
<chrisccoulson> that's the wrong restart command for compiz ;)
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: ever since , I installed Lucid on a separate partition ... I'm using same /home for both lucid and karmic
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - that's why
<mac_v> hmm..
<chrisccoulson> what has happened is, you've saved a session in karmic (where compiz set the restart command to /usr/bin/compiz.real)
<chrisccoulson> and then tried to restore it in lucid, where /usr/bin/compiz.real no longer exists
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: ah.. ok , how do i remove it?
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - you can just delete ~/.config/gnome-session/saved-session
 * mac_v checks
<chrisccoulson> i'm just wondering if gnome-session should check the existence of the executable when loading saved session info
<chrisccoulson> to handle things like upgrades
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: what other session info would be removed? anything else that would be lost?
<mac_v> nvm... i'm removing it...
<mac_v> brb...
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - did that fix it?
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: yay , fixed :)
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: awesome , thanks
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - cool. it's still a bug though, as it will break in the same way on upgrade for anybody using session saving
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: yeah... so , i'll leave the bug open  , and mention the workaround ?
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - yeah, no problem. you can just copy the IRC log if you like :)
<mac_v> nice.. :)
<rickspencer3> pitti, kenvandine: http://theravingrick.blogspot.com/2009/12/quidgetsprompts-gtkdialogs-now-one.html
<tedg> seb128: I can't believe you got mad at me for not using a field that isn't even in the Debian Policy Manual: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-controlfields.html
<tedg> seb128: :)
<seb128> tedg, which one?
<tedg> seb128: Breaks
<seb128> tedg, http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html#s-breaks?
<tedg> seb128: Okay, why isn't it a control field?
<seb128> it is?
<seb128> see 5.6
<seb128> 5.6.10
<seb128> on the page you pointed before
<tedg> seb128: Ah, I see.  Sorry :)
<seb128> np ;-)
<seb128> and for the record I didn't get mad there ;-)
 * mac_v filed a Bug #498195 , regarding the icon not changing :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 498195 in indicator-application "Rhythmbox menu icon doesnt change indicating the player state" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/498195
<mac_v> tedg: why is it only using a 16px icon size :(  . the indicator-message applet uses 22px this uses 16px , its tough to get good icons in 16 px :(
<dobey> you're actually suggesting 22px is easier to find icons in?
<dobey> :)
<tedg> seb128: There, I fixed the vim syntax highlighting macro -- so I'm all good.
<mac_v> dobey: hehe , easier to get it done , we can just get more info in.. ;)  I couldnt add an extra "audio wave" for the rhythmbox icon ;)    actually all the humanity panel icons are only 16-17px icons done in 22px ... just missed having an extra pixel i guess ;p
<tedg> mac_v: They really should match the text hight, what ever that is.
<tedg> mac_v: That's why it's important not to make them a particular size, but a few.
<mac_v> tedg: ah...ok , makes sense... what other applets are being done or planned?
<dobey> eh
<dobey> there's no good way to do icons that match the text height
<dobey> but the most fitting icon for that height should be picked
<tedg> dobey: the only way would be if we could pass the icon the baseline and the max/average accender and decender.  But yeah. :)
<tedg> mac_v: Applets?
<mac_v> err...
<mac_v> tedg: i meant , menus nm/gpm/volume?
<tedg> mac_v: Do you mean these?  https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=indicator-application
<mac_v> oh , boy! thats a huge list...
<mac_v> tedg: all those for Lucid? awesome :)
<tedg> mac_v: Well, that's the goal -- I can't imagine we'll get through *all* of them.
<tedg> mac_v: :)
<mac_v> ;)
<mac_v> tedg: but some features are being removed because of this migration :( .. like for rhythmbox , it was possible to minimize by just clicking on the icon , but now its not possible :(
<tedg> mac_v: Yes.  We need a way to reopen it using the icon as well.
<mac_v> tedg: maybe using the right-click instead?  should i file a bug for that ?
<tedg> mac_v: We plan on making right click open the menu as well.
<mac_v> hmm ...   :(
<tedg> mac_v: But we can't in gnome-panel currently.  It's controlled by the panel.
<tgpraveen122> mac_v: so right click for open/close left for options. that is just the opposite behaviour of what is right now. will get confusing
<tgpraveen122> tedg: right click opens same menu or different menu as left click
<mac_v> tgpraveen122: the present behavior uses the left-click for menus and thats is being done to keep it consistent
<tedg> tgpraveen122: I think it should open the same.
<tgpraveen122> mac_v: umm no. in karmic left click opens/removes from tray for RB
<mac_v> tgpraveen122: i'm talking about Lucid... karmic is old stuff ;p
<tgpraveen122> :-D
<tgpraveen122> one prob with app indicators if i understand right is that it will be better for volume control,NM, etc but will make open/close of rythmbox,banshee type of apps which minimize to tray
<tgpraveen122> clicking the indicator and in the menu clicking the open or something increases no. of steps for a commonly used operation
<dobey> tedg: you can calculate the height of the text, and make the lookup call check for the best size :)
<mac_v> tedg: why open same menu for both right and left clicks , doesnt seem very ideal , when we could just use the right-click for other actions like minimize , or anything else...
 * mac_v also tries to remind tedg about a long forgotten app named inkscape :)
<tedg> dobey: Yes, but it seems like the idea icon would also be based on the height above baseline, for instance.  You wouldn't want a lot of visual weight where the text doesn't naturally have it.  But, yes, for the simple case that makes sense.
<tedg> mac_v: X supports, I think 9 buttons on pointers, perhaps we should put functionality behind all of them?  ;)
<tedg> I think right click makes sense on something that is alike a canvas.  But not in a menu bar type structure.
<dobey> tedg: most icons aren't small enough to work that way for my text :)
<dobey> you can only fit so much detail in 8px
<tgpraveen122> mac_v: the prob is that what would right click do with volume control or NM then? application indicator from what i read on their docs seems to aim at consistency above most other things
<mac_v> ;p even OSX failed with their one button mouse
<tedg> dobey: You just need a higher DPI screen ;)
<dobey> tedg: my laptop is 260dpi :)
<dobey> but yes, i do need a 1200dpi screen
<mac_v> tgpraveen122: consistency doesnt mean you loose functionality that was already present... nm already has a context menu , volume we can find something else ;p
<tgpraveen122> i am actually all for having traditional behaviour with app indicators. left click for mini/open and right for the menu on all items
<tgpraveen122> and for places where open/min is not applicable like volume control etc only there right and left click should bring up the same menu
<dobey> i'm all for just getting rid of app icon thingies
<tgpraveen122> it is having some amount of consistency while maintaing traditional behaviour and stilll being sane
<tgpraveen122> tedg: whatsay?
<dobey> traditional behavior?
<tgpraveen122>  left click for mini/open and right for the context menu \
<rickspencer3> having a context menu on something that is essentially a menu doesn't really make sense
<tgpraveen122> like in karmic for say rhythmbox icon
<rickspencer3> I think the new Application Indicator design is much more sane
<dobey> rickspencer3: i think it makes sense in some cases, but not the majority
<dobey> probably not on indicators at all so much
<tgpraveen122> well if it solves the easy open/remove from tray for apps like banshee,RB etc then it would be even great
<rickspencer3> what I really want is the easy keyboard access
<dobey> banshee/rb shouldn't be sticking crap in the tray :)
<rickspencer3> as a netbook user, especially
<mac_v> rickspencer3: but what about folks who use the mouse more? ;)
<rickspencer3> mac_v, the mouse should work perfectly
<rickspencer3> but lots of people *can't* use a mouse for all different reasons
<rickspencer3> sometimes it's hardware, but some people have physical limitations that make mousing very onerous
<rickspencer3> we should always strive to be inclusive in our design
<mac_v> rickspencer3: actually , the new design does make sense , but the only problem is the removal of behavior like the "click-to-minimize" which certain apps have :)
<dobey> mac_v: they still have that
<rickspencer3> mac_v, well, those functions should become menu items in the menu
<dobey> mac_v: there's a button in their title bars that looks like [_] that does exactly that
<kenvandine> mac_v, you should be able to close a window and have it really just hide
<rickspencer3> dobey, lol
<kenvandine> and like in rb, there is a show/hide menu item
<rickspencer3> dobey, is right, but mac_v is referring to the windows going away entirely
<mac_v> dobey:  actually as kenvandine mentions it mimizes on close ;)
<kenvandine> yup :)
<rickspencer3> I find those behaviors maddening
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, i dig it :)
<rickspencer3> when I try to click on the indictor and it hides/shows the window
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, oh that
<rickspencer3> it pisses me off
<dobey> mac_v: which is inconsistent with every other app :)
<kenvandine> yeah... that is annoying
<kenvandine> toggling
<mac_v> kenvandine: but we cant restore it :(
<tgpraveen122> rickspencer3: yeah this will make it increase one step ie first click on indicator to open menu then click on open action
<kenvandine> mac_v, yes you can
<rickspencer3> tgpraveen122, right
<mac_v> kenvandine: you mean , only from the menu ;)
<kenvandine> mac_v, i uploaded a fix for that
<kenvandine> well yeah
<kenvandine> mac_v, how else?
<dobey> rb/banshee should have the stupid tray icon removed, and just fix their UIs. everyone likes the tray icon because it lets them hide the giant ugly UI
 * rickspencer3 goes for lunch
<dobey> if we had something like the osx dock, they would belong there, but we don't, we have the systray
<dobey> so everyone abuses that :)
<mac_v> kenvandine: well , no other way now , since the clicks have interchanged... [i was mentioning using right-click , but not all apps have the feature to minimize :/ ]
<tgpraveen122> dobey: apps like banshee/rb have tray icon because they are open for long periods of time when one is doing something else so it shouldnt take up space on the task bar (bottom panel) and still be accessible
<tgpraveen122> so having a tray icon for them makes sense. how do u suggest they get rid of this functionality
<dobey> tgpraveen122: so do you also have a tray icon for firefox?
<dobey> firefox stays open far longer than rb for me
<tgpraveen122> well if ff is open then i will mostly be using it
<dobey> (primarily because rb crashes after pulseaudio leaks a crapload of FDs)
<tgpraveen122> but rb i splaying songs in background
<dobey> tgpraveen122: i have 6 firefox windows open right this second
<tgpraveen122> and only when i want to change songs or something i need it else i want it to be out of my way doing its job
<mac_v> dobey: well ff , is open here too , but ff needs to be visible for it to actually be of use ;p ... while rb doesnt ;)
<kenvandine> dobey: on that tiny laptop?
<tgpraveen122> dobey: umm tabs
<dobey> kenvandine: well if i were using my tiny laptop, yes, but no
<dobey> kenvandine: i use my desktop pc at home :)
<tgpraveen122> should be used
<dobey> tgpraveen122: no, they shouldn't :)
<dobey> that's one thing i very much hate about chrom(e,ium)
<mac_v> yay i found one person who actually doesnt use firefox tabs \o/
<dobey> mac_v: i do use tabs
<dobey> mac_v: but i also use multiple windows
<tgpraveen122> mac_v: many IE users dont use it too
<mac_v> tgpraveen122: thats why i mentioned "firefox" ;p
<dobey> mac_v: the way chrom{e,ium} works, horribly interrupts my workflow
<tgpraveen122> i mean IE users who shift to ff ;p
<mac_v> dobey: how so?
<dobey> mac_v: well, i also use multiple desktops
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, quidgets are looking nice :)
<dobey> mac_v: and some windows have different sizes
<dyek_> Hi! I saw a lot of annoying gvim error messages below. Is it known what can be the workaround to remove such messages?
<dyek_> (gvim:29397): CRITICAL **: gtk_form_set_static_gravity: assertion `static_gravity_supported' failed
<dobey> mac_v: when i click on a link in my e-mail client in another desktop, i expect a new window on that desktop
<dobey> mac_v: but no, i have to go find it now
<dobey> also, chromium looks nothing like the rest of my gtk+ apps
<dobey> which saddens me
<mac_v> dobey: ah, ok.. well , i use devilspieand assign ff / chrome one desktop :)  chrome works nice without a top panel ;)
<dobey> chrome works nice for google
<mac_v> hehe , that too ;)
<dobey> it lets them build an OS out of their web empire
<dobey> but for people, it's not really all that great
<mac_v> "wempire" ;p
 * mac_v doesnt really understand all the fuss around chrome OS :)
 * tgpraveen122 says mac_v should wait to see chrome os netbook prices
<dobey> i don't think the price of chrome os can be expressed in dollars
<chrisccoulson> dyek - you need to report a bug at https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vim/+filebug
<chrisccoulson> preferably with a backtrace when you run gvim with G_DEBUG=fatal_criticals
<chrisccoulson> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingProgramCrash
<seb128> dobey, the firefox analogie just don't work there
<seb128> dobey, you can close firefox and restore the session
<seb128> it will not make any difference
<seb128> but if you do stop rhythmbox you get nothing playing either
<seb128> you do want to service to keep running
<seb128> even if you don't want to interact with it
<dobey> seb128: rbox isn't a service. it's an application. if you want a service, you're using mpd or slingbox or something already anyway :)
<dobey> seb128: the analogy fits, because you can minimize rbox and it will keep playing
<seb128> well I want something to play my music which is in the default installation
<seb128> it will be noise in your tasklist though
<dobey> i can minimize firefox, and google chat or whatever will be still running as well
<seb128> well you can close firefox and open it later again
<seb128> that avoid noise while you are not using it
<seb128> how do I tell rhythmbox to just play and get out of my way?
<dobey> seb128: then perhaps the solution is to change our multimedia framework in the default installation
<seb128> I don't want to have alt-tab listing it
<seb128> or fix rhythmbox
<dobey> you push the "play" button on your keyboard, and put it on a different workspace
<seb128> what is the fix you suggest?
<seb128> that's a workaround
<dobey> well, it sounds like what you want is a service, not a file manager. rbox is a fancy file manager.
<seb128> what is wrong with having an audio service running and not getting in the way?
<dobey> rbox is not a service
<mac_v> dobey: you suggest to use a new workspace instead of a tray icon ;)
<seb128> why not?
<dobey> trying to make it one with a tray icon is just a workaround
<seb128> code to play + a gui is a service + a client
<dobey> if you want a service, the gui needs to be a client of that service
<seb128> what is the difference?
<seb128> having no ui on screen is basically the same
<dobey> a tray icon isn't no ui on screen
<seb128> well you need a way to reopen it
<seb128> you could close without a try and tell users to reopen the UI using the menu entryu
<seb128> entry
<seb128> try -> tray
<dobey> yes
<dobey> and to do that the gui and the "service" should be separate
<seb128> why?
<seb128> just comment the current systray show call
<seb128> and you get that
<dobey> because it's the same as running the skype gui so you can see your skype contacts in pidgin
<seb128> what difference does it make to have your interface not displayed or not displayed?
<seb128> are you concerned about the ressource use of the ui while it's not on screen there?
<dyek> chrisccoulson: Found the bug report already: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vim/+bug/402188
<dyek> Thanks!
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 402188 in pida "gvim complains about "gtk_form_set_static_gravity: assertion `static_gravity_supported' failed" in the shell it's started from" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<dobey> seb128: if the ui isn't going to be displayed, why should it be wasting resources
<dobey> seb128: it's not my only concern no, but it's a valid one
<seb128> you trade a small extra use for less complexity
<dobey> seb128: i'm concerned we're creating crappy workarounds for crappy UIs, rather than making good UIs that don't need workarounds
<dobey> small extra use?
<seb128> the server,client things and the UI things are different topics really
<seb128> you could just hide the systray in the current design
<seb128> and tell user to run the application again to stop what they are playing
<seb128> if your concern is the systray use
<mdeslaur> asac: bug #496206
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 496206 in modemmanager "Analog USB modem isn't closed when probing fails" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/496206
<mdeslaur> asac: I assigned it to you
<seb128> any it's friday evening, got to go
<seb128> see you later
<ccheney> boot times are getting impressive :) < 19s now :)
<dobey> would help if rbox/pulse would stop leaking file descriptors already :(
<seb128> (oh and quick note I'm on holidays starting today until end of the year now)
<seb128> bye everybody!
<chrisccoulson> lol @ the last comment on bug 3935
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 3935 in glib2.0 "Gettext support for gkeyfile when accessing .desktop files" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/3935
<mac_v> huh! o.0
<mhujairi> anyone there ??
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-12-20
<baptistemm> hello
<baptistemm> is there a know bug which could prevent me to boot. I don't have gdm started (not starting sound neither) and display stays black
<baptistemm> with lucid
<RAOF> baptistemm: Could be intel and vga16fb fighting over framebuffers
<baptistemm> I do have an intel chip yes
<baptistemm> RAOF, do you have a bug number and/or a fix
<RAOF> baptistemm: Sorry, I don't have a bug number, and it seems to have been fixed for me; alternatively, you can just delete /lib/modules/2.6..../kernel/.../vga16fb.ko & run update-initramfs.
<RAOF> Or just blacklist.
<chrisccoulson> awalton - there? i think i remember you saying some time ago that you were doing some work on libnotify so that it caches server capabilities. did i remember correctly, or have i got the wrong person?
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-12-20
<Zdra> hello, is it possible to fallback to normal desktop on natty?
<Zdra> ah, starting metacity, gnome-panel and kill unity seems to work
<Zdra> is there a setting to do that?
<fta> Zdra, you have a small menu at the center of the bottom panel in gdm; select Classic
<fta> there's also a pref (System / Admin / Login Screen)
<Zdra> fta, cool let me test that :)
<Zdra> hm, on natty there is a tab missing in the appearance dialog, how can I tell to not use compiz but use metacity instead?
<TeTeT> hi, anyone has a pointer for me why my natty desktop does not work after login any longer? I get asked for my keyring passphrase and then it's waiting forever. X is fine so far, I can start a separate X server and it works
<geser> TeTeT: Classic Desktop or Unity one?
<TeTeT> geser: Unity
<xclaesse> is it known that nm-applet is segfaulting at startup in natty?
<cyphermox> xclaesse, depends. I don't see it segfault here. are you fully up to date?
<cyphermox> xclaesse, don't hesitate to open a bug, if you have the number I'll take a look
<xclaesse> cyphermox, I installed yesterday from daily
<xclaesse> and I'm up to date now, yes
<xclaesse> #0  0x000000000042dd4e in ?? ()
<xclaesse> #1  0x000000000041bc83 in status_icon_activate_cb ()
<cyphermox> heh.
<xclaesse> how, I see that coming, ubuntu badly patched it for indicator that I'm not using
<cyphermox> xclaesse, can you report a bug? it should mostly do it by itself when apport gets triggers when nm-applet crashes?
<xclaesse> hm, no, even with indicator applet, still crash
<xclaesse> cyphermox, apport does not start it seems
<cyphermox> xclaesse, check if you have files in /var/crash
<xclaesse> that dir does not even exist :/
<cyphermox> it systematically crashes every time you start it?
<cyphermox> or maybe send me the core file if it crashes when started from the command line and you get one?
<xclaesse> cyphermox, ok got one
<cyphermox> great
<cyphermox> can you send this to me by email? how big is it?
<xclaesse> cyphermox, http://people.collabora.co.uk/~xclaesse/core
<xclaesse> could someone upload libfolks 0.3.3 to natty? it is in debian exp :)
<sense> I was wondering: 'metacity --replace' replaces Compiz (if that is the active wm), and 'compiz --replace' replaces Metacity if that is the active wm). But what about 'gnome-panel --replace', now Compiz-plugin Unity provides a panel? (And vice-versa.) Shouldn't the --replace things do something there, or do they already do something?
<cyphermox> xclaesse, still there?
<nessita> mvo: ping
<mvo> hey nessita
<nessita> mvo: hi there! can I ask you an aptdaemon question?
<mvo> nessita: sure
<nessita> mvo: how can I "programatically" check if a package is installed?
<nessita> I've seen from the doc that I can install a package using aptdaemon.client.AptClient().install_packages, but even if the package is installed I get the gksudo gtk screen, and I need to raise that window only if a package is not installed
<mvo> nessita: the best way to do this is "cache=apt.Cache(); if pkg in cache and cache[pkg].is_installed: do_something()"
<mvo> nessita: the aptdaemon is (unlikey e.g. packagekit) only concerned with stuff that needs superuser
<nessita> mvo: awesome, thanks!
<mvo> nessita: just querying state (or even simulating install/removal etc) can all done in the cache
<nessita> mvo: what do you mean with simulating install/removal?
<mvo> nessita: pydoc apt ; pydoc apt.Cache" should have some useful info, if you need anything specific, I will be happy to help
<mvo> nessita: just call cache[pkg].mark_install()
<mvo> nessita: and then cache.get_changes()
<nessita> ah, I understand
<mvo> nessita: that will give you a list of apt.Package objects that changed, you can then query the state with "pkg.marked_install", pkg.marked_delete
<mvo> marked_upgrade
<mvo> etc
<nessita> right, and in that case call aptdaemon?
<mvo> yes, if "is_installed" is all you need to know then that is enough, no need to run mark_install()
<mvo> if you are interessted in the changes that it would trigger, then the later is the better option
<hallyn> is xscreensaver expected to lock up in unity right now?
<Amaranth> expected? no, probably not
<Amaranth> I doubt anyone has even tried it
<nessita> mvo: hey, are you available for another aptdaemon question?
<xclaesse> cyphermox, pong
<mvo> nessita: aptdaemon questions, please ask! sorry for the delay, I was in a conf call
<nessita> mvo: hey! I was having lunch, I hope you're still around. Not sure what step I'm missing since I'm getting: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/545995/
<nessita> mvo: in that paste, client is a aptdaemon.client.AptClient()
<devildante> nessita: it sounds like the aptdaemon dbus service file is not present on your system
<nessita> devildante: yeah, which is very odd
<devildante> nessita: did you check if it's present?
<nessita> devildante: using d-feet I've got no services running on :1.112
<nessita> only :1.11 and :1.114
<devildante> nessita: isn't the whole point of dbus to start services only when it's needed?
<nessita> yes, as far as I know
<mvo> nessita: hm, odd, I just tested this http://paste.ubuntu.com/546023/ on maverick and natty and its fine for me
<nessita> mvo: I'll re test
<nessita> mvo: it worked now...
<nessita> no idea what happened before. Thanks!
<nessita> devildante: thanks to you too
<devildante> nessita: np ;)
<devildante> mvo: hello btw :)
<mvo> hey devildante
<mvo> nessita: hm, maybe it crashed? anyhting in /var/crash ?
 * nessita looks
<nessita> /var/crash is empty
 * mvo scratches head
<nessita> mvo: when  I tested this I didn't run any mainloop
<nessita> maybe that was the cause?
<mvo> nessita: indeed, that sounds plausible
<mvo> nessita: sorry for not mentioning this, there are gtk widget available btw if you need to show progress etc
<nessita> mvo: yes, I've seen it in the rythmobox u1 plugin :-)
<nessita> thanks!
<mvo> cheers!
<Shred00> if i have a bzr checkout of http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/evolution/ubuntu/ i assume i won't see any changes that were made for a maverick-proposed evolution until it's accepted into maverick-updates, is that correct?
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-12-21
<robert_ancell> Riddell, ping
<robert_ancell> (or any other Kubuntu dev)
<rodrigo_> morning
<rodrigo_> hmm, ssh-agent is broken for me, I guess I need an update
<xclaesse> Hm, natty never remove the message "To run a command as administrator (user "root"), use "sudo <command>"."
<rodrigo_> brb
<rodrigo_> anyone knows what's wrong with ssh-agent? It never asks me for a password when using bzr, git, rsync, etc
<rodrigo_> ugh, system quite broken after last upgrade :(
<rodrigo_> hey pedro_
<pedro_> hello rodrigo_
<rodrigo_> pedro_, not taking holidays?
<pedro_> rodrigo_, i'm taking some starting the next friday (24) until next year
<pedro_> rodrigo_, you're on holidays right?
<rodrigo_> pedro_, ah, cool :-)
<rodrigo_> pedro_, was last week, back to work this week
<rodrigo_> and off next week again :)
<pedro_> cool!
<rodrigo_> pedro_, are you using latest natty updates?
<pedro_> rodrigo_, haven't updated my machine today yet, anything broken?
<rodrigo_> pedro_, lots, that's why I ask, wanted to know if you had the same problems
<rodrigo_> ssh-agent is the worst one
<pedro_> ok let me update to check
<rodrigo_> have to mow to a vt to use bzr, git, rsync, etc
<rodrigo_> move, not mow
<rodrigo_> ugh, and now umount for a drive I mounted by hand is taking ages
<pedro_> rodrigo_, just updated and everything works fine here
<rodrigo_> hmm
<rodrigo_> I guess it's something with the GNOME3 PPA then
<cyphermox> good morning!
<rodrigo_> hi cyphermox
<cyphermox> hey rodrigo_!
<xclaesse> cyphermox, hello... any progress with nm-applet crash?
<udienz> Hello Ubuntu-Desktop Team
<udienz> i need your help for my merge proposal
<udienz> https://code.launchpad.net/~udienz/ubuntu/maverick/light-themes/light-themes.fix549365/+merge/42840
<udienz> dholbach recommended me to ask at here
<udienz> bug 549365
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 549365 in light-themes (Ubuntu) "Terminals have a translucent background (affects: 3) (heat: 29)" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/549365
<udienz> thanks before
<charlie-tca> bryceh: Is bugbot your script?
<cyphermox> xclaesse, yep, I'll upload the update in a minute
<cyphermox> xclaesse, it's uploaded now. just give it time to build, and it should be fixed (here it works, no more crash with my 3g dongle)
<momelod> greetings channel.  I've broken my power management on my latop after upgrade to 10.10.  basically i cannot run gnome-power-manager.  When i do, i get this error: http://pastebin.com/hYRuMB7Q
<momelod> i can no longer sleep or hibernate (unless i manually run `/etc/acpi/sleep.sh`)
<momelod> but the option to sleep, hibernate are missing from my logout menu
<momelod> and, there is no battery monitoring happening either, so my laptop will drain the battery completely unless im there to power off beforehand.
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, ping
<cyphermox> momelod, you should ask about this in #ubuntu, this is a channel for Ubuntu development. you may want to reinstall upower to fix this, but I'm just taking a wild guess there ;)
<momelod> thanks.. tried re-installing upower..
<momelod> no luck
<momelod> but thanks
<mvo> tremolux: hey, I merged the inline-purchase branch, nice work :) if you could update trunk so that the experimental-faststart one merges, that would be nice
<tremolux> thanks mvo!  will do
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: pong
<mvo> thanks tremolux
<joaopinto> which package should I use to file a bug for the global menu ?
<rodrigo_> joaopinto, libdbusmenu-gtk
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, I don't remember what I wanted to tell you :-)
<joaopinto> rodrigo_, I was told to use appmenu-gtk
<rodrigo_> ah, that might be it
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: if it was about couchdb-glib it's still on my list - I was just busy with more urgent stuff like work :). I'm planning on getting back to it after christmas.
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, no hurries, don't worry
<dobey> kenvandine: can you sponsor https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/natty/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store/use-defer/+merge/44358 ? :)
<kenvandine> sure
 * pitti waves
<dobey> thakns
<dobey> hey pitti
<pitti> hey dobey, how are you?
<dobey> alright. yourself?
<pitti> pretty well, thanks! enjoying my holidays
<kenvandine> hey pitti
<dobey> nice
<kenvandine> dobey, you should have changed the dist to natty while touching the aptdaemon stuff in the music store
<kenvandine> dist="maverick"
<kenvandine> and
<kenvandine> PARTNER_LIST = "canonical-partner-maverick.list"
<dobey> hrmm
<kenvandine> makes me wonder how banshee handles installing the codec
<dobey> i don't think it does yet
<kenvandine> i am pretty sure there is some mechanism, but i bet it isn't via the partner repo
<dobey> i didn't realize it hardcoded that
<kenvandine> dobey, kind of fragile huh ? :)
<kenvandine> i bet there is a better way
<kenvandine> lsb_release or something
<dobey> yes
<kenvandine> would be better to grab that from /etc/lsb-release then
<dobey> preacher.preach(choir)
<dobey> would be better to abstract that more
<dobey> so that the right thing can be done on !ubuntu
<kenvandine> want to fix that before i sponsor this?
<kenvandine> or should i do a quick s/maverick/natty/ and sponsor?
<kenvandine> dobey, ^^
<dobey> kenvandine: i'll file a bug; do a quick s/maverick/natty/ for now
<kenvandine> will do
<kenvandine> thx
<dobey> i'm surprised nobody has complained about this yet. we build nightlies on lucid, maverick, and natty
<kenvandine> weird
<kenvandine> dobey, nobody complained because it only matters on new installs
 * gnomefreak cant find menus at all 
<kenvandine> jasoncwarner, meeting?
<jasoncwarner> kenvandine:
 * kenvandine wonders if it will be just you and i :)
<jasoncwarner> :)
<pitti> hey jasoncwarner
<kenvandine> and pitti
<kenvandine> :)
<pitti> I'm at home, so I can as well join :)
<jasoncwarner> pitti: morning :)
<jasoncwarner> Alright...https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-12-21/
<tremolux> hiya  everyone  \o
<jasoncwarner> rodrigo_: Riddell: cyphermox: tremolux: mterry: meeting time...
<rodrigo_> hey kenvandine
<kenvandine> hey rodrigo_
<jasoncwarner> Anyone else around?
<Riddell> hi
<jasoncwarner> First things, please be sure to update the above link with any interesting items for the week.
<jasoncwarner> I don't think we had any actions from last week so we can dive right in to
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] Unity
<kenvandine> no didrocks :)
<jasoncwarner> without seb or didrocks, not sure what kind of update we can give. Anyone?
<rodrigo_> :)
<kenvandine> nope...
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] Software Center
<mterry> hi
<tremolux> summary is posted on the meeting wiki
<tremolux> :)
<tremolux> (unless you want me to paste here -- but I think we stopped doing that)
<jasoncwarner> tremolux: works for me
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] Kubuntu
<Riddell>  * KDE built on ARM and PowerPC in natty
<Riddell>  * KDE SC 4.4.5 in lucid-proposed for testing
<Riddell>  * KDevelop Beta in
<Riddell>  * 4.6 release candidate due today to packagers
<Riddell>  * Akonadi beta packaged
<jasoncwarner> Thanks, Riddell. Anything you wanted to add?
<Riddell> nope
<jasoncwarner> if not, I didn't see it on the template but
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] Partner update?
<kenvandine> nothing... nobody was around for the meeting
<jasoncwarner> :)
<jasoncwarner> one of those weeks....
<jasoncwarner> X.org is later today
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] Tools and Processes
<jasoncwarner> Anyone have anything for tools and processes updates?
<jasoncwarner> :)
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] AOB?
<jasoncwarner> shortest.meeting.evar!
<kenvandine> yeah :)
<pitti> :)
<jasoncwarner> [END MEETING]
<jasoncwarner> Well then!
<rodrigo_> :)
<jasoncwarner> don't forget to update the weekly summary
<jasoncwarner> that is it! Thanks everyone.
<tremolux> woo!  thanks everybody
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> happy holidays to everyone
<mterry> :)
<cyphermox> happy holidays ;)
<pitti> happy holidays and merry christmas everyone!
<cyphermox> kenvandine, know anything about the unity cmake process?
<cyphermox> I just found out there is an issue... here I get some weird behavior just for compiz files in bzr bd; it tries to install /
<cyphermox> d'oh
<cyphermox> tries to install /home/mtrudel/Projects/build-area/unity.../debian/tmp/home/mtrudel/Projects/build-area ... ;)
<Amaranth> It did that to seb128 too
<cyphermox> hrm.
<Amaranth> it doesn't do it on the actual buildds though
<Amaranth> he hacked around it for a local build, we couldn't figure it out
<cyphermox> it's most likely something specific to building with bzr bd
<cyphermox> heh, pbuilder it is then
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> cyphermox, no... sorry :)
<cyphermox> ;)
<cyphermox> thanks :)
 * pitti goes back to holiday mode; see you everyone!
<dobey> kenvandine: well, it only matters when the music store is first used. that may not be the same time as install
<kenvandine> yeah
<ari-tczew> could someone tell me why I should merge on lp:~ubuntu-desktop/farsight/ubuntu instead on default bzr branch for natty?
<ari-tczew> according to Robert's comment on https://code.launchpad.net/~ari-tczew/ubuntu/natty/farsight2/lp-690736/+merge/43800
<micahg> ari-tczew: well, it's where the VCS headers point, but it's out of date :-/
<ari-tczew> micahg: Agreed. This branch seems to be another than Ubuntu source.
<micahg> ari-tczew: Robert might be on in about 3-4 hours if he's not on vacation yet
<ari-tczew> micahg: Do you think that leave a MemoMsg is a good option?
<ari-tczew> I'm not sure whether 3-4 hours I'll be in bed.
<micahg> ari-tczew: if you won't be on then, sure
<bryceh> charlie-tca, yes
<charlie-tca> great! It doesn't change the status when it leaves a comment that the bug is being close
<bryceh> charlie-tca, hrm
<charlie-tca> bryceh: I like what bugbot does, but I think it should change status to invalid when it says the bugs are closed
<bryceh> charlie-tca, I noticed that but thought I fixed it.  Was this a recent change (within the last week?)
<charlie-tca> 17th
<bryceh> charlie-tca, yeah it's actually supposed to set to Expired
<charlie-tca> The bug I caught today was commented 12-17, so maybe it is fixed, then. I will keep my eye open for later than that changes
<charlie-tca> do you want the status changed on the bugs I come across?
<bryceh> yeah it runs once a week
<bryceh> I'll disable it until I get a chance to figure out why it's busted
<charlie-tca> Thanks
<bryceh> charlie-tca, yeah if you could update those statuses, that'd be a huge help
<charlie-tca> I can do that. Just wanted to make sure I was doing something right.
<charlie-tca> bryceh: latest one I came across was bug 659405
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 659405 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Xorg crashes on suspend (affects: 1) (heat: 10)" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/659405
<ari-tczew> micahg: even so, I can't merge it with ubuntu-desktop branch. reason: This branch is not mergeable into lp:~ubuntu-desktop/farsight/ubuntu.
<kamusin> just for curiosity, will be gnome-system-tools included in ubuntu natty?
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: you can't merge it into ~ubuntu-desktop branch as those track only packaging.
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: heh, Robert could inform me instead requiring merge.
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: you should branch lp:~ubuntu-desktop/farsight/ubuntu locally, add your changes, and then push and request a merge.
<kamusin> there isn't a 'user' way to sync date/time with a ntp server under natty or I am too blind ...
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: I'll try, but I remmeber that 6 days ago I couldn't do anything on this branch. Dunno why. Odd data.
<mterry> kamusin, go to your clock and click on Time & Date Settings
<mterry> kamusin, but that's a better question for #ubuntu which is the support channel
<dobey> what is it that keeps screwing up my compiz settings every time i upgrade compiz?
<ari-tczew> bzr: ERROR: Invalid url supplied to transport: "lp:~ari-tczew/ubuntu-desktop/farsight/ubuntu/lp-690736": No such project: ubuntu-desktop
<ari-tczew> how can I create a branch related to lp:~ubuntu-desktop/farsight/ubuntu ?
<ari-tczew> hmmm, I tried another way
<ari-tczew> bzr: ERROR: Permission denied: "~ari-tczew/farsight/ubuntu/lp-690736/": : Cannot create branch at '/~ari-tczew/farsight/ubuntu/lp-690736
<ari-tczew> could anyone help me?
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: maybe you? ^^
<kenvandine> mterry, ping
<mterry> kenvandine, hi
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: have you tried lp:~ari-tczew/ubuntu/farsight/lp-690736/ ?
<kenvandine> mterry, do you have a general idea of the status of the gir transistion?
<mterry> kenvandine, mostly done
<mterry> :)
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: or lp:~ari-tczew/farsight/lp-690736
<kenvandine> mterry, doko wants someone to email ubuntu-devel with a status and a brief note on what people should do if they run into a package that hasn't been fixed
<cyphermox> ari-tczew, non-related, could you please take another look at my cnetworkmanager merge request?
<kenvandine> mterry, think you can do that?
<mterry> kenvandine, yeah, sure
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> i've been fixing what i see
<dobey> ari-tczew: lp:~owner/distro/series/sourcepackage/branchname
<ari-tczew> dobey: you're wrong. We've discuss about this above. It's branch unrelated to Ubuntu. Just ubuntu-desktop stuff.
<dobey> ari-tczew: ubuntu-desktop is just a team. the branches are just the packaging branches where changes are staged for going into ubuntu itself.
<ari-tczew> dobey: Robert Ancell asked me to merge into ubuntu-desktop/farsight instead Ubuntu packaging.
<ari-tczew> cyphermox: I can.
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: thanks! your advice was helpful.
<cyphermox> thx
<geser> mterry: re gir ABI chnage: did the directory for .gir files also change?
<kklimonda> geser: no :)
<mterry> geser, no
<mterry> whoops, too slow  :)
<geser> so gir1.2-* packages install in /usr/share/gir-1.0/?
<mterry> geser, yup, it's a bit of a mess
<mterry> geser, the file itself says what abi it is
<kklimonda> geser: yes - that's how upstream have decided to do that.
<mterry> as a field in the xml
<jasoncwarner> bryceh:  and robert_ancell:, you guys ready for meeting? :) should be really quick
<jasoncwarner> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-12-21
<RAOF> Howdie hi :)
<jasoncwarner> RAOF: hey!
<robert_ancell> yup
<robert_ancell> quick western meeting..
 * bryce_ waves
<bryce_> I think RAOF's out this week
<RAOF> Am I?
<bryce_> RAOF, or not
<bryce_> RAOF, thought you took the rest of the year off?
<RAOF> I got a bit confused by canonicaladmin; it's possible that I'm on holiday for the last 3 days.
<RAOF> bryce_: No, just the start of last week.
<jasoncwarner> RAOF: I think so ;)
<jasoncwarner> I think you are ;)
<jasoncwarner> ok...getting going...
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] X.org update
<RAOF> A bunch of patches have finally landed upstream!  Yay!
<RAOF> A bunch of our patches, though, so it's not very interesting for the non-X people :)
<bryce_> I did some updates to the X apport scripts.  Also not very interesting for the non-X people.  But will cut down on stray error messages in bug reports and generally clean stuff up.
<bryce_> also, I'm chatting with the compiz folks about possibly merging the X and compiz apport scripts
<bryce_> the scripts are already 90% the same stuff anyway, and we are always bouncing bugs back and forth between compiz / mesa / etc. so it makes sense
<bryce_> my thinking is that this may make diagnosing unity X-ish bugs a tad easier
<jasoncwarner> ok....
<jasoncwarner> Anything else for X.org?
<jasoncwarner> nothing else?
<RAOF> Oh.  Kubuntu users who find that X crashes when logging out have some testing packages.
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] aOB?
<bryce_> canonicaladmin is *painfully* slow
<bryce_> everyone must be checking their xmas holidays at the same time ;-)
<jasoncwarner> bryce_ agreed
<bryce_> we could probably code a replacement in the time it takes to wait for it to refresh ;-)
<bryce_> nothing else from me; been a really short week for me due to sick + vacation time
<RAOF> Nothing else here, either.
<jasoncwarner> well then
<jasoncwarner> I htink
<jasoncwarner> [END MEETING]
<jasoncwarner> !
<jasoncwarner> :)
<bryce_> thanks
<jasoncwarner> next meeting is in january !
<jasoncwarner> enjoy holidays!!!!
<RAOF> While I'm here with a small captive audience, how useful would other people find a Do plugin that indexes your gnome-keyring and lets you copy passwords to the clipboard?
<cyphermox> RAOF, ah, cool idea
<RAOF> Well, there's one other person who'd like it.  I guess I'll release it with the rest of do-plugins then :)
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: around?
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, yup
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: I proposed new merge to ~ubuntu-desktop/farsight/ubuntu
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, thanks for that
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: when do you going for holiday?
<robert_ancell> 24th
<robert_ancell> back on the 3rd
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: I hope that I'll prepare some merges to sponsor by you tomorrow.
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, awesome.  btw, if you subscribe ubuntu-desktop to do the merges they show up on http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html (I'll probably end up doing them anyway)
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-12-22
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: I'm not sure. Last time I've discussed with seb128 about sponsoring me by you.
<ari-tczew> We've explained that if you're subscribed or setted as reviewer, then know that you're sponsor.
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: I prepared a merge also for webkit, but there is FTBFS.
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, yeah, I asw that.  It needs to be patched to run the latest GTK - there's probably a patch in the upstream git
<ari-tczew> ok
<robert_ancell> mclasen, hey, I'm also doing a patch for the gtkprint tests (they're trying to access old private values) - are you ok if I commit it without a bug report?
<mclasen> oh yeah, sure
<robert_ancell> ta
<robert_ancell> mclasen, btw, loving all the API cleaning in the new GTK...
<robert_ancell> all the things that tripped me up when learning are melting away
<mclasen> yeah, cleaning out a decade of cruft
<rodrigo_> morning
<davmor2> Hey guys I've noticed something odd with natty, after the screen has blanked I'm not getting password for access,  I'm also not able to click on anything on the desktop either.  I'm assuming that this is an issue with the screensaver would that be correct?
<nessita> hello everybody! is anyone available to sponsor a natty package?
<nessita> merge proposal is: https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu/natty/ubuntuone-control-panel/ubuntu-control-panel-0.1.0/+merge/44464
<kenvandine> nessita, i will be in a bit, finishing something else and then i need to run an errand
<kenvandine> if you ping me in a couple hours to remind me i can do it :)
<nessita> kenvandine: sure I can, and I will. Thanks!
<kenvandine> np
<cyphermox> howdy
<kenvandine> hey cyphermox
<cyphermox> hey kenvandine
<cyphermox> I found a workaround to locally build unity yesterday
<kenvandine> :)
<cyphermox> except my fix for multimonitor stuff didn't quite work :P
<cyphermox> I'm not sure if that will be fine for the buildds, but I'll try it on a ppa later
 * kenvandine runs out for a couple errands, bbiab
<Amaranth> cyphermox: what was the workaround? editing the .install file?
<cyphermox> Amaranth, nope, define COMPIZ_PREFIX in the dh_auto_configure target to ".." works here
<cyphermox> which is also why I'm not convinced it will work on the buildds
<Amaranth> weird
<Amaranth> yeah, I don't think so
<cyphermox> somehow I tend to agree ;)
<cyphermox> at least it means for now I can build the package and test my patches locally
<cyphermox> Amaranth, however that still means there is something to tweak in the cmake files to make it work properly
<Amaranth> cyphermox: I guess we could add that on to the giant list smspillaz is collapsing under :)
<cyphermox> Amaranth, nah, I intend to send merge requests ;)
<Amaranth> cyphermox: careful, if you fix the build system I'm going to poke you for all build system issues :)
<cyphermox> hahaha
<cyphermox> nothing's fixed yet ;)
 * cyphermox notes to not let Amaranth know about fixes done in the future...
<cyphermox> bbiab
<jhon_> Hello, in Lucid the frequency monitors always at start are in 'performance' when usually was in 'ondemand'  anyone know how can I fix this ?
<nessita> kenvandine: hey there! friendly reminder for https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu/natty/ubuntuone-control-panel/ubuntuone-control-panel-0.1.0/+merge/44468
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, ping
<rodrigo_> hey nessita
<nessita> hey rodrigo_, how are you?
<rodrigo_> nessita, still recovering from vacation, but otherwise fine, and you?
<nessita> rodrigo_: pretty good, looking forward for vacations :-)
<rodrigo_> nessita, are you off next week?
<nessita> yes!
<rodrigo_> cool
<xclaesse> yay, nm-applet is working again in natty \o/
<xclaesse> cyphermox, <xclaesse> yay, nm-applet is working again in natty \o/
<cyphermox> sweet, thanks for the feedback
<nessita> mterry: thanks for the sponsoring of u1-control-panel package!
<mterry> nessita, yw!  :)  looking pretty nice these days
<nessita> thanks
<kenvandine> nessita, still need sponsoring?
<kenvandine> nessita, guess not :)
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, pong
<nessita> kenvandine: no, thanks, m-terry did it :-)
<kenvandine> cyphermox, did a google search last night to see if i could program a logitech harmony remote using ubuntu... first hit was an old blog post from you :)
<kenvandine> cyphermox, that stuff still work ok on natty?
<cyphermox> kenvandine, afaik, yes. and I still maintain it in Debian :)
<cyphermox> I have two remotes I actively use at home, and planning on a third one to have access to every once in a while ;)
<cyphermox> kenvandine, which model do you have?
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> 600
<cyphermox> kenvandine, I think that works
<kenvandine> got it for my wife for xmas, which probably sounds weird
<cyphermox> no, in fact not really :)
<kenvandine> but she complains nearly daily about having to use 3 remotes :)
<cyphermox> exactly :D
<kenvandine> which actually doesn't bother me at all... :)
<kenvandine> after 10 years of complaining, i am fixing it :-p
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: oh! do you just package the harmony stuff, or are you an upstream?
<cyphermox> mdeslaur, I package it and do some contribution upstream... not huge amounts though
<kenvandine> cyphermox, it is pretty simple isn't it?
<kenvandine> web configure, suck down some file and copy it to the usb device?
<cyphermox> right
<kenvandine> *simple*
<cyphermox> it uses the web interface to get the data to flash to the remote
<kenvandine> nice that the logic is all on the web
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: I _was_ going to send you a harmony 1000 to reverse-engineer, but now... :)
<cyphermox> mdeslaur, I'd be happy to look into it
<cyphermox> I think the 1000 is already in progress too
<kenvandine> cyphermox, does the hardware change much?
<kenvandine> would be nice to have a stable interface to the device... but the hardware vendors don't usually agree for some reason
<cyphermox> not really, but I know more recent remotes are being painful.. they use a new website in silverlight
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: I don,t actually have one
<cyphermox> I know my 300 doesn't work at all yet.
<cyphermox> (working on it)
<cyphermox> well, if we had a database of codes for devices, and a better understanding of how they are written to the remote (or changing the firmware completely to something free) we could do lots
<cyphermox> afaik, the firmware *is* replaceable, since you can flash updates to it ;)
<kenvandine> yeah, but who wants to maintain firmware
<mdeslaur> in _silverlight_? ugh
<cyphermox> kenvandine, I meant something like rockbox, basically, but for the harmony ;)
<cyphermox> mdeslaur, yeah, exactly how I felt.. plus it really looks for IE.
<xclaesse> is it known that ssh agent doesn't work in natty?
<xclaesse> could be because I'm using gnome-keyring 3
<dobey> rodrigo_: ping. bug #559082 is fixed by now i hope?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 559082 in rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store "Missing 64 bits of fluendo partner plugin (affects: 1)" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/559082
 * xclaesse is sick of that kworkerd process freezing his UI
<xclaesse> maverick and natty are unusable when that happens
<dobey> kenvandine: filed #693536 btw if you care :)
<dobey> xclaesse: what, you don't like having all your processes go into diskwait? :)
<kenvandine> dobey, thx
<xclaesse> I don't understand such a blocker bug didn't get fix since kernel 2.6.35
<kenvandine> bug 693536
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 693536 in rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store "Distribution series hardcoded for installing Fluendo plug-in (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/693536
<dobey> oh right, i forgot ubot requires the "bug" prefix
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: hello! I'm merging sane-backends
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, hi, cool
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: which branch do I have to touch? ubuntu or rather ubuntu-desktop team?
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, check the Vcs-Bzr link in debian/control.  In general it's the ubuntu-desktop one
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: OK, I'll do it. so don't I need to create a bzr merge for ubuntu branch?
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, you would if that's where we were doing the packaging
<robert_ancell> The Ubuntu branch is the "new" way of doing things, but most packages are still maintained in ~ubuntu-desktop branches
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: I've done ~90%. I'm fighting with this package 4hours!
<robert_ancell> heh, I know that feeling!
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: the wall is different between md5sums of tarballs
<robert_ancell> the wall?
<ari-tczew> so generic diffs is specific and have to avoid creating patches debian-changes (quilt 3)
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: the wall as obstacle
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: do you use MoM when you are merging?
<robert_ancell> no
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-12-23
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: are you able to sponsor curl? I'll do it now.
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, sure
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: you shouldn't drop d/changelog changes
<ari-tczew> while merging
<robert_ancell> why not?  They just add clutter
<ari-tczew> this is a history of delta and explanation why it has been added
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: sane-backends merge is ready to review. bug 693578
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 693578 in sane-backends (Ubuntu) "Merge sane-backends 1.0.21-9 (main) from Debian unstable (main) (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/693578
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, when you do a merge, the last changelog entry should contain all the information on what is different compared to the debian version.  The patch headers contain the bug links/details
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: sorry gregory, I just tell you about advices which give me bdrung - core-dev also
<micahg> robert_ancell: right, but the actual changelog entries showing when it originally happened can be helpful as well
<robert_ancell> micahg, yeah, but I think that's a sympton of bad patch headers - if everything is done correctly then it should be clear.  Not you can always get the old history from bzr
<micahg> robert_ancell: might not be a patch if Debian doesn't have a patch system
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: even if you're talking well, we have a policy and we should respect it - keeping changes in d/changelog
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, where is the policy?
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, ta
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, sure, but that's not may packages at the moment
<bcurtiswx> robert_ancell, is there a newer version of webkit we can get for natty or the GNOME3 PPA ?
<bcurtiswx> robert_ancell, because i'm building empathy from source just to see if it works.. and i get http://paste.ubuntu.com/546777/
<robert_ancell> bcurtiswx, yeah, the GNOME3 PPA needs updating.  I was doing it but it takes so damn long to compile (>1hr) and it overheats my laptop and it shuts down half way :(
<bcurtiswx> which is a webkit  problem, but empathy
<bcurtiswx> webkit takes THAT long??
<bcurtiswx> wow
<bcurtiswx> well, is there a branch I can build from.. i'll see if i end up with the same fate
<ari-tczew> would be nice if you won't forget about my merge request during fix gnome 3.0
<ari-tczew> (for webkit)
<micahg> robert_ancell: if no one gets to the webkit merge/FTBFS for natty, I'll try to look at it before the end of the year
<robert_ancell> micahg, cool, thanks
<ari-tczew> micahg: are you going to spend end of the year on fix FTBFS webkit?
<micahg> ari-tczew: I can add it to my growing list of things that I'm trying to fix before the end of the year
<bcurtiswx> robert_ancell, is there a branch I can use for webkit i will try my laptop, see if i end up with the same fate
<robert_ancell> bcurtiswx, lp:~ubuntu-desktop/webkit/ubuntugtk3
<bcurtiswx> robert_ancell, thx
<robert_ancell> When it works, push it to lp:~gnome3-team/webkit/ubuntu
<bcurtiswx> robert_ancell, optimistic, i like it :)
<robert_ancell> :)
<micahg> robert_ancell: can I request access for gnome3 packaging (for gnome-shell)?
<robert_ancell> micahg, sure, I thought I'd added you
<micahg> robert_ancell: thanks!
<robert_ancell> done
<robert_ancell> Does anyone know Dean Loros (autocrosser)
<robert_ancell> ?
<ari-tczew> nope
<micahg> robert_ancell: and it's just debian dir branches, right?
<robert_ancell> micahg, yes
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: I guess that we can forward only d/watch file to Debian. The rest is ubuntu-specific change, right?
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, for what?
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: sane-backends merge
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, yes, I think so
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: how about you for merging non-gnome-related stuff for main?
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, sure as long as it's desktop related
<robert_ancell> what are you thinking of?
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: some merges available in main, probably non-desktop related, unfortunately
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, are they maintained in ~ubuntu-desktop brz?
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: nope
<bcurtiswx> still building
<bcurtiswx> robert_ancell, http://paste.ubuntu.com/546791/
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: curl merge is ready to review. bug 693635
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 693635 in curl (Ubuntu) "Merge curl 7.21.2-4 (main) from Debian unstable (main) (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/693635
<vish> robert_ancell: hi, could you upload your patch on Bug #411559  ? seems we missed it for maverick too.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 411559 in policykit-gnome (Ubuntu) (and 4 other projects) "Unfriendly message upon typing incorrect password (Policykit-GNOME/GDM/gnome-screensaver) (affects: 8) (dups: 2) (heat: 56)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/411559
<robert_ancell> vish, you're psychic - I just started doing it now!
<vish> :)
<vish> robert_ancell: awesome! thanks.. :)
<robert_ancell> vish, it's a pain, I really wanted upstream to take it but they don't seem interested
<vish> yea..
<apw> yo ... i have a machine which i updated this morning (natty) and gdm greeter is now cycling without prompting
<apw> constantly erroring about assertion `window == NULL || GDK_IS_WINDOW (window)` failed
<apw> anyone seen anything like t
<apw> that, any ideas as to diagnosis
<ricotz> rodrigo_, hi
<ricotz> rodrigo_, the current gtk+3.0 2.91.7 tarball is broken and will break many builds like g-s-d
<rodrigo_> oh?
<ricotz> it misses *.pc after some transition, it is fixed upstream
<rodrigo_> ok, and there's a new upstream release, right?
<ricotz> i mean some *.pc files
<ricotz> no there isnt
<rodrigo_> ah, right
<ricotz> i have packed  a git snapshot in ppa:ricotz/staging
<ricotz> which works
<ricotz> rodrigo_, but there seems to be more trouble with the latest 2.23.3 release
<rodrigo_> gtk2 2.23.3?
<ricotz> yes
<rodrigo_> hmm
<rodrigo_> ricotz, can you propose your gtk3 fix for merging?
<rodrigo_> into the natty package
<ricotz> rodrigo_, could you read the log of ubuntu-devel
<rodrigo_> yes
<rodrigo_> oh, the irc channel you mean?
<ricotz> rodrigo_, it is a git snapshot, not sure if this should go into archive
<rodrigo_> right
<ricotz> oh, yeah, i meant the irc
<rodrigo_> I'm not connected to that channel, so can you pastebin the log?
<ricotz> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/12/23/%23ubuntu-devel.txt
<ari-tczew> does Robert Ancell working today yet?
<ari-tczew> or is he already on holidays?
<ricotz> he already worked on things and might be on holidays now
<rodrigo_> ari-tczew, he's been working the whole week, afaik, not sure if he is on holidays today
<ricotz> rodrigo_, he pushed the gtk and g-i updates ;)
<rodrigo_> yes
<ricotz> also g-i packaging is broken
<ricotz> it seems he dropped the gir1.2-* transition
<ari-tczew> he signed my merge as him in webkit branch :/
<ari-tczew> not good as sponsor
<ricotz> rodrigo_, i will copy my gtk3 snapshot to the gnome3 ppa?
<rodrigo_> hmm, I guess that's the best thing to have things working
<rodrigo_> so yes, copy it and send a mail to robert, please
<ricotz> rodrigo_, could you fix the g-i package?
<rodrigo_> ricotz, I can try
<rodrigo_> ricotz, the one in natty?
<ricotz> yes
<Guest7185> is gdm broken?
<ricotz> rodrigo_, the changes from ubuntu4 to ubuntu5 are missing
<ricotz> rodrigo_, in ppa:ricotz/testing you can find the working g-i packaging
<rodrigo_> ricotz, ok, cool
<rodrigo_> ricotz, although I can't upload/merge, so if you already have it fixed, why don't you propose a merge?
<ricotz> rodrigo_, sorry, i dont have it branched and these are snapshot packages
<rodrigo_> ok
<bilalakhtar_> Is GDM in natty broken?
<rodrigo_> bilalakhtar_, not for me
<ricotz> bilalakhtar_, yes, try to downgrade gtk2 to 2.23.2
<bilalakhtar_> okay
<bilalakhtar_> will have to download debs manually I guess
<bilalakhtar_> anyone knows how to install multiple debs at a time using dpkg?
<ricotz> unfortunatelly, yes, dpkg -i *.deb
<bilalakhtar_> okay thanks for the info
<ronoc> mdz: hey, any news on the fluendo codec workitem -> "[mdz] to follow up on the fluendo codecs installation question" from https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-application-selection
<mdz> ronoc, thanks for the reminder. i'll see what I can find out, though a lot of folks are away on holiday already
<ronoc> mdz, grand just wondering where we are at with that
<mdz> ronoc, where we are is that I hadn't done anything about it since UDS until just now. I've now sent an email inquiry
<ronoc> mdz, cool
<ronoc> banshee doesn't like podcast atom feed...
<ronoc> *my
<ronoc> forwind.net/podcasts.atom
<ronoc> but rb is fine with it
<mdz> loading my library via DAAP is very slow in banshee, while RB handles it better (still slow but much less so)
<rodrigo_> ricotz, have you thought about submitting the gnome-shell packages in your PPA to the gnome3 ppa?
<ricotz> rodrigo_, not yet
<ronoc> mdz, will chat with Alex about these issues when he comes online after lunch
<mdz> ronoc, I've been thinking that what's needed is a caching mechanism for DAAP. then it wouldn't matter so much that it's slow to load everything up initially
<mdz> but I haven't looked into it to test that theory
<ronoc> yeah that would work, my C# is not existent, but i'd imagine i could give it a shot
<mdz> ronoc, you're a C programmer, right?  All you need to do is tune up a half step ;-)
<ronoc> mdz: :)
<ronoc> grab some lunch
<cdbs> ricotz: yes, that downgrade worked
<cdbs> thanks
<cdbs> BTW, this issue which I just faced (broken login due to GTK upload) is known, right?
<cdbs> I can't find a bug number
<rodrigo_> ricotz, https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gobject-introspection/merge-ricotz/+merge/44573
<ricotz> rodrigo_, thanks
<rodrigo_> ricotz, I sent a mail to robert so that he reviews, merges and uploads it
<cassidy> is there some plan to package glib-networking ?
<cyphermox> cassidy, I don't know, what does it do?
<cassidy> it's needed for libproxy integration
<cyphermox> ah, it's in debian experimental
<cyphermox> cassidy, is it for libproxy integration in a specific package? just trying to find out what would use it so I can add that to a possible bug about syncing the package from experimental :)
<cassidy> cyphermox, basically all the app using gio's network feature will gain from it
<cassidy> including telepathy-gabble
<cyphermox> cool
<rodrigo_> how do I migrate a bzr branch from an old version to the new one
<rodrigo_> a remote branch that is, can't push to it because the remote is old
<maxb> rodrigo_: migrate?
<maxb> can you describe the situation a little more?
<dobey> robbiew: bzr upgrade nosmart+lp:blahblah
<maxb> oh, that sort of old
<dobey> err
<dobey> rodrigo_: ^^ ; not robbiew
<rodrigo_> dobey, thanks, that worked indeed :)
<bcurtiswx> so much for unity not exploding :P
<bcurtiswx> i have no desktop nor applets on my classic desktop.. nothing shows on unity interface
<Amaranth> bcurtiswx: yeah, apparently it may be a gtk thing
<Amaranth> I dunno, that's what hggdh was thinking anyway
<bcurtiswx> hmm.  GTK failures are never fun
<bcurtiswx> i tell ya, this GNOME3 stuff is just a mess
<bcurtiswx> any update to anything can be broken by packages that once worked fine for it, but are now too old with deprecated functions
<Amaranth> bcurtiswx: We went from "GTK3 is going to be current GTK2 minus deprecations" to last minute rapid changes in GTK3 with corresponding GTK2 released pushed out so they could still say that stuff was deprecated in 2.x :)
<hggdh> bcurtiswx: same here. On Unity, I still cannot drill down on the indicators, so...
<rodrigo_> bcurtiswx, well, we're packaging a very much in progress work, so it's not the developer's fault, really
<rodrigo_> we should probably though pay more attention to gtk3 upgrades
<ricotz> rodrigo_, in this case gtk2 is broken ;)
<rodrigo_> ah, that's another story then :)
<ricotz> rodrigo_, i think mclasen pushed some fixes
<rodrigo_> yes, I think so
<mclasen> Amaranth: you're welcome to help out...
<ricotz> mclasen, hi, might be worth a new tarball? since this is quite a big problem
<mclasen> ricotz: not sure what oyu are referring to ?
<ricotz> mclasen, oh, i meant gtk2 - http://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?h=gtk-2-24&id=120915d6deff05c0154c9d44c3903a8a6e1b3036
<mclasen> i'm sure your distro can manage to patch that
<ricotz> mclasen, yeah, alright ;)
<rodrigo_> ricotz, hmm, your gtk3 package is missing libgtk-x11-3.so
<rodrigo_> or seems so, I upgraded and now apps complain about it missing
<ricotz> rodrigo_, hmm, i havent changed the packaging at all
<ricotz> rodrigo_, sorry, but i have to go :(
<mclasen> rodrigo_: its libgtk.so now
 * mclasen sends those announcements for a reason...
<rodrigo_> mclasen, right, so I guess it's an app not rebuilt yet
<mclasen> yeah, abi is still changing
<bcurtiswx> rodrigo_, i don't blame anyone.  its going to be like this whether we want it to be or not. :)
<dobey> is there an easy way to figure out the gir api version? ie, 1.2 vs 1.0?
<bcurtiswx> rodrigo_, gnome-keyring was published 8 hours ago.  Is there any reason I wouldn't see it in the PPA yet ?
<dobey> mterry: ping
<mterry> dobey, hi
<dobey> mterry: hey, i saw you sent http://old.nabble.com/gir-ABI-change-td30509226.html ; can you answer some more technical concerns about that change?
<mterry> dobey, I'll try
<dobey> mterry: do you know why debian made that change? is there an e-mail archive i can read on debian-devel or something?
<dobey> mterry: it seems like the resulting gir files are still in /usr/lib/girepository-1.0/ (which is obviously not 1.2)
<mterry> dobey, they made the change because gir 1.2 format files are incompatible with gir 1.0 files, despite sharing the same name
<mterry> dobey, correct
<mterry> dobey, GNOME upstream decided not to update the file location
<mterry> dobey, under the assumption that not enough people would be affected to do it right
<mterry> (my interpretation, obviously not a quote)
<mterry> As for a Debian email...  I don't have one at hand
<dobey> mterry: ok that is a bit off. and makes it even harder for me to do what i'm trying to do :(
<mterry> dobey, what's that?
<dobey> mterry: so we have 'nightly' builds of all the ubuntuone client projects. some of them have gir data for the C libraries. and we're currently only using one packaging branch/recipe per project to build these nightlies. this means that we now have to name the packages differently on lucid/maverick vs. narwhal (even though they contain the same files on disk). so i was going to make a substvar to name the package correctly, b
<dobey> mterry: also, what will happen if upstream gets past 1.0 and decides to change the file format again, and actually call it 1.2? seems like a conflict of interest there, no?
<mterry> dobey, that won't happen.  upstream calls the current abi version 1.2.  You can see by checking the actual file contents of a gir.  it has a version=1.2 line somewhere. They just chose not to update the location
<mterry> dobey, so if they go to 1.3, we'll see whether they update the file location or not.  but that would only affect parellel installability
<dobey> hrmm, actually, calling it 'abi' is a bit weird too.
<dobey> but anyway
<dobey> is there any way i can determine if it's 1.0 or 1.2 or whatever i need to use, from running a script or something?
<mterry> dobey, well, it probably means abi in the context of the typelib
<mterry> dobey, for gir, yes.  you see the <repository> root node?  it has a version attribute
<mterry> dobey, for typelib, I'm not so sure
<dobey> no, where do i get a repository root node?
<dobey> i'm pretty sure parsing some random xml to try and guess the version isn't the right way to go about it, anyway
<mterry> dobey, open /usr/share/gir-1.0/xlib-2.0.gir
<mterry> dobey, you're not guessing.  it says right there
<dobey> mterry: but what happens if the file i decide to parse says "1.0" but the gir tools that generate the file i'm installing create a "1.2" file?
<dobey> then the package would be named wrong. so parsing someone else's .gir files won't work (and i can't parse mine since it's not yet built)
<mterry> dobey, oh i see your question.  you want to know which version of the tools you have
<dobey> i want to be able to substvar the correct version into the binary package name, yes
<mterry> dobey, well, you could either check which version of g-ir-scanner is installed (by checking gobject-introspection's package version number, it doesn't seem to have a --version) or go by distro codename
<dobey> yeah, none of the g-ir-* seem to have a --version option :(
<mterry> dobey, I don't know which version shipped with maverick
<dobey> although i am not sure that would help
<dobey> lucid had 0.6.8, maverick 0.9.3, and narwhal has 0.10.0 as of today, but did have 0.9.12 for most of its life prior to today
<mterry> dobey, I don't know which generated which gir offhand.  You might want to check the output to know
 * mterry goes afk
<dobey> mterry: thanks anyway
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: holidays?
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, off soon
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: could you add even header about me in the d/changelog in webkit?
<ari-tczew> I guess that's fair to sign who did the merge...
<robert_ancell> ari-tczew, ?
<robert_ancell> "even header"?
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: if a couple of contributors work on one package then everyone has header like [ full name ] and under header describe of his work
<robert_ancell> oh, sure
<robert_ancell> which bits did you work on?  I did that update in paraller
<robert_ancell> parallel
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: my clipboard doesn't work, I can't copy a link. look into my branch linked to bug 691104
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 691104 in webkit (Ubuntu) "Merge webkit 1.2.5-2.1 (main) from Debian unstable (main) (affects: 2) (dups: 1) (heat: 16)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/691104
<ari-tczew> robert_ancell: look on bug 693976
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 693976 in gtk+2.0 (Ubuntu) "[natty] Copying to clipboard broken (affects: 5) (heat: 28)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/693976
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-12-24
<rodrigo_> cool, have a panel again :-)
<kklimonda> happy halloween!
<charlie-tca> Thank you
<nisshh> wait, what?
<nisshh> kklimonda, do you have your calendar upside down? :)
<cyphermox> smspillaz, ping?
<bcurtiswx> cassidy, I'm still getting webkit issues on empathy build, but empathy only requires 1.3.2, and we have 1.3.6 .  what version are you building with ?
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-12-26
<aphrek> hi all - can anyone recommend a way of displaying bandwidth (KB/Mb rather than menu based) in the menu bar (ubuntu)
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-12-19
<RAOF> Urgh.  Steaming is not kind to slightly-less-than-fresh milk.
<RAOF> Huh.  Thunder.
<RAOF> Crazy weather!  Who moved Sydney's rain down to Hobart?
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: I had so much rain over hte weekend...yesterday I was cleaning the mini-flood from our basement.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: stupid weather
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> RAOF: ah, installing linux-image-3.2.0-6-generic now, let's see whether that cures the hangs
<RAOF> pitti: Oh, we've got a new kernel, based on rc6?  Sweet.  I can have both a non-crashy system *and* have sbuild work!
<pitti> RAOF: yes, it's -rc6
<pitti> RAOF: I grabbed it from NEW
<pitti> RAOF: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/3.2.0-6.12/+build/3021232
<pitti> still need to wait for the doorstopper arches to finish building, then NEWing, l-meta, etc. until everyone gets it
<RAOF> Yeeehaw!
<GunnarHj> pitti: Good morning, Martin!
<pitti> hello GunnarHj, how are you?
<GunnarHj> pitti: Fine, thanks. Hope you are as well.
<GunnarHj> pitti: Can you please take a look at bug 905429? It's a regression from the pygobject upgrade last Friday.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 905429 in python2.7 "gnome-language-selector crashed with ValueError in _build_localename(): too many values to unpack" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/905429
<pitti> I am
<pitti> GunnarHj: yes, already on my list for today
<pitti> it's my last official day, need to clean up my list :)
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok, great.
<GunnarHj> pitti: Does it include the a-s and l-s MPs? :)
<pitti> less urgent than above crash, but in general, everything which is sitting in my ubuntu mailbox :0
<pitti> at least it seems this morning we didn't get any major iso build breakage or other nasty bug
<pitti> so no firefighting to do this morning
<GunnarHj> pitti: Sounds promising. :)
<pitti> last week was full of that
<mainerror> So that is what you do to make my early Precise journey that pleasant?
<pitti> basically, watch like a hawk for problems, and fix them :)
<pitti> and since we have a dedicated team for this, this actually works
<pitti> supported by daily automatic testing in https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Precise/
<pitti> (bad example today, the server tests are broken, but the server ISOs themselves should be good)
<pitti> and a general mindset of developers to not break stuff so hard
<mainerror> Yea I was listening to the stream for that session.
<RAOF> pitti: Do you know what I need to do to turn a PPA into something that we can copy into the archive?
<pitti> RAOF: hm, kindly ask the launchpad guys to give you one of these "blessed" nonvirtualized PPAs?
<RAOF> Ok.  I think we may have done that.
<mainerror> I should totally get cracking with learning how to package. Sounds like something that should be fun.
<pitti> mainerror: you'll find a lot of agreement in this channel :)
<RAOF> I'll finish the rest of the world-building, then scream at someone that the world *still* breaks when the gesture extension is not available, then prepare to copy to the archive :)
<pitti> GunnarHj: did you already happen to send a bug to python upstream? if not, I can do it now
<pitti> it's not a problem in python3, but ought to be fixed in python2.7 indeed
<pitti> GunnarHj: nevermind, known already -- http://bugs.python.org/issue3067
<pitti> so it seems setlocale is not meant to work with unicode in py2.7
<rodrigo_> morning
<pitti> hey rodrigo_, how are you?
<rodrigo_> hi pitti, I'm fine and you?
<pitti> rodrigo_: quite fine, thanks! trying to mop up everything outstanding on my last official day today :)
<pitti> rodrigo_: how are you? looking forward to the holidays?
<rodrigo_> pitti: last official day?
<rodrigo_> ah, before vacation?
<pitti> rodrigo_: yes
<rodrigo_> ah ok
<pitti> "official" since I figure I'll need to do a few things here and there until Wednesday, but then I'll disappear
<rodrigo_> going anywhere, or just staying at home relaxing? :D
<pitti> rodrigo_: no, we'll go to Dresden again to spend the holidays with our families and friends
<pitti> all of my friends will also come to Dresden (many are living in different cities or even countries these days), so looking forward to that
<GunnarHj> pitti: Saw your comments on the python issue. Only fixing it in l-s  means that locale.setlocale() keeps being broken in Ubuntu, doesn't it?
<pitti> GunnarHj: right; but it's always been like that
<GunnarHj> pitti: Yes, but the news is that type 'str' strings now are converted to type 'unicode'.
<GunnarHj> In gi/overrides/Gtk.py
<pitti> so that would happen if you stuff e. g. the contents of an input field right into setlocale() without conversion
<pitti> indeed it would be better to fix setlocale(), but seems upstream already rejected that
<pitti> and at some point we'll use python3 anyway
<pitti> so I guess the committed workaround will do for now
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok, you are the one with a helicopter perspective on it. :)
<pitti> well, it's more like the pragmatic perspective :)
<pitti> GunnarHj: I have an outstanding MP for l-s which I want to take a look at, then I'll upload
<pitti> rodrigo_: do you know if g-settings-daemon starts syndaemon?
<pitti> rodrigo_: I'm trying to understand bug 868400, apparently we sometimes get two syndaemons running
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 868400 in xserver-xorg-input-synaptics "Synaptics touchpad stops working" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/868400
<rodrigo_> pitti: yes, it does
<pitti> rodrigo_: hm, could that happen if g-s-d spawns syndaemon, then crashes, then restarts, and starts another syndaemon?
<rodrigo_> yes
<rodrigo_> that might be the cause indeed
<pitti> syndaemon_spawned is only valid while g-s-d is running
<rodrigo_> yes
<pitti> So there is the conflict: two syndaemon instances, one from lightdm and one from logged in user.
<pitti> ooh
<pitti> or that
<rodrigo_> hmm, lightdm runs it?
<pitti> but comment 69 has two syndaemons from the user
<rodrigo_> then it might be the g-s-d-crashing-and-restarting thing
<pitti> and comment 81 is the one with one from lightdm and one from user
<rodrigo_> hmm
<pitti> rodrigo_: if g-s-d respawns, could it even use the old syndaemon?
<pitti> or does it need to know its pid and some fd to it?
<rodrigo_> it needs to know the pid
<rodrigo_> let me double check
<rodrigo_> yes, it keeps track of the pid
<pitti> rodrigo_: but only for internal housekeeping
<rodrigo_> yes
<pitti> rodrigo_: not for actually communicating with it
<pitti> rodrigo_: once syndaemon is started, does it work completely on its own or does it need to be controlled from outside/g-s-d?
<rodrigo_> it works on its own
<pitti> in the former case, it could just call pidof instead of manager->priv->syndaemon_spawned
<rodrigo_> hmm, just saw it doesn't kill the pid on exit, although not sure it should
<rodrigo_> yes, it could do that, yes
<pitti> then if pidof returns true, it coudl just grab that pid
<rodrigo_> yeah
<pitti> so that it can kill it if the user disables the function
<rodrigo_> right, that should be the best way
<rodrigo_> syndaemon needs to not run if the feature is disabled
<pitti> right
<pitti> rodrigo_: I updated the bug accordingly; I gave the lightdm task to robert (I think we should just disable syndaemon completely there via gsettings)
<pitti> rodrigo_: I guess you won't have time any more to work on this, though?
<rodrigo_> pitti: I'm almost done with the install languages, so once I'm done, if there's time I can work on it
<rodrigo_> assign the bug to me for now, if you want
<rodrigo_> if no time, I'll assign it back
<pitti> rodrigo_: ok, will do; thanks!
<rodrigo_> although this is an upstream thing, so I can fix it next week also
<pitti> rodrigo_: oh, nice! g-c-c language selector is working now?
<rodrigo_> almost
<rodrigo_> a few details missing still though
<rodrigo_> but almost there :)
<pitti> cool!
<pitti> rodrigo_: I guess we are still missing the aptdaemon part for returning the set of packages to install?
<pitti> what-provides('locale', 'es') or something
<rodrigo_> I have a branch with that
<rodrigo_> so all should be done tomorrow, or Wed I hope
<pitti> oh, already? I had expected to work on this in January, after my stable+1 team shift
<pitti> great!
<pitti> rodrigo_: are you using l-s' pkg_depends file for this?
<pitti> or just call check-language-support?
<rodrigo_> yes, needed a backend to test, so aptdaemon was the best fit for now
<rodrigo_> just calls check-lang-support
<rodrigo_> the missing thing would be to move the script to aptdaemon, right?
<pitti> rodrigo_: ah, good; so I can just change that to use the pkg_depends file in January without disrupting anything else
<rodrigo_> yeah
<pitti> yay for having encapsulation behidn a d-bus api
<rodrigo_> :)
<pitti> rodrigo_: I'll throw the script away (or just change it to call the d-bus api)
<pitti> rodrigo_: in aptdaemon it's much cheaper to figure this out by re-using an existing apt.Cache() instance
<rodrigo_> yes
<Sweetshark> Bonjours toujours!
<Sweetshark> -s
<pitti> Sweetshark: argh, noo! the French mafia brainwashed you already?
<Sweetshark> pitti: I am just infiltrating them!
<Sweetshark> pitti: dont blow my cover.
 * Sweetshark has LibreOffice (Libre in the name was also an success of the french mafia) 3.5 beta0 completing ./debian/rules build.
<Sweetshark> (on precise)
<Sweetshark> but there is still MIR galore ahead (I just switched to --with-system-foo for the stuff we are missing for now)
<Sweetshark> ahem
<Sweetshark> --without-system-foo
<pitti> ah, good; that should hopefully greatly reduce the MIRs?
<Sweetshark> pitti: well, I can do a lot more --without-system-foo stuff, that would make my life a lot easier (however the LO package bigger and if there is a security update in the external libs that would suck) ...
<pitti> right
<pitti> Sweetshark: well, the size will increase either way, as these new external libraries would need to get added to the CD, too
<pitti> but external libs are still better for security updates, of course
<Sweetshark> pitti: however, it seems some stuff that _rene_ is using isnt even published at debian (libcmis, libtextextcat-dev), so IMHO I would just go with --without-system-foo for those for now.
<pitti> Sweetshark: we still have -4MB space left on the CDs, so that's how much they can grow :)
<pitti> (i. e. we are already oversized)
<Sweetshark> pitti: and I dont think a lot of other apps reusing these libs as of now. If they would we would have them duplicated (once in LO, once system-wide), which really would waste a lot of space.
<Sweetshark> (possibly also CD-space)
<pitti> Sweetshark: right, for stuff that isn't prone to security vulns, the bundled stuff will do fine for now
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<Laney> stgraber just created desktop-extra
<Laney> have at it :-)
<mterry> cyphermox, I'm looking at the 'iw' MIR
<mterry> cyphermox, there are some seemingly important bugs in LP.  Is the package working?
<cyphermox> it was :)
<cyphermox> let me check those bugs again, IIRC it's all stuff that needs to be closed or something
<cyphermox> as far as I'm concerned, it works, I can see scan results, etc.
<rodrigo_> out for a bit, bbl
<jbicha> Laney: thanks
<Laney> np
<Laney> we can't 'drop' stuff from desktop like that since it's autogenerated
<Laney> the seeds need to be fixed
<Laney> afaik anyway
<Laney> maybe pitti knows more
<pitti> Laney: what is "like that"?
 * pitti is missing jbicha's questino apparently
<jbicha> I think gnome-panel and gnome-applets should be moved from desktop to desktop-extra
<pitti> that should be fine, they are in universe now
<pitti> edubuntu-desktop-gnome still pulls them in
<pitti> I'll verify with cjwatson in #devel
<Laney> maybe refreshing the packagesets is a manual process?
<jbicha> since we're going with GTK 3.4, is there a reason why I shouldn't upload gedit 3.3 to precise?
<pitti> jbicha: as we want to stay on 3.2, I'd turn that question around
<pitti> jbicha: i. e. "does or will it depend on anything else in 3.4 and does it improve things noticeably"?
<jbicha> pitti: do we want to stay on 3.2? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0
<jbicha> gedit doesn't yet depend on 3.3, but it's hard to predict what'll happen
<pitti> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-gnome-version
<pitti> jbicha: so far it's: glib/gtk 3.4, gnome 3.2, consider g-control-center as we have some active work going on on that
<pitti> (or backport the new region panel)
<jbicha> the whole 3.2/3.4 thing is still confusing, the pad only lists a few things to keep on 3.2
<pitti> need to run, see you tomorrow!
<pitti> (I'm officially on vacation from tomorrow on, but need to wrap up a few things)
<jbicha> I wonder if gnome-games will still be ok since they've been doing a lot of work on it (porting games to vala for instance)
<pitti> jbicha: yes, we can update individual parts if they don't introduce regressions and dependencies to other 3.4 parts
<jbicha> well I think gedit will be fine but we'll talk more later
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-12-20
<jml> compiz is chewing up a lot of CPU
<jml> should I file a bug about this? (precise)
<dbarth> jml: yes please
<dbarth> jml: it's weird because i don't think there was a new version released
<dbarth> jml: so that must be external causes
<jml> dbarth: ok. will do.
<dbarth> jml: just let me know of the bug number or subscribe me
<jml> dbarth: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/906816
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 906816 in compiz "compiz always using significant chunk of CPU" [Undecided,New]
<dbarth> jml: thanks
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<Riddell> is there a meeting today?
<pitti> Riddell: don't think so; half of the team or more is on vac already
<dobey> pitti: uh, firefox/etc are really reporting bytes transfered as base 10 rather than base 8?
<pitti> dobey: nautilus/gvfs etc. is; I'm not entirely sure of firefox
<dobey> that is not very nice
<pitti> I think firefox still gets it wrong, too
<dobey> base 10 is wrong :)
<pitti> no, it's not
<dobey> it is when you are transferring in blocks of base 8
<pitti> unless you only have two fingers
<pitti> but we don't
<pitti> or if we do, it's absolutely uninteresting for a human-readable size
<pitti> but anyway, we've been through this, and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UnitsPolicy is the result now
 * ogra_ grumbles about ubuntu-docs taking over 30min to unpack in precise ... that was only 15min in oneiric, did it really grow so much or are we using some insane compression mechanism now ?
<pitti> dobey: anyway, even if you want base-2, then format_size_for_display is still wrong
 * ogra_ expects the same issue for gnome-user-docs ...
<pitti> dobey: as it doesn't use the correct units then, like MiB/GiB
<dobey> pitti: i didn't say format_size_for_dispay was right
<dobey> but it's all there is in glib < 2.30
<pitti> dobey: but as format_size_for_dispay was essentially unfixable, they deprecated it
<pitti> dobey: right, for older releases we just have to live with it
<pitti> dobey: but I sent an updated MP which now gets along with both
<pitti> it gives the correct output for >= 2.30, and remains unchanged for < 2.30
<pitti> which is pretty much what we want for SRUs, etc.
<dobey> what i'm saying, is the policy seems to be broken
<dobey> pretty much *everything* reads/writes data in 4096 byte blocks, not 1000 bit blocks
<pitti> how is that relevant?
<pitti> it doesn't matter if your read/write block size is 1024 or 1234567
<pitti> what you display are either file sizes or transfer rates
<dobey> because it's readying bytes, not bits
<dobey> reading, not readying
<pitti> ok, I'm afraid I don't follow
<pitti> which part of the policy do you think is broken?
<pitti> (or the g_format_size() implementation for that matter?)
<dobey> the g_format_size implementation is fine; it just calls g_format_size_full () with the default of using 1000 instead of 1024, and _full lets you use 1024. i think defaulting to 1000 is a bad idea, vs requiring developer to make a conscious choice, but whatever, i don't care to argue that
<pitti> well, that was made because in all except rare circumstances 1000 is the right default now
<dobey> and i fundamentally disagree with perpetuating the lies of an entire industry, but whatever. ex post facto standards are complete bollocks, if you ask me. :)
<kenvandine> oh interesting, i didn't know about the UnitsPolicy page... i've wondered about that a couple times in the past
<dobey> i think the network bandwidth thing is wrong, though
<pitti> well, it's not ex post fact
<pitti> humans have counted in base-10 (well, some in base-60) for centuries
<pitti> just some nerds a couple of decades ago thought it was a good idea to confuse people with a Mega-something which is not actually what Mega- means
<kenvandine> it makes sense, normal humans prefer easy number
<kenvandine> +s
<pitti> someone just abused the SI prefixes to mean something different
<pitti> _that_ was the confusion, not switching back to real base-10 prefixes
<dobey> pitti: computers have never counted in base 10
<pitti> why should users care?
<kenvandine> dobey, computers != humans
<dobey> the IEC standard didn't exist until 1998
<dobey> and hard disk manufacturers had been cheating since way before then
<kenvandine> we're talking about representing the information to humans not computers
 * kenvandine stops feeding the dobey :)
<pitti> dobey: why cheating?
<pitti> dobey: 100 MB == 100.0000.000 Bytes
<dobey> humans don't care. they just want the computer to match what the box says.
<dobey> when they see certain things
<pitti> (scratch that extra 0, YKWIM)
<dobey> there is no box label for how many bytes your computer transferred across the network
<pitti> what I do agree to is that using the base-2 prefixes is confusing
<pitti> like, 100 MiB for file sizes, etc.
<pitti> since users do not know what these really are either
<pitti> we still need them for total mem size
<dobey> the XiB crap is annoying because of the i
<pitti> that's why we shouldn't use it for most things :)
<dobey> people making stupid naming choices in a standard is no excuse for avoiding base 2
<dobey> "we'll just make stupid names for things, so nobody will use them!"
 * pitti stops any hope of getting dobey out of his geek unit world, and just STFU :)
<kenvandine> pitti, it is hard not to feed the dobey :)
<pitti> dobey: if you had written the standard, which prefixes would you have chosen, OOI?
<dobey> drwxr-xr-x   2 dobey dobey      4096 2011-05-06 16:19 æçåç¢/
<dobey> drwxr-xr-x   2 dobey dobey 4.0K 2011-05-06 16:19 æçåç¢/
<dobey> :)
<dobey> pitti: i wouldn't pick names that sounded like they came from care bears, at least
<pitti> but that's a lie :)
<pitti> it's 4.096 K
<dobey> pitti: so do you have a patch for ls?
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UnitsPolicy#Exception
<pitti> dobey: --si
<pitti> dobey: http://xkcd.com/394/ is an even clearer standard :)
<ricotz> jbicha, hi
<ricotz> jbicha, good catch and interesting patch in gnome-themes-standard for nautilus, but i think something like this would be better http://paste.debian.net/plain/149749
<jbicha> ricotz: oh, would that work too?
<jbicha> I don't actually understand theming
<ricotz> jbicha, this is hard to notice, but it only draws this dark line?
<ricotz> and this smaller change does the same, and wouldnt break nautilus 3.3
<jbicha> ricotz: yeah, it would be better to work with both nautilus 3.2 and 3.3
<ricotz> as long nautilus 3.2 doesnt use GtkGrid it doesnt interfere with the newer style definitions
<ricotz> jbicha, please change it then
<jbicha> ricotz: yes, doing it now :)
<ricotz> thanks
<ricotz> jbicha, you messed the patch up :(
<ricotz> jbicha, please look at the paste again
<ricotz> do it exactly that way
<jbicha> ricotz: sorry, I'll just copy and paste then
<ricotz> jbicha, me again ;), the break against fglrx in g-s arent compatible with ubuntu
<ricotz> i think it should be something like "fglrx (<< 2:8.910)"
<jbicha> ricotz: maybe we could just leave that line out since I hear that the latest fglrx still doesn't work right for everyone w/ gshell
<jbicha> ricotz: also you should join the desktop team
<ricotz> jbicha, yes, dropping the line would be the best
<jbicha> actually, fglrx-driver isn't in Ubuntu at all, so I don't think the breaks hurts anything to be left in
<ricotz> indeed ;)
<ricotz> jbicha, on the other hand i was thinking fglrx 2:8.911 fixed some things
<pitti> cyphermox: did you sync libnl3?
<pitti> ah, there's a MIR already for xmlstarlet, nevermind
<jbicha> ricotz: I was thinking of 8.881 which still had problems but I don't run ATI so I don't know if the problems are fixed now or not
<cyphermox> pitti: yeah
<cyphermox> I just did the MIR too, I had forgotten all about hte new xmlstarlet requirement
<ricotz> jbicha, ok, i thought i read some good news about the newer driver
<pitti> happy holidays everyone! I'll stop IRC now, please mail me if you need me to do something over the holidays (no response time guarantee, though)
<broder> where's the best place to send feedback on dx's multi-display spec? ayatana@lists.lp?
<mterry> chrisccoulson, hey, congrats!
<alex_mayorga> Hello! Can someone here help me get rid of bug 907012
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 907012 in indicator-datetime "indicator-datetime uses 80% of RAM or 3.1g" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/907012
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-12-21
<pitti> cyphermox: are you going to do the libnl3 library transition?
<pitti> (on holiday since yesterday, and I really have to spend some time off the computer)
<pitti> . o O { pretty please don't break precise over the holidays so hard! }
<pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/nbs.html has become a mess in just two days again
 * micahg thought people weren't supposed to be uploading and forgetting, especially in main
<pitti> micahg: they aren't indeed
<ricotz> pitti, hi, do you have a moment?
<ricotz> pitti, the change for 16_use_synchronous_notifications.patch in http://launchpadlibrarian.net/85261136/gnome-settings-daemon_3.2.1-0ubuntu2_3.2.2-0ubuntu3.diff.gz doesnt look right
<ricotz> -+                ca_gtk_play_for_widget (window, 0,
<ricotz> ++                ca_gtk_play_for_widget (manager->priv->dialog, 0,
<rodrigo_> morning
 * ogra_ wonders why the dash in his precise install shows the totem icon for "play music" ... RB is installed 
<ogra_> hmm, and it actually stzarts totem if i click it
<ricotz> rodrigo_, hi
<rodrigo_> hi ricotz
<ricotz> rodrigo_, i think i found a problem in a patch of g-s-d
<rodrigo_> which one?
<ricotz> 16_use_synchronous_notifications.patch which you ported for 3.2.1 > 3.2.2
<rodrigo_> oh, that breaks for every update iirc, yes
<ricotz> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-settings-daemon/ubuntu/revision/230/debian/patches/16_use_synchronous_notifications.patch#debian/patches/16_use_synchronous_notifications.patch
<ricotz> you replaced the window variable
<ricotz> i noticed it while porting it for 3.3.3+
<rodrigo_> right
<rodrigo_> just missed it when merging the upstream code
<ricotz> this is present in oneiric too then
<rodrigo_> yes
<rodrigo_> ok, have to go out for lunch, bbiab
<ricotz> rodrigo_, ok, feel free to fix it ;)
<cyphermox> asac: ping?
<asac> cyphermox: hi. what projects do you want me to hand over again?
<cyphermox> asac: connman, ofono, modemmanager
<cyphermox> the main problem is setting up mirroring of git trees so that I can setup daily builds
<asac> mm done
<asac> nm done
<asac> cyphermox: ofono done
<asac> check things out
<cyphermox> asac: thanks
<cyphermox> asac: you'll keep handling ~modemmanager? There's two pending
<cyphermox> asac: toabctl I've already spoken to and explained the process and use for the team
<asac> nm team is part of mm team
<asac> only rarely you need to apply to mm team i geuss
<cyphermox> yeah
<cyphermox> asac: well, thanks, and have nice holidays :)
<asac> thx and you too!
<achiang> durr... http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/777774/
<achiang> empathy was forcibly removed from my system... known bug?
<micahg> dist-upgrades aren't always safe in the devel release :)
<achiang> agreed
<achiang> just didn't know if it was a known issue or not... i could file a bug
<micahg> my guess would be mirror lag since there's no build failure, I'm trying a dist-upgrade myself in a moment to check
<micahg> yeah, working fine for me
<micahg> it could also be archive skew depending on when you did it
<kenvandine> achiang, probably libfolks
<kenvandine> it had a new binary
<kenvandine> if you dist-upgrade before the new binary was installed it would want to remove empathy
<achiang> i see
<achiang> thanks kenvandine and micahg
<kenvandine> achiang, np
<achiang> kenvandine: well, now i'm getting a crasher. :-/
<kenvandine> in empathy? yay :)
<achiang> oh hrm
<achiang> 2nd time around it wants to work again
<achiang> this is weird.
<kenvandine> did you click on it in the indicator?
<achiang> i launched it from the indicator
<kenvandine> yeah, known bug
<kenvandine> fixed in trunk
<achiang> then gmail chat forgot its password
<achiang> so i clicked on the pencil to edit the account info
<achiang> and that's when it crashed
<kenvandine> oh... that is different
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> apport catch it?
<achiang> trying to reproduce
<achiang> kenvandine: can't reproduce it. :(
<achiang> sorry
<kenvandine> bummer...
<dobey> i wish i didn't have to pbuilder-foo updaet as a separate command from building a .dsc
<dobey> so annoying, that
<achiang> kenvandine: argh, i can't authenticate to google's jabber now. :(
<kenvandine> that is interesting
<kenvandine> are you getting auth failures?
<achiang> where would they appear? .xsession-errors?
<kenvandine> it should give you an infobar at the top of the contact list
<achiang> yes, getting auth failure
<achiang> i just regenerated a new app-specific password in google too
<kenvandine> ok, so it lets you put in a new password and still fails?
<kenvandine> is this account created in empathy-accounts or gnome-online-accounts?
<achiang> correct, can put in a new password and it fails
<achiang> not sure about empathy-accounts vs g-o-a
<kenvandine> open empathy-accounts
<kenvandine> select the account
<achiang> i could try to remove the account and create a new one inside empathy, i guess?
<kenvandine> it will tell you
<achiang> kenvandine: http://chizang.net/alex/tmp/empathy-accounts.png
<kenvandine> ok, so that rules out goa
<kenvandine> achiang, try creating a new one and see if it works
<kenvandine> achiang, maybe it is because you are using an app specific password?
 * kenvandine doesn't know anything about that
<achiang> kenvandine: no, this has worked for months, until empathy was removed; then i added it back and it broke
<achiang> maybe i am missing some other lib?
<achiang> kenvandine: removing and recreating an account doesn't help
<kenvandine> humm
<achiang> kenvandine: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/777802/
<achiang> does that look right to you?
<kenvandine> folks doesn't have anything to do with auth though
<kenvandine> after empathy got removed and re-added
<kenvandine> achiang, did  you logout and back in?
 * kenvandine wonders if the empath-auth process never died
<achiang> kenvandine: i rebooted
<kenvandine> :(
<achiang> and i don't have an empathy-auth process running right now
<achiang> should there be one?
<kenvandine> not necessarliy
<kenvandine> but that gets run when it tries to auth
<achiang> hm, there's an empathy-debugger
<kenvandine> that is just the log viewer
<achiang> there are no auth logs?
<kenvandine> the auth failure should be in the gabble log
<kenvandine> and you have empathy 3.3.2 right?
<achiang> 3.3.2-0ubuntu1
<achiang> where is the gabble log?
<kenvandine> you have to use empathy-debugger to view it
<kenvandine> select gabble from the select drop down up top
<achiang> i see: mission-control, sofiasip, file-transfer, indicator-approver, and logger
<achiang> maybe that is my problem
<kenvandine> oh!
<kenvandine> do you have telepathy-gabble installed?
<achiang> ii  telepathy-gabble                       0.15.1-0ubuntu1
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> you should have a log if it tried to use it
<kenvandine> is there a telepathy-gabble process running?
<achiang> nope
<achiang> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/777812/
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> look under mission-control
<kenvandine> it should at least show where it tried gabble
<kenvandine> maybe gabble isn't starting?
<achiang> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/777818/
<achiang> kenvandine: perhaps line 245?
<achiang> and higher up, there are lines 225 and 226
<kenvandine> no possible handlers
<kenvandine> interesting
<kenvandine> achiang, what do you have in /usr/share/telepathy/clients/
<achiang> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/777825/
<nessita> ok, router went crazy, had to reboot it
<nessita> dobey: did I miss something?
<dobey> nessita: in here, or in #ubuntuone? i don't know what the last thing you saw, was :)
<achiang> kenvandine: well... i just rebooted again, and now jabber works. unfortunately sip is broken, and that is much more important to me
<kenvandine> ugh
<nessita> dobey: in #ubuntuone, sorry
<kenvandine> so just a reboot... nothing else?
<achiang> kenvandine: control-m to bring up the dialing interface; i type in any numeral, and the windows all go away
<achiang> kenvandine: right, just a reboot
<achiang> kenvandine: the contact window and the dialing window
<achiang> they go away
<kenvandine> ok, that could be a new bug introduced in empathy 3.3.2 :)
<achiang> but empathy seems to stay up
<achiang> kenvandine: can you try and reproduce?
<kenvandine> yeah, it is unrelated
<kenvandine> try installing empathy-call
<achiang> i am using telepathy-sofiasip
<kenvandine> maybe the latest sip stuff won't work with the fallback call interface
<achiang> brb
<achiang> kenvandine: after installing empathy-call, no improvement
<achiang> (and another reboot just for giggles)
<kenvandine> :(
<kenvandine> ok, look at the sip logs
<kenvandine> i'd have to figure out how to setup sip
<kenvandine> achiang, for me it is crashing when i type the first diget in
<kenvandine> digit even
<kenvandine> like it is trying to autocomplete something
<achiang> kenvandine: that is exactly the behavior i'm seeing
<kenvandine> oh... this looks folks related
<kenvandine> achiang https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/empathy/+bug/907501
<ubot2> kenvandine: Error: <Bugtracker.plugin.Launchpad instance at 0xa5ae8cc> bug 907501 not found
<kenvandine> achiang, i'll look at this tonight
<achiang> kenvandine: thanks!
<achiang> much appreciated
<kenvandine> thx for finding it :)
<achiang> wonder why apport doesn't want to catch that for me
<kenvandine> it did for me
<achiang> kenvandine: np, i was poking around in this space because the dialpad UI once the call is established is horrible
<achiang> and i wanted to fix it
<achiang> well, also, i use this on an hourly basis to dial into way too many concalls
<kenvandine> achiang, it might not be horrible now that you have empathy-call installed
<kenvandine> this is the new experimental clutter-gst based call interface
<kenvandine> which is getting major work done this cycle
<kenvandine> ok, this should be fixed in 3.3.3, updating now :)
<achiang> kenvandine: wait, what? you just fixed 907501?
<kenvandine> upstream did :)
<kenvandine> i think
<kenvandine> either way updating to 3.3.3 was on my todo list for today :)
<achiang> a beer for you, sir
<toabctl> i got the debian-dir of the glib branch from lp:~ubuntu-desktop/glib/ubuntu glib.head . How can i get the source package now?
<toabctl> fakeroot debian/rules get-orig-source does not work because source version is 2.31.4.tested-0ubuntu4
<toabctl> see http://paste.ubuntu.com/777885/
<kenvandine> achiang, well i no longer get that crash... but a different one :/
<kenvandine> achiang, i just uploaded 3.3.3, and it no longer crashes when typing the number in
<kenvandine> however it does crash which i click "Audio Call"
<kenvandine> so different bug
<kenvandine> but... i reproduced the exact same behavior with 3.3.1 as well
<kenvandine> so perhaps this isn't a new bug
<kenvandine> achiang, was it working for you before the 3.3.2 update?
<kenvandine> if so, perhaps my account isn't working or something
<kenvandine> i haven't used it in years
<achiang> kenvandine: yes, it was definitely working since like, mid-november
<achiang> kenvandine: until basically yesterday
<achiang> or today, rather
<kenvandine> achiang, ok, cool
<kenvandine> so maybe it will work for you
<achiang> let me see
<kenvandine> let me know please
<achiang> kenvandine: hm, hasn't hit the mirror yet
<kenvandine> achiang, not published yet
<kenvandine> give it an hour or so
<achiang> ok
<kenvandine> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/empathy/3.3.3-0ubuntu1
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-12-22
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<achiang> kenvandine: empathy-sip crash> i see the same crasher as you after attempting to dial
<kenvandine> ok... :(
<kenvandine> did apport fire for it?
 * kenvandine is so glad g_debug is no longer spewing to .xsession-errors :)
<achiang> kenvandine: no, i don't know what happened with apport. :(
<achiang> kenvandine: i verified i have it turned on
<achiang> but... i dunno. no worky
<kenvandine> weird
<achiang> kenvandine: but it is exactly the same symptom you describe: can enter in numbers to dial, but as soon as you try to dial, the windows go away
<achiang> kenvandine: so... maybe you can catch it?
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> i can
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> i'll give you a bug # when i file it
<kenvandine> achiang, do you have contacts already added for sip?
 * kenvandine doesn't see a way to add those, so maybe you can't
<kenvandine> i was wondering if it crashes from calling from a contact instead of dialing
<achiang> kenvandine: hm, no, i wasn't calling a contact
<achiang> kenvandine: it was just dialing
<kenvandine> achiang, is there a way to add a sip contact to your contact list?
<achiang> let me try
<kenvandine> i couldn't do it... the sip account wasn't available in the add contact dialog
<kenvandine> which seemed weird to me
<achiang> kenvandine: i see the sip account, but it is greyed out and does not let me select it
<kenvandine> same here
<kenvandine> the crash is in empathy_contact_get_account
<achiang> maybe it's crashing because there is no account
<kenvandine> perhaps, i think it is a g_return_if_fail on the account
<achiang> kenvandine: i'll add you on g+
<kenvandine> just not sure why the account isn't valid
<achiang> and see about calling you. :)
<kenvandine> hang on... i have empathy in gdb... not going to work for making calls right now :)
<achiang> kenvandine: oh, i did add you, but maybe didn't get added back
<achiang> or rather, you don't appear in my contacts list
<dobey> kenvandine: can i bug you for some sponsoring? :)
<kenvandine> achiang, bug 907916
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 907916 in folks "empathy crashed with SIGSEGV in empathy_contact_get_account()" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/907916
<achiang> thx
<kenvandine> np
<kenvandine> seems upstream is already looking at it
<kenvandine> dobey, perhaps, is it an easy one?
<dobey> kenvandine: i would suspect they're all easyâ¦ how do you define easy? :)
<dobey> one is a new source package for universe
<kenvandine> something that won't take long to review... and not an SRU
<dobey> the rest are updates to precise
<dobey> no, it's all precise
<kenvandine> dobey, i can take a swing at them
<dobey> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/907888 is the new package one
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 907888 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] dirspec" [High,In progress]
<kenvandine> dobey, might be later tonight though
<kenvandine> the new package i probably won't be able to do before the break... i am scrambling to do a bit too much right now
<dobey> ah ok
<kenvandine> not to say i won't do it over the break :)
<kenvandine> but i usually try to do fun work over the break :-p
<dobey> yeah i'm just trying to get it all in before, since the day i come back from back, we'll be doing another set of releases :)
<dobey> kenvandine: and in the future you won't really have to sponsor, since i'm going to push to get us a delegated team for u1 :)
<dobey> doh; found a typo in the new package, and launchpad is being evil right now
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-12-23
<rodrigo_> morning
<micahg> hi rodrigo_
<rodrigo_> hi micahg
 * micahg had fun uploading his first desktop package
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<rodrigo_> ok, EOD and EOY for me, so have a nice vacation all
<rodrigo_> and see you from the other side next year :)
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, have a great holiday!
<markuss> hey guys ive a problem with menus duplicating in lucid when i create an item in the menu it pops up somewhere else
<markuss> beside untcking the box is there another way to stop this
<markuss> as ive a lot of menus and it would take ages to go through one by one
 * mterry works on merging gnome-menus
<micahg> mterry: are the hyphen-* and hyphenation-* packages intrinsically tied to anything regarding versioning?
<micahg> i.e. can we upgrade one to a new upstream w/out upgrading them all
<mterry> micahg, I don't know off hand.  Sweetshark might know
<ricotz> micahg, hi
<micahg> hi ri
<micahg> hi ricotz
<ricotz> micahg, is it possible to have some firefox/thunderbird stable builds for precise in the ppas?
<ricotz> meaning firefox 9.0.1 and thunderbird 9.0
<micahg> ricotz: why?  people on precise should be running the betas
<ricotz> micahg, i dont like running the earlier thunderbird betas ;)
<dobey> mterry: can i bug you to sponsor some "uploads"?
<micahg> we need beta coverage to assure our stable releases remain "stable"
<mterry> dobey, ok
<dobey> mterry: https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu/precise/ubuntuone-control-panel/ubuntuone-control-panel-2.99.0/+merge/86455
<dobey> mterry: https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/precise/ubuntuone-client-gnome/release-2-99-0/+merge/86488
<micahg> ricotz: I think I've had more trouble with the later betas than the earlier ones personally :)
<dobey> mterry: https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/precise/libubuntuone/release-2-99-0/+merge/86624
<ricotz> micahg, i know and understand that, at least an upload of the actual releases would have been nice
<dobey> :)
<mterry> guh
 * mterry startws
<ricotz> micahg, yeah, bug can appear everytime
<ricotz> micahg, are there packaging differences between oneiric and precise?
<micahg> ricotz: now that the betas come a couple days after release, it doesn't pay to waste build time on precise for the stable releases, I can discuss with chrisccoulson about adding it to the {firefox,thunderbird}-stable PPA, but I  think he'll have a similar response
<dobey> mterry: the changes probably seem a lot bigger than they actually are, though; new autotools on oneiric seems to have created a huge diff for my two; and the control panel one is mostly changes to the qt UI which isn't packaged yet
<mterry> k
<micahg> ricotz: shouldn't be, I do hear the argument a little stronger for thunderbird than firefox though, unfortunately, I don't have thunderbird 9 for oneiric yet due to some bzr branch issues which I'll resolve over the weekend probably
<ricotz> micahg, yes, thunderbird is what i am more worried about
<dobey> mterry: thanks :)
<mterry> dobey, so I see that ralsina is usually the distro acceptance person for U1 stuff?
<dobey> mterry: huh?
<mterry> dobey, I looked at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuEngineering/12.04/UpstreamDevelopment/ProjectTracking
<mterry> dobey, I'm not sure in this new Acceptance Criteria world, but maybe this has to go through ralsina?
<dobey> mterry: i don't really know what that page means
<mterry> dobey, ah, well in an attempt to make precise work all the time, so that teams don't block other teams from getting their work done, there is a renewed focus on automated and manual tests, as well as people responsible for signing off that an upstream is good test-wise and that a given release is ready to enter the distro
<dobey> mterry: right; so, these releases are also off a stable-3-0 branch, which we only backport things too after they've been tested in trunk
<mterry> dobey, right.  so you as upstream are signing off on them.  but distro also has a sign off step, owned by ralsina
<dobey> mterry: what does it mean to sign off on something there?
<dobey> mterry: ralsina, not having upload priveleges to any of the packages, probably doesn't make sense to be that person, either, does he?
<mterry> dobey, it means to run the automated tests again in a 12.04 environment and run some (manual or automatic) integration tests
<mterry> dobey, as for ralsina being appropriate, I don't know.  Let me see who put ralsina down...
<dobey> i think it was joshua; but i think someone told him we need to have our projects on that page, and that was all he was told
<mterry> dobey, yeah joshua
<mterry> dobey, who normally helps with the reviews/packaging?  kenvandine?
<dobey> ken, seb
<dobey> well, so; that's also going to change in the next few weeks; i am going to propose a new delegated team for the u1 packages, so we don't have to go hunt people down to sponsor our packages all the time
<micahg> dobey: you actually want a packageset, I need to fix that wiki page
<dobey> yes, and i think a team to own the packageset, no?
<micahg> all managed packagesets have associated teams now to make adding people easier, but that's an implementation detail
<dobey> right, and the wiki seems to call the combination "delegated team"
<micahg> then people can apply for upload rights to the packageset and we just add them to the associated team (but the team part isn't something non-DMB members should really have to worry about)
<micahg> dobey: right, I think that's wrong, a delegated team is something like ubuntu-desktop that can approve uploaders on their own
<dobey> well the wiki says it can go either way
<micahg> right, I need to fix the wiki :), maybe during vacation
<dobey> anyway
<dobey> back to the problem at hand
<dobey> mterry: i guess i can sign off on them, en absentee for ralsina? :)
<mterry> dobey, probs not  :)  I can send an email to Jason and cc you to try to find someone else since ralsina can't upload the packages
<dobey> ugh
<mterry> dobey, the whole point of this is to avoid doing things like cowboying packages in on Fridays before holidays  ;)
<dobey> some of them were proposed on tuesday :(
<dobey> and we will have a release day on jan 3, as well; the day we all return from holiday
<mterry> dobey, well since we apparently don't have a distro person to sign off on it, it could have been proposed a month ago and still blocked on distro readiness
<dobey> which is entirely crap, if you are going to have releases every 2 weeks :)
<dobey> kenvandine: ^^ sign off on it. you know you want to. it's all good. :)
<mterry> dobey, releases every 2 weeks is fine!  you just need to find an actual distro-readiness owner
<dobey> me! :)
<mterry> until that happens, no ubuntuone releases can enter the archive
<mterry> dobey, you're the upstream owner
<dobey> mterry: ken is listed in all 3 columns for gwibber
<dobey> and pittin in all 3 for jockeyâ¦
<mterry> dobey, yar, it's a sliding scale of importance and disruptiveness.  Talk to managers if you want to argue about this
<dobey> i just want to get the packages in. heck, pretty much all the changes in ubuntuone-client-gnome and libubuntuone, are in precise already anyway :(
<mterry> dobey, ?  then what're the merges for?
<dobey> the only things that aren't really, are being regenerated with new autotools, adding a -Wno-error=, and version bump.
<dobey> mterry: new releases since the patches are included upstream now. and to get us in the habit of having bi-weekly releases
<dobey> mterry: there are most likely going to be little to no changes in everything for our releases on jan 3, but we want to build the habit of timed releases, regardless
<dobey> we even have milestones on the stable branches for all our releases all the way up to final freeze :(
<mterry> dobey, this is all good stuff.  I'm just saying that distro has a new acceptance process and I don't want to short circuit it
<kenvandine> mterry, preach it brother!
<dobey> i don't either, but i don't want to make worthless releases that users can't test, for 6 weeks, while we try to figure out what the wiki page means. i'm not trying to argue about it, either; but i've spent 3 days this week doing basically nothing but releases. :-/
<mterry> kenvandine, do you know who was expected to be the distro sign-off'er for U1 stuff?  Is it you?
<dobey> i know rick has been assigning some bugs to kenvandine when we landed some fixes in trunk, to put them in ubuntu
<kenvandine> probably me
<dobey> kenvandine: can you sign off on the uploads, please?
<kenvandine> i would rather not on friday before everyone goes away for a week...
<kenvandine> any important fixes?
<kenvandine> how risky?
<kenvandine> dobey, i thought you were going to propose them to me yesterday?
<dobey> kenvandine: did i not link you to them? and you said you were really busy as well
<kenvandine> dobey, no... no links
<dobey> i think the risk is quite low
<kenvandine> i might not have been able to get to it then either
 * kenvandine reads scrollback for links
<dobey> i can re-paste
<dobey> https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu/precise/ubuntuone-control-panel/ubuntuone-control-panel-2.99.0/+merge/86455
<dobey> https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/precise/ubuntuone-client-gnome/release-2-99-0/+merge/86488
<dobey> https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/precise/libubuntuone/release-2-99-0/+merge/86624
<dobey> also have a new package 'dirspec', and an ubuntuone-dev-tools which depends on it
<dobey> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/907888 is the bug for dirspec with the files; i don't know if Laney approved/uploaded it though.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 907888 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] dirspec" [High,In progress]
<dobey> https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/oneiric/ubuntuone-dev-tools/release-020/+merge/75196 is the dev-tools that depends on it
<kenvandine> mterry, the distro signoff person has to be someone from platform right?
<dobey> err, no that isn't
<dobey> doh
<mterry> kenvandine, I assume
<dobey> stupid firefox history
<dobey> https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/precise/ubuntuone-client-gnome/release-2-99-0/+merge/86488 is the dev-tools merge
<kenvandine> dobey, how important is the new package?
<dobey> kenvandine: very; we need to MIR it, and get it on the CD, as we'll be switching all the ubuntuone python code to use it
<dobey> instead of python-xdg, which is unmaintained and not cross-platform
<dobey> and in a few weeks, i'll probably write up a post strongly suggesting other python projects which depend on python-xdg currently, to switch to it
<kenvandine> dobey, are you going to be checking in on irc or checking email next week?
<micahg> dobey: you do realize there are other rdepends of python-xdg in main, right?
<dobey> kenvandine: yes
<kenvandine> dobey, i'll review them today and upload them on monday
<dobey> micahg: yes. and all of them need to move off of it i think; and when i think dirspec is ready for them to do that, i will be strongly suggesting it. :)
<kenvandine> at least then if we need to scramble to fix the distro it isn't on christmas day :)
<dobey> we won't need to scramble to fix the distro :(
<kenvandine> dobey, famous last words
<kenvandine> i seem to recall ted saying that about dbusmenu once on a friday
<micahg> dobey: also, anything cross-distro should really be done through freedesktop.org as pyxdg is
<kenvandine> that was no fun
<dobey> micahg: freedesktop.org is a royal waste of time.
<kenvandine> dobey, i am sure everything will be fine... but we don't like to go all john wayne on our users :)
<dobey> meh
<dobey> chicken ;)
<dobey> or should i sayâ¦
<dobey> "What are ya? Yeller?"
<Laney> dobey: no I did not. Perhaps tomorrow if you still need it.
<Laney> keep the bug status updated or something
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> dobey, most of the control panel changes are to the qt code
<dobey> kenvandine: right, which isn't even packaged in ubuntu yet :)
<kenvandine> lowers the risk
<kenvandine> poor gtk
<dobey> right, which is why i say this stuff is all pretty low risk. :)
<kenvandine> dobey, ubuntuone-client-gnome FTBFS
<kenvandine> the patches need to be removed
<dobey> eh, didn't i do that? grr
<kenvandine> which worries me a bit.. makes me wonder if you even tested it :)
<dobey> hrmm; i wonder why they didn't conflict when i did merge-upstream. that is weird
<dobey> the whole "3.0 (quilt)" having auto-applied patches is very confusing :(
<dobey> s/auto/pre/
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> dobey, also in libubuntuone you should add changelog entries for the debian/control changes
<micahg> dobey: I don't believe that's the case anymore with dpkg 1.16.1
<dobey> micahg: you mean it doesn't pre-apply them any more?
<kenvandine> dobey, i commented on those in the merge proposals
<micahg> dobey: oh, wait, I guess it does in the source upload and then unapplies them locally
<kenvandine> let me know when it is fixed and i'll look again
<dobey> kenvandine: ubuntuone-client-gnome should be fixed now
<kenvandine> dobey, thx
<micahg> oh, hmm, not sure if that's right either :0/, that could only be with the option to not apply patches by default
<dobey> micahg: see. confusing.
<dobey> kenvandine: and libu1 fixed as well
<kenvandine> dobey, ok... these are REALLY  low risk changes... i'll test locally and if all goes well i'll upload them
<kenvandine> if they break, i'll hunt you down :)
<kenvandine> dobey, i am not going to do dirspec now though
<kenvandine> i have other stuff i really want to finish before the break
<dobey> kenvandine: thanks much
<kenvandine> np
<kenvandine> dobey, are you staying in VA for the holiday?
 * kenvandine can't believe he just turned on the air conditioning
<dobey> kenvandine: yeah, am not going anywhere
<kenvandine> too warm for christmas!
<dobey> maybe will go out to the garage some, or to the pub; but that's about it :)
<kenvandine> :)
<micahg> that would be a welcome change from the 30s in Chicago :)
<dobey> not too warm here
<dobey> just a bit warmer, and it would be perfect
<kenvandine> dobey, control panel fail...
<kenvandine>     from ubuntuone.controlpanel.utils import (ERROR_TYPE, ERROR_MESSAGE,
<kenvandine> ImportError: No module named utils
<kenvandine> dobey, fix debian/python-ubuntuone-control-panel.install
<dobey> ugh
<dobey> kenvandine: that's nessita's branch and she's already on holiday. :-/
<kenvandine> ok, i'll fix it
<dobey> thanks
<kenvandine> np
<kenvandine> micahg, it is 74 here...
<micahg> well, i'm wearing a short sleeve shirt :)
<kenvandine> i guess i should enjoy it before going to budapest in january, that is going to be cold!
 * micahg wishes for 74 again
<kenvandine> micahg, i am wearing flip flops :)
<micahg> kenvandine: cold like Chicago :)
<Nafallo> kenvandine: ooh. you got a weather forecast? :-)
<kenvandine> Nafallo, no... but everyone keeps asking me if i am crazy for going to budapest in january
<kenvandine> that can't be good
<Nafallo> kenvandine: pfff, just tell them you're going to Budapest... not Lulea in north Sweden ;-)
<Nafallo> (where facebook is building weathercooled DCs :-)
<kenvandine> hehe
<dobey> i am glad i am not going to budapest :)
<kenvandine> dobey, ubuntuone-client-gnome is causing nautilus to crash
<dobey> eh?
<dobey> works ok here
<kenvandine> crashes on both of my precise boxes
<kenvandine> dobey, stacktrace coming
<dobey> my precise laptop actually locked up hard while doing an apt-get upgrade last night. :(
<dobey> i haven't turned it back on yet, though
<dobey> the older version crashed it on precise though, after the glib update to 2.31
<kenvandine> dobey, bug 908261
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 908261 in ubuntuone-client-gnome "nautilus crashed with SIGSEGV in g_closure_invoke()" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/908261
<kenvandine> it did?
<kenvandine> never for me...
<dobey> yeah, because there was a bug in the .convert; at least g-s-d crashed because of it, i thought nautilus did too
<kenvandine> actually, in  a fresh session it doesn't crash until i browse to the ~/Ubuntu One directory
<kenvandine> gsd is crashing as well
<kenvandine> apport isn't catching it though
<kenvandine> once i browse to my Ubuntu One directory, it crashes everytime i start nautilus back up
<kenvandine> until i logout
<dobey> weird
<dobey> am doing dpkg --configure -a on laptop right now
<dobey> the software-center postinst is evil
<dobey> my hdd light is going crazy, for an absurdly long period of time :(
<dobey> did something change in nautilus recently?
<dobey> laptop updated
<kenvandine> dobey, downgrading libsyncdaemon-1.0-1 to 2.0.0-0ubuntu4 fixed it
<dobey> huh, no crash here
<dobey> and nothing has changed in libsyncdaemon, so that is weird
<dobey> i am on 32 bit though
<dobey> oh now it's crashed
<dobey> that took a while
<kenvandine> it crashes once i browse to a shared folder
<kenvandine> ok... i updated the bug to ubuntuone-client
<kenvandine> uploading this now
<dobey> wtf.
<kenvandine> dobey, kind of weird that libubuntuone has a build dep on libsyncdaemon-1.0-dev (>= 2.99.0) but not a depends
<dobey> come on apport retracer
<kenvandine> i guess i just haven't browsed a shared folder in a while
<kenvandine> so not a new bug
<dobey> well, i'm sure plenty of people do
<dobey> kenvandine: hrmm; i just updated the existing version numbers to the new ones in the control file
<kenvandine> yeah, but maybe it doesn't really depend on the newer version
<dobey> oh, actually a bit of libsyncdaemon did change, but it was only the part that talks to SSO, because there was an api change in ubuntu-sso-client
<dobey> so it does need that to work with the new ubuntu-sso-client in precise
<dobey> ah well
<dobey> now this nautilus crash has upset me :(
<dobey> heh
<kenvandine> dobey, all uploaded
<kenvandine> if you get a patch for libsyncdaemon, let me know :)
<dobey> thanks
<kenvandine> now that i know that is crashing, it is bugging me too
<dobey> meh, apport doesn't auto-attach relevant xsession-errors bits
<dobey> kenvandine: are you coming to VA next week? or working? or just staying at home?
<kenvandine> staying home
<dobey> cool
<dobey> why isn't it crashing on oneiric. bah
<dobey> fml it is surprisingly hard to find swordfish here, without having to drive 20-30 miles.
<Nafallo> dobey: apt-cache show swordfish
<Nafallo> ;-)
<dobey> oh well; day is done, it is.
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-12-24
<BigWhale> Wouldn't it be nice if Unity/compiz remembered position and placement of windows? I know I can do that in CCSM, but per application option would really be awesome.
<Laney> dobey: run-tests mentions the Affero GPL
<dobey> it does? odd
<Laney> :-)
<dobey> not that it matters since nothing in it is actually defensible in court :)
<Laney> well, indeed, i'm not going to block on it
<Laney> you might want to fix it though
<dobey> yeah, i will. thanks :)
<Laney> dobey: I made these changes
<Laney>   [ Iain Lane ]
<Laney>   * rules: Move sequence name before parameters in dh call.
<Laney>   * copyright; Add LGPL3 header
<Laney>   * control: Remove obsolete XB-Python-Version
<Laney> want to see a diff?
<Laney> otherwise good to go imo
<Laney> not that any archive admins will be reviewing for a while :P
<dobey> thanks;
<dobey> only one not quite clear to me is what you mean by "sequence name" in the rules file?
<Laney> put $@ before --with
<dobey> is it supposed to be called that way? i thought it was the other way round
<Laney> I think higher compat levels enforce this
<Laney> SYNOPSIS dh sequence [--with addon[,addon ...]] [--list] [debhelperÂ options]
<dobey> ah; i had seen it the other way somewhere, and thought it was correct. i'll remember that, thanks.
<Laney> np
<Laney> ok, doing
<Laney> there we go
<dobey> cheers! maybe i'll get lucky and someone will poke at the NEW list during the break :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-12-25
<BigWhale> Who decides which application will be included in the official repository? And if it is too late to get something into Pangolin repository?
<bjsnider> no it isn't
<dobey> BigWhale: it's a concerted effort; and it's not too late yet. feature freeze is a bit off still, but earlier is better
<BigWhale> Cool. Thanks for the info.
<BigWhale> I'll try to pull it off.
<BigWhale> If I get all the required permissions from previous author.
<dobey> BigWhale: what is it?
<BigWhale> This https://launchpad.net/kazam
<dobey> ah ok
<BigWhale> dobey, people actually liked the app, OMG also ran an article on it and I did some work to replace ffmpeg with gstreamer, the author decided he won't continue the work, so ...
<bjsnider> BigWhale, so it's dead?
<BigWhale> You're name probably isn't Jim... but ... It's dead Jim.
<BigWhale> (comma missing there)
<bjsnider> why should it be included in precise if it's dead?
<BigWhale> bjsnider, I emailed original author today asking him if I can get permissions for Launchpad so that I can pick it up.
<bjsnider> i see
<BigWhale> bjsnider, I'd like to work on it
<BigWhale> and continue maintaining it.
<bjsnider> you have the programming acumen to handle it?
<bjsnider> of course if he doesn't give you permission you can just fork it
<BigWhale> bjsnider, I believe so. For precise I'd just patch things up so it would work. Then I'd like to rewrite GUI in Vala.
<BigWhale> And I'd prefer not to fork it. Sometimes it just creates confusion.
<BigWhale> docs on ppa versioning are a bit confusing
<dobey> BigWhale: what sort of package are you trying to version in your ppa?
<BigWhale> well not exactly confusing, I can understand why and what I have to change, just not sure where... :>
<BigWhale> dobey, I'm trying to package fixed Kazam into a ppa
<dobey> are you building nightlies, or a plain debian package?
<BigWhale> just a deb package, no need for nightlies for now
<BigWhale> oh changelog
<dobey> yes, changelog
<BigWhale> Denied, rejected!? Oh my gawd! :'(
<BigWhale> :>
<BigWhale> Perhaps it doesn't like that I changed my GPG key just recently ...
<BigWhale> hmm, two files were acceted, but .changes file was rejected ...
<dobey> ignore those errors
<BigWhale> yeah I noticed that package was uploaded and it is being built
<BigWhale> this auto build is really neat
<BigWhale> Package built, app is installable, ppa is working, app is working, pushing changes ... yay.
<bjsnider> BigWhale, just slap ~ppa1 or something on the end of the version string in changelog
<BigWhale> bjsnider, I just added ppa1 to the end, docs didn't say anything about ~ :>
<dobey> yes they do
<dobey> but really it should be $UPSTREAM_VERSION-$NEXT_DEBIAN_VERSION~$SERIES(N)
<dobey> so 0.0.0-0ubuntu2~oneiric1 for example
<BigWhale> there must be many docs
<BigWhale> many different docs
<BigWhale> https://help.launchpad.net/Packaging/PPA/BuildingASourcePackage#versioning
<BigWhale> here's where I looked
<dobey> oh, it has two different sets of versioning recommendations, which both pretty much suck
<dobey> :-/
<BigWhale> It says that I should add ~oneiric1 ...
<BigWhale> after the ppa1
<dobey> ah yes, it also says that
<dobey> but the ppa1 in there is just bad :-/
<BigWhale> I followed this example: "To do this, add the suffix ppan (where n is your package's revision number). Two examples: "
<BigWhale> but I'll change to whatever it is supposed to be. :)
<dobey> i think someone needs to fix the docs
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-12-17
<micahg> stgraber: not that I know of, did it happen with 17?
<chris_gr> Good morning to everyone,is this the official ubuntu support channel?
<jbicha> chris_gr: no, that's #ubuntu
<chris_gr> ok ty
<pitti> Good morning
<stgraber> micahg: I think so, timing looks plausible
<Laney> hey
 * Laney suspects a quiet day ;-)
<pitti> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey pitti, less stressed now that I have all of my Christmas shopping done :P
<Laney> you?
<pitti> Laney: hah, good one
<pitti> Laney: less stressed now that the belt examination is behind me :)
<Laney> oh, yeah I saw that on G+ - congratulations!
<Laney> I guess that took a lot of preparation
<pitti> some 4 weeks of intensively training all the various parts, and then just generally going to training regularly
<mitya57> hi, can anybody please comment on lp:~mitya57/ubuntu-themes/remove-desktop?
<Laney> mitya57: can you check with people in #ubuntu-unity that they are unused?
<Laney> and explain the packaging changes in d/changelog please
<mitya57> Laney: will do both things now
<Laney> cheers, and thanks for the change
<Laney> let me know the outcome and I can merge it in for you
<Laney> well, I hope I can
<Laney> does anything break if we enable the wayland backend in gtk3?
<Laney> bug #954352
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 954352 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu Raring) "Enable wayland backend" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/954352
 * mitya57 hates MSU's WiFi
<mitya57> [15:29]   <mitya57> Laney: re ^^: they don't reply, so I've requested their review at the mp
<Laney> mitya57: OK, sure. I'm not subscribed to it but feel free to ping me in a couple of days.
<mitya57> Laney: OK.
<czajkowski> anyone know where I'd find Bilal Akhtar  on irc or his ir nick ?
<jibel> czajkowski, https://launchpad.net/+search?field.text=Bilal+Akhtar ?
<jibel> he doesn't seem to be online
<czajkowski> jibel: cheers just wondered if he hung out in here
<czajkowski> http://blog.itsbilal.com/index.php/2012/12/connect-an-android-4-0-phonetablet-to-ubuntu-the-reliable-way/  following this as want some xmas tunes on phone and wondering why we have to hack a 12.10 desktop just to get my phone to talk to it :/
<jibel> czajkowski, he used to hang out here and various other ubuntu channels but haven't seen him recently
<czajkowski> left comment on the blog, time to catch a flight, thanks jibel
<jibel> yw
<micahg> stgraber: unfortunately, I don't see anything upstream about people having issues with paper size
<xnox> czajkowski: libmtp from my ppa should have just fixed your phone to e.g. sync music to it via rhythmbox & banshee. Was it not enough? Or do you actually want to browse folders on it?
<robru> cyphermox, ping
<cyphermox> robru: pong!
<robru> cyphermox, hey! did you get that email about the SRU stuff? do you have a minute to help me with that?
<cyphermox> robru: I didn't see, but yeah I have time, just a second
<robru> ok
<robru> cyphermox, it was sent to mathieu@canonical.com, is that incorrect?
<cyphermox> yeah ;)
<robru> cyphermox, ahhhh, I'll forward it to you then. what's the right address?
<robru> cyphermox, (that's the address listed in the company directory...)
<cyphermox> oh wait, it is the correct address
<cyphermox> I mean I got the email, I'm looking at the bug
<robru> oh, o
<robru> ok
<cyphermox> so, we should figure out why it's just Fix Committed and not yet Fix Released, as in why it's not yet in the compiz in raring
<cyphermox> SRUs should have their fixes be in the dev release first at least
<cyphermox> then if it's indeed a small fix you'll want to target add a target to the bug for Quantal -- you should have a link "Nominate for release" for that
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-12-18
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> jasoncwarner: hey Jason, how are you? Still online?
<Laney> hey
<Laney> Can someone tell me how to handle d/changelog in the daily autolanding branches?
<Laney> looking at https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/ubuntu-themes/remove-desktop/+merge/139264
 * mitya57 thought that the automatic uploader would replace the "-- " line anyway
<mitya57> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ps-jenkins/ubuntu-themes/latestsnapshot/revision/266/debian/changelog
<mitya57> like here ^^
<Laney> I thought they were generated from the commit messages
<Laney> jibel: hey, ^-- do you know perchance?
<Daviey> Laney: I thought the mail to -devel said it wasn't doing that.. You might want to read for clarity.
<Laney> Daviey: thanks for the clue, let me check
<Laney> Daviey: Do you have a reference? I can't seem to find it ...
<Daviey> Laney: Re: [ubuntu/raring-proposed] libunity-webapps 2.4.3daily12.11.29-0ubuntu1 (Accepted) - 29th Nov, Thread starter Micah
<Laney> So it says it's autogenerated from bugs or NEWS
<Laney> do you think that means it's OK to fill it in in the absence of those things?
<jibel> Laney, changelog is generated from the bugs fixed by the upload
<Laney> jibel: Should we avoid touching debian/changelog then?
<Daviey> jibel: I was going to chime into the thread, but it seemed wise just to 'give space' as it was close to bikeshedding.. But what we do with openstack uploads built from VCS is.. Use the first line of the VCS commit message, and wrap at 80 chars.  If it has a LP bug reference, we look up the bug title and use that instead.
<Daviey> scripted obv.
<Daviey> Requires discipline on the committers to have a clean commit log.
<Laney> so mitya57 should link the bugs to the branch and not change the changelog or?
<jibel> Laney, from the code direct modifications to debian/changelog should be merged as it is not considered a packaging change, but that'd require a confirmation from didrocks
<Laney> jibel: will anything break too badly if we try it and see?
<jibel> Laney, no, the worst thing that might happen is to force a manual publication
<Laney> alright, let's see ;-)
<Laney> mitya57: what about the pngs?
 * mitya57 looks
<Laney> infact then places becomes completely empty if those are removed
<mitya57> $ find . -name *.png
<mitya57> ./distributor-logo.png
<mitya57> what pngs?
<Laney> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mitya57/ubuntu-themes/remove-desktop/files/head:/places/128/
<Laney> for example
<mitya57> What is that doing outside ubuntu-mono-*? I'll remove it.
<mitya57> should I remove my debian/changelog part and link the branch to a bug?
<Laney> nah, leave it, I want to see what happens
<mitya57> :)
<Laney> plus it's better than just a bug title anyway
<mitya57> yes, but titles sometimes say the reverse to what should be in the changelog
<mitya57> "- libunity9 now depends on unity-common which depends on compiz (LP: #1062099)" - example
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1062099 in libunity (Ubuntu Quantal) "libunity9 now depends on unity-common which depends on compiz" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1062099
<Laney> yeah
<mitya57> I've updated the branch, btw
<Laney> I don't think bug titles are a really good thing to use here on their own
<Laney> perhaps "Commit message
<Laney>   - fixes <bug title> (LP: #xxx)"
<Laney> ta, pullin'
<Laney> mitya57: merged, thank you!
<mitya57> nice, thanks
<Laney> apparently I can push to that branch ;-)
<mhr3> desrt, gdbus question - say i have an object that i'm about to export (ie call register_object), but need to wait on something async before doing so, is there a race-free way to do that?
<desrt> this is a very old question :)
<desrt> you mean like waiting to see if you successfully acquire a name? :)
<mhr3> i know, and old answer was no afair :)
<desrt> it's still the same.
<desrt> do the export preemptively
<mhr3> i can't
<desrt> you won't get any calls on the object until after you return to the loop
<mhr3> the object has props that are initialized async
<desrt> heh
<mhr3> so i'm screwed
<mhr3> i'll go cry to david then
<desrt> ya
<desrt> i was going to recommend that :)
<mterry> Does anyone know about the youtube webapps SRU that robru was working on?  I have a note from didrocks to help it along this week.  I don't see any SRU bugs for it
<Laney> mterry: try asking #webapps
<mterry> Laney, fair enough
<Laney> I did however just notice that unity-webapps-youtube is newer in quantal-updates than raring ...
 * Laney whips up some SQL to find out if anything else is like that
<mterry> Laney, :-/
<micahg> Laney: I thought the AAs have a warn script for stuff like that
<Laney> micahg: I dunno
<Laney> it's only libimobiledevice unity-webapps-twitter unity-webapps-youtube if my script is right
<qengho> Do we have a meeting today?
<Laney> nope
<qengho> Ah, okay.
<qengho> I'll dump my status anyway.
<qengho> desktop-r-chromiumbrowser-improvements]
<qengho> Looking okay. Falling prey to Hofstadter's Law.
<qengho> 1) Still working on getting all stable-ubuntu released, but actually releasing is postponed until #2 is fixed.
<qengho> 2) A new bug that makes webapps ask for permissions unnecessarily. Could be because of outdated unity-chromium-extension packages. ##webapps knows of it. Normal maintainer is on baby-leave, so I'm looking too.  LP#1091334
<qengho> 3) Someone volunteered to translate a new language, so I guess I have to give mo
<qengho> re thought to launchpad translations soon.
<qengho> EOF
<micahg> qengho: 1 is only blocked on 2 for quantal, we can still update the rest
<micahg> qengho: and if that's only with .97, let's push .95
<qengho> micahg: Hrm, I don't know if it's only .97.  Will check .95 too.
<qengho> micahg: I'm still working on the others.  Context-switching on long runs of compiles.  I might have a few ready today.
<qengho> Lunch.  Back in a bit.
<Sweetshark> status here:
<Sweetshark> 1/ beta2 tagged upstream: https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/gitweb?p=core.git;a=commit;h=4104d660979c57e1160b5135634f732918460a05
<Sweetshark> 2/ QA Marathon running, supported by ubuntu bibisect and prereleases: http://skyfromme.wordpress.com/2012/12/12/libreoffice-test-marathon-bibisect-4-0-and-ubuntu-packages/
<Sweetshark> 3/ https://plus.google.com/113210431006401244170/posts/E7Ktup1Aq4M bug and fix identified, applied upstream, next release in end of Jan., we should fasttrack that
<Laney> cyphermox: dude! you here?
<mterry_> Anyone here with 12.10 w/ an intel GPU that wants to help verify an SRU?  Wooo!
<Laney> or someone who knows abotu webapp packaging
<Laney> I want to upload those no-change rebuilds but I'm scared about touching the packages
<mterry_> Laney, I know that they generate the various source packages from a template
<Laney> yeah I saw that it's all bundled into one repository
<Laney> I don't want to pull in whatever upstream changes there happen to be though
<mterry_> Laney, is this a separate thing from pushing the SRU into raring?
<Laney> no
<Laney> it's exactly that
<Laney> I could just add a .1 on the end
<mterry_> Laney, yeah, I'd just do that
<Laney> ack
<mlankhorst> did I miss meeting?
<mterry_> mlankhorst, didn't have it (holidays)
<mlankhorst> yay
<cyphermox> Laney: I'm there, sorry I didn't see your ping
<robru> does anybody know what it means when D-Feet gives the error message "nn:expected value"? I think it might have something to do with dbus method signature errors, but I'm pretty sure I have the method signature correct, so I don't really know what it's trying to tell me
<bryce> robert_ancell, not seeing RAOF or TheMuso, and jasoncwarner is apparently without internet.  I've been on vacation since the last meeting and only been doing bug work today so have nothing to report.  You have anything to discuss?  If not, short meeting yay.
<robert_ancell> I like short meetings :)
<bryce> robert_ancell, great, well have a nice day.  :-)
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-12-19
<RAOF> Es es es es es are youze.
<Sarvatt> RAOF, winner of the most nonsensical IRC comment of the year award.
<robru> Sarvatt, RAOF: I understood 'SRUs' quite clearly.
<Sarvatt> oh, makes sense now :)
<RAOF> Ding!
<Mirv> mording
<Al562> Hello, does anyone know how to reset keyboard shortcuts back to default??
<pitti> Bonjour Ã  tous!
<tjaalton> so, every time I insert an audio cd, nautilus adds ~17 "devices" to the list, also on the dash
<tjaalton> this on quantal
<tjaalton> ejecting it doesn't make them go away
<tjaalton> and when the disc is mounted they all are shown mounted
<tjaalton> killing gvfs-udisks2-volume-monitor resumed sanity
<bizhanMona> HI I am using ubuntu 12.04, currently we are using a application logger based on log4j which is a rotating logger. This utility is a very older, I was wondering if there is a newer logger we can use? thx
<mitya57> bizhanMona: that's probably not a right channel to ask your question, but: http://logback.qos.ch/reasonsToSwitch.html
<bizhanMona> mitya57: thank you and forgive my ignorance.
<mvo> no seb128? mehhh .. I wonder if someone minds if I update to the latest pycairo?
<Laney> mvo: If it's API compatible etc, I'd say go for it if you want it.
<Laney> preferably via debian if possible
<mvo> Laney: cool, I don't want to step on toes there, but will look into a update, looks like there are a few changes in the build system though
<jbicha> is it ok if I update gsettings-desktop-schemas to 3.7.3 since it just adds schemas? or should we wait until later in the cycle?
<jbicha> on the other hand, gnome-shell won't actually respect the new schemas so it might just confuse people looking in dconf-editor so I guess we better not
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-12-20
<czajkowski> hmmm latest updates on 12.10 is causing me no end of woes on compiz crashes, bt it wont open up a crash report for me to follow up on it :/  anyone seeing anything similar?
<mhr3> larsu, what installs com.canonical.indicator.sound?
<mhr3> and hello btw :)
<larsu> mhr3, indicator-sound
<larsu> mhr3, and hello btw :)
<mhr3> larsu, that exact pkg?
<mhr3> includes the schema?
<larsu> mhr3, yeah, I think so. I couldn't imagine anything else creating that schema
<larsu> let me check
<larsu> $ dpkg -S /usr/share/glib-2.0/schemas/com.canonical.indicator.sound.gschema.xml
<larsu> indicator-sound: /usr/share/glib-2.0/schemas/com.canonical.indicator.sound.gschema.xml
<larsu> mhr3, ^^
<mhr3> hmm, now i wonder how come that libunity tests pass then
<larsu> hehe
<larsu> a bug?
<jbicha> mhr3: is it because unity depends on indicator-sound?
<mhr3> unity might, but libunity doesn't
<attente> is anyone able to bzr branch ubuntu:empathy?
<attente> sorry, never mind, i did lp:empathy instead
<mhr3> oh, i see why do they pass
<mhr3> TEST: test-blacklist-crash... (pid=12577)
<mhr3> (process:12577): libunity-WARNING **: unity-sound-menu.vala:149: Could not create a desktopappinfo instance from app: rhythmbox.desktop
<mhr3> (process:12577): libunity-CRITICAL **: unity-sound-menu.vala:120: Cannot locate the Desktop file
<mhr3> (process:12577): libunity-CRITICAL **: unity_mpris_gateway_export: assertion `self != NULL' failed
<mhr3> (process:12577): libunity-CRITICAL **: unity_mpris_gateway_unexport: assertion `self != NULL' failed
<mhr3> PASS: test-blacklist-crash
<mhr3> tests that really isn't testing anything
<Sweetsha1k> 22:23 <@shm_get> Sweetsha1k I could not help 1/ I was not here, 2/  http://paste.ubuntu.com/1452996/plain/ apparently request a launchpad login
<Sweetsha1k> ^^ why are we doing this ^&*^ btw? The only thing it does is: a/ make ubuntu-users chance of help go to zero on a general question b/ make people hate ubuntu
<desrt> Sweetsha1k: people were using it for distribution of malware
<desrt> requiring signon short-circuited that
<robru> this is why we can't have nice things :-(
<desrt> fpaste solves the problem in a much nicer way
<desrt> it asks for a captcha after a certain number of views
<Sweetsha1k> desrt: yep.
<Sweetsha1k> desrt: the problem is, people arent even noticing it. they are signed on, use paste.u.c without a hassle, and ask over at e.g. #libreoffice and get flamed by someone who actually wanted to help them ...
<desrt> Sweetsha1k: i use fpaste :)
<Sweetsha1k> I use good ol' pastebin, it does what I need. Its other users that get the trouble.
<Sweetsha1k> desrt: and if its 'hey, this is my first build and I have this problem?' post that sucks ...
<rickspencer3> hey all ... let's say I had "a friend" who wanted to buy a game to "test" steam on Ubuntu
<rickspencer3> which would you recommend?
<bcurtiswx> TF2 is free, thats OK
<bcurtiswx> World of goo has high ratings, it's more like a puzzle game, but fun too
<rickspencer3> bcurtiswx, ok, I'll let him know
<rickspencer3> bcurtiswx, well, this friend has played world of goo, and found it to be kind of like work
<bcurtiswx> haha, so don't use the brain.. got it
<rickspencer3> bcurtiswx, anyway he/she is trying team fortress 2 ;)
<bcurtiswx> good, i'm waiting for counterstrike to make it to Linux, if that happens in the next century
<rickspencer3> tf2 is a 12.2 gb download?
<rickspencer3> woah
<bcurtiswx> orangebox is large
<bcurtiswx> but a lot of games run on it
<bcurtiswx> so i hope porting those to linux will be quick.. even in valve time..
<sarnold> rickspencer3: how much effort was it to go through the wine+windows steam route to unlock the beta?
<bcurtiswx> sarnold, it's open to everyone now
<bcurtiswx> store.steampowered.com
<rickspencer3> sarnold, I just downloaded directly from steam
<sarnold> bcurtiswx: oh, heh, so I'm back to nothing special? :)
<bcurtiswx> ;)
<sarnold> well, that's probably for the best. I let the whole wine+steam thing to unlock it block me from ever trying the beta...
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-12-21
<attente> hi desrt
<desrt> attente: hey
<desrt> attente: what's up?
<attente> desrt: you're back from poland?
<desrt> yup.  since a couple days ago.
<attente> how was it?
<desrt> busy
<desrt> you get much done these past weeks?
<attente> not really
<desrt> :(
<desrt> on vacation yet?
<attente> not really :(
<desrt> how are you 'not really' on vacation? :p
<attente> good question...
<attente> anyways
<attente> the module is not playing well with empathy
<desrt> does empathy have an app menu?
<attente> i believe so
<attente> yes it does
<desrt> ya.. no doubt GtkApplicationWindow is the source of your troubles
<attente> well
<desrt> time for some clever tricks :)
<attente> i fixed the module so it would fall back on the old menubar/action group if it had it
<attente> but this problem is a different one altogether
<attente> i can't even diagnose it
<desrt> the trouble is that you will have to add the actions from the GtkMenuBar action group to the existing action group of the window
<desrt> when does your vacation start?
<attente> desrt, this is fine actually
<attente> it's already done
<desrt> oh.  good :)
<attente> i have no idea
<attente> re: holiday
<desrt> maybe you should ask jasoncwarner_ :)
<desrt> my understanding is that the entire company is on vacation starting from a couple of days before christmas through to the new year
<desrt> i don't know exactly what 'a couple of days' is, though
<desrt> probably today is your last day, i guess
<attente> are you on holiday?
<desrt> ya
<desrt> for the past two weeks
<desrt> :D
<attente> ah, sorry
<desrt> no worries
<attente> that would explain the emptiness today
<attente> <insert end of the world joke here>
<desrt> ya
<larsu> desrt, attente, hi. The company's vacation is all through next week iirc
<larsu> (I took next week and the 31st)
<attente> hi larsu
<Sweetshark> yay, beta2 finished to build.
<robru> gooood morning desktop team!
<Sweetshark> goooood evening desktop team.
 * Sweetshark is off for holidays.
<desrt> robru: your move is complete, i guess?
<robru> desrt, ehhhhhhh
<robru> desrt, my stuff is still in storage in winnipeg and I'm living in a hotel in victoria.
<desrt> ahh
<desrt> the sweet life
<robru> desrt, aiming to find an apartment by feb 1st
<desrt> seen any curb stompings outside your hotel window yet?
<robru> desrt, thankfully not!
<desrt> so a step up!
<robru> quite!
<xnox> robru: Victoria, BC? That's a big move =)
 * xnox liked Winnipeg a lot.
<robru> xnox, yep! it's my lifelong dream to live here. I've loved this place since I was a kid!
<robru> xnox, you liked winnipeg? ever been there in winter? ;-)
<jbicha> xnox: what were you doing in Winnipeg?
<xnox> robru: jbicha: yeah I lived there for a whole year, so I did enjoy +30 in the summer & -45 in the winter ;-)
 * xnox remembers the days looking at -40 & wishing it was -45 cause then the school is closed.
<sarnold> haha
<xnox> jbicha: foreign exchange student living with a host family for one school year.
<xnox> here in UK they close schools at -10 or something silly like that.
<jbicha> oh wow
<jbicha> since when did the Desktop Team get overrun by Canadians?
<xnox> jbicha: when wasn't it, eh?! =)
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-12-22
<erappleman> hi, i found a really nasty modal dialogs bug that affects enterprise networks
<erappleman> oh hey jbicha, just the guy i was looking for
<erappleman> i found a modal dialogs bug that affects enterprise networks. if you do not supply a ca cert, your mouse is blocked from connecting or ignoring the prompt to supply one.
<erappleman> what package governs modal dialogs? i'd like to add it to the bug i filed: 1093188
<erappleman> bug 1093188
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1093188 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "Modal dialog does not permit connection if you fail you select a CA cert for an enterprise network" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1093188
<jbicha> erappleman: I don't have a WPA2 Enterprise connection but thanks for the bug, I think it's reported in the right place for now
<erappleman> jbicha, overlay-scrollbar is the culprit
<erappleman> if i start g-c-c with it disabled, no bug
<erappleman> i hate those scrollbars. they ruin everything and make point-on-the-bar scrolling impossible.
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-12-23
<sepisoad> Isn't it nice to integrate Open WebOS into Ubtunu Desktop, at least for tablet/mobile/TV version of unity. It has many cool features that can increase Unity usability
<tattimies> hallo
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-12-16
<pitti> Good morning
<darkxst> hi pitti
<pitti> hey darkxst
<darkxst> Laney, any chance you could do a saucy build of trusty webkitgtk on your special ppa? ppa builders still dislike webkit ;(
<Laney> morning
<darkxst> hey Laney
<Laney> darkxst: hmm
<darkxst> Laney, please!
<Laney> they all build for too many architectures
<Laney> also I'd rather not have to do it for every release
<Laney> did you try disabling debug symbols etc?
<darkxst> Laney, its only to fix Bug 1163886
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1163886 in webkit (Ubuntu) "software-center crashed with signal 5 with WebKit 2.0+" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1163886
<Laney> oh man we should SRU that
<darkxst> it has been SRU'ed
<darkxst> but we have a new webkit on the PPA's
<Laney> are you already ahead of saucy then?
<Laney> ._.
<darkxst> yes
<pitti> hey Laney, good morning
<Laney> hey pitti
<Laney> how are you?
<pitti> Laney: quite fine thanks! last week before holidays, and still so much stuff to do .. :)
<pitti> Laney: can merge your new dbusmock template today when you can clean it up (or tell me to do it myself if you  don't have time)
<Laney> I'll do it, sure, just catching up on weekend stuff atm
<Laney> all the things will still be there after holidays ;-)
<pitti> yes, and I don't want them to :)
<darkxst> Laney, so just this once, can you do it?
<darkxst> I tried disabling debug symbols in the past, but we have dbgsym's enabled on the ppa's
<Laney> it makes me edgy, the PPA you're talking about is for doing armhf test builds
<Laney> let me think about it
<xnox> ubiquity looks very weird with new gtk
<xnox> it's like 1.5 wider than it used to be
<darkxst> Laney, ok, let me know
<Laney> xnox: I guess file a bug, attach a screenshot and let larsu know its #
<xnox> Laney: i don't exclude that ubiquity is setting style / properties / etc wrong. Ubiquity code did grow since forever, and we do try hard to center re-position the main window.
 * xnox boots it in !chinese locale first
<xnox> btw Ubuntu Kylin default wallpaper is pure beauty.
<darkxst> xnox, I also have had reports that the partition resize slider is broken
<xnox> darkxst: i want a screenshot of that. because we did change in saucy the day before release, so it actually might be what it suppose to be.
 * xnox spins up a large vm to test that.
<darkxst> xnox, these are recent, since 3.10 landed, no slider shows up at all apparently
<darkxst> xnox, Bug 1260473
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1260473 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "The slide bar that allow to rezise the partition does not appear" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1260473
<xnox> darkxst: .... and no screenshot
 * xnox is not Neo to read visual data based on green scrolling text ;-)
<darkxst> no I don;t have a screenshot
<darkxst> numerous people are still complaining though....
<darkxst> although I guess thats about normal for the "maybe" install along-side option
<xnox> nah, it really is broken worse than it normally used to be.
<darkxst> xnox, ok, its hard to know sometimes, we get a lot of noise on g+ and mailing lists, from people that refuse to actually file bugs
<xnox> darkxst: who is "we"?
<darkxst> Ubuntu GNOME
<xnox> darkxst: well, i believe it's a gtk+3.10 regression, and as GNOME flavour you are best suited to take it up upstream =)
<xnox> ;-)
<Laney> you buck passer
<xnox> giggley giggley gi =)
<xnox> i've been fixing theming bugs in gtk/ubiquity since I started hacking on ubiquity
<xnox> i honestly fell like switching to qml/qt, but maybe that simply has it's own set of UI/themeing bugs.
<Laney> we should make sure to test ubiquity with new gtks really
<xnox> i don't think gtk based flavours will be happy, but then again, they'll just pick up the frontend maintainance, like kubuntu did for the qt frontend since forever.
<xnox> Laney: ubiquity - the gtk stress test, caught like 3 grave bugs in glade/gtkbuilder alone....
<darkxst> xnox, seems like a larsu thing really, I don't really have much to do with the gtk update (other than wanting it)... themeing is well beyond me
<xnox> darkxst: well, if one wants gtk update one gets bugs & regressions that come with it. So please help fix them, instead of complaining about the complaints you get =)
<xnox> anyway
<xnox> with the width bug, it feels like some rough widgets blows out of proportion.
<xnox> which is probably the full-ubiquity-window-width progressbar.
<darkxst> xnox, not complaining, just forwarding!
<xnox> darkxst: that doesn't help either. triaging bugs, usually involves filtering. e.g. marking the "missing diver bug" as confirmed and attaching screenshot.
<Laney> xnox: is it upstart-ish to have 'start <somejob>' in a pre-start script?
<xnox> Laney: yes.
<Laney> interesting
<xnox> Laney: it's a non-blocking way to do inverse of "start on starting me" in the "somejob"
<darkxst> xnox, I don't track ubiquity bugs, unless I happen to see them reported via iso tracker
<xnox> Laney: such that "somejob" doesn't need to know about all the reverse-alternatives it should be starting on.
<Laney> Hmm, I think you'd want it to be blocking usually
<Laney> like, you put it in pre-start because you need the job to run your main program
<darkxst> but I do see noise form the 'report-a-bug-phobes'
<darkxst> who when you tell them to run 'ubuntu-bug' say Its too hard
<Laney> https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/ubuntu-system-settings/welcome-wizard/+merge/186862
<Laney> the upstart stuff in there seems smelly to me
<Laney> wizard/main.cpp and the user session job
<Laney> xnox: please look
<xnox> Laney: you really don't want it blocking, otherwise one can easily end up in a dead-lock.
<xnox> Laney: if blocking is needed, one should use "start on starting" for one thing to block starting the other.
<Laney> how should one job make sure another one is running without the cooperation of that one?
<xnox> wait-for-state
<Laney> NEVER HEARD OF IT!
 * Laney rtfms
<xnox> typically one does "start foo" and then checks that "foo" is start/running, after a timeout
<xnox> one can write it manually, or use the magic job wait-for-state
<xnox> let me show you a good example.
<xnox> So in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/plymouth/+bug/967229
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 967229 in plymouth (Ubuntu) "Text mode shown briefly with various "cryptic" texts when logging out or shutting down" [High,Triaged]
<xnox> i proposed this: f
<xnox> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/158609890/message-less-shutdown.patch
<Laney> that should be in the cookbook
<xnox> it's a bit akward, because I first check that the job exists, since it might not.
<xnox> otherwise ti's straight forward.
<xnox> e.g. plymouth-shutdown, waits for lightdm to stop
<xnox> and rc [016] waits for plymouth-shutdown to start
<xnox> such that one gets "cryptic message less" shutdown.
<xnox> "flickerless" is a better term, I guess.
<Laney> ta, that's interesting
<xnox> also note https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/upstart/+bug/962047
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 962047 in upstart (Ubuntu) "document wait-for-state" [Medium,Confirmed]
<Laney> might want to change that assignment :-)
<xnox> Laney: i think the right solution is for upstart to implement states
<xnox> e.g. "when runlevel=2 and networking IFACE!=lo" thus start me when those conditions are satisfied and stop me when they are not
<xnox> such that e.g. restart networking works and doesn't bring down the machine to ~= runlevel 1.5
<Laney> well, in this case you want to be able to cause some state transitions to happen too
<xnox> when does osk keyboard start?
<Laney> apparently mterry knows this is a pile of hacks apparently
<Laney> from the comments
 * Laney is spooked by this
<Laney> "let the technical debt in and fix it later" is a model which scares me
<Laney> 'started unity8'
<xnox> Laney: I don't see how wizard will work without unity8, so ubuntu-system-settings-wizard should be: start on started unity and started maliit-server
<xnox> oh, but it's starts it's own session?!
<xnox> i thought ubuntu-touch-session is gone already.
<Laney> no idea
<xnox> how is this meant to work? or e.g. how does the existing tour-guide work?
<Laney> nah that still exists
<Laney> the normal greeter starts it
<Laney> I think this is about initial configuration
<xnox> cause the inital system setup is suppose to be part of the tour-guide (either before or after it, can't remember from design docs)
<Laney> seems like it should be a system job
<xnox> it's per user, as per design.
<xnox> not system-wide.
<Laney> or maybe even just started by unity8 if necessary
<Laney> ho hum
<pitti> Laney: sorry about https://code.launchpad.net/~laney/python-dbusmock/timedated-template/+merge/198976
<pitti> Laney: that's a bit strange, does timedatectl get the date itself, not from timedated?
<pitti> s/date/time zone/
<Laney> pitti: aha, of course, I even noticed that in the second testcase
<Laney> It gets the offset from localtime() or similar
<Laney> pitti: try now
<pitti> Laney: cheers
<pitti> Laney: merged
<Laney> \o/
<Laney> thanks, I'll leave it alone for now :P
<pitti> Laney: poke me when it gets urgent, otherwise I'll finish my ofono template first, and upload towards the end of week
<Laney> pitti: I'll need to finish the testcases themselves first, might not be done this week (= year) anyway; take your time
<Laney> vim .procmailrc
 * pitti nudges Laney's mouse pointer in position
<Laney> uh no, you aren't a shell prompt
<Laney> damn you FFM :P
<pitti> FFM â¥
<Laney> huh, a missing colon. I wonder how many years that has been there...
<Laney> GNOME announce mails have always hit my inbox and I never bothered to look until now
<xnox> FFM?
<xnox> i thought we'd have FFE by know based on the builtin webcams. (Focus Follow Eyesight)
<mlankhorst> oh
<xnox_> Laney: subtle
<Laney> I tried unsubtle and it didn't work :P
<attente> Laney, thanks for the review, i just fixed those issues
<Laney> great, I'll look again tomorrow
<alkisg> attente: hi, would you mind having a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-keyboard/+bug/1260226 ?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1260226 in Indicator keyboard "Xorg layout switching shortcut doesn't update indicator" [Undecided,New]
<robert_ancell> desrt, are we using dconf 0.19 in trusty?
<desrt> we ought to be
<desrt> i don't know if Laney uploaded it yet, though
<robert_ancell> it appears not
<Laney> nein
<Laney> I will do
<Laney> is there a release this time?
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-12-17
<Laney> morning
<larsu_> hi Laney
<Laney> hey larsu, how goes?
<larsu> Laney: better than yesterday. Still not fully there, but I'll be able to work today :)
<Laney> larsu: ah, well I'm glad you are on the right road :-)
<Laney> take it easy
<larsu> Laney: thanks :)  How are you doing?
<Laney> decent, thanks. I think I got Christmas shopping under control now ...
<sil2100> Mirv: yay, the second patch I need for appmenu-qt5 might also get accepted \o/
<Mirv> sil2100: great news!
<sil2100> psivaa: coming? Not much to update, but still ;)
<Sweetsha1k> Moin!
<Sweetshark> please read bug 1261669, if you want to see a clusterf^!$ of fun ...
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1261669 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "LibreOffice needs to be rebuild with gcc#58800 fixed." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1261669
<Laney> ah compiler bugs
<Laney> darkxst: did you forward your long â int patch for glib?
<xnox> another possibly gtk3.10 layout regression bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1261600
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1261600 in gnome-sudoku (Ubuntu) "Window for Sudoku "New Game" is about 30 px high and can't be enlarged (Trusty)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<xnox> is the too wide bug affects python-gi only?
<asac> is there anyone doing pulse these days?
<Laney> asac: diwic and TheMuso - https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+changelog
<asac> thx
<desrt> saluton, kaj Äojan mardon
<Laney> greetings desrt
<Laney> Sweetshark: qengho Laney larsu mlankhorst desrt tkamppeter attente meeting time!!!!
<mlankhorst> nuh!
<qengho> Aiee!
<desrt> no meeting without seb
<desrt> where is seb?
<Laney> ohhhhhhhhhh yes there is
<Laney> probably drinking an appletini somewhere
<Laney> (on holiday already)
<Laney> let's get started
<Laney> Sweetshark: ho
<qengho> I'll go.
<Laney> like that is it
<Laney> qengho: do it
<qengho> * Hacked on, packaged up, and tested some HAL replacement that makes Adobe's content-protected flash work again.  Broken since HAL removed in Saucy.
<qengho> * Testing -fPIE on chromium. Also still testing apparmor profiles.
<qengho> EOF
<Laney> h...al... replacement?
<qengho> Just a thin shim that routes DBUS calls to udisks.
<qengho> Adobe's not changing Flash for us.
<Laney> mmk
<Laney> ah, we got chromium updated in T too, neat
<qengho> Crazy, I know. Not my idea.
<qengho> Yeah, yay.
<Laney> neat, thanks qengho
<Laney> Laney: hi
<desrt> desrt: hello!
<Laney> â¢ Quiet-ish week for me
<Laney> â¢ Mainly worked on u-s-s testing and related things
<Laney> â Extended dbusmock's upower template to emit signals
<Laney> â Added some testcases for battery hot/cold plugging to u-s-s
<Laney> â Made upower emit property data when introspected (weird type guessing behaviour)
<Laney> â Wrote a template for systemd-timedated
<Laney> â¢ u-s-s reviews
<Laney> â¢ timezonemap reviews & merges
<Laney> â¢ Now looking at GNOME updates; glib2.0 gtk-pixbuf
<Laney> DONE
<Laney> larsu: you're up
<larsu> woah, this is new order!
<Laney> I just took the order on https://launchpad.net/~canonical-desktop-team/+members
<Laney> first names baby
 * desrt changes his name to desrt
<larsu> I've continued the work on evince (giving it proper menus)
<larsu> had some discussion with cimi about my latest overlay-scrollbar patches, got merged after some changes
<larsu> was sick the last two days (feeling better today though)
<larsu> eof
<Laney> oh yay, neat stuff
<Laney> did you see the gtk 3.10 weird sized window reports?
<Laney> I saw a couple on IRC - ubiquity sudoku
<Sweetshark> Laney: /me reporting late from a call.
<Laney> couldn't reproduce sudoku myself ...
<larsu> Laney: ya, but it was reverted. I'm responding to the ubiquity bug right now
<Laney> wondering what people saw if it was reverted
<Laney> anyway, cool, as long as you know
<larsu> that's what I'm asking :)
<Laney> Sweetshark: you can go now
<xnox> depends when they upgraded....
<Sweetshark> rebasing in circles: libreoffice-l10n source rebased on LO master, release branch, back to debian
<Sweetshark> packed LO 4.1.4~rc2 to ppas (general LO ppa and 4.1 ppa)
<xnox> larsu: so fully upgraded desktop image shouldn't have the weird resize bug?
<Laney> xnox: it wasn't in distro
<xnox> UbuntuKylin desktop has weird resize issue with ubiquity, last time I synced that image.
<Sweetshark> Laney: and TDF board election.
<Sweetshark> EOF
<Laney> election results?
 * desrt votes Sweetshark 
<Laney> vote for pedro^wbjoern
<larsu> xnox: no, it shouldn't be a problem after gtk 3.10.5
<Sweetshark> Laney: preliminary result will get out tommorrow. You can still vote for me (if you are a TDF member)
<larsu> xnox: but it will be next cycle :)
<Laney> teehee
<Laney> Sweetshark: weren't we going to see a new LO for trusty or do I misremember?
<Laney> I remember talking about it when we did the harfbuzz transition
<Sweetshark> Laney: yes, we also bumped the old libreoffice 4.1 in trusty for the transition.
<Laney> yeah
<Sweetshark> Laney: also makes the saucy SRU happy.
<Laney> I thought that the talk at the time was that we were going to get a 4.2 RC
<Laney> or something
<Laney> or beta?
 * Laney forgets
<Sweetshark> Laney: LO 4.2 is at beta2 -- we shouldnt go to the archive before 4.2.0rc1 (this week)
<Laney> ok, maybe that's what I remembered
<Laney> thanks
<Sweetshark> Laney: betas will stay in the prereleases ppa only.
<larsu> xnox: ah, I was wrong. It was only reverted for GtkDialogs. Ubiquity's main window is not a subclass of that, right?
<Laney> mlankhorst: your turn
<mlankhorst> working on DD (am report is positive, waiting for front desk!), xorg-server saucy sru, initial upload of pieces of the lts-saucy stack, rebasing my kernel patches again :/
<Laney> ooh, NM
<Laney> that last stage can take a little bit
<Laney> mlankhorst: thanks
<xnox> larsu: what is the change, and what should I do to fix this?
<Laney> desrt: now it is you
<desrt> continued efforts in glib/gtk/lower-gnome-platform portability.  upstream bug count so far: 19 fixed, 9 pending, 1 rejected
<desrt> did a major refactor of GtkApplication to add platform-specific backends, properly abstracted, fixing a few bugs in the
<desrt> process.  also rebased attente's menu work and did a lot of quartz menu-related fixes.  this puts us in good position to solve the 'alternate menu' situation.  could also support a future 'mir' backend this way.
<desrt> spent a day tracking down an issue in gobject-introspection: the giscanner lexer and parser get out of sync with each ot
<desrt> her which causes some macro definitions to appear as if they're coming from different files, which causes all kinds of t
<desrt> roubles
<desrt> hm.  that last one didn't work out as i expected.
<xnox> larsu: both forward and backwards compatible. and ubiquity does use all sorts of window types......
<desrt> last time i copy/paste my updates!
<Laney> haha, you try to be all prepared and this is what happens
<Laney> I enjoyed all of the "Remove alleged support for ..." in 2.39.2
<Laney> dunno if that was you or not, portability reminded me of it ...
<desrt> ya.. that was danw
<desrt> but it's related to the portability work i've been doing in the sense that we wanted to actively make sure we weren't breaking people before we started making changes like that
<Laney> glad to see that kind of stuff is being cared for
<Laney> cheers
<Laney> tkamppeter: hey
<tkamppeter> - poppler: Fixed "pdftops -origpagesizes", it did not rotate the PostScript output when the PDF input had the rotation field set. Submitted patch upstream.
<tkamppeter> - poppler: Bug fixes on PostScript output, especially make duplex printing work.
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Make PPDS-less duplex printing on PostScript printers work, also scale-to-fit
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<desrt> tkamppeter: how did that work (from a month or two ago) on the brother drivers end up working out?
<larsu> xnox: it depends on what should determine the window's size. Judging from the first screenshot on the bug, it looks like gtk_window_set_default_size() should be enough
<xnox> larsu: hm, but I don't know the default size. Usually we just let the widgets auto-determine that. Should I set it to 1x1 ? =)
<Laney> d
<Laney> the elusive tkamppeter
<Laney> attente: you're up
<xnox> am I interrupting a meeting? I'm sorry.
<Laney> xnox: yeah, almost done
<larsu> xnox: ya, let's talk after the meeting
<Laney> maybe now if attente is MIA
<pitti> qengho: hal shim> chrisccoulson wrote one quite some time ago, FYI
<attente> just some u-s-s language panel fix up, tested and re-enabled some of the maliit settings which are working now
<attente> modifier-tweaks branch got merged into trunk, continued compiz/unity key grabbing work, should have something ready this week
<attente> eof
<qengho> pitti: yes, it was incomplete. I found another on g*thub that was further along.
<Laney> did seb128's ass kick on the compiz branch that was stalling pay off?
<tkamppeter> desrt, what do you mean with brother drivers, which bug number?
<desrt> tkamppeter: you were trying to work to get the brother driver situation improved a while ago
<desrt> tkamppeter: so that people didn't have to download them from their site
<attente> Laney, i don't know what he did, but it worked :)
<Laney> great
<Laney> ok, meeting over
<Laney> next one will be next year
<Laney> happy holidays!
<Laney> xnox: you may resume :P
<happyaron> anyone has some time to sponsor a small package?
<xnox> Laney: i'd like to make AOB suggestion to the chair to change the channel topic when meetings are in progress =) and/or use meetingology to set/unset the topic.
<tkamppeter> desrt, it is difficult with Brother, trhey need to work out legal stuff whether they can set up drivers for auto-download.
<happyaron> https://code.launchpad.net/~happyaron/+junk/fcitx-qimpanel-configtool
<happyaron> source tar is https://github.com/lenky0401/fcitx-qimpanel-configtool/archive/fcitx-qimpanel-configtool-0.1.3.tar.gz
<Laney> xnox: yeah we should use meetingology
<xnox> larsu: ubiquity default window is GtkWindow, modal, resizable, always center, no default width/height set, normal hints, decorated.
<Laney> I got it to join this channel but it never happened
<Laney> I don't have enough access to change the topic either :-(
<xnox> larsu: should i change default size to "1,1" in the gtkbuilder ui file ? =) sounds like a broken gtk to me ;-)
<larsu> xnox: no, that won't fix it. It used to be that gtkwindows had a maximum width of 640px, independent of how much space widgets inside a window requested
<larsu> xnox: that changed. So you can either set a sane size, or fix whichever widget requests to much space
<xnox> larsu: aha, sounds good.
<larsu> xnox: the most common case seem to labels, which don't wrap by default. You can set max-width-chars for those
<xnox> larsu: so I believe the "progressbar" or the "bottom right" aligned url link are the culprits.
<xnox> (not visible by default)
<larsu> xnox: progress bar sounds reasonable. Want me to have a look?
<xnox> fill: yes, expand: no.
<xnox> hm. inside expander there is "minimum content width/height -1" of a scrolled window.
<xnox> but if hidden.... it shouldn't affect layout.
<larsu> ya
<larsu> is the progress bar a custom widget?
<xnox> hm. i have a label which is ellipsize end, maximum width  in chars -1, line wrap mode word character
<xnox> no, it's just GtkProgressbar, horizontal.
<larsu> ah, it should be enought to set max-width-chars of the label to something sane
<xnox> hm. i guess i should do some trial and error on a few of these now.
<xnox> larsu: it would help to be able to "introspect" which widgets pull/request/force the largest allocation
<larsu> definitely :/
<xnox> larsu: is there a GtkGrid based GtkDialog yet? /me is sick of GtkBox
<larsu> I don't think so, no
<xnox> i find gtk3.0 a bit pre-mature. it released with deprecated symbols and we are stuck with using deprecated widgets in the default set =(
<xnox> and i bet 4.0 is not going to happen any time soon.
<attente> dpm, hi
<xnox> larsu: huh, this makes no sence.
<larsu> xnox: right, that's the reason why seb128 decided to stay behind a cycle for gtk. It's still a lot of work to keep up...
<xnox> larsu: the default value of gtk-label's max-width-chars is "-1", has that been changed to a sensible value?
<larsu> xnox: no.
<xnox> larsu: how is this suppose to work then? is it actually intended to cause full-screen-width apps by default?
<dpm> hi attente
<larsu> xnox: no, width should be defined by the screen's work area
<attente> dpm, there's some issues that we ran into with the QLocale api in qtbase-opensourcesrc-src
<larsu> xnox: can I run ubiquity in my session?
<xnox> larsu: please don't, it runs as root and eager to format your hard-drive by default =)
<attente> like for example, trying to instantiate an QLocale('en_DK') falls back to a plain English locale
<xnox> larsu: in practice, install ubiquity-frontend-gtk and don't go past partitioning step ;-)
<larsu> xnox: ah okay. Is there a way to quickly test the ui?
<xnox> larsu: and launch ubiquity
<attente> and the nativeLanguageName of QLocale('en_GB') is 'British English'
<attente> instead of 'English'
<xnox> larsu: or just lauch a desktop CD in the VM, which is what I do.
<xnox> larsu: it was not fun re-installing =/
<larsu> xnox: well, I want to make changes to it and test them
<xnox> larsu: that's fine. boot into live session and you can close / change / start it as many times as you wish.
<attente> dpm, we're wondering if it's worth it to update the CLDR data in that package so that it matches more closely to what libicu provides
<dpm> attente, for the first issue, I assume that the en_DK translation was available and wasn't used? Otherwise, if it's not available, or if a particular string has no en_DK translation the default is to fall back to C (which is en_US)
<xnox> larsu: and most of the ui is in gtk-builder / glade editable files.
<happyaron> Laney: have time to sponsor my package?
<Laney> happyaron: not massively right now
<Laney> could you subscribe the sponsors and me?
<attente> dpm, i think it might be an issue with that entry not existing in the CLDR, iirc
<happyaron> Laney: ok
<dpm> attente, in general, I think it's a good idea to keep CLDR data up to date, yes.
<attente> dpm, i guess i'm just wondering if we should patch it up ourselves though in qtbase-opensource-src
<attente> dpm, looking at the CLDR, en_DK is definitely missing...
<attente> and this is definitely where the problem of all these language name variants is coming from too
<Laney> I'd be dubious of doing it downstream
<Laney> someone should at least explain the problem upstream first
<dpm> attente, I think it might be worth checking with whoever is usually doing the packaging
<dpm> I think there is some coordination with KDE/Debian to get that done
<dpm> yeah, or doing it upstream at Qt, as Laney mentions
<attente> dpm, Laney, ok, thanks
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> make[7]: *** No rule to make target `org.gtk.test.gschema.xml.orig', needed by `all-am'.  Stop.
<ricotz> Laney, revert ca830f273396322a29c439f760c06e9bad0399f1 and it works
<Laney> ricotz: o rly
<ricotz> Laney, at least doing so before tarballing it
<Laney> it's a ryan lortie patch
<Laney> that little horror
<ricotz> Laney, i think the *.orig extension is the problem
<ricotz> and it gets deleted due some debian/make rules
<Laney> let me see
<Laney> it doesn't fail when built from git tbh
<Laney> is it dh_clean?
<ricotz> so the packaging is doing it while it thinks it is some left-over
<Laney> trying with -Xxml.orig passed to dh_clean
<attente> "en_DK does not exist. This is not supposed to work." :(
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> reading some blog post that says en_DK is a hack
<Laney> ricotz: this seems to work
<mlankhorst> ugh
<mlankhorst> why is my cursor hidden when I use synergy to control it ?
<larsu> xnox: sorry, didn't have time till now to have a look at ubiquity. The problem comes from the wireless page. I'm trying to find out which widget right now.
<darkxst> Laney, that patch only applies for gdb/python3, probably not safe for python2 which all other distros are using
<darkxst> Laney, slightly different fix - https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=720635
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 720635 in general "Make gdb pretty-printers compatible with Python3" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<Laney> darkxst: decent
<darkxst> Laney, it seems only ubuntu links gdb against python3, although I guess eventually upstream will switch
<Laney> seems likely that it'll happen at some point
<Laney> I'll take that into tomorrow's glib upload
<Laney> if you can't commit, ping back on the bug to have colin do it
<darkxst> Laney, just pushed
<Laney> cool
<kyanardag_> Hi, I have ubuntu 13.10 installed in an Asus N55JV laptop. When I reboot, suspend works fine but after some time, suspend does not work (suspends and immediately wakes up). I checked /var/log/pm-suspend.log file and there's no error message. I don't know how to troubleshoot this, can somebody help me?
<sarnold> kyanardag_: sounds similar to e.g. bug 1252121
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1252121 in systemd-shim (Ubuntu Trusty) "missing PrepareForSleep signal after resuming, causing networking to stay disabled" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1252121
<kyanardag_> hi sarnold, thanks for your reply. I read the bug description and it's different than what I am experiencing..
<sarnold> kyanardag_: yeah, the symptoms you described are different, but I have a suspicion it's the same overall mechanism that's involved.
<kyanardag_> in my case, suspend actually works, but it's for a second only.. and network comes back normally..
<kyanardag_> is there a more appropriate chat room that i should seek help?
<sarnold> no, this one is decent enough, but the fellow doing the work on this is in germany; he'll likely return in six to eight hours. hehe.
<kyanardag_> :)
<sarnold> kyanardag_: you could try the systemd-shim package from the saucy-proposed repository, I found it addressed most of my suspend / resume problems
<kyanardag_> i am from Turkey, my time zone is close to Germany.. it won't be problem..
<kyanardag_> it's already installed
<kyanardag_> but not sure if it's from "proposed" repo
<sarnold> kyanardag_: oh, good :) he's an early-riser. hehe. check dpkg -l systemd-shim  -- if the version is 6-0ubuntu0.13.10 then you have the version from -proposed
<kyanardag_> mine is 4-0ubuntu0.13.10
<kyanardag_> what is the nickname of the individual working on this issues, who is from Germany
<sarnold> kyanardag_: okay, that's an update, not the -proposed package
<sarnold> kyanardag_: pitti
<kyanardag_> thanks, i'll seek help from him..
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-12-18
<veebers> Hmm, just installed Trusty on a new laptop, trying to shutdown just powers it down and then starts it up again. Is it possible it is a software issue or a hardware issue?
<Laney> morning
<larsu> Laney: morning!
<larsu> how is it going?
<Laney> hey larsu, it's going quite well thank you - had a night in playing board games last night :-)
<Laney> how are you?
<larsu> nice. I'm good thanks. Feeling much better today :)
<Laney> great, in time for holidays!
<larsu> \o/
<Laney> been irritating some local politicians to try and make some streets around here traffic free too
<Laney> all good fun
<larsu> cool! Did they comply?
<Laney> positive sounds, apparently arranging a meeting in january or something
<Laney> turns out some people already asked for similar stuff
<mlankhorst> well I have a bike lane for 16 km or so next to the busy road. :P
<Laney> though having never interacted with politicians before, I'm wary of getting a fobbing off
<mlankhorst> hehehe
<larsu> ha
<mlankhorst> they might snare you in red tape
<larsu> well, at least they're listening
<Laney> yep
<larsu> which is a step up from many politicians I know...
<larsu> (unless there's an election coming up, of course)
<Laney> it's been closed for a year already for some tram works
<Laney> so my argument is "look, the world didn't end, let's keep it shut"
<mlankhorst> have you met any, larsu?
<larsu> mlankhorst: some local ones when I used to live in magdeburg
<Laney> mlankhorst: cyclist campaigns here often use "go dutch" as a slogan :P
<Laney> cycle lanes on busy roads we certainly can do
<mlankhorst> heheheh
<mlankhorst> so what are the tests unity runs in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mesa/+bug/1260068 ?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1260068 in mesa (Ubuntu) "Unity continuous-integration fails in armhf due possibly to a libegl issue" [Critical,Confirmed]
<larsu> xnox: man, half a day of looking in the wifi plugin to find out the real issue was in the prepare plugin :/  anyway, patch is up: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1260396
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1260396 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu Trusty) "Ubiquity window spans width of screen" [High,In progress]
<larsu> xnox: and suprisingly small for now. I'd appreciate some testing, maybe we need that for other labels as well
<xnox> larsu: ack. thanks a lot for hunting this down.
<larsu> xnox: it's one of those search-for-a-long-time-come-up-with-a-two-line-patch things. At least I learned now how ubiquity works :)
<ochosi> tiheum: just read your post about the new icon-theme, "eventually" landing on the desktop means you're not aiming for 14.04?
<xnox> larsu: and the most hackiest page of them all, as well =)
<larsu> heh, ya
<Sweetshark> You may  call me director for two more years: http://blog.documentfoundation.org/2013/12/18/preliminary-results-elections-tdf-board-of-directors/
<larsu> Sweetshark: congrats!!
<Sweetshark> larsu: thx.
<desrt> Sweetshark: congrats :)
<tiheum> ochosi: Our priority is to deliver a complete and beautiful icon theme on mobile and tablet for 14.04. The desktop needs more work both in terms of icon design (files, folders, devices, Gnome 3 symbolic icons) and development (adapt the GTK theme, patch Unity 7). So porting the icon theme to the desktop is something that we will consider but at this point no decision has been taken.
<ochosi> tiheum: ok, thanks for the update! just to clarify where i'm coming from, i'm the artwork-lead of xubuntu and i'm really interested in your work and happy to see it happening!
<tiheum> ochosi: thanks
<ochosi> tiheum: so in fact i would be very happy to adapt the icon-theme for xubuntu also and maybe even contribute to your theme, if you're open for that
<ochosi> tiheum: depends on how you'll work on this project, if it's something more "in-house" i guess i'll have to wait for it to trickle down
<Sweetshark> desrt: thx. In very happy with the result -- the board composition is something that is workable.
<desrt> plus... everything is better with meeks
<Sweetshark> desrt: meeks as a board member or as a voting method? we have both ;)
<desrt> the guy created his own voting method?
<desrt> how does that work?  extra points based on the impressiveness of your beard?
<Sweetshark> desrt: no we are hackers. extra points for neck beards.
<Sweetshark> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meek%27s_method#Meek
<tiheum> ochosi: We are still doing design explorations and improvements for the icons. I think that the project will be open to contributions once the design principles will be agreed and the corresponding guidelines published.
<ochosi> tiheum: ok, sounds nice! anyway, keep up the good work! :)
<tiheum> thank you!
<xnox> tedg: ++
<attente> Laney, is there a way to cache the build output of dpkg-buildpackage/debuild/bzr bd?
<Laney> cache in what way?
<Laney> you mean a build log?
<attente> like to reuse the build directory between builds
<attente> so that the package doesn't need to be re-built if i've only changed a few files
<Laney> oh, -nc = "no clean"
<Laney> doesn't always work properly though
<attente> so subsequent builds would automatically know to reuse the directory? there isn't an extra flag for that?
<Laney> it won't work with out of tree builds
<Laney> tried ccache? ;-)
<attente> sure, i'll give ccache a try :)
<sabdfl> any reason we have deps on both gstreamer-1.0 and gstreamer-0.10 in -desktop?
<Laney> sabdfl: I think the status is that there's one or two stragglers that didn't get ported yet (I think bluez and firefox), and you need to seed those packages otherwise you don't get proper output
<Laney> 'those' being -alsa and -pulseaudio IIRC
<sabdfl> ack, thanks Laney
<Laney> bluez actually has an upstream version that is ported but there was an issue that I can't quite remember which seb128 mentioned
<kenvandine> looks like gnome-media also still depends on it
<kenvandine> which g-c-c depends on
<Laney> I thought we booted that out
<cyphermox> Laney: bluez 5 I guess you mean, which is hugely different from 4.101 and then we run into other things not being ported
<kenvandine> gnome-control-center-data depends on it
<cyphermox> like pulseaudio
<Laney> yeah
<kenvandine> actually, i'm looking at saucy, maybe that's been  fixed for trusty
<Laney> it has Replaces: gnome-media-common
<cyphermox> pulseaudio now has bluez5 support but only in git AFAIR, not as a formal release
<Laney> anyway, I guess that's the reason
<kenvandine> good, almost done migrating away from 0.10 :)
<Laney> apt-cache show firefox
<Laney> ERM
<Laney> doesn't have any gst dependencies, weird
<Laney> I guess we probably ought to keep on seeding those 0.10 packages even when the default install is ported away though
<Laney> it's pretty inexplicable when they're not installed and you get no audio
<cyphermox> yeah :/
<pitti> Laney: FYI, dbusmock 0.10 released and uploaded to sid, with your fixes and timedated template
<Laney> yay
<pitti> should autosync by tomorrow
<pitti> I don't think it'll be caught by the freeze
<Laney> thanks, I'll work on those tests more tomorrow probably
<Laney> nah, surely it's not on any image
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-12-19
<Mirv> morning
<RAOF> Aloha
<Laney> hey!
<Laney> happy penultimate day before holidays for most people :-)
<larsu> Laney: same to you!
<pitti> hey Laney, likewise!
 * pitti hugs Laney and larsu, seems not many people holding the fort here any more
<Laney> hey pitti and larsu
<larsu> yeah, it seems very empty these days
<Laney> turns out seb128 makes a lot of noise :P
<RAOF> Hah
<larsu> haha
<tsdgeos> did we update the intel driver in trusty recently?
<tsdgeos> i'm getting weird crashes
<tsdgeos> http://pastebin.kde.org/pjjbsztsv <-- crash in i965_dri.so Â¿Â¿??
<tsdgeos> horizontaljournaltestExec: ../../../../src/glsl/ralloc.c:81: get_header: assertion Â«info->canary == 0x5A1106Â» failed.
<RAOF> tsdgeos: Last update (of note) was 11/12/2013
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-panel/+bug/1256961
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1256961 in gnome-panel (Ubuntu) "new glib (2.39.1) causes some indicators & nautilus to not load promptly" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Laney> ?!
<Laney> darkxst: got any insight into that?
<tsdgeos> RAOF: is that month/day or day/month ?
<RAOF> tsdgeos: Day/month. Sorry, should have put the year the other way 'round.
<tsdgeos> RAOF: hmmm, this is more recent, like today/yesterday
<tsdgeos> wonder if the update to qt5 that came in yesterday is the culprit
<tsdgeos> Mirv: what was in yesterday's update to Qt 5.0.2?
<RAOF> Possibly; it doesn't seem that your driver stack changed.
<tsdgeos> And now i get this http://pastebin.kde.org/pref7ap09 :-S
<tsdgeos> or llvm changing broke mesa? (me has no clue if he's saying crazy stuff now)
<darkxst> Laney, hi
<Laney> hey there
<Mirv> tsdgeos: not by me, seems some arm64/ppc64el related dependency changes
 * tsdgeos cries
 * tsdgeos reboots and see if that magically helps
<darkxst> Laney, not real sure, however that is quite diverged from upstream (gnome-panel, nautilus handling desktop), so unlikely to be tested
<Laney> darkxst: it's weird, I don't know how glib is to blame and couldn't easily downgrade it to saucy's version to check that theory
<Laney> by chance I tried gnome-session-quit --logout before the stuff loaded and got an error about not being in the running phase
<darkxst> Laney, I agree, doesnt seem like a glib bug to me
<Laney> could be a GSource change or something
<darkxst> hmm there were a bunch of changes to the session handling
<darkxst> not sure if they made it into trusty or not
<darkxst> (in gnome-session)
<Laney> we got gnome-panel 3.8 quite recently
<Laney> gnome-session didn't change so much
<Laney> well, downgrading g-p didn't fix it
<darkxst> Laney, I'm not at all familiar with gnome-panel....
<Laney> probably can't spend more time on this now
<Laney> I'll keep it in mind
<dholbach> hiya
<dholbach> can somebody take a look at https://launchpad.net/bugs/1260942 for sponsorship please?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1260942 in epiphany-browser (Ubuntu) "new upstream release 3.10" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<dholbach> I reviewed it, but was a bit unsure about the package name changes
<Laney> what is epiphany-browser-webkit2?
<Laney> rmadison doesn't know about it
<Laney> don't tell me it's for something in a GNOME team PPA
<dholbach> Laney, I have no idea
<Laney> darkxst: he;lp
<dholbach> there's lots of desktop stuff in http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/ :)
<Laney> mmm, seems like a good pre-xmas task
<Laney> for tomorrow afternoon
<Laney> upload the crack, then run away for two weeks
<Laney> MUHAHAHA
<dholbach> haha :)
 * dholbach hugs Laney
 * Laney hugs dholbach back
<Laney> hope you have nice holidays lined up!
<dholbach> I do - I'm going to stay in Berlin this time along with a bunch of friends of mine - it should be good :)
<dholbach> how about you?
<Laney> neat
<Laney> various parental travellings, then back here for new years
<dholbach> nice :)
<Laney> yeah, always nice to get out into the countryside for a bit
<Laney> pitti: did you see the python-dbusmock depwait?
<Laney> looks like component mismatches
<pitti> Laney: oh, indeed I didn't
<pitti> argh
<pitti> I thought ofono was in main
<pitti> ok, so we can't test this
<pitti> (during package build)
<pitti> I'll remove it
<Laney> I guess the MIR will happen this cycle
<pitti> Laney: uploaded, thanks for pointing out
<Laney> np, thanks to you for fixing
<Sweetshark> http://www.apertura.co.nz/collabora <- kiwis go LibreOffice ...
<pitti> [ubuntu/trusty] python-dbusmock 0.10-1svn1 (Accepted)
<pitti> Laney: ^  \o/
<pitti> tvoss: ^ FYI, that contains the ofono mock
<tvoss> pitti, \o/
<Laney> w00t
<Laney> attente: I don't think you can take the longest one
<Laney> on my system that ends up prefering 'iso88591' encodings instead of 'utf8'
<Laney> also couldn't you do that before processing them with icu? or are there cases in which more than one locale maps to the same display name?
<Laney> GunnarHj: how does l-s build the list of format locale options?
<Laney> also, hello and merry christmas ;-)
<attente> Laney, so i guess in general we need a way to choose 'en_US.UTF-8' over 'en_US'
<Laney> I'm hoping we can steal what language-selector does here
<Laney> also I was thinking you'd do the QSet subtraction so that you can avoid that .contains check at line 326 :-)
<Laney> pretty minor point really
<attente> well, if it makes you happy ;)
<GunnarHj> Laney: l-s picks the items resulting from 'locale -a' that ends with '.utf8' (and converts .utf8 to .UTF-8)
<Laney> ahhhhh
<Laney> do you need to do any deduplication?
<Laney> you've found it's reliable enough?
<GunnarHj> Laney: No. Yes, I'm not aware of any reported issues in this respect.
<Laney> Neat
<Laney> attente: think we can do that?
<attente> Laney, sure, but can we guarantee that every locale has a .utf8 variant?
<GunnarHj> attente: *.utf8 is not the real name of any locale, it's an alias. But 'locale -a' reports every UTF-8 locale as ll_CC.utf8.
<Laney> I'm pretty sure you always get a UTF-8 locale
<Laney> I'd hope l-s would have run into any problem by now
<Laney> *cough* famous last words
<GunnarHj> attente, Laney: Btw, there is the @variant thing... So don't pick items that end with .utf8, pick items that include .utf8 somewhere in the string.
<Laney> nod
<attente> GunnarHj, thanks, wfm
<Laney> attente gets all the hard problems
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-12-20
<pitti> Good morning
<Fudge> ~/j andlinux
<darkxst> hi pitti
<darkxst> ok to update gsettings-desktop-schemas?
<pitti> hey darkxst, how are you?
<darkxst> yeh good, you?
<pitti> pretty well, thanks; cleanup on last day this year :)
<darkxst> pretty sure all removed keys, have been reverted in my package. don't think there is anything that will blow up the world
<Laney> g'morning
<mlankhorst> g'day
<Laney> happy last day!
<sil2100> Morning! Happy last day indeed ;)
<mlankhorst> happy 1-day-before-shortest-day!
<Laney> yeah then it's basically summer right
 * RAOF basks in the evening sun
<Laney> you crazy upside down people
<Laney> desrt: hrm, the gdbus-names test has started being unreliable: https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Trusty/view/AutoPkgTest/job/trusty-adt-glib2.0/
<Laney> & the log: https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Trusty/view/AutoPkgTest/job/trusty-adt-glib2.0/37/ARCH=i386,label=adt/consoleText
<Laney> what could be up there?
<larsu> Laney: can you reproduce this on your machine?
 * larsu tries
<Laney> haven't seen it there
<Laney> let me run it under gnome-desktop-testing
<Laney> I ran it 50 times and it passed (not under the testing runner)
<Laney> hmm, it eventually ran out of inotify watches
<Laney> well, "Cannot initialize inotify"
<larsu> the gdbus-names test?
 * larsu is confused
<Laney> yep
<Laney> Might have been my fault for running dbus-launch n times though ... :-)
<larsu> :)
<larsu> the test launches its own bus btw
<Laney> nod
<Laney> yeah this seems saner
<Laney> ran it 1000 times, passed
<larsu> so the connection that g_bus_get() returns is marked as closed
<larsu> and then signal_subscribe() prints that error on stdout
<larsu> Laney: same for me, I'm going by the log
<larsu> is there any way to get at that backtrace?
<Laney> let's see, maybe there's a crash file
<larsu> looks like there was some error uploading it
<Laney> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Trusty/view/AutoPkgTest/job/trusty-adt-glib2.0/37/ARCH=i386,label=adt/ there's one linked here
<larsu> ah cool, thanks
<larsu> hm, not very helpful
<Laney> larsu: you shouldn't g_source_remove (id) after g_main_loop_run (loop) returns, right?
<Laney> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/160125510/buildlog_ubuntu-trusty-amd64.whoopsie_0.2.24.2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<larsu> Laney: that shouldn't be a problem
<Laney> oh ok, I thought that might remove the sources for you
<larsu> no, it doesn't. Sources are added to main contests, not loops
<larsu> the problem in that link is that somebody is removing a source that was already removed
<larsu> glib started warning about that recently
<Laney> right
<Laney> I know the problem
<Laney> let me get the code
<Laney> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~daisy-pluckers/whoopsie/trunk/view/head:/src/tests/test_monitor.c#L150
<larsu> the one in line 150 is the one that causes this warning?
<Laney> no, lies, it's the one at 207 isn't it
<larsu> ya, I was about to say
<larsu> time sources need to return something, g_main_loop_quit() doesn't
<larsu> if they return FALSE, they're removed. You can't call g_source_remove() again on those
<Laney> the 150 one happened locally
<Laney> I think, it's kind of hard to read
<Laney> so I think you could make them both return FALSE and then not g_source_remove() i t
<Laney> yes?
<larsu> yes. That might leak the source though
<larsu> when it never gets triggered
<larsu> but I guess that's okay for the test
<Laney> ya, otherwise I could pass a boolean in to track that
<Laney> not sure it's worth it
<larsu> aren't these callbacks just to timeout the test?
<larsu> so that it doesn't run too long? You could just assert in the callback
<Laney> yeah but I don't think g_test_fail () stops the test
<Laney> stuff happens after
<larsu> ah, okay
<Laney> the second one doesn't g_test_fail () actually
<Laney> not entirely keen on unwinding the logic :P
<larsu> ah, because it waits for two seconds to test that the callback is never triggered
<larsu> so it shouldn't fail in the timeout
<larsu> kind of a weird thing to test
<sabdfl> join #yandex
<sabdfl> hehe
<ochosi> oops :)
<Laney> buh, glib-networking is failing too
<desrt> Laney: i hate unreliable tests :p
<larsu> desrt: speaking of which, do you in which situation g_bus_get() can return a connection that is closed?
<larsu> I thought it returns NULL if it can't establish the connection
<Laney> they were all super reliable until 2.39
 * larsu done with duolingo for the day. Back to work!
<desrt> larsu: i can't help but wonder if this is something wrong with our tester rig
<larsu> hm
<Laney> attente: the 'preview' thing seems to have gotten broken
<Laney> where it changes the language on the selection screen
<attente> Laney, yeah, that's been broken for a long time now
<Laney> oh ok
<Laney> I thought it worked
<attente> it did
<attente> but something changed in the toolkit and i didn't figure out what it was
<Laney> alright, I'll file a bug
<Laney> this looks good now, will approve
<Laney> happy holidays desktoppers!
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-12-22
<excalibr> Hi!
<excalibr> I just submited a patch for a package through bug report. What should I do next to get it looked at?
<xnox> excalibr: subscribe "ubuntu-sponsors" team to the bug report
<excalibr> xnox, then what will happen?
<xnox> excalibr: patch ends up in review queue, sponsors review it, and either comment or upload into the archive.
<xnox> see http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/
<xnox> and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
<excalibr> alright. thank you :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-12-15
<pitti> Good morning
<mlankhorst> morning!
<didrocks> good morning
<larsu> morning!
<ochosi> morning folks
<didrocks> hey larsu, ochosi
<ochosi> larsu: quick question, where is your gtk3.14 staging PPA? (so i can start to prep the xubuntu vivid themes)
<larsu> ochosi: in the desktop team ppa
<didrocks> pitti: hey, welcome back! I hope you had a safe flight back :)
<didrocks> pitti: I saw that you were cooking this week-end
<didrocks> and pushing new systemd :)
<didrocks> pitti: I wanted to know if there was any reason you didn't include bug #1400682 patch?
<ochosi> larsu: oh indeed. note to self: don't start asking around *before* having had coffee...
<ubot5> bug 1400682 in systemd (Ubuntu) "Add xdiagnose fallback when display-manager fails to start" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1400682
<larsu> ochosi: haha, no worries ;)
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, Ã§a va !
<pitti> didrocks: yes, flight was uneventful, and I could sleep a bit too
<pitti> didrocks: the main reason was, I did the merge/update mostly on the plane, and I didn't have that patch downloaded  yet :/
<pitti> didrocks: but there is a test regresssion and a timedatectl crash on i386 anyway, so I'll need to upload a new version today anyway
<pitti> didrocks: I have that bug open now :)
<didrocks> pitti: perfect, thanks!
<didrocks> pitti: nice that you could sleep, how long was it btw?
<didrocks> I guess something like 9-10 hours?
<pitti> didrocks: 11 hours
<pitti> 18:55 to 5:30 on the way back, 22:55 to 10:50 on the way there (1 h time zone difference)
<didrocks> yeah, quite long, at least, no jetlag :)
<ochosi> larsu: quick question, is file-roller on your list of apps to remove CSD?
<mlankhorst> I should not be allowed to have smartphones :P
<didrocks> mlankhorst: breaking one?
<mlankhorst> yeah I cracked the screen on the aquaris
<didrocks> it's still a build machine at least
<mlankhorst> true but I was using it to test.. if I can figure out how to get the screen permanently unlocked and bright it would be fine
<didrocks> mlankhorst: you can maybe get it repaired?
<didrocks> like I don't think it's a particular screen compared to android versions
<larsu> ochosi: I thought seb already patched that?!
<larsu> ochosi: it doesn't have csd on latest vivid, or are you talking about a new version?
<mlankhorst> didrocks: is it possible to unlock the screen without using the touchscreen? I already have the phone setup
<mlankhorst> adb shell etc works
<ochosi> larsu: this is vivid with the ubuntu-desktop PPA (gtk3.14) and file-roller: http://i.imgur.com/n36Mjdz.png
<didrocks> mlankhorst: not that I know of
<ochosi> larsu: i'll switch mirrors, maybe mine is lagging behind...
<didrocks> mlankhorst: I would really try to go to a repair shop, the model from what I know is similar to the android one
<didrocks> so they should have that screen
<larsu> ochosi: which desktop? I have a normal title bar on unity
<ochosi> larsu: xubuntu
<mlankhorst> didrocks: it's identical, but yeah I guess I can take a look
<ochosi> larsu: did you only add a check for unity?
<ochosi> larsu: my guess is that both mythbuntu and ubuntu-studio (maybe even u-mate) would appreciate "!=gnome" instead of "==unity"
<ochosi> and lubuntu probably
<larsu> ochosi: it checks for GNOME: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/file-roller/ubuntu/view/head:/debian/patches/bz_unity_headerbar.patch
<ochosi> weird
<didrocks> larsu: we really need a framework to tweak that on runtime, by capability I guess
<didrocks> like "support-overlay-scrollbar"
<didrocks> "support-appmenu"
<didrocks> "disable-foo"
<ochosi> larsu: not sure you noticed, but it has a normal menu plus a headerbar, so something is fishy there
<didrocks> (yeah, I know, I introduced this per-session name based in 2009/2010, but I regret now :p)
<ochosi> larsu: better visible here: http://i.imgur.com/waneudI.png
<larsu> didrocks: ya... we talked about having another xsetting, like we do for global menu and buttons in dialog headers
<didrocks> larsu: yeah, that would make sense
<larsu> didrocks: consensus so far has been "oh no, not another xsetting"
<didrocks> as there is no phone, tablet or whatsoever
<didrocks> done properly, there is "touch screen", "keyboard", "screen size", "battery"
<larsu> ochosi: probably because gtk-shell-shows-menubar is 0
<didrocks> and changing the app/framework behavior on that
<didrocks> larsu: did you try to compare that to media queries?
<larsu> didrocks: compare what?
<larsu> interesting idea, though...
<didrocks> like, media queries are really trying to do that and base on capability rather than form factor/session
<larsu> right
<didrocks> larsu: just taking web media queries as an example as part of that discussion
<didrocks> as an argument :)
<didrocks> larsu: not the most important thing right now, but this discussion just makes me thinking that :)
<larsu> didrocks: makes a lot of sense to me. We'd still need something like xsettings to provide the values, though
<didrocks> larsu: yeah, that's clearly one of the way to achieve this
<didrocks> just talking about the general concept, before we introduce an unity8-desktop for instance :)
<didrocks> finding a grub script typo -> *not* fun
<larsu> the unity8 guys have a plan
<larsu> I don't know what that is, though
<didrocks> we should follow the same one for desktop for sure (not implementation-wise, but for coherence)
<didrocks> anyway, sorry for side-tracking :)
<didrocks> waiting for grub2 to pass tests (again :p)
<ochosi> larsu: right, so should i report a bug about this?
<larsu> didrocks: haha, no worries :)
<larsu> ochosi: I'm not sure what the issue is?
<larsu> you don't have a global menu in xubuntu, do you?
<larsu> so having that xsetting set to 0 is correct, and you get a local menu
<ochosi> larsu: ehm, the issue is that file-roller has CSD..?
<ochosi> the menu part is fine
<ochosi> it was just confusing for me that there could be a mix
<larsu> I don't understand how that is confusing. If you tell gtk that you want a header bar and a menu inside the window, that's what you get
<larsu> what's in your XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP?
<ochosi> larsu: it's XFCE
<ochosi> sry, g2g, bbl
<larsu> ochosi: ah, it is a bug in the patch
<larsu> I can reproduce
<larsu> ochosi: which version do you have installed? The patch I linked to is not yet in vivid
<larsu> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/file-roller/ubuntu/revision/150
<larsu> Laney: is file-roller file-roller blocked on anything?
<willcooke> morning
<didrocks> hey willcooke, feeling better?
<Laney> heya
<didrocks> morning Laney, good week-end?
<larsu> morning Laney, willcooke
<willcooke> didrocks, not really.  Paracetamol  helps
<didrocks> urgh :/
<didrocks> willcooke: take it easy, soon holidays!
<willcooke> heh #
<Laney> hey didrocks et larsu
<willcooke> looking forward to it
<Laney> not bad thanks, did some xmas shopping ;-)
<Laney> you guys?
<Laney> larsu: file-roller> not sure offhand, did robert-ancell do that one maybe?
<didrocks> played some nice board games and finished watching breaking bad :)
<larsu> Laney: don't know, thought you might
<Laney> still haven't played that game I got in DC :(
<Laney> larsu: I'll take a look
<larsu> thanks
<larsu> the one we have now checks for Unity to disable csd
<larsu> the new one checks for !GNOME
<Laney> they did that upstream?
<larsu> no, robert_ancell did (and you committed it apparently)
<larsu> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/file-roller/ubuntu/revision/150
<Laney> i see
<Laney> "(blocked on gtk 3.14)"
<darkxst> Laney, about everything is blocked on gtk 3.14 now (for us anyway!)
<didrocks> pitti: I hope I'm using git-dpm well and patching the grub patch to generate other installed init system FYI
<Laney> darkxst: ya, lots for us too, might be that we can deal with the remaining issues post upload
<Laney> I need to test ubiquity though
<ricotz> Laney, hi :), just a small request, could you define the mir minimum-requirement in the gtk+3.0 packaging?
<Laney> what is it?
<pitti> didrocks: sure -- if it looks ok and dpkg-source is happy, it's good :)
<ricotz> Laney, idk, at least the trusty version is not sufficient
<Laney> I could make it >= what-we-have-now
<Laney> you probably just want to disable that for the PPA
<ricotz> i know and i will, still would be nice to keep track on such things
<ricotz> also there is a 3.14.6 ;)
<Laney> yep
<Laney> larsu: I see you got an ok for your icon patch ;-)
<larsu> Laney: I dumbed it down considerably with only 2 lines left
<Laney> ya
<Laney> seems this is acceptable
<larsu> speaking of which - virtmanager has large buttons because one of the toolbar icons is 48x48
 * larsu figured that out after inspecting css for 20 minutes
<Laney> what about the borders?
<larsu> borders have always been on those, no?
<larsu> I can remove them if you prefer
<Laney> don't think so
<Laney> one sec, lemme boot utopic
<Laney> larsu: http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/virt-manager.png trusty
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/virt-manager-new.png that's with 3.14.5
<larsu> I stand corrected. Thanks.
<desrt> Laney: you never told me how great schroot is
<Laney> desrt: dude, welcome to the enlightened
<desrt> i jhbuild on fedora on my ubuntu linode
<desrt> yo dawg and all that
<larsu> schroot?
<larsu> desrt: good ... err ... morning?
<desrt> hi :)
<larsu> you're up early
<desrt> larsu: it's a system for maintaining images of other distros that you can chroot into
<desrt> it has some extremely lovely features
<larsu> coool
<desrt> like the way i'm using it now, it unpacks a fresh .tar each time
<desrt> so i can explode it however i want
<desrt> and when i logout, it deletes it
<desrt> it also has a lot of really great features like automatically bindmounting /sys /proc /dev and (insanely usefully) /home
<darkxst> larsu, jhbuild is a major hack, schroot would be better, but it helps finding ubuntu issues
<desrt> i've used it from time to time when Laney wants me to fix a bug on some weird arch or another but i only really "learned" it this weekend
<desrt> i should done that years ago
<desrt> *shoulda
<didrocks> desrt: you can even mount the overlay as tmpfs to avoid the unpacking :)
<desrt> didrocks: linode has no aufs support in their kernels :(
<didrocks> argh, so switch to btrfs and use nspawn coming with systemd 219 ;)
<desrt> meh
<desrt> containers are too heavy
<desrt> i also really really really like how desrt on the outside is desrt on the inside
<desrt> it's totally perfect
<larsu> darkxst: this seems to be for a different use case than jhbuild...
<didrocks> desrt: ahah, nicely said :)
<larsu> (which I'm actualy quite fond of these days)
 * desrt did a pile of jhbuild hacking over the weekend
<darkxst> larsu, yes GNOME upstream has no sbuild/schroot stugg
<desrt> i added support for finding out about _all_ of the things that are needed to build the lower bits of gnome
<desrt> including the stuff that we couldn't previously add checks for (libxml2-python, docbook-xsl)
<desrt> and now i have a new mode that dumps the full list in machine readable form like pkgconfig:egl,c_include:jpeglib.h,...
<darkxst> desrt, like making system modules satisfy jhbuild?
<desrt> and another script that runs that list against a Contents.gz from apt-file and comes up with various solutions
<desrt> darkxst: ya...
<willcooke> desrt, you're up early
<Laney> or late ...
<desrt> early :)
<desrt> Laney: maybe you could help me with some of the issues i hit
<desrt> i asked in #debian but it was pretty slow over the weekend
<Laney> #debian-devel might be better for that kind of q
<desrt> first issue is that i want to find a way to effectively say: apt install a b 'c | d' e f 'g | h'
<desrt> where c/d are alternatives for the same functionality and g/h the same for another
<desrt> like jpeg vs. jpeg-turbo or something
<desrt> currently my script takes all of the possibile combinations of the alternatives, does apt dry-runs on them all and calculates a 'cost' based on the number of reported Inst and Remv lines (with removals costing 1000 times more than adds)
<desrt> then it picks the lowest cost
<Laney> I'd build a .deb with that in Depends: and let apt figure it out
<desrt> unfortunately that involves doing apt dry-runs of ~1000 operations over 192 possible combinations... which takes 5-10 minutes :(
<desrt> Laney: ya.... i was hoping for a better way
<desrt> more direct
<Laney> that's what sbuild does when it resolves build-deps, for example
<desrt> also: Depends: lines are a bit "opinionated", right?
<Laney> or there's a script called mk-build-deps
<desrt> like, the thing on the left is the one that is taken unless the others are already installed, no?
<Laney> ya
<Laney> well, kind of, if it's not installable then it'll try the other one
<desrt> does it do that even if the 'cost' is high?
<desrt> like for example say i had libfooa and libfoob mutually conflicting
<desrt> they have corresponding libfooa-dev and libfoob-c
<desrt> *-dev, sorry
<desrt> then package 'c' depends on libfooa-dev | libfoob-dev
<desrt> and my system had libfoob installed
<desrt> will apt uninstall libfoob in order to get me libfooa-dev just because i didn't have libfoob-dev?
<desrt> because in that case i'd sort of hope for the more reasonable "oh... he's already got libfoob... so probably he just wants the -dev of that"... which is what my 'minimum cost' thing was tilting for
<desrt> you know.. mk-build-deps is not bad...... and it would additionally give me an artifact that i could install in order to force all of the depends of my jhbuild to stay installed
<Laney> I think apt is smart enough to prefer not to remove packages if it can
<Laney> but you get into mvo territory at this point
<desrt> i already sent him an email :)
<Laney> or you could do some experimentation
<desrt> i'll see if i can play with mk-build-deps
<desrt> ya...
<desrt> see what it gets me
<Laney> 'equivs' is a tool for building packages which don't do anything other than have metadata
<Laney> so you can test using that
<desrt> great advice.  thanks.
<Laney> or even use it to generate your fake package for dep solving
<desrt> i had another issue, but it's less likely you know about it (or even that it has a solution at all)
<desrt> i want a command that i can call that will answer the question "which package do i have to install in order to get a given uri into the system xml catalog"
<desrt> ie: i want to know what will make 'xmlcatalog /etc/xml/catalog http://docbook.sourceforge.net/release/xsl/current/' return a positive result
<desrt> (my current thinking towards a best solution here is to hardcode the package name 'docbook-xsl'... i don't plan on the xml depends of jhbuild undergoing a dramatic expansion any time soon... but a generic solution would be nice...)
<Laney> sorry, had a guy around checking the energy efficiency of the house... gone now...
<desrt> very nice of him
<Laney> I think that particular operation is done by packages invoking update-xmlcatalog in their mantainer scripts which are usually generated by dh_installxmlcatalog during the build
<Laney> soooo no I don't know of a way you could determine that :)
<desrt> ya.. i'm aware of that much, but it's sort of the opposite of what i want
<desrt> i'd need somewhere a database of all the people who ever do that
<desrt> in general, we need to start getting better information about this sort of stuff into apt...
 * desrt wants to apt install pkgconfig:gl or apt install c_include:jpeglib.h or apt install python2:libxml2
<desrt> or (xml:http://whatever)
<desrt> Laney: is there a better way to install-with-deps than using apt-get install -f?
<desrt> the proposed solution in my contrived case above is removing the package with the alternative depends
<Laney> maybe gdebi, but I'm not sure what resolver it uses
<Laney> or make a local repository using dpkg-scanpackages and put that into sources.list
<Laney> ISTR some talk about apt getting "apt install .deb"
<desrt> Laney: long overdue, that one....
<Laney> DonKult @ #debian-devel might know more - he's an apt guy
<desrt> Laney: the idea of adding a local repository is interesting -- i don't even actually need the .deb files in that case
<desrt> can just ask apt "what would you do" based on the Packages file
<desrt> in any case, the result of the experiment is that apt does 'the wrong thing'
<desrt> (ie: it wants to remove libfoob)
<Laney> ubiquity seems ok with new gtk
<Laney> closing in on the upload
<xnox> \o/ Laney
<Laney> xnox: remembered to check it this time ;-)
<Laney> ps. nice christmas tree
<xnox> =))))
<Laney> shared mine with you on g+
<xnox> Laney: haven't been on g+ for a while.
<xnox> .... lennart invited me to systemd hack-fest.
<Laney> haha
<Laney> it seemed like a reasonable option from the android share menu
<xnox> pitti: are you going for lennarts/systemd fosdem hackfest?
<pitti> xnox: yes, I will
<xnox> didrocks: as well and marco d'Itri.
<xnox> pitti: i'll ponder about it.
<Laney> larsu: do you need to get someone to review https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/ubuntu-themes/gtk-314 ?
<larsu> Laney: yes, but I've just started working on it again
<larsu> seb128 tried it last week and didn't notice any issues
<Laney> yes I've been trying it too
<Laney> not hugely qualified to review though
<larsu> that's fine, I'm not hugely qualified to write it ;)
<Laney> if we're going to upload gtk then this needs to go in too
<larsu> yep
 * larsu is fixing toolbar buttons right now
<Laney> ok, please put up a MP when that's done :)
<larsu> "done". lol.
<Laney> I believe in you!
<larsu> haha - there are little issues all over the place
<larsu> and changing something in the theme _always_ breaks something else
<larsu> we need some way to properly test theming
<Laney> it doesn't have to be 100% to get it in vivid
<larsu> of course
<larsu> let me finish the toolbar/flat button stuff and then I'll MR
<Laney> did you notice that the session selector in unity-greeter got a border too?
<Laney> :)
<larsu> I did now :)
<Laney> put it on the pad
<Laney> not a priority
<larsu> yep
<larsu> thanks
<pitti> didrocks: FYI, I sent a fix for the timedatectl regression upstream and fixed test_profile in Debian git; I'm now trying to reproduce the NSpawn.test_boot failure (doesn't happen locally)
<pitti> didrocks: so uploading a new version will still take a bit, but I'll see to getting it done by tomorrow
<pitti> I'll be off for the afternoon
<desrt> pitti: take care
<pitti> hey desrt, how are yoU?
<desrt> busy :)
<didrocks> pitti: thanks for keeping me posted, now that I sent the grub thing, I'm about to finish some desktop developer stuff. Then, moving on on more systemd work
<didrocks> pitti: still want to discuss with you about fsck before pushing more :)
<didrocks> but let's do that tomorrow
<desrt> pitti: you going to the systemd hackfest in brussels?
<pitti> desrt: (OTP) yes, I will
<pitti> desrt: will you be on fosdem, too?
<desrt> yes
<desrt> hopefully will get some kdbus stuff nicely tied up there
<willcooke> didrocks, cheapo ebay laptop battery update.... wont charge above 60% now.
<didrocks> willcooke: yeah, so the cheap was really "cheap" :/
<willcooke> quelle surprise
<didrocks> well, see the positive side: it didn't explode when you plugged it
<willcooke> :D
<didrocks> ;)
<larsu> yet
<willcooke> LOL!
<didrocks> roh
<pitti> didrocks: I responded to bug 1400682
<ubot5> bug 1400682 in systemd (Ubuntu) "Add xdiagnose fallback when display-manager fails to start" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1400682
<xnox> Laney: i don't see any pictures shared with me on G+... did you use the right account instead of a defunct @canonical.com one?
<Laney> don't know, I typed your name in the app ^o)
<didrocks> pitti: agreed, doing this change and closing the bug report then
<Laney> xnox: https://plus.google.com/u/0/109160032876474505377/posts that one
<xnox> Laney: right - so I see if it I go to your page, but I didn't get a notification about it =/
<xnox> Laney: yours is lovely and tall and nice toys - just enough.
<xnox> Laney: mine is much shorter than that and more fluffy
<Laney> it expanded after we got it home
<Laney> wanted something skinnier
<Laney> i like the fluffiness ^_^
<didrocks> pitti: I guess on the bug report, you wanted to tell "graphical.target.d" or really "display-manager.service.d" (and so, using RequiredBy=)
<ochosi> larsu: ah right. the version of file-roller i have is 3.12.2-0ubuntu1 (so standard vivid)
<ricotz> Laney, was it intended to drop "--include-image-data" from update-icon-cache?
<didrocks> pitti: done, tested and uploaded in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xdiagnose/3.7.1
 * didrocks goes for some cycling
<pitti> didrocks: I actually meant display-manager.service.d/, so that we can keep to Wants=
<pitti> didrocks: oh wow, thanks!
<didrocks> pitti: the issue is that we would have graphical.target still active
<didrocks> I'm unsure we would want that
<pitti> didrocks: you didn't ref/close the bug?
<didrocks> right now, it's overriding well as a Requires
<pitti> oh, invalid
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, it's not exactly the same approach/component, so didn't retarget it
<pitti> didrocks: anyway, great to see that this .d/ thing works!
<didrocks> yeah ;)
<pitti> didrocks: now, 218 isn't in vivid yet, but I'll work on that as fast as possible :)
<didrocks> pitti: we can just override display-manager.service.d if you prefer in the future, I'm just not feeling confortable letting graphical.target as active when the graphical server didn't really start
<didrocks> pitti: actually, it's working on 217 as well
<didrocks> 218 just introduce the edit command
<pitti> didrocks: ok, that seems fine
<pitti> didrocks: oh right
<didrocks> this override mechanism are how generators are working in /run/system/ actually :)
<didrocks> I just didn't map into my brain, but yeah, way nicer
<didrocks> thanks for the suggestion :)
 * pitti hgus didrocks
<pitti> ok, I'm off for some hours to do some christmas shopping
 * didrocks hugs pitti back
<didrocks> enjoy! (and good luck)
 * didrocks really off to some exercise now
<ochosi> larsu: another question, if i may, is patching CSD in gnome-calculator also on your list?
<dgadomski> hello everyone
<dgadomski> Trevinho: hey, do you remember the focus storing change (fix for bug #1125442)?
<ubot5> bug 1125442 in Compiz 0.9.11 "Always Visible and On Top Windows Steal Focus on Workspace Switch" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1125442
<dgadomski> Trevinho: there was a regression caused by the change (bug #1393020), do you have any idea how to differentiate viewport moving caused "manually" from those caused by clicking on the launcher (like in the bug description) on the compiz level?
<ubot5> bug 1393020 in compiz (Ubuntu) "[regression] "Remember Focus" does not play well with unity launcher so shouldn't be default enabled or better yet the rev should be reverted" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1393020
<Trevinho> dgadomski: hi
<Trevinho> dgadomski: mh, no I don't remember a way now... but I could investigate
<Trevinho> dgadomski: however, Brandon Schaefer (now offline, it will be back in about 2hrs) said me he prepared a fix for that changwe
<Trevinho> dgadomski: so, if you wait him to join yo could have a chat with him about that
<larsu> ochosi: again, works on unity :)
<larsu> ochosi: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/vivid/gnome-calculator/vivid/view/head:/debian/patches/git_no_headerbars_in_unity.patch
<larsu> ochosi: probably we should update this to !GNOME as well
<ochosi> yeah: if (!is_desktop ("Unity"))
<dgadomski> Trevinho: great, I will talk to him, thanks!
<ochosi> larsu: yeah, would be great in order for things to be consistent, at least across desktops
<Laney> ricotz: that's only in the gtk2 one, right? and I think it's going to be dropped from there too
<Laney> so... yes
<draven33> need some help with compiz in 14.04  i activatewd dual loghin compoz and metacity an can't align the 3d windows on the cube they form outside the cube
<ricotz> Laney, i meant the gtk3 3.14.5 packaging
<Laney> where do you think it got dropped?
<ricotz> Laney, iirc I added it in the early gtk3 packaging for gnome3 ppa, and I thought it is needed still
<ricotz> ignore me if it isn't needed anymore and i will drop it as well
<Mirv> I wonder if any core-dev would be happy to ack compiz https://ci-train.ubuntu.com/job/ubuntu-landing-012-2-publish/46/artifact/packaging_changes_compiz_1%3A0.9.12.0+15.04.20141210.2-0ubuntu1.diff ? ...or if I'll ask for better changelog. all of that is related to the line "added support for multi-arch installations"
<Mirv> mostly the cleanup to remove all debian/tmp/ from *.install could have been mentioned as well
<bschaefer> dgadomski, hello!
<dgadomski> bschaefer: hey
<bschaefer> did you have some questions about the workspace needing reverting?
<dgadomski> I wanted to fix bug #1125442, but Trevinho told me that you were working on some fixes already
<ubot5> bug 1125442 in Compiz 0.9.11 "Always Visible and On Top Windows Steal Focus on Workspace Switch" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1125442
<bschaefer> dgadomski, well i wasn't actually work on a fix atm
<bschaefer> i fixed a bug your prev merge caused but that was a simple fix. The main other issue would be to not re-focus a cached window when clicking on a launcher icon
<bschaefer> Trevinho, do you remember how the launcher icon actually focus an icon on a differnet workspace?
<bschaefer> we call a workspace switch in unity or compiz?
<dgadomski> bschaefer, oh, sorry, I pasted wrong link, this was the bug I was thinking about: bug #1393020
<ubot5> bug 1393020 in compiz (Ubuntu) "[regression] "Remember Focus" does not play well with unity launcher so shouldn't be default enabled or better yet the rev should be reverted" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1393020
<bschaefer> dgadomski, right, i assigned my self that bug just because i reverted your merge
<bschaefer> (not really a fix though)
<Trevinho> bschaefer: all unity side should bein PluginAdapter::FocusWindowGroup
 * bschaefer looks
<Trevinho> bschaefer: so, there's no direct request to switch to another vp... it just happens when you ask compiz to focus a window
<bschaefer> Trevinho, i see, so we can patch that bit of code in compiz i suppose?
<bschaefer> that should be in ... screen/window.cpp?
<Trevinho> bschaefer: I suppose
<Trevinho> bschaefer: probably on activate window
<bschaefer> Trevinho, well ideally we need to think of a better way to cache said window
<bschaefer> dgadomski, but ideally, we need to come up with a way to restore focus on that cached window
<bschaefer> if and only if its on that workspace and we are not focusing a new window on that workspace
<dgadomski> bschaefer: I was debugging this and I saw that moveViewport (where the window is cached) is called in both cases and I was not able to determine how to differentiate between "manual" viewport changing versus the launcher-initiated
<bschaefer> right, that was a worry of mine as well... though we might have to figure out a better way to cache the window
<bschaefer> dgadomski, theres a place somewhere in compiz
<bschaefer> that focuses a window
<bschaefer> thats what the launcher uses, and in there it switches the viewport
<bschaefer> so we can detect when the launcher is being used, or rather we can detect when a window is being focus (hopefully?)
 * bschaefer looks at compiz
<bschaefer> Trevinho, dgadomski looks like the wall plugin causes the window to be moved
<bschaefer> you can test that out by disabling the plugin then attempting to click on a launcher icon... strange
<dgadomski> bschaefer: what do you mean by "causes the window to be moved"?
<bschaefer> dgadomski, err not window to be moved but workspace/viewport to be moved
<dgadomski> bschaefer: yeah, and if you change the wall to e.g. cube you are still affected by this issue, so this needs to be fixed below the plugin layer
<bschaefer> dgadomski, right, but we need to ensure the plugins work as well
<bschaefer> dgadomski, the issue being that the unity launcher is using the wall plugin (or rather the wall plugin is auto moving workspaces to the "wanted" focused window)
 * bschaefer might not be making much sense
<dgadomski> bschaefer: I see your point, the unity launcher also works in the same way with cube, so probably cube also moves viewports while focusing a window outside current viewport
<bschaefer> dgadomski, right, so if those plugins are disabled
<bschaefer> all is well
<bschaefer> but we have the wall enabled, meaning it'll attempt to focus a window
<bschaefer> on its viewport
<bschaefer> so we need to add a case in that plugin to be handled
<bschaefer> dgadomski, then i think we can get the fix re-merged :)
<bschaefer> compiz is ... like a N headed monster where N is the number of plugins enabled...
<dgadomski> bschaefer: Trevinho mentioned earlier that there may be a way to recognize the reason behind the moveViewport inside compiz
<larsu> bschaefer: lol, more like N = 2^n_plugins
<bschaefer> larsu, haha... true
<willcooke> +RAND(10)
<bschaefer> Trevinho, ^
<bschaefer> n^n
<Trevinho> dgadomski: ehm? :P
<bschaefer> i like to imagine the best way this could turn out... We need to have ideally on each workspace a last focused window
<dgadomski> "<Trevinho> dgadomski: mh, no I don't remember a way now... but I could investigate"
<bschaefer> when we have landed on said workspace we need a way to check "Did we just change focus to get here?" vs "We just got here, change focus to last focused window"
<bschaefer> those two cases are the tricky part, but what "should" happen
<dgadomski> Trevinho: so if you don't remember a way not it means that there probably was a *WAY* :)
<bschaefer> is as soon as the launcher focuses the window, the last focused window for that workspace should be updated
<bschaefer> which would resolve our issues
<Trevinho> dgadomski: oh, yeah... there is... :)
<bschaefer> Trevinho, haha
<bschaefer> dgadomski, so we need to look at making sure we update the last focused cached window per workspace
<bschaefer> if we can do that, then when the launcher focuses a window on any workspace, that workspace updates its last focused window and we are set :)
<Trevinho> bschaefer: it's very likely that each workspace plugin (like wall or cube) implements that switch
<bschaefer> Trevinho, i greped
<bschaefer> Trevinho, but it doesn't matter, we can get around this under the hood
<bschaefer> Trevinho, all we have to check for is FOCUS OF NEW WINDOW
<bschaefer> when a new window is focused update the last focused window on the workspace its on
<Trevinho> bschaefer: I see..
<bschaefer> so when we move to that workspace it will always get focus
<bschaefer> that sound reasonable?
<bschaefer> as...other wise im just imagining a mess of code to handle all strange edge cases
<Trevinho> bschaefer: yes, that seems correct
<bschaefer> so instead of updating the last focused window each time we move workspace
<bschaefer> the details could be hammered out
<dgadomski> bschaefer: are you thinking about caching focused window e.g. in CompWindow::activate?
<bschaefer> dgadomski, not 100% sure where but that might be a good place
<bschaefer> dgadomski, we just need a way to cache a window per workspace
<bschaefer> and when a new window is focused to update that cache array
 * didrocks waves good evening and good night
<dgadomski> bschaefer: caching in CompWindow::activate does not work as expected, I will continue debugging tomorrow morning
<bschaefer> dgadomski, sounds good, i think the screen will have to know about it
<bschaefer> vs the window
<bschaefer> good luck!
<dgadomski> bschaefer: thanks! take care
<bschaefer> you to!
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-12-16
<calamari> hi. I suspended my tablet and now it wants my password. but, I cannot type anything because the on screen keyboard is not showing up.
<calamari> what do I do?
<sarnold> calamari: can you ssh in and file a bug? ubuntu-bug unity  I think ought to do it
<sarnold> calamari: I don't know if there's any way to request the keyboard or break the lock though :/
<calamari> Gave up and plugged in a keyboard
<calamari> Disable the lock screen now
<sarnold> oh, nice :)
<calamari> I guess that will work
<pitti> Good morning
<larsu> good morning!
<didrocks> good morning
<larsu> lut didrocks!
<didrocks> hey larsu :)
<darkxst> hey didrocks, larsu
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, Ã§a va ?
<pitti> hey larsu, hello darkxst
<pitti> didrocks: do you still have something to upload for systemd? I'm about to upload 218-2 to exp, and merge to Ubuntu
<larsu> good morning pitti, darkxst!
<didrocks> evening darkxst :)
<didrocks> pitti: no, nothing to upload from me
<didrocks> pitti: Ã§a va bien, et toi ?
<pitti> didrocks: moi aussi, merci !
<darkxst> hey pitti
<darkxst> seems didrocks is the only one that has my timezone correct ;)
<darkxst> larsu, any progress on gtk?
<larsu> darkxst: working on some last theme fixes - I think Laney wants to upload after that
<darkxst> larsu, ok good ;)
<darkxst> larsu,  have you seen https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=735211 (re 3.16 has removed theme engine) specifically comment #10]
<ubot5> Gnome bug 735211 in Class: GtkStyleContext "Deprecating gtkthemingengine in 3.14" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<larsu> darkxst: yes, Company told me before it happened
<larsu> darkxst: and actually waited until we could do all things in our theme without unico
<darkxst> larsu, so it won't be a problem then?
<larsu> darkxst: not for ubuntu-themes
<larsu> I don't know about others
<darkxst> ok
<mlankhorst> morning
<Mirv> pitti: if you'd have some time at some point, please see the trusty usb-creator SRU which seems to work fine https://code.launchpad.net/~yuningdodo/ubuntu/trusty/usb-creator/usb-creator.lp1361474+lp1300361-recreate-udisks-client/+merge/232852
<didrocks> hey mlankhorst
<mlankhorst> hey
<willcooke> morning
<didrocks> good morning willcooke
<didrocks> still sick? :/
<willcooke> mildly
<willcooke> :)
<didrocks> I guess you will get on shape just in time for holidays ;)
<willcooke> I hope so :)
<willcooke> There is something going round at the school.  Some people have had it for 3 weeks :/
<Trevinho> oh, same curse hrere -_
<willcooke> :(
<Trevinho> -_-
<didrocks> urgh :/
<Laney> hey hey
<didrocks> greetings Laney!
<willcooke> o/
<Laney> what's up
<pitti> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> pitti in multiple channels!
<Laney> looking forward to the holidays
<Laney> Christmas pub quiz tonight :-)
<Laney> you?
<pitti> multi-vector IRC attack mode!
<pitti> last 2.5 days of work this year, too; I'm also looking forward to the 2 week break
 * didrocks publishes ubuntu make 0.3 now that it's in the release pocket
<didrocks> pitti: do you have time to talk about the keyboard console setup and fsck support in systemd?
<pitti> didrocks: yeah, let's do it now
<pitti> didrocks: want to HO?
<didrocks> pitti: fine with me :)
<pitti> didrocks: calling
<Laney> took me 8 tries to type my gpg passphrase just then
<Laney> security through untypability
<mlankhorst> oh my security is security through amnesia
<willcooke> :D
<mlankhorst> I have a laptop for which I can't access the disk because I forgot the crypto password
<willcooke_> hey willcooke get outta here already
<willcooke> mlankhorst, after a few false starts I'm back up and running in U8 again
<willcooke> mlankhorst, should I add your PPA yet, or keep waiting?
<mlankhorst> sec
<mlankhorst> should be safe
<didrocks> pitti: any opinon on bug #1401984?
<ubot5> bug 1401984 in systemd (Ubuntu) "non persistent logging after cleaning log files on disk" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1401984
<pitti> didrocks: yeah, I noticed that as well, seems a bug in how rsyslog creates the dir
<pitti> didrocks: oh -- /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/var.conf creates it as 0755 root:root, perhaps that's related?
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, as it can't write to it
<pitti> I'm not sure what creates that dir under upstart
<willcooke> didrocks, can you tell me, is there a LP page/project for the system settings in u8?
<willcooke> s/didrocks/anyone
<didrocks> pitti: seems it's creating with the same right nevertheless
<pitti> didrocks: oh, it's rsyslog.postinst which creates it
<didrocks> willcooke: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-system-settings
<pitti> didrocks: no, my dir here is also root:syslog 0755
<pitti> didrocks: I've got a feeling that tmpfiles.d snippet needs its permissions fixed
<willcooke> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> willcooke: yw
<willcooke> oh, cant log bugs there
<didrocks> pitti: so, 2 fixes? tmpfiles.d to root:syslog and the perm as 775?
<willcooke> ignore
<pitti> didrocks: yeah
<didrocks> willcooke: yeah, you need to log bugs at the package level
<willcooke> thx didrocks - I saw the message about 0.5 of a second after I hit enter :)
<didrocks> pitti: and then, seeing why I got some different perms than the rotated file
<didrocks> on the syslog file itself
<didrocks> heh :)
<pitti> didrocks: I'll verify this and fix debian/patches/Bring-tmpfiles.d-tmp.conf-in-line-with-Debian-defaul.patch accordingly
<didrocks> pitti: TBH, having it owned by syslog group sounds like just a hack as multiple daemons write there, they all should be able to recreate their file
<pitti> didrocks: wouldn't they all run as syslog user?
<desrt> good morning eÅ­ropanoj
<didrocks> pitti: Xserver, lightdm?
<didrocks> pitti: lightdm doesn't forward to syslog IIRC?
<didrocks> hey desrt
<larsu> morning desrt!
<pitti> didrocks: right, they all have their own log files; X runs as root, lightdm logs into /var/log/lightdm/ (but also as root)
<larsu> you're up late today ;)
<desrt> larsu: i've been up an hour already :)
<didrocks> pitti: right, I know, we don't want to tackle that now, but sounds that we are just safe because most of those daemons run as root :)
<desrt> waking up before the sun is nice during the winter because it means that you're awake to take in 100% of the tiny amount of sun we get at this time of year
<pitti> didrocks: yeah, the others have to create their own subdir
<didrocks> pitti: ok, so fixing to root:syslog and 775 for now?
<pitti> didrocks: just tested that under sid, and it doesn't automagically fix things; hang on
<didrocks> pitti: oh? I did chmod/chown here quite happily
<didrocks> both under systemd and upstart
<pitti> didrocks: yes, I mean editing /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/var.conf
<didrocks> ah
<didrocks> yeah, I guess as the dir is already there and created by rsyslog postinstâ¦
<didrocks> it doesn't "fix" permissions, right?
<pitti> didrocks: oh! no syslog group under Debian, rsyslog runs as root
<larsu> desrt: dude, don't tell me about a tiny amount of sun you get. Try living nine degrees further north
<didrocks> pitti: oh? interestingâ¦
<desrt> larsu: :)
<didrocks> sun was nice, but sun was yesterdayâ¦ :/
<pitti> didrocks: yep, works fine; I'll fix it
<didrocks> pitti: ok, rsyslog + systemd then?
<pitti> didrocks: not sure yet; either I'll patch the original file in systemd, or find out whether later tmpfiles.d/ can override previous entries, then we can ship it in rsyslog
<pitti> to keep the delta at one place
<pitti> If multiple files specify the same path,
<pitti>        the entry in the file with the lexicographically earliest name will be applied
<pitti> great
<didrocks> pitti: let me try if it's fixing the perms
<pitti> didrocks: works fine here
<pitti> didrocks: thanks for pointing out, I'll upload a fix
<didrocks> pitti: hum, I wonder why it didn't "fix it" to root:root beforehand?
<didrocks> as /var/log/ was root:syslog and /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/var.conf mentioned root:root
<pitti> didrocks: tmpfiles.d doesn't say that; - means "no change"
<didrocks> ah
<pitti> didrocks: if you say 0755 root root - it would change
<didrocks> pitti: ok, so you are changing that as well, interesting that we can enforce this under systemd
<didrocks> pitti: that won't fix the issue under upstart though, but ENOTAREGRESSION I guess :)
 * larsu read ENOTANAGRESSION
<pitti> didrocks: yeah :)
<didrocks> larsu: depends on how much you can be offended by syslog :)
<larsu> didrocks: not really tbh
<pitti> didrocks: testing http://paste.ubuntu.com/9540423/ now
<didrocks> pitti: seems logical (and seems systemd logic is always "first one wins")
<pitti> didrocks: yes, that's documented
<didrocks> pitti: want me to retry on my spare box?
<pitti> didrocks: sure, if you want to; I'll toss you the debs once they are built
<didrocks> good ;)
<pitti> didrocks: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/tmp/rsyslog_7.4.4-1ubuntu12_amd64.deb
 * didrocks installs and reboots
<pitti> didrocks: works fine here, I cleaned /var/log/* before; with current rsyslog, no new files; with that rsyslog, I get files and the dir perms are ok
<didrocks> pitti: confirmed, work!
<pitti> didrocks: merci ! /me dputs
<didrocks> sweet ;)
<pitti> didrocks: meh, I haven't the slightest idea why my test container gets killed when the VM runs under Jenkins, but not when I run it manually :/
<pitti> didrocks: I suspect /etc/machine-id isn't properly initialized (unfortunately there's no journal that early in the boot process)
 * pitti blames didrocks' new patch :)
<pitti> (j/k, I call systemd-machine-setup manually before, it should be there)
<didrocks> pitti: well, you can still check that by just disabling the .service ;)
<didrocks> I don't think that unmounting or whatsoever will kill the Jenkins VM, apart from an apparmor thing seeing the service as doing bad things :p
<davmor2> pitti: so let me get this straight there is no logging if systemd isn't up so how the hell do you find out whats wrong with the kernel that stopping systemd from starting ;)
<pitti> davmor2: there's dmesg ;)
<pitti> davmor2: but I don't see dmesg on test failure, and I'm not sure if it's working for containers (I doubt it)
 * pitti waves, cu tomorrow
<davmor2> pitti: ah that would do it :)
<davmor2> pitti: o/
<didrocks> have a good evening pitti :)
<willcooke> if everyone could just agree on whether is single or double hyphens for passing in command line params, that'd be great
<desrt> willcooke: there's a universal standard there violated only extremely rarely
<desrt> double hypens for --gnu-style-long-args and single for single-letter flags
<desrt> and only a few weird commands like tar which let you give options without using - at all
<desrt> and a few others than take long flags with -, like 'find', but those are very rare
<desrt> (and with find, you're really not giving commandline options as much as writing a small program.... as evidenced by the fact that '!' is one of the args you can give)
<larsu> desrt: and all of the qt command line tools use single hyphen for long flags
<willcooke> meeting time
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Dec 16 15:30:46 2014 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic:
 * willcooke is unprepared #
<willcooke> please stand by
<didrocks> <lift music>
 * Sweet5hark stands by
 * Sweet5hark hopes the lift music is creative commons. If the music is bad, at least its properly licensed.
<willcooke> Roll call:  attente_ desrt  didrocks FJKong? Laney larsu mlankhorst qengho Sweet5hark tkamppeter
<willcooke> I think thats everyone
<mlankhorst> hey
 * qengho is here.
<FJKong> hey
<willcooke> attente_, are you around?
<willcooke> #topic attente_
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic: attente_
<attente_> backport gdk-mir patches: https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/gtk/refresh-mir-backend/+merge/244491
<attente_> debugging pointer crossing events
<willcooke> good stuff, thanks attente_
<willcooke> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic: desrt
<willcooke> he was here a minute ago
<willcooke> we can come back around if needs be
<willcooke> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic: didrocks
<didrocks> hey
<didrocks> Ubuntu developer desktop:
<didrocks> * Released Ubuntu Make 0.3: http://blog.didrocks.fr/post/Ubuntu-Make-0.3-brings-Intellij-IDEA-and-Pycharm-support
<didrocks> * Additional fix for the appmenu support in java application, now in archive (but stuck in proposed and some archs FTBFS) and MIR in progress!
<didrocks> * Merged intellij and pycharm branches
<didrocks> * Fixed medium tests that were failing. Tests are becoming hard to track due to the datacenter still being down for desktop VM tests.
<didrocks> * Refreshed docker images
<didrocks> Systemd:
<didrocks> * Analyzed fsck <-> plymouth integration, as well as looking our ubuntu logo theme. After discussing with Martin, we'll go to more complex solution, but which is acceptable upstream and will remove quite some cruft in our plymouth themes.
<didrocks> * Enabled the X fallback.
<didrocks> * Some debugging around keyboard issue and logging (which was in syslog after all)
<didrocks> Bluez:
<didrocks> * Discussed with rsalvetti on the kernel fixes that will be needed for Touch to ensure we won't be blocked on this
<didrocks> Mic:
<didrocks> * Voted on FOSDEM desktop room talk.
<didrocks> * Archive admin and some MIR duties.
<didrocks> EOF
<mlankhorst> cheers for the fallback-x work
<willcooke> woot, thanks didrocks
<didrocks> yw ;)
<willcooke> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic: FJKong
<FJKong> * continue pinyin research
<FJKong> * close 2 bugs of sogou input method get ready for new version release
<FJKong> * take one day off
<FJKong> EOF
<willcooke> thanks FJKong
<FJKong> yw
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic: Laney
<Laney> â¢ More work on gtk 3.14, merge .6, merge with Debian, test, ready to go once theme is
<Laney> â¢ Update evolution (+ in Debian, although not so relevant there) to not pass -Bsymbolic-functions when linking, can crash otherwise
<Laney> â¢ Also update evolution-* to 3.12.9, need to SRU this to 14.10
<Laney> â¢ Update vte2.91 + in Debian
<Laney> â¢ Update libsoup2.4 + in Debian
<Laney> â Test failure and another test hang, upstream both with fix for first, upload w/test disabled :(
<Laney> â¢ SRU glib-networking to 14.10
<Laney> â¢ Update dpkg to add some Breaks to work around dpkg trigger cycles, track CI for this due to infrastructure downtime
<Laney> â¢ Merge new dbus upstream from Debian, thanks MoM
<Laney> â¢ DMB: meeting, welcome teward as a new developer
<Laney> â¢ Install desktop-next, find out that gtk is broken in mir, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qtmir/+bug/1401968
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1401968 in QtMir "GTK applications don't work anymore under unity8" [Critical,Triaged]
<Laney> â¢ Organise travel for fosdem and a sprint afterwards
<Laney> â¢ Fix a crash bug in gnome-terminal caused by our transparency patch
<Laney> â
<willcooke> nice
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<Laney> np
<willcooke> #topic larsu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic: larsu
<larsu> hey. My cold came back again last week, so I don't have a whole lot to report
<larsu> still working on the gtk update and related things (like the theme :( )
<willcooke> ack, thx larsu
<larsu> sorry for the short one this time :/
<Laney> what do you think is left before we can upload?
<willcooke> hope the cold goes away, I feel your pain :)
<larsu> thanks, it's better this week
<larsu> Laney: I have a hang of getting caught up in too many fixes in the theme at once. I'll try to separate the most important bits right after the meeting
<Laney> maybe we can just take the branch as-is
<Laney> you can keep working on it after that of course
<larsu> sure, that works as well
<willcooke> cool
<willcooke> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic: desrt
<willcooke> back to desrt
<desrt> was another big week of kdbus hacking
 * Laney sees steam rising in front of the window and knows that the heating is now on :D
<mlankhorst> and there's a leak?
<desrt> i did some substantial reengineering of how that's structured internally, getting rid of quite some hackery that's in there... and kdbus is now working single threaded, and it's able to send and receive messages exactly as you expect for async apps (services and clients)
<Laney> why would there be a leak?
<mlankhorst> steam!
<desrt> unfortunately due to not running the mainloop it deadlocks during sync calls -- but that's totally fine because i wanted to change how that works anyway (to make it much more efficient) so i'm going to do that over the next while
<desrt> i also played with schroot and did some work on the sysdeps feature of jhbuild over the weekend -- this will help with jhbuilding inside of buildds, which could be interesting for a lot of reasons
<desrt> schroot is cool.  if you are an ubuntu developer who hasn't fully learned about how to use this tool, take some time to learn it.
<desrt> it's really really great
<desrt> eof
<willcooke> thanks desrt
<willcooke> I think I will check out schroot too
<desrt> if you need some help poke me (or Laney may even be better)
<willcooke> could be useful for when I try and build things from source and end up smashing new libs all over the place because I'm too lazy to work out how to do it properly
<Laney> ubuntu-dev-tools has a mk-sbuild script to make the chroots
<willcooke> niiiiice!
<desrt> willcooke: ya... it's awesome for spinning up a system that you can feel free to absolutely destroy
<desrt> and then wipe it all away again a few seconds later
<desrt> Laney: it's also super-easy to just debootstrap them
<willcooke> sounds like I need that in my life
<desrt> although i guess you have to do some manual work of building a .tar or whatever
<willcooke> better than reinstalling because I'm stupid
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> #topic mlankhorst
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic: mlankhorst
<mlankhorst> - Found a regression in the mesa-lts-utopic backport to trusty, uploaded a fix.
<mlankhorst> - Uploaded a new xorg-server to vivid with the security fixes.
<mlankhorst> - Prepared xorg-server 1.17 in ppa:canonical-x/x-staging.
<mlankhorst> - Rebased standalone Xmir on top of 1.17 and made it work on GLES platforms.
<mlankhorst> - Fixed mesa acceleration in Xmir 1.17 just now.
<mlankhorst> - Fixed a regression in nouveau.
<mlankhorst> ^D
<willcooke> mlankhorst, was getting 200+ fps in gears today :)
<willcooke> I know it's not a real test :)
<willcooke> but I like it
<mlankhorst> with -egl? that means that vblank was not working and it was using -sw mode :P
<willcooke> yeah, it did look like vblank wasnt working
<willcooke> but SPEED :)
<mlankhorst> oh try with hw, really..
<willcooke> switch ?
<willcooke> -hw?
<mlankhorst> no just wait a bit
<willcooke> always with the waiting :)
<qengho> Is that "no hardware"?
<mlankhorst> sa19 has fixed the black screen when using mesa
<mlankhorst> resizing seems to work correctly too
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic: qengho
<qengho> * Nursing. Entrire family has the flu.
<qengho> * More work on Mir/Wayland/Ozone/Chromium.
<qengho> Installed Desktop Next. Cried a lot. Switched back for now.
<willcooke> lol
<willcooke> hope everyone is on feeling better soon qengho - sounds like a lot of us are suffering this week
<willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic: Sweet5hark
<qengho> *I* got a wonderful vaccine, I guess.
<mlankhorst> willcooke: if you want a better test for acceleration, try https://mblankhorst.nl/etc/glxspheres
<qengho> Thanks.
<Sweet5hark> * 4.3.5~rc2 created tarballs, will build for PPA and later SRU later todayish
<Sweet5hark> * some grinding trough launchpad bugs
<Sweet5hark> * I caused a regression upstream, is fixed now, but misses a test: writing that right now
<Sweet5hark> * prepare 4.4.0~beta2 prerelease for ppa (twice. some hassle with the tarballs being actually beta1 tarballs, so needed extra tweakage)
<Sweet5hark> * some code review,
<Sweet5hark> org and the usual syncing upstream (e.g. among other stuff, helped collecting some datapoints on TDFs 2014 annual report at http://pad.documentfoundation.org/p/annualreport)
<Sweet5hark> * havent looked at schroot yet, wonder I should still do, now that I have my own lo-pbuilder wrapper running in a jenkins doing most of the chrooting/setuiding
<Sweet5hark> EOF
<willcooke> thx Sweet5hark
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<willcooke> guess tkamppeter isnt around atm
<willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<willcooke> Worked on:
<willcooke> - Finished gnome-bluetooth patch (awaiting review)
<willcooke> - Started on gnome-control-center bluetooth patch
<willcooke> - Fixed simple-scan bugs
<willcooke> - Released simple-scan 3.15.3
<willcooke> - TPM support
<willcooke> - Reviewed merge proposals
<willcooke> oops
<willcooke> Should say:
<willcooke> - Started on unity-control-center bluetooth patch
<willcooke> #topic any other business
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2014-12-16 | Current topic: any other business
<Laney> when's next meeting?
<willcooke> For those of you who are going to the Mir sprint please get your travel auth done asap
<willcooke> Next meeting will be 6 Jan
<willcooke> Oh, and FOSDEM people, travel auth as well please
<willcooke> Have an excellent and restful holiday
<willcooke> HO HO HO - HAPPY PRIMARY GIFTING PERIOD
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Dec 16 16:00:02 2014 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2014/ubuntu-desktop.2014-12-16-15.30.moin.txt
<didrocks> thanks, you too! :)
<tkamppeter> - system-config-printer: Completed first Utopic SRU verification, withdrawn Trusty SRU as IPP-over-USB is not yet working correctly, posted Utopic and Trusty SRUs for fixing automatic driver download.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<willcooke> thx tkamppeter sorry I was too hasty with ending the meetin
<willcooke> g
<willcooke> mlankhorst, for spheres, do I use -egl ?
<mlankhorst> no :P
<mlankhorst> -egl was a hack because I was still working on fixing xmir, those fixes are in sa19
<willcooke> mlankhorst, just getting the blackness without
<willcooke> so I should wait, right?
<mlankhorst> update xmir
<mlankhorst> sec
 * willcooke is scared 
<willcooke> it wants to upgrade u8 too
<willcooke> and it'll break again :)
<mlankhorst> install xserver-xorg-xmir=2:1.17.0~rc1-0ubuntu1+sa19
<Laney> anyone know where to find fedora build logs offhand?
<Laney> found it koji.fedoraproject.org
<willcooke> mlankhorst, installed, thx
<willcooke> mlankhorst, so now I drop the -egl ?
<willcooke> mlankhorst, Xmir wont connect to Mir at all now
<willcooke> mlankhorst, ignore, works now
<willcooke> ??
<mlankhorst> ok
<mlankhorst> drop the -egl
<willcooke> nice and smooth :)
<willcooke> and synced
 * Laney waves
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-12-17
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> Ã§a va pitti ?
 * didrocks digs into ubuntu archives about the hibernate removal discussion :p
<pitti> didrocks: Ã§a va bien, et toi ?
<didrocks> pitti: Ã§a va bien ! Il fait encore un peu trop nuit pour aller faire du vÃ©lo avant la pluie :)
<pitti> oui, c'est encore sombre ici aussi
<mlankhorst> Hello, world!
<didrocks> hey mlankhorst!
<mlankhorst> bonjour
<mlankhorst> ca va?
<didrocks> Ã§a va bien ! et toi ? :)
<mlankhorst> ca va :p
<pitti> hmm, did anyone try ubuntu-desktop-next? I just tried the amd64 one on my thinkpad, and I don't get very far
<pitti> I see the "welcome to your phone" wizard coming up (using only a small part of my external screen, and only rendering halfway on the internal one)
<pitti> I can move the mouse cursor, but that's it -- no clicking, no "continue", no changing lanugage, keyboard doesn't do anything, etc.
<pitti> Laney: ^
<didrocks> pitti: did you try only with one monitor?
<didrocks> I know multiple monitors are not supported yet, so maybe that's what puzzle Mir?
<pitti> only external one would be ok too :)
<pitti> no, I didn't try yet, I'll do now
<didrocks> pitti: maybe it can't just decide between your two shiny monitors ;)
<pitti> didrocks, Laney: ok, with just the internal monitor it worked better
<pitti> the terminal app doesn't install, though :/
<pitti> (install button doesn't do anything)
<pitti> anyway, I could do what I wanted on VT1 after finding out how to log in :)
<pitti> can we pretty please pre-install terminal-app?
<didrocks> pitti: that would be for Laney's seed I guess, but yeah :)
<didrocks> pitti: did you log in to sso by any chance?
<pitti> didrocks: yes, I had to
<pitti> otherwise you can't install apps
<didrocks> ok, so termina app doesn't install? weird
<didrocks> terminal*
<didrocks> ok, going for some cycling before the rain
<didrocks> ttyl guys :)
<mlankhorst> have fun
<didrocks> thx
<mlankhorst> cold cold cold
<willcooke> morning
<Laney> pitti: it's click only and we can't/don't install them
<Laney> and it's not "my" seed
<Laney> also hi
<willcooke> :)
<mlankhorst> ooh, greece spam
<mlankhorst> helpfully with a english translation below it
<willcooke> didrocks, thank you for you email re: hibernate - very interesting
<willcooke> I agree, we shouldn't/couldn't use it
<didrocks> willcooke: yeah, the feature is great under really specific circumstances
<didrocks> but not widely applicable unfortunately
<willcooke> yeah
<pitti> Laney: https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/vivid-adt-glib2.0/28 regression (email notifications are still broken)
<pitti> it also seems to have regressed deja-dup
<Laney> pitti: blag, ok
<Laney> Test glib/network-monitor.test failed: Child process killed by signal 11
<Laney> interesting that it worked at build time
<Laney> let's see
<pitti> Laney: I can retry the glib one
<Laney> it's probably real
<Laney> well bah, it works in a chroot
 * Laney does the adt dance
<Laney> oh man, accidentally hit ctrl-c after it failed
<Laney> at least it did fail
<Laney> larsu: gdbus question
<Laney> It's possible to create a GDBusProxy for any name if you give G_DBUS_PROXY_FLAGS_DO_NOT_AUTOSTART isn't it?
<larsu> Laney: you can also create it for any name if you don't pass that flag :)
<Laney> won't it try to start it and give an error then?
<Laney> I mean a name which you don't have a .service for on the system
<larsu> right, it will error out with "no such name"
<ochosi> larsu: not sure whether you're seeing this in unity too, but indicator sound's scale is reacting a bit odd to click-events with gtk3.14
<larsu> Laney: but the same happens if the name doesn't exist and you pass DO_NOT_AUTOSTART
<Laney> run this test program
<larsu> ochosi: indeed...
<Laney> http://paste.ubuntu.com/9550482/
<ochosi> larsu: ok, good to know. i was afraid it would only be in xubuntu...
<larsu> ochosi: thanks for pointing it out :)
<Laney> I get "yes"
<ochosi> larsu: no worries, i guess that's the whole point of testing the gtk3.14 PPA ;)
<larsu> Laney: not sure right now what the semantics are. The proxy definitely calls GetNameOwner(), so "g-name-owner" should be NULL for you
<larsu> Laney: but it doesn't seem to watch the name. Strange.
<Laney> right I'm wondering if you need to do a test like this before using it
<Laney> this is coming from glib itself https://git.gnome.org/browse/glib/tree/gio/gnetworkmonitornm.c#n248
<Laney> this code crashes if nm isn't installed
<larsu> wow
<larsu> do you have a bt?
<Laney> over there ->
<Laney> line 222 props is NULL
<Laney> from line 260
<larsu> it should definitely not crash, even if you call a method on a non-connected proxy
<Laney> I think 256 probably just wants to check the owner as well?
<larsu> Laney: g_dbus_proxy_get_cached_property_names() is documented to return NULL in some cases
<larsu> so that code should check for that
<larsu> Laney: not sure, let me check when this even happens
<Laney> and probably check for NULL there too I guess, for safety's sake
<larsu> Laney: ah, it only returns NULL if it cannot connect to the bus at all
<Laney> nod
<larsu> it should probably check for name-owner
<larsu> and also for NULL in 222
<larsu> but that won't ever be a problem I think: properties are always loaded when the name exists
<Laney> might as well, or an assert ...
<larsu> right
<larsu> this code also doesn't deal with nm restarting
<larsu> not sure if that is ever an issue though
<Laney> larsu: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=741653
<ubot5> Gnome bug 741653 in gio "gnetworkmonitornm: Check if network-manager is running" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<Laney> something weird happened to the bt
 * Laney lunch
<Sweet5hark> soo, people onboard UAL28 seem to be doing sightseeing over the Isle of Wright and the Channel for 2-3 hours now ... thats not exactly on the way from Heathrow to NY.
<willcooke> didrocks, qengho, bregma - got a familly emergency, have to cancel our meetings.  WIll catch up with you later.
<willcooke> mlankhorst, ^
<qengho> rgr
<mlankhorst> ok bb
<mlankhorst> good luck
<tkamppeter> Laney, hi
<tkamppeter> Laney, about the syncing of cups-filters, I asked OdyX already some weeks ago and there he already told me that he had started on the ippusbxd package and so I did not do the same, already done work. He told me that he will put the ippusbxd package into experimental for now, due to the Debian freeze.
<larsu> Laney: just pushed two commits which to ~larsu/ubuntu-themes/gtk-314 which fix all button issues I was aware of
<larsu> and updated the pad
<Laney> tkamppeter: I see some recent commits there actually, would be nice to find out what's left to do and get it uploaded :)
<Laney> larsu: cool, care to make a MP?
<larsu> Laney: sure
<Laney> does anyone normally review those?
<larsu> https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/ubuntu-themes/gtk-314/+merge/245004
<larsu> Laney: seb does
<larsu> when I ask him too :)
<Laney> cheers
<larsu> Laney: are you subscribed to unity-control-center MRs?
<Laney> nope
<larsu> Laney: this trivial fix would be nice-to-have: https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/unity-control-center/primary-toolbar/+merge/245005
<Laney> I joined the team but it's not enough to get notifications
<Laney> yeah looks good, thanks
<larsu> can you approve though?
<Laney> yep
<larsu> thanks
<Laney> trade for a review of my glib patch
<larsu> deal
<Mirv> is it just me having funny issue logging in vivid/lightdm today? it claims I can just "log in" (no password), but it fails to do so (obviously). if I login from tty1 and press enter in lightdm, it logs in..
<larsu> Laney: bah, that g_free() in the middle of the function is quite ugly
<larsu> I see why you did that though
<larsu> desrt: do you have a strong policy for this? https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=741653
<ubot5> Gnome bug 741653 in gio "gnetworkmonitornm: Check if network-manager is running" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<larsu> man, why does _get_name_owner() even return a copy?
<larsu> oh, threading
<desrt> larsu: looks like a danw bug
<desrt> (this is where the "Dan W." problem gets extra confusing)
<larsu> mh?
<desrt> Dan Williams = NetworkManager maintainer
<desrt> Dan Winship = GIO Networking maintainer
<larsu> desrt: I asked if Laney's patch is ok for you (g_free() in the middle of the function)
<desrt> NetworkManager issues in GIO = probably you want Dan Winship
<larsu> this is more a gdbusproxy issue
<desrt> the patch appears to be in gnetworkmonitornm.c
<larsu> which I hear is maintained by you now :P
<larsu> true, but that part of the question was more general
<larsu> meh, whatever. I won't accept_commit-now for this part anyway
<desrt> imho the correct thing to do here is to create the proxy with only unique names
<desrt> proxies on well-known names have always been a mistake in my opinion
<larsu> and deprecate g-name-owner?
<desrt> the trouble is that david one thought it would be reasonable to try to support this..
<desrt> *once
<desrt> but seriously... what do you do when people query properties on a dead service?
<larsu> ya, clearly
<larsu> but you could still create a proxy for a non-existent unique name
<larsu> or the unique name you created it for disappears
<desrt> lame
<larsu> why? Same problem, no?
<desrt> the idea is that you'd use watch_name_owner() to uncreate the proxy as soon as the name vanishes
<larsu> of course, but you'd still need to return something from _get_properties()
<desrt> well, the thing is... with the unique-name-disappears case we can reasonably assume that someone will be cleaning up the mess soon
<desrt> so we can just return the old values
<larsu> GetProperties() call might not succeed when you first create the object
<desrt> with the well-known name, we need to pretend
<desrt> larsu: isn't GDBusProxy init failable?
<desrt> i think that's what happens in that case
<larsu> no, it only fails when it can't connect to the bus
<larsu> aka never
<desrt> i'm pretty sure you're wrong
<desrt> g_dbus_proxy_new_sync() takes a GDBusConnection and returns GError
<larsu> I checked earlier - but maybe I missed something
<larsu> that file is a bit convoluted
<desrt> ya....
<desrt> i really hate that class
<desrt> never use it myself
 * didrocks should stop writing g_debug in systemd codeâ¦
<larsu> deprecate it!
<larsu> didrocks: s_debug!
<desrt> "just use gdbusconnection, you wimps"
<larsu> right
<didrocks> larsu: almost, log_debug ;)
<larsu> desrt: anyhow, is danw actively reviewing patches?
<desrt> larsu: trouble is that we can't really change this code to introduce new ways to fail
<desrt> larsu: on this sort of stuff?  yes.
<larsu> ok, I'll wait for him to comment then
<larsu> Laney: sorry :/
<larsu> desrt: why not?
<Laney> shrug
<Laney> separately, want to push https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=741259 ?
<ubot5> Gnome bug 741259 in .General "gtkmodelmenuitem: force icon scaling" [Normal,New]
 * Laney will cherry-pick it for the upload
<larsu> Laney: ah, mclasen ok'ed it. I missed that. I'll push it when I'm back home
<desrt> larsu: this code makes me want to cry
<larsu> desrt: stop reading it ;)
<desrt> but anyway you're right
<desrt> explicitly:
<desrt>   if (result == NULL)
<desrt>     {
<desrt>       /* We just ignore if GetAll() is failing. Because this might happen
<larsu> :(
<desrt> is gdbusproxy actually crashing, or what?
<desrt> or just returning null strings?
<larsu> no, gnetworkmonitornm is, because it doesn't check the return value of get_cached_properties() for NULL
<desrt> because unless gdbusproxy is crashing in response to relatively innocent outside uses, i'm not inclined to change anything inside of it
<larsu> I wonder if NULL is correct there, or if { NULL } would be better
<desrt> right.  so we need to fix the nm code
<desrt> NULL is better
<larsu> this is what Laney's patch does
<larsu> does it return NULL when the name disappeared, too?
<desrt> { NULL } means "i'm connected and i see that there are exactly 0 properties"
<larsu> I agree
<larsu> something like _is_connected() might be nice to have
<larsu> so that you don't need to make a copy of the name owner
<desrt> you have it.  it's called g-name-owner.
<desrt> ahb
<desrt> this shouldn't make a copy.
<larsu> yay threads
<desrt> no.
<desrt> yay bad api design
<desrt> the proxy belongs to a particular context.  it receives all notifications through dispatches on that context
<desrt> if you're querying it from that context (as you must) then there is no way that it can see changes from the bus while you're querying it
<desrt> you have to return to the mainloop
<desrt> it's just plain old bad api
<larsu> you must?
<desrt> oh please tell me you must...
<larsu> otherwise why would it need the property_lock?
<desrt> oh.  you not must.
<desrt> head â desk
<desrt> THIS OBJECT IS TERRIBLE
<larsu> right. I had the same reaction earlier today
<desrt> and here i am in kdbus land figuring out a way to forbid even touching the _connection_ from the wrong thread
<desrt> and we have proxies taking locks all over the place
<desrt> i can't even imagine what horror show awaits me when i try to get gdbusproxy working on a kdbus gdbusconnection
<desrt> i particularly love how they use code locking here and not even data locking
<desrt> larsu: my suggestion is to slowly back away from GDBusProxy and fix things in the nm code (as the patch does).  danw is your go-to for that, though.
<larsu> desrt: backing away from GDBusProxy towards subscribing to property change notifications manually?
<desrt> backing away as in typing ":q" into any relevent vim windows
<larsu> lol
<larsu> done.
<desrt> :)
 * desrt is having lots of fun in kdbus land this morning
<desrt> it turns out that pretty much everything is racy
<larsu> uh oh
<desrt> the cookie-based approach turns out to be kinda bad -- so we're trying futexes instead :)
<larsu> uhm, yay!?
<desrt> ya.  i love futexes.
<larsu> Laney: pushed the patch to bug 741259
<ubot5> bug 741259 in transmission (Ubuntu) "Transmission hangs no matter what" [Undecided,Expired] https://launchpad.net/bugs/741259
<larsu> (gnome bug)
<Laney> thanks!
 * Laney screams
<Laney> ci traiiinnnnn
<didrocks> choooo choooo
<Laney> https://ci-train.ubuntu.com/job/prepare-silo/3548/console
<didrocks> Laney: not sure how they handle the REQUEST_ID nowdays
<Laney> yeah pinged in the channel
<didrocks> waow, they reintroduced all the variable in prepare-silo?
<didrocks> instead of having to click in the spreadsheet, filing the REQUEST_ID and fetching the info from there?
<didrocks> (this was still available manually in the prepare-silo-manual beforehand, but that was for emergency)
<Laney> right then, climbing time
<Laney> see you!
<Laney> larsu (everyone): gtk is in ppa:ci-train-ppa-service/landing-008
<Laney> I think it's ready to go and will do that first thing tomorrow
<Laney> it's there with theme and u-c-c
<Laney> there's an alpha freeze so now/then doesn't matter much anyway
<Laney> darkxst: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ fyi
 * Laney waves
<larsu> Laney: neat, thanks!
<Laney> I shit myself because all of the theme fixes went away
<Laney> luckily it had been downgraded by mistake :)
<larsu> haha
 * didrocks waves too
<darkxst> Laney, Great!
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-12-18
<Noskcaj> What's the plan with adwaita-icon-theme? Will it be dropped in as a complete replacement for gnome-icon-theme soon, or is there something else that's going to happen
<didrocks> good morning!
<pitti> Good morning
<Noskcaj> evening pitti, didrocks.
<didrocks> hey pitti, Noskcaj!
<Noskcaj> Do either of you know what's going to happen with adwaita-icon-theme?
<didrocks> Noskcaj: hum, I think it's more a question for darkxst and the Gnome ubuntu team
<Noskcaj> asking here at the request of darkxst
<didrocks> or do you talk about the split that was discussed some weeks ago?
<didrocks> with duplicated icons and so on
<didrocks> (with our ubuntu themes)
<Noskcaj> didn't see that
<didrocks> so, unsure about the question "what's going to happen" then :)
<Noskcaj> gnome-themes-standard-data now depends on adwaita, and i'd like to have the gnome stack at 3.14 within a few days of gtk3.14 landing
<didrocks> yeah, so it's about the icon split
<Noskcaj> that and when will adwaita hit main
<didrocks> seb128 was following and discussing that few weeks ago here
<darkxst> didrocks, Noskcaj I think the discussion ended with Laney going to look into splitting it
<didrocks> Noskcaj: why would we need it in main? IIRC, seb was in favor of keeping it splitting?
<didrocks> oh, so, let's wait on Laney then ;)
<didrocks> but I don't think it will need to be in main then
<darkxst> didrocks, it would then replace gnome-themes-standard, so of course it would need to be in main
<Noskcaj> didrocks, the gnome-themes-standard-data dep, i assume we can swap that out for g-i-t | a-i-t
<darkxst> but anyways I have to run, be back a bit later
<darkxst> gnome-icon-theme even
<didrocks> darkxst: the source would be in main, not all binaries though
<darkxst> didrocks, yes sure
<didrocks> yeah, makes sense :)
<didrocks> Noskcaj: so, wait for Laney, he will be around in a couple of hours
<darkxst> Noskcaj, g-i-t is missing a bunch of 3.14 icons
<Noskcaj> darkxst, then maybe we can't
<darkxst> but temporarily you can do that
<darkxst> (the missing icons only really affect CSD
<darkxst> atm I think
<darkxst> gotta go now
<larsu> good morning!
<didrocks> hey larsu
<larsu> hi didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> larsu: I'm good, thanks! trying to find a smart way to play with systemd LIST_ systems
<didrocks> and you?
<larsu> didrocks: good as wel, thanks. Still having morning tea :)
<Laney> hey
<Laney> I think I said it was probably what we'll end up doing, but I haven't volunteered to do that work yet ;-)
<larsu> morning Laney
<Laney> yo
<Laney> how's it going?
<larsu> had some time last night and started hacking on a better gsettings-editor
<larsu> http://i1.minus.com/iHcd2rB5tAtGz.png
<Laney> this guy loves writing tools ;-)
<larsu> he does!
<Laney> nice
<larsu> was born out frustration :)
<larsu> Laney: maybe I should finish some of them at some point... :/
<Laney> that's always the hard part :(
<Laney> blerg
<Laney> chromium keeps telling me that tabs are not responding
 * Laney wonders what changed
 * Laney uploaded gtk
<Laney> ph33r
<larsu> \o/
<darkxst> Yay! thanks Laney and larsu ;)
<Laney> time to push all that crack into the distro
<Laney> ;-)
<davmor2> Laney: Adding that to the list of reason you shouldn't be left alone with the distro
 * Laney jingles the keys and then zooms off in a ferrari
<davmor2> throws the stinger across the gateway
<Laney> bah
<Laney> un use-header-barring dialogs is not fun
<larsu> Laney: there's a xsetting for that...
<Laney> apps have to look up the value and respect it
<Laney> it works automatically for built in dialogs
<larsu> ah right
<larsu> there's a helper function for it, but it's not public :(
<Laney> the real problem is when app authors have set it in a .ui file
<Laney> because it's construct-only
<Laney> :/
<larsu> that whole situation is a mess
<larsu> sorry
<Laney> distracted by a test failure that might be to do with 3.14 anyway
<Laney> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/vivid-adt-autopilot-gtk/lastBuild/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/console
<larsu> autopilot \o/
<larsu> are those test cases in autopilot-gtk?
<Laney> yep
<Laney> they work in my system
<Laney> but do fail in a test vm
<larsu> how do I run it?
<larsu> autopilot doesn't let me point it to the test case
<Laney> see the test script debian/tests/autopilot
<larsu> ah, thanks
<Laney> hmm, one of them seems to be a race
<Laney> and Eventually isn't compatible with raises
<Laney> hmm
<larsu> i don't see an eventually there
<Laney> I want to add one
<larsu> there's only that one failure in test_widegt_tree:154, right?
<Laney> getting 2 here
<Laney> test_actions.py:127
<larsu> in that same log?
 * larsu is confused
<Laney> local
<Laney> I see that other one too
<larsu> maybe that happens because the buttonbox doesn't exist when that xsetting is not set?
<Laney> larsu: ah if I install our theme it works
<Laney> also running with GTK_THEME=Adwaita makes it fail
<larsu> nice catch
<larsu> makes sense, everything's hard-coded pixel-values in there
<Laney> blurp
<desrt> hello friendly hackers
<Laney> hey ho
<Laney> how's it going?
 * didrocks is going to try an eventually dry cycling exercise :)
<didrocks> hey desrt
<didrocks> bbl
<Laney> larsu: want to look at http://paste.ubuntu.com/9560212/ ?
<desrt> didrocks: enjoy
<Laney> it's a script to provide the renamed desktop files
<Laney> or desrt I guess ;-)
<didrocks> desrt: that will depend on how dry I will be once back ;) but thanks!
<larsu> Laney: ah cool. This is the NoDisplay route?
<Laney> the important lines start at 66
<Laney> all three of them
<desrt> the mime association spec recently underwent a tweak that if an app is not registered as supporting a file type then it cannot be the default for that type
<Laney> default meaning user selected?
<desrt> that may still be OK though because i think most implements add an app to [Added] when setting it as the default
<desrt> which will ignore the fact that you stripped away the mimetypes here
<Laney> I wanted to avoid having the same application listed twice
<desrt> ya.  i totally understand why you did it.
<Laney> nod
<Laney> do you think this is basically ok?
 * Laney lunches, bbiab
<mlankhorst> willcooke: I've fixed Xmir just in time :P
<willcooke> mlankhorst, what bit is fixed? :)
<mlankhorst> blackness
<willcooke> niiiiice
<mlankhorst> based partially on how modesetting was handling dri2
 * willcooke nods like he knows what that means
<mlankhorst> modesetting is the fallback xorg driver if no other drivers are loaded, but it can use opengl modesetting is the fallback driver xorg uses if no acceleration is available. But with the recent changes in 1.17 it gained some features like acceleration if opengl is available. :P
<willcooke> Sweet5hark1, when I run libreofice --calc --norestore is still opens Writer - any ideas what I'm doing wrong?
<willcooke> mlankhorst, neat :)
<mlankhorst> I think the acceleration is stable again, I had some problems when resizing with compositing enabled, but that could be because the buffer was being destroyed because of resizing before unity had a chance to use it
<willcooke> *cough* *cough* I hadn't actually installed calc, only writer
<didrocks> no spreadsheet then? :p
 * didrocks gives malus manager point :)
<didrocks> (well, you win 2 of course if you use some only spreadsheet tools, likeâ¦ hemâ¦ some Gthingy :p)
<mlankhorst> hah
<mlankhorst> it seems that glamor uses BGR internally, noticed some discoloration when swapping with those fixes..
<willcooke> erk
<willcooke> mlankhorst, should I apt-get dist-upgrade?
<willcooke> actaully, I wont.
<willcooke> I tihnk it's working enough for my purposes right now
<willcooke> I will finish my video before I upgrade
<mlankhorst> oke
<mlankhorst> yeah don't dist-upgrade if it's not needed
<mlankhorst> just update xmir only
<Laney> pitti: could it be that adt-run --source blah.dsc doesn't pick up test deps from the passed package?
<Laney> I'm not seeing light-themes installed
<pitti> Laney: it does pick them up
<pitti> Laney: I mostly run it with a tree (adt-run -B my/source//), but it shoudl work equially well with a .dsc; please also pass -B though
<pitti> otherwise it'll rebuild the whole package instead of taking the archive .debs
<Laney> ah wait a second, it failed to build :)
 * Laney tries with -B
<Laney> might be a sign that I need to add this to build-deps too, though
<Laney> better
 * didrocks waves good evening
<robert_ancell> mterry, around?
<Noskcaj> Laney, In case you missed my question last night, what's happenng wit hadwaita-icon-theme being split so it can replace gnome-icon-theme for us?
<Laney> I did not miss it
<Laney> It's a good idea, someone should do it. Feel free
<Noskcaj> robert_ancell, I hope you don't mind me changing bug 1399047 to include most of gnome's desktop stack. They need to all be uploaded at together when adwaita has been worked out
<ubot5> bug 1399047 in gnome-themes-standard (Ubuntu) "Update gnome core packages to 3.14" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1399047
<Noskcaj> Laney, Sorry if it sounds like i'm nominating myself
<Noskcaj> i'd just break something, and further reduce my chances of ever getting MOTU
<Laney> well I don't expect to get to it this side of Christmas I'm afraid :(
<robert_ancell> Noskcaj, if they have to be uploaded together then it makes sense to use one bug
<desrt> an american, a european and an australian on irc at the same time
<Noskcaj> desrt, ha
 * desrt senses a disturbance in the force
<Laney> one world, one love
<mterry> robert_ancell, am now
<robert_ancell> mterry, I'm trying to understand these MPs for unity-greeter
<robert_ancell> https://code.launchpad.net/~albertsmuktupavels/unity-greeter/force-small-height/+merge/244874
<robert_ancell> https://code.launchpad.net/~albertsmuktupavels/unity-greeter/fix-lp-1374778/+merge/244950
<robert_ancell> I can reproduce the problem easily in test-mode, but I'm not 100% sure what's going wrong and if the fixes are just fixing the symptoms not the problems
<robert_ancell> Both fixes seem to solve the problem
<robert_ancell> The widget code is a little scary :)
<mterry> robert_ancell, oy! gtk's size negotiations.  I'd hoped to be done with them now that I'm in qml land
<robert_ancell> you can never escape :)
<mterry> robert_ancell, so...  does that second one obsolete the first?
<robert_ancell> mterry, yes, I think so.
<robert_ancell> But it's kind of odd, picking the size based on a position property that is not used elsewhere in the class to decide behaviour
<robert_ancell> And it isn't guaranteed to update the size when the position changes
<mterry> robert_ancell, we probably recalculate size while moving them around, especially when moving between position 0 and non-zero?  Basing things on position isn't SO weird, because elsewhere in that class, we support both "small" and "normal" versions of the content, based on whether we're drawing inside the main entry zone or not
<mterry> So it's already aware of the concept of the specialness of being in position 0 a bit
<robert_ancell> mterry, ok, so the second patch seems sound to you? It seems the simplest
<mterry> robert_ancell, I'm not sure...
<mterry> robert_ancell, the second patch looks like it is modifying the "normal" (or large) preferred_height to be grid_size = 1
<mterry> Whereas I would expect to need to modify just the small box height
<mterry> Both these patches seem to be changing normal box height
<robert_ancell> I think it might be the normal box is overlapping adjacent entries and stealing their inputs
<mterry> robert_ancell, well of the two I prefer the second one, feels a little less magic
<mterry> robert_ancell, I'm a bit removed from this code now so I am not entirely certain why it works either
<mterry> robert_ancell, but I'd agree with you that it seems to be making the size small enough to not cover other boxes
 * mterry tests it on larger oddly sized boxes
<robert_ancell> mterry, ok, I was just hoping you might remember. I'm not too worried about the quality since u-g is basically on life support and it does seem to fix the problem without side-effects
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-12-19
<Laney> hey hey
<Laney> happy last day before xmas hols?
<larsu> yep. morning!
<didrocks> hey larsu, Laney!
<didrocks> happy last day ;)
<Laney> \o/
<larsu> didrocks: morning. Same to you!
<Laney> Noskcaj: btw I was just thinking while eating my breakfast that you can probably leave the depends at gnome-icon-theme and seed adwaita-icon-theme in the interim
<darkxst> Laney, thats what I told noskcaj as well
<Laney> nod
<darkxst> gnome-icon-theme(-full) | a-i-y
<darkxst> ai-t
<darkxst> I'll update our seed in the morning, about to head out now
<Laney> as and when, just saying you don't need to be blocked on this
<darkxst> Laney, I don't know why Noskcaj though we were blocked on it
 * didrocks wonders why asprintf would return in a double free or corruption when freed
<didrocks> argh
<didrocks> _cleanup_free_
 * didrocks shuts up
<larsu> didrocks: takes some time getting used to ;)
<didrocks> larsu: seems so, yeah :p
<didrocks> larsu: it's awesome nonetheless, should just remove some old pure C-habits
<didrocks> larsu: I think I'll have to introduce some i18n support in systemd though, there is not apart from policykit files, I wonder how to do that properly and acceptable for upstreamâ¦
<larsu> didrocks: don't know. There's a hackfest right before FOSDEM in Brussels
<larsu> such a thing is probably talked about in person
<didrocks> yeah, I'm going there ;)
<didrocks> yep
<larsu> do you think the tools should be translated?
 * larsu has never really understood why we do this, tbh
<larsu> gcc's german error messages are pretty bad
<didrocks> larsu: I'm sending via plymouth some fsck strings
<larsu> (for example)
<larsu> didrocks: ah, that's different of course
<didrocks> that's supposed to be displayed in text mode and the splash screen
<didrocks> (text mode is just /dev/console) ;)
* Laney changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v
<willcooke> didrocks, can you offer me any pointers...
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/software-center/+bug/1361932
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1361932 in bastion (Ubuntu) "Bastion will not download in Software Center" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<willcooke> The support team have contacted me to ask about a few reports they've had of paid-for games not downloading
<willcooke> I dont think this is a desktop issue really
<willcooke> but is there anything I can do to test it?
<willcooke> for example, can I use apt-get to install paid-for apps?
<willcooke> didrocks, forwarded you an email
 * didrocks reads
<didrocks> willcooke: I have some creds for bastion (I have bought this humble bundle pack), let me give it a try first
<didrocks> willcooke: nice, I even can't get my own page back from paid software-center apps on the server
<didrocks> willcooke: clicking on "my apps" after logging in, leads me to https://software-center.ubuntu.com/dev/
<didrocks> I do receive a forbidden response there
<didrocks> is it the same for you?
<didrocks> I guess the mixed https://software-center.ubuntu.com with developer.ubuntu.com
<didrocks> which means that everything that you bought are not accessible
<didrocks> let's try directly with software-center
<didrocks> willcooke: looking for bastion there, it's crashing and I get empty entries
<didrocks> (with a nice traceback on the console)
<willcooke> sorry, was afk
<willcooke> reading
<willcooke> yes, Forbidden
<willcooke> You don't have permission to access /dev/ on this server.
<willcooke> I imagine that's a virtual dir. rather than trying to access /dev
<didrocks> so, there are some issues server-side, but as well software-center is crashing
<willcooke> I wonder if the crash is related to the server side issues
<willcooke> unhandled exceptions
<didrocks> willcooke: is it the same for you? like if you type "bastion", you get some empty entries?
<didrocks> ValueError: Need either appname or pkgname or request
<didrocks> but first error is APIError: 401
<didrocks> ERROR: can not obtain a oauth token
<didrocks> I guess that's why we have empty entries then, and software-center doesn't handle it well
<willcooke> didrocks, if I type bastion in to USC, I *do* get a result back
<willcooke> 401 = Unauth
<didrocks> willcooke: you are maybe already logged in with oauth? or not?
<willcooke> not logged in at all
<didrocks> yeah, that's why I guess
<didrocks> try to log in
<didrocks> (it's under File IIRC)
<willcooke> hrm, cant see to log in anywhere
<willcooke> (find the option to)
<didrocks> willcooke: try the oneconf option: "sync between computers"
<didrocks> it will prompt you for sso login normally
<didrocks> willcooke: actually, I get the second crash because I'm on vivid I think (they didn't update the catalog to it I guess)
 * didrocks tries on trusty vm
<willcooke> ahh, yes
<willcooke> ok, if I try and buy MyCraft I get prompted to log in
<didrocks> yeah, same for bastion in my vm
<didrocks> it's adding the private ppa succesfully, downloadingâ¦
<willcooke> So are we all playing games this afternoon instead of working then, or what?
 * larsu whistles
<willcooke> last day of term man
<Laney> sounds like official permission to me
<Laney> BYE SUCKERS
 * Laney wheelspins in some gravel
 * willcooke wonders if there is an online version of Buckaroo 
<willcooke> yes there is
<willcooke> but its flash
 * didrocks starts steam
<didrocks> """testing purpose"""
<willcooke> ohhh, let's play Red Alert multi player
<didrocks> \o/
<willcooke> I really suck at that game, but it's ace
<didrocks> ahah ;)
 * willcooke installs wine
<willcooke> OpenRA FTW
<willcooke> LULZ "Battle control initialised" \o/
<ari-tczew> Laney: hi, I was looking on clutter-1.0 since there is a comment on MoM "1.20.0-1 blocks on gtk3.0 3.14"
<ari-tczew> However, the delta is already applied in Debian and package builds fine.
<Laney> we have 3.14 as of yesterday
<ari-tczew> really?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> it's probably possible to get the new clutter stack now
<Laney> I didn't look into it yet though, go ahead if you like
<ari-tczew> ok, then I'm going to request a sync
 * ari-tczew is outdated
<ochosi> Laney: quick gtk3.14 question: toolbar-buttons have borders now? i noticed that was noted in the transition-pad somehow, but should this be "fixed" in the theme..?
<Laney> ochosi: theme -> larsu
<ochosi> righty
<ochosi> thanks Laney
<Laney> sorry
<ochosi> larsu: quick gtk3.14 question: toolbar-buttons have borders now? i noticed that was noted in the transition-pad somehow, but should this be "fixed" in the theme..?
<Laney> I'm off to do some errands / have lunch at the cafe
<Laney> biab
<larsu> ochosi: you mean in light-themes?
<larsu> I fixed that...
<ochosi> nope, just noticed it in xubuntu
<ochosi> with our theme
<ochosi> and then i remembered reading something like that on your pad
<ochosi> and wondered whether it was something you patched in gtk or in the theme
<larsu> no, it's not a patch
<larsu> probably your theme doesn't remove borders for buttons that have the .flat class set
<larsu> (that was the problem in light-themes)
<ochosi> oh, i guess we don't do anything about the .flat class yet
<ochosi> thanks for the hint!
<ochosi> that was all i needed :)
<ochosi> do you also have empty checkboxes in menus?
<ochosi> or: did you
<ochosi> like this: http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-191214-130354.php
<larsu> ochosi: yes. Something doesn't use background-image for those anymore but -gtk-icon-source
<larsu> replacing that is enough
<ochosi> ah, ok
<ochosi> will take a look
<ochosi> thanks for the hints!
<larsu> you're welcome!
 * didrocks is going for some serious cycling today
<didrocks> hoping staying dry AND not exploding any wheel this time :p
<larsu> didrocks: good luck!
<didrocks> larsu: thanks! yeah, I think it's luck I start needing :)
 * didrocks can't wait to have knees fixed and run again, seems less dangerous :p
<larsu> hehe
<Laney> possible error in my plan
<Laney> came to university library to work
<Laney> extreme concrete cutting going on outside
<Laney> loud
<larsu> Laney: depends on your plan. if it was to not get work done, it worked.
<Laney> I guess I could read the interesting books that are in here instead
<ochosi> Laney: that can happen anywhere though, no?
<Laney> which part?
<ochosi> the noise, i mean it's not something i associate with uni libraries
<ochosi> or even separately, uni or libraries :)
<Laney> it's just bad luck
<ochosi> indeed
 * didrocks is going to fetch his new glasses
<didrocks> so, guys, enjoy your holidays!
<didrocks> merry christmas, happy new year and all the fuzz :)
<asac> didrocks: !!
<asac> enjoy!
<didrocks> asac: thanks, you too man :)
 * didrocks waves
<Laney> laters
<Laney> happy hols!
<Noskcaj> mterry, Could geocode-glib be MIRed as part of the geoclue-2.0 transition. It's needed by most gnome stuff that needs geoclue-2.0
<Noskcaj> e.g. g-s-d and libgweather
<Noskcaj> mterry, ping
<mterry> Noskcaj, hello!
<Noskcaj> Did you see my question about geocode-glib a few hours ago?
<Noskcaj> "Could geocode-glib be MIRed as part of the geoclue-2.0 transition. It's needed by most gnome stuff that needs geoclue-2.0"
<Noskcaj> e.g. g-s-d and libgweather
<darkxst> geocode-glib actually contains the other half of what was in geoclue-1.0
<mterry> Noskcaj, no I didn't see it
<mterry> Noskcaj, let me look at geocode-glib real quick
<mterry> Noskcaj, is there a MIR bug for it yet?
<Noskcaj> No, i was hoping it could be bundled with geoclue-2.0, since it's the other half of what geoclue 1 was
<mterry> Noskcaj, I see, so the code was in main before
<Noskcaj> yeah
<mterry> Noskcaj, let me look at the packaging real quick, but I can add a task/comment to the geoclue-2.0 bug
<Noskcaj> :)
<mterry> Noskcaj, can you add a team bug subscriber for it?
<Noskcaj> darkxst, gnome team can do that can't we?
<mterry> Noskcaj, darkxst: I assume so, that's the contact for geoclue-2.0...
<mterry> Noskcaj, well it looks fine except for that
<Noskcaj> great
<mterry> added comment, once there's a subscriber that should be fine
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-12-20
<darkxst> Noskcaj, done
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-12-14
<pitti> Good morning
<hikiko> Hello
<darkxst> hey pitti hikiko
<darkxst> pitti, can you hint ubuntu-gnome-meta through proposed, its blocked on s390x being uninstallable
<pitti> hey darkxst
<pitti> darkxst: will have a look, yes
<darkxst> permanently if possible? I really don't think it seems like something we would ever support!
<darkxst> pitti, thanks
<didrocks> good morning
<hikiko> Hey didrocks pitti darkxst
<didrocks> hey hikiko
<darkxst> hey didrocks
<didrocks> good evening darkxst
<darkxst> not so much, the start of another heat wave by the looks of it ;(
<didrocks> argh, here winter (or rather late fall) is definitively here
<pitti> bonjour didrocks !
<pitti> darkxst: hm, I actually don't know how to hint over uninstallability; Laney, can you teach me?
<didrocks> bonjour pitti !
<didrocks> bon week-end ?
<pitti> didrocks: oui, mais beaucoup de travailler :)
<pitti> didrocks: on fait le menage, beaucoup de biscuits (qui met 7 heures..), et quelques autres choses avant les vacances de NoÃ«l
<pitti> didrocks: et toi ?
<didrocks> pitti: beaucoup plus calme pour moi :) on est sorti voir des amis le samedi, et dimanche, votÃ©, puis restÃ© Ã  la maison (j'ai fini Ã  nouveau "the last of us")
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> morning seb128
<seb128> re didrocks ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, thanks for the geonames MIR review
<seb128> larsu proposed the changes for u-c-c on friday, which means we can land that today ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: yw!
<didrocks> nice :)
<larsu> happy Monday!
<larsu> hi pitti seb128 and didrocks? How were your weekends?
<seb128> hey larsu
<seb128> "ok"
<seb128> I got a cold on thursday and so, and it got worth
<larsu> oh sorry to hear :( Get better!
<seb128> like blocked nose, headache, fever
<seb128> thanks
<larsu> why are you working then?
<larsu> get to bed!
<seb128> I think I'm over the main part
<seb128> well, that was yesterday
<seb128> today the fever is gone and I start feeling better
<larsu> ah, ok. Left the bad parts of the cold for your free days, eh?
<seb128> also doing IRC from the couch in pyjama in not really exausting ;-)
<didrocks> good morning larsu, my week-end was good! went to see friends and played/finishes some video games
<seb128> yeah :-/
<larsu> haha
<seb128> also better to have the cold now than during holidays
<larsu> indeed!
<larsu> I think I might have one as well (Faina just had one and I'm feeling an itch in my throat)
<seb128> oh, take it easy!
<larsu> it's not bad at all yet - I even went to the gym just now and was fine
<pitti> hey larsu and seb128 !
<pitti> seb128: uh, get well soon! *hug*
<seb128> I did some mistakes on this one, I helped friends to carry firewood on friday
<seb128> and I went to a special tennis mixed group event saturday afternoon
<pitti> larsu: quite busy indeed! we cleaned the appartment, spent 7 hours on baking "Plaetzchen" (Christmas cookies), and some other xmas prep
<seb128> (I only had the nose blocked by then and I though that would be ok, but rest would probably have been smarter)
<seb128> hey pitti, merci
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<didrocks> stricking news *hundreds of people infected in north of Europe*
<didrocks> :)
 * pitti chuckles about didrocks' typo, it actually makes sense in German (stricking == knitting)
<pitti> and indeed that has become quite popular again :)
<larsu> pitti: PlÃ¤tzchen!!!
<larsu> yummie
<willcooke> morning all
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<Laney> hey hey
<willcooke> morning Laney
<willcooke> it's so dark today I have to have the lights on during the day :(
<willcooke> still, only another week and a bit until the winter equinox
<Laney> mmm, pretty grey out there
<didrocks> good morning Laney, had a nice long week-end?
<didrocks> willcooke: man, move a nice country, where we had sun and blue sky :)
<willcooke> :'(
<willcooke> didrocks, don't supposed you're interested in doing a house swap this summer? ;)
<didrocks> willcooke: haha, let's see, only if you can garantuee 100% sun :)
<willcooke> I can 100% not guarantee that
<didrocks> ;)
<seb128> hey willcooke Laney, how are you?
<willcooke> morning seb128
<Laney> pitti: you probably want to make it not build the uninstallable package
<Laney> and hi
<Laney> hey didrocks and seb128!
<Laney> I got like 2 items of christmas shopping...
<Laney> but otherwise it was nice seeing family and friends, had a christmas meal yesterday
<Laney> and decorated the tree
<seb128> nice
<Laney> the shop sold me a quite eccentric one
<Laney> so it looks funny but i quite likt that
<Laney> what about you?
<seb128> got a cold, spent sunday on a couch with blankets and fever :-/
<seb128> I start being a bit better today
<willcooke> :( feel better seb128
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> oh no
<seb128> better now than during holidays ;-)
<seb128> why is britney blocking compiz? it has some uninstallability on s390 but I doubt it's coming from the update
<Laney> that needs fixing
<seb128> what needs fixing?
<seb128> britney?
<Laney> no
<Laney> compiz
<seb128> well, the update is not making anything worth
<seb128> it should be blocked
<seb128> "fixing" compiz has a long chain
<Laney> it is going to make an uninstallable package which britney won't do
<seb128> going to libindicator which is not building on s390 yet because it needs mono
<seb128> that package is already uninstallable
<seb128> no?
<seb128> it basically goes down to s390 being incomplete atm
<Laney> then go talk to adam about changing britney to allow this
<Laney> but as it stands it needs to be fixed
<seb128> or s390 needs to be removed from the compiz archs :p
<Laney> that would count as a fix
<seb128> that would solve the installability issue
<seb128> I wonder if we should do that
<seb128> I'm not going to fix mono on s390
<seb128> xnox ^ do you know if anybody is working on that?
<Trevinho> Morning folks
<seb128> hey Trevinho! how are you?
<seb128> oh, seems like xnox did build mono on s390 yesterday
 * seb128 retries libindicator
<seb128> libappindicator rather
<didrocks> morning Trevinho
<seb128> no, mono not installable
<seb128> do we have porter s390 machines?
<seb128> or boxes we can use to debug installability issues
 * seb128 retries gtk-sharp build
<seb128> no :-(
<Laney> on snakefruit there is a chdist that you can use
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> seems to work though
<seb128> what? mono?
<Laney> apt-get build-dep libappindicator
<seb128> I'm trying to understand https://launchpadlibrarian.net/229872115/buildlog_ubuntu-xenial-s390x.gtk-sharp2_2.12.10-5.1_BUILDING.txt.gz
<seb128> libappindicator is unhappy because libgtk2.0-cil-dev can't be installed
<seb128> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/229960923/buildlog_ubuntu-xenial-s390x.libappindicator_12.10.1%2B15.04.20141110-0ubuntu1_BUILDING.txt.gz
<seb128> Laney, how does that chdist work?
<Laney> chdist apt-get xenial-proposed-s390x --dry-run build-dep libappindicator
<Laney> as the ubuntu-archive user
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> so I guess it's a component mismatch issue
<Laney> or the bootstrap archive
 * seb128 checks where mono binaries have been sent
<seb128> hum, rmadison doesn't know about s390
<seb128> Laney, or is that chdist using the special bootstrap archive where the builders are not?
<Laney> the other way around
<Trevinho> Hi didrocks
<Laney> but I added it and don't see the problem still
<seb128> hum, k
<seb128> could be a component mismatch
<Laney> also tried with removing universe
<Trevinho> Hey seb128, better, but leaving London today :-(
<Laney> and rmadison does have s390x
<Trevinho> seb128: you?
<seb128> Trevinho, having a cold, but I'm over the fewer and starting being better
<seb128> Trevinho, had a fun w.e in London?
<seb128> Laney, it doesn't for me, does it has a cache that can be stalled or something?
<Laney> no
<Laney> rmadison -a s390x -s xenial-proposed -S mono
<Laney> works
<seb128> $ rmadison -s xenial -a s390 -S mono
<seb128> $
<Laney> x
<seb128> or
<seb128> proposed
<seb128> DOH
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> hehe
<seb128> but no
<seb128> oh, yes
<seb128> and s390x
<seb128> nothing seems wrong with the components there :-/
<Laney> this is odd
<Laney> also my desktop's unity session didn't come up
<seb128> :-(
 * Laney nooooo
<seb128> Laney, can you look at https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/unity-control-center/no-gcc-recommends/+merge/280179 ?
<seb128> I added the correct recommends (I think at least)
<Laney> yep
<Laney> thanks
<seb128> thanks for spotting the error
<Laney> any time (H)
<didrocks> pitti: If you have any time/ideas on that topic, I'm quite stuck now on bug #1525841 (tried to describe all the testing and such)
<ubot5> bug 1525841 in plymouth (Ubuntu) "xubuntu and lubuntu (maybe other flavors?) doesn't have plymouth text progress on live" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1525841
<didrocks> pitti: unfortunately, plymouth debug mode doesn't help much :/
<pitti> didrocks: will look in a bit, currently stuck on something
<didrocks> sure
<seb128> willcooke, btw unsure if you saw my request for review on https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-themes/update-nautilus-theme/+merge/279468 / if you have any opinion on that
<Laney> bah
<seb128> Laney, did you figure it out?
<Laney> I don't get this libappindicator thing
<seb128> :-(
<Laney> I stole one of the autopkgtest s390x machines
<Laney> ubuntu@adt-xenial:~$ sudo apt-get build-dep libappindicator
<Laney> ...
<Laney> After this operation, 916 MB of additional disk space will be used.
<Laney> Do you want to continue? [Y/n]
<seb128> that doesn't make much sense to me
<seb128> libappindicator requires gtk-sharp2
<seb128> which never built on s390x
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk-sharp2/2.12.10-5.1/+build/8374832
<seb128> are you sure the official builders use that bootstrap archive?
<seb128> though ^ should build, since mono is built for s390x in xenial-proposed
<seb128> so unsure why those are not installable
<Laney> cli-common-dev seems ok to me
<Laney> with or without bootstrap
<seb128> is there any of your env where you could disable universe?
<seb128> if things work then it has to be a component mismatch issue
<Laney> I did
<seb128> :-(
<Laney> see what xnox has to say
<xnox> seb128, it's in -proposed at the moment
<seb128> xnox, hey
<xnox> seb128, what's mismatched?
<xnox> yo ;-)
<seb128> xnox, I don't know, I'm trying to understand https://launchpadlibrarian.net/229961165/buildlog_ubuntu-xenial-s390x.gtk-sharp2_2.12.10-5.1_BUILDING.txt.gz
<seb128> it's from an hour ago
<xnox> mono is in xenial-proposed only, that build record is for xenial-release only. We need mono tracker and transition mono first, before we can build all the mono on s390x.
<willcooke> seb128, I'll give it a test
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<seb128> oh right
<seb128> or we need a no change upload of gtk-sharp2
<willcooke> seb128, seems I didnt get an email or any kind of notification about that review request though?
<seb128> so it builds in proposed
<xnox> which is what my plan to work on today a bit was =)
<seb128> willcooke, you should have, do you filter launchpad emails to a spam box?
<xnox> seb128, please don't do that it's much easier to just retrigger it in the release pocket.
<xnox> and makes mono transition bigger... and then trades things cross arch.
<seb128> xnox, what is blocking mono to migrate?
<xnox> it's a transition
<xnox> seb128, similar to e.g. debian https://release.debian.org/transitions/html/auto-mono.html
<xnox> which i am setting up for us.
<seb128> k
<xnox> seb128, you can help, by removing obsolete and uninstallable packages though ;-)
<xnox> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/plasma-widget-runcommand/+bug/1525716
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1525716 in plasma-widget-yawp (Ubuntu) "RM uninstallable, obsolete plasma4 only widget, not usable in plasma5" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<xnox> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gwibber-service-sohu/+bug/1525718
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1525718 in gwibber-service-sohu (Ubuntu) "RM parent package gwibber (and friends) removed from the archive a long time ago" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<xnox> so plasma4 is gone, yet some of the widgets remain; gwibber is gone, yet some gwibber-service-* remain.
<seb128> xnox, I can do that
<xnox> tah, that will lower uninstallable count across all arches, which is good.
 * larsu wonders if we have a garbage collector for such packages
<xnox> it's poor removal skills... e.g. when gwibber was removed, it's reverse deps & build-deps should have been removed too
<seb128> yeah
<didrocks> xnox: speaking of which, planning on working on the issues for the s390-* packages that were pre-promoted but doesn't apply to MIR requirements?
<didrocks> (in case you didn't see my comments ;))
<xnox> didrocks, i did see your comments.
<didrocks> xnox: good, just ping me once the fixes will be in!
<Sweet5hark1> willcooke: around?
<willcooke> Sweet5hark1, hi hi
<xnox> xnox> didrocks, i did see your comments.
<xnox> <xnox> didrocks, planning to work on them. however not sure i'll get them done this week. And if i don't get them done this week, it will spill over to the next year.
<xnox> <xnox> they are on my "todo" list -> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=s390x
<xnox> * xnox ponders if I lost the internetz
<didrocks> xnox: you did!
<xnox> sigh, i forgot to push ben configs. i need more coffee...
<xnox> Laney, does transition tracker run every hour or every 15 minutes?
<Laney> every minute if proposed has changed and it's not running
<Laney> iir
<Laney> c
<xnox> oh, cool.
<xnox> but does proposed needs to move to get it to run at all?
<xnox> well i just uploaded s390-tools that should do it.
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> you can already start if you look at update_output
<xnox> i know... i'm being lazy =)
 * Laney fixes dbus-sharp ftbfs
<Laney> (maybe)
<seb128> didrocks, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-control-center/15.04.0+16.04.20151214-0ubuntu1 if you want to promoted the geonames binaries
<didrocks> seb128: done!
<seb128> didrocks, thanks!
<didrocks> yw
<willcooke> Trevinho, before you leave London today, if you have time, could you speak to Mathieu James about getting:  1) a new eject icon 2) a new Bluetooth icon set 3) your svn/png request 4) a new "+" icon for creating new tabs in Terminal?
<willcooke> (as per our meeting last week with design)
<willcooke> ((just going trough the notes))
<seb128> willcooke, one week we forgot in london than I wanted to ask design what nautilus icons
<seb128> they are big in xenial
<seb128> we should maybe lower that
<willcooke> seb128, yeah, agreed.  We can just make them smaller and I will send digitalalex a screenshot for approval
<willcooke> seems like a"no-brainer" to me
<seb128> do we just want to put the default to the smallest value?
<seb128> is that small enough?
<seb128> or do we want to change the scale/how
<seb128> like an extra value smaller and keep the current set otherwise?
<didrocks> sounds the safest bet (and back to where we were)
<didrocks> and yeah, +1 for that change the sooner, the better
<didrocks> (making hard to use nautilus everyday)
<seb128> didrocks, adding an extra smaller value?
<seb128> or just changing the default?
<seb128> or both?
<seb128> I talked a bit to upstream about it
<didrocks> changing the default IMHO, we were scaling them back before, right?
<seb128> we had more zoom levels before
<seb128> you could go quite small
<seb128> issue said that one issue they have is that they said their canvas sucks
<seb128> so the spacing/padding is not smart enough to look good at all zoom levels
<seb128> that's why they limit it
<didrocks> well, that doesn't prevent to have a "sane" default :p
<didrocks> which isn't the current one
<seb128> I'm going to experiment a bit, at least lower the default from one step and maybe add a 48px value if that doesn't looks too buggy
<didrocks> yeah
<seb128> right
<seb128> didrocks, willcooke, thanks for the feedback
<didrocks> FWIW 48px is "okish" IMHO
<didrocks> but still just a little bit too big for my taste
<didrocks> (but I could bear with it)
<seb128> the current set is 64/96/128
<seb128> 64 is a bit big to my taste as well
<seb128> I'm going to get at least 48 back
<didrocks> ah, sorry, I thought *that* was 64
<didrocks> yeah
<seb128> pitti, did the way journald works changed in xenial?
<seb128> I get those in syslog when I open a guest session
<seb128> apparmor="DENIED" operation="connect" profile="/usr/lib/lightdm/lightdm-guest-session" name="/run/systemd/journal/stdout" pid=13907 comm="dbus-daemon" requested_mask="w" denied_mask="w" fsuid=993 ouid=0
<seb128> I guess the guest session profile needs an update
<pitti> seb128: there's been a few bug fixes, but no structural change
<pitti> right, I guess so
<seb128> but I didn't remember seeing those on wily
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<xnox> seb128, libindicate uses obsolete build-dep. I fixed that. Now it seems to have a generic too-much-Wall-Werror-build-failure can somebody take a look at it?
<seb128> xnox, I can
<xnox> thank you =)
<seb128> yw:
<seb128> yw!
<xnox> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libindicate/12.10.1-0ubuntu4
<xnox> i'm not happy with the new mono by the way... loads of things FTBFS: https://launchpad.net/~xnox/+archive/ubuntu/nonvirt/+packages
<xnox> and the tracker is crap too. I shall design a better one.
<Laney> there are some removals to be done there
<seb128> I removed clutter-sharp as it was removed in Debian
<xnox> looks like loads of things use "old" 2.0/4.0 "abis" yet only 4.5 is available now.
<xnox> so things were bitrotting.
<Laney> boo
<Laney> tomboy-blogposter seems crufty
<Laney> ampsharp has a removal bug
 * xnox is rebuilding tomboy, as that is not installable...
<Laney> gnome-desktop-sharp2
 * xnox thinks we should keep tomboy....
<xnox> gnome-desktop-sharp2 is good
<xnox> (arm64 has always failed, the rest built)
<Laney> mummy
<Laney> I said tomboy-blogposter
<Laney> gnome-desktop-sharp2 is removed from debian.
<xnox> what's up with mono-addins? a generic build-failure or should things migrate to something else?
<Laney> ndesk-dbus
<xnox> Laney, tomboy-blogposter -> it was never in debian no?
<xnox> (and i think we can fix it)
<Laney> who cares about carrying random ancient cruft around?
<Laney> but if you want to spend your time doing that, go nuts
 * xnox thought tomboy was a flagship app...
<Laney> doesn't mean that every addon for it is flagship does it
<Laney> lllllllllllunchhhhhhhhhhh
<seb128> Laney, enjoy!
<seb128> happyaron, hey, could you have a look to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lightdm/+bug/1509829 ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1509829 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "lightdm-guest-session profile is too strict to input Japanese text with fcitx-mozc" [High,Triaged]
 * xnox ponders if i should upload things when i have no idea what i am doing
 * xnox is hacking mono / C# project files.
<Laney> umm
<Laney> go to #debian-cli?
<xnox> sent bug report, pasted to #debian-cli
<xnox> will upload into ubuntu for now, and if things are terribly broken, i'm sorry for all c# users =) but i think it's mostly harmless change anyway.
<xnox> Laney, http://paste.debian.net/344421/ to fix https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=807915
<ubot5> Debian bug 807915 in src:mono-addins "mono-addins: FTBFS with new mono, upgrade to 1.2 release?" [Serious,Open]
<Laney> you could wait like a few minutes for directhex to reply
<Laney> it's what I did for dbus-sharp though
<Laney> if acked you could even upload to debian...
<xnox> sound good.
 * xnox ponders if there is a compiler way to enforce target framework.
<happyaron> seb128: yes I just read that in email
<seb128> happyaron, hey! thanks ;-)
<seb128> larsu, can you comment/reply to mterry on bug #1525156?
<ubot5> bug 1525156 in geonames (Ubuntu) "[MIR] geonames" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1525156
<seb128> larsu, how is the nautilus menubar going btw? still working on that?
<didrocks> argh, failures in tests after merging contributor's branch :/
<didrocks> (large ones)
 * didrocks fixes
 * didrocks waves good evening! See you tomorrow guys.
<didrocks> seb128: get better! :)
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<seb128> have a nice evening didrocks!
<didrocks> thanks ;)
<seb128> Laney, thanks for doing the ligdata update ;-)
<Laney> np
 * Laney warps across IRC
<larsu> seb128: sure can do
<seb128> larsu, danke
<Laney> right, see you!
<seb128> Laney, have a good evening!
<mterry> larsu, so I commented back about geonames.  maybe IRC would be a faster dialog though
<willcooke> g'night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-12-15
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, comment vas-tu ?
<didrocks> Ã§a va pitti, et toi ?
<pitti> didrocks: Ã§a va bien
<pitti> il faut faire trop de choses jusq'Ã  NoÃ«l :)
<didrocks> pitti: hÃ©hÃ©, pareil ici !
<duflu> Morning Europe
<didrocks> hey duflu
<duflu> Seems our xenial images have not been passing sufficiently since 9 December? But the "current" one also doesn't work (fails to install). Any news?
<duflu> (http://cdimages.ubuntu.com/daily-live/)
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<duflu> He says from a warm sunny Summer afternoon
<didrocks> duflu: I would ask that to the fundation team (cyphermox for instance), they are in charge of the iso/installer (and yeah, the installer was failing on flavors as well)
<RAOF> I installed from current just yesterday?
<darkxst> Ubuntu GNOME images are busted from non-root Xorg changes on atleast Virtualbox
<darkxst> but not heard any issues with the actual installation
<didrocks> RAOF: current is the one that passed the tests, (I can install it as well), pending doesn't
<didrocks> I still see for any of them the live installer session exiting though (and going to live session mode as the fallback)
<duflu> Mine consistently fails to install UEFI at the end and gives up. Maybe I should try a different machine
<duflu> Secureboot is off, too
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> re seb128
<seb128> re didrocks
<didrocks> seb128: did you try to create a persistent usb drive recently? It seems I can't (even the blocks alignement after a dd are wrong, so I can't rewrite the partition table)
<didrocks> usb-creator is busted as well
<seb128> didrocks, they dropped the feature on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/usb-creator/0.3.0 it seems
<seb128> I read that yesterday
<seb128> thanks for bringing it up, I wanted to ask mdeslaur / cyphermox what's the point of keeping usb-creator if there is no persistency
<seb128> we can as well use disks then
<seb128> you said "usb-creator is busted as well"
<seb128> did we have another tool to do persistent drives?
<didrocks> well, basically, it's just about adding a new partition
<didrocks> labelled casper-rw
<didrocks> but I can't do that (gparted, fdiskâ¦)
<seb128> :-/
<didrocks> because if you dd the iso, it complains about the partition table not being aligned
<didrocks> (same with disks)
<seb128> urg
<didrocks> tried xubuntu and lubuntu (for debugging the plymouth thing)
<seb128> I use disks and it works usually
<didrocks> you don't try to create another partition though?
<didrocks> to add persistency
<didrocks> (creating an usb live is fine, it's just after when you want to add persistency that it's failing)
<didrocks> soâ¦ I can't even debug this plymouth thing (as I need to reboot asking more debug info to plymouth) :/
<didrocks> I could probably break on casper-bottom and changing the file manually, but if I need to reboot, that will become tedious
<seb128> no I didn't try to add persistency
<seb128> (sorry, had to move, we have some worked over to fix an issue with water on the balcony)
<didrocks> no worry!
<xnox> morning people
<didrocks> hey early xnox :)
<xnox> didrocks, yeah was up since 6:50 or so.
<didrocks> didn't beat me (even with the time diff), but still good time ;)
<didrocks> good, at least, I get now why the text theme in flavors isn't working
<seb128> hey xnox
<xnox> seb128, i think there is a gdcm transition entangled into mono.
<xnox> as it needs to be considered...
<seb128> yeah, of course, wouldn't be fun otherwise right?
<seb128> :-(
<Trevinho> Hello mates!
<seb128> hey Trevinho! how are you?
<didrocks> hey Trevinho!
<seb128> pitti, hey, with run-autopkgtest, is the trigger the candidate package or one of the rdepends it impacts?
 * seb128 is lost with those things
<Trevinho> Hi seb128 and didrocks!
<didrocks> Unpacking libpython2.7-minimal:ppc64el (2.7.11-2) ...
<didrocks> dpkg-deb (subprocess): decompressing archive member: lzma error: compressed data is corrupt
<didrocks> dpkg-deb: error: subprocess <decompress> returned error exit status 2
<didrocks> dpkg: error processing archive /var/cache/apt/archives/libpython2.7-minimal_2.7.11-2_ppc64el.deb (--unpack):
<didrocks>  cannot copy extracted data for './usr/lib/python2.7/re.py' to '/usr/lib/python2.7/re.py.dpkg-new': unexpected end of file or stream
<didrocks> nice!
<didrocks> seems to have been transient, a give back worked
<duflu> Trevinho, maaate
<andyrock> morning
<seb128> hey andyrock, how are you?
<didrocks> good morning andyrock
<Laney> mewwwwww
<didrocks> hey Laney
<didrocks> Trevinho: hum, seems that lp:unity doesn't match what's in the xenial archive, does it?
<didrocks> (no 7.4.0+16.04.20151211-0ubuntu1)
<didrocks> nothing in bilbetto
<didrocks> I was thinking it was doing merge and clean automatically?
<seb128> hey Laney
<Laney> hey didrocks & seb128!
<Laney> how goes?
<seb128> Laney, good! and you?
<didrocks> good good :)
<Laney> mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm not bad
<Laney> I thought I had a bike meeting last night
<Laney> checked my phone as I was next to the door
<Laney> and it was not :(
<didrocks> argh :/
<Laney> so I was like Â¬_Â¬
<Laney> planned to be out all evening
<Laney> so watched the first episode of "the man in the high castle" on streaming instead
<seb128> well, at least you didn't get cold!
<seb128> what happened to the bike meeting?
<seb128> wrong day?
<pitti> hey Laney!
<Laney> next week
<Laney> would have gone climbing instead but it was too late!
<Laney> hi pitti!
<Laney> you ok?
<larsu> good morning!
<didrocks> morning larsu
<larsu> hi didrocks! How are you?
<seb128> hey pitti
<seb128> hey larsu
<Laney> morgen larsu
<didrocks> Laney: I'm good, thanks, you?
<larsu> haha nice email seb128! How are you?
<larsu> hi Laney!
<larsu> sup?
<Laney> looks foggy
<seb128> larsu, I'm better thanks :-) what about you? managed to avoid the cold?
<Laney> I want some kind of coloured lights in here
<Laney> to brighten the place up
<Laney> maybe a lava lamp
<larsu> didrocks: (replying to Laney's ping ;) ) I'm pretty good - throat is not worse than yesterday \o/
 * didrocks see again blue sky, sun, and 14Â° this afternoon
<larsu> took a lot of rest
<Laney> 14Â°
<Laney> SICKENING
<larsu> seb128: I don't think I'm over it, but at least it's not worst
<didrocks> yeah, quite unusual
<larsu> *worse
<Laney> it is about 9 here I think
<didrocks> which is quite high, the average maximum at that period is 7 here
<seb128> is anybody else having issue with canonical infrastructures?
<didrocks> vpn and s-jenkins works here
<Laney> laney@snakefruit:~$ echo hi seb128
<Laney> hi seb128
<seb128> hum, it's just slow
<larsu> cute :)
<seb128> Laney, pitti, I'm probably just too stupid to use that tool right, but what is wrong with "run-autopkgtest -s xenial -a amd64 --trigger=gvfs/1.26.2-1ubuntu1 libgdata"?
<Laney> why do you think it's wrong?
<seb128> because http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/g/gvfs/xenial/amd64/ didn't get updated
<seb128> mot recent run is from 2:49 utc
<Laney> you ran the libgdata test
<seb128> I want to unblock http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html#libgdata
<seb128> what should have I  used?
<seb128> the reverse?
<Laney> yep
<seb128> trigger=libgdata/0.17.4-1
<Laney> do you have retry-autopkgtest-regressions?
<Laney> from lp:ubuntu-archive-tools
<Laney> run that and c+p the ones from there
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> I've a log where it says it's a big hammer to retry stack of failures
<Laney> it just prints them
<Laney> you pick the ones you want
<seb128> k
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> good tip
<Laney> I always typo the package name or the version or something when trying to do it manually
<Laney> humans suck, up the machines
<seb128> yeah
<happyaron> looks ibus upstream now prefer ibus-libpinyin over ibus-pinyin in general
<seb128> I wish we had some web clicky thing for that
<seb128> hey happyaron!
<Laney> there is a bug for that
<Laney> ahoy happyaron
<happyaron> hey guys, :)
<Laney> ä½ å¥½å?
<seb128>   File "./retry-autopkgtest-regressions", line 43, in get_regressions
<seb128>     for arch, (state, _) in archinfo.items():
<seb128> ValueError: too many values to unpack (expected 2)
<seb128> BAH
<happyaron> Laney: æå¾å¥½ï¼è°¢è°¢
<Laney> PIIIIIIIIITTTTTTTTTIIIIIIIIIII
<didrocks> tititi ;)
<pitti> seb128, Laney: sorry, got diverted
<pitti> seb128: that command looks right
<pitti> why would http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/g/gvfs/xenial/amd64/ get updated? you started a libgdata test
<seb128> pitti, yeah, I reversed what the trigger and package are
<pitti> seb128: ah, saw it in backlog now; all ok now?
<seb128> pitti, right, I'm not familiar with the vocabulary
<Laney> r-a-r crashes :)
<seb128> I don't know what a "trigger" is
<seb128> or what is the trigger and what is the triggered
<seb128> and what Laney said
<didrocks> trigger is the condition I guess ;)
<pitti> seb128: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ProposedMigration/AutopkgtestInfrastructure#Re-running_tests explains it a bit, but I'm happy to expand on that
<seb128> I though libgdata would trigger gvfs
<seb128> but I guess it means libgdata is the trigger
<pitti> seb128: so "--trigger=libgdata/0.17.4-1 gvfs": you run gvfs' tests with libgdata from -proposed
<Laney> -            for arch, (state, _) in archinfo.items():
<Laney> +            for arch, (state, _, _) in archinfo.items():
<pitti> seb128: i. e. libgdata gets updated, and its reverse dependenies (like gvfs) get run against that new versrion
<Laney> I guess it got an extra item at some point
<pitti> seb128: so libgdata is the trigger ("why is this test run?") and gvfs the test
<seb128> pitti, ok, thanks
<pitti> Laney: eek, did I break run-autopkgtset yesterday?
<pitti> Laney: ah, retry; will fix, sorry about that
<Laney> bah
<Laney> my session has failed to come up again
<pitti> Laney: I'll robustify it
<seb128> Laney, btw, we lost gnome-contacts from the iso, I guess it's because it was there through empathy recommends only, but it's not a wanted change?
<seb128> Laney, do you have any error? how did you fix it yesterday?
<Laney> seb128: don't know, maybe that is a good change
<Laney> yesterday I tried again and it worked
<seb128> what's the error when it doesn't?
<seb128> is it compiz failing to load the unity plugin?
<Laney> compiz (core) - Debug: Loaded plugin opengl from: /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/compiz/libopengl.so
<Laney> compiz (core) - Info: Starting plugin: opengl
<pitti> Laney, seb128: fixed retry-autopkgtest-regressions (now works with any number of extra URLs), sorry about that
<Laney> that is the last thing
<Laney> pitti: thanks!
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> excuses.yaml now has both URLs to the package history as well as the direct link to the log file
<pitti> (as part of exposing those on excuses.html)
<seb128> Laney, where are those logged nowadays?
<pitti> seb128: bug 1475491 FYI; it's just a lot of work as we need to put that behind SSO
<ubot5> bug 1475491 in Auto Package Testing "provide web-based "retry test" functionality" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1475491
<pitti> and I have NFC about that
<seb128> I don't understand, guest sessions have a gnome-session-Unity.log by mine doesn't
<pitti> so if anyone has experience with that, I'm glad about help :)
<seb128> pitti, I see
<Laney> seb128: which?
<Laney> I'm looking in unity7.log.1.gz which has a current timestamp
<Laney> so I assume that is from now...
<Laney> or maybeupstart just rotated it
<seb128> Laney, my unity7.log has no plugins loading
<seb128> but maybe it was rotated/cleaned
<seb128> Trevinho might be able to help to debug
<seb128> or andyrock
<Laney> it has loads of compiz stuff
<seb128> in what state is your session?
<seb128> working nautilus but no unity UI?
<Laney> no nautilus
<seb128> ok, so not an unity issue
<seb128> rather gnome-session?
<Laney> it has the background from the greeter in a weird resolution
<seb128> or upstart?
<Laney> like it does for a second before nautilus starts
<seb128> I guess you don't have a gnome-session-Unity.log in .cache/upstart?
<seb128> anything interesting in syslog?
<Laney> no gnome session anything
<Laney> wait
<Laney> no they're all old
<seb128> I think those logs go to journal nowadays
<seb128> didrocks, did you figure out what's going on with unity and why the recent landing was not merged back?
<Laney> they -> gnome-session upstart
<seb128> upstart job still output to .cache/upstart no?
<seb128> I don't understand why my session has no gnome-session-Unity.log
<seb128> where a guest has
<seb128> I wonder if I'm not using upstart for some reason
<didrocks> seb128: I'm still waiting on Trevhino
<seb128> right
<didrocks> didn't find the branchâ¦
<seb128> Treeevinnnnnhoooo
<seb128> Trevinho, dude!
<Trevinho> yeah...
<didrocks> Trevinho: looking at IRC sometimes? :)
<didrocks> 10:03:30  didrocks | Trevinho: hum, seems that lp:unity doesn't match what's in the xenial archive, does it?
<didrocks> 10:03:41  didrocks | (no 7.4.0+16.04.20151211-0ubuntu1)
<didrocks> 10:03:45  didrocks | nothing in bilbetto
<didrocks> 10:03:55  didrocks | I was thinking it was doing merge and clean automatically?
<Trevinho> didrocks: I was focused on finishing something, sorry... I ignored the popups :-P
<Trevinho> didrocks: yeah, it has not been merged yet since compiz in silo is not released yet
<seb128> there is something weird with the ci website and jenkins
<seb128> they seem to have lost history and have incomplete records
<Trevinho> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/xenial/update_excuses.html#compiz
<didrocks> Trevinho: I don't find this landing in the ci website, where is it?
<seb128> https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/# has no xenial unity landing
<Trevinho> https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/628
<didrocks> it's not in the dashboardâ¦
<Laney> the only weird thing I can see is a kernel trace in the journal
<didrocks> I'm not even able to decipher what's the landing state is
<didrocks> ah, it's per component
<didrocks> no indication of a global one
<didrocks> robru: any idea why request 628 which isn't merged/fully landed isn't available on the dashboard? (index page) ^
<didrocks> it's in migrating
<robru> didrocks: we just had a catastrophic failure and restored from backups, lost about a day of data
<didrocks> seb128: I guess it doesn't show up the migrating ones
<seb128> didrocks, it does on https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/tickets?status=pocket
<seb128> it's confusing
<didrocks> yeah
<seb128> "all" should include what it states
<seb128> didrocks, Trevinho, I think it's fine to force merge that one, it's blocked due to s390x/mono/etc transitions
<didrocks> robru: the weird part is that it's still showing up in migrating
<seb128> not because of issues in the landing
<didrocks> robru: so some data are duplicated at different places and not coherent perhaps?
<didrocks> seb128: +1
<Trevinho> Yeah, I didn't want to point this out not to bother, but I'd force the landing
<robru> didrocks: what if the issue exactly? 628 is an old enough request it's not lost
<didrocks> robru: it's not in the main page
<seb128> didrocks, can you force merge it since you seem on it?
<didrocks> seb128: I'm not even sure how to do that, can try :p
<robru> didrocks: it's on the second page, it's paginated
<robru> On the bottom it says "... More ..."
<robru> didrocks: you should be able to run merge job, any core dev can
<didrocks> robru: ah, it's paginated, ok, makes sense why we didn't see it
<didrocks> yeah, it's running right now, thanks!
<robru> Yw
<didrocks> the "â¦olderâ¦" to me was more archived ones
<didrocks> Trevinho: seb128: done
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<Trevinho> didrocks: nice
<Trevinho> didrocks: as you know I'd love to get upstream and downstream to be always sinced, not when all the silo lands... But I understand the reasons why it's not doing that :)
<Trevinho> robru:  	Uncaught exception: FileNotFoundError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: '/var/lib/jenkins/silos/ubuntu/landing-011/xenial/unity/unity_published.new ? :o
<robru> Trevinho: hang on
<robru> Trevinho: what request number?
<Trevinho> robru: still 628
<robru> Ugh, race condition
<robru> Trevinho: its merged, it's done
<robru> Trevinho: run the abandon job i guess if you want that error to go away
<seb128> larsu, I don't think you replied yesterday, but still on the nautilus menubar? how is that going?
 * larsu scrolls back
<larsu> seb128: oh indeed - I overread because of the other ping. Yes, ongoing :(
<seb128> larsu, any estimate how much more work is it? I'm working if it's starting being too much and should look for a plan B
<larsu> seb128: no, I was just distracted by a lot of things
<larsu> I finish it in the next days
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> I'm still working today and tomorrow
<seb128> but I might connect and upload that on friday if you get it ready
<seb128> I wanted to get that off my list before holidays if possible
<larsu> got it
<larsu> it's a gtk upload as well
<seb128> Laney, I guess gnome-calendar is an after holidays at this point?
<seb128> larsu, oh, ok
<larsu> yeah, wasn't straight forward unfortunately :/
<Laney> seb128: I filed the mir yesterday
<Laney> so it is in the hands of those fine people
<seb128> great
<xnox> is gnome-calendar "california"
<xnox> ?
<larsu> nope
<Laney> launch time
<Laney> unity is warning about num lock?!?!?!
<pitti> didrocks: ok, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ProposedMigration/AutopkgtestInfrastructure#Test_request_format now documents bzr and git support
<pitti> didrocks: and git cloning works
<pitti> didrocks: I ran "autopkgtest/run-from-checkout --git-source https://github.com/ubuntu/ubuntu-make.git" on the CI infra and it works fine
<pitti> didrocks: to do a full run, is there some PPA of your's which I could run this against, to avoid cluttering the main Ubuntu test result container?
<pitti> didrocks: i. e. the test dependencies will be satisfied from ubuntu + this PPA (you might not need them if your tests run against the code in git of course -- but it's still relevant for determining the result URL)
<didrocks> pitti: \o/ you ROCK!
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, please use ppa:ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu-make
<pitti> didrocks: thanks, you too!
<pitti> didrocks: should they run against trusty or xenial?
<didrocks> pitti: there are some build tests dependencies in some ppa
<didrocks> trusty for now (main target)
<davmor2> didrocks: pitti is not a rock, he's an awesome person, you liar ;)
<didrocks> ahah :)
 * pitti teaches the concept of verbs to davmor2
<didrocks> pitti: ppa:ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu-make-builddeps for trusty test deps
<seb128> Laney, yeah, that feels buggy (num lock warning), want to open a bug about it?
<seb128> I went wth about it as well
<pitti> didrocks: oh erk
<davmor2> pitti: good luck with that
<pitti> didrocks: I just used the former
<pitti> didrocks: ok, cancelling, and re-running
<didrocks> pitti: you need both
<pitti> didrocks: what's the difference between ppa:ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu-make-builddeps and ppa:ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu-make?
<Laney> seb128: I guess it's useful on laptop keyboards
<seb128> is it?
<didrocks> pitti: ppa:ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu-make is the end consumer product, which ubuntu-make backported and it's deps
<Laney> yes if it's making you type numbers instead of letters
<didrocks> pitti: ppa:ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu-make-builddeps is additional tests dependencies when needing newer version
<Laney> some of them have a num lock like that
<seb128> Laney, it's confusing/buggy on external keyboards though
<Laney> indeed
<Laney> but I think the feature has good intentions :)
<didrocks> but I prefer end users to not using theme as it's new version, possibly API breakageâ¦
<didrocks> like python3-requests 4.0 instead of 3.x
<seb128> larsu, right, suboptimal implementation then, still worth a bug report :-)
<pitti> 'ubuntu-make-trunk {"test-git": "https://github.com/ubuntu/ubuntu-make.git", "ppas": ["ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu-make-builddeps", "ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu-make"]}'
<pitti> didrocks: ^ looks ok?
<larsu> seb128: you mean Laney ?
<pitti> didrocks: I somewhat arbitrarily call the test name "ubuntu-make-trunk", let me know if I should use something else
<didrocks> pitti: perfect! (/me prefers the "master" rather than trunk term to match git, but yeah ;))
<pitti> didrocks: the name only matters for the result path
<pitti> didrocks: yes master!
<didrocks> thanks ;)
<seb128> larsu, yes, you people having a nickname starting with la*!
<pitti> didrocks: http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/running.shtml#pkg-ubuntu-make-master
<seb128> :-)
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, it's quite "amazing" that we ship (and use) python-requests by default :/
<larsu> Laney: change your nick!
<pitti> and with that -- c'est l'heure de dejeuner !
<didrocks> sweet!
<didrocks> pitti: bon appÃ©tit!
<pitti> didrocks: merci !
<seb128> pitti, bon'ap
 * pitti will watch the 3rd episode of Breaking Bad
<didrocks> heh, a new addict :-)
<didrocks> pitti: liking it so far? :)
<Laney> people need to three letter tab!
<Laney> ask cjohnston
<seb128> Trevinho, what was the rational to add that numlock warning? there is no bug report attached to the merge request
 * didrocks declares online search to be now off by default (and related scope purged/demoted)
<seb128> didrocks, well done!
<didrocks> ;)
<seb128> didrocks, thanks for transitionning the music lens to the new gee on the way as well
<didrocks> seb128: no worry! it will be one less upload I guess ;)
<seb128> indeed
<didrocks> just need a publisher cycle for all removals and demotions to be taken into account, and we should be good
<pitti> didrocks: yes, I do! pretty dark, though
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, told you, better to be in a good mood for that one :)
<Laney> heh
<Laney> I made it to about 10 episodes
<didrocks> Laney: you should have hang on, it's awesome! :)
<didrocks> or rather, hook up stronger ;)
<Laney> seems there's quite a lot of cool series out now
<Laney> the amazon/netflix productions are pretty decent
<didrocks> indeed
<Laney> maybe one day I'll get back to breaking bad
<Laney> :P
<didrocks> as attente told me in China
<didrocks> "I'm so jaleous, you don't know what's going to happen then" ;)
<didrocks> (and he was write, the serie is more and more awesome)
<cyphermox> yeah, so awesome they ended it and planning to start it again ;)
<didrocks> cyphermox: you mean, not "better call saul", but something else?
<didrocks> better call saul is really different, but quite descent :)
<Laney> speaking of
<didrocks> decent*
<cyphermox> yeah, something else, with Walter White
<Laney> lunch and an episode of high castle
<Laney> laters ;-)
<didrocks> nice! :)
<didrocks> enjoy Laney
<pitti> didrocks: https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-trusty-ubuntu-desktop-ubuntu-make?format=plain
<pitti> didrocks: so in particular: https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-trusty-ubuntu-desktop-ubuntu-make/trusty/amd64/u/ubuntu-make-master/20151215_130855@/log.gz
<didrocks> pitti: good! so pep8 and small tests are running fine :)
<desrt> hello desktopians
<larsu> morning desrt
<seb128> hey desrt
<Trevinho> seb128: so... Numlock... Well, I found annoying when using a notebook computer where the TN is shared with the keyboard itself and the numlock  toggles it. I would have loved to get a way to detect that, but I don't think it exists.
<desrt> good morning, larsu, seb128
<seb128> Trevinho, right, see my comment, we tried in the past and reverted due to hardware sucking and users hating it
<Trevinho> seb128: or... Maybe I could show the warning in different ways, so... Like making it semi-transparent when only numlock is there like a "ligher warning"
<seb128> Trevinho, I'm unsure the situation changed
<didrocks> good morning desrt
<desrt> hey didrocks :)
<Trevinho> lighter*
<seb128> Trevinho, you can try, I predict that users are still going to hate it, numlock on is normal on a standard external keyboar
<seb128> d
<seb128> I disabled numlock a few time because of the warning
<seb128> thinking my numlock was in wrong state
<seb128> which in fact was no, I want it on
<Trevinho> I do as well when docking...
<seb128> see :-)
<Trevinho> so... mh I understand that this might be complicated :-PÃ¹
<seb128> I gave some past upstream and downstream references on the bug on why that was reverted when tried
<seb128> we can go through that feedback loop again though and see
<mdeslaur> ohgawdplease no
<seb128> haha
<seb128> see :-)
<Trevinho> seb128: I think keeping it at 30% opacity gives an idea without being a "strong" attention mark...
<seb128> Trevinho, we can try
<Trevinho> seb128: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/14027728/
<Trevinho> seb128: ah for some reason I thought it was a question ("how we can try") :-P
 * mdeslaur stars pre-emptively filing bugs and assigning them to Trevinho
<Trevinho> mdeslaur: better than having to fill the bugs by myself :-)
<mdeslaur> hehe
<xclaesse> seb128, do you know where ubuntu configures gtk to have window buttons (close/maximize/...) on the left?
<seb128> xclaesse, I think in the theme
<seb128> or maybe it's a gsettings key
<seb128> larsu or mitya57 probably remember
<xclaesse> GtkHeaderBar takes "gtk-decoration-layout" property on GtkSettings
<xclaesse> didn't find that in theme
<xclaesse> I would like to extend that to be able to tell to skip all buttons when maximized
<seb128> the index.theme has a ButtonLayout
<seb128> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-art-pkg/ubuntu-themes/trunk/view/head:/Ambiance/index.theme#L12
<seb128> hum, that's older
<seb128> dunno
<seb128> xclaesse, https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/ubuntu-themes/headerbar-fixes/+merge/200477
<larsu> xclaesse: it takes it from gsettings
<larsu> xclaesse: org.gnome.desktop.wm.preferences button-layout
<larsu> unity-settings-daemon watches that key and sets the xsetting
<seb128> what larsu said I guess
<larsu> seb128: I can't make the meeting today :( Sent you an email with the updates
<seb128> need to go for a bit otherwise I'm going to be late for the meeting
<seb128> brb
<seb128> larsu, ok :-(
<larsu> I'll be back later as well (but might be quite late)
<seb128> k
<seb128> have fun!
<xclaesse> larsu, seb128, thanks !
<xclaesse> my plan is to improve GtkHeaderBar's parser to accept format like "<buttons when windowed>;<buttons when maximized>"
<xclaesse> so on ubuntu that would be "close,minimize,maximize:;"
<xclaesse> meaning no button when max
<larsu> interesting :)
 * desrt ph33r
 * xclaesse is just too lazy to introduce a new setting
<desrt> good morning, xclaesse
<xclaesse> I already patched ubuntu theme to make GtkHeaderBar look the same has a toolbar when window is maximized
<xclaesse> that can be done with simple css
<xclaesse> desrt, morning :)
<xclaesse> gave a try to ubuntu 16.04, more headerbar everywhere... something needs to be done
<desrt> xclaesse: interesting how you treat each dconfchangeset database separately
<desrt> which, of course, makes a good deal of sense for serialise/deserialise
<xclaesse> you mean for user and default values?
<desrt> but i actually didn't expect you to use that on the reader side...
<desrt> ya
<desrt> for some reason i expected each key to be sent as a pair of (mvmv)
<desrt> like a{s(mvmv)} or so
<xclaesse> yeah, could have made my own type, but I just though it was easier to reuse changeset' serialize code
<desrt> ya.  makes sense, i think.
<seb128> hey desktopers
<didrocks> hey hey seb128
<seb128> #startmeeting
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Dec 15 15:31:10 2015 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
<seb128> Roll call:  andyrock, attente, desrt,  dgadomski, didrocks, fjkong, happyaron, hikiko, laney, larsu (out), qengho, seb128, sweet5hark, themuso (out), tkamppeter, robert_ancell (out), willcooke (out)
<desrt> hello second in command!
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> ok, let's get rolling
<seb128> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: andyrock
<seb128> andyrock, hey
<andyrock> hey
<andyrock> so my week
<andyrock> * reviewed Trevinho's MP
<andyrock> * reviewing the patch proposed by a community guy to improve search and launch of application from the dash
<andyrock> \eow
<andyrock> I should finish the review today or maximum tomorrow
<andyrock> then I'll move to supporto "startup notification" in the dash
<seb128> k
<seb128> thanks andyrock
<seb128> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: attente
<seb128> attente, hey
<attente> hi all
<attente> spent the week debugging and fixing the apparmor dconf and kernel patches which went stale due to upstream changes and submitted it to the mailing list, also think i might've found a kernel bug that should be easily fixable
<attente> revisiting the popup menu refactoring stuff in gtk
<attente> (eof)
<desrt> attente: try to get in good with the kernel guys... i have a few more patches you can write when you're finished with these ones =)
<attente> desrt: apparmor related or ...?
<desrt> inotify, etc. :)
<seb128> attente, hide!
<desrt> you know... simple stuff
<desrt> *cough*
<attente> rofl. i guess not like the off-by-one error i found...
<desrt> in security code?
<attente> rhashtable code
<desrt> cute.
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> thanks attente!
<attente> thanks seb128!
<seb128> I hope they are going to like the patches this time
<seb128> next
<seb128> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: desrt
<seb128> desrt, hey
<desrt> hi
<desrt> working on the dconf/gsettings stuff still
<desrt> preparing a dconf release for today which will not break things
<desrt> following that will be a glib release that will not break things (later in the week)
<seb128> finger crossed!
<desrt> after that, i think there is probably going to be some breakage
<seb128> fingers even
<seb128> haha
<desrt> the gsettingsbackend interface is going to change in an incompatable way so there will need to be a lockstep upgrade between dconf and glib at some point
<seb128> I see
<desrt> i _may_ be able to preserve compatibility across the upgrade but i'm not sure it's worth it
<Laney> "will" is a good word
<desrt> considering this has always been considered a private interface and there is only one out-of-tree implementation of it
<seb128> well, as long as you don't break anything existing users along the way...
<desrt> it's only the backend interface that's changing
<desrt> so ya... i'll sync up again when i know a bit more about exactly how it will go down
<seb128> k
<desrt> \end{week}
<seb128> thanks desrt!
<seb128> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: dgadomski
<seb128> dgadomski, hey
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> Sorry, I don't have anything in particular to share this week. I was busy with non-desktop stuff.
<dgadomski> thank you
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> thanks dgadomski
<seb128> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, hey :-)
<didrocks> hey!
<didrocks> Ubuntu Make:
<didrocks> - released Ubuntu Make 15.12 (features below).
<didrocks> - jetbrains changed its website breaking us. Consequently, adapt to new jetbrains' website (after some poking, they are using client-side javascript), so found their API rather and using this which should be more stable. Adapt medium tests assets for this as well, fake certificates, as all IDEs based on it.
<didrocks> - close the too many bugs opened (even after the fix) on this ^ :)
<didrocks> - merged an external contributor's update to Unity3D. Fixe medium tests to work with this.
<didrocks> - some cleanage on beautifulsoup warnings on xenial.
<didrocks> Misc:
<didrocks> - uploaded plymouth, and adapting all flavors community themes to it. Did some post-upload fixes. Still one flavor bug to fix (but know, understanding the issue).
<didrocks> - registering Google Code In tasks and spent quite some time mentoring. We had one fix on unity in for now, 2 are in a good progress state, some will need more workâ¦
<didrocks> - worked on language support, fixup missing packages in some locales.
<didrocks> - some AA duties like reviewed geonames, promoting/demoting some packages
<didrocks> - MIR duties (a bunch of s390-related reviews + geonames)
<didrocks> .
<seb128> good week didrocks! (as usual ;-)
<didrocks> thx ;)
<seb128> thanks for the MIRs
<Laney> MIR team is the best team
<seb128> see the love :-)
<seb128> ok, next
<desrt> mir team?
<Laney> that's Mir
<seb128> desrt, the one that review things that go in main
<didrocks> (yw on the MIR, but more people would be very welcomed ;))
<seb128> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: FJKong
<desrt> seb128: i know ;)
<seb128> FJKong, hey
<FJKong> heyu
<FJKong> hey
<seb128> desrt, I see what you did :p
<FJKong> sogou IM bug tracking:
<FJKong> 1 restart after changing font size.
<seb128> it's not friday yet!
<FJKong> 2 sometimes it will crash after system suspend.
<FJKong> 3 prepare new feature plan for next release.
<FJKong> other:
<FJKong> 4 trying building QtWebkit but not goes well.
<FJKong> eof]
<seb128> what's the issue with qtwebkit? and why do you need to build it?
<FJKong> oh, I just want to try, for wechat
<qengho> FJKong: I might be of assistance.
<FJKong> qengho: nice
<FJKong> let talk about it later
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I guess you can talk outside the meeting then
<seb128> thanks FJKong
<seb128> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: happyaron
<seb128> happyaron, hey? you sent me your summary so I guess not there ...
<seb128> 1. Yet another libpinyin transition.
<seb128> 2. OpenCC transition.
<seb128> 3. Update of fcitx family.
<seb128> 4. Working on the mozc issue with unity-greeter.
<seb128> #topic hikiko
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: hikiko
<seb128> hikiko, hey
<seb128> oh, she's off according to the week summary email
<seb128> and willcooke didn't fwd me the status he got
<seb128> so next I guess
<seb128> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Laney
<seb128> Laney, hey
<Laney> hi
<Laney> â¢ short week & weird week - off friday & in london office thursday
<Laney> â¢ file gnome-calendar mir and document some issues to fix later
<Laney> â¢ upload new gtk 3 and gtk 2, massage tests until they go in
<Laney> â¢ massage for dbus too
<Laney> â¢ new libgdata
<Laney> â¢ uploads for bullet/gdal/stuff transition which in the end got traded off for a load of new uninstallables in the release, help fix some of those
<Laney> â¢ debug some s390x issues, fix some but mainly pass them over to my mentee xnox
<Laney> â¢ some fixes for mono transition, to debian and ubuntu
<Laney> â¢ start working on gstreamer
<Laney> â¢ some small fixes for geonames including LP project admin, found an LP bug while doing that
<Laney> â
 * didrocks wonders if he shouldn't /nick dbus to get a massage from Laney
<Laney> you want a massage?
<seb128> haha
<qengho> Ew.
<seb128> from crucher?!
<Laney> that can be arranged
<Laney> step over to my private room
<didrocks> ahah :)
<pitti> oh la la
 * Laney puts some barry white on
<desrt> ...
 * didrocks escapes then
 * Laney actually does do that
<seb128> enjoy the music! :-)
<seb128> thanks Laney
<desrt> is this why we don't have sprints anymore? :)
 * Laney is reminded of ally mcbeal
<seb128> #topic larsu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: larsu
<seb128> who is watching his niece and not IRC, but he sent his update!
<seb128> - modify the blurry-screenshot patch according to company's input
<seb128> - help out with some issues noticed while doing the MIR for geonames
<seb128> (thanks seb128)
<seb128>   - look into making the timezone popover in control center less jiggly
<seb128>   - look into apparent slowness of the popover on slower machines / hard
<seb128>   drives, but couldn't reproduce yet (reported by seb128)
<seb128> - nautilus :/
<seb128> - reviews/bugs as usual
<seb128> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: qengho
<seb128> qengho, hey
<qengho> Hi hi.
<qengho> Just one thing.
<qengho> * Working on new upstream chromium release & xdg-utils
<seb128> ah, I was going to ask about xdg-utils
<seb128> saw that it still didn't get an upload
<seb128> let us know when you need sponsoring review again
<qengho> Yeah. It should be easy. I'll ask for sponsor tomorrow.
<Laney> theeeeeere's no way they could have made two
<qengho> Er, not upstream again.
<qengho> Just my dist patches.
<seb128> Laney, :-)
<seb128> qengho, well, that's the one didrocks reviewed and asked you to rebase on the archive upload right?
<seb128> or the debian update
<qengho> Yes.
<seb128> k
<seb128> well, let us know when it's ready for a new review round
 * qengho nods.
<seb128> thanks qengho
<seb128> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: seb128
<seb128> â¢ reviewed, tweaked, uploaded geonames (thanks didrocks for the NEW review!)
<seb128> â¢ debugged a bit nautilus segfault issues/provided info upstream
<seb128> â¢ reviewed/landed unity-control-center use of the new geonames
<seb128> â¢ landed unity-settings-daemon fix from diwic
<seb128> â¢ travelled to London for a day for design meetings
<seb128> â¢ tested e-d-s oauth changes from 3.19, doesn't solve our issue
<seb128> â¢ restored g-s-d cursors plugin schemas to fix u-s-d corresponding code
<seb128> â¢ updated nautilus
<seb128> â¢ updated evolution-indicator to not use gtkhtml (deprecated and removed from Debian)
<seb128> </week>
<didrocks> oh gtkhtml is gone for good!
<seb128> yep!
<didrocks> nice :-)
<seb128> evo using webkit now even for composing ;-)
<Laney> my shotwell patches to port to wk2 got pushed
<didrocks> one less parser duplication in distro :)
<seb128> ok, next is ...
<seb128> #topic Sweet5hark1
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Sweet5hark1
<didrocks> (10 more to come ;))
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, hey!
<Laney> going to look at the state of that again after holidays
<seb128> Laney, oh, they did? I though it was an "inspiration" patch but not a fully working version?
<seb128> it means shotwell has a new maintainer as well?
<Laney> there were a few tweaks but seems like it was mostly ok
<Laney> nah, just someone wanting to get stuff off webkit1
<seb128> k
<seb128> no Sweet5hark1 again I guess...
<seb128> k, seems not
<seb128> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: tkamppeter
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Released 1.4.0 upstream with
<tkamppeter>    - Support for Braille printers via CUPS
<tkamppeter>    - Security fix in foomatic-rip
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Packaged and commited to Debian GIT repo.
<tkamppeter> - Committed fix for /etc/init/cups.override on the phone as merge proposal to lxc-android-config
<tkamppeter> - MIR for openjpeg (Ghostscript/Poppler) will be done by Security team end of January.
<tkamppeter> - Question: The Braille support in cups-filters needs liblouisutdml-bin which is in Universe (needs MIR and I do not know whether Security team has still a slot for 16.04) and perhaps more MIRs for dependencies. Should I separate Braill as optional binary package? Or should we do the MIRs?
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<seb128> tkamppeter, is that a build-time requirement or only runtime?
<seb128> ok, let's discuss that after the meeting
<seb128> I don't know how much that feature is requested
<seb128> but it's probably not something we need on the default installation/main
<seb128> universe supported splitted out would probably be good enough
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<seb128> #topic other topics?
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: other topics?
<seb128> (sorry I don't have status updates from others, willcooke didn't fwd me those)
<Trevinho> seb128: /me
<seb128> arg
<seb128> sorry
<Trevinho> np
<seb128> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Trevinho
<seb128> hey :-)
<Trevinho> Â· Removed gconf backend from compiz
<Trevinho> Â· Fixes in the nautilus-launcher integration.
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed compiz build failure caused by new pkg-config handling of quotes in variables and xorg-gtest
<Trevinho> Â· Finalized new landing of bamf, compiz, nux and unity
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed nautilus folders handler desktop file to open folders in new windows
<Trevinho> Â· Use filemanager *WithTimestamp operations
<Trevinho> Â· Add kind of \"ref-counting\" to key actions, so that they can't be ungrabbed if there are multiple customers.
<Trevinho> Â· Final revew of Kylin lockscreen shield and other contributions
<Trevinho> Â· Muted some a11y warnings spamming the logs when opening quicklists
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed misalignment of maximized scaled windows
<Trevinho> Â· And last, but most important... Joined the Canonical Xmas party in London
<Trevinho> î¿î¿î¿
<seb128> (sorry I worked from the previous week list where you were on national holidays)
<seb128> gconf removed from compiz \o/
<Laney> good joke
<Laney> would chuckle at again
 * Sweet5hark1 is late
 * seb128 didn't get the joke (I think?)
<seb128> thanks Trevinho
<Laney> he escaped some quotes
<seb128> ha!
<seb128> he seems to know his public :p
<seb128> now with compiz off the gconf list we are getting close from being able to ship the LTS without it on the iso
<seb128> Sweet5hark1 promissed an updated libreoffice
<Sweet5hark1> libreoffice 5.1 has no gconf upstream.
<seb128> apturl needs fixing
<seb128> and aisleriot can be dropped I guess
<seb128> I'm going to fix apturl
<seb128> #topic Sweet5hark1
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Sweet5hark1
<seb128> hey, since you are there, you might have an update? ;-)
<Sweet5hark1> - snappifying libreoffice:
<Sweet5hark1> - got a build finished with some hacks from hell
<Sweet5hark1> - some tests still fail, install not tested yet
<Sweet5hark1> - its still huge
<Sweet5hark1> EOF
<seb128> thanks Sweet5hark1
<seb128> since you mentioned 5.1 before, what's the status of that one?
<seb128> when do you expect to see it landing in xenial?
<ricotz> next week ;P
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: as per upstream schedule https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleasePlan#5.1_release
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: we already have the current beta in the ppa for xenial
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, well, our versions tracker shows that Debian has it in experimental
<Laney> seb128 is allergic to red lines
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: do you want to dump a beta to xenial?
<seb128> Ahchoo
<ricotz> please no
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: note that betas do not even have l10n
<seb128> ricotz, why not?
<ricotz> the RC1 seems reasonable though
<ricotz> seb128, we just have beta 1 in the ppa
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, I trust you, whenever you think is right
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: yeah. not yet ;)
<seb128> anyway, no need to block the meeting on that dicussion
<seb128> thanks Sweet5hark1
<ricotz> and this is kind of a critical element to use ;)
<seb128> #topic other topics
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: other topics
<seb128> ricotz, yeah, it's also an unstable distro
<seb128> not a production one
<seb128> we don't want to make things not work
<seb128> but we also want early feedback and not being overconservative
<Laney> last meeting of the year
<Laney> happy holidays!
<ricotz> (I know, still there are reasons for it to be beta ;P)
<seb128> indeed, I was going to say
<didrocks> who is there next week?
<didrocks> o/
<seb128> happy holidays everyone!
<ricotz> hohoho
<didrocks> here*
<Laney> didrocks: you are?
<didrocks> yep
<Laney> going to be quiet for you I think :)
<didrocks> seems so :)
 * Laney will watch your webcam to make sure you are working
<didrocks> Laney: guess which finger am I showing up to you right now? :)
<Laney> thumb
<didrocks> I am*
<Laney> pointing upwards
<didrocks> sure sure :)
<seb128> from hr.c.c there are not so many people off
<didrocks> many other didn't set it in the calendar or are not reading the meeting :)
<Laney> the mail said assume everyone is off
<seb128> robert&luke&laney&attente&sweetshark&willcooke&me
<Laney> so I guess that at least means there is no meeting
<seb128> right
<seb128> no meeting
<desrt> fascinating
<seb128> but it seems half the team is still working
<desrt> see you all next year :)
 * Laney group hug
<seb128> ok, let's wrap on that
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Dec 15 16:18:28 2015 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2015/ubuntu-desktop.2015-12-15-15.31.moin.txt
<Laney> keep an eye on telegram
<seb128> thanks everyone
<Laney> for pix
<seb128> :-)
<Laney> like the one I just sent
<didrocks> thanks guys!
<attente> thanks
<seb128> Laney, hehe, larsu should send one back from his niece!
<Laney> consuming huge block of cheese
 * desrt listening to snow day
<Laney> snow would be good
<desrt> no kidding
<seb128> Laney, what webkitgtk users are still needed porting if we drop s-c?
<Laney> http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/ng5
<desrt> we've had double-digits here :(
<Laney> these temperatures are mad
<seb128> same here
<seb128> wth with winter
<desrt> http://weather.gc.ca/city/pages/on-128_metric_e.html
<desrt> currently 10Â°c.  wtf.
<desrt> oo!  -1 on saturday!!
<seb128> the only good part about that is that the drive for holidays is going to be easy
<attente> xclaesse: i revised the apparmor patches, it'll probably take some time to review since it's holiday season, but it should look something like this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/14029227/ http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/14029217/
<tkamppeter> seb128, the dependencies for Braille are run-time dependencies, additional filters to turn formatted text into a Braille with transscription of the formatations.
 * attente hopes for snow
<Laney> seb128: software-center for the iso I think
<Laney> we have devhelp and evolution in main at least too
<seb128> I guess we could talk about demoting those
<Laney> devhelp is on wk2 actually, probably just needs to move over
<Laney> so evolution
<Laney> that could probably go
<tkamppeter> seb128, I think I will split the binary packages to get a separate cups-filters-braille package and this one can stay in Universe.
<seb128> tkamppeter, I would split the binary and have the braille support in universe then
<seb128> tkamppeter, good choice
<didrocks> tkamppeter: sounds like the best bet
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<Laney> I think anyway, will look next* week
 * Laney has a calendar reminder for that
<xclaesse> attente, looks good to me, thanks
<xclaesse> attente, in the meantime I wrote a simple keyfile
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: checking schedules and my vacation 5.1.0~rc1 in the second week of january might be a good goal for xenial. addendum for the weekly report: also bumped the ppa to 4.4.7 upstream release for vivid.
<tkamppeter> seb128, unfortunately, themuso is already EOY, otherwise we could ask him about the importance of the Braille printing support and about whether he would run the MIRs if he wants it in Main.
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, k, thanks
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, I wouldn't bother much about vivid at this point, it's neither current stable nor a LTS
<seb128> tkamppeter, yeah, I'm unsure he knows how common those printers are though ... let's split to universe to start and we can discuss MIR if somebody makes a case for promoting
<seb128> Laney, do you have a Debian desktop install fs handy?
<attente> xclaesse: there's also a way to "yes-no" query if a particular path is readable/read-writable, but i guess you don't really need it. but it should be available if your requirements change (this is all pending the review, of course)
<tkamppeter> seb128, OK.
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: yeah. 4.4.7 was an extra dot release. usually .6 would have been the last. However, my 4.4.7 build is also the base for ricotz backports to trusty/precise. Easy to just do that than to have nagging mails why the last 4.4 release is missing.
<xclaesse> attente, awesome
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, right, if it's not too much work...
<xclaesse> attente, can you give me the link to the new patches please?
<xclaesse> attente, does it need kernel side patches as well?
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: one only ever knows after the fact, but this one was quick ;)
<attente> xclaesse: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/apparmor/2015-December/008939.html
<tkamppeter> seb128, how can I let cups-browsed have different default settings (in /etc/cups/cups-browsed.conf) on the phone and on the desktop?
<Laney> seb128: a filesystem?
<xclaesse> attente, thanks
<attente> xclaesse: yes, there is a kernel patch (in that mail). it applies on the xenial kernel, but i haven't tried to apply it on the upstream one. i doubt that would work...
<xclaesse> attente, what tool are you using for fetching those patches?
 * xclaesse is always surprised that in 2015 we still don't share patches as a real git branch
<attente> xclaesse: for the apparmor user space, you can apply them on the upstream bazaar branch after doing a git init in the directory
<attente> it sucks, but it's what i did to produce them in the first place...
<mitya57> seb128, xclaesse: code in that merge proposal is no longer actual, nowadays gtkheaderbar reads the layout from XSettings
<mitya57> (and unity-settings-daemon reads the setting in gsettings, does some translation, and makes it available on XSettings)
<seb128> Laney, yeah, I want to know what cursor themes are installed in /usr/share/icons and if they provide the icons for "progress" and "text"
<seb128> Laney, so basically need a find on an unpack tree
<seb128> no need of a running instance
<seb128> is Debian doing live session isos nowadays?
<seb128> mitya57, thanks, that's what larsu replied earlier
<seb128> mitya57, just curious, but if python-keyring builds fine without python-fs couldn't you just drop that b-d in debian and have the package in sync?
<xclaesse> mitya57, yep, got it, I'll work on it during my Christmas vacations
<seb128> xclaesse, thanks for looking at that!
<Laney> seb128: mine isn't clean
<Laney> you can probably install task-gnome-desktop in a chroot th ough
<seb128> unclean is probably fine
<seb128> but if it's work don't bother, it's probably not worth it
<seb128> trying to tell gedit upstream that those are "not standard" because our themes don't ship them is probably not going to be the right way anyway
<seb128> we should probably fix our themes to have symlinks
<seb128> seems like that's what fedora/adwaita does
<seb128> like progress->left_ptr_watch
<seb128> which all themes have
<xclaesse> seb128, no promise, but it's getting on my nerves so I think I'll just stop complaining and just fix it :p
<seb128> :-)
<tkamppeter> seb128, see also Debian bug 808057
<ubot5> Debian bug 808057 in cups-filters "Please demote dependency on liblouisutdm1-bin" [Normal,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/808057
<Laney> seems it's adwaita
<seb128> k
<seb128> tkamppeter, right, confirms what we said
 * didrocks waves good evening and good night!
<mitya57> seb128, https://anonscm.debian.org/cgit/python-modules/packages/python-keyring.git/commit/?id=4d47c1c01e91f1172a4bbf88be32a04b168b1fd0
<mitya57> I will upload 5.7.1 soonish, and sync that.
<seb128> mitya57, great, thanks
<qengho> Isn't there some way to make dpkg-source or something not unpack some files from the orig tarball? I only see some debian/source/options param to exclude some pattern on creation, but that's not what I want.
<Laney> no
<Laney> what do you want that for?
<qengho> Laney: As of last week, Chromium ships with some binutils and compilers and such. I want to make sure I'm not using them, ever.
<Laney> remove them in the clean target or repack the tarball you get from upstream
<qengho> Laney: And I don't want to repack the orig tarball. I've gone out of my way to make sure I am not the weakest point if Large Government security agency wants to slip some backdoor into some big opaque software, so I check upstream checksums in build machines.
<qengho> Okay. clean it is.
 * qengho lunch
<mterry> Is anyone else dogfooding webbrowser-app?  Looks like it's broken for me on xenial desktop now.  Just want confirmation
<mterry> Doesn't seem to finish loading any page
<seb128> let me try
<seb128> is that unity7 or unity8 session?
<seb128> mterry, wfm
<seb128> on  unity7
<mterry> seb128, unity7
<mterry> humph
<tkamppeter> seb128, splitting I have done now on Debian's GIT repo of cups-filters, so we only need to wait for the next release by Debian which will auto-sync into Ubuntu.
<seb128> tkamppeter, well done!
<seb128> wooot, Laney cleaning red lines ;-)
<Laney> o\
<tkamppeter> seb128, how can I let cups-browsed have different default settings (in /etc/cups/cups-browsed.conf) on the phone and on the desktop?
<seb128> tkamppeter, try having a look to what they did with bluez, I'm unsure what's the best way, I think they do something like changing the code/scripts to load an alternative config is present and they install that alternative config in some touch package
<ricotz> seb128, hi, are you available to sponsor a merge of gettext?
 * Trevinho waves... And goes decorating the xmas tree!
<seb128> ricotz, I can do that
<seb128> Trevinho, have fun, post a photo for us on the group once you had it decorated ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, great, ttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gettext/+bug/1526373 -- it is still building though -- https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/ubuntu/staging/+sourcepub/5776623/+listing-archive-extra
<seb128> ricotz, ok, I have a look in a few minutes
<seb128> thanks for working on that!
<ricotz> yeah, quite an important one ;)
<tkamppeter> seb128, I did not see anything in bluez which makes a difference between desktop and phone.
<seb128> tkamppeter, try asking morphix
<qengho> I'm digging the progress bar on apt-get invocations.
<tkamppeter> seb128, morphix or morphis?
<tkamppeter> seb128, Simon Busch?
<seb128> tkamppeter, yes
<tkamppeter> On a merge proposal I got the answer "Review: Approve; LGTM but needs proper landing through the citrain", what do I have to do now?
<desrt> xnox: didn't realise you were back.  welcome :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-12-16
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning!
<pitti> bonjour didrocks !
<didrocks> hey pitti, how are you?
<seb128> hey desktopers didrocks pitti
<didrocks> re seb128
<tjaalton> seb128: hey, did you file a bug about the touchpad scrolling with -libinput?
<pitti> bonjour seb128, tu es tÃ´t !
<pitti> didrocks: trÃ¨s bien, merci ! et toi ?
<pitti> seb128: "le monde appartient a ceux qui se lÃ¨vent tÃ´t" :) (je peux practiquer mon franÃ§ais..)
<didrocks> pitti:  Ã§a va bien :-)
<didrocks> pitti: tu pars quand en vacances ? Fin de semaine ?
<pitti> didrocks: oui, on va Ã  Dresden dimanche
<pitti> Je vais commencer le travail 4 janvier
<didrocks> profitez bien :-)
<pitti> didrocks: et toi, les mÃªmes dates ?
<didrocks> pitti: non, le 24 pour moi
<didrocks> et je reviens le 4
<didrocks> (il me restera 5 jours Ã  utiliser en dÃ©but d'annÃ©e prochaine)
<pitti> oui, moi aussi -- en fait, 6.5
<didrocks> waow ;)
<seb128> tjaalton, oh, no, what was the command again?
<seb128> pitti, oui, c'est tÃ´t mais Ã  cause de mon rhume
<seb128> je me suis rÃ©veillÃ© et je toussais
<pitti> seb128: erk, get well soon then!
<seb128> I'm much better thanks
<duflu> tjaalton: Oooh, do we have new touchpad functionality if you enable libinput in X?
<seb128> just accumulation during the night and mornings still a bit annoying
 * duflu gets interested having dove into libinput with Mir
<tjaalton> seb128: touchpad-edge-detector from libevdev-tools
<seb128> tjaalton, I need to install the -libinput driver and restart session?
<tjaalton> duflu: well, it should be somewhat better than with synaptics
<tjaalton> seb128: yup
<duflu> tjaalton: Smooth scrolling (real smooth scrolling using the touchpad coords) is a dream...
<duflu> Erm, wait. GTK already has that. It's only the web browsers to catch up
 * duflu rephrases that; real smooth scrolling in a web browser in Ubuntu would be excellent
<RAOF> -fuse-ld=gold, you're my only friend.
<RAOF> Why isn't that default yet? âº
<seb128> tjaalton, "Error: this device does not have abs axes"
<seb128> tjaalton, ?
<tjaalton> hmm, dunno about that
<seb128> that was the command you recommended using right?
<seb128> $ sudo touchpad-edge-detector /dev/input/event0
<tjaalton> event0 is the touchpad?
<tjaalton> bbl
<seb128> how do I know?
<seb128> ah
<seb128> it's not
<seb128> event7 according to Xorg log
<seb128> tjaalton, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-input-libinput/+bug/1526633
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1526633 in xserver-xorg-input-libinput (Ubuntu) "edge scrolling not working correctly on latitude e6410" [Undecided,New]
<tjaalton> seb128: right, thanks
<seb128> yw
<seb128> the values seem a bit random
<seb128> I wonder if that depends of the unit
<seb128> it seems a bit random to make udev rules from random laptops out there
<tjaalton> do the values change if you try it again?
<tjaalton> actually you should be able to run it from the console
<tjaalton> so doesn't need -libinput
<seb128> I really insisted over the edges this time
<seb128> Touchpad sends:	x [70..1862], y [106..1308] -^C
<seb128> but yeah, it changes a bit, another try insisting on the edges
<seb128> Touchpad sends:	x [87..1873], y [134..1308] -^C
<tjaalton> so it is a bit off
<tjaalton> I get the same as what kernel says
<tjaalton> on mine
<seb128> exactly the same?
<tjaalton> yes
<seb128> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> seb128, hello
<tjaalton> so I think rounding the values appropriately would probably make sense
<seb128> robert_ancell, how are you?
<robert_ancell> seb128, good
<tjaalton> seb128: add the touchpad dimensions there too
<tjaalton> in mm
<seb128> robert_ancell, what are you doing around that late? ;-)
<seb128> tjaalton, mesured with a ruler? ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, working on gnome-software..
<seb128> robert_ancell, how is that coming along?
<seb128> out of being blocked on packagekit 1
<robert_ancell> seb128, I've got enough working to start proposing the review support upstream: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=759527
<ubot5> Gnome bug 759527 in General "Add support for reviews" [Normal,New]
<seb128> robert_ancell, somebody mentioned that upstream wanted to drop support for stars/rating?!
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, Richard wants to now use them for GNOME / Fedora but they can still remain supported by plugins.
<robert_ancell> I think he doesn't think the current data is good enough. I hope he'll change his mind when he sees how it works in Ubuntu with our review server
<robert_ancell> Human reviews are always going to be better than any algorithm.
<robert_ancell> s/now/not
<seb128> k
<tjaalton> seb128: can't see another way :)
<seb128> tjaalton, I was trying to find the specs, it's a latitude that should be standard
<seb128> 38x66
<tjaalton> thx
<seb128> tjaalton, do you know what's different in the current stack that scrolling works fine?
<tjaalton> wider margins I guess
<seb128> do we already have hooks to make hardware work? if so could be translate those to the new system automatically?
<tjaalton> hardcoded in the synaptics driver or so
<tjaalton> only some jumpycursortresholds quirks
<didrocks> flocculant: hey! FYI, I just uploaded a plymouth fix for your missing themes on any flavors' live when booted up in a vm :)
<didrocks> so, starting from tomorrow, you should see your text splash screen :)
<flocculant> didrocks: if it builds ... it didn't yesterday, I think software-centre or something like that - but if it does I will be sure to check that and give you cookies :)
<didrocks> flocculant: thanks! :-)
<flocculant> didrocks: given the ubuntu one just failed to build - I would guess I'll be seeing the same
<didrocks> yeah, probably
<seb128> tjaalton, btw our libinput is not uptodate, is that wanted?
<Trevinho> Morning
<didrocks> hey Trevinho!
<Trevinho> hi didrocks
<didrocks> Trevinho: I have a start of a patch for you. Seems the guy was able to find his way through the code + updating the po himself
<didrocks> Trevinho: he didn't find how to get the key from compiz though, mind giving him a hint (not the finale solution), It's hardcoded for now
<seb128> hey Trevinho, how are you?
<Trevinho> didrocks: sorry for which bug?
<didrocks> Trevinho: https://code.launchpad.net/~mcintire-evan/unity/add_screenshot_shortcut_hints/+merge/280671 when you get some time (please ping me once done so that I can pounce back in the google code in interface)
<Trevinho> hi seb128, ok... you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<Trevinho> didrocks: ah, ok fine :-)
<tjaalton> seb128: uploaded a new one to debian last week but didn't merge yet. now there's another update
 * Trevinho has big network issues since last night...
<seb128> tjaalton, right
<Trevinho> nothing loads :-(
<didrocks> phew, back to green (still yellow of quite for latest release): https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/udtc-trusty-tests/2522/ !
<seb128> Trevinho, offline hacking is the best! :-)
<Laney> hhhhhhhhhhheyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
<seb128> hey Laney!
<seb128> how are you?
<seb128> smeeling the holidays getting close? ;-)
<Laney> seb128: we're going out for carol singing tonight :-)
<didrocks> morning Laney!
<Laney> so yes I am excited!
<Laney> hey didrocks!
<Laney> how are you both?
<didrocks> I'm good, thanks, going to run in 20 minutes before it's getting too warm :-)
<Laney> yeah this is STUPID
<Laney> I was walking around outside in just t-shirt and jeans yesterday
<seb128> Laney, doing good, almost over my cold
<didrocks> yeah, it's crazy weatherâ¦
<Laney> seb128: you ready for a holiday?
<seb128> not so much
<seb128> didn't decide what video games to buy for the holidays yet!
<Laney> hohoho
<seb128> I'm also pondering getting a ps4, my ps3 is overheating or something and freezing, which is become frustrating
<seb128> but yeah, otherwise I think I'm ready :-)
<seb128> some small items on my todolist things, moved the rest to next year
 * seb128 apt auto-remove a bunch of old unity scopes
<seb128> thanks didrocks, seems things worked well :-)
<didrocks> phew!
<didrocks> :)
<seb128> no larsu today?
<seb128> ah, I bet gym
<seb128> larsu, do you plan to get your screenshot patch into 3.18? benjamin seems to be mostly fine with it from review comment but I'm unsure if it's master only work?
<Laney> pumping iron
<larsu> pumping himself, more (not doing excercises on the machines)
<larsu> guten morgen!
<Laney> seb128: can we get that software-center branch reviewed if it's going to fix all the iso build failures? :)
<Laney> hey larsu!!!!
<Laney> what is up
<seb128> hey larsu!
<larsu> hey Laney and seb128
<larsu> not much. went to the gym :)
<Laney> LEGS DAY
 * larsu feels better than yesterday, but still has a bit of a runny nose
<Laney> okay I've said the two gym phrases that I know now
<seb128> Laney, I doubt mvo is going to have slots for that, I was going to ask dobey but unsure either ... do you feel like doing it? if not maybe didrocks can have a look when he's back from exercice, his python foo is good
<Laney> I just saw that you were asked to review
 * Laney probably doesn't know the most ever
<larsu> Laney: you know more than me ;)
<Laney> althought it looks straight forward
 * Laney looks then
<seb128> Laney, yeah, because I pointed out the issue on #ubuntu-devel yesterday ... I'm fine doing a review but my python is not the best, I don't know much about the future and stuff he decided to use
<Laney> those are "give me some python3 syntax on python 2"
<seb128> Laney, to me it looks like the apt-xapian-index changes from barry are abi incompatibles
<seb128> like updating that component shouldn't make other parts stop working
<seb128> it feels like a workaround that now software-center needs to start using futurs
<seb128> what about other rdepends?
<Laney> I would guess that he forgot about the plugin interface
<Laney> but in the archive only s-c uses that outside of a-x-i itself
<seb128> if that's true I guess it's ok
<seb128> mv
<seb128> no mvo
 * Laney test building
<Laney> failed to load file /var/lib/apt-xapian-index/cataloged_times.p: a bytes-like object is required, not 'str'
<Laney> qqqqqqqqquality
<Laney> maybe that is the minor unrelated bug
 * Laney upgrades
<Laney> seems to be
 * seb128 enables xenial-proposed
<Laney> brave
<seb128> yeah, just wanting the new compiz
<seb128> ok, I can remove gconf2 now, at the cost of evolution-indicator/pidgin/tomboy (not default)  libreoffice-gnome (going to be fixed with the next version) and aisleriot (it's ok)
<seb128> but gconf-service is still an issue :-/
<seb128> chromium nm-applet g-t
<seb128> session restart with new compiz anyway
<Laney> yay, neutralised that error
<seb128> Trevinho, could you review https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/unity-lens-files/use-gee-0.8/+merge/280696 or who is looking after lenses?
<seb128> Trevinho, also I would like to that with https://code.launchpad.net/~rtandy/unity-lens-files/bug1425714/+merge/251014 then
<seb128> should I do it or would you prefer doing it/including with some unity landing?
<seb128> Laney, thanks for handling the s-c issue
<Laney> np
<Laney> there's quite a few outstanding s-c merge proposals
<Laney> I guess we sort of gave up on the vcs hey
<seb128> no we didn't
<seb128> but dobey said he would change s-c to be CI landing compatible
<seb128> he's too busy for that apparently though...
<seb128> if that's not done he could perhaps at least push the approved/uploaded ones to trunk
<seb128> or add some of us to the team
<Laney> it's at ubuntu13 in the distro and there are plenty of proposed branches sitting there in various states
<didrocks> last time I did a review on software-center, I got flammed by dobey
<didrocks> so, not really willing to try again
<Laney> so something should change
<didrocks> (even if the change was pending for *months*)
<Laney> trainifying it sounds like a decent idea
<didrocks> yep
<seb128> didrocks, was a while ago I guess?
<seb128> dobey review/approved some 4-5 of my bugfixes branches before 15.10
<seb128> and he said he would CI trainify the project so we can land it easily
<seb128> I guess he just got too busy
<seb128> he would probably accept a branch that does it if somebody want to do the work
<didrocks> seb128: 2 months?
<seb128> k, weird, dunno what happened on that one
<seb128> as said I got a bunch of my fixes reviewed/approved
<didrocks> yeah, I got flammed when I approved them myself
<didrocks> as apparently "desktop team isn't upstream"
<didrocks> not the other way around :)
<seb128> fair enough
<seb128> well either there is an active upstream who merge our stuff
<didrocks> I can implement a fix if you need
<seb128> or we can become upstream ;-)
<didrocks> I thought you wanted me to review it? which is what I'm objecting :p
<didrocks> (due to this)
<seb128> didrocks, oh ok, sorry I should have unpinged, Laney did it
<didrocks> ah ok :)
<seb128> and he landed the change
<didrocks> good
<seb128> didrocks, thanks for following up though! (and good luck with plymouth)
<Laney> would be good if the approved things got merged though
<seb128> +1
<didrocks> seb128: thanks, should be fine :)
<seb128> but I think backlog already has enough ping to do_bey on the topic
<seb128> let's see what he says
<seb128> larsu, did you actually reply to my question from earlier?
<seb128> sorry if I missed the reply in the middle of the hey
<larsu> seb128: ooh benjamin replied
<larsu> ooh. a week aho
<larsu> *ago
<seb128> right...
<larsu> the patch doesn't apply to master becasue I made it for 3.18 (and he reverted the original on master)
<larsu> the original is still in 3.18
<larsu> I'll clean this up and push it
<seb128> k
<seb128> but the original was a behaviour change or something?
<seb128> and created the segfault?
<seb128> should we get the revert+new_version then?
<larsu> yes
<larsu> (to the first question)
<larsu> no to the second
<larsu> just get the new patch for 3.18 (or wait for a release)
<seb128> waiting for a release is fine if it's going to be handled in that branch in upstream gnome-3-18
<larsu> it will
<Trevinho> seb128: so... saw now your pings... Sorry. Let me check those
<seb128> larsu, danke
<seb128> Trevinho, no worry, thanks!
<larsu> seb128: the original change is already in 3.18 - so I have to fix that anyway
<seb128> right
<seb128> I was a bit lost
<seb128> thanks for the replies
<seb128> seems it's all good/being handled
<larsu> yes, I simply missed the reply
<seb128> k
<xnox> desrt, some people didn't know i was away; and other pretend that i am still away -> which is good, get asked for help less ;-)
<Trevinho> seb128: do you want me to land those on next round?
<alexarnaud> Hi everyone !
<seb128> Trevinho, that was my other question, I can do a landing now with that if you prefer, so it's out of the way before holidays
<seb128> hey alexarnaud
<seb128> Laney, didrocks, do you know/remember what is added gconf-service to misc:Depends and when?
<seb128> or shlibs?
<didrocks> dh_gconf maybe?
 * didrocks looks
<alexarnaud> I'm trying to integrate gsettings back-end on the hypra's company Debian blend. Can you give me more informations about the process ?
<Trevinho> seb128: ah, sure as you prefer.. I'd love to do a pre-xmas (but max in this week) landing as well, but I don't know whether it might be risky... As I won't be back till 12/01...
<seb128> didrocks, doesn't seem so, didn't find a reference to gconf-service in debhelper or dh* or gnome-pkg-tools
<alexarnaud> I've only ini beckend available. Did we forgotte something ?
<didrocks> seb128: and gconf2 isn't added?
<didrocks>                         addsubstvar($package, "misc:Depends", "gconf2 (>= 2.28.1-2)");
<seb128> didrocks, in fact "gconf-service" is added
<seb128> which I don't want
<seb128> (that's network-manager-applet)
<Laney> not off hand
<seb128> I'm tried to figure why/how
<Laney> try with DH_VERBOSE=1
<didrocks> was going to ask which package :)
<seb128> trying
<seb128> debian/network-manager-gnome.substvars:shlibs:Depends=gconf-service,
<seb128> wth
<seb128> gconf-service is an empty package
<seb128> how is it creating a shlibs
<seb128> or
<didrocks> interestingâ¦
<seb128> oh
<seb128> /var/lib/dpkg/info/libgconf-2-4:i386.shlibs:libgconf-2 4 libgconf-2-4 (>= 2.31.1), gconf-service
<seb128> didrocks, Laney, unping, thanks
<didrocks> ah, it's still linking to the lib though?
<seb128> I guess
<seb128> going to look at that next then ;-)
<seb128> lunch first though
<seb128> bbiab
<didrocks> enjoy seb128 :)
<seb128> thanks
<larsu> seb128: pushed
<Laney> â¥
<Trevinho> seb128: so... you do the landings or should I?
<seb128> Trevinho, as you want, just tell me
<Trevinho> seb128: I can do that, but I'd need some reviews to complete the unity landing, so waiting for andyrock. If I can get that by tomorrow I'll do the landing, otherwise feel free to go.
<andyrock> I'll do them by tomorrow :D
<seb128> Trevinho, I'm on holidays tonight, also unsure I want to lock it with an unity landing
<seb128> Trevinho, I'm going to land it now, easier, ok?
<seb128> hum
<seb128> Laney, do you do the rest of the evolution stack as well?
<seb128> (just asking, seems pointless than I do updates while you merge the same things)
<dobey> seb128: i thought we are dropping software-center in xenial for gnome-software?
<seb128> dobey,
<seb128> 1- we are trying, it's not done
<seb128> 2- nobody said software-center was going to be removed, it's likely going to stay in universe and still have some users
<seb128> 3- it would still be good to have those branches merged
<desrt> good morning everyone
<seb128> hey desrt
<didrocks> good morning desrt
<desrt> hello seb128, didrocks
<dobey> seb128: right. i just thought that plan would give a little more time to get the CI train landings enabled and such. i have a couple of critical bugs to fix for the next phone update this week, as i'm off until january after friday, and the ota9 freeze day is like the second day back in january. seems i am always fixing critical things. hopefully i can get this one done early and find a little time to poke at s-c
<seb128> dobey, ok, thanks for looking at it ... is there much needed to CI enable it?
<seb128> maybe we can contribute a patch?
<dobey> seb128: i'm not 100% sure how much work it will take to enable it for CI, as the recent announcement re: disbanding of ci team, such that we have to manage our own jenkins setups for MP testing
<dobey> so i will have to get some clarification on how much config there is for ci train, and get something set up for MP testing
<flocculant> didrocks: as I suspected - can't check today :) keeping cookies warm
<seb128> dobey, thanks
<didrocks> flocculant: as long as there are not dehydrated, I'm fine :)
<Trevinho> seb128: ah sure that's fine
<balloons> didrocks, just fyi I toggle off 'beginner task' on your GCI tasks. Students can only do 2 beginner tasks in total. I assume all of your tasks will take more than 1 hour to do and aren't intended as an 'intro' task which is what the flag is for
<didrocks> balloons: ah, I was thinking that some would still qualify as "beginners" ones. But there was no indication of what that was meaning (didn't know about the time spanning)
<didrocks> I assessed that 3 days of work -> ~1-2h (that's how I rated the time)
<balloons> didrocks, yea, I'm going through the list. Many people tagged there stuff as beginner, which would prevent students from working on it (presumably most have done the begineer tasks now)
<didrocks> interesting, didn't know about this limitation :)
<didrocks> 2 beginners tasks per studentâ¦
<balloons> yea. It's a bad name. For instance, I put a beginner task to install ubuntu. That's the idea of the scope
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> it's not really "contributing" though :)
<balloons> right.. it's intended to introduce you to ubuntu is all. That's how I understand the flag to mean. Hence the limit
<didrocks> balloons: oh btw, do you think the guy on https://codein.withgoogle.com/dashboard/task-instances/5153191301742592/ is trolling?
<balloons> so you can just do a bunch of intro tasks and get credit. Any 'real' work wouldn't be a beginner task
<balloons> *can't do
<balloons> didrocks, wild. I've not seen something like that yet
<didrocks> balloons: there is a start to everything :)
<balloons> and yea, thanks for letting us know. We'll take care of it
<didrocks> balloons: if he resubmit with the same document, I'll just unassign him
<didrocks> and ping you :Ã 
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> let's give the benefit of a doubt and we'll seeâ¦
<balloons> right. I'd just like to note he's done it on a task. We give one strike :-)
<didrocks> heh, yeah ;)
<seb128> desktopers, opinion on http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/nautilus.png vs http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/nautilusbis.png ?
<seb128> (it probably needs some design but I guess a bg is better than none meanwhile so going to include that while landing a theme fix)
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<didrocks> I prefer the #1
<didrocks> matching more
<didrocks> (even if less noticeable)
<Laney> grey one
<seb128> more subtle
<seb128> right
<Laney> and yes I was going to do evolution
<seb128> k
<Laney> didn't know someone started on it here before working on it
<seb128> Laney, I did this one this morning
<seb128> sorry
<Laney> np
<didrocks> so yeah, definitively the more subtle one :)
<seb128> ok, let's go with that, better than no bg
<seb128> we can design tweak about new year
<didrocks> yeah ;)
<Laney> seb128: can you remember the recent bug that e-d-s corrupted some settings or something?
<seb128> Laney, not from that description, sorry
<Laney> hmm
<seb128> was sort of settings?
<seb128> I remember discussing online accounts, gtk depends and calendars
<Laney> like account settings
<Laney> I think there was some unrecoverable problem that they fixed in a later update
<seb128> we had the password provider missing issue
<seb128> sorry I don't think I remember the one you are talking about :-/
<Laney> never mind
<Laney> was wondering if it could be https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=800496
<ubot5> Debian bug 800496 in evolution-ews "evolution-ews: Unable to store Host URI / OAB URI" [Grave,Open]
<seb128> didrocks, Laney, if you of you want to +1 https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-themes/basic-appnotification-theme/+merge/280735
<Laney> I know the effect is good, larsu would know better if the css is ;-)
<Laney> oh does it also look good in ambiance?
<seb128> Laney, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/laney.png
<didrocks> not shockingâ¦
<Laney> less padding?
<seb128> urg
<didrocks> true
<seb128> wait
<seb128> I think I didn't apply it :p
<Laney> heh
<didrocks> haha
<didrocks> and here is when is becomes horribly red after applying it :p
<Laney> I want it to be scrolling
<Laney> like <marquee>
<Laney> including the button
<didrocks> that's the step before asking for the <blink>
<seb128> refresh
<Laney> looks GREAT!
<seb128> :-)
<didrocks> yep ;)
<didrocks> thanks for fixing it seb128!
<seb128> yw!
<seb128> bah
<seb128> Trevinho, do you know what's wrong with https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-002/+sourcepub/5779409/+listing-archive-extra ?
<seb128> was unity-files-lens never landed through CI?
<seb128> I guess some tagging needed or something so the changelog generator knows what to consider
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, tagging was missing. Thus the train screw up
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> need a changelog with * Automatic snapshot from revision <rrrr> (bootstrap) ?
<Trevinho> we can just tag lp:unity-files-lens with proper revision
<didrocks> it used to have 3 ways for bootstrap:
<didrocks> - proper tagging revision
<didrocks> - the changelog that seb marked
<didrocks> - the 3rd fallback is the latest change in debian/changelog with the line matching latest version in distro
<seb128> Trevinho, can you do that if you know what tag to use?
<didrocks> (which should match everything)
<Trevinho> seb128: it's just the last revision number you want
<didrocks> but maybe that changed
<Trevinho> seb128: I can btw...
<seb128> Trevinho, I don't understand
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DailyRelease/InlinePackaging recommends the changelog thing
<seb128> I might just do that
<Trevinho> seb128: basically you need to add a tag that matches the revision released to the archive
<didrocks> seb128: that's quite old, I would recommend tagging
<didrocks> (the changelog is a fallback)
<didrocks> which wasn't the case in the daily release day :)
<seb128> just bzr tag 7.1.0+13.10.20130920-0ubuntu1
<seb128> and push?
<Trevinho> seb128: let me check
<Trevinho> seb128: ok, i've pushed the tag
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> bzr push --tags
 * Trevinho done that
<Trevinho> didrocks: --tags is for git ;)
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> so rebuild in the train now?
<didrocks> same all, same all :)
<Trevinho> yeah, let's see :)
<Trevinho> it worked to me the past time
<didrocks> rebuild should regenerate the changelog
<seb128> started
<seb128> let's see
<seb128> didrocks, Trevinho, thanks
<larsu> seb128, Laney: it is!
<seb128> larsu, thanks
<seb128> Trevinho, didrocks, https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-002/+sourcepub/5779432/+listing-archive-extra
<seb128> Trevinho, didrocks, worked ;-)
<didrocks> great! :)
<Trevinho> :)
<Trevinho> sil2100's tricks work :)
<sil2100> I'm innocent!
<Trevinho> ^_^
<davmor2> don't believe sil2100 he is so guilty he has forgotten what innocent looks like ;)
<sil2100> That is sooo not true
<sil2100> ;)
<davmor2> sil2100: okay what does innocent look like then :P
<seb128> Trevinho, andyrock, btw unity keeps eating CPU for me after going to great/login back into the session, on xenial, I opened https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1526868 with a bt of the thread stucked in pam code, unsure how useful the bt is
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1526868 in unity (Ubuntu) "Unity eats cpu after switch to greeter/back to session" [High,New]
<Trevinho> seb128: mh, ok... andyrock might study that I guess :)
<seb128> how do you tell what thread is using the cpu again?
<didrocks> ok, I think it's time to EOD!
<didrocks> enjoy your holidays Laney & seb128 :)
<didrocks> happy new year!
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<seb128> didrocks, have a good evening, good luck for the week before your holidays, and enjoy the time off then!
<didrocks> seb128: thanks a lot, you too! Do not work too late tonight :)
<Laney> bye didrocks!
<seb128> don't worry
<Laney> happy holidays!
<seb128> I'm mostly done with my todolist
<Laney> break EVERYTHING
<didrocks> Laney: don't spam us too much on telegram with photos! :)
 * didrocks notes down
<seb128> doing inbox 0 and some small cleanings before holidays
<Laney> we need work to do :P
<seb128> haha
<didrocks> let's upload $something tomorrow :)
<didrocks> seb128: good luck! :)
<seb128> yeah, let's upload buggy things and run off letting those to fix for others :p
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> I'm going to start spamming tonight
<Laney> at the carol singing
<didrocks> pffff :p
<didrocks> see you next year guys! ;)
<davmor2> Laney: Good king wenless last looked out on never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down
<seb128> haha
<seb128> Laney, btw probably a post holidays topic, but you think yesterday than the gnome-contacts drop was maybe a good thing ... I don't think I agree, having somewhere to store contact info (out of a text file made with gedit) looks like something useful on desktop to me
<seb128> darkxst, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus-share/+bug/1526894 if you could look at it, thanks
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1526894 in nautilus-share (Ubuntu) "Should clean < xenial conffile on upgrade" [Low,New]
<seb128> ups
<seb128> is gnome-user-share, I reassigned
<Laney> seb128: Feels niche to have that on a desktop these days but you can always put it back if you want
<seb128> yeah, maybe
<Laney> I don't feel strongly enough to argue against it
<Laney> could also be that it's just me who doesn't use it and many other people do
<seb128> yeah, I don't know either
<seb128> like often in those cases having actual numbers would be useful
<seb128> but we don't have them so need to do without...
<seb128> brb session restart
<seb128> larsu, hey again, I guess the nautilus menubar thing is not going to be ready today?
<larsu> seb128: depends on when you consider today to be over and if I go to the open source meetup thing
<seb128> larsu, seems not, I'm probably going to call it a day/start holiday in 10 minutes or so
<seb128> larsu, don't worry, that's for next year then
<larsu> seb128: in 10 minutes definitely not ;)
<larsu> enjoy!
<larsu> (and sorry)
<seb128> larsu, maybe try to get it lined up before your holidays so we can get it in when coming back without having to resume context and delay more
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> enjoy the opensource meeting!
<larsu> makes sense
<seb128> ok, on that note calling it a day/week/year
<seb128> have a good extra days work for those not on vac yet
<seb128> then have good holidays everyone!
<seb128> see you next year!
<qengho> You too, seb.
<Laney> bye seb128!
<attente> bye seb128!
<Laney> send me a picture of you in a santa hat
<seb128> hohoho
 * Laney speed builds evo
<Laney> come on, got to leave!
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: have fun!
<seb128> today is day for sending pictures of yourself as jedi though
<seb128> not as santa ;-)
 * Sweet5hark1 is going to the SW sneak preview tonightt ;)
<seb128> Laney, don't miss the carols!
<Laney> no chance
<Laney> putting my socks on now
<Sweet5hark1> dammit snap build broke again
<Trevinho> I'm going against this Star Wars night tonight... And going to watch a comedy movie instead... :-D
<Trevinho> Star was can wait...
<Laney> I've never seen any of that series
<Laney> so THERE
<Trevinho> I've just seen a couple... But still, here's everybody is crazy since it's released in Italy before than everywhere else
<Trevinho> (weirdly)
<Laney> RIGHT BYEEEEEEEEEE HAPPY CHRISTMASSSSSSSSSSSS
<Laney> probably will pop online though :P
 * Laney is a #ubuntu-desktop addict
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-12-17
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<flocculant> morning pitti didrocks
<pitti> bonjour didrocks et flocculant !
<didrocks> good morning flocculant, pitti!
<flocculant> not sure about good - it's certainly early - woke up at 4 couldn't get back to sleep ...
<didrocks> urgh
 * didrocks is really annoyed by xnox's pkgconfig merge with debian for his tests :)
<didrocks> (finally got the time to have a look at this issue that only happened on "desktop", where pkg-config is installed
<didrocks> not like my builders or autopkgtests setup :p
<Trevinho> Good morning!
<didrocks> hey Trevinho, how are you?
<pitti> didrocks: oh, something broken there? the merge happened a month ago already
<Trevinho> didrocks: I can say quite well, finally.
<Trevinho> didrocks: you?
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, the issue is that when you install pkg-config, you have a dpkg hook installed now
<didrocks> pitti: and this hook doesn't work well when you use dpkg --root
<didrocks> I'm unsure if dpkg --root shouldn't look at the hooks config in the usual dirs
<didrocks> or if the hook should be fixed to not mixed with real installation when --root is used
<didrocks> Trevinho: I'm good thanks!
<pitti> didrocks: interesting, I wasn't aware of this mechanism even
<didrocks> pitti: it's passing in builders and autopkgtests because I don't install pkg-config here, so I don't have the guilty hook
<didrocks> yeah, I'm doing funky stuff to test adding an architecture and such in my tests :)
<didrocks> and the hook hardcode the path, so I can't even just "discare it"
<pitti> didrocks: could you just remove the hook for the tests?
<pitti> if you don't care about cross-building
<didrocks> pitti: how come? It's on the system itself in /etc/dpkgâ¦
<didrocks> pitti: so it means running those tests are root
<didrocks> (and so, running those as root on my machineâ¦ :/)
<pitti> didrocks: oh, I thought it breaks your tests
<didrocks> it does
<pitti> didrocks: ah, for that; so at least you want something nondestructive like sudo mount -o bind /dev/null /usr/share/pkg-config-dpkghook
<didrocks> I can't run small tests locally on my machine itself now
<pitti> which will make the test -x fail
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, but this will require root as well, no?
<pitti> didrocks: yes, it does
<pitti> didrocks: oh, you call dpkg as user in a temp dir?
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> (with fakeroot to install package)
<didrocks> and --root=<path>
<didrocks> local repo, everything locally brewed :)
<pitti> didrocks: so why doesn't that take the dpkg config files from that fakeroot as well?
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, I think that's the dpkg bug, it should IMHO
<pitti> didrocks: you mean fakechroot bug?
<didrocks> no
<pitti> oh, fakeroot, not fakechroot
<didrocks> fakeroot only
<didrocks> I'm still using system dpkg and such
<didrocks> just faking hiding dpkg with "dpkg --rootâ¦"
<didrocks> s/faking//
<didrocks> pitti: basically: https://github.com/ubuntu/ubuntu-make/blob/master/tests/small/test_requirements_handler.py#L59
<didrocks> maybe there is a DPkg::<something> directive
 * didrocks looks
<didrocks> argh, it's a linked list when added
<didrocks>   /* Add the new hook at the tail of the list to preserve the order. */
<didrocks>   **hook_tail = hook_new;
<didrocks>   *hook_tail = &hook_new->next;
<Trevinho> didrocks: with new unity/launcher integration, we've a dbus dependency with nautilus (not that without it it wont' work, but still)... I was wondering whether. So should I add it to reccomends?
<didrocks> pitti: filed a new upstream dpkg bug FYI
<didrocks> Trevinho: what happens if nautilus isn't installed?
<Trevinho> didrocks: well, launcher icons (the trash and devices one) won't be illuminated, or wont' control any window. They should work as they used to work before
<Trevinho> didrocks: so only as a shortcut to open stuff
<didrocks> Trevinho: ok, recommends sounds right then
<didrocks> Trevinho: btw, not sure if you noticed, be the student updated his patch: https://code.launchpad.net/~mcintire-evan/unity/add_screenshot_shortcut_hints/+merge/280671
<didrocks> Trevinho: I'm not sure we have any category matching well where to put this, but I guess, we don't want to expand with another one (and fighting with nux layouting ;))
<Trevinho> yeah, I agree
<Trevinho> also there's the thing that adding too many stuff might pretend the view to be shown in low resolutions (by low also <= 1366x768)
<didrocks> Trevinho: yeah, so I guess where he added it is fine
<didrocks> Trevinho: mind reviewing it once more? Will be nice to have it merged before EOW if possible :)
<Trevinho> didrocks: yeah, I'd love to do an unity landing before xmas, but not sure it's sane. As I won't be back till 12nd...
<larsu> good morning!
<Trevinho> didrocks: and well, you might revert in case, but...
<didrocks> Trevinho: well, I can consider the "approval" to be +1 for his code in task
<didrocks> Trevinho: so, just approve if you feel so, already :)
<didrocks> hey larsu
<Trevinho> (old Trevinho would have merged it any day, but he's getting more responsible :PO)
<larsu> hi didrocks!
<didrocks> Trevinho: just review it, if it's good, tell me and I can close the task :)
<Trevinho> didrocks: sure, I was in the meeting with kylin before... I'll do that shortly
<didrocks> thx
<didrocks> hum, one test become racy (only on xenial), seeing the diff, apt 1.1.5 sounds like a good guilty guy
<didrocks> mvo: hey, is that expected with new apt that I can (not always), having multiple times the same status reported by the apt binding?
<didrocks> mvo: this doesn't happen 100% of the time (with the same test), but if you look at https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-xenial/xenial/i386/u/ubuntu-make/20151217_075907@/log.gz, I'm installing one package, one bit, I get twice:
<didrocks> 2015-12-17 07:58:38,914 [umake.network.requirements_handler] DEBUG: ['testpackage'] download update: 0.0% of 1
<didrocks> 2015-12-17 07:58:38,924 [umake.network.requirements_handler] DEBUG: ['testpackage'] download update: 0.0% of 1
<didrocks> (I would expect to have progress triggers only if the percentage changes, even slightly)
 * didrocks changed his test to be more resilient against this
<mvo> didrocks: the way this works internally is that it call the progress callback periodically so that you don't need your own mainloop (if you set the timeout low enough). this has the side-effect that it will also report non-changes just so that you can refresh your ui
<didrocks> mvo: ok, do you confirm that wasn't the case before or I just good lucky over the past 2 years?
<didrocks> mvo: changing the tests to take that into account is quite easy for me, just wanted to know if I wasn't dreaming :)
<xnox> didrocks, ? =)
<didrocks> xnox: see my discussion with pitti about the dpkg trigger and --root suport
<flocculant> didrocks can have 1 cookie, (I'll keep the one for 32 bit warm still, that failed to build) - thanks for fixing that :)
<didrocks> flocculant: yw! happy to have found it :)
<didrocks> flocculant: bonus: the initramfs is smaller than before the plymouth merge :)
<flocculant> :)
<xnox> didrocks, i keep wondering to make the 2x plymouth theme the default.
<xnox> not because there are more high-dpi screens than normal, but because both are usable with 2x theme.
<cyphermox> xnox: is the current plymouth theme unusable on high-dpi?
<cyphermox> I mean, I would agree it likely is quite small, but still
<ricotz> hi, could someone sponsor automake-1.15 merge -- https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/ubuntu/staging/+sourcepub/5781864/+listing-archive-extra
<cyphermox> (I have no idea how it looks on high-dpi mind you)
<didrocks> xnox: I don't know if there is any info from the script exported for this
<didrocks> xnox: part of the issue is that the script will really need a complete rewrite, there is a lot of dead code in the ubuntu logo one
<xnox> cyphermox, not usable at all. hence a while back i added a "2x" theme too, which one can manually opt into using update-alternatives.
<xnox> didrocks, there are two scripts/themes packaged - 1x and 2x.
<xnox> didrocks, is there any api to query screen dpi/scale factor these days as root? e.g. I could query gsettings or somesuch in postinst and automatically opt into 2x theme....
<didrocks> xnox: no api AFAIK, (that's why we have the scale thingy in Unity)
<didrocks> but query user's info gsettings key (user info) in postinst (root)
<didrocks> hemâ¦ ;)
<cyphermox> xnox: guess from xdpyinfo?
<cyphermox> wait nvm, same issue
<desrt> good morning, peeps
 * ogra_ wonders in that light if leaning back and watching IRC scroll by then counts as peepshow
<didrocks> good morning desrt
<desrt> didrocks: what are you up to today?
<didrocks> desrt: working on moving from jenkins to autopkgtests for ubuntu make tests
<didrocks> as the jenkins infra is going down
<didrocks> what about you?
<desrt> doing my dance back and forth between dconf and glib.  did the dconf release yesterday, so back to glib today to add some new APIs that i can use from the next dconf release :)
<didrocks> handy!
<desrt> kinda ugly, in fact
<desrt> i'm really increasing the coupling of dconf and glib here
<desrt> oh well
<desrt> in a way the coupling was already there insofar as all GSettingsBackend implementations are expected to be dconf-like
<desrt> which is more complicated than it sounds
<desrt> so i just got an email from asustor's RT-equivalent
<desrt> i filed a ticket about missing files in their GPL package
<desrt> i got zero reply from anyone
<desrt> and now the system is telling me the ticket is being automatically closed due to inactivity
<desrt> suggestions?
<desrt> i'd prefer to avoid hiring a lawyer
<bzoltan_> Mirv:  is there a known problem with the CI infra?
<didrocks> Trevinho: the MP was updated
<didrocks> oh you approved \o/
<didrocks> rocking
<Trevinho> didrocks: yeah :)
<didrocks> pitti: probably a stupid question, but I don't find any answer on http://packaging.ubuntu.com/html/auto-pkg-test.html or https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ProposedMigration/AutopkgtestInfrastructure. What's the directory where I should push artefacts to be saved in swift? (or even with a local adt-run, if they can be stored outside the vmâ¦)
<pitti> didrocks: that's in https://people.debian.org/~mpitt/autopkgtest/README.package-tests.html aka /usr/share/doc/autopkgtest/README.package-tests.*
<pitti> didrocks: put them into  $ADT_ARTIFACTS/
<didrocks> pitti: ah, excellent, thanks for the pointer :)
<didrocks> ok!
<didrocks> pitti: good news: docker tests run inside the vm without any trickery contrary to jenkins!
<pitti> didrocks: with --output-dir=X they will appear in X/artifacts/
<pitti> didrocks: nice! with trickery you mean the ssh -tt?
<didrocks> yep!
<pitti> didrocks: ah, same issue that we had back then
<didrocks> indeed :)
<didrocks> pitti: the only issue I have is that the testbed is set to something in /tmp (and I have a tmpfs limited to 2G here)
<didrocks> so large tests don't run, need to find a way to tell "use the disk, son" ;)
<pitti> didrocks: with VM?
<pitti>  -o OVERLAY_DIR, --overlay-dir OVERLAY_DIR
<pitti>                         Temporary overlay directory (default: in /tmp)
<pitti> didrocks: ^ you want that then? perhaps /var/tmp/
<pitti> didrocks: 2GB! you only have 4 GB?
<didrocks> pitti: I have 8GB, but I like having enough for the browser and such
<pitti> ah
<didrocks> used 4.5GB here
<pitti> didrocks: anyway, so adt-run [...] --- qemu -o /var/tmp/ yourimage.img
<didrocks> pitti: excellent, thanks a bunch! :)
<didrocks> pitti: I guess I'll be able to do everything is needed on my side. I guess the last things we will check is what's available through the proxy and if sourcing /etc/environment really works for docker
<didrocks> (but that can wait January)
<pitti> didrocks: right, but that shouldn't be an issue as long as you run tests locally?
<didrocks> yep!
<didrocks> at least, I'll have a reproduceable local system :)
<pitti> Laney: yay prodstack troubles again (IS  knows)
<pitti> Laney: I can't ssh into stuff, and all workers died
<didrocks> hopefully, Laney is on holidays and won't see that :)
<flocculant> I'll screenshot it for him
<didrocks> poor Laney :p
 * desrt observes the start of the eoy slowdown
 * didrocks doesn't feel any slowdown with google code in :p
<didrocks> pitti: the testbed isn't kept between tests? It would mean I need to put all tests in the same scripts (as I think we don't want to install ubuntu-desktop 4 times ;))
<pitti> didrocks: depends
<pitti> didrocks: the test bed is reset if
<pitti>  - the current test declares "breaks-testbed", or
<pitti> - the current test has Depends: which the next test does not have
<didrocks> ahhhh
<pitti> didrocks: and yeah, you really want to pre-prepare an image with u-desktop for taht
<didrocks> so I need to keep the same Depends list
<pitti> didrocks: same, or only add to it
<didrocks> ok, let me try this
<pitti> didrocks: but I suppose you'll run this more than once
<didrocks> yeah :)
<pitti> didrocks: so, cp the VM, start it, install u-desktop, and save that
<didrocks> pitti: I have the desktop one, but I'm doing a little bit more in setup that just installing u-desktop
<didrocks> I was using that just as an example
<pitti> didrocks: well, sure -- if it's "cheap" setup that doesn't hurt, but installing u-desktop on a minimal cloud image sucks
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, we discussed that, and agreed, we'll need to do something about it :)
<didrocks> but let's try to get something ready first
<pitti> didrocks: once we run that in production I can work on building desktop-ish images, this is just for not making you weep too much when running locally :)
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, I'm already doing that with pleasure when I see that apt install -y ubuntu-desktop is just upgrading ubuntu-desktop package :p
<didrocks> time to go, see you tomorrow guys!
<alexarnaud> Good evening everyone !
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-12-18
<hikiko> Hello
<pitti> Good monring
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks !
<didrocks> hey pitti, Ã§a va ?
<pitti> didrocks: Ã§a va bien, merci ! et toi ?
<didrocks> Ã§a va, merci !
<alexarnaud> bonjour didrocks et pitti
<alexarnaud> quelqu'un s'y connait en packing compiz ?
<didrocks> alexarnaud: yeah, a little (I did package it for years ;))
<pitti> bonjour alexarnaud
<alexarnaud> didrocks: do you want to spek in english or in PM ?
<didrocks> alexarnaud: I'm fine with both, whatever you prefer ;)
<alexarnaud> didrocks: I'm trying to have access to GSettings on my Debian package but nothing work. Which part of the Ubuntu package or configuration should I get for this ?
<didrocks> you mean, accessing the gsettings schema/key for building profiles?
<alexarnaud> didrocks: for the package, see http://debian.hypra.fr/debian/import_key
<alexarnaud> didrocks: yes
<alexarnaud> I thing we have fail in the packaging or in compiz version maybe. I don't what part or what element I need to check to active GSettings in Compiz.
<didrocks> so, to build the gsettings profiles, you need to:
<didrocks> use -DUSE_GSETTINGS=ON
<didrocks> (look at our source package in debian/rules
<didrocks> -DCOMPIZ_DISABLE_GS_SCHEMAS_INSTALL=OFF
<didrocks> at least, with those, the base gsettings schema will be generated
<alexarnaud> what "COMPIZ_DISABLE_GS_SCHEMAS_INSTALL=OFF" mean ?
<didrocks> to install in "make install" the gsettings schemas files
<didrocks> (yeah double negation in the settings! :p)
<didrocks> you just change your debian/rules to use both cmake flags
<alexarnaud> OK didrocks, thanks you very much. Will you hear this afternoon ? I will applies your advises the afternoon.
<didrocks> alexarnaud: I should be, yeah :)
<alexarnaud> didrocks: OK, thanks very much
<didrocks> yw!
<alexarnaud> didrocks: if you would like another day we could discuess accessibility issue in Compiz. May you could help to find which people treats accessibility subject at Canonical.
<alexarnaud> didrocks: I work at hypra.fr, we choose Mate and Compiz to deliver accessible desktop to visual impaired and blind people
<didrocks> alexarnaud: there are no more upstream real upstream per say, but you can still talk to hikiko and TheMuso I guess about this
<didrocks> alexarnaud: however, we'll accept contributions I guess for those and can merge in trunk :)
<didrocks> ah, you work with Access42 :)
<alexarnaud> didrocks: no really, it just creats the initial web site.
<alexarnaud> but we know lot of people in the french #a11y community
<alexarnaud> didrocks: if you want you can join the Debian group to help us to make compiz in Debian
<didrocks> yeah, I see you were at debconf as well and I think you know kinouchou and such ;)
<didrocks> alexarnaud: I tried to push it some years ago, there seems to have no real interest and TBH, I'm not maintaining compiz anymore, so not sure I'll be a good bet in the long term for this :)
<alexarnaud> didrocks: yes, kinou give me you nick few years ago for talking Compiz and Unity a11y
<alexarnaud> didrocks: wait a moment I will give you the links
<didrocks> (and then, pitti thinks again "all those french guys know each other" ;))
<alexarnaud> didrocks: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=722451
<ubot5> Debian bug 722451 in wnpp "ITP: compiz -- Compositing "3D" window manager" [Wishlist,Open]
<pitti> bien sÃ»r ! France, c'est trÃ¨s petite, il n'y a pas beaucoup de personnes :)
<didrocks> pitti: ahah, Ã©videmment ! :)
<alexarnaud> pitti: tout a fait :)
<didrocks> alexarnaud: yeah, just a note ubuntu packaging == upstream ones (I'm the one who pushed it)
<didrocks> if there are changes we can do to vendorize it and add some "if debian" in rules or such, I think we can merge that
<didrocks> so that we don't split the packaging effort, it's then easier to maintain
<didrocks> alexarnaud: I guess the only thing we don't want to go back is to split compiz is gazillion of sources
<alexarnaud> didrocks: https://alioth.debian.org/projects/compiz/
<didrocks> back at the the time, there were 8 sources for compiz
<didrocks> which needed to be built in the correct order
<didrocks> knowing that compiz never had a stable ABI
<didrocks> and so, this was just a PITA for each release :)
<didrocks> so, I think you should try to merge with our packaging, and see where the differences are needed
<didrocks> that way, you will have the gsettings backend and such without any additional effort :)
<didrocks> apart from some patches, there is nothing ubuntu-specific in it
<alexarnaud> didrocks: gsettings are available by default in Ubuntu ?
<didrocks> (and we can vendorize those)
<didrocks> alexarnaud: sure, for at least 2 years
<didrocks> that's why I really think you shouldn't duplicate the work and start from our work
<alexarnaud> OK
<didrocks> we also build a special gles version for capable machinesâ¦
<alexarnaud> didrocks: gles ?
<didrocks> opengles
<alexarnaud> Oh, OK
<didrocks> we have some mate (for ubuntu mate) default profile as well
<alexarnaud> I'm totally aware of some part of Compiz technologies. I need to lear more and more.
<didrocks> with the packaging, adding a profile is just a question of dropping the right .ini file
<alexarnaud> didrocks: alose for gsettings ? ini file are automatically converted to gsettings at initialisation ?
<didrocks> alexarnaud: exactly!
<alexarnaud> didrocks: good !
<didrocks> not initialization, build time though
<didrocks> but users won't care about that detail :)
<alexarnaud> what's about /etc/compizconfig/config ? If we change settings.
<didrocks> this is just for people using the ini backend
<didrocks> which is untested for quite a while, I wouldn't recommend using it
<didrocks> (and only people fiddling in ccsm may use it)
<didrocks> oh also, we dropped the gconf backend recently FYI
<didrocks> (we didn't use it for a while, but it will still around. However, there is no reason at all to use it nowdays)
<ricotz> didrocks, hi, could you sponsor a automake-1.15 merge?
<didrocks> ricotz: hey! if it's a 5 minutes review, yeah, otherwise, I would prefer if we can get the traditional patch pilot doing it
<ricotz> didrocks, https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/ubuntu/staging/+sourcepub/5781864/+listing-archive-extra
<didrocks> ricotz: uploaded
<ricotz> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yw ;)
<ricotz> didrocks, on that thought autoconf-archive is quite outdated and could use an update too ;)
<didrocks> seems you just candidated yourself to it :)
<ricotz> it is in the same ppa, but it should be updated in debian
<didrocks> let's wait in debian then, and maybe try to poke the patch pilot?
<didrocks> people should really do their shifts, anyone it's always the same set of 6-8 people doing all reviews
<didrocks> ricotz: for all those build tools, you can poke doko
<larsu> morning!
<didrocks> hey larsu!
<ricotz> didrocks, I see, hard to actually reach him though ;)
<larsu> hi didrocks, what's up?
 * larsu has to leave again in a bit - doctor's appointment
<didrocks> ricotz: he should be in european time, maybe try to ping steve at the same time :p
<didrocks> larsu: everything's fine. You? are you ill? :/
<ricotz> didrocks, alright, thanks
<larsu> didrocks: no it's good :)
<larsu> didrocks: thanks
 * ricotz thinks this sudden perl transition is be quite a holiday gift :\
<didrocks> ricotz: isn't it? :/
<ricotz> I am hoping the archive reaches a normal state before everyone is leaving ;)
<pitti> haha, that was a good one
<didrocks> ricotz: a couple of tests failed: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/230427459/buildlog_ubuntu-xenial-amd64.automake-1.15_1%3A1.15-3ubuntu1_BUILDING.txt.gz
<ricotz> didrocks, hmm :\, perl 5.22? the ppa build was before the new perl hit the archive
<didrocks> can be
<cyphermox> ricotz: hey, are you still interested in updating NM?
<ricotz> cyphermox, hi, are you sure you mean me?
<cyphermox> I thought so, maybe not
<ricotz> could be I touched it some years ago
<cyphermox> no, someone asked me not that long ago
<cyphermox> ignore me, I'm sick and not sleeping.
<ricotz> that wasn't me then ;)
<cyphermox> ;)
<ricotz> didrocks, I would say, wait for the transition to finish and retry the build
<didrocks> ricotz: if you think it's perl related, let's seeâ¦
<didrocks> ricotz: just remind me of retrying please
<willcooke> morning all
<ricotz> didrocks, the ppa build succeeded fine (also against -proposed at this time), simply retying it now might even work too
<didrocks> ricotz: ok, let's see
<didrocks> willcooke: !!!
<didrocks> willcooke: feeling better?
<willcooke> didrocks, yeah, mostly.
<willcooke> must have been something from child #1 school going round.
<didrocks> willcooke: urgh :/
<Trevinho> Morning!
<Trevinho> willcooke: nice to read you're better!
<willcooke> hey Trevinho, thanks
<willcooke> still a bit "drained" ;)
<didrocks> hey Trevinho :)
<Trevinho> Hi didrocks
<Sweet5hark> willcooke: morning!
 * Sweet5hark opens a wormhole to communicate out of vacation.
<willcooke> hey Sweet5hark
<didrocks> hey Sweet5hark
<tjaalton> I changed my session language, but nautilus in xenial doesn't change the links (on left-side pane) and now they're broken. where to fix that?
 * Sweet5hark waves through the wormhole to didrocks. ;)
<didrocks> tjaalton: IIRC, it's using ~/.config/user-dir*.
<didrocks> tjaalton: you probably need to kill nautilus as well
<tjaalton> didrocks: those are fine, they got created after logging back in
<tjaalton> the localized versions that is. left-side pane links are still in en(us)
<willcooke> davmor2, still around?
<davmor2> I am
<willcooke> davmor2, do you remember if the 3g modem thing ever got fixed?  I'm still seeing issues.  The modem is "online" now, which it wasn't before, but I can't seem to connect
<willcooke> still working out whats going on
<willcooke> from what I can remember, the old problem was usb modeswitch seg faulting
<willcooke> and I /think/ that is indeed fixed
<davmor2> willcooke: so iirc the old issue was that the version of usb modeswitch died and left you in the usb data mode rather than modem mode, if that were the issue still you wouldn't see it to connect to
<willcooke> ah, maybe that is it then
<willcooke> I'll try it from the cli
<davmor2> willcooke: do you have modem manager installed or have you removed it to flash the phone at any point
<willcooke> davmor2, this is my test machine, so totally standard
<willcooke> davmor2, a USB modeswitch from the cli makes it appear and work
<davmor2> willcooke: right just double
<davmor2> checking
<davmor2> willcooke: right so sound like possibly one for cyphermox who fixed it last time
<davmor2> willcooke: it might be that the fix got dropped by the new imports
<davmor2> willcooke: but I thought that the fix came from upstream and was applied
<willcooke> yeah, I think the fix was for a seg fault
<willcooke> this /seems/ to now be that it didnt do the modeswitch
<willcooke> humm
<willcooke> idea...
<willcooke> maybe it had mounted it as a usb drive
<willcooke> and needed ejecting
<willcooke> but that it wasnt in the laucher
<willcooke> so I didnt try that
<davmor2> willcooke: should switch automatically
<willcooke> let's see....
<willcooke> I'll just finishing setting up the APN and see what happens when I reboot
<didrocks> pitti: ok, all large tests are passing but one (on the ~400 tests in total)
<didrocks> pitti: I don't know why when I'm extracting Unity3D, at some point, it's stopping and don't finish up. I'll need to add some debug, I guess it doesn't detect properly the end of the file or suchâ¦
<didrocks> but well, getting close :)
<didrocks> ok, extract_all in tarfile is doing something weird on this FS inside qemu
 * didrocks removes exception handler to fetch more info
<pitti> didrocks: you mean on package installation, or doesn't it start?
<pitti> didrocks: for starting and 3D we might need some extra measures such as configuring the dummy driver
<didrocks> pitti: package installation
<didrocks> I don't yet if it's failing or not :p
<didrocks> (to start)
<desrt> word up.
<willcooke> hey desrt
<didrocks> morning desrt
<desrt> hello willcooke and didrocks
<desrt> willcooke: happy to see you back :)
<willcooke> davmor2, hrm - seems to be working now.  Ignore :L)
<willcooke> :)
<pitti> hey desrt!
<desrt> belated hello, pitti :)
<qengho> ayan: hi
 * davmor2 forgets that willcooke ever said anything
<didrocks> pitti: btw, the issue with the end of file was the unity server which served invalid files for a couple of hours
<ayan> qengho: hihi!
<pitti> c'est Ã§a, mes amis -- je commence mes vacances :)
<pitti> I wish you all some nice holidays!
<willcooke> cya pitti, happy Crimbo
<willcooke> right, Christmas starts here.... good night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-12-20
<Mirv> if anyone has possibility to test this, I believe it'd be good to have for 14.04.4 since all new Windows computers are shipping with Win 10: https://code.launchpad.net/~timo-jyrinki/os-prober/trusty_add_win10_to_the_list/+merge/281040
<Mirv> if I understand correctly it's also a reason why "install side-by-side" option is not offered when installing Ubuntu, but that also would need testing
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-12-19
<flexiondotorg> Morning desktopers. Just me?
<davmor2> Morning all
<davmor2> man nothing but meetings so far this morning
<davmor2> flexiondotorg: you are not alone \o/
<flexiondotorg> davmor2, Hello
<davmor2> flexiondotorg: man that is a big echo
<flocculant> 'cho 'cho 'cho
<tkamppeter> xnox, hi
<ximion> Laney: hi! regarding the AppStream "your data is wrong" issue, I hope I can resolve the autopkgtest issues today and make the package ready for x-updates
<ximion> the AS test failure is harmless (and I should have fixed it right away...), the Isenkram issue is weird, doesn't even seem related - could be triggered due to AS now exposing more metadata
<ximion> in any case, I'll look into that
<xnox> tkamppeter, yes?
<tkamppeter> I want to ask you whether you could help on bug 1642966.
<ubot5`> bug 1642966 in systemd (Ubuntu) "package cups-daemon 2.1.3-4 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess new pre-removal script returned error exit status 1" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1642966
<tkamppeter> Have a look especially at comment #49.
<tkamppeter> It looks for me that something was changed recently having the debhelper not shutting down the cups.path unit file any more during shutdown, making CUPS being triggered right after the shutdown of the main unit and so the shutdown break.
<tkamppeter> Looks like a problem in the debhelpers for systemd.
<tkamppeter> xnox ^^
<xnox> tkamppeter, bug report from mark.... horum.
<tkamppeter> xnox, tons of duplicates, sabdfl is only one of the people hitting this bug.
<xnox> tkamppeter, something is very wrong. Still reading. My current guess is that '.path' unit is missing partof/bindsto => such that whenever the main service file is gracefully stopped, the path unit should stop too, as we are done with this thing.
<xnox> suspecting that daemon removes file from monitored path, on shutdown, which triggers the .path unit, to restart the thing again.
<xnox> tkamppeter, also I use google chrome printer (e.g. upload things to google drive / google chrome and print from there direct to printer) e.g. I have stopped using cups itself on ubuntu years ago =/
<xnox> but i can setup up cups to play with this.
<xnox> tkamppeter, re comment #39 i think you need "PartOf=" is some of these units https://www.freedesktop.org/software/systemd/man/systemd.unit.html -> Configures dependencies similar to Requires=, but limited to stopping and restarting of units. When systemd stops or restarts the units listed here, the action is propagated to this unit. Note that this is a one-way dependency â changes to this unit do not affect the listed units.
<tkamppeter> xnox, CUPS has a so-called keepalive file with which it tells whether it should be started right on the next boot (if it has remaining jobs, shares printers, or the web interface is active) or not (start on demand only, like on next job) .
<tkamppeter> So on shutdown CUPS removes the keepalive file if on next boot only on-demand is needed, and it keeps the file if on next boot CUPS is needed right away.
<xnox> tkamppeter, in systemd's opinion i would start cups on boot, always, and then auto-shutdown if not needed (no jobs left, no shared printers, to web interface active) and disintegrate back into on demand launch for next job if and when that arrives.
<xnox> this on-demand logic is backwards, and .path units are not meant for this type of state conservation.
<tkamppeter> xnox, adding PartOf=cups in cups.path (and cups.socket) should solve the problem. Am I right?
<xnox> tkamppeter, hehe =) just writting "xnox," in the comment does not send me an owl or a telegram =) but nice try. You could have subscribed me to the bug report, before adding that comment.
<xnox> tkamppeter, i believe so. But i think you only want that on the .path unit.
<xnox> tkamppeter, because you want .socket to be alive (for on demand printing?!) to active the otherwise dead .service unit.
<xnox> tkamppeter, but before uploading that it needs testing. This is certainly an interesting bug to work on.
<xnox> targetting this for myself to look at before break for christmas.
<tkamppeter> xnox, I had subscribed you to the bug and you are still subscribed.
<xnox> =(
<xnox> weird
<xnox> tkamppeter, huh, i do have emails about it. but they are fairly context less and marked as read. I'm so sorry for missing this. And thank you for pinging me about it.
<tkamppeter> xnox, it was some days after my comment #49, when I realized that there was no answer from the systemd or debhelper side, that I decided to subscribe you and add comment #50 to assure that you get a notification.
<tkamppeter> xnox, I did not want to re-post the longish comment #49.
<tkamppeter> xnox, note also that the unit files of CUPS are supplied upstream. So you should also report an upstream bug on CU{PS, either about a fix for cups.path or about always starting CUPS on boot but closing immediately if nothing has to be done from boot on.
<xnox> tkamppeter, ack.
<tkamppeter> xnox, what do I have to run after editing a unit file?
<xnox> tkamppeter, systemctl daemon-reload
<tkamppeter> xnox, Thank you. I have now added PartOf=cups.service to the [Unit] section of cups.path and then done the daemon-reload. With this I do not get the error message in the reproducer of comment #18 any more.
<tkamppeter> xnox, seems that this is the solution, to be applied in cups upstream.
<xnox> tkamppeter, to use the statefile to launchd cupd on boot only, i think you want a generator that does "[ -f /var/lib/that/state/file ] && ln -s ../../lib/systemd/system/cups.service $1/multi-user.target.wants/cups.service" or some such.
<xnox> tkamppeter, such that on boot, systemd runs the generators; which checks if that file is on disk; and if it is, adds cups.service to the initial transaction of service to start on boot.
<tkamppeter> xnox, I think I will stay with CUPS' architecture and try the adding of the "PartOf=cups.service" at first.
<tkamppeter> xnox, posted https://github.com/apple/cups/issues/4935
<tkamppeter> The bug bot is not recognizing GitHub issues.
<tkamppeter> xnox, I asked the users for testing now, comment #52
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-12-20
<flexiondotorg> davmor2, You and me again?
<davmor2> flexiondotorg: \o/
<davmor2> flexiondotorg: maybe next year you'll forget to take holiday and realise you have like 10 left at the end of the year and book most of december off too ;)
<flexiondotorg> Maybe :-)
<flexiondotorg> Due to starting late in the year I didn't have much holiday.
<andyrock> hey
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-12-21
<davmor2> Morning flexiondotorg
<flexiondotorg> davmor2, Morning!
<flexiondotorg> davmor2, Last day for me today. You?
<davmor2> flexiondotorg: pfff part-timers the lot of you
<davmor2> I'm here till Friday
 * Laney hugs flexiondotorg and davmor2 
<Laney> you brave men
<flexiondotorg> Laney, o/
<flexiondotorg> Get back to wrapping you :-)
<Laney> I came on to do some Advent of Code :P
<flexiondotorg> hehe
<davmor2> Laney: you insane man don't you do enough of that through the year?
<happyaron> got shoot by a weird bug on upgrading 16.04(.0) to latest, that's update-binfmts core dump, and python3.5-minimal cannot be configured
<happyaron> is there any other reports?
<flocculant> flexiondotorg davmor2 - just having a butchers at ubuntu iso double checking an issue - noticed icon missing for network there - known issue?
<flexiondotorg> On xubuntu?
<flocculant> no - on Ubuntu :)
<davmor2> flocculant: yeap it is the unity8 indicator
<flocculant> flexiondotorg: I'd tell ochosi in #xub-dev in that case :p
<davmor2> flocculant: in january it will be blocked but the person that needed to do it is off till then
<flocculant> davmor2: ok - cheers - jusrt thought I'd mention it :)
<flocculant> ubuntu is seeing this bug 1651716 though
<ubot5`> bug 1651716 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "17.04 boots direct to live desktop, no option to Try or Install" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1651716
<flocculant> davmor2: I'm guessing that most of everyone if off for ages now?
<davmor2> yeap
 * flocculant makes note to see if xnox will unbreak our panel in January :D
<xnox> bug 1651716 looks scary
<ubot5`> bug 1651716 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "17.04 boots direct to live desktop, no option to Try or Install" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1651716
<xnox> flocculant, sure i will. i'm planning to rm src:upstart =)
<flocculant> xnox: might be scary - but would be a whole lot worse if it defaulted to installing :D
<flocculant> refusing to acknowledge you saying anything like rm src:upstart :p
 * flocculant got fed up with the installer doing silly things with unused space in a drive and added a tiny partition at the end to stop it 
<xnox> flocculant, i think instructions on that wiki are wrong... as i lost the lubuntuqt session i think
<xnox> Laney, in Ubuntu Gnome, selecting GTK+ theme Ambiance or Radience ends up having black corners on all windows, instead of rounded transparent corners like in Adwaita theme or under Unity 7. Is it known and/or possible to fix?
<Laney> xnox: ask Trevinho
<Laney> I'm sure it is somehow
<flocculant> xnox: wiki page?
<flocculant> oh - if you meant unused space comment - I was talking about bug 1638639
<ubot5`> bug 1638639 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Installer trims unallocated space from extended partition" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1638639
<Trevinho> xnox: oh... We've a patch for gtk, but that shouldn't affect it...
<qengho>  /join #hugs
<qengho> Argh.
<dobey> qengho: don't be shy. hugs are ok. don't let the nazi conservatives stigmatize your hugs!
<qengho> dobey: You can't fool me. I saw you alarm the free-hugs girl in Buenos Aires.
<qengho> And yes, smash the partiarchy.
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-12-22
<flocculant> davmor2: no talking to yourself then ...
<davmor2> I always talk to myself, sometimes you need to hear sense ;)
<flocculant> indeed - always my reasoning too :p
<xnox> Trevinho, i wonder if the black corners are actually "glow" which doesn't render in gnome shell right.
<xnox> under unity7 nothing is flat, and everything has glow/shadows.
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-12-23
<davmor2> Morning all
<flocculant> hi davmor2 :)
<davmor2> flocculant: how do
<flocculant> pretty good all things considered :p
<flocculant> you too I trust :)
<davmor2> flocculant: busy but good thanks
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-12-18
<whisk848> âââââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETplcvndlw: darkxst sary jjohansen drjam grrr[m] ubot9 hurricanehrndz potashnik[m] ayan jhernandez anpok micahg robert_ancell marlinc duflu jibel hyperair koza muktupavels chiluk el jzheng vila frederico4d[m] mbiebl_ DB9[m] Texou mcs_ isantop mgedmin chrisccouls
<whisk848> ââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETtugddj: micahg vila darkxst flocculant DB9[m] ochosi ddstreet slashd bschaefer ryeguy[m] Texou el drjam hyperair shiznix mdeslaur chiluk ayan ejat hggdh koza muktupavels anpok duflu cpaelzer marlinc ubot9 g4Fd63FhtS55rx6r jibel dgadomski grrr[m] hurricanehrndz robert_ancell veebers mcs_ jb
<whisk848> âââââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETjvdogfgmf: jzheng bschaefer chrisccoulson veebers cpaelzer robert_ancell lifeless ayan frederico4d[m] el potashnik[m] ochosi hyperair chiluk vila ember duflu g4Fd63FhtS55rx6r jjohansen ejat sary drjam mcs_ ubot9 dgadomski shiznix muktupavels jhernandez ddstree
<whisk848> ââââââââââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETukuueb: jbicha el jzheng anpok hggdh robert_ancell koza darkxst ximion Texou flocculant g4Fd63FhtS55rx6r ubot9 davidcalle muktupavels frederico4d[m] mgedmin mcs_ jhernandez beidl chiluk sary dgadomski mdeslaur
<whisk848> âââââââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETbjilvi: el jibel ayan ember anpok sary vila mcs_ edwinksl davidcalle mbiebl_ jbicha hurricanehrndz drjam lifeless mdeslaur chiluk bschaefer DB9[m] Texou shiznix mgedmin marlinc jhernandez potashnik[m] flocculant slashd isantop dgadomski mic
<bac35> ââââââââââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETjctwwmbuaw: koza jibel potashnik[m] marlinc micahg anpok muktupavels jzheng el ubot9 hggdh hurricanehrndz drjam hyperair davidcalle edwinksl handsome_feng flocculant robert_ancell mcs_ vila mbiebl_ DB9[m] ddstr
<bac35> ââââââââââââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETjmcwsdc: edwinksl ochosi bschaefer muktupavels jbicha lifeless ryeguy[m] dgadomski vila anpok mdeslaur ayan marlinc hggdh ubot9 el jibel handsome_feng jjohansen hyperair flocculant jzheng em
<bac35> âââââââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETlvrsjjnuqv: sary mdeslaur isantop davidcalle maclin chrisccoulson DB9[m] jzheng drjam ubot9 vila ayan jhernandez flocculant mgedmin duflu muktupavels marlinc hurricanehrndz slashd Texou bschaefer mbiebl_ beidl potashnik[m] edwinksl chiluk v
<bac35> ââââââââââââââ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--jYqzJErTI LRH IS LIVE NOW!! CALL 415-349-5666 #LRH EFNETpptdjyn: jbicha ddstreet marlinc jjohansen ejat Texou frederico4d[m] mbiebl_ DB9[m] micahg veebers mcs_ handsome_feng darkxst anpok sary vila hurricanehrndz slashd flocculant cpaelzer chiluk jhernandez koza mdeslaur ember jzheng hyperair chrisccoulso
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers!
<tjaalton> duflu: hi, the libinput backport was too aggressive, had to drop it from debian
<tjaalton> which means it'll autosync to bionic too
<tjaalton> seems to be in proposed
<duflu> tjaalton, I know, that's annoying, but am dealing with lots of home maintenance emerergencies today... I think libinput perhaps should have followed our request and made it a configurable option
<duflu> *emergencies
<tjaalton> ok, no worries, just a FYI
<Nafallo> morning o/
<oSoMoN> morning Nafallo
<Trevinho> Hello guys... A little jatlagged...
<dechinchilla> Friends, I pitched an app for Ubuntu I'd like to kickstart in the hopes of getting some early input and feedback. https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/661688 I didn't get quite as much of either as I had hoped. What's my next move? Where do I go?
<oSoMoN> good morning/afternoon Trevinho
<seb128> hey Trevinho, back to good old Europe?
<seb128> lut oSoMoN
<seb128> dechinchilla, hey, try maybe ubuntu-users list or forums?
<dechinchilla> seb128, Thanks
<seb128> yw! and good luck with the app
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah.. back to the cold :)
<Trevinho> hey oSoMoN
<kenvandine> jibel, sru bug 1736232 has been in the queue for 10 days.  anything we can do to get that to updates?
<ubot5`> bug 1736232 in gnome-software (Ubuntu Zesty) "GNOME Software shows U1 login for snaps" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1736232
<jibel> kenvandine, I approved bug 1716633 this morning (needed to wait to check if there was new crashes for this version on errors.u.c)
<ubot5`> bug 1716633 in gnome-software (Ubuntu Zesty) "Installed, popular and featured snaps are loaded in parallel threads can crash" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1716633
<jibel> kenvandine, it should be good to publish now.
<kenvandine> jibel, awesome
<jibel> kenvandine, you can ask someone from the sru team on #ubuntu-release
<kenvandine> jibel, thx, i pinged
<kenvandine> jibel, we're very anxious to get started on the next critical gnome-software SRU :)
<flexiondotorg> Hello desktopers
<flexiondotorg> Anyone here familiar with the the supported resolutions are for banner-icon.png that is overlaid on banner.png for feature snaps in GNOME Software?
<oSoMoN> hello flexiondotorg
<oSoMoN> sorry I'm not familiar with that
<flexiondotorg> oSoMoN: o/
<jibel> kenvandine, whn is it planned?
<jibel> when*
<kenvandine> jibel, robert already did the backport and james should be working on getting it in proposed
<kenvandine> jibel, bug 1690280
<ubot5`> bug 1690280 in gnome-software (Ubuntu Xenial) "Classic confined snaps don't install" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1690280
<jibel> kenvandine, okay, QA can probably do the verification this week for a release 1st week of january
<kenvandine> jibel, great
<kenvandine> popey, ^^
<popey> yay
<flexiondotorg> oSoMoN: Where is the source for the snap plugin for GNOME software?
<jbicha> flexiondotorg: it's upstream so https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-software/tree/plugins/snap
<flexiondotorg> Thanks jbicha
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Are you there?
<jbicha> I'm half here .)
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Ok. Just wondered if you could sponsor bug #1735362. But it's no urgency, I suppose.
<ubot5`> bug 1735362 in ibus-libpinyin (Ubuntu) "Replace ibus-sunpinyin with ibus-libpinyin" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1735362
<GunnarHj> doko: If I forward to Debian, that would be including your change of the build dep from python2 to python3.
<doko> GunnarHj: ta!
<GunnarHj> doko: Ok.
<jbicha> GunnarHj: ask Seb if you want the desktop bugs team subscribed to pkgs
<doko> GunnarHj: hmm, where did you forward the patch to Debian?
<GunnarHj> doko: Haven't done it yet...
<jibel> kenvandine, is there a card on the board for next sru?
<kenvandine> jibel, nope
<kenvandine> well, i don't think so :)
<jibel> kenvandine, I didn't find any
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Ok, I'll ask Seb about that. Or do you see an alternative?
<kenvandine> jibel, i'll add one
<jibel> kenvandine, thanks.
<jbicha> alternative to Seb? no, he's irreplacable :)
<kenvandine> jibel, actually there is
<kenvandine> https://trello.com/c/onHI86gJ/62-bug1690280-support-installing-of-classic-snaps
<kenvandine> well, not specifically for the sru
<kenvandine> but that's for the fix
<kenvandine> jibel, i assume we need a new card?
<jbicha> my understanding is that Main packages need a Canonical team subscriber and I guess that means ibus stuff falls to the Desktop team these days
<jibel> kenvandine, i'd be useful to have a card for each SRU with the list of bugs that it will address
<jibel> so yes, a new card
<kenvandine> jibel, will do
<jibel> unless it's the only bug fixed in this sru
<kenvandine> it is just one bug
<kenvandine> afaik
<kenvandine> jamesh should be able to confirm
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Yeah, that was my understanding.
<jibel> i find cards to document a single bug redundant with LP, but that's my opinion :)
<kenvandine> jibel, cool, then we'll just use the bug :)
<doko> GunnarHj: please do
<GunnarHj> doko: I will in an hour or two.
<oSoMoN> gânight folks
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-12-19
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<duflu> and alan_g and seb128 and cking and
<seb128> hey duflu & desktopers
<duflu> and morning Laney
<seb128> how are you today?
<duflu> and sil2100
<jamesh> hi oSoMoN, seb128
<seb128> duflu, La_ney is on holidays until new year
<duflu> seb128, dramatically better; Tuesday vs Monday
<seb128> hey jamesh
<alan_g> Morning already?!
<oSoMoN> hey duflu, seb128, jamesh, Laney, alan_g
<duflu> alan_g, just kidding. Go back to bed
<seb128> duflu, did you get your house issues sorted out?
<duflu> seb128, /mostly/ fixed but I could have bought a small car for the cost
<seb128> :/
<sil2100> Morning o/
<sil2100> ;)
<oSoMoN> hey sil2100
<Trevinho> Morning!
<duflu> Morning Trevinho
<duflu> Must be your bed time
<Trevinho> duflu: hey duflu
<Trevinho> No, I'm back to Europe now
<duflu> Trevinho, I know but I assume you work all night
<Trevinho> I try to be a good boy now
<oSoMoN> seb128, kenvandine[m][m]:Â are we doing the team meeting today?
<seb128> oSoMoN, no, we said previous week that next one would be on jan 9th
<kenvandine[m][m]> I didn't think so
<oSoMoN> right, that's what IÂ thought, thanks for confirming
<oSoMoN> I would have missed it as I need to pick up my daughter from school today
<ejat> anyone can help to take a look into bug 1728354
<ubot5`> bug 1728354 in ntfs-3g (Ubuntu) "ntfs: unsupported reparse point" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1728354
<ejat> really need it to be patch for the latest windows 10 post creator update
<doko> oSoMoN: I'm starting archive test rebuilds tomorrow. would be nice if you could turn off all your dailies/nightlies if you don't look at the results until Jan 2 ...
<oSoMoN> doko, I don't have dailies/nightlies, all my builds are manually triggered
<oSoMoN> so I'll refrain from triggering new builds starting tomorrow
<oSoMoN> doko, until what time do IÂ have?
<doko> oSoMoN: I don't know, have a look at the buildds, you'll see the queue lengths. if you have to do a build or two, just do
<seb128> doko, is there any reason that archive rebuild should get higher priority than the work from others?
<seb128> oSoMoN, imho it's good to know that builders have backlog but it shouldn't stop you to do builds when they are needed or useful to you, there is no rule that archive rebuild should lock others from doing their work
<doko> seb128: yes, to get a test rebuild done in finite time
<doko> and if people are on vacation not looking at results, then I'd like to reduce the load on the buildds if possible
<oSoMoN> good night all
<linuxr> hi all, I got some crappy documentation to connect to a vpn server, but I have problems setting this up on my client. Basically all I know is a gateway address and a shared secret password. Can someone help?
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-12-20
<robert_ancell> jbicha, around by any chance?
<jbicha> yes
<robert_ancell> jbicha, I want to update the Debian accountsservice package - do you have commit access or can I get access or who can I ping to make it happen?
<jbicha> you should talk to sunweaver (Mike Gabriel from Debian MATE). He was interested in accountsservice recently and he is an admin for the collab-maint team that you'll need to join
<jbicha> but he's offline for the holidays
<jbicha> could you review the accountsservice path at LP: #1699216 ?
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1699216 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu) "Encrypted home support" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1699216
<jbicha> patch
<jbicha> my only concern there was that I don't have much experience with library API handling to know whether the patch was safe
<jbicha> the patch is at comment #35
<robert_ancell> jbicha, will look
<hurricanehrndz> What does [0:0] mean in ufw rules
<hurricanehrndz> nm
<duflu> koza, is something missing or broken in 5.47?
<duflu> Or just 5.48 is soon?
<koza> duflu, it seems 5.48 is soon
<duflu> koza, OK. It would always save effort if we could predict the ideal release to wait for
<koza> duflu, i have seen some reports that certain keyboards are broken on 5.47 so I have pulled a brake on it
<koza> duflu, the truth is also that i have been so much time out this quoter that there has been no genuine time to package it and test properly for me
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> koza, I forgot the meeting was meant to be 50 minutes ago. And so did Google. Anything to discuss?
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<koza> duflu, i guess i have failed to move all of the instances
<koza> duflu, it requires PM skills, where is will? ;-)
<duflu> koza, I believe you just have to say yes when Google Calendar asks if you want to apply a change to all instances
<koza> duflu, nothing new this time
<koza> duflu, i told, PM skills
<koza> :)
<duflu> post meridiem? people management? project management?
<duflu> Or Google permissions?
<koza> project manager
<koza> this is the special skill set that developers are lacking and it includes fluency with calendar apps (as well as sympathy for colorful charts;)
<Trevinho> Morning
<duflu> Morning Trevinho
<duflu> And bye
<oSoMoN> good night all
<robert_ancell> flexiondotorg, does MATE use AccountsService?
<jbicha> robert_ancell: I believe it's used by all Ubuntu desktop flavors
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-12-21
<flocculant> jbicha: we likely to see an update to gvfs before release? bug 1739537
<ubot5`> bug 1739537 in gvfs (Ubuntu) "mtp volume is not removed when unplugging" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1739537
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<duflu> Morning seb128
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you?
<duflu> seb128, I was hungry so snacked. Fine now :) You?
<seb128> I'm good :)
<dupondje> Hi guys. Small question, what could be the cause that gnome-terminal laggs my whole pc when there is fast output in it (like when I tail -f some logfile)
<dupondje> gnome-terminal goes to like 60% cpu :s
<duflu> dupondje, that sounds familiar but I can't fine the Ubuntu bug reports. You would have more luck looking upstream closer to the source: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=gnome%20terminal%20performance
<duflu> I also can't *find* them
<duflu> dupondje, maybe https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=778926
<ubot5> Gnome bug 778926 in Backend: Wayland "[gnome-terminal] Very poor scrolling performance on wayland with high DPI" [Normal,New]
<duflu> One surprising side-effect of using Wayland instead of X11 is that there is now no 2D acceleration where previously there was in Xorg. So some simple things like clearing a rectangle to a colour or scrolling could be much more CPU intensive with Wayland
<duflu> So I discovered when working on GTK performance issues in 17.10
<dupondje> That seems the be the issue indeed :) Cause its since I'm using a new laptop with HiDPi
<dupondje> 2D acceleration still needs to be added or ?
<duflu> dupondje, OK then two separate issues. (1) Please subscribe to that bug. (2) I don't think 2D acceleration is planned at all, AFAIK. Devs would probably prefer instead that more people used OpenGL instead of software blitting. Fortunately GTK4 does exactly that, compared to GTK3
<duflu> And Qt already does. So only GTK3 is a problem really
<duflu> Only GTK3 on Wayland is a problem really
<duflu> dupondje, solving the problem you describe is one of the main goals of GTK4, as far as I have heard
<dupondje> but gtk4 is for 20xx? :D
<duflu> Yes, probably this century
 * duflu has no idea on the timeline for that
<dupondje> so until then we have to live with gnome-terminal eating 60% cpu? :D
<duflu> dupondje, if you scroll fast enough then yes. You have to keep in mind the computer will and must display each frame accurately. So if you scroll really fast it's like asking the machine to play a 3D game with software rendering
<duflu> That's what GPUs are *mostly* for. To avoid that bottleneck and push hundreds of millions of unique pixels to the screen each second, more efficiently than a CPU can
<duflu> Then there is the argument that it's not really an important bug. If your terminal is scrolling so fast that it uses significant CPU then it's already too fast to read, and not useful. Maybe redirect your output so it doesn't scroll
<dupondje> well partly agree :) thing is, it worked fine, and now (on wayland) its broken, which is not cool ofcourse
<duflu> dupondje, yeah I experienced similar when testing window (actually just decorations) redraw performance. It was much faster with X11 vs Wayland
<duflu> But that's somewhat intentional. No fast path exists for GTK3 on Wayland yet
<dupondje> in fact its better to stay on X11 then :)
<dupondje> in this stage
<duflu> dupondje, there are benefits and drawbacks. It's also possible gnome-terminal just contains some bug that is fixable without needing GTK4 acceleration
<duflu> But in general you can't animate in software a largish window like a terminal that is scrolling without using noticeable CPU
<LyzardKing_> willcooke: Hi! I'm the maintainer for ubuntu-make. I just updated the wiki.ubuntu.com page to reflect the recent changes (snap, ppa, and other details.). At the moment the updated ppa is on my personal launchapd account. Is the ubuntu team interested in keeping instead the ubuntu-desktop ppa (aka the old one...)?
<jbicha> flocculant: do you mean for bionic or for artful? (gvfs)
<alexarnaud> jbicha: Hello, do you plan to package BRLTTY 5.5 for Ubuntu 18.04 ? Do I have to fill a bug for that ? It's braille display driver for GNU/Linux.
<jbicha> alexarnaud: I'm not working on brltty now
<alexarnaud> I know but who is in charge of this package ? Do you plan to migrate the BRLTTY package from main to community to use the Debian package ?
<alexarnaud> The new BRLTTY release 5.5 comes in April 2017 and Ubuntu BRLTTY package stays on 5.4.
<jbicha> no, brltty needs to stay in main
<jbicha> lots of people are on holiday now
<jbicha> maybe ask in #ubuntu-devel in January, maybe you can find someone from the Foundations Team to work on doing the merge (updating the package)
<jbicha> you can file a bug if you like. If you do, add the tags upgrade-software-version and needs-debian-merge
<alexarnaud> OK :), to be honest I don't exactly why BRLTTY needs to be in main. But you're more experienced than me. I just want to inform you about the current situation of BRLTTY on Ubuntu. As I've to help blind people to use Ubuntu since few months I think it could better to have an up-to-date BRLTTY package on 18.04.
<alexarnaud> Thanks, I'll do that.
<jbicha> it needs to be in main so that it can be used in the installer
<alexarnaud> Oh, thanks for the explanation.
<flocculant> jbicha: bionic :p
<jbicha> flocculant: sure, we'll package a new release eventually
<jbicha> gvfs follows the GNOME release schedule so if we package GNOME 3.28, that's around February https://wiki.gnome.org/ThreePointTwentyseven
<flocculant> jbicha: okey doke - thanks for the info
<flocculant> was a bit disconcerting when I had a bunch of phones and tablets apparently :p
<kenvandine> heber, popey just invited you to be a mentor, can you please accept it?
<heber> kenvandine, sure let me check
<robert_ancell> jackpot51, hello, looking at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/accountsservice/+bug/1699216
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1699216 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu) "Encrypted home support" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<robert_ancell> jackpot51, I updated the bug with some feedback.
<jackpot51> Thanks robert_ancell
<jackpot51> I will get to work on updating it
<robert_ancell> jackpot51, note I haven't got confirmation from the original authors that is a valid use of account type but it seems reasonable to me. The other option was a CreateUser2 method that took params arg of type "a{sv}" so we could add any other future options into it.
<jackpot51> That makes sense
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-12-22
<duflu> RAOF: Are you aware of any concept of Wayland input shape or surface targeting?
<RAOF> duflu: You're probably looking for wl_surface.set_input_region() ?
<duflu> ROAF: Yes, thanks
<duflu> RAOF: For your reading pleasure: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=791865
<ubot5> Gnome bug 791865 in wayland "Mouse input passes straight through simple Wayland clients (only in gnome-shell, not in Weston)" [Major,New]
<RAOF> Fun!
<oSoMoN> good morning from Normandy, desktoppers
<jibel> Hi oSoMoN , welcome to the rainy Normandy
<oSoMoN> salut jibel
<duflu> oSoMoN, jibel, sunny Western Australia says good evening and good night. See you next year
<duflu> Also morning seb128
<duflu> and sverdy
<ondra> hi, anybody here able to help with greeter issue on 16.04?
<ondra> or how to resolve "session_get_login1_session_id: assertion 'session != NULL' failed" when I try auto loging
<oSoMoN> ondra, so what's happening? logging in fails?
<ondra> oSoMoN it's on arm64
<ondra> oSoMoN and I can't get greeter to show up
<ondra> oSoMoN greeter itself throws load of errors but not sure if those are main problem
<ondra> oSoMoN things like (unity-settings-daemon:5932): Gtk-WARNING **: Theme parsing error: unity-greeter.css:59:22: The :focused pseudo-class is deprecated. Use :focus instead.
<ondra> oSoMoN can I use 'lightdm-gtk-greeter' on 16.04 or not good idea?
<oSoMoN> haven't tried that myself, the default is unity-greeter
<ondra> oSoMoN I tried to enable auto logging so I skip greeter, but this seems to still either start greeter or I get "session_get_login1_session_id: assertion 'session != NULL' failed"
<ondra> oSoMoN if I do not add auto login, lightdm log seems to be OK
<ondra> oSoMoN but greeter log finishes with (nm-applet:5639): Gtk-CRITICAL **: gtk_widget_show: assertion 'GTK_IS_WIDGET (widget)' failed
<oSoMoN> ondra, but with auto-login turned off, do you get the greeter displayed, eventually?
<ondra> oSoMoN nope
<ondra> oSoMoN nope, this is my greeter log http://paste.ubuntu.com/26233567/
<ondra> ups sorry that was lightdm
<ondra> oSoMoN here is greeter http://paste.ubuntu.com/26233569/
<oSoMoN> lightdm log looks fine
<oSoMoN> and all those theme parsing errors look suspicious
<oSoMoN> ondra, so have you tried switching to lightdm-gtk-greeter?
<oSoMoN> see https://askubuntu.com/questions/75755/how-to-change-the-lightdm-theme-greeter
<ondra> oSoMoN yeah with that it fails to start lightdm at all
<oSoMoN> huh
<ondra> oSoMoN and no logs in /var/log/lightdm at all
<ondra> oSoMoN BTW those errors for greeter, is it possible I'm missing some packages?
<oSoMoN> ondra, I don't know, I'm not familiar with lightdm, I'm afraid the lightdm experts are all on vacation already
<ondra> oSoMoN yeah, never mind
<ondra> oSoMoN time to have Xmass break :)
<oSoMoN> I guess so :) sorry I wasn't of help hereâ¦
<ondra> oSoMoN no worries at all
<ondra> oSoMoN have a great holiday and talk to you next year :)
<oSoMoN> ondra, thanks, you too and see you on the other side
<popey> oSoMoN: great to see 0ad land :)
<oSoMoN> popey, yeah, it was long overdue
<seb128> ok, enough work,n have good holidays desktopers!
<oSoMoN> yeah, time to call it a year, have a great break everyone, tty in January!
<Trevinho> Leaving too... Merry christmas and happy new year!
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-12-23
<Laney> HO HO HO
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-12-24
<edgard_> hola
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-12-17
<willcooke> Morning all
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<willcooke> hi oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hi willcooke
<Laney> HELLO!!!!
<oSoMoN> MORNING Laney
 * Laney bangs some pans
<Laney> hey oSoMoN! how's it going?
<seb128> hey willcooke oSoMoN Laney, did you have a good w.e?
<oSoMoN> I'm good, had a good long week-end, how are you guys?
<seb128> I'm good but tired, w.e was exhausting. I went to France to prepare things for holidays and buy things, so busy days, quite some train and worked on saturday in exchange for thursday
<seb128> now a few 'normal' days before holidays :)
<seb128> oh, also we received our replacement modem, having landline internet again \o/
<ricotz> good morning all
<ricotz> oSoMoN, hi
<oSoMoN> hey ricotz
<ricotz> oSoMoN, I ran into some trouble with gcc-mozilla which requires an update
<ricotz> gcc 6.5.0 is required for armhf/arm64 builds, I have managed a backport for xenial which works, but trusty is a problem
<ricotz> See https://gcc.gnu.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=83623
<ubot5> gcc.gnu.org bug 83623 in middle-end "[8 Regression] ICE: in convert_move, at expr.c:248 with -march=knl and 16bit vector bswap/rotate" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<oSoMoN> looking
<ricotz> this bug the reason for the new build requirement
<ricotz> oSoMoN, updates are here https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/ubuntu/red/+packages
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> back in .nl again now?
<seb128> yeah, for a few days then driving back to France for the holidays
<Laney> you ping pong ball
<Laney> long weekend was nice here, got some xmas shopping done and otherwise just hung out
<seb128> :)
<Laney> had some nasty weather
<seb128> nice
<seb128> it was cold and windy here :/
<oSoMoN> ricotz, have you looked into the build failures on trusty already?
<ricotz> oSoMoN, yes, briefly, no idea how to fix it though
<oSoMoN> ricotz, ok, at a first quick glance I have no clue either, I'll put it on my list to look at later this week, can't do right now
<ricotz> oSoMoN, I assumed this is bootstrap problem
<ricotz> oSoMoN, ok, no hurry -- I guess, you can ignore the ~mt3 change
<willcooke> Laney, what do you use for finding the right emoji?
<willcooke> i.e. am I using Characters wrong, because I find it too hard to scroll up and down and just use google instead
<Laney> willcooke: I use the search provider in Shell normally
<Laney> but sometimes they have stupid names
<Laney> ð like that one
<willcooke> Is that an extension?
<Laney> I always wanted to search for it as 'devil' or 'evil'
<willcooke> ohhh
<willcooke> I bet I have the snap which doesnt do search providers yet
<Laney> but it is "smiling face with horns"
<Laney> yeah probably
<Laney> unlucky :-)
<willcooke> kk, thx
<willcooke> k_envandine will fix that :)
<Laney> you can still do the same searching in Characters itself tho
<willcooke> yeah, that doesnt work at all for me
<Laney> then you probably won't enjoy the shell thing
<Laney> ð¤·
<Laney> "shrug" ð
<willcooke> so in Chars itself, if you search for "fireworks" do you get any results  (also what happens in shell for you?)?
<Laney> ð
<Laney> that
<willcooke> that doesnt work for me
 * willcooke opens a bug
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<Laney> that doesn't work for me in the snap version
<Laney> maybe it doesn't include the emoji font?
<willcooke> I can browse the font, just not search
<Laney> k well seems snap specific, /usr/bin/gnome-characters works fine
<Laney> feel free to confirm/disconfirm that
<seb128> any idea where it's searching? in that in the glyph names?
<Laney> they have a text name associated yes
 * Laney won't get further involved in debugging though
<willcooke> the deb works as expected
<Laney> ð­
<seb128> jbicha, bug #1808702 might be something for you/a regression for that SRU/security update
<ubot5> bug 1808702 in gnome-desktop3 (Ubuntu) "Bubblewrap integration broke user thumbnailers" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1808702
<andyrock> morning all!
<willcooke> hi andyrock
<Laney> hey andyrock
<Laney> how's the capital city?
<Laney> seb128: i'm uploading a mutter to cosmic that should fix that g-s-d thing (https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/3567/+packages)
 * Laney takes a deep breath and uploads nautilus
<Laney> well, it'll be blocked on promotions ...
<seb128> Laney, oh ok, sorry I didn't follow up on that tiem from the weekly summary from previous week, I didn't care much about that SRU so I was wondering just asking the SRU team to delete it
<Laney> nm
<seb128> Laney, having it in proposed allows starting testing, so good for step
<Laney> it's a valid bug that could happen again
<seb128> right, it's non LTS serie, I'm a bit lazy to do work on it at this point but you are right it's best if we deal with it
<seb128> Laney, nicely done for nautilus :)
<Laney> cheers
<seb128> cyphermox, hey, I plan to do a plymouth upload to change the default timeout, do you want me to cherry pick the recent fix your commited upstream and did you start on that yourself?
<cyphermox> on vacation this week, I'm not really here
<cyphermox> feel free to cherry-pick
<cyphermox> actually
<cyphermox> what default timeout?
<willcooke> cyphermox, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/plymouth/+bug/1808196
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1808196 in plymouth (Ubuntu) "Set the default delay to 0" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> cyphermox, sorry, I didn't see you replied, will do!
<seb128> cyphermox, enjoy your holidays :)
<seb128> cyphermox, (the timeout was +1ed by Steve on principle)
<seb128> willcooke, thx for catching up the question ;)
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> Laney, I can upload you ubuntu-settings pending change right, that's not going to create issues before other components are in place? (out of maybe printing a warning for the key override not matching a schemas for those having it not installed yet) (I've another tweak to the settings I want to upload, pondering either staging yours or included it in the upload)
<Laney> seb128: aye do it
<seb128> Laney, thx
<Laney> was going to do that later anyway
<seb128> one less thing to do :)
<Laney> :>
<cyphermox> seb128: well I was just surprised I thought there weren't timeouts in plymout
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-12-18
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<jibel> Hi oSoMoN and duflu
<duflu> Hi jibel
<oSoMoN> hey duflu, jibel
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, en forme ?
<oSoMoN> oui, et toi?
<seb128> nickel, un peu la bourre pour finir des choses avant les vacances mais sinon Ã§a va :)
<oSoMoN> pareil, pas assez de jours dans la semaine pour tout faire, et câest justement la pÃ©riode de lâannÃ©e oÃ¹ jâaimerais me poser et faire les choses tranquillement sans stressâ¦
<seb128> :(
<duflu> Hi seb128
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you?
<duflu> seb128, without headache so much better than yesterday. How are you?
<seb128> tseliot, hey, bug #1808874 might one for you? (unsure if you are subscribed to the component, I just review daily bugs and it's in today's batch)
<ubot5> bug 1808874 in ubuntu-drivers-common (Ubuntu) "nvidia-detector doesn't seem to detect nvidia" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1808874
<tseliot> seb128: I don't think we use nvidia-detector any more. I should just remove it
<seb128> tseliot, sounds good to me, having a non working tool is confusing, dropping it is fine and resolves the issue :)
<tseliot> seb128: yes. I'll take care of that
<seb128> thx!
 * Laney nods vigorously
<willcooke> Is nvidia-detector different to the "additional drivers" section in Software & Updates?
<willcooke> also hi
<seb128> happy cold-decembre-morning u.k
<seb128> hoi willcooke Laney
<duflu> Morning willcooke and Laney
<Laney> hey seb128 duflu
<Laney> vot iz up
<Laney> I forgot to do a status update /o\
<oSoMoN> no Xmas presents for Laney!
<Laney> 6 replies, so did everybody else it seems
<duflu> Wrong page?
<seb128> no, it has 6 posts
<seb128> some holidays though
<duflu> Maybe he means 6 < 11
<seb128> yes, 6 is low is what he meant I think
<Laney> yes
<Laney> was that not clear?
<seb128> jamesh, tkamppeter, weekly summary reminder?
<seb128> others were off yesterday/on holidays
<Nafallo> meeting? ;-)
<Nafallo> :-) even
<Nafallo> oh, I'm early...
<willcooke> Meeting
<willcooke> !
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Meeting - 2018-12-18
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Dec 18 14:31:48 2018 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Meeting - 2018-12-18 | Current topic:
<andyrock> o/
<Nafallo> o/
<seb128> hey
<jbicha> o/
<willcooke> Roll call: andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks (hols), duflu (out), jbicha, jamesh (out), jibel, kenvandine, laney (out), oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho (hols), robert_ancell (out)
<jibel> hi
<kenvandine> o/
<willcooke> I think we've got enough people.  I'll start on the BB incoming
<willcooke> andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu (out), jbicha, jamesh (out), jibel, kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<willcooke> oops
<oSoMoN> o/
<willcooke> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<willcooke> The usual url-dispatchers #1718254
<willcooke> Nothing new
<jbicha> oh that shouldn't be tracked for bionic
<willcooke> kk, marked as not fixing
<willcooke> Just looking at bb tracking
<willcooke> Does this need work in compiz still?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-release-upgrader/+bug/1778817
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1778817 in compiz (Ubuntu Bionic) "release upgrade from xenial to bionic desktop: screen locks itself, password to unlock fails" [Critical,New]
<willcooke> cc incoming is clear
<seb128> (unsure about that compiz one)
<willcooke> cc tracking is in good shape
<andyrock> mmm not sure how does it relate to compiz
<andyrock> usually is the update manager that should disable the lockscreen during the upgrade
<willcooke> Yeah, and that's fixed, so perhaps we can mark it as not affecting compiz?
<andyrock> yeah
<willcooke> andyrock, would you do the honors?
<andyrock> kk
<willcooke> thx
<willcooke> dd incoming: http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1805857 is assigned to L_aney - checking my notes
<kenvandine> whoops, i forgot to update the hub before my days off
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1805857 in network-manager (Ubuntu Disco) "network-manager dep8 failure blocks dnsmasq proposed migration" [High,Triaged]
<seb128> he mentioned it in his summary
<seb128> he has it on his backlog before holidays
<willcooke> got it
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-drivers-common/+bug/1808874
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1808874 in ubuntu-drivers-common (Ubuntu) "nvidia-detector doesn't seem to detect nvidia" [Undecided,New]
<willcooke> was talked about this morning
<willcooke> This is different to the software and updates tool right?
<seb128> yes, it's a command line utility which is not in use nowadays apparently
<willcooke> kk cool
<seb128> I don't think it's import to rls track so I would tag -notfixing
<seb128> and assign to tseliot since he said he's going to fix it
<willcooke> done
<willcooke> everything else is clear
<willcooke> woot
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-drivers-common/+bug/1768637 ?
<willcooke> Feels like we're on top of the rls bugs
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1768637 in ubuntu-drivers-common (Ubuntu) "/etc/modprobe.d is not a file" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<willcooke> oh, I assumed that wasnt a desktop one
<seb128> it's in desktop set on the list :p
<seb128> tseliot, ^ do you know what's the deal with this one?
<willcooke> meh
<seb128> I would probably vote -notfixing and havign a look anyway, same as previous one
<tseliot> seb128: it's not really a bug
<willcooke> tseliot, would you mind commenting on the bug?  I'll mark as not fixing
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Meeting - 2018-12-18 | Current topic: AOB
<seb128> tseliot, well, having those sort of messages by default in the journal seems buggy to me, and the string contains "error", maybe the message should be at least changed to hint those are ok problems
<willcooke> Anyone got anything they want to talk about, ask for help on, etc?
<tseliot> willcooke: I can make the app more quiet if it bothers uses that much
<seb128> or hidden by default/behind a --debug option
<tseliot> *users
<jbicha> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages looks mostly good
<jbicha> could we get Desktop removed from https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/postgresql-common ?
<seb128> tseliot, well, if I see those in the warning it looks like something is trying to access things and failing so a bug
<jbicha> I'm going to handle sane-backends this week
<willcooke> thanks jbicha
<seb128> jbicha, L_aney stepped up to handle that section
<seb128> seems like you are stepping on each others toes
<seb128> which is not nice
<seb128> but thanks for carring, just maybe do it in a way synced up with him?
<jbicha> I think Laney said he wasn't going to be able to make the meeting?
<jbicha> and we were in AOB now
<seb128> he sent his summary/status via email
<seb128> I expected willcooke to share it
<jbicha> I don't mind letting someone else handle it :)
<willcooke> #topic Migrations
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Meeting - 2018-12-18 | Current topic: Migrations
<willcooke> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<willcooke> apport, we should ask foundations/bdmurray to investigate, seems that
<willcooke> test got way slower / more flaky recently
<willcooke> sane-backends, same old story with no progress
<willcooke> pygobject, would be good if someone were to look at the ubuntu-make
<willcooke> regression there
<willcooke> harfbuzz fails in debian too, hopefully we get an update for free
<willcooke> libixion/liborcus seems to come down to test failures
<willcooke>   https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html#mdds
<willcooke> rls looks OK to me
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Meeting - 2018-12-18 | Current topic: AOB
<seb128> willcooke, thx :)
<jbicha> libreoffice will need a rebuild for liborcus
<willcooke> sorry. I assumed everyone had seen it, but of course, that email wont be public
<seb128> k, so sane-backends jbicha said he would deal with, thx!
<seb128> do we have anyone who wants to look at ubuntu-make?
<willcooke> Was there a community maintainer there for a while?
<seb128> I think so, Didier would know the detail but he's on holidays
<jbicha> ubuntu-make has ssl cert errors in its autopkgtest log
<willcooke> I can see if I can track the guy down
<willcooke> might be an easy fix
<oSoMoN> jbicha, re libreoffice, I'm preparing 6.1.4 and will upload to disco today
<seb128> oSoMoN, did you see the mdds failure (https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-disco/disco/amd64/m/mdds/20181218_114522_7f023@/log.gz) ?
<seb128> unsure if that's going to be an issue for libreoffice
<jbicha> oSoMoN: thanks, liborcus was just syncd from Debian a few hours ago so no need to rush :)
<oSoMoN> seb128, nope, looking
<seb128> jbicha, @ssl,  so it's a known issue/you know what to do?
<jbicha> seb128: I don't know what to do for ubuntu-make except ask Foundations for help?
<seb128> k, I though you made that comment because you had more info on what the ssl problem is
<seb128> it's obvious from the log that there is a ssl error yes :p
<seb128> there is also a code coverage error
<seb128> oh well, let's see if xnox maybe can help with the ssl issue, otherwise that can probably wait post holidays
<willcooke> It's not blocking anything is it?
<seb128> pygobject only
<seb128> which I don't think is in a transition at this point
<willcooke> it can probably wait then
<willcooke> anything else before we end the meeting?
<seb128> not from me
<willcooke> we can continue after if needed
<willcooke> thanks all
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Dec 18 14:58:54 2018 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2018/ubuntu-desktop.2018-12-18-14.31.moin.txt
<seb128> thx
<jbicha> ð
<willcooke> kenvandine, any ideas on this bug?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-characters/+bug/1808785  Is it related to search providers?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1808785 in gnome-characters (Ubuntu) "Searching for emoji in the snap yields no results ð­" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<kenvandine> no
<kenvandine> shouldn't be
<andyrock> thx
<kenvandine> i'll look at that one
<seb128> willcooke, if you double click on a symbol do you get a proper name for it
<seb128> or just an unicode char number?
<willcooke> just the unicode numebr
<seb128> right, that's the issue, same here
<seb128> kenvandine, but it works for you? you get the name?
<jbicha> willcooke: searching in the snap works fine for me
<willcooke> huh
<willcooke> jbicha, did you do a fresh install?
<seb128> jbicha, and detail views have the full name?
<seb128> jbicha, do you know where it's getting the name from?
<kenvandine> checking
<kenvandine> if i search by name i get the emoji
 * kenvandine tries other way
<jbicha> I have rev 139 instaleld with the default gnome-3-26-1604 snap
<willcooke> lemme try in a VM
<willcooke> (sorry folks, don't put too much time in here, it's only emoji after all)
 * willcooke expects slaps from Laney 
<seb128> 'only', that's all what kids carfe about when sending msg :p
<seb128> or I've been told so!
<kenvandine> it does work for me
<kenvandine> by name and by emoji
<kenvandine> but not the color emoji
<kenvandine> not sure what's different
<jbicha> I have color emoji
<kenvandine> i have color emoji
<kenvandine> but if i search for "smile" i only see the non-color smile emoji
<kenvandine> and if i copy the char for a color emoji and search for it i don't find anything
<kenvandine> but if i copy the char for non-color emoji and search it does find it
<willcooke> Instead of "Santa" I have "CJK Unified Ideograph-1F385"
<willcooke> not as festive
<jbicha> oh
<jbicha> I uninstalled the gnome-characters .deb and I think I see what Will was seeing
<willcooke> ahh
<willcooke> yes
<seb128> I don't have the deb
<jbicha> I used 'snap run gnome-characters' but maybe dbus-activated apps are more fun
<willcooke> ah yes, I removed it
<jbicha> I haven't looked into the details, but I think the names are magically compiled into the app
<seb128> you lost me there
<seb128> if that was the case then having the deb installer shouldn't make a difference
<jbicha> it is a strange app and out of date (I think it supports Unicode 9 mostly?)
<jbicha> gtk's emoji chooser at least supports Unicode 10
<kenvandine> andyrock: the lock screen/ubuntu-dock issue is back now :(
<willcooke> fresh install of 18.04 works fine
<andyrock> kenvandine: I knew that it was not a full fix
<kenvandine> i left my laptop asleep for 4 days... woke it up this morning and saw the dock and the screen while it was actually locked
<kenvandine> andyrock: yeah, you had said that :/
<andyrock> kenvandine: I need to debug it manually
<jbicha> seb128: btw, GNOME is dropping the To Do app from GNOME Core
<kenvandine> it seemed solid to me for 2 days... before it had been reliably broken
<jbicha> I noticed because of https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-online-accounts/commit/bf77325d8 (which is a bit inaccurate)
<seb128> jbicha, what's the rational?
<jbicha> also https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-build-meta/commit/5ca458d300
<Laney> ð­
<seb128> wb Laney
<Laney> guten tag
<Laney> thx for pasting me thing
<oSoMoN> good night all
<willcooke> night all
<seb128> jbicha, thx for the reviews/details, I don't think I'm going to bother dealing with having to manually add Gbp keywords at the bottom of commits but it's useful to know
<seb128> that work feels over-engineered
<seb128> I mean it's a fine tech, powerful, but it makes any 'easy' work being so much more tedious that it used to be
<seb128> than*
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-12-19
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN, seb128, all
<oSoMoN> good afternoon duflu
<Laney> yo
<seb128> hey oSoMoN duflu Laney
<seb128> how are you?
<duflu> 'lo Laney
<willcooke> moin
<oSoMoN> yo Laney, salut seb128, moin willcooke
<seb128> hey willcooke
<duflu> Hi willcooke
<Laney> hey seb128 duflu oSoMoN willcooke
 * Laney is good, won the pub quiz last night :>
<willcooke> woot!  Congrats Laney
<willcooke> What did you win?
<willcooke> Was it a special xmas one?
<Laney> N pints (forgot how many)
<Laney> yeh, all the questions were xmas themed
<willcooke> love it
<Laney> luckily for us one of the team members has excellent christmas #1 knowledge
<willcooke> :D
<Laney> how many christmas number 1s has cliff richard sung on?
<willcooke> I'd guess at maybe 3 of his own, and then a couple of charity ones, so...five?
<seb128> Laney, again! you/your team are gooood :)
<Laney> close, it's 4
<Laney> 2 solo / 1 with some band (the shadows?) / band aid
<willcooke> No points for close though
<willcooke> I think we could have a pub quiz in the channel
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> haha
<seb128> virtual beers
<Laney> good plan
<willcooke> I wonder if there is a bot for it, I bet there is
<seb128> Laney, I commented on the nm/autopkgtest bug, I asked on #nm the other day and thomas made a short reply in between other things (then I was travelling/off, didn't manage to resume that conversation), that's not a solution but give some info/can be maybe useful
<Laney> thx
<Laney> i'll have a look at that
<Laney> proposed-migration forgot about the n-m test and let dnsmasq migrate
<Laney> that's a bit dubious
<seb128> :/
<Laney> trying to write a testcase for that and fix it too
<seb128> andyrock, Trevinho: hey, can we get an ubuntu-dock update for disco with what is in trunk from ubuntu dashtodock?
<duflu> seb128, which branch is that? The Ubuntu branch seems to be unchanged from January
<duflu> Oh. That was a couple days ago. Nevermind :)
<seb128> upstream dashtocok I meant
<seb128> dashtodock
<duflu> It got refreshed this week
<seb128> duflu, upstream git has the popover changes and your repaint fix
<seb128> would be nice to have those in the distro
<duflu> seb128, not in the ubuntu-dock branch
<seb128> right, which is what I was asking them about
<seb128> rebasing our branch on trunk
<seb128> and getting that uploaded to disco
<duflu> seb128, yeah sorry. I was misled by "from ubuntu dashtodock". You mean from master
<seb128> yeah, "ubuntu"->"upstream" was an unfortable typo
<seb128> doh
<seb128> unfortunate
 * seb128 needs coffeee
<duflu> Righto
<duflu> +1
<seb128> :)
<duflu> seb128, it's a little unfortunate actually. I wrote that fix in January and it got stuck on apparently erroneous community testing
<seb128> :(
<seb128> so we should also SRU the fix to bionic maybe?
<duflu> Still goot intentions
<duflu> seb128, no it needs time to mature yet
<seb128> k
<duflu> -goot +good
<willcooke> If we SRU d-2-d to B from D, it would change the behaviour of the window preview ordering.  From "most recent at the top" to "always listed in the order they were opened in"
<willcooke> I'd be very happy to see that.
<willcooke> IMO the current ordering is broken
<willcooke> well, and upstream's view as well now
<willcooke> so that would be a nice thing to do
<willcooke> but, it does change the behaviour, so dunno, is that a special case?
<Laney> would have to convince the SRU team
<Laney> but if you can make a convincing argument, probably could be done
<Laney> wholesale SRU might be interesting (in a bad way) depending on what else is in there, chance of regressions / other behaviour changes etc
<willcooke> ack, thx Laney
<Laney> probably possible with enough will :-)
<seb128> willcooke, right, what L_aney said, I wouldn't could on a behaviour change to be easy to justify to the SRU team, one things users expect from a LTS is stability and not having to adapt/re-learn workflows (especially true in work place where changes might mean more support calls/having to explain to employees the changes/etc)
<Laney> probably going to follow what upstream said on network-manager and just remove the check for the link state
 * Laney tests that
<Laney> fatal: repository 'https://code.launchpad.net/~network-manager/network-manager/+git/ubuntu/' not found
 * Laney slaps the archive
<seb128> bah, launchpad :/
<andyrock> "morning" all
<andyrock> seb128: let's wait for Marco to be online
 * andyrock overslept too
<Laney> hey andyrock
<Laney> hope you're feeing relaxed ;-)
<andyrock> Laney: xmas mood ð
<Laney> ah, a hangover
<Laney> it all becomes clear
<andyrock> ð
<talx> andyrock: whos marco
<andyrock> Trevin_ho
<andyrock> talx: ^^^
<seb128> hey andyrock! happy post-drinking 'morning' :)
 * andyrock did not drink yesterday :( 
<andyrock> my alarm (my gf) did not wake up today
<seb128> lol
<andyrock> I mean now she is awake
<seb128> well, it's good, at least you are rested and ready to be productive in the afternoon :)
<seb128> and you still beat Marco anyway :p
<andyrock> "did not wake up" can be easily misunderstood for something else
<seb128> no misunderstanding, don't worry, just teasing you :)
<Trevinho> Morning guys!
<Laney> hey Trevinho !!!!!
<Laney> wb, did you have a nice holiday?
<Trevinho> Laney: hey laneyyy!
<seb128> hey Trevinho, wb! you have been good at not showing up here during you holidays, that's nice ;)
<seb128> did you have a good time?
<seb128> where are you now? still on the other side of the ocean? or back on the old continent for the holidays?
<Trevinho> And hi seb128 too...
<Trevinho> for both... Yes had great time
<Trevinho> landing in Europe in shorts in December was fun too ðð¢
<seb128> haha
<seb128> you noticed that was a mistake right? ;)
<Trevinho> seb128: yep... Well I was getting notifications but I stay away from it... Although the newly created 3g cuban network would have allowed to interact in some way (a bit expensive but in the cities - better smaller) works quite well. So I almost joined the revolution at its first day
<seb128> Trevinho, making history!
<Trevinho> as for the shorts.. Well I had a change but I prefer to fly confortable
<Trevinho> and happened something I never thought it could... After more 20 days of cuban food, when Alitalia brought me "ravioli di mare" I was about to eat the container too, as hungry i was for some quality stuff ð
<Trevinho> Imagine that in Cuba these days there's miss of flours, eggs and many basics (for locals, not much in restaurants). Quite shocking.
<andyrock> hi Trevinho
<andyrock> welcome back!
 * andyrock goes for lunch
<seb128> andyrock, enjoy!
<willcooke> wb Trevinho
<Trevinho> thanks willcooke
<andyrock> seb128: Trevinho so regarding rebasing ubuntu-dock agains dash-to-dock
<andyrock> *against
<seb128> oSoMoN, sorry to add to your pre-holidays stress level but looks like the new mdds got autosynced from Debian and changed abi number and it makes the libreoffice-l10n autopkgtest fail
<seb128> https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-disco/disco/i386/libr/libreoffice/20181219_132149_dfb21@/log.gz
<seb128> it looks for mdds-1.2 >= 1.2.3 but it looks like that got bumped to 1.4
<andyrock> I guess it's doable, the only question is who? Trevinho or me? :D
<seb128> you guys know each other well enough to sort that detail out I'm sure
<seb128> :)
<Trevinho> andyrock: I can do that, if you're busy with something elsre
<oSoMoN> seb128, ack, looking
<willcooke> Trevinho, when you do take a look at d2d, can you make sure this gets in too:  https://github.com/micheleg/dash-to-dock/issues/639#issuecomment-444826023
<gitbot> micheleg issue 639 in dash-to-dock "[request] Do not reorder window thumbnails after clicking on them" [Enhancement, Closed]
<willcooke> It's in master now by the looks of it, but just want to be sure
<Trevinho> willcooke: it looks in master so...
<Trevinho> yes
<willcooke> coolio, thanks
<oSoMoN> seb128, there's already a distro patch to build with mdds 1.4, but it's not applied when building/running autopkgtests, this should be easy enough to fix
<Trevinho> do we have an ubuntu bug for that too?
<willcooke> dont think so, lemme check
<willcooke> I will create one if not
<seb128> oSoMoN, great
 * oSoMoN wonders why autopkgtest passed in a VM near me this morning, though
<seb128> willcooke, that's why I was asking a rebase/upload btw
 * seb128 sees that willcook rrrrreeeaaallly care about that change :)
<willcooke> yeah, I thought so, but that's the thing I really care about, so just wanted to be explicit
<willcooke> ha
<willcooke> indeed
<seb128> right, you made that obvious by now :p
 * willcooke <- stuck record 
<willcooke> there will be much rejoicing
<seb128> we are going to land, don't worry, that's your holidays' present for this year :)
<willcooke> :DDDD
<seb128> oSoMoN,  the most recent mdds sync/build is from 6 hours ago
<seb128> the previous version failed autopkgtest and didn't move out of proposed
<seb128> so you probably tested before it migrated and without proposed?
<oSoMoN> I tested with -proposed
<oSoMoN> but it could very well be that I hadn't upgraded everything from proposed, only selected packages
<willcooke> Trevinho, I created a bug and assigned it to you: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock/+bug/1809129
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1809129 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu) "Window previews have inconsistent ordering" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> lol
<oSoMoN> seb128, false alarm, those autopkgtest failures are testing version 1:6.1.3-0ubuntu9
<seb128> oSoMoN, oh ok, sorry for overlooking that :/
<oSoMoN> because 6.1.4 is not finished building yet
<oSoMoN> no worries :)
<oSoMoN> that said, s390x tests failed with the correct version, looking
<oSoMoN> badpkg: Test dependencies are unsatisfiable.
<Trevinho> andyrock: https://github.com/micheleg/dash-to-dock/pull/862 should be fine, a part finalization and such, not sure why github complains though
<gitbot> micheleg issue (Pull request) 862 in dash-to-dock "ubuntu-dock: merge with upstream v64" [Open]
<andyrock> danke
<Trevinho> (ah, no complains...) it just doesn't allow rebasing, but that's fair
<Trevinho> better to merge in this case
<seb128> willcooke, replying to your trello comment here, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/402016278/ubuntu-welcome-privacy-popup.png isn't good enough for the mozilla privacy notice?
<willcooke> otp, standy by
<seb128> willcooke, that's what you get when clicking on the privacy mention from https://launchpadlibrarian.net/402015630/ubuntu-welcome-privacy.png
<seb128> bbiab, time for pre-evening erands
<oSoMoN> seb128, I can upload n-m, but I can't merge the branch, I'm not part of ~network-manager
<willcooke> seb128, ace, I didnt know that was there already!
<Laney> oSoMoN: how unfortunate
<Laney> cyphermox: can we add ~ubuntu-desktop to https://launchpad.net/~network-manager/+members please? nm is in the desktop set
<Laney> oSoMoN: if you push it to your own namespace after uploading I can push that on to the central repo
<oSoMoN> Laney, ack, I'll do that
<Laney> cyphermox: another admin also probably wouldn't go amiss
<oSoMoN> Laney, uploaded, and https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/network-manager/+git/network-manager/+ref/bionic
<Laney> thx
<Laney> oSoMoN: can haz tag?
<Laney> (well, arguably that shouldn't be pushed until it's accepted)
<oSoMoN> Laney, done, IÂ often forget to push the tags separately
<oSoMoN> Laney, correct, let's wait until it's accepted
<Laney> ok, try to remind me if you can remember ;-)
<oSoMoN> will do
<oSoMoN> huh, my changes have been pushed it seems
<Laney> branch has
 * Laney is in 'bisect dnsmasq' mode now
<willcooke> night all
<oSoMoN> good night all
<Trevinho> jbicha: for ubuntu side of gjs isntead can you please sponsor https://code.launchpad.net/~canonical-desktop-team/ubuntu/+source/gjs/+git/gjs ?
<jbicha> oh we probably don't need to branch for that. I'll take a look today. (I forgot my power cord so I'll need to go back home first)
<seb128> Trevinho, andyrock, k, I'm calling it a day, I would have like to get that ubuntu-dock update done today but looks like it's not going to happen, please try to get it out tomorrow morning if possible (unsure what you got blocked on/why it took more than the afternoon, but let's talk about it tomorrow morning, ping me when you get online)
<jbicha> Trevinho: I think that LP: #1803271 does not explain or mention the *other* changes from 1.52.1 to 1.52.5
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1803271 in gjs (Ubuntu Bionic) "[regression] Much higher CPU during some gnome-shell operations" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1803271
<jbicha> also there are a bunch of changes in 1.52.4-1 that aren't necessary for bionic
<jbicha> I recommend going back to 1.52.1-1ubuntu, merge upstream/1.52.5 and then you don't need to make any changes in debian/ (except updating the Vcs fields and add the new debian/changelog entry)
<jbicha> oh and dropping the 3 Ubuntu patches, but they aren't exactly the same as the 3 Debian patches
<jbicha> please point the Vcs fields to https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu/+source/gjs/+git/gjs
<jbicha> I suggest dropping the tilde from your version number
<Trevinho> jbicha: ok, I can just merge with that then
<Trevinho> jbicha: as per vcs fields, we use the other ones in most of places
<Trevinho> and it's more readable indeed
<Trevinho> anyway, I've updated it
<Trevinho> jbicha: so this is https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu/+source/gjs/+git/gjs/+merge/361167
<jbicha> sure, that version of the vcs is fine
<jbicha> I'll look again later tonight
<Trevinho> ta
<jbicha> Trevinho: do you think we need a new bug to track 1.52.5 or do you want to add that info to the existing bug
<Trevinho> we can do both, let me add one
<jbicha> 2 nitpick issues then: there are extra lines added to gbp.conf that aren't needed in the SRU. The patches you listed in the changelog don't match the filenames you actually removed.
<Trevinho> jbicha: fixed both
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-12-20
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<Laney> moin
<willcooke> morning
<willcooke> 5 sleeps to go
<seb128> hey Laney willcooke
<seb128> willcooke, you mean you are not going to sleep for 3 days tomorrow evening? ;)
<willcooke> LD
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> Not expecting much sleep Christmas eve
<Laney> waiting up for santa to arrive
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> how's it going?
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Oh hi Laney, willcooke and oSoMoN
<duflu> Your day always starts when mine is at full throttle
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<Laney> hey duflu oSoMoN
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, en forme ? prÃªt pour les vacances ou presque ?
<oSoMoN> hey Laney
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, presque prÃªt, encore 2-3 trucs Ã  boucler mais Ã§a devrait Ãªtre bon aujourdâhui, et toi?
<seb128> un peu pareil :)
<andyrock> good morning
<Laney> hey andyrock
 * Laney is using Banshee to rip a CD
<Laney> still a nice workflow ð
<seb128> hey andyrock!
<seb128> it has been removed from disco, that as tomboy :/
<Laney> yep
<Laney> everyone left the ecosystem
<Laney> wonder why that might have been
<Laney> still going to keep hold of this .deb :>
<oSoMoN> w00t, tomboy is not in disco any longer?
<oSoMoN> I can't live without tomboy
<oSoMoN> quick, someone make a snap for it!
<andyrock> Trevinho: is the change of uuid going to cause any problems?
<Laney> bisectbisectbisect
<jbicha> seb128: hi, can we unsubscribe the desktop team from https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/postgresql-common ?
<kenvandine> oSoMoN: a snap for tomboy might be interesting :)
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, yes, I've put it on my list of things to explore if I have spare time (ha ha!)
<kenvandine> :)
<jbicha> kenvandine: you use tomboy?
<kenvandine> jbicha: i used too
<kenvandine> for many years
<kenvandine> but i did switch to google keep a couple years ago
<kenvandine> which isn't as good as tomboy, besides the fact that i can also use it on my phone :)
<jbicha> did you ever try gnote?
<jbicha> also, there's https://wiki.gnome.org/Apps/Tomboy/tomboy-ng (tomboy devs decided to rewrite it in Pascal)
<kenvandine> jbicha: i'm sure i played with it
<kenvandine> not tomboy-ng
<kenvandine> gnote
<kenvandine> jbicha: but the only reason i moved away from tomboy (which i loved) was cloud storage
<kenvandine> i really wanted to use the same notes on my desktop and phone
<jbicha> sure
<seb128> jbicha, (done for postgresql-common)
<seb128> andyrock, Trevinho, what's the status for that ubuntu-dock update?
<andyrock> seb128 I sent you the debdiff
<andyrock> it's good to go
<jbicha> seb128: are you interested in promoting the desktop & tracker/tracker mines stuff to main? https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches-proposed.html
<jbicha> libcue libgsf tracker tracker-miners gnome-shell-extension-desktop-icons
<seb128> andyrock, k, thx, it was unclear to me if you were waiting on a reply from Trevinho on the uuid thing
<andyrock> seb128: on that was my mistake
<andyrock> he did not change the uuid
<seb128> k
<andyrock> I misread the diff ð
<seb128> jbicha, I can have a look so I'm unsure we want to unblock/land things the day just before people start being off for holidays, we might as well just wait for post holidays
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-12-21
<Laney> cyphermox: thanks!
<kenvandine> such a quiet day today :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-12-16
<RAOF> Hm. 1255MB RSS seems a little excessive for the gnome-shell process.
<duflu> RAOF: Yeah. ubuntu-bug gnome-shell
<RAOF> duflu: Enjoy https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1856516
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1856516 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Excessive memory usage in Wayland session" [Undecided,New]
<duflu> I will do so after lunch, thanks
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers, happy Monday!
<jibel> Salut oSoMoN and everyone
<jibel> last week before holidays \o/
<oSoMoN> salut jibel
<oSoMoN> yay, looking forward to some rest
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN and jibel
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<duflu> RAOF: You just reminded me how long it's been since I memory-profiled
<duflu> Sorry I have no advice right now
<RAOF> Heh
<RAOF> Fair enough!
<seb128> goood morning desktopers
<duflu> Morning seb128
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you? had a good w.e?
<duflu> seb128, crazy with Christmas and birthday prep. You?
<duflu> I spent so long testing flicker-free boot last cycle that I didn't notice the plymouth theme had changed to match the noise of the gnome-shell theme. It's nice
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> I'm doing good, pre-holidays weeks are buuussssyyy here as well though!
<duflu> Just not the grub theme yet
<duflu> Annoyingly in many/most cases Plymouth hardly shows. It's the grub theme (kernel booting) that uses the most time
<marcustomlinson> morning duflu oSoMoN jibel RAOF and seb128
<duflu> Hi marcustomlinson
<seb128> hey marcustomlinson, how are you? had a good w.e?
<Laney> hello there
<Wimpress> Morning o/
<marcustomlinson> hey Laney
<marcustomlinson> and Wimpress
<marcustomlinson> seb128: doing good thanks :)
<Wimpress> Everyone well?
<seb128> hey Laney, Wimpress, how is the u.k today?
<Wimpress> Grey. Very grey today.
<oSoMoN> good morning seb128, marcustomlinson, Laney, Wimpress
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, comment va ? t'as passÃ© un bon w.e?
<oSoMoN> trÃ¨s bien, mais on ne sâest pas posÃ©s une seule seconde, et encore plein de trucs Ã  prÃ©parer avant les vacances
<Laney> hi marcustomlinson seb128 oSoMoN Wimpress
<duflu> Morning Laney and Wimpress
<Laney> yo duflu
<seb128> oSoMoN, c'est un peu pareil ici  :-)
<Laney> seb128: it looks ok from here just about
<Laney> you well?
<seb128> I'm good! had a nice w.e, we had dinner with friends on saturday and I played some tennis yesterday
<Laney> :>
<seb128> and I managed to squeeze some presents shopping in between things!
 * seb128 is late on that
<Laney> nice
<Laney> I have a few of those now too
<Laney> not enough though, going to be next weekend /o\
<ricotz> good morning desktopers!
<oSoMoN> good morning ricotz
<seb128> hey ricotz, how are you?
<ricotz> oSoMoN, seb128, hey
<marcustomlinson> hey ricotz
<ricotz> marcustomlinson, hi
<ricotz> oSoMoN, mozilla requiring -std=gnu++17 is bad news for xenial
<oSoMoN> yes
<ricotz> hmm, shipping a copy of a sufficient libstdc++6 in /usr/lib/firefox ?
<ricotz> welcome to windows' dll-hell
<ricotz> aka having gcc-mozilla 8.3.0 and borrow it from there
<jamesh> if only we had a system to let an app to run against a different set of shared libraries to those on the host system
<seb128> ricotz, you might want to verify the vala/19.10 SRU so it goes to updates?
<ricotz> seb128, aah, right
<ricotz> mdeslaur, hi, looks like your mysql-5.7 upload in bionic has a regression and libmysqlclient-dev requires a dep on libssl-dev too
<ricotz> this likely affects all security upload of mysql-5.7 5.7.28
<mdeslaur> ricotz: I'm aware of the missing dep, I'll add it in the next update...what's the regression?
<ricotz> mdeslaur, libreoffice doesn't build due to underlinking without an explicit dep on libssl-dev
<mdeslaur> ricotz: oh, ok, yeah, I'm aware of that on
<mdeslaur> one
<ricotz> meaning the required libraries are missing to properly link
<ricotz> mdeslaur, ok
<mdeslaur> ricotz: I plan on fixing that with the next mysql update
<ricotz> mdeslaur, ack
<mdeslaur> next oracle security alert is in january
<seb128> Laney, unsure if that's on your list but the glib SRUs (bionic & eoan) seem blocked on autopkgtests problems, I retried some that looked flacky and worked but eoan/i386 is failing which looks like might be a real problem/worth investigating
<seb128> Laney, should I create a trello card for that maybe?
<seb128> marcustomlinson, since I saw you ping about your libreoffice SRU, is it likely to be impacted by ^ ?
<seb128> (if so maybe add a build-depends on libssl-dev temporary as workaround)
<marcustomlinson> seb128: autopkgtests all passed against my ppa
<marcustomlinson> for all arches
<seb128> marcustomlinson, k, as I said I was just mentioning it in case
<marcustomlinson> seb128: sure thanks for the headsup :)
<seb128> marcustomlinson, np!
<ricotz> disco and later should not be affected
<seb128> great
<ricotz> mysql-8.0 is packaged correctly
<Laney> seb128: I should look at eoan, the rest are for Gunnar
<seb128> Laney, ack, thx
<hellsworth> good morning everyone!
<hellsworth> hope yall had a good weekend :)
<marcustomlinson> hey hellsworth
<hellsworth> o/
<oSoMoN> hey hellsworth
<hellsworth> hi!
<seb128> hey hellsworth, did you have a good w.e?
<hellsworth> yep! it was a lot of fun! the birthday party was perfect :)
<seb128> excellent :-)
<seb128> Wimpress, jibel, Laney, do you know if we have any infra/tests still relying on autopilot-gtk/legacy? in context of bug #1856574
<ubot5> bug 1856574 in python-testtools (Ubuntu) "removal of various autopilot packages" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1856574
<Laney> no sorry, I don't now :(
<Laney> know
<jibel> seb128, ubiquity tests use python3-autopilot which requires libautopilot-gtk
<jibel> seb128, I'm looking how to drop python2 deps from libautopilot-gtk
<jibel> seb128, but package tests are failing ATM
<jibel> seb128, once this is fixed I think we can completely drop the python2 version of autopilot from the archive
<seb128> jibel, k, good to know, I've added a trello card so we don't forget about it, might be worth adding a comment on the bug as well with some details
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-12-17
<jibel> morning all
<duflu> Hi jibel
<duflu> If you were 15 minutes earlier it would have also been morning in Australia
<jibel> Hey duflu, I could have been earlier actually, i'm up since 4:30. far too early :(
<jibel> good thing is that i'll end my day early afternoon
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<jibel> bonjour oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut jibel
<seb128> gooood morning desktopers!
<jibel> salut seb128, Ã§a va?
<seb128> lut jibel, ouais, et toi ?
<jibel> seb128, dÃ©marrÃ© beaucoup trop tÃ´t Ã  mon goÃ»t ce matin mais Ã§a va
<seb128> Ã  quelle heure ?
<duflu> Morning seb128
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you today?
<duflu> Also see ya.. :)
<duflu> Good, you?
<seb128> I'm good
<seb128> duflu, have fun!
<duflu> Will try ;)
<jibel> seb128, rÃ©veillÃ© Ã  4:30, dÃ©marrage Ã  5:00 pour m'occuper l'esprit
<seb128> jibel, outch, en effet c'est tÃ´t :-(
<jibel> seb128, at least autopilot-gtk is fixed
<jibel> seb128, I'll need a sponsor
<seb128> le positif c'est que t'as dÃ©jÃ  fait une demie journÃ©e de travail :)
<seb128> jibel, I can sponsor
<jibel> even the tests are passing. I'm wondering how the ever passed during the build. dbus was not started
<seb128> jamesh, if you didn't IRC block me yet for nagging you every week about that, weekly summary reminder :-)
<seb128> hum, that looks weird indeed
<jibel> well, latest release was 15.10 so maybe the behaviour was different by then
<jibel> stable quality software requires no maintenance ;)
<marcustomlinson> hey seb128 and jibel
<seb128> hey marcustomlinson, how is it going?
<marcustomlinson> seb128: good thanks. you?
<seb128> I'm good thx
<oSoMoN> salut seb128 , good morning marcustomlinson
<marcustomlinson> hey oSoMoN
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, how are you? how was the talk yesterday?
<oSoMoN> seb128, I'm tired but good. The talk went well, there weren't many attendees (a dozen), but they asked lots of questions afterwards, and a couple of them expressed interest in snapping their apps
<oSoMoN> and then we had beers :)
<seb128> oSoMoN, nice!
<marcustomlinson> oSoMoN: nice :) do you have slides to share?
<lan3y> interesting
<Wimpress> Morning o/
<marcustomlinson> hey Wimpress
<seb128> k, looks like we can all go in holidays, doko DoSed the infra for the week probably...
<marcustomlinson> seb128: bye! have a happy christmas!
<marcustomlinson> XD
<seb128> indeed, you too!
<seb128> would be nice to have NMU support in launchpad
<seb128> also would be nice to have people consider the impact on the archive/others before that kind of giant stack of uploads
<seb128> anyway, let's not get into ranting mood today :-)
<Wimpress> Hi desktoppers.
<marcustomlinson> hi
<oSoMoN> hey Wimpress
<Wimpress> Just finishing up another meeting. Be with you in a few mins.
<kenvandine> hey hey hey
<hellsworth> good morning everyone
<oSoMoN> good morning hellsworth
<hellsworth> hi oSoMoN. hope your tuesday is going well :)
<seb128> hey hellsworth, how are you?
<hellsworth> i'm really tired but slowly waking up
<seb128> coffee!
<hellsworth> most definitely
<Trevinho> the kid played the kid? :)
<Wimpress> Right, shall we start?
<seb128> _o/
<seb128> oh, a Trevinho!
<seb128> Trevinho, bunjourno, long time not seen on IRC :-)
 * Trevinho is always hidden in his hole!
<marcustomlinson> a wild Trevinho appears
<seb128> I noticed
<Wimpress> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2019-12-17
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Dec 17 14:34:27 2019 UTC.  The chair is Wimpress. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Thanksgiving Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2019-12-17 | Current topic:
<seb128> that's the effect of winter on you? ;-)
<Wimpress> Roll call:  didrocks (out), duflu, hellsworth, jamesh, jibel, kenvandine, Laney, marcustomlinson, oSoMoN, seb128 , tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell
<seb128> _o/
<marcustomlinson> \o
<Trevinho> _/
<kenvandine> hey
<Laney> sup
<oSoMoN> o/
<hellsworth> \o
<Wimpress> #topic rls-bb-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Thanksgiving Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2019-12-17 | Current topic: rls-bb-bugs
<Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<Wimpress> This one is still unassigned http://launchpad.net/bugs/1856054
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1856054 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "pulseaudio now depends on libsnapd-glib1 which recommends snapd" [High,Confirmed]
<marcustomlinson> we're tracking this as https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/snapd-glib/+bug/1856196
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1856196 in snapd-glib (Ubuntu Eoan) "Lower the snapd recommends to a suggests" [High,Fix committed]
<marcustomlinson> right?
<marcustomlinson> in any case feels like a -1 from me
<Laney> that bug should be won't fixed with a reference to the other one
<seb128> right
<Laney> when that is done it's just someone ranting about a library
<hellsworth> should the second bug be moved to a different release to get actually addressed?
<hellsworth> well fix committed effectively across teh board
<seb128> it's already targetting the different series it needs
<hellsworth> right
<hellsworth> thanks
<Wimpress> Right, so I shjall close #1856054
<seb128> wontfix it yeah
<Wimpress> Done.
<Wimpress> Move on to tracking bugs?
<seb128> yes
<Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<kenvandine> bug 1794478
<ubot5> bug 1794478 in network-manager (Ubuntu Bionic) "Automatic ipv4 not assigned to bond interface is manual ipv6 is assigned to it" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1794478
<Wimpress> There's a few unassisnged for desktop.
<Laney> Till unassigned a bunch of bugs from himself
<hellsworth> there are so many unassigned bugs in the unknown section..
<oSoMoN> I just talked to slashd about that specific one, and he said his team is going to take care of it, as it's something a client cares about
<Wimpress> SHould we assign it to slahd then?
<kenvandine> great
<oSoMoN> IÂ don't know, I'd let him do that, it's fine to leave it unassigned until then, no?
<oSoMoN> I'll ping him to ask
<Wimpress> OK
<Wimpress> http://launchpad.net/bugs/942856
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 942856 in network-manager (Ubuntu Bionic) "NetworkManager does not support AES-encrypted private keys for WPA 802.1x authentication" [Medium,In progress]
<seb128> they are all in the same bucket of 'bionic n-m SRU needs someone to care about it if we want to see it happening'
<seb128> I'm unsure we are going to resolve that today...
<Wimpress> seb128 Laney kenvandine I think we need to review these in a separate call.
<seb128> or we just rls-bb-notfixing those for now to reflect we don't have maintainer and can't take on those
<Laney> ok
<seb128> that wfm
<Wimpress> Let's just park the n-m unassigfned bugs for now.
<seb128> +1
<kenvandine> +1
<Laney> Next meeting we should deal with them either way if they are still there
<Wimpress> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs/+bug/1637988
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1637988 in gvfs (Ubuntu Cosmic) "Enable the nfs backend" [Wishlist,Fix committed]
<Laney> Don't want them to be hanging around eternally
<seb128> indeed
<Wimpress> Agreed.
<seb128> Wimpress, we usually skop the fix commited ones
<seb128> that gvfs is another tricky situation
<seb128> and not new
<Laney> looks like fix committed is wrong there though, is it?
<seb128> basically libnfs is in universe in bionic/cosmic and has been promoted since
<seb128> Laney, yes, the SRU got deleted
<Laney> nod
<seb128> I don't have the energy to deal with that one atm though
<seb128> but we should probably either wontfix or put back to triaged
<seb128> basically security team would like to see a libnfs update if we want to retro-promote
<seb128> but that comes with a soname change
<seb128> there was some customer requests behind though
<seb128> maybe another one to discuss in the same other meeting...
<Laney> can't be that important if it idled for 7 months
 * Laney is on team won't fix ;-)
<seb128> right
<seb128> well, maybe we lost a customer on the way or disapponted one :-(
<Wimpress> I am OK with won't fix for bionic.
<seb128> Wimpress, go for it then
<seb128> if we wontfix bionic we can wontfix cosmic as well for sure
<Laney> lol cosmic
<seb128> well in any case cosmic is wontfix at this point
<seb128> :)
<Laney> :D
<Wimpress> Done.
<Wimpress> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libssh/+bug/1847514
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1847514 in libssh (Ubuntu Bionic) "libssh-0.8 is detected as 0.7" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Wimpress> Why is libssh in the desktop-packages?
<Laney> remmina it looks like
 * Wimpress blames Trevinho ;-)
<Wimpress> I don't think this is rl critical for the desktop.
<seb128> it looks like a real problem but no obvious solution and probably not rls material imho
<seb128> I vote rls-bb-notfixing
<Wimpress> +1
<Laney> indeed
<hellsworth> agreed
<Wimpress> Done
<Laney> you need to delete the bionic line fwiw
 * Trevinho not sure is faulty for libssh being there.
<Laney> for ones that already got nominated
<Wimpress> ANd done.
<Wimpress> Move on to Disco?
<seb128> +1
<Wimpress> #topic rls-dd-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Thanksgiving Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2019-12-17 | Current topic: rls-dd-bugs
<Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<Wimpress> Looks good.
<Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<Wimpress> An n-m bug there we will sort out another time.
<seb128> +1
<Wimpress> Other than that looks good.
<Wimpress> Time for Eoan?
<seb128> yes
<Wimpress> #topic rls-ee-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Thanksgiving Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2019-12-17 | Current topic: rls-ee-bugs
<Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ee-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<Wimpress> Looks good.
<Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ee-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<Wimpress> I'll skip over the n-m unassigned bug
<Wimpress> http://launchpad.net/bugs/1845801
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1845801 in gdm3 (Ubuntu) "[nvidia] Automatic login fails and then all subsequent logins fail. Killing gnome-session-binary fixes it, or just not using automatic login." [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> Laney, is that similar to your recent problems/debugging?
<seb128> Wimpress, we should probably just assign the other lines to tseliot there
<Laney> doubt it
<Laney> that's the same bug we have been skipping for weeks
<seb128> right, I'm assigning to tseliot now
<Laney> cool
<Wimpress> I've assigned Alberto to gnome-session since he assigned himself to that for Eoan.
<Wimpress> But, what about gnome-shell?
<seb128> I did the same
<seb128> one person does the investigation
<Wimpress> OK.
<seb128> we can then reassign later if required
<Wimpress> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-restricted-modules/+bug/1856407
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1856407 in linux-restricted-modules (Ubuntu Eoan) "nvidia-435 is in eoan, linux-restricted-modules only builds against 430, ubiquity gives me the self-signed modules experience instead of using the Canonical-signed modules" [High,In progress]
<tseliot> Wimpress, seb128 what am I supposed to do with that, exactly? Disable the splash with NVIDIA?
<seb128> tseliot, I don't know, I don't understand the issue enough to tell. But it seems to be something quite some user complain about so we need to dig at the bottom of it
<seb128> Wimpress, unsure what is needed for ubuntu-drivers-common in that one but looks like Seth is on it
<seb128> maybe assign to him with a comment saying to reassign back/talk to us if there is work needed from our side?
<Wimpress> OK
<tseliot> I can't really reproduce the problem here
<tseliot> and I think that blacklisting nvidia, and have it default to the text splash might be a little heavy handed
<seb128> k, we need to have a look/discuss options
<seb128> but probably not now, we still have some topics to cover and less than 15min to the next meeting for some of us
<Wimpress> #topic rls-ff-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Thanksgiving Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2019-12-17 | Current topic: rls-ff-bugs
<Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ff-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<Wimpress> Looks good.
<Wimpress> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ff-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<Wimpress> n-m again. SKip that for now.
<Wimpress> Other than that, looks good.
<Wimpress> #topic update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Thanksgiving Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2019-12-17 | Current topic: update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<seb128> incoming actually should be empty, those are assigned, I'm untagging them
<Wimpress> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<Wimpress> Nice work team! Excuses is looking in good shape for desktop.
<seb128> \o/
<marcustomlinson> wow
<marcustomlinson> looks good
<seb128> one is a MIR waiting for security review, one is waiting for steve to do i386 restoring of binaries
<hellsworth> hopefully we'll get the libmail-dkim-perl sorted out this week too
<seb128> basically our only real item is the duplicity build failure
<seb128> the 2 bottoms ones built now so they should go away
<Wimpress> Should we create a Trello card for duplicity?
<Laney> someone needs to fix it, so ... probably
<Wimpress> seb128: Please, can you create card for duplicity.
<Wimpress> ANyone fancy it?
<seb128> I can (if we don't have it yet)
<seb128> I'm working on it
<hellsworth> i'll take a look at duplicity
<seb128> hellsworth, oh, if you want that would be welcome :)
<Wimpress> Thanks hellsworth
<hellsworth> will you please create the card and add me to it?
<hellsworth> or i can'
<hellsworth> there will be a card and it will be looked at :)
<seb128> hellsworth, https://bugs.launchpad.net/duplicity/+bug/1853809 was used for some of that but got closed
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1853809 in Duplicity "Tests fail with python 3.8 due to deprecation warnings" [High,Fix released]
<Wimpress> Great.
<hellsworth> ok thanks seb128
<hellsworth> i'll holler if i get stuck
<seb128> hellsworth, I will card it and add you
<hellsworth> ty
<seb128> thanks to you!
<Wimpress> Time for AOB?
<seb128> hellsworth, ah, we have one already, adding you to https://trello.com/c/BwzB6AHv/12-duplicity-focal-ftbfs
<Wimpress> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Thanksgiving Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2019-12-17 | Current topic: AOB
<Wimpress> I need coffee before the next call.
<Wimpress> Nothing more from me.
<Trevinho> I might need some comments on https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/3v1n0/libfprint-tod-example-driver
<seb128> nothing from me either
<Trevinho> so feel free to check that
<Trevinho> (and dependent lib)
<seb128> Trevinho, k, what does "tod" mean?
<Trevinho> TOuch Driver... I didn't like just "td" xD
<seb128> Wimpress, we should aim at making the meeting go a bit faster in the futur if we can, it used to fit in an half hour, more time for coffee :-)
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: I think this fell out of your radar. Please could you comment: https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=128803
<ubot5> bugs.documentfoundation.org bug 128803 in Calc "Copy / pasting cell in Calc sometimes pastes as an image" [Normal,New]
<Wimpress> seb128: OK.
<Wimpress> All done?
<seb128> I think so
<Wimpress> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Thanksgiving Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Dec 17 15:28:03 2019 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2019/ubuntu-desktop.2019-12-17-14.34.moin.txt
<marcustomlinson> thx
<seb128> thanks team!
<Wimpress> Thanks desktoppers
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: yes, I've to get into that asap
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: I'm just afraid that the LO guys are brushing it off thinking it's entirely a mutter issue
<marcustomlinson> and I don't know enough to explain that it isn't
<Trevinho> Yeah, I've to check through the things again, but I will
<marcustomlinson> thanks Trevinho!
<jibel> I'd need a sponsor for autopilot-gtk 1.6. Branch and debdiff attached to bug 1856574
<ubot5> bug 1856574 in python-testtools (Ubuntu) "removal of various autopilot packages" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1856574
<seb128> jibel, I uploaded now but the vcs was missing an archive upload, I merged that in and sent you the patch (I can't push to the git)
<jibel> seb128, thanks
<seb128> np! thank you for doing the actual work :)
<jibel> seb128, ah that's fine, I re-fixed it
<Laney> jibel: in the new ubiquity enhanced design, do you know why encryption is under advanced features? (i know it's on the design like that, wondering if you know why it is)
<Laney> s/enhanced/focal/ ;-)
<Laney> or mpt ^-
<mpt> Laney, it wasnât my first choice, but it was something they could implement in time that showed the dependency between encryption and LVM
<Laney> It's just that I'm a bit concerned about hiding full disk encryption like that
<mpt> Laney, hmm, is the âEncrypt the new Ubuntu installationâ¦â checkbox shown in <https://docs.google.com/document/d/1bZ4yQIVgGaUGSYu3qiUHnQt3ieBZoqunP_DcleHCr3I/preview#bookmark=id.wht5l3rbb5bm> no longer present?
<jibel> we can revisit that this cycle but it was very hard to go against the way partman expects things to happen when you go forward and backward between several disk setup steps.
<Laney> mpt: hmm, no, it looks like this currently: https://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/focalubi.png
<jibel> mpt, the design implemented is from page 12 to 16 of the spec
<jibel> with encryption in the advanced dialog
<mpt> jibel, sure, understood, I didnât realise that meant getting rid of the non-LVM encryption
<jibel> I don't remember we ever had non lvm encryption
<mpt> It was added to the installer in Ubuntu 12.10
<mpt> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FullDiskEncryptionHowto
<jibel> hm, I'll have to reinstall 12.10 then. But before the change there was only lvm and lvm+encryption not encrpytion without lvm
<jibel> I'll search when it disappeared and why
<mpt> I was under the impression that the reason you used the phrase âthe new Ubuntu installationâ so often in your initial UI was that you were copying the text of that checkbox
<Laney> I think it did require you to install on LVM, but it wasn't presented as a sub-item
<mpt> Hmm, the help page doesnât mention LVM â¦ Maybe it did use LVM and I was oblivious
<hellsworth> i need to pop down to the post office to mail all the things but i'll be back
<hellsworth> i'll be afk for maybe an hour (depending on the line)
<marcustomlinson> alright I'm out. g'night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-12-18
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<jibel> hi oSoMoN, duflu and everyone
<duflu> jamesh, is that problematic version 7.5 (reverted from updates to proposed) going to get released again in 7.6?
<duflu> The code hasn't changed
<duflu> https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-audio-dev/pulseaudio/log/?h=ubuntu-bionic
<duflu> Morning jibel
<jamesh> duflu: it will migrate back to updates with the new snapd-glib
<duflu> jamesh, good then :)
<jamesh> no need for a new release
<duflu> I was worried about having to rewrite the history of 7.6 before it goes out
<jamesh> I don't think anyone has discovered any problems with the policy module: it was just the dependency issue with libsnapd-glib1 pulling in snapd
<duflu> ð
<oSoMoN> salut jibel
<oSoMoN> hey jamesh
<marcustomlinson> duflu: did you determine that libreoffice was actually at fault here? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/1856702
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1856702 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "LibreOffice window behind Firefox was flickering when Firefox asked me for a passsword to access the CUPS logs." [Undecided,New]
<marcustomlinson> sounded more like a general rendering issue than specifically libreoffice. curious if you knew something more about it
<duflu> marcustomlinson, no just most likely LO if other apps are unaffected
<duflu> Back later...
<marcustomlinson> morning desktoppers
<duflu> Oh hi marcustomlinson :)
<marcustomlinson> I'm really awake now ;)
<duflu> marcustomlinson, I tidied up bug 1856702 for you.
<ubot5> bug 1856702 in mutter (Ubuntu) "LibreOffice window behind Firefox was flickering when Firefox asked me for a passsword to access the CUPS logs." [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1856702
<marcustomlinson> oh excellent thanks!
<Laney> o/
<duflu>                       \o
<oSoMoN> good morning marcustomlinson, Laney
<popey> Good morning
<popey> if gnome-shell is consuming 3.0g RES in top, should I be concerned?
<popey> I mean, i have 32GB RAM, but this seems excessive
<duflu> Morning popey, yes gigabytes is a concern but only if it is RES or RSS
<duflu> We have bug 1856516 about that just this week
<ubot5> bug 1856516 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Excessive memory usage in Wayland session" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1856516
<popey> last time this happened you asked me to gather vmm data
<popey> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/HKWmz7gKhx/
<popey> I'm on x
<popey> i have a cronjob I just started which gathers the data you asked for in another bug report
<duflu> popey that history shows the RSS at 3.2GB the whole time. Thanks, but I am not sure we need more info other than that proof of a bug. Maybe just ensure you don't have any non-Ubuntu extensions
<popey> is there a way to list my active extensions easily?
<duflu> I'm not sure if you want an *accurate* list. I rely on the automatic attachments to peoples' bug reports
<duflu> popey, also they have to be uninstalled. Anything installed but inactive can still hurt
<duflu> Because bugs
<popey> hm, okay. I don't actually think I have any, but i cant be 100% certain
<popey> indeed
<popey> I'll file a dummy bug in ubuntu-bug against gnome-shell and throw it away, that'll gather it?
<duflu> popey, yes I was just about to ask for that. It's more valid than "dummy" :)
<popey> hah
<popey> ok, while I do that, check this out. another bug I dunno if it has been filed...
<popey> https://youtu.be/869e9YwW0vw
<duflu> Whoa, youtube within youtube. Yeah I am looking at stutters/freezes again now
<duflu> Unless strace or something in the journalctl -f shows a possible cause then I am not sure what to suggest right now
<popey> ok
<duflu> IO% is an interesting angle though
<duflu> Got to run
<JanC> gnome-shell always keeps growing the longer you run it, unfortunately
<popey> I tend to be averse to rebooting, I suspend my laptop all the time and leave it running all day and night often.
<popey> Which I don't think is unreasonable behaviour :)
<JanC> you can always try restarting gnome-shell, that should get you some memory back
<popey> Good point.
<JanC> gnome-shell is at 4.7 GiB here now, so I guess I should restart it too...  :P
<JanC> (desktop that is running pretty much 24/7)
<JanC> with an uptime of a couple of weeks...
<popey> do you have a bunch of extensions out of interest?
<JanC> I have some, but I tested for a couple weeks 1 or 2 releases ago where I only had the default ones, and it had the same issues
<JanC> compiz also had similar issues, of course...
<RikMills> I seem to recall a bug about ubiquity detecting hardware stage hanging for a long while with 100% CPU? Does anyway have a link?
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers
<oSoMoN> good morning hellsworth
<hellsworth> hi!
<hellsworth> i hope your day is going well :)
<oSoMoN> hellsworth, it is, thanks! how are you?
<hellsworth> oh i'm great thanks!
<marcustomlinson> jdstrand: hey, I'm new to this sort of issue, is there something I need to do for this? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/1849680
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1849680 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "audit spam in dmesg (libreoffice)" [Undecided,New]
<jdstrand> marcustomlinson: I've not looked at the packaging much before just now, but it looks like debian/rules references dh_apparmor and there is setup via sysui/desktop/share/apparmor.sh. the basic process would be to patch to add accesses to the profiles. best practice would be to attach that to the bug and a member of the security team can review it
<marcustomlinson> okidokes
<marcustomlinson> thanks
<jdstrand> marcustomlinson: if you need help with the rules, that's fine too
<jdstrand> marcustomlinson: /sys/fs/cgroup/{,**} r, would be one
<jdstrand> marcustomlinson: using the dri-common abstraction would be another
<jdstrand> marcustomlinson: using the mesa abstraction for the mesa_shader_cache write is probably fine
<jdstrand> marcustomlinson: you can test that the profile compiles with 'apparmor_parser -QTK profile' (no root needed) and can load into the kernel with 'apparmor_parser -r profile' (you probably knew that :)
<jdstrand> marcustomlinson: @{PROC]/@{pid}/cgroup r,
<jdstrand> marcustomlinson: @{PROC]/@{pid}/mountinfo r,
<jdstrand> marcustomlinson: I think that all together that'll get rid of a lot of noise
<marcustomlinson> jdstrand: that helps a lot thanks!
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-12-19
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<jibel> bonjour duflu and oSoMoN
<duflu> Hi jibel
<oSoMoN> salut jibel
<Laney> ho de ho
<oSoMoN> hey Laney
<Laney> hey oSoMoN
<seb128> gggoood morning desktopers
 * Laney nods seb128 
<Trevinho> One more hackfest...
<Trevinho> https://wiki.gnome.org/Hackfests/ShellExtensions2020
<seb128> Trevinho, hey Marco! someone was also mentioning a settings one yesterday I think, unsure if that's real though
<seb128> nice to see a snap/flatpak on the list with Canonical suggesting it :-)
<Trevinho> Yeah, nice indeed
<Trevinho> seb128: good, nice to see Hackfests coming.
<Laney> mobile user spotted!
<jibel> default desktop snap packages are reinstalled during upgrade to focal. Is it really what we want to do?
<jibel> removing them before the upgrade makes the upgrader crash. I'm looking for the right way to fix this.
<Laney> like removed and installed?
<jibel> yeah, removed manually from eoan then upgrade to focal
<Laney> no wait
<Laney> do you mean: all of the snaps are removed and installed again
<Laney> or: if I remove a snap, it is put back onto my system
<jibel> I removed them from eoan, upgraded to focal and they are reinstalled by the upgrader.
<Laney> indeed, sounds buggy
<Laney> jibel: looks like this function needs to check if the .deb was installed before installing the snap? https://git.launchpad.net/ubuntu-release-upgrader/tree/DistUpgrade/DistUpgradeQuirks.py#n515
<Laney> or in _prepare_snap_replacement_data
<Laney> neat, it does have code to refresh to the stable/ubuntu-foo channel for the new series, was expecting that to be missing
<jibel> Laney, yes, I'll fix it with the other crash
<Laney> coolio
<Laney> we need to make this support snap2deb too btw, not sure if that interests you at the same time :-)
<jibel> just fixing automated tests ATM
<Laney> okey
<seb128> Laney, do you know offhand if SRU builds with proposed enabled?
<Laney> yes they do
<seb128> Trevinho, ^ so yeah, backport that vala fix
<seb128> ricotz isnt around to complain about the fact that the vala bionic SRU creates build issue for other components
<seb128> I will comment on the bug though
<Trevinho> seb128: iirc I enabled it in my schroot as for this, probably Laney was also the one pushing me to do it
<Laney> what are you on about
<seb128> Laney, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vala/0.40.17-0ubuntu1 makes gnome-calculator trigger https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-calculator/merge_requests/17
<seb128> rather the error fixed by that mr
<seb128> Trevinho notices while testing a fix for a regression in his currently gnome-calculator/bionic SRU
<Laney> I see
<seb128> Laney, seems like the glib update makes glib-networking autopkgtests fail (mentioning since I happened to look at the report and those don't trigger notifications, sorry for the noise if you were already aware)
<Laney> yeah I saw thanks, going to look into it
<jibel> I get this when I git push to LP
<jibel> $ git push  lp:~jibel/ubuntu-release-upgrader
<jibel> fatal: remote error: Path translation timed out.
<jibel> has anyone seen this or am I doing something wrong here?
<Laney> jibel: think there's some kind of LP bug regarding that, perhaps try #launchpad
<jibel> Laney, that was it, cjwatson fixed it.
<Laney> cool
<hellsworth> good morning folks!
<jibel> hi hellsworth
<hellsworth> hi jibel!
<Laney> hey hellsworth
<Laney> what's going on g
<hellsworth> oh not much. getting into the thick of a cold i think
<hellsworth> jsut gotta power through today and tomorrow :)
<Laney> sux
<hellsworth> eh it could be worse
<hellsworth> looking forward to the break
<seb128> kenvandine, do you think you could squeeze in backporting the commit mentioned on bug #1856927 to focal today if you have some free slot? it makes totem segfault on start on fiscal, I'm away from my main desktop until holidays and managed to screw my key on the laptop :/
<ubot5> bug 1856927 in grilo-plugins (Ubuntu) "totem crashed with SIGSEGV in build_flavored_key() from insert_key_mapping()" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1856927
<kenvandine> seb128: i can try
<kenvandine> got several things scheduled for this afternoon
<seb128> kenvandine, thx, if you don't have time don't worry that can wait for after holidays
<kenvandine> i can probably get to it in the morning
<seb128> thx
<gQuigs> does anyone have a good description of what cursors are for X11 apps (from xrestop for example) - I'm guessing it's an allocation to do transitions of some kind with the mouse cursor..
<gQuigs> to show up differently over different kinds of backgrounds, like over text vs other things..
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, aday was asking about https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-control-center/issues/681 - is that something you've been involved in?
<robert_ancell> I'm assuming willcooke is probably not going to follow that up at the moment :)
<kenvandine> nope :)
<kenvandine> i haven't been involved
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, what's the simplest way to build a GTK snap these days? I want to update https://github.com/robert-ancell/multipass-gui to be able to build.
<hellsworth> does the snap not currently build?
<hellsworth> oh it's missing the desktop-gtk3 section or you can use the gnome-3-28 extension
<hellsworth> if you'd like, i can take a go at tryig to make it build..
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, please do :)
<hellsworth> okey dokey
<robert_ancell> I think it relied on the method of the day, which I'm guessing is no longer applicable.
<hellsworth> robert_ancell: why is it classic confinement?
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, because it has to run the 'multipass' command
<hellsworth> hmm ok so it needs to be classically confined
<hellsworth> i wonder why the gnome-3-28 extension doesn't support classic confinement
<robert_ancell> This is not a project that is being worked on, but want it fixed because others are still using it (https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/multipass-gui/8067/14) and just don't want to leave bad examples around
<hellsworth> fair enough
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, I also have a not work related project that I want to snap (https://github.com/robert-ancell/microflash). I had a go back when I made it, but the need to access USB devices was tricky. I really wanted it to be strictly confined rather than classic. I ended up making a Snap like PPA, but it's not as nice. Would love some advice on if that's do-able these days.
<robert_ancell> Ah, now I remember. The big issue is registering a MIME type.
<robert_ancell> That's kind of essential to make it work.
<hellsworth> i have not yet dealt with registering MIME types in snaps
<hellsworth> kenvandine: what was the thought behind extensions only supporting strict and devmode confinement?
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, should you be looking for a simple example to try... :) :) :)
<hellsworth> hint taken robert_ancell :)
<robert_ancell> Was I that subtle??
<hellsworth> robert_ancell: it looks like https://bugs.launchpad.net/snapd/+bug/1849094 is still open and I don't see a workaround
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1849094 in snapd "Feature request: allow snaps to register new mime types" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<robert_ancell> subscribed.
<hellsworth> robert_ancell: https://github.com/robert-ancell/multipass-gui/pull/5
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, thanks!
<hellsworth> my pleasure
<kenvandine> hellsworth: can't really work with classic
<hellsworth> but why not
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, "Could not find a required package in 'build-packages': python3-distutils"
<hellsworth> oh shoot
<hellsworth> i have a hacked verison of snapcraft installed so let me try agian with the stable snapcraft :)
<hellsworth> robert_ancell: did you see that when trying to build?
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, came out of the CI build
<robert_ancell> https://travis-ci.org/robert-ancell/multipass-gui/builds/627437203 if you can see that
<hellsworth> yep thanks
<hellsworth> i'm building it now as in the pr, but with the stable snapcraft
<hellsworth> if it builds and runs fine here without adding python3-distutils, then i guess that's something that docker needs?
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, yeah, I wasn't sure where that error was coming from. Snapcraft is the only part of the source that has 'build-packages', so I would have thought it was required for that.
<hellsworth> yeah
<hellsworth> it built ok over here with teh stable snapcraft
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, actually, I'm using the ubuntudesktop/gnome-3-26-1604 docker image - kenvandine is that no longer appropriate?
<robert_ancell> I guess it should be an 18.04 image.
<kenvandine> Not with core18
<hellsworth> well robert_ancell we could just add python3-distutils to the build section and see if that appeases the docker build?
<hellsworth> it shouldn't affect the final snap anyways
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, I'm just thinking if it's not actually required in the snap then it should be done the level above, i.e. either use a newer image of apt install it.
<robert_ancell> I'll try switching to https://hub.docker.com/r/ubuntudesktop/gnome-3-28-1804
<robert_ancell> The original issue was actually that it was built against a too old version of GTK for some desktop, so this is probably the right thing to do anyway.
<robert_ancell> Oh wait, snapcraft is going to build inside a VM isn't it? So the docker image is not so important. So many layers...
<hellsworth> can you setup travis to use multipass?
<robert_ancell> I guess if you install multipass inside the docker image then snapcraft would use it?
<robert_ancell> It looks like it's being built locally, but working now.
<robert_ancell> Success!
<hellsworth> woo hoo! so just switching your docker did the trick?
<robert_ancell> yes
<hellsworth> hot dog!
<robert_ancell> Hmm, it's not showing up in snapcraft.io, but Travis said it uploaded it.
<hellsworth> hmm. maybe check back in 5 min?
<robert_ancell> Previously it's been instantaneous, and haven't got an email saying it's in a queue. Yeah, hopefully will turn up soon.
<hellsworth> indeed
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, thanks for the fixes!
<hellsworth> no problem :)
<robert_ancell> ah, it was my shonky Travis config.
<robert_ancell> Looks like I need to update SNAP_TOKEN in Travis as well.
<robert_ancell> SNAP_TOKEN is just the macaroon, right?
<robert_ancell> https://docs.travis-ci.com/user/deployment/snaps/ is pretty vague
<kenvandine> robert there is now an ubuntudesktop-3-28-1804 docker image
<kenvandine> nevermind, you figured that out :)
<kenvandine> yeah, and snapcraft using multipass is great :)
<hellsworth> kenvandine: what would the env var be to add to the override-build section to add the built binary to the prime dir?
<hellsworth> or maybe i just cp it
<hellsworth> no env var necessary
<hellsworth> ok nmv
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> I think you want to use something like $SNAPCRAFT_PRIME
 * kenvandine doesn't recall the env for that
<kenvandine> but the most reliable way to do that
<hellsworth> yeah my problem is that the binary built that lives in parts/cherrytree/build/cherrytree doesn't get primed: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/2RzfhRk8qp/
<hellsworth> in fact, the prime directory doesn't have a usr component at all
<hellsworth> so i guess i need to mkdir -p ../prime/usr/bin and then cp it to there, but that seems hacky
<hellsworth> i figured it would be better to just snap the c++ version of cherrytree since the commits show that it's actively being developed, even if the developer is not the most communicative
<hellsworth> rather than rewriting the app
<hellsworth> before i had snapped the python2 version that is no longer seeing develoopment
<hellsworth> are you around tomorrow ken?
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, The store was unable to accept this snap.
<robert_ancell>   - confinement 'classic' not allowed with plugs/slots
<robert_ancell> I guess you can't make a classic snap that accesses the themes?
<hellsworth> interesting
<hellsworth> well lemme try to remove those plugs/slots and rebuilt
<hellsworth> it was a hunch to add them
<hellsworth> yeah it builds and runs just fine without the plugs
<hellsworth> there are a lot of fontconfig warnings and errors though. i mean they were there even with the plugs. but fyi..
<hellsworth> oh it looks like you've already removed it
<hellsworth> good on you robert_ancell :)
<hellsworth> i was gonna make another mr but nvm :)
<hellsworth> ok i gotta run. see some of yous tomorrow!
<hellsworth> robert_ancell: if you still have issues with that snap, ping me on telegram so i'll see it
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, woohoo, it's uploaded to edge now.
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-12-20
<ahayzen> robert_ancell, hey, when running gnome-software from code, is there any special one needs to do to get polkit permissions to work with the snapd plugin ? I get things like "Requires authentication with @snapd"
<robert_ancell> ahayzen, no, it should be automatic.
<robert_ancell> ahayzen, what versions of g-s/snapd etc?
<ahayzen> robert_ancell, gnome-software master and snapd 2.42.1, this in on fedora 31, as i couldn't get gnome-software master to build on ubuntu/debian before :-) (maybe it can now though)
<robert_ancell> ahayzen, can you try:
<robert_ancell> $ curl --unix-socket /run/snapd.socket http://localhost/v2/logs
<robert_ancell> $ curl --unix-socket /run/snapd.socket -H 'X-Allow-Interaction: true' http://localhost/v2/logs
<robert_ancell> The former should fail with an auth error, the latter should prompt for a Polkit auth
<robert_ancell> The command is otherwise safe and will just return some system logs
<ahayzen> yup those work :-)
<robert_ancell> All G-S does is set the HTTP headers, and snapd does the Polkit auth. Perhaps it's not working in Fedora for some reason
<ahayzen> yeah, must be broken somehow. I'll submit my code change i have anyway as WIP as most of it i can test, and you can tell me if it's crazy :-)
<robert_ancell> sure, @ me on the MR and I'll have a look.
<ahayzen> thanks! :-)
<jibel> morning everyone
<duflu> Morning jibel
 * duflu just noticed his drink coaster is a Red Hat CD from 1997 and smiles
* duflu changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc
<jibel> Hey duflu
<Laney> moin
<Laney> feel like it's going to be a quiet one :>
<duflu> Pin drops
<duflu> Morning Laney
<jibel> good morning Laney
<jibel> glad you bring some animation
<Laney> guten morgen duflu und jibel
<duflu> wie gehts?
<jibel> es geht mir gut, danke
<Laney> auch gut. ich freue mich auf die weichnachtspause!
<Laney> und dir?
 * Laney drags things out of ancient brain compartments
<duflu> umm, same
<duflu> my German is too rusty
<jibel> mine too. I studied german for 7 years and never used it
<Laney> same
<Laney> will get the chance in 2020 though!
<jibel> I even worked for a german company and never spoke a single word of german
<jibel> no wonder tests were passing, I was testing the wrong code :(((
<jibel> I need holidays
<duflu> I will be in Monday and Tuesday. For anyone I don't see then, happy holidays
<kenvandine> getting all caught up on USN refreshes before the EOY
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<jibel> is seb128 here today?
<kenvandine> he just joined :)
<kenvandine> he's not supposed to be here
<seb128> hey
 * kenvandine glares at seb128 
<jibel> I don't see joiners
<seb128> I travelled on wednesday and said I wouls swap some hours
<jibel> salut seb128
<seb128> lut jibel
<seb128> hey kenvandine
<seb128> what's up?
<kenvandine> getting caught up on all these USN refreshes :)
<jibel> not much, very quiet day, fixing the testsuite of ubuntu-release-upgrader before holidays
<seb128> holiday coming \o/
<kenvandine> seb128: i don't think i can get to grilo
<jibel> man need it so much
<Laney> moin seb128 kenvandine
<jibel> +I
<kenvandine> gotta finish these refreshes and a couple other bits of and bobs before the new year
<seb128> kenvandine, no worry, as I said it can wait for after holidays
<seb128> hey Laney
<kenvandine> sorry... last minute push :)
<seb128> kenvandine, I noticed the trello spam, that's still not fixed :p
<kenvandine> lol
<hellsworth> good morning folks!
<hellsworth> how do i restart multipassd again?
<hellsworth> answer: sudo snap restart multipass
<hellsworth> grumble grumble multipass is still taking forever to start a vm and then fails saying it can't find snap/snapcraft.yaml :(
<hellsworth> ok there it goes
<hellsworth> finally
<Laney> finishing the year on an upload that doesn't build anywhere /o\
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mutter/3.34.2-1ubuntu1
<hellsworth> sounds about right
<Laney> works on my system
<Laney> fml
<Laney> will have to hope I get a chance to look into it
<Laney> BYEEEEEEEEEEEEE
<hellsworth> cheers!!
<hellsworth> happy holidays :)
<seb128> Laney, enjoy the holidays!
<seb128> tjaalton, the liglvnd update seems to make things angry, looks like the -dev doesn't bring libGL anymore which fails random autopkgtests and builds
<tjaalton> seb128: things moved to libgl-dev etc
<tjaalton> could be they were tested against new mesa + old glvnd
<tjaalton> glvnd seems to be out of new now
<seb128> tjaalton, see the libglvnd section on https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-package
<seb128> yes, I newed it today
<seb128> tjaalton, that sounds weird, new mesa was waiting on glvnd to be newed to build
<seb128> but yeah, you are right, autopkgtest only pick the one package it tests from proposed
<tjaalton> should have both
<seb128> if they need to go in lock step then you miss a Breaks?
<tjaalton> maybe
<seb128> or versioned depends
<tjaalton> libgl-dev has breaks on old mesa
<tjaalton> etc
<tjaalton> and replaces
<tjaalton> so it's new glvnd and old mesa
<seb128> tjaalton, unsure why it manages to try those autopkgtests with the old mesa then
<seb128> tjaalton, anyway either we need to fix the dependencies for that to not happen
<seb128> or we need to manually retry those with a trigger on the new mesa version
<tjaalton> I don't see what to change without making circular deps
<seb128> tjaalton, well, https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-focal/focal/amd64/d/ddnet/20191220_164053_023ce@/log.gz
<seb128> tjaalton, that installs libglvnd-dev and no libgl-dev so maybe that one should also have the Breaks to force the mesa upgradE?
<tjaalton> that's just a broken package, libglvnd-dev never provided libGL.so
<tjaalton> nah, it installs libgl1-mesa-dev which used to provide it
<tjaalton> new version of it depends on libgl-dev now, this test installed the old version
<tjaalton> ah actually
<tjaalton> libglvnd-dev did provide the .so, but not headers
<tjaalton> so adding the lib{egl,gl,gles}-dev pkgs as libglvnd-dev depends should fix it
<tjaalton> new mesa isn't actually needed for this
<seb128> sounds like tyhe right way to fix it
<seb128> it's just that something should pull in libgl which doesn't atm
<tjaalton> right
<tjaalton> didn't realize so many pkgs had actually started to build-depend on libglvnd-dev instead of mesa-common-dev etc
<tjaalton> or any at all..
<tjaalton> anyway, I'll push a new one to debian
<Laney> this is probably something to do with why mutter fails too
<Laney> so I hope for it to magically fix itself :>
<tjaalton> tomorrow-ish
<hellsworth> ok i'm off. see yall next year!!
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-12-21
<Laney> tjaalton: can you look at mutter and see if we're missing a build-dep or something please?
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-12-22
<Laney> nm, fixed it
