#ubuntu-motu 2005-06-06
<iceman> anyone able to help me set up a UBUNTU and REDHAT network ? between two computers ?
<crimmy> hmm, that's really a #ubuntu question...
<SEBest> hello, anyone awake? :)
<tseng> how can i print my LDPATH?
<crimmy> echo $LD_LIBRARY_PATH ?
<tseng> yeah nothing there
<tseng> just wondering if it would search  /usr/X11R6/lib
<tseng> it doesnt seem to
<crimmy> yes, it should
<crimmy> (/etc/ld.so.conf)
<tseng> hm its the onlything in there even
<tseng> gosh
<ajmitch> afternoon
<crimmy> 'afternoon
<tseng> hi ajmitch
<tseng> ajmitch: do you know how long it takes from alioth signup -> svn login
<ajmitch> no idea sorry
<tseng> ok.
<plugwash> whats the ubuntu universe policy on compilers that compile themselves?
<crimmy> that's not an issue
<crimmy> it's really a license issue
<crimmy> anything DFSG-free can go into universe
<plugwash> it seems ubuntu has copied the fpc source package into universe
<plugwash> but it can't compile it because there are no existing fp-compiler packages to compile it with
<ajmitch> ah, more bootstrapping issues
<crimmy> ajmitch: indeed
<ajmitch> they can be worked around, afaik
<ajmitch> we have to talk to lamont & he can sort out a special case for them
<ajmitch> if we ask nicely
<plugwash> afaict the easiest soloution would be to just upload the binary packages from sid
<crimmy> are they in main?
<plugwash> yeah
<crimmy> oh, then yeah, just a sync is necessary
<ajmitch> sure, but ubuntu doesn't accept binary uploads, they need to be slipped in another way
<ajmitch> crimmy: a sync will only grab the source package & try to build it
<crimmy> ajmitch: hmm, still the ole chicken-n-egg.
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> which is why we get a binary package into the buildd chroot in order to bootstrap it
<crimmy> yeah, hence needing the special-case
<ajmitch> mono used to have the same issue
<plugwash> out of interest why don't ubuntu accept binary uploads?
* ajmitch shrugs
<ajmitch> I guess to ensure that things compile from source :)
<crimmy> which is a cleaner approach, really
<ajmitch> yes, better than uploading a package that doesn't compile anywhere but on the maintainer's box
<ajmitch> (missing build-deps, etc)
<ajmitch> in a 6-month release cycle we want to make sure that packages build nicely on the supported architectures asap
<Lathiat> theres also potential security concerns
<ajmitch> Lathiat: such as?
<Lathiat> if you upload binaries, it could be different from the source
<ajmitch> sure
<plugwash> am i correct in thinking that you bulk import from sid and only bother to check why a package isn't building when someone complains?
<ajmitch> plugwash: for universe, yes
<ajmitch> we do have a page for build logs
<ajmitch> but there's not many of us looking after universe to fix everything
<ajmitch> most real fixing will tend to be done after automatic imports from sid have stopped
<ajmitch> except for our friend the Cxx transition & others :)
<plugwash> the Cxx transistion?
<plugwash> know any good pages that introduce how ubuntu fits together
<plugwash> ie when they import how they prepare releases where buildd logs are etc
<ajmitch> there are some good pages on the wiki. one moment
<ajmitch> http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/DeveloperResources
<plugwash> [02:39]  <ajmitch> there are some good pages on the wiki. one moment <-- that was the last line i got please repeat anything said to me after it
<ajmitch> 13:40 < ajmitch> http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/DeveloperResources
* ajmitch has to go, will bbl
<plugwash> all your pages seem to talk about hoary and warty and i saw one mention of breezy
<plugwash> is there a page somewhere that details what the names actually mean?
<plugwash> ahh found it
<\sh> morning
* Nafallo says good morning to all!
<\sh> hey Nafallo
<\sh> hmmm...
<\sh> the date for the ubuntu backports meeting is not on the calendar...should I add this event?
<siretart> moin
<siretart> \sh: backports meeting? did I miss something?
<Amaranth> june 1
<Amaranth> http://ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UbuntuBackports
<\sh> hey siretat
<\sh> hmm...i think i misspelled your nick in my blogentry
<siretart> \sh: my nick is my login here at university. Student der Ingenieurwissenschaften Reinhard Tartler
<\sh> siretart: well, but siretat != siretart ;)
<siretart> yeah ;)
<Treenaks> at least it's not siretard ;)
<\sh> hehe
<siretart> jupp :/
<siretart> \sh: whats the url again for your blog?
<\sh> linux.blogweb.de
<siretart> thnx
<siretart> \sh: what do you think about the backports? should we (as motus) support them?
<Nafallo> yay! python as religion ;-)
<\sh> siretart: no..mako want to diskuss with motu and mains if we should support backports or not, if yes, how we should handle them so that they're not causing more troubles with ubuntu linux ;)
<\sh> siretart: the best way to handle this, is to change some parts of the update policy of ubuntu
<\sh> or to have a similar development stage like gentoo...so not starting over from debian unstable, but to update/upgrade the already existent packages
<siretart> \sh: this sounds a bit like building up something in the spirit of http://backports.org
<\sh> siretart: well, yes, but the biggest problem is, that we should be in sync with them...so if they're building new packages with new deps etc. we should have them...and they should hold on ubuntu policy
<\sh> siretart: and btw...no lintian warnings anymore with njam, manpage, .desktop file (but someone has to check it ;))
<siretart> \sh: I'll have a look at it this evening
<\sh> siretart: i will try to build an amd64 package as well
<\sh> morning ogra
<ogra> heya
<\sh> wel
<\sh> i could really need some help with arkrpg
<\sh> and aspseek...i don't really know what to do with it
<\sh> cvs.aspseek.org is not reachable
<\sh> even the pserver cvs server is not reachable anymore..
<opi> morning
<\sh> hi opi
<opi> hi \sh
* [Chameleon]  is away: ZZzzz...
<siretart> doko: sorry about my poor changelogs, will improve them. shall I reupload an corrected rlog package?
<doko> siretart: no, but please update the diff, it should be a help for the Debian package maintainers, when feeding back these patches
<\sh> hmmm...any issues with mini-dinstall and amd64 arch?
<\sh> i can't process one package for amd64
<\sh> grmpf..my fault
<tseng> hi
<tseng> Nafallo: please try blam today
<Nafallo> tseng: Kaloz
<Nafallo> tseng: k even
<tseng> thanks
<Amaranth> Treenaks: not going to hapen
<Amaranth> err, happen
<Amaranth> Treenaks: http://rafb.net/paste/results/OfoO5h18.html
<Treenaks> not enough info
<Treenaks> you really need a debug version
<Amaranth> make a totem-dbg package then :)
<Treenaks> Amaranth: apt-get source totem-xine; apt-get build-dep totem-xine; DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nostrip fakeroot dpkg-buildpackage -b -uc
<Treenaks> maybe libxine too
<Amaranth> that'd take hours
<Amaranth> well, an hour anyway
<Treenaks> Amaranth: do you want that bug fixed or not? :)
<Amaranth> wtf
<Amaranth> why does totem need firefox-dev
<tseng> the plugin.
<Treenaks> it builds a firefox plugin
<Treenaks> a very cool one
<Treenaks> (it works!)
<Treenaks> it even resizes!
<Amaranth> building
<Amaranth> needed to add in an sudo and a cd
<tseng> why is mono stuff going bong on ppc
<Nafallo> tseng: X Window System Error. could this be because my hoary-xorg? ;-)
<tseng> Nafallo: uhhh
<tseng> Nafallo: wow i dont want to hear any more complains from you
<Nafallo> tseng: hehe. you will... when xorg works again ;-)
<tseng> mono might be fixed before xorg, at this rate
<tseng> we dont re-break things
<Nafallo> hehe
<tseng> i guess i need someone on ppc/breezy to tell me what is actually uninstallable here
<tseng>   mono-jit: Depends: mono-assemblies-base-1.1.7
<tseng> ah there it is
<tseng> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/m/mono/1.1.7-0ubuntu5/mono_1.1.7-0ubuntu5_20050528-2214-powerpc-failed.gz
<\sh> i looks like, that I will fix my problem with arkrpg just now...
<DanielN> \sh: you wrote in MOTUNewPackages "when - requested some changes"  but which do you mean?
<tseng> no one with ppc/
<\sh> DanielN: we spoke about them..old entry...i will take a new look on this package
<\sh> tseng: give me money for a pegasos ;)
<DanielN> \sh: aha.. all clear now!
<DanielN> thx for your newbie introducion works :D
<Amaranth> Treenaks: I guess libxine needs rebuilt too, i get no extra info from totem-xine
<Treenaks> Amaranth: did you dpkg -i the deb?
<Amaranth> yes...
<Treenaks> Amaranth: what does 'file /usr/bin/totem' say?
<Amaranth> /usr/bin/totem: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386, version 1 (SYSV), for GNU/Linux 2.2.0, dynamically linked (uses shared libs), not stripped
<Treenaks> ok.. not stripped = good
<Treenaks> uh yeah.. go for libxine
<\sh> DanielN: do u have an amd64 machine running breezy in a working env?
<DanielN> no sorry, intel only here ...
<DanielN> other question: is it possible to upgrade directly to breezy from warty?
<Treenaks> uh
<Treenaks> why breezy, not hoary?
<Amaranth> TIAS, i hope so
<Treenaks> Amaranth: ?
<Amaranth> try it and see
<DanielN> Treenaks: why not ?
<Amaranth> building libxine1c2 now
<Treenaks> DanielN: it'll break
<Amaranth> wait, don't g++ packages get built with 3.3 on regular machines?
<DanielN> ok .. then first hoary and then breezy?
<Treenaks> Amaranth: no
<Amaranth> ok, building then
<Treenaks> I guess..
<\sh> *outch* a splinter in my finger
<Unfrgiven> hi all
<Amaranth> Treenaks: much better now
<Treenaks> Amaranth: what does it say now?
<Amaranth> http://rafb.net/paste/results/ZxGZE518.html
<Treenaks> argh.. threads
<Amaranth> i said that long ago
<Amaranth> totem starts like 12 threads
<DanielN> \sh: is ish providing cable internet too ?
<ogra> DanielN, yep
<\sh> DanielN: yep
<DanielN> hehe
<\sh> DanielN: but depends where u r living :)
<DanielN> \sh: i'm from switzerland ..  and here cable internet is most used broadband technology
<\sh> DanielN: not here ;)
<\sh> DanielN: not internet via tv cable ;)
<DanielN> i know, thats wy i'm asking
<DanielN> \sh: who? whatelse then?
<DanielN> but ish is providing tv, isn't it?
<\sh> DanielN: yep..
<\sh> DanielN: in germany internet via cable is not as common as e.g. dsl
<DanielN> \sh: ah... clear now :) well, i think cable is nearer to best effort than dsl
<tseng> oh man i can upload this beagle!
<tseng> no dbus
<Treenaks> tseng: upload that first then ;)
<tseng> Treenaks: "first"?
<tseng> checking for X11/extensions/scrnsaver.h... no
<tseng> configure: error: Unable to find scrnsaver.h.  You probably need to install XFree86 development packages
<tseng> i need to fix xorg first
<Treenaks> tseng: \o/
<tseng>  /usr/X11R6/include/X11/extensions/scrnsaver.h its right there
<tseng> gosh
<tseng> maybe we took it out of ldpath
<Treenaks> tseng: -I
<tseng> oh man configure is crack
<tseng> its like its a foreach kind of, but scrnsaver is a special case
<tseng>   --x-includes=DIR    X include files are in DIR
<tseng>   --x-libraries=DIR   X library files are in DIR
<\sh> tseng: have similare problems with arkrpg
<\sh> all this autotools stuff is broken
<\sh> doesn't find anything from X anymore
<tseng> jeez
<tseng> so whats the fix
<tseng> i had it yesterday with libX11.so.6.2
<tseng> it found libX11.so.6 (a symlink) just fine
<tseng> in the same dir
<tseng> but that was ld, not autotools
<tseng> mono looking things up in an ld sort of way, rather
<tseng>  for ac_header in X11/extensions/scrnsaver.h
<tseng> oh
<\sh> checking for X... /tmp/buildd/arkrpg-0.1.4b/./configure: line 20949: test: too many arguments
<\sh> /tmp/buildd/arkrpg-0.1.4b/./configure: line 20949: test: too many arguments
<\sh> /tmp/buildd/arkrpg-0.1.4b/./configure: line 20949: test: too many arguments
<\sh> this is what i get from configure
<\sh> and i cant fix it...i tried everything
<tseng> that sucks
<\sh> remove aclocal+config.{guess,sub} relibtoolize autoreconf blabla
<\sh> nothing works
<\sh> i tried to find out if there is a new version...
<\sh> but arkrpg is now known as arkhart
<\sh> version number: 1.4
<\sh> the other child with a problem is aspseek
<\sh> no cvs is available, the last debian bug entry is from fabbione from 2003
<\sh> and the software...it refuses to build ;)
<mdke> are there any italian motus?
<\sh> ok..
<\sh> xincludes and xlibs is fixed for arkrpg
<\sh> i provided them...do we have fixed build variables for it in cdbs?
<DanielN> so i'm asking again: direct upgrade from warty to breezy is impossible?
<\sh> and now for the easy errors ;)
<siretart> DanielN: I noone has tested this yet, I think. I don't think this will be supported somewhere, so, to be safe, upgrade to hoary first, if possible
<siretart> I think, even
<Unfrgiven> hi again... i've been looking to help out with the c++ transition. i know ive left it pretty late but i havent had much time recently. anyways, here i am. now im a bit confused looking at the wiki pages... it seems like everything on UniverseCxxTransition is done? or am i reading it wrong?
<\sh> ok..going home#
<DanielN> me2
<DanielN> ill here @ work
<Unfrgiven> tseng: for test-building debian source pacakges whats the quickest way to build it? i use pbuilder... i just wanted to know if there was a quicker way... since pbuilder is slow as it unpacks the chroot and what not
<tseng> pbuilder is slow
<tseng> but its correct
<tseng> if you are doing alot of fast test builds
<tseng> you can apt-get build-dep package
<tseng> and in the top of the source tree
<tseng> dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot
<tseng> it will put source and debs in ../
<Unfrgiven> ok cool. thanks
<tseng> always pbuilder the final result to be sure
<tseng> before uploading
<Unfrgiven> tseng: yep, gotcha
<tseng> rock on.
<plugwash> hi i asked in here about fpc yesterday and was told that the starting compiler would have to be slipped into the buildd system as ubuntu don't allow binary uploads
<plugwash> is this in hand already or is thier some way more permanent than irc that i should report it?
<Burgundavia> cya all
<GheRivero> res people
<\sh> jo GheRivero
<siretart> who answers richardo to join #ubuntu-motu? ;)
<siretart> currently, I'm in a hurry :(
* \sh is here...but also in stress 
<\sh> siretart: where is he?
<siretart> \sh: he mailed ubuntu-devel
<siretart> wanting a review for his oregano package update
<\sh> ah ok....will answer him
<siretart> thanks. I would have done this myself, but I really gotta go now home.. bye folks!
<\sh> ../Ark/ArkObject.h:100: error: 'Cache' has not been declared
<\sh> ../Ark/ArkObject.h:108: error: 'Cache' has not been declared
<\sh> what is it?
<DanielN> ree :)
<ivoks> hi! :)
<DanielN> hello, me 16 years old, is searching a nice, good-looking and interested MOTU to review some packages :D
<ivoks> :)
<Amaranth> as soon as i can get seb to upload pyxdg 0.12 into main i'll need someone to review smeg 0.7 :)
<ivoks> i got my PGP signed by joy@debian.org :)
<ivoks> do you trust me now, guys? :)
<Nafallo> hehe
<tseng> |QuaD-: did you try it?
<SEBest> how come people define 2/3 times the same bug in malone?
<tseng> SEBest: until a week or so ago it was impossible to search existing bugs, for one
<tseng> SEBest: for two, alot of people just dont bother to search at all
<tseng> same problem on bugzilla
<SEBest> tseng, i mean exactly the same text
<ozamosi> and the same reporter
<tseng> maybe a bug or a repost then
<SEBest> bug 839 840 841 843
<SEBest> but there are many like this
<tseng> maybe a bug or a repost then.
<SEBest> a majority i think
<tseng> like, when a webform is slow and someone hits submit many times, you know
<tseng> and bugs, you know what they are.
<SEBest> yes i guessed that too
<SEBest> but most of the bugs a double or triple :s
<|QuaD-> tseng: i tried it, it is kinda buggy... still playing
<SEBest> i think it's buggy and people hit the same button twice, and it gets submitted more than one time
<tseng> that sounds about right
<SEBest> malone was developped by ubuntu?
<tseng> yes.
<|QuaD-> tseng: beagle isn't crawling my files
<SEBest> they didn't like existing bug tracking system? like bugzilla, mantiss issue-tracker?
<|QuaD-> crashes on imlog
<SEBest> |Quad i have the same problems
<|QuaD-> but the other parts work ok
<|QuaD-> :)
<tseng> SEBest: this one is supposed to be able to pull bugs in from other bugzillas and BTS
<SEBest> i never get beagle indexing any file :s
<tseng> SEBest: is one of the main points.
<tseng> also track the status of those bugs
<SEBest> tseng, i think malone needs itselft to track his ownbugs :s
<tseng> yes, its buggy
<|QuaD-> SEBest: it isn't indexing ANYTHING for you?
<SEBest> buggy tracking system :)
<SEBest> quad: only mails and things like this
<SEBest> but i've never been able to make it index files
<|QuaD-> mine is doing mail, blam, liferea, tomboy, and launcher
<SEBest> it is always stuck
<SEBest> yes me too
<SEBest> but no files
<SEBest> that's the most impressive feature that is missing for me :(
<|QuaD-> heh
<tseng> mine did a file
<tseng> with a bit of pushing
<|QuaD-> lol
<SEBest> only one? :d
<tseng> no, i mean one Live
<tseng> you know what i mean
<SEBest> oki :)
<tseng> i did a search then made a file to set if off intentionally
<tseng> it indexed lots of files
<SEBest> maybe i've too much file for him
<SEBest> or maybe he doesn't like my files :)
<tseng> you guys have user_xattr set right?
<SEBest> i guess it's not curious enough lol
<SEBest> yes of course
<|QuaD-> tseng: yeah, the last release did fine
<tseng> there is a thing called EXERCISE_THE_DOG=1 to export
<SEBest> just need to put it in fstab righ?
<tseng> im not sure what it does, something about forcing index
<|QuaD-> tseng: that just unthrottles it
<tseng> ok id call that an upstream things
<tseng> since it works for me.
<|QuaD-> tseng: what do you mean?
<tseng> i mean, it works for me
<tseng> so when you figure out what the problem is, let me know and I might have  a shot at fixing it
<|QuaD-> tseng: it indexes files as i create them / modify them
<|QuaD-> but it doesn't index pre-existing files
<tseng> oh I see
<|QuaD-> i don't know if that helps at all
<tseng> what if you removed ~/.beagle and started all over maybe
<tseng> i really dont know
<|QuaD-> tseng: lemme try
<SEBest> tseng: does it look for filenames?
<tseng> yes
<SEBest> i querying seb
<SEBest> echo seb > test
<SEBest> works
<tseng> yep.
<SEBest> touch seb
<SEBest> doesn't
<tseng> well yeah
<tseng> they might ignore that now if theres no content
<SEBest> damned
<tseng> i just searched for FilterJpeg and got FilterJpeg.cs in both copies of beagle source tree in my /home
<tseng> 0.0.10 would not have been indexed before today, obviously
<SEBest> how come it doesn't index my exsisting files?
<Amaranth> beagle works again?
<tseng> i dunno id appreciate if you could tell me
<tseng> i cant fix what I cant see
<tseng> or give me a test to proove that mine isnt working either
<Amaranth> well, it needed dbus
<tseng> because im pretty sure it does
<Amaranth> 0.0.10 doesn't though, does it?
<tseng> Amaranth: eh? its in breezy, de-busted
<tseng> Amaranth: get with the times
<tseng> :P
<Amaranth> heh
<|QuaD-> tseng: you have EXERCISE_THE_DOG=1 exported?
<Amaranth> since when? an hour ago? :P
<tseng> no
<SEBest> |Quad i have it
<tseng> its definately looking at files dude
<|QuaD-> tseng: how are you running it?
<Amaranth> yay, i can get bleeding edge search tool back ;)
<|QuaD-> tseng: both SEBest and I are having the same problem :)
<tseng> it is like "what to do with random-guadec-video.ogg"
<SEBest> i think one file may block it :)
<SEBest> it only index 136 files for me :s
<tseng> beagled --debug --fg
<|QuaD-> SEBest: those are probably the ones that have been modified
<Amaranth> now i guess need tomboy and vlc and i'll be happy :D
<Amaranth> s/guess/just/
<tseng> yeah tomboy wants dbus
<tseng> stupid thing
<|QuaD-> why does tomboy use dbus?
<tseng> plugins
<Amaranth> yeah, i thought mono moved into main and we could get libdbus-cil built like that
<Amaranth> dbus, it's the new bonobo
<SEBest> |Quad to go to school
<|QuaD-> ohh
<tseng> we are waiting for Kamion to update the seed list
<Amaranth> ah
<Amaranth> cool
<|QuaD-> hmmm i might know why, the filesystem thing is crashing because i have a path that is too long
<tseng> DEBUG: worker added: name=Beagle.Daemon.QueryDriver+QueryClosure refcount=1
<tseng> DEBUG: Finished task Crawling /home/brandon/work/debian/mono-1.1.7/mcs/class/Managed.Windows.Forms/Test in .07s
<tseng> there you have it.
<|QuaD-> i figured it would start back up :)
<tseng> those arent new files at all.
<tseng> oh yeah i had a file with / in the name
<tseng> that pissed it off
<tseng> they told me it was a mono bug and super hard to fix
<ivoks> hi all
<tseng> so i changed my files
<SEBest> |quad : export BEAGLE_EXERCISE_THE_DOG=1
<|QuaD-> tseng: the / ?
<tseng> |QuaD-: yes.
<tseng> i had mp3s like Artist - Foo / Bar.mp3
<|QuaD-> SEBest: thats not good for performance
<|QuaD-> lets see what else beagle doesn't like
<SEBest> yes, but now it indexed my files
<herve> houba!
<tseng> hi.
<|QuaD-> SEBest: i am trying to actually fix it :)
<tseng> btw, are any of you using the firefox plugin?
<|QuaD-> i wish there was an easy way just to see exceptions
<|QuaD-> tseng: i haven't even gotten to the applet yet :)
<tseng> hah
<|QuaD-> i first need the daemon to work :)
<tseng> i mean, to index visited pages
<tseng> id be eager to get that working
<|QuaD-> ohhh, i don't use ff :)
<|QuaD-> anyways
<tseng> i often forget where i saw things
<Amaranth> tseng: anything i can do to get libdbus-cil built on my system?
<tseng> and my history is too big to search
<tseng> Amaranth: erm
<|QuaD-> tseng: isn't there one of those for epiphany?
<|QuaD-> tseng: i don't want it indexing my pr0n though :)
<tseng> eh
<Amaranth> turn the extension off, browse pr0n, turn it back on
<|QuaD-> Amaranth:
<|QuaD-> :)
<|QuaD-> i will bbl, going to let beagle run, i will let you know if i fixed the file error :) or found a cause
<tseng> yep im going to walk off too
<tseng> good luck guys
<\sh> Riddell: ping
<DanielN> YAY .. 've put me on maintainer candidates.. muah :D
<Riddell> \sh: yo
<ivoks> \sh: hi
<ivoks> DanielN: ?
<\sh> Riddell: i'm confused right now with one question: where is the binding of XF86Mute (xorg key) and KDEs KMIx Mute command?
<\sh> Riddell: i'm trying to build new symbol settings for my new keyboard :)
<Riddell> \sh: is there such a binding?
<SEBest> this beagle thing should also search in deb packages
<SEBest> like apt-cache search
<DanielN> ivoks: i've putted mysqlf on the list .. just that :)
<DanielN> mysqlf
<ivoks> :)
<DanielN> damn
<DanielN> myself
<DanielN> too much mysql in mind :)
<\sh> Riddell: well, actually, if i
<ivoks> damn linux! :(
<\sh> I'm pressing the "mute button" on my laptop kmix is muting
<\sh> pressing again, unmute
<Riddell> \sh: it's not kmilo is it?
<\sh> kmilo?
<\sh> Riddell: even when I'm stopping kmix it's starting when I press this button
<\sh> the ssame with vol inc/dec buttons
<Riddell> \sh: try killing kded then try pressing buttons
<\sh> Riddell: not working anymore
<Riddell> \sh: sounds like kmilo then
<\sh> Riddell: where can i find some infos about it?
<Riddell> \sh: kmilo is a kded module which somehow reads magic keys (like my thinkpad ones or your generic internet keyboard ones) and does something with them (like start kmix and tell it to mute)
<Riddell> \sh: google and my kde.me.uk page should come up
<Riddell> \sh: I think it's not very well thought out, it should just map to key bindings then kmix should hve global bindings for XF86Mute et al
<Riddell> \sh: what are you wanting to make it do?
<\sh> Riddell: well, yes if kmix would has those settings..but mute is not in the list of shortcuts
<\sh> Riddell: trying to define a new keyboard map fpr this genius wireleess twintouch 19enb
<\sh> keyboard :)
<\sh> hmm
<\sh> so it's not well documented ;)
<\sh> Riddell: this is easy :) why are those nifty toys not well documented
<Riddell> \sh: what have you managed to do?
<\sh> Riddell: well, first of all, I checked the source for your kmilo
<herve> hey, did you know there are easter eggs in gnome?
<Amaranth> such as?
<\sh> I wondering, why you use KShortCut("XF86AudioMute") but not for the XF86AudioVolumeUp and Down?
<herve> Amaranth, alt+f2 and type "free the fish"
<Amaranth> can't alt+f2, i'm on breezy :P
<Amaranth> omfg, alt works again!
<Amaranth> lmao, nice
<ivoks> herve: nice voting :))
<Nafallo> lol
<\sh> DanielN: ping
<Nafallo> he had speed when you touched him ;-)
<DanielN> \sh: pong :)
<\sh> DanielN: do u have jabber or some of {ICQ,MSN} IM?
<DanielN> i've got MSN *shame*
<Amaranth> eww, system monitor got fat
<DanielN> ;)
<abelli> is ogra around?
<\sh> DanielN: u should switch ;)
<abelli> is that beautiful creature (read ogra) around?
<\sh> DanielN: anyways...give me your msn name :)
<\sh> abelli: ogra is at guadec :)
<DanielN> i know but .. most of friends are using msn and microsoft cause they don't know others..
<DanielN> \sh: daniel_neuenschwander@msn.com
<abelli> \sh: which means that they have connection too or what?
<herve> another one, type "gegls from outer space"
<Riddell> \sh: I didn't write the generic keyboard plugin so I've never looked at it (I did the thinkpad one)
<Riddell> \sh: but if you can fix it, that's great :)
<herve> DanielN, you can use msn chat without a msn address
<DanielN> herve: i know but i'm too mhmh .. pissed on to switch .. to much work
<\sh> DanielN: go online :)
<Amaranth> herve: how do i unfree the fish?
<DanielN> \sh: i'am online
<\sh> Riddell: need to svn co the whole kde stuff
<herve> Amaranth, I didn't think about the consequences :-)
<herve> other gnome tips: http://lintellect.org/index.php?p=13
<Nafallo> herve: how to kill the damn fish? :-P
<Amaranth> no wonder gnome is so bloated! all these games! </netscape homepages>
<DanielN> \sh: why you went off?
<herve> hey guys, what's wrong with a fish passing by your screen? ;-)
<abelli> herve: mmm .. how do i fish the fish?
<Nafallo> herve: he's afraid of me? ;-)
<Amaranth> herve: i think it eventually goes off the bottom of the screen and goes away
<Nafallo> Amaranth: he comes back
<Amaranth> she
<Amaranth> wanda
<Amaranth> click on her :)
<Amaranth> :/
<Amaranth> you have to kill the panel to get rid of her
<Amaranth> or wnck-applet, that might do it
<Nafallo> gaah
<Nafallo> the panel
<Amaranth> since i upgraded to 2.11 i've had this handy little launcher named 'Restart Panel'
<Amaranth> since it seems to have given on up ever updating it's menus
<Riddell> \sh: it's a big checkout :)
<Nafallo> hmm
<\sh> Riddell: i know :)
<Nafallo> Mark_Shuttleworth_-_Partial_Keynote.ogg is actually an empty room :-P
<Nafallo> annoying.
<\sh> Riddell: but I need to have an actual source tree of kde anyways:)
<Riddell> Nafallo: I discovered that
<mgalvin> hi all
<herve> hi
<ivoks> tierd...
<ivoks> bye all
<herve> bye
<|QuaD-> weird beagle only indexes files if i do --allow-backend Files
<\sh> if anybody knows c++ and is expert for new invention in g++-4, can u look at arkrpg?
<\sh> i'm stucked...the configure problems I solved, but not the c++ problems
<siretart> re
<siretart> arkrpg is really challenging..
<siretart> btw, did anyone had a look at oregano yet?
<herve> no
<herve> sadly, I'm overbooked for now
<siretart> ah, now I get it
<siretart> he converted it to native.
<siretart> I'll go on with that, don't worry
<siretart> hm.
<\sh> guys...
<\sh> non existent sourcepackages, which are only for ubuntu, should they have 0ubuntu1 in the version?
<ajmitch> yes, that is usually suggested
<herve> you mean it's an ubuntu native package? ;-)
<ajmitch> unless you've got a good justification for making it a nativ package
<\sh> well...it
<\sh> it's not in debian
<\sh> (not officially)
<ajmitch> just tell us what it is :P
<herve> but it could be some day?
<herve> (though in a higher version)
<\sh> e.g. klibido or qinx
<\sh> herve: well...in the moment i'm thinking about finding a deb maintainer who could sponsor an upload
<\sh> but, why not the other way...officially in ubuntu, and synced into debian ;)
<herve> it's called a sponsor ;-)
<ajmitch> you might even find one around here
<ajmitch> seeing as there's a few DDs here ;)
<herve> hmm, does he need an ftpmaster too?
<ajmitch> ?
<herve> nothing to set up in the ftp archives?
<ajmitch> why would he? DDs only complain to ftpmasters on rare occasions
<herve> no review for security, etc.?
<herve> well, no
<ajmitch> packages get uploaded, NEW ones get processed by the ftpmasters
<herve> this one is not really the role of ftpmasters, I guess
<herve> I understand it's a NEW package
<herve> \sh, no?
<\sh> herve: yes
<\sh> i checked again p.d.o
<herve> also wnpp?
<\sh> wnpp?
<ajmitch> if you really need a sponsor, I can probably do it for you
<herve> \sh, bugs.debian.org/wnpp
<jamessan> Work-Needing and Prospective Packages
<herve> search for the name of your pacakge
* ajmitch has to run off to work now, will bbl
<\sh> cu ajmitch
<\sh> herve: will check right now
<\sh> ok...one its in there
<\sh> old one
<\sh> Sat, 18 Dec 2004 13:33:03 UTC;
<\sh> bug date
<herve> marked as RFP or ITP?
<\sh> ITP
<herve> from someone with a debian.org address?
<\sh> no
<\sh> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=286203
<herve> then someone just enthusiastic :-)
<\sh> means?
<herve> there is a procedure in case you are serious about entering debian
<\sh> the problem is the same as in gentoo :)
<\sh> there is too much software ;)
<herve> hard to say for sure, probably he found another occupation
<\sh> well...
<herve> or maybe no DD payed attention
<herve> and end of the story
<\sh> the best wa is to get it into debian and sync it from there
<\sh> so,i will make a deal with ajmitch ;)
<\sh> or someone else :)
<herve> \sh, http://debian.neo.pl/wfmh/pool/main/k/kwin-style-qinx/
<herve> are you sure it's not the same person? :)-
<\sh> its the same person...and this release is old :)
<\sh> 1.4 is actual
<herve> he should ask debian-mentors then
<herve> or find someone here ;-)
<\sh> as i said: same problem with gentoo...the latest release was 1.2 inside 2005.0 (i uploaded the ebuild) and nobody took care about updated
<\sh> updating even
<\sh> well...lets do it via dd from ubuntu as a nice sponsor ;)
<\sh> at least I'm sure it's compiling against kde-3.4.1 and is gcc4 clean ;)
<herve> so in better shape that most of the kde packages in debian ;-)
<\sh> herve: please review :)
<\sh> motunewpackages ;)
<herve> I wish I could :-)
<herve> but real life is... er, real!
<herve> painly real
<\sh> hehe :)
<\sh> and I'm renaming the stuff to come straight with the naming convention
* ajmitch is at work..
<ajmitch> :)
* herve is at sleep, better!
<ajmitch> hah, I wish I could still be sleeping
* |QuaD- hasn't started work yet, and isn't sleeping yet either
<\sh> hehe
<\sh> playing with twisted-2.0.0a2 and shtoom
* |QuaD- starts his job on the 8th :(
<DanielN> if someone has a notebook, not used, tell me :)
<DanielN> or not using, better
<ajmitch> |QuaD-: good to hear that you have a job upcoming though :)
<\sh> ajmitch: we should talk about a sponsored upload ;)
<ajmitch> \sh: sure.. talk with the guy that did the ITP if you can
<|QuaD-> ajmitch: yeah, most of my friends that graduated with me done
<\sh> what is the meaning of ITP?
<|QuaD-> alright, i gotta run
<|QuaD-> ttyl
<|QuaD-> \sh: intent to package
<ajmitch> intent to package
<\sh> ok
<herve> night, gniiiii!
<herve> see ya!
<siretart> re
<DanielN> cu
<mgalvin> siretart, hi, do you guys have any plans for games(educational games) for kids?
<mgalvin> I started looking around at the tux4kids games and would love to help get this packaged up and into ubuntu
<siretart> mgalvin: no, I don't have any special plans about educational games. If you want to help packaging and improving existing packages, ROCK!
<mgalvin> siretart, ok cool, i will spend some time on them, just so you know the other day I also started packaging some other game related packages includeing cegui and ogre
<siretart> mgalvin: ROCK
<\sh> doko: ping
<siretart> mgalvin: if you have some games package that you think should be uploaded to ubuntu, add them here: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUNewPackages and ping me ;)
<mgalvin> siretart, i will do that when they are ready, I have a few already built, but as I am still learning there are some improvements i want to make before getting them uploaded
<mgalvin> siretart, if you have time, feel free to check them out at http://www.simplifiedcomplexity.com/ubuntu/packages/hoary/i386/
<ajmitch> we'll be sure to try & set soem time aside for reviewing of packages :)
<siretart> :)
<mgalvin> sounds good :)
<doko> \sh, pong
<\sh> doko: i saw u r uploading c++ apps to main...should we do that also with universe?
<doko> \sh, no, not before the C++ libs in universe are converted
<\sh> ok
<\sh> hmmm
<\sh> I'm installing SIP express router now on my ubuntu box...lets check it out..
<siretart> doko: perhaps I'm too dump, but I think my diff in https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11222 is correct. (??)
<siretart> dumb, even
<doko> -Package: librlog1
<doko> +Package: librlog1c2
<doko>  Section: libs
<doko>  Architecture: any
<doko>  Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Depends}
<doko> no conflict/replaces ...
<doko> siretart, it's in the package, not in the diff
<siretart> ok I am too dumb for noticing this. sorry for bothering. (note to self, never bother others when already tired)
<siretart> will update..
<siretart> done
<\sh> going to bed...night guys.
<siretart> gn8, \sh
#ubuntu-motu 2005-06-07
<siretart> has anyone else also problems loggin into our wiki?
<siretart> ok, created new account, works again
<siretart> gn8, folks
<HiddenWolf> Ok, jongens
<HiddenWolf> geloofscrisis
<HiddenWolf> http://www.symphonyos.com/desktop.html
* HiddenWolf is onder de indruk
<mgalvin> dinner time, l8r all
<HiddenWolf> sorry, didn't tab right.
<HiddenWolf> That was dutch, and ment for #u-nl
<pf-guest> can anyone help a fool who fogot his usrname during a protracted move from one state to another??????
<pf-guest> :(  I guess not  *sigh*
<Unfrgiven> hi all
<Unfrgiven> im just building anjuta for gcc4. it builds cleanly
<Unfrgiven> and doesnt require any packages. do i need to do anything for this app?
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: nope
<Unfrgiven> bummer.. :(
<Unfrgiven> so are we only really concerned with libs?
<Unfrgiven> be back soon... got a meeting
<ajmitch> yes, just libs at the moment
* ajmitch will bbl also
<StR> Hi there...
<StR> anyone here could helo me with the gmailfs status?
<tseng> oh man there goes my productivity
<tseng> got mythtv going again
<schweeb> poor tseng
<schweeb> tseng: I'm ordering my new laptop
<tseng> schweeb: good
<tseng> schweeb: your old one sucks
<zul> anyone know what this error means...description-synopsis-starts-with-an-article
<tseng> zul: probably it starts with an article
<tseng> A, The.. right?
<zul> heh...yeah
<schweeb> tseng: getting an X41, fully loaded
<tseng> schweeb: rock on
<schweeb> then, my friend
<schweeb> THEN
<schweeb> I can start working on packages again
<tseng> yeah right
<tseng> slacker
<schweeb> hehe
<schweeb> I finally got my work VPN access, so things will be goin a lot easier
* [Chameleon]  is back (gone 15:58:48)
<Burgundavia> [Chameleon] , please turn that off
<[Chameleon] > Burgundavia: interesting... two channels I get a warm welcome, and one I get "please turn that off".
<Burgundavia> [Chameleon] , imagine if everybody had one of those things going
<Burgundavia> the signal noise ration would be horrendous
<[Chameleon] > Burgundavia: does everybody?
<[Chameleon] > Burgundavia: Just for you, I have configured it to be silent on channels with more than 30 users
<[Chameleon] > ... I think...
<[Chameleon] > let me test it
* [Chameleon]  is away: I'm busy
* [Chameleon]  is back (gone 00:00:04)
<jsgotangco> heh
<[Chameleon] > Burgundavia: did you see it?
<Burgundavia> yep
<jsgotangco> go nuts
<Burgundavia> and I saw it #ubuntu as well
<[Chameleon] > well, either it requires a restart or it just doesn't work.
<[Chameleon] > I think I have just turned it off...
<[Chameleon] > I just went away and back
<[Chameleon] > and I don't think it printed
<[Chameleon] > Burgundavia: confirm?
<Burgundavia> yes, i didn't see it that time
<[Chameleon] > Burgundavia: happy now?
<Burgundavia> yes
<Burgundavia> thank you
<[Chameleon] > yeah
<danko123456> can I ask this question here:  whats the difference between universe and multiverse?
<Unfrgiven> universe is open source software and multiverse is closed source.
<danko123456> thank you.
<Unfrgiven> danko123456: no probs :)
<danko123456> kk:)
<\sh> morning
<schweeb> night :)
<\sh> :))
<Unfrgiven> \sh: hey, how you doing?
<\sh> re
<Unfrgiven> re?!?
<crimmy> (re-hi)
<Unfrgiven> ah right )
<Unfrgiven> :)
<jsgotangco> Unfrgiven, hey
<Unfrgiven> ive got a problem with a pacakage i'm testing for the c++ transition. its called ocaml-nox but all other packages that depend on it depend on "ocaml-nox-3.08". in other words the maintainers have put the specific version number in the name. IMO this needs to be changed. does that sound ok? i'm going to remove the version number from the package name and the depends will become "ocaml-nox (>= 3.08)"
<Unfrgiven> jsgotangco: hey dude. how r u?
<jsgotangco> not bad
<jsgotangco> playing around with moin
<jsgotangco> heh
<Unfrgiven> jsgotangco: moin rocks :)
<jsgotangco> Unfrgiven, ive been trying about apache2 and moin on hoary
<jsgotangco> its been pretty seamless with apache2
<Unfrgiven> jsgotangco: just to let you know that I have been doing work on the intro developer docs... not ready for review yet but im still chugging away at it.
<jsgotangco> oohhh
<jsgotangco> that's great
<jsgotangco> i think i should update the wiki
<jsgotangco> just in case
<crimmy> Unfrgiven: that seems really, really odd.
<crimmy> Unfrgiven: are all those packages really strongly version-dependent?
<Unfrgiven> crimmy: yeah i was shocked. you can try it yourself... try apt-get install ocaml-findlib"
<Unfrgiven> crimmy: doesnt seem like it. and even if they were, its still the wrong way to do it
<crimmy> Unfrgiven: what does the Debian maintainer say?
<Unfrgiven> any pacakge dependant on ocaml-nox is uninstallable...
<Unfrgiven> crimmy: i havent e-mailed him yet. ill do so today
<crimmy> I would have ocaml-nox-3.08 provide ocaml-nox and thus have all packages depend on ocaml-nox
<crimmy> BUT that's only if those packages aren't strongly version-dependent
<Unfrgiven> why not call it ocaml-nox and have a depends in other packages as "ocaml-nox (= 3.08)"?
<\sh> first of all....I need a coffeine and some nicotine
<Unfrgiven> its a real mess
<DanielN> hi folks :)
<Unfrgiven> crimmy: im thinking that im just going to clean up the packages for ubuntu anyway... as it is they are not currently installable
<Unfrgiven> DanielN: hi :)
<Unfrgiven> heres a general question, when we package an app for ubuntu by using a debian package, do we need to change the "Maintainer" field in the control file?
<crimmy> no
<crimmy> Changed-by will be done automatically
<Unfrgiven> ok. but in the changelog we put our own name right?
<crimmy> yes
<crimmy> you could just call it ocaml-nox and have those packages depend on that = version, sure
<crimmy> you really need to work that out with the Debian maintainer [group] 
<Unfrgiven> crimmy: thats the plan.
<Unfrgiven> i will e-mail them... but i do think that they've stuffed something up here... because the packages are totally not installable (not on ubuntu or debian(
<DanielN> ouou
<DanielN> i need help
<Unfrgiven> DanielN: what can we help you with? :)
<DanielN> i've got a file, beginning with '\' and i need it know, but i can't copy it from console (only having console)
<Unfrgiven> '\\'?
<DanielN> no only \filename.sxw
<Unfrgiven> i meant, have you tried "cp \\filename.sxw blah"
<DanielN> yeah
<DanielN> ah
<DanielN> not yet ;)
<Unfrgiven> haha :)
<DanielN> haha
<DanielN> working
<DanielN> thanks a lot :)
<Unfrgiven> np
<\sh> jesus
<\sh> i fixed arkrpg
<Unfrgiven> \sh: congrats!
<crimmy> excellent
<Unfrgiven> \sh: i read your blog... it sounded painful
<\sh> yeah
<\sh> first of all, autotools sh*t and then g++ source errors :(
<Unfrgiven> \sh: now i just hope that someone actually uses it :)
<crimmy> autotools is always crack
<\sh> Unfrgiven: i don't mind :) but at least, we can go on with the universe cxx trans
<Unfrgiven> \sh: while everyone is here i may as well ask. whats the best way to identify packages that need love for the c++ transition. im talking universes specific. is it only stuff on the CXXLibraryList wiki page that doesn't have a "who" assigned? beucase i don't think that list has all the packages...
<\sh> Unfrgiven: well, most of it is on this list
<\sh> Unfrgiven: the rest we will take care about it later..first all libs must be done, then we need to see about the apps
<Unfrgiven> \sh: ok...
* Unfrgiven goes universe lib hunting...
<DanielN> \sh: it think i've fixed your requests now, uploaded :)
<\sh> DanielN: will check it later...need to fix some dtv issues here
<DanielN> no problem .. just wanted to inform you :)
<DanielN> does someone know, who to ping for ALSA related questions?
<DanielN> Cxx transition: is "just" rebuilding c++ packages with gcc4 ?
<\sh> not "just"..:)
<\sh> for g++ libs u have to rename the lib pkgs
<DanielN> ok
<DanielN> if you think i'm able to do some work there, i would help:)
<doko> DanielN, just pick a package, read the wiki pages, and file a bug report together with the patch
<DanielN> doko: and if no patch is required to build?
<doko> which package?
<DanielN> just for example
<doko> for a library, there's always a patach needed
<DanielN> aha
<DanielN> ok .. i think i have to read a bit more about
<DanielN> :)
<DanielN> and how i try to build with gcc4? pbuilder i.e. ?
<\sh> DanielN: in the end, u should have luck and everything is easy :) but if you find a package like arkrpg then you should sit early in the morning with classic music and the gcc-3.4 g++ changes documentation on the toilet and reading ;)
<doko> DanielN, just setup a breezy chroot
<doko> DanielN, pickup the cppopt package, looks like an easy one
<DanielN> doko: pbuilder won't suffice?
<DanielN> \sh: sounds like fun ;)
<doko> sure, if it runs in a breezy environment
<DanielN> it does :)
<DanielN> doko: so i'll try cppopt :)
<DanielN> hmm
<DanielN> doko: so i must do a patch only for renaming the package?
<doko> DanielN: yes
<DanielN> doko: and this happens like a normal patch?
<DanielN> but only diff debian/controll?
<doko> DanielN, depends on the package
<DanielN> yeah
<DanielN> i should have it now .. looked over some other patches to get it :)
<doko> you know https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/BreezyToolchainTransition ?
<DanielN> yep
<opi> morning :-)
<Treenaks> hey
<\sh> ok...eris is passed
<Treenaks> Eris?
<\sh> arkrpg ia64 compilation not ready...
<\sh> liberis-1.2
<\sh> oh did i say, i fixed all errors in arkrpg this morning? ;)
<Treenaks> \sh: it's now officially bug-free ?
<siretart> \sh: you did?! ROCK!
<siretart> \sh: what was it?
<\sh> Treenaks: i don't know, but now it's officially "compiling on my machine without errors"
<\sh> siretart: read my blogentry...I figured out, that listening to vanessa mae and her interpretation of vivaldi and reading g++ changes is good for better understanding
<\sh> siretart: the c++ errors were really easy in the end :)
<\sh> http://gcc.gnu.org/gcc-3.4/changes.html#cplusplus
<\sh> search in this document for: Using a name introduced by a typedef in a friend declaration or in an explicit instantiation is now rejected, as specified by the ISO C++ standard.
<\sh> and u find the solution after this sentence
<siretart> puh. you absolutly rock
<siretart> I justed tried it with g++-3.4, there it seemes to work
<siretart> gotta go, cu later
<ivoks> hi all
<ivoks> doko: ping
<ivoks> doko: I can't upload, I'm just a member, not MOTU :(
<ivoks> DanielN_: :)
<DanielN_> ivoks: here :)
<Unfrgiven> hi all ive just had a crack at packaging an app for the c++ transition. could someone review it?
<ivoks> DanielN_: to become MOTU, you have to be Member first
<DanielN_> yeah
<DanielN_> i know
<ivoks> DanielN_: are you member?
<DanielN_> no
<ivoks> :)
<DanielN_> ;(
<ivoks> then start with that first :)
<doko> DanielN_, just put it somewhere on the web
<DanielN_> what?
<doko> or submit a bug report in bugzilla.ubuntu.com
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: crack?
<DanielN_> doko: i have to provide the patch-diff only, right?
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: ?!?!
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: < Unfrgiven> hi all ive just had a crack
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: hehe aussie slang :)
<ivoks> DanielN_: i will help you with package... leave doko, he has much things to do :)
<ivoks> DanielN_: so... where did you stuck?
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: so... it doesn't compile or what? :)
<Unfrgiven> doko: could you review the package i just did for the c++ transition? http://ankur.ath.cx/ubuntu/libextractor/
<DanielN_> ivoks: i'm not stucked .. i don't now why he has pinged me :)
<ivoks> :)
<DanielN_> but thanks for your help anyway, i'll use it maybe other times :)
<doko> Unfrgiven: where's the debdiff?
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> doko: i could help him, if you want :)
<doko> ivoks: sure, please do
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: you have to do debdiff
<Unfrgiven> doko: ivoks: http://ankur.ath.cx/ubuntu/libextractor/libextractor_0.4.2-2.diff.gz
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: no, that's not it...
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: i'll explain you
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: when you d/w source, you get three files
<\sh> doko: thx for reviewing :)
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: .diff.gz, .dsc and .tar.gz
<Unfrgiven> yep
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: when you build your source, you also get .diff.gz, .dsc and .tar.gz
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: but different version
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: then you need to do debdiff <package>-<oldversion>.dsc <package>-<newversion>.dsc
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: that will output all the changes in these two releases
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: ah i see
<Unfrgiven> ok
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: so, we just download old source, put that diff, and we have your source
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: redirect output in some file, calling it .diff or .patch
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: ah gotcha. alright i'll do that now
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: and upload only that file, not whole source :)
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: i did same mistakes only 2-3 weeks ago :)
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: :)
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: thanks for the advice. ill have another "crack" at it ;)
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: so, i could take a look at your package, but i'm not a MOTU and can't do reviews or uploads
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: yeah me neither. im trying earn my way to becoming a MOTU :)
<DanielN_> candidate here too :)
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: there is something much better on that way than becoming a MOTU - you will learn how to package :)
<ivoks> i'm not candidate yet, i don't feel ready yet...
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: yeah im trying to learn that too... in fact im implementing the IntroDeveloperDocs spec... so learning packaging is a must!
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: do i need to add the "c2" to the "Package" field?
<ivoks> uh...
<ivoks> not only that...
<ivoks> you have to add c2 if it wasn't c102
<ivoks> and you have to fix dependecies
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: yeah it wasnt...
<ivoks> so -dev of that package depends on packagec2
<ivoks> and all dependencies, if they are different, of the source
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: ok cool, thanks :)
<ivoks> if there is libxclass, it must become libxclassc2
<ivoks> but not all apackages
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: so i need to also update all the packages from apt-cache rdepends <lib>?
<ivoks> you have check CxxLibraryList and apt-cache search
<ivoks> no
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: but you have to add new lines to control file
<ivoks> yourpackagec2 must replace yourpackage, and it has to conflict with yourpackage
<ivoks> yourpackage-dev must depend on yourpackagec2
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: ok... so Provides, Conflicts and Replaces?
<ivoks> no Provides
<ivoks> only Conflicts and Replaces
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: ok
<chmj> CXX Transition 101 -> wiki pages
<ivoks> yeah :)
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: it's not very easy in the begining
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: but after while you'll understand most of it...
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/CxxLibraryList
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: well with such friendly developers, i can only succeed :)
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> time to go...
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: ok, thanks for your help
<ivoks> np
<ivoks> you read that text on CxxLibraryList
<ogra> hi all
<ogra> is anybody fond of doing a postgresql transition for pittis new packages ?
<Unfrgiven> ogra: hi
<ogra> hey Unfrgiven
<Treenaks> ogra: change build-dep; check if it still works; re-upload, right?
<ogra> yep
<Treenaks> not too many packages?
<ogra> the list is on the ubuntu-devel ML
<Treenaks> yeah I saw it
<ivoks> ogra: hi :)
<Treenaks> pitti has been mailing a lot :)
<ogra> yep :)
<ogra> hi ivoks
<ivoks> and bye :)
<Treenaks> ogra: I could do the build-dep/recompile thing.. but I can't test all of them
<Treenaks> btw, tseng is our Mono god, right?
<\sh> hey ogra.
<ogra> Treenaks, if it happens now and they compile fine, there is enough time for user tests and bugreports...
<ogra> hi \sh
<Treenaks> ogra: ok :)
<ogra> :)
<Treenaks> ogra: anyway, tseng = mono-god?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> absolutely
<ogra> even novell knows that ;)
<Treenaks> :)
<Treenaks> you need libmono-dev to be able to run beagle (which doesn't compile on ppc/amd64..) on x86
<pitti> ogra: it might be a _bit_ more than that
<Treenaks> because it tries to find libMonoPosixHelper.so instead of $&.0
<Treenaks> pitti: oh? what more could it be?
<Treenaks> pitti: removing the "private" calls?
<pitti> transition to libpq-dev changes the include path, so packages should generally use "pg_config --includedir"
<pitti> Treenaks: no, they shouldn't appear in any external package (if they really do, well, that's my problem then)
<Treenaks> pitti: ok
<Treenaks> btw, when did mozilla-firefox become just plain firefox?
<Treenaks> and why didn't dist-upgrade upgrade it for me?
<Treenaks> should I make that a bug?
* Treenaks is full of questions today
<pitti> Treenaks: indeed, that sounds like a bug for thom
<Unfrgiven> ogra: can you review my first c++ transition package? libextractor_0.4.2-2ubuntu1.debdiff
<ogra> Unfrgiven, have you tagged it on the wiki ? and opened a bug with the patch attached ?
<Treenaks> pitti: when are you going to upload pg8?
<Unfrgiven> ogra: ive tagged the wiki. havent opened a bug yet. i wanted to make sure i was doing it right first.
<Treenaks> pitti: (so I can plan my time for the transition stuff)
<ogra> Unfrgiven, make a patch and add it to the bug...
<tseng|work> hi ogra
<pitti> Treenaks: next monday
<pitti> Treenaks: would be cool to have some help there :-)
<ogra> hey big mono master tseng|work
<pitti> moins tseng|work
<tseng|work> hiya pitti, everyone
<\sh> JESUS Oliver
<Unfrgiven> tseng|work: hey dude
<\sh> missing conflicts
<\sh> forgot to update the diff
<tseng|work> ogra: marks talk wasnt streamed! at least not archived
<Treenaks> tseng|work: it was.. only 50%
<tseng|work> how do you mean
<Treenaks> tseng|work: you mean the guadec talk right?
<tseng|work> yes
<ogra> \sh, just oliver please
<ogra> ;)
<Treenaks> tseng|work: there's the "partial keynote" from Mark on the archive page
<tseng|work> the video i got was just two guys dopping around with a projector
<tseng|work> no partial anything
<Treenaks> hmm. suckage
<\sh> ogra: if u need a helping hand for your bugs...:)
<ogra> \sh, i'd be happy about every Cxx thingie i can get rid of ;)
<tseng|work> ogra: oh beagle needs amd64 love
<tseng|work> ogra: there are non-PIC xorg libs now
<ogra> tseng|work, i'll look at it... (indeed)
<\sh> ogra: btw...I fixed arkrpg :) build issues and g++ issues...this morning it came to me ;)
<tseng|work> i imagine that will break alot
<tseng|work> :(
<ogra> i saw the upload
<Treenaks> tseng|work: according to fabbione, it's the way you call gcc or something
<tseng|work> Treenaks: as in, without -fPIC?
<Treenaks> tseng|work: it should call "ld" or something (see log)
<tseng|work> hm.
<Treenaks> tseng|work: and there's a libMonoPosixHelper.so vs libMonoPosixHelper.so.0 thing..
<tseng|work> Treenak: in what exe/dll?
<Treenaks> tseng|work: uh.. de-install libmono-dev and run beagled
<Treenaks> tseng|work: didn't log it
<Treenaks> sorry
<tseng|work> ok, thanks.
<tseng|work> do you have a wiki account?
<Treenaks> yes
<tseng|work> can you put that on the todo on MOTUMono
<Treenaks> k
<tseng|work> thanks!
<tseng|work> thats my tracking place for now
<\sh> ogra:i will take a look on your bugzilla list...and take everything I can manage
<tseng|work> i was nearly to the bottom of it too :)
<ogra> \sh, thanks a lot, owing you a beer ;)
<\sh> ogra: well...i owe u a beer :)
<ogra> so we are even then.... sad.....all nice beer we cant drink now :/
<tseng|work> Riddel is an upload monster
<Treenaks> tseng|work: KDE.. monster..
<Treenaks> ;)
<\sh> ogra: what about a meeting? when u have time?
<tseng|work> ogra: i am writing a cli packaging policy for debian
<ogra> yay
<tseng|work> ogra: CLIPolicy on the wiki
<ogra> oki, i'll check it
<tseng|work> thanks :)
<tseng|work> the end section will change to "mono specifics"
<ogra> \sh, my next weekends are fairly booked....
<Treenaks> tseng|work: note added to the wiki
<\sh> doko: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10804 i will upload for him
<\sh> ogra: check your schedule :) and let's occupy it for better things then working;)
<ivoks> will ubuntu follow LSB?
<ivoks> or.. accept LSB specifictions
<ogra> it already does (as far as they exist yet)
<ivoks> http://refspecs.freestandards.org/LSB_3.0.0/LSB-Core-generic/LSB-Core-generic/runlevels.html
<Treenaks> urgh.. the display manager runlevel crap
<Treenaks> if you don't want a displaymanager, remove it!
<ivoks> not onlt display manager
<Treenaks> ivoks: the rest is already te same
<Treenaks> ivoks: check /etc/inittab
<doko> \sh, yes please do
<ivoks> Treenaks: ok
<\sh> ivoks: u need review and upload for your cxx bugs?
<ivoks> \sh: upload - yes
<\sh> ok.
<\sh> hard night
<ivoks> review are doing only ogra and doko, IIRC?
<ogra> ivoks, i trust \sh's c++ knowledge even mre then my own....
<ivoks> ok then :)
<ivoks> \sh: shall we start? :)
<ivoks> \sh: http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11194
<ivoks> \sh: http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11083
<ivoks> \sh: http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11063
<ivoks> three would be enough for now... :)
<\sh> ivoks: moment...i have one xclass
<ivoks> ?
<ivoks> we fixed that one :)
<ivoks> together :)
<ogra> \sh, xclass can get uploaded after a testbuild
<\sh> heheh :) amd64 testbuild is included in my upload ;)
<ogra> great
<\sh> ogra: ivoks is right...xclass was one package, i fixed with ivoks...and tested it on ravel :)
<ivoks> lol
<ivoks> you fixed :)
<\sh> at least i deleted ;)
<\sh> fixing is something else ;)
<\sh> yeah..worked
<\sh> ivoks: please assign all your bugs to sh@sourcecode.de zhx
<\sh> -z+t
<\sh> so i have them in my list
<ivoks> ok
<\sh> thx
<\sh> ok...givemeonecoffeeandacigarettetime
<ivoks> \sh: there
<ivoks> others are builded and uploaded
<ivoks> \sh: why did you change status on libxclass?
<ogra> heh, i was about to aks the same
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> i think like a real MOTU :)
<ivoks> opencv is too much for me :(
<ivoks> FTBS on amd64 and ia64
* Treenaks kicks the wiki in the groin
<\sh> Accepted:
<\sh> xclass_0.8.3-1ubuntu2.diff.gz
<\sh>  to pool/universe/x/xclass/xclass_0.8.3-1ubuntu2.diff.gz
<\sh> what?
<\sh> ivoks: please have an eye on http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/byDate/today.html
<ivoks> ?
<\sh> ivoks: if you package failes or succeed you will see it there :)
<chmj> \sh, did you upload libcoin ?
<\sh> chmj: no..i was waiting for an answer :)
<ivoks> \sh: i know that :)
<ivoks> \sh: opencv will fail, don't upload it
<ivoks> \sh: others should work
<\sh> chmj: but i can upload it if you want...
<\sh> ivoks: i will check it on ravel
<chmj> \sh, no, let me check
<\sh> chmj: k
<DanielN_> rofl
<DanielN_> i can't report on bugzilla
<ivoks> sure you can...
<DanielN_> "Yo must choose a component" .. but there isn't a possibiliti in the form to select a component :/
<ivoks> type it's name :)
<\sh> UNKNOWN
<ivoks> it would be too long list :)
<\sh> is the component for universe
<ivoks> \sh: only for transition
<DanielN_> ok
<ivoks> ttg
<ivoks> bye
<\sh> ivoks: geht doch ;)
<\sh> xclass_0.8.3-1ubuntu2_20050531-1346-powerpc-successful.gz
<\sh> xclass_0.8.3-1ubuntu2_20050531-1346-amd64-successful.gz
<\sh> xclass_0.8.3-1ubuntu2_20050531-1346-ia64-successful.gz
<\sh> xclass_0.8.3-1ubuntu2_20050531-1349-i386-successful.gz
<\sh> ivoks for motu ;)
<chmj> \sh, whats your version on libcoin ?
<ogra> \sh, on his way ;)
<DanielN_> https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11372
<DanielN_> don't know if my patch is ok, but i tried it :)
<\sh> 2.3.0-1ubuntu1 (after trans)
<\sh> libcoin40
<\sh> coin2 as src package
<chmj> bug number?
<\sh> https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11043
<DanielN_> could someone check that speedy ? :P
<chmj> I just did
<chmj> posted a reply
<DanielN_> chmj: reffering to which but, now?
<DanielN_> bug
<chmj> yours #11372
<DanielN_> ok
<DanielN_> i'm checking back :)
<\sh> argl..ivoks
<chmj> \sh, seems ok, go for it
<DanielN_> chmj: what you mean exactly with "use source package name"? Replaces and Conflicts will be done just now
<\sh> chmj: coin2? upload?
<\sh> uploaded now :)
<chmj> DanielN_, like this : CXX Transition: <source package name> - renaming <library> to <library>c2
<DanielN_> chmj: done :)
<\sh> ok..ETA to go home: -22m
<DanielN_> :D
<DanielN_> me 2 \sh: working until 5 sucks ;)
<\sh> ogra: ping
<ogra> \sh, pong
<\sh> ogra: today is TB at 8pm UTC but I will be a little bit late...max. 30 mins or something
<ogra> oki
<\sh> so if ivoks is on motu way...put a ++ for me :)
<mgalvin> hi all
<ogra> oki
<\sh> home now :)
<Amaranth> damn, now i wish i was a community member :)
<DanielN_> mhm?
<\sh> re
<\sh> key
<\sh> most of ivoks stuff is uploaded
<\sh> 1 is not working
<\sh> one faile
<ivoks> hi
<\sh> ah ivoks
<ivoks> \sh: ping
<ivoks> :)
<\sh> one patch is wrong
<ivoks> let's see your observations...
<\sh> one package was not compiling
<\sh> openscenebla
<ivoks> we will see :)
<ivoks> you said strutilsxx
<\sh> for the patch...add a new changelog entry
<\sh> yeah
<ivoks> there are two patches!
<\sh> thats the patch one
<ivoks> \sh: you have to patch it with first, then second
<\sh> the 2nd patch which should change the libname i think...u updated the last changelog entry.and it ends up in a patch reject
<\sh> ivoks: i did .)
<ivoks> let me see..
<\sh> ubuntu1 is in the tree
<\sh> and i should say ubunut2 concerning your comments
<ivoks> hm, strange...
<ivoks> ok, i'll make another one...
<\sh> ivoks: ubuntu2 must be the rev
<ivoks> i know
<ivoks> it seems i uploaded wrong patch :)
<ivoks> wait...
<ivoks> this package was fixed and uploaded by someone
<ivoks> it doesn't need new patch
<ivoks> or... just a sec... argh...
<\sh> <pre id="comment_text_2">rong package name in shlibs file, please fix ASAP</pre>
<ivoks> i know...
<\sh> that was doko
<ivoks>  libstrutilsxx0.7
<\sh> and i think he uploaded the source with your first patch
<ivoks> instead of libstrutilsxx0.7 :)
<ivoks> c2
<ivoks> gr...
<ivoks> fix is on the way :)
<ivoks> building...
<\sh> thx
<ivoks> fixed, uploaded patch
<ivoks> what's wrong with openscenegraph?
<\sh> ivoks: didn't check the buildlogs now...i only saw that it was failing
<ivoks> i'm going crazy with stoopid gaim
<ogra> ivoks, see jdubs talk, gaim is good for highschool girls ;) http://stream.fluendo.com/archive/6uadec/Jeff_Waugh_-_Project_Topaz.ogg
<Nafallo> ogra: you should have seen my gf when she read that ;-)
<ogra> hehe
<ogra> Nafallo, you wathched the talk live ?
<ogra> s/talk/stream
<Nafallo> ogra: yepp. every since I knew there where streams I've followed them :-).
<ivoks> eh..
<ivoks> it show me two copys of same user :)
<Nafallo> ogra: I've eaten atleast 3 bowls of popcorn a day ;-).
<ogra> hehehe
<ivoks> ok... how much of this stream is waiting for speech? :)
<ogra> some minutes before it starts... its probably clever to download it and move a bit forward....
<ivoks> it's 300MB :)
<ivoks> pardon, 130
<ivoks> :)
<ogra> but you can see mvo and me running around and seb128 looking while waiting ;)
<ivoks> yuhu! here it comes
<ivoks> ogra: i don't know you yet :)
<ogra> ivoks, there is one or the other picture of me on the web ;)
<ivoks> it would be funny to see KDE on this conference :)
<doko> ivoks: just another old hacker, nothing spectacular ... ;-)
<ivoks> doko: :))
<Amaranth> hi, i hate users
<Amaranth> :/
<ivoks> you see one, you've seen them all :)
<ogra> doko, but with a baggy belly like yours since sydney ;)
<ivoks> i'll have to come to one conference to meet you all guys
<ivoks> any one willing to sponsor my trip? :)
<ivoks> omg.. topaz 3.0
<ivoks> :))
<\sh> ogra is the man with long hairs ;)
<\sh> but there r many long haired men ;)
<ogra> hehe _the_ man ?
<ogra> ivoks, http://www.flickr.com/photos/whiprush/13478028/
<ivoks> ;)
<\sh> ogra: i found a nicer one :)
<\sh> ogra: and i will blog it :)
<\sh> and I want to know what grass u smoked ;)
<ogra> argh
<\sh> haha
<\sh> http://linux.blogweb.de/archives/26-Oh-my-god.html
* \sh runs
<ogra> \sh, thats harmless
<ogra> there are worse pictures of me :)
<\sh> ogra: but take a look ... your eyes...i mean, this only happens with too much you know what inside...or sitting 96h in front of a crt ;)
<\sh> bbut when I found it, I was sitting in the NOC and was laughing like hell
<ogra> you mean the beautiful rings ?
<\sh> they're so small :)
<ogra> hey, i'm over 30, i'm supposed to get rings around my eyes and pleats
<ivoks> will there be screenshots? :)
<\sh> ogra: hahaha....i don't have rings under my eyes...and u r only 1 year older then me :)
<ogra> \sh, wait a year ;) (or ask doko)
<ivoks> that's why i'm still 23 :)
<chillywilly> who is who in that picture?
<\sh> ogra: dmitry is going to be 30 in two weeks...and he's starting already to forget things...he didn'tbelieve me when I told him, that he's getting alzheimer now ;)
<ivoks> nice ambition...
<ivoks> 10 untill 2010
<ogra> 10x10, yeah
<chillywilly> nice pics
<ivoks> impossible...
<ogra> ivoks, only with such an attitude ....
<ivoks> ogra: i agree
<ivoks> but, still...
<ivoks> this is uberambition :)
<\sh> what is 10x10?
<ogra> hey, we have very big backers
<ivoks> gnome covering 10% of global desktop untill 2010
<ogra> ivoks, nokia is using gnome in the future....
<ivoks> ogra: i know
<ivoks> ogra: i'm planing to buy 770
<\sh> ivoks: ah....yeah right, 90x10 for kde
<ogra> we have novell pushing (and paying for) ximian....
<\sh> ogra: novell == suse == kde ;)
<ivoks> yeah... but novell reportet losses this querter
<ogra> brazil and spain are big gnome backing countrys....
<ogra> \sh, wrong
<ivoks> \sh: novell will dump KDE in suse
<\sh> hmm..then its time that redhat buys novell
<ogra> \sh, novell == ximian + suse + kde + a lot of political fuss
<ogra> \sh, redhat == gnome....
<\sh> ogra: thats why
<Lathiat_> novell linux desktop = gnome + yast
<ivoks> more important ubuntu == gnome
<\sh> anyways...no trolling
<\sh> now...i have to shower
<\sh> but before...can I remove the candidates from tb agenda?
<ogra> \sh, everybody should do that himself
<ogra> after being approved
<\sh> on maintainer candidates yes, but on the TechnicalBoardAgenda
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> these can go, yes
<ogra> but only the Consider lines, i'm not sure when the rest appeared there
<\sh> sure only the consider lines
<\sh> the rest is new
<\sh> shower
<plugwash> don't most distros ship both kde and gnome?
<ivoks> plugwash: i think all, except slackware :)
<ogra> plugwash, not by default....
<ogra> plugwash, most of them select one default...
<ogra> as suse uses KDE and redhat uses gnome
<ogra> (even if they ship and install both)
<ivoks> well, you can't have two defaults :)
<ogra> redhat once tried
<ogra> (mixin gnome and kde)
<plugwash> or there is debian which afaict ships neither gnome or kde by default
<ogra> debian ships and installs both by default if you install the desktop task
<ivoks> there it is... gaim for girls
<Nafallo> ivoks: :-)
<ivoks> but it still sucks :)
<chillywilly> ajmitch: naughty naughty
<chillywilly> http://www.flickr.com/photos/whiprush/13477862/
* #ubuntu-motu  [freenode-info]  help freenode weed out clonebots, please register your IRC nick and auto-identify: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup
<herve> hi
(abelli/#ubuntu-motu) ok, ppl .. thanx a lot .. ill install gnu darwin .. not really a problem .. it's just something that works ..
(\sh/#ubuntu-motu) abelli: what about kde?
(\sh/#ubuntu-motu) oh meeting starts
(abelli/#ubuntu-motu) \sh: nothing interesting .. ogra and i needed some horse power for ruby ..
<ogra> exclude me there please :)
<abelli> have a good meeting ppl, thanks for everything you're doing (ohh how nice is plan9 ... what an OS) ..
<abelli> well "plan9 is different .. not the usual OSes .. language interpreters .. simply work on there" .
<abelli> s/Ses/Se
<abelli> a present for you: http://pastebin.com/292857
<abelli> libfmod has problems with uhu-pkg
<ivoks> omg
<ivoks> :)
<abelli> ivoks: what?
<ajmitch> ivoks: congrats
<abelli> ivoks: congratulations .. for everything ..
<ivoks> thanks
<ivoks> 7 days ago i wasn't even a member :)
<ajmitch> bbiab
<ivoks> diamond: congrats
<diamond> ivoks: cheers -)
<ivoks> yuhu!
<dholbach> ROCK
<ivoks> let's get drunk
<dholbach> add yourself to wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU please :)
<Mithrandir> tseng|work: you're wanted in -meeting
<dholbach> ivoks, diamond: would you send a signed mail to elmo (as discussed on wiki/Uploads) and clarify with mako that he got your signed CoC?
<ivoks> sure
<diamond> dholbach: i'm pretty sure elmo's added my key to the keyring,
<diamond> dholbach: at least, when dredg uploaded the packages i'd fixed,
<dholbach> diamond: not before you became motu
<diamond> dholbach: i stopped seeing it on #hoary-changes after a while
<diamond> dholbach: right
<dholbach> 1) whitelisting of mail adress
<dholbach> 2) keyring (permission to upload)
<diamond> ah. whitelisting. that must have been it so
<ajmitch> diamond: you got in? well done :)
<dholbach> after that you're completely in MOTU land
<diamond> ajmitch: i think so. it's either that or it's all a cruel hoax. i'm gonna put my hands over my ears and go with the first option -)
<diamond> dholbach: ok, cool.
<elmo> dholbach: dude, please have people mail the role address and not me personally
<elmo> the role address goes (or will go) into a RT system, my email doesn't
<diamond> elmo: i.e. keyring@, right?
<dholbach> elmo: i said so: "wiki/Uploads"
<elmo> diamond: yes
<elmo> dholbach: "< dholbach> ivoks, diamond: would you send a signed mail to elmo ("
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> i'm reading wiki
<ivoks> don't worry
<diamond> elmo: wiki/Uploads could be slightly clearer on this, should i send a signed mail, with my gpg public key attached?
<ivoks> yeah...
<ivoks> i don't get it too :)
<dholbach> elmo: excuse me for not making it more precise... i just wanted to add the fact that you could be asked for anything going wrong with it... sorry
<diamond> or just random "Hi, new maintainer, this mail is signed with my personal gpg key"?
<elmo> diamond: doesn't matter of the mail is signed, as long as I get the key-id from you one way or the other
<elmo> dholbach: sorry, not having a go, it's just I've had a bunch of MOTUs mail me direct, and they all said you told them to :)
<dholbach> HAHAHA
<ivoks> :>
<diamond> elmo: ok, cool. i can clarify it on wiki/Uploads if you think that's a good idea?
<dholbach> i will completely stop NOW
* diamond grins
<elmo> diamond: sure
<diamond> right. if i clarify it wrong, hit me -)
<ajmitch> dholbach: you're just too eager :)
<ivoks> and that's good
<diamond> how does " * New maintainers should mail keyring@ubuntulinux.org with their gpg key id to get added" sound?
<dholbach> just add "i, John Doe (ircnick) was made a MOTU on <date>", so $APPROPRIATE_PERSON will remember :)
<elmo> diamon: please use ubuntu.com, but otherwise fine
<diamond> elmo: ok, np. i'll change the existing address then too...
<ivoks> there... signed and mailed
<ogra> tseng|work, they just asked about mono in main... but all buerocracy is already done ;)
<diamond> i have a wiki question, on wiki/Uploads, why do some paragraphs have bullets in front of them and others not, they've all got ' * ' before them in the edit source...
<diamond> can't figure out why the line i added clarifying the new maintainer keyring stuff is bulleted, it probably shouldn't be
<dholbach> that's a wiki error
<dholbach> don't mind
<\sh> i need a faster machine I think
<diamond> dholbach: ah, ok. i'll stop stressing then -)
<dholbach> you don't
<dholbach> :)
<dholbach> the wiki does
<dholbach> i can tell ;-)
<diamond> signed and mailed too. i hope ,-) first time using mutt for gpg on that box
<diamond> hmm. should i be adding myself to http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UbuntuMembers as well?
<diamond> it seems a bit neglected
<ivoks> strange...
<\sh> guys... i will ask the question here then :) are we able to get at least shell access on amd64,ppc,ia64 to compile and test packages before sending them to the buildd somewhere? (i want to exclude private or personal hardware, I'm thinking more of farms like sf.net)
<ivoks> damn... problems :(
<ivoks> my wifi-radar will get replaced :(
<Mithrandir> \sh: for amd64, ravel.
<\sh> Mithrandir: yeah :) but this is normally your personal (maswans) playground..(private?)
<Mithrandir> \sh: it's not a private box, it's run by the high performance computing center, north, in Sweden.
<\sh> Mithrandir: is it sponsored for those works? :)
<Mithrandir> yes, it's a box given from AMD sweden for Debian porting work.
<Mithrandir> iirc
<\sh> Mithrandir: nice...do u think more companies like amd would sponsor diff. arch hardware for those projects? it would be nice to see a chroot or at least a compile stage directly on ppc or ia64 (just like i see it now on ravel for amd64)
<Mithrandir> \sh: canonical obviously has a bunch of hardware; I can ask if there's any way we can provide some sort of compile farms for people.
<dholbach> good night
<\sh> Mithrandir: this would be more then kewl...
<\sh> gnight daniel
<dholbach> bye st. hermann ;-)
<\sh> saint ... the time must be there for this ;)
<dholbach> :)
<\sh> ajmitch: ping :)
<ajmitch> \sh: yep, boss is around, I'm at work :)
<\sh> ajmitch: so what do u think...via debian or should debian sync from ubuntu? ;)
<plugwash> surely the best way would be for the same maintainer to be involved with a package on both sides
<ajmitch> ideally, yes
<\sh> plugwash: this would be me
<ajmitch> so, get it into debian :)
<\sh> but i'm against putting everything into one package :)
<tseng> hi
<ajmitch> hello tseng
<\sh> ok....stopping for toda...cu tomorrow morning :)
<\sh> gnight
<dholbach> bye \sh
#ubuntu-motu 2005-06-08
<dholbach> good night everyone... now really
<Unfrgiven> good morning all
<ajmitch> hi Unfrgiven
<diamond__> nite folks.
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: hey dude :)
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: how goes it
<ajmitch> it goes ok, what's up?
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: i did my first c++ transition package yesterday. i am trying to get someone to review it :) you free for a few min?
<ajmitch> nope, I'm about to go out for an hour
<Unfrgiven> i figure an early review will identify anything im doing wrong and then i can proceed with other packages
<ajmitch> I'll be back home after that for a bit though
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: ok no probs :)
<tseng> hi
<ajmitch> hi Arrogance
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: in case you get time, the package is called libextractor. patch is on bugzilla
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: sure, will do
* ajmitch will bbl
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: :) thanks
<Arrogance> evening
<ajmitch> back..
<crimsun> re
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: for libextractor, I think debian/changelog should have the changes, like the renaming :)
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: you also need to rename the files in debian/ that are libextractor1.*, and change the shlibs
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: ok thanks. ill do that now. what do i need to do with the shlibs?
<ajmitch> change it to use libextractor1c2 :)
<ajmitch> it's important so that anything built with libextractor-dev gets the right lib dependency
<ajmitch> bbiab
<Unfrgiven> im having a problem with another package which FTBFS. one of the problems ive seen is that the Makefile.am for one of the subdirs does not include $(X_CFLAGS) for the variable swfplayer_CFLAGS. but when I add it to Makefile.am and re-configure, the X_CFLAGS doesn't show up in Makefile.in nor Makefile. what gives?
<ivoks> averybody: ping :)
<ivoks> hi
<whiprush> heya Unfrgiven
<ivoks> anyone has up-to-date breezy?
<ivoks> omg....
<ivoks> ls: /usr/lib/X11: No such file or directory
<ajmitch> ivoks: and you'e surprised? :)
<ivoks> ajmitch: yeah :)
<ivoks> ajmitch: could you check you /usr/include/X11
<ivoks> is it a link to /usr/X11R6/include?
<ajmitch> still a dir here
<ajmitch> not sure if I'm right up-to-date though for X
<ivoks> i am
<ivoks> so... when that happend? :)
* ajmitch shrugs :)
<ajmitch> check the package changelog :)
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks>  The 'what could possibly go wrong?' release.
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> doh...
<ivoks> Donations of sales of the Nokia 770 Internet Tablet in the Developer Device Program will go to the GNOME Foundation. - nice
<ajmitch> of 500 of them.. not all
<ivoks> yeah, i know
<Treenaks> ajmitch: still
<ivoks> i'll buy 770
<|QuaD-_> ivoks: do you know the price yet?
<ivoks> i heard something arrounf 300$
<ivoks> strange, it doesn't support ogg
<|QuaD-_> thats actually not bad
<|QuaD-_> i wish i needed one
<ivoks> 300$ is ok price
<ivoks> but it must have ogg support :)
<|QuaD-_> its small which is nice
<|QuaD-_> hopefully can install windows programs
<|QuaD-_> *linux programs
<|QuaD-_> blah
<|QuaD-_> not window
<|QuaD-_> s
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> well, it has file manager
<ivoks> but... who knows...
<|QuaD-_> i want things like ssh and vnc
<|QuaD-_> not just a webbrowser
<|QuaD-_> i have my sidekick2 for that
<ivoks> ssh? without keyboard? :)
<|QuaD-_> ivoks: they can put one in!
<|QuaD-_> clipon or whatnot
<ivoks> but that would be nice
<ivoks> you'll be able to chroot on it and develop :)
<ivoks> it works trough usb-storage :)
<|QuaD-_> i would actually zaurus
<|QuaD-_> *rather a
<ivoks> hm...
<ivoks> Reproduction, transfer, distribution or storage of part or all of the contents in this document in any form without the prior written permission of Nokia is prohibited.
<|QuaD-_> lol
<|QuaD-_> now time for bed
<\sh> morning
<DanielN> morning :)
<\sh> grmpf
<Unfrgiven> \sh: hey dude
* \sh has a problem
<siretart> hi \sh
<\sh> what about c libs which have to be recompiled?
<\sh> morning guys
* siretart has to held a talk in 15 minutes.. :/
<siretart> hold, even
<Mithrandir> \sh: hm?  Why would C libs have to be recompiled?
<\sh> Mithrandir: i have one c++ lib...gnome-chemistry-utils/
<siretart> \sh: the C-ABI should be stable
<\sh> it needs gtkglext-1.0.6
<\sh> but gtkglext is not being installed in my breezy pbuilder cause of deps
<\sh> libgtkglext1-dev is not being installed at least
<Unfrgiven> \sh: i was doing this package libflash for the cxx transition. it was marked FTBFS for gcc4. in looking at the package it became clear to me that the problem was actually the autotools files. so i looked at the home page and found new a upstream release. so instead, i packaged it. it builds on gcc4 and has the new naming conventions in place. i need a review :)
<koke> hey, how it's going the transition?
<\sh> 1/3 of universe libs done
<koke> sorry, but I'm too busy now with work+exams
<koke> great :)
<\sh> Unfrgiven: again...libflash-0.4.11-4  is broken
<\sh> Unfrgiven: and what version u have now?
<Unfrgiven> \sh: 0.4.13 :)
<\sh> u packaged it completly new or u took over the debian and worked with uupdate?
<Unfrgiven> i downloaded the package from upstream... and massaged the debian/ files to fit with the new version.
<\sh> Unfrgiven: bugno?
<Unfrgiven> \sh: i havent created a bug yet... do we normally do new upstream releases as bugs?
<\sh> Unfrgiven: it belongs to the cxx transistion :)
<Unfrgiven> \sh: ok :) ill create a bug now...
<koke> ogra: I've just seen serpentine
<koke> do you know MixMaker?? http://mixmaker.forge.trilug.org/screenshots.php
<koke> I haven't tried yet but it looks nice
<\sh> the deps are fcked
<DanielN> patched aqsis-libs :)
<DanielN> need 2 more MOTU's to review :)
<DanielN> yep
<DanielN> i see .. reviewing isn't a graceful task ;)
<DanielN> micropolygon.cpp:41: error: declaration of 'Aqsis::CqMemoryPool<Aqsis::CqMicroPolygon, 512l> Aqsis::CqPoolable<Aqsis::CqMicroPolygon, 512l>::m_thePool' outside of class is not definition
<DanielN> micropolygon.cpp:42: error: declaration of 'Aqsis::CqMemoryPool<Aqsis::CqMovingMicroPolygonKey, 512l> Aqsis::CqPoolable<Aqsis::CqMovingMicroPolygonKey, 512l>::m_thePool' outside of class is not definition
<DanielN> could someone help out with that?
<Nafallo> hmm, apt-cacher should switch places on apache and apache2 in it's deps.
<ogra> terrex, hi :)
<ogra> the biggest differenc to debian packaging here is, taht we do most of the stuff in teams/as a team instead of having personalized packages....
<ogra> there re some technical differences as well, i.e. the versioning scheme must allow us to update from the debian version....
<ogra> but the debian NM guide is a good start for ow :)
<ogra> now
<terrex> then, developping in ubuntu is more hierarchized?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> more teamwork
<terrex> i understand.
<ogra> we review the packages of each other for example....
<ogra> we have certain teams for certain tasks, you can see them on wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUTeams
<ogra> we try to share the knowledge....
<terrex> hehe, it seams that you've worked in debian before.
<ogra> nope, but i used debian for more then 8 years and follwed the development
<terrex> ok
<ogra> one of the worst things there are the personalized packages.... if you do an NMU there you might get flamed badly afterwards...
<ogra> but if the dev just dissapears his package might hold up everything....
<ogra> this cant happen in ubuntu and is essential with such a thing like time based releases :)
<Treenaks> ogra: I think it would be a good thing for Debian too
<Treenaks> ogra: it would make mass migrations a lot easier
<ogra> yep... they are thinking about a teambased model afaik
<Treenaks> ogra: (like the toolchain thing, etc)
<ogra> yep
<terrex> and, why debian releases so slow ?
<DanielN> could someone help me out with aqsis (cxx-trans) ?
<DanielN> i've got an error while compiling
<ogra> terrex, politics ?
<Treenaks> ogra: eternal discussion about nothing
<Treenaks> ogra: i.e. flamewars. i.e. politics
<ogra> yeps
<terrex> there is a lot of debian based distributions, but ubuntu was the first to include xorg instead xfree3, per example.
<ogra> yeah, we are quick ;)
<ogra> for breezy we are the first that base nearly everything on gcc4
<ogra> and include mono by default
<DanielN> yeah, even aqsis :)
<DanielN> moin dahane :)
<dahane> moin DanielN :)
<DanielN> ogra: ping :)
<DanielN> host unreachable ;)
<ogra> DanielN, pong
<ogra> which host ?
<DanielN> just a joke
<DanielN> ogra: my error, posted above .. is this code related or what?
<ogra> might be, i'm not a C++ guy :) but it looks like.... doko ?
<\sh> i'll have a look
<\sh> tired like hell i am ;)
<DanielN> ok, then i provide this package to someone other..as a gift.. (no c++ guy at all)
<ogra> the "declaration" thingie smells like it
<DanielN> yep
<\sh> what is it?
<DanielN> aqsis
<\sh> 1.0.0-1?
<DanielN> yep
<\sh> asquis-libsc2?
<DanielN> yep
<\sh> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<\sh>   libfltk1.1-dev: Depends: libfltk1.1 (= 1.1.6-2ubuntu4) but it is not going to be installed
<\sh> DanielN:
<DanielN> \sh:
<\sh> libfltk1.1: Depends: xlibmesa-glu but it is not going to be installed or
<\sh>                        libglu1
<\sh> i can't build it
<DanielN> \sh: you can't build what?
<\sh> DanielN: aquis
<DanielN> aqsis
<Amaranth> backports meething in 6 hours?
<ogra> yep :(
<Amaranth> is jdahl even going to be there?
<DanielN> \sh: yep me too, but i didn't et any deps errors
<\sh> DanielN: i get the dep errors
<\sh> DanielN: u made an update?
<ogra> all the backports people will be there if i understood right
<Amaranth> jdahl is the only backports guy
<ogra> nope, there are at least three
<ogra> we talked to thm
<ogra> them
<Amaranth> i mean, he runs the project and does most of the backports, but he accepts packages from other people
<Amaranth> oh
<ogra> one got a member last CC meeting....
<doko> ogra: learn it ;-p
<ogra> :P
<DanielN> \sh: but i didn't change anything with deps
<\sh> DanielN: me neither
<DanielN> mhm
<ogra> seems i have to.... i have to port pdf utils to poppler....
<DanielN> i've taken it from hoary archive
<DanielN> \sh: and it compiled well .. even this c++ related error was there
<DanielN> argh
<DanielN> breezy i mean
<\sh> doko: there r some issues with deps
<\sh> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<\sh>   libfltk1.1: Depends: xlibmesa-glu but it is not going to be installed or
<\sh>                        libglu1
<\sh> doko: just updated my breezy chroot and pbuilder again
<\sh> it's now the second package i found with the same error message
<\sh> libgtkglext1 is another one
<ogra> \sh, ping daniels about it .... thats X related
<\sh> ogra: no :) it's dep related..I think rechecking deps and recompile would help
<\sh> ogra: but these r c libs...and i don't want to put my hands on it
<doko> ogra, \sh: no, it's not X related
<ogra> doko, sure, the package names changed...
<\sh> ogra: so it's only build related...shoud I touch the build-deps for those packages?
<doko> ogra: no
<ogra> libglu1-xorg
<ivoks> hi all! :)
<ogra> hey ivoks
<ivoks> i still can't belive what happend last night :)
<ogra> heh
<doko> ogra: look at the build deps ...
<doko> \sh, gtkglext is in universe, and is not yet rebuilt.
<\sh> libglu-dev-xorg is it now, right?
<\sh> doko: hmm can we force it?
<ivoks> ok, new x libs
<ivoks> does this one fix links?
<ogra> doko, ther is an "or" so if the second name is right it should build
<\sh> ivoks: no
<ogra> and the second name should be libglu1-xorg instead of libglu1
<ivoks> :(
<doko> \sh, trying with a rebuild
<\sh> doko: without changing the rev?
<doko> no
<\sh> ok...touching the package then...and uplaod
* \sh should go home
<\sh> doko: so the policy for plain rebuilding is: adjustin rev -> checking build-deps -> debuild -S and upload?
<ivoks> gr...
<doko> \sh, yes, except that C++ apps in universe are currently frozen, so don't even try it ;-)
<ivoks> ok, should I patch openscenegraph to include files from /usr/X11R6/include or wait fixing /usr/include/X11?
<\sh> doko: i'm talking about libs :)
<\sh> doko: e.g. gnome-chemistry-utils build-deps on gtkglext
<\sh> and who the hell changed "StephanHermann" to "sh" in the cxx lib list?
<\sh> ,-)
<ivoks> :)
<\sh> he forgot the \ ,-)
<doko> \sh, it's shorter and you can read the comments in the last column
<chmj> and we use IRC nicks mostly anyway
<\sh> just joking
<\sh> adjusting build deps
<DanielN> goddamn shit here at work
<DanielN> sucks ...
<\sh> DanielN: i will rebuild libfltk as well
<DanielN> \sh: ok, thanks
<\sh> doko: u were faster ;)
<doko> \sh: I know ;)
<\sh> but i uploaded gtkglext ;)
<\sh> btw...
<\sh> after the packages are successfully build how long it takes to the apt-repositories and to the mirrors?
<Amaranth> 6 hours, iirc
<Amaranth> well, they mirror every 6 hours
<\sh> Amaranth: and the main apt-repos? how long it takes from buildd to them?
<\sh> directly?
<Amaranth> *shrug*
<ogra> \sh, i think to the main archive its about 45 min
<ogra> (worst case)
<DanielN> arghl
<DanielN> i'm near to the gummizelle
<dahane> lol
<DanielN> :)
<Treenaks> DanielN: the what?
<DanielN> Treenaks: don't know how to say that in english
<DanielN> mabye the gum-prison? :P
<dahane> rubber-cell ?
<DanielN> LOL :D
<Treenaks> DanielN: the only part I didn't know was "zelle", but thanks :)
<Treenaks> padded cell?
<DanielN> maybe
<DanielN> don't know.. but it's used for psychos here :)
<Treenaks> DanielN: yeah, the cell with the soft walls so you can't hurt yourself :)
<DanielN> right .. this one i mean
<DanielN> and i'm near to her :>
<doko> \sh, as I said ... won't help, the archive is still frozen for C++ apps
<DanielN> must smoke one now...
<DanielN> or i'll go crazy with this fucking win packaging tools
<\sh> doko: what c++ app?
<DanielN> it's a lib
<\sh> i don't get it :)
<doko> gtkglext?
<\sh> is a lib?
<ogra> Package: gtkglext
<ogra> Binary: libgtkglext1-dev, libgtkglext1, libgtkglext1-doc
<\sh> and a plain C one ;)
<\sh> hmm
<\sh> I'm getting mad...take gtkmm libs
<ivoks> ok, libpqxx is mess :)
<ivoks> but it builded on i386
<ivoks> so, how can i test it on other platforms now?
<\sh> ivoks: u have a signed gpg key now?
<ivoks> yes
<\sh> so ask Mithrandir for amd64
<ivoks> i did...
<ivoks> he told me to send email, and i did that..
<ivoks> no response yet :)
<ivoks> \sh: http://pks.aaiedu.hr:11371/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=0x6C1277A9D3BDA225
<DanielN> ivoks: MOTU now?
<ivoks> DanielN: yes :)
<ivoks> DanielN: your name was called on the meeting, but you weren't there
<DanielN> ivoks: congrats then!!! :)
<DanielN> ivoks: damn .. didn't know it
<ivoks> DanielN: but, you aren't member yet, so...
<DanielN> yeah
<DanielN> but i'm on the NewMember list now
<DanielN> so first step is done :)
<ivoks> no
<ivoks> you have to become Member first
<ivoks> ok
<DanielN> yeah
<DanielN> i said im on the newmembers list ;)
<DanielN> how long does this take .. ivoks ?
<ivoks> it depends
<ivoks> on your work
<ivoks> tritium: hi
<tritium> hi ivoks
<DanielN> ivoks: lol .. so i can wait until hurd is there or something :)
<DanielN> ivoks: next meeting i'll be there .. it's a techboard meeting, right?
<\sh> ivoks: i reassign #11083 back to u :)
<ivoks> DanielN: no
<ivoks> \sh: thank you :)
<ivoks> \sh: but, i can't do anything yet :(
<ivoks> \sh: that patch should work
<mgalvin> good morning all (well for those of you where its morning time ;)
<ivoks> it's 3PM :)
<mgalvin> 9am here ;)
<tritium> 8:24 am here :)
<\sh> ivoks: ok...will take care about it this evening
<DanielN> ivoks: whatelse then?
<as> hlo
<ogra> hey as
<DanielN> ogra: what kind of meeting happened yesterday?
<ogra> TB
<DanielN> techboard?
<ogra> yep
<DanielN> ok, then i'll be there next time :)
<ogra> only two weeks from now :)
<DanielN> ok
<DanielN> hopefully i'm member soon
<ogra> hey tseng|work
<tseng|work> hi.
<ogra> someone asked today if you could update your IRC whois info with a real name....
<tseng|work> who?
<tseng|work> i guess i can
<ogra> tseng|work, infinity..
<tritium> hi ogra, tseng|work
<ogra> hey tritium
<tseng|work> hi tritium
<tseng|work> hi Nafallo, how is your blam
<Nafallo> tseng: I'm going to install it again now. with breezy fully up2date :-).
<Nafallo> tseng: and hi! :-)
<tseng|work> i cant get breezy fully up to date
* Amaranth can
<Nafallo> tseng: message. sorry for the spam ;-)
<tseng|work> xorg is permaf***ed
<Amaranth> well, except for the recent X complaining about xkbcomp symlinks
<DanielN> ll
<Treenaks> tseng|work: that's got to hurt
<DanielN> permafucked .. what a word
<tseng|work> its like permafrost
<tseng|work> with more inuendo.
<DanielN> eheh :)
<Nafallo> ogra: you have troubles with blam on amd64? :-)
<ogra> Nafallo, dunno.... i'm just installing 200 packages, blam was held back by the broken firefox....
<Nafallo> ogra: hehe, oki.
<Nafallo> ogra: blam crashes when I refresh stuff. blam --sync works :-P.
<ivoks> hi
<Nafallo> hi ivoks :-)
<ivoks> how are things? :)
<Nafallo> working xorg :-)
<Nafallo> almost working blam
<Nafallo> rather good :-)
<Nafallo> and you?
<ivoks> camed to tell you i'll be away for a week
<ivoks> i have to catch up some stuff on uni, so i'll concentrate on that for a week
<ivoks> Mithrandir: hi
<ivoks> Mithrandir: did you get my email yesterday?
<Mithrandir> hi ivoks
<Nafallo> ivoks: do what you have to do :-)
<Mithrandir> ivoks: yes, sorry I haven't acted on it yet.
<ivoks> Mithrandir: ok
<ivoks> \sh: untill lib/X11 is fixed, there will be no opensceengraph upload
<ivoks> \sh: i'll fix strutilsxx as soon as I get upload account
<ivoks> or at least, account for testing on amd64
<ivoks> :(
<mgalvin> quick question...
<mgalvin> where do the pkg-config (.pc) files for libs usually go, in the lib.deb itself or lib-dev.deb
<mgalvin> ?
<Mithrandir> in the -dev package.
<mgalvin> Mithrandir, thnx
<Nafallo> ogra: wb
<ogra> yay
<ogra> new xserer :)
<Nafallo> :-)
<ogra> hmm... the v is missing if i type to fast....
<ogra> ...is that a bug ?
<ogra> *g*
<Nafallo> ogra: sure. bug daniels ;-)
<ogra> hehe
<ivoks> :)
<Nafallo> ogra: run it from a terminal ;-)
<ogra> what ? blam ?
<Nafallo> ogra: yepp. most likely will crash when you try to refresh ;-)
<ogra> yep, it does
<Nafallo> ogra: however it works with blam --sync :-P
<ogra> but not refresh
* Nafallo -> phone, brb
<ogra> hmm, refresh via themenu works.....
<ogra> weird, now refresh works completely
* Nafallo -> back
<Nafallo> ogra: blam --sync works, blam doesn't :-P
* Nafallo -> back
<ivoks> off i go...
<ivoks> bye all
<ivoks> see you in a week
<Nafallo> ivoks: don't forget to ban yourself ;-)
<ivoks> ban? :)
<ivoks> no, i'll come every day, but not for long...
<\sh> ivoks: what u wanna do? holiday?
<ivoks> i have too much on uni this days, so i have to concentrate on that...
<ivoks> \sh: no, end of academic year
<\sh> this is fscking i need windows to finish my tax work
<Nafallo> and I need windows to update my dvd+-rw firmware :-P
<\sh> well...how can i enable a tunnel device on ubuntu?
<DanielN> \sh: elster?
<\sh> DanielN: jepp
<DanielN> \sh: it's a webinterface, isn't it? and it's not running with GNU/Linux ?
<\sh> DanielN: its windows visual basic or something like this..
<\sh> i tried with wine...didn't work
<\sh> now i'm trying to install windows xp with qemu ;)
<DanielN> *urgh*
<DanielN> doesn't work!
<DanielN> tried it long time
<DanielN> without success
<ogra> \sh, so you'll miss the "get rid of the kernel" meeting :)
<DanielN> meeting today?
<ogra> only the kernel team :)
<ogra> so its nothing important
<\sh> ogra: what was it?
<ogra> *g*
<DanielN> but it's open for interested if i'm right?
<\sh> ogra: when?
<Nafallo> DanielN: always :-)
<ogra> sure as all ubuntu meetngs
<ogra> \sh, 4min
<DanielN> :)
<Nafallo> \sh: 3min ;-)
<\sh> left or eta?
<DanielN> ^^
<ogra> Nafallo, adjust your clock
<Nafallo> \sh: eta :-)
<\sh> ok..so guys give me a hint..
<\sh> modprobe tun
<\sh> ifconfig tun0 bla doesn't work
<\sh> ah sit
<DanielN> \sh: /dev/net/tun: not found ??
<\sh> is there
<Nafallo> ogra: didn't change anything ;-)
<\sh> ut i also have a sit0 now...ipv6 to ipv4
<\sh> this i don't want
<tseng|work> there is no agenda for backports
<tseng|work> only a tiny bit i added
<\sh> tseng|work: most of it will come when we're discussing the matter
<tseng|work> well id rather have it on the page
<tseng|work> so i dont have to yell and scream it in foul words
<\sh> hmm...
<\sh> add my 2cents :)
<tseng|work> thanks
<tseng|work> added " No changes to language interpreters (python, mono). These could affect existing packages in unexpected ways."
<\sh> and then there are such apps like eric3...python apps depending on python + pythonlibs like pythonqt...in hoary eric3+pythonqt3 are b0rked...eric3, because of bugs in eric3 itself, and otherwise because of some bugs in python-qt3
<Amaranth> 150 minutes to the meeting?
<Amaranth> this is going to be..interesting
<Lathiat> i thought it was like, nowish
<ogra> tseng|work, added my bullet points to the agenda... would you have a look if they are to harsh ?
<\sh> ogra: they're fine
<ogra> ok
<\sh> i should add: no backports for packages in main
<ogra> all: please add what comes to your mind
<\sh> ogra: With whom of the distro team do backports maintainers communicate regulary about the changes their packages introduce ?
<ogra> yep... anything wrong with that ?
<\sh> what do u think, as ubermotu and godfather of motu ;)
<\sh> is it good to have those backports as a universe division? so those people have to talk with us at least?
<ogra> they should talk to *somebody* no matter who...
<ogra> i'm just missing the communication....and i want it to be adressed
<\sh> then we should address it like this: universe group will have to ack or nack packages
<\sh> btw...what about RT? :)
<ogra> nothing yet
<\sh> i'm getting tired of this wiki list...it's slow
<ogra> yep, its annoying
<DanielN> http://media2.big-boys.com/bbfiles/images/bbpics/pic1118.jpg
<DanielN> lol :)
<DanielN> i think i'm sure no, how to alive this damn network exame
<DanielN> tomorrow
<\sh> ogra: wtf is cairo?
<ogra> \sh, new rendering engine....
<DanielN> short question: if i've got something like aplus-sfs .. it must be renamed to aplus-fsfc2 too?
<herve> yoohoo! keyboard shortcuts are back!
<Nafallo> herve: :-)
<\sh> herve baby :)
<herve> ??
<DanielN> ok, then i ask again: everythink on CxxLibraryList becomes version to versionc2 ?
<DanielN> no exceptions
<herve> er...
<herve> some libs require a smarter name change
<herve> the page detailling the plan of action gave examples
<herve> if you know what a soname is, you'll be interested
<\sh> DanielN: not at all
<DanielN> no i don't .. but i think herve will tell me :)
<\sh> DanielN: if you have something like this: libblac102 then it becomes libbla
<herve> ha yes, that too
<\sh> but libfoo will become libfooc2
<DanielN> aha
<DanielN> and if i haf something like aplus-sfs ?
<DanielN> lol.. have
<herve> but libfoo-qt become libfooc2-qt no?
<\sh> is it a lib?
<DanielN> well.. it's on the library list, so i guess...
<\sh> DanielN: there r also apps
<DanielN> yep
<DanielN> but they're signed as apps
<doko> DanielN, which packages do use aplus-sfs?
<DanielN> how do you mean, doko?
<doko> apt-cache showpkg aplus-sfs
<\sh> its a programming language
<DanielN> yep
<doko> look for the reverse dependencies
<\sh> <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Strict//EN" "DTD/xhtml1-strict.dtd">
<\sh> <body> With whom of the distro team do backports maintainers communicate regulary about the changes their packages introduce </body>
<DanielN> ok
<\sh> argl
<\sh> wrong c&p cache
<\sh> A+ programming language run-time environment
<DanielN> mhm ..
<DanielN> lib or no lib? :)
<\sh> no lib
<DanielN> grmpf
<\sh> run-time enviroment
<DanielN> and apps are frozen
<herve> DanielN: what is the "Section:" of the package?
<herve> ha ok
<\sh> and apt-cache rdepends aplus-fsf == aplus-fsf-dev
<DanielN> herve: interpreters
<DanielN> ok .. then i'll use the force to search for another lib :)
<siretart> hi folks
<DanielN> haydiho siretart
<herve> hi siretart
<mgalvin> h siretart
<herve> did you have an error upgrading xbase-clients?
<mgalvin> just a heads up, I just finished packaging libcwd - a c++ debugging lib and I put it on the MOTUNewPackages wiki page
<siretart> herve: yeah, same here
<Nafallo> herve: yes
<siretart> herve: it talked something about a symlink and /usr/bin/xkbmap or something
<herve> okay, I'm not debugging it for nothing :-)
<siretart> anybody already working on hplip?
<siretart> and there it is. the sudden silence :)
<herve> well, you deserved it
<herve> what a sily question ;-)
<siretart> hehe
<siretart> just wanted to avoid duplicate work. I'm on it
<Nafallo> siretart: you should ask the backports-people :-)
<herve> ha, it's a library
<herve> I thought of some machine
<\sh> i'm stucked
<\sh> one lib depends on one of ivoks libs (not finished)
<\sh> the other on a strange libqt3-mt-dev dep...which i can't resolv.
<herve> ok, I see what's wrong
<herve> that was distracting after such a horrible day
<herve> s/day/week
<\sh> doing ivoks work now....this is holding us up
<\sh> NO!
<herve> hmm, I posted how to fix xbase-clients upgrade
<herve> someone interested here?
<\sh> i have to fix all ocaml stuff
<\sh> anyone wants to help?
<herve> in what way?
<\sh> i think its okay...i don't know howmany packages i have to b-d fix
<siretart> \sh: if you can make a list of dependencies to fix, I will take that as priority
<\sh> siretart: lets wait..i need to fix ivoks package
<siretart> ok
<\sh> ocaml-findlib is now on the buildds
<\sh> siretart: but we should take care about it...
* siretart knows nothing about ocaml. but mldonkey should definitly be workable in breezy soon ;)
<herve> okay, I have a confession
<herve> I felt in love with mini-dinstall :-)
<siretart> herve: :)
<\sh> my repos is working with mini-install...and a small nice php include file for showing the repos to the world
<\sh> ogra: ping...sorry to bother, but do u have a fast maschine for test compile stuff? where i could access a breezy dchroot? (i386)
<ogra> \sh, 900mhz 128MB ?
<\sh> hehe
<\sh> ok
<\sh> i think i have to take one dl380 from our DC
<ogra> \sh, and not before the meeting ended, i have to figure out how to enable port forwarding on my cheapo router
<ogra> i'll buy a opteron box soon....
<dholbach> hellas
<herve> hi
<ogra> ****************** backports meeting in 15 min please join #ubuntu-meeting if you havent already **********************
<Amaranth> backports meeting kinda started 15 minutes ago ;)
<ogra> heh
<tseng|work> oops :(
<\sh> this will be difficult
<Nafallo> \sh: indeed
* ajmitch hopes this meeting goes quick so he can go back to sleep ;)
<Nafallo> ajmitch: it won't ;-)
<ajmitch> *sigh*
<ajmitch> I could just put the laptop aside, noone would know..
<herve> ajmitch, to work you mean? :-)
<ajmitch> herve: it's 8am here, not working until 1pm ;)
<herve> just remembered you go at work around that time
<herve> argh, the day you could have made an few extras in bed :-)
* ajmitch is still in bed :)
<herve> hehe
<ogra> herve, #ubuntu-meeting
<herve> no thank you
<ogra> please
<herve> I don't feel involved in that at all
<herve> and besides, this is by far no the time to ask me more
<ogra> herve, it might break your work once....
<herve> don't tell me backports will mix with ubuntu packages...
<ogra> it could be, thats why we need everyone there
<dholbach> i don't think so
<dholbach> everything will be fine :)
<herve> ogra, don't think you won because you threatened me :-)
* tseng|work threatens herve
<herve> I feel like they're describing Debian testing dist
<ogra> herve, worse
<\sh> the problem is different
<\sh> the problem is not the backport itself...
<\sh> (forgetting about self abi transition ;))
<\sh> the problem is the user who wants all this nifty new software
<\sh> thats one point for the gentoo user base
<herve> but gentoo users are generally better skilled than ubuntu ones, no?
<herve> I mean, the targeted audience
<\sh> herve: devs yes, users no
<elmo> \sh: err
<elmo> gentoo devs are better skilled than ubuntu ones?
<herve> elmo, you have to when fixing your system all the time ;-)
<herve> ogra, I'm losing confidence my attending is necessary
<tseng|work> herve: eh
<tseng|work> herve: pass the pipe!
<\sh> elmo: no :)
<\sh> elmo: this i never said :)
<\sh> gentoo devs are better skilled then gentoo users
<\sh> sorry for the missunderstanding :)
<tseng|work> there are good and bad gentoo devs
<tseng|work> same in debian i imagine, even though their testing is *alot* harder
<\sh> tseng|work: i'm not talking about the devs...the users i'm talking about..and we know, that there r really some noobs playing sometimes cflags jockey, cause they heard from a friend of a friend..that this flags makes gentoo 150% faster
<tseng|work> dude -j007
<tseng|work> yes.
<ajmitch> \sh: sure, it just crashes that much faster too
<elmo> I recompile my hoary with -pipe
<\sh> so users eating everything...even sh*t if u tell them, it makes u like hulk
<elmo> what about you guys?
<Mithrandir> elmo: *chuckle*
<ajmitch> -099
<Mithrandir> elmo: AMAZING DIFFERENCE.
<Mithrandir> elmo: EVEN THE COMPILES GO FASTER
<tseng|work> -pipe makes my harddrive seek less
<Mithrandir> elmo: dude, where do you learn all those nice tricks!?!?!?
<tseng|work> RML says thats what i need to do!
* Mithrandir goes back to hacking on his Xau replacement
* tseng|work goes home
<tseng|work> bye
<\sh> no coffee anymore
<ajmitch> bye tseng|work
<\sh> cu tseng|work
<herve> I can' take more
<herve> night guys
<herve> (and girls)
<\sh> cu herve
* lamont__ screams at launchpad... comes here instead.
<lamont__> libgetargs-long-perl is ftbfs, loops until disk-full if it can't reach a web site...
<lamont__> ogra/dholbach/whoever: fix that. kthxbye
<\sh> hehe
<ogra> lamont__, i'll look at it
<lamont__> I don't care if it's ftbfs, I care that it trashes the buildd
<lamont__> (infinite loop bad...)
<ajmitch> ouch, that is an evil build issue :)
<elmo> lamont: we should add a check to the buildd that kills the build after log is > 500Mb
<lamont__> oh - I like that.
* lamont__ makes a note
<dholbach> ogra, lamont__: fixed it
<ogra> oh, thanks, that shortens my day
<ogra> :)
<dholbach> can everybody have a look at UniverseNewPackages and add whatever NEW package he can think of, we got in?
<ajmitch> yes sir :)
<siretart> puh. THAT was a meeting..
<ajmitch> fairly short
<dholbach> :)
<siretart> lol
<\sh> so they're under motu control or what now?
<\sh> the main thing i didn't catch up...
<siretart> I checked the package kodos, it got automerged from MOM and I'm happy with the result. What do I need to do to get it uploaded?
<siretart> \sh: I assume that concrete policies for what and when to backport will be discussed at a later meeting
<ajmitch> siretart: upload as you normally do.. with dput on the changes file once you sign it
<siretart> ajmitch: when I do a `debuild -S -sa` I get asked for the gnupg key from scott, so I assume I have either to change the changelog, or pass some magic to debuild, right?
<\sh> debuild -S -sa -k<your email addr>
<siretart> and I assume thats the same procedure when I would sponsor a package for someone else, right?
* \sh is smiling to dholbach for this debuild magic ;)
<siretart> debuild magic?
<\sh> -k ;) it will leave the changed by field of the original man but signes the changes file with your key
<\sh> and I wanted to go to bed early
<siretart> \sh: too late ;)
<\sh> seems so...ok....one more nicotine injection and then off to bed
<ajmitch> ok, so backports should be taken off the bad words list for this channel now :)
<\sh> ajmitch: believe me or not...if this backports project becomes ubuntu-backports, there will be a new attempt...lets say: breakmyubuntu
<dholbach> GRUMPYGROUNDHOG
<dholbach> we will break it all ourselves
<dholbach> ROCK! :)
<\sh> well
<ajmitch> oh yes, when users start installing from grumpy, then it'll be fun!
<\sh> i made a backport and a newport for hoary
<\sh> and I'm thinking about genubuntu
<Amaranth> i need a stupid hoary user to test gnome-menus for me :)
<\sh> Amaranth: join the ubuntuusers.org forum ;)
<ajmitch> wireless in my room is almost as bad as UDU :)
<dholbach> ajmitch: wow :)
#ubuntu-motu 2005-06-09
<\sh> genubuntu -> world compile with -O99 -pipe -fomit-frame-pointer -sse -mmx -sse99
<ajmitch> \sh: what, no -ffast-math -sse3 ? :)
<\sh> oh thx i forgot ;)
<dholbach> siretart: this is funny: doko maintains the package, keybuk "fixed it" and you uploaded it :)
<dholbach> THAT's collaboration
<ajmitch> dholbach: well MOM fixed it, really :)
<dholbach> ajmitch: and that's not even appropriate :)
<siretart> dholbach: did I do something wrong? (just want do be sure that I didn't do something really stupid)
<dholbach> siretart: perfectly alright
<ajmitch> hopefully not.. as long as you followed the report
<siretart> puh!
<ajmitch> sometimes you have to build with -sa, other times not
<siretart> I was irritiated that I didn't get any mail
<dholbach> ajmitch: just when you have new upstream version
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> I've got a stack of merges to get back to, I think :)
* ajmitch updates his merge list
<tseng> hi
<ajmitch> hello tseng
<\sh> ubuntu debootstrap can do also a debian unstable chroot?
<elmo> yes
<\sh> good...so i can prepare some new packages for debian, ajmitch can review and sponsor an upload ,-)
<\sh> so we can resync them into ubuntu ;)
<ajmitch> I can try & get them in - wait until sarge is released & etch is open
<ajmitch> otherwise I'd probably get smacked by debian people ;)
<dholbach> :)
<tseng> meebey got mono in :)
<ajmitch> experimental or sid?
<tseng> sid
<siretart> sid
<siretart> :)
<ajmitch> right, there wouldn't have been NEW processing then
<\sh> argl
<\sh> findlib is not build
<\sh> fck
<ajmitch> ftpmasters would possibly ignore my upload until post-sarge anyway
<siretart> ajmitch: do you think this weekend is still realistic? ;)
<\sh> Purging configuration files for xorg-common ...
<\sh>  Removing any system startup links for /etc/init.d/xorg-common ...
<\sh>    /etc/rcS.d/S70xorg-common
<tseng> hrm well mono wasnt in sarge
<\sh> dpkg - warning: while removing xorg-common, directory `/usr/X11R6/lib/X11' not empty so not removed.
<tseng> so it might not be frozen
<siretart> well, ok, thats highly offtopic here in this context..
<dholbach> ajmitch: do you read debian-devel?
<ajmitch> dholbach: sometimes..
<tseng> siretart: debian development is off topic here?
<dholbach> the thread that was kicked off about wifi-radar in ubuntu was very interesting
<ajmitch> usuually just debian-devel-announce
<dholbach> "Is Ubuntu a fork" or something
<ajmitch> the fun threads
<dholbach> there were much less anti-ubuntu sentiments than i expected
<plugwash> from what i can gather ubuntu is less of a fork and more of an alternate release process
<dholbach> once we got teams cracking on stuff, we should announce them on debian-devel as well
<ajmitch> I resort mostly to gmane now for reading the lists
<dholbach> i subscribed to it
<dholbach> since this thread was really exciting
<siretart> plugwash: and a completly different development process
<dholbach> for the debian-ubuntu future :)
<siretart> dholbach: absolutly!
<dholbach> i really think we should sink our teeth in there to make sure history is to be made :)
<ajmitch> certainly
* ajmitch starts readint the threads
<ajmitch> haha
<ajmitch> "It's a spoon."
<\sh> "there is no spoon" ;)
<siretart> lol
<tseng> i dont think the rest of you really work like I do
<ajmitch> tseng: no, we're not nearly as 1337 as you
<tseng> i spend more time communicating with debian and upstream then I do touching packages
<ajmitch> we don't do so much packaging of new stuff
<\sh> tseng: thx for ur effords ;)
<tseng> im not going to force that on anyone
<tseng> but.. i think its a good idea
<ajmitch> different things are needed in different areas
<dholbach> it absolutely is
<tseng> i mean i wouldnt expect dholbach to do it the same as me
<tseng> he touches every package he can find
<dholbach> not really
<\sh> grmpfumasdasjdh
<tseng> but if you work in a specific area..
<dholbach> yeah... TEAMS!
<tseng> yes
<dholbach> atm i just touch my thesis stuff... :/
<tseng> the gnome motu team should be best friends with debian gnome
<tseng> and gnome.org
<dholbach> yeah
<ajmitch> seb does gnome packages for debian, too
<tseng> yes
<dholbach> i'll be off to bed now
<ajmitch> so he's been the main contact for both, I think
<ajmitch> night dholbach
<dholbach> good night
* \sh is off to bed, tooo
<ogra> \sh, use some real chat software....
<ajmitch> but one thing that is consistently raised is that we have to feed bugs back to debian
<\sh> ogra: i don't use gaim ;)
<ogra> \sh, Konversation terminates all the time
<\sh> gaim is for college girls
<ogra> take xchat
<tseng> ogra: remind me why we have this patch in tomboy?
<\sh> no :) i just hit some buttons while i was writing
<tseng> ogra: dajobe doesnt like it.
<ogra> \sh, so you dont want to meet college girls ?
<ogra> tseng, which one ?
<\sh> ogra: too young...too loud for an old fart like me
<tseng> ogra: you added a patch
* ogra tries to remember 
* tseng looks
<ogra> feel free to drop it
<tseng> where is the patches page?
<\sh> *note* i have to send a patch to debian and upstream for arkrpg */note*
<tseng> thats where he found it
<ogra> tseng, ???
<\sh> ok gentlemen
<ogra> tseng, which patches page ?
<tseng> the one where we diff w/ debian
<tseng> and give patches
<\sh> don't fix breezy :)
<ogra> MOM ?
<ogra> hmm
<tseng> http://people.ubuntu.com/~scott/patches/tomboy/
<tseng> this.
<tseng> http://people.ubuntu.com/~scott/patches/tomboy/tomboy_0.3.2-4ubuntu5_unknown.patch
<ajmitch_> sigh, irssi, doesn't want to play nice again today :)
<tseng> and that :)
<tseng> is the patch in question
<Nafallo> *unknown.patch ;-)
<\sh> chmod 0000 *hidden.patch ;)
<\sh> night all :)
<ogra> tseng, because it didnt work without the patch
<tseng> can you explain breifly what it actually does?
<ogra> tseng, revert it
<tseng> heh i wont revert it if it doesnt work w/o it
<tseng> i just need to justify it to dajobe before he merges it in debian
<ogra> tseng, tomboy didnt start with an error that m is not defined
<ogra> in the line in question
<tseng> oh.
<Nafallo> *proper.patch :-)
<Nafallo> baah. to much p2p for me :-P
<ogra> tseng, and the line if (q == null) { somehow implied that it should be } else if (q != null) {
<tseng> it should just be else
<tseng> i imagine
<ogra> it was a shot in the dark that worked, i'm not after keeping it if its wrong :)
<ogra> yeah, else is the right way
<ajmitch_> I'd assume that is it was if (q==null) then the second if being q would be redundant
<tseng> yes
<ogra> yop
<tseng> ill confirm the bug again
<tseng> and then try to fix it with an else
<ogra> it was at some inhuman hour in the morning when i made the patch
<ajmitch_> caffiene underdose?
* tseng boots laptop
<tseng> was it only failing on amd64?
<tseng> arg ill look at it later
<ogra> tseng, ^^^^
<ogra> tseng, tomboy didnt start with an error that m is not defined
<ajmitch> but m is referenced on the next line?
<ogra> thats not amd64 spwcific
<ogra> yep
<tseng> yeah..
<tseng> he probably didnt see it on mono 1.
<tseng> 1.0
<tseng> i dunno
<ogra> else is just the right fix
<tseng> no it needs to check for m
<tseng> because it calls m next line
<tseng> yes?
<ogra> it doesnt in my patch...
<tseng> how can m fail to be !null
<tseng> and then get an object reference in the next line
<ogra> but works with my patch... which is redundant...
<tseng> i dont see why though :P
<tseng> its kind of voodoo
<tseng> ajmitch: update easytag please :P
<tseng> gar xbase-clients
<ajmitch_> tseng: ?
<tseng> ajmitch_: cxx
<ajmitch_> k
<tseng> whats the lib
<tseng> libid3-3.8.3c2
<tseng> it wants to be built with that, i think
<tseng> im not entirely sure what the cxx plan is all about
<ajmitch_> if it doesn't supply a lib, it'll get rebuilt once libs are done
<ajmitch_> since it'll be in the blacklist of affected c++ apps
<tseng> oh ok.
<ogra> bye guys
<ajmitch_> libid3 is in main, and already done
<tseng> bye ogra.
<ajmitch_> bye ogra
<Mithrandir> has anybody packaged the RHDS yet?
<tseng> redhat destkop slowness?
<Mithrandir> directory server
<tseng> ah.
<Nafallo> bye ogra
* ajmitch updates some of his debs
<tseng> ajmitch: what do you normally do to "syncronize with debian"
<tseng> ajmitch: i think i am probably doing it the hard way
<ajmitch> no, I think you're probably doing it properly
<ajmitch> I haven't been communicating with debian nearly as much as I should have
<tseng> i mean the technical process
<tseng> i normally do svn up in package mono and look at changed files since the last i looked
<tseng> and copy changes by hand
<tseng> i envision you other guys doing some fancy crap with debdiff (which ive never used)
<ajmitch> debdiff on the .dsc files to get the diff between the trees
<ajmitch> I use MOM to get the debdiffs, too
<tseng> hm
<tseng> well i do stuff before its actually uploaded
<tseng> *G*
<ajmitch> since a lot of stuff I'd do would be just checking merges, making sure that what I do doesn't conflict..
<tseng> im just that slick
<ajmitch> heh :)
<ajmitch> I don't deal with debian's unreleased stuff yet, unless it's my own :)
<ajmitch> and I should be moving to bazaar for that
<tseng> oh if im not bleeding
<tseng> its no good
<ajmitch> pnet might actually have a new release in a week or so
<tseng> i feed on crack.
<ajmitch> so I'll update that, of course
<ajmitch> it probably still won't run most apps that we care about
<tseng> yeah im not sure why we are bothing to genericize cli stuff
<tseng> when nothing works outside of mono
<tseng> maybe someday..
<ajmitch> I might throw in a patch to try & use mono crack from its GAC
<ajmitch> it'll just require me to figure out the version hasking used, should be trivial enough
<tseng> man im starving
<tseng> this might be another no-upload night
<ajmitch> I haven't uploaded for weeks
<Nafallo> tseng: fetch an amd64 and get hacking ;-)
<Mez> can anyone help me with using the wiki - /query please
* tseng goes for dinner
* ajmitch goes off to work
<Unfrgiven> morning all
<Unfrgiven> doko_: ping?
<tseng> morning Unfrgiven
* Nafallo goodnight
<Unfrgiven> tseng: morning :)
<Unfrgiven> tseng: how are things at your end?
<tseng> good thanks
<tseng> whats up
<tseng> oh man the dog made me go running
<tseng> im beat.
<Unfrgiven> i had a question regarding the c++ transition and shlibs
<tseng> ok, ajmitch can answer better than me
<tseng> i only touch mono crack
<Unfrgiven> ok ill wait for his return
<ajmitch> hi Unfrgiven
<ivoks> hello
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: hy
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: hi
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: i just uploaded a new patch with the fixes you and doko suggested. i wasn't too sure what to do with shlibs but I think i've got it right now. you able to have a quick look? https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11371
<ivoks> ok... serpentine looks really nice
<tseng> yes.
<ivoks> yes? :)
<tseng> it looks nice.
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: I might take a look in a bit, I'm at work
<ivoks> did someone allready package it?
<ajmitch> ivoks: yes, it should be in main
<tseng> ogra looked at it
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: ok no probs. thanks :)
<ivoks> ok
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: looks better
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: :)
<ivoks> looks good
<ivoks> ok, so I could try to upload my first package? :)
<ajmitch> ivoks: if you want
<ivoks> wifi-radar for example :)
<ajmitch> hmm :)
<ivoks> no? :)
<ivoks> yuhu!
<ivoks> how, i guess it's up
<ivoks> Successfully uploaded packages.
<crimsun_> you should get an email from katie
<ivoks> ok
<ivoks> no, no email from katie :)
<crimsun_> it runs every 5 minutes
<crimsun_> :00, :05, :10, ...
<ivoks> i guess my email isn't whitelisted yet
<ivoks> oh, i'll check then later :) or... now :)
<ivoks> nothing :(
<ivoks> once i'm able to upload, i shouldn't upload .deb, right?
<crimsun_> correct, only source uploads
<crimsun_> you only upload diff.gz + dsc usually
<ivoks> ok
<ivoks> changes?
<crimsun_> (yes, changes, too)
<ivoks> ok
<ajmitch> yes, .changes is definitely required
<ajmitch> ivoks: what are you using to upload?
<ivoks> dput
<ajmitch> dput is configured for ubuntu?
<ivoks> yes
<ivoks> dput ubuntu ....changes
<ajmitch> ok, so you'd do something like 'dput ubuntu package_version_source.changes'
<ivoks> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/Uploads
<ivoks> yes
<ajmitch> right
<ajmitch> I haven't seen it on the changes list yet, but that could just be slow
<ivoks> ajmitch: i guess my mail isn't whitelisted
<ivoks> time to get some sleep
<ivoks> bye
<enodev> motu? whats this about??
<ajmitch> masters of the universe
<enodev> who are the masters=
<enodev> ?
<ajmitch> wiki.ubuntulinux.org/MOTU
<enodev> yaeh alright i know the topic and the wiki
<enodev> thought about some personal responses
<ajmitch> good :)
<enodev> =) the masters speakin to me....
<ajmitch> we work on universe packages..
<ajmitch> a fairly big area, of course
<crimsun_> when we're not working on universe packages, we're stuffing monkey brains into burlap sacks and selling them on the market
<enodev> and quite off the ubuntu idea?
<enodev> the market...
<enodev> ubuntu says universe is baaaad
<enodev> sorry for my simple arguments =)
<enodev> well i admid i lied about reading the wike... but motu makes sense to me now. i myself get most off the universe#
<ajmitch> ubuntu doesn't say universe is bad
<ajmitch> it's just not officially supported
<enodev> but it doesnt really recommend it
<ajmitch> which is why the MOTUs work on it
<enodev> are u a *MAINTANER* ?
<enodev> xcuse my spellin
<ajmitch> I'm a MOTU, but I don't work on packages in main yet
<enodev> i always thought universe was not part of the main stuff coz it lacked some ideas.. u know?
<enodev> they make quite good statements why what is in the main  trunk?
<ajmitch> ideas?
<ajmitch> main is what is officially supported for security & the like, by canonical
<enodev> its more than just security
<enodev> its the idea - as of what i have understood - about ubuntu
<enodev> free to all
<ajmitch> yes, and that's common across everything..
<enodev> in one part its what i like ubuntu for
<enodev> its meant to be for everyone
<enodev> and if theres something that doesnt fit to all it be in  universe
<ajmitch> no, universe isn't like that
<enodev> but still available to thoose who re already "enlightened"
<enodev> i see ubuntu as desktop thing for me and my mom
<ajmitch> universe is those packages that aren't part of the core distro, they're freely available to download for all
<enodev> not for all
<enodev> not all know how to add the sources.list to universe
<ajmitch> it's not terribly hard
<enodev> i know
<enodev> but most dont
<enodev> ive read an interesting article - a review
<enodev> done by a windows user who had never touched linux so far
<enodev> and all the hype about ubntu just vansihed
<enodev> cause she didnt have all she wanted for a desktop os
<enodev> ubuntu is great!
<enodev> im here to tell it
<enodev> but the simple desktop user doesnt get it
<enodev> they dotn get as far as to the universe
<enodev> .... until some one tells them about the masters :)
<enodev> but i dont wanna talk about ubuntu. we know its cool. anyway
<enodev> what the motu do?
<enodev> *what do
<enodev> are doing?
<enodev> are going to do?
<enodev> i dont know any of you
<enodev> although ive installed alot off the universe
<enodev> ..perhaps most
<enodev> i remember the debian people complain
<enodev> we're just taking from them
<enodev> makin it impossible t give something back
<whiprush> that's not true.
<whiprush> patches are fed back.
<whiprush> wether they're applied is another thing entirely.
<enodev> yeah but debain people say ubuntu is changin too much
<enodev> makin it impossoble to merge patches
<enodev> i dont know ive looked in to it
<enodev> ive never
<enodev> sorry about missin words. it keeps happening
<enodev> how much is ubuntu a cult makin people believe whats said?
<enodev> am i totally off?
<whiprush> You need to be a cult to be nice to people. :)
<whiprush> er, you don't need.
<enodev> i found myself praising ubuntu without knowing really much....
<enodev> i like ubuntu very much. i see a very important future
<enodev> i wonder how many windows user are in this channel
<ajmitch> probably not so many, this is usually a devel channel
* ajmitch is finished work for the day, wandering off home now
<ajmitch> bbl
<enodev> so the masters are all developers?
<whiprush> mostly
<enodev> is it hard to put something nice into universe?
<chillywilly> anyone here ever use openvpn - http://openvpn.net?
<ajmitch> can't say I have
<ivoks> morning
<ivoks> noone? :)
<ivoks> no one even
<Treenaks> nobody
<ivoks> hehe
<ivoks> netherland?
<Treenaks> ivoks: why?
<ivoks> 62,8%
<ivoks> that's huge...
<Treenaks> yes
<ivoks> so, will parliament accept that or will they vote?
<Treenaks> The cabinet will retract the proposal
<ivoks> that's reasonable...
<ivoks> \sh: morning
<\sh> morning
<\sh> anyone with a laptop here?
<Treenaks> lots of the "no" voters said: "We don't dislike Europe, we just dislike this particular 'constitution' for it"
<Treenaks> \sh: at home
<\sh> i have some serious problems with powernowd
<ivoks> Treenaks: i tought so... EU is fine, but constitution needs patches :)
<Treenaks> ivoks: exactly
<ivoks> powernowd?
<ivoks> don't use that...
<ivoks> wait... i do :)
<Treenaks> ivoks: FULL POWER ALL THE TIME
<Treenaks> ivoks: uh.. wait
<\sh> so i can disable powernowd from the runlevels?
<ivoks> why not?
<ivoks> \sh: what's wrong?
<\sh> when it's fireing up, it puts my centrino cpu into 500mhz mode
<ivoks> heh
<ivoks> \sh: is it on battery?
<\sh> no :)
<ivoks> strange
<ivoks> \sh: are you sure?
<\sh> hmm...there is a cable going to the powerplug
<\sh> yeah i'm sure
<ivoks> cause, it starts at maximun, then drops when booting stops
<\sh> ivoks: yeah, but it's not going up again
<ivoks> mine is now @600
<ivoks> \sh: kernel change? :)
<\sh> standard ubuntu i686 kernel
<ivoks> hm
<\sh> ivoks: btw...ocaml-findlib is not compiling properly
<\sh> i changed yesterday the deps for it
<ivoks> \sh: ?
<\sh> ivoks: your app...gdome2-cpp-smart0 or something uses it
<ivoks> ?
<ivoks> i don't have any app in ubuntu :(
<ivoks> i'm still not a MOTU :((
<\sh> ivoks: u r
<\sh> ivoks: ping elmo ;)
<\sh> ok...brb
<ivoks> elmo: ping
<ivoks> ok...
<ivoks> i'm doing a big system for one large company in croatia
<ivoks> it will be my first misson critical deployment on ubuntu :)
<ivoks> wb doko
<tseng> hi
<\sh> re
<\sh> bah...only because of my taxes i had to install windows xp
<\sh> and because of an exchanged laptop mainboard the normal winxp install cd from hp is not working anymore :(
<Unfrgiven> ogra: hi dude
<Unfrgiven> doko: ping?
<ogra> hey
<Unfrgiven> ogra: thanks for your kind words in e-mail :)
<ogra> :)
<ajmitch> hi ogra, Unfrgiven
<Unfrgiven> ogra: ajmitch: got a question... i was doing the transition for libflash... and it was proving to be a pain... then i checked upstream and they've had *two* new releases. so i pacakged the new version and transitioned it... so when i create a bug in bugzilla, which file(s) should I upload?
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: hi
<ogra> Unfrgiven, upstream = debian ?
* Nafallo says morning all!
<ajmitch> hi Nafallo
<Unfrgiven> ogra: upstream = software developers, not debian
<Unfrgiven> ogra: debian is on the same version that we are
<Unfrgiven> ogra: i took the debian package and grabbed the new source.... and massaged the debian/* files to update version
<ogra> hmm
<terrex>  Please dont complain about mono deps for next 2 weeks
<terrex> hehehe
<terrex> ;-)
* Nafallo wonders from what date that counts ;-)
<terrex> X-DD
<Treenaks> Nafallo: tomorrow
<Unfrgiven> ogra: ?
<ajmitch> until the right bits are built in main, don't complain :)
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: be sure to provide an updated package back to debian :)
<Nafallo> Treenaks: hehe
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: i will. but what about upload to ubuntu? what should i do with it? should i attach the dsc, orig.tar.gz and diff.gz to the cxx transition bug?
<ajmitch> it'll be a special case, I think
<Unfrgiven> yep so i should attach it to the bug right?
<ajmitch> the debdiff *may* include all you need
<ajmitch> only if you wanted a huge attachment that would cause some of us to cry :)
<Unfrgiven> i think its safer to upload the source pacakges to the bug rather than have an insane debdiff :)
<\sh> Unfrgiven: did u do a uupdate with the new upstream source?
<\sh> ubuntu reached lycos europe :)
<Unfrgiven> \sh: nup.
<\sh> *rotfl*
<\sh> this is pure geek stuff from japan
<\sh> http://www.thanko.jp/kinniku_mouse.html
<\sh> Mouse with power shocks
<ajmitch> haha
<ivoks> hi
<ivoks> elmo: ping
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: hey
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: wassup? :)
<\sh> hey JohnDong
<chmj> \sh, libcoin ?
<Unfrgiven> ivoks: just saying hi :)
<ivoks> \sh: hi
<JohnDong> hey
<ivoks> Unfrgiven: ok
<JohnDong> just decided to drop in for a bit
<JohnDong> had a FreeNX request, but ubuntu-devel is handling that well
<\sh> chmj: is uploaded
<chmj> built ?
<\sh> chmj: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/c/coin2/2.3.0-1ubuntu1/
<\sh> anybody familiar with ocaml?
<ivoks> :(
<\sh> ivoks: there should be an updated source package for ocaml-findlib
<\sh> (findlib == source name of the package)
<\sh> i adjusted the ocaml build deps...please have a look for the buildlogs from yesterday for this package. I think i missed some xorg build deps...can u check?
<JohnDong> can we get Blender 2.37?
<ivoks> \sh: sec...
<Amaranth> JohnDong: Hi, I'll be playing ogra today. :) If you joined MOTU you could get us Blender 2.37 :)
<ajmitch> any MOTUGames people around?
<JohnDong> lol
<ajmitch> ah, I see it's already listed on the page, nevermind :)
<\sh> ajmitch: siretart ?
<ajmitch> \sh: yeah, I wasn't sure if he was around
<ivoks> \sh: i never worked with findlib...
<\sh> ivoks: i never worked with any package which I transistioned ;)
<ivoks> \sh: i didn't transition findlib
<ivoks> \sh: neither any package depending on it
<\sh> ivoks: it's C :)
<ogra> JohnDong, the FreeNX implementation as is is to broken in our opinion, Mithrandir is working on a sane port since some time
<ogra> JohnDong, hi btw
<\sh> ivoks: gdome2-cpp-smart2 depends on ocaml-findlib
<ivoks> \sh: i didn't do that
<ogra> JohnDong, is blender 2.37 n debian ?
<JohnDong> ogra: hi :). I was just talking with him about FreeNX, and he at least GOT the source packages this time :)
<\sh> ivoks:  gmetadom
<\sh> 
<\sh> libgdome2-cpp-smart0
<\sh>  Need to update dependency on ocaml-nox.
<\sh> this is yours ;)
<ivoks> ?
<JohnDong> ogra: no, but 2.36 patches apply cleanly against 2.37 :)
<ivoks> \sh: ?!
<ogra> JohnDong, ah, sorry i'm terribly busy today, didnt follow -devel (i only react on pings currently ;) )
<ivoks> \sh: find . -name control -exec grep ocmal {} ';' doesn't find anything :)
<\sh> ivoks: check your cxx libs list :) gmetadom is your package;) and i need this package for gtkmathview
<\sh> ivoks: ocaml-nox dependencies :) in gmetadome
<ajmitch> yeah I've been bitten by ocaml deps as well
<\sh> ajmitch: we have to check all universe ocaml-* libs
<ogra> JohnDong, if you find a MOTU willing to maintain the belnder package then, i see no problems
<JohnDong> ogra: GREAT, now I'm on recruiting duty....
<ivoks> \sh: lol i never did that package! who signed it for me?
<JohnDong> lol
<\sh> ivoks: not me
<ajmitch> \sh: sure, let's get started :)
<ajmitch> ivoks: you've been volunteered
<\sh> ajmitch: i started with findlib :)
<ajmitch> great
<ivoks> ?
<ajmitch> I've never used ocaml
<ivoks> heh
<ivoks> np, i can build it
<ivoks> i didn't know it was assigned to me
<\sh> ajmitch: can u check the buildlogs for it? i don't understand the xorg stuff there...normally there shouldn't be any problems
<ajmitch> \sh: check which build logs, sorry?
<ogra> JohnDong, the problem with packages we patch is that its likely that we have to care for them for a while, so someone has o take the blame ;)
<ivoks> i really need access to 64 bit computers
<\sh> ajmitch: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/f/findlib/1.0.4-3ubuntu1/findlib_1.0.4-3ubuntu1_20050601-2015-i386-failed.gz
<ivoks> i can't test sources without them..
<JohnDong> ivoks: have you tried abusing Sourceforge?
<ajmitch> ok..
<ajmitch> \sh: /usr/bin/gcc-3.4.gcc-opt: No such file or directory
<ajmitch> Error while building custom runtime system
<ivoks> :))
<\sh> argl
<ajmitch> so it wanted a Build-Depends on gcc-3.4, I think
<\sh> lemme finish my xp install...will take care about it
<ajmitch> sure
<\sh> .oO(i have to fix  gnome-chemistry-utils (c++ errors), findlib, gnuift ,gnuradio gtkglextmm ,gtkmathview )
<\sh> ivoks: i will take then also gmetadom
<ivoks> wait
<ivoks> i downloaded source now
<ivoks> i'll do it
<\sh> ivoks: u have to w8 ;) i need to fix findlib ;)
<ivoks> damn! you are confusing me :)
<\sh> ivoks: gmetadom needs findlib :)
<\sh> argh..need to reboot ...brb
<ivoks> \sh: i didn't know that, cause i never touched that source
<JohnDong> oh yeah, how about a wine 20050419 import from Sid?
<JohnDong> wine fixes so much per release!
<Nafallo> ivoks: are you supposed to be here? ;-)
<ivoks> ?
<Nafallo> ivoks: you are supposed to be away for a week? :-)
<ivoks> yeah, but...
<ivoks> i'll do this two packages...
<ivoks> i don't know who put me there :)
<ajmitch> JohnDong: source packages are in, the build just needs fixed
<\sh> ivoks: 2 packages?
<\sh> wanna do findlib?
<ivoks> \sh: yeah, libflash too
<JohnDong> ajmitch: ok
<ajmitch> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/w/wine/0.0.20050419-1/
<\sh> ivoks: libflas?
<Nafallo> ivoks: hehe. I knew you should have banned yourself yesterday ;-)
<ivoks> \sh: no, finish that one... i don't have upload right still :(
<ivoks> \sh: libflash
<\sh> libflash is Unfrgiven
<ivoks> ?Q
<ajmitch> JohnDong: I suspect once deps are sorted there may still be g++ 4.0 issues
<ivoks> no according to my list
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven has a libflash package done
<ivoks> ?!
<ivoks> why is my nick there?
<ivoks> hm...
<ivoks> libextractor?! i did that one?
<ajmitch> wiki breakage?
<ivoks> who messed with WIKI!?!
<\sh> brb
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven did that one as well
<JohnDong> ajmitch: Gentoo seemed to be ok with GCC4, so I hope we'll be, too :)
<ajmitch> the wiki is fragile
<Amaranth> JohnDong: wine breaks so much per release
<ogra> JohnDong, yes, once we have transitioned half of the universe :)
<Amaranth> JohnDong: people that use photoshop on wine generally use a copy of wine from 2003, it works best
<ivoks> https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/CxxLibraryList?prevDiff%3Amethod=%3C%3C+previous+edit&currentRevision=4
<ivoks> ?!?!
<ajmitch> ivoks: what?
<Amaranth> ivoks: you were working on that?
<ivoks> https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/CxxLibraryList?prevDiff%3Amethod=%3C%3C+previous+edit&currentRevision=7
<ivoks> who did this?!
<JohnDong> Amaranth: hmm, well, the stuff that I work with are very MSI dependent, and work best with later releases
<ivoks> ajmitch: too much || || in the end on revision 4
<ivoks> and lot's of errors on revision5
<ivoks> pardon, revision 7
<ajmitch> ivoks: ok..
<ajmitch> as we said, a wiki is fragile :)
<ajmitch> ogra: heard any more about RT?
<ogra> ajmitch, not yet, i'll bug elmo these days....but he's likely to be busy releasing sarge until the weekend ;)
<ajmitch> true :)
<ogra> (at least from what i heard)
<ivoks> hm...
<ivoks> some one tought I'm AnkurKotwal :)
<Nafallo> baah. let sarge wait ;-)
<ajmitch> ivoks: what, you're not? :)
<ivoks> ajmitch: :)
<ivoks> ajmitch: :) no
<ajmitch> hehe
<ajmitch> I've met Unfrgiven at UDU
<ajmitch> I know you're not him :)
<ivoks> well, some one changed NameLastname into Nick
<ivoks> and did mistake
<ivoks> s
<ivoks> mistakes :)
<ivoks> ok, i'll fix that...
<ivoks> so... AnkurKotwal is Unforgiven?
<Nafallo> ivoks: no. don't forgive him yet ;-).
<Amaranth> arg
<Amaranth> gmail doesn't let you filter on cc
<Amaranth> i mean, i'm sure it would be possible if their form had the option for it, since you can search based on cc
<\sh> hmm...
<ivoks> \sh: change you comments :)
<\sh> i installed windows xp now, my grub is away, can i boot with warty live cd, chroot to my hoary and change it again? this should work
<\sh> ivoks: when I'm back on linux :)
<ivoks> why not?
<ivoks> \sh: ok, i
<ivoks> \sh: i'll do it for u
<\sh> ivoks: are u taking over the packages from Unfrgiven ?
<Nafallo> \sh: something like that. install mbr again + edit menu.list :-)
<\sh> Nafallo: thats for sure...but i'm not sure about my reiserfs parts ;)
<ivoks> \sh: no, some one put my nick instead of his name
<ivoks> \sh: so i'm fixing that
<\sh> ivoks: the packages or the wiki? ,-)
<ivoks> \sh: yes
<ajmitch> sleep time, see you all tomorrow :)
<tseng> bye ajmitch
<ivoks> \sh: some one put ivoks instead of AnkurKotwal
<ivoks> ajmitch: night!
<Amaranth> neat, gmail doesn't do any validation on what you put in filters
* \sh morphs into ogra right now, just like hes forcing to recruite everyone for MOTU, i will force ivoks to fix gmetadom
<\sh> ;)
<ivoks> \sh: i will grap few packages tomorrow
<Amaranth> if you put 'foo@bar.com' it puts the filter as to:(foo@bar.com) so if you put 'foo@bar.com) OR cc:(foo@bar.com' the search is to:(foo@bar.com) OR cc:(foo@bar.com)
<ivoks> i have too much work for uni today
<\sh> ivoks: no problem :) I'm slowing down a bit, cause to tired, and I need to have time for my real life right now..
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> \sh: who do i have to kill to get upload account arround here? :)
<\sh> ivoks: u need your key in the ring :)
<ivoks> well... i send it to keyring@ubuntu.com
<\sh> ivoks: your email addr is whitelisted?
<\sh> ivoks: read http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUOnceYouAreApproved
<ivoks> \sh: i send signed coc when i become member, so i guess it is...
<ivoks> \sh: i read that 3 times :)
<\sh> ivoks: read http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/Uploads
<ivoks> \sh: did that too
<ivoks> and tried to upload
<\sh> ivoks: mailed upload@ubuntulinux.org for whitelisting, send mail with gpg key to keyring@ubuntu.com and ping elmo when hes around ;)
<ivoks> i didn't mail upload, tough....
<\sh> ivoks: but it will take at least a week until elmo is reacting..don't worry :)
<ivoks> ok then
<ivoks> now i know timeframe
<ivoks> when was meeting? 30? 31?
<Unfrgiven> \sh: i have taken gmetadom :)
<Unfrgiven> \sh: it was already marked as me
<Unfrgiven> its a VERY painful package to do though
<Unfrgiven> because the ocaml packages need to be fixed up first
<Unfrgiven> and theres a lot of them
<Unfrgiven> im heading that up though....
<Unfrgiven> i need to email the debian maintainers to find out what they were thinking when they named ocaml-nox as ocaml-nox-3.08... the "-3.08" is part of the name not the version! :(
<ivoks> :)
* Nafallo < shower, bbl
<mgalvin> hi all
<\sh> Unfrgiven: re
<\sh> Unfrgiven: i took findlib (source) ocaml-findlib (binary) package, but failed to build
<\sh> Unfrgiven: all ocaml in main r without -3.08 so we should fix only the universe packages.
<\sh> and btw...back in linux :)
<Unfrgiven> \sh: ok will do.
<\sh> Unfrgiven: the buildlogs from yesterday is http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/f/findlib/1.0.4-3ubuntu1/findlib_1.0.4-3ubuntu1_20050601-2015-i386-failed.gz
<mgalvin> i built a package for libcwd and later found that there is already a debian version of a previous release
<mgalvin> what do you guys usually do, should this package be imported from deb into ubuntu then update
<\sh> mgalvin: take the debian package, update the package to the latest upstream version, debdiff it, send it back to debian :)
* Nafallo > here
<mgalvin> \sh, ok, then how do i then get into ububtu
<mgalvin> it is not currently in ubuntu anywhere
<\sh> mgalvin: so its a new package? Put it on moment *search*
<\sh> https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniverseCandidates
<\sh> here
<mgalvin> \sh, ok I will update the debian package and add it to the wiki
<mgalvin> \sh, thnx
<Unfrgiven> \sh: ill have a look at it tomorrow.
<Unfrgiven> for now im going to get to bed....
<Unfrgiven> gnite all
<\sh> Unfrgiven: i don't know if I can manage, but if i have time, i'll take a look again...
<Nafallo> Unfrgiven: nite
<mgalvin> Unfrgive, good night
<Nafallo> Unfrgiven: night even
<\sh> Unfrgiven: g'night dude :)
<Unfrgiven> \sh: yep sure... thanks
<Unfrgiven> cya
<lamont> mgalvin: do you mean this libcwd: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/libc/libcwd/
<lamont> 0.99.34-1, fwiw
<mgalvin> lamont, that looks like it
<lamont> mgalvin: so you're looking to update that to a newer upstream version?
<mgalvin> lamont, yes
<lamont> the biggest thing to work through there is coordinating with the debian maintainer since we really really really want to have the same .orig.tar.gz as debian does.
<mgalvin> lamont, i already spoke with madduck, the debian maintainer for this package
<lamont> coolness
<mgalvin> he is swamped and said its ok for me to work on it
<mgalvin> :)
<mgalvin> so i guess the best route is to grab the debian version at 0.99.39 and update that, or should I be updating this ubuntu verision at .34?
<mgalvin> since its in ubuntu already
<mgalvin> the debian version is here http://packages.debian.org/unstable/libdevel/libcwd-dev
<wasabi> So I need to go about starting the process of being allowed to upload to main.
<Riddell> anyone got examples of packages which have renamed? I'm wondering what the best thing to do is
<Treenaks> firefox ?
<ogra> Riddell, see the Cxx transition :-P
<ogra> there are hundrets ;)
<Nafallo> hehe
<Riddell> ogra: that's libraries
<ogra> yep, whats the problem, they all changed their names
<Riddell> things depend on libraries so they get swapped magically, with an application I'm wondering how to make a user with the old package get the new one
<Nafallo> Riddell: unrar -> unrar-free
<Nafallo> mozilla-firefox -> firefox
<Nafallo> the last one was switched in ubuntu-desktop iirc
<Nafallo> ogra: ping
<\sh> ok...need to go home now...
<\sh> cu later dudes
<Burgundavia> crap, look at the red on the build list today
<Nafallo> ogra: will blam be in breezy main? and why isn't python2.4-gnome2-extras in main here? :-)
<ogra> Nafallo, because it was not moved yet
<ogra> and no, blam will stay in universe
<ogra> Nafallo, dependency packages that move to main (mono deps and python2.4-gnome2-extras) need a security review first
<Nafallo> ogra: I'm replanning my mirror. that's why I'm asking :-).
<Nafallo> ogra: ahh, I wondered what was wrong ;-)
<ogra> will take some time, i have to write a spec for python2.4-gnome2-extras, then pitti will review it
<Nafallo> no hurry. just try to work about what packages is in use and what need to mirror universe and multiverse I currently have :-P
<Riddell> what's that site that dead packages go to?
<tseng> MorgueCandidates i am thinking
<tseng> search for Morgue
<Nafallo> morgue.ubuntu.com, but it seems it's not updated.
<Nafallo> tseng: hi tseng :-)
<tseng> hi
<tseng> i had to restart all my rrdtool graphs :(
<tseng> i was almost up to a full week of data
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> i found munin really nice
<Lathiat> sweet as rrd frontend
<Lathiat> easy to write plugins for
<\sh> re
<Amaranth> if lintian gives me 'build-depends-without-arch-dep' because i depend on debhelper, can i ignore it?
<Mithrandir> I would rather fix it.
<Mithrandir> use build-depends-indep
<Amaranth> ok
<Amaranth> woo
<Amaranth> i pass in lintian on the deb and dsc
<Mithrandir> pass the .changes file to lintian
<Amaranth> passed
<Amaranth> now i just need to wait for pyxdg 0.13 to hit main
<Mithrandir> it got lost in the upload queue according to elmo.
<Amaranth> katie died or something
<Mithrandir> yeah
<Mithrandir> poor katie
<Amaranth> we can rebuild her
<ogra> she is well again... she just told me so by mail
<Amaranth> is she better, faster, stronger?
<ogra> no, just like before
<Amaranth> wow, you're probably older than me and didn't get that
<Nafallo> lol
<Nafallo> ogra: rss-screensavers?
<ogra> yeah, there seem to be some... i didnt investigate it yet...
<ogra> was rather busy to merge all changes by hand... :(
<Nafallo> ogra: sounds kewl. just have to find them then ;-).
<ogra> now to a new lock window.... the current one will slap the users in the face with its uglyness again
<Mithrandir> ogra: would you care to fix the problem where it times out while you're typing?
* \sh dives into assembler stuff
<\sh> ah ogra...fck..i forgot to ask u
<\sh> branislav's in town
<ogra> Mithrandir, thats included in the spec i worked out with mpt in sydney, yes.... the clock shall reset with every digit you type
<Mithrandir> ogra++
<\sh> this evening poco loco between friesenplatz and rudolfplatz .. some drinks with old friends? u r interessted?
* Amaranth pokes people toward https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUNewPackages
<Amaranth> can i get a review of smeg? it's rather small
<Amaranth> passes lintian with no warnings, should be quick
<ogra> did i mention that overheating laptops are most annoying ?
<\sh> ogra: u should use a hp ;) slow but stable ;) at least when it's not plugged in the portreplicator
<ogra> \sh, my next one will be a hp :)
<Amaranth> Riddell: ping?
<\sh> ogra: u got my message about branislav?
<ogra> yep...
<Riddell> Amaranth: yo
<Amaranth> ogra: you should review my package ;)
<Amaranth> Riddell: you said to ping you to review smeg
<ogra> 1. i got no car around.... 2. i have to fix the screensaver and want to be ready before the weekend .... so no, but send my greetings
<Nafallo> ogra: does everything you own overheat or is the same one? :-P
<ogra> its always the same
<\sh> ogra: Kaloz
<\sh> ogra: aeh ;) k
<Riddell> Amaranth: where can I find it?
<Amaranth> https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUNewPackages
<Riddell> Amaranth: poke me in a minute, I need to release koffice
<Amaranth> ok
<\sh> try to fix ocaml
<\sh> Unfrgiven: ping
<Riddell> you'll all be pleased to hear that KOffice 1.4 rc has just been announced
<ogra> hmmm....
<\sh> riddell: python-kde3 will come this night
* ogra woners if he should be pleased
<\sh> goffice is not around ;)
<Amaranth> Riddell: cool
<\sh> thx riddell for your work :)
<ogra> \sh, http://www.gnome.org/gnome-office/
<ogra> \sh, tsk tsk tsk
<Riddell> gnome-office, also known as "throw some random applications together and call it a suite"
<\sh> ;)
<Riddell> tsk, I'm just a troll
<\sh> !topic Troll Time Now
<Riddell> \sh: but ogra started it!
<\sh> Riddell: true, it's called: TrollTech
<\sh> no I started it ;)
* ogra is pleased that the KDE people also have something they can call office, even if you cant open M$ files in it :)
<\sh> what?
<ogra> oh, can you ?
<\sh> shaving+showering+smelling very nice time now ;)
<Riddell> Amaranth: README file in smeg could do with some work :)
<Amaranth> hehe
<Amaranth> can't think of what to write
<Amaranth> want me to put something in there first?
<Riddell> dpkg-source: cannot represent change to lib/smeg/MenuHandler.pyc: binary file contents changed
<Amaranth> i put that in there?!?
<Amaranth> ack
<ogra> ouch
<Amaranth> i checked so many times and missed on the last upload :/
<ogra> just do a rm *.pyc in the clean target
<Riddell> shouldn't cdbs magicaly do the correct clean?
<Amaranth> no, i think i left those in there before tar'ing it
<Riddell> Amaranth: well if you're updating the tar files may as well put in "Smeg is an XDG menu editor" or something in README
<Amaranth> those files aren't in my tar
<Amaranth> so cdbs is failing me
<Amaranth> nice
<Amaranth> any ideas?
<Amaranth> they're not in my orig or the deb i built, either
<ogra> Nafallo, FontGlide and FontGlide (scroller) are the rss screensavers
<Nafallo> ogra: thanx :-)
<Amaranth> i'll reupload with a README though
<ogra> heh, they are actually quite cool :)
<Riddell> Amaranth: ah wait, could be my fault
<Amaranth> Riddell: reuploaded with README
<Riddell> Amaranth: cool
<Amaranth> you ran it before you built it? :)
<Riddell> Amaranth: I did
<Amaranth> hehe
<Riddell> python is sneaky like that
<Riddell>   File "/usr/lib/smeg/DialogHandler.py", line 30, in ?
<Riddell>     import gtk, gtk.glade
<Riddell> ImportError: No module named glade
<Amaranth> that's not a part of pygtk in ubuntu?
<Amaranth> whatever package it's in, it's in the DesktopSeed for ubuntu :P
<Riddell> not of python2.4-gtk2
<Amaranth> *groan*
<ivoks> hello
<Amaranth> must be python-gnome
<ivoks> elmo: ping :)
<Amaranth> no, not there either
<\sh> Riddell: do have it at your hand: which version of sip4 is in breezy right now?
<Riddell> Package: sip4  Version: 4.2.1-1ubuntu3
<\sh> good..txh
<Amaranth> ah
<Amaranth> python2.4-glade2
<Amaranth> i'm stupid
<Riddell> installed python-glade2 and now I get a different error
<Amaranth> what?
<Riddell>   File "/usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/xdg/Menu.py", line 498, in parse
<Riddell>     raise ParsingError('File not found', filename)
<Riddell> xdg.Exceptions.ParsingError: ParsingError in file '/etc/xdg/menus/applications.menu', File not found
<Amaranth> oh, that
<Amaranth> yeah, the .desktop file runs smeg --kde
<Riddell> I was running from command line
<Amaranth> but none of this runs without pyxdg 0.13, which hasn't hit main yet
<Riddell> and I don't have that file
<Amaranth> Riddell: Fix kde and I can fix smeg.
<Nafallo> Amaranth: I've downloaded it already.
<Amaranth> Nafallo: it hit main? woo
<Nafallo> :-)
<Riddell> pyxdg installed fine
<Amaranth> Riddell: Yes, but kde's applications.menu is kde-applications.menu, running with --kde makes smeg look for that.
* Nafallo pulls xscreensaver atm ;-)
<Amaranth> Riddell: If you guys hadn't broken the spec I wouldn't have had to break smeg. :)
<\sh> shermann@shermann-laptop:~/kde/pykde/trans$ sudo pbuilder build python-kde3_3.11.4+snapshot20050316-0ubuntu2
<\sh> now it goes
<ivoks> sudo?
<ivoks> fakeroot
<Riddell> Amaranth: I'm open to suggestions on how to fix that
<Amaranth> make both depend on a common package
<Riddell> Amaranth: and the only reason KDE moved and gnome didn't was I changed the package first then jdub said "oh well gnome doesn't have to change now"
<Amaranth> if gnome would have moved i would have switch to another distro
<Amaranth> anyway, reuploaded packages with dependency on python2.4-glade2
<Riddell>   File "/usr/lib/python2.4/os.py", line 159, in makedirs
<Riddell>     mkdir(name, mode)
<Riddell> OSError: [Errno 13]  Permission denied: '/home/jr/.config/smeg'
<Riddell> not very good at it's exception catching this thing :)
<Amaranth> your permissions are screwed
<ivoks> :)
<Amaranth> so far all the exceptions are in pyxdg
<Amaranth> except for the glade thing
<Amaranth> why would you not have access to your own $XDG_CONFIG_HOME?
<Amaranth> brb
<Riddell> Amaranth: it's a chroot, my permissions are indeed screwed
<Riddell> I still get
<Riddell> xdg.Exceptions.ParsingError: ParsingError in file '/etc/xdg/menus/applications.menu', File not found
<Riddell> when I run with --kde  or from a menu
<Amaranth> kde-applications.menu exists?
<Riddell>  /etc/xdg/menus/kde-applications.menu does
<Nafallo> lol
<\sh> hehehe
<Riddell> Amaranth: in the .desktop files you should have GenericName=Menu Editor  and just  Name=smeg
<\sh> Riddell: u want my build.log?
<Riddell> \sh: of pykde?
<\sh> yeah
<\sh> screwed completly
<Riddell> \sh: erk
<\sh> xbase clients and kdelibs4c2
<\sh> etc. pp
<Riddell> oh, X package errors
<Nafallo> ogra: gaah! that won't be my default rss-reader anyway ;-)
<Amaranth> Riddell: i have no idea what's wrong with your system then :/
<Amaranth> Riddell: this works fine here
<ogra> Nafallo, why ? its cool
<Amaranth> Riddell: Aren't you the one that told me to make it 'Smeg Menu Editor' so you can tell at a glance what it is?
<Nafallo> ogra: maybe if you got 3d-love ;-)
<Amaranth> ok, so i should depend on gnome-menus | kdelibs4
<\sh> kdelibs4c2
<ogra> Nafallo, lets see ;) if someone extends the days by 10h i'll probably have time
<ivoks> kde made transition?
<Riddell> Amaranth: don't think so, not sure.  but it should be as I just said
<Amaranth> Riddell: That doesn't help GNOME users out much.
<\sh> ivoks: where r u living? ,-)
<Nafallo> ogra: ooh. I thought my lack of 3d was the reason for the lag ;-)
<Amaranth> Riddell: I can do that in smeg-kde.desktop though
<Riddell> Amaranth: how so?
<wasabi_> Hello!
<ogra> Nafallo, you can adjust it
<Amaranth> Riddell: gnome doesn't show the generic name
<\sh> Riddell: ah...libkonq etc.
<Riddell> Amaranth: it works if I have a file /etc/xdg/menus/applications.menu, then when run with --kde it picks up the kde-applications.menu file
<Riddell> Amaranth: but it needs a applications.menu to be there
<Amaranth> *boggle*
<Amaranth> damnit
<Riddell> Amaranth: not my fault if gnome doesn't implement the spec properly :)
<\sh> Riddell: http://ubuntu.linux-server.org/pykde-build-20050602.log
<wasabi_> I need to start down the road of getting upload perms to main. Where do I start?
<Amaranth> Riddell: I don't see how that can be unless pyxdg is broken.
<Amaranth> the needing applications.menu part, i mean
<Riddell> "/etc/X11/xkb/xkbcomp symbolic link points to wrong location"  \sh I've seen other people complain about that
<Amaranth> i'll have to wait for lanius to get back online
<Amaranth> smeg will probably have to wait for pyxdg 0.14
<Riddell> Amaranth: other than that I'm happy with the package
<Nafallo> ogra: yea. that made it a lot easier. but it seems the damn thing lacks UTF-8 love or something ;-).
<\sh> Riddell: but it's not the main issue
<Riddell> \sh: seems to be the issue in that build log
<Nafallo> ogra: i.e. Matar<strange char>
<Nafallo> ;-)
<ivoks> \sh: would you test one source for me? on amd64?
<\sh> ivoks: can it wait for tomorrow? i'm on the run to meet an old friend :)
<ivoks> \sh: np
<ivoks> ogra: could you? :)
<ivoks> or anyone who has access to amd64?
<\sh> Riddell: is someone working on it?
<ogra> ivoks, didnt you sort it out with Mithrandir yet ?
<\sh> daniels?
<Amaranth> Riddell: I'm not convinced something is horribly wrong with pyxdg
<ivoks> ogra: no
<Amaranth> Riddell: Mostly because the owner isn't on a distro that did the kde-applications.menu junk.
<Amaranth> s/owner/developer/
<ivoks> ogra: i don't know why, he didn't tell me
<Riddell> Amaranth: have you tried running it without applications.menu?
<Amaranth> s/not/now/
<Amaranth> yes, i just did
<Riddell> ah
<Amaranth> it used only my ~/.config/menus/applications.menu
<Riddell> Amaranth: I've put my review on MOTUNewPackages
<Amaranth> should have used /etc/xdg/menus/kde-applications.menu and ~/.config/menus/kde-applications.menu
* Riddell goes out to hand out Kubuntu CDs
<Amaranth> so, if i make this gnome-only for now it should be fine?
<wasabi_> ogra, what's it take to get main upload permissions? :)
<ivoks> well, bye all
<\sh> ok...gentlemen time for "brain reset part II"
<ogra> wasabi_, TB decides.... normally you get asked to put yourself on the agenda
<wasabi_> So I guess I should be putting myself on the agenda.
<\sh> cu later
<wasabi_> I haven't really focused much on the formal Ubuntu stuff... like, when meetings are, etc.
<wasabi_> Or even where the Agenda is. heh
<\sh> wiki/TechnicalBoardAgenda
<wasabi_> What just stuck "Review JerryHaltom for upload permissions to main (Java moving to main)." or something
<Amaranth> Riddell: It now depends on gnome-menus. Until pyxdg gets fixes it'll have to be gnome only.
<Amaranth> Riddell: Or even GNOME and KDE as long as gnome-menus gets pulled in.
<herve> houba!
<Amaranth> hey, i have another victim!
<Amaranth> herve: can i get your to review a package for me? :)
<Amaranth> err you
<Amaranth> i need to learn how to type
<herve> "your" was good
<herve> but missing the name "mind"
<herve> I get it back and ping you then
<jani> evening all
<herve> hi jani
<herve> long time not seen
<herve> how are you?
<jani> busy, thanks :)
<jani> haven't had much time for ubuntu lately :(
<herve> yeah, I know what it is
<jani> all the rocking going on and I am just a spectator...
<herve> I'm in the beginning of such a period
<herve> I'm glad guadec videos are available
<herve> now there is something on TV :)-
<Nafallo> s/tv/computer/ ;-)
<Nafallo> herve: or tv-out? :-P
<herve> I don't have a TV set anyway!
<Nafallo> herve: yay! way to go :-). I'm trying to sell mine ;-)
<herve> no thank you :-)
<herve> still 14 bugs in sarge :-(
<Amaranth> 14?
<Amaranth> i thought it was down to 8
<herve> I see 4 new open lately
<herve> alright Amaranth, I'll concentrate on your package
<Amaranth> ok
<Amaranth> it might change soon, but cool :)
<Amaranth> nevermind, that version is doable
<Amaranth> but once we get a new pyxdg out i'll have a new version of smeg, how is that handled?
<herve> or just say if you want me to focus on a particular aspect
<Amaranth> well, as is it should rock for GNOME
<Amaranth> need to wait for a new pyxdg to make it work on KDE again
<herve> I think you'll set a minimal version requirement for pyxdg
<herve> since you will depend on it
<Amaranth> i have one
<Amaranth> >= 0.13
<herve> I see you fixed smeg being a native package :-)
<herve> you're the author?
<herve> boy, new packages review really needs love
<Amaranth> yeah, i'm the author
<herve> just wondering for comparing the source tarball
<herve> hmm... do you know about the new python object model?
<Amaranth> yes
<herve> you wouldn't use it?
<Amaranth> doesn't pyxdg need to use it for that to work?
<herve> I don't think so, you're not inheriting from it
<Amaranth> yes i am
<Amaranth> that's what xdg.MenuEditor.MenuEditor is
<herve> I'm looking at the smeg binary
<Amaranth> eh?
<Amaranth> not sure what you mean then
<herve> it contains a Smeg class
<Amaranth> yes...
<Amaranth> you mean you want me to inherit from object for no reason?
<herve> for catching up with python and use the new object model
<herve> you'll gain a better garbage collector for example
<Amaranth> is it ok if i wait until pyxdg 0.14 and smeg 0.7.4 to have this reviewed? :)
<Amaranth> we just got some bugs fixed, i'll toss that in too
<Amaranth> well, might as well review it, so i know what else to look at
<herve> I was just curious about the code
<herve> but I'll focus on the packaging, don't worry :)
<Amaranth> if i get you and Riddell to review this what should i do when i put up 0.7.4?
<Amaranth> just mark that it's a new version on the wiki?
<herve> that's a big flaw of the wiki
<herve> and why we need a request tracker
<herve> as for me, I'll mark my comments as applying to the 0.7.3-0ubuntu1 version
<Amaranth> ok
<herve> hehe, debian/control.in template
<herve> you'll find lovers and enemies of this :-)
<herve> hmm maybe the manpage needs an update
<herve> it refers to gnome only
<Amaranth> I don't know how to make a man page. Someone else made that.
<herve> I just borrowed one and changed the text for mine ;-)
<Amaranth> hey, this man page says i wrote it
<Amaranth> hehe
<Amaranth> anything else?
<herve> no
<herve> the packaging looks good
<Amaranth> ok, all of that will be fixed in 0.7.4 :)
<herve> haven't it the application yet
<Amaranth> yeah, not hard to get cdbs packaging right
<herve> s/it/tried
<herve> but I'll test 0.7.4, anyway?
<Amaranth> only if you're willing to make pyxdg 0.14 debs :)
<herve> it's in universe?
<Amaranth> no
<Amaranth> i have to wait for seb
<herve> ha yes, I saw him uploading it
<Amaranth> yeah, he just uploaded 0.13 today
<Amaranth> and we released 0.14 :)
<Amaranth> well, we're about to anyway
<herve> hehe
<herve> pyxdg 0.14 :-)
<Amaranth> yep
<Amaranth> seb is too fast
<herve> reminds me...
<mgalvin> hey herve, when you say you resync a package with debian, what is that is being done, I only ask b/c I am working on debian packages the I would like to see get into ubuntu
<herve> I diff what the actual ubuntu brought to the debian one at that time
<herve> and reapply it where needed on the new debian one
<herve> but it requires having archives of debian packages
<herve> which I hardly find
<herve> for pylint it was easy since I knew what to do
<herve> python transition... memories :-)
<Amaranth> ok, 0.7.4 out
<Amaranth> just need to wait for pyxdg to hit main
<Amaranth> i'll update the wiki
<ajmitch> morning
<herve> hi ajmitch
<herve> mgalvin, you got my answer?
<mgalvin> herve, yup, thnx
<ajmitch> mm, snowing here..
* ajmitch wonders if that's why noone else is in the office yet :)
<mgalvin> l8r all
<herve> night all
<herve> Amaranth, I test smeg 0.7.4 and approve your package
<Amaranth> ack
<Amaranth> he didn't update the wiki
<Amaranth> ok, i need one more review then smeg can go into universe and people can cheer, right ;)
<Amaranth> ?
* Amaranth annoys more people into getting his package reviewed :)
* Nafallo would want to annoy someone with his mirrorproblems ;-)
<|QuaD-_> is ooo2 motu or main?
<Amaranth> for breezy it either is or will be main
<Amaranth> is, ubuntu-desktop depends on it
<|QuaD-_> Amaranth: ok, cuz both ooo and ooo2 keep crashing on me when i try to use the menus
#ubuntu-motu 2005-06-10
<dholbach> hellas
<dholbach> can everybody please give me a brief statement over their last month with the MOTU crew?
<ajmitch> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hey
<ajmitch> not hard to summarise my efforts recently ;)
<ajmitch> although the last month includes everything since UDU
<dholbach> just a random statement - what you liked, what you did, what you disliked, which idea you had you want to tell the world :)
<dholbach> not just you, andrew :)
<ajmitch> everyone has to file a report :)
<dholbach> nooooo, just a statement
<ajmitch> alright..
<dholbach> so it won't just be my babbling
<dholbach> :)
<ajmitch> you don't babble
<Amaranth> dholbach: hey
<Amaranth> dholbach: review my package ;)
<Amaranth> it's smeg
<Amaranth> i need one more review
<dholbach> Amaranth: ...
<Amaranth> dholbach: please? :)
<ajmitch> Amaranth: if you want, I can review this afternoon after work?
<Amaranth> ajmitch: that works, thanks
<tseng> ajmitch: do you use svn.d.o?
<dholbach> Amaranth: i can absolutely understand your excitement
<ajmitch> tseng: no, I haven't
<ajmitch> not for commit access anyway
<tseng> ajmitch: i can login to svn.d.o with ssh
<tseng> but i cant commit with the same password over ssh
<tseng> as in, it prompts again for the password
<tseng> not some access control
<Amaranth> did you try just putting in the password again? :)
<tseng> yes
<ajmitch> odd, is it wanting you to use an ssh key instead?
<tseng> i dunno
<tseng> i just uploaded a key to the web interface
<tseng> ill try it again tommorow
<tseng> oh yeah right
<tseng> htf does that happen
<tseng> eh, the ssh key works in any case
<ajmitch> tseng: figured it out?
<tseng> yeah it worked with the key after 3 tries
<tseng> i cant imagine how i can type perfectly in the other tab
<tseng> and fail repeatedly in that one
<tseng> but yeah..
<tseng> its committed
<ajmitch> great, I can at least remember my alioth password now
<dholbach> tseng: any comment on what the MOTUMono team achieved in the last month? want to mention something?
<ajmitch> dholbach: heh, what hasn't it achieved?
<Nafallo> dholbach: mono in main! :-)
<tseng> dholbach: we moved 1.1.7 into breezy, updated every app per the new standards, drafted a policy doc for Debian review, moved to main...
<tseng> and more!
<ajmitch> almost everything specced out at UDU
<tseng> well i wouldnt say that
<tseng> we have alot of trouble on !x86
<Nafallo> and amd64 haven't even got the packages ;-)
<tseng> i am going to bother sabdfl a good bit about testing hardware whenever he surfaces again
<Nafallo> AFAIKS
<tseng> Nafallo: QUITCHERBITCHIN
<dholbach> alright, got it
<tseng> :P
<Nafallo> tseng: I love you to :-)
<tseng> thanks dholbach !
<dholbach> so... come on people: some random comments
<tseng> er
<tseng> CXX team rocks my face
<dholbach> is MOTU live SO boring?
<tseng> ogra is a canonical employee
<tseng> um
<Nafallo> tseng: huh?
<tseng> Nafallo: huh?
<Nafallo> tseng: when did he became that? :-)
<tseng> sorry was that a secret
<Mithrandir> was it?
<tseng> i didnt think so.
<Nafallo> tseng: I dunno. I know that I didn't knew :-).
<tseng> well, he did, and we should congratulate him
<Nafallo> kewl! ping ogra!!! :-D
<Nafallo> ogra: ping even
<Mithrandir> he's probably asleep, given that it's half past midnight in his TZ
<Amaranth> when did that happen?
<tseng> a few weeks.
<Amaranth> cool
<ogra> pong ?
<ogra> Nafallo,
<Nafallo> ogra: congrats! :-D
* Nafallo hugs ogra *
<ogra> heh, thanks :)
<tseng> sorry i didnt mean to make a big fuss ogra.
<tseng> heh
<Nafallo> ogra: know that you are here dholbach want's random text from you ;-)
<dholbach> give a brief comment on: "your last month with the MOTU crew"
<dholbach> everybody :)
<ajmitch> hmm, looks like I was dropped from NetworkMagic
<Amaranth> can't you just say "we kicked ass"?
<ogra> dholbach, feel free to qoute from my mails about Cxx transition :)
<dholbach> oh please
<dholbach> spontaneous!
<dholbach> i already DID research
<dholbach> now i want to add some life! :)
<ogra> point out that MOTU works tighter with the backports team and that we hope that both sides participate in that
<dholbach> yeah
<\sh> back from brain reset part II
<tseng> huh svn sucks
<tseng> oh i know
<Amaranth> \sh: Could I get you to review smeg for me? It's on MOTUNewPackages.
<Amaranth> herve reviewed it and said it was ok, i fixed the one issue Riddell had, i just need one more
<\sh> Amaranth: sure this morning after coffee and first piece of newspaper :)
<Amaranth> ok
<\sh> i just had a hard evening behind me, with the latest rumours about digital tv and internet over cable
<\sh> and then all the beer
<\sh> really hard..
<\sh> ogra: greetings back from branislav...he's happy, that you found the job u ever whished for :)
<tseng> so anyone have a ppc?
<ogra> thanks :)
<tseng> or ill have to bug pitti again
<tseng> to build in concordia
<tseng> silly mark..
<\sh> ogra: and hi from sherif :) can i give him your icq uin?
<dholbach> http://moz.gotdns.org/ubuntu/motu-report/
<dholbach> oops... well :)
<\sh> hehe
<tseng> it could use some formatting
<tseng> but its nice
<dholbach> no additions?
<ajmitch> dholbach: that's a long URL for the merges :)
<ajmitch> you could use tinyurl?
<dholbach> yeah, sure
* ajmitch ought to put up his merge scripts & stuff some time
<ajmitch> the list I ran a couple of days ago showed about 300 packages still
<\sh> dholbach: yes one addition
<dholbach> \sh: fire away
<ajmitch> diamond, not diamon
<\sh> that without ogra and u, without the recruitement work ogra's doing and without your efford for having quality this team wouldn't be the one team :)
<\sh> and: THX FOR ALL THE ROCK AND ROLL ALL DAY :)
<ogra> :)
<tseng> yep without them i would be the only MOTU
<dholbach> WOW
<tseng> they are the #1 recruiter
<tseng> s
* dholbach bows impressedly :)
<\sh> dholbach: and this is not only "blabla". ogra and I had some talks about personal leadership :) and he knows what I like and what not :) and u 2 have it, really, u made it, no, u make it, u will make it :)
* Mithrandir tickles tseng
<dholbach> Stephan Hermann, new MOTU, C++ rocker and KDE enthusiast wants to add: "that without ogra and u, without the recruitement work ogra's doing and without dholbach's effort for having quality this team wouldn't be the one team :)" and: "THX FOR ALL THE ROCK AND ROLL ALL DAY :)"
<tseng> Mithrandir: did i break something? :P
<dholbach> ok with you? :)
<tseng> Mithrandir: thats my job.
<Mithrandir> tseng: no, not this time.
<\sh> and now...time to go to bed for \sh
<tseng> good :)
<Mithrandir> tseng: does beagle do any kind of indexing of remote stuff?  Or be able to connect to a remote beagle instance or something?
<dholbach> thanks \sh :)
<tseng> Mithrandir: it has a web service
<tseng> i dont remember if i turned it on or not
<tseng> there was a user request
<wasabi_> A remote beagle would be an awesome idea.
<ogra> tseng, so anybody can search your disk remotely ?
<wasabi_> Like, if beagle could search remote NFS mounts by contacting the beagle on the remote NFS server
<Mithrandir> tseng: using what protocol?
<tseng> ogra: yes
<tseng> Mithrandir: http
<tseng> it has its own interface i think
<Mithrandir> tseng: ew; can you get it to use client certs or something?
<ogra> Mithrandir, its a built in webserver in beagle
<tseng> I never used this yet
<\sh> tseng: y don't u use google?
<tseng> Mithrandir: its off-by-default
<wasabi_> It's crazy how there are so many negative reactions to searching remote systems.
<Mithrandir> tseng: but I want it, but I'd like it not to be crackful.
<wasabi_> I am searching for a commercial product for my office right now to allow us to do that.
<tseng> you have a firewall?
<ogra> Mithrandir, you just connect to the remote box and lok up the online banking docs, cool eh ?
<tseng> you can block the port and use stunnel or ssh or what not
<tseng> anyway ill try and get it running here
<ogra> tseng, thats a huge security hole
<Mithrandir> tseng: that's the wrong solution. :-)
<tseng> ogra: blocking the port?
<Mithrandir> tseng: it should be using some sort of secure auth by default.
<tseng> its off-by-default
<tseng> ok, ill look at it im talking out my ass
<wasabi_> Can beagle be run as a system daemon?
<wasabi_> As root.
<tseng> wasabi_: it runs as a user
<ogra> tseng, split the package
<wasabi_> Or something.
<ogra> beagle-web
<Mithrandir> tseng: cheers, cool.
<Mithrandir> tseng: just wondering, mostly. :)
<\sh> ok..guys g'night ... will see u tomorrow :)
<ogra> or even beagle-webserver
<wasabi_> It'd be neat if it was like the ms indexing service.
<wasabi_> corporations find that stuff invaluable
<ogra> \sh, thanks for the flowers :)
<tseng> http://www.gnomebangalore.org/images/Beagle-firefox-ws.png
* tseng looks for docs
<\sh> ogra: give the flowers to your wife^Wgirlfriend :) I think she needs them more then u :)
* \sh 's off
<tseng> (--enable-network, Enable Network Service (default disabled))
<tseng> hm this is different from webservices option
<tseng> i wonder what it does
<Mithrandir> blah, where's ivoks?
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: away for studies for a week or something like that.
<Mithrandir> silly reason. :P
<tseng>         Enable Network          yes
<tseng>         Enable WebServices      yes
<tseng>         Enable Rendezvous       no
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: ;-)
<tseng> this keeps getting scarier
<Nafallo> hehe
<tseng> i might leave it off
<Nafallo> tseng: my mirrorscript is much scarier atm ;-)
<dholbach> good night people
<tseng> bye dholbach
<Nafallo> tseng: wants to redownload the whole main and restricted ;-)
<dholbach> have a nice... evening or something :)
<Nafallo> dholbach: night :-)
<Nafallo> tseng: and that's from all three releases :-P
<tseng> ok i still dont see beagle opening a tcp port
<Mithrandir> tseng: rendezvous++
<tseng> Mithrandir: howl--
<Mithrandir> tseng: but then I even more want it to authenticate.
<tseng> oh oh
<tseng> stupid me
<tseng> $ ./configure --enable-webservices=yes
<Mithrandir> tseng: we need a free howl replacement.
<tseng> i skipped the yet
<tseng> yes*
<tseng> hm no
<tseng> it picked it up
<tseng> "You must explicitly start it while launching beagled, by providing one of the following command line options: "
<tseng> --web-start: starts web-server on port 8888 & root directory as $(prefix)/share/doc/xsp
<tseng> --web-port xxxx: starts web-server on port xxxx & root dir as $(prefix)/share/doc/xsp
<tseng> --web-root /x/y/z: starts web-server on port 8888, with root directory as /x/y/z
<tseng> ah-hah tollef
<tseng> Beagle web access is restricted to local accesses, by default. If you wish to have the your local beagle daemon support global web access, you must specify the command line option '--web-global'.
<tseng> http://beaglewiki.org/WebServiceInterface < its all on here
<Mithrandir> tseng: can you tell it what interface to listen to too?
<tseng> i only see port
<tseng> but at that point choosing an interface couldnt be that hard
<Amaranth> interface to list to?
<tseng> listen.
<tseng> Mithrandir: i think its safe to ship with this in any case, since its non-trivial to turn on at all, and harder to go outside of localhsot
<Nafallo> tseng: seems like it
<tseng> Mithrandir: you should read about the access control to non-local users even once its allowing access they see no files by default.
* tseng dinner?
<Unfrgiven> \sh: pong
<Unfrgiven> good morning all
<ajmitch> bbl
<Unfrgiven> tseng: does beagle require kernel 2.6.12 to work? or will it work ok with 2.6.10 (as shipped with hoary)?
<tseng> i wouldnt recommend it
<Unfrgiven> tseng: bummer :( ndiswrapper doesnt work too well on 2.6.12 for me :(
<Unfrgiven> tseng: so i guess no beagle for the moment
<zul> 2.6.10's inotify doesnt work too well either
<Unfrgiven> zul: yeah... i guess if i have to choose network connectivity versus beagle, i have to choose the network
<tseng> mmm, ndiswrapper is bogus
<Unfrgiven> tseng: what other choice do i have for a broadcom wifi card :(
<Nafallo> Unfrgiven: replace it ;-)
<Unfrgiven> Nafallo: this is on my  laptop
<Nafallo> Unfrgiven: yes? :-)
<Unfrgiven> Nafallo: :P
* Nafallo could replace his by removing one screw.
<Nafallo> don't want to do that though ;-)
<zul> lazy :)
<Nafallo> zul: baah. it's GPL'd now ;-)
<Nafallo> zul: btw, rt2x00 is beta.
<Nafallo> zul: still think we should wait for final though.
<zul> i agree..
<Nafallo> zul: but! there is a new module ;-). rt2570. development started today on that. seems they are reusing a lot of code.
* Amaranth begs a review :)
<Nafallo> 802.11g rt2570 USB driver
<zul> im quite aware of it will have a look at it sometime
<Nafallo> zul: I'll look at it aswell. I might do since I get all those bloody mails about it ;-)
<Nafallo> might aswell even
<mgalvin> after updating a debian package and sending it back up to debian, i should now change the version again to <package>-<version>-0ubuntu1, correct?
<wasabi> If you have a change to make.
<mgalvin> well i updated it to the latest version of the package
<mgalvin> an ubuntu specific change you mean?
<mgalvin> keyboard is going ntz, gottareboot anyay, brb
<mgalvin> much better :)
<chillywilly> you guys are too unreasonable, therefore I will be releasing UU (Uber Ubuntu) next week....that is all ;)
<chillywilly> the "Randy Rhinocerus"
* Amaranth needs one more review for smeg :/
<Amaranth> Riddell: can you see if 0.7.4 fixes your issues with smeg?
<Riddell> Amaranth: URL?
<Amaranth> Riddell: sorry, back
<Amaranth> Riddell: http://dev.realistanew.com/smeg/0.7.4/
<tseng> chillywilly: i hope you are joking.
<Amaranth> tseng: he said that here right after complaining about firefox 1.0.4 in #ubuntu
<tseng> gfg
* Riddell reviews
<Amaranth> herve reviewed and ok'd 0.7.4, didn't update the wiki
<mgalvin> what is they general feeling about cdbs? do you guys use it here in ubuntu (other then for debian .debs that already use it)?
<Riddell> python-xdg was updated quickly
<tseng> yes we use it
<Amaranth> Riddell: yeah, seb jumped on it
<tseng> i use it for all my new packages when it makes sense
<Amaranth> i told him there was a new release, 5 minutes later he had it uploaded
<Amaranth> <seb128> Amaranth: yeah, users want smeg :p <seb128> I don't want to make them angry :)
<Amaranth> ;)
<tseng> am I overly pissed off, or are people getting stupider?
<mgalvin> tseng, thnx
<tseng> mgalvin: nps
<Amaranth> tseng: people are getting stupider, i think :P
<tseng> heh
<tseng> the winner for the day is {Seb}
<tseng> "i am a beagle hacker"
<chillywilly> tseng: yes that was a joke
<tseng> k.
<Riddell> Amaranth: it doesn't seem to save changes
<Amaranth> wha?
<Amaranth> let me guess, it saved ~/.config/menus/applications.menu even though you used --kde
<zul> tseng: a little from column a, a little from column b
<Riddell> Amaranth: for one thing there's no Save button or menu entry
<Riddell> Amaranth: it does save to .config/menus/kde-applications.menu
<Riddell> Amaranth: but it doesn't actually change any of the names
<Amaranth> does ~/.local/share/applications or ~/.local/share/desktop-directories/ have anything in it?
<Amaranth> it seems to be working here
<Riddell> Amaranth: they do
<Riddell> Amaranth: but the files in them just have the origional Name= value and not the new one
<Amaranth> Riddell: that makes no sense, i just tried here
<Amaranth> Riddell: i removed all my local stuff, moved applications.menu aside, and worked in --kde mode
<Amaranth> Riddell: did it change for any locale?
<Riddell> Amaranth: ah hah
<Riddell> Amaranth: yes
<Riddell> it changed for en_GB
<Amaranth> Riddell: Your locales are setup wrong?
<Riddell> but my chroot is in C
<Amaranth> oh, that bug
<Amaranth> yeah
<Amaranth> nothing i can do there :/
<Riddell> Amaranth: ok, it's just chroot strangeness, I'll let you off :)
<Amaranth> heh
<Amaranth> python reads /etc/environment
<Amaranth> which hoary sets wrong, i thought maybe that was biting you
<Riddell> Amaranth: from a usability view I think it should open properties on a double click
<Riddell> and it should have a save button or menu entry
<Riddell> but I'm all for having it uploaded
<Amaranth> I thought the 'GNOME Way' was auto apply. ;)
* Riddell doesn't do Gnome Way
<Amaranth> well, it's a gnome app that just happens to work pretty well with kde :D
<Riddell> yeah
<Amaranth> be happy i removed the dependency on python2.4-gnome2 :D
<Riddell> feel free to port it to pyqt :)
<Amaranth> ha
<Amaranth> document pyqt first
<Amaranth> even as is, i think it's a huge improvement over kmenuedit
<Riddell> agreed
<Amaranth> no offense to waldo
<Riddell> waldo isn't a usability expert
<Riddell> so still needs one more person to review?
<Amaranth> yeah
<Amaranth> be trying to round one up for about 8 hours now :/
<mgalvin> good night all
<ivoks> omg
<ivoks> i have /dev/bull file :)
<ivoks> some package has typo :)
<Amaranth> lmao
<Amaranth> what's in it?
* ajmitch returns
<ivoks> Amaranth: updating mime :)
<schweeb> ivoks: does it persist across reboots? if so, it's a typo in udev
<ivoks> well... i don't reboot this machine
<schweeb> heh
<ivoks> i even upgraded from sarge to hoary without reboot :)
<schweeb> grep -r bull /etc
<ivoks> -sr
<ivoks> nothing... hm
<ivoks> Updating MIME database in /usr/share/mime...
<schweeb> dpkg -S /dev/bull ?
<ivoks> no
<ivoks> that's not going to work
<schweeb> true
<ivoks> maybe it's my fault
<schweeb> I guess the mknod would be in a pre/post script
<ajmitch> so grep in /var/lib/dpkg/info
<ivoks> but i never redirected output from dpkg
<ivoks> lol
<ajmitch> but a script might do ... 2>&1 > /dev/bull
<schweeb> yes
<schweeb> so you don't have to look at output
<ivoks> Argument list too long
<ivoks> ok... let's try another aproach :)
<ajmitch> use find :)
<ivoks> bluefish
<ivoks> :)))
<schweeb> I have an idea
<schweeb> just a sec
<ivoks> bluefish.postinst:        /usr/bin/update-mime-database /usr/share/mime > /dev/bull
<schweeb> yea, that's what I was about to say, is check the dpkg scripts dir
<ajmitch> fix it, file bug in debian if it's there :)
* ajmitch looks up debian's BTS
<ivoks> ajmitch: will do, but now is 4:30AM :)
<ajmitch> oh, looks like ubuntu has a newer version, maintainer dholbach ;)
<ivoks> he's typo? :)
<ivoks> he's?!
<ivoks> uh... his
<ajmitch> seems to be :)
<ajmitch> malone report time!
<ajmitch> ivoks: want me to file it for you?
<schweeb> man
<schweeb> look at ajmitch, all excited to file malone bugs
<ajmitch> schweeb: ?
<ajmitch> haha
<ajmitch> malone is fun ;)
<ivoks> :)
<schweeb> ajmitch: I saw the pic of you and tseng flipping me off, how rude :P
<ivoks> ajmitch: i will do it :)
<ajmitch> schweeb: haha :)
<Amaranth> ajmitch: Could you take a look at smeg now? It's on MOTUNewPackages
<ajmitch> schweeb: yeah, forgot about that one :)
<ajmitch> Amaranth: you're keen to get this reviewed, aren't you?
<Amaranth> yeah :)
<Amaranth> i only need one more person
<Amaranth> herve didn't update the wiki before he left :/
<ajmitch> are all the deps in main or universe?
<Amaranth> hmm
<Amaranth> i think main
<schweeb> wonder if mako ever checked to see if my CoC sig was fine for membership...
<ajmitch> Amaranth: as long as they're in so that I can build it & run it :)
<ivoks> schweeb: :))
<Amaranth> it's just python stuff, pyxdg, and a dep on gnome-menus | kdelibs-data
<Amaranth> yeah, it's all in breezy though
<ajmitch> great
<schweeb> since I haven't been around much laterly
<schweeb> *lately
* ajmitch hopes he doesn't have to upgrade too much 
<schweeb> there a big list of shit to do?
<Amaranth> ajmitch: just pyxdg, afaik
<ajmitch> oh yeah
<Amaranth> schweeb: MOTUNewPackages needs much love
<Amaranth> personally i think this stuff should be on malone
<ajmitch> Amaranth: no build-deps on any of those packages?
<Amaranth> ajmitch: just cdbs, debhelper, and python-dev
<ajmitch> ok..
<schweeb> Amaranth: not motu yet, so can't approve, sorry :(
<ivoks> damn malone
<ivoks>  Sorry, a system error occurred
<ajmitch> heh
<schweeb> I'm getting all hyped and motivated again though, cause I'm getting a new laptop
<schweeb> time to do more work :D
<ivoks> oh, come on!!!
<ivoks> malone is broken
<ajmitch> everyone knows that :)
<schweeb> does lamont still have buildlogs going to his ~
<ajmitch> yep
<ivoks> lol /dev/bull
* ajmitch waits for the deb to install..
<ivoks> what deb?
<ajmitch> smeg
<ivoks> :)
<ajmitch> I've got to test it as part of the review :)
<Amaranth> any problems with the packaging?
<ajmitch> nope
<ajmitch> seems to all be in order
<Amaranth> woo
<ajmitch> when should the menu changes take effect?
<Amaranth> on exist
<Amaranth> err, exit
<ajmitch> ok
* ajmitch has a fair bit of junk in his menus
<Amaranth> too resource intensive doing them on-the-fly
<ajmitch> yay, worked beautifully
<ajmitch> good work, this looks good :)
<Amaranth> just don't look at the code ;)
<ajmitch> oh I did, very very briefly :)
<schweeb> welcome dooglus
<dooglus> hi schweeb
<Amaranth> and if you know anything about gtk clipboard's and treestore's, i need lots of help there :)
<dooglus> that Amaranth bloke gets around!  :)
<Amaranth> dooglus: 11 channels :)
<ajmitch> Amaranth: good, no random junk gets left in the deb when doing a source build after a binary build :)
<Amaranth> ajmitch: thank cdbs
<ajmitch> Amaranth: heh :)
<ajmitch> so do you want me to upload now that you have your three reviews?
<Amaranth> i'm thinking about adding a clean:: rm -rf build next time to make it end exactly how it started
<Amaranth> yes please
<Amaranth> i was trying to get an earlier version of this into hoary universe, this has been a long time coming :)
<ajmitch> ok, who was the 3rd reviewer?
<ajmitch> I see riddell & myself
<Amaranth> herve
<Amaranth> he didn't update the wiki
<Amaranth> herve night all
<Amaranth> herve Amaranth, I test smeg 0.7.4 and approve your package
<Amaranth> * herve has quit ("Leaving")
<ajmitch> ok
<ivoks> ajmitch: you could upload wifi-radar too :)
<Amaranth> woo
* ajmitch uploads smeg...
<ajmitch> Successfully uploaded packages.
<ivoks> ajmitch: i would do it, but i don't have acc yet :(
<Amaranth> i get to be the first ubuntuforums project to say i'm in ubuntu ;)
<Amaranth> well, i guess backports kinda beat me
<crimsun> not the 'b' word
<ajmitch> they're not formally in yet :)
<crimsun> please not the 'b' word
<ivoks> :)
<Amaranth> crimsun: we can't discriminate against the 'b' word anymore
<ajmitch> crimsun: the 'b' word has been struck from the naughty list now ;)
<Amaranth> crimsun: they're an official ubuntu project now
<ivoks> yeag
<ajmitch> ivoks: url to latest wifi-radar?
<blahrus> when did they become official?
<crimsun> my $deity.
<ivoks> b-people doing b-stuff
<ivoks> ajmitch: http://www.grad.hr/~ivoks/ubuntu
<crimsun> so uh, who's redoing all their incorrectly versioned stuff?
<schweeb> ajmitch: man, that must have given a few people some heart attacks
<ajmitch> crimsun: official yesterday
<Amaranth> right after they agreed to not do crack things like backport mono and pull things from places other than breezy
<schweeb> "backports, oh no"
<blahrus> ohhhh wifiradar :)
* schweeb goes off to read the mailing list to catch up
<ajmitch> they agreed to feed all crack here, and then backport from us :)
<crimsun> ok, whew
<crimsun> sounds like an acceptable compromise
<ivoks> blahrus: yes? :)
<schweeb> anyone awake right now happen to have an IBM X41/X40?
<ajmitch> crimsun: and to have strict limits on backports from main
<blahrus> I would really like to help out, I don't have much experience or anything? Any suggestions?
<blahrus> ivoks: been looking for that
<Amaranth> ajmitch: should i scrub smeg from MOTUNewPackages?
<blahrus> ivoks: need to update breezy, but I wanna wait untill x is worked out
<ivoks> blahrus: lol, it's there for a month :)
<blahrus> ivoks: I need this box that I am running it on
<ajmitch> Amaranth: make a new section 'Uploaded', and move it to there
<blahrus> ivoks: i don't keep up todate as I should
<ajmitch> so we can keep the reviews around
<schweeb> blahrus: what are you interested in?
<Amaranth> nice, firefox crashed
<ivoks> blahrus: wifi-radar works on all debian based distros :)
<schweeb> blahrus: packaging, bug reporting, ?
<schweeb> best way is to either upgrade to breezy
<blahrus> schweeb: sounds good, where should I start
<schweeb> and do bug reports
<schweeb> or
<schweeb> take bug reports on packages
<schweeb> and fix them
<blahrus> schweeb: I guess I am better if I am given tasks
<schweeb> yea, I'm working on finding some myself
<schweeb> I've been out of the loop a while
<ajmitch> schweeb: dude, CxxLibraryList still needs your love
<schweeb> ajmitch: as long as they're simple repairs
<Amaranth> ajmitch: done
<schweeb> I'm no coder
<blahrus> schweeb: any suggestions for updating to breezy if I do it right now, I need x to work :)
<ajmitch> ivoks: I suppose I should install this wifi-radar on my laptop to test it ;)
<ivoks> ajmitch: go ahead
<schweeb> blahrus: do I know you from Ars or something, your nick seems familiar
<ajmitch> ivoks: you got the reviews needed for wifi-radar?
<Amaranth> ajmitch: should i cut out the reviews for it?
<ivoks> ajmitch: milions of ubuntu users are using it daily :)
<Amaranth> millions?
<ivoks> ajmitch: herve and siretart said it's ok :)
<Amaranth> if we have millions GNOME 10x10 is done
<schweeb> blahrus: there's a mailing list post on how to get X working I believe
<schweeb> but it's in quite a bit of flux
<ivoks> Amaranth: it's a joke
<blahrus> schweeb: yea you do seem very fimilar shome how
<schweeb> and could break any day
<blahrus> schweeb: devel list?
<ajmitch> ivoks: ok, will check the diff, sign & upload
<schweeb> ubuntu-devel? no,  not really
<ivoks> ajmitch: my sign isn't enough?
<schweeb> hang out on Ars Technica/#linux and here
<blahrus> schweeb: what else are you into online
<ajmitch> ivoks: if your key isn't in the keyring yet, then no
<schweeb> other than those... #linode...
<schweeb> which I'm barely ever on
<ivoks> ajmitch: yeah, that figures :)
<ajmitch> otherwise it's a waste of time me uploading, because you could do it ;)
<blahrus> thats IT!
<schweeb> ahhh
<blahrus> i used to be big on linode
<schweeb> heh
<blahrus> still a great product
<schweeb> yea
<blahrus> just run my own servers now :)
<schweeb> I'm pretty friendly w/ caker and mikegrb
<blahrus> yea caker is one smart man
<schweeb> but same here, I run my own user mode linux server, actually
<schweeb> was looking into Xen, but no hardware/time
<blahrus> really
<blahrus> yea xen seems cool
<ajmitch> ivoks: wifi-radar may have been accepted, but sitting in NEW - we'll never know
<blahrus> what distro do you run your uml kernel on?
<schweeb> sid
<blahrus> cool
<ivoks> ajmitch: ?
<schweeb> sid from like 9 months ago
<ajmitch> ivoks: when you uploaded it, it may have been sitting in a queue that elmo approves
<blahrus> no updates?
<schweeb> sshhhhh
<ivoks> ajmitch: ah... ok
<ajmitch> I've uploaded anyway
<crimsun> sid from nine months ago might well be sarge ;)
<blahrus> haha
<ivoks> ajmitch: thanks
<ajmitch> no problem
<schweeb> alright
<schweeb> looking at cxxlibrarylist
<blahrus> schweeb: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=38630
<blahrus> schweeb: that the fix?
<schweeb> checking
<schweeb> sounds about right
<schweeb> no guarantees
<Amaranth> ajmitch: you and herve finally decided on a team leader for MOTUPython?
<blahrus> heheh go fig ;)
<schweeb> I'm in windows right now :(
<ajmitch> Amaranth: not really, I just wrote my name down ;)
<ajmitch> he can take it if he wants
<ajmitch> Amaranth: and feel free to join
<schweeb> actually, I can't even really be useful tonight, until my Solaris downloads complete
<schweeb> boo
<Amaranth> ajmitch: Not MOTU, can't get my key signed. :/
<blahrus> schweeb: what are you doing with Solaris?
<schweeb> blahrus: for work
<blahrus> schweeb: what do you do?
<schweeb> I work for one of the big auto companies...
<blahrus> cool
<schweeb> about 50% SOlaris
<blahrus> wow
<schweeb> lots of AIX
<blahrus> kinda wierd . . . .
<schweeb> a little linux
<schweeb> a little windows
<crimsun> yeah, lots of aix ;)
<blahrus> AIX i understand
<blahrus> but little windows that a plus
<schweeb> meh
<schweeb> Windows is a PITA
<ajmitch> Amaranth: you don't need to be MOTU to be part of a team, just to lead
<blahrus> what apps do they run on Solaris
<ajmitch> Amaranth: do you live far away from anyone who can sign your key?
<blahrus> yes it is, only reason I run it at home (windows 2000) just to play a few games I just don't wanna mess with wine or cedga
<schweeb> directory server, sybase, websphere (I think, or that may only be the AIX systems)
<schweeb> PVCS
<ajmitch> schweeb: you're a tape boy, right? ;)
<blahrus> hah
<schweeb> ajmitch: h4n
<schweeb> ajmitch: I haven't even touched a tape in 3 wks
<Amaranth> ajmitch: 100mi or so
<ajmitch> schweeb: whiprush & tseng have corrupted me
<schweeb> ajmitch: tseng is my bish
<schweeb> and whiprush /is/ a bish
<crimsun> Amaranth: where are you located?
<ajmitch> Amaranth: that's a shame, I live way down in southern NZ & got my key signed :)
<blahrus> 280 upgraded . . .. here goes nothing.
<Amaranth> sioux city, iowa
<Amaranth> usa
<schweeb> I'm in MI
<ajmitch> in this tiny little town there's 4-5 DDs, and a bunch of others in the strong set
<schweeb> (which is obvious, working for an auto company)
<blahrus> I am in IL
<crimsun> Amaranth: I'm about 269 mi from you
<schweeb> although, I'm already close to the strong set
<blahrus> not that I apart of MOTU
<Amaranth> crimsun: lincoln, ne?
<schweeb> thanks to mako
<schweeb> <3
<crimsun> Amaranth: rochester, mn
<Amaranth> heh
<schweeb> I have no idea what to do w/ cxxlibrarylist :P
<ajmitch> schweeb: find a package, fix it
<schweeb> most of them look claimed
<ajmitch> tips are on BreezyToolchainTransition
<ajmitch> schweeb: plenty aren't
<schweeb> I also know no C++, so these better be easy :P
<Amaranth> some are just a package name change
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> mostly it's packaging changes
<Amaranth> others are small fixes to make them compile on g++4
<ajmitch> rather than deep c++ magic
<blahrus> thats great Mark Shuttleworth on on wikipedia
<blahrus> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Shuttleworth
<Amaranth> i think some required l33t C++ skills
<Amaranth> blahrus: been on wikipedia since before ubuntu existed
<Amaranth> btw, i'm on wikipedia ;)
<ajmitch> amazing :)
<schweeb> yea, so why do they need a name change.. just curious
<blahrus> Amaranth: where is your link
* ajmitch suddenly becomes an Amaranth fanboi ;)
<Amaranth> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travis_Watkins
<Amaranth> someone else created it, i added the birthday and blog link
<ajmitch> ah that's right, you're infamous for pymusique
<blahrus> Amaranth: leet ;)
<Amaranth> ajmitch: i try :)
<Amaranth> my avatar on ubuntuforums is the pymusique logo
<Amaranth> no one notices
<blahrus> anyone know how much BW ubuntu uses on an avg day?
<schweeb> blahrus: hard to tell, considering there are unofficial mirrors all over, and torrents
<blahrus> yea, I was wondering more about the update mirror and stuff . . . .
<schweeb> ah
* Unfrgiven back from lunch
<blahrus> just wondering I do a lot of colo . . . so just the questions I ask :0
<Unfrgiven> hi everybody
<ajmitch> wb Unfrgiven
<Unfrgiven> Amaranth: dude... you have your own wikipedia page... respect!
<blahrus> dont boost his ego . . .
<schweeb> yea, speaking of colo, I'm considering a new one myself
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: why not? i like to give credit where its due :)
<schweeb> gotta start looking for 1U's soon
<blahrus> oh yea? I know I am just giving him a hard dtime
<blahrus> PM coming :)
<Amaranth> blahrus: It can't boost anymore. ;) I still get hatemail from apple fanboys from time to time.
<blahrus> really . . . oh gosh
<blahrus> apple ever contact you about it?
<Amaranth> nope
<blahrus> I guess they don't care they are still making money
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: the stuff on UniversexxTransition. the ones that FTBFS, do we need to write the patches? im happy to submit patches. im fluent in C++
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: the ones on the universeCxxTransition should all have patches, afaik
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: even the ones without the patch tag?
<ajmitch> I haven't looked..
<ajmitch> take a look at the debian bug for them
<Unfrgiven> yeah ive got one open atm. that one doesnt have a patch on the debian bug.
<ajmitch> which one?
<ajmitch> it won't get built until cxxapps aren't blacklisted on the buildds any longer
<Unfrgiven> aleph
<ajmitch> you can fix it & submit the patch to debian
<Unfrgiven> excellent... ill do that then
<ajmitch> by the time we can build apps, etch might be open :)
<ajmitch> and you might just be able to sync from debian
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: also with regards to me submitting my libflash changes to debian. how should i do that? cuz i packaged a new upstream release
<Unfrgiven> and transitioned to gcc4 as well in one hit
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: send an URL as a wishlist bug to the libflash maintainer
<ajmitch> be polite ;)
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: whats with the debian elitist attitude?
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: because we DDs are so much better than everyone else you know ;)
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: im just trying to help after all :)
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> some maintainers might be a little touchy
<ajmitch> you get that with any large group of geeks
<ajmitch> ubuntu has stayed surprisingly free of those attitudes
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: so i need to create a new bug against debian as a wishlist bug? or just send an email to the maintainer with a link with the url of my source packages?
<ajmitch> it has made it a lot more fun to work on ubuntu
<ajmitch> new wishlist bug, it makes it easier to keep track of
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: thats what i love most about ubuntu... the friendly community! i never thought i'd move away from debian... but ubuntu is worth it!
<ajmitch> yeah, I never intended to swicth away from debian, but I finally did..
<ajmitch> although I still work on debian
<ajmitch> and I should really do more work there :)
<blahrus> ajmitch: what do you do for debian
<ajmitch> blahrus: I just maintain a few packages
<crimsun> heh, I replaced a seven year-old sid system with hoary before I moved up here
<blahrus> crimsun: where do you live?
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: ive wanted to be a debian developer for so long... it was always so hard to get my foot through the door.
<blahrus> ajmitch: thats cool
<crimsun> blahrus: rochester, mn
<blahrus> wow lots of mid-west people here
<Unfrgiven> ive managed to get involved with ubuntu quite easily... UD's (ubuntu devs) rock!
<ajmitch> yeah, so I became a DD just after I got involved with ubuntu :)
<blahrus> Unfrgiven: do you know a lot of C?
<crimsun> I'm actually from the east coast, but I'm up here with the blue for the summer
<ajmitch> I was in the NM queue for awhile
<ajmitch> this team-based approach seems to be quite a lot more productive for what we need
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: yeah a reasonable amount. im a c++ dev by profession. ive done quite a bit of C work too.
<crimsun> it certainly encourages cooperation more
<blahrus> Unfrgiven: yea I guess thats been my only fallback about being a linux guy, is I don't know much programing
<crimsun> bah, you don't have to know any programming to be a linux guy
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: but you don't have to be a programmer to contribute. i used to think like you as well until recently. but now ive realised that there is so much more
<Unfrgiven> packaging for instance != programming
<blahrus> well I know that, but i just don't feel like I can give back as much
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: how about docs/qa/testing/packaging?
<Unfrgiven> there is still heaps that you can do
<Unfrgiven> and i promise that you'll probably leanr some programming along the way :)
<blahrus> I have done a bit of packaging in fedora but not ubuntu
<blahrus> updating my breezy box now, not looking forward to X being borken
<Unfrgiven> i thought that X probs were fixed now?
<blahrus> I guess I am about to find out :)
<Unfrgiven> i must admit that i havent updated breezy in like 4 weeks now :)
<blahrus> mirrors must be bogged down, only getting about 44k
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: I've done selective upgrades :)
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: same :)
<ajmitch> blahrus: that's more than I can ever get :)
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: but in my case selective = approx. 5 packages :)
<blahrus> ajmitch: really, I have gotten 300k plus
<ajmitch> blahrus: I only have 256Kbps DSL
<blahrus> ajmitch: ahhh
<schweeb> ajmitch: you have metered too, like the aussies?
<ajmitch> schweeb: thankfully not on this plan
<schweeb> that would be horrible
<ajmitch> but if I went to 2Mbps, I'd have a 10GB data limit
<schweeb> weak
<ajmitch> 64Kbps after that :)
<schweeb> I've downloaded that in a week, easily before
<blahrus> I think I have 4mbps and around 40kbps up
<ajmitch> NZ is even worse than australia for broadband
<Unfrgiven> australian broadband is improving though... im on unlimited 512 atm
<ajmitch> NZ is slowly improving, not keeping up with the rest of the world very well
<Unfrgiven> but 6-8MBPS is now avaialble... with upto 40 GIG limits
<Unfrgiven> and some aussie isps now have ADSL2+ which is upto 24MBPS
<Unfrgiven> now that is SWEET
<ajmitch> 40GB is still easy to get through in a month
<ajmitch> we might get ADSL2+ in a couple of years :)
<ajmitch> they say later this year.. but I doubt that'll be useful for most
<Unfrgiven> i really wish i had a faster connection... but its so much worse for you so i shouldnt complain
<Unfrgiven> my in-laws in NZ have the 2MBit link... i love using the net there :)
<Unfrgiven> its almost worth not updating breezy till i go there because then its done VERY quickly :)
<schweeb> I'm stuck on 384kbit right now
<ajmitch> heh :)
<schweeb> sucks
<schweeb> I'm maxing it out as we speak
<schweeb> w/ 2G of ISOs
* ajmitch was on 128Kbps until february or so :)
<schweeb> yea
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: ouch!
<Unfrgiven> schweeb: ouch! :)
<blahrus> in my town, I can get cable line, 6mbps down and 512kbps up for 79 a month
<schweeb> I had 256kbit until they upgraded their plans
<schweeb> blahrus: yea, can pretty much get that here
<schweeb> with Comcast
<Unfrgiven> i've just started using apt-proxy... its a godsend... especially since i run multiple chroot environments on multiple machines
<schweeb> but I have Charter
<blahrus> schweeb: yea we have insightbb
<blahrus> I like have a smaller provider :)
<blahrus> having*
<Unfrgiven> how much does breezy change on a daily basis? ive considered mirror it at home as a nightly job....
<Unfrgiven> *mirroring
<Unfrgiven> that way my updates would be speedy
<blahrus> depends on the take and what got updated
<ajmitch> just do apt-get -dy dist-upgrade from cron each night
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: doesnt work like that for apt-proxy
<ajmitch> sure it does
<ajmitch> I've used apt-proxy for quite awhile
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: apt-proxy downloads only what you request... i want to cover all the packages accross my multiple envs...
<ajmitch> oh alright.. :)
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: :)
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: howd u get a gnu.org email address?
<ajmitch> use apt-move & apt-move mirror...
<ajmitch> for doing some gnu stuff
<ajmitch> awhile back
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: oooh... i havent heard of apt-mirror. ill go investigate it
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: im still waiting for my ubuntu email address. elmo said the member addresses werent setup yet
<ajmitch> yeah, I want one of them..
<ajmitch> I got the tshirt, now I want the email :)
<schweeb> heh
<schweeb> I got a tshirt too
* |QuaD-_ wants an ubuntu email address :)
<|QuaD-_> (
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: ditto :)
<schweeb> yea, whenever t hey get the email addresses, put me right onthe list
<|QuaD-_> schweeb: i dunno bout you, but i am not a member, so i can't get one
<Unfrgiven> do members get shell accounts?
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: probably not
<schweeb> |QuaD-_: I am
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: MOTUs?
<|QuaD-_> schweeb: ohh
<ajmitch> elmo is trying to set it up so that only email accounts are given
<ajmitch> probably not, again..
<ajmitch> we're not special enough ;)
<schweeb> it shouldn't be too tough for him to do
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: bummer. oh and does being a MOTU mean you can upload for universe?
<|QuaD-_> ajmitch: at least you get email addresses :)
<schweeb> just use mysql or pgsq or ldap
<schweeb> Unfrgiven: yep
<schweeb> that's the whole point
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: that is preceisely what a MOTU is
<ajmitch> we can do that, and not much else
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: oh... i though MOTUs can review and sign packages and the uploading was the next level up
<schweeb> |QuaD-_: it's not _too_ tough to become a member, just put in time, make yourself useful, and make yourself known
<ajmitch> no, MOTUs review, sign, and upload
<ajmitch> it's why our reviews matter :)
<Unfrgiven> im wanting to become a motu, working towards it :)
<ajmitch> the reviewing policy is something the MOTUs decided on ourselves
<schweeb> they sign it because of the upload process
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: its quite a good policy
<schweeb> the buildd only accepts valid MOTU/maintainer keys
<Unfrgiven> schweeb: yeah. hence my interest :)
<schweeb> heh
<ajmitch> we don't have our keys in the main keyring, only the universe keyring for uploads
<ajmitch> so we can't accidentally break main
<schweeb> right
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: yeah and thats fair enough.
<ajmitch> well, tseng, ogra & dholbach can all upload to main now
<Unfrgiven> is it fair to say that most of the main devs are canonical employees?
<ajmitch> yes, most are, not all
<schweeb> I'd say maybe half
<ajmitch> I don't know who's on the list of main uploaders
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: yeah i heard about ogra, tseng and daniel.... good for them. they deserve all the credit they get for their awesome efforts
<crimsun> that's it
<Unfrgiven> all three are very hard working and friendly guys
<crimsun> the rest of us are limited to unlimited
<crimsun> universe
<crimsun> brain freeze
<Unfrgiven> crimsun: wll put :)
* ajmitch is a mere MOTU, not an uploader to main yet
<schweeb> tseng's a slacker!
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: main requires a lot more time investment as well though. perhaps not everyone can put that sort of time in
<ajmitch> I know that
<ajmitch> but I just got some more free time :)
<crimsun> I should have a bit this weekend to work on cxxtrans
* ajmitch has a full week or so of no work
<schweeb> ajmitch: nice
<crimsun> great :)
<ajmitch> time to hit c++ like a ton of bricks
* blahrus has downloaded all updates . . . here goes nothing
<schweeb> I've gotta fix my workstation at work, install NX on it
<JDahl> I'd bet even taking case of universe takes up alot of time... I was thought of getting more involved, but cant see where I'd get the extra time from
<schweeb> so I can "work from home"
<schweeb> JDahl: there's no minimum time requirement or anything
<crimsun> I could vpn in, but I live 5 minutes from work, so it's kinda pointless
<schweeb> you work in .edu though
<schweeb> much more laid back environment
<schweeb> :p
<ajmitch> JDahl: just give the time you have
<blahrus> NX is great
<crimsun> schweeb: ibm, actually.
<ajmitch> NX is a great concept, the code is a steaming pile, apparantly :)
<schweeb> crimsun: oh, I thought you worked for a .edu
<blahrus> ajmitch: yea?
<crimsun> schweeb: I did/do, but I'm up here now ;)
<schweeb> crimsun: what you doing there
<ajmitch> blahrus: a bit tangled
<blahrus> ajmitch: all i know is it worked on dial when I was still there
<blahrus> thought it was sweet
<Unfrgiven> i have remote access to work. its great :) only problem is that we use Novell for vpn and there is no free client :( the company doesn't buy the linux client! so i have to use a windows box to access work remotely
<crimsun> schweeb: power5 inav stuff
<schweeb> crimsun: nice
<schweeb> we have a lot of power5's
<schweeb> and power4's
<blahrus> Unfrgiven: wine wont run it?
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: to be honest, i havent tried. but i doubt it very much since it installs a driver
<blahrus> ahhhh
<blahrus> then I doubt it also :(
<JDahl> schweeb, I work for .edu - but as a young guy trying to make it that's hardly a "laid back environment" :P Maybe in 5-10 years it will be
<Unfrgiven> im shocked that there isnt a free novell client
<schweeb> JDahl: how old are you?
<JDahl> schweeb, 31
<schweeb> eh, you're old
<crimsun> bah, that's not old
<schweeb> :)
<Unfrgiven> i think ajmitch is the youngest here isnt he?
<crimsun> :p
<schweeb> I'm 21
<Unfrgiven> schweeb: oooh we have a new winner :P
<ajmitch> aha, schweeb's younger :P
* schweeb sips his beer
<JDahl> schweeb, I probably spend 21 years in school
<schweeb> haha
<ajmitch> schweeb: at least I could buy beer at 18 here :)
<schweeb> I just put school on hold for a while
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: gotta luv NZ & Aus eh :)
<schweeb> got a great offer to work at my current job
<blahrus> 21 here also
<Unfrgiven> schweeb: what do you do? who for?
* ajmitch is 23 in a week or so.. sometimes that feels old ;)
<blahrus> ajmitch: don't rub it in!
<schweeb> Unfrgiven: backup administration for EDS/Chrysler
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: im turning 24 in 4 months... im feeling old!
<blahrus> schweeb: what are you drinking
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: schweeb is a tape boy ;)
<schweeb> Bell's Oberon
<schweeb> brewed in Kalamazoo, MI... awesome stuff
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: LOL!
<schweeb> Unfrgiven: he lies.
<blahrus> schweeb: looks really good
<blahrus> already at their site
<blahrus> hum . ..  beeer
<schweeb> Unfrgiven: I also most likely make way more money than he :p
<ajmitch> schweeb: of course you do
<ajmitch> schweeb: I'm still at uni
<blahrus> schweeb: can't order off their site?
<ajmitch> st least for another couple of weeks
<schweeb> blahrus: probably not
<schweeb> blahrus: you'd have to go to a specialty beer store to get it there
<schweeb> and it's not exactly cheap here
* ajmitch wonders if Unfrgiven drinks 4X or fosters ;)
<schweeb> foster's? eww
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: neither... i cant stand beer. im a whiskey man!
<ajmitch> aha
<schweeb> blahrus: I suggest purchasing some... best beer I've ever hda
<schweeb> *had
<ajmitch> schweeb: he's australian, no accounting for lack of taste..
<Unfrgiven> fosters sux anyway. we export it because we can't stand it. :)
<schweeb> ajmitch: lol
<blahrus> schweeb: yea It sucks being a beer snob already at 21, I think I have paid more beer than most people have in their life
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: yeah I know
<JDahl> cant stand beer? I don't recall I ever met a person that can't stand beer
<schweeb> blahrus: meh, I'll still drink Busch or Milwaukee's best if that's all there is
<schweeb> JDahl: most girls
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: I've heard that not even uni students would drink it
<blahrus> schweeb: I can't
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: now now lets not start an aus vs nz war here ;)
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: very true :) what degree do you do?
<blahrus> schweeb: some times I would like too
<ajmitch> CS, grad diploma in telecommunications
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: kewl. and you finish in a couple of weeks?
* ajmitch wouldn't mind a guiness sometime soon.. ;)
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: yep
<blahrus> guiness
<blahrus> ohhhh guiness
<ajmitch> maybe I should come back over to sydney & visit
<blahrus> gosh how I love it
<schweeb> lol
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: so what you doing after you are done? you already have a job dont u?
<schweeb> I have guinness in the fridge as well
<ajmitch> yeah, a job for a few months doing php coding
<blahrus> schweeb: STOP!
<schweeb> and Bell's Pale Ale
<schweeb> :)
<Unfrgiven> schweeb: for the record,im not a female :P but i still hate beer
<schweeb> lots of my newly earned funds go towards beer and food
<blahrus> don't force me to drink the mgd that my grandpa left in the fridge
<schweeb> eww
<schweeb> bottom of the barrel
<blahrus> yea I KNOW!
<schweeb> go to the store man!
<schweeb> it's only midnight
<schweeb> maybe 11 there
<schweeb> there's gotta be a meijer's or something
<blahrus> he did leave some reallly good vodka
<schweeb> what type?
<blahrus> there is but then I would have to leave
<blahrus> starts with an S
<schweeb> Stoli?
<blahrus> smoothest I have ever had
<blahrus> let me check
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: are you an aspiring motu as well?
<Amaranth> drinks like one ;)
<blahrus> might have to get glass while I am down there ;)
<ajmitch> he will be
<ajmitch> because to be a MOTU is the greatest honour
<blahrus> doesn't get much better
<ajmitch> blahrus: we'll find something for you to do that you like :)
<blahrus> brb
<Unfrgiven> BTW "motu" in Hindi (Indian Language) means fatty!
<schweeb> Unfrgiven: all MOTUs are alcoholics :p
<blahrus> hahah fatty
<ajmitch> we are not!
* Amaranth is not old enough to drink
<ajmitch> schweeb: we enjoy a quiet beer at times :)
<blahrus> I have a friend that works with an Indian, and he named his sun Nigar . . . .
<ajmitch> Amaranth: sure you are..
<Unfrgiven> Amaranth: dude! how young are you?
<Amaranth> 18
<blahrus> he said he thoght about changing it now that he know what it means in the US
<Unfrgiven> Amaranth: thats old enough where i live!
<ajmitch> Amaranth: 18 is more than old enough to drink
<schweeb> ajmitch: lies
<Unfrgiven> schweeb: its true
<schweeb> hah
<ajmitch> maybe not for you backwards people in the US ;)
<schweeb> tim hull is back at suggesting stuff for breezy
<schweeb> nice.
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: hahaha
<JDahl> I love Belgian beer, but that's pretty hard to get in the US - and expensive
<schweeb> how absolutely annoying
<blahrus> I have been drinking a lot of bluemoon and shlafly and of corse the guiness
<schweeb> JDahl: blue moon or what
<blahrus> BLUE MOON!
<Unfrgiven> schweeb: who's tim hull? the medicine mask guy?
<schweeb> no
<schweeb> well, maybe
<blahrus> brb I need to check that vodka
<schweeb> look at the mailing list
<Amaranth> HostingGeek?
<ajmitch> hah that medicine mask is great ;)
<JDahl> schweeb, mostly I like the Trapiste Ale (Chimay, Westmalle, etc)
<ajmitch> schweeb: devel, users, or sounder?
<Amaranth> is sounder low-traffic enough to leave it for 2 days and not be swamped with email?
<schweeb> ajmitch: devel
<schweeb> ajmitch: thully on irc... thull@umich.edu
<ajmitch> only mail I see from him is may 8th
<schweeb> basically, he seems to want Ubuntu to be OOB exactly how HE configures his system
<schweeb> no matter how odd the config setting
<schweeb> ajmitch: I have some historical ones on my other server
<schweeb> nothing much good recently
<blahrus> schweeb: seagam's
<blahrus> or something like that
<schweeb> ajmitch: but, basically, it's one of those threads where mdz immediately smacked it down
<ajmitch> sounds fun
<blahrus> mdz hehe
<Unfrgiven> schweeb: mdz is too nice though
<ajmitch> looks like it's time to smack down a flatmate for bandwidth abuse...
<ajmitch> I can't get my breezy crack!
<blahrus> Errors were encountered while processing:
<schweeb> Unfrgiven: he gets down to business when he has to
<blahrus> doesn't sound good
<ajmitch> blahrus: expected :)
<blahrus> should I reboot?
<blahrus> see what happens
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: you know how i kept asking at UDU if we've met before? i remembered that you look very similar to a kiwi that i worked with, Simon Gralick. the resemblance is uncanny!
<schweeb> Unfrgiven: especially on debian-legal type threads
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: scary
<Unfrgiven> schweeb: ah right... must check those out some time
<blahrus> brb
<blahrus> going to restart X
<ajmitch> hmm, I'm at 99% of downloads, and it starts timing out
<ajmitch> how annoying
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: indeed
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: how does one check if a package cleans up after itself properly?
<ajmitch> in what way?
<Amaranth> would it be bad if my smeg package ran rm -rf build/ on clean::?
<ajmitch> Amaranth: not at all
<Amaranth> ok, next version will
<Amaranth> next version will be 0.8, but yeah
<ajmitch> argh, xscreensaver-gl just won't get past 2,001,136 bytes :)
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: in terms of files that the ./configure has created
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: and the make
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: hmm, check what goes into the diff..
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: ah ok... thats all then.
<ajmitch> or keep a list of files around.. check to see if building the package twice causes diff to complain about binary file changes
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: sounds easy enough
<ajmitch> it is
<blahrus> having some issues :(
<ajmitch> wb
<ajmitch> X not working?
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: such as?
<blahrus> well I am doing a dist-upgrade
<Amaranth> dirty
<blahrus> x failed to start
<blahrus> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=38630&page=2&pp=10
<blahrus> didn't work
* Amaranth can't remember the symlink tricks to make that work
<ajmitch> probbaly reconfigure your xorg.conf
<ajmitch> since the font paths changed
<blahrus> ehhh how easy is that?
<ajmitch> dunno what else might have changed :)
<blahrus> xorg 6.8.2-21 is installing now
* ajmitch is trying to upgrade a bunch of packages now
<blahrus> ajmitch: good luck :)
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: i had the font paths issue yesterday
<ajmitch> if it breaks, I get to keep the pieces
<Amaranth> i'm fully upgraded in breezy
<Amaranth> no issues
<blahrus> one thing I have found, is if I update every day I don't have many issues
* blahrus wishes fonts deb's weren't so big
<Unfrgiven> hey Treenaks
<Treenaks> morning
* Treenaks kicks the power company
<blahrus> Treenaks: no power when you got up?
<Treenaks> blahrus: oh there was.. but there hadn't been for some time during the night, apparently
<blahrus> Where do you live?
<Treenaks> Netherlands
<Treenaks> this is the second power break in 3\ years
<blahrus> hum . . . synaptic just got removed . . .  . ..
<Treenaks> \o/
<Treenaks> (did I say that? :))
<blahrus> well it looks like x kinda started
<blahrus> dang I knew this was going to happen.
<Unfrgiven> Treenaks: what does "\o/" mean? ive seen you use it before... and ive tried to work it out but i cant :)
<Treenaks> Unfrgiven: arms raised in the air in celebration (think "Yay!")
<blahrus> not yay! :)
<Unfrgiven> Treenaks: oh right... i would've never worked that out!
<blahrus> alright well it goes to x but it stays black and nothing happens I can't even get another term.
<Unfrgiven> whats in your /var/log/Xorg.log?
<blahrus> can't get to it
* HostingGeek wonders if he still is banned from #ubuntu
<blahrus> system goes to X and then locks up . . . should have known better than this
<blahrus> any suggestions or should I just go to bed for the night
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: reboot  reboot in maintenance mode. and then check the log. disable gdm from starting on boot
<blahrus> maintenace mode?
<Unfrgiven> argh... i cant remember what we call it in ubuntu... u know in the grub menu
<Unfrgiven> select the other option for your kernel
<Unfrgiven> repair mode?
<Unfrgiven> sorry i have a mindblank atm...
<blahrus> ahhh recovery mode
<Unfrgiven> thats the one :)
<Unfrgiven> i kept thinking safe mode but thats windows!
<blahrus> think I put a bit to much vodka in the drink this time
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: im sure ull b ok :P
<blahrus> the font paths are missconfigured
<blahrus> how do I reconfig X in ubuntu?
<Unfrgiven> just manually edit /etc/X11/xorg.conf
<Unfrgiven> make a backup first
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: i went through this process las night
<Unfrgiven> *last
<blahrus> manually . . . . ehhhh
<Unfrgiven> i had to change /usr/lib to /usr/X11R6/lib or vice versa... cant remmeber now
<Unfrgiven> in xorg.conf for font paths
<blahrus> it is set to usr/share/X11
<blahrus> they seem to be there
<Unfrgiven> hmmm... im at work right now on a windows box... so i cant tell you what it should say
<blahrus> well thanks for your help at this time its best if I go to bed, I will talk to you all tomorrow
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: ok np. good night
<blahrus> night all
<\sh> morning
<\sh> ogra: ping
<doko> ajmitch: ping
<ajmitch> doko: yes?
<doko> ajmitch, you did claim a lot of cxxlibs on the wiki page, are you still working on these?
<ajmitch> doko: yes, I've come across quite a few that FTBFS with no patch yet
<ajmitch> and I've just had a very busy couple of weeks
<doko> can you fix them?
<ajmitch> maybe - some occurred due to a compiler upgrade (4.0.0-7ubuntu6 -> -7ubuntu7)
<ajmitch> which I didn't have time to put together into a bug report for you
<doko> I added the new names, where missing. please could you check, if you do use the same?
<ajmitch> ok
<doko> yes, the compiler got stricter, but those are usually fixable in the package
<ajmitch> this package was templates upon templates :)
<doko> ugh
<doko> what about fox and fox1.2?
<ajmitch> ah, firebird2, that requires me to write a patch
<ajmitch> editex had ocaml issues
<ajmitch> freefem needs to be filed in bugzilla
<ajmitch> gfccore, gfcui are big debdiffs
<doko> there are 17 claimed packages. did you start to work on all of them?
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> most are done, I just haven't cleaned up the diffs or uploaded the approved ones
<doko> please could you upload the approved ones?
<ajmitch> some need to be synced from debian again (libcommoncpp2)
<ajmitch> certainly
<ajmitch> apart fro mexams, I just finished at university today
<doko> heh, cool!
<ajmitch> I'm quite happy about that :)
<ajmitch> chmj: around?
<doko> don't get me wrong, I just want to have other apps buildable again ;-)
<ajmitch> doko: I know, I've been wanting to get some time to work on these again :)
<ajmitch> hmm, who broke the upload host?
<doko> ajmitch: which one?
<ajmitch> upload.ubuntu.com, I get connection refused
<doko> ajmitch: yes, looks like it's down
<doko> DanielN: ping
<doko> ajmitch: try again
<ajmitch> uploading..
<ajmitch> thanks
<tseng> doko: hey
<ivoks> hi
<doko> tseng: hi
<ivoks> is there any other graphical sudo besides gksudo?
<tseng> doko: ok. we need someone to be testing ironpython and mono and filing mono bugs for things that dont work
<tseng> doko: that way it can actually get fixed :
<tseng> :)
<doko> tseng: yes ... maybe I need a mono intro first ... are you around in about 1 hour? need to finish some pysvn stuff first.
<tseng> hm no.. we are so badly timed
<tseng> i will be on in a very limited fashion from work in about 2 hours
<ivoks> "I hope you didnt hardcode gksudo but rather $graphical_sudo ?"
<ivoks> doh... :)
<ivoks> hi
<ivoks> I have some great ideas for http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/Firewalls
<ogra> \sh pong
<tseng> hi ogra
<ajmitch> ivoks: yes...?
<Treenaks> ivoks: what's this obsession with firewalls? all ports are closed by default. Programs that open ports are quite obvious about it.
<doko> ajmitch: did you test cln?
<ajmitch> doko: is there a problem with it now?
<doko> yes
<doko> see the build logs
* ajmitch sighs.. it build fine here last time I tried it
<ajmitch> I don't upload diffs that I haven't tested :)
<ogra> hey tseng
* ivoks back
* ajmitch retries here
<ivoks> ajmitch Treenaks firewall would be pice of cake to organize with layer 7 filtering
<tepsipakki> hmm, I need some help with dpatch..
<ivoks> so you don't need to know what app opens which port
<ajmitch> ivoks: sure, just implement layer 7 filtering in a nice user-friendly & non-intrusive manner
<ivoks> ajmitch: it's easy
<ivoks> :)
<tepsipakki> the first time I run debian/rules binary, it complains "01_rename_binary.dpatch: script expects -patch|-unpatch as argument", but the second time it goes fine
<ivoks> i just need a guy who know python :)
<ivoks> maybe herve
<ajmitch> ivoks: I know python fairly well, but you haven't explained how you'd do it
<ajmitch> doko: right, so it sued to build fine, now it doesn't with compiler updates..
<ajmitch> s/sued/used/
<ivoks> ajmitch: ever used http://l7-filter.sourceforge.net/ ?
<ajmitch> can't say I have, is the performance anywhere near adequate?
<ivoks> ajmitch: /usr/local/sbin/iptables -A FORWARD -m iprange -m layer7 --l7proto edonkey --src-range 192.168.0.10-192.168.0.80 -j REJECT
<ivoks> ajmitch: there goes edonkey... without needing to know which ports it uses etc...
<ajmitch> great, now what about ssl? :)
<ivoks> ajmitch: you can't beat that
<ivoks> ajmitch: but then user will want that
<ivoks> ajmitch: you can use ssl tunneling by accident :)
<ivoks> s/can/can\'t/
<ajmitch> depends on the app
<ajmitch> some might do ssl by default, without the users having to intervene
<ivoks> ajmitch: apps come from main/universe... under control
* ajmitch hates targetting a moving compiler 
<ajmitch> ivoks: well if you think l7-filter is useful, try & convince fabbione to include it in the kernel :)
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> ajmitch: iptables userland needs patching then too :)
<ajmitch> that's trivial to achieve compared to convincing fabbione
<ivoks> :)
<ajmitch> now *if* you managed to get all that in, then a pygtk frontend would be trivial to put together :)
<ajmitch> doko: found cln patch on mailing list, rebuilding :)
<\sh> ogra: pingeling .... i have something for you for your special project concerning bugzilla ;)
<ogra> yep, shoot
<\sh> ogra: http://wire.dattitu.de/archives/14-Looking-for-quickest-bugfixer.html
<ogra> \sh, the questions is if we really want to honor th quickest :) i'd rather see the community voting for the best bugfixer.... for one, because they know which bug bugged them most and secondly we get a heap full of people looking at bugs that never looked at them before :)
<ajmitch> sometimes the quickest solution isn't the best :)
<ogra> (you need to look at the bugs first, before you can vote ;) )
* ajmitch is fighting the joys of dpatch
<ivoks> doko: what's with openscenegraph?
<doko> I did add an xclass comment ...
<ivoks> doko: yeah, xclass was builded couple of days ago...
<ivoks> Lathiat: problems? :)
<ivoks> ajmitch: ping
<Lathiat> ivoks: hmm ?
<ajmitch> ivoks: yes?
<ivoks> Lathiat: quit, join
<ivoks> ajmitch: what's FQDN of ravel? :)
<Lathiat> shrug, think my isps transit is b0rking
<ajmitch> huh?
<ivoks> fully qualified domain name
<ivoks> hostname
<ajmitch> but what is ravel?
<ivoks> ?
<ajmitch> that is what you typed? :)
<ivoks> yes
<ivoks> Tollef created username for me on amd64 machine(s)
<ajmitch> so why are you asking me? :)
<ivoks> i guess name of that machine(s) is ravel
<ivoks> or am i wrong? :)
<ajmitch> I have absolutely no idea
<\sh> ogra: well, we should think about "the quickest" as well, cause fixing .desktop files is also important ;-)
<ivoks> \sh: do you have access to ravel?
<ajmitch> ivoks: I believe you may be asking the wrong person about this :)
<ogra> \sh, if the community decides that, then well :) but in any case i want them to decide who gets the bonbon
<ivoks> ajmitch: it seems so, yes :)
* ajmitch is not special enough to have access to amd64
<\sh> ivoks: yes
<ivoks> \sh: and IP of ravel is? :)
<ivoks> \sh: of FQDN
<ivoks> \sh: s/of/or
<\sh> Non-authoritative answer:
<\sh> Name:   ravel.hpc2n.umu.se
<\sh> Address: 130.239.46.12
<ivoks> thanx
<\sh> i'm trying to put 2 patches into a package since this morning...and i don't find the time...
<tepsipakki> ok, why do I get this: dpatch call -a=pkg-info 01_rename_binary
<tepsipakki> 01_rename_binary.dpatch: script expects -patch|-unpatch as argument
<tepsipakki> no one here uses dpatch?-)
<tepsipakki> I just don't understand why "dpatch call" tries to execute the patch
<ajmitch> because that's what 'call' means :)
<ajmitch> each patch is meant to be executable - I got the same thing before
<ajmitch> I don't think you need to do dpatch call
<tepsipakki> this is straight from the manpage/documentation..
<ajmitch> I know
<tepsipakki> hrmh, and I thought it was necessary ;)
<ajmitch> not afaik
<ajmitch> at least it works for me without doing that
<tepsipakki> yeah, seems to be so. damn you, man dpatch
<tseng> man dpatch is cryptic imo
<tseng> or at least less than obvious
<tepsipakki> well, the example at least is.. I find it silly that right after dpatch apply-all should be call-all
<tepsipakki> if call-all is supposed to apply those patches..
* Nafallo says morning all!
<ajmitch> hi
<Nafallo> ajmitch: any meetings today? :-)
<ajmitch> not that I know of..
<Nafallo> k, thanx :-)
<ajmitch> check the meeting calendar
<ajmitch> Amaranth: thanks for enforcing, I only saw that when it was too late :)
<Nafallo> ajmitch: aha, those are not propagated to the ical thingie.
<ajmitch> ok, sleep time, package finally compiled :)
<ivoks> :)
<Amaranth> ajmitch: what happened to smeg?
<Amaranth> i would have figured it would be through by now, it's been almost 12 hours
<ajmitch> Amaranth: any new package has to be manually approved
<ajmitch> so be patient, please
<Amaranth> ah
<ogra> Amaranth, i mean to remember the ETA for NEW packages is 48h
<Amaranth> ok, i can wait
<Amaranth> was just wondering
<dooglus> Amaranth: isn't "smeg" a little unpleasant for a package name?
<Amaranth> dooglus: hehe
<dooglus> Amaranth: it means "genital discharge", if memory serves
<Amaranth> it's also british slang
<dooglus> Amaranth: yes, for the stuff that collects on your 'bits'.
<Amaranth> no, it has another meaning too
<dooglus> what's that then?
<Amaranth> generic swear word
<dooglus> almost all swear words have their originals in sexual matters
<Amaranth> http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=smeg
<dooglus> smeg derives from smegma, "the secretion of a sebaceous gland; specifically : the cheesy sebaceous matter that collects between the glans penis and the foreskin or around the clitoris and labia minora"
<Amaranth> it's from red dwarf
<Amaranth> dooglus: the name is not changing
<dooglus> Amaranth: no way is it from red dwarf.  red dward is from the 80's, but it's been in common usage since at least the 70's to my knowledge
<Amaranth> dooglus: it started out as an acronym, the fact that it's a swear word makes it even better because that's what the fd.o menu spec and implementations of it make me want to do
<Amaranth> dooglus: well, americans were introduced to smeg as a swear word through red dwarf
<dooglus> Amaranth: ok.  in much the same way that austin powers taught you the word "shag"?
<Amaranth> no, i knew that one
<Amaranth> that was 70s lingo in the US too
<dooglus> oh ok
<dooglus> what's it an acronym for?
<Amaranth> smeg?
<dooglus> yeah
<Amaranth> simple menu editor for gnome
<dooglus> oh nice
<Amaranth> it's for gnome, kde, and xfce now, so i dropped the acronym meaning
<dooglus> "for guis"?
<Amaranth> I might change the name before 1.0, but it would take someone coming up with an awesome name.
<Amaranth> nice, that works ;)
<jamessan|work> should change it to smee. simple menu editor extraordinaire  ;)
<Amaranth> smee? why do i know that word?
<jamessan|work> that was the name of a character in Peter Pan
<jamessan|work> iirc
<jamessan|work> yup
<Amaranth> no more acronyms, it'd have to be a made up word that sounded cool and stood out
<tepsipakki> http://www.anxietyculture.com/jokes.htm
<Amaranth> smeg stands out and makes you look ;)
<tepsipakki> theres your "smee" ;)
<Amaranth> lmao
<Amaranth> that's smegging horrible
<Nafallo> sme ;-)
<Nafallo> simple menu editor :-)
<Amaranth> bleh
<Lathiat> for Gnome
<Amaranth> kde-applications.menu is crack, btw
<Amaranth> more than one menu has <Name>Applications</Name>
<Amaranth> i'm not even sure that's supposed to be valid
<mgalvin> hi all
<\sh> going home now :)
<\sh> cu later
<dooglus> what "crack" mean in that context?
<Amaranth> dooglus: crap
<dooglus> Amaranth: thanks.  :)
<siretart> hi
<siretart> I processed with package gpsdrive, it is listed in CXXLibraryList. It does not need renaming or recompilation, because the included libs are not C++
<siretart> how to proceed next?
<ogra> does it depend on any Cxx stuff ?
<\sh> re
<siretart> ogra: the package has some parts built with g++, but the to libs installed in /usr/lib are plain gcc
<siretart> two libs
<ogra> siretart, tag it as application in the most right field and leave it alone until we start to transition the apps
<siretart> ogra: ok. will do
<\sh> need a coffee and a shower :(
<siretart> can the Replaces field hold two packages?
<siretart> I assume yes, but havn't seen it yet
<jdong> can someone import the latest xmess (xmame) from Sid?
<jdong> Ubuntu's a bit behind
<jdong> 0.88 vs 0.96
<siretart> looking
<siretart> jdong: is it a C++ app?
<jdong> siretart: dunno....
<siretart> jdong: c++ apps are restricted, because of the cxx transistion
<jdong> siretart: I don't see any cxx files
<jdong> siretart: all .c
<siretart> hm
<jdong> siretart: I grepped the entire tar archive... no CPP
<siretart> well, rechecking, breezy already has the latest sid version
<jdong> no cpp, cxx, hpp, hxx.....
<siretart> 0.96-1
<jdong> really?
<jdong> yeah
<jdong> nvm
<siretart> http://packages.ubuntu.com/breezy/source/xmame
<jdong> is that a packages.ubuntu.com bug?
<jdong> the summary listing on a search shows 0.88, but the link shows 0.96
<jdong> anyway, I feel stupid... thanks for putting up with me :)
<siretart> you're welcome
<siretart> jdong: packages not touched by us are synced automatically
<siretart> jdong: so manual intervention should only be needed when the new version FTBFS or if we touched the package in the past
<siretart> this can be seen at the 'ubuntu' string in the version number
<\sh> jdong: becoming a motu? :)
<siretart> yeah! :)
<jdong> siretart: thanks for the info; sometimes I see Breezy behind Sid, and I was unsure how that worked ;)s
<|QuaD-> is it possible to fix the ubuntu breezy font problem not allowing gnucash to start without restarting x
<jdong> BTW, not in the near future :)
<mgalvin> silly question, what does FTBFS mean?
<siretart> |QuaD-: if you have a patch which fixes the problem, yes
<jdong> FastTrak is using BFS? ;)
<|QuaD-> siretart: :)
<siretart> jdong: FTBFS = fails to build from source
<mgalvin> thnx
<mgalvin> thnx
<jdong> siretart: that doesn't seem to happen too often, if at all :D
<siretart> s/jdong/mgalvin/
<jdong> Anyone know htf Debian Sid is building Azureus???
<jdong> Are they pulling free java out of their rears?
<jdong> They are calling javac, which leads me to believe Sun Java... Azureus and blackdown doesn't play well
<ogra> jdong, http://hwdb.ubuntu.com/buildlogs/ dont say it doesnt happen often *g*
<jdong> If we can get that in Breezy ;)
<siretart> jdong: http://buildd.debian.org/build.php?arch=&pkg=azureus
<jdong> siretart: nowhere close to being up to date
<siretart> maybe someone did some binary uploads. not an option for ubuntu
<jdong> siretart: nothing on x86
<jdong> siretart: maybe; it is under contrib
<jdong> Anyone know why Bittorrent 4.x.x is taking so long to get into sid?
<siretart> jdong: because debian demands binary uploads along with source.
<jdong> siretart: thanks for the clarification
<siretart> jdong: package name?
<jdong> siretart:bittorrent :)
<Amaranth> bittorrent 4 is getting into sid?
<Amaranth> that'll make my patches against it easier, i don't have to deal with packaging
<jdong> Amaranth: no; I was wondering what's taking so long
<jdong> The 3 patches don't like 4 at all
<siretart> jdong: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=298814
<jdong> oh come on, you gotta be kidding.....
<jdong> lol
<jdong> are you guys as anal about non-free licensing???
<jdong> I suppose that's similar to why bittornado rev 12 isn't in Sid???
<siretart> jdong: well, debian has free software guidlines and a social contract
<siretart> jdong: check the debian bts
<jdong> the only other thing on my wishlist was Webmin....
<jdong> the Debian maintainers told me they are "stabilizing" it for Sarge
<jdong> I suppose that means aging.....
<\sh> Amaranth: what patches?
<jaldhar> jdong: its done.  the latest version (1.210) will be going into sid today
<jdong> jaldhar: yay!
<jdong> Breezy import?
<jdong> lol
<jdong> on the edge of my seat here.....
<Amaranth> \sh: was adding things like a notification tray icon (minimize to tray), removing the 3 torrents at a time limit, and making the window not autoresize to fit torrents so it doesn't grow off the screen
<\sh> Amaranth: u mean in the python code..
<jdong> god xmame takes centuries to compile... it's not done yet....
<Amaranth> \sh: yes
<jdong> I anticipate the fun upload.....
<\sh> Amaranth: r u interessted to build a good gui for the python bittorrent client?
<\sh> Amaranth: I'm coding on a kde frontend ;)
<jdong> LOL
<jdong> GTK
<jdong> lol
<Amaranth> \sh: i don't do KDE, sorry
<jdong> how about a decent g3torrent port?
<siretart> jdong: well, go for it! :)
<\sh> i have my ultimate project
<jdong> siretart: I gave a good three hours of effort
<jdong> siretart: it runs, it debianizes (roughly)....
<jdong> siretart: it also crashes and freezes, free of charge
<\sh> http://www.nexuiz.com/
<jdong> well I'm off again
<jdong> :)
<siretart> \sh: friends of mine talked about that earlier. do you intend to package it?
<\sh> siretart: yes
<\sh> siretart: just for the fun of it...
<siretart> \sh: w00t! :)
<\sh> siretart: but psht will be a surprise ;)
<\sh> siretart: btw...njam has good news
<siretart> ja?
<\sh> running archs: i386, amd64 (hoary and breezy)
<siretart> cool
<\sh> it's on newpackages :)
<\sh> u can review :)
<\sh> so we can upload it to breezy
<\sh> and jdong can backport it ;)
<spacey> nexuiz package?
<spacey> can i get it somewhere?
<\sh> spacey: it's not there...but hopefully soon
<spacey> \sh, k :)
* spacey already downloaded it from nexiuz site, but package is much better ofcourse:)
<\sh> spacey: i want to try that
<spacey> \sh, it doesn't work here out of the box ;/
<spacey> ah well,
<\sh> spacey: lets see :)
<\sh> spacey: i don't know what it is anyway..saw only the screenshots and liked it
<\sh> spacey: but u r invited to help :)
<spacey> hey
<spacey> ok
<spacey> i'll look into it tomorrow
<spacey> bbl
<spacey> i am the sisster spacey
<spacey> hy is to the centrum
<\sh> grmpf
<\sh> looks like i have to remove gnuradio 0.9 and put gnuradio 2.5 in
<DanielN> hi
<\sh> evening DanielN
<DanielN> moin \sh :)
* Nafallo < phone
* Nafallo > here
<\sh> argl
<\sh> /usr/include/boost/config/compiler/gcc.hpp:92:7: warning: #warning "Unknown compiler version - please run the configure tests and report the results"
<\sh> ok...lets patch it
<\sh> it's just like a puzzle today
<herve> weekend, my love!
<herve> :-)
<\sh> *looksaround* my love?
<herve> I'm in love with the weekend itself ;-)
<\sh> and I'm puzzeling :)
<\sh> new version of gnuradio
<\sh> libboost is not recognizing gcc4
<\sh> so, patch first boost then new upload , w8ing etc.
* Nafallo < movie(s), bbl.
* Nafallo is away: movie(s), bbl
<herve> C++ application packags are still frozen?
<\sh> yepp
<herve> did you know that: gtweakui.sourceforge.net/
<\sh> no I'm not a gnome guy ;)
<ogra> herve, yep, thats well known, its also on gnomefiles.org
<DanielN> \sh: you forgot one task - whats about when? ;)
<\sh> DanielN: just now
<DanielN> \sh: just take it easy ;)
<\sh> grmpf..my exwife..she's nerving again
<\sh> DanielN: when is arch all?
<DanielN> yep
<\sh> then put a -i behind the debhelper scripts
<\sh> and unpatch is reverting applied patch, so patch -p1 -R < <patchfile>
<DanielN> oke
<DanielN> \sh: debhelper scripts: each dh_* ?
<\sh> yeah..check man debhelper
<DanielN> ah
<DanielN> so i have to put -i behind _each_ dh_* part in debian/rules ?
<\sh> yep
<DanielN> \sh: ok thanks ..
<DanielN> \sh: that's all to be fixed?
<\sh> jups
<\sh> i think so
<DanielN> updating breezy chroot :)
<\sh> find 2 other motus now ;)
<DanielN> \sh: fixed (hopefully) ..
<\sh> check page ;)
<DanielN> \sh: you know a review friendly MOTU ?
<DanielN> \sh: which page?
<DanielN> ahh
<DanielN> thanks \sh ! :)
<DanielN> ping siretart
<DanielN> herve: ping
<DanielN> hihi .. i'm nerving i think ;>
<\sh> noe
* Nafallo is back (gone 01:58:41)
<\sh> ok boost should be fixed to recognize gcc4 as a compiler
<\sh> doko: ping
<DanielN> \sh: how do you worked it out? (had same error msg by another pkg)
<\sh> DanielN: I read the mailinglist :)
<\sh> check the changelog :) it should be on the servers now
<\sh> DanielN: the workaround is config/compiler/gcc.hpp to recognize gcc4 as working compiler
<\sh> DanielN: it should work now
<DanielN> ok
<DanielN> thx
<DanielN> some other MOTUs online? ;)
<\sh> DanielN: but let me check it out first with the new version of gnuradio
<DanielN> do what you have to do ;)
<tseng> i wonder if ill be able to upload mono tonight
<tseng> (main upload)
<\sh> woot?
<\sh> rocking :)
<\sh> and i hope that i can do my first sourceupload :)
<\sh> hey chris`wikiwork
<chris`wikiwork> ;)
<chris`wikiwork> \sh, du bist auf ubuntuusers.de garnicht so aktiv, oder?
<\sh> chris`wikiwork: ich mag keine foren ;)
<\sh> chris`wikiwork: und ich hab schon genug zu tun ;)
<chris`wikiwork> ;)
<chris`wikiwork> jo, du bist ja auch der Master des UNiversums *lach*
<\sh> oops
<\sh> english ;)
<chris`wikiwork> ;)
<chris`wikiwork> #ubuntu-de..
<\sh> sry guys ;)
<mgalvin> the nvidia cg toolkit installs examples and docs into /usr/local/Cg, the docs are just txt files which i guess should just be moved into /usr/share/doc/...
<mgalvin> is there a special place where examples usually go
<mgalvin> ?
<mgalvin> the ex's are sample code
<\sh>  /usr/share/doc/<packagename>/examples/
<mgalvin> thats a good place for them ;)
<mgalvin> thnx
<|QuaD-> any motus bored and want to package a game ?
<|QuaD-> http://www.ultimatestunts.nl/
<tseng> are you bored and want to package a game?
<tseng> its easier for someone to review your package than to create one.
* |QuaD- doesn't know how
<alake> If nobody grabs it by later tonight I could take it.
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, i'm looking at it now
<mgalvin> hi, alake
<metallikop> hey mgalvin
<mgalvin> alake, did you get my email?
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: can you walk me through how to do it? so i can learn?
<metallikop> |QuaD-: do a google for ubuntu new maintainers guide
<metallikop> mgalvin: which one?
<tseng> debian?
<|QuaD-> metallikop: ok :)
<metallikop> yeah the debian maintainer guide :)
<metallikop> close enough
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, and take a look at http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: ok
<metallikop> I should be working on a new guide tonight with Jorge Castro for Ubuntu.
<mgalvin> metallikop, about appliworks
<metallikop> oh, yeah I got your email.  I'll package that up for you tonight
<metallikop> Unless you just want my packages.
<|QuaD-> i am going to try to package this :)
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, After reading that guide, within a few short hours I was creating packages :)
<metallikop> |QuaD-: feel free to let me know if you have any problems.
<|QuaD-> thanks guys :)
<mgalvin> metallikop, so you already have a package built for it?
<metallikop> yeah, just need to do an upgrade to your latest version (which I like quite a lot by the way)
<mgalvin> ok, i was going to package it, but since you alreay did, roll with it, I am just looking for a few to call my own, i don't want to take yours away from you
<metallikop> hehe, no worries
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: i am reading this guide... so far seems not too bad
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, yup :) its pretty much driven by a makefile calling some helper apps (generally speaking)
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: haha, well, make isn't working right now, i can't compile it (something with the source, going to try an older version)
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, your best bet for learning is to find a package that actually works :)
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: any suggestions of an easy one?
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, i just finished libcwd, which I know works
<mgalvin> try that one for practice
* Nafallo is away: movie(s), bbl
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: do you have a link
<|QuaD-> nnm found it
<mgalvin> http://libcwd.sourceforge.net/
<|QuaD-> yeah :)
<mgalvin> my version is at: http://www.simplifiedcomplexity.com/ubuntu/packages/hoary/i386/libcwd/
<|QuaD-> ok... hopefully i will know how to check it once i make it
<|QuaD-> do i have to do a make install to make sure it installs? or is configure and make enoguh?
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, to try it out first ./configure --prefix=/opt;make;make install
<mgalvin> you don't want it in you "real" system for now
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: then just remove /opt/whatever after i am done?
<|QuaD-> "configure: error: Versions of CC and CXX do not match" gak!
<mgalvin> |Quad-, when makeing the package, it gets built into a fakeroot by dpkg-buildpacke
<|QuaD-> is this a c++ file?
<mgalvin> yea, are you on breezy
<|QuaD-> :) yup
<mgalvin> :)
<|QuaD-> maybe i should try a different package?
<mgalvin> try something else :)
<mgalvin> yea
<\sh> ahhh...
<|QuaD-> any OTHER suggestions?
<\sh> gnome-chemistry-utils fix
<mgalvin> um, gnome clipboard daemon
<|QuaD-> is that def packageable?
<mgalvin> http://www.simplifiedcomplexity.com/ubuntu/packages/hoary/i386/gnome-clipboard-daemon/gnome-clipboard-daemon_1.0.orig.tar.gz
<|QuaD-> is that the source or your package
<mgalvin> thats the original source i downloaded from upstream, you can get it here: http://members.chello.nl/~h.lai/gnome-clipboard-daemon/
<mgalvin> too
<|QuaD-> i will try packaging that
<mgalvin> that one is actually probably best b/c its just a Makefile like how the guides first example is
<mgalvin> not ./configure for this one
<|QuaD-> so do i still do a make install?
<mgalvin> the guide will explain everything :)
<mgalvin> yes, that stuff is driven by the rules files
<blahrus> any one running current breezy and have x -21 yet?
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: ok... time for me to play
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, good luck :)
<|QuaD-> thanks :)
<Amaranth> blahrus: i'm totally up-to-date in breezy
<blahrus> hum . . . i am getting x locking up the whole system
<blahrus> goes to a black screen
<blahrus> and I can f1 into other terms
<Amaranth> i have nfi how i made it work
<Amaranth> hacks to make old versions work on top of hacks to make keysyms work on top of hacks to make fonts work etc
<blahrus> well hitting the power button just made it go to shut down
<blahrus> I guess that means its not fully locked up
<Amaranth> hitting the power button always works
<blahrus> i am getting Warning: font rendered for ".pcf" already registered at priority 0
<Amaranth> oh, you mean it went through an init 1?
<blahrus> and a few more than that
<Amaranth> init 1 is shutdown, right?
<blahrus> I didn't see anything it just shut down
<blahrus> I think init 0 is
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: what would i put for "Section"
<|QuaD-> in the control file
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, gnome
<|QuaD-> ok
<Amaranth> blahrus: then it was hard locked
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, the sections are the sections you can see insynaptic
<Amaranth> blahrus: power button always works, that's the mobo, not the os
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: i use apt :)
<blahrus> Amaranth: great . . . .
<blahrus> any ideas on a fix
<Amaranth> not a one
<Amaranth> like i said, i don't know how i got mine working
<mgalvin> l8r all, time to go home, TGIF :)
<|QuaD-> # Add here commands to install the package into debian/gclipboardd.
<|QuaD-> /usr/bin/make install DESTDIR=/home/derek/deb/gclipboardd-1.0/debian/gclipboardd
<|QuaD-> make[1] : Entering directory `/home/derek/deb/gclipboardd-1.0'
<|QuaD-> make[1] : *** No rule to make target `install'.  Stop.
<|QuaD-> make[1] : Leaving directory `/home/derek/deb/gclipboardd-1.0'
<|QuaD-> make: *** [install]  Error 2
<|QuaD-> gak
<\sh> damn
<\sh> i need fftw3 and this is compiled with g77
<\sh> but not 4.0
<\sh> re herve
#ubuntu-motu 2005-06-11
<\sh> now i can go to bed
<chris`schnarchen> LOL
<chris`schnarchen> me now ;)
<herve> ok I'm off
<herve> night all
<herve> I'll answer later
* \sh 's off
<crimsun> ok, weeend
<crimsun> weekend, even. Time for cxxtrans!
<plugwash> lamont any chance you could slip fp-compiler and fp-units-rtl (the second one is not actually needed for the build but apt will complain if its not there) package from into the buildd environment so that fpc can build
<plugwash> *from debian sid
<lamont_r> plugwash: no way in hell
<lamont_r> otoh, I can bootstrap fp-compiler for you
<lamont_r> plugwash: which architectures should it build on?
<lamont_r> (for bootstrapping, we'll do one build using the debian packages, then we'll remove all traces of debian from the chroot, install the bits we just built, and do another build.  the second build is the one we upload.)
<plugwash> debian currently has it for i386 powerpc and sparc
<lamont_r> ok.  I'll bootstrap i386 and ppc, I expect fabbione can get around to sparc sometime
<lamont_r> which source package is this?
<lamont_r> ah, fpc
<lamont_r> interestingly, PaS has i386 powerpc, not sparc..  Hence sparc is not autobuilding
<lamont_r> which would explain why it's out-of-date
* lamont_r updates PaS
<plugwash> PaS?
<lamont_r> Packages-arch-specific, the file that controls what packages the buildd's try to build
<lamont_r> there.  now the debian sparc buildd will actually try to build it tomorrow sometime.
<lamont_r> hrmpf... 80% of my poor machine's time is in wait states, 3% is user space
<plugwash> your a debian developer as well as a ubuntu one?
* lamont_r thinks I'm I/O bound
<lamont_r> plugwash: yes
<lamont_r> http://qa.debian.org/developer.php?login=lamont@debian.org
<lamont_r> hrm.. that reminds me...
<Amaranth> aren't most of the ubuntu developers?
<plugwash> btw what exactly is multiverse?
<plugwash> is it the equivilent of debians contrib/non-free?
<koke> who is in the security team?? (apart from pitti)
<Amaranth> um
<Amaranth> i think the maintainers handle their own security updates
<koke> Amaranth: security uploads are managed by the security team
<koke> but it seems it's pitti + his shadow :)
<plugwash> btw how long is security support on ubuntu
<plugwash> with such a fast release cycle i can't imagine you can hold off long before upgrading
<tseng> for universe it is one release cycle (6 months)
<tseng> for main its 18 months
<tseng> or 3 releases.
<plugwash> thats from when the version in question is released?
<blahrus> hey all
<ajmitch> hi
<mgalvin> hi
<mgalvin> in the control file the uploaders field is just "Uploaders:" right?
<blahrus> hey all
<ajmitch> mgalvin: yes, although it's not really necessary for ubuntu
<mgalvin> ajmitch, ok thnx, just needed to know b/c today I became the new maintainer for the libcwd package which has been uploaded to debian through its previous maintainer (my new debian sponsor) madduck, so I am adding him as an uploader
<ajmitch> ok
<tseng> hi ajmitch.
<tseng> hm was i supposed to upload some kind of beagle fixage
<tseng> oh libmono0-dev
<|QuaD-> how does that fix beagle?
<tseng> er thats not the fix
<tseng> thats the problem, more or less
<|QuaD-> oh :)
<tseng> upstream developers dont seem to realize that you cant rely on libfoo.so
<|QuaD-> thats why there are stability issues with beagle?
<tseng> we have that in -dev packages
<tseng> so I need to go back and make patches to force libfoo.so.x.y
<|QuaD-> ok
<tseng> and kick upstream around a bit.
<tseng> the culprit is stuff in libmono-dev atm
<ajmitch> dllmap crack?
<tseng> yes
<tseng> totally shithouse
<tseng> novell should know this stuff
<tseng>  /usr/lib/libMonoPosixHelper.so.0 vs /usr/lib/libMonoPosixHelper.so
<ajmitch> yeah I had the same issue with pnet
<tseng> pnet has libMono?
<tseng> :P
<ajmitch> no, just requiring a map
<tseng> um
<tseng> grep -R PosixHelper * give me nothing
<crb> Hi all.
<crb> Should I mention problems with universe here or straight to launchpad?
<mgalvin> crb, whats the problem, if its a bug, then yes stick it in launchpad
<crb> The version of a couple of debs doesn't match the filenames in universe.  Not a bug against the program, just the package/s.  libxml-libxml-perl & libxml-libxml-common-perl.
<mgalvin> is it in hoary or breezy
<crb> hoary
<mgalvin> well, it will probably not be fixed for hoary since its non-critical, it can surely be fixed for breezy, i would say just open a bugs for them in launchpad and someone will fix em, i'll take a peak at them when I get a chance
<crb> i've thrown one in (or at least tried, malone complained a little) and I'll install the files manually
<crb> but I imagine the debs are OK, and its just the Packages file is out of sync?  Are they regenerated every so often?
<mgalvin> well, new come over from debian once and a while, but the packages are only rebuilt when fixes are made, not sure if that answers your question
<mgalvin> that particular issues must not have gotten fixed
<crb> I'm familiar with repos and packaging - the problem sounds like it's in the repo, not in the package, if you see where i'm coming from.
<mgalvin> i got ya now, sorry its midnight here ;=/
<mgalvin> well the mirror i hit to grab packages from seems to be broken, argh
<mgalvin> what is the version diff u r seeing?
<crb> http://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/bugs/910/
<mgalvin> ok, well the mirrors seem to be not working right now which may be the problem
<mgalvin> i am seeing the same thing here against the us mirror
<ajmitch> hello crb
<crb> nz doesn't really have a mirror, I think it goes straight to archive. which is in the UK?
<crb> hey ajmitch
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> they just put in the country codes for future expansion
<mgalvin> this is the actual package on the server
<mgalvin> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/libx/libxml-libxml-perl/libxml-libxml-perl_1.56-6_i386.deb
<ajmitch> I don't know why the Packages file would get out of sync for haory, as it should be frozen
<ajmitch> probably something elmo has to fix up
<ajmitch> crb: how's life up north?
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: can you attempt to package that ultimate stunts game?
<crb> ajmitch: cold and windy
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, sure, what was the url again?
<ajmitch> we managed to have a bit of snow here yesterday
<crb> mgalvin: yeah, i've installed it already
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: http://www.ultimatestunts.nl/
<crb> ajmitch: you run mythtv?
<mgalvin> crb, ok, sorry i couldn't be more helpful
<crb> np, i was more just trying to alert
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, thnx, i'll take a crack at packing it up
<ajmitch> crb: nope, I don't have a card for it
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: no no no, thank you!
<blahrus> anyone aware of where libavifile is at? or maybe why it isn't is breezy atm?
<blahrus> nm, they are still working on moving it to gcc4
<ajmitch> possibly
<ajmitch> I see libavifile-0.7
<blahrus> there we go
<blahrus>   drip: Depends: libavifile-0.7c102 (>= 1:0.7.38.20030710-1.1) but it is not installable
<blahrus> guess the need to fix drip
<ajmitch> yup
<ajmitch> apps need to be recompiled, and they will be
<ajmitch> but not until the libs are done, afaik
<Unfrgiven> hi all
<ajmitch> hi Unfrgiven
<blahrus> whats up
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: im good
<Unfrgiven> how r u
<blahrus> not to bad
<blahrus> got x working this afternoon so i am happy again :)
<blahrus> wish memcoder was working
<blahrus> wanted to mess with dvd ripping again
<Unfrgiven> blahrus: what was the prob with x?
<blahrus> fonts and symlink issues
<blahrus> I hate hacking around on a system, but I guess its one of the best ways to learn
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, i got all of its deps tracked down, i think
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, and i got it to compile cleanly and run
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: it sounds like you are about to add a but
<blahrus> everytime I use acidrip I get an error code 139 with mencoder
<mgalvin> :) on hoary though, and since its a cpp app, i don't if it'll work on breezy yet
<blahrus> VDecoder init Failed :(
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: :(
<blahrus> this is in hoary not beezy btw
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, and sound isn't working, but i think I can fix that
<crimsun> sound can be a beast
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: i noticed that was a weird dependency.... sdl
<mgalvin> and it uses openAL for sound by default which i installed, but in the conf file the section seems to only have FMOD options
<mgalvin> i have to play with it a bit
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: take your time... i can't use it until uploads for c++ packages resume to breezy
<|QuaD-> mgalvin: thanks for the good work :) bedtime for me
<|QuaD-> ttyl
<mgalvin> |QuaD-, same here, l8r
<mgalvin> good night all
<abelli> ciao Gods,
<abelli> is breezy usable?
<uniq> don't think so.. X is randomly breaking atm.
<abelli> uniq: thx
<\sh> morning
<chris`duschen> morning \sh
<chris`duschen> uniq, my X is working :-)
<uniq> chris`duschen: it'll probably break soon :)
<uniq> i have x running too.. but it needes some work.
<\sh> morning ivoks
<ivoks> hi
<ivoks> nice...
<ivoks> sarge -> hoary -> breezy -> hoary
<ivoks> without reboot :)
<chris`wikiwork> LOL!
<ivoks> ok, time for cxx
<ivoks> :(
<ivoks> http://www.libranet.com/
<ivoks> :(
<ivoks> Mithrandir: ping
<DanielN> ivoks: some time to spend for a review? ;)
<ivoks> DanielN: sure
<ivoks> DanielN: where is source?
<DanielN> ivoks: http://marissa.ath.cx/daniel/archive/breezy
<DanielN> ivoks: on MOTUNewPackages too!
<ivoks> when?
<DanielN> yep
<ivoks> what's with debian_stuff/?
<ivoks> that's in upstream?
<ivoks> dir should be called when, not when_dist
<DanielN> ivoks: yep, is in upstream .. and the dir is called when_dist from upstream too
<ivoks> oh, upstream packaged this?
<ivoks> errr... debianized?
<DanielN> no, i began from scratch again
<Mithrandir> ivoks: pong
<Mithrandir> ivoks: don't /quit from irc all the time. :P
<ivoks> Mithrandir: :)
<ivoks> Mithrandir: i would need couple of packages on ravel... :)
<Mithrandir> postgresql-dev chrpath done
<ivoks> DanielN: from scratch? that diff doesn't look like you did
<ivoks> Mithrandir: automake too
<Mithrandir> ivoks: which automake?
<ivoks> Mithrandir: sec..
<ivoks> Mithrandir: it doesn't specify version... i guess ^automake$ then :)
<DanielN> ivoks: i mean that i didn't use the debian files from upstream
<DanielN> ivoks: debian_stuff is going to be deleted by patch!
<ivoks> DanielN: ah, right... you changed man :)
<ivoks> err.. Makefile :)
<DanielN> ;)
<Mithrandir> ivoks: you need kde stuff?
<ivoks> Mithrandir: no
<Mithrandir> good
<ivoks> Mithrandir: giflib-dev lib3ds-dev ccache - this three too :) please... :)
<Mithrandir> ok, automake1.4 installed.
<ivoks> thanx
<ivoks> DanielN: Section: unknown - that's wrong
<ivoks> DanielN: you should specify some Section
<DanielN> ok .. which one would be suitable?
<ivoks> that's perl script?
<DanielN> yep
<ivoks> utils would be good
<DanielN> ok, thanks ivoks .. i would fix that :)
<DanielN> i'll
<ivoks> wait... there is more :)
<DanielN> ..
<ivoks> Description starts with when is...
<ivoks> not When is...
<ivoks> and doesn't end with '.'
<ivoks> and... initial release can't include "cleaning debian/" :)
<DanielN> ah .. ok
<ivoks> it's first release, you didn't clean previous release :)
<DanielN> ;>
<DanielN> ok, clear now for me, tx
<ivoks> leave out (DNE) from MAINTAINER_NAME
<ivoks> only name ans lastname goes there
<DanielN> argh yeah, i found it right now, that i zhaven't changed this in the Makefile
<DanielN> ;>
<ivoks> hm..
<ivoks> bigest issue
<ivoks> when_dist must be when-1.0.23
<DanielN> hm..
<ivoks> and one more thing...
<ivoks> you never patch that Makefile
<DanielN> mhm.. why not?
<ivoks> you defined patch:
<doko> DanielN: ping
<ivoks> but you didn't tell .PHONY to run it :)
<DanielN> ivoks: err.. that needs some explanation now :)
<DanielN> doko: pong
<doko> DanielN, did you see my comments on the C++ libs, you are working on?
<DanielN> doko: if you're Matthias Klose, then yep :)
<ivoks> :))
<doko> DanielN: ok, fix it ;-)
<DanielN> doko: i've fixed cppopt already .. you can take a look
<ivoks> DanielN: in debian/rules, line 98
<ivoks> DanielN: binary: patch binary-indep binary-arch
<DanielN> doko: with debdiff now ;)
<DanielN> ivoks: ah ok.. but the patch commands at beginning of debian/rules must be there too?
<ivoks> DanielN: you defined patch "function"
<ivoks> DanielN: but you never run it
<DanielN> ahhhh
<doko> DanielN: where is libcppopt0_c2_patch.diff
<ivoks> DanielN: you must run it before building :)
<ivoks> DanielN: and you can leave out unpatch :)
<DanielN> ivoks: ok thanks
<DanielN> doko: mhm.. ??
<ivoks> DanielN: work on that and then i'll check it again...
<ivoks> Mithrandir: ping :)
<DanielN> ok .. thanks for your tipps
<Mithrandir> ivoks: yes?
<doko> +patch: patch-stamp
<doko> +patch-stamp:
<doko> +	dh_testdir
<doko> +
<doko> +	patch -p1 < debian/patches/libcppopt0_c2_patch.diff
<doko> +
<doko> +	touch patch-stamp
<doko> +
<ivoks> Mithrandir: giflib-dev lib3ds-dev ccache - please :)
<tseng> hi Mithrandir.
<doko> DanielN, where is this file?
<DanielN> doko: mhm.. i should put it in debian/patches
<DanielN> but then i must do 2 diffs
<DanielN> :/
<Mithrandir> ivoks: done
<ivoks> Mithrandir: :* :)
<ivoks> Mithrandir: i guess you don't have /usr/lib/X11/Xlib.h :)
<doko> DanielN: no, just use debdiff. And I'm wondering why you need a patch at all ...
<DanielN> hrmpf
<DanielN> to rename it, i thought
<ivoks> ?
<DanielN> doko: i think, no the big AHA is comming
<ivoks> DanielN: you have to rename it
<DanielN> ivoks: talking about what now?
<Mithrandir> ivoks: Xlib.h should not be in lib; I'm kinda busy now so if it's not something kinda urgent, please hold it.
<ivoks> DanielN: same thing doko is
<DanielN> doko: i just rename it normally and create a debdiff of it, without apply a patch in any kind.. LOL.. missunderstanded that
<ivoks> Mithrandir: it's ok... not urget, i'll investigate that...
<DanielN> but right now?
<ivoks> doko: one question... in the end, Xlib.h will be in /usr/lib/X11 or only in /usr/X11R6/include/X11 ?
<doko> DanielN, sounds ok
<DanielN> doko: ok, then it's burned in my brain now, how transition works, thanks :)
<doko> ivoks, ask daniels, I don't know his plans. But I assume, it will be in /usr/include/X11
<ivoks> doko: thanks
<Mithrandir> oh, hi tseng.  Sorry, busybusy.
<tseng> heh, nps
<tseng> i have to try to package .net 2.0 preview stuff for doko today
<ajmitch> sleep time, night all
<tseng> ironpython is written with all that crap
<ivoks> doko: stutilsxx is ready for upload [ https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11083 ]  builds on amd64 and i386 (tested)
<DanielN> ivoks: how should i handle it, to rename when_dist to when-1.0.23 ?
<ivoks> yes
<ivoks> mv when_dist when-1.0.23
<ivoks> :)
<DanielN> in Makefile?
<ivoks> DanielN: you should read http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/
<DanielN> ivoks: i'm working with this document, yep
<ivoks> DanielN: then open section 2.3
<DanielN> k
<DanielN> ivoks: but i moved it to when-1.0.23
<ivoks> ok, let's go from start...
<ivoks> d/w source package
<DanielN> yep
<doko> ivoks: looks fine, but please attach one patch covering both fixes. the new diff is not complete.
<ivoks> untar it
<ivoks> doko: ok (but ubuntu1 is up allready...)
<ivoks> DanielN: untar it
<ivoks> DanielN: it will create when_dist directory, right?
<DanielN> yeah... and this one i renamed to when-1.0.23 before beginning packaging work
<ivoks> DanielN: enter it, and do: dh_make -e your.email@address -f ../when-1.0.23.tar.gz
<DanielN> done it like that ivoks!
<ivoks> ok
<DanielN> :/
<ivoks> now untar that when-1.0.23
<ivoks> now untar that when-1.0.23.tar.gz
<ivoks> it will create when-1.0.23 dir
<DanielN> ah
<ivoks> not when_dist
<ivoks> DanielN: now, that's your source on top of which you create your package
<DanielN> ivoks: ok.. another '?' is cleaned out now :)
<ivoks> it's signed and has correct naming
<\sh> grmpf
<doko> ivoks: sure, but we should have a patch, which we can forward to debian
<ivoks> doko: ok, it's up (nice to hear it would be sent to debian)
<DanielN> ivoks: that doesn't work like you said! the upstream tarball: when.tar.gz -> when_dist mv when-1.0.23 -> dh_make -e ba@ba.b -f ../when.tar.gz
<ivoks> DanielN: ?
<DanielN> gives when_1.0.23.orig.tar.gz -> still when_dist
<ivoks> DanielN: tar xvfz when.tar.gz && mv when_dist when-1.0.23 && cd when-1.0.23 && dh_make -e YOUR@EMAIL -f ../when-1.0.23.tar.gz
<ivoks> copy paste that
<ivoks> change only your email
<DanielN> ivoks: i've done it like that.. vut there isn't a ../when-1.0.23.tar.gz
<\sh> grmpf
<DanielN> so i get an error, that the upstream tar isn't there ;)
<ivoks> \sh: problems? :)
<\sh> yes
<\sh> ivoks: please read http://people.debian.org/~pxt/nc6000/ the part about irda...and tell me what I'm doing wrong...
<\sh> i removed parport and the serial ports
<\sh> installed this toshiba util, it's initializing my irda port, but modprobe smsc-ircc2 doesn't work
<ivoks> DanielN: mv when.tar.gz when-1.0.23.tar.gz
<ivoks> DanielN: tar xvfz when-1.0.23.tar.gz && mv when_dist when-1.0.23 && cd when-1.0.23 && dh_make -e YOUR@EMAIL -f ../when-1.0.23.tar.gz
<DanielN> ivoks: ok, i'll test it
<ivoks> \sh: depmod -a?
<\sh> ivoks: no
<ivoks> \sh: so, you buit modul and install it
<ivoks> now it doesn't come up?
<\sh> ivoks: it's not an module...toshiba thingy is extra app
<ivoks> ?
<\sh> and smc-ircc2 is module for kernel 2.6 (it's already there)
<ivoks> modprobe smc-ircc
<ivoks> ?
<DanielN> ivoks: sorry, but i think you're wrong.. if i do it similar to your hint above, the .orig.tar.gz still gives a when_dist and not a when-1.0.23
<ivoks> ok
<ivoks> DanielN: and what about when-1.0.23.tar.gz?
<ivoks> DanielN: where did i mention .orig.tar.gz?
<DanielN> ivoks: mhm.. now you're making me diffused... the target is to provide an orig.tar.gz with when-1.0.23 instead of when_dist, right>?
<ivoks> DanielN: no, objective is to provide when-1.0.23 with when-1.0.23.tar.gz
<DanielN> hm
<DanielN> but then there will be never a tarball without when_dist
<ivoks> \sh: i don't get it... modprobe smsc-ircc2 uploads module or not?
<\sh> yes...but freezes the kernel
<ivoks> DanielN: ?
<\sh> or better it tries to install many of them
<ivoks> \sh: ah... :)
<DanielN> ivoks: i mean, that when_dist don't become when-1.0.23
<ivoks> DanielN: man...
<ivoks> DanielN: there is allready source package of when on upstream site
<ivoks> DanielN: why don't you use it?
<ivoks> it has errors, tough...
<DanielN> ivoks: yep
<ivoks> when_1.0.23.orig.tar.gz - should be when-1.0.23.tar.gz
<DanielN> mhm
<ivoks> DanielN: http://www.lightandmatter.com/when/when_1.0.23-debian-source.tar.gz
<DanielN> well.. i'm such a fuck diffused now.. think packaging isn't something for me :/
<ivoks> \sh: kernel errors are hard to discover over irc :)
<ivoks> DanielN: relax :)
<\sh> ivoks: it's not a kernel error :(
<\sh> it's a user to stupid error...
<ivoks> \sh: it is if module freezes kernel
<\sh> ivoks: no..modprobe -v shows me, that it's tries to load many instances of smsc-ircc2
<ivoks> DanielN: ok, let's do original when.tar.gz, step by step... i'll do it with you
<\sh> and that breaks my mem
<ivoks> :)))
<DanielN> ivoks: no no.. spend your time to something more important.. i'm fucked of to package something at this time now.. but thanks ;>
<ivoks> DanielN: don't give up
<ivoks> DanielN: i said same thing not long ago :)
<DanielN> ivoks: i don't give up.. but i'm pissed a bit off right now
<DanielN> :)
<ivoks> DanielN: you choosed fscking package :)
<ivoks> DanielN: but it isn't hard
<ivoks> look
<DanielN> ivoks: yeah, but i thought that when is a easy stuff to start ;)
<ivoks> DanielN: first package is allways hard
<DanielN> ivoks: clearly ;)
<ivoks> DanielN: tar xvfz when.tar.gz
<ivoks> DanielN: mv when_dist when-1.0.23
<DanielN> yep
<ivoks> DanielN: tar -cf when-1.0.23.tar when-1.0.23
<ivoks> DanielN: gzip -9 when-1.0.23.tar
<ivoks> DanielN: cd when-1.0.23
<DanielN> aaaaaaaaargh :)
<ivoks> DanielN: dh_make -e you@email.address -f ../when-1.0.23.tar.gz
<DanielN> ivoks: why you didn't say that earlier that i have to create the tar.gz manually... cleared out much now
<ivoks> DanielN: heh :)
<ivoks> DanielN: point is... you have to have source archive <package>-<version>.tar.gz
<DanielN> k
<ivoks> DanielN: that extracts to <package>-<version>
<DanielN> ivoks: yep.. i'm understanding now. and from this tar, the orig.tar.gz will be created
<ivoks> DanielN: problem is that author did <package>.tar.gz that extracts to <package>_dist.tar.gz
<ivoks> silly, IMHO
<ivoks> DanielN: no
<DanielN> yep
<ivoks> DanielN: that is your source tar.gz
<DanielN> mhm
<ivoks> DanielN: you will not have .orig.tar.gz
<ivoks> pardon :)
<DanielN> ivoks: mmm.. but i thought that a orig.tar.gz is a _must_
<ivoks> you will
<ivoks> you will not have when-1.0.23.orig directory :)
<ivoks> DanielN: i type faster then i think :)
<DanielN> omg
<DanielN> diffused again now
<ivoks> what?
<DanielN> so i'll hzave an orig.tar.gz now or i don't?
<ivoks> DanielN: yes
<DanielN> aha
<ivoks> DanielN: when you do dpkg-buildpackage
<DanielN> mhm.. but isn't that a native package then?
<ivoks> DanielN: it will create .dsc, .diff.gz and .orig.tar.gz
<ivoks> DanielN: error :)
<ivoks> DanielN: dh_make created .orig.tar.gz
<DanielN> yeah
<ivoks> DanielN: dpkg-buildpackage will not do that :)
<DanielN> ...
<ivoks> yeah, i hate doing 5 things in the same time :)
<DanielN> ivoks: no one said to you that you have to do 5 things at same time ;) as your choice
<\sh> it's time to reinstall my b0rked ubuntu install :(
<ivoks> ?
<DanielN> ivoks: so i can follow your steps with creating this source tar?
<\sh> ivoks: i broke everything :) in german i say all the time "Ich hab zu viel gefrickelt"
<DanielN> \sh: :))
<ivoks> you have to much <some word i don't understand> :)
<ivoks> DanielN: you have source now, now edit/fix debian/*
<ivoks> since i downgraded breezy to hoary, my fonts are... hm... wierd :)
<\sh> now i can build my shelf
<DanielN> now i can build my tte :)
<spacey> \sh, did you check nexiuez?
<spacey> \sh, the -glx version doesn't start properly here, and the -sdl version is slow like ****
<spacey> :)
<\sh> spacey: not now..
<\sh> i have to figure out some other problems first
<ivoks> like he's ubuntu installation :)
<ivoks> again... he's :)
<ivoks> his
<\sh> ivoks: well..just now ;)
<\sh> but i just finished my shelfs
<\sh> shelves even
<\sh> two of them
<spacey> \sh, sure, thats all i had to say anyway :)
<\sh> spacey: u tried to compile the stuff?
<spacey> \sh, no, i'll try that, i just used to precompiled binaries atm
* Nafallo puts on extra socks.
<herve> morning
<ivoks> herve: hi
<tepsipakki> hi, there's a fairly trivial fix needed for rbscrobbler to build (trayicon/Makefile: -I/usr/include/python2.3/ -> -I/usr/include/python2.4/). the build-deps also need to be changed to python2.4-dev
<tepsipakki> I've tested this
<tepsipakki> so.. how to get this fix in?
<herve> let me check
<\sh> re
<herve> Amaranth, I see smeg hited the archive ;-)
<herve> tepsipakki, how should I credit you for the fix?
<herve> real name, email?
<tepsipakki> credit?-) actually it was suggested by Kamion, I just tested the build on a clean breezy-chroot =)
<herve> hehe, ok
<Nafallo> herve: credit cjwatson or something ;-)
<herve> Nafallo, done :-)
<herve> still 5 min until I downloaded the build deps
* Nafallo is away: gone chopin.
* Nafallo is away: gone shopping.
<herve> I would like to talk a walk
<herve> but the weather is strange
<herve> shopping sounds nice too :-)
<DanielN> yes! when should be fine now :)
<herve> tepsipakki, uploaded, thanks!
<herve> DanielN, remind me to review your package when I come back
<herve> see you later
<tepsipakki> herve: thank _you_!
<DanielN> \sh: when should be perfect now, if ivoks is right with his hints :)
* Nafallo is back (gone 00:42:23)
<uniq> hmm.. can anyone confirm that libxml-sax-expat-perl is uninstallable in hoary?
<uniq> 404
<uniq> http://packages.ubuntu.com/cgi-bin/download.pl?arch=all&file=pool%2Funiverse%2Flibx%2Flibxml-sax-expat-perl%2Flibxml-sax-expat-perl_0.37-3_all.deb&md5sum=e430e4a9f8926fe83e8589e810f9575b&arch=all&type=main
<uniq> 404 on all the mirrors i've tested.
<uniq> it's in the packages file though.
<uniq> it leaves libxml-simple-perl, gnuift-perl and most important docbook2x uninstallable.
<uniq> the source doesn't exist either.. http://packages.ubuntu.com/hoary/source/libxml-sax-expat-perl
<DanielN> uniq: seems that you're right! but here: http://www.artfiles.org/ubuntu.com/archive/pool/universe/libx/libxml-sax-expat-perl/libxml-sax-expat-perl_0.37-3_all.deb there it is :)
<uniq> i know, i have it already.. it's just that it's broken in hoary.
<DanielN> mhm..
<DanielN> you should talk to a MOTU
<uniq_> argh.. my ipv6 is unstable.. :/
<uniq> finally stable.. xs26 ipv6 service isn't very stable.
<uniq> danieln: that's why i posted my message in this channel -motu :)
<\sh> ok..now I'm back in action
<\sh> well just now
<uniq> \sh: hi, i've got work for you - read back please :)
<\sh> ??
<uniq> libxml-sax-expat-perl is uninstallable in hoary
<uniq> 404
<uniq> even though it's in the packages file.
<uniq> can't download the source either http://packages.ubuntu.com/hoary/source/libxml-sax-expat-perl
<uniq> and you get 404 on most of the mirrors http://packages.ubuntu.com/cgi-bin/download.pl?arch=all&file=pool%2Funiverse%2Flibx%2Flibxml-sax-expat-perl%2Flibxml-sax-expat-perl_0.37-3_all.deb&md5sum=e430e4a9f8926fe83e8589e810f9575b&arch=all&type=main
<uniq> that breaks libxml-simple-perl, gnuift-perl and most importantly docbook2x.
<Amaranth> woo, smeg made it
<\sh> uniq: hmmm
<\sh> uniq: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/libx/libxml-sax-expat-perl/
<uniq> that's -2
<uniq> and i have the package, i don't need it. universe just needs to be fixed.
<\sh> hmmm2
<\sh> it has a meaning that it is not there anymore
<uniq> well, update the Packages file then :)
<\sh> nono...officially it's not there
<\sh> anymore
<uniq> apt-get thinks -3 is there because it is in the Packages file, when -2 is, apt-get doesn't automagicaly failover and install -2. it must be specified.
<uniq> and -2 isn't in the Packages file at all.
<uniq> so users can't even force the version with =version
<\sh> Riddell: ping
<uniq> don't think he's around.
<siretart> hi
<siretart> is some java guru here? I need to install jboss. whats the recommended way to install on hoary?
<DanielN> welcome back, ivoks :)
<ivoks> hi
<DanielN> ivoks: you should review when again, should be fine now :)
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> ok... let's see...
<DanielN> ;>
<ivoks> i can't open URL on MOTUNewPackages
<ivoks> server down?
<ivoks> http://marissa.ath.cx/daniel/archive/breezy doesn't work
<tseng> worksforme
<\sh> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUNewPackages
<ivoks> now it works for me too
<ivoks> i'm so pissed
<ivoks> :(
<DanielN> ivoks: marissa.ath.cx doesn't work?
<ivoks> works now
<DanielN> fine :)
<ivoks> again, you don't do patching
<ivoks> you added patch on wrong place :)
<ivoks> when you build binary, it calls binary function
<ivoks> this one calls binary-indep
<ivoks> which calls build and install
<ivoks> non of these calls patch
<\sh> ??
<ivoks> \sh: :)
<DanielN> ivoks: but i added patch do PHONY
<DanielN> as you said
<ivoks> DanielN: not to .PHONY, but to binary:
<ivoks> DanielN: I said look at line 97
<ivoks> DanielN: i even pasted here how it whould look like
<\sh> right
<\sh> the patch call needs to be before configure target
<ivoks> yes
<\sh> so configure: patch configure-stamp
<ivoks> and unpatch after clean
<DanielN> ivoks: ok, i'll check that later, the horse entrecote is just finished :)
<\sh> clean: unpatch yeah
<\sh> horse?
<DanielN> pferdeentrecote :)
<ivoks> DanielN: one more thing
<DanielN> yep?
<ivoks> dpkg-gencontrol: warning: unknown substitution variable ${shlibs:Depends}
<ivoks> you don't have .shlibs
<tseng> we are starting to add alot of NEW packages
<tseng> this isnt scalable
<\sh> u mean a real "pferd"?
<tseng> we should have a meeting about it.
<ivoks> so you can't put Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}
<DanielN> \sh: yeah? whatelse
<ivoks> DanielN: same thing with misc
<\sh> DanielN: nice :)
<\sh> tseng: we need RT
<tseng> RT?
<\sh> request tracker
<tseng> no, we dont
<ivoks> i agree
<\sh> this wiki stuff is not good enough for package tracking
<tseng> we need the packages to go to Debian with sponsors
<ivoks> and one more thing...
<tseng> or someone to take them over.
<ivoks> we shouldn't add every app that is out there
<Burgundavia> tseng, https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/bugs/809
<ivoks> and I agree - we should/must cooperate with Debian
<tseng> we dont need better tracking for new packages, we need to not add so many locallyh
<\sh> ajmitch: ping ! sponsor uploads now ;)
<ivoks> for that we should stop flamewar on debian-lists, and start productive conversation
<tseng> that are going to be added in Debian with an ITP
<tseng> ivoks: what flamewar?
* \sh doesn't read debian lists ;)
<tseng> I work with debian devels every day
<\sh> tseng: and how long should we gonna wait?
<tseng> half of cannonical is DDs
<ivoks> tseng: you don't know? :)
<tseng> \sh: wait for what?
<tseng> ivoks: is this something new, or the same couple people with a stick up their ass
<\sh> tseng: wait for integration in debian?
<\sh> tseng: wnpp is full of requests...
<ivoks> tseng: Subject: Is Ubuntu a debian derivative or is it a fork?
<tseng> \sh: how many with good packages?
<\sh> tseng: oh there r some...
<tseng> anyway the problem is this
<tseng> i package XYZ new mono package
<\sh> too many packages, too less people, too much governance overhead @debian?
<tseng> then i find an ITP for it by some DD who doesnt know anything about mono
<tseng> and its all wrong.
<tseng> i have to explain to him why and fix the package
<ivoks> tseng: do we need to fill ITP?
<tseng> we should be filing the ITPs
<ivoks> :)
<tseng> still after daniel and andrew review it
<tseng> then we wont have problems with merging, see
<ivoks> true
<Burgundavia> \sh, I think the last, and possibly even the appearance of the last in the most important
<\sh> tseng: i'll give u an example
<\sh> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=286203
<tseng> wow, useful one
<\sh> tseng: well, what is usefull?
<tseng> boo
<tseng> if you want proof, 3 people packaged it
<\sh> tseng: when the user are downloading and compiling those things by themself, is it useful then?
<\sh> right
<\sh> and this guy, who opened this bug, is pissed
<ivoks> as I understand, when one fills ITP, one has to wait for it's approval?
<tseng> he can be pissed, but it stands that its a volunteer project
<tseng> if the software is lame, no one will want to pick it up
<\sh> i can take over his whole repos and upgrade all packages to whatever I want
<tseng> but we arent doing NEW stuff for a bunch of ugly themes
<tseng> its cool new Gnome software that people want
<\sh> hahahaha
<ivoks> ok... here is idea
<uniq> and KDE stuff :)
<Amaranth> boo?
<tseng> boo.
<Amaranth> i've always wanted to play with that
<tseng> yep
<ivoks> we package software and fill ITP
<ivoks> we don't have to wait for Debian
<Amaranth> nice mix of python and C#
<tseng> ivoks: yes.
<tseng> MOTU should not be a fork
<\sh> sh*t i'm waiting for my pizza
<tseng> as the thread says
<ivoks> cause, they'll have ITP and that package will be used in debian too
<tseng> yep.
<ivoks> but meanwhile, it can be in ubuntu
<tseng> and we'll be there first or work with the guy who was
<ivoks> so, it would be one big source repository for all debian derivates
<tseng> to make sure we dont have bad merges
<ivoks> yeah
<tseng> zwiki login is annoying
<tseng> it has 0 persistance
<Amaranth> oddly this session saver extension for firefox adds persistance
<Amaranth> well, not oddly, i guess
<Amaranth> it's supposed to just remember what tabs you had open, i guess it remembers their state and etc too
* tseng cleans up MOTUNewPackages
<\sh> hmmm...
<Amaranth> smeg has been uploaded and in on the mirrors, could be removed
<tseng> i movedit to uploaded
<\sh> can someone give me a gmane link to this thread?
<Amaranth> well, i did that right after ajmitch uploaded it
<Amaranth> but i didn't know what to do with the reviews
<tseng> er
<ivoks> \sh: moment...
<tseng> im moving them to uplaoded
<Amaranth> any reason MOTUNewPackages can't be scrapped for malone?
<ivoks> \sh: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2005/05/msg00000.html
<ivoks> \sh: no, that's wrong one... sec
<ivoks> \sh: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2005/05/msg01438.html
<ivoks> tseng: so, no new packages untill we settle this up with debian?
<tseng> i cant make that decision all by myself
<tseng> but im getting sick of conflicting packages in ITP
<ivoks> i agree
<ivoks> tseng: is that topic for TB?
<tseng> On the other hand, I've had packages for which ubuntu has moved to a
<tseng> newer upstream version without properly updating the debian/ files,
<tseng> resulting in packages that are severely broken (some to the point of
<tseng> unusability), with my name listed as maintainer.
<tseng> uh?
<tseng> i dont understand this email at all
<ivoks> it means that someone repackaged whole thing
<ivoks> and left DD as maintainer
<Burgundavia> pure hatred --> http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2005/05/msg01468.html
<ivoks> DanielN: your diff should compleetly remove debian_stuff out of source
<ivoks> DanielN: but then you are maintainer of that package
<\sh> *shakinghead*
<ivoks> \sh: :)
<ivoks> 3:1 nice :)
* Treenaks looks at the panel
<ivoks> http://live.index.hr/ :)
<Treenaks> SCARY animation..
<Treenaks> mozilla seems to want attention
<ivoks> lol... IIS crashed :)
<ivoks> no live anymore :))
<Burgundavia> Treenaks, what is this panel stuff that people keep talking about?
<Lathiat> Burgundavia: heh (@d-d
<tseng> this is all so silly
<Treenaks> Burgundavia: open firefox (which will take a while), then focus something else
* \sh is reading now this bull***** 
<tseng> we leave attribution in the form of a changelog
<Burgundavia> Lathiat, that is only flame I see on that whole thread, so I am very happy
<Treenaks> Burgundavia: watch the panel pulsate when the window is mapped
<tseng> and we note out own changes also in the changelog
<tseng> wtf would we change the Maintainer field in every package
<Burgundavia> Treenaks, focus on something?
<Treenaks> Burgundavia: "window wants attention"
<\sh> tseng: the thing is, we're doing now their work for sarge+1
<Treenaks> Burgundavia: in hoary it'll just be bold. in breezy it's bold and it pulsates
<ivoks> we should all stop for a minute and organise this
<ivoks> otherwise ubuntu will become fork and it wouldn't have enough people to be this good
<Burgundavia> Treenaks, huh? I am felling very stupid!
<\sh> and when they have access to our bugzilla etc. and transistion list they have to get the packages and merge the changes
<Treenaks> Burgundavia: When a window wants attention, the indicator for that window in the window switcher in the panel will be bold, right?
<Treenaks> Burgundavia: in breezy, it's not just bold, it slowly fades strangely as well
<\sh> ivoks: what do u think how many months mandrake needed to be a real fork of redhat?
<Burgundavia> Treenaks, hmm, ok
<tseng> \sh: years.
<Burgundavia> there are still mdk packages that install on redhat
<Burgundavia> at least my old RH8 did
<ivoks> \sh: and where is mandrake now?
<ivoks> dead
<ivoks> :)
<\sh> ivoks: no
<Lathiat> Burgundavia: rofl @ tollefs its a spoon
<\sh> ivoks: they have their user base
<\sh> ivoks: so will ubuntu
<ivoks> \sh: that wouldn't be good
<ivoks> debian is big great base on top of wich is easy to work
<\sh> ivoks: why not? do u think progeny will stay close to debian?
<ivoks> if we fork, you can forget about 6 month cycle
<\sh> ivoks: we forked already...
<ivoks> we should stop
<\sh> ivoks: we're quite faster
<ivoks> imho
<\sh> ivoks: we are at least sarge+1 and how long did it take debian to try a release after woody?
<Treenaks> \sh: progeny will stay VERY close to Debian (that's what Ian wants)
<\sh> i mean, no offense against debian, they do really good work
<jaldhar> \sh the two situations are really not comparable
<Treenaks> and don't forget that ubuntu has "buzz"
<Treenaks> Debian Sarge will sounds like "Hey, they finally released?"
<\sh> Treenaks: that's what ian wants, but what about his user? if the user wants to be much better and faster, then he has to take action and take over debian ;)
<Treenaks> Progeny will sound like "Oh no, more Debian"
<tseng> ok well i want to talk to daniel and ogra
<tseng> my ideas have 0 to do with this thread
<tseng> i hadnt even read it until today
<Treenaks> this is not about the firewall flamewar, is it?
<tseng> and we should have a meeting.
<\sh> Treenaks: no
<tseng> Treenaks: no?
<Burgundavia> Treenaks, progeny will ship 2.10, only the 3rd distro to do so
<Treenaks> tseng: ubuntu-devel ml
<tseng> Treenaks: i told stunned he was wrong, and the other guy was right but an ass
<tseng> Treenaks: so i think it will go away
<tseng> yes?
<Treenaks> Burgundavia: after ubuntu and suse, yes
<\sh> They generally don't. Ubuntu considers it more effective to spend
<\sh> their time on PR to make people think they are giving stuff back, than
<\sh> to actually do it; it generates more 'goodwill', since most people
<\sh> won't bother to check. This thread will probably become a good
<\sh> example, most of the others did.
<\sh> Andrew Suffield
<Amaranth> Treenaks: Are you talking about how the contrast on the window list changes to make it look like things are pulsing?
<\sh> hmmm
<\sh> i have an idea
<Treenaks> Amaranth: it already looks that way in breezy
<Amaranth> Treenaks: I know.
<jaldhar> \sh: oh that's just Andrew Suffield :)  He rarely has a good thing to say about anything
<\sh> we collect all patches and changes from bugzilla etc. put them into one big tar.gz and send them to the debian-devel-ml
<Treenaks> Amaranth: and it's cool :)
<Amaranth> just making sure i'm thinking of the same thing
<Amaranth> yeah
<ivoks> \sh: :)
<Amaranth> \sh: They'll kill us.
<Amaranth> WebCore vs KHTML, but on the distro level
<jaldhar> \sh: I think mosts DDs do want to cooperate with Ubuntu its just a question of what is the right way
<Burgundavia> Treenaks, I see why I never see it. I only have one app per virtual desktop
<\sh> Amaranth: yeah, but they have their "give back and thanks for the fish"
<Treenaks> we (MOTU) at least should file/fix Debian bugs as well as Malone bugs
<Treenaks> imho
<Treenaks> and send patches, etc.
<Treenaks> then "they" can't say we're not helping
<Amaranth> does sid have gnome 2.10?
<jaldhar> I think all MOTUS should also join the Debian new maintainer process
<Treenaks> Amaranth: experimental does
<Treenaks> Amaranth: sid has .8
<Treenaks> Amaranth: uh.. sarge
<Amaranth> it might not be too late to get my patch for gnome-menus in there
<Lathiat> jaldhar: thats stupid
<jaldhar> Lathiat: why?
<DanielN> ivoks: so i put a "patch" to configure?
<DanielN> sorry
<Lathiat> jaldhar: if im a motu who just pets some packages to work properly on ubuntu, theres no reason for me to become a dd
<DanielN> could you write that again, i don't have the chatlog, ivoks
<Lathiat> jaldhar: esp since, for example, i wouldnt have a package to maintain to make me a dd for a start
<ivoks> DanielN: you can do that too, yes
<Lathiat> jaldhar: and i might not have the time to do this
<Amaranth> who wrote the blog entry on patching with cdbs and debhelper?
<Lathiat> jaldhar: or agree with debains policies, or whatever
<ivoks> DanielN: configure: patch configure-stamp
<Lathiat> jaldhar: i do howevver, think people who are uploading (new, non-debian) packages to ubuntu should if possible try to get involved with debian
<DanielN> ok.. and i leave the other patching stove above?
<DanielN> paching stuff i mean
<ivoks> DanielN: who wrote that control for you? :)
<DanielN> dh_make
<DanielN> :)
<ivoks> DanielN: you define patch "function" with "patch: "
<jaldhar> Lathiat: that's a very short-sighted attitude.  Unless the package you are working on is so inconsequential it does not interact with any other you need to be involved with the OS has a whole
<ivoks> DanielN: it isn't executed untill you call it from configure or build
<Lathiat> jaldhar: its not
<jaldhar> Lathiat: that's the difference between a distro and a CD full of shovelware
<Lathiat> jaldhar: if all im doing is petting packages to work on ubuntu
<DanielN> ok, so i have to add patch to configure and leave the rest as it is.. thx ivoks.
<Lathiat> jaldhar: or fixing Cxx stuff
<ivoks> DanielN: then you have to say to configure: "function" that you would like it to call patch: function, before it exec it self
<Lathiat> i would be absoltely no use as a DD
<Burgundavia> jaldhar, Ubuntu is much easier to get a pcakge into, please don't make it arbitrarily harder, for no real gain
<Lathiat> because none of it applies to debian
<\sh> DanielN: info make :)
<Lathiat> and part of becoming a DD is packaging something
<Lathiat> i dont have anything to package
<ivoks> DanielN: so you define configure: with configure: patch configure-stamp
<Lathiat> (afaik anyway, ic ould be wrong)
<jaldhar> Burgundavia: and thats your goal?  More packages or better packages?
<DanielN> ivoks: ok.. wati i'll fix it
<ivoks> DanielN: in configure-stamp: you define all other non-patching related configurations
<DanielN> ivoks: can i erase Depends completely?
<ivoks> DanielN: NO!
<DanielN> :P
<Burgundavia> jaldhar, more and better, they are not exclusive
<DanielN> then leave it blank or what?
<Burgundavia> jaldhar, I want packages that flow into the distro faster
<ivoks> DanielN: does your package depends on perl?
<ivoks> DanielN: it does.
<ivoks> DanielN: then, put Depends: perl (>= 5.0.0)
<\sh> I agree with Burgundavia
<jaldhar> Burgundavia: but note I didn't say don't do anything for ubuntu until you've passed Debian new maintainer process, only that you should go through it
<ivoks> so..
<\sh> jaldhar: and then?
<DanielN> ivoks: argh.. have that in build-deps...
<DanielN> ivoks: ok
<ivoks> just fill ITP, send it to debian
<ivoks> and put it in ubuntu
<jaldhar> \sh: and then you will be able to work better with Debian and vice-versa.  Everyone wins
<Burgundavia> jaldhar, I only dable in the package process, and have no interest in maintaining a program for a long time, ala debian
<ivoks> then DD will know package allready egxist and will contact you
<ivoks> DanielN: build-deps are something different
<ivoks> DanielN: build-deps are packages you need to build your program
<ivoks> DanielN: so, you don't need perl there
<\sh> jaldhar: well, there is one reason I don't want to play with debian in the first way, and this is the "old system of blabla"
<jaldhar> Burgundavia: so in answer to my earlier question you prefer quantity to quality.
<ivoks> DanielN: Depends: are packages that you program needs so it could work
<ivoks> DanielN: you need perl there
<\sh> jaldhar: i don't like discussions about "is this license correct for debian?" or "is ubuntu a fork or what" or "ian said: "Progeny" on his blog...kill him"
<Burgundavia> jaldhar, as I said before, they are not mutally exclusive
<ivoks> \sh: that's why we need to cooperate
<jaldhar> \sh: everyone goes through that phase.  You'll grow out of it.  Even gentoo is putting the brakes on a little bit as people actually start using them for serious stuff
<DanielN> ivoks: patch: patch-stamp
<DanielN> patch-stamp:
<DanielN>         dh_testdir -i
<DanielN>         patch -p1 < debian/patches/when_1.0.23_p1.diff
<DanielN>         touch patch-stamp
<DanielN> unpatch: unpatch-stamp
<DanielN> unpatch-stamp: patch-stamp
<DanielN>         dh_testdir -i
<ivoks> ?
<DanielN>         patch -p1 -R < debian/patches/when_1.0.23_p1.diff
<DanielN>         rm -f patch-stamp
<\sh> ivoks: it has nothing to do with "coorperate"
<jaldhar> \sh: as for the mailing lists, ignore most of whats said there
<DanielN> ivoks: configure: patch configure-stamp
<DanielN> configure-stamp:
<DanielN>         dh_testdir -i
<DanielN> is that ok so?
<ivoks> DanielN: don't paste
<ivoks> DanielN: yes, that's good
<DanielN> ok
<jaldhar> \sh: the real talk is going on behind the scenes but you need to be on the inside to see it
<\sh> jaldhar: "serious" stuff is something else...I can go on with the distribution and I can give the userbase quality
<DanielN> i'll put it on then
<\sh> jaldhar: and gentoo is another story...i don't want to talk about it
<ivoks> DanielN: fix debian/control too
<DanielN> yep, done
<\sh> jaldhar: the mailinglist is not important :)
<ivoks> DanielN: and remove debian_stuff
<ivoks> DanielN: you have double files...
<DanielN> ivoks: debian_stuff should be removed via patch
<jaldhar> \sh: debian-devel, mostly not.  Other lists are more productive but like I said a lot of stuff goes on behind the scenes
<\sh> jaldhar: right...but there is a big difference between "debian" and the rest of the "world"
<ivoks> DanielN: no
<ivoks> DanielN: it should be in package's diff
<ivoks> DanielN: that patching source you are doing with patch: function is stoopid :)
<DanielN> ok, so i simply delete it in the source top?
<\sh> jaldhar: it's extreme in their "thinking"
<ivoks> DanielN: remove patch: and unpatch:
<ivoks> DanielN: and just change that Makefile
<ivoks> and other changes
<DanielN> ivoks: this patching stuff comes from \sh ;)
<ivoks> i'm sure you missheard him :)
<DanielN> ivoks: but i shouldn't edit the upstream stuff without patch?
<DanielN> right?
<jaldhar> \sh: um I'm a Debian developer and I'm talking to you.  So it can't all be extreme can it?
<ivoks> DanielN: you aren't!
<ivoks> DanielN: orig.tar.gz will allways be upstream's source
<ivoks> diff.gz will contain your changes
<DanielN> aha
<DanielN> lol
<\sh> jaldhar: do not take it personal...it has nothing to do with the people personally
<ivoks> it's silly to patch a program, and that patch will just create another patch
<DanielN> ok
<DanielN> so i remove all patching stuff
<ivoks> IMHO, we should have one basic list/bugzilla for all debian derivates
<DanielN> and simply rm -r debian_stuff/
<ivoks> launchpad is good start
<ivoks> DanielN: yes
<DanielN> ok thanks a lot my dear ;)
<jaldhar> \sh: oh no I understand.  I'm just saying there are some extreme parts and some not. Don't give up on the whole thing just because of a part
<ivoks> it would be silly to package same thing twice!
<\sh> jaldhar: but there are a mass of narrow-minded people, who don't want to improve, and want to deal with unix 0.1 ;) and in the end, i was introduced to many of those narrow-minded
<\sh> but I can change :)
<ivoks> \sh: true, but, look it this way... aren't all people in USA monkeys, just because their president is :)
<\sh> ivoks: no :)
<\sh> ivoks: just like not all frenchmen will eat frogs ;)
<ivoks> there should be good will from ubuntu and debian side
<jaldhar> \sh: that's unfortunate.  All I can do is repeat that there are many in debian who do want to work with Ubuntu and other deriavatives/forks/whatever
<ivoks> we should work together as much is possible
<ivoks> but not mix distributions
<\sh> ivoks: yeah...and my last bugreport is now 4 days old
<tseng> ivoks: eh I already do it.
<adn> hello
<jaldhar> ivoks: right on!
<ivoks> \sh: the point is
<ivoks> you fix bug in debian
<\sh> jaldhar: see, and I want/try to work with ubuntu, gentoo, fedora and debian together
<ivoks> but tell them about it
<adn> I am the maintainer for Debian's p7zip, and was asked by a user to have a ubuntu version for it
<adn> is http://adn.diwi.org/ubuntu/p7zip/ OK?
<ivoks> u see..
<ivoks> this is stoopid
<ivoks> why shouldn't one be able to take sarge package and install it on hoary?
<tseng> ivoks: because of differnt versions of key libraries?
<jaldhar> \sh: yes Debian may not be the world as you said, but for Ubuntu it is all the continents and half the oceans :-)
<tseng> thats hardly stupid.
<ivoks> tseng: but those diffs aren't that different
<tseng> adn: hi!
<ivoks> tseng: look at sarge <-> hoary transition
<adn> tseng: hi!
<\sh> jaldhar: in the end we're working for opensource, to rule da world ;)
<tseng> adn: what happens in the begining of an ubuntu cycle is, every package from debian is synced over
<ivoks> whole thing is so meesed up beacuse one has libc6-X.Y.Z-qwert1 and other libc-X.Y.Z-qwert1.1
<tseng> adn: if your package is in Sid, it will automatically appear in our next release
<adn> here is scrolling what I was just reading on debian-devel@ :)
<adn> tseng: oh, then no need for me to worry about it, right?
<adn> ok, great!
<tseng> adn: if you want to work directly with ubuntu you are always welcome to join us, but you dont have to worry about manually syncing things in most cases.
<adn> and when is the next cycle?
<tseng> the final release will be in October.
<ivoks> truth is that debian becomed one big fat distro
<adn> tseng: you mean have p7zip in ubuntu's main?
<ivoks> with lots of packages unmaintained correctly and even more useless
<tseng> adn: it will be in universe
<adn> by me working directly with ubuntu
<tseng> adn: *is* in universe rather.
<adn> tseng: yes, cycle => universe
<adn> but "to work directly with ubuntu" => main?
<tseng> no.
<adn> ok
<tseng> things dont often move to main
<ivoks> jaldhar: debian should first clear it's trenches, and ubuntu it's
<tseng> but we now have a team supporting universe, so it will continually improve in quality
<adn> ok, then how could I help with p7zip? :)
<tseng> adn: keep rocking as the debian maintainer is the easiest :)
<ivoks> adn: you did allready
<adn> not having an ubuntu by myself :
<adn> :)
<adn> ok, thanks, then
<tseng> we benefit from your work for free
<tseng> so thank you.
<adn> you're welcome :)
<ivoks> adn: would you like to recive ubuntu's patches for your package?
<adn> ivoks: I would be very very happy
<ivoks> ok..
<ivoks> another idea
<adn> but isn't people/scott/ enough?
<ivoks> all patches we do in debians packages
<DanielN> ivoks: it's up and fixed
<ivoks> we should put them in debian/patches/ dir
<adn> ok
<jaldhar> adn: btw, you can set up pbuilder to create packages under Ubuntu if you want to do some basic testing
<ivoks> we would change only changelog
<ivoks> and rest of the stuff would be in one file
<adn> jaldhar: yes, that is how I made those on http://adn.diwi.org/ubuntu/p7zip/
<\sh> now
<\sh> i will build a debian pbuilder env
<ivoks> this way, that one file would be easy to review by DD
<\sh> and start with packages not in debian, to put them in debian :)
<adn> ivoks: OK, then I'll have a frequent look on people/scott to find patches if there are
<ivoks> adn: sec..
<adn> ok
<ivoks> adn: this is idea :)
<ivoks> adn: we should figure out something to make it easier for all of us
<adn> I think so, too
<ivoks> i think new packages in ubuntu should be reported to debian
<adn> exactly
<ivoks> but not over ITPs
<ivoks> cause that sucks
<tseng> er?
<ivoks> :)
<tseng> you think you are going to get a fasttrack because you are ubuntu?
<adn> ivoks: then how?
<ivoks> ?
<tseng> go the same route as everyone else
<jaldhar> ivoks: if keybuks page had an RSS feed it would save a lot of time manually checking it
<adn> if not ITP?
<tseng> thats fair
<ivoks> not fasttrack
<adn> you'll have to find a sponsor...
<ivoks> ok, ITP would be fine
<\sh> jaldhar: keybuks page?
<ivoks> RSS feeds would be nice too
<jaldhar> maybe Ubuntu devs who are also Debian devs could be permanent sponsors
<jaldhar> \sh: scott remnants patches page
<\sh> jaldhar: ah you mean this MoM?
<adn> jaldhar: it could be a way
<adn> but sponsorship is not intended to be a "semi-automated" process
<adn> then they do are the deb maintainers for those packages
<adn> for example creating a pkg-ubuntu project
<adn> for debian
<ivoks> lol
<adn> backporting the ubuntu new packages to debian
<ivoks> that one would end up in ubuntu too :)
<adn> :)
<ivoks> agree
<ivoks> debian would need to work on colaboration too
<ivoks> it isn't one way proces
<adn> yup
<jaldhar> ivoks: definitely not
<ivoks> someone said here, let's gzip all patches and send on devel-list
<ivoks> we should provide means for you to easily download patch
<ivoks> but i don't think we should send them to you
<ivoks> filling ITP and provide RSS feeds should be ok, right?
<ivoks> ITP for new packages...
<ivoks> RSS feeds for patches
<tseng> eh we dont need to make decisions now, we need to have a MOTU meeting
<adn> every maintainer should have the right to choose the way (rss, mail, bts, ...)
<ivoks> tseng: sure, just considering options
<jaldhar> ivoks: It would be ok for me.  But could there be a subscription system so if you did want mailing you could?
<tseng> this could be part of launchpad
<ivoks> yes
<ivoks> launchpad is great for that
<tseng> but it would have to offer the debian maintainer some reason he'd want to sign up
<Amaranth> so we don't totally fork away from him? :D
<tseng> eh that is our problem not his
<tseng> unless we are fixing bugs in his package
<tseng> i always work iwth the same group of packages
<ivoks> why would that be fork?
<tseng> i know all my debian maitnainers
<tseng> so..
<tseng> if i change something, i tell them
<ivoks> if ubuntu developer changes something
<tseng> and we coordinate changes back and forth
<tseng> i sync with them, they sync with me
<ivoks> why shouldn't DD apply that cnage too?
<ivoks> yes
<ivoks> everybody happy
<ivoks> development goes faster
<tseng> yes, happy with me
<tseng> the rest of MOTU is apparantly pissing people off
<tseng> not blaming anyone on either side
<tseng> its just happening
<ivoks> \sh: are you here?
<ivoks> we should have MOTU meeting and talk about this
<tseng> yes, we should
<ivoks> and then go to debian with proposal
<\sh> ivoks: yepp
<ivoks> meanwhile, they should have same thing
<\sh> but right now, i'm mirroring a complete repository
<ivoks> \sh: say something :) you are MOTU
<\sh> ivoks: u r motu as well
<ivoks> yes, but i like other oppionos
<\sh> ivoks: but both parties should read something about "baz" ;)
<ivoks> and I know you think different than me...
<adn> who are MOTU?
<tseng> adn: they maintain/bugfix things in universe
<ivoks> adn: you should know that before comming here :)
<adn> I mean persons
<tseng> ah, there is a list on the wiki
<adn> I read the topic, don't worry :)
<tseng> hang on
* \sh is no motu ;)
* \sh is \sh with too much work
<ivoks> well... ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTU
<adn> ok
* adn is taking a seat :)
* adn is reading the wiki ;)
<tseng> adn: basically, we auto sync things from Debian, this doesnt always work 100%
<\sh> i hope debian.neo.pl is not pissed, while I'm hammering with 10MB/s on their apache
<adn> yes, yes, I know the principle :)
<tseng> adn: for example, we are using GCC4 now, so the MOTU team is fixing debian packages that dont build
<adn> I just wanted "names" :p
<tseng> k.
<adn> tseng: oh, ok
<adn> you're kind of porters, then
<tseng> most of the team doesnt work so much in new packaging or stuff like that
<tseng> yep!
<tseng> its QA for universe
<adn> ok
<ivoks> adn: and, wouldn't it be great if debian would have all those patches?
<adn> are there DD MOTU?
<tseng> one.
<\sh> adn: no
<ivoks> adn: so, going to gcc4 would be pice of cake
<tseng> ajmitch
<adn> ivoks: not sure
<\sh> adn: there r some motus who r dd
<\sh> adn: but not all of them
<adn> ivoks: some patches are not agreed with from the DD maintainer side
<ivoks> adn: then there is our first problem
<ivoks> we patch one package to fix gcc4, and you patch it with another patch
<ivoks> what then?
<adn> but, in the absolute, patches should indeed be minimal
<adn> as fixes should be integrated here and there
<\sh> adn: we're providing debdiff pacthes...so it will be against a debian package
<tseng> adn: yep.
<adn> \sh: yes
<Amaranth> hey, konq passes the acid2 test now
<tseng> adn: we do track a few things ahead of debian (gnome, mono, gstreamer).. but in those cases we work with debian also
<\sh> adn: so u have to do only a patch -p{1..4} < debdiff.patch in the debianized sourcetree
<adn> tseng: that is really great
<\sh> adn: replace changelog
<ivoks> \sh: no, not replace!
<\sh> adn: upload to debian
<ivoks> \sh: append
<\sh> ivoks: yeah
<ivoks> \sh: that will preserve compatibility
<\sh> but the version scheme must be updated ;)
<\sh> because debian is our upstream
<ivoks> eh..
<\sh> and for breezy+1 we will sync again :)
<ivoks> if we are going to work together
<ivoks> we should establish new versioning
<ivoks> why..
<adn> but I think my ideal would lead to a fusion :)
<\sh> adn: impossible right now
<adn> \sh: exactly, that is an utopical idea ;)
<\sh> adn: we're not compatible with debians religion ;)
<ivoks> well, if we do x.y.z-0ubuntu1, and other packages depend on x.y.z-0ubuntu1 that will be wrong
<adn> \sh: which religion?
<\sh> and i don't think about technical issues..
<adn> yup
<tseng> i think he means, ubuntu is alot more laid back then debian in several places
<tseng> software freedom, new maintainer standards..
<ivoks> we should divide program version from package version
<\sh> adn: it's the same reason why the debian planet maintainer removed ians blog the last time he was spreading news about progeny ;)
<ivoks> and other packages should depend on program version, not package version
<adn> \sh: he made a bad decision, right
<adn> an "under pressure" bad decision
<\sh> adn: no :) he followed the OSS principle
<ivoks> this way you could have 1.2.3-ubuntu123 and 1.2.3-sarge234254 deps that would go along without problems
<\sh> adn: free as in free speech :)
<adn> \sh: hmm
<ivoks> ah, monolog :)
<adn> what do you mean?
<\sh> adn: and this guy from p.d.o wanted to be the king of queens and shut down ian's blog
<adn> which principles lead to remove ian's blog without even telling him?
<\sh> adn: debian has an idea, everything should be GPLed in a common way...
<\sh> adn: even documentation and opinions and statements
<adn> you tell him, you discuss it with him
<\sh> no..
<adn> \sh: it is easier to package, if gpled ;)
<Amaranth> the big fuss over it was because the guy running p.d.o was an ubuntu dev
<adn> Amaranth: I didn't even know it
<\sh> Amaranth: who was it?
<Amaranth> i can't remember
<adn> the new one is an ubuntu dev
<adn> mako
<\sh> mako's maintaining p.d.o?
<tseng> i thought scott was.
<\sh> lol
<\sh> hahhahahaha
<\sh> rotflbtc
<\sh> I go home ;)
<zul> i just love when ian murdock promotes progeny
<adn> I just don't care :)
<\sh> http://linux.blogweb.de/archives/13-Free-as-in-free-speech...-and-all-that-nonsense.html
<\sh> i p*ssed of keybuk *rotfl*
<\sh> and he approved me as member
<tseng> so?
<tseng> he is a cool enough guy
<\sh> this was wrong from him..:)
<\sh> no offense against him :)
<adn> who is keybuk?
<\sh> well...
<tseng> adn: scott james remnant
<\sh> gentoo staff was much more complaining against me :)
<adn> ok
<tseng> gentoo staff are asshats about planet
<\sh> when I kicked drobbins
<tseng> and the users
<ivoks> i have to go now...
<zul> truthfully i could care less about gentoo
<ivoks> we should meet and discuss things...
<tseng> yes.
<ivoks> for now, bye all
<DanielN> going out now.. nice evening to all of you.. ivoks: it's finished as you know :p
<\sh> zul: sometimes it's funny to see how the politics are improving from time to time
<zul> its all politics all the time
<tseng> yep.
<adn> well, see p.d.o now, if you want to laugh :p
<tseng> saw it.
<tseng> its his blog, i hate planet censorship
<\sh> tseng: me too
<\sh> but more funnier to see: he's far more onto ubuntu then debian ;) at least he's using plone ;)
<tseng> thats a good things?
<\sh> tseng: not at all..but the similarities are fascinating...
<adn> nice evening
<\sh> hmm...strange
<\sh> ssh is not forwarding $DISPLAY?
<\sh> argl..no xauth
<herve> re
<\sh> hoi herve
<ivoks> hi :)
<ivoks> hi tritium
<tritium> hi ivoks
<tritium> How are things?
<ivoks> been better :)
<ivoks> lots of work on university..
<tritium> same here
<herve> hi ivoks
<herve> anyone knows of lulu.com?
<ivoks> herve: hi
<ivoks> nope
<ivoks> interesting concept
<ivoks> herve: planing to write a book? :)
<herve> a child's dream
<herve> evince really is a great piece of software
<Lathiat> it is
<ivoks> lol lulu.com
<ivoks> 25%
<\sh> what is lulu.com
<ivoks> free publishing :)
<ivoks> herve: you are good with python?
<herve> I head to it :-)
<ivoks> what do you say we develop one nice firewall for ubuntu? :)
<herve> yet another one? :-)
<ivoks> no, the real one :)
<Lathiat> iptables -P ACCEPT DROP; iptables -P OUTPUT DROP
<Lathiat> done!
<ivoks> herve: it has bounties :)
<herve> but I mean it
<\sh> a firewall?
<herve> there already are a dozen of firewall GUIs
<ivoks> yeah... let me just check firestarter
<\sh> u know that a firewall is a concept not a piece of software
<\sh> fwbuilder
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> fwbuilder is gtk?
<ivoks> herve: acctually, we need small applet
<herve> \sh, as I understand his point, we think of "firewall" as a protecting application for the average ubuntu user
<ivoks> herve: that would do "security high/medium/low"
<herve> ivoks: why would one want low security? :-)
<ivoks> herve: that would be ACCPET policy, no rules
<herve> isn't that a question asked by SELinux? :-)
<ivoks> damn
<ivoks> i didin't compile netfilter :)
<herve> apt-get install iptables :-)
<ivoks> ?
<ivoks> that
<ivoks> 't not it
<ivoks> lol, ante, you can write lying on one hand, and typing with other :)
<ivoks> bulgaria:croatia 1:3
<encolpe> Hi
<herve> houba
<herve> ivoks,
<ivoks> yes, darling?
<herve> for ending up with that firewall thing
<herve> I'm afraid I can't afford to give more time
<ivoks> ok
<ivoks> i'll try firestarter
<ajmitch> it won't take long, even I could write one ;)
<\sh> hey ajmitch
<ivoks> it would only need to run iptables :)
<ajmitch> hi
<ivoks> ok, reboot into new kernel...
<ivoks> i shall return :)
<herve> ajmitch, you usually say you lack of time
<herve> you're surprising me :-)
<ajmitch> herve: I just finished all but exams at uni last week
<herve> exams...
<herve> I thought you were teaching there :-)
<ajmitch> that too ;)
<herve> you couldn't make up your mind :)-
<ajmitch> heh
* ajmitch has to leave, will be back in a few hours :)
<\sh> ajmitch: we need sponsors ;)
<ivoks> for debian? :)
<\sh> yeepp
<ivoks> yeah..
<ivoks> anyone DD in MOTU?
<ajmitch> sure
<ivoks> who? :)
* ajmitch is DD
<ivoks> so, you could be our link
<\sh> ajmitch: check http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=286203
<ivoks> :>
<ajmitch> sure, but I said I'm going out right now :)
<\sh> gogogo :)
<ivoks> out?
<ajmitch> so talk to me when I get back, or email me @ ajmitch@debian.org :)
<ajmitch> yes, outside
<ajmitch> big blue room
<ivoks> you?! outside?!
<ivoks> is this a joke
* ajmitch nods
<ivoks> ?
<ajmitch> no joke
<ajmitch> really leaving
<ivoks> i tought you are bot :))
<Amaranth> anyone wanna bet ubuntu wins cnet's "Open Source Initiative of the Year" award ;)
<ajmitch> haha
<ajmitch> bbl :)
<ivoks> ajmitch: enjoy
<herve> \sh, I have one too ;-)
<\sh> herve: what? :)
<herve> an ITP
<\sh> well..i'm only taking over from this guy
<ivoks> heh
<\sh> not all
<\sh> some upstreams are too old
<ivoks> we should probably wait couple of days
<ivoks> untill we agree about this things at least on MOTU meeting
<ivoks> will we fill or not ITPs
<ivoks> ah..
<ivoks> i give up :)
<ivoks> that's to complicated
<ivoks> let's fork :)
<herve> we already did :-p
<\sh> ivoks doesn't want to understand ;)
<ivoks> i know we did
<ivoks> but we should stop
<ivoks> :(
<herve> heh, I'm just kidding!
<\sh> ivoks: why do u want to stop development?
<ivoks> \sh: i didn't said that
<ivoks> \sh: you could be good politican :)
<\sh> ivoks: the thing is, how many new packages coming into universe?
<\sh> in the last couple of days, only smeg
<\sh> and thats all
<ivoks> yeah, couse my wifi is still waiting :)
<\sh> the rest is only gcc/g++ 4 bugfixing and petting ;)
<ivoks> seriously, we should define framework for new packages
<\sh> and this will get back to debian, this way or the other
<ivoks> we should contact debian
<ivoks> what if someone in debian puts smeg into debian?
<ivoks> we would have problems with that package on syncing
<\sh> how? Amaranth is the developer I think :)
<ivoks> now, imagine 100 packages like that
<\sh> he can say "forget it" ;)
<\sh> ivoks: what about the 100 packages, which weren't packaged by debian nor ubuntu?
<ivoks> if we have unique framework for all debian derivates (not just ubuntu)
<\sh> SIP Express Router is a good example
<ivoks> it would be much easier
<\sh> it has debian/* and it's completly b0rked
<\sh> btw..i have to fix this package
<ivoks> \sh: then you take it, fix it and put it back in mutual source repository
<ivoks> \sh: every distro can then grap it and build it
<ivoks> knoppix, ubuntu, debian...
<\sh> ivoks: u see...and this is not working :)
<ivoks> no one tried
<ivoks> why wouldn't we have binary repository for ubuntu packages
<ivoks> and source from debian.org?
<\sh> ivoks: http://www.linuxbase.org/
<ivoks> participants: debian :)
<\sh> yes...and can u alien a package from debian directly into redhat, without adjusting config files and where they r installed?
<\sh> even the position of QT is different from distro to distro
<ivoks> \sh: then one source repository would be step in right direction for debian based distros
<\sh> ivoks: read the documents about "bazaar" :)
<ivoks> \sh: i know for bazaar
<\sh> thats what I said earlier :)
<ivoks> we should suggest it to debian
<\sh> ivoks: they know :)
<ivoks> force it
<ivoks> tell them that's the way.. we have infrastructure - let's do it
<\sh> ivoks: how can u force something in an democratic anarchy?
<ivoks> force bazzar
<ivoks> not them
<ivoks> like promote, talk about it
<ivoks> etc...
<ivoks> i didn't choose right word
<\sh> ivoks: there must be a decision be made..the decision will be made for ubuntu via techboard
<ivoks> i know
<\sh> ivoks: the decision for debian is a mixture of 100s of important and more important people, who wants to have something to say.
<\sh> ivoks: that is the only problem with debian (imho), sometimes they're talking too much, instead of going on with the future
<ivoks> we all know debian has bad organistaion
<ivoks> when i did my first review of ubuntu
<ivoks> on my LUG
<ivoks> I ended review with sentence "Ubuntu can give so much to Debian, maybe first thing is example of organization that works."
<\sh> ivoks: the answer will be: "Even if ubuntu claims to be free, it's the project of a commercial company"
<ivoks> well, debian should wake up then
<ivoks> computers cost money
<\sh> the descision can only be made on the level of the developers...to have a technical solution
<ivoks> one thing is free software, something totaly different is company
<ivoks> companys can build free software
<ivoks> we should talk to them ASAP
<herve> do you remember something about libosmesa6-dev or mesag-dev to be changed?
<\sh> what is it?
<herve> mesa development headers :-)
<\sh> wasn't it xlibmesa ?
<\sh> or libglu?
<\sh> now?
<herve> I don't have a clue
<\sh> which lib?
<herve> tulip
<ivoks> oh, tulip :((
<herve> yes...
<herve> I thought the powerpc package list was broken
<herve> but it still occurs
<ivoks> what will be with /usr/lib/X11?
<ivoks> i can't build openscenegraph untill this is resolved
<herve> even changing some configure/Makefile?
<ivoks> i didn't change...
<ivoks> i can and i will when i'll know default place for development libs
<ivoks>  /usr/X11R6/include doesn't look like good solution for me
<herve> quoting ogra: "fixed the build dependencys (xlibmesa-gl-dev, libglu-dev-xorg, libgle3-dev and libxinerama-dev added)"
<herve> I guess I have something like that to do
<ivoks> bye all
<herve> bye
<herve> is #u-d active?
<tepsipakki> very..
<herve> tepsipakki, I trust your word :-)
<tepsipakki> warning, some gnome-bashing on the list ;)
<herve> I'll distract them :-)
<tepsipakki> i meant that there's one quite vocal guy preaching his visions
<tepsipakki> oh well..
<herve> too late :-)
<\sh> my skype runs like hell :)
<Nafallo> \sh: sounds... ehm... bad ;-)
<\sh> no...it's ok..just had a nice chat with a friend of mine :) with artsdsp it's working ;)
<Nafallo> hehe
<blahrus> afternoon all!
<Riddell> \sh: yo
<tepsipakki> dooglus: my breezy runs fine with gnome..
<tepsipakki> damn..
<\sh> Riddell: why is kmilo not working in kde 3.4.1 as in 3.4.0?
<\sh> Riddell: just installed kubuntu today ;)
<herve> nice thread on #u-d
<herve> "I have the bigger"...
<herve> s/bigger/bigest
<herve> biggest?
<tepsipakki> biggest, yeah ;)
<tseng> herve++
<\sh> preparing again python-kde3 package
<\sh> hamlib just compiled successfully
<Riddell> \sh: no idea
<Riddell> should work just the same
<\sh> tomorrow I will recompile all new apps for breezy and put them in my repos
<\sh> hmm....
<\sh> have to recheck my X config
<\sh> then it's i think the keyboard layout
<herve> still X errors at yours?
<herve> tseng, you need an upload.
<herve> ?
<tseng> herve: to main.
<herve> argh
<tseng> he'll fix it
<herve> who had the idea to move it to main? ;-)
<tseng> he jsut didnt move my key yet, its fine.
<herve> seb128 would help too
<herve> but it doesn't look like an emergency
<tseng> nope.
#ubuntu-motu 2005-06-12
<herve> ?
<herve> dholbach see addicted to making new packages :-)
<\sh> hehe
<herve> s/see/seems
<ivoks> :)
<DanielN> good nicht all
<DanielN> night
<DanielN> argh
<ivoks> night
<\sh> cu DanielN
<ivoks> hm...
<ivoks> lots of new goodies in breezy :)
<\sh> now it goes...python-kde3 is coming...can u here it?
<herve> I like reading the english mistakes of german people
<herve> it helps me understand the german pronounciation :-)
<\sh> yeahme to
<\sh> hear ;)
<Amaranth> i love users
<ivoks> :)
<\sh> i'm thinking to fast , faster then I can move my fingers ;)
<herve> that and ogra always saying "then" when he means "then"
<Amaranth> one of them sent me a translation for smeg and another actually wrote the translation code for me
<herve> quite many germans people do the same mistake
<Amaranth> the code to generate pot files and compile conversions and etc
<herve> Amaranth, yes, I'm managing a project at this time
<herve> I'm the user/developer wanting to push the project further :-)
<herve> Amaranth, gettext?
<Amaranth> don't suppose any of you know how to deal with translations and .desktop files
<Amaranth> xgettext, yeah
<\sh> shermann@shermann-laptop:~/downloads$ w
<\sh>  00:34:04 up  9:34,  4 users,  load average: 7,11, 4,72, 3,35
<\sh> hmmm
<Amaranth> i mean, i know you do Name[de] =whatever but is there a way to use gettext and etc to generate that for you?
<\sh> my laptop is melting ;)
<herve> not that I know
<herve> \sh, try as I do, place an usb fan towards it :-)
<Amaranth> ok, i'll just have to take patches against the .desktop files
<herve> (a usb...)
<\sh> herve: hahaha :)
<\sh> an usb is correct ;)
<\sh> herve: there is no place anymore for an usb fan :)
<herve> no, "u" sounds like a consomn (?)
<herve> so "a" is needed
<herve> unless you pronounce it as "ou" of course :-)
<\sh> i thought [uiao]  needs an "an"   ;)
<\sh> think i need another holiday in an anglosaxxon country ;)
<herve> it depends on how the pronounciation of the word begins
<herve> pronouncing "i" is a mess in english
<herve> there are like three ways to pronounce it
<lamont> quantlib looks to be a dpkg-architecture victim
<herve> depending on the origin of the word, etc.
<herve> hi lamont
<\sh> herve: so it's an ubuntu linux, but a usb fan?
<herve> I think so
<herve> it's "oubountou", not "ioubountou"
<lamont> one could argue an USB, or a USB...
<herve> but my english skills are melting like ice
<\sh> or an universal serial bus ;)
<lamont> but given that USB is generally pronounced by stating the 3 letters, and the named letter U doesn't start with a vowel.....
<herve> \sh, no, "iouniversal" ;()
<lamont> herve: an universe
<herve> you teach me that one
<\sh> i pronounce it "younevercal" ,-)
<ivoks> junivers
<herve> no, sounds strange to me
<\sh> 7topic MOTU english lessons, please join and listen
* lamont shrugs.  note that american is not english, either
<herve> \sh, python-kde3 still hasn't reach my mailbox
<\sh> herve: it compiles :)
<herve> repeat after me, "the cat is driving the car"
<herve> \sh, at yours or the buildd? I mean I have not seen any announce on breezy-changes
<\sh> "the car is catching the cat"
<\sh> herve: at mine
<herve> that's why I can't hear it then
<herve> we're too far away from each other!
<\sh> herve: not too far away ..:)
<herve> well, like 10 hours of train
<herve> and something like 800 km for a bird
<herve> for a european swallow (?) I mean
<herve> not carrying any coconut
<\sh> hmm...coconut
<\sh> g'night gentlemen...\sh is off to bed
<herve> night
<ivoks> night
<herve> I won't be long either
<herve> just by the time I file another dozen bugs :-)
<herve> night itou
<Amaranth> is the new X safe?
<chillywilly> who broke my GUI? ;)
<chillywilly> fess up
<Amaranth> you GUI?
<Amaranth> your
<chillywilly> yes, the one installed on my computer
<chillywilly> hence is is *mine*
<chillywilly> muwaahahahaha
<chillywilly> um, anyway...carry on
<tseng> Amaranth: works for me
<tseng> most working breezy xorg to date
<Amaranth> tseng: good, because i already upgraded
<tseng> heh
<ajmitch> hi
<tseng> hi ajmitch
<dooglus> where should I report 'universe' bugs in breezy?
<dooglus> https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/ ?  or is there somewhere separate?
<ajmitch> launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone
<dooglus> wow, really?
<dooglus> how would I know to use that site instead of the regular bugzilla?  is there a webpage somewhere?  or how?
<ajmitch> dooglus: would I tell you a lie? :)
<ajmitch> have a look in the channel topic
<dooglus> ajmitch: I believe you, but if I hadn't stumbled upon this channel (and it does have quite an odd name) then I would have submitted the bug to bugzilla.u.c...  and it wouldn't have told me not to
<ajmitch> yes, and it's listed on the wiki as well, I believe
<dooglus> what about bugs in main for breezy?  where do they go?
<ajmitch> bugzilla
<dooglus> and bugs in main for hoary?
<ajmitch> bugzilla
<dooglus> is there a field that I can use to speficy whether the bug shows up in hoary or breezy?
<ajmitch> probably write in the comment
<dooglus> ajmitch: ok, fine.  thanks.
<dooglus> I just noticed.  if I go to bugzilla and try to 'add a bug', it offers a link to launchpad for 'ubuntu universe' bugs...
<dooglus> however, it's right at the end, and the 3rd link was to bugzilla, and that's apparently for "any issues with anything distributed as part of Ubuntu".
<dooglus> perhaps that message should be clearer - is 'universe' part of ubuntu or not?  it's not clear.
<ajmitch> perhaps you could file a bug about it in bugzilla? :)
<dooglus> heh, funny you should say that...
<dooglus> https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11488
<dooglus> ajmitch: does launchpad work?
<dooglus> I just tried using it to report a bug and got a 'system error'
<dooglus> "Big bugs have little bugs upon their backs to bite 'em;
<dooglus> Little bugs have smaller bugs, and so on, ad infinitum."
<Amaranth> oh yeah, malone was broken last time i tried
<dooglus> ugh.
<ajmitch> malone has issues
<tseng> hi
<zul> does anyone have and adm8211 based card?
<zul> i want to see if it has sysfs support?
<lamont> asedriveiiie needs gcc-4.0 liove
<lamont> love, even
<lamont> and kxl needs xorg love
<lamont> hk-classes: g++-4.0 love
<lamont> raidutils, schooltool: g++-4.0
<lamont> giblib: xorg
<lamont> libast: gcc-4.0
<lamont> allegro4: gcc-4.0
<lamont> db2: gcc-4.0
<lamont> g'night all
<\sh> morning
<\sh> python-kde3 upload now
<\sh> Riddell: ping
<ivoks> pong :)
<\sh> lol
<ivoks> Mithrandir: ping
<Mithrandir> ivoks: yes?
<ivoks> Mithrandir: i have two requests :)
<ivoks> Mithrandir: mpich and lam4-dev
<Mithrandir> done
<ivoks> thank you
<Mithrandir> np
<ivoks> it's great to be member of this great team
<ivoks> if I can do anything for you guys, just ask
<\sh> http://photos.shermann.blogweb.de/main.php/v/shermannpics/events/ish_buddies_20050602/?g2_navId=x6e802011
<\sh> the best cable tv engineers in cologne, germany :)
<\sh> strike
<\sh> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/p/python-kde3/3.11.4+snapshot20050316-0ubuntu2/
<\sh> Riddell: u can test python-kde3 ;)
<ivoks> ajmitch: ping
<ivoks> ajmitch: BIG PING :)
<ivoks> ajmitch: < fabbione> ivoks: the patch isn't extremely bad.. if you can get people to work on userland, i can consider patching the kernel
<Lathiat> ivoks: waz dat fir>
<Lathiat> for
<SquishyWaffle> Greetings, I just stumbled my way through creating my first package :)
<ivoks> Lathiat: layer7 filtering
<Lathiat> ivoks: specifics?
<ivoks> Lathiat: firewall that would filter traffic based on protocol, not ports
<Lathiat> ivoks: sounds cpu intensive :)
<ivoks> Lathiat: so you would say, HTTP OK, FTP NOTOK
<ivoks> Lathiat: it isn't that much...
<ivoks> i filter 300 computers with that...
<Lathiat> ivoks: but does it do it on like every packet
<Lathiat> ivoks: or like start of connection
<ivoks> Lathiat: http://l7-filter.sourceforge.net/technicaldetails
<ivoks> it checks only first package
<ivoks> packet :)
<Lathiat> ivoks: ah, sounds cool
<Lathiat> ivoks: but i mean like, a bit of data needs to pass for these things, does it just rudely reset it if none of it matches?
<ivoks> Lathiat: it isn't that cpu intensive
<ivoks> it's quite nice
<Lathiat> ivoks: or does it just listen to both sides before passing any data
<Lathiat> ivoks: because assumedly one side will send something first
<ivoks> ?
<ivoks> Lathiat: you define will you be allowed to establish connection
<ivoks> so.. it's posibble to ban all incoming HTTP requests
<ivoks> but you will be able to establish any HTTP connection outside
<ivoks> like normal netfilter
<\sh> ivoks: this is not new
<ivoks> acctually, this is just a appendix for netfilter :)
<ivoks> \sh: of course it's not new :)
<ivoks> \sh: but tell me, how would you ban any HTTP request on local maching from outside?
<\sh> ivoks: securecomputing sidewinder
<ivoks> you can't do that with netfilter the way it is now
<ivoks> lol
<\sh> ivoks: no joke...most of beautiful things of securecomputing is in there :)
<ivoks> \sh: but you aren't telling me that everyone should buy sidewinder, aren't you? :)
<\sh> ivoks: and I'm trained on it
<ivoks> and it isn't free
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> so, it's uselss to us
<ivoks> like UNIX :)(
<\sh> ivoks: the problem is, in a company I can't come with a solution for highsec and tell them: "hey, use this one, it's free, nobody give u a garanty or warranty, but it's working"
<ivoks> \sh: i'm not telling about company
<ivoks> \sh: i'm talking about home users
<\sh> ivoks: does a home user need really layer7 filtering?
<ivoks> \sh: i would say, yes
<\sh> does a homeuser knows what layer7 filtering is?
<ivoks> he doesn't need to know that he's using that
<ivoks> home user wants "i want HTTP" "I want P2P
<\sh> so we should make the same mistake like ms?
<ivoks> but i don't want "that an that"
<ivoks> ?
<\sh> telling the user that he can secure himself, without a clue what he's doing?
<ivoks> \sh: not without a clue
<\sh> ivoks: most normal home users haven't any clue...this is the pitfall in MS thinking
<ivoks> but home user doesn't want to know anything about iptables
<\sh> ivoks: no, they want to have things like firestarter, or "personal firewalls"
<ivoks> he just wants to work
<ivoks> right
<\sh> so a normal iptables packet filter does it for u. most propably he's using the packetfilter on his dsl router
<\sh> he doesn't need layer7 filtering
<\sh> but
<ivoks> \sh: normal netfilter does not do it right
<ivoks> you can't block fasttrack and allow http with netfilter
<ivoks> without going to layer 7
<ivoks> they use same ports (80)
<\sh> a enterprise edition of * Linux for ISPs or SOHOs they need layer7 and more :)
<\sh> whatever fasttrack is ;)
<ivoks> \sh: p2p network
<\sh> hmm........
<ivoks> one of most popular..
<ivoks> at least, it was :)
<\sh> so the return port is 80?
<doko> ajmitch: ping
<ivoks> \sh: yes
<\sh> ivoks: so it's different...
<ivoks> \sh: http://www.kazaa.com/us/index.htm
<\sh> http -> questioning port == 80
<\sh> http -> answering port > 1024
<\sh> fasttrack -> questioning port => ?
<\sh> fastrack -> answering port == 80?
<ivoks> yes
<\sh> for what layer7 then?
<\sh> filter incoming port of 80 and block it
<\sh> or accept it
<ivoks> ah...
<ivoks> did you ever fight against p2p in your backyard? :)
<\sh> it makes more sense, if u have a httpd running on your side, and u want to filter the incoming requests
<\sh> ivoks: no...
<ivoks> \sh: i did... closing ports is useless
<\sh> ivoks: why? if u want to use fasttrack open port 80 incoming, if not, close it
<ivoks> but it connects to other computers on port 80
<ivoks> and you can deny outgoing traffic to 80
<\sh> ivoks: thats outgoing
<ivoks> s/can/can't/
<ivoks> \sh: i started disscusion on ubuntu-devel, so I would appriciate any comments or sugestions
<\sh> ivoks: of course u can :) install squid on one special machine, open port 8080 for all users, configure filter for fasttrack detection and deny all requests of this filter
<\sh> the rest can go out, open outgoing connections from squid server to port 80 outside
<ivoks> and what about other networks?
<ivoks> that don't have same port all the time
<ivoks> for example, winmx
<ivoks> there is no way to filter it
<\sh> ivoks: as I said, a firewall is not a software solution, it's a concept.
<ivoks> \sh: i agree
<ivoks> \sh: but you can't have squids on local machines
<ivoks> well...
<\sh> if u say: no p2p block all p2p ports..if one p2p network using common ports e.g. http, u need to filter on application level
<ivoks> i have to go now
<\sh> but this is not for homeusers
<ivoks> topic is on ubundu-devel, please, comment there
<\sh> if homeuser wants to have p2p -> open it, if not, close it
<ivoks> \sh: problem is...
<ivoks> \sh: does user know on what port p2p works?
<ivoks> wouldn't it be easier "open p2p" "close p2p"?
<ivoks> i think that is much better then "open 80, 4111, 2345, 1234, but close 1234 and 452"
<ivoks> s/452/4551/ :)
<ivoks> i really have to go now...
<ivoks> see you
<DanielN> morning
<Treenaks> Which laptops work better in ubuntu? HP or Dell or both?
<\sh> most of the things from HP is working nicely with ubuntu...but the irda port and the sd card reader is not working as expected.
<\sh> for irda there is a solution with a separate piece of software, but the sd card reader will be difficult
<doko> DanielN: morning
<\sh> doko: u addicted package machine ;)
<DanielN> mhm
<DanielN> i'll try kubuntu now... never done that before :)
<doko> DanielN: fix your outstanding C++ packages first ;-)
<tseng> hi
<\sh> argl
<\sh> 500kg in less then 15 minutes
<\sh> and what i'm doing now with 1000 music cds...i don't have place for it in my new flat
<tseng> \sh: oh man my mom moved my stuff around at her house
<tseng> \sh: dumped all my cds
<tseng> all out of order and stuff
<\sh> well..in this case, it wasn't my mom, it was my exwife who chased me out ;)
<tseng> heh
<tseng> i dont have any of those, luckily
<\sh> hehe
<herve> morning
<tseng> hi
<\sh> hey herve
<\sh> herve: python-kde3 just reached your inbox ;)
<herve> haven't read it yet :-)
<tseng> oooh @ "Hide Read Messages"
<tseng> perfect for breezy-changes
* Mithrandir notes that's default for gnus already.
<herve> hey, I need to read again the announces sometimes
<herve> and TB is smart enough to point me to the first unread messag
<tseng> herve: you can unhide it, obviously
<tseng> i can actually have a huge ammount of mail and find stuff now, thanks to beagle magic
<tseng> suprisingly i dont use it enough
<Mithrandir> I need to make beagle talk to my imap server.
<\sh> Mithrandir: the search of kmail is good enough :)
<siretart> hi folks
<herve> hi siretart
<Mithrandir> \sh: that would imply installing kmail.  And if it doesn't index, you lose.
<\sh> Mithrandir: well..indexing is done by cyrus imapd...thats enough ;)
<Mithrandir> : tfheen@vawad ~ > du -sh ~/Maildir
<Mithrandir> 7,0G    /home/tfheen/Maildir
<Mithrandir> there's _no way_ I'm letting cyrus close to my mail. :-)
<tseng> hah wow
<tseng> 122M	.maildir
<\sh> for my new imap spool...i'm on 288MB
<Mithrandir> tseng: that's my inboxes (which means all spam, lists, etc filtered away) for 2004. :P
<uniq> mine is 2.8G and curier-imap-ssl+kmail works just fine.
<tseng> Mithrandir: ah, i /dev/null spam over a certain threshold
<tseng> Mithrandir: so i only get about the bottom 3rd of it
<Mithrandir> tseng: I refuse anything getting > 10 as the SA score.
<tseng> i think mine is 7 or 8
<Mithrandir> which still accounts for somewhere in the range of 30MB/month.
<\sh> i still have to include my old archive
<tseng> i need to fiddle with something, im starting to get a few mails a day to my inbox
<tseng> and yes I retrain it every week or 2
<tseng> on uncaught.
<herve> ho no, not "I have the biggest one" again :-)
<tseng> herve: i see your schwartz is as big as mine?
<herve> I refuse to answer!
<tseng> watch the movie.
<\sh> your "schwartz" ?
<tseng> spaceballs
<\sh> sad, i saw it only in german
<tseng> hm
<tseng> i imagine that takes alot out of it
<\sh> well..i could imagine what the meaning is
<\sh> ah
<\sh> "may the schwartz be with you" -> "Mge der Saft mit dir sein" ;)
<\sh> http://dict.leo.org/cgi-bin/dict/urlexp/20030328015533
<tseng> Saft = juice?
<tseng> iirc.
<\sh> yeah
<\sh> it's a bad translation
<tseng> wow.
<\sh> i think the word "schwartz" comes from the jewish language (jiddish)
* siretart is looking at https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUToReview
<siretart> there is a lot outdated stuff there, I cleaned a few things up, but still..
<DanielN> ah herve, i should remind you, as you said ;)
<siretart> does anyone know LorenzoHernandezGarciaHierro?
<doko> DanielN: C++ ping again?
<herve> siretart, he's trulux, no?
<herve> DanielN, sure!
<trulux> herve: ?
<siretart> ah
<DanielN> doko: i'm learning right now.. but i have a bit time tonight maybe
<siretart> trulux: I've seen your selinux packages on https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUToReview. are they still for reviewing?
<trulux> siretart: I think so
<trulux> siretart: ask pitti
<siretart> hm. okay
<\sh> yes...the first "it works now" messages are coming for python-kde3 ;)
<herve> DanielN, so "when" is to be reviewed,
<herve> ?
<DanielN> yeah
<herve> DanielN, can you tell about the debian package on the author's page?
<DanielN> herve: nothing to tell.. i began from scratch
<herve> you didn't see it?
<DanielN> no i didn't.. i saw that there's a binary deb.. but the source i didn't saw, until ivoks has tell me yesterday
<herve> anyway, I have a problem
<herve> dpkg-source: error: file when_1.0.23.orig.tar.gz has size 30420 instead of expected 30418
<DanielN> hmm
<DanielN> no idea
<siretart> ok. ToReview cleaned up a bit
* herve lost
<herve> siretart, how this page differs from MOTUNewPackages?
<siretart> herve: ToReview are updated packages from existing one. NEW packages don't have hit either debian nor ubuntu
<herve> hmm ok
<herve> DanielN, but you checked what the author has set up for packaging?
<ivoks> hi
<herve> hi
<\sh> doko: u will do the transition again for debian? :)
<DanielN> herve: ???
<herve> DanielN, the debian_stuff directory
<ivoks> herve: he didn't removed it? :)
<herve> I can guess from a comment you're a german speaking swiss :-)
<shawarma> Hi! I'm a bit confused by the procedures for becoming a master of the universe... I have created a package, so there's no point in putting it into the UniverseCandidates as it's already made... What am I supposed to do?
<\sh> if it's a new package (not in debian neither in ubuntu: MOTUNewPackages)
<\sh> for becoming a MOTU u have to go the steps of "Ubuntu Member" -> "MOTU"
<shawarma> \sh: Ok. What if it was already in Debian (it's not, but the next package might be)
<herve> shawarma, MOTU is a special status you don't need to maintain packages
<herve> \sh, you forgot a step :-)
<\sh> install ubuntu?
<\sh> oh now
<\sh> -w
<DanielN> herve
<herve> shawarma, it would be better if it enters Debian first
<\sh> create a wiki page..without a wiki page u won't  become a member ;)
<DanielN> i deleted debian_stuff
<herve> \sh, maintainer != motu
<DanielN> as ivoks said to me
<herve> DanielN, what? no leave it :-)
<ivoks> :>
<herve> you're supposed to be less instrusive as possible in the upstream package
* herve kicks ivoks!
<ivoks> herve: come on
<\sh> herve: he asked: [15:24]  <shawarma> Hi! I'm a bit confused by the procedures for becoming a master of the universe.
<ivoks> that debian_stuff is for debian package
<shawarma> I have to say that I'm not less confused now.. :-)
<ivoks> shawarma: fist, you have to create your own wiki page
<shawarma> I thought Masters of the universe was the group of maintainers of the universe.
<shawarma> ivoks: Done.
<\sh> shawarma: motus doesn't maintain packages...we r giving love to the packages ;)
<ivoks> shawarma: then you have to apply for a Ubuntu Member
<\sh> but a motu could be a package maintainer
<shawarma> shawarma: But in order to become that I have to have done stuff, but I can't do stuff before I'm a member... Or?
<shawarma> ivoks: That was for you..
<\sh> shawarma: u can ask for reviewing and sponsored upload :)
<\sh> shawarma: u can prepare your wiki page
<ivoks> to become ubuntu member, you have to something for community
<\sh> write documentation whatever ubuntu related for the community
<herve> ivoks, it's harmless to leave it, and I don't like the idea of removing stuff in upstream packages
<shawarma> \sh: 2 questions: What do you mean by "giving love"? Who do I ask for sponsorship?
<ivoks> herve: well... ok
<ivoks> no sponsorship here
<\sh> shawarma: wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUNewPackages
<ivoks> everybody will help you
<ivoks> damn..
<ivoks> hdf5 needs a lot of patching :(
<\sh> shawarma: we will review the packages and deciding then if it goes into the repos e.g.
<\sh> ivoks: hahaha u have it ;)
<ivoks> mine still didn't :)
<ivoks> warning: the address of 'H5G_init_interface', will always evaluate as 'true'
<\sh> ivoks: check the rules file
<ivoks> i get like hunderts of these and a like :)
<\sh> the package name depends on the rules and version of changelog
<ivoks> \sh: package is ok...
<\sh> its a mess
<ivoks> source isn't nice for g++4
<ivoks> or gcc4
<\sh> ivoks: u checked the other page? with the debian bug reports?
<ivoks> warning: ISO C90 does not support 'long long'
<ivoks> \sh: nope :)
<\sh> huahuahua
<\sh> ivoks: this will be your masterpiece
<ivoks> funny thing is...
<ivoks> it compiles :)
<\sh> warnings ;)
<ivoks> just with 1000^7 warnings :)
<shawarma> Ok. Now it's added to MOTUNewPackages... so now I just wait?
<DanielN> herve: what about when now?
<ivoks> typedef unsigned long long      hsize_t;
<ivoks> someone was drunk when doing this :)
<\sh> shawarma: sad but true
<shawarma> \sh: It's only sad if the wait is long..
<\sh> shawarma: right now we're in a cxx transition and it takes all our power
<ivoks> shawarma: it is
<\sh> shawarma: well...check d.b.o/wnpp ;)
<ivoks> shawarma: now we are totally occupied with cxx
<\sh> u will find packages waiting for >1 year..but we're faster
<shawarma> \sh: I'd imagine. Debian is not the fastest organization in the world. :-)
<herve> Daniel, continuing the review
<\sh> shawarma: imagine we're only 20 ppl
<\sh> 20?
<ivoks> warning: cast discards qualifiers from pointer target type
<ivoks> man...
<ivoks> :(((
<\sh> ogra: recruiting ;)
<ivoks> it's 4MB gizped messed source...
<herve> ivoks, want an aspirin? :-)
<shawarma> Can you explain this MOTU thing again? You are just the guys with upload privileges, or what? Or how do you differ from the package maintainers?
<ivoks> \sh: there is new debian hdf5
<ivoks> \sh: should i use that one? :)
<herve> shawarma, yes we upload packages but that's only a part of it
<herve> ivoks, I'd like a sync, yes
<herve> shawarma, we upload because we fix packages and sync with debian
<\sh> ivoks: sure
<\sh> sync it, if it's not already
<ivoks> ah, no new things in -3
<herve> shawarma, the motus also approve new packages and new colleagues
<ivoks> only fixes in debian/*
<ivoks> damn... :(
<herve> ivoks, still, sync it please
<ivoks> herve: sure
<ivoks> i was hoping for some patches :)
<herve> like debian would care for gcc 4 for now ;-)
<herve> but check upstream too
<herve> you can sync a new one with -0ubuntu1 as the revision
<ivoks> i know
<ivoks> i did that with wifi-radar
<shawarma> herve: Ok... I just got confused because on the MOTURecruitment page it says that if you want to become a MOTU, you go to the MaintainerCandidates page, and on the MOTU page it says to go to MOTURecruitment if you want to be a maintainer. I assumed MOTU == maintainer.
<ivoks> wich still isn't uploaded :)
<herve> shawarma, I know it's a mess, I felt the same :-)
<siretart> hm. mesa is challenging :)
<shawarma> herve: So I'm still not totally sure.. I guess I just want to be a regular maintainer (don't have time for all the stuff you guys apparantly do).. Where is that process outlined?
<shawarma> herve: Sorry to bother you with all my stupid questions when you're so busy, I'm just very eager to get started on helping out.
<ivoks> yes, there is new version
<\sh> shawarma: follow the DD way
<shawarma> \sh: Become Debian Developer first?
<\sh> or put the package on MOTUNewPackages and ask for review + upload
<\sh> shawarma: this is for us the best way...get the package inside debian, we sync
<herve> shawarma, ask yourself two questions: what have you done for ubuntu so far, and what do you want to do as a maintaner?
<shawarma> \sh: Stupid question: Where to as for review + upload?
<\sh> shawarma: here? :)
<herve> shawarma, you have to prove you're a valued member and you will bring help to the universe
<ivoks> shawarma: you can start with porting hdf5 :)
<herve> if it's just for making a package entering ubuntu, it's not worth the effort
<\sh> rotfl
<shawarma> \sh: I've tried to become a Debian Developer for ages, but I need signatures and stuff, and there aren't a lot of DD's around here to sign my key..
<\sh> shawarma: there is another possibility
<ivoks> shawarma: well, you need signatuers here too
<\sh> shawarma: u can send at least your passport copy or whatever to them
<ivoks> shawarma: but not only from ubuntu or debian developers
<siretart> shawarma: what package are you talking about? why do I think it should be in ubuntu?
<shawarma> lbtouch. it's a driver for a touchscreen found on Fujitsu Lifebooks.
<shawarma> It should be in Ubuntu because I need the package and other people probably need it as well.
<ivoks> oh, god, no...
<siretart> shawarma: ah, sounds great.
<ivoks> debian patch for hdf5 has...
<ivoks> 96000 lines :(
<ivoks> jesus...
<shawarma> ivoks: Really? who can sign it besides them?
<siretart> shawarma: I think it would very helpfull if there was a MOTU or ubuntu developer who could test your package
<shawarma> siretart: Sure would. It's listed on the NewPackages page.
<shawarma> It generates one of those -source-packages usable with the module-assistant.
<\sh> siretart: it could go with the laptop testing
<siretart> \sh: great idea!
<ivoks> lol! i can't belive it
<ivoks> source has comment like: /* Define if `dev_t' is a scalar */
<\sh> shawarma: your package is on MOTUNewPackages?
<ivoks> and debian maintainter fix it into:
<shawarma> \sh: Yup.
<ivoks>  /* Define if \`dev_t' is a scalar */
<ivoks> what's with the \? :))))
<ivoks> it's comment, doesn't get parsed :)
<shawarma> ivoks: *G*
<\sh> shawarma: i see what i can do
<shawarma> \sh: You can search for lbtouch.
<shawarma> \sh: That'd be great!
<shawarma> \sh: there's no rush, I just want to be sure that I've done everything right and someone will look at it eventually.
<shawarma> \sh: If adding it to MOTUNewPackages should be sufficient, I'll just wait.
<\sh> shawarma: right now, we have a project with laptop testing..i think we will find one with a lifebook
<shawarma> \sh: Ok. to make it work 100%, you need an X-driver, which I'm going to package later today.
<\sh> hehe...we need this as well
<ivoks> ok, i'll need weeks for hdf5
<ivoks> and C/C++ bibles
<herve> and a couple of gurus :-)
<ivoks> 100, to be specific :)
<ivoks> this is a mess
<ivoks> i'm thinking about doing debian/* from start
<ivoks> http://hdf.ncsa.uiuc.edu/HDF5/release/platforms5.html
<ivoks> hm...
<ivoks> !!! :))) !!!!
<ivoks> gcc 3.2.3, 3.3.6, 3.4.4, 4.0.0
<\sh> ivoks: sync it from debian
<ivoks> \sh: we have latest debian in
<ivoks> but upstream has new one
<ivoks> wich compiles with 4.0
<ivoks> at least, they say it does
<\sh> ivoks: uupdate is your friend :)
<ivoks> uupdate?
<\sh> man uupdate :) comes together with uscan
<ivoks> doing that allready :)
<ivoks> i should do uupdate on allready debianized source?
<\sh> ivoks: the upstream has debian/ ?
<ivoks> no
<\sh> so
<\sh> u do this
<\sh> download upstream package
<\sh> (put it where your .dsc files are)
<\sh> then enter debianized old sourcetree
<ivoks> and uupdate
<ivoks> too many rejects :(
<\sh> uupdate -v <new upstream ver> ../<upstream tar.gz>
<\sh> ivoks: resolv them
<ivoks> when i say many, i don't think 10 or 20 :)
<\sh> if u do, u don't have to make a source upload
<herve> ivoks, you may contact the maintainer for common work
<herve> he's a nice french guy ;-)
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks>  # Be optimistic about future versions of gcc.. :-) - QAK - 2003/10/20
<ivoks> nice :)
<herve> ivoks, "#301418: hdf5: Please update to version 1.6.4"
<herve> :-)
<ivoks> :)
<DanielN> herve: you found some misstakes in when?
<ivoks> then we will wait :)
<herve> DanielN, ha yes, but nothing serious
<herve> more like cleanups
<DanielN> cool
<herve> ivoks, I'm quite serious about contacting the DD
<ivoks> herve: i know
<ivoks> josselin? is he/she male of female? :)
<herve> male
<\sh> does it matter?
<herve> quite rare name, yes
<herve> \sh, for ivoks, probably :-)
<ivoks> :)
<\sh> i had this yesterday on #ubuntu-de
<\sh> there is a girl :) and the first person who didn't know it, tried to "flirt" with her *eg*
<herve> ok, I made my duty, 3 new packages reviewed
<ivoks> wow
<ivoks> when? :)
<\sh> which ones?
<herve> \sh, by the way, remind me if "leiber" is male or female
<herve> I quite never remember
<herve> ivoks, when plus the two first in the list
* herve <- hungry!
<\sh> leiber? die leiber? the bodies? ;)
<DanielN> herve: what about the orig.tar.gz size? could i do anything here?
<herve> Daniel, I'll inspect it
<DanielN> ok
<herve> \sh, ouch! liebe?
<ivoks> hm..
<ivoks> 1.6.4 goes really nice with gcc4
<\sh> herve: love? die liebe :)
<herve> dear, I meant
<herve> and not deer, with your accent :-p
<\sh> dear has no "male or female" it's an adjective
<\sh> it's more "the" dear ;)
<\sh> Dear Woman, Dear Man
<herve> hmm...
<\sh> dear == lieb, teuer
<herve> I once was told to use "lieber" and not "liebe"
<herve> because it was for men
<\sh> thats different from dear :)
<\sh> Lieber Herve
<\sh> male
<ivoks> ok, got to go..
<ivoks> see you
<\sh> Liebe Susu
<\sh> female
<ivoks> bye
<\sh> cu ivoks
<herve> ok, I'll try to remember
<herve> bye ivoks
<ivoks> herve: -r is for males, and -e is for females
<ivoks> german is hard :-/
<\sh> ivoks: well
<\sh> ivoks: das liebe tier
<\sh> tier is "it"
<ivoks> that's middle
<\sh> ivoks: right..:)
<herve> ivoks
<ivoks> das
<\sh> and it's not "dear" ;)
<herve> joss is online on freenode ;-)
<ivoks> der das die
<ivoks> herve: i've send email allready
<\sh> Dear <bla> == as introduction in a letter is different
<ivoks> Liebe Susu is start of a letter, right?
<\sh> yeah
<ivoks> das liebe tier is like... loving animal
<ivoks> or dear animal
<\sh> right
<\sh> no
<ivoks> dear like loving
<ivoks> not like start of a letter
<\sh> my beloved animal
<ivoks> right
<ivoks> it doesn't have to be my
<ivoks> or?
<\sh> my dear darling == mein teurer schatz :)
<herve> DanielN, your orig.tar.gz is ok, I'd just say to "debuild -S" again
<herve> \sh, I didn't want to be _that_ personal :-)
<\sh> 7topic german lesson for free ;)
<\sh> herve: hehehe
<ivoks> \sh: ja, mein, aber in das liebe tier, er ist keine mine
<\sh> herve: is it a friend, or just a formal letter?
<ivoks> mein, not mine :)
<herve> \sh, just to show off my german abilities
<ivoks> es ist, nicht er ist
<herve> (which turned out to be a failure, as you can guess)
<ivoks> an, my deutch sucks... it's been a while :)
<DanielN> herve: i've fixed your issues...
<ivoks> "your"?
<ivoks> DanielN: they were your issues :)
<DanielN> ivoks: thanks ;)
<DanielN> herve: without the error about the orig size
<herve> hehe,
<ivoks> bye for real now
<herve> ivoks, you stole me the words :-)
<herve> bye ivoks
<herve> ++
<tseng> hi (for real)
<herve> DanielN, I'll approve it then
<DanielN> herve: ok
<DanielN> :)
* Micksa looks at /topic
* Micksa wonders if he's allowed in here
<siretart> Micksa: hi! why do you think you were not allowed here?
<Micksa> well I sorta read "Masters of the Universe" as "elite"
<\sh> damn
<Micksa> then I realised which universe it's about :)
<\sh> need to go to office..
* Micksa avoids making He-Man jokes
<\sh> some radio services are not working :(
<Micksa> (which I'm sure haven't been done yet)
<siretart> ;)
<Micksa> I gotta get my GPG key signed
<siretart> Micksa: great! :)
<Micksa> lifeless would be a good start, we live in the same suburb and I've known him for, like, 2 years no
<Micksa> now
<Micksa> but you know he would probably ask to see my license anyway
<\sh> fck...off i go
<siretart> does anyone heard about pdumpfs-rsync?
<siretart> it is not installable in hoary, and I'm trying to locate the debian package (from debian)
<Micksa> dammit, that joke was wasted on this channel :)
<Micksa> remind me, what's the difference between universe and the packages in debian?
<Mithrandir> they're modified to work on Ubuntu in the cases where ubuntu has switched to newer versions and such.
<Micksa> are there any packages in universe not in debian?
<Mithrandir> yes
<Micksa> is the modification generally automatic?
<Mithrandir> no
<siretart> Micksa: modification is handwork. http://people.ubuntu.com/~scott/patches/ shows you the difference to the debian packages
* Micksa doesn't envy this scott fellow
<Riddell> \sh: cool
<siretart> Micksa: well, he has good scripts ;)
<Micksa> who did/does the majority of this handwork?
<siretart> well, the motus handle the universe packages, the packages in main is up to the ubuntu developers
<siretart> interessted in helping? ;)
<Micksa> sorta
<siretart> great! then you are perfectly right in this channel :)
<Micksa> not RIGHT now :)
<Micksa> I have an assignment due, um
<Micksa> 3 days ago
<Micksa> and another one due in 2 days
<Micksa> and a job
<Micksa> :)
<Micksa> I am rather behind at the moment
<Micksa> blame a dead laptop
<herve> yeah, a new "ubuntu forks" thread starting on debian-devel!
<tseng> link please.
<siretart> more spoons! :)
<herve> lists.d.o doesn't list it yet
<herve> tseng: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2005/06/msg00327.html
<tseng> AFAIK we have a joint plan on that front already
<siretart> hey, ubuntu is sooo evil!
<tseng> people should google before they throw mud around
<siretart> tseng ++
<tseng> erm doko posted it right there
<tseng> i dont understand why binary compatibility between ubuntu and debian has any relevance
<tseng> we ship all their packages every 6 months
<siretart> tseng: because that affects the traffic and rants on *-user mailing lists
* tseng ignores the uninformed.
<herve> I don't imagine if we get a FUD everytime ubuntu does something before debian...
<tseng> I don't have the patience for those folks.
<Mithrandir> tseng: please, Joss is a moron and he's going to be shot down.
<tseng> Mithrandir: rock on.
<Mithrandir> tseng: that is, I just sent him a mail asking him to fuck off and check his facts before posting FUD.
<tseng> :)
<Mithrandir> (a bit more politely, but that was the essence of it)
<tseng> ive just been sortof watching that spot in dismay since I started advocating that more MOTU work directly with Debian
<Amaranth> malone is _still_ broken?
<siretart> Mithrandir: thanks for your very appropriate answer
<tseng> and I started seeing this silliness
<tseng> Amaranth: eh, probably
<Amaranth> it's been like that for about 3-4 days now :/
<tseng> well, its only a few more weeks until we are supposed to be replacing bugzilla
<Amaranth> ha!
<tseng> so anything that doesnt work you should be pretty actively telling bradb
<Amaranth> there is a reason everyone uses bugzilla :)
<tseng> yep..
<Amaranth> tseng: well, i'd file a bug but the bug reporter is down ;)
<tseng> yeah he is in here sometimes
<tseng> im sure he knows about major brokens, but in general.
<Amaranth> well, the main bug page is down and when you file a bug you get an error, so i'd hope he knows
<tseng> right
<siretart> Joss is making it hard to follow the CoC...
<tseng> siretart: heh, thats nothing.
<herve> hard to follow the CoC, heh...
<AnHu> hello, yesterday a new version of GRAMPS was released (2.0.3) GRAMPS 1.0.8 is in the reposity. Can someone update this? You can find the source code on http://sourceforge.net/projects/gramps
<herve> let me check
<herve> hmm... 2.0.1 had a build failure
<herve> AnHu, if I upgrade gramps further than debian does
<herve> I will be accused of ruining Debian's business model :-p
<herve> </private joke>
<AnHu> OK ;-) But would make this job?
<herve> I'm looking at it
<herve> 1.0.8 you say?
* herve fool
<herve> you're using hoary hedgehog?
<AnHu> yes
<herve> gramps won't receive any update unless there is a security alert
<herve> or a very serious bug
<herve> hoary has entered production stage now
<Amaranth> it will be updated in breezy, when that releases
<AnHu> ok, that means, there won't be many updates for hoary
<AnHu> I had compiled it today, there aren't problems
<zul> no there wont
<herve> this is not the issue
<AnHu> ok
<herve> AnHu, if you already have it up for your system, that's the best I can do
<AnHu> ok no problem.
<herve> also, check with the backports team
<herve> maybe they did it, or they will be interested by your work
<AnHu> is there a project for actual hoary packages? Are this the backports?
<herve> yes
<herve> google will help you find them
<herve> more than me, I mean :-)
<AnHu> ok thanks
<herve> why do I make the assumption that everyone is living dangerously using breezy...
<herve> I even wonder if doko works for canonical...
<doko> herve: I do
<herve> hehe, you should be ashamed to work for a company working for debian ;-)
<AnHu> Ubuntu packages and Debian Sid package together make problems? I heard something about instability
<tseng> its not a great idea
<tseng> more inconsistancy than instability
<AnHu> can someone give me a good backport server address?
<AnHu> Not too busy?
<Amaranth> AnHu: the forums have a list of all of them
<AnHu> ok I will see on it.
* siretart hates native packages for packages not debian native :/
<AnHu> thanks I find it. Have you the irc channel of the backports team?
<ivoks> hm...
<ivoks> herve: that french guy...
<herve> hehe
<herve> yes I know :-)
<ivoks> did you saw his post on list?!
<herve> he plays the moron
<ivoks> he will hear me now...
<ivoks> this is too much...
<herve> easy
<ivoks> it's time to start showing some names on that list..
<herve> remember the CoC
<ivoks> i know :)
<ivoks> don't wory
<ivoks> eh :)
<DanielN> hi ivoks my little reviewer ;)
<ivoks> so, debian is going for g++4 too?
<ivoks> hi DanielN
<herve> ivoks, obviously
<herve> I'm sure doko planned it months ago
<ivoks> yeah..
<ivoks> that's not something you pop-up over night
<ivoks> ok, replyed...
<ivoks> this is going in wrong direction
<ivoks> what to say...
<ivoks> i asked him does he wants patches for 4.0
<ivoks> and does he want me to help him with new package
<ivoks> and now he talks that no one contacted DDs for cooperation
<ivoks> hehe :)
<ivoks> world is strange place :)
<herve> yeah, like I never send patches to a DD and he never merged them
* herve gazes at dia
<ivoks> the point is MOTU would be more efficient if we cooperate with debian
<ivoks> cause our number is... SMALL :)
<JDahl> will Debian start using gcc4.0? I thought Debian was too conservative for that
<ivoks> JDahl: it will, but it will take some time...
<ivoks> debian isn't conservative
<ivoks> it's just too big :)
<ivoks> what's vancouver project?
<Amaranth> vancouver proposal
<Amaranth> basically don't hold back etch for non-main archs
<siretart> the proposal sets criteria for archs for beeing released by the debian release team. for all other archs the porter teams would have to do releases for themselves
* siretart just got a real shock
<ivoks> it was about time
<siretart> the slapd upgrade in sarge didn't go well. it killed all data. had to restore backups..
<ivoks> happend to me once
<ivoks> lol, once :) couple of times
<ivoks> but that wasn't sarge's problem
<siretart> does anyone of you happen to have a breezy on amd64?
<siretart> would please anyone of you try to build http://siretart.tauware.de/ubuntu-packages/mas/mas_0.6.2-2ubuntu1.dsc and tell me if it FTBFS?
<ivoks> sec...
<ivoks> do you have patch?
<ivoks> i don't have debdiff on amd64
<siretart> ivoks: I uploaded the debdiff
<siretart> ivoks: and it is a native package :(
<ivoks> ?
<ivoks> mas_0.6.2-2.dsc
<ivoks> i have only this
<siretart> ah, the rest is in the same directory:
<siretart> http://siretart.tauware.de/ubuntu-packages/mas/
<siretart> is the source http://siretart.tauware.de/ubuntu-packages/mas/mas_0.6.2-2ubuntu1.tar.gz
<ivoks> ahaaa
<DanielN> ivoks
<DanielN> you're the one from croatia, right?
<ivoks> siretart: -p4 man :))
<ivoks> DanielN: yes
<DanielN> :)
<DanielN> AnteKaramatic?
<ivoks> yes
<DanielN> ok, i'm learning the names and put it togheter with the suitable irc nick :)
<ivoks> siretart: sorry, i don't have all build-deps
<ivoks> Mithrandir: ping
<siretart> in breezy?
<ivoks> siretart: on this amd64
<ivoks> it's not mine
<siretart> ah, ok
<Seveas> any #ubuntu ops here?
<Seveas> we need one desperately
<ivoks> guy is k-lined :)
<schweeb> Seveas: look for an IRC op
<schweeb> lilo or someone
<ivoks> ah... time to go
<ivoks> uhh.... nice post
<ivoks> herve did you read it?
<ivoks> from eduard bloch
<\sh> jesus
<\sh> why did i subscribe to debian-devel?
<\sh> ah yes
<\sh> IVOKS !
<\sh> ;)
<\sh> because of u i subscribed to it
<ivoks> :)
<\sh> ivoks: u read the thread about cxx transition for sarge+1?
<ivoks> why? i didn't told you to do that
<ivoks> \sh: yes
<ivoks> why? :)
<herve> ivoks, do I *really* need to follow the thread?
<herve> I usually get bored after the second or third answer :-)
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> herve: well, it's a debian guy attacking debian :)
<\sh> ivoks: because it's boring ;)
<\sh> and annoying
<\sh> to grown up people
<\sh> one of the statements it's really near to reality:
<\sh> Eduard Bloch:
<\sh> Really? IMO it is exactly the lack of authority and strong top
<\sh> management that has lead us into the current situation.
<\sh> Source: Message-ID: <20050605181335.GA22200@debian>
<ivoks> yeah
<ivoks> that's the one i'm talking about :)
<herve> one of the reasons I don't want to be a DD anymore
<herve> I don't have time to lose into this
<\sh> hehe...
<siretart> is there a g77-4.0?
<\sh> no
<\sh> what lib or app?
<\sh> i have a problem with the new upstream package of gnuradio ;)
<herve> how surprising :-)
<\sh> g77-3.4 is the one in the repos
<tseng> why would someone be writing a radio app in fortran
<\sh> herve: but I red it's an upstream bug
<\sh> tseng: it's one part of the package...for frequency stuff ;)
<\sh> s/red/read/ (read in past tense)
<siretart> ah
<mgalvin> hi all
<\sh> hi mgalvin
<herve> hi
<\sh> gaga...this is the second time i help one debian devel ;)
<\sh> I'm good today
<siretart> waah, the terror continues..
<\sh> haaha
<\sh> which terror?
<[Chameleon] > anyone available to consult with me on an error I'm getting compiling Mono 1.1.7 on Ubuntu/AMD64?
<tseng> [Chameleon] : ask me ->
<siretart> \sh: these paranoid threads on debian-devel
<\sh> siretart: yeah :)
<[Chameleon] > tseng: make[4] : Entering directory `/home/paul/mono/mono-1.1.7/mono/mini'
<[Chameleon] > ...
<[Chameleon] > mini-amd64.c: In function `merge_argument_class_from_type':
<[Chameleon] > mini-amd64.c:239: warning: `class2' might be used uninitialized in this function
<[Chameleon] > mini-amd64.c: In function `mono_arch_output_basic_block':
<[Chameleon] > mini-amd64.c:4915: internal compiler error: Segmentation fault
<tseng> are you building from source?
<[Chameleon] > tseng: yes.
<tseng> why?
<[Chameleon] > tseng: mono 1.1.7 is unavailable for AMD64
<[Chameleon] > at least, I haven't found it
<[Chameleon] > tseng: I believe we talked over email about this
<tseng> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/m/mono/1.1.7-0ubuntu5/mono_1.1.7-0ubuntu5_20050528-2216-amd64-successful.gz
<tseng> oh you are the backport guy.
<tseng> so should at the ver least be building from the source packages
<tseng> and not straight from the tarball
<[Chameleon] > I am
<[Chameleon] > hmm
<[Chameleon] > ok
<tseng> apt-get source mono from breezy deb-src
<tseng> but i think i mentioned before I in no way support that
<[Chameleon] > so the only way is to get the source from the breezy repo?
<[Chameleon] > I mean, obviously not the only way, but the best way?
<tseng> i have no idea if that works or not
<[Chameleon] > :(
<tseng> I have plenty of work to do getting things ready for the next release
<tseng> w/o helping everyone who wants to build their own crack on the previous release
<[Chameleon] > tseng: sorry to bother you
<tseng> np, sorry to bear bad news.
<tseng> we just cant work backwards.
<[Chameleon] > yeah
<[Chameleon] > tseng: so this log file you sent me showing success was under Breezy?
<tseng> yes.
<[Chameleon] > tseng: is Breezy still a mine field or is it mostly usable at this point?
<tseng> its usuable this week
<[Chameleon] > :>
<tseng> I cant speak for next week :P
<[Chameleon] > yeah
<[Chameleon] > can you approximate when a beta might be available?
<[Chameleon] > Oct is release, right?
<tseng> yes
<tseng> so 3 or 4 months for fairly solid test builds I guess
<[Chameleon] > so, a beta might be available a month or two before?
<[Chameleon] > yeah
<[Chameleon] > hmm
<\sh> ok...time to go to bed
<herve> hehe \sh
<herve> I wondered wether you ever sleep :-)
<\sh> herve: did u know? I'm ogra's clone;)
<\sh> *yawn* I'm off
<siretart> gn8 \sh
<herve> \sh, I'm more concerned about doko's sleep :-)
<herve> night by the way
<zyga> hello
<zyga> could anyone point me to mplayer packager?
<herve> package or maintaner?
<zyga> packager
<zyga> the person that actually makes the package we get
<herve> er...
<herve> I guess it's a debian folk
<herve> s/it/he
<zyga> I've tried to contact the maitainer but he does not package mplayer
<herve> hrm... isn't mplayer a native package... folks?
<zyga> (dpkg-deb -I ...)
<zyga> anyway
<zyga> I've got a patch for RTC support
<zyga> and no idea who to send it to
<herve> so you should contact mplayer authors
<zyga> herve: they don't care about mplayer.deb for ubuntu
<herve> hmm, you lost me
<zyga> herve: I've created a trivial init.d script
<herve> you have a patch for mplayer, right?
<zyga> no
<herve> mplayer needing init.d?
<zyga> I've got a patch for the .deb
<herve> ha ok
<zyga> herve: yup - for RTC
<herve> well, I can't really figure it out
<herve> but see with marillat@debian.org
<zyga> I did
<zyga> he has nothing to do with it ;-)
<herve> what did he say exactly?
<zyga> > FYI You are listed in the package as a maintainer.
<zyga> I know. Ubuntus are packaging my unofficial packages.
<zyga> > is my message, rest is his reply
<herve> maybe you asked the wrong question. :-)
<zyga> I've sent him the patch and asked if he would include it
<herve> we have made his packages entering Ubuntu
<herve> it's not like we did his job
<zyga> he said he is not debian/ubuntu maintainer
<herve> erm... I'm puzzled
<zyga> as am I ;] 
<herve> let me inspect
<zyga> (mplayer-custom is broken, mplayer-nogui is slow as hell (tm), so I build mplayer myself but the script could be included)
<zyga> included with officially added unofficial debs
<herve> mplayer runs fine at mine
<mitsuhiko> same for me
<herve> I wonder what happened in Christian's head
<zyga> mplayer-custom dies on illegal instruction
<herve> those french debian developers... :-)
<herve> I don't use -custom but -586
<zyga> other mplayers run fine but 50-80% slower than simple build of mplayerhq.he tarball
<zyga> I've got k7
<tseng> k7 is not 586?
<zyga> tseng: vector ops are different - right?
<tseng> dunno.
<tseng> why i asked :P
<mitsuhiko> think so
<zyga> (and mplayer is the only app I could think of that really use them on desktop)
<zyga> amd has 3dnow, indek has sse
<zyga> intel :)
<herve> zyga, send your patch at hcauwelier@oursours.net
<herve> I'll talk with marillat
<zyga> herve: it's online at http://www.suxx.pl/mplayer
<zyga> herve: It still needs to fail gracefuly
<herve> ok, noted
<zyga> herve: now it works or keeps silent
<herve> but is it needed?
<zyga> herve: who's email is that, yours?
<herve> yes, mine
<zyga> herve: it makes syncing audio and video possible on my box (and all other boxes I use)
<zyga> herve: otherwise audio slowly becomes out of sync
<zyga> herve: mplayer barks about it
<zyga> herve: just run from command line and see
<zyga> herve: (set rtc to 64 for example)
<herve> yes but I mean
<herve> it affects the whole system
<herve> it could be useful for other needs
<herve> or gravely affects some applications
<zyga> herve: I know none other but I welcome information
<chris`> Sodele.. bin pennen n8 all :)
<zyga> herve: this is maximum user settable frequency
<zyga> I doubt that could break apps if it's higher
<zyga> I trust mplayer devs
<zyga> If they tell me to switch it to 1024 I do
<zyga> I use it for a few years and had no problems but then again this is a desktop - not a server
<herve> another clue
<herve> so you asked them or read to set this setting to 1024?
<zyga> herve: mplayer prints this message:
<zyga> (wait)
<mitsuhiko> zyga: Is this a custom patch or is it included in the new mplayer version?
<zyga> Linux RTC init error in ioctl (rtc_irqp_set 1024): Permission denied
<zyga> Try adding "echo 1024 > /proc/sys/dev/rtc/max-user-freq" to your system startup scripts.
<zyga> mitsuhiko: that message has been in mplayer source code for a long time
<zyga> mitsuhiko: the patch I speak of does not alter mplayer - just the package
<herve> zyga, I can't answer you know
<zyga> mitsuhiko: it simply does that: adds echo 1024 > /proc/sys/dev/rtc/max-user-freq
<herve> I'll ask Marillat why he pretends he's not the maintainer
<mitsuhiko> zyga: I see. You want to include a init stract that does this line
<zyga> herve: okay
<zyga> mitsuhiko: exactly, It's online if anyone is interested
<herve> and I'll ask #u-d folks about setting it by default in ubuntu
<zyga> thanks
<mitsuhiko> can there occour a problem on some boxes?
<mitsuhiko> by setting this to 1024?
<zyga> mitsuhiko: I have no ide  - it never happened to me
<zyga> mitsuhiko: tested on amd64, i386 both intel and amd
<mitsuhiko> i will try goole ;)
<zyga> good idea
<zyga> not tested on ppc due to ENOPPC
<tseng> i bang my head on ENOPPC a bit
<zyga> :-)
<mitsuhiko> hey. I've found someting
<mitsuhiko> mplayer can use 3 methods to sync video and audio
<mitsuhiko> 1.) old internal usleep()
<mitsuhiko> which is not the best one
<mitsuhiko> 2.) RTC -> there you have to do echo 1024 > /proc/sys/dev/rtc/max-user-freq
<tseng> so hang on
<mitsuhiko> 3.) run mplayer with -softsleep
<tseng> you kids all want to make an initscript to set a sysctl?
<mitsuhiko> ok. i've found the problem of method 2
<tseng> did you consider /etc/sysctl.conf?
<zyga> tseng: :->
<mitsuhiko> some notebooks with speedstep will get problems when /proc/sys/dev/rtc/max-user-freq is greater than 64
<tseng> i didnt say just throw it in there
<zyga> tseng: as you might have noticed IANA debian/ubuntu developer
<tseng> i mean document it so that users who want it can add the line
<mitsuhiko> selflinux.org recommends method 3
<tseng> having sysctl settings in an init script seems very odd
<tseng> to me at least.
<zyga> softsleep will eat cpu
<zyga> I did not know about laptop problems
<zyga> I dont have any centrino cpus :/
<mitsuhiko> tseng, yes a init script for this small line is not the best idea
<mitsuhiko> but me
<zyga> I had no idea how to do that better ;-)
<mitsuhiko> zyga: Yes softsleep eats cpu power but on centrino notebooks it should be the best way
<tseng> so can you guys document this somewhere?
<tseng> and decide on a sane default
<zyga> mitsuhiko: did you learn what kind of problems exactly?
<zyga> tseng: I'm happy either way - I dont have centrinos and this is a very usefull addition
<zyga> (for me personally)
<mitsuhiko> zyga: if you understand german, here is the list: http://www.selflinux.org/selflinux-devel/html/mplayer05.html
<zyga> mitsuhiko: a bit - I'll try
<mitsuhiko> ok. bed calls, i will go
<mitsuhiko> wish you a good night
<zyga> http://www.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.selflinux.org%2Fselflinux-devel%2Fhtml%2Fmplayer05.html&langpair=de%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF8
<zyga> what would I do without google? :P
<mitsuhiko`sleep> you would try astalavista
<zyga> ;-)
<zyga> darn the relevant part is not translated
<mitsuhiko`sleep> rofl
<zyga> hey - it's beta ;-)
<herve> zyga, I sent a mail to marillat explaining the situation
<zyga> as everything these days ;] 
<zyga> herve: great
<lsuactiafner> zyga : while on the subject tell him to make a static 32bit binary compiled for athlon-4 so that ppl can play the wmv with the 32bit codec
<lsuactiafner> on 64bit systems
<zyga> lsuactiafner: I don't talk to him anymore - I'll wait for his reply to herve's mail
<lsuactiafner> heh
<lsuactiafner> he didnt respond to me so i just figured i was annoyhin him
<zyga> lsuactiafner: build it yourself - it's not that difficult I guess
<lsuactiafner> zyga : i did
<lsuactiafner> problem is there are several thousand ppl out there unable to view wmv
<tseng> im not sure that "problem" is relevant to ubuntu
<tseng> we cant do much about proprietary codecs, much less on alternative architectures
<zyga> I'd rather see that wmv is just a lucky trick
<zyga> or wait untill someone cracks wmp for windows xp 64
<tseng> if it werent for w32codecs crack, people would actually be petitioning sites to use theora
<zyga> tseng: I doubt it
<lsuactiafner> ummm
<Amaranth> jlj has wmv3 working on vlc
<zyga> tseng: I could count people that understand what a codec is on one hand
<Amaranth> i need to kick him in the pants and make him commit it to cvs
<lsuactiafner> tseng : it is revelant to ubuntu, mplayer for 32bit systems i suppose cna play wmv with the correct codecs
<lsuactiafner> on 64bit systems mplayer-amd64 cant play wmv even witht he correct codecs.
<zyga> lsuactiafner: win32 codecs are probably illegal
<tseng> probably?
<tseng> definately
<tseng> there is 0 distributability
<lsuactiafner> yeh but i dont care if its legal
<zyga> tseng: depending on your location
<zyga> tseng: ;-) think china
<zyga> tseng: think kuba
<zyga> :>
<lsuactiafner> i live in south-africa and my vice-president steals millions, proven in court and nothing is done about it
<lsuactiafner> he doesnt even have the decency to leave his office
<Amaranth> lsuactiafner: I +q'ed you in #ubuntu for talking about this stuff, don't do it here too.
<lsuactiafner> no way the authorities will care if i opened up @ winxp cd factory
<zyga> ubuntu does not like to be like your vice president
<lsuactiafner> oh yes
<lsuactiafner> just saying a 32bit binary is needed for ppl who want to break the law and live on the edge
<lsuactiafner> static binary tho
<Amaranth> most of those people don't _want_ to, they don't know
<Amaranth> 2 or 3 people flipped when i said w32codecs was illegal
<zyga> Amaranth: it could probably be made tiny bit more legal if someone had a legal windows copy
<zyga> Amaranth: and the law permits him to break certain eula parts
<tseng> well then you can go and talk to marillat
<lsuactiafner> is there a way to disable a certain package by default in apt-get
<zyga> Amaranth: *and* mplayer would distribute a program that would simply hack those libs
<zyga> Amaranth: then it could be said that the user dit this himself
<lsuactiafner> mplayer32 would be like mplayer64 just with static -vo libs totally seperate from the codecs
<zyga> Amaranth: no redistribution
<lsuactiafner> under ftp://ftp.puk.ac.za/outgoing/ there is a copy of mplayer32 static that several ppl have benifited from
* Amaranth would rather have 64-bit native mplayer in ubuntu than 32-bit static that makes it easy to break the law
<tseng> Amaranth++
<herve> I don't have the courage to read what I missed
<herve> but just one thing
<tseng> herve: im gripping my chair.
<herve> lsuactiafner, about 32-bit static on 64-bit architectures
<herve> lsuactiafner, I believe those 64-bit compiles were added by ubuntu developers
<herve> so you should ask on #u-d
<lsuactiafner> Amaranth : i have both binaries installed so that i can play wmv also
<herve> tseng, sometimes you answer so strange expressions :-)
<herve> night all
#ubuntu-motu 2006-06-05
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Bluekuja> hello bddebian ;)
<bddebian> Hello Bluekuja
<LaserJock> hi bddebian, again
<bddebian> Heh
<Erlang> home made rack from a guy in #programmeur: http://www.mathnet.org/rackmount/ worthy of mention
<shawarma> What's the difference between the MOTU team and the ubuntu-dev teams in Launchpad?
<LaserJock> not a whole lot
<LaserJock> the ubuntu-dev team are the people who have upload rights to Universe/Multiverse
<Erlang> well, I guess MOTUs should be mostly be focus around maintaining Universe packages, but I think that this frontier has been blured quite a bit.
<BlueT_> morning :)
<Erlang> BlueT_: 'vening
<LaserJock> the motu LP team is around for somewhat historical reasons
<LaserJock> for the universe-bugs
<LaserJock> ML
<shawarma> LaserJock: Oh, ok. That makes sense. The description for ubuntu-dev reads: "This is the "Masters of the Universe", the general Ubuntu development team which has full upload rights to universe and multiverse" :-)
<LaserJock> shawarma: right, so the ubuntu-dev LP team is the real MOTUs
<LaserJock> the motu list was for people to get Universe bug reports, I believe
<shawarma> Ok.
<crimsun> yep, so we could avoid spamming core-dev
<LaserJock> but we love spamming them :-)
<bddebian> Yeah we do :-)
<crimsun> you might, but I value my insanity /and/ my lifespan
<LaserJock> hehe, well it is at least nice to seperate out the bugs by Main vs Universe
<crimsun> why is that people /always/ file wishlist bugs /after/ final release?
* crimsun grumbles
<LaserJock> because they wish that the distro had done it before release :-)
<shawarma> I have suddenly been blessed with a lot more spare time and so I feel it's time to get back in the MOTU game... What would make sense to do right now? It's my impression that stuff has to be REALLY important to go into Dapper and it's going to be a while before merging from Debian becomes a big thing.. What do you guys do these days?
<crimsun> the only things that will enter dapper-updates are really critical bugfixes
<LaserJock> shawarma: I think the edgy repos will open fairly shortly
<crimsun> edgy should be open within two days, and the massive sync trawl will begin
<crimsun> s/with//
<shawarma> Ok. Yeah, and then it's pretty obvious what I should be doing. :-)
<LaserJock> yeah, I think that will be good. I'd like to test some things in edgy before I do -updates
<crimsun> personally I'm drowning in bug reports, and I have three presentations to give this week, so I'll probably be doing not-very-much unless it blows up someone's computer
<shawarma> I've been away from any proper Ubuntu work for the last 6 months or so.. Has there been any big changes in procedure? Do I still upload stuff to REVU and ping someone with the proper privileges?
<LaserJock> 3 presentatons? ouch.
<LaserJock> shawarma: more or less, we are using LP more
<LaserJock> using LP teams
<crimsun> LaserJock: (well, 5, but the dapper ones for LUGs I'm not counting)
<shawarma> LaserJock: I see.. How do I upload stuff to LP?
<LaserJock> shawarma: well, you can attach debdiffs to bug reports and assign the motu-reviewers team to get it uploaded
<LaserJock> but REVU is still used for new packages
<shawarma> LaserJock: I was thinking more in terms for merges from Debian.
<shawarma> s/in terms for/in terms of/
<LaserJock> shawarma: I think we will probably use a script on the REVU server and file bugs/attach debdiffs
<LaserJock> we did that for Dapper towards the end before UVF
<shawarma> Hmm.... I'm not sure what you mean, but it'll probably all be glaringly obvious when it becomes relevant in the next few days. :-)
<LaserJock> yes
<shawarma> So the short story is that right now, there's not a whole lot of stuff I can do to help out?
<LaserJock> hmm, I guess there is still bug triaging, we've got lots of uncomfirmed bugs out there
<shawarma> I suppose.
<shawarma> er.. the MOTU bugs link in topic is broken. Does anyone have it lying around so a new tinyurl can be created?
<shawarma> oh... it might be tinyurl that's b0rken.
<shawarma> None of the links work right now.
<shawarma> It's definitely tinyrl that's b0rken, so never mind.
<shawarma> tinyurl, even.
<hub> 516MB of packages to pull
<hub> dapper - 1.5month
<bddebian> w00t
<LaserJock> shawarma: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bugs?field.searchtext=&orderby=-priority%2C-severity&field.status%3Alist=Unconfirmed&field.status%3Alist=Needs+Info&field.status%3Alist=Confirmed&field.status%3Alist=In+Progress&field.status%3Alist=Fix+Committed&assignee_option=any&field.assignee=&field.owner=&field.component=4&field.component=3&field.component-empty-marker=1&field.omit_dupes.used=&field.omit_dupes=on&field.has_patch.used=&fie
<sivang> ouch
<LaserJock> oh freaking heck that is huge
<shawarma> Yeah. No wonder it was tinyurl'ed.
<sivang> hmm, does anybody remember how to tell netstat to not resolve ips and just show ip numbers intead of hostnmaes?
<irvin> -n ?
<crimsun> yes, -n
<LaserJock> darn, specs are very hard to wade through
<Optocus> opera from the ubuntu repo won't install on dapper
<Optocus> any idea why?
<crimsun> that's a #ubuntu question. Use the Debian etch/testing package.
<Optocus> crimsun: i thought they would send me to motu because opera is not quite official
<crimsun> Optocus: no, it's a "daily use" question.
<Optocus> crimsun: it is an xlibs dep problem
<Optocus> crimsun: i just wanted to mention this
<crimsun> that's beyond our control. Opera operates their repo, not us.
<Optocus> crimsun: just in case, this is what apt-get says "Depends: xlib6g (>=3.3.6) but it is not installable or xlibs  but it is not installable"
<Optocus> crimsun: i see
<DarkMageZ> Optocus, it has been known that if you grab xlibs from the breezy repo, then install opera, it works fine
<Optocus> DarkMageZ: cool! thanks
<Optocus> DarkMageZ: any idea which breezy repo that is?
<crimsun> no, /don't/ do that
<Optocus> DarkMageZ: i mean, is it in the universe or the multiverse?
<crimsun> use the Debian etch/testing package
<crimsun> it has the proper dependencies. Someone needs to punch Opera in the guts.
<Optocus> crimsun: of xlibs or of opera?
<crimsun> of Opera
<crimsun> I'm referring to 9 beta, btw
<Optocus> crimsun: but isn't this just the repo you recommend: "http://deb.opera.com/opera/ etch"
<Optocus> crimsun: this opera won't work!
<crimsun> god no
<Optocus> crimsun: really! i myself am aware it's very strange
<crimsun> http://www.opera.com/download/index.dml?opsys=Linux%20i386&lng=en&ver=9.0b2&platform=Linux%20i386&local=y
<Optocus> crimsun: thank you. it's a good suggestion: i heard opera 9 is stable anyway.
<Optocus> crimsun: btw, do you think they will soon solve the problem in the repo? is it of any help that i anounced you about it?
<crimsun> Optocus: we can't do anything about their repo.
<crimsun> and I have no idea if/when they'll fix it
<Optocus> crimsun: can't we just add xlibs (or whatever they require) in our repos? it seems this dep is the only problem.
<crimsun> Optocus: no, we obsoleted xlibs as of breezy.
<crimsun> modular X.Org -> libx11-6 et al.
<blanky> hey what's up
<Optocus> crimsun: neither does konqueror nor links want to download opera
<Optocus> crimsun: they open it as a text file
<Optocus> crimsun: which is silly
<crimsun> http://www.opera.com/download/get.pl?id=28026,&location=131&nothanks=yes&sub=marine  works for me
<Optocus> crimsun: neither does this last url work, but at least this one works in wget. so i simply wgot opera.
<Optocus> crimsun: thank you
<DarkMageZ> crimsun, that opera 9 beta 2 you linked us to, still depends on xlibs :S
<Optocus> crimsun: same deps requiring :((
<Optocus> yes
<crimsun> Optocus: hmm? I get nothing of the sort.
<crimsun> Optocus: you /are/ talking about opera_9.0-20060518.6-shared-qt_en_etch_i386.deb, correct?
<Optocus> crimsun: yes
<Optocus> crimsun: exactly what you gave me
<Optocus> crimsun: are you using dapper?
<crimsun> Optocus: then you just need to apt-get -f install
<crimsun> it'll pull in the empty transitional xlibs package
<Optocus> crimsun: oh, this is the method you're using?
<crimsun> Optocus: I used gdebi the second time around, but this method I just described works just fine
<Optocus> crimsun: now it says i have a broken package on my system, but opera works. is it wrong? (and thanks anyway)
<crimsun> what broken package? And really, these are #ubuntu questions
<Optocus> crimsun: opera is broken (in synaptic)
<crimsun> Optocus: ``sudo apt-get check'' confirms that?
<Optocus> crimsun: sorry for being offtopic here, but the only reason i continued here was that all my other replies are here :(
<bddebian> Fuck, I can't fix shit anymore
<crimsun> bddebian: b.s. :p
<bddebian> No, not B.S. :-(
<sander_m> Hello all. I have a quick question: I have developed a Hearts game for GNOME (www.gnome-hearts.org) and I am busy packaging it for Debian (waiting for #369928 to get uploaded). Should I build and upload a separate ubuntu package for MOTU/REVU or can I simply have the Debian package automatically imported and rebuilt in Ubuntu?
<Lathiat> sander_m: either would work, the latter is preferable
<bddebian> Why?
<Lathiat> why what?
<crimsun> "why is my pony from bddebian delayed in the post?"
<sander_m> Lathiat: Thanks. How would I go about it? Most of the wiki seems to be about manual repackaging of existing packages.
<bddebian> Why if it got in Debian would we want to see it on REVU?
<Lathiat> bddebian: i said the latter is preferable
<bddebian> crimsun: Damn mail server :-)
<bddebian> Lathiat: Oh, hehe, sorry I read that wrong
<Erlang> sander_m: You mean how to get the package in Debian?
<crimsun> sander_m: don't worry about the Ubuntu side right now. Get it into Debian, and it'll be synced into Ubuntu.
<sander_m> No, I have that covered. How do I get it into Ubuntu after it has been accepted in debian unstable
<sander_m> ah, okay :-) I thought I had to request a sync of my package or something somewhere
<Erlang> It'll get synced automagically IMHO
<sander_m> Does syncing cover rebuilding as well? It's a C package so there are glibc6 dependency conflicts between debian and ubuntu builds
<Lathiat> yep
<Lathiat> the source is taken, binary rebuilt
<crimsun> sander_m: is it a versioned b-d?
<NthDegree> does anyone know how to change the default make settings?
<sander_m> the debian version is hearts_0.1-1.
<sander_m> I imagine that the ubuntu version would become hearts_0.1-1ubuntu1
<crimsun> sander_m: no, hearts_0.1-1 unless we have to make a change.
<crimsun> a straight sync is a straight "pull source, throw at buildd" thing
<sander_m> No changes needed AFAIK. I built a dapper backage with pbuilder and it works
<sander_m> s/backage/package
<crimsun> then you have to do nothing.
<sander_m> How ofter are (new) packages synced?
<Lathiat> depends on the development period
<Lathiat> i figure open of edgy there'l be a big mass sync and will continue for a bit
<Lathiat> not sure on the schedule
<sander_m> Ah, good. I had hoped to be in time for edgy
<Erlang> YOu are in advance for Edgy.  It's not open yet.
<sander_m> One more question: Are there different universe versions for breezy, dapper, edgy, etcetera? Or is it one big universe and will breezy/dapper people be able to install hearts from universe as well after the sync?
<Lathiat> no its per release
<crimsun> sander_m: same as in Debian.
<sander_m> And the sync will sync it for all releases? Or should I still use REVU for older releases?
<Lathiat> older releases dont really get changed
<blanky> hey
<sander_m> So, if my package gets synced with the edgy mass-sync then dapper people won't be able to use it?
<Lathiat> correct
<crimsun> well, they won't be able to use it right off the bat.
<crimsun> it can always be backported into dapper-backports
<sander_m> Ah, I understand. And what group handles the backports?
<crimsun> no real group.
<crimsun> well, the archive team processes requests, I suppose
<Erlang> Under what rules a package can be backported?
<crimsun> it has to build unchanged from current development on $stable
<Erlang> unchanged?
<Erlang> meaning no changes to dependencies too?
<sander_m> Ah, just found https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBackports - I'll just file a bug in backports after the sync.
<sander_m> Thanks for all the info :-)
* Erlang looks at the page too.
<ajmitch> afternoon all
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<\sh> moins
<ajmitch> hey bddebian, \sh
<\sh> ajmitch: did you ever managed to get a i386 pbuilder on amd64? (no i don't mean debootstrap that works)
<ajmitch> hm?
<ajmitch> why is that so hard?
<ajmitch> I don't think I've setup a new pbuilder here for awhile, just copied the ones I had
<\sh> ajmitch: normally not, --debootstrapopts="--arch=i386" but it doesn't work :( a normal debootstrap does work...
<\sh> oh and somehow pammount and dm-crypt devices are not working together, even if pammount and cryptosetup says different
<\sh> grrr
<\sh> or I'm too stoopid
<Optocus> crimsun: what if we just added xlibs (which is about 90 kb only!) to dapper, just as a dep for opera, and just for now?
<\sh> Optocus: for what?
<Optocus> crimsun: \sh please read our discussion about two hour earlier
<bddebian> \sh: Opera
<\sh> Optocus: opera should provide a special ubuntu package, and not broken packages if they want to support ubuntu users
<Optocus> \sh please read our discussion about two hour earlier
<Optocus> sorry
<Optocus> \sh: only for now
<Optocus> \sh: please? :D
<\sh> Optocus: what is "for now"? now is "edgy"...not dapper anymore :)
<Erlang> \sh: about pbuilder and debootstrap...
<Erlang> \sh: have you tried
<Erlang> something like
<\sh> Optocus: please write opera to provide new packages
<Erlang> --debootstrapopt --arch --debootstrapopt i386 ?
<\sh> Erlang: yes
<\sh> Erlang: and I read http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/pbuilder-maint/2005-October/000019.html
<\sh> Erlang: no change on dapper...i still fetches amd64 packages and not like debootstrap only i386 packages :(
<\sh> Erlang: I have a i386 debootstrap chroot running on my amd64 box, but I won't succeed in pbuilder :(
<Erlang> ok.  I had falses hopes it was actually working yesterday.
<Erlang> \sh: I thought about creating a pbuilder .tgz for i386 on a 32 bit chroot and then moving it out to the AMD64.
<\sh> Erlang: that would be one possible solution for people which have i386 machines :)
<\sh> s/which/who/
<\sh> Erlang: but it's documented on pbuilders homepage and on some other resources, so it should work somehow
<Erlang> well, I mean creating it in the i386 chroot.  Creating a i386 chroot on a i386 chroot works right?
<\sh> Erlang: should...
<Erlang> it doesn't?
<\sh> I will try
<Erlang> I have not tried myself...
<Erlang> One could even create an pbuilder tgz inside a qemu VM.
<\sh> Optocus: the other possibility is that opera is releasing the source, so that real packager can package it the correct way
<Optocus> \sh: i then hope they will release their source soon
<\sh> Optocus: they won't :)
<Optocus> \sh: well, then this is not "another possibility" :)
<Erlang> \sh: poke me if it works.  I'm away.
<Optocus> Seveas: you there?
<\sh> Erlang: k
<Optocus> Seveas: (i hope you followed our opera discussion) please add xlibs to your repo (for dapper): it is the only way opera can be installed for now. you find it in breezy and it's just about 90kb.
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<\sh> cu bddebian good night :)
<bddebian> :-)
<Hobbsee> hi everyone
<\sh> moins Hobbsee
<Optocus> Seveas: are you there?
<\sh> it's 7:27 in germany and netherlands ;)
<Hobbsee> \sh: your reasoning?  no one should ever sleep :P
<\sh> Optocus: I wonder if dennis is awake...he's not crazy like me to get up at 3 o'clock :)
<\sh> which is 1:00 UTC
<Optocus> \sh: dennis is seveas?
<\sh> Optocus: yes...whois seveas
<Laser_away> woot!
<Hobbsee>  hey Laser_away
<Laser_away> I got Dapper installed on my laptop
<\sh> Laser_away: already did it many times *eg*
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Laser_away> this laptop has never seen linux
* Hobbsee makes a mental note to go back and install edgy some time, for when the repos open.
<Laser_away> it is my wifes
<Laser_away> but I"m going to need to take it to Paris
<Laser_away> so it needed a makeover ;-)
<Laser_away> 'cause I think I'd be kicked out if I showed up with my Windows XP+Putty setup :-)
<tritium> Laser_away: you're going to Paris?
<tritium> hi, by the way ;)
<Laser_away> tritium: yes, I got sponsored
<Laser_away> and hi!
<tritium> Ah, nice.  Congrats.  :)
<Laser_away> thanks, I really didn't expect it
<ajmitch> next thing you know you'll be working fulltime for them...
<tritium> Cool.  I just got back home from my 10 yr. reunion
<tritium> hi ajmitch
<Laser_away> ajmitch: I think not
<ajmitch> hello tritium
<ajmitch> Laser_away: I didn't say you'd get paid ;)
<Laser_away> I'm realizing just how terrible I am at this and I really do like chemistry
<Hobbsee> hey tritium
<Hobbsee> hey ajmitch
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee
<Laser_away> although I'm starting to think about scientific software development
<\sh> Laser_away: congrats for the sponsoring :) you will have a nice time in paris ;) let raphink show you the hidden places in paris where men have to go when they are in paris ;)
<tritium> Hi Hobbsee
<Laser_away> \sh: I'm not sure if raphink will be there (he got a job in Nice) and I should probably stay away from hidden places ;-)
<\sh> Laser_away: I think he will be there :)
* ajmitch certainly won't be there
<Laser_away> he was talking about comming up for the weekend since it is hi birthday and his parents are in Paris
* \sh neither...no time 
<ajmitch> \sh: that's a shame
<Laser_away> ajmitch: that is too bad, really
<ajmitch> it happens
<\sh> ajmitch: Monday 19th to Friday 23rd June 2006, won't fit in my time schedule...if it was over the weekend, I could have tried
<ajmitch> it wasn't too likely that I would have been sponsored :)
<ajmitch> \sh: I'm the same, I can't be away that week
<\sh> ajmitch: but for me it's just a couple of kilometers away, for you several thousands ;)
<ajmitch> yes, it'd be at least 2 days flying :)
<Laser_away> I would almost rather have waited for a dev conference when more of the people I know (MOTUs and doc people) were there
<ajmitch> why?
<Laser_away> because I'd like to meet you guys (and Hobbsee) in person some time
<Hobbsee> Laser_away: that could be fun :)
<ajmitch> maybe in another couple of years
* Hobbsee curses the doorbell.
<Hobbsee> Laser_away: is there some form of conference that we're more likely to all be at?
<ajmitch> a big, canonical-funded release party?
<Optocus> Laser_away: um, are you really _away?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: mmm...could be fun :)
<\sh> ajmitch: but we need to have a place which is in the middle of the earth ;)
<\sh> the same distance for everyone
<\sh> which could be a ship...in the middle of the pacific ocean
<\sh> MS Shuttleworth ;)
<Hobbsee> \sh: antarctica?
<Laser_away> Optocus: I should be and I was too lazy to change my nick
<\sh> Hobbsee: most likely
<\sh> This is a summary of all `failed' messages and warnings:
<\sh> `pdfetex -ini  -jobname=latex -progname=latex -translate-file=cp227.tcx *latex.ini' failed
<\sh> `pdfetex -ini  -jobname=pdflatex -progname=pdflatex -translate-file=cp227.tcx *pdflatex.ini' failed
<\sh> `etex -ini  -jobname=jadetex -progname=jadetex &latex jadetex.ini' failed
<\sh> `pdfetex -ini  -jobname=pdfjadetex -progname=pdfjadetex &pdflatex pdfjadetex.ini' failed
<\sh> joy
<ajmitch> most regular flights to antarctica go from NZ
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: I thought you didn't like the cold?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: i dont.
<Optocus> \sh: shouldn't it be Mr Shuttleworth?
<Optocus> \sh: i mean.. why Ms?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: snow is fun though - and worth doubling my body mass for, with the addition of many warm jackets :P
<\sh> Optocus: MS because most of the big ocean ships are named MS
<Optocus> \sh: oh, didn't make the connection
<ivoks> \sh: mother ship
<Hobbsee> oh...i notice that either :P
<Hobbsee> ivoks: gotcha
<ivoks> \sh: you can find MS only on boots that are from that ship
<ivoks> like rescue boats :)
<ivoks> s/boots/boats :)
<\sh> ivoks: no..e.g. MS AIDAAURA
<Laser_away> isn't MS more of a british term
<\sh> Length: 203.2m - width: 28.1m - gauge: 6.3m
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: besides, in really cold places, they tend to have fireplaces :)
<ajmitch> not here
* ajmitch will need thawing out soon
<Laser_away> I'm not terribly fond of the cold, and I'm not terribly fond of heat. I like it in between
<\sh> http://www.cruiseferry.de/dschiffe.html
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: hehe - just dont freeze before your plane trip :P
<ivoks> \sh: but.... the name of the ship is AIDAura
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: then you can thaw out
<\sh> ivoks: no it's MS AIDAURA :)
<ivoks> \sh: http://www.kreuzfahrten-pool.de/aidaaura-8-S.html
<ivoks> \sh: or http://www.cruiseferry.de/aidaaura.html
<Laser_away> oh, the british use HMS (His/Her Majesty's Ship or something)
<\sh> ivoks: "Kreuzfahrtschiff MS AIDAaura" the headline ;)
<ivoks> ms is... ah, let's drop it...
<\sh> doesn't matter
<Laser_away> darn, 424 packages to update, I should have just downloaded the final .iso instead of trying to use the Beta
<ajmitch> it's so annoying, not having anything to update each day
<ajmitch> I should go back to debian so I can get my daily fix
<Laser_away> I know
<Laser_away> I keep apt-get updating in hopes of something from dapper-updates
<ivoks> ajmitch: well...
<Hobbsee> hehe!  so that's not only me then!
<ivoks> ajmitch: if you have printers and want to test something...
* Hobbsee thinks that there needs to be a DUA group.
<Laser_away> DUA?
<Hobbsee> (dist-upgrade anonymous)
<Laser_away> hehe
<ajmitch> ivoks: 1 printer, using jetdirect protocol
<Hobbsee> then again, i will get to reinstall probably - from flight 4, then dist-upgrade to edgy.  or something.
<ivoks> ajmitch: well, just for the sake of fun, you can put http://www.grad.hr/~ivoks/ubuntu/cups in your sources.list :)
<Laser_away> ajmitch: maybe you should keep an experimental chroot around to feed your habit
<ajmitch> Laser_away: I do
<Hobbsee> ivoks: is that because you got blasted by the other guy, the other day?  :P
<Hobbsee> er, scratch that.
<ajmitch> ivoks: what's so special about this package?
<ivoks> Hobbsee: no, that guy has some mental issues :)
<Hobbsee> i dont know *where* i was going with that.
<Hobbsee> ivoks: hehe - i was watching it - but decided to stay well awya from it :P
<ivoks> Hobbsee: but cups in dapper has some seriuos bugs
* ajmitch has no idea what Hobbsee is talking about
<\sh> ivoks: your package doesn't fix them all ;)
<Hobbsee> ivoks: tell me about it.  more to the point, dont tell me, i already know, and i've already seen so many complaints over it.
<ivoks> \sh: that's true, but fixes at least 10 of them, which is 10% :)
<\sh> ivoks: read kurt pfeifles blog entries on planet.kde.org
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: #kubuntu a few days back - some guy ranting.
<ivoks> \sh: i did... that's the guy with mental issues :)
* Hobbsee suspects she doesnt know what she's talking about either :P
<\sh> ivoks: no...it's the guy who drank beer with us and Till from Linuxprinting.org ;)
<tritium> Hobbsee: that guy actually ranted on Slashdot too
<Hobbsee> tritium: *groan*
<ivoks> \sh: that's the guy that doesn't understand what's feature freeze
<ajmitch> ivoks: most don't
<ajmitch> but who is this person?
<\sh> ivoks: the discussion about cups 1.2 svn version started already in the beginning of dapper
<Laser_away> neither do a lot of MOTUs and core-devs :-)
<ivoks> \sh: i don't want to talk about KDE untill they *do* something with kdeprinting
<\sh> ivoks: and till and kurt were talking about this all the time.
<\sh> ivoks: till is not kde, but cups
<ivoks> \sh: i know, but this ranting guy is from KDE
<Laser_away> hmm, I've never had a problem with cups, but I really don't use it much
<ivoks> instead of ranting, they could at least change website for kde printing, which states Latest News: 2002.
<\sh> ivoks: are you going to paris? most likely you will meet him :)
<ivoks> \sh: no, i'm not
<Hobbsee> ivoks: and on that note, what a *pity* that you wont get the great honour of meeting him :P
<\sh> ivoks: ok..then you have to come to cologne in november to the linux world expo :)
<ivoks> \sh: hardly... i don't like KDE :)
<\sh> ivoks: no to meet me ;)
<ivoks> that guy wanted us to include snmp discovery which: a) was included after feature freeze and b) didn't compile on all platforms
<ivoks> and i'm not sure it's even fixed in 1.2.1
<ivoks> :)
<\sh> well, as I said the last time: the problem will be fixed, if you throw away your printer and just use pdf as print out
<ivoks> otoh, he has a point with livecd bugs
* ajmitch needs more RAM in this laptop
<ajmitch> or I could close firefox...
<ivoks> time to go...
<ivoks> see you guys
<Optocus> anybody have any idea at about what time Seveas comes online?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: haha.  close firefox :P
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: it's been open only three weeks, right?
<ajmitch> 3 days :P
<ajmitch> ajmitch    426  2.2 34.4 621892 352748 ?       Rl   Jun02 115:28 /usr/lib/firefox/firefox-bin -a firefox
<Hobbsee> bah.  pathetic.  :P
<Laser_away> Hobbsee: do you use FF or konqi?
* \sh wants to have xgl removed from peoples brain until it's really, and I mean really, usable
<Hobbsee> Laser_away: firefox for webbrowsing.  of course.
<\sh> all those ricers
<Laser_away> \sh: what's xgl? ;-)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Laser_away> Hobbsee: of course? lots of KDErs use konqi for web browsing
<Hobbsee> Laser_away: true
<\sh> Laser_away: konqui only...because it's fast :)
* Hobbsee only ever has to use konqi very occasionally for webbrowsing
<Hobbsee> for the howto, for getting the mozilla binaries of firefox :P
<DarkMageZ> \sh, xgl & compiz are really useable, it depends on how well you setup your system
<ajmitch> \sh: but ubuntu is the new ricer distro
<\sh> DarkMageZ: no..it's a pain for users....with all this ati and nvidia crap.....
<DarkMageZ> \sh, you want some help? ati or nvidia be you?
<ajmitch> heh
<Optocus> Laser_away: what is konqi? is it a nickname for konqueror?
<Laser_away> Optocus: yes
<\sh> DarkMageZ: no..i'm on i915 and I don't want to have a work processor which is flying in 3d space or waving around
<Laser_away> I don't use X enough to warrant using Xgl, so I've never even tried it
<ajmitch> & i915 really isn't that fast
<ajmitch> Laser_away: it's just extra shiny bling, nothing really useful
<\sh> ajmitch: not on this r200 ;)
<whiprush_> ajmitch: aiglx is much better for intel cards
<ajmitch> whiprush_: I know
<whiprush_> I have it on my X40 with an i855 and it's not so bad.
<ajmitch> \sh: why do you say that?
<whiprush_> too bad to use everyday though.
<Hobbsee> whiprush_: thanks, i'll have to remember that.
* ajmitch has an i915 in his laptop, it's not really that wonderful for opengl - can't play doom3 on it :)
<whiprush_> aiglx is in x7.1 anyway isn't it?
<\sh> whiprush_: but aiglx is a different approach :)
<whiprush_> yeah
<ajmitch> different implementation, same basic idea
<DarkMageZ> \sh, well, if u want to not hear xgl stuff, tell them they are in the wrong channel, and point them to #ubuntu-xgl :)
<whiprush_> well, you can run compiz on both, so you're stuck with the same bugginess anyway. :D
* ajmitch even considered setting up xgl with his cheap nvidia card, but it'd be too much like hard work
<\sh> ajmitch: because with 1.2GHz and 1.2kg...and the heat, you know
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> yeah, my laptop's a 2GHz thing, 1GB RAM
<\sh> DarkMageZ: the problem is, that they are trying out unsupported software...and then they are pissed, if I tell them: go away, xgl is unsupported, you are alone
<\sh> DarkMageZ: or write to novell
<\sh> on german channels that is
<kagou> hi
<DarkMageZ> \sh, oh, i see, since we don't support german in #ubuntu-xgl they bug people in the ubuntu-german huh?
<\sh> DarkMageZ: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-users/2006-June/080790.html not only on german channels ;)
<\sh> oh joy
<DarkMageZ> hmm, i don't have any idea's for the german channel, but for the english, compiz.net or #ubuntu-xgl is where to tell em to go :)
<\sh> DarkMageZ: or don't use xgl at all, because it's unsupported ;)
<\sh> DarkMageZ: and wait for official releases with support
<DarkMageZ> or both :)
<\sh> Hobbsee: what was the QList replacement in qt3? ;)
<Hobbsee> \sh: what?  no idea, i only heard about qlist yesterday...
* ajmitch might wait for xgl in edgy
<\sh> bah...this source is crap
<ajmitch> heh
<\sh> ajmitch: oh well, qlist is still valid in qt1/2 but not in qt3 :(
<ajmitch> you're trying to port some really old source?
<\sh> ajmitch: no..it should work with qt3 ...but somehow it's build on SuSE...novell crap
<ajmitch> typical
<\sh> and qlist.h is deprecated for qt3, and replaced by qvaluelist in qvariant.h ... oh joy...patching
<NthDegree> \sh, I had the most heletic time with xfs :P I got kernel panics on boot
<\sh> NthDegree: hum?
<Hobbsee> what happened there?
<\sh> NthDegree: don't use it on the boot partition when you are using grub or lilo...so /boot shouldn't be xfs :)
<NthDegree> i made /boot ext3
<\sh> NthDegree: what kernel panics you got?
<NthDegree> and /var a 20GB and /usr 20GB
<NthDegree> it was to do with syncing disks
<NthDegree> i needed to remove the splash to see it
<\sh> hmm?
* NthDegree brb
<NthDegree> back :)
<tuxmaniac> is there any minimal ubuntu install
<tuxmaniac> i mean without Desktop enviroment
<Gloubiboulga> tuxmaniac, yes, the server install
<Optocus> tuxmaniac: i think not
<\sh> there is, named ubuntu server ;)
<\sh> or debootstrap ;)
<tuxmaniac> \sh: how much is the installation size?
<tuxmaniac> of ubuntu server i mean
<\sh> tuxmaniac: not much...I don't know exactly
<tuxmaniac> less than 100 MB?
<\sh> tuxmaniac: I can't tell right now...wait for tomorrow, when I'm back in the office
<tuxmaniac> \sh: aah ok
<NthDegree> hey \sh I just compiled my 1st kernel I think
<\sh> NthDegree: why?
<NthDegree> so I could remove all unnecessary drivers etc.
<NthDegree> and because I wanted to compile a fresh kernel from ubuntu repos
<\sh> NthDegree: you know then it's unsupported...and I hope you used make-kpkg
<NthDegree> ummmm.........
<NthDegree> i used the traditional make
<\sh> so you don't have a debian package ;)
<NthDegree> well don't you just dump the executable into the boot partition and use grub to boot it?
<ajmitch> no
<\sh> not on debian systems
<\sh> on suse yes, or redhat, also yes, and on gentoo actually, but not never nono on debian systems ;)
<NthDegree> oops
<NthDegree> so what do i have to get to make as a debian/ubuntu package?
<\sh> man make-kpkg
<NthDegree> i don't have that command
<\sh> sudo apt-get install kernel-package
<NthDegree> thatnks
<NthDegree> thanks**
<\sh> ok one more cigarette and then I'm trying to sleep at least 2 hours...I'm awake since 3am utc+2
<NthDegree> well i only got 3 hous sleep
<NthDegree> i had a friggin queen wasp in my room all night
<NthDegree> and it woke me up - i didn't notice it all night
<imbrandon_> morning everyone
<sivang> morning
<siretart> hi folks
<ajmitch> hey siretart
<ajmitch> yay, another pointless osnews rant
<sivang> hey siretart
<siretart> heyho sivang
<sivang> siretart: how's the weather over there? how you been ?
<siretart> sivang: oh, thanks I'm fine. the last days we had nice sunshine, today it's rather cloudy. how are you?
<sivang> siretart: good , catching on loads of -devel and other MLs backlogs
<siretart> :)
<ajmitch> heh
* ajmitch has a massively-full bugs folder
<ajmitch> I should just mark them all as read
<ajmitch> sigh
<ajmitch> bugs like bug 48312 annoy me
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 48312 in boot "nice try....but this is alpha at best" [Normal,Rejected]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/48312
<jpatrick> that was stupid
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> and then you have eugenia filing bugs
<ajmitch> which is always fun
<zul> oooh...example
<ajmitch> bug 47949
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 47949 in grub-installer "let user boot random unknown OSes by some kind of magic" [Normal,Rejected]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/47949
<ajmitch> instructing kamion on why he shouldn't reject her bugs
<tseng> "by some kind of magic" probably has a thing do to with it
<ajmitch> kamion changed that bug title
<tseng> but its a good thing she popped her ugly head up to start filing bugs after release
<ajmitch> yes, it's always appreciated to be forcefully instructed what to do about bugs
<tseng> one day it will occur to her that no one boots 6 os's
<tseng> on one pc
<jpatrick> I only have one
<tseng> in bugzilla
<tseng> you can lock a bug
<ajmitch> something that's needed for malone
<ajmitch> to avoid submitters reopening rejected bugs
<zul> fun fun...http://eugenia.blogsome.com/2006/06/01/ubuntu-606-doesnt-work-for-me/
<ajmitch> oh yes, she can be quite shrill
* ajmitch loves how *many* *exclamations* *etc* are in bug 45309
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 45309 in sun-java5 "sun-java5 dlj license needs clarifications" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/45309
<AnAnt> shawarma: the splash thing worked, thanks for your help
<Toadstool> hi everybody
<jpatrick> hi Toadstool
<Toadstool> hey jpatrick
<zul> its quiet
* ogra gets some pots from the kitchen and makes some noise with them
* shawarma joins in on kazoo
* \sh listens to bonnie tyler - holding out for a hero
* shawarma joins in on kazoo to that as well :-)
* sivang is in a very nosiy high speed wifi mall
<\sh> sivang: i can imagine...all these wireless cables hanging around..terrible ;)
<sivang> \sh: hhe, yeah
<ajmitch> time to prepare stuff for dapper-updates
<tseng> yay, updates
<Hobbsee> yay!
<tseng> yay, Hobbsees
<ajmitch> hello tseng, Hobbsee
<tseng> hi
* Hobbsee suddenly wonders if she's multiplied
<Hobbsee> hey ajmitch and tseng
<ajmitch> I suppose I'd better find out how the rules file goes
<ajmitch> considering I now maintain the package
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: what do you now maintain?
<ajmitch> a php package
<Hobbsee> fun
<ajmitch> if I can be bothered, I should rewrite the packaging
<zul> ajmitch: is dapper-updates open now
<ajmitch> yes, it's been open for awhile
<sivang> hey there Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> :)
<pschulz01> Greetings... How do I go about getting a package into MOTU?
<Hobbsee> pschulz01: what package?  is it in debian already?
<pschulz01> Hi Hobbsee... no.. It's called 'yaagc'. http://www.ibiblio.org/apollo/yaAGC.html
<Hobbsee> pschulz01: that looks very sciency...
<pschulz01> I have created a deb, but there is a lot of QA required on the software.
<pschulz01> I'm in touch with the 'upstream' but I still have a lot to learn about debs.
<pschulz01> :-) -
<Hobbsee> Laser_away: around?
<pschulz01> It would fit under 'science'.
<pschulz01> Do I approach debian?
<Hobbsee> pschulz01: Laser_away is the one who usually does the science-y stuff, but you're welcome to package it :)
<Hobbsee> see the topic for info on how to package
<pschulz01> Hobbsee: I've packaged it.. (well, as nicely as I can)
<Hobbsee> pschulz01: do you have the source?
<pschulz01> Hobbsee: Yes..
<pschulz01> Hobbsee: Do I need to specify my changes as a 'diff'?
* Hobbsee wonders what the protocol is for this
<Hobbsee> pschulz01: i believe that one of the MOTU's has a look at the source
<pschulz01> I'll put it on a website then...
<pschulz01> .. and then come back. Is there an email for Laser_away?
<ajmitch> if it's a new package, put it on REVU
<pschulz01> How? Sorry, new to REVU/MOTU.
<pschulz01> Ahhh.. found https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<pschulz01> To confirm.. the steps are 1) Send keyid to keyring@tiber.tauware.de. 2) Upload package.
<ajmitch> send key, wait for key to be added to keyring, then upload
<pschulz01> ajmitch, approx. 5 mins?
<pschulz01> ajmitch, approx. 5 mins to wait?
<ajmitch> it's added by a person :)
<pschulz01> ajmitch, cheers.. is just the 8 hexdigit key required? (My key has been loaded into launchpad)
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> sign your email too
<pschulz01> ajmitch, Hmm.. lucky you said that... I was about to use gmail.
<pschulz01> ajmitch, email away :-)
<ajmitch> ok
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ajmitch> hi bddebian
<ajmitch> pschulz01: done
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<ajmitch> pschulz01: a password will be created when you upload your first package, the username being the email address on the gpg key
<pschulz01> ajmitch: My packaging isn't very 'nice', but it does produce a deb. It is also isn't complete.. not all binaries a built. Happy to upload it though.
<ajmitch> you'll eventually get people reviewing it & commenting on it
<bddebian> That reminds me, how far behind are we on REVU?
<pschulz01> Cool! I hope they don't throwup first though.
<ajmitch> bddebian: probably very far
<bddebian> Yeah, I was thinking about hitting REVU for a little bit
<bddebian> Though I am probably not the worlds greatest reviewer :-(
<\sh> go for it barry
<Hobbsee> hey bddebian
<ajmitch> as long as you get most of the problems & give some helpful tips, it's fine
<bddebian> Heya Hobbsee
* ajmitch should probably stay away from REVU
* Erlang whispers "k-p-l" to bddebian 
<bddebian> k-p-l?
<pschulz01> ajmitch, Uploading source...
<pschulz01> ajmitch, Having a problem...thought the upload was having problems with not being 'passive' ftp.. so I stoped it..
<ajmitch> and now you can't upload
<pschulz01> :-)
<pschulz01> (Sorry to be a pain.)
<ajmitch> I've cleared it
<pschulz01> Trying again..
<pschulz01> Thanks.
<pschulz01> (Slow dialup connection)
* ajmitch tries to remember the days of dialup
<Hobbsee> icky.  dont remind me!
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: only one update for dapper?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: there will be more :P
* ajmitch thinks -devel has just got too OT
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: haha.   let them have a break :P
<Hobbsee> they cant upload yet anyway...
<Hobbsee> it's the *one* chance for them all to be a bit crazy
<ajmitch> no, but there are people doing work for dapper-updatesa
<Hobbsee> true
<ajmitch> hm, TB meeting in 6 hours
<ajmitch> 8AM is far too early to wake up
<tseng> ajmitch: i am dying
<bddebian> 6 hours??
<bddebian> Today is only 6/5
<tseng> i walked this guy through building an ubuntu box with ethereal in another data center
<ajmitch> ok, sorry
<tseng> he gets 2 more servers for it
<ajmitch> bddebian: you said 20:00, I thought you meant today :)
<tseng> some admins out there insist on installing suse
<ajmitch> sad
<jsgotangco> tsk
<bddebian> ajmitch: 6/6 :-)
<tseng> i am not testing/supporting my code on suse
<tseng> sucks to be him.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: whiner.
<bddebian> hehe
<ajmitch> bddebian: already 6/6 here
<bddebian> Ack
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you're so kind
* Hobbsee wishes her meeting was at 81
<Hobbsee> !
<\sh> TB meeting?
<\sh> should I put my name on the list for ubuntu-dev rights? ;)
<ajmitch> \sh: depends if they'll have you
<bddebian> \sh: Nah, you are banned ;-P
<\sh> bddebian: I'm deactivated btw ;)
<bddebian> :'-(
<ajmitch> pschulz01_away: you did upload the .changes file, right?
<ajmitch> ah, it's still uploading..
<Hobbsee> bddebian: go for it
<zul> \sh: go for it
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Go for what?
<Hobbsee> bddebian: whatever you were goign to go for in the TB meeting tomorrow...
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: we're still waiting for you to apply
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: keep waiting :P
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Oh I have applied for main, though I am not sure why :)
<Hobbsee> bddebian: that's what i thought at first, then wondered if you had MOTU rights at all
* Hobbsee probably will go for MOTU.  at some point.
<\sh> Hobbsee: bddebian was my padavan
* bddebian seems to recall doing some uploads for Hobbsee... Sheesh :-)
<bddebian> \sh: :-)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> hey!  i'ts after midnight, and i've forgotten who i sent various bits to...
* ajmitch ought to sleep sometime before dawn
<Hobbsee> i think i sent them to you, ajmitch and zaka*me...and maybe a couple of dholbach.
<Hobbsee> too many to remmeber.
<ajmitch> someone says 'too many to remember' & still doesn't want to go for MOTU...
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: yes, you should.
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> that was more or less the same thing over and over :P
<bddebian> :-)
<Hobbsee> pschulz01_away: another aussie hey?  cool
<ajmitch> sigh, not another one...
<zul> thats what the world needs more dingos
<bddebian> hehe
<Hobbsee> hehe @ ajmitch
<Hobbsee> just another one, to boss you around :P
<ajmitch> yay
<Hobbsee> :P
<thierryn> lifeless : ping
<lifeless> thierryn: whats up ?
<thierryn> lifeless : could you change the topic? I think we are no longer in feature freeze since dapper is out :P
<tuxmaniac> heya gang
<phanatic> hi people
<bddebian> Heya phanatic
<phanatic> heya bddebian
<NthDegree> does anyone know how to change the gcc version used for compiling
<\sh> CC=gcc-3.3 e.g.
<NthDegree> thanks
<NthDegree> i'm trying to make a wine x86_64 package
<NthDegree> and it gives me this error checking for C compiler default output file name... configure: error: C compiler cannot create executables
<\sh> hahaha
<\sh> NthDegree: that won't work
<NthDegree> does now
<\sh> NthDegree: you won't get it running ;)
<NthDegree> well after putting your example it is configuring
<\sh> NthDegree: you can run 64bit applications of windows with it :)
<\sh> NthDegree: but no 32bit applications on 64bit ;)
<\sh> NthDegree: and I think that's what you want
<NthDegree> actually windows has it's own compatibility layer for that
<\sh> NthDegree: windows yes, but not wine
<NthDegree> but i'm kinda doing this to fill a hole in the package repos
<\sh> NthDegree: and if you compile wine on amd64 you'll get 64bit support, but no 32bit support
<\sh> NthDegree: hole in the package repos?
<NthDegree> i know
<NthDegree> and it won't compile :(
<crimsun> wouldn't you want a "32-bit" wine in a "32-bit" chroot, then?
<NthDegree> crimsun there is no 64 bit wine package right now
<NthDegree> isn't it better to fill a gap as some apps may need it
<\sh> NthDegree: with purpose
<\sh> NthDegree: the 64bit support is very unstable
<\sh> NthDegree: and there are no 64bit windows applications at all
<NthDegree> i can tell, it wont compile easily
<crimsun> I'm fairly certain \sh tried this many months ago.
<\sh> NthDegree: I was reponsible for the package...I know about what I'm talking
<NthDegree> why is it that barely anything seems to compile for me
<\sh> crimsun: well, yes :)
<NthDegree> \sh have you any tips for making a good system for compiling source code
<NthDegree> i feel like i'm missing something massively
<\sh> NthDegree: pbuilder?
<\sh> NthDegree: or a debootstrap chroot for testing
* _ion uses sbuild
<NthDegree> i've never done a proper chroot before, except in gentoo
<LaserJock> NthDegree: the question might be, what are you trying to do?
<LaserJock> build packages?
<\sh> NthDegree: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapChroot
<NthDegree> ok i'm setting it up
<NthDegree> i take it that this is like having a separate system
<ajmitch> yep
<\sh> NthDegree: exactly
<NthDegree> ah poo lol if only I had known then I wouldn't have clogged up this system with development bits
<_ion> nthdegree: sudo debfoster
<NthDegree> debfoster?
<_ion> nthdegree: You may install development stuff temporarily with apt-get and then remove them with debfoster. To install stuff "permanently" you may run sudo debfoster packagename
<NthDegree> oh
<_ion> nthdegree: Of course that doesn't remove the need for a chroot environment for testing.
<_ion> But that is handy for development.
<NthDegree> i'll probably have to move my chroot to a separate fs
<_ion> Why?
<NthDegree> well i like both kubuntu and xubuntu
<NthDegree> and i like my system clean so i'd multiboot them with shared /home, /boot and /var/chroot
<\sh> NthDegree: you can run kubuntu and xubuntu on one machine...and if you are cool gnome as well
<NthDegree> yes but that is not as clean as a multiboot
<NthDegree> i think i'll compile qtella if it isn't already done yet
<hub> hey guys
<ajmitch> hey hub
<LaserJock> hi hub
<bddebian> Heya hub
<highvoltage> hey hub
<_ion> hola        hub
<\sh> hey hub
<magnon> hey hub
<LaserJock> wow, that's a pretty good "hey guys" response :-)
<highvoltage> hey _ion
* highvoltage thinks so too
<highvoltage> i like _ion's continuation of the ladder.
<highvoltage> _ion++
<LaserJock> hehe
<ajmitch> artfully done
<hub> wow
* ajmitch never gets greeted that enthusiastically :)
<bddebian> heh
<LaserJock> me neither, I get more like "go home you lazy bum!" ;-)
<bddebian> HI AJMITCH
<hub> bddebian: capslock
<bddebian> No, that was enthusiasm :_)
<ajmitch> no it wasn't
<highvoltage> hi  ajmitch
<ajmitch> that was just bddebian trying to compensate :P
<highvoltage> *pink pony hello*
<ajmitch> haha
<LaserJock> lol
<ajmitch> I suppose it's about time for me to sleep
<highvoltage> goodnight ajmitch
<LaserJock> darn it, I so want an Ubuntu logoed pony :-)
* _ion has no caps lock. :-(
<_ion> An evil ctrl button has taken over it.
* ajmitch wonders if 5:30AM is a sane time to be trying to sleep
<bddebian> Sure, why not
<LaserJock> http://www.cafepress.com/ubuntushop/ is totally missing a pony, who wants a stupid teddy bear anyway? :-)
* _ion wonders if the dog is included with "Ubuntu Dog T"
<bddebian> Ohh, the Ubuntu Thong.  Now I can replace my Debian one.. ;-P
<LaserJock> eeewwwwwwww
<tseng> ...
* LaserJock runs to the garbage can to throw up, brb
<bddebian> Oh, you mean you don't want me to send you the Debian one?? ;-P
<ajmitch> kickban!
<LaserJock> no, I have enough Debian crap to deal with :p
<highvoltage> i would buy ubuntu underwear, if it looked better. the ubuntu logo on the cafepress underwear is just too small.
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [+o tseng]  by ChanServ
<highvoltage> size matters with underwear :)
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [+b *!*=bdefrees@*.ottens.com]  by tseng
* bddebian was kicked off #ubuntu-motu by tseng (tseng)
<tseng> done and done
<\sh> highvoltage: hmmm...
<\sh> lol
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [-b *!*=bdefrees@*.ottens.com]  by tseng
<ajmitch> hah
<highvoltage> i wouldn't want to take off my clothes and have a girl see that i have a small ubuntu logo...
<tseng> bddebian: <3
<bddebian> Man, rough crowd :-)
<bddebian> highvoltage: hehe
<LaserJock> highvoltage: lol
* ajmitch leaves while he still can
<ajmitch> night all
<LaserJock> cya ajmitch
<\sh> cu ajmitch
<\sh> have a good night
<highvoltage> night ajmitch
* \sh is thinking about a kubunu logo on his bum
<zul> ajmitch: you'll be back
<highvoltage> \sh: you know, some people might say that that would be appropriate ;)
<bddebian> Gnight ajmitch
<bddebian> \sh: You got the Ubuntu logo tattooed on your bum? :-)
<LaserJock> highvoltage: you just need to get the Ubuntu bumper stick ;-)
<\sh> bddebian: it's just a thought ;)
<bddebian> That's hard core man :-)
<highvoltage> LaserJock: i have an ubuntu bumper sticker on my car
<bddebian> Maybe if I ever make core-dev I'll get an Ubuntu tattoo :-)
<\sh> bddebian: or the edubuntu logo as tribal round my upper arm
<highvoltage> i should actually put ubuntu stickers on my motorbike too...
<\sh> let's start a wiki page
<LaserJock> hehe, wonder if Mark's got a no-name-yet.com tattoo
* \sh 's laptop is looking like a trunk who travelled around the work
<\sh> s/work/world/
<LaserJock> \sh: I'd say get the artwork team involved, but it might take them a while to come up with something ;-)
<\sh> 2 ubuntu sticker, one go-opensource sticker, one combots sticker and one opensuse sticker
<highvoltage> \sh: where did you get the go-opensource sticker?
<\sh> highvoltage: linuxtag :) I have as well a opensuse shirt and baseball cap ;)
<highvoltage> cool :)
<\sh> highvoltage: other people had to pay for those gadgets, I got them for free ;)
* \sh has one ubuntu mug and one kubuntu mug, but no ubuntu or kubuntu t-shirt...but a gentoo and debian shirt ;)
<\sh> and next week everything will be delivered to my son ;)
* LaserJock is envious. He has no stickers or any computer related paraphernalia
<\sh> LaserJock: you are going to paris?
<highvoltage> LaserJock: i'll bring some along later this month :)
<\sh> LaserJock: if so, take a role of ubuntu stickers with you ;)
<\sh> brb....need to pack my bag for tomorrow morning
<LaserJock> highvoltage: great
<LaserJock> yes, I'll have to start my collection at Paris
<LaserJock> I used to have a cool "LaserJock" sticker from a laser company on my computer (hence the nick)
<LaserJock> OT: has anybody ever had problems where with IMAP read emails don't stay read but go back to unread after a few minutes?
<LaserJock> hmm, I'll take that as a no for now
<crimsun> LaserJock: yes, I have when accidentally running multiple imap clients
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> at the same time?
<crimsun> yep
<crimsun> it's pretty easy to lose track of mutts in screens
<LaserJock> yeah, I can imagine
<LaserJock> I use Mail.app and thunderbird and mutt, but not usually at the same time
<LaserJock> I do notice on the server though that I have 4 imapd processes going
<LaserJock> darn, but then I closed Mail.app and they all went away
<crimsun> yay, -updates is working
<LaserJock> crimsun:hmm, looks my problem is a know bug in Mail.app going back to at least Jan. and Apple doesn't seem to want to fix all that much. Go Apple! ;-)
<crimsun> Confirmed -> Rejected !
<LaserJock> righteo
<LaserJock> hmm, know what am I going to use, MS Entourage?
* tuxmaniac heads to launchpad after a long time to do some bug triaging
<highvoltage> MS Entourage? is that an MS font or something?
<LaserJock> that is the MS mail app in OS X
<LaserJock> i.e. the OS X version of Outlook
* highvoltage spits at it
<LaserJock> hehe, it actually isn't too bad
<LaserJock> but I'm finding in general that some of the OSX apps just plain suck. But maybe I've been using Linux too long
<NthDegree> this is gonna sound retarded but what's the Qt header package called?
<\sh> libqt3-mt-dev
<NthDegree> ok now that's weird
<NthDegree> i have that installed
<\sh> but you don't find the qt headers?
<\sh> well, because the qtdir is /usr/share/qt3/ ;)
<NthDegree> so i have to go modify the configure file then?
<\sh> NthDegree: yes
<\sh> --with-qt-dir=/usr/share/qt3 should help
<NthDegree> ok now it's time to fetch kde with apt-get build-dep ktorrent :)
<NthDegree> thanks \sh
<\sh> hmmm..ktorrent is there ;)
<NthDegree> i know
<NthDegree> i am doing qtella
<NthDegree> but most of the same stuff is used for ktorrent
<_ion> About warsow: 5. I've seen this game is GPL'd. Where can I get the source? What about the media?
<_ion> Direct a request by email to the contact address, which is found in the docs folder, and you'll get a download url in the response.
<_ion> The media is copyrighted, and will remain artist's property unless we abandon this project. In that case, we will ask the artist for their permission to make the media gpl.
<hub> any beagle packager here?
<tseng> hub: yes?
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [-o tseng]  by tseng
<hub> tseng: why is it configure with --disable-evolution?
<tseng> is it?
<tseng> it has evo enabled
<tseng> but it gets split into beagle-backend-evolution
<\sh> _ion: so no joy for a package
<Kyral_FreeBSD> So if you don't like or have Evolution then you don't need it for Beagle :P
<hub> tseng: ah weird. my mistake
<tseng> hub: np
<hub> tseng: on the other wv support seems not to be enabled
<tseng> thats right
<hub> why?
<tseng> we just got a usable wv package pretty late iirc
<tseng> and it broke api
<tseng> didnt want to do it in dapper
<hub> tseng: I posted them a while ago in REVU
<hub> nobody did even look at them
<_ion> sh: Well, maybe the artist would permit the redistribution of the media if asked. Then it could go to multiverse, right?
<tseng> i looked
<tseng> but I couldnt do it for dapper
<tseng> we will get it in edgy
<tseng> keep on top of it
<hub> okay
<hub> it is required for AbiWord-HEAD anyway
<\sh> _ion: the main app could go in universe if it's gpl, but the media..needs a good license and redistribution license for multiverse
<_ion> sh: My point is that maybe they give exactly that if someone asked nicely. :-)
<\sh> _ion: how many people we have to ask?
<_ion> solomonk@warsow.net would be a good starting point
<sladen> _ion: I did some work on trying to get warsow to do useful things
<sladen> _ion: and pb`` is the coder who actually knows things
<sladen> solomonk seems to be the manager/frontperson
<sladen> ^^ == knows things relating to the build/source
<sladen> I got one fps out of it and couldn't get past the menu last night.  So I was hacking bits out of the source
<\sh> can someone remove xgl from the universe archives, pls pls pls
<sladen> \sh: how come/
<Kyral_FreeBSD> because its a broken ass toy
<Kyral_FreeBSD> and we are tired of hering questions in #ubuntu about it :P
<\sh> sladen: because all people coming now install xgl and breaking their system
<sladen> agreed.  unfortunately putters like wanking over it
<sladen> punters
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: even in #kubuntu-de we are tired
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Why do people even USE it
<\sh> ricer
<Kyral_FreeBSD> I mean the novalty wears off
<\sh> mostly ex gentoo user
<Kyral_FreeBSD> lol
<zul> because its super neat
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Even I like sourcebased
<Kyral_FreeBSD> but jeez
<\sh> "hey mom, look, I have a rotating 3d word processor"
<Laser_away> \sh: heah, I'm an ex-gentoo user and I don't use Xgl ;-)
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Frankly for eye-candy XCompMgr suffices
<\sh> "no mom, I can't write a letter for you on this thing...no it's just rotating...you know, mom, it's cool"
<\sh> "yes, mom, it's openoffice I know, but you see, it's rotating, no typing allowed"
<Kyral_FreeBSD> hmm
* bddebian installs xgl... ;-P
* Kyral_FreeBSD wonders what the size difference between -O2 and -Os is....
<Laser_away> bddebian: yeah, I was just going to say, you can rotate windows? neato
<\sh> I think we need a new demo coder scene for linux..
<Kyral_FreeBSD> ???
<zul> ick...
<Kyral_FreeBSD> I think I wanna try making an Ubuntu/kFreebsd
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: for eyecandy we need nice demos like in c64, atari and amiga times ;)
<hub> tseng: btw, let me know if you need help for wv1
<tseng> hub: syre
<tseng> sure
<NthDegree> w00t
<NthDegree> qtella is compiling :D
<NthDegree> so can someone tell me how I am to make this into a package
<NthDegree> Spec?
<Spec> heya
<Spec> what's up?
<NthDegree> can you show me how to make qtella into a package
<Spec> is qtella a package already?
<NthDegree> i've ran make and it appears to have compiled successfully
<NthDegree> no i don't think so
<NthDegree> apt-get turned up nothing
<NthDegree> and it was a challenge to get working with a few compile problems so I doubt anyone as packaged it
<Spec> check out this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Packaging
<Spec> there's lots of packaging guides on the wiki
<LaserJock> NthDegree: check out http://help.ubuntu.com/ , specifically the Packaging Guide
<Spec> perhaps there should be a link in the topic pointing people to packaging documentation
<NthDegree> oh yeah I can't test it properly because it needs X
<crimsun> LaserJock: did you commit Rob's patch+my note?
<LaserJock> crimsun: I'm thinking about it, there is actually more to clean up with the chroot section
<crimsun> LaserJock: ah, ok.
<crimsun> feasible to have updates to ubuntu-docs in dapper-updates, I should hope
<LaserJock> I think so, I know the translations will be updated at least
<LaserJock> well, I had a discussion with infinity the other day about the sudo part
<crimsun> right, I was present :)
<LaserJock> oh, well you were there
<LaserJock> sorry
<LaserJock> anyway, I'd like to make sure that is cleaned up as well
<NthDegree> where do i get debuild from?
<\sh> apt-get install devscripts
<NthDegree> ty \sh :)
<\sh> NthDegree: np
<NthDegree> oops :$ well i'm close now atleast - debuild problems
<\sh> what problems?
<NthDegree> WARNING: Can't find the right public key-- can't check signature integrity.
<NthDegree> debuild: fatal error at line 791:
<\sh> do you have a gpg key?
<NthDegree> nope
<\sh> and as uid the email address as in debian/changelog?
<crimsun> then you need to append " -uc -us"
<NthDegree> this is so confusing, qtella uses god knows what
<crimsun> or just create a gpg key, heh, since you'll need one anyway
<\sh> re bddebian
<NthDegree> gpg: keyring `/root/.gnupg/secring.gpg' created gpg: keyring `/root/.gnupg/pubring.gpg' created gpg: skipped "root <martyn.hare@tiscali.co.uk>": secret key not available
<NthDegree> gpg: [stdin] : clearsign failed: secret key not available WARNING: Can't find the right public key-- can't check signature integrity. debuild: fatal error at line 791:
<NthDegree> well i think it made me some keys
<NthDegree> but as root lol
<crimsun> why are you building as root?
<sivang> \sh: I wonder what overrides the lease time from the server, any idea?
<NthDegree> because if i don't it usually messes things up
<NthDegree> and it's a chroot so it has to be root doesn't it?
<crimsun> NthDegree: you're not using pbuilder?
<NthDegree> :|
<\sh> sivang: send dhcp-lease-time 3600;
<\sh> in /etc/dhcp3/dhclient.conf
<\sh> sivang: I commented it in
<crimsun> (or sbuild)
<NthDegree> i'm trying the debuild method
<Spec[x] > wow
<NthDegree> since it seems easier
<Spec> you still need a gpg key
<crimsun> NthDegree: debuild -S  is standard; then pbuild the generated source package
<NthDegree> i'm stuck at debuild
<LaserJock> right, but don't run debuild as root
<LaserJock> in fact, you really don't have to do anything as root when you are packaging
<NthDegree> so make a new user and su into it?
<LaserJock> why do you need a new user?
<sivang> \sh: shit, is this a known bug or something?
<LaserJock> just do it as yourself
<NthDegree> wait a sec
<NthDegree> but in a chroot my user doesn't exist
<LaserJock> you could
<\sh> NthDegree: wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapHowto
<\sh> there is written how you can enabled sudo etc. with your user and passwd
<LaserJock> NthDegree: seriously, check out the Ubuntu Packaging Guide, it is all in there
<tseng> LaserJock++
<tseng> Unfrgiven++
<highvoltage> where's Unfrgiven?
<highvoltage> he's the only other person i know that named his nick after a song name.
<tseng> are you sure that is where he got it?
<LaserJock> he's around every once in a while
<tseng> its just a word
<tseng> he has a family
<LaserJock> yeah, I remember you guys talking about it
<tseng> he doesnt live on irc
<tseng> like some of us..
<highvoltage> tseng: yes, it's from a metallica song
<tseng> i know the song
<tseng> WHOOPS I CORRECTED MY GRAMMER IN A GLOBAL SERVER MESSAGE
* tseng chokes, falls from chair, dies
<highvoltage> he asked me if my nick is from a linkin park song. so i said yes, and asked him if his name is from the metallica song.
<Spec> hmm?
<tseng> I don't listen to linkin park
* highvoltage resussitates tseng 
<tseng> Spec: Lilo
<Spec> what about lilo?
<tseng> nothing.
<Spec> i'm confused :-/
<highvoltage> well, i don't listen to them anymore either. but i don't like changing nicks.
<_ion> My nick is from Bob Marley's "Ion Lion in Zion".
<LaserJock> I've got some linkin park in my limited library
<bddebian2> METALLICA RULZ!! :-)
<_ion> (In case no-one noticed the pun, i was actually joking.)
<highvoltage> _ion: cool :)
<Spec> i have a paintball gun that's named 'ion'
<Spec> it's vicious >:)
<highvoltage> ion3 is also quite cool.
<_ion> highvoltage: Agreed.
<LaserJock> I tried it the other day
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Who's bright idea was it to FURTHER split up the install CDs?
<Kyral_FreeBSD> I thought the idea of Espresso was to reduce the number of choices?
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: the alternate cd is not going to be shipped
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: only the desktop cd aka livecd with ubiquity..that was the plan
<Kyral_FreeBSD> \sh: Then why is it offered for download? And what is it even?
<Kyral_FreeBSD> People are like "Uhh, whats the Alternate" thing
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: because the live cd installer has some pitfalls
<Kyral_FreeBSD> ...then fall back to NCurses...
* Kyral_FreeBSD seriously never saw the problem with the NCurses one
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: e.g. it eats your former installed grub
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: d-i und ubiquity are two different approaches
<Kyral_FreeBSD> ....call me an idiot, but how many ways are there to install a system?
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: 2
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: for ubuntu that is :)
<Kyral_FreeBSD> I mean its basically downloading or copying the system onto the newly partitioned space
<Kyral_FreeBSD> How many ways are there to do that?
<Kyral_FreeBSD> ..without shell aliases and all that...
<NthDegree> ubotu what's the time
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: the alternate cd has more packages on it , I think, and desktop cd is just pure the desktop installation
<\sh> but I can be wrong
<Kyral_FreeBSD> ..../me falls down
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Oy....
<NthDegree> how do i get the time and date in here?
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Remind me never to ask you guys for help designing an installer
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: but the main reason for this is to save money for the ship it cds
<\sh> NthDegree: console: date ;)
<Kyral_FreeBSD> or date -u for UTC!
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: hehe...we are not designing the installer, rants go to #ubuntu-devel ;)
<Kyral_FreeBSD> sorry I didn't have it open and I needed a rantzone :P
<Kyral_FreeBSD> whats LTS mean anyway....
<\sh> Long Term Support
<Kyral_FreeBSD> ...*facefault*
<\sh> means 3 years for desktop, 5 years for server
<Kyral_FreeBSD> I think I've been in the ArchSauce too long
<Kyral_FreeBSD> I know...why is it in the name of the release...implies there is a STS version :P
<\sh> what information do you need to cover your absence?
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: the other releases are still 18 months
<Kyral_FreeBSD> absence?
<Kyral_FreeBSD> \sh: I meant of Dapper
<Kyral_FreeBSD> ie, Dapper LTS & Dapper STS
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: there is no dapper sts
<\sh> only LTS ;)
<crimsun> Kyral_FreeBSD: no, it's just to distinguish the longer support
* Kyral_FreeBSD falls down
<Kyral_FreeBSD> nevermind....
<Kyral_FreeBSD> This is making my head hurt...
<\sh> LTS means: guaranteed support commercial and community wise
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Yes
<\sh> phew...cheers guys
<Kyral_FreeBSD> but I was saying that by making it the title of the release, that SOME people (I don't put ANYTHING past the masses) will think that there is a STS version too
<bddebian> Oh well, time to head home.  Later gang
<crimsun> cya bddebian
<LaserJock> Kyral_FreeBSD: they are happy to look for one :-)
<Kyral_FreeBSD> yah
<bddebian> crimsun: Got that pony yet? ;-P
<\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: mv /dev/rant /dev/sabdfl ;)
<Kyral_FreeBSD> and I have to handle the "Where is the STS version" request
* Kyral_FreeBSD sighs
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Sorry guys
<Kyral_FreeBSD> long day
<Kyral_FreeBSD> spent 3 hours in the car and had to go right to work after
<LaserJock> Kyral_FreeBSD: and there are 2 installers because sometimes people don't want/need the GUI one
<hub> tseng: wv1 will be brought by the debian resync anyway
* Kyral_FreeBSD yawns and shuts up to read his Shell Scripting book
<LaserJock> Kyral_FreeBSD: but we are trying to move to ubiquity as much as possible, I think
* Kyral_FreeBSD shrugs
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Do whatever you guys
<LaserJock> ?
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Remember what I say is the great part about Open Source?
<LaserJock> I'm not seeing an issue, if you like the curses based install you download the alternate CD
<dooglus> when is the UVF for dapper going to be?
<lucas> <\sh> Kyral_FreeBSD: mv /dev/rant /dev/sabdfl ;)
<lucas> note that this doesn't work
<lucas> for example, mv /etc/motd /dev/null is *really* a bad idea
<Amaranth> yes
<Amaranth> unless you enjoy reboots
<\sh> lucas: mv /var/spool/rants/kyral_rants /dev/sabdfl ;)
<\sh> but actually he got the point :)
<Amaranth> \sh: cat /var/spool/rants/kyral_rants > /dev/sabdfl :P
<lucas> dooglus: about 3 months ago ?
<\sh> no kyral_rants is a directory ;)
<\sh> doesn't matter.
<\sh> I drink beer now
<crimsun> dooglus: going to be...?
<dooglus> lucas: I thought so.  so why did my apt-get upgrade just install new upstream versions of gedit and epiphany?
<lucas> bugfixes
<crimsun> dooglus: they're from dapper-updates. gnome-desktop has a standing exception grant to UVF.
<dooglus> crimsun: oh, I see.  so dapper will continue to track all the gnome desktop packages upstream?
<crimsun> dooglus: within reason
<dooglus> seems strange.  I thought the point of having releases was that they're stable.  dapper today may have more bugs than dapper yesterday...
<LaserJock> no, the point is that the updates are for a reason
<crimsun> dooglus: you may note the timeliness of ubuntu's release cycle to gnome's. And only dot releases for gnome, i.e., I wouldn't expect to see 2.16 in dapper.
<crimsun> but 2.14.x, yes
<hub> tseng: strangely beagle depends on less thing than it should
<hub> tseng: looks like dependencies are not calculated for libbeagleglue
<NthDegree> so how do i get a gpg key?
<lucas> NthDegree: by reading one of the various GPG tutorials on the web :)
<hub> tseng: I'm dumb once again. sorry for the noise
<LaserJock> NthDegree: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GnuPrivacyGuardHowto
<NthDegree> thanks
<\sh> hub: what about your job? still getting money?
<hub> \sh: still getting paid, yeah
<\sh> hub: good :)
<\sh> oh man, I'm today the master of first lvl support
<\sh> I should apply for the canonical support center in montreal
<Spec> ah, "Doesn't matter, I drink beer now", the best line of the days.
<hub> \sh: I applied back in November at canonical and my application has been left unsanswered
<hub> \sh: instead hired another $FORMER_COWORKER
<\sh> hub: kick mark
<hub> \sh: that still had a job at that time
<hub> \sh: but probably because he got coopted
<\sh> coopted?
<hub> a friend of somone already in the place
<_ion> You probably shouldn't have written the part about you thinking of killing your ex-employer to the application.
<hub> _ion: ahaha
<hub> _ion: very funny
<\sh> hub: hmm...ask mark why the application is not answered, not even with a "no, we hired one already"
<hub> \sh: at that time they had nobody. it was during ubz in fact
<hub> \sh: I'll just keep the idea for Dave Null
<hub> it does not matter anyway
<\sh> hub: for me, it would matter
<hub> well, I'm just getting used to all that sh*t anyway, and I currenly have a job, a house and other stuff
<\sh> hub: as you know, mark has my cv and he can call me every day and night time, if he needs someone...but I don't want to work for canonical somehow. for a couple of months ok, but not longer
<hub> \sh: yeah, and I do understand your situation
<\sh> hub: my situation is getting better :)
<hub> I hope
<\sh> hub: let me tell you, that I will pay back all supporter (motus here) when I'm finished with my project...I'll earn at least that what some people are earning per year ;)
<\sh> hub: in 60 days :)
<\sh> hub: talking about money where the tax is already removed ;)
<\sh> hub: but I would like to know why my application wasn't answered
<Toadstool> g'night
<NthDegree> night
#ubuntu-motu 2006-06-06
* havoc is back :)
<ReMink> I've created my first package and my repository _o/ he he
<havoc> nice
<ReMink> It's gajim 0.10.1
<havoc> now that I've *finally* figured out how to open up this damn vaio, I got a larger hdd, and am about to dual boot it
<havoc> so chillywilly will get his wish, and I'll finally be an ubuntu convert
<_ion> So you'll reboot between OpenBSD and Ubuntu then?
<havoc> haha
<havoc> I *wish* I could use only *nix, but unfortunately that doesn't pay the bills out here :(
<ReMink> I go to create my page in the ubuntu's wiki :D
<havoc> e.g. I was doing more M$ Access and C# crap today (seperate clients/projects), but the mortgage will be paid another month
<Erlang> havoc: Linux pays MY bill just fine :D
<havoc> Erlang: you're lucky :|
<_ion> Linus pays my bills.
<havoc> in 2005 Milwaukee, WI, US was rated 7th *worst* for IT in the US :(
* havoc is west of the Milwaukee Metro area
<Erlang> I live in a pretty small place.  The is very few Linux company around.  I'm lucky I've found aplace.
<Erlang> it's a startup thought.  I may be out of job by christmas ;D
<havoc> :(
<havoc> most of the contract work out here is web based crap
<havoc> which is all that bad
<havoc> not all that good though either
<havoc> but it lets me stay in a console
<havoc> even for the ASP crap
<LaserJock> darn it, every time I have a sweet Ubuntu setup somebody has to take it :(
<shawarma> LaserJock: What do you mean by "take it"?
<LaserJock> well, I had a nice setup at work and that got replaced by an iMac
<LaserJock> then I set up an alternative box
<LaserJock> and today that got taken by a undergrad for the summer
<shawarma> What do you do for a living?
<LaserJock> I'm a chemist
<LaserJock> aka, grad student for life
<shawarma> I see.
<shawarma> So you don't work with computers? Well, as a tool obviously, but apart from that?
<LaserJock> no, I just hang out here cause I like it :-)
<LaserJock> I'm an experimental physical chemist
<LaserJock> I'm a laser jock
<LaserJock> but every once in a while I get to do some Fortran or C programming for data acquisition and analysis
<NthDegree> LaserJock why don't you use scientific linux
<NthDegree> it's RHEL but for free with optimisations for your kinda thing
<NthDegree> and you could multiboot it with ubuntu
<LaserJock> I don't need scientific linux, tbh
<NthDegree> i know
<NthDegree> but it's worth looking at
<LaserJock> Ubuntu is exactly what I wanted
<shawarma> What does it do that any othe rLinux distro doesn't?
<NthDegree> shawarma, it is released every 7 years and is highly stable
<LaserJock> it has more computational science and statistics packages
<NthDegree> it doesn't
<NthDegree> that's incorrect it has no more science stuff than ubuntu
<LaserJock> more than RHEL by default, doesn't it?
<shawarma> NthDegree: Every 7 years?!?? That's almost as often af Debian!
<NthDegree> it is optimised for scientific things
<LaserJock> I was comparing it to RHEL
<NthDegree> shawarma it gets service packs like windows
<NthDegree> so it does get more than maintenance patches
<shawarma> Oh, ok.
<LaserJock> actually in my department we only run SuSE and Ubuntu for Linux
<shawarma> 7 years is a loooong time, though.
<NthDegree> but CentOS/fermi/scientific linux all have RHEL but for free and it's basically like getting the best of fedora w/o the hard work :)
<LaserJock> yeah, except I really have never been impressed with any Red Hat product
<NthDegree> I want to help ubuntu so hence i'll be using ubuntu as my main distro
<NthDegree> but CentOS (if it works) will be my stable, secure distro where as ubuntu will be my "do stuff for a good cause and get lots of pleasure" distro
<shawarma> Well, I'm off to bed. Cheers, guys!
<LaserJock> cya shawarma
<NthDegree> then when ubuntu has matured a bit more then it'll be ditch the red hat permanently season :D
<NthDegree> cya shawarma night
<LaserJock> scientific linux would really not do anything for me. I briefly had a look at it
<NthDegree> well centos probably would but the live cd doesn't boot for me
<pschulz01> Greetings.. I unsuccessfully tried to upload a package 'yaagc' to REVU last night... Is there anyone here who can clear it for me?
<LaserJock> pschulz01: heah, that's a science packge, right?
<NthDegree> lmao
<pschulz01> Yes. (space related)
<LaserJock> pschulz01: you were talking to Hobbsee (I read the backlog)
<pschulz01> I'm really after some packaging advice/suggestions/help.
* pschulz01 must really find out where the logs are :-)
<pschulz01> Laser_away, Yes
<pschulz01> LaserJock, yes
* NthDegree is gonna clean up his system
<LaserJock> pschulz01: people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs/ I believe
<pschulz01> yaagc is software that emulates the original Apollo Guidence Computer (the one that went to space)
<LaserJock> pschulz01: anyway, I'm the MOTU Science team guy so I'm always interested in seeing new packages
<pschulz01> Hi there!
<LaserJock> btw, I also got an #ubuntu-science channel going ;-)
<pschulz01> I've been playing with it off and on for a year or so.. and would like to see it available.
<NthDegree> pschulz01 well if you have actually made a package it makes you way better than me
<NthDegree> i can't even get my gpg sorted properly
<LaserJock> NthDegree: no key yet?
<NthDegree> LaserJock, well I made one but it wants the Real Name to be root
<LaserJock> what does?
<pschulz01> NthDegree: I've been packaging software for myself as I've needed it.. but never actually found the canonical way (no pun intended).
<NthDegree> lmao
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> pschulz01: I see your package in the REVU incoming
<NthDegree> HP source, great on chips :P
<pschulz01> Can you delete it? My dput failed.
<LaserJock> pschulz01: I don't think I can (I'm not a REVU admin) but I don't think it should matter
<LaserJock> pschulz01: just dput over the top of it, i.e. remove the .upload file or use dput -f
<pschulz01> LaserJock, can I delete it? (there was mention of 'dcut' in one of the messages.)
<LaserJock> no
<pschulz01> OK.. I'm a little concerned about the size though.. and the 'cleanlyness'.
<LaserJock> well, throw it up there and we can take a look :-)
<pschulz01> Uploading via ftp yaagc_20060110-2.dsc: Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of yaagc_20060110-2.dsc
* NthDegree thinks you need to make an ftp account
<LaserJock> no
<pschulz01> Note: This problem might be caused by files already existent on the server.
<pschulz01>       For the official Debian upload queues, the dcut(1) utility can be used
<pschulz01>       to remove stale files from unsuccessful uploads.
<LaserJock> hmm
<pschulz01> I'll up the version number, rebuild and try again :-)
<LaserJock> do you get any errors when building the source package
<pschulz01> No.. the source package get's built OK.
<pschulz01> On it's way.
<pschulz01> Can dput output progress?
<LaserJock> well, it made it to the server
<pschulz01> Looks to be like it's still going though..
<pschulz01> No.. finished...
<pschulz01> Well that was faster than my dialup at home :-)
<LaserJock> ahh, I see a sources.changes this time
<pschulz01> 'Not running dinstall' - what does this mean?
<LaserJock> dinstall is for apt repos, I believe. that is normal
<StevenK> dinstall was used for Debian uploads. Once you'd uploaded the changes, you could ssh in and run dinstall -n to see if your upload had a hope of being accepted.
<StevenK> That has since changed.
<StevenK> Which means, dput saying 'Not running dinstall' is because it isn't ssh in and running dinstall -n
<StevenK> Er, ssh'ing
<pschulz01_away> StevenK, So I can safely ignore this?
<StevenK> pschulz01_away: Exactly.
<pschulz01_away> StevenK, Thanks... so many things not to worry about :-)
<NthDegree> ok peeps i'm gonna go clean up my system
<NthDegree> brb
<ajmitch> afternoon all
<crimsun> 'lo ajmitch
<ajmitch> how are you, crimsun ?
<crimsun> ajmitch: not bad, and yourself?
<ajmitch> alright
<crimsun> cool
<ajmitch> lamenting the loss of the server at work
<ajmitch> it's died again
<crimsun> d'oh
<ajmitch> brand new box, hardware failures
<ajmitch> well, 06:06:06, 6/6/06, the 6bone was shut down :)
<crimsun> hehe
<zul> hey ajmitch
<ajmitch> hey zul
<crimsun> some of these CommunityEdgyIdeas make me weep
<crimsun> e.g., under Multimedia: "Make Mark hire a good lawyer to take a look at every countries law."
<ajmitch> weep or laugh
<ajmitch> I'm not sure which
<crimsun> nor I
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ajmitch> good day bddebian
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi ajmitch, Laser, crimsun!! :-)
<crimsun> heya bddebian
<zul> crimsun: the conaxant one comes to mind
<bddebian> Heya zul
<ajmitch> zul: we *MUST* provide winmodem support
<ajmitch> for every winmodem out there
<bddebian> *must*? :_)
<ajmitch> otherwise ubuntu as an OS has failed
<tseng> we should also autodetect freebsd
<tseng> and beos
<bddebian> Ugh
<zul> ajmitch: meh..
<ajmitch> excellent
<ajmitch> bugreport asking us to get a new xentools version in now
<bddebian> You are surprised by that? :-)
<ajmitch> not in the slightest
<LaserJock> ajmitch: you know a Caritas?
<ajmitch> aye
<ajmitch> I understand you've been stalking
<bddebian> heh
<LaserJock> not exactly stalking
* crimsun looks forward to bddebian's main upload privs tomorrow :)
<LaserJock> is that tommorow?
<ajmitch> 'not exactly'
<bddebian> Why so you can laugh at me some more?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: damnig words if ever I heard any
<crimsun> bddebian: no, so I can punt fixes your way :-)
<bddebian> Ah :-)
<zul> yeah like alsa or kernel stuff
* ajmitch will give bddebian all his uploads
<bddebian> That's IF I get accepted and that is a BIG if
<zul> bddebian: we just like to torture you
<Erlang> Hurray hurray! Erlang builds on HPPA
<bddebian> w00t
<crimsun> "World Cup streaming to cause network meltdown" seems a bit extreme
<LaserJock> lol
<bddebian> Finally the TRUE cause of global warming!! ;-P
<zul> end of the world dont you know
<LaserJock> bddebian: rofl
<ajmitch> hey jsgotangco
<jsgotangco> good morning ajmitch
<bddebian> Yeah, heya jsgotangco :-)
* StevenK ponders actually going to uni.
<ajmitch> StevenK: don't do it!
<StevenK> ajmitch: Why not?
<ajmitch> because uni is evil
<TheMuso> Uni is evil if you really don't care about your degree/whatever you are studying for.
<StevenK> Well, I'm confused. It's week 12 of a 14 week semester, but the unit I'm doing had the final exam last week.
<TheMuso> heh
<StevenK> So I'm going to go in and ask the lecturer "What the?"
<bluefoxicy> how do I get the 'wtf' command
<robitaille> bluefoxicy:  bsdgames
<robitaille> at least according to packages.ubuntu.com
<bluefoxicy> bsd == bull shit daemon?
<bddebian> Berkley Systems Division or some such
<bluefoxicy> oh
<bluefoxicy> oh that bsd
<bluefoxicy> nm
<robitaille> BSD = Berkeley Software Distribution
<bddebian> Oh yeah, that's it :-)
<robitaille> I had to look in wikipeadia..I can never remember the exact definition :)
<robitaille> even after spending 2 years in Berkeley...
<jsgotangco> what does wtf do?
<robitaille> it must be a game...
<Laser_away> robitaille: I think spending time at Berkeley will do that to you ;-)
* jsgotangco feeds his interest by installing
<robitaille> Laser_away:  I was too busy dealing with my NT servers to think about BSD at the time
<jsgotangco> lol its an acronym db
<robitaille> ah cool
<jsgotangco> wtf PEBKAC
<jsgotangco> hehe
<pschulz01> Laser_away, Was I ment to get a password emailed to me whe I uploaded to REVU this morning?
<robitaille> obviously only a geek would even know about PEBKAC :)
<robitaille> I have to install that package...
<jsgotangco> lol this is fun
<jsgotangco> it has like 20+ games for the console
<robitaille> battlestar?
<jsgotangco> yeah
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<robitaille> adventure?  That must be the old game I used to play on my commodore 64
<jsgotangco> it even has hangman and a star trek game
<robitaille> jsgotangco:  since you are in the gaming business...I guess you can play all these game at work for educational purposes? :)
<jsgotangco> yeah even the sucky ones
<jsgotangco> thank goodness im part of the mobile/handheld division
<Laser_away> pschulz01_away: actually, have you emailed keyring AT revu.tauware.de to get you gpg key added to the keyring?
<pschulz01_away> Yes, I did that first.
<pschulz01_away> But that wasn't that long ago.
<Laser_away> and you got a response?
<pschulz01_away> No.
<Laser_away> then perhaps you haven't been added
<pschulz01_away> Cool.. just so I know.
<Laser_away> ajmitch_: ping? could you help pschulz01_away here with a REVU problem? ^^
<Laser_away> ok, I'm really away now
<ajmitch> yes you have been added
<ajmitch> I told you on IRC
<ajmitch> and you don't get a password emailed to you
<pschulz01> ajmitch, yes.
<pschulz01> ajmitch, should I expect a password at some stage?
<ajmitch> when you request it
<pschulz01> Cna i please have a password?
<ajmitch> I mean when you request it on REVU
<pschulz01> Oh..
<ajmitch> after your first successful upload..
<pschulz01> :-) Thanks.. not clear from the wiki.
<pschulz01> ajmitch, Sorry, it's perfectly clear.. I just can't read.
<dholbach> good morning
<Gloubiboulga> hi dholbach, hi kagou
<kagou> hey Gloubiboulga  :)
<dholbach> heya Gloubiboulga, kagou
<dholbach> how are you guys?
<kagou> morning dholbach
<kagou> fine and you ?
<Gloubiboulga> dholbach, good, thinking about Xubuntu edgy :)
<Hobbsee> hey dholbach Gloubiboulga and kagou
<Gloubiboulga> hey Hobbsee
* StevenK jumps on Hobbsee
* Hobbsee thumps StevenK 
<Hobbsee> anyone know what my jabber password is?
* kagou is learning how to make nice packages :)
<dholbach> hey slomo
<Hobbsee> kagou: nice :)
<kagou> i'v installed and configured pbuilder/dput/mini-dinstall :)
<slomo> hi dholbach :)
* Hobbsee is now wondering about her sanity.
<StevenK> Hobbsee: What's to wonder about, it's missing. :-P
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> my memory, too...
<kagou> doing some works on packages for edgy (for photo team) ... and waiting now for the sync. i must learn more on packaging (patch integration and so on)
<dholbach> kagou: Edgy will be your Cycle! :)
<kagou> lol
<kagou> someone can explain me what's the process for me to push a new package. this in the case where debian package is old, so i'v made a new fresh release.
<dholbach> push where?
<dholbach> kagou: to get it reviewed?
<kagou> dholbach, push on edgy mirrors :)
<Hobbsee> grr.  it's the early hours of the morning in the US.
<dholbach> kagou: you can't just upload it like that
<dholbach> kagou: you need to get it reviewed and then uploaded by someone in the keyring
<dholbach> kagou: if you have a patch, then providing a debdiff is cool
<dholbach> kagou: if it's a complete package you might want to get it reviewed on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU
<kagou> thanks dholbach.
<kagou> lol -> "If you happen to enjoy Linux, but dislike Ubuntu, you probably regretted connecting to the Internet in the second half of the past week" -> http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20060605
<ajmitch> alright..
* ajmitch considers FDS
<Hobbsee> fds?
<dholbach> hey schweeb
<dholbach> schweeb: long time no see
<zakame> hi all
<ajmitch> hey zakame
<zakame> hi ajmitch! how's network-auth? =)
<ajmitch> getting there :)
<ajmitch> how's your project going?
* ajmitch doesn't quite understand what it is you're doing :)
<zakame> the same, figured out how to do cvs+rcs
<ajmitch> ew
<zakame> now I'm trying to port this modem-locking code (copied from C, apparently) to use Perl's flock :/
<ajmitch> that doesn't sound nice :)
<zakame> yeah :/ that's my project, being the janitor
<ajmitch> ah
<ajmitch> worthwhile, but no glory in it ;)
<zakame> hehehe
<zakame> learning a lot though, so I'm not worried about the glory
<ajmitch> which is good :)
<zakame> indeed :)
* ajmitch needs some decent music to listen to
<ajmitch> hm, new kernel works ok in vmware ;)
<jsgotangco> ajmitch: he's supposed to resurrect an age-old myth called paging systems
<ajmitch> explain
* ajmitch needs to figure out how to run git properly
<jsgotangco> when we were yet to be conceived by our parents, they used this contraption where they received numeric codes
<jsgotangco> then it became alpha numeric
<jsgotangco> heh
<nawty> hiya, how do i request that a package is updated from debian ?
<crimsun> nawty: are the ubuntu and debian versions identical?
<crimsun> nawty: meaning, of course, that ubuntu's trails debian's but has no ubuntu-specific changes
<nawty> crimsun: as far as i can see, yes.
<crimsun> nawty: package?
<nawty> crimsun: two of them, actually.
<nawty> crimsun: xen-tools, and postfix-policyd.
<crimsun> nawty: xen-tools will be autosynced. postfix-policyd has a ubuntu delta.
<nawty> crimsun: any idea on the autosync timeframe?
<ajmitch> nawty: they'll be synced into edgy
<nawty> crimsun: aah, ok, how do i find out more information on the ubuntu changes for policyd.
<crimsun> nawty: erm, well, edgy's not supposed to open until today or tomorrow
<ajmitch> some packages *may* have a chance of getting into dapper-backports
* tuxmaniac is reading a flame war that is happening between Debian and Ubuntu on his home LUG mailing list
<ajmitch> I don't know if we've worked out any policy for that yet, it's on the TB agenda today
* tuxmaniac is responsible in a way ;-)
<ajmitch> tuxmaniac: yay
<Kamping_Kaiser> tuxmaniac, what lug?
<nawty> crimsun: but edgy's going to well be, broken for a while.
<crimsun> nawty: it's just a b-d specific change for libmysqlclient15-dev.
<tuxmaniac> Indian Linux user group Chennai.
<ajmitch> nawty: yep, it'll be great fun
<tuxmaniac> Kamping_Kaiser: its just catching up
<nawty> crimsun: so there's no chance of getting the updated package, that fixes bugs, into dapper ?
<ajmitch> nawty: this is why it's important to get things into dapper before release
<crimsun> nawty: of which package fixing which bug{,s}?
<tuxmaniac> Kamping_Kaiser: will have a fitting climax when I plan to demo Dapper :-D
<tuxmaniac> Kamping_Kaiser: in the next meet
<Kamping_Kaiser> hehe
<nawty> crimsun: policyd, i've just updated my bug :
<nawty> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/postfix-policyd/+bug/36823/+index
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 36823 in postfix-policyd "Update ? debian upstream much higher version..." [Normal,Confirmed] 
<nawty> crimsun: have a squiz at the last comment.
<crimsun> erm, I see only 1.61 as really valid...
<ajmitch> & there's new functionality added between 1.55 (which we have) and 1.61
<nawty> yes, that too.
<crimsun> there's no clear delineation of what critical bugs are fixed, either, which makes -updates more difficult
<nawty> well i'm running a source compiled version at the moment, because 1.55's changes were causing problems on my systems.
<nawty> ubuntu's synced from unstable ?
<crimsun> if the fixes can be backported to dapper's 1.55-1ubuntu1, then that would have a better chance of making it into -updates
<crimsun> I think it's safe to assume that 1.73 isn't going into -updates, though.
<nawty> and it's bad to use debian packages on an ubuntu system?
<crimsun> nawty: building a source package is 100% fine
<crimsun> dropping binaries from pool, though, can cause furry rabbit death
<crimsun> holy backlog in -devel
<nawty> crimsun: so should i not bother filing bug reports against old pcakages ?
<ajmitch> you can, but post-release updates have to be considered carefully
<crimsun> nawty: it's worth filing them if you can provide a debdiff against current $stable source packages
<crimsun> ah, I see, it's the ole bleeding edge naming vs. stable naming and "but more time == fewer bugs" arguments.
<ajmitch> the same old discussion
<ajmitch> I think I should install debian
<ajmitch> (in vmware)
<ajmitch> hm
<ajmitch> hopefully edgy will open soon & get gcc-4.1
<ajmitch> I think it's sitting ready
<Toadstool> hi everybody
<ajmitch> crackful
<ajmitch> cd lib/libadminutil;    gmake BUILD_OPT=1 NSPR_BASENAME= USE_PTHREADS=1 SECURITY=domestic MOZILLA_SOURCE_ROOT_EXT= ICU_SOURCE_ROOT_EXT= USE_64=1
<ajmitch> /bin/sh: gmake: command not found
* ajmitch wonders why we don't have the gmake->make thing
<ajmitch> I see, manoj's decision
<Mithrandir> also s/;/&&/
<ajmitch> yeah, I thought I'd try out dsbuild for fedora directory server
<ajmitch> breaks all over
<zul> heylo
<ajmitch> hi
<Toadstool> hi lucas, sorry to bother you again with http://tiber.tauware.de/~lucas/versions/ but there's another little issue :)
<lucas> yes ?
<Toadstool> lucas: the changelog links all point to pool/universe even for main packages
<lucas> yup
<lucas> but there's no way to determine where a package comes from currently
<Toadstool> ok :)
<Toadstool> thanks anyway
<ch34ter> why does my bash history fill with stupid commands like this one: cd "`echo -e '\057home\057dx\064\065\067\060\062\067\063\061\063\064\067\066\056OLD'`"? and how do i fix this?
<Kyral> Morning
<Hobbsee> hey Kyral
<Kyral> Is it just me or did siretart become a AM :P
<Hobbsee> a AM?
<Kyral> something Maintainer in Debian
<Kyral> not a full on Maintainer, but like a new maintainer
<Mithrandir> Application Manager
<Kyral> Check the Debian-NewMaint list
<Hobbsee> oh
<Kyral> You have NO Idea how many MLs I lurk on :D
<Hobbsee> Kyral: i'm sure i dont want to know :p
<siretart> Kyral: I'm not a DD yet, but that could happen quite soon, right
<Kyral> Lesse....Arch's, Dapper Changes (guess that is dead now), Debian Announce, Ubuntu Announce, Debian Mentors, Debian NewMaint, Debian News, Debian Science, The Linux Kernel Mailing List, Ubuntu Devel, Ubuntu Users, Ubuntu Doc, Ubuntu Kernel, Ubuntu Motu, Ubuntu Science, Universe Bugs, Xen Users
<Kyral> siretart: Ah I just noticed your name when I was skimming the ML
<Hobbsee> ick, scary!
<Kyral> LKML is funny sometimes
<Kyral> like Linus' announcement of 2.6.17-rc5
<Kyral> "Hey guys, I said there wouldn't be another -rc, but I lied!"
<Kyral> lol Multiplayer Spreadsheets
<shannon> why isn't foldingathome in the repos?
<Hobbsee> er...because no one has packaged it?
<shannon> Well -- I know that, but it says in the wiki that it could not be packaged because it had to be obtained from stanford university --
<imbrandon> probbly a lic issue then
<shannon> why can't a copy from their site be put in a .deb?
<shannon> maybe so
<Hobbsee> probably requires a click thru licence or something.  which is a pain
<shannon__> You actually do not have to see the liscence
<imbrandon> is it compatable with the gpl though
<shannon__> it's just fed through less in one of the bash installers
<shannon__> no
<imbrandon> thats the reason
<imbrandon> ;)
<shannon__> but why not put it in restricted or multiverse or somewhere?
<imbrandon> probbly becouse no one has done it ;)
<shannon__> hum
<shannon__> I'mnot much of a packager
<ch34ter> why does my bash history fill with stupid commands like this one: cd "`echo -e '\057home\057dx\064\065\067\060\062\067\063\061\063\064\067\066\056OLD'`"? and how do i fix this?
<Hobbsee> ch34ter: er...did you type it in?
<ch34ter> Hobbsee: not at all!
<Hobbsee> odd...
<shannon__> ch34ter: perhaps another program>
<ch34ter> Hobbsee: i suspect this is from some bash script made by the ubuntu team
<shannon__> ch34ter: hiw often is it in the history?
<ch34ter> shannon__: which other program could it be? and why didn't it do the same in breezy?
<shannon__> ch34ter: no idea, I just know that 99% of people do not speak unicode
<ch34ter> shannon__: quite often. almost every session. as though it's some bash.rc script
<shannon__> ch34ter: less ./.bashrc
<imbrandon> have you tried to cat the files and grep for it , seeing where it comes from ?
<imbrandon> shannon__: my plate is kinda full today and tomarrow but i would be happy to look at packaging it up for edgy if everyting checks out lic wise , drop me an email imbrandon@kubuntu.org to remind me and i'll look at it later this week
<ch34ter> imbrandon: what could determine bash translate everything to unicode before saving it to its history?
<shannon__> imbrandon: okay -- if it's lic is not terrible, I'll e-mail ya
<imbrandon> ch34ter: no idea honestly , have toy checked in #ubuntu ? wider audiance
<imbrandon> s/toy/you
<ch34ter> imbrandon: way too wide.
<havoc> ch34ter: grp -Hnris "echo \-e" ~/
<havoc> that should get you started
<havoc> grep -Hnris "echo \-e.*057home" ~/
<ch34ter> havoc: what is grp?
<ch34ter> oh
<havoc> typo :)
<ch34ter> does it look like unicode?
<havoc> no idea, I don't use unicode at all
<shannon__> imbrandon: I read the license - Legally. you have to wget a copy from stanford for each computer, and have permission from the owner of the computer.
<imbrandon> shannon__: thats why its not packaged then ;)
* shannon__ stops whining
<shannon__> Thanks anyway!
<bddebian> Heya gang
<tseng> hi
<bddebian> Hi tseng
<zul> bddebian: nervous yet..heh heh
<bddebian> Nah, let them laugh at me
* tseng gives it to him easy
<bddebian> No way d00d
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Whats going on?
* Kyral_FreeBSD looks up from helping in #ubuntu?
<Kyral_FreeBSD> bddebian going before the TB or something?
<bddebian> Kyral_FreeBSD: Yes
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Go for it my Hurd Freak Friend :D
<bddebian> Heh
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Actually right now I'm filling out the form to have this little program I wrote listed in the Free Software Directory
<bddebian> Cool
<slomo> bddebian: nervous? why should you be nervous? ;)
<kagou> commenting dh_strip is it enough to obtain a package with debug information ?
<kagou> commenting in rules of course
<slomo> kagou: DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS="nostrip debug noopt" should do it too for most packages
<Sp4rKy> hi motus
<kagou> slomo: with this no need to comment out dh_strip, right ?
<slomo> kagou: right... dh_strip doesn't strip binaries if you have nostrip in DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS
<slomo> noopt disabled optimizations for some packages
<slomo> and debug is used in some packages for stuff like --enable-debug for configure
<kagou> slomo: last question : i build with pbuilder, how to use   DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS="nostrip debug noopt" ?
<slomo> no idea ;) i guess pbuilder inherits the environment variables from it's executing shell
<kagou> i hope so :)
<slomo> and then there's --debbuildopts
* kagou hugs slomo 
<Sp4rKy> please, i'm packing my first package (yersinia) , so i do many mistakes, and each dput update send mail :/ Does exist some way to pre-valid my package ?
<Sp4rKy> pbuilder and lintian are ok
<Erlang> well, if pbuilder and lintian are okay
<Sp4rKy> can i dput it ?
<Erlang> Sp4rKy: You can dput it on REVU yeah.
<zul> put it on revu
<Sp4rKy> ok, thx
<Sp4rKy> just a last check :)
<Sp4rKy> Gloubiboulga help me a lot for this package, so i think it's good
<Erlang> Sp4rKy: It'll get checked on REVU.  Most of the package review cannot be automated.
<Erlang> Sp4rKy: as for automation, you can also try linda, and piuparts
<Sp4rKy> oups, i'd put dapper and not edgy into the changelog
<bddebian> slomo: Because I suck? :-)
<Tonio_> hi all
<Sp4rKy> hi again
<Sp4rKy> i've some issue during the dput action
<Sp4rKy> i've this error message
<Sp4rKy> Uploading via ftp yersinia_0.5.6-0ubuntu1.dsc: Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of yersinia_0.5.6-0ubuntu1.dsc
<Sp4rKy> Toadstool says me than i should talk with sirestart or sistpoty for manual delete
<bddebian> Heya Tonio_
<LaserJock> Sp4rKy: did you send a signed email the keyring@tiber.tauware.de?
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, i'm a neebie in packaging , so i don't really know what i must do if there is issues :/
<LaserJock> Sp4rKy: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<Toadstool> LaserJock: yes he already did and already uploaded as well
<LaserJock> hmm
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, it's the first mail for account create i think , ok i did it and i did already uploaded yersinia
<Sp4rKy> Toadstool, :)
<LaserJock> Sp4rKy: ok, but did you get a reply to your email?
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, yes of course
<Sp4rKy> and i 'd uploaded some packages without any bug
<Toadstool> Sp4rKy: argh, go to go... I hope you'll find out what's wrong ;)
<Toadstool> cya
<LaserJock> hmm
<Sp4rKy> Toadstool, thx , 'later
<Sp4rKy> http://pastebin.com/762712
<Sp4rKy> that is the messages out by dupt
<jabra> can someone help me package a perl module
<LaserJock> jabra: how far have you gotten?
<slomo> bddebian: bah, you don't :P
<jabra> think I have a good place to start http://www.debian-administration.org/articles/78
<jabra> i'll let you know when I have questions
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, do i use dcut ?
<LaserJock> Sp4rKy: you don't, I don't think
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, or send an email to the motu mailist ?
<Sp4rKy> or just wait sirestart or sispoty come back
<LaserJock> you could email admin AT tiber.tauware.de
<LaserJock> oh wait, just a sec
<LaserJock> Sp4rKy: what version did you upload
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, version of yersinia ? 0.5.6 , it's an update
<LaserJock> ok, I see it on REVU
<Sp4rKy> ok
<Sp4rKy> but i think the update you see is wrong
<Sp4rKy> here is the good update i've jsute packaged
<Sp4rKy> but don't uploaded yet
<LaserJock> I mean there are quite a few uploads
<LaserJock> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2369
<Sp4rKy> yes i know, i'm sorry about thaat
<Sp4rKy> i've made many corrections yesterday with Gloubiboulga
<Sp4rKy> and uploaded the package each time :/
<jabra> i'm gettin debuild not found
<jabra> i'm I doing something wrong?
<LaserJock> jabra: install devscript
<jabra> k
<LaserJock> devscripts actually, I think
* Kyral_FreeBSD yawns
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Tell me when the party is guys :P
<bddebian> It's always a party here
<LaserJock> all here, all the time
<Kyral_FreeBSD> I meant for bddebian getting Core Dev :P
<bddebian> Oh, he's not going :-)
<Kyral_FreeBSD> lol
<LaserJock> oh, well I'm sure we can start partying now :-)
* Kyral_FreeBSD smacks bddebia
<Kyral_FreeBSD> I think if the TB declines him, we have to mutiny
<zul> part...of...funeral
* bddebian kicks zul :-)
<zul> doh...party or funeral? :)
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, any idea about what must i do ?
<Kyral_FreeBSD> oh should I be lazy and ask someone to package shcd for me or... lol
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Wait is MuttNG in the repos?
<Erlang> MuttNG? I like how that sounds.
<LaserJock> Sp4rKy: your sure that the lasted upload is not the one you want? and you used dput -f ?
<Kyral_FreeBSD> yes, it means the Next Generation of the venerable Mutt client
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Long time no blog update LJ :P
<LaserJock> Kyral_FreeBSD: because I've been actually working :-)
<Kyral_FreeBSD> So have I!!!
<LaserJock> Kyral_FreeBSD: I'll get to it in time
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Jeez....
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, there is an issue in the latest upload (look at the diff.gz , is about 19k) and yes i'd used dput - f
<LaserJock> hmm, I'm really not sure what is going on
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, :/
<LaserJock> but I'm not an expert with REVU, I've only used it a couple times
<Sp4rKy> ok
<jabra> ok two thing I need to add libxml-twig do I add that after perl (>= 5.8.0-7)
<jabra> things
<Sp4rKy> so i'll wait sirestart /sispoty
<jabra> second the tests need sudo to run the tests
<LaserJock> Sp4rKy: or email REVU admins (which is siretart and sistpoty and a few others)
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, admin AT tiber.tauware.de ?
<LaserJock> I think so it is on the REVU wiki page as well
<crimsun> bddebian: pssht, you had better :-)
<Sp4rKy> :)
<jabra> i'll work on this after my class
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, i've send an email , thx :)
<LaserJock> Sp4rKy: sorry I wasn't more help, you are the second person to have the problem I think
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, ok , thx for your help !
<Sp4rKy> another question, must i use dh_python for a python prgoram ?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> but it is handy
<LaserJock> you can take a look at what it does to the postinst scripts
<bddebian> crimsun: I had better what? :-)
<crimsun> bddebian: get core-dev, durh :p
<bddebian> Bah :-)
<bddebian> wb tuxmaniac
<tuxmaniac> bddebian: hi
* tuxmaniac will miss all of you guys for three days as he is off to a hill station for vacation [err.. relaxation] 
<tuxmaniac> from tomorrow
<NthDegree> :)
<LaserJock> tuxmaniac: have fun :-)
<NthDegree> how do you erase a DVD?
<NthDegree> me forgot#
<ogra> NthDegree, #ubuntu
<Kyral_FreeBSD> cat NthDegree >> /dev/net/irc/freenode/#ubuntu
<NthDegree> lol
<lucas> while reading linux journal, I'm amazed at the number of writers using (k)ubuntu
<lucas> really impressive
<hub> lucas: the editor in chief has a thing against Gnome
<NthDegree> i use kubuntu :D
<hub> and I'm amazed also to still find too much Windows or MacOS X screenshots
<lucas> yes, and so many articles about running windows apps using wine or qemu ;)
<NthDegree> hub, well I say Mac OS X is just an expensive RHEL with wierd looking GNOME :P
<hub> NthDegree: it is NON-FREE
<lucas> NthDegree: it also happens to be proprietary software
<LaserJock> NthDegree: hehe, not exactly
<lucas> with sharewares with the author picture in them etc :)
<NthDegree> i know that mac is proprietary
<LaserJock> I'm running OS X right now and it doesn't seem like RHEL
<NthDegree> but X isn't
<hub> NthDegree: but the X in MacOS X does not mean X11
<NthDegree> LaserJock, go on RHEL and give it a mac theme :)
<hub> it means 10
<NthDegree> or even better CentOS
<LaserJock> NthDegree: but the apps are totally different, the functionallity is totally different, the package management is totally different
<NthDegree> LaserJock but the whole point of OS X is it's X compatibility
<hub> LaserJock: there is a package management>
<hub> NthDegree: NO
<hub> NthDegree: it is not at all
<hub> NthDegree: they put X just to compete with Sun
<hub> NthDegree: and eventually Windows
<NthDegree> what's the point in getting the OS X when you can get mac classic
<hub> (that have commercial solution)
<hub> NthDegree: it is #ubuntu-motu here
<hub> not #mac-zealotery
<NthDegree> yep i forgot :|
<LaserJock> who is the mac zealot?
<NthDegree> you :P
<LaserJock> oh
<LaserJock> :-)
<LaserJock> I just like it
<hub> NthDegree: btw, learn things before show ridiculous arguements like that
<LaserJock> I wouldn't say I'm a zealot about it
<NthDegree> 1st of all Mac uses UNIX (Darwin I think) it also uses bits that other OSes worked hard on making
<NthDegree> and they charge for it :| so ridiculous don't you think?
<NthDegree> anyways nvm about mac, we got good ol' ubuntu which is much better :)
<LaserJock> not particularly, but whatever. this probably is very OT and prone to getting us off course :-)
<LaserJock> I'm personall very impressed with OSX and actually use it more than Ubuntu (not of my own choosing)
<NthDegree> one thing that annoys me though is the AMD64 side of things, ubuntu has the best AMD64 (especially k8) support around
<NthDegree> fedora, windows, mac, RHEL etc. have poor x86_64 support
<hub> NthDegree: why Mac? Apple don't even have 64bit hardware
<NthDegree> yet ubuntu seems to have the most pure 64bit stable packages around
<NthDegree> hub: Mac support intel chips now
<NthDegree> and regular PCs
<hub> NthDegree: and they don't have 64bits hardware, and MacOS do NOT run on regular PC
<NthDegree> but they are a couple of generations behind
<hub> NthDegree: stop your trolls please
<phanatic> hi people
<NthDegree> hub: they do, I know a few people with regular PCs using Mac
<hub> NthDegree: NO
<NthDegree> ???
<LaserJock> ok guys lets quite it down a bit
<LaserJock> quiet even
<NthDegree> http://www.thinksecret.com/news/0506intelmac.html < FACT
<hub> NthDegree: *right*. you are a troll
<NthDegree> how can you say that?
<LaserJock> NthDegree: As for installing Mac OS X on non-Apple hardware, attempts to boot from the included Mac OS X for Intel disc resulted in an error message on both a Dell and off-brand PC
<hub> NthDegree: MacOS X does NOT run on non Apple hardware. that is a fact. what you are saying is just gossips based on a prerelease software designed to run on stock PC
<hub> NthDegree: because there was no hardware, in order to allow developers to transition
<hub> NthDegree: but none of these concern Ubuntu, so what is the story?
<lucas> NthDegree: if you could run it on your hardware, would you run OS X instead of ubuntu ?
<NthDegree> i wouldn't
<NthDegree> OS X sucks
<LaserJock> although I can't wait to be able to run Ubuntu on this iMac
<hub> NthDegree: so why are you advertising it?
<NthDegree> :|
<NthDegree> i'm not advertising it
<NthDegree> who said that i think it's good
<hub> you started non-sense troll here
<NthDegree> no
<NthDegree> i never started talking about mac 1st of all
<NthDegree> i wasn't the person who talked about it at 1st
<hub> <NthDegree> hub, well I say Mac OS X is just an expensive RHEL with wierd looking GNOME :P <- you started the troll
<NthDegree> ok maybe, but that's because I hate Mac too much
<LaserJock> ok, well lets just calm it down
<hub> and then you continued with incorrect information
<hub> while we said that it was already OT
<bddebian> Or at least please move it to #ubuntu-offtopic?
<hub> bddebian: yeah
<NthDegree> no they even share a non-ppc copy of it on piratebay
<LaserJock> NthDegree: just because it is i386 doesn't mean it runs on a normal PC
<LaserJock> NthDegree: and please drop it for now
<LaserJock> it really isn't adding to our general conversation
<NthDegree> ok :(
<LaserJock> A general statment or 2 isn't a problem
<LaserJock> but to go on and on about something like that really isn't going to get you anywhere
<NthDegree> i suppose
<LaserJock> lots of people us Windows, OS X, and Ubuntu all the time and are happy with all of them for one reason or another
* Bazzi hugs NthDegree 
<NthDegree> hahaha
* NthDegree wants a hug off krazykit :P
<NthDegree> so anyway, now that i've probably made half of you fall asleep :( shall we get back to talking about motu stuff
<LaserJock> hehe
<NthDegree> i still have to set up my goddamn dchroot on both ubuntu and kubuntu
<LaserJock> chroots are a wonderfull thing
<NthDegree> i agree
<highvoltage> they so are
<NthDegree> but do they really make good jails as they say?
* imbrandon needs to readup on making a 32bit chroot on my 64bit buntu
<NthDegree> imbrandon i think it's under debootstrap
<highvoltage> well, there are tools like jailer for that
<NthDegree> search that on the ubuntu site
<imbrandon> NthDegree: heh well that means nothing to me so far becouse i havent ever setup a normal chroot either ;)
<NthDegree> i have
<imbrandon> NthDegree: yea planed on it
<NthDegree> but i want it to work on both my ubuntu and kubuntu
<NthDegree> i made a separate patition for mine
<imbrandon> just gonna wait till after the meeting incase i break my system i've got irc till then ;)
<LaserJock> imbrandon: DebootstrapChroot has a section on setting up a chroot 32 bit
<imbrandon> kk LaserJock
<NthDegree> LaserJock will a chroot allow you to execute X apps
<LaserJock> yes
<NthDegree> what like 32 bit ones?
<LaserJock> I run a full Ubuntu install in one of mine
<imbrandon> nice
<NthDegree> i want to use chroot to update my ubuntu and kubuntu to the same time
<LaserJock> ?
<NthDegree> and make a dev environment for packages too
<NthDegree> well think of it this way
<NthDegree> I have 1 partition for ubuntu and another for kubuntu
<imbrandon> i mostly just want it so i can build i386 pkgs without rebooting into my 32bit buntu and also w32codecs dont play nice unless in a chrrot on 64bit buntu i have heard
<LaserJock> imbrandon: should work for that
<hub> why 2 partitions?
<NthDegree> because i don't like mixing DEs
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock,  yersinia was dputed :) thx for your help
<LaserJock> Sp4rKy: ok, cool
<NthDegree> i have a /var/chroot partition too :)
<hub> btw, what goes in dapper-updates?
<imbrandon> hub: i do the same thing, so they dont mix , i actualy have 4 partitions currently , a 32bit ubuntu 32bit kubuntu and a 64bit of each
<Ubugtu> Ubuntu bug 32 in 3270 "3270: 5250 emulation code, all rights reserved" [Normal,Resolved: notwarty]  http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=32
<hub> imbrandon: I only have one
<LaserJock> hub: very important updates ?
<hub> imbrandon: and I use the most aproriate
<NthDegree> hub: udates are for less important update
<hub> LaserJock: define very important
<NthDegree> security-updates are patches
<LaserJock> hub: whatever mdz thinks is important
<hub> ah ok
<hub> at least that defines correctly
<NthDegree> hub, updates are like say for updating kde 3.5.1 to 3.5.2
<NthDegree> and the security updates are patches for like 3.5.1
<LaserJock> well, I'ts a little sketchy for me at the moment
<LaserJock> NthDegree: not exactly
<LaserJock> NthDegree: -security is for security fixes -updates is for non-security but important updates
<NthDegree> updates are for latest bits
<LaserJock> kind of
<NthDegree> because say debian they stick to one version of KDE for each release
<NthDegree> or one version of FireFox
<NthDegree> and patch them
<imbrandon> anyone having trubble bringing up the url http://www.vmware.com/vmwarestore/newstore/vserverbeta_download.jsp or is it just me
<NthDegree> no that's free imbrandon
<NthDegree> until it is no longer beta
<LaserJock> NthDegree: backports is more what you are talking about
<NthDegree> i know lol
<NthDegree> but edgy isn't even beta yet so you know
<imbrandon> NthDegree: i know the costs etc , i just cant get to the url atm, i got to it on my other box like 5 sec ago
<NthDegree> vmware server isn't worth it
<LaserJock> NthDegree: ? -security is for security fixes, -updates are for important updates, -backports if for whatever else that meets the backports policy
<Sp4rKy> i've a new question
<Sp4rKy> i'm packaging a python software named devede.py , but it should be located to /usr/bin/devede (without the .py)
<LaserJock> right
<NthDegree> Sp4rKy it's not compiled yet i don't think
<NthDegree> that may be why
<Sp4rKy> what must i do , modify theoriginal filename or rename the file after it has been moved to /usr/bin
<NthDegree> Sp4rKy just use the normal method of packaging
<NthDegree> it should make it correctly
<LaserJock> imbrandon: doesn't work for me, it's just sitting there
<Sp4rKy> i thought the name mustn't contain any extension
<LaserJock> Sp4rKy: you can move it around after it is intalled
<Sp4rKy> ok
<Sp4rKy> thx
<NthDegree> Sp4rKy, it is in source form right?
<LaserJock> Sp4rKy: in debian/rules if the source installs it with the .py
<Sp4rKy> yes
<imbrandon> thanks LaserJock i was going nuts lol
<jabra> ok so I can run perl Makefile.PL; make; make test and works fine when I run debuild one of the tests says operating not permitted
<mark_> hey everyone
<LaserJock> hi mark_
<bddebian> Hello mark_
<mark_> i need some masterful help.. =)
<mark_> first off IM a newb..windows xp hating newb..
* bddebian hides
<mark_> so last night was my first ever install of linx (ubuntu)
<mark_> anyone here wanna helpme?
<LaserJock> mark_: #ubuntu is the support channel
<_ion> With developing Ubuntu packages?
<jabra> LaserJock: thoughts?
<mark_> ohh oops
<mark_> sorry!
<LaserJock> jabra: hmm
<jabra> obviously I don't wanta have to sure sudo to build it
<LaserJock> jabra: can you paste the complete debuild run to a pastebin?
<jabra> sure do you want one manually done with perl Makefile.PL; make ; make test as well?
<LaserJock> nah
<jabra> k
<jabra> "] 
<jabra> http://pastebin.com/763141
<LaserJock> jabra: are you using pbuilder to build it?
<jabra> naw
<jabra> do I have too?
<jabra> I really haven't setup pbuilder yet
<LaserJock> it's a good idea, but you don't *have* to
<LaserJock> jabra: I really don't know any perl so I'm not sure what that error means
<jabra> it means it needs privs to run the test
<jabra> though I can do it manually without failing
<LaserJock> I'm not sure why that would be
<jabra> I dunno
<LaserJock> well, that's annoying
<jabra> ya definatly
<jabra> LaserJock: know anyone who could help me
<theCore> why Mono cannot be included into the Install CD? too big?
<jabra> if I do it with sudo can I still submit it for review?
<crimsun> theCore: among other reasons
<crimsun> theCore: I don't know /the/ reason, though
<LaserJock> jabra: I don't think sudo would help, have you tried it?
<LaserJock> crimsun: hehe, cause somebody forgot to write the spec? ;-)
<jabra> it  gets around that test
<LaserJock> weird
<LaserJock> so sudo works but fakeroot doesn't
<_ion> Just patch it to skip the test. :-)
<jabra> I dunno
<theCore> crimsun: ok, thanks
<jabra> LaserJock: could you help me some of the lintian bugs
<LaserJock> maybe, I'm not doing so good with helping today :-)
<jabra> what do you mean
<LaserJock> well, I didn't fix the last thing you wanted help on
<LaserJock> I'm suprised you still want me to help ;-)
<jabra> I have a much of errors from lintian
<jabra> any that you can help me with I would appreciate
<jabra> I really need this module packaged
<LaserJock> pastebin them and I'll tell you which one you can ignore
<jabra> k
<jabra> http://pastebin.com/763240
<LaserJock> jabra: ok, the first W: is due to the Standards-Version line in debian/control
<ogra> use lintian -i next time :)
<LaserJock> yeah, that too
<jabra> it hasn't created the package yet
<jabra> that is with debuild
<LaserJock> jabra: you can run lintian -i on the .dsc file
<ogra> in fact you should :)
<jabra> should be libnmap-parser-perlubuntu
<LaserJock> ?
<LaserJock> ogra: I usually forget since I look at the lintian run debuild does
<ogra> jabra, you mean the second line? that indicates a broken orig.taz.gz naming
<ogra> *tar
<jabra> ya
<ogra> LaserJock, well i also only do it with new packages i must admit :)
<jabra> how do I fix the first warning?
<LaserJock> jabra: use 3.6.2 for Standards-Version
<jabra> k
<jabra> ok fixed that warning
<jabra> the 2nd should be libnmap-parser-perl-ubuntu for source in control?
<ogra> the second indicates a wrong naming scheme for your orig.tar
<ogra> .gz
<ogra> fix that and it will go away
<jabra> and the errors?
<siretart> hi folks
<phanatic> hi siretart
<siretart> huhu phanatic
<pygi> hey phanatic, siretart ;)
<crimsun> thanks guys :)   [didn't want to clutter #-meeting] 
<dholbach> crimsun: you rock!
<siretart> crimsun: absolutely!
<phanatic> crimsun: congrats, keep on the great work you've done so far :)
<pygi> crimsun, once again congrats ;)
<jabra> anyone know a good perl module I can model this thing after?
<LaserJock> freaking heck, I forgot
<LaserJock> crimsun!!!!
<Sp4rKy> how could i rename a file after dh_install ?
<bddebian> mv
<Sp4rKy> but when , during build-install step ? (just after dh_install) ?
<bddebian> Sure
<Sp4rKy> bddebian, seems to don't work :/
<bddebian> What happens?
<phanatic> seems to be a packaging session going on @ #-meeting :)
<LaserJock> hehe
<Sp4rKy> mv /usr/bin/devede.py /usr/bin/devede
<Sp4rKy> mv: cannot stat `/usr/bin/devede.py': No such file or directory
<bddebian> Ah.. Not /usr
<bddebian>  You need to put in under the debian build tree
<bddebian>  Like debian/<package>/usr/bin/
<Sp4rKy> oups
<Sp4rKy> ok
<LaserJock> hmm, seems like mdz is in the offering mood today
<phanatic> LaserJock: indeed :) no wonder, he's release manager, so nothing to do after release :D
<LaserJock> hehe
<pygi> crimsun, another patch ;)
<bddebian> Time to head home, later folks
<bddebian> Congrats again crimsun
<Sp4rKy> bddebian, http://pastebin.com/763434
<crimsun> bddebian: danke
<Sp4rKy> here is the dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa output
<bddebian> Sp4rKy: You need to do it well before dh_installdeb.
<Sp4rKy> ouch, ok
<bddebian> Anyway, I have to run, good luck
<Sp4rKy> ok thx
<Sp4rKy> good bye
<crimsun> siretart: excellent, I'll apply too so we can have more coverage for u-b
<siretart> crimsun: superb!
<LaserJock> I will too
<LaserJock> or maybe not, if you have to be a core-dev
<siretart> the team is restricted, so we need to catch jdong on irc to change it to moderated
<LaserJock> I'd like to help anyway
<Kyral_FreeBSD> if bddebian has Core-Dev then I know who to go for HURD uploads :P
<lucas> siretart, LaserJock: great ! /me didn't really enjoy his interactions with u-b during dapper cycle ;)
<siretart> lucas: you mean jdongs? I think he was rather frustrated that things didn't go like he wanted..
<siretart> s/rather/a bit/
<Sp4rKy> sorry for inconvenience , but i have always the same issues
<lucas> yeah
<crimsun> the new policy should smooth things out considerably since three of us are core-dev
<lucas> maybe more communication with -core-dev would have helped
<feilex> hi - i would like to chat to ( mark ) sabdfl - is he still around? - I have an internet security question
<siretart> I didn't know that {dapper,breezy}-updates was supposed open for uploads at all
<ogra> lucas, applying for motu and showing packaging skills and community involvement would also have helped a lot
<siretart> feilex: try mailing him. he is on irc from time to time
<feilex> how?
<crimsun> siretart: nor I
<feilex> what is his email?
<ogra> lucas, he's applying for motu since months but has never uploaded a package
<siretart> ogra: he is still on the 'proposed members' list
<crimsun> siretart: err, did you mean -backports?
<ogra> siretart, i think so
<siretart> crimsun: argl, yeah, s/-updates/-backports/ again :/
<lucas> I didn't know that
<shawarma> feilex: Maybe you can start with discussing it on one of the mailing lists..
<lucas> ok, </jdong-bashing> :)
<ogra> heh
<siretart> I'll triple check every upload to -backports ;)
<crimsun> siretart: sok, I'm getting good at the regexp ;)
<feilex> i actually just have a question: i have constant problems with hackers - is there some way to know what information they are downloading - so to say: 'capture the packets and analise them?'
<Kyral_FreeBSD> ....you mean crackers right?
<StevenK> siretart: s/\(-\)updates/\1backports/ ;-P
<siretart> StevenK: does this work in vim as well? ;)
<StevenK> It ought to.
<siretart> hehe
<StevenK> Yes it does
<StevenK> I think vim supports sed and perl style regexs.
<StevenK> (That one being sed)
* Hobbsee waves to StevenK 
* StevenK jumps on Hobbsee
* Hobbsee just splats on the ground
<lucas> hey, I was wondering about something
<siretart> ok, gn8 folks. cu tomorrow. I heard edgy opens tomorrow ;)
<lucas> am I the only one finding it very difficult to work on merges when the "base version" is not the one you would expect it to be ,
<lucas> ?
<Sp4rKy> please ,  a python script located in /usr/bin should be named script or script.py
<Sp4rKy> ?
<lucas> script, since policy 3.7 ;)
<lucas> (yeah, ubuntu doesn't have it yet)
<Hobbsee> siretart: yay!
<Sp4rKy> i'm thinking too, but i have issue when i try to rename the script , anyone could help me ?
<Sp4rKy> the package is devede
<crimsun> what's the error on rename?
<Sp4rKy> but when i put a "mv debian/devede/usr/bin/script.py debian/devede/usr/bin/script" just before dh_installdeb it doesn't works
<crimsun> would you paste the error?
<Sp4rKy> mv debian/devede/usr/bin/devedy.py debian/devede/usr/bin/devede
<Sp4rKy> mv: cannot stat `debian/devede/usr/bin/devedy.py': No such file or directory
<LaserJock> so do you know that devedy.py made it there?
<crimsun> that just means debian/devede/usr/bin/devedy.py doesn't exist, and if it doesn't exist, it can't be renamed.
<crimsun> is it really devedy.py btw, or should it be devede.py?
<Sp4rKy> yes but it should exist , right ?
<crimsun> caveat: I haven't looked at the source, so I don't know if there's supposed to be a "devedy.py"
<Sp4rKy> the package works when i delete the move
<crimsun> yes, but is the source filename correct?
<Sp4rKy> yes
<LaserJock> Sp4rKy: do  a dpkg -c on the resulting .deb and see if it is really installed
<Sp4rKy> max@Sp4rKy-laptop (23:30) /home/max/devede/devede-1.6 #ls
<Sp4rKy> debian  devede.desktop  devede.glade  devede.gladep  devede.png  devede.py  docs  install.sh  pixmaps  po  uninstall.sh
<Sp4rKy> ok i'll try
<crimsun> there's no devedy.py, just as I suspected.
<crimsun> it's an 'e', not a 'y'
<Sp4rKy> i'm really stupid
<Sp4rKy> and very tired
<crimsun> sok, it happens to all of us
<Sp4rKy> :/
<Sp4rKy> it works now , thx crimsun !!!
<crimsun> np
<Sp4rKy> does exist a way to test package before put them on REVU
<Sp4rKy> to avoid many dput updatet :/
<shawarma> Like lintian or linda?
<Sp4rKy> yes i know them
<Sp4rKy> but with yersinia i've made a lot of update due to a lot of little inconvenience
<Sp4rKy> whereas lintian and linda like my packages
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: ...well, you should always be testing your packages before/after updating to REVU :)
<crimsun> spacey: it's useful to have pbuilder/sbuild and a separate chroot for that purpose
<shawarma> Then what do you mean by "a way to test package"?
<Sp4rKy> just a way to avoid many update
<Sp4rKy> like a personnal MOTU reviewer to help me :D
<Sp4rKy> thx to gloubiboulga :D
<shawarma> Could you perhaps give an example of the kind of error you'd like to catch before uploading that is easier to see after uploading?
<Sp4rKy> little errors like change dapper by edgy in the changelog or del all the unusuable line in rules ...
<shawarma> so the kind that is spotted by reviewers? Nah, I don't think there's a tool for that.
<shawarma> Other than a personal checklist that you always go through before uploading.
<Sp4rKy> ok
<Sp4rKy> i'll try
<Sp4rKy> thus are my first packages , but i would create many packages, so i'll try to make good packages now !
<shawarma> Stuff like: Commented lines in debian/rules, changelog entry, .ex-files in debian/, missing dependencies (test with pbuilder)..
<Sp4rKy> in this package, i've done the modification of debian/rules , changelog , control
<Sp4rKy> del all the *.ex and *.EX file
<Sp4rKy> test with pbuilder and lintian
<Sp4rKy> so i think it could be uploaded to revu ...
<shawarma> Great. Common mistakes are missing man pages for any binary in /usr/bin/ or /usr/sbin/
<Sp4rKy> lintian says that
<shawarma> That's true.
<Sp4rKy> lintian doesn't output any errors/warning
<shawarma> Well then just go ahead an upload.
<shawarma> The human review process is also a great way to learn.
<Sp4rKy> yes of course
<Sp4rKy> uploaded to revu :)
<Sp4rKy> please, yet other questions :/
<Sp4rKy> i hope i don't disturb you with all my questions
<shawarma> Hey, if I didn't want to be disturbed I most certainly wouldn't be on IRC. :-)
<Sp4rKy> :)
<Sp4rKy> ok
<Sp4rKy> so , i'll try to package audacious
<Sp4rKy> and i've some questions about the way to "explode" binary and library in to packages
<Sp4rKy> do i just write 3 sections in debian/control and 3 .install files ?
<tseng> something like that
<tseng> but you should really consult similar packages
<tseng> and the debian policy
<Sp4rKy> i consult the debian policy :)
#ubuntu-motu 2006-06-07
<jabra> can someone help me with packaging a perl module
<shawarma> Can someone point me to the example .dputrc that used to be somewhere on REVU?
<shawarma> or just throw it my way in a /msg ?
<shawarma> Never mind. Found it
<jabra> can someone help me with packaging a perl module
<zul> hey
<shawarma> Can anyone give me a crash course in lintian overrides?
<ajmitch> morning all
<Laser_away> hi ajmitch
<thierryn> is there an update in security repository about  http://www.securityfocus.com/bid/18290 ?
<thierryn> I just discovered someone sent an email in my account from my account with the link inside...
<DarkMageZ> any news about the edgy eft repo?, i can
<DarkMageZ> can't wait to get a testbox back on the bleeding edge :)
<ryanakca> hmmm... I just made an updated package of bzflag, and I'm wondering wether I set the package maintainer to Tim Riker, or to me... btw, this IS just a trial/practice package :)
<ryanakca> I made the package... yet make debian-cvs default = tim riker... if you get what I mean... I didn't make the source... just package it :)
<Laser_away> keep the maintianer the same
<ryanakca> Laser_away: kk, ty
<ryanakca> Laser_away: kk, and if the package works, even though it probably wont... is there a way of sharing it, to see if it works on anybody else's box?
<Laser_away> ryanakca: yes, REVU. wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU
<Laser_away> or if there is a bug report you can attach a debdiff
<ryanakca> Laser_away: again, ty :)
<Laser_away> np
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Laser_away> hi bddebian
<ajmitch> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi LaserJock
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<ajmitch> LaserJock: ah, finally not away? ;)
<LaserJock> well, I kinda gave up
<bddebian> Heh
<LaserJock> I was going to work, and then my experiment didn't work out so well
<bddebian> Kaboom? :-)
<LaserJock> not exactly
<LaserJock> but the Environmental Health & Safety  inspection guys were in today :(
<ajmitch> nasty
<bddebian> Joy
<LaserJock> and we get an EPA inspection next week
<LaserJock> so I have to be on my best behavior
<ajmitch> or not show up to work
<LaserJock> and clean up all the unmarked chemical waste ;-)
<ajmitch> show them into another lab :)
<LaserJock> I'm the senior grad student (although the youngest) so I have to be there
<ajmitch> darn
<LaserJock> plus I'm the Laser Safety Officer for the lab so ...
<LaserJock> but the guys that do the laser safety inspections know absolutely nothing about lasers :(
<ajmitch> you need a safety officer?
<LaserJock> yeah
<ajmitch> how powerful are those lasers?
<LaserJock> well, there is Class 1 to Class 4
<LaserJock> we have Class 4
<LaserJock> but considering laser pointers are usually Class 3 that doesn't say a whole lot
<ajmitch> heh
<LaserJock> you can easily blow the retina off the back of your eye if you get a direct hit
<tseng> a cdrw is pretty high powered
<LaserJock> yeah
<ajmitch> right
<LaserJock> but the biggest danger is the high voltage
<LaserJock> the power supply has 50,000 volt capacitors
<zul> heh laser fights in the hallway...lasertag
<tseng> lasertag doesnt even use lasers
<bddebian> Heya tseng
<tseng> hi
<bddebian> zul: Happy now? :-)
<zul> yes very :)
<LaserJock> but we keep fighting with the campus laser safety officer about laser goggles
<zul> if you need my help just ask
<LaserJock> they don't understand that if you have googles that block the laser beam from nailing your eyes, that also means you can't see where the darn thing is going
<ajmitch> heh
<LaserJock> I was explaining that today to one of the Uni's top EH&S guys, and he stares at me for a minute and says,"yeah, that might be a problem" :-)
<bddebian> FSck, I don't even know what to work on right now..
<ryanakca> is this a valid debian/changelog file? http://pastebin.com/764239 (well... it's a snippet)
<ajmitch> bddebian: hack on main
<bddebian> Why
<ajmitch> because you were told to
<ajmitch> so do it
<bddebian> I was told to?
<ajmitch> yes
<Toadstool> ryanakca: er, "see ChangeLog" is not the right thing to do imho...
<bddebian> ryanakca: Looks fine, though I would say "New upstream release"
<bddebian> ajmitch: By whom?
<ajmitch> mdz
<ajmitch> and me
<ajmitch> get to work!
<bddebian> Doing what?
<ryanakca> Toadstool: 2.0.4 changelog: http://pastebin.com/764244
<Toadstool> bddebian: you can hack main, rock on :)
<ajmitch> bddebian: hacking main, get moving
<ajmitch> you said you wanted to fix X
<bddebian> ajmitch: You have zul for that
<bddebian> ajmitch: Fabbione didn't want my help
<Toadstool> 'night everybody
<ajmitch> no, fabbione didn't want someone just coming along & expecting to fix things
<bddebian> GNight Toadstool
<ToadZzZztool> cya bddebian ;)
<ajmitch> zakame spent a week or more just getting stuck into the bug list & finding his way around
<bddebian> I live on the bug list what's your point?
<ajmitch> I didn't say finding his way around malone
<bddebian> Apparently I should just be packaging new BS packages :-)
<ajmitch> but getting stuck into the code
<bddebian> Frickin' Hurd
<LaserJock> hehe, I used to say something similar to the sheep
<LaserJock> when I was going up
<bddebian> ??
<LaserJock> Hurd -> Herd ;-)
<LaserJock> whatever
<bddebian> :-)
<bddebian> How do packages get removed from REVU?
<LaserJock> you ask REVU admin to do it
<ajmitch> someone asks a revu admin
<bddebian> Can someone remove qt-x11-free then? :-)
<ajmitch> and you slip a REVU admin some cash
<bddebian> And why does keytouch say no comments/advocates but there is a boatload of comments?
<ajmitch> qt-x11-free is in the archived section on REVU
<ajmitch> why do you want someone elses upload removed now?
<bddebian> Ah, so archived section means it's uploaded?
<ajmitch> because the number of comments is against the most recent upload
<ajmitch> yes, archived means uploaded or no longer relevant for reviewing
<bddebian> Ah, OK, NM then :-)
<bluefoxicy> heh
<bluefoxicy> Add/Remove applications lets me hide commercial andu niverse
<bluefoxicy> but it doesn't do the equally important task of hiding KDE, GNOME, XFCE, Qt, or GTK+ apps.
<bluefoxicy> on a gnome desktop I shy away from XFCE suite programs, and definitely don't want KDE apps that install the base environment for KDE
<bluefoxicy> what do you get like a third or a half of the KDE desktop?
<bluefoxicy> The Xubuntu guys don't want parts of gnome in Xubuntu, they're still trying to buff all of that out of the distribution entirely
<bluefoxicy> I should probably go bug on that.
<FunnyLookinHat> bluefoxicy, throw it into a suggestion for edgy i suppose
<bluefoxicy> yeah
<Hobbsee> hi all
<Sp4rKy> hi MOTUs
<Hobbsee> hey Sp4rKy
<Sp4rKy> just a little question before go to work :)
<Sp4rKy> how must i do when the "/usr/local/*" path is wrote diresctly in the Makefile and couldn't be switched by any option
<Sp4rKy> do i use mysoftware.install file ?
<Hobbsee> er...hmmm...
* Hobbsee doesnt know
<Sp4rKy> :/
<Sp4rKy> i think it's that , because we mustn't modify the Makefile :/
<Hobbsee> unless you can set it in debian/rules somehow...
* Hobbsee is guessing, i really dont know/remember
<Sp4rKy> i think the only way with debian/rules file is using dh_install
<Sp4rKy> so i'll back later (i'm late for work :)
<ajmitch> alright
* ajmitch hopes edgy is open within 24h or so :)
<Hobbsee> hey ajmitch
* Hobbsee was wondering if it would be
<ajmitch> fairly likely
* TheMuso remembers reading something this morning about launchpad needing to be updated for edgy or something.
<TheMuso> c
<ajmitch> yes, and it's going down for that update in a few minutes
<ajmitch> more soyuz fixes & the like
<hub> with debian resync
<hub> or not yet?
<ajmitch> I don't know
<ajmitch> we'll find out
* Hobbsee watches it explode in the distance...
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you have no faith in our launchpad developers
<Hobbsee> guess it didnt wokr :P
<Hobbsee> heh
* Hobbsee hides from the big and scary LP developers, who she would have just offended
<ajmitch> there are some in sydney, too...
<Hobbsee> oh dear...so they could come find me?
<ajmitch> yes
<Hobbsee> no they couldnt...they'd need my address.
<hub> if the men in black knock at the door it is them
<Hobbsee> hehe
<ajmitch> they don't need to
<ajmitch> they're launchpad developers
<hub> Hobbsee: no need. they'll traceroute the IPs
* hub should go to bed instead. it is late here
<Hobbsee> bah.  bed seems a world away...
* Hobbsee growls again at having been woken up this morning.
<hub> Hobbsee: depends of were in the world. summer is coming here too
<Hobbsee> true
* Hobbsee wonders how close they could trace it...
<ajmitch> because you have offended launchpad, sabdfl will fly over to australia to take care of things
<Hobbsee> hehe
* Hobbsee hides in a corner
<ajmitch> hiding will not help
<Hobbsee> sure it will!
<Hobbsee> hiding *always* helps!
<ajmitch> nope
<Hobbsee> :(
<Hobbsee> do i have any other alternatives?
<ajmitch> yes
<Hobbsee> what are they?
<ajmitch> sincerely apologise
* ajmitch gets back to doing stuff
<Hobbsee> oh.
<Hobbsee> hmmm....
<ajmitch> I recall that the toolchain needs to be setup for edgy before any other packages will be built
* Hobbsee "borrows" the stuff, so that ajmitch cant go and do it :P
<Hobbsee> ah okay
<ajmitch> please don't
<Hobbsee> sorry...
* ajmitch must do this stuff
<Hobbsee> i was joking, really
<ajmitch> this stuff is very important stuff
<Hobbsee> go for it
<ajmitch> having someone steal it on irc is rather inconvenient
<Hobbsee> hehe
* ajmitch should replace his monitor
<ajmitch> hi Yagisan
<Yagisan> G'day ajmitch
<Hobbsee> hey Yagisan
<Yagisan> Hi Hobbsee
<Yagisan> ajmitch: found out today why my plone site is so slow
<ajmitch> why is that?
<ajmitch> RAM issues?
<Yagisan> ajmitch: evidently apache wasn't caching it, even though I though I set that up.
<ajmitch> ah
<ajmitch> this is annoying
<ajmitch> I have to try & remember my windows password
<Yagisan> ajmitch: heh. what version ?
<ajmitch> 2k3
<Yagisan> ajmitch: we have tools in multiverse to "fix" that. chntpasswd or similar
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> but it shouldn't be needed
<ajmitch> since I'm sure I've got the password that it uses
<ajmitch> however I have been playing with active directory
<ajmitch> wouldn't surprise me if it were breaking
<ajmitch> hm yes
<Yagisan> ah. quite likely.
<ajmitch> especially as it still works with cygwin sshd
<ajmitch> but not logging into the desktop
<ajmitch> there we go
<Yagisan> heh. I found an amusing song
<ajmitch> hm, luma looks like a moderately useful tool
<Hobbsee> Yagisan: the llama song, by any chance?
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: ah, I believe it is called "Which Backstreet Boy is gay ?"
<Hobbsee> oh
<ajmitch> .*
* Yagisan is emailing it to some Backstreet boys fans, and going to look forward their replies >:)
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: it's to the tune of one of their songs. Also means I set amule up correctly O:-)
<Hobbsee> oh ok
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: I have a twisted sense of humor
<ajmitch> yes, you do
<ajmitch> australians...
<Hobbsee> so do i, dont worry.  people are convinced i'm a pyromaniac, for some reason.
<Laser_away> light anything on fire lately Hobbsee?
* Hobbsee mutters about new zealanders
<Yagisan> ajmitch careful, or we'll try to ebay your country again
<Hobbsee> Laser_away: er...i'd have to think about that...
<Hobbsee> Yagisan: hehe!
<Yagisan> ;)
<ajmitch> Yagisan: it's a shame, we can't even pay people to tow australia away :)
<Laser_away> lol
<Hobbsee> mainly cos you lot dont have the money to do it ;P
<Hobbsee> or the resources
<Hobbsee> crud, scratch that.
<ajmitch> heh
<Hobbsee> hobbsee:  think *before* you type!
<ajmitch> it's so much more amusing if you think afterwards
<ajmitch> it gives us hours of fun
<Hobbsee> Laser_away: i dont think so, but there was a fire drill yesterday at my uni...
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: hehe.  sure.
* Yagisan is looking on in stunned disbelief at what Hobbsee typed
* Hobbsee blames the morning meeting, for scrambling her brain!
* Hobbsee reminds herself again - think *before* typing!
<Yagisan> ajmitch: of course you can't pay people to tow australia away. all the employed kiwis at at bondi ;)
* Yagisan sprints like mad
<Hobbsee> hehe.  i dont feel so bad now :P
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> goody, looks like I have an LDAP schema setup
<ajmitch> I just need to populate it
<Yagisan> actually, there may be some kiwis near me. The pub is flying a kiwi flag
<ajmitch> of course there are kiwis near you
* Yagisan winders if they know it is a kiwi flag
<ajmitch> I come from a town of ~4000 people
<Yagisan> ajmitch: doubt it. I'd spot anyone that speaks english near my place
<ajmitch> I walk into a shop in brisbane, talking to the person behind the counter about linux
<ajmitch> and it turns out her parents are from the town I'm from
<ajmitch> sigh
<ajmitch> can't get away from them
<Hobbsee> haha
<Yagisan> ajmitch: centrelink isn't a shop :-P
<ajmitch> :P
<ajmitch> http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/archives/014045.html
<ajmitch> yay for politics
<Hobbsee> icky, politics.
<Hobbsee> guess i have to vote at the next election, too...that'll suck!
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: why ? free bbq, free toilet paper err promotional material. Chance to see your vote really doesn't matter because the bigger dickhead will win anyway.
<Hobbsee> Yagisan: that is true..i just really couldnt be bothered going down and doing it...
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: I took my wife down one day to see how it worked. The best bit - the bbq
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> parents used to drag me down to teh local school with them - we just climbed over bits of the buildings
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: besides, not attending is like all the people in the US that didn't feel like voting - a defacto vote for shrub and friends
<Hobbsee> true
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: I'd rather vote uni fees down, then up - but that's just me.
* ajmitch sets network-auth back to drafting...
<Hobbsee> i think we're in a stable area anyway - so it doesnt really matter what a few people vote...
* Hobbsee cant believe that she's actually discussing politics
* Hobbsee checks which state she's in
<ajmitch> and the rest of us here are slaving away over ubuntu
<ajmitch> and you discuss politics!
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: no, just is it worth voting, and is the bbq worth it
<Hobbsee> hush you!  :P
<Hobbsee> Yagisan: i dont recall us getting bbq's - but i think we usually go down later...
<Yagisan> ajmitch: hurry up with my updates. *cracks whip*
<ajmitch> Yagisan: you wait
<Yagisan> ajmitch: quiet slave *cracks whip harder* :-P
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: "otherwise we'll have to taunt you a second time"  :P
<crimsun> dang, ajmitch is fighting a one-man battle
<Hobbsee> hey crimsun
<crimsun> hullo
<ajmitch> crimsun: yes, all the cheap seats are filled with hecklers tonight
<crimsun> =] 
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: dont worry.  we'll get you worse when you're actually here :P
* ajmitch fetches a nice & updated pam_krb5
* Yagisan pretends to work and fires up a copy of enemy territory.
* Hobbsee doesnt even have to pretend to work - people come in here, and i switch to another desktop :P
* Yagisan will probably get owned by the bots
<dholbach> good morning MOTU world!
<Hobbsee> hey dholbach
<dholbach> heya Hobbsee!
<Hobbsee> :)
<siretart> hi folks
<siretart> ajmitch: you got Network Authentication approved for SoC?
<pygi> siretart, yup, he did
<siretart> cool! congrats to ajmitch! :)
<ajmitch> oh yes
<ajmitch> thanks :)
<ajmitch> siretart: so now you can give me tips & a wishlist ;)
<siretart> ajmitch: oooh, you are accepting wishlists? *evilgrin*
<ajmitch> one must accomodate users where possible
<siretart> hehe
<siretart> ajmitch: are you thinking about a 'simple' single signon kerberos based system?
<ajmitch> yes
<siretart> cool :)
* ajmitch is getting further with a manual setup :)
<shawarma> I have a package that's not showing up in REVU. My e-mail is either sh@warma.dk or sh@linux2go.dk and the package is network-manager-pptp
<ajmitch> did you upload a source-only package?
<shawarma> Yup
<ajmitch> do you have the output of dput?
<ajmitch> since it's not in incoming or rejected on tiber
<shawarma> http://pastebin.com/764750
<ajmitch> "Upload package to host ubuntu"
<shawarma> Yeah, I have no idea why it says that. I'll just toss my .dputrc in there as well.
<ajmitch> and your /etc/dput.cf or ~/.dput.cf?
<ajmitch> I hope you have .dput.cf, not .dputrc :)
<shawarma> oh....
<shawarma> :-H
<shawarma> Whoops.
<shawarma> that's probably it, then. :-D
<ajmitch> it probably went to launchpad
<ajmitch> since /etc/dput.cf defaults to upload.ubuntu.com
<shawarma> *G* Oh, well..
<ajmitch> it's all frozen now, so shouldn't be any harm in it :)
<ajmitch> was distro set to edgy?
<shawarma> Yes
<shawarma> Does http://pastebin.com/764751 look right? Because now I'm getting errors from dput.
<ajmitch> heh, hopefully it doesn't get shoved into a queue there :)
<ajmitch> try DEFAULT rather than default
<shawarma> Great. That was it.
<shawarma> I'll just fix it on the wiki.
<ajmitch> thanks
<shawarma> Hmm... No, it looks right on the wiki...
<ajmitch> heh
* shawarma wonders where he got this from..
<shawarma> "Upload package to host revu
<shawarma> Much better. Thanks!
<ajmitch> I see it uploading now
<ajmitch> it should be processed in a couple of minutes
<shawarma> Cool.
<ajmitch> excellent, now I can't login to my box
<ajmitch> (in vmware)
<cbx33> hi guys
<cbx33> after some packaging help
<cbx33> I'm new to packaging
<cbx33> I wanted to ask
<cbx33> when using deb helper
<cbx33> in the rules file
<cbx33> if I had a package.install file
<cbx33> to tell it where to install files
<cbx33> what would i need to put in the rules file for that to be executed?
<cbx33> dh_install?
<ajmitch> yes
<cbx33> wuld package, have to match exactly the name of the package?
<cbx33> or will it install all .install pacakges?
<ajmitch> for each package in debian/control it will do the appropriate package.install
<ajmitch> depending on dh_install arguments, etc
<cbx33> yes i see
<ajmitch> the manpage can explain better than I can at the moment :)
<cbx33> the same for dirs
<cbx33> ok thanks ajmitch
<cbx33> one last thing quicky, if you have multiple packages in the control file, is that how it'll create multiple source packages from the same source tarball?
<azeem> multiple source packages?
<ajmitch> hi azeem, \sh
<Yagisan> cbx33: you'll get multiple binary packages & one source package
<\sh> moins
<azeem> heya
<\sh> cbx33: there is no such thing as multiple source packages...it's one debian src package and multiple binary packages
<ajmitch> yay, a different error message
<ajmitch> making progress here ;)
<ajmitch> finding how important DNS is to kerberos...
<Mithrandir> "quite". :-)
<cbx33> ok, sorry i meant binary
<cbx33> ajmitch: indeed
<ajmitch> Mithrandir: yes, I was a little slack with DNS for my vmware setups :)
<cbx33> ahhhh vmware
* cbx33 hugs vmware
<ajmitch> hey jsgotangco, what's new?
<jsgotangco> well...
<zul> hey
<kelmo> siretart: gday
<siretart> huhu kelmo
<siretart> how are you?
<kelmo> i am ok, could be happier with some things, but thats a long story . . .
<kelmo> and you?
<ajmitch> hi kelmo
<kelmo> gday ajmitch
<havoc> morning
<kelmo> siretart: i have prepared a small patch against the ubuntu wpasupplicant package, if you would like to discuss/test/consider it as patch for a bugfix update
<kelmo> siretart: http://rafb.net/paste/results/7vEFTc86.html
<sivang> hey guys
<pygi> hey siretart ;)
<kelmo> siretart: i realise you are probably working, so please ping me via email with questions concerning that (i will be leaving shortly)
* ajmitch wonders how fluent sabdfl's russian is now :)
<havoc> ajmitch: morning
<jsgotangco> oh no
<Hobbsee> hey all
<jsgotangco> they might be preparing for "go back to space" brochures by now
<jsgotangco> we're doomed
<ajmitch> heh
<Toadstool> hi everybody
<Hobbsee> hey Toadstool
<Toadstool> hi Hobbsee
<Lathiat> ajmitch: i got a dsl upgrade :)
<Lathiat> ajmitch: 1.8M/s ;)
<ajmitch> Lathiat: good
<ajmitch> I can commence hating you now
* Lathiat grins
<Lathiat> 17.5G quota 'l hurt a bit tho
<Lathiat> but i gues you get 10..
<ajmitch> 20
<Lathiat> fortunately the isp has an ubuntu/debian/etc mirror thats free traffic
<Lathiat> still
<ajmitch> but the 20 is uploads & downloads, no free traffic
<Lathiat> uploads too? ouch
* ajmitch is still on 3.5Mbps/512k
<Lathiat> no isp here.. well except telstra.. accounts uploads
<ajmitch> blame telecom
<ajmitch> we all do
<hub> that suck
<Lathiat> i thought you had 2/128
<Lathiat> must've gone up?
<ajmitch> I had 2/128
* Lathiat has 17.5/1
<ajmitch> it went up
<Lathiat> if i move to modem to the other side of the less dodgy wiring might go up a bit, have to try later when i cbf
<Lathiat> (can go to 24/1)
<ajmitch> not like you'll see much difference
* Riddell points https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuEdgyPackageUpdates out to the channel
<ajmitch> we may get ADSL2+ within another 2-3 years
<Lathiat> well telstra doesnt do adsl2+ here
<Lathiat> have to go a third party isp whos goit their own dslams
<Lathiat> of which there are 2
<Lathiat> 1 of which has one in my exchange
<Lathiat> its been pretty recent tho, like, last 6months o rso
<Lathiat> telstra i dont think will for a long time
* kelmo is unable to get cable or adsl
<Lathiat> iiborg bought ihug over there
<Lathiat> they might roll out dslams there?
* kelmo does not like telstra
<ajmitch> Lathiat: yeah, they promised to invest $20m if LLU went through
<ajmitch> and we got LLU.. so we'll see what arrangements happen
<Lathiat> unbundled local loop?
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> *finally* happened
<Lathiat> ('ULL' here)
<Lathiat> nice
<ajmitch> same thing, LLU=local loop unbundling
<Lathiat> ah
<Hobbsee> kelmo: telstra's evil.  especially when the internet goes down, along with the phone.
<Lathiat> that happened to me
<Lathiat> they connet my internet yesterday
<Lathiat> well thats what they said
<Lathiat> in reality, i lose the whole line, no dial tone
<Lathiat> they fixed it today
* Hobbsee is just looking forward to getting fibre to the home, rather than copper cabling.
* Hobbsee thinks that will be fun.
<ajmitch> by the time that comes around here, I'll have probably sworn off computers for life
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> wont you get bored then?
<ajmitch> no
<ajmitch> I'll be sane
<Hobbsee> sanity's boring.
<DBO> Hobbsee, is there really that much you can download?
<DBO> you'll have ever linux distro known to man in the first 48 hours... then what?
<Hobbsee> well, no, i'm restricted by my harddrive...but still...
<vinboy> u guys from new zealand?
<Hobbsee> vinboy: ajmitch is
<vinboy> COOL
<vinboy> same as me
<vinboy> i could guess it when he mentioned the LLU
<Hobbsee> the telstra whingers are in australia
<vinboy> hahaha
<vinboy> close enough
<Hobbsee> and i say that, with me being one of them :P
<vinboy> Hobbsee: r u a packager?
<vinboy> u from aus too?
<Hobbsee> yes, i'm an aussie, and i probably count as a packager
<vinboy> nice nice
<Riddell> I think MOTU is having an antipidean takeover
<Hobbsee> Riddell: an antiwhat?
<_ion> do al th aus abbrev words?
<tseng> I was going to say
<ajmitch> _ion: wrds, not words
<tseng> "r u a typist?"
<tseng> but I thought better of it
<Riddell> antipodean
* Hobbsee goes off to wikipedia.
<tseng> In Britain, "the Antipodes" is often used to refer to Australia and New Zealand (and "Antipodeans" for their inhabitants), despite the fact that neither Australia nor New Zealand actually overlap the antipodal points of Britain.
<Hobbsee> ah, i see..
<jsgotangco> interesting
<DBO> so who do I beg to get the MythTV in multiverse updates from its current year old release to something released like 6 months ago...
* Hobbsee mutters and grumbles about people using big and difficult words that she doesnt understand, then remembers defenestration and antidisestablishmentarianism, and stops complaining.
<jsgotangco> defenestration lol
* tseng throws jsgotangco out the 2nd story window
* DBO tells Hobbsee about pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis
* zul discobunulates jsgotangco 
<jsgotangco> doh
<Hobbsee> hehe
<jsgotangco> sounds like you disco'ed me to death
<tseng> Your search - discobunulates - did not match any documents.
<tseng> I know discombobulate..?
<cbx33> DBO: you got a definition for that mouthful?
* Hobbsee wants to hear it
<DBO> http://dictionary.reference.com/help/faq/language/p/pneumono.html
<ogra> DBO, wow, if you add some capital letters and numbers that makes a very safe passwrod
<ogra> *password too
<DBO> its a perfectly cromulent word cbx33
<cbx33> passrod ?
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> splendid
<zul> ogra: ipfreely1 is a secure password isnt it?
<ogra> well, i'd add a capital letter somewhere
<DBO> zul, if only for the fact that nobody would want to admit it
<tseng> factitious means not real, btw
<tseng> oh shit
<tseng> it would, with an I
<cbx33> tseng: LMAO
<tseng> odd to have a dictionary definition say that a word is "facticious"
<tseng> its in the dictionary
<DBO> tseng, odd indeed
<Riddell> DBO: you can make updated packages and get them reviewed
<DBO> lemme say something... pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis, you're suspect
<tseng> "facticious" and "alledged to mean" don't work well in the same line
<DBO> tseng, i think that might be a typo
<cbx33> check out tseng and his dictionary :p
<tseng> that I would buy
<tseng> antidisestablishmentarianism < i always thought this was the biggest word
<DBO> Riddell, yeah I tried that once, turns out Im a bad maintainer =P
<tseng> and it is real
<DBO> tseng, well you never heard of our even bigger factitious word
<tseng> but is it factitious or ficticious?
<tseng> the world may never know
<tseng> 'Llanfairpwllgwyngyllgogerychwyrndrobwllllantysiliogogogoch', a village in Wales
<DBO> thats a name
<DBO> thats cheating
<tseng> http://dictionary.reference.com/help/faq/language/l/longestword.html
<DBO> Im going to name my as of yet non-existant child Llanfairpwllgwyngyllgogerychwyrndrobwllllantysiliogogogoch+1 just to spite them
<tseng> that word is disturbingly short on vowels
<DBO> the welch have never been fond of them
<DBO> they graced us english speakers with the word cwm
<Riddell> ll is a vowel
* ajmitch would love to be able to login & authenticate here
<DarkMageZ> if a package (an emulator eg, dosbox), has a bug in it that isn't likely to be ever to get fixed upstream, because it already has a workaround which they are happy with, is it ok to reject the bug, solong as i explain why?
<DarkMageZ> they = upstream
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: login and authenticate?
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: yes?
* Hobbsee didnt know what that meant.
<Hobbsee> login and authenticate to what?
<ajmitch> ubuntu?
<Hobbsee> oh
* Hobbsee wins the stupidity award for the night
* ajmitch is doing network auth stuff
* Hobbsee grabs the dunce cap, puts it on, and sits in the corner.
<Hobbsee> ah, fun
<ajmitch> don't be silly
<ogra> ajmitch, will it be prepared for AD ?
<ajmitch> ogra: we'll see
<ajmitch> it should be possible
<ogra> its a request i get very often for edubuntu, would be cool to at least have the hooks to implement it later
<tseng> AD already works fine for login with just libpam-krb5
<tseng> i use it here on every server
<tseng> so i dont have to keep track of passwords on 2 dozen boxes
<ajmitch> that's what I'd expected
<tseng> i dont do anything beyond that
<tseng> apperantly people do
<tseng> actually using krb5 tickets for something useful would be nice
<_ion> tehd: to do [something] . teett: to have [something]  made. teettt: to have [something]  had made. teettttt: to have [something]  had had made. etc.
<ogra> you just installed libpam-krb5 and didnt configure anything ?
<tseng> no
<tseng> I added some krb5 base packages
<tseng> and listed my domain controller in /etc/krb5.conf
<ogra> aha
<tseng> and then
<ajmitch> most info on it goes into a fair bit more detail
<tseng> edited some files in pam.d
<_ion> Whoops, the last word should have been "teetttt", too many "t"s. ;-)
<tseng> to use krb5
<tseng> but there isnt that much to it
<DBO> you ever consider doing ldap over AD?
<tseng> why would I do that
<tseng> LDAP is scary and unencrypted
<tseng> LDAPS is even scarier
<_ion> teetttttttttttttttttttt: to have [something]  had had had had had had had had had had had had had had had had had had made.
<DBO> LDAP can do TLS...
<tseng> _ion: dude
<tseng> _ion: got it.
<tseng> I don't see a benefit to using ldap in my case
<cbx33> tseng: I'm trying to get AD auth working properly on edubuntu
<tseng> cbx33: cool.
<DBO> eh, Im a fan, we use it fairly extensively here, but then again, we dont really use it the same way most people do...
<cbx33> I got the auth working fine, and the connection of the home dir
<cbx33> but....it won;t load allow them to log in graphically
<tseng> not much interested in mounting home dirs all over the place
<cbx33> and I'm not sure y
<tseng> backhauled between a half dozen data centers
<cbx33> well, this is to facilitate a windows integration
<DBO> tseng, oh no user directly authenticates through ldap, actually the AD servers get their sam files overwritten from the ldap tree (its actually flat) when we add users into the ldap cluster
<DBO> then perms are still handled at the AD server for that part of the network
<tseng> DBO: i see
<DBO> we still have to handle things like their email, phone access, file lockers... tons of things
<tseng> email..
* tseng makes a face at exchange 5.5
<DBO> eh, we run sendmail
<DBO> big Sun servers
<DBO> anyhow... all we do is throw someones name in the ldap cluster and it pushes their login info out into all the different services in about 20 seconds (that about 40 different boxes it has to go to)
<cbx33> DBO wow
* Hobbsee notes that she is burning herself accidently.  eek.
<cbx33> Hobbsee: awww....
<cbx33> sunlight?
<DBO> cbx33, the guy who made this system is a friend of mine, and the worlds sickest geek
* Mithrandir douses Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> no, laptop powerpack - was usign it as a heater.
<DBO> he was doing unix when he was 12... 20 years ago
<cbx33> ahhh
<Hobbsee> thanks Mithrandir - now i'm even colder!
<cbx33> sheesh
<cbx33> DBO wish I'd started linux ealier
<DBO> this was before linux =P
<cbx33> yeh, but I'm just saying
<DBO> =)
<Mithrandir> Hobbsee: better than getting roasted.
<cbx33> I could have gotten loads more years under me belt
<Hobbsee> Mithrandir: true
<jsgotangco> cbx33: i started linux years before but just started contributing 2 years ago :/
<DBO> anyhow tseng... the idea was we could consolidate all of our authentications with ldap, which is kinda important with over 20k active users, and 100k accounts
<tseng> AD does auth to the same place with krb5 or ldap
<tseng> afaik
<cbx33> I've been coding in one way or another since I was 10
<tseng> it uses the same underlying data, different protocols
<cbx33> jsgotangco: but only been using linux for about 3 years
<jsgotangco> that still amounts to something
<DBO> AD is ldap of sorts... its microsofts sick love child of ldap
<tseng> I know what it is
<DBO> =)
<tseng> but the domain controller answers krb5 requests with the same data
<tseng> windows itself prefers krb5 as the transport, I believe
<cbx33> jsgotangco true - just gotta learn more...MORE MOOOORREEEEE
<cbx33> my latest efforts, packaging
<DBO> tseng, either can be secured fairly easily, but most security should be handled at the network level anyhow.  If you have security issues at the server level its already wayyyy too late...  Heck, our wireless network is entirely unencrypted
<tseng> haha, lecture me about security
<DBO> sorry...
<DBO> Im sure you know more than I
<tseng> I work at a giant financial company
* DBO works at a giant university
<tseng> we process credit, debit, power half the ATMs in the US
<DBO> oooooh
* cbx33 works at a school and shuts up
<tseng> we encrypt things in our own data center, and everywhere else when possible
* cbx33 wishes he was clever
<cbx33> -er
<DBO> tseng, I meant you no offense, nor did I mean to... patronize you, that was NOT my intent
* jsgotangco befriends tseng one more time
* tseng hugs jerome
* jsgotangco shows tseng his empty debit card
<tseng> DBO: haha I don't care
<tseng> jsgotangco: it is already about 50 places in the tape room
<tseng> jsgotangco: i have it :)
<jsgotangco> nice
<tseng> the tape room has a badge reader on either door
<tseng> you have to swipe both sides or you are locked in
<tseng> visa rules
<DBO> tseng, you'll love how i have to get into my office...
<cbx33> cool
<tseng> mantrap?
<DBO> no, better
* cbx33 uses wait for it...... a key
<jsgotangco> do you use carbon monoxide for fire security?
<tseng> not that I know of
<DBO> I approach the building  to two double doors with keypad locks, open those
<DBO> inside there are two more double doors, swipe card to get through that
<DBO> then inside of THAT there is a security guard and a hand scanner (looks like something out of minority reports, they just put it in)
<DBO> you and the guard BOTH scan
<DBO> then the door opens
<tseng> hah we have that kind of crap in Denver
<DBO> you have 45 seconds to do the whole thing or an alarm load as all... my ears still ring...
<tseng> the man trap you badge in and out of
<tseng> and it weighs you going in and out
<DBO> we just have a metal detector... the weigh thing is a nice touch
<tseng> yeah
<cbx33> the other day a kid kicked in the door to our office and stole 14 laptops
* cbx33 suddenly feels very small
<DBO> tseng, so I forgot my key combo one time (its really long)...
<jsgotangco> that ain't no kid that's a punk!
<DBO> set the alarm off
<DBO> twenty minutes later Im surrounded by security guards, who decide to let me in after resetting the alarm.
<DBO> I go in, enter my keycode... go to swipe the card... shoot, left that in the car (WOOOP WOOOP WOOOP)
<sladen> tseng: there's one of those Teleports in Telehouse.  Designed to count people in and out.  Unfortunately the undernourished cleaning staff are let enough to slip through two-at-a-time, which of course they do do because otherwise it takes about another 60 seconds
<DBO> twenty minutes later I call in sick...
<sladen> s/let/light/
<cbx33> DBO hahahaha
<DBO> cbx33, it was a bad start, I decided to work from home
<tseng> sladen: wild
<tseng> this guy here is pretty big, it goes nuts when he tries to get in
<Mithrandir> jsgotangco: using CO for firefighting is just mean.  Better to use CO2.
<jsgotangco> well i know a local datacenter using it but had to change it since they got a court ruling..
<Mithrandir> given that CO is very very harmful to people, I'm not surprised.
<Mithrandir> (no, it's not toxic.  It just kills you, and if not gives you a hell of a headache)
<ogra> well, you save the money for the exterminator with CO :)
<jsgotangco> heh
<cbx33> I'm getting a problem of Zorg taking up 40% cpu for no reason
<cbx33> Xorg
<\sh> re
<cbx33> anyone know where I can delve to get more information
<lucas> which video driver ?
<DBO> running xgl?
<cbx33> nope
<cbx33> stock
<cbx33> installed dapper
<cbx33> ariver is ati
<cbx33> driver sorry
<cbx33> maybe I should switch to VESA
<DBO> been doing this long?
<lucas> no
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> ever since I installed dapper
<lucas> which options are enabled ?
<lucas> is DRI enabled ?
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> i2c,bitmap,ddc,dri,extmod,freetype,glx,int10,type1,vbe
<DBO> so restarting x doesnt help?
<cbx33> well fo a while
<cbx33> but the problem comes back
<cbx33> I havn't been able to narrow it down
<DBO> what programs do you run all the time?
<cbx33> at the mo, firefox, gedit, terminal, evience
<cbx33> and nautilus
<cbx33> it must be a subprocess
<cbx33> but i can't figure it out
<lucas> check your xorg log
<lucas> try to enable RenderAccel
<lucas> there are lots of options in ati's man page
<cbx33> lucas it doesn't do it all the time
<DBO> do you have firefox pages with flash open?
<DBO> flash = the cpu death
<cbx33> no, flash isnt even on this machine
<cbx33> yet
<DBO> start closing proggies 1 by 1 and watch the cpy
<DBO> cpu even
<cbx33> I've done that
<cbx33> it still stays at 40 odd %
<cbx33> I have another unrelated problem on a different machine soneone might be able to help out with, it's a laptop and since upgrading to dapper, even minute or so, it skips two keys that I press
<cbx33> happens in both terminal and xchat, that I have seen so far
<cbx33> nothing in any logs
<zakame> hi there, someone pinged me earlier?
<ajmitch> probably talking about you
* ajmitch mentioned you earlier today :)
<zakame> ajmitch! ooh, hehe
<zakame> yeah, here and in -kubuntu-devel
<ajmitch> if in doubt, blame it on someone else
<zakame> hehe
* Hobbsee blames ajmitch 
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: I *was* refraining from blaming you
<Hobbsee> haha!  just.
* Hobbsee did nothing...nothing at all!
<ajmitch> but you spoilt it
* Hobbsee will go back to the corner, with the dunce cap, if you wish.
<zakame> Hobbsee: erm?
<Hobbsee> ouch.  wrist just cracked.
* Hobbsee *doesnt* think that was supposed to happen.
<Hobbsee> zakame: i didnt ping you...
<DBO> Hobbsee, then my wrists are very broke
<Hobbsee> heh
<zakame> lol
* ajmitch ought to sleep
<Hobbsee> mmm...sleep...
<Hobbsee> yes
* ajmitch is happy to see that lp has the NEW queue visible now (once there are packages in it)
<ajmitch> yes, sleep is a good thing
<zakame> ooh, LP now has a NEW queue?
<ajmitch> yeah
<tseng> ajmitch: oh nice.
<tseng> zakame: always has
<tseng> zakame: it was just not visible
<ajmitch> a visible one, at least
<zakame> tseng: good
<tseng> that will solve some questions of "where did my upload go"
<tseng> in more esoteric cases
<ajmitch> I was just following that edgy was listed, and will be getting stuff published soon
<ajmitch> if we're lucky we can upload soon
<tseng> brilliant
<jsgotangco> zomg! is it open? is it? is it?
<tseng> i need gnome 2.15 crack of the day
<ajmitch> jsgotangco: no
<ajmitch> jsgotangco: sit down
* tseng ruffles jsgotangco 
* jsgotangco withdrawal symptoms
<tseng> The Churn
<ajmitch> no idea when they'd turn on the firehose
<zakame> jsgotangco: lol
<jsgotangco> i cant use this gnome! its too old!
<siretart> ajmitch: there is a visible NEW queue? where?
<ajmitch> siretart: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/edgy/+queue
<ajmitch> not only new, but accepted & rejected
<siretart> fascinating
<ajmitch> hopefully it's useful
<siretart> :)
* ajmitch needs to get the LDAP part working properly with this now that kerberos authenticates
<ajmitch> Mithrandir: the mid-project evaluation is coming up at the end of the month - I'll be heading off to .au for a couple of weeks around that time, but will have a laptop & net access
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: we should probably have a small status meeting soon too.. Tomorrow, maybe?
<ajmitch> sure
<ajmitch> the distro team meeting is at 0800 UTC
<zakame> SoCer hard at work :)
<ajmitch> so I was going to try & show up weekly for that at least
<seaLne> is compat still 5 in edgy?
<ajmitch> still 5? it only just became 5 :)
<ajmitch> the compat version you're talking about is for debhelper versions
<ajmitch> which don't change often
<seaLne> yeah
<zakame> you can always export DH_COMPAT=5 too
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: so a bit after that, maybe, then?
<ajmitch> Mithrandir: alright, I don't think it'll be a long meeting
* ajmitch hopes the time gets rotated each week for it
<Mithrandir> the distro meeting?  I suspect so.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<crimsun> 'lo bddebian
<Hobbsee> hey bddebian :)
<bddebian> Hi crimsun and Hobbsee
<ajmitch> hello bddebian
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<ajmitch> oh that is anoying
<ajmitch> s/anoying/annoying/
<ajmitch> I plug in a scanner, and it's ubuntu in vmware that gets hold of it
<tseng> vmware only mounts usb when it is focused
<tseng> in windows at least
<ajmitch> not in linux
<ajmitch> & this is vmware server, so focus probably wouldn't matter
<hub> how do I unsubscribe a malone bug?
<hub> I hate malone UI
<bddebian> As far as I know you cannot
<hub> and people wonder why malone is hated
<tseng> they do?
<tseng> I didn't know there was any question
<Mithrandir> hub: uh, just click the "unsubscribe" link?
<hub> Mithrandir: I don't see that link
<Mithrandir> which bug is this?
<\sh> hub: there is "unsubscribe"
<hub> where
<hub> I only see subscribe
<\sh> under mark as duplicate
<Mithrandir> then you're not subscribed, then.
<hub> subscribe there is
<\sh> if there is no such thing as unsubscribe, you are not subscribed
<hub> and I get notified of the bug
<hub> each and every time
<Mithrandir> which bug is this, then?
<hub> "alse notified"
<hub> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/libgnomeprint/+bug/34112
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 34112 in libgnomeprint "gnome programs don't respect ~/.cups/lpoptions" [Unknown,Unknown] 
<ajmitch> either that or you're part of a team that's subscribed
<ajmitch> and you can't unsubscribe those
<Mithrandir> hub: you probably filed one of the duplicates, then
<hub> possibly
<ajmitch> hm, new UI there
<hub> but that is not a good reason
<ajmitch> hi pygi
<pygi> hey ajmitch
<\sh> hub: also notified :)
<ajmitch> hub: sure it's not, but complaining here doesn't get it fixed :)
<hub> at least I didn't miss the obvious thing
<hub> it is just dumb stupid
<hub> I 'm on #launchpad complaining now
<ajmitch> hub: good lucking hunting down all the duplicates to see which you're subscribed to :)
<bddebian> heh
<hub> ajmitch: I'd rather hunt down one of the developer
<hub> ajmitch: easier task
<ajmitch> bradb is closer
<hub> ajmitch: bradb is only in montreal
<hub> yeah
<hub> 2 hours drive
<hub> I filed a bug
<\sh> ok.../me goes back to karlsruhe
<\sh> cu
<Sp4rKy> hi MOTUs
<bddebian> Hello Sp4rKy
<bddebian> Any luck?
<Sp4rKy> bddebian, no , but i just come back from work , so i'll test again :)
<bddebian> OK :-)
<Sp4rKy> :)
<Sp4rKy> Toadstool is helping me , i hope he's better than me :)
<bddebian> He's better than me :-)
<Toadstool> I don't think so but nice try bddebian ;)
<Erlang> bddebian is teh k|ng of self-esteem.
<Toadstool> indeed :)
<jpatrick> oh
<Erlang> Even I can say "well, I rock", sometimes...
<bddebian> Erlang: Totally :-(
<seaLne> what is the correct way to deal with a admin/.svn directory that lintian complains about?
<bddebian> Delete it? :-)
<azeem> is it in the upstream tarball?
<seaLne> azeem: yeah
<bddebian> Ugh
<azeem> seaLne: well, ask upstream not to do that
<azeem> otherwise, I'd just ignore it for now, especially if this is a Debian package you're modifying, as opposed to packaging from scratch
<jpatrick> seaLne: "rm -rf admin/.svn" in clean: rule
<seaLne> jpatrick: i tried that and it complained
<jpatrick> ..
<seaLne> http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/765489
<azeem> it's a warning
<seaLne> so that is the correct way then?
<azeem> but yeah, it's pointless trying to remove them
<seaLne> so just live with lintian error?
<jpatrick> seaLne: yeah
<bddebian> Get upstream to fix it :)
<bddebian> Heya ivoks
<ivoks> hello
<sivang> has mergers from debian started already? or are we waiting for the edgy archive to open? :)
<bddebian> I noticed Edgy is on LP already :-)
<Sp4rKy> please which list diffuse this informpations ?
<LaserJock> morning people!
<jpatrick> LaserJock: morninh
<bddebian> LASERJOCK!! :-)
<LaserJock> the one and only, I think
* LaserJock looks around
<Sp4rKy> hi LaserJock
<highvoltage> hey LaserJock
<highvoltage> anyone seen mvo around?
<LaserJock> anybody know a ttreg ?
<bddebian> LaserJock: Not I
<Sp4rKy> dh_installexamples examples
<Sp4rKy> cp: cannot stat `/usr/share/renamer/': No such file or directory
<Sp4rKy> why dh_installexamples don't use /usr/share/doc ?
<LaserJock> example files I believe are supposed to go in /usr/share/<packagename>
<bddebian> Aye
<LaserJock> they aren't exactly documentation I suppose, I'm not sure of the exact reason
<Sp4rKy> ok , so how could i create this directory (why dh_installexamples doesn't do it ) ?
<LaserJock> Sp4rKy: I would think it would already be created
<bddebian> Sp4rKy: It should either be part of configure/make or you can do install -d debian/<package>/usr/share/<package>/foo/bar
<Sp4rKy> does exists an order for the different dh_* calls ?
<LaserJock> they should be called in the order that they are listed
<Sp4rKy> ok
<Sp4rKy> a strange thing : when i comment dh_installexamples (i 've so dh_install and dh_installdocs) , dpkg-buildpackage works perfectly, and the /usr/share/<package> rep was created
<LaserJock> k
<Sp4rKy> so what's wrong with dh_installexamples
<Sp4rKy> and can i use dh_install to install examples ?
<Toadstool> Sp4rKy: examples should be installed in /usr/share/doc/<package-name>/examples
<Sp4rKy> so i could install them with dh_install ?
<LaserJock> sure
<Sp4rKy> Toadstool, you came back ?
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, ok , so i'll do this :)
<Toadstool> Sp4rKy: yep, a few seconds ago :)
<Sp4rKy> :)
<Toadstool> Sp4rKy: you should use dh_installexamples to my mind
<Sp4rKy> Toadstool, just 2 warnings and my package will be good
<Sp4rKy> Toadstool, did you see my previous comment ?
<Toadstool> yep
<Sp4rKy> so you may help me about dh_installexamples issues :)
* Sp4rKy hope is english isn't too bad :/
<Toadstool> the error message you get is weird since dh_installexamples never uses /usr/share/<package-name> as far as I know
<Sp4rKy> and so ?
<Toadstool> thus I think you made some kind of little mistake which causes this :)
<Sp4rKy> what is the good way ?
<Sp4rKy> i've try with <package>.examples file formatted like *.install files
<Toadstool> doesn't work like that
<Sp4rKy> yes
<Sp4rKy> just the name of the files
<Toadstool> could you paste your debian/rules on pastebin?
<Sp4rKy> i've see my mistake just when i wrote here
<Toadstool> :)
<Sp4rKy> i test
<Toadstool> er, got to go...
<Toadstool> cya
<Sp4rKy> ok
<Sp4rKy> seems work
<hub> lol
<hub> https://launchpad.net/products/malone/+bug/48860
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 48860 in malone ""Also notified" makes difficult to unsubscribe" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed] 
<hub> same bug that triggered that report
<hub> and mine is 48862
<hub> *sigh*
<shawarma> I just read a post on the u-d mailing list asking why we didn't have user-mode-linux in Ubuntu. I was writing him a long e-mail about how we sync at the beginning of each development cycle and that user-mode-linux hadn't made it into Debian in time, but then I took a look at the changelog of user-mode-linux in Debian and it seems it's been in the Debian archives at least since october... So why is it that we don't have it in Ubuntu?
<Sp4rKy> how could we register to u-d mailist ?
<LaserJock> lists.ubuntu.com
<imbrandon> lists.ubuntu.com
<Sp4rKy> thx :)
<imbrandon> errr yea what LaserJock said ;)
* imbrandon is slow
<LaserJock> shawarma: not sure, it might have been a deliberate decision
<shawarma> LaserJock: Yeah, that's what I'm thinking and I'm just quite curious why we would decide to leave it out.
<LaserJock> shawarma: an appropriate question in -devel might get you a good answer
<Tonio_> hello
<crimsun> well, we do have uml-utilities for the userspace side
<crimsun> are you asking about the kernel side, ala skas3, etc.?
<shawarma> LaserJock: Probably. I'll just sit here and hold my breath until someone answers the other guy who asked in the first place. :-)
<shawarma> crimsun: The actual user-mode-linux package containing the kernel and such.
<crimsun> shawarma: that's a good question. I've always done it by hand.
<shawarma> crimsun: It used to be in Debian. That was really nice.
<shawarma> crimsun: Then it went away for some reason but now it seems to be back.
<shawarma> crimsun: What is this skas3 you're talking about?
<imbrandon> crimsun: mind having a look / review of http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2353 now that the edgy repos are there so maybe i can get it in soon ;)
<crimsun> shawarma: http://user-mode-linux.sourceforge.net/skas.html
<crimsun> goodness, edgy's open?
<imbrandon> well the repos are on archive.ubuntu.com and they are talking of it in -devel, not sure if its official yet
<imbrandon> [12:33]  * Keybuk is already running edgy
<imbrandon> [12:33]  <Keybuk> you guys are SO BEHIND
<imbrandon> [12:33]  <bddebian> hehe
<imbrandon> [12:33]  <ivoks> :)
<imbrandon> [12:33]  <ivoks> Keybuk: tell us, tell us, is it broken? :)
<imbrandon> ;)
<crimsun> oh god, first upload is the kernel
* imbrandon go's to setup a pbuilder for edgy
<LaserJock> crimsun: do you know of any good references on how to make a Python app in to a real (read distributable) program
<crimsun> LaserJock: err, don't understand the question
<imbrandon> but yea crimsun if you dont mind have a look at that so i can get my 2+ people to agree that it can be uploaded to universe
<crimsun> it's not redistributable [packaging-wise]  now?
<bddebian> Yeah crimsun, where you been "Mr. Main Uploader"? ;-P
<imbrandon> pweease ;)
<siretart> edgy seems to be still empty
<LaserJock> yeah
<bddebian> Heya siretart
<imbrandon> heya siretart
<crimsun> siretart: yeah, keybuk's filtering each upload
<siretart> huhu bddebian, hi imbrandon
<crimsun> < Keybuk> however there's a queue at the door < Keybuk> and I'm dressed up as a bouncer deciding who can come in or not
<imbrandon> heh
<LaserJock> crimsun: ok, the specific problem is that we need to tell the python program where it's glade file is but the glade file might be in different places depending on $DESTDIR, etc.
<crimsun> imbrandon: got the url loaded, will check when time's less scarce (ETA: 20 mins)
<siretart> crimsun: AFAIU, uploads to edgy are quite senseless, because the chroots have not been set up on the buildds. infinity seems to wait on new gcc's, which in turn wait for new glibc.. oh well
<crimsun> siretart: yeah, toolchain fun!
<imbrandon> thanks crimsun
<crimsun> bddebian: sorry, still awaiting my ponies
<imbrandon> zomg !!!!111
<Sp4rKy> http://pastebin.com/765662 <== what's wrong ?
<imbrandon> heh jpatrick had some ponie pic's yesterday , was kinda funny
<crimsun> LaserJock: hmm, why would the glade file be any different relative to $DESTDIR?
<jpatrick> crimsun: here you go: http://img426.imageshack.us/img426/5561/pony14pz.jpg
<imbrandon> hehe
<crimsun> jpatrick: no way. http://youtube.com/watch?v=d8gxL3maWFs
<crimsun> (for all great eye-stabbing justice)
<jpatrick> arg, flash...
<hub> crimsun: "Hello, you either have JavaScript turned off or an old version of Macromedia's Flash Player. Click here to get the latest flash player." <- welcom freedom lovers
<jpatrick> hub: my poiny
<crimsun> yeah, the sickliness of Flash(tm)
<jpatrick> point not pony
<crimsun> it's some video clip from My Little Pony
<hub> crimsun: is not slick. it requires me to install software I don't trust
<hub> crimsun: that don't run on my platform of choice
<LaserJock> crimsun: no, the point is we don't know how to make a relative link from the .py to the .glade because we can't (don't want to)  hard-code it
<hub> (PPC)
<crimsun> hub: right. In any case, bddebian is supposed to send me ponies via post. I'm still waiting...
<imbrandon> hub: does gplflash run on ppc ?
<bddebian> crimsun: Nah, I'm useless
<hub> imbrandon: does it work?
<imbrandon> afaik ? never tried it
<hub> so
<jpatrick> Gnash freezes up here
<crimsun> LaserJock: hmm, pyglade documentation doesn't have a "best practices" or something similar?
<crimsun> it shouldn't need to be hardcoded afaict
<hub> imbrandon: Flash is a proprietary file format the Macromedia REFUSE to Open
<hub> imbrandon: advocating it is accepting to relinquish your freedom
<LaserJock> crimsun: ok, I'll try there. I'm such a software newb
<_ion> I found gnash to be in a rather useless stage currently.
<_ion> For general web surfing, that is.
<imbrandon> hub: here are 3 alteritives to it that are gpl though https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RestrictedFormats#head-f4b5a0e592cf89fac0bb7f5388c8e1733413af21
<hub> imbrandon: that are equally broken
<imbrandon> probbly
<imbrandon> i just know they exist
<imbrandon> heh
<hub> _ion: Gnash is really active, but there is a real long way to have it work
<_ion> hub: Yes.
<hub> _ion: because of the inherant complexity of Flash itself
<hub> including the various version released
<_ion> That's what i've understood.
<hub> and the obesive control Macromerdia instist to put on
* _ion is looking forward to gnash's development with enhusiasm.
<_ion> t
<LaserJock> bah, the freelance packaging I did made the Dapper release announcement!
<hub> _ion: I rebuild very often for curiosity
<hub> _ion: but still not advocating any use of flash
<_ion> hub: Nobody should _ever_ advocate any use of flash. :-)
<hub> _ion: agreed
<hub> not couting that gnash will force license violation by itself
<hub> as MP3 and other patented shit is required to implement it
<LaserJock> anybody know what "Ubuntu 6.06 LTS also has a new mechanism to make commercial software available" means in the release announcment?
<tseng> it means gnome-app-install can handle 3rd party repos
<tseng> from proprietary vendors
<hub> that thing written in Python?
<LaserJock> ok, but the examples they give are for Multiverse pacakges
<crimsun> it's the "use commercial software" or whatever checkbox in g-a-i
<crimsun> (enables multiverse)
<siretart> crimsun: do you happen to know what this checkbox actually does?
<siretart> my observation was that it shows packages from multiverse
<crimsun> right, that's my experience
<LaserJock> so I really don't understand much of the "new mechanism" part
<LaserJock> new mechanism = gai checkbox, I guess
<crimsun> well, "includes a checkbox widget in gnome-app-install" probably doesn't fit well in the release announcement ;)
<azeem> isn't the point that g-a-i presents specific commercial apps like DB2 etc., and not random multiverse crap?
<azeem> not that I've checked
<Sp4rKy> http://pastebin.com/765662 <== what's wrong ?
<crimsun> azeem: right, it's just a selection afaik
<LaserJock> azeem: ahh, that might make sense
<bddebian> Sp4rKy: You got me on that one?
<LaserJock> well that explains some things
<Sp4rKy> bddebian, sorry , i odn't understand what you say
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: I've seen something similar when attempting to pbuild a package before the base.tgz is finished being generated
<LaserJock> I'm packaging one of the items they say is in there and I wondered why there was lots of interest in getting it into Multiverse
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, but the dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa was finished before !
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: try updating your pbuilder then pbuilding the package
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, i'll try
<crimsun> imbrandon: ping
<imbrandon> pong
<crimsun> imbrandon: I don't see apt-mirror in Debian
<imbrandon> its not
<imbrandon> its a new package
<crimsun> imbrandon: which means that you should version it 0.4.4-0ubuntu1
<imbrandon> ummm it is versioned that way i thought, *looks*
<imbrandon> apt-mirror_0.4.4-2-0ubuntu1.dsc
<crimsun> imbrandon: also, you mention in the changelog that you adjusted mirror.list for dapper, but, there's no diff for it in the actual diff.gz
<crimsun> imbrandon: 0.4.4-2-0ubuntu1?
<crimsun> why -2-0ubuntu1?
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, i have again the same error
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, i did pbuilder update
<imbrandon> crimsun: the orig was versioned 0.4.4-2
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: please post your current .diff.gz and .dsc (and a link to the orig.tar.gz)
<imbrandon> so i should drop the -2 in the orig when adding -0ubuntu1 ?
<crimsun> imbrandon: let me check the sf Web site
<imbrandon> crimsun: i changed the mirror.list before the orig package was made, there was no debain pkg before
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, ok
<imbrandon> kk
<crimsun> eww
<imbrandon> apt-mirror.sf.net
<crimsun> upstream has it versioned incorrectly
<crimsun> well, I guess not given upstream can use whatever versioning it wants
<imbrandon> ok ....... do we reversion it ?
<imbrandon> and notify upstream ?
<crimsun> I don't know why upstream doesn't just use 0.4.x instead of incrementing a packaging revision, given it's a native package
<crimsun> imbrandon: I was expecting upstream to use standard nomenclature, but in light of the native source package being 0.4.4-2, you'd want to make yours 0.4.4-2ubuntu1
<imbrandon> ok , can do
<crimsun> which would make it native as well, and you wouldn't have a diff.gz
<imbrandon> kk
<imbrandon> well it would have a diff with the mirror.list changes
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, sos-sts.info/ubuntu/renamer
<crimsun> imbrandon: no, if it's native, there won't be a diff.gz
<imbrandon> ok
<imbrandon> can i delete the revu upload so i can totaly repackage it ? if not revu will try to make diff's when i upload
<crimsun> you should be able to just upload an entire new set
<crimsun> shouldn't need to have an admin delete anything
<imbrandon> kk i'll try that
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, did you see  my  link ?
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: yes, sec, getting to it :)
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, ok :) i wait
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: would you link me to the orig.tar.gz, please?
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, there is th elink to the main website into the DOWNLOADFROM file
<crimsun> ah, ok.
<Sp4rKy> :p
<imbrandon> crimsun: apt-mirror (0.4.4-2ubuntu1) edgy; urgency=low <--- correct ?
<imbrandon> given it wasent in debian before
<crimsun> imbrandon: yes
<imbrandon> k
<imbrandon> building now, upload again in a sec
<crimsun> upstream really needs to be prodded into changing the versioning
<crimsun> that's just my $0.02, though
<imbrandon> yea i'll send em an email, and see what comes of it
<siretart> err, are you talking about uploads to edgy?
<imbrandon> siretart: it WILL be for edgy but not yes, just REVU right now
<imbrandon> s/yes/yet
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: just stepping through debian/* : control needs copyright date{,s}
<crimsun> sorry poor phrasing
<crimsun> copyright needs Copyright date
<Sp4rKy> ok
<Sp4rKy> i add it
<Sp4rKy> and for the "./utils" issue ?
<crimsun> getting there :)
<Sp4rKy> date for the copyright holder ?
<imbrandon> gah , ok i just rebuilt my build box, i hate reinstalling all the tools, i'm missing something ...........
<imbrandon> make: dh_testdir: Command not found
<imbrandon> make: *** [clean]  Error 127
<imbrandon> debuild: fatal error at line 768:
<imbrandon> dpkg-buildpackage failed!
<imbrandon> thats with debuild -S -sa
<bddebian> apt-get install devscripts?
<imbrandon> debhelper ?
<imbrandon> got that bddebian
<bddebian> Or debhelper, aye :-)
<imbrandon> hehe there should be a list of build tools ;)
<imbrandon> that did it , thx bddebian
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: yes
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, where could i get it
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: from upstream
<crimsun> it should be in the source files, too
<Sp4rKy> i don't see it in source files, i'll try to upstream
<Sp4rKy> i didn't know all package and all software need an official anounce for the GPL licence
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: does this package use Qt3 or Qt4?
<Sp4rKy> yes qt3
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: debian/control need to build-depend on libqt3-mt-dev and qt3-dev-tools at least, then
<crimsun> needs^
<Sp4rKy> shlibs doesn't find them ?
<crimsun> shlibs are for runtime, we're talking about creating the package, which is build-depends
<Sp4rKy> ouch
<Sp4rKy> k
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: you also need to modify debian/changelog: the distribution is "edgy" (Ubuntu) not "unstable" (Debian), and the version would be 1.0.2-0ubuntu1 since the package is not in Debian
<Sp4rKy> i thought i had change them :/
<Sp4rKy>  we're talking about creating the packag <== The error is during pbuilder test
<imbrandon> crimsun: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2381  <-- redone
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: yes, I know, I'm just reviewing debian/* since I had to retrieve it anyway
<Sp4rKy> ok
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, no idea ?
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: (sorry, phone @work)
<crimsun> (will resume asap)
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, k
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: must be an issue on your end, since after adding the *qt3* b-ds it begins to build just fine
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: granted it bombs because libpcre3-dev is missing as a b-d...
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: can you regenerate your base.tgz fresh if you're on broadband?
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, yes , with -S -sa ?
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: if you mean ``debuild -S -sa'', yes
<Sp4rKy> i mean dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -S -sa , is the same ?
<crimsun> you can use that, sure
<Sp4rKy> ok
<crimsun> (I just have debuild in shell history)
<Sp4rKy> done
<Sp4rKy> what do you want ? orig.tgz ?
<crimsun> (no, I have the bz2)
<crimsun> does pbuilder still throw that error?
<Sp4rKy> trying ...
<Sp4rKy> i've always the same error :(
<Sp4rKy> don't you have ?
<crimsun> nope
<Sp4rKy> :/
<Sp4rKy> i've done modification in debian/control :(
<Sp4rKy> i've the same error with devede
<crimsun> the only things I changed in debian/control were to add those build-dependencies
<Sp4rKy> whereas it worked yesterday
<crimsun> Copying source file -> copying [renamer_1.0.2-0ubuntu1.dsc]  -> copying [./renamer_1.0.2.orig.tar.gz]  -> copying [./renamer_1.0.2-0ubuntu1.diff.gz] 
<crimsun> Extracting source
<crimsun> that's where yours trips, correct?
<Sp4rKy> yes
<Sp4rKy> i've the same error with all packages :/
<Sp4rKy> in fact maybe i have this error since the start of the pbuilder tree :/
<crimsun> yes, that indicates it's an actual pbuilder error
<Sp4rKy> do you think i should recreate a pbuilder ?
<crimsun> yes
<Sp4rKy> ok
<crimsun> (I mentioned that above :)
<Sp4rKy> did you mentionned recreate or update ?
<crimsun> recreate
<Sp4rKy> i'd update
<Sp4rKy> sorry
<Sp4rKy> how could i delete current ?
<crimsun> it will be overwritten, or if you're paranoid, just erase it first, then recreate it
<Sp4rKy> ok
<Sp4rKy> thx
<tritium> crimsun: is there any chance of using vmware player images rather than pbuilder chroots to achieve the same effect?
<Sp4rKy> i'll come back when recreated
<crimsun> tritium: seems like a bit more work for essentially the same chroot idea, but I don't see why not
<crimsun> (not to mention the whole using Free tools bit, but whatever, that's just ideological)
<crimsun> tritium: unless you are asking whether MOTU will move to use vmware...?
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, must i create with --distribution edgy ???
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: no, dapper currently
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, ok
<imbrandon> crimsun: that new upload look better .... ? brb gonna grab some mt dew
<tritium> crimsun: I'm not asking if MOTU will move to that.
<tritium> Just curious if it's a viable method
<jsgotangco> hey =)
<imbrandon> heya jsgotangco
<jsgotangco> good morning
<crimsun> imbrandon: will look in 5 mins
<crimsun> tritium: yep, it is.
<imbrandon> kk crimsun no big hurry, just curious
<tritium> cool, thanks, crimsun
<crimsun> np
<tritium> magandang umaga, jsgotangco
<jsgotangco> tritium: hi well its too early atm here
<tritium> oh, okay :)
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: yep, generates fine.
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: dpkg-deb: building package `renamer' in `../renamer_1.0.2-0ubuntu1_i386.deb'.
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: make sure you upload a newer version with these changes to revu please, thanks
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, ok
<Sp4rKy> my pbuilder is creating
<bddebian> crimsun: You have a quick minute for a /query?
<Sp4rKy> the issue is that dpkg-deb create correctly my .deb :)
<crimsun> bddebian: absolutely
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, always the same error :(
<bddebian> Sp4rKy: I haven't been keeping up with the conversation.  Can you build it OK outside of pbuilder?  I.E. somethign like sudo dpkg-buildpackage -us -nc?
<Sp4rKy> with dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa
<Sp4rKy> buit the issue is when i try to use pbuilder , i 've this error during test :
<Sp4rKy> cp: cannot stat `./utils': No such file or directory
<bddebian> Have you whacked your pbuilder and rebuilt it? :-)
<Sp4rKy> i just rebuild the pbuilder
<bddebian> Ah, hmm
<Sp4rKy> and i've this error woth all the packages i try to pbuild , also good packages
<bddebian> Sp4rKy: Any chance you have some fs corruption or anything?
<Sp4rKy> http://pastebin.com/766033 <== a pbuild try
<Sp4rKy> bddebian, i really don't think
<crimsun> ok, if it's all packages, it sounds like a pbuilder configuration issue
<Sp4rKy> is there other thing to do before use pbuilder (than pbuilder create) ?
<crimsun> I take it you're not using ~/.pbuilderrc ?
<Sp4rKy> yes
<crimsun> yes you are, or yes you are not? :)
<Sp4rKy> sorry
<Sp4rKy> yes i'm not !
<crimsun> hmm, ok, it shouldn't matter. Since I'm a configuration file whore, I like ~/.pbuilderrc
<bddebian> heh
<Sp4rKy> i don't know what is .pbuilderrc
<crimsun> it's your version of /etc/pbuilderrc
<Sp4rKy> ok
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: first thing, check ``dmesg'' to see if there are kernel messages regarding your hard drive controller
<crimsun> if there are, hat's a sign to investigate filesystem corruption, as bddebian mentioned
<crimsun> that's^
<Sp4rKy> nothing
<Sp4rKy> and fsck done this morning
<Sp4rKy> pfff
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: you're on dapper, correct?
<Sp4rKy> yes
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: and plenty of space in /var (or / )?
<Sp4rKy> /dev/hdc6             7.4G  4.6G  2.4G  66% /
<crimsun> hmm, that should be plenty
<Sp4rKy> i think soo
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: wait...
<Sp4rKy> but i've a space issue with df :/
<Sp4rKy> yes ?
<crimsun> that's suspicious. Are you sure you're pbuilding the dsc?
<crimsun> I vaguely remember errors like that when accidentally pbuilder the .changes
<Sp4rKy> yes
<Sp4rKy> i made the /changes :(
<crimsun> what command you using to pbuild?
<bddebian> ack :-)
<crimsun> are
<crimsun> (I am mightyfumblefingers this afternoon)
<Sp4rKy> i use *source.changes
<crimsun> ooops
<crimsun> don't
<crimsun> pbuilder requires a dsc
<Sp4rKy> works perfectly with dsc :)
<crimsun> yes, only use the dsc
<bddebian> w00t :-)
<Sp4rKy> i'm sorry for the time you lost for a stupid mistake
<crimsun> that's ok, I've stumbled across that one, too
<crimsun> hence the "wait..." :)
<Sp4rKy> :)
<crimsun> note in the man page for pbuilder that build only accepts [options]  foo.dsc
<Sp4rKy> when Gloubiboulga explain me how package i made many mistakes between sources.changes (dput) and .dsc (pbulder) :)
<crimsun> yeah, it can be confusing at first.
<crimsun> you pbuild a dsc, but you upload a source.changes
<Sp4rKy> yes
<Sp4rKy> thanks a lot for your help
<crimsun> np
<Sp4rKy> you are really the best :)
<crimsun> nope
<Sp4rKy> why ?
<crimsun> we've a pyro and a deity in here
<crimsun> both outclass me =] 
<bddebian> Yes he is the best :)
<Sp4rKy> :)
<bddebian> Who's the pyro?
<crimsun> hobbsee
<Sp4rKy> bddebian, thx to you to
<bddebian> Oh, hehe, makes sense :)
<Sp4rKy> o
<bddebian> Sp4rKy: No worries, glad you got it going
<bddebian> And believe me, I make LOTS of stupid mistakes ;-)
<crimsun> we all do :)
<Sp4rKy> :)
<Sp4rKy> thx for all MOTUS
<crimsun> -> coffee
<Sp4rKy> Good night motus
<crimsun> 'night Sp4rKy
<Sp4rKy> thx
<bddebian> Gnight Sp4rKy
<crimsun> imbrandon: will look when I return
<imbrandon> kk crimsun np like i said no hurry just dident want it forgot about ;)
<Sp4rKy> in fact , i finish my packaging before
<bddebian> Time to head home, later folks
<ToadZzZztool> g'night
<tiagoboldt> 'night
<crimsun> imbrandon: some notes wrt apt-mirror: 1) It may be preferable to use archive instead of us.archive in mirror.list; 2) debian/changelog should reference debian/rules (not debain/rules); 3) You may wish to correspond with upstream to update debhelper compat if possible; 4) debian/copyright needs a date for the Copyright and should include the preamble at least, you'll want to ping upstream about that
<crimsun> imbrandon: otherwise it looks fine for first-pass
#ubuntu-motu 2006-06-08
<imbrandon> cool thanks crimsun
<imbrandon> will take care of all that asap so when the edgy repos open we can upload
<imbrandon> crimsun: ping ...
<crimsun> imbrandon: pong
<imbrandon> hey ok since i'm new to this i'm trying to figure out the dh_COMPAT=3 stuff and what it means and what i need to do to update it to 4+ etc etc
<imbrandon> google is not being nice, or i just dont know what to search for
<imbrandon> per your sugestion about apt-mirror, i was thinkiing i could change it and just send a patch upstream
<imbrandon> took care of everyting else
<bddebian> Heya folks
<imbrandon> heya bddebian
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya imbrandon, LaserJock
<crimsun> imbrandon: change it to 5 and send the patch upstream
<imbrandon> just the dh_compat= line ? thats it ?
<crimsun> yes, and if you have a debian/compat, change that
<imbrandon> k
<crimsun> (I don't remember your source package well enough)
<bddebian> Hey crimsun
<crimsun> hullo bddebian
<imbrandon> ok crimsun , bddebian , LaserJock , or anyone else .... all ready for prying eyes http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2383
<crimsun> imbrandon: did you heed the linda output? You need to bump the b-d version in debian/control, too.
<imbrandon> ouch .. he ok , i'm gonna get this right one of these days , ok whats the stuff about the #DEBHELPER# tag >?
<crimsun> the source package has a custom postinst, so you don't necessarily need to add that tag to it
<imbrandon> k
<imbrandon> and the standards version of 3.5.2 ?
<crimsun> you need to actually check that against current Policy
<imbrandon> k
<crimsun> dapper has 3.6.2.2
<imbrandon> ok linda and lintian look ok this time cept for the standards version and that can be changed later .... http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2384
<ajmitch> afternoon all
<imbrandon> heya ajmitch
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<crimsun> imbrandon: right, better
<crimsun> 'afternoon ajmitch
<imbrandon> ok i'll package up a patch for upstream but thus far looks good for edgy universe ?
<LaserJock> ji ajmitch
<ajmitch> jey LaserJock
<LaserJock> hmm, having a little problem with the keyboard ajmitch?
<ajmitch> only as much as you are :)
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> or jej
<imbrandon> ;)
<LaserJock> well, I know what my problem was, I just wouldn't expect such sloppiness from you ;-)
<imbrandon> darn #*-es people j/k
<ajmitch> it was perfectly deliberate
* StevenK waves
<ajmitch> hello StevenK
<imbrandon> 'ello
<crimsun> 'lo
<LaserJock> 'i
<bddebian> Hello StevenK
<LaserJock> hmm, so does anybody here work with TeX stuff?
<ajmitch> define 'work with'
<StevenK> I can write LaTeX, does that count?
<bddebian> As little as possible :)
* StevenK creates a base tarball for edgy
<LaserJock> I'm thinking more along the lines of packaging
<ajmitch> nope
<ajmitch> not that silly
<LaserJock> well, I got (or rather ubuntu-science) and email from a Debian TeX maintainer about how Ubuntu wasn't doing a very good job
<ajmitch> excellent
<ajmitch> you always appreciate those emails
<sladen> *sigh*
<LaserJock> he was saying that we were slow to fix what he said were RC bugs so they only landed in -updates
<sladen> release-critical TeX.  Oh right(!)
<tseng> yeah
<tseng> it would be nice if we could watch their bugs
<tseng> but you cant always
<LaserJock> yeah
<tseng> i peak at beagle on occassion
<LaserJock> it is bug #36145 if anybody is interested in seeing the fun
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 36145 in tetex-base "hyphenation does not work after upgrade from breezy to dapper" [Medium,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/36145
<ajmitch> oh that one
<StevenK> LaserJock: Was that Frank Kuster?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> Ralf Stubner
<StevenK> Heh, I would have considered Frank abrasive enough to do it
<tseng> it takes a special kind of person to maintain TeX
<StevenK> One that is a masochist.
<LaserJock> so I replied back and said that we just simply lack manpower
<LaserJock> he also said we have a *very* outdated version of auctex
<LaserJock> so I said we had the current Debian unstable up to 2 days before UVF
<LaserJock> I don't know, but I just wondered if there were enough people to get a little team or something going
<ajmitch> not enough of us care? :)
<LaserJock> do I have to answer that?
<StevenK> LaserJock: I'm not masochistic enough.
<ajmitch> yes you are
<ajmitch> you're a DD
<StevenK> *And* I read -devel
<LaserJock> yeah, see that's my problem. I did a couple bug fixes for TeX in Dapper
<ajmitch> StevenK: a lost cause
<LaserJock> but I'm a TeX user
<LaserJock> not a maintainer
<ajmitch> LaserJock: I'm barely a user
<LaserJock> well, I have to write all my research material in tex
<LaserJock> I even did a poster once (4ftx4ft) in tex
<StevenK> I'm with ajmitch. I use TeX. Not very often, though
<LaserJock> lot of good you DDs are then, shesh ;-)
<hub> LaserJock: at least you don't have to use a proprietary program
<hub> LaserJock: unlike some
<LaserJock> ugggh, I'd have nightmares
<LaserJock> "no, no please don't make me use Word, I beg of you! Anything but Word!"
<StevenK> One of the lecturers at Uni refuses to accept online submissions in Word.
<LaserJock> awesome
<StevenK> "Submissions in Word will be ignored. If you wish to typeset your assignment, I'd suggest you look at nroff, or LaTeX."
<LaserJock> actually I've used Word quite a bit for writing reports
<LaserJock> but I can't stand it for anything over like 3 pages and no graphics
<bddebian> So do it in NotePad ;-P
<StevenK> My problem with it is that people concentrate on making it look pretty, to the detriment of the actual content.
<bddebian> Hmm, what to do tonight...  Look at bugs I can't fix, play Morrowind, or none of the above :-)
<ajmitch> fix bugs
<bddebian> I cant
<LaserJock> why not?
<ajmitch> do it anyway
<bddebian> Because I'm st00pid :-)
<shawarma> ...just read a bit of the backlog.. I suppose I could toss some love at tetex. I use it daily. I even hope to package TeXlive for Edgy.
<shawarma> Not right now, though.
<ajmitch> bddebian: oh shut up
* bddebian shuts up
<ryanakca> hmmm... how do you install packages into fakeroot? http://pastebin.ca/63102
<crimsun> hmm
<ajmitch> you don't
<ajmitch> fakeroot isn't a chroot
<ajmitch> so you'd have to do apt-get build-dep bzflag
<ajmitch> & hope the build-deps it lists are there
<crimsun> this changelog entry seems ... unique:
<crimsun> * Drop LinuxThreads on all arches, require 2.6 on all architectures. - debian/sysdeps/linux.mk: Use linuxthreads instead of nptl.
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> glibc?
<crimsun> I'm not one to question JeffB, but...
<crimsun> yeah
* ajmitch wants to try edgy on the T2000
<ajmitch> he mentions optimisations! ;)
<crimsun> mm -mcpu=niagara
<imbrandon> uhht ohh Vista Public Beta 2 just hit the MS website, thats gonna be a whole nother nightmare for support on people trying to dual boot
<zul> then dont :)
<imbrandon> not for me, for the newbs that try it
<imbrandon> ;)\
* ajmitch needs lunch or something
<crimsun> ouch, a distro team meeting at 4 AM localtime
<ajmitch> not so bad
<ajmitch> 8PM for me
<bdubuntu> Eeks
<ajmitch> crimsun: it'll probably be a short meeting anyway
<ajmitch> a 'welcome to edgy' talk & people giving details of what they've done since release apart from drinking :)
<bdubuntu> heh
<Toadstool> hi here
<ajmitch> hi
<Kyral> oy oy oy
<Kyral> its heating up again...
<Kyral> oy and now I get hell from Kass for agreeing with Seveas...
<Kyral> RPI....
<bddebian> WTF...?
<Kyral> huh?
<bddebian> What are you talking about? :-)
<Kyral> FliesLikeABrick's cloak
<Kyral> it has RPI in it
<FliesLikeABrick> aye it does
<Kyral> Rochester PolyTech?
<FliesLikeABrick> Rensselaer
<Kyral> same thing
<FliesLikeABrick> sorry for the constant join/part, some script kiddie on quakenet keeps CTCP flooding a couple people in our channel
<bddebian> Kyral: I meant the Kass comment
<FliesLikeABrick> no, we > Rochester ;)
* Kyral ignites in a flame colored with green and gold
<Kyral> Then you my friend are my enemy
<FliesLikeABrick> right-o ;)
<Kyral> <== Clarkson University
<bddebian> Kelly Clarkson?
<Kyral> If I recall, our hockey team embarrassed yours this year
<FliesLikeABrick> Kyral my dad went to clarkson
<FliesLikeABrick> '78
<Kyral> lol
<Kyral> I betcha he loves you now lol
<FliesLikeABrick> lol
<Kyral> bddebian: RPI and Clarkson are colleges in NY State who are pretty much bitter rivals
<bddebian> Kyral: I know, I am in Philly.  I was being sarcastic :-)
<Kyral> and the thing about Kass
<Kyral> someone pissed off Seveas with shit about Automatix and got banned from #ubuntu
<Kyral> I got hell for siding with Seveas
<bddebian> Uhm, OK
<bddebian> BTW, why are you in an Ubuntu support channel when you don't use Ubuntu anymore? (Just curious?)
<Kyral> Because I can still help :D
<bddebian> That's cool
<Laser_away> who is the distro team?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: the team employed by canonical to work on ubuntu. they have to show up for the meeting. all the rest of us are optional
<Hobbsee> morning all
<bddebian> Hi LaserJock, Hobbsee
* ajmitch checks watch
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: hush you!
<Hobbsee> hey bddebian
<LaserJock> ajmitch: what do they do? I haven't really understood that
<ajmitch> LaserJock: what do you mean?
<LaserJock> I mean what are they supposed to do? what is their purpose?
<ajmitch> the team or the meeting?
<LaserJock> team
<Kyral> fucking hell
<Kyral> I can't put my braces back in
<ajmitch> LaserJock: it's just the group of canonical employees who work on the distro, as opposed to launchpad
<ajmitch> you've probably seen what they do by now :)
<Kyral> Jees
* Kyral sighs
<Kyral> Watch for the Forums to heat up again
<theCore> how can I make a package from a program that doesn't use the standard autoconf build method?
<freeflying|away> anyone has set up edgy's chroot?
<ajmitch> freeflying|away: yes, but there's nothing new yet
<LaserJock> ajmitch: implement specs is what I've seen
<ajmitch> theCore: quite a few packages don't use autotools
<freeflying|away> ajmitch: thanks
<ajmitch> you just need to build it & put the results in the right place
<theCore> ajmitch: so, does it mean that I have to manual create a debian/rules file for it?
<ajmitch> sure
<theCore> oh
<theCore> I get it
<theCore> thanks ajmitch
<ajmitch> depending on what you mean by 'manually create'
<ajmitch> you can probably still use most of the debhelper tools
<theCore> ok, manually edit
<ajmitch> you should do that anyway
<theCore> I trying to package Diva, but it seem that it uses a patched GStreamer CVS, I will have surely have a hard time with it
<theCore> (yuck, I really need to check my spelling)
<LaserJock> anybody use git for something other than the kernel?
<ajmitch> nope, I use bzr for everything else
<LaserJock> k
<LaserJock> I sure wish bzr had better documentation
<LaserJock> I'm just too dumb to get very far
<ajmitch> what do you have trouble with?
<LaserJock> ajmitch: not so much trouble as I doubt I'm using it effectively/right
<ajmitch> right
<LaserJock> I'm learning a little bit since I started a python software project
<LaserJock> I'm pretty excited
<LaserJock> but I really haven't gotten to work on it yet
<LaserJock> it has mostly been cbx33
<LaserJock> and he even made a package for it
<LaserJock> by reading the Packaging Guide
<ajmitch> great
<ajmitch> what is it?
<LaserJock> gisomount
<LaserJock> it is a Python gtk iso mounter
<ajmitch> ok
<LaserJock> nothing earth shattering
<ajmitch> sounds like something that could be a nautilus extension :)
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> we will be adding that too
<LaserJock> it also will do md5sums
<LaserJock> it kind grew out of all the Dapper testing
<LaserJock> cbx33 was doing lots of test for Edubuntu
<LaserJock> and he wanted to check md5sum and browse the .isos
<LaserJock> but he was doing quite a few
<LaserJock> so, I don't know. It's kinda cool for a first project, we are both learning Python and GTK
<LaserJock> and bzr
<ajmitch> Toadstool: you noticed that pervasive ipv6 integration is a release goal for debian etch?
* ajmitch will be doing a bit more pygtk stuff in the next few weeks, I suspect
<LaserJock> but I think I might also need to do a little C if I end up trying to implement my Edgy spec
<ajmitch> which is?
<LaserJock> edubuntu-dynamic-menus
<LaserJock> trying to adjust the Applications menu depending on what group a user belongs to
<Lathiat> ajmitch i noticed it :)
<Lathiat> (ipv6)
<Lathiat> theres a few interesting goals there
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> Lathiat: I just saw https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IPv6Integration
<Lathiat> thge new gtk framebuffer installer looks quite nifty
<Lathiat> one bug is on touchpads it seems to be a 1:1 mapping rather than a movement map
<Lathiat> so if i start in the top elft the mouse jumps there adn starts moving
<unix_infidel> Lathiat: what laptop you got?
<Lathiat> unix_infidel: dell insipron 8600
<unix_infidel> hey guys, i know i can install kde on top of the standard ubuntu install, but how large will the binary installation plus the debs be?
<Lathiat> unix_infidel: 100-150M of debs at ag uess
<Lathiat> no idea on install size
<Lathiat> 600M?
<Lathiat> i pulleda lll of those figures from thin air :)
<Lathiat> let me know how right i am :)
<unix_infidel> i'm deciding b/w ubuntu and kubuntu, but i'd like to get idea of what kinda resources i'm dedicating.
<unix_infidel> heh, i thought you guy's were the masters of the universe :P
<Lathiat> the resources between each are probably about the same
<unix_infidel> 600 sounds about riht.
<unix_infidel> 100-150 sounds about right.
<unix_infidel> i'd just like to get a closer estimate.
<unix_infidel> from an authoritative source...unless i'm wrong :P
<Lathiat> apt-get install kubuntu-desktop
<imbrandon> no idea but try it out and let us know so we cxan tell the next person ;)
<Lathiat> see hwo much it says it needs
<Lathiat> :)
<unix_infidel> Lathiat: i know that's about 145MB
<unix_infidel> i'm more interested in the binary.
<Lathiat> you mean
<Lathiat> how much space on disk after?
<unix_infidel> yes.
<Lathiat> instal it and find out :)
<Lathiat> wait
<Lathiat> doesnt apt tell you?
<unix_infidel> i havent installed it yet.....
<unix_infidel> i'm deciding b/w ubuntu and kubuntu :P
<unix_infidel> LOL
<Lathiat> Need to get 133MB of archives.
<Lathiat> After unpacking 398MB of additional disk space will be used.
<imbrandon> unix_infidel: i'm on kubuntu and did .... sudo apt-get install ubuntu-dektop and got .....
<imbrandon> Need to get 147MB of archives.
<imbrandon> After unpacking 676MB of additional disk space will be used.
<Lathiat> tis what it says for me
<Lathiat> i already have the kde base libraries and stuff installed tho
<Lathiat> tis whyt heres a big difference
<unix_infidel> aight, cool, i'm going to install regular ubuntu then.
<Lathiat> as i run kopete and stuff
<Lathiat> unix_infidel: just remember that when y9u install kubuntu
<Lathiat> you lose all the gnome stuff
<Lathiat> i suspect that ab ase install of either
<Lathiat> is basically the same
<unix_infidel> Lathiat: nah, i'm going to install ubuntu
<unix_infidel> and do apt-get install kubuntu-desktop
<Lathiat> . righjt, ok
<Lathiat> that makesa  mess of your menus :)
<unix_infidel> Lathiat: i use fluxbox :P
<unix_infidel> this is for testing purposes :P
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<imbrandon> gnight bddebian
<unix_infidel> why the hell else would you think i'd be interested in how much space i'm "wastin"
<LaserJock> I dio ubuntu and then install kubuntu-desktop and xubuntu-desktop for the heck of it
<unix_infidel> nw that's just crazy.
<unix_infidel> anwyway, i'm going to give it a go
<unix_infidel> i think you'd get better support here than in #ubuntu :P
<unix_infidel> i mean seriously....i hate going in there :P
<LaserJock> ajmitch: I merge for a particular branch all the time, is there a way to have bzr remeber that?
<ajmitch> it might have --remember
<ajmitch> I can't recall ;)
<ajmitch> yeah, it does
<imbrandon> w00t stuff coming accross edgy-changes .... time to learn to setupa chroot .... or hmmm vmware
<tritium> :)
<ajmitch> back later
<LaserJock> imbrandon: do the chroot
<imbrandon> anyone have an idea when universe will be open for uploads ?
<LaserJock> it's good for you :-)
<LaserJock> it more or less is now, I think
<imbrandon> LaserJock: do you have one setup so when i fail i can ask you questions ;)
<LaserJock> a chroot?
<imbrandon> yea
<LaserJock> yeah, I've got like 7 or 8 of them spread all over the place
* imbrandon has never done it before
* StevenK has seven on this machine.
<LaserJock> oh it's not bad, just use wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapChroot
<imbrandon> nice , is it simple enough to semi walk me though here on irc ?
<imbrandon> ahh ok
<imbrandon> thanks
<imbrandon> and you can setup any enviroment in chroot ? even say suse or such ? not that i would setup suse but its good toknow i could , or say debian sarge chroot etc
<LaserJock> you can do debian and Ubuntu, but I don't think you can do other distros (at least not easily) but I'm totally not sure of that
<imbrandon> cool , yea mostly just debian ish is all i'm interested in
* Kyral yawns
<Kyral> night peopel
<imbrandon> night Kyral
<nenolod> hi! I'm one of the audacious developers. Your listing in launchpad for it is umm, grossly inaccurate. It is listed as being dependant on GST, while in reality we have our own backend.
<unix_infidel> hey nenolod :)
<Erlang> eh, I thought for a second that it was pretty strange for somebody to qualify himself as an audacious developer...
<nenolod> Erlang: haha. :P
<nenolod> Anywho, when I tried to submit an update, it said I wasn't authorized to, so I just wanted to let you all know. I'll idle in here and see if the driver for the audacious package in Launchpad shows up.
<Erlang> I don't see an 'audacious' package.
<unix_infidel> nenolod: there is none.
<unix_infidel> they have a package on their website.
<nenolod> unix_infidel: there is in Launchpad. It's a child of gstreamer.
<Erlang> URL?
<nenolod> http://launchpad.net/projects/GStreamer
<nenolod> what I am saying is that 'audacious' should not be a child of that.
<nenolod> because they are entirely unrelated things.
<nenolod> :-P
<Erlang> I see now.
<nenolod> oh. lowercase gstreamer, sorry
<Erlang> but I don't think that this means much.
<nenolod> I run IRC outside X, so that was from memory. :P
<unix_infidel> nenolod: there's an audacious package for ubuntu in the repsos
<unix_infidel> repos*
<imbrandon> https://launchpad.net/products/audacious
<nenolod> imbrandon: yes. what I am saying is that I am upstream, and I wish to make a correction to how it is described
<imbrandon> nenolod: then you are better of trying #launchpad ;)
<nenolod> imbrandon: thanks
* ajmitch returns
<TheMuso> Hey all. Do I have to fetch the new 2.6.17 kernel for edgy from git? Or is there a package somewhere?
<ajmitch> there will be a package
<ajmitch> be patient
* Lathiat laughs
* ajmitch mutters about impatient crack-addicts
<TheMuso> heh
<TheMuso> I guess I am interested to try some screen reader crack :)
<ajmitch> you can grab it from git if you want
<ajmitch> but by the time you finish compiling it, the packages will probably be built & in edgy
<TheMuso> Yeah true.
<TheMuso> I'll just wait.
<ajmitch> it took me a few hours to build on my box
<ajmitch> & edgy is switching to gcc-4.1
<TheMuso> Thats several kernels though isn't it?
<ajmitch> yes
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> This will be a very fun cycle.
<TheMuso> Especially if gcc is being upgraded. :)
<ajmitch> if?
<ajmitch> it's there now
<ajmitch> switching to 4.1 (and a new glibc) is the first task that has to be done before anything else gets built
<TheMuso> Ah thats true.
<TheMuso> hmm ok. Hasn't been built yet.
<ajmitch> some people just don't know when to shut up :)
<seaLne> if there is a version of a package in debian but the package for kubuntu dosen't actually inherit from it (debian didn't do anything but various kubuntu specific patches) should it be -0 or -1?
<ajmitch> I'd probably still stick with -0ubuntuX
<seaLne> that was my initial thought as -1 would mislead but i wan't sure
<siretart> uuuh, first edgy uploads. nice!
<ajmitch> morning siretart :)
<ajmitch> how are you?
<siretart> thanks fine, I'm currently starting my day work with dynamic aspect weaving. and you?
<siretart> morning dholbach!
<ajmitch> morning dholbach
<ajmitch> I'm just waiting for the meeting which should be in ~15 minutes
<dholbach> hey siretart, hey ajmitch! hello everbody
<ajmitch> hm
<ajmitch> k3b upload on revu? I wonder why...
<ajmitch> looks to only be a new upstream version
<seaLne> so people can look at it
<seaLne> primarily Riddell
<dabaR> how do I change the install script inside a .deb file?
<dabaR> It is performing some check that I want to skip
<crimsun> which install script?
<crimsun> pre/post, that is
<dabaR> pre.
<dabaR> it does not install
<dabaR> so I guess it is pre
<dabaR> It is all still in a .deb
<crimsun> where does dpkg actually barf?
<dholbach> hey crimsun
<crimsun> if you have already tried dpkg -i, you can edit the preinst, otherwise you need to change preinst in the source package and reroll the deb (preferably)
<crimsun> hullo dholbach :)
<Hobbsee> hey all
<dabaR> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/15295
<crimsun> eek, a pyro
<ajmitch> hide the matches!
<Hobbsee> matches?  did i hear someone mention matches?
<dabaR> I want to skip that check, what should I go about doing?
<crimsun> dabaR: since it's already unpacked, just edit /var/lib/dpkg/info/bcm43xx-firmware.preinst
<dabaR> hm...
<dabaR> or, ahhh...
* Hobbsee grabs the matches from ajmitch and sets crimsun on fire.
<Hobbsee> mmm..fire...
<ajmitch> ok...
<ajmitch> strange person
<Hobbsee> hehe
<crimsun> must be the .au connection ;)
<Hobbsee> :P
<ajmitch> must be
<dabaR> Not there.
* Hobbsee considers who to set on fire next.
<crimsun> dabaR: which /var/lib/dpkg/info/bcm43xx-firmware.p* exist?
<dabaR> heh
<dabaR> nothing under there with bc
<dabaR> there is a bc, actually, I guess the calc
<crimsun> ah, so it's all in /var/tmp/bleh, then (which you'll see if you use dpkg -D3773 -i)
<dabaR> Noooo please don't make me use that.
<dabaR> hehe
<crimsun> in that case you'll need to retrieve the srcpkg for bcm43xx-firmware and change the preinst, then reroll the binary package
<dabaR> I have nothing under /var/tmp
<crimsun> yeah, it's temporary :)
<dabaR> OK, I guess I have to wait for cafuego then.
<crimsun> (he should be providing the src package for download alongside the binary package...)
<dabaR> It is some bug in his package which makes Ubuntu not load any more if you install, then uninstall, then reinstall that particular package with my wlan card. Is there many things that could cause that?
<crimsun> "not load" meaning "fails to boot and load gdm"?
<dabaR> it stops at one of the steps in the boot up process. I can't recall which one right now.
<dabaR> falls from the graph to the normal scren.
<dabaR> Oh, ya, it was the system log something.
<dabaR> Starting system log
<dabaR> Or kernel log, not 100% sure now.
<crimsun> haven't run across that one, mayhap a bug filed in Malone already?
<dabaR> It is just with his package, which is not in any way official, so I am not sure. See, I talked to him about it, but before I found out that it only happens when you uninstall, then reinstall, and he decided to put that check. In the meantime, I misplaced the old .deb which did not have that check, so I can not install now. Hence the question about changing the check.
<dabaR> check 1-2
<dabaR> And my monodoc crashes every time I click on a link within a page.
<dabaR> but, that is another story.
<crimsun> mm, yeah, without having seen the source package, I dunno...
<dabaR> OK, thanks for the chat:) see ya
* ajmitch would just blame Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> hehe
* Hobbsee would just throw a trout at ajmitch for doing it.
<crimsun> well, they /are/ both in .au ...
<ajmitch> they?
<ajmitch> cafuego as well, you mean?
<crimsun> yeah
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: NZ doesnt count as a separate country - it's too small :P
<crimsun> hmm, mubuntu?  ("managed"?)
<phanatic> hi people
<Hobbsee> hey phanatic
<phanatic> heya Hobbsee
* ajmitch hungry
* Hobbsee throws some raw fish to ajmitch 
<ajmitch> you're so very helpful
<Hobbsee> there you go, there's dinner.
<Hobbsee> :) anytime
* ajmitch sighs
* StevenK jumps on Hobbsee.
* Hobbsee splats on the ground
<StevenK> Hrm. I ought to be more careful.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: here's dinner.  StevenK would make great dinner.
<StevenK> Hah, I'm going out for dinner tonight.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: take us with you? :P
<StevenK> If you can get to my place in oh, 2 minutes.
<ajmitch> sure
<ajmitch> I can try
<Hobbsee> StevenK: not with that couch in the way.
<StevenK> Heh
* StevenK heads off.
<Hobbsee> apparently traffic was very slow/blocked in one direction on one of the roads, because there was a couch in the way, just sitting on the road.
<ajmitch> australians...
<Lathiat> haha
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> i didnt see it though - just heard about it - not sure where it was
<zakame> hi all
<ajmitch> hi zakame
<zakame> heya ajmitch
<ajmitch> how's SoC going?
<zakame> janitor work as usual, cleaning up the source :)
<ajmitch> fun
<zakame> yup, and learning too :D
* ajmitch is having fun breaking things
<zakame> hehe
<jenda> ploink. Just noticed there is no contact listed in the wiki for this chan. Should I add one?
<jenda> sladen?
<sladen> jenda: if you want to
<jenda> Well, are you the contact person? ;)
<jenda> (I'm translating the page, so I stumbled upon that)
<crimsun> dholbach heads motu iirc
<Hobbsee> hehe...breaking things...dont tempt me... :P
<dholbach> crimsun: in what regard?
* jenda is confused.
<crimsun> dholbach: aren't you still listed as being the "head"?
<jenda> I'm more like looking for the person in charge of the channel...
<crimsun> oh, irc channel,
<dholbach> crimsun: I'm not sure if MOTU ever had a "head" :)
<crimsun> dholbach: ah, ok. I blame Jeff W. ;)
<jenda> err... not helping :D
<dholbach> crimsun: haha :)
* dholbach hugs crimsun
<Hobbsee> hey dholbach
<dholbach> heya Hobbsee
<jenda> Aww...
<zakame> hi dholbach !
<dholbach> heya zakame, hey ogra
<zakame> heya ogra
<crimsun> jenda: a number of people have chanserv privileged access, if that's what you seek
<jenda> dholbach: so... who is in charge of the channel? (formally)
<dholbach> jenda: nobody
<jenda> crimsun: not really, that I found out yself :) was looking for the formal.. right.
<dholbach> jenda: we're a team
<ogra> meh, i missed the meeting, damned
<jenda> Great :)
<ogra> morning dholbach
<dholbach> ogra: still going on
<dholbach> jenda: what is your question?
<crimsun> ogra: hasn't gotten to 'o' yet
<ogra> phew :)
<jenda> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/InternetRelayChat
<dholbach> ah ok
<jenda> This channel has no contact person.
<dholbach> well, "the MOTU team" is
<dholbach>  :)
<jenda> I'm translating the page, so I'd like to know - and can fix it in the orig as well.
<ajmitch> dholbach is still the Face of MOTU :)
* ajmitch wonders who gets listed for -motu-school
<Hobbsee> hmmm...that ops page is out of date...
* jenda waves at ajmitch
<jenda> so...
<jenda> oh no :)
<dholbach> ajmitch: I think I'll write a spec about that
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: maybe you?
<jenda> should I go around and update it?
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: nope
<Hobbsee> jenda: just https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRCOperators
<ajmitch> dholbach: a spec about the face of MOTU? :)
<ajmitch> or a spec about the school?
<ajmitch> so-called
<dholbach> the latter
<jenda> Hobbsee: doesn't help...
<ajmitch> which would have been useful if we'd kept going with it
* Hobbsee wishes they had kept going with it
<dholbach> Edgy will give MOTU a big boost
<dholbach> I can feel it
<jenda> Hobbsee: the page I'm working on is there to list channels and their contacts.
<Hobbsee> jenda: yeah, i saw...that looks okay
<crimsun> hmm, importing Sid into LP.
<jenda> Well, if you come up with who is actually the contact - please ping me :) I'll put teh freenode contact for now.
<ajmitch> dholbach: we need to be ready to handle the influx of new faces then
<zakame> dholbach++
<ajmitch> Mithrandir: aha, happy birthday ;)
<zakame> I can't wait for the merges to begin ;)
<ajmitch> someone want to go through & write up some info on what tasks a new person can do?
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: thanks
<ajmitch> merging stuff will probably be the first big task (again)
<ajmitch> Mithrandir: how many years now?
<Mithrandir> 26
<crimsun> hey, happy birthday!
<zul> young'un
<crimsun> (dang I feel my old bones creaking...)
<zakame> happy birthday Mithrandir ! =)
<Hobbsee> Mithrandir: happy birthday :)
<ajmitch> crimsun: you're only a couple of years older, right? :)
<crimsun> just one ;)
<Hobbsee> bah.  old people :P
<Mithrandir> thanks all. :-)
* ajmitch gets back to doing stuff
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: yes, we are
* Hobbsee grabs her collection of walking sticks, and starts handing them out...
<Toadstool> heya MOTUs
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: can we talk a bit in ~1 hour?
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> I'll try & stay awake :)
<Mithrandir> thanks.
<pschulz01> Greetings all..
<pschulz01> New package. I'm working through the Packaging Guide, and would like to know if the original tar has to have the same name as the package..
<pschulz01> Also, anyone have an example for the 'get-orig-source' rules file target?
<crimsun> pschulz01: the original tar should be named foo-version.orig.tar.gz
<crimsun> pschulz01: sorry, foo_version.orig.tar.gz
<pschulz01> crimsun - thanks... upstream wasn't cooperative..
<pschulz01> crimsun, well.. not at this stage (I haven't spoken to them about this.)
<crimsun> pschulz01: it doesn't matter what upstream actually names theirs
<pschulz01> Should I have this in the parent directory befor building?
<crimsun> the orig.tar.gz of the source package has to follow that syntax, and you can rename upstream's tarball if necessary
<crimsun> pschulz01: yes, if the source package is non-native
<pschulz01> crimsun, It was also 'bz2'ed.. have converted to gz as per manual.
<crimsun> ugh, 3 hours of sleep or fewer before my next meeting
* crimsun collapses
<ajmitch> lucky crimsun
<ajmitch> work meeting?
<zakame> awww
* zakame can't believe he's building Perl from source
<ajmitch> sick man
<pschulz01> What do I do if the original 'tar' doesn't extract to a suitable tree? eg. yaAGC (instead of yaagc-<version>)
<ajmitch> pschulz01: it doesn't matter
<pschulz01> ajmitch, Just start editing?
<pschulz01> (adding debian dir?)
<ajmitch> yep
<zakame> brb
<Toadstool> ajmitch: yep, I know ipv6 is an etch release goals but I've not seen a thing about that on d-d@ or d-ipv6@...
<Toadstool> *goal
<ajmitch> probably just debian-release
<Toadstool> hum, right
<Toadstool> ajmitch: nope, can't find anything except for the announce :/
<zakame> shoot building perl just triggered the OOM
<pschulz01> What envirment variables should I be setting? (Eg. how do I get emac's changelog mode to pick up my email address?)
<zakame> erm, DEBEMAIL?
<pschulz01> Ahh...it's not a environment variable... (setq debian-changelog-mailing-address "myname@debian.org"))
<ogra> not setting it is a quite effective safety net btw :)
<ogra> you have to look at the changelog again and have to s/localhost/your domain/ in it
<pschulz01> Ahh..
<ajmitch> ogra: not effective enough sometimes :)
<ajmitch> I'm sure I've seen uploads go through from 'root@localdomain'
<ogra> ajmitch, right, but it saved my ass some times already
<zakame> you can always have a progn or somesuch to get the environment variable
<ogra> well, that only works if you dont sign with the changelog address
<ajmitch> ogra: problem is that I use both @ubuntu.com & @debian.org for changelogs
<ajmitch> depending on where I'm uploading
<ogra> my gpg would choke on root@localdomain
* Hobbsee thinks her parents are crazy.  they want to go on a cruise from sydney, around new zealand.
<Hobbsee> why????
<ajmitch> why not?
<ajmitch> do you have something against NZ?
<Hobbsee> because it doesnt take that long to fly - and wouldnt you actually want to go *on* the island, rather than around it???
<ajmitch> see the coastline, etc...
<ajmitch> visit various coastal cities, perhaps
<Hobbsee> true
<pschulz01> Go to Milford Sound by boat... beats driving!
* Hobbsee would take a plane.
<Hobbsee> no, got nothing against NZ at all - apart from aussies lovign to tease the NZ'ers
<Mithrandir> Hobbsee: I totally understands them.  But then, I'm probably weird.  (I took the train from Oslo to Hong Kong nine years ago)
<Hobbsee> hehe, fair enough
<Mithrandir> s/understands/understand/
<Hobbsee> they dont want to take me either :(
<ajmitch> so you get to stay home alone & have parties?
<Hobbsee> so it seems...
<azeem> Hobbsee: it's just a boring trip *around* an island, why would you want to go along? :PO
<azeem> s/O$//
<ajmitch> besides, if you visited NZ you'd be without internet access while on a boat...
<Hobbsee> azeem: haha true
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: e
<Hobbsee> exactly!
* ajmitch needs dinner sometime
<ajmitch> and no, raw fish does not count
<pschulz01> I've made some changes to the source of a package.. when/how does the '.diff.gz' file appear?
<Hobbsee> cooked fish any better?
<ajmitch> pschulz01: when you do debuild -S, for example
<Hobbsee> pschulz01: is the folder named "packagename-versionnumber"?
<pschulz01> ajmitch, Doing that...
<pschulz01> Hobbsee, No..
<Hobbsee> pschulz01: it needs to be, for the .diff.gz to be created, with the debuild -S, i recall
<pschulz01> I'm just extracting upstreams tar and editing.
<pschulz01> But... but.. but..
<Hobbsee> oh ok
<pschulz01> ( ajmitch said it didn't matter...)
<Hobbsee> there's something different and weird about that
<Hobbsee> pschulz01: believe him over me!
<pschulz01> Hobbsee, I do get a warning from dpkg-build package.
<pschulz01> Ahh,, need to use '_' in orig.tar.gz
<viviersf> lol gr8
<Hobbsee> that's the other one
<viviersf> theres a python package with only a readme telling you to download the source and compile it
<viviersf> :(
<Hobbsee> hey Kyral
<zakame> hi Kyral
<Hobbsee> hmmm.  some guys in u-o want to get me drunk, and then get me to dance.  how odd.
<zakame> heh
<tseng> that means they think you are a hottie
<tseng> but still not a good idea
<Hobbsee> they've never even seen what i look like!
<Hobbsee> i know, i'm not that stupid to accept :P
<tseng> i have no idea what u-o iwas, i presumed something university
* Hobbsee is just mind-boggling at the thought
<Hobbsee> tseng: #ubuntu-offtopic
<tseng> I see.
<tseng> pretty weird
<sivang> so, has mergers started already? :)
<ajmitch> no
<ajmitch> no uploads yet, at any rate
<ajmitch> people probably have some merges prepared
<tseng> MoM is broke
<tseng> afaik
* ajmitch wants tomboy shipped on desktop by default, now
<tseng> indeed
<tseng> i changed my defaults for gnome-volume-manager and nautilus
<tseng> to use f-spot
<Gloubiboulga> hello!
<Gloubiboulga> Debian policy version is now 3.7.2, do we use this in Standards-Version for new packages in edgy?
<ajmitch> might as well, once debian-policy gets synced
<Gloubiboulga> ok
<Toadstool> Gloubiboulga: I've advised Sp4rky to do so for yersinia
<tseng> ajmitch: i wonder if kamion meant to upload new upstreams to dapper
<ajmitch> hm?
<tseng> they went to dapper-changes
<ajmitch> oops
<ajmitch> I guess he should have done the coffee first
<tseng> could be launchpad is still sending to the old list
<ajmitch> no
<ajmitch> well..
<ajmitch> possible
<Gloubiboulga> Toadstool, I've seen this, that's why I asked here ;)
<ajmitch> anything is possible with launchpad
<ajmitch> nothing on https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/libselinux yet
<Gloubiboulga> Toadstool, his package looks great, only a debian/copyright issue
<Toadstool> Gloubiboulga: ok ^^
<Toadstool> yep, just read your comment about the copyright
<Mithrandir> who was it who played with ifolder again?
<ogra> Mithrandir, mez
<ogra> Mithrandir, i wish he hadnt uploaded that unreviewed and unapproved crap
<ajmitch> I'm sure it was an accident
<ajmitch> kamion let it out of NEW a few months after it was uploaded
<Mithrandir> it doesn't seem to be in dapper?
<ajmitch> no, we got it removed
<Mithrandir> ah, ok
<ajmitch> it was old, broken & unbuildable
<ogra> ajmitch, still it had no reviews at all and its a really odd package
<ajmitch> ogra: I hope he just made the mistake of uploading to dapper when he meant to upload to REVU
* ogra didnt know it was sitting in the queue
<ajmitch> well we can see the queue now :)
<ogra> i thought he did a last minute upload of "what he had"
<ogra> i aslo didnt knwo the removal was approved ...
<ajmitch> yes, tseng & I talked to kamion
<ogra> ajmitch, i was here during that conversation, i justs didnt get that it was actually removed
<ajmitch> right
<ogra> good thing though :)
<ajmitch> it still required simias to be buildable
<ajmitch> don't know if that was uploaded at all
<ogra> i dont think so
<\sh> cool..no ifolder in ubuntu, but xgl...I actually don't know what's more harmful ;)
<ogra> xgl isnt harmful
<ogra> its locked away in universe ... you need to do some manual steps to even get it working
<\sh> ogra: believe me over the weekend and on monday we had to answer hundreds of xgl questions on #kubuntu-de.
<\sh> because every ricer is installing xgl and they don't know what to do ... it is harmful for the community supporter
<ajmitch> it's quite painful
<ogra> \sh, well, i tend to ingnore them :)
<ogra> xgl wont make it into xorg anyway ... i guess it will stay in its niche and be happy over there
<ajmitch> we got xgl & compiz in universe when they were released, and noone cared enough to update them
<ajmitch> yes, novell vs redhat
<\sh> ogra: I told them, it's unsupported, they are on their own
<ajmitch> they each have their pet method of doing things
<\sh> I don't need a wordprocessor which is rotating three dimensional over my 2d desktop ;)
<ajmitch> don't forget the wobbling!
<ogra> yeah, we even have a SoC project for a wobbly screen magnifier ;)
<\sh> oh wobbling email clients I don't need either, I'm already blind ;)
<ajmitch> ogra: and I still wonder why.. :)
<ogra> ajmitch, to see the letters wobbling while zooming in and out :)
<ajmitch> haha
<Hobbsee> hehe.  scary
<Hobbsee> there's apparently a nvidia guide for xgl for kubuntu now :)
<ajmitch> oh, I should take a look
<ajmitch> I need to have windows bouncing around
<\sh> btw...is edgy open for action?
<Hobbsee> hehe
<ajmitch> no
<zul> ajmitch: i note a tone of sarcasm there..
* Hobbsee just wants this stupid program to crash!
<ajmitch> \sh: there's plenty of action, but not of the right kind
<ajmitch> zul: really?
* \sh has to work on some packages over the weekend
<zul> ajmitch: really
<hub> action?
* ajmitch shouldn't be cooking dinner this late
<Hobbsee> haha
<Hobbsee> what are you havign ajmitch?
<Hobbsee> it's almost 1am there!
<ajmitch> curry
<StevenK> It took you that long to decide?
<Hobbsee> nice
<Hobbsee> StevenK: how was your dinner?
<StevenK> It was okay.
<ajmitch> StevenK: no, it took me that long to do something about it :)
<StevenK> The Chinese resturant we went to wasn't up to its usual high standard tonight. :-(
<ajmitch> since I was watching the distro meeting, talking about soc work, other random stuff..
<ajmitch> ah, a shame
<Hobbsee> :(
<Hobbsee> bleck, chinese
<ajmitch> you don't like?
<StevenK> How can you not?
<Hobbsee> no, especially when it's half cold
<ajmitch> fussy..
<Hobbsee> i dont mind rice and noodles though :P
<Hobbsee> hehe..yep
<StevenK> What about Thai?
* Hobbsee shrugs - that doesnt seem so bad
<Hobbsee> depends on what it is - and how spicy it is.  curries are good
<ajmitch> this is just a beef vindaloo..
<StevenK> I'll usually only have a curry if I've got a flu.
<ajmitch> how unfortunate
<ajmitch> why only then?
<ajmitch> you'd lose most of the taste with the flu..
<pschulz01> Does anyone here use dpatch?
<tseng> yes, everyone
<pschulz01> :-)
<tseng> its in the MOTU toolbox
<pschulz01> Good.. I think it's going to be the only way I'm going to be able to get this package to build.
<ajmitch> why do you think that?
<pschulz01> Upstream uses a home spun 'configure' script...
<ajmitch> is that a problem?
<pschulz01> I would like to use 'autoconf' and friends, but that requires something like 'autoreconf' to be run to create a real 'configure' prior to calling the packaging tools.
<pschulz01> Upstream doesn't support PREFIX.
<ajmitch> why would you completely change the upstream build system like that?
<pschulz01> (easily)
<tritium> On launchpad, what's an ubuntero, and why would I not be shown as one?
<pschulz01> Sorry.. DESTDIR
<ajmitch> tritium: someone who's signed the CoC
<tritium> ajmitch: I've certainly done that
<ajmitch> I'd assume so, otherwise you couldn't upload :)
<tritium> yeah, strange...
<ajmitch> I see I'm not marked as one now
<ajmitch> LP bug
<tritium> indeed
<tritium> I'll file it
<pschulz01> ajmitch, It also tries to support multiple architectures but doesn't do it very well.
<ajmitch> unilaterally ripping out a build system & replacing it with autoconf isn't the best way to maintain a package
<ajmitch> s/autoconf/autotools/
<phanatic> hey dholbach
<pschulz01> ajmitch,comment appriciated..
<ajmitch> since you end up having to maintain a large burden
<pschulz01> ajmitch, I would like to push patches upstream that make it easier..
<JohnnyMast> any italians around ?
<imbrandon> !it ?
<JohnnyMast> yeah those fokes :)
<ajmitch> pschulz01: best to work closely with upstream for it
<tritium> ajmitch: maybe we haven't signed version 1.0.1 of the Code?
<pschulz01> ajmitch, I'm also getting lots of "dpkg-source: cannot represent change to...  binary file contents changed"
<tritium> perhaps it was only 1.0 that we signed, in other words
<ajmitch> tritium: probably, and it *was* unsignable until the last code rollout a couple of days aho
<ajmitch> s/aho/ago
<pschulz01> ajmitch, You're right there.
<ajmitch> however 1.0 ->1.0.1 is typographical changes onlu
<tritium> ajmitch: okay
<azeem> pschulz01: binary contents changed means you're adding/changing something which is not a text file
<azeem> you cannot do that when making a diff like .diff.gz
<pschulz01> pschulz01, I have had some success (see recent upload to REVU)  when I edit the configuration myself, but this doesn't solve the long term problem.
<pschulz01> azeem, cheers...
<\sh> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/edgy/
<\sh> woot?
<pschulz01> How are 'autotool' packages handled? Is it possible for the packaging scripts to run 'autoreconf' or is it expected that this will have been done upstream?
<pschulz01> (or does it depend on the package?)
<azeem> it should be done upstream
<azeem> but if the upstream tarball isn't up to it, you can either run it yourself and use the result as a patch when preparing the source package, or run it during package build time (and Build-Depends on the autotools)
<azeem> the latter isn't recommended though I think
<pschulz01> OK.. I wondered how the automatic build and test tools would be able to cope with it.
<pschulz01> All very straight forward really.
<\sh> azeem: I like the build time autoreconf way much more
<azeem> the main problem seem to be issues with one of the autotools versions changing between rebuilds and thus leading to unexpected results
* azeem doesn't really have an opinion on it
<pschulz01> \sh, are you doing this with any packages?
<pschulz01> \sh, (looking for an example)
<\sh> pschulz01: no...just packages which are not working as expected because of outdated aclocal and stuff like this..not every time...
<pschulz01> \sh, cheers..
<h3sp4wn> Is there any good documentation on using dpkg-cross with ubuntu ? Or just the debian docs for it
<Hobbsee> night all
<phanatic> night Hobbsee
<imbrandon64> gnight Hobbsee
<Ibalon> hi all
<crimsun> wee, "Ubuntu udev policy"  [https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edgy-changes/2006-June/000024.html] 
<Kyral_FreeBSD> oh sadness, bddebian isn't here
<crimsun> he's bdubuntu now, I think ;)
<Kyral_FreeBSD> lol
<Kyral_FreeBSD> I finally got around to installing HURD
<Kyral_FreeBSD> ...or trying to lol
<Kyral_FreeBSD> I load it with GRUB, it goes to a command prompt, then promptly freezes lol
<crimsun> perhaps it's a test of HURD worthiness
<tseng> perhaps it's a signal for you to use linux like everyone else
<Kyral_FreeBSD> tseng: Where is the fun in that?
<tseng> I don't know, getting the hardware support we have worked hard to win so far
<tseng> not reinventing the wheel
<Kyral_FreeBSD> hehe
<Kyral_FreeBSD> The reason I am trying out HURD is the same reason I am trying out BSD
<tseng> BSD actually works
<Kyral_FreeBSD> :P
<Spec> hehe
<Kyral_FreeBSD> Its so I can learn about it and why its different than GNU/Linux
<tseng> if you were trying to apply knowledge to the real world you would be better off with FreeBSD, Linux and Solaris or AIX
<tseng> not HURD
<tseng> but thats enough stop energy for one day
<Tonio_> hi
<swarog> hello
<LaserJock> hello swarog
<swarog> damn what a huge buglist :)
<swarog> i guess bunch of work you have
<crimsun> yeah, just wait til MoM starts churning.
<crimsun> fun++
* LaserJock hugs MoM
<Amaranth> crimsun: That's when you hide and hope it all goes away. :)
<tseng> or wait for dholbach
<tseng> and bddebian
<dholbach> where's the big buglist?
<Kyral_FreeBSD> ...crap
<Kyral_FreeBSD> HURD works...but only left me with ed as an editor
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:dholbach] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: Ubuntu Universe Repository Maintainers | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Documentation | Focus on http://tinyurl.com/nl87h (MOTU bugs) and http://tinyurl.com/rjcqu (UNMETDEPS) and http://tinyurl.com/kbxpe (mysqlclient) | http://tinyurl.com/pghsw (motureviewers)
<tseng> Kyral_FreeBSD: er.. vi?
<Kyral_FreeBSD> tseng: not even
<Kyral_FreeBSD> just plain ed
<_ion> And what's wrong with ed? ;-)
<Kyral_FreeBSD> I don't know how to use it :P
<_ion> There's a good man page.
<Kyral_FreeBSD> guess what
<tseng> its fine unless you want to see what you are doing
<Kyral_FreeBSD> man isn't installed
<spacey> cat? less?
<spacey> or do you want to edit:P
<Kyral_FreeBSD> edit.. :P
<_ion> cat >foo
<_ion> ;-)
<Kyral_FreeBSD> yah except you have to relize I am using a KVM switch right now and HURD freezes anytime I use anything other than the alphanumeric keys on the keyboard :P
<Kyral_FreeBSD> If I jack a keyboard in directly it works however
<sivang> so, the universe is now open in edgy?
<tseng> no
<tseng> if you upload it will be rejected
<LaserJock> hmm, still?
<tseng> yes still
<tseng> we dont have a sane toolchain even
<LaserJock> like that can stop us ;-)
<sivang> ah, right, see Scott's email to u-devel about getting X and more basic tool chain before
<LaserJock> I don't plan on doing anything until probably after Paris
<sivang> makes sense :-)
<LaserJock> what is the title of Scott's email?
<tseng> Re: Accepted *
<LaserJock> hmm, I'm feeling like I'
<LaserJock> I'm missing emails
<LaserJock> hmm, I didn't get those emails
<LaserJock> well that's odd
<LaserJock> I wonder if the department server is having issues
<imbrandon> LaserJock: to sum it up, they all look similar to this  ......
<imbrandon> This has also been rejected.
<imbrandon> Guys, please don't upload to edgy just yet ... we've got a large dep
<imbrandon> stack before X stuff is going to work
<imbrandon> Scott
<imbrandon> --
<imbrandon> Scott James Remnant
<imbrandon> scott@ubuntu.com
<imbrandon> only given diffrent reasons ;)
<LaserJock> imbrandon: yeah, i'm reading it on the archives for now, until my mail gets here :(
<LaserJock> I wondered why I didn't have the usualy amount of mail this morning
<crimsun> oh don't worry, I suspect you'll soon have a flood wrt "installing a compiler by default"
<imbrandon> hahaha yea
<imbrandon> is apt-get install build-essential that hard ?
<LaserJock> hu theCore
<Kyral_HURD> Jeez I better stop this before I get accused of cloning...
<LaserJock> yeah, one is enough ;-)
<Kyral_HURD> or 2...
<theCore> bonjour LaserJock
<Kyral_HURD> Jeez, where is bddebian when I need him...
<LaserJock> probably breaking his Hurd too ;-)
<Kyral_HURD> lol
<tseng> LaserJock: what is the problem with just syncing latex from debian
<LaserJock> somebody has to do it
<tseng> I nominate you
* tseng hides
<LaserJock> so far I just haven't been worrying about the main packages since I figured there was a core-dev to take care of it
<tseng> you thought wrong
<tseng> there are only ~30 of us
<LaserJock> sure, but there aren't *that* many Main packages ;-)
<tseng> and we arent all as hyperactive as some motus
<azeem> I don't think many more people work on SuSE or RedHat either
<tseng> much more than on ubuntu main
<azeem> well, packaging things I mean
<azeem> plus you can sync a lot and don't need to do everything
<lucas> are we free to start working on merges & syncs ?
<lucas> or should we wait ?
<tseng> wait.
<lucas> ok
<LaserJock> well, the specifc complaint was that a bug that Debian TeX considered RC took months to get fixed in Dapper (and ended up having to be done in -updates)
<lucas> I don't think it's a good idea to exclude main packages from the scope of MOTU teams
<lucas> many main packages are in main just because they are dependancies
<LaserJock> the big issue comes after UVF and we stop automatically syncing
<LaserJock> and nobody bothers to go back a see if a TeX sync is needed
<tseng> it normally wouldnt be needed
<LaserJock> we needed several this time
<tseng> unless someone has a stick up their ass about one particular bug
<LaserJock> since te move to 3.0
<tseng> and if they dont make a fuss in ubuntu land
<tseng> how could we know
<lucas> not that many people used dapper before the release
<tseng> it is nice to notify someone before you expect action
<tseng> rather than criticize after the fact
<lucas> so monitoring debian changes is still a good idea ...
<tseng> it is
<LaserJock> well, the specific bug was #36145 and it was know for a while
<LaserJock> in Ubuntu
<tseng> but it goes both ways
<tseng> if they want to hold us to their bugs
<tseng> they can participate
<tseng> no?
<LaserJock> well, I think their point is they fixed the bug on their end and they want Ubuntu to follow suit
<bluefoxicy> tseng
<tseng> yes?
<LaserJock> but at certain times in the release cycle it just isn't very easy
<bluefoxicy> who did you say I should talk to about gcc stack protection?
<bluefoxicy> Trulux wants to know.
<tseng> pitti is working on it
<bluefoxicy> I thought you said another guy was working on hardened in ubuntu too
<LaserJock> but bug #36145 did take some time
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 36145 in tetex-base "hyphenation does not work after upgrade from breezy to dapper" [Medium,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/36145
<tseng> Yagisan was
<tseng> but pitti is working on it atm
<bluefoxicy> thanks.
<tseng> a few test packages
<bluefoxicy> anyway don't let me interrupt.  :)
<bluefoxicy> (by the by, why the hell is python apparently executing code in 'anon'?)
<tseng> no idea
<tseng> anyway my point is
<tseng> if they are watching your package
<tseng> and want you to sync fixes
<tseng> they should tell you before, not after
<tseng> does that make sense?
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> but in this case since there was a bug in our BTS
<tseng> oh
<LaserJock> and it looked like we just sat on it for a few months
<tseng> and was it made clear that it was RC?
<LaserJock> I'm not sure
<LaserJock> take a look at it
<tseng> meh
<tseng> whatever
<LaserJock> basically, it was reported on 3/23 and there was a fix reported the same day
<LaserJock> and it took until 5/10 to get any dev response
<LaserJock> hmm, all these "Reply-to-List" people must be using mutt, I've been searching for other mail clients that have that feature and I haven't found any yet
<Erl[Work] > LaserJock: Kmail?
<LaserJock> Erl[Work] : does it? interesting
<LaserJock> I've never used it
<Erl[Work] > Unless I'm mistaken about what you mean.
<LaserJock> I tried Mail.app, Thunderbird, Opera, Gmail
<nawty> hi, anyone know when the merge from debian into edgy?
<LaserJock> nawty: probably a bit yet, I think they gotta get all the core stuff set up first
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  discussion in #pax on oftc is bringing up ubuntu and how it doesn't play well with mprotect() restrictions
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  as of breezy, running ubuntu with pax mprotect() is not feasible.  Can you be a dear and find out what these people broke?
<bluefoxicy> this may be related to running code in anonymous mappings all over the place
<nawty> LaserJock: ok, would there be an announcement?
<LaserJock> nawty: I would guess so, probably on ubuntu-devel
<bddebian> Heya gang
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<LaserJock> bddebian: dude, I don't know that you should be hugging people in -devel ;-)
<bddebian> Bah
<zul> yeah i dont think people like to be hugged for some odd reason
<LaserJock> only -motu and -bugs get bugs ;-)
<bddebian> Should I kick him instead? :-)
<zul> yeah i dont think you want to pss him off
<Kyral_FreeBSD> bddebian!!
<bddebian> zul: Why not?
<bddebian> Heya Kyral
<Kyral_FreeBSD> I got Hurd loaded :D
<bddebian> Nice
<Kyral_FreeBSD> I was on here with Irssi earlier :P
<zul> bddebian: just a sneaky suspicion...
<LaserJock> hehe, not the way to make core-dev :-)
<zul> thats what i was thinking
<bddebian> LaserJock: I didn't so, wtf :_)
<imbrandon> when's egdy gonna let universe uploads  ......... *ducks and runs*    ..... just kiddin
<tseng> ...
<imbrandon> tseng: was just jokin
<tseng> ARE WE THERE YET?
<imbrandon> hehehe
<tseng> you will see that in the topic in a few weeks
<tseng> #ubuntu-devel
<zul> how bout now?
<imbrandon> she's pinching me ....... he's looking out my window .......
<imbrandon> can i have a pony till we get universe opened totaly ? .... heheh
<_ion> imbrandon: echo OPTIONS=pettype:pony >>~/.nethackrc
<imbrandon> hahaha
<imbrandon> s/:pony/:ponies/g
<imbrandon> ;)
<imbrandon> i'm greedy
<_ion> s/:ponies/:a_freaking_herd_of_pink_unicorn_ponies/
#ubuntu-motu 2006-06-09
<zul> you guys are quiet
<imbrandon> shhhh we're hunting ponies
<ryanakca> Anyone have some spare time on their hands... to help me learn package building... or guide me in the right direction & answer some questions? If its not too much of a hassle...
<ryanakca> I mean... if you'd rather hunt ponies... thats fine..
<ryanakca> LOL
<imbrandon> lol i would help you but i'm just learning myself, chek out the debian new maintainers guide though its very good
<ryanakca> yeah... I'm reading it... just that I don't understand some things
<ryanakca> like patching... I know what it is... just not how...
<ajmitch> afternoon
<zul> evening
<ryanakca> night
<_ion> ryanakca: Here's an example of how to begin creating a package: wget -N http://johan.kiviniemi.name/tmp/packaging_rumor.{timing,script} && scriptreplay packaging_rumor.{timing,script}
<ryanakca> ummm... I'm lost :)
<ryanakca> I can make a basic .deb with dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot / dpkg-buildpackage -sa -rfakeroot
* _ion just watched Dancer in the Dark. I think it's one of the best movies i've seen, and i usually don't even like that genre. :-)
<ryanakca> just the patching...
<LaserJock> ajmitch: have you pushed any bzr branches to bazaar.launchpad.net?
<ajmitch> no, I haven't yet
<LaserJock> hmm, I tried, but it said "Parent directory does not exist"
<LaserJock> oh well
<Toadstool> re
<LaserJock> oh for goodness sakes, I can't get bzr push to do anything. I don't understand how it is supposed to be used for anything
<Toadstool> :)
* Toadstool still uses the ol'good subversion for most of its projects
<LaserJock> well, I like bzr for local things, but every time I try to do anything remotely I just end up using rsync or scp
<ajmitch> LaserJock: ask in #bzr
<ajmitch> 12:30 < spiv> siretart: the url for pushing to bazaar.launchpad.net is sftp://bazaar.launchpad.net/~USER/PRODUCT/BRANCH, where USER is your launchpad nick, PRODUCT is the name of a product registered in
<ajmitch>               launchpad (or +junk for no product), BRANCH is the name for this branch.
<LaserJock> right
<LaserJock> did that
<LaserJock> can't even push to my other box
<Toadstool> LaserJock: yeah right, I'm moving to bzr for the packages i'm working on for edgy on the other hand ;)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: I didn't say ask *me* in there :)
<LaserJock> hehe
<Toadstool> er, speaking about packages for edgy, I feel like I'm not that efficient... :/ one full day on a python lib package... I suck...
<LaserJock> well, that's what you get for pawning me off to another channel
<ajmitch> LaserJock: it's called delegation
<LaserJock> ajmitch: great delegate me off to a room of dead people ;-)
* ajmitch should be a manager ;)
<LaserJock> for sure
<Toadstool> :)
* Toadstool should go to bed
<Toadstool> g'night
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<ajmitch> hi
* havoc is taking the leap and putting ubuntu on his primary workstation :|
<havoc> chillywilly will be shocked
<bddebian> w00t, go havoc :-)
<havoc> I put it on my laptop a few days ago
<havoc> but workstation that I use at least 10hrs a day is different
<havoc> I'm sure it'll piss me off to some degree, but I'll suck it up and adjust ;)
<bddebian> What do you run now?
<havoc> (piss me off getting everything back to the way I like it)
<havoc> bddebian: this machine has been mandrake for 6(?) years or more
<LaserJock> wow
<bddebian> Mandark? WTF? ;-)
<havoc> specifically cooker
<havoc> their dev distro
<LaserJock> I think I used mandrake for all of 10 mins
<havoc> so I'm used to having a ton of bleeding edge crap installed
<ajmitch> so run edgy
<ajmitch> it should be bleeding & raw
<bddebian> I was just going to say that :-)
<havoc> ajmitch: is that what I have to do to get the latest firefox?
<ajmitch> define 'latest;
<havoc> current "release"
<havoc> 1.5.0.4
<ajmitch> you mean instead of the 1.5.0.3 in dapper?
<havoc> how "stable" is edgy?
<havoc> ajmitch: yes
<ajmitch> edgy is not stable, usable, or installable
<ajmitch> and 1.5.0.4 will be in dapper :P
<tseng> install it in a chroot if you must
<tseng> but you wont get anywhere
<havoc> ajmitch: ah, so there are updates to certain apps
<ajmitch> havoc: yes
<havoc> tseng: heh, ok
<ajmitch> they're called security fixes
<havoc> ajmitch: ok, that's what I wanted to know
<ajmitch> and updates
<LaserJock> and backports
<bddebian> Heya tseng
<tseng> hi
<havoc> still wasn't going to stop me from installing it
<tseng> good luck with that
<ajmitch> we're not going to throw dapper out the door & ignore it for security
<havoc> but it's nice to know that at least one little thing won't piss me off :)
<tseng> hope you dont have amd64
<ajmitch> tseng: that's easily fixable
<havoc> tseng: I meant installing dapper
<tseng> oh
<havoc> now finally chillywilly will get off my case ;)
<havoc> I'm also trying to lighten my work load by standardizing all the nix boxen I maintain
* havoc is sick of the crazy mix of machines
<LaserJock> ajmitch: well, supposedly Dapper universe is completely unsupported so I wouldn't count on any -security or -updates action ;-)
<havoc> hell, I'm even standardizing the windows boxes
<bddebian> Vista Beta 2? ;-P
<havoc> soemone package zoneminder ;)
<havoc> bddebian: ack
<ajmitch> havoc: you've been here long enough to learn how :)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: ha. ha. ha.
<bddebian> heh
<havoc> bddebian: no, getting all the family members to use XP, makes my job of free support easier :|
<havoc> ajmitch: haha, not yet
<havoc> but soon
* ajmitch thinks that we should kick anyone from the channel that hasn't had an upload to the repositories in the last 2 weeks ;)
<LaserJock> bye bye ajmitch
<ajmitch> let me get something into dapper-updates...
* havoc uploads some "stuff"
* LaserJock  needs to go back over the science bugs and see what is -updates material
<havoc> I was in #kubuntu, but they were driving me nutz
<bddebian> Hmm, I might have to hide too
<LaserJock> from me?
<bddebian> No, from getting kicked off the channel :-)
<LaserJock> doh, I don't think so
<havoc> you guys just had a release, it's summer, relax a bit ;)
<ajmitch> we can't relax
<LaserJock> no, we gotta get ready for Edgy
<ajmitch> we're too on edge
<bddebian> LaserJock: I am not sure I've uploaded in the last two weeks?
<LaserJock> Monday is the deadline for specs
<LaserJock> bddebian: I think you have, haven't you?
<havoc> the wife and I are taking our 2nd vacation in 7yrs next week
<havoc> yay :)
* ajmitch checks bddebian's upload record
<ajmitch> bddebian: you're safe till tuesday
* bddebian is glad ajmitch is always here to keep him on the straight and narrow :-)
<LaserJock> I know I'm toast
<LaserJock> I suck as a MOTU
<tseng> you only get deactivated after a year or two of sucking
* ajmitch grabs the violin
<LaserJock> yeah, yeah
<tseng> i believe
<bddebian> Hmm
<ajmitch> LP team membership is for 2 years
* bddebian checks when he was "accepted"
<LaserJock> ok, I'm going home
<ajmitch> bye
<LaserJock> I think I might even close my irssi
<havoc> later :)
<bddebian> Later LaserJock
<LaserJock> cya all
<havoc> soon all the machines will be debina, ubuntu, or winxp, and my life will become much easier...for a time
<bddebian> Heya crimsun_
<LaserJock> Is the Paris summit not going to have a cool nick name?
<Amaranth> LaserJock: UbuntuOnFire? :/
* Amaranth hides
<NthDegree> lol
<LaserJock> well, we had UbuntuFrenchKiss
<LaserJock> but I don't think that is offical ;-)
<NthDegree> that's as bad as saying we should be called the motubators :\
<bddebian> hehe
<NthDegree> i just hope when I fix up kubuntu wih lilo that it doesn't go putting it in the MBR :(
<bluefoxicy> ok guys
<bluefoxicy> what do I do with this.. thing... I have?
<bluefoxicy> I made a package.
<bluefoxicy> I can tar it up and submit it somewhere ... I think.
<LaserJock> put it on REVU?
<bluefoxicy> ok see now I'm going to ask another question.
<bluefoxicy> What the hell is REVU?
<LaserJock> wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU
<LaserJock> it is the review system that MOTU uses
<bluefoxicy>     *      A GPGKey  <-- Check
<bluefoxicy>     *      Know how to make Debian packages (see PackagingTips)  <-- No fucking clue
<bluefoxicy>     *      One or more new packages to upload  <-- Check
<LaserJock> for making packages I'd use the Ubuntu Packaging Guide
* Lathiat wonders how you can have a package to upload, yet not know how to make them
<LaserJock> it's shipped with Dapper or is at help.ubuntu.com
<LaserJock> Lathiat: well, I didn't want to say that but ...
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  making packages needs a dummy mode.  Making Gentoo ebuilds was far easier than this ;P
<Lathiat> with cdbs and most modern packaging systems i've found it relatively easy
* bluefoxicy has read the debian packaging guide a billion times.. wonders if the ubuntu packaging guide is better.
<bluefoxicy> Lathiat:  CDBS? Code to Do the BS?
* bluefoxicy notices his package is ... probably not signed.
<LaserJock> bluefoxicy: well, I hope the Ubuntu packaging guide is a bit easier to read
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  I'll look at it later.
<bluefoxicy> The debian one is a monster of technowhatsis and no real hand-holding.. once someone walks you through it it's easy but damn if the docs aren't murderous.
<LaserJock> Lathiat: hopefully the Edgy version of the packaging guide will do CDBS better justice
<bluefoxicy> Bug in the CDBS guide:  It uses more profanity than me in one sentence
<LaserJock> which CDBS guide?
<bluefoxicy> https://wiki.duckcorp.org/DebianPackagingTutorial/CDBS
<bluefoxicy> Also I love how they say not to use KDE
<bluefoxicy> awesome, I got it rewritten with CDBS now.  That was WAY easier.
<bluefoxicy> now does anyone want to give me a hint on htf to make this damn thing sign with my gpg key
<bddebian> dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa
<bluefoxicy> ok
<LaserJock> is the same name and address that is used for your key in the changelog?
<bddebian> Or debuild
<bluefoxicy> will it use my default key or base it on the maintainer field or what?
<bluefoxicy> yes.
<bluefoxicy> it's... not asking...
<bluefoxicy> bluefox@icebox:/tmp/x/pax-utils/pax-utils-0.1.13$ dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa -uc -us -rfakeroot
<LaserJock> don't use -uc or -us
<bddebian> -us means unsigned source
<LaserJock> that tells it to not sign
<bluefoxicy> oh
<bluefoxicy> I'm dumb.
<bluefoxicy> it's the same e-mail addy buti t doesn't like it
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  I am ... not sure I did this correctly.
<bluefoxicy> Files:
<bluefoxicy>  ac01f406bcb831cbf9e0e1f54770a679 262 devel optional pax-utils_0.1.13.dsc
<bluefoxicy>  894252f3e5aa1468e755ba34afa7705f 204679 devel optional pax-utils_0.1.13.tar.gz
<bluefoxicy> these files were both just generated
<LaserJock> good
<bluefoxicy> that's... normal right?
<LaserJock> yeah
<bluefoxicy> the original source is a .bz2
<bluefoxicy> ok.
<LaserJock> is this a brand new package
* bluefoxicy thought it was supposed to go source-patch-dsc-changes
<bluefoxicy> yes
<LaserJock> ok, so you should use debuild -S -sa
<bluefoxicy> I'm a brand new packager aren't i?  :)
<bluefoxicy> I did that
<LaserJock> oh yeah, i see that
<LaserJock> you made a Debian native package
<LaserJock> which is what you use if the package is specific to Ubuntu
<LaserJock> but you probably don't want that
<bluefoxicy> well, all I did was pretty much slap a rules file into debian/rules and mess with changelog and control
* NthDegree has to get back to packaging soon
<NthDegree> i'm slacking right now :) that's my excuse
<LaserJock> what did you call the tarball
<bluefoxicy> what tarball :)
<LaserJock> the original tarball
<bluefoxicy> the original source is http://dev.gentoo.org/~solar/pax/pax-utils-0.1.13.tar.bz2
<bluefoxicy> so I guess basename that.
<LaserJock> hmm, I'm not sure about .bz2 tarballs
<LaserJock> anyway, you should copy that tarball to pax-utils_0.1.13.orig.tar.bz2
<bluefoxicy> in the parent directory?
<LaserJock> yeah
<bluefoxicy> Build-Depends: cdbs
<bluefoxicy> Standards-Version: 3.6.2.1
<bluefoxicy> from control in the source area... wtf is standards-version
<LaserJock> they version of the Debian Policy that the package adheres to
* bluefoxicy writes "none" in there :)
<LaserJock> bluefoxicy: don't do that
* bluefoxicy isn't sure it's conforming but whatever.
<LaserJock> bluefoxicy: really, if you read the Ubuntu Packaging Guide it should help
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  honestly it's 12:34 am, I'd rather bug you unless you're busy and I'm keeping you from work :)
<bluefoxicy> But I guess I should.
<LaserJock> it least take a look
<bluefoxicy> link?
<bluefoxicy> packaging tips has links to the new debian maintainer's guide
<LaserJock> http://help.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html
<LaserJock> yeah, don't worry about wiki pages
<bluefoxicy> will try this but I don't feel any surer of wtf i'm doing.
<LaserJock> hehe, just keep with it, it'll start to make sense after a while
<bluefoxicy> yeah it.. made a .gz with everything in it.
<bluefoxicy> they're right.. this distribution is really dirty  :/
* bluefoxicy prods at this thing and wonders if it's working
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  I should have a .dsc and a .dsc.asc and a .gz and that's it right?
<LaserJock> bluefoxicy: no, you should have a .dsc, a diff.tgz, and a .orig.tar.gz
<bluefoxicy> dammit what the hell.
<bluefoxicy> does this not work with bzip2 tarballs
<bluefoxicy> I can pipeline it to gzip
<LaserJock> it might not I can't remember exactly
<LaserJock> but get rid of the old stuff
<bluefoxicy> bzcat pax-utils_0.1.13.orig.tar.bz2 | gzip > pax-utils_0.1.13.orig.tar.gz
<bluefoxicy> ok i got a diff now.
<LaserJock> k
<LaserJock> zless it to see what is in there
<bluefoxicy> pax-utils-0.1.13  pax-utils_0.1.13.diff.gz  pax-utils_0.1.13.dsc  pax-utils_0.1.13.dsc.asc  pax-utils_0.1.13.orig.tar.gz  pax-utils-0.1.13.tar.bz2
<bluefoxicy> that's my directory now
<bluefoxicy> it's correct.
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  now what the hell do I do with it
<LaserJock> yeah, that looks good
<LaserJock> well, you can build it into a .deb
<bluefoxicy> from the dsc?
<LaserJock> yeah
<bluefoxicy> command?
<LaserJock> do you have a pbuilder setup? I'm guessing no
<bluefoxicy> no
<bluefoxicy> I do this on a hot system
<bluefoxicy> I have no care for chrooting it (ironicly)
<LaserJock> you should do it on a pbuilder eventually
<bluefoxicy> I should
<LaserJock> in the mean time ...
<bluefoxicy> right now I don't have libsafe so I'm not worried about it flipping out and killing someone like RPM does
<tritium> yeah, to make sure it won't ftbfs
<bluefoxicy> (rpm makes shit depend on libsafe if libsafe is installed)
<LaserJock> if you have the build deps run debuild and it will produce a .deb
* bluefoxicy doesn't have debuild
<LaserJock> you sure? how did you build the source package? dpkg-buildpackage?
<bluefoxicy> I know this one .. it's ... umm.  something.... d.... no I have no clue what the pakcage is
<LaserJock> devscripts
<bluefoxicy> yeah, dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa -rfakeroot
<LaserJock> do dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot then
* bluefoxicy has debuild now
<bluefoxicy> buildpackage going.
<bluefoxicy> mmmm....... that didn't give me a .deb
<LaserJock> what did it give you
<bluefoxicy> nothing except a bunch of files caused by 'make'
<LaserJock> hmm?
<bluefoxicy> in the source tree, it spewed files around etc but just didn't build a package out of them
<LaserJock> how do you know?
<bluefoxicy> also -tc does not build packages
<bluefoxicy> err.  does not clean the files
<bluefoxicy> I looked in the source tree when it was done, how else would I know
<LaserJock> did you look in ../
<bluefoxicy> notihng's in ../ except .dsc and .dsc.asc
<bluefoxicy> I think I did something wrong.
<LaserJock> hmm, did you get any errors from debuild ?
<bluefoxicy> trying again
<bluefoxicy> dpkg-genchanges: failure: cannot read files list file: No such file or directory
<LaserJock> ok
* bluefoxicy guesses that was important
<LaserJock> yeah
<bluefoxicy> "The postinst and prerm files are examples of maintainer scripts. They are shell scripts that are executed after installation and before removal, respectively, of the package. In the case of the Ubuntu hello package, they are used to install (and remove) the info file."  <-- this is why I hate modern package management.
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  no instructions on making 'files', hintcoin?
<LaserJock> bluefoxicy: I gotta go to bed so this is the last thing I can give you
<bluefoxicy> ok
<bluefoxicy> I should sleep too really
<LaserJock> well actually I'm not exactly sure since I don't know what your rules file looks like
<bluefoxicy> very simple
<bluefoxicy> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/class/makefile.mk
<bluefoxicy> DEB_MAKE_CLEAN_TARGET    := distclean
<bluefoxicy> DEB_MAKE_BUILD_TARGET    := all
<bluefoxicy> DEB_MAKE_INSTALL_TARGET  := install DESTDIR=$(CURDIR)/debian/pax-utils
<LaserJock> I'd just read through the pacakging guide and also read the dpkg man page and look at what dpkg-genchanges expects
<bluefoxicy> well the packaging guide didn't seem to mention files..
<bluefoxicy> http://help.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/basic-scratch.html but you can check later.
<LaserJock> probably for a reason
<bluefoxicy> go to sleep.
<bluefoxicy> i should sleep too.
<bluefoxicy> SOMEBODY HELP ME.  *assumes innocent look*
<ajmitch> bluefoxicy: try adding "include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/debhelper.mk"
<bluefoxicy> thanks.
<ajmitch> currently you'll have no debian(or ubuntu) specific stuff to make a package out of what you're building
<bluefoxicy> uh.
<bluefoxicy> it gave me a gpg error?  o_O
<bluefoxicy> otherwise worked
<ajmitch> because the changelog email address & the gpg key don't match?
<bluefoxicy> no, because it did something wrong.
<ajmitch> 'something wrong' isn't descriptive enough
<bluefoxicy> it spewed out "enter passphrase:" and then spewed out an error about /tmp/seahorse
<ajmitch> fun
<bluefoxicy> and I got confused like "is it going to ask for my... oh"
<ajmitch> sounds like you're trying to use some agent & it's failing
<bluefoxicy> so I enter my passphrase and it says "ohshit gpg error sry" and dies.
<bluefoxicy> debsign: gpg error occurred!  Aborting....
<bluefoxicy> ok that time it spit them out in the correct order and it didn't work
<bluefoxicy> I didn't tell it to use any agent, and it straight asks for my pass phrase.
<bluefoxicy> If it could say something more descriptive than "gpg error occurred!" I could fix it.
<bluefoxicy> brb I need another shirly temple
<bluefoxicy> ajmitch:  otherwise it's working now.
<ajmitch> good
<ajmitch> though it still needs to be signed before upload to REVU
<bluefoxicy> signing worked before.
<bluefoxicy> I have no idea why it broke now.
<ajmitch> and you need to have your key in REVU's upload keyring
<bluefoxicy> the site says I don't need to get my key signed.
<ajmitch> that is correct
<ajmitch> but it does say you need to send the key
<bluefoxicy> apparently I have to send it up anyway?
<bluefoxicy> ok
<ajmitch> and I assume you'll have yours signed
<bluefoxicy> (i thought the key was just to get access to log in for comments)
<ajmitch> no, mini-dinstall uses the upload keyring to accept uploads
* bluefoxicy rm debian/preinst because he doesn't do anything in there anyway.
<bluefoxicy> ajmitch:  it signs the .dsc if I build with dpkg-buildpkg -S -sa -rfakeroot
<bluefoxicy> if I build with debuild it doesn't sign the resulting deb.
<ajmitch> you need to have the .dsc & .changes signed
<bluefoxicy> ok
<ajmitch> if you have GPG_AGENT_INFO in the environment, it'll use it
<ajmitch> I can't see how else it's getting /tmp/seahorse..
<bluefoxicy> negatory.
<ajmitch> you can just try with debsign alone, on the .changes file
<bluefoxicy> dpkg-buildpackage, what's the command I want
<ajmitch> ?
<bluefoxicy> I'm going to build the debs over again but not use debuild
<bluefoxicy> to see if it's a bug in debuild
<bluefoxicy> apparently dpkg-buildpackage is not having any trouble signing the .dsc
<bluefoxicy> (yes it bitches about seahorse too)
<ajmitch> it would be a bug in debsign rather than debuild, if there were any
<bluefoxicy> well it works with dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot, or at least doesn't complain.  DOes the signature go straight into the .deb?
<ajmitch> no
<bluefoxicy> then it's not working.
<bluefoxicy> nor is it complaining.
<bluefoxicy> ajmitch:  I think it just likes seahorse.  >:(  I installed it and it started magically using it
<ajmitch> crazy
<bluefoxicy> this is freakish
<bluefoxicy> it says problems with the agent with debuild, and then gpg fails
<bluefoxicy> with dpkg-buildpkg -rfakeroot the seahorse agent pops up and asks me to authorize key signature use
<bluefoxicy> I wonder wtf the difference is.
* bluefoxicy uses -rfakeroot with debuild.
<bluefoxicy> Successfully signed dsc and changes files
<bluefoxicy> OH REALLY, WHERE ARE THE .asc FILES THEN
<bluefoxicy> ajmitch:  get me the beating stick.
<bluefoxicy> oh it's inline.
<bluefoxicy> ok well now I have to find that page again since firefox crashed (it does that a lot)
<Hobbsee> hi all
<bluefoxicy> man now I have to fish for my keyid
<bluefoxicy> this is retarded.
* bluefoxicy pokes it with gpa
<bluefoxicy> got it
<bluefoxicy> ajmitch:  why do I have to put my keyid in the e-mail anyway?
<bluefoxicy> besides so I have to go look and see what it is
<ajmitch> as if that's hard
<bluefoxicy> eh, it changes a 3 second process to a 15 second one but not particularly.
<Hobbsee> bluefoxicy: say something nice in the email, or he might jump on you :P
* ajmitch certainly has no plans to do that
<bluefoxicy> it's 2:07 am, I am not obligated to be nice.  I've been nice all day, except I've been trying to build a tiny package since 10pm and I'm frustrated or something
<Hobbsee> oh, so that was reserved for me, got it.
<bluefoxicy> hehe
<bluefoxicy> yes he's more likely to jump a girl ;P
<Hobbsee> hush you!
<bluefoxicy> I still want to know why ubuntu is so dirty compared to debian... though thusfar I'm not having any trouble besides with libgcrypt.so.11, which I fixed by simply killing the PT_GNU_STACK setting.
<bluefoxicy> it makes no logical sense that there'd be so many W|X mappings strewn around on a debian derivative.
<bluefoxicy> what the crap
<bluefoxicy> there's no ld.so.conf
<bluefoxicy> how the hell... no, screw it, I don't care.
* bluefoxicy scans the whole system.
<bluefoxicy> gzip I've got a fix for already (don't use hand-written assembly)
<bluefoxicy> RWX --- ---   /lib/klibc-t2jM36h7OcxUNTDzncfER2p7kd4.so  <-- what the crap is that
<bluefoxicy> textrels everywhere *sigh*
* Hobbsee kicks her bad tempered wifi card.
* Hobbsee lectures on how her wifi card should connect when she demands it, and that it should *stay connected*!
<bluefoxicy> alright, I'm done for the night.
<Hobbsee> night bluefoxicy
* bluefoxicy goes to brush teeth while a scanelf runs
<bluefoxicy> if anyone wants to see the output from this I'll rafb it in a minute
<bluefoxicy> http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/hardened/pax-utils.xml and http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/hardened/gnu-stack.xml are good reads
<bluefoxicy> And pretty much spell out why I'm packaging this thing
<bluefoxicy> Only worth reading if you're into security stuff though.
<bluefoxicy> http://rafb.net/paste/results/bzsFEw53.html  Bading.  Sleep time.
<swarog> morning
<siretart> morning
<ajmitch> hi
<ajmitch> how are you siretart?
<phanatic> morning
<ajmitch> hi phanatic
<phanatic> hi ajmitch
<siretart> ajmitch: I'm okay. just arrived at work
<siretart> ajmitch: and you? how's your SoC project coming along?
<ajmitch> coming along ok :)
<ajmitch> I'm doing well enough
<siretart> :)
<ajmitch> considering what I'll do for the server side
<ajmitch> whether to make it flexible enough in eggy to accomodate configuring samba4 (has its own ldap/kerberos server)
<ajmitch> s/eggy/edgy/
<phanatic> ajmitch: your project sounds really interesting :)
<ajmitch> I've done the manual client & server setup
<ajmitch> now it's mainly coding & packaging to do
<Hobbsee> nice work :)
<siretart> ajmitch: how do you manage user and group accounts in ldap? what front end do you use for adding new users?
<ajmitch> siretart: that comes under the coding & packaging part ;)
<Hobbsee> hehe - eggy.  i wonder just how many people write the wrong distro in their changelogs when uploading things...
<swarog> phart
<ajmitch> currently I've been testing with a kde app called luma
<ajmitch> which seems to be fairly useful
<siretart> it's not really kde, it's 'just' qt..
<ajmitch> I *may* need to write something simple with pygtk to replace the gnome 1.x app directory-administrator
<siretart> but we deployed it at the internet cafe I was adminning.
<ajmitch> right
<ajmitch> same thing
<ajmitch> ;)
<spacey> we use luma as well
<spacey> on inregular basis
<ajmitch> I have to make sure that I get all the ldap&kerberos stuff to work together for user management though
<siretart> ajmitch: say, IIUC, when adding a new user, you need to add it to both ldap and add a kerberos principal, no? AFAIK luma can only do the former..
<ajmitch> siretart: what do you use for the kerberos side of things?
<ajmitch> yeah, that's my problem
<swarog> winbind?
<siretart> ajmitch: I never touched kerberos yet. thats why I'm asking
<ajmitch> right :)
<siretart> :)
<spacey> ajmitch if you write something up please let me know :>
<ajmitch> spacey: sure, I know ogra will love something for edubuntu
<ajmitch> infinity is considering throwing a samba4 beta into edgy if it's near usable
<siretart> not only for edubuntu. some ppl would sell such a solution as the 'holy grail'
<spacey> i will love it too
<ajmitch> so that may be fun to play with for AD stuff
<ajmitch> siretart: yes, I saw some posts on the forums (sigh) about what ubuntu needs for the enterprise :)
<siretart> samba4 will never be usuable. that's because of their development model
<siretart> it's more likely that someone backports the AD specific features from samba4 and calls it samba-ad-killer or somethin
<ajmitch> some nice setup can be done to integrate all these pieces for the small business
<siretart> g
<ajmitch> tight integration needed though
<ajmitch> like DNS, mail, etc
<ajmitch> getting to the 'just works' stage of setting up a fully ubuntu network would be wonderful
<siretart> that's not easy
<ajmitch> it's not
<ajmitch> something to work on over a few releases, or as a separate product
<ajmitch> it can be worth it though
<TomaszD> hey guys, since the gnome packages are on a permanent UVFe, will we sooner or later see NM 0.6.3 in dapper-updates? :)
<ajmitch> TomaszD: no
<TomaszD> ajmitch, no? why not.
<ajmitch> or I should say 'very, very very unlikely'
<TomaszD> shame then.
<TomaszD> btw is Firefox 1.5.0.4 going to hit updates? I'm quite concerned with all the security holes it patches...
<ajmitch> because it's not just a simple bugfix
<ajmitch> 1.5.0.4 will be
<TomaszD> ok
<ajmitch> mainly because it's near impossible to separate out security from other patches in it
<TomaszD> oh, so that's the point.
<TomaszD> but the gnome packages are being updated regardless what they fix
<TomaszD> no?
<ajmitch> no
<TomaszD> I've seen evince, epiphany and such being updated, none AFAIK were security updated
<TomaszD> oh well
<TomaszD> just being curious
<ajmitch> that's -updates, not -security
<ajmitch> and N-M is not in GNOME anyway
<TomaszD> it's on the GNOME ftp server
<TomaszD> so I thought it is
<ajmitch> so is f-spot
<ajmitch> and 1000 other apps :)
<TomaszD> good point
<TomaszD> :)
<ajmitch> GNOME is only getting 2.14.x updates anyway
<ajmitch> and that was planned out carefully before release
<TomaszD> and that is a good thing, since you can satisfy the bleeding edgers for a slight moment
<TomaszD> ;)
<ajmitch> ubuntu's N-M carries a few patches that would have to be carefully tested & ported forward if necessary
<dholbach> good morning motu world
<ajmitch> hey dholbach
<ajmitch> how are you?
<dholbach> hey ajmitch, fine -- how are you?
<ajmitch> good :)
<dholbach> cool
<phanatic> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hey phanatic
<crimsun_> mm edgy breakage!
<ajmitch> yay!
* ajmitch just loves the warm fuzzy feeling of breakage
* siretart hopes for new radeon and kernel in edgy...
* DarkMageZ hopes for new dosbox
* ajmitch has new kernel built from git, but no new l-r-m
* TomaszD also hopes for a working radeon driver at that matter
<siretart> DarkMageZ: should be autosync'ed soon
<ajmitch> DarkMageZ: that'll come later, once syncs/merges are underway
<ajmitch> it's unmodified in dapper, so should be autosynced
<DarkMageZ> syncing with debian... they need to upgrade
<ajmitch> then hassle debian :)
<DarkMageZ> or i should learn how to package properly, and become the ubuntu maintainer, so we can have 0.65 :)
<ajmitch> we prefer not to get ahead unnecessarily, since we have to then take the bugs in the face...
<ajmitch> morning \sh
<DarkMageZ> my main wish is that they fix bug #30447
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 30447 in xserver-xorg-driver-ati "Lockup problems with both the free xorg ATI driver and the proprietary fglrx driver, using various ATI cards" [High,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/30447
<siretart> hey \sh
<\sh> moins
* ajmitch wonders if he can quickly setup nfsv4 to mount on login 
<ajmitch> hey pygi
<pygi> hey ajmitch
<Toadstool> hi motus
<xerxas> Hi
<xerxas> I cannot connect to a wpa secured access point with network-manager but can with wpa_supplicant
<xerxas> what should I do ?
<xerxas> report a bug ?
<\sh> xerxas: network manager is using wpa_supplicant as far as I can see...which release are you using?
<xerxas> dapper
<pygi> that would probably be 0.6.2
<xerxas> \sh: I'm at work right now , I don't have my ubuntu here
<xerxas> I need to trace the problem
<pygi> xerxas, you must have wpa_supplicating to connect to wpa secured access point with network manager :P
<xerxas> but I wanted to know if this is usefull
<xerxas> pygi: Yes I know
<xerxas> I think it's a problem with wpa_supplicant integration within network-manager:
<xerxas> I have an ipw2100
<xerxas> wpa_supplicant doesn't want to associate with the access point with -Dipw
<pygi> ipw2100 works perfectly for most people
<pygi> xerxas, anyway, this is not the right channel
<xerxas> I need to use -Dwext
<pygi> go to #ubuntu, and if they cant help you fix it, file a bug
<xerxas> I think network-manager wants to use -Diwp
<xerxas> ipw
<xerxas> pygi: I managed to fix it (not in network-manager but manually )
<xerxas> pygi: I think I can fix it with network-manager scripts
<xerxas> but I didn't investigated yet
<xerxas> pygi: should I report that as a bug ?
<pygi> xerxas, do as you want...if it's not a bug, we'll drop it :P
<xerxas> (need to gather more information before , and will try to fix it )
<xerxas> pygi: seems to be a bug
<xerxas> or a configuration problem
<xerxas> the thing is , breezy have older drivers, ipw2100 switched to wireless extension with newer kernel
<xerxas> network-manager needs to follow the switch
<xerxas> when will edgy developpement start ?
<xerxas> I don't think I will report this bug as a dapper one
<kelmo> gday ;-)
<pianoboy3333> I seem to be having interesting problems with dpkg, can someone look at this: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=1114386
<ajmitch> file a bug on dpkg against it
<ajmitch> hm
<ajmitch> looks like there is one
<ajmitch> bug 46530
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 46530 in blt "process_queue: Assertion `dependtry <= 4' failed." [Medium,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/46530
<pianoboy3333> oh
<pianoboy3333> good
<pianoboy3333> ajmitch: it also says if you read that code thing there, that I have one package that is not fully installed or removed, how can I find that one?
<ajmitch> dpkg --configure -a
<ajmitch> still gives you that error, I see
<pianoboy3333> yes
<ajmitch> great..
<pianoboy3333> :)
* ajmitch confesses no knowledges whatsoever of dpkg internals
<pianoboy3333> :)
<zul> hey
<phanatic> afternoon
<Hobbsee> hey phanatic
<phanatic> heya Hobbsee :)
<havoc> hmm, morning here
<havoc> and I still don't have ubuntu installed :|
<Hobbsee> almost midnight here
<havoc> (still backing stuff up)
<havoc> was closer to 80GB than 58GB, and I ran out of room :(
<Kyral> Morning MOTU
<phanatic> hi Kyral
<phanatic> Kyral: no freebsd now? :)
<phanatic> hey dholbach
<Kyral> phanatic: the machine is still running but I'm not logged in
<phanatic> Kyral: oh, i see...
<Kyral> FreeBSD == spare lab machine
<Kyral> as is the Hurd machine I have going :D
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Gloubiboulga> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hi Gloubiboulga
<phanatic> heya bddebian, Gloubiboulga :)
<Gloubiboulga> hi phanatic
<bddebian> Heya phanatic
<Toadstool> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi Toadstool
<Toadstool> ping a revu admin... siretart or ajmitch maybe?
<cbx33> ping ajmitch
<cbx33> ping Mithrandir
<havoc> yay, can finally start the install
<Hobbsee> cbx33: he's probably asleep by now
<cbx33> ah ok
<cbx33> thanks Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> it's gone 2am there now
<phanatic> hey raphink
<raphink> hey phanatic
<raphink> I wanted to talk to you lately
<raphink> some infos you might be interested in
<phanatic> raphink: great, just pm me :)
<pygi> raphink, the conference stuff? :P
<raphink> yes
<raphink> there's a low cost company from Nice to Budapest
<pygi> raphink, ah
<raphink> might be interesting
<pygi> how much $?
<pygi> and how much was it before?
<phanatic> pygi: gone to pm, i'll tell you the details ;)
<pygi> phanatic, #conf-hu is nice :)
<havoc> yay, ubuntu installed, now to move back all my data :|
<jabra> I needs docs on building a ubuntu mirror
<imbrandon> jabra: one sec
<imbrandon> jabra: a full mirror or just a personal mirror for your arch ?
* imbrandon moves away from Hobbsee's Pitchfork
* HobbseePitchfork waves her pitchfork threateningly at imbrandon 
<imbrandon> lol
<Toadstool> ping raphink
<raphink> pong Toadstool
<Toadstool> raphink: hi, you're a revu admin, aren't you?
<raphink> sure
<Toadstool> if you have time could you change the email adress I use to log in REVU?
<raphink> no I can't do that
<raphink> the account is linked to the email
<Toadstool> :(
<raphink> I would have to recreate a new account
<raphink> which is not easy, since accounts are created automatically using the address you first use to upload
<raphink> why do you need to change this?
<Toadstool> 'cause I want to use my @ubuntu.com now
<raphink> you can use it to sign your packages
<raphink> if you add it to your key
<Toadstool> already did that
<raphink> you don't need to change your REVU account
<raphink> then just sign your packages with it now, and upload
<raphink> that'll do
<Toadstool> ah yes, sorry I tried to login before my upload to test
<Toadstool> now it works
<raphink> ;)
<Toadstool> thanks anyway :)
<raphink> good
<raphink> np
<Toadstool> heh lintian on revu doesn't like edgy in the changelog and 3.7.2 standars version :)
<Toadstool> standards even
<\sh> Toadstool: nobody upgraded to edgy now...and I think we need to wait after the weekend...
<Toadstool> great breakage ongoing? :)
<\sh> what do you expect
<\sh> but we have soccer world chanmpionships as well
<ogra> how's that related ?
<\sh> so everybody in germany is sitting in front of the computer, except ogra and me
<tritium> \sh: you mean TV?  ;)
<\sh> s/computer/tv/
<\sh> yes
<hub> hey \sh
<HobbseePitchfork> tv?  what's that?
<Toadstool> \sh: i'm sitting in front of my computer but we have the tv on the lan ;)
<\sh> trying to fix my 8tb radi6 array
<bddebian> Heya tritium
<tritium> hey bddebian
<jabra> imbrandon: actually wondering I I can use debian testing as a apt-proxy for dapper
<\sh> ogra: will you watch the soccer match in 20 minutes?
<LaserJock> hi tritium and bddebian
<tritium> hi LaserJock
<ogra> \sh, i didnt even know there is one in 20 mins ...
<ogra> and no, i'll watch anything but soccer
<LaserJock> jabra: testing? are we that out of date?
<\sh> ogra: today is the beginning of the soccer worldcup...and we are waiting for the masses to go home to a free highway
<jabra> the server is debian testing
<jabra> and I wanta setup a server with dapper and use debian as the proxy
<Hobbsee> smart idea.  *mutters at traffic again*
<jabra> wondering if that can work
<LaserJock> oh
<jabra> LaserJock: side note, working on packaging nmap::parser for debian. If I get it accepted we can get it into ubuntu or will it need to be repackaged?
<jabra> www.ccs.neu.edu/home/jabra/debian
<LaserJock> if it goes into unstable then it will be synced into Edgy
<LaserJock> if it is there before we stop the automatic syncing
<jabra> k and if I want it in dapper I will need to repackage it
<ogra> if you want it in dapper it frost needs to enter edgy
<ogra> *first
<LaserJock> well, it can't go into dapper proper, I don't think
<imbrandon> no new packages will get into dapper propper
<jabra> universe ?
<LaserJock> ogra: can we backport NEW packages?
<ogra> then you can ask for a backport if it can be backported without big changes to the source
<jabra> k
<jabra> when it gets accepted I will bring it up again
<LaserJock> or is nmap::parser not NEW new?
<ogra> LaserJock, i think so, if they dont have weird dependencys and build out of the box
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> I still think we need a backports policy spelled out on a wiki page or something
<jabra> feel free to take a look at what I have done already
<imbrandon> jabra: and if your on debian testing and want to setup an apt mirror for dapper the *easiest* way is to use apt-mirror.sf.net but thats not the official way
<tseng> it was spelled out in a meeting
<imbrandon> LaserJock: agreed
<LaserJock> tseng: kinda
<jabra> imbrandon: ok
<imbrandon> tseng: kinda but not totaly and not everyone go's to the meeting , leaste not every meeting
<LaserJock> it still wasn't terribly clear to me (maybe it was just me) as indicated by my NEW question
<tseng> thats why meetings are logged
<tseng> and posted to an ml
<LaserJock> it sounded like siretart was going to write up a backports howto on the wiki so that should make it better for sure
<imbrandon> true tseng but still , if i was looking for that information i wouldent know what meeting and such
<tseng> if you were a backporter at the time
<tseng> you would have known
<jabra> sorry for the confusion i'm talking about apt-proxy
<tseng> and would have hopefulyl passed that info on
<imbrandon> ;)
<tseng> apperantly not the case
<Hobbsee> night all
<jabra> imbrandon: ^
<tseng> bye Hobbsee
<LaserJock> cya Hobbsee
<tseng> i hope writing a "howto" on backporting doesnt attract the same kind of "help" as last time
<imbrandon> gnight hobbie
<LaserJock> tseng: last time?
<Hobbsee> trrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
<Hobbsee> oops
<tseng> LaserJock: rules need to be followed
<Hobbsee> keyboards dont actually make too bad a pillow...
<imbrandon> lol
<Hobbsee> hmmm...interesting
<LaserJock> tseng: yeah, hence siretart writing down the rules is a good thing, no?
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<imbrandon> tseng: last time? and i dont think that would be a problem as long as not just anyone is given -backports upload access as it is now and the "rules" spelled out on the wiki
<tseng> LaserJock: only if people dont ignore them
<bddebian> Oh and imbrandon and tseng
<LaserJock> tseng: better than nothing, I would think
<imbrandon> heya bddebian
<imbrandon> yea rules are kinda hard to follow if they are hard to get at and read
<siretart> LaserJock: aaargl. thanks for the reminder. will do that now
<imbrandon> tseng: i see your point but i dont think the wiki is a bad idea
<tseng> people happily "backport" things into their personal web space and attract a large number of users very quickly
<tseng> currently
<tseng> most people who learn packaging go through MOTU channels here
<tseng> and learn things right
<tseng> a backport quickstart lets people get up to speed quickly
<tseng> w/o understanding hows, whys and why not
<LaserJock> tseng: no, not a HOWTO in the packaging sense, a HOWTO as in what are the rules and what is backportable and who is able to upload
<tseng> I see.
<imbrandon> LaserJock: +1
<imbrandon> yea
<tseng> ok.
<imbrandon> more a "rules" thing not ness a howto package
<imbrandon> there are tons of doc's on packaging already etc
<imbrandon> the correct way
<tseng> sorry to make a fuss, alot of people have done alot of f$%#^ up things
<tseng> and i dont want anything to encourage it
<imbrandon> tseng: true ;)
<LaserJock> hehe, nooo ;-)
<LaserJock> I'm actually thinking about cleaning up most of all the packaging related wiki pages and having us refer to the Packaging Guide instead
<tseng> that would be nice
<imbrandon> LaserJock: good idea
<tseng> you know what would be really nice?
<tseng> a properly formatted, tested LiveCDCustomizationHowto
* bddebian doesn't comment on the grounds that he may incriminate himself :-)
<LaserJock> yes, oh please yes
<imbrandon> YES !!!!!!!!!!
<imbrandon> lol
<bmonty> LaserJock: we'll probably need to add bzr info as well
<tseng> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LiveCDCustomizationHowTo
<tseng> this doc hasnt weathered that well
<imbrandon> tseng: i've been trying to figure that out myself , not as simple as a knoppix remaster, but it should be IMO
<tseng> and you are starting to have multiple versions
<tseng> i remastered breezy
<tseng> not yet for dapper
<LaserJock> bmonty: in the packaging guide?
<bmonty> LaserJock: yes, since we can now store package source in bzr archives
<imbrandon> LaserJock: seeing as *buntu projects use bzr alot i would say so
<LaserJock> bmonty: yeah, i'll add that to the list
<tseng> http://www.atworkonline.it/~bibe/ubuntu/custom-livecd.htm
<tseng> this is actually pretty good
<tseng> besides being ugly
<LaserJock> guys, btw. If you want to see something in the Edgy version of the Packaging Guide just put it on wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuPackagingGuide, please, pretty please :-)
<imbrandon> could probbly be adapted and put into the currect wiki page couldent it ?
<tseng> i always feel bad about wiping out an existing wiki page with dozens of contributions
* imbrandon would like to see a -motu metapackage for things like devscripts debhelper bzr etc
<tseng> and tacking onto it is worse
<tseng> can you guys throw it in yelp?
<tseng> or docs.ubuntu.com
<imbrandon> yelp ?
* tseng summons jsgostango
<tseng> i spelled that all wrong
<ogra> i'm not sure yelp is really an option for policy docs
<tseng> great i woke ogra
* tseng hides
<bddebian> Uh oh :-)
<ogra> heh
<imbrandon> hehe
<ogra> asnt there a post to -devel some time ago advertising a CD build tool ?
<ogra> +w
<imbrandon> orga yea
<LaserJock> tseng: wait, what do you want? I'm on the doc team too
* imbrandon changes topic to informal doc team dissussion .... lol just kiddin
<LaserJock> lol
<LaserJock> or and EC meeting, I think we might have almost a quorum
<LaserJock> ;-)
<imbrandon> heh
<tseng> LaserJock: http://www.atworkonline.it/~bibe/ubuntu/custom-livecd.htm
<tseng> LaserJock: that doc, officialized
<tseng> doesnt matter to me
<tseng> i can read it there
<imbrandon> ^^ and maybe that tool added also that was discussed in -devel
<LaserJock> hmm
<imbrandon> the current page is dated ( on the wiki )
<LaserJock> well, once the wiki move is over we can sort of lock up some of the good wiki pages
<imbrandon> but would be a shame to wipe it
<Yagisan> G'day all. any non-nvidia users here ?
<bddebian> Heya Yagisan
<imbrandon> 'ello Yagisan
<LaserJock> tseng:  that would be one page that I'd like to see updated, cleaned up, and frozen for general editing
<imbrandon> ok i got to get back to work, bbaib
<Yagisan> Any non-nvidia users (or nvidia older then geforce4), could you dcc or email me the output from 'glxinfo -l > opengl_info.txt'
<tseng> what wiki move?
<tseng> Yagisan: woo ssp
<Yagisan> how are things going bddebian and imbrandon
<tseng> imbrandontoo
<bddebian> Yagisan: OK I guess, thanks.  Yourself?
<Yagisan> tseng:  where ?
<tseng> Yagisan: will be in edgy
<tseng> for a few things
<LaserJock> tseng: all of the documentation wiki pages ( CategoryDocumentation) are being moved to help.ubuntu.com
<tseng> LaserJock: cool.
<Yagisan> bddebian: ok. see my saga re my daughter and the lift doors in #edubuntu ?
<LaserJock> so that wiki.ubuntu.com will just be for specs and other development
<tseng> can anyone edit help?
<tseng> or they have to proove sanity
<Yagisan> tseng: only some apps ?
<LaserJock> ideally, all documentation will be on help.ubuntu.com (shipped docs and wiki, etc.)
<tseng> Yagisan: yes?
<tseng> Yagisan: in paralel there will be an i386-ssp
<imbrandon> Yagisan: http://www.buntudot.org/people/~imbrandon/misc/opengl_info.txt
<Spec> LaserJock: when's that happening?
<tseng> Yagisan: where the whole archive is tested
<Spec> LaserJock: everyone's links to wiki.ubuntu.com will break... :-/
<tseng> for buildability
<LaserJock> tseng: everyone will be able to rw except for a few critical docs that only the wiki team will have rw. only the wiki team will be able to delete
<LaserJock> Spec: no, links will be preserved
<Yagisan> tseng: hmm. I'd rather all by default myself - but considering even I broke a few apps that understandable. amd64 ?
<imbrandon> Yagisan: is that what you wanted ?
<Spec> oh, okay
<tseng> Yagisan: that isnt sane imo
<tseng> Yagisan: talk to pitti if you feel strongly otherwise
* imbrandon has a Intel 845 Video
<Yagisan> imbrandon: thank you
<imbrandon> np
<LaserJock> Spec: for now there will be redirects at wiki.u.c so that google searches, etc. are intact
<Yagisan> tseng: not sane ? overhead was minimal on many apps that I did test with. BTW, did I miss the announcement ?
<tseng> what announcement
<Yagisan> tseng: about ssp
<imbrandon> announcement ?
<tseng> it is a spec
<tseng> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+spec/gcc-ssp
<tseng> a plan for possible development in edgy..
<tseng> please ignore the roadmap its been made useless
<tseng> by certain people
<imbrandon> thats where gcc take advantage of nx on amd64 ?
<tseng> no
<imbrandon> ahh umm ok
<tseng> nx has nothing to do with ssp
* imbrandon would like to see that
<Yagisan> imbrandon: it tries to prevent buffer overflows in certain types of code
<tseng> PT_GNU_STACK emmitted by gcc controlls NX
<tseng> and is in the default gcc
<tseng> ubuntu binaries are already marked
<tseng> but no one is auditing the results for correctness
<LaserJock> hmm, backporting would also be a good topic for the Ubuntu Developer's Reference, no?
<imbrandon> ahh good wasent sure about that, i just got my amd64 a few days ago and JUST now getting it all setup for dev let alone taking advantage of any of it
<imbrandon> LaserJock: at leaste a pointer to the backporting doc's yes
<imbrandon> like in an appendex ofr something
<LaserJock> imbrandon: well, I prefer to make the wiki docs obsolete ;-)
<imbrandon> well what i mean is maybe make the backporting section a appendex not part of the main doc but avaible
<LaserJock> ah, yeah. that could be
<LaserJock> the debian version has some similar material, regarding different components, etc.
<imbrandon> right
<imbrandon> i come from an rpm world to ubuntu but i've looked at the debian maint guide , packaging etc etc etc as kinda an insite into "the ubuntu way"
<imbrandon> infact i still have an old suse box here i keep arround just to package rpm's when the rare case arrives, guess i could setup a suse chroot later and rid that box of suse ;)
<imbrandon> tseng: how hard would it be to setup a local debian/ubuntu build server to enable ssp by default ?
<tseng> imbrandon: Yagisan has done something similar
<tseng> but the plan is to do it on the main builders
<imbrandon> right right , i was just thinking out loud ;)
<tseng> you want sbuild
<tseng> + sauce
* Yagisan went for pbuilder + tmpfs + raid 0
<Yagisan> I've temporally stopped my ssp setup, simply because debians current gcc-4.1 FTBFS in pbuilder, yet the debian autobuilders build it
<imbrandon> hrm next question the box i would use to make the local build server would be an i386 ( amd1800+ ) could i have it build amd64 debs automaticly , as the test box would be a amd64
<imbrandon> Yagisan: ouch
<imbrandon> dchroot -c edgy -d
<imbrandon> grr whoops
<bddebian> heh
<tseng> dchroot++
<LaserJock> can you make non-debian based chroots?
<tseng> it will be a few weeks before edgy is really in full gear
<tseng> LaserJock: of course
<imbrandon> tseng: yea
<imbrandon> LaserJock: yea
<tseng> LaserJock: but not with debootstrap obviously
<tseng> in gentoo you untar the base and build up, rpm has a debootstrap kind of thing
<imbrandon> tseng: yeea edgy isnt ready but i got my chroot al setup and waiting for goodness ;)
<tseng> i have one too
<imbrandon> i have a clean dapper chroot and a edgy one, thinking of doing a suse one later today so i can wipe that old suse box and just use chroot to build rpm's
<imbrandon> and use the hardware to build a local build server
<tseng> haha suse
<imbrandon> heh
* Yagisan has 6 chroots and counting
* imbrandon has 2 
<tseng> < 3
<imbrandon> dapper clean and edgy
<tseng> while we are counting
<LaserJock> do you think it would be possible to make an Ubuntu chroot in OSX?
<imbrandon> i dont like building on my main dapper becouse i have kde3.5.3 etc , its not a clean dapper
<tseng> LaserJock: probably
<imbrandon> LaserJock: possible but i think *bsd its called a jail or something
<tseng> if fink has enough to run debootstrap
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> that would totally rock my world
<imbrandon> you could probbly do it without debootstrap too but it would not be easy
<LaserJock> well, they don't have a debootstrap
<thierryn> how do I get access to my username@ubuntu.com e-mail adress?
<imbrandon> LaserJock: as OSX is more BSDish i would look at bsdchroots but honestly i have no idea, i've booted into osx like a whole 3 times ;)
<LaserJock> access? it is forwarded to the LP preferred address
<imbrandon> thierryn: its a forward to your lp addy
<LaserJock> I know I can build a OSX chroot from within  OSX, but that's no good. I want Ubuntu dang it :-)
<thierryn> ha ok thanks!
<Mithrandir> LaserJock: no, you can't.  The OSX kernel can't run linux binaries.
<imbrandon> LaserJock: look at the info for building a osx chroot and adapt it for *buntu it probbly isnt much diffrent
<imbrandon> ahhh ok Mithrandir
<LaserJock> Mithrandir: hmmm, :(
<imbrandon> Mithrandir: what does it run BSD compiled X or something ?
<imbrandon> ( for the xserever )
<Mithrandir> imbrandon: more or less, yes.
* LaserJock just goes back to his ssh
<imbrandon> ahh
* imbrandon is suprised darwin dosent run elf bins as bsd does
<Mithrandir> imbrandon: it's compiled for darwin and uses the gui bindings in MOSX.
<imbrandon> ahhh , makes sense
<LaserJock> I sooo wish the intel macs had come out a week later
<imbrandon> so in a chroot the host os has to be able to run the chroot kernel ?
<Mithrandir> imbrandon: it's just one kernel.
<imbrandon> err that made no sense nm
<imbrandon> yea i thought about that after i said it
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> some reason i was thinking vm like xen etc
<LaserJock> I've got parallel's virtualization going, but it isn't the same
<imbrandon> LaserJock: running ppc mac ?
<LaserJock> no, intel, hence all the problem
<siretart> how to forward/redirect in Moin?
<imbrandon> ;)
<LaserJock> if it was a ppc, I'd just slap on Ubuntu np
<imbrandon> bootcamp ubuntu
<tseng> does og maciel irc
<LaserJock> siretart: #REDIRECT NewPage
<LaserJock> tseng: I thought so, but I can't remember the nick
<LaserJock> imbrandon: I think you can only bootcamp Windows XP
<LaserJock> or just Windows
<imbrandon> LaserJock: i've seen ppl on the net use it for linux. but i could be wrong as i dont ahve a mac to test it ;)
<imbrandon> bootcamp suposidly just emulates an old bios windows and chainloads it
<LaserJock> hmm, I thought it was specific to Windows (I wouldn't put it bast Apple)
<siretart> please proofread https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BackportsHowto
<LaserJock> ohhh, I found a "Gentoo in OSX chroot " HowTO
<LaserJock> ack, can you downgrade libc6 on dapper to the breezy version without breaking everything?
<imbrandon> doubtfull
<bddebian> Extremely doubtfull :-)
<LaserJock> ok, I'm trying to help somebody that is trying to do just that
<imbrandon> ouch, why ?
<LaserJock> I'm not sure
<LaserJock> they compiled something on breezy
<LaserJock> but it doesn't want to compile on dapper
<LaserJock> so they are trying to install the breezy .deb
<imbrandon> breezy chroot to run it ;)
<LaserJock> with some --overwrite action :(
<imbrandon> sounds like it will be a broken system
<imbrandon> in the end ;)
<LaserJock> oh my gosh, he tried to do like all of breezy's build-essential+deps
<imbrandon> heh
<Yagisan> LaserJock: what app ?
<imbrandon> looks like he gets to backup /home and start over
<thierryn> how do I get acess to my ubuntu/member/your_nick hostname
<imbrandon> thierryn: ping Seveas
<LaserJock> NS2
<Seveas> thierryn, what's your LP id?
<thierryn> thierryn
<LaserJock> network simulator 2 I guess
<Seveas> thierryn, could you send me a reminder mail (dennis@ubuntu.com), have to go in a few minutes
<thierryn> k I'll do that
<thierryn> sent
<Yagisan> night all
<bddebian> Gnight Yagisan
<imbrandon> gnight Yagisan
<LaserJock> anybody heard of network simulator 2
<zul> is it a game? :)
<LaserJock> no, a network simulator ;-)
<cbx33> LaserJock, oooh I was looking for one of those a while back
<LaserJock> siretart: do we want the community at large requesting backports via archive-team?
<siretart> LaserJock: no. community shall first ask ubuntu-backporters for investigating the issue
<siretart> LaserJock: ubuntu-archive only if ubuntu-backporters have confirmed the package to be ready to be backported
<LaserJock> siretart: then maybe you should change the "Howto request a package to be backported" to be a little less generic ;-)
<LaserJock> I think that could be hit a lot by searches
<LaserJock> oh wait, I guess you do say to subscribe ubuntu-backporters. is that sufficent?
<siretart> LaserJock: yes, they should subscribe ubuntu-backporters, but not ubuntu-archive
<LaserJock> hmm, maybe just put that explicitly under the howto request section
<LaserJock> I think the archive team might not like getting random backporting requests
<siretart> right
<LaserJock> ah, and I see jdong has a sticky on the forums that says to use the backports LP
<siretart> yes, I've mailed him yesterday about this
<siretart> LaserJock: please reread
<LaserJock> hehe, much better ;-)
<LaserJock> do you want to put anything on how to contribute or join the backports team?
<siretart> LaserJock: well, it involves doing some work, and contacting existing members of the backport team. I think thats rather obvious, no?
<LaserJock> I suppose
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  ajmitch helped me get the thing working, I've got a signed .dsc and .changes
<bluefoxicy> wtf do I do now.  :)
<bluefoxicy> oh and I've hacked the /etc file in that wiki entry.
<LaserJock> if it looks good
<LaserJock> put it on REVU
<bluefoxicy> http://bluefox.kicks-ass.org/stuff/bluefox/pax-utils/  It looks like that, but I don't know how to use the tools to put it on revu.
<bluefoxicy> were there instructions?
<bluefoxicy> it's dput something isn't it
<bluefoxicy> brb making a shirly temple
<LaserJock> bluefoxicy: wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU
<bluefoxicy> ah
* bluefoxicy had to read into it a bit, the specifics are hidden in a paragraph instead of put in a code block
<LaserJock> yes
<bluefoxicy> done.
<bluefoxicy> well
<bluefoxicy> that was certainly educational.
<zul> cd /etc/courier
<zul> damn it
<LaserJock> bluefoxicy: hmm, did you use debuild -S -sa ? specifically the -sa part when building the source package
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  noticing there's no .asc, just a signed .dsc?
<bluefoxicy> I had to use debsign
<LaserJock> weird
<LaserJock> no, I don't see a .orig.tar.gz
<bluefoxicy> dpkg-buildpackage would build and sign the source package but not the binary
<LaserJock> well, we don't care about the binary
<bluefoxicy> and debuild would build a binary and not sign anything
<bluefoxicy> it asked me for a password and then said GPG cried
<bluefoxicy> oh yeah I noticed that
<bluefoxicy> it didn't upload the .orig
<bluefoxicy> -rw-r--r-- 1 bluefox bluefox 61280 2006-06-09 00:47 pax-utils_0.1.13.orig.tar.gz
<LaserJock> make sure you us -sa and then dput the _source.changes file
<bluefoxicy> -rw-r--r-- 1 bluefox bluefox  1499 2006-06-09 01:53 pax-utils_0.1.13_i386.changes
<bluefoxicy> that's what I dput
<LaserJock> no
* bluefoxicy debuilds again.
<LaserJock> don't do that one
<bluefoxicy> I don't have another .changes.
<bddebian> Debuild .dsc files not .changes
<LaserJock> and rm the .upload or use dput -f to override your previous upload
<bddebian> oh, nm
* bddebian erases :-)
<LaserJock> to late, it's in the logs bddebian
<bddebian> doh
<bluefoxicy> gpg: problem with the agent - disabling agent use
<bluefoxicy> debsign: gpg error occurred!  Aborting....
<bluefoxicy> debuild: fatal error at line 791:
<bluefoxicy> running debsign failed
<bluefoxicy> debuild does this.
<LaserJock> debuild -S -sa does?
<bluefoxicy> debuild -S -sa yes.
<LaserJock> ok, try using -k<keyid>
* bluefoxicy copies the keyid from the line 2 lines above that
<bluefoxicy> still failed.
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  it's finding the right key, debuild just can't make gpg work.
<LaserJock> then, that's a problem :-)
<bluefoxicy> dpkg-buildpackage can do it, so can debsign
<zul> your gpg key has to match the debian/changelog
<bluefoxicy> debuild has gpg cry that it can't find an agent
<bluefoxicy> zul:  it does.
<zul> i ran into the same problem before
<LaserJock> zul not with -k
<bluefoxicy> You need a passphrase to unlock the secret key for
<bluefoxicy> user: "John Moser (New key generated Feb 24) <john.r.moser@gmail.com>"
<bluefoxicy> 4096-bit RSA key, ID 07093105, created 2006-02-24
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  is there another way to do it?
<LaserJock> ok, so if you do dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa -rfakeroot it works? or no
<bluefoxicy> that works.
<LaserJock> fine, use that then
<LaserJock> I'm not sure why debuild would have a problem
<bluefoxicy> Uploading via ftp pax-utils_0.1.13.dsc: Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of pax-utils_0.1.13.dsc
<LaserJock> ack, we've been getting those a lot lately
<bluefoxicy> will hammering it over and over until it behaves work or will that just create unnecessary log bloat on the server
<siretart> bluefoxicy: try options '-uc -us'
<JohnnyMast> how do you get the line number with vi ?
<bluefoxicy> :
<bluefoxicy> hmm.  I don't know.  XD
<jabra> so anyone know if apt-proxy on debian testing can work as a apt-policy for dapper
<bluefoxicy> siretart:  I can't upload to revu with -uc -us
<jabra> wondering if the source.list on the debian testing machine would need to have entries for debian and ubuntu to pull the packages
<bddebian> No because it would be unsinged
<siretart> bluefoxicy: use 'debsign *.changes' to sign your upload
<bluefoxicy> it's already signed.
<bluefoxicy> it just won't upload.
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  what do I do?
<LaserJock> dude, use debsign on *.changes like siretart said and re dput
<bluefoxicy> bluefox@icebox:/tmp/x/pax-utils$ cat pax-utils_0.1.13_source.changes |grep SIGNATURE
<bluefoxicy> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
<bluefoxicy> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  it's ALREADY signed.
<bluefoxicy> do I have to sign it again?
<LaserJock> ni
<LaserJock> no
<jabra> wondering if the source.list on the debian testing machine would need to have entries for debian and ubuntu to pull the packages
<bluefoxicy> dput says my signature is good too btw.
* bluefoxicy tries to kill it from the server.
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  I think I may have to dcut the stuff off the server.  >/
<LaserJock> hmm, I don't know if you can do that
<bluefoxicy> Neither do I.
* bluefoxicy tries again.
<LaserJock> siretart: do you know what to do? I've seen this 3 times so far
<bluefoxicy> Uploading via ftp pax-utils_0.1.13.dsc: Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of pax-utils_0.1.13.dsc
<bluefoxicy> Note: This problem might be caused by files already existent on the server.
<bluefoxicy>       For the official Debian upload queues, the dcut(1) utility can be used
<bluefoxicy>       to remove stale files from unsuccessful uploads.
* siretart just cleared the incoming queue, retry uploading
<bluefoxicy> siretart:  I just adjusted it to use libcap too, should I add a -1 and add a section to the changelog and reupload that?
<bluefoxicy> or does it not matter at this stage
* bluefoxicy assumes it dooesn't matter.
<bluefoxicy> YAY!
<LaserJock> \o/ I see it in incoming
<LaserJock> bluefoxicy: it's on review, now you just have to clean it up :-)
<tkteo> Hi Laserjock, this is tkteo from TeX Live and debian-tetex-maint lists
<LaserJock> tkteo!!!
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  it's got proper depends and proper build deps.. I think.. cdbs depends on debhelper, which depends on build-essentials, right?
<bluefoxicy> and of course it has libcap-dev
<LaserJock> something like that
<LaserJock> but you versioning is wrong
<bluefoxicy> why didn't you tell me that before
<LaserJock> bluefoxicy: well, i'm sure there are other issues
<LaserJock> but first you have to get a package up where people can see it
<bluefoxicy> what's wrong with my versioning at any rate?
<LaserJock> bluefoxicy: I'll give you three guesses :-)
<bluefoxicy> I don't have a -1
<LaserJock> an 0ubuntu1 for a package that isn't in Debian yet
<bluefoxicy> pax-utils (0.1.13-0ubuntu1) stable; urgency=low
<LaserJock> not stable
<LaserJock> stable is a Debian repo
<bluefoxicy> then?
<bluefoxicy> oh
<bluefoxicy> universe.
<LaserJock> you probably want edgy or dapper
<bddebian> No, dapper or edgy :-)
<zul> most likely edgy
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  no chance of getting it in dapper universe ;)  so edgy
<LaserJock> edgy's kinda weird since it really hasn't opened yet, but that is what it is heading for
<LaserJock> tkteo: did you see my pm?
<tkteo> yes, I just noticed it, not used to the multiple windows on irc cos I have not irced in years
<LaserJock> hehe
<tseng> bluefoxicy: why would you randomly start uploading things
<tseng> you need to be in the keyring
<tseng> ie, approved uploader
<LaserJock> tkteo: is you nick registered on freenode?
<bluefoxicy> nice to see you too, tseng.
<LaserJock> tseng: I thought he was?
<tseng> the pleasure is all mine
<tseng> LaserJock: oh no.
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  what are you up to these days btw?
<tseng> I work at a major financial company in the networking group
<tkteo> I doubt my nick is registered; I never even heard of registering a nick
<tseng> [notice(NickServ:NickServ@services.)]  The nickname [tkteo]  is not registered
<tseng> there you have it
<LaserJock> tkteo: ok, join #ubuntu-science then so we don't add to the noise ;-)
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  I mean in ubuntu.
<tseng> beagle, muine, whatever
<bluefoxicy> ah
<NthDegree> is edgy ready for testing?
<zul> a bit eager arent we?
<tkteo> laserjock: I have now joined #ubuntu-science
<bddebian> w00t
<bddebian> :-)
<NthDegree> well IMO kubuntu is still a little messed up on dapper
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  besides Yagisan and pitti, is there anyone else I should ask to try and build a niche team similar to -hardened in Ubuntu? (yes I'm aware you're not so hot on the idea)
<tseng> pitti (or me) arent very interested in niche
<tseng> you can carefully add features to the main distro
<tseng> in our estimation
<zul> NthDegree: developers are still working on the toolchain and it isnt even usuable yet
<NthDegree> oh ok :)
<NthDegree> is kde 3.5.3 ready for kubuntu?
<zul> you might want to try #kubuntu-devel
<NthDegree> :| didn't know they had one
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  gentoo has a team that basically polices textrels, W|X mappings, trampolines, etc along with all the other stuff... I really want something like that over here.  But I still don't even know half the stuff you guys were doing, much less understand it all.
<tseng> "you guys" = hardened gentoo?
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  adding things like SSP and PIE and friends are fine, but what do you do when they break things?  Back them off?
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  yes.
<imbrandon> ...
* NthDegree wishes ubuntu had PaX, PIE, SELinux & other protections
<tseng> yes of course you back them off
<tseng> same as filter-flags
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  you have to, at first.  But then what?
<tseng> most of the stuff with problems, historically, has been hard to get fixed upstream
<tseng> they don't understand the issues, or care
<tseng> if you can get them at all
<bluefoxicy> you know I don't want to admit it but you're right.
<tseng> I know you don't
<tseng> but you guys didnt spend a few years doing it
<bluefoxicy> I know what you guys did.  You worked your assess off for no profit.
<tritium> NthDegree: SELinux would be nice, yes, especially for .gov adoption
<tseng> yeah, it pretty much went nowhere
<tseng> pappy is completely out of his mind these days
<bluefoxicy> pappy was always insane XD
<tseng> not like this
<NthDegree> well SELinux is like one of the few things pulling me away from *ubuntu
<bluefoxicy> tseng I haven't seen pappy but I can extrapolate, I watched him get worse and worse as time went on :P
<tseng> NthDegree: we will have to userland mostly in edgy
<tseng> NthDegree: if someone steps up to seriously work on policy
<tseng> NthDegree: are you that someone?
<NthDegree> tseng, well I used to do crazy things with windows policies
<tseng> all of this stuff takes a massive ammount of work
<tseng> and it is still too hard at the end of the day for most people to use
<tritium> wasn't trulux working on that?
<NthDegree> tseng but it's like saying if I hardened down say for example slackware no-one will benefit but me
<tseng> tritium: I will let blue comment on that
<NthDegree> but if i did SELinux for ubuntu then everyone would benefit :)
<bluefoxicy> trulux decided that ubuntu is playing with its dick when security time comes around instead of getting any work done
<bluefoxicy> and ran to Fedora.
<tritium> tseng: ok.  I do seem to remember some "issues" with that
<tseng> trulux is a fanatic imo
<tritium> bluefoxicy: oh, I see
<tseng> and antisocial
<tritium> sorry, I was not aware
<bluefoxicy> He doesn't understand that you need to actually put someone in who wants to reach a goal before the distro in general cares.
<NthDegree> bluefoxicy: I ditched the original ubuntu for that exact reason
<NthDegree> I used to have ubuntu and kubuntu mulitbooted
<NthDegree> but since i've done CentOS (GNOME) , kubuntu (KDE) and slackware (XFCE)
<bluefoxicy> tseng: Personally I feel if we could get collaboration between a hardened team in Ubuntu and hardened-gentoo it would benefit both sides.  There would be a lot of shared effort, and there would be negotiating power from two major distros when it comes to upstream.
<tseng> hardened gentoo is a niche market of a distro most upstreams don't care about
<tseng> unfortunate fact
<NthDegree> that'll be about as difficult as convincing RHEL users that .deb is better :p
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  I do not know how to handle this, however.  It's difficult, I don't understand the politics from all sides, and it's hard to play inside the politics.  Solar goes nuts if you mention selinux, but nobody in ubuntu is going to deploy grsecurity.
<tseng> selinux is maintained by the kernel team
<tseng> and redhat, and nsa, etc
<tseng> grsecurity is maintained by a fanatic nutcase
<tseng> you take a stab at what is maintainable
<tseng> in ubuntu
<NthDegree> http://fedora.redhat.com/About/ < we need the security they have
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  nods.  Last I could tell, hardened and main gentoo were at odds with eachother.  I don't think hardened cares much about the rest of the distro though, since they can fix the problems themselves.
<tseng> NthDegree: what fedora has is better than nothing I agree
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  In Ubuntu, selinux {execmod,execmem,execstack,execheap} will cover pax mprotect() and be disablable or adjustable per-policy.
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  tell solar that and he'll stop talking to you for 6 hours.
<tseng> if i tell solar he will politely disagree
<tseng> he likes me a bit more :)
* NthDegree brb
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  the way I see it I don't care.  Find a broken application, fix it for an selinux policy like that, and it'll work on PaX.
<tseng> controlling pax via selinux assumes that users will use both
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  no, not controlling pax via selinux.
<tseng> which isnt that bad since people can use chpax
<bluefoxicy> <bluefoxicy> tseng:  In Ubuntu, selinux {execmod,execmem,execstack,execheap} will cover pax mprotect() and be disablable or adjustable per-policy.
<bluefoxicy> mimicing PaX using selinux policy.
<tseng> ...
<tseng> i thought you were talking about our integration
<tseng> to controll execstack etc on binaries in selinux policy
<tseng> whatever.
<bluefoxicy> no, I was talking about what RedHat uses
<NthDegree> redhat uses a hell of a lot
<bluefoxicy> Ubuntu isn't going to slap pax in
<NthDegree> they compile with IBMs stack-smash protection
<bluefoxicy> I'm looking for the path of least resistance
<bluefoxicy> NthDegree:  hardened gentoo has done that for ages :P
<tseng> NthDegree: a few things are compiled with ssp
<tseng> last i looked
<tseng> your daemons
<tseng> which we will do in edgy as well
<bluefoxicy> pitti found out that ssp breaks pgs.
<bluefoxicy> why has nobody fixed this yet
<tseng> and hopefulyl have a basic selinux support
<tseng> bluefoxicy: pgs?
<tseng> postgres
<bluefoxicy> I bet it's the same fuck-up in egenix that I found 2 years ago
<bluefoxicy> yes.
<tseng> did he find that out yesterday?
<bluefoxicy> I think yeah.
<NthDegree> I have a better suggestion than SELinux
<tseng> can we make a channel without trulux running in and saying omg you arent doing enough you are all dumbasses
<NthDegree> but it might need adaptation for KDE
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  sure.  Make sure it's registered, make sure you have ops, and +q him.
<tseng> haha
<bluefoxicy> you did it to me all the time
<NthDegree> tseng now isn't that rude of him :p
<tseng> you said certain things back then
<tseng> that were very worthy of a +q
<bluefoxicy> no I just talked too much
<bluefoxicy> about the sky being blue and such.
<bluefoxicy> HOLY SHIT GUYS
<bluefoxicy> A BUG JUST CRAWLED ACROSS MY SCREEN EWW
<NthDegree> lol
<tseng> you were a complete nut :)
<NthDegree> so am I
<NthDegree> We could do with Novell AppArmor
<NthDegree> it's much easier to set policies for
<NthDegree> but it has a few KDE problems right now
<tseng> i really think selinux with a solid policy is the way to go
<tseng> but i am not about to do the work on that front
<tseng> im a non-expert on that front
<NthDegree> tseng no-one will
<tseng> thats positive :)
<NthDegree> we don't need it really with proper chmodding
<tseng> thats misinformed :)
<tseng> #ubuntu-hardened seems to be the place to be
<tseng> rather than put all the motu to sleep
<NthDegree> well if we all sat down and figured out what files could be chmodded then wouldn't that do it
<NthDegree> #ubuntu-hardened :|
<tseng> no
<tseng> it is much more complicated than DAC
<tseng> if DAC was that good no one would have written LSM etc
<lukaswayne9> I'd like to upload a package to the REVU, but I am completely clueless about pgp, gnupg, what must I do to be added to the keyring?  I attatched my public key to an email and I was replied with: please rather upload your key to a public keyserver.  What does this mean and how can I do it?
<LaserJock> lukaswayne9: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GnuPrivacyGuardHowto
<lukaswayne9> Perfect!  Thanks LaserJock
<LaserJock> np
<LaserJock> hmm, maybe I need to start using the bot more
<bddebian> heh
<LaserJock> there are a few things that keep coming up
<bddebian> Later folks
<Knowledge_> Guys, a quick question...
<Knowledge_> I remember I did it when I was using 5.04, but how would I compile my kernel to include the i8k.o file? I remember a really easy way to do it thru some menu of some sort. But I can't find it anymore. (I'm going to try this on Dapper)
<brandon_> OK guys, i was talking to Riddell on another channel about this. i've got a new kplayer deb i've built here and i want to put it in the repos
<brandon_> he said i should ax for an account
<lifeless> ax?
<brandon_> that's slang for ASK
<pygi> ask probably :P
<brandon_> so what do i need to do?
<LaserJock> wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU
<ajmitch> morning
* ajmitch just listened to a lovely head crash
<ajmitch> daily cron jobs are great for that
<LaserJock> head crash?
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> hard drive death
<dholbach> have a nice weekend
<LaserJock> oh, I was thinking of what I do on my headboard when I'm trying to read at night
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> no, the hard drive seems to be totalled now
<LaserJock> that sucks
<ajmitch> a little
<ajmitch> can't even pull any SMART info off it at the moment
<ajmitch> it was showing no new errors not half an hour ago
<bluefoxicy> ajmitch:  Shelf it for a few years.
<ajmitch> how helpful
<bluefoxicy> ajmitch:  the drive in my server is a post-death.  It suffered a fatal head crash 3 years ago.
<tseng> put it in the freezer is more like it
<tseng> it makes the ball bearings contract
<tseng> and it spins more easily
<bluefoxicy> wouldn't even find the drive during bootup
<bluefoxicy> the bios would be like "Primary Master..>" *CLICK CLICK CLICK CLICK*
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  that works?  I thought that would warp the platters a little (they contract too) and cause general fuckery with the small, sensitive components.
<bluefoxicy> I just left mine on top my dresser for like 3 years, and it works now.  *magic*  :)
<tseng> not what i heard
<tseng> my friend does it
<ajmitch> this drive was on its way out awhile ago anyway
<ajmitch> it was only holding old data that was backed up
<ajmitch> everything else is on RAID
<bmonty> ajmitch: how does the SoC project?
<bmonty> s/does/goes
<ajmitch> alright
<bmonty> what are you planning to start working with?
<ajmitch> automating & integrating client configuration :)
<ajmitch> using your python-krb5 lib will come a little later, I think
<ajmitch> first I need to get the packaging side done
<ajmitch> then the tools
<bmonty> ajmitch: I'm using it now to prototype a couple of tools
<ajmitch> ok, what tools?
<bmonty> I've got a clone of klist written in python
<ajmitch> nice
<ajmitch> could be useful
<bmonty> I'm working on a clone of KfW in pygtk
<ajmitch> though I'd have to declare all this as 'not by me' for SoC ;)
<ajmitch> which is fine
<bmonty> mostly I'm concerned that the way python-krb5 is currently written makes sense
<ajmitch> that it's done in a pythonish style?
<bmonty> ajmitch: yes
<ajmitch> hi \sh
<\sh> moins
<ajmitch> ok, gone from just a head crash to a full system lockup
<ajmitch> my day is getting better by the minute
<\sh> I have to kick some xubuntu maintainer ;)
<pygi> \sh: what happened? :P
<sivang> have a nice weekend, motus
<sivang> singing off for now
<pygi> bye sivang ;)
<sivang> laters pygi  :-)
<\sh> I installed today xubuntu-desktop, and it set it as default session in kdm
<pygi> what's wrong with that? they are promoting themselves :)
<\sh> which was heavily wrong, because my default was kde
<hub> who should I contact for shipit
<hub> it looks like a bad UI made me do something wrong
<brandon_> i've made a source tarball and i've got dput configured, but it didn't build a deb.src file, assuming that's what a deb source is
<bmonty> brandon_: try "dpkg-buildpackage -S"
<bmonty> and/or check the packaging guide
<\sh> jani monoses is janimo on irc right?
<Gloubiboulga> \sh, yes
<\sh> oh well, I'll file a bug report :) that's all what I can do now
<brandon_> bmonty: that built the tarball and a .dsc file
<bmonty> wow, don't ever try to seperate \sh from kde! :)
<bmonty> brandon_: yes, that is what dpkg-buildpackage does :)
<brandon_> bmonty: so that and the deb is all i need to upload right?
<hub> \sh: well, I think it does that on purpose
<bmonty> brandon_: have you read the packaging guide? where are you trying to upload to?
<hub> \sh: when I installed ubuntu-desktop over my kubuntu-desktop it did it
<\sh> bmonty: no, it is definitly a bug...it shouldn't change the users first choice
<bmonty> \sh: I agree
<\sh> hub: ubuntu-desktop is doing that as well?
<\sh> then it's a global problem
<bmonty> at least not without asking you first
<brandon_> to revu. i have read and followed the wiki guide for it, but it's not totally clear
<\sh> hub: could you comment on https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/xubuntu-meta/+bug/49187 to clearify that ubuntu-desktop is doing the same?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 49187 in xubuntu-meta "xubuntu-desktop configures xubuntu as default session in kdm, even if its wrong" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed] 
<bmonty> brandon_: you only upload source packages to revu which would consist of the .dsc and tarball you just made
<brandon_> bmonty: i don't upload the deb? what's the point of not uploading the very file i want to give people access to?
<\sh> brandon_: revu is not a repository for downloading
<bmonty> brandon_: the .deb is built from the source package
<hub> \sh: but I think it is the intended behaviour
<\sh> hub: it shouldn't
<hub> \sh: commented
<\sh> hub: thx
<bmonty> brandon_: all of this is in the Ubuntu Packaging Guide BTW
<brandon_> i don't know where that is, but what i'm currently reading says ask for help here
<hub> \sh: np
<hub> http://fasmz.org/~pterjan/blog/?date=20060609#p01 <- sort of a troll
<bmonty> brandon_: if you have dapper installed, look at System->Help->System Documentation
<\sh> brandon_: sure...here is the right place to ask :) and we tell you now, upload to revu only source packages with .dsc,diff.gz and orig.tar.gz files ;)
<bmonty> brandon_: the packaging guide is available from there
<brandon_> i'll read it and memorize every word
<bmonty> I hope you have a good memory :)
<bmonty> later everyone
<ajmitch> crimsun_: ping
<Toadstool> g'night
<brandon_> when i run the dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa command, where should the source.changes file be created?
<hub> brandon_: in ..
<hub> next to the .deb
<hub> .dsc I mean
<brandon_> it isn't being created
<crimsun_> ajmitch: pong
<brandon_> it looks like it's trying to sign the package with the original creator's key instead of mine
<hub> brandon_: I remember some sort of bug
<brandon_> my key is set as the default though
<crimsun_> brandon_: use -kblahblah
<ajmitch> crimsun_: playing doom3 again, got those alsa errors
<ajmitch> looking at the console, it's not an uncommon error (according to google)
<crimsun_> ajmitch: please pastebin?
<ajmitch> same as on http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-80755.html
<brandon_> crimson: thank you
#ubuntu-motu 2006-06-10
<crimsun_> ajmitch: so you're using alsa and not oss?
<ajmitch> crimsun_: yes
<crimsun_> ajmitch: which device?
<ajmitch> if I switch to oss, and put the right libs in place, it works
<ajmitch> um
* ajmitch will have to check that
<ajmitch> crimsun_: I did no configuration on doom3 for alsa, so I didn't select a device
<crimsun_> ok. Please try "+set s_alsa_pcm plughw:0"
<ajmitch> during DOOM 3 initialization...
<ajmitch> WARNING: sound subsystem disabled
<crimsun_> that's ... unique
<ajmitch> quite spethial
<crimsun_> does doom3 emit any additional debug output?
<ajmitch> setting speakers to stereo gets me the messed up sound again
<ajmitch> nope
<ajmitch> I'm using an amd64, so the sdl libs for doom3 are coming from ia32-libs-sdl
<ajmitch> to use OSS, I need to borrow the sdl lib from a 32-bit chroot :)
<crimsun_> ok, having not played doom3, does its sound system default to surround?
<LaserJock> wow, I just did a dist-upgrade on stable and it had 68 packages to upgrade
<LaserJock> shesh, so much for stable ;-)
<crimsun_> LaserJock: /which/ stable? :-)
<crimsun_> (we have three currently ;-)
<LaserJock> Debian stable
<crimsun_> ah
<ajmitch> crimsun_: I'm thinking so
<crimsun_> ajmitch: hmm, have you tried using "+set s_alsa_pcm plug:surround51" ?
<crimsun_> man, this syntax for doom3 seems odd
<ajmitch> will try
* ajmitch only has boring stereo speakers
<LaserJock> woah, you got speakers? cool
<ajmitch> ok, no sound again, same WARNING
<crimsun_> ajmitch: what effect does "+set s_alsa_pcm surround51" have?
<ajmitch> no improvement, no sound
<crimsun_> ok, that's plain odd
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> makes me suspect that I used to play it with OSS without realising
<ajmitch> since the sound option defaults to 'best', rather than explicitly alsa or oss
<crimsun_> hmm, "+set developer 1" should be more verbose
<crimsun_> please try "+set s_alsa_pcm plughw:0 +set developer 1"
<ajmitch> nothing extra related to sound
<ajmitch> plughw:0 gets me the short write errors again
<crimsun_> ok, let's attempt to short plug; what about "+set s_alsa_pcm hw:0" ?
<ajmitch> WARNING: sound subsystem disabled
<ajmitch> nothing else
<ajmitch> proprietary software is great like that
<crimsun_> man, I need to smack ttimo
<ajmitch> heh
* crimsun_ considers ltrace and strace 
* ajmitch considers how much that will kill this box :)
<crimsun_> I suppose in the absence of source code being available, ltrace and strace will have to suffice
<crimsun_> oh, it hangs with redirected output?
<ajmitch> I doubt it
<ajmitch> but I have zul wanting to borrow my box for a kernel compile in a few minutes
<crimsun_> ah, right
<\sh> so good night folks..
<medelin> Hi, someone already check the cmph package?
<crimsun_> come again?
<ajmitch> I'm assuming he means a package on revu
<medelin> yeah
<medelin> I upload this in 7/jun
<ajmitch> so only a couple of days ago
<medelin> ajmitch: you are a reviewer?
<ajmitch> in a sense
<bluefoxicy> hmm. Snort 2.6 is out, 2.4 just ended its lifespan, and dapper still uses 2.3.3... :(  lemme guess, Debian still hasn't caught up
<havoc> gah, no themes for gkrellm
<havoc> so there's no mplayer in ubuntu?
<crimsun_> in multiverse.
<havoc> hmm, I have that enabled in apt
<havoc> (sources.list)
<havoc> yet atp-cache search isn't showing anything by kmplayer*
<crimsun_> are you looking for kmplayer or mplayer? afaik they're different.
<crimsun_> kmplayer's in universe; mplayer's in multiverse
<crimsun_> havoc: as in http://pastebin.ca/63460
<havoc> I wanted mplayer
<crimsun_> so enable multiverse and refresh your packages cache
<havoc> did that, still no mplayer
* bluefoxicy looks at snort and ohcrap x.x
<bluefoxicy> well.  I can try o_o
<crimsun_> havoc: then you didn't enable the correct one. Pastebin your sources.list.
<Kyral> hmm I should get an account on SF...
<havoc> crimsun_: http://pastebin.com/771095
<crimsun_> havoc: see your error yet?
<LaserJock> Kyral: why?
<crimsun_> havoc: look very closely at line 26.
<Kyral> LaserJock: this little daemon thing I wrote
<LaserJock> Kyral: yeah? cool
<Kyral> it ain't much, but one of my profs mentioned it to Russ Nelson and he said I should submit it to the Free Software Directory
<havoc> crimsun_: I can't see it, all these damn trees in the way ;)
<crimsun_> havoc: you enabled -backports.
<Kyral> I could host it on my webspace...but I'm having problems with DNS and I'd like to have it someplace where it wouldn't depend on my server
<havoc> crimsun_: ok, so I have backports, not multiverse
<crimsun_> havoc: you need multiverse for dapper, not dapper-backports.
<Kyral> Don't think I can package it for Debian or Ubuntu right now anyway
<havoc> what's the URL to the "everything" sources list?
<havoc> or the wiki url?
<havoc> (to that page)
<havoc> i.e. what do I need in there
<havoc> ?
<Kyral> unless MuttNG compiled with libestmp is in the repos :P
* havoc is still a little new to apt
<LaserJock> havoc: where you have universe in lines 16 & 17, add multiverse to the end like it has on line 26
<havoc> thanx
<havoc> so multiverse isn't in the config by default (not even commented out)?
<LaserJock> hmm, I thought it was commented out but I guess not
<LaserJock> you can add them all via synaptic too
<LaserJock> if you want the GUI version ;-)
<havoc> bah, guis :(
<Kyral> KISS :D
<crimsun_> "bah"? You're trying to install mplayer.
* ajmitch wonders why this is suddenly a support channel
<Kyral> Keep It Simple Stupid :D
<Kyral> oh ajmitch don't be a downer
<havoc> ajmitch: sorry, my bad :|
<Kyral> not like anything else was going on
<havoc> ok, very nice :)
<crimsun_> well to be fair, havoc /could/ have asked in #kubuntu
<LaserJock> doh, I forgot that I wasn't being paid for IRC support
<havoc> heh, harrassing them enough already ;)
<havoc> LaserJock: I do enough IRC support, but I do it cuz I like to be able to help
<havoc> unfortunately time is limited :(
<LaserJock> I do it because I love the pay ;-)
<havoc> heh, you're in the wrong line of work then :)
<havoc> hmm, still no gkrellm themes, guess they're not packaged
<LaserJock> I thought there were
<Kyral> hmm maybe not SF....
<LaserJock> no?
<Kyral> hehe, too many restrictions :D
<Kyral> I'll just use my own server :D
<crimsun_> or berlios
<Kyral> oh?
<LaserJock> restrictions?
<LaserJock> hmm
<Kyral> dunno, I saw a lot of legalese
<Kyral> and I've been meaning to setup a SVN domU anyway
<Kyral> I just wish I could get 4 static IPs....
<havoc> the gkrellm themese have bad licenses?
<StevenK> Kyral: Your ISP doesn't do extra statics, or won't?
<Kyral> its my school
<Kyral> I dunno I should just go talk to them
<Kyral> I mean if the MAC doesn't change its static
<Kyral> but my domU MACs are randomly generated everytime they reboot
<Kyral> and bring them down on a monthly basis to fsck their partitions
<Kyral> ^I bring
<LaserJock> havoc: most artwork has bad licenses, in a DFSG way, I believe
<havoc> ah
<Kyral> Dontcha love Xen :D
<LaserJock> no, never tried it
<Kyral> Firewalling on dom0 is a BITCH
* StevenK notes his ISP will route him a /29 for $120/year.
<Kyral> how many IPs is that?
<StevenK> 6 useable
<Kyral> (BTW fsck that when I am paying $7/year for the domain)
<StevenK> I'm paying $65/month for Internet anyway.
<Kyral> <==Free :P
<StevenK> Blah
<Kyral> <<===College :P
<LaserJock> hello, it's called tuition
<StevenK> I dislike using the Internet at uni.
<StevenK> It's firewalled to all hell, and I could get faster connection speeds if I got out and pushed the packets out of the interface myself.
<LaserJock> my uni line is fast
<LaserJock> it is fairly firewalled though (like 6667)
<Kyral> eh I can run a webserver outta my dorm
<bluefoxicy> um
<bluefoxicy> oh yeah
<Kyral> not Mail or DNS or FTP
<bluefoxicy> I should probably log into revu or something to see if there's any comments.
<Kyral> which is why I run the server from the computer lab :D
<LaserJock> is LP going to be like a bzr version of BerliOS or SF?
<StevenK> Kyral: I like my ISP. They're cheap, they don't mind you running Linux, upload traffic is uncounted, their subnets aren't listed on the DUL, and they don't mind you running services.
<Kyral> DUL?
<StevenK> Dial-Up Users List
<Kyral> heh
<bluefoxicy> http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/pax-utils-0606091425/linda
<Kyral> its more like is "I don't care about Linux. Run it if you want but hell if we will support it"
<Kyral> (my home ISP)
<bluefoxicy> pax-utils; This package makes use of CDBS and debhelper, but doesn't depend on debhelper This package, which makes use of CDBS and the debhelper part of CDBS, does not depend on debhelper.
<brandon_> i just installed a package from source, but the problem is, it put the executable in /usr/local/kde/bin instead of /usr/bin. can i change that parameter?
<StevenK> It's a list of subnets that are considered to be dynamically assigned by dial-up ISPs. Which means that they must be infested with spammers.
<bluefoxicy> uh.  Doesn't CDBS depend on debhelper.  O_o
<Kyral> brandon_: recompile with "prefix=/usr
<crimsun_> bluefoxicy: (no, it doesn't)
<brandon_> Kyral: thank you
<bluefoxicy> crimsun_: (wow)
* bluefoxicy depends on debhelper then.
<Kyral> frankly custom compiles I prefix with /opt
<Kyral> nothing from Apt goes to /opt :P
<StevenK> Kyral: My ISP are more like "I can't tell you how to do it, but here's how you do it with Windows, and I'm happy to look at the auth logs for you."
<bluefoxicy> should I just 'debhelper' depend or 'debhelper (>=something)'?
<LaserJock> I'm not really sure who my ISP is right now
<crimsun_> bluefoxicy: if you need a specific dh compat version, then you need to version the build dependency
<crimsun_> (>= 4.0 would be a good idea)
<bluefoxicy> crimsun_:  I honestly have no idea so I'll just version it.
<bluefoxicy> to >=4.0
<bluefoxicy> alright
<bluefoxicy> That should be everything.  I moved version to -0ubuntu1, added a debhelper dependency.  I'll dput the new one.
<brandon_> i'm getting an error when i try to build a deb. i'm using the command "fakeroot debian/rules binary" and the error is that i'm missing a couple of the .mk files it needs
<Kyral> hmm
<Kyral> anyone have a good primer for GUI programming
<crimsun_> precise errors would be nice.
<StevenK> Kyral: Yes. Don't try.
<Kyral> like about event driven stuff
<Kyral> StevenK: Where is the fun in that?
<brandon_> crimson_ are you talking to me?
<StevenK> Kyral: Google for a GTK tute.
<Kyral> StevenK: I know where it is
<Kyral> I meant to signal theory in general
<crimsun_> well, gtk's or qt's approach?
* Kyral falls down
<Kyral> something more basic lol
<Kyral> as in the helping me think in the event driven paradigm instead of the style I think in now
<crimsun_> brandon_: yes
<brandon_> i'm wary about pasting too much code in here, but this is what i'm getting: "make: *** No rule to make target `/usr/share/cdbs/1/class/kde.mk" and also with another file in the same location called "debhelper.mk"
<StevenK> Kyral: aptitude install libevent-perl ; perldoc Event ?
<Kyral> StevenK: No apt :P
<StevenK> Awww.
<Kyral> I'll just look it up on perl.org
<Kyral> :D
<Kyral> Sysinfo for 'HyperDream': Linux 2.6.16-beyond running KDE 3.5.3, CPU: AMD Athlon XP 2100+ at 1734 MHz (3470 bogomips), HD: 244/432GB, RAM: 957/1011MB, 90 proc's, 3.20d up
<StevenK> http://search.cpan.org/~jprit/Event-1.06/lib/Event.pod
<StevenK> HyperDream. Dear me.
<Kyral> lol
<Kyral> I used to call it "InsaneFreedomDestinyAndDarkness" lol
<StevenK> % hostname
<StevenK> liquified
<Kyral> lol
<Kyral> see I have fun with my computer names :P
* Erlang has got 2 'puter: Silvester & Tweetee
<Kyral> next time I should seriously do
<Kyral> pwgen -n 1 >> /etc/hostname
<StevenK> steven@liquified:~% ruptime | tr -s ' ' | cut -d\  -f1 | paste -d ' ' -s -
<StevenK> crippled destroyed enervated infected killed liquified
<Kyral> huh?
<Erlang> I'm guessing pbuilder don't support Edgy yet
<Kyral> dude...
<StevenK> That's all of my machine names.
<StevenK> Taken from ruptime.
<Kyral> ruptime?
<crimsun_> brandon_: I presume you have both cdbs and debhelper installed?
<StevenK> Kyral: It takes status from rwhod of machines on the local network.
<Kyral> and I was about to say, stop with the Regexps...I have been studying them all day
<StevenK> That is no regexp, it's an evil one-liner. ;-)
<Erlang> regexps rawks
<brandon_> crimsun_: i'll check. i didn't need them on the previous debs i built though
<Kyral> you wanna see an evil on liner?!
<Erlang> I there a motu that'll be kind enough to review kpl some day?
<Erlang> well, motu or not motu.  whoever can review.
<crimsun_> link, and I'll look in a few hours after I've committed this fix for moodle.
<Kyral> strings `mysql -u <user> -p<password> -e 'select filename from table where ISNULL(content)' testdatabase | grep filename | sed 's/[[:space:] |] //g'` | sed 's/[[:xdigit:] [:cntrl:] ] //g'
<Erlang> crimsun_: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2361
<Kyral> THATS an evil one liner
<Erlang> I've done worse.  Like a five-line one-liner...
<Kyral> and that doesn't COMPLETE the job lol
<Kyral> anyone have a sed statement for stripping HTML tags?
<StevenK> I usually use lynx -dump for that
<Kyral> hehe
<Kyral> PDFs are a bitch to extract text from
<Kyral> unless you use something like ps2ascii or pdftohtml
<Kyral> I hate to say it, but MSWord files are easier in that regard
<Kyral> dump the file with strings, then sed out all the nasty control and formatting
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Kyral> mv Kyral /dev/bathroom/shower :P
<rob> hi, just wondering if anyone can tell me what the better option is, chroot or pbuilder (for building packages)?
<bddebian> Most use pbuilder here afaik
<bddebian> Of course I am wrong often :-)
<Erlang> there is sbuild too
<rob> heh
<rob> whats easier when starting off?
<Erlang> pbuilder is quite easy.
<bddebian> Aye
<rob> is there an edgy debootstrap package available yet?
<ajmitch> yes, in edgy
<ajmitch> though it's simpler to just debootstrap dapper & upgrade
<bddebian> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<rob> yeah, the packaging guide recommends going to packages.ubuntu.com, but its not there yet
<havoc> ok, I've been asking in #kubuntu for hours now, and am loath to ask here, but how to I set a null root passwd?
<Kyral> ....
<Kyral> I wwon't tell you
<rob> why would you want to do that?
<havoc> or set a null passwd in general in ubuntu?
<Kyral> and I will shoot anyone that does
<havoc> I'll be sure to setup a page with <blink> tags when I figure it out then
<Kyral> Because you are a flaming idiot to even THINK of setting a null root password
<havoc> I want it for  convinience/laziness/experience/physically-remotely-inaccessible-box
<Kyral> .....
<havoc> and been doing it on this machine for years
<Kyral> Like I said
<Kyral> you are an idiot
<havoc> whatever
<Kyral> does the word "security" mean anything to you
<havoc> yes, and it doesn't matter on this box, does that mean anything to you?
<Kyral> sorry, its one of these things that is a complete foreign concept to me
<havoc> so, web page w/ blink tags
<rob> the web page with blink tags is an even greater insult
<rob> :P
<havoc> heh, that's the point
<havoc> at leats someone got it
<havoc> ^least
<Erlang> pbuilder update to edgy works fine.  great.
<Erlang> ubercrap, an ITP has been filed for kpl...
<brandon_> did the mplayer crew recently change their cvs directories? the paths don't work anymore
<crimsun_> brandon_: they no longer use cvs.
<zul_> no idea
<crimsun_> brandon_: svn checkout svn://svn.mplayerhq.hu/mplayer/trunk/
<crimsun_> (announced on their homepage)
<bddebian> Heya crimsun_
<Daemon> havoc: without being rude, if you don't know how to set a null password then you probably aren't a person that should use a null password
<crimsun_> 'lo bddebian
<havoc> Daemon: I know how, ubuntu won't let me
<Daemon> especially for the root user
<havoc> Daemon: I guess if you knew about the inner workings of ubuntu you'd know that
<havoc> you cannot set a null passwd with either passwd or usermod
<Kyral> there is a reason for that
<havoc> and if you manually edit shadow you will still be prompted for a passwd
<Daemon> havoc: I can only see that as a good thing
<havoc> anyway, I got it done
<havoc> now for the web page with <blink> tags
* havoc is kidding about <blink>
<havoc> stupid pam :<
<havoc> so now I will use my null root passwd on my non-network connected box
<havoc> Hobbsee: evening :)
<Hobbsee> morning havoc
<havoc> morning for my wife, but not me
<Hobbsee> er, okay...
<Hobbsee> you're in different places?
<havoc> she's a 3rd shifter
<Hobbsee> ah
<imbrandon> heya Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey imbrandon
<bddebian> Heya imbrandon, Hobbsee :-)
<Hobbsee> hey bddebian
<imbrandon> sup bddebian
<bddebian> Not much, you folks?
<imbrandon> naddda
<jsgotangco> good morning
<imbrandon> your home early Hobbsee
<TheMuso> Hey all.
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: it's saturday here...
<imbrandon> ahh nm its sat for you
<bddebian> Heya jsgotangco, TheMuso
* Hobbsee is just plain cold, and supposedly studying
<imbrandon> lol just realized that
<imbrandon> heya guys
<Hobbsee> hey TheMuso and jsgotangco
<imbrandon> Hobbsee, its been 90+ here all week ;)
<imbrandon> 90+ f
* Hobbsee mutters about nice warm weather not being here
* imbrandon mutters about his nforce network drivers not working on his shiny new amd64
<TheMuso> heh
<imbrandon> sucks cant get it to network for nothin
* TheMuso specs
<imbrandon> amd64 3400+ 1gb ram 160gb sata150
<imbrandon> nvida something video lol
<imbrandon> and nforce chipset and nforce networking
<zul_> nforce blows
<imbrandon> everything works outa the box with dapper but the networking , and it see the card but wont get a ip from dhcp nor will it work if i set an ip
<imbrandon> kinda boggleing
<zul_> what module are you using?
<imbrandon> zul_, yea but thats what was onboard when i bought it, i might just throw another nic in it
<imbrandon> zul_, forcedeth or similar
<zul_> hmmm
<imbrandon> thats what it loaded outa the box, dident get it on the net to dload anything else heh
<imbrandon> like i said i got 100000000 nic cards laying arround here , probbly just throw another in it for the time being tiill i figure it out , leaste that will let me get it online and try diffrent things
<imbrandon> just kinda sucks of all things not to work the freakin nic card lol
<imbrandon> zul_, here's the exact computer i bought, only thing diffrent is i added 512mb more ram   http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000F3MG22/002-7102751-1896829?v=glance&n=541966
<zul_> what does dmesg say?
<imbrandon> i would have to go fire it up, havent been using it today ;)
<zul_> ah ok then
<imbrandon> give me about and hour to finish up this download then i'll go throw a new nic in it and fire it up
<imbrandon> if your still awake/arround then
<zul_> sure i might not be but open a bug in lp if im not with the full details
<imbrandon> kk
<zul_> also run dhcp in debug mode and attach log files as well
<imbrandon> ok how do i do that , i tried dhclient eth0 but it wouldent get an ip
<Kyral> damn O'Reilly
<imbrandon> btw the card does work ( tested in windows that came with it lol )
<imbrandon> just to rule that out
<imbrandon> and the cable etc etc etc
<Kyral> damn them for making such kickass programming books!
<zul_> dhlient -d
<imbrandon> ok
<imbrandon> lol Kyral that almost sounds sarcastic
<Kyral> no it isn't
<Kyral> because I am weak...lol I want all their Pocket References :D
<imbrandon> ahh ;)
<imbrandon> i have the php and c# pocket ref's they are nice
<Kyral> they have a buy 2 get 1 free deal going on at their site
<imbrandon> and O'Reilly PHP Cookbook that is VERY nice
<Kyral> lesse, Linux Pocket Reference, Perl Pocket Reference, Python Pocket Reference
<imbrandon> yea i should grab one for python
<imbrandon> do they have a python / qt one ?
<bluefoxicy> I have a question about uploading stuff.
<Kyral> my copy of Python in a nutshell is 3 years old
<Kyral> Holy hell when did Python 2.5 come out?
<bluefoxicy> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2390  <-- I have some comments on stuff to do now
<bluefoxicy> when I do that will I upload -0ubuntu2 or -0ubuntu1 again?
<imbrandon> Kyral, i'm just now picking up python ;)
<Kyral> imbrandon: I made a joke that you know you program too much when all you need to pickup a language is to read the first few chapters of one of O'Reilly's "In A Nutshell" books :D
<crimsun_> bluefoxicy: 1
<imbrandon> bluefoxicy, probbly -0ubuntu1 again ( without looking ) if its not in the repos yet
<bluefoxicy> imbrandon:  ok.
<Kyral> oh thats what I wanted
<Kyral> not Python Pocket Reference
<imbrandon> hahaha Kyral
<Kyral> Regular Expressions Pocket Reference
<imbrandon> is there a python / qt O'Rilly book ?
<Kyral> I dunno
<Kyral> grep the site for it :D
* imbrandon looks
<crimsun_> imbrandon: / bluefoxicy: always target the upload version you intend to make to Ubuntu
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> crimsun_, yea thats what i thought, just wasent totaly sure
<Kyral> I should con the head of our CS Department to get a Safari subscription for the entire department
<bluefoxicy> "you might want to switch to debhelper compatibility 5 (but 4 is ok as well) "  Honestly do I care?
<Erlang> duuuh, the guy that filed the ITP before me has a kpl package and his diff is like 5mb...
<crimsun_> bluefoxicy: 5 would be excellent (remember to bump the versioned b-d in debian/control then)
<Erlang> the compressed .orig is 600k...
<bluefoxicy> crimsun_: I'm guessing, the "compat" file in debian/?
<bluefoxicy> just spit "5" in there?
<bluefoxicy> (also I got Pre-Depends from probably gzip, which I used as a template package)
<crimsun_> bluefoxicy: yes. Possible it might be exported in debian/rules, too.
<bluefoxicy> not in rules.
<bluefoxicy> I used cdbs
<crimsun_> then just adjust debian/co{mpat,ntrol}
* bluefoxicy leaves the whole 'this file defines..' stuff from elf.h in and just cut-pastes to copyright
<imbrandon> crimsun_, will there be an announcement of some type somewhere ( ? -motu mailing list ? ) when edgy is avaible for general universe uploads ?
<bluefoxicy> crimsun_:  I love the status
<bluefoxicy> "Lightbulb and hammer"
<bluefoxicy> You should get rid of the icons and just type it straight in.
<crimsun_> imbrandon: to -devel{,-announce} I suspect
<imbrandon> kk
<crimsun_> imbrandon: it will be fairly obvious, too. You'll see the X.Org 7.1 packages built.
<imbrandon> heh true and probbly 1000000000 pkgs comming over -changes
<bddebian> imbrandon: You will get an invitation in the mail ;-P
<imbrandon> heheh
<crimsun_> (from bddebian ;)
<imbrandon> mark will come knock on my door ;)
<crimsun_> (and a pony)
<imbrandon> hahaha
<bddebian> crimsun_: Oh yeah, Alpo called.  Somehow they got your shipment ;-P
<jsgotangco> alpo haha
<crimsun_> pfft
<bluefoxicy> ... ok that wasn't bad.
<imbrandon> hahah speaking of ponies ...i was showing off photoshop on wine ...... well hold on the pic speaks for its self ....... *looks for the pic*   .... http://www.buntudot.org/people/~imbrandon/screenshots/snapshot4.png
<jsgotangco> nice ponies
<tuxmaniac> HAve the bug triaging started for 6.06
<tuxmaniac> :-)
<bddebian> Don't you feel dirty running non-Free software on a Free OS? :-)
<bddebian> tuxmaniac: No we still have bugs from Warty out there :-)
<tuxmaniac> bddebian: heh
<jsgotangco> it has a start button
<imbrandon> bddebian, the only non free software i run is photoshop and as soon as someone ( i'm not qualified ) decides as i do that gimp dont cut it and makes something better i'll keep running ps ;)
<jsgotangco> ps is very expensive :/
<imbrandon> jsgotangco, yea dont you love my kde theme ;)
* jsgotangco doesn't use kde
<imbrandon> jsgotangco, yes i payed ~700$ usd
<imbrandon> for ps
<jsgotangco> ugghh
<jsgotangco> well i guess its worth for most people who use it
<imbrandon> very much so, i would be happy to use gimp if i could get 1) a qt interface 2) an MDI interface
<imbrandon> and dont say gimpshop
<imbrandon> ;)
<crimsun_> hooray, fixed $it
<imbrandon> krita comes close but not near as powerfull as even gimp
<jsgotangco> for most people,  converting to gimpshop is such a pain
<bddebian> crimsun_: What'd you fix now studboy?
<crimsun_> moodle
* bluefoxicy ponders reworking snort with cdbs.... mainly because snort is at 2.6 and debian has 2.3, 2.4 is latest supported stable branch and just died, and 2.6 is the new stable branch
<bluefoxicy> besidse
<bluefoxicy> I want inline support
<bddebian> Damn, I thought I had too much running commentary until you came around bluefoxicy :-)
<bluefoxicy> I regularly get +q'd in any channel I'm active in
<bluefoxicy> you can't compete with me.
<bddebian> Oh I have no desire too thanks :-)
<imbrandon> i assume +q is muted ;)
<bddebian> +duct-tape
<imbrandon> haha
<bddebian> Sorry, couldn't resist :-)
<bluefoxicy> yeah
* Hobbsee duct tapes bluefoxicy 
<bluefoxicy> kinky
<bluefoxicy> but i'm not into girls dearie :p
<imbrandon> i usaly just idles alot and looks for a channel to turn red becouse someone said his name then checks irc
<bddebian> Hobbsee is a girl d00d
<bluefoxicy> oh come on it wasn't THAT bad.
<imbrandon> bluefoxicy, but still not approperate, even as lax as *-motu is , its still not *-offtopic and i dont think it would be in there either IMO
<Hobbsee> bluefoxicy: and you wonder why you get +q'd a lot....
<bluefoxicy> imbrandon:  hey she duct taped me
<bluefoxicy> I was perfectly on topic with the snort thing
<bluefoxicy> I think.
<imbrandon> i was talking about *kinky* but lets drop it for the sake of it dosent belong here ;)
<bluefoxicy> oh
<bluefoxicy> Well she duct taped me!  :P
<bluefoxicy> Anyway
<imbrandon> anyhow yes snort was ontopic etc etc etc
<imbrandon> lets move on .......
<Hobbsee> cut the sex talk, or i'll +m you.
<Hobbsee> er...+b you, i mean.
<bluefoxicy> I wonder what snort 2.6 uses for inlining these days
<imbrandon> wth is snort anyhow ? like sed ?
<bluefoxicy> no
<bluefoxicy> snort is a network.. daemon.. thing, kind of... that sits on the network and picks up all traffic and anylizes it for attacks
<bluefoxicy> it used to be a simple intrusion detection system and packet sniffer (hence why it's a network daemon thing and not a side app like ethereal)
<bluefoxicy> but since 2.3 it's had an inline module that lets it actually stop attacks from reaching the applications they're destined for.
<bluefoxicy> so i.e. you could have apache, gaim, or mozilla pick up a connection, someone sends a malformed jpeg or URL or something to pop up a buffer overflow and get a remote shell
<bluefoxicy> snort sees the attack, notices it's ... an attack, and drops the associated packets.
<bluefoxicy> Attacking host (due to tcp/ip design) will keep trying to resend for error correction for a bit, but it's hopeless really; after a few seconds the connection times out.
<bluefoxicy> intrusion prevention systems are a really nice concept.  Reactive stuff, like anti-virus, so not really a great deal of usefulness; but the concept is nice.
<bluefoxicy> virus signatures tend to be several hours before initial release of a virus; on the other hand, IDS/IPS signatures are several hours behind the release of the initial vulnerability
<bluefoxicy> so theoretically you're covered by the time a worm is written or by the time an attacker starts throwing attacks etc; but a fast attacker jumping on the chance (one worm was written and deployed within an hour of associated vulnerability being discovered) or a simple zero day attack will still get you.
<bluefoxicy> Additionally, deploying something like Snort with the inline module to work as an IPS on a routing device has the effect of protecting the ENTIRE network segment behind it
<bluefoxicy> so an ubuntu-based firewall with snort with inlining with a properly up-to-date rule set would have the effect of protecting every ubuntu, redhat, windows, and MacOSX machine behind it, even if they all had public IPs (think IPv6 and you get a block of IPs)
<bluefoxicy> Hence, I find it interesting to try to get inlining working in ubuntu :)
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: you staying this time?
* imbrandon hopes
<Hobbsee> hehe
<imbrandon> grr this is getting stupid , brb i'm gonna reboot
<Erlang> crimsun_: don't mind kpl.  I'll go throught Debian because of the previous ITP
<crimsun_> Erlang: ok
<rob> is {$shlibs:Depends} something that is frequently used on the depends line of the control file?
<LaserJock> rob: yes
<rob> ah, thanks LaserJock
<LaserJock> np
<kelmo> gday
<siretart> hey kelmo!
<siretart> kelmo: many thanks for your patches!
<kelmo> siretart: do they need to be substantiated by a bug report to be used?
<siretart> kelmo: no, I need to include them in the request to mdz
<kelmo> siretart: cool
<siretart> pointers to existing bugs would have been okay  as well, therefore I asked
<kelmo> it was only recently that I found those blunders
<siretart> ok
<kelmo> and they were found by me, so no bug report was made
<kelmo> who would I report it to? ;-)
<siretart> kelmo: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/wpasupplicant/+filebug
<kelmo> arg, registration
<kelmo> siretart: okay, just received you last mail. seems i overlooked the fact about openssl linkage
<siretart> yes, you'll need a launchpad account for nearly anything in ubuntu, including membership, ship-it, forums, bugreporting..
<kelmo> well, i may as well get shipit to post me some cd's while i am at it
<kelmo> i've not looked at ubuntu before, and I know it has some goodies I would like to investigate
<siretart> kelmo: see inbox
<kelmo> siretart: thanks for that
<siretart> I have to thank you for the patch :)
<siretart> anyway, I'm afk. cu later
<lifeless> morning
<kelmo> later, have a good day
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [-o lifeless]  by lifeless
<kelmo> hi lifeless
<phanatic> morning
<Gloubiboulga> hey phanatic :)
<phanatic> heya Gloubiboulga :)
<Toadstool> hi everybody
<imbrandon64> heya Toadstool
<Toadstool> hi imbrandon64
<imbrandon64> Hobbsee: one bad thing about the new 64 is kbfx dont run right , thus no windows theme for me yet ;) looks like i'll have to patch it once i find out whats wrong
<imbrandon64> lol
<Hobbsee> imbrandon64: ah...
<imbrandon64> BUT its blazin fast
<imbrandon64> ;)
<Hobbsee> :)
<imbrandon64> Sysinfo for 'birdofprey': Linux 2.6.15-23-amd64-generic running KDE 3.5.3, CPU: AMDAthlon643400+ at 1002 MHz (2006 bogomips), , RAM: 609/687MB, 111 proc's, 2.2h up
<imbrandon64> there we Hobbsee 353 ;)
<Hobbsee> imbrandon64: much better :P
<imbrandon64> there we go*
<zakame> hi all
<Hobbsee> hey zakame
<zakame> heya Hobbsee
<ajmitch> ok, another couple of quick packages thrown together
<Hobbsee> yay :)
<zakame> hmm what's the lightest notebook under 2 lbs?
<ajmitch> probably an actual book?
<ajmitch> eg I've got mono developer's notebook (part of an o'reilly series)
<sladen> a second-hand 286 laptop might cost under 2 pounds by now
<ajmitch> 2lb weight
<ajmitch> the 'surprise present' from google
<ajmitch> and I doubt you could pay someone 2 pounds to take away a 286 laptop
<zakame> aj	bingo, got the notice
<ajmitch> yes, I got an email tonight as well :)
<zakame> its highly unlikely that it be a sony vaio 505 or a toshiba libretto u100, right? :)
<ajmitch> extremely
<zakame> anyhow brb dinner :D
<zakame> 1/wind 1
<mvirkkil> Is there any recent mercurial package for dapper?
<mvirkkil> The current version has been the same since hoary.
<Hobbsee> mvirkkil: not by now, but we can have a new one in edgy...
<mvirkkil> ubuntu has 0.7, while 0.9 is in debian unstable.
<mvirkkil> Hobbsee: That would be very nice.
<Hobbsee> mvirkkil: what's the latest upstream?
<mvirkkil> Hobbsee: 0.9.x iirc
<Hobbsee> er, i think if it's in debian unstable, it should get synced over automatically...
<mvirkkil> Hobbsee: Well, afaic, it didn't for dapper
<mvirkkil> Hence, dapper still at 0.7
<Hobbsee> hmmm...that's what just occured to me.
<ajmitch> because 0.8 wasn't uploaded to debian until after upstream version freeze for dapper
<mvirkkil> ajmitch: ok.
<ajmitch> so it wasn't synced
<Hobbsee> gah.  cant type quick enough, that's what i was next going to ask
<ajmitch> and noone requested it be upgraded
<Hobbsee> they've jumped 2 versions, since UVF?
<ajmitch> yes
<mvirkkil> It's a shame. Moinmoin uses mercurial and they are recommending me to use mercurial 0.8 or newer.. I'm working on moinmoin for my soc.
<ajmitch> bzr has moved just as fast
<Hobbsee> ah ok
<ajmitch> it could possibly go into dapper-backports in the future
<ajmitch> but I'm not sure when that's opening up :)
<ajmitch> and you'll want to do your soc project asap
<mvirkkil> Hmm.. Could I interest anyone in creating a backport of it for dapper? I could offer to add some feature to moin in exchange ;) Fixing someone's pet-peewee.
<siretart> ajmitch: dapper-backports should already be open for direct uploads
<ajmitch> siretart: that's good
<ajmitch> siretart: open for core-dev uploads yet?
<siretart> mvirkkil: in order to 'backport', we would need a package to be backported
<mvirkkil> ajmitch: I did something a bit silly, and forced the installation of a deb compiled against a newer version of libc. Not the safest thing to do, I know.
<ajmitch> the package to be packported is in sid
<siretart> ajmitch: yes, this was decided at the last TB meeting at last
<ajmitch> I saw it was decided, I didn't know if it was implemented :)
<siretart> ajmitch: I don't know how launchpad is behaving currently
<ajmitch> noone really does
<siretart> nobody has tried yet ;)
<mvirkkil> siretart: Perhaps backporting the one in debian unstable?
<ajmitch> backporting from edgy would be preferable, since we wouldn't want to do an upload, but a sync across
<siretart> right
<ajmitch> it's all a conspiracy to promote bzr
<siretart> the policy is that we only upload if we really need to modify the source
<mvirkkil> I'd me much obliged if someone would do this :) I'm not sure what I could offer in exchange?
<havoc> morning everyone
<mvirkkil> oh, well. It was worth a shot...
* ajmitch had better sleep
<Hobbsee> hmmm...sleep...
<havoc> ajmitch: night night :)
<mvirkkil> hmm.. ok, so how would I go about backporting the package myself? Download debian src files? (I'm working on a 650MHz laptop with 128MB of ram)
<mvirkkil> Or is this the wrong channel to ask?
<siretart> mvirkkil: no, this channel is okay
<siretart> mvirkkil: I'd suggest that you setup either sbuild or pbuilder, see SbuildHowto or PbuilderHowto how to set them up
<siretart> mvirkkil: in principle, you download the source package (.dsc, .diff.gz and .orig.tar.gz) and tell either sbuild or pbuilder the .dsc
<mvirkkil> siretart: Ok. There's no way I could convince you to do it for me? Free beer on your next visit to finland?
<havoc> I'd give them all free beer anyway ;)
<siretart> mvirkkil: ;)
<siretart> just a sek
<mvirkkil> havoc: You live in Finland?
<havoc> no
<havoc> the states, but I'd still give people free beer when they visit
<havoc> in fact I *do* give people free beer :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<havoc> chillywilly knows ;)
<Hobbsee> what's people's attraction with free beer anyway?
<mvirkkil> I was away last summer during debconf, couldn't buy anyone anything..
<havoc> um, it's beer, and it's free?
<tseng> alcohol--
<mvirkkil> Personally I prefer free t-shirts, but then again noone ows me anything..
<mvirkkil> I'm currently personally in debt to a few hackers...
<siretart> mvirkkil: amd64 or i386?
<mvirkkil> siretart: i386
<siretart> gnarf.. one more time..
<slomo> isn't mercurial arch all?
<mvirkkil> slomo: I think it has some c-stuff
<siretart> slomo: no :/
<mvirkkil> slomo: it's like 90% python, but some stuff are in c for speed.
<slomo> ah ok
<mvirkkil> afaic
<slomo> mvirkkil: btw, what project are you working on and who's your mentor? :)
<mvirkkil> slomo: I'm working on docbook<->moin stuff
<mvirkkil> slomo: My mentor is Karsten Wade from the fedora project.
<siretart> mvirkkil: http://siretart.tauware.de/dapper-mercurial
<mvirkkil> siretart: Thanks!
* mvirkkil bows to siretart 
<siretart> :) - I told you, it isn't that complicated ;)
<mvirkkil> siretart: do you live anywhere near heidelberg?
<Hobbsee> siretart: where'd you grab the source from?  straight from debian?
<siretart> Hobbsee: apt-get source in a sid chroot
<Hobbsee> siretart: yeah, thought so
<siretart> mvirkkil: for some definition of 'near': I live in nuernberg
* Hobbsee only has one chroot for the moment though
<jpatrick> Hobbsee: I have 15
<Hobbsee> haha
<jpatrick> nah just 2
* siretart has some lvm snapshots. schroot rocks!
<siretart> hoary, breezy, dapper, sid, each amd64 and i386. for home use it's okay..
<siretart> ;)
<Hobbsee> ouchy!
* Hobbsee would think you'd need a big hard drive for all of that!
<siretart> it isn't that bad
<havoc> bddebian: hello
<Hobbsee> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bddebian> Hi havoc, Hobbsee
<mvirkkil> siretart: I owe you one.
<siretart> mvirkkil: next time in finnland ;)
<siretart> mvirkkil: why do you ask about heidelberg?
<bddebian> Heya siretart
<mvirkkil> siretart: I have a friend who lives in hidelberg. I could have organized for your free beer through her ;)
<siretart> huhu bddebian!
<siretart> mvirkkil: hehe :)
<mvirkkil> siretart: But yeah, next time in finland :)
<siretart> mvirkkil: but you could do me a favor anyway: could you please file a bug about mercurial to backport it to dapper-updates, say that you tested my binary package, it was okay in dapper, subscribe ubuntu-backports and assign it to me?
<mvirkkil> siretart: ok, I'll try to figure out how to do that :O)
<lukaswayne9> I've uploaded my package fceu-server to the REVU with dput, but I don't see it in the REVU.  Is this normal?
<phanatic> lukaswayne9: you have to wait for a while (5-10mins) until it appears there
<lukaswayne9> phanatic: Alright, this is my first time doing this, I wanted to make sure I was doing it right
<lukaswayne9> phanatic: thanks :)
<phanatic> it's already there btw :)
<mvirkkil> siretart: Hopefully I didn't mess up: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/mercurial/+bug/49261
<Ubug2> Malone bug 49261 in mercurial "Backport a more recent version to dapper-updates" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed] 
<mvirkkil> wow :)
<siretart> great :)
<lukaswayne9> phanatic: oh great!
<lukaswayne9> what's the policy on getting ubuntu universe packages into debian?
<siretart> lukaswayne9: you need a debian maintainer to care for
<bddebian> And an act of God ;-P
<bddebian> j/k
<lukaswayne9> :-P
* mvirkkil is doing the "I just got a dapper package of mercurial, so my system's package manager doesn't think my system is broken and doesn't refuse to update, so now I have an up to date system again"-dance
<lukaswayne9> are there many packages in universe but not debian?
<siretart> lukaswayne9: currently about 550 packages: http://tiber.tauware.de/~lucas/versions/unimultiverse-outdated-debian.html
<bddebian> eeks :-)
<lukaswayne9> Is there an organized effort to putting them in debian as well?  By debian or ubuntu?
<tseng> lukaswayne9: it is called utnubu
<tseng> debian developers to pull new ubuntu packages into debian
<tseng> some teams, like debian-mono have members from both sides
<tseng> and we just work together to start with
<lukaswayne9> oh, i see
<lukaswayne9> that's good to hear :)
<lukaswayne9> Now that I've uploaded my first package, I just wait for someone to review it and move it to universe?
<jose> Hello
<jose> I am the developer of gnomecatalog
<jose> i had upload gnomecatalog to motu
<jose> two months ago. nobody still have review it
<Hobbsee> jose: two months ago, we were still in UVF and feature freeze, so nothing on REVU would get into dapper.
<Hobbsee> it should get into edgy though
<jose> ahh.. ok
<jose> i have to wait ? it isnt?
<jose> Thanks hobbsee..
<jose> i hope to see gnomecatalog in edgy
<zakame> back
<Toadstool> heya everybody
<zakame> hi Toadstool
<Toadstool> hey zakame
<Toadstool> jose: you should upload a new version of gnomecatalog with 0.2.5-0ubuntu1 instead of 0.2.5-ubuntu1 and dapper replaced by edgy in your debian/changelog file
<jose> thanks toadstool i'll do it..
<Toadstool> and you can safely remove the other changelog entries as the package is not released yet and they're not that important imho
<Toadstool> and last but not least i'm currently packaging mmpython ;)
<Toadstool> see http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2388
<jose> cool i use it ..
<Toadstool> hum you should also use a compatibility level of 5 now
<Toadstool> that is 5 in debian/compat and debhelper (>= 5.0.0) in debian/control
<jose> ok
<jose> i am trying to do this weekend
<Toadstool> ok :)
<lukaswayne9> I'm new to Debian packaging, and I've just uploaded my first package to the REVU.  If anyone has has some spare time, I would really appreciate if they could look over my package and let me know how it could be improved.  The package name is fceu-server.  Thanks!
<Hobbsee> lukaswayne9: nothing can be uploaded to edgy yet anyway - repos arent open properly yet
<lukaswayne9> oh, alright
<Toadstool> lukaswayne9: which package?
<Toadstool> ah yes sorry
* Toadstool should read the whole sentences before asking silly questions
<lukaswayne9> Toadstool: It's alright, I do it all the time :)
<Toadstool> ;)
<Sp4rKy> hi MOTUs
<bmonty> morning everyone
<Sp4rKy> morning !!! I just came back from work :/
<Hobbsee> evening
<bddebian> Heya bmonty, Sp4rKy
<Sp4rKy> hey bddebian
<Hobbsee> night bddebian
<Sp4rKy> how are you ?
<bddebian> Fine thanks, you?
<bddebian> Gnight Hobbsee
<bddebian> or whoever you are ;-P
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> @time sydney
<Ubug2> Current time in Australia/Sydney: June 11 2006, 01:32:01
<Sp4rKy> bddebian, fine too :) i'm finishing my first packages :)
<Hobbsee> darn.  my clock does not lie.
<bmonty> well it is morning here.  I'm only on my second cup of coffee
<bmonty> hi bddebian
<bmonty> @time US/Central
<Ubug2> Current time in US/Central: June 10 2006, 10:32:39
<bmonty> Ubug2 is off by a couple of seconds :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> that doesnt help much
<G0SUB> @time Asia/Calcutta
<Ubug2> Current time in Asia/Calcutta: June 10 2006, 21:10:57
<mvirkkil> @time Finland/Helsinki
<mvirkkil> @time Europa/Finland/Helsinki
<bmonty> oh great, now you broke it!
<mvirkkil> lol
<G0SUB> bmonty: no, those time zones are wrong
<tseng> @time US/Eastern
<Ubug2> Current time in US/Eastern: June 10 2006, 11:43:34
<bddebian> heh
<bmonty> G0SUB: yes, I know
<mvirkkil> G0SUB: I don't think he was serious
<G0SUB> mvirkkil: heh, but I was (a bit) :)
<jose> hi
<jose> i have uploaded a new version of gnomecatalog for edgy
<bockman> hi crimsun_, i was wondering if you were making any headway on the openvpn bug in Breezy/Hoary?  (Bug #45827)
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 45827 in openvpn "openvpn old security problems (Breezy)" [Medium,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/45827
<bluefoxicy> I still need one more MOTU advocating pax-utils on REVU, if anyone has time to take a look?
* havoc needs gigE
<bluefoxicy> tseng: /join #xiph
<bluefoxicy> er
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  ignore that
* bluefoxicy kicks his client and tries to make it join a channel peacefully
<brandon_> i installed an app from source and now i'd like to make a deb, but fakerrot debina/dules binary won't work because the directory doesn't have a "debian" folder. the program is installed though
<brandon_> sorry, that was "fakeroot debian/rules binary"
<Erlang> brandon_: non need to make the rules file yourself.
<Erlang> if it's not there.
<brandon_> sicne there's no debian folder, that means the deb would have no control file, no scripts etc.
<brandon_> Erlang: i don't need the rules file?
<Erlang> eer
<Erlang> sorry it's a typo
<Erlang> YOU need to make the rules file yourself.
<Erlang> and the control file
<Erlang> and such.
<brandon_> well, that's a shock
<Erlang> It can be very easy or very hard depending on the package.
<brandon_> maybe i'll just write up a control file that gives me credit for the app, since the developer didn't bother to take it
<Erlang> well, technically, there is nothing keeping your from doing that, but that'd be dishonnest
<brandon_> i'm just mad that the guy didn't bother to do it
<brandon_> where am i supposed to look for dependencies and such?
<Erlang> you should be glad that he is actually spending time working on the program .
<Erlang> brandon_: It's supposed to be in the README file or the ./configure script might tell you what's missing.
<Erlang> brandon_: check the packaging guide: http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html
<Erlang> hahah
<Erlang> oops wrong
<brandon_> Erlang: i'm getting an error because the control file has some syntax problem. it says "continued value line not in field"
<Erlang> erm.  you should check the control file syntax then.  I need to go away
<rave_> whats the paste bin again
<havoc> pastebin.com ?
<rave_> no its defunctional atm
<rave_> there is a
<havoc> rafb.net/paste/ is another one
<rave_> pastebin.ubuntusomething.ocm
<havoc> ah
<rave_> ty havoc
<rave_> i always loved you
<johnnymast> :)
<LaserJock> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/
<rave_> i did something bad
<johnnymast> i coded in C when i wanted C++ :(
<johnnymast> http://rafb.net/paste/results/CU86P486.html
<bddebian> Heya gang
<crimsun_> 'lo bddebian
<bddebian> Hi crimsun_
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  can you give me a heads up on anything I need to do for http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2392 or give me a second advocate if it looks good?
<bmonty> hi everyone
<crimsun_> 'lo bmonty
<LaserJock> hi bmonty!
#ubuntu-motu 2006-06-11
<tseng> bluefoxicy: ok
<bluefoxicy> tseng:  thanks.
<bddebian> Heya bmonty, tseng
<tseng> hi
<LaserJock> hmm, I just got beagle to work, neat
<tseng> yay beagle
<LaserJock> I'm not sure if I'm using it right, but it seams to work
<tseng> it autostarts now
<tseng> and then you just do a search
<LaserJock> oh
<LaserJock> I looked on the beagle website
<LaserJock> so I did beagled, beagle-index-info, beagle-search
<tseng> beagled will just exit
<tseng> as its already running
<LaserJock> is beagle-search the right way to search?
<LaserJock> I see that the deskbar-applet can use Beagle, does that work?
* LaserJock is showing his lack of GUI experience
<bockman> hi crimsun_, i was wondering if you were making any headway on the openvpn bug in Breezy/Hoary?  (Bug #45827)
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 45827 in openvpn "openvpn old security problems (Breezy)" [Medium,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/45827
<crimsun_> bockman: I've already sent a diff to security-review and will ping pitti about it on Monday.
<bockman> excellent, thank you very much
<ReMink> Hello all !
<ReMink> When I want to launch "dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot", my shell says : dpkg-checkbuilddeps: Unmet build dependencies: bison libssl-dev libglib2.0-dev ....
<ReMink> BUT ! In my control file, I've always this
<crimsun_> ReMink: you don't have them installed.
<ReMink> crimsun_: I must install this ?
<ReMink> On my system ?
<crimsun_> ReMink: there's a difference between having them listed in debian/control:Build-Depends and having them installed{,in the chroot}
<ReMink> Ok crimsun_
<tseng> who is daemon@poleboy.de ?
<tseng> on REVU
<ReMink> crimsun_: Now :
<ReMink> applying patch 09_browser to ./ ... failed.
<ReMink> make: *** [patch-stamp]  Erreur 1
<ReMink> :/
<ReMink> crimsun_: Can you help me ?
<crimsun_> tseng: that's sistpoty
<crimsun_> Stefan Potyra
<tseng> oh
<tseng> ok.
<tseng> thanks.
<crimsun_> np
<ReMink> crimsun_ ... ?
<crimsun_> ReMink: you haven't given me any context
<ReMink> crimsun_: I'm creating Xchat 2.6.4 (.deb)
<ReMink> crimsun_: And, when I launch dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot
<ReMink> I've this message
<ReMink> crimsun_: simply
<ReMink> crimsun_: Understand you this error ? :/
<crimsun_> ReMink: you're doing it the difficult way
<crimsun_> apt-get source xchat and uupdate
<ReMink> And ..
<crimsun_> resolve any conflicts by checking debian/patches
<crimsun_> there may well be fixes in debian/patches that have been included upstream
<crimsun_> then roll the 2.6.4 deb
<crimsun_> the patch error is pretty straight-forward; look at the reject
<ReMink> crimsun_: How to roll the 2.6.4.dev ... :/
<ReMink> I don't learned like tha
<ReMink> I don't learned like that *
<crimsun_> ugh, I may as well do this.
<ReMink> mhmh
<ReMink> So, I go in my bed :o)
<ReMink> dimanche 11 juin 2006, 01:13:51 (UTC+0200)
<ReMink> In france
<ReMink> crimsun_: thanks
<Toadstool> wow that so late... I'd better go to bed too :)
<Toadstool> g'night everybody
<crimsun_> uh, well, I /was/ going to walk him through it...
<crimsun_> 'night Toadstool
<tseng> Ubugtu: bug 49192
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 49192 in libgcrypt11 "libgcrypt11 has an executable stack" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/49192
<ajmitch> hello
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<rob> when using dh_make the maintainer name I'm getting is 'root' despite not even being root at the time, is there a way of changing this?
<bddebian> rob: What did you put in the changelog?
<rob> nothing yet, I'm just following http://help.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/basic-debhelper.html
<bddebian> what did you pass to -e <address> ?
<rob> my usual email address
<rob> this is being done in a chroot (so not touching the host system)
<bddebian> Oh, for maintainer name it is probably picking up your username
<rob> my username in the chroot is still rob though..
<rob> I trued using chfn to edit it within the chroot
<rob> s/trued/tried
<bddebian> Hmm
<rob> maybe I should edit the changlog first?
<bddebian> There shouldn't be a debian/changelog yet
<rob> yeah there isn't
<bddebian> WTF?  I don't even have dh_make??
<rob> its within its own package I think
<rob> dh-make
<Kyral> well, bddebian is god
<Kyral> so bddebian doesn't NEED dh_make :P
<rob> hehe
<Kyral> oh bddebian I compiled my first proggy on HURD successfully
<bddebian> Kyral: Nice
<bddebian> Why isn't dh-make in debhelper?
<Kyral> I dunno if anyone has done it, but MuttNG compiles and works on HURD
<LaserJock> bddebian: because dh-make can be used without debhelper I suppose
<rob> ah, got it. I just set $DEBFULLNAME to my full name and it picked it up
* rob loves man pages
<Kyral> rob: then thoust will love Perl
<Kyral> rob: all the documentation is in manpages :D
<rob> heh nah I'm a python guy
<Kyral> rob: Well, I'm trying to learn Python
<bddebian> rob: :-)
<rob> Dive into Python is pretty good
<Kyral> but then again I'm also learning sed, grep, awk, bash, and perl at the same time
<rob> regular-expressions.info
<Kyral> I made a joke, but I am beginning to think it is more of a truism
<rob> I think thats it, thats really helpfull
<LaserJock> Kyral: I'm working on a Scripting for Ubuntu doc spec, I'm not sure if it will happen
<Kyral> "You know you are a programmer when you all you need to pick up a new language is to read one of OReilly's "In A Nutshell" books"
<Kyral> LaserJock: right now my opinion of the DocTeam is nil
<LaserJock> oh yeah?
<Kyral> Corey went and removed all references to "sudo apt-get install" on the Fluxbox wikipage
<rob> Kyral, how come?
<rob> heh..
* rob stays slient
<LaserJock> yeah, what's wrong with that?
* Kyral glares at rob
<rob> wasn't me!
<Kyral> Easy, it sends the impression that the official stance is that the command line is something to be avoided
<Kyral> and you KNOW my opinion on such
<LaserJock> it isn't so much CLI vs. GUI
<LaserJock> we had people doing a s/apt-get/aptitude/
<tseng> crimsun_: still here?
<Kyral> if you say Synaptic is a better tool I will sed you out of existance
<Kyral> LaserJock: it was Corey, the changelog said it was
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> but we had people fighting over apt-get vs. aptitude
<bddebian> Kyral: Hey, try gc on Hurd for me! ;-P
<LaserJock> so we decided to take out specifc package manager references
<Kyral> so you put in Synaptic? :P
<Kyral> Hypocrit :P
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> nobody put in Synaptic did they?
<Kyral> hehe okay I overreacted
<Kyral> I saw "Synaptic" in a + line :P
<LaserJock> we are just saying: "install X, Y, Z packages" rather than telling how
<Kyral> Then we have people asking how :P
<LaserJock> because no matter what we put somebody is going to be pissed off
<Kyral> Welcome to the world :P
<Kyral> my name is Chris "Kyral" Peterman, resident since October 4th 1985 :P
<tseng> crimsun_: i need a hint what to do here, on my desktop i will be happily playing a song and it will suddenly do this thing where it gets stuck on 2 notes like a broken record
<Kyral> bddebian: gc?
<tseng> crimsun_: killing the app will eventually stop the audio, but it doesnt unbreak it
<bddebian> Hans Broehms garbage collector
<Kyral> bddebian: oh does Hurd still have that little glitch about not seeing more than 2 GB of HD space?
<bddebian> No
<Kyral> bddebian: linkage?
<bddebian> linkage?
<Kyral> link to the place where I can download it
<bddebian> apt-get source gc
<LaserJock> Kyral: so try not to be too mad at the doc team, we were just trying to be consistent and not favor and package manager
<Kyral> or an ftp site (I LOVE that translator!!)
<Kyral> bddebian: I'll do it on Monday
<Kyral> bddebian: remind me :P
<bddebian> :-)
<Kyral> Tomorrow == Church
<Kyral> which means
<Kyral> DAY OF REST!!!
<bddebian> Oh, hmm, source package is libgc
<rob> hmm how can I make my gpg keys available in my chroot?
<LaserJock> I use dchroot -d and bindmount my /home
<rob> I have /home mounted in my chroot, but I'm getting gpg: WARNING: unsafe ownership on configuration file `/home/rob/.gnupg/gpg.conf'
<rob> then it fails to sign the files, "secret key not available"
<rob> grr
<LaserJock> rob: so what is the ownership on your gpg.conf
<bddebian> That is just a warning not an error
<rob> then it gets to:
<rob> Now signing changes and any dsc files...
<rob>  signfile dolphin_0.5-1.dsc Robert Stoffers <rstoffers@ubuntu.com>
<rob> gpg: skipped "Robert Stoffers <rstoffers@ubuntu.com>": secret key not available
<rob> gpg: [stdin] : clearsign failed: secret key not available
<rob> LaserJock, my normal user account and the user account in the chroot are the same
<bddebian> You have .gnupg dir in your chroot?
<rob> I have /home mounted in the chroot
<bddebian> Ah
<rob> so yes
<rob> ok, using -k'UID' with debuild works fine
<rob> but thats using my normal key
<rob> (which I guess is fine)
<bddebian> Heya jsgotangco
<jsgotangco> good morning
<Hobbsee> hi all
<rob> hey Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey rob :)
<rob> hey, you might be able to help me with a problem, I'm trying to build a kde-related package, but the configure file is complaining about kde-config not found, I've added kdelibs4-dev to the build-depends but its still not satisfied, any ideas?
<Hobbsee> kde-config not found...hmmm...
<Hobbsee> is that the exact name of the file, or something?
<rob> doesn't have anything to do with the Kubuntu config panel causing the problem?
<Hobbsee> it could need kdebase-dev maybe?
<Hobbsee> not really sure
<Hobbsee> if you have the exact file name, its' seasy enough to check which package it's in...
<bmonty> rob: you could look in the configure script and find out what file it is looking for
<bmonty> and then use dpkg to find out what package provides it
<rob> bmonty, yeah thats what I'm doing
<rob> its doing if test -x "$dir/kde-config"; then
<rob> it looks for a kde-config file in $PATH
<rob> looks like kdelibs-bin according to apt-file
<Hobbsee> try installing that, and check again?
<rob> yeah, its in pbuilder though
<Hobbsee> add it to debian/control?
<Hobbsee> as a dep?
<rob> yeah, no good
<Hobbsee> or maybe even a build-dep?
<rob> I tried as a build-dep, let me try as a dep
<rob> no good as a dep
<Hobbsee> hmmm...what did the attidition of kdebase-dev do?
<Hobbsee> as a b-d
<bluefoxicy> wtf
<bluefoxicy> I can't record and play flash at the same time
<rob> kdebase-dev was no good either
<Hobbsee> rob: or kdecore?
<rob> I'll give kdecore a shot
<Hobbsee> i dont have any more guesses after that..
<imbrandon> morning peeps
<rob> nup
<imbrandon> err after noon Hobbsee ;)
<Hobbsee> hey imbrandon
* Hobbsee wants breakfast!
<rob> perhaps the configure file is looking in the wrong place, due to Kubuntu messing with the control center
<imbrandon> umm its ~1pm for you correct ?
<Hobbsee> 12.30
<imbrandon> ;)
<imbrandon> late start today ?
<Hobbsee> yeah
<imbrandon> heh i've had about 3 hours sleep in last 24 so this will probbly be a short day for me too ;)
<Hobbsee> ouchy!
<imbrandon> anyone else tried google spreadsheets ? they are gonna put a nother nail in MS coffin with that one, might not be the last but every little step helps
<havoc> who maintains dhcpd?
<imbrandon> Maintainer: Eloy A. Paris
<imbrandon> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/dhcp3
<havoc> bah
<imbrandon> guess thats not what you were looking for ?
<havoc> nope
<havoc> not someone who's here
<havoc> are there any docs on connection sharing w/ ubuntu?
<havoc> I'm not getting anywhere w/ google
<havoc> and dhcpd seems to be broken
<bmonty> havoc: you mean NAT?
<havoc> MASQ actually, but yeah
<havoc> dhcpd is complaingin cuz I don't have a subnet declaration for the *wan* iface in dhcpd.conf
<havoc> which makes no sense
<bmonty> can you give it an all zeros netmask?
<havoc> never tried
<havoc> it's a dynamic iface though
<havoc> again, it makes no sense
<havoc> how do I declare a dynamic subnet?!?
<bmonty> you are trying to provide dhcp on a dynamic interface?
<havoc> no
<havoc> share a cable modem connection
<havoc> but dhcpd wants me to declare a subnet for the wan iface
<havoc> it's insane
<bmonty> do you have two nics?
<havoc> I've been doing this for years and I've never seent his before
<havoc> yes, 2 nics
<havoc> I have shorewall and bind setup already
<havoc> shorewall for MASQ, firewalling and traffic shapping, and bind for local caching name server
<bmonty> I still don't get why you would want dhcpd running on your wan interface
<havoc> I *DON'T*
<bmonty> you mean dhcpcd then ?
<bmonty> or dhclient
<havoc> dhclient is already running
<havoc> and working
<havoc> but dhcpd won't start due to the lack of a subnet declaration on the wan iface
<havoc> which makes no sense, as I've said over and over already
<bmonty> havoc: so tell it not to use the wan interface
<havoc> not having a declaration should be all it needs
<havoc> it should only bind to ifaces in defined subnets
<bmonty> havoc: check /etc/default/dhcp3-server
<bmonty> havoc: not true
<bmonty> havoc: the default is to bind to all interfaces that are up unless you tell it otherwise on the command line
<havoc> ok, I think we're getting somewhere now :)
<havoc> YAY!
<_ion> if value.nil? or value.is_a? FalseClass
<_ion> Sorry, missed the target.
<havoc> bmonty: thanx
<havoc> got me pointed int he right direction
<bmonty> havoc: glad to help :)
<ToHellWithGA> hello
<bmonty> hi ToHellWithGA
<havoc> bmonty: I keep forgetting about the "default" thing, and I also had to remove the 'dhcp
<ToHellWithGA> i don't know if it's a deliberate omission or something that could be patched, but beep-media-player has a very limited subset of input plugins even with multiverse enabled
<havoc> bmonty: I keep forgetting about the "default" thing, and I also had to remove the 'dhcp' package
<ToHellWithGA> i manually installed the FLAC input plugin but think it might be good to incorporate it into a mass plugins package, such as the plugins package for quod libet
<ToHellWithGA> bmonty: does that seem legit?
<bmonty> ToHellWithGA: I don't know, I'm not familiar with beep-media-player
<ToHellWithGA> it's a new version (more of a fork i guess) of xmms
<bddebian> God I suck :-(
<ToHellWithGA> when i want the winamp-esque interface in linux, which i reiterate is rare, i use bmp
<ToHellWithGA> bddebian: i don't think you're that bad
<bmonty> I do though
<bddebian> Heh, you don't know me yet :-)
<bddebian> See
<Hobbsee> hey bddebian
<Hobbsee> what have you done now?
<bddebian> Hi Hobbsee
<havoc> bddebian: evening :)
<bddebian> Nothing, I can't fix shit
<bddebian> Heya havoc
<Hobbsee> bddebian: heh, dont worry - none of us can fix naything either
* imbrandon is only good at breakin things
<imbrandon> and not even THAT good at that ;)
<Hobbsee> hehe!
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: you clearly need practice.
<bddebian> Yeah, it takes practice to suck like me :-)
<Hobbsee> hehe - and acheive deity status, yes
<bddebian> Ahhh, I get it now
<bddebian> I'm the God of all those who suck! :-)
<Hobbsee> hehe!
<ToHellWithGA> do yall know offhand who built the ubuntu packages for quod libet?
* Kyral shivers
* ToHellWithGA offers Kyral an irish coffee
<ToHellWithGA> caffeine to wake you up, heat to heat you up, and alcohol to keep you from knowing when you're cold
<ToHellWithGA> hooray ireland
<Kyral> Nah I'm gonna curl up in bed with a Manga :D
<rob> hmm, so according to apt-file, kdelibs-bin: usr/bin/kde-config - but adding kdelibs-bin to build-deps doesn't work, its as if pbuilder is ignoring it.
<ToHellWithGA> i have yet to read an actual comic *book*
<ToHellWithGA> just the little magazine style superman ones
<rob> any ideas? I'm lost
<rob> I've emailed the dev of the program in question, maybe he can help?
<zakame> hi all
<bddebian> Heya zakame
<Hobbsee> hey zakame k
<havoc> is there some dummy/aggregate "development" package?
<havoc> i.e. some package that will install most of the common dev tools?
<Hobbsee> er?  for kde, kde-devel, there's devscripts....it really depends what you're compiling
<havoc> no, like make, gcc, etc...
<Hobbsee> havoc: build-essential
<havoc> thanx :)
<rob> where does pbuilder dump the binary package once it is built?
<Hobbsee>  /var/cache/pbuider/result or something?
<Hobbsee> i'ts in /etc/pbuilderrc
<rob> for me it was /var/cache/pbuilder/dapper/result
<Hobbsee> nyah, it was a guess.
<Hobbsee> i get mine to build in my /home, anyway
<rob> probably due to the multiple pbuilder env I have :)
<bmonty> rob: you can use --buildresult to tell pbuilder where to throw the debs
<rob> thanks bmonty
* rob copies that down
<bmonty> no need to write it down..just "man pbuilder" :)
<rob> heh yeah
<crimsun_> tseng: (sorry, away for the evening) Which app{,s}, sound driver and codec (``cat /proc/asound/modules && tail -2 /proc/asound/oss/sndstat''), and is the symptom related to any pattern of file type (mp3, vorbis, flac, aac, ...) or usage pattern?
<rob> what does one put the desktop file in the package (one I created)?
<crimsun_> s/what/where/ ?
<crimsun_> in debian/
<rob> just copy it there, thats it?
<rob> I don't have to tell it about it?
<crimsun_> which step are you referring to? There are two. #1. The file needs to exist in debian/ . #2. It needs to be copied or moved into the package build dir via debian/rules .
<rob> ah ok, even when using cdbs?
<crimsun_> yes, even cdbs isn't omniscient about desktop files
<rob> what about the man page .docbook file I created, just include the makefile.mk in the rules file and set the DEB_INSTALL_MANPAGES_app variable to app.1?
<rob> oh, and copy that to debian/ as well
<rob> I have both my .desktop file and .1.docbook (manpage under debian/ in my package
<rob> err
<rob> the rules file doesn't seem to want to pick them up though, what is the relative location that I need to put in?
<crimsun_> rob: how are you moving them in debian/rules ?
<rob> well, thats where I put them before build
<rob> I'm getting (during pbuild):
<rob> dh_install dolphin.desktop /usr/share/applications/kde/
<rob> cp: cannot stat `./dolphin.desktop': No such file or directory
<crimsun_> no
<rob> I get something similar for the .docbook file too
<crimsun_> cp debian/dolphin.desktop debian/$yourpackage//usr/share/applications/kde/.
<crimsun_> (replacing $yourpackage, of course)
<crimsun_> (and omitting the duplicate '/')
<rob> no such directory
<crimsun_> then mkdir before or use install -D
* rob slaps head
* ajmitch wonders why his vmware instance is broken all of a sudden
<ajmitch> it's not the one I upgraded to edgy, either
<jsgotangco> cursed
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> looks like udev is hanging
<ajmitch> the vmware host box had a hard shutdown though
<rob> its been a long day.
<ajmitch> surely not :)
<jsgotangco> i have a long weekend (independence weekend)
<jsgotangco> ciao guys
<ajmitch> bye
<rob> so do I, still been long
<rob> going though the packaging guide + KubuntuPackagingGuide (on the wiki) and trying to make sense of it all
<ajmitch> ah I see
<ajmitch> that one which was hanging had 2.6.17
<ajmitch> but no upgraded udev
<ajmitch> doesn't seem to help booting it with 2.6.15... oh wel :)
<rob> crimsun_, that was no good, still the same error
<crimsun_> rob: pastebin debian/rules, the command, and errors
<crimsun_> it's difficult to troubleshoot in the dark
<rob> ok
<rob> http://pastebin.ca/64134
<crimsun_> you're blatantly misusing dh_install
<rob> oh, well I got that from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Packaging/Kubuntu?action=show&redirect=KubuntuPackagingGuide
<rob> titled Example: copy the desktop place to another place
<crimsun_> ah, I see
<crimsun_> then why not just put it in .install?
<crimsun_> sorry, thought you meant something else
<crimsun_> btw, the reason it's failing is because you omitted the parent directory
<crimsun_> unless dolphin.desktop resides in the top-level of your extracted source, it will fail
<crimsun_> e.g., if it's debian/dolphin.desktop, you need the debian/ portion, too
<rob> so it needs to be /debian/dolphin.desktop?
<crimsun_> omit the leading '/'
<rob> hmm, ok I tried that and it still failed
<rob> eailer
<crimsun_> where is dolphin.desktop?
<rob> under debian/
<crimsun_> use debian/dolphin.desktop, and fix the destination
<rob> ok, see what happens
<rob> fix the destination?
<crimsun_> you're attempting to install it to the real /usr/share/..., which will fail.
<rob> so /debian first?
<crimsun_> err, which dh compat version are you using?
<rob> 4
<crimsun_> yeah, you need to strip the absolute
<crimsun_> it should just be usr/share/applications/kde/
<rob> ah ok
<crimsun_> (note how the example you referenced omits the leading '/')
<rob> ah yes
<rob> ok, I'll try another build
<rob> hmm ok that seemed to work, except now I get:
<rob> touch debian/stamp-makefile-build
<rob> docbook2x-man debian/dolphin.1.docbook
<rob> I/O warning : failed to load external entity "debian/dolphin.1.docbook"
<rob> /usr/bin/db2x_xsltproc: cannot parse input document
<crimsun_> rob: it is actually xml docbook?
<crimsun_> (i.e., the format may actually be sgml docbook, in which case you need to pass -S to it)
<rob> :)
<rob> nevermind, it worked that time
<rob> lets test it
<rob> ok, package worked, man page worked, not getting an icon though for it in the menu..
<crimsun_> in kde?
<crimsun_> you probably need to log out and back in
<rob> yeah, just used a different account
<rob> ok, looks like it works great, thanks for your help crimsun_
<crimsun_> np.
<rob> ok, time for dinner, then after that look at revu
<Sp4rKy> hi
<TheMuso> What time on Monday do specs have to be in?
<TheMuso> nvm got it.
<rob> what files do I need to upload to revu?
<rob> with dput
<rob> its a new package
<jose> please...what change is necessary in source.list to install linux-image-amd64-k8 ???
<jose> please...what change is necessary in source.list of dapper to install linux-image-amd64-k8 ???
<rob> try #ubuntu
<rob> eek, that upload to revu died
<rob> how can I remove the files it did complete from revu?
<Sp4rKy|plage> rob you need the .dsc
<fabo> rob: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<rob> just dput it?
<Sp4rKy|plage> rob, and you can overide an upload with -f
<Sp4rKy|plage> dput -f mypackage.dsc
<rob> I'm getting: Uploading via ftp dolphin_0.5-1.dsc: Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of dolphin_0.5-1.dsc
<rob> didn't do that the first time when it died half way though
<Sp4rKy|plage> rob i'd the same issue
<jose> I did. No answer there.
<rob> ah ok, must be a server issue
<Sp4rKy|plage> you must send an email to the admin mailist to ask them delete your files
<rob> ah motu-reviewers@tauware.de?
<Sp4rKy|plage> no , admin , i don't know the exact adress , go to MOTU wiKi
<rob> ah k
<ajmitch> rob: what's the upload?
<rob> ajmitch, dolphin
<ajmitch> rm'ed
<rob> thanks ajmitch
<tuxmaniac> have the edgy repos opened?
<\sh> on the 7th already
<ajmitch> define 'opened'
<ajmitch> the base packages are being uploaded & setup
<ajmitch> nothing else is accepted
<\sh> and it will break your running system ;)
<ajmitch> and eat your children
<\sh> if you mean with "open" "break my system", so yes, it's open >:->
<bluefoxicy> ugh
<bluefoxicy> a bug I posted on ubuntu and upstream got rejected upstream because the package is deprecated and will have no new releases (even for security fixes)
<\sh> bluefoxicy: which one?
<\sh> moins ajmitch btw :)
<ajmitch> \sh: why did you say that vmware is x86 (32-bit) only & never in ubuntu?
<ajmitch> hi :)
<bluefoxicy> \sh: libgdk-pixbuf2, from gtk/gnome 1.2 series, the old, dead, depricated gnome branch
<\sh> ajmitch: because the 64bit version is still not released ;)
<ajmitch> \sh: 64-bit vmware server is running just fine here
<bluefoxicy> \sh:  It's of no consequence on a normal install, but it causes an executable stack in anything linking to it (i.e. xmms), I fixed that
<ajmitch> and vmware player is in multiverse
<bluefoxicy> I love how my 'fixes' are like "Yeah you have to patch all .S files, run this 4 line shell script it'll do it for you" instead of actually submitting a patch
<\sh> ajmitch: but 64bit vmware workstation and 64bit sx server (the one with a patched redhat on it) is still fragile and not for a production environment and is non free-software afaik
<ajmitch> \sh: that wasn't what you said in your email at all :)
<\sh> ajmitch: VMWare (not the player or the free Server) is non-free software.
<bluefoxicy> anyway I'm going ot bed, it's 4:51am here.
<ajmitch> rob: did you get your key in the REVU keyring, or did you just try uploading anyway?
<\sh> ajmitch: too many people are refering to vmware running on x86 (32bit) so, yes, my statement is a bit flaky, but 99% times true ;)
<rob> ajmitch, I've emailed but not yet, the guide says I can upload anyway?
<ajmitch> you should wait for it to be added
<rob> oh I see
<ajmitch> the wiki should say that you can do it without the key being signed, but not without it being added
<rob> ok
<ajmitch> mini-dinstall rejects packages that aren't from maintainers in the upload keyring
<bluefoxicy> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardenedHacking  <-- I had fun today, I'll fix the rest of /usr/lib when I wake up, and zip and vlc
<rob> ah ok, I'll guess I'll have to wait then
<phanatic> morning MOTUs
<\sh> hi phanatic
<ajmitch> rob: I can add it now, just had to warn you :)
<rob> :)
<rob> ok
<phanatic> hi \sh
<ajmitch> ok, imported
<\sh> oh no
<\sh> 20.06 Cologne: Sweden - England ... my beloved cologne will be destroyed
<\sh> by hooligans
<rob> ajmitch, you'll have to delete that dolphin package again I think
<ajmitch> fun
<ajmitch> rm'ed again
<ajmitch> hi Yagisan
<Yagisan> G'day ajmitch
<rob> thanks ajmitch
<rob> is there a lag involved with adding my key to the keyring?
<ajmitch> no
<ajmitch> when I said I've done it, I've done it
<rob> hmm, oh it just took a long time that time
<ajmitch> long time for what?
<Toadstool> hi everybody
<Yagisan> G'day Toadstool
<Toadstool> hey Yagisan
<Toadstool> hum, tiny question... I'm packaging a python lib and lintian complains about 4 files having a #! line although they are not in the PATH. I'd like to avoid using a patch system just to remove these shebangs... is the lintian clean thing mandatory? :)
<lifeless> consider that warning a strong hint
<Toadstool> yep, for sure...I'll try to ask upstream to remove these lines
<lifeless> its likely tht either the files are meant to be run (in which case teh #! is appropriate, but on equestions why the files are in the library, not in bin), or its a bug (in which case, tell upstream at minimum)
<Toadstool> then, I'll report the bug upstream
<Toadstool> thanks lifeless
* tuxmaniac suddenly feels that his ubuntu system is responding slower day by day
<tuxmaniac> But Initially it was fantastic. But once I started loading packages the system has become slow
<tuxmaniac> I hav no unnecessary services runnn
<\sh> re
<ajmitch> hi
* Hobbsee bounds in with a sledgehammer, and waves it in greeting.
<\sh> heya Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey \sh :)
* Yagisan grabs the sledgehammer and uses it on his package a few times before tossing it back to Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hehe!
<Hobbsee> thanks :)
<tseng> crimsun_: app = gstreamer, flac so far
<tseng> crimsun_: but something very similar used to happen with mythtv
<tseng> crimsun_: emu10k1, TriTech TR28602
<kagou> hey hub around?
<tseng> crimsun_: also.. the music is on a usb drive
<kagou> hub: exiv2 is now at 0.10 http://www.exiv2.org/changelog.html new features are great :)
<tseng> crimsun_: i just managed it again with an mp3
<tseng> crimsun_: under pretty low load
<slomo> tseng: what are you doing? :)
<tseng> slomo: my desktop chokes every few hours
<tseng> slomo: it will play the same 2 notes over and over like a broken record
<tseng> usually the rest of the system doesnt hang
<tseng> "usually"
<slomo> hrm
<slomo> sounds evil
<tseng> yeah
<sladen> tseng: the circular buffer, probably still has audio data in it, but nothing is replacing it so the sound car dis going round and round over the same data.  probably.
<tseng> sladen: i really think it is in alsa or the card itself
<tseng> as gstreamer works everywhere else
<tseng> shrug
<sladen> tseng: feeding audio to the card is basically the case of having a buffer with head and tail pointers.  You have to constantly replace the data otherwise it'll loop
<sladen> tseng: if the program feeding the data in crashes/whatevers, then it'll give the behaviour you describe
<sladen> why the crash/stop/wahtever occurs is another matter, it could be tALSA or it could be food or bar
<ajmitch> time for sleep
<ajmitch> night all
<Yagisan> night ajmitch
<Hobbsee> night ajmitch
<Hobbsee> hmm...sleep
<\sh> Hobbsee: time for a sunday afternoon beer ;)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> ewww...if you say so :P
<havoc> bah, morning
<Hobbsee> hey havoc
<havoc> hiya
<havoc> I think I'm going to try alien to install a mdv rpm
<havoc> trying to get zoneminder built, and it has a *lot* of deps
<havoc> heh, this is going to be interesting
<\sh> MOTUs, cheers
<bmonty> bye \sh
<\sh> bmonty: no :) cheers as in "get a beer and toast" ;)#
* Hobbsee toasts with \sh, using her empty glass
<bmonty> \sh: ah, I thought "cheers" was the standard european why of saying "cya later!"
<Hobbsee> bmonty: it also means "thankyou" so...
* Hobbsee didnt think it meant cya later...
<\sh> Hobbsee: in UK it means as well, cya later :)
<Hobbsee> oh ok, weird.
<\sh> Hobbsee: but it can also mean "Prost"
<bmonty> yeah, maybe that is my problem....all the brits I have worked with always say "cheers" why they are leaving :)
<Hobbsee> whatever that is
<\sh> one toast to the different english "slangs" ;)
<Hobbsee> ah right
<\sh> Hobbsee: "Prost" is german for "cheers" which is not "cya later" ;)
<bmonty> why should we make it easy for non-english speakers to learn, right? :)
<Hobbsee> bmonty: or those of us who do speak english, just not your english
<bmonty> Hobbsee: true
<\sh> lol
<Hobbsee> at least we dont mangle our english like certain small countries :P
<\sh> e.g.?
<Hobbsee> NZ, of course.
<havoc> heh, Hobbsee is gonna get smacked ;)
<\sh> they mangle their second language?
<Hobbsee> havoc: hehe - by who?
<havoc> isn't ajmitch from NZ?
<Hobbsee> \sh: what's their first?
<Hobbsee> havoc: he is...but he'd better not smack me :P
<\sh> Hobbsee: new zealand-ish? what ever the first people spoke
<Hobbsee> \sh: oh.  maori or something.
<\sh> maori that was it ;)
<\sh> thx
* Hobbsee doubts most people there speak maori
<zakame> hi all
<Hobbsee> hey zakame
<bmonty> hi zakame
<zakame> heya Hobbsee! whatchadoin'?
<zakame> heya bmonty! :D
<Hobbsee> zakame: playing with fire, i suspect... :P
* \sh listens to "Toto - Africa"
* Hobbsee listens to the sound of an otherwise silent house - yay :D
* jsgotangco can only hear crickets hear
* bmonty listens to a baby crying
<havoc> :(
* zakame hears the hum of a cvs build
* Hobbsee sends bmonty off to care for said child
<bmonty> he is sitting on my lap trying to type on the keyboard right now
<bmonty> definately a linux hacker in the making :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<havoc> heh, cool :)
<Hobbsee> just make sure he doesnt type the terrible command
<\sh> oh wow...my son phoned me today, he wants a 1300 euro e-guitar and a amplifier which cost more then the guitar ... fun
<bmonty> nice
<sladen> \sh: "want".  joy.
<havoc> ah, kids
<Hobbsee> bleck.  i'll pass.  at least for a long while!
<zakame> cool
<havoc> no kids for the wife and I yet, but enough neices/nephews right now
<sladen> \sh: ask him much he'd be willing to pay if he had to buy it all himself
<\sh> sladen: hehe..he wants it for free..but daddy has to pay somehow
<\sh> and I finally will succeed to buy this thing...it's a fender
<sladen> \sh: is it a one-off that could only be purchased at this point in time;  or will it still be there in 3-6months?
* havoc notes that he and chillywilly live near Les Paul's hometown
<\sh> sladen: the special prise now it's 1100 for the guitar and the amplifier 1200 ... but I can't afford it this month...next month I could buy at least the guitar..*sigh*
<\sh> sladen: but he is good in music at all, he plays piano and guitar
<sladen> and how much more would it be normally?
<\sh> as I said, the guitar 1300 and the amplifier 1.4 or 1.5k
<\sh> forget the piano and guitar lessons which cost me 70 euros each per lesson
<sladen> so is that *both* for 1200, or *both* for 1100+1200=2300 this month?
<sladen> mmm
<\sh> sladen: it's 1100+1200
<highvoltage> 70 euro!? wow that's expensive.
<jsgotangco> it must be a tube amplifier to be that expensive
* highvoltage thought paying R70 for his guitar lessons were a lot
<jsgotangco> transistor amps don't cost like that
<jsgotangco> prolly 100W up
<\sh> highvoltage: 70/8 (or what the rand to the euro is) you won't get it anymore in germany, finally the last 10 years ;)
<\sh> highvoltage: the guitar teacher comes from argentina
<sladen> oooh, 47310 pieces of pita-bread
<\sh> highvoltage: the piano teacher comes from russia...both are outstanding
<highvoltage> \sh: heh. seems like living in a 3rd world country does have its benefits then :)
<jsgotangco> heh
<\sh> highvoltage: hahaha....ZA and 3rd world country, come on
<\sh> highvoltage: when I see the gold sand mountains just a couple of miles away from jo'burg city ...
<\sh> highvoltage: but you are right, just wait 10 years, you will have the same prices ;)
<highvoltage> yeah, .za is strange like that. it's 1st world mixed with 3rd world.
<\sh> highvoltage: did anything changed with the telecom monopoly in ZA?
<highvoltage> nope :(
<highvoltage> we still pay big $$$ for connectivity
<jsgotangco> heh
<jsgotangco> nothing changes
<\sh> highvoltage: yeah, I know :( and air time is much cheaper
* highvoltage nods
<highvoltage> \sh: how are you these days? it sounds like it's going much better. i'm happy for you.
<\sh> uh...I'm totally strange...I never use airtime , just when I'm talking about ZA...in other areas I would talk about prepaid time
<highvoltage> heh. i think the americans also call it airtime.
<sladen> "free minutes" (despite that you paid on a contract for them..."
<havoc> "anytime minutes"
<\sh> highvoltage: well, I'm freelancing, and if everything goes right, I'll have a job in 2 months, with an unlimited contracted etc.
<highvoltage> nice. i want to go just the other way around. go from full time job to freelancing.
<\sh> highvoltage: and the money I earned now, I used to pay my debts
<highvoltage> a full time job is just a bit restrictive for me.
<\sh> highvoltage: next month I'm on the take over road again
<highvoltage> yeah baby!
<highvoltage> that's quite quick.
<highvoltage> last time i had financial problems it took me a long time to recover.
<\sh> highvoltage: well, for me it's just because of the money...earning 33k euro for 66 days after tax is quite good
<\sh> s/66/60/
* jsgotangco is surviving somehow
<highvoltage> geepers, so it is.
<\sh> .oO(for a freelancer)
<\sh> highvoltage: but I would want to work in ZA...
<highvoltage> \sh: yep, in Durban :)
<\sh> highvoltage: I'll take cape town as well :)
<\sh> highvoltage: but durban would be really a surprise
<\sh> highvoltage: but as I said, I finally managed to get my biltong connection up and running
<highvoltage> \sh: perhaps you might want to subscribe to clug-work at http://lists.clug.org.za
<highvoltage> \sh: people post about linux related job openings in CT there
<highvoltage> heh :)
<\sh> highvoltage: friend of mine comes from zimbabwe (white one) but he has relatives in ZA, who are "smuggling" biltong to London, where the sister of my friend is living ... so every four weeks, fresh biltong ;)
<highvoltage> yes, very
<highvoltage> uhm... 'fresh' :)
<zul> whats biltong?
<highvoltage> zul: where do you live?
<jsgotangco> biltong.....
<jsgotangco> yummmm
<jsgotangco> biltong+amarula=bliss
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: you've been to .za?
<jsgotangco> no but i have a good connection
<highvoltage> i like amarula too. even had it with ice cream once :)
<\sh> jsgotangco: please don't mention amarula
<zul> highvoltage: im in canada but lived in keny for a couple of years
<zul> s/keny/kenya/g
<highvoltage> zul: i think in canada/us they call it 'beef jurky' or something (based on what i've seen in a survivor episode)
<jsgotangco> well beef jerky is a bit thinner
<jsgotangco> but the concept is the same
<zul> ah ok
<\sh> highvoltage: but they don't have game
* \sh is getting hungry
<jsgotangco> heh this reminds me of that nasty sabdfl pic endorsing beef jerky
<\sh> jsgotangco: ugh...he is a revolutionist
<\sh> jsgotangco: but I saw this article and the picture as well, when he traveled to ISS
<jsgotangco> yeah
<jsgotangco> haha
* jsgotangco looks for it again
<jsgotangco> "Final Frontier Beef Jerky"
<\sh> link?
<\sh> where was it ?
<jsgotangco> http://www.beefjerky.com/soyuz1.html
<\sh> his eyes says different
<jsgotangco> lol
<\sh> whoever will be in paris, YOU HAVE TO ASK HIM IF IT'S REALLY JUST AS GOOD AS SELF-MADE BILTONG ,)
<zakame> haha
<\sh> I always forget to ask him...
<\sh> join #ubuntu-za-fans
<\sh> to be not OT
<\sh> but it's sunday ;)
<\sh> It's alive #ubuntu-za-fans
<jsgotangco> brb
<havoc> yeah, I can see the problem with packaging zoneminder, and why no one (not even debian) has done it yet
<havoc> plus you kinda need some video hardware to actually test it
<\sh> havoc: what video hardware?
<havoc> \sh: for this: http://www.zoneminder.com/
* \sh listens to "Prince  - Purple Rain"
* _ion listens to "Rain  Purple Prince"
<\sh> oha...I can try to grab for more infos on that piece of software....I have a company
<\sh> which uses this tool
<\sh> (not my company)
<havoc> ah, I like it, but it's a bitch to build
<havoc> the only actual packages are mandriva packages
<havoc> been trying to convert it with alien, not going so well :(
<havoc> I guess I'll go back to trying to build it :(
<\sh> havoc: alien is evil
<havoc> zm is a really cool app though
<\sh> havoc: but read the spec file thoug
<\sh> h
<havoc> spec file?
<\sh> for the mandriva rpm packages :)
<havoc> ah
<havoc> I've just been doing make, fix deps, make clean; make, over and over
<havoc> beena  bad week so far
<havoc> converted 3 machines to ubuntu
<\sh> havoc: really, read the spec file, you get most of the build deps and what they are doing for a clean build..
<havoc> ok
<havoc> fyi: it's built by a zm guy, not mandriva
<havoc> the only official dist of zm is the tarball
<\sh> havoc: doesn't matter but you get the point :)
<havoc> which kinda sucks
<havoc> yes, I get it :)
<\sh> I would have a look myself, but I'm kinda handicaped
<havoc> I got configure to go smoothly, now just hitting a bunch of undefined funcs during make
<\sh> never build a running package while you are drinking beer
<havoc> heheh
<havoc> that's what I was doing last night, until ~1am :)
<\sh> drinking beer or packaging zm? ;)
<havoc> both
<\sh> joy
<havoc> well, building zm, not packaging
<havoc> be doing the same most of the day today too :)
<\sh> T'pau: China in your Hand
<havoc> but 3 ubuntu installs/conversions, one a vaio laptop, one a primary workstation, one a gateway/router/fileserver, and numerous hardware hacks/upgrades/changes
<havoc> what a week :(
<\sh> havoc: you can tell
<havoc> and then fighting w/ ubuntu most of the time
<havoc> I got it beat down now though ;)
<\sh> from monday to wednesday sick and then going to work...
<havoc> :(
<havoc> but these machines will be ubuntu for years now
<havoc> one problem being that the fw box is old, has 4 drives in it, so I have to disconnect one to use a cdrom :(
<\sh> but now it's sunday, and I'm feeling well, so wtf...let put beer into my system
<havoc> mmm, beer :)
<havoc> no ld.so.conf on ubuntu?
<_ion> havoc: Why should there be one?
<tseng> oh no not this again
<tseng> you don't need it
<havoc> forget I asked
* Yagisan wishes he could automate his package maintainence
<_ion> yagisan: uscan, uupdate
<Yagisan> _ion: actually, it's a bit more involved then that. Packages need to be generalised, and made policy compliant.
<Yagisan> _ion: from 12 packages, to 1 package ideally. Then to send a copy to revu. Doubt I could use if for Debian NM
<sivang> re folks
<sivang> I'm trying to use the debootstrap document
<sivang> but have an issue:
<sivang> 1) not a single package other then the base is installable
<sivang> 2) this makes gpg errors ign some of the repos
<sivang> is this known?
<sivang> (I'm setting a dapper chroot inside a dapper system)
<sivang> following this document:
<sivang> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapChroot
<Kamping_Kaiser> sivang you cant install other packages? what fails? gpg errors?
<sivang> Kamping_Kaiser: I have GPG errors, but any package I try to install just seems to have the sourc but not the binary available
<sivang> Reading package lists... Done
<sivang> Building dependency tree... Done
<sivang> Package gnupg is not available, but is referred to by another package.
<sivang> This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or
<sivang> is only available from another source
<sivang> E: Package gnupg has no installation candidate
<sivang> very weird
<sivang> I never had something like this
<Kamping_Kaiser> hm. niether (but i havent followed the wiki for a while).
<Kamping_Kaiser> have you check your sources list and re updated?
<sivang> Kamping_Kaiser: yep, they're all gold
<Kamping_Kaiser> hm
<Kamping_Kaiser> have you tried a second mirror?
<sivang> mirror is working with the non chroot system
<sivang> should work with the chroot just the same
<Kamping_Kaiser> yeh, thats true :/
* Kamping_Kaiser has no idea. i havent had issues with my chroots :(
<sivang> thanks anyway :)
<bmonty> anyone gotten nfs4 to work with dapper?
<\sh> bmonty: no just running nfs3
<bmonty> \sh: yeah, I've got nfs3 also
<bmonty> now with gig-e!
<\sh> bmonty: get two of them in bonding mode, if you want a reliable connection to your nfs server
<bmonty> \sh: so far it has been very stable with single cards
<Yagisan> G'day bmonty. didn't get your dcc the other day
<\sh> bmonty: yes, I know but to be sure that it won't fail ever
<bmonty> if my network goes down I'm pretty much hosed...hosts need access to nfs for home dirs and ldap+kerberos for user info
<bmonty> Yagisan: sorry, can you remind me what I was trying to send to you please :)
<\sh> bmonty: so no datacenter ;)
<bmonty> \sh: nope
<bmonty> I don't get paid for reliability...though I have to listen to the wife if I break something
<Yagisan> bmonty: output from "glxinfo -l"
<bmonty> Yagisan: oh yeah, on ATI hardware, right?
<Yagisan> bmonty: yes if possible
<\sh> bmonty: uhhh..which can kill you ;)
<Yagisan> true that. I limit my tinkering to when my wife doesn't need the systems
<\sh> *rotfl* IT specialists and their wifes
<bmonty> Yagisan: it should be trying to send now
<Yagisan> bmonty odd. it's not coming through.
<bmonty> \sh: what *really* pisses her off if when she tells me something is broken, but when I take a look everything is working perfectly
<bmonty> Yagisan: can I email to to you then?
<Yagisan> bmonty: could email it to jamie_jones_au@yahoo.com.au
<\sh> sing "Ubuntu, yes we 've had some fun, yes we had our ups and downs, been down that rocky road...." Huey Lewies And The News "Stuck with You" ;)
<bmonty> Yagisan: sent
<Yagisan> argh. my sed foo was awlful. now to uncripple my package
<Yagisan> bmonty: thanks
<bmonty> can we upload fixes to dapper-updates, or do we need to get permission first?
<\sh> permissions first
<bmonty> is there someplace where the process is described?
<\sh> bmonty: I think there was a document about that..but I can't find it right now
<pmjdebruijn> lo
<pmjdebruijn> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/15558
<pmjdebruijn> hi I'm trying to package some OOo templates of mine
<pmjdebruijn> but dpkg-buildpackage fails, because some filenames have spaces in them... how can I get around this issue? I really _do_ want to keep the spaces...
<TomaszD> why don't you replace them with underscores?
<sladen> pmjdebruijn: do you need to use "quotes" in  debian/rules ?
<pmjdebruijn> TomaszD, well, that means the underscores are displayed in OpenOffice.org, and that just looks plain ugly, and not that user friendly
<pmjdebruijn> sladen, yeah single quotes
<TomaszD> oh, ok
<pmjdebruijn> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/15559
<pmjdebruijn> that's my debian/rules
<sladen> pmjdebruijn: both 'acpi-support' and 'example-content' have filenames with spaces in them inside
<\sh> sladen: we should fix it ;)
<pmjdebruijn> sladen, I'll investigate example-content :) thanks
<sladen> pmjdebruijn: try using 'install' rather than 'dh_install'
<pmjdebruijn> sladen, yeah example-content isn't using dh_install either
<sladen> pmjdebruijn: and/or you probably want somethin that installs the files to  $DESTDIR/usr/lib....
<sladen> not to /usr/lib
<pmjdebruijn> sladen, does $DESTDIR work with dpkg-buildpackage
<Yagisan> someone have a few minutes to go over icons with me ?
<sladen> pmjdebruijn: dpkg-buildpackage just calls  debian/rules *  in the correct order
<\sh> pmjdebruijn: $DESTDIR is something for the upstream source makefile
<Yagisan> I have a .png installed in /usr/share/pixmaps/deng.png yet the .desktop file shows no icon, and the debian menu has a box icon.
<sladen> Yagisan: what are the permiisions on the file?
<Yagisan> sladen: all read
<Yagisan> sladen: specifically -rw-r--r--
<sladen> Yagisan: what's the .desktop file;  and what's the contents of the desktop file?
<pmjdebruijn> \sh, there is no upstream makefile
<\sh> pmjdebruijn: then you need to implement the behaviour by yourself
<Yagisan> sladen: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/15560
<sladen> pmjdebruijn: you want to be installing the files in   debian/pcakgesname/usr/lib/...
<Yagisan> sladen: look correct ?
<pmjdebruijn> sladen, sweet, that works :)
<sladen> Yagisan: mmmm, seems to
<Yagisan> sladen: ok. if it's not me, I don't know what it is then.
<pmjdebruijn> http://www.xs4all.nl/~bruijn9/temp/openoffice.org-humanist-templates_0.3-1_all.deb
<pmjdebruijn> it worked thanks all :)
<kagou> hi
<\sh> ok..guys, going to bed..
<\sh> cu
<pmjdebruijn> thanks again.. bye
<havoc> ok, got zoneminder *mostly* working now
<havoc> had to build ffmpeg from cvs
<havoc> gah, still no go :(
<crimsun_> tseng: is the symptom reproducible if you play them from your IDE({P,S}ATA) HD?
<havoc> heh, zoneminder is already listed in: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Candidates?action=show&redirect=UniverseCandidates
<tseng> crimsun_: will see
<tseng> crimsun_: it used to happen with mythtv playing off the capture card
<tseng> to a ringbuffer
<crimsun_> tseng: ok
<crimsun_> sivang: RE: etherape, it seems to install fine here in a dapper i386 chroot
<crimsun_> sivang: hint, libpcap0.7 is a main package; are your repositories enabled correctly?
<Sp4rKy> hi
<nthdegree_> where's the qt headers again
<jpatrick> libqt3-mt-dev
<nthdegree_> no where they are stored
<nthdegree_> on the filesystem
<crimsun_> http://packages.ubuntu.com/libqt3-mt-dev
<crimsun_> scroll down, click List
<jpatrick>  /usr/share/include/qt3
<nthdegree_> thanks
<ryanakca> ok, I get an error when running dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -sa  on the source of kcontrol obtained threw apt-get source kcontrol. I'm just practicing... but it IS confusing... especially when you can't build the source of a prebuilt package.... http://pastebin.ca/64499
<ryanakca> and I don't think I should have to build a changelog each time I build a package... well a premade package... a new one is fine, but the source of one...
<ryanakca> also, another question, why do I have to run "sudo apt-get build-dep kcontrol" if kcontrol is allready installed? http://pastebin.ca/64502
<crimsun_> ryanakca: build dependencies are /not/ identical to runtime dependencies.
<crimsun_> ryanakca: the tools needed to build an automobile obviously differ from the tools required to drive one
<crimsun_> ryanakca: you need to run dpkg-buildpackage from the root of the extracted source.
<ryanakca> crimsun_: lol, nice analogy... Thanks...
<crimsun_> ryanakca: note that you're one level deeper
<ryanakca> so I have to build kde-base and not kcontrol?
<crimsun_> you're building kdebase, which is the source package
<crimsun_> building the source package generates the binary packages
<ryanakca> kk... just wondering... because debuild runs in kcontrol...
<ryanakca> oh well, thanks :)
<sladen> ryanakca: the tools required to build cars can build lots of different types of car
<crimsun_> that's because debuild is a bit more intelligent about checking where you are in the actual source tree
<ryanakca> lol
<ryanakca> :)
* sladen tends to only use debuild
<crimsun_> same. Makes my life a bit less stressful.
<ryanakca> I think I'll be using debuild too...
<ryanakca> do people still use dh_make?
<crimsun_> sure
<Gloubiboulga> yep, I use it too :)
<ryanakca> does debuild "debianize" the source directory? Or is it just dh_make that does that... I'm trying to piece together information here and there along with the "Debian Net Maintainers' Guide"
<crimsun_> debuild requires infrastructure to be present.
<crimsun_> dh_make can generate that infrastructure.
<crimsun_> if you're finding it all a bit much, I recommend you start with the Packaging Guide available from System> Help
<ryanakca> ??? so debuild requires the DEBIAN/ directory, and its dh_make that creates it. right?
<crimsun_> (and one level deeper, but I appear to have uninstalled yelp, which messes with that)
<crimsun_> ryanakca: dh_make is one method of debianising a pristine source package, yes
<ryanakca> crimsun_: packaging guide isn't in the KDE Help Center... you in GNOME or KDE?
<crimsun_> ryanakca: the former
<ryanakca> lol, that's why :)
<crimsun_> ryanakca: use http://help.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html
<ryanakca> thanks
<nthdegree_> can someone tell me how to use pbuilder in a non-chrooted environment
<crimsun_> nthdegree_: a.k.a. the `normal' usage?
<nthdegree_> iunno it wants debootstrap but i'm using my running system
<Sp4rKy> youpi , my first package seems good (advocated by one MOTU :)
<nthdegree_> mine isn't done yet
<nthdegree_> i need to do pbuilder but it's pissing me off over debootstrap
<crimsun_> nthdegree_: pbuilder is dead easy.
<crimsun_> apt-get install pbuilder && cp /etc/pbuilderrc ~/.pbuilderrc
<nthdegree_> ok i got it going with pbuilder create
<crimsun_> well, you need to change ~/.pbuilderrc first...
<nthdegree_> why?
<crimsun_> specifically, you need to change #COMPONENTS="main restricted universe multiverse" to
<crimsun_> COMPONENTS="main restricted universe"
<nthdegree_> well crimsun_ i did that :)
<crimsun_> ``pbuilder foo.dsc''
<crimsun_> it's pretty straightforward :)
<nthdegree_> yeah I just gotta wait for it to download all this cr@p that I already have lol
<nthdegree_> i made about 5 gpg keys to get everything straight
<nthdegree_> i'm gonna have problems backing the actual one up
<nthdegree_> plus I have to get the key into CentOS, Slackware and Kubuntu i386
<nthdegree_> oh poo
<nthdegree_> still not done my package
<nthdegree_> the rules need altering
<nthdegree_> it's not getting the dependencies i need
<crimsun_> ...rules?
<crimsun_> debian/rules has nothing to do with dependencies. That's debian/control's realm.
<nthdegree_> crimsun_ it isn't downloading the components i need
<nthdegree_>  i need the Qt bits
<crimsun_> to build it?
<nthdegree_> yes
<crimsun_> then fix debian/control:Build-Depends
<nthdegree_> how do i lay that out
<crimsun_> come again?
<nthdegree_> Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Depends},  <--- what do I add to the end lol
<crimsun_> does it build correctly?
<nthdegree_> no it won't even configure
<crimsun_> < crimsun_> then fix debian/control:Build-Depends
<crimsun_> you need at least libqt3-mt-dev
<crimsun_> (possibly libqt3-compat-headers, too)
<nthdegree_> i do, the developer hasn't converted it all yet
<nthdegree_> what do I put for section?
<nthdegree_> it's an internet application
<ryanakca> does debuild use pbuilder as well?
<nthdegree_> no ryanakca
<nthdegree_> you run debuild -S then sudo pbuilder build ../*.dsc
<nthdegree_> that's the standard way anyways
#ubuntu-motu 2007-06-04
<PriceChild> eek forgot to move packaging copyright to bottom but hopefully that doesn't really matter...
<thedonvaughn> any revu admins kindly available?
<LaserJock> what do you need?
<TheMuso_> Hey all.
<LaserJock> morning TheMuso 
<thedonvaughn> LaserJock, remove my account and files that was created yesterday, so that I may re-open it with my correct gnupg key
<LaserJock> thedonvaughn: you've updated the key on Launchpad?
<thedonvaughn> LaserJock, yes
<thedonvaughn> LaserJock, the issue is i was never able to get my password.  I uploaded one package with my old key, and i can not decrypt it because of an error with my elg-e secondary key
<bashelier> hey TheMuso :)
<bashelier> TheMuso: I have a question about network-manager-ovpn
<bashelier> TheMuso: why didn't you add the patch 02_fix_wrong_awk_path.diff in the Debian package ?
<bashelier> TheMuso: oups I'm sorry, you're not the one I was looking for for this package ^^", anyway, I have qestion about adonthell-data
<Adri2000> bug #118508 - TheMuso: I reviewed bashelier's merge of adonthell-data
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118508 in adonthell-data "Please merge adonthell-data 0.3.4.cvs.20050903 from Debian Unstable (main)" [Wishlist,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118508
<Kmos> !factoid
<ubotu> I am ubotu, all-knowing infobot. You can browse my brain at http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl - Usage info: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBots
<Adri2000> TheMuso: and I'm not sure of "Update Italian translation." which you put as a remaining change
<Adri2000> TheMuso: it's not in the previous ubuntu changelog entry, and my guess is that these .po changes come from MoM's output, and that you thought they were real changes
<bashelier> geser, Lutin: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xulrunner/+bug/118500
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118500 in xulrunner "Please merge xulrunner (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Rejected]  
<TheMuso> Adri2000: Yes thats right. I wasn't sure what happened back then, so leaving that out of the new entry is fine.
<pygi> hi hi
<Adri2000> ok, thanks TheMuso. bashelier: so you can fix that
<bashelier> Adri2000: ok
<pochu> Adri2000: would you mind to review 118030 too? :)
<pochu> bug 118030
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118030 in listen "Please merge Listen 0.5-3 from Debian Unstable (main)" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118030
<Adri2000> pochu: #87959 is already closed, so no need to mention it in the remaining changes, otherwise soyuz will try to re-close it :)
<bashelier> Adri2000: done
<pochu> Adri2000: It was for reference. Would "#87959" be OK (instead of "LP: #")
<crimsun> LaserJock: it's dirty, but someone has to do it.  Besides, many of our bug reports come from there (even though they're not reported as bugs...)
<crimsun> I'm probably missing a good 70% of ALSA bugs simply by not reading UF consistently
<LaserJock> crimsun: yeah, that's the bugger of it
<Adri2000> pochu: personally I don't put the bug number at all in the remaining changes. but if you prefer to put it, no problem, I'll keep it with "LP:" (I hope soyuz can handle it :p)
<crimsun> anyhow, back into hell.
<LaserJock> for all the junk and noise, there is a certainly amount of good stuff there
<LaserJock> thedonvaughn: ok, got the keyring synced, what packages did you upload?
<joejaxx> LaserJock: crimsun maybe someone can work out some LP/VBF bridge :P
<thedonvaughn> LaserJock, thanks, i sent you a pm
<LaserJock> joejaxx: yeah, the Forums guys have some proposals on that ;-)
<joejaxx> ;)
<pochu> Adri2000: so do you find it ok? :)
<crimsun> joejaxx: I'm tired of waiting for something to happen, and meanwhile, hundreds of potential bug reports are being lost in the cracks.  This reflects poorly on my work, on Ubuntu and its derivatives, and generally, I just don't have time for this mess.
<joejaxx> crimsun: yeah :\
<joejaxx> crimsun: maybe UF should point people to launchpad
<LaserJock> well, they've added some LP linkage
<joejaxx> and a FAQ on how to submit a useful bugs
<LaserJock> I think you can link *to* LP from UF
<joejaxx> s/a//g
<LaserJock> I'm pretty sure they already have FAQ/Stickies on that
<Adri2000> pochu: I'll upload it as soon as I've finished with bashelier's merge
<joejaxx> LaserJock: so why are people still submitting bugs on the forums? :\
<joejaxx> "submitting"
<pygi> joejaxx, they'll always do that, you can't stop them
<LaserJock> joejaxx: because people don't read
<LaserJock> the don't know what's a bug and what isn't
<crimsun> that's not necessarily an issue.
<LaserJock> because they would have to leave the forums and sign up on LP
<crimsun> What _is_ an issue is that there is no way for devs to cull this information from UF.
<LaserJock> because they want a quick solution to their problem and not run around LP
<joejaxx> i am surprised more people have not been using answers.lp
<LaserJock> crimsun: yes, I agree
<LaserJock> joejaxx: they won't use what they don't know about
<joejaxx> LaserJock: true
<joejaxx> maybe there needs to be a forum announcement
<crimsun> I agree that a user shouldn't _have_ to use launchpad
<crimsun> I do not agree that there is not _employed_ Canonical structure in place to make it happen
<PriceChild> Hey crimsun, upstream fixed the copyright and wondered whether http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5358 is good for an advocation yet? :)
<crimsun> We simply cannot expect anyone - users, maintainers, developers, whatever - to read _everything_ before asking for help
<crimsun> And likewise, those of us hacking upstream and downstream don't have resources to ferret out all these posts
<PriceChild> joejaxx, whenever i see someone reporting a bug on the forum I point them towards launchpad... but I don't see everythign and it just needs more people pointing the others :)
<joejaxx> PriceChild: :)
<crimsun> PriceChild: I'm not even close to finishing my Forum stomp, sorry.  Perhaps in a few hours if someone else hasn't stepped up.
<PriceChild> Haha :) I'm off to bed soon so I won't notice :P
<crimsun> 28124 posts?  Right.
<crimsun> And this is just Hardware & Laptops.  :(
<joejaxx> crimsun: do you think some sort of extended search engine would help?
<joejaxx> have an external search engine spider the forums
<joejaxx> or certain parts
<crimsun> joejaxx: that would still require someone to _search_, which may be useful for new users but certainly doesn't assist a resource-starved dev
<joejaxx> crimsun: true
<joejaxx> so we want the information to be pre-presented
<joejaxx> in some sort of organized fashion
<crimsun> think about it: users and devs are identical.  We all want information at our fingertips.  The difference is that the latter wants pertinent information to resolve the former's symptoms.
<joejaxx> yeah
<Plug> A new version of network-manager-pptp, which closes lots of bugs, including a bit AMD64 crasher, is available for revu: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5361
<Plug> It's been tested by people on LP bugs and received good feedback.
<LaserJock> crimsun: yeah, I just don't know really how you do much about that
<LaserJock> in a concrete sense
<crimsun> Plug: remember to mention the debian/control change.
<Plug> as a changelog entry?
<crimsun> yes.
<crimsun> also, update COPYING in the root of the extracted source package.  The FSF address is outdated.
<Plug> I've been prompted about that by lintian before.  Has it changed again more recently than feisty's release?
<nixternal> crimsun: mind taking a look at bug 118517 when you get a chance?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118517 in plucker "[Gutsy Merge]  Please merge plucker (1.8-21ubuntu1) from Debian Unstable (main)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118517
<crimsun> Plug: no, but the version distributed in the source package still uses the obsolete one
<Adri2000> pochu: what about the change "Don't modify listen.py's hashbang (it's not there anymore because of 07_listen.py.patch)" ? I don't see it in debian, is it not needed anymore?
<Plug> crimsun: right.  I wonder why lintian didn't tell me this time. 
<Plug> Is that something that I should fix in the orig.tar.gz, or as a dpatch?
<Adri2000> pochu: ok, it has been done in debian, but it's not explicitly written in the changelog
<crimsun> Plug: just fix it in the extracted source so it'll appear in the diff.gz
<crimsun> Plug: oh wait, is this a new upstream version?  Then yes, fix it in the orig.tar.gz.
<crimsun> Sorry about the confusion.
<crimsun> yay, page 4 of 1407
<Adri2000> pochu: listen uploaded
<crimsun> god, have they _still_ not fixed plucker?
<nixternal> crimsun: I am working on that
<crimsun> no, I'm referring to the patch
<nixternal> there is no more plucker development sadly, unless they are doing it underground
<nixternal> well, I am redoing a SVN patched version of plucker that will probably be Ubuntu only as I can get the Debian maintainer in on it 100% yet
<nixternal> I have a library I am trying to get sponsored now in Debian that will allow us to use the patched plucker in the svn snapshot
<crimsun> ok, so what do you want me to do with 118517?
<nixternal> I guess merge it for the time being to close it in MoM and DaD, that way there nobody else goes messing with it I guess
<crimsun> ok, please reroll the debdiff (adhere to DebianMaintainerField)
<nixternal> we are back to that now...last I was told not to and now I am being told to do so. :)
<nixternal> I will reroll it really quick
<crimsun> ....who told you not to?
<nixternal> sorry, I partake in the "no snitching law" :p
<nixternal> in other words, I don't remember
<nixternal> I have an idea, but I can't remember 100%
<crimsun> ok, well remember that if we modify anything in the Debian source package, then we adhere to DebianMaintainerField.  This includes simple rebuilds.
<crimsun> The only exception if is the Maintainer field already contains an @ubuntu.com
<nixternal> roger that
<crimsun> right, is if ^.
<Adri2000> crimsun: do we have to adther to DebianMaintainerField when uploading a build1 version?
<Adri2000> adhere*
<nixternal> crimsun: do I add the XSBC-Original-Maintainer or remove the original maintainer totally?
<crimsun> nixternal: add & change.
<crimsun> Adri2000: it's a good idea to change it (as stated above).
<Plug> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5363
<pochu> Adri2000: thanks!
<Adri2000> pochu: np, thanks for your work on this package :)
<nixternal> crimsun: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/7935687/plucker_1.8-21ubuntu1.debdiff
<crimsun> nixternal: please note the debian/control change in debian/changelog
<nixternal> crimsun: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/7935695/plucker_1.8-21ubuntu1.debdiff
<nixternal> thank you :)
<crimsun> done, please follow up.
<PriceChild> persia, Woo thanks for advocation :)
<nixternal> I am building a new package, and it is one that requires the following commands in order to install via tarball
<nixternal> make -f Makefile.dist && ./configure --prefix=`kde-config --prefix` && make && sudo make install
<nixternal> how would you go about doing a rules file for that there? would you recommend debhelper or cdbs for it?
<persia> nixternal: If you're using cdbs, add make -f Makefile.dist to your makebuilddir/foo:: rule.  If using debhelper, just put it before ./configure in your configure: rule.
<LaserJock> persia: question about ggobi, why did you convert the .png to .xpm?
<LaserJock> persia: well, I guess you maybe didn't do the actual change
<persia> LaserJock: I didn't actually change it, but my recommendation is to include both .xpm and .png to support Debian menu files (eventually).
<LaserJock> seems odd
<LaserJock> I'd just install the .png and be done with it
<LaserJock> anyway, I just saw it go by on ubuntu-science so I thought I'd ask
<persia> LaserJock: If you do that, and someone creates a Debian menu file, it won't show up, as the Debian menu system requires .xpm format for images.  I remember something about discussion to change that, but I don't know that it happened.
<TheMuso> c
<TheMuso> ugh
<LaserJock> persia: sure but I don't know why Ubuntu should carry a diff for Debian menus :-)
<LaserJock> Debian shouldn't even be using Debian menus ;-)
<persia> LaserJock: Yeah, well.  I'm going to disagree with you formally for policy reasons, but I completely agree with the reasons for your claim :)
<LaserJock> hehe
<nixternal> for copyright, using the persons IRC nick isn't appropriate correct?
<nixternal> I don't know wtf people can just put their damn names and email addresses in copyright properly
<PriceChild> Wahey thanks crimsun!!! :D
<LaserJock> nixternal:  OMG, SPAM!
<nixternal> right
<nixternal> you know what, this is a great app too...this dude needs to be smacked for his noobish ways though
<LaserJock> or is that OMG, mechanically separated animal byproducts
<persia> nixternal: There are special exceptions to allow pseudonyms in copyright, but it has to be a registered pseudonym (with the appropriate authority granting the copyright).
<nixternal> persia: this person has put their online nick in every header for the source
<nixternal> and uses a freakin' link to a web form contact page
<persia> nixternal: If they haven't registered their online nick as a pseudonym with their local government office, that's just wrong.
<nixternal> persia: people actually do that? if they do, then they are wrong as well ;p
<nixternal> haha, I am going tomorrow and registering my nick
<nixternal> muhehe
<LaserJock> nixternal: registering Mr. Vista?
<nixternal> heh, if you go to the apps website, he puts out everyones name who contributed and their email address, yet he doesn't provide his info
<nixternal> LaserJock: ..*#*#$($!)*)$&@#)*$#_@*$*_%&)#*)#__@#+($*_%#*)#$
<nixternal> I think that qualifies for hell just having that though ;)
<LaserJock> wow, that's "swearing ... Chicago style"
<nixternal> hahahaha
<nixternal> if this guy has KDE SVN access, he can only hide so much...muhehehe
<nixternal> thank god kde svn is so slow right now
<nixternal> 2 people in Ubuntu Chicago with Dell 1501s, DEAD, 3 people in my LUG with 1501s, DEAD. That is 5, count them 5, Dell 1501 series laptops dead within the past month or so
<ramatieg> Is there an easy way to statically link only some libraries?
<crimsun> nixternal: so what are you saying about Vista?
<crimsun> Vista kills people?
<nixternal> yes
<nixternal> it is like cigarettes
<nixternal> now we just need to get more people to start sueing
<crimsun> neat, so if I get all these Forum users to use Vista...
<LaserJock> crimsun: nixternal likes the rush of russian roulette/Vista
<crimsun> must be a Chicago thing
<LaserJock> must be
<nixternal> you know, I could go with XP or 2000, but vista? hell man, you might as well tell people I am the purple teletubby
* LaserJock thinks that would be a good bog post
<crimsun> we already knew that.  You have a reddish purse emblazoned with the Microsoft logo.
<nixternal> I have tried Vista 1 time, at Best buy or Circuit city...I have watched it break though on other people's machines
* Kioshen tells everyone that nixternal is the purple teletubby
<nixternal> gah!@!#
<Kioshen> :)
* nixternal fires up his mIRC scipts
<nixternal> teehee
* Kioshen hides
<nixternal> hahahaha
<nixternal> oh wait, BitchX has the /f#@#em script
* Kioshen prepares his poking device just in case
<nixternal> but I don't have powah here
<DarkSun88> Night.
<ryanakca> nixternal: what happened to irssi? eh?? eh???
<nixternal> heh, that is all I use
<ryanakca> lol
<nixternal> 19:22:34 Irssi: Client: irssi 0.8.11 (20070425 1813)  
<ryanakca> mIRC scripts in irssi?
<nixternal> I am afraid to use Konversation, seeing as Kubuntu does it all wrong ;p
<nixternal> and you know I am poking fun at recent events with that I am sure
<ryanakca> Konversation hates me :S
<nixternal> heh, and so do the devs ;p
<nixternal> hahahahah
* nixternal stops
<nixternal> where is jucato when you need an answer to anything?
<ryanakca> I get disconnected once, and then I get reconnected 25 times in a span of 3 minutes, with "Excess Flood" as the quit message
<LaserJock> I like konversation
<ryanakca> LaserJock: I did too
<LaserJock> but tend to use xchat/irssi more since I'm in gnome
<ryanakca> yeah
<ryanakca> irssi runs on my server, and I can get to it from anywhere
<ryanakca> offtopic-ish question:
<ryanakca> CMake Error: Could NOT find QtCore. Check /home/kde-devel/kde/build/soprano/CMakeFiles/CMakeError.log for more details.
<ryanakca> when trying to build soprano, as per http://techbase.kde.org/Getting_Started/Build/KDE4#Soprano
<ryanakca> any idea?
<crimsun> finally on page 6 of 1407. :(
<LaserJock> wow
<TheMuso> crimsun: Ok to take qjackctl?
<ryanakca> crimsun: for?
<crimsun> TheMuso: all yours.
<TheMuso> crimsun: Thanks.
<LaserJock> crimsun:  you must be going pretty thoroughly
<crimsun> TheMuso: keep in mind the md5sum mismatch, so you'll need to manually apply the Debian diff.gz against our orig.tar.gz.
<persia> TheMuso: about 8 hours ago, DarkSun88 was looking at whether the new upstream version closed a couple more LP bugs.  I thought there would be another debdiff (and completely failed to leave a comment).
<TheMuso> Right.
<crimsun> LaserJock: well, yes.  What's the alternative? :)
<TheMuso> persia: I'll keep my eye out then.
<crimsun> ryanakca: trawling the Forums for audio "bug reports".
<persia> TheMuso: I don't think the merge changes - just whether the LP bugs are closed automatically (if you want better freebob or just to clear the queue).
<ryanakca> crimsun: oh, fun
<LaserJock> crimsun: skimming I guess
<TheMuso> persia: Right.
<crimsun> LaserJock: not an option.
<crimsun> imagine if your kernel simply skimmed your hardware.
<crimsun> "Oh, that's unimportant."
<LaserJock> I thought that's what it did ;-)
<StevenK> "What's that? Oh, it's a video card. I don't care."
<crimsun> actually, that sounds like a really interesting DoS. Hmm.
<TheMuso> crimsun: I take it by MD5sum mismatch you are rerfrering to .orig.tar.gz?
<crimsun> TheMuso: yep.
<TheMuso> Ok.
<TheMuso> hmm ok. Looks like a merge request was filed.
<ryanakca> umm. can anybody open kdiff3 foo.BASE foo.OTHER foo.THIS   and then scroll up and down with the middle scrollwheel? I'm getting low-pitch static like noise out of my speakers, only when I scroll in that app.
<crimsun> um...
<crimsun> so what are you really saying?
<persia> ryanakca: That's not a kdiff issue - it's related to the video card and sound card.  Try wrapping your sound card in a faraday cage.
<crimsun> are you saying that opening multiple files with kdiff3 results in non-working scrolling or that attempting to use the scroll wheel exposes pci bus noise?
<ryanakca> crimsun: lost me :)
<crimsun> that's precisely what I said, too.
<crimsun> I have no idea what you are trying to say.
<ryanakca> crimsun: the latter I guess
<crimsun> it's most probable that you have a lower quality motherboard.
<crimsun> if it truly bothers you, use a USB audio device, or puncture your eardrums.
<ryanakca> crimsun: I'll take puncturing my eardrums :)
<ryanakca> crimsun: just thought it was a bit odd, but, nevermind
<nixternal> what can I do about this package? the author only wants to give out his nick and a form to email him?
* nixternal thinks that I will deny the bug requesting packaging if he doesn't want to play nice
<persia> nixternal: You might be able to find a useful cluebat in the debian-legal archives, if you really want the package.
<nixternal> I have been searching that for the past 30 minutes
<nixternal> I am back in 2006, gotta few years to go yet :)
<crimsun> combine google with waybackmachine
<jmg> doesnt google sponsor archive.org?
<crimsun> page 9!
<crimsun> ok, overdosed on the Forums for now.
<nixternal> heh, I found my first company I worked for after the military on wayback...pretty cool
<nixternal> so I found the old webpage I did for them, about 9 years ago
<Hobbsee> morning all
<RAOF> Mornin Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> :)
<Hobbsee> hi spam
<jsgotangco> hi!
<jsgotangco> good morning!
<Hobbsee> :)
<nixternal> hiya jsgotangco 
<jsgotangco> hey nixternal how's it going on your side
<nixternal> it's going
<nixternal> how about yourself?
<jsgotangco> not bad will be moving to new place and work in a week so things have been hectic
<nixternal> cool, at least you are going back to work
<jsgotangco> well a month of rest helped
<jsgotangco> also got to sort out a lot of personal ToDos
<jsgotangco> right now I am just grabbing Nexuiz and will be fragging 
<Plug> crimsun: cheers for the upload
<nixternal> well, from what I have found, you can use whatever name you want when copyrighting your material...you can even use Anonymous for a name
<persia> nixternal: It really depends on your jurisdiction.  For US law, see  401.b.3 of http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap4.html.  At least in the US, it is required that one use a "generally known alternative designation", which is usually interpreted to be a properly registered alias.
<nixternal> persia: in the US I can copyright a book under Anonymous or a pseudonym
<nixternal> that is why this is confusing
<nixternal> there are many countries that allow this, and then there are some countries that don't
<nixternal> I found an entire thread on just this in debian-legal from 1998
<ScottK> nixternal: Get your licensing question figured out yet?
<nixternal> nope
<nixternal> can you use apt-cache to search within a license? or any command where I can search for stuff within the debian/copyright? there are a couple of names that are listed and I want to see if I can find them
<ScottK> grep?
<nixternal> how would I use grep to go through the repos and find a name?
<nixternal> man, and don't tell me to bash it :)
<persia> nixternal: Which thread?  I've just skimmed all the 1998 archives, and I'm not seeing it.
<nixternal> sorry..hehe 2003
<nixternal> site: works great in google :)
<nixternal> http://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2003/10/msg00204.html
<nixternal> there is the start of it..that is the most confusing and uneducated thread I have ever read
<nixternal> it is nothing more than a bunch of he-said, she-said
* ScottK would suggest ask Tollef.  He'll (or Pitti) have to accept it or not in the end.
<nixternal> heh, the greatness of a phone call to a lawyer
<nixternal> he just told me I could copyright any material as "Jesus Christ" if I wanted to
<nixternal> and to think, copyright lawyers answer the phone at 9:30pm on a sunday evening
<nixternal> if I was to sue, I would have to come forward and prove that I am "Jesus Christ" though
<kenro> Oh it's good to be back home.
<kenro> On Freenode...
<nixternal> heh, did you click your heals together a few times first?
<nixternal> now place like freenode
<nixternal> now place like freenode
<nixternal> jeesh, I can spell
<kenro> Fayd knot
<nixternal> heh
<persia> nixternal: I agree with ScottK: you should ask an archive admin.  From my reading, I believe that copyright under pseudonym is OK, so long as it can later be shown that the pseudonym uniquely identifies an entity (person or corporation), but that anonymous copyright does not restrict rights in any way (is indistinguishable from public domain).  Regarding copyright to Jesus Christ, that's just an assignment of copyright: you cannot later assert re
<persia> Grr.   "Regarding copyright to Jesus Christ, that's just an assignment of copyright: you cannot later assert restrictions (e.g. GPL) unless these are agreed by the assignee."
<kenro> I pirated time from churches, hotels, even Fedex/Kinkos.
<nixternal> are there any archive admins online right now?
<kenro> persia, why would someone waste time to get anonymous patent?
<nixternal> kenro: don't get me started on that one ;p
<nixternal> I am dealin with a package that is anonymous in (c) holding
<persia> kenro: My claim is that an anonymous copyright doesn't mean anything.  I suspect the same applies to patents, but as there is no automatic grant of patent, I suspect that pseudonymous patents are the closest one could ever achieve.
<nixternal> I just asking Mith in ubuntu-devel, I am sure he is sleeping where ever in the world he is right now
<kenro> So (one) might seek to garauntee that no other should use said * to make money...
<kenro> forget it, I won't get you started...
<Hobbsee> nixternal: yes, and norway
<nixternal> oh ya, definitely sleeping
<kenro> When's the Gibbon coming?
<nixternal> October
<kenro> Well, I hope it's safe to use early, coz I just spent 35 dollars on an install CD that's 3 releases old.
<nixternal> http://tinyurl.com/2u69f4
<nixternal> cool
<kenro> nixternal:  think that's tiny, I got the world's shortest poem. I'm publishing it tonoght public domain.
<kenro> LOOK   See Me.
<persia> nixternal: At least in AU, http://www.copyright.org.au/publications/G024.pdf seems to indicate that the copyright holder must be able to assert rights in order to grant a license (e.g. GPL).  Otherwise, the work is protected by normal copyright (so assigning copyright to "Jesus Christ" means you cannot then GPL the software).
<kenro> persia:  Can I GPL my poem?
<Hobbsee> nixternal: FWIW, usually a person will require being in the web of trust for uploading things - which requires that they've shown a person in the web of trust their ID which matches their key.
<persia> kenro: If you can demonstrate you can assert copyright, yes.
<Hobbsee> but copyright is likely different
<kenro> persia:  I just released it to pubdom...
<nixternal> there are packages in Debian with
<nixternal> Upstream Author: Money <monty@xiph.org>
<nixternal> err
<nixternal> s/Money/Monty
<nixternal> heh. the vorbis stuff as a matter of fact is like that
<nixternal> http://svn.xiph.org/trunk/cdparanoia/debian/copyright
<persia> nixternal: That's a pseudonym which can be disambiguated by running `whois xiph.org`.  That's sufficient to meet "generally known".
<nixternal> interesting
<nixternal> well I have an email address for this other person
<nixternal> well, this same person has a few copyrights in both KDE and possibly Debian
<persia> nixternal: If you can (relatively) easily get sufficient information to contact the person to discuss licensing questions, it may be sufficient.  Getting Monty's physical address is easy, but I don't know about your new package.
<nixternal> ya, I don't know about a physical address
<kenro> Forgive me for the over-the-top counterexample...
<nixternal> well, seeing as he has some library files that are in kde, of which is in Debian...I need to find the packages now
* nixternal puts on his detective gear and gets to work
<nixternal> http://directory.fsf.org/KPlayer.html
<nixternal> there is the FSF "verifying" his license and listing him in the directory
<nixternal> I can put that in the copyright file as backup maybe?
<kenro> I'll be back. Unless I'm Beethoven first.
<Dabian> I have trouble mailing mwolson
<Dabian> I get an error
<nixternal> alrighty then
<crimsun> right, no mention of method or error.
<crimsun> -brilliant-
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> Requires: or Required:
<nixternal> to lazy to google
<nixternal> crimsun: if I am building a package the is a KDE frontend to mplayer, mplayer doesn't go in the build-depends: correct? does it go into depends:
<nixternal> nm, answered my own question
<crimsun> just Depends
<crimsun> unless it's so screwed up that it actually requires mplayer being present to compile...
<nixternal> it doesn't
<arcligh1> I have a quick question about .deb packaging, specifically, how to add manpages for code that doesn't have any in the original source tarball.
<RAOF> You write one :)
<arcligh1> :)
<arcligh1> I used help2man to make minimal man pages.
<RAOF> An example of that is the "specto" source package.
<RAOF> Oooh, that sounds like a good idea. :)
* RAOF didn't know about that.
<arcligh1> I've built my first package but it's from FSF so there are no man pages; I added them, packed everything up, but they're not in the original tarball so I was afraid they'd disappear if anyone regenerated the package.
<RAOF> And you want to know how to get those man pages into the right spots in the final package?
<arcligh1> Precisely.
<crimsun> dh_installman(1)
<crimsun> remember to build
<crimsun> -depend on debhelper
<RAOF> arcligh1: They will (or should) make it into the diff, so your man pages will stay in the source package.
<arcligh1> Let me check what I've built so far...
<arcligh1> FWIW, for as many files as I had to touch, the whole process was far less painful than an equivalent RPM build. A nice surprise.
<arcligh1> Ok, I think I see what's happening.
<arcligh1> I'm building a package for marst, the GNU ALGOL60 -> C translator
<arcligh1> (don't ask...)
<arcligh1> I unpacked it, created the ./debian directory with skeleton files, deleted a bunch and edited the rest
<RAOF> Sounds good so far
<arcligh1> generated the manpages and put them in the original ./docs directory in the unpacked source tree
<RAOF> They should probably be in the debian directory.
<arcligh1> iteratively built the package, ran lintian, and adjusted the ./debian files until lintian came up clean
<RAOF> (Generally, you shouldn't change *anything* outside of the debian directory.  If you need to, it's a good idea to add a patch system to the build)
<arcligh1> Agreed.
<RAOF> Sounds like the package is pretty much ready for review, then?
<arcligh1> I hope so
<arcligh1> It wasn't clear how to format marst.manpages to reference manpages in the ./debian directory
<arcligh1> It just contains doc/macvt.1 and doc/marst.1
<arcligh1> This feels like a dumbly simple question
<RAOF> They'd be "debain/macvt.1" and "debian/marst.1", surely.
* arcligh1 smacks head.
<arcligh1> Duh. :)
<arcligh1> That's disturbingly clear.
<RAOF> As far as I know, all directories in all the files are relative to the top-level source directory.  The debian directory is just another directory :)
<arcligh1> Thanks!
<RAOF> NP.
<arcligh1> I have this strange urge to package up dead languages so it's easy for people to play with them, say in the context of a CS comparative languages class.
* RAOF has never seen one of those.  Sounds kinda cool.
<arcligh1> And a small project like this was perfect for learning how to build .deb packages.
<arcligh1> I'm a sysadmin; my background is in engineering not CS so I'm trying to pick up all the stuff I would've learned without having to get another degree.
<RAOF> Fair enough.
<RAOF> Once you've got some idea of how debhelper works, you can use CDBS, which does almost everything for you :)
<arcligh1> Cool.
<RAOF> It's a bit of arcane magic, though, so it's good to have some idea how it does what it does for when it breaks.
<arcligh1> I figured I'd start simple.
<arcligh1> Now to sort out this bzr thing; I've stuffed the package into my local svn repository so at least it's under some form of version control.
<RAOF> Aaah, sweet bazaar.
<RAOF> Sweet, sweet distributed version control.
<arcligh1> "B-but where does the canonical source *live*? ... Brain ... melting ..."
<arcligh1> :)
<imbrandon> qemubuilder .... hrm
<imbrandon> quiet night
* StevenK sends around a few boys to drive-by imbrandon's house.
<imbrandon> heh good, i'm at work, hopefully they will be gone when i get there
<nixternal> I have just finished watching the sopranos for the 3rd time tonight...drive-by sounds harmless now
<imbrandon> heh
<nixternal> 1 more episode to go
<nixternal> man, I can't wait until next Sunday
<highvoltage> nixternal: I love it when I feel that way about a series :)
<nixternal> man...I don't think I have ever watched a show that has kept me on the edge so much
<nixternal> not even M.A.S.H. did that for me
<crimsun> hmm, www.ubuntuwire.com doesn't lead to the "community buildds" anymore?
<crimsun> 8 K/s on tiber.
<dholbach> good morning
<bashelier> hey dholbach :)
<bashelier> dholbach: could I show you one merge ore two ?
<dholbach> hey bashelier
<crimsun> dholbach: when you have time, please eyeball http://adhd.irule.net/~crimsun/rhythmbox_0.11.0-0ubuntu3.debdiff . I've tested the upgrade path and verified it resolves the issue.
<dholbach> bashelier: can you post links in here for somebody to review them and if you don't get answers drop me a mail about it?
<bashelier> dholbach: no problem, thanks :)
<dholbach> thanks bashelier
<bashelier> here are two merge requests, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/inventor/+bug/118608 and, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/erlang/+bug/118604, could someone have a look ? :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118604 in erlang "Please merge erlang (universe) from Debian Unstable (main)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<dholbach> crimsun: looks good
<dholbach> crimsun: thanks for looking into it
<crimsun> dholbach: I have a source package prepared locally and can upload it now.
<dholbach> crimsun: rock on - just upload it
<crimsun> done.
<dholbach> crimsun: not sure about tribe1 freeze though - but in that case it'll be queued anyway
<Fujitsu_> crimsun: Yay! /me builds.
<crimsun> if you want a deb, I pbuilt it earlier
<Fujitsu> Ah, yes please. I'm currently building qgis, so it'd have to wait a couple of hours if I were to build.
<Fujitsu> Found it, thanks.
<crimsun> crimsun@Box.pts/0.~/pbuilder/result sha1sum rhythmbox_0.11.0-0ubuntu3_i386.deb
<crimsun> b2be85b8c4820e38cbb884bd5b98aecf4231d7dd  rhythmbox_0.11.0-0ubuntu3_i386.deb
<Fujitsu> Right.
<Fujitsu> Box. Very creative!
<StevenK> Heh, I was just thinking that.
<StevenK> % hostname 
<StevenK> liquified
<crimsun> I actually had no say in its naming.  It was done by the admin.
<crimsun> the other machine's hostname is "FUN".  Truly creative.
<StevenK> A fun box. Hrm.....
<siretart> crimsun: I see that you're updating pbuilder-gutsy on tiber
<siretart> crimsun: do you notice any problems there?
<pygi> hey siretart ^_^
<siretart> hi pygi 
<crimsun> siretart: I was going to pbuild rhythmbox there, but it was updating much more slowly than usual - on the tune of 8 K/s
<crimsun> other than that, I don't notice anything horrendous
<siretart> crimsun: yes, its awfully slow. I wanted to reboot tiber to boot a 2.6.17 kernel
<siretart> I hope dapper's userspace can handle this
<crimsun> the indicator says ~2.5 minutes of downloading updated packages remaining
<siretart> okay, please ping me when you're done
<Fujitsu> siretart: Userspace shouldn't be a problem, but are you sure it works with the NIC again?
<siretart> I'll reboot tiber than
<crimsun> siretart: sure thing.
* StevenK twitches.
<siretart> Fujitsu: no idea. I hope it does. that's what I want to figure out
<StevenK> Large Ubuntu changes to debian/rules, and the Debian maintainer just went and rewrote it.
<siretart> Fujitsu: if it does come up, I'll upgrade tiber to edgy and then to feisty. and see what gets broken
<Fujitsu> Sounds nice and messy.
<siretart> StevenK: what package? who was it/
<Fujitsu> Mekong is still (semi-)happily running Dapper with a Breezy kernel.
<StevenK> siretart: python-qt4
<siretart> hm. Torsten Marek, never heard of him...
<crimsun> siretart: finished & logged out
* Fujitsu throws some rocks at Rhythmbox. It's still saying things are unknown, when they clearly have correct tags. Debug output doesn't give anything useful, unfortunately.
<crimsun> Fujitsu: hmm, same situation as 0.11.0-0ubuntu2?
<Fujitsu> crimsun: I believe so.
<crimsun> that patch fixed things for me
<Fujitsu> I presumed they were due to that bug, but maybe not.
<siretart> crimsun: thanks, rebooting now
<crimsun> Fujitsu: if you can, try removing your library and reimporting in an attempt to reproduce the symptom
<Fujitsu> crimsun: Done a few times. It seems to only affect some of the files that are mounted on smbfs at the moment.
<Fujitsu> (just tried copying one to another place, and it works)
<crimsun> hmm!
<Fujitsu> They play fine, but their tags aren't read.
<dholbach> ooooh, new canonical job posting: http://www.ubuntu.com/employment#ISVPPS
<crimsun> "Debian developer ideal, but must have some Linux-based packaging experience."
<crimsun> welp, there goes me :-)
* Fujitsu shudders at the realisation that scp is doing remote tab completion.
<sorsis> where could i find more specific information of ubuntu update process?
<imbrandon> sorsis, which update process ?
<sorsis> how updating is done step by step
<sorsis> dep package update
<StevenK> Excellent. I run off to get my dinner, and while I'm gone, the band next door finish up.
<sorsis> i'm tring to make own package repository and update-tool for client so it would be nice if i would know how it works
<joejaxx> StevenK: :P
<sorsis> for example if i have package program in version 0.4, newest is 0.6, but most ubuntu users are allready updated to 0.5 before. what happens?
<joejaxx> it updates to 0.6
<sorsis> does it distribute whole new application package or is there specifically created update packages?
<siretart> sorsis: you understand how apt works?
<sorsis> somewhat
<siretart> perhaps you should read http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/apt-howto/index.en.html
<sorsis> is there package which updates from 0.4 to 0.6, does it have to install first update to 0.5 and then to 0.6 or does it do more like clean install of package 0.6
<siretart> it will always try to directly update to the 'best' package
<siretart> with 'best' being the highest version available in most cases 
<bashelier> doko: ping
<sorsis> but is there packages which work as update packages or is it allways the normal newest application.dep which is found from repository?
<doko> bashelier: just ask
<siretart> sorsis: I don't understand your question
<siretart> sorsis: I think you should really read the apt-howto 
<bashelier> doko: ok sorry, I've just succesfully build gdc with gcc-4.1, but with --disbale-shared, as indicated on upstream website, could you tell me how is it a problem really ?
<bashelier> how much*
<doko> bashelier: the only thing I can see: if we teach the gcc driver to know about the D language, then we might get into problems; as long as you use gdc as the compiler driver, things should work well
<\sh> moins
<\sh> who wants to take care about wine in ubuntu?
<sorsis> siretart: lets say that you have installed application-0.4. your neighbour has installed 0.5. repository provides version 0.6. do both ger same package while they do upgrade, or do both get different package?
<bashelier> \sh: me :)
<\sh> bashelier, do you have upload rights or a sponsor which is in ubuntu-wine team?
<siretart> sorsis: if they are both using the same repository, both will get 0.6 on the next upgrade
<\sh> (no motu is in ubuntu-wine btw...pls support the ubuntu-wine team, thx=
<bashelier> doko: then, why not to build gdc only from the gdc source tarball, and --disable-shared if with_d = yes ?
<\sh> bashelier, gdc just compiles with a complete gnu-c source tree
<sorsis> siretart: but is it same package? i understand that both upgrade to 0.6 but is it the same package they get?
<sorsis> siretart: bit by bit
<siretart> sorsis: err, apt 'just' downloads packages from the archive. it calls dpkg for the actual upgrade. does this help you?
<bashelier> \sh: I'm in contact with yuriy in the ubuntu-wine team
<sorsis> siretart: do people who don't have program installed at all use the same package to get fresh installment
<\sh> bashelier, you need at least a sponsor from motu...
<sorsis> so dpkg handles the update process more specifically
<sorsis> siretart: yes that helps. thank you.
<\sh> bashelier, take the new packages from archive.linux-server.org, i packaged them last saturday
<bashelier> \sh: no problem for that, can ask several frenchs MOTUs
<\sh> bashelier, tonio or raphink are good candidates ;)
<raphink> what for?
<\sh> raphink, sponosring wine uploads :)
<raphink> I'm not a big alcohol fan ;)
<bashelier> ^^"
<raphink> (nor a win32 fan either)
<raphink> but I can sponsor uploads if necessary
<bashelier> \sh: dgeting it
<raphink> just send me the debdiff with an explanation if necessary
<bashelier> raphink: ok, thanks :)
<\sh> raphink, wine has only new upstream versions ;) so -S -sa and a debdiff is not a good solution :)
<raphink> ah it's a new upstream
<raphink> well then send the package by email or put it somewhere 
<bashelier> raphink: I'm rather going to put it somewere, is is 15M size
<raphink> ok then
<raphink> you can put it on REVU oetherwise
<\sh> bashelier, push it to a bugreport :)
<bashelier> \sh: ok :)
<doko> bashelier: I do not want to build it from the gcc-4.1 source; but it might be worth to make the gcc driver be knowledgable about D sources (like done for java and ada sources)
<\sh> bashelier, have fun with wine :)
<\sh> bashelier, and please talk to scott ritchie, who is doing the winehq packages...
* \sh leaves
<bashelier> \sh: I will, thanks for everything :)
<bashelier> have a nice day \sh 
<bashelier> doko: so what do you suggest finally ?
<doko> bashelier: nothing else than suggested previously =) add the D tar.gz to the gdc source package, don't modify the driver (yet).
<bashelier> doko: ok, I'll send you the final debdiff against gcc-4.1 right after my exams :)
<doko> bashelier: cool
<bashelier> raphink: ping
<bashelier> raphink: here is the bug, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wine/+bug/118616, should I add a changelog entry to mention I'm going to maint it in ubuntu ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118616 in wine "Please upload wine 0.9.38" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<svschwartz> nice bug ))
<persia> bashelier: To make reviewing easy, consider attaching an interdiff of the debian/ directory (so the reviewer can see how the packaging changed).
<bashelier> persia: as \sh just said, this is just a new upstream release :)
<persia> bashelier: Right.  That makes for a small interdiff :)
<bashelier> persia: okay, hold on a second :)
<bashelier> persia: the "small" interdiff is 12216 lines long ^^"
<johnnybuoy> hi all!
<persia> bashelier: That's the output of `interdiff -z packagename_version-revision.diff.gz packagename_newversion-newrevision.diff.gz > packagename_version-newrevision.interdiff`?
<johnnybuoy> is there someone familiar with mono here?
<johnnybuoy> I'm trying to get banter compiled, but I have problems with the mono deps
<johnnybuoy> it seems ubuntu has a lot of mono libs missing yet
<bashelier> persia:  wc -l wine_0.9.38-0ubuntu1.interdiff
<bashelier> 12216 wine_0.9.38-0ubuntu1.interdiff
<johnnybuoy> so I'm looking for gnome-keyring-sharp, but it seems it's not in gutsy (libgnome-keyring-cil)
<johnnybuoy> and the feisty version doesn't work
<StevenK> One conflict fixed for python-qt4. Only three more to go.
<persia> bashelier: That's a huge amount!  Either lots of patches were accepted upstream (and removed), or lots of patches were added to the new upstream.  Either way, it's probably good to try to explain it.
<bashelier> johnnybuoy: if the API of mono-libs are not considered as "stable" yet, they can't be put in the GAC, so it's must be a path problem,see:
<bashelier> apt-cache madison libgnome-keyring-cil
<bashelier> libgnome-keyring-cil |    0.0.1-8 | http://archive.ubuntu.com feisty/universe Packages
<bashelier> gnome-keyring-sharp |    0.0.1-8 | http://archive.ubuntu.com feisty/universe Sources
<bashelier> gnome-keyring-sharp |    0.0.1-7 | http://archive.ubuntu.com dapper/universe Sources
<bashelier> gnome-keyring-sharp |    0.0.1-8 | http://archive.ubuntu.com edgy/universe Sources
<johnnybuoy> ah, okay, I'll try the source deb
<Fujitsu> !info libgnome-keyring-cil gutsy
<ubotu> Package libgnome-keyring-cil does not exist in gutsy
<johnnybuoy> nope
<johnnybuoy> it's not in gutsy
<bashelier> persia: ok then, don't have time to do it now, but is it really necessary ? this version have been packaged by \sh, I'm just asking for upload, thing that he would have done if...
<Fujitsu> `(From Debian) RoM; obsolete' is the reason for removal.
<johnnybuoy> Fujitsu, obsolete?
<persia> bashelier: It's not a requirement: it just makes it easier for the reviewer when the packaging changes are already explained.
<Fujitsu> johnnybuoy: Right. Debian bug #392427
<bashelier> persia: ok, I'll try to do that tonight, thanks
<ubotu> Debian bug 392427 in ftp.debian.org "RM: gnome-keyring-sharp -- obsolete" [Normal,Closed]  http://bugs.debian.org/392427
* bashelier away
<johnnybuoy> strange
<johnnybuoy> why does banter depend on it then?
<Fujitsu> Because mono is strange.
<Fujitsu> !find gnome-keyring-sharp gutsy
<ubotu> Package/file gnome-keyring-sharp does not exist in gutsy
<Fujitsu> It'd be nice to know why it was obsolete...
<persia> Fujitsu: http://russell.rucus.net/2005/gnome-keyring-sharp/
<Fujitsu> persia: Ah, thanks.
<Fujitsu> Maintainers probably should give a reason when requesting removals.
<raphink> bashelier: how come the changelog was made by \sh?
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
<siretart> raphink: the problem with wine isn't that it is maintained by MOTU team, but that it isn't maintained at all :(
<siretart> raphink: in the past, \sh was in effect the only one updating the package to the latest version. but that's all
<raphink> right
<raphink> although it's a popular package
<siretart> that's the problem with it
<raphink> it's good if bashelier wants to take that responsability
<siretart> it has a very high userbase, but nobody is interested in working on it :(
<raphink> very understandably
<raphink> ;)
<siretart> e.g.: if the apport crash reports are not usable for wine, we should add an apport hook to disable them
<raphink> I mean I wouldn't like to spend the little time I have on a win32-centered project
<raphink> siretart: I see
<siretart> there are many more problems with it
<bashelier> raphink: I do :)
<raphink> which is good bashelier
<siretart> bashelier: you want to work on wine?
<raphink> yes siretart, he wants to support wine
<siretart> great news
<raphink> yep
<siretart> bashelier: are you already in 'ubuntu-wine'?
<highvoltage> I have to package a win32 product suite for a client. it would also be nice if there were guidelines on how windows software should be packaged.
<raphink> do you feel at ease with packaging bashelier? I see yo uhave a few packages in gutsy already
<raphink> very good point highvoltage
<raphink> I've seen horrid packages for win32 apps lately
<pygi> highvoltage, there are guidelines
<pygi> highvoltage, wine-doors stuff
<pygi> ergh, why is LP timing out o.O
<siretart> raphink: my problem is that I don't have enough time and energy left to really care about wine as well
<highvoltage> pygi: aah
<siretart> raphink: I notice that the wine package bugs are growing over, and the package hasn't seen real maintainance work besides updating
<siretart> and the updates between releases are nearly always looking like massive rewrites
<pygi> highvoltage, what? :)
<highvoltage> pygi: about the guidelines
<siretart> ideally, we'd have a ubuntu-wine team, which tracks upstream, discusses with them, cherry-picks patches during freeze times, and triages all wine bugs
<pygi> did you saw those guidelines highvoltage ? :)
<highvoltage> pygi: no. where are they?
<siretart> if bashelier is willing to work on that, you have my full support!
<pygi> I could even package that stuff for you if you need it
<pygi> sec
<pygi> highvoltage, http://www.wine-doors.org/trac/wiki/HowToApplicationPack
<highvoltage> pygi: but that doesn't use debian packages, does it?
<pygi> highvoltage, nop
<pygi> but it does enable you to package/update/whatever windows applications
<highvoltage> pygi: ah, well I mean specifically in context of ubuntu packages
<pygi> oh, sorry then
<bashelier> siretart: ok thanks a lot :)
<siretart> bashelier: as a start, could you please have a look at http://archive.linux-server.org/
<siretart> bashelier: please import them to the ~ubuntu-wine bzr branches on lp
<bashelier> siretart: just have to join the ubuntu-wine team first
<siretart> bashelier: you can prepare the branches in your personal branches first
<bashelier> siretart: ok :)
<imbrandon> i think i might have some time to wine triage later today too possibly
<imbrandon> and yes that apport hook would be nice
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<bashelier> siretart: just pushing now
<RainCT> Hey
<RainCT> do you know when LP will be back?
<persia> RainCT: Hi.  Did you see the upstream comment about desktop-file-utils?
<RainCT> Hi persia. Yes. Do you know where the CVS for desktop-file-utils is?
<persia> RainCT: http://webcvs.freedesktop.org/menus/desktop-file-utils/ or cvs.freedesktop.org module menus/desktop-file-utils.
<RainCT> persia: ah yes just found it
<RainCT> persia: what should I do if that version is updated? reject the bug and open a new one requesting a new package for desktop-file-utils?
<persia> RainCT: You can either reject the bug and make a new one, or add a comment saying that upstream version x.y addresses this issue.  I recommend editing the bug, as that way the current subscribers will continue to see your work on it, and it is less likely to get lost.  Don't forget to update the upstream bug as well, either with a patch if more is required, or to close it if everything is addressed with the rewrite.
<RainCT> persia: okay then I'll update it
<RainCT> persia: it seems everything is ok with the new one
<persia> RainCT: Thank you for chasing this.
<apachelogger> omg
<apachelogger> evil lintian :S
<apachelogger> W: krawlsite: binary-or-shlib-defines-rpath ./usr/bin/krawlsite /usr/lib:/usr/share/qt3/lib
<apachelogger> suggestions what I can do?
<TheMuso> apachelogger: There is a utility that can strip that stuff from binaries.
<TheMuso> apachelogger: Give chrpath a try.
* apachelogger tries
<RainCT> persia: is the tag called 'needs-packaging'?
<RainCT> ah yes found it
<persia> RainCT: Not in this case, as the package already exists.  You just want the "upgrade" tag. "Needs-Packaging" is for a new package, not yet in the archives.
<RainCT> persia: should be tagget 'update' or?
<RainCT> :p
<persia> RainCT: Yes.
<fernando> moin all
<pochu> !tags
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about tags - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<RainCT> persia: ok, I'll try to package it on wednesday. thanks for your help!
<persia> RainCT: That would be great.  Thank you very much.
<dholbach> TheMuso: new lsr - maybe you want a new contributor to do the update? :_)
<TheMuso> dholbach: I don't mind doing it.
<dholbach> alrighty
<RainCT> is there something I can work on from school (aka without linux)?
<persia> RainCT: Translations, bug triage, .desktop files and icons don't need Linux.  Remember to test when you get home before uploading the patches.
<pochu> !tags is We use some common tags for the bugs. Check https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad/Tags to know them.
<Riddell> Nightrose: hi, I hear you're interested in helping with kubuntu packages?
<RainCT> persia: translations isn't possible with my language (catalan), don't ask me why :S. I'm triaging bugs now but I don't think I'm very good in this :p
<StevenK> RainCT: Why not? Because Jordi Mallach has done of all of them?
* persia didn't ask :)
<RainCT> Stevenk: xDD
<RainCT> StevenK: no, I think they are set as suggestions and not used or something strange
<RainCT> well I've to go
<RainCT> bye
<xxxxx1> morning people!
<ScottK> Good morning
<ScottK> nixternal: Re your discussion about who can copyright stuff last night, this message from the clamsmtp author might be of interest http://preview.tinyurl.com/2c4k7l
<Nightrose> Riddell: hi yea thats right
<Riddell> Nightrose: cool, do join us in #kubuntu-devel if you like
<ScottK> bashelier: If you are going to do someone else's merges, please ask first.
<pygi> anyone around? :)
<pygi> pochu, poke! :)
<pygi> (messing with your package, so if you wanna sponsor, I'd be grateful ;))
<pochu> pygi: hi
<pygi> hey ^^ Mind sponsoring an upload for me?
<pochu> Which package?
<pochu> pygi: I don't have upload rights :)
<pygi> pochu, oh! I'll bug someone else then :) Scribes btw  ;)
<pygi> who wanna sponsor a package? raise your hands now :)
<persia> pygi: Is it a new revision, or a new package?  If a new revision, subscribing ubuntu-universe-sponsors should get attention within a day or so (especially for a merge).
<pygi> persia, I know that, but heh :P New revision :)
<pochu> !importance
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about importance - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<pygi> pochu, hehe :)
<pochu> pygi: btw, what are the changes to scribes? My sponsor will upload 0.3.2.6 tonight.
<pygi> pochu, meh, I created a 0.3.2.6 package :p
<pygi> pochu, you should talk to it's authors you know :)
<pygi> but ok, then I can remove my packaging
<pygi> oh well
<pochu> pygi: talk to whom?
<pygi> pochu, authors of scribes ;)
<pochu> I've already done it ;)
<pygi> pochu, meh, didn't meant that
<pygi> I mean you should talk to them all the time :p
<bueroman> 1.2G maemo-sdk-vm.tar.bz2
<bueroman> sorry! wrong channel! :(
<pochu> pygi: oh :)
<PriceChild> persia, pochu I added !tags for you :)
<pochu> PriceChild: thanks a lot :)
<pochu> PriceChild: I have a question, have you added them in all channels, or just in these two?
<PriceChild> all
<pochu> Cool
<persia> PriceChild: Thanks a lot.
<pochu> PriceChild: Maybe you can add !importance to all too. I've miss is here :)
<pochu> !importance
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about importance - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<PriceChild> !importance | pochu 
<ubotu> pochu: You can learn about setting bug importance at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Importance
<pochu> PriceChild: thanks :)
<RainCT> persia: I know you didn't ask but I tell you for the case you have some suggestion.
<RainCT> persia: (btw, say it if I'm too tiresome ;-P)
<persia> RainCT: No worries.  I'll just ignore you if you're too tiresome :)  I've only submitted a couple translations to Rosetta, but my understanding is that you need to be a member of the appropriate translation team to submit final translations, but that suggestions are set for review by the team, and appreciated.
<persia> s/but/and/2
<Hobbsee> hi all!
<xxxxx1> morning hobbsee!
<xxxxx1> core-hobbsee :>
<ScottK> Hello Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> :)
<Hobbsee> :)
<koke_> hi all!
<ScottK> Hello koke_
<highvoltage> I have a makefile that does a         find usr/ -type f >> debian/install
<StevenK> Ewww!
<highvoltage> but the filenames have spaces in, which doesn't seem to work that well
<highvoltage> StevenK: do you have an alternative for me? :)
<StevenK> Yeah. Listing them manually? Like it's going to change every other day.
<highvoltage> StevenK: I need it automated, because the package contains more than 500 little files
<StevenK> highvoltage: And? debian/install can contain wildcards.
<highvoltage> ah ok. so I'll just do the find usr/ -type f then, and put in a * wherever I see a space?
<StevenK> Twitch
<StevenK> Um, don't do that, then?
<highvoltage> StevenK: sorry, I'm not following you
<StevenK> highvoltage: Okay, my point is that the list of files isn't going to change very often. I daresay those 500 small files are spread over like five directories. So you can put debian/usr/lib/* in debian/install
<persia> highvoltage: Why does the makefile modify debian/install?  If it's debian/rules, debian/install should already be populated.  If it's a separate makefile, it would be better to patch it to use a collection (perhaps tracked during the build), and use the local install: rule to put them in $(PREFIX)/usr/lib/
<highvoltage> StevenK: aah, use wildcards like that. I see
<StevenK> highvoltage: If you don't use wildcards, there will be pain. Your pain. :-)
<highvoltage> StevenK, persia: well, this particular package is for a Windows product, so this contains this programs software that will go into the wine "drive_c" directory
<highvoltage> StevenK: heh :)
<highvoltage> what's the point in having an install file anyway? Why not install everything that you have in your package directory?
<StevenK> If they're already under debian/<package> you don't need a .install file
<persia> highvoltage: The debian/install file is to install extra stuff that the upstream makefile failed to install (often used for local things that are stored in debian/).
<highvoltage> perhaps I should do that?
<highvoltage> persia: aaaaah
<highvoltage> StevenK: when you say debian/<package>, does <package> mean the package name as defined in the control/changelog file?
<highvoltage> StevenK: for example, would I put my files under debian/package-name/usr ?
<StevenK> The package name in the changelog is the source package name.
<StevenK> I mean one of the binary packages listed in the control file.
<highvoltage> StevenK: ok
<highvoltage> StevenK: where should I put the files then?
<StevenK> Um, I'd suggest debian/<package>/usr/share/<package>
* highvoltage tries that
<highvoltage> *sigh*. I still end up with a practically empty .deb
<StevenK> highvoltage: You can e-mail a link to the source and I can look when I get to work?
<highvoltage> StevenK: that will be appreciated, thanks
<StevenK> highvoltage: stevenk@u.c
<highvoltage> StevenK: do you have irc access at work?
<StevenK> When I choose to. :-)
<StevenK> highvoltage: It's 12:23am local, so I won't be at work for roughly 8 hours
* StevenK scampers off to bed.
<highvoltage> StevenK: aah, ok. goodnight!
<StevenK> Night!
<Hobbsee> hiya Nightrose 
<Nightrose> hey Hobbsee - cheer from me too for your success - shure a lot of people allready did that ;-)
<Hobbsee> Nightrose: thankyou :)
<Qball> Hobbsee: what did you do
<Hobbsee> Qball: i went to the moon.
<Qball> aah
<Qball> boring
<Hobbsee> Nightrose: what kind of stuff have you looked into packaging so far?
<leonel> good week everyone !
<Nightrose> Hobbsee: unfortunatly nothing so far - right now I'm bussy washing my cloth from linuxtag, getting the room tidy and writing a blogentry about our booth and stuff at linuxtag
<Nightrose> butt I'll do that later
<Nightrose> -t
<Hobbsee> Nightrose: ahh, fun :)
<Hobbsee> nixternal: did you ever get your answer?
<joejaxx> Hello All
<Hobbsee> hi joejaxx 
<joejaxx> :)
<bashelier> siretart: here it is https://code.launchpad.net/~bashelier/wine/winehq-upstream, and I'm now part of the ubuntu-wine team :)
<joejaxx> :)
<nixternal> Hobbsee: get my answer on what
<Hobbsee> nixternal: the copyright for an aliased name
<nixternal> ahh, not yet
<dholbach> anybody interested in updating telepathy-python telepathy-glib and libtelepathy - I'm happy to review and sponsor
<mruiz> :-)
<bashelier> dholbach: what is it ? new upstream release ? merge ?
<dholbach> bashelier: new releases
<bashelier> dholbach: I can do that :)
<dholbach> rock and roll
<dholbach> let me know how it goes
<fernando> bashelier: hi
<fernando> bashelier: let's go to work together on its ?
<bashelier> dholbach: libtelepathy latest revision is -1, is the package synced from debian ?
<dholbach> bashelier: I guess so
<bashelier> dholbach: do you have the upload right on mentors ?
<dholbach> no, I'd upload it to Ubuntu - to Debian, I can't upload
<bashelier> dholbach: if not, I can put it on REVU, upload it in debian with my sponsor and then sync it
<bashelier> fernando: on telepathy ? :)
<siretart> bashelier: err, nice, but how do you intend to use the branch? 
<dholbach> bashelier: as you like it, let me know if there's something to review
<bashelier> dholbach: just have to test build and then I'll put it on revu, hold one 2 minutes ;)
<dholbach> bashelier: take your time
<dholbach> bashelier: coordinate with fernando for the tarballs
<dholbach> bashelier: maybe you can even cross-review
<dholbach> let me know how that goes
<bashelier> dholbach: np
<bashelier> dholbach: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5364
<dholbach> fernando: which updates are you doing?
<fernando> dholbach: python-telepathy together with bashelier 
<bashelier> ^^
<dholbach> super
<dholbach> bashelier: checking it out in a bit
<mruiz> hi all. Someone know if the Uploader field (Debian) in debian/control must me replaced as XBSC-Original-Uploader ? I ask, bacuse https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField is only about Maintainer...
<pochu> mruiz: no, leave the uploader as it is.
<mruiz> thanks pochu 
<nixternal> unless you have ubuntu edits
<pochu> Since it doesn't mean anything in Ubuntu.
<nixternal> pochu: that isn't correct, crimsun pointed me to an email last night
<bashelier> dholbach: ok thanks :)
<mruiz> nixternal, :o
<nixternal> we do use the XBSC-Original-Maintainer: now and use MOTU for the Maintainer...only in Ubuntu edits though
<nixternal> so if your package is something like foo_1.0-1ubuntu1 then it would have the Maintainer set to MOTU
<nixternal> and the orig maintainer set to XSBC-Original-Maintainer
<dqdev> hello all! I have an 'urgent' question
<nixternal> and then make a note in the changelog
<dqdev> after an update of ubuntu, the graphical envirnoment went crazy. BTW I am using ubuntu 7.04 AMD64. Whenever I change desktops, I lose the application-bar (up) or the lower-panel. Any ideas what;s wrong?
<mruiz> nixternal, I did it
<pochu> nixternal: That's what I meant, sorry if I wasn't clear :)
<nixternal> hehe
<mruiz> nixternal: I'm asking about Uploader field ;-)
<nixternal> OH
<nixternal> damnit, I just ran out of breath for a misunderstanding
<nixternal> ;p
<mruiz> hehehehe
<nixternal> ya leave it alone ;)
<nixternal> sorry....
<pochu> nixternal: lol, you confused me :)
<nixternal> pochu: and I confused myself, so somehow I think that makes us even :)
<mruiz> It was my fault :P
<nixternal> I just seen the XSBC thing
<dqdev> and whenever I try to playy a video with movie player, the window turns into black or other elements come in the middle
<nixternal> that is what you call "sipping the juice w/o knowing the flavor"
<nixternal> dqdev: #ubuntu is where you will get an answer for that..you are in a dev channel of highly caffeniete people, of which most are foaming at the mouth in a very rabid way :)
<Hobbsee> mmm...caffeine...
* nixternal chugs down some more
<dholbach> bashelier, fernando: seems we can sync telepathy-python from incoming
<dholbach> bashelier, fernando: good work on libtelepathy (uploading)
<dholbach> bashelier, fernando: libtelepathy uploaded - thanks you two
<Dabian> ubotu: seen mwolson
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen mwolson - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<fernando> dholbach: on libtelepathy, only Mr. bashelier work in it.
<fernando> bashelier: good work
<bashelier> thanks :)
<bashelier> fernando: what about telepathy-python then ? :)
<dholbach> maybe you can work on the other together
<bashelier> dholbach: this is already the case in pm ;)
<dholbach> rock
<dholbach> thanks a lot you two - I think I can push all my package update requests to the two of you from now on ;-)
<bashelier> dholbach: feel free to ask anytime ;)
<dholbach> thanks :)
<dholbach> brb
<xxxxx1> hello dholbach 
<dholbach> heya xxxxx1
<bashelier> dholbach: telepathy-glib builds fine, just have to fix lintian warnings and then I'll upload it
<dholbach> bashelier: excellent
<bashelier> dholbach: "File telepathy-glib.devhelp.gz not symlinked to from devhelp dirs": "to from" sounds strange doesn't it ?
<dholbach> a bit, yes
<bashelier> dholbach: this warning can't be fixed because devhelp is in Suggests, and then it's impossible to make a dh_link in the debhelp dirs
<dholbach> you could add the directory to debian/dirs
<bashelier> dholbach: right :)
<Martinp23> dholbach: would you happen to have any jobs for me to do? :)
<dholbach> Martinp23: if you coordinate with fernando - there are some gnome updates on http://mail.gnome.org/archives/ftp-release-list/2007-June/thread.html
<dholbach> Martinp23: I'm happy to review
<dholbach> although your updates might not land in the next 3-4 days
<dholbach> as we're approaching gutsy tribe 1 release
<bashelier> Martinp23: you should have a look to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO ;)
<Martinp23> bashelier: hehe :)
<Martinp23> dholbach: OK - will do 
<Martinp23> brb
<mruiz> dholbach: when Merges/Syncs days will finish ?
<dholbach> mruiz: I'd reckon that with UpstreamVersionFreeze we should have them done
<dholbach> hey gpocentek
<dholbach> gpocentek: thanks for goffice/gnumeric goodness
<gpocentek> dholbach: np
<Adri2000> pochu: bug #87959 - see, soyuz tried to re-close the bug :/ you should file a bug against soyuz
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 87959 in listen "Listen should build-dep in firefox-dev" [Medium,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/87959
<bashelier> dholbach: I'm sorry, I don't now how to fix this warning: don't know where the link should be
<dholbach> bashelier: drop me a mail with that and I'll look at it tomorrow
<bashelier> dholbach: ok
<dholbach> thanks bashelier
<dholbach> it does not sound like a serious issue to me, but nice if we can get it fixed
<cbx33> hey all
<cbx33> ping imbrandon 
<pochu> Adri2000: Bug #118671
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118671 in soyuz "Changelog-Close feature tries to close already-closed bugs." [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118671
<LaserJock> pochu: related to that, what if we don't want to actually close the bug
<LaserJock> I suppose we should have some documentation on that
<pochu> LaserJock: then split the "LP:" part.
<pochu> Since it looks for "LP: #" constructions
<LaserJock> yeah, but something should be documented
<pochu> Maybe we should use "Ubuntu:"
<pochu> LaserJock: Yes, I'll write something later tonight.
<LaserJock> we've used something like LP: # for a long time for all referenced in changelogs
<stgraber> If a MOTU has some time : http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5355 , thanks
<bmm> Anybody willing to post a comment on ccbuild http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5295 is very welcome, I'm looking for my first avocate
<bmm> stgraber: haha, what timing ;-)
<stgraber> yeah :)
<bashelier> stgraber: have you made the orig tarball by yourself ?
<stgraber> bashelier: I had to, as mentioned in the changelog it's been retrieved from git
<ScottK> geser: Did you know someone is working on decoratortools to get it into Debian?
<geser> I've seen an ITP for it
<geser> Debian bug #425761
<ubotu> Debian bug 425761 in wnpp "ITP: decoratortools -- version-agnostic decorators support for Python" [Wishlist,Open]  http://bugs.debian.org/425761
<ScottK> There's a draft package in the Debian Python Modules Team svn.
<bashelier> StevenK: I have a question, README.Debian-source must be added in case the orig tarball has been repacked, is it already the case if it has been build from a git repo for example ?
<bashelier> erf
<ScottK> Would it make sense to help push that one out and not make an Ubuntu unique one?
<bashelier> ScottK: this question was for you ^^"
<ScottK> geser: http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/python-modules/packages/decoratortools/trunk/debian/?rev=0&sc=0
<geser> this doesn't surprise me as kov filed the ITP
<ScottK> bashelier: If you didn't have an orig.tar.gz, then you should explain how to construct what you used for the source tarball.
<bashelier> ScottK: ok thanks :)
<bashelier> stgraber: see what ScottK just said first ;)
<ScottK> geser: Debian Python Modules Team is very open to Ubuntu people IME.
<bashelier> stgraber: then, just let me the time to eat and I'll finish your review ;)
<gpocentek> somebody knows if the beryl packages on REVU can be archieved?
<gpocentek> looks like they are all in the archive
<geser> ScottK: I only needed decoratortools to unbreak turbogears but as Debian worked around it (for now) I stopped packaging it.
<ScottK> OK.  So you aren't actively working the package?  Nevemind then.
<ScottK> Nevemind/Nevermind
<geser> no
<stgraber> bashelier: ok, there is the way to build it in the changelog (get the git, remove .git and existing debian/ + add COPYING (gpl-2)), so I think that should be ok
<ScottK> geser: Should we archive it then?
<bashelier> stgraber: exact commands must be listed in README.Debian-source, please read http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/developers-reference/ch-best-pkging-practices.en.html#s-bpp-origtargz ;)
<geser> ScottK: yes, did I forget it?
<ScottK> geser: Yes.  I just archived it.
<geser> hmm, I remember archiving it
<gpocentek> I'm wondering what happened on REVU
<gpocentek> all the beryl packages were archived IIRC
<ScottK> geser: I see other stuff that I'm pretty sure was archived.  It looks like when the server was rebooted, some stuff came back for some reason.
<geser> I'm pretty sure the beryl packages were also already archived
* ScottK just re-archived 4 of my packages that I know were archived.
<ScottK> Maybe siretart will read the scrollback and can explain...
<bashelier> siretart: ping
<stgraber> bashelier: New version uploaded to revu, renamed the directory inside the .orig.tar.gz and added the README.Debian-source thing
<bashelier> stgraber: ok, let me have a look :)
<bashelier> stgraber: first, minor: please add a blank line between lines 1 and 2 in debian/changelog
<bashelier> stgraber: extented description: please add Homepage, idented with two spaces
<bashelier> stgraber: please remove libpam-exec.install, and put "README" in a debian/docs file
<bashelier> stgraber: debian/rules: please put "-Wl,-z,defs" in first CFLAGS declaration line 12
<bashelier> stgraber: try to be a bit more precise in manpage, and use /usr/share/debhelper/dh_make/debian/manpage.1 as template ;) also see others pam_* manpages for examples
<bashelier> siretart: debian/changelog: missing package license, incomplete license declaration, see /usr/share/debhelper/dh_make/debian/copyright
<stgraber> bashelier: thank you, I'll have a look at that a bit later
<Riddell> revu server is slow to download from today
<nixternal> revu server is always slow for me..but not as slow as LP
<nixternal> or the wikis
<nixternal> the wikis for me, open a page, go to lunch, come back and it should be done loading
<Kmos> hehe
<Kmos> nixternal: have you tried www.opendns.com ?
<nixternal> ya, it is actually worse
<Kmos> jesus
<nixternal> opendns causes to many problems for me
<Kmos> it's your ISP problem so..
<nixternal> well, it isn't so much a DNS problem as it is a connection problem
<nixternal> I use a caching server here to help
<Kmos> :)
<Kmos> i've 512/128 kbps
<Kmos> and it's fast
<nixternal> I am 8MB/384k
<Kmos> and it's so slowly
<Kmos> hehe
<Kmos> traceroute give you a lot of hops ?
<nixternal> ya, there is a booged connection between me and the UK somewhere
<nixternal> ya, around 30+ hops usually
<Kmos> yeah
<Kmos> i got that too i think
<Kmos> my ISP uses http://www.cogentco.com
<Q-FUNK> http://30hopsmax.at/
<Kmos> web based game
<Kmos> !?
<Kmos> lol
<cbx33> pingity imbrandon 
<Kmos> nixternal: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/24117/
<Kmos> i've also 30 hops
<pygi> cbx33, :)
<cbx33> hey pygi 
<HiFructose> guys where can i report a package bug?
<HiFructose> well, packaging bug to be clear sorry
<xxxxx1> HiFructose: in launchpad
<xxxxx1> hmm
<HiFructose> xxxxx1: ok thanks
<xxxxx1> packaging bug?
<HiFructose> xxxxx1: libsexymm is missing the pkg-config file
<ScottK> HiFructose: Tag it as a packaging bug when you file it.
<HiFructose> allright
<HiFructose> ok actually, i just download the source, and the source package doesn't have one either
<HiFructose> report to upstream first then?
<HiFructose> or will/would/should the package maintainer in ubuntu add one on his own?
<fdoving> who are revu admins? 
<crevette> hello
<fdoving> hi.
<crevette> I would need the REVU keyring to be re-sync to permit to upload packages
<pygi> sispotty probably
<RainCT> Hi
<jussi01> ajmitch: can do it if he has time crevette
<Qball> Seveas: I had to poke you
<RainCT> keescook: thanks :)
<keescook> RainCT: sure!  thanks for getting it built up!  :)
<xxxxx1> bye all!
<DarkSun88> G'night
<siretart> gpocentek: ScottK: geser: yes, all uploads > 3 months ago have been archived, as discussed/announced on ubuntu-motu@. nobody objected/joined in the discussion that time
#ubuntu-motu 2007-06-05
<geser> siretart: the problem is that some old uploads got unarchived
<siretart> geser: yes, that was a mistake from my side, I said yesterday on irc
<siretart> geser: I accidentally reset all archived information while writing the auto-archive script :(
<geser> is it safe to archive them again?
<siretart> yepp
<siretart> I won't reset them again. it was an accident :(
<siretart> good night!
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
* #ubuntu-motu  [freenode-info]  channel trolls and no channel staff around to help? please check with freenode support: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#gettinghelp
<crimsun> ok, Forums time!
<Hobbsee> oh?
* Hobbsee raises an eyebrow at crimsun 
<crimsun> yep, time for the daily support trawl
<Hobbsee> urgh
<crimsun> I just tell myself everything will be ok, and then I jump back into hell.
<crimsun> three hours later, I climb out, rinse, and go back to real-life work.
<crimsun> interestingly enough, yesterday's trawl has already uncovered two corner cases not fixed in ALSA 1.0.14, but we've got one of them fixed already.
<Nafallo> *yawn* morning
<Hobbsee> morning Nafallo 
<Nafallo> 7:02 and I'm awake..
<StevenK> pm? :-P
<Nafallo> am :-P
<Nafallo> except we have 24h here ;-)
<Nafallo> I got stuff to do today so... ;-)
<Nafallo> and then I will be away again until friday morning ;-)
<Fujitsu> `Battery may be invalid' to you too, g-p-m!
<nixternal> haha
<nixternal> wb LaserJock 
<Amaranth> how can i make pbuilder use packages i've build/installed locally to satisfy build deps?
<Amaranth> please tell me the answer is easier than 'setup a custom repo'
<Hobbsee> pbuilder login --bindmounts /directory/with/debs
<man-di> bashelier: I will upload tonite when I have access to my gpg key
<ajmitch> setting up a custom repository is dead simple though
<pygi> xD
<cbx33> hey guys....and nomachine NX experts here?
<cbx33> ping imbrandon 
<siretart> Amaranth: may I suggest to use sbuild on a specially prepared (read: with your local packages installed) chroot?
<siretart> cbx33: hardy, since it is non-free
<cbx33> well there is FreeNX
<siretart> which isn't nomachine NX
<cbx33> which is in Seveas' repo
<siretart> cbx33: you might have more look if you just asked what you want to ask ;)
<cbx33> ahh i see
<cbx33> ok
<siretart> s/look/luck/
<Amaranth> the server is still non-free
<cbx33> ok
<siretart> Amaranth: I thought the client was non-free
<Amaranth> this is X, the thing on the client computer is the server :)
<cbx33> i was wondering if multiple people could watch the same NX session
<siretart> AFAIU, Freenx provides a GPL'ed server, which can be used with the non-free-but-free-as-in-beer client from nomachine
<cbx33> while one person could control it
<Amaranth> siretart: the the non-free bit is the server :)
<Amaranth> it's a modified xfree86
<Amaranth> i think that's how it works anyway :)
<siretart> Amaranth: they still call the thing which you use to login to the remote server "NX client"
<siretart> and the last time I looked at it, the installation was still very scary
<siretart> (2 weeks ago)
<cbx33> well /me got it up and running very easy with the seveas pacakge
<cbx33> i was just wondering if anyone knew about multiple viewings of the same session
<dholbach> hiya
<Hobbsee> dholbach!!!
<dholbach> hi Hobbsee
<geser> Hi dholbach
<Fujitsu> Evening dholbach, Hobbsee, geser.
<geser> Hi Fujitsu
<cbx33> hey Fujitsu Hobbsee geser dholbach 
<Hobbsee> hi Fujitsu, cbx33 
<geser> Hi cbx33
<dholbach> hi cbx33, hi Fujitsu
<Fujitsu> Hi cbx33,
<RAOF> Fujitsu: Incidentally, gnome-power-manager thinks that *my* battery is valid :).
<Fujitsu> RAOF: Valid, or invalid?
<RAOF> Fujitsu: Valid.
<Fujitsu> Aw. Damn.
<RAOF> And g-p-m is getting really cool.  "5 mins until charged, Provides 2 hrs 10 min battery runtime"
<Fujitsu> I dare not unplug the power, or about 30 seconds later it decides that I need to shut down.
<cbx33> heheh
<RAOF> :)
<Fujitsu> Provides 25 minutes battery runtime! Yay! (I know I can get about 1:10 out of it at the moment)
<Fujitsu> It seems to do some crazy profiling thing.
<Fujitsu> And because I haven't run it down significantly with this new version it thinks the capacity is limited.
<RAOF> Yeah, it's not very accurate for me at the moment either.
<Fujitsu> The profiling graphs are a little odd.
<RAOF> I'd expect 3+ hours on a near full charge.  Although I suppose that's less at 100% brightness.
* Fujitsu runs the battery down now, to see if it helps the estimated time at all
* RAOF tries the same.
<Fujitsu> Thanks for the notification that my battery is full as I unplug it, g-p-m.
<crimsun> really? Mine tells me that I can't suspend-to-*, and it takes 50 seconds for the session logout dialog to appear.
<crimsun> of course `sudo pmi action suspend` works just dandy, as does "hibernate"...
<crimsun> but that's why I love development branches!
<Fujitsu> crimsun: I don't bother to wait for the logout dialog to appear, and just flip to tty1 to shutdown from there. I didn't know it would eventually appear.
<crimsun> oh look, that's precisely what's being discussed in -devel
<crimsun> what a coincidence
<Fujitsu> Heh, yes.
<Fujitsu> Arrrgh
* Fujitsu stabs g-p-m to death.
<Fujitsu> I have more than 0% remaining, thanks.
<StevenK> Nah, you just think you do.
<Fujitsu> Ah, the graph looks slightly more sane now.
<Fujitsu> Rather than dropping from 60% to 20% in about a minute, those points have now vanished and are heading up.
<Fujitsu> Oh great, it's now critically low, and my computer will *power-off* when it becomes completely empty.
<Fujitsu> I've never seen a GNOME application spout so much rubbish in such a short time.
<Hobbsee> that's a feature
* Fujitsu drops a g-p-m carcass on Hobbsee.
<StevenK> Hrm. Could it be egging Fujitsu on to install Kubuntu.
<Fujitsu> StevenK: No.
* Hobbsee notes that this coincides very nicely with her recent core-dev status...
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Hahaha.
<Fujitsu> Baaaaah, why is my battery percentage going distinctly up when I'm still unplugged? How do I gain 10% of my power with no input?
<StevenK> Magic, clearly.
<RAOF> Fujitsu: Lag.  g-p-m now updates itself via the internet.  Get a faster connection :)
<StevenK> Bwahaha
<Qball> :D
<Fujitsu> g-p-m is being nasty and retrospectively modifying the Charge History graph.
<bashelier> man-di: ok thanks :)
<pgquiles__> I am packaging a library which creates libsnmp++.so.0.0.0. How do I create the symlinks (libsnmp++.so.0 and libsnmp++.so)? Manually? shlibs? something else?
<bashelier> pochu: ping
<pochu> bashelier: pong.
<bashelier> pochu: hey :) I wanted to ask you if I could merge listen, this merge is simple ;)
<pochu> Any sponsor for Bug #72382? It's an easy fix, so it won't take a lot for review it :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 72382 in mail-notification "Popup not working with KDE 3.5.5" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/72382
<pochu> bashelier: There's -4 in Debian?
<bashelier> pochu: yep, give me a minute and I'll send you the debdiff
<pochu> bashelier: I can't upload it, so need to send it to me ;)
<pochu> But I've seen the changes. Please, do it :)
<bashelier> pochu: np ;)
<bashelier> pochu: here it is : http://82.234.91.6/listen_0.5-4ubuntu1.patch, let's report a bug now
<pochu> Cool
<Qball> ugh...  elcassy is drunk in #ubuntuforums
<bashelier> pochu: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/listen/+bug/118759
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118759 in listen "Please merge listen (universe) from Debian Unstable (main)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<pochu> bashelier: thanks!
* pochu hugs bashelier 
<bashelier> thanks to you ;)
* bashelier hugs pochu too
<pochu> Anybody with super-upload-powers? :) Bug #72382 and #118759 need you :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 72382 in mail-notification "Popup not working with KDE 3.5.5" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/72382
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118759 in listen "Please merge listen (universe) from Debian Unstable (main)" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118759
<StevenK> Hrm, make is a really hard parent.
<StevenK> Live child 0x0064e290 (install-arch) PID 2924 
<StevenK> Reaping losing child 0x0064e290 PID 2924 
<StevenK> And even if you don't lose!
<StevenK> Reaping winning child 0x0064e290 PID 2907 
<sacater> imbrandon: ping?
<imbrandon> sacater: You sent me a contentless ping.  This is a contentless pong.  Please provide a bit of information about what you want and I will respond when I am around.
<sacater> ah
<sacater> imbrandon: ping want to talk to you about server space
<dholbach> does the connection to tiber seem a bit slow to any of you?
<bashelier> dholbach: it does :/
<dholbach> ok, just didn't know if it was just my problem
<bashelier> dholbach: do you have a few minuts to sponsor a very simple merge ?
<dholbach> bashelier: I can look at it, yes
<bashelier> dholbach: here it is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/listen/+bug/118759 :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118759 in listen "Please merge listen (universe) from Debian Unstable (main)" [Low,Confirmed]  
<dholbach> bashelier: I'm reviewing the patches and packages in my mails now too - so please bear with me :)
<cbx33> hey imbrandon you there?
<cbx33> was messing around with NX today
<dholbach> bashelier: looks good - doing a test build now
<bashelier> dholbach: ok thanks :)
<Fujitsu> Yay, g-p-m is giving slightly sane time estimates now I've put the battery through a full cycle.
<dholbach> bashelier: for future uploads: if you close a bug with your upload, add a (LP #<bug number) to debian/changelog - that way they'll automatically be closed
<dholbach> bashelier: i'll close this one manually
<bashelier> dholbach: np, I will, thanks
<dholbach> alright
<dholbach> bashelier: uploaded
<bashelier> dholbach: thanks, would you agry to let me try to merge/sync bluez-hcidump now? :)
<dholbach> sure
<bashelier> thx
<ryanakca> when asking for a sync... just create a bug with "Please sync <packagename> from Debian"?
* Hobbsee would suggest the request sync script
<Hobbsee> but yes, that works
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Note that it must be modified for non-MOTU.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: yes, that's now documented on DeveloperResource
<Hobbsee> s
<Fujitsu> Ah, good.
<ryanakca> Hobbsee: request sync script?
<ryanakca> ah
<ryanakca> I see
<Hobbsee> ryanakca: yes.  see /usr/bin/requestsync and change where it says to subscribe ubuntu-archive to be ubuntu-universe-sponsors.  it's documented on w.u.c/DeveloperResources
<ryanakca> Hobbsee: I've edited for -sponsors, but https://wiki.edubuntu.org/SyncRequestProcess doesn't explain how to use, so, `requestsync aoeui 7.10 Sid` is what I'm guessing, based on 'requestsync <source package> <target release> [basever] '
<ryanakca> but, it fails...
<Martinp23> dholbach: Should I leave those packages I did with you, or put them on REVU?
<geser> ryanakca: try requestsync aoeui gutsy
<StevenK> ryanakca: You'll also need deb-src lines for gutsy
<ryanakca> ah, ok
<ryanakca> thanks :)
<DktrKranz> bashelier, has freeradius sync bug #118733 been processed by an archive admin?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118733 in freeradius "Please sync freeradius (universe) from Debian Unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118733
<DktrKranz> if not, you should reopen it in order to be processed
<lionel> DktrKranz: looks like bashelier closed the bug...
<lionel> (and it was not processed)
<DktrKranz> It seems so
<DktrKranz> it's not a big issue, though
<lionel> DktrKranz: right :)
<LongPointyStick> ryanakca: use requestsync aoeui gutsy
<dholbach> Martinp23: they are fine at your place - as you like it - still reviewing your package and will reply soon
<Martinp23> dholbach: OK :)
<dholbach> Martinp23: replied
<dholbach> fernando packaged stuff like crazy
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<dholbach> he's bloody amazing
<dholbach> Martinp23: maybe we should create DesktopTeam/WIP on the wiki
<dholbach> Martinp23: so we don't clash on stuff we're working on
<Martinp23> dholbach: Indeed - that would be helpful
<dholbach> Martinp23: I'll do that and link it from /TODO
<Martinp23> dholbach: OK - /me will work on the packages :)
<dholbach> Martinp23: thanks a lot for that
<jekil> hello
<fernando> moin all
<bashelier> hey fernando :)
<fernando> hey bashelier 
<apachelogger> mr_pouit: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5245 please revu :)
<ScottK2> Good morning all.
<xxxxx1> morning people!
* StevenK wonders if he can get irssi to lose its DNS cache.
<persia> Does anyone know how long it takes for a Debian upload to get to ftp.debian.org, or another place I can see it before it gets there?
<StevenK> persia: dak for Debian runs once a day.
<StevenK> persia: And, http://incoming.debian.org/
<persia> StevenK: Thanks.  Now to make sure my hijacker is doing a good job :)
<StevenK> Hah
<StevenK> Oh crap.
* StevenK has a bad feeling he has just realised what the problem with this merge is.
<persia> Grrr..   Debian maintainers grabbing ITAs should check the Ubuntu patch :(
<ScottK> persia: Depending on the maintainer, they may not be interested.  Even from my perspective as an Ubuntu person, those patches are sometimes hard to make sense of.
<cbx33> StevenK: surely it's good that you know the problem?
<ScottK> persia: What's worked for me is direct dialogue with the maintainer or individual bugs on BTS with a patch specific to that problem.
<StevenK> cbx33: Well, why not?
<persia> ScottK: In general, that works for me.  This was a package that was orphaned, and I spent two weeks getting it into shape for Debian, and submitted to a Debian sponsor for an ITA, and someone else trumped me as the new maintainer.  I'll submit patches now, but I had a really nice and clean package, without many issues now still in Debian :(
<ScottK> I see.  Sounds a bit frustrating.
<StevenK> Debian often is.
<StevenK> </bitterness>
<persia> ScottK: Yep.  Just venting here.  I expect we can probably get a merge once I've had some dialog with the new maintainer.
<StevenK> persia: File the ITA first! First!
<persia> StevenK: I was encouraged not to by my Debian sponsor until the package had been reviewed.  Next time I'll seek a Debian sponsor I know better (hint, hint).
<StevenK> You can't afford my rates.
<StevenK> :-P
<Hobbsee> StevenK: can be persuaded to uplaod :P
* persia decides to purchase Australia and charge sufficient rent to afford StevenK's consulting fee.
* ScottK wonders if persia is kidding given real estate prices in Japan...
<persia> :)
<StevenK> persia: Buy a quad core Pentium D, and I'll upload libc6 if you ask me.
<ScottK> persia: If you are interested in Python modules at all, the Debian Python Modules Team is very open to Ubuntu participation and has several DDs that will also sponsor stuff outside the scope of what DPMT covers.
<imbrandon> lol
<StevenK> Buy *me* a quad core, that is. :-)
<persia> ScottK: Nope.  I'm already on the debian games team, and will probably join debian-multimedia once I clear my plate.  This was just one of my wxWindows -> wxWidgets transitions, for which upstream and Debian were dead (and it wasn't a team package), so I thought I'd become a Debian Maintainer.
<ScottK> OK.  Just a thought.
<persia> StevenK: Does Australia still have that surcharge on data processing equipment as needing to be certified by the telephone authority?  Are you allowed to run equipment intended for other countries?
<StevenK> persia: Yes, and no.
<persia> StevenK: OK.  Next time I seek an upload, I'll buy you a quad core Pentium D and keep it on my bookshelf until the laws change :)
<StevenK> Well, it needs to be Austel approved if it connects to the POTS.
<StevenK> So, ship it over. :-)
<persia> StevenK: Only POTS?  That's an improvement.  I'll keep it in mind.  Thanks.
* StevenK kicks gluBuild2DMipmaps() for returning invalid value.
<Fujitsu> Has anybody else using LVM noticed that some LVs have vanished from /dev/<VGName> in Gutsy recently?
<Fujitsu> persia: I had to reread the summary of bug #118772 a few times to confirm I wasn't delusional :P
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118772 in freqtweak "Please don't merge freqtweak 0.7.0~cvs20070605-1 from Debian" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118772
<persia> Fujitsu: I've contacted the maintainer.  I'm hoping for a sync in a week or so, but didn't want anyone to get excited before it was ready :)
<bashelier> does someone have an i386 ready to test latest Debian zsnes revision ? (new upstream version) I'll ask for sync if it works
<bashelier> (I'm have a ready .deb and a rom)
<Hobbsee> ryanakca: did you get it working?
<Lutin> persia: about the comment you made on inventor: glw is not included in ubuntu. it was provided by the source package 'meta', from which glw has been removed a while back, dunno why
<persia> Lutin: Thanks for the note.  I thought it was just similar to GL vs. GLU at first glance.
<Lutin> persia: err. I actually meant mesa . the point is, we end up with unsable packages that we can't fix :/ (I also screwed up by requestiong a sync for xbvl, same thing)
<persia> Lutin: Perhaps there is a need for a libGLw package?
<Lutin> persia: yep, maybe. I haven't been able to find out why it was removed from ubuntu though. looks like it was during the edgy devel sycle
<Lutin> cycle*
<bashelier> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/inventor/+bug/118608
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118608 in inventor "Please merge inventor (universe) from Debian Unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Needs info]  
<bashelier> apt-file didn't give me any resoult about the missing files
<bashelier> result*
<bashelier> perhaps just a missing b-d on libglw-dev, let's try
<persia> bashelier: Always try apt-cache search foo before build-depending on foo :)
<StevenK> GLw hasn't existed since Breezy.
<bashelier> persia: I'll remember :)
<StevenK> And thanks for asking before taking my merge.
<bashelier> sure, sorry
<StevenK> In future, it's polite to do so.
<bashelier> will do, don't worry
<Lutin> StevenK: oh, breezy ?
<Lutin> StevenK: do you know the rationale for its removal ?
<StevenK> Yes. It's a complete PoS.
<Lutin> StevenK: sorry, what's PoS ?
<StevenK> I went digging and found out the sordid tale when I did the inventor merge for Dapper, but Dapper was a long time ago.
<StevenK> Lutin: I'll rephrase. The code is utter crap. :-)
<Lutin> StevenK: ahh, I see. thanks :)
* persia notes that the last inventor release was 4 years ago, and suggests submitting a patch upstream for a code migration away from libGLw (and patching it locally and in Debian regardless of the lack of upstream response).
<persia> (or request a drop)
<leonel> hello !
<imbrandon> StevenK, still awake ?
<Hobbsee> hi imbrandon 
<StevenK> Nope.
<imbrandon> StevenK, something for you to dream about tonight ... http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/06/lolcode.jpg
<imbrandon> Hobbsee!
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: you promised me some scripts, a while ago.
<imbrandon> Hobbsee what ones ?
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: they havent appeared in my inbox.
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: konversation nightly scripts, etc
<StevenK> imbrandon: Twitch.
<imbrandon> i've been forgetfull/busy lately heh, ahhh ok
<imbrandon> i'll grab those now-ish
<Hobbsee> good man.  thankyou
<imbrandon> StevenK, i knew you would like that
<leonel> I need to put  some patches  is it better  to run  dpatch-edit-patch once for every patch  or do  only one time  dpatch-edit-patch ?
<bashelier> pochu: ping, just to ask you if I could merge monodevelop
<pochu> bashelier: Sure. Just add the new dependency, and ask slomo whether it's ok or not.
<bashelier> pochu: new dependency has been added in latest Debian revision ;) see Debian #424075, just have to build depend on firefox-dev, depend on firefox for the merge
<ubotu> Debian bug 424075 in monodevelop "monodevelop: FTBFS: Got a SIGSEGV while executing native code." [Serious,Closed]  http://bugs.debian.org/424075
<pochu> bashelier: That's what I mean :) There are no more changes to merge, so just add the build-dependency ;)
<ScottK> leonel: I'd do it once per patch so that you can be very clear in debian/changelog what goes with what and why it's there.
<bashelier> pochu: ok :)
<leonel> ScottK: that's what I was thinking ..
<leonel> ScottK:  thanks
<LaserJock> gpocentek: ping
<ScottK> No problem.  It's always important to be clear what's happening and why.  It's even more important for security uploads.
<gpocentek> LaserJock: pong
<LaserJock> gpocentek: see pm
<LaserJock> dholbach: pingy pingy for you too
<dholbach> LaserJock: hello
<LaserJock> dholbach: how many MC members do I need? all of them?
<dholbach> LaserJock: it has been up for vote since friday and it'd be nice to hear some views on it - I'm going to reply to the mail today - I've been very busy - so sorry for not replying to it direclty
<LaserJock> dholbach: well, I ask because there is a TB meeting in 3 hrs
<LaserJock> dholbach: I think if you can email I'll have all the MC but ajmitch
<LaserJock> as I think he'll still be asleep
<dholbach> right
<LaserJock> I'm trying to figure out if I need to show up at the TB meeting or not ;-)
<LaserJock> the TB might also be interested to know if they need to show up or not
<dholbach> hobbsee's interview was done separate from the TB meeting
<LaserJock> heh
* Hobbsee hugs dholbach and LaserJock 
<LaserJock> dholbach: yes, but I think that was just because of scheduling
<dholbach> so I'm sure that if you missed the meeting, you'd still get processed quickly enough
<Hobbsee> i dont do 4am meetings.
<LaserJock> the TB meeting today is a decent time for me so if it's possible great
<LaserJock> if not that's fine
<dholbach> alright
<LaserJock> I just wondered
<dholbach> I can pass on the vote as it is
<dholbach> if you want to get it processed quickly
<Hobbsee> dholbach: and even that got delayed :P
<dholbach> right
<LaserJock> dholbach: well, if they aren't going to take it without ajmitch's vote then I don't see the point
<dholbach> I can't promise you anything
<LaserJock> I guess I could ask mdz or something
<dholbach> I think a majority will be enough, if they're convinced as well
<Hobbsee> it'd surprise me if they followed the rule to the letter, instead of the idea of the rule
<Hobbsee> considering timezones and such
<LaserJock> dholbach: mdz wants to wait
<dholbach> ok thanks LaserJock
<bashelier> pochu: have you also added metacity in the Deps ? It had been removed in revision 0.13.1+dfsg-1 in Debian
<slomo> pochu, bashelier: looks good... pochu, can you already upload ot universe?
<bashelier> slomo: here is the debdiff, but I want first to know why the dep metacity has been re-added, because it has been removed in debian and not mentioned in changelog in ubuntu revisions
<bashelier> slomo: http://paste.stgraber.org/1377
<slomo> bashelier: it can be dropped, no idea why anymore but it can ;)
<bashelier> slomo: ok, just let me check the build and then I'll attach debdiff the debdiff to the bug :)
<pochu> slomo: not yet :)
<slomo> pochu: oh, too bad :)
<pochu> slomo: oh, and if you have one second, bug #72382 is a one-line fix (add a dependency)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 72382 in mail-notification "Popup not working with KDE 3.5.5" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/72382
<pochu> slomo: hehe, but I'll get there sooner or later ;)
<slomo> ok, will upload
<mruiz> hi all
<pochu> Hello mruiz 
<pochu> slomo: thanks!
<mruiz> hello pochu 
<mario_> dholbach, poke
<dholbach> pygi: in a phone call
<pygi> oki
<bashelier> slomo, pochu: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/monodevelop/+bug/118795
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118795 in monodevelop "Please merge monodevelop (universe) from Debian Unstable (main)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<RainCT> Hi
<RainCT> do "Updated Merges" also require some work?
<bashelier> RainCT: update merge list you mean ?
<RainCT> bashelier: the 'Updated Merges' from http://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html
<RainCT> do they need some intervention are is there everything done automatically?
<bashelier> RainCT: don't know, I'm using DaD :p
<dholbach> pygi: back
<pygi> was just wondering what happened with packages yesterday
<apachelogger> everyone in revu mood please have a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5391
<bashelier> apachelogger: np hold on ;)
<apachelogger> aye :)
<dholbach> pygi: some people took care of them
<pochu> RainCT, bashelier: DaD and MoM do almost the same. The merge is done automatically if no conflicts are found, but you still need to check everything went fine.
<nixternal> RainCT: I forgot to tell you, the current Gutsy package for Plucker doesn't build the desktop anymore
<pygi> dholbach, ok then :)
<dholbach> pygi: thanks
<pygi> for what? I didn't help ;)
<nixternal> RainCT: it is my job to Debian to accept my libemhttp package so we can start building the patched kplucker (v1.9) from their dev svn
<bashelier> pochu: didn't know it was called "updated packages", thanks :)
<RainCT> nixternal: so do you need the .desktop or not?
<nixternal> if you have one, you can shoot it my way
<nixternal> I can guarantee that the 1.9 doesn't have it either
<nixternal> I want to get a proper plucker-desktop build before the end of Gutsy
<nixternal> plucker code isn't the prettiest, and they went ahead and used a non-standard library for this patched version
<nixternal> why they couldn't have just used the curl library instead
<pochu> apachelogger: check this error in lintian: W: ksshaskpass source: configure-generated-file-in-source debug/config.log
<pochu> apachelogger: http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/ksshaskpass-0706051220/lintian
<apachelogger> pochu: already asked upstream to fix this
<pochu> apachelogger: you can fix it in your package in the meantime :)
<apachelogger> pochu: just a clean rule?
<bashelier> apachelogger: debian/control: please mention "Homepage" before the url
<pochu> apachelogger: also in debian/copyright, link to the GFDL the same way you're doing with the GPL (in /usr/share/common-licenses/)
<bashelier> apachelogger: debian/copyright: missing package license
<apachelogger> me@apoc:/usr/share/common-licenses$ ls
<apachelogger> Artistic  BSD  GPL  GPL-2  LGPL  LGPL-2  LGPL-2.1
<apachelogger> pochu: no gfdl installed by default
<geser> /usr/share/common-licenses/GFDL -> GFDL-1.2 (on gutsy)
<apachelogger> omg
<apachelogger> that's the feisty chroot ^_^
<apachelogger> bashelier: 
<apachelogger> pochu: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5392
<bluekuja> apachelogger, you should remove autogenerated-configure files
<bluekuja> apachelogger, as reported by lintian
<bluekuja> apachelogger, just adding a clean rule
<apachelogger> ehm
<apachelogger> http://revu.tauware.de/diff.py?upid1=5391&upid2=5392
<apachelogger> line 28-30
<bluekuja> apachelogger, why those files are still there?
<bluekuja> apachelogger, http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/ksshaskpass-0706051300/lintian
<apachelogger> the question is: why does lintian still detect them
<apachelogger> dpkg-source: warning: ignoring deletion of file debug/config.log
<bluekuja> ^^
<apachelogger> well
<apachelogger> letz just say lintian is today kinda stupid :P
<pochu> And linda? ;)
<bluekuja> ^^
<bluekuja> apachelogger, seems that its not lin* problem
<bluekuja> ;)
* apachelogger just tars his brain and sends it to upstream
<Hobbsee> hehe
<leonel>   find /  -name  leonel -print ..
<leonel> I'm lost !
<leonel> :)
<nixternal> anyone know which list and when it was noted that we should prune .la files from installing? is this only for libraries or for binaries as well?
<xxxxx1> nixternal: .la is -dev related
<nixternal> that is what I thought, wasn't 100% positive though
<xxxxx1> should stay in -dev
<nixternal> wonder where persia is hiding
<polopolo> hello all, what do must have already done when you want to be a MOTU?
<polopolo> !moty
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about moty - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<polopolo> !motu
<ubotu> motu is short for Masters of the Universe. The brave souls who maintain the packages in the Universe section of Ubuntu. See  http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
<geser> polopolo: just start working on MOTU tasks
<nixternal> MOTUs: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5393  <- revu me please :)
<polopolo> geser: Does not make scense if I not do everything?
<polopolo> Is there a list what MOTU's do's?
<bashelier> polopolo: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO ;)
<polopolo> But must I do all MOTU works, or only a few, like only packaging?
<polopolo> and merging, sync
<pochu> Does anybody's gnome-system-monitor display 0 KB of memory for almost every application?
<pochu> I'm going to report a bug, but I'd like to ensure it's not me :)
<pochu> In Processes tab, Memory field.
<bashelier> pochu: sorry, not using gnome :}
<bashelier> polopolo: just try to do everything you can ;)
<xxxxx1> pochu: for me is using 4mb
<Martinp23> pochu: In gutsy, yes :(
<Martinp23> gnome-system-monitor, gnome-panel, firefox-bin and nautilus are the only ones using memory, apparently :S
<geser> polopolo: you don't need to do all, you can specialize if you want
<pochu> Martinp23: cool, same here.
<pochu> Martinp23: It wasn't happening at the beginning of Gutsy, so I'll look at the changelog and file a bug report.
<pochu> Thanks for the confirmation :)
<Martinp23> pochu: No problem :) - well done for spotting it 
* Martinp23 restarts gutsy machine to see if it has any effect
<polopolo> wowoww, is gutsy avalible????
<polopolo> Can I download it?
<Martinp23> polopolo: A few days until the fist iso is released, I think
<Martinp23> I've just done a dist-upgrade
<polopolo> aha
<pochu> Martinp23: I don't think so. I've seen that problem for at least a week ;)
<polopolo> I download it right now
<ogra> the first tribe CD is planned for thursday
<Martinp23> pochu: If you set your screensaver to come on after only a minute or so, and use a flash website in FF, does the screensaver come on even through there is mouse activity (for you)?
<polopolo> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GutsyGibbon/Tribe1
<ogra> Martinp23, for sure it does, there is nothing in flash that tells any screensaver to not run
<Martinp23> aha!
<ogra> oh, wait you said mouse activity ...
<ogra> thats flash being evil ansd hogging the input 
<ogra> *and
<Martinp23> yes - I would have expected that to be picked up, even if flash had captured the mouse
<Martinp23> meh - my fault for using it :P
<polopolo> how to upgrade from Feosty to Herd1?
<ogra> if you move the mouse out of the browser win while the screensaver is on, does it come back ? 
<Martinp23> ogra: Yes - I just need to wave the mouse furiously when things start fading
<ogra> Martinp23, rather blame adobe for crappy code :)
* dholbach calls it a day
<dholbach> see you tomorrow
<blueyed> Hi masters of the free universe!
<lionel> hi blueyed
<blueyed> Could someone sponsor the upload for bug 88617 (SRU), please? It seems to be ok finally.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 88617 in duplicity "incremental backup does not work" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/88617
<leonel> ScottK: clamav  has all the patches applied the security bugs are in the 90.X versions  are missing in dapper's clamav  and I can't find  where to patch  them they are for the  cab.c  in 90.X  there's no  cab.c  in 88.X   and  the  cve-2007-2650  and cve-2007-1745 can be done   debian has all patched but the last CVE     but I can't see where they  pathed their  sarge's  clamav 
<ubotu> The OLE2 parser in Clam AntiVirus (ClamAV) allows remote attackers to cause a denial of service (resource consumption) via an OLE2 file with (1) a large property size or (2) a loop in the FAT file block chain that triggers an infinite loop, as demonstrated via a crafted DOC file. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2007-2650)
<ubotu> The chm_decompress_stream function in libclamav/chmunpack.c in Clam AntiVirus (ClamAV) before 0.90.2 leaks file descriptors, which has unknown impact and attack vectors involving a crafted CHM file, a different vulnerability than CVE-2007-0897.  NOTE: some of these details are obtained from third party information. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2007-1745)
<ScottK> leonel: It may be that the issue doesn't apply to the earlier versions.  I don't know.
<leonel> I'll need more time to see what debian did ..
<leonel> and see if I can get the patched from there
<ScottK> Sounds good
<leonel> but that won't be today .. :(
<ScottK> OK.  I'll mostly be offline the next 4 days, so ask here if you need help.
<jetsaredim> can someone tell me how to change the java plugin that firefox uses from blackdown to sun?
<jetsaredim> /join#firefox
<nixternal> ScottK: any time to revu that kplayer package?
<ScottK> nixternal: Maybe.  I've got some other stuff I need to get done first.
<nixternal> k, get the other stuff done and hollah :
<nixternal> )
<nixternal> ya, split line smiley! /me patents it
<siretart> nixternal: did you have contact with marillat about kplayer?
<nixternal> not yet I didn't..but from what I understand they are keeping it in debian-multimedia
<nixternal> for some reason, they think it is the same thing as kmplayer
<jetsaredim> anyone know the answer to my firefox question?
<nixternal> jetsaredim: that would be a #ubuntu question truthfully
<nixternal> sudo update-alternatives --config java
<jetsaredim> i tried that
<jetsaredim> but that doesn't seem to have any affect on firefox
<siretart> nixternal: why do you say about 'them'? who else is running debian-multimedia.org?
<nixternal> I don't know
<nixternal> if he is a DD how come he doesn't push it into the Debian repos? why keep it separated into a non-official repo?
<siretart> nixternal: because he is pretty pissed of debian
<nixternal> ahhhh
<nixternal> well then that may explain some stuff :)
<nixternal> plus he hasn't updated kplayer in a few months either
<man-di> nixternal: the whole repo seems outdated to me
<nixternal> ya, there are some old things in there...
<nixternal> siretart: do you know if he is typicall a cool dude? would he respond well if I asked him to update or see if he wants to turn over maintainership?
<siretart> nixternal: http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/k/kplayer/kplayer_0.6.2.dsc 404s
<nixternal> or get it into debian main
<nixternal> siretart: I removed it from Debian because they said Christian maintains it already in a non-official repo
<siretart> nixternal: no idea. that's why I'm so interested in knowing if he has responded to a mail from you
<man-di> nixternal: didnt you wanted to get kplayer into debian?
<nixternal> I will email him direction
<nixternal> man-di: yup, but was redirected to Christian
<man-di> ah
<man-di> well, directing to Christian is like sending one into the desert
<nixternal> which is good, because it gave me a chance to make some changes and split the package into kplayer and kplayer-docs
<man-di> IMO
<jetsaredim> nixternal: when I run the java config command you posted earlier
<nixternal> man-di: that is what I have heard
<jetsaredim> what does the "+" sign next to an entry mean?
<nixternal> you are interested in the * sign
<siretart> nixternal: that guy isn't a DD nor a NM, so I wouldn't give too much on him
<nixternal> siretart: @debian.org email for him
<nixternal> or are we talking about someone else?
<man-di> siretart: there are some DDs I dont give much on...
<jetsaredim> nixternal: i got that, but I have 4 entries and the blackdown one has the + sign next to it for some reason
<siretart> man-di: like marillat?
* siretart agrees
<man-di> siretart: more worse ones
<siretart> nixternal: I'm talking about Raphael Geissert
<nixternal> oh
<siretart> man-di: indeed
<nixternal> man, I wish people who weren't DDs on that list wouldn't make recommendations on such things then
* man-di should get his *** up and become a MOTU
<siretart> man-di: didn't you try to apply some time ago? ;)
<man-di> siretart: I wanted
<man-di> siretart: but I had not much time for it
<man-di> I should not give advices to nixternal here, I'm a noone
<nixternal> siretart: well, I will get this package into Ubuntu, and then turn around and talk with Christian about it, and push changes to him if he is interested
<siretart> man-di: totally understandable. You're doing a great job on java packages!
<nixternal> man-di: but siretart is backing you it seems :)
<man-di> siretart: describing myself I would do s/great/bad/
<man-di> siretart: yesterday I uploaded an unsigned eclipse
<siretart> man-di: huh? I must have a bad perception then ;)
<siretart> that happens. nothing to worry about
<man-di> siretart: well, I have probably high standards for myself
<siretart> nixternal: I'd say pass marillat a mail, and if he doesn't respond, find a DD to sponsor you
<man-di> nixternal: if you need a DD, call me
<siretart> man-di: btw, do we have a (very) rough timeline for openjdk in debian/ubuntu yet?
<siretart> I'm just curious, but not necessarily in need for java packages (yet)
<man-di> siretart: as always, its done when its done
<siretart> sure
<man-di> siretart: seriously tom marble and doko want to work on it during debconf
<man-di> tom is from SUN
<siretart> ah, that's great news
<siretart> man-di: he is even in this channel ;)
<man-di> siretart: yeah, he tries to be everywhere
<man-di> siretart: he is the openjdk ambassasdor and tries to keep the community happy
<man-di> I guess he dont likes when we talk about him ;-)
<siretart> man-di: okay :)
<TheDumbo> Seveas: poke
<highvolt1ge> colour is evil.
<TheDumbo> well, he told me to poke him.
<tsmithe> man-di, you around?
<man-di> tsmithe: yes
<tsmithe> hmm sorry, don't worry
<tsmithe> (yet)
<ajmitch> hi
<nixternal> hi
<LaserJock> morning ajmitch 
<ajmitch> LaserJock: sorry I didn't get to your mail about core-dev
<LaserJock> ajmitch: no problemo
<LaserJock> ajmitch: looks like I've got time :-)
<ajmitch> yeah
<LaserJock> I just got up this morning and saw some emails and thought maybe I could get them all in before the TB meeting today
<ajmitch> too much time
<LaserJock> so I thought I'd give it a go
<LaserJock> but Matt's right, it is short notice
<lionel> hi ajmitch :)
* ajmitch sighs
<RainCT> can someone guide me on what to do to package the new version of desktop-file-utils? (see bug 117180)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 117180 in desktop-file-utils "Encoding is deprecated" [Wishlist,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/117180
<TheMuso> Hey all
<fernando> hey TheMuso 
<porthose> asac: this is porthose do you still need help
<bashelier> asac: about xulrunner: keeping ubuntu patches is has build on amd64, sparc and ppc, but has ftbfs on ia64, do you want to have a look to the build log ?
<LaserJock> hmm, can somebody check fridge.ubuntu.com for me?
<PriceChild> LaserJock, too many connections?
<pygi> sure
<_MMA_> Same here.
<pygi> hehe
<pygi> same
<LaserJock> hmm, that doesn't seem good
<pygi> did you post how to conquer world? :P
<porthose> same here to many connections
* PriceChild is finding oddness with his gizmod upload that went through... realising tar.gz on revu is twice as big as it shuold be but can't figure out why...
<LaserJock> PriceChild: sure you didn't get a tarball within a tarball?
<LaserJock> I've seen that happen
<PriceChild> LaserJock, yeah that's what I'm dreading... but that "shouldn't" have happened
<PriceChild> because of a debian/rules get-orig-source which "can't" have messed it up
<PriceChild> (repackaged from bz2)
<TheDumbo> howdy
<TheDumbo> still no Seveas 
<PriceChild> revu seems to be _really_ slow and dropping my connection, not that I've ever downloaded an entire tarball from it before...
<geser> LaserJock: fridge.ubuntu.com WFM
<RainCT> good night
<PriceChild> ah its back up geser :)
<LaserJock> yeah, it's back up
<LaserJock> I just wondered if I had somehow broken it :-)
<PriceChild> LaserJock, I've figured out what's happenning... Its been downloading the tar.bz2 perfectly after looking at debian/watch, then for some reason it must be uscan that's making a .orig.tar.bz2 to it. my next line to then bzcat gizmod*.tar.bz2 catches both of them...
<LaserJock> heh
<PriceChild> s/.orig.tar.bz2/.orig.tar.bz2 symlink/
<PriceChild> I guess I should ask someone to take gizmod out of the build queue?
<DktrKranz> crimsun, I reviewed the debdiff of bug #117793, which should reflect your comment. could you please have a look at it? thanks
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 117793 in dbmail "/var/run/dbmail disappears" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/117793
<xxxxx1> bye all!
<PriceChild> LaserJock, do you know who I should poke?
<LaserJock> PriceChild: build queue of what?
<PriceChild> well it shows up in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+queue?start=20 which I assume is waiting to be built/something?
<LaserJock> you would need to talk to a archive admin
<LaserJock> but I'm guessing they might be all gone by now
<geser> does somebody know the gcc define for IA64? __x64_64__ is for AMD64 which one is for IA64?
<PriceChild> I've fixed it and am about to push it to revu... where should I find an archive admin? -devel?
<DktrKranz> geser, I think it's __ia64__
<bashelier> geser: already ftbfs on the very lasts uploads on ia64
<geser> bashelier: if you also mean xulrunner, I'd suggest to modify the patches to also check for IA64 (__ia64__)
<geser> DktrKranz: google confirms your guess
<DktrKranz> you have to try it
<bashelier> geser: I can do that, but I don't have a ia64 buildd at home, how could I check it works ?
<geser> as AMD64 and IA64 fails to build with the same error, I'd say that the same patch should fix it for both
<bashelier> geser: okay, give me a minute to make an other debdiff
<crimsun> is this the xulrunner merge from earlier?
<geser> yes
<crimsun> I pbuilt it on current amd64/gutsy before uploading...
<etank> if an app is version -0.1pre1 what would the correct name of the deb be when packaging it?
<PriceChild> crimsun, uuu hey :) fixed the above problems in http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5394
<crimsun> etank: 0.1~pre1-0ubuntu1
<crimsun> assuming it doesn't already exist in Debian
<etank> i am going to try to package wine-doors and it is wine-doors-0.1pre1
<porthose> asac: you still need help
<bashelier> crimsun: builds fine on amd64: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/7977086/buildlog_ubuntu-gutsy-amd64.xulrunner_1.8.1.4-1ubuntu1_BUILDING.txt.gz ;) problem on ia64
<ajmitch> etank: use crimsun's suggestion
<crimsun> bashelier: ah, I just misread geser's comment
<etank> crimsun: with a tilda between the 0.1 and pre?
<ajmitch> otherwise you'd run into problems when 0.1 is released
<crimsun> etank: yes
<geser> crimsun: do you think the same patch as for AMD64 would also fix the FTBFS on ia64? it's the same error
<etank> crimsun: ok
<bashelier> geser: have to apt-get source again... will take more than a minute so :)
<ajmitch> since 0.1~pre1 < 0.1 < 0.1pre1
<crimsun> geser: AFAIK, yes
<etank> so then this would be correct wine-doors-0.1~pre1-0ubuntu1 ?
<geser> if this fixes the build on IA64 that would unblock some other packages on IA64
<Kmos> etank: yes
<etank> cool
<crimsun> DktrKranz: acked, uploaded & Status set accordingly.
<etank> crimsun: dh_make doesn't seem to like the ~
<crimsun> etank: most people here will recommend you not use dh_make(1)
<bashelier> geser: shall I make a new revision for this fix ?
<DktrKranz> crimsun, thanks
<pochu> crimsun: why not?
<etank> crimsun: what is recommened then?
<etank> i am going from http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html on this?
<crimsun> etank: you can use anything you want, but some people prefer cdbs
<geser> bashelier: a new revision is only needed if it got uploaded
<crimsun> pochu: ^^
<bashelier> geser: ok
<geser> as this wasn't uploaded yet, simply modified the patch (note it perhaps also in the debian changelog) and recreate the debdiff
<etank> that part of the packagingguide is very short on content :(
<crimsun> etank: patches are welcome :)
<etank> crimsun: im still learning how to do all of this.
<etank> i dont know all of the tools yet.
<crimsun> etank: if you're using dh_make(1), be aware of the Description section of its man page.
<pygi> etank, but you will learn ;
<pygi> ;)
<LaserJock> hmm, that reminds me
<etank> pygi: eventually (maybe)
<pygi> etank, bad attitude, bad =)
<crimsun> with great mentors like LaserJock and geser, you can't help but learn!
<pygi> crimsun, mhm ... and I'm bad? :P
* pygi is helping etank :P
<etank> brb
<crimsun> well, I'm not deliberately excluding anyone :P
<pygi> not sure ;)
#ubuntu-motu 2007-06-06
<bashelier> % grep ia64 88*88_ubuntu_pyginputstream.dpatch:+#if defined(__x86_64__) || defined(__ia64__)
<bashelier> 88_ubuntu_pyiinputstream.dpatch:+#if defined(__x86_64__) || defined(__ia64__)
<ryanakca> Hobbsee: nope...
<bashelier> 88_ubuntu_pyiinputstream.dpatch:+#if defined(__x86_64__) || defined(__ia64__)
<bashelier> 88_ubuntu_pyiinputstream.dpatch:+#if defined(__x86_64__) || defined(__ia64__)
<bashelier> 88_ubuntu_pyiinputstream.dpatch:+#if defined(__x86_64__) || defined(__ia64__)
<bashelier> geser: here are the changes, updating changelog now
<ajmitch> oh dear
<geser> bashelier: looks good
<ryanakca> Hobbsee: I tried 'requestsync aoeui gutsy', didn't work even after adding deb-src lines and apt-get update
<etank> pygi and crimsun, I need all the help I can get. =)
<geser> ryanakca: requestsync doesn't work with new packages yet (but StevenK has a patch for it)
<ryanakca> geser: ah, ok, thanks... any idea where I can get his patch?
<pygi> etank, crimsun is evil :P One should never listen to him :)
* pygi hides =)
<crimsun> pygi's onto something.
<crimsun> I should just wear these devil horns proudly.
<geser> ryanakca: on his harddisk, he has written the patch only hours ago
* pygi managed to implement eltorito and is happy now, but hates that there's no spec for multi-boot images :(
<ryanakca> geser: ah, shucks
<ryanakca> geser: so I assume I will have to manually file the request on LP?
<Kmos> how to apply the diff to the newest package ? can't remember
<Kmos> lol
<geser> ryanakca: in theory yes, but aren't we still in auto-sync mode and new packages should be fetch automagically?
<Kmos> patch -p0 ../file.diff inside the new directory.. is not working
<bashelier> Kmos: patcj -p1 < diff ?
<bashelier> patch*
<ryanakca> geser: dunno...
<Kmos> i think my patch isn't working for some reason
<ryanakca> geser: if so, all the bettep :)
<ryanakca> s/bettep/better
<Kmos> now it's working
<geser> ryanakca: first wail till aoeui pass Debian NEW before looking for a sync
<ryanakca> geser: ok
<bashelier> geser: here it is http://paste.stgraber.org/1386
<bashelier> geser: attached to the bug : https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xulrunner/+bug/118500
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118500 in xulrunner "Please merge xulrunner (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Needs info]  
<jekil> why if i do this in rules dh_install doc/* $(CURDIR)/debian/packagename/usr/share/doc/blabla in the deb i get the stuff under /tmp/dbuild ?
<asac> porthose: yes i always need help :)
<asac> porthose: what timezone are you in? (e.g. its 1 am here now and i wanna go to bed :))
<crimsun> jekil: I recommend you use debian/foo.install, in which case you should realise that the second field is relative to the package build dir.
<jekil> crimsun: yeah, but i think is a good practice explicit CURDIR, right?
<porthose> USA central
<crimsun> jekil: yes, but it's not semantically what you intend.  See dh_install(1)'s Description section.
<MrKeuner> hi, are the translations I make using launchpad shared with the actual projects themselves?
<pochu> MrKeuner: this is not #ubuntu-translators ;)
<pygi> dude, you were told to ask #ubuntu-translators
<MrKeuner> I did
<pygi> and yes, the projects could use the translations
<pygi> this is not #ubuntu-translations
<asac> porthose: ok ... can you be here tomorrow?
<pochu> MrKeuner: you can ask danilos or carlos in #launchpad. They probably know it.
<MrKeuner> pochu: thanks
<pochu> np
<jekil> crimsun: i read the man page, but the question are the same.. and i must explict CURDIR in foo.install?
<porthose> yea not a problem go to bed lololol
<geser> bashelier: will look at it tomorrow
<bashelier> geser: ok thx
<geser> I will also ask asac about his opinion on this
<asac> geser: today? ... i am really in bed now ;)
<geser> nah, tomorrow. I'm on my way to bed too.
<asac> geser: cool cu and night
<bashelier> sweet dreams guys
<crimsun> jekil: in the first field you may - definitely not in the second field [of the same line] 
* nixternal kicks #ubuntu-motu hoping persia falls out
<nixternal> hiya jsgotangco 
<jsgotangco> good morning! (7am here)
<ajmitch> hey jsgotangco 
<bashelier> 01:06 < jsgotangco> good morning! (7am here)
<bashelier> jsgotangco: sonds strange here ^^"
<bashelier> sounds*
<crimsun> excellent.
<ajmitch> that's ok, it's jsgotangco 
<crimsun> !nixternal |nixternal
<ubotu> nixternal: Oh no!  The pointy-clicky Vista lover has arrived!
<nixternal> gaha
<jsgotangco> heh
<nixternal> !-nixternal
<ubotu> nixternal has no aliases - added by Hobbsee on 2007-05-31 09:32:53
<ajmitch> he's allowed to sound strange
<nixternal> thank ubotu for snitching on Hobbsee
<ajmitch> poor nixternal
<jsgotangco> err? even opera updates are included?
<Kmos> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5396
<jsgotangco> strange
<jsgotangco> ajmitch: heh :P
<Kmos> someone can check the gqview package on revu
<crimsun> Kmos: main's currently frozen.  Have you spoken with Ryan about updating in Debian?
<Kmos> crimsun: nop..
<crimsun> I recommend that as an initial step
<Kmos> i've also updated ddclient and it's not in debian i think
<Kmos> i don't use debian =)
<ajmitch>   ddclient |    3.7.0-3 | http://apt-proxy sid/main Sources
<ajmitch> ddclient is, but still older than what we have
<Kmos> gutsy has 3.7.1
<Kmos> :)
<nixternal> 18:16:56 [   dasnipa]  nixternal: they should add that to your bot msg... for complaints contact nixternal 1800-I love MS
<nixternal> see what you have started crimsun 
<pochu> lol
<nixternal> I am waiting to hear back from Google on my anti-google stance against the chicago office
<nixternal> they are having a Google Chicago event and invited us..I replied "if only it was gnuoogle"
<nixternal> they hate that
<pygi> nixternal, I told ya he's evil
<pygi> what did you expect?
<nixternal> lol
<pochu> So does anybody knows how to make pbuilder not exit when a build fails? I can't find it at pbuilderrc(5), pbuilder(1)
<jsgotangco> ok off to the salt mines
<pochu> The wiki doesn't help either :/
<StevenK> pochu: You need to add a hook.
<StevenK> pochu: http://pastebin.ubuntu-nl.org/24337/
<nixternal> well well well
<StevenK> nixternal: 3 buckets of water.
<nixternal> hehe
<StevenK> nixternal: Just like, "'I see', said the blind man."
<nixternal> which sea?
<pochu> StevenK: thanks :)
<etank> pygi: got a sec?
<leonel> ScottK: something  I just realize ...   Support  clamav  88.2  for another 4 years ????
<leonel> a server running clamav  I think it's better with the  nonLTS ubuntu 
<jmg> is universe supported as lts?
<jmg> i thought only main
<crimsun> support only refers to 1) main & restricted; 2) whatever is specified in a support contract.  Not mutually exclusive.
<crimsun> (mneptok, jbailey, or any other Canonical employee working on Ubuntu could clarify beyond that.)
<pochu> Martinp23: bug 118875, if you want to confirm it :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118875 in gnome-system-monitor "Memory displays 0 bytes for almost every processes." [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118875
<etank> crimsun: what do you do an app that already has a debian folder in the .tar.gz file?
<etank> actually it is a sym link to a debian folder.
<pochu> etank: you can move it to debian-upstream, and say it in debian/README.Debian-Source
<etank> pochu: would you then copy back the changelog, control, etc files?
<pochu> etank: You can either use them if they're useful, or create your owns.
<pochu> e.g. wxwidgets moves debian/ to debian-upstream/, and uses its own debian/ directory.
<pochu> Which is entirely different from the upstream one, I think.
<AndyP> StevenK, pochu: i've added a "Running a Shell When Build Fails (Intro to Hook Scripts)" section to the PbuilderHowto wiki page based on your conversation, hope that's ok
<pochu> AndyP: Sure it is, thanks a lot!
<AndyP> welcome :)
<StevenK> AndyP: Would you mind also mentioning that the hook script needs to be a+x, too?
<AndyP> StevenK: sure
<pochu> Good night MOTUs and MOTU padawans!
<LaserJock> oh man, this weekend I saw a He-Man DVD at Walmart
<LaserJock> I almost bought it just case
<LaserJock> *cause
<StevenK> The old He Man, or the new one?
<AndyP> he-man was so not a jedi knight
<crimsun> one of the best computer video game series IMO.  YMMV.
<LaserJock> StevenK: not sure actually, my wife showed it to me
<LaserJock> if I had something MOTU I could do with it I might buy it
<crimsun> of course you can.  Interview him for BehindMOTU.  Duh?
<joejaxx> lol
<StevenK> LaserJock: I found the simplest way to tell is if He Man looks like a ponce and Shadow Cat looks wrong.
<LaserJock> heh
* nixternal wants to see Transformers
<joejaxx> nixternal: it looks pretty good
<StevenK> I saw a preview for it last night.
<nixternal> ya, there was a DirecTV thing last night about it
<AndyP> good night folks
<joejaxx> Goodnight AndyP 
<helfire> lol, nice sign off message :)
<etank> can one of you recommend an easy (noob friendly) app to try packaging?
<etank> i have been trying to do wine-doors but i just don't get it.
<crimsun> could you rephrase that question?  It's a bit ambiguous to me.
<crimsun> ah, a specific source.
<crimsun> well, try cdbs.
<etank> crimsun: i was trying to use cdbs to package it but i keep getting errors
<etank> it is probably because i dont understand it (cdbs) that well
<crimsun> wow, this dist/debian/ is ... unique.
<etank> i just want to work on something that will help me learn 
<lathiat> crimsun: 'special' ;)
<etank> i assume that once you get the debian/rules file setup for cdbs then you run 'debuild -S' ?
<crimsun> debian/*
<crimsun> and it'd be debuild -S -sa  at the least
<crimsun> well, the basic structure for the source packaging is present in dist/debian/
<crimsun> it's a bit crackful, but nothing that can't be fixed.
<Hobbsee> yay, crackful
<etank> so would i still need to move the original to debian-upstream in that case?
<crimsun> I wouldn't move it
<crimsun> I'll work through it with you if you'd like
<etank> that would be great
<crimsun> ok, let's go to #ubuntu-classroom
<jmg> so
<jmg> bug #75295 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 75295 in linux-source-2.6.20 "Feisty freeze, kernel (?) tries to access DVD drive" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/75295
<ajmitch> so
<jmg> heh
<ajmitch> throwing out random bug numbers isn't going to achieve much
<jmg> clearly
<lathiat> i hear throwing out random patches does
<lathiat> ;)
<ajmitch> lathiat: only if they get attached to bugs & the right teams subscribed :)
<ajmitch> otherwise they tend to get lost in the noise
<lathiat> 'close enough'
<jmg> i was hoping that someone would say "I just got a fix from jeff and am testing it now"
<lathiat> ajmitch: Hah, even then your lucky... ;)
<ajmitch> lathiat: much higher chance of success if you prepare a debdiff for upload
* ajmitch watches epiphany randomly die
<jmg> last activity on the kernel bugzilla was last month
<Kioshen> hi everyone, i'm trying to build a deb package using the packaging guide but it fails at the signing stage with this error :
<Kioshen> Now signing changes and any dsc files...
<Kioshen>  signfile hello-debhelper_2.1.1-1.dsc Jean-Franois Gagnon Laporte <kioshen@gmail.com>
<Kioshen> gpg: skipped "Jean-Franois Gagnon Laporte <kioshen@gmail.com>": secret key not available
<Burgundavia> do you have a gpg key?
<Kioshen> however, I can cleartext sign any file by using gpg directly
<Kioshen> yes
<Kioshen> i'm trying to build hello-debhelper
<Kioshen> using debuild -S
<joejaxx> Kioshen: -kKEYHERE
<ajmitch> probably due to the accented character which you can't have in the changelog
<ajmitch> (iirc)
<Kioshen> joejaxx: you mean my key id ?
<ajmitch> yes
<joejaxx> Kioshen: yes
<Kioshen> ajmitch: Do I have to redo my gpg then ?
<Kioshen> joejaxx: thanks it passthrough
<joejaxx> Kioshen: you are most welcome
<Kioshen> Will I always have to this or there an environment variable I can set ?
<Kioshen> (sorry for my bad english ... it's getting late ;))
<Kioshen> After googling around a bit, you set DEBSIGN_KEYID in ~/.devscripts as a workaround for this
<Kioshen> seems a little hackish though
<Kioshen> Thanks everyone
<crimsun> why does that seem hackish whereas -kfoo doesn't? :)
<Kioshen> specifying -kfoo seems hackish too since it doesn't get my gpg key correctly
<Kioshen> probably because of my  in my name
<crimsun> no, it doesn't look there but at the id
<Kioshen> :/
<StevenK> If DEBEMAIL and your key match, it should just deal.
<Kioshen> How can I verify this ?
<Kioshen> visually it does
<StevenK> More correctly, if the Changed-By address in the .changes files is one of the addresses on your key with no comment, it should just cope.
<Kioshen> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/24358/
<Kioshen> it seems fine
<Kioshen> I'm using this key http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?search=0xDA35D895&op=index
<StevenK> It's the comment of "Development key"
<Kioshen> Do I add it to DEBFULLNAME
<StevenK> Then your Changed-By will read: Jean-Franois Gagnon Laporte (Development key) <kioshen@gmail.com>
<Kioshen> So it's a no go then
<Kioshen> From what I understand, I'm stuck using -kfoo with debuild ?
<Kioshen> Anyway, I'm probably beating a dead horse ... I'll tackle others problems tomorrow. Thanks StevenK for the follow up !
<Kioshen> 'night everyone
<jmg> is libapache-mod-python bugged?
<crimsun> pretty contextless question.  Want a contextless response?
<crimsun> :)
<RAOF> jmg: Yes.  I can read everything you write!
<jmg> apt-get install apache libapache-mod-python, then trying to hello world results in 'import site' failed
<jmg> http://www.pastebin.ca/543678
<crimsun> it's a straight sync from Debian for Edgy through current Gutsy, so...
<jmg> its goatsed?
<jmg> sigh
<crimsun> so which Ubuntu version is this?
<Fujitsu> jmg: It's trying to tell you to use apache2
<ajmitch> libapache-mod-python, or libapache2-mod-python?
<jmg> Feisty
<jmg> libapache-mod-python
<jmg> Fujitsu: im trying to develop for a server running apache1.3
<jmg> Fujitsu: i migrated myself away from 1.3 years ago
<ajmitch> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libapache-mod-python/
<jmg> i searThere are currently no open bugs.
<jmg> because nobody uses it? :)
<jmg> so, ideas?
<jmg> prefix?
<jmg> :/
<jmg> doesnt 'Could not find platform independent libraries' mean something sinister?
<jmg> what should $PYTHONHOME be on a working ubuntu?
<RAOF> jmg: Blank?  Do you mean $PYTHONPATH?
<RAOF> (Which should also be blank, IIRC)
<jmg> http://www.modpython.org/pipermail/mod_python/2006-March/020487.html
<jmg> bugged since breezy
<Burgundavia> jmg: buggy, not bugged
<Burgundavia> bugged means it has an electronic snoping device in it
<joejaxx> :P
<jmg> or that it has an open bug
<Burgundavia> no, that would still be buggy
<Burgundavia> or "it has a bug"
<crimsun> Toadstool fixed a similar bug in an earlier Debian revision.
<crimsun> see bugs.do/libapache-mod-python
<jmg> according to that, the bug should be fixed
<jmg> because that fix is already in the version in feisty
<crimsun> yes, and that modpython.org post is for Breezy.
<jmg> yes
<jmg> and im here on feisty and the bug is still there
<jmg> sooo
<crimsun> are you certain you're hitting the _same_ bug?
<jmg> i get some extra prefix stuff
<jmg> but the same could not import mod_python.apache
<crimsun> does it make any difference that the default python version is not 2.4?
<jmg> i dont know, does it?
<crimsun> well I can't easily test...
<jmg> im just checking out the sauce now
<jmg> apt-get install build-essential
<joejaxx> lol
<joejaxx> that is funny
<joejaxx> the CIA's website runs on plone
<jmg> haha orly
<joejaxx> yeah
<crimsun> their public web site :)  They have several internal ones.
<joejaxx> go to cia.gov and look at the page icon
<joejaxx> crimsun: of course :)
<jmg> ahahhaah
<joejaxx> there are sites restricted to certain ipranges/subnets as well
<joejaxx> jmg: :P
<jmg> they're trying hard to make it look like it's not plone
<jmg> Referer: https://www.cia.gov/css/ploneStyles0607.css
<jmg> Referer: https://www.cia.gov/css/ploneStyles0607.css
<jmg> er
<jmg> Server: Netscape-Enterprise/4.1
<jmg> they probably got sick of getting mambowned
<joejaxx> lol
<jmg> joejaxx: thanks for that humorous distraction
<joejaxx> :) you are most welcome :)
* jmg goes back to banging his head on desk
<superm1> Hi mates.  Could anyone do a revu?
<jmg> ok guys, explain this
<jmg> I rebuilt the package without changes and it worked
<jmg> so either there is a missing dependency or the build in the archive is horked
<crimsun> it's obviously the latter
<jmg> great
<crimsun> Build finished at 20060919-2358 <--
<jmg> orly
<crimsun> yes, that's the buildd log.
<crimsun> you can verify via timestamps on http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/liba/libapache-mod-python/ , too.
<jmg> whats the implication?
<crimsun> it hasn't been rebuilt since edgy was released.
<jmg> excellent.
<ajmitch> crimsun: similar bug filed earlier today
<ajmitch> bug 118901
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118901 in libapache2-mod-encoding "Feisty's libapache2-mod-encoding binary have a broken ABI,plz rebuild." [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118901
<crimsun> 118901
<crimsun> yes.
<gnudeep> Hi All 
<gnudeep> I created the deb for wsas 
<gnudeep> wsas is a java  based webservice engine 
<gnudeep> I need to get REUV upload rights 
<Hobbsee> !revu
<ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<gnudeep> ok 
<superm1> Hobbsee, I noticed that you also use the alias LongPointyStick on irc, is there a history as to why you use both?
<gnudeep> I have added my gpg keys to the launchpad 
<gnudeep> please add my gpg key to REVU keyring 
<Hobbsee> superm1: because i'm australian
<Hobbsee> gnudeep: sure, give it about 10 mins for it to resync
<Hobbsee> superm1: basically, because i dont leave my laptop on all the time, and au connections tend to drop out a bit
<gnudeep> Hobbsee, ok 
<Hobbsee> superm1: so i can still log, with it there
<superm1> ah that makes sense
<superm1> rather than having to use Hobbsee_ and Hobbsee__
<Hobbsee> superm1: and occasionally if i'm logging in from uni, or my connection is bad, i'll just ssh into there, and talk from there
<superm1> and such
<Hobbsee> yeah
<Hobbsee> most people realise that LongPointyStick isnt actually here
<gnudeep> Hobbsee, what  is the procedure to get the upload passwd 
<Hobbsee> recover the password on the front page of revu - once you've actually gotten something uploaded and accepted, iirc
<superm1> gnudeep, you will get an email from revu, that you need to decrypt
<superm1> after you hit that recover password button
<gnudeep> ok 
<gnudeep> WSAS is a java based package. I did not find any specific Doc for java based packages in Ubuntu guides 
<Hobbsee> did you check the debian packaging guides?
<superm1> gnudeep, when packaging it, there are a few other packages that use java, like eclipse or azureus
<superm1> that come to mind
<gnudeep> I used dpkg-deb --build to build the deb with compiled binary 
<superm1> that you might consider looking at for ideas
<gnudeep> I followed Tomcat5.5
<man-di> superm1: azureus is packaged really bad
* man-di is debian java maintainer
<superm1> man-di, can't say i've looked at the package ever.  Just know its java :)
<Hobbsee> man-di: fix it?  :)
<man-di> Hobbsee: there is some long-standing dispute with the maintainer of azureus, ask doko for more infos
<Hobbsee> man-di: in debian or ubuntu?
<man-di> Hobbsee: debian
<man-di> Hobbsee: in ubuntu afaik doko maintains azureus
<man-di> and its packaged a bit differently
<man-di> uses another SWT
* Hobbsee thought it was unmaintained in ubuntu
<man-di> Hobbsee: I know that doko at least did some work on it in the past
<Hobbsee> true
<StevenK> Didn't Fujitsu touch it last and then regret it?
<Hobbsee> man-di: if you've got patches, etc for teh debian version, it'd surprise me if ti wasnt accepted
<gnudeep> man-di, any idea about the quality of the tomcat deb
<man-di> gnudeep: its in good shape but probably not the best example
<superm1> Hobbsee, would you be able to do a revu for me this evening at all before I take off for the night?
<Hobbsee> at some point, perhaps
<man-di> Hobbsee: I use my time for stuff I know that it will be accepted
<superm1> Hobbsee, http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5397
<Fujitsu> Argh, azureus. (my highlighting seems to not want to work)
<StevenK> Heh heh.
<man-di> I need to leave now
* StevenK terrorizes Fujitsu
* Fujitsu is already terrorised by azureus.
* Fujitsu convinces somebody else to touch it.
<man-di> gnudeep: if you want to get a review of it, send me a mail with a link to the *.dsc file to konqueror@gmx.de
<Fujitsu> That way it gets removed from my list :)
<man-di> gone
<gnudeep> man-di, ok
<RAOF> Fujitsu: No way it's gonna be me.  Last thing I got persuaded to touch was democracyplayer.  Uuurgh.
<Fujitsu> Hahahah, I think that's worse.
* Fujitsu does an mplayer security update.
<Fujitsu> I guess I'll have to create a separate branch for feisty-security.
<Fujitsu> (bzr branch, that is)
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Can you please attack bug #118855 with your release nomination acceptance powahs?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118855 in mplayer "Stack overflow in mplayer cddb handling" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118855
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: do what to it now?
<jamuraa> Hello, I have a question about how packages from Debian sid get into Ubuntu universe
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Aha, you have them too, of course.
<Fujitsu> !ask | jamuraa 
<ubotu> jamuraa: Don't ask to ask a question. Just ask your question :)
<jamuraa> Wow, that was dumb.  Let me rephrase:  what is the process that debian sid packages take to get into ubuntu universe? 
<pygi> who poked me before? 
<Fujitsu> jamuraa: If they are unmodified in Ubuntu, they will be automatically synced across (until DebianImportFreeze)
<Fujitsu> If they have had modifications made in Ubuntu, they are merged manually.
<StevenK> Bugger. I've lost the magic approve button.
<jamuraa> Fujitsu: so new packages in debian sid are automatically added if they build?
<RAOF> jamuraa: Only if there are no Ubuntu-specific changes.
<Fujitsu> Unless they're in contrib/non-free, yes.
* RAOF tries to parse that statement properly :)
<jamuraa> RAOF, Fujitsu: totally new, just got through the NEW queue new, not a new version..  and in main.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Ah. It's no longer -core-dev, it's -drivers
<Fujitsu> Oh, ffs.
<StevenK> Which means it's community council, tech board, sabdfl or cjwatson.
<Fujitsu> Noted.
<Hobbsee> oh drivers?  not -release?
<StevenK>  Bug nominations are evaluated by release managers and accepted or declined for fixing in a release.
<StevenK> The Ubuntu release manager is Ubuntu Drivers.
<Hobbsee> sucky.
* Hobbsee whines about it to the relevant parties
<Fujitsu> Yes, let's make the CC control all of our bugs.
<Fujitsu> Why not?
<Fujitsu> Makes a whole lot of sense.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Sorry.
<Hobbsee> oh...this...
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Hrrm?
<Fujitsu> There is a spec in progress by BjornT to give component uploaders the appropriate rights, but this is just stupid.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: it's a bug
<Hobbsee> it should be -releases who can accept
<StevenK> -release
<Hobbsee> er, yes
<Fujitsu> Which is even more restricted. Yay.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: done
<Hobbsee> i think
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: How'd you manage that?
<Hobbsee> sekrit magic
<StevenK> It's been accepted, but is still showing as nominated.
<Fujitsu> Yes, I noticed that.
<Fujitsu> But I'm still trying to work out how Hobbsee accepted them.
<StevenK> I don't think they have been.
<Fujitsu> Well, they've renominated and autoaccepted by her.
<Hobbsee> i'm not sure if i've done it right yet
<Hobbsee> [16:29]  <pitti> Hobbsee: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+source/mplayer/+bug/118855
<Hobbsee> [16:29]  <pitti> you have to manually change the URL
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118855 in mplayer "Stack overflow in mplayer cddb handling" [High,In progress]  
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: ^
<Fujitsu> It's done, but LP seems to have failed to notice that you shouldn't have nominations for open tasks.
<Hobbsee> yeah, well.  it's a bug, but that's the workaround
<Fujitsu> Malone does like having bugs.
<Fujitsu> So ubuntu-release is the group that accepts them, and LP is lieing when it says ubuntu-drivers is?
<StevenK> lying
* Hobbsee puts a tribe 2 milestone on it while she's at it
<Hobbsee> no, anyone in ubuntu-dev can do it, it appears
<Hobbsee> if they know the workaround
<Hobbsee> (which was mentioned on the conference call)
<Hobbsee> ie, add gutsy/ or $release/
<Hobbsee> in the URL
<Fujitsu> Using the 'Also needs fixing here' button?
<Hobbsee> yep
<Fujitsu> Ahaha, I forgot you could do that. I've done it a couple of times via the email interface.
<Fujitsu> Their permissions system is really thorough, obviously.
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> you're in -dev
<Hobbsee> that's all they're mostly restricting it to
<Fujitsu> It looks to me like that would be accessible to anybody.
<Hobbsee> it's not
<Hobbsee> i dont think
* Fujitsu wonders why this workaround hasn't been mentioned at all except for just then.
* TheMuso choaks on dust as he enters.
<StevenK> chokes doesn't have an a
<TheMuso> well it does when I am concentrating on coughing. :)
<StevenK> Hum. Maybe I need to throw my pedantic, depressed self at REVU.
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Nooo! Don't do it!
<TheMuso> Its just grand when a porshion or a brick wall has been knocked out.
<TheMuso> s/or/of/
<Fujitsu> s/porshion/portion/
<superm1> StevenK, if you'd like, you can take a look at the package i mentioned to Hobbsee 20 min ago or so
<TheMuso> yeah ok
<TheMuso> attention is not on typing atm
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: because the use of milestones and release has changed, and it only became clear on said conference call what it was supposed to be used for.
<StevenK> superm1: I could. In my current mood, I'm likely to 1) not accept it, 2) bite your head off for little errors
<Fujitsu> What's it being used for now, Hobbsee?
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: it's complicated
<superm1> StevenK, Hm.  Well its a pretty simple package, maybe you won't find any little errors :)?
<superm1> StevenK, your call though, i dont think REVU is exactly an anti-depressant for most people
<Fujitsu> And I suppose the only documentation is inexplicably locked away somewhere incredibly private.
<StevenK> More like a depressant.
<nixternal> StevenK: if you are throwing yourself at revu, there is a little present by yours truly
<nixternal> ;p
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: the milestones are only to be used for tribes and such
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: so we can say "needs to be fixed in gutsy", and then milestone it for a particular tribe
<Fujitsu> Ah, that makes sense.
<Hobbsee> yeah, when it actually came out that way
<man-di> back online
* Fujitsu grumbles.
<Fujitsu> Why is package installation in sbuild killing my gnome-panel?
<StevenK> OOM Killer?
<Fujitsu> No, it's doing the normalish thing that happens to some people when installing/upgrading packages. I'm just surprised that it still happens inside sbuild.
<dholbach> good morning
<Hobbsee> hiya dholbach!
<dholbach> hey Hobbsee
<Fujitsu> Hi dholbach.
* dholbach hugs Hobbsee ecstatically
* Hobbsee hugs dholbach ecstatically back :D
* Hobbsee be squishe
<Hobbsee> d
<dholbach> :-)
* Hobbsee breaks, and shatters on the floor
* pygi composes Hobbsee back
<dholbach> nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
* Fujitsu fixes the new RM
* Hobbsee isnt the RM.
<Fujitsu> What's the title?
<Hobbsee> release engineer
<doko> Hobbsee, man-di: the only difference is the integration of some gnomish look and feel (tabs, icons, and so on)
<Hobbsee> RM means i'd have access to the DC, and i dont have htat
<Fujitsu> Oh, I thought it was the other way around :(
<Hobbsee> nope
* Fujitsu makes a note to never again get involved with any mildly large package that is maintained in bzr on LP.
<nixternal> man-di: I got a reply back from marillat
<nixternal> No, I don't intent to package kplayer officially
<nixternal> that is what he said
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: If you touch mplayer again, please make the modifications in bzr.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: even rebuilds?  OK, sorry, didnt know it was in bzr
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Even rebuilds, or changelogs get messed up and versions are wrong.
<Hobbsee> oh blerg.  that was 2 months ago.  no wonder i dont remember it
<Fujitsu> Heheh.
<LaserJock> is there a canonical list of what packages are using bzr?
<Fujitsu> I'm doing a security update now, and it got rejected.
<LaserJock> I remember there was a wiki page at one point
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: I don't believe so. Most have XS-Vcs-Bzr set, though.
<ajmitch> hello LaserJock 
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch 
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: ah, good point
<BugMaN> hi all
* LaserJock hugs dholbach 
* dholbach hugs LaserJock back
* siretart hugs both dholbach and LaserJock 
<LaserJock> hi siretart!
* dholbach hugs siretart back
<LaserJock> I must be up late for sure
* Hobbsee hugs siretart too
<LaserJock> all the Germans are showing up ;-)
<siretart> dholbach: regarding the revu problems, it might be quicker to just ask an tiber admin to cleanup the upload queue in case of binary uploads
<siretart> dholbach: in the past, this didn't appear too often, and in general, we always had some admin around
<LaserJock> siretart: what was the problem?
<siretart> LaserJock: binary uploads aren't processed and blocking subsequent uploads.
<dholbach> siretart: ok cool
<siretart> LaserJock: see your tiber admin inbox
<LaserJock> siretart: ah, I cleaned the queue out a couple days ago
<LaserJock> there were several binary uploads and stuff ~ 1 month old
<siretart> LaserJock: oh, I notice you don't forward your tiber.tauware.de mail, do you read them on tiber?
<bashelier> hey all :)
<siretart> hi bashelier 
<LaserJock> siretart: yes, and somewhat infrequently :/
<siretart> ok
<bashelier> hey siretart :)
<LaserJock> siretart: I guess I could set a .forward
<LaserJock> I just haven't bothered
<siretart> LaserJock: yes, or .procmail. whatever you prefer
<LaserJock> I suppose .procmail would help filter things out better :-)
<LaserJock> there's a decent volume of email coming from tiber
* LaserJock gets out his German dictionary
<siretart> LaserJock: oh, dholbach just says that he is forwarding an email from marek and tom, and if we could have a look at it
<LaserJock> ah, what a beautiful language :-)
<LaserJock> it's even fun to listen too
<siretart> really?
<siretart> :)
<LaserJock> I think so
<LaserJock> when I was younger I always thought it was really a really rough language, probably from all the silly American movies
<LaserJock> like klingon or something
* ajmitch did start writing something for killing off binary packages at one point
<ajmitch> I'll see if I can get it working 
<LaserJock> but now that I've been to UDSs and have actually heard it spoken by real people it sounds nice
<siretart> cool
<siretart> LaserJock: I can confirm you that german spoken in silly americal movies indeed sounds very strange and funny to germans ;)
<LaserJock> well, it should be fairly easy to see if something other than a _source.changes file has been uploaded and kill them
<LaserJock> of course "easy" is still "not done" until somebody does it ;-)
<siretart> exactly ;)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: sure, give me 10 minutes
* ajmitch finds ~/queue-reaper in his home dir
<LaserJock> heh
<ajmitch> just uploading f-spot to revu now
<ajmitch> ok, it works for i386 packages at least
<ajmitch> siretart: check ~ajmitch/queue-reaper please
<LaserJock> hmm, does Debian really chance it's archive key every year?
<LaserJock> I'd like to add the Debian archive key to apt on tiber
<LaserJock> but I'm not sure if the debian-archive-keyring package is new enough
<jmg> Is it reccomended to upgrade to feisty and then to gutsy or direct to feisty?
<crimsun> yes, the archive key is changed.
<crimsun> yes, it's new enough if you pull 2007.02.19-0.1
<crimsun> don't dist-upgrade to gutsy unless you pass through feisty.
<LaserJock> tiber's got 2006.01.10
<LaserJock> I can manually add the key though
<crimsun> edgy -> gutsy does work with a fair amount of breakage, but it's certainly massageable.  Most definitely not supported, however.
<jmg> ok 
<crimsun> ...yeah, this OO.o upgrade is going to wait until I get to the office.
<siretart> ajmitch: I'd do a 'rm -v' in the script to get better response in the cron mails
<siretart> LaserJock: please verify the key is correct (by signatures), and go on with adding it manually
<LaserJock> gpg: BAD signature from "Debian Archive Automatic Signing Key (4.0/etch) <ftpmaster@debian.org>"
<LaserJock> hmm
<shawarma> LaserJock: I've seen that before. An apt-get update usually fixes it.
<LaserJock> blah, I'm an idiot
<LaserJock> I figured it out, I was trying to verify the wrong thing
<shawarma> LaserJock: It probably happens if you update while some combo of Release.gpg, Release, Packages.gz, Packages, Sources, Sources.gz is out of sync.
<shawarma> LaserJock: Oh.
<shawarma> LaserJock: I sometimes get it from apt-get update.
<bashelier> siretart: ping, about xine-ui, libxine1-ffmpeg has been added in the Deps on last Debian revision, so a sync in required, would you agry if I filed the bug ?
<bashelier> (this Deps was the remaining Ubuntu change)
<siretart> bashelier: yes, in fact we can sync xine-ui now. However, I didn't bother since the diff is currently zero. I've had requested a sync on the next upload to debian
<ajmitch> siretart: ok, changed that
<bashelier> siretart: "next" upload was yesterday, so it's time :)
<LaserJock> siretart: ok, Debian archive key added
<LaserJock> siretart: that'll  keep me from getting stupid authentication error emails on my cron jobs
<LaserJock> \o/ for less mail
<dholbach> LaserJock: mruiz is working on gnome-chemistry-utils
<LaserJock> oh?
<LaserJock> mruiz: what are you planning on doing with it?
<dholbach> he wanted to the merge and the update
<LaserJock> dholbach: I kinda doubt it'll work very well given our current goffice version
<sivang> hi all
<Lure> StevenK: do you plan to work on python-qt4 merge? 
<dholbach> LaserJock: ah, we still didn't fix it to work with the newer version?
<mruiz> LaserJock: I was merging it and I had problems with the build in pbuilder
<LaserJock> well, you keep getting goffice from experimental ;-)
<bashelier> siretart: so are you going to use requestsync or do you rather want me to do ask it with a bug ?
<dholbach> LaserJock: as I said before: I doubt the patch is going to be big
<dholbach> if somebody prepare 0.8 or whatever the new version is, let me know and I'll try to work on a patch
<LaserJock> well, we should do gchemtuils 0.8 if we're going to do anything
<LaserJock> if I remember right that's supposed to work with goffice 0.4
<siretart> bashelier: I don't really care here, however you like
* siretart hugs LaserJock and ajmitch 
<siretart> lunch.now
<dholbach> LaserJock, mruiz: if there are problems with it, let me know and I'm happy to help to get that resolved
<mruiz> LaserJock, I had this problem: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/24096/
<dholbach> (as we've discussed it like 3-4 times already)
<mruiz> thanks dholbach !
<LaserJock> dholbach: well, I'm a bit concerned overall with using unstable goffice
<LaserJock> we got quite a few gnumeric bugs
<dholbach> LaserJock: but not because of goffice
<LaserJock> well
<dholbach> we have it in now, we can't roll back
<LaserJock> you have unstable goffice because of your version of gnumeric
<LaserJock> it's a trade off for sure
<dholbach> and we had gnumeric bugs before
<dholbach> we can't roll back easily and it'S good if we collaborate with upstream to get issues resolved
<dholbach> I don't feel that the current version of gnumeric is immature
<LaserJock> no, I wouldn't say that
<dholbach> ok good
<LaserJock> but we did have at least 2 releases where we released the unstable goffice version
<LaserJock> and skipped the stable one
<dholbach> yes
<LaserJock> which is sort of odd
<dholbach> skipped the stable one?
<dholbach> which versions are you talking about?
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> we had 0.1 and 0.3 
<LaserJock> and missed 0.2 and 0.4
<LaserJock> hopefully 0.4 will be in gutsy and it'll be all good
<dholbach> we have 0.4.0 in gutsy
<dholbach> ttbomk there was no 0.4.* when we released feisty
<LaserJock> yes
<dholbach> or it was when we were in deep freeze already
<LaserJock> there was suppose to be
<LaserJock> but it was very late
<dholbach> so there was nothing we could do
<dholbach> right
<LaserJock> sure
<dholbach> so best to deal with the goffice we have now :-)
<LaserJock> I'm not really complaining
<dholbach> ok good
<LaserJock> i'm just saying we need to watch things
<dholbach> right
<LaserJock> I talke with gchemutils upstream
<LaserJock> since I'm involved
<mruiz> :-)
<LaserJock> and he's adjusting his release schedule to better fit Ubuntu's schedule
<dholbach> when the API was broken in goffice, I remember that it was a small change in one call of a function
<dholbach> so if we really need to patch gnome-chem-utils, I doubt it's going to take a lot of effort
<dholbach> and that's been more than a year ago
<dholbach> maybe other changes have happened, but that I don't know
<dholbach> so if you want, please keep me in the loop and I'll try to help out
<mruiz> dholbach, LaserJock : then, what will happen with my merge (gnome-chemistry-utils)? or Should I do a package update (only)?
<dholbach> both
<LaserJock> dholbach: sure, thanks for the help
<dholbach> np
<LaserJock> gchemutils 0.8 is released
<LaserJock> and it deps on goffice > 0.3.6
<mruiz> yes: https://savannah.nongnu.org/projects/gchemutils/
<bashelier> dholbach: do you have time to have a look to a few sync requests ?
<LaserJock> I think trying to get 0.6.3 to build in gutsy is going to be a real mess
<mruiz> LaserJock, what's the current version of goffice ?
<dholbach> bashelier: not now, I have a phone call in some minutes and I need to prepare something
<dholbach> bashelier: please ask in here and if nobody replies back, drop me a mail
<bashelier> dholbach: np, thanks
<dholbach> thanks bashelier
* dholbach hugs bashelier
* bashelier hugs dholbach too :)
<LaserJock> mruiz: in gutsy 0.4
<mruiz> LaserJock: I found a bug related to missing headers and its patch: https://savannah.nongnu.org/projects/gchemutils/ 
<mruiz> https://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/index.php?19523
<bashelier> mruiz: you can use google.com/codesearch to find file using the undeclared functions and then have a look to the included headers ;)
<LaserJock> mruiz: yes, that as fixed in 0.6.5
<LaserJock> mruiz: but it only works with goffice 0.2
<mruiz> :-(
<StevenK> Lure: I have a package ready to upload; just waiting for the freeze to lift.
<Lure> StevenK: great - I am waiting for qt4 event loop support which is in 4.2-1
<StevenK> Lure: The merge was a nice difficult one, with Debian changing from -0 to -1 and trying to shoehorn the Ubuntu changes in
<Lure> StevenK: yep, I know our rules is very different than theirs (do not recall why really), and I am really happy that you did it ;-) thanks a lot
<StevenK> Lure: Why? -dbg packages
<Lure> StevenK: true that, but why the for loop being replaced?
<StevenK> Because we rely on make variables expanding out to rules, whereas the Debian way uses one target.
<Ubuntu-Qatar> hi all
<pochu> Does anybody's update-manager hangs when going to install updates? (gutsy)
<coNP> What is the proper way to get openbox 3.4 in gutsy? Should I wait till it appears in debian sid and file a sync request? Or should I update the package?
<gpocentek> coNP: we still have some time before the freeze, my opinion is that we should wait for an update in debian
<coNP> cannot wait a little freeze in this summer :)
<lionel> oh, openbox has a famous maintainer in Debian :)
<pygi> which would be?
<lionel> Mithandir :)
<pygi> he's famous? nah :)
<gpocentek> :)
<pygi> you must be joking :P
<gpocentek> pygi: be careful, he can do whatever he wants to your packages :p
<pygi> gpocentek, like what? :)
<gpocentek> hum... dropping them from the archive for instance :)
<pygi> gpocentek, doubt it ^^
<Lutin> could someone using an amd64 arch. try to install cinepaint, and then try to install it from feisty-proposed to make sure it installs correctly ?
<xxxxx1> morning people
<giskard> chi sono i MOTU italiani^
<giskard> ops wrong channel :(
<effie_jayx> I ma trying to do a dbuild -S but it says my passphrase is not available... am I missing something?
<Hobbsee> use -k<yourkeyid> too
<effie_jayx> okk
<imbrandon> Hobbsee, -k<your@email.com> works too :)
<Hobbsee> true that
<imbrandon> i never rember my key id but i use my email :)
<imbrandon> easy to rember
* Hobbsee just exports her keyID
<StevenK> Part of your email should work too, I use -kstevenk
<effie_jayx> I get the same error
<effie_jayx> i did dbuild -kF9C7378B -S
<effie_jayx> and it says my passphrase is not available...
<effie_jayx> that may have to do with the fact I got My gpg key on my older box no?
<imbrandon> is your gpg secret key on the machine ?
<imbrandon> yes you need to have it on the same machine
<imbrandon> it nees the secret key and the passphrase
<bashelier> effie_jayx: gpg --list-secret-keys
<imbrandon> thats what makes it secure
<effie_jayx> imbrandon,  I have the secring.gpg from my older box
<RainCT> Hi
<effie_jayx> ok I just imported it to my new box
<effie_jayx> thanks guys
<imbrandon> np
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<xxxxx1> hello DarkSun88 
<DarkSun88> xxxxx1: Hello
<fernando> moin all
<khaur> hi, is there a reason for mozilla-mplayer package to depend on "mplayer", so that "mplayer-nogui" is not an option?
<ogra> khaur, how would your mother change settings for it ? would she know how to do that in commandline ?
<ward_> i was able to compile gephex so i thought, let's find out how to make a deb from it
<ogra> might be a good move to have "mplayer | mplayer-nogui" in the deps though so you can optionally use nogui ... but for the common user you will need soemthing to change settings 
<ward_> found this page: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=51003
<ward_> followed instructions, but... i don't end up with a deb and i don't end up with an error either !
<ward_> what could be the problem?
* ward_ wants an error
<khaur> ogra: err.. i'm not sure what you mean, but it should be so that by default is no mplayer is installed, mozilla-mplayer pulls mplayer with it, but if mplayer-nogui is installed, mozilla-mplayer settles with it
<ogra> khaur, well ,the reason to default to the gui variant is that we dont support commandline stuff by default if we have an alternative ... but what i wrote above about the deps will solve it for you as you described
<ogra> khaur, feel free to file a bug and quote our conversation ;)
<khaur> ogra: yeah, my problem is just that in order to have mozilla-mplayer, i _have_ to install mplayer (with gui). i'm not saying for the common user should be changed
<khaur> err.. i'm not saying anything should be changed for the common user ;)
<Adri2000> ogra: what about a dep mplayer | mplayer-nogui ?
<ogra> khaur, adding a | mplayer-nogui after mplayer to teh deps will solve that ...  
<Adri2000> :)
<ogra> Admiral_Chicago, yes thats what i said above
<ogra> 10 mins ago :)
<ward_> anyone?
<Adri2000> ogra: ah, sorry
<xxxxx1> hello dholbach 
<dholbach> hiya xxxxx1
<dholbach> how's it going?
<xxxxx1> fine. :)
<ward_> probably tjhe problem is that there is no configure file in gephex, to get the configure file one must first execute bootstrap.sh
<ward_> how can i tell dh_make that it needs to execute bootstrap.sh first?
<ward_> anyone please?
<ward_> i'm working on it atm and i don't have very much time
<ward_> (also: i'm not doing it for myself... i don't need it...)
<jekil> hello
* ward_ stops wasting time, i'll read it when i get back if someone answers
* RainCT is sorry for ward_ but has no idea about it :p
<ward_> its weird
<ward_> people in here make packages right?
<ward_> (in a different way then the ubuntu guide and forum says? :s)
<ward_> RainCT, if u have a link to another howto/tutorial alike page
<ward_> feel free to give it lol
<xxxxx1> ward_: why different?
<ward_> xxxxx1, because RainCT didn't know i thought people here made packages in a different way then what i'm doing
<RainCT> ward_: no, sorry. I haven't looked much into packaging yet, just fixing small stuff. 
<ward_> RainCT, its the first time i try too
<ward_> RainCT, i thought, hmmm lets try to make adeb
<Adri2000> khaur: have you filed a bug against mplayerplug-in (source package of mozilla-mplayer)?
<RainCT> ward_: :)
<xxxxx1> ward_: you're using revu?
<ward_> xxxxx1, nope
<ward_> this guide: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=51003
<ward_> xxxxx1, 
<ward_> xxxxx1, i think the only problem is bootstrap.sh needs to get executed to get a configure file
<ward_> and dh_make obviously needs a configure file
<xxxxx1> ward_: did you read packagingguide?
<ward_> xxxxx1, this is the only ubuntu document i found
<ward_> and this one: http://doc.gwos.org/index.php/Deb_Guide
<ward_> but that's the same
<xxxxx1> https://help.ubuntu.com/6.10/pdf/ubuntu/C/packagingguide.pdf
<ward_> xxxxx1, i'll look at it
<ward_> xxxxx1, do i need to read all of that to make one little package???
<xxxxx1> you can start with packagingguide.
<ward_> lol easy decision, i won't ever make a deb in my life :-)
<ward_> i don't need them anyway, i can install from source :-)
<ward_> now i know what the developer meant with "there is probably not gonna be time to make a deb"
<ward_> why exectly is there wrong info in the docs then by the way?
<ward_> and the forum
<ward_> xxxxx1, 
<ward_> so those docs from the forum are simply wrong?
<xxxxx1> i didn't read it forum msg.
<ward_> that way appealed to me as its not taking much time
<ward_> they used dh_make, xxxxx1 
<xxxxx1> but is safe for you learn the first steps from packagingguide and then ask your questions.
<ward_> xxxxx1, i can't read that much
<ward_> maybe i'll make it trough the first 2 pages without being distracted
<ward_> but will do whenever i have more time/feel like it
<Adri2000> khaur: actually the bug is already reported. assigning to me, I will take care of it later.
<nixternal> ScottK: you free at all? Wanted to see if you could take a look at that kplayer app I put on revu...don't approve it, but you can remove it...I am going to resubmit a RFS to mentors here in a few, but would like to get some input before I do
<leonel> goooood  morning !
<bashelier> 17:16 < leonel> goooood  morning !
<bashelier> nice ^^
<leonel> :)  I'm  on  UTC -6
<leonel> so   9:22 AM here
<leonel> well Have a  GREAT day !
<leonel> looking  at    https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GutsyReleaseSchedule    Jun 21  Remaining upstream merges completed, Rebuild Test     that means that  no more  merges  after  Jun 21 ?
<Hobbsee> leonel: in the best case, yes
<leonel> Hobbsee: so If I'd like to  gutsy had a package with  newer version   I should  ask to be included on debian  then ask for merge to gutsy before  Jun 21 ?
<Hobbsee> leonel: you can still do merges and such up to upstream versoin freeze
<Hobbsee> the thing you quoted refered to when teh autosyncer gets turned off
<leonel> Hobbsee: ok thanks 
<leonel> debian has   dbmail 2.2.3   and  dbmail has released  2.2.5  
<leonel> and gutsy has 2.2.3
<leonel> so for  gutsy to have 2.2.5   the road is first  in debian then gutsy   
<leonel> right /
<leonel>  ?
<Hobbsee> usually
<Hobbsee> it's easier that way
<Hobbsee> although you can throw 2.2.5 straight into ubuntu, then add any of debian's fixes in too
<effie_jayx> leonel,  can you help me with a merge?
<leonel> effie_jayx:  never made a merge    I need to learn that procedure 
<Hobbsee> effie_jayx: what's up?
<leonel> Hobbsee: that sounds great  !
<effie_jayx> Hobbsee,  well I am not certain of what I am to do with this merge...
<effie_jayx> Hobbsee,  I am looking at it and I am trying to check if everything is ok for ubuntu.
<effie_jayx> Hobbsee,  check the changelog for moodle
<effie_jayx> 1.7.2-1
<khaur> Adri2000: ahh, great. thank you very much :)
<RainCT> how should a package with version `4.3.0~rc1-1' be named with -ubuntuX ?
<RainCT> 4.3.0~rc1-1ubuntu1?
<RainCT> ah ok nvm
<xxxxx1> RainCT: it already have a debian version?
<RainCT> xxxxx1: nevermind
<dholbach> siretart: did you notice problems with the speed of net connection of tiber?
<dholbach> siretart: or changes?
<dholbach> (I'm just downloading a 120M netbeans5.5 with 8k/s ... :-/)
<xxxxx1> dialup?
<xxxxx1> :>
<dholbach> no
<nixternal> dholbach: speaking of netbeans, does the intellisense stuff work for you? where it completes the functions, i.e. Double.parseDouble(str), when you type in Double and hit the . it brings up a list of the functions or autocompletes them?
<nixternal> some in class said it does it for them in windows, however I haven't gotten it to work with Kubuntu yet
<nixternal> s/some/somone
<nixternal> s/somone/someone
<dholbach> nixternal: no idea, I'm sorry
<dholbach> nixternal: I'm mostly reviewing the packaging and basically testing it
<dholbach> nixternal: I suggest you get in touch with the maintainers and or file bugs
<nixternal> while my_spelling == sucks { s/mistype/correct_spelling; }
<nixternal> dholbach: I will look at it a little more, for some reason it is looking at jre and I would think it should look at jdk
<dholbach> I don't know
<dholbach> there are even a few bug contacts for it
<dholbach> so best to file a bug and find out
<nixternal> well I did mine as a source install...I will grab the pkg and test it
<joejaxx> hello elkbuntu :)
<joejaxx> hello dholbach nixternal 
<nixternal> hola joejaxx 
<nixternal> popey: you around at all? there is a guy in #ubuntu-doc that is looking for screencast editor advice...do you have any?
<xxxxx1> hello LaserJock 
<LaserJock> hi
<geser> Hi LaserJock
<tsmithe> oh look it's a LaserJock 
* LaserJock waves to the crowd
<Vorian> hello
* nixternal chucks a five to his gumbah LaserJock 
<LaserJock> heh
<Vorian> nixternal, isn't a gumba a mushroom
<Vorian> ?
<nixternal> I wonder where persia is hiding...I need to redo the RFS for KPlayer since the debian-multimedia (marillat) doesn't want to do it officially
<nixternal> Vorian: I have no clue
<tsmithe> isn't it a little creature in mario, Vorian?
<Vorian> ah
<nixternal> I just hear it all the time at the local cafe, thought it meant friend or something
<tsmithe> but it looks like a mushroom :P
<tsmithe> lol
<tsmithe> probably does
<nixternal> I could have very well just insulted LaserJock as well and not even know it
<Vorian> nope, its goomba
<Vorian> sorry nixternal 
<Vorian> :)
<LaserJock> nixternal: like I care ;-)
<nixternal> am I right or wrong? :)
<nixternal> hahah
<nixternal> LaserJock: awww, do you need a hug?
<nixternal> I am not going to give you one, but I can find someone to do it I am sure
<LaserJock> nah, doing fine thanks
<nixternal> good to hear
<LaserJock> I got all my core-dev votes in
<LaserJock> I'm happy
<nixternal> my lawn is 2 feet high and I can't find the motivation to go and mow it
<nixternal> every time I do, something *buntu pops up and draws my attention
<nixternal> LaserJock: like you were expecting anything less? I could have told you that you will be a core-dev asap
<popey> nixternal: thanks
<nixternal> thanks popey!
<popey> :)
<LaserJock> nixternal: well, I wasn't certain by any means
<nixternal> I knew you would get it..same with Hobbsee...How much more can you prove that you know what you are doing..catch my drift?
<LaserJock> nixternal: well, I wasn't as pleased with my +packages page as I wanted to be
<LaserJock> I was originally going to go for it right after Mt. View
<LaserJock> but I thought I needed more work in Main
<nixternal> LaserJock: just because you aren't happy with your +packages view has nothing to do with the knowledge you have of the system...everyone looks at you with questions and you seem to always answer them..and when you have questions you always know where to go...you know what you are doing and it has been proved
<nixternal> now me filling out a motu app is 50/50...I would expect a no right now, that is why I am waiting
<porthose> asac: Good mourning
<pygi> hey folks
<pygi> anyone have access to sparc or ppc?
* pygi would need to test a fix
<nixternal> I need a vid card for my ppc so I can get it working
<pygi> nixternal, oh :)
<geser> pygi: sparky.ubuntuwire.com but only for devs
<pygi> won't help then, but thanks
<tarzeau> pygi: yes?
<pygi> tarzeau, yes what? :)
<tarzeau> pygi: i got an ultra5 (cow.ethz.ch) 
<tarzeau> pygi: what you need tested on the sparc?
<pygi> tarzeau, possible to test a gutsy debdiff for brasero for me?
<tarzeau> err it's debian sid... i can only test software packages on it
<tarzeau> or you tell me that also works there and we test it
<pygi> perhaps it will work, yea
<pygi> tarzeau, please grab newest brasero source package from gutsy, and gimme mail, so I'll send you debdiff
<pygi> ups, no, it won't work
<pygi> damn it :(
<pygi> (forgot we don't have libburn and libisofs there)
<tarzeau> i can also installt hose?
<tarzeau> if it's just those two
<asac> porthose: hey
<tarzeau> pygi: you know what i'd like to be able...
<porthose> I have a little problem I'm on my old ladies puter, I have to go buy a new hd for my puter
<tarzeau> pygi: i've got this script http://www.linuks.mine.nu/ubuntu/uncurse   -- what about the other direction? ubuntu is available for sparc? 
<pygi> tarzeau, yes, it's available for sparc
<tarzeau> pygi: and gutsy is like sid, right?
<tarzeau> pygi: can you give me your sources.list somehow?
<pygi> tarzeau, kindof. but perhaps it lacks some packages
<tarzeau> doesn't matter, it'll be fun to write a curse script
<pygi> of gutsy?
<pygi> sure
<tarzeau> yeah, send them over to me
<porthose> so could u meet me back here at 5:00 utc
<asac> 5:00 utc? in the morning?
<asac> porthose: ?
<pygi> tarzeau, http://pastebin.ca/545177
<porthose> around this time
<asac> porthose: consider, its 7am here at that time :)
<porthose> what time zone you in
<asac> UTC + 2 
<tarzeau> pygi: in ubuntu is there a codename like sid that never changes?
<tarzeau> pygi: for the latest one?
<pygi> tarzeau, no
<porthose> If around this time is good
<tarzeau> pygi: k, i try to change my box into ubuntu, if it works i get back to you
<pygi> tarzeau, kk
<pygi> thanks
<porthose> I want to help but it seems like everything else is getting in the way right now, see you tomorrow this time. k
<pygi> porthose, hehe :)
<tarzeau> pygi: looks good so far: http://www.linuks.mine.nu/ubuntu/curse
<pygi> hehe :)
<tarzeau> machine is not so fast, so takes a moment to do the "upgrade"
<pygi> no worries
<pygi> thanks for doing this btw :)
<tarzeau> no prob, this way i can test my uncurse script further
<tarzeau> you play nethack too?
<pygi> no :P
<tarzeau> sauerbraten, or other games?
<pygi> no games here, sorry
<tarzeau> 3d modeling? music stuff?
<pygi> I play guitar, but that isn't going to help you :P
<tarzeau> record it?
<tarzeau> i need free music songs, for in a game...
<pygi> meh, I don't play good :)
<tarzeau> k :)
<pygi> but nice that you're making a game, we need those :)
<tarzeau> i don't make a game, it's more of a level/map/textures/music for a game, www.sauerbraten.org
<tarzeau> pygi: but i do game packages :)
<pygi> oki, we need those too ^_^
<pygi> meh, cube2
<pygi> now I know what you're talking about :)
<tarzeau> yeh ;)
<pygi> I think I started original cube once when I was testing something
<tarzeau> that must be a long time ago, cube is pretty much older
<tarzeau> dpkg: regarding .../dpkg_1.14.4+svn20070602r802-0ubuntu1_sparc.deb containing dpkg:
<tarzeau>  package uses Breaks; not supported in this dpkg
<tarzeau> ugh, ubuntu hacks dpkg?
<pygi> meh'
<tarzeau> they still don't have lzma support?
<pygi> :(
<tarzeau> pygi: no no, that was just the 1st try
<tarzeau> pygi: it can take a few, don't give up so early
<pygi> :P
<tarzeau> if we want ubuntu, we get it
<tarzeau> even if it's by hacking sources and manually building, installing them
<tarzeau> i don't want a system between sid and gutsy -- either one or another
<tarzeau> dpkg -i --force-all dpkg*ubuntu*.deb
<tarzeau> works :)
<tarzeau> now for the rest of the packages
<pygi> tarzeau, sorry, but you're doing weird and hackish stuff :P
<tarzeau> pygi: create a gutsy sparc box for you?
<pygi> tarzeau, not that =)
<pygi> the conversion stuff hehe :)
<tarzeau> it works. rly. i swear
<tarzeau> does it matter if i don't run a ubuntu kernel?
<tarzeau> (it'd require a reboot, which i hate, downtime coolness...)
<tarzeau> do they also have KEXEC enabled? wait doesn't work on non-x86
<pygi> don't think kernel would matter much  in this case
<tarzeau> great, i don't have a cd-burner in the box either
<pygi> you don
<pygi> don't need cd-burner
<pygi> I need you to "apt-get source brasero", apply debdiff I give you, and try building it in pbuilder gutsy enviroment
<tarzeau> pygi: still upgrading
<pygi> (you could have done that without converting sid to gutsy IMHO but heh :P)
<tarzeau> i know, but i was curious if it's possible to convert
<tarzeau> and i'm surprised how well it works
<tarzeau> i've had several people wanting to convert their ubuntu to debian, and did so successfully
<pygi> everything is possible, but with hacks
<tarzeau> damn ubuntu broke my webserver on cow.ethz.ch
<pygi> what did you expect :P
<tarzeau> it starts it again
<Baby> hi here too tarzeau :)
<tarzeau> Baby: heh, hi
<tarzeau> Baby: are you not dd? you might want to sponsor evolvotron?
<pygi> baby is a dd? How possible is that? o.O
<tarzeau> dunno, it was just a guess
<Baby> nop, I'm not a DD
<tarzeau> Baby: you need to get one
<Baby> pygi: what's wrong with being a DD anyway?
<Baby> :P
<pygi> Baby, nothing, but how can a baby be DD? :
<pygi> :P
<Baby> XDDD
<Baby> yup, that's right ;)
<Baby> that's why I'm not a DD i guess :)
<pygi> perhaps an honorable DD tho :P
* Baby will found debian-babies and ubuntu-babies
<tarzeau> ugh
<Baby> ;)
<tarzeau> weeee ubuntu stops all my deaemons and doesn't start them...
<tarzeau> are they nuts???
<pygi> tarzeau, dude, I told you that you're doing it the wrong way :P
<pygi> haha :)
<Baby> stops all the daemons? exorcism? buffy? ;)
<tarzeau> and it looks like [ OK ]  SUSE and REDHAT without colors
<tarzeau> damn ubuntu is fast http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/games/donkey-bolonkey
<tarzeau> they do it automatic or manually?
<TheDumbo> no it aint
<pygi> what are you talking about tarzeau :P
<pygi> tarzeau, how is it going? :P
<tarzeau> pygi: Running updmap-sys. This may take some time...
<tarzeau> pygi: you've ever worked on sparc computers?
<pygi> tarzeau, very very tiny bit
<tarzeau> they're not like buzz lightyear
<tarzeau> but i've updated my launchpad info meanwhile
<tarzeau> pygi: hey, i are ubuntuhero also, can i has karma?
<pygi> tarzeau, lol? :P
<tarzeau> https://launchpad.net/~gurkan-linuks is me!
<tarzeau> i also wants a karma
<pygi> heh
<tarzeau> rly just wan!
<tarzeau> it's still upgrading btw, Building format(s) --byhyphen language.dat. This may take some time...
<tarzeau> the tex packagers should be shot
<tarzeau> it's being called and updated many many times and it takes ages
<tarzeau> i'll remove it right afterwards
<tarzeau> now what can i do with launchpad? i like those small rocket icons. can i set up us the bomb?
<pygi> np
<tarzeau> pygi: want to learn some nethack?
<tarzeau> webserver running again
<tarzeau> pygi: telnet 80.219.76.235 27015      to watch
<pygi> tarzeau, no need to watch, thanks :)
<pygi> and no time for nethack
<tarzeau> ok
<etank> tarzeau: that is like watching ascii pacman :)
<tarzeau> etank: heh, and best of all it's realtime and you can make bets
<etank> strange
<leonel> In a backport  can I edit  debian/rules  to adjust the  package versions  ?
<tarzeau> leonel: the version is not in debian/rules
<tarzeau> leonel: it's in oh for the deps? yes sure
<leonel> I'm trying to backport python-psycopg2 to dapper 
<pygi> jdong, poke
<leonel> tarzeau: I mean   debian/control
<tarzeau> leonel: yes that
<leonel> python-psycopg2  asks  for  debhelper  5.0.37   and  dapper has  5.0.7
<tarzeau> leonel: if the software still works with those other versions
<leonel> yes
<tarzeau> leonel: usually you don't do versioned depends, if you do, you do it with a very damn good reason
<leonel> it compiles  and works  with    python setup.py  build     and  install  and works  fine
<leonel> so no problems  to  edit debian/control  to  adjust the dependencies  ?
<tarzeau> no
<leonel> great 
<leonel> thanks
<leonel> or ...
<leonel> dpkg-buildpackage   -d  will do  ?
<leonel> so I don't edit  debian/control ...
<tarzeau> no
<tarzeau> edit debian/control
<leonel> ok
<tarzeau> pygi: ok i'm ready tell me command again please
<pygi> tarzeau, "apt-get source brasero"
<tarzeau> and build it?
<pygi> then apply this:
<pygi> http://files.libburnia-project.org/releases/sparc_ppc_build_fix.debdiff
<pygi> and then build
<tarzeau> k
<pygi> (In pbuilder)
<tarzeau> ok but is slow
<tarzeau> pygi: how to apply the debdiff?
<pygi> tarzeau, patch -p0 > sparc_ppc_build_fix.debdiff
<pygi> I think :)
<tarzeau> can you give me .pbuilderrc for gutsy?
<tarzeau> i only know pbuilder in sid debian
<pygi> no here, sorry :(
<tarzeau> i'll try to figure out
<tarzeau> problem is patch is for 0.5.90
<tarzeau> and apt-get source got 0.5.2
<tarzeau> what version should i use?
<leonel> one dependency was on python-central which is not on dapper    edited   debian/rules  so It didn't call dh_pycentral  and all builded  fine ! 
<leonel> now  to make the source with those changes ?
<tarzeau> leonel: and you know what dh_pycentral is good for?
<tarzeau> leonel: i always use debuild (builds source+binary)
<tarzeau> dpkg-buildpackage is the same unless give it option to do otherwise
<pygi> tarzeau, meh, gutsy has 0.5.90
<tarzeau> so your sources.list wasn't good?
<pygi> it was (probably)
<pygi> damn, I just remembered
<pygi> sparc didn't built so you can't get 0.5.90 for sparc ;P
<pygi> this fix is supposed to fix it
<pygi> so you'll have to download source package manually
<tarzeau> i can do that... 
<leonel> tarzeau: dh_pycentral is for python modules    and  is provided  by python-central  which  dapper's does not have it 
<tarzeau> pbuilder create --distribution gutsy will take some time
<leonel> I edited  debian/control to remove  that dependency 
<tarzeau> leonel: aha. i'm a python illiterate
<leonel> tarzeau: I've already requested a  backport  in lauchpad
<leonel> tarzeau: this  deb I've made   will be for  internal use  only .
<tarzeau> leonel: i see
<leonel> tarzeau: while the backport gets done
<tarzeau> pygi: here's how it applied: patch -p4 < ../sparc_ppc_build_fix.debdiff
<pygi> oki :P
<pygi> as long as it applied :P
<tarzeau> building w/o pbuilder just to check, until pbuilder is ready
<tarzeau> applied perfectly
<pygi> k, let's see if it'll build
<leonel> no module compiled ..
<leonel> need to backport  python-central  ...
<tarzeau> installing some build-deps
<tarzeau> pygi:   libhal-dev: Depends: libhal1 (= 0.5.9-2ubuntu1) but 0.5.9-3 is to be installedE: Broken packages
<pygi> mrh
<tarzeau> pygi: maybe i can also update that package. it's just slow
<pygi> yup
<RainCT> good night
<bashelier> geser: 
<bashelier> oups
<bashelier> sorry
<tarzeau> pygi: trying now pbuilder build brasero_0.5.90-0ubuntu2.dsc
<pygi> kk
<nixternal> why does vim-full require gnome package?
<tarzeau> nixternal: apt-cache show vim-full
<tarzeau> apt-cache rdepends vim-gnome
<tarzeau> see ?
<xxxxx1> bye all
<nixternal> I know that..just wondered why all of the gnome stuff...would be nice to ahve a seperate vim-full that didn't depend on all of that
<tarzeau> pygi: sorry: W: Unable to locate package libburn4-dev
<tarzeau> E: No packages found
<tarzeau> pygi: rest is here http://cow.ethz.ch/ubuntu/brasero/
<tarzeau> i'm going to sleep or play some sauerbraten
<crimsun>      0.3.6-0ubuntu1 0
<crimsun>         500 http://archive.ubuntu.com gutsy/universe Packages
<crimsun> make sure you have universe enabled in your pbuilder cache.
<pygi> tarzeau, meh, ok
<tarzeau> me?
<tarzeau> MIRRORSITE=http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu
<tarzeau> DISTRIBUTION=gutsy
<tarzeau> that's my .pbuilderrc
<tarzeau> what do i need to add in there?
<crimsun> pbuilder only enables main by default.
<tarzeau> aha
<tarzeau> you can tell me what to make so it enables universe?
<crimsun> COMPONENTS="main universe"
<crimsun> you'll need --override-config next
<crimsun> (with update)
<tarzeau> k i try
<pygi> tarzeau, well, sparc should have libburn4-dev
<tarzeau> pygi: i try what crimsun suggest and retry to build
<tarzeau> pygi: possible my mirror is outdated?
<pygi> oki
<pygi> tarzeau, hear ya tomorrow, and thanks for helping
<pochu> lionel: Congratulations!
<lionel> thanks pochu :)
<pochu> lionel: now you can sponsor me :p
<lionel> ;)
<geser> lionel: welcome as MOTU
<lionel> thanks geser :)
<crimsun> congrats.
<crimsun> wait, did I +1?  What was I smoking?
<crimsun> ;-)
<lionel> thanks crimsun
<lionel> thanks for all your patience and uploads geser and crimsun !
<bashelier> hey geser :)
<Lutin> lionel: congrats :)
<geser> Hi bashelier
<superm1> speaking of uploads...... crimsun could I bugger you for a revu?
<pochu> superm1: ask lionel who is new :p
<superm1> lionel, congrats :)
<lionel> :)
<superm1> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5397
<bashelier> lionel: congrats! ;)
<lionel> thanks bashelier
<lionel> thanks supem1
<bashelier> superm1: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5397, why are you in Maintainer field instead of XSBC-Original-Maintainer ?
<superm1> bashelier, I'm going to be XSBC-Original-Maintainer once we get our mailing list 
<superm1> for ubuntu-mythtv
#ubuntu-motu 2007-06-07
<superm1> So its a "for now" sort of thing.  All of the mythbuntu packages that i'm submitting, i'm doing that way atm.
<crimsun> bashelier: it's perfectly acceptable for @ubuntu.com to appear in Maintainer and there not be XSBC-Original-Maintainer, which is only applicable if the source package is in Debian.
<bashelier> crimsun: didn't now that, thanks
<crimsun> superm1: missing Depends on ttf-bitstream-vera
<superm1> crimsun, didn't even anticipate that since that is installed with myth :)  Ok. i'll add it
<crimsun> superm1: is this package a dependency of "myth"?
<superm1> well it will be a dependency of mythbuntu-desktop
<superm1> which does depend on ttf-bitstream-vera
<superm1> just saying thats why i didnt catch it
<crimsun> ok.  You should still depend on it due to mythbuntu-desktop being a simple meta.
<superm1> right
<superm1> i'll fix that up after work later
<crimsun> ok.
<superm1> thanks
<crimsun> np
<crimsun> Fujitsu: I believe I've isolated the missing patch for the Unknown.  It's a shame I didn't read back far enough in the SVN commit history.
<Fujitsu> crimsun: What was it?
<crimsun> Fujitsu: http://preview.tinyurl.com/3b75wo
<Fujitsu> Um, so it was only updating the metadata if the state change failed? Wha?
<crimsun> it wasn't processing all the events, apparently
* Fujitsu applies.
* TheMuso decides to move from dchroot to schroot+LVM snapshots.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: schroot is nice.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: As I have found out, while experimenting with them.
<TheMuso> So I'm dumping my straight chroot partitions and using schroot.
<TheMuso> So much better when it comes to testing.
<DarkSun88> G'night
<Fujitsu> crimsun: That fixes it! But I must leave now.
<Fujitsu> Thanks!
<crimsun> np
<crimsun> I'll push it post-Tribe1
<AndyP> this might seem like a silly question but what's the difference between the outstanding merges and the updated merges listed on MoM?
<crimsun> ah crap, I ordered a movie ticket online and completely overlooked the time thanks to this Rhythmbox fix :-)
<AndyP> whoops
<jsgotangco> doh!
<crimsun> AndyP: outstanding -> have yet to be processed since the time MoM first ran in the devel cycle
<crimsun> AndyP: updated -> new merge versions available since the last time MoM ran in the devel cycle
<AndyP> crimsun: got it, thanks
<crimsun> ah, the sacrifices I make for Ubuntu ;-p
* crimsun phones the cinema
<crimsun> ok, fixed deb + source posted at http://adhd.irule.net/~crimsun/rhythmbox-gutsy/
<pochu> Good night folks!
<Kioshen> Hi everyone, as discussed during the recent Q&A with dholbach, I'd like to help out with updating package for the soon to be released Gnome 2.19.3
<Kioshen> I've read the recipe for updating a package on the wiki, but it doesn't explain what do I do with the resulting package afterwards
<Kioshen> I was wondering if somebody was available to give me a little hand
<crimsun> sure.  Can you be a bit more precise about what you intend to do "with the resulting package"?  Are you trying to compile it?
<Kioshen> Well after I manage to update the package somehow and sign it. Where should I upload it ? To REVU ?
<crimsun> Kioshen: if the source package already exists in Ubuntu, please file a bug against the source package using Launchpad, then attach URLs to the new source package.
<Kioshen> okay so I'll have to setup an anonymous ftp on my home server then
<Kioshen> Do I have to add a particular tag ?
<crimsun> you don't have to set up an anon ftp; you may use REVU as you mentioned above.
<crimsun> the important part is filing the bug and linking to the new source package.
<crimsun> you don't have to use a special flag AFAIR
<crimsun> s/fl/t/
<Kioshen> crimsun: okay I'll search malone to find how to do it properly
<Kioshen> crimsun: thank you :)
<crimsun> np
<Kioshen> Come to think of it, I guess I have to warn the current Ubuntu maintainer when I'm working on updating a package like an ITP bug for Debian ?
<Kioshen> or the bug report is sufficient warning ?
<crimsun> it would be courteous to mention it.
<Kioshen> guess i'll be spaming a couple people then hehe
<helfire> how is everyone tonight?
<leonel> does   sun-java6 is handled  here ?
<leonel> http://sunsolve.sun.com/search/document.do?assetkey=1-26-102934-1  how does this can be  patched ?
<ajmitch> sun java is mostly handled by the java team, such as doko_ 
<ajmitch> who is most likely asleep
<ajmitch> please file a bug & mark it as a security bug
<ajmitch> keescook: alive?
<RAOF> I wonder if the lack of new democracyplayer bugs is due to it actually working for people other than me, or because noone's running gutsy.
<luckyone_> hello masters of the universe
<luckyone_> please, I beg of you - can you help me get kdenlive into the repos?
<luckyone_> I need to make a father's day gift for my dad
<ajmitch> sigh
<ajmitch> people should stick around if they want things to be done
<luckyone> hello?
<ajmitch> hi
<jsgotangco> ajmitch: heh
<ajmitch> luckyone: you have a package of it that you want reviewed?
<luckyone> ajmitch: I don't - is how to do that on the Contributing page?
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> various things on there like the packaging guide
<luckyone> ajmitch: the packages are availalbe here http://www.debian-multimedia.org/mirrors-testing.html
<ajmitch> though I see there is an 'in progress' bug
<luckyone> ajmitch: for kdenlive?
<ajmitch> yes, though not much info on it
<ajmitch> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/93892
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 93892 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  KDenlive" [Wishlist,In progress]  
<luckyone> I am very excited about getting this - it looks much easier than Kino for newbs like me
<AndyP> good night all
<jussi01> good morning all!!
<ajmitch> hello
<ajmitch> in .au for a change?
<jussi01australia> ajmitch: yea
<jussi01australia> just got here yesterday
<jussi01australia> :D
<ajmitch> how long are you there for?
<jussi01australia> 2 weeks
<ajmitch> not bad
<jussi01australia> :D anyway, got to run for a little while, heading out to do some stuff :D
<ajmitch> bye
<joejaxx> lionel: Congrats :D
<leonel> ajmitch: ok  I will 
<leonel> ajmitch:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sun-java6/+bug/115687    it's already reported but not as  a security bug 
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 115687 in sun-java6 "java6 update1 is released, please update" [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]  
<ajmitch> probably because it was announced as a security problem afterwards
<leonel> so can it be changed  as a security bug ?
<ajmitch> yes, I've done so
<leonel> I look but I can't see where to change it 
<superm1> crimsun, ping
<jmg> hrm i tried to upgrade to feisty using update-manager and it failed so i am continuing with apt-get 
<jmg> so many questions from debconf :/
<LaserJock> is anybody here running a mailing list that gets email from LP?
<StevenK> LaserJock: Yes.
<StevenK> LaserJock: ubuntu-universe-sponsors on lists.u.c
<LaserJock> StevenK: is it an open list?
<StevenK> Sort of.
<StevenK> In fact, the only messages it gets are from LP.
<LaserJock> hmm, my ubuntu-science list is apparently getting a lot of spam
<LaserJock> the only reason I have it as an open list is because of LP bugmail
<jsgotangco> you have no idea how many spam we get on the community council list ;-)
<StevenK> We (being Hobbsee and I) had u-u-s set to "subscribers only", but this means we had to whitelist everyone manually, which was getting irriating.
<ajmitch> jsgotangco: lots of complaints? :)
<jsgotangco> heh wish it was complaints, its mostly about the usual insult to my manhood
<StevenK> Ah yes, the usual spam.
<LaserJock> StevenK: so you white list them as they come in and hopefully the list gets smaller with time?
<StevenK> LaserJock: "had set", not anymore.
<LaserJock> ah, so it's completely open now?
<StevenK> I didn't say that.
<StevenK> But I think the solution being used is not suitable for your problem.
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> so maybe I just need tell people to get better spam filters
<StevenK> Heh
<LaserJock> hmm, if you could get mailman to accept messages with an Launchpad header that'd probably work
<LaserJock> I wish I could get this list on lists.ubuntu.com
<Burgundavia> which list?
<LaserJock> ubuntu-science
<Burgundavia> then move it
<LaserJock> heh, easier said than done
<jussi01au> Hello again
<Hobbsee> lionel: congratulations
<lionel> morning
<lionel> Hobbsee: thanks!
* Hobbsee hugs LaserJock 
<StevenK> lionel: Congrats, I've approved your u-u-s membership, too
<LaserJock> hi Hobbsee 
<LaserJock> congrats lionel 
<Hobbsee> hiya
<lionel> StevenK: I've just seen that. Double thanks for you ;-)
<lionel> Thanks LaserJock
<ajmitch> sigh, snow tonight/tomorrow
<StevenK> Fun.
<lathiat> i would be excited about that, having never seen snow before :)
<lathiat> i'm sure it gets to be a PITA but would be exciting the first time ;p
<imbrandon> never seen snow!?!
<StevenK> Me either.
<lathiat> nope..
<imbrandon> wow
<lathiat> no snow in Australia for the most part
<ajmitch> imbrandon: they're australians
<lathiat> especially not on the western side
<imbrandon> its 80 F here atm
<imbrandon> summer
<ajmitch> even plenty of kiwis have never seen snow
* Hobbsee has seen snow 1 and a half times.
<imbrandon> half , hehe
* RAOF wonders about the "1/2"
* RAOF comes from Tasmania, and hence has seen snow all the time.
<imbrandon> penguins ftw
<Hobbsee> fake snow.
<imbrandon> stuck in the freezer ?
<LaserJock> my goodness
* StevenK bites his tongue so the Tasmanian jokes don't escape.
<imbrandon> heya LaserJock 
<LaserJock> where I'm from we have snow probably at least 5 months a year
* RAOF wasn't born there, so StevenK can go wild for all he cares :)
<imbrandon> they will love boston in november then, probably be 3 feet of snow
<LaserJock> heh
<StevenK> RAOF: Heh
* Hobbsee wont be at boston, so wont get to see it :(
<Hobbsee> unless something major happens
* ajmitch won't be at boston
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: like getting sponsored?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: probably more than that.  but that would help
<LaserJock> I don't think I'll make Boston either
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: it's the fact that uni will probably get mroe than a little pissed off.
<LaserJock> which is sad since it's in the US
<Hobbsee> and the non-US ones interest me more
<ajmitch> well you're probably certain to get sponsored
<LaserJock> I like the US ones better
<StevenK> Spoken like a true American.
<LaserJock> I don't do quite so well in foreign countries
<LaserJock> StevenK: it's what I know :-)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: yeah, but i'd prefer the non US ones, and i'd prefer to get sponsored to them - assuming that i wouldnt get sponsored every time
<ajmitch> which is still likely
<Hobbsee> what, the sponsorship every time?
<ajmitch> yes
<Hobbsee> i thought i had to work there for that
* TheMuso would like to be sponsored for Boston, if Hobbsee doesn't. :)
<ajmitch> you almost do
<nixternal> !Hobbsee
<ubotu> I phear the stick so shhhhh
<nixternal> woohoo, hola chica!
<Hobbsee> sabdfl has requested new kubuntu people get sponsored for november
<Hobbsee> hiya nixternal 
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: true that.
<TheMuso> I'd like to go anyway.
<nixternal> 00:53:30 [ LaserJock]  I like the US ones better
<nixternal> when was the last time you went to Boston?
<nixternal> haha
<TheMuso> There is a small chance that I could go for UbuntuStudio...
<LaserJock> I've never been to Boston
<LaserJock> but international travel just gets me nervous
<nixternal> I actually like Boston..it is a rough and tumble type of town
<Hobbsee> nixternal: which means what?
<StevenK> LaserJock: Try it from .au
<nixternal> make a wrong turn and it could be your last..they have some serious gang issues
<StevenK> Oh, that's ... comforting.
<nixternal> Hobbsee: meaning, if you don't wear Bruin's black and gold, you are asking for a fight :)
<Hobbsee> okay, then i'm *really* not going to boston.
<Hobbsee> even more so than before
<nixternal> the city of Boston, the inner harbor area, around Fanuel (I spelled that wrong I am sure) is awesome
<nixternal> you go south in to southie land, i.e., Brokton and such...like the AOL voice
<nixternal> Goodbye!
<LaserJock> bah
<LaserJock> like Paris was all that safe
<nixternal> but you have to hit the Irish pubs...my lord talk about a great time
<LaserJock> I'd say they should do it in Montana
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: that was the weird thing - spain felt safe
<nixternal> gotta go to the Salty Dog, the original Cheers pub
<nixternal> LaserJock: hahahah, or Chicago!
<LaserJock> but I don't want you all discovering how awesome my home state is and moving there ;-)
<LaserJock> http://www.montana-sucks.com/
<nixternal> hahaha
<TheMuso> I'm too happy in .au to move anywhere else.
* Hobbsee would prefer to be alive at the end of the conferences, tyvm.
<nixternal> and whatever you do when in Boston, do not go into the "Great Dig" as you will either drown, or it will collapse in on you :)
* nixternal can't wait for mako to read this log
<LaserJock> hah
<LaserJock> that's only happened once
<nixternal> twice, not including the workers
<nixternal> wasn't there a recent squashing?
<LaserJock> hmm, the one I heard about was a couple years ago I think
<nixternal> one just happened either in 06 or 07
<nixternal> a big chunk skwished um
<nixternal> ;)
* LaserJock notes that Montana is very safe, unless you mess with a bear, moose, or mountain lion
<nixternal> then again, us Chicagoans can't say crap...our own river sprung a damn leak
<LaserJock> or oh, if you stake a claim on somebody's water rights or mine
<nixternal> or you go where it says "NO TRESPASSING"
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> don't snip fence wires
<StevenK> Isn't that like half the state?
<nixternal> screw that, Montana has crazy militiamen and cults and stuff
<LaserJock> nixternal: but that keeps us safe
<LaserJock> who needs police?
<nixternal> very true
<nixternal> my lord, I am moving to Montana!
* Hobbsee now thinks better of being *anywhere* in the US.
<nixternal> actually, I like New Hampshire...their motto is "Live Free or Die"
<StevenK> Hobbsee: That is a good idea.
<nixternal> Hobbsee: the US is a huge cesspool
<LaserJock> we had a luny that set his grandparents on fire in their house
<Hobbsee> cesspool?
<nixternal> and I can do the breast stroke in it!
<StevenK> Hobbsee: A cistern
<StevenK> Basically
<nixternal> the bottom of a drain, where all the nasty stuff collects
<Hobbsee> ahh
<LaserJock> my parents even though of locking their door
<nixternal> hehe
<LaserJock> but they couldn't find the key
<nixternal> hahahhaa
<nixternal> heh, and doors in Chicago are like bank vaults
<nixternal> where jjesse lives, where I was born, it is the same
<nixternal> noone messes with you, you got the militia...good stuff
<nixternal> NYC would be a cool place as well for a UDS
<nixternal> DC, northwest side only
<jsgotangco> you guys complain too much about your home areas, you haven't seen really really bad parts :P
<LaserJock> I've been to a conference in DC
<nixternal> jsgotangco: I have been to Rockwell Gardens, it doesn't get any worse
<nixternal> Rockwell Gardens actually caused me to quit working for CPS
<LaserJock> it was ok, but hotels were really expensive and food was hard to find
<nixternal> ya, they close everything so early in DC
<nixternal> unless you are in Georgetown
<LaserJock> I vote for Kansas City
<LaserJock> and we can all hook up to imbrandon's sweet setup
<nixternal> eh, KC is OK if you are into that sweet bbq ;)
<imbrandon> :)
<nixternal> sweet, 21.33s of lag
<nixternal> I knew you would come around and see that one ;p
<imbrandon> i vote KC
<imbrandon> we even have the confrence rooms at the same building my DC is in
<imbrandon> that we rent
<nixternal> KC would work for me, 8 hour drive I think
<imbrandon> 2 miles from the airoport
<LaserJock> hmm, but then you guys had BTK
<nixternal> hahahahhahahaha
<LaserJock> that's a -1 there
<nixternal> I was just thinking about that
<imbrandon> btk ?
<Admiral_Chicago> nixternal: we can carpool :)
<nixternal> BTK is gone
<nixternal> Bind
<nixternal> Torture
<superm1> sweet its only 3 hours for me imbrandon.  do it.
<nixternal> Kill
<nixternal> the btk killer ring a bell imbrandon ?
<nixternal> ;)
<imbrandon> i'll poke my boss and sabdfl about it, dunno if it would go anywhere, but it would be cool
<imbrandon> dude mythbuntu.org got dugg? wow
<superm1> imbrandon, yes :)
<imbrandon> 80 MB/s for a bit
<nixternal> heh, Chicago has a Googleplex now..we are supposed to go down for Google days or something this weekend..they want to wine and dine us
<imbrandon> superm1, should have took me up on the lighttpd :)
<imbrandon> hehe
<LaserJock> I want to go to Chicago
<superm1> imbrandon, i was thinking about that at about 12PM today :)
<LaserJock> everybody tells me I need to go there
<imbrandon> heh
<nixternal> LaserJock: jjesse was just here a couple of weeks ago
<superm1> imbrandon, where do you have stats at for the day for it?
<nixternal> LaserJock: all we have is a bean
<imbrandon> superm1, http://cacti.gsi-host.com/cacti/graph_image.php?local_graph_id=20721&rra_id=1&nologin=1   <-- thats the port mythinbuntu.org is on
<superm1> yup right about 12, that when i remember it being pretty bad
<imbrandon> spiked at 82mb
<superm1> i ran awstats on it, some 1507 ISOs went out 
<imbrandon> heh
<superm1> (not counting the guy who mirrored us and the torrents of course)
<imbrandon> yea its best to do torrent only on the webserver, even if the server seeds
<superm1> we're still on pg2 of digg right now too.  
<imbrandon> we found that out with ubuntustudio.org
<superm1> we were making bets in -mythtv about how many ISOs were going to be downloaded since the rss feed announce.  none of us even anticipated this many
<imbrandon> for an alpha thats good
* Hobbsee didn tknow mythtv were doing ISO's - although that's logicla
<StevenK> Hobbsee: It's Mythbuntu, not MythTV
<StevenK> If I could afford the odd $1,000 for a Myth box, I'd be downloading one as well.
<imbrandon> before you make the next release lemme know a few hours before , we'll tweak some settings and squeeze somemore horse power out of the box
<Hobbsee> StevenK: sorry, that
<LaserJock> I got to talk to one of the IT managers of my Uni today
<superm1> imbrandon, we set up a bunch of milestones to hit before next release, so it will be some time :)
<LaserJock> turns out he's a big ubuntu fan
<imbrandon> kk
<superm1> but i'll make sure we are more prepared
<imbrandon> LaserJock, nice
<superm1> for sure
<superm1> Hobbsee, www.mythbuntu.org :)
<imbrandon> they are an official deriv now too hehe
<imbrandon> along with studio
<LaserJock> superm1: how does it compare to that Linux Media Center thingy
<Hobbsee> ah yes, nice :)
<superm1> LaserJock, honestly can't say i've used it yet
<StevenK> Linux MCE is .... interesting.
<superm1> so couldnt tell you
<superm1> i've heard that linuxmce is quite "overkill"
<superm1> for its purpose
<LaserJock> I saw a nifty video of it Linux MCE
<StevenK> So interesting I'm going to stay away from it.
<superm1> but that was about all i've heard
<imbrandon> i wanna try the XMBC linux port, i love it on my xbox
<imbrandon> wont run anything else on it
<StevenK> Hmph. No TV Out or LIRC for Mythbuntu.
<imbrandon> XBMC*
<LaserJock> I hardly watch much TV
<imbrandon> StevenK, /yet/
<superm1> StevenK, for this release, no
<LaserJock> I've just got a rabbit ears setup
<StevenK> imbrandon: Yes.
<imbrandon> LaserJock, youtube!
<superm1> we're just a baby alpha right /now/
<LaserJock> and a 10 year old CD player
<StevenK> superm1: That's okay, my Myth setup is a big pipedream, at this point. :-)
<man-di> moin
<imbrandon> ello man-di 
<LaserJock> nixternal: I must confess, I mostly don't understand your blog post
<nixternal> me either
<nixternal> don't feel bad
<nixternal> I started going, then I got upset, and quit when I head>kb
<superm1> MOTUs, while i've got a bunch of you here, i was a it confused by a warning lintian was throwing at me, could someone take a look?
<superm1> I attached it as a comment on http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5405
<man-di> superm1: you just have to reference /use/share/common-licenses/GPL
<man-di> superm1: no need to put the GPL text in every GPLed software
<superm1> man-di, crimsun has made it clear to me the last few packages to ship a copy of the license in the software
<superm1> always make sure that a COPYING file was included
<man-di> superm1: only if its not one of the common-licenses
<LaserJock> well, it needs a COPYING file in the source
<LaserJock> but you don't need to include the whole GPL in debian/copyright
<superm1> which its not in this package
<superm1> its just a COPYING file and a short header in debian/copyright
<man-di> superm1: dont put extra GPL texts into the binary packages
<superm1> just the source package
<superm1> and then reference it
<man-di> superm1: for the soruce package thats upstreams task, not yours
<man-di> for the orig tarball I mean
<superm1> well upstream didn't include it in this case (although they should have)
<man-di> then its a bug upstream should fix imidiately
<nixternal> g'nite
<bashelier> hey man-di 
<bashelier> thanks a lot for the uploads ;)
<man-di> superm1: putting extra GPL text into a binary package is a bug, IMO
<man-di> bashelier: no problem, I like to help
<superm1> man-di, http://revu.tauware.de./details.py?upid=4910
<superm1> that was the (first) one crimsun had indicated to me to add the COPYING file
<superm1> i'm getting conflicting opinions about what what *should* be done then
<man-di> superm1: he surely dont meant to put it into a binary package
<superm1> when he uploaded that, debian/docs has COPYING
<bashelier> man-di: cool :) then I would be glad if you could also have a look to this one http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/g/gtkedit/gtkedit_1.0-1.dsc ;) (already reviewed by bartm but no news from him for 5 days...)
<man-di> bashelier: always use same sponsor you used last time for a package
<imbrandon> man-di, why i use miltipal sponsors all the time
<bashelier> man-di: I meant bartm had already had a look at it, but the package have never been uploaded before
<man-di> bashelier: and I have some additional rules for my sponsoring: links to .dsc to me via mail (then mutt does half the work for me) and dont do work another sponsor has already done
<bashelier> man-di: np, thanks ;)
<man-di> I do ofcourse sponsor the packaghe when bartm agrees or is MIA
<man-di> bashelier: sorry for my strict rules
<bashelier> man-di: np, I understand ;)
<man-di> bashelier: at least I'm not as pedantic as some other sponsors (e.g. when it comes to unneeded newlines in files in debian/*)
<imbrandon> see thats why i dont bother with upstream if i dont already know the maintainer or i'm not the maintainer myself
<imbrandon> shit like that pisses me off to no end
<imbrandon> and is petty power trips
<RAOF> Is there any particular reason why I shouldn't change democracyplayer to build against xulrunner rather than firefox?  It's one less delta against the debian package.
<imbrandon> ( the un-needed cr-lf's etc )
<crimsun> RAOF: it's up to you if you're touching the package, but realise there's an existing (newly opened bug) on xulrunner regarding header files
<crimsun> RAOF: generally it's best to keep the Ubuntu as minimal as possible
<crimsun> and I really did just get woken up by a friggin bug report.  Grr.
<imbrandon> crimsun, hehe, heya
<Hobbsee> RAOF: you're in luck!
<RAOF> And a feature-request bug, too :/
<Hobbsee> hehe
* jussi01au smack his brothers desktop...
<jussi01au> hi all
<RAOF> Heydi
<jussi01au> hi RAOF, your in .au arent you?
<RAOF> Yes, indeed.
<jussi01au> where??
<RAOF> In fun, huge,  Sydney
* jussi01au is in au roight now...
* RAOF suspected as much :)
<jussi01au> hehe
<DarkMageZ> au is a big place. i'm also in au
<jussi01au> hehe...ok :D
<jussi01au> im in melbourne
<jussi01au> well...geelong, but melbourne als
<jussi01au> o
<DarkMageZ> you are 1000km away
<RAOF> It's only big if you count the huge essentially unihabited desert between the east and west coasts :)
<jussi01au> lol
<jussi01au> so does anyone feel like helping me with a technical issue?
<jussi01au> if someones got too much time on their hands.. :P
<RAOF> Feel like, yes.  Should, no :)
<jussi01au> hehe
<jussi01au> just x has died...
<jussi01au> nothing too serious
<Hobbsee> jussi01au: wow, cool
<jussi01au> hello Hobbsee :D
<RAOF> Marking gaussian elimination has to be one of the most boring things I've ever done.
<jussi01au> lol
<jussi01au> its giving some message about errors opening wacom, and could not init font path element (insert several paths here), and something about free fontpath FPE refcount is 2 should be 1...
<RAOF> I've seen all of those.  The first one is definitely non-fatal.  The second one is almost certainly non-fatal.  And I don't think the third one is fatal either.
<jussi01au> ok...
<crimsun> actually they're all fatal.  You're going to die.  It's written in the stars.
<RAOF> However, I seem to recall something like that pattern happening when XGL was segfaulting somewhere along its init path.
<jussi01au> lol crimsun
<RAOF> Well, yeah.  Of course he's gonna die :)
<crimsun> See?  Fatal.
* RAOF just hopes it's not *soon* :)
<jussi01au> RAOF: one day...
<jussi01au> :P
<jussi01au> hmmm...now we are getting somewhere...
<jussi01au> got a login screen... however...
<jussi01au> when you login i just goes back to the login screen...
<RAOF> Cool.  With a "your session lasted < 10 seconds" care of misspelling "dbus-launch" as "dus-launch"?
* RAOF rocks
<jussi01au> huh?
<RAOF> Oh, that was my most recent reason for getting kicked back to the login screen.
<jussi01au> lol
<crimsun> jussi01au: sanity-check:  /var and /tmp mounted read-write with plenty of free space?  lo iface up?
<crimsun> further, does /tmp have sane permissions?
<jussi01au> crimsun: Im not sure.... Ill go have a look... its the little bothers machine...
<crimsun> (it should be 1777)
<jussi01au> hello dholbach
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> hey jussi01au
<RAOF> Good evening dholbach 
<dholbach> hiya RAOF
<bashelier> good morning dholbach 
<dholbach> hey bashelier
<dholbach> did you get your sync requests done?
<jussi01au> crimsun: just before I go on... its failing on a few things at startup...
<LaserJock> good morning dholbach 
<dholbach> hey LaserJock
<bashelier> dholbach: not yet, but I haden't sent you a mail as u-u-s is suscribed to the bug ;)
<dholbach> ah ok, that's cool
<jussi01au> crimsun: it fails on swap activation, assembling raid arays, and mounting local filesytems (which is probably the problem..no?)
<RAOF> Wow, that's a full house :)
<jussi01au> :)
<RAOF> Do you *have* a mounted /tmp partition?
<RAOF> Does it actually have any raid arrays?
<jussi01au> hmmm... I dont know...
<RAOF> Well, can you log in on a VT?
<jussi01au> it wont open a tty if thats what your asking.... recovery mode doesnt do anything...(and jussi is showing just how much of a noob he actually is...)
<RAOF> Yeah, that's what I'm asking.  It won't switch to a terminal (Ctrl+Alt+F1)?  And by "recovery mode doesn't do anything", do you mean you don't get a prompt in *recovery mode*?
<jussi01au> yeah, it just goes to the log in screen when you boot in recovery mode...
<RAOF> That's some crazy menu.lst happening.  Just append "remove the 'quiet splash'" and append 'single' to the grub options then next time you boot.
<jussi01au> ooh... now we have a VT...
<jussi01au> hmmm.. why didnt it do that last boot...
<RAOF> Still all the same problems?
<jussi01au> yeah... still doesnt log in...
<RAOF> You mean you still don't have a shell?
<jussi01au> no, we have a shell, but it wont log into x...
<RAOF> Oh, that's cool.
<RAOF> Now we get to actually work out what's wrong, and fix it :)
<jussi01au> :D
<RAOF> Now you actually have access to the system, *do* you have /tmp and /var mounted, and do they have the right permissions?
<jussi01au> hmmm, doesnt look like /tmp is mounted but /var is...
<jussi01au> (there is nothing in /tmp)
<bashelier> geser: looks like the patch have worked on ia64 :)
<RAOF> Hm.  Does /tmp have 1777 permissions?
<RAOF> jussi01au: And can you touch something in it?  (As in "touch /tmp/foo")
<jussi01au> touch /tmp/foo gives no output
<StevenK> jussi01au: Which is right.
<StevenK> jussi01au: Most Unix commands will silently succeed.
<jussi01au> hmmm, how do i check permissions from the command line?
<StevenK> ls -l
<Fujitsu> jussi01au: ls -l
<StevenK> Hrm, did I win?
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Unfortunately :(
<Fujitsu> You always do.
<StevenK> Hah
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Type faster. :-P
<Fujitsu> rsync and scp and sbuild together lag this system a bit too much for tab switching.
<svschwartz>  Most Unix commands will silently succeed. ))
<StevenK> The reason I ask is most clients will update their own buffer and then send the text to the server.
<StevenK> svschwartz: Well, if run correctly. :-)
<jussi01au> RAOF: -rw-r---r--
<RAOF> Uuuuur.
<RAOF> jussi01au: So why didn't touch fail?  Oh, 'cause you're root :)
<RAOF> jussi01au: chmod 1777 /tmp
<svschwartz> StevenK: if only any UNIX command had a progress bar ))
<StevenK> Hah
<jussi01au> RAOF: done
<jussi01au> lol svschwartz
<RAOF> jussi01au: Now that programs can actually stick files in /tmp, you might want to try logging in again :)
<jussi01au> RAOF: I did try, but no joy... should I try a windows fix? (ie. restart?) :P
<RAOF> Maybe.  You should probably fix the "can't mount local filesystems" problem, too.
<RAOF> Check that /etc/fstab actually points to useful things :)
<jussi01au> hehe, yeah, actually that could be an issue...
* jussi01au goes to check...
* jussi01au smacks his brother... hard... AUTOMATIX??? what were you thinking!!
<jussi01au> ok... the fstab looks horrible...
<Fujitsu> Urrrgh.
<StevenK> jussi01au: Ask him if he was. Thinking, that is.
<RAOF> Whooops.  kill -9 dpkg FTW!
<jmg> lawl
<crimsun> maybe it's that new kernel thingy that LaserJock mentioned.
<jussi01au> there are a whole lot of /tmp/whatever references... whats that all about...??
<RAOF> Why would you want to mount something to a subdirectory of /tmp?
<LaserJock> crimsun: kernel thingy?
* jmg dist-upgrades laptop to gutsy
<RAOF> jussi01au: Is it using UUIDs everywhere?
<jussi01au> RAOF: pretty much....
<svschwartz> jmg: is your system still alive ? ))
<jmg> svschwartz: it survived edgy -> feisty
<jmg> 1%/432mb ;)
<RAOF> jussi01au: Good.  No hda->sda->hda annoyances for you :)
<svschwartz> cool )) if your laptop will survive, I'll upgrade mine ))
<jussi01au> hmmm... 2 actually... /dev/hdd1 and /dev/hda1
<Hobbsee> jmg: svschwartz there are cds to test for clean installs, if you want.
<jussi01au> RAOF: /dev/hda1 is generated by automatix...
<jmg> Hobbsee: really?
<jmg> there were no alphas where i looked
<jmg> when*
<svschwartz> Hobbsee: I want to try dist-upgrade, never done it befor :)
<Hobbsee> ahh ;)
<Hobbsee> svschwartz: see https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2007-June/023789.html
<jmg> Hobbsee: i have a fatal bug in feisty kernel
<crimsun> LaserJock: "looks like a VGA device. Nah, unimportant. Skip it."
<jmg> well, workflow fatal
<LaserJock> crimsun: hehe
<RAOF> svschwartz: My laptop survived Feisty->Gutsy about a month ago :)
<jmg> i cant dump the videos off my camera because none of my pcs will work with the sdhc card :(
<jmg> so i have to upgrade one to gutsy
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: A member of gEDA upstream emailed me this morning about ensuring our packages are up to date. We're (and Debian is) two releases behind at the moment.
<jussi01au> RAOF: what actually happened with the hda/sda problem? this system has been broken for a good while now...
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: awesome :/
<svschwartz> RAOF: well it's of statisticas mistakes :))
<crimsun> uh...exfalse coring?  in gtk.main()?  what the...
<RAOF> jussi01au: I wasn't touched by it, but it was to do with the libata transition.  Things went from hd? under IDE to sd? under libata.  Then, it turned out that libata didn't work properly for some controller/drive combinations, so they went back to IDE and hd?
<crimsun> exfalso, even
<StevenK> crimsun: Neat!
<jussi01au> RAOF: ahhh...ok
<RAOF> jussi01au: If that system was using /dev/hda, and the kernel got upgraded to one which used libata... :)
<crimsun> Fujitsu: thanks for helping test the Rhythmbox fixes
<Fujitsu> crimsun: No problem; thanks for finding them.
<jussi01au> RAOF: could it be that the uuid's have changed? 
<RAOF> jussi01au: I don't think so.  That would somewhat eliminate the whole point of UUID's :)
<gnudeep> Hi All 
<jussi01au> hehe... :D
<gnudeep> Do we need to have src deb each and every package 
<jmg> gnudeep: huh?
<RAOF> Every package needs to be built from a source package, yes.
<gnudeep> gnu/deep ;)
<gnudeep> when I upload a deb to revu do I need to have a src deb also
<RAOF> But that doesn't mean that each binary package in the repository has it's own source package.  Many produce multiple binary packages.
<Fujitsu> You have to upload a source package, not a binary.
<jmg> gnudeep: are you talking about NoSourcePackages?
<jmg> NoMoreSourcePackages*
<gnudeep> I created the deb for WSAS .. WSAS is a AXIS2 based webservice engine written in Java
<gnudeep> the project has a maven2 build system 
<gnudeep> it creates a ZIP file with binary 
<svschwartz> RAOF: and what about universe and multiverse in gusty? more than that I've installed codecs with automatix ))
<gnudeep> I wrote a simple to create the deb following the Tomcat deb
<svschwartz> RAOF: will god forgive me ? :)
<RAOF> svschwartz: Oooh.  It *should* be OK, but if you couldn't upgrade I wouldn't be too surprised.
<gnudeep> Where I can find the Tomcat deb build system ?
<jmg> ack
<jmg> gnudeep: apt-get source tomcat
<svschwartz> RAOF: whish me luck for tonight ))))
<RAOF> :)
<jmg> then look in the debian/ dir
<gnudeep> jmg, thanx
<crimsun> I recommend you look at tomcat5.5, but yes, the basic idea is identical.
<jmg> crimsun: doesnt tomcat use ant?
<jussi01au> RAOF: crimsun, got any more ideas?
<crimsun> jmg: yes, was just passing him a current source package name.
<jmg> ok
<jmg> gnudeep: whatever you do, try to stick to java policy
<RAOF> jussi01au: Nah, not really.  I'm not so experienced at such low-level fixing.
<jmg> http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/java-policy/x86.html
<jussi01au> RAOF: ok, thanks for your help anyway... :D
<RAOF> Has anyone else tried the Rhythmbox's new gapless engine?  Does it actually play music for anyone?
<gnudeep> jmg, what is the java policy 
<jmg> RAOF: 63%
<jmg> gnudeep: have a read of that
<jmg> http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/java-policy/index.html
<gnudeep> jmg, thanx
<RAOF> Whoops, that log was a little bit bigger than I thought.  It seems rhythmbox spits out 2.8 mb worth of debug text in about 30 seconds :)
<svschwartz> motus: is Gusty Gibbon daily build the same images as at https://isotesting.stgraber.org/ ?
<dholbach> svschwartz: that's the ones that need testing, yes
<dholbach> and it's 'gutsy' :-)
<svschwartz> dholbach thnx ))
<dholbach> super
<crimsun> RAOF: what issue are you chasing?
<RAOF> crimsun: The newly filed bug 119044 - the gapless/crossfading backend never starts playing for me.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119044 in rhythmbox "Crossfading engine never starts playing" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119044
<crimsun> ah, known upstream
<crimsun> no fix yet
<crimsun> but - we do have fixes for the Unknown tag bits
<Fujitsu> :D
<crimsun> half of the required fix is in; the other half is known, committed, and works
<RAOF> And that went into -0ubuntu3 didn't it?
<Fujitsu> No, unfortunately
<crimsun> http://adhd.irule.net/~crimsun/rhythmbox-gutsy/  has it
<RAOF> I don't actually use rhythmbox, I just wanted to try out gapless playback :)
<RAOF> I'll go and attach the upstream bug to mine.
<RAOF> Hey, there doesn't seem to *be* an upstream bug.  crimsun, did you have a bug in mind?
<crimsun> no
<Fujitsu> What's the PPA upload URL? incoming.d.l.n/username?
<RAOF> Hm, is it worth filing a bug upstream then?
<crimsun> RAOF: you'd need to pull SVN trunk first - lots of fixes there
<RAOF> Right.  I might do that sometime, but not now.  I'll keep an eye out for new rhythmbox packages and test again, though.
<gpocentek> hello
<imbrandon> hrm how can i redirect cron output ( from a job ) to syslog
<imbrandon> heya gpocentek 
<gpocentek> hello imbrandon 
<crimsun> AndyP: please remember to include the Debian component (e.g., 119023)
<shawarma> imbrandon: Pipe it through logger?
<frandavid100> hello!
<frandavid100> how can I force a file's installation?
<frandavid100> I get an error saying that it's trying to overwrite /usr/lib/libgconf2-4/2/libgconfbackend-xml.so
<Kmos> frandavid100: yes you can
<Kmos> --force
<highvoltage> !seen mvo
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen mvo - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<dholbach> highvoltage: he's usually on #ubuntu-devel but in his part of germany it's a bank holiday today
<dholbach> highvoltage: so I guess he'll not be around today
<dholbach> anything I can do for you?
<frandavid100> so Kmos, how would the command be? sudo dpkg -i --force nameofthepackage.deb?
<gnomefreak> frandavid100: no 
<gnomefreak> frandavid100: there are differnet --force options. depending on what you need to do. Its not normally a good idea to force anything
<frandavid100> well I just compiled a package and created a deb with checkinstall but now it tells me it conflicts with libgconf2-4
<frandavid100> gonna try make install
<dholbach> arg :-((((
<dholbach> don't overwrite libraries with locally built stuff
<highvoltage> dholbach: aah, ok
<highvoltage> dholbach: I received a menor request, should I speak to mvo first before assigning, or can I just introduce them?
<dholbach> ask him and ask the new contributor to checkout the links from MOTU/Mentoring/Contributor before
<frandavid100> dholbach: if I built it locally, shouldn't everything be ok and according to my libraries?
<dholbach> frandavid100: no, you overwrite gconf with the stuff you built locally
<frandavid100> alright
<dholbach> frandavid100: that's what's giving you the clash and error message
<dholbach> especially if you don't know how the new gconf thing is different
<frandavid100> yeah but it still seems weird
<frandavid100> alright, make install works but I get a core dumped error anyway
<frandavid100> see yoy later!
<dholbach> is REVU broken atm?
<dholbach> I can't post comments
<dholbach> oh... value too long
<dholbach> grmbl
<StevenK> Heh
<geser> StevenK: is your patch for requestsync somewhere available?
<jmg> svschwartz: my laptop didnt survive, in almost the worst possible way
<StevenK> geser: Hrm. I'm not sure if I finished it.
<jmg> it hardswitched the wireless off
<jmg> to reenable it, i have to boot into windows, but i deleted my windows partition ages ago
<jmg> the laptop's entire point is as a wireless wkstn
<Kaloz> jmg: what kinf od wireless card are you using?
<jmg> Kaloz: ipw2200
<svschwartz> jmg : (((
<Kaloz> jmg: there was a standalone driver for rfkil lstuff
<Kaloz> let me try to remember the location
<jmg> Kaloz: yeah?
<jmg> i tried that rfswitch
<jmg> my problem is, i dont think there are many of my laptop around (asus m5200a)
<jmg> the s5200n doesnt work
<Kaloz> I had an asus, but the hotkey on that simply generated a keypres,s and I've handled it through acpi even
<Kaloz> jmg: we shoudl figure out what happens when you pres the button.. try to run acpi_listen in terminal, and check if that says anything about it
<jmg> jmg: it is allegedly supported by asus_acpi
<jmg> http://www.csie.ntu.edu.tw/~b92101/uclinux-dist/linux-2.6.x/drivers/acpi/asus_acpi.c
<jmg> doesnt look like anything is sent when i press the button
<Kaloz> and if you check dmesg, there's not log about "unknown key pressed" stuff, right?
<jmg> right
<StevenK> geser: Do you have a patch to requestsync for your stuff?
<jmg> but i already tried a setkeycodes i found on ubuntuforums
<jmg> so i might have screwed it :/
<jmg> setkeycodes e004 147
<jmg> heh
<jmg> the sleep button works now, didnt before
<jmg> hmmm
<jmg> perhaps i am scragged by something i tried to enable fn-f2 when i was in edgy and it wouldnt work... now i am in dapper
<jmg> doh! i mean gutsy
<jmg> i will download the gutsy iso tomorrow and install
<jmg> i will try the live (could never install from live as it doesnt have enough ram) and alternative
<jmg> Kaloz: unless you want me to try something?
<Kaloz> not right now
<geser> StevenK: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/24553/
<jmg> Kaloz: ok
<jmg> arrgh
<jmg> i had some code to write tonight
<StevenK> geser: Ah, right. My idea is to take my work and your work, mangle it into requestsync and upload devscripts.
<geser> sounds good
<jmg> Kaloz: the fn key no longer works to trigger pgup-pgdn, if that helps
<jmg> Kaloz: I think i might have the wrong keyboard layout..
<StevenK> geser: Is that really necessary?
<StevenK> changelog.debian.net/<foo> just redirects anyway
<geser> only for main
<StevenK> url = 'http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/%%s/%s/%s/current/changelog.txt' % (subdir, sourcepkg)
<geser> "Please note that this facility currently only works for packages in main." from http://changelogs.debian.net/index.php
<StevenK> Why %%s ?
<geser> I want a verbatim %s in it which gets replaced with main, contrib or non-free to find the right component
<geser> line 38 in the paste
<StevenK> *Guess* ?
<StevenK> It looks it up!
<geser> it tries which url works
<StevenK> There's far a more elegant solution, the comment even says so.
<StevenK> Hrm.
<StevenK> Now I can't think of a package to try it with.
<StevenK> Can someone throw some contrib/non-free package names at me? :-)
<geser> argouml
<geser> ifeffit
<man-di> sun-java5-jdk
<geser> flashplugin-nonfree
* man-di hopes StevenK is not hit too hard with these package names
<StevenK> Heh
<geser> StevenK: if there is an easier why than to try 3 urls, I will try it out. I don't want to parse the HTML page from the PTS for the component
<StevenK> geser: There is an easier way, I'm just investigating.
<bmm> If any MOTU has time, I'm looking for somebody who is willing to advocate ccbuild http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5295
<DktrKranz> any u-u-s to look at bug #119016?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119016 in vlc "vlc-nox depends on missing libpostproc0d" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119016
<persia> DktrKranz: As soon as the Tribe 1 freeze lifts, all the packages depending on libflac-dev will eed to be rebuilt for the 1.1.4 transition.  It's probably better to wait a couple days for this one.
<DktrKranz> persia, thanks for the news
<DktrKranz> persia, since vlc depends on libflac-dev (>= 1.1.2-3), should I arrange Build-deps to reflect 1.1.4?
<persia> DktrKranz: If you like, but it should happen automatically once the archive is updated.  If you adjust it, it will FTBFS today, but will guarantee the transition when it happens.  Personally, I usually only use versioned build-deps when the code requires it, rather than for library transitions, to make backporting or compilation in other environments easier.
<StevenK> geser: Okay, I've implemented what you did, without guessing.
<StevenK> "Please sync flashplugin-nonfree (multiverse) from Debian unstable (contrib)."
<persia> bmm: Commented: I think only debian/copyright is left :)
<bmm> persia: great, I'll have a look at it!
<geser> StevenK: have you found the easier way?
<StevenK> geser: Yup.
<StevenK> geser: http://qa.debian.org/madison.php?package=%s&a=&b=&c=&s=unstable&text=on
<icf7> Is there any way to invite people to review a certain package on REVU?
<pochu> Yes, print the link and ask :)
<persia> icf7: Please post the package review URL here.  Please wait a while prior to posting again.
<icf7> persia: Thank you, and thanks to all who review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5359 ;)
* persia looks
* pochu wonders why there's no diff.gz
<StevenK> Because the version is native.
<StevenK> It probably shouldn't be
<pochu> Right.
<icf7> The original is a zip file
<StevenK> So? Repack it and set the version to 0.07.2-1
<pochu> icf7: It looks like your debian/ dir is inside the upstream tarball, while it shouldnt.
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<StevenK> pochu: Yes, because it's native.
<pochu> Or even -0ubuntu1.
<icf7> StevenK/pochu: Thanks, I'll do that
<StevenK> Yes, sorry, I'm in Debian-mode.
<pochu> heh.
<pochu> Hello DarkSun88 
* StevenK context-switches
<DarkSun88> Hello pochu :)
<pochu> icf7: in debian/copyright, "Upstream Author(s)" shouldn't have the "(s)", since there's just one author.
<pochu> icf7: Also, in copyright too, don't make lines longer than 80 chars.
<bmm> persia: I'm doing a 'dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot' to check if the rules changes didn't brake the build. After that I'll be uploading a new version and poke you again. Thanks for the review!
<icf7> pochu: Thank you, I'll fix that. Any other problems beside that?
<persia> bmm: No problems.  While I'd be happy to look at it again, I'd recommend asking for review as you did before rather than poking specific individuals: the more different people look it over, the more likely you'll have a perfect package.
<bmm> k
<pochu> icf7: why you have a patched/ dir? Is it intended?
<icf7> pochu: no, this is a mistake. Thank you
<pochu> icf7: also the sunflow.png.uu file
<icf7> pochu: mmm, i read something and understood I could not include any binary file in the debian directory. Isn't that the case?
<Hobbsee> hi all
<pochu> Heya Hobbsee 
<geser> Hi Hobbsee
<pochu> icf7: I don't know :)
<Hobbsee> :)
<persia> icf7: Commented.  Also, don't include any binary files in debian/.
<persia> Hobbsee: Hi.
<Kmos> how to test Cpu frequency scaling on my laptop ?
<icf7> persia: Commented? Do you mean I should comment the rules file?
<Kmos> icf7: no.. commented at revu website
<pygi> hey ho
<persia> icf7: Sorry.  I've commented on REVU.
<icf7> Kmos: Ah, thank you
<bmm> Any MOTU (and persia): I'm looking for the first advocate of ccbuild http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5408
<bluekuja> bmm: I think you can delete config.sub and .guess for a cleaner diff
<bluekuja> in debian/rules
<bmm> bluekuja: are you talking about the newest upload? Because I thought I just changed that...
<icf7> persia: Thanks for your corrections, I am working on fixing all problems
<bluekuja> bmm, is the link you provided above the "last"?
<Hobbsee> bmm: no need to say "non maintainer upload"
<Hobbsee> diff looks fairly clean - but i would wonder about using a patch system, if you're making that many changes
<bmm> Hobbsee: wanted to please Lintian
<persia> icf7: Good luck.  You might want to look at the "Preparing New Packages" section of http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing for some hints on things to check.
<Hobbsee> bmm: some of the stuff only applies to debian
<bmm> bluekuja: yes, that link is the most current. So I forgot to remove the files before doing a debuild -S -sa ?
<Hobbsee> bmm: and we dont have maintainers, per se
<StevenK> NMU is a Debian-ism
<bluekuja> bmm, yeah, it seams so
<bluekuja> *seems
<persia> bmm: Looks much better.  Do you really want to maintain the patches natively?  dpatch might be easier (later - it's harder now).
<pygi> persia, if it's something simple, simple-patch might work
<pygi> btw. I don't think we want native packages
<persia> pygi: It's not CDBS.
<pygi> I might be wrong ofcourse
<pygi> persia, oh, ok then ^_^
<pochu> icf7: you should probably call dh_iconcache, since you're installing the icons in /usr/share/pixmaps/
<persia> pygi: Sometimes we do use native patches, especially when the package is maintained in Debian, and the Debian maintainer prefers native packages.
<bluekuja> bmm, you added a clean rule, but it should be ok to delete ifneq "$(wildcard /usr/share/misc/config.sub)" ""
<bluekuja> 	cp -f /usr/share/misc/config.sub config.sub
<bluekuja> bmm, same for config.guess
<pygi> persia, yes, but the key word is "sometimes" :)
<pygi> I remember saying once that I used it, and was "kicked" for that =)
<pygi> tarzeau, hey
<bmm> bluekuja: ok, I thought I had to move those rules from the clean to config-status to make sure the files where there before the build but not after. Those (ifneq) lines can really be completely removed?
<persia> bmm: By build-depending on autotools-dev, you guarantee that the files will be present.
<bmm> Ah, few... ok, so I don't need the copy rule either? (configure will know where to look?)
<persia> bmm: You still need to copy the files, but you don't need to test that they are there (although the test should always succeed, so it doesn't really hurt).
<bmm> persia: OK, I've removed the test. Should I do a new upload or wait for more comments?
<tarzeau> hey pygi 
<persia> bmm: If you're doing a new upload, wait a minute, and I'll post a wishlist to REVU.
<bmm> Ok, I'll wait for the comments :-D
<persia> bmm: posted
<bmm> persia: thanks!
<mshima> how do I do to make someone take a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/116897?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 116897 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  virt-manager" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<persia> mshima: Generally, REVU is preferred for new packaging, but announcing it here certainly collects attention.
<bluekuja> mshima, that's cool
<mshima> but it's enough there is a new version of libvirt
<mshima> and its in main
<bluekuja> mshima, please add a bug watcher for debian
<bluekuja> not the link itself
<bluekuja> :)
* ajmitch should probably update libvirt one day
<bluekuja> (if you are the original reporter)
<ajmitch> oh well, sleep time now :)
<bluekuja> gnight ajmitch :)
<persia> mshima: How would you like comments on the proposed package?
<mshima> should I upload it to revu?
<bluekuja> mshima, are you package's author?
<mshima> I just changed some things..
<bluekuja> mshima, well, if you want it in, upload it on REVU
<mshima> libvirt I updated the ubuntu' s one
<bluekuja> MOTUs will take a look
<mshima> one minute
<mshima> and libvirt?
<mshima> libvirt is in main, what should I do?
<bluekuja> mshima, huh^
<bluekuja> *?
<bluekuja> you have packaged libvirt too?
<mshima> yes ubuntu repos has version 0.1.8 and the upstream version is 0.2.2
<bluekuja> mshima, you can upload it to REVU too, I think..but you need core-dev comments for it
<bluekuja> or simply work with ajmitch that wanted to update it
<mshima> I made only 2 changes over the one of repos.
<mshima> but ok
<bmm> persia: learning dpatch is going to take me some time, so don't expect a new version today ;-) I'll get back to the channel once I've learned and applied it.
<persia> bmm: OK.  Ask here if you get stuck.  Good luck.
<bmm> thanks, will do
<pygi> bmm, it's trivial ;)
<persia> bmm: Rather, ask pygi to help :)
<pygi> no, no, I know nothing :P
<pygi> persia is your persn :p
<pygi> person*
<bmm> Just tried "dpatch-edit-patch 01_toolstobash" expecting it to work, but that ended in a stop, telling me that my rules wasn't ready yet... I'll keep at it, needing no one!
<pygi> hehe
<afflux> Adri2000: ping
<afflux> Adri2000: I think I didn't really understand your last comment in bug 118531... The ubuntu changes were merged into debian, so we could sync now. Afaik we don't need any changelog entries, if we do only a sync..?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118531 in xchm "Please merge xchm 2:1.13-3 from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118531
* persia wonders why /usr/share/dpatch/dpatch.make doesn't appear in either the manpage or README.
<AndyP> afflux: he means change the bug title and description to request the sync instead of a merge and include the changelog entry in the description of the bug report
<bmm> haha, about the patch rule of dpatch, it states in dpath.make(7) "the one that exists, and is not depended upon by another one". dh_make only leaves you with rules that depend on each other :-)
<bmm> I can just do "config.status: configure" -> "config.status: patch configure", right?
<persia> bmm: Right.
<StevenK> Or configure: patch
<persia> bmm: Don't forget to unpatch in clean:
<bmm> that one was easy :-P
<afflux> AndyP: doh. I thaught he talked about the package itself. ;)
<bmm> StevenK: configure is not defined inside of my debian/rules
<persia> bmm: Don't define it.  Since configure already exists, it will assume it to already be patched if you use configure: patch.
<bmm> persia: yeah, I just used "config.status: configure" -> "config.status: patch configure", I'm now working on the dpatch-edit-patch part
<mshima> How can I make a core-dev to take a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5410
<mshima> ?
<persia> mshima: You can't.  You can request review here, and a core-dev may be amoung your reviewers.
<Hobbsee> bribes accepted.
<mshima> persia: ok
<bmm> Nobody said it, but I should probably add dpatch as a build-dependency, right?
<persia> bmm: Ideally.
<bmm> And I should remove the Nom-maintainer-upload? Or should I just leave it there for the enjoyment of the debian folks?
<Hobbsee> remvoe ti
<persia> bmm: For new Ubuntu packages, it should be removed.
<bmm> k
<mruiz> hi all :-)
<bmm> Any MOTU: I'm looking for the first advocate for the just updated ccbuild http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5413
<Fujitsu> .
<Fujitsu> Oops.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu's now offered to review it.  thanks, Fujitsu 
* Fujitsu is busy writing something to speak to the school weather station on a regular basis.
<Fujitsu> Evil binary serial protocols.
<persia> mshima: If you've already uploaded to REVU, it's generally easier to include the REVU URL in the new version bug description, and helpful for review to include an interdiff or the output of `diff -urN foo-x.y/debian foo-x.z/debian`.
<mshima> persia: then I attach the interdiff in the bug?
<StevenK> persia: Or a debdiff of the two .dsc's
<persia> mshima: That's what I've done.  Note that interdiff doesn't always do the right thing: sometimes you need the diff -urN to make it readable.
<persia> StevenK: Does that work for new upstreams?  I always had difficulties clearly deliniating packaging changes from upstream changes with debdiff.
<StevenK> persia: Sort of. 
<mshima> persia: thanks
<man-di> persia: debdiff ... | filterdiff -i '*/debian/*'
<man-di> persia: this shows you only changes in debian dir
<man-di> persia: and changes to upstream should be normally handled by patch files in debian/patches
<persia> man-di: For perfect packages, that's nice, but I've seen far too many native patches laying around to trust that.  Good hint though.
<man-di> persia: well, right
<man-di> persia: dont totally trust it
<man-di> but you get a nice picture
<persia> man-di: I agree it's a handy tool when comparing two versions, but I'm not sure it's the best source of a first glance for a reviewer.  On the other hand, I actually like reading diffs and diffs of diffs, so perhaps I have an odd viewpoint.
<bmm> persia: thanks for the advocation and the help!
<persia> bmm: No problems.  Thanks for preparing the package.
<nixternal> persia: !!!
<nixternal> wth you been hiding?
<nixternal> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5393
<persia> nixternal: My productivity is inversely proportional to my time in channel, and I wanted to feed things back to Debian.
<nixternal> there is the new package, I split it up
* persia looks
<StevenK> persia: Oh, you lie!
<nixternal> I am going to RFS that for Debian, and then sync it here..but I wanted to get your opinions on it before I go back to Debian with it
<nixternal> marrilat said he has no plans of getting it into Debian
<persia> StevenK: ?
<StevenK> "[00:33]  < persia> nixternal: My productivity is inversely proportional to my time in channel, ..."
<persia> StevenK: ahh...
<nixternal> hehe, he is right though
<nixternal> I can sit in the channel and watch/talk and the time goes by and no work gets done
<StevenK> I have days like that.
<nixternal> everyday seems to be like that for me
<nixternal> like today, I need to mow the lawn...but you guys will cause me to not do it :)
<nixternal> I blame Ubuntu for my grass being a few inches tall
<persia> nixternal: Looks like you hit all my previous points.  Do you want a full review?
<nixternal> persia: if you have time sure
<nixternal> then what I will do is take it back to unstable, change the control a little and RFS it back into Debian with marillat's note
<nixternal> persia: if you could please...what all flags do you use with lintian that gives you all of the reports you look at?
<nixternal> I was trying to figure out how to do it so I can see the directory size and structure
<persia> nixternal: My preferred lintian and linda flags are listed at MOTU/Contributing.  Be sure to run them on both source.changes and arch.changes to run all the checks.
<nixternal> gotcha
* leonel on  utc --6    good morning    !!
<StevenK> So, UTC 5?
<lionel> bluekuja: are you around ?
<nixternal> mornin' here in UTC 5 as well :)
<bluekuja> lionel: yeah
<lionel> bluekuja: I try to understand your last merge of pymsnt
<lionel> Debian changelog say
<lionel>   * Incorporate Ubuntu's 130_twisted_2.5.patch for twisted 2.5 compatibility.
<lionel>     It's needed because the twisted.scripts.twistd module no longer has a
<lionel>     checkPID function. However the checkPID function is available in the
<lionel>     twisted.scripts._twistd_unix' module.
<lionel> and in remaining changes, we have
<lionel>      - debian/patches/130_twisted_2.5.patch: Add patch to work with Twisted 2.5.
<bluekuja> lionel, that's strange to have it applied then
<lionel> bluekuja: if you say that your work is strange, what should I say ? :)
<bluekuja> lionel, anyway my fault didnt see the previous changelog entry
<bluekuja> lionel, the strange is that the patch is applied on a tree where that patch has been already included
<lionel> bluekuja: changes does not conflict
<lionel> no reasons to fail
<lionel> Ok, I will reject my request sync...
<lionel> bluekuja: Ok, never mind, your sponsor should also have detected it :)
<lionel> thanks for the clarification
<bluekuja> lionel, dont worry, thanks to you for pointing it out
<nixternal> thank goodness for revu...I just rm'd my damn kplayer directory :)
<Hobbsee> haha, ouch
<nixternal> ok maybe I didn't...man i must be a cd dummy this morning
<persia> nixternal: "Real Men don't make backups. They upload it via ftp and let the world mirror it.'' --Linus Torvalds.
<nixternal> I have no clue wth I was looking but thought it was gone
<nixternal> persia: well then, I guess I am a real man then :)
<nixternal> my daddy will be proud!
<jgw_> the version of cacti in dapper drake is an old version with several vulnerabilities. is it appropriate to file a "bug report" on this, as i believe this is the LTS version?
<jgw_> our dapper cacti box was 0wned yesterday by automated scanners
<jgw_> the dapper version of cacti is several versions behind
<etank> <possible dumb question> Is what jgw_ is asking for considered a backport?
<jgw_> its in universe
<StevenK>      cacti | 0.8.6h-1ubuntu3.1 | dapper-security/universe | source, all
<StevenK>      cacti | 0.8.6h-3~dapper1 | dapper-backports/universe | source, all
<jgw_> i guess i just need to track down what i responsibly need to do, as i'm sure there are plenty of other dapper cacti users out there, who apt-get upgrade all day long, but are still vulnerable
<StevenK> jgw_: Was that -security version installed?
<jgw_> StevenK: yes
<StevenK> Crap.
<StevenK> The next step is find the vulnerable code and prepare a patch for it.
<nixternal> you weren't use God for your password were you ;p
* nixternal watched hackers again last night
<nixternal> s/use/using
<_MMA_> lol
<nixternal> jgw_: you aren't the first person I heard say that about cacti either...it seems the admins at the uni switched a Debian box to Red Hat because they were sick of not getting fed the stable updates
<_MMA_> I actually rented that from Netflix a couple of weeks ago and realized it wasnt as good as I remembered.
<nixternal> hehe, come on...Acid Burn rocks!
<_MMA_> :)
<nixternal> her laptop had all kinds of elite frame buffers with like 32mb of ram
<jgw_> nixternal: i dont blame ubuntu, cacti is horrible :)
<jgw_> horribly written, but extremely useful
<nixternal> heh, well we are talking about an admin who probably just set up his first linux box
<jgw_> nixternal: the bot hacked in via a vulnerability in graph_image.php
<nixternal> then again, the school needs to shut off "finger" on their DNS servers...god I love having a Sun box at the uni sometimes
<jgw_> there's an exploit where you can execute arbitrary shell commands
<StevenK> jgw_: In which case you can diff graph_image.php between the version in Dapper, and the newest upstream version.
<jgw_> as user www-data
<jgw_> StevenK: that fixes MY issue, but doesnt mitigate the risk to other LTS users
<StevenK> jgw_: File a bug in Launchpad, mark it as Security, and get someone here to look at it.
<nixternal> now that will
<jgw_> StevenK: should i take some sort of action and report this?
<jgw_> StevenK: excellent, thanks :)
<StevenK> jgw_: File a bug and attach the patch if you can come up with one, I meant.
<jgw_> StevenK: so its not as simple as upgrading the package to 0.8.6j?
<StevenK> No, that just isn't going to happen.
<jgw_> ok gotcha
<StevenK> If there's a CVE number, put it in the bug report, saves us trying to track it down.
<jgw_> i am off to SF for WWDC soon, but will work on it and try to get something going before i jet off
<jgw_> ok
<jgw_> thanks again
<jgw_> it appears that graph_image has had a series of this type of vulnerability
<jgw_> i found an older CVE on versions prior to f
* jgw_ shakes head
<StevenK> Maybe you should tell cacti upstream to not give up their day job. :-P
<jgw_> well, like i said, cacti is just horribly written
<jgw_> its a shame its so useful
<elmargol> maybe a other distribution already has this fix?
<jgw_> i imagine 7.04 might ;)
<jgw_> graph_image.php is really small
<jgw_> i'm just going back through our logs now, to verify some stuff
<persia> nixternal: I've commented on kplayer.
<nixternal> thank you
<nixternal> I was looking at the manpage garbage and trying to find a package similar from debian, and most of the packages I grabbed didn't have the manpages...so I need to create a quick one from scratch probably
<nixternal> waste of space and time truthfully, since it doesn't have any command line flags
<nixternal> ooh, it does have some
<nixternal> ahh the typical kde, qt and all..nothing special
<Adri2000> afflux: pong
<persia> nixternal: Even if there's not much, the Description is nice, and given the size, a FILES section might be interesting.
<afflux> Adri2000: I didn't understand your last comment on bug 118531 cause I thought you were talking about the package itself instead of the bug. I think/hope I fixed everything now.
<Adri2000> afflux: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118531 in xchm "Please sync xchm (universe) 2:1.13-4 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118531
<afflux> Adri2000: in general, can we use the "requestsync" script from devscripts?
<afflux> Adri2000: ah, just saw the last paragraph on the wiki page.
<Adri2000> afflux: yes, just change the code to not confirm the bug and to subscribe u-u-s instead of ubuntu-archive
<persia> afflux: Or wait.  requestsync has seen recent work, and may be more useful soon.
<StevenK> Actually, the version of devscripts I just uploaded to Gutsy has a requestsync script which takes a -s option which does that.
<afflux> ah, cool.
<persia> StevenK: I the tribe 1 freeze off yet?  I haven't seen heaps of archive activity.
<StevenK> persia: Seems to be.
* persia updates
<persia> Not for me :(
<Hobbsee> persia: yeah, i'ts all out of UNAPPROVED, at least. 
<Hobbsee> not sure if hte buildds are on manual though
<somerville32> I really like whats happened to the motu wiki.
<somerville32> It is now actually useful!
* somerville32 cheers.
<Adri2000> afflux: one "(universe)" in the summary is enough :) ; "The upstream version includes all ubuntu changes" please explicitly say what are the ubuntu changes (ie. desktop file fix), and it's rather Debian version, not upstream.
<afflux> Adri2000: sorry, I seem to be asleep at the switch
<persia> Hobbsee: I'm currently most interested in flac-1.1.4, which is built, just not yet distributed.  I'm guessing it'll be sorted tomorrow.
<Hobbsee> persia: check if the buildds are set to AUTO or manual
<Hobbsee> (via LP)
<Hobbsee> persia: perhaps it's waiting on hte publisher run?
<persia> Hobbsee: That's what I thought.  I'm guessing publisher was manual for tribe 1, and that it's being addressed presently, so new stuff will appear soon.
<Hobbsee> it was taken off manual 1:20 ago
<Hobbsee> assuming it all got taken off, not just some
<afflux> Adri2000: okay that way?
<Adri2000> afflux: yes, thanks, I will ack it in a moment
<afflux> thank you
<persia> Hobbsee: Odd.  I'm either confused by the output of `apt-cache madison flac`, or am not interpreting https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+builds?build_state=built&build_text=flac correctly.
<Hobbsee> persia: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=flac
<Hobbsee> persia: new binaries, it appears.
<persia> Hobbsee: Right.  So why do I get http://pastebin.ca/547977?
<Hobbsee> persia: because the binary NEW only holds back the binaries, not the sources.
<persia> Ahh..  You answered my question before I asked :)  Thanks.
<Hobbsee> :)
<Hobbsee> no problem
<Hobbsee> it's confusing
<RainCT> Hi
<geser> StevenK: I'm just looking at the patched requestsync. Fetching the changelog won't work for libs.
<geser> if sourcepkg is e.g. libgnome, sourcepkg[0] 
<geser> will produce a 'l' and not the 'g' you need to append to 'lib'
<geser> StevenK: does "affect ubuntu/<srcpkg>" work for new packages (LP doesn't know about it yet)?
<Hobbsee> geser: StevenK went to bed.
<geser> ok
<geser> does he read his scrollback?
<Hobbsee> usually, i think
<persia> geser: Do I remember correctly that you use vpnc?  Would you have time to test bug 92570?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 92570 in network-manager-vpnc "nm-applet dissapears after connecting to vpn" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92570
<geser> persia: yes, I use vpnc but without NM at home and vpnc with NM on my notebook for the wifi access at the university
<persia> geser: Thanks.  The patch looks sensible (if a dirty hack) to me, but I can't confirm it still works after application.
<pochu> beuno: you have seen there's a new MOTU, haven't you? :)
<pochu> (for the UWN)
<nixternal> persia: how should I add this manpage? put it in debian/ and manually install it? or should I make it into a patch and place it into the source?
<beuno> pochu: nope, can you email me some info on it?
<pochu> nixternal: put it in debian/ and call dh_installman debian/<package>.1
<persia> nixternal: I recommend putting it in debian/, and sending it upstream.  In either case, you probably want to install it with dh_installman.
<pochu> beuno: Sure thing :)
<beuno> pochu: thanks so much}
* persia needs to type faster :)
<nixternal> heh
<nixternal> persia: should I put that under install/foo::
<persia> nixternal: CDBS does it for you: just populate debian/kplayer.manpages
<nixternal> roger
<pochu> beuno: sent
<nixternal> persia: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5414
<nixternal> that should be the one!
<persia> nixternal: Great.  I'll take a look in the morning :)
<LaserJock> alrighty
<LaserJock> I need some perl help
<LaserJock> if ($version =~ /-[^.-] +(\.[^.-] +)?(\.[^.-] +)?$/) {
<LaserJock> I want to add an "and" in there
<LaserJock> can I just do s/}/ and (stuff here) {/ ?
<tsmithe> try it and see?
<LaserJock> hmm, I think I want to do it in the ()
<tsmithe> that would make more sense
<tsmithe> or i guess you could open another set of parentheses, and stick ( (...) and (...) )
<tsmithe> but i'm talking out my arse
<will_________> Hey, I requested a backport of blender 2.44 from gutsy and got the following reply in e-mail, what's it mean and what do I do?
<will_________> b/i/r in prevu
<will_________> +1 feisty
<mr_pouit> b/i/r means builds/installs/removes
<icf7> can anyone point me to an example implementation of get-orig-source for a sourceforge project?
<lionel> mr_pouit: r does not mean run ? 
<mr_pouit> lionel: ah yes ^^
<lionel> :)
<will_________> So how do I obtain it?
<lionel> will_________: everything is fine. You have to wait (yes, sorry) for the hack of a member of the backport team
<lionel> and after an archive admin will do the backport
<will_________> Alright sounds good.  How long could it possibly take?
<lionel> IIRC, jdong told he will hack backports this week-end
<lionel> so you can hope this for next week
<will_________> how will I know when it's added?
<lionel> comments will be added in the bug you filed
* AndyP sighs
<AndyP> i've been on campus for hours, installing fedora 7 on a room of computers :(
<crevette> hello
<crevette> I tried to push a package to REVU to be reviewed by GNOME Desktop Team, but I received an error
<crevette> Signer is not permitted to upload to the component 'main' of file 'gdm_2.19.2-0ubuntu1.dsc'
<crevette> what should I do with the package
<lionel> crevette: you did not push it to REVU but to ubuntu
<crevette> ah
<crevette> :)
<crevette> I read in the wiki "Since Ubuntu 6.06 LTS (Dapper Drake), dput is already configured for REVU uploads"
<crevette> so I acted
<lionel> hum...
<crevette> ah okay
<lionel> crevette: are you part of Contributors of packages for ubuntu universe ?
<crevette> I should ...
<crevette> default_host_main = ubuntu
<geser> crevette: dput knows about revu, but revu is not default: dput revu your_pkg.changes
<crevette> :)
<crevette> geser: yepo
<crevette> thanks
<crevette> quick and efficient 
<crevette> :)
<crevette> argh
<crevette> the dput transfer started, stalled and then failed
<crevette> I cannot upload my package anymore
<LaserJock> crevette: you're uploading gdm to REVU?
<crevette> yep
<LaserJock> how big is the .orig.tar.gz?
<crevette> 6372709
<LaserJock> it's on there
<crevette> too big ?
<LaserJock> wait a few minutes for the cron job and it should be up
<crevette> what happened ?
<LaserJock> 6372709 2007-06-07 15:33 gdm_2.19.2.orig.tar.gz is what I have on REVU
<crevette> Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of gdm_2.19.2-0ubuntu1.dsc
<LaserJock> did you try uploading more than once
<crevette> after the error I tryed again twice
<LaserJock> if it's already there it will complan
<crevette> the first error was 
<crevette> Error '(110, 'Connection timed out')' during ftp transfer of gdm_2.19.2-0ubuntu1_source.changes
<LaserJock> oh, right
<LaserJock> use dput -f or remove the .upload file
<RainCT> crevette: I just submitted a patch for gdm 2.19.1, is it too late to get it in if the problem is still there on .2?
<crevette> you have the bug number ?
<crevette> LaserJock: okay i try that right now
<crevette> LaserJock: it doens't work 
<LaserJock> what did it do?
<crevette> error 503
<dholbach> does http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Recipes/CheckingLibrarySymbols make sense to everybody?
<crimsun> dholbach: looks nice.  Might want to link to what "you will need to update the version" implies.
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> that should be covered in another howto maybe
<crimsun> yes.
<crimsun> and I should really write up that schroot wiki page...
<dholbach> we need more recipes :)
<dholbach> so people play with the tools a bit before they ask for a mentor :)
<LaserJock> dholbach: that's sweet
<dholbach> now somebody needs to upload ubuntu-dev-tools :)
<dholbach> I hope the time for everybody agreeing on GPL was long enough
<crimsun> what about the guys working in nexenta?
<crimsun> did we consider them?
<dholbach> oh... agree on GPL for the tools in ubuntu-dev-tools
<dholbach> because all of them were without copyright notices
<crimsun> right.  Does Nexenta or whatever use GPL?
<dholbach> they ship most of the stuff we do
<LaserJock> crimsun: I think they'd be kinda sunk if they didn't
<LaserJock> I think they use all the GNU tools
<ajmitch> morning
<pochu> Hey ajmitch 
<icf7> Should I include a debian/README.Debian-source file if I provide rules: get-orig-source ?
#ubuntu-motu 2007-06-08
<bmm> Although it's not long after my first advocation, I'm looking for my second for ccbuild http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5413 or any comments.
<RainCT> good night
<bmm> night night
<pochu> bmm: I'd change the link to the downloads in debian/copyright, so you don't have to change it with every new release ;)
<bmm> pochu: change it how? You mean point to the homepage, not the source file?
<pochu> Well, either the homepage, or the downloads page.
<bmm> I'm not really expecting a new release soon, so it should be ok. But I'll put it on my todo
<pochu> Night folks
<TheMuso> Hey all.
<RAOF> Hey TheMuso 
<RAOF> Ah, forums.  Where else would you find such useful suggestions as "make it boot faster" :)
<YokoZar> RAOF: Well, it may not specify HOW to do it, but it does help to know what users want in general every now and again
<YokoZar> I'd imagine many of us never reboot, so boot times aren't as big a deal for us than most of our users ;)
<RAOF> YokoZar: Eh, maybe.
<YokoZar> RAOF: On the other hand, I get tons of "make it work better", which isn't exactly useful :)
<persia> Is there an easy way to determine from package source whether a package is VCS maintained in Ubuntu vs. being VCS maintained in Debian?
<nixternal> persia: good morning :)
<persia> nixternal: Good morning.  I'm looking now :)
<nixternal> hey, just so you know, I put the latest kplayer on mentors and ana will hopefully sponsor it shortly
<persia> nixternal: Great!
<nixternal> ya, but take a quick look and see if you come up with anything...just in case ana and them decide there are to many k*players in kde-extras :)
<AndyP> hmm, the latest pymsnt merge should've been a sync
<TheMuso> Grrr! You gotta love companies that release proprietary software for Linux, and make a deb available, which is *ABSOLUTELY SHOCKING* quality.
<TheMuso> The deb packaging that is.
<persia> heh
<TheMuso> persia: For a start, they ask questions in pre/postinst, and do not use debconf.
<AndyP> ew
<persia> TheMuso: You could submit a patch.  Most of debian/ can be reconstructed from the binary :)
<TheMuso> My thoughts exactly
<TheMuso> persia: Very true.
<DarkSun88> G'night
<crimsun> actually I reboot fairly often
<crimsun> one of the side effects of testing changes
<RAOF> Is kvm broken for anyone else?  Man, Sid's gnome looks ugly by default.
<crimsun> not ugly ... functional :-)
* StevenK appears.
* TheMuso cringes even more at this appauling deb.
<TheMuso> Symlinking libraries from /opt/lib to /usr/lib is just asking for trouble.
<fredericthewise> good morning all!! (jussi01 on brothers machine)
<TheMuso> Whats more, the libraries don't have version numbers in their names.
* TheMuso c hecks for a soname.
<fredericthewise> morning  TheMuso 
<TheMuso> Hey fredericthewise
<AndyP> TheMuso: so does this mystery demonic package have a name? :)
<TheMuso> AndyP: Its a software speech synthesizer, that is only available for purchase.
<jussi01> hey TheMuso, you are in au correct??
* ajmitch returns
<TheMuso> jussi01: Yes.
<TheMuso> brb
<jussi01> hello ajmitch 
<persia> nixternal: Commented.  Note that menu files are more important in Debian than in Ubuntu.
<crimsun> time to take a look at LSR.  New $employer will allow me to spend some time to work on it.
<ajmitch> crimsun: where are you now?
<crimsun> ajmitch: in a coffee shop :-)
<ajmitch> :P
<ajmitch> I mean in terms of $employer
<crimsun> I'm in the Washington, D.C. area
<nixternal> persia: which directory should I populate the kplayer manpage to?
<crimsun> "the correct one."
<crimsun> kplayer(1)
<nixternal> heh, there are quite a few "one"s
<crimsun> no, literally one.
<crimsun> one (1)
<nixternal> so in the kplayer.manpages, it should be populated with?
<nixternal> kplayer.1 is in debian/
<persia> nixternal: Just put debian/kplayer.1 in kplayer.manpages (yes, 1)
<crimsun> debian/kplayer.1
<nixternal> rock on
<nixternal> thanks
* AndyP looks at the easytag merge and goes cross-eyed
<persia> nixternal: dh_installman takes care of the destination based on the manpage filename.
<TheMuso> crimsun: Um... What are you on about?
<AndyP> when debian catches up with the versions of our -0ubuntuN packages, how on earth do we merge them?
<crimsun> TheMuso: I'm doing to dig in
<crimsun> grr, going to dig in
<TheMuso> crimsun: Why? Whats up with it?
<crimsun> TheMuso: nothing's "up" with it.
<TheMuso> crimsun: um ok.
<persia> AndyP: Use the ubuntu orig.tar.gz, and create a debdiff including the debian changes (if appropriate) in the Ubuntu package.
<crimsun> TheMuso: employer has an interest in making it work for our aging workforce, many of whom are impaired.
<TheMuso> crimsun: aaah
<TheMuso> crimsun: Well maybe orca would be a better bet.
* persia thought LSR was deprecated for actual screen reading
<crimsun> I'll look into that
<AndyP> persia: ok, i think i get that
<TheMuso> persia: LSR was IBM's screen reader for GNOME, but now that its dormant, I say let it lie. I'd rather the one screen reader for GNOME.
<crimsun> unlike alsa, it's a fairly new category for me
<persia> TheMuso: That makes sense to me, although my (very light) interest in LSR is more about the input device management.
<TheMuso> persia: um ok.
<AndyP> ah i see seb128 is the easytag maintainer for both debian and ubuntu, i'll wait until i've asked him about it
* AndyP scours MoM for another victim
<persia> bluekuja: About kid3: Please remerge once Ubuntu actually ships FLAC 1.1.4: the current merge doesn't work.
<TheMuso> AndyP: You're welcome to do nufw which is in the updated merges sectio.
<TheMuso> section
<AndyP> TheMuso: thanks, i'll take a look
<TheMuso> ewwwwwwww!!! Ok this package really sucks! It depends on libstdc++2.10-glibc2.2
<crimsun> flac is in binary NEW.
<crimsun> yay for transitions.
<persia> crimsun: Yep!
<persia> If anyone has a moment, would they be willing to tell me why `find /usr/share/applications -type f -name *.desktop -printf '%p\n' -execdir grep -q "^MimeType";` doesn't work?
<AndyP> persia: maybe the * is being used by bash (or whatever shell) and not find ?
<persia> AndyP: Thanks.  I've actually just realised I need \; instead of ;, which seems to address it.  Darn shell quoting rules.
<AndyP> :)
<nixternal> is there a set of tools, besides lintian and linda, that you use for revu'ing? I want to cut down on packaging issues I seem to have by following the documentation
<persia> nixternal: There's a list of hints for reviewers available from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Reviewing.  It's not everything people use, but it might reduce comments.
<nixternal> ya, already use that
<nixternal> for instance, how do you validate a .desktop file? that was the first I have ever heard of that
<nixternal> and I can verify the desktop file does in fact work when installing the pkg's
<persia> nixternal: Ah.  That's just me :)  The tool is called desktop-file-validate, in the desktop-file-utils package.  The current .desktop only works in KDE (not that many XFCE or GNOME users are likely to use kplayer, but...)
<nixternal> ahh, very true
<nixternal> well my fix for that is everyone should do the right thing and use KDE :p
* nixternal hides
<persia> nixternal: So, you'll port plucker-desktop to QT then :)
<nixternal> now that is a sweet tool
<nixternal> bah, to much work involved with that horrible app
<nixternal> it seems a lot of people are ditching plucker-desktop and using a util called Sunrise
<nixternal> supposedly similar, except for the fact that it just works :)
<nixternal> persia: for the desktop files, is it recommended to use a patch for each .desktop file, or is it fine to have 1 patch fix all .desktop files?
<persia> nixternal: I think 1 patch for all the .desktop files is easier to maintain.  Also remember to put something in /usr/share/pixmaps, as other environments don't search the legacy KDE image locations.
<nixternal> yup...I will get that
<nixternal> the cut&paste desc..you were referring to the manpage?
<persia> nixternal: debian/control.  The manpage is great, but the long descriptions in the control file for -common and -doc looked like repetitions of the main description at first glance.  On the other hand, descriptions isn't really a strong point for me.
<nixternal> oh, they are..only following other packages, that is why I did it that way
<AndyP> what does it mean when the .po files in debian/po/ all have .UBUNTU suffixes and there aren't any .DEBIAN counterparts? they were removed from the debian package?
<AndyP> (from MoM)
<crimsun> depends.
<crimsun> for main source, always prefer the Debian .po
<crimsun> Rosetta's used for that.
<crimsun> for universe, it's a bit more complicated
<persia> nixternal: As I said, it's not something I know well.  If you have other example packages, it's probably fine.
<AndyP> crimsun: um ok, but there aren't any Debian .po
<crimsun> AndyP: so prefer the Debian source.
<AndyP> ah i see, ok
<crimsun> joejaxx: have you made headway on ndisgtk?
<joejaxx> crimsun: hmm?
<crimsun> joejaxx: I pinged you a couple weeks ago regarding the merge
<joejaxx> crimsun: i do not see it on MoM
<joejaxx> :\
<crimsun> use DaD
<joejaxx> do you have a link? it is not in the top any longer
<joejaxx> gah
<joejaxx> topic*
<crimsun> note that the DaD version is broken; you need to manually inspect it
<leonel> crimsun:  for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbmail/+bug/119131    I see the package in MoM  that's where I'll start ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119131 in dbmail "Please Merge 2.2.5 from Debian Unstable" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<crimsun> leonel: according to DaD, luca is already working on it.
<LaserJock> blah
<LaserJock> having both MoM and DaD really bugs me
<leonel> crimsun: I've mailed him knowing that he fixed somethings  for 2.2.3  and  said  it was ok  for me to do the merge 
* persia encourages people working on merges to 1) Check LP for bugs on the package that might have patches that could be applied during the merge, and 2) File a merge bug before starting work (and not work on packages with open merge bugs).
<crimsun> leonel: ok, please change the comment on DaD and update the bug Status on LP according
<joejaxx> LaserJock: do you have a link to DaD
<joejaxx> ?
<crimsun> see the topic.
<crimsun> err
<crimsun> http://dad.dunnewind.net/universe.php
<crimsun> silly topic.
<ScottK2> Good $TIMEOFDAY everyone.
<ScottK2> siretart: I saw your note to Doko on ubuntu-devel about recommending python-celeemttree.  I think a large question about that particular pacakge is why we build it for Python 2.5 at all since it's now built in.
<ScottK2> siretart: Debian only builds it for Python 2.4 and earlier.
<ScottK2> urgh. large/larger.
<leonel> hey ScottK2 I'm going for my first  merge ..
<ScottK2> Hey leonel.  Great.  Which one.
<leonel> dbmail
<ScottK2> Ah.  
<leonel> but there are patches that need to be applied
<ScottK2> How's clamav security updating going?  I've been offline the last two days.
<leonel> let's see how it gets
<viveksri15> hi all
<joejaxx> well time for my merge adventure :P
<leonel> scottK2 clamav   I had to  stop it,  It  turned  complicated to find the patches in the changed version  ..
<joejaxx> viveksri15: hello
<ScottK2> leonel: Did you talk to dktrkranz about doing the dbmail merge?
<leonel> scottK2  but  I'm  not abandoning  clamav
<leonel> scottK2 yes  I've mailed him  and  said  it was ok  for me to do the merge
<ScottK2> leonel: It might be worth it to pubilsh the patches you've gotten done so far.
<ScottK2> leonel: OK.  Just making sure.  It's considered polite, but not everyone does it.
<leonel> scottK2 for dapper's clamav  I can only  apply  1 the  ole2  
<leonel> scottK2  the o
<ScottK2> leonel: One fix is better than no fixes.
<leonel> scottK2 there are 4 more to be fixed 
<leonel> scottK2 but I got  lost  since the patches must be applied  in    cab.c  and  dapper's  clamav   does not have  cab.c  file ...
<leonel> ScottK2 the ole2  I'll work on it  tomorrow    
<ScottK2> OK.  But if you end up having to put it aside for a while, you should ask keescook to publish what you've gotten done.
<leonel> scottK2 ok    I was not going to abandon  dapper's  clamav    
<ScottK2> OK.
<ScottK2> Sounds good.
<leonel> scottK I need to find those patches in sarge's clamav
<leonel> scottK2 I need to find those patches in sarge's clamav
<ScottK2> leonel: I expect keescook could help you find them.
<leonel> scottK2 ok  I'll  ask him  but first let me  search in sarge's  
<ScottK2> OK.
<AndyP> TheMuso: nufw merged in bug #119249
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119249 in nufw "Please merge nufw 2.2.0-2ubuntu1" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119249
<TheMuso> AndyP: Ok, will have a look in a bit.
<ScottK2> Hello effie_jayx.
<effie_jayx> hey ScottK 
<effie_jayx> hey ScottK2
<ScottK2> How are things going?  Have you started working on anything else?
<effie_jayx> ScottK2,  moodle
<effie_jayx> I am a bit stuck
* ScottK2 hasn't looked at the pacakge, but could try and help if you have a question...
<effie_jayx> ScottK2,  the only change reads... new upstream version
<LaserJock> effie_jayx: you are merging moodle?
<effie_jayx> LaserJock,  just for kicks ... to learn ... yes
<LaserJock> Edubuntu is working on moodle I think
<effie_jayx> LaserJock,  I am trying to learn... I am not going for the money yet :D
<effie_jayx> :S
<effie_jayx> ScottK2,  did you check the changelog?
<effie_jayx> the thing is I am not quite sure If I am doing the right things...
<LaserJock> so, today I merged lintian and added in a check that will stop NMU warnings for ubuntuX packages
<ScottK2> effie_jayx: No.  I was waiting to see if LaserJock had anything to say.
<ScottK2> LaserJock: That sounds good.
<effie_jayx> ScottK2,  Ok
<LaserJock> moodle isn't exactly the ideal "starter" package
* ScottK2 will look now.
<effie_jayx> I see
<ScottK2> effie_jayx: Did you pick moodle or did someone suggest it to you?
<effie_jayx> I picled it
<effie_jayx> my bad...
<ScottK2> LaserJock: Do you have a pending merge that would be good for someone new (I have none)
<LaserJock> hmm, how about texmacs
* effie_jayx check MoM for texmacs
<minghua> LaserJock: Debian "fixed" the octave wrong result bug by switching back to g77
* ScottK2 hides from anythin with tex in the name...
<LaserJock> minghua: and that "fixed" it?
<LaserJock> ScottK: it's an editor, it's not that bad
<LaserJock> darn it, I'm running out of hard drive space
<crimsun> you don't need it.  Gimme.
<LaserJock> well, I've got a gutsy source/i386 mirror
<LaserJock> it's eating up a lot of space
<LaserJock> and now I'm actually using vmware
* StevenK wishes he had another 15Gb or so to commit to his mirror so it could grab source.
<LaserJock> I've got 1 last partition to wipe
<LaserJock> it has OpenSUSE on it
<LaserJock> but I can just use vmware for that
<minghua> LaserJock: yes, because gfortran and g77 has different ABI for complex numbers on 64-bit platforms
<minghua> LaserJock: and BLAS/LAPACK/ATLAS is compiled by g77
<LaserJock> interesting
<LaserJock> so I'm using up 49GB for gutsy mirror
<RAOF> Man, there's this strange voice recognition filter on Telstra's support line.
<StevenK> My edgy/fiesty/gutsy amd64/i386 mirror is 57Gb.
<StevenK> I'm thinking it might be time to stop mirroring edgy.
<StevenK> RAOF: Whenever I call Telstra, it can't seem to pick up my mobile number.
<StevenK> RAOF: It asks "Is your query about the phone you're on now?" Which is the office PRI, so of course it isn't.
<RAOF> StevenK: Or it's about the landline at my new flat, and I want to know whether it's atually *connected* or not!
* RAOF thought he'd merged TeXMacs recently.
<LaserJock> StevenK: only 57GB?
<StevenK> LaserJock: Heh, I only have 60Gb available for it.
<effie_jayx> RAOF,  there is a new package
<LaserJock> StevenK: I've got 942M free
<effie_jayx> RAOF,  texmacs-1.0.6.10
<RAOF> effie_jayx: Oooh, I use texmacs.  What interesting bugs are fixed :)
<Hobbsee> hi all
<RAOF> Hey Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> :)
<AndyP> hm 5:25am... time for bed. good night folks
<RAOF> So, I should get internet at my flat in a week or so.  Woooo!
<Hobbsee> yay!
* Hobbsee has already hard-rebooted the router this morning, to get internet.
* Hobbsee should play phone-mangling at some point, too.
<Hobbsee> yup. it's dead.
<nixternal> .desktop file, for an action, is it necessary to provide a name and and type?
<persia> nixternal: Could you rephrase?  I'm not sure how to answer other than http://standards.freedesktop.org/desktop-entry-spec/latest/
<nixternal> ya, I was looking at that, and ummm they forgot all about Actions :)
<Hobbsee> yay, successful phone-mangling!
<persia> Actions?
<nixternal> i.e. actions uses in service menus and such in KDE
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Phone mangling?
<crimsun> this channel is particularly random tonight.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: VOIP phone.  hell when the internet connection goes down
<nixternal> Actions=AddToPlaylists;AddToCollection;
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Oh.  Whoops :)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: ie, it usually doesnt get another IP, so you have to hard-reboot the voice box.
<Hobbsee> and usually, once you do that a few times, it'll come back
<Hobbsee> else you have to wipe all the settings, put them back in, etc.  much pain.  or just ignore the phone :P
<RAOF> Ah, technology.  Isn't it wonderful.
<Hobbsee> yep, yep
<Hobbsee> technology in au is definetly very wonderful
* Hobbsee plans to move to another country, at some point.
<persia> nixternal: I'm having trouble finding docs on that, but I think http://techbase.kde.org/SysAdmin/Kiosk/Keys implies you want to use X-KDE-AuthorizeAction=
<persia> Hobbsee: It's not all the tech, just everything that has anything to do with telecommunications :)
<crimsun> Hobbsee: denmark? sweden? the netherlands? finland? germany?
<Hobbsee> persia: hehe
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Muscent be a good VOIP device then.
<Hobbsee> crimsun: europe somewhere.  maybe germany
<nixternal> persia: those are for kde rc config files
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: it's an engin voicebox.
<crimsun> I'd choose .nl for sure
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: and i'ts on hellstra, so...
<Hobbsee> crimsun: why so?
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Hmm ok. A voicebox is a rebranded spa afaik
<TheMuso> .c
<crimsun> because everywhere else sucks.
<TheMuso> ugh
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: yeah, that sounds vaguely familiar
<persia> nixternal: See the "Authorising .desktop files" section.  I'm just not finding a good reference for legacy KDE menu entries, and how to migrate to f.d.o .desktop files.
<TheMuso> Well I am using a SPA-3102 here
<TheMuso> With no real problems.
* persia wonders if a .desktop file installed in a non-ideal location is actually a bug in Debian.
<crimsun> sure, why not?  Bugs for everyone!
<polopolo> hello all, what must I do if I want to merge from debian?
<persia> crimsun: The difficulty is that while I can find documentation indicating that Ubuntu appls should follow the f.d.o spec, I'm not finding anything similar in Debian, aside from a couple notes that .desktop files are nice, and that applying Ubuntu .desktop file patches is safe.  I don't want to generate heaps of extra bugs that don't apply just to reduce my personal delta.
<polopolo> And if I want test my package in debian, must I then test in debian 4.0?
<RAOF> polopolo: Sid, I believe.
<RAOF> polopolo: AKA: unstable.
<crimsun> persia: a wishlist bug certainly seems innocuous
<persia> polopolo: If the Ubuntu package differs from the Debian package, you need to apply any Ubuntu changes that are still appropriate to the Debian package and propose it for upload.  See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Merging for more guidance.
<persia> crimsun:  Maybe.  I'll put those last in the queue of patches to feed.
<polopolo> RAOF: where can I download unstable, I cannot find on debian.org
<polopolo> And is a sponsor who says in revu 'yes' or it says 'uploaded'?
<man-di> polopolo: cdimage.debian.org
<polopolo> man-di ty
<polopolo> man-di: then I come to http://www.debian.org/CD/
<polopolo> wait, i'm now on ftp of the serer
<persia> polopolo: For a merge, you generally wouldn't want to use REVU.  See the merge docs above, or "Preparing New Revisions" in MOTU/Contributing.
<minghua> man-di: I don't think it's safe to point people to sid installers unless the d-i team acclaim that they are useful
<man-di> minghua: the page contains etch too
<minghua> man-di, polopolo: the standard way to get an unstable/sid system, I believe, is installing stable and dist-upgrade
<man-di> minghua: its the official page for downgrads
* RAOF didn't know there *were* sid installers.
<man-di> downloads
<nixternal> persia: the desktop files can't be fixed 100% until they update the xdg standards a little more
<minghua> man-di: I thought polopolo was asking "how to download unstable"?
<nixternal> desktop-file-validate contradicts itself with X-Type and Type
<man-di> minghua: oops, I overlooked the "unstable"
<persia> nixternal: desktop-file-validate was recently rewritten upstream, so I'm not surprised.  If you get it close enough, that's good enough.
<minghua> RAOF: http://people.debian.org/~joeyh/d-i/build-logs.html
<RAOF> Heh, cool.  Next time I want to install a sid vm, I'll head there :)
* man-di always uses debootstrap...
<minghua> RAOF: make sure you read http://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/Today first
<minghua> (actually, I found the link on that wiki page)
<RAOF> "Fails due to dpkg database corruption".  Fun.
<nixternal> persia: when I build out the package, kplayer and tmp seem to hold the same files..how can I fix that?
<viveksri15> hi all
<persia> nixternal: I'm not sure, nor if you need to.  Do the binaries contain the right files?  I'll download again and do a local build to experiment in a little bit.
<nixternal> yes
<persia> nixternal: If your binary debs match your desires, I wouldn't worry about extra files that only appear during the build.
<nixternal> ok
<nixternal> I have the xpm icon being installed via rules into debian/tmp/usr/share/pixmaps using install/kplayer-common::
<nixternal> is that cool, or would you do it another way?
<persia> nixternal: I'd use debian/kplayer-common.install to install things in general, but specifically, I recommend putting the icon in kplayer, as otherwise lintian will complain that your menu file references a icon not included in the package.
<nixternal> roger
<nixternal> so no need to add that to the rules then?
<persia> nixternal: CDBS already uses kplayer*.install to install the files into the packages.  Putting it in debian/rules makes two places where you are installing things, and will likely be more confusing to anyone else working with the package.  In general, only overload CDBS when the helper files cannot do what you wish.
<nixternal> k
<StevenK> Hrm RAOF isn't running around on fire.
<chris_> Nope, RAOF has found somewhere inside that's got UniWide coverage.
<StevenK> RAOF: Does that mean your usual desk is open to the elements? :-P
<RAOF> Nope, but my usual desk *isn't* "UniWide"
<Pumpernickel> Double-wide?
<crimsun> he's referring to his uni's lovely wifi
<crimsun> which undoubtedly still beats my uni's
<RAOF> Maybe.
<RAOF> They're pretty clueless when it comes to linux support.
<crimsun> no, I retract that.  I'm sure it does.
<crimsun> I'll put it this way: all the APs in this building are in closets on each floor next to the rear stairwell.  That's right.  Precise identical location on each floor.  One per floor.  For nine floors.
<RAOF> Sounds good to me.
<RAOF> Nice and predictable deadzones!
<crimsun> It would - except only the one on the bottom floor (basement) is connected.
<crimsun> I happen to be on the sixth floor.
<RAOF> ...
<RAOF> Oh, dear.
<crimsun> Remember, the admins for this dear place named the two MACs I can use "FUN" and "Box".
<RAOF> Ok. UniWide beats your wireless.
<jussi01> hello everyone
<Hobbsee> hiya jussi01 
<persia> Hi jussi01
<jussi01> hi Hobbsee, persia
<RAOF_> Hey jussi01 
<jussi01> hello RAOF_
* Hobbsee wonders if her uni wifi will work today
<jussi01> good luck Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> :)
<Hobbsee> i have to go in there at some point... :(
* jussi01 is heading to the football tonight. (essendon v west coast) :D
<Hobbsee> ooh, fun!
<StevenK> jussi01: Woot!
<StevenK> jussi01: At the 'G?
<jussi01> yeah, going with the little brothers :D
<Hobbsee> jussi01: are you normally australian, or you a temporary one?
<jussi01> StevenK: telstra dome
* svschwartz installed gysty i386, looks fresh and stable :)
<jussi01> Hobbsee: Im neither... I am an aussie, how ever i reside in finland....
<jussi01> hee on holiday
<Hobbsee> ahhhh
<jussi01> here..
<Ej_Pulsar> hi to all, i have 2 dirs: one with source files and another with patch files. I wan't to merge diff files with source, can anybody help? I try to use patch command but don't know how do it recursively for all patch files
<Hobbsee> you should come pu to sydney
<RAOF> Yeah, that's where all the cool kids are :)
<StevenK> Heh
<jussi01> hehe, I wish...
<jussi01> someone paying for my virgin/jetstar flights ?
<jussi01> :D
<RAOF> Just walk.  It's not *that* far :P
<persia> Ej_Pulsar: You might be looking for combinediff, but you might also be looking for dpatch.
<jussi01> lol
<StevenK> Heh
<jussi01> RAOF: only, what, maybe 1000 k's ?
<crevette> hello
<RAOF> Yeah, give or take.
<jussi01> hehe :D
<crevette> I have a problem when I try to build a package with 'debuild -S -sa -kDEADBEEF', the resulting *.change use my local address not the one set in DEBEMAIL
<crevette> I have me@myhostname
<Ej_Pulsar> persia, thank a lot
<persia> crevette: Check your debian/changelog
<jussi01> morning dholbach
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> hey jussi01
<persia> crevette: More expansively, I recommend not using -kDEADBEEF unless you are sponsoring someone else's upload, as that way the attempt to sign the package will automatically check against the available keys.
<crevette> persia: it seems it doesn't work without that
<nixternal_> crevette: better yet, add -> export DEBEMAIL=email@address.com  <- to your ~/.bashrc
<persia> crevette: Right.  You need to have your key match the last email address in the changelog.  That's why I recommend not using -k, because it fails if that's not the case.
<jussi01> anyway lads and ladies, im off to the footy, see you all later
<Hobbsee> have fun :)
<Hobbsee> hi spam
<jussi01> i will...bye
<dholbach> crevette: DEBEMAIL - I wrote this in the mail too, no?
<crevette> yep
<crevette> but for a reason I didn't understant, it didn't worked, now it will worked
<crevette> I'm sure
<geser> StevenK: Hi, have you read your scrollback about the bug in requestsync?
<dholbach> crevette: did you    source ~/.bashrc   ?
<StevenK> geser: Yup.
<dholbach> crevette: or restart the terminal session?
<crevette> dholbach: I forgot to modify debian/changelog
<dholbach> ah ok
<StevenK> geser: I'm still thinking about the whole affects ubuntu/ thing for new packages. What makes you think it won't download changelogs for libs?
<geser> if you take sourcepkg[0]  from e.g. "libgnome" you get "l" and if you prepend "lib" to it, you get "libl" not "libg"
<nixternal_> persia: my menu file is getting installed in /usr/share/menu as kplayer-common and not kplayer..how do I fix that?
<persia> nixternal_: Umm..  I think you have to do something tricky with the .install files.  Let's both read `man dh_install` and see if we can figure out what.
<nixternal_> ya, that had a lot to say :)
<dholbach> geser: if sourcepkg.startwith("lib"): str=sourcepkg[0:4]  else: str=sourcepkg[0]    no?
<StevenK> geser: Ahhhh, right.
<persia> nixternal_: On the other hand, if you put both menu and the icon in kplayer-common, I think you won't get a lintian error.
<StevenK> geser: That's me just being a bozo.
<nixternal_> I am going to try something...
* RAOF goes off watch Battlestar Galactica.
<persia> nixternal_: If that doesn't work, you could probably add an rm to install/kplayer-common::, as I don't see any way to pass -X to dh_install under CDBS.
<nixternal_> persia: menu relies on the order of debian/control. I put kplayer at the top and it works as it should
<persia> nixternal_: Neat!  Thanks for sharing the solution.
<superm1> hi persia could i query you for a revu this evening?
<persia> superm1: Depends on where in the world you live, and what you mean by evening, but likely.
<superm1> persia, :)  I'm in the US, CST so, i guess its somewhat evening - probably past my bed time though either way 
<superm1> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5402
<persia> superm1: In that case sure.  I'll look in 10-15 minutes.
<superm1> persia, thanks 
<minghua> it's early morning in US CST :-)
<nixternal_> it is very early morning in CST :)
<Admiral_Chicago> quite early.
<superm1> I dont declare it early morning until like 3 or 4A
<superm1> when i realize i should have gone to bed 5-6 hrs before
<nixternal_> 20 minutes until 3
<nixternal_> god I enjoy the slowness of pbuilder
* persia thinks it's even odds whether it's morning or evening CST at this point.
<persia> superm1: Is this a Debian candidate package for pre REVU before submitting to Debian mentors?
<superm1> persia, No, its going into ubuntu only
<superm1> as its for an ubuntu derivative
<nixternal_> persia: when you get a chance, no rush, as I am going to update my RFS with this info for sponsors as well
<nixternal_> http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/k/kplayer/kplayer_0.6.2-1.dsc
<persia> nixternal_: Are you still seeking a separate early Ubuntu upload, or just going to Debian for sync?  If the former, please also update REVU.
<nixternal_> going Debian and then request sync
<nixternal_> unless Debian says no, at which point I convert it back into Ubuntu only
<persia> superm1: Commented.
<persia> nixternal_: OK.  I'll check the Debian package.  How would you like comments, if any?
<superm1> persia, thanks.  question though.  Why -0ubuntu1
<nixternal_> persia: what ever is easiest
<superm1> if its ubuntu native package
<persia> superm1: It's an Ubuntu package, so it should have an Ubuntu revision.  For native (see my other comment), 0.1ubuntu1 works as well.
<superm1> persia, even if it has no aspirations of ever going up to debian?
<persia> superm1: The package may not have aspirations, but I cannot speak for the thoughts of Debian maintainers in the future.  Someone might like the artwork.
<superm1> persia, reason I bring it up, is because we recently had another mythbuntu-artwork package uploaded
<superm1> that got a 0.1
<superm1> version 
<superm1> without the ubuntu1 appended
<persia> superm1: That's the beauty of REVU.  You'll get different comments from different reviewers.  In any case, debian/copyright and debian/docs would have prevented my advocation.
<superm1> Ok :)
<superm1> persia, when opening a bzr branch on LP to manage this, is there a different tool to grab from the branch and update?
<superm1> (a good example avail that you know)?
<persia> superm1: Personally, I think there should never be new Ubuntu native packages.  We use launchpad, so it's really not that hard to generate a bzr upstream (and track in LP) for these packages.  This also allows work to be done during freezes without interfering with the release candidate versions.
<nixternal_> OK, I am going to go to bed...persia, if that package is wrotten, highlight me :)
<nixternal_> g'nite
<persia> superm1: I haven't worked with any bzr packages yet, but for cvs packages, I use get-orig-source: in debian/rules, as documented in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/CommonPackagingMistakes/ChangingTheOrigTarball.  I'm guessing bzr ... export would do the same thing.
<superm1> persia, any such page that explains how to do it with cdbs though?
<dholbach> you can just    rm .bzr
<dholbach> or use ... hang on
<persia> superm1: The example listed as "directly imported from cvs" was extracted from a CDBS debian/rules.
<persia> dholbach: is rm .bzr preferable to bzr ... export?
<superm1> oh 
<dholbach> I don't think there's a bzr export
<persia> dholbach: Ah.  man bzr is lying to me then.
<dholbach> oh, there is
<dholbach> sorry
<superm1> persia, i'll look into switching this to bzr then too.  thanks for the suggestions
<persia> superm1: That'd be great.  Thanks for taking the extra trouble.
<dholbach> there's also    DEB_AUTO_CLEANUP_RCS
<dholbach> DEB_AUTO_CLEANUP_RCS := yes
<dholbach> not sure if that helps you there
<superm1> dholbach, are those supposed to clean up .bzr?  ( I would assume they have support for .svn and .cvs already)
<persia> dholbach: Neat!  I still prefer foo export, but that's a nice tool for broken upstreams.
<maarten_> I set up an account without password yesterday, for my daugther, and it was not as straightforward as i expected (i had to edit /etc/gdm/gdm.conf-custom and /etc/pam.d/gdm by hand...). is this something to take upstream, or might this be something to improve for ubuntu?
<Fujitsu> maarten_: System->Administration->Login Window?
<maarten_> Fujitsu: this particular option can not be set there
<persia> maarten_: It's difficult by design.  You might be interested in the Enable Automatic Logon.
<maarten_> persia: yes, i have seen the option but it does not do what i want
<persia> maarten_: The side effect of not having a password is a very high probabilty of remote exploit.  If you use Automatic Logon, you can then use logoff, logon to get to a different user, while maintaining a default for use by those who don't remember passwords well.
<maarten_> persia: but if i restrict login only to gdm, this is no problem
<pochu> Morning
<persia> Fujitsu: I noticed your comment on bug #110151.  I'm not sure how to commit the changes safely.  Could you?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 110151 in mplayer "mplayer not compiled with nas audio support" [Wishlist,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/110151
<Fujitsu> persia: Sure, but it's fairly easy. Check out ~ubuntu-dev/mplayer/ubuntu, make changes, commit.
<persia> maarten_: I understand what you seek, and why.  I just believe that a request to make it easy will be rejected if a bug is submitted to either the Ubuntu bugtracker or upstream.
<persia> Fujitsu: Thanks.  I keep meaning to read some bzr docs, but keep putting it off :)
<Fujitsu> Baaah. Stupid MSN Messenger. Today the servers are denying the existence of any of my contacts when I use PyMSNt + jabberd14, and Pidgin just crashes.
<pochu> Fujitsu: amsn?
<DarkMageZ> Fujitsu, how long ago did this start happening/
<maarten_> persia: what surprises me most is the fact that gdm.conf has this option PasswordRequire=false , but that this is not enough
<Fujitsu> DarkMageZ: Some time within the last 12 hours.
<DarkMageZ> Fujitsu, i just logged on fine
<Fujitsu> I can log on fine, but attempting to establish a switchboard session results in the server telling me the contact doesn't exist, even when I just received a presence notification.
<Fujitsu> Hi \sh.
<\sh> guys, who is responsible for the nexuiz packages in universe?
<Hobbsee> andyp did hte merge
<persia> \sh: There's a sync request pending.  AndyP has been working on them.
<Hobbsee> jdong
<Hobbsee> siretart
<\sh> I prepared some packages for feisty (nexuiz 2.3) if you need them, http://archive.linux-server.org/nexuiz/ source and binary.
<Nightrose> hi \sh
<\sh> hey Nightrose 
<persia> \sh: Would you mind filing a bug about that?  It'll be easier to track.
<BugMaN> hi \sh :)
<\sh> persia, sure
<persia> \sh: Thanks.
<persia> nixternal_: When you get to backscroll, the only thing I see left is that kplayer.install should specify usr/share/pixmaps/ instead of debian/tmp/usr/share/pixmaps/kplayer.xpm for the icon installation.
<maarten_> persia: anyway, i'd be pleased to add this functionality to gdmsetup. but i'd like to know beforehand if it would have a change of being included..
<superm1> persia, debian/  shouldnt be committed to the bzr branch too in this arrangement, correct?
<persia> superm1: Right.  debian/ is different.  If you like, consider having a separate branch for debian/ to maintain the ubuntu package.
<superm1> I think the thing that was confusing me is that bzr-buildpackage refers to grabbing directly from the branch to build
<superm1> that woudl be referring to the debian/ branch then
<persia> superm1: bzr-buildpackage is designed for bzr debian/ with standard upstream.  I think you're planning the opposite.
<superm1> yup :)
<persia> maarten_: I don't think the chances are high, but gdm is in main: if you really want pre-discussion, either #gnome or #ubuntu-devel may contain people with stronger opinions.
<superm1> persia, regarding debian/copyright, calling it a library.  do you mean to just change all instances of Library to say "Theme Package"
<superm1> or something to that effect?
<persia> superm1: That's a tricky one.  LGPL is usually for libraries.  I think you can search and replace to adjust it, but you might want to search for examples.  You probably also want to make sure to identify which files are covered by which copyrights - I don't know which icons belong to the MaxTux2 theme.
<siretart> Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> siretart
<siretart> \sh: I uploaded nexuiz 2.3 yesterday to debian. you might rather want to sync from there
<persia> siretart: AndyP requested a sync, but I asked why {$Source-version} was a good replacement for {$Upstream-version} before ACK'ing.  Feel free to update bug 119252 if I am in error (and a sync is correct).
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119252 in nexuiz "Please sync nexuiz (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119252
<superm1> persia, i really like the way this turned out with the bzr branch instead.  I can see how new revisions will be incredibly easy the way its done now
<superm1> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5419
<\sh> siretart, cool....I just packaged it yesterday evening ... and hooray...fantastic game ;)
<maarten_> persia: ok, thanks for your input. i just mailed the people most prominently listed in the gdm changelogs, to ask what they think
<persia> superm1: Great!  You might consider deporting your other native packages for the next release :)
<persia> maarten_: That's also a good strategy.  Good luck.
<\sh> siretart, btw...are you DD now?
<superm1> persia, for sure i will. We have several other one sthat will be on their way in still, i'll update them to do it this way instead too
<bashelier> hey \sh 
<\sh> moins bashelier 
* Hobbsee waves to \sh 
<persia> superm1: That'd be great, and it also increases the chances that your work will be also used by other distributions (and more people will help).
<\sh> Hobbsee, btw...congrats for core-dev :)
<Hobbsee> \sh: thankyou :)
<bashelier> \sh: I've just axchanged a mail with Scott Ritchie, looks like he wants to upload wine packages inubuntu himself now
<\sh> bashelier, which is good :)
<\sh> bashelier, hopefully for him it's easy to become a motu in no time...
<bashelier> \sh: right, the downside is he asked me to sponsors his uploads... but I'm not a MOTU :)
<\sh> bashelier, hehe...I think you find at least one motu to sponsor those packages...he will take over the responsibilty
<bashelier> \sh: np for me, thanks :)
<\sh> bashelier, at least there are people who are taking care of wine in ubuntu...and scott is one of the good guys...
<bashelier> \sh: ok ;)
<\sh> bashelier, and scott has a lot of know how regarding wine
<bashelier> \sh: I've noticed that yes :)
<superm1> persia, i've got one more that i updated to be done the same way if you could look it over http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5420
<persia> superm1: Sure.  As a note, you'll probably get better response by asking for general review than targeting specific individuals (unless you've been working with them on a specific package for a while).
<superm1> noted.  I had figured since you had got me to use bzr for these you might be the best to leave the first comment :)
<persia> superm1: No worries.
<superm1> on this note though i will actually get to bed.  4am.  yikes.
<superm1> Thanks again for all the help this evening persia.  really appreciate it.
<persia> superm1: 5420 still looks native.  Are you sure you uploaded the files you wanted?
<superm1> whoops there is one that didnt get moved into that directory
<siretart> \sh: since quite some time already...
<persia> superm1: If you upload again in a hurry, there'll be a comment when you wake up :)
<\sh> siretart, so you could do mentoring for debian?
<siretart> persia: I think this should have been dealt now in debian, I talked to Fuddl about this
<siretart> \sh: yes, I'm e.g. sponsoring Fuddl's work on the nexuiz packages
<superm1> ok all reuploaded.  bed now
<\sh> siretart, cool...I'll come back to you ;)
<siretart> \sh: sure!
<persia> siretart: OK.  Do you want to ACK the sync, or shall I paste your comment?
<siretart> persia: let me see the bug first, what's the bugno?
<persia> siretart: bug 119252
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119252 in nexuiz "Please sync nexuiz (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119252
<siretart> persia: ack'ed
<persia> siretart: OK.  Sorry for the confusion.
<persia> I'm trying to clean out the U-U-S queue, and there are about 10 ACK'd sync requests there.  Does anyone have an objection to me unsubscribing from them?
<lionel> persia: that's what you proposed in your procedure. Nobody object, so, go on :)
<persia> lionel: I usually like to wait 10-15 minutes before slapping people with procedure, but that's the plan :)
<Lutin> anybody with a feisty amd64 and 5 minutes free ?
* wolfeon has a intel64 :)
<wolfeon> Lutin: what is up?
<Lutin> wolfeon: would you mind installing cinepaint, checking that it fails to install, and then install it from feisty-proposed and see if it works ?
<wolfeon> *downloading*
<wolfeon> guess it doesnt help I have proposed by dedault :P
<Lutin> err :/
<wolfeon> tells me unmet deps for cinepaint-data
<wolfeon> for the non-proposed repos
<Lutin> wolfeon: ok
<Lutin> wolfeon: does it install fine when proposed then ,
<wolfeon> it installs..
<wolfeon> but when I run cinepaint, there is a sigsegv aught
<wolfeon> *caught
<Lutin> wolfeon: yep, I have a fix for it but need to propagate the -proposed package to -updates before uploading the right fix
<Fujitsu> Lutin: Won't one SRU be better than two?
<wolfeon> I wonder if my patch for python-fam was ever fixed
<Lutin> Fujitsu: well, pitti told me to upload the 2nd after the first has been uploaded
<Fujitsu> That's odd.
<Lutin> yeah
<Fujitsu> I guess it allows for minimal regressions.
<persia> Lutin: While in general it's better to have 1-change debdiffs for SRUs, wouldn't the release of something that installs but doesn't run just lead to frustration for users?  In this special case, you might want to check with an archive-admin again.
<Lutin> persia: doing it right now :)
* persia types too slow
<persia> ly
<persia> mshima: About the wm5 support bugs.  Have you had further contact with upstream?
* persia notes that those who like to prepare debdiffs should review https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=patch as a source of bugs to fix.
<leonel> hello  everyone !
<joejaxx> Hello leonel 
<DktrKranz> hi leonel 
<leonel> hey  DktrKranz   my  please  merge dbmail 2.2.5  report was cancelled   on launchpad  
<DktrKranz> huh?
<DktrKranz> cancelled?
<leonel> didn't know that I must do first the diff and then  report it  on launchpad 
<leonel> :)
<DktrKranz> so, do you mean rejected?
<afflux> DktrKranz: bug 119131
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119131 in dbmail "Please Merge 2.2.5 from Debian Unstable" [Undecided,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119131
<DktrKranz> thanks
<leonel> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbmail/+bug/119131
<DktrKranz> I see
<leonel> well no problem   let's do the diff first
<persia> leonel: That was only rejected because you forgot to assign yourself, and a triager wanted to reduce extra bugs.  Please set to "Confirmed" and assign yourself while you work on it.  Apologies for any confusion.
<DktrKranz> you could set it to "In progress" and assign it to yourself
<persia> leonel: As DktrKranz says, "In Progress" is probably even better.
<leonel> persia: I'm learning   sorry for causing the confusion ..
<DktrKranz> leonel, thanks for working on that
<persia> leonel: No worries.  The same thing happened to me a few times :)
<leonel> great !
<DktrKranz> have a look at BTS too
<leonel> this is a great way to start a day ...
<DktrKranz> I submitted some of Ubuntu deltas to Debian
<leonel> having  great support  for  breakfast   what  else you can ask ?
<DktrKranz> so they could hopefully be included in the feature
<DktrKranz> *future
<leonel> DktrKranz: ok I'll check the  BTS 
<leonel> but I'm  stuck  with some bugs in clamav that I'll fix  today  and  then  start the  dbmail merge
<persia> leonel: Looking through the backscroll, I'd just like to confirm that the best practice is to have an open bug ("In Progress", Assigned) in LP before proceeding with a merge, to let others know you are working on it (and to check to make sure such bugs don't exist prior to working on a merge).
<leonel> Ok    assigned to me  and  set it  to  "in progress"
<leonel> persia: which bugs ?  that someone is already working ?
<DktrKranz> check if there are rejected bugs, too
<DktrKranz> sometimes maintainers want to push some changes in
<DktrKranz> and provide a merge themselves
<DktrKranz> it happened to me once
<leonel> ok  that's why I've mailed  you DktrKranz  first  
<persia> leonel: I only see your merge listed from https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbmail/+bugs, but it's just a good idea to check before processing.  Also, if you can fix 78946 when merging, that would be great.
<leonel> bug 78946
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 78946 in dbmail "ssl wrapper support broken for pop3 (init script)" [Undecided,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/78946
<leonel> persia: will do 
<DktrKranz> I think it's fixed in gutsy
<DktrKranz> or it is no longer an issue
<DktrKranz> maybe we can nominate for stable releases and mark as fixed in gutsy
<persia> DktrKranz: If it's fixed in gutsy, it can be closed, unless it represents a security update or SRU, in which case the applicable releases should be nominated.
<leonel> so  how  does the  non security bugs  get  fixed ??    like  the security bugs ?
<persia> Looking at the bug in detail, I don't think it meets the criteria for SRU, as it's not reported as a regression, and doesn't cause a loss of user data.  Maybe a backport?
<DktrKranz> a backport could go
<persia> leonel: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/SRU and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates have some information.
<DktrKranz> I don't know if it is critical bug
<DktrKranz> but I think it isn't
<leonel> persia: thanks
<DktrKranz> anyway, we could tell submitter to do what persia suggested
<persia> DktrKranz: To request a backport, for something fixed in the current development release, mark the package task "Fix Released" and report it against the whatever-backports virtual package (e.g. feisty-backports).  You'll want to first make sure it meets the backport criteria (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BackportRequestProcess).
<leonel> ooo  that's what SRU  means ..
<DktrKranz> it should, I will give it a try later this evening
<persia> DktrKranz: In general, it's a good idea for maintainers to chase these processes, rather than submitters.  If you (or leonel, or another one of us) believe it should be backported or SRU'd, we can follow the process.  If not, it's better just to tell the submitter that it is fixed in the current version, and will be released shortly (if it doesn't meet the policy criteria for any of SRU, Security, or Backport).
<DktrKranz> so, If I think it can be eligible, it's me who asks for a SRU/Backport/something, right?
<persia> DktrKranz: Right.  We review the bugs, and follow the processes to get the fixes in the archive (or whatever is required to close the bug).
<DktrKranz> thanks
<persia> That way the submitters can use their computers happily, and the more technically ept can send us patches (to save us time).
<DktrKranz> good
<DktrKranz> I'm in contact with the guys from bug #110637
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 110637 in php5 "php5-interbase missing in feisty" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/110637
<DktrKranz> for an issue related to php5 universe packages
<DktrKranz> we are gathering informations in order to have a good base to start working
<DktrKranz> is it worth to ask suggestions to TB?
<persia> DktrKranz: I'd start by contacting some of the recent PHP5 uploaders here or in #ubuntu-devel, rather than going straight to the TB.
<DktrKranz> I asked pitti during feisty developmen cycle
<DktrKranz> I was late do to anything, though
<persia> DktrKranz: Is it still an issue for gutsy?  It's certainly not to late to do something now.
<DktrKranz> is it
<DktrKranz> I waited for tribe 1 to be released before asking
<DktrKranz> gutsy misses php5-interbase, php5-imap and php5-mcrypt
<DktrKranz> which are not shipped in php5 since they depend on package in Universe
<DktrKranz> I collected some info here: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2007-June/001687.html
<persia> DktrKranz: I think there is time.  FeatureFreeze isn't until August, so there's a while yet to prepare a new complementary package that could provide those, if there is sufficient coordination with the main packages.
<DktrKranz> so, a php5-universe could be a choice
<persia> If you have time to speak with interested parties and document a proposed strategy to address it (perhaps a Spec formatted document in the wiki), you could probably get it done.
<DktrKranz> I will coordinate with carlos, who uploaded a package in REVU
<DktrKranz> we mailed in the later days to define a strategy
<DktrKranz> and we should meet in IRC during weekend
<persia> DktrKranz: Great!  Good luck.  Please document the plan in the Wiki once finalised, and announce the page to ubuntu-motu@ to ensure that interested parties have a chance to review prior to execution.
<DktrKranz> should I ask for a mentor to help us reviewing it?
<DktrKranz> once it is done
<persia> DktrKranz: If you have a mentor, asking them for review is a good idea.  Whether you already have a mentor or not, asking for review here is a good idea.
<DktrKranz> I'll keep it into account
<DktrKranz> now, let's get business :)
<DktrKranz> thanks for your feedback
<DktrKranz> see you
<leonel> wow no php5-imap  in gutsy  ?  we need that  for squirrelmail   don't we ?
<persia> leonel: You might want to get involved with the plan, just to make sure :)
<leonel> great  !
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<Hobbsee> hiya
* persia stops processing U-U-S for the day.  Anyone want a REVU?
<bmm> Any MOTU willing to comment on ccbuild http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5413 is very welcome. I'm looking for the second advocate
<afflux> damn
<afflux> can anyone unsubscribe ubuntu-archive from bug 119317?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119317 in empathy "Please sync empathy (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119317
<afflux> I forgot to use -s in requestsync
<StevenK> Only ubuntu-archive can unsubscribe themselves.
<mshima> persia: the libsynce maintainer is blocked. so I couldn't email him
<persia> mshima: OK.  Based on the last comment, do you still seek sponsorship for bug 116626
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 116626 in libsynce "WM5 (Windows Mobile 5) support" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/116626
<mshima> yes, but libsynce is in main.
<mshima> persia: and the others packages depends on it.
<mshima> persia: Don't know what to do.
<persia> mshima: Unless you are working on something that depends on the newer packages, and cannot wait until it reaches Debian, I would suggest either waiting until it syncs, and closing the bug, or rejecting the bug as not required now.  If the new upstream doesn't reach debian until after Debian Import Freeze, you can manually request a sync for the relevant packages.
<persia> StevenK: Why did you set bug 119317 "Needs Info"?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119317 in empathy "Please sync empathy (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119317
<StevenK> No ack
* persia looks again
<mshima> persia: They will not work, for now I'm using my packages but would be nice to have at ubuntu repos.
<persia> StevenK: Ah.  Did you refresh first?  I'll adjust :)
<StevenK> persia: Right, thanks. :-)
<persia> mshima: My apologies, but I'm confused.  What will not work, exactly?  In what way?
<mshima> persia: There is a new framework for syncing with the wm5, there is a new program (odccm) to make the connection with wm5.
<persia> mshima: OK.  Am I correct then in assuming that all the packages upstream listed in the bug need to be added to the repository, or updated to make things work, and that some of those components are in main?
<mshima> And I have to compile the kernel module by myself. They are working upstreams but didn't got in already.
<mshima> persia: yes
<persia> mshima: OK.  Thanks for explaining it.  This sounds like a medium-sized transition to me, given that there are several source updates and new packages that must happen together, and a number of packages in universe and main need to be updated to use the new library.
<persia> mshima:  Could you please create a wiki page documenting everything that needs to be done to manage this transition, including links to the upstream-generated .dsc files (that are intended for Debian) and information about which packages need to be recompiled to use the new library?
<persia> Once complete, please email ubuntu-devel-discuss@l.u.c to announce your plan (feel free to ask for feedback here first), and notify the appropriate people of what must be done?  This will probably work better than trying to process it one bug at a time.
<mshima> persia: I think I made a confusion.
<persia> mshima: I've unsubscribed ubuntu-universe-sponsors from the bug, pending the development of the new strategy.  Let me know if you need any help.
<mshima> persia: libsynce is not in main.
<mshima> persia: it is in universe
<persia> mshima: That makes it easier then :)  I still recommend making a library transition wiki page, as there are ~15 rdepends that should be managed together, but the annoucement should be sent to ubuntu-motu@l.u.c instead.
<mshima> persia: ok thanks
<RainCT> persia: new debdiff for bug #48292 uploaded ;)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 48292 in dosbox "Doesn't have a .desktop file" [Wishlist,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/48292
<persia> RainCT: Thanks.  I'll look at it now.
<mshima> persia: how do I do to get core-devs attention at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libvirt/+bug/119100
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119100 in libvirt "Please update to 0.2.2" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<pochu> mshima: you can subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors
<mshima> There is no package at the repos that depends on it so it shouldn't be difficult to update it
<mshima> pochu: thanks
<persia> mshima: Firstly, you'll generally get a faster and better response if you ask questions to the channel, rather than individuals.  Secondly, you've already done everything you need to do.
<Hobbsee> pochu: only if there's actually something to upload
<Hobbsee> oh, there is, cool
<persia> interdiff too :)
<mshima> persia: ok
<persia> mshima: For future note, you don't need to attach the .dsc and .diff.gz files when you've already uploaded to REVU.  It's also a good idea to give an explanation of why the package should be upgraded (new feature X, closes bug Y, etc.).
<persia> mshima: Nevermind: you've got that - it's just small, and I missed it.  Sorry.
<pochu> Hobbsee: hi :)
<Hobbsee> hiya
<Hobbsee> er, sorry, that was to go to mshima 
<mshima> persia: ok, I think it is small too, but there are a lot of changes. Next time I will make it bigger  ;)
<persia> mshima: If a core-dev doesn't comment in the next 10-12 hours, I'd recommend updating the description to include more.  If it is getting attention, there's no need.
<mshima> persia: right
<zul> libvirt is universe not main
<pochu> !info libvirt gutsy
<ubotu> Package libvirt does not exist in gutsy
<pochu> !info libvirt gutsy0
<pochu> !info libvirt0 gutsy
<pochu> :)
<ubotu> Package libvirt does not exist in feisty
<ubotu> libvirt0: library for interfacing with Xen & other virtualization systems. In component main, is optional. Version 0.1.8-0ubuntu2 (gutsy), package size 68 kB, installed size 196 kB
<zul> i could of have sworn ajmitch did something with libvirt in friesty
* ajmitch did
<pochu> Maybe it's been promoted
<zul> oh hey ajmitch 
<persia> zul: Boundaries are vague :)
<ajmitch> it was put straight to main due to rh cluster suite stuff
<ajmitch> hi zul 
<mshima> !info libsynce0 gutsy
<ubotu> libsynce0: A helper library for synce, a tool to sync WinCE devices. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.9.3-1 (gutsy), package size 18 kB, installed size 96 kB
<mshima> cool
<zul> wasnt that part of xen that got promoted?
<ajmitch> libvirt-dev was a build-dep 
<zul> ah ok
<persia> RainCT: Given the ffmpeg delay, would you like to consider a fix for bug 62987 as part of your work on 118422?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 62987 in xmms2 "won't build on ubuntu's buildds, but builds locally and in Debian" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/62987
<geser> persia: is xmms2 still using scons?
<geser> last I looked it switched to something others
<persia> geser: As usual, you are correct.  That's part of what makes fixing 62987 easy :)
<geser> without scons it should build now also on the buildds
<polopolo> Who is a sponsor?
<persia> polopolo: Someone who reviews and uploads the work of others.
<ajmitch> night all
<polopolo> so the revewers and uploaders are the sponsers?
<persia> Night ajmitch
<polopolo> night
<persia> polopolo: Usually.  Not everyone who can upload chooses to sponsor.
<polopolo> I know, ok, thank you
<RainCT> persia: eh.. how?
<geser> RainCT: you can probably ignore it. xmms2 had problems building on the buildds (but only there) in the past.
<geser> but as I doesn't use scons anymore, it should build now
<persia> RainCT: Take a look at the build log, and see what is missing.  Verify that it is being provided by the build-depends of the new package.  If geser is correct (as is usually the case) the problem was the use of scons, which is no longer used, so you could put a changelog entry that says "No longer uses scons (LP: 62987)" to close it.
* persia doesn't think ignoring bugs helps reduce the 30,000 open bugs
<zul> persia: maybe so but it does improve your sanity
<geser> persia: what I meant is that the bug probably doesn't need any special action
<persia> zul: To some degree.  I've reviewed about 50 bugs that were being ignored today, and by prodding them, have been able to solicit about 6 new revisions to address the issues, which makes me feel good.
<persia> geser: It probably doesn't, but I expect it will just get left if not looked at.  During a merge is a great time to check for bugs that probably don't apply and mark them closed.
<RainCT> uo, is \sh back?
<apachelogger> RainCT: nope, away as we can see :P
<RainCT> apachelogger: well, that's not what I mean :p
<apachelogger> RainCT: yeah I know but I dunno a proper answer :P
<apachelogger> \sh_away: any nice reason why you're idling here?
<RainCT> persia: I agree with geser that it should work without scons, but how can we be sure of that if it does not try to build?
<persia> RainCT:  With scons, it's hard to test, as the behaviour on the buildds is special.  If you watch the bug separately, that's fine too.
<JonathanArg> hola a todos
<JonathanArg> estan
<JonathanArg> hola
<persia> JonathanArg: 
<JonathanArg> q tal
<JonathanArg> hola
<JonathanArg> hay alguien q conteste
<Hobbsee> !ping
<ubotu> pong
<jussi01> !test
<ubotu> failed
<sacater> just to say, I going away for 2 weeks from sunday, so if my membership things get acted upon whilst I am away, just hold onto them until the 24th
<keescook> leonel: I use a script to attempt to extract debdiffs from debian packages: http://people.ubuntu.com/~kees/scripts/d-pulldebdiff
<keescook> e.g. d-pulldebdiff clamav 0.90.1-3etch2
<leonel> keescook: Great !  I'll take a look and  let's finish those  bugs ..
<pochu> sacater: your membership won't be touched until it expires, and I think they're for one year + renewal
<pochu> So don't worry ;)
<sacater> pochu: its been about a week since I gained membership, when does it normally get processed
<lionel> sacater: what do you mean by "get processed"
<lionel> You are already in the LP team
<gnomefreak> 2 years
<gnomefreak> sacater: if you mean email than it more than likely is already enabled try having someone send you email to <yourLPid>@ubuntu.com :)
<RainCT> keescook: "(you can check what patch system is in use with scripts like this[1] )" you forgot to say what [1]  is :P
<keescook> RainCT: eek! sorry, one sec
<keescook> RainCT: okay, bug 119135 updated.  sorry about that!
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119135 in gdm "wrong &quote; entity" [Low,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119135
<RainCT> np
<Kmos> anyone have time to look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5396 (gqview latest stable version)
<keescook> archive admins, can you check on a binary-NEW of "libmyth-dev"?  I don't see it listed at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+queue but it's not been published yet.
<Hobbsee> keescook: wrong channel for htat
<keescook> Hobbsee: ah, dang, was hoping myth==universe would land me here
<Hobbsee> keescook: sure, but the canonical employees tend to hang in -devel
<Hobbsee> keescook: at least hte archive ones
* keescook nods
<leonel> keescook: now we got  4  new  CVEs  for  clamav  one is local  
<leonel> keescook: cve  2007-3023 2007-3024  2007-3122 2007-3123 
* keescook nods
<Kmos> cve-2007-3023
<ubotu> unsp.c in ClamAV before 0.90.3 and 0.91 before 0.91rc1 does not properly calculate the end of a certain buffer, with unknown impact and remote attack vectors. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2007-3023)
<Kmos> :)
<keescook> leonel: that reminds me, I just opened bug 119361 so that LP will correctly use CVE-YYYY-NNNN instead of YYYY-NNNN for their tracking
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119361 in malone "CVE links should use CVE-YYYY-NNNN format" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119361
<leonel> 3023 patch found .
<mok_> I can't log on to revu's homepage.
<mok_> When I do "recover" and decode the message, it says "None"
<bmm> Any MOTU: ccbuild is looking for a second advocate or comments http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5413
<leonel> keescook: we got in  feisty's clamav    0.90.2-0ubuntu1.1    after patching the new  4 cves  will be   0.90.2-0ubuntu1.2 ??
<RainCT> bug #119220 can be rejected or?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119220 in empathy "empathy: no launcher in the menu" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119220
<RainCT> oops wrong channel :p
<pochu> If a package doesn't have a dh_iconcache call, does it mean that when you install, the menu item won't load the icon?
<keescook> leonel: yes, that's the correct version for feisty.
<leonel> keescook: pbuilding now 
<keescook> leonel: great!  thanks for staying on top of clamav.
<leonel> dapper's  clamav   Is my pain ...
<leonel> :)
<alexises> hello
<alexises> i have a problaime for a desktop file
<alexises> i have creat a desktopfile but i don't know to install it
<alexises> i use dh_install ?
<pochu> alexises: yes, putting it in debian/<package>.install
<alexises> ok
<pochu> If the desktop file is in debian/, the line in <package>.install should look like "debian/<package>.desktop usr/share/applications/
<alexises> ok
<RainCT> keescook: please check bug 119135
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119135 in gdm "wrong &quote; entity" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119135
<keescook> RainCT: looks great. I will get it built & uploaded.  thanks! :)
<jekil> after a down of my internet connection where i am uploading to revu, i cant upload the same file. how can i do?
<RainCT> :)
<Kmos> keescook: u're a core-dev ?
<keescook> Kmos: yup
<Kmos> keescook: can you look at this one http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5396
<Kmos> pitti doesn't have time
<keescook> Kmos: sure, one sec
<Kmos> thanks
<Kmos> very much
<jekil> the error is this: Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer 
<keescook> Kmos: I think the "X-Original-Maintainer" field needs to be "XSBC-Original...."
<Kmos> keescook: why?
<Kmos> isn't that a debian thing ?
<Kmos> Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
<Kmos> X-Original-Maintainer: Torsten Landschoff <torsten@debian.org>
<keescook> for it to be processed correctly by launchpad (as I understand it) the "S" "B" and "C" are for binary, source, and ... changes, I think.  anyway, without that, the "Original-Maintainer" field just kinda vanishes
<Kmos> i've this at my ddclient package, that is at gutsy
<keescook> I might be wrong.  :P
<Kmos> keescook: i change it right now
<keescook> Kmos: the other issue is that this is a new upstream, so pitti will end up looking at it anyway.  :)
<Kmos> keescook: uploading with XSBC changed
<Kmos> keescook: pitti tells me that another one can check it and upload
<Kmos> he told crimsun some days ago, but the main was frozen because of tribe1
<keescook> ah, right, because it existed prior, yes.  (sorry, I'm still new to doing REVUs.  ;)
<Kmos> :-)
<Kmos> keescook: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5428
<keescook> Kmos: I'm waiting for the orig to download.  brb
<Kmos> :)
<Kmos> it tested it with pbuilder and it created .deb fine
<Kmos> *I
<PriceChild> I'm trying to figure out how to fix an unmet dep on libetpan10. I can't figure out why ${shlibs:Depends} would pull that in instead of libetpan11. apt-get install libetpan10 mentions that it is referred to by another package and I'm wondering if this could have something to do with it?
<geser> PriceChild: the package needs a rebuild to get linked against libetpan11
* PriceChild wonders if he was so silly that he didn't just rebuild it himself to see...
<keescook> crimsun: is there a special magic you use to take a REVU-approved package and uploaded it (which generates the motu email, etc?)  I wanted to pull the trigger on http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5419
<keescook> Kmos: your changelog seems to replace pitti's.  instead it should be added on to the top.  (i.e. the changelog for 2.0.1-1ubuntu2 is missing)
<keescook> (and actually, it seems that that version was uploaded to fix the Original-Maintainer issue)
<PriceChild> geser, Thankyou. I can't believe that wasn't the first thing I did... :(
<Kmos> keescook: hmm.. it seems that that version was uploaded to fix the Original-Maintainer issue ??
<Kmos> keescook: uploading with martin changelog
<keescook> Kmos: cool, thanks.
<Kmos> done
<Kmos> keescook: i deleted martin changelog accidently
<Kmos> when I do the dch -i -D gutsy
<Kmos> :)
<keescook> heh  :)
<Kmos> keescook: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5429
<geser> another security bug in wordpress 2.2 :(
<alexises> bashelier toujours rien ?
<Kmos> geser: wordpress is a mine of bugs :)
<Kmos> bad php code written
* pochu wonders whether anybody is running unstable ATM :)
<keescook> geser: unless source of fun.  *sigh*
<geser> Kmos: Debian discussed dropping WP for etch
<keescook> geser: yeah, I watched that for a while.  I guess we'll see how much traction they got from upstream's promise to support security updates better.
<Kmos> geser: i think that's good =) if someone needs it, install and maintain it
<keescook> Kmos: looks good.  I've marked it +1
<RainCT> what has to be done in order that a program starts automatically after installation? (for bug 119220)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119220 in empathy "empathy: no launcher in the menu" [Undecided,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119220
<geser> keescook: http://wordpress.org/support/topic/120857 points to the changeset fixing this problem
<keescook> geser: nice, that's an improvement.
<Kmos> keescook: thanks
<keescook> Kmos: np.  I need the REVU practice.  ;)
<Kmos> :)
<Kmos> https://launchpad.net/ustouch
<Kmos> my project :)
<persia> RainCT: Regarding 119220, I believe that the correct method to have something start up by default is to add a .desktop to /etc/xdg/autostart, but you might want to seek confirmation that this is not GNOME-specific.
<Kmos> keescook: try to find another core-dev to give another +1 and upload it
<vil> hi all
<vil> any idea why buntudot.org does not work?
<vil> I did not check it lately and now I get server not found in firefox
<DarkSun88> G'night
* persia thought only one REVU (or core-REVU) was required for new upstream versions prior to UVF.
<RainCT> persia: that starts it each time you start session? if I understood right it already does start automatically, but only once it was launched for the first time (or perhaps after reboot, reporter did not confirm that), so what it needs is to be started after installation
<keescook> leonel: great work.  were you able to test against a "bad" RAR file?
<leonel> still looking for a bad one ..
<persia> RainCT: It seems to use the legacy /usr/share/gnome/autostart directory, but yes, it only activates after logout and login (or reboot).  Fixing this is hard, as the postinst runs as root, and so doesn't know which sessions to update.  I don't think a menu item is helpful - it would be used only once, and only by people who just installed empathy, and haven't logged out and logged back in, thereby cluttering the menus uselessly.
<RainCT_brb> persia: isn't it possible to run    su <username>; empathy; exit;         ?
<RainCT_brb> persia: (where username have the script replace it with the user that is logged in)
<persia> RainCT: Sure, but for which <username>?
<persia> RainCT: What if multiple users are logged in?  How about one user on the desktop, and one via ssh?
<leonel> keescook: I'm making a bad rar to test 
<RainCT_brb> persia: ok, thanks
<RainCT_brb> good night
<leonel> keescook: couldn't make the file 
<leonel> :(
<leonel> keescook: i've asked a  clamav developer if he can provide the bad rar which I cant access in the clamav bugtracker
<keescook> leonel: okay, good
<alexises_> bashelier tu est la ? j'ai envie d'esseyer un truc
<alexises_> bashelier voir si je peut me connecter sur ton ordi (enfin juste voir si 'jarrive  l'identification)
<bashelier> alexises_: please, first do /topic, then choose the right chan
<alexises_> ho sorry 
<alexises_> i have not see  
<alexises_> merci
<somerville32> join #ubuntu-devel
<somerville32> err...
<alexises_> good night i go in my bed
<leonel> keescook: Eliot from Clamav  send me the a bad rar     tested on  clamav  without patches : 
<leonel> leonel@human:~ $ clamdscan Desktop/clamcrash.rar 
<leonel> /home/leonel/Desktop/clamcrash.rar: lstat() failed. ERROR
<leonel> keescook:  tested  in with the patched  clamav :
<leonel> leonel@ubuntu:~$ clamdscan Desktop/clamcrash.rar 
<leonel> /home/leonel/Desktop/clamcrash.rar: OK
<pochu_> Night MOTUland :)
#ubuntu-motu 2007-06-09
<keescook> leonel: great!
<crimsun> keescook: no runes, no.  I do it manually.
<keescook> crimsun: would you mind looking over http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5419 since I'm still a bit new to REVU work?
<crimsun> sure
<crimsun> (will do)
<fernando> exists other way to upload to revu instead ftp?
<crimsun> keescook: looks good, did you have any particular question(s) about it/protocol?
<keescook> mostly I just wanted to know what the process was since I was the 2nd person +1 it.  should I upload it?
<crimsun> keescook: if you'd like, certainly
<crimsun> it has the equivalent of three ACKs
<keescook> ah, needs 3 not 2?
<crimsun> (only requires 2)
<keescook> okay
<crimsun> I reviewed it last for the debian/control:Depends addition
<keescook> and is it just you that cc's motu with REVU uploads, or is that something everyone up'ing from REVU should do?
<crimsun> yes, if you upload a new source package originating from revu, archive it, and send an email to the ubuntu-motu ML
<keescook> okay, will do
<crimsun> thanks
<persia> crimsun: 3 ACKs?  I thought the two ACKs needed to be for the same revision.  Is this not the case?
<crimsun> ?
<keescook> persia: right, I think crimsun ack a totally different version
<persia> (05:56:30) crimsun: it has the equivalent of three ACKs
<crimsun> 18:55 < crimsun> keescook: looks good
<crimsun> 18:56 < crimsun> I reviewed it last for the debian/control:Depends addition
<crimsun> that constitutes an ACK
<crimsun> the ttf-bitstream-vera addition came from my previous on-IRC review with Mario
<persia> crimsun: Ah.  The IRC ACK.  Thanks.
<crimsun> np
<leonel> we need to fix the kernel   so  when a kernel update is done  there's no need to reboot  to use the new kernel :)
<keescook> crimsun: how do I "archive" the REVU entry?
<crimsun> go to the main page, find the entry, click Archive on the far right.
<keescook> oh, durr.  heh, I was hunting around on the upload page.  :)
<crimsun> ;)
<crimsun> insecure temp file creation, eh?  I'm suddenly reminded why we stopped shipping alsaconf.
<nesl247> Hi folks. Is there any guide to creating packages, other than the one that contains hello-debhelper or whatever the package was called?
<crimsun> nesl247: guide?  Meaning the Ubuntu Packaging Guide and the Debian Policy Manual & Debian New Maintainers' Guide & Debian Developer's Reference?
<nesl247> Whatever the one linked in the how to become a motu one, is one that I never want to see. One that I looked at already
<crimsun> (and I really think that ought to be New Maintainer's to be consistent with Developer's, but whatever.)
<crimsun> nesl247: constructively, what did you find horrible about it?
<nesl247> It's completely useless
<nesl247> It's says a bunch of times, this is an example package, we have no need for file x, y, and z
<nesl247> And is too basic to actually learn to package
<nesl247> Because it has like no deps, nothing at alll
<nesl247> all*
<crimsun> ok.  Can you recommend a better package with which to begin - one that will appeal to both novice packagers and seasoned non-Debian packagers?
<nesl247> Any package
<nesl247> tar, alsa, compiz, doesn't matter
<crimsun> I'm going to blithely ignore the "alsa" option, because that's utterly unrealistic.
<nesl247> And the guide doesn't go into detail enough
<nesl247> It should basically walk you through step by step, line by line
<nesl247> crimsun: I haven't seen alsa's packaging, so I wouldn't know
<crimsun> ok, I'm sure there are several developers here who can work with you on improving the reference if you desire.
<crimsun> well, I _am_ familiar with it.  I maintain it in Ubuntu.
<bluekuja> lionel, ping
<crimsun> maybe we can pick one package from each big language team, so to speak
<nesl247> I'd much rather you guys spend time on redoing the ubuntu packaging system all together heh
<crimsun> say, quodlibet for Python, pavucontrol for C, etc.
<minghua> I'd rather not.
<nesl247> I've never seen anything so complicated.
<crimsun> that's not an Ubuntu issue.  You want to talk to the dpkg development team in Debian, since we use dpkg and apt-based tools.
<nesl247> I'm not trying to start a flamewar, and am truely interested, so please don't bite my head off, but have you guys ever considered using something different?
<crimsun> for this group of universe maintainers?  As a group it has never crossed "our" mind.
<crimsun> for Ubuntu development, certainly it has crossed the minds of at least a couple Canonical employees who work on Ubuntu.
<minghua> if you derive from debian, you must use debian packaging, I don't think there is negotiation room for that
<persia> minghua: One could do something like alien (although I'd be opposed).
<crimsun> people have suggested ebuilds, conary, checkinstall (?!), forgetting packages altogether and dumping crap wherever...
<minghua> persia: you forgot to mention checkinstall...
<crimsun> (don't worry, I just did.)
<nesl247> Who says you have to use debian packaging?
<persia> minghua: There's a reason for that :)
<minghua> crimsun: :-)
<nesl247> Just because you originally started as a debian fork, doesn't mean you can't change.
<crimsun> nesl247: Debian is our source pool.  It would be foolish to dump it.
<nesl247> I was just curious. I know the complication of packaging has turned me off from ever creating a deb
<crimsun> Consider how many source packages are synced (unchanged in Ubuntu) directly from Debian main.
<nixternal> there is no way in hell I could keep up with bdmurray with the triage man...I have gone 8 hours straight and finally cleaned up kdepim
<crimsun> take a look at the bottom left pie chart at http://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html
<nixternal> I find it funny that if you ask someone for more info, they won't answer for months, but as soon as you "close" a report, they respond within 10 minutes
<crimsun> nixternal: of course.  That's why I always reject immediately. ;)
<crimsun> j/k
<nixternal> hahaha
<persia> nixternal: That's why they get closed after a month or two of not responding to "Needs Info" :)
<nixternal> I need to go through kdelibs next
<nixternal> persia: I do the same....30 days and no response, the is long enough, closed, reopen if issue still exists..kthxbye ;)
<crimsun> nesl247: as you might infer, completely obliterating that navy blue (or some shade thereof, I'm a bit colour-stupid) portion would be unwise.
<nixternal> man, testing kdepim bugs, I crashed KMail a hundred times, destroyed my smtp settings
<nesl247> crimsun: huh?
<crimsun> 20:13 < crimsun> take a look at the bottom left pie chart at 
<crimsun>                  http://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html
<nesl247> Oh
* nixternal notes, backup ~/.kde/share/apps/kmail && ~/.kde/share/config/kmail* before triaging in the future
<snerfu> I took the battle for wesnoth and retooled it to be a wastelands style game.
<snerfu> I wonder if googlepages would be a good place to host it.
<persia> Would anyone be willing to lead me through the process of sponsoring requests for SRU updates (into -proposed)?
<crimsun> persia: sure.
<crimsun> err, I need more tea, though.
<persia> crimsun: Thanks.  When you get your tea, could we look at bug 69151?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 69151 in dvdauthor "Edgy: dvdauthor: segfault" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/69151
<apachelogger> http://pastebin.kubuntu-de.org/1203
<crimsun> persia: ok, so the patch needs some review.  First it needs indication of origin.
<apachelogger> :S
<apachelogger> any idea why this is happening?
<crimsun> persia: origin needs to be noted either in the patch itself or in debian/changelog
<persia> crimsun: OK.  Are there restrictions on Origin (must be backported from development or upstream) or are locally produced patches acceptable?
<crimsun> persia: the latter
<persia> OK.  So the patch generator could just report that they created a new patch as well.
<crimsun> persia: absolutely
<crimsun> just as long as the patch pedigree is unquestionable.
<persia> Next, I'm guessing that it needs to be listed as "edgy-proposed" (looking in more detail, this might not really be a SRU request, but I'd like to keep it as an example).
<crimsun> persia: right, for the distribution
<crimsun> it's a suitable SRU candidate, as it would appear to resolve a fairly major issue
<persia> So, assuming that the patch is acceptable, would I verify that the patch submitter was willing to follow the SRU process (as "Needs Info"), and just upload to proposed, or are there additional steps required?
<crimsun> just upload, correct  (noting the version would need to be fixed -5ubuntu0.1)
<minghua> persia: just curious -- is this bug fixed in feisty/gutsy?
<persia> OK.  That's easier than I thought.  I was a little worried about "The sponsor of the upload is responsible for testing the update." from MOTU/SRU, as I don't use most of the pending packages, and wasn't sure how to test.
<crimsun> persia: you are responsible, yes, but that comes after an ubuntu-sru member has stated that it's available in -proposed for testing, after which you'd send an email to the ubuntu-motu ML to request testers
<persia> minghua: This is an old bug, and that probably needs investigation.  I haven't looked yet, but if I don't see something obvious, I'll ask the patch submitter to investigate more deeply when preparing new sponsorship requests.
<persia> crimsun: OK.  So I send the mail to ubuntu-motu, rather than the patch submitter?
<crimsun> persia: asking for testers, correct
* persia only did one as a contributor, and the procedure was a little different
<crimsun> yes, the universe SRU procedure was overhauled as the MOTU Council's first item of business
<crimsun> or was it the second?  I'm losing my memory.
* tritium donates 2 GB of ram to crimsun 
<crimsun> anyhow, one of the major complaints was that there was too much red tape in universe SRUs, so MC tried to change that - hopefully for the better
<persia> crimsun: OK.  Thanks.  I think I need to organise some stable test environments before actually sponsoring these, but I can now triage them (and further reduce the sponsors queue).
<crimsun> persia: yep, thanks!
<crimsun> tritium: :)
<persia> I'd prefer to dump responsibility for chasing testers on the contributor, but I understand the decision :)
<persia> Grr..  https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/dapper-updates/+source/foo should go somewhere.
<crimsun> wishlist!
<persia> crimsun: Malone or Soyuz?
<crimsun> launchpad
<crimsun> apachelogger: it's in rejected; I can't move it because I don't have the powah
<cypherbios> Hi. I'm packaging an application using python-distutils (aka setup.[py,cfg] ) and the localization files (.mo) are going to a wrong place (going to /usr/share/locale/$LANG instead of /usr/share/locale/$LANG/LC_MESSAGES). Anyone knows what could it be?
<persia> Ah.  Never mind.  Those URLs shouldn't work.  That information is contained in .../dapper/... as a separate pocket.
<crimsun> cypherbios: is the Makefile correct?
<crimsun> or if it doesn't use a Makefile, is the install target for the po data correct?
<cypherbios> crimsun: oh. I think is it...
<cypherbios> crimsun: but the Makefile seems to be correct:
<cypherbios> %.mo : %.po
<cypherbios> 	mkdir -p $(subst .po,,$<)/LC_MESSAGES/ 
<cypherbios> 	msgfmt $< -o $(subst .po,,$<)/LC_MESSAGES/$(DOMAIN).mo
<crimsun> hmm, yes.
<cypherbios> crimsun: the build log shows me this:
<cypherbios> creating /home/cypher/aptoncd-dev/packaging/debian/0.1.91-1/tmp/aptoncd-0.1.91/debian/aptoncd/usr/share/locale/pt_BR
<cypherbios> copying build/mo/pt_BR/LC_MESSAGES/aptoncd.mo -> /home/cypher/aptoncd-dev/packaging/debian/0.1.91-1/tmp/aptoncd-0.1.91/debian/a
<cypherbios> ptoncd/usr/share/locale/pt_BR
<cypherbios> crimsun: the build/ directory has the correct directory tree, but copies to a wrong directory...
<crimsun> hmm
<crimsun> type subst
<crimsun> shell builtin?
<cypherbios> crimsun: what? I didn't understand...
<crimsun> ah, right, make.
<cypherbios> crimsun: the lines above I've retired from the .build file
<crimsun> yes, I somehow ignored that you pasted from a Makefile instead of shell script (?!)
<crimsun> (long day)
<cypherbios> :)
<crimsun> will have to look at the source package.  Doesn't seem immediately obvious from here.
<crimsun> (more tea)
<leonel> keescook: for bug 119386  does not apply to  dapper and edgy   tested the bad.rar file  and  no problems there  and  the CVEs say that are for  clamav 90.  The temp files bug is  for the  function  cli_gentempstream  which does not exist  in clamav 88 
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119386 in clamav "Remote Attack in RAR Files and Insecure Temporary Files Creation" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119386
<Simon80> if a new package gets into debian, will it automatically sync into Ubuntu?
<bryyce> often, but not always
<bryyce> see http://merges.ubuntu.com/main.html
<keescook> leonel: ah! great, thank you.
<joejaxx> Simon80: you have to request it i believe
<Simon80> hrm, ok, thanks
<minghua> bryyce: I doubt that merge page answers Simon80's question
<minghua> Simon80: it eventually will, but may take quite some time
<Simon80> alright
<Simon80> cause I saw an update get in faster than this new package I'm watching
<minghua> Simon80: yeah, unchanged packages (without ubuntuX in the version number) get synced automatically, new packages need manual approval to get synced, IIRC
<Simon80> but they usually get approved?
<Simon80> not that I'm desperate for this package to get in :D
<Fujitsu> New packages will automatically sync unless they're in contrib or non-free, but they have to go through source and binary NEW like anything else.
<minghua> Simon80: at this stage, yes, they usually get approved
<minghua> Fujitsu: you can't really call stuck in NEW as "get synced", can you? :-)
<minghua> Fujitsu: but thanks for the clarification
<Fujitsu> minghua: Why not? There's no manual process that has to be performed by us.
<minghua> Fujitsu: okay, I see what you mean.  I wasn't really thinking of the "re-sync with debian, drop all ubuntu changes" type of sync
<Fujitsu> Neither was I. I was thinking of the brand new package in Debian type.
<Fujitsu> minghua: ^^
<minghua> Fujitsu: then what are you referring by "no manual process that has to be performed by us"?  which other syncs need manual process?
<Fujitsu> minghua: You said `new packages need manual approval to get synced'. You meant NEWing?
<minghua> Fujitsu: and by "us" do you mean MOTUs, or developers in general, especially ftp-masters (or what do they call it, archive admins?)?
<Fujitsu> `us' meaning not archive admins.
<Fujitsu> I should have probably clarified that.
<minghua> Fujitsu: no, I was wrong on that statement, I thought some archive admin needs to enable syncing new packages instead of just packages already in ubuntu
<Fujitsu> Well, they have to run a separate script to import new ones rather than just the normal autosync, but it's done regularly like the normal one.
<Fujitsu> So it's not really manual.
<Fujitsu> Just done less regularly.
<minghua> Fujitsu: I am confused.  Except the "dropping all ubuntu changes, resync with debian" type, neither new packages nor updated packages need our (non archive admin) manual processing. Is that correct?
<Fujitsu> Right (until DebianImportFreeze)
<Simon80> I can't wait
<Simon80> DebianImportFreezeParty!!!!!
* minghua wonders why there is a party for that
<Simon80> PartyDownLikeThereIsNoMoreUbuntuReleases!
<minghua> granted, you usually don't need a strong reason for parties, but still
* Simon80 is just fooling around
<Simon80> yeah, I was going to say
<Simon80> whatever you can use to justify it
<Simon80> one can take a cue from ncix.com, who are perpetually holding a sale, and I'm not exaggerating
<Simon80> last one I checked on was called the "Pre-Summer" sale or something
<Simon80> yep
<Fujitsu> Hm, I really shouldn't have been coding this weather station communication program at 2am. Converting miles->kilometres by dividing by 1.6 is really not the way to go.
<Simon80> well, obviously, you multiply by (1/1.6), to save repeated division
<Simon80> if you don't do that, the wasted cpu resources will cause the weather station to asplode
<Fujitsu> Of course.
<Simon80> what were you referring to there? I don't actually see the problem
<minghua> you should multiply by 1.6
<Simon80> oh, right
<Simon80> this is why I need sleep
<minghua> or it that "multiply with"?
* minghua hates prepositions
<Fujitsu> 'by' is correct, I believe.
<minghua> thanks Fujitsu
<nixternal> anyone know which package would control issues on external usb devices/drives that are formatted ext3/reiser and not allowing people to execute? 
<nixternal> would the be kernel related? udev?
<nixternal> I can't confirm this, as all of my external usb devices/drives are ext3 and I have none of the issues that everyone responded to in this one report
<persia> nixternal: There are a large number of packages installed.  Unfortunately, it takes significant investigation of a broken system to determine the culprit.  You might add mount and friends to your list as well, or even the desktop volume management systems, which might pass frustrating flags under certain conditions.
<nixternal> true
<persia> Um  s/installed/possibly related/
<nixternal> seeing as they are external usb devices, I was thinking pmount as well
<persia> nixternal: Maybe.  Is pmount there by default?  It's not installed for me (and I automount USB devices without trouble).
<minghua> persia: that's very strange.  do you have ubuntu or kubuntu?
<persia> minghua: Um...  ubuntu-minimal plus packages I like :)
<persia> I'm using GNOME, so it's probably more similar to ubuntu.
<minghua> persia: Hmm, actually I am probably wrong.  I though gnome-volume-manager will eventually pull in pmount.
<minghua> persia: it seems, at least in Debian unstable now, g-v-m use gnome-mount instead.
<persia> gnome-volume-manager -> gnome-mount -> dbus/hal
<minghua> let me check etch
<persia> minghua: I think it used to be that way - and that I used to have pmount installed, but I no longer remember the transition.
<minghua> persia: yes.  in Debian etch, g-v-m 1.15.5 still depends on pmount
<minghua> (etch has gnome 2.14/2.16 mix by the way)
<persia> minghua: That makes sense.  I think it's that way in edgy, but I'm not sure about feisty.
<minghua> feisty is 2.18, isn't it?  then it should already be using gnome-mount, as Debian unstable has 2.18.
<persia> minghua: Yep.  I just checked, and feisty indeed uses gnome-mount.
<persia> On the other hand, I think kubuntu uses pmount to serve kdebase-kio-plugins
<minghua> kdebase is one of the only two packages that depend on pmount in Debian unstable right now
<minghua> (in etch it is four)
<persia> Odd.  Debian bug 391502 appears to tell the story, but it looks like pmount really shouldn't be required.
<ubotu> Debian bug 391502 in kdebase "Incorrect dependency on pmount" [Serious,Closed]  http://bugs.debian.org/391502
<persia> nixternal: Do all the users with that problem use KDE?  It seems that there was a patch applied to Debian that might have leaked, which could cause odd issues.
<nixternal> no
<nixternal> they use kde and gnome
<persia> In that case, it's down into ubuntu-minimal territory.  mount, udev, linux, and freinds.
<persia> Or perhaps hal, if these are all desktop mounts.
<nixternal> hal or pmount
<persia> nixternal: I doubt pmount, just because it's only in kubuntu - the GNOME users wouldn't encounter the problem with pmount.
<nixternal> orly
<minghua> persia: shouldn't, yes; but unfortunately the reality still requires a dependency according to the bug
<nixternal> interesting
<persia> minghua: Yep.
<minghua> nixternal: bug number?
<nixternal> man, I gotta find it now :)
* nixternal goes to the bug emails coming in
<minghua> stabbing in dark, I would bet on hal
<persia> minghua: Be prepared - there are at least three or four separate master bugs currently building about user mount issues, which may not all be the same.
* minghua is just curious
<minghua> I usually don't touch packages I don't understand anyway
<minghua> (not that I can touch hal/udev/etc., of course)
<nixternal> bug 108214
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 108214 in pmount "cannot execute programs/scripts from USB drives (including reiserfs and ext)" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/108214
<nixternal> while you are at it, change it from pmount :)
<StevenK> That bug smacks of the device being mounted noexec
<minghua> nixternal: why should I reassign from pmount?
<_Enchained> hi all
<persia> minghua: Try hal.  I suspect linux.fstab.options
<nixternal> because if pmount is kubuntu only, then it wouldn't be the reason for the issues..because people are reporting it in ubuntu as well
<_Enchained> Someone to review a few packages ?
<_Enchained> I have 4 or 5 waiting on Revu
<minghua> nixternal: okay, haven't read the "happens in ubuntu as well" part yet
<persia> _Enchained: Please post the URLs (I recommend one every few hours until they've all been posted), and announce the status ("New Package", "Seeking Advocate for new upload", "Seeking second advocate").  Please only post each new upload once per day.
* persia needs a keymap that includes '_'
<nixternal> minghua: maybe I thought I saw the Ubuntu stuff because the pmount was ubuntu-meta, but I changed the package
<_Enchained> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5348
<_Enchained> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5349
<_Enchained> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5350
<_Enchained> those 3 are similar
<minghua> nixternal: finished reading, no where in the bug report says it happens to gnome users as well
<_Enchained> and should be fine
<nixternal> minghua: re ^^
<Hobbsee> _Enchained: do you need teh b5i2iso.install file?
<_Enchained> and another I've just send : http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5430
<_Enchained> Hobbsee yes It install the binary ^^
<Hobbsee> shouldnt the rules automatically do that?
<minghua> nixternal: let's keep it assigned to pmount then :-)
<_Enchained> or maybe I should rename it just "install" ?
<Hobbsee> i thought you only needed a .install file when there were multiple binaries
<nixternal> minghua: ditto :)
<Hobbsee> i wouldnt have thought you needed it *at all*
<Hobbsee> but check it
<_Enchained> Hobbsee no. make only create a binary and then we must move it
<persia> Hobbsee: Depends on how broken upstream is.  For a good makefile, you're right.  For annoying upstream with a lousy makefile, not so much.
<Hobbsee> persia: ah, fair enough
<minghua> Hobbsee: depend on where your "make install" installs to
* persia recommends working with orphaned leaf packages for good understanding of how broken things can be, yet still work.
<minghua> I user debian/install file even for one-binary package with same upstream source, just to reuse the code
<_Enchained> The three *2iso are little utils that just create a binary in the current folder
<Hobbsee> persia: i'm about to test build - did you want to look that one first over as well, then i can upload it?
<persia> Hobbsee: Which?
<Hobbsee> persia: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5348
<persia> Hobbsee: Sure.
<Hobbsee> thanks
<_Enchained> :) thx
<Hobbsee> (no point downloading it twice)
<persia> Hobbsee: I'm trusting you to build and run all the lintian & linda checks on the binary.  I'll just chase copyright, rules, etc.
<Hobbsee> persia: yeah
<Hobbsee> no problem
<persia> _Enchained: Does your package brak any other packages?
<persia> s/brak/break/
* Hobbsee thought there was a dh_install --list-missing command that could be run in the binary
<_Enchained> how could it do this ?
<Hobbsee> maintainer mangling hanst been done
* Hobbsee fixes
<minghua> it's so fun to see RMS startled by Debian package naming systems :-)
<persia> _Enchained: Some packages conflict with others in odd ways (e.g. serial2net and teg used the same default high port for years), or have conflicting dependencies (e.g. cyrus21-imap & cyrus-imap).
<_Enchained> I think it doesn't
<_Enchained> but how can I be sure of that ?
* minghua really hopes we can use Breaks: field in the near future
<Hobbsee> it'll be picked up when the archive scripts are run
<persia> Hobbsee: I'm not advocating.  Commenting...
<Hobbsee> persia: OK
<Hobbsee> er, bugger it.  i hit enter on dput
* Hobbsee will have to upload another, fixed version
<persia> Hobbsee: Aside from maintainer, the only other issue that blocked me was section.  Not a big deal.
<Hobbsee> oh yes, dammit.  i noticed that, then forgot
* persia advocates under pressure and expects favors from Hobbsee :)
<Hobbsee> _Enchained should be the one feeling pressured :P
<_Enchained> Hobbsee : what is Maintainer mangling ?
<_Enchained> I don't feel under pressure ;)
<Hobbsee> _Enchained: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
<Hobbsee> persia: i believe you meant the priority field?
<persia> _Enchained: You should.  A not ideal package with your name attached was just uploaded.  Now it must be fixed :)
<Hobbsee> persia: utils is a valid section field.
<Hobbsee> and is correct, iirc.
<persia> Hobbsee: Right.  I can't seem to type what I'm thinking :)
<Hobbsee> _Enchained: persia: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5349 seems to have the same problems.
<Hobbsee> i wonder if we actually have the maintainer stuff documented anywhere
* Hobbsee has a script to fix such things ;)
<_Enchained> the 3 *2iso are similar ;)
<persia> Hobbsee: Do you have a script to undo it?  There's a couple bugs in DaD I want to fix, but haven't gotten around to writing the undo script yet.
<_Enchained> So, I must find someone with a unbut.com email ?
<Hobbsee> persia: to undo it?  no
<persia> _Enchained: See the URL Hobbsee posted.  There are default maintainers, if the XSBC-Original-Maintainer field is populated.
<persia> Hobbsee: Alas.  Thanks anyway.
<Hobbsee> _Enchained: 
<Hobbsee> #
<Hobbsee> If the package is in universe or multiverse, the Maintainer field will be set to Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
<Hobbsee> #
<Hobbsee> If the Maintainer field is modified, the old value will be saved in a field named XSBC-Original-Maintainer
<_Enchained> persia debian/b5i2iso.manpages <- just a file which contains the name of the manpage file ?
<StevenK> _Enchained: Right
<_Enchained> ok
<_Enchained> Hobbsee so I put my email adress in XSBC-Original-Maintainer and MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com> in Maintener field ...?
<man-di> moin
<Hobbsee> yep
<_Enchained> ok thx
<Hobbsee> Ubuntu MOTU... that is
<Hobbsee> yep, same things apply for all three of them.
<Hobbsee> _Enchained: priority should be "optional"
<_Enchained> ok
<Hobbsee> according to the debian new maintainers guide
<persia> _Enchained: I've just checked 5430 as well: That one needs the same work.
<_Enchained> which persia ?
<_Enchained> maintener and ?
<persia> nautilus-wallpaper
<_Enchained> (what work)
<_Enchained> priority optional ?
<Hobbsee> nautilus-wallpaper has other errors too
<Hobbsee> yeah
<_Enchained> and Maintener field
<persia> _Enchained: At a minimum maintainer and priority optional.  You probably also want to build the binary and run lintian and linda against the arch.changes file for more hints.
<_Enchained> for nautilus-wallpaper It wanted to install some doc files in a wrong path
<_Enchained> so I rm them in rules :s
<_Enchained> I don't know what is the better way to fix this
<persia> _Enchained: That's the right way.
<persia> nixternal: The mounting issue is new behaviour for feisty, right?
<nixternal> they say it is, however I can't reproduce it
<nixternal> my build directories are all on a usb 500gb drive
<nixternal> all of my repos and what not. and then my gpg key is on a usb stick as well...all ext3 partitions
<persia> nixternal: I had a user last night who was looking at it, but it was on someone else's computer, and they only had a couple hours.
<superm1> persia, keescook wasn't sure on the process to upload mythbuntu-gdm-theme after he looked it over and gave it another +1 after you.  Would you be able to upload it?
<persia> superm1: He was around earlier, and I thought he uploaded.  Did you check the NEW queue?
<superm1> persia, let me double check
<persia> superm1: If it's really not uploaded, I'll upload, but I don't like rejections :)
<superm1> persia, ah yes he did.
<superm1> my mistake :)
<superm1> i havent been around the last few hrs
<persia> superm1: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2007-June/001708.html
<persia> No worries.
<Hobbsee> sigh. dad's whining about the amount of stuff being downloaded.
<persia> Hobbsee: You need to move to a country without foolish quotas.
<Hobbsee> persia: i know.  i plan to.
<Hobbsee> persia: just a) where?  b)  after uni  and c) where do i find the resources to do it?
<persia> Hobbsee: Choose a) based on your first impressions from a 30-year old tour book.  Nothing else will keep you more than a year or two.  For c) apply for an overseas job, and request relocation sponsorship.
<Hobbsee> persia: a 30 year old tour book, hey?
* Hobbsee would like germany, or the UK, somewhere.
* Hobbsee doesnt speak much german though.
<Hobbsee> yeah, the relocation sponsorship would be the smartw ay to go
<persia> Hobbsee: The alternative is a one-way discount fare :)
<Hobbsee> persia: true that
<man-di> Hobbsee: germany is nice, except when you live here...
<Hobbsee> man-di: heh, why so?
<Hobbsee> man-di: so is anywhere, i suspect
<man-di> Hobbsee: I live here for 33 years and I want to learn to know something else
<Hobbsee> ahhh
<Hobbsee> i suspect that applies to anywhere - which is a good incentive to move every ~10 years or whatever, i guess :P
<TheMuso> Heya folks.
<man-di> Hobbsee: I guess so
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso!
* persia decides hal is opaque
<persia> hi TheMuso
<_Enchained> Hobbsee persia Can you take a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5431 ?
<_Enchained> I've updated it
<_Enchained> If it's ok I do the same changes to the others
<Hobbsee> _Enchained: looks good to me.  persia?
<persia> _Enchained: I get a build failure.  I think you want debian/b5i2iso.1 in debian//b5i2iso.manpages.
<_Enchained> oops yes
<Hobbsee> ah there we go, it failed while i was on the phone
<_Enchained> the debian/foo.manpages works only with cdbs ?
<persia> _Enchained: Also, as a wishlist item, an upstream changelog would be good (but no worries if it doesn't exist).
<persia> _Enchained: Debhelper too, but you need to include h_installman -p<package> in debian/rules
<persia> s/h_installman/dh_installman.
<Hobbsee> see, this is why i hate reviewing.
<Hobbsee> people always find other stuff that i never remember about
<persia> Hobbsee: That's why it takes two :)
<_Enchained> -p is to use the foo.manpages file ?
<persia> _Enchained: -p is to specify the package to install in.  For single binary sources, it's optional.
<_Enchained> ok
<_Enchained> persia Hobbsee I can't dput the new version oO
<_Enchained> Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of b5i2iso_0.2-0ubuntu1.dsc
<persia> _Enchained: It's not that we're ignoring you, just that we don't have a solution.  You might try uploading again, or poking a REVU admin (if there is one around).
<_Enchained> I'll try later
<_Enchained> 08:30am ...time to sleep lol
<Hobbsee> persia: you're not a REVU admin?
* Hobbsee had to grab some food before going into work, etc.
<Hobbsee> _Enchained: please try uploading again - i've removed the offending files
<persia> Hobbsee: heh.  I've only been reviewing two weeks :)  These things take a while.
<Hobbsee> persia: ask siretart about it.
<Hobbsee> he doesnt bite
* Hobbsee even met him at UDS
<_Enchained> Hobbsee it's ok
<_Enchained> uploaded
<Hobbsee> persia: if you could review again, and give me links to any that you ack, i'll try to look when i get home again
<persia> Hobbsee: Sure.
<Hobbsee> thanks
* Hobbsee runs around and gets ready for work
<Hobbsee> bye all
<persia> _Enchained: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5432 advocated.  Which were the other ones, or are you sleeping now?
<_Enchained> ok I do the same modif
<_Enchained> on the others
<persia> _Enchained: No rush.  If you want to get to them this afternoon, that's fine too.
<_Enchained> no it's ok
<_Enchained> Strangly I'm not so tired
<_Enchained> ^^
<_Enchained> persia I've updated pdi2iso and cdi2iso
<persia> _Enchained: OK.  I'll take a look in a minute.  Thanks.
<Lutin> hey there
<_Enchained> yep Lutin 
<Lutin> hey _Enchained 
<persia> _Enchained: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5433 commented.  Should be easy to fix.
<_Enchained> ok persia updated
<persia> _Enchained: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5434 has the same problem.
<_Enchained> ok
<persia> _Enchained: And even though I advocated before, I realise that b5i2iso does as well.  Please fix that too :)
<_Enchained> ok
<_Enchained> persia http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5436
<_Enchained> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5432
<_Enchained> and the other you already commented it :)
<persia> _Enchained: 5432 still doesn't install the upstream changelog.
<_Enchained> oops
* Fujitsu tells X off for stuffing up font sizes completely.
<persia> Fujitsu: The secret is: once you get it working, never, ever restart X :)
* Fujitsu had to reboot into a new kernel to use powertop.
<DarkMageZ> that sounds like a windows excuse
<Lutin> persia: btw, what bug in DaD were you interested in fixing ?
<persia> Lutin: Two actually: the one about having conflicts with change build-deps, and the one about not noticing syncs.  I think both of these will go away if DaD unmangles the maintainer (saving the name of the Ubuntu team) prior to diff3, and then remangles afterwards (if appropriate).
<Lutin> persia: the changelog will remain in the patch though
<persia> Lutin: I've just not gotten around to adding a unmangle function to process/merge and testing yet.
<_Enchained> persia It doesn't upload
<_Enchained> same as before
<_Enchained> :/
<persia> Lutin: Depends.  I've had changelogs merged to Debian :) (although I admit this is rare)
<_Enchained> Is there a revu admin ?
<persia> Lutin: Also, when reviewing REPORT, seeing only a changelog entry makes it clear - less investigation is required to ensure that a sync can be performed.
<Lutin> persia: don't catch your last point (or actually can't catch how it is related to REPORT)
* persia looks at DaD output again
<_Enchained> persia I have the same problem. I go to sleep. If you see a revu admin, ask for him to remove the bad package and ping me. I'll upload again
<_Enchained> (or tell to Lutin)
<persia> _Enchained: Sleep well.  Upstream changelog isn't blocking anyway: only a good thing to have.
<jamyskis> hi all...does anyone know if there is a decent howto anywhere on how to replace packages with newer versions of the program in *my own repository*? Is it just as simple as creating a new deb and updating the packages_i386.db or is it more complicated?
<persia> jamyskis: Depends on your local repository format, but basically just upload an updated .deb to that repository.
<jamyskis> persia: it's just that i read something about diff files and such like, but I can simply replace it and people who have my repo in their sources.list will get an update notification?
<superm1> jamyskis, followed by dpkg-scanpackages or falcon update or the repository update
<DarkMageZ> jamyskis, to create a repository http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=60130
<superm1> jamyskis, what do you use for managing your repository?
<persia> Lutin: For syncs, I think you're right, but I still think unmangling and remangling would prevent things like vcf:debian/control.
<jamyskis> superm1 i saw a howto somewhere on how to create a repo and created a bash script from it
<persia> jamyskis: What you've read about diff files is probably procedural documentation for updating the Ubuntu repositories, to which you may not have direct upload permission.  For a local repository, you have permission, and don't need to follow that procedure.
<superm1> jamyskis, well i'm not sure how in depth or complicated your current setup is with it.  I would highly recommend you look into falcon for managing a personal repository though.  It makes life very simple
<jamyskis> persia: that's good to know :) thanks
<DarkMageZ> jamyskis, guide to making/altering packages http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html
<jamyskis> superm1: I'll look into it :) thx
<jamyskis> DarkMageZ: that's how i learnt how to create debs, but the creating a repo thread in the forum i've bookmarked for future ref...thx
<superm1> jamyskis, it would be a good idea to look into getting these changes into the ubuntu versions of the packages too, so people on a larger scale can benefit.
<Lutin> persia: wep, that'd be possible. (just thought that adding one more check in the diff3 loop could easily prevent from merging the changelog if it is the only different file)
<DarkMageZ> superm1, do you know if falcon ever got fixed to work on feisty?
<jamyskis> superm1: none of my packages are in the ubuntu repos at the moment...i sent my package naughts-and-crosses to MOTU but it was rejected, I need to take a closer look at the reason why
<superm1> DarkMageZ, i've got it working on my copy of feisty, it was a matter of replacing a shebang at the top /usr/bin/falcon only I think
<persia> Lutin: That'd be neat.  Then if the maintainer was on complete autopilot, it would be an undocumented fakesync, which wouldn't be entirely bad (although not ideal).
<superm1> Seveas was pretty close to something with falcon 2 though recently, 
<superm1> but you'd have to check with him on *how* close :)
<superm1> jamyskis, I don't see it up on revu.  How did you submit it?
<jamyskis> is there a website somewhere for falcon?
<persia> jamyskis: http://launchpad.net/falcon
<superm1> jamyskis,  https://launchpad.net/falcon 
<superm1> its not in apt (unfortunately), but there are several third party repos that have a deb of it available
<Lutin> persia: sure
<persia> Lutin: I keep getting other things stuck in my queue above DaD, so probably won't get something put together for another week or so, at a minimum.  If you have time before then, and want to fix it, feel free :)
<Lutin> persia: btw, I'm leaving on monday for 6 weeks, so if you feel uncomfortable with parts of the code, please send me an email (with a clear title :) ) rather than using irc
<Lutin> or ping Adri2000 :)
<jamyskis> i can't even remember my revu password and i'm having a job recovering it
<persia> Lutin: Ah.  I guess it's mine then :)  The code seems pretty sensible, but thanks.  I'll publish a branch if I have something I think works, for review (probably by Adrien, as you'll be away).
<persia> Have a good trip.
<persia> jamyskis: You only need the password to comment.  If you're stuck, just upload.
<jamyskis> its ok i've got the password now
<jamyskis> hold on
<jamyskis> i'll dig up falcon in a second
<jamyskis> superm1: naughts-and-crosses revu submission -> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4533
<Lutin> persia: ok. thanks! :)
<superm1> jamyskis, I'm not a motu (yet), but I can look over a few things if you'd like some input on it
<jamyskis> superm1: that would be great, i'll sort out falcon first and then if you'd like we can work over the sub together
<jamyskis> thanks
<superm1> jamyskis, first off as bddebian was saying, is this intended to be a native ubuntu package
<jamyskis> superm1 i think the mistake i made there was the name was wrong
* persia disaparages native Ubuntu packages
<jamyskis> naughts-and-crosses_0.83.tar.gz is supposed to be naughts-and-crosses_0.83.orig.tar.gz
<superm1> okay from looking over debian/copyright, you are getting sources from an upstream site
<superm1> you will need to provide that .orig.tar.gz
<superm1> and change the version number
<superm1> to append a -0ubuntu1 instead
<jamyskis> what does that mean?
<superm1> that means to grab the upstream tar.gz archive
<superm1> and rename it appropriately
<superm1> so it can be used for building the package
<superm1> in this case, i believe it would be naughts-and-crosses_0.83.orig.tar.gz
<jamyskis> ok :)
<superm1> since that is the upstream version
<superm1> so then debian/changelog's entry needs to show up as 0.83-0ubuntu1
<jamyskis> looking at the manpage issue i need to learn how to write manpages
<superm1> Next off, debian/copyright needs a short header of the license being used (in this case the GPL)
<superm1> if you look at the source for pretty much any GPL app in ubuntu/debian, the debian/copyright file will always include a preface describing that license
<superm1> followed by that reference to where it is stored on the system
<jamyskis> ok noted
<superm1> this was the page i was directed at for learning to write debian/copyright better:
<superm1> http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/03/msg00023.html
<superm1> it includes a very good example
<LaserJock> anybody up?
<persia> Hi LaserJock
<superm1> next off, debian/rules, you might consider looking into using debhelper instead for a lot of those things
<superm1> morning LaserJock 
<superm1> rather than manual copying like you are
<jamyskis> i actually found debhelper more difficult than doing it from scratch
<LaserJock> anybody have an idea where I can go to figure out how to change the screen brightness on my laptop?
<LaserJock> this is driving me nuts
<persia> LaserJock: Are there dedicated hot keys that don't work?
<superm1> LaserJock, what brand laptop?
<LaserJock> superm1: Toshiba
<superm1> LaserJock, there is an app in synaptic, the name slips my mind right now
<LaserJock> persia: yep, and I can't find any place to do it otherwise
<superm1> that allows those hotkeys to work
<superm1> (for most toshibas)
<persia> LaserJock: Ah.  I'm not sure for Toshiba, but I had to install a special utility for an old Sony I had.
<LaserJock> superm1: I found a couple, but they can't find some kernel module
<superm1> jamyskis, well you will have to make sure that if you are doing it by hand rather than debhelper, that you are actually catching all the docs and such
<superm1> i can see you aren't installing AUTHORS
<superm1> INSTALL README
<LaserJock> is there a way to look at possible kernel modules to load?
<LaserJock> I *think* I need to find some acpi video module
<superm1> LaserJock, if they ship a modules-source, possibly build using module-assistant
<LaserJock> superm1: they say it isn't necessary :/
<superm1> hm
<persia> LaserJock: The available kernel modules are under /lib/modules/...
<LaserJock> I'm trying toshset
<LaserJock> and it gives me: required kernel toshiba support not enabled.
<superm1> jamyskis, really it would be a good idea to try to do debian/rules with debhelper or cdbs possibly though.  it is a lot easier for a maintainer to read,update, and revu
<persia> LaserJock: Try `modprobe toshiba_acpi`, maybe?
<jamyskis> superm1: ok, I'll give it a go...I'm a little concerned about the manpage issue, and I don't know what FSSTND-dir-in-usr usr/doc/ means
<jamyskis> superm1: the rest i can figure out
<persia> jamyskis: FSSTND-dir-in-usr is complaining that nothing should be in /usr/doc (use /usr/share/doc/<package>/ instead).
<LaserJock> persia: heh, I get a Fatal error, no such device :(
<LaserJock> I'm guessing that's my problem
<persia> LaserJock: Cool!  You don't really have a Toshiba then :)
* LaserJock wonders what he paid Toshiba for then
<persia> LaserJock: Rather, you probably have a new one for which the kernel has yet to provide support.
<LaserJock> this laptop is nearly 3 years old
<jamyskis> superm1: ok, thanks for the help, I'm going to occupy myself with debhelper, I'll come back if I have any probs
<superm1> LaserJock, after searching apt, your using fnfxd, i would guess
<superm1> great jamyskis, good luck :)
<LaserJock> superm1: fnfxd doesn't work
<jamyskis> thanks :)
<persia> LaserJock: Alternately, you mentioned a need for video ACPI before, did you try loading .../kernel/drivers/acpi/video.ko?
<LaserJock> also get kernel related errors
<LaserJock> persia: I do have a video module loaded
<LaserJock> I'm assuming that's the one
<LaserJock> but /proc/acpi/video/ is empty
<superm1> LaserJock, it appears toshset installs /usr/share/doc/toshset/supported-models.txt.  Long shot, but are you on the list :)
<persia> LaserJock: You might want to file a bug.  If you can collect enough information about your hardware, it can usually be fixed by adjusting the hints in a few files, but knowing which files is hard.
<LaserJock> superm1: not on the list
<LaserJock> ok, I'm going to reboot
<LaserJock> as sometimes I know that does things
<LaserJock> like turns on my sound card
<persia> Grumble.  I was *using* LP.
<jussi01> good evening all
<LaserJock> well, sound's back on
<persia> Hi jussi01
<LaserJock> but:
<LaserJock> FATAL: Error inserting toshiba_acpi (/lib/modules/2.6.20-16-generic/kernel/drivers/acpi/toshiba_acpi.ko): No such device
<jussi01> hello persia
<persia> LaserJock: Are you ready to dive into the kernel-source?
<LaserJock> so the kernel doesn't even know my laptop is a toshiba :(
<superm1> LaserJock, what does dmesg say after you do that modprobe?
<LaserJock> persia: for Fn keys? I'm not sure
<LaserJock> superm1: nothing
<LaserJock> nothing relevant I should say
<LaserJock> well, this is just retarded
<LaserJock> I hate Toshiba, and I hate laptops
<crimsun> which model Toshiba do you have, for starters?
<LaserJock> A65-126
<crimsun> bios revision?
<LaserJock> no clue
<crimsun> use `sudo dmidecode`
<LaserJock> 1.90
<crimsun> now download and execute http://www.linux-sound.info/alsa/scripts/alsa-info.sh , then tell me the url.
<LaserJock> that is something else crimsun 
<LaserJock> http://pastebin.ca/552401
<crimsun> you likely need to blacklist snd-atiixp-modem
<LaserJock> Processor:         unknown
<LaserJock> ^^ that's a good sign ;-)
<jamyskis> superm1: does the package absolutely have to have a manpage?
<crimsun> I'm also not convinced you're 1) using the most current & Linux 2.6-known-good bios revision, 2) you aren't using a bad DSDT
<superm1> jamyskis, it doesn't *have* to have one, but its a good idea to write one
<jamyskis> superm1: i'm trying to get my head around the syntax - whoever designed this syntax should be shot
<LaserJock> crimsun: how do I check 1 & 2
<persia> jamyskis: If there is a user accessible binary, almost none of the reviewers will advocate without a manpage.
<superm1> jamyskis, see the app manedit
<crimsun> you can start with: echo blacklist snd-atiixp-modem|sudo tee -a /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist
<superm1> or similar apps
<superm1> makes the whole process a lot less painful
<jamyskis> superm1: looks like it too :) thanks
<LaserJock> crimsun: and what is that supposed to fix?
<Seveas> superm1, pretty close means that I'm redoing bits of the configuration things and then beta 1 is done
<crimsun> LaserJock: I don't know offhand if it will fix anything, because at best it can only help resolve sound issues if your DSDT isn't broken.
<crimsun> See http://acpi.sourceforge.net/dsdt/view.php?manufacturer=Toshiba
<superm1> Seveas, very exciting :)
<crimsun> Unfortunately, your specific model isn't listed, but you can see from that list that Toshibas, well, suck.
* persia notes rather that Toshiba has little respect for commonly accepted industry standards.
<Burgundavia> indeed
<Burgundavia> my laptop doesn't even report battery discharge rate
<crimsun> it's also their use of Microsoft's ASL compiler
<Burgundavia> its acpi even baffles mjg59
<LaserJock> rebooting, brb
<LaserJock> crimsun: http://pastebin.ca/552421
<LaserJock> I still don't know why it won't let me modprobe toshiba_acpi
<LaserJock> I guess my model is just not supported?
<persia> LaserJock: Either your model isn't supported, or your DSDT is confusing the kernel.  Probably the former.
<crimsun> LaserJock: I'm not sure what that output is supposed to tell me.  Is audio audible or inaudible?
<LaserJock> well, right no it is
<persia> LaserJock: You could probably fix it, if you were willing to determine what bits to poke in drivers/acpi/toshiba_acpi.c
<LaserJock> *now
<crimsun> ok, well, I don't care if your science packages asplode on your Toshiba.  I only care for sound.  ;-)
<Burgundavia> crimsun: is my broken acpi related to why mics plugged into the front mic jack don't work?
<LaserJock> crimsun: the audio problem comes and goes
<crimsun> LaserJock: again, impossible to diagnose unless you establish for certain that your ACPI and DSDT are known-good.  And knowing it's a Toshiba, well, fat chance.
<LaserJock> crimsun: it seems to actually be better in Ubuntu than in Windows, but sometimes it still boots/resumes without sound
<LaserJock> I"m not as worried about sound as finding some way to change the LCD brightness
<crimsun> Burgundavia: possible but improbable, but I don't know if your DSDT used the Microsoft ASL compiler.
<crimsun> s/used/was created by/
<crimsun> LaserJock: suspend<->resume issues introduce a completely new vector; it'd be nice to know if sound is audible consistently now.
<LaserJock> crimsun: I'll run it for a while and report back if it is a problem again
<crimsun> I hate Toshiba P100s.  All of them known to exist use broken DSDTs, and it really creates dozens of new bugs for me every week.
<LaserJock> oh, awesome
<LaserJock> I see a note that my model of Toshiba doesn't have a toshiba BIOS
<crimsun> :)
<persia> LaserJock: See, you don't really have a Toshiba :)
<LaserJock> well, they certainly could have fooled me
<crimsun> normally I smile when I read that someone has a Toshiba, because that pretty much means I can reject the sound bug outright.
<superm1> and clearly they did :)
<LaserJock> I even paid to get the stupid thing repaired
<persia> That's called "Marketing".
<crimsun> well, if anyone has horrid marketing, Creative Labs certainly is in the top three ignoble list.
<LaserJock> and my wife wonders why I want to get a new laptop, shesh
<crimsun> don't you already have an Apple running OS X?
<LaserJock> crimsun: that's my work computer
<LaserJock> I've just got crappy machines at home
<jamyskis> debhelper is a bloody nightmare
<jamyskis> superm1: when it says that the extended description line is too long, does it mean the summary in the control file?
<superm1> jamyskis, it should be less than 80 columns
<superm1> if its more, then wrap to the next line instead
<jamyskis> superm1: can you have blank lines in the extended description`
<jamyskis> ?
<superm1> You can make a blank line show up by " ."
<superm1> let me pastebin for a better explanation. 
<jamyskis> ok
<superm1> jamyskis, like this http://pastebin.ca/552458
<superm1> on line 8 you just put the period
<superm1> and then carry on as normal for other lines
<jamyskis> got it
<jamyskis> superm1, i built the package complete with manpage (named manpage.1) but typing man naughts_and_crosses doesn't work - im not sure if it installed or not
<superm1> jamyskis, you have to include a debian/manpages
<superm1> that lists what manpages get installed 
<superm1> for debhelper to pick up
<superm1> you can see a list of installed files in the resultant package using "dpkg -L"
<superm1> after its installed
<man-di> or dpkg -c ...deb (for uninstalled packages)
<superm1> man-di, oooh didn't know you could do that :)
<man-di> superm1: hehe, easier to check stuff before installing and something wents wrong
* persia prefers dpkg --contents - longer to type, but easier to remember
<superm1> jamyskis, also make sure that you included a dh_installman 
<superm1> in debian/rules
<jamyskis> superm1: i have the problem that my makefile was automatically generated and it sends the docs to /usr/doc and i'm trying to adjust my makefiles
<jamyskis> superm1: but im not sure how
<superm1> jamyskis, well don't make the changes to the Makefile unless you intend to release those changes in the upstream version too.  all your changes should be done in the debian/ directory
<superm1> if you must edit the Makefile, do so using a dpatch
<jamyskis> how do you do that?
<man-di> What nick has Arthur Loiret again?
<LaserJock> dang, this laptop sounds like an airplane taking off :/
<jamyskis> i have two variables in the configure script i need to change...how would i do that in the debian directory?
<persia> man-di: bashelier
<\sh> jamyskis, via autofoo magic
<man-di> jamyskis: perhaps configuring with --mandir=... --infodir=.... helps you
<man-di> persia: thanks
<man-di> bashelier: ping
<bashelier> man-di: pong
<man-di> bashelier: I just replied to your mail
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<man-di> bashelier: to make it more clear: replace ${Source-Version} by ${source:Version} or ${binary:Version}
<man-di> bashelier: to make the package binNMU safe
<bashelier> man-di: thanks, I'll also try to update my lintian version :)
<man-di> bashelier: http://wiki.debian.org/binNMU explains this a bit
<bashelier> man-di: I'm reading, thanks a lot
<siretart> we don't do binNMUs in ubuntu, but sourceful uploads with no changes outside debian/changelog, but in debian, binNMUs are quite important
<man-di> siretart: this is about sponsoring a package for Debian
<man-di> siretart: and the later sync
<man-di> so it should be okay for Debian first
<siretart> oh. I see
<siretart> that's correct
* man-di plays the Debian sponsor for some people asking her for a sponsor
<siretart> it's still imporant to know that in debian, arch: all packages never build on buildds, and in ubuntu, they always are, and always on i386
<siretart> and this is where much confusion comes from
<man-di> siretart: thats known at least to me
<man-di> but thanks for reminding
<man-di> I know Debian und Ubuntu are handling some stuff quite differently
<man-di> and both hat their reasons for doing so
<man-di> siretart: another question: do you know then the bandwith problem on tiber will be solved? the java package comparison is not updated anymore
<siretart> man-di: no not yet, I want to look at debconf more into it
<man-di> ah, okay
<siretart> I thought a reboot might fix it, but it didn't :/
<man-di> what is the problem at all? network driver collapsing?
<siretart> not sure. I might need to get a support ticket from serverpronto
<Fujitsu> man-di: I've got a few of those running on the ServerPronto box that I administer. I can easily set it up there if you wish.
<man-di> Fujitsu: that would be great, all I need is what http://tiber.tauware.de/~lucas/versions/java.html shows
<jamyskis> superm1: should the directory in the source directory for manpages be called man manpage or manpages?
<man-di> Fujitsu: just an updated version
<superm1> jamyskis,  the file should be debian/manpages
<superm1> and it just lists all shipped manpages
<jamyskis> superm1: i have the file debian/manpages which has manpage.1 in it
<superm1> such as debian/foo.1
<jamyskis> superm1: but i don't know where manpage.1 should go
<jamyskis> dh_installman complained it couldn't find it
<superm1> right, you need to refer to it as debian/foo.1 rather than foo.1
<bashelier> man-di: uploaded, shall I send you an other mail ?
<jamyskis> superm1: got you...just an administrative question, I've put the name of the distribution as gutsy because i thought the deb would be included in 7.10's repos
<jamyskis> superm1: should i ignore the warning that the distribution name is invalid?
<superm1> jamyskis, yes
<superm1> jamyskis, its just because of the version of linda/lintian on the revu machine doesn't recognize it
<man-di> bashelier: yes, please
<superm1> so not a big deal
<jamyskis> ok...hopefully this will be the last pbuilder i run now...
<bashelier> man-di: done
<man-di> bashelier: thx
<jamyskis> superm1: thanks for your patience by the way, I've just noticed that this has been going for two hours now
<superm1> jamyskis, not a problem, glad to see these things being fixed so we can get this into the archive :)
<superm1> jamyskis, i am going to get to bed though now, its a bit early in the morning where i am
<jamyskis> superm1: as soon as I've got this fixed i'll get to work on my other game :)
<jamyskis> superm1: ok then good night and thanks again :)
<superm1> night all
<persia> jamyskis: Once you've got a package you think works, please upload again, and annouce the URL here.  You'll likely get another review, and perhaps advocation.
<jamyskis> persia: will do
<jamyskis> ok that didn`t work either :( despite adding --docdir=$${prefix}/share/docs to the ./configure in debian/rules it's still installing the docs in /usr/docs
<jamyskis> ok its not docs it doc
<jekil> hello
<jamyskis> hi jekil
<persia> jamyskis: Is /usr/doc defined in ./configure?
<jamyskis> persia: yes
<persia> With which variable name?
<jamyskis> persia: docdir (not by my doing, I must add, as I developed the game using the Anjuta IDE and Anjuta created the makefile for me) 
<persia> jamyskis: No worries about how it was generated: I just wanted to make sure that you were passing the right argument.  I've seen some odd ./configure files :)
<jamyskis> persia: :)
<jamyskis> its still installing to /usr/doc
<persia> jamyskis: As I see it, if ./configure isn't accepting the argument, you have four options, as a matrix.  Either as upstream or in a dpatch, either patch configure to parse --docdir= or define docdir as /usr/share/doc/ directly.
<man-di> jamyskis: does configuring with --docdir=/usr/share/doc help?
<persia> jamyskis: There are also less clean solutions, like adding a mv command to binary/install, but you really don't want to do that.
<jamyskis> persia: I'll try a manual source install
<jamyskis> persia: manual source install didn't work either
<jamyskis> persia: would it help if i set docdir in the configure manually in both the source directory and the orig.tar.gz?
<jamyskis> i have no idea how to use dpatches
<jamyskis> persia: ok this gets weirder - ill show you something in the pastebin hold on
<jamyskis> persia: http://pastebin.ca/552514 <- excerpt from the original configure file...what do you notice?
<persia> jamyskis: As upstream, you'll want to bump the version number for the configure change (and perhaps want to adjust config.in instead).  As the packager, you'll want to `man dpatch.make` and look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/PatchingSources
<Fujitsu> Wow, tiber's 'net connection really is slow.
<persia> jamyskis: Ah.  Try passing --datarootdir=/usr/share :)
<persia> Wait, that's already there.  Now I'm confused.
<jamyskis> persia: it already is :)
<jamyskis> persia: exactly
<jamyskis> persia: that's why i don't get it...when i do it through debhelper it installs the docs to /usr/doc, if i do a manual source install it installs them to /usr/local/doc
<jamyskis> i don't get it
<persia> jamyskis: Try a local build, and track down what actually gets put in the Makefile.  Perhaps you can backtrack what is happening.
<jamyskis> persia: http://pastebin.ca/552518
<jamyskis> persia: yet when i "make install" it installs the docs to /usr/local/doc/naughts_and_crosses
<persia> jamyskis: That's built with `./configure; make` or with `debuild`?
<jamyskis> persia: ./configure/make
<persia> jamyskis: You'll probably want to look at the install: rule of your Makefile.  I suspect something odd.
<jamyskis> persia: prefix is set as /usr/local so it should be installing the docs in /usr/local/share/doc/naughts_and_crosses by default
<jamyskis> PACKAGE_DOC_DIR=/usr/local/doc/naughts_and_crosses
<persia> jamyskis: That sounds like an upstream bug to me :)  Nice work in finding it.
<jamyskis> persia: thanks although its my program
<jamyskis> :)
<persia> jamyskis: When you are both upstream and the packager, it's a little easier, because you don't have to patch - you can just release a new version :)
<jamyskis> persia: true, I'm just left a little confused how I can solve this because this is a problem with automake
<geser> jamyskis: look in Makefile.am: naughts_and_crossesdocdir = ${prefix}/doc/naughts_and_crosses
<jamyskis> geser: change that to ${prefix}/share/doc/naughts_and_crosses?
<jamyskis> upstream and package?
<geser> that would install it in the correct place but it still would ignore the --docdir value
<jamyskis> that'll do for the time being
<jamyskis> i just want to get this deb package sorted
<geser> don't forget to regenerate Makefile.in (or patch it also)
<geser> when I look at Makefile.in, it looks like docdir is defined but not used
<Kmos> geser: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5429 -> please commment this one
<Kmos> *comment
<geser> Kmos: for merges 1 ACK is enough, but I can still look at it
<persia> Kmos: For new upstream merges, you only need one advocate (prior to UVF).  Once you get an advocation, if it's not uploaded, you should bug your advocate :)
<jamyskis> i don't believe this - it's STILL installing to /usr/doc
<jamyskis> ok i and my wireless mouse need a rest
<jamyskis> ill be back later on
<geser> jamyskis: did you update Makefile.in and re-run configure to update also Makefile?
<geser> Kmos: you should ask keescook (or some other core-dev) for uploading it as gqview is in main
<crimsun> I'll look.
<Kmos> crimsun: you can upload it ?
<crimsun> I have to look first.
<Kmos> ok :)
<Kmos> crimsun: thx
<jamyskis> geser: i did and its still doing it
<jamyskis> geser: i'll come back to it later
<geser> hmm
<jamyskis> geser: thx again
<Kmos> ubuntu-main-sponsors is a mailing list ? i can't found it
<crimsun> it's an LP team
<crimsun> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-main-sponsors
<Kmos> thx
<crimsun> guess uploads are being queued again.
<crimsun> are these outages being announced somewhere?
<Fujitsu> crimsun: No, but I suspect they now think we're used to them going into big black holes regularly.
<man-di> I have added my gpg key to launchpad and added myself to "Contributors of packages for ubuntu universe". What else do I need to do to be able to upload to REVU?
<persia> man-di: Sleep on it (or bug an admin) to get the keys synced.
<man-di> cool, thats all?
<persia> man-di: Yep.  It's a low barrier to entry :)
<Kmos> crimsun: any news ?
<korobase_> Hi,all. I am new here!
<persia> Hi korobase_
<crimsun> ~$ sudo -u revu1 revu-key update
<korobase_> :persia.Can I ask you some questions?
<crimsun> running.  It will take a while due to tiber being a bit sluggish over the network.
<Kmos> :)
<persia> korobase_: You'll get a better response by just asking the channel in general, but I might answer.
<crimsun> Kmos: see my statement 20 minutes ago.
<korobase_> ok,good.
<Kmos> [11:48]  <crimsun> guess uploads are being queued again.
<Kmos> but you can't approved it and it goes to queue ?
<crimsun> Kmos: I've already uploaded it.  I have nothing to do with it beyond that.
<Kmos> crimsun: ah!.. thc
<Kmos> crimsun: ah!.. thx
<Kmos> :)
<korobase_> I want to find a mentor. Any one can help me?
<Kmos> bug 3222
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 3222 in vim "gvim is hidden in menu" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/3222
<Kmos> i think it's already fixed..
<Kmos> someone else can confirm it
<persia> korobase_: A mentor is not a requirement to help, but you might be interested in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Mentoring/Contributor
<jekil> i cant upload to revu because i get this error http://rafb.net/p/Q5kI5H94.html
<persia> jekil: Is this for a package you recently uploaded?
<jekil> persia: because in the last upload my gprs connection going down, so it's a partial upload, but i can't overwrite
<persia> jekil: OK.  I just wanted to make sure.  When that happens, ask here for someone to delete the old upload from REVU (you need to specify the package name).
<jekil> persia: thanks
<jekil> so, anyone can delete tablelist old upload from revu?
<persia> jekil: Not anyone, but many people (more than just REVU admins).
<persia> jekil: Sorry ignore that :)
<Hobbsee> hey all
<persia> hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> :)
<persia> The really fun part of looking at bugs nobody wanted to sponsor for the last 8 months is the number of removal requests I get to file :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> eyah - a lot of them i either dont understand, or cant tell if they're still relevant
<Hobbsee> 8 months, hey?
<persia> Hobbsee: Sort by "recently changed".  Most of the ones at the top should be fine for upload.
<persia> That's not so bad - there used to be ones from 2005 around :)
* Hobbsee isnt uploading anything in current state
<persia> ?
<Hobbsee> true that - they changed the ones assigned to MOTU to being subscribed to u-u-s
<DarkMageZ> if you don't understand a bug. then ask in the bug for a better explaination.
<Hobbsee> well, the diff was more the problem
* persia echos DarkMageZ and notes that unsubscribing, setting "Needs Info", and saying what you want is a good way to get it.
<Hobbsee> "how does this solve the problem, and does it do it in a sane way?"
<persia> Hobbsee: Ask the requestor.  It's their responsibility to provide enough information to be sponsored.
<Hobbsee> true that
<Hobbsee> that's what i usually do
<Hobbsee> but large buglists have a habit of making me go "i'm not actually getting this down, there's no point in continuing"
<persia> Hobbsee: It's not a large buglist :)
<Hobbsee> no, but anything over 1 page == large
<persia> Hobbsee: It's 1/3 of a page.
<Hobbsee> true.  last i looked at it and worked on it was a while ago
* persia pokes the team leader
<StevenK> Uh oh
<Hobbsee> hehe
* Hobbsee has been doing other things
* persia prepares for various implements of shinyness
* Hobbsee ponders gouging persia's eyes out with the Very Shiny Spoon of Curviness.
<StevenK> You forgot the trademark
<persia> StevenK: Doesn't it take at least a day or two to register a trademark?  I think that's a new one.
<crimsun> things are accelerated in Hobbsee time.
<Hobbsee> 
<Hobbsee> indeed.
<Hobbsee> using HobbseeLogic
<Hobbsee> in the HobbseeWorld
<Hobbsee> and 25 is a cube in HobbseeWorld, dammit!!!!
<imbrandon> moins all
<Hobbsee> morning redneck.
<imbrandon> heh heya
<StevenK> Hah
<imbrandon> you seem in rare form today 
<imbrandon> hehe
<Hobbsee> in rare form?  why so?
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: i've been dealing in kde buglists and such.
<imbrandon> ahh
<apachelogger> is revu server not accepting uploads or something?
<Fujitsu> apachelogger: What's it not doing?
<persia> apachelogger: It's been working for several people in the last few hours.  What problem are you experiencing?
<apachelogger> persia: 12 hours ago I tried to upload kopete-thinklight -> didn't wanna upload
<persia> Nafallo: Does bug 114301 still need sponsorship, or will the bzr commit get released to gutsy in due time?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 114301 in gajim "Bug in fr.po translation that breaks invitation" [Low,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114301
<apachelogger> 3 hours later I uploaded a fixed version of kde3-theme-domino
<apachelogger> didn't show up in webinterface yet
<apachelogger> same for libprojectm
<persia> apachelogger: Odd.  I saw several updates to packages about 5 hours ago, showing in the webinterface.  Ping an Admin.
* Hobbsee looks in
<Hobbsee> i saw kde3-theme-domino sitting there, iirc
<apachelogger> Hobbsee: not the fixed version though
<Hobbsee> ahh
<Hobbsee> oh
<apachelogger> :)
<Hobbsee> that's weird
<Hobbsee> did anyone here upload krawlsite?
<apachelogger> me
<Hobbsee> or swfdec?
<apachelogger> not me
<Hobbsee> or libprojectm_0.99-0ubuntu1_source.changes ?
<apachelogger> me
<persia> Kmos: Sorry for the long delay.  3222 is an odd bug.  It might be worth referencing https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/menu-items-revisited or https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/better-structured-game-menu as plans toward a solution.
<Hobbsee> apachelogger: okay, wait ~5 mins, i think it is, and it should magically appear
<apachelogger> Hobbsee: ok :)
<Hobbsee> apachelogger: you didnt drop out of the REVU group on LP, i assume?
<Hobbsee> that's weird.
<Hobbsee> !revu
<ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<Hobbsee> very odd.
<apachelogger> Hobbsee: hopefully not
* apachelogger checks
* Hobbsee tries updating the keyrink
<Hobbsee> -g
<apachelogger> https://launchpad.net/~apachelogger/+participation
<Hobbsee> yeah
<Hobbsee> oh well
<Kmos> CVE-2005-1790
<ubotu> Microsoft Internet Explorer 6 SP2 6.0.2900.2180 and 6.0.2800.1106, and earlier versions, allows remote attackers to cause a denial of service (crash) and execute arbitrary code via a Javascript BODY onload event that calls the window function, aka "Mismatched Document Object Model Objects Memory Corruption Vulnerability." (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2005-1790)
<Kmos> persia: nice
<Kmos> persia: i've added the blueprint to that bug
<Kmos> asac: bug 26038
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 26038 in mozilla "[CVE-2005-1790]  DoS against Mozilla-based browsers" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/26038
<Kmos> asac: isn't this fixed ?
<DarkMageZ> Kmos, according to the bug report it hangs 1.5. but it does appear to hang firefox 2.0.0.4 here. so unless someone can confirm that it's not killing dapper anymore.
<DarkMageZ> doesn't appear to hang 2.0.0.4 *
<Kmos> dapper has v2.0.0.4 ?
<DarkMageZ> na, feisty has 2.0.0.4. but dapper has 1.5 which the bug says is affected.
* persia suggests someone does an SRU
<Kmos> it says fix released on debian
<Kmos> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=340282
<ubotu> Debian bug 340282 in mozilla-browser "[CVE-2005-1790]  DoS against Mozilla-based browsers" [Grave,Closed]  
<apachelogger> Hobbsee: already found the problem?
<Hobbsee> apachelogger: did it publish?
<Hobbsee> apachelogger: well, i found that the uploads got rejected
<apachelogger> nope :(
<apachelogger> hm, I knew revu would hate me for all the uploads ;-)
<Hobbsee> i wonder
<Hobbsee> if the keys in the keyring are being updated - are they throwing the old keys out, and adding new ones, or what?
<Kmos> lionel: bug 5106
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 5106 in jabberd2 "jabberd2 s2s crashes shortly after startup" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/5106
<Kmos> lionel: can you do a sync for debian ?
<StevenK> It is probably grabbing all the keys from LP, throwing them together and replacing the current keyring at the end.
<Kmos> *from
<Kmos> lionel: can you do a sync from debian ? it has version s10 in experimental
<lionel> Kmos: it is fixed in Debian ?
<lionel> yes, we can sync from Debian
<Kmos> lionel: yes, it is
<lionel> Kmos: can you make a sync request, I'll ack it
<Hobbsee> StevenK: that's what it's looking like to me
<Kmos> "2.0s11 seems to be in Debian experimental now if someone wants to request a UVFe."
<Kmos> s11
<lionel> yeah, I have seen
<Hobbsee> apachelogger: oh, i see the problem
<DarkMageZ> Kmos, firefox 1.5.0.12 from mozilla just hung on me using that poc. ubuntu's firefox package in dapper is messy, so it's difficult to see the individual debian/ubuntu patches. i doubt it has been fixed in dapper.
<Kmos> DarkMageZ: i marked it was fixed
<Hobbsee> er, this thing is seriously weird.
<Kmos> lionel: can i assign the sync to you ?
<lionel> yeah, np
<Kmos> ok, thx
<Hobbsee> hobbsee@tiber:~$ gpg --list-public-keys 7D2BCE85  C3F159CA 945348A4
<Hobbsee> gpg: error reading key: public key not found
<Hobbsee> hobbsee@tiber:~$ gpg --list-keys 7D2BCE85  C3F159CA 945348A4
<Hobbsee> gpg: error reading key: public key not found
<apachelogger> sry, got disconnected
<Hobbsee> someone who's better at gpg...what does that mean?
<Hobbsee> is that the public key of what tiber considers it's owner, or of the individual people's keys?
<StevenK> Well, the first question is where does the keyring updater script put the keyring?
<Hobbsee> some temporary location and then moves it, it seems.
<StevenK> Moves it where, though?
<geser> Hobbsee: are you doing it as the right user?
<StevenK> Since I suspect it isn't ~hobbsee/.gnupg
<geser> else it checks your pubring on tiber
<Hobbsee> geser: yes.  /srv/revu1-production/uploaders.gpg
<Hobbsee> sorry, StevenK /srv/revu1-production/uploaders.gpg
<StevenK> Hobbsee: gpg --keyring /srv/revu1-production/uploaders.gpg ....
<Hobbsee> then it asks me to type a message
<Hobbsee> it appears that the keyserver is timing out.
<StevenK> gpg --keyring /srv/revu1-production/uploaders.gpg --list-keys 7D2BCE85
<Hobbsee> StevenK: no root
<jrib> in REVU, is the login usually the email?
* Hobbsee pokes siretart 
<persia> jrib: It is always the email on the key.
<Hobbsee> the primary, i think
<persia> Right.  Sorry.
<Kmos> lionel: bug 119545
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119545 in jabberd2 "Please sync jabberd2 2.0s11 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119545
<jrib> Thanks, I wasn't sure if I had just forgotten the login name.  Can someone check if the recover lost password feature is working?  It doesn't give me any text to decrypt
<persia> jrib: Have you uploaded anything?
<jrib> persia: many months ago
<lionel> Kmos: thanks, I'll have a look in a few min
<persia> jrib: You only need to log in to comment on your uploads.  If your account got lost for some reason (I don't know why it would), a new upload should regenerate it.
<jrib> persia: ah ok, thanks
* Hobbsee moves the files out of rejected.  again.
<apachelogger> :S
<Hobbsee> apachelogger: i'ts timing out, so i think it hasnt actually imported your key.
<Hobbsee> either that, or has stuffed up somewhere, and isnt actually copying over *anyone's* key to the correct place
<Hobbsee> apachelogger: what's the full name on your key?
<Hobbsee> oh wait, nvm
<Hobbsee> it's not done alphabetically anyway, it seems
<apachelogger> *backspace*
<geser> Hobbsee: what happens when you try to add his key to the keyring?
<Hobbsee> geser: havent tried.  not sure i have the permissions to.
<Hobbsee> especially as the keyring is in a different place, it looks like
<Hobbsee> which i likely dont have write access to
* apachelogger is afraid
<Hobbsee> apachelogger: of?
<apachelogger> to never be able to upload
<Hobbsee> nah, siretart will be able to fix it
<apachelogger> cause I'm packaging pure amarok love right now :)
<jekil> this lintian error is related to what? manpage-has-useless-whatis-entry
<apachelogger> jekil: http://lintian.debian.org/reports/Tmanpage-has-useless-whatis-entry.html
<Hobbsee> apachelogger: oh?  which version?
<apachelogger> Hobbsee: not amarok, but visualization for amarok
<apachelogger> Hobbsee: http://xmms-projectm.sourceforge.net/
<Hobbsee> apachelogger: neat.  email it to me, if you like, when you're done
* Hobbsee can try uploading it from here
<apachelogger> k, thx :)
<persia> jekil: You need to provide a little more information about the program in the short description.  Try to use keywords that will help people using apropos to find man pages.
<jekil> persia: thanks
<jrib> If I am trying to package something that does not provide tarballs (I had to do an svn co), do I create a tar.gz of the checkout?  Also, what should I calll the directory of the checkout, should I rename it to  program-revision_number  or  program-date?  Anyone know where the documentation is for this?
<StevenK> jrib: Create a tarball of an export.
<StevenK> jrib: Since a checkout will have .svn directories everywhere.
<jrib> good point
<Hobbsee> hi chuck 
<persia> jrib: See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/CommonPackagingMistakes/ChangingTheOrigTarball (look for the cvs example).
<jrib> persia: thanks
<persia> jrib: Don't forget debian/README.Debian-source :)
<mumbly> hi
<lionel> hi mumbly
<_Enchained> Hobbsee hi. can you remove again the b5i2iso package ? I can't upload it (same error than this morning)
<Hobbsee> still waiting on the key resync
<Hobbsee> did the fix this morning work though?
<_Enchained> what fix ?
<_Enchained> the others seem ok. I just forgot to include the upstream changelog in this one.
<Hobbsee> _Enchained: shoudl be gone
<_Enchained> again :/
<_Enchained> should I use dcut ?
<StevenK> Not for REVU
<_Enchained> ok
<Hobbsee> no
<RainCT> persia: about bug 117180, the new upstream version is in Debian experimental
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 117180 in desktop-file-utils "Encoding is deprecated" [Wishlist,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/117180
<luisbg> what do I need to tweak in a package if it uses cmake instead of makefile?
<RainCT> persia: the only difference I see (beside the maintainer) is that there's a debian/defaults.list file on Ubuntu but not on Debian (don't know if it was there on the old debian version or it was added by Ubuntu)
<RainCT> persia: if it wasn't there too on the old Debian version, does it need a merge to add that file?
<persia> RainCT: I'm looking.
<apachelogger> hm
<apachelogger> anyone knows what to do against rpath issues?
<apachelogger> W: libvisual-projectm: binary-or-shlib-defines-rpath ./usr/lib/libvisual-0.4/actor/actor_projectM.so /usr/lib/X11
<mr_pouit> you can try to add --disable-rpath to ./configure args
<persia> apachelogger: http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html has a section on rpath
<apachelogger> persia: thx
<apachelogger> persia: considering I unerstand this properly ... rpath is only a real issue when it defines /usr/lib?
<persia> apachelogger: Um.  I read it as rpath is a problem unless it is a private library, with no -dev package, and no other users.  Try to avoid rpath unless something bad happens without it.
<apachelogger> persia: well, how to get rid of that thing?
* apachelogger doesn't see a problem anyway, since libvisual-projectm is private
<persia> RainCT: I think it needs to be a merge.  Check with the person who always handles this package to see if there are other pending changes.
<persia> apachelogger: if it's completely private, it might not be a problem, if you can guarantee it's completely private.  In that case, you can use a lintian override.  To get rid of it, try mr_pouit's suggestion first.  If that doesn't work, check the build system to see what needs to get passed where (or patched).
<apachelogger> k, thx
<persia> RainCT: Sorry - the some changelog entries are missing, which makes it confusing.  You need to coordinate with the last uploader.
<Nafallo> persia: will not need sponsorship since I'm a MOTU myself. I think the change is currently to small to be an upload by itself. Please leave feedback on that though.
<persia> Nafallo: Thanks for the update.  I'm going to drop it from the U-U-S queue, assuming that your last comment is sufficient feedback and that the fix will be applied in gutsy.
<Nafallo> persia: it will, thanks.
<persia> Yay!  Only 18 left :)
<man-di> persia: ping eclipse
<man-di> persia: tell me if you need more infos
<persia> man-di: Already looking at it (LP auto-emails bug subscribers).
<man-di> persia: can you look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libcommons-dbcp-java/+bug/119560 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119560 in libcommons-dbcp-java "Please sync libcommons-dbcp-java 1.2.1-5 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<man-di> the version is in debian incoming currently
* persia needs to write a guide to the perfect SYNC bug.
<man-di> persia: sorry to create you so much troubles
<Hobbsee> persia: not the request sync script?
<man-di> Hobbsee: script?
<Hobbsee> requestsync, yes.
<persia> man-di: The goal is something like bug 114137 (which also isn't perfect).  You need a short summary of why a sync is better than a merge, and the new debian changelog (for eclipse only 3.2.2-1).  I think the current state of the eclipse bug is fine, but 119560 is hard to read.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 114137 in thuban "Please sync thuban 1.2.0-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114137
<persia> Hobbsee: I don't like requestsync.  I think my bug is better.
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> then you havent requested enough syncs yet :P
<persia> man-di: No trouble.  If I tell you how to make a good sync, I have less to do :)
<persia> Hobbsee: For me, it's easier to use LP than requestsync, as my local mail is broken, and I usually already have the Debian changelog in front of me from determining that I can do a sync.
<geser> persia: what don't you like on requestsync?
<persia> geser: 1)  It requires working local mail.  2)  The formatting on LP later is ugly.  3)  It doesn't provide enough guidelines about what should be included in Rationale.
<persia> geser: Other than those, it's nearly perfect, especially with the recent patches.
<Hobbsee> persia: ah, fair enough
<Hobbsee> it requires smtp.
<Hobbsee> persia: uh...you're not changing the smtp server are you?
<luisbg> do you guys have your pbuilders built for gutsy or for feisty?
<persia> luisbg: I have sbuild for both.
<luisbg> persia, building it for gusty stalls to me :S
<Hobbsee> i have a gutsy and feisty pbuilder
<geser> persia: afaik 1) is wrong as it delivers the mail directly to fiordland.ubuntu.com
<persia> Hobbsee: I haven't actually used requestsync since Dapper - it's just too ugly.
<RainCT> persia: where can I see who was the last uploader?
<Hobbsee> persia: well, there were great improvements since then.
<Hobbsee> RainCT: aptitude changelog foo
<persia> RainCT: aptitude changelog packagename
<RainCT> ah yes :p
<RainCT> thanks
<persia> Hobbsee: I still don't like the formatting, and LP is easy for me, as I already have the package bugs page open and the changelog in front of me.  I won't tell anyone else not to use requestsync, but I'm not likely to be convinced for a while yet :)
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> fair enough
<jekil> any revu admin here?
<persia> luisbg: Build it for feisty, and dist-upgrade to gutsy once it's built.
<Hobbsee> jekil: yes, but i believe it's stuffed.  technicla term.
<luisbg> persia, will do, thanks
<persia> luisbg: Just be careful with the naming.  Some of the automated scripts assume the name and the release match, so you might need to adjust a couple things.
<luisbg> persia, what differences does a package need in the rules file if built with cmake instead of make?
<persia> luisbg: Trivially, an extra 'c'.  More specifically, with CDBS you need to overload the build, and with debhelper you need to adjust the rules to use the cmake conventions instead of the make conventions.
<luisbg> hmmmm feisty stalls in the same place, just after Get:6 http://archive.ubuntu.com feisty/multiverse Packages [148kB] 
<persia> luisbg: Also, you'll often get a better, faster response when asking questions in general, rather than to specific individuals.
<luisbg> persia, may I pm you?
<persia> luisbg: OK, but I don't use pbuilder, so I'm not necessarily the best person to ask about it :)
<luisbg> it's not about pbuilder, it's about adjusting the rules
<man-di> persia: so do you want me to give additional infos to one of the bugs?
<persia> man-di: Sorry.  I've become distracted.  Please, for bug 119560, but rather different information than more (use "Edit Description").
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119560 in libcommons-dbcp-java "Please sync libcommons-dbcp-java 1.2.1-5 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119560
<Kmos> someone can explain me why flite 1.2 was named flite 1.2-release2.2
<Kmos> ?
<Kmos> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/flite/1.2-release-2.2
<Kmos> http://www.speech.cs.cmu.edu/flite/packed/flite-1.2/
<Kmos> doesn't have that on .tar.gz
<luisbg> :S my pbuilder create is getting stalled at 99% everytime, doesn't matter if it's for gutsy or feisty or with multiverse or not
<DarkMageZ> Kmos, that naming convention was imported from debian like that. feel free to burn them :P
<Kmos> DarkMageZ: yeah.. =)
<Kmos> i'm doing the package now
<man-di> persia: comment to 119560 added
* persia recommends keeping Debian naming conventions so I don't have to file a removal request for the buggy package now again sync'd two years from now.
<Kmos> persia: i can't change flite to flite (1.3-0ubuntu1) ?
<persia> man-di: Thanks.  I'll take this.  Please consider using "Edit Description" next time, to update the full text of the bug, and make it clearer to read.
<Kmos> !info flite
<ubotu> flite: A small run-time speech synthesis engine. In component universe, is extra. Version 1.2-release-2.2 (feisty), package size 216 kB, installed size 444 kB
<persia> Kmos: I don't really care about the tar.gz name, and think upgrades are good, but please try to keep the source package and binary package names in sync with Debian.
<Kmos> persia: ok
<man-di> persia: ah, now I got what you meant. sorry for being slow...
<persia> Kmos: Sorry.  I misunderstood.  Changing the version to 0ubuntu1 will be a good thing :)
<Kmos> ah.. ok =)
<Kmos> +--  7 lines: flite (1.2-release-2.2) unstable; urgency=low -- Clment Stenac
<Kmos> this is the latest changelog
<Kmos> what differs from X-Original-Maintainer to XBSC-Original-Maintainer
<Kmos> how to know what to use?
<persia> Kmos: Use XSBC-Original-Maintainer.  The first draft of DebianMaintainerField was vague, and we spent a week or so experimenting before we decided on that.
<Kmos> ah.. ok
<persia> Kmos: To explain in more detail, X means that devscripts shouldn't complain, B means copy it to the binary, S means copy it to the .dsc, and C means copy it to the changes.  I think there's something in MOTU/FAQ about it.
<Kmos> i'll see that later
<Kmos> thx
<Kmos> so by default use always XSBC for Ubuntu
* Kmos building flite-1.3 with pbuilder
<Kmos> https://launchpad.net/+builds/
<Kmos> is so slowly today
<Kmos> :)
<man-di> does a sync request needs to be ACKed by two MOTUs?
<lionel> man-di: only one
<man-di> lionel: thx
<lionel> np :)
<man-di> persia: thx for ACKing both packages
<persia> man-di: No more cookies for you today.  For the rest, you have to subscribe U-U-S like everyone else :)
<man-di> persia: Thank you very much
<siretart> Hobbsee: huh?
<Hobbsee> siretart: seems like REVU is broken - it's timing out to the keyserver when the keyring resyncs, and people are getting uploads into rejected/ when tehy used to be able to upload to revu
<siretart> damn
<siretart> I'll look into it in a sek
<persia> OK.  Triage and cleanup of the U-U-S queue is complete.  Someone else please sponsor (or otherwise make go away) the remaining bugs :)
<man-di> persia: I can file new ones and subscribe U-U-S easily
<man-di> ;-)
<persia> man-di: That would be welcome :)
<bashelier> thanks for audiere man-di ;)
<Kmos> siretart: revu has some auto-expire system to delete packages ?
<Kmos> it's so slowly last days
* Hobbsee does a mass reject on the entire ubuntu buglist
<Hobbsee> Kmos: it's not out of space
* persia congratulates Hobbsee on not having to upload anything else ever!
<Hobbsee> hehe
<man-di> persia: thx
<man-di> bashelier: thx
<jekil> revu is broken? clik here: http://revu.tauware.de/lostpw.py?email=alessandro@lonerunners.net
<persia> jekil: Yes.  It's being worked on.
<jekil> oh thanks
<siretart> Kmos: the hardware has problems
<Kmos> siretart: that's bad
<Hobbsee> siretart: is PPA  and such expected to take it over?
<Hobbsee> seeing as you were working on that
<Kmos> siretart: which type?
* persia didn't think PPA extended to Contributors in first release.
<siretart> Hobbsee: I'm still thinking about that. PPAs currently don't over any UI at all, and it is unlikely to get one which is able to replace REVU soon
<siretart> Hobbsee: however, I've been started to think how REVU2 could fetch sources from ppa's and offer commenting functionality and run lintian/linda and such
<siretart> Hobbsee: if you want to help coding, sure!
<siretart> Kmos: bandwith is slow
<Hobbsee> siretart: darn.  i've lost the web address to get to PPA's now
<Hobbsee> siretart: ahh.  sounds interesting
<Hobbsee> i dont have the coding knowledge, sorry
<persia> Huh?  PPAs work?  How?
<shawarma> siretart: Oh, you're actually helping out with the PPA coding, too?
<Hobbsee> ah, found the bugger.
<Hobbsee> persia: http://ppa.dogfood.launchpad.net/hobbsee/
<siretart> shawarma: no, I'm not
<shawarma> siretart: Ah, ok.
<siretart> shawarma: the ppa's offer an interface to apt. I'm thinking how revu could exploit that
<shawarma> siretart: Oh, right. I got lost in your conversation there.
<shawarma> Quick question:
<siretart> hm. revu's bandwith is like 10-20k/s, and I have no idea why. the interface is at 100mbit/FD
<shawarma> What's the syntax for having a Depends: on e..g package foo version >= 2.5-1  AND < 2.6 ?
<StevenK> Specify it twice
<shawarma> Is it Depends: foo (>= 2.5-1), foo (<< 2.6) ?
<siretart> right
<StevenK> shawarma: Yup
<shawarma> Or can I join them somehow?
<shawarma> Ok, great. Thanks.
<siretart> no
<Kmos> siretart: maybe it needs a restart :) only 20 kb/s lol..
<Kmos> system is updated? something is wrong
<siretart> Kmos: its uptime is 5 days, and the problems where already there before the reboot
<Kmos> :(
<Kmos> it uses apache or lighttpd ?
<siretart> apache, revu is implemented in mod-python
<siretart> need to run now, will look at it again in debcamp
<siretart> sorry
<man-di> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libapache2-mod-jk2/+bug/29605 is fixed by removing libapache2-mod-jk2. The last version this was included was breezy. Can someone please how to close this properly?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 29605 in libapache2-mod-jk2 "mod_jk2 is deprecated, mod_jk is newer (and for apache2)" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  
<Hobbsee> man-di: as in, how to close it, or what to say?
<man-di> what settings to use for closing
<man-di> and: Am I allowed to close this at all?
<persia> man-di: You are allowed to close.  If it is fixed in the archives, please set to fix released, and report with which version is was fixed in a comment.
<Hobbsee> man-di: yes, you can close it, click on libapache2-mod-jk2 (Ubuntu), and change the status, and hit "save changes"
<persia> man-di: If it is not fixed (and doesn't apply because it was breezy), please reject with that as an explanation.
<man-di> persia: it was fixed by the removal
<persia> man-di: In that case, reject it.
<persia> man-di: And comment that it is rejected because it no longer applies to a package in the ubuntu archives.
<persia> man-di: On a more general note, you might want to ask (at a more active time) about bug management in #ubuntu-bugs.  Also, the topic of that channel has some useful links for how to manage bugs.
<man-di> persia: too late, I closed it already
<man-di> persia: thanks for the hint
<persia> man-di: Great!  Thanks.
<man-di> lionel: you merged libapache-mod-jk last time?
<man-di> lionel: I wonder why you put the following change into it:
<man-di> -	cd build/docs && lynx -dump -nolist changelog.html > changelog
<man-di> +	cd build/docs/miscellaneous && lynx -dump -nolist changelog.html > ../changelog
<sacater> is it possible to 'upgrade' from an ubuntu install to a tribe CD without having to re-install ubuntu
<sacater> i would prefer to upgrade throught the stages
<Hobbsee> sacater: yes.  dist-upgrade.
<sacater> Hobbsee: ooooh
* sacater checks
<Hobbsee> sacater: but you likely dont want to update to a snapshot.
<Hobbsee> you want to keep going for the moving target.
* sacater bows at Hobs
<sacater> Hobbsee
<sacater> thank yee
<Hobbsee> :)
<jrib> how can I figure out what version of python-support I need to depend on to byte-compile a python module if I know that the module requires python >= 2.3?
<geser> jrib: afaik linda or lintain will warn about the version of python-support if missing
<geser> if you depend on python-support doing the .egg-info renaming, you need to depend on pyhton-support >= 0.6.4
<jrib> geser: thank you
<jrib> I get "dpkg-gencontrol: warning: unknown substitution variable ${shlibs:Depends}" when I try to build my package, why?  Here's what my control looks like atm: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/24878/
<jekil> where i must install a software that must be installet right this: http://rafb.net/p/VUi1nc57.html
<geser> jrib: you don't call dh_shlibdeps in debian/rules?
<jrib> geser: hmm, I
* jrib whacks '
<jrib> I'm using cdbs and have  include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/debhelper.mk  , I think that is supposed to call the dh_ stuff automatically.  Or am I wrong?
<Hobbsee> jrib: in theory, that's true
<geser> you are right
<geser> jrib: aren't you packaging a python app?
<jrib> geser: yeah
<jrib> a module
<geser> ok, a module might need it
<jrib> geser: I tried reading the man page that describes it but wasn't sure I understood it so decided to leave it in.  I think you may be right that it isn't needed though.  The module is pure python
<jrib> interesting... even if I remove it I still see the warning in my pbuilder, must just be a quirk of some kind
<geser> as long as your python module doesn't link against other libs, you can ignore the warning
<leonel> hello hello !
<leonel> keescook: I've upgraded feisty's clamav  to the patched version  on another feisty   and  keeps  failing  with the  bad.rar     But the clamav I've builded with  pbuilder after patchin  and made the  debdiff  works  fine  ..
<nixternal> effie_jayx: I notice you are Kubuntu on your laptop...how come your daughter isn't :)
<effie_jayx> nixternal,  hehe... kde is a killer on that omnibook
<nixternal> KDE is killer on everything!!!
<effie_jayx> i tired it one... and it was just too slow
<nixternal> the only de that I noticed was slow for me ever, was enlightenment
<nixternal> KDE has always been super fast for me, but then again I usually tweak a few things as well
<effie_jayx> well kde would eat up 90 ram for sure...
<nixternal> I don't need all the bling bling junk, it just gets in the way
<effie_jayx> and it only has 128 megs
<nixternal> oh ya
<effie_jayx> mine has a gig so I'm cool for kde
<nixternal> you got Edubuntu on that laptop for her is it just Ubuntu?
<leonel> keescook: the patched and builded here works  fine   and the updated from security  keeps  failing 
<effie_jayx> nixternal,  it's xubuntu with the extra software
<nixternal> ahhh, cool
<effie_jayx> the edu packages...
<effie_jayx> she is one ubuntu freak
<effie_jayx> :D
<effie_jayx> she just doesn't know the name ;)
<effie_jayx> nixternal,  but once I ran a live cd of kurumin... with kde and edu packages on a pentium 1 133mhgz and 256 ram
<leonel> keescook: did I made something  wrong ?
<alefteris> where can i ask some newbe questions about packaging?
<geser> #ubuntu-motu :)
<effie_jayx> and taht would be here :D
<yosch> raphink: ping
<keescook> leonel: I'm not sure; it should be the same results.  Can you email me the "bad" RAR?
<alefteris> what i do when the original source i want to packages is in .zip instead of tar.gz? I convert it my self and continue as usual?
<geser> alefteris: yes
<alefteris> ok thanks
<jrib> my upload to revu doesn't seem to be showing up (uploaded 15 minutes ago)
<bmm> dput gave no error messages?
<Hobbsee> jrib: revu is a bit broken
<jrib> Nope, ended with: Successfully uploaded packages.    Not running dinstall.
<jrib> Hobbsee: ok, so should I just try again some other day?
<Hobbsee> yeah, i think so
<Hobbsee> give it a few days, at least
<leonel> keescook: what's your email ?
<leonel> keescook:  kees@ubuntu.com ?
<leonel> keescook: just  reinstalled  clamav  and all worked  fine ...
<blueyed> I want to provide a debdiff for bug 66278: should I use 0.97-20ubuntu8 or 0.97-20ubuntu7.1 for the version (it's for gutsy)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 66278 in grub "[patch]  update-grub: savedefault can cause problems" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/66278
<Kmos> blueyed: always the latest one
<blueyed> Kmos: it's currently 0.97-20ubuntu7 - my question is how should I increase it in the changelog.
<Kmos> 0.97-20ubuntu8
<blueyed> thanks.
<Kmos> i think it's that
<Kmos> because the version number wasn't changed
<Kmos> yeah, it's 
<Kmos> 0.97-20ubuntu8
<Kmos> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/grub/0.97-20ubuntu7
<sacater> going away for 2 weeks, toodles
<crimsun> bye.
<StevenHarperUK_> Hi : i'm looking for help to get my Python Project into a DEB package, I have made a Setup.py that is making a bdist, but i need to know how is the best way to do the next step
<cypherbios> StevenHarperUK_: have you already read the Debian Python Policy?
<StevenHarperUK_> Can you give me a URL please
<crimsun> http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/python-policy/  and http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy
<cypherbios> that's right
<StevenHarperUK_> I have spent abut 6-7 hours on this
<StevenHarperUK_> Ill read all that then :p
<cypherbios> StevenHarperUK_: it's a good point to start ;)
<StevenHarperUK_> ta
<cypherbios> crimsun: oh, I still having that problem with .mo files, would you take a look at source if I put it into somewhere you can get?
<crimsun> sure
<cypherbios> thanks, I'm going to upload somewhere
<crimsun> I'm a bit scattered this evening - lots of kids running around, so I may not respond immediately
<cypherbios> crimsun: no problem, no hurry
<cypherbios> crimsun: http://www.cypherbios.org/aptoncd/0.1.91-1/
<cypherbios> crimsun: when you have the chance... thanks :)
<jekil> where i must install a software that must be installet right this? http://rafb.net/p/VUi1nc57.html
#ubuntu-motu 2007-06-10
<lionel> man-di: still arround ?
<man-di> lionel: yes, but I found out
<lionel> ok, sorry, I was afk 
<man-di> lionel: when 1.2.23-1 has entered testing I will do an upload to unstable which incorporates all your changes
<man-di> lionel: np at all
<lionel> man-di: you rock :)
<man-di> lionel: perhaps we should think about security updates for feisty and other dists
<man-di> lionel: aka CVE-2007-1860
<ubotu> mod_jk in Apache Tomcat JK Web Server Connector 1.2.x before 1.2.23 decodes request URLs within the Apache HTTP Server before passing the URL to Tomcat, which allows remote attackers to access protected pages via a crafted prefix JkMount, possibly involving double-encoded .. (dot dot) sequences and directly traversal, a related issue to CVE-2007-0450. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2007-1860)
<man-di> lionel: that is a one-line fix
<lionel> ah great, I did not look at the diff (a bit buzzy at work those days)
<Emanon> I'm looking for alpha-testers for a package I'm writing (supposed to work a little like Apple's TimeMachine): http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=469049
<Emanon> Is there a pool of testers for Ubuntu somewhere online? Or is there another way of doing it?
<lionel> Emanon: the best place for finding testers is probabily the forum
<Emanon> lionel: You suggest just trying to generate some community interest?
<lionel> yes
<coNP> Emanon: I think people hanging around in #ubuntu+1 might want to alpha/beta test software :) not that I want to encourage you to off-topic some channel :)
<yosch> hi guys
<Emanon> Thanks guys. But I think it might be a good idea if there was a pool of a few dozen testers to be available for people trying to introduce new packages to Ubuntu - perhaps people that want to help with development but not interested in programming themselves...
<Emanon> hi
<yosch> trying to do my first revu upload and I get a connection refused
<coNP> Emanon: based on the pacakge description people in #ubuntu-server might also be interested
<lionel> Emanon: it's difficult to have a pool of people who are interested in testing all king of software
<lionel> kind
<Emanon> coNP: Sound like a good idea - thanks
<persia> yosch: Do you only have a problem with dput, or can you also not reach http://revu.tauware.de?
<yosch> I'm in ubuntu-universe-contributors, on the wiki page it says loging = anomymous for dput config
<yosch> persia: I can reach the website with a browser
<Emanon> lionel: What if there was a sub-forum under programming where developers could post test requests. That way, those with some willingness might be encouraged to pick and choose what they want to test.
<persia> yosch: Great.  The machine is up, and you can route to it :)  Now, if you ftp to revu.tauware.de directly, can you log in with username "ftp" and a password matching the primary email address on the GPG key you have registered with launchpad?
<lionel> Emanon: that was my idea
<yosch> persia: I get this dput error: urllib2.URLError: <urlopen error (111, 'Connection refused')
<Emanon> lionel: Didn't mean to steal it from you ;)
<yosch> persia: OK, I'll try that, thanks
<yosch> persia: yeah I'm in and I can see the incoming directory
<yosch> persia: should I put my package in there directly then?
<yosch> I'm packaging a nice open font with sources: http://www.levien.com/type/myfonts/inconsolata.html  (I have a Debian ITP on it too, just waiting for a sponsor there)
<persia> yosch: Don't put it there directly: if there are timing issues with your upload, it could break, and require REVU admin intervention to fix.  A manual ftp was just to make sure that your connection worked.  I'd try dput again, making sure to use `dput revu ...`, as I don't see why you should get that error.
<yosch> which makes me ask the following question: is it OK to keep unstable in the changelog? or does it need changing?
<yosch> persia: OK
<persia> yosch: Ah.  The latest changelog entry must target the current Ubuntu development environment, and the version should be an Ubuntu version.  Your statement of "keep unstable" makes me wonder: is this a new package, or an adjustment to an existing package?
<yosch> persia: let's say this package will also be backported to dapper/edgy/feisty?
<jrib> hi, anyone interested in reviewing a python module?  http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5444
<persia> yosch: Backports don't happen through REVU.  If it's in the archives, follow the backport request process (see the wiki) to request a backport.
<yosch> persia: it's a new package the Debian ITP: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=396906
<ubotu> Debian bug 396906 in wnpp "ITP: inconsolata -- Monospace font designed for code listings" [Wishlist,Open]  
<jrib> Also, debuild seems to automatically create debian/pycompat even though the docs for pysupport say it isn't needed
<persia> yosch: OK.  Just wanted to make sure REVU was the right place.  If it's likely to get into Debian in the next couple weeks, it might be easier to wait for a sync.
<yosch> persia: OK, so in my changelog: instead of  (001.006-2) unstable   I'd have  (001.006-3ubuntu) gutsy ?
<yosch> yes I'd rather not have too much of a delta
<persia> yosch: "-3ubuntu1", but otherwise yes.  If you don't want delta, wait for it to get into Debian, and file a sync request.
<yosch> I'm part both of the Debian Alioth and the LP fonts team, and I need to know the best way to handle this
<persia> yosch: Sorry - that's "-2ubuntu1".
<yosch> persia: so keep the current 2 for Debian release and add a sub release number after ubuntu
<persia> yosch: I recommend syncs, because then the package only has to be maintained in one place.  It's only worthwhile generating an Ubuntu version if there are differences between the Debian and Ubuntu packages.
<persia> yosch: Right.  That way, if -3 is published in Debian, and there is no important Ubuntu delta, a sync can be requested.
<yosch> persia: Ok syncs then.
<yosch> hat's the process for asking a sync again?
<yosch> s/hat's/what's/
<yosch> and what's the policy on importing changelog entries into upstream Debian: say an ubuntu devs modifies a synced package, produces a patch, increments the changelog, what do you recommend happens with these added changelog entries in upstream Debian?
<persia> yosch: If it gets published to Debian before 21st June, the sync should be automatic.  If not, it's https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess.  A nice example sync request bug is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/thuban/+bug/114137
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 114137 in thuban "Please sync thuban 1.2.0-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Fix released]  
<yosch> persia: OK, thanks a lot. You've been very helpful :)
<persia> yosch: I've seen several ways of applying Ubuntu changes to Debian, but I recommend something like http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/s/slashem/current/changelog with "Thanks to <Ubuntu person>".
<yosch> persia: OK will do that
<persia> yosch: Of course, only use "sync" when taking all the changes.  "merge" is better when only taking some changes.
<yosch> persia: is the merge process described somewhere?
<persia> yosch: I've never seen any docs for the process to merge Ubuntu changes into Debian.  Generally, Debian maintainers prefer that Ubuntu packagers add patches to the BTS when making changes.  For merging Debian changes into Ubuntu, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Merging
<persia> yosch: If you think documentation for merging Ubuntu changes into Debian would be useful, I'd recommend getting in touch with the utnubu team, and maybe getting something up in the alioth wiki.
<minghua> utnubu project has a mailing list, BTW
<persia> bug 118964 seems to have passed a couple ubuntu-archive runs without processing.  Would someone mind taking a look, and letting me know if I need more information?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118964 in csound "Please drop csound & cecilia from ia64 and amd64" [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118964
<chillywilly> there's no resitricted modules for the Xen kernel?
<chillywilly> if I have a router/firewa/gateway box running Dapper is it ok to go straight to Fesity ;P
<chillywilly> firewall
<chillywilly> or should I go to edgy first?
<Nafallo> chillywilly: edgy first
<chillywilly> I'd like to play with the Xen support
<chillywilly> ok
<octoberdan> Nafallo: Why go to edgy first?
<joejaxx> reduces the chance of breakage? :)
<Nafallo> octoberdan: since dapper -> dapper+2 isn't supported.
<chillywilly> I am sure lots of stuff will break...that box also runs a mail server
<joejaxx> chillywilly: are you sure you want to risk the chance of it breaking with it running so many vital services?
<joejaxx> :P
<chillywilly> joejaxx: it's my home gateway/firewall/router box
<chillywilly> nice, a c++ exception thrown
<chillywilly> courier-authdaemon
<chillywilly> core dumped...
<chillywilly> bah
* octoberdan pats chillywilly on the back
<chillywilly> it's not my fault
<chillywilly> I know I dealt with this before
<statik> hi! I just created my first package, and joined ubuntu-universe-contributors. I've read that the next step is to ask REVU admins to re-synce the REVU uploaders keyring so that I can upload to revu. Anyone around that do this for me?
<crimsun> statik: running.
<statik> thanks
<Hobbsee> crimsun: it's kinda broken - or was yesterday
<crimsun> yeah, he's going to check with newz2000 on Monday
<statik> silly questions is there a tool or script to help format changelog entries?
<ranf> hi
<jmg> debchange
<statik> jmg: thanks
* jmg goes back to trying to ungoatse gutsy
<man-di> good morning
<man-di> when a sync is ACKed, is it done automatically?
<persia> man-di: No.  An archive admin needs to process it manually.  They usually process the bugs once or twice a week.
<man-di> persia: Thx
<tritium> crimsun: the email account on my GPG key is no longer valid.  What's the best thing to do to update it?
<crimsun> tritium: I would use gpg --edit-key D838A341
<tritium> crimsun: and add a new account?  Revoke the old one?
<crimsun> just use the `adduid' option, then use the `primary' option to toggle the newly created one as the primary one, then use the `deluid' option to remove the old one, then `save' and `quit'.
<crimsun> then upload the amended key directly to keyserver.ubuntu.com
* persia thinks 'revuid' was designed for this, rather than 'deluid'.
<tritium> Hmm, okay.  Now, I just have to pick the new primary one.  I've got a yahoo and a gmail account.  All my other addresses are forwarding addresses only.
<tritium> Thanks you, crimsun.
<crimsun> well, yes revuid is useful in this case
<crimsun> I don't use revuid because my accts don't expire; I don't want them disappearing under me
<crimsun> if you mean that your email address no longer exists, then it's a better idea to use revuid
<tritium> I guess it doesn't make sense to add one of my forwarding-only addresses, right?
<crimsun> sure it does
<tritium> Yes, my @purdue.edu no longer exists
<persia> tritium: If you have a forwarding address that you are sure will always exist, it's probably the best choice for the primary key.
<persia> s/key/uid/
<tritium> No kidding?  I thought I couldn't sign anything with a forwarding-only address...
<Hobbsee> *shit*
<tritium> persia: if that's the case, I feel much better!
<tritium> Hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi tritium 
<Hobbsee> bugger.
<persia> tritium: Your key is about identity, not email.  On the other hand, if you can't send masquerading as your forwarding address, you should have your sending address as an alternate uid, or people may not believe you are really you, and instead thing your key has been compromised.
<tritium> persia: thank you.  That clears up some of the confusion I had.
<crimsun> it might be of interest to note that many MOTU use forwarding emails in debian/changelog entries
<crimsun> (and of course, there're @debian.org)
<Hobbsee> presumably there's no way to remove revoked UIDs off the key?
<tritium> I believe gmail may allow me to send masquerading
<Hobbsee> as in, to not show them?
<tritium> (as my forwarding address)
<crimsun> Hobbsee: it's problematic; you need to use revuid and ensure the propagation of the new key
<persia> Hobbsee: Once you've uploaded a key to the keyservers, it's almost impossible to delete anything, and even if it were possible, the keyserver maintainers would try to stop you.
<Hobbsee> crimsun: i've already used revuid, it's showin gas revoked.
<crimsun> yes, that's the extent of it
<Hobbsee> ah right, so you cant actually delete, and not show it on there at all
<Hobbsee> okay then
<persia> Hobbsee: That's by design.  The idea is that if you once used hobbsee@myfavoritewebmail.org, and later stopped, you would revoke the uid.  When someone else starts using that email address, everyone knows it's not you.
* Hobbsee accidently deleted a uid off that she wanted to keep.  not so smart
<tritium> So, I'll use revuid, then.
<Hobbsee> persia: fair enough
* Hobbsee has now readded it
<crimsun> speaking of which, it's about time for that yearly update
<crimsun> expires: 2007-06-26.  Yep, right around the corner.
* Hobbsee has a non-expiring key.
<crimsun> I'm a bit paranoid about it; when I croak, I want it to invalidate automatically.
<crimsun> Takes care of those pesky "premature death" situations.
<tritium> oh, crimsun...
<crimsun> hmm?
<Hobbsee> i suspect that people will *notice* if i get killed.
<crimsun> yes, but will your next of kin revoke your key(s) and upload in a timely fashion? ;)
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> point
<Hobbsee> i'm not sure hwo the ubuntu community would then find out about my death, unless one of them killed me, although i'd expect friends of mine from the ubuntu community to actually say something.  *shrugs*
<tritium> I hope my wife would figure out how to send you all my regards, should I pass away.
<tritium> But, if that doesn't happen, know now that I'd have wanted her to.
<crimsun> I plan to be reinserted into the matrix.  Err, wrong universe.
<Hobbsee> i think it would also be fairly obvious if one of the ubuntu-type people called my mobile, and got told that way.
<StevenK> crimsun: So you attach the Revokation to your will and instruct your executur to make sure that it gets uploaded to a keyserver within 24 hours of hearing about it.
<crimsun> oh, right.
<AnAnt> Hello,
<AnAnt> I am making a package for some software
<StevenK> crimsun: I mean, that sounds sensible to me.
<AnAnt> problem is that the orig. tarball contains binary file, how to deal with that situation ?
<StevenK> Binary how?
<StevenK> Binary as in blob of stuff, or binary as in pre-compiled binary for a specific platform?
<AnAnt> StevenK: pre compiled
<AnAnt> StevenK: for i386
<RainCT> Hi
<persia> AnAnt: Does the program work without that binary, or do you have source to regenerate the binary?
<AnAnt> persia: I have the source to regenerate binary  in the same tarball
<persia> AnAnt: Just delete the binary in the clean: rule.  Leave it in the orig tarball.
<AnAnt> persia: and during build, the binary can be removed using make clean
<AnAnt> ic, ok
<jekil> hello
<tritium> If I've designated a new uid as primary, it has a "*" next to it, correct?
<Hobbsee> that just means "you've selected me"
<Hobbsee> iirc
<Hobbsee> ie, dont do a deluid or a revuid straight after - else it will revoke whatever you've said
<tritium> okay, thanks, Hobbsee
<AnAnt> persia: btw, the clean: rule you meant was in Makefile or debian/rules file ?
<persia> AnAnt: If you're going to tell upstream that the files should be deleted, I'd recommend patching the Makefile, and sending the patch upstream.  If you're having trouble with upstream communication, or upstream doesn't accept patches, use debian/rules.
<AnAnt> ok
<persia> AnAnt: More verbosely: not deleting the binaries in the clean rule is a bug in the upstream build system (everything generated by the build system should be deleted in clean).  Patches are best for upstream bugs.  debian/rules allows one to work around broken upstream, but more people look at debian/rules, so fixing upstream mistakes should only be done there when upstream won't.
* tritium wimps out and uses seahorse rather than cli
<AnAnt> persia: ok, there is a clean rule in upsteam's Makefile that removes the binaries, so I don't need to do anything in debian/rules, right ?
<persia> AnAnt: You need to call `make clean`, but that's recommended by default anyway, so you probably don't have to change it.
<AnAnt> ok
<tritium> Hobbsee: did you use seahorse when you deleted your UID?  I can't find a revuid option in seahorse.
<Hobbsee> no
<Hobbsee> i dont use gnome
<tritium> oh, that's right...
<tritium> okay, got it revoked via cli.  So, I don't want to delete it, eh?
<Hobbsee> deleting doesnt seem to work
<persia> tritium: If you delete it, the keyservers will restore it.
<tritium> okay, thanks, persia
<persia> tritium: For future note, if you ever use keys that are not public, deleting is useful.  It's just the public web of trust that prevents it.
<tritium> gotcha, thanks
<Hobbsee> persia: uploaded x3
* persia notes that the fact that distributed vlc doesn't compile with libflac8 has been added to the issues attempting to be resolved by bug 119016, and that people with pending changes to vlc might want to hijack the bug, as it was intended as a no-changes library rebuild.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119016 in vlc "vlc-nox depends on missing libpostproc0d" [Medium,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119016
<persia> Hobbsee: Enchained will be very happy.
<Hobbsee> yep :)
<persia> Hobbsee: Did you also archive them and send the REVU mail?
<Hobbsee> yep
<Hobbsee> well, almost
<persia> Hobbsee: Excellent.  I won't worry about it then.  Thanks.
<tritium> persia: can you please check my key on https://launchpad.net/~mrimbert, and see if it looks like I did it right?
<persia> tritium: I'm about to run out of time, but I'll glance at it quickly.
<tritium> thanks
<persia> alumni looks to be the default, but I'm out of time.  Sorry.
<tritium> no problem.  thanks
<Hobbsee> persia: right.  done done ;)
<jekil> someone can review please? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5450
<persia> tritium: Sorry about that.  Yes, alumni is default, and purdue is revoked.  You can see a nice report from http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=0x8B9A47A2D838A341
<persia> Hobbsee: Thanks.
<persia> jekil: sure
<tritium> Thanks, persia :)
<jekil> thank you persia 
<persia> jekil: I still like it, but you might want to add a comment in debian/copyright detailing the license of the Debian packaging.
<jekil> persia: ok, thanks
<persia> jekil: If you plan to do that, I'll wait to advocate.  If you are assigning copyright for the packaging to upstream, and want to use their license, I'll hit this upload.
<jekil> persia: yes i do it
<persia> jekil: OK.  Let me know when you have a new upload :)
<jekil> persia: thanks :)
<jamyskis> hi everyone
<jamyskis> hi again persia
<jamyskis> does anyone know the version of liballegro that will be included in gutsy?
<jamyskis> the existing one has the version number appended to the name which is a problem if 4.3 will be included
<jamyskis> i've gotten the error configure-generated-file-in-source config.log from lintian but i can't find config.cache or config.status anywhere
<man-di> jamyskis: rm config.log
<jamyskis> man-di: doesn't exist
<persia> jamyskis: Based on previous upstream history, probably 4.3.1, although past performance is not an indication of future releases.
<jekil> persia: what is the format of the licenso of the debian packaging? Packaging license: blablabla? I can't found an example
<jamyskis> persia: so what should i put in for build-depends because that will affect the liballegro4.2 or liballegro4.3 dependency
<jamyskis> liballegro4.3 doesn't work anyway but if i put liballegro4.2 then gutsy will have problems
<jamyskis> i can't count on there being a transitional package
<man-di> jamyskis: it does somewhere
<man-di> jamyskis: otherwise lintian wouldnt have complained
<persia> jamyskis: For now, use liballegro4.2-dev.  When 4.3 is available, process as a library transition.  Based on the package naming, it looks like 4.2 and 4.3 will both be available in gutsy (unless we're all very busy trying to fix it).
<jamyskis> persia: ok, got it
<jamyskis> man-di: i've done a search twice on anything with config.log config.cache or config.status in the entire upstream source directory (including debian files) 
<jamyskis> there's nothing there
<man-di> jamyskis: perhaps its removed meanwhile
<jamyskis> man-di
<jamyskis> man-di: maybe
<man-di> jamyskis: but its definitely in the sources checked by lintian
<jamyskis> man-di: i've included rm -f config.log in the clean rule anyway
<man-di> jamyskis: e.g. in the *.diff.gz
<man-di> jamyskis: normally you should not need that
<man-di> jamyskis: it only stays when you stop ./configure while its working
<man-di> or when it fails in between
<jamyskis> found em - they're in the upstream orig.tar.gz
<man-di> jamyskis: oh, thats really evil
<man-di> jamyskis: you should tell upstream to remove it for next release
<jamyskis> note to self: remove config.log and config.status for next release
<man-di> jamyskis: you are upstream?
<jamyskis> man-di: yp
<man-di> jamyskis: you are using autotools?
<jamyskis> man-di: yep
<man-di> use "make dist" to create a release tarball
<man-di> this should create a clean tarball
* jamyskis thinks... "32 degrees and nothing to drink in the house"
<AnAnt> are there issues with globbing in Makefiles ?
<persia> AnAnt: Depends on ${SHELL}.  It7s safest to avoid bashisms.
<jamyskis> ok i give up
<AnAnt> persia: is *[^~]  bashism ?
<jamyskis> i think i'll just stick to distributing my stuff in .tar.gz form
<persia> AnAnt: I'm never sure - run `dash` to check :)
<persia> jamyskis: Why?
<AnAnt> ok
<jamyskis> persia: i managed to fix the problem i had yesterday with it installing in /usr/doc from source
<jamyskis> persia: it works fine installing in /usr/share/doc with ./configure make make install
<persia> jamyskis: Great!
<man-di> jamyskis: I dont like to say this but mostly such problem come when upstream has some issues
<jamyskis> persia: but pbuilder insists on installing it in /usr/doc
<man-di> jamyskis: send me your upstream tarball and I can have a look at it: konqueror@gmx.de
<persia> jamyskis: There's probably still something funny with autotools then.  The advantage of having (or being) a maintainer of a debian-style package is that you'll get lots of feedback on how to make a clean tar.gz release.
<persia> Of course, it's easier when someone else is the maintainer :)
<jamyskis> persia: thanks...i'll just take another look through and then i'll send it
<persia> jamyskis: Thank man-di - I'm just blathering :)
<TheDumbo> !seen seveas
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen seveas - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<jamyskis> persia man-di: sorry my bad :)
<jamyskis> man-di: bear with me i'm going to extract the source docs and data and build the anjuta project from scratch
<man-di> jamyskis: take your time
<man-di> jamyskis: I have plenty of other stuff to do ;-)
<persia> Do comments in REVU notify the uploader in any way?
<Hobbsee> no
<persia> Hobbsee: OK.  Thanks.  You don't happen to know where to file wishlist requests for REVU2, do you?
<StevenK> In siretart's head?
<Hobbsee> persia: code is in bzr, i believe.  or siretart can give you access if you're interested in working on it
<StevenK> I wonder if REVU2 would be better done in Rails.
<persia> Hobbsee: Thanks, but I'm not that interested :)
<StevenK> Given mod-python is hell to work with.
<persia> StevenK: Thanks.  I'll file some bugs there then.
<StevenK> persia: Hrm?
<persia> (21:50:46) StevenK: In siretart's head?
<StevenK> Ahhhh
<jamyskis> BLOODY ANJUTA!
<jamyskis> i've just figured out what it was doing the whole time
<tsmithe> StevenK, python is great for web!!
<jamyskis> i had Copying, README, AUTHORS etc. included in the docs section of the project when you're actually supposed to use the ones included in the upstream rootr
<jamyskis> *root
<tsmithe> i use lighttpd with scgi/fastcgi, and a wsgi framework; and it works swell!
<persia> tsmithe: Don't bother.  StevenK actually understands apache :)
<tsmithe> oh darn
* StevenK smirks
<tsmithe> but i'm saying you don't need to use mod-python... or apache!
<tsmithe> i guess you already knew that though
<DarkSun88> Hi
<Hobbsee> hiya
<DarkSun88> Hi Hobbsee 
<jamyskis> persia, man-di: i got it - Anjuta was rewriting the Makefile.am which was installing the docs in /usr/doc/pkgname
<jamyskis> i just locked the overwrite of the top level Makefile.am and it installed from source without a hitch
<jamyskis> in all the right places
* StevenK kicks people who write shell scripts full of bashisms and then call them with /bin/sh.
* jamyskis feels a slight pain on the arse from StevenK.
<Kmos> StevenK: that will have problems with dash
<Kmos> :)
<jamyskis> i made that mistake often enough
<jamyskis> how long do the extended description lines in control have to be again? 60 or 80?
<DarkSun88> Long description 60 lines
<jamyskis> DarkSun88: thanks
<man-di> DarkSun88: I really wonder which packages have long descriptions with 60 or more lines
<man-di> Where can I find an uptodate multidistrotools version?
<DarkSun88> I don't know. Sorry
<persia> man-di: Does `bzrbranchhttp://ox.blop.info/bazaar/multidistrotools/` not work?
<man-di> persia: last time I looked it didnt
<man-di> at least it was not uptodate
<Fujitsu> man-di: http://tiber.tauware.de/~laserjock/multidistrotools/ is pretty much the main branch at the moment.
* StevenK twitches.
<StevenK>   * Use bash to call extract_syms.sh, it's full of bashisms, and worse, was
<StevenK>     pulled from libtool code.
<Fujitsu> Mine might have a revision or two that that doesn't, but most are merged into LaserJock's.
<man-di> Fujitsu: thanks
* persia suggests that updating the wiki would be good.
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Which package?
<StevenK> Fujitsu: libwibble
<StevenK> It's sitting in accepted
<xerosis> hi, i want to do my first package, is it better to do a normal package or a merge at the minute?
<persia> xerosis: What do you want to learn from doing a package?
<xerosis> persia: how to be a packager :p
<man-di> Fujitsu: how am I supposed to download that? wget doesnt want to because of robots.txt
<Fujitsu> man-di: bzr branch
<man-di> Fujitsu: thx
<persia> xerosis: I'd recommend starting with https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=packaging: You'll learn a lot from fixing these issues, and get to see a large number of different ways that packages are packaged, so you can develop a preference for certain styles.
<persia> xerosis: Specifically, a new package is usually hard to start with, and a merge doesn't really teach much packaging, as most of the work is already done.
<Hobbsee> persia: something KDElike is the idea...i just cant really think of anything little that there's to do
<bmm> Any MOTU is welcome to comment or advocate http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5413 .ccbuild has one advocation at the moment.
<jamyskis> persia: the manpage should be called manpage.1 in the debian directory and there should also be a file called manpages which has debian/manpage.1 listed right?
<persia> Hobbsee: Umm.  That's harder, as y'all tend to be good about fixing KDE packaging issues.
<Hobbsee> heh, exactly
<persia> jamyskis: Depends.  In general, yes.  Given your situation, I'd recommend that upstream distribute the manpage and install it directly.
<persia> jamyskis: $(PREFIX)/man/$(Section)/$program.$section
<persia> xerosis: I still believe the best way to learn packaging is to fix other peoples packages, but if you really want to work on a KDE package, you might do best to search for the "needs-packaging" tag instead of the "packaging" tag.  Note that while most of the "packaging" bugs are not KDE packages, much of the software is usable in Kubuntu.
<persia> bmm: That's an excellent request for review.  Thanks for both stating the status of the package and listing the name of the package.
<xerosis> persia: i guess doing non-kde packages isn't too bad really
<xerosis> persia: will have a look to see what i can do
<bmm> persia: thanks
<persia> xerosis: Usually I'd also recommend searching for KDE bugs with easy fixes, and submitting new revisions, but there was recently a massive KDE bug triage effort, and I don't know how many easy ones are left :(
<xerosis> persia: damn efficient people, taking work away from noobs
<man-di> Fujitsu: this version runs on current gutsy?
<Hobbsee> persia: there's still enough, i'[m sure
<man-di> Fujitsu: I ask because I get this: http://paste.debian.net/30101
<Fujitsu> man-di: I haven't tried it in a couple of weeks.
* Fujitsu looks.
<persia> Hobbsee: Is there a tinyURL for the KDE bugs, or a team which has all the relevant packages subscribed?  It'd be nice if xerosis had an easy time searching.
<man-di> I remember having the same problem with lucas' version somewhen in Feisty release cycle
<Hobbsee> persia: xerosis the best i've found is https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-team/+packagebugs
<xerosis> Hobbsee: that's what i've been using
<persia> Hobbsee: Thanks.
<coNP> What command should I use if I want to update a package and have to include binary files (in fact png images) in the diff as well?
<Fujitsu> coNP: You'll have to uuencode them, probably. Why do you need them?
<persia> coNP: build-dep on sharutils, uuencode the files into debian/foo.uu, and uudecode during the build; rule (or some dependency thereof).
<coNP> this seems a bit complicated :)
<shawarma> coNP: It's the only way. Our diffs don't work with binary data.
<coNP> actually I wanted to implement a feature but I might send it upstream
<coNP> and then no need to diff binary files
<jamyskis> persia: i think i finally have a compliant deb package complete with manpage :)
<jamyskis> i didn't include the manpage upstream because it was far more complicated
<persia> jamyskis: Congratulations!  Upload to REVU, and find out whether you're right :)
<xerosis> persia: would https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/blender/+bug/116540 be okay?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 116540 in blender "blender 2.44 package should use python 2.5" [Low,Confirmed]  
<xerosis> persia: oops, just read that it's only at 2.44 in the repos, sorry
<RainCT> debian maintainer field is XSBC-Original-Maintainer?
<persia> RainCT: Yes.
<jamyskis> persia: it's uploaded...does it take a while before it appears on the current uploads list?
<persia> jamyskis: I think it happens every 5 minutes, so if you upload at the worst time, it should be no more than 300 seconds.
<jamyskis> persia: ok i'll grab myself a cup of tetleys in the meantime ;)
<jamyskis> ive just found out i can run lintian on the deb :S
<jamyskis> anyone know the new FSF address?
<jamyskis> never mind i got it
<persia> jamyskis: See the Preparing New Revisions section of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing for recommended flags for lintian and linda (to catch everything).
<jamyskis> persia: right, it's definitely clean now (apart from the invalid distribution complaint because i entered gutsy)
<persia> jamyskis: So, upload and ask for review :) (see above for a good request)
<jamyskis> persia: i'll reupload in a second
<jamyskis> persia: the thing is that lintian complains that my manpage has an error
<jamyskis> although i've used man with it and it works fine
<persia> jamyskis: Does lintian explain the error when you use the recommended flags?
<jamyskis> persia: no
<jamyskis> persia: only when i run lintian on the binary deb
<jamyskis> like the reviewer did last time
<persia> jamyskis: Right.  When you use the recommended flags on the binary .deb, it should tell you what the error is in sufficient detail to fix it.  If not, pastebin the fully expanded error, and ask for help here.
<RainCT> can someone (persia?) please check the debdiff for bug 119683?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119683 in qdacco "qdacco includes no .desktop file" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119683
<man-di> Fujitsu: any idea about multidistrotools?
<persia> RainCT: No need to mention me :)  If I have time, I'll look anyway, and if I don't it just distracts me and delays any review.
<Fujitsu> man-di: No, unfortunately. Seems that python-apt has changed its interface, and I haven't got time to look into fixing it now.
<RainCT> ok sorry
<man-di> Fujitsu: thanks for looking into it
<Fujitsu> I'll probably have a look tomorrow or Tuesday.
<persia> RainCT: Looks OK to me.  It will get picked up as soon as someone who isn't just interested in merges and syncs processes the U-U-S queue.  No need to ask here.
<persia> RainCT: Don't forget to file the bug in Debian, and link to that bug in Launchpad.
<RainCT> yes, doing that now
<persia> RainCT: Sorry.  BTS is slow, I guess I looked too soon.
<RainCT> eh.. does 'bugreport' send bugs to Debian or Ubuntu?
<persia> RainCT: "bugreport"?
<geser> default for reportbug is Ubuntu but you can say it to mail the Debian BTS
<RainCT> sorry, reuportbu
<RainCT> (* reportbug)
<RainCT> geser: how can I do that?
<geser> put "bts debian" in your ~/.reportbugrc
<geser> cp /etc/reportbug.conf ~/.reportbugrc if you don't have already one
<RainCT> ok thanks
<tobiasschulz> is a revu admin inside this channel (im german, so sorry for my english)
<tobiasschulz> ?
<persia> tobiasschulz: Usually, but not always on the weekend.  What are you trying to accomplish?
<tobiasschulz> i would like to upload a package using revu, and on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU?action=show&redirect=REVU  it says "Next, ask the REVU admins in #ubuntu-motu or at  keyring@tiber.tauware.de to re-sync the REVU uploaders keyring, which grants you upload rights to REVU."
<tobiasschulz> but if there are no admins, i will try it tomorrow again
<persia> tobiasschulz: OK.  If an admin is around, they'll probably start a sync soon (most read backscroll, even if they are away a bit).  If not, I think the keys are sync'd automatically each night (CET), so it should be fine by tomorrow, even if nobody gets to it now (although that's not ideal for you).
<tobiasschulz> ok thank you
<jamyskis> i think im going to scream
<jamyskis> i now have to start from scratch because the arch-indep data is far too big
<jamyskis> and i need to create two seperate packages for it
<persia> jamyskis: Not from scratch.  You only need two binary packages.  This isn't too hard.
<jamyskis> persia: two folders with the same upstream but with different rules files? 
<persia> First, add a new Binary: section at the end of debian/control for naughts-and-crosses-common (or whatever your package name is + "-common".
<persia> jamyskis: Nope.  One upstream, one rules file, etc.  Just two binary packages.
<jamyskis> persia: ok...i'm reading
<persia> Set the architecture of the -common package to "all"
<persia> Make the regular package depend on the -common package.
<persia> Rename debian/manpages, debian/install, etc. to debian/packagename.manpages, debian/packagename.install, etc.  (only for the debhelper helper files).
<jussi01> good evening everyone :D
<persia> Hi jussi01
<jussi01> hello persia
<persia> Add debian/packagename-common.install, and list all the arch-independent data there.
<persia> This should give you two packages, with the right contents.  There's likely a bit more tweaking required, but linda & lintian should help (and I don't remember off the top of my head).
<jamyskis> persia: i don't have a debian/install file
<persia> jamyskis: That's OK.  If you don't have it, you don't need to rename it :)
<jamyskis> persia: will it ignore the architecture independent stuff then when it builds naughts-and-crosses?
<man-di> Fujitsu: I have got it to work now with replacing "mtd bin2src ..." with some grep-dctrl magic.
<man-di> Fujitsu: but the output looks really simplistic to what lucas generated at http://tiber.tauware.de/~lucas/versions/java.html
<Fujitsu> man-di: What command are you using to generate it now?
<man-di> the srcpkg file?
<Fujitsu> What does the output you get look like?
<persia> jamyskis: My memory is that it will move everything you install into -common out of the base package.  Let me find you a doc.
<man-di> its just a list with source package names
<Fujitsu> You need to run it through mdt compare-versions and mdt versions2html or so.
<man-di> Fujitsu: http://paste.debian.net/30111
<man-di> Fujitsu: thats what I do
<man-di> Fujitsu: my current script is http://paste.debian.net/30112
<Fujitsu> "mdt compare-versions sid gutsy | mdt filter ../lists/science-all | mdt removals removals.txt A | mdt versions2html -t "Science package" -d -u -a Sid -b Gutsy > science.html" is what I use.
<Fujitsu> man-di: What does the generated .html have in it?
<man-di> Fujitsu: lucas version e.g. has links to patches.ubuntu.com and to bugs.launchpad.net
<Fujitsu> I believe there are some options to versions2html that do that.
<Fujitsu> Options: -d, --debian-links               Include Debian-related links in the output -u, --ubuntu-links               Include Ubuntu-related links in the output
<persia> jamyskis: http://wiki.debian.org/PkgSplit is the clearest I could find about it.
<Fujitsu> Bah, I am being told I must go to bed now.
<man-di> Fujitsu: good nite and thx for your help
<jamyskis> persia: i think i've sussed it
<jamyskis> persia: thanks
<jamyskis> i hope i'll be able to get my second game done quicker next time
<jamyskis> this has taken the best part of three days
<persia> Anyone seeking Membership and want more linkable stuff for their wiki page?
<jamyskis> thanks for all the help persia
<persia> jamyskis: As you become familiar, it becomes easy.
* man-di wonders about libgnuinet-java which is 1.1.1-1 in unstable and 1.1.1-2 in gutsy
<jamyskis> persia: ok, i have a naughts-and-crosses-common deb file which is 4K and a naughts-and-crosses file which is 324K (the same as the original)
<jamyskis> persia: somethings gone astray
<persia> man-di: sync'd from experimental
<man-di> persia: aah, right, that makes sense
<persia> man-di: Easiest way to check is to look at the Ubuntu changelog, either on LP, or on an Ubuntu system (or chroot) with `aptitude changelog foo`.
<man-di> persia: yes, I know. I just looked at the output of multidistrotools without more checking and wondered
<persia> man-di: `aptitude changelog libgnuinet-java` is fewer keystrokes than "/me wonders about libgnuinet-java which is 1.1.1-1 in unstable and 1.1.1-2 in gutsy" :)
<polopolo> hello, can someone help my me with setting my gpg in launchpad?
<persia> polopolo: Where are you stuck?
<polopolo> wait, psb
<polopolo> is Passphrase password???
<persia> polopolo: Depends on the tools you used to generate your key.  Passphrase is the secret phrase you entered when generating your key.
<RainCT> yes
<polopolo> So I can type my password?
<polopolo> ?
<jamyskis> brb just getting food
<polopolo> nobody as the answer?
<persia> polopolo: When creating your key, you were asked for a secret phrase.  Do you remember what it was (don't tell me)?
<polopolo> nevermind, it already done, wait for the next problem
<polopolo> ok, when I getting send my code to lanchpad, I get a problem
<polopolo> it says Ie not uploaded already to ubuntu
<polopolo> When I do it
<persia> polopolo: Did you already sync your key to the keyserver?
<polopolo> no, I do it now
<polopolo> I do it, but no massage
<polopolo> then I go back and enter the same
<polopolo> Then it says it not on the server
<polopolo> that the problem
<persia> polopolo: Can you find your key when you search from http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/?
<polopolo> Error handling request: No keys found
<polopolo> That the error I get
<persia> polopolo: When you uploaded your key to the keyservers, which keyserver did you use?
<polopolo> today, keyserver.ubuntu.com
<persia> polopolo: Hmmm.  For some reason it's not there (or your search terms don't work).
<polopolo> I searched with my fingerprint
<persia> polopolo: Try searching with your name.
<polopolo> There it
<polopolo> but the old one, not the new one
<persia> polopolo: Do they have the same email address?  Is the old one valid?
<polopolo> the old one as the old email I do not use anymore
<persia> polopolo: Do you still have the secret key?  You can change the email address on the key.
<polopolo> no, I don, it was on my remove partition
<polopolo> BTW, i see now this on the error of lanchpad
<polopolo> Keys sometimes take up to an hour to be synchronized between servers.
<polopolo> maby wait?
<persia> polopolo: Maybe, but usually if you upload to a speciific keyserver, the key should be on that server.  Check again in an hour, and if that doesn't work, paste the ASCII-armour'd version of your public key on the search form to force it.
<polopolo> ok, I wait a hour, thank you, I go make further with my package
<persia> gnomefreak: Is something still happening with bug 55782?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 55782 in kxdocker "doesnt open in edgy" [Medium,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/55782
<gnomefreak> persia: dont know im not the one working on it but last i checked it didnt work
<persia> gnomefreak: I just haven't seen the assingee in a while, and you were the reporter, so I thought you might know.
<gnomefreak> persia: i wish i did. edgys should work from what i have heard but feisty didnt (not sure on gutsy i havent installed it yet
<persia> gnomefreak: The package hasn't changed since edgy, so it's probably still broken.  I'll assign to noone, and ask for someone to generate a gutsy fix then.  Perhaps after that's done, a SRU can be considered.  Thanks.
<gnomefreak> thank you
<persia> gnomefreak: If you have some spare time, and want to respin the patch, I'd be happy to get it uploaded fairly soon.
<polopolo> ohyeah, https://help.ubuntu.com/6.06/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/basic-scratch.html must be updated, some things are wrong here
<gnomefreak> persia: if not ill do it this week. but i would like to see what he did first
<persia> gnomefreak: The patches are in the bug :)
<gnomefreak> oh nice :)
<beuno> can anyone clarify to me the difference between "universe" and "multiverse"?
<gnomefreak> mulyiverse holds nonfree packages
<persia> gnomefreak: ping me if it doesn't get sponsored in a reasonable amount of time.  3 releases is too many to have an outstanding patch :)
<gnomefreak> persia: ok ill try on gutsy tonihgt or tomorrow
<persia> gnomefreak: Thanks.
<gnomefreak> thank you for looking at it :)
<persia> gnomefreak: We're slowly improving.  Soon, UUS reviews should be within a week or so.
<gnomefreak> persia: im tempted to agree with the post before yours
* persia looks again
<gnomefreak> Additionally, kxdocker appears dead. As of April 23, 2007, the project is now XQDE...
<beuno> gnomefreak: THANKS
<gnomefreak> no sense in adding it to gutsy (keeping it in)
<gnomefreak> if someone wants to build XQDE than i say go for it
<gnomefreak> grabbing to build feistys
<gnomefreak> beuno: yw
<persia> gnomefreak: I'm not really familiar with the package.  If you think so, please reject this bug (with the appropriate comment), and open a new bug to remove it from Ubuntu.  It's probably a good idea to get the replacement in first :)
<gnomefreak> well im gonna work on feistys build for it and ill file another bug but i cant close this one until feisty is fixed but i will comment on it
<persia> gnomefreak: OK.  There's a bit of a procedural issue, that we're only supposed to SRU things that are fixed in gutsy.  If it is to be fixed in feisty, it needs to be fixed in gutsy first, even if the plan is to drop the package after the archive-admins approve the SRU.
<gnomefreak> ok thats fine ill spin it in gutsy too than file bug :)
<persia> gnomefreak: If you'd like the fix in feisty, don't open the drop bug first :)
<gnomefreak> hmmmm
<gnomefreak> persia: im leaning towards saying screw it for feisty. is it really worth it since it has been same version for 3 releases
<gnomefreak> no upstream fixes
<persia> gnomefreak: It's your bug, so it's your call.  If you decide it's not worth it, just retract (reject) the bug with a comment.  If one of the other subscribers really wants it, perhaps they can help get it done.
<persia> (and reopen it)
<gnomefreak> would this be a backport canidate?
<persia> gnomefreak: Which?  The bugfix, or XQDE?
<gnomefreak> xqde
<persia> gnomefreak: If it builds on edgy or feisty, probably.  If it needs new libraries, probably not.
<gnomefreak> ok well lets get one thing at a time done :)
<persia> coNP: When requesting sponsorship, it's a good idea to review the sponsors queue guidelines at the top of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Sponsorship/SponsorsQueue to make sure that it will be accepted.
<StevenHarperUK> Hello : could a MOTU please re-sync the REVU uploaders keyring, so I can have upload rights to REVU?
<gnomefreak> persia: should i subscibe anyone to the drop request of kxdocker?
<persia> gnomefreak: You've decided not to fix it in feisty then?  From your comment to the bug, I thought you planned to get an SRU out.
<coNP> persia: thanks, now should I ask someone to mentor?
<gnomefreak> persia: i updated it
<persia> coNP: No need.  If you've met all the criteria listed in "Notes for Contributors", subscribing the sponsors is sufficient.
* persia looks at kxdocker again.
<gnomefreak> makes no sense to me that after 12 months no upstream updates. the project doesnt look all that great from thier links
<coNP> thanks persia I guess everything is fine
<gnomefreak> but that doesnt stop it from getting in
* polopolo still does not understands why his key is not on keyserver.ubuntu.com
<persia> gnomefreak: I'm caught up now.  Sounds good.  To get sponsorship for a drop, it's the same as sponsorship for anything else.  Before asking for sponsorship, I recommend getting in touch with the Debian maintainer.  They may agree with you, and make a package of xqde, and it's a lot easier to get a drop approved by the archive-admins when there's a RoM removal request outstanding in Debian.
<persia> gnomefreak: Separtely, drops are easier when the replacement is already packaged and distributed in Ubuntu, as then there's a guarantee that there's no loss of functionality, without waiting for someone to get around to packaging the new software.
<polopolo> persia, what do you mean with ascii, how can I do it?
<persia> polopolo: gpg --export --armor should generate some pasteable text for you (I think).
<polopolo> aha
<polopolo> add, thank you very very much
<polopolo> :D
<StevenHarperUK>  Hello : could a MOTU please re-sync the REVU uploaders keyring, so I can have upload rights to REVU?
<persia> StevenHarperUK: It appears that nobody who can is around right now.  I believe it syncs automatically each night, and many of the people who can read backscroll, so it may also be manually synced based on your last request.  There's no need to repeat yourself.
<StevenHarperUK> Roger that
<jonek> hi, I have problems with the package em8300-source. is here the right place to ask questions about it?
<persia> jonek: Are you attempting to use the package, or patch it?
<jonek> persia: use it - which seems impossible or at least very difficult on feisty - so I would like to help improve it
<persia> jonek: I understand.  I stopped using it with dapper.  If you have questions about how it works, #ubuntu is your channel.  If you are trying to patch it, and need help making a new package, this is the right place.  For help with changing it, I recommend upstream - my memory is that they are fairly responsive and helpful.
<polopolo> Can someone help my with the following problem?
<jonek> persia: is an ubuntu specific bugzilla available for the em8300-source package?
<polopolo> I  get the error
<polopolo> ackage name "gVerse" is not in a valid format.
<polopolo> Debian policy manual states:
<polopolo>   "Package names must only consist of lower case letters, digits (0-9),
<polopolo>    plus (+) or minus (-) signs, and periods (.)"
<jonek> persia: do you mean debian by upstream?
<geser> polopolo: what's the software name you want to package?
<persia> jonek: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/em8300, but you might be interested in http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?src=em8300 as well.  Upstream is http://dxr3.sourceforge.net/
<jonek> persia: thx
<polopolo> geser: gVerse
<geser> you need to use gverse as package name
<geser> the orig.tar.gz needs also use gverse
<polopolo> sorry, I have to eat
<StevenHarperUK> Hi : i'm trying to make a Source package, my project is in Python, what's the difference between a source package and a binary one if its a Python based package?
<StevenHarperUK> Oh, and what's the point of providing a binary package if its in Python?
<geser> the source package contains as shipped by upstream (usually a tar.gz, tar.bz2, etc.) and the binary package contains the files as they end up after compilation and installation
<StevenHarperUK> Ok so I have a tar.gz made by my Python setup.py
<StevenHarperUK> how do I make that into  adeb source package
<geser> the binary package installs the executables to /usr/bin/, the data to /usr/share/, the man pages to /usr/share/man, etc.
<geser> a source package is the upstream archive (orig.tar.gz), Debian/Ubuntu changes (files in debian/ and modifications of upstream code) as diff.gz and a .dsc glueing both together
<StevenHarperUK> Ok : Im the author of the Source.tar.gz : I have that bit made
<StevenHarperUK> How do I make a Debian Source from that
<geser> !packagingguide
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
<StevenHarperUK> I also have the final Package made : the bit im stuck on is the Source deb
<geser> it's not a source deb, the source package contains of 3 files: the orig.tar.gz, the .diff.gz and the .dsc file
<StevenHarperUK> Rigth
<StevenHarperUK> so whats a sdc?
<StevenHarperUK> ***dsc?
<geser> if you have everything set up to build a binary deb correctly, you also get the source package
<StevenHarperUK> Thats the problem I dont think I have
<geser> the .dsc file contains the md5sum of the .orig.tar.gz and the md5sum of the .diff.gz and some meta information
<StevenHarperUK> Im using dpkg-deb to make the deb
<geser> it gets generated automatically during building
<statik> hi, i did my first upload to revu last night, a new package called python-coverage. I don't see it showing up on http://revu.tauware.de/, should it?
<StevenHarperUK> is dpkg-deb the right tool to use?
<geser> not really, it is very, very low-level, you don't normally call it yourself
<StevenHarperUK> Oh I have got it working with that
<geser> the normal way is to use debian/rules and dpkg-buildpackage (or debuild)
<StevenHarperUK> Yes but I don't have a rules file..... as its Python there's no compile
<geser> dpkg-deb is used by the tools which help you at building the package
<geser> but you have to copy the files to the correct location (e.g. setup.py install) which is also done in debian/rules by the install target
<persia> statik: It should show up within about 5 minutes.  When it doesn't you should ask here why it didn't.  Are you a member of ubuntu-universe-sponsors?
<geser> pick a python package which is similar to yours and look there how the packaging is done
* persia notes that http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy may also be helpful.
<statik> persia: I joined last night, yes. I think I got some of the details wrong on the source package that I uploaded, like the distro series in the changelog.
<StevenHarperUK> I am finding that there is a lack of complete documentation on all This Packaging
<StevenHarperUK> Making my App was easier
<StevenHarperUK> which is wrong
<persia> statik: Did someone sync the keyring since you joined? (I don't know your timezone, so "last night" doesn't tell me enough)
<statik> persia: yes, I asked for a sync about 9 hours ago, and crimsun started one
<StevenHarperUK> geser : if I get a source package (python based one) will that have all the structre and files I need?
<geser> yes
<geser> you get a unpacked upstream tar.gz with a debian/ dir. The important files for you are in debian/
<StevenHarperUK> Basically you just call my setup.py  file to do the install : thats teh standard
<StevenHarperUK> So that will go iin the Rukes file?
<geser> persia: I remember Hobbsee have problems with keyring syncing yesterday (timeout or something) but I don't know if it got resolved.
<StevenHarperUK> **rules?
<persia> statik: Most of your package appears stuck in incoming, and your source.changes was rejected.  I'm not sure why.  I think you need to have the files deleted before you can upload again.
<persia> geser: Yes, but REVU is working for some people.  I don't understand why (or why not).
<geser> StevenHarperUK: as that it's common cdbs (a packaging tool) has a ready plugin for it
<statik> persia: that makes sense, I've learned more in the last few hours and fixed several things in the source package (and even tested in a pbuilder). Do you know how I could get the files deleted so I can upload a new source package?
<persia> statik: Someone has to delete them manually.
<statik> persia: ok. is this something that I should send an email request about, or does it get handled automatically? (and thanks for all the help!)
<persia> statik: It gets handled by asking here.  It's Sunday in most parts of the world, and those who tend to fix it aren't very active right now.  If you don't hear from someone else, try asking again tomorrow.
<statik> persia: perfect, I'll do that. thanks again!
<beuno> what's the policy on uploading packages from Ubuntu to Debian with patches from Ubuntu?
<shawarma> Bump the debian version and just upload it, I suppose.
<shawarma> IANADD, but I don't see what else there is to do.
<persia> beuno: To get an official answer, you'd need to ask someone in Debian.  Ubuntu prefers that patches are applied in Debian.
<shawarma> beuno: Removing the "ubuntuX" part from the version string in the process of course.
<beuno> what's the policy on uploading packages from Ubuntu to Debian with patches from Ubuntu?
<shawarma> ?
<shawarma> Um..
<persia> beuno: Personally, I like it when Debian maintainers do something like http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/s/slashem/current/changelog
<shawarma> Bump the debian version and just upload it, I suppose.
<shawarma> IANADD, but I don't see what else there is to do.
<shawarma> beuno: Removing the "ubuntuX" part from the version string in the process of course.
<shawarma> this is going to be a long day. :)
<beuno> persia, shawarma, these are new packages that aren't in Debian
<beuno> (I'm add the debconf, btw)  :p
<shawarma> beuno: Ah. That did not become much more obvious when you asked the exact same question the scond time :)
<persia> beuno: I believe best practice is to file an ITP and contact the utnubu team.
<beuno> shawarma: I didn't get that answer, they're still playing around with the APs
<beuno> persia: I already have a sponsor, already pacakged it, and already have the ITP
<beuno> I'm just wondering on how to handle the work done on the initialy packaging done in Ubuntu
<persia> beuno: Then it gets uploaded.  It should follow Debian policy (Debian versions, dedicated maintainer, etc.), but otherwise Ubuntu doesn't impose anything.  Thereafter, Debian should become the default source of new upstreams, etc.
<beuno> as in acknowledgeing it
<beuno> great then, I'll dedicate my next 2 weeks here to packaging Ubuntu apps into compying with Debian plicy and uploading them  :D
<persia> beuno: Ah.  In debian/copyright, leave the "This package was originally debianized by J. Random Hacker", and in the Debian Packaging is copyright foo section, list the original packager.
<beuno> persia: right, that's the answer I was looking for, thanks
<persia> beuno: TO clarify, something like "The packaging is (C) 2003-2005 Enrique Roblefo Arnuncio <era@debian.org>, 2007, Emmet Hikory <emmet.hikory@gmail.com> and is licensed under the GPL, see above.", except the other way around.
<persia> beuno: Just a note; you probably don't want to put everything back in Debian.  There are a number of packages that have been separately packaged for Debian (with different names) and should be removed from Ubuntu.  There are also a number of packages that don't integrate well, or don't provide new functionality.  My memory is that Debian prefers to only have the best two or three apps for each function, and prefers integration.
<jamyskis> hi everyone...am back
<jamyskis> persia: did you catch the problem i was having earlier on with two deb packages (naughts-and-crosses, naughts-and-crosses-common) being created but only naughts-and-crosses actually containing the stuff?
<polopolo> Can someon help my package a program with debhelper like gVerse
<persia> jamyskis: Sorry, I missed it.  Could you pastebin debian/naughts-and-crosses-common.install?
<jamyskis> persia: sure hold on
<jamyskis> persia: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/25011/
<beuno> I'm having trouble packaging with CDBS, the Ubuntu docs aren't clear on how to actually build the package (http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/basic-cdbs.html)
<persia> jamyskis: Ah.  You need a destination :)  Where are the files supposed to end up?  Also, is this the entire contents of the data/ directory?
<jamyskis> persia: with the exception of Makefile, Makefile.am and Makefile.in yep :)
<jamyskis> persia: can you post the format in the pastebin?
<jamyskis> persia: the problem is that some of the graphic files are a little big
<jamyskis> persia: im working on way to compress them without resorting to yet more libraries
<persia> jamyskis: It's "source destination" for each line, space delimited.  Drop the initial / from the destination.
<RainCT> I've a (a bit off-topic) question: I'm writting a Python application with many .py files, but only of them should be executed directly. So, would the main .py go to /usr/bin and the others to /usr/include/<program name>, or what?
<persia> jamyskis: Also, you can use globs, so "data/*.bmp usr/share/naughts-and-crosses-common/" would work.
<jamyskis> persia: ok got it thanks :)
<geser> RainCT: yes, but /usr/share/<packagename>
<daschl> hey guys, someone packaging-related here? :)
<persia> jamyskis: geser ha just reminded me, you probably want "usr/share/naughts-and-crosses" (no -common).
<RainCT> geser: ok, thanks. will Python automatically search there if I make an import or how to I write it?
<persia> daschl: Very much so.
<jamyskis> persia: good timing, i'd just finished debuild -S -sa and was about to build the binary :)
<daschl> persia, hey. i found a problem here https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ruby-defaults/+bug/50480 and someone told me that this is very packaging-related, so i decided to come up with this issue here
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 50480 in ruby-defaults "Reported version is incorrect" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
<persia> daschl: Just to make sure I understand, this is a wishlist request for a no-changes version bump?
<daschl> persia, i dont know what you are talking about, this is my first "bugfix" on ubuntu.. 
<daschl> persia, but: yes, i think so.. the version numbers are inconsistent!
<persia> daschl: OK.  To rephrase.  The request is to change the version of the package, but not anything els about the package?
<daschl> persia, yes.
<jamyskis> ok...here's hoping that this time it's right
<daschl> jamyskis, do you mean my request?
<jamyskis> daschl: sorry, no...i meant that i've been at trying to build a ubuntu repo compliant deb for the past three days and there's always been something wrong
<jamyskis> daschl: but we've almost got it sorted
<daschl> jamyskis, i c :D
<persia> daschl: I don't think we want to fix that in Ubuntu without coordination with Debian.  You might be intersted in looking at debian bug 359810 as a possible link for your bug.
<ubotu> Debian bug 359810 in ruby-defaults "ruby-defaults: please use less confusing package versionning scheme" [Wishlist,Open]  http://bugs.debian.org/359810
<daschl> persia, why is this important? (really, im interested :))
<jamyskis> persia: didn't work
<persia> daschl: If we bump the version in Ubutu, and Debian uploads a newer package with new fixes, we won't be automatically notified, which means the fixes might take a long time to get to Ubuntu.
<daschl> persia, oh, so it would be good if debian and ubuntu cooperate and bump the version together..
<persia> daschl: Exactly, or to change the version scheme for ruby-defaults so it is less confusing.
<daschl> persia, so what can i do?
<persia> daschl: You could contact Ukai-san, but the Debian bug is a year old without response, so you shouldn't expect much.  You could also point the Ubuntu bug submitter to the Debian bug, and apologize for the confusion, but that doesn't fix it.
<jamyskis> persia: i forgot to put the last / in
<jamyskis> in the install file
<jamyskis> don't know if that would make a difference
<persia> jamyskis: Ah good.  I've been digging in http://wiki.debian.org/PkgSplit and not seeing anything that would explain the issue :)
<daschl> persia, thx, brb
<jamyskis> persia: didn't make a difference
<jamyskis> if you'd like i can .tar.gz the entire folder if you'd like to take a look
<persia> jamyskis: Better for me would be for you to upload the (broken) package to REVU, as I'm to bed very soon :)  Maybe someone else will see it quickly.
<jamyskis> its fine...im just about wound up with it for today anyway
<jamyskis> i can carry on tomorrow
<jamyskis> because i think i'll end up smashing my keyboard in if this plays up any more
<jamyskis> the debian lot really need to look at how this lot works because there really is no need for debian packaging to be this complicated
<jamyskis> thanks for all your help persia :)
<RainCT> is there any path where default config files are stored (if the users hasn't it's own)?
<persia> RainCT: /etc/<packagename>
<RainCT> thanks
<jrib> would anyone like to review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5444http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5444, a python module?
<jrib> (you only have to review it once :P)
<jamyskis> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5454 <-- could someone take a look and find out why my attempts at creating split packages are resulting in everything going into one and nothing in the other? thanks
<jamyskis> anyone there?
<lionel> jamyskis: probabily:)
<jamyskis> lionel: was just curious because it went dead
<lionel> it's week-end, people are sometimes afk
<jamyskis> lionel: you're capable of reviewing packages aren't you?
<lionel> I'm not sure I have reviwer rights, and I have to go in few min. Could you drop me a mail?
<jamyskis> lionel: no worries...i'll leave it until tomorrow
<jamyskis> i've been trying to package something for three days now and somehow it always doesn't meet ubuntu repo requirements
<jamyskis> i'm pretty much at the point now where i'm about ready to give up and just continue hosting it at my repo
<lionel> keep trying to get your package in
<lionel> it will nice for Ubuntu to have the package, and nice for you to learn always more
<lionel> I know sometimes it can be frustrating to be reviewed
<jamyskis> lionel: the problem is less the reviewers and more the fact that the debian lot neglected any kind of usability when they designed the package creation system
<jamyskis> if they simplified the process of creating packages there might be more submitted
<man-di> jamyskis: its complex, but when you are used to it its very flexible
<jamyskis> man-di: maybe, but there needs to some kind of interface that sacrifices some of that flexibility for ease-of-use for beginners
<jamyskis> man-di: maybe a GTK+ GUI :)
<jamyskis> man-di: otherwise beginners just get swamped in the dozens of files and options
<man-di> jamyskis: you are free to write such a tool ;-)
<jamyskis> man-di: i was actually thinking about it but i need to know how the packaging system works first :)
<man-di> jamyskis: I guess its easier to just learn all the files then writing such a tool
<man-di> jamyskis: I do debian packaging since several years
<jamyskis> man-di: true, most people write stuff that they themselves would need and once they know what they need to write such a tool, they don't need a GUI anymore
<man-di> and I think such a GUI would be even more complex to use then just using a text editor to edit some files
<jamyskis> man-di: that's the problem, the motivation to solve a lot of problems
<jamyskis> i disagree - it depends on how you design the GUI
<man-di> and there are always different ways to solve some issue
<man-di> the GUI need to cope with all the different ways
<daschl> i think the gui should only help during the first steps, not the whole way :) .. after some time you surely switch to CLI 
<jamyskis> if you provide a user the means to select a PGP key and design the file structure that would be ample for beginners...it sacrifices the flexibility but is sufficient for most
<jamyskis> daschl: you are right, of course
<jamyskis> but a GUI would be a good start
<jamyskis> i used synaptic almost exclusively at the start before i got to know how apt-get works
<man-di> jamyskis: dh-make creates a good first skeleton, IMO
<daschl> jamyskis, i agree with you. but i dont have the knowledge and skill to write such a gui .. and i really wonder that theres nothing out there
<jamyskis> daschl: then maybe that's something i'll bring up
<daschl> jamyskis, it would be great if i can assist you during the development progress, so i can learn it all from scratch 
<jamyskis> daschl: i was considering learning and using glade for it
<daschl> jamyskis, well i played around with gtk+ (especially ruby-gtk) 
<jamyskis> daschl: too advanced for me :)
<jamyskis> daschl: maybe wxWindows though
<jamyskis> sorry wxWidgets
<daschl> jamyskis, gtk+ is really easy! do you know any programming language quite well? 
<jamyskis> daschl: i'm reasonably proficient in c++
<jamyskis> still have a lot to learn
<jamyskis> but i program my games in it
<daschl> jamyskis, well.. you can have a look at the c++ bindings for gtk, but i prefer Qt for the moment.. it rocks :)
<jamyskis> no experience with "serious apps" though
<jamyskis> daschl: will do :)
<jamyskis> actually if this is to become part of ubuntu wouldn't learning python be a better option and doing it in that?
<jamyskis> python has gtk+ bindings
<daschl> jamyskis, Qt really kicks ass.. i needed a gui for a network device configurator and i tried gtk+ first, but then i looked at Qt and i changed the whole app :)
<juliank> Hi! Can somebody please upload the merged revision of ndisgtk (0.7.2-1ubuntu1) to universe? http://jak-linux.org/projects/ndisgtk/pkgs/ndisgtk_0.7.2-1ubuntu1.dsc (also at REVU)
<jamyskis> daschl: i do like qt (and kde) but the whole look and feel of it is spoiled under gnome
<daschl> jamyskis, i dont agree with you .. have you ever looked at amaroK for example?
<polopolo> hello
<jamyskis> daschl: not yet
<jrib> polopolo: hi
<jamyskis> polopolo: hello
<polopolo> Is it a problem if I use http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/ch-start.en.html to make my .deb?
<polopolo> for ubuntu
<man-di> polopolo: thats in fact the recommended way
<man-di> polopolo: debian and ubuntu packaging is basically the same
<polopolo> ok
<man-di> polopolo: there are only some nuances that are different
<polopolo> version numbers I alreadt knows
<daschl> jamyskis, look here (amaroK under Gnome) .. my desktop: http://www.netfux.org/Screenshot.png
<daschl> jamyskis, of course, only original cds ripped with "abdce" :)
<jamyskis> daschl: you have your kcontrol well set up but you can recognise it isn't native :)
<daschl> jamyskis, it is native.. i didnt change anything!
<jamyskis> daschl: i mean the theme settings with qt are seperate from gtk+
<daschl> jamyskis, yes they are separate, but what you see here is default :) .. i installed amarok at my girlfirends pc (gnome feisty) and nothing looked different
<jamyskis> daschl: exactly...but if a user starts playing around with fonts and themes but doesn't know the difference between gtk+ and qt then you end up with something like this: http://www.jamyskis.net/Screenshot.png
<jamyskis> oops
<daschl> jamyskis, looks ugly :p
<jamyskis> daschl: i rest my case :)
<jamyskis> that's not my theme by the way
<daschl> jamyskis, xD
<daschl> jamyskis, i c
<jamyskis> i just did it to make a point hehe
<daschl> hehe
<_Enchained> hi
<_Enchained> Can someone remove this package from REVU please : http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5252
<lionel> man-di: just for your information bug #119739
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119739 in libapache-mod-jk "libapache-mod-jk is vulnerable to CVE-2007-1860" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119739
<man-di> lionel: yes, I saw this in my mail already
<man-di> lionel: thx for taking care of this
<lionel> man-di: no pb!
<man-di> lionel: should this be fixed for edgy, feisty and pre-dapper too?
<lionel> I have just added patch for Dapper, Edgy, Feisty
<lionel> (pre Dapper is not supported any more)
<man-di> lionel: okay, thx
<man-di> lionel: I have uploaded new version to unstable too, this can be merged to gutsy
<RainCT> jamyskis: I've tried out Open Invaders but it didn't start up but let my PC at 640x480 resolution. Then when I pressed Ctrl + Alt + Backspace the PC restarted :S. I'll sue you ;P
<lionel> man-di: yeah, I have seen on devel-changes, thanks!
<jamyskis> RainCT: that's the first I've heard of that...especially since the game uses 800x600 natively
<jamyskis> did you just try to use the package in MOTU?
<jamyskis> its broken
<RainCT> jamyskis: well then it was 800x600, fact is everything looked very big and I saw only like 1/3 of the screen
<RainCT> jamyskis: I compiled the source from your web
<RainCT> (and I don't know if it outputed something since the terminal window wasn't on my screen anymore, it was at the bottom :P)
<jamyskis> RainCT: try starting with open_invaders -w
<RainCT> jamyskis: well, not today :P
<jamyskis> RainCT: Not feeling brave enough ;)
<RainCT> jamyskis: I'd, but I don't what happened that Ctrl + Alt + Backspace restarted and I don't want to wait for it to restart again :P (well, I could just go to Ctrl + Alt + F1 and restart from there, but anyways.. perhaps tomorrow)
<jamyskis> RainCT: it sounds like something is not right with your X server or video drivers
<jamyskis> RainCT. do you have a 3D driver installed?
<RainCT> jamyskis: no, I don't even think my video card has 3D.. It has just 8MB memory xDD
<jamyskis> RainCT: interesting...
<jamyskis> RainCT: could you do me a favour and type lshw >hardware.txt and then send me the contents of that file?
<jamyskis> RainCT: I'd be very interested to know what part of the game caused the comp to crash
<RainCT> jamyskis: as root?
<jamyskis> RainCT: doesn't need to be
<jamyskis> RainCT: works as normal user
<_Enchained> Is there a revu admin here ?
<_Enchained> (to remove a package)
<RainCT> jamyskis: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/25025/
<jamyskis> RainCT: to the best of my knowledge you do have 3D capability (i810 driver) although in this case that doesn't matter because OI doesn't use hardware acceleration
<jamyskis> RainCT: but i'll see if i can find someone else i know with this graphics card and see if i can reproduce the problem
<jamyskis> RainCT: thanks for the heads up
<RainCT> jamyskis: okay. ping me tomorrow if you want and I'll try again
<RainCT> going to bed now
<jamyskis> RainCT: okey-doke good night
<jamyskis> im off to bed too
<jamyskis> good night everyone
<RainCT> good night
#ubuntu-motu 2008-06-02
<Seeker`> If I want to get started with packaging stuff, is it ok to do it on a VirtualBox guest system running 8.10?
<persia> Seeker`: Well, excepting that 8.10 doesn't exist yet, yes.
<Seeker`> persia: ok, ubuntu in virtualbox using the intrepid repos
<persia> Seeker`: That would be a reasonable way to test things.  Note that you may find it frustrating when handling your keys, but this oughtn't matter while you get started.
<persia> Eventually, I expect you'll find working with local chroots easier, although it took me months of experimentation after I was packaging regularly to determine the setup that worked for me.
<nxvl> Seeker`: or a chroot environment (i.e pbuilder)
<Seeker`> I was going to have a go at this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/115288
<nxvl> Seeker`: you can also work on hardy, but at the end test it using a chroot environment
<emgent> morning
<persia> Seeker`: For new packaging, you really want to be in the development environment, to get the right toolchain, etc.  In general, I recommend bugfixing prior to packaging, as it's a lot easier to learn packaging bit-by-bit while fixing bugs, rather than all at once.
<Seeker`> persia: anything in particular where you recommend starting?
<persia> Seeker`: Depends on what you like.  Searching for the bitesize or packaging tags on LP might be a good place.
<persia> If you are familiar with debugging, looking at the apport crashes to dig out small fixes from stacktraces could work.
<persia> If you're good with build systems, looking at the FTBFS list on qa.ubuntuwire.com might be a good place.
<persia> There's heaps of packages with lintian errors of varying importance.  Some (like missing intepreter, missing manpage, etc.) are fairly easy, and interesting to fix.
<Seeker`> hmm
 * Seeker` may wait for the next "packaging 101"
<persia> Seeker`: What interests you.  I'll help you find your first bug.
<persia> Also, feel free to ask questions here anytime.  People may be slow to answer, but they ought eventually.
<Seeker`> I've not really done any packaging stuff before, so I'm not really sure
<persia> Seeker`: OK.  Have you done coding or debugging before?
<Seeker`> I've just finished a CS degree, so I have done quite a bit of coding before, but only really on assignments (not any publicly released software or anything)
<nxvl> persia: btw, did you think i'm ready or near to be ready for applying for MOTU?
<persia> nxvl: I'd have to review and check.  Best to wait until several people sponsoring your changes tell you to apply: this gets better testimonials and helps you identify sponsors for your MOTU application (as opposed to sponsors for your fixes).
<nxvl> persia: yep, that's what i'm waiting for, just asking :D
<persia> nxvl: I recommend just keeping on with what you're doing, and the day will come.  At that point, it won't really matter to you very much.
<nxvl> yep
<nxvl> that's what i also think
<Seeker`> persia: did you see my reply?
<persia> Seeker`: Yep.  Just hunting a bug for you.
<persia> Seeker`: Why don't you take a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kerberos-configs/+bug/179142
<persia> Solving this requires a bit of research into the right format for the configuration file, some thoughts about how it might work, a small text change, and some testing.  It ought be a good way to get familiar with the process, and start working with a package.
<persia> Don't forget to assign yourself and set "In Progress" if you're going to work on it.
<Seeker`> persia: ok
<Seeker`> persia: from the looks of it, that field is required in the configuration file, and the example here: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Samba/Kerberos uses "Example.com"
<persia> Seeker`: Yep.  It's pretty clearly a bug.  It just needs someone to figure out how to get the right solution, and set it up.
<Seeker`> persia: looking here: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kerberos-configs it looks like it has already been fixed possibly
<persia> Seeker`: I'd recommend verifying that.  If it is indeed fixed, then just mark it Fix Released with a comment reporting your research and the results.
<persia> Seeker`: I chose if from the list at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=bitesize : You can try finding another one there that nobody ha started yet.
<Seeker`> persia: as its 4am, I reckon i'll have a look for something else tomorrow. Thanks for the hlep.
<persia> Seeker`: Thanks for closing a bug :)
<Seeker`> :)
<Seeker`> hmm, think I found another non-bug
<persia> Seeker`: The more of those that can be closed, the better.  We've lots of bugs, and not enough people closing them.  Thanks a lot for helping.
<Seeker`> persia: can you have a quick look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/230865
<Seeker`> In the code for the program, it says:   parser.add_option ("--dist-upgrade","--dist-ugprade", action="store_true", which makes me think that the 2nd option was deliberately added
<persia> Seeker`: Quite possibly there used to be a -u or something, which is now gone.  I'm not sure.
<Seeker`> persia: if that were the case, the "-u" would just be removed, not replaced with "--dist-ugprade". I think that it may be deliberate to catch a typo
<persia> Seeker`: Ah.  Right.  --distugprade.  I suspect you are correct.
<Seeker`> shall I close the bug? or just comment that I  dont think it is a bug?
<persia> Seeker`: Hard to say.  Depends on how strongly you feel about it.
<persia> If you think catching the typo is good, set "Won't Fix", and explain why.  If you think the extra option should be removed, submit a patch.
<persia> Note that in the case of update-manager, where there is source locally managed in Ubuntu in BZR, patches as branches are appreciated over patches as debdiffs (although this is a rare exception for packages in general: there are maybe 30 packages of this style)
<Seeker`> ok
<Seeker`> i've just left a comment for now - see if it gets any response
<persia> Seeker`: Remember to subscribe to the bug if you want to see the responses.
<Flannel> Gaaaah.  What would be wrong with apt-cache policy shows something, but you can't apt-get it due to no install candidate?
<Hobbsee_> Flannel: something that you installed whe nit did exist, but doesn't still exist.
<Flannel> Hobbsee_: No, theres no current install.  Here, I'll show.
<Flannel> http://dpaste.com/54272/
<persia> Flannel: Candidate: (none) tells you there's nothing available to install (although it may be referenced).
<Hobbsee_> even though it's on the version table.  strange.
<Flannel> Yeah, and thats a fresh update
 * Hobbsee_ does an upgrade
<persia> Flannel: Try a purge for it, as 5.0.24a-9 likely oughtn't be there.
<Flannel> persia: Its an upgrade, and... let me bring in the person who's actually having the issues.
<persia> Looks to me like it got pinned too high, and then removed, and now it can't upgrade, and can't install.
<Flannel> jb0t, meet persia, he's got an idea.
<jb0t> hi.. i'm all ears :)
<persia> jb0t: Did you even pin or hold mysql-common?
<jb0t> persia: no
<persia> jb0t: Hm.  My idea is incorrect then.  Do you have a .deb in /var/cache/apt/archives ?
<jb0t> ha. so frazzled, i started typing commands in this window.  one sec
<jb0t> persia: http://dpaste.com/54276/
<persia> jb0t: Delete /var/cache/apt/archives/mysql-common_5.0.24a-9_all.deb and try again.
<jb0t> same error
<persia> jb0t: Got me then.
<wgrant> Has purging been tried?
<jb0t> no.  but its not installed.
<jb0t> afaict
<wgrant> Does it have a config left over, though?
<wgrant> dpkg -l mysql-common
<jb0t> http://dpaste.com/54277/
<jb0t> seems to
<wgrant> Aha.
<wgrant> So it knows of an old version.
<wgrant> sudo apt-get remove --purge mysql-common, and hope it forgets about it.
<jb0t> http://dpaste.com/54277/
<wgrant> sudo apt-get purge mysql-common
<jb0t> same error
<wgrant> Bah.
<jb0t> ahh
<jb0t> !!
<jb0t> install -f actually removed it this time
 * wgrant hates intermittent ACPI faults.
<jb0t> ugh.  still no luck.  won't install.  can't remove or purge, and still shows the conf on dpkg -l mysql-common
<jb0t> wth is going on here
<jb0t> oh. was removing my failed attempt on the .deb install i guess
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hi ajmitch
<Hobbsee_> oh noes, it's ajmitch
<ajmitch> where?!?
<StevenK> ajmitch: In a mirror!
<ajmitch> now that's a scary though
 * Hobbsee_ points.  there!
<jb0t> wgrant: i backed up /var/lib/dpkg/status and proceeded to remove mysql-common.  it (seems to) no longer thing its installed, but same errors on install attempts both with apt-get install and dpkg .deb
<jb0t> *think
<Hewus> Hi, quick question. Does anyone know why myspell-en-au is in universe, while the other three myspell-en-* are in main?
<bimberi> Struth mate, is it?  Stone the crows!
<Hewus> Stone the crows? Haven't heard that one..
<wgrant> Neither have I, fortunately.
<bimberi> Ah, you younguns :)
<norsetto> howdy dowdy
<RAOF> Man, that's what I call a backtrace.  #94 0x0000000000430030 in main ()
<pwnguin> hah
<RAOF> Nearly breaks the magical 100 functions on the stack.
<norsetto> huats !!!
<huats> norsetto !!!
<huats> already awake ?
<huats> ;)
<norsetto> norsetto !!!!
<RAOF> (When you die with 100 functions on the stack you get a plaque)
<norsetto> huats: heck, its holiday here today :-)
<huats> ;)
<huats> hum
<persia> RAOF: Which bug?
<huats> I understand now :)
<RAOF> persia: epiphany-webkit is not particularly stable on gmail.com :)
<persia> RAOF: Ah.  No, I suppose not :)
<RAOF> Let us combine unfinished code with serious browser-side javascript.  What could _possibly_ go wrong? ):
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> OOoh, it's deterministic!  Awesem.
<persia> At least the combination explains the depth of the stacktrace.  Running Javascript within the Javascript container within Webkit within GNOME...
<RAOF> About >50 of those functions were within libwebkit, too.
<persia> norsetto: Quick explanation: components are supposed to be self-including, so universe can depend/build-depend on main, and multiverse can depend/build-depend on universe.  For an example of a split package, see lshw with part in main and part in universe (and source in main).
<persia> (also, mythbuntu is a multiverse derivative, rather than a universe derivative)
<norsetto> persia: so, the answer is no, a multiverse source cannot have a binary in universe
<persia> norsetto: Right.  Well, it could technically, but it would violate the current semantics.
<norsetto> persia: yes, I understand its not a technical problem
<huats> persia: hello
<slytherin> Can someone please give back libvte-java?
<dholbach> slytherin: best to ask in #ubuntu-devel - more archive/buildd admins are hanging out there
<persia> dholbach: We can all do it now :p
<persia> slytherin: Do you have a build failure URL?
<norsetto> dholbach: also motu can now :-)
<dholbach> oh... OH!
<RAOF> Awesome.
<dholbach> :)
<RAOF> (for those playing along at home, the dbg symbols for webkit are 50mb)
<slytherin> persia: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/14854649/buildlog_ubuntu-intrepid-powerpc.libvte-java_0.12.3-5_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz It is failing on powerpc, sparc, ia64 while it has built on i386 and amd64. Looks like wrong timing.
<persia> slytherin: Giving it back where it failed.  For future reference, the URL that is useful when requesting a give-back is https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+source/libvte-java/0.12.3-5 (or https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libvte-java/0.12.3-5/+build/620720 if you only need one)
<slytherin> persia: Ok.
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<sebner> hoi sistpoty|work
<sistpoty|work> hi sebner
<sebner> sistpoty|work: when is the next MOTU meeting so I can mail the fridge folks ^^
<sistpoty|work> sebner: should be regular schedule, I guess?
<sistpoty|work> sebner: so 13th, 20 UTC
<sebner> sistpoty|work: thanks =)
<sistpoty|work> np
<norsetto> all heil sistpoty|work
<sistpoty|work> hi norsetto
<sebner> sistpoty|work: hmm, heil? xD
<sebner> morning norsetto
<norsetto> sebner: your excellency
<sistpoty|work> oh, heh... well yes. I guess I shouldn't react to "heil" *g*
<sebner> haha
<sebner> cody-somerville: thanks =)
<sebner> norsetto: first thing is to add a new stanza in debian/control? http://paste.ubuntu.com/16371/
<norsetto> sebner: ok, make this "
<norsetto> This package offers
<norsetto>  SSL-Support for eggdrop.
<norsetto> oh s*e
<sebner> ^^
<sebner> ha!
<sebner> I'm not *that* dumb =)
<norsetto> sebner: make the final line of description a different line
<norsetto> sebner: and chage the short description
<sebner> norsetto: how different should the final line be?
<norsetto> sebner: no, its me the dumb who doesn't paste text correctly
<norsetto> sebner: a separate line
<sebner> norsetto: http://paste.ubuntu.com/16372/ ?
<norsetto> sebner: note that the two packages should conflict with each other, it shall not be possible to install both at the same time
<sebner> norsetto: a versioned conflict or just on the package?
<norsetto> sebner: nope, it really has to be a self-standing line
<sebner> norsetto: ah k. I'll show when I added the conflicts field
<RAOF> Am I right in remembering that there was a bug in a pkgconfig file which made most of gnome uselessly depend on libffi4, with the added bonus of making a whole lot of stuff uninstallable?
<sebner> norsetto: also a "Replaces" ?
<norsetto> sebner: why a replaces? I suggest you look at how other packages handle binaries with files in same locations ...
<norsetto> sebner: and think as well what will happen when you upgrade from previous versions ...
<sebner> norsetto: ok ok
<rzr> asac: hi
<rzr> asac: do you know http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NetFront ?
<asac> rzr: not yet. does it ship its own engine?
<rzr> i guess yes, since it seems to be closedsource
<rzr> asac: http://www.accessdevnet.com/index.php/ACCESS-Linux-Platform-Native-Development/Inside_ALP.html
<rzr> see the 1st image
<ruiboon> hi. how do i know if a package is using dpatch or cdbs? (trying to pack in a bug fix)
<persia> ruiboon: It could be using both.  You can tell if it is using CDBS because it will Build-Depend: on CDBS in debian/control and #include some CDBS rules in debian/rules.
<persia> ruiboon: You can tell if it uses dpatch because it will likely mention dpatch in debian/rules, and all the patches in debian/patches will be in dpatch format.
<ruiboon> persia: i was told that it is using dpatch by u-u-s but then there is no dpatch include nor debian/patches
<persia> ruiboon: Which bug?
<ruiboon> persia: bug 234365
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 234365 in unison "Place unison.log file in ~/.unison" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/234365
<norsetto> ruiboon: what-patch tells me it is using dpatch
<norsetto> ruiboon: and indeed it is a bd and is in the rules file too
<ruiboon> norsetto: i guess i have to create my own debian/patches directory and files then
<ruiboon> norsetto: the rule file didnt mention dpatch though
<norsetto> ruiboon: no need, dpatch-edit-patch will do that for you
<norsetto> ruiboon: include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/dpatch.mk
<ruiboon> norsetto: oops. i missed that one
<ruiboon> norsetto: thanks (:
<norsetto> ruiboon: thank Luca ;-)
<norsetto> ruiboon: in the future you may want to use what-patch, a utility which is in ubuntu-dev-tools
<ruiboon> norsetto: that will certainly be useful. (actually it is already installed but i just didnt discover it)
<ruiboon> norsetto, persia: Thanks again (:
<emgent> morning \sh
<emgent> :)
<\sh> is it morning or is it the hell after linuxtag 2008
<persia> \sh: Can it be both?
<\sh> persia, dunno..but what I know is, we hacked the bordcomputer of a mercedes C class without using computer technique last night...we had luck to not be killed from a stupid driver on the highway
<\sh> 160 km/h on the left lane..this stupid guy was pulling over from right to left and good that sput was reacting fast enough to brake...ABS + ESP were working great...
<emgent> gh
<\sh> after that, bordcomputer said: "Dear Driver, you don't have ABS, you don't have ESP and I really don't know what's your driving speed anymore...better to park this broken expensive car somewhere and wait for help"
<emgent> hahahaha
<\sh> without driving speed and some sensors ... our board navi refused to work, too...so we were waiting for almost 4 hours for a new car to get home
<\sh> planned ETA at home: 18 UTC....real time at home: 1am UTC...
<Iulian> Hey
<mpt> What's the procedure for asking for a program to be packaged? I've read <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU> but it doesn't seem to cover that.
<slytherin> mpt: file a bug
<dholbach> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<\sh> mpt,  wishlist bug, tag it as "needs-packaging"
<mpt> ok, thanks :-)
<mpt> ah, already reported, bug 94494
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 94494 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] Songbird" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/94494
<slytherin> persia: You forgot to give back libvte-java on ia64
<persia> slytherin: OOps!
<yannick> Hi, does someone knows how apt-ftparchive can handle 2 flavors of ubuntu (e.g. hardy and gutsy) ?
<persia> slytherin: given-back
<slytherin> persia: thanks, powerpc and sparc builds have completed already.
<slytherin> persia: It will be great if you give back libglade-java also - https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libglade-java/2.12.8-5
<persia> slytherin: Given back.
<Hobbsee> heh.  other people getting bugged for givebacks.  yay!
<persia> Hobbsee: Main is still all yours :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> yes, but there's less of that
<Hobbsee> persia: it goes without saying that you're using buildd.py?
<\sh> uh we have new semi-archive-professionells ;)
<persia> \sh: Yep, like you.  Go visit a failed-build page.
<Hobbsee> \sh: they should be able to do new packages reviews at some point, too
 * persia thinks that's exceedingly dangerous
<Hobbsee> persia: yes, well.
<\sh> oh...that's why I was in a somewhat unstable state of mind...to not deal with LP...I really had forget about LP...
<\sh> wow...but I think LP ants could improve the UI ;)
<yannick> Hi, can apt-ftparchive (or dpkg-scanpackage) knows to which distro a .deb belong?
<persia> yannick: Not directly.  There's the Origin: header, but it's often ignored.
<yannick> persia, i've .deb, some belong to hardy and some to gutsy, using apt-ftparchive result in mixing them either into hardy, either into gutsy. Do you know how I can solve this?
<persia> yannick: Create two separate archives, one for gutsy and one for hardy.  Alternately, look at a more powerful tool that supports pool.
<yannick> persia, do you know such tool (supporting pool)?
<persia> yannick: Sorry.  Not off the top of my head.  I don't tend to keep more than two or three packages in a private repo, and then only for an hour or so while testing something.
<yannick> persia, ok, thank you very much
<nxvl> morning :D
<persia> yannick: Actually, I do have a word of advice: dak is larger and more complicated than you need.
<yannick> persia, I thinnk I'll wrote a bash script to discard gutsy packs while I run apt-ftparchive for hardy, and then discard those for hardy when i'll run apt-ftparchive for gutsy. Hopefully I've a naming convention for my packs including the distro name in it.
<persia> pochu: The size of freepats is precisely the issue.
<persia> I'd prefer libwildmidi to depend on freepats, but it makes gstreamer-bad really heavy.
<persia> This is especially annoying to the vast majority of people who don't actually every use .mid files.
<fredreichbier> hello. i found a bug in the git ubuntu package, where do i report that?
<slytherin> fredreichbier: launchpad.net
<fredreichbier> slytherin: there is no git entry in launchpad. should i report it on launchpad.net/ubuntu?
<slytherin> fredreichbier: yes that is what I meant, under ubuntu project search for package git
<fredreichbier> ah, sorry. thank you!
<persia> In the special case of git, I believe the package is named git-core (unless this is an issue with GNU Interactive Tools)
<fredreichbier> however, the bug has already been reported by someone else ;-)
<mterry> Question re: LP #207437 -- the patch is upstream, so it will be included in intrepid, so I figure no need to provide intrepid debdiff, and the change doesn't seem important enough for hardy.  Do I just do nothing more there?  (in terms of being a good MOTU-in-training)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 207437 in cheese "Hildon only:  Cheese crashes when using menu items About, Quit" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/207437
<persia> mterry: Not directly, as it won't crash in the default installation.
<white> Marco Rodrigues here?
<persia> white: he's not allowed to talk here.
<persia> white: He goes by Kmos: try /query
<white> not allowed to talk here? -v?
<white> he just reassigned a few bugs to my packages without checking/looking over them
<white> wasn't really the nicest thing to do :)
<persia> white: That's why he's not allowed to talk here.
<Hobbsee> white: if he's acting on ubuntu stuff again, after being asked to stop doing all development, tehn you'll probably need to whine to the MC.
<persia> Well, it depends on what is done.
<persia> We'll listen, but we may not be the appropriate parties to do much
<white> Hobbsee: wow, that is quite a statement, he must have been quite ...
<Hobbsee> white: it took many months to get rid of him.  the motu ML and motu-council mailing lists have the juicy details, including a stamp from mark.
<Zelut> Is there a way to have pbuilder use my local mirror during & after pbuilder creation?
<persia> Zelut: pbuilder --login is the easiest way to explain (but doesn't handle creation)
<Zelut> persia: I can get it to use it via --othermirror (for post installation), but can't figure out creation..
<Hobbsee> !pbuilder
<ubottu> pbuilder is a system to easily build packages in a clean chroot environment. To get started with PBuilder, see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<Hobbsee> Zelut: follow ^, and modify /etc/pbuilder/apt.config/sources.list before creating the pbuilder.
<mok0> sebner, yo!
<jpds> dholbach: cool packaging video
<schmiedc> jdps which video?
<schmiedc> jpds*
<jpds> schmiedc: http://www.jonobacon.org/?p=1190
<schmiedc> thx
<jpds> you're welcome.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<Iulian> Hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hi sistpoty|work, Iulian
<schmiedc> hi
<dholbach> jpds: I'm glad you like it
 * jpds hugs dholbach 
<schmiedc> :)
<schmiedc> de vid is super
<effie_jayx> dholbach,  ping
<dholbach> effie_jayx: pong
<effie_jayx> dholbach,  I started working on a merge on saturday and since you were one of the initial maintainers of it I was wondering If I could ask you a couple ofsimple q's about it
<effie_jayx> if you have the time of course
<dholbach> effie_jayx: which package is it? sure
<effie_jayx> bakery2.4
<dholbach> alright
<dholbach> effie_jayx: shoot :)
<effie_jayx> dholbach,  it seems there is a new version in debian. and there are several differences in packaging. with regards to dependecies I am a bit lost. what could help me determine if the deps are ok for ubuntu as well?
<effie_jayx> name changes...
<mok0> eeek I can't get sound on that video...
<dholbach> effie_jayx: the debian package generally looks good but the biggest problem I see right now is that there's libbakery-2.4-common vs libbakery-common
<effie_jayx> dholbach,  aslo I am unsure about the changes that originated the merge in the first place.
<effie_jayx> right
<dholbach> effie_jayx: we packaged it before Debian did and started off from bakery2.3
<effie_jayx> dholbach, mmkey. that clears that.
<dholbach> effie_jayx: libbakery-common is the better name (would need a conflicts/replaces)
<effie_jayx> dholbach,  ok, any other comments ... I think I can do this...
<dholbach> effie_jayx: the depends look good to me on first glance
<effie_jayx> dholbach,  version numbers is what got me jittery
<dholbach> effie_jayx: it might be worth trying to build a package that build-depends on libbakery-2.4-dev (prefixsuffix or glom maybe)
<dholbach> effie_jayx: thanks for stepping up to do the work :)
<dholbach> effie_jayx: I haven't checked to closely but for now the package naming change is one thing we definitely need to keep ( probably until the next LTS :-( )
<effie_jayx> dholbach, trying hard to keep up ;)
<dholbach> effie_jayx: if you need any more help with it, let me know
<effie_jayx> dholbach,  keep the name then
<dholbach> that'd be even a bigger diff :)
<\sh> dholbach, cool video btw
<effie_jayx> dholbach,  ok.. I'll start with it and shall email if anything comes up... thanks for the input
<effie_jayx> dholbach,  is that ok?
<dholbach> effie_jayx: absolutely
<dholbach> effie_jayx: and thanks for that
<dholbach> \sh: thanks for the flowers :)
<effie_jayx> dholbach,  thanks for?
<dholbach> effie_jayx: taking care of the merge :)
<effie_jayx> dholbach,  thank me when it's done... hehehe
<dholbach> hehe
<schmiedc> are there any other vids for people who decider about getting involved?
<sebner> dholbach: *n *i* *c* *e*
<\sh> dholbach, jono mentioned it on friday...and I'm wondering if we are able to do those videos "live"...(with chats during the live feed and as well interacting with other people (when they have a cam attached)) too :))
<dholbach> \sh: it would be nice to get more videos on there - also localised ones
<dholbach> schmiedc: expect more to come up soon
<sebner> \sh: uhhh /me has a build-in webcam =)
<Hobbsee> ack, videos.
<Hobbsee> pictures are bad enough!  :P
<schmiedc> dholbach:cool
<\sh> dholbach, I promised jono to present a software for doing those liveshows via browser ... it's what I'm working on in my company...
<dholbach> sebner: MOTU Videos in "Austrian" FTW! Yoohoo! ;-)
<dholbach> \sh: oh great
<sebner> dholbach: lol. "carinthian" :P
<schmiedc> sebner: Styrian :P
 * sebner hides xD
 * schmiedc follows
<Zelut> can anyone give me some feedback on my package in REVU? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=origami
<mok0> I propose that Contributing Developers be allowed to request syncs directly to ubuntu-archive
<siretart> mok0: I object to that proposal. strongly.
<mok0> siretart: why is that?
<siretart> mok0: you didn't provide a rational either - please do first ;)
<Hobbsee> mok0: i also object strongly to that proposal.
<mok0> I think it's a small privilege, and ucd's have gone through an approval process
 * Hobbsee thought revu was a priveledge.
 * mok0 is not talking about revu
<siretart> mok0: the priviledge is equal to the uploading priviledge. I don't see how it would be less than (full) upload access
<mok0> siretart: how so? It is processed by an archive admin
<Hobbsee> mok0: who should not have to figure out if all changes should be dropped.
<mok0> I don't want to argue strongly for the point, I'd just like to understand your position
<sebner> mok0: huhu. mok0. \o/ thanks =)
<Hobbsee> siretart: it's slightly less - everything there's gone thru debian.  mind you, that's no guarentee on quality, at times.
<mok0> Well, this is what should be examined when somebody applies for ucd
<mok0> siretart: it is definitely much less than upload privs
<siretart> mok0: the archive admins do not review the ubuntu changes and evalute if it was safe for the delta to be dropped. If they did that in the past, that would be a saftey bonus, but nothing to rely on
<sebner> mok0: I asked for the right to change the wishlist and it would be a long process to allow that ... ^^
<siretart> moreover, lp will offer an UI so that every upload can request syncs without archive admin intervention
<Hobbsee> sebner: be a part of -bugcontrol?
<sebner> Hobbsee: that's not the same ;)
<mok0> Hobbsee: and it practice it's not possible
<siretart> mok0: I fear that debian maintainers will use that feature to undo divergence in the ubuntu branch of their package. I've seen enough pointless and wrong request for syncs in the past
<Hobbsee> sebner: why?
<mok0> Hobbsee: they don't process the list of applicants
<Hobbsee> mok0: around UDS, or at all?
<Hobbsee> mok0: if they don't, you should poke bdmurray about it.
<Hobbsee> and/or heno
<sebner> Hobbsee: because a lot people see the universe group a step near MOTUship and this right isn't that big compared to mok0s sync right.
<siretart> mok0: why should syncing be 'less' priviledge than regular upload priviledges? - considering dropping previous work is a hard decision from time to time!
<ScottK> Sync right is exactly the same as upload rights.
<siretart> and I really don't expect random contributors to be able to do that assessment
<mok0> siretart: I don't have your experience, but the syncs I have seen have been very straightforward
<Hobbsee> ScottK: excluding the fact that it's been thru debian QA.  which doesn't necessarily mean that any QA was actually done on it (see -games, etc)
 * ScottK is seriously considering advocating we push new contributors away from merges and leave them to the more experiences.
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Right, but it give the ability to land code in the archive.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: oh, sure.
<ScottK> mok0: Many of them aren't.
<Hobbsee> mok0: specifically for you, i've seen various questions which have been rather elementary, which you either got wrong, or didn't know the answer to, so i'm not sure that something so 'elementary' as sync requests would be a good thing for you to touch, without a sponsor checking, anyway.
<sebner> ScottK: I'm against it pushing me away from syncs and merges ;) (courier ?)
<Hobbsee> but that's learning for you - i'm sure you'll slowly learn, and be given more privs as a result.
<siretart> mok0: boy, this merge and sync buisness is hard work and definitly not an beginners task. I agree with ScottK that we should take newcomers away from that work. it is way too error prone and very hard to undo.
<mok0> I everyone is opposed there is no point for me to push it any further. I thought it would be good to offer ucd's additional privelges to ordinary contributors...
<Hobbsee> mok0: such as?
<mok0> Hobbsee: such as what?
<Hobbsee> (apart from the sync requests)
<Hobbsee>  I thought it would be good to offer ucd's additional privelges to ordinary contributors...
<Hobbsee> hence, such as?
<mok0> Hobbsee: the right to process a sync
<mok0> Hobbsee: but not to upload
<mok0> After all, they are approved by MC.
<Hobbsee> mok0: the MC doesn't touch them.
<ScottK> sebner: You haven't just started.
<mok0> ... and the handfull we have now are quite capable
<sebner> ScottK: hmm?
<mok0> Hobbsee: surely, MC approves UCDs?
<ScottK> sebner: I don't think you're the beginner I was suggesting should be pushed away from merges.
<siretart> mok0: can you please point me to the criteria under which the MC approves new members?
<soren> mok0: I'm not sure why we'd want to grant syncing privileges to more people than we grant upload priv's to?
<mok0> sebner: weren't you evaluated by MC?
<sebner> mok0: yes
<ScottK> mok0: Yes, MC approves, but not based on technical criteria.
<Hobbsee> mok0: oh, that they do.  but they don't get approved based on the criterias of whether something is good to upload, changes can be dropped, it's suitable to do it at this time, etc.
<siretart> ScottK: I wasn't sure, but I expected that
<Hobbsee> OTOH, mok0 is not exactly a beginner, either
<sebner> ScottK: Ahhh, I thought that you mean that only the beginners should do merges and syncs ^^
<ScottK> sebner: No.  I think the shouldn't.
<mok0> My suggestion is that UCDs continue to do merges but can push a sync to ubunut-archive
<sebner> ScottK: understood
<Hobbsee> mok0: suggestion examined, and denied :)
<mok0> heh
<sebner> Hobbsee has the power \o/
 * Hobbsee has the stick...
 * sebner hides
<siretart> mok0: my suggestion is that UCDs should not consider working on merges at all
<jpds> long live the pointy stick \o/
<mok0> My suggestion has the merit of gradually increasing responsibility towards MOTU status
<Hobbsee> siretart: why, if they're eventually going to go for MOTU?
<Hobbsee> mok0: if you can upload one section of code directly to one component, why shouldn't you be able to upload any other sections of code to that component?
<siretart> Hobbsee: there is tons of less error prone work in ubuntu to work on.
<sebner> ScottK: no time for courier? I'm curious what you are saying in the end also because you told me somthing about the "example" courier
<soren> mok0: I'm not sure why syncing should have a lower barrier of entry? It's just as intrusive as a regular upload?
<Hobbsee> siretart: oh, sure, but i thought these guys were going for universe unlimited upload rights
<ScottK> sebner: I ended up being out of town unexpectedly almost steadliy since UDS.
<siretart> Hobbsee: sure. but I think working on existing packages gives you way faster the experience in packaging than working on merges in the first place.
<mok0> soren: not really. A sync has already been processed by the DD. In a merge, you can introduce terrible things
<siretart> I may be wrong, of course
<\sh> a sync can also break things...terribly
<soren> mok0: syncs can do quite terrible things, too.
<sebner> ScottK: ah ok then, sry for annoying =) (Just curious about for final opinion on me ^^)
<ScottK> mok0: But a sync has been processed by a DD for Debian.
<ScottK> sebner: No problem.  The reminders are good.
<sebner> ScottK: I'm waiting if you have finished with courier ;)
<emgent> hello
<Hobbsee> siretart: true.  althouhg of course, when they get up to possible MOTUship, they'll be wanted to have exposure to all of it.
<sebner> hi emgent
<emgent> ScottK: have you saw about wordpress backport?
 * white gets the popcorn out
<Hobbsee> siretart: but i see your point
<ScottK> emgent: No.
<ScottK> emgent: Bug?
<emgent> just a moment
<Hobbsee> mok0: in a sync, the DD hasn't checked for ubuntu changes that might be important.
<Hobbsee> it's just checked that the proposed changes work for *debian*.  not for ubuntu.
<ScottK> mok0: One case for Ubuntu/Debian diff is we've fixed something that applies to Debian.  In many other cases it's because Ubuntu is different.  Before you can understand in some cases if a sync is appropriate, you need to understand that.
<emgent> ScottK: Bug #172440
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 172440 in wordpress "[CVE-2007-6013] Authentication cookies easily derivable from password hash" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/172440
<sistpoty|work> imho there are both easy and difficult merges, so I don't think it's a good idea to keep new people from doing merges, nor to encourage them.
<mok0> Hobbsee: that's true, but we do encourage people sending patches to Debian, and it's pretty trivial to see if that has been done since last release. Otherwise, ScottK's rule still applies for UCDs as well as everyone else
 * Hobbsee has seen enough people manage to screw that up, who might fit in that 'contributor' category, too.
<ScottK> mok0: I agree that there are merges that it's trivial to see if they should be syncs.  I just don't think that's the most common case.
<mok0> If the UCDs are known to follow ScottK's rule I think it could be a great time saver for the MOTU crew
<ScottK> emgent: Backports aren't for bug fixes (particularly not for security fixes).  Get it fixed in -security first and then if there is new capability worth a backport, ask for it then.
<ScottK> mok0: Which rule is that (the ask first one)?
<mok0> "Don't touch what you don't understand"
<ScottK> Ah.
<mok0> :)
<ScottK> That's a good one.
<emgent> ScottK: i can fix it, but it`s very long and big work. I think to backport for include the newest features too.
 * ScottK wishes some MOTU would follow that rule.
<mok0> ... none mentioned...
<Hobbsee> ScottK: don't.  it'll send you down a path of disollusionment if you think like that.
 * \sh don't touch main anymore...
<ScottK> emgent: Backports is not for security fixes.  If it's not feasible to patch it to fix it, talk to kees_ or jdstrand about putting the new version in -secuirty.
<emgent> \sh: lol :)
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Just because I with for it, doesn't mean I have any expctation I'll get it.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: true, but that still leads to disollusionment.
<ScottK> Urgh.
<ScottK> with/wish
<ScottK> Hobbsee: You assume it's possible for me to be more disillusioned than I already am.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: this is true.  you're still alive, so tha'ts a fair assumption.
<Hobbsee> :)
<mok0> Hobbsee, ScottK, cheer up you 2 grumpypots :-)
<ScottK> Well.  Maybe.
<Hobbsee> mok0: grumpy?  nah.
<siretart> sistpoty|work: is that dexconf quirk easy to port to general qemu/faumachine?
<sistpoty|work> siretart: haven't looked at it yet in detail, and I fear it's not (at least not to FAUmachine)
<\sh> man...opensuse build service can now work with other installed buildservices somewhere around the world...I wonder when it happens, that we have more then one LP...
<mok0> Hobbsee: Ah, ok, only disillusioned and bitter ;.)
 * \sh 's catching up with the important news of the last month
<Hobbsee> mok0: i'm not sure that bitter really fits.  i'm aware that i don't really have the time to put into it, so have stepped back a lot, and so don't have the same degree of caring about it anymore.
<sistpoty|work> siretart: well, it could be ported, I guess: that's the corresponding line in dexconf: QEMU_KVM=$(grep "QEMU Virtual CPU" /proc/cpuinfo || true)
<mok0> Hobbsee: don't worry about it, I am just teasing
<sistpoty|work> siretart: but of course that'd be quite wrong for FAUmachine (it's meant to behave exactly like real hw)
<Hobbsee> mok0: as in, i still care that my stuff is right, and i still care somewhat that everyone else's is right, so is not compromising the archive, but i don't tend to smash people with the Long Pointy Stick of DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!â¢ for getting it wrong repeatedly anymore.
<siretart> sistpoty|work: what does qemu report in /proc/cpuinfo?
<sistpoty|work> siretart: no idea, haven't checked actually
<sistpoty|work> siretart: and I have the strong believe that the current hardy x won't start with a real cirrus gd5446 as well.. I'll add some more details to the bug
 * mok0 has thankfully not tasted the LPS yet... :-/
<siretart> sistpoty|work: aah, plain qemu reports "Pentium II (Klamath)"
<mok0> Gotta go, see you later!
<sistpoty|work> cya mok0
<siretart> sistpoty|work: perhaps it is possible to set the DefaultDepth on a per driver level?
<sistpoty|work> siretart: maybe... I'm just about to dig through where it comes from (must be somewhere in xorg-server-1.4.1~git20080131/hw/xfree86/common)
<wasabi> Hey anybody work with IKVM?
<wasabi> Ahh. Only minor Ubuntu forks. Never mind. Shall consult Debian maintainer.
<jpds> wasabi: how are you cloaked, and not identified?
<wasabi> I don't follow?
<Hobbsee> jpds: freenode playing with the new services.
<Pici> jpds: You dont have to be on a registered user to identify now.
<Hobbsee> jpds: it kept the cloaks, but forced everyone to reidentify
<Pici> Well, that too, but my answer doesnt answer your question
<jpds> Hobbsee: hmmm
<sistpoty|work> siretart: I guess I'm a little bit stupid. this appears to be a bug in the cirrus driver after all
<siretart> sistpoty|work: sorry?
<sistpoty|work> siretart: imho the cirrus driver determines it's max pixel clock value by the wrong bpp entry (the one from the framebuffer), but need to dig a little bit further into the code still
 * sistpoty|work heads home now... cya
<green_mandarin> hi guys
<green_mandarin> is a Ubunteros here?
<amikrop> How can I declare wxPython as a dependency?
<amikrop> python-wxgtk does not have an installation candidate, so I am not sure how to handle this
<amikrop> So, any help, please?
<geser> amikrop: which python-wxgtk? 2.4, 2.6 or 2.8?
<Balachmar> Hi, I want to check if someone else already is packaging blender 2.46 for hardy (backports)
<geser> amikrop: see "apt-cache search python-wxgtk"
<amikrop> geser: Any.
<amikrop> I have done so.
<amikrop> I want any python-wxgtkx.y
<geser> amikrop: depend on python-wxgtk2.4 | python-wxgtk2.6 | python-wxgtk2.8 if it works with any of the three
<geser> the version you prefer list at first
<amikrop> geser: I haven't thought of that. Thanks.
<jb0t> Flannel: i figured it out.  mysql-common was pinned in /etc/apt/prefs
<jb0t> i must have downgraded going from dapper to edgy because the package was broken at the time.
<sebner> Balachmar: 2.46 is not even in intrepid so wait until then before you request a backport
<jb0t> anyway.. persia, Flannel, wgrant...thanks for your help last night
<Balachmar> @sebner: Well, I wasn't really requesting a backport, but offering to do it :) (or at least try it...)
<sebner> Balachmar: no need to package it at your own. we merge it from debian
<Balachmar> Any idea, on how long that will take (not really impatient, but curious) And how long will it take to be backported afterwards?
<sebner> Balachmar: depending on when Debian it has ;) When intrepid has it I usually takes just a few days if you annoy the right people ^^
<Balachmar> Because I want to learn how to help out, and I just wanted to try blender 2.46 as well. And I saw that more people wanted it. And thought, well maybe I could try it myself.
<sebner> Balachmar: well, blender seems no to be the right thing to start with
<sebner> \sh: any hints?
<\sh> any software is good to start with packaging, after reading all the documentations about packaging...
<\sh> s/reading/reading+watching/ ;)
<sebner> \sh: Tell something about merging :P
<Balachmar> I was reading: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/openweekhardy/PackagingA and thought I could follow that...
<geser> \sh: don't forget "understanding"
<Balachmar> :) ofcourse, you shouldn't be doing things like a headless chicken...
<\sh> geser, oh I thought that implies "reading" ;) ok "after reading+watching and understanding"
<sebner> \sh: uhhhh that's not that clear :P
 * Balachmar agrees with sebner
<Balachmar> So, basically I just thought that I should check here in order to prevent that different people are doing the same thing
<sebner> Balachmar: good ;)
<\sh> Balachmar, it's open source ... many people are doing the same thing...
<jpds> ScottK: are you there?
<amikrop> Is it legal to package/distribute freeware firmware?
<sebner> \sh: bah. It's good to check and ask -.-
<ScottK> Yes
<jpds> ScottK: pm?
<ScottK> Sure
<Balachmar> @\sh I think it would be more efficient if the work is divided. So not too much is done twice (or trice or....)
<\sh> sebner, if miguel would have asked matthias if someone is working on a desktop software...gnome would have never been invented...
<sebner> \sh: but that's a total different thing
<\sh> Balachmar, regarding one distro yes...regarding the whole universe ... people do whatever they want...
<Balachmar> @\sh: This is about packaging, it would be foolish to package the same thing twice
<amikrop> I mean, is it legal to include some freeware, hardware firmware into my package, and distribute it?
<Balachmar> @\sh I understand what you mean
<Balachmar> @amikrop: Free as in speech, or free as in beer? :P
<\sh> Balachmar, check gnome-look or kde-look.org...people package software for debian, redhat, ubuntu, suse, mandriva, whathaveyou...they don't care about double the work already done...they do something because they want to ...
<\sh> and this is good..
<amikrop> Balachmar: Beer (I said "freeware", not "open source").
<Balachmar> @amikrop, then you have too read the license, but I think most of the time, they don't want you to distribute the software
<Balachmar> @\sh: With the risk of being stupid: And why is this good?
<\sh> Balachmar, people are interested to learn something? they are curious how things are working and trying to understand the system? I mean we are living in a consuming community..people who are ready to learn and curious are sometimes hard to find :)
<Balachmar> @\sh: OK then it is mostly good for themselves :) But I get your point
<\sh> Balachmar, what's good for you could be good for others..
<Balachmar> @\sh: Don't get too philosophical now! :P
<\sh> hmm...I was telling this people at linuxtag when they were asking "why the hell are you investing your free time into opensource"...they were quite excited and fascinated that geeks are thinking about those things...
<\sh> one guy already started to work on software + packaging...
<Balachmar> :) always nice to amaze people
<Balachmar> But if I would somehow still want to package blender 2.46 couldn't I also send it in to debian, so that they wouldn't have to do it?
<\sh> Balachmar, you can send a bug report with the package attached (when you use thedebian package as base)
<sebner> Balachmar: btw, blender is already in experimental ... ;9
<Balachmar> @sebner aah I see, so no need to do that. But shouldn't it then be fairly easy using pbuilder?
<sebner> Balachmar: what should be easy?
<Balachmar> I am just reading the howto. And just build bc from source.
<geser> while I see you talking about blender, /me remembers to continue the download of the "bunny" movie via torrent
<Balachmar> @sebner: to create a ubuntu hardy package for blender
<sebner> Balachmar: hmm yes but that's not the way we are doing that normally
<Balachmar> @sebner: but it could be a transitional solution for the impatient few among the hardy users wouldn't it?
<Balachmar> And if it isn't that hard I am willing to give it a try
<sebner> Balachmar: you can always giving it a try and offer it through your PPA if you want
<Balachmar> @sebner, I will just do that: for learning sake ;) \sh
<sebner> ^^
 * \sh goes off and learn who to reactivate his whole human system from being in rescue mode....bathtub  bow
<sebner> hf \sh
<amikrop> I have made a package which once installed, enables a ueagle modem user to connect to the internet (installs the firmware, asks ADSL params and fills configuration files, provides some simple, related scripts, etc). I really think it makes new users' lifes easier, and generally, makes the process of using the modem, fully-automated. I have tested it from many aspects, and it seems functional. I believe it will help. So, are there any st
<amikrop> eps I should take, to provide the package to a larger community than myself, family and friends?
<sebner> \sh: bathtube? bad Harald is showing dumb things :P
<geser> Balachmar: you could even fetch the blender source package from Debian experimental and if it builds in hardy without modifications, make it available via your PPA
<sebner> geser: shouldn't he do a proper merge?
<leonel> ScottK: http://lurker.clamav.net/message/20080602.130841.9c64bafa.en.html  <-- it's coming
<Balachmar> @geser: I have downloaded the .dsc from debian experimental and am currently trying to build it using Pbuilder.
<Balachmar> @sebenr, how would I do a proper merge?
<geser> sebner: ah, we have Ubuntu changes, then a merge would be the better solution
<sebner> Balachmar: look at the outstanding ubuntu changes.
<sebner> geser: yep =)
<Balachmar> I have found this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging?action=show&redirect=MOTU%2FHowToMerge
<ScottK> leonel: Thanks.
<ScottK> leonel: You saw that the 0.92.1 packages are in feisty/gutsy updates now, right?
<Balachmar> When using Pbuilder: I get an error that it cannot satisfy the build dependencies
<sebner> Balachmar: pastebin
<leonel> ScottK: yes I did that's why I stopped searching  cves
<amikrop> geser: In other words, how can I contact a responsible for reviewing my package?
<geser> amikrop: where is your package? on REVU?
<amikrop> geser: What do you mean by saying "REVU"?
<sebner> amikrop: where is your package?
<geser> !revu
<ubottu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<amikrop> sebner: On a LAN repository.
<amikrop> geser: I will have a look and answer you.
<sebner> amikrop: upload it to revu ;)
<amikrop> sebner, geser: OK, thanks. I will.
<amikrop> OK. Joined revu-uploaders in Launchpad. But I can't find a way to upload. Any hints?
<sebner> amikrop: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<devfil> amikorp: if you want to upload a package type on terminal: dput revu _souce_changes_of_package_to_upload
<sebner> amikrop: first you may want ask a revu admin to sync the keyrings
<amikrop> I see.
<Zelut> can universe contain software under a non-free license?
<sebner> Zelut: nope
<geser> no, only multiverse and there only if it's redistributable
<Zelut> sebner: I didn't think so but a user just pasted me the commented lines from the sources.list which mention it may be non-free..
<sebner> Zelut: non-free ist debian
<sebner> Zeddie: debian != ubuntu
<Zelut> sebner: this guy is a GNU-head so he considers it tainted if it even mentions it 'might' contain.
<sebner> Zelut: well, see what geser wrote
<Zelut> sebner: / geser: well I guess the question is then why does the commented sources.list mention it might be?
<geser> Zelut: how exactly is the software licensed?
<geser> Zelut: can you show the line you got?
<Zelut> geser: http://pastebin.ca/1037110 - a paste from the default sources.list file..
<Balachmar> Hi, If I use grab-merge.sh for blender it comes up with the 2.45 version not the 2.46. So, what should I do then?
<sebner> Balachmar: as I said. blender 2.46 is in experimental and grab-merge only fetched from unstable. you have grab the source manually
<Balachmar> @sebner: ooh sorry, I guess I missed that.
<sebner> np
<Balachmar> @sebner: Is there some documentation on how to do that?
<sebner> Balachmar: http://packages.debian.org/source/experimental/blender
<Balachmar> @sebner and then use those files instead of the ones you get from grab-merge?
<sebner> Balachmar: yes though you have to apply the remaining ubuntu changes manually
<Balachmar> @sebner thanks for the info. Will check that some other day. Have to check the finances now. But I guess I will be back :)
<sebner> ^^
<sebner> hf
<amikrop> The url you gave me, says about a `dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa -rfakeroot` command. Where to execute it? Inside the my-package directory (which contains the DEBIAN directory and the filesystem tree of the package's data)?
<amikrop> I did so and got that output: http://dpaste.com/54389/
<sebner> amikrop: inside the package directory
<amikrop> sebner: But I got this error message, above.
<sebner> amikrop: strange but doesn't seem that you are in it
<amikrop> (Am I missing any files? I just have "DEBIAN/", "usr/" and "etc/" in the package directory.
<sebner> amikrop: does debian/changelog exists?
<amikrop> No. Not even "debian/" exist.
<sebner> amikrop: but DEBIAN/ ??
<amikrop> I always package using "DEBIAN/", not "debian/".
<sebner> use debian/ ^^
<amikrop> ok
<geser> looks like the temporary dir from where the deb is made
<amikrop> geser: Yes, that is it.
<Jazzva> norsetto: Are you ok with me updating gnome-mplayer and gecko-mediaplayer?
<norsetto> Jazzva: totally ok
<amikrop> sebner: So, I need "debian/changelog"? I never used that before. Where can I find some documentation about the contents of "debian/changelog"?
<geser> amikrop: call dpkg-buildpackage from the contain the source and the debian/ dir
<Jazzva> norsetto: Cool. I'll start working on it tonight and change bug report's status to In Progress (and assign myself). Thanks :)
<geser> amikrop: how did you build your packages till now?
<sebner> !packaging
<ubottu> The packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports
<norsetto> Jazzva: no, thank you :-)
<sebner> geser: hmm. O_o
<Jazzva> :)
<geser> sebner: I also suspect seeing someone doing it the wrong way
<sebner> geser: true. Now I'm keen to here the answer of your question
<amikrop> geser: with `dpkg -b`
<amikrop> geser: I find it pretty simple and straightforward.
<sebner> amikrop: no valid packages then ....
<amikrop> sebner: Why not?
<sebner> amikrop: because a valid package needs all the things mentioned in the packaging guide. manpages, .desktop, changelog .....
<geser> amikrop: and how do you automate applying patches, calling configure with the right flags, building the package?
<amikrop> geser: I guess I don't.
<amikrop> So, I should follow the packaging guide step-by-step? I didn't know it was mandatory. OK, then, I will.
<sebner> geser: *thumbs up*
<emgent> heya
<effie_jayx> hey emgent
<devfil> emgent: hi
<RoAkSoAx> chan #ubuntu-irc
<RoAkSoAx> oops
 * ajmitch goes & trolls in there
<Neurostu> so I'm having a problem building a package is there anybody here that has a few minutes to answer some questions
<Laney> Neurostu: It's best to just ask, then anyone who knows can answer if and when they see it
<Neurostu> ok so I'm trying to build 2 packages, the first one builds fine, but the second one depends on the first....  I get the following error:
<Neurostu> dpkg-shlibdeps: failure: no dependency information found for /usr/lib/libsomanetwork-1.0-0.3.so.1 (used by debian/tspikes/usr/bin/ratetimelinevis).
<Neurostu> When I inspect the first package using dpkg --contents <package name> I get
<Neurostu> lrwxrwxrwx root/root         0 2008-05-30 20:24 ./usr/lib/libsomanetwork-1.0.so -> libsomanetwork-1.0-0.3.so.1.0.2
<Neurostu> lrwxrwxrwx root/root         0 2008-05-30 20:24 ./usr/lib/libsomanetwork-1.0-0.3.so.1 -> libsomanetwork-1.0-0.3.so.1.0.2
<Neurostu> I have the first package installed,  so i'm not sure exactly what the error means
<Neurostu> sorry for the flood
<ajmitch> in the library package, you used dh_makeshlibs?
<Neurostu> no just dh_make
<ajmitch> dh_make template may not be enough
<ajmitch> did you tell dh_make that the first package was a library?
<Neurostu> no, how exactly do I do that (sorry this is my first time building debs)
<ajmitch> library packaging is a complex beast, full of pitfalls
<ajmitch> in debian/rules in the library package, you'll want to have dh_makeshlibs there
<ajmitch> the debian library packaging guide may be of some help, though it'll probably seem overly complex
<Neurostu> ok... I'll check it out...
<Neurostu> what are the main differences between using pbuilder and dh_make
<mok0> Neurostu: they're 2 very different beasts
<Neurostu> but they are used to accomplish the same task right?
<mok0> Neurostu: no
<Neurostu> oh..
<mok0> dh_make creates template files in the debian/ directory
<Neurostu> k
<mok0> pbuilder compiles and builds packages
#ubuntu-motu 2008-06-03
<Neurostu> so pbuilder is more in-line with dpkg-buildpackage
<mok0> Neurostu: yes, only it does in in a chroot enviroment
<mok0> Neurostu: ... after downloading and installing all Build-depends packages
<Neurostu> and the chroot environment allows you to build packages for a specific architecture even if your machine is a different architecture
<Neurostu> ?
<mok0> Neurostu: uhm, only if you have an amd64
<ajmitch> usually only in the case of building i386 packages on amd64
<mok0> Neurostu: then you can build for i386 arch too
<mok0> ajmitch beat me to it :-)
<Neurostu> ok so do you guys prefer the pbuilder route over dpkg-buildpackage?
<mok0> Neurostu: depends. But it's good because you don't need to pollute your machine with a whole bunch of -dev packages
<RAOF> Pbuilder is useful in that it is closer to how your packages are built on the buildd.  It'll catch failure to build due to insufficient build-dependencies, for example.
<Neurostu> so I've been trying to read the debian library packaging guide... but I'm not sure what changes I need to make to the rules file
<Neurostu> I wasn't sure if I need to run dh_makeshlibs instead of dh_make, when I try dh_makeshlibs i get "find: debian/libsomanetwork: No such file or directory"
<RAOF> Neurostu: These two tools may be named similarly, but they do entirely different things.
<RAOF> dh-make creates a debian/ directory contianing useful templates for a new source package.
<Neurostu> right... I've been using it to do that for a while
<RAOF> dh_makeshlibs is normally run from debian/rules, and creates a package.shlibs file that provides dpkg-shlibdeps with informaiton about library dependencies.
<Neurostu> I'm guessing that I need to add dh_makeshlibs to a specific place in the rules file
<RAOF> Yes; it'd be in the binary: rule, IIRC.
<RAOF> But this is not a simple proposition; library packaging is a complex beast, with all sorts of crazy pitfalls.
<Neurostu> right that's what they said above.  So i found the dh_makeshlibs in the rules file generated by dh_make, I just uncommented it and I'll see if that works
<ajmitch> RAOF: quoting me now?
<RAOF> ajmitch: Am I?  Only unintentionally? :)
<ajmitch> 10:48 < ajmitch> library packaging is a complex beast, full of pitfalls
 * RAOF is much less original than he thinks.
<Neurostu> ok so the 2nd package built and installed.  It just looks like I'm having problems with glade now...
<Neurostu> so the src/ directory has the .glade file, and when I run dpkg --contents <package2.deb> it isn't included in the package, where would I go about getting it included in the .deb
<RAOF> Neurostu: Is it installed as a part of the build process?
<mok0> Heh, try out this coolness: http://goosh.org/
<Neurostu> hmm... let me check
<Neurostu> So when I run make install it gives me the same error
<Neurostu> so its a problem I will have to work on with the developer
<Neurostu> thanks for your help
<jml> RAOF: cryptomnesia!
<persia> Neurostu: You can work around it by force-installing the missing glade files with dh_install
<Neurostu> dh_install is that a command I run or do I add that line to rules?
<persia> Neurostu: dh_install goes in debian/rules.  Read the man page to determine how to get your files installed.
<RAOF> It's a command you run from rules.  'man' is your friend.
<Neurostu> man --> is a great friend  sometimes I forget that...
 * persia curses RAOF's cogent concise commentary
 * RAOF find's it a pity 'RAOF' doesn't start with 'c'.  Alliteration FTW!
<persia> Right.  Should have used a given name :)
 * RAOF is indicted for cruely to the common appostrophe.
<Neurostu> sorry for my pedantic questions, but what man entry am I looking at (dh_make?)
<RAOF> dh_install.
<RAOF> Also, debhelper.  'man debhelper' will give you an overview of the dh_* helpers.
<RAOF> Aha!  I think I've caught a fundamental disconnect.  The debian/rules file is just a makefile.  As such, all of the tab-indented lines are just passed to a shell to be run.
<persia> RAOF: Well, passed to a series of shells.  Don't try any fancy shell scripting...
<RAOF> Oh, yeah.  One shell per line.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<nixternal> boo
<RAOF> Howdie bddebian.
 * RoAkSoAx giving a talk about merging xD
<bddebian> Hi RAOF
<mneptok> persia: konban-wa
<RoAkSoAx> anyone know why i cant install a pbuilder for intrepid?
<RoAkSoAx> it shows me this: E: No such script: /usr/share/debootstrap/scripts/intrepid
<RAOF> Oh, because you haven't upgraded your debootstrap to the version in hardy-proposed or hardy-backports, I forget which.
<RoAkSoAx> oh right, cool thnaks, forgot to enable backports :)
<soonick_cancun> hello everyone. I have just signed up to launchpad, and signed a code of conduct so i could get started helping to ubuntu. But i dont know where can i start. I have readen a little but i think i would lear faster if i actually did something.
<soonick_cancun> can someone give me a clue how to start?
<persia> soonick_cancun: Well, this channel is mostly about contributing to development.
<soonick_cancun> im fine about it
<persia> We tend to review the open bugs, and close them, with a bit of updating to new versions as well.
<soonick_cancun> so how can i get a bug to fix?
<persia> I'd recommend taking a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing, picking a bug that annoys you, and fixing up the package as much as you can.
<persia> One source of bugs people consider easy is to look at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs and select the "bitesize" tag on the left (I forget the real URL).
<soonick_cancun> should i join bugsquad?
<persia> soonick_cancun: Depends on your interest.  My experience was that working with bugsquad gave me a lot of confidence with the processes, and helped me find packages I could help fix.
<soonick_cancun> well i need confidence with the process, so i think ill do it :P
<persia> soonick_cancun: Most of the bugsquad coordination is on #ubuntu-bugs.  Here we tend to focus on the code changes related to the bugfixes.
<soonick_cancun> do i need to join bugsquad to fix a bitesize bug?
<soonick_cancun> should i go to that channel to get help with the process?
<persia> soonick_cancun: Nope.  Anyone can fix bugs.
<persia> bugsquad tends to look at bugs, and try to make sure they are well-understood.
<persia> That way developers (who may also be bugsquad) can use that understanding to prepare a patch, and get it to users.
<soonick_cancun> ah, that seems helpful. So i can find a bitesize bug i am interested, go to bugsquad to find a deep explanation about it, fix it and then come here for help to upload it?
<persia> soonick_cancun: the deep explanation ought be in the bug.  The bugsquad team tries to help get it there.  Unfortunately, they only process 2500-3000 bugs a week, so not every bug is as complete as would be easy for a new developer.
<soonick_cancun> so i should get one, fix it and they should help me upload the solution?
<persia> soonick_cancun: If you pick one, and fix it, and prepare a patch, the relevant sponsors will upload it.  See https://wiki,ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing
<soonick_cancun> ok, then i guess ill try that
<soonick_cancun> should my next doubts be directed to bugsquad?
<persia> soonick_cancun: Depends on the doubt.  If it's about bug management, bugsquad are the group to ask.  If it's about development participation, this is the place to ask.
<soonick_cancun> ok, ill go to bugsquad then to get some help to get started. Thank you very much for the orientation persia
<persia> soonick_cancun: Thanks for helping with Ubuntu
<soonick_cancun> to soon to say that, but i hope i get there :P
<poolie> hi
<poolie> i want to package bzr 1.6beta1 for our ppa
<poolie> is 1.6~beta1-1~ppa1 an appropriate name/
<RAOF> poolie: That suggests that its got a Debian revision.
<soren> If it were me, I'd probably stick "0ubuntu" in there, too, and get 1.6~beta1-0ubuntu1~ppa1
<RAOF> _Exactly_ what I was going to suggest ;)
<soren> :)
<poolie> hm interesting
<poolie> so it seems like people should be doing that for most ppa packages?
<RAOF> Unless, of course, that it is based on the 1.6~beta1-1 debian package :)
<soren> poolie: Mostly, yes.
<persia> poolie: That format should be followed if the package is intended to be a temporary upgrade for an installed Ubuntu system.  If you have other intentions, other version formats may be suitable, but we can't really help so much.
<poolie> it's not a temporary fix, i guess it's closest to being a backport
<poolie> in that i'm packaging it for dapper..hardy
<persia> poolie: Let's call that temporary, under the assumption there may be an official backport later :)
<directhex> then i'd suggest something other than ~ppa1
<directhex> something alphabetically earlier than the letter "d"
<persia> directhex: Good point!
<directhex> since official backports get a ~distro extension, so a "ppa1" package would not be replaced by an official dapper, edgy, etc
<poolie> like "b"? :-)
<poolie> oh sorry, i mistyped before, it's actually ~bazaar1
<RAOF> That would work ;)
<dholbach> good morning
<poolie> hello dholbach
<dholbach> hi poolie
<ajmitch> hey dholbach
<dholbach> hi ajmitch, hi slomo_
<huats> morning everyone
<BugMaN> morning huats :)
<Balachmar> Hi, I was trying to build a package for hardy (blender 2.46) using pbuilder and the stuff from debian experimental
<persia> Balachmar: Did it work?
<Balachmar> It fails, because it doesn't find the libftgl-dev. But it is in the repo, but as ftgl-dev (so without the lib)
<Balachmar> How could I make this build ok, can I somehow create a symlink kind of link to that package?
<slytherin> Balachmar: just change the dependency in debian/control file, add a changelog entry documenting the change.
<Balachmar> slytherin: I'll have a look
<Balachmar> Because I was using the dsc file, So I guess I'll have to change something in the tar.gz file as well
<Balachmar> ok, made the change in the diff file. See what it does
<Balachmar> the ftgl-dev should be deprecated in interpid, according to the diff file (at least it is deprecated in debian)
<wgrant> Balachmar: I've got a working Blender 2.46 in my PPA.
<wgrant> I just backported ftgl.
<persia> Balachmar: It's best to never change the tar.gz file.  This is the entire purpose of the diff.gz file.
<wgrant> https://launchpad.net/~wgrant/+archive
<wgrant> Balachmar: It doesn't work by simply altering the dependency.
<Balachmar> @persia: I kind of got that
<Balachmar> @wgrant: ok, so you have already backported blender 2.46 to hardy! Great!
<Balachmar> Then I might try something else, to be useful
<Balachmar> wgrant: What did it take to create the package?
<wgrant> Balachmar: I simply took blender and ftgl from experimental and uploaded them to my PPA, with a new changelog entry.
<Balachmar> wgrant: That was ofcourse my nest step, to take ftgl as well :)
<Balachmar> wgrant: So you first created the ftgl package and uploaded it to your ppa, then you could build the blender package as well, since it was able to find the ftgl and then you uploaded it to your ppa as well. Am I right?
<wgrant> Balachmar: Correct. But you need not bother yourself with that - just grab them from my PPA.
<Balachmar> wgrant: already doing that :) Just curious if I was right on how you did it :)
<Balachmar> So that I can help out with packaging in the future.
<gaspa> wgrant: i can't fully understand your comment.... ( about the patch system... i used the one in the package... or there's something wrong?
<nicolasvw> Hello, is there a tool that can be used to get fresh sources using the debian/watch file ?
<james_w> nicolasvw: "uscan"
<nicolasvw> james_w: thankx !
<wgrant> gaspa: Ooops, indeed, I was looking through it too quickly and automatically mentally stripped out the leading +. Ignore me.
<gaspa> wgrant: fine. ;) thanks.
<gaspa> wgrant: feisty done. for intrepid perhaps i could drop some ubuntu deltas, so it takes a little more. :)
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<Laney> lo
<norsetto> greetings and salutations
<dholbach> hiya sistpoty|work, hi norsetto
<dholbach> hey Daviey
<sistpoty|work> hi dholbach
<sistpoty|work> hi norsetto
<Daviey> hey dholbach!
<norsetto> morning dholbach
<dholbach> how are you guys doing? :)
 * norsetto is surviving
 * Daviey is GOOD
<dholbach> norsetto: is it that bad?
<norsetto> dholbach: survival is good, its extintion which is bad :-)
<dholbach> norsetto: right... but if "survival" is everything or your only pressing concern.... :-)
 * laga ponders going for MOTU
<laga> so i'll have to do some merges, i guess
<dholbach> laga: there's a lot of stuff on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO - you could pick some bitesize bugs or something from http://daniel.holba.ch/really-fix-it
<laga> thanks, bookmarked.
 * Daviey didn't know about really-fix-it
<persia> Daviey: It's the ultimate source of prepared fixes just waiting for someone to snipe them :)
<geser> Hi *
<norsetto> heya geser
<gaspa> wgrant: it's enough sending the diff also for intrepid, or should i file another bug, for merge?
<laga> does https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates/MicroReleaseExceptions also apply to universe/multiverse?
<laga> we're missing lots of upstream fixes for MythTV in hardy - and there's no way i'll do an SRU for 20 patches :)
<wgrant> gaspa: Don't bother filing another bug.
<gaspa> cool. :D all done, then.
<wgrant> gaspa: Danke.
<gaspa> :)
<gaspa> wgrant: uops. No, wrong diff. just a minute.
<persia> laga: The rules apply.  On the other hand, those are general exceptions.  Any given upload is considered by the SRU team.  Note that except in special circumstances, it's unlikely to be accepted as just a new upstream.
<laga> persia: sad.
<persia> laga: Why?  Stability is key.  What's bad about a single SRU with 20 patches?
<directhex> maintainer time
<laga> i'd love to pull in a new snapshot from their release-0-21-fixes branch, get some testing done (maybe 10 positive comments instead of the usual 2) and be done.
<laga> persia: because SRUs are supposed to be non-invasive.
<geser> laga: be happy that you don't need to do a SRU for each patch :)
<persia> laga: You could ask the SRU team.  Note that if the release-0-21-fixes branch is all bugfixes, and you document the bugs & fixes, there's a good chance it would be approved.
<persia> It's mostly about documentation and testing, rather than hard & fast rules.  As long as it's transparent to the user, and doesn't break anything, and doesn't change the feature set, it is likely fine.
<directhex> laga, question is, has the protocol version been bumped at all since 0.21?
<laga> directhex: no
<laga> they didn't do it this time :)
<laga> persia: i'll talk to motu-sru then. thanks
<directhex> laga, well, that makes it easier to argue that an update is non-invasive, since it (shouldn't) break mixed setups
<laga> doing a backport would be much easier, but hardy-backports isn't enabled by default :(
<directhex> laga, personally i want the update, for greyfoxx's upnp fixes
<laga> directhex: you can always use the weekly fixes builds.. i still need to push them, though ;)
<persia> laga: Also, the policy is that backports aren't permitted as a bugfix channel.
<laga> persia: indeed.
<directhex> laga, can't you enable backports by default in mythbuntu?
<laga> directhex: we (accidentally) did that for 7.10.
<laga> then 0.21 came out
<laga> it was a terrible mess :(
<directhex> laga, oh. oops.
<directhex> laga, shove one of the mythbuntu ppa repos in, then?
<laga> there have been at least 60 commits to the release-0-21-fixes branch since the last mythtv upload to hardy. too lazy to count properly now.
<laga> directhex: we're already doing that for the weekly builds, but we usually want to stay as close to the ubuntu archives as possible
<laga> persia: does motu-sru have a dedicated mailing list?
 * directhex wonders what the chances would be for putting backports of mono on hardy. the mono developers are... unkind... about ubuntu's neolithic versions, and the problems it causes them for support
<persia> laga: Nope.  Coordination is on the ubuntu-motu@ list.  There is often a representative here, but they've all been hiding recently.
<wgrant> directhex: They could adopt a less ridiculous attitude.
<wgrant> directhex: Distributions won't upgrade stable releases at upstream's whim.
<persia> directhex: If the intrepid mono compiles and works on hardy, and you can organise a few testers, getting them into -backports might be possible (although the rdepends list is *vast*)
<wgrant> They need to realise that, if they don't already.
<directhex> wgrant, remind me of ubuntu's approach to firefox versions
<wgrant> directhex: That's because Mozilla upstream is insane, and unlikely to change.
<persia> directhex: That's the other option: upsteam gets deeply involved in Ubuntu integration, and petitions the Technical board.
 * persia notes that this tends to make upstream match Ubuntu schedule rather than the other way around, so isn't a good solution for those wishing to maintain their own schedule)
<laga> the whole "upstream's schedule should be linked to ubuntu's" is insane anyways.
<directhex> i can't see them changing their releases to match. if anything motivates them, it'll be SLES timescales
<directhex> but in SLES world, updates DO happen to stable releases
<persia> laga: Personally, I don't see any reason for upstream to match Ubuntu, but not matching comes with the consequence that Ubuntu shipped versions may not match latest upstream.
<laga> of course. that's not a bad thing.
<persia> Exactly.  The point is that no upstream can have it both ways.
<persia> (except Mozilla, and we'd rather not do that, except that it can't be called Mozilla if we extract and ship security patches, because upstream is, as noted, insane)
<sistpoty|work> note to self: don't try ctrl-alt-backspace in a vm, if the keyboard is not grabbed *G*
<schmiedc> gg
<geser> :)
<soren> sistpoty|work: Even then... ?
<soren> sistpoty|work: I thought you couldn't work around ctrl-alt-backspace being sent to your own X serveR?
<sistpoty|work> soren: no idea actually
<soren> Regardless of keyboard grab, focus or whatnot..
<soren> sistpoty|work: Otherwise, it would fail to be the final resort kind of way of killing your X server if your input goes bonkers.
<directhex> in vmware, you do ctrl-alt-space, then let go of space, and do backspace/f1/whatever whilst keeping ctrl-alt going
<directhex> it seems to behave
<sistpoty|work> soren: *nod*, that makes sense
<soren> directhex: I wonder how they pull that off..
<soren> *shrug*
<directhex> magicks, of the dark variety
<soren> :(
<soren> persia: ping
<persia> soren: Yes, I have too much RAM.  Sorry :(
<soren> persia: I have an alternate patch here..
<persia> pasties?
<soren> moment..
<soren> Gah.. I accidentally pushed it to launchpad.
 * soren kicks bound branches.
<persia> Heh.
<persia> This is part of why I like CVS.  You do your work locally with quilt or the like, and then push the patches on purpose :)
<soren> persia: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-virt/ubuntu-jeos/trunk/revision/69
<soren> You /like/ CVS?
<persia> soren: Well, I like that I never commit by accident.  it's the not committing by accident that tends to be an issue.
<TheMuso> lol
<persia> Anyway, about this patch: are you sure `rm -rf root` won't delete target when INSTALL_IN_PLACE is "YEAH"?
<soren> persia: Reasonably.
<persia> soren: OK.  I recently had a bad experience with rm -rf and symlinks, but it wasn't Ubuntu, so it may be safe.
<soren> persia: Now I'm completely sure. Just tested it.
<soren> persia: Could you take it for spin real quick?
<persia> soren: Excellent.  The rest looks good, although I'd still like the tmpfs option for those making images that can fit in tmpfs, but it's likely a personal preference :)
<soren> persia: That's what "-d /dev/shm" is for :)
<persia> real quick?  No.  I'll start a run, but it takes a while.
<soren> I do it all the time on my workstation.
<persia> soren: Ah.  right :)
<persia> soren: all the different ways I try to run that fail with debootstrap: ... Permission denied :(
<soren> :$
<soren> Er..
<soren> Ok.
<persia> soren: Mind you, I just pulled the script from bzr, and am running it in a local directory.  Might that be breaking some assumption?
<soren> persia: No, that should be fine. I think I know what's wrong.
<soren> persia: *headdesk*
<soren> persia: Grab from the bzr tree again, and try again, please.
<Balachmar> Hey, just found this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/blender/+bug/235424 And I know that wgrant actually already has packages for blender 2.46 for hardy. So what should be done for this bug to be squashed?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 235424 in hardy-backports "Update package from upstream to version 2.46" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<ogra> Balachmar, well, just wait until its built in intrepid and ask for a backport :)
<Balachmar> ogra: OK, I was just checking of maybe I could do something to help :) And I tend to prefer to look at packages I know/use
<ogra> Balachmar, well, laga seems to be responsible for getting it from experimental into ubuntu according to http://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html
<ogra> i'm sure he appreciates help
<ogra> oh, err
<ogra> not laga, sorry
<Balachmar> you mean Daniel Hahler
<ogra> yeah
<Balachmar> I'll send the guy an e-mail then.
<ogra> right, ask him if you can help :)
<soren> persia: Any better?
<persia> soren: Sorry.  As is so often the case, today is the scullery maid's night off.  Just pulling now...
<soren> persia: O_o
<StevenK> Heh
<persia> soren: At least it is running debootstrap, which isn't usually possible on my system.  Things are looking good.
<soren> persia: Coolness.
<persia> soren: Is this targeted as a replacement in -updates, or for intrepid?
<soren> persia: The former.
<persia_ume> soren: it ate my workstation :(
<soren> persia_ume: You are kidding of course?
<persia_ume> Not really.  I'm currently at stage 1/5, 741/1906 of a fdisk recovery
<soren> Whuh...
<persia_ume> s/fdisk/fsck/ (my brain is apparently also affected)
<persia_ume> I'm not sure either.  Everything looked good, and then the screen went black and the BIOS started
<soren> Heh... I somehow doubt that could be my fault. :)
<soren> persia_ume: Although.
<soren> ....
<soren> What happens if you fill your /tmp up completely?
<persia_ume> I wasn't really doing much else: I was I/O bound hard enough to block most other activities.
<persia_ume> But I was using --in-place, which should use the local image, rather than /tmp, right?
<soren> No, it still puts the stuff in /tmp, but loop mounts the final images instead of using a temporary directory to build the system.
<persia_ume> Ah, and my /tmp was full of random stuff (some of which was large)
<soren> Well, if your system misbehaves if your tmpfs fills up with stuff, that's a bug elsewhere :)
<persia_ume> (And I don't have very much more than 2x RAM)
<persia_ume> soren: Yes, but the --tmpfs flag worked for me...
<persia_ume> (as did the crude hack that broke it for everyone else)
<persia_ume> I suppose the correct answer is that people who want to mount things like me ought mount something else and use -d
<soren> Well, it worked fine for me, too. I just stumbled when I was running ubuntu-vm-builder inside a vm with 96 MB ram,.
<soren> Boom!
<persia_ume> heh
<amikrop> Why this https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete is required to follow? It is quite complicated. This one http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-debpkg.html looks very simple and easy.
<soren> persia_ume: Well, with --in-place we support a nosuid and nodev /tmp. That something else doesn't support a tmpfs filling up is not really in scope for me :)
<persia_ume> amikrop: There are no restrictions on which packaging guide you use, so long as the resulting package complies with the policy defined in the debian-policy package on the current development release.
<persia_ume> soren: Makes sense.  I suspect the set of people who have /tmp on /tmpfs and the set of people who have /tmp nodev,nosuid has a small intersection.
<amikrop> persia_ume: I find https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete complex. Are there any other more simple guides that lead to hardy-debian-compliant packages?
<amikrop> persia: I find https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete complex. Are there any other more simple guides that lead to hardy-debian-compliant packages?
<persia> amikrop: no need to repeat yourself :)
<persia> Anyway, there's the Debian packaging guide.  There are also lots around the net.
<persia> The debhelper 7 guide is interesting, as is the CDBS documentation.
<persia> You can check yourself against most of policy by running lintian against your packages (both source and binary)
<persia> My personal recommendation is to take a source package, create a debian directory, add copyright and control to match other packages you've seen (and the source on which your package is based)
<persia> Use dch --create to create debian/changelog
<geser> amikrop: forget the ibm guide as fast as you can, with this guide you won't get any package into Debian or Ubuntu
<persia> And start a debian/rules based on what you like.
<amikrop> geser: OK :-/
<amikrop> persia: So, what guide do you suggest?
<amikrop> geser: Can't I create compliant packages as simply as with the ibm guide?
<soren> "the ibm guide"?
<persia> amikrop: I typically suggest the Ubuntu one, but no guide can be both simple and complete: there are too many ways to create a valid package.
<amikrop> Or, much more simply than the Ubuntu Packaging Complete Guide?
<amikrop> persia: Which is the simplest?
<amikrop> soren: http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-debpkg.html
<persia> amikrop: I've not made a comparison, but I'm guessing it's wrong :)
<persia> Based on what I see from that URL, I'm guessing the IBM guide is the simplest, but it misses the point of a source package entirely.
<persia> As a result, the package cannot be easily modified or distributed, and won't work on multiple architectures.
<amikrop> persia: So, should I follow the Ubuntu one? It is complicated in the way that it uses many tools, and says too much about the rules file and stuff. The thing is that I don't want to compile stuff. My package has some basg scripts, some Python scripts, and some object code. I also want to be able to write some simple postinst and postrm files.
<persia> amikrop: OK.  You can't package object code without compiling it: that won't work on multiple platforms.
<amikrop> s/basg/bash
<persia> That said, for the rest, just put everything you want in a directory structure that makes it easy to understand.
<persia> Make sure you have a license in COPYING in the root directory.
<amikrop> persia: The object code is not open source.
<persia> amikrop: That's OK.  This is your package, for your use.
<geser> amikrop: the guide tries to be general, if you don't have nothing to compile, you can skip this step
<amikrop> (The object code is not mine.)
<persia> amikrop: Do you have the source?
<geser> amikrop: how is it licensed?
<amikrop> persia: no
<amikrop> freeware
<amikrop> It is not a common license.
<amikrop> It is theirs. A custom license.
<amikrop> It allows distribution.
<persia> amikrop: OK.  You won't be able to make a compliant package.  Go back to the IBM guide, but be warned that this can't easily be distributed.
<amikrop> geser: But it says too much about many tools, like dh_* and many many other stuff. It makes thing really complicated.
<laga> well, the guide probably tries to be complete.
<wgrant> laga: And useful.
<amikrop> I find it confusing.
<laga> making binary-only packages isn't exactly a common use case in the FLOSS world.
<geser> amikrop: it can be easy and it can be hard, depending on the source
<amikrop> laga: It is not my choice.
<persia> amikrop: To ask a different question: who is the target audience for the package?
<amikrop> persia: end-users
<persia> amikrop: Surely, but what sort?  Internal, Customers, The World?
<amikrop> Just users that want to connect to the Internet easily with a usb modem.
<amikrop> geser: Is this section https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#head-b1e654041de2f572282304b43e4b5191866afe46 enough to package some simple stuff?
<persia> amikrop: There are a few different open-source packages out there for that purpose.  You say "It's not my choice".  Why do you want to package these specific objects?
<persia> amikrop: "Packaging From Scratch" is the hardest way to package :)
<geser> but it's easier to use than cdbs if you source isn't like cdbs expects it
<persia> True, but debhelper is typically easier still.  Anyway, for just images, python, glade, bash, etc. I find CDBS + debian/install painless.
<persia> (that's python *scripts*, not modules)
<amikrop> Look. I want to install some Python scripts, some Bash scripts, and some Object code (architecture-independent). Also, I want to write a minimalistic postinst and postrm. Just that.
<amikrop> What is the most simple way to do this?
<soren> persia: The conclusion was that the patch was good, right?
<persia> soren: The conclusion was that the patch was likely to work for people not me, and that I should complain to someone else :)
<soren> persia: :) gotcha
<Hobbsee> santiago-ve: were you the one looking at kguitar on the weekend?
 * Hobbsee merges spamprobe.
<schmiedc> is it a better idea to start with packaging on a "real" machine or should i setup a vm instead?
<amikrop> So, what should I read in order to accomplish that simply?
<persia> schmiedc: Either works.  If you go for the real machine, either have a test machine for using the development release or create some chroots for testing.
<schmiedc> ok
<schmiedc> thx
<amikrop> How can I do what I need, then? What do I need to read?
<amikrop> Any suggestions?
<amikrop> persia, geser: Excuse me, but I didn't understand the conclusion. What guide/section should I read to cover my needs?
<persia> amikrop: I don't really understand your needs, and don't tend to recommend guides anyway.
<amikrop> persia: OK. I want my package to install some Python scripts, some Bash scripts and some Object code. I also want to write a simple postinst and a simple postrm script. What should I read?
<persia> amikrop: See, I'm really not sure that's what you want.  I think you likely either want to work with upstream to have their source (even if you don't distribute it) or want to select a different upstream.
<persia> Packaging object code is fraught with difficulty, and even the best packagers routinely make significant mistakes.
<persia> Further, I'm fairly certain nobody has written a guide that lets you do that successfully and reliably.
<wgrant> And you are unlikely to find guidance for packaging severely non-free software here.
<geser> amikrop: one question: what kind of object code is it if it's arch-independent?
<amikrop> OK. Let's forget about object code. How can I package some simple python/bash scripts?
<persia> amikrop: That's easy.  I listed it all earlier.
<amikrop> geser: It is related to the ueagle-atm kernel module.
<geser> amikrop: I'd suggest something with debhelper like described in the "Packaging from Scratch" section
<amikrop> persia: You mean the Complete Ubuntu Packaging Guide?
<geser> amikrop: does it get upload to the modem? i.e. is it a firmware?
<amikrop> geser: Yes.
<persia> amikrop: No, I mean the step-by-step instructions on creating an orig.tar.gz from your scripts, and which files to create in debian/ to generate a source package.
<amikrop> persia: Which URL is this?
<persia> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/06/03/%23ubuntu-motu.html
<persia> amikrop: Sorry.  That's won't be up to date for another 15 minutes, but it will be from 14:27
<emgent> heya
<persia> Or is it.  I'm lost.
<amikrop> geser: So, "Packaging from Scratch" is it?
<geser> amikrop: that would be my suggestion
<persia> Anyway, to summarise.  Put everything in a directory to make it easy to modify.  Put the license in COPYING.  Use that to make orig.tar.gz.  Unpack again.  Add debian/copyright and debian/control.  Use dch --create for debian/copyright.  Use the 1-line debian/rules from the CDBS documentation.  Indicate your installation in debian/install.
<amikrop> geser: OK. Thanks.
<amikrop> persia: I will try. Thanks.
<santiago-ve> Hobbsee, yes i was working with kguitar
<afflux> nicolasvw: gdecrypt download link updated, thanks for the hint
<devfil> asac: ping
<sebner> persia: may I merge xgalaga?
<persia> sebner: Please, and anything else of mine excepting freqtweak.
<afflux> hi sebner :)
<sebner> persia: ^^, I haven't got that much time so I'm just taking ones that are fast to process
<sebner> hoi afflux =)
<persia> sebner: Heh.  Most of mine are likely from RCbugs or just quick & easy anyway :)
<sebner> persia: ^^ We'll see. hmm xgalaga. Remaining change: .desktop, attached patch in BTS 329 ago  -.-
<sebner> *329 days
<persia> sebner: Yes, well.
<persia> He doesn't want to maintain "third-party" packages anymore.
<sebner> persia: how should I understand "third-party" ?
<persia> sebner: xgalaga is actually up for adoption, although I've enough I'm not doing that I'm not going to take that now.
<sebner> persia: ah understood
<nicolasvw> afflux: np, will get back at it then ;)
<persia> sebner: re: third-party: http://kitenet.net/~joey/blog/entry/a_change/
<afflux> nicolasvw: have fun with updating, I guess a simple uupdate will do.
<afflux> nicolasvw: ah, please check that all links in the debian/ dir now point to gdecrypt.pentabarf.de instead of just pentabarf.de :)
<afflux> forgot to change this in debian/copyright on last update, iirc.
<nicolasvw> afflux: will do ;)
<sebner> persia: ah. thanks
<afflux> thanks
<afflux> nicolasvw: err wait. could you wait a minute? I just found two bugs in the ubuntu gdecrypt package. Will check them and provide fixes.
<sebner> persia: should I add a "Version=1.0" though validation doesn't complain?
<persia> sebner: Yes, please.
<nicolasvw> afflux: Let me know
<afflux> nicolasvw: will do
<persia> sebner: and update the BTS please.
<sebner> persia: *polish*
<sebner> persia: before or after the merge ^^
<persia> sebner: Doesn't really matter.  The BTS entry ought only have the minimal patch anyway (no changelog, etc.)
<sebner> persia: I know I know. Will do =)
<persia> Thank you.
<sebner> Has somebody haXX0red LP? It's so damn slow ... again ^^
<persia> It at least isn't working at all for me.  Try edge.
<sebner> persia: I'm always on edge
<ScottK> sebner: We know.
<mok0> sebner: yeah that slowness is killing me too...
<persia> sebner: Consider muscle relaxants
<mok0> persia: he'll fall asleep
<sebner> rofl
<\sh> valerian helps too
<persia> mok0: Hmm.  Hard balance then :)
<mok0> no, no, we want him up and busying about
<sebner> mok0: hey my syncs are really syncs \o/ Are you tired reviewing my syncs (yesterdays discussion)
<mok0> sebner: I never get tired of your syncs ;-)
<sebner> mok0: hrhr
<sebner> ScottK: You have the good contacts to LP folks. speed them up :P
<ScottK> It seems even more slow than usual to me.
<ScottK> sebner: They mostly run when they see me coming.
 * sebner is wondering why ^^
<ScottK> It's sufficiently slow that it even breaks http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/
<sebner> lol
 * ScottK doesn't have two or three hours to explain.
<persia> someone whose attention isn't split by a meeting could go ask in #launchpad...
<mok0> ScottK: Hmm, it says it's just me...
<ScottK> Hmmm.  I got "The server encountered a temporary error and could not complete your request." more than once.
<Laney> It seems fine for me
<mok0> sebner: now that I've got you, I was looking at a sync of yours...
<sebner> mok0: hmm?
 * mok0 tries desperately to find it again
<mok0> ah, openbox
<sebner> ah
<sebner> well, normally reserved for geser =)
<sebner> mok0: you can have a merge. just a sec ;)
<mok0> sebner: uh-uh, I'll keep my hands off then
<sebner> mok0: pfff. don't pick the nice syncs :P
<sebner> bug #237082
<mok0> sebner: the bug should be assigned to geser, then
<sebner> mok0: he is subscribed
<ubottu> sebner: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/237082/+text)
<mok0> lol
<sebner> -.-
<sebner> bug #237082
<sebner> ubottu: go go go
<mok0> gogogogo
<ubottu> sebner: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/237082/+text)
<ubottu> Factoid go go go not found
<sebner> -.-
<mok0> rofl
<sebner> mok0: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xgalaga/+bug/237082   =)
<ubottu> sebner: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/237082/+text)
<mok0> sebner: another desktop file addition
<sebner> mok0: unfortunately
<sebner> isn't norsetto the .desktop guy?
<mok0> I will sponsor it if you send that to the Debian maintainer
<sebner> mok0: it is there since 329 days but I'll update it
<mok0> We don't want all those tiny deltas
<mok0> sebner: you mean it's been on the bug tracker for 329 days?
<sebner> mok0: exactly
<persia> mok0: xgalaga is up for adoption.  It's in git.  Grab Joey's git, and update it, and take it over (after getting Joey's approval and confirming with Debian-Games), if you like.
<persia> mok0: Also, we do want delta for .desktop files, as we don't support Debian menu files very well.
<mok0> persia: But if the DM will put it in, that's better
<geser> sebner: as I don't have currently time to check the openbox sync I've subscribed u-u-s to the bug. So mok0 can review it if he has time.
<mok0> persia: I don't have an interest in xgalaga, really
<sebner> geser: ah good to know, thanks
<sebner> mok0: go go go =)
<persia> mok0: Agreed.  It's not worth keeping a delta without a BTS entry unless we really, really, need to do so.
<mok0> sebner: It's not clear to me why the Ubuntu delta can be scrapped
<sebner> mok0: openbox? sec
<sebner> mok0: because we synced it a long time .. reduce the double work ..
<mok0> sebner: but it must have been repackaged for a reason
<soren> kirkland: There's nothing technically wrong with putting me and jamie as uploads in your ubuntu-virt package, but it's a bit confusing since we don't use it in Ubuntu.
<sebner> mok0: hardy release maybe?
<soren> kirkland: uploaders, I mean.
<kirkland> soren: oh, right
<kirkland> soren: i'll fix that and put another revision in REVU
<kirkland> soren: i was mirroring what I saw in another package
<sebner> mok0: not sure if it's ready for the hardy release maybe
<sebner> mok0: the debian version to sync I mean
<soren> kirkland: While you're at it, please make a copy of the GPL and stick it in the top level directory of the package. Call it COPYING.
<sebner> RainCT: can you give us feedback?
<kirkland> soren: it's currently in debian/copyright
<soren> kirkland: Not quite.
<soren> kirkland: debian/copyright actually specifically says: You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License
<soren> along with this program.  If not, see <http://www.gnu.org/licenses/>.
<soren> kirkland: The package looks fine, so I'm going really nitpicky on you right now :)
<soren> kirkland: Your .PHONY target in debian/rules refers to a checkroot target which doesn't exist.
<sebner> mok0: later, are you reviewing the merge or should I subscribe u-u-s?
<soren> kirkland: the build-stamp target seems superfluous.
<soren> kirkland: So does the install target.
<kirkland> soren: hmm, okay
<soren> And build is missing from .PHONY.
<soren> kirkland: There's a tiny, tiny bug in debian/control, but that's more of an issue with ubuntu-vm-builder, actually :)
<mok0> sebner: I will review it
<sebner> mok0: fine =) *convinced* =)
<sebner> mok0: And now I also have the LP number in the changelog ^^
<soren> kirkland: A package must not depend on a package of lower priority than itself, and u-v-b is priority: extra, but I think it's ok to change u-v-b to optional.
<kirkland> soren: okay, what bug is that?
<kirkland> soren: ah
<Iulian> How do I add an icon to the Programming category? I did have a look at standards.freedesktop.org but I couldn't find anything.
<afflux> nicolasvw: I added a patch for bug 231303, please add that one to the packaging using dpatch.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 231303 in gdecrypt "gdecrypt crashes when used with truecrypt >= 5" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/231303
<amikrop> Sorry for disturbing again, but I have a problem with dh_make. I don't really get how it works. We get into the directory where we have our filesystem tree and run dh_make?
<Iulian> amikrop: You have to run dh_make in the source dir.
<persia> amikrop: Be careful with dh_make.  It makes many assumptions, some of which are completely wrong, and contains lots of files you don't need.
<Iulian> amikrop: You might want to have a look at man dh_make
<amikrop> I have a directory. Let's say "my-package/". Inside there are two directories, e.g. "etc/" and "usr/". Where do I run dh_make?
<sebner> persia: but a beginner shouldn't create the files manually I suppose O_o
<mok0> sebner: yes, good boy...
<sebner> ^^
<amikrop> Wait, dh_make is about source archives. I don't have a source archive. I just want to place some Python scripts into the filesystem.
<persia> sebner: Why not?
<persia> sebner: amikrop can basically copy his special custom license for copyright, needs to do control anyway, and can use a 1-line CDBS rules.
<sebner> persia: Just think that scare a little bit
<sebner> persia: well, this is a special case
<amikrop> I mean, I don't have a .tar.gz file with C source code in it. I just want to place some Python script into specific directories.
<amikrop> *scripts
<persia> amikrop: Right.  As I said before, first create your tar.gz file with your scripts, and then package it.
<kirkland> soren: okay, if that's all, i'll go make those changes happen
<amikrop> "Packaging from Scratch" assumes that I have C source.
<amikrop> Which I want to compile.
<soren> kirkland: That's all I could find.
<soren> kirkland: :)
<amikrop> persia: But how to package it? How can I tell debhelper where I want it to put my scripts?
<kirkland> soren: k
<persia> amikrop: Your 1-line CDBS debian/rules will call dh_install.  You put the instructions in debian/install.  man dh_install
<amikrop> OK
<RainCT> sebner: eh?
<RainCT> :P
<sebner> RainCT: -.-, can we sync openbox? We you started packaging at your own?
<amikrop> It seems I am missing something here. All I know about packaging is "the IBM guide". I haven't understood anything from "Ubuntu Complete Packaging Guide". I think I am missing the essence (I am not a native English speaker). Can someone explain the basics, please?
<amikrop> Such as ... what do we do?
<RainCT> sebner: if no (important) changes are lost by doing so, yes
<amikrop> I would be grateful.
<sebner> RainCT: second question? We = why ^^
<RainCT> sebner: and what do you mean with "you started packaging at your own"?
<RainCT> sebner: I just uploaded the new version in time for hardy
<sebner> RainCT: -0ubuntu1, so because of the time you didn't sync it from debian?
<mok0> RainCT, sebner, I just ack'ed the openbox sync
<mok0> sebner: RainCT forked it off in Jan 2008
<amikrop> persia: Can you please explain me the basics? Don't assume that I know anything. It would be really nice if you could explain me what do we do. Just the very basics. How do we start, for example. I can't understant "Ubuntu Complete Packaging Guide".
<amikrop> *understand
<mok0> sebner: the earlier version was 3.4.5-1, and RainCT created 3.4.6-0ubuntu1
<RainCT> right.. I don't remember now but that was probably when FF was approaching
<sebner> mok0: you have the responsibility :P xD
 * persia is distracted by many things, but may explain later, if sufficienly motivated to lecture
<sebner> mok0: no to be honest I don't see something that speaks against a sync =)
<mok0> sebner: right
<sebner> mok0: ah kk, just can't remember but I wasn't requesting a sync just for fun so it should be right ^^
<sebner> RainCT: fine, thanks
<RainCT> and I updated openbox and obconf and send patches for both to Debian (obconf was updates some days later with the changes from my patch)
<mok0> sebner: but your request was not really adequate, I am sorry to say
<sebner> persia: no stress, calm down =)
<sebner> mok0: I'll have to learn to explain/write more. thanks for the hint
<lukehasnoname> Guys, I can't get into #ubuntu (using mibbit) so I'll ask here quickly: I need a CHM reader. CHM viewer won't show pages correctly, anything else that works?
<mok0> sebner: yeah, you have to provide the reasons why, "time to sync" is not convincing
<mok0> lukehasnoname: CHM??
<amikrop> geser: Or, could you help me, please? I have not understood anything from "Ubuntu Complete Packaging Guide". Could you explain the very basics? Like, what do we do?
<sebner> mok0: I just don't want to steal the reviewer all the work :P Everybody has to train his brain xD
<mok0> sebner: very funny ha, ha, ha.
<lukehasnoname> Microsoft Compiled HTML Help
<lukehasnoname> mok0
<persia> lukehasnoname: This still isn't a support channel.  There's a way to get into #ubuntu with mibbit: read the instructions in the redirect.
<mok0> Feel the force, lukehasnoname...
<kirkland> soren: okay, so I should drop the Uploaders line entirely?
<lukehasnoname> props persia. I didn't get that floodbot message last time. Sorry to interrupt
<kirkland> and as for Maintainer, I put myself...  Is that correct?
<soren> kirkland: It's not incorrect :)
<mok0> "compiled html" ... that would be Microsoft allright
<soren> kirkland: We generally put either motu or core-dev, but as long as it's an @ubuntu.com address, you're fine.
<kirkland> soren: what is correct?
<soren> kirkland: And yes, drop the uploaders line entirely.
<kirkland> soren: dropped.
<kirkland> soren: i'll make motu the maintainer
<soren> kirkland: its presence suggests a Debian origin, which clearly is not the case :)
<soren> kirkland: Alright. It's: "Ubuntu MOTU developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>"
<kirkland> soren: right, thanks.
<kirkland> soren: okay, cp /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL-3 to COPYING in the top level of the package
<mok0> ok, sebner your stuff is off the table now
<kirkland> soren: checkroot removed
<sebner> mok0: fine. May I find more? ^^
<kirkland> soren:  all references to build-stamp removed
<mok0> sebner: go right ahead. Of course they can always sit in the queue
<kirkland> soren: what about build and binary-arch targets?  they're empty too.....
<soren> kirkland: You need binary-arch.
<soren> kirkland: It's mandatory.
<soren> kirkland: So is build.
<kirkland> ok
<soren> kirkland: install is not, so feel free to drop that.
<soren> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-source.html#s-debianrules
<kirkland> soren: thanks.
<sebner> mok0: IIRC they are in queue ^^
<kirkland> soren: okay, as for the priority, i think ubuntu-vm-builder should be increased to "optional" for intrepid....  what do you think?
<sebner> bug #234162
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 234162 in kslovar "Please sync kslovar 0.2.7-1 from Debian(Unstable)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/234162
 * persia will be giving a special packaging lesson on how to package scripts, webapps, and firmware installers in #ubuntu-classroom starting at 15:30 UTC today.
<sebner> mok0: =)
<kirkland> soren: sorry, i see that you said that above
<sebner> persia: that's in 8 minutes xD
<mok0> Hey, that's in 7 minutes!!
 * persia goes off for a snack
 * mok0 rushes over to #ubuntu-classroom to get a good seat
<sebner> persia: but don't come too late xD
<kirkland> soren: okay, so I'm going to leave ubuntu-virt as "optional", and submit a patch/branch to you changing u-v-b to optional
<soren> kirkland: Alright.
<sebner> mok0: ACK my sync first. I like my description  ;)
<geser> mok0: what's in #u-classroom?
<soren> It's secret.
<kirkland> soren: do I bump the version from 1.0 to 1.1 now when I push to REVU again?
<geser> hmm, /me has to look himself then
<mok0> geser: eerrr persia's giving a class there?
<mok0> sebner: I have to verify that of course...
<sebner> mok0: sure :)
<soren> kirkland: No.
<mok0> hmph, I can't join u-classroom...
<mok0> there
 * sebner winks mok0 
 * mok0 hugs sebner
 * sebner hugs mok0 back =)
<kirkland> soren: crap, sorry, got your response too late....
<kirkland> soren: I built and uploaded ubuntu-virt_1.1 to REVU
<schmiedc> when does the lesson start there?
<kirkland> soren: PPA's won't take an updated package with the same version number
<mok0> schmiedc: now
<kirkland> soren: I assumed REVU was the same
<schmiedc> :)
<kirkland> soren: besides, i kinda wanted the changelog entry, so that I can go back through all the advice i got on this package
<soren> kirkland: Right.
<persia> kirkland: Many reviewers will discourage multiple changelog entries on REVU
<kirkland> persia: seriously?
<kirkland> hrm  :-/
<ScottK> kirkland: The purpose of REVU is to get packages reviewed for inclusion in the archive.  The debian/changelog should be appropriate for that.  You can use review comments to keep track of what's happened between each upload.
<kirkland> ScottK: okay thanks.  the confusion really comes from the difference between the PPAs and REVU.  PPAs will reject a second upload of a version already present.  Evidently REVU will not.
<ScottK> No.  That's a feature of REVU.  You can do multiple uploads of the intended package until you get them right.  REVU will also give you diffs between the uploads.
<Hobbsee> RainCT: ping
<kirkland> ScottK: okay, can I revert the change?  ie, back it down from 1.1 to 1.0 by uploading again?
<RainCT> Hobbsee: pong
<Hobbsee> RainCT: your gweled upload....
<Hobbsee> RainCT: did you test it?
<RainCT> yes, I've it installed right now
<RainCT> Hobbsee: because of the menu?
<Hobbsee> RainCT: yeah.  looks like it's changed the default language for everyone.
<Hobbsee> RainCT: was that intentional?
<kirkland> ScottK: Already uploaded to revu.tauware.de
<kirkland>   
<kirkland> ScottK: looks like no
<RainCT> Hobbsee: no, I have to look at that some day
<Hobbsee> RainCT: fixing it now - there's a patch.
<Riddell> Iulian: ping
<RainCT> Hobbsee: oh ok, great :)
<RainCT> Hobbsee: was this caused by the upload?
<ScottK> kirkland: On revu you can ask someone to nuke the upload and start over.
<Hobbsee> RainCT: looks like the patch did a whole bunch of the glade file over again, including changing language.
<Hobbsee> RainCT: yup
<Hobbsee> RainCT: the original patch shows the french.
<kirkland> REVU people: can you nuke ubuntu-virt so that I can start over?  problems with the versioning of the package, and it's just getting more confusing....
<Iulian> Riddell: pong
<Riddell> Iulian: giver seems to have two wrapper scripts, giver and givere, the only difference is that givere is sh not bash, is that intended?
<RainCT> Hobbsee: uops, sorry then
<Iulian> Riddell: Hmm, no, I don't think so. It should be the same as giver.
<Riddell> Iulian: but givere is intended to be there?
<Hobbsee> RainCT: the more amusing thing is that i've only noticed this tonight.
<ScottK> RainCT or Hobbsee: Would one of you please nuke ubuntu-virt off REVU for kirkland?
<Iulian> Riddell: Not really, no. I will have a look at it to be sure.
<RainCT> ScottK: sure
<ScottK> kirkland: ^^
<kirkland> ScottK: thanks much!
<ScottK> RainCT: Thanks.
<kirkland> RainCT: let me know when I can upload again
<ScottK> RainCT: Didn't MOTU used to have a nuke this package button on REVU?
<RainCT> ScottK: it depends on which level you have, contributor or admin.. but as a MOTU you should be admin
<RainCT> ScottK: to be sure, you don't even have the 'archive' button?
<RainCT> kirkland: done :)
<kirkland> RainCT: cool, thanks
<ScottK> RainCT: I have archive, but not nuke.
<RainCT> ScottK: ah. and if you archive something and then go to the archived uploads page, there isn't nuke?
<ScottK> Ah.  Didn't try that.
<RainCT> (or even without archiving anything)
<ScottK> RainCT: That's it.  Thanks.
<RainCT> np :)
<kirkland> RainCT: hmm, it's still telling me "Already uploaded to revu.tauware.de" ... is there some meta data in my local directory blocking an upload?
<sistpoty|work> kirkland: yes a .upload file (you can use dput -f)
<RainCT> moment
<RainCT> ah, right
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: no need to run that root script manually or?
<RainCT> (root script = script as root)
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: hm? which one?
<sebner> sistpoty|work: I just merged xgalaga. You'll like that game ^^
<ScottK> kirkland: Alternatively just delete the .upload file and then dput normally.
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: wasn't there a file which you have to execute to completely clean up nuked stuff?
<sistpoty|work> sebner: haven't tried it yet iirc
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: yes, /me looks
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: /srv/uploads/removals.txt
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: so is it necessary to run this file before someone reuploads?
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: and it should always only be run manually
<RainCT> yeh
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: no, it's completely unrelated, as every new upload will result in a new upid, and hence in a new directory on the server
<RainCT> ok :)
<Iulian> Riddell: I don't think it's intended to be there. Afaics givere is the same as giver. I'd have to talk to upstream to be sure but it's pretty inactive, didn't get any mail from them.
<Iulian> Riddell: Is there anything you might want to suggest?
<nicolasvw> afflux: got that, thankx for the patch
 * Hobbsee ponders actually doing a SRU.
<kirkland> soren: okay, REVU issues sorted out, uploaded a new copy of ubuntu-virt_1.0
<kirkland> soren: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=ubuntu-virt
<sebner> mok0: thanks =) Now I only have *1* merge left
<emgent> heya people
<Riddell> Iulian: I don't mind, I accepted it
<Neurostu> when specifying dependencies in control, do I need to specify each library individually or can in use wildcards like: libboost*
<Iulian> Riddell: Ok, I will fix it in the next upload.
<geser> Neurostu: use ${shlibs:Depends} and dh_shlibdeps in debian/rules to get this field filled during build
<Neurostu> geser: so i found dh_shlibdeps in my rules file, what is the syntax to list the libs under that? Also can I use wild cards or do I need to specify the libs one by one
 * sistpoty|work heads home... cya
<geser> Neurostu: dh_shlibdeps checks the binaries of your package which libs there are linked with, look up the packages they are in and puts this into the variable ${shlibs:Depends}
<sebner> *tumbs up* for persia  =)
<Neurostu> Sorry, I know it can be hard to explain thing to noobs, but I just want to make sure I get this.  I have dh_shlibs uncommented in rules, and I have Depends: ${shlibs:Depends} in my control file,  is that all I need? Or do I need to specify the list of dependencies
<geser> Neurostu: that's all you need
<geser> Neurostu: at least for libraries
<geser> if you need some other packages too then you must add them manually to Depends
<Neurostu> ok great. Thanks
<Iulian> Would anyone like to sponsor bug 237018? Here you can find the debdiff http://paste.ubuntu.com/16606/plain/
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 237018 in qgit "No icon installed" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/237018
<mok0> Iulian: I'll sponsor it if you promise to forward the mods to the DM
<Iulian> mok0: I was doing that right now.
<mok0> Iulian: cool :-)
<sebner> mok0: I made the experience that we should report that back to debian and wait for a sync ^^
<mok0> sebner: then we have to remember to get back to it.
<mok0> sebner: if the DM uploads a new version, it will be auto-synced
<sebner> mok0: assign the bug to ourself ... dunno. I just heard that very often
<mok0> sebner: I know
<sebner> mok0: why autosynced?
<mok0> because the DM will bump the release by 1
<mok0> sebner: automerged, of course
<sebner> ^^
<sebner> kk
<Iulian> A package shouldn't be synced forever, if I'm not wrong.
<Iulian> And afaics this package was synced every time.
<Iulian> Although I see a lot of packages without an Ubuntu change.
<mok0> Iulian: we strive to reduce the number of packages with Ubuntu changes
<Iulian> mok0: Right.
<mok0> Iulian: but as was said earlier today on the channel, it is sometimes difficult to get the DM to include .desktop entries quickly
<Iulian> mok0: Well, they are not so important for a package.
<mok0> Iulian: what about the copyright on the icon?
<mok0> Iulian: Debian doesn't use them
<Iulian> mok0: I'm looking for a copyright. This is the website from where I downloaded it http://developer.imendio.com/issues/browse/GGL-71
<mok0> Iulian: that is the most minimalistic debian/copyright I have seen to date... I would not pass in Ubuntu
<mok0> s/I/it/
<Iulian> mok0: Yea, that's what I thought in the first place.
<mok0> Iulian: hm, it says it's qgit's icon...
<Iulian> mok0: Indeed
<ScottK> Not sure about the package you are looking at now, but debian/copyright on a lot of older packages would seem skeletal if going through New today (Debian or Ubuntu).
<sebner> mok0: Do we "have" to convert a .png to a xpm?
<mok0> ScottK: it's qgit
<ScottK> So I guess it's not so old.
<mok0> sebner: yes
<ScottK> sebner: No binary files in debian dir.
<sebner> kk
<mok0> sebner: or uuencode it
<Iulian> mok0: So the best way would be to talk to the DM to include the desktop file I created.
<slytherin> geser: ping
<mok0> Iulian: yes, absolutely, but he may not be motivated to release a new package version just for Ubuntu
<geser> slytherin: pong
<slytherin> geser: Can you please advocate xml-commons-external?
<sebner> mok0: some days ago I reported a change back and 2 hours later he released a new version (though with a lot other changes but somehow lucky) ^^
<Iulian> mok0: Exactly
<geser> slytherin: will to later today, I'm now in a meeting
<slytherin> geser: Ok.
<mok0> Iulian: exactly, my comment or sebners?
<Iulian> mok0: Your comment.
<Iulian> mok0: First of all I should talk to him to see if he is preparing a new upload, if yes I will tell him to include the desktop file too.
<mok0> Iulian: But, we need to find out where that icon comes from
<mok0> Iulian: ... and the .xpm
<Iulian> mok0: The .xpm is the icon I converted from .png
<mok0> Iulian: sure, but we only have that guy's word that it's a qgit icon
<mok0> It'd be nice to find it and see what the copyright of it is
<Iulian> mok0: Yea, that would be nice indeed.
<mok0> Iulian: otherwise you have to make one :-P
<Iulian> mok0: Ehh?
<Iulian> mok0: You have to be kidding me.
 * mok0 never kids 
<Iulian> mok0: To be honest, I don't know nothing about how to create an icon.
<mok0> Iulian: but seriously, I don't think we can add an icon as a special Ubuntu feature without knowing that it is allowed
<mok0> Iulian: It's just a square image that you scale down to 48x48
<mok0> Iulian: The Gimp
<Iulian> mok0: Uhmm, yeah, I forgot completely about the copyright thingie.
<Iulian> mok0: Do I have to do it manually?
<mok0> Iulian: I know... "it's just a little picture..."
<Iulian> mok0: With my touchpad? :P
<Iulian> mok0: Heh :)
<mok0> Iulian: I was thinking... how about taking those little red & black lines and dots from the screenshot
<mok0> http://sourceforge.net/project/screenshots.php?group_id=139897&ssid=33933
 * Iulian is looking
<mok0> green actually
<Iulian> mok0: Right
<mok0> Iulian: looks a bit like the "old" one
<mok0> Iulian: then put a Q in there perhaps
<Iulian> mok0: Ohh, you're right. I would have to change that.
<Iulian> mok0: Yea, maybe.
 * Iulian is opening gimp.
 * mok0 has to go cook dinner...
<Iulian> mok0: Enjoy
<YokoZar> Is anyone here a Debian sponsor?  I'd like to get a package into universe that's currently waiting for sponsorship in Debian: http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/l/libtorrent-rasterbar/
<YokoZar> I could just upload it to Ubuntu myself, but it seems like it'd be better to go the Debian route first.  The package has been waiting for a Debian sponsor for a few weeks now
<Neurostu> So I'm almost done getting my packages built... I got them to compile but I get the following error when I try to install them, here are the last few lines of the error: http://mwl.pastebin.com/m72720411
<Laney> Neurostu: Did you install using dpkg?
<Neurostu> I specified the package that I need to run the program in the control file so shouldn't it automatically download when I run dpkg -i package.deb
<Neurostu> yes I used dpkg
<geser> Neurostu: sudo apt-get -f install
<slytherin> YokoZar: If you are uploading it to Debian already then it is better to file a sync bug once it gets accepted.
<geser> Neurostu: dpkg -i doesn't install the dependencies for you, only apt-get
<slytherin> Neurostu: dpkg doesn't work that way
<Neurostu> ok, can apt-get install from a local deb? or does it only install from repos?
<geser> Neurostu: only from a repo, but it can be a local repo
<Neurostu> ok great thanks
<Neurostu> Great, it grabbed the needed packages from the ubuntu repos! Thanks! you guys really have helped me out a ton!
<YokoZar> slytherin: I'm not a Debian developer, that's why I need a Debian sponsor to do it (it's not my package, but a package I want to upload depends on it)
<slytherin> YokoZar: Fine. My point is that once someone sponsors it into Debian, file a sync bug. You will have wait for a while.
<slangasek> er, no sync bug needs to be filed
<slangasek> we're in auto-sync mode right now
<YokoZar> slytherin: Yeah, that was my thought.  Just wanted to poke around here and hope I can get it sponsored so I can get working on the dependent packages ;)
<ScottK> slytherin: Also there's no harm in waiting a while at this point in the release cycle.
<slytherin> :-)
<slytherin> ï»¿geser: One more request. I have filed bug 235737 for moving glassfish-javaee to universe. It will be great if you can verify and ack it.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 235737 in glassfish "Please move package to universe" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/235737
<Laney> Huh? Someone confirmed one of my merge bugs
<ScottK> Laney: Put it back and point the triager too https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToTriage#head-0670f256d42484d8f9d0cec896eb2c05e43388e3
<Laney> ScottK: Thanks, will do
<aDmos> hi an alle. ist deutsch als sprache ok?
<laga> english is much preferred
<aDmos> ok, sorry
<Neurostu> can anyone recommend some literature on how to sign packages? I've tried reading the ubuntu wiki page but it isn't making a lot of sense
<schmiedc> how to you mean sign?
<geser> Neurostu: where are you struck?
<schmiedc> isn't it with gpg
<geser> yes, it is
<Neurostu> So I've built my packages but when I install them it says: WARNING: The following packages cannot be authenticated!
<Neurostu> yes I want to sign with gnupg
<schmiedc> have you attached your key to your launpad acc?
<Neurostu> so I don't even  have a key yet...
<Neurostu> or a launchpad acct
<schmiedc> i am pretty new to that stuff myself
<schmiedc> so from where do you want to install your packages?
<Neurostu> geser: from what I've read, it looks like all I need to do is great a signature and then pass that to dpkg-buildpackage to sign the package, is this right
<geser> Neurostu: ah, you talk about repository signing
<Neurostu> I'm going to host them from my own webserver
<Neurostu> geser: yes I think so..
<geser> you need to sign the Release file
<geser> and on the client add the public key you signed the repository with
<geser> depending on the software you use to manage the repository it can perhaps automate this all
<geser> (the signing of the Release file)
<RoAkSoAx> wouldn't be easy to just use a PPA?
<geser> RoAkSoAx: PPAs aren't signed
<Neurostu> so what is a Release file?  So I haven't been using any software to manage the repo, i've just been doing it all by hand (granted the repo only has 2 packages in it and probably won't grow past 10 packages or so)
<RoAkSoAx> true
<RoAkSoAx> but instead of setting a hole new repo server would be easy to have a PPA, right?
<Neurostu> So, we already have a webserver running, it is hosting our SVN repo, and our wiki
<Neurostu> we would like to keep everything in house as well
<Neurostu> Geser: So all I need to do is create a release file, sign it, and give my users the public key?
<geser> yes
<laga> falcon is a very nice piece of software to manage a repository. just in case you don't want to do it all manually.
<geser> Neurostu: see e.g. http://falcon.kaarsemaker.net/ for an easy repository manager which can create a gpg-signed repository
<Neurostu> ty
<NielsE> I'm working on the packagingGuide with the gnu-helloWorld, now I want to change the text of the manpage, where can I do that? ./man/hello.1 gets overwritten each time I "debuild"
<lukehasnoname> laga and geser thanks for that, I've wondered what it takes to set up a repo
<ScottK> lukehasnoname: Falcon is pacakged and in the Ubuntu repository for Hardy.
<LaserJock> mok0: ping
<LaserJock> norsetto: ping
<sebner> LaserJock: huhu, how are you? how are you doing with your studies?
<LaserJock> pretty good
<norsetto> LaserJock: yessir!
<LaserJock> norsetto: libitpp SRU
 * norsetto stands on attention
<LaserJock> norsetto: where are we with that
<norsetto> LaserJock: yessir yes
<norsetto> LaserJock: the bug report says it all
<LaserJock> I poked around with it this morning and it builds fine
<norsetto> LaserJock: it builds fine, it installs fine, it runs fine
<LaserJock> is that sufficient for a "works for me"?
<norsetto> LaserJock: last I talked with pitti he was pretty happy with it, I don't know why he hasn't uploaded yet, perhaps just busy with other stuff
<LaserJock> norsetto: OK, I'll add a "builds/installs fine here, please move to -updates"
<norsetto> LaserJock: okki dokki, it won't hurt, thanks for checking it
<LaserJock> norsetto: thanks for doing the SRU
<norsetto> LaserJock: my pleasure
<norsetto> sebner: how are things going with eggdrop?
<sebner> norsetto: will fight it on weekend. Have to learn for school -.- hours and hours
<laga> study hard. or you'll end up doing merges for the rest of your life :)
<schmiedc> gg
<sebner> laga: If I would recieve money for it of course. When should I start =)
<DktrKranz> sebner, you only receive a "uploaded, thanks ;)", no money
<\sh> sebner, just do your abi and study :)
<laga> sebner: you doing your abi this year?
<sebner> folks, I'm young. don't destroy my dreams xD
<sebner> laga: yes
<\sh> if you don't do that, you'll end like me...old, motu and stressfull senior unix admin...you don't want to do that
<sebner> laga: in 3 weeks
<laga> sebner: good luck. my GF will be done on thursday. :)
<sebner> \sh: no, I hate server stuff :P
<sebner> laga: ^^ thanks
<laga> sebner: i got mine last year.. and i didn't enjoy the process, so be smarter than me and actually start studying when there's still time left.
<laga> ;)
<sebner> laga: I discovered that ^^
 * norsetto wonders what of the 3 is worse: old, motu or senior unix admin
<mario_limonciell> how do you earn an application binary interface?
<\sh> sebner, the only way to fly is working with servers...desktops are so user oriented
<schmiedc> to late for me to start early enough :P
<laga> mario_limonciell: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abitur :)
<sebner> \sh: I'm a user, I'm merging for users ^^
<mario_limonciell> laga, oh that's a lot less enjoyable
<\sh> norsetto, you don't say anything ;)
<mario_limonciell> i'll continue to pretend that you meant what i thought you did by ABI
<laga> mario_limonciell: well, i rather have abi than ABI - ABIs tend to change a lot.
<norsetto> \sh: well, I'm not a senior unix admin :-)
<sebner> norsetto: If you don't say you are old, you aren't old xD
<\sh> oh well...my boss told me this morning, that I have to give some presentation how the internet actually works for all our development horses ;)
<sebner> lol
<schmiedc> nice
<\sh> na
<\sh> if you do some development on web apps or other things using the net, you should already know
<schmiedc> Ã¤hmm right
<\sh> anyways...time to move my old body to the couch and waiting for food
<\sh> bbt
<schmiedc> gg enjoy
<ScottK> \sh: You need another ~10 years before you're allowed to complain about old.
<LaserJock> the u-u-s queue is quite long :(
<sebner> what's up MOTUs?
<sebner> clean the queue :P
<schmiedc> where is the queue?
<geser> schmiedc: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-universe-sponsors/+subscribedbugs
<geser> LaserJock: it's not that long if you ignore bug #230350
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 230350 in chmsee "Missing Debian Maintainer field" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/230350
<geser> btw: could someone with more patient try to open that bug and check if there is something to sponsor?
<LaserJock> it would be good to clean out the bugs that aren't really appropriate and they should all be triaged (proper status and Importance)
<NielsE> I'm working on the packagingGuide with the gnu-helloWorld, now I want to change the text of the manpage, where can I do that?
<nicolasvw> geser: they're a few of those upthere I never get to open... lp timeouts on me each time ;)
<NielsE> I have changed about every file, but when I install the .deb it gives me the original manpage
<norsetto> NielsE: my guess is that you are not installing the updated package, what version would that be? And what version have you installed? You can check with debdiff (or directly in the .diff.gz) if your change was applied correctly
<schmiedc> cya
<NielsE> norsetto: the changes are beÃ¯ng applied, the .diff for example note's that ./doc/hello.texi has changed
<sebner> norsetto: I'm not working on eggdrop right now but I have a (stupid) question about the control file. why just doesn't we set a "eggdrop replaces eggdrop-ssl" and the other way round?
<norsetto> sebner: why would you want to do that? Is not the right use for the replaces
<sebner> norsetto: dunno, it's just that my brain tells me that that is the most logical solution xD
<geser> nicolasvw: the famous "Missing Debian Maintainer field" bug, it has too many tasks that LP times out regularly
<ScottK> geser: There was a fix for that on (IIRC) dogfood.  Dunno if it's deployed now or now.
<sebner> ScottK: correct my it that's not true but it seems that this maintainer thing is the fault of the MOTUs since a contributor doesn't get his debdiff uploaded without a missing MOTU field!?
<norsetto> sebner: replaces will overwrite the other package, conflicts will just refuse to install
<ScottK> sebner: Depends on who uploaded it.
<ScottK> sebner: Some of them date to before we had a policy to change the maintainer.
<sebner> ScottK: but not all :P
<ScottK> Yes.
<sebner> norsetto: if I have eggdrop installed and want to install -ssl it conflicts so I have to remove the one first. Replaces does this automatically for me so why isn't that the best solution??
<norsetto> sebner: because some users may do that without knowing, like installing eggdrop and eggdrop-ssl at the same time
 * ScottK hands sebner update-alternatives
<sebner> norsetto: what happens if I install both at the same time?
<sebner> ScottK: hmm?
<norsetto> sebner: you really want to use replaces when a package "functionally" replaces another one
<ScottK> sebner: The alternatives system is the way you're supposed to deal with multiple packages doing the same job in the same file namespace.
<sebner> ScottK: ah I know that from java ^^
<sebner> norsetto: ah I think I'm understanding slowly
<LaserJock> I can actually get to the Debian Maintainer bug now
<nicolasvw> woohoo LaserJock ;)
<sebner> norsetto: like libungif and libgif or how that was called!?
<norsetto> sebner: dunno about that
<sebner> norsetto: nvm. Will bug you again on weekend =)
<apachelogger> sebner: that was/is a transition
<apachelogger> the libgif src now creates a libungif package which is eventually empty and just depends on libgif
<sebner> apachelogger: yes but the both libs have the same functionality?
<apachelogger> yep
<sebner> so I'm right
<sebner> ^^
<LaserJock> I got a question about the u-u-s queue, should unsub'ing when a task is done or is not ready for action?
<LaserJock> I noticed that u-u-s is subscribed to a total of ~ 2k bugs
<sebner> LaserJock: 2k? xD rofl
<ScottK> LaserJock: How many of those are the Debian Maintainer bug?  It'll show up once per affected package.
<cody-somerville> I only see 139 bugs.
<ScottK> Have I mentioned lately that I'm not a fan of the LP U/I.
<LaserJock> well, I think there are only ~ 100 total for the Debian Maintainer
<LaserJock> cody-somerville: that's the open bugs
<LaserJock> there are 2k total subscribed
<sistpoty> <- off to bed
<sistpoty> gn8 everyone
<ScottK> LaserJock: Most people don't bother to unsubscribe if they've fixed it.  I don't see that as a real problem.
<LaserJock> ScottK: it's not particularly, I just wonder if it eventual would bite us in the butt if it just keeps going up
 * cody-somerville wonders if launchpad is 32bit of 64bit.
<cody-somerville> *or
 * norsetto wonders if launchpad is real
<LaserJock> but more important are the Incomplete bugs and ones that are not ready or appropriate for u-u-s
<ScottK> It's a pretty beefy postgres DB on the back end, I think it won't be a problem.
<sebner> norsetto: maybe canoncial released a haXX0r virus that makes a illusion -> LP xD
<LaserJock> I think maybe we should close the Debian Maintainer bug
<LaserJock> how are we even supposed to work with debdiffs, etc. on that thing
<LaserJock> s/we/you all/ ;-)
<ScottK> LaserJock: I think it's like the Perl 5.10 transition bug.  It'd have been better not filed, but at this point the damage is done.
<ScottK> LaserJock: I'd do it from bugmail myself.
<sebner> ScottK: how to process this then? Automatically rebuild als the packages against new perl?
<LaserJock> ScottK: which bugmail? from u-u-s subscription?
<ScottK> Well if you're subscribed to bugs for any of the affected packages, you get it all.
 * ScottK certainly does for both.
<LaserJock> I just wonder if we could at least unsub u-u-s
 * ScottK sort of assumed that was generally applicable.
<LaserJock> it's rather pointless, IMO
<ScottK> Agreed.
<norsetto> LaserJock: my guess is that if you unsubscribe it, it is going to be subscribed again in no time
<LaserJock> norsetto: why? we can send an email to -motu
<ScottK> LaserJock: Then the next hopeful who attaches a debdiff subscribes it again.
<LaserJock> hmmpf
<LaserJock> surely we can handle a small deviation from normal workflow
<norsetto> LaserJock: about workflow, where are we with this election business!?
<LaserJock> hmm
<ScottK> LaserJock: I say we assign it to they guy that filed it and make him sponsor all the uploads.
<ScottK> they/the
<LaserJock> ScottK: that's not a bad idea :-)
<LaserJock> ScottK: it's not a terribly important bug, IMO, since we already decided to change as we uploaded
<ScottK> Agreed.
 * ScottK just wishes he could unsubscribe from the bugmail.
<ajmitch> good morning
 * cody-somerville wishes he didn't get unwanted bugmail.
<LaserJock> norsetto: my guess is we may just want to have a consensus on how many people to have on the team
 * cody-somerville wishes bugs didn't exist.
<LaserJock> norsetto: if it's ok to just add all 3 then we're ready to go
<norsetto> morning ajmitch
<sebner> cody-somerville: do would you do then for (x)ubuntu? ^^
<cody-somerville> :O
<norsetto> LaserJock: lets say, if somebody is not ok then we change ;-)
<sebner> first do = what ^^
<cody-somerville> sebner, jerk! Xubuntu is not buggy :P
<sebner> cody-somerville: Oh sorry. I forgot :P
<norsetto> cody-somerville: does xubuntu use gconf keys?
<LaserJock> norsetto: well, follow up sistpoty's email with that please
<LaserJock> norsetto: just a "If nobody objects I say we add all 3" or some such
 * andrew_sayers wishes he had bugs enough to complain about :p
<norsetto> LaserJock: indeed
<cody-somerville> norsetto, Isn't that done on the application level?
<norsetto> cody-somerville: ok, so, there is no infrastructure being provided by the desktop manager?
<cody-somerville> norsetto, Not at the moment. They are working on something calling xfconf for 4.6 which will ship with 8.10
<cody-somerville> norsetto, Applications that use gconf use gconf
<ajmitch> LaserJock: good to see you back amongst us (again) ;)
<LaserJock> ajmitch: bah
<norsetto> cody-somerville: ok, good to know. Still on xubuntu, do you know what path its used as the default path in file dialogues? $HOME or something else?
<cody-somerville> norsetto, $HOME usually
<norsetto> cody-somerville: I see, I got a report about one of the applications I packaged where a user is reporting that in the save dialogue the path is always / in xubuntu
<cody-somerville> norsetto, what application?
<norsetto> cody-somerville: I don't have xubuntu, but its $home in gnome or kubuntu, so I was wondering
<cody-somerville> norsetto, I have ubuntu-desktop installed
<cody-somerville> norsetto, but we do install gconf
<cody-somerville> norsetto, but if a package in ubuntu adds the key and we don't ship that package...
<norsetto> cody-somerville: what do you mean you don't ship it? Its in our repo.
<cody-somerville> norsetto, We do ship it
<cody-somerville> norsetto, What I am saying is that if another package we don't ship installs the key you're using, we might not have it
<norsetto> cody-somerville: I wouldn't know about that. Anyhow, if you want to check the bug, its bug 236887. I set it to invalid for the time being, perhaps you can understand why on xuubuntu its doing that?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 236887 in gecko-mediaplayer "Leading slash when downloading video (firefox 3, gecko media plugin)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/236887
<cody-somerville> norsetto, just because it doesn't work in Xubuntu doesn't mean it isn't a bug in your package
<norsetto> cody-somerville: thats why I would like a xubuntu guy to check it out, I can't reproduce in gnome/kubuntu
<cody-somerville> norsetto, Instead of closing the bug you should have marked it as incomplete and given a test case for someone else to try and confirm.
<cody-somerville> norsetto, If you'll do that, I'll be happy to try and reproduce it.
<norsetto> cody-somerville: I can do that, no problem.
<cody-somerville> Thanks :)
<norsetto> cody-somerville: done, thanks for helping
<cody-somerville> norsetto, no problem
<lukehasnoname> I'm surprised mono isn't in multiverse
<ScottK> Why?
<ScottK> Theories of maybe it has patent problems don't count.
<directhex> because novell si teh devil
<directhex> now, someone sponsor my mono 1.9.1 merge
<ScottK> mono is in Main, isn't it?
<directhex> yeah
<ScottK> So this would be the wrong channel.
<directhex> true
<ScottK> directhex: Did you subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors?
<directhex> ScottK, aye
<ScottK> That should be enough then.
 * norsetto looks around for masochist core-devs
<lukehasnoname>  no
<lukehasnoname> it is in universe
<directhex> no, it's in main
<ajmitch> incorrect, main
<lukehasnoname> monodevelop (1.0+dfsg-1ubuntu1) [universe]
<lukehasnoname> er
<lukehasnoname> gm
<ScottK> lukehasnoname: He said mono
<lukehasnoname> er, hm
<lukehasnoname> ya
<directhex>      1.2.6+dfsg-6ubuntu3 0
<directhex>         500 http://mirror.ox.ac.uk hardy/main Packages
<lukehasnoname> as soon as I pasted that I thought, "wait, this argument is too easy
<lukehasnoname> "
<ScottK> Well then.  You were right about one thing.
<ScottK> ;-)
<lukehasnoname> I guess main is handled by core devs
<lukehasnoname> check, ya
<ScottK> Yes and for mono, not this one.
<directhex> i'll just poke slomo_ some more.
 * ajmitch used to do mono merges, but hasn't touched it for awhile
<directhex> well, the debdiff is done, checked, verified, and working for me. but there's all that handwavey "other" stuff that happens in the background to turn bugs into packages
<Jazzva> norsetto: Regarding bug 236887, it is mentioned in changelog for gnome-mplayer 0.6.2 as fixed. Should I close the bugreport. gecko-mediaplayer uses gnome-mplayer, so I suppose that gnome-mplayer can be the source of the problem.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 236887 in gecko-mediaplayer "Leading slash when downloading video (firefox 3, gecko media plugin)" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/236887
<Jazzva> norsetto: to close it in the changelog, that is...
<norsetto> Jazzva: you mean this one "Fix problem with 'Save As..' where filename started with a /"?
<Jazzva> Yep... It sounds similar to the bugreport...
<norsetto> I'm not sure actually
<Jazzva> Oh, I think I misread it
<norsetto> jazzva: but you could be right
<norsetto> jazzva: I think you got it right :-)
<Jazzva> Well, we can ask upstream, if that's what they meant...
<norsetto> jazzva: well, upstream is not very responsive in this kind of questions, you may try
<Jazzva> norsetto: I think I saw a bugreport on their BTS, so I'll check again...
<norsetto> jazzva: lets check their bts
<ember> a package using epoch needs his package.symbols with epochs too?
<Jazzva> norsetto: It's not there. I'll file a bugreport, just to see if the change in the ChangeLog is the fix for the bug reported.
<norsetto> Jazzva: no, don't do that, just wait a sec
<Jazzva> k
<guest22> Can someone explain the procedure for submitting a new version of a package already accepted into Ubuntu? Is the review process the same as for a new package?
<ScottK> guest22: No.  Make the package, attach the diff.gz to a bug, and subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors (if the package is in universe)
<norsetto> Jazzva: no, I can't find any reference, but looking at the code I think this is indeed the problem reported
<Jazzva> Hmm, we might ask the reporter to test the new package... Dunno, to upload it to the PPA for hardy and to post the link. What do you think?
<Jazzva> norsetto ^^
<guest22> ScottK: That procedure also holds if the update corresponds to new upstream source? Presumably the diff.gz is just on the debian directories, and the build system access the new upstream source by using the watch file?
<norsetto> Jazzva: no, the report is clear, the filename that starts with a /, just close it in the changelog, I'll mark the bug as fix committed
<norsetto> jazzva: thanks!
<Jazzva> norsetto: No problem. Glad I can help :)
<ScottK> guest22: That's the case I was specifically mentioning.  When you make your new source packages, diff.gz is one of the files produced.
<ScottK> The sponsor should retrieve the source tarball themselves.
<guest22> Sorry, my question wasn't clear. When uploading to REVU, the full debian source package is provided. In this case, only the diff.gz is uploaded, so the source package has to be built by someone before it's included as an update.
<norsetto> ok, now that jazzva made my day I can go to bed
<norsetto> g'night all
<Jazzva> norsetto: You'll have the diffs in the morning ;)
<ScottK> guest22: That's correct.  You need to build the source package to make the diff.gz and then the sponsor will make it again when they review/upload it.
<guest22> ScottK: And in this case the sponsor is any MOTU who becomes involved by noticing an open bug report, as opposed to noticing a new package for review on REVU?
<ScottK> Yes.  This is why you subscrive ubuntu-universe-sponsors.  That puts it on the list to be looked at.
<guest22> ScottK: OK, thanks for the explanation.
<ScottK> No problem.
#ubuntu-motu 2008-06-04
<Jazzva> What is the right way of preparing diff for new upstream version? Interdiff or debdiff?
<ruiboon> Jazzva: afaik should be interdiff. debdiff is used for the same upstream version
<Jazzva> ruiboon: Thanks
<TheMuso> Jazzva: We no longer use interdiff. The approach now is to use a .diff.gz, and somehow give a link to the upstream tarball, preferably with either a debian/watch file or a debian/rules get-orig-source rule.
<Jazzva> TheMuso: Hmm, ok. I have already uploaded the interdiff, but I'll prepare diff.gz. I couldn't remember if that was the process in the last upload for this package, but it looks like it was. Thanks for the help :)
<leleobhz> someone know if its possible to dist-upgrade from debian lenny to ubuntu hardy?
<leleobhz> its a dom0 machine
<Laney> No
<leleobhz> some reasonsable way to do this/
<wgrant> Reinstall.
<wgrant> It's the only option.
<leleobhz> hell...
<wgrant> What you're asking is to both crossgrade and downgrade.
<leleobhz> another to get out: its possible to install ubuntu into a promise S150 TX4 raid?
<leleobhz> because its a softraid controller... so i dunno if i can do this
<wgrant> Also, this isn't a support channel. You want #ubuntu.
<leleobhz> ok, np
<leleobhz> wgrant: thanks!
 * ajmitch did once do a crossgrade from sid to hoary, about a month after warty released
<ajmitch> of course at the time there weren't quite so many ubuntu modifications
<wgrant> And Hoary was months older than sid...
<wgrant> *wasn't
<persia> Changing at release time to the next dev release would be a bumpy ride for six months, but might be least painful.
<ajmitch> right, it was during the autosync phase
<wgrant> Changing from a dev non-release to an earlier release would be very, very difficult.
<persia> wgrant: Yes, indeed.  Nearly impossible, given how dpkg does things.
 * ScottK almost succeeded once in upgrading an old Xandros 3.0 (based on Sarge) install to Dapper.
<ajmitch> almost?
<persia> ScottK: Also, that's release to later release, which is easier than pre-release to older release
<ScottK> It was going very nicely until I did a bad thing.
<ScottK> Yes.
<ajmitch> my sid->hoary install lasted well until dapper, when the hardware died & I did a fresh amd64 install
<persia> ajmitch: You didn't want to try the i386 -> amd64 upgrade? ;)
<ajmitch> couldn't be bothered :)
<persia> ScottK: What was the "bad thing"?
<ajmitch> the fresh install gave me a chance to setup lvm on raid properly from the installer, rather than trying to do an in-place upgrade
 * persia has been waiting for a good excuse to do that
<wgrant> I've never crossgraded from Debian, but I do have a Warty/Hoary (I forget which)  installation which has been upgraded through every release and is now on Hardy.
<ajmitch> that's just working as intended
<wgrant> But our upgrades don't work, remember?
<ajmitch> I'm still in the process of upgrading that amd64 install to hardy
<ajmitch> a few packages at a time
<ScottK> persia: I thought I had successfully booted into the new kernel (I hadn't - lilo got me and I hadn't given enough attention to exactly what happened) and I deleted some critical kernel modules from the old kernel.
<persia> ScottK: Ah.  That can hurt.
<ScottK> Yeah.
<nhandler> Is the addition of the Vcs-Svn field in debian/control considered too significant to be dropped?
<persia> nhandler: How do you mean?  For a merge?
<nhandler> persia: Yeah. One of the Ubuntu changes was adding a Vcs-Svn field to debian/control. I don't know if this is significant or not
<RAOF> Very much so.
<persia> nhandler: It might be, depends on the Vcs-Svn entry.
<persia> If Ubuntu added it for an Ubuntu-dedicated VCS, than it's essential.
 * RAOF lets persia take this one :)
<persia> If Ubuntu added it because Debian happens to keep something somewhere, maybe less so.
<persia> If Debian updated and removed it for internal Debian purposes, it's critical that we drop it, even though it might look like outstanding Ubuntu variation.
<persia> These cases need a bit more investigation, and the automated tools can't help very much.
<nhandler> persia: It doesn't look like the field was ever present in Debian. It points to: vn://svn.debian.org/utnubu/packages/gtimelog.
<persia> nhandler: Hmm..  That's a somewhat odd case.
<persia> Does that repo have the existing package?
<persia> Generally, I think the Utnubu changes are worth keeping, but the team is less active these days :(
<nhandler> persia: I'm not the familiar with svn, but when I attempted to go to svn.debian.org/utnubu/packages/gtimelog in firefox, I got a 404 error
<persia> nhandler: How about svn co svn://svn.debian.org/utnubu/packages/gtimelog
<nhandler> persia: Do you think this is because utnubu is no longer the maintainer?
<persia> "utnubu" was never the maintainer.  That's just a Debian team that helped reduce the Debian/Ubuntu variation (somewhat like DCT, but from the other side)
<nhandler> persia: The svn co command downloaded an older version, 0.0+svn65. The version I am merging is 0.0+svn88-2
<persia> nhandler: Then you want to drop it, as it is clearly inaccurate.
<nhandler> persia: Ok, I'll drop it. Just out of curiosity, what does that field do?
<persia> nhandler: It tells the package management tools to tell the user that the source is maintained in a VCS.
<persia> This makes it easier for collaborative maintenance, as people can just update the VCS.
<nhandler> persia: Ok, but it doesn't actually download anything from the VCS, right?
<persia> nhandler: It can, it depends on which tools you use.  apt-get source doesn't.
<persia> Good examples of how this works are for the Python Applications Packaging Team or the Games team.
<persia> In the vast majority of cases, both teams sync all the time, as when there are Ubuntu changes, Ubuntu members of the team commit them to the VCS, and they are in the next Debian release.
<nhandler> persia: Ok, I think I get it now. Thanks for all of your help (once again ;) ). I'm going to go and finish up the bug report. Then I'm going to get some sleep
<persia> nhandler: Glad to explain.  Thanks for asking, and good luck with the merge.
<nhandler> persia: Actually, now that I can drop the Vcs-Svn addition, it is a sync ;)
<persia> nhandler: Even better :)
<StevenK> TheMuso: So, what do I have to do to get an SRU approved? :-)
<ajmitch> beg? beer?
<TheMuso> StevenK: I assume you've followed https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<TheMuso> StevenK: If so, bug number please. :)
 * StevenK peers at the wiki page
<StevenK> TheMuso: Bug 195260
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 195260 in mailscanner "MailScanner won't start due to variable $FIELD_NAME" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/195260
<TheMuso> StevenK: looking.
<StevenK> Heh. MailScanner in Intrepid is caught up by the Perl transition.
<TheMuso> StevenK: ACK. Noted in the bug also.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Hm. Do I still need two acks?
<TheMuso> I would say get into intrepid first but since it will affected in the perl transition things should sort themselves out.
<TheMuso> StevenK: No just one.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Right, since the version of MailScanner in Intrepid is a sync, I seriously doubt it has the same problem.
<TheMuso> StevenK: Indeed.
<dholbach> good morning
<wgrant> white: You're killing off 915resolution, I see.
<directhex> is it still needed? i've been able to get proper behaviour without 915resolution and just a few xorg.conf tweaks since hoary
<wgrant> directhex: Um, you can't have needed it in the first place, then...
<wgrant> The X driver changes needed to work around it only appeared in -i810-modesetting, which later became -intel, which only appeared in the last couple of Ubuntu releases.
<directhex> hm, i'm confusing 915resolution with i855-crt
<wgrant> Ah, that makes sense.
<wgrant> But you're right, 915resolution is no longer required.
<directhex> i had terrible trouble with the -intel driver, which forced purchase of a bunch of geforces
<directhex> but ho hum
<wgrant> When was this?
<wgrant> I have found -intel to be the best driver I've worked with.
<directhex> hm... i think i was using a hardy alpha, and a release version didn't help
<directhex> it strongly objected to the widescreen 20" HP monitors i was using
<ssam> would anyone be interested in pushing https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/totem/+bug/217301 for SRU. Sebastien Bacher has commented that it is simple and worth it. it has been fixed in debian and intrepid
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 217301 in gst-plugins-ugly0.10 "Real Player stream is garbled on BBC radio" [Medium,Fix released]
<directhex> oh, that's not just me then
<directhex> i'd say it's worth an SRU, not that my word counts for anything
<DktrKranz> ssam: it seems a good SRU candidate. please, nominate for hardy and subscribe motu-sru. If you can prepare a debdiff for hardy-proposed and provide a good TEST CASE, it would be great.
<ssam> can the debdiff by pulled out of the debian or intrepid update?
<directhex> does the intrepid update change anything other than fixing that bug?
<ssam> directhex, i dont think so https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gst-plugins-ugly0.10 its the 0.10.7.4-1 version
<DktrKranz> ssam: since there is a new upstream version, you should simply apply patch from upstream and prepare a new revision in hardy.
<DktrKranz> it is not probably worth backporting a whole release, unless it fixed only this bug
<directhex> the version number HAS changed, so you should check the upstream changelog to see what changed from 0.10.7.3 to 0.10.7.4
<ssam> ok
<ssam> i have already put a patch on the bugreport that just makes the changes needed https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/totem/+bug/217301/comments/11
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 217301 in gst-plugins-ugly0.10 "Real Player stream is garbled on BBC radio" [Medium,Fix released]
<DktrKranz> I see, is it the one provided by gnome 529359 ?
<ubottu> Gnome bug 529359 in gst-plugins-bad "BBC Real Audio stream is just noise" [Normal,Resolved: fixed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=529359
<ssam> its from gnomes SVN server
<directhex> looks like it to me, DktrKranz
<ssam> i mean the freedesktop svn
<DktrKranz> good, then. Just apply in gst-plugins-ugly0.10 source package and prepare a debdiff. If you need guidance, you can ping me or ask here :)
<ssam> DktrKranz, are these https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing the right instructions?
<effie_jayx> Hey guys, I am trying to build a source package but I seem to get an error when doing so. it complains about ": or ::" in the target file 'clean', it is basically in the clean section of debian/rules. I am sure I did not touch there and the file just reads 'clean:' to state the clean section.
<ssam> DktrKranz, is it ok to just apply the patch, or do i need to put it in debian/patches
<DktrKranz> ssam: yes. They're not a complete set, but they include basic steps. Since SRUs are a bit different from regular uploads, feel free to ping if you need assistance.
<james_w> effie_jayx: hi, does the package use cdbs?
<ssam> and is it ok, that i dont know exactly how the patch works. just that it does work for me, and that upstream have committed it
 * effie_jayx checks
<effie_jayx> james_w,  yes
<Laney> Is there a problem creating intrepid chroots (pbuilder) atm?
<james_w> effie_jayx: with cdbs targets should use '::', let me see if this is explained somewhere.
<effie_jayx> james_w,  thanks
<Laney> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/16822/
<james_w> effie_jayx: no, the docs don't explain this well. If you change "clean:" to "clean::" does it work?
<effie_jayx> james_w,  worked
<effie_jayx> james_w,  strange. as I did not touch that section of debian/rules
<devfil> asac: ping
<effie_jayx> james_w,  thanks for the tip :D
<james_w> effie_jayx: are you doing a merge?
<effie_jayx> james_w,  yes
<james_w> effie_jayx: was it changed in Debian?
<effie_jayx> james_w,  basically it was a package that was not in debian and the debian/rules is a lot different
<asac> devfil: hey.
<effie_jayx> james_w,  my guess is that mom messed up with the :'s from the package
<devfil> hi asac, we didn't speak
<james_w> effie_jayx: ah, ok. It's possible the merge caused this them. what's the package, I'd like to take a quick look?
<asac> devfil: yeah sorry.
<ssam> DktrKranz, do i need to have gpg keys set up to do this
<effie_jayx> james_w, bakery2.4
<devfil> asac: np
<asac> devfil: do you have any preferences on the areas you would like to learn/contribute?
<DktrKranz> ssam: it is not strictly required
<ssam> so can i skip the debuild -S stage, or tell it not to look for a key
<james_w> ssam: "debuild -S -uc -us" tells it not to sign
<devfil> asac: no, I don't have preferences
<DktrKranz> james_w: you're quick ;)
<ssam> thanks
<asac> devfil: did you use vcs systems in the past?
<devfil> asac: I don't know what is a vcs system
<asac> devfil: cvs, svn, git, bzr?
<james_w> effie_jayx: yeah, Debian switched to cdbs so the merge would have been a bit confused. It says debian/rules was conflicted, so did you have to remove conflict markers from the file?
<devfil> asac: then no
<asac> devfil: ok. do you know what patches are?
<effie_jayx> james_w,  yes I did, but I may have forgoten only clean then
<devfil> asac: yes
<effie_jayx> james_w,  I will double check.
<asac> devfil: ok, then I guess you qualify to start doing merges
<devfil> asac: I already merged different packages
<asac> devfil: ah. ok, then what do you want to learn?
<devfil> asac: SRU and how to fix bugs more difficult than <package> doesn't contain desktop file
<effie_jayx> james_w,  another interesting issue is the naming conventions for libbakery-common
<effie_jayx> james_w,  dholbach suggest we keep the name for it at least until next LTS
<james_w> effie_jayx: ah, I'd listen to dholbach then :-)
<dholbach> effie_jayx: I didn't suggest that - I just said we need to bear in mind that there's a naming change :)
<effie_jayx> dholbach, ohhh
<effie_jayx> my bad then
<dholbach> effie_jayx: we'd need an additional conflicts/replaces then at least
<james_w> effie_jayx: the generally preferred thing to do its to follow Debian, but make sure to transition existing users properly.
<dholbach> (that's the only thing I discovered we need to make sure - but I didn't look at it too closely)
<dholbach> the debian changes look very good so the closer we get, the better
<ssam> DktrKranz, i am trying to use pbuilder to build the unmodified version but i get dependency errors http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/16828/
<effie_jayx> That's waht I did
<effie_jayx> well I am building taking all big changes from the debian packages
<ssam> i have "deb-src http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ hardy restricted main multiverse universe" in my source.list
<effie_jayx> mostly documentation stuff. placing the files where they should be in terms of hierarchy
<effie_jayx> so I am waiting for the build to quick check with a dpkg --contents and see if it keeps things in place
 * effie_jayx crosses fingers
<asac> devfil: ha ;)
<devfil> asac: and more important is how to triage, I've read wiki pages but I don't know hot to start etc...
<effie_jayx> dholbach,  so I will check to see if the package moves docs like the debian package suggests and then I shall go with the package, shal make sure it conflict and replaces the current ubuntu package
<effie_jayx> dholbach and james_w , thanks
<devfil> s/hot/how
<james_w> ssam: do you have universe enabled inside the chroot?
<dholbach> effie_jayx: you ROCK
<effie_jayx> dholbach,  and you DJ
<effie_jayx> :D
<dholbach> hahahaha
<dholbach> effie_jayx: I take that as a compliment :)
<dholbach> james_w DJs too and he was just awesome
<asac> devfil: to start, pick out a few important packages with a decent bug load
<asac> and monitor them.
 * james_w hugs dholbach 
<asac> devfil: the other way is to find bugs that are milestoned, targetted for hardy
<DktrKranz> ssam: be sure to put COMPONENTS="main restricted universe multiverse" in your pbuilderrc
<asac> or milestoned for intrepid
 * dholbach hugs james_w back :)
<devfil> asac: this is how to do a SRU?
<DktrKranz> dholbach: mind spending some nights in northern italy as DJ? They pay well on Garda Lake :P
<asac> devfil: depends on what oyu mean by SRU
<asac> devfil: SRU basically just means that you want to bring a fix to a stable release
<asac> devfil: that is not a security issue
<dholbach> DktrKranz: let's see if we can combine that with some kind of Ubuntu meeting :-)
<DktrKranz> heh
<devfil> asac: ok
<asac> devfil: if you want to identify bugs that are already more or less approved to be suitable to be fixed in a stable update you should look at the "hardy", "gutsy" buglist
<asac> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy
<devfil> asac: ok
<asac> devfil: if you finnd important bugs on your own, you can nominate that bug and once you get a dev approve it for "hardy", you can work on it.
<devfil> ok
<asac> devfil: usually only important bugs get approved for a stable update. But having a good patch at hand can help to better understand the risk/benefit ratio
<asac> and thus might lead to approval for bugs that wouldnt have been approved without a patch
<devfil> asac: uhm ok
<Laney> Can someone help me with this error setting up an intrepid pbuilder? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/16822/
<devfil> asac: and how to triage?
<white> wgrant: jip, i requested the removal. Do you still have a usecase for it or were you just noticing it?
<asac> devfil: hard to give general rule. i think we would need specific bugs to look at
<\sh> wgrant, damn...what I was thinking
<devfil> asac: for example this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/epiphany-browser/+bug/237302
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 237302 in epiphany-browser "Epiphany crashes on using the zoom function" [Undecided,New]
<asac> devfil: first step is figuring if its reproducible
<asac> devfil: if you can, you should do a backtrace
<devfil> asac: ehm...backtrace?
<asac> devfil: take a look at the backtrace, look in code and see if the information in the backtrace makes sense.
<asac> if so forward upstream and if you feel good enough to fix it, start to work on it
<asac> devfil: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingProgramCrash
<asac> devfil: there are three ways mentioned to get an idea about the crash: Backtrace, valgrind, strace
<asac> try to get used how they work, what the output means and so on
<devfil> asac: if the backtrace makes no sense?
<ssam> DktrKranz, i have attached a debdiff, added a test case, nominated for hardy, and subscribed motu-sru https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/totem/+bug/217301
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 217301 in gst-plugins-ugly0.10 "Real Player stream is garbled on BBC radio" [Medium,Fix released]
<ssam> does it look ok
<wgrant> white: Noticing, sorry.
<wgrant> Somewhat glad to see that hack go, I guess.
<wgrant> Though it was invaluable in its time.
<white> jip, it had its moments :)
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<\sh> moins siretart
<\sh> hmm
<\sh> crap tabcomp
<\sh> moins sistpoty|work i meant
<sistpoty|work> hi \sh
<siretart> hey \sh!
 * siretart highfives sistpoty! 
<sistpoty|work> hi siretart
<siretart> sistpoty|work: great job on the cirrus beast! :)
<sistpoty|work> thanks
<sistpoty|work> hm... looks like there are no daily images built atm, right?
<siretart> sistpoty|work: AFAIUI cjwatson or evand maintain the daily builds. you might want to ask them?
<siretart> sistpoty|work: but anyway, the package is not in -updates yet, is it?
<sistpoty|work> siretart: no, but I promised bryce to test his new dexconf with kvm today
<ssam> sistpoty|work, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/236544 see colins comment
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 236544 in ubuntu "Daily cds not being preduced for PowerPC" [High,Invalid]
<siretart> sistpoty|work: ah, I see
<sistpoty|work> thanks ssam
<sebner> directhex: finally you got mono updated. congratulations ;)
<directhex> oh, did i? must've been slomo__, i was poking him earlier this morning
<sebner> directhex: of course he uploaded it but you prepared the necessary diff ;) Now you are responsible for it (bugs ,..) =)
<directhex> i will take on every responsibility required to pass the buck to meebey@debian.org
<sebner> directhex: self fixing :P
<directhex> it's called delegation! it's like a management job. the employees (debian developers) do the hard work in packaging and bug reporting. the rest of us wear cool hats, and drink all the champagne at the shareholders' meetings
<directhex> i should go through old mono bugs & see if they still apply
<sebner> directhex: if your aren't a MOTU you can't delegate ^^
<norsetto> hi all
<directhex> poot. and it's in main, too, so that wouldn't help
<sebner> huhu norsetto
<norsetto> huhu sebner
<sebner> ^^
<norsetto> sebner: weather looks horrible in hermagor: http://www.webcams.travel/map/#lat=46.626571&lng=13.371906&z=14&t=h
<porthose> Would a kind MOTU please help me with bug 236717.  After additional correspondence with the submitter, the discribed behavior was actually due to a bonked PHP install.  Should I "assign" the bug to myself and set the "status" to "invalid"?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 236717 in ampache "ampache package install never completes" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/236717
<directhex> sebner, so is it my job to close the merge bug, or the guy who uploaded it?
<\sh> porthose, can you make the correspondence a part of the bug?
<\sh> porthose, if yes, please attach it, and just invalid the bug...no need to assign it to you...
<porthose> sure
<porthose> k thx
<\sh> porthose, welcome :)
<siretart> directhex: it is your job to mention the merge bug in debian/changelog, and the job of the sponsor to verify that you did so
<directhex>   * Merge with Debian (LP: #225426), remaining Ubuntu changes:
<siretart> directhex: in that case the bug should be closed when it hits the archive
<siretart> automatcally by soyuz
<directhex> Published in intrepid-release 2 hours ago
<siretart> directhex: it seems the changes file hasn't been created on an ubuntu but on a debian system
<siretart> directhex: at least the changesfile does not have a bug closing directive.
<dhart> hey, I think we found some developer packages (cxxtest and csockets) that require packaging. They're at https://edge.launchpad.net/~gama/+archive . I'll ask Gama to follow up with the instructions at the Contributing doc .
<siretart> directhex: who did create that changes file?
<directhex> siretart, which changes file? i just made a debdiff!
<siretart> directhex: who did sponsor you?
<directhex> siretart, probably slomo__, since i was poking him this morning
<siretart> slomo__: if you upload stuff to ubuntu, please use an ubuntu chroot even for creating the source packages, or make sure that you manually close the launchpad bugs by hand. As seen on bug #225426
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 225426 in mono "[wishlist]please update mono to 1.9.1" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/225426
<siretart> directhex: for this upload, the bug must be closed manually
<directhex> gpg: Good signature from "Sebastian DrÃ¶ge <slomo@circular-chaos.org>"
<directhex> siretart, i'll close it then. "fix released"?
<siretart> yes
<siretart> yes
<porthose> hehe killed my first bug, thx again \sh :)
<amikrop> I got this, while `sudo apt-get purge packagename`-ing my package:
<amikrop> Removing ueagle-setup ...
<amikrop> update-rc.d: /etc/init.d/ueagle-startup exists during rc.d purge (use -f to force)
<amikrop> dpkg: error processing ueagle-setup (--remove):
<amikrop>  subprocess post-removal script returned error exit status 1
<amikrop> Why? What did go wrong?
<amikrop> Why does /etc/init.d/ueagle-startup exist? Why did it not get removed before postrm was executed?
<persia> amikrop: You didn't use dh_installinit
<amikrop> What is it?
<persia> It's a special helper to install init scripts.
<persia> man dh_installinit
<amikrop> persia: By the way, thanks to your yesterday course on #ubuntu-classroom, I managed to create a Ubuntu-valid Debian package :)
<persia> amikrop: Well, almost.  It doesn't purge cleanly yet :)
<amikrop> persia: I am sure it will soon do ;-)
<amikrop> persia: And how can I remove the "badly-purged" package now? :-/
<persia> amikrop: BY hand
<persia> amikrop: Just purge the package, and then delete the files it complains about, and then hunt down any leftovers.
<amikrop> Aha.
<DktrKranz> ssam: a couple of notes regarding bug 217301, your debdiff require some adjustments, first of all target must be hardy-proposed (as per policy), you should also adjust maintainer field as per wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField. Last one: patch should be managed with simple-patchsys.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 217301 in gst-plugins-ugly0.10 "Real Player stream is garbled on BBC radio" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/217301
<geser> Hi *
<DktrKranz> patch-systems are explained here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/PatchSystems
<amikrop> Hello geser :-)
<amikrop> persia: I handled my rules install section like that: http://paste.ubuntu.com/16863/
<persia> amikrop: I think that's overkill, and possibly wrong (as it's not compressed), but then I'm a CDBS fan.
<amikrop> persia: Compressed? What should I compress?
<persia> dh_compress
<amikrop> persia: I uncommented dh_installinit. I created `debian/ueagle-startup.init`. Should I remove ueagle-startup from being manually copied to /etc/init.d/ueagle-startup (by `debian/rules`)?
<amikrop> Should I left postinst and postrm, as are?
<amikrop> (`debian/postinst` and `debian/postrm`)
<amikrop> I mean, I uncommented dh_installinit in `debian/rules`.
<amikrop> (and gave it the -r argument, too)
<persia> amikrop: I'd need to be looking at your package in considerably more detail to answer that.
<persia> Your best bet is to try it, and see what works for you.
<amikrop> It doesn't work.
<persia> linitan -iIv can help, although carefully reading all the debhelper manpages will also be informative.
<amikrop> persia: I want to have a simple posinst and a simple postrm. Is it necessary to use dh_installinit?
<geser> amikrop: it's not required to use dh_*, but it makes it easier
<amikrop> geser: So, I can have a postinst and a postrm without dh_installinit.
<amikrop> Is that correct?
<geser> yes
<geser> dh_installinit is only a helper so every package does it the same way and doesn't repeat the common problems
<persia> amikrop: The key part is that you have to handle everything in /etc carefully, and especially so the init scripts, to ensure that you preserve the user changes.
<amikrop> OK. So, what do I do with 4 things: 1) postinst 2) postrm 3) rules 4) the startup script?
<amikrop> Where do I place each, in order to have a correct init script that installs and gets removed correctly?
<amikrop> I bet these things: 1) place postinst in debian/ 2) place postrm in debian/ 3) uncomment dh_installinit 4) rename it to startup-script.init and place it to debian/
<amikrop> Please, correct me where I am wrong.
<geser> amikrop: looks good
<amikrop> OK. Before trying it out, what about the manual copy of startup-script to /etc/init.d/startup-script? Should I skip it?
<amikrop> (I mean, the cp command in debian/rules.)
<amikrop> Will dh_installinit copy my startup-script automatically and I should skip doing it manually?
<geser> if I understand the man page for dh_installinit correctly it will install the init-script for you
<amikrop> So, I should comment out that line in my rules file: "cp $(CURDIR)/start/* $(CURDIR)/debian/ueagle-setup/etc/init.d"?
<geser> yes, you can comment it out
<amikrop> OK. Again, before trying it out, should I also remove etc/init.d from my debian/dirs file?
<amikrop> Or is it necessary, even if I use dh_installinit?
<geser> iirc it should get created automagically so you don't need to list it in debian/dirs
<geser> Hi sebner
<amikrop> geser: Alright. Let me try all these out, and I will let you know the results :-)
<sebner> hoi geser =)
<amikrop> geser: I ran dpkg-buildpackage and created the .deb. But I extracted it, and I also extracted data.tar.gz only to find out that there was no etc/init.d/startup-script :-(
<amikrop> geser: So, it seems it didn't work.
<geser> how did you call the init script and how is your package named?
<Iulian> Hey
<amikrop> geser: ueagle-startup.init
<amikrop> geser: My package is named ueagle-setup.
<geser> try to use the same name for both, i.e rename your init script to ueagle-setup.init
<amikrop> geser: OK
<amikrop> geser: Worked. Thank you.
<DktrKranz> \sh, did it happen to you to request some p-a-s adjustments?
<\sh> DktrKranz, yes for wine on lpia
<DktrKranz> \sh, who did you ask to do the adjustment? infinity?
<\sh> DktrKranz, infinity/elmo/and theres another one mentioned in the p-a-s file...
<DktrKranz> \sh, is publicily available in Ubuntu? Or should I take Debian's ?
<\sh> DktrKranz, it's one for all :)
<\sh> DktrKranz, it's shared :)
<DktrKranz> ah, new thing learned :)
<DktrKranz> \sh: thanks
<\sh> and it happens to be a good thing, that the responsible people are involved or paid by ubuntu/canonical ;)
<\sh> I think lamont was the third man :)
<DktrKranz> yessir :)
<DktrKranz> ok, I'll drop a mail to them
<\sh> DktrKranz,  hehe :)
<amikrop> geser: I examined the .deb manually and found out that everything was OK, but a prerm was added by dh_installinit. Also, when I tried to remove my package, I got this error: http://paste.ubuntu.com/16880/
<geser> amikrop: prerm is ok, as you want to stop what you started before removing it
<amikrop> It seems dh_installinit did well to copy /etc/init.d/ueagle-startup but neglected to remove it, before postrm was ran.
<geser> amikrop: why does it talk about /etc/init.d/ueagle-startup? didn't you renamed it to ueagle-setup?
<amikrop> geser: No, I just used dh_installinit -r --name=ueagle-startup
<geser> ah
<amikrop> And renamed ueagle-setup.init to ueagle-setup.ueagle-startup.init as the man page said.
<geser> hmm
<owh> doko, I've just added a comment to bug #204594, about line 90 and 91 of the init-functions file. I think it needs to be combined with a || as well to transfer the status from $? if set -e is set.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 204594 in lsb "UVF exception for lsb-3.2" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/204594
<owh> kirkland: This is the issue we discussed last week about the set -e.
<ssam> DktrKranz, thanks for the comments, where can i find information about simple-patchsys. it will try to do a better patch this evening.
<amikrop> geser: It seems I must somehow tell dh_installinit to remove /etc/init.d/ueagle-startup before postrm executes.
<ssam> DktrKranz, oops, you already ansered that :-)
<amikrop> persia: Does dh_installinit normally remove the init script it installed?
<persia> amikrop: It should insert some logic in postrm.  You might need to add #DEBHELPER#
<kirkland> owh: hey
<owh> kirkland: Hiya, nearly off to bed. I just pinged you about the comments we made last week on the set -e.
<kirkland> owh: right
<owh> kirkland: I just poked the person who submitted the patch, suspecting it might be simpler, rather than me starting a new bug and patch cycle.
<kirkland> owh: good idea
<owh> kirkland: If we keep this up we might make the functions work yet :)
<amikrop> persia: postrm is manually created by me. dh_installinit just generated a prerm. Where should I add #DEBHELPER#?
<owh> kirkland: See you in a couple of hours for the u-s meeting.
<kirkland> owh: k
<persia> amikrop: At the bottom of your maintainer scripts.
<amikrop> Both postinst and postrm?
<kirkland> owh: I think you're looking for doko
<amikrop> persia: The truth is that dh_installinit also generated ueagle-setup.postinst.debhelper, ueagle-setup.postrm.debhelper and ueagle-setup.prerm.debhelper.
<doko> about what?
<persia> amikrop: All your maintainer scripts
<amikrop> persia: dh_installinit also generated ueagle-setup.postinst.debhelper, ueagle-setup.postrm.debhelper and ueagle-setup.prerm.debhelper.
<kirkland> doko: bug #204594
<kirkland> doko: owh left, but I've been helping him with this
<ubottu> kirkland: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/204594/+text)
<kirkland> ubottu: thanks.  doko: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lsb/+bug/204594
<ubottu> kirkland: Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<kirkland> doko: basically, we have another patch that needs the pidof() function to be "set -e safe"
<kirkland> doko: owh is suggesting a change to make it so
<kirkland> doko: if you agree with his change, I'll attach another debdiff to that bug, perhaps you can sponsor
<DktrKranz> ssam: thank *you* for fixing that :) If you need assistance, it's probable I'll be around this eve.
<doko> kirkland: fine with me.
<amikrop> persia: How can I fix this?
<amikrop> gpg: skipped "Aristotelis Mikropoulos <amikrop@gmail.com>": secret key not available
<amikrop> gpg: [stdin]: clearsign failed: secret key not available
<amikrop> persia: Beacause the package is ready for REVU, and I need a gpg key to log in to the REVU website.
<norsetto> amikrop: is it? Hmmmm, I suppose its lintian clean?
<persia> amikrop: gpg --gen-key.  Also, best to ask questions generally: the more I get pinged, the less likely I am to respond happily.
<persia> I almost always respond happily to unaimed questions :)
<persia> (when I am around and have time)
<amikrop> OK, sorry :P
<amikrop> But I already have a gpg key.
<amikrop> And I formatted my pc. Can I recover my gpg key?
<Hobbsee> ...no
<mok0> amikrop: maybe the anti-terror police can help
<persia> amikrop: You can retype it from the hardcopy of your secret key :)
<amikrop> I don't remember it :P
<amikrop> It looks like I am going to generate a new one, but I wil have to update it on Launchpad.
<mok0> amikrop: don't ever loose your gpg key if you want to be taken seriously in this forum ;-)
<Hobbsee> or give it out
<persia> Or let it get in a position where someone else has access
 * Hobbsee wonders what on earth she was going to do.
<amikrop> OK. From now on, I will backup my ~/.gpg directory before I format.
<amikrop> mok0: Got it :)
<\sh> Hobbsee, when you are loosing your secret key?
<Hobbsee> \sh: losing?  i didn't lose it.
<Hobbsee> \sh: i had it on brandon's machine, though, as i didn't know about debsign -r
<mok0> amikrop: amikrop, you really should read the gpg documentation. There is a whole chapter devoted to how you secure your private key
<Hobbsee> \sh: entire effect was null, as brandon and i have the same upload powers, and i didn't have motu at the time, and he did.  but still.
<amikrop> mok0: OK ;)
<mok0> amikrop: http://www.gnupg.org/gph/en/manual.html#AEN513
<amikrop> Real name: Aristotelis Mikropoulos <amikrop@gmail.com>
<amikrop> Invalid character in name
<amikrop> What is going on?
<amikrop> Where is the invalid character?
<mok0> amikrop: I don't think your real name includes an email address?
<james_w> <
<Hobbsee> yeesh.  security is very slow
<mok0> amikrop: ... or maybe you mother and father were very foresighted
<amikrop> How can I see my "key id"?
<amikrop> (Launchpad requires so)
<mok0> amikrop, gpg --list-keys
<amikrop> Yes, but what of all these is called the id?
<mok0> amikrop: the key id is an 8 digit hex number
<amikrop> alright
<mok0> amikrop: mine says "1024D/404825E7"
<mok0> amikrop: yours will look something similar, it's the 8 digits after the /
<amikrop> ok, ok
<amikrop> Now, I need to set a keyserver. Any help?
<schmiedc> launchpad itself has doku for import your key
<amikrop> schmiedc: I know, I am following that.
<schmiedc> ok
<schmiedc> step 12 then
<amikrop> schmiedc: Wait, I thought you meant the 3-steps guide in the user page. Where is the doku you are talking about?
<schmiedc> https://help.launchpad.net/YourAccount/ImportingYourPGPKey?action=show&redirect=ImportingYourOpenPGPKey
<amikrop> schmiedc: thanks
<schmiedc> np
<cprov-lunch> hi guys, can someone help this guy with his PPA package -> https://answers.edge.launchpad.net/soyuz/+question/35261 ?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<kirkland> doko: okay, patch attached to https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lsb/+bug/204594 ... only question, though, is if lsb should be merged first?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 204594 in lsb "UVF exception for lsb-3.2" [Undecided,Fix released]
<persia> cprov-lunch: Without deep investigation, it's likely broken because of toolchain changes.  We've had issues with a number of backports for that reason.
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi sistpoty|work, geser
<schmiedc> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hello schmiedc
<doko> kirkland: well, send a patch to do the merge and the fix?
<lukehasnoname> hello ubottu
<lukehasnoname> :(
<cprov-lunch> persia: yes, that's what I've imagined. Can you comment that in the question, please ? (it's good for you karma)
<kirkland> doko: okey doke, i'll do the merge first
<kirkland> doko: upload to chinstrap, and you can upload there, then apply the set-e patch?
<persia> cprov: If someone else doesn't get to it before I have time to think about it in a little depth :)
<cprov> persia: great, that will do for me, thanks.
<sistpoty|work> cprov: maybe you have an answer for my question? https://answers.launchpad.net/soyuz/+question/34821
<cprov> sistpoty|work: uhm, very strange, did you try talking to adam (infinity) he might know why sbuild is not behaving as expected.
<sistpoty|work> cprov: no, not yet
<cprov> sistpoty|work: I will point him to the question, no worries.
<sistpoty|work> cprov: ok, thanks... you don't happen to know what build target sbuild actually invokes there?
<sistpoty|work> (as it might be a bug in the package, though everything looks right on first glimpse)
<cprov> sistpoty|work: not by heart.
<sistpoty|work> kk
<leleobhz> its safe usa libc6-xen with xen or its better move /lib/tls ?
<leleobhz> *use
<lukehasnoname> What does "triage" mean in server/bugspeak?
<amikrop> Why I am getting this? $ dput revu package_version_source.changes
<amikrop> Can't open /home/indy/Desktop/hacking/sandbox/ueagle-setup-1.0/package_version_source.changes
<amikrop> Oh, OK. I am really sorry.
<amikrop> Never mind.
<amikrop> I uploaded it and press "Recover Password" (on REVU). But it says there isn't such account, yet. Do I need to wait?
<mok0> amikrop: yes, it takes a while for revu to update it's keyring.
<wgrant> amikrop: Give it about 2.5 minutes from now.
<wgrant> Uploads are currently processed every 10 minutes.
<mok0> wgrant: I think he's waiting for his gpg public key to be recognized
<wgrant> mok0: No, accounts are created on upload processing.
<kirkland> doko: doing the merge, there's one strange conflict between the Ubuntu and Debian versions
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: I'm just doing a resync of the keyring. is uegle-setup from you?
<kirkland> doko: ubuntu ->     if [ -n "$sig" -o "$sig" = 15 -o "$sig" = TERM ]; then
<kirkland> doko: debian     if [ -z "$sig" -o "$sig" = 15 -o "$sig" = TERM ]; then
<sistpoty|work> (+a somewhere)
<amikrop> sistpoty|work: yes
<kirkland> doko: -n and -z are opposites of one another, so I'd think that one of these is objectively correct, and the other incorrect
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: did you intent to have it as a native package? (just saw that while checking the queue)
<amikrop> sistpoty|work: What do you mean "native"?
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: that it doesn't have an orig.tar.gz (usually, if you downloaded s.th. from somewhere and package it, you don't want a native package)
<amikrop> Then I don't want a native package.
<amikrop> My package includes some downloaded stuff.
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: then I suggest to check how you named the tarball that you downloaded (should be <packaganame>_<upstreamversion>.orig.tar.gz)
<amikrop> OK. And do what with the name?
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: just name the tarball you downloaded like this. if dpkg-source finds such a tarball in the parent directory to the extracted package, it will create a non-native package, otherwise a native
<amikrop> sistpoty|work: OK. Should I re-package and re-send, then?
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: yes please... I'll remove that upload then, ok?
<amikrop> sistpoty|work: OK
<schmiedc> so for by non-native packages there is no upstream inlcuded?
<amikrop> sistpoty|work: But the upstream is a very small part of my package. Should I still make that .orig.tar.gz?
<sistpoty|work> schmiedc: a non-native package consists of 3 files, the .orig.tar.gz (which is what you downloaded from upstream), the .diff.gz (unified patch against that) and the .dsc (information like checksums etc.)
<sistpoty|work> schmiedc: a native package is just a tarball and the .dsc
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: yes
<amikrop> OK, then.
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: otherwise noone knows what you downloaded, and what you added as packaging
<sistpoty|work> (and a few other things)
<schmiedc> sistpoty|work: thx
<amikrop> sistpoty|work: I got it.
<norsetto> dholbach, geser, soren, persia, nixternal : can anyone in the power close the motu-sru affair? Everybody is happy to have 6 people in the team, bless them and lets move on
<DktrKranz> yay!
<sistpoty|work> thanks for following up norsetto! :)
<norsetto> sistpoty|work: ;-)
<DktrKranz> I prepared a small recap for new members, just to inform them what they agreed to do... you fools :P
 * persia notes that the MC meeting is running over-time, and so it may be a bit before there is a serious response
<\sh> did I miss something?
<norsetto> persia: then overrule the MC meeting, we elect you dictator-for-life
<persia> norsetto: I'd decline.  2 years will be a very long time, and that's not even as dictator :)
<amikrop> sistpoty|work: The upstream version is completely different from my package's version, and nowhere in my package there is any upstream info. Is that right?
<norsetto> persia: wise decision, all dicators-for-life have a very short life ...
<\sh> but one
<persia> \sh: The key difference is benevolence :)
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: hm...?
<amikrop> sistpoty|work: I mean, the version of the upstream program, is not the same version an the version of my package.
<amikrop> Neither, I refer the updtream version anywhere in my package (e.g. in the control file).
<amikrop> *upstream
<amikrop> Is that normal?
<mok0> amikrop: the upstream version is defined in debian/changelog
<\sh> persia, oh this guy...no I didn't mean this guy ;)
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: actually debian/changelog should contain the upstream version number as a part of the version (it's <upstreamversion-debianrevision>)
<directhex> upstreamversion-debianrevisionubuntuubunturevision
<amikrop> OK. I will update that info and then upload :-)
<amikrop> You mean that everywhere, I use the upstream version?
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: no, only in debian/changelog and in the name of your orig-tarball
<amikrop> E.g. my .deb will be called package_upstreamversion_arch.deb?
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: yes
<sistpoty|work> (well, there's the debian-revision in there as well)
<amikrop> Upstream version is 1.1. Package version is 1.0. In changelog it says 1.0-1. What should I fix/change?
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: debian/changelog
<sistpoty|work> (you're packaging version 1.1, don't you?)
<amikrop> yes
<sistpoty|work> so don't lie about it then :P
<directhex> if you're  building a package for ubuntu (not debian) of version 1.1 of an app, it should be 1.1-0ubuntu1
<directhex> incrementing the last number when the package (but not upstream) changes
<amikrop> Oh, OK.
<amikrop> And what about the number before "ubuntu"/
<amikrop> ?
<amikrop> (e.g. 0)
<directhex> that's the debian package version. 0 means "not in debian yet"
<amikrop> Or, in ubuntu in our case.
<directhex> so if you were taking a debian package 1.1-7, the first ubuntu-modified version of that would be 1.1-7ubuntu1
<amikrop> Excuse me for being repeated, but only 5% of the code in my package is from upstream. Should I still give that a version?
<amikrop> I mean, the package is nearly native.
<directhex> unless you're the upstream, i'd stick to the convention
<mok0> amikrop: have you forked the software?
<amikrop> mok0: No.
<amikrop> directhex: OK.
<amikrop> Here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/16908/ "Version:" refers to the upstream version?
<mok0> amikrop: what file is that?
<mok0> output of dh_make perhaps
<amikrop> yes
<mok0> amikrop: the "1.1" will be found in debian/changelog
<amikrop> OK
<mok0> amikrop: you need to put -0ubuntu1 after it
<kirkland> doko: okay, I have a merged, built lsb package for Intrepid
<amikrop> mok0: In changelog?
<mok0> amikrop: yes
<amikrop> So, the .orig.tar.gz which was generated by dh_make is a copy of my .tar.gz (5% upstream code, 95% mine code). Is that OK? Should I proceed?
<mok0> amikrop: are your changes a whole bunch of patches?
<mok0> amikrop: or 1 patch
<mok0> ?
<amikrop> They are not changes. They are code which import the upstream code.
<mok0> amikrop: do you distribute the code from a homepage somewhere?
<amikrop> mok0: Not yet.
<mok0> amikrop: you need to do that
<amikrop> Anyway, what should I replace #nnnn in changelog, with?
<amikrop> mok0: OK, I will.
<mok0> amikrop: the number of the needs-packaging bug you file in Launchpad
<amikrop> There is no such a bug.
<mok0> amikrop: right. You file one
<amikrop> OK.
<amikrop> Now?
<mok0> amikrop: you have a LP account, yes?
<amikrop> Yes. How do I file s need-packaging bug?
<amikrop> *a
<amikrop> *needs
<mok0> amikrop: goto launchpad.net -> ubuntu
<warp10> Heya all!
<mok0> amikrop: press the "Bugs" tab
<mok0> amikrop: press the brown button "Report a bug"
<amikrop> mok0: OK ...
<mok0> amikrop: see bug 200783 as a guide
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 200783 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] ChibiTracker -- a portable impulse tracker" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/200783
<mok0> amikrop: In summary, write "[needs-packaging] ueagle-setup"
<amikrop> ok
<amikrop> tags: needs-packaging
<amikrop> ?
<mok0> amikrop: you add that tag in the pink menu, top left
<mok0> amikrop: give a little blurp about the program in the bug description
<mok0> amikrop: set status to -> In progress, and assign yourself to the bug
<amikrop> ok
<mok0> amikrop: easy, huh?
<amikrop> yep :P
<mok0> amikrop: so, in changelog, put this: (LP: #237385)
<persia> norsetto: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-June/003990.html
<amikrop> mok0: Oops, I uploaded while having this: * Initial release (Closes: #237385)
<amikrop> mok0: Should I re-upload?
<mok0> amikrop: don't worry about it, you can fix it in the next upload
<mok0> amikrop: the sponsors will likely have other comments
<amikrop> OK :P
<mok0> amikrop: now, be patient, inclusion of new packages is not yet high on the sponsors' priority list...
<norsetto> DktrKranz: in layman term https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-June/003990.html means start working and we bless you later
<mok0> amikrop: atm, we focus on merging packages from Debian
<amikrop> mok0: How do I re-package while informing for updating the version?
<amikrop> mok0: I see.
<amikrop> I mean, should I manually change the package version? Or, should the version be updated at all for trivial changes?
<mok0> amikrop: you don't need to update the version every upload. Just leave it at -0ubuntu1
<DktrKranz> norsetto: oooh... I can go on holiday now \o/
<DktrKranz> :)
<mok0> amikrop: revu tags each upload with date and time
<sebner> hio siretart
<sebner> hio sistpoty|work ^^
 * sebner waves
<mok0> amikrop: it doesn't care about version-release
<sistpoty|work> hi sebner
<mok0> sebner!!!
<amikrop> mok0: You mean, I should change 1.1-1 to 1.1-0ubuntu1 ?
<mok0> amikrop: yes
<sebner> mok0: :) :) :)
<amikrop> manually?
<schmiedc> hi sebner
<norsetto> DktrKranz: we will chase you whenever you go, to the alps or to the sea!
<mok0> amikrop: eerrr? how else would you do it?
<amikrop> Manually and only in the chanelog?
<mok0> amikrop: yes
<amikrop> I don't know, maybe by renaming the .tar.gz.
<mok0> amikrop: that's the only place where the version and release is defined
<amikrop> And re-running dh_make.
<mok0> amikrop: no
<amikrop> mok0: OK.
<mok0> amikrop: from now on, you just edit the files. You can happily forget all about dh_make
<mok0> (that piece of crap)
<DktrKranz> norsetto: you won't find me, and if you do, I'll have heavy weapons to persuade you
<mok0> ooops, forgot CoC
<amikrop> mok0: Cool. When the sponsors tell me to make some changes, should I alter anything in the changelog?
<DktrKranz> mok0: ask for a CoC exception, it's useful in these cases :)
<mok0> amikrop: no
<amikrop> (Like, the version, or some notes)
<amikrop> OK
<mok0> amikrop: there will be feedback on REVU
<amikrop> OK.
<amikrop> I will re-upload, for correction the version and the LP thing.
<amikrop> * of the
<mok0> DktrKranz: try: curse(); except CurseException: print "oops, sorry"
<DktrKranz> heh
<amikrop> mok0: Another thing (and sorry for the many questions): In debian/copyright, the "Copyright:" section needs mine copyright, or th upstream's?
<amikrop> *the
<mok0> amikrop: hang on
<mok0> amikrop: all copyrights must be acknowledges, including your own. See here:
<mok0> http://wiki.debian.org/Proposals/CopyrightFormat?highlight=(Copyright)
<amikrop> mok0: I got some warnings this time. Are things alright? http://paste.ubuntu.com/16916/
<mok0> !maintainer | amikrop
<ubottu> amikrop: The "Maintainer" field in a package's information (debian/control) should indicate the Ubuntu team responsible for the Ubuntu specific changes to a package (often the !MOTU for !Universe packages). The original maintainer is preserved in the field "XSBC-Original-Maintainer".
<mok0> amikrop: line 21-22 you can ignore
<amikrop> mok0: OK. What aboutthe uninitiazlied value?
<amikrop> mok0: Should I make those files non-executable?
<mok0> amikrop: I don't know where that comes from, probably a bug in dpkg-source. Just ignore it
<amikrop> sistpoty|work: Please, if there are any ueagle-setup uploads up there, delete them. I will start real uploading from now on. Thank you.
<amikrop> mok0: Should I make those files non-executable?
<sistpoty|work> amikrop: any motu can delete these btw. ;)
<mok0> amikrop: it doesn't matter, you can if you want to get rid of the warnings
<amikrop> sistpoty|work: Oh, OK :-)
 * sistpoty|work heads home now.
<sistpoty|work> cya
<amikrop> mok0: OK. So, I should use MOTU as Maintainter?
<mok0> amikrop: the motu mailing list
<mok0> Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
<amikrop> kk
<schmiedc> cya
<amikrop> mok0: My package takes ages to install. Perhaps the fact that I made the maintainer scripts non-executable, is to blame?
<mok0> amikrop: no that has nothing to do with it
<mok0> \sh: I saw your terminator post & decided to try it out. How do you set the font?
<amikrop> mok0: OK. How can I set my init script not to start after the installation?
<amikrop> (I use dh_installinit)
<mok0> amikrop: hmm. I don't know
<amikrop> mok0: OK. Thanks for everything :-)
<mok0> amikrop: np!
<mok0> amikrop: man dh_installinit says to use --no-start
<amikrop> mok0: kk ;)
<pmartren> hi, I have got an issu while packaging something : I can't create a directory in /home/toto/
<pmartren> I don't know what to write in debian/dirs
<pmartren> I would like to create /home/($LOGIN)/.mypackage actually
<persia> pmartren: You really don't.
<persia> You want to have your package create user preferences if they don't already exist the first time it launches.
<persia> If it doesn't do this natively (and can't easily be patched to so do), use a wrapper script to do it, and then launch the binary (with a quick launch if the preferences are already there)
<amikrop> Where do I have to keep the .orig.tar.gz for my package not to be considered as native?
<amikrop> Also, can someone sync, please?
<amikrop> No, it's OK.
<amikrop> But where do I have to keep the .orig.tar.gz? In which directory?
<amikrop> mok0: Any ideas?
<persia> amikrop: Don't poke people.  Also, above the package directory.
<persia> Or if you are in the directory with debian/, you should have ../(package).orig.tar.gz
<amikrop> persia: And then build source (sorry)?
<amikrop> Why a native package was created? I do have a .orig.tar.gz http://paste.ubuntu.com/16926/
<slytherin> amikrop: where is it located?
<amikrop> slytherin: In the parent directory.
<slytherin> amikrop: what is the name of .orig.tar.gz file?
<amikrop> There is the directory ueagle-setup. Inside, there are ueagle-setup-1.1 and ueagle-setup-1.1.orig.tar.gz.
<amikrop> Inside ueagle-setup-1.1 there is debian/ and other stuff.
<slytherin> amikrop: the file name should be package_version.orig.tar.gz, note underscore _
<amikrop> I execute dpkg-buildpackage inside ueagle-setup-1.1.
<amikrop> Ooh. OK. Thank you.
<ssam> DktrKranz, i think i have made all the needed changes to my debdiff at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/totem/+bug/217301
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 217301 in gst-plugins-ugly0.10 "Real Player stream is garbled on BBC radio" [Medium,Fix released]
<Jazzva> norsetto: I uploaded the fixed diff.gz for gecko-mediaplayer...
<norsetto> Jazzva: thanks!
<Jazzva> No problem :)...
<DktrKranz> ssam, so it seems, I'll review a bit, test it and, if good, sponsor to hardy-proposed. thanks :)
<ssam> thanks :-)
<DktrKranz> ssam, anyway... pretty difficult task for a "noob", good job ;)
<amikrop> When I build the binary package, I get a warning about the user-defined field "Original Maintainer".
<amikrop> Is there a problem somewhere?
<slytherin> amikrop: nope, looks like lintian doesn't know about original-maintainer which is specific to Ubuntu.
<amikrop> slytherin: alright
<norsetto> Jazzva: uploaded
<Jazzva> norsetto: Thanks :)
<norsetto> Jazzva: np, you may want to keep your eyes open for the next update, kevin usually does it every month
<Jazzva> norsetto: Ok. Thanks for the tip :)
<mohbana> hi
<mohbana> how long does getting a package accepted take?
<persia> mohbana: Between a day and a year, depending on the package, the packaging, the interest of the packager and reviewers, and the attention of an archive admin.
 * persia hasn't seen longer than a year with a single packager, but may be mistaken
<DktrKranz> ssam, reviewed, ACKed and sponsored, thanks :)
<ssam> DktrKranz, many thanks :-)
<DktrKranz> you're welcome
<Kopfgeldjaeger> could somebody maybe have a look at my 20-line-debdiff in bug #147058? it's just correcting the maintainer field and a .desktop file
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 147058 in lynx "Substandard .desktop file (patch attached)" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/147058
<persia> Kopfgeldjaeger: lynx is in main, so it may take a bit to get reviewed.
<Kopfgeldjaeger> persia: that's ok, as we have enough time till intrepid. but i just don't want it to be lost.
<Kopfgeldjaeger> persia: so i can't do anything? i mean, i should just wait.
<persia> Kopfgeldjaeger: Yes, you should just wait.  You might track down why lynx is in main: it's not the best curses browser, so it's likely pulled by a dependency.  If you can pull it to universe, it gets easier to update.
<Kopfgeldjaeger> OK
<Q-FUNK> hm. is something wrong with the PPA builders?  I've had a small package marked as "building" for the last hour.
<geser> Q-FUNK: your xserver-xorg-video-nsc 1:2.8.3-2ubuntu2 upload? it's only queue
<stgraber> Q-FUNK: 22 packages in the amd64 queue, 23 in the i386 one
<stgraber> Q-FUNK: some kernels are building, so you'll have to wait :)
<geser> and right now a wine build started
<Q-FUNK> kernels, in PPA?
<geser> why not
<aDmos> hi to all. i'm new here but I want to get involved too.
<Q-FUNK> ompaul: hiya there :)
<ompaul> Q-FUNK, hit here
<ompaul> hi there even
<Q-FUNK> heh
<Q-FUNK> ompaul: how was the return trip from UDS?
<ompaul> Q-FUNK, uneventful only 1hour 20 longer in the airport on the departing side more than I had to be
<Q-FUNK> oh?
<ompaul> typical delay
<Q-FUNK> ah yes
<LaserJock> DktrKranz, jdong: around?
<DktrKranz> LaserJock, yep
<LaserJock> DktrKranz: how does http://laserjock.us/files/ubuntu/sru_todo.html look to you?
<DktrKranz> LaserJock, nice :)
<LaserJock> DktrKranz: does it seem helpful? anything that you'd want to have when doing SRUs?
<DktrKranz> LaserJock, since we have > 80 bugs in our page, having a tool that sort them and attracts our attention is simply great.
<geser> LaserJock: how comes that apache2-mpm-itk is listed below "Needing Verification" and "Verification Done"?
<LaserJock> one sec
<LaserJock> geser: ah, I know why, it's a bug ;-)
<geser> LaserJock: what about some sorting? perhaps sort after source package name
<LaserJock> geser: it's possible
<geser> LaserJock: besides this the page looks really good
<ScottK> superm1: Do you plan on continuing to use guidance-backends for Intrepid?  If so, can I talk you out of it?
<mario_limonciell> yes please talk me out of it
<ScottK> mario_limonciell: Don't do it.
<mario_limonciell> eg another solution would be nice :P
<DktrKranz> linux source pakcage? on motu-sru list? mmmh...
<ScottK> mario_limonciell: What do you use it for?
<DktrKranz> ah... subscribed erroneously :)
<mario_limonciell> ScottK, turning on an extra X module for VNC
<laga> mario_limonciell: i thought that was broken?
<ScottK> mario_limonciell: So you're modifying the xorg.conf with it?
<mario_limonciell> ScottK, yex
<mario_limonciell> yes
<mario_limonciell> laga, yeah well i'm under the assumption that part is fixed (the module causing segfaults)
<mario_limonciell> s/is/gets/
<sebner> ScottK: We haven't set a jackpot for our courier bet or?
<ScottK> mario_limonciell: It looks pretty trivial to script with xrandr (reading man xrandr).  I suggest that.
<mario_limonciell> honestly starting using it because pitti was using it for jockey at that time.  what's the solution he is ending up with?
<ScottK> mario_limonciell: Dunno.  I'm hoping to talk him out of it too, but he didn't answer so fast.
<mario_limonciell> ScottK, well consider me already talked out of it, but if it stays i'll keep using it
<tseliot> ï»¿ScottK: xrandr is ok but sometimes (especially with proprietary drivers) editing xorg.conf is still necessary :-(
<ScottK> I can't remove it if it has rdepends ...
<LaserJock> DktrKranz: that's part of why I did the page, so we can catch mistaken subscriptions or people not setting the status correctly
<ScottK> tseliot: How does one know when xorg.conf editing is needed?
<mario_limonciell> ScottK, well i mean if pitti comes up with another solution for jockey, i'll just switch to his solution, so i'll remove the rdepend in that case
<DktrKranz> so, we need to set status carefully. if I understand well, it works on bug statuses
<DktrKranz> (and tagging at a later stage)
<ScottK> mario_limonciell: OK.  Sounds fair.
<mario_limonciell> well wait i should have bargained here.  i'll do everything i said i'd do if you look over a backport ;)
<LaserJock> DktrKranz: exactly
<tseliot> ï»¿ScottK: it depends on what you're trying to do. You're talking about developers using guidance's xorgconfig.py to set up the xorg.conf, right?
<ScottK> tseliot: Yes.
<LaserJock> DktrKranz: it's both easy to do and it helps enforce the policy so people are consistent
<DktrKranz> LaserJock, we missed that. many thanks!
<ScottK> tseliot: My goal is to remove all of kde-guidance for Intrepid if possible.
<sebner> ScottK: ok I also accept hugs :P
<tseliot> ï»¿ScottK: I'm working on a new parser which should be able to replace guidance
<ScottK> sebner: You're on the list.  I've had about 0 Ubuntu time since I got back from UDS.
<ScottK> tseliot: Excellent.
<ajmitch> hi
<sebner> ScottK: no no, We had a bet who is faster. the debian maintainer or you and you loose so I won ;)
<ScottK> tseliot: Will it be ready so that others can try it soon (and it's a good alternative to Guidance)?
<ScottK> sebner: OK.  Did he do another upload?
<sebner> ScottK: exactly. currently in incoming but my debdiff also works with it since only 2-3 files were updated with copyright things or something like that
<tseliot> ScottK: sure, since I will need it for this spec: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/xorg-options-editor
<ScottK> tseliot: Great.  I'd encourage you to work with mario_limonciell and pitti to make sure it meets their needs too.
<ScottK> ajmitch: Hello.
<tseliot> ï»¿ScottK: and if you have a look at the wiki you will also find a link to my bazaar branch with the code of its first experimental release. Of course bryce, pitti and mvo will review the code since I want to be sure that the code is good enough.
<mario_limonciell> ScottK, the bug i was hoping  to bargain would be bug 237085 if you could
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 237085 in hardy-backports "please backport mythtv & mythplugins 0.21.0+fixes17416 from intrepid" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/237085
 * ScottK looks
<DktrKranz> any sponsors for main around?
<\sh> DktrKranz: -> -devel?
<DktrKranz> \sh, I didn't see any interaction, but I'll try there :)
<sebner> gn8 folks
<siretart> hey folks
<siretart> ScottK: did I miss something important in the serverteam meeting so far?
<ScottK> siretart: Just that tomorrow is the deadline for spec drafting.
<ScottK> Most of it was whether or not to update openldap in Hardy.
<siretart> ScottK: interesting. seems they don't want contributors to work on specs?
<siretart> or maybe I just missed the announcment somehow
<ScottK> siretart: I think it was just sort of assumed we would.
<andrew_sayers> Are there any good ways of drumming up more interest in this remote help assistant idea?
<andrew_sayers> I really need people to test it out, but I don't know how to do that without seeming like I'm spamming places.
#ubuntu-motu 2008-06-05
<emgent> heya
<skipper> Hi, I have created a package for pwdhash and uploaded it to REVU: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=pwdhash It's now almost a month ago. No one is interesting in reviewing or have I to do something?
<Laney> skipper: I think we just have to wait. I have one on there too :)
<Laney> Sometimes the MOTUs have REVU days where everyone focuses on reviewing packages on there, maybe there will be one soon
<skipper> then I will wait
<wgrant> So now we have a proposal for -proposed-proposed. Great.
<ScottK> wgrant: May as well get -proposed-proposed-proposed while we're at it, just to be safe.
<ScottK> No one seems to be jumping on my "Just don't leave proposed on all the time" solution.
<skipper> sounds a litte bit like m*cr*s*ft. they create patches for patches for patches. ;)
<wgrant> ScottK: I leave -proposed on all the time, but that's because I can't upgrade to Intrepid like I usually do.
<ScottK> Right, but wouldn't you agree that's not the general/supported case for it?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ScottK> Heya bddebian.
<bddebian> Hi ScottK
<RAOF> Hey bddebian, ScottK
<bddebian> Heya RAOF
<fale> hello
<fale> how can I put a package on PPA that requires cmake?
<persia> fale: Take a look at some of the packages returned by `grep-dctrl -FBuild-Depends cmake -sPackage /var/lib/apt/lists/*hardy_universe_source_Sources` for examples using cmake
<fale> persia: my question is: PPA can compile my package if my package to be compiled required cmake?
<persia> fale: If the package is constructed correctly to call cmake properly, yes
<fale> persia: :)
<fale> persia: I'll try
<fale> persia: I have to upload the cmake folder?
 * TheMuso glances over the email about debian policy 3.8.0.0
<ScottK> README.Source seems to be the one that will most commonly affect packages
<persia> fale: I'm not sure.  The command I provided before will give examples of packages using cmake
<fale> persia: ok, I'll check iy :)
<TheMuso> ScottK: Yeah.
<persia> I like the addition of "how to patch this for compilation" to README.Source
 * ScottK prepares a macro for "Read man dpatch-edit-patch" and "Read man cdbs-edit-patch."
<persia> heh
<ScottK> I think it's useful for obscure systems but overkill for the common cases.
<ajmitch> "Take this double-ROT13-encoded patch, run it through this hideous perl filter, reindent it all to apply, and then reboot"
<persia> double-ROT13-encoding?  How does that work for punctuation?
<ajmitch> who needs punctuation?
<persia> Ah.  Right.  I hadn't sufficiently considered the perl filter
<ajmitch> it's as obsolete as correct grammar these days
<TheMuso> Nothing like policy changes to keep you on your toes.
<ajmitch> it makes life exciting
<ajmitch> of course I'll still trying to keep up with changes from 2+ years ago
<moquist> if somebody could take a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=vpnywhere I'd appreciate it.
<theseinfeld> hi all
<theseinfeld> is there a way to install autobuilder for Ubuntu?
<theseinfeld> Do I follow the Debian steps or is there something more Ubuntu like?
<RAOF> theseinfeld: Why are you asking this in #ubuntu-motu? :)
<theseinfeld> because you are the masterst of the universe :)
<theseinfeld> ?
<RAOF> I don't know what autobuilder is, but this doesn't sound like a question about the development of Ubuntu; you may have more luck in #ubuntu or #ubuntu+1 (if you're using Intrepid)
<theseinfeld> well, it is about building packages, but not on ppa/revu
<theseinfeld> :D
<theseinfeld> I will try with #ubuntu channel. Thanks
<dholbach> good morning
<Hobbsee_> morning!
<theseinfeld> morning
<RAOF> 'lo, dholbach.
<Hobbsee_> theseinfeld: you likely do follow debian's instructions, but this is really not a support channel.
<dholbach> hi RAOF, hobbsee, theseinfeld :)
<theseinfeld> thanks Hobbsee
<theseinfeld> then, anybody up for the http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=libdc1394-22
<theseinfeld> It has been there since February?
<theseinfeld> :D
<theseinfeld> even lool is active this morning :)
<huats> morning everyone
<Laney> Howdy all
<Laney> Anyone got a merge free for the taking?
<Laney> \sh: Mind if I do paprefs?
<persia> Laney: Not Debian merges, but there's heaps of upstream merges outstanding, if you like.
<persia> Take a look at http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/uehs
<persia> Err http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/uehs/no_updated.html
<Laney> persia: I've not done one of these before, do I have to ping anyone beforehand?
<persia> Laney: It's about the same as a merge.  You don't have to do anything, but people get annoyed when you don't collaborate.  Best to check with the last uploader, and specific maintainer, and look for bugs on LP.
<persia> s/and spe/or spe/
<persia> The key difference between a upstream merge and a debian merge is that the thing to attach to your bug is the new diff.gz, rather than the debdiff against Debian.
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<DktrKranz> pitti, doko: regarding bug 237083, is there any available test case to check if proposed update is good?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 237083 in openjdk-6 "openjdk-6 SRU for hardy" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/237083
<DktrKranz> mh... wrong chan...
<doko> DktrKranz: just one? glassfish should be checked with the new build to test the keystore problems, netbeans started to see the fontconfig problem. you can check in intrepid as well. same package
<ruiboon> hi. is there any macro that automatically fills in the build-depends field in debian/control ?
<persia> ruiboon: No, and you wouldn't want one, as sometimes you want to compile with, or not compile with some library supported by the application.
<ruiboon> persia: thanks. i guess i have to fill it in myself
<persia> ruiboon: Typically the README or INSTALL file in the source ought tell you which libraries you need, which ought get you 80% of the way there.
<ruiboon> persia: ah.. that helps. thanks
<norsetto> heya
<sebner> huhu norsetto
<norsetto> huhu sebner
<lukehasnoname> good morning all
<norsetto> morning lukehasnoname
<sistpoty|work> hi norsetto
<norsetto> sistpoty|work: heya master
<huats> norsetto:  hello my friend
<norsetto> huats: THE huats!
<huats> norsetto: THE norsetto
<huats> ;)
<effie_jayx> dholbach, i was working on the package. I must change conflict/replace to make sure all packages get updated
<dholbach> effie_jayx: that sounds about right
<effie_jayx> I initially thought of libbakery-common but all three packages have to replace ubuntu old ubuntu versions
<superm1> where's that nifty webpage i saw posted here at some point that lists SRU's and all of their statuses?
<dholbach> effie_jayx: really?
<effie_jayx> Since all previous versions in debian replace 2.3, i was just wondering
<dholbach> effie_jayx: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html - you need conflicts/replaces if files move from one package to another
<dholbach> effie_jayx: I thought it was only libbakery2.4-common and libbakery-common that had files moving around
<effie_jayx> Doesn't the package leave the old 0ubuntu1 around?
<dholbach> effie_jayx: if you add a conflicts, it should get removed in the upgrade process
<effie_jayx> Ok. I'll try it and see
<wgrant> superm1: Try http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/sru/. The ubuntu-archive one is linked from there, if that's what you want.
<superm1> yes that's exactly what i was looking for
<superm1> thanks wgrant
<wgrant> np
<Neurostu> can someone shed some light on what:
<Neurostu> dpkg-genchanges: error: badly formed line in files list file, line 1
<Neurostu> dpkg-buildpackage: failure: dpkg-genchanges gave error exit status 9
<Neurostu> means
<cyberix> Tool called linda does not exist in 8.04?
<lucas> cyberix: it was removed from debian. use lintian.
<cyberix> k
<Neurostu> anybody?
<slytherin> Neurostu: what are you trying to do exactly?
<Neurostu> trying to figure out what the error msgs I'm getting mean
<Neurostu> I posted them here about 40 minutes ago
<cyberix> I did not have to use -f in order to update my package at REVU. I wonder, if I broke up something
<Neurostu> slytherin: here is a pastebin of the errors: http://mwl.pastebin.com/m11739416
<amikrop> Can I rename my package (it is uploaded but not examined) from ueagle-setup to ueagle?
<slytherin> cyberix: did you change version?
<amikrop> I thought it would be OK ro rename it to ueagle, because there is no other Ubuntu package with "ueagle" in its name, so it could not be confused.
<slytherin> Neurostu: I saw the error message, but tell me what are you trying to do? Make a package?
<cyberix> slytherin: yes
<amikrop> Also, there is not much point in appending "-setup" to a package, because what all packages do, is setting up.
<slytherin> cyberix: why? you are not supposed to.
<amikrop> When I say uploaded, I mean uploaded to REVU.
<cyberix> slytherin: New upstream release
<amikrop> So? Could there be a problem?
<slytherin> amikrop: You can sure change package name. That way it will have another entry in revu. Make sure you comment on old entry asking to discard it.
<slytherin> cyberix: Are you trying to get review on new package or just new version of existing package?
<amikrop> slytherin: alright ^^
<Neurostu> slythering: yes, that is the output when I run dpkg-buildpackage
<Neurostu> I'm trying to build a .deb
<cyberix> slytherin: a new package
<cyberix> slytherin: Review brought up a bug which was then fixed upstream
<slytherin> cyberix: Then it is fine. Shouldn't be a problem.
<cyberix> slytherin: Ok. Great.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<schmiedc> hoi
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hello schmiedc, geser
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty|work
<dholbach> YokoZar: do you think you could follow up on the wine post on planet ubuntu?
<YokoZar> dholbach: For some reason the posts I make don't seem to get syndicated to planet ubuntu
<YokoZar> dholbach: Anyway I'm not sure what you want me to do, the patch Brandon links to is likely to cause regressions
<dholbach> YokoZar: and it doesn't look like a good advice to most wine users :-/
<YokoZar> Well, it makes his program work, and I think it's pretty clear from the post that this shouldn't be done unless you're running it and it bothers you enough
<dholbach> also a PPA might work better than the sudo apt-get remove --purge wine; sudo make uninstall; sudo make install business
<YokoZar> or just forking package and building locally
<dholbach> oh well - I just thought you might be in the best position to answer this
<dholbach> and definitely weird your blog does not turn up on planet ubuntu
<dholbach> it looks like it's fine in the config
<dholbach> I call it a day - see you tomorrow
 * sistpoty|work heads home... cya
<Neurobuntu> When I run: debuild my package compiles and build successfully into a deb, however it says that my file debian/files has a badly formed line... this is weird because I didn't create this file, what is supposed to be in this file
<Neurobuntu> does debuild try to put the .deb into the repository pocket?
<persia> Neurobuntu: debian/files contains a list of files to go in the deb.  You shouldn't have created it.  debuild doesn't care about pockets.
<Neurobuntu> persia: if debuild is creating the file for me why is it giving me the badly formed line error
<persia> Neurobuntu: I'm not sure.  It's something odd happening as a result of your debian/rules call.  You might try looking at the file, and compariing with the same file from another package that doesn't have that error.
<Neurobuntu> persia, ok thanks
<Neurobuntu> persia, is the files list necessary, i mean will a deb install correctly without it?
<Neurobuntu> or if it isn't correct
<persia> Neurobuntu: Check your created .deb with dpkg --contents.  I suspect it's missing something.
<Iulian> Hi
<Neurobuntu> persia: I don't think so, it looks like everything is in there
<persia> Neurobuntu: Hmm.  I don't know.  You might ask someone to review the package in detail, but it might just work.
<Neurobuntu> ok well I'll figure this out eventually, ty
<SniperBeamer> hi, is it possible to tell cdbs not to create usr/share/doc/... but instead link to a common doc dir?
<persia> SniperBeamer: It does that by default.
<persia> In /usr/share/doc/...
<persia> Just put the same files in all the subpackages.
<persia> (or maybe I'm mistaken, but I think that's right - someone please correct me otherwise)
<RoAkSoAx> hi guys, does anyone knows why i get this warnings when trying to create a new pbuilder ? The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<RoAkSoAx>   aptitude: Depends: libapt-pkg-libc6.7-6-4.6 but it is not installable
<RoAkSoAx>   libept0: Depends: libapt-pkg-libc6.7-6-4.6 but it is not installable
<RoAkSoAx> and how can i fix it?
<geser> RoAkSoAx: interpid?
<RoAkSoAx> geser, yep
<geser> looks like aptitude and libept0 need a rebuild with the recent apt
<SniperBeamer> persia: it only symlinks files (except copyright)
<RoAkSoAx> geser, how to do that ;)
<geser> RoAkSoAx: you would need a interpid pbuilder for that
<SniperBeamer> and lintian complains with debian-changelog-file-is-a-symlink
<Pennycook_> Hi guys, I was directed over here by #kubuntu.  I have a question about using prevu; I've updated to Qt4.4 using backports and need to backport Intrepid's version of lyx.  Given lyx exists in Intrepid, is running "prevu lyx" enough, or do I need to provide a URL, maybe something else?
<RoAkSoAx> geser, so should i create a hardy pbuilder and upgrade too intrepid??
<RoAkSoAx> geser, libapt-pkg-libc is a package right?? cause i can't find it in the repos
<persia> SniperBeamer: You can ignore the lintian error, and symlinks don't take that much space.
<geser> RoAkSoAx: yes, that would too
<geser> RoAkSoAx: libapt-pkg-libc is provided by apt
<RoAkSoAx> geser, ok thanks, so i'll create a hardy pbuilder and upgrade it too intrepid
<SniperBeamer> persia: sure, I just think symlinking the whole dir is a cleaner solution
<persia> SniperBeamer: Maybe.  Investigate dh_link.
<SniperBeamer> dh_link says that the usr/share/doc/... dir already exists
<SniperBeamer> I didn't find an option that stops cdbs from calling dh_installdocs
<Jazzva> Just to make sure... Changes to .po files should be removed from the final debdiff in a merge?
<geser> Jazzva: yes, unless they were made on purpose which should be documented in the changelog
<persia> Jazzva: Typically.  Check the Ubuntu changelog.  Except in rare cases, we prefer Debian .po files.  In those rare cases, you need to merge manually, but should be sure to push the change to Debian.
<Jazzva> persia, geser: Thanks.
<Jazzva> persia: What would be those rare cases?
<persia> Jazzva: When there was an error of some sort that was fixed.  Maybe a typo, etc.
<Jazzva> persia: I see... thanks :)
<emgent> Security Meeting now on #ubuntu-meeting
<whyking_> hi
<whyking_> is this the right place for me to ask about an ubunut-package provided by MOTU (namely scipy) ?
<RoAkSoAx> geser, any ideas why i get this?? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/17309/
<persia> whyking_: You can ask, although we may not know.  If it's about a bug, you may have better luck in #ubuntu-bugs.  If it's about support, you may have better luck in #ubuntu.
<geser> RoAkSoAx: that's kind of "normal", yes, it's a bug
<geser> RoAkSoAx: check if you have already upgraded libc6 and coreutils before proceeding
<whyking_> I was wondering, there are some special functions in scipy.sandbox, those are present in the scipy-0.6 source tarball, but not in the i386 compiled version.. why would that be the case? and, any plans on changing that?
 * persia points at http://women.debian.org/wiki/English/MaintainerScripts as a source of information about debugging maintainer script issues
<geser> RoAkSoAx: s/coreutils/findutils/
<geser> RoAkSoAx: bug #234345
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 234345 in findutils "xargs: xargs.c:443: main: Assertion `bc_ctl.arg_max <= (131072-2048)' failed." [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/234345
<RoAkSoAx> let's see
<RoAkSoAx> i don't have those packages in the update-manager for upgrade.. but i'll upgrade my system and i'll tr again
<RoAkSoAx> thanks geser ;)
<norsetto> whyking_: could very well be a packaging bug, would you mind issuing a bug report about it in Launchpad?
<norsetto> whyking_: well, seems like upstream has disabled the building of sandbox modules
<whyking_> norsetto, what do you mean with upstream?
<whyking_> norsetto, it is also not present in the debian package
<whyking_> norsetto, is that what oyu mean?
<sebner> whyking_: upstream is the programmer
<whyking_> hm.. I do not think so.. it is present when I build the from the source
<norsetto> whyking_: well, all subpackages are commented out in setup.py
<whyking_> norsetto, oh, you are right
<whyking_> unfortunate
<sebner> norsetto is the rainman =)
<whyking_> norsetto, well, thanks for looking into that
<norsetto> whyking_: np
<schmiedc> cya
<norsetto> sebner: how far are you from the lake?
<sebner> norsetto: the lake (which one) or a lake?
<norsetto> sebner: isn't there a lake in your village?
<sebner> norsetto: ~5-10km away
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, you gonna take a bath in the lake?? :P xD
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: noooo!?
<wasabi> Packaging question: I have a command I want a daemon to run after the daemon is upgraded, to restart the daemon. but it also has to run AFTER some packages which depend on the daemon: and are thus after the daemon
<wasabi> Basically the daemon has plugins.
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, lol i was just joking :P
<wasabi> After any plugins are updated, the daemon should restart. Should I implement this in each plugin's postinst?
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: /me is too tired to discover jokes ^^
<RAOF> wasabi: That sounds like the way to go.
<wasabi> Hmm.
<RAOF> wasabi: Because, looking at it another way, from the plugin package's perspective it's not properly installed until the daemon has restarted; thus, it should restart the daemon.
<RAOF> For bonus points you could try dpkg triggers to have this happen exactly once per package-management-session, but I'm not familiar with them.
<crimsun> hmm, so I need to revert these sysv-rc changes.  Sigh.
<ajmitch> caused some breakage?
<sebner> gn8 folks
<crimsun> ajmitch: no, just the intrepid merge deprecates multiuser semantics.
<crimsun> or at least I'm led to believe so from the changelog.
<RAOF> And the mail on ubuntu-devel, presumably.
 * ajmitch is still trying to catch up on -devel mail
<ajmitch> just got to that one now :)
#ubuntu-motu 2008-06-06
<lifeless> who is the freenode-guru in here?
<emgent> lifeless: what problem with freenode?
<persia> lifeless: Hobbsee, but I might be able to answer something.
<lifeless> well
<lifeless> I'm wondering about the ubuntu-XX channels
<lifeless> are they language/country/?? - what is the XX for
<lifeless> I'd like to get an ubuntu-la (la for Latin) going, but its registered
<persia> lifeless: Might be country, might be language, might be state, depends on the local demographics.
<emgent> true..
<lifeless> (registered and empty I should say)
<emgent> lifeless: list it :)
 * persia looks up the channel map
<lifeless> by list, do you mean query?
<emgent> yeah with /list *ubuntu*
<emgent> (03:52) :: LIST Server load is temporarily too heavy. Please wait a while and try again.
<lifeless> :P
<emgent> argh..
<lifeless> persia: if you have a doco pointer I'm happy to chase it
<lifeless> persia: otherwise, thanks :P
<persia> New services have a new command.  You can look it up on freenode blog.
<persia> Hmmm..  #ubuntu-la isn't listed as IRCC controlled on https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InternetRelayChat.  Ask in #ubuntu-ops to see if any of the IRCC is there, and if you can have it.
<LaserJock> ScottK: do you happen to know if cmake is going to be backported?
<RoAkSoAx> does anyone has this error when trying to create an intrepid pbuilder?? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/17397/
 * RoAkSoAx can't install a pbuilder for intrepid T.T
<RAOF> RoAkSoAx: Oh.  I thought that had been fixed.
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, yeah me too.. but my system is up to date and still having the same issue.. any ideas on how to fix it??
<RAOF> Nah, not really.  You could try unpacking the deb, fiddling with the postinst, repacking, and then installing it.
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, ok i'll try, thanks ;)
<jml> I saw a travel agent advertising Intrepid holidays.
<jml> cognitive dissonance ensued.
<RAOF> Heh.
<RoAkSoAx> lol
<ScottK> LaserJock: Dunno
<Hobbsee> RoAkSoAx: you need to upgrade findutils first.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: ^
<RoAkSoAx> Hobbsee, everything is up to date T.T
 * Hobbsee bets it isn't.
<RoAkSoAx> Hobbsee, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/17404/
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Ah, that's what fixed it for me, was it?  It's actually been a couple of weeks since I installed Intrepid, so these transitory teething problems fade from my memory.
<RoAkSoAx> unless i need to add proposed to my repos.. cause i have everything else enabled
<persia> RoAkSoAx: Try `sudo aptitude update; sudo aptitude upgrade`.  Sometimes that makes a difference.
<RoAkSoAx> persia, i will ;)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: yeah
<Hobbsee> RoAkSoAx: which version of findutils do you have installed?
<RoAkSoAx> Hobbsee, Version: 4.2.32-1ubuntu2
<Hobbsee> RoAkSoAx: that'll be why.  that's not the latest.
<RoAkSoAx> where can i get the latest then ?
<RoAkSoAx> or how can i?
<Hobbsee> from the repositories, apparnetly
<Hobbsee>   Version table:
<Hobbsee>  *** 4.4.0-2ubuntu2 0
<Hobbsee>         500 http://mirror.internode.on.net intrepid/main Packages
<Hobbsee>         500 http://archive.ubuntu.com intrepid/main Packages
<RoAkSoAx> but how can i do it if i'm in hardy...
<RoAkSoAx> i created a hardy pbuilder and trying to upgrade to intrepid is where i get the error
<RAOF> I think I just upgraded again, and it worked.
<RAOF> (In the pbuilder environment, is where you'd do this)
<Hobbsee> oh, you're in hardy.  right.
<Hobbsee> use pbuilder login --save-after-login, and upgrade findutils that way
<RoAkSoAx> ok thanks Hobbsee :)
<ajmitch> hello dholbach
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> hi ajmitch
<ScottK> Anyone know what's up with the Italian loco team?
 * ScottK was just reading emgent's blog on planet.
<ajmitch> no idea, I don't want to get into loco drama
<dholbach> ScottK: I tried to leave a comment on the blog entry but it didn't work
<ScottK> It's just morbid curiousty on my part.
<dholbach> hmmm
<ScottK> seele dragged me to my first IRC loco meeting just this week for our local team.
<dholbach> how was it?
<ajmitch> our loco team is fairly quiet, mostly just a few regulars in the IRC channel
<ScottK> dholbach: It was pretty quiet for me.  seele is a strong personality.
<ScottK> Mostly I asked if there would be beer at the event they were discussing.
 * ajmitch does meet up with some #ubuntu-nz people in person from time to time
<dholbach> ScottK: which Loco is yours? were there lots of people?
<ScottK> dholbach: us-md (Maryland).  It's a small group.
 * RAOF doesn't even know if there _is_ a Sydney loco group.
<Flannel> If you can read italian, the LoCo logs are available
<ScottK> No Italian here.
<ajmitch> RAOF: there's enough of you sydney people
<Flannel> RAOF: No, it's an -au thing
<slangasek> Flannel: and if we can read italian, we also know where they are without being given a URL? :-)
<Flannel> !logs
<ubottu> Official channel logs can be found at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ - For LoCo channels, http://logs.ubuntu-eu.org/freenode/
 * RoAkSoAx LoCo team has just been approved as an official team :)
<dholbach> ScottK: seele said something about usability testing - was that what it was about?
<ScottK> Yes.
<dholbach> nice
<StevenK> RAOF: We seem to fit in -au
<dholbach> RoAkSoAx: which one is that? Peru? :)
<RoAkSoAx> dholbach, yep :)
<dholbach> it's just awesome to see everybody active with Ubuntu around the world :)
<StevenK> I have to say, the ubuntu-au logo is awesome
<ajmitch> it's not too bad
<ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NZTeam?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=nzubuntu-small.png
<StevenK> ajmitch: That's cool, too
<geser> good morning
<RoAkSoAx> dholbach, i just remembered that there is something that i want to ask you... why don't you make packaging guide available for translation in LP?
<dholbach> RoAkSoAx: the packaging guide is available on the wiki nowadays
<RoAkSoAx> dholbach, yeah i know.. but the thing is that it is much easier to do it through rosetta
<dholbach> RoAkSoAx: so there's no source anymore (as in docbook as it used to be)
<RoAkSoAx> so if i want it translated.. can i just start doing it on a wiki page right?
<dholbach> RoAkSoAx: exactly
<RoAkSoAx> and how about the Ubuntu $(language) Development Teams
<RoAkSoAx> is anyone in charge already to get the packaging guide and stuff translated?
<dholbach> RoAkSoAx: the discussion we had at UDS was mostly informational - we tried to hear what works well for existing teams and what's important to them
<dholbach> I'm not sure anybody has gotten around to summarising the discussion yet
<dholbach> RoAkSoAx: so no, there's no organised effort right now trying to translate the packaging guide yet
<ScottK> I thought we were migrating back to configuration controlled policy documentation?
<dholbach> ScottK: hm?
<ScottK> The first Friday session at UDS that cjwatson did.
<dholbach> erm, I'm afraid I don't know which one that was
<RoAkSoAx> dholbach, ok, so i guess i'm free to start its translation to spanish :)
<ScottK> dholbach: Look on the gobby server for the doc called policy-and-standards
<dholbach> ScottK: gracias
<dholbach> ScottK: hum... what do you get if you open it in gobby? to me it looks empty
<ScottK> dholbach: Get the one that ends in 's'
<dholbach> :)
<dholbach> ScottK: that looks good - I'm not sure though that it replaces the Packaging Guide as it's not so much a policy document, but a beginner's guide
<dholbach> it's a great idea to make more use of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuPackagingChanges again
<ScottK> dholbach: I think we'd be better off to use Debian new maintainer's guide with a short supplement for Ubuntu differences.
<ScottK> dholbach: Who's going to update our packaging guide to support the new Debian policy uploaded yesterday?
<dholbach> ScottK: which changes are you most concerned about?
<dholbach_> ScottK: which changes are you most concerned about?
<ScottK> dholbach: The Debian.source rules definitely need to be included.  Not sure what else.
<ScottK> dholbach: I'm mostly concerned about systematically getting it figured out since we have no process and have forked the documentation.
 * ScottK heads to bed.
<dholbach> ScottK: I agree that the more we can re-use, the better - we just need to think about how best to do that
<dholbach> ScottK: good night
 * dholbach goes out to walk the dog
 * RoAkSoAx goes to bed... g'night all
<TheMuso> StevenK: I worked out the problem I was having with that code. Turns out in glibc 2.7, the code that defines the ucred structure has had a __USE_GNU #define placed around it. Joy! :)
<StevenK> Ahh!
<TheMuso> Well in a version of glibc between hardy and intrepid.
<StevenK>      glibc | 2.7-10ubuntu3 |         hardy | source
<StevenK>      glibc | 2.8~20080505-0ubuntu3 |      intrepid | source
<StevenK> So, I suspect you mean between 2.7 and 2.8
<TheMuso> Yeah.
<TheMuso> Now to get this updated merge uploaded, and actually get built on the buildds.
<\sh> damn...I shouldn't subscribe to planets..with strange articles
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<RAOF> Howdie, sistpoty.
<sistpoty|work> hi RAOF
<norsetto> huhu all
<wgrant> Evening norsetto.
<geser> Hi norsetto, sistpoty|work
<sistpoty|work> hi geser, norsetto and wgrant
<norsetto> sistpoty|work: master at work
<wgrant> Hi geser, sistpoty|work.
<geser> Hi wgrant
<norsetto> geser: guten tag
<norsetto> this reminds me of a group of people all trying to shake hands together :-)
<wgrant> norsetto: Heh, yes.
<sistpoty|work> norsetto: heh, sounds like a math execercise *g*
<neil_d> I have written a CUPS printer that can email (as a pdf) what was printed.  how would I go about publishing this so other can use/modify ?
<\sh> neil_d, talk to tkampeter
<\sh> neil_d, talk to tkamppeter to be correct
<\sh> neil_d, he's on #ubuntu-devel
<neil_d> \sh: ok
<effie_jayx> hey all.. I was just checking the build log and I found this at the end, what does it mean:
<effie_jayx> dpkg-genchanges: warning: duplicate files list entry for file libbakery-2.4-dev_2.4.4-1ubuntu1_i386.deb (line 5)
<amikrop> How can I fix these lintian complaints? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/ueagle-0806051620/lintian
<ogra> amikrop, well, it tells you pretty detailed whats wrong
<\sh> amikrop, http://lintian.debian.org/reports/tags/binary-arch-rules-but-pkg-is-arch-indep.html
<amikrop> \sh: thanks
<amikrop> \sh: So, I should rename the binary-arch section in my debian/rules?
<ogra> no, make sure to use the code you have in there in binary-indep instead
<ogra> (or dont use it at all if you dont need it there)
<amikrop> ogra: OK, thank you.
<amikrop> In my debian/rules, configure, configure-stamp, build and build-stamp only call each other (and touch two empty files). Can I remove them all?
<amikrop> I have Standards-Version 3.7.2. How can I get 3.7.3?
<jpds> amikrop: change it in debian/control
<amikrop> jpds: Manually? Shouldn't I get my dh_make to generate correct "Standards-Version"s automatically?
<jpds> amikrop: manually, it's only one line.
<amikrop> jpds: ok
<ScottK> amikrop: Why 3.7.3?
<amikrop> ScottK: lintian says so
<effie_jayx> hey all
<effie_jayx> I was wondering about the results of a build, I am not really sure why I get the following build warinings
<effie_jayx> dpkg-genchanges: warning: duplicate files list entry for file libbakery-2.4-dev_2.4.4-1ubuntu1_i386.deb (line 5)
 * ScottK reads #ubuntu-devel and boggles.
<ScottK> Raise you hand if your an core-dev and think using alien is a solution to packaging problems?
 * ScottK looks around
<bddebian> Heya gang
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<Hobbsee> ScottK: you do realise that alien is in main, don't you.
<ScottK> Hobbsee: I didn't, but it doesn't change my opinion any.
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty|work
<laga> Hobbsee: yeah, LSB requires it. but it's still not a great idea for some uses cases :)
<Hobbsee> yeah, true
 * ScottK finds it useful to get from srpm to tar.gz, but not to make a .deb.
 * Hobbsee is merely pointing out that there appears to be some useful case.
<ScottK> Agreed, but not producing final Debian packages (IMO anyway).
<ScottK> lsb-core depends on it.  Not sure why.
<ScottK> OK.  So fewer hands here than in #ubuntu-devel.
<Nafallo> meeh. just couldn't be bothered. ask for a +1 next time ;-)
<laga> ScottK: i believe LSB specifies that software ough tot be available in rpm format (or a restricted subset thereof to ensure compatibility)
 * sistpoty|work particularly won't say a word beginning with check and ending with install here *g*
<emgent> mornign
<sistpoty|work> hi emgent
<emgent> sistpoty|work: :)
<ScottK> laga: Makes sense in an LSB kind of way.
<mterry> OK, so I want to use pdebuild and I occasionally get something like "pbuilder-satisfydepends-dummy: libgnomeui-dev which is a virtual package".  Is this my fault, debian/control's fault, or libgnomeui-dev's fault?
<mterry> (I should say, pdebuild fails seemingly because of the above message)
<mterry> Hmm, bad example.  I didn't actually get it for libgnomeui-dev.  But I have for other -devs
<devfil> asac: ping
<norsetto> need help devfil?
<devfil> yes, with a bug, I don't know the way to fix it
<norsetto> devfil: which one?
<devfil> norsetto: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wxwidgets2.8/+bug/196834
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 196834 in wxwidgets2.8 "wxPython demo is not installing properly" [Low,In progress]
<norsetto> devfil: ok, whats the problem?
<devfil> norsetto: examples readme says: "Note that some of them will attempt to write to the current
<devfil> working directory, or to the home directory of the user they are run as." and "Some of the files have been compressed in accordance with Debian policy
<devfil> regarding documentation"
<norsetto> devfil: yes?
<devfil> so I think I should use debconf to ask the dir when examples should be extracted
<norsetto> devfil: wait a sec, what is the problem, that the examples are gzipped?
<devfil> exactly
<norsetto> devfil: well, thats not a problem, its standard debian policy
<norsetto> devfil: you may use a -x in dh_compress but that would be against the policy
<devfil> yes, but people want it unpacked
<devfil> norsetto: for this reason I think I should use debconf to ask
<norsetto> devfil: well, then they unpack it themselves
<devfil> norsetto: yes, but how I should do prerm file?
<devfil> examples need to write to the current dir, so they can be unpacked in usr/share
<devfil> and debconf should ask for the dir
<devfil> but prerm?
<norsetto> devfil: examples are not supposed to be run from /usr/share, they have to be copied to your local dir
<norsetto> devfil: actually, they should not be run, they should be "read" as examples, but thats another story
<devfil> norsetto: examples should be unpacked in home?
<norsetto> devfil: no, examples shall be installed in /usr/share/etc.etc.
<devfil> norsetto: and they are installed in /usr/share...
<norsetto> devfil: users that wants to use them, have to unpack them to a local dir where they have the necessary privileges
<geser> I usually see packages installing examples in /usr/share/doc/<pkgname>/examples
<norsetto> geser: correct
<norsetto> devfil: so, there is nothing wrong with that package, no bugs to be fixed
<devfil> norsetto: good, how I should set status bug?
<geser> I'd explain why it's not a bug and set to "invalid"
<norsetto> devfil: either invalid or won't fix, roughly speacking invalid means its not a bug, won't fix we recognise its an issue but we won't do anything about it
<devfil> geser: ok thanks
<devfil> norsetto: ok thanks, now another question
<devfil> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wxwidgets2.8/+bug/211553
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 211553 in wxwidgets2.8 "wxPython isn't on path in hardy beta" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<devfil> in this bug I've used ln -snf to do a link
<devfil> package use update-alternatives
<devfil> maybe I can use it to do links?
<norsetto> devfil: isn't the package using pycentral/pysupport?
<devfil> norsetto: ehm... I don't know
<norsetto> devfil: ok, better check it out, either of them should take care of that automatically
<norsetto> devfil: let me fetch a link
<norsetto> devfil: this should do: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy
<devfil> norsetto: it use pycentral
<norsetto> devfil: ok, pycentral just recently did a transition, perhaps there is some hardcoded stuff to be changed
<devfil> norsetto: I'm scared
<norsetto> devfil: :-) don't
<norsetto> devfil: just check debian/rules and the install files
<norsetto> devfil: for the other bug, I see that there is a script in debian which seems to be written for the end users
<norsetto> devfil: just check that is installed (and where) and point users to it
<devfil> norsetto: yes, unpack_examples.sh but nobody seems to see it
<devfil> norsetto: yes, is what I will do when I will invalid the bug
<norsetto> devfil: well, is it well documented? If it is there is nothing more we can do
<norsetto> devfil: which seems to be the case, look at README.example in /examples
<devfil> norsetto: there is a readme
<devfil> norsetto: yes, I looked at it
<devfil> norsetto: readme is installed in the same dir of unpack_examples.sh
<norsetto> devfil: so, just mark that as invalid and give the above reasons
<norsetto> devfil: there is also a wxwidgets2.8 package in experimental (2.8.7.1-0.1) which you may want to check?
<devfil> norsetto: I looked at it and I proposed me as co-maintainer for wxwidgets2.8 packages in debian, but I'm waiting for a reply
<norsetto> devfil: ok, for the python stuff, I see a lot of things hardcoded in there, if I were you I would ask help to a python$deity
<devfil> norsetto: ehm..what? :)
<norsetto> devfil: ask somebody who is knowledgeable about python packaging
<norsetto> devfil: especially pycentral
<devfil> norsetto: for example?
<norsetto> devfil: ask scottk, he is usually helpfull, if he doesn't know the answer himself he may point you in the right direction, otherwise try asking to doko, he is pycentral mastermind
<devfil> norsetto: for wx.pth links?
<norsetto> devfil: for the problem about the application not being in the right path
<devfil> yes, the fix is in the bug but do you think I should use update-alternatives?
<norsetto> devfil: that fix looks like a hack, maybe a simple rebuild is enough
<devfil> norsetto: no, you are not understanding
<norsetto> devfil: yes, thats typically me :-)
<devfil> norsetto: to fix #211553 I used ln -snf to link wx.pth to the right dir, but package also use update-alternatives, so do you think I should use update-alternatives as package do?
<norsetto> devfil: thats what I said, linking seems the wrong hack, pycentral should install the files in the correct locations, if it doesn't I suspect that due to the transition, some of the hardcoded paths in rules has to be changed, and/or a rebuild is needed
<devfil> norsetto: then I didn't understand :) sorry
<devfil> norsetto: 	DH_PYCENTRAL=nomove dh_pycentral
<devfil> 	for v in $(PYVERS); do \
<devfil> 	  ln -sf ../../wx/python/wx.pth debian/$(package_gtk_py_ver)/usr/lib/python$$v/site-packages/wx.pth; \
<devfil> 	done
<devfil> this should link wx.pth
 * sistpoty|work heads home... cya
<NielsE> can someone help a beginner-motu (me)? I'm trying to change the tekst of the manpage of the gnu's helloworld example, and repackage it, but I dont know how (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=819635)
<norsetto> Nielse: you should see your changes in the diff.gz after debuild -S, if you don't than you missed something
<NielsE> in the .diff.gz I can see my changes in hello.1, but after instaling the .deb the manpage does not seem to be affected
<norsetto> NielsE: than you are not installing the right deb
<nhandler> norsetto and NielsE: Are the manpages removed when you uninstall a package?
<norsetto> nhandler: yes
<NielsE> there is only 1 generated.., do I need to patch the diff to the .deb created by "debuild"?
<NielsE> after deleting the .deb "man hello" doesn't work anymore
<norsetto> nielse: where do you take the deb that you install?
<NielsE> I click on it in nautalis, or sometimes just "sudo dpkg -i hello-versionnumber.deb"
<norsetto> NielsE: yes, but where is it? Try also changing the changelog so you are sure that the version matches your changes
<NielsE> its in the directory above the source folder
<norsetto> nielse: you are using pbuilder?
<NielsE> not always, I am going to run it now
<norsetto> NielsE: be aware that pbuilder by default gives you the new .deb in /var
<norsetto> NielsE: /var/cache/pbuilder/result to be exact
<NielsE> oh, I thought it just checked if it was able to build it on a clean install
<NielsE> the .deb created by pbuilder has still the same manpage.., do I need to run some scripts or something before my changes are applied in the source code?
<norsetto> NielsE: no, as I said, change also the changelog, so you know which version to build
<emgent> heya people
<NielsE> the newly created deb has version number 2.1.1-1 (thats also in the changelog), and the original version is called 2.1.1
<norsetto> NielsE: 2.1.1 is an upstream version
<NielsE> yeah offcourse, thats the original version I wgetted from a gnu-ftp-site
<norsetto> NielsE: so, create a new version called 2.1.1-2 which contains a new changelog and your changes to the man pages
<norsetto> NielsE: build that and when you install 2.1.1-2 you will see the new man page
<NielsE> ok I will try
<norsetto> NielsE: otherwise, the only thing I can think of is that there is another manpage being installed
<NielsE> to create a new version, all I need to do is making an extra entry in the changelog and do "debuild", "debuild -S" and do a new pbuild?
<norsetto> Nielse: only debuild -S and then a new pbuilder build, debuild alone will make a new deb
<NielsE> I think I have found a part of the problem, hello.1 says: " DO NOT MODIFY THIS FILE!  It was generated by help2man 1.24.", but the tekst that is in the hello.1 is nowhere to be found in the source directory.., where does help2man gets the tekst from?
<NielsE> wait.
<norsetto> Nielse: give me a link to the tarball
<NielsE> http://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/hello/hello-2.1.1.tar.gz , help2man is the manpage generating script
<geser> NielsE: my guess would be it's generated from the output of --help
<norsetto> NielsE: looks like is source/hello itself
<NielsE> `$this_program' generates a man page out of `--help' and `--version' output, think you're right, now I'm going to find out where in the source code the --help gets printed I think
<NielsE> yeah I found it in the C source code, yay
<NielsE> also when you submit a new patch to a bugreport, do you only give the diff or the whole new .deb?
<geser> NielsE: only the (deb)diff
<NielsE> thanks, my edited manpage is working :)
<NielsE> I do need a "debuild" before I do a "debuild -S" though or else he won't compile the program again and thus the manpage is unchanged then
<NielsE> thank you very much for your time :-)
<sistpoty> cyberix: good work with mi2svg :)
 * sistpoty is off again
<mathiaz> What's the current policy about Vcs-* fields when doing a merge from Debian ? Should they be moved to XS-Vcs-* ?
<slangasek> mathiaz: why would you move them to XS-Vcs-*?  Current dpkg in intrepid recognizes Vcs-*, doesn't it?
<persia> slangasek: Yes.
 * slangasek nods
<geser> slangasek: I guess the idea is that the Ubuntu package isn't managed in the specified vcs
<slangasek> mathiaz: anyway, what I've seen some developers do, which makes sense to me, is move the Debian value to XS-Orig-Vcs-*, and set a Vcs-* value pointing at the Ubuntu repo
<persia> mathiaz: There's been some discussion, but no resolution.  Some people believe that it ought be removed or point to an Ubuntu VCS unless the Ubuntu changes are committed to the previously identified VCS.
<persia> Some people prefer to leave it alone, as being an extra thing to have to change.
<slangasek> geser: that's reasonable, but XS-Orig-Vcs-* doesn't achieve that :)
<slangasek> geser: er, I mean, XS-Vcs-* doesn't achieve that
<persia> XS-Orig-Vcs-* might, but the tools will all ignore it.
<slangasek> since it's just a roundabout way to wind up with the same Vcs-* field in the source package
<mathiaz> slangasek: hm.. ok so there isn't an official recommendation then
<slangasek> ttbomk, that's correct
<persia> mathiaz: It's that s/Vcs/XS-Vcs/ has absolutely no effect on the binary package produced.
<mathiaz> persia: ok - I'll leave them as is for now (following the road of "this is an extra thing to change")
<persia> mathiaz: OK.  On the other hand, if you want to renew the discussion on the mailing list, it might not be bad.  It's likely too late for intrepid, but we ought get some resolution at some point, and need to do it while people are still merging, but before a new release starts.
<slangasek> I propose that for intrepid, we implement the whole-archive import and have bzr autogenerate the values ;)
<persia> slangasek: Too late for intrepid.  Please make another suggestion.
<persia> Also, last I looked, we didn't have merge tools smart enough to automate merging.
<mouz> I tried to introduce a (fake) dependency by expanding the Depends: entry in debian/control. I compiled using pbuilder. The package I added is not in the pbuilder cache (nor anywhere else on my system). I expected pbuilder to retrieve it, but that did not happen. How come? Does something somewhere understand there is no real dependency?
<laga> as you have just been told elsewhere, you need to expand the build dependencies :)
<mouz> :) Wanted to see what's the difference between the channels. Could have asked it more directly.
<laga> i hope we passed your little quiz then.
<mouz> so far not much diff
<apachelogger> Nightrose: sebner wants to join the amarok team
 * sebner starts to hate apachelogger -.-
<Nightrose> sebner:  what do you want to do?
<emgent> hehehe :)
<emgent> hi slomo
<emgent> sebner:
<emgent> :)
<sebner> huhu ember
<sebner> huhu emgent -.-
<emgent> lol
<sebner> Nightrose: well, that's somehow a problem. dunno where I fit
<Nightrose> sebner: tell me what you are good at ;-)
<sebner> apachelogger: hmm?
<Nightrose> and I will try to find something for you
<sebner> gn8 folks
#ubuntu-motu 2008-06-07
<nxvl> jcastro: ping
<cyberix> Are Mondays still REVU days?
<persia> cyberix: Wednesdays were announced as REVU days, but there hasn't been a lot of activity.
<leleobhz> how can i see if a package have a mantainer into ubuntu?
<RAOF> leleobhz: Generally, we don't have the same maintainer concept as Debian.  You can check the changelog to see if someone has consistently been uploading, though.
<leleobhz> RAOF: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/praat
<leleobhz> well, have a lot of versions patched by Auto-sync
<leleobhz> RAOF: and so, i mantain a unnoficial package on my repositories
<leleobhz> its to ask too how can i be a package mantainer
<RAOF> Ok.  So that means we've just been taking it straight from Debian, and it'll have a Debian maintainer.
<leleobhz> RAOF: ?
<RAOF> It looks fairly active in Debian, too.  You probably want to talk with the Debian maintainer if you're interested in that package.
<leleobhz> RAOF: im interested only in ubuntu, not in debian
<leleobhz> mainly beucause i dont want to be a dd
<leleobhz> but a ubuntu member
<RAOF> leleobhz: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU is the canonical page.  But to start off with you can file and fix bugs that you're interested in.
<leleobhz> RAOF: my problem is im very good with shell and some python
<slangasek> It's Ubuntu's preference to not diverge from Debian on individual packages where this is feasible; that means that talking to the Debian maintainer is still the best first step
<RAOF> Heh.  I don't much want to be a DD either, but I maintain a couple of Debian packages.  You then get Ubuntu (and a bunch of other derived distro) packages for free.
<leleobhz> RAOF: a.k.a. im not so good to patch complex bugs...
<RAOF> leleobhz: Then patch simple bugs :)
<leleobhz> RAOF: ;]
<RAOF> Heh, nice typo in that changelog.
<leleobhz> the main problem of praat is the updates it have...
<leleobhz> its at least 3 new version every month
<leleobhz> its a reason ive created a fork of this package for ubuntu.
<leleobhz> RAOF: http://www.fon.hum.uva.nl/praat/manual/What_s_new_.html
<RAOF> It looks like the Debian maintainer's keeping up with the releases, though.
<slangasek> why is the frequency of rleeases a "problem"?
<slangasek> s/rleeases/releases/, too
<leleobhz> RAOF: what take my attention is Auto-Sync... that i dont know what is
<RAOF> leleobhz: That's the process by which we automatically take new/updated packages from Debian Sid and copy the source to Intrepid.
<leleobhz> slangasek: err... may the frequency of bugfixes? its a very buggy program...
<leleobhz> RAOF: hmmmm, and for final releases?
<RAOF> Ubuntu is based on Debian, and most of our packages are copied unchanged from Debian.  And the vast majority of the rest are trying to make it so we can copy them unchanged from debian :)
<leleobhz> get the lattest sid at freeze date?
<RAOF> Yup.  And later, but manually, if the Sid package has important fixes.
<slangasek> leleobhz: so you're saying that frequent bug fixes are... bad?
<slangasek> leleobhz: as RAOF mentioned, the Debian maintainer is keeping up with the upstream releases; so I don't understand what the problem is, here
<leleobhz> slangasek: no... (sorry by bad english) im saying praat is a buggy software... and have a lot of bugfixes lauched every month
<RAOF> If the problem is that the new releases aren't making it into Hardy, then that's entirely expected.  Hardy's released, and hence doesn't get new versions of stuff (without fairly significant paperwork).
<leleobhz> anyway, ive understood the debian sincronism
<leleobhz> RAOF: can be changed the releasing process?
<RAOF> No
<leleobhz> like: stay in hardy 5.0.X
<leleobhz> and all X be updates?
<RAOF> If it's so buggy that it's useless, then it shouldn't be in the archives.
<leleobhz> heh... isnt program fault.. its very userfull, but almost release have a bugfix..
<RAOF> That's the way with all software.
<RAOF> There's _always_ bugfixes in new releases.  And almost always new bugs introduced.  That's why the default upgrade policy is "no" - at least that way, you're stuck with the bugs you know!
<leleobhz> hmmm.... ok...
<leleobhz> another: have some policy beyond updates on ppa?
<RAOF> There are ways to request exceptions to the default policy, but they generally want the minimum possible change to fix a bug.
<RAOF> PPA's aren't official.  You can do what you want with them.
<leleobhz> RAOF: how can i see packaging related bugs?
<leleobhz> (i think this is a thing i can handle)
<jcastro> search launchpad for "bitesize" bugs, those are a great way to get started
<slangasek> jcastro: it seems he's interested in a particular package, which only has two open bugs in LP :)
<slangasek> (both of them segfaults, whoo)
<jcastro> yeah but he can practice fixing others. :p
<slangasek> :-)
<jcastro> actually I am losing in Scrabble and only half following the conversation
<leleobhz> slangasek: well, this package is a little problem to me (no more since my unofficial packageS)
<nxvl> jcastro: have you tried plukr? is like better than friendfeed IMHO
<leleobhz> slangasek: but anyway i want to start helping with something
<jcastro> nxvl: ugh, not another one
<slangasek> leleobhz: oh, then jcastro's suggestion is a good one :)
<nxvl> jcastro: there are A LOT!
<nxvl> jcastro: http://www.plurk.com/
<leleobhz> slangasek: have some pre-requisite to fix bugs except be in lauchpad?
<slangasek> leleobhz: there are no prerequisites for solving bugs; there are processes for getting bugfixes uploaded to Ubuntu that you would have to follow once you know a fix
<slangasek> I believe the MOTU wiki link posted earlier will help explain this
<leleobhz> slangasek: stupid ask, why lintian tell-me hardy is a invalid target distribution?
<leleobhz> (mind note: im using hardy)
<ryanakca> How could one build knmap on a host without internet access? The manpage is in docbook format and http://paste.debian.net/5585/
<leleobhz> E: praat_5.0.24-1_source.changes: bad-distribution-in-changes-file hardy
<Serega> hi all
<Polo> hi, I put some packages on revu, and I can see on the lintian file, "source: out-of-date-standards-version 3.7.2 (current is 3.7.3)"
<Polo> what should I do ?
<RainCT> Polo: change the Standards-Version in debian/control to 3.7.3
<Polo> ok thanks
<persia> Erm.  Shouldn't we be looking at standards-version 3.8.0 now?
<Iulian> Hey
<sistpoty> hi folks
<TheMuso> persia: I'd say once lintian and the actual policy itself ihit intrepid we could...
<sistpoty> persia: has the timeframe for motu-sru extension already passed? (I'm sure about the 48h bit, but not about the "or so" *g*)
<sistpoty> persia: if so, can you finally add the new members? *g*
<persia> TheMuso: I'd probably accept either policy on REVU now, but I agree with you for NEW, and it might make sense to combine them.
<persia> sistpoty: It's the or so bit.  I had vaguely planned to do it tonight, but might have done it in the morning if I wasn't prompted.
<sistpoty> persia: thanks!
<sistpoty> persia | TheMuso: can you add me to ubuntu-universe-sponsors? I just feel like clearing the queue a little bit, and otherwise I can't unsubscribe u-u-s
<persia> sistpoty: ~sistpoty?
<sistpoty> persia: yep
<persia> sistpoty: Done, and done.
<sistpoty> persia: thanks!
<persia> sistpoty: Much as I appreciate the accolades, you get a free 30-minute cache for that.  No need to repeat so often :)
<sistpoty> heh
<ryanakca> How could one build knmap on a host without internet access? The manpage is in docbook format and http://paste.debian.net/5585/
<persia> ryanakca: Depend on something that provides the DTD
<persia> s/Depend/Build-Depend
<ryanakca> persia: ah, ok, and then change the DTD in knmap.1.docbook to /usr/share/foo/bar.dtd ?
<persia> ryanakca: I think there's some mangling done internally, if you have the right one, but that ought work too.  I haven't looked at docbook in a long time, and am fuzzy on the details.
<ryanakca> persia: thanks
<albert23> sistpoty:  http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=478524 may give an answer to your soyuz question
<ubottu> Debian bug 478524 in libtommath "libtommath - FTBFS: latex: command not found" [Serious,Open]
<sistpoty> thanks albert23, /me looks
<albert23> sistpoty: and hs-plugins builds fine if you drop build-indep-stamp from the build: target
<sistpoty> albert23: hm. but that would not build the indep part on i386 then
<albert23> sistpoty: the indep part will be build via binary-indep --> install-indep --. build-indep-stamp
<sistpoty> albert23: but I can't see how the indep thingy is called from build-arch atm. can you?
<sistpoty> (so I don't think that bug report applies here)
<albert23> sistpoty: on i386, the buildd will call dpkg-buildpackage -b which will call debian/rules binary
<albert23> yhen binary depends on binary-indep
<sistpoty> albert23: yes, but for binary, build-depends-indep must be installed according to policy.
<albert23> sistpoty: on i386 the buildd will install b-d-i
<sistpoty> albert23: yes, and there it builds fine. that's why I linked to the amd64 FTBFS log ;)
<albert23> sistpoty: so on amd64 the buildd does not install b-d-i and calls dpkg-buildpackage -B
<albert23> the dpkg-buildpackage calls debian/rules build, which causes the problems
<albert23> for the build target b-d-i should be installed as well
<sistpoty> albert23: ah, so it's a bug in dpkg-buildpackage? (where did you see the -B btw., as I can't see that in from the log)
<albert23> so either the buildd must install b-d-i before calling dpkg-buildpackage -B
<albert23> or dpkg-buildpackage -B should not call debian/rules build
<albert23> that's the discussion in the debian bug
<sistpoty> ah. I guess I should have read the bug to the end *g*
<albert23> sistpoty: I don't see the -B either, just the effect of either binary or binary-arch being called
<sistpoty> bug filed: 238141
 * sistpoty is off again... cya
<devfil> ut is possibile to sync packages from experimental?
<crimsun> yes
<geser> yes
<devfil> packages not in ubuntu
<crimsun> (yes)
<devfil> crimsun: so I simply request a sync for example for http://packages.debian.org/sid/gstreamer0.10-plugins-farsight package, is this right?
<crimsun> devfil: have you confirmed that you can drop the gstreamer-tools build-dependency?
<devfil> crimsun: I'm trying, it's only an example
<crimsun> it seems like it still requires the Ubuntu delta
<crimsun> e.g., dh_gstscancodecs
<devfil> crimsun: yes, I posted the first package I've found
<colo939> Hi, I am considering the possibility of developing a GUI front end for ftp as a project for my user interface design class but I am not sure where to start.  I apologize if this is the wrong place for such a discussion
<ScottK-laptop> colo939: Why not do something that isn't redundant to a bunch of existing projects?
 * ScottK-laptop complains and runs off.
* nixternal changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | 8.04 is released: Let's fix any SRU-worthy bugs before the users try the package. | Intrepid open, go wild! https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html | QA targets available from http://qa.ubuntuwire.com | Wed. June 11, 2008 - REVU Day!
<emgent> heya
<ryanakca> woah, wicked netsplits :)
<\sh> ryanakca: someone is fcking around with the links....wasting traffic that is ;)
<txwikinger> When do we go to Standards Version 3.8.0?
<sebner> gn8 folks
#ubuntu-motu 2008-06-08
<directhex> where's the right place to moan if a package hasn't been correctly added to the archive?
<nhandler> Is it ok to fix a bug in a package when you are doing a merge?
<directhex> if it's a bug in the debian package, then you should try to get the bug fixed by the DD behind it
<directhex> generally speaking though, differences between the debian package and ubuntu packages (like bugs, really) would be the point in merges versus a sync
<nhandler> directhex, the package already needs a merge. I'm just wondering if it is ok to fix an additional bug at the same time
<ryanakca> Should I create a knmap-base to fix "I: knmap: arch-dep-package-has-big-usr-share 1596kB 82%" ? http://paste.debian.net/5703/ lists the files in knmap
<LaserJock> cody-somerville, ScottK2 : congrats on MOTU SRU, good luck.
<cody-somerville> LaserJock, thank you :)
<crimsun> yay, finally I get to subscribe the sponsors and let someone else upload
<crimsun> or ignore, but that's no longer my prerogative ;)
<LaserJock> crimsun: you expired?
<crimsun> yep, completely.
<LaserJock> crimsun: hmm, congrats, if that makes any sense
<crimsun> yeah, it doesn't really change anything.
<LaserJock> I was too chicken to expire from everything
<LaserJock> I'm hanging onto my hard-won upload rights for now ;-)
<crimsun> :-)
<cody-somerville> wow....
<cody-somerville> did devel-discuss explode this evening?
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> welcome to a "Poisonous People" test case
<ScottK2> LaserJock: I'm not sure congratulations is the right sentiment, but thanks.  It'll be "Fun".
<LaserJock> ScottK2: it's really not bad
<LaserJock> hopefully my script on qa.ubuntuwire.com/sru will help you guys
<ScottK2> LaserJock: I looked at it and it does look like it's much better than looking at a stack of subscribed bugs.  Thanks.
<crimsun> mmm, mailing list spam
 * ScottK-laptop cheers for the power outage being over ...
<crimsun> those storms hit bge?
<ScottK-laptop> Yes.  There was a line down several blocks from here that I know from experience feeds our neighborhood.
<crimsun> urg
<ScottK-laptop> Yes.  When the power line is laying on the street, the odds of the lights coming back on real soon are low.  As it was, I think were were out for ~3 hours, which isn't bad considering what it was.
<crimsun> still, pretty bad given the current weather
<crimsun> not looking forward to the next couple days
<chillywilly> what handles automounting things in gnome for ubuntu?
<chillywilly> why do my IDE drives show up as scsi devices?
<ScottK> chillywilly: This isn't a support channel, but the answer is that what you're thinking means it's a scsi device doesn't mean that at all.
<chillywilly> I know this is not a support channel but ubuntu does things differently than anything a stock debian system does and frankly I have no idea how it does things anymore ;P
<chillywilly> so I was curious
<crimsun> chillywilly: libata.  The conversion began some releases ago.
<chillywilly> ok
<chillywilly> that explains it then
<chillywilly> I knew it was some other subsystem that debian must not be using
<ScottK> chillywilly: It's a standard Linux kernel thing.  If Debian isn't doing it, they're the ones that are non-standard (I'm sure Lenny has this too).
<chillywilly> just not used to dealing with the "new" way...I'm a little behind the times I guess
 * siretart admires ScottK's enegy to actually read and followup to u-d-discuss
 * wgrant is disappointed at -devel-discuss' disintegration.
<siretart> true
<Burgundavia> siretart: http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2008-February/msg00129.html
<Burgundavia> same gut
<Burgundavia> guy, rather
<RAOF> Was that the one which ended with "I've got a textbox, so I'm pretty much done for a note-taking-app?"
<RAOF> Heh, yes it was.
<wgrant> Burgundavia: That's on -devel-discuss now as well.
<Burgundavia> yep
<Burgundavia> personally, I am not really keen on people taking Ubuntu and adding non-free software, but then again, dell is doing it
<wgrant> Right, and the Netbook Remix seems to be a very directed, OEM-restricted, embedded version.
<wgrant> And it's not part of Ubuntu, so the complaints about non-free stuff in Ubuntu are completely wrong.
<wgrant> My main gripe is the lack of a freely encoded copy of that video, and that's pretty minor.
<Burgundavia> that is not something that only Canonical is guilty of doing
<Burgundavia> in fact, we in the FOSS community are really bad about not providing OGG theora
<siretart> Burgundavia: "I've never written a program before so I also need some help. Also I need a place to put it on the web."
<Burgundavia> ah, yes, classic
<siretart> Burgundavia: that guy is cute..
<wgrant> siretart: It's a great thread.
<wgrant> I've read most of it.
<siretart> I hope I didn't
<wgrant> Paraphrasing one of the replies to the "I've got a textbox" bit: "Yes, that's like 5 lines of Python"
<Burgundavia> I could write that
<Burgundavia> codecs are such a nasty little bit of work, because it is such a massive catch 22
<wgrant> They are nasty, but why is it a catch 22?
<Burgundavia> if you add them, you basically need to have binary-only, ala fluendo
<Burgundavia> which is non-free
<Burgundavia> if you don't, you lose functionality
<Burgundavia> to me, as long as the iso somebody downloads is mostly free, that is fine. Pre-installed stsuff is a different ball of wax
<Treenaks> Isn't that what the automagic codec installer thing is supposed to handle?
<Burgundavia> doesn't solve the dvd issue, and sort of
<wgrant> The correct solution is to dispose of the patents and/or use free formats... but the former is hard.
<Burgundavia> the licensed fluendo codecs have access to teh specs, and thus are actually good
<Treenaks> Burgundavia: except that they're sometimes written by morons, so IPv6 + Fluendo MMS bits = no worky
<Burgundavia> I cannot help that occasionally people screw up
<Treenaks> (s/morons/people who aren't up to date on ipv6 bits/)
<Burgundavia> there is a lot of free stuff that likely doesn't handle ipv6 very well
<Treenaks> Burgundavia: yes, but I can fix those
<Treenaks> Burgundavia: usually
<Burgundavia> yes, the fluendo codecs, like all non-free software, cannot be fixed by people like you
<Burgundavia> ETHISISNOTASHOCK
<Treenaks> Burgundavia: I know it's well-known, that doesn't make it good :)
<directhex> where's the right place to moan if a package hasn't been correctly added to the archive?
<Treenaks> s/good/a good thing
<wgrant> directhex: 'correctly'?
<directhex> wgrant, a missing architecture
<wgrant> directhex: Meaning it hasn't built yet?
<directhex> wgrant, it's built, as per https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mono/1.9.1+dfsg-1ubuntu1/+build/627107
<wgrant> Architectures don't go missing unless they are simply waiting to be built, or there is a problem with the package on that architecture.
<wgrant> directhex: Looks like it's probably in NEW, but I'll check.
<wgrant> Yeah, look at https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mono/1.9.1+dfsg-1ubuntu1
<wgrant> #   intrepid i386   Successfully built  (NEW)
<directhex> wgrant, it's causing failed builds for mono-dependent packages on non-x86 arches
<wgrant> directhex: Right, they'll need to be given-back afterwards.
<wgrant> This is perfectly normal behaviour.
<directhex> hm, it might not be the first time this kind of behaviour's happened, but it causes very odd behaviour for one arch to act differently to others, due to treating all the arch-indep stuff (which is where the NEW stuff will have appeared) the same as the arch-specific stuff.
<wgrant> directhex: It's not odd behaviour. It's well-known, fairly common, easily recognisable behaviour
<wgrant> Odd behaviour is when the same sort of thing happens, but due to Soyuz eating binaries. Which is less common.
<Nightrose> ~[5~[5~[5~[5~[5~[5~[5~[5~[5~[5~[5~[A
<Nightrose> sorry
<Lantash> [Question] I'm currently working on the distribution mechanisms of the application LottaNZB I contribute to. Both the setup.py and the deb package installation work almost perfectly now, but there's one thing I don't figure out:
<Lantash> The installation of the MIME icon. Currently our MIME icons are installed into /usr/share/icons/hicolor/*/mimetypes/application-x-nzb.png. 'gtk-update-icon-cache -q -f -t /usr/share/icons/hicolor' is run after the installation. Now the problem: All applications ï»¿(such as Firefox and the file browser of LottaNZB) except Nautilus seem to use this icon for NZB files. Installling the icon to ï»¿/usr/share/icons/gnome did the trick but I gue
<Lantash> Thanks in advance!
<rzr> Jazzva: ok got your email :)
<Jazzva> rzr: Cool. Sorry for that :)
<rzr> no pb
<rzr> was my sf.net email bouncing ?
<Jazzva> I don't think so, since you received the e-mail :)
<rzr> ok
<rzr> because most I use this email in most of my debian work
<rzr> and i know sf is not reliable at all
<Jazzva> It worked this time ;)
<w-h-s> can I include font files that come from the same website but in different licenses in same package?
<RainCT> w-h-s: yes, but you have to list all licenses in debian/copyright
<w-h-s> RainCT# thanks
<RainCT> yw
<Lantash> Doesn't anyone know an answer to my problem I explained about two hours ago in this channel?
<Lantash> http://pastie.org/211041
<Lantash> I'd be grateful!
<devfil> a MOTU can sponsor a sync?
<nhandler> Hello nxvl
<nhandler> Hello zachs
<zachs> hey...
<amikrop> So, are these instructions working? https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UsbAdslModem/ueagle-atm
<nhandler> I know that you should normally wait until your sponsors think you are read before applying to become a MOTU. However, when should you apply to be an Ubuntu Contributing Developer?
<amarillion> Hey, I'm trying to create multiple pbuilders according to the guide: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<amarillion> But it's not working. For some reason it's ignoring my .pbuilderrc
<amarillion> For example, if I do
<amarillion> DIST=blah sudo pbuilder create
<amarillion> it works normally, but I expect it to print         "Unknown distribution: blah"
<amarillion> any ideas?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> try to put your stuff in /etc/pbuilderrc
<amarillion> Kopfgeldjaeger, no luck, it's still ignoring it
<amarillion> I'll send an email to the list
<amarillion> OK this is weird.
<amarillion> When I run /usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-loadconfig directly, it works
<amarillion> but not if I run it indirectly through pbuilder
 * nhandler is away: BRB
 * nhandler is away: BRB
<amikrop> Are there any similar instructions for Intrepid (or even for Hardy)? https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UsbAdslModem/ueagle-atm
<nhandler> So, does anyone here have an answer to the question I asked earlier about when a persion should apply to be an Ubuntu Contributing Developer?
<RainCT> nhandler: basically when you feel that you are ready and/or some MOTUs recommend you to do so
<nhandler> RainCT, from my understanding, an Ubuntu Contributing Developer is pretty much the same as an Ubuntu Member. Do they gain any new privileges? If not, what do you need to be ready for?
<RainCT> nhandler: some visible contributions that you can show and other people that will speak in favour of you
<RainCT> basically
<RainCT> nhandler: and no, beside the privilegies that Ubuntu Membership gives (@ubuntu.com e-mail redirect, possibility to be on planet.ubuntu.com and permission to print business cards)
<RainCT> (at least not at the moment, they is/has been discussion about giving other privilegies)
<nhandler> RainCT, so pretty much, as long as you have contributed, and have people that will speak in favor of you, you should apply?
<RainCT> yeh
<jono> Hobbsee: ping
 * nhandler is away: Away
#ubuntu-motu 2009-06-03
<neurobuntu> when specifying the build-depends in the control file can you use wild card characters or does each package have to be specified individually?
<persia> neurobuntu, You need to specify packages individually.
<neurobuntu> thank you persia
<loic-m> Once a patch has been applied upstream, can I erase the patch from debian/paches in the merge that ships the relevant upstream tarball.
<persia> loic-m, Yep.
<loic-m> persia: thanks again
<persia> (in fact, that's why some people recommend the use of debian/patches: it makes it easier to track what to drop.)
<pace_t_zulu|work> is the LGPL adequate licensing to get a software package into ubuntu?
<persia> pace_t_zulu, Yes.  LGPL is completely acceptable.
<pace_t_zulu> persia, thank you
<dupondje> hello, I checked https://merges.ubuntu.com/a/audacious/REPORT, downloaded the ubuntu.tar.gz, fixed it, but how to upload it now ?
<persia> !sponsoring
<ubottu> Sorry, I don't know anything about sponsoring
<hyperair> hmm how does one copy a package from ubuntu directly into a PPA?
 * persia glares at Nuku-Nuku and considers kicking
<hyperair> persia: why?
<persia> hyperair, Because it complains at me whenever I use an ubottu command.  I want it to do one of the following: 1) use a different attention character, 2) not complain when another bot is doing what I asked, or 3) follow the Ubuntu IRC policy and not be here, because we have bots enough.
<persia> Anyway https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperGuide/Sponsorship
<persia> I'm just not yet annoyed enough to kick
<hyperair> heheh
<jpds> !test
<ubottu> sigh... again? I'm busy here, I already told you it failed.
<dupondje> could somebody plz check https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/audacious/+bug/383271
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 383271 in audacious "Please merge audacious 2.0.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<dupondje> Its the first time I fixed a merge, so hope all is ok :D
<stefanlsd> oh, you did
<stefanlsd> dupondje: i cant make out whats happening in that attachment.  did you  debdiff previous.dsc new.dsc > file.diff ?
<dupondje> stefanlsd: yep I did that
<stefanlsd> dupondje: mm. file doesnt have any new lines for me - http://launchpadlibrarian.net/27463987/debdiff
<dupondje> weird
<dupondje> stefanlsd: www.dupondje.be/deb.diff ?
<stefanlsd> dupondje: yeah. that works.
<dupondje> its the same :p
<dupondje> but ok
<dupondje> :)
<dupondje> need to add it to the bug or ?
<stefanlsd> yeah, delete what you have there and try re-attach
<dupondje> ok done
<dupondje> gtg now, back in 20mins :D
<bencrisford> Ok this is gonna be a really nooby question.  And I'm a little embarrassed I am asking :P.  I have edited the debian/control, but as it is read-only I cannot save even with :wq!...   Help?
<stefanlsd> bencrisford: why is it read only? did you download the file originally with sudo?
<bencrisford> stefanlsd: Erm...  Probably :/
<stefanlsd> bencrisford: if you haven't done much, start again without using sudo...
<bencrisford> stefanlsd: I just spent best part of an hour adding depends to all the packages :'(
<stefanlsd> bencrisford: ok, well then maybe you can work around it.  something like   chown username filename   (your username)
<bencrisford> stefanlsd: Hang on, i've had an idea.... :)
<bencrisford> stefanlsd: Is it possible to save the changes to a different file
<bencrisford> im using vim
<stefanlsd> bencrisford: yeah.  :w /tmp/newfile
<bencrisford> stefanlsd: Oooh, thanks.  Do I replace newfile with a filename?  or what?
<stefanlsd> bencrisford: yes. filename
<bencrisford> stefanlsd: Thank you so much!  You saved my hours work!
<stefanlsd> bencrisford: np :)
<bencrisford> Changelogs have always confused me
<bencrisford> stefanlsd: Do I just change the line with the bullet points?
<bencrisford> The top line makes no sense to me :(
<stefanlsd> bencrisford: Im not quite sure what you are trying to do?  Best is to edit the debian/changelog with the dch command.  So for a new entry,  dch -i   or to edit an entry,  dch -e
<bencrisford> i did dch -i
<bencrisford> is the changelog .dch?
<bencrisford> i think i sorted the rest stefanlsd, but its asking me what to save it as, is it debian/changelog.dch
<bencrisford> ?
<stefanlsd> bencrisford: the changelog is the file  debian/changelog. debian/changelog.dch is the temporary file it makes while editing.  just save and quit and it will do the right thing
<bencrisford> well im in nano
<bencrisford> i did ^X, and it says
<bencrisford> save as debian/changelog.dche and i dont know what its meaning
<stefanlsd> bencrisford: no sure about nano.  try and just push enter and see what it does. check the contents of debian/changelog for your entry
<bencrisford> i did
<bencrisford> and it seems to have worked
<bencrisford> cheers stefanlsd :)
<bencrisford> now i'll just do a diff, and submit my patch?
<stefanlsd> bencrisford: yeah
<dupondje> stefanlsd: back :D
<fabrice_sp> siretart, sorry to bug you again :-D I'm not able to build the mplayer package as you need to delete the build-indep-stamp target (not created anywhere, but needed for install-indep-stamp)
<fabrice_sp> in debian/rules
<stefanlsd> dupondje: sorry. havent had a chance to look properly. im busy working on something atm
<dupondje> ok:)
<dupondje> maby somebody else can get a look ? :D
<fabrice_sp> dupondje, what do you want to get reviewed? Maybe I can help
<fabrice_sp> By the way, any brave MOTU willing to have a look at bug #283208?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 283208 in ubuntu "Please merge gmerlin 0.4.0-0.1 from Debian multimedia (unstable)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/283208
<dupondje> fabrice_sp:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/audacious/+bug/383271
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 383271 in audacious "Please merge audacious 2.0.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<fabrice_sp> dupondje, you shouldn't have ko.po in your debdiff, except if it's within the original ubuntu changes
<fabrice_sp> dupondje, the same for all the .po files and the .pot ones
<dupondje> how can I solve that its not included ?
<fabrice_sp> how do you generate your debdiff?
<fabrice_sp> also, in your changelog, you should reference which Ubutnu changes are still applicable
<dupondje> debdiff debian.dsc ubuntu.dsc > deb.diff
<fabrice_sp> hmmm, should be ok. what you can do is edit the debdiff, us a clean source directory, with debian version, and apply your debdiff
<fabrice_sp> this is what a MOTU would do to check your debdiff is correct, and the resulting package builds fine
<dupondje> so I need to get the debian source, and apply my debdiff on it, and try to compile right ?
<fabrice_sp> dupondje, yes, but use a pbuilder to build it: this will avoid having some generated source updated
<fabrice_sp> so the sequence should be:
<fabrice_sp> - get a clean debian base source (expand the debian.dsc)
<fabrice_sp> - apply your debdiff
<fabrice_sp> - build the ubuntu.dsc
<fabrice_sp> - check that the package builds with pbuilder
<fabrice_sp> this way, you should get a clean debdiff
<fabrice_sp> before doing that, update your changelog as requested before
<dupondje> There werent any Ubuntu changes to the package ? Or do I misunderstand the questions :)
<fabrice_sp> I think my English is not so good at that time :-)
<dupondje> ;)
<fabrice_sp> what I mean is that a merge by definition contains some specific Ubuntu changes (otherwise, it's a sync). This changes should be referenced in you changelog entry
<fabrice_sp> something like
<fabrice_sp>   * Merge from debian unstable (LP: #383271). Remaining changes: ...
<fabrice_sp> you can use the sebner entry (1.5.1-4ubuntu1) as an example
<dupondje> ok :) i'll give it a look
<dupondje> but it seems my deb.diff doesn't want to apply :s
<dupondje> wtf :)
<dupondje> fabrice_sp: enabling SSE2 on x86_64 is in fact the only change I did  + removing the patches that are obsolete ...
<fabrice_sp> in the debdiff you attach, I don't see any change appart the po files...
<fabrice_sp> so even enabling SSE2 enabling is not there... :-/
<dupondje> +  * Enabled SSE2 on x86_64
<dupondje> it is ?
<fabrice_sp> the comment, yes
<fabrice_sp> but the change in debian/rules?
<fabrice_sp> or wherever it is?
<dupondje> its in rules
<dupondje> mmm
<dupondje> i'll check
<fabrice_sp> but not in the debdiff
<fabrice_sp> ok ;-)
<xenocampanoli> Subject:  trying to compile libldap-ruby I get ldap.c:424: error: âLDAP_OPT_X_TLS_PROTOCOLâ undeclared (first use in this function).  This is shown as a macro only in my /usr/include/ldap.h.  Another told me it is commented out in his /usr/include/openldap.h, but I do not have one of those.
<xenocampanoli> I am using Ubuntu Server 9.04 for my testing.
<dupondje> fabrice_sp: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/27467532/deb.diff
<dupondje> should be better
<alefteris> hi all! Can I use pbuilder to build the source package also?
<fabrice_sp> dupondje, it's better. As there is no changes left, put "Merge with Debian unstable. No remaining changes " in your changelog
<fabrice_sp> dupondje, also, get rid of all the .po files changes to send the debdiff
<alefteris> or a way to build the source package with bzr builddeb?
<alefteris> nevermind, found bzr bd --quick :)
<dupondje> fabrice_sp: I downloaded the debian.dsc applied debdiff, builded the dsc
<dupondje> but the debdiff result is the same ;)
<fabrice_sp> which debdiff you applied? The one with the modifications on the .po files, or one without that?
<siretart> fabrice_sp: well spotted
<fabrice_sp> siretart, ;-)
<dupondje> fabrice_sp: I need to manually remove the .po files ?
<fabrice_sp> siretart, I've just built the mplayer-nogui packages with that change, so it should be ok
<dupondje> from the diff ?
<fabrice_sp> dupondje, in the debdiff, yes
<dupondje> oh ok
<dupondje> is there a 'lazy' way to do that ? ;)
<fabrice_sp> hmmm, I can tell you that all the changes after the debian/rules files are .po changes, so you can delete all the line after
<siretart> fabrice_sp: okay. I think I'll update the debian/get-orig-source.sh script to do something similar like the ffmpeg one before actually uploading it. then it should be easy to add an mencoder package and upload to ubuntu
<fabrice_sp> siretart, what do you mean by similar to ffmpeg? the 2 get-orig-source.sh looks similar to me :-/ By the way, in Debian, will you still drop the mencoder.c source?
<fabrice_sp> (this is done in strip.sh)
<fabrice_sp> have to go. Bye :-)
<dupondje> fabrice_sp: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/27469484/deb2.diff
<dupondje> :p
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/audacious/+bug/383271
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 383271 in audacious "Please merge audacious 2.0.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<dupondje> should be ok now !
<ausimage> I am looking for some help in getting an app I am developing into Karmic universe hopefully...
<ausimage> https://edge.launchpad.net/soovee, https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ausimage/soovee/trunk
<ausimage> I really need some packaging advice on how to build multiple packages from a python distutils package....
<ausimage> then anyother suggestions I can manage to improve the app and get it in ;)
<persia> ausimage, While I can't comment usefully on python specifically, the basic model for multiple binaries from a single source is fairly straightforward.
<persia> One runs the build system (in this case, distutils), and ends up with a filesystem tree containing all the provided files.
<dupondje> Need review of:
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/audacious/+bug/383271
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 383271 in audacious "Please merge audacious 2.0.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/audacious-plugins/+bug/383307
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 383307 in audacious-plugins "Please merge audacious-plugins 2.0.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<persia> One then creates a set of ${binary-package}.install files in debian/, with each listing the path of the files that belong in that binary package, selected from the set of files constructed by the build system.
<ausimage> yeah, persia I guess I was unclear how this is accomplished with distutils...
<persia> dupondje, You mentioned that 20 minutes ago.  You may do better to make sure it's in the sponsors queue, and wait a bit.
<ausimage> cause distutils does all the magic usually AFIAK
<persia> ausimage, Separate the concepts in your mind.  distutils does all the magic to construct the target filesystem, putting stuff in /usr/bin, /usr/share/doc, /usr/share/man, etc.
<persia> Then, dh_install extracts specific files from that target filesystem, and distributes them into the binary packages.
<ausimage> hmmm....
<persia> ausimage, So, when you run distutils from within debian/rules in any of the suggested ways, you end up with debian/tmp/usr/...
<ausimage> k
<persia> Then, when you run dh_install, it pulls from there into debian/${binary-package}/usr/...
<persia> And those are turned into the tarballs that get inserted into the .deb files.
<ausimage> so the *.install would be names of packages to build with its on manifest based on the tree under debian/tmp/usr ?
<ausimage> that is just a flat file of one file per line?
<dupondje> persia: its in the SponsorQue :) sorry for bothering :)
<persia> ausimage, debian/*.install would be named to match the binary packages, and contain file lists to match the desired contents.  Some classes of wildcards are acceptable.  man dh_install.
<persia> Yes, just a flat file.  One file (or glob) per line.
<ausimage> hmmm... I will attempt this...
<persia> ausimage, Good luck.  If you get stuck, just ask back here.
<ausimage> persia anything else I need to get this package moving into the repos?
<ausimage> persia: is there a method to get the magic directory for python modules?
<persia> ausimage, That's where we get into python-specific stuff, and I can't help you very much.
<persia> (because I don't know myself)
<ausimage> ahh
<ausimage> hopefully a pythonista will share their knowledge
<persia> As for getting the package into the repos, the best means are either to get it into Debian, or push it to REVU.  Some people find each of them faster or more effective, so it's hard to recommend one over the other.
<ausimage> persia: can I have duplicate files in multiple packages?
<persia> ausimage, You can, but then the packages must conflict.  I doubt this is what you want.
<persia> Better is to abstract out a -common package, and have other packages depend upon it.
<ausimage> no... k... I am particularly thinking of my docs
<ausimage> which also has licencing et al...
<persia> For docs, a foo-doc package is recommended.
<persia> And it's generally considered good practice to only Suggests: or possibly Recommends: the -doc package.
<ausimage> I plan to have cli, gui, lib and core
<persia> (so users can install it or remove it as they like, rather than forcing it to be present)
<persia> Add -doc to your list, and you're good.
<persia> -core vs. -common is up for debate, depending on the details of what would be included.
<ausimage> persia: how do I show the dependcies?
<ausimage> a new package section in control?
<didrocks> mdeslaur: nice :)
<persia> ausimage, debian/control consists of one Source stanza and some number of Package stanzas.  If you want to generate multiple binary packages, you need multiple Package stanzas.  You'd just add your Depends, Recommends, Suggests, etc. in the Package stanzas, as appropriate.
<ausimage> that is what I thought just wanted confirmation....
<ausimage> I am wondering why it suggested to Python-Version and Replaces when they generate warnings :?
<persia> ausimage, Could you rephrase that as a question, perhaps with more context and detail?
<ausimage> persia in the dpkg-buildpackage output I notice that Python-Version and Replaces seem to raise warnings that indicate the tag is not valid
<persia> ausimage, for replaces, review http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html  For Python-Version, I think you want XS-Python-Version, and I think that's permitted to be a warning.
<persia> (but look for a python person to confirm that last bit)
<ausimage> I will check... other than those... it did build the packages correctly :)
<persia> Congratulations.  One's first multiple-binary package is always an adventure.
<ausimage> Yeah reading the web was not helpful imho...
<persia> The answers are all on the net.  The trick is that most of the good information is descriptive rather than prescriptive, and assumes you already know what you're doing, but just need to check to confirm it's correct.
<ausimage> ahh ;)
<ausimage> I found nothing to indicate the simplicity of multiple packages till you explained it ;)
<persia> The EXAMPLE section of dh_install(1) outlines it very clearly, but I agree that this isn't necessarily the first place people look.
#ubuntu-motu 2009-06-04
<superm1> cody-somerville, what's up? i'm in between airports, so leave me a message with what ya need
<persia> superm1, I suspect it was about a sound issue encountered with a particular device, now solved by an upgrade to karmic (unless my backscroll memory overflowed)
<superm1> persia, ah okay
<dtchen> superm1: vostro 1520, already fixed in karmic. possible backport to jaunty-proposed (later) by apw.
<persia> (of course, he who actually pinged ought to have provided both bits of information :) )
<asomething> any one around who can add me to universe-sponsors?
<TheMuso> asomething: Sure. Whats your LP username?
<asomething> TheMuso: andrewsomething
<TheMuso> asomething: Ok will add it, and congrats.
<asomething> Thanks!
<TheMuso> Done.
<ajmitch_> what's the benefit of being a team member? getting the extra pile of bugs to look at?
<TheMuso> ajmitch_: being able to unsubscribe uus if need be for one.
<ajmitch_> hm, true
 * ajmitch_ should probably join up there & u-m-s as well
<TheMuso> ajmitch_: I can get you into the former if you'd  like.
 * persia goes to give ajmitch a gold star
<ajmitch_> alright
<ajmitch_> persia: but I want a pony!
<persia> ajmitch_, Then create a launchpad group with a pony icon
<ajmitch_> heh
<fta> if i ship an icon in different sizes in /usr/share/icons/hicolor/*/apps/, do I also need to continue to ship one in /usr/share/pixmaps?
<persia> fta, It depends on whether all the environments you wish to support include /usr/share/icons/ in their icon cache search path (most do).
<ajmitch_> looks like kees will be the most likely person to poke about u-m-s at this hour
<fta> persia, that's chromium, i asked upstream to provide several sizes, now i have 16 32 48 and 256
<ajmitch_> 256? that's rather large
<persia> fta, Excellent.  The part I can't tell you is if that will work in kubuntu.
<fta> 256 is for gnome do
<fta> persia, ok, so i'll keep my old 48x48 icon in /usr/share/pixmaps for now and ask the kde guys what they need
<persia> fta, My understanding was that the KDE cache was considerably more flexible than the GNOME cache.  It's XFCE that makes me wonder.
<persia> (yet somehow I managed to type "kubuntu" instead of "xubuntu", for which I must apologise)
<fta> oh, ok. i'll find someone using xubuntu then
<JontheEchidna> hicolor works in kde (since it's the xdg fallback icon theme)
<persia> JontheEchidna, Didn't hicolor come from KDE?
<JontheEchidna> hmm, that's ringing a few bells so there's a good chance it did
<JontheEchidna> especially since kde was a major contributor to xdg along with gnome
<persia> Certainly.  .desktop files are basically .link files redone.
<ajmitch_> what's the best way to go about sponsoring merges? unsubscribe u-u-s when it's uploaded?
<ajmitch_> assuming that this package builds properly & is flawless :)
<freakabcd> hi all
<ausimage> persia: I just pushed out my update package to lp and revu... :D
<persia> ajmitch_, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Sponsorship/SponsorsQueue
<persia> freakabcd, Hi
<persia> ausimage, Cool.
<ajmitch_> of course, I only searched for 'Sponsoring'
<ausimage> I hope to really get some good feedback on how I can make my package better and to see it in Ubuntu
<ajmitch_> nellery: sorry about the bug spam, just juggling statuses ;)
<nellery> ajmitch_: no problem, thanks for sponsoring that :)
<prefrontal> hey guys, do i need to plan to have my package included in universe in conjunction with an ubuntu release or can it happen at any time
<ajmitch_> it needs to be ready, reviewed & uploaded before feature freeze
<ajmitch_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KarmicReleaseSchedule has the relevant dates for this release
<prefrontal> August 27th
<prefrontal> thanks ajmitch_
<lifeless> I strongly suggets you have it uploaded way before that
<lifeless> because the first upload will probably generate a bunch of bug reports
<prefrontal> i've had my own repo for years
<prefrontal> what kinds of bug reports?
<ajmitch_> reviewing may take awhile as well, depending on how busy people are
<ajmitch_> have you looked at getting it into debian as well?
<prefrontal> also, can i have a development snapshot of my project that i update semi frequently?
<prefrontal> no i haven't
<prefrontal> sometimes i get dependency conflicts but they are almost always because the user has some weird video card for which opengl is not working correctly
<prefrontal> what other kinds of bug reports are you thinking of? related to the package itself?
<prefrontal> here is my software btw http://grey.colorado.edu/emergent
<lifeless> prefrontal: your own debian repository with the software interacting with all 16K other packages?
<prefrontal> yes
<prefrontal> it has a huge whack of dependencies. our software is complicated
<lifeless> then thats where I would expect bug reports
<lifeless> its just a trend I see with new packages
<prefrontal> but nothing else depends on our software
<ajmitch_> that'll make it fun to review
<lifeless> prefrontal: so, as I said, just get it uploaded early; if I'm wrong you got in early no harm done
<prefrontal> k:)
<lifeless> if I'm right, you'll have time to fix things without needing SRU's
<prefrontal> i can use SRU's to have the package included in previous versions of ubuntu?
<ajmitch_> do you have a source package around that you build the binary package from?
<ajmitch_> no, you can't include new packages that way - instead you use backports to get it into earlier versions
<prefrontal> no, for my own repo i just use cpack's 'make deb' target. i built a package from hand once, it sucked
<ajmitch_> you may need to learn the sucky way of doing it to get a source package ready for review
<prefrontal> yeah i know, thats why i'm here :)
<prefrontal> about that frequent development snapshot package?
<prefrontal> emergent-snapshot
<prefrontal> can i do that, and how frequently?
<lifeless> sure
<lifeless> two ways
<lifeless> a PPA
<lifeless> with the regular package name in the PPA
<lifeless> or a dedicated snapshot package in karmic
<lifeless> I recommend a PPA
<lifeless> its much cleaner
<prefrontal> i've used someone elses PPA before i think
<prefrontal> they then have to modify sources.list?
<prefrontal> which wouldn't present a benefit to me, since thats just like using my own repo
<prefrontal> you're saying there is something unclean about the dedicated snapshot package
<prefrontal> e.g., i wouldn't be able to do nightlies?
<ajmitch_> it does have the benefit of being built automatically on different architectures
<prefrontal> oh that could be nice
<ajmitch_> nightly uploads wouldn't really work, and you couldn't do that with a snapshot package in a released version of ubuntu
<ajmitch_> but you can with a PPA
<prefrontal> how frequent can i update my snapshot? weekly/monthly?
<prefrontal> ok, i have a different idea..
<ajmitch_> someone would probably need to review & upload the snapshot package each time, and this would just be for the development relerase unless you were then also getting the snapshot updated in backports
<ajmitch_> and I don't know how that would go :)
<prefrontal> is Ubuntu ok with a snapshot package that svn checkouts the source code to my software and compiles it?
<ajmitch_> does your software change that rapidly?
<lifeless> prefrontal: its like, but not like using your own repo
<ajmitch_> using a PPA is probably the best option, I think
<ajmitch_> since you don't have to worry about ubuntu freezes, etc
<lifeless> prefrontal: firstly it builds with all the current karmic dependencies, and it builds in the same environment as karmic itself, so you'll find out about build issues
<prefrontal> yeah it does change a lot, we are scientists and our nose and hence code follows the funding
<lifeless> secondly, it builds on all the karmic architectures, so you'll find out about portability to things like lpia that you were perhaps not doing yourself
<prefrontal> yeah.. we haven't really thought about that
<prefrontal> we can't target specific archs?
<lifeless> and lastly, you'll be building via the standard deb rule, rather than the cmake deb rule
<lifeless> you can, but the experience of getting it building in a PPA will make sure you have addressed those things
<prefrontal> i see
<lifeless> so PPA's are great for upstream software authors to use as a staging area for updates to their software in Ubuntu itself
<prefrontal> i think i'm going to create a PPA - thanks a lot guys
<ajmitch_> NB: PPAs only accept source package uploads, like ubuntu
<prefrontal> NB?
<ajmitch_> short for nota bene, or colloquially 'take note of this'
<prefrontal> kk
<prefrontal> cool, so, after I upload a new source package to a PPA, does it get compiled straightaway, or is there a periodic cron?
<prefrontal> reductio: can I submit a new snapshot package for each commit?
<prefrontal> (to my PPA)
<ajmitch_> each upload would go into a queue to get built
<lifeless> prefrontal: yes you an
<prefrontal> nice
<lifeless> prefrontal: various upstreams do this already
<ajmitch_> uploading on every commit may be a bit of overkill for something that large though
<ajmitch_> depending on how often you commit
<lifeless> prefrontal: I'd suggest establishing a baseline and uploading incrementals though
<prefrontal> we don't do that now and wouldn't likely start, but i would like to do more frequent builds
<lifeless> step 1) get it working. step 2) tune :)
<ajmitch_> step N) automagic building based on pushes to bzr branches in launchpad? :)
<lifeless> ajmitch_: :)
<ajmitch_> if that comes about soon
<prefrontal> what kind of compile farm you guys got?
<prefrontal> just curious..:)
<prefrontal> we just got a 26 node cluster with dual quad core nehalems and 24 gb ram per node
<prefrontal> make -j8 takes less than a minute on a single node
<prefrontal> takes like 30 minutes on my laptop
<lifeless> I don't remember the details
<lifeless> lots though
<lifeless> they get shared with other things - at release time I think most of the builders become mirrors for ubuntu; demand goes through the roof for a while there
<lifeless> lp has most of the details
<lifeless> https://edge.launchpad.net/builders/
<lifeless> I coulnt 53 machines
<ajmitch_> with a lot of interesting names
<lifeless> there may be hidden ones for embargoed builds too; I dunno quite how that hangs together.
<StevenK> lifeless: There isn't, they just state 'Building private build'
<prefrontal>  those are virtual machines?
<prefrontal> some of them look to be
<bodhizazen> All Hai oh great ones :)
<bodhizazen> I have  a question which should be easy , but no one has answered for me
<bodhizazen> Let us say I am building a package from source, applying a patch
<bodhizazen> call this package foo
<bodhizazen> so I get the ubuntu source (apt-get source foo) -> patch -> build it
<bodhizazen> how do I number the package so as not to confuse apt-get (dpkg) ?
<bodhizazen> ie I want to maintain satisfaction for dependencies
<bodhizazen> So bar depends of foo-ubuntu-1.0
<bodhizazen> and I build foo-patched
<bodhizazen> how do I number it ?
<lifeless> prefrontal: we build on VM's for security. clean machine every time
<lifeless> bodhizazen: that will depend on how strict bar's dependencies are
<lifeless> bodhizazen: which is probably why noone has answered it, because there isn't a single answer, other than 'you should learn how version numbering in dpkg works'
<bodhizazen> would you have a link you would advise ?
<lifeless> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-controlfields.html#s-f-Version
<bodhizazen> Thank you  :)
<jmarsden> Chapter 7 too: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html
<prefrontal> lifeless, thats impressive:)
<bodhizazen> The problem is , sometimes bar can be very strict, in which case it seems like a can of worms :)
<lifeless> bodhizazen: it may be a bug in bar, or necessary for some reason. So if you think its going to occur you should check bar (or the reverse-depends of foo) and possibly change them too
<bodhizazen> Assuming I do not mind the breakage / building in a chroot ...
<bodhizazen> may I assume I can change / edit the dependencies as I wish ?
<jmarsden> Sure.  What you do in the privacy of your own computer is your own business :) :)
<lifeless> within sensible constraints yes
<lifeless> if you put it in a PPA you should be aiming for something that is in principle uploadable to ubuntu too
<bodhizazen> What I am working on is the php5 meta package
<bodhizazen> but I do not run apache
<bodhizazen> so I want to remove the apache dependencies
<bodhizazen> I am applying the php-fpm patch
<bodhizazen> http://php-fpm.anight.org/download.html
<lifeless> if you're planning on submitting that for Ubuntu, you should probably discuss it on the list first ;)
<bodhizazen> I have no problem building from source (ie php directly)
<bodhizazen> and I am trying to go to a ppa
<bodhizazen> which list ?
<ajmitch_> probably ubuntu-server
<bodhizazen> Good advice
<bodhizazen> for the moment I am wanting to learn what is involved (or at least a general idea) with going from source to a ppa ;)
<bodhizazen> not that I do not want to work with ubuntu-server, I am just at the beginning stage and as you can see need a little advice on actually packaging, lol
<ajmitch_> I'd love to help but I have to leave the computer for a bit - most of what you need to know will be covered on the wiki
<ajmitch_> !packagingguide
<ubottu> The packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports
<jmarsden> bodhizazen: If you can build it in a pbuilder chroot locally, (and that chroot is "normal"), it will be fine in the PPA also.
<jmarsden> So once you've read the Packaging Guide, check out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto and try building your packages that way; then try uploading them to a PPA.
<Flannel> bodhizazen: You don't have to have apache stuff to install the php5 metapackage.  it's depends are satisfied by php5-cgi
<bodhizazen> jmarsden, I have nginx + php-fpm up and running in an OpenVZ container , which is essentially a chroot
<bodhizazen> Flannel, the fpm essentially replaces php5-cgi
<jmarsden> bodhizazen: Well, it is a choroot but it contains a bunch of modules that are unlikely to be present by default in a PPA or a pbuidler... so it will not check build dependencies nearly as well as a real pbuilder
<bodhizazen> so it is php5-common with a patch, but otherwise is run as you would fastcgi
<bodhizazen> can pbuilder be run in a VM ?
<jmarsden> I'm very imperfect... when I build stuff on a "real" machine or a VM and forget to also test in a pbuilder chroot, that's when I find my PPA builds fail with dependency problems...
<bodhizazen> such as KVM or Virtualbox ?
<jmarsden> Yes, I run pbuilders inside virtualbox VMs here
<jmarsden> Lets me test on Debian when I am running Ubuntu as my primary OS...
<bodhizazen> I will look at that over the next few days
<bodhizazen> The problem is I am patching php5-common
<bodhizazen> but that is part of php5 the meta package , lol
<fabrice_sp_> jmarsden, you don't need a vm for that: you can use a simple chroot to have a debian env in your machine
<fabrice_sp_> except if you are using windows as primary os
<Flannel> bodhizazen: php5 is a metapackage... just don't install it.
<jmarsden> fabrice_sp_: True, but then if I want to test the resulting built modules under Debian, and the app concerned needs a GUI... I'm not sure I can do that in a chroot, can I?
<AnAnt> hello, when was the last sync from Debian ?
<fabrice_sp_> jmarsden, you can use the x-windows server of Ubuntu to see the window
<fabrice_sp_> I actually do it with karmic (in a chroot) and even an i386 chroot for Firefox (because of flash on amd64)
<jmarsden> fabrice_sp_: OK... thanks.  I should try that (although virtualbox is so easy to use anyway).
<bodhizazen> Flannel, apt-get source php5-common pulls all of php5 (the meta package) with all it's dependencies
<bodhizazen> dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -uc -b then builds all of php5 and all of it's dependencies,
<fabrice_sp_> AnAnt, you mean for Karmic? The last automatic sync will be end of June (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KarmicReleaseSchedule).
<bodhizazen> so I am trying to figure out how to build just php5-common ?
<fabrice_sp_> jmarsden, the pb with VM is that you have to dedicate the memory, and some packages are so huge during compilation, that they 'eat' more than 1Gb... I also use virtualbox, but not for building ;-)
<AnAnt> so before June I shouldn't ask that a package get sync'ed from debian ?
<jmarsden> fabrice_sp_: OK.  I do have pbuilder chroots under the main OS for building too; I tried it both ways.  I put 8GB in this desktop so I can run several virtualboxes of 1GB each with no real worries... could probably try running a couple of 2GB Virtualboxes if I needed to :)
<jmarsden> AnAnt: Unless the older package you are replacing in Ubuntu has a -XubuntuY Ubuntu-specific package earlier, autosync will do the job for you until then.  BTW... it is already June :)
<fabrice_sp_> AnAnt, no, except if it has some Ubuntu changes that can be discarded
<fabrice_sp_> jmarsden, is quicker with his 8Gb of RAM :-)
<jmarsden> if I run enough vboxes I will slow down :)
<fabrice_sp_> sure! :-) I only have 2, so I don't have much room to run a lot of VM ;-)
<dholbach> good morning
<fabrice_sp_> 2Gb, I mean
<fabrice_sp_> Hey dholbach ! Good morning ;-)
<jmarsden> fabrice_sp_: Yes, that would be pretty limiting.
<dholbach> hiya fabrice_sp_
<fabrice_sp_> jmarsden, my VM's don't have more than 400 Mb, so for building, itÂ¡'s very short (the compiler sometimes eat all the ressources, and I have to kill the VM)
<fabrice_sp_> dholbach, how are you doing this morning?
<dholbach> very good very good - how 'bout you?
<fabrice_sp_> Good too :-) a bit hot lately here (more than 30ÂºC), so I don't sleep as much as I liked to :-)
<AnAnt> ah, ok
<AnAnt> dholbach: thanks
<ajmitch_> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hiya ajmitch_
<ajmitch_> dholbach: I was inspired by you & sponsored an upload today ;)
<dholbach> wooohoo!
<dholbach> more sponsoring!
<ajmitch> and rejoined u-u-s so I can mangle the bugs
 * ajmitch isn't in u-m-s though
<ajmitch> dholbach: mind re-adding me there?
<StevenK> ajmitch: You're actually doing some sponsoring?
<dholbach> ajmitch: done
<StevenK> ajmitch: Who are you, and what have you done with the real ajmitch?
<ajmitch> StevenK: shush, before you kill off my desire to do any more
 * StevenK smiles sweetly
<ajmitch> I even merged stuff!
<ajmitch> Now let me revel in the fact that I've done more uploads to karmic already than the last 3 releases together
<StevenK> Haha
<StevenK> How many is that?
<ajmitch> bugger all :)
<StevenK> Less than 9?
<ajmitch> 6 or 7 so far, I think
 * StevenK did 9 in a lump this morning for NBS-age
<ajmitch> so I saw
<ajmitch> they were mostly rebuilds though, they hardly count
<StevenK> But I did test build them!
<AnAnt> ok, can you upload these: LP #359436 , LP #359444 , LP #359446 ?
<ajmitch> I'd hope so! :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 359436 in ubuntume-gdm-themes "Rename package and update artwork " [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/359436
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 359444 in usplash-theme-ubuntume "Rename package and update artwork " [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/359444
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 359446 in ubuntume-themes "Rename package" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/359446
<StevenK> ajmitch: :-)
<AnAnt> they are for karmic now
 * StevenK uploads something to decrease the evilness present in the archive by a little.
<prefrontal> hmm, debootstrap karmic doesn't seem to be making use of both cores
<AnAnt> brb
<StevenK> ajmitch: Does acidlab count? :-P
<ajmitch> decreasing the evilness? I doubt it
<ajmitch> it's a php package, that's pure evil right there
<StevenK> But it was using yada, and now it isn't!
<ajmitch> oh, that's alright then
<jmarsden> So before it was impure evil, and now it is pure evil? :)
<ajmitch> I'm not sure whether uploading php5 made me evil or not
<StevenK> PHP + yada == evil^evil ; PHP == evil
<slytherin> Can anyone please tell me the meaning of this condition - ifneq ( ,$(filter-out $(DEB_HOST_ARCH), arm mipsel mips armel))
<StevenK> If the arch isn't arm, mips, mipsel or armel do the following
<slytherin> StevenK: thanks. I was trying to figure out why armel build of libjogl-java fails. I thought the condition was problem.
<slytherin> StevenK: any idea if DEB_HOST_ARCH evaluates to armel on the armel buildd? Or should we rather use DEB_TARGET_ARCH?
<StevenK> steven@obliterated:~$ dpkg-architecture -qDEB_HOST_ARCH
<StevenK> armel
<slytherin> StevenK: then I am not able to understand why the build is failing
<StevenK> slytherin: Where's the build log?
<slytherin> StevenK: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libjogl-java/1.1.1+dak1-5/+build/983218/+files/buildlog_ubuntu-karmic-armel.libjogl-java_1.1.1+dak1-5_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<slytherin> StevenK: the logic is supposed to be in such a way that if the arch is armel then 'javadoc' target should not be run. But the target is running anyway, it times out and fails.
<slytherin> StevenK: looks like the same problem is happening in Debian as well.
<StevenK> Build killed with signal 15 after 150 minutes of inactivity
<StevenK> Ahh
<StevenK> Perhaps javadoc should only run on the i386 builder and dump the docs into a arch all package?
<slytherin> StevenK: that is what supposed to happen according to the logic in debian/rules file. But the logic is not working. I will log a bug in Debian.
<StevenK> slytherin: With my logic, javadoc should only get run in the binary-indep target, so the !i386 builders would never call it
<slytherin> StevenK: how can that be handled in cdbs?
<StevenK> As a hack?
<slytherin> StevenK: No I am asking how to achieve what you are suggesting in a rules file which is using cdbs.
<StevenK> Yes, and my suggestion is a hack ;-)
<StevenK> H
<StevenK> *Hmm
<StevenK> I wonder if this is as simple as ifeq rather than ifneq
<gaspa> someone could please giveback ocaml-http
<gaspa> ?
<gaspa> (in my ppa builds fine)
<gaspa> and ocaml-lastfm as well, please.
<nenolod_> hi.  is karmic auto-import frozen yet?  audacious2 just hit debian sid a few days ago.
<maxb> nenolod: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KarmicReleaseSchedule - no
<StevenK> nenolod: It doesn't appear in the new source report I just ran on the archive master.
<nenolod> StevenK: it's there :P
<nenolod> StevenK: http://qa.debian.org/developer.php?login=nenolod@dereferenced.org
<StevenK> http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/a/audacious2/ is 404
<StevenK> And?
<StevenK> Oh, I know. It's stuck in Debian NEW.
<nenolod> no.
<StevenK> Wait a few weeks, then
<nenolod> it's not in NEW
<nenolod> it is in SID.
<nenolod> StevenK: as the fucking maintainer of audacious, i damn well know where it is.
<StevenK> Ah, I was looking for the package name of audacious2
<nenolod> yeah.  sorry for the confusion.
<nenolod> we were originally going to run them side by side
<StevenK> Right. The version of audacious in Karmic has Ubuntu changes, so it needs a merge
<nenolod> since 2.0 series was originally meant more as a platform demo, than an actual finished product
<nenolod> yeah. i'll do it.
<nenolod> i need to up a fixed plugins though
<nenolod> i made an oops
<nenolod> :P
<StevenK> Looks like someone else has done it
<nenolod> well, plugins needs to be merged against pending 2.0.1-2
<nenolod> otherwise audacious-plugins-dev convenience package becomes broken
<nenolod> as i said, i made an oops
<StevenK> But audacious-plugins is a seperate source?
<nenolod> StevenK: yep
<StevenK> That also needs a merge
<nenolod> yep
<nenolod> i've done it before in ubuntu
<StevenK> I don't trust the audacious merge in https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/audacious/+bug/383271 either
<nenolod> i need to go through and see what changes ubuntu has added on and if they are even relevant anymore, anyway.
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 383271 in audacious "Please merge audacious 2.0.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<nenolod> StevenK: yeah.  it's done incorrectly.
<nenolod> SSE2 is safe to enable on x86_64, but...
<nenolod> that's a new patch introduced
<StevenK> I think it drops changes, but I haven't confirmed
<nenolod> i'll look into it
<nenolod> probably after audacious-plugins/2.0.1-2 goes up later today
<nenolod> StevenK: i commented on the merge
<loic-m> What's the bast way to ckeck what o put in build depends when packaging a new program?
<loic-m> I checked http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/ch-dreq.en.html#s-control , all methods are a bit confusing
<siretart> look in the README or COMPILATION file in the package?
<iulian> loic-m: The source should have some docs saying what packages it needs in order to build the program.
<loic-m> siretart: there's no information there
<iulian> loic-m: What about its homepage?
<loic-m> iulian: no information either :(
<siretart> loic-m: it is very hard to guess what build dependencies a package needs. if it is not documented, I generally inspect the source to understand how it works
<iulian> Well, in this case I usually build it with pbuilder to see what dependencies it needs.
<jpds> loic-m: Well, I guess pbuilder it until it works I guess :/
<jmarsden> loic-m: Worst case, try building it in a base pbuilder chroot with no Depends: at all and see what fails, and go from there?
<siretart> which is a good idea in any case in order to get an idea what the package is doing
<loic-m> So each time the pbuilder fails, I add the missing bit to control? That sound doable, easier than read the source for me ;)
<siretart> welcome to the dark side...
<iulian> loic-m: Yes.
<loic-m> ok, thanks
<jmarsden> loic-m: Yes.  if you have a compiled binary you can also try running ldd on it so see what libraries it links to, for some extra clues?
<siretart> there are indeed some wrapper around the open syscall that observe what header files a subprocess is trying to open and guesses on that bases what development package might be relevant
<loic-m> jmarsden: I tried objdump -p /usr/bin/foo | grep NEEDED as the Debian maintainer guide suggest, but it gave me far to much dependencies
<siretart> it still requires a bit of thinking
<loic-m> ldd list is eevn bigger
<loic-m> I'll try the pbuilder fail method first...
<rawang> hi, when I use pbuilder to build package, but failed, and i want to dig it, and pbuilder remove the build environment, how can i keep it unremoved
<loic-m> When I used objdump -p /usr/bin/foo | grep NEEDED, I tried filtering the libs in build-essential, but i still had far to much libraries. I just want to make sure I don't add useless build-depends
<jmarsden> rawang: Would https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#Running%20a%20Shell%20When%20Build%20Fails%20(Intro%20to%20Hook%20Scripts) help you out?
<loic-m> As a more general question, when reviewing on REVU, how do one check if the build-depends and depends in debian/control are correct (i.e. neither too much or too little)?
<jmarsden> too little => package would not build in a pbuilder.  too many is harder to detect, you have to know, or try removing the ones you think are unnecessary and rebuild, as far as I know.
<ultrafredde> Hi again, anyone feeling for a review of http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/task Would be appreciated. Really.
<rawang> jmarsden, hey, big thanks, it helps
<rawang> jmarsden, but it appears my problem is caused by fakeroot, since the build need to generate something with root privilege, but fakeroot can't do anything except get a root id
<geser> rawang: have you the exact error message?
<rawang> geser, sure , http://paste2.org/p/244640
<rawang> geser, thanks a lot
<rawang> geser, you will noticed at line 27, it said permission deny
<loic-m> When a package need intltool to build, what's the difference between using intltool and intltool-debian? Is it just that -debian depends on less stuff?
<loic-m> Or is the only difference that intltool-debian supports "Debconf template files" and intltool doesn't?
<geser> rawang: my guess would be to set $HOME to something which can be written to (like /tmp) but better ask someone who is more familiar with mono packaging (like directhex)
<directhex> moo?
<directhex> aha, rawang has encountered a rather... common... issue
<geser> directhex: see the paste http://paste2.org/p/244640 from rawang
<directhex> export MONO_SHARED_DIR=$(CURDIR)
<directhex> add the above to rules
<rawang> geser, but this is not the first time I run into "permission deny" problem when I build package with "dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot", "sudo dpkg-buildpackage" resovle all
<directhex> and add "rm -rf $(MONO_SHARED_DIR)/.wapi" to your clean rule
<rawang> ok
<rawang> directhex, in the debian/rules file?
<directhex> although whatever the package is, should you be cooperating with pkg-cli-apps ?
<directhex> oh... right, sorry
 * directhex goes back to sleep
<rawang> directhex, wow, thanks a lot! :)
<geser> rawang: the buildd run the build as a user (and only parts as root with fakeroot) so you need to take care that your package doesn't write outside it's packaging directory
<directhex> yes, debian/rules is the makefile. you need to override MONO_SHARED_DIR because mono has a simple evaluation for where to put the .wapi folder for processes
<rawang> geser, but you know, I even failed at "debuild -S" at "permission deny" error, I have to use "sudo debuild -S" to update my .dsc file :(
<directhex> rawang, right, you have files now owned by root
<directhex> time for a big ol' "chmod -R"
<rawang> ahhhh...
<rawang> directhex, maybe "chown -R"  :)
<directhex> bah!
<rawang> errr
<rawang> directhex, geser wooh, big thanks, after I add MONO_SHARD_DIR, it succeed to build :)
<directhex> rawang, are these the same packages sshaw has been bugging me about?
<rawang> directhex, heh, yeah, maybe
<rawang> directhex, I'm not sure what packages he worked on :)
<loic-m> When packaging a frontend, should I put the program it's a frontend of in Depends, Suggests or Recommends?
<directhex> rawang, anyway, please make your source package available somehow for peer review
<directhex> loic-m, can the frontend be used in any way, shape or form without the app it's a frontend for?
<rawang> directhex, yeah, of course, now I successful build those packages, next I will put it on my ppa and REVU, hopefully you could take a glance to review it :)
<loic-m> directhex: fact is it can start without the program, and you can configure the options and manage your collection of games without the program - but not play them
<directhex> rawang, yes - but i won't advocate uploading mono-related packages directly to ubuntu (we prefer to upload to debian). revu's ui is nice enough for the review process though ;)
<loic-m> directhex: it's a frontend for mame, so even without it can be usefull to manage a collection of roms
<directhex> loic-m, then it sounds like a Recommends to me, especially since recommends are pulled in by default
<directhex> certainly not suggests
<rawang> directhex, ok, so what's your opinion?
<rawang> directhex, make them available on debian first?
<loic-m> directhex: thanks a lot
<rawang> directhex, actually, I was planning to put them on ubuntu, and then debian, since ubuntu have a more friendly package promotion process and interface
<directhex> rawang, well, yeah. file a request to join on https://alioth.debian.org/search/?type_of_search=soft&group_id=0&words=pkg-cli-libs&Search=Search
<directhex> and generally be in #debian-cli on oftc
<directhex> we can review your package and have it uploaded to debian, whereupon it gets pulled into ubuntu automatically
<directhex> and then you only need to maintain it in one place which benefits the most users, as part of a team of maintainers
<rawang> directhex, ok
<gaspa> could someone please giveback ocaml-http and ocaml-lastfm ?
<rawang> directhex, i have requested to apple pkg-mono before, but no one else response to me :)
<directhex> rawang, hence the IRC suggestion, so people can put names to fac... well, nicks
<rawang> directhex, sorry, but what it means above? :)
<directhex> rawang, if you're in the IRC channel, then when meebey receives a join request, he can go "hm, anyone know who this Ray Wang guy is?" and get an answer
<rawang> directhex, ok ,if someone knows me, I am accepted? :)
<directhex> rawang, more or less
<directhex> rawang, i'd recommend you file an ITP bug (intention to package) to further cement the relationship between you and the package
<rawang> directhex, where should I file that bug?
<rawang> directhex, say something like," I'm working on this package, hopefully someone won't duplicate this build" ?  :)
<directhex> rawang, ITP bugs should be filed against the "wnpp" pseudo-package.
<directhex> rawang, if you have a working mail server configured (and even if you don't, i suppose, you can send the result by hand) then run "reportbug -B debian wnpp"
<rawang> directhex, I'm terribly sorry, what you said seems like new things to me :(
<directhex> the wizard will help you fill in the standard ITP template
<rawang> directhex, in debian's terminal?
<directhex> rawang, well, in a terminal window. the "-B debian" allows it to run on non-debian distros
<directhex> like ubuntu, which has a different bug reporting mechanism
<rawang> directhex, so reportbug is a command, it could generate a wnpp template, you fill out the template, the command will help you to send it to somewhere?
<directhex> yup!
<rawang> directhex, thanks a lot, I never heard of this before :)
<directhex> this allows you to start your package's life on a high note - the first changelog entry should be something like " * Initial release (Closes: #123456)" which means you get to close a bug on day one ;)
<rawang> lol
<directhex> rawang, once you're in pkg-cli-libs i can help with the packaging bits & bobs, as i can then write to the package directly before it gets uploaded
<rawang> directhex, that would be awesome! thanks in advanced! :)
<rawang> didrocks, i have one source package generate 2 packages, so when I first to *reportbug* , which package name I should use? or both?
<slytherin> directhex: I added the information you asked to bug 378613. Let me know if there is anything more you need.
<directhex> rawang, the source package name is the important one at this point
<directhex> slytherin, thanks
<rawang> ok, make sense
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 378613 in banshee "banshee won't start on Jaunty powerpc (Mono.Data.SQLiteClient exception thrown)" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/378613
<rawang> directhex, so i just need to file a ITP bug with my source package name for both binary packages, right?
<directhex> rawang, right. just one bug. source is what matters at this point
<rawang> ok, thank you
<slytherin> directhex: The problem exists in Debian as well. Should I file a bug in Debian too?
<directhex> slytherin, if it's a mono bug then yes, if it's a banshee bug then no
<slytherin> directhex: how do I know?
<directhex> you give me 3 minutes to compare to an amd64-generated empty repo ;)
<directhex> hm... interesting
<directhex> there's definitely a big difference between the two
<directhex> slytherin, were you reproducing the issue on squeeze or sid?
<directhex> hm, squeeze
<slytherin> directhex: squeeze (testing).
<directhex> slytherin, i have a sneaking suspicion that an sqlite bug is exposing a banshee bug
<slytherin> he he
<directhex> slytherin, okay, it seems the first-run database creation is not completing successfully. my DB has several values yours doesn't
<directhex> slytherin, HOWEVER, here's the interesting bit - one of the values is 0 for me and NULL for you
<slytherin> directhex: is that anyway arch dependent?
<directhex> slytherin, well, it shouldn't be, but it's the only line which isn't simply values missing in your DB
<hyperair> Build-Depends-Indep contains build dependencies for arch independent packages, right? if there's only one package, and it's arch indep, should i just dump everything into Build-Dep then?
<directhex> hyperair, i would
<hyperair> alright
<hyperair> i can't remember why i ended up dumping more than half of the deps for bansheelyricsplugin in build-dep-indep
<slytherin> hyperair: Build-Dep usually includes cdbs/debhelper and anything that is needed to run the clean target
<hyperair> slytherin: i see.
<hyperair> slytherin: but it's kind of pointless to separate it if you're only having one binary package, right?
<slytherin> hyperair: it is not if you want to keep lintian happy.
<hyperair> slytherin: i don't understand. isn't lintian happy if you dump everything in build-dep?
<slytherin> hyperair: I don't think so. But check for yourself.
<hyperair> hmm
<directhex> slytherin, i'm going to forward the bug upstream, and bug them about it when they're awake
<slytherin> directhex: thanks
<directhex> slytherin, actually, i have an idea. are you in a position to test something for me?
<slytherin> directhex: not right now. I am in office.
<slytherin> directhex: drop me a mail if possible. I will do that tonight if I can.
<directhex> slytherin, i've posted to the bug report instead
<slytherin> directhex: checking
<hyperair> slytherin: looks like lintian doesn't mind.
<slytherin> directhex: I will try using your empty db tonight. And I guess I will wait for mono2.4 to migrate to testing. Do you plan to fix the bugs that are blocking the migration?
<directhex> # mono is only 9 days old. It must be 10 days old to go in.
<juanje> Hi, someone like to review any of these packages? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/mount-systray  ||  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gedit-plugin-tloleo  ||  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/backintime
<directhex> so i need a time machine to fix that blocker ;)
<StevenK> Or patience
<StevenK> And since you use mono, you must have lots, since it's slow
<slytherin> directhex: right but even after that there are two 'serious' bug which will block the migration
 * StevenK hides
<directhex> slytherin, the serious bug will be fixed in the next upload (likely to be Monday, since there's a new bugfix release due from upstream). the grave bug i can't work on without help from a porter, since i lack access to sparc hardware
<slytherin> directhex: thanks for info
<directhex> slytherin, i'm waiting for at least a -3 upload before requestsync to karmic, as -2 and below have an issue cleanly upgrading with aptitude
<slytherin> hmm
<directhex> slytherin, see, another reason i should be a DD sooner rather than later - access to funny machines to test things on ;)
<slytherin> directhex: :-)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<iulian> Heya bddebian.
<neurobuntu> hi!
<neurobuntu> when building a package using cdbs and the variable "DEB_MAKE_CHECK_TARGET = test"  how can I generate the FTBFS error if the tests fail...
<dholbach> Packaging Training with mvo in #ubuntu-classroom now!
<azeem> neurobuntu: shouldn't it fail?
<azeem> neurobuntu: if not, maybe the upstream build system does not error out if the checks fails
<neurobuntu> azeem, I thought that it would but i've seen the tests fail but the packages still get built in the end
<bddebian> Hi iulian
<neurobuntu> azeem, I'll talk to upstream about it... but under normal conditions I shouldn't have to catch the errors from the test?
<azeem> neurobuntu: well, check yourself
<neurobuntu> ok
<neurobuntu> azeem, thanks for your help
<azeem> run "make test", and see the return value
<directhex> dtchen, how big was your music collection?
<mterry> vorian: Got a sec to talk about kio-gopher?
<vorian> sure thing
<vorian> mterry: sorry, yes :)
<mterry> vorian: I was just doing some merge work and thought I'd hit it.  But it looks like the two packages (debian and ubuntu) have never really merged.  Debian uses just 1.3 numbering, we use 1.3-kde4.2.0 numbering.  Is there a good reason to keep that or can I just request a sync?
<vorian> hmmm
<vorian> is that the only difference?  I seem to recall other differences
<mterry> vorian: Debian intentionally strips the -kde4.2.0 part in its watch file.  Um, seems to be the only difference after merging anyway
<vorian> even in rules?
<vorian> we should be using kde4.mk
<mterry> vorian: Upstream uses /usr/share/pkg-kde-tools/makefiles/1/cdbs/kde.mk
<mterry> vorian: We use /usr/share/cdbs/1/class/kde4.mk
<mterry> vorian: Seems like a droppable change?
<vorian> hmmm
<vorian> i'll have to take a closer look
<mterry> vorian: Yeah, I'll leave it to you then.  :)
<JontheEchidna> That's a droppable change, kde4.mk was a fork we used in intrepid and jaunty
<vorian> fantastic
<JontheEchidna> in karmic we merged the one from pkg-kde-tools
<vorian> yeah, so it should be syncable
<vorian> ok, thanks JontheEchidna
<mterry> vorian: OK.  I'll request a sync
<mterry> vorian: But we don't care about stripping the version?  Do the -kde4.x.x releases change anything if the main version doesn't change?
<JontheEchidna> oh, KDE usually updates the translations shipped with the -kde4.x.x releases
<vorian> yeah, we get that versioning from upstream
<JontheEchidna> so there is probably some merit in keeping the -kde4.x.x version
<vorian> It's not a huge deal to drop in on extragear stuff
<vorian> l10n doesn't ship for extragear
<JontheEchidna> right, the apps themselves ship their translations
<JontheEchidna> and afaik we don't strip them from universe packages
<vorian> mterry: your call - but there is merit to staying in sync with debian :)
<JontheEchidna> that is true too, losing slightly-updates translations for barely-maintained extragear isn't that big of a deal :)
<mterry> vorian: I'd sync it if there's no great loss.  But I wonder why upstream strips.  Maybe I'll file a debian bug about that
<vorian> mterry: or join #debian-kde and ask plusing
<vorian> pulsing, even
<vorian> bleh, see JontheEchidna, i can't type
<vorian> pusling
<Stupendoussteve> If I run a line like mpi-default-bin [!lpia] openmpi-bin [lpia], would that prevent mpi-default-bin as pulling openmpi-bin as a dependency for other architectures?
<Stupendoussteve> in build-depends that is
<binarymutant> what provides the cdbs rule uploaders.mk ?
<geser> {gnome,ruby}-pkg-tools have one such named file
<binarymutant> geser, thank you I think I found it
<binarymutant> I'm fixing a ftbfs but the package doesn't seem to conform to python policy, should I fix this as well or let the real maintainer handle it?
<geser> try to keep the Ubuntu delta minimal, so change only as far as necessary
<geser> unless the package in maintained by QA in Debian, then you can do more and forward the patch to Debian so it can hopefully be synced again soon
<binarymutant> your always great help geser thank you
<binarymutant> geser, do you have time to sponsor this patch? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/deskbar-applet/+bug/383675
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 383675 in deskbar-applet "deskbar-applet ftbfs" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<binarymutant> actually...
 * DBO pokes directhex 
<directhex> evening jason. what's on your mind?
<DBO> was hoping I might be able to get a recommendation for a icon theme packager
<geser> binarymutant: where is the promised debdiff in that bug?
<DBO> Elementary Icons really need a PPA =)
<binarymutant> geser, a control.in was getting me :(   but it's attached now
<directhex> DBO, i don't really have any experience with packaging that kind of thing
<DBO> i know, you only package insanely hard things =P thats why I was looking to see if you knew someone we could poke
<directhex> pochu, is debian bug #531870 about removing libgda2 entirely from the archive? if so i'll need to beat upstream
<ubottu> Debian bug 531870 in libmono-system-data1.0-cil "libmono-system-data1.0-cil: Please stop suggesting libgda2-3" [Normal,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/531870
<pochu> directhex: yes, it is
<pochu> I talked to Mirco about it, he told me to report the bug
<geser> binarymutant: I just noticed that I can't sponsor it, you need a core-dev for that (ubuntu-main-sponsors). And don't forget to close your bug in your changelog entry
<binarymutant> ah okay, thanks for trying geser
<binarymutant> any ubuntu-main-sponsors in here?
<geser> for this package you might have better chances to find one in #ubuntu-desktop
<binarymutant> thanks again geser, always the best help :)
<bencrisford> How much work constitutes universe-contributor rank?  I appreciate I probably have far to go, but I am just wonderinhg
<binarymutant> bencrisford, ask your sponsors they're always really great help with that sort of information
<bencrisford> ok :)
<bencrisford> I haven't actually had any sponsors yet binarymutant :(, although I have subscribed them to a couple of bug fixes of mine ;)
<geser> bencrisford: as a hint 2-3 months of visible contributions (e.g. sponsored uploads)
<bencrisford> geser: Ok. ty ;)
<directhex> pochu, filed the bug upstream back in september ;)
<pochu> directhex: :)
<pochu> link?
<geser> bencrisford: and if manage to get an sponsored upload each week (on average) that might be considered enough (but the more the better :)
<directhex> pochu, https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=430332
<bencrisford> geser: I'm trying to fix a bug at least every two days at the moment.  But i doubt ill be able to keep that up, im quite busy at school atm
<geser> bencrisford: no problem. that aren't any hard numbers, if you show that you contribute and do this over some time you should get u-c-d without problems
<bencrisford> geser: Ok ;), thanks for your advice/help :)
<studio32> I get this error: W: rumor: info-document-missing-dir-section usr/share/info/rumor.info.gz
<studio32> http://pastebin.com/m72856a2
<ausimage> Any python gurus lurkin? I would like some feedback on my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/soovee
 * ausimage notices that REVU has issues with Python packaging in general :/
<ausimage> or Python in general :(
<ajmitch> ausimage: that does look problematic
<ausimage> yeah...
 * ajmitch checks on how you destroyed REVU
<ausimage> :O
<ajmitch> killed it dead!
<ausimage> huh? All I did was dput my package for review.... LP has never had issues with the task
<ajmitch> obviously REVU has some bugs in handling that stuff :)
<ausimage> I saw that
<vorian> anyone seen an error like this one - dh_install: plasma-widgets-workspace missing files (), aborting
<ausimage> vorian that sounds like my issue with multi packaging :/
<ausimage> perhaps a file in an install manifest is missing?
<vorian> no, i know how to fix those
<vorian> i've never seen this error
<ajmitch> ausimage: sadly I don't have time to dig into the REVU error right now, might look at it in an hour or so
<ausimage> ahh
<ajmitch> though your changelog looks well-formed & shouldn't be breaking the parsing
 * ausimage also was looking for a deep review of his effort... so he can make the necessary changes to improve his python app and skills 
<ajmitch> until REVU is fixed people won't be able to see your package
<ausimage> :O
<ajmitch> first suggestion is to not upload it as a native package, where you have to change the whole version number for every packaging change
<ausimage> hmmm... you mean to leave the version off?
<ausimage> the new package that is there is because of code changes made after discovering an oversight
<ajmitch> no, I mean to add on the debian versioning
<ajmitch> such as 1.04-0ubuntu1
<ausimage> k
<ajmitch> so that you only change the -0ubuntu1 for packaging changes
<vorian> ah, found it
<vorian> there was an extra new line
<ajmitch> vorian: tricksy
<vorian> aye,
<ausimage> I can do that in the future ajmitch
<ajmitch> and it was set to complain about missing files?
 * ausimage seems vindicated on that one ;)
<vorian> always, can't have any hotness missing
<vorian> ajmitch: i knew it was the .install file - I just didn't understand why i was getting that error
<vorian> er, ausimage
<vorian> :P
<ausimage> :D
<ausimage> ajmitch: I guess that means two changelogs unless it is kosher to upload -0ubuntu1 to a PPA :/ Besides I thought ppa1 was on that file :?
<ajmitch> upload -0ubuntu1~ppa1 to a PPA
 * ajmitch must really go to work now, will be back later
<stgraber> cody-somerville: ping
<cody-somerville> stgraber, pong
<stgraber> cody-somerville: I'm helping someone with an universe SRU, the bug is opened in LP with an attached debdiff (taken from the same bugfix in Debian), what should happen next ? Can I upload that directly to proposed or is that something motu-sru should do or approve first ?
<savvas> what does "Chroot problem" mean? https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cgal/3.4-4ubuntu1/+build/1059619
<savvas> ah, E: There are problems and -y was used without --force-yes
<geser> savvas: usually that it should be retried later
<dtchen> you're probably hitting the coreutils bug
<dtchen> (haven't looked at the log yet)
<savvas> ok thanks :)
<loic-m> Do we support the Sparc arch for karmic?
<directhex> loic-m, if we do, i could do with access to a sparc box :/
<dtchen> directhex: not sure i understand your earlier question regarding "how big was your music collection?"
<directhex> dtchen, i'm trying to get a proper handle on media player RAM scalability, i heard you had lots of music
<dtchen> directhex: ah. currently my library in banshee is ~4K songs. earlier banshee and rhythmbox libraries have been somewhere between 60-600K songs, but those machines are long gone.
<dtchen> (it's always easier to store massive libraries when you don't have to tote a laptop with limited store)
<superm1> directhex, can't you just write a simple $(language) script that would to and make a copy of a few files many times and modify the id3 tags to simulate a large library?
<superm1> s/to/go/
<directhex> superm1, yeah, probably..... effort :'(
<directhex> superm1, easier if i found someone with a big collection just lying around on irc ;)
<dtchen> directhex: think greg-g has a fairly sizeable library
<superm1> directhex, right.  well if you don't find such a person, i'm guessing this would be like a 15 line script or so to walk a directory and do these tasks
<porthose> directhex: not sure if this will help but I have 13K songs on my ampache server
<directhex> porthose, that's about 10k more than me, so could provide an interesting measure. if you're bored enough
<porthose> directhex: what do yea need?
<directhex> porthose, just add the whole lot to the library for whichever gnomish media library apps you have access to, and read off the "writable memory" column from gnome-system-monitor whilst playing a sample track
<directhex> porthose, i want to know to what degree the numbers i have for my 3k collecton are representative
<porthose> directhex: ok may take a while
<porthose> directhex: I'm importing everthing into rythembox, I'll give you a ping when it is complete and I have some numbers for yea ;-)
<directhex> yays!
<directhex> porthose, rhythmbox is especially interesting as it's the only major player written in a "low level" language - but it also uses XML for its library storage and loads the entire library into one liststore
<doctormo> Hey all
<directhex> hello doctormo
<somaunn> doctormo, hello
<doctormo> I'm trying to enable debugging in jabberd2 (which should be a package option somehow) but anyway, setting DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS didn't seem to want to work
<doctormo> Ofcourse if anyone is good with jabberd already, perhaps they can tell me why it never seems to want to work.
#ubuntu-motu 2009-06-05
<porthose> directhex: 175 mib used when play a track, sorry it took so long, life got in the way
<directhex> stupid life. try patching it!
<directhex> porthose, that's a huge number! that's the "Writable Memory" column?
<porthose> oops how about 22 mib
<directhex> 32 bit cpu?
<kklimonda> porthose: nice, my banshee uses almost 70 :/
<kklimonda> seems like rhythmbox is still better when it comes to memory consumption :/
<directhex> that's a remarkably low value for a library of that size, porthose
<directhex> kklimonda, it's about 25% better with mono 2.4
<kklimonda> directhex: is mono 2.4 going to get into 9.10?
<directhex> kklimonda, yes
<directhex> kklimonda, waiting for 2.4.2 bugfix release on monday
 * porthose double checks
<porthose> directhex: yea it's showing 28 to 29 mib writable memory
<directhex> porthose, that was i386 or amd64?
<porthose> i386
<directhex> okay, makes sense
<directhex> i get pretty much the same values from RB, with a much smaller library - but on amd64
<directhex> now, i totally need to go to bed
<porthose> directhex: night
<ausimage> ajmitch: you track down how I presumably broke review?
<dholbach> good morning
<slytherin> dholbach: good morning
<dholbach> hi slytherin
<fabrice_sp>  good morning dholbach !
<dholbach> heya fabrice_sp
<mochaRHW> hello, anyone here I can ask a quick question about Atheros drivers?
<mochaRHW> hello?
<dholbach> mochaRHW: maybe #ubuntu-kernel? but just ask
<dholbach> no need to ask to ask :)
<mochaRHW> I was just wondering if anyone knows what version of madwifi was used to build the ath_pci.ko module in Jaunty?
<mochaRHW> modinfo says "D3FD3BD11169A96DBCFF8DE"
<dholbach> definitely #ubuntu-kernel
<mochaRHW> ok, I'll try
<dholbach> the -motu team does not maintain any parts of the kernel
<dholbach> good luck
<dholbach> the kernel people might wake up in a few hours
<mochaRHW> yea, seems like everyone is asleep!
<dholbach> :)
<mochaRHW> no one in #madwifi either
<geser> good morning
<MooKow> buildd issues?
<LordKow> .
<geser> looks like it
<gaspa> geser: you mean the one about mktemp package?
<geser> yes
<gaspa> what happened?
<geser> don't know
<gaspa> :)
<wgrant> coreutils contains and now Conflicts with mktemp.
<wgrant> apt doesn't like removing Essential packages, which mktemp is.
<wgrant> A fixed coreutils has been uploaded (producing a transitional non-Essential mktemp binary), but it needs to be built manually.
<geser> wgrant: btw: should we leave hppa in the FTBFS list (for now) or remove it as it's e-o-l?
<wgrant> geser: I think I might just remove it, as I don't think a DAS can be removed from Soyuz...
<AnAnt> can someone sponsor those:  LP #359436 , LP #359444 , LP #359446 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 359436 in ubuntume-gdm-themes "Rename package and update artwork " [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/359436
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 359444 in usplash-theme-ubuntume "Rename package and update artwork " [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/359444
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 359446 in ubuntume-themes "Rename package" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/359446
<qiyong> hey, how the US and europe economics now?
<hyperair> does anyone here use tcptrack?
<hyperair> it's currently pretty useless in jaunty and karmic; no connections are shown at all
 * kmdm peers at debuild -S checking build-deps rather than just spitting out a source package to be built with pbuilder...
<hyperair> kmdm: -S -d
<kmdm> hyperair: It's doing...  debuild -S dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -d -us -uc -S
<kmdm> (pretend there's a linefeed in there)
<hyperair> heh
<hyperair> strange.
<hyperair> it should work
<kmdm> yeah, quite - this always used to work...not my first package build by any stretch of the imagination
<hyperair> hehe
<hyperair> well try running dpkg-buildpackage then
<kmdm> I guess I should examine debian/rules and see what it's doing there... but am I right in thinking in general building the source package doesn't need to check the build-deps since they get resolved by pbuilder when doing the binary package?
<kmdm> hyperair: Bah, this package depends clean on configure, which then checks the build-deps... *sigh*
<hyperair> ha. no wonder.
<hyperair> ooh netsplit.
<hyperair> kmdm: it's ./configure checking for builddeps then? and not dpkg-checkbuilddeps?
<kmdm> well, it's calling dpkg-checkbuilddeps manually
<jpds> hyperair: Yeah, tcptrack looks broken.
<hyperair> jpds: =(
<kmdm> it looks like the packager's assumed that everyone bulds in place since they're doing make clean style stuff too
<hyperair> i'd fix it, but this looks beyond my capabilities.
<hyperair> heh no wonder.
<jpds> hyperair: Still, who needs it when we have tcpdump, tcpflow, iptraf, .....
<hyperair> kmdm: you mean debian/rules calls dpkg-checkbuilddeps?
<kmdm> hyperair: Aye, well... checkbuild: chmod u+x ./debian/dpkg-checkbuild ./debian/dpkg-checkbuild debian/control
<hyperair> jpds: i liked tcptrack's interface. i use iptraf otherwise, but the thing is that tcptrack shows the rates of each connection in real time. iptraf only shows one at a time.
<kmdm> (with linefeeds) :)
 * hyperair facepalms
<hyperair> kmdm: wipe it out and package it from scratch
<hyperair> or salvage the bits that you can
<directhex> kmdm, sometimes you can't run "make clean" without "./configure"
<directhex> kmdm, which causes scenarios where you need build-deps in order to make a source package
<kmdm> directhex: Aye, they were guarding a make clean/distclean in there
<directhex> kmdm, that makes less sense
<kmdm> If anyone's curious enough: https://launchpad.net/~kees/+archive/ppa/+files/heartbeat_2.1.4-2~hardy1.dsc (seems to be a direct backport from upstream to Hardy)
<kmdm> I'm just trying to coax it onto dapper at the moment, could be a losing battle though. :)
<savvas> well if you think it's going to be useful for the server, it's worth a try, you can also backport its dependencies if you think that's required :)
<kmdm> Anyone know if dapper had some equivalent of python-central?
<stani> pochu: What means 'declined for Karmic' at bug #370839?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 370839 in spe "kiki should depend on python-wxgtk2.6 or python-wxgtk2.8, not just on python-wxgtk2.6" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/370839
<pochu> hey stani! looking
<pochu> stani: it means there's no need to open a karmic task, the "normal" task can be fixed in karmic as it's the development cycle
<stani> pochu: I am a bit confused if this bug should be a SRU or not
<stani> pochu: I am afraid there will come more duplicate bugs
<stani> pochu: I mean for Jaunty
<slytherin> stani: I don't think 'changing build depends' would be allowed in SRU.
<stani> and it if it's a SRU for Jaunty, it should be fixed in Karmic first right?
<stani> slytherin: it's not about 'build depends' but about 'depends'
<pochu> slytherin: it's a new ORed dependency
<pochu> stani: seems fine to me, will the kiki.py change still work with wx2.6?
<stani> slytherin: and the dependencies causes bugs in Jaunty because in Jaunty wxpython 2.6 is the default, while before it was 2.8
<pochu> it sounds fine as it won't change anything for people that already have it
<stani> pochu: it will work even better, as now kiki uses a deprecated class of wxpython2.6
<pochu> except for the code change, but if it still works with 2.6 it should be fine IMHO
<pochu> stani: ok cool
<pochu> stani: so it just needs to be uploaded to karmic, and then we could SRU it
<pochu> with approval from the MOTU SRU folks, of course
<stani> pochu: yes
<stani> pochu: I am just doubting what would be the best reason for the SRU
<pochu> stani: does it still break SPE, even after your SPE SRU?
<slytherin> stani: my mistake, got confused.
<stani> it might be the use of deprecated class, breaks with wxpython2.8, unnecessarily making a dependency of wx2.6
<pochu> the unneeded dependency is probably not a good enough reason, I guess
<pochu> so unless it still breaks something, we can leave it
<pochu> i.e. if SPE works fine now after the SRU
<stani> pochu: no my SPE sru fixes SPE of course, but now spe is dependent of 2.6 and 2.8, but it will break applications which are only compatible with 2.8
<stani> so SPE is fixed, but there will be others which might break
<pochu> hmm, you could say that as the reason for the SRU
<stani> not every other application uses wxversion to force a wxpython version
<stani> now wxpython applications assume 2.8, not 2.6
<pochu> so if kiki uses 2.6 and your app doesn't care, will it pick up 2.6?
<pochu> even if both 2.6 and 2.8 are installed?
<stani> yes, this is another sru bug, for which I submitted a fix, which I guess mok0 is dealing with
<pochu> stani: I mean, in general
<pochu> not specifically with SPE
<stani> pochu: yes all other applications which expect 2.8 are affected
<pochu> stani: that's a good reason then IMHO
<stani> for example if you have an application which depends on python-wxgtk2.8, it will use wxpython 2.6 when it just does an "import wx"
<stani> and most likely this application will fail
<pochu> oh
<pochu> but that's the wxwidgets bug, right?
<stani> no
<stani> the application could use wxversion to select its versions, but most apps don't care
<stani> they suppose you've installed the right wxpython version
<pochu> okay
<pochu> so let's just fix it
<stani> pochu: it doesn't break directly, but it will provoque breaking
<pochu> yeah, it's alright then
<stani> pochu: if you read the original bug report, you see that the author complains that his applications don't work any more. probably he doesn't know he could fix it with wxversion, but there will be more people like this
<stani> pochu: you want me to start the SRU process? (with the hope you will back me up)
<pochu> stani: yes, but it needs to be uploaded to karmic first
<stani> pochu: this is in the pipeline right? I could already prepare the SRU process as I did for bug #377044 (read first line)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 377044 in spe "SPE fails to run any scripts after upgrade to jaunty" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/377044
<stani> pochu: and it would be nice if you could give feedback on that bug (as the SPE sru fix is now waiting in -proposed)
<pochu> stani: I only have Hardy here :(
<stani> pochu: than you can beta test the new Phatch from my PPA ;-) (just joking, no obligations)
<pochu> stani: yeah I can do that ;)
<pochu> stani: the PPA is ~stani ?
<stani> pochu: yes, more info here http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1178224
<stani> pochu: do you know why Phatch fails to build by a "chroot problem", see https://launchpad.net/~stani/+archive/ppa/+build/1060898?
<stani> pochu: that only happens on Karmic
<pochu> stani: everything's failing to build
<pochu> stani: see #ubuntu-devel's /topic
<stani> pochu: ok, so it is just a matter of time
<pochu> yup
<cjwatson> wgrant: we're killing karmic/hppa now
<cjwatson> wgrant: it will have the side-effect that builds for karmic/hppa will basically never have happened, but lamont says he's ok withthat
<cjwatson> with that
<wgrant> cjwatson: I didn't think that was possible without a bit of manual DELETE action.
<wgrant> That explains it.
<wgrant> That's a bit ew, though.
<cjwatson> it is a bit. but the alternative is having karmic/hppa continue to show up as a sort of ghost town.
<cjwatson> I'd honestly rather it just went away and I don't think anyone *really* cares enough ...
<wgrant> Or convince Soyuz people to implement a DAS.disabled flag.
<wgrant> Of course. But altering history is always a little iffy for me.
<stani> pochu: I prepared the SRU request, so it can start once it is uploaded to Karmic https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/spe/+bug/370839
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 370839 in spe "kiki should depend on python-wxgtk2.6 or python-wxgtk2.8, not just on python-wxgtk2.6" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<mterry> I'm looking at a FTBFS that seems like it should BFS.  I might just be missing some details about buildds.  Does anyone have a sec to look at bug 383921?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 383921 in taglib "FTBFS in Karmic because of a broken librcc-dev dependency" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/383921
<mterry> It builds in my chroot, and the buildd tried to build it a full month after librcc was done building.  So it seems like the buildd should have been able to get librcc.
<slytherin> mterry: what is BFS?
<mterry> slytherin: Build From Source
<slytherin> mterry: You can ask someone from core team to give back the package. Try #ubuntu-devel. Please mention that it builds fine in your karmic chroot.
<mterry> slytherin: Hmm, OK.  Still curious why it failed.  Maybe they'd know
<cjwatson> (for the record, the reason mterry couldn't reproduce the bug was that his chroot had universe enabled and the buildd's chroot didn't since it was building for main
<cjwatson> )
<mterry> cjwatson: :)  Thanks
<savvas> now that the coreutils bug is fixed, the builds that had problems are set to be rebuilt right?
<savvas> in cgal it says "Needs building", just checking, in case I have to do any requests: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cgal/3.4-4ubuntu1/ :)
<cjwatson> savvas: yes, they are set
<geser> I guess a mass-giveback will happen (if it did not already happen)
<cjwatson> "needs building" is what you get *after* a mass give-back
<cjwatson> and before it's actually built
<savvas> cool, thanks :)
<jdstrand> slangasek: hi! what is the process for a sync request from debian-multimedia? eg, bug #378124
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 378124 in ubuntu "Please sync divxenc 1.3.0-0.0 from debian-multimedia" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/378124
<pwnguin> hyperair: how stable is your unstable banshee ppa?
<hyperair> pwnguin: as stable as banshee unstable is.
<pwnguin> ie, there's a 1.5 release as of june 1st
<pwnguin> it seems to have rhythmbox imports, which i'd like to try out
<pwnguin> but im not sure i want to upgrade daily
<pwnguin> ah, i see. they use an even/odd numbering
<pwnguin> hyperair: so the unstable ppa tracks the official beta releases, and you have a seperate daily build?
<hyperair> pwnguin: bingo.
<pwnguin> ok, that makes more sense
<hyperair> pwnguin: what confused you? perhaps i can amend the descriptions
<pwnguin> hyperair: i wanst sure what the difference between unstable and daily was
<hyperair> i see.
<pwnguin> you might make a note that the unstable is from official upstream unstable releases
<pwnguin> not all projects have unstable release series like that
<slangasek> jdstrand: update-sources should grab from debian-multimedia; then you just need to pass a -D option to sync-source.py (or syncbugbot)
<jdstrand> slangasek: that is what I figured, but wanted to be sure. thanks!
<hyperair> well you can enable all three PPAs together
<mterry> With regards to inclusion in 'main', is it by source package or by binary package?
<superm1> mterry, the source package has to be in main for any of the binary packages to be in main. not all of the binary packages have to be in main though
<superm1> see lirc for example, it's source is in main, and liblircclient0 is, but 'lirc' and 'lirc-x' aren't
<mterry> superm1: Cool.  OK
<nixternal> anyone have any idea as to why sun-java6-plugin deps on the following:
<nixternal> firefox | firefox-2 | iceweasel | mozilla-firefox | iceape-browser | mozilla-browser | epiphany-gecko | epiphany-webkit | epiphany-browser | galeon | midbrowser | xulrunner
<nixternal> no konqueror in there, arora, rekonq...discrimination I tell you!
<nixternal> why not just x-www-browser?
<sebner> nixternal: firefox2 is obsolete, what's arora rekonq? ^^
<nixternal> 2 new KDE browsers
<nixternal> plus Konqueror isn't even in the list there
<vorian> arora?
<nixternal> though I don't even know if arora or rekonq have java support yet, I was being a bit of an ass with those 2 :)
<vorian> <3 arora
<geser> does the plugin work with those and is installed in the right dir?
<nixternal> arora is qt not kde
<nixternal> geser: yup
<nixternal> well it works with konqueror
<nixternal> I don't know about the other 2
<vorian> I have to use sun-java6-bin (i think) to get java properly working with arora
<ausimage> ajmitch: how is the REVU issue comming along :S
<nhandler> Is there a way to have dch act as if I am on Debian? When it creates a new changelog entry, it wants to append ubuntu1 instead of bumping the Debian revision
<cody-somerville> dtchen, interestingly, no sound at all with new kernel
<cody-somerville> dtchen, will try old kernel once I get back from walk with the dog.
<nhandler> For those interested, it appears that I can use the --distributor option
<cody-somerville> dtchen, hm.... killing pulseaudio fixed the problem
<dtchen> cody-somerville: usually a mixer element (volume)/sink issue
<bencrisford> I am getting a debuild error today :/
<bencrisford> yesterday debuild -S worked fine
<bencrisford> but on a package today it wont
<bencrisford> http://paste.ubuntu.com/189282/
<JontheEchidna> bencrisford: you need to build-depend on the gnome-pkg-tools package
<JontheEchidna> and also install it on your system ;-)
<directhex> nhandler, yes, there is a way
<nhandler> directhex: I found it, see above
<bencrisford> JontheEchidna: Oh, how do I do that =S?
<bencrisford> just install the gnome-pkg...
<bencrisford> and do apt-get install build dependencies?
<JontheEchidna> then in debian/control, put gnome-pkg-tools in the build-depend sline
<JontheEchidna> *line
<bencrisford> JontheEchidna: Ohhh..  Ok, thanks :)
<JontheEchidna> :)
<cjwatson> nhandler: -U
<cjwatson> (or yes, --distributor)
#ubuntu-motu 2009-06-06
<MTecknology> Who maintains the drupal package for the ubuntu repos?
<MTecknology> !info drupal6 jaunty
<ubottu> drupal6 (source: drupal6): a fully-featured content management framework. In component universe, is extra. Version 6.10-1 (jaunty), package size 1055 kB, installed size 4852 kB
<MTecknology> The current version is 6.12
<cody-somerville> !info drupal6 karmic
<ubottu> drupal6 (source: drupal6): a fully-featured content management framework. In component universe, is extra. Version 6.12-1 (karmic), package size 1072 kB, installed size 4892 kB
<cody-somerville> fancy that
<MTecknology> cody-somerville: ... drupal will only be updated with ubuntu releases?
<cody-somerville> !backports
<ubottu> If new updated Ubuntu packages are built for an application, then they may go into Ubuntu Backports. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports - See also !packaging
<MTecknology> cody-somerville: I understand that much, but the drupal updates usually include security patches too
<cody-somerville> MTecknology, I can imagine
<MTecknology> cody-somerville: I suppose for my case then it might be a better idea to keep drupal in /var/www/ :P
<cody-somerville> Personally, I never use web based apps from the repo
<MTecknology> I was trying to move to doing it
<MTecknology> but ya, probably a good decision to keep w/ what I was doing then :P
<MTecknology> anyway - It's bed time - I get up to go to work 0100, makes for a fun night
<MTecknology> ttyl
<cody-somerville> bye
<SirDerigo> un derigo para encontrarlos a todos, un derigo para engaÃ±arlos, un derigo para atraerlos a todos y atarlos al S.L
<kklimonda> when I work with package (i.e. making changes and using UNRELEASED pocket) what should I do with package version? Bump debian revision or use the same?
<xnox`> my package is in the debian import queu / accepted
<xnox`> do new pacakges from debian get synced into ubuntu? or do I need to file a sync bug in launchpad?
<jmarsden> xnox`: They get synced.  sword just got synced into Karmic :)
<jmarsden> SWORD was manual, but a new package that has no package-w.x-yubuntuz already in Karmic is supposed to autosync,
<xnox`> jmarsden: ok =D
<jmarsden> Is xiphos ready to get into Debian unstable?
<xnox`> hmmm it's already in the queue/accepted
<xnox`> http://incoming.debian.org/
<jmarsden> Cool!
<xnox`> after it will all both bibletime & xiphos land in karmic & get compiled we can start filling out requests for backporting ;-)
<xnox`> did we tell sword people that we have sliced and diced their tarball?
<jmarsden> Well, we told the ones in the pkg-crosswire list at least :)
<xnox`> yeah there are about 15 people signed up to the list is it all the upstream bibletime / xiphos / sword lurking?
<Fenix|home> Greetings
<Fenix|home> TheMuso: Are you available?
<artfwo> Hi! Has there been any progress with bug 372243?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 372243 in texlive-base "FTBFS of other packages due to dpkg-trigger bug in texlive-base" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/372243
<kklimonda> what is current debian policy about asking questions during package upgrades? is there any?
<maxb> I don't know of anything official, but I imagine it's something like "Only do it if you really really need to "
<gaspa> can someone please give-back alt-ergo and pxp ? (they build fine in my ppa, so at least amd64,i386 and lpia)
<geser> gaspa: done
<gaspa> geser: :)
<hyperair> when a bug is marked for expiration, should i change its status to invalid?
<hyperair> or should i just leave it as incomplete?
<aboSamoor> Hi, this is my first time to think about packaging, usually everything is available in repositories with updated versions. Now, I found that bpython is not in jaunty and I want to package it and add it to my own repository, is there any specific tutorial for python packaging ?
<loic-m> !packaging
<ubottu> The packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports
<loic-m> aboSamoor: bpython |    0.9.2-1 |      unstable | source, all
<loic-m> aboSamoor: so it's in debian
<loic-m> aboSamoor: and karmic, see: bpython |    0.9.1-1 | karmic/universe | source, all
<aboSamoor> loic-m: I tried the debian package and it is installed without problems but it crashs before starting, so I thought I may have to package it against ubuntu
<loic-m> aboSamoor: just get the source package first, and build it for Jaunty or use a pp
<loic-m> s/pp/ppa
<loic-m> or use prevu bpython for a quick look at karmic's 0.9.1
<bencrisford> I have been working on a bug, I fixed it so I made a debdiff
<bencrisford> but all that appeared in the debdiff was the changelog entry
<bencrisford> none of the important stuff that actually needed to be changed
<bencrisford> i have tried again and again...  help :'(
<loic-m> bencrisford: what was the fix?
<randomaction> are you taking debdiff of .dsc files?
<bencrisford> loic-m: It was really simple, it was a matter of adding a dependency
<loic-m> bencrisford: so the control file was changed
<bencrisford> loic-m: Yes
<bencrisford> but the debdiff didnt show it
<bencrisford> loic-m: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/27556542/pellusus_2.26.0-0ubuntu2.debdiff
<loic-m> bencrisford: are you sure the debian/control was change when making the diff.gz?
<loic-m> bencrisford:did you manually check the diff.gz before doing the debdiff?
<bencrisford> loic-m: Well I edited the control,  did a dch -i then debuild -S, then from the new package i made the debdiff
<loic-m> bencrisford: check the resulting diff.gz
<bencrisford> ok
<bencrisford> loic-m: Its not in the diff.gz either, but if i was to add my change to the diff.gz and did my debdiff again..
<bencrisford> would that work?
<loic-m> bencrisford: dunno. Is saving 2 seconds worth the trouble?
<loic-m> bencrisford: I think there's a way to do it, or you can resign afterwards, but does the debuild take _that_ long?
<bencrisford> loic-m: ?  I don't understand..
<bencrisford> how can i fix this?
<loic-m> bencrisford: just make sure debian/control has the dependency, then run debuild again
<bencrisford> i have done that several times now loic-m
<loic-m> bencrisford: for the other solution, I've never used it, so I can't explain ;)
<loic-m> bencrisford: if you debian/control has the dependency, it should show up in the diff.gz
<bencrisford> loic-m: Hmm, ok, ill try, ty for your help btw ;) :)
<loic-m> bencrisford: unless you didn't save, use the wrong directory, or there's something I can't imagine
<loic-m> bencrisford: hope it works
<bencrisford> loic-m: I'll be back in a bit
<loic-m> no pb
<thekorn> hi,
<thekorn> I'm packaging a python application, using cdbs
<thekorn> and I would like to add a .desktop file
<thekorn> waht's needed to get this .desktop file registered?
<thekorn> appart from installing this file into /usr/share/applications
<loic-m> thekorn: put the file package.desktop in debian folder (package=name of pkg)
<loic-m> thekorn: oh, so it's should be enough if you lready install it
<loic-m> thekorn: just check you're also installing an icon
<loic-m> in /usr/share/pixmaps
<loic-m> and check your .desktop file with desktop-file-validate
<thekorn> loic-m, yes, ok, so there is no need to add gnome.mk to debian/rules?
<thekorn> or run dh_desktop?
<thekorn> that's what the packaging guide says, but if I add this, the builder complains about missing ./configure
<loic-m> dh_desktop too
<pochu> hi thekorn :)
<loic-m> if I read the man page correctly
<thekorn> hi pochu
<thekorn> oh man, packaging is so easy, but obviously way too hard for me ;)
<pochu> thekorn: gnome.mk is not needed
<thekorn> hmm, ok, let me try whithout it
<pochu> dh_desktop is not needed anymore since jaunty
<pochu> but it will do no harm
<loic-m> pochu: I didn't know that, thanks
<thekorn> super, thanks pochu and loic-m, it worked
<thekorn> pochu, can we fix it in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#.desktop%20Files ?
<pochu> thekorn: yeah, can you do it?
<thekorn> pochu, sure
<pochu> dh_desktop is not needed anymore since Jaunty because desktop-file-utils 0.15-2 register /usr/share/applications/ as a trigger
<pochu> so whenever you install a file there, update-desktop-database will be called
<pochu> so you don't need to manually call it
<pochu> (which is what dh_desktop does)
<alex-weej> anyone know how i can programmatically enable the universe repo? or am i going to have to butcher sources.list "manually"?
<thekorn> pochu, ah ok, thanks for the explaination, I quoted you in the comment of my edit
<pochu> :)
<thekorn> else, nobody would trust a packaging n00b like me ;)
<bencrisford> loic-m: No matter how many times I try, or what I try, nothing seems to be working :'(
<AnAnt> Hello, can someone sponsor those:  LP #359436 , LP #359444 , LP #359446 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 359436 in ubuntume-gdm-themes "Rename package and update artwork " [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/359436
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 359444 in usplash-theme-ubuntume "Rename package and update artwork " [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/359444
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 359446 in ubuntume-themes "Rename package" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/359446
<bencrisford> loic-m: What im doing is simple as this:
<bencrisford> vi debian/control
<bencrisford> dch -i
<bencrisford> debuild -S
<bencrisford> cd ..
<bencrisford> debdiff  file.dsc file-new.dsc > file-new.debdiff
<gaspa> can someone please give-back galax?
<jpds> gaspa: By your command: http://paste.ubuntu.com/189600/
<gaspa> jpds: thanls
<gaspa> thanks
<binarymutant> if someone has the time to do a revu on this package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pidgin-mbpurple I would be very appreciative :)
<pi-meson2> A colleague and I are trying to package the latest HDF5 libraries and pytables to a PPA. Both build fine locally, and pytables (which depends on hdf5) builds the deb, but the deb doesn't install, claiming that "Package libhdf5-serial" is not installed. Is there any way to get additional debugging information from dpkg -i to help us figure out where we're going wrong?
<StevenK> dpkg won't install dependancies for you
<StevenK> apt will, however
<pi-meson2> right, I know that
<pi-meson2> we built (and installed) the dependency ourselves
<pi-meson2> that is, we built the deb that provides the dep ourselves (that's one of the things we're trying to package)
<StevenK> So it seems you need to install libhdf5-serial first
<pi-meson2> right, we did! or thought we did
<pi-meson2> http://paste2.org/p/250097 claims it's "installed"
<StevenK> That's your problem
<StevenK> libhdf5-serial-1.8.3-0 != libhdf5-serial
<pi-meson2> so our libhdf5 deb should also list "libhdf5-serial" under its "provides"?
<StevenK> That would solve that particular issue, yes
<penguin42> Does anyone here understand the origin and versioning of cryptsetup? The changelog in the source ends in 2007
<pi-meson2> StevenK: okay, that ended up working, thank you very much for the help
<penguin42> anyone know about the _( and N_( macros - what's the difference?
<nixternal> wgrant: when are you going to put the synaptics package into karmic? need my tapping back :p  in the mean time I will test out your PPA one
<nixternal> wgrant: vote of confindence from me, that gives me my tapping back :)
<loic-m> slangasek, ping
<slangasek> loic-m: hi
<loic-m> slangasek, hi
<loic-m> slangasek: about http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep5/ I've got a few questions
<loic-m> slangasek: don't know if you'ge got the time though
<loic-m> slangasek: mainly for the Files: section, this bit "indicating files that have the same licence and share copyright holders."
<loic-m> slangasek: it gets overly messy on big src/ with each files having diferent mix of authors
<loic-m> slangasek: wouldn't it just be better to just group the files with the same License, and group the copyrights even if they're not all the same on each file?
<slangasek> loic-m: the format doesn't dictate how you group authors; if you have twenty authors across 60 files and you want to list a single Files section for them, the format allows you to do that
<slangasek> this should probably be clarified in the draft
<loic-m> slangasek; Thanks. That's not clear from the description (see the citation)
<loic-m> slangasek: that would be great
<loic-m> slangasek: I think the other question I had was about multiple year copyright, since all the example are one year only (not so clear then)
<loic-m> slangasek: I remember reading (don't know if it was FSF or Debian) that we should detail each year, like 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004
<loic-m> slangasek: and not 2001-2004
<slangasek> loic-m: correct representation of multiple-year copyrights is dictated by law, I don't think we should make any claims about this one way or the other in the spec :)
<loic-m> What's the specification take on that?
<loic-m> slangasek: ok. Maybe state what the law is then for more clarity (or add multiple years example)
<slangasek> we might refer people to the law, or to a faq someone else has already written
<slangasek> stating what the law is would be out of scope for this
<loic-m> slangasek: last question -  when there's many files in a folder, and only a few have a different License
<loic-m> since the format should also be human-readable
<loic-m> Isn't there a way to cover all files minus a few files other than glob, which isn't really human-readable?
<slangasek> I'm not sure why you say globs aren't human readable; they're more readable than anything else I can think of for doing this
<slangasek> and they're also machine-readable
<loic-m> I'll try to point you to an example in a minute
<jmarsden> loic-m: Remember you can do a straight somedir/* glob and then later Files: sections take care of the exceptions.
<jmarsden> So there is little need for a complex glob...
<jmarsden> Incidentally, there is a typo in the dep5 spec: "If multiple Files declaratioun match the same file, then only the last match counts."
<jmarsden> declaratioun should be declarations, I think :)
<loic-m> jmarsden: here's what mess I'm thinking about http://paste.ubuntu.com/189767/
<loic-m> oversimplified of course ;)
<loic-m> "Remember you can do a straight somedir/* glob and then later Files: sections take care of the exceptions." that sounds exactly like what I'd like - src/* then list the files in src/ that aren't included
<loic-m> unless of course we use the ""If multiple Files declaratioun match the same file, then only the last match counts."
<jmarsden> Which is exactly what you should do.  So you can simplify the first Files to Files: src/* -- which is human readable.
<loic-m> Ok, thanks. I wasn't sure about it.
<jmarsden> I'm no expert, but that's how i read the spec, anyway :)
<loic-m> jmarsden: can anybody edit the DPE-5 page?
<jmarsden> I'm not sure.  Anyone could, when it was a wiki, but now it is a DEP... try it, I guess :)
<loic-m> I don't think I'd dare though ;)
<loic-m> It's probably editable on the VCS
<loic-m> I'd just like to see that you group files with the same licenses, not the same exact copyrights
<slangasek> you can create a bzr branch of it and push changes
<slangasek> but it's deliberately not a wiki at this point, because that resulted in lots of drive-by edits without any discussion among the larger Debian community
<slangasek> by "push changes", I mean "email the DEP drivers and ask them to merge"; but there are some internal administrativa to sort out yet before we're actually ready to do that, fwiw
<loic-m> slangasek: i may just edit a patch and send them to somebody that can edit the page, or just send the questions needing to be clarified and a few modified paragraph proposing a way to clear them
<bencrisford> loic-m: Just fyi, i managed to fix that problem from earlier with LaserJock's help :), i just needed to edit the .in rather than
<stefanlsd> Something i've done in dep5 recently. I feel its quite readable and also helped me to get the licensing more correct - http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~stefanlsd/+junk/gears/revision/18
<bencrisford> than just the control*
<slangasek> loic-m: honestly, I would recommend waiting until the discussion process starts on debian-project
<slangasek> right now there's far *too much* private discussion going on of the DEP, which I'm trying (weakly) to wrap up
<loic-m> bencrisford: good to know
<loic-m> bencrisford: Althoug I don't know what's the .in ;)
<bencrisford> loic-m: I think its what debuild reads
<bencrisford> it doesnt read the control, but the control.in
<bencrisford> apparently anyway
<loic-m> stefanlsd: thanks, it looks good!
<loic-m> slangasek: ok, it's just that some of us are trying to use it esp. for new packages
<loic-m> well, thanks a lot slangasek, stefanlsd and jmarsden
<nhandler> If I run piuparts with the -p flag (to have it use pbuilder), shouldn't it parse my ~/.pbuilderrc file to determine the location of the tarball?
<loic-m> bbl
<kklimonda> nhandler: well, it would be nice. unfortunately it has /var/cache/pbuilder/... hardcoded
<warp10> Is there someone with an amd64 machine with debian sid installed available? I need it for a small test.
<jmarsden> warp10: I have a sid amd64 pbuilder chroot (under Ubuntu 9.04) if that is sufficient for your test...but can't you run sid amd64 in a VM or chroot yourself to do such testing?
<warp10> jmarsden: your chroot should be enough. You should install python-vtk, launch python and type "import vtk"
<jmarsden> OK...
<warp10> jmarsden: regarding to your question: I could, but my connection is really slow this evening, so I was looking for a faster solution.
<jmarsden> Hmmm.  I'm updating it now... pbuilder-sid login got me everything up to "entering the shell" ... and then something that sucked up input but never displayed a shell prompt!
<warp10> jmarsden: oh, weird
<jmarsden> Definitely... and it still does it after an update.  I'll try creating a new one (I have FIOS 10mbps download speed here, so it shouldn't take *that* long...)
<ajmitch> sorry, I only have i386 sid at the moment
 * warp10 really, really envys jmarsden's connection
<ajmitch> so do I :)
<jmarsden> :)  if I paid a little more I could get 20mbps up and down... I have not succumbed to that temptation yet 10 down and 2 up is plenty for now :)
<warp10> jmarsden: ok, I'm starting to hate you :D
<jmarsden> It's done with the download part of the pbuilder create already ...
<warp10> jmarsden: If I had created the chroot, it would still downloading the package list right now. Don't know why, it is incredibly slow and lagged here. Network issues, probably
<RoAkSoAx> heya guys how can I update the headers of a patch?
<jmarsden> sounds like it.  There it's done, 547 seconds start to finish.
<jmarsden> RoAkSoAx: If it uses quilt, use quilt refresh ?
<RoAkSoAx> jmarsden, ok thanks:)
<jmarsden> warp10: Hmmm, I'm guessing I have something bad in my .pbuilderrc .. the new one has the same behaviour the old one did regarding pbuilder-sid login
<warp10> jmarsden: oh, too bad. Can't understand what's the problem could be
<jmarsden> I'll get there... but this "quick test" isn't turning out as quick as you hoped... sorry about that :)
<warp10> jmarsden: no problem, rather thank you for your helpfulness
<jmarsden> Ah... it *is* a shell... just no prompt... echo $SHELL typed into the void gets me /bin/bash... now I need to figure out where the shell prompt went...
<ajmitch> warp10: what was the vtk problem you were having anyway?
<warp10> ajmitch: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=529961
<ubottu> Debian bug 529961 in python-vtk "python-vtk: not usable on amd64: ImportError: No module named" [Important,Closed]
<warp10> ajmitch: I have found that bug is still present on i386
<ajmitch> ok
<warp10> and I would like to know if the amd64 is really fixed. I would like to see it actually fixed ASAP, I can't merge mayavi2 without a working vtk
 * ajmitch would check it out, but has to run out now for a bit :)
 * jmarsden is trying to do the test in his somewhat impaired chroot shell... :)
<jmarsden> at-get import python-vtk is bring in 47 other packages with it...
<jmarsden> s/bring/bringing/
<warp10> jmarsden: probably the whole python stuff and something more
<jmarsden> Yes, lots of fonts and X libraries and so forth.  It's done now :)
<jmarsden> warp10: test gets me a tracebackm last line of which is ImportError: No module named libvtkCommonPython
<warp10> jmarsden: and now I'm wondering why the debian maintainer thinks his latest upload fixed this issue
<warp10> jmarsden: thanks a lot for your time & bandwith, your help has been remarkable
<jmarsden> Sorry, I can't help you with that question :)
<jmarsden> No problem.
<ajmitch> warp10: I can confirm it broken on i386 also
<warp10> ajmitch: indeed. looks like there is a missing link
<contrast> Greets, everyone...
<contrast> Would someone here be so kind as to re-package GJay ( http://launchpadlibrarian.net/3400922/gjay_0.2.8.3-5_amd64.deb ) for Jaunty? The name of a library the package depends on has changed, and this is one of my favorite apps. :)
<RoAkSoAx> jmarsden, when updating a patch header, should I specify it in the changelog??
<jmarsden> I'm not a MOTU... I'd say yes, just to be safe -- but if you update 20 of them don't add 20 lines to the changelog :)
<RoAkSoAx> jmarsden, haha k thanks :)
<contrast> Sorry if this is the wrong place for making that kind of request, but could someone point me in the right direction?
<jmarsden> contrast: The better way to request that would be to file a needs-packaging bug in launchpad, I think.
<contrast> jmarsden: That's normally what I'd do, but this package was deleted from the repositories since it's no longer maintained (following Debian's lead).
<vorian> contrast: it will still need a needs-packaging bug
<contrast> jmarsden: It's a tiny change that needs to be made to the last version that was package - s/libgsl0/libgsl0ldbl/ in the control file - but I'm not sure how to do this while still maintaining the integrity of the package.
<contrast> vorian: got cha. thanks for the heads up.
<contrast> packaged*
<jmarsden> contrast: Hmmm, then you need to find it a new maintainer, not just a one time update of an existing package... I'm not sure how best to proceed in that case... I'd be tempted to file the needs packaging bug anyway and indicate why you feel this is a useful package to have in Debian/Ubuntu
<contrast> point taken... so would anyone here be interested in maintaining the package for the most amazing playlist creator ever? :P
<contrast> j/k - i'm filing the report now.
<RoAkSoAx> vorian, heya!! gotta question... if I updated the patch headers (quilt refresh patch.diff).. should I put that in the changelog
<vorian> yes, put every-little-thing you change in the changelog (even if it's 20 patches)
<vorian> but you could do it like
<vorian> * frefresh patches:
<vorian> - patch.1
<vorian> - patch.2
<vorian> so on, and so forth
<RoAkSoAx> contrast, I think that package is not longer on debian either.. and it has been deprecated because it depends on xmms...
<RoAkSoAx> vorian, ok cool thanks
<jmarsden> vorian: Why not do:   * debian/patches/*: Refreshed all 20 patches      instead?
<contrast> RoAkSoAx: yeah, that's kind of what i was thinking... this probably means it's not going to make it back into the official repos, right?
<RoAkSoAx> contrast, right
<vorian> depends
<contrast> so umm... what now? :)
<jmarsden> contrast: Looks like you'll need to find someone to package it and put it in a PPA for you, or learn packaging yourself so you can repackage it... see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete
<contrast> cool. thanks
<jmarsden> No problem.
<RoAkSoAx> contrast, or just download the source package, change add a jaunty entry on the changelog, and put it in a PPA
<contrast> RoAkSoAx: tried that, couldn't get it to build after installing all dependencies
<RoAkSoAx> contrast, why it would not build?? because of xmms i would guess...
<contrast> nope, i installed xmms via a ppa. one sec, i'll try again and pastebin the output
<RoAkSoAx> ok
<contrast> http://pastebin.ca/1450088
<contrast> i should note this is after applying the diff found here - https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/gjay/0.2.8.3-5build1 - by running the command "patch -p1<../gjay_0.2.8.3-5build1.diff" in the orig directory.
<RoAkSoAx> contrast, you would have to take a look in prefs.c line 338 and see why it's failing to build
<contrast> yeah, tried that... given i'm not a programmer, it didn't help much. :P
<RoAkSoAx> contrast, well what I  would try to do is download xmms and gjay from dapper, add a changelog entry from jaunty on each, and then try to build them
<contrast> will do. thanks for the info.
#ubuntu-motu 2009-06-07
<RoAkSoAx> heya guys... I want to package from scratch a program that contains a kernel module and and a user space daemon. When issuing dh_make, and selecting the type of package.. what should I select?
<jmarsden> RoAkSoAx: I suspect that whichever you pick you'll end up making a lot of changes to the resulting template files from dh_make -- mabe try both and use the one that looks closest to what you think you'll want?
<RoAkSoAx> jmarsden, ok thanks :)
<directhex> i suspect dh_make is 101% useless for this kind of package
<directhex> you want to look at a package which makes use of dkms, and rip off the contents of its debian/ folder
<RoAkSoAx> ok
<pythonic> hi, revu says Package is for "unstable" but only packages for "karmic" are currently accepted.
<jmarsden> pythonic: Did you upload a package to REVU that had "unstable" in the debian/changelog when it should have said "unstable"?  In the top line of the changelog file?
<pythonic> right, it has unstable, should that be karmic (or whatever the next one is)?
<loic-m> pythonic: unstable is for Debian, replace it with karmic and use a -0ubuntu1 version number
<loic-m> pythonic: you just need need to edit that in the changelog (version + distribution)
<pythonic> ok, i have 0ubuntu1 version.. karmic is just the next release right? do i update the package when karmic is released to whatever the next release is?
<pythonic> (if the package is not accepted before karmic releases)
<jmarsden> Yes, as far as I know.
<pythonic> ok, thanks
<pythonic> i need to bump the version to 0ubuntu2 etc. for this right?
<loic-m> nope
<pythonic> oh, ok, when do i bump version numbers?
<loic-m> as long as the package isn't accepted, you only get one entry in the changelog - 0ubuntu1 for new pkg not in Debian
<loic-m> pythonic: it's different from Debian, where you document your changes and bump the version even when the package hasn't been accepted yet
<pythonic> i see.. i already have a package or two at 0ubuntu2. should i change those to 0ubuntu1?
<loic-m> pythonic: once the package enter the repos, you bump the version number when you release a new version or modify the packaging
<loic-m> pythonic: are they on REVU?
<pythonic> yes
<loic-m> Then AFAIK it should be 0ubuntu1 with only one changelog entry (you can regroup info from the two entries you have at the moment if it's relevant)
<pythonic> ok, thanks
<loic-m> you're welcome
<pythonic> ok, fixed now
<davideotape> Hi guys :)
<davideotape> Does anyone know how I can download the french source for https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/iat when I'm on an english computer?
<directhex> davideotape, french source?
<davideotape> directhex: Well, the french translation of that package
<davideotape> If it helps, this is the bug I'm working on: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/iat/+bug/379290
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 379290 in iat "typo in french description of iat" [Undecided,In progress]
<iulian> davideotape: apt-get source <pkg>
<davideotape> iulian: That gets me the source with the English translation, which doesn't' have the French description in it
<kklimonda> could any MOTU sponsor bug 383109?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 383109 in mercurial "Mercurial needs to be rebuilt for Python 2.6" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/383109
<davideotape> kklimonda: Does that bug not need to be set to confirmed now you've provided a patch?
<kklimonda> davideotape: good point.
<iulian> davideotape: That's odd.  I have no idea, sorry.  I couldn't find any translation in the source package.
<directhex> the description as in "apt-cache show" description?
<iulian> directhex: Yea, it seems so, take a peek at the bug report.
<davideotape> directhex: Yes, but the french description
<directhex> right, i didn't think ubuntu used that
<directhex> check rosetta?
<davideotape> directhex: iat doesn't seem to use rosetta (ie. https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/jaunty/+source/iat) doesn't exist
<pochu> only packages in main do
<geser> kklimonda: looking at your debdiff: how will this change fix the dependencies on python itself?
<kklimonda> geser: right now python 2.6 modules are installed in /usr/local/...
<davideotape> pochu: I've found http://packages.debian.org/lenny/iat . What does debian use for it's translations?
<kklimonda> geser: because of that they aren't even installed in package.
<pochu> davideotape: is it translated at all?
<geser> kklimonda: the current python packaging helper know about that and move the files around, see http://launchpadlibrarian.net/27399626/buildlog_ubuntu-karmic-i386.mercurial_1.2.1-3_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz
<davideotape> pochu: It must be, as the bug reporter ( https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/iat ) says that they are using the french version
<kklimonda> geser: but not modules compiled into .so
<pochu> oh
<geser> ah, I guess I begin to understand
<pochu> davideotape: it's not the program that is translated, but the description :-)
<kklimonda> geser: copying build/lib.linux-i686-2.6/mercurial/base85.so -> /build/buildd/mercurial-1.2.1/debian/tmp/usr/local/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/mercurial - they go here and then aren't in resulting package at all.
<geser> right
<kklimonda> geser: and because of that /usr/bin/hg has python2.5 hardcoded as interpreter
<davideotape> pochu: Okay. So where about are descriptions translated for ubuntu then?
<pochu> davideotape: ddtp in Debian
<davideotape> pochu: So that bug is one that would need to be fixed in debian, and passed downstream?
<pochu> davideotape: you should check if the typo is in Debian, and if so, the answer is yes
<pochu> I think there's something similar to ddtp in Ubuntu, but am not sure what it is
<davideotape> pochu: Thanks, I'll go and have a look now :)
<geser> kklimonda: thanks, uploaded (with one additional change)
<pochu> kklimonda: a FTBFS in Ubuntu that doesn't happen in Debian isn't a serious bug in Debian (re mercurial)
<kklimonda> pochu: heh, my bad - I though about it too late.
<pochu> you can still lower it :)
<DktrKranz> pochu, at least for now :)=
<pochu> DktrKranz: and hopefully not for a long time :-)
 * DktrKranz accepts bets
<mib_oujn9hi1> hey can anyone help me create a simple meta package
<kklimonda> pochu: can I send an email with Severity: minor in first line and then comment? debian bts is really confusing sometimes.. ;)
<DktrKranz> kklimonda, send one with severity bugnumber wishlist to control@bugs.debian.org instead
<pochu> or use the 'bts' command :)
<kklimonda> yeah, it's much easier :)
<goshawk> hi
<goshawk> there is a problem with this package
<goshawk> http://packages.ubuntu.com/karmic/mercurial
<goshawk> i can't install on karmic
<goshawk> due to dependency error
<goshawk> python < 2.6
<goshawk> but debian/control says : +Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Depends}, ${python:Depends}, ucf (>= 2.0020),
<goshawk> + mercurial-common (= ${source:Version})
<cody-somerville> goshawk, Whats your question exactly?
<goshawk> have python been updated recently that a recompile of mercurial is needed?
<pochu> goshawk: the fix has already been uploaded
<pochu> what version of mercurial are you trying to install?
<goshawk> mercurial (1.2.1-3
<goshawk> official from karmic
<goshawk> i'm in karmic
<pochu> goshawk: 1.2.1-3ubuntu1 fixes it
<pochu> so just wait until it appears in your mirror
<goshawk> oki :)
<goshawk> pochu: as long as you know, was it just a recompiling problem or a probem in the control or rules (i'm the one that filled the sync for that package, this is why i wanna know)
<goshawk> *sync bug
<pochu> goshawk: it needed some adjustements to build with 2.6
<goshawk> pochu: thx
<siretart> FYI: I've just uploaded debian's mplayer uploaded to ubuntu
<aravindoo> hello everyone
<aravindoo> i am new. how do i join motu
<hyperair> !motu
<ubottu> motu is short for Masters of the Universe. The brave souls who maintain the packages in the Universe section of Ubuntu. See  http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
<Laney> there's a getting involved link in the topic
<aravindoo> thank for info guys
<hyperair> have fun
<thjc> Hi all, I am working on packaging a new library (gearbox) for ubuntu. The library uses cmake and produces a python extension, however doesnt use distutils
<thjc> I am on good terms with the developers so can get changes made to the build system, what is the recommended way of dealing with python extensions with cmake?
<hyperair> er. use their build system?
<hyperair> actually the recommended way of dealing with python extensions is using distutils
<hyperair> i suggest you drop by #debian-python and ask the guys there
<hyperair> in OFTC, by the way
<thjc> okay will do
<kklimonda> When I'm updating package in ubuntu and, between time I have prepared debdiff and it was sponsored by developer, new version is released can I keep in changelog entry about previous one that didn't make it to ubuntu?
<kklimonda> I keep changes in bzr repository so reverting it because update didn't happen is going to be pain in the ass.. ;)
 * LarstiQ would keep the changelog entries
<LarstiQ> but I don't see how having it version controlled is making it _harder_
<kklimonda> no harder, just more work - i would have to revert a commit ;)
<LarstiQ> kklimonda: no?
<kklimonda> why not?
<ScottK> kklimonda: No.  Debian/changelog should be the history of the package in the archive.
<ScottK> You needed revert, just merge the changes in and then re-edit your changelog.
<ScottK> needed/needn't.
<LarstiQ> ScottK: which archive though?
<ScottK> The Ubuntu one (or Debian/Ubuntu in the case of packages we get from Debian and modify).
 * ScottK observes the Ubuntu is the distro we are working on here ....
<LarstiQ> ScottK: the latter case is tricky
<ScottK> LarstiQ: Not at all.  We have well established tools for the merge process.
<LarstiQ> nevermind
<ScottK> OK.  Obviously we aren't communicating very well.
<ScottK> If you care to discuss it, it's fine with me.
<LarstiQ> ScottK: you make a valid point, it's just that I'm not included
<LarstiQ> so I'll do the right thing and leave this channel, as I should have before
<LarstiQ> ScottK: I'm fine with discussin it somewhere else
<ScottK> LarstiQ: I certainly didn't intend to say anything that would cause you to leave.
<LarstiQ> ScottK: no worries
<LarstiQ> ScottK: would /query be ok with you?
<e-jat> can some one verify this : http://tinyurl.com/q6cm5l
<ScottK> LarstiQ: If you really feel  it's needed.  OK.
<kklimonda> e-jat: link is broken
<e-jat> yups .. proposed repo broken right ?
<kklimonda> no, the link to the post is broken
<ScottK> YokoZar: I thought you'd be interested in http://ariya.blogspot.com/2009/06/how-to-get-spotify-running-on-opensuse.html
<YokoZar> ScottK: thanks
<ScottK> no problem.
<LarstiQ> ScottK: thanks, and cheers
 * LarstiQ goes back to #bzr
<c_korn> can anyone explain me why this build fails? http://launchpadlibrarian.net/27625080/buildlog_ubuntu-jaunty-i386.vlc_1.0.0~rc3-1~ppa1~jaunty1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<soren> c_korn: Because libvlccore2 stopped provinding a unescape_URI function?
<c_korn> soren: so I just have to delete those two lines from the symbols file?
<soren> c_korn: Err...
<soren> c_korn: Not exactly.
<soren> c_korn: I mean.. Yes, that will make the build succeed again, but if something is actually using that symbol, you're screwed.
<c_korn> (as I see the symbols have been removed upstream http://git.videolan.org/?p=vlc.git;a=commit;h=2341f8bbc23622d0d8b8a511b7cc745d20beb878 )
<soren> If it was never used externally and only exported by accident or whatnot, you're probably fine.
<pochu> cool - http://af.reuters.com/article/oddlyEnoughNews/idAFTRE55623320090607
<directhex> pochu, sadly it sounds like the BNP have some seats too
<pochu> not everything can be perfect...
#ubuntu-motu 2010-06-07
<Laney> mk-sbuild chroots seem to be very far from minimal
<Laney> just noticed subversion being installed in a lenny one
<funkyHat> I've posted a version bump debdiff which fixes mpd: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mpd/+bug/588253
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 588253 in mpd (Ubuntu) "mpd: error while loading shared libraries: libavcodec.so.52" [Undecided,New]
<cpscotti> Hey everyone, whats next for a SRU with verification-done? just waiting? ( bug 480772 )
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 480772 in harpia (Ubuntu Lucid) "OpenCV 2 incompatibilities" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/480772
<darkwing-netbook> Question... is packaging for GNOME (Ubuntu) and KDE (Kubuntu) The same? I want to learn and I and KDE/Kubuntu user so as I take my journey I want to learn the KDE side if there is a difference
<ScottK> cpscotti: Is it tagged 'verification-done'?  If so, then it's just a question of it having had enough age in proposed and then it will get copied to updates.
<om26er> I have made an upload to revu should I subscribe ubuntu sponsers?
<om26er> * to the bug report
<dupondje> om26er: what bug # ?
<om26er> bug 590048
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 590048 in Ubuntu "[needs packaging] gnome-global-menu" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/590048
<dupondje> think it should just be on REVU
<dupondje> not totally sure neither :)
<YokoZar> ScottK: ugh so it appears that somehow we ended up with two versions of spring in the lucid archive
<ScottK> YokoZar: Oops.
<ScottK> How so?
<YokoZar> ScottK: I think one was synced from debian ("spring") and the other was the upgrade of the one I made ("spring-engine")
<\sh> ScottK, I just dist-upgraded to lucid yesterday, since then my dovecot sieve stuff is not working anymore...(not it's not the plugin s/cmusieve/sieve/ problem) and I can't see anything in the logfiles...any clue where I can have look to determine the problem?
<ScottK> \sh: No.  That's the only issue I've heard of.  I'd ping ivoks when he's around.  He knows it better than I do.
<ScottK> YokoZar: What's the state of spring/spring-engine relative to each other?
<\sh> YokoZar, talk to ttx.. because I wanted to work on integrating spring into ubuntu for the ehcache stuff
<\sh> s/I/he == ttx/
<ScottK> \sh: Are you sure it's the same spring?
<YokoZar> ScottK: lucid version of spring is unplayable and out of date.  Debian unstable version is up to date.  Lucid spring-engine is playable but one minor version behind debian unstable spring
<\sh> argl..it RTS...hail double names
<YokoZar> right that was one reason why I called it spring-engine to begin with
<\sh> YokoZar, hmmm..then I think the java spring will be named after libspring-<foo>-java ?
<YokoZar> If that makes more sense then yeah
<ScottK> YokoZar: Then my recommendation would be to SRU the Lucid spring to be a dummy package that pulls in spring-engine and then do the reverse in maverick.
<YokoZar> ScottK: Yeah that was my thought
<ScottK> Then get spring-engine source removed in Maverick.
<ScottK> We'll have to carry a diff until after then next LTS, but that's unavoidable now.
<YokoZar> Well it was unavoidable when debian chose a different package name really
<YokoZar> we'd always have to have the dummy package
<ttx> \sh: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libspring-2.5-java
<\sh> ttx, yes...aren't there any binaries for spring java still?
<ttx> \sh: "Missing build dependencies: libtiles-java"
<\sh> ScottK, FAILED /etc/dovecot/conf.d/01-dovecot-postfix.conf overwrote my dovecot.conf settings
<ScottK> You had a file called /etc/dovecot/conf.d/01-dovecot-postfix.conf?
<\sh> ScottK, no I haden't my old config was in dovecot.conf
<ScottK> Then it didn't overwrite it.
<\sh> ScottK, but now installed dovecot-postfix created one 01-dovecot-postfix.conf and this overwrote the settings in dovecot.conf it seems
<ScottK> It may have over-ridden it ....
<\sh> because in it is still cmusieve
<\sh> which is wrong
<ScottK> We did an SRU to fix the sieve naming problem in dovecot-postfix.
<\sh> ScottK, is it sill in proposed?
<ScottK> Is it still in -proposed maybe?
<ScottK> Heh.
<ScottK> I'd say have a look.
<ScottK> (it's very late here)
<maco2> live lock on answers from each other now?
<\sh> ScottK, still in proposed
<ScottK> \sh: Give it a try and then mark it verified if it works.
<dholbach> good morning
<eric_> when is next revu motu meeting day?
<kaushal> hi
<kaushal> can some one here help me with my post on https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-server/2010-June/004279.html ?
<soren> kaushal: Did you read xtables-addons-common's package description?
<kaushal> soren: is there a way to uninstall iptables ?
<kaushal> I mean source
<soren> Just delete it.
<kaushal> where do i look for it ?
<soren> You put it there.
<kaushal> soren: i deleted it
<soren> Then it's gone.
<soren> this conversation is silly.
<kaushal> soren: apologies
<kaushal> I did that still it refers to iptables v1.4.4: Couldn't load match `ipp2p':/usr/local/libexec/xtables/libipt_ipp2p.so: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
<kaushal> wierd
<soren> You did what?
<kaushal> I did apt-get purge iptables xtables-addons-common
<kaushal> and reinstalled it
<soren> Well, you clearly installed some other version of iptables in /usr/local
<kaushal> yeah
<soren> You probably want to get rid of that.
<kaushal> yes
<kaushal> soren: is there a way to remove it completely
<soren> kaushal: You could rm the files completely. Incidentally, "rm" is short for remove.
<dholbach> Adri2000: are you still working on bug 366532? somebody in #debian-ubuntu just asked me about the bug
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 366532 in Merge-o-Matic "Please don't list xbuildy packages on merges.ubuntu.com" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/366532
<kaushal> soren: i deleted it completely
<kaushal> now the error i get is -bash: /usr/local/sbin/iptables: No such file or directory
<kaushal> when i ran iptables -m ipp2p --help
<Rhonda> kaushal: I think your question is better suited in #ubuntu, actually.  But a "rehash" should help you.
<Rhonda> hmm, or what that is called.
<kaushal> Rhonda: i did hash ldconfig
<Rhonda> It's iptables that gives you troubles, not ldconfig. Just restart your shell session will get rid of the message too, and those questions are still better suited in #ubuntu.
<kaushal> sure
<kaushal> Rhonda: Thanks
<kaushal> Rhonda: i rebooted the box
<kaushal> still no luck
<Rhonda> kaushal: I'm sorry but I won't continue this in here because this clearly is the wrong channel for your question, see #ubuntu instead for end-user trouble shooting. Sorry.
<kaushal> Rhonda: ok
<xteejx> Hey guys, I'm messing around trying to package stuff for Ubuntu, more of a "learn to use my packaging skills" thing. Does it make a difference whether it is packaged for Ubuntu or Debian? i.e. can I package something purely for Ubuntu, and does it go over to Debian anyway or is that nothing to worry about?
<Rhonda> xteejx: There is nothing going over to Debian, the workflow only does the other direction. Out of curiosity, why don't you want to have it in Debian?
<xteejx> Rhonda: There's no reason, its just that the documentation for packaging for Ubuntu seems to be easier to follow
<xteejx> I don't know how to package for Debian, barely even Ubuntu but getting there
<Rhonda> It shouldn't be any difference, actually. :)
<xteejx> Oh :)
<Rhonda> If the package is proper for Ubuntu it should be proper for Debian too, lintian has only minor differences in Debian and Ubuntu.
<xteejx> Oh cool, I've had no lintian errors or anything
<Rhonda> And the policy isn't derived in relevant parts from what I know.
<xteejx> That's handy then. So it's just a small change in the changelog really to reflect debian instead?
<Rhonda> Usually yes. I think there is minor difference in the control file too.
<Rhonda> Debian usually just uses Maintainer: field and nothing more in that respect that ubuntu does.
<xteejx> One other question sorry for being a pain: Is it Ok to use dpatch with a single patch to change the Makefile? (I don't seem to be able to make the PREFIX bit work on its own)
<xteejx> Oh that's good then :)
<Rhonda> Oh, you aren't a pain. :)  And actually I'd settle for quilt instead of dpatch, but yes, using patches is a good thing instead of changing directly.
<Rhonda> Some people would even suggest to you to use source format 3.0 (quilt) right ahead.
<xteejx> Is there any documentation for quilt at all? (I have googled but its a bit mumbo jumbo dpatch seems dead easy)
<xteejx> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Howtos/Quilt found something :)
<xteejx> Is anyone able to take a look at my debian/rules and Makefile please I think I've got it right but not totally sure http://paste.ubuntu.com/446080/ http://paste.ubuntu.com/446081/
<xteejx> Anyone at all? Please :)
<tumbleweed> xteejx: you can use "dh" for a much shorter debian/rules
<xteejx> tumbleweed: How do you mean?
<tumbleweed> you can use "install" instead of copy + chmod
<tumbleweed> and instead of mkdir
<xteejx> But that's what the upstream Makefile does I'm confused
<tumbleweed> xteejx: oh, don't modify upstream makefile if you don't have to. I assume you pasted it because you wrote it
<xteejx> Oh lol nope :)
<xteejx> I ermmm nicked it for packaging it seemed a simple perl script would be easier to package for a first go than something complex :)
<tumbleweed> xteejx: /usr/share/debhelper/dh_make/debians/rules is an example
<tumbleweed> man dh for more
<xteejx> tumbleweed: It's just dh $@   - what will that do?
<sommer> morning
<tumbleweed> xteejx: that calls dh with the rule name as a parameter
<tumbleweed> man dh to see what it does then
<xteejx> ok thanks
<tumbleweed> xteejx: see http://kitenet.net/~joey/blog/entry/debhelper_dh_overrides/ for some more advanced usage
<tumbleweed> (or look at packages using it)
<carstenh> xteejx: if you don't like the short rules file just don't use it. there is nothing wrong with a longer one, although yours could be cleaned up
<tumbleweed> and you have to understand what's going on in the longhand version to understand dh
<xteejx> I understand the Makefile, dh is the problem
<tumbleweed> xteejx: dh just calls all the debhelper scripts one would normally call, in the right order
<tumbleweed> and it can correctly build some of the most common build methods without any configuration
<BlackZ> xteejx: I'd replace PREFIX ?= /usr/local with PREFIX ?= /usr
<tumbleweed> BlackZ: that was the upstream Makefile
<BlackZ> tumbleweed: well, I think /usr/local should be replaced by /usr
<tumbleweed> BlackZ: that can be passed on the make command line
<tumbleweed> i.e. make PREFIX=/usr
<BlackZ> tumbleweed: sure
<xteejx> yeah I tried that with the package itself "make PREFIX=/usr" and it looked fine
<BlackZ> xteejx: yeah, that works
<xteejx> I think that's the only difference from the Makefile really, just how to put it into a rules
<tumbleweed> xteejx: btw it's hard to evaluate your package just from the rules file. upload it to revu if you want decent feedback
<BlackZ> tumbleweed: why revu and not in debian instead?
<BlackZ> it'd have a lot of benefits
<tumbleweed> BlackZ: oh, definitly, assuming xteejx is keen
<xteejx> I'm keen :)
<tumbleweed> xteejx: mentors.debian.net
<BlackZ> xteejx: read http://wiki.debian.org/Utnubu
<BlackZ> it could help you too
<xteejx> utnubu lol
<tumbleweed> or probably more relevant https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Debian/ForUbuntuDevelopers
<BlackZ> tumbleweed: what I have linked is the more simple, considering xteejx is still learning
<BlackZ> s/what/the one
<tumbleweed> BlackZ: that page is all about ubuntu for debian people. I don't seet hta much relevance
<xteejx> So upload the package to debian mentors and have it reviewed then? Or revu?
<BlackZ> xteejx: I'd suggest mentors.debian.net first
<tumbleweed> xteejx: if you can, get it through debian first. No need to duplicate effort
<BlackZ> but if you prefer REVU, go ahead
<BlackZ> the fact is that if you will get your work into debian it will be synced with ubuntu and the other debian-derivates
<xteejx> I suppose if it was Ubuntu only, if someone in deb packaged it mine would get removed
<BlackZ> so that would give more benefits
<xteejx> never used revu by the way so either is fine with me :)
<xteejx> http://wiki.debian.org/HowToPackageForDebian seems more readable on most things
<tumbleweed> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide is also useful. But be aware - lots of guides on these topics are out of date
<xteejx> that's cool I've already went through that one anyway :)
<RunePhilosof> ajmitch, Is there something more I can do to speed up the sru process for bug 528957 (button clicks not detected)?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 528957 in libsdl1.2 (Ubuntu Lucid) "mouse button clicks not detected in windowed mode" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/528957
<ari-tczew> cody-somerville: do you will merge xchat?
<cody-somerville> I can
<ari-tczew> cody-somerville: nice
<cody-somerville> ari-tczew, If you're interested in doing it, please feel free to go ahead though
<ari-tczew> cody-somerville: hmm, so, I'll try do it, if I won't got time or my work will fails, then I'll ask you for merge okay?
<cody-somerville> ari-tczew, okay
<ari-tczew> can I clean /var/cache/pbuilder/result by any command?
<sebner> ari-tczew: wouldn't it make more sense to wait for 2.8.8 to appear in Debian?
<arand> ari-tczew: I think rm ./* is the way things go..
<ari-tczew> sebner: I want to have a clean merge, now we have ubuntu5 revision. and we dunno when Debian will release 2.8.8 version
<ari-tczew> I've reported to bug tracking a new upstream release a few days ago
<sebner> ari-tczew: bug them :P
<sebner> ari-tczew: *directly*
<ari-tczew> ^^
<ari-tczew> sebner: what "directly" ?
<sebner> ari-tczew: catch them in irc
<ari-tczew> arand: I asked for command
<ari-tczew> sebner: are you lazy? :>
<sebner> ari-tczew: hm?
<ari-tczew> sebner: wiki
<sebner> ari-tczew: have you sent me a mail? :P
<ari-tczew> I've forgotten email you yesterday
<sebner> ;)
<arand> ari-tczew: I was simply saying "there doesn't seem to be one"..
<dupondje> doing some merges again :)
<dupondje> hrhr :p
<sebner> ari-tczew: I'll write something today, promised
<ari-tczew> arand: ok
<ari-tczew> dupondje: what do you think about fix some security issues?
<dupondje> like ?
<ari-tczew> example
<ari-tczew> are you interested?
<dupondje> maby yea :) if its not that hard
<ari-tczew> dupondje: you should get to know fixing security issues if you're interested in MOTU
<dupondje> fine, you have an example where I can start ?
<ari-tczew> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/UpdateProcedures
 * micahg didn't think security fixes were part of MOTU
<jdstrand> they sure can be
<highvoltage> micahg: who else would do them for universe :)
<ari-tczew> open bugs are available on https://bugs.launchpad.net/~motu-swat
<jdstrand> I would encourage anyone wanting to contribute to universe to look at open security issues
 * ari-tczew +1 for jdstrand
 * micahg was referring to not required for becoming MOTU, not as in good to do
<dupondje> thats a nice list ... :)
<ari-tczew> of course all CVEs are available on Ubuntu CVE Tracker http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/ but I think that we should fix security issues by importance and reports
<ari-tczew> I disagree with micahg. I think that fixing security issues should be a part of MOTU work
<micahg> ari-tczew: I'm not disagreeing with that
<jdstrand> ari-tczew: well, I don't think micahg expressed an opinion, just current state
<micahg> ari-tczew: I'm just saying that I didn't think it was *required* for becoming a MOTU
<jdstrand> I too think it should be part of MOTU
<ari-tczew> micahg: so current state, ok
<ari-tczew> I think that this was a language barrer
<micahg> ari-tczew: +1
<ari-tczew> :)
<dupondje> so ari-tczew, pick one of https://bugs.launchpad.net/~motu-swat list ?
<ari-tczew> dupondje: I'll be glad
<dupondje> damn, some seem to be extremely old
<dupondje> and some have already patches :)
<ari-tczew> dupondje: yea, but you should check these patches in upstream
<ari-tczew> there are a channel for security  #ubuntu-hardened
<ari-tczew> and I'm open for questions
<xteejx> Question: If a source tarball has a directory Name-x.y-src can we change it to name-x.y when packaging it (even though this is changing the source)?
<slytherin> xteejx: yes you can
<xteejx> slytherin: Cool thanks :)
<slytherin> xteejx: your .orig.tar.gz should have the directory in name-x.y format
<xteejx> slytherin: The source tarball doesn't really matter then? Or keep that the same to it can be diff'd properly?
<slytherin> It is acceptable to repack source tarball for cases like this.
<xteejx> Oh Ok that saves messing around then hehe thanks slytherin :)
<tumbleweed> dpkg-source doesn't care about the root directory in the .orig.tar.gz
<tumbleweed> it can be called anything, as long as there is only one root-level item
<Adri2000> dholbach: no I'm not
<dupondje> ari-tczew: http://dupondje.be/asterisk.debdiff
<dholbach> Adri2000: ok :/
<ari-tczew> dupondje: could you give me a bug number?
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/dapper/+source/asterisk/+bug/173610
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Ubuntu: list.index(x): x not in list (https://launchpad.net/bugs/173610)
<dupondje> ah well :)
<dupondje> and ari-tczew  :)
<ari-tczew> dupondje: wait 5 minutes okay?
<dupondje> fine :)
<dupondje> take your time
<ari-tczew> dupondje: do you plan using bazaar instead debdiffs?
<dupondje> ari-tczew: never used bazaar ...
<dupondje> but can't be that hard ? :)
<ari-tczew> dupondje: I thought that this is hard, but not! you're downloading source by command: bzr branch
<ari-tczew> upload by: bzr push
 * tumbleweed still finds mom quicker than the UDD equivalent
<ari-tczew> dupondje: I'll review your patch, if it will be good, then I'll teach you to use bzr
<ari-tczew> can I got .deb files generated by pbuilder?
<tumbleweed> ari-tczew: /var/cache/pbuilder/result
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: doesn't exist :/
<ari-tczew> .deb file of course doesn't exist
<tumbleweed> ari-tczew: are you using the standard .pbuilderrc where you specify DIST?
<tumbleweed> then it would be /var/cache/pbuilder/maverick-amd64/result
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: I use command $ sudo pbuilder-dist maverick build
<tumbleweed> hmm never used that
<tumbleweed>        By  default, pbuilder-dist will store all the files it generates in ~/pbuilder/. This can be changed by setting
<tumbleweed> ... from pbuilder-dist(1)
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: it's exist, thanks! you have a beer from me
<tumbleweed> lol
<dupondje> mmm beer :)
<ari-tczew> ~/pbuilder/maverick_result
<ari-tczew> dupondje: you will get a more beer from me if you help me to clear bug list on ~motu-swat :)
<dupondje> to bad
<dupondje> i'll have to cook :P
<ari-tczew> dupondje: some comments from me about your patch, have you got a time right now?
<dupondje> sure
<ari-tczew> dupondje: well, the line SECURITY UPDATE should be shorten. before http references you should put a "-"
<ari-tczew> like in merges: first "*", below "-"
<ari-tczew> CVE's number too have to start with -
<ari-tczew> dupondje: look at bug 322196
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: list.index(x): x not in list (https://launchpad.net/bugs/322196)
<ari-tczew> click on bzr diff, this is my patch. please look
<dupondje> hmz ari-tczew all the previous changelog entries of asterisk doesn't have - in front ...
<dupondje> thats why I did it like that
<ari-tczew> dupondje: I see, but please put as I propose to you
<ari-tczew> latest upload in asterisk dapper was in 2007, long time ago
<dupondje> I see, i'l fix
<ari-tczew> also, I don't see patch description
<ari-tczew> please follow with https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/PatchTaggingGuidelines
<ari-tczew> also you can look on my patch (bug number is above ^^ ) as example for security update. as you saw, ACK without problems
<dupondje> http://ubuntu.dupondje.be/asterisk2.debdiff
<ari-tczew> dupondje: better, better! progress. but please in debian/changelog, please do [enter] after "Detail" word, then white spaces until word "Record" will be under "SECURITY". then will be looks clearly
<ari-tczew> dupondje: and rename file patch.CVE-2007-6170.dpatch to CVE-2007-6170.dpatch I don't see a reason for have this filename
<ubottu> SQL injection vulnerability in the Call Detail Record Postgres logging engine (cdr_pgsql) in Asterisk 1.4.x before 1.4.15, 1.2.x before 1.2.25, B.x before B.2.3.4, and C.x before C.1.0-beta6 allows remote authenticated users to execute arbitrary SQL commands via (1) ANI and (2) DNIS arguments. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2007-6170)
<ubottu> SQL injection vulnerability in the Call Detail Record Postgres logging engine (cdr_pgsql) in Asterisk 1.4.x before 1.4.15, 1.2.x before 1.2.25, B.x before B.2.3.4, and C.x before C.1.0-beta6 allows remote authenticated users to execute arbitrary SQL commands via (1) ANI and (2) DNIS arguments. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2007-6170)
<ari-tczew> dupondje: your CVE's patch still needs to got a description https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/PatchTaggingGuidelines -> http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep3/ you can look on my patches
<dupondje> http://ubuntu.dupondje.be/asterisk3.debdiff
<ari-tczew> dupondje: I'm going on dinner, you're free and go cooking :)
<dupondje> ok chief ;)
<ari-tczew> I'll leave a message
<ari-tczew> dupondje: I have to go out right now. I'll review your 3rd patch later.
<RoAkSoAx> micahg: did you file the bug for testdrive?
<micahg> RoAkSoAx: no, I was going to SRU in your bug
<micahg> RoAkSoAx: are there specific commits that I can pull to make an SRU?
<dupondje> asac: you there ?
<RoAkSoAx> micahg: just the support for vbox3.2 right?
<micahg> RoAkSoAx: yep
<RoAkSoAx> micahg: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~testdrive/testdrive/trunk/revision/245 though the packaging change has not yet been pushed to the trunk
<micahg> RoAkSoAx: perfect, thank you, if you want, I can prepare the SRU
<dupondje> somebody can help me with a MIR ?
<micahg> RoAkSoAx: oh, right, we need to push the packaging change to maverick first
<micahg> RoAkSoAx: so, should I just make a debdiff?
<micahg> RoAkSoAx: unless you want to just push it, it's just | virtualbox-3.2 in control
<ScottK> dupondje: What kind of help?
<dupondje> ScottK: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libutempter/+bug/589103
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 589103 in libutempter (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libutempter" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<dupondje> Include the rationale and description of the violations of UbuntuMainInclusionRequirements, and a confirmation that you checked the requirements carefully.
<dupondje> tought I did it ...
<ScottK> dupondje: List all the items 1 - 9 in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuMainInclusionRequirements in the bug.
<dupondje> ScottK: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libutempter/+bug/589103 better ? :)
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 589103 in libutempter (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libutempter" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<ScottK> dupondje: Much.
<dupondje> asac: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libutempter/+bug/589103 :)
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 589103 in libutempter (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libutempter" [Undecided,New]
<dupondje> feel free
<ScottK> asac: Don't forget about gpsd ....  I never heard back from lool on it.
<BlackZ> please, sponsor bug #590481
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 590481 in hostname (Ubuntu) "Please merge hostname 3.04 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/590481
<dupondje> BlackZ: thats something for -devel
<dupondje> main package ..
<BlackZ> I think here are some core developers ;)
<hyperair> it's off-topic here ;-)
<BlackZ> OK hyperair sorry, asking in the -devel channel
<dupondje> anyway if you added ubuntu-sponsors it should be ok :)
 * hyperair agrees
<hyperair> i wish there was a way to filter out just the packages that i can upload =\
<hyperair> i used to regularly check the uus queue, but now that it's been merged with ums, it's kind of hard to figure out which packages you can and cannot sponsor
<micahg> hyperair: well, CTRL + F on the sponsors page :)
<geser> hyperair: go for core-dev :)
<hyperair> =(
<hyperair> micahg: what do you expect me to do, ctrl+f each of the... god knows how many packages there are in universe?
<ScottK> Sounds like a great task for a new script in ubuntu-dev-tools
<micahg> hyperair: sorry, I was about to look at the page, there was a new version that made it easier to tell what one could upload
<hyperair> lol ScottK.
<ScottK> Not kidding.
<micahg> hyperair: would unseeded count?
<hyperair> ScottK: i'm more inclined towards launchpad.net button^Wfilter
<hyperair> micahg: i think so.
<micahg> hyperair: http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/
<ScottK> hyperair: Yes, but guess which is easier to get done sooner ...
<hyperair> hmm has that been updated?
<dupondje> I can't sponsor :p
<dupondje> hyperair: yes
<hyperair> i remember that list being hopelessly outdated, *and* still sticking seeded packages in.
<dupondje> Last updated at: Mon, 07 Jun 2010 20:26:25 +0100
<hyperair> ScottK: like syncpackage, eh?
<ScottK> Sure.
<dupondje> hyperair: if you feel bored: https://launchpad.net/bugs/590820, https://launchpad.net/bugs/590831
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 590820 in debian-med (Ubuntu) "Please merge debian-med 1.6 (universe) from debian unstable" [Undecided,New]
<hyperair> eh no, i'm not bored =p
<dupondje> https://launchpad.net/bugs/589908
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 589908 in synce-kpm (Ubuntu) "Fix FTBFS due to changed Python options" [Undecided,New]
<dupondje> there is enough of review stuff :D
<hyperair> i'll start looking at them once my btrfs woes are over.
<hyperair> or otherwise temporarily stalled.
<dupondje> exotic filesystems :)
<ScottK> dupondje: I just put a comment in 589908 that I think we should hold off on uploading it for now.  Let's see if we get the fix for free from Debain via sync first.
<dupondje> ok
<dupondje> there is an upstream bug, so it should be possible :)
<ScottK> I'm pretty sure the guy that filed it will NMU the package if the maintainer doesn't respond.
<dupondje> I keep an eye on it
<hyperair> dupondje: yes, very exotic ;-)
<dupondje> SynCE is outdated since karmic or so, its nice to have 0.15 now
<dupondje> :)
<dupondje> hyperair: xfs feels exotic also sometimes
<dupondje> xfs_check doesn't even work if you don't have tons of memory :P
<cpscotti> Hey any archive admin with some time to check a SRU with fix-commited and verification-done (10 days old) (bug 480772 ) Is there something else to do? Or waiting is enough?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 480772 in harpia (Ubuntu Lucid) "OpenCV 2 incompatibilities" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/480772
<ari-tczew> dupondje: ping
<lool> ScottK: Saw the gpsd ping, but didn't get a chance to have a look, dont have much time for MIRs right now
<lool> ScottK: If you'd find another MIR reviewer in the mean time, that might work better
<ScottK> asac: ^^^
<ScottK> lool: Thanks.
<ari-tczew> lool: do you maintain libsmbios in Debian?
#ubuntu-motu 2010-06-08
<stevecrozz> i'm thinking about filing a 'needs packaging' issue for uwsgi (which I maintain in my ppa). I've never done this before, so what steps should I be taking now to get my package into both debian and ubuntu with the least pain?
<dholbach> good morning
<ari-tczew> RoAkSoAx: I sent an e-mail to you. Please check.
<ari-tczew> dupondje: pong to me if you will be able to talk
<lool> ari-tczew: I dont maintain libsmbios, I'm listed as an uploader because I sponsored it
<lool> ari-tczew: who-uploads libsmbios > 2.0.3.dfsg-1 to unstable: LoÃ¯c Minier (lool) <lool@debian.org>
<lool> ari-tczew: I dont even have hardware to test it AFAIK
<ari-tczew> lool: so you can't pack a new upstream release?
<lool> ari-tczew: package in Debian or Ubuntu?  I could if I get some testers
<ari-tczew> lool: Debian. I've packed new upstream of libsmbios, but it's in queue for Ubuntu
<ari-tczew> lool: hmm, so, would you like to sponsor my package, then forward to Debian?
<lool> ari-tczew: I could review the packaging changes and tell you whether these look ok, I'd need some testing of the final source package in each distro before uploading it
<lool> I dont care that you test binaries that I build, but I do care that we test binaries built in each environment
<karyo> hello
<karyo> can I get some advice?
<funkyHat> !ask | probably applies here
<ubottu> probably applies here: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
<karyo> thx. I'm new to all this IRC stuff :->
<karyo> I'd like to contribute to Ubuntu. I have some experience with ubuntu, have been reading a lot about gnu/linux/distros, have a lot of general knowledge on computers and programming but little skill
<karyo> I want to join a team. I think triagers/motu would be nice to start. what do you think?
<funkyHat> karyo: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted would be a good place to start reading if you're interested in packaging
<karyo> should I be? I found that packaging had a bit steep learning curve especially for debian/dpkg. I was starting to think that maybe I might not be able to contribute anything meaningful. Is it really hard as I think it is?
<porthose> karyo, if you want to triage bugs #ubuntu-bugs is the place to be https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad
<funkyHat> ugh. bzr merge-package just completely failed at even attempting to merge mpd's init script.
<karyo> thx porthose. what I really want to know is which is easier? I really think I should get more experience, but I'm not sure what should be my first step.
<porthose> karyo, bugs would be a good place to start, it really depends on what interests you :)
<karyo> well, I'm mainly interested in localization. I'm already involved in translating ubuntu/related projects to my native language, and found that there are a lot of issues non-english ubuntu versions face. I'm not sure how or if i can effectively handle such issues.
<funkyHat> I filed a bug about mpd crashing, and a debdiff to fix it, but I've noticed there's a newer version in squeeze so I'm merging that
<funkyHat> I guess I should mark my initial bug as invalid?
<lfaraone_> There is a problem ("GDM crashes after selecting the "Sugar" desktop")for which there is a well-known fix that I have tested myself, and have committed to the upstream Debian packaging repository. I'm waiting for an upload of the fix to unstable. Can I SRU the fix to Lucid before it's uploaded to Unstable without creating an Ubuntu delta in Maverick?
<lfaraone_> (I have the upload privlages)
<lfaraone_> jdong, slangasek, ^^
<funkyHat> I've just done my first merge using bzr. woop. https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mpd/+bug/591307
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 591307 in mpd (Ubuntu) "request to merge mpd 0.15.9-2 from debian testing" [Undecided,New]
<slangasek> lfaraone_: SRUing to lucid doesn't automatically affect whether there's a delta in maverick.  We *can* copy SRUs from lucid to maverick after they've built, but can be asked not to.  What's the package?
<funkyHat> oops... forgot to assign to myself before subscribing universe sponsors... I hope that doesn't create unnecessary noise
<ari-tczew> requestsync has failed: /usr/bin/requestsync:31: DeprecationWarning: please use 'debian' instead of 'debian_bundle'
<geser> on lucid or on maverick?
<ari-tczew> maverick
<geser> it doesn't work at all because of this warning?
<dutchie> in the course of fiddling with Makefiles and things trying to make mit-scheme build on i386, i saw error messages popping up suggesting to transition 3.0 (quilt). Would this be a good idea?
<ari-tczew> geser: it's only warning. I've completed the bug description, but requestsync fails at the end, during send packets to launchpad
<geser> ari-tczew: did you get any error? it might be an LP API issue, as I've seen many timeouts (503 service unavailable) recently
<ari-tczew> heh I didn't save
<ari-tczew> now I requested sync manually, so requestsync should tell me about duplicate
<ari-tczew> and I can't reproduce bug message
<geser> I'm currently fixing the warning for trunk (thanks for the notice)
<ari-tczew> geser: I'll look for any sync and try again to reproduce bug
<geser> you might be lucky to get it through or trigger an timeout, it's not really predictable or repeatable
<ari-tczew> geser: I think that it's could be a timeout
<carstenh> dutchie: different patch systems in debian and ubuntu for the same package make syncing between these distributions harder
<ari-tczew> geser: is it possible due to long description of bug?
<dutchie> carstenh: there's no patch system at the moment
<dutchie> carstenh: presumably, if I did, it would make more sense to submit it to debian and sync it?
<geser> ari-tczew: I don't know the reasons for the many timeouts recently. I assume they are also the reason for the FTBFS page being out-of-date.
<ari-tczew> geser: is it possible due to DDoS on launchpad?
<carstenh> dutchie: I would just wait until debian switches. people don't like non-functional changes in "their" packages made by other people
<dutchie> carstenh: fair enough
<ari-tczew> geser: that looks bug requested manually, because requestsync has been crashed: bug 591349
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 591349 in chef (Ubuntu) "Sync chef 0.8.16-4 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/591349
<dutchie> http://pastebin.com/T170RhPn :(
<carstenh> debian's mit-scheme does not have this problem?
<dutchie> don't know
<dutchie> (this is after me fiddling with it)
<dutchie> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/48268732/buildlog_ubuntu-maverick-i386.mit-scheme_9.0.1-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz is the build log from the buildds
<geser> etc/create-makefiles.sh: 53: mit-scheme-i386: not found
<dutchie> yes
<dutchie> i fixed that (probably wrongly) by doing MIT_SCHEME_EXE="/usr/bin/mit-scheme-native" ./configure in debian/rules
<geser> did it fix this problem?
<dutchie> it fixed the mit-scheme-i386 not found problem
<dutchie> but no I get the problem I pasted just now
<geser> have you tried contacting the Debian maintainer for help?
<ari-tczew> question to sponsors: who think that package doesn't need to be synced, because package seems to be the same?
<shadeslayer> ari-tczew: not a sponsor,but if version is same in ubuntu and debian,why sync it?
<geser> ari-tczew: have you an example?
<ari-tczew> geser: bug 591342
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 591342 in mistelix (Ubuntu) "Fake sync mistelix 0.31-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/591342
<dutchie> no, not yet. should I?
<shadeslayer> btw anyone know how to package java stuff? please join #ubuntu-packaging :)
<ari-tczew> shadeslayer: because if we'll sync package and Debian will release a new package revision (version), then package will get in Ubuntu automatically
<shadeslayer> ari-tczew: uh.. not true
<geser> dutchie: you could at least try if you are out of ideas what is broken
<ari-tczew> shadeslayer: ?
<shadeslayer> ari-tczew: the package might need a merge or sync depending on the condition whether or not i works as in ubuntu as well
<dutchie> geser: ok, thanks for the pointer
<ari-tczew> shadeslayer: first heard. us job is remove diff between Ubuntu and Debian. are you a sponsor?
<geser> ari-tczew: fakesync because of different md5sum of the .orig.tar.gz?
<ari-tczew> geser: yes
<shadeslayer> ari-tczew: no im not a sponsor :)
<ari-tczew> shadeslayer: I thought
<shadeslayer> geser on the other hand probably is :P
<shadeslayer> ari-tczew: i mentioned it in my first chat ;)
<ari-tczew> shadeslayer: "not a sponsor" heh, not precisely, who "not sponsor"
<shadeslayer> ari-tczew: hehe :P
<ari-tczew> you should write "I'm not a sponsor, but I think that..."
<ari-tczew> geser: have you objections about sync package if packages seems to be almost the same or the same?
<geser> no objections in general
<ari-tczew> fine
<geser> but because this is a fakesync, I'm not sure if it's really worth it
<ari-tczew> geser: really
<geser> I see the benefit of being able to auto-sync in future (when a new upstream version is uploaded). but till then fakesyncs are needed.
<nperry> Hello MOTU, wondered if somone could have a look at xserver-xorg-video-nouveau for maverick, it seems to of failed its last build becuase its still depending on Xserver 1.7
<ari-tczew> x-swat team should help us in xserver
<geser> nperry: there is a Xorg transition in maverick going on right now but I don't know how far it's already done
<nperry> I thought it has been completed
<nperry> Hang on a second, I dont think it should be motu should be talking to shouldn't it be X swat?
<arand> nperry: xserver is in main, so nope, motu are not the ones properly in charge no.
<geser> yes, #ubuntu-x should know better about the Xorg state in maverick right now
<nperry> Sorry my mistake!
<ari-tczew> nperry: Timo Aaltonen is knowledge developer of X packages. you can find him on launchpad
<solarion> what're the units on the disk utility's benchmarking tool's horizontal axis (percentage of what)?
<shadeslayer> geser: btw are all your merges done?
<shadeslayer> i checked yesterday and only 3-4 were left :P
<ari-tczew> shadeslayer: are you looking for work?
<shadeslayer> ari-tczew: hehe.. yes,but i can do it only from friday
<geser> shadeslayer: didn't check recently
<shadeslayer> geser: of the 26 there originally only 3-4 are left in universe :P
<shadeslayer> ari-tczew: basically i know some packaging and am looking at enhancing my knowledge
<geser> there are also some in main
<shadeslayer> geser: if theyre not gone till friday ill have a look :P
<ari-tczew> shadeslayer: maybe you want to get some knowledge in fixing security issues?
<shadeslayer> ari-tczew: hmm... how tough is it? ive been using kubuntu for the past 1.5 years and have packaged some kde apps and help out in packaging KDE, my lp page is : launchpad.net/~rohangarg
<shadeslayer> ari-tczew: so maybe you can guide me with how to proceed :P
<ari-tczew> shadeslayer: sure, but now I'm going to cycling
<ari-tczew> shadeslayer: please read yesterday's logs from this channel
<shadeslayer> ari-tczew: any specific time?
<ari-tczew> I teached dupondje to prepare security fixes
<shadeslayer> thanks :)
<ari-tczew> similiar to now
<ari-tczew> 18-20 UTC +2H
<shadeslayer> ari-tczew: ill just do a search for dupondje
<shadeslayer> ari-tczew: found them :)
<ari-tczew> nice, I'm going on bike, see you
<samliu> hi motu, I was wondering if someone could help me with packaging a java application
<samliu> in particular, open-source liferay, src can be found at http://www.liferay.com/downloads/liferay-portal/additional-files
<samliu> I read all of http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide but I can't seem to make it work -- I can edit the control file and run debuild, I've set up my gpg key but I get a 1.7kb empty deb package
<RainCT> samliu: I'm not familiar with Java packaging, but do you have some particular problem?
<samliu> oh hi Rain, yes I am not sure how to package my application
<samliu> in particular, I'm confused about the whole ./configure make make install thing
<DeeJay1> jono: hi, where I can find more info about https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-m-document-daily-builds ?
<samliu> isnt' that only for C/C++ programs? how do I create an installer for my program, I guess that's my question
<jono> DeeJay1, email dholbach - he can give you all the details
<DeeJay1> jono: ok, will do as I'm really interested in it (as currently I run the daily builds for Emerillon manually )
<jono> DeeJay1, it is really awesome - he can give you the details :-)
<DeeJay1> jono: I've noticed that a few cool things are coming in Launchpad and some nice improvements for Rosetta also (the one thing I still miss in Rosetta is "add comment" function for reviewers)
<RainCT> samliu: Yes, that's only for stuff using autotools.
<RainCT> samliu: In your case it'll be different, depending on what build system your application uses.
<RainCT> samliu: I can't find any info on packaging for Java, so I guess the best would be to look at some similar existing package as example.
<samliu> thanks Rain, I will look into it
<lfaraone_> slangasek: sugar-0.88, but I haven't uploaded it yet.
<slangasek> lfaraone: ok - that package already has a newer version in maverick, so no risk of clobbering anything there anyway
<lfaraone> slangasek: okay, just uploaded, re bug 542338. it'll show up in the queue in a few minutes.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 542338 in sugar-0.88 (Ubuntu) "GDM crashes when Sugar session is selected" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/542338
<funkyHat> Any chance someone could take a look at my merge of mpd? https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mpd/+bug/591307
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 591307 in mpd (Ubuntu) "request to merge mpd 0.15.9-2 from debian testing" [Undecided,New]
 * ajmitch really wishes that the diffs generated for merges were against debian
<slangasek> ajmitch: bzr diff --old lp:debian/sid/$package
<ajmitch> slangasek: right, it's just a bit harder to eyeball a 25k line diff on launchpad
<dupondje> I have a control.in file with @PLUGINS_DESCRIPTION@, where is that fetched from ?
<ajmitch> I'm fetching the branches now & will do that, it just takes more time to check it
<slangasek> oh, on launchpad; I wouldn't attempt to review a bzr branch through the web gui
<slangasek> especially when my very next step would be to download the branch anyway
<ajmitch> I tend to look at the diff on LP to catch any obvious issues before grabbing the branch
<ajmitch> saves time on my abysmally slow connection :)
<slangasek> (need a good way to have local source mirrors of bzr branches though; hmm, maybe I should file a bug on udd about this)
 * ajmitch fetches both ubuntu & debian branches into a shared repository before diffing
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gedit-plugins/+bug/590831 => does the merge look good ? :)
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 590831 in gedit-plugins (Ubuntu) "Merge gedit-plugins 2.30.0-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New]
<dupondje> Riddell: nice going :)
<ajmitch> funkyHat: you seem to have missed the changes to debian/control in the changelog
<funkyHat> ajmitch: I didn't make any changes myself, are they not just a result of the merge?
<lfaraone> slangasek: huh. LP had an older version of the package so it was rejected as being older than the current version in lucid. reuploaded.
 * funkyHat looks
<ajmitch> funkyHat: they are, but you need to list all remaining changes from debian
<ajmitch> see the changelog entry for 0.15.4-1ubuntu1
<funkyHat> ajmitch: oh... silly me
<funkyHat> ajmitch: can I simply amend the changelog, commit and push again, or do I need to do something different?
<ajmitch> apart from that it looks good at a glance, though listing previous changes that are dropped in this upload can be useful, like the patch from upstream
<ajmitch> yes, you can just do that
<funkyHat> done
<ajmitch> funkyHat: given the speed of apt-get update in pbuilder, it may be a little while before I can upload it :)
<funkyHat> ajmitch: â¢)
<Riddell> porthose: ping
<Riddell> porthose: what gives you authority to ack bug 590202 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 590202 in pybliographer (Ubuntu) "Sync pybliographer 1.2.12-3.2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/590202
<ari-tczew> Riddell: what is wrong in above bug ^^ ?
<Riddell> it's been ACKed by porthose but he doesn't seem to be a member of ubuntu-dev
<ajmitch> Riddell: he does upload rights to some packages, iirc
<ajmitch> but I can't recall how that's checked
<geser> Riddell: he is a MOTU (https://edge.launchpad.net/~cjsmo), 3rd badge from left
<geser> and Latest memberships mentions even the date (MOTU since 2010-01-08)
<ajmitch> I didn't think people were still getting added to ~motu, but to ~ubuntu-dev (which he's an indirect member of)
<geser> ubuntu-dev = motu + core-dev + ppu
<Riddell> so ~motu gives you upload rights?
<ari-tczew> Riddell: of course
<ari-tczew> :O
<geser> ~motu gives uploads rights to universe and multiverse
<Riddell> what's the one which is just a membership but doesn't give you upload rights?
<kklimonda> universe contributors
<geser> ~universe-contributors
<Riddell> ah, that's my mistake then
<ajmitch> Riddell: thanks for doing syncs anyway :)
<ajmitch> now that heimdal is in, I can file one for krb5-auth-dialog
<Riddell> but since I'm done with syncs for today it'll probably stay there until my next archive day next week :)
<ajmitch> surely they'll be done more than once a week?
#ubuntu-motu 2010-06-09
<Riddell> maybe or maybe not, depends on the thoroughness of the other archive admins
<ajmitch> or depending on how annoying our nagging is :)
<porthose> Riddell, not sure what you mean?
<Riddell> porthose: all sorted, please ignore :)
<Riddell> siretart: can you ack bug 590219 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 590219 in ffmpeg-extra (Ubuntu) "Remove libavutil-extra-49 from maverick (multiverse)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/590219
<porthose> Riddell, k :)
<lfaraone> If I'm writing a guide for people new to Debian/Ubuntu packaging to teach them how to package a specific type of software that has well-defined ways for operating and being distrubited, would it be acceptable to provide a skeleton akin to what dh_make produces but customized for this class of software?
<james_w> could you teach dh_make how to do the right thing for that class?
<lfaraone> james_w: Possibly. Ideally, I'm trying to make a solution that is akin to "just add water!" (source, description, copyright)
<lfaraone> james_w: it's using CDBS, so it might be rejected as duplication of the existing cdbs option, no?
<james_w> possibly, I don't know
<james_w> depends whether it's something like python, or like "sugar app" I guess?
<james_w> python module I mean
<lfaraone> james_w: sugar app.
<james_w> I don't know if there is a useful distinction, but there may be one to the dh_make maintainer
<james_w> you could ask
<james_w> always better to just have the tool do the right thing IMO
<ajmitch> there are a few separate tools around that do that
<lfaraone> hmmm. dh_make supports templates. this may be the way to go.
<lfaraone> *user supplied.
<lfaraone> ajmitch: like waht?
<ajmitch> like dh-make-php, or similar stuff for CPAN modules
<ajmitch> (which is dh-make-perl)
<ajmitch> I'm not sure if you want to go down that path
<lfaraone> ajmitch: I'd like to implement the simplist solution possible, but nothing simpler.
<Ddorda> hey, i'm looking for an unpackaged program so i can gain experience. is there a list or something?
<ScottK> Ddorda: If you want to gain experience with packaging, fixing bugs and packaging patches is a much better way to do it.
<Ddorda> ScottK: i want to learn how to package a program from zero, i guess that method won't fit for now, but after i'll know more i believe that this is what i'll do
<ScottK> Ddorda: Look for bugs tagged 'needs-packaging' in Launchpad.
<Ddorda> ScottK: oh! thanks! that's i was looking for :)
<artfwo> Hi! Would anyone care to sponsor bug 591528 (main)?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 591528 in libraw1394 (Ubuntu) "FTBFS on all architectures (Maverick)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/591528
<micahg> artfwo: you might have better luck in #ubuntu-devel
<micahg> artfwo: since it's in main
<artfwo> okay, will try there
<ajmitch> artfwo: so it doesn't try & connect to www.oasis-open.org anymore with your patch?
<artfwo> nope
<artfwo> ajmitch, when docbook-xml is installed in the system, docbook-utils no longer try to look for it online
<ajmitch> useful
<ajmitch> I'll upload it once I've built it then
<artfwo> ajmitch, okay, thanks
<siretart> Riddell: AFAIUI, it is a standard NBS job. so in short: yes
<raywang> TheMuso, hi
<raywang> TheMuso, hi, let's talk about it here.
<TheMuso> raywang: ok sure.]
<raywang> TheMuso, ok, thank you for taking your time to review packages. 0.3.2 seems have some bugs, and I plan to have you sponsor 0.3.1 instead, what do you think?
<TheMuso> raywang: Sure, these pacakges won't be going into the Ubuntu archive proper. They will go into the accessibility-dev PPA, and possibly into vinux if the vinux devs want them.
<TheMuso> raywang: At-spi2 will only be considered if its stable enough for every day use, which it seems it is not, so for maverick, we are sticking with at-spi v1.
<raywang> TheMuso, that's good
<raywang> TheMuso, alright, that makes sense, but at least there is somewhere that holds new at-spi2 for the people who wants them. :)
<TheMuso> raywang: Agreed.
<raywang> TheMuso, and do you have some time to write me an Testimonials, I'm applying ubuntu member, and I need your help if you would like to do it. :)
<raywang> TheMuso, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RayWang
<TheMuso> raywang: Unfortunately I haven't see much of what you have been doing in the community, so I am not sure I am in a position to comment.
<raywang> TheMuso, yeah, I see, anyway, thanks all the same. :)
<TheMuso> raywang: np
<lifeless> TheMuso: you can comment on the contributions you're seeing, and development is a contribution
<lifeless> TheMuso: there is the contributing developer concept now :)
<TheMuso> lifeless: I haven't seen anything yet, thats my point.
<lifeless> ah kk
<dholbach> good morning
<abogani2> to you
<ari-tczew> dholbach: I wrote: Ubuntu package has forwarded -> as all package was uploaded in Debian and Debian has released a more revisions than Ubuntu
<dholbach> ari-tczew: I'm not sure I understand
<ari-tczew> dholbach: it's visible in Debian's changelog
<dholbach> ari-tczew: Ubuntu introduced changes that were already upstream
<dholbach> ari-tczew: like in upstream upstream
<dholbach> ari-tczew: debian packaged new upstream tarballs separately (and only one of the security issues in mentioned in the debian changelog)
<dholbach> ari-tczew: as you can see from the debian bug tracker, nothing was ever forwarded from ubuntu to debian
<ari-tczew> dholbach: you don't understand me. I mean _package has forwarded_ so Debian earlier doesn't got this package, but Ubuntu yes. Then later maintainer drag package from Ubuntu, adjust for Debian and pack in Debian newer upstream releases, but not in Ubuntu
<dholbach> ari-tczew: I don't think that's what happened
<dholbach> in Ubuntu: chef (0.7.10-0ubuntu1.1) karmic-security; urgency=low Mon, 28 Dec 2009 18:21:07 -0800
<dholbach> in Debian: chef (0.7.14-3) unstable; urgency=low Wed, 04 Nov 2009 16:33:44 -0700
<dholbach> (so even before the fix landed in Ubuntu, there were a couple of new upstream releases in Debian already)
<dholbach> in general it was OK to sync the package, but the analysis wasn't quite right
<ari-tczew> dholbach: and what next?
<dholbach> ari-tczew: I ACKed the sync
<dholbach> ari-tczew: as I said: it was OK to sync, I just had a question about the explanation in the bug
<ari-tczew> dholbach: as you see, my syncs almost always are good :P
<directhex> isn't chef tollef's?
<directhex> hm, no.
<directhex> oh, he's hacking upstream
<sim> Hi
<ari-tczew> hi sim
<sim> How to restrict kernel package (ppa) build to a single architecture ?
<sim> Actually I am only interested in building the amd64 kernel package
<sim> Moreover I'd like avoiding Makefile mutilations :)
<ari-tczew> sim: why do you neeed to disable build on other architectures ?
<sim> ari-tczew: I want build a kernel package which provide support for a x86_64 board
<sim> ari-tczew: so a x86 build will not be different from the generic version
<sim> ari-tczew: just it will use some extra space...
<abogani2> sim: debian.master/rules.d/* debian.master/control.d/*
<ari-tczew> sim:  I dunno
<sim> I am really sad to have to do that :(
<sim> I will have to merge some specific ppa modifications with the next kernel package releases
<sim> A way to select the build target from the launchpad platform would be a real improvement
 * abogani2 waves
<abogani2> Anyone could procede with sync for this package: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rxtx/+bug/591682
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 591682 in rxtx (Ubuntu) "Sync rxtx 2.2pre2-1 (universe) from Debian sid (main)" [Wishlist,New]
<BlackZ> abogani2: if you have subscribed ubuntu-sponsors it's OK
<ari-tczew> cody-somerville: you can take merge xchat. I'm busy until 18th June
<ari-tczew> abogani2: why you ask about this sync? you are not a requester
<ari-tczew> cody-somerville: bug for xchat is bug 591714
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 591714 in xchat (Ubuntu) "Merge xchat 2.8.6-6 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/591714
<abogani2> ari-tczew: Because last change (-ubuntu1) is mine.
<ari-tczew> aha ok
<BlackZ> cody-somerville, ari-tczew: I can proceed with the merge if for you is OK
<ari-tczew> BlackZ: so let's go. cody-somerville give me a free hand to take this one so you can take this merge instead me
<ari-tczew> I'm going to gym, see you later
<gnomefreak> tseliot: is X safe to upgrade now? it has held back packages and it wants to remove some key X packages, at least i think they are key packages
<tseliot> gnomefreak: upgrade to what? Lucid?
<gnomefreak> tseliot: no in Maverick but its not a Lucid->Maverick it is a full Maverick and it just started yesterday i think
<gnomefreak> well it was a Lucid tot Maverick upgrade was a few weeks ago
<gnomefreak> s/tot/not
<tseliot> "not" or "to"?
<gnomefreak> to sorry
<tseliot> you might want to ask RAOF if the xserver ABI was bumped. If so, maybe we need to rebuild the nvidia driver
<gnomefreak> tseliot: the nvidia drivers dont work for me at all. I installed the drivers from Nvidia. jockey only offered me the 96,173,nvidia-current but i should be offered 185. but either way none of the 3 offered work
<tseliot> gnomefreak: "don't work"? No logs?
<gnomefreak> i guess he is afk
<gnomefreak> tseliot: dropped to low graphics
<tseliot> gnomefreak: you can collect the logs from low graphics mode
<tseliot> please, do that, then we'll speak again
<gnomefreak> tseliot: ok im lookgin atm
<gnomefreak> this is taking forever to upload to bug report
 * gnomefreak goes for smoke while it does its thing
<gnomefreak> tseliot: i updated the bug i filed (sorry forgot the bug) here it is. bug 590571
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 590571 in xserver-xorg-video-nouveau (Ubuntu) "The monitor turns off after kernel selection in Maverick" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/590571
<sim> Finally, I have proceded like this: http://pastebin.org/321552
<sim> That's quite dirty... but enough good for me
<micahg> if a binary pkg is removed from one source and moved to another w/out a binary, should a bug for a transitional package be in the binary remove request for archive or a separate bug?>
<micahg> if a binary pkg is removed from one source and moved to another w/out a binary, should a bug for a transitional package be in the binary remove request for archive or a separate bug?>
<ScottK> micahg: I'm not sure I understand the question.
<micahg> ScottK: bug 591758
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 591758 in tct (Ubuntu) "please remove 'timeout' from Maverick" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/591758
<micahg> ScottK: it seems like we need a transitional package as well
<ScottK> Looking
<geser> for builds the transitional package is not needed and for upgrades in this case neither (who doesn't have coreutils installed)
<micahg> geser: he's concerned about FTBFS due to the transition
<ScottK> micahg: Is timeout still a separate binary or is it now embedded in an already existing binary package?
<geser> timeout is part of "coreutils" now
<geser> micahg: it looks like only chromium-browser build-depends on timeout, so it shouldn't be an problem to fix this one package (drop the build-dependency)
<micahg> geser: k, he's working on that, ok, good to know there's no other issue
<ScottK> micahg: I agree with what geser said.  If it had been a lot of packages, then it might have been useful to have coreutils "Provide: timeout" as a transitional measure, although since versioned provides are supported, that kind of approach is not always completely satisfactory.
<micahg> ScottK: k, thanks
<geser> micahg: a versioned build-dependency on "coreutils >= 8.0 | timeout" might be in order to make sure a timeout binary is available (or fix the coreutils FTBFS)
<micahg> geser: for chromium?
<geser> yes
<geser> coreutils FTBFS on e.g. armel, and the currently available version doesn't have timeout yet, so on armel the timeout package is still needed until the coreutils FTBFS is fixed
<BlackZ> cody-somerville: the xchat merge from the latest debian unstable version is ready, please see bug #591714
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 591714 in xchat (Ubuntu) "Merge xchat 2.8.6-6 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/591714
<xteejx> Hey guys, bug 588301 in lincity-ng/libphysfs...had a look thru the source and version 2.0.0-2 had a symlink added as a patch I think, but it has since been removed
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 588301 in libphysfs (Ubuntu) "Can't start lincity-ng because libphysfs-1.0.so.0 doesn't exist" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/588301
<xteejx> Can someone check my debdiff on bug 591847, I think it's ok, also is there any chance this can be done, and am I right in subscribing the Review team?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 591847 in a7xpg (Ubuntu) "push button to start message in a7xpg is ambiguous" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/591847
<BlackZ> xteejx: have you did a patch?
<xteejx> BlackZ: A debdiff you mean? Yes. Unless you mean a patch to fix the 'problem', then yes I did that too with quilt
<xteejx> Took a bit of messing around to learn it, but done :)
<BlackZ> xteejx: so if you did a patch attach it too
<xteejx> BlackZ: Ok, is that the case even though it's in the debdiff?
<BlackZ> and in the changelog entry, start_game_string.patch (LP: #591847) would be enough
<BlackZ> (with the description)
<BlackZ> xteejx: I'd attach debdiff + patch
<xteejx> That is what I have in the changelog... the patch name, close LP bug and description
<BlackZ> xteejx: but if you have did the patch you have to include it in the bg
<BlackZ> s/bg/bug
<xteejx> huh?
<xteejx> I re-read it :) Yeah I made the patch, so I'll attach it then :)
<BlackZ> xteejx: and fix the changelog
<BlackZ> xteejx: * debian/patches/start_game_string.patch: Changes ambiguous "push button to start" to "push CTRL to start" (LP: #591847) would be enough
<xteejx> BlackZ: Oh you mean the LP description put it into the changelog?>
<BlackZ> xteejx: the debian/changelog file, it should be as I suggested you
<xteejx> BlackZ: Ok, I think I understand :) thanks BlackZ
<BlackZ> xteejx: also, you have to include the patches in a file tipically called 00list or series in the debian/patches directory
<BlackZ> (if it doesn't exist, create it)
<xteejx> BlackZ: I updated the series file to include my patch so that it would be applied during build
<BlackZ> xteejx: but without the .patch extension
<BlackZ> you have to add them without the extension
<xteejx> All the rest have extensions in the series file
<xteejx> .patch, .diff
<xteejx> hence the reason I did the same :S
<BlackZ> xteejx: hmmm, so let it
<BlackZ> BTW it's not an error!
<xteejx> so generally drop the extensions?
<BlackZ> xteejx: I'd drop it but that's not required, the patch will work BTW
<xteejx> BlackZ: Ok, I'll leave it then to make it look more uniform with the rest, makes sense I suppose :)
<BlackZ> xteejx: if they have, let it
<xteejx> Ok :)
<xteejx> Thanks BlackZ
<tonyyarusso> All right, I could use a bit of packaging help if there's anyone around.
<geser> what kind of problem do you have?
<tonyyarusso> First item of business:  I thought I'd try making a get-orig-source rule.  Upstream doesn't currently version the tarball, nor use a clear name, so it comes as linux-nrpe-agent.tar.gz.  I need that to be something more along the lines of nagios-xi-agent-0.1.orig.tar.gz.
<tonyyarusso> Obviously just a mv would change the name of the tarball, but what about the folder it would unpack?  Wouldn't changing the name of that mess up the MD5?
<geser> the folder name doesn't matter to which in unpacks as long as it's one folder
<tonyyarusso> oh, all righty then
<tonyyarusso> Next up:  I'm attempting to do this with debhelper (although I'm not sure if I really need to...), but I don't really understand what all of the different parts do and which ones I actually need.
<tonyyarusso> My package is platform independent.  All it does is a) pull in some dependencies, b) copy some perl & shell scripts to a directory created by one of those dependencies, and c) add some config options in /etc and restart a service.
<tonyyarusso> geser: Do I need anything at all other than dh_install?
<geser> only the common ones
<tonyyarusso> such as?  testdir, testroot, clean ?
<dupondje> Where can I see packages that arent accepted yet ?
<dupondje> xserver-xorg-input-mouse shows newer version then there is in the archive :s
<micahg> dupondje: which version?
<micahg> (ubuntu)
<dupondje> maverick ..
<micahg> dupondje: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/+queue
<dupondje> its not there :P
<micahg> dupondje: maybe your mirror?
<dupondje> archive.ubuntu.com ... guess its up-to-date :P
<micahg> dupondje: amd64 not built yet?
<dupondje> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-input-mouse
<dupondje> xserver-xorg-input-mouse (1:1.5.0-2)
<dupondje> aptitude show gives me: Versie: 1:1.5.0-1
<micahg> dupondje: are you on amd64?
<dupondje> ye
<micahg> hmmm
<micahg> should be published now
<dupondje> tought also :) its weird
<tonyyarusso> What does the .PHONY rules target do?
<dutchie> tonyyarusso: it tells make that those rules don't correspond to making an actual file
<dutchie> tonyyarusso: i'd recommend reading the documentation for make :)
<tonyyarusso> joy
<ajmitch> funkyHat: uploaded your mpd merge, sorry for the delay :)
<funkyHat> ajmitch: no worries â¢). Thanks â¡)
<imbrandon> afternoon all
<ajmitch> hi imbrandon
<imbrandon> heya ajmitch
<imbrandon> so if i bind mount /usr in /etc/fstab will it mount early enough not to cause normal boot issues ?
<tonyyarusso> Can I use a get-orig-source rule in such a way as to not even have a source in my directory to begin with?  (ie I have debian/ and nothing else, and the rule should download the rest)
<tonyyarusso> If yes I must be confused about how to reference it, because debuild succeeds but pbuilder fails, with a "can not stat file" error later in rules.
<ari-tczew> why developers write in debian/changelog only "Resync on Debian" without any informations?
<ari-tczew> I saw it in packages uploaded by doko and seb128
<sebner> ari-tczew: because they are lazy
<ari-tczew> maybe I'll request syncs without explanation?
<ajmitch> sure, they'll probably get closed without explanation then
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: some packages are too big, too important and maintained only by the handful of developers who are in touch with each other so it's not a problem in these cases and it's much faster to just write * Resync with Debian then to point every delta we still carry over.
<ari-tczew> if anyone require abidance, let's require from himself
<ari-tczew> s/abidance/rules=policy
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: I see that you're not a developer (only PPU for 1 package) and you have answers for all question. congratulations!
<ajmitch> ari-tczew: check again, he is in ~ubuntu-dev
<ari-tczew> ajmitch: ^^ only PPU for 1 package
<ajmitch> so please hold back on the sarcastic responses as well
<tonyyarusso> Could someone show me a good example of get-orig-source usage?
<ajmitch> tonyyarusso: I don't believe it's meant to be used at build-time, if that's what you're trying to do
<ari-tczew> please don't be too much sensitive, I love these such discussions
<tonyyarusso> ajmitch: oh.  It's just to save you the trouble of fetching it?
<ajmitch> tonyyarusso: yes, from what I've seen of how's it's generally used
<tonyyarusso> hrm, ok
 * tonyyarusso still has no idea what he's doing, but is getting closer, kinda
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: the number of packages I have upload rights too doesn't have much to do with my observation skills nor with my knowledge about the project or policies. If you have asked your question in hope that there is a written policy "canonicaly employees/ubuntu-cure-dev members are allowed not to write as detailed changelog entries as everybody else" then you should rephrase your question and I
<kklimonda> would not answer it like that. But your question is an open one so I've decided to answer it to the best of my knowledge.
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: in the start I'd like to say that I'm not happy in answer by other language instead our native. I don't attack nobody, but only I said: if anyone require rules, he should require starting from himself.
<ari-tczew> I've observed that only from me developers are require some special things and they don't respect me and my work.
#ubuntu-motu 2010-06-10
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: I don't take it personally and I don't think you should do that either. Why do you think they require something *only* from you and not from others (and by others I mean people who are not part of motu/ubuntu-cure-dev)? When I get asked to fix something I've missed (like bug I haven't closed, some justification I haven't made) I just do it. The asking person isn't there to make my life
<kklimonda> harder or to stop my efforts - he or she's helping me to learn from my mistakes and assure a degree of quality of all uploads I do. Are there developers who don't have to abide to some rules? Yes. For various reasons. Does it matter to me personally? Not really. Should it matter to you? I have no idea. If it does you can raise your opinion on the ubuntu-devel (or ubuntu-devel-discuss to get more
<kklimonda> input from non-developers) whether do they see that as a problem. If it's a problem according to the majority of contributors I think it should be fixed. I'm not sure how.
<kklimonda> bah, this discussion isn't best suited for IRC :)
<maxb> Does anyone know of any cdbs-using package which does configure-make-make-install TWICE, against two different dependent-library versions in a single source?
<maxb> I am trying to bludgeon slony1 into building against multiple postgres versions in a PPA
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: ping. are you able to discuss? sorry for the delay
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: sure. I still have some time :)
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: heh nice, it's late. sorry again for the delay, I took the shower. Well, I don't like attitude of expierenced developers. They don't want to approve me to MOTU, because they don't like my behavior.
<ari-tczew> apparently I can't integrate (and this same cooperate) with other contributors as team
<ari-tczew> I guess that this is nonsense, because I only show/say my views.
<ari-tczew> do I need to change my views, because someone don't like them? nonsense
<ari-tczew> I don't offend anyone. If someone feels hurted by me, just tell me. We'll look for fix the problem.
<ari-tczew> I see that my work and my time (time is money) is leaking by developers's fingers.
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: we should probably move this to private chat (not that I want to hide something, it's just not going to be on the topic discussion). If you think it's more appropriate to discuss it here and others don't mind we can stay :).
<ari-tczew> ScottK, I know that you're watching this or you'll see this: I thought about our problem and I have to say it: Ubuntu needs a contributors, not contributors needs Ubuntu
<funkyHat> I notice that the new version of mpd is built for i386 but not amd64... is there often a long delay between the builds? (I checked the build status page and nothing's shown up there, it shouldn't, I built it for amd64 while testing â¢))
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: no, I want to show what are going here, because situation is not healthy
<Laney> hi funkyHat, it appears to just be waiting to start
<Laney> See https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mpd/0.15.9-2ubuntu1/+build/1784550
<ajmitch> funkyHat: see the queue length at https://edge.launchpad.net/builders
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: heh, fine. I'll assume then that others don't mind this discussion until proven otherwise.
<funkyHat> Laney: ajmitch: thanks â¡)
<ajmitch> and yes, I built it on amd64 locally as well
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: if someone want to undermine my views, let's talk.
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: Okay. I can only base my view on comments (yours and those from other people) from your motu application, the two discussion with you I have seen, this discussion and our last private discussion I'm not willing to quote publicly. I can't comment from the technical standpoint as I don't work with you in any way.
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: oooo! that's it! "base my view on comments"
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: Ubuntu Developers team is created by a lot of people. We all have our differences, goals, worse and better days. We all share the same goal of making Ubuntu as good as it can be given the resources we all have.
<ari-tczew> don't you have yours views? individually? I see that if someone wrote "he is not patient" then everybody wrote the same. sick!
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: yes - I have my own view I'm presenting here. If you'd let me to write it first.It's based on all the comments from your application page - not only comments from other people but also your response.
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: I believe you are making a mistake thinking that those who comment on your applications are following someone's lead.
<ari-tczew> they wrote: more patience. ok, nice (btw. I think that this is character issue). I want to say: More gratitude and more understanding!
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: ScottK and Laney have written their comments at different times, they are not related to the same issue.
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: your lack of patience may be a character issue but it's something you have to work on. We all have our issues but at the end of the day we all have to work as a team.
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: I see no problem with cooperate as a team and if someone tell me that I'm not ready for teamwork I'm going to say - nonsense! :|
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: ScottK has, correctly, pointed your mistake out. Your reaction has been asking him to basically fix it or shut up.
<ari-tczew> with Laney we have a clear question.
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: we all make mistakes. Hell, I've done one myself just another day uploading SRU and forgetting to write a justification (I've discussed it with other developer and assumed incorrectly he'd be the one to process it). The problem is how do we deal with other people pointing them out.
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: and ScottK exaggerates that I'm damaging bug tracker - sorry, but lol for it.
<Laney> I once uploaded a PPA package to the distribution
<Laney> which kicked off a transition far too early, that was a bad mistake
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: I see that developers seems to be much sensitive
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: sorry, but you have sounded so defensive it has actually been aggressive - It may not have been your intention, the language barrier can make heated discussion evern more heated but that's even more of a reason to weigh your words carefully.
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: what is wrong in my words?
<ari-tczew> show me
<Laney> I think you guys should maybe take this to PM now
<imbrandon> or email
<ari-tczew> easiest way is say shut up and get out there, because just you're too small and you're only contributor and we are a developers! yea this is it
<ari-tczew> I hope that you'll merge all packages and clean sponsors queue. Fix all CVEs and invite more contributors. good luck!
<carstenh> #583698 is imho wronly tagged "importance low" and has an trivial debdiff attached
<carstenh> that should have been "wrongly"
<samliu> hi there, anyone happen to know how to package java applications from source? I could use some pointers
<carstenh> apt-get source weirdx or any other random java package does not help?
<carstenh> ok, X in java does not sound that easy, but there are other packages
<micahg> carstenh: I think that was set low because it was a corner case, but I might be wrong
<carstenh> wrong decisions can be fixed ;)
<ScottK> ari-tczew: Ubuntu needs a community and that means people need to be able to deal with criticism without being reactive and hostile.
<ari-tczew> ScottK: are you sure that you are able to got criticism?
<ari-tczew> after thoughts I want to tell you, that your opinion is very exaggerated
<ScottK> ari-tczew: I'm not always perfect at it.
<ScottK> No one is perfect at anything.
<ScottK> If you can't accept feedback from fellow developers I don't trust you to have upload rights.
<ScottK> Your continuing to argue about it convinces me more that I am correct.  If you want to change my mind, start by accepting responsiblity for them.
<ari-tczew> ScottK: since 4 hours I want to show: only your opinion is correct. ONLY!
<ari-tczew> and I can say nothing
<ScottK> ari-tczew: FWIW, I agree with you that there are developers that don't do a proper job of documenting changes.
<ari-tczew> ScottK: is your opinion irrefutable? always are sure 100%?
<ari-tczew> can not I criticise you?
<ScottK> ari-tczew: No.  I'm not always 100% certain, but you're aggressive behaviour at the moment is convincing me more that I am correct in this case.
<ScottK> By attacking me, you are making it worse.
<ScottK> You may also note that several other people have said similar things to you.
<ScottK> You might consider that we aren't all wrong.
<ari-tczew> ScottK: who?
<ari-tczew> I know about you and Laney but with Laney we have a clear situation
<ScottK> I read kklimonda's comments as similar.
<ScottK> That's just today.
<ari-tczew> ScottK: I suggest to update your opinion about: do you have problem with me about packaging skill or problem with behavior?
<ari-tczew> I think that we need to split these issues
<ScottK> ari-tczew: I haven't sponsored anything of yours recently (if ever), so I don't have an opinion on your packaging skills.
<ScottK> I don't think I've ever said anything bad about them.
<ari-tczew> ScottK: I don't like see "he is damaging bug tracker"
<ScottK> Ah.  That's not packaging exactly in my view.
<ScottK> You were making inappropriate changes to the bug tracker and saying you were going to continue doing it.
<ScottK> That was damaging the bug tracker.
<ScottK> You did, in the end, change your mind on that.
<ari-tczew> ScottK: I have enough, sorry. Good luck and have fun!
<ScottK> ari-tczew: Please also note that nowhere have I said you should never be a MOTU nor have I said you should not contribute to the project.
<ScottK> (for reference, I have said that before and that individual is still the only person ever to have been disallowed from volunteering for MOTU work)
<ajmitch> now he was damaging
<ScottK> Yes.
<jean>  
<ari-tczew> fine then. I won't damage anymore
<ScottK> ari-tczew: If I see a pattern of you being accepting of feedback from other developers and not hostile/defensive, then I'll reconsider my position, but I have to see it first.
<ari-tczew> ScottK: argumented feedback OK, but with this damaging is very big word
<ari-tczew> nothing else which has done is not important, only this one mistake
<ajmitch> wasn't that text removed from the feedback section?
<ScottK> I'm double checking
<ajmitch> from what I can see, it was only there for an hour until you changed it to be more diplomatic
<ScottK> ari-tczew: The word you are complaining about isn't there anymore.
<ScottK> It hasn't been for quite some time.
 * ajmitch isn't quite sure of the value of changing -1build1 uploads to -1fakesync1 - AFAIK it's only -XubuntuY revisions that are special-cased for syncs
<ScottK> ajmitch: In theory if we use fakesync1, then the sync script could get smart enough to autosync new upstream versions.
<ScottK> But not new revisions that would need to be handled manually.
<ari-tczew> I heard that autosync from Debian is going to sync XbuildY packages, but if this is fakesync, autosync provides a lot of error messages and archive admins are not satisfied
<ScottK> That's correct.
<ScottK> Traditionally I've always used ubuntu1 for a fakesync exactly so syncsource wouldn't attempt to sync it.
<ari-tczew> so I'm going to make fakesyncs for not provide error messages by autosync
<ari-tczew> but if it's ubuntu1 then we don't know directly about mismatching tarball
<ari-tczew> ScottK: so changing version to fakesync it;s correct or not?
<ScottK> ari-tczew: I think it's a new idea and there is no clear policy yet.
<ScottK> I think it's fine to do it, but I also wouldn't be suprised if other people disagreed.
<ari-tczew> fine, so let's sponsor my patches
<ScottK> ari-tczew: I've got other work planned for this evening.
<ari-tczew> ScottK: I said this generally, not precisely point this work on you
<ScottK> ari-tczew: OK.
<ari-tczew> ok, let's get shutdown launchpad and irc. see you! good luck and have fun again
<ajmitch> it must be fairly late there :)
<ari-tczew> yea
<kklimonda> ajmitch: don't even ask. this discussion has been too long ;)
<ajmitch> kklimonda: oh I know
<ajmitch> I've been watching it go on
<ajmitch> and I'm still not convinced about uploading a whole lot of fakesyncs where the only change is in the changelog to shut up buggy tools
<kklimonda> ok, time to get as much sleep as I can. g'night :)
<ajmitch> night
<ScottK> ajmitch: I agree we shouldn't upload just to call it fakesync, but I think there's a useful distinction to be made and so when doing a new fakesync (for other needed reasons), it's a decent idea to use Xfakesync1.
<ajmitch> right, but quite a few of the packages by ari-tzcew that I can see in the sponsoring queue are just for this
<ScottK> I wouldn't support that.
<ajmitch> which is why I was checking up on what the autosync tools look at
<ScottK> Currently it will just overwrite buildX.
<ajmitch> I didn't think there'd be any difference between -1build1 and -1fakesync1 at this point
<ScottK> It's probably trivial to teach it to have new upstream versions overwrite fakesync.
<ajmitch> at least not in terms of errors done
<ScottK> Maybe it's the other way around.
 * ScottK didn't look.
<ajmitch> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/exifprobe/+bug/591259 is an example of one I was hesitant to sponsor
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 591259 in exifprobe (Ubuntu) "Fake sync exifprobe 2.0.1-1build1" [Undecided,New]
<ScottK> wgrant: Will syncsource.py do a sync for a fakesync1 revision?
 * ajmitch has the LP source to look at here
<ajmitch> though wgrant is the acknowledged expert
<ScottK> Oh, right.  Forgot you do that stuff too.
<ajmitch> I don't really :)
<ScottK> You have the source, so you're way ahead of me.
<ajmitch> from what I can see, it's only looking for the string 'ubuntu' in the version
<ScottK> OK,
<ajmitch> it shouldn't need forcing for either -1build1 or -1fakesync1, and would treat them the same
<ajmitch> amusing, it calls dak_utils.fubar() to complain
<ScottK> How hard would it be for it to treat XfakesyncY like XbuildY if the candidate has a new upstream and like XubuntuY if it is just a new revision?
<ScottK> Nice.
<ajmitch> from what I can see, it wouldn't take much, if it splits the upstream versions & compares on those if faeksync is in the debian revision
 * ScottK whistles inoccently and looks around for someone with the source handy to make a branch....
<ajmitch> fine, I'll fork it :P
<ajmitch> testing this will be fun
<TheMuso> raywang: Seems Debian's git repos have been updated with at-spi2 v0.3.3. I am probably going to base off those for the time being. What is wrong with v0.3.3 at the moment?
<raywang> TheMuso, okay, I'll find some clue for you. :)
<TheMuso> raywang: Its just that you said there were important bugs in it, and are sticking with 0.3.2 in your PPA.
<TheMuso> raywang: I am just curious as to why.
<raywang> TheMuso, no, no, I just mean that if there is no one taking care of packaging at-spi2, I'd love to help on, but if someone is doing it.I'd like to use them. :)
<TheMuso> raywang: ok I will likely uploading the Debian packages to a PPA later, that is if I don't need to make changes myself to suit Ubuntu.
<raywang> TheMuso, and what I mean for 0.3.2 is I just know there are some/few bugs that i believe is important, they might break something, so i didn't package 0.3.3.  but I'll find them for you. and then we will see. :-)
<TheMuso> raywang: Doesn't matter, it all needs testing anyway, I'll just upload the latest.
<raywang> TheMuso, that's great
<TheMuso> 8/c
<raywang> TheMuso, so where I can find the new at-spi2 upload?
<raywang> TheMuso, and who is currently maintain them?
<TheMuso> raywang: They are currently in the pkg-a11y git repo on git.debian.org
<raywang> alright
<raywang> TheMuso, okay, I may made some mistake, the latest release would probably good enough. and I forget the bug that I have seen before. :P
<TheMuso> ok
<raywang> it's great to see Samuel Thibault is taking care of those packages.
<TheMuso> yep
<TheMuso> hrm. They don't have at-spi2-pyatspi there it seems.
<raywang> TheMuso, it's call pyatspi
<raywang> called
<TheMuso> raywang: that explains it then. :p
<raywang> TheMuso, so, he is taking charge of them, but anyway I would still like to do something for a11y, if there is anything i can do, please let me know. :)
<TheMuso> raywang: Sure, thanks for the offer of assistance.
<raywang> my pleasure
<ripps> Does anybody here know how to make dkms package. Lucid/Maverick aren't able to use wacom bamboo ctl-460+ because the kernel uses out of date code. I was hoping I could help a lot of people by using dkms to auto-update the wacom module everytime a kernel is installed
<ScottK> ripps: Did you try looking at a package that already uses dkms?
<ripps> ScottK: not yet, do know an example of one that's well done?
<micahg> does virtualbox-ose use it?
<ripps> hmm, there's a virtualbox-ose-dkms package
<ScottK> bcmwl uses it too.
<ripps> any packages that use debhelper 7?
<ripps> well, I found a template that uses cdbs, I guess that'll have to do.
<jetienne> http://packages.debian.org/sid/nodejs this package is in debian but not in ubuntu, what is the process to get it included in ubuntu repositories ?
<statik> jetienne, you can use the requestsync tool to file a bug requesting that the package be synced into ubuntu.
<jetienne> statik: ok. i will see how to use this tool
<ajmitch> it is in maverick
<jetienne> Connecting to fiordland.ubuntu.com:25 ...
<jetienne> Sync request mailed.
<jetienne> should i supposed it worked ? where can i double check?
<ajmitch> a sync request wasn't needed
<ajmitch> !backports
<ubottu> If new updated Ubuntu packages are built for an application, then they may go into Ubuntu Backports. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports - See also !packaging
<jetienne> ajmitch: so the request wont make it happen ?
<statik> ah, i just took your word for it that it wasn't in ubuntu
<statik> sorry about sending you in the wrong direction there
<ScottK> jetienne: It's already happened.
<jetienne> ScottK: nodejs is already in ubuntu you mean ?
<ScottK> Yes.
<jetienne> ScottK: why apt-cache search dont find it ?
<ScottK> It's just in the maverick release, not lucid.  If you want to get it backported to lucid, follow the backports process
<jetienne> ScottK: oh cool, thanks. next release is fine by me
<ajmitch> I'll close the bug now then :)
<jetienne> https://bugs.launchpad.net/lucid-backports/+bug/592034
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 592034 in lucid-backports "nodejs clean/fast/opensource/javascript interpreter" [Undecided,New]
<RAOF> What?  _Another_ javascript interpreter?
<jetienne> RAOF: this is v8, you can find it in chrome and chromium. This is the server version + nice network library
<dholbach> good morning
<BlackZ> if a new package in debian is still not synced in ubuntu should be filed a sync request? (also if the package isn't in ubuntu)
<dholbach> Packaging Training Session in 15m in #ubuntu-classroom: Operation Cleansweep and the Patch Reviewers Team!
<jetienne> BlackZ: yes (according to what i have been told this morning)
<sebner> jetienne: BlackZ : Auto-syncs should still run some time?!
<jetienne> sebner: ? dunno, just repeating what i have been told
<BlackZ> sebner: yeah, but it's not still synced in ubuntu, BTW I'd like to ask the sync because there's a package which FTBFS because of a missing dependence
<siretart> did you check that it's not still in the NEW queue?
<BlackZ> siretart: seems not
<ScottK> BlackZ: In Debian Main or Contrib/Non-free?
<BlackZ> ScottK: main
<ScottK> jetienne: What you were told before wasn't exactly correct.  Prior to Debian Import Freeze (which is were we are now), there should be no need to file sync requests.
<ScottK> BlackZ: What package?
<BlackZ> ScottK: glue-schema
<jetienne> ScottK: ok, how long is the Debian Import Freeze ?
<ScottK> !schedule | jetienne
<ubottu> jetienne: Ubuntu releases a new version every 6 months. Each version is supported for 18 months to 5 years. More info at http://www.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/releases & http://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeBasedReleases
<ScottK> oops.
<ScottK> Let me get you the link.
<jetienne> http://www.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/releases <- this one is a 404
<ScottK> jetienne: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MaverickReleaseSchedule
<BlackZ> ScottK: so, should I file a sync request?
<ScottK> BlackZ: Looking
<jetienne> ScottK: ok
<ScottK> BlackZ: It depends on how urgent it is.  It's a relatively new package.  New packages only get brought in by a separate type of sync run that is done less often.  It will get run again before DIF, so I'm certain it will get into Maverick.  If you can wait, I wouldn't file the sync request as it's more manual work for the archive admins.
<jetienne> the interest of lucid is the LTS support. especially for the package relevant on servers
<BlackZ> ScottK: I can wait, but it's a required dependence for a package (actually it FTBFS due to that)
<ScottK> BlackZ: If for some reason it's not here by DIF, then request a sync.  I'm pretty sure it will be.
<ScottK> It's very difficult to reliably work on archive consistency stuff like that prior to DIF anyway.
<BlackZ> ScottK: ok, thanks
<tonyyarusso> Where does dh_install look for files, in v6 mode?
<ScottK> Why v6?
<tonyyarusso> ScottK: I thought it might be useful to make things compatible with hardy still.  I guess if that's stupid I could skip it.
<ScottK> tonyyarusso: Hardy has debhelper 7 in backports.
<tonyyarusso> oh, wait.  debhelper is only a build-depends, not a depends.  Then yeah, this is stupid.
 * tonyyarusso was thinking about the production servers for some reason instead of just build machines
<tonyyarusso> ScottK: the first part of the question still stands I guess, although supposedly it looks in $builddirectory/debian/tmp.  Testing that now...
<tonyyarusso> gah
<tonyyarusso> Still getting "dh_install: nagios-xi-agent missing files (conf/nrpe.d/*.cfg), aborting"
<tonyyarusso> from ls, /tmp/buildd/nagios-xi-agent-0.1/debian/tmp/conf/nrpe.d:
<tonyyarusso> -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 1.2K Jun 10 15:45 common.cfg
<ScottK> What if you change *.cfg to common.cfg?
<tonyyarusso> I'll try that, but the documentation seems to agree that dh_install should be okay with wildcards.
<tonyyarusso> On the plus side, it's making me really happy that I'm not waiting for some 3-hour compile every time to figure this out :P
<tonyyarusso> cp: cannot stat `debian/tmp/conf/nrpe.d/common.cfg': No such file or directory
<Rhonda> tonyyarusso: You don't have to completely build, you even can run the dh_ scripts manually by hand.
<tonyyarusso> I wish I could find some good examples of this somewhere.
<xteejx> Hey guys, trying to merge a package with the merge-buildpackage script and it keeps coming up with "tail: cannot open `debian/changelog' for reading: No such file or directory"  help?
<xteejx> Any ideas?
<xteejx> I'm in the same directory as the merge script
<geser> you should call it from the packaging dir
<xteejx> geser: You mean from the source dir or the build dir (where the dsc and tars are?
<geser> in the unpacked directory
<xteejx> ah ha!! thanks geser it's working now, didn't think to try something as simple as that hehe :)
<Guest24362> hello is there anyone who could review my application? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=cortina
<Guest24362> nick eric
<eric2> ok well no one answers... could someone tell me the next review day??
<carstenh> patience ... people don't read irc all day
<eric2> ok
<heff09> hello ive just upgraded to lucid and have some questions, is any 1 on ?
<Pici> heff09: If you're looking for a support channel, #ubuntu is the place, if this is a packaging/motu question then please continue.
<heff09> ok my problem is to do with fgrun not opening when installed ?
<heff09> is there help here with that ?
<danohuiginn> I have a bug that's fixed by rebuilding the package (bug #589443).
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 589443 in pdfshuffler (Ubuntu) "pdfshuffler fails to install to a usable state on maverick" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/589443
<danohuiginn> so I believe the correct procedure is to add an entry to the changelog, so the build daemons will rebuild it. Is that right?
<Pici> heff09: Why do you think that is something for the MOTUs?
<danohuiginn> And Is there somewhere I can see build logs for the earlier package, to figure out what went wrong beforehand?
<heff09> sorry noob here dont know what MOTUs is
<ScottK> danohuiginn: Those are stored in Launchpad as wekk.
<Pici> heff09: You are in the #ubuntu-motu channel right now, not #ubuntu
<heff09> ok
<Pici> heff09: This channel is for the people who do the packaging of applications in the repositories, it is not the place to get regular support.
<hyperair> !#ubuntu
<ubottu> Ubuntu is a complete Linux-based operating system, freely available with both community and professional support. It is developed by a large community and we invite you to participate too! - Also see http://www.ubuntu.com
<Pici> !support
<ubottu> The official ubuntu support channel is #ubuntu. Please be aware that this channel is for development only.
<hyperair> ah whoops =p
<Pici> :)
<danohuiginn> ScottK: thanks. Where exactly do I find wekk on launchpad? searching isn't turning anything up
<asomething> danohuiginn: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/48295354/buildlog_ubuntu-maverick-i386.pdfshuffler_0.5-1_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz
<danohuiginn> thanks, asomething
<ScottK> danohuiginn: I agree it needs a rebuild.
<ScottK> danohuiginn: For a rebuild it's trivial to upload a no chance version.  I'll take care of it.
<danohuiginn> Ok. thanks, ScottK
<danohuiginn> although the build log seemed to contain a few errors as well
<ScottK> It did.  I checked and it builds fine now.
<danohuiginn> great
<ScottK> danohuiginn: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pdfshuffler/0.5-1build1
<ScottK> danohuiginn: Thank you for your contribution to Ubuntu.
<danohuiginn> thanks for being so welcoming :)
<jcastro> hyperair: were you the one working on putting pdfmod in ubuntu/debian?
<hyperair> jcastro: yes. i'm stuck at getting pdfsharp in.
 * jcastro nods
<hyperair> jcastro: it'll take time, and i haven't had a suitably contiguous block of time
<hyperair> to look at it, i mean
<jcastro> is there anything I can do to help?
 * jcastro thinks it would be a nice featured app in the software center
<hyperair> jcastro: nothing much really. i'll just have to figure out how to use xbuild, and then get it to work on pdfsharp
<hyperair> i should probably start working on poppler-sharp too, i've gotten it autotoolized upstream
<MaximLevitsky> what is the policy on EXPREMENTAL in the ubuntu kernel?
<imbrandon> not to say someone wont awnser here, but you might have a b it better luck in #ubuntu-kernel for that one
<imbrandon> s/b it/bit
<gnomefreak> did anyone else get emails from admin@ubuntu.com?
<ajmitch> you meanapart from the usual spam/phishing/general crap that comes through with fake addresses?
<geser> "Subject: ubuntu.com account notification"?
<gnomefreak> yes
<ajmitch> that's usual, just delete them
<geser> I've currently 66 of them in my spambox
<gnomefreak> thats the first time i saw them but none of them say to me
<gnomefreak> thanks for the info
<ajmitch> ScottK: so I've changed sync-source.py to complain & bail out if trying to sync a package with fakesync in the revision & same upstream versions
<ajmitch> the fun part will be testing it, and seeing if the archive admins with shell access will find it useful
<ScottK> Cool.
<ScottK> I'd say if it tests out, send mail to ubuntu-devel and let's discuss.
<ajmitch> & then run the launchpad patch submission gauntlet
<ScottK> meh.  Details.
<ajmitch> [NOT Updating - Fakesync] hello_2.5-0fakesync1 (vs 2.5-1)
<ajmitch> k, so that works
<geser> but hello 2.6-1 would get autosynced?
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> apt_pkg.upstream_version() is useful for that
<jcastro> directhex: #sparkleshare on gimpnet pls.
#ubuntu-motu 2010-06-11
<porthose> DktrKranz, ping! The link I mailed you is now good.  Shortly after I sent that mail to you my cable modem went up in a ball of flames :(
<ScottK> porthose: Is it on youtube?
<porthose> ScottK, na didn't have time to grab my phone was to busy putting the fire out :)
<ajmitch> get your priorities right next time please
<porthose> hahaha
<dholbach> good morning
<DktrKranz> porthose: oki thanks, I'll have a look as soon as my email client quits to bother me :)
<eric_> Is there someone who could review my program? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=cortina
<shadeslayer> hi small question,when signing files gpg agent doesnt seem to be running,any ideas on how to fix this? Im using kubuntu
<ScottK> shadeslayer: Look in your .gnupg directory at the gpg conf file and make sure "use-agent" is present and not commented out.
<shadeslayer> ScottK: its there :)
<shadeslayer> ScottK: the problem is that it doesnt detect any user-agent
<ScottK> That should be sufficient from a configuration perspective.  I'm not sure then.
<xteejx> Afternoon all.
<xteejx> How long does it take a merge to be looked at? (in general I mean I'm not in a rush)
<shadeslayer> xteejx: well you could ask someone here to look at it it
<xteejx> Oh cool Ok then it's bug 592622...please be nice it's the first one I've done on my own ;) hehe
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 592622 in xtrs (Ubuntu) "please merge xtrs 4.9c-3.2 (mutliverse) from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/592622
<xteejx> mutliverse? Doh!
<jariq> What do you think about packages generated with cpack (module of cmake) ? Does anyone use it to generate packages ?
<shadeslayer> hi is there a example of a transitional package i can study?
<Rhonda> shadeslayer: Just make an empty package (no debian/package.install file or similar) which has a Depends on the new package and contains as sole entry a symlink for the copyright file
<Rhonda> erm, s/copyright file/doc directory/
<shadeslayer> Rhonda: i was reading this : http://baraujo.net/blog/?p=17
<shadeslayer> Rhonda: is that ok?
<Rhonda> Is one way to do it. Looks like the transitional package will end up with all the docs in it, too. And Arch: any is just wrong, it should be Arch: all
<shadeslayer> Rhonda: btw can i place the entry anywhere in the control file,or should they be back to back?
<shadeslayer> Rhonda: ah ok
<Rhonda> You can put them anywhere, but putting them last is a good idea.
<Rhonda> There is special casing for the first binary package stanca, appart from that there is nothing special.
<Rhonda> So ordering does only matter for the first two entrys: Source, and first Package.
<shadeslayer> ah...
<shadeslayer> Rhonda: btw for maverick,in the changelog i write unstable or unreleased
<Rhonda> shadeslayer: Erm, definitely not unreleased. I think unstable is proper for maverick, but then I'm not a Ubuntu dev yet. :)
<shadeslayer> :)
<shadeslayer> Rhonda: i went with UNRELEASED
<Rhonda> I would expect that to get rejected when being uploaded.
<shadeslayer> somebody answered in #kubuntu-devel :)
<shadeslayer> Rhonda: oh im uploading to bzr
<Rhonda> That's pushing, not uploading. ;)
<shadeslayer> then will request a merge with the kubuntu-members branch...
<shadeslayer> bzr is not co-operating right now :P
<ScottK> Rhonda: FYI, we put the actual release name in debian/changelog, so if he had been uploading, maverick would be correct.
<xelister> I would like to debug kmail in lucid-proposed, but it seems there are no -dbgsym's for lucid-proposed?
<xelister> how to by hand build and install needed -dbgsym for kmail...? will it be 100% compatible with lucid-proposed's kmail (so I can get information about a crash that already occured on the PPA installed kmail from lucid-proposed)?
<shadeslayer> hi anyone working on https://merges.ubuntu.com/d/derivations/REPORT ?
<shadeslayer> if not id like to take it up
 * shadeslayer wonders how the same version is already in the repo
<shadeslayer> !merge
<ubottu> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<xteejx> How long does it normally take once sponsors have been subscribed to a merge for them to take a look at it? (In my case it's only been 2 hours and I'm not complaining :))
<shadeslayer> xteejx: got a sec?
<xteejx> shadeslayer: Sure
<shadeslayer> xteejx: can you teach me how to merge a package? like the basic overview
<shadeslayer> i cant really follow the wiki
<shadeslayer> i know packaging,but merges look different :)
<xteejx> shadeslayer: I'm probably not the best person to ask I'm only learning myself everything MOTU related and merging is my first kinda motu thing lol
<xteejx> yeah the wiki was hard for me to follow too
<xteejx> I can *try* and explain it as I know it, I've done 2 merges so far
<shadeslayer> xteejx: yeah sure
<shadeslayer> xteejx: you can use the merges youve done as examples
<xteejx> shadeslayer: The basics of it is, you use the grab-merge script on the wiki to grab the packages, i.e. the base, debian and current ubuntu packages, then read the REPORT and change/fix what it says, update the changelog, debuild -S it to build a source package, try to build it in pbuilder and if all is fine and works, debdiff the differences between the debian.dsc & new-ubuntu.dsc and also old-ubuntu.dsc & new-ubuntu.dsc
<xteejx> Hope that gives some help, that's how I understand it
<shadeslayer> xteejx: ok and how do i use the script?
<xteejx> download it to where you want to build and sh ./grab-merge/.sh
<xteejx> .sh
<shadeslayer> xteejx: ohh...
<shadeslayer> xteejx: but you just said,that grab the merge script to grap the packages.. how do i do that?
<xteejx> use the script to do it
<BlackZ> shadeslayer: have you read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging ?
<shadeslayer> BlackZ: i am reading that,but i cant understand how to use the script
<xteejx> download it
<xteejx> use it
<BlackZ> shadeslayer: man grab-merge and read the section "DESCRIPTION"
<shadeslayer> ah
<BlackZ> I think you will understand
<xteejx> BlackZ: Is grab-merge in the repos??
<shadeslayer> yep
<xteejx> bloody hell there's me using the script haha :D
<BlackZ> xteejx: yes, it's included in the ubuntu-dev-tools package
<xteejx> sudo apt-get install grab-merge
<xteejx> oops wrong window ;)
<BlackZ> there's no need to do that
<BlackZ> just sudo apt-get install ubuntu-dev-tools
<shadeslayer> ahh i see thats how you use it :D
<xteejx> I have that installed, so I must already have it and not noticed hehe
<BlackZ> if you already have it, so you have grab-merge too
<shadeslayer> grab-merge webkitkde :P
<BlackZ> -so
<xteejx> BlackZ: Thanks, didn't know we had it in repo hehe
<xteejx> I think my last merge went well, debuild and pbuilder worked perfectly, updated changelog and edited the control file
<BlackZ> xteejx: oh, is it uploaded?
<xteejx> no have subscribed sponsors, awaiting a look
<xteejx> bug 592622
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 592622 in xtrs (Ubuntu) "please merge xtrs 4.9c-3.2 (multiverse) from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/592622
<BlackZ> ah, then just wait :)
<xteejx> What are the difference between the light/dark green merges?
<geser> different value in the Priority field of the package
<xteejx> ahhh :) thanks geser makes sense now
<nisshh> hey, id like to get my app into the ubuntu repos, didrocks told me id have to get it uploaded by a MOTU, can someone help me out?
<didrocks> nisshh: you should go to the REVU process (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU)
<nisshh> didrocks: yea i was just looking at that
<fabrice_sp> When happened the last sync of new packages from Debian? I'm trying to see is invalidating bug 589156 or not
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 589156 in Ubuntu "Request sync otcl (1.14~RC2+dfsg1-1), tclcl (1.20~RC2-2),ns2 (2.35~RC4-1), nam (1.15~RC3-1), ns3 (3.8-3) from Debian sid main" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/589156
<fabrice_sp> it seems that all this packages has been accepted on the 30th of May in Unstable
<ndemir> Hello. I am trying to understand the process of the packages for universe. I am looking packages in REVU and i can see packages that is not added to universe althoug it is in REVU for years. For example; here is a packaging wish for cdemu from 2007: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/105452 I saw that one of the answers to this wish is from the developer of cdemu. He created cdemu deb package and uploaded it to REVU and PPA. But it is still not in un
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 105452 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] cdemu" [Wishlist,In progress]
<ndemir> 105452
<ndemir>  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/105452
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 105452 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] cdemu" [Wishlist,In progress]
<ndemir> any answer?
<tumbleweed> ndemir: it takes some effort to get a package into Ubuntu. If the packager loses interest tehn someone else needs to do it
<ndemir> but it has been 3 years since the bug has been opened.
<ndemir> this is not about interest.
<ndemir> tumbleweed
<tumbleweed> ndemir: there are many bugs that have been opened that long. But not enough manpower to deal with them
<tumbleweed> if you want to get involved, wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs
<ndemir> tumbleweed: yes i want to get involved but first of all i want to understand the process. and it seems really interesting to me that the developer of an application creates a package for ubuntu nearly two years ago, but this package is still not in universe.
<ndemir> as i said, this is one of the similar situations.
<tumbleweed> ndemir: the way the process usually works, is:
<tumbleweed> the package gets maintained by someone in Debian, and gets pulled into Ubuntu
<tumbleweed> it's often not the developer of the application that maintains it
<tumbleweed> getting something into Debian isn't a once-off drive-by process - it needs someone who'll package future versions and deal with bugs
<ScottK> ndemir: We possibly have the manpower to review ~10% of the submissions we get properly.
<tumbleweed> packages can off course be maintained directly in Ubuntu, but that's rarer
<ndemir> ScottK, tumbleweed: i think now i understand the way you follow. Rather than maintaining the package directly in Ubuntu, you choose the way to get the package from Debian.
<ScottK> ndemir: If you have a focused interest in a package, that's usually better.
<tumbleweed> ndemir: maintainers in Debian look after their own packages. In Ubuntu almost all packages are maintained big a big group of people who don't know the packages they are working on. During each release cycle, we are lucky if a particular package gets looked at once.
<ndemir> Scottk, tumbleweed: So it means that it would be better if i would do the same thing. Is there a page that i can learn this process? The process that getting packages from Debian.
<tumbleweed> ndemir: this particular package isn't in Debian
<ndemir> tumbleweed: sorry. i did not understand.
<ScottK> ndemir: Once it's in Debian, we automatically sync up to Debian import freeze and then after that you can request to have new packages sync'ed up until feature freeze.  After that it will wait until the next release cycle
<tumbleweed> if you want to maintain cdemu, you can submit it to Debian. There is lots of documentation on that procss here: http://www.debian.org/doc/devel-manuals
<ScottK> Also see mentors.debian.net
<ndemir> ScottK and tumbleweed: thanks for your information. It seems that if i will maintain a new package i should do it for Debian. if i want to do something about packaging for Ubuntu, i should follow bugs.
<tumbleweed> ndemir: packages *can* be maintained in Ubuntu, but if they aren't ubuntu-specific it probably makes a lot more sense to do it in Debian
<tumbleweed> you've seen the REVU queue :)
<BlackZ> ndemir: the fact is it's better to upload them in debian
<BlackZ> it'd have more benefits
<BlackZ> and you will get BTW your work in ubuntu, with the sync
<tumbleweed> (and Debian is better suited to package maintainance)
<BlackZ> ndemir: but if you want to do something for ubuntu try fixing bugs or merging packages (just for example)
<tumbleweed> ndemir: there's packaging work to do in Ubuntu too, but it's more to do with fixing problems and syncing new versions over from Debian: wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
<MTecknology> "Some [proprietary licenses] may be called "free" licenses but have many limitations which you will not be aware of until you are in the middle of a lawsuit." MeThinks_TrueCrypt_License
<Rhonda> ScottK: Makes sense when thinking about how you do releases, thanks for the headsup. :)
<ScottK> You're welcome.
<imbrandon> afternoon all
<arand> Hrm, I'm trying to file a debian package update request but I'm not sure if this is proper: http://pastebin.org/325207
<tumbleweed> arand: yes (although there is another bug in the merged set of three). Have you tested to see if it does fix them?
<tumbleweed> did you see the requests for removal in 471642?
<arand> tumbleweed: Yes, and it was removed from testing
<tumbleweed> arand: I'd give you bug a title along the lines of "new upstream version (foo) fixes critical bugs"
<tumbleweed> (you could also just reply to 471642)
<arand> tumbleweed: I have not, hmm, I really should I guess, let's see if just slapping the new version as package-in-package like the old one does work..
<carstenh> arand: is there a way to test pango-graphite?
<arand> carstenh: I don't know, apart from making sure it doesn prevent all of gnome from starting on login
<arand> I'm not even half sure what it's meant to be doing. Only thing I know is that it's a downright nuisance at the moment..
<arand> carstenh: It seems like the new version fits in the packaging mold neatly though, it seems...
<carstenh> arand: I could just upload it, but I won't upload something I can't test.
<carstenh> you need to create a new orig.tar.gz containing the old one ... weird cdbs
<arand> Yea, but it doesn't seem to be much besides that in need of doing..
<carstenh> by testing I mean that I can see it does something, an empty package would also not cause a broken gdm
<carstenh> yes, packaging is easy, checking it the patch still applies must also be done. but someone needs to understand what this thing is supposed to do ;)
<carstenh> s/it/if/
<arand> afaik, if you install it, along with e.g. ttf-sil-doulos you should see a new font in use by default on the system, if I've understood things correctly...
<carstenh> I don't use something you would consider as "desktop environment"
<imbrandon> screen ? heh
<carstenh> and my default system font is "fixed"
<arand> Ah, well that makes things trickier I guess
<carstenh> imbrandon: still X, but nothing that looks like kde, gnome oder xfce4
<imbrandon> ahh
<arand> Right.. so the .orig. is just the proper upstream archive within an archive... :S
<carstenh> imbrandon: http://stateful.de/~carsten/tmp/100612OhP4MaAhIHE/screenshot.png nothing special, just no menus or panels ...
<arand> No nickcolor in irssi? How on earth do you cope?
<jpds> http://spooky.ubuntuwire.com/~jpds/Screenshot.png
<carstenh> arand: I already use all my colors in my prompt and if you got a good tft you see also different colored backgrounds ;) http://stateful.de/~carsten/tmp/100612E0lhWJBy8Yg/screenshot.png
<carstenh> arand: since this bug is release critical and also very old you can prepare a NMU (that means e.g. you choose -0.1 as debian revision number and you do not touch the packaging unless you really need to) and ask the sponsor to upload it to the delayed queue instead of reporting an additional bug. finding a sponsor who is able to test it does not seem to be easy, but you could at least try it by writing a mail to debian-mentors@lists.debian.org
<arand> Ok, so that's like an SRU but for debian?
<carstenh> a "Stable Release Update" is an update targeted at the stable release, right?
<carstenh> since the package is not in stable it is a bit different, but both have in common that they avoid needless changes
<carstenh> a "NonMaintainer Upload" fixes bug when the real maintainer does not have the time to do so but it should not change things that do not need to be changed, that is job of the maintainer
<carstenh> arand: http://www.debian.org/doc/developers-reference/pkgs.html#nmu
<arand> Hmm, right, I'm not sure a whole new version would pass by those requirement, especially when taken into account how much clue I have about the package's functionality itself..
<arand> (zilch)
<carstenh> arand: one thing might not be that obvious: using a debian revision number lower than the next maintainer upload would be in combination with uploading to the delayed queue is done to give the maintainer some time to upload his package, in this case the debian archive software throws your version away
<arand> But I'm building the new version on my maverick test machine now though, at least I can check i the bug apperas to have gone away..
<carstenh> arand: a whole new version is perfectly ok if nobody is willing to backport the fix, the requirements are less strict that when you do a SRU
<arand> carstenh: Ah, ok, well the package seems to have fallen somewhat out of maintenance as far as I can tell by the debian bug report..
<carstenh> arand: you need to build in a sid chroot (or pbuilder) and also upload the binary to the webspace you use to publish the package, debian does not use source-only uploads
<tumbleweed> arand: sounds like the lack of maintainance is upstream, not in debian. It's worth trying to get the DD to upload the new version before doing so in ubuntu
<arand> carstenh: Is that just a matter of "pbuilder-dist sid --create"?
<carstenh> tumbleweed: that's what he tries to (NMU)
<carstenh> ok, "the" DD ... he has still a chance to upload it before the NMU would move from delayed to the archive
<tumbleweed> NMUing new versions isn't really done, though
<carstenh> arand: i guess so, if pbuilder-dist lucid --create would be the correct command for lucid
<arand> carstenh: Ah, but I thought I had to use a sid chroot, no? I'm already using pbuilder for all my building otherwise)
<carstenh> tumbleweed: this bug is from 2008 and the new upstream version is from 2009. i don't see why one should wait longer and I already did NMUs for new versions
<tumbleweed> actually he does look very inactive
<carstenh> arand: pbuilder is a kind of a chroot
<carstenh> tumbleweed: one could argue if the package should be orphaned
<tumbleweed> carstenh: yeah, new versions are QA uploads, not orphaning
<tumbleweed> unfortunatly the orphaning process is slow
<carstenh> tumbleweed: there is even an example of a -0.1 NMU in the developers reference
<carstenh> | If a new upstream version is packaged in the NMU, the Debian revision is set to 0, for example 1.6-0.1.
<tumbleweed> yes
#ubuntu-motu 2010-06-12
<arand> Hmm, it's an improvement with the new version, but only slightly, it (seemingly) crashes gnome-panel upon installation of the ttf-sil-doulus font that goes along with it to induce the crash, and it also makes the first entry in the window list have a title of two dots... And only if you open a second window does they expand to show the full title...
<carstenh> NMU fits if you still think the maintainer should stay maintainer
<arand> So this is definitely not a clear-cut fix
<carstenh> arand: you should write this to one of these bugs and mention that you tested it on ubuntu and not debian
<arand> Hmm, hang on the last issue might be unrelated...
<arand> Ah, yea, that it just gnome-panel being funky..
<arand> (or something or other in maverick)
<arand> Hmm, that might've just been a solar flare.. I'm not seeing any issues now
<carstenh> arand: did firefox crash with the old version?
<arand> Hm, yea, can't reproduce the gnome-panel reset, now...
<arand> carstenh: Well on maverick I ended up with just the desktop background, no nautilus, no gnome-panel, etc. firefox crashed if i installed the combo "pango+ttf-sil-dou" and didn't log out, and it seems it *only* crashes many desktop apps on lucid, not affect base gnome stuff thus badly
<arand> Hrm, I'll try to make that more comprehensible..
<carstenh> arand: and the new version fixes these issues? do you think the package is ready to be uploaded?
<arand> Hmm, yes, the issues I saw seems to have been either due to some other maverick issue (present with the packages removed) Or a random solar flare (the respawn of gnome-panel on install) which I have not been able to reproduce...
<arand> I would think it's ready for upload though...
<arand> When I just install the old version, and try starting applications, pretty much none of them starts at all..
<arand> and if I then log out and login, I get no gnome-panel etc.
<carstenh> arand: I just try to reproduce it on sid
<arand> Hmm, you mean you are going to or that I should try?
<carstenh> ... and failed
<carstenh> I tried
<arand> Mind that you will need a font e.g. ttf-sil-doulos to go with it in order to get the crashing going.
<carstenh> [2]  + segmentation fault  command firefox "$@"
<arand> Hmm, so it is reproducible?
<carstenh> do you want me to test and upload your package? if so you need to upload it to revu, mentors.debian.net or any other webspace and tell me the uri of the dsc file
<carstenh> yes, it is
<carstenh> you would also need to write a mail to the bug (in this case after I uploaded it), the tool nmudiff helps you doing so
<arand> Ok, So it should be 0.9.3-0.1 for version, and then (Closes: #nnn) with the debian bug there, And "Non-maintainer upload", anything more that should go in the changelog? (Oh, and "New upstream" as well of course)
<arand> pbuilding in a lucid chroot is good enough?
<carstenh> yes, since i need to rebuild it anyway
<arand> Ok
<carstenh> the repackaging of the orig tarball could also be mentioned in the changelog
<carstenh> this is not obvious and not doucmented in README.Souce
<carstenh> +r
<arand> Ok (even though it follows the same procedure as earlier packaging?
<carstenh> "earlier packaging" is broken ;)
<carstenh> this should be written in a way the makes it clear that the unchanged original upstream tarball is included in the new one
<arand> Hmm, I have remade the package similarly, but it should be mentioned that I "remade it broken" just to point it out.
<carstenh> no
<carstenh> using /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/tarball.mk is perfectly ok, but it should be documented somewhere
<carstenh> the missing documentation is what i meant with broken
<arand> Ok
<carstenh> the next one who touches the package will need to open the changelog and see this and in case of a maintainer upload can create a file debian/README.Source to document this more in detail
<carstenh> just a short sentence, possibly only spawning one line is ok
<arand> "Unchanged original upstream tarball is included in the .orig.tar.gz" that ok?
<carstenh> "* Rebuild upstream tarball without win32 binaries." (tanken from an other package) sounds somehow better
<carstenh> it would be ok, this is just bikeshedding
<arand> I didn't know it did that... if it did?
<carstenh> arand: yours does not describe a change but a state
<arand> Ah, hmm...
<carstenh> * Create new orig.tar.gz including unchanged original upstream tarball due usage of cdbs' tarball.mk.
<carstenh> choose whatever you like, it does not matter at all
<arand> I'll just copy that I think :)
<carstenh> :)
<arand> Ok, and it builds, so I should upload it for you to get somewhere then?
<arand> Ah, pressed enter before confirming there
<arand> hang on...
<arand> carstenh: Ok, right, built installed and tested briefly the new one just to be doubly sure. It seems ok, would simply uploading to ubuntu-one and paste links or so suffice?
<carstenh> arand: if ubuntu-one speaks http, yes
<arand> http://pastebin.com/rVgUaz1t are the download links, hope they work.
<carstenh> arand: try dget http://stateful.de/~carsten/tmp/100612THdExm7CbqE/pango-graphite_0.9.3-0.1.dsc
<carstenh> arand: you can't do this with ubuntu one, thus ubuntu one is not appropriate for uploading debian packages. this time it is ok, I downloaded every file individually
<arand> Yea, I don't really have anywhere else to put files publicly though, unless I'd send them by email...
<carstenh> arand: mentors.debian.net?
<arand> Ah, I'll look at it.
<carstenh> arand: uploading is done using dput, though ftp should also work but is more work in this case
<arand> carstenh: Ah, up now, but some warnings of NMU, needing to be on the first line, important to fix?
<carstenh> arand: i fix this, no need to reupload because of this
<arand> (along with a whole lot of other warnings, which I'm not sure I can do much about atm): http://mentors.debian.net/cgi-bin/maintainer-packages?action=details;package=pango-graphite
<carstenh> I don't have access to this URL
<carstenh> but I can check lintian warnings myself ;)
<arand> oops http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/p/pango-graphite/
<arand> That's the one to point at is it?
<carstenh> it'S a lot better than ubuntu one, perfect would be http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/p/pango-graphite/pango-graphite_0.9.3-0.1.dsc :)
<arand> Ah, yea, true. First time i heard of this mentors place though :)
<carstenh> arand: everything looks fine, though I don't like the diff between the upstream versions ;)  I'll upload it soon
<arand> carstenh: Thanks! Should I take to commenting on the debian & ubuntu bugs as well?
<arand> Should an email be sent directly to current maintainer?
<carstenh> 01:27:04 < carstenh> you would also need to write a mail to the bug (in this case after I uploaded it), the tool nmudiff helps you doing so
<arand> Oops, sorry, ok then.
<carstenh> if there is no diff between ubuntu and debian it should be sync automatically and you could close these bugs or however this is handeld in ubuntu
<arand> Right, needs to be some SRUs done I guess, and I think we've got at least five reports in need of merging..
<carstenh> of course it must first migrate to ubuntu
<carstenh> SRU? how could this package migrate to lucid?
<carstenh> hmm, ok, it was in debian testing ...
<arand> Yea, and if reading the bug-log, it seems like the issue has been around since, well 8.04, so either removing it or trying to upgrade it, or even if they insist on finding a small diff for it...
<carstenh> i might have found it already ...
<carstenh> at least I saw some things in the diff that could fix segfaults
<arand> Aha! :) By the way, what should I put down as the DELAYED/XX value, what do you intend to upload it to?
<carstenh> arand: I prefer a longer interval, so 5 days should be ok in this case
<arand> carstenh: Ok, works for me. I'm mentioning you as the one to contact for a longer delay, that ok?
<arand> And also that you are the sponsor
<carstenh> what are you doing?
<arand> Trying to write the nmudiff mail
<carstenh> are you wrinting this mail by hand?
<arand> I'm editing the nmudiff template I'm given
<carstenh> oh, right ... there is this part I normally delete :)
<arand> Aha :D
<carstenh> yes, it's ok
<carstenh> thanks for fixing a release critical bug :)
<carstenh> I guess you need my email adress for doing so: "Carsten Hey <carsten@debian.org>"
<arand> I'm mentioning testing on ubu 10.10, should I mention aanything about sid?
<carstenh> I tested it on sid, if you mention testing on ubuntu you should also mention testing it on sid
<arand> carstenh: Hmm, this will show up on the bug report, right? Should I place emails in plain like that then?
<carstenh> yes, when I write a mail it is also plain
<arand> You've confirmed it working on sid then? Or just confirmed the bug?
<carstenh> both
<arand> Ok
<carstenh> and you don't need to write a novel. "I prepared a nmu fixing this rc bug by packaging the new upstream version, someone uploaded it to delayed/5, contact him if you want it to be moved to a different queue. arnad"
<arand> But I like novels :)
<carstenh> this would be enough, there is no comitee the reviews all bugs so similar
<carstenh> s/so/or/
<carstenh> did I mention that I uploaded it a while ago? if not: i did
<arand> Ok, let's see if send-mail managed to work that out.
<carstenh> arand: http://stateful.de/~carsten/tmp/100612DPBdDKxsig8/fileVXtHBK
<carstenh> arand: try if this also fixes the bug
<arand> I'll do.
<carstenh> arand: this is just all the autofoo and documentation changes removed
<carstenh> arand: same with useless whitespace changes removed: http://stateful.de/~carsten/tmp/100612YXv6da2FrcI/fileKKZNX9
<arand> Ok, cheers
<carstenh> arand: good night
<arand> Good, night, thanks for all the help!
<carstenh> you're welcome :)
<arand> For context in  diff, does it have to be equal amounts on both sides?
<tumbleweed> at the beginning or end in a file, it obviously won't be
<arand> tumbleweed: Hm, well if I edit it down to just three prior lines of context (as opposed to eight) it does work, but I can't for the life of me figure out why, I don't see where it fails... anyways, I'll just keep it at three I guess
<wgrant> Why are you manually altering diffs at all?
<arand> What is the correct way to go about it?
<arand> ..trying to make a patch apply..
<wgrant> I'm confused. I just... generate a diff with the 'diff' command.
<arand> So edit the file that are to be patched and generate a new diff rather?
<arand> I already have the diff from otherwhere.
<spiv> I think you can use the --fuzz option to patch to do that.  Or try the 'wiggle' command.
<arand> Hmm, fixed now, seems like a couple of lines from the original diff had gone missing mystersiously :/
<shadeslayer> hi i want to help with a ftbfs issue,whom do i approach? ( i know what caused this http://people.ubuntuwire.org/~lucas/ubuntu-nbs/64/plasma-widget-networkmanagement_0.9~svn1112085-0ubuntu4_lubuntu64.buildlog )
<lucas_> shadeslayer: you are on the correct channel
<shadeslayer> lucas_: i know that,but after i correct the error what do i do? fix in bzr and ask for merge?
<geser> create a debdiff (or a merge proposal) and file a sponsoring request (in this case you might also try to look for a sponsor in #kubuntu-devel)
<shadeslayer> awesome... ill ask Riddell :D
<shadeslayer> geser: any idea why https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/+source/plasma-widget-networkmanagement/+builds shows the builds are fine?
<shadeslayer_> hmm so the versions are the same.. but buildlog shows failure?
<geser> shadeslayer: because it was build in lucid and copied to maverick
<shadeslayer_> ahh... that is so wrong
<shadeslayer_> the library should now install the 4.5.0 version instead of the 4.4.0 version
<shadeslayer_> geser: so i should correct the packaging right?
<geser> yes
<anoteng> After uploading a package to revu, am I just supposed to wait until somebody notices it? Or should I ask for a review here, or do something else to draw attention to it?
<shadeslayer> geser: small question,suppose i want to find string in *.install file and list the file name as well,any command for that?
<geser> grep
<shadeslayer> geser: hmm.. i did cat *.install | grep something , but no filename
<geser> useless use of cat
<geser> grep something *.install
<shadeslayer> \o/
<shadeslayer> nice :D
<xteejx> bug 592328, terribly sorry guys, accidentally subscirbed universe-sponsors to that bug report, just to make you aware there's no debdiff or patch, again sorry about that wrong bug report
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 592328 in xmakemol (Ubuntu) "please merge xmakemol 5.16-4 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/592328
<hyperair> anoteng: you may request for reviews here, but please rate-limit your requests to at most once every 24 hours.
<ripps> ls
<lfaraone> If someone gives all users of Debian and Ubuntu a patent license for a certain patent, requires fees for its use elsewhere, but the code covered under the patent is GPL'd, can it be included in Universe?
<anoteng> I'd like a review of http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/transgui, this is an application I and many others use daily and I'd like to see it included in Ubuntu. I'm sure the pro's will find a lot of things for me to fix in the package though... bug #332067
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 332067 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] transmission-remote-gui" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/332067
<nigelb> lfaraone: best bet, there is a debian legal list or something
<nigelb> those folks are the pro at this, ask them
<geser> lfaraone: what about derivates from Debian or Ubuntu? do they need a license or are they covered by this license?
<nigelb> btw, you can have gpl *and* restrictions - that is not GPL
<nigelb> *cannot*
<nigelb> you *cannot* have gpl *and* restrictions - that is not GPL
<lfaraone> nigelb: GPLv2 doesn't talk about patents, I don't think.
<nigelb> lfaraone: ugh, we need a lawyer
<lfaraone> geser: I think the terms discussed with upstream would be something like "you can use this on Debian and Ubuntu desktop systems, as well as on its derivatives, but not on mobile devices"
<geser> lfaraone: hmm, that still might fail DFSG Â§8 (License Must Not Be Specific to Debian)
<geser> better ask debian-legal and/or the TB as the decision might differ for Debian and Ubuntu
<nigelb> lfaraone: http://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/
<lfaraone> geser: mk. wasn't sure if DFSG covered patents.
<nigelb> patents get murky, since all countries don't support software patents
<geser> lfaraone: I don't know either.
<Rhonda> nigelb: software patents are silly anyway because they patent an idea instead of a specific implementation, thus immensly hindering any progress - especially since they also grant almost trivial idea patents.
<nigelb> Rhonda: agreed, totally
<nigelb> Rhonda: if somone patented for loops, and another person patent while loops - image where we'd be :/
 * geser wants the patent for if :)
<Rhonda> lfaraone: And yes, restricting it to Debian and Ubuntu, and also the devices on which it might get used, makes it clearly non-free.
<Rhonda> nigelb: Well, there is also a patent for progress bars. Go figure.
<nigelb> geser: haha, I'm taking the '==' and '!' :p
<wgrant> But we have stuff in universe which clearly violates software patents outright.
<wgrant> And it was deliberately moved there because that was the only restriction.
<Rhonda> Now let's see wether I manage a lenny-backports version for wesnoth-1.8 1.8.2 before the karmic-backports version (1.8) gets approved.  :P
<nigelb> Rhonda: what the...
<Rhonda> wgrant: Patents that aren't likely to be enforced or are explicitly known to _not_ get enforced usually are ignored.
<nigelb> oh, some good news, number of patches in ubnutu awaiting review has gone down from 1952 to 1583 in 8 days \o/
<nigelb> can somone help me understand bug 491805?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 491805 in loqui (Ubuntu) "loqui.desktop file in the wrong place." [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/491805
<geser> what you don't understand?
<lfaraone> Rhonda: well, upstream mentiones on their site that there is "patent pending" on their work.
<lfaraone> Rhonda: http://stereopsis.com/flux/
<lfaraone> nigelb: the file is in X, it should be in Y.
<nigelb> geser: how do I fix it.  I didn't understand what I have to modify to fix it (actually I need to make sure if the patch there fixes things)
<nigelb> Also, it seems to be deleted from debian, probably because the package remains unchanged from 2005 :/
<geser> nigelb: I have trouble to understand the last question from comment #3 but the last patch looks fine and is ready to get applied.
<nigelb> geser: is this worth fixing? with no active development?
<nigelb> Its copied from ubuntu dapper for all releases so far
<nigelb> Also, interesting page I ran into via google for this package http://people.debian.org/~bartm/borg/missing.html
<Rhonda> Maybe sounds like an idea to get it removed.
<Rhonda> What was the reaons it got removed from Debian?
<nigelb> Rhonda: how do I find that? btw?
<nigelb> *bts?
<Rhonda> ftp-master.debian.org has the removal files
<nigelb> 10 MB text file, wow
<geser> I assume the package was never in Debian: http://www.mail-archive.com/dapper-changes@lists.ubuntu.com/msg11559.html
<nigelb> geser: see ubuntu changelog - we always too it from debian. I see unstable entries
<wgrant> Look at the Origin.
<wgrant> It's back from the dark days of syncing everything from everywhere.
<nigelb> From everywhere? What does that mean?
<nigelb> We've only synced from Debian I thought.
<wgrant> Once upon a time, we imported vast amounts of stuff from places like apt-get.org.
<wgrant> for no good reason that I know of, since it was somewhat before my time.
<nigelb> I just searched in the full removal list from debian, I don't see this package there.
<geser> nigelb: we usually sync only from Debian, but we can sync from any repository if we want
<geser> nigelb: because the package was never in Debian
<nigelb> geser: So, its synced from some other repository?
<geser> just because the changelog mentions unstable it doesn't mean that the package was in unstable
<nigelb> oh, I took that as indication till now
<geser> yes, see http://loqui.good-day.net/
<nigelb> well, development seems to have stopped in 2005
<tumbleweed> svn repo has activity 2009-12-23
<nigelb> so, whats the take, push the fix and leave it at that?
<nigelb> Also, I suspect the bug tracker and svn web interface is in japanese
<carstenh> arand: man rediff might be interesting for you, i used filterdiff to filter the upstream diff
<tumbleweed> carstenh: nice, haven't come across that before
<arand> carstenh: Ah, cheers, It turned out that for some reason there was a chunk missing in the middle of the diff, hence the issues. I've tested the reduced patch on maverick, and it seems to work well.
<carstenh> tumbleweed: I also found those only per accident ;) there are more useful utilities in patchutils
<tumbleweed> yeah, I'm busy reading up on it
<carstenh> arand: the nmudiff was a bit big, seems to be a bug in nmudiff when used with cdbs' tarball.mk
<carstenh> arand: i'm not sure if everything even in the reduced diff is needed, but it should at least be a good base to prepare the SRUs
<tumbleweed> carstenh: lol @espdiff
<carstenh> :)
<arand> Yea, I've pasted it to the LP report, as well as cleaned up the duplicates. Seems like this was the one and only bug ever bug in pango-graphite in ubu, that's saying something I guess...
<carstenh> how could one report additional bugs when nobody could use it because of this bug ;)
<arand> Yea.
<arand> Trying to get nmudiff to send the contents to a sane place was a horror though..
<carstenh> arand: you could just have pasted the changelog in this case
<carstenh> and skip the whole "attach diff" part
<arand> Ah, ok. I'll remeber that the next time..
<carstenh> arand: debian is less about strict rules or policies than ubuntu, common sense works in most cases
<carstenh> (in those cases where people don't show the required common sense there are still policies to point to)
<osieorb18> hello, oh great Masters of the Universe. I am looking for an Lpia architecture of GNOME Inform 7 for Linux. I would appreciate any help with getting this.
<arand> Hmm, I had always imagined kindof the opposite.
<carstenh> arand: if you depend on sponsors that reqiure you to adhere to more or less random policies before they sponsor your package "the opposite" might also be true ;)
<arand> Ah. :)
<carstenh> osieorb18: isn't lpia dead in ubuntu? (that's really a question, I'm not sure about this)
<arand> Yea lpia support was dropped recently, and a brief check shows that v7 isn't even in debian unstable yet..
<osieorb18> so is there any way of running the program on an lpia system? (I run Ubuntu Netbook Remix for the HP MIni)
<arand> You'll likely need to recompile as per the response you got over at linuxforums ;)
<carstenh> osieorb18: which version of ubuntu you run is also an important information
<osieorb18> When i try and do that I run into various sorts of problems.
<arand> osieorb18: What kinds?
<osieorb18> like the instructions say "run 'make'", but there are 2 makefiles (.am and .in) and neither of them run when I run make, and they run into other problems when I try changing the filenames
<carstenh> run ./configure first
<arand> You'll likely need to run some four of configure, aoutogen or similar first?
<osieorb18> yeah.
<osieorb18> after running ./configure, I'm supposed to run make
<carstenh> try ./configure || echo ./configure failed
<arand> osieorb18: But it seems the source is already setup for a debian package, so it should be a simple matter of debuild and then use pbuilder for convenience.
<arand> osieorb18: From the unpacked source directory, simply run "debuild -us -uc -S"
<osieorb18> pbuilder?
<arand> osieorb18: And then just sudo pbuilder --build ../gnome-inform7_5Z71-0ubuntu1.dsc
<osieorb18> hm
<arand> osieorb18: Make sure you have ubuntu-dev-tools installed, which should include pbuilder and the tools used by debuild
<osieorb18> ok, installing that.
<arand> osieorb18: pbuilder is a template chroot, an environment to build debian packages in conveniently, automatically resolving dependencies.
<osieorb18> ah I see.
<arand> osieorb18: You will need to create the environment first with "sudo pbuilder --create"
<osieorb18> sudo: pbuilder: command not found
<arand> Hmm, it may be that pbuilder is not included in your version of ubuntu-dev-tools then, well just "sudo apt-get install pbuilder" should do I guess
<arand> osieorb18: Oh, and it seem like this package has build dependencies from the universe repository...
<arand> osieorb18: So you'l need to conifgure pbuilder slightly
<arand> osieorb18: As per https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#Universe%20support
<arand> osieorb18: only the first "COMPONENTS" bit will be neccessary if you just build for ubuntu
<osieorb18> when I extract the .gz, I just get a single file. Is that supposed to happen?
<osieorb18> Also, .pbuildererrc doesn't exist.
<arand> osieorb18: It's two parts, .tar to bunch it up, .gz to compress, so to decompress you need to pass it through both. Luckily you can do it automatically by just passing -z for gzip to tar, like so: "tar -xzf I7_5Z71_GNOME_Source.tar.gz"
<arand> osieorb18: Yes, that's the default, to add the manual configs (e.g. "use universe") you'll have to create it and add the COMPONENTS line given in the wiki link.
<osieorb18> ah k
<osieorb18> when I do the pbuilder create step, I get: W: Failure trying to run: chroot /var/cache/pbuilder/build/8879/. mount -t proc proc /proc pbuilder: debootstrap failed  -> Aborting with an error  -> cleaning the build env      -> removing directory /var/cache/pbuilder/build//8879 and its subdirectories
<arand> osieorb18: Hmm, which version of ubuntu are you using?
<osieorb18> I know it's Ubuntu Netbook Remix for HP Mini, maybe 9.04? I'm not sure of exact numbers.
<arand> osieorb18: Make sure you have the: pbuilder debootstrap devscripts -packages installed
<osieorb18> yeah.
<osieorb18> have all of them
<arand> Hrm, do you hapen to have a CD/DVD enabled as a source?
<osieorb18> no, there is no CD/DVD drive
<geser> for which Ubuntu release do you try to build a pbuilder? maverick?
<osieorb18> Ubuntu Netbook Remix for HP Mini 110 9.10, Hardy.
<osieorb18> It's Ubuntu 9.10
<osieorb18> i think
<osieorb18> and is hardy
<arand> Hmm, maybe if you also add "MIRRORSITE=http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/" to the ~/.pbuilderrc file?
<arand> osieorb18: "lsb_release -a" would tell you
<osieorb18> No LSB modules are available. Distributor ID:	HP Mi (Mobile Internet) Description:	HP Mi (Mobile Internet) Release:	1.2 Codename:	None
<arand> Heh, seems like HP has actively removed it :/
<osieorb18> they did that for a lot of stuff. It's like they are trying to make a more "stupid-user"-friendly version of ubuntu.
<osieorb18> by hiding everything
<arand> osieorb18: But anyways, hardy is 8.04 and karmic is 9.10..
<osieorb18> hm
<osieorb18> it was compiling for hardy
<arand> osieorb18: Does adding that to your pbuilderrc make it happier?
<osieorb18> no, it's still failing
<osieorb18> wait oh must reconfig.
<osieorb18> no, still need to create...
<osieorb18> same failure: W: Failure trying to run: chroot /var/cache/pbuilder/build/10634/. mount -t proc proc /proc
<osieorb18> apparently the 10634 directory doesn't exist.
<arand> osieorb18: If you use uname -a and match up with kernel version at https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux you should be able to tell..
<arand> osieorb18: Could it be something weird like this: http://forum.ovh.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1942
<osieorb18> I'm thinking hardy, but I have 2.6.24-22-lpia, not any of what they have. hm
<osieorb18> yeah, that looks similar, I hadn't checked the syslog tho
<arand> So that might indocate that HP has stuck their own custom kernel in there, which is conflicting with chroot, or mount(?)...
<osieorb18> yeah, sounds quite likely
<tina__> I've upgraded to Lucid Lynx 10.04 ltd and now the system doesn't recognise the external hard drive- Seagate Expansion USB 2.0 Hard Drive. Is there some code I can cut and paste to get to the contents of the drive?
<geser> !support > tina__
<ubottu> tina__, please see my private message
<osieorb18> is there any simple way to check if HP has done something like that?
<arand> osieorb18: I don't know of one no.
<osieorb18> so I'm screwed unless I want to install a new version of ubuntu on here?
<arand> osieorb18: Well at this stage it will likely be more convenient mucking about with the dependencies outside of the chroot.
<osieorb18> hm
<arand> osieorb18: so remove pbuilder (if you did install it manaually, and don't want it/intend to give up on that)
<osieorb18> k
<arand> then have a look in the debian/control file in the source directory
<carstenh> arand: mails to control@bugs.debian.org do not show up in the main bug page, mails to bugnumber@bugs.debian.org do. you need to write to both if you want one mail to show up in the main bug page and also set the bug to pending or similar.
<arand> osieorb18: There under "Build-Depends:" it will list all the packages you need tom make sure you have installed to build it.
<carstenh> arand: man bts could be interesting if you just want to write a mail to control@...
<arand> carstenh: Ok, I tried sending to both at once, bcc:ing control@ but that just failed with no response at all, it did work is I sent two separately to each of them, it seems :/
<osieorb18> arand: ok installing
<arand> osieorb18: You may want to keep track of which of these packages you installed anew, and which were already installed before, so you can remove the new ones after you've completed building it.
<arand> But it may just be that I failed to setup mutt to send correctly to BTS...
<carstenh> arand: weird, this should have worked, maybe the bbc: was the problem.  there is no reason to use bcc: since there is no reason to hide that you did _not_ forget to write the mail also to control@ ;)
<carstenh> s/bbc/bcc/
<osieorb18> ok, so those are installed.
<arand> Ah, well, nmudiff seemed to send that template to mutt, so I just went along with it...
<arand> osieorb18: Then in the source directory, just run "debuild -uc -us"
<osieorb18> hm, says to install pbuilder again
<arand> ...I think, no -S will make it build and compile as well afaik..
<dupondje> doing the weekly merges/syncs :)
<dupondje> hÃ©hÃ©
<carstenh> arand: if bcc:ing control is default in nmudiff it does not seem to be the problem, someone would have noticed it already if there is such a misconfiguration in some mail filter that is trigered by default.
<osieorb18> arand: so now what.
<arand> osieorb18: I guess you could try to install it and run it but..
<arand> osieorb18: What is the error message it gives?
<osieorb18> Use of uninitialized value in pattern match (m//) at /usr/bin/dpkg-source line 429. dpkg-source: warning: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but Maintainer: does not have Ubuntu address dpkg-source: warning: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but there is no XSBC-Original-Maintainer field dpkg-source: building gnome-inform7 in gnome-inform7_5Z71-0ubuntu1.tar.gz dpkg-source: building gnome-inform7 in gnome-inform7_5Z71-
<arand> osieorb18: If it's lengthy, use pastebin
<arand> !pastebin
<ubottu> For posting multi-line texts into the channel, please use http://paste.ubuntu.com | To post !screenshots use http://tinyurl.com/imagebin | !pastebinit to paste directly from command line | Make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic.
<arand> osieorb18: It got cut off at "building gnome-inform7 in gnome-inform7_5Z71-..."
<gusnan> What's up with "This package could not be extracted; there's no browsable directory for it on REVU." - seems to affect quite a lot of the packages on revu.
<osieorb18> arand: I can't seem to set up pastebin easily, and I need to go and attend to some other business. I should be back on in an hour or less to struggle over it some more.
<dupondje> merge 5 :p
<dupondje> lol this goes fast
<alket> hi
<rlameiro> hello everyone
<rlameiro> i am thinking now on learnong packaging
<rlameiro> is it a good start, trying to package a python script?
<rlameiro> or should i focus on compiled software?
<fabrice_sp> rlameiro, Hi
<carstenh> rlameiro: choose the one you know most about, if you program mostly in C you should package something written in C. another option is learning how to package software by fixing bugs in existing packages.
<rlameiro> hi
<fabrice_sp> you can also fix existing packages
<rlameiro> i make some python, hence the question
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: are you working on the etherboot merge?
<fabrice_sp> we still have some packages that are not installable / buildable with python 2.6
<rlameiro> this is for starting, my idea is to help the ubuntustudio project packaging things and send them to REVU
<fabrice_sp> BlackZ, no, because I saw that actual package has a critical bug
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: which one?
<fabrice_sp> let me check
<fabrice_sp> bug 570870
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 570870 in etherboot (Ubuntu Lucid) "pxe boot doesn't work with kvm" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/570870
<fabrice_sp> the proposed fix is in -proposed right now
<fabrice_sp> BlackZ,
<BlackZ> thank you fabrice_sp
<fabrice_sp> Do you hace special interest in etherboot?
<BlackZ> fabo: not really, I'd say more or less
<BlackZ> ops, fabrice_sp
<BlackZ> sorry fabo, tab mistake
<fabrice_sp> ok: so you're not looking for merges :-)
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: I was looking for some packages to be merged and I've found it too
<fabrice_sp> you can take the console-braille merge
<fabrice_sp> (if it makes sense)
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: sure
<fabrice_sp> cool :-)
<fabrice_sp> I'm justtrying to see if a package now builds in armel, and I have to install qemu...
 * fabrice_sp is just following armel for dumb wiki page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ARM/RootfsFromScratch
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: done! bug #593143
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 593143 in console-braille (Ubuntu) "Please merge console-braille 1.2 (universe) from debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/593143
<fabrice_sp> that fast!
<fabrice_sp> :-)
<fabrice_sp> you can check openturns meanwhile
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: looking
<fabrice_sp> this is a package that builds in 2 hours... :-)
<fabrice_sp> IIRC
<kklimonda> a/b 2
<fabrice_sp> hmmm a=4?
<fabrice_sp> hmm, anyone with a working armel qemu image? Mine doesn't seems to boot... :-/
<tumbleweed> fabrice_sp: I installed a sid one a week or two back. Let me try maverick
<fabrice_sp> tumbleweed, this is to check if atlas builds: https://launchpad.net/bugs/586760
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 586760 in atlas (Ubuntu) "Please merge atlas 3.8.3-22 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,In progress]
<fabrice_sp> thx!
<fabrice_sp> have to go. bbl
<carstenh> fabrice_sp: http://people.debian.org/~aurel32/qemu/armel/ has one for lenny
<dupondje> 7 syncs / merges today :)
<fabrice_sp> carstenh, not sure that the problem in buildds for Ubuntu will show up with sid. I'll try
<tumbleweed> fabrice_sp: I see maverick doesn't have a working debian-installer on armel. building a rootstock root
<fabrice_sp> this is what I tried, but the image does not boot...
<fabrice_sp> I may test with a lucid one, instead
<fabrice_sp> (the problem was happening in lucid)
<dupondje> Got a question about a package
<dupondje> http://patches.ubuntu.com/d/dia-newcanvas/dia-newcanvas_0.6.10-5.1ubuntu2.patch
<dupondje> is that build-depends change really needed?
<dupondje> its totally at the bottom btw :)
<fabrice_sp> dupondje, build the package and see if the dependency is duplicated
<dupondje> it builds without problesm
<dupondje> problems*
<geser> dupondje: this isn't a change in build-depends but a change in depends for libdiacanvas2. Check the Depends line for the libdiacanvas2 deb
<dupondje> hmz, its not even a dual depend...
<geser> the script which does the depends line, merges it IIRC
<geser> what version does the libgtk2.0-0 depends have with and without this change in the resulting deb?
<dupondje> how to check that exactly ?
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: debian/rules:7: /usr/share/cdbs/1/class/python-module.mk: Nessun file o directory, what's the package there? I'm not sure
<geser> dupondje: less package_ver.deb (if you use lesspipe) or dpkg-deb -I package_ver.deb
<carstenh> fabrice_sp: upgrading from lenny to ubuntu maverick could work
<geser> BlackZ: cdbs
<fabrice_sp> carstenh, good idea, yes. Will try tomorrow.
<BlackZ> geser: yeah, I have it, but when I run 'debuild -S -sa' I get thatr
<BlackZ> -r*
<dupondje>  Depends: libc6 (>= 2.7), libglade2-0 (>= 1:2.6.1), libglib2.0-0 (>= 2.24.0), libgtk2.0-0 (>= 2.8.0)
<dupondje> without the change :)
<BlackZ> seems it wants a package which isn't available
<fabrice_sp> dupondje, the change is not needed then
<geser> dupondje: like fabrice_sp said; looks good without the change
<dupondje> ok lets sync :D
<fabrice_sp> BlackZ, it's in cdbs in sid
<fabrice_sp> but not in Maverick, it seems. A merge is needed ;-)
<fabrice_sp> !info cdbs maverick
<ubottu> cdbs (source: cdbs): common build system for Debian packages. In component main, is optional. Version 0.4.83ubuntu1 (maverick), package size 1172 kB, installed size 1632 kB
<fabrice_sp> sid is 0.4.84
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: well, I will try to work on it
<tumbleweed> fabrice_sp: btw, rootstock built
<fabrice_sp> BlackZ, check with the latest uploader first, just in case
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: sure
<fabrice_sp> tumbleweed, cool
<fabrice_sp> Have to go now. CU tomorrow. Bye
<ari-tczew> debfx: ping
<ari-tczew> debfx: your change in kadu (B-D on libqt4-webkit-dev) is crashing my PC.
<osieorb18> anyone else have lpia architecture?
<geser> lpia got abandoned with lucid (or was it even karmic?)
<osieorb18> karmic I think might have been the last one.
<osieorb18> I've been having trouble compiling tho
<osieorb18> so if someone else can make an installable file for lpia that would be great
#ubuntu-motu 2010-06-13
<lfaraone> Is there any real restriction beyond "we can distribute the binary legally" with software in multiverse? Can binary-only software be distributed this way?
<JanC> lfaraone: as long as there are no restrictions about distributing and (very important!) redistributing, that's the only restrictions AFAIK
<JanC> for example Adobe's flash plugin doesn't allow re-distribution, so it can't go into multiverse as is
<lfaraone> JanC: okay. how do we evaluate SRUs for binary-only software in multiverse? If upstream or someone with access to the source provides a new binary, we can't audit that they followed the SRU criteria, right?
<JanC> lfaraone: I suppose you'd have to rely on their word, which is exactly why open source software is preferred...
<JanC> and I have no idea if there is any official process for that currently
<lfaraone> JanC: okay, thanks.
<paultag> Hey MOTU. I'm looking to practice debian-izing a small app that I wrote. It's in python. What should I be doing to make my debianizing life easy down the road ( only thing I can think of is build system, but I'm sure there is more )
<paultag> and by debianizing, I mean rolling it into a .deb, this is Ubuntu only ( a small app for an Ubuntu team )
<paultag> not that that matters :)
<paultag> Anyone? Bueller?
<micahg> paultag: are you packaging for the archive or for your own use?
<paultag> micahg, PPA, I am not going to be guidelines strict. I get a lot of that upstream
<micahg> paultag: ok, then we have a special channel for that: #ubuntu-packaging, but being the weekend, idk who's around, so patience is suggested
<paultag> micahg, I don't quit freenode often :)
<paultag> micahg, thanks :)
<micahg> paultag: np
<fabrice_sp> Hi. atlas is FTBFS because "Warning: In order to build Atlas under i386, you need the CPU extension sse3 available on your CPU"
<fabrice_sp> is there any buildds that have sse3 capability?
<fabrice_sp> or they are all virtualized?
<tumbleweed> fabrice_sp: ran atlas on armel all night. It still loops
<fabrice_sp> tumbleweed, thanks for trying :-)
<tumbleweed> np
<fabrice_sp> what is strange is that is doesn't seem to loop on Debian :-/
<fabrice_sp> bug in compiler?
<tumbleweed> dunno, can't see anything obvious. But I'm off hiking this morning - will have a look later
<fabrice_sp> good hiking then :-)
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: openturns merge finished, I'm building it right now
<arand> Can the debian packaging be GPLv3 when something that is packaged (e.g. images sounds) are under a "only along with this software and no modification"-type of license?
<BlackZ> arand: just specify in the debian/copyright file other licenses of the software
<BlackZ> specifying the files
<arand> Yea, There's a whole tonne of them, since there's different contributors etc.
<arand> So the GPL only applies to the debian/ folder, regardless of what is packaged then?
<BlackZ> arand: yes, and the other files with the GPL license applied
<BlackZ> arand: you can follow http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/dep/web/deps/dep5.mdwn?op=file&rev=135
<arand> Oh, that's something to delve into alright..
<EricBa> Please could someone revu my package at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=cortina
<EricBa> i ment review
<EricBa> hier kriegt man nie ne antwort oder?
<geser> EricBa: most people are idle, especially on weekends. And to find reviewers is at all times hard.
<EricBa> i tried many times befor
<EricBa> many days
<geser> you are not the only person who has trouble to find a reviewer as only a few MOTUs do reviews
<fabrice_sp> EricBa, I'll have a look
<fabrice_sp> but I see 6 uploads a day, I don't know if it's still stable enough
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: merge of openturns finished bug #593284 it builds!
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 593284 in openturns (Ubuntu) "Please merge openturns 0.13.2-4 (universe) from debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/593284
<fabrice_sp> BlackZ, cool: I'll have a look later (I'm processing the sponsoring queue)
<fabrice_sp> thanks ;-)
<fabrice_sp> EricBa, here?
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: if you don't want to build it, http://launchpadlibrarian.net/50262430/buildlog_ubuntu-maverick-i386.openturns_0.13.2-4ubuntu1~maverick1_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz
<BlackZ> the build will take around 1 hr
<fabrice_sp> I know :-/
<EricBa> yes
<fabrice_sp> I always build locally, to check the resulting deb file
<fabrice_sp> why are all dependency with versions?
<fabrice_sp> it will make harder backporting, excp if mandatory
<EricBa> it needs that version
<EricBa> ok pkg-config and dbus dont need a version
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: so you will build it locally ?
<fabrice_sp> sorry: have to go. Will check later
<fabrice_sp> BlackZ, yes
<ScottK> fabrice_sp: Even for i686 you can't assume sse2, so something needs to be done run time to detect if sse2 is present or not and not use it if it isn't.
<fabrice_sp> ScottK, so what would be the fix for atlas in i386?
<fabrice_sp> I can desactivate the detection of sse3, but I'm not sure the package will be usable
<fabrice_sp> it compiles fine in amd64
<tumbleweed> Automatically Tuned Linear Algebra Software - that says it all :/
<tumbleweed> fabrice_sp: I've been looking at the armel build log, I'm not convinced that it wouldn't have eventually finished
<fabrice_sp> so just slowness?
<tumbleweed> very very slow. It keeps tuning things until it's happy, as far as I can tell
<jpds> The arms are slow.
 * tumbleweed is trying another build - a few days this time...
<tumbleweed> jpds: I gave it about 8 hrs
<fabrice_sp> I've desactivated it in the last upload, so until someone complains that there is no armel build of atlas, it will stay that way
<fabrice_sp> the worst part is that the i386 build failed because of missing sse3 instruction in the buildds...
<fabrice_sp> so right now, atlas is broken
<tumbleweed> hmm: from debian's build logs:
<tumbleweed> Build needed 42:20:15, 216776k disc space
<fabrice_sp> 42 hours?! not too bad :-)
<tumbleweed> that'll be on real hardware though, probably a lot faster (and doesn't segfault like qemu)
<fabrice_sp> the armel buildds in Ubuntu are real hardware or qemu?
 * tumbleweed was going to ask the same thing
<fabrice_sp> :-)
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: Warning: In order to build Atlas under i386, you need the CPU extension sse3 available on your CPU
<BlackZ> are you afraid to enable it?
<tumbleweed> BlackZ: we can't require sse3 on i386
<fabrice_sp> BlackZ, and this is in the buildds, not in my computer ;-)
<jpds> fabrice_sp: Real hardware.
<fabrice_sp> BlackZ, it's detected with cpuinfo
<fabrice_sp> jpds, thx
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: ahhh, hmm ...
<tumbleweed> fabrice_sp: oh you mean it needs sse3 for building a version that doesn't require sse3?
<fabrice_sp> tumbleweed, not sure about not requiringsse3 to run, but build requires it
<fabrice_sp> I have to disable the sse3 detection, and upload to a ppa, to test
<fabrice_sp> BlackZ, your comment in Bug 589120 means that it can be a sync?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 589120 in osmo (Ubuntu) "Please merge osmo 0.2.10-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/589120
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: no, there's another change
<fabrice_sp> ok: I've seen so many nug reports this afternoon that I don't remember each of them :-)
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: check in the changelog file
<fabrice_sp> ok
<fabrice_sp> about atlas: it build sse3 packages: libatlas3gf-sse3
<tumbleweed> ah right. and it probably wants to test them so it can tune
<fabrice_sp> exactly
<tumbleweed> time for canonical to upgrade the buildd farm :)
<fabrice_sp> hmm, my guess is that I will desactivate the optimized version :-D
<jpds> tumbleweed: There's no better armel hardware to upgrade to.
<tumbleweed> jpds: no I mean sse3
 * jpds looks at wikipedia.
<ScottK> fabrice_sp: sse2 detection needs to be done at run time.
<ScottK> I'm not sure what needs to be done to achieve that.
<tumbleweed> ScottK: this is for a -sse3 package
<ScottK> Oh.
<ScottK> Ignore me then.
 * fabrice_sp has just uploaded a package that deltes all sse3 packages and 'downgrade' builds to sse2
<fabrice_sp> BlackZ, why the second hcnage is still required?
<fabrice_sp> IIRC, -DGTK_DISABLE_DEPRECATED is used to avoid error on deprecated methods
<fabrice_sp> anyone can confirm that?
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: I think to allow to package
<BlackZ> why drop it?
<fabrice_sp> It seems that the comment is broken :-)
<fabrice_sp> BlackZ, and this would allow us to sync the package ;-)
<fabrice_sp> no bug is referenced, so it's hard to find why it has been changed
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: then feel free to rename the bug and delete the patch
<BlackZ> I can't right now
<fabrice_sp> if I were sure, I would have done it already :-)
<fabrice_sp> I'll try to build 0.2.8-1ubuntu1 in lucid, to see if it FTBFS
<fabrice_sp> BlackZ, 0.2.8-1ubuntu1 FTBFS in lucid, so that would explain the fix
<fabrice_sp> I'll convert the bug to a sync request and ack it
<dupondje> If something is ftbfs on armel, can we somewhere retry to build it to see if it build now ?
<tumbleweed> dupondje: on your own qemu
<dupondje> no other way ?
 * tumbleweed has one set up if you want me to test for you
<dupondje> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/loop-aes-utils/2.16.2-1/+build/1764607 => is quit a strange error :s
<tumbleweed> that looks like a compiler bug
<dupondje> gcc is upgraded
<dupondje> so maby it works now
<tumbleweed> ok, I'll test
<tumbleweed> yay, qemu segfault :)
<dupondje> lol
<tumbleweed> dupondje: building (it probably won't segfault again until its done)
<dupondje> what was wrong ? :)
<tumbleweed> IO seems to cause it. it aften segfaults soon after running aptitude
<dupondje> I hate it when merges reported are lagging :)
<dupondje> accept them :D
<dupondje> its still building ? ;)
<dupondje> https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html => what are the different colors btw ? :)
<tumbleweed> dupondje: yes, it's slow
<tumbleweed> hah. I had to read the source to answer that for myself
<tumbleweed> the colours are for debian priorities
<tumbleweed> it really should say at the top "ordered by by priority"
<tumbleweed> dupondje: same build error
<dupondje> crap :(
<anoteng> I'd like a review of http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/transgui . This is an application I and many others use daily, and I'd like to see it included in Ubuntu. I'm sure the pro's will find a lot of things for me to fix in the packageâ¦ bug #332067
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 332067 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] transmission-remote-gui" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/332067
<fabrice_sp> anoteng, version should be 0ubuntu1, target maverick
<fabrice_sp> run update-maintainer to use latest value for maintainer
<Rhonda> Alright. wesnoth-1.8 v 1.8.2 hit lenny-backports earlier than wesnoth-1.8 v 1.8 did hit karmic-backports.  %-)
<arand> Is it possible to manage binary changes in the diff.gz? e.g. I'm adding an image, am I needed to stick it in the .orig.? (I'm not packaging with policy in mind..)
<Rhonda> arand: With source format 3.0 (quilt) it's possible to manage binary changes.
<Rhonda> Because it will be .debian.tar.gz instead of .diff.gz
<arand> Ah, ok, I'm not using 3.0 then I guess.. Well making an .xpm of the image works as my quickfix :/
<tumbleweed> arand: that are base64
<tumbleweed> or
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: could you look at bug #593416 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 593416 in qemu (Ubuntu) "Please merge qemu 0.12.4+dfsg-2 (universe) from debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/593416
<fabrice_sp> BlackZ, strange enough: there is no qemu in maverick :-/
<fabrice_sp> from karmic: Deleted in karmic-release on 2009-09-24  (Reason: merged into qemu-kvm,
<BlackZ> hmm, but it provides the 'qemu' package
<BlackZ> (seems the old one)
<fabrice_sp> so sorry: it seems that you worked on a dead-end merge
<fabrice_sp> yeah: the qemu package is the old one
<BlackZ> ok, marking as invalid
<fabrice_sp> seems so
<BlackZ> please, unsubrscribe U-S
<fabrice_sp> I found strange qemu in universe
<fabrice_sp> done
<BlackZ> fabrice_sp: so you could look at bug #590158 :P
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 590158 in amsn (Ubuntu) "Please merge amsn 0.98.3-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/590158
 * fabrice_sp hates merges from -0ubuntu1 versions :-)
<fabrice_sp> I'll have a look tomorrow :-)
<BlackZ> heh thanks fabrice_sp !
<fabrice_sp> yw!
<fabrice_sp> thanks to you to work on that!
<fabrice_sp> really
#ubuntu-motu 2011-06-06
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> hiya
<tumbleweed> micahg: are you a core-dev these days? :) bug 792616
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 792616 in python-scipy (Ubuntu) "Sync python-scipy 0.9.0+dfsg1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/792616
<tumbleweed> oh, why did I think that was main?
 * tumbleweed hasn' thad enough sleep
<matttbe> Hello,
<matttbe> I'm looking for a sponsor for 3 packages:
<matttbe> * Cairo-Dock: it's a bugs fixed version => bug 786104
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 786104 in cairo-dock (Ubuntu) "Please update Cairo-Dock to 2.3.0~2.1 version (bugs fixed only)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/786104
<matttbe> * Cairo-Dock Plug-Ins: bugs fixed version too => bug 786105
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 786105 in cairo-dock-plug-ins (Ubuntu) "Please update Cairo-Dock Plug-Ins to 2.3.0~2.1 version (bugs fixed only)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/786105
<matttbe> * Gthumb: we are currently not able to install GThumb on Ubuntu Oneiric due to the new version of libbrasero-media3 => bug793438
<matttbe> is someone can help me? Thank you :)
<matttbe> A bzr branch has been linked to these 3 bug reports, so it should be easy to fix I think
 * tumbleweed sees them in the sponsorship queue
<tumbleweed> if there's no rush, someone will get to them
<matttbe> tumbleweed: ok no problem, it's just because the cairo-dock branches have been added more than 2 weeks ago and Gthumb doesn't work. But it's not urgent for Oneiric ;)
<matttbe> But if someone want to sponsor them, I'm here if he wants some details
<micahg> tumbleweed: not unless I missed something :)
<tumbleweed> micahg: no, I was being an idiot. It happens quite often :)
<anarcat> hi
<anarcat> how do i get a package *removed* from ubuntu?
<anarcat> i have opened a bug in the package, but since I'm the maintainer, i figured i could do a bit more https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/aegir-provision/+bug/793567
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 793567 in aegir-provision (Ubuntu) "remove from ubuntu" [Undecided,New]
<micahg> anarcat: file a bug and subscribe ubuntu-sponsors if you can't upload it
<anarcat> okay, done
<micahg> anarcat: no, you "subscribe someone else", not also affects project
<tumbleweed> anarcat: (hi, btw) the archive admins also occasionally remove packages that were removed from debian, by themselves.
<micahg> anarcat: it's already been removed from Ubuntu oneiric
<anarcat> tumbleweed: hi :) this was has been removed for a while now!
<anarcat> micahg: oh.
<anarcat> what a mess have i done...
<tumbleweed> nah, np
<micahg> anarcat: don't worry about it :)
<anarcat> ok
<anarcat> er
<anarcat> so
<anarcat> do i need to do anything more here? :)
<tumbleweed> mark the bug invalid
<anarcat> but it's still in lucid/maverick... can't it be removed there?
<lucidfox> no
<lucidfox> and no need for it
<anarcat> why is that?
<lucidfox> If a package shipped in an earlier Ubuntu release, it will continue to be supported for the rest of that release's support cycle
<anarcat> it should *not* be supported :)
<anarcat> nobody in his right mind should be installing that stuff :)
<tumbleweed> is it actually going to do any damange? or just not work?
<anarcat> tumbleweed: it's confusing users right now
<anarcat> we have install instructions that tell them to add another archive to their sources.list, but sometimes they mess up
<anarcat> and then end up installing 0.3 and come back complaining it's not working :)
<anarcat> so yeah, it's creating problems - and doing damage :P
<lucidfox> Why not just upload a working version over this one?
<anarcat> because the "working version" is not policy-compliant
<anarcat> it duplicates code from the drupal6 package, it doesn't cleanup after itself
<anarcat> there's a bunch of issues that should keep it away from the debian (and ubuntu?) archives
<tumbleweed> can the version in the archive not be fixed to do no damage? (even if it doesn't work very well)
<anarcat> i wouldn't bother...
<anarcat> it's very old
<anarcat> and upgrading between the two is quite hard
<evaluate> anarcat, you could contact the original maintainer of the package in Debian, he might be willing to help packaging and even sponsor it. Also, you could look into the packaging of the old version, to se how they fixed them (if it's applicable).
<anarcat> so in short - no
<anarcat> i am the original maintainer
<evaluate> I see.
<anarcat> i am the maintainer of the debian package, and i'm the lead of the upstream project :)
<anarcat> doing my best here :P
<tumbleweed> anarcat: stable releases will always have old packages in them, stable tends to imply old
<anarcat> packaging this sucker is quite a challenge
<evaluate> And can't the package be fixed so that it complies with the packaging standards?
<anarcat> evaluate: i will not fix 0.3
<anarcat> and 1.1 will be hard, but it's on my todo...
<anarcat> it's just... hard
<evaluate> Yeah, I meant the new one.
<anarcat> see this for the gory details: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=532923#26
<ubottu> Debian bug 532923 in wnpp "ITP: aegir-provision -- backend of the Aegir hosting system" [Wishlist,Open]
<anarcat> any feedback and help here would be strongly appreciated
<evaluate> In #3 you mention "upstream". Didn't you say *you* were upstream?
<anarcat> yes, i am part of the upstream team
<evaluate> Well, #3 at least should be fixed in upstream.
<anarcat> i agree, but it's just more work for me :P
<evaluate> The FHS isn't Debian specific, but *nix specific, so your application should normally conform to that.
<anarcat> i am aware of that
<anarcat> as i said
<anarcat> the package is not ready to get into debian or ubuntu
<anarcat> but it's better than the manual install
<anarcat> *so* the older package should be removed
<evaluate> anarcat, are the patched from the version in lucid/maverick to the working one big?
<anarcat> yes.
<evaluate> I'm not aware of the actual procedure in such a case, but if the currently packaged version isn't working *at all*, it might justify a SRU
<anarcat> see this huge bump: https://www.ohloh.net/p/aegirproject/analyses/latest
<anarcat> that's 0.4 :P
<blackmoon-105> hi, in the "libsm6" package, .so files are under  /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/  but  they should be under /usr/lib  Or i'm wrong?
<micahg> blackmoon-105: no, that's multiarch :)
<evaluate> anarcat, anyway, I'd guess a SRU might rather be an option than a complete removal. But micahg or tumbleweed could probably tell you more on this...
<blackmoon-105> micahg: i've asked this because when i compile wxWidget it is unable to find libsm in the x86_64-linux-gnu  only if it's under /user/lib
<blackmoon-105> */usrlib
<blackmoon-105> **  /usr/lib/
<micahg> blackmoon-105: right, it needs to be fixed for multiarch
<blackmoon-105> micahg: so it's a wxwidget bug?
<micahg> blackmoon-105: well, yes, to some extent, the lib path appears to be hardcoded
<micahg> blackmoon-105: actually, I haven't looked at the packaging, so I shouldn't say that
<tumbleweed> evaluate, anarcat: This just isn't something I have any experience in dealing with. We much prefer minimal patches for SRUs, but for broken leaf packages like this, version updates are possible. However you don't have a new release to replace it with, so things get messy :/
<tumbleweed> I don't know how the SRU team would respond to replacing it with an empty package saying "removed, totally broken". I suspect you'd have to argue that there's no way anyone could possibly be using it.
<blackmoon-105> micahg: maybe i should report thi issue in launchpad, if isn't already reported
<micahg> blackmoon-105: sure, you can tag it multiarch
<blackmoon-105> micahg: ok, thank you
<anarcat> tumbleweed: well, people *could* use it, but the problem is it's much less featured and much more confusing than the later versions
<anarcat> i wouldn't recommend anybody using that version
<anarcat> as then they would have a hard time upgrading to latter versions
<anarcat> tumbleweed: the other thing is that this is blocking a backport...
<anarcat> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/drush/+bug/755169
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 755169 in drush (Ubuntu) "Backport drush 4.4-1 from natty to lucid, maverick" [Undecided,In progress]
<ScottK> anarcat: The only times I'm aware of packages being removed from releases were for legal reasons where they turned out not to be legally distributable or one case of a very security sensitive application being removed because people were being exploited.
<tumbleweed> anarcat: sounds like its best to leave it alone then, it doesn't sound too bad.
<ScottK> anarcat: It won't block the backport.  I just commented in the bug (I run the Ubuntu Backports project).
<lucidfox> Okay, and that leaves all REVU packages from 2010 reviewed
<lucidfox> I really should have got to it earlier... Like, say, in the natty cycle :p
<lucidfox> On that note, why does the reviewer icon on REVU look like the Tetragrammaton symbol from Equilibrium?
<paultag> lucidfox: I LOVE THAT MOVIE!
<paultag> What a fantastic film
<paultag> never noticed that, hahaha
<micahg> bdrung: BTW, I tried to file the eclipse sync over the weekend, but requestsync didn't work on natty or oneiric (0.122 and 0.124)
 * micahg filed a bug on the crash
<bdrung> micahg: there is already a bug report for that
<bdrung> micahg: you have to file the sync manually
<micahg> well, the retracer should dupe then
<micahg> bdrung: ok, will do tonight
<micahg> jtaylor: can you take a look at bug #793695, it seems similar to the other one you fixed
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 793695 in storm (Ubuntu) "package python-storm 0.18-0ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: unable to open '/usr/share/pyshared/storm-0.18.egg-info/top_level.txt.dpkg-new': No such file or directory" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/793695
<jtaylor> I'll take a look
<micahg> jtaylor: thanks
<jtaylor> micahg: same issue
<jtaylor> egg file replaced by folder
<micahg> jtaylor: is there a more global fix that can be done or is this a one off issue?
<jtaylor> well dpkg say its intended behaviour and dh_python2 says its a dpkg issue
<micahg> fun :)
 * micahg knows nothing about python, so unfortunately can't help much
#ubuntu-motu 2011-06-07
<dholbach> good morning
<poolie> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hey poolie
<jmarsden> Who might know the status of the SAN upgrade that should provide more disk space for the Ubuntu ISO build machines, and so allow Lubuntu to use that build infrastructure this cycle?  Per UDS discussion this was going to happen "in a few weeks"... I don't know how to get updated status :)
<micahg> dholbach: ^^
<dholbach> micahg, no idea
<dholbach> cjwatson or pitti might know - I never even heard of this being a problem
<Rhonda> Someone good a good tool for producing a screencast? istanbul somehow is dysfunctional for me, recordmydesktop only is in sync when setting frame rate to 2 per second, â¦
 * Rhonda . o O ( Rhonda: please ask in #ubuntu, this is off-topic here )
<dholbach> Rhonda, talk to popey or duanedesign in #ubuntu-community-team
<jmarsden> dholbach: Thanks, I'll email cjwatson.  It is needed for Lubuntu to become really really "official" as a Ubuntu variant... or that was my understanding from the UDS session about https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/other-lubuntu-o-integrate-ubuntu-ecosystem
<dholbach> jmarsden, awesome - I'm sorry for not being more helpful, but I don't know anything about CD image creation
<Laney> morning
<micahg> hi Laney
<cjwatson> jmarsden: it's making progress - hardware's been installed, waiting for a sysadmin to provision the storage, last I heard
<StevenK>  /win 22
<hrw> hi
<hrw> if package got built and 'some binary packages for this source are not yet published in the repository.' is visible then it means that someone has to check and accept NEW binary packages? (source one passed NEW already)
<geser> yes, someone == archive admin
<geser> you can see the queue at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric/+queue
<hrw> 12 NEW binary packages. nice set
<hrw> 18 when amd64 and i386 counted
<jtaylor> why is the latest thunderbird update a security update? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/thunderbird/3.1.10+build1+nobinonly-0ubuntu0.11.04.2
<jtaylor> seems purely cosmetic
<Laney> micahg: chrisccoulson: ^
<soren> jtaylor: IIUIC, tt fixes a regression that was introduced in a security update.
<micahg> jtaylor: yeah, see http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/usn-1122-3/
<jtaylor> ah thx, overlooked the regression tag :/
<Restless> Hello!
<Restless> can anybody help with advocating my package?
<Restless> I need the second advocate: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/rhash
<Restless> (I'm new on the channel, so don't what is the shortest way into distro)
<tumbleweed> Restless: this package doesn't look ubuntu-specific, please consider maintaining it in debian, and getting it into Ubuntu that way
<Restless> tumbleweed: I'm not too familiar with debian, so it will take longer time
<evaluate> Restless, if your package builds fine under ubuntu and doesn't depend on any ubuntu specific packages (which I don't think is the case for your application), it should have a fairly high chance of building fine in Debian too.
<evaluate> You will need a couple of changes in the debian/changelog and possibly a couple of other places, but the rest should be fine. You then just need a mentor that uploads your package to the Debian repo and you're done. :-)
<tumbleweed> Restless: we don't encourage bringing new packages into Ubuntu through REVU. Debian is better suited to maintaining most packages, as packages have explicit maintainers. In Ubuntu packages that nobody cares about can go unnoticed and uncared for for a long time
<Restless> evaluate: I possibly need to install debian, get familiar with their bug-tracking and so on... :)
<evaluate> Restless, yeah, you would need a sid box for building your package, but you could also use a VM or a chroot. Also, http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/ should give you most of the information you need to know about packaging for Debian.
<Restless> evaluate: ok, sounds like a plan
<evaluate> Restless, also, for bugs there is 'reportbug', which is fairly easy to use IMHO, and the BTS itself isn't too complicated either.
<Laney> the BTS is fine once you get used to it
<Laney> I probably prefer it to malone
<geser> for bug filing in Debian using reportbug is ok, but when I want to attach a patch, I find LP easier to use (unless I didn't figure out an easy workflow for it yet)
<hrw> geser: reportbug allows to add patch
<geser> hrw: to an existing bug?
<hrw> geser: mailto:BUGNUMBER@bugs.debian.org?
<evaluate> geser, there are also emails, y'know?
<hrw> geser: attach patch to mail and done
<hrw> geser: Debian BTS is mail centric
<Laney> or bts --mbox show bugno if you want to reply to a specific mail
<evaluate> geser, http://www.debian.org/Bugs/server-control might help...
<geser> I know, but I need to remember to write a proper subject (for the maintainer who gets the mail; or copy&paste it from the existing bug), don't forget to really attach the diff to the mail when writing some explanation and perhaps even download the mbox for proper threading (I like to be nice to the maintainer)
<Restless> evaluate: what debian version do I need to install?
<Laney> you can make an unstable chroot
<Restless> is debian-6.0.1a-*.iso ok?
<evaluate> Restless, your package will first go into debian sid (also known as unstable) so you should best build against that one.
<Laney> if you want a full install then get a testing image and upgrade it to unstable
<evaluate> Restless, you can theoretically install any version and then just point your sources.list file to sid and do an upgrade (or dist-upgrade)
<Restless> ok, I'll try http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/weekly-builds/amd64/iso-dvd/debian-testing-amd64-DVD-1.iso
<Laney> you might want to use the net installer to download less stuff
<Restless> sound better :)
<tumbleweed> geser: bts --mbox show (it's awesome)
<Laney> tumbleweed: beat you to that :-)
<Laney> and yes it is great
<geser> will try it out the next time
<tumbleweed> Laney: he didn't seem to listen to you :)
 * Laney sulks
<Laney> what MUAs does that work with?
<tumbleweed> mutt works well, obviously
<Laney> that is all i've ever used it with
<tumbleweed> I guess anything that you can feed an mbox to
<Laney> wonder which ones those are
 * ScottK would imagine any that run on *nix can read an mbox.
<tumbleweed> there is of course a difference between being able to read an mbox and making it easy to view a random mbox. For many you'd probably have to "import" the mbox, even if it used mbox storage internally
<Laney> indeed, it has to be able to take it on the commandline for this interface to work
 * ScottK would have imagined wget + import would work, but OK.
<Laney> does, but mildly more cumbersome
<ScottK> chrisccoulson: You are TIL mongodb.  It needs to get off of boost1.42 and onto 1.46.  Debian has a much newer version.  Would you please look into updating it to the newer boost?
<chrisccoulson> ScottK, is it urgent? i can take a look at it when i get some free time, but i only ever worked on mongodb before to port it to a newer jsapi
<ScottK> chrisccoulson: Not urgent.
<chrisccoulson> ok, that's fine then :)
<ScottK> You might talk SpamapS into it.  IIRC he has some interest.
<Laney> lucas: hey, how do you populate upload_* in UDD? Directly fed from somewhere or parsing -changes@?
<Laney> (I'd quite like to add ubuntu counterparts for a DEX thing)
<lucas> Laney: parsing of list archives
<Laney> excellent
<Laney> I'll likely be able to repurpose it then
<lucas> would the DEX infra rely on UDD, or are you setting up something separate ?
<Laney> it's just a query I want to run at the minute
<Laney> measuring ubuntu uploads relative to debian
<Laney> but I figure it may be more generally useful, hence wanting to smush it into UDD
<tumbleweed> Laney: hrm, any chance of importing ubuntu upload history? that would be really handy for determining sponsorship
<Laney> tumbleweed: yeah, that's what I was talking about
<Laney> but what do you mean?
<tumbleweed> Laney: list-sponsorships in lp:~stefanor/ubuntu-dev-tools/extra-scripts
<Laney> quick summary?
<tumbleweed> endorsements: it generates a list of sponsorships that you've done for someone. Also theoretically useful for sponsorees wanting to find who to contact for endorsements.
<Laney> ah ok
<tumbleweed> currently scrapes -changes archives, but a UDD table would make it a lot faster
<Laney> shouldn't be too hard to do
<micahg> ScottK: chrisccoulson: I was going to take mongodb, but it needs porting to mozjs185, I also was going to as the Debian folk why they're using xulrunner-dev instead of libmozjs in Debian
<micahg> *ask
<chrisccoulson> i thought i already did mongodb?
<micahg> chrisccoulson: it's ported to xulrunner 2.0 IIRC
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok. that's probably 99% of the way there already then
<micahg> chrisccoulson: yeah, it is
<micahg> I'll try an actual merge over the weekend (short week this week)
<micahg> chrisccoulson: unless you actually want to do it :), I figure you have a lot of other stuff you're working on
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i've got a lot of other stuff to do first ;)
<jtaylor> concerning https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tahoe-lafs/+bug/782461
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 782461 in tahoe-lafs (Ubuntu) "too high version dependency on pycryptopp" [Undecided,New]
<jtaylor> is it possible to upgrade pycryptopp via -updates, it only has two depends, one of which is broken by the current version
<jtaylor> the current upstream is 12 releases newer than the debian pacakge, so I guess this would never be approved?
<micahg> jtaylor: its only rdepend is tahoe-lafs, so that could probably be ok, what's the diff between the versions?
<micahg> IANA ubuntu-sru member :)
<jtaylor> 373 files changed, 83419 insertions(+), 76662 deletions(-)
<micahg> jtaylor: oh, fun...
<micahg> jtaylor: let's get it in oneiric first :)
<micahg> preferably through Debian
<jtaylor> I asked the maintainer to do so a month ago ._.
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: considering the last 3 uploads were team uploads, I think you can add yourself to uploaders and go for it
<tumbleweed> (assuming you'll be caring about it in the future)
<jtaylor> I don't
<tumbleweed> well just team upload it then
<jtaylor> I jsut got drawn into it as tahoe is a rdep of one of my packages
<jtaylor> oh nice, POX already started packaging the new version in svn
#ubuntu-motu 2011-06-08
<ScottK> micahg: I'm not concerned about who deals with it, I just want to be able to remove boost1.42 shortly after DIF.
<micahg> ScottK: heh, ok, I'll take gnash too if no one beats me to it
<micahg> ScottK: I think we'd like to remove xulrunner in the same time frame so either way it needs to be fixed :)
<ScottK> Thanks
<kaushal> Hi
<kaushal> When is JAVA6 U26 going to be available in Ubuntu ?
<kaushal> checking in again for the query
<micahg> kaushal: java is in the partner repo for lucid and later, it will be available as soon as the partner devs get a chance to do it
<kaushal> ok
<kaushal> micahg: is there a Bug opened in Launchpad
<micahg> kaushal: I don't see one
<kaushal> micahg: when you say partner devs ?
<kaushal> is it from canonical or community or Sun
<micahg> kaushal: the devs responsible for the partner archive (Canonical)
<kaushal> micahg: ok
<kaushal> can i get some sort of information as and when its available ?
<micahg> kaushal: you can subscribe to the appropriate $RELEASE-changes mailing list on lists.ubuntu.com
<kaushal> ok
<kaushal> $RELEASE-changes
<kaushal> I dont see it on that list
<kaushal> not sure i understand that
<micahg> kaushal: i.e. lucid-changes, maverick-changes
<kaushal> ok
<kaushal> micahg: Thanks
<kaushal> Your message was rejected
<kaushal> :(
<kaushal> micahg: What could be the issue ?
<dholbach> good morning
<hrw> how to request debian sync for package?
<Rhonda> hrw: Not needed at the current stage of development, it happens automatically.
<Rhonda> Unless you want to sync from experimental. See requestsync in ubuntu-devtools package.
<Rhonda> ubuntu-dev-tools actually
<hrw> Rhonda: regina-normal is at 4.6-1.1 in oneiric compare to 4.6-4 in debian
<hrw> and 4.6-1.1 ftfbs
<hrw> I am now checking -4 to build
<Laney> if the package has Ubuntu modifications then you need to explicitly request it
<Laney> after checking that they are no longer needed
<Rhonda> Ah, wait
<Rhonda> That's 4.6-1.1ubuntu3
<Rhonda> So it can't be synced, it requires a merge.
<Rhonda> â¦ unless all changes got incorporated, then an explicit sync request is needed explaining why the diff can get dropped
<Rhonda> hrw: Please be precise, it's 4.6-1.1ubuntu3 in oneiric, not 4.6-1.1  :)
<hrw> ok
<hrw> so the proper way is to check ubuntuisms in package, merge/fix them, request review/sponsoring?
<Rhonda> Sounds proper
<hrw> thx
<hrw> if ubuntu changes are not required how should I solve debian/changelog? use Debian one or merge Ubuntu one into it?
<Rhonda> if they aren't required file a sync request and explain why they can get dropped
<Rhonda> There's a wiki page explaining what should be in such a sync request, though "requestsync regina-normal" should get you a decent template to start with.
<hrw> thx
<hrw> ok. let it build and I go for a haircut in meantime
<ScottK> hrw: I already requested a sync for regina-normal.
<hrw> ScottK: noticed
<hrw> ScottK: anyway I do not consider that time wasted - learnt few things
<ScottK> Good way to look at it.
<c_korn> hello, if a debian/control file has the XSBC-Original-Maintainer field set it is included in the package's Original-Maintainer field which is then called invalid by lintian. am I doing something wrong?
<Rhonda> Are you using lintian from Debian or from Ubuntu?
<c_korn> ubuntu
<c_korn> 2.5.0~rc2ubuntu3
<pcpratts> hi, I am trying to make a website installer, but lintian doesn't like files in /var/www.  what is the standard place to put a website to keep lintian happy?
<soren> pcpratts: /usr/share, typically.
<pcpratts> soren: okay thanks
<pcpratts> how should I modify the apache config files?
<pcpratts> I could create a parser and modify that way
<pcpratts> oh wait, I remember apache has a sites-available
<Pici> I could be wrong, but I think I've seen packages stick things in /etc/apache2/conf.d/
<pcpratts> yeah, phpmyadmin does that
<pcpratts> but I am making a new site root
<pcpratts> okay, thanks for the help.
<pcpratts> hello all, I am working on lintian errors.  how do I add something as a conffile?
<pcpratts> is conffile a file with a newline separated list?  or maybe things go in control?
<cjwatson> pcpratts: man dh_installdeb
<pcpratts> k, thanks
<cjwatson> also http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-files.html#s-config-files for policy on usage
<cjwatson> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ap-pkg-conffiles.html#sE.1 for file format
<cjwatson> pcpratts: ^-
<pcpratts> cjwatson: thanks, it is going in etc/cron and etc/init.d so I am sure the are config files
<cjwatson> if it's going in /etc, debhelper should do it for you automatically, as long as you're using a sufficient debhelper compat version
<cjwatson> i.e. with modern packaging it should just work, so the question is why you aren't using modern packaging :-)
<pcpratts> cjwatson: oh, okay.  I am writing a rules file manually, and doing other stuff, is there something easier
<pcpratts> cjwatson: I am using some dh commands, but not everything
<cjwatson> I'd need to see the full source package to advise
<cjwatson> I always use /usr/share/doc/debhelper/examples/rules.tiny and customise from there as advised in 'man dh'
<cjwatson> but you must be doing something pretty overly manual in order not to benefit from debhelper's conffiles default; that's been around for a long time
<pcpratts> cjwatson: okay, I'll take a look at that.
<pcpratts> cjwatson: oh haha
<pcpratts> cjwatson: is is pretty empty and looks like it is using make.  I don't use make
<cjwatson> !
<pcpratts> cjwatson: this is just a php/mysql website with mostly java programs doing the backend, so I build with ant
<cjwatson> debian/rules should be a makefile
<cjwatson> sure, it often calls something else to do the hard work
<pcpratts> cjwatson: yeah, but then I just call ant
<cjwatson> but not having debian/rules be a makefile is Really Really Weird.
<pcpratts> cjwatson: okay, okay, yeah it is a makefile, my mistake
<cjwatson> can I see your source package, please?
<pcpratts> cjwatson: sure what parts
<cjwatson> everything in debian/
<pcpratts> cjwatson: how should I get it to you
<cjwatson> tarball on a website?
<cjwatson> or   for x in debian/*; do echo "===== $x ====="; cat "$x"; done   and put the output on paste.ubuntu.com
<pcpratts> http://paste.ubuntu.com/621793/
<cjwatson> pcpratts: you must call dh_installinit and dh_installcron *before* dh_installdeb; normally up before dh_strip
<cjwatson> the tiny rules file approach gets the ordering right for you
<cjwatson> also you should not call dh_installdeb or dh_installcron in the install: target
<pcpratts> cjwatson: okay, yeah, I just added those last two
<pcpratts> cjwatson: trying to follow advice
<cjwatson> and dh_installinit and dh_installcron in binary-arch probably ought to have -a options, to match the other commands there
<cjwatson> fix that and it should wwork
<cjwatson> *work
<cjwatson> oh, also, you need to move dh_installdeb after dh_shlibdeps
<pcpratts> cjwatson: okay awesome.  I'm trying it now
<pcpratts> cjwatson: I guess I didn't quite understand the tiny rules file approach
<pcpratts> this is what the website looks like if anyone is interested: http://www.xanthusbase.org/
<pcpratts> any biology researcher can install the website for their bacteria that they study
<cjwatson> the general idea is that you have a very short template which Does The Right Thing in general, and then you add override_* targets for any case where your package's behaviour is at all unusual
<cjwatson> it saves, for example, having to remember which the correct order to call dh_* commands in is
<pcpratts> yeah, okay
<pcpratts> just curious, are you funded by any company?
<pcpratts> I am always amazed there is someone on that can help
<cjwatson> yes, I work for Canonical
<pcpratts> awesome
<pcpratts> if all the lintian errors are gone, is a package automatically accepted in ubuntu?
<tumbleweed> no, packages need manual review by ubuntu developers to be accepted (and then another round of review by the archive admins)
<pcpratts> cjwatson: okay, those errors are gone.
<Laney> there's no way lintian could catch many errors
<pcpratts> okay
<tumbleweed> when possible, please aim new packages at Debian rather than Ubuntu, ubuntu universe has a fair number of uncared-for rotting packages, we don't want to add to them.
 * tumbleweed finds myself saying this a lot at the moment, we should add an ubottu factoid
<Laney> !revu
<ubottu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
 * tumbleweed doesn't see "deprecated"
<Laney> just checking.
<pcpratts> hmm, I don't have any systems currently that run debian
<pcpratts> but I will look into it, thanks
<pcpratts> I have pretty standard dependencies
<tumbleweed> Laney: well, the REVU wiki page starts with a big disclaimer, that's a start
 * Laney s/may/will/
<tumbleweed> yeah
<pcpratts> Laney: haha, I get paid to do this
<pcpratts> so I will
<Laney> :-)
<pcpratts> but yeah, I have other projects too
<pcpratts> will have to bring another computer from home making the number on my desk equalling 8
<Laney> you can run a virtual machine or maybe in a chroot (depending on what the software is)
<pcpratts> that that's true
<pcpratts> I don't tend to like to work in a virtual machine
<pcpratts> because lots of what I do is computationally intense
<tumbleweed> !no revu is <reply> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu-specific packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU  Please consider maintaining new packages in Debian rather than Ubuntu, they can be easily synced across.
<Pici> !no revu is <reply> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu-specific packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU  Please consider maintaining new packages in Debian rather than Ubuntu, they can be easily synced across.
<ubottu> I'll remember that Pici
<tumbleweed> Pici: thanks
<Laney> silly bot with selective hearing
<tumbleweed> I got a PM reply saying it was awaiting moderation :)
<pcpratts> I have these two errors:
<pcpratts> E: openmods: section-is-dh_make-template
<pcpratts> E: openmods: no-copyright-file
<pcpratts> but I have a copyright file
<pcpratts> and I checked that I don't have any template files
<Laney> run lintian --info *.changes and you'll get more information
<pcpratts> okay thanks
<fabrice_sp> Hi. Does anyone see where the error is there: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/73222469/buildlog_ubuntu-oneiric-i386.deal.ii_6.3.1-1.1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz It builds fine in amd64 (see https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/deal.ii/6.3.1-1.1)
<fabrice_sp> strange enough it last 4 hours in i386 before failing and 45 minutes in amd64 for full buiding.....
<geser> fabrice_sp: make[1]: *** No rule to make target `common/Make.global_options'.  Stop.
<geser> search for "Error 2" in that log
<fabrice_sp> got it! thanks geser
<pcpratts> in a deb package, I am trying to put a package in /etc/apache2/sites-available/
<pcpratts> oops, package = file
<pcpratts> I see it when I open the deb with the archiver
<pcpratts> but I don't see it when I install the deb
#ubuntu-motu 2011-06-09
<pcpratts> I get a warning: WARN: uid is 0 but '/etc' is owned by 1000
<poolie> hi spiv, i hope V is better?
<Rhonda> poolie: uh, how do you manage to get uid 1000 as owner for /etc?
<poolie> Rhonda: i think you have me confused with pcpratts
<Rhonda> Erm, right.
<dholbach> good morning
<nigelb> Folks, I'm working with iamfuzz to get a list of ftbfs where its failing because of the toolchain change.  Hopefully, that can drive some people to jump in and fix them. (apart from myself)
<geser> nigelb: if you have some candidates with a good internet connection, you can point them to the openarena-* ones (the source packages are 36-400 MB big)
<geser> fixing them is pretty easy as the problematic binary gets build in debian/rules
 * tumbleweed is happy to sort those out
<tumbleweed> nigelb: doko filed bugs for a fair number of the toolchain related FTBFSs, didn't he?
<geser> tumbleweed: thanks, using something like "$(DEB_BUILD_GNU_TYPE)-gcc -Wall $(CFLAGS) $(LDFLAGS) -lz debian/qvmbrute.c -o debian/qvmbrute" should do it
<geser> that's for openarena-{085-data,maps,misc,players,players-mature,texutures), that's in total around 800 MB of source packages to download
<tumbleweed> geser: 085-data looks like an argument-order issue, with -lz too soon
 * tumbleweed has a local mirror on my desktop these days :)
<geser> tumbleweed: yes, exactly
<nigelb> tumbleweed: probably. But I want to catch as many as I can.
<nigelb> tumbleweed: Do you suggest I use the bugs that doko filed or scroll through the build failures to catch more, if any?
<tumbleweed> nigelb: I don't know, I assume the onse he filed are a good start. But the build failures are the most accurate source, obviously
<nigelb> tumbleweed: I'm working with iamfuzz to get a list by 20th and get folks to work on them (of course work on those bugs myself too!)
<tumbleweed> nigelb: great. I'm sure there are a bunch of us who'd happily help + mentor those
<nigelb> tumbleweed: :)
<Laney> nigelb: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?tag=no-add-needed;users=peter.fritzsche@gmx.de;exclude=tags%3Apatch
<Laney> you might be interested in debian failures too ...
<nigelb> Laney: oooh, that's neat.
<nigelb> Laney: what's the binuitls-gold?
<Laney> a different linker which uses --no-add-needed
<Laney> http://wiki.debian.org/ToolChain/DSOLinking
<nigelb> Laney: So, essentially, its the same thing that happens in Ubuntu.
<Laney> right
<nigelb> Then, this goes to my list as well :-)
<Laney> some of those might have unforwarded patches in ubuntu
<nigelb> hrm, possible. The build I fixed a few days back in Ubuntu got fixed in Debian too with my patch :-)
<Laney> good chap
<aboudreault> Hi
<aboudreault> I try to build a package... my dev machine is lucid. and the pbuilder env is lucid. However. I always get this message: You should recreate aclocal.m4 with macros from libtool 2.2.6 Debian-2.2.6a-1ubuntu1
<lucidfox> What package is it?
<aboudreault> though I ran: aclocal, automake, autoconf
<aboudreault> what's the problem, the libtool should be the same, no?
<aboudreault> lucidfox, it one of our packages. spatialite.
<aboudreault> looks like my ltmain.sh is not regenerated. will delete it explicitly.
<cjwatson> run libtoolize too (or just use autoreconf instead of running all the tools separately)?
<aboudreault> yeah, just ran autoreconf, I didn't know that utility.
<aboudreault> alright, it fixes the issue.
<geser> aboudreault: better use autoreconf, a missing run of libtool caused recently a weird FTBFS in oneiric (pidgin)
<aboudreault> I see. thanks
<aboudreault> there is no libiconv on ubuntu?
<aboudreault> ha, it seems to be in libc.
<Quintasan> debfx: ping
<debfx> Quintasan: pingpong
<Quintasan> debfx: Why doesn't pbuilder-dist save my sources.list?
<Quintasan> debfx: I logged in with --save-after-login, all packages are there
<Quintasan> but sources.list are replaced
<debfx> Quintasan: the source.list is defined in pbuilderrc
 * Quintasan has nothing in there
<debfx> Quintasan: pbuilder-dist probably passes the options directly to pbuilder
<Quintasan> --override-config
<Quintasan> herp derp
<Laney> away until Tuesday if someone else wants to take over pushing GHC up to the top of the hill
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/ghc.html very almost gone
<cjwatson> Laney: I can keep it going, I think
<cjwatson> did some rescoring just now
<Laney> nice
<Laney> there's some FTBFS I haven't gotten around to giving back yet
<cjwatson> yeah, was doing a bit of those
<cjwatson> gitit for one :-)
<Laney> sometimes the tracker doesn't show all of the bdeps for some reason
<cjwatson> also a bunch of Build-Depends: ghc6 in applications
<cjwatson> but I assume that will need to involve the Debian Haskell team
<Laney> yeah, they don't matter so much
<Laney> transitional to the rescue
<Laney> but if you get bored ;-)
<cjwatson> at what point can I unblacklist and sync haskell-dummy?
<Laney> now should be fine
<Laney> probably want to remove ghc6 from the tracker though
<cjwatson> OK, cool, will do that in a bit
<cjwatson> I removed it from the archive, will that do?
<Laney> as in libghc6*
<Laney> otherwise the dummies will interfere
<cjwatson> oh, right, hmm
<cjwatson> maybe wait 'til it all goes green then?
<Laney> actually they shouldn't match is_affected
<cjwatson> mm, right, haskell-dummy Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 7)
<Laney> it probably confused the tracker because of the untransitioned packages
<Laney> but there's none of those left any more
<sjkwizard> is it possible to add xflux (http://stereopsis.com/flux/linux.html) to the ubuntu official repository?
<sjkwizard> ops...i mean fluxgui (that include xflux)
#ubuntu-motu 2011-06-10
<kaushal> Hi
<kaushal> as per https://wiki.kubuntu.org/PackagingGuide/Recipes/PackageUpdate
<kaushal> How do i get both soure for JAVA6 U24 and U26
<hyperair> `c
<hyperair> oops
<dholbach> good morning
<micahg> hi dholbach, thanks for taking care of that zabbix merge
<dholbach> micahg, no worries
<G> dholbach: thanks from me as well :)
<micahg> G: sorry about that :)
<G> micahg: no problem, I have been meaning to do a couple of more merges of other packages, but suddenly got busy
<G> trying to work out why the build failed though, it's odd
<G> and it just built perfectly in pbuilder
<micahg> G: which package?  do you have a log?
<G> micahg: zabbix
<G> the i386 build failed, once it got merged, but it builds in pbuilder
<G> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/73256808/buildlog_ubuntu-oneiric-i386.zabbix_1%3A1.8.5-1ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<micahg> G: is the pbuilder updated?  (dev release changes fast)
<G> micahg: it's a compile time issue, I'd imagine pbuilder doesn't have much effect on that (but version wise, it's not the latest build or anything, I've got to fix up the second VM I got for building stuff before I can start following the latest greatest pbuilder
<micahg> G: you can update the pbuilder instance to make sure you're running the latest base packages
<G> oh you mean the pbuilder build env? or pbuilder itself?
<G> I litterally just created the pbuilder build env for i386
<G> it's as if the launchpad builders, aren't applying the patches after removing them
<G> Is it me, or is this the problem: dpkg-source applies patches, rules file seems to call dh clean, doesn't reapply patches before ./configure?  http://pastebin.com/YgCYf5E6
<micahg> yeah, that seems a little weird
<geser> is "clean: unpatch" in debian/rules correct for v3? especially that I don't see a "patch" dependency
<G> ahhh I know what it is....
<geser> G: ^^ try without the "unpatch" dependency on the clean target
<G> dh_autotools-dev_updateconfig, is running dh_clean?
<G> geser: I'm not sure if that is it, http://pastebin.com/7jTi81zT (pbuilder i386 build) http://pastebin.com/8R9nuHMi (Launchpad builder build)
<G> pbuilder is running dpkg-source -b zabbix-1.8.5 which applies the patches, again, but the LP Builder isn't
<G> dholbach: do you have your buildlogs from when you said that it built okay in a VM for yourself?
<dholbach> G: no, not any more
<G> oh wait, launchpad builders, build from the bzr checkout, don't they? they don't create a source package first and build that do they...
<micahg> G: no, they build from the uploaded source package
<G> micahg: so the code is merged, then a sourec package is made by the merger, and uploaded?
<G> (basically)
<micahg> G: correct
<G> micahg: ahhh okay, I thought that could explain why dpkg-source -x wouldn't be run
<micahg> G:  you can pull down the version that dholbach uploaded and compare it to yours
<G> yeah I think I will
<G> do that while I get a cup of tea
<G> micahg: mine looks the same as dholbach's upload, both do the 'right thing' in pbuilder etc
<micahg> G: I'm sorry, I don't have time to actually look into it at the moment, but maybe someone else does
<G> micahg: yeah, thanks for the pointers
<G> micahg: I thought I may have been testing it wrong
<micahg> G: are you using an up to date mirror w/pbuilder?
<G> micahg: should be up to date, I'm using mirrors.kernel.org
<geser> G: do you have a pbuilder build log at hand you could upload somewhere?
<micahg> G: depending on which mirror they're 2 hrs-1 day behind
<G> geser: http://dev.nigelj.com/zabbix-pbuilder.txt
<geser> G: ah, the difference is that your pbuilder also build the source package (see the dpkg-source -b call before "debian/rules build") which applies the patches again but LP doesn't build the source package
<G> geser: ah ha,
<G> geser: but shouldn't "prepare: patch prepare-stamp" take care of that for us?
<G> geser: oh, I now get what you are talking about w/ removing clean: unpatch now...
<G> I guess cleaning shouldn't unpatch anyway, right?
<geser> G: not sure right now after looking at the debian/rules file more closely
<G> I'm pretty sure 'prepare: patch prepare-stamp' isn't really involved w/ this issue, because otherwise we should be seeing automake etc run
<geser> G: yes, prepare is not called as far as I see
<geser> there is build -> build-%-stamp -> configure-%-stamp -> extract-%-stamp and the chains ends there, only extract calls prepare
<G> yeah, debian/rules clean, is getting called, which is wiping the patches, followed by debian/rules build  (before that on pbuilder, dpkg-source reapplies the patches, but LP doesn't)
<G> geser: so does the change need to be... build: patch $(foreach ....
<G> errr I mean: 'build: prepare $(foreach...'
<G> that would I think 'fix' it
<G> that way: patch, dh_autotools-dev_updateconfig, aclocal, autoconf etc, would all be called, only once, before the source is copied into the variant directories etc
<geser> yes, might work
<geser> G: the Debian build log shows the same (the patches get removed but not applied again), you might want to file a bug about it (in Debian)
<G> geser: yep, I will do
<geser> thanks
<G> geser: looks like that was it
<G> geser: PPA build has managed to progress to the mysql build, which holds promise
<G> so, whats the best way to get this sorted, another bzr merge review?
<micahg> G: that or a bug + debdiff + subscribe ubuntu-sponsors
<G> easier to just to a merge-review I think :)
<G> micahg: geser: thanks guys
<G> Daviey: thanks!
<G> sorry, I missed that extra space too
<Daviey> G, no worries :)
<Daviey> G, You are using dch, right?
<G> Daviey: I had used dch, and then I realised I would have ugly merge proposal, and did a copy & paste, and it must've added an extra space somewhere
<Daviey> ah
<G> (copy and paste, due to just deciding to use a completely new branch locally)
<Daviey> G, BTW - if you do open a LP bug for things like that - you can link it to the Debian bug - which makes it easy for people in the future when merging to look at the LP bug and trace it back to Debian etc.
<G> Daviey: yeah, good point, I'll keep it in mind
<Daviey> G, good o.. i think i would have been pulling my hair out finding that fix, good job.
<G> Daviey: credit goes to micahg and geser for pointing in the right directions etc
<Daviey> Ah yes, i see in scrollback
<micahg> gusnan: sciteproj retried on all archs
<gusnan> micahg, thank you!
<dholbach> tumbleweed, if you have a bit of time and can review https://code.launchpad.net/~dholbach/ubuntu-sponsoring/734746/+merge/64157 we'd get a little bit closer to finishing our two work items regarding harvest :)
<tumbleweed> dholbach: yeah I noticed that, I'll look this evening
<dholbach> yeehaw! :)
<dholbach> thanks muchly tumbleweed
<tumbleweed> I see you've also got a list of CSV files to attack, great :)
<dholbach> I think the bulk of them will land on bdmurray's plate - I hope there's a lot of reusable code involved
<dholbach> the others were from gaspa and geser(?)
<bdmurray> dholbach: what's on my plate?
<dholbach> bdmurray, bug 734746 is all about moving harvest-data feeds from .csv to .json as it would allow us to show long descriptions too
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 734746 in ubuntu-sponsoring "Bring long descriptions to Harvest" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/734746
<dholbach> it's nothing super urgent, but optional data is much easier to handle with json and it'd be nice to not only show bug numbers, but also bug titles, and stuff like that
<dholbach> https://code.launchpad.net/~dholbach/ubuntu-sponsoring/734746/+merge/64157 has an example for the generation of sponsoring data
<dholbach> comment 4 on the bug lists all the feeds which would be nice to have moved over to json output
<bdmurray> got it thanks
<dholbach> thank YOU :)
<nigelb> tumbleweed: Not someone.  Its me and iamfuzz :-)
<tumbleweed> nigelb: right :)
<nigelb> tumbleweed: my IRC was sucky or I'd have chimmed in the meeting, I just got the notification about that ping.
<nigelb> Clearly, I'm in too many channels for irccloud to process :p
<tumbleweed> nigelb: heh, well we really need to do something about those FTBFSs
<tumbleweed> normally the big push is at the end of the release schedule
<nigelb> tumbleweed: which means a lot of them don't get fixed.
<tumbleweed> nigelb: any time frame on that list?
<nigelb> tumbleweed: 20th is the deadline we're set to finish the list.
<nigelb> so, another 10 days.
<tumbleweed> is it on the wiki?
<tumbleweed> nigelb: we were wondering about marking some FTBFS bitesize, or somehow grouping them. I think your list would be a good test to see how easily we can get FTBFS-fixers
<nigelb> tumbleweed: the list I'm making is only of the ones failing due to the ld change.
<nigelb> tumbleweed: I believe those are easy enough to be marked bitesize
<tumbleweed> agreed
<vish> what is the difference between https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev  and  https://launchpad.net/~motu  ?   I'm confused cause ~ubuntu-dev also mentions MOTU..
<ScottK> All MOTU are ubuntu-dev.  Not all ubuntu-dev are MOTU.
<tumbleweed> vish: I think people can be members of a packageset team without having motu rights
<broder> ~ubuntu-dev also contains people who have PPU rights, i thought
<tumbleweed> that description on ~ubuntu-dev is confusing, yes
<vish> so ~ubuntu-dev is for PPU folks only?
<tumbleweed> no, it's all ubuntu developers
<broder> i thought it was anyone who has any upload rights
<tumbleweed> broder: yeah that's what I was trying to say
<vish> tumbleweed: so if someone were to be added to only that team, what would they have applied for?
<ScottK> vish: The people who are in ubuntu-dev, but not MOTU have some kind of restricted upload right.
<ScottK> Most, but not all of these will be PPU.
<tumbleweed> vish: PPU, I'd guess? /me isn't a DMB member
<ScottK> There is at least one person who is kubuntu-dev, but not MOTU, so it's not just PPU.
<vish> maco/ Laney: could you fix that description to something that is better :)
<vish> ?
<vish> i was looking at https://launchpad.net/~hrw and was confused.. its better i just ask hrw i guess :D
<vish> hrw: you are in ~ubuntu-dev , so you get BugControl membership too with that. I would like to deactivate your membership in bugsquad mentoring, is that OK? (unless you feel you need specific mentoring)
<cjwatson> vish: ubuntu-dev is mainly for voting rights
<cjwatson> at least by way of things that use that team
<vish> ah!
<vish> cjwatson: i couldnt figure out hrw's membership, whether he was MOTU or â¦  i guess he got PPU access recently
<ScottK> He did.
 * vish nods
<hrw> vish: feel free
<vish> hrw: neat! thx..
<hrw> vish: I use bugcontrol only on bugs against my packages
<vish> k..
<hrw> vish: now I only need to find a way to unsubscribe from that team ML ;)
<vish> hrw: i think i sent the mail first and then deactivated you, probably why you got the mail :)
<hrw> ok, then I am fine with it
<hrw> have a nice weekend
<oier> hello guys
<oier> i have a question regarding #682202
<oier> I fixed the bug for latex-beamer but since there is no bazaar trunk in launchpad I created a package using pbuilder
<oier> where can I upload the package or have other devs sponsor it?
<psusi> oier: sure there is: lp:ubuntu/latex-beamer
<oier> allright, many thanks!
#ubuntu-motu 2011-06-11
<G> if someone is an expert on watch files, I'd love to know if there is a secret way of obtaining the previously determined version number for 'filenamemangle'
<G> ahhh actually, I managed to get it working another way
#ubuntu-motu 2011-06-12
<bjsnider> is it possible to run autoconf/autotools and whatnot from debian/rules or should it be run on the orig tarball?
<directhex> bjsnider: dh_autoreconf ?
<bjsnider> directhex, now is that run atuomatically if autotools-dev is installed, or is it necessary to add it to debian/rules?
<directhex> bjsnider: you need to add it to debian/rules, and build-depends on dh-autoreconf
<ali1234> can anyone tell me why this package was deleted? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/amd64/ktechlab
<ali1234> oh wait, never mind
<ali1234> it links to a bug
<hakermania> Oneiric will support Unity bar, right? I mean it's a non-temporary change... Right?
<sagaci> unity bar?
<directhex> i guess it's a bar in london where the unity upstream goes to get drunk
 * iulian nods.
<c_korn> how can I check if dpkg-gensymbols should find symbols? currently I get this: $ dpkg-gensymbols -plibzen0 -d
<c_korn> No symbol information to store.
<omenrose> hai
<omenrose> may I ask something?
<broder> !ask | omenrose
<ubottu> omenrose: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
<omenrose> I just wonder, why was my conky disappear while I click my Desktop
#ubuntu-motu 2012-06-04
 * tumbleweed waves bug 1008271 at jtaylor
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1008271 in python-scipy (Ubuntu) "Bump to 0.10" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1008271
<shubham> hello
<shubham> i am new to using irc so excuse me if i am to verbose
<shubham> i want to try fixing a bug in natilus
<shubham> #nautilus
<shubham> i want to ask where should i get the source from
<shubham> should i use github ?
<shubham> anyone
<tumbleweed> bzr branch lp:ubuntu/nautilus
<shubham> thanks
<tumbleweed> see http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/fixing-a-bug.html
<shubham> @tumbleweed Thanks for the link i will look into the page
<tumbleweed> np
 * tumbleweed goes to bed
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> good morning dholbach
<dholbach> hey geser
<iulian> Morning dholbach, geser.
<dholbach> hey iulian
<iulian> Oh, it's Monday already.
<iulian> Hmm.
<Laney> yeah, how did that happen?
<Zhenech> they skipped the weeked for some booze I heard
<Zhenech> stupid gods
<vibhav> tumbleweed: You there?
<tumbleweed> yes, hi
<vibhav> tumbleweed: I uploaded a debdiff (lucid) for bug 569514 , you might want to see it
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 569514 in calamaris (Ubuntu Natty) "Doesn't work for squid3 logs" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/569514
<tumbleweed> vibhav: where's the SRU paperwork? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Procedure
<tumbleweed> also. the version still needs to changed, the same version is published in lucid and natty
<kendfinger> Has OpenSSH 6.0 been uploaded?
<Laney> !info openssh quantal
<ubottu> Package openssh does not exist in quantal
<Laney> utter lies
<Laney> yes, it has.
<kendfinger> Cool! Thanks!
<kendfinger> openssh-client is what I meant.
<Laney> maybe that bot works on binary packages, indeed
<Laney> !info openssh-client quantal
<ubottu> openssh-client (source: openssh): secure shell (SSH) client, for secure access to remote machines. In component main, is standard. Version 1:5.9p1-5ubuntu1 (quantal), package size 937 kB, installed size 2297 kB
<Laney> seems out of date
<kendfinger> I am pretty sure that is wrong!
<Zhenech> openssh-server | 1:6.0p1-1ubuntu1 |       quantal | amd64, armel, armhf, i386, powerpc
<Zhenech> thats what rmadisson says
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> Pici: ^^^^^ the bot is out of date :(
<Pici> Laney: I'll see what I caan do.
<Laney> cheers boss
<AmberJ_> Hello
<AmberJ_> I manually built a program and then did 'checkinstall' (essentially 'make install') to create a deb. The deb file has a lib/libpln.so of size ~47MB.
<AmberJ_> I created another deb using debuild and the same lib/libpln.so file is only ~2MB.
<AmberJ_> Why is there this vast difference in file sizes of same file?
<AmberJ_> In fact size of every file in lib/ created with checkinstall is greater than corresponding files created with debuild...
<azeem_> AmberJ_: maybe the checkinstall files are unstripped?
<AmberJ> azeem_: "unstripped"?
<azeem_> yes
<ogra_> dressed :)
<azeem_> run "file" on both and compare the output
<jtaylor> AmberJ: debug symbols are still in
<jtaylor> removing them is called stripping
<jtaylor> which is done by dh_strip during normal build
<ogra_> (and has nothing to do with dresses, despite my bad joke above :) )
<AmberJ> Thanks jtaylor, very well explained. And azeem_'s 'file' explained the rest.
<AmberJ> ogra_: I'll leave it to others to decide if that was a bad joke :D Thanks
<ogra_> :)
<AmberJ> What's an indep (independent?) binary?
<jtaylor> something that is architecture independent
<jtaylor> = it runs everywhere without recompile
<AmberJ> ah
<jtaylor> usually interpreted stuff like python or cli
<jtaylor> or documentation
<AmberJ> ok
<AmberJ> I use 'bzr dh-make' to setup debian/ templates... What should I choose if I plan to split upstream into multiple debs: multiple binary or library ?
<jtaylor> probably multiple binary
<AmberJ> I mean that upstream has multiple binary executables and libraries
<jtaylor> unless its a library
<jtaylor> hm thats more complicated
<jtaylor> are the libraries "public" = they can be used by other programs too
<AmberJ> jtaylor: yes, those libraries can be used independently without the need for other upstream 'components'.
<jtaylor> k it should still be similar to the multiple binary package except that you build library packages from it too
<AmberJ> That's why we plan to separate them into separate packages. Roughly speaking, any library that can be used independently goes in a separate package (and the same applies to executables)
<jtaylor> which means following all conventions for them
<jtaylor> correct library packaging is quite timeconsuming
<AmberJ> I guess I should choose "multiple binary" and then use $package.install to fine tune library packages (?)
<jtaylor> yes
<jtaylor> you can create both templates to see what dh_make would give you
<AmberJ> yes, that's a nice way t see how dh_make handles both
<AmberJ> *to
<AmberJ> Thanks :)
<AmberJ> Tried both dh_make templates. It seems I'll need to combine template files from both templates
<jbicha> bdrung: light-themes was already uploaded to precise-proposed, it's just waiting in the queue
<bdrung> jbicha: thanks. then it's less to do for me
<bdrung> jbicha: btw, the current light-themes version still has some issues (background color of icons of selected apps wrong in the application selector)
#ubuntu-motu 2012-06-05
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> good morning
<Laney> these OpenERP-prerequisite backports are impressive
<Satoris> Hi. I'm interested in getting the Ninja build system (https://github.com/martine/ninja) packaged. There's a request for it (bug #988478) and I have it packaged in my PPA (pending build): https://launchpad.net/~jpakkane/+archive/ppa
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 988478 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] ninja (small build system)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/988478
<bregma> Satoris, why don't you submit an ITP to Debian and get it in to Debian instead?
<Zhenech> because there are already two packages with ninja* names in debian
<Satoris> Because I am not a Debian developer (I have not used it in years even) and because the package is special in certain ways. I'm not sure it even builds on anything other than x86/AMD64 and possibly ARM.
<Zhenech> why, oh why, do people chose such names
<Zhenech> its like call all your kernels kernel
<Satoris> Also, they don't do releases. The recommended way to go is to just grab trunk.
<bregma> I called all my sons "Sam,"  what's the problem there?  (when I call, they all come running)
<Satoris> It would be inconvenient if "aptitude install package" installed every package in the repos.
<Satoris> Though it would make dependency management easier.
<Zhenech> I guess dak would not be able to handle this, multiple sources with the same name
<Zhenech> (does ubuntu use dak at all?)
<ogra_> no
<ogra_> only the first few ubuntu release used dak
<geser> Zhenech: as Ubuntu syncs from Debian, we have those ninja* packages too
<Zhenech> geser, ehm right, ofc, but makes my argument nil :)
<AmberJ_> The project I'm packaging is distributed under AGPL license. Do I need to write whole license (~700 lines) in debian/copyright file?
<AmberJ_> Or, will a small AGPL notice (similar to http://pastebin.com/efD3zerf) will suffice?
<AmberJ_> Plus, do we need to explicitly state a (maintainer) clause for debian/copyright for "File: debian/*" ?
<Zhenech> dont need, can
<AmberJ_> Right...so, copyright for debian/* is optional (If not specified, copyright for upstream applies).
<Laney> you should add yourself as a copyright holder though probably
<Laney> and for the first question, if it's in /usr/share/common-licenses/ then you don't need to replicate it
<Laney> otherwise you do
<AmberJ_> got it. Thanks :)
<AmberJ_> Laney, Are files in /usr/share/common-licenses/ installed with system?
<AmberJ_> Or, can I add a line in debian/install to put a copy of my license in /usr/share/common-licenses/ ?
<Laney> they come from base-files and you can't add your license in there, no
<AmberJ_> ok
<AmberJ_> http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/debian-dir-overview.html#the-control-file says an entry: "Bzr-Vcs" ... But when I try to debuild, I get "dpkg-source: warning: unknown information field 'Bzr-Vcs' in input data in general section of control info file"
<AmberJ_> I guess the wiki page needs to be fixed
<AmberJ_> Or, is it supposed to be "Vcs-Bzr" (like "Vcs-Git") ?
<jtaylor> it should be Vcs-Bzr
<jtaylor> who can edit that site?
<jtaylor> ok its bzr managed
<AmberJ_> Thanks, I'll make it Vcs-Bzr then...
<AmberJ_> And, Vcs-Web is supposed to be a link to web interface to the repo...right?
<jtaylor> yes
<AmberJ_> *Vcs-Browser
<AmberJ_> Upstream code has a cmake target called "tests". The default debian/rules (generated by bzr dh-make) has "%" target which means "all targets" in upstream make config.
<AmberJ_> Is there a way to exclude just one target (in upstream's cmake)?
<AmberJ_> A link to appropriate documentation will suffice (since I'm starting with reading debian/rules documentation)...
<Zhenech> override_dh_auto_test:
<Zhenech> \t#noop
<AmberJ_> ok, an empty target
<Zhenech> yeah
<AmberJ_> Does this works for any CUSTOM_TARGET defined? like...
<AmberJ_> override_dh_auto_CUSTOM-TARGET:
<Zhenech> whatever custom target is
<AmberJ_> (where CUSTOM-TARGET is any target defined in Makefile)
<AmberJ_> ok
<Zhenech> it works with every dh_* command
<AmberJ_> ah right..
<Zhenech> (see man dh)
<AmberJ_> Thanks :)
<Zhenech> and thats what you should care about
<Zhenech> as not every target is called in upstreams makefile
<Zhenech> but only the "needed" in terms of dh thinks (make, make install, make tests usually)
<AmberJ_> yes
<AmberJ_> If I change debian/* , I can use 'debuild -nc' so that build resumes from where it stop due to error...right?
<Zhenech> *shrug* no idea :)
<Zhenech> but most probably yes, if -nc means no clean
<AmberJ_> I read it somewhere on Ubuntu/Debian docs....don't remember the exact option (-nc i.e.)
<AmberJ_> yes, -nc means no clean (http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/packaging-new-software.html#next-steps)
<AmberJ_> Thanks :)
<AmberJ_> What is the difference between a "Transitional" and a "Meta" package?
<Zhenech> transitional is temporary to get users from a to b
<AmberJ_> Does "temporary" means that a "Transitional" package will be removed from future version?
<Zhenech> meta is either to get user to install a-best-implemenation or a set of packages that are commonly known as a
<Zhenech> may/should yes
<AmberJ_> ok thanks :)
<pavolzetor> hi, are there any plans for updating clutter in precise/Q
<pavolzetor> ?
<pavolzetor> there is annoying segfault, which was fixed in recent point release
<AmberJ_> Suppose I do creating multi-binary/deb... Do I need to explicitly specify files for "ALL" packages in "EACH" $package.install ?
<AmberJ_> I did a install with 2 binaries/debs in debian/control  (pretty much default config setup by dh-make i.e. 2 packages: xyx and xyz-doc ). Without any contents in xyz.install and xyz-doc.install, it created almost empty packages
<Zhenech> yes all
<Zhenech> but you can use wildcards
<Zhenech> like usr/bin/* in foo.install
<AmberJ_> In fact, iirc, dh-make didn't made any xyz.install ... It only created xyz-doc.install
<Zhenech> and usr/share/* in foo-common.install
<Zhenech> (not sure if usr/share is a good example)
<AmberJ_> yes, wild cards...
<AmberJ_> I asked because dh-make didn't created foo.install (it only created foo-doc.install). So, I thought maybe it was like: put files specified in foo-doc.install in foo-doc.deb .... and put everything else in foo.deb
<Zhenech> nope
<AmberJ_> Ok, I was wrong! Thanks (again) :)
<\sh> moins
<micahg> hi \sh
<\sh> hey micahg
<\sh> micahg: hows life?
<micahg> \sh: good
<micahg> \sh: and you?
<\sh> micahg: right now? very good...just thousands of miles away from home in sunny california
<ajmitch> hi \sh
<\sh> hey ajmitch
<bobweaver> hello there I am making a package and for some reason I am getting error on dh_usrlocal   sayong that there is a imagaes in my images folder so it can not rm that ?
<bobweaver> what up with that ?
<bobweaver> ERROR :    http://paste.ubuntu.com/1025921/
<bobweaver> why can I not package in /usr/local ?
<tumbleweed> because that's for sysadmins
<bobweaver> lol l
<bobweaver> <not I says this guy not yet at least
<tumbleweed> packaged stuff belongs in /usr/share
<bobweaver> tumbleweed,  work around is to make rules file into script ?
<bobweaver> so change the upstream then ?
<tumbleweed> bobweaver: the way to fix it is to make the build system respect PREFIX
<bobweaver> nad how to so that ?
<bobweaver> do * not so
<bobweaver> for next time now I am hacking upstream to be in usr/share
<tumbleweed> depends on the package
<bobweaver> thanks tumbleweed
<bobweaver> package is a perl package
<bobweaver> here is upstream http://blog.bodhizazen.net/linux/zen-koans/
<bobweaver> I am going to hack at it and make it save all stuff to usr/share/*
<tumbleweed> what does your debian/rules look like?
<tumbleweed> cause I don't see any build system
<bobweaver> just a simple rules
<bobweaver> that is just upstream
<bobweaver> I have not pushed to bzr yet
<bobweaver> will do now
<bobweaver> p:~josephjamesmills/+junk/zen-koans
#ubuntu-motu 2012-06-06
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> good morning dholbach
<dholbach> hey geser
<iulian> Morning.
<AmberJ_> http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/libraries.html#an-example lists the name of file as "debian/libnova-0.12-2.install" ... Do we need version numbers in *.install filenames?
<AmberJ_> Could not we simply use libnova.install instead?
<Zhenech> you do not need numbers in install files
<Zhenech> but you need the soname of the library in the binary package name of the library
<Zhenech> and then you get the soname into the install file too :)
<AmberJ_> But when I do 'apt-cache search lib', most lib* packages don't have soname/version in their name (?)
<mitya57> actually "libnova-0.12-2" is the package name here
<AmberJ_> yes, I get that.... but why don't most lib* packages in ubuntu don't have soname/version for e.g. http://pastebin.com/ANLjqDfD
<mitya57> AmberJ_: Perl libraries are not ELF libraries, so they don't have a soname
<mitya57> Most "regular" libraries should have a soname in the package name
<AmberJ_> Right, I get it now.
<AmberJ_> I need to read more about libraries...
<geser> vibhav: re your zerofree merge: during a merge the new Debian entries are kept as is and not "merged" into the merge change log entry (you add a new changelog entry)
<geser> usually the output of MoM is a good starting point for a merge
<AmberJ_> Why do both code blocks in http://i.imgur.com/2VqL1.png have different format?
<AmberJ_> Source of above linked image: http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/debian-dir-overview.html#additional-files
<tumbleweed> you mean leading / vs no leading /?
<AmberJ_> yes
<tumbleweed> who knows, but feel free to propose a merge tidying it up
<tumbleweed> the leading / makes no practical difference
<AmberJ_> The path is considered relative to debian/tmp/ ?
<tumbleweed> see dh_install's manpage
<tumbleweed> relative to debian/tmp or relative to . if it wasn't found there
<AmberJ_> right. Thanks!
<AmberJ_> It's the other way.... If not found in current dir, it fallbacks to debian/tmp ..
<tumbleweed> :)
<AmberJ_> Anyways, upstream's Makefile installs it in debian/tmp...So, I don't have much to worry about atm ;)
<AmberJ_> What are *.substvars files created in debian/ ?
<AmberJ_> Temporary files used by debuild etc.?
<AmberJ_> I guess a packager is not expected to fiddle with them (it seems so having looked at their contents)
<jtaylor> the substvars files contain variables which are substituted into control
<jtaylor> like shlib:Depends
<AmberJ_> yes, I see that from it's contents
<arand> AmberJ_: Yeah, it's an auto-generated file.
<AmberJ_> ok (I won't mess up with it then). Thanks!
<jtaylor> you can mess with them, but the need for that is rare (and should more likely be done over dpkg-gencontrol
<AmberJ_> With over ~100 warnings, I have other stuff to take care of than mess with *.substvars files ;-)
<AmberJ_> Fixing 100 warnings are sufficient to keep me busy for quite some time :D
<jbicha> wow, test-building on amd64 didn't help much here: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/google-glog/0.3.2-1
<Laney> oh my
<ajmitch> jbicha: bit of a problem there :)
<jbicha> the changelog: "Fix FTBFS on several architectures", I think we need a few more architectures :)
<tumbleweed> i386 is clearly not the dominant architecture any more
<AmberJ_> Suppose I have multi-binary config... Let's say foo.install and foo-doc.install. Can we use 'install' file as well (alongwith foo.install and foo-doc.install)?
<tumbleweed> AmberJ_: install will apply to the first binary package
<tumbleweed> so when you have more than one it's best to just name the package in each config file
 * Laney was just pointed to an amusing ajmitch work item
<Laney> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/other-q-backports-bof
 * Laney giggles
<ajmitch> Laney: yessir?
<tumbleweed> yup, he volunteered, out of nowhere
<Laney> I remember now
<ajmitch> s/nowhere/a creeping madness/
<Laney> the heady excitement of a UDS session leads one to make rash promises :P
<ajmitch> I'll have to try & get that landed well before feature freeze then
<ajmitch> the change itself is pretty trivial
<Laney> there's still other structures that need to be in place though really
<ajmitch> list them all somewhere please
 * Laney wonders why Launchpad times out so much more recently
<Laney> did a timeout change?
<ajmitch> yes
<Laney> the other stuff should be on that BP
<Laney> bots and such
<ajmitch> default timeout changed ~a week ago
<Laney> sounds about right
<ajmitch> https://lists.launchpad.net/launchpad-dev/msg09410.html
<ajmitch> Laney: so how's that bot going?
<Laney> i branched the code.
<ajmitch> woohoo!
<ajmitch> that's progress :)
<Laney> i added some logging to the code!!!!!
<ajmitch> more progress than I've had on the rcbugs rewrite with udd :)
<Laney> i'll get debfx through NM then look at it some more :P
 * Laney gets on that now
<tumbleweed> Laney: good luck with the core-dev application btw. I'm still hanging back waiting for more endorsers
<ajmitch> tumbleweed: you need endorsers?
<tumbleweed> ajmitch: yeah, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StefanoRivera/CoreDevApplication
<Laney> i have to upload to main more now, which rapidly becomes irritating
<tumbleweed> indeed
<Laney> when sponsoring is rewuired
<Laney> q
<tumbleweed> ajmitch: Laney does too
<ajmitch> but Laney has lots of photos to show how technical he is
<tumbleweed> heh
<Laney> technical in all the right ways
<tumbleweed> he knows that pretty pictures are far more convinsing to the DMB than endorsements
<tumbleweed> convincing even
<ajmitch> of course
<ajmitch> distract them with kittens or something
 * ajmitch probably needs to sponsor stuff to write anything nice that counts
 * Laney will hassle you from now until July 2nd
<tumbleweed> yeah I haven't had many sponsors for main-stuff, which doesn't help so much
<Laney> "so, why are mono and ghc both knackered on arm?"
<Laney> /part
<tumbleweed> pretend you are a community member who doesn't have access to porterboxes
<ajmitch> so will you approve each other's core dev membership, or recuse yourself both times? :)
<Laney> actually, the arm one is down :P
<tumbleweed> certainly can't endorse each-other
<AmberJ_> ok thanks tumbleweed!
<Laney> tumbleweed: how long are you in uk for?
<tumbleweed> Laney: til friday. I should have been proactive about getting out of town, but the weekends have all been pretty busy
<Laney> ah, bad luck
<Laney> guess seeing the queen was more exciting :P
<tumbleweed> pish
 * tumbleweed had better rain at home
<AmberJ_> Suppose I have two packages: foo and bar. If a file in foo depends on another in bar, I'll need to add "Depends: bar" in foo.install
<AmberJ_> I guess the answer is yes, but I still thought of asking (just to be sure)
<tumbleweed> foo.install instructs dh_install. It has nothing to do with dependencies
<AmberJ_> oops, I meant: "If a file in foo depends on another in bar, I'll need to add "Depends: bar" in debian/control " ?
<AmberJ_> + for entry corresponding to foo package in debian/control
<Laney> if you /need/ the bar available when foo is run, then yes Depends is what you want
<AmberJ_> yes that's what I meant to ask..
<AmberJ_> I'll add appropriate Depends then..
<tumbleweed> or Recommends if it'd fail gracefully without it and not everyone would need it
<AmberJ_> I already divided upstream into 14 packages (there might be a few more) so that independent components go into separate packages :D
<AmberJ_> I'll need to confirm with upstream devs to find which packages go into Recommends and which in Depends.
<tumbleweed> there's also Suggests :)
<Laney> and Enhances!
<AmberJ_> And, the most important one: Pre-Depends :D
<AmberJ_> important since docs say "Use it very sparingly" ;)
<tumbleweed> err, you should try and avoid that one
<tumbleweed> has anyone written anything that uses Enhances, yet?
<AmberJ_> yes, I was j/k
<AmberJ_> Umm.. Suppose foo.deb has 2 binary executables: foo1 and foo2.
<AmberJ_> bar.deb has 1 .so library
<AmberJ_> If foo1 depends on bar.so ... but foo2 does NOT depends on bar.so,
<AmberJ_> Will we add a Depends:bar to foo package
<AmberJ_> ?
<tumbleweed> yes
<tumbleweed> unless it wolud print a helpful error when running foo2 and many people would never use foo2
<tumbleweed> btw, these questions are far easier with real examples
<AmberJ_> I do have a real case in front of me. And, from what I have seen it won't print a helpful error message. So, I'll add Depends: line ...
<AmberJ_> Thanks!
<tumbleweed> dh_shlibdeps knows about shared libraries
<tumbleweed> if foo2 is dynamically linked to libbar, it'll add the dependency fo ryou
<AmberJ_> ok
<tumbleweed> also, if you are packaging shared libraries, beware, they're non-trivial (and there's a decent fairly old howto out there somewhere)
<AmberJ_> yes, http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/libraries.html (fotunately, it's linked from new UDD packaging page) :)
<tumbleweed> I meant http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html
<AmberJ_> yes, this one is linked from the bottom of wiki page (but I was too lazy to read it).
<tumbleweed> but yes, looks like the packaging guide has a nice overview
<AmberJ_> Now that you mention it, I'll read the other tutorial as well.
<AmberJ_> "In the lib* package, only the runtime library, and the files necessary to use the runtime library should be included..." ... I guess this means that lin lib* packages, at the minimal we'll need to put library (*.so) and header files?
<tumbleweed> header files go in -dev
<AmberJ_> Err, that means MOAR packages!
<tumbleweed> yes
<AmberJ_> Ah, that was mentioned in the next paragraph :(
<tumbleweed> thanks to multi-arch, library packages tend to just contain .so.X.Y.Z shared libraries and .so.X symlinks
<AmberJ_> I should read the complete guide first. Thanks!
<tumbleweed> be aware that it's fairly old. It predates deb-symbols and multi-arch
<slangasek> "thanks to multiarch"?  multiarch by and large hasn't changed anything in package contents
<slangasek> keeping separate -dev packages has been policy forever :)
<tumbleweed> it did force a few extra things to move out, but fair enough :)
#ubuntu-motu 2012-06-07
 * achiang wonders if he has enough street cred to apply for motu yet
<micahg> achiang: https://launchpad.net/~achiang/+uploaded-packages looks a little light
<achiang> micahg: yeah, i agree.
<achiang> micahg: does +maintained-packages count for anything?
<micahg> achiang: maybe in concert with other things (technically we don't have maintainers in Ubuntu), could help for PPU though
<achiang> micahg: ok, no worries. i'll keep trying to find time outside of $DAYJOB and keep beefing up for motu. :)
<micahg> achiang: I'd suggest just doing the stuff you want to do if you were a MOTU, you should be able to rack up enough sponsorships to apply them
<achiang> (just like everyone else)
<micahg> s/them/then/
<micahg> err..rack up sponsorships is a poor choice of words, rack up enough experience, when people start asking why you're not MOTU, you'll know you've made it
<achiang> hehe
<achiang> micahg: ok, thanks for the advice
<achiang> micahg: hm, one more question, might i have enough experience to be an ubuntu member yet? my wiki page is kinda lame
<micahg> achiang: as in non-dev membership?
<achiang> yeah
<micahg> achiang: let's move to PM
<ppedruzzi> hello, everyone. I need some help in reverting a dpkg -i that has failed the configuration step. anyone?
<dholbach> good morning
 * micahg wonders how ecstatic YokoZar is about wine 1.4 in Debian
<Laney> maybe we can undiverge at some point
 * Laney fades away until Sunday
<Laney> tata
<geser> good morning
<iulian> Morning.
<jtaylor> why can'T I install libglib2.0-dev:i386 without breaking my system? oO
<jtaylor> on 12.04
<jtaylor> a figured it out
<jtaylor> its the recommend on python
<jtaylor> kind of dangerous for such a base package
<AmberJ> Hello
<jtaylor> does someone have a cpu with avx?
<jtaylor> a nevermind misinterpreted some lines
<PaoloRotolo> Hi all!
#ubuntu-motu 2012-06-08
<psusi> so... there seem to be two different versions of libboost... 1.46 and 1.48... and 1.46 is the default... this is because the libboost devs don't understand that they aren't supposed to break ABI on minor revisions?
<RAOF> Yes. And probably partially because it's moderately difficult to not break ABI in C++.
<broder> boost uses minor revision numbers like everyone else uses major revision numbers
<psusi> great
<ajmitch> boost1.48 became default in debian a little late for it to happen in precise as well
<psusi> I'm trying to build and package this nifty game I found called freeorion but it seems that it needs 1.48 of boost, but it also needs libogre, and libogre depends on libboost, which points to 1.46... and the -dev packages of libboost 1.46 and 1.48 are not coinstallable
<psusi> so if I install libboost1.48-dev to make the game happy, it removes libboost1.46 and thus, libogre, which the game also needs...
<psusi> so I guess I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place?
<ajmitch> it does make it just a bit awkward
<psusi> why does C++ make it harder to not break ABI?
<ajmitch> are you trying to build this for precise or quantal?
<psusi> precise
<ajmitch> ScottK is the boost expert, I'm sure he'd be happy to help :)
 * micahg thinks ajmitch found a way to make ScottK hide
<ajmitch> micahg: he's fobbed boost off onto me before, I have to return the favour
<psusi> so... in precise, libboost 1.48 is available, but 1.46 is still the default... so to fix this... a special -xxx build of libogre would need made to build against libboost1.48 right?  but quantal has moved to 1.48 as the default, so there it shouldn't be a problem?
<ajmitch> quantal has 1.49 as default
<ajmitch> just to be different
<psusi> that should work... presuming that libogre has been rebuilt against it
<ajmitch> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/boost1.49.html shows ogre as 'good'
<ajmitch> so it should be rebuilt against 1.49
<psusi> maybe I just need to upgrade to quantal
<psusi> so why are the 1.46 and 1.48 not coinstallable?
<psusi> I thought that was the point of creating packages with the version number in the name?
<ajmitch> right, but they ship files in unversioned paths
<ajmitch> & the same binaries, etc
<psusi> when you add the version number to the name, aren't you supposed to add it to the paths of the binaries too?
<psusi> I mean, what's the point of having two source packages if their binaries can't both be installed?
<psusi> or was it that some of the binary packages are coinstallable, but not all of them?
<psusi> hrm...
<ajmitch> the library packages should be coinstallable, just not the -dev packages, which leads to this sort of mess
<psusi> ok, that's what I thought... so why are the libs coinstallable, but not the -dev?
<ajmitch> because libraries have the version in the SONAME
<psusi> but the headers don't?
<ajmitch> but not in the header paths for the -dev packages (and lots of build tools)
<psusi> ahh, and libogre-dev depends on libboost-dev... argh
<ajmitch> right, which means ogre shouldn't need any particular boost version
<ajmitch> I think boost is set up this way because it would be a lot of work to make it all parallal installable
<psusi> hrm... if libboost-dev were a provides: of both 1.46 and 1.48 then if I installed 1.48, I could install libogre, right?  but it looks like it isn't... libboost-dev is a binary package provided by the 1.46 sources, not 1.48
<psusi> so when libogre specifies depends: liboost, it requires 1.46, not 1.48
 * ajmitch should upgrade to quantal this weekend & see what breaks
 * psusi needs to start using btrfs so that such upgrades can easily be reverted when the shit hits the fan
<psusi> how the hell does g++ use that much ram?  I just saw a cc1plus process using 1.2g rss
 * ajmitch blames templates
<psusi> that's like blaming header files or macros
<psusi> seems like you'd need like 10kloc of templates instantiated 10,000 different ways to do that
<psusi> and even then...
<ScottK> The fact that boost -dev packages aren't co-installable means related sets of packages need to be on the same version of boost.  It's not usually an issue.
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> good morning
<\sh> moins
#ubuntu-motu 2012-06-09
 * tumbleweed waves from coatia. Expect to be out of contact for the next week
<ogra_> slacker !
<ogra_> :)
<highvoltage> tumbleweed: have fun!
<AmberJ_> Hello
<AmberJ_> http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html#id249952 says that: "usr/lib/*.so	: development linkage file, used when other programs are linked with -lxxx" belongs to -dev package
<AmberJ_> What are development linkage files?
<AmberJ> Anyone?
<AmberJ> I guess everyone is 'busy' enjoying their weekends ;)
<rmooney> What is your question?
<bobweaver> Hello there hello there can I get some help uploading a debian package to a ppa that I made for friend ? all the code is located http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/+junk/zen-koans/files    I built the package two different ways and it will still not upload with dput    dpkg-builpackage  & also with debuild -S -sa uploads great but I get a e-mail saying that it has failed  ppa is located  https://launchpad.net/~josephjamesmill
<bobweaver> s/+archive/koan  Thanks for your time :)
<AmberJ> bobweaver: https://launchpad.net/~josephjamesmill does not exist
<bobweaver> O_o
<bobweaver> https://launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/+archive/koan
<bobweaver> the all the code is here thou
<bobweaver> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/+junk/zen-koans/files
<AmberJ> I cannot see build logs on PPA url (permissions issue, I guess). Can you upload them to a pastebin?
<bobweaver> sure
<bobweaver> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1032308/     < zen-koans_0.0.1-1ubuntu2_source.ppa.upload
<bobweaver> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1032310/  <  zen-koans_0.0.1-1ubuntu2_amd64.ppa.upload
<bobweaver> this is my first time ever using dput and leting launchpad make the build not sure if I am doing something wrong but I went thou all the wiki for LP and also Motu packaging guide
<AmberJ> Not this.
<bobweaver> you want the email that gets sent with rejection ?
<bobweaver> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1032316/
<AmberJ> When build on PPA fails, you get an email about the same. When you go on your PPA page, you see a build failed message with build log.
<AmberJ> The log is very long spanning many pages. It's PPA build fail log.
<mitya57> bobweaver: you have wrong Section: field in debian/control
<bobweaver> Thanks mitya57
<bobweaver> and also AmberJ
<mitya57> you are welcom
<mitya57> *welcome
<bobweaver> I will fix control file now
<bobweaver> perl would be the correct section ?
<bobweaver> reading from here http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-archive.html#s-subsections
<bobweaver> it's a perl program or modual plug in
<bobweaver> or should it be "contrib"
<bobweaver> I am confused sorry
<AmberJ> Sorry, I am much of a newbie my self to this...
<iulian> bobweaver: Those are the archive areas. Have a look at http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-controlfields.html#s-f-Section.
<bobweaver> iulian,  yeah I was looking at that and am confused
<bobweaver> seems like there are three main sections
<bobweaver> then there are "sub-sections "
<bobweaver> what is contrib ?
<bobweaver> or should this be "perl" as it is nothing but a new modual and a perl script
<mitya57> bobweaver: perl is ok
<mitya57> contrib means that the package depends on non-free components
<bobweaver> thanks a ton !
<iulian> bobweaver: Here, found it. See http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-archive.html. Scroll down to 2.4.
<bobweaver> lol seems like there are a-lot of the same-page :/
<PaoloRotolo> Hi all!
<PaoloRotolo> Salve
<AmberJ> If a package foo has both some *.so and some binaries, there will still exist a foo-dev.deb for header files for libraries in foo.deb
<AmberJ> ...as is for lib*.deb style packages.
<bobweaver> mitya57,  iulian  AmberJ  Thanks again I will also I will report back on errors or anything with upload of package I am also going to clean up the changelog file
<vibhav> Could somebody have a look at  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libvdpau/+bug/1010920 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1010920 in libvdpau (Ubuntu) "Please merge libvdpau (main) from Debian Unstable (0.4.1-6)" [Undecided,New]
<AmberJ_> In other words, lib*.deb has companion lib*-dev.deb packages. Does -dev packages exist for packages that have both binaries and libraries packaged together?
<bobweaver> Ok so this is what I did I rm all the old tar stuff dsc deb ect then changed control and also changelog. made new tar.gz file mv it then ran dh_make -f foo.tar.gz  then mv  foo.tar.gz ../   then debuild -S -sa
<bobweaver> Now I am going to try to use dput again
<mitya57> bobweaver: you should use dh_make only when you create initial packaging
 * Elbrus was going to say that
<Elbrus> ;)
<mitya57> you should just edit d/control and run debuild -S -sa
<bobweaver> mitya57,  I can just make tar czf foo.orig.tar.gz foo/   ?
<bobweaver> ahh cool Thanks a ton !
<mitya57> bobweaver: yes, if your build directory doesn't yet contain original source
<bobweaver> there are more things that I must must learn because It has been taking me alot time to clear out debian file and all old build stuff then make new tar mv to source tree  run dh_make then mv tar back ../ then fakeroot dpkg-buildpackage -f then debuild -S -sa
<bobweaver> dpkg-buildpackage -F     *
<bobweaver> less errors this time but I got this error        Unable to find distroseries: unstable
<bobweaver> because it is quantel  ?
<mitya57> you shouldn't generally run dpkg-buildpackage, debuild calls it for you
<mitya57> yes, in ubuntu it's quantal or precise, unstable is for Debian
<bobweaver> Thanks again <skipping record
 * bobweaver watches his karma on LP drop dramatically 
<bobweaver> does dch conform to Ubuntu standers ? meaning it makes control file set up for Ubuntu ?
<bobweaver> Is it better to use dch instead for altering control by hand ?
<bobweaver>  \0/   https://launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/+archive/koan
<bobweaver> thanks a ton every one !
<mitya57> bobweaver: dch is used for editing changelog, not control
<bobweaver> woops there is a tool like dch for d/control ?
<mitya57> bobweaver: sorry for the late reply (please call me directly next time); no, there's no such tool
<bobweaver> mitya57,  will do thank's for getting back to me :)
<tumbleweed> highvoltage: that's the plan, although I clearly made the mistake of getting a local sim and bringing a travel laptop charger :)
<highvoltage> tumbleweed: hehe
<jtaylor> stupid libtool I add something to LDFLAGS its ordered fine in the Makefile, but after libtool mangles it LDFLAGS lands behind the libs oO
<directhex> libtool is made of stupid
<AmberJ> If a package foo.deb has both some *.so and some binaries, does foo-dev.deb exist as well (for header files for libraries in foo.deb)?
<AmberJ> Similar to lib*-dev.deb for lib*.deb
<maxb> AmberJ_: Well it would depend on the package. But often, yes.
<jtaylor> though in that case it is more common to split the deb into a library and binary deb
<directhex> amberJ, it's totally at packager's discretion.
<jtaylor> as having seperate headers implies its a public library
<directhex> how about just pcfiles?
<directhex> e.g. monodevelop or banshee
<jtaylor> they don'T have libraries
<AmberJ> http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html#id250085 says using libfoo-runtime or libfoo-dev or /usr/lib/libfooX ...
<jtaylor> I used libfoo-bin once
<AmberJ> Someone mentioned that above lined debian library packaging guide is outdated. Can I use above mentioned reocmmendations from that guide?
<AmberJ> s/lined/linked
<maxb> There are examples of using -bin, -util, -utils, -tools, -runtime in the archive
<jtaylor> most use -bin
<jtaylor> util is probebly most intuative
<AmberJ> ok
<AmberJ> Huh... I don't understand why some *.so files go in lib*.deb and others in lib*-dev.deb ?
<AmberJ> Source: http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html#id250154
<maxb> AmberJ: *files* or *symlinks* ?
<maxb> I would be surprised to see a .so *file* in -dev
<AmberJ> http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html#id249952 says: "usr/lib/*.sodevelopment linkage file, used when other programs are linked with -lxxx" for *-dev.deb
<AmberJ> maxb: that^
<maxb> right; that would be a symlink to the .so in the libfoo.deb
<AmberJ> maxb: But http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html#id249898 says: "Usually, (libfoo.deb) contains the library file itself, somehow called libfoo.so.X.X.X and its symlink libfoo.so.X ..."
<AmberJ> That link says that there's a symlink in libfoo.deb package...
<AmberJ> Do you mean to say that we add another in libfoo-dev.deb as well?
<maxb> yes, there are symlinks there too
<AmberJ> ohk
<AmberJ> Got it now! Thanks everyone.
<maxb> The essence of what's going on is:
<maxb> * The actual shared library has the most specific versioned name
<maxb> * There's a symlink containing (normally) a single integer, which is the name by which the library gets looked up by at runtime
<maxb> * There's a symlink containing no version at all (or just the major version) by which the latest version of libfoo can be linked to at build time
<maxb> e.g. have a look at the contents zlib1g vs. zlib1g-dev
<AmberJ> hmm, that concisely explains it all.
<maxb> :-)
<maxb> Are you familiar with the concept of a 'soname'?
<AmberJ> #1 is to facilitate existence of multiple versions of a library. #2 and #3 are to facilitate library lookup at  runtime and compile time.
<AmberJ> yes, I read about soname role in packaging at http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/libraries.html
<maxb> the soname is how the linker, accessing the library via #3, knows what the #2 name is to code in to the binary for use at runtime
<AmberJ> ok
#ubuntu-motu 2012-06-10
<PaoloRotolo> Hi all!
<jtaylor> gna who synced plplot
<jtaylor> bad micahg
<jtaylor> micahg: I consider gdl to be more important than hiding plplots symbols which not even upstream does
<jtaylor> any objects to me reverting that again?
<jtaylor> yey mpich2 is broken in precise ._.
<jtaylor> ldd -r /usr/lib/libmpich.so.3 has undefined symbols
<micahg> jtaylor: no, sorry, you can revert that, sorry I missed it
<directhex> jtaylor: debian MPI stack in "broken" shocker?
<micahg> jtaylor: I guess the question is is Ubuntu doing something breaking a lot of things or is this a one off instance
<jtaylor> micahg: its a debian only change and gdl is the only thing broken by it
<jtaylor> third parties could be encouraged to link against private stuff but I don't care much about that
<jtaylor> I have hopped gdl would get fixed before the freeze but it seems its out of debian now
<jtaylor> directhex: I foolishly decided adopt a mpi library, now I have to fix mpi too ._.
<jtaylor> directhex: or as the library is in main just don't care, it works in debian ;P
<bobweaver> Hello there Should include GPL3 a copy that is with all the software that I am packaging up right now ?
<bobweaver> Yes I am using gpl3 for everything unless upstream is different
<bobweaver> thanks for your time
<bobweaver> looking to see if it is in /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL-3
<bobweaver> and it is :)
<bobweaver> Nevermind then
<bobweaver> sorry to waste time
<jtaylor> the software itself must have a copy of the gpl3 in its source
<jtaylor> but it does not need to be installed on debian systems, debian/copyright is for that
<bobweaver> jtaylor,  thank you very much
#ubuntu-motu 2013-06-03
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> infinity: Good. I had no clue and didn't want to sync-and-find-out-later. Thanks for checking.
<infinity> Laney: Turns out the irritating complexity of the patch was still required, but I refreshed it to be based on gcc-4.8 instead of 4.7 and uploaded.
<Laney> rockin'
<Laney> Assuming mitya57's gdcm works then that should smooth the path for poppler to migrate
<Laney> ah, balls, calligra
<mitya57> Laney: thanks for uploading xpdf!
<Laney> np
<Laney> I did a grep and then noticed the stuff is already there ...
<Laney> I suppose the remaining issue is missing fixes to that code in poppler.
<mitya57> Which fixes?
<Laney> As in, if it gets fixes in the future
<Laney> keeping it in sync
<mitya57> Yes, let's hope Poppler will have less code cleanups in future :)
<Laney> ha hahahaha aha. yeah.
<Laney> anyway, should be done for now ...
<tumbleweed> mfisch, mitya57: welcome to MOTU :)
<iulian> Uh-oh!
<mitya57> tumbleweed: should/can I take part in MOTU meetings?
<tumbleweed> mitya57: MOTU meetings kind of died
<mitya57> Hm, looks like that, yes
<tumbleweed> if we are going to resurrect them, we'd need a reason
<mfisch> thanks tumbleweed
<tumbleweed> and somebody to drive them for a few months
<Laney> added
<Laney> get to breakin'
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/New
<Laney> might be a bit ancient but maybe useful
<mfisch> proper understanding of dput is useful
<mfisch> Laney: whats the general policy on DEP3 headers (adding/updating them)? I know desktop tries to do so
<Laney> I'd say it's a good idea and you should do it
<Laney> but I don't think there's a policy per se
<mfisch> from the ones I've seen sometimes a time machine would help
<mfisch> Laney: thanks
<Laney> there's a ton of old stuff
<Laney> it pays to consider patches when you come across them and help them along in life
<mfisch> yeah, I tried one last week and I couldn't figure out where it originated
<mfisch> Laney: what are the debian channels you hang out on in order to collaborate better?
 * mitya57 always uses DEP-3, and also exports QUILT_REFRESH_ARGS="-p ab --no-timestamps --no-index" to make patches cleaner
<Laney> I'm in loads
<Laney> good ones might be #debian-devel, #debian-mentors and #debian-gnome
<mfisch> those would be good starts, thanks
<tumbleweed> while we only have to follow policy, I try to follow best practices, and enforce them on sponsorees
<tumbleweed> e.g. DEP-3, DEP-5 on new packages, autopkgtests whenever possible, forward everything upstream, etc etc
<mfisch> mitya57: I've not used those flags before, I'll add it to my notes
<tumbleweed> mfisch: I belive they are mentioned in the debian new maintainer's guide
<mfisch> for the 2 new packages I've done, upstream has been very amenable to taking all the patches, so we dont have any.. so far
<mitya57> mfisch: s/my notes/.bashrc/
<Laney> .quiltrc
<mitya57> that's indeed better, didn't know about that
<Laney> argh cdbs argh
<Laney> how can I hook into make check?
<tumbleweed> the answer to  "how do I ... in cdbs" is always "read the source"
<Laney> it's not giving me much
<Laney> i'm just overriding the whole target
<tumbleweed> you want to add something?
<Laney> I want to export FOO=$(mktemp -d), run the testsuite and then remove the directory
<Laney> I suppose I could just do it at the top level
<Laney> use a fixed directory name, perhaps that's not so bad
#ubuntu-motu 2013-06-04
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> git-svn clone is one seriously slow operation
<Laney> I should have done it locally on alitoh
#ubuntu-motu 2013-06-05
<mfisch> Do we have a webpage that lists out of date universe packages like the desktop team uses (http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/ubuntu-desktop.html)?
<ajmitch> mfisch: there are various pages like http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/uehs/no_updated.html or http://qa.ubuntuwire.org/mdt/universe.html
<mfisch> ajmitch: thanks, thats perfect
<mfisch> any sbuild users here? as a pbuild user, I have a couple questions
<mfisch> and I answered my own questions, had a permissions issue on a file
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> good morning
<alo21> hi, I have a question about changelog during a merge...
<alo21> I would like to focus on xenomai package (universe)...Why 2.5.5.2-1ubuntu2  package doesn't report 2.4.8-2ubuntu1 changes?
<mitya57> alo21: because it's not a merge
<mitya57> 2.5.5.2-1ubuntu1 does
<alo21> ubuntu2 ?
<mitya57> alo21: all merges have ...ubuntu1 number
<alo21> mitya57, and   2.5.5.2-1ubuntu2 is just a Ubuntu upgrade. right?
<mitya57> yes
<alo21> hhmm.. ok. I am going to update the changelog
<alo21> mitya57, when you mentioned debian/control and debian/libxenomai1.{postinst,preinst,postrm} files... are they just a part of uncommented files?
<mitya57> alo21: uncommented?
<alo21> not documented
<mitya57> alo21: there was also changelog.dch in that diff, but it's just a dch's backup and should be deleted
 * mitya57 will be back in an hour
<alo21> I am running debdiff.. which diff do I have to create? debian-new_ubuntu?
<mitya57> alo21: If you name it debian-ubuntu-something.debdiff, then it is supposed to be debian-new_ubuntu :)
<alo21> mitya57, depends on what you want...I mean..during a merge, you pick debian package and apply my debdiff?
<alo21> mitya57, for example..is this debdiff (http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5735883/) good?
<mitya57> ... and he is gone
<geser> wanted to add some suggestions/comments on the debdiff and noted that he's gone too
<mitya57> geser: add on bug 1186588 please
<ubottu> bug 1186588 in xenomai (Ubuntu) "Please merge xenomai 2.6.2.1-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1186588
#ubuntu-motu 2013-06-06
<dholbach> good morning
<alo21> hi... im going to fix bu #1186588
<alo21> bug #1186588*
<ubottu> bug 1186588 in xenomai (Ubuntu) "Please merge xenomai 2.6.2.1-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1186588
<alo21> my question is.. Do I have to delete dh_installudev too?
<geser> alo21: no, keep it
<geser> it should like like:
<geser> dh_installdocs -s -A
<geser> dh_installdocs -s -A
<geser> dh_installudev
<geser> (sorry, c&p fail, only one time dh_installdocs)
<alo21> geser, I supposed it, and I want to be sure...Ok. Thanks :)
#ubuntu-motu 2013-06-07
<mfisch> why are some packages versioned with dfsg in the version number?
<StevenK> mfisch: Because they're have non-free bits removed by the maintainer
<StevenK> s/re/ve/
<Unit193> they've have
<mfisch> grammar or not, that makes sense, thanks
<Unit193> (Debian Free Software Guidelines.)
<jaalto> Hi, Whom should I ocntact to get few of the Launcpad bugs closed? I'm the Debian maintainer of those packages and have checked them.
<dholbach> good morning
<jaalto> Anyone in the channel with admin rights to close bugs in Launchpad?
<Adri2000> jaalto: anyone can close a bug in LP afaik
<Adri2000> jaalto: except maybe for the wontfix status
<jaalto> Adri2000: you can? Hm
<jaalto> Let's take e.g. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/speedometer/+bug/510800 ... I'm logged on, where is the knob?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 510800 in speedometer (Ubuntu) "speedometer crashed with AttributeError in __init__()" [Undecided,New]
<Adri2000> jaalto: click the pencil icon near "new"
<jaalto> Adri2000: Direction...? Up, Down, Right of page ....?
<Adri2000> at the top of the page, where you can see the status, importance, and assignee of the bug
<jaalto> Adri2000: got it.
<jaalto> Adri2000: Does "Fix releaed" also close the bug?
<lifeless> fix released/invalid/wonfix/opinion are all closed states
<jaalto> lifeless: Ok. Thanks.
<jaalto> What is the generic URL to access bug by number in Launchpag? In Debian that is http://bugs.debian.org/NNNNN
<jaalto> Launchpad
<TheLordOfTime> jaalto:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/NNNNNNN
<Laney> pad.lv/nnnn
<TheLordOfTime> that too
<TheLordOfTime> Laney:  quick refresh of my memory in case patch policy has changed, Bug-Ubuntu lines in the DEP3 should have the bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/NNNNNN link format, or the pad.lv format?
<TheLordOfTime> or does it not matter?
<Laney> doubt it matters
 * TheLordOfTime shrugs
<Laney> I usually include the full one
<TheLordOfTime> mhm
<Laney> mainly because I'm copy and pasting rather than typing it
<TheLordOfTime> xD
<jaalto> Is pad.lv/nnnn official?
<TheLordOfTime> jaalto:  afaict it's part of Launchpad, like a redirect, if you want to be "official" the link I gave you is more characters, but does the same thing.
<TheLordOfTime> confirmed to work using one of the bug numbers i watch like a hawk (both methods)
<jaalto> TheLordOfTime: ok.
<TheLordOfTime> ... i lied
<TheLordOfTime> pad.lv isn't part of LP
<TheLordOfTime> my fault sorry
 * TheLordOfTime woke up an hour ago
<TheLordOfTime> jaalto:  but, pad.lv/NNNN and bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/NNNN do the same thing
<Legendario> hi. I'm trying to build a package. After running lintian i corrected stuff it pointed but it still show the same warnings. What is wrong?
<coolbhavi> Legendario, what are the errors you are getting?
<Legendario> coolbhavi, regular errors on debian/files configuration. U wanna see?
<Legendario> coolbhavi, http://pastebin.com/JDxmQdjL
<coolbhavi> Legendario, most of them are related to debian/rules because some of the statements used there can be obsolete
<Legendario> coolbhavi, i know but after changing that it still shows the same errors
<Legendario> I have corrected them, but lintian shows the same stuff. What should I do?
<geser> did you rebuild the source package you run lintian on?
<Legendario> geser, yes. Do I have to pass some argument to bzr builddeb for that?
<geser> I don't think so
<jaalto> Could someone makr this "won't fix". I've written explanation why it's not https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/zpaq/+bug/1074840
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1074840 in zpaq (Ubuntu) "Zpaq package isnt up to date (wasnt updated over 2 years)" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<TheLordOfTime> jaalto:  probably should have asked in -bugs, but... *looks*
<TheLordOfTime> actually i'll leave this for a MOTU :P
<jaalto> I'm closing the Debian bug 693656 that is referened in the LP bug with similar explanation.
<ubottu> Debian bug 693656 in zpaq "zpaq: Zpaq package isnt up to date (wasnt updated over 2 years)" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/693656
<jaalto> TheLordOfTime: can the MOTU group be reached by email?
 * TheLordOfTime shrugs
<TheLordOfTime> jaalto:  i usually have good luck finding someine in-channel within a 30 minute period of time
<TheLordOfTime> but that implies patience
 * TheLordOfTime kicks his keyboard for beings tupid
<jaalto> TheLordOfTime: The problem is with timezones...
<TheLordOfTime> jaalto:  i'm pretty certain there's MOTUs on from all over.
<geser> jaalto: set to "wontfix" as requested
<TheLordOfTime> also devs, but... :P
<jaalto> geser: Oh, good. Thanks.
<TheLordOfTime> jaalto:  out of pure curiosity...
<jaalto> TheLordOfTime: yes?
<TheLordOfTime> there's no updated version in debian is there, as a separate package
<TheLordOfTime> (on that bug)
<TheLordOfTime> s/bug/package/
<jaalto> TheLordOfTime: zpaq 1.x is all there is. I've reponded to numerous requests to upgrade, but unfortunately it's road closed (or bridge burnts) and not possible. Someone is free to packge the 6.x zpaq from scratch. Then 1.x can be obsoleted.
<TheLordOfTime> that was my question :P
 * TheLordOfTime was curious if anyone had an ITP up for zpaq 6.x as some other alternate package or not
<TheLordOfTime> ... oh COME ON i fixed that FTBFS problem already...  *goes to kick the nginx package around a bit on his local builders*
<jaalto> TheLordOfTime: Not to my knowledge, there is no RFP/ITP. See http://www.debian.org/devel/wnpp/requested
<Laney> ah, yay, got lp-udd to verify the cert again
<Laney> still had to monkeypatch httplib as python-launchpadlib doesn't have a way to let you override the default
<Laney> afaict, anyway
#ubuntu-motu 2013-06-08
<mitya57> Does anybody know what this can cause this: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/141952452/buildlog_ubuntu-saucy-amd64.xenomai_2.6.2.1-2ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz ?
<mitya57> (I can't reproduce this locally)
<mitya57> Hm, I can't reproduce this even if I'm doing a binary-arch build :(
 * mitya57 installs pkg-create-dbgsym and tries to build with that
#ubuntu-motu 2014-06-02
<cosms> hde
#ubuntu-motu 2014-06-03
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2014-06-04
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> guten morgen motu
<ogra_> moin
#ubuntu-motu 2014-06-05
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2014-06-06
<vincent_c> Noskcaj: since you aren't in #debian-python right now...just pinging you about https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=744820#51
<ubottu> Debian bug 744820 in release.debian.org "squeeze-pu: package catfish/0.3.2-2+deb7u1" [Normal,Open]
<vincent_c> needless to say this is starting to get really frustrating for me as a sponsor :(
<vincent_c> should I start assuming that you don't usually test your packages before asking for an upload?
<Chipaca> hi all
<Chipaca> I've got a patch to a package I'd like landed in ubuntu. It's golang-go-dbus-dev, a package we get via debian. Sergio, the person that got it into debian, is away on holiday, and will push the diff into debian when he returns. Until then I'd like to get unblocked, land these changes.
<Chipaca> is this the right place to ask for somebody's help?
<Chipaca> the diff in question is http://people.canonical.com/~john/golang-go-dbus_bzr20140217-1ubuntu1.diff
<rbasak> Chipaca: looking
<Chipaca> rbasak: thanks
<rbasak> Chipaca: are the patches committed upstream?
<Chipaca> rbasak: yes
<Chipaca> there are the last to commits upstream
<Chipaca> *these
<Chipaca> rbasak: bzr log -l3 lp:go-dbus/v1
<Chipaca> the patches are r126 and r127; r125 is what's packaged
<rbasak> OK
<rbasak> Please could you mark up the patches with dep-3, with pointers to the upstream commits etc?
<rbasak> http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep3/
<rbasak> I understand that you believe it should be temporary, but I'd prefer to see it done properly in case it ends up being there longer.
<rbasak> Then it's clear to any future developer that they're upstream cherry-picks and will disappear soon.
 * Chipaca looks
<xnox> Chipaca: rbasak: you can ask to get it sponsored into debain.
<Chipaca> rbasak: re dep3, is the author of the patch the author of the upstream delta, or the author of the patch itself?
<xnox> e.g. I can NMU it into debian & sync into ubuntu, thus not adding extra work to sergiusens when he returns.
<rbasak> xnox: AIUI, the maintainer is a Canonical employee and will do it next week. So I didn't think it was worth the overhead to make any formal request eg. bug.
<Chipaca> week after next, actually
<Chipaca> next week i could wait for :)
<rbasak> xnox: oh if you could do that then that would be great
<xnox> rbasak: =)
<Chipaca> (two weeks holidays! such luxury)
<xnox> Chipaca: well and 2 weeks of sprinting before that.
<Chipaca> xnox: oooh! NMU away, then :)
<xnox> Chipaca: let's read what you wrote there first.
<rbasak> xnox: I think you can just do a new upstream "release" (ie. bzr snapshot, which was there before)
<xnox> Chipaca: do you simply want new upstream release?
<Chipaca> xnox: yep
<Chipaca> this does mean i won't be able to then ask you to endorse my PPU thing :-/ but it is certainly the better way :)
<xnox> Chipaca: hm. I thought sergiusens was maintaining it. But in Debian maintainer is set to Tianon Gravi
<rbasak> Chipaca: put it in your future PPU application anyway
<Chipaca> xnox: you might be looking at golang-dbus
<Chipaca> xnox: != golang-go-dbus
<Chipaca> yes, I don't know why they're both in the archive either
<xnox> better
<Chipaca> golang-dbus wasn't there when we packaged golang-go-dbus, fwiw
<Chipaca> (golang-dbus is from github, in one of the abandoned predecessors of the launchpad go-dbus)
<rbasak> I'll leave this to xnox then I guess?
<xnox> Chipaca: rbasak: hm, i'm not in pkg-go team, thus won't be able to update VCS.
<xnox> jamespage: would you mind doing new upstream release of golang-go-dbus into debian, from bzr snapshot?
<xnox> debian vcs is git/pkg-go, maintainer sergiusens who is enjoying beaches, sun and etc at the moment
<jamespage> xnox, ok
<Chipaca> rbasak: xnox: jamespage: thanks!
<jamespage> Chipaca, xnox: who has a snapshot for me then?
<Chipaca> jamespage: xnox: I don't know exactly what a snapshot is in this context, but I can provide it if you tell me (or point me at something that tells me)
<Chipaca> jamespage: the thing to be packaged is what's currently on lp:go-dbus/v1
<Chipaca> maybe that's what you need?
<xnox> jamespage: $ bzr export --per-file-timestamps golang-go-dbus_1~20140606.tar.gz lp:go-dbus
<xnox> jamespage: that should generate identical tarball on any machine, no?
<Chipaca> lp:go-dbus/v1
<Chipaca> is the "released" or stable one
<xnox> right.
<xnox> and last commit was on 2014-05-30
<xnox> 82929f4ef3f20657089efdd2c472afb9  golang-go-dbus_1~20140530.tar.gz
<xnox> $ bzr export --per-file-timestamps golang-go-dbus_1~20140530.tar.gz lp:go-dbus/v1
<xnox> jamespage: ^ do you get the same md5sum?
<Chipaca> 82929f4ef3f20657089efdd2c472afb9
<jamespage> hmm
<jamespage> no
<xnox> hmm everyone should. Unless there is a bug in python2.7 again.
<xnox> --per-file-timestamps does generate reproducible tarballs.
<jamespage> xnox, nope - I do get the same being dumb
<jamespage> Chipaca, xnox: uploaded to unstable - it will take LP some time to notice
<Chipaca> jamespage: thanks!
<Chipaca> jamespage: where in launchpad would this be?
<jamespage> ubuntu
<jamespage> Chipaca, it will autosync
<Chipaca> jamespage: ok :)
<Chipaca> was looking at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/golang-go-dbus and suspecting something was missing, but I'll trust you on that :)
<xnox> Chipaca: it will first appear on http://packages.qa.debian.org/golang-go-dbus then after some time on https://launchpad.net/debian/+source/golang-go-dbus and then eventually on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/golang-go-dbus
<Chipaca> xnox: perfect
<Chipaca> xnox: what's the timeframe?
<Chipaca> hours? days?
<rbasak> Debian's publisher runs are pretty slow. IIRC, it's a matter of a day or two.
<xnox> Chipaca: next debian dinstall is at 1952 UTC, after that it will publish (another half an hour), then launchpad syncs and builds it.
<xnox> Chipaca: i'd expect it by mid-night UTC, or tomorrow morning.
<Chipaca> excellent
<xnox> unless we make the 13:52 dinstall, then it will be snappy
<Chipaca> even better than excellent :)
<Chipaca> anyway, school run. Thank you all!
<Chipaca> xnox: looks like we didn't make the 13:52
<Chipaca> xnox: jamespage: golang-go-dbus-dev 1~bzr20140530-1 in ubuntu \o/ thanks yet again!
#ubuntu-motu 2014-06-07
<newone> how can I start contribute in ubuntu?
<newone> for development
<sney> hello
<sney> 2 things: 1) my debian hexchat package has a new upstream release! 2.10.0-1 is in sid now, and I was told that new releases would have to be synced manually. b) what do I modify in order for hexchat to minimize to the unity tray? or does that have to be done at the ubuntu end
<Unit193> Howdy.  Are you trying to get hexchat in trusty or utopic?  If utopic, then it's already in there.  I don't know unity, but if the tray is just indicators something like https://launchpad.net/hexchat-indicator
<sney> which one is 14? trusty?
<Unit193> (https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/hexchat/2.10.0-1) Trusty is 14.04, utopic is 14.10.
<sney> I'm not really familiar with ubuntu's policy wrt version freezes
<Unit193> !sru | Yeah, it is a bit weird, for sure.
<ubottu> Yeah, it is a bit weird, for sure.: Stable Release Update information is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<Unit193> (Note, I am not a motu or uploader.)
<sney> well, you know the bot keywords so that's usually good enough
<sney> 14.10 releases in october I assume?
<Unit193> Exactly.
<sney> that's good enough then
#ubuntu-motu 2014-06-08
<michagogo> What would be the next step towards getting the SRU in for bug 1314616?
<ubottu> bug 1314616 in bitcoin (Ubuntu) "[SRU] bitcoin to be maintained upstream in PPA: Replace distro archive "bitcoin" bitcoin with an empty dummy package" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1314616
#ubuntu-motu 2015-06-01
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2015-06-02
<sergio-br2> hi
<dholbach> good morning
<ochosi> Rhonda: hey! any reason why wily isn't showing up on packages.ubuntu.com yet?
<Rhonda> ochosi: because I was too lazy to do it yet. :)
<ochosi> alrighty :)
<Rhonda> btw., the wiki doesn't mention wily in the Releases page
<Rhonda> meh, it does, I'm blind :)
<Rhonda> I guess I'll remove utopic already.
<Laney> utopic's still alive
<Rhonda> For less than two more months?
<Laney> it's your call but I bet people still use it for that
<Rhonda> Ok.  But lucid gets removed. :)
<Laney> what's the config like?
<Laney> could you script it to be generated from $(ubuntu-distro-info --supported) or something?
<Rhonda> I guess so.  There is also this metainfo website that the information could get pulled from I guess.  We had that discussion in Debian context recently where that one was mentioned.
<Rhonda> I have this workplan for debcamp to work on the packages code so maybe I get something done at that time.
<jimcornette> Hello there, I am making a simple c++ console application with Qt.  I have compiled it and it runs fine.  But when I try to build it with sbuild it errors out saying that there is no QCoreApplication  even though I have added widgets and core and network to my .pro file and also to d/control any idea what is going on ?
<jimcornette> it is a simple avahi register.  so it is a simple console application.
<jimcornette> My debian/control and debian/rules files    http://paste.ubuntu.com/11527486/
#ubuntu-motu 2015-06-03
<dholbach> good morning
<sergio-br2> good night
#ubuntu-motu 2015-06-04
<dupingping> Hi, everyone.
<dholbach> good morning
<dupingping> dholbach, morning.
<dholbach> hi dupingping
<dupingping> hi
<dupingping> dholbach, are you a moderator?
<dholbach> moderator in which sense?
<dupingping> I means that Ubuntu Software Center's moderator.
<dholbach> ah, no - sorry
<dholbach> which package are you looking for help with?
<dupingping> My software is in pending review stats in Ubuntu Software Center for 4+ days.
<dholbach> which package is it?
<dupingping> it's ubuntu-sticky.
<dholbach> do you have a link to it?
<dupingping> it's not published yet. please look the status, at following url.
<dupingping> https://developer.ubuntu.com/en/publish/application-states/
<dupingping> Review pending is second step.
<dholbach> no... the link you mention is about the software store for the phone
<dholbach> not for the desktop
<dholbach> unfortunately it takes a lot longer to get software in through this process for the desktop right now as it requires manual review
#ubuntu-motu 2015-06-05
<dholbach> good morning
<Rhonda> hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
<Rhonda> -rw-rw-r-- 1 packagesubuntu packagesubuntu 1742244 May  4 15:39 cron.log
 * Rhonda redirects herself to #canonical-sysadmin
<Rhonda> ochosi: I've been told that there was a request to discontinue the mirror pulse triggers to the packages site, so I'm uncertain about the future of the service.
<Laney> a... request?
<Laney> Rhonda: I think we should request that the request be unrequested. :)
<Laney> Seems at the very least impolite to do that without consulting the maintainer
<Laney> Probably was unintentional :)
<Rhonda> I assume so too, just waiting for response now.
<ochosi> Rhonda: oh, well i hope that's not going to happen then. it's quite useful
<Rhonda> hmm
<Rhonda> the manual run doesn't do anything, it hangs at "lockfile" â¦
<Rhonda> ok, I give up for now
#ubuntu-motu 2015-06-06
<slackner> micahg: ping?
#ubuntu-motu 2015-06-07
<micahg> slackner: pong
<slackner> micahg: hiho, you probably remember my request regarding inclusion of wine-staging. the two weeks are almost over (on wednesday to be precise), but still no answer from scott :(
<micahg> :(
<micahg> I'll poke around and see if anyone's heard from him lately
<slackner> micahg: kk, maybe someone knows some details :/ but he also hasn't updated his repos for a while, either he lost interest or is very busy with other stuff it seems
<micahg> right, ok, well, maybe we can chat Wed around this time then if we don't hear from him and work on next steps
<slackner> kk
<Fantu> hi, someone can take a look here please? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs/+bug/517021 autotest fails that block important -updates push to trusty don't seems a real regression
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 517021 in gvfs (Ubuntu Utopic) "gvfsd-metadata causes 100% CPU usage" [Undecided,Fix committed]
#ubuntu-motu 2016-06-07
<fossfreedom> Hi - not sure if I'm on the correct channel ... but I'm looking for a Debian Mentor who will be willing to sponsor my package "budgie-desktop" - this is the desktop environment from the Solus distro
<jbicha> fossfreedom: see also #debian-mentors on the oftc network
<fossfreedom> Thanks - will try.
#ubuntu-motu 2016-06-08
<Unit193> Logan: Pokepoke.  fastimport?  I don't remember the conclusion.
#ubuntu-motu 2016-06-09
<Unit193> (Also, that change I mentioned that could make the package syncable, I found it: https://anonscm.debian.org/cgit/users/unit193-guest/deluge.git/commit/?id=d066f6fa2cd91b8fba466320e537427d01ba9372)
#ubuntu-motu 2017-06-05
<Unit193> rbasak: python-certbot looks uninstallable in artful.
<Unit193> Ah, I see.  Nevermind then.
#ubuntu-motu 2018-06-04
<tsimonq2> zcot: Keep me updated, and I'm willing to help if you provide specifics. :)
<zcot> tsimonq2: Ok. thank you. So, let me understand this. should I end up with a .deb file that has no discernible source code? -only debian control stuffs.
<tsimonq2> zcot: No.
<tsimonq2> zcot: To look at vc again, see the tail of this build log: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vc/1.3.3-4/+build/14970760/+files/buildlog_ubuntu-cosmic-amd64.vc_1.3.3-4_BUILDING.txt.gz
<tsimonq2> zcot: That's just a rough idea. :)
<tsimonq2> zcot: And you really shouldn't be working with the deb itself; try using something like debuild (dpkg-buildpackage) or sbuild via https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SimpleSbuild
<zcot> i did dh_make, editing, then debuild.
<tsimonq2> dh_make is a raw command that's usually called by debuild or sbuild. :)
<tsimonq2> Usually, you should only have to run the unedited packaging through sbuild.
<zcot> so that log. what is that exactly?
<tsimonq2> It's the build log from Launchpad.
<zcot> yea, I might have some mixed up tools for all I know. or the provided template files? i installed some ubuntu recommended packaging stuff but like I got that thing about /DEBIAN or /debian so that was weird. or somewhat incompatible versions. one error from lintian mentioned wrong standards version 3.9.6 listed in control file(current being 3.9.7)
<zcot> so are any binary packages built manually? or the point is to create the proper source(and that's available in it's own right) and then of course that can create any variety of shippable binary.
<tsimonq2> Right
<tsimonq2> All you should have for packaging is stuff under debian/
<zcot> Ok. I'll get into that sbuild guide and see what I can come up with.
<tsimonq2> Cool.
#ubuntu-motu 2018-06-07
<zcot> tsimonq2: Hi. I followed the bzr specific guide, was able to work out my way through a package. I uploaded  +junk as just debian versioning method. Is this an easy way for you to take a look(without the .dsc or .changes)? : https://code.launchpad.net/~zcotcaudle/+junk/list-apt-installs-package
#ubuntu-motu 2018-06-08
<fnatter> hi ubuntu-motu, I have filed an SRU (a sync of an unstable bug fix to bionic): https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libjsyntaxpane-java/+bug/1770809
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1770809 in libjsyntaxpane-java (Ubuntu Bionic) "[bionic SRU] Port libjsyntaxpane-java 0.9.6~r156-7 java9 crash to bionic" [Undecided,New]
<fnatter> Would someone be so kind to consider triggering the SRU process?
<rbasak> fnatter: looks good in principle but I don't have time to review/sponsor right now. Please ping me tomorrow if you don't find anyone before then.
<rbasak> And thank you for preparing this for Ubuntu :)
<tsimonq2> I'll do what I can right now, but there's a chance I'll defer the actual patch review to someone else.
<tsimonq2> fnatter: I personally consider the lack of a DEP-3 header in a patch a blocker to sponsorship, please fix that.
<tsimonq2> Also, "Origin" should have e.g. "commit:5fc7559" rather than the full link I think.
<tsimonq2> Lastly, you don't need to add your name to uploaders, and you just need to target the upload at "bionic"
<tsimonq2> Otherwise, lgtm :)
<rbasak> A full web-based URL is pretty normal for Origin.
<tsimonq2> rbasak: Oh?
<tsimonq2> I guess I've always preferred the full URL, but YMMV
<rbasak> tsimonq2: that sounds like the inverse sense of what you just said above
<fnatter> rbasak: I will fix this in the next days, I might not have time on the weekend, thanks!
<fnatter> tsimonq2: "Origin" contains a full URL because the repo is a fork of the original jsyntaxpane repo, that the package was originally created for
<fnatter> and there are at least two forks
<fnatter> I will fix the DEP3 header in debian/patches/disable-pom
<fnatter> see you
