#edubuntu 2005-11-07
<signifer123> there a way to stop them from isntalling stuff?
<signifer123> installing*
<bluefrog-10> they can't install stuff as normal user
<ogra> how where ? 
<signifer123> anywhere
<signifer123> doing this so i can see if i can convince my school to move to linux
<ogra> you cant stop them from  compiling and installing stuff in ~/bin ... as you cant avoid that in other OS's
<signifer123> aww...
<magnon> and stopping them from compiling and installing stuff in their own home dir is yet another limitation you wouldn't need
<ogra> you can easily install firefox in your windows homedir, noboidy can prevent you
<bluefrog-10> yes but it will confined in their thing, won't mess witht the system
<magnon> if anything goes wrong, you can delete their homedir and get up a backup
<ogra> its not different in linux
<signifer123> there a way to keep them from having access to the hd at all?
<magnon> you could of course limit how much memory and disk a user could consume
<magnon> that's pretty easy.
<signifer123> they can just use the servers shared drive only
<magnon> signifer123: then they wouldn't be able to read the freaking programs
<signifer123> jsut set everything to 555?
<magnon> ugh
<ogra> sure, you can set up nfs homedirs ...
<magnon> just leave /usr as it is and all that
<ogra> wont work
<signifer123> 755
<signifer123> :-
<signifer123> p
<ogra> the apps need to be able to access settings to run
<ogra> 755 is possible, indeed
<magnon> but very ugly
<signifer123> agh....
<magnon> why would this be a problem, anyway?
<signifer123> well then i'll have to do alot befroe i'll be able ot convince them to goto linux :-p
<magnon> students aren't inherently evil
<signifer123> school thinks so
<magnon> they _should_ have access to use their system to learn and all
<magnon> school is silly then
<signifer123> all they need it for is internet and ofice apps
<signifer123> office*
<magnon> sure, you could limit everything with SELinux, but that's a LOT of work :P
<magnon> just don't install anything else, then
<signifer123> but then you have to keep them from installing stuff, ohh and gnome
<signifer123> it uses gnome right?
<signifer123> :-P
<signifer123> i would psot this but couldn't find na edubuntu forum
<magnon> there's a mailing list
<magnon> what's the issue with gnome?
<magnon> you could use kubuntu with edubuntu as well
<magnon> and possibly the later xubuntu
<signifer123> ohh can i keep them from accessing the system aprt of the menu?
<corey_> for dapper, that will be hidden for non-admin users
<corey_> s/that/the system menu
<magnon> well, they can't _use_ anything in the system menu without being an admin
<magnon> so it's just silly to have it there... but it doesn't hurt
<corey_> yes, they can use the preferences menu
<magnon> that's personal :)
<magnon> I think they should be able to
<magnon> signifer123: what about trying to find reasons why things working as it is, does not hurt, and give that to the teachers instead?
<signifer123> on windows?
<magnon> a computer is no good as a tool if you completely limit the toolchain :-/
<magnon> no, on edubuntu
<signifer123> itso n windows and i want ot convince the trade over...
<magnon> right
<magnon> but they want a bunch of security, it seems
<signifer123> yeah...
<magnon> convince them that it's not needed, since it isn't
<magnon> and explain why.
<magnon> should work nicely
<signifer123> well...probably not
<magnon> you could also show the plans for edubuntu which aren't implemented yet, there's a bunch of plans in http://www.edubuntu.org
<magnon> why not? if they already set their minds on that, but still asking you, why ask you at all?
<bluefrog-10> the best thing is to prepare your plan and do a demo
<magnon> also
<magnon> as Jeff so nicely says
<signifer123> i ahvn't set theri minds on linux
<magnon> show the benefits rather than anything else :-)
<signifer123> so far the only reason i could convince them si because everything they have done to the windows to restrict us i can show them a way around
<bluefrog-10> do u have windows thin client on a terminal server or thick clients?
<signifer123> we run windows 200 on middle line 1 year old dell
<signifer123> 2000
<signifer123> with login novell netware
<signifer123> shared in our county
<bluefrog-10> meaning all clients are windows installed, correct?
<signifer123> except the server
<signifer123> i think its solaris
<signifer123> never checked
<signifer123> lol
<signifer123> whoops
<signifer123> yes
<magnon> wow, you're in for saving big money then ;)
<signifer123> lol
<signifer123> i'm sure the IT staff will be happy to hear they have to learn linux :-P
<signifer123> thats gonna be hard to beat
<signifer123> ...
<magnon> they should be happy to learn!
<magnon> :D
<bluefrog-10> don't tell them they are going to learn linux but..
<signifer123> yeh but the county has to spend $$$ on teaching them
<magnon> as I said, long term investment
<magnon> since you have next to no licensing costs 
<magnon> none if you choose not to have support
<bluefrog-10> they will have more time by changing a network card that has failed rather than reinstalling windows..
<magnon> true
<magnon> maybe they can even lay off one :P
<signifer123> and convince them that they bought the office 2002 lisences for nothing becuase we are switching to OO
<magnon> return them
<magnon> :D
<signifer123> i'm sure MS will be happy to refund us becuase we are switching to linux :-P
<bluefrog-10> don't talk to them about money they lost if u are not prepared to show them how much they are going to save
<bluefrog-10> even in high schools downtime can be transposed in money
<signifer123> k
<signifer123> gotta start on slideshow :-p
<bluefrog-10> and live demo
<signifer123> of course
<signifer123> whats the min reqs?
<signifer123> becuase we have old gateways runnign windows 98 laying off somewhere in the costodial hall
<signifer123> not being used
<magnon> for thin clients or thick?
<signifer123> whatever would work for a live demo
<magnon> oh
<magnon> you should have a machine that works well then
<magnon> don't you have a laptop you could use?
<bluefrog-10> to make a demo, server with 256 ram is enough..
<signifer123> lemem grab my home pc and drag it up to central office :-P
<signifer123> 256 megs?
<signifer123> those have like 16 emgs of ram
<magnon> ehm
<bluefrog-10> well one must be serious at least
<magnon> edubuntu might be lighter than windows, but it's not anno 1984
<signifer123> lol
<bluefrog-10> u don't show how good is ferrari if it has only 3 wheels
<signifer123> LOL
<magnon> 16 megs isn't even enough for a thin client
<signifer123> 32?
<magnon> 32 is good for a thin client
<signifer123> well i could pop in a 96 meg if they let me take it home
<signifer123> making 128 megs
<magnon> this is for the thin though
<magnon> you need a server as well
<bluefrog-10> 32 for clients would be good but beware, they only want office and internet but during the show they will want to see other applications, that u can be sure of
<signifer123> well i'm sure they'll keep solaris on the server
<magnon> some kind of machine which doesn't suck would do
<signifer123> thin client has gnome?
<magnon> and the solaris one is probably a different arch
<signifer123> well the server is only for novell netware...
<magnon> get another machine then
<magnon> steal a desktop
<signifer123> lol
<magnon> if they want you to do a demo they better give you resources
<signifer123> idk if i wait like 4 months i'll get my dad s old comp
<bluefrog-10> set up your machine in no other solution
<signifer123> and edubuntu might get a better release by then
<magnon> there's no more edubuntu releases in six months
<magnon> http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuWiki
<magnon> read around for the concept of thin clients
<signifer123> the thing is i havn't even convinced them to do a demo
<magnon> oh
<magnon> then you're ahead of yourselves
<signifer123> well i can convince the head of my school easy
<bluefrog-10> u have to know what they want to do not what they don't want to do and propose a plan accordingly
<signifer123> yeah but first i have to catch their interest
<bluefrog-10> just try not to bypass the IT guys
<bluefrog-10> u would end up in a one way street
<bluefrog-10> sry a dead end street
<signifer123> lol, i already annoyed thme my first yer here...
<signifer123> year*
<signifer123> them*
<signifer123> think they forgot about it by now
<bluefrog-10> not the good thing to do if you want to convince them
<signifer123> well you see i know a few others who want ot get linux on machines
<signifer123> so i can have them propose it
<signifer123> EdubuntuLite on this cd too?
<bluefrog-10> so make a demo with your guys in a club thing or whatever and incidentally invite the IT guys to come and give advice
<bluefrog-10> even if they don't anything about linux
<signifer123> lol
<bluefrog-10> don't ask them for advice they can't give of course
<signifer123> crap
<signifer123> theres alot of them
<signifer123> http://carrollk12.org/admin/techservices/staffext.htm
<signifer123> snap
<signifer123> Insure that appropriate steps are taken to comply with the Federal No Child Left Behind Act.
<signifer123> that might slow down the use of linux
<bluefrog-10> how come?
<signifer123> well fi they have no clue on how ot use it its a bit hard to keep up
<signifer123> if
<signifer123> it have rc client?
<bluefrog-10> well if they manage servers they are capable to mange linux, u should stop take them for absolute idiots..
<signifer123> i mean the teachers
<bluefrog-10> time for bed bye
<signifer123> well off ot soccer
<signifer123> cya guyz
<signifer123> hey
<arkan0x> mh
<dabaR> hi.
<dabaR> The link on the www.ubuntu.com page for the wiki(on the top) points to a dead URL.
<dabaR> namely, www.ubuntu.com/wiki, instead of wiki.ubuntu.com
<signifer123> you guys know it still says ubuntu config?
<pips1> highvoltage, ping
<highvoltage> pips1: pong
<pips1> hi
<highvoltage> hi there.
<pips1> are we having a meeting now?
<mhz> morning you all
<highvoltage> pips1: i'm not sure. we're supposed to
<highvoltage> hi mhz 
<mhz> hi, Mr. Voltage
<highvoltage> pips1: but i think it might have been postponed due to UBZ
<highvoltage> JaneW isn't connected it seems
<pips1> well, on http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event it says the next edubuntu meeting is only nov 16th
<pips1> hi mhz
<mhz> highvoltage: pips1 
<pips1> highvoltage, should we discuss things without JaneW or do you want to wait?
<pips1> do you expect anyone else?
<mhz> pips1: sorry, what is the discuss. about?
<pips1> mhz: edubuntu website
<highvoltage> sorry, lost my signal a bit there.
<highvoltage> pips1: still here?
<pips1> yep
<mhz> pips1: what about it?
<mhz> pips1: BTW, you've been testing edubuntu? if so, any place I could read about the machines, net, etc you've used?
<pips1> mhz, highvoltage wants to get the web team going, I think... ask him! :-)
<mhz> highvoltage: count on me? is it moin we're talking? (I love moin, i think we're not fully using its potential)
<highvoltage> ok, seems like my connection is fine again.
<highvoltage> let's move this discussion to #ubuntu-meeting, that way it gets logged in the right place
<highvoltage> edoo: announce meeting in #ubuntu-devel, now!
<pips1> ubuntu-devel or ubuntu-meeting ?
<highvoltage> sorry, i'm being silly. ubuntu-meeting
<pips1> ok, i'm there :-)
<highvoltage> mhz: can you also join #ubuntu-meeting?
<highvoltage> cool, let's start
<pips1> jsgotangco, will you join us at #ubuntu-meeting ?
<pips1> hello
<mhz> back
<mhz> hno73: sorry, what do you need?
<pips1> mhz, i think everyone is now at #ubuntu-doc but not sure
<mhz> oh...
<pips1> hi ogra
<ogra> moin
<pips1> exactly :-)
<pips1> are you aware of the ubuntu website troubles?
<pips1> apparently the plone site "imploded"
<pips1> exploded, whatever
<jsgotangco> chaos! true and pure!
<pips1> jsgotangco, oh yeah!
<pips1> jsgotangco, it's a bit over my head, to be honest!!
<jsgotangco> pips1: its ok we're just moving from A to B really
<pips1> the server is so painfully slow, though
<pips1> :-/
<ogra> didnt hear anything
<jsgotangco> ogra: sure
<jsgotangco> enjoy the blizzard of montreal
<jsgotangco> hno73: do you use an eye tracker?
<hno73> jsgotangco: no, a stck :)
<hno73> stick
<jsgotangco> with an on screen keyboard?
<hno73> possibly the best mouthstick in the world :)
<hno73> on a keyboard
<jsgotangco> i can't visualize it
<jsgotangco> im trying dasher and other apps
<mhz_gettin_ready> hno73: did you see my corections at -doc?
<mhz_gettin_ready> hi JaneW 
<mhz_gettin_ready> JaneW: did you solve your 'inbox' issue?
* mhz_gettin_ready leaving
<pips1_food> highvoltage, http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuSiteOfficialContent
<highvoltage> pips1: very, very nice!
<symbulos> is juliux aroun?
<juliux> yes
<juliux> how can i help you?
<symbulos> hi, do you remember our discussion about edubuntu?
<juliux> yes a little bit
<symbulos> I would be really grateful if you coud burn the DVD and send it. I pay for everyting. I go a look around but withut good results.
<juliux> symbulos, ok i can do that
<juliux> symbulos, how much dvds you need?
<juliux> symbulos, can you send me a mail at juliux@ubuntu-de.org 
<symbulos> just one, then I can duplicate easily
<symbulos> yes of course
<symbulos> wait
<juliux> ok
<symbulos> just sent, let me know if you receive it. We should be soon able to have an office not far with broadband and everything, but we have a demo on the 18, we would like to have a copy and test before then.
<juliux> ok i will brun the cd today and i can bring it tommor to the post office
<juliux> s/cd/dvd
<symbulos> s/cd/dvd:-)
<symbulos> thanks, let me know how much do I have to send you, can do transfer from Deutsche Bank through friend
<symbulos> have you had a go with it on laptops?
<symbulos> we were thinking of using trying it on FS Amilo D.
<pips1> highvoltage, ah you are still around!
<pips1> highvoltage, I just sent you an email...
<pips1> highvoltage, anyway I need to go now... talk to you later! bye!
<symbulos> juliux: i have to go. Thank you for DVD!
<symbulos> bye
<juliux> are the edubuntu and the breezy dvd the some?
<signifer123> hello
<juliux> hi signifer123 
<juliux> ogra, are the edubuntu and the breezy dvds the same?
<smykes> guys I cant connect to a SMB share on a 2000 machine :/
<bluefrog-10> yes
<bluefrog-10> try places > network servers
<bluefrog-10> oh sry i read can i
<smykes> im trying to log in but its attaching @ubuntu to any user name
<bluefrog-10> no way to erase it after it's attached?
<smykes> no it just tells me You must log in to access student@UBUNTU domain BLAH
<smykes> I just need it to be student
<smykes> im changing the host name
<smykes> maybe that will work
<smykes> brb
<bluefrog-10> from linux into windows or reverse?
<smykes> linux to windows
<smykes> waiting for it to shut down
<smykes> everything seems fucked up
<smykes> hard reboot :(
<ogra> juliux, indeed they are not :0
<ogra> juliux, the edubuntu DVD contains the edubuntu CD plus all of main
<juliux> ogra, i see, but the name of the iso is also breey
<ogra> the ubuntu DVD contains the ubuntu CD plus all of main
<ogra> sure, they are the breezy release
<juliux> ogra, but the filenames are the same
<ogra> kubuntu is called breezy too
<juliux> oh not good
<juliux> ogra, and do you have a short german text about edubuntu ?
<ogra> not yet... i have an english presentation... i'll put it online somewhere...
<ogra> sorry, in a meeting currently, cant talk...
<juliux> ok
<juliux> ogra, link?
<ogra> i'll give it to you if its up
<juliux> ogra, i have somebody who will translate it into german
<signifer123> got it working yet?
#edubuntu 2005-11-08
<mhz> moin there
<mhz> ogra: r u available?
<mhz> JaneW: r u available?
<signifer123> wow people talk so much in here...
<mhz_BBS> pitux: ping
<pitux> hello
<mhz_BBS> pitux: tienes los datos de luis?
<pitux> que datos
<mhz_BBS> mail y telefonos?
<pitux> quieres saber su estado civil?
<mhz_BBS> heheh
<pitux> te los envie en un privado
<pitux> ping: mhz_BBS
<mhz> ya
<Pygi> Hello :)
<juliux> hi
<Pygi> I was interested if someone may point me to a person I should report to, if I want to help develop Edubuntu
<juliux> Pygi, than you should wait until ogra is here
<Pygi> oh, main developer or?
<juliux> yes
<Pygi> ok
<Pygi> I'll wait
<Pygi> thanks for your help
<juliux> np
<DarthTode> hi there
<Pygi> Hi
<DarthTode> anyone knows where to find information regarding Linux in Education (for example xx% of schools in x country use Linux, etc) ?
<Pygi> It seems only me talks, and I know how much schools uses Linux in my country because I implemented it :P
<Pygi> I don't know any stats where you might find :/
<jsgotangco> its pretty hard to actually get one unless a local government releases data
<DarthTode> damn...
<Pygi> yup
<jsgotangco> unless you're in spain, you'll probably be hard pressed to get actualy usage data
<DarthTode> actually I need exact data to convince my company to release a driver for Linux
<Pygi> driver for what?
<DarthTode> interactive whiteboard
<jsgotangco> wow
<DarthTode> very fashion in schools
<jsgotangco> that would be awesome
<DarthTode> yeah !!
<Pygi> will do a marketing campaign :)
<DarthTode> i'm the product manager for France
<DarthTode> in France we use a lot Linux in schools
<DarthTode> but impossible to get those bloody exact data
<DarthTode> Pygi --> where are you from?
<DarthTode> Pygi --> oh, Croatia ;-)
<DarthTode> I remembered a match between France and Croatia, few years ago, in the World Cup... anyway ;-)
* jsgotangco would like to go to france sometime
<Pygi> I remember the match too :)
<Pygi> In Croatia there are like 10 computers in entire school system, and it's some extra group in a gymnasium in Osijek I think...
<Pygi> In here goverment is not very friendly toward Linux :P
<jsgotangco> 10 computers?
<Pygi> yup :/
<DarthTode> Pygi --> what a match... ;-)
<Pygi> I meant computers with Linux :P
<DarthTode> Pygi --> wow... only 10... what a pity...
<Pygi> Only Linux :P
<Pygi> Well, I know...
<Pygi> We are now working on trying to improve it...
<DarthTode> jsgotangco --> come and see what beautiful country it is :-)
<jsgotangco> DarthTode, yeah hopefully
* jsgotangco lives in sunny manila (philippines)
<Pygi> I am co-founder of ubuntu-hr team, and coordinator of local Linux community (a little while ago I became one)...
<jsgotangco> i have a friend in paris though...
<Pygi> so now things are going good for us :)
<Pygi> that's one of the reasons why I wanna help develop Edubuntu 
<jsgotangco> Pygi, sure we'll need all the help we can get
* jsgotangco is looking for help in documentation
* Pygi is offering help in coding / developing :)
<jsgotangco> Pygi, what exactly? packages?
<jsgotangco> Pygi, remember Edubuntu is bsaed on ubuntu
<Pygi> whatever it needs :P Yes, I know that it's based on Ubuntu
<DarthTode> Ubuntu and of course Edubuntu are really awesome
<jsgotangco> Pygi, i said that because your coding/packaging skills can benefit the 3 projects instead of focusing on 1
<DarthTode> I love that distribution
* Pygi offers help in installer :) www.sourceforge.net/projects/crowly :)
<DarthTode> Pygi --> it's really cool to be a co-funder !!
<Pygi> Yup, but I don't know who to talk to to become Ubuntu developer :P
<jsgotangco> Pygi, go to #ubuntu-motu
<DarthTode> jsgotangco --> a friend of mine is from Philippines, he was always the best in english lesson at school... ;-)
<jsgotangco> you can start by contributing to Universe
<jsgotangco> DarthTode, we're pretty good in english
<Pygi> kk, will do for now :)
* Pygi is afk...will be back in like half of hour...
<DarthTode> jsgotangco --> I know !!! ;-)
<jsgotangco> DarthTode, where are you located?
<jsgotangco> DarthTode, there was a query before in the list early in the Edubuntu development cycle about support for electronic white boards...
<jsgotangco> unfortunately, we don't have open source drivers for those...
<DarthTode> yeah
<DarthTode> actually I'd like to get info as I told you, to be able to develop an opensource driver for our boards
<DarthTode> I'm from Paris, France :-)
<jsgotangco> oh are the teen riots ended?
<DarthTode> oh my... not really
<DarthTode> last night, cars were burning, and it seems young people shoot with real bullets on the police... amazing...
<DarthTode> :-(
<jsgotangco> wow
<jsgotangco> i saw it on the news last night...
<jsgotangco> things like that don't happen over here, so it can be scary for me
<DarthTode> actually it's because of two young who died because they were chased by the police
<DarthTode> two from "da hood"
<jsgotangco> gang wars
<DarthTode> so the others went crazy...
<jsgotangco> we don't get riots like that over here
<jsgotangco> we do have loose firearms in the city, but people aren't stupid to fight the cops because most of them are armed with automatic rifles
<jsgotangco> even if i have a gun, i don't stand a chance with an M16
<DarthTode> yeah, u right
<jsgotangco> well i gotta go
<jsgotangco> i'm gonna pick up my wife
<jsgotangco> see you later
<DarthTode> but cops can't just shoot people like that in France, we're not american...
<jsgotangco> (nice talking to you too)
<DarthTode> see ya mate
<DarthTode> yeah, nice :-)
<weasl77> ntu
<Pygi> back :)
<Pygi> back :)
<Pygi> back :)
<mhz> morning
<Pygi> Welcome :)
<juliux> re
<zakame> hi all
<juliux> hi ogra 
<ogra> juliux, http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/edubuntu/edubuntu_talk.pdf
<ogra> morning
<juliux> ogra, nice
<juliux> ogra, http://www.juliux.de/linux/edubuntuwork1.odt
<lemoncake> hi
<lemoncake> i need help
<lemoncake> whit the installation of edubuntu
<lemoncake> who can help me?
<juliux> lemoncake, ask and wait
<lemoncake> ok
<lemoncake> when i install edubuntu on my pc...in installation it doesn't ask me for the root password
<lemoncake> now
<lemoncake> i need to install a package
<juliux> there is no root account
<lemoncake> with dpgk
<juliux> ubuntu and edubuntu use sudo
<lemoncake> ok
<juliux> the user you have creat by the installation can make everything via sudo
<lemoncake> usage: sudo -K | -L | -V | -h | -k | -l | -v
<lemoncake> usage: sudo [-HPSb]  [-p prompt]  [-u username|#uid] 
<lemoncake>             { -e file [...]  | -i | -s | <command> }
<lemoncake> mm
<lemoncake> when i write "sudo" in terminal
<lemoncake> in terminal appear this
<lemoncake> if i want to install a package with dpkg 
<lemoncake> how can i do this?
<juliux> sudo <the programm you want to use with root rights
<lemoncake> so
<lemoncake> sudo dpkg?
<juliux> f.e. sudo dpkg -i ltsp.deb
<lemoncake> when i write in the terminal example: sudo dpkg -i NeroLinux.deb it ask to me the password...i write it..then i say that other process have the lock of the database
<lemoncake> :??
<lemoncake> ehm the it
<lemoncake> excuse me
<lemoncake> then it say that other process have the lock of the database
<smi|e> can i install edubuntu-desktop?
<smi|e> on ubuntu
<lemoncake> juliux are you online??
<lemoncake> it's an emergency because i need to install some packages
<smi|e> lemoncake: whats the matter?
<lemoncake> mmm read up
<highvoltage> smi|e: yes, you can
<smi|e> lemoncake: you want too install a package right?
<smi|e> lemoncake: whats the package called
<highvoltage> lemoncake: if it says other processes have locked the database, you probably have synaptic or aptitude open somewhere
<highvoltage> you need to close them first before you can use dpkg or apt
<smi|e> highvoltage: know any wicked programs i should install on ubuntu
<highvoltage> smi|e: many :)
<smi|e> highvoltage: give me a list ;)
<highvoltage> amarok is a nice mp3 / ogg player
<highvoltage> mplayer-686 is my favourite video player
<smi|e> got them ;)
<highvoltage> quanta is my favoutire html editor
<highvoltage> kuickshow is my favourite image viewer
<highvoltage> liferea is a very nice RSS feed reader
<smi|e> k
<smi|e> whats a rss feed reader for?
<highvoltage> it's like an email reader, it "finds" changes in blogs and on news sites such as slashdot,
<smi|e> k
<highvoltage> then it compiles it for you. you can stay up to date very easily.
<highvoltage> you want games too?
<highvoltage> supertux is like mario bros. very nice.
<highvoltage> armagetron is a nice 3d game. so is tuxracer.
<highvoltage> i should compile a list from my big pc. lots of nice stuff installed there. i'm now on laptop, mostly work stuff here.
<lemoncake> excuse me 
<lemoncake> i have a lan
<lemoncake> with  a computer that have windows xp
<lemoncake> and this computer that have edubuntu 5.10
<lemoncake> i want to have access to shared folder by windows xp from this computer
<lemoncake> how can i do this??
<highvoltage> how do you want to share it, do you need to protect it?
<highvoltage> you have several options.
<lemoncake> no
<lemoncake> i have shared some folders in windows xp
<highvoltage> edubuntu is running a web server, so you could share it through that. 
<lemoncake> no
<highvoltage> oh, if you want to share both ways, samba is your best bet.
<lemoncake> ok
<highvoltage> apt-get install samba
<lemoncake> ok 
<lemoncake> i have installed samba yet
<highvoltage> i think you can do it in gui, but i only know text mode
<lemoncake> mm
<lemoncake> ok
<highvoltage> once samba is installed, you edit /etc/smb/samba.conf
<highvoltage> then you change security = user to security = share
<highvoltage> then you add (to the end of the config)
<highvoltage> [sharename] 
<highvoltage>   path = /path/to/stuff/you/want/to/share
<highvoltage>   public = yes
<highvoltage>   writable = no
<highvoltage>   browsable = yes
<highvoltage> this will create a share that you can access from windows called "sharename"
<highvoltage> windows users will be able to access this, but not write it. change writable to yes to change this.
<highvoltage> brb
<lemoncake> i can't modify it 
<lemoncake> with gedit
<lemoncake> when i push backspace it does do nothing
<lemoncake> *doesn't
<highvoltage> probably because you don't currently have permissions
<highvoltage> hold on...
<highvoltage> press alt+f2, then type gksudo gedit
<highvoltage> enter your password and press enter
<highvoltage> you will then be able to open smb.conf and edit away
<lemoncake> ok
<highvoltage> edoo: ping
<edoo> highvoltage: what?
<highvoltage> edoo: ping is <reply> pong
<edoo> highvoltage: 
<highvoltage> edoo: ping
<edoo> highvoltage: sorry...
<highvoltage> hmmm..
<enyc> high: ping
<enyc> high: ping  seq 1
<enyc> high: ping  seq 2
<enyc> high: ping  seq 3
<enyc> hmm 100% packet loss ;-(
<highvoltage> edoo: ping
<edoo> pong
<highvoltage> enyc: :)
<signifer123> hey ya'll
<juliux> hi signifer123 
<highvoltage> hi signifer123 
<signifer123> anyone here successfully covnerted a windows school to linux?
<highvoltage> i've converted many :)
<signifer123> complete ms?
<signifer123> did you find a useful repalce ment ofr integrade or novell
<signifer123> netware*
<signifer123> or wouldi have to write a integrade replacement
<enyc> where is high ?
* enyc in 3vil UK ;-)
<signifer123> huh?
<signifer123> USA?
<highvoltage> sorry, friend just came to visit.
<highvoltage> this is in RSA
<highvoltage> (south africa)
<highvoltage> the labs here didn't have netware.
<signifer123> :-P
<highvoltage> which made it easy.
<signifer123> figures
<highvoltage> most of the windows labs were unmaintained, and falling apart.
<signifer123> any advice anywho?
<highvoltage> these schools embraced linux because with it they got a community, something they never had with their windows labs.
<signifer123> dang it....
<highvoltage> signifer123: what are you thinking of doing?
<signifer123> jsut tryingot get school system to move ot linux
<signifer123> edubuntu :-P
<highvoltage> which school system? are you an educator?
<signifer123> CCPS http://www.carrollk12.org
<signifer123> not an educator
<signifer123> student :-p
<signifer123> the onyl main reason i could show them for switching really is security
<highvoltage> :)
<signifer123> what?
<highvoltage> hi thomas
<highvoltage> i think it's excellent that a student is lobbying for linux at school.
<signifer123> lol, you an educator?
<signifer123> or admin?
<signifer123> ohh well i'll need help so i'll pop on..and ask alot of Q's
<highvoltage> pop in any time.
<highvoltage> also feel free to join the edubuntu-devel mailing list on http://lists.ubuntu.com
<highvoltage> i'm the technical co-ordinator at tsf.org.za
<signifer123> well that makes it alot easier for you
<highvoltage> makes what easier?
<signifer123> convincing the switch :-p
<signifer123> tech leader :-p
<signifer123> so you know of any linux netwares?
<highvoltage> i think there's a client in universe, but i haven't used it yet.
<signifer123> well i'll jsut see if wine cna run it...
<signifer123> brb jumping into edubuntu
<Signifer123> back
<Signifer123> do you gyus plan on making themes for gnome and firefox etc...
<highvoltage> what kind of themes?
<Signifer123> like i guess something laong the lines of what happened to the icons
<highvoltage> yes. it's likely that future versions of edubuntu will have different themes.
<highvoltage> some which are more appropriate for university, etc.
<Signifer123> k cool
<Signifer123> fun...
<Signifer123> to edit icons owuldi ahve to compile it again?
<Signifer123> nautilus
<highvoltage> nope.
<highvoltage> most icons are stored in /usr/share/icons
<highvoltage> you can simply replace the icons with other .png files if you want to change it for yourself.
<highvoltage> if you want to submit it to edubuntu, there might be a bit more work envolved, but we could find someone else to do it too.
<Signifer123> k
<Signifer123> does that include all apps like firefox is in there?
<highvoltage> in the gartoon theme, yes.
<highvoltage> some themes does not have all the icons, so it will fall back to a default.
<Signifer123> ok will other apps put thier icon in there too?
<Signifer123> like if i install glade
<highvoltage> glade seems to get it's icon there too.
<Signifer123> k
<highvoltage> are you on an ubuntu / edubuntu box right now?
<Signifer123> i'm on ubuntu with a vmwared edubuntu
<highvoltage> ok. check the /usr/share/icons/gartoon
<highvoltage> directory
<highvoltage> you'll see how it works there
<Signifer123> yeah i see
<Signifer123> can gimp edit svg?
<Signifer123> apperntly not nvm
<highvoltage> nope
<highvoltage> use inkscape for .svg
<Signifer123> it synaptic won't isntall it :-p
<Signifer123> dependency errors
<highvoltage> strange
<bluefrog-10> hi highvoltage, by chance do you know how to find by command line in terminal if a ther's a lock on a file pls?
<highvoltage> what kind of lock?
<highvoltage> linux doesn't have locks on files like windows does.
<highvoltage> if you want to know which processes is using a file, you can use lsof
<highvoltage> ex: lsof /dev/cdrom
<bluefrog-10> sry it's the other way i want.. i explain
<highvoltage> if it's firefox which has a lock file, it will be in the ~/.mozilla-firefox/profile/xxxxxx dir
<highvoltage> openoffice in ~/.openoffice/lock (iirc)
<highvoltage> some of the daemons store lock files in /var/run
<highvoltage> but file locking per se does not exist in linux, linux is over that.
<bluefrog-10> while doing apt-get update it's trying to lock /var/lib/dpkg/,
<highvoltage> bluefrog-10: do you have synaptic or aptidute open?
<bluefrog-10> and if synaptic is open it's stating that it can't do it
<bluefrog-10> am wrting a script to automate the install of samba-ldap
<highvoltage> yes, synaptic puts a lock file in /var/cache/apt/packages
<highvoltage> and if dpkg sees it there, it refuses to do anything
<highvoltage> exiting synaptic is the correct thing to do before running dpkg
<enyc> moo de beep
<bluefrog-10> and i'd like to have a function which looks if apt-get will be able to lock the dir
<enyc> err i dont have the edubuntu box atm...
<enyc> erm
<bluefrog-10> so in my function I was wondering if there is a way to check by command line if a lock can be put on the dir
<enyc> sombody woth an onstalled edubuntu....  please run 'tuxpaint'  ** using the menu entry ** -- applications >  etc...
<highvoltage> enyc: moo to you too
<enyc> does the sound work [you should hear a sound when tuxpaint finishes loading icons etc.] 
<highvoltage> bluefrog-10: a lock can't be put on a dir
<bluefrog-10> k ty
<enyc> ?
<highvoltage> apt-get moo
* enyc waits ;-)
<enyc> '''...."Have you mooed today?"...''
<enyc> indeed
* enyc wonders if somebody here going to try what i suggested ;-)
<highvoltage> enyc: sorry, what did you suggest?
<bluefrog-10> highvoltage, i found out what i had difficulty to express... I nedd to check if there is a lock file in the dir...
<highvoltage> ah
<bluefrog-10> i solved my problem
<highvoltage> ok
<bluefrog-10> i tink
<bluefrog-10> no wrong, oh well, i'll find out..
<enyc> sombody woth an onstalled edubuntu....  please run 'tuxpaint'  **using the menu entry ** -- applications >  etc... does the sound work [you should hear a sound when tuxpaint finishes loading icons etc.]   ??
<highvoltage> enyc: yes, mine works, although i don't have a standard edubuntu installation
<enyc> hmmm
<enyc> kk
<highvoltage> enyc: is this on thin client or full machine?
<enyc> ''workstation' install ;-)
<Signifer123> mine runs fine
<enyc> though i origonally saw the problem on a ubunut breezy box changed to edubuntu
<enyc> seemed that starting tuxpaint FROM the menu seemed to result in it not-working....
<enyc> [no sound] 
<enyc> under the usual  esd etc.
<Signifer123> you mean jsut going App>Graphics>Tux Paint
<Signifer123> works great for me...
<Signifer123> or terminal
<enyc> hmm ok
<enyc> odd
<Signifer123> you use dvd?
<Signifer123> i used the cd to install
<enyc> i had/have a situation where sound not work when startet from menu
<enyc> but thats on a ubuntu >> edubuntu   migrated...
<enyc> i.e. 'apt-get isntall edubuntu-base'
<enyc> how_confusing
<Signifer123> :-p
<enyc> i dont have the udubuntu-box about
<Signifer123> lol
<enyc> its out in a nursery place ;p
<enyc> err edubuntu-box even
* enyc still getting used to dvorak
<bluefrog-10> highvoltage, ty for the lsof, had to read again what u wrote me eralier to see that i missed this crucial information for me... :)
<DaSkreech> Hello
<DaSkreech> Can I install edubuntu on top of ubuntu base?
<DaSkreech> Or rather if I installed ubuntu-minimal could I install edubuntu-desktop and get the same as a default install of Edubuntu?
<bluefrog-10> I believe that if you apt-get install edubuntu-desktop edubuntu-server, you will obtain what you want, but am not 100% sure
<DaSkreech> Right
<DaSkreech> But this is a school so I'd rather not have anything I don't need to have
<DaSkreech> Also it seems that edubuntu does a LTSP install on install would edubuntu-desktop or server take care of that from apt-get?
<bluefrog-10> edubuntu-server will tell you about depencies
<bluefrog-10> dependencies
<DaSkreech> Ok So the method is to install ubuntu breezy minimal or base and then apt-get edubuntu-desktop and server
<bluefrog-10> the best thing is to install from edubuntu install cd
<DaSkreech> The compuetr won't allow it
<DaSkreech> computer
<bluefrog-10> explain
<DaSkreech> I can't
<DaSkreech> It reaches a section of install where it stops and says the computer ran out of space installing to /var
<DaSkreech> the computer has 30 Gb free
<DaSkreech> If I go to terminal 2 a df shows that everything except the CDrom has at most 33% used
<bluefrog-10> have u checked the md5sum of the iso?, verify the cd in itself, to do that i think you can type expert at boot and then there should be a "verify cd" option
<signifer123> that is werid...i installed it on a 4 gig hd
<DaSkreech> I used the same CD to install to 3 other machines
<DaSkreech> and I've used multiple CDs they all throw an error at teh same palce
<DaSkreech> I would suspect the Cdrom drive but Xandros is installed and the same thing happens
<DaSkreech> it boots up till a certain section then freezes
<DaSkreech> So i installed Ubuntu and it works fine
<DaSkreech> So I'm going to install ubuntu-base or minimal and apt-get edubuntu
<bluefrog-10> ok
<signifer123> do you guys have other themes for icons and such other than elementary school style?
<signifer123> guess..not?
#edubuntu 2005-11-09
<cata_lemc> hello, zorry for my english, but i am chilena
<pitux> hello cata welcome to the channel
<pitux> also can your visit the channell ubuntu-es
<cata_lemc> thanks
<pitux> soy el jose
<pitux> si esta es tu primera visita por el irc
<pitux> te puedo ayudar, no hay problema
<cata_lemc> sadly not a community exists even in Spanish
<cata_lemc> a hola pepe la cata de lemc
<cata_lemc> entre como le dije al profesor
<pitux> no exist the oficial community in spansih
<pitux> pero te invito a visitar ubuntu-es
<cata_lemc> como no lo encontre
<pitux> esa es la comunidad de ubuntu en espaol
<cata_lemc> ayer llegue a la casa y me puse a buscar informacion y no encontre na
<pitux> a el mauricio talvez se conecte mas tarde
<cata_lemc> y que canal es esa comunidad
<cata_lemc> por que el profe me dio esta no ma
<pitux> esa es la comunidad de edubuntu
<cata_lemc> ya pero que dire pa cvachar
<pitux> osea nos juntamos todos los usuarios de ubuntu que hablamos espaol
<pitux> y damos soporte a los osuarios que recien empiezan
<pitux> hablamos de cualquier cosa
<pitux> participamos en proyectos etc
<pitux> y esta es la comunidad de edubuntu
<pitux> para usuarios de edubuntu
<pitux> que es una ubuntu pere con mas software educativo
<cata_lemc> ya pero esa comunidad ene spaol
<cata_lemc> tiene alguna pagina u otro canal donde se reunan
<pitux> si ps todos hablan en espaol
<pitux> ahi puedes decir por ejemplo "hola quiero instalar linux alguien me puede ayudar"
<pitux> y la gente que esta te va dando consejos etc
<pitux> el canal es #ubuntu-es
<cata_lemc> en este mismo server
<pitux> si freenode es el server 
<pitux> donde hay mas comunidades de software libre a nivel amundial
<cata_lemc> pka
<cata_lemc> oye tu estas en esa sala tambien o no?
<pitux> sip
<pitux> yo me conecto como cinco canles siempre
<cata_lemc> oye me meti y no existe
<cata_lemc> pedi un listado y tampoco aparece
<pitux> yo estoy adentro se llama #ubuntu-es
<pitux> en freenode
<pitux> por dionde chateas pone "/join #ubuntu-es"
<cata_lemc> ya po si es este mismo server o no?
<pitux> sin las comillas dobles
<pitux> te va a mandar directamente al canal
<pitux> el slash lo debes respetar
<cata_lemc> si ya gracias
<mhz> hi
<pitux> mhz
<mhz> holas
<mhz> recibi la encuesta
<mhz> thx
<pitux> una comapera entro a freenode
<mhz> heeeeeee
<mhz> y como se sintio?
<pitux> nadie respondio
<pitux> solo yo
<mhz> hehehe
<mhz> que canal?
<pitux> esta chateando ahora en ubuntu-es
<mhz> como se llama?
<pitux> cata_lemc
* mhz leaving to yet another install
<arkan0x> http://dotgnu.org/   !!!----> look!
<pitux> hello arakan0x
<arkan0x> hi pitux , se ownearon dotgnu
<pitux> pa lla voy
<pitux> arakan0x, que es Digital mind?
<arkan0x> un grupo de hackers 
<pitux> me meti a la pagina peo hay una foto que no logro ve
<arkan0x> sipos , se la ownearon
<arkan0x> fijate en lo que dice abajito
<pitux> ahhhh si cacje
<DaSkreech> hi bluefrog-10
<mhz> hip
<DaSkreech> hello
<mhz> hi
* arkan0x is away: (- -) .. xD!
<juliux> morning
<mhz> hi there
<mhz> Anyone from UK here?
<apokryphos> mhz: I am 8)
<mhz> hey
<zakame> hi all
<mhz> hi zakame 
<apokryphos> hi
<zakame> what's up?
<mhz> apokryphos: yesterday I was on a 1-day-seminar and had the chance to talk to one UK guy from Becta.org.uk
<mhz> he said he'd be very interested in seeing how edubuntu works
<mhz> and maybe have some contact with the UK community
<apokryphos> wow, nice
<apokryphos> mhz: there's a few more of us in #ubuntu-uk. sabdfl himself is located in London, IIRC.
<zakame> cool! :D
<mhz> now, if he lives in Chile (don't know but he spoke good spanish) I can demo it to him. If not, maybe you could get him there
<apokryphos> mhz: whereabouts in the UK is he?
<zakame> hihi
<mhz> yeah. I know there's a -uk channel, however, IMHO, there's quite a diff between Linux topics (ie #ubuntu) and ICT issues regarding education
<apokryphos> certainly
<apokryphos> I'm pretty familiar with the edu components of ubuntu; perhaps moreso the KDE ones (I've written quite some documentation for them)
<mhz> Edubuntu people (me, ie) are fans of Linux (not mandatory) but we are mainly interested on how we apply ICT foe better processes
<mhz> and so, my idea of edubuntu gang getting in touch with people working on education 
<mhz> I use edubuntu with Wmaker, Kde, Gnome, Fluxbox and XFCE4
<apokryphos> I installed Linux on a couple of school computers; convinced the technicians after some time 8)
<mhz> just depending on the server + network layout and the clients
<apokryphos> right
<mhz> cool
<mhz> Next wed. I'll install on 16 lab computers, at Universidad de Santiago, for 'about-to-become-Math teachers'
<mhz> sorry... lab with 16 pcs
<apokryphos> nice; it's good to see Linux comps being used more. Been tutoring a few computer science friends on a lot of basics, too
<mhz> indeed
<mhz> so, shall I get in touch with this guy and see if someone from edubuntu can contact him?
<apokryphos> I'm not on any Edubuntu team
<mhz> ohh
<mhz> currently, there are no teams, AFAIK
<mhz> we are THE team
<mhz> 8)
<apokryphos> there's an Edubuntu team listed on Launchpad isn't there?
<mhz> ohh, well, yes
<zakame> yep
* zakame reminds himself to get a copy for upgrading from hoary
<mhz> are you familiar with it? can you talk about edubuntu?
<apokryphos> sure; perhaps not as well as Kubuntu, but I'd think so
<apokryphos> the result of being a terrible addict to IRC and *buntu =)
<mhz> ehehhee
<mhz> see? then u're ready
<mhz> I can't find his biz card yet but I will
<apokryphos> Ok, let me know where he's located. If it's nearby, I wouldn't mind making a visit
<mhz> educool
<mhz> now i gotta get cooking
<zakame> hihi
<mhz> heheh
<apokryphos> enjoy
<mhz> thx
<mhz_cooking> JaneW: hi
<JaneW> mhz_cooking: hello, how's the cooking?
<mhz_cooking> hehehe
<mhz_cooking> about to start
<JaneW> mhz_cooking: I see you have been trying to get hold of me... Mark is about to start the program for the day...
<mhz_cooking> JaneW: as I mentioned before, we're planning and actually doing a lot of stuff here in Santiago, Chile regarding Edubuntu
<JaneW> the schedule has been pretty full, I have been allocated from 9am to 8pm each day
<mhz_cooking> okidoki
<mhz_cooking> np
<JaneW> mhz_cooking: I have told MArk that we have an interested and active Chile community
<mhz_cooking> as long as you still love me
<JaneW> yes we love you a lot
<mhz_cooking> community? so far we're no more than 4 active people
<mhz_cooking> :(
<JaneW> we are just trying to do as much as we can while we are here...
<JaneW> 4 can be a community ;)
<JaneW> it;s a start
<mhz_cooking> but next wed i have a huge "let's see what edubuntu is like" and I could use some officiality :D
<JaneW> in what way?
<mhz_cooking> 16 Math teachers will be trained on edubuntu
<mhz_cooking> these 16 techers are in their final term of studyng at university
<mhz_cooking> and we are convincing them (motivating them) to start 'crossing' the math curriculmm with ICT tools (edubuntu)
<mhz_cooking> yesterday one of them joined IRC (here) for 1st time but no spanish speakers found
<mhz_cooking> so she called me :)
<mhz_cooking> next Thursday, I have to demo edubuntu to one of the largest Teachers/Schools oriented orgs, here (they reach 4000 schools!)
<mhz_cooking> JaneW: if i can convince this org to help us, then we can do huge stuff for Edubuntu Chilean Tour
<mhz_cooking> JaneW: IMHO, edubuntu 'fans' profile is bit diff from xUbuntu users
<jsgotangco> mmm???
<mhz_cooking> so 'officiality' could mean to have access to 'formal' docs (paper, cards, posters, etc) that help us show we're not talking only about a 'distro' but a serious company-like worl
<mhz_cooking> JaneW: yesterday I was on a semninar talking with Chilean Gov. people (education minester, ie) and Schools principals, etc.
<mhz_cooking> these people are SO USED to having M$ campaigns and M$-like biz images that everytime I mentioned what we are doing (esp. when mentioning the 'comunity') they couldn't quite get all ideas. They asked me for brouchers, studies or surveys regarding % of teachers willing to use Edubuntu in schools, how the tools in edubuntu would help on specific chilean educational curriculum , etc
<jsgotangco> mhz_cooking: are you requesting for support?
<mhz> re
<mhz> JaneW: sorry
<mhz> (i forgot I was on batteries)
<mhz> JaneW: basically, I guess that 'officiality' for these people would mean to have 'real official things', at least while I get time to produce all the data we'll need (surveys, studies, etc). Officiality could even be "official Edubuntu Cd's", broucheres, stand, etc
<jsgotangco> mhz: that's asking a lot in my opinion
<mhz> jsgotangco: yes, indeed
<mhz> jsgotangco: and I am not asking for ALL that, BTW
<jsgotangco> mhz: we're too small atm
<mhz> please, don't think I want that. I am just saying/discussing here that we could have a plan 
<mhz> we could even figure out what to say to many FAQ's or comparission these kind of peopl do
<mhz> jsgotangco: ie. i could afford to have some biz cards printed out. Can I print or even include edubuntu logo on biz cards? 
<jsgotangco> biz cards are easy
<jsgotangco> but edubuntu-marketing is another story
<mhz> jsgotangco: i guess, but my current biz cards say 'tecnocimiento' and they do not mention edubuntu anywhere. I dont' knw if i can just include it or I have to follow a certain procedure, ie.
<JaneW> I got disconnected so I'll resend my last msges in case they weren't received
<JaneW> mhz_cooking: we don't have much official stuff wrt edubuntu, but there are a few ubuntu resources available
<JaneW> mhz_cooking: I don't think we'll have any 'marketing' budget for edubuntu before dapper is releases
<JaneW> mhz_cooking: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuAtConferences for what is available and how to get it...
<mhz> JaneW: ok
<jsgotangco> mhz: you'll see a brochure or two that mentions edubuntu...
<jsgotangco> mhz: it was done with breezy in mind
<mhz> JaneW: what if i get some funds here in Chile, what can/can't I do with them using Edubuntu name/image?
<mhz> jsgotangco: ok
<jsgotangco> mhz: but feel free to make your own as well, who knows they might be used as well
<mhz> jsgotangco: so, you say that there's no 'procedure' i must follow before?
<JaneW> mhz: printing your own stuff is not an issue at all, jeff elkner and paul flint has done the same thing
<jsgotangco> mhz: logo usage for ubuntu applies for edubuntu as well i assume
<mhz> ohh
<jsgotangco> mhz: in fact you're empowered to make a business model behind it
<JaneW> mhz: it would be nice if we can see what you produce... but I don;t think even that is compulsary, but please do use your discretion
<JaneW> yes logos are trademarked to Canonical and must be stated as such
<mhz> JaneW: any news on CDs"
<mhz> ?
<JaneW> mhz: we are not getting CDs for breezy, but will get some for Dapper when it's more polished
* mhz snifs
<JaneW> again you are free to make your own, and we'll encourage ppl to use your packaging if they do so
<jsgotangco> JaneW: ahh that makes things clearer then :)
<jsgotangco> mhz: don't worry its called growing pains :)
<JaneW> we will also look at ogra's suggestion of using his contact to press and ship Cds for a small fee (to cover costs)
<JaneW> we are still seen as a community project
<ogra> JaneW, we'll need a text for the CD cover... "lorem ipsum" isnt really informative to the users ;)
<mhz> ogra: no problem, I can solve that 2day
<ogra> copy and pasting parts of the release notes and wrapping it in some text should be enough
<mhz> JaneW: I was talkign to apokryphos a bit before suggesting he gets in contact with a UK guy from becta.org.uk
<mhz> he was interested in seeing edubuntu an talk to an 'official edubuntu' memeber?
<mhz> when I told him we're a community... his faced changed a bit
<mhz> :)
<apokryphos> You have to be in Linux a lot of time to notice the community; never noticed it at all when I wasn't in it
<mhz> peple seem to be reticent to 'communities' when it comes to make biz decision based on 'community' tools
<mhz> JaneW: so that's one of the little stupid questions so far I have no proper answer for.
<jsgotangco> mhz: its a community project, business are empowered to make a business model behind it
<mhz> (maybe stupid is not the corrct word i meant)
<mhz> jsgotangco: yes, indeed. I 100% agree
<mhz> jsgotangco: I think I'll endup doing that
<jsgotangco> if business insists on having solid stuff we'll probably end up like red hat or suse
<jsgotangco> (which isn't really bad imo)
<mhz> not bad, but not the sense
<aeon17x> sir gotangco, good evening po! ^^
<jsgotangco> aeon17x: hi
<zakame> aeon17x: are you the one at LP? https://launchpad.net/people/snoocete
<aeon17x> Yup, that's me.
<mhz> jsgotangco: apokryphos mentioned he's not a memeber of edubuntu team. Does he need to be listed on launchpad to say he's memeber? :D
<aeon17x> I think.
<zakame> aeon17x: hihi :)
<apokryphos> mhz: I'm not really involved in edubuntu in a real way; I'd feel dirty being listed there 8)
<jsgotangco> mhz: well since the lp page is controlled by ogra and JaneW, they are empowered to approve people based on contributions to the project..
<aeon17x> Oh my, Launchpad is down. =/
<jsgotangco> its under maintenance
<mhz> okidoki
<jsgotangco> mhz: a lot of development stuff will revolve around lp in the near future, at the moment, most of malone stuff is benefitting the group structure of lp
<zakame> aeon17x: you're at UP too right?
<jsgotangco> mhz: now its being used heavily for specs in ubz
<aeon17x> zakame: yeah, UP Diliman.
<zakame> aeon17x: ooh :)  Why not come up at #ubuntu-ph? :)
<aeon17x> zakame: We have a local Ubuntu channel? Yay! *teleports*
<jsgotangco> mhz: we could get more solid ground on future stuff if we actually make at least a manual that integrates all the default components
<mhz> jsgotangco: so, from your perspective, what are the current benefits to be or not to be in LP
<JaneW> mhz: what do you mean about not listed? ppl can request to be included in the team... it is moderated so ogra and I would approve the memebership, but we encourage ppl to participate and join the team
<ogra> indeed you need a LP account to join
<JaneW> mhz: and wrt your request about starting a spanish language mailing list for edubuntu, I think go ahead! However obviously Oliver and I would not be able to contribute to it, and if you have anything of relevance to the rest of the group please pst it to the english list as well. ok?
<jsgotangco> mhz: lp is an infrastructure that is unique to ubuntu/canonical, anything ubuntu related will use it
<mhz> JaneW: heheh ok. it's just that I am so used to IRC and ML's that LauchPad is fairly new to me, so whan apokryphos mentioned he was not listed.. I then got questions in my head
<jsgotangco> mhz: including packaging
<JaneW> I am not sure what the protocal is for having it set up and whether you can use the ubuntu servers, ogra do you know?
<ogra> https://launchpad.net/people/edubuntu/+join ;)
<mhz> JaneW: perfect! Oliver asked me to go thruogh the validation key process and I am on it now
<JaneW> mhz: and I the ide aof the survey is great, good idea, thanks!
<ogra> JaneW, jdub is the guy to go to
<jsgotangco> JaneW: he'll have to ask jdub to set up a list
<JaneW> ok great
<jsgotangco> JaneW: but if i recall, our list can support multiple languages
<JaneW> mhz: sorry to have been ignoring you for days, it was a case of just being too busy to be here on IRC - sorry
<JaneW> as it is I have just missed the talks this morning so have no idea about BZR and HCT...
<mhz> JaneW: as I said, np as long as you still love me :D
<mhz> oops
<jsgotangco> JaneW: BZR is BAZ-NG
<JaneW> I love everyone who loves edubuntu and helps here :)))
<mhz> heheh
<mhz> educool then
<JaneW> esp ogra
<jsgotangco> JaneW: even slackers?
<JaneW> even slackers
<JaneW> jsgotangco: BUT YOU AREN;T A SLACKER :)
* ogra throws air kisses to JaneW 
<jsgotangco> i'm quite afraid at my future output for dapper...
<mhz> yes, I guess ogra is the one receiving love on daily basis
<mhz> jsgotangco: what you mean?
<ogra> hey flint 
<flint> ok then...
<JaneW> ogra: thanks for the kisses, workrave forced me to strech first before reposnding ;)
<ogra> lol
<JaneW> hey flintstone
<jsgotangco> mhz: my job is getting more and more complicated by the day
<JaneW> non-ubz ppl the BOFs are starting now..
<JaneW> jsgotangco: have you started your new job now?
<jsgotangco> JaneW: yes its terribly time-consuming at the moment
<jsgotangco> i only have time to idle around and chat
<mhz> jsgotangco: hehehe
<JaneW> jsgotangco: lol
<JaneW> jsgotangco: well I hope you are enjoying it
<jsgotangco> seriously, my first week is hell
<mhz> jsgotangco: i bet you knew all new processes are moe time consuming
<mhz> let's wait a couple weeks and you'll be able to have more idling time :)
<jsgotangco> i truly doubt it
<mhz> hehe
<mhz> what do you do there?
<jsgotangco> slave around on 10 RHEL servers locally and 10 more remotely
<mhz> ooooops
<mhz> how many users in total?
<jsgotangco> dunno probably millions its carrier grade linux
<mhz> oooohhhh
<mhz> then, u're right.
<mhz> you won't have more time 
<mhz> at least more than current
<mhz> at least no more than current
<jsgotangco> mhz: its a fun job and new for me (carrier grade), paycheck is good, pays the bills and enough to save more, but stress level is probably higher than usual because we're dealing of 24x7 systems on telco level
<mhz> jsgotangco: if iget the funds for edubuntu here in chile, I promise at least you'll receive a t-shirt or mug (don't know which is 1st)
<jsgotangco> i'd love that :)
<mhz> so you won't miss that much
<mhz> but keep in mind that there'll be a chilean flag somewhere :)
<jsgotangco> oh i'll surely be around...but on a different level..i've been testing stuff on other fields that will most likely help edubuntu
<mhz> and I DO NOT MEAN a $ tshirt -f chile :D
<mhz> jsgotangco: great
<mhz> now... i do gotta getr back to cooking
<mhz> THANK you all for saving me the time to write so many mails with my doubts on it
<aeon17x> Sir gotangco, I have a suggestion.
<jsgotangco> aeon17x: sure please don't call me sir
<jsgotangco> :)
<aeon17x> Hehe... anyway, I believe there should be a way for Edubuntu to be installed in an XFCE environment instead of GNOME straight from the installer.
<jsgotangco> aeon17x: the next version would most likely use XFCE for clients
<aeon17x> Hah, that's great.
<jsgotangco> xubuntu-desktop
<jsgotangco> aeon17x: it'll depend on the guys BOF'ing it at UBZ (ogra, jammcq, sbalneaves, etc.)
<ogra> jsgotangco, unlikely...
<ogra> but you can always install xfce
<JaneW> mhz_cooking: you are approved :)
<jsgotangco> ogra: eh?
<JaneW> mhz_cooking: sorry  I made you wait for 18 minutes ;)
<ogra> jsgotangco, xfce is not in main
<aeon17x> Dang.
<ogra> and i wont be able to take care of an additional DE
<jsgotangco> unless someone makes an inclusion report?
<ogra> additionally it wont fit on the CD
<jsgotangco> ogra: true
<jsgotangco> unless we seed something different entirely
<jsgotangco> (given 6 months of developmet that is asking too much already)
<ogra> launchpad will support making derivative distros very easy, you should be able to make a xfce based CD then
<ogra> jsgotangco, we only have 6 weeks
<ogra> not 6 months
<jsgotangco> huh?
<jsgotangco> January?
<ogra> dapper will freeze 1 month earlier ...
* ogra mubles something about 5 year support
<jsgotangco> is there a release schedule already?
<ogra> no big changes are allowed, only polish
<ogra> nope, but thats the tendency
<jsgotangco> (i undestand the 5 year support for servers though)
<apokryphos> jsgotangco: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DapperReleaseSchedule
<ogra> and 3 years for desktops
<ogra> apokryphos, thats not final yet
<apokryphos> sure
<jsgotangco> im interested on the milestone and freeze dates
<ogra> they should be public next week...
<ogra> there are still discussions going on
<ogra> but the main scope is to polish dapper and bring in as less new stuff as possible, modulo gnome, xorg and the kernel
<ogra> s/dapper/breezy/
<jsgotangco> ogra: we're sticking to 2.12.1?
<ogra> i said modulo :)
<jsgotangco> aaye...didnt notice
<ogra> these are the things that get updated in any case
<jsgotangco> xorg that'll be fun
<ogra> xorg is already nearly 7.0 in breezy... the updates will be minopr
<highvoltage> hola
<JaneW> ogra: edubuntu is 47 now. W00t!
<JaneW> http://distrowatch.com/index.php?dataspan=4
<ogra> :-D
* ogra needs to update his presentation ;)
<jsgotangco> wow freebsd 6 is released
<highvoltage> JaneW: congrats
<JaneW> highvoltage: pour ce qui ?
<vincenzio> I'm having my tenth grade class set up edubuntu and a science lab of clients.
<vincenzio> but we're doing it as a gateway with two nics, NAT style.
<vincenzio> any pitfalls we should look for?
<JaneW> highvoltage: sorry I am incredibly slow wrt your commnts, I got it...
<magnon> vincenzio: there's nothing wrong with that type of setup, no
<vincenzio> install the system with both nics inserted, or install with one and add the second nic and turn on NAT after the fact?
<magnon> is this the server?
<vincenzio> yes.
<highvoltage> JaneW: sorry, i don't understand.
<magnon> so the server will act as the gateway to the internet for all the thin clients and eventual thick clients as well?
<magnon> hmm
<highvoltage> what do you mean with slow wrt to my comments?
<vincenzio> no, not the thick clients as well.
<vincenzio> just the thin.
<jsgotangco> wow Edubuntu is no. 44
<magnon> vincenzio: so you have another gateway somewhere then
<vincenzio> yes.
<magnon> you won't need NAT on the terminal server
<magnon> the thin clients connect to the internet from the terminal server anyway
<vincenzio> oh good.
<magnon> the programs are running on the server, so they're not connecting from the thin clients
<vincenzio> so then they'll get DHCP from where? the main gateway?
<magnon> from the terminal server
<magnon> but two NICs is still a good idea
<mhz_cooking> I use 2 nics, BTW
<mhz_cooking> ISP -> eth0 AND eth1 -> switch -> thin clients
<mhz_cooking> vincenzio: and dhcp is run from eth1
<vincenzio> I was going to do ISP->linksys gateway->switch->edubuntu eth0 and then edubuntu eth1->switch->clients
<mhz_cooking> should work afaik
<magnon> yeah, that's no problem
<mhz_cooking> ogra did some nice 'tuxpaint' drawing about some layouts
<mhz_cooking> :)
* mhz_kinder taking daughter to schol and bb
<JaneW> highvoltage:  it means "what for?", and then I understood
<highvoltage> aaaaah. for the 47 position :)
<highvoltage> sorry, seems like i'm a bit slow.
<highvoltage> i think we're going in a circle :)
<highvoltage> pere_gone: how are you? i didn't realise you were petter.
<highvoltage> edoo: pere is Petter Reinholdtsen
<edoo> highvoltage: gotcha
<juliux> re
<highvoltage> re?
<juliux> yes re
<juliux> don't ask where i come from
<highvoltage> but we know you're from .de :)
<highvoltage> edoo: highvoltage.location is South Africa
<edoo> highvoltage: sure thing
<juliux> highvoltage, yes
<juliux> highvoltage, but there are no german words for re
<highvoltage> what does re mean?
<flint> BTW  zimmerman and olli gave a great dog and pony to the LTSP mafia!
<highvoltage> regarding?
<highvoltage> edoo: flint is Paul Flint
<edoo> highvoltage: sure thing
<highvoltage> hi flint!
<highvoltage> a dog and pony?
<vincenzio> a dog and pony show.
<flint> a presentation of what the  edubuntu project was.  
<vincenzio> where you trot out the best of what you want to show off.
<vincenzio> the purebread of the best specimens that behave just as you like.
<flint> the deal here is that the LTSP maintainers of yore are very happy, interested and comitted to colaboration with the Ubuntu borg...
* vincenzio is done defining that expression.
<vincenzio> Yore!
<flint> vincenzio, yore as in the oldsters that have maintined LTSP and K12 for many moons...
<highvoltage> that's very cool.
<flint> I will be bursty on this channel because I am in the midst of the thing...
<highvoltage> :)
<vincenzio> flint: as in the people that made it possible for me to run it on fedora core1.
<vincenzio> which is what I intend to replace with edubuntu
<juliux> highvoltage, reenter ?
<vincenzio> although it's using bootp instead of pxe on the clients, and I shall have to etherboot alter those roms.
<highvoltage> vincenzio: what is using bootp?
<highvoltage> k12ltsp 4.00 used pxe and etherboot, edubuntu uses pxe (making it work with etherboot isn't that tough, it seems)
<highvoltage> but you won't need bootp for edubuntu.
<vincenzio> the clients don't use PXE to get the network booting... they're using etherboot, not bootp, I misspoke.
<vincenzio> and this is an OLD k12ltsp install.
<vincenzio> I mean, three years old.
<vincenzio> can edubuntu also do pxe and etherboot at the same time?
<vincenzio> or is it a one-or-the-other proposition?
<highvoltage> i think it's easy hackable
<highvoltage> vincenzio: remind me to test it tomorrow
<highvoltage> if you look at the /etc/dhcpd.conf in Fedora Core 1 (K12LTSP 4.10)
<highvoltage> you'll see that they have a nice hack in dhcpd.conf to make both work, i can't see why that won't work in edubuntu.
<mhz_kinder> re
<highvoltage> mhz: how's the kinder?
<vincenzio> highvoltage: I'll ask you to test it on monday, if that's not too much trouble.
<mhz> highvoltage: kinder is fine
<highvoltage> no problemo, i'd like to test it, so that ogra can include it.
<highvoltage> mhz: and how are you?
<mhz> highvoltage: very tired
<mhz> actually, unvelieavably... I was feeling almost the need of not sitting anywhaere near the computer
<mhz> :))
<mhz> but on the other hands, pending list must diminish
* mhz has more than 2 hands
<highvoltage> <g>
<mhz> highvoltage: and how are you feeling today?
<mhz> how's life treating you?
<highvoltage> ok, actually. i'm in the process of buying my first car.
<mhz> wow!
<highvoltage> dad's old car, really, but it's still a relief.
<mhz> much more than just bikes?
<highvoltage> also translating AbiWord into afrikaans on launchpad, which is quite addictive.
<mhz> highvoltage: aren't you too young to get a car?
<highvoltage> yes, my motorbike is fine for getting to work and back, but driving between cities suck.
<mhz> lol!
<highvoltage> nope, i'm 23. i should've had my licence a few years back :)
<highvoltage> edoo: highvoltage.age
<edoo> highvoltage.age is 23
<mhz> .oO( i couldn't help imagining highvoltage on the bike at 40 km per hour
<highvoltage> 40 km/h ?
<jsgotangco> that's pretty slow
<mhz> yes
<highvoltage> that's what i'm thinking
<jsgotangco> i used to drive a yamaha at 100km/h
<highvoltage> my bike is small, but it can go 90 at least comfortably :)
<jsgotangco> 300cc
<highvoltage> mine is just a 125cc.
<highvoltage> dirt cheap bike
<mhz> highvoltage: then why driving between cities sucked at 90 km/h
<jsgotangco> but ever since i got married my wife banned me from driving a bike
<highvoltage> it only cost 1076 US$ new
* mhz loves bikes
<highvoltage> http://www.gomoto.co.za
<highvoltage> me too.
<jsgotangco> so now i only drive a geerzer family car
<highvoltage> as soon as i paid the car, i'm traiding the bike in for a bigger one :)
<mhz> why is that wives always ban us from driving bikes?
<mhz> ohhh, highvoltage is single
<mhz> :(
<highvoltage> see, i don't have a wife yet, so i should get a proper bike before i get a wife.
<highvoltage> :)
<mhz> LOL
<jsgotangco> yes
<jsgotangco> mhz: because we have kids?
<highvoltage> once i have kids i will be less reckles.
<mhz> yes, but I would have loved to get a wife who also drives bikes
<mhz> so I BAN her
<jsgotangco> heh
<jsgotangco> what kind of bikes anyways
<mhz> jsgotangco: but I doubt it's only the kids
<mhz> I'd say there's gotta be something else
<jsgotangco> well i grew tired of bikes anyways
<mhz> jsgotangco: I had a 50 cc and a 500 CC
<mhz> both yamahas
<mhz> both yamahas?
<mhz> ?
<jsgotangco> 500cc!
<jsgotangco> why do you need such?
<mhz> yes
<mhz> jsgotangco: i am very extremist for my tastes
<highvoltage> i saw a nice yamaha 500cc yesterday.
<mhz> :)
<highvoltage> i'm keeping an eye on it for march 2006 :)
<mhz> mine sounded like a big old truck
<mhz> highvoltage: but jsgotangco is right
<jsgotangco> unless you do motogp or motocross i'm not getting a 500cc
<mhz> actually, I only used it to go from house to work and back
<highvoltage> i think i'll probably get something slightly smaller as well.
<mhz> sometimes to go between cities and beach
<mhz> 250 cc is more than perfect
<highvoltage> what i do like about my bike though, is that I only need to put in about R30's petrol in a week.
<mhz> yep!
<mhz> That I miss!!
* mhz has no car nor bike
<mhz> just a bycicle
<mhz> bicylce
<mhz> whatever
<mhz> :)
<highvoltage> i don't think i'll survive 1km on one of those :)
<mhz> geeeeee! life changes!
<jsgotangco> i have a 1.1 petrol car
<highvoltage> life is bazaar
* mhz filing a divorce paper!!!
<highvoltage> correction: bizzarre
<mhz> hehe
<highvoltage> edoo: exchange 30 ZAR to USD
<jsgotangco> it was a good buy last year since after that petrol prices jacked up
<edoo> highvoltage: 30.00 (South Africa Rand (ZAR)) makes 4.48939 (United States Dollar (USD))
<mhz> jsgotangco: we should all use electricity or gas, instead of petrol
<highvoltage> hear hear!
<highvoltage> or feul cell technology.
<mhz> exactly
<highvoltage> i'm going to make lots of money out of fst one day.
<jsgotangco> nothing beats fossil fuel,...the sound of a rumbling engine...
<highvoltage> (or so i dream)
<mhz> jsgotangco: hehehehe, yes, maybe
<highvoltage> except for warp drive. that sounds cool too.
<mhz> highvoltage: still dream??? DEFINATELY: you are single
<mhz> :D
<jsgotangco> EFI made cars wimps
* jsgotangco still has his old 4wd
<highvoltage> mhz: yeah, sadly. i don't think i'll ever stop.
<mhz> guys: I say that if we depend on fossil fuel then we depend on M$ products as well. But if we are enlightened enugh to choose Free Technology, then WHY don't we choose otheer means of energy, too?
<highvoltage> because they're all patented and proprietary already :)
<mhz> hehehehe
<highvoltage> i wanted to copyright my dna so that Microsoft can't clone me and use me against me.
<mhz> let's hacke them (www.hackaday.org)
<highvoltage> but i couldn't, because the medical companies already own most of my dna.
<jsgotangco> mhz: sure when a solar car can do 120km/h, i'm getting one
<highvoltage> i'm a bit unhappy that i run on proprietary code, but like someone else pointed out earlier, at least it's cheaply reproducable hardware.
<mhz> jsgotangco: we can travel at 90 km/h an less accidents will occur and we'll get there in time
<jsgotangco> mhz: asian drivers are crazy
<vincenzio> I have carburettors on my cars, but I'm thinking of converting to EFI with megasquirt
<jsgotangco> mhz: comparable with italian drivers
<mhz> jsgotangco: when i went to peru (BTW, Peru-Chile are discussing again about territory), I really got scared of the way they drove
<mhz> they did not even have traffic signs
<jsgotangco> mhz: there's a reason why a typical car has 180 on the dashboard...
<jsgotangco> hehe
<mhz> hehehe
<mhz> highvoltage: you are nutsa
<mhz> nuts
<highvoltage> i get that a lot.
<jsgotangco> if i had time and money, i'd buy an old mazda rx or a honda type-r
<mhz> that, you won't stop either
<highvoltage> check my nice karma: https://launchpad.net/people/jonathan/+karma
<mhz> if i had money, i'd make teltrasnportation 
<highvoltage> hmmm..
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: dude thats 1253 karma, obviously you have a lot of time to translate
<mhz> wow
* jsgotangco looks at his puny 114
<mhz> hehehe, I have 10!
<mhz> hehehhe
<mhz> IRC should count too!
<mhz> :D
<mhz> and the talks, and the convincing teachers
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: i do it inbetween things. the nice thing is i can do 10 now, 10 again later and so on.
<mhz> and the installations
<highvoltage> i can even do it while watching t.v.
<highvoltage> or in meetings while i pretend to take minutes.
<jsgotangco> sure
<mhz> lol!
<jsgotangco> you're the only one doing afrikaans atm
<jsgotangco> but us, we do peer review first
<highvoltage> i just want to beat jordie.
<mhz> jsgotangco: could we include successfull installations on karma?
<highvoltage> jordi.
<highvoltage> he has 40 000.
<mhz> wow
<highvoltage> or he had... at least.
<jsgotangco> well
<highvoltage> i think the markings changed, but he has 36xxx something
<jsgotangco> jordi's obviously a different case
<mhz> jordi is sick
<mhz> :)
<highvoltage> one of my big weaknesses is that i get very competitive. *very*
<highvoltage> what's wrong with jordi?
<mhz> 3x.xxx is tooooo much
<mhz> too much karma can kill
<jsgotangco> mhz: not in lp
<mhz> BTW, whose idea is the 'karma' score??
<jsgotangco> the lp team who else
<mhz> jsgotangco: and talks?
<mhz> jsgotangco: booh!
<jsgotangco> mhz: request that on miscellaneous
<jsgotangco> heh
<highvoltage> more things must count for karma, for sure.
<highvoltage> like when jane baked cake. that must count for something!
<mhz> exactly
<jsgotangco> jeezz i can bake
* mhz sends some mocachinno
<highvoltage> edoo: jsgotangco++ [ can bake ] 
<highvoltage> we can do IRC karma
<highvoltage> edoo: karma jsgotangco 
<edoo> highvoltage: jsgotangco has dulia of 1
<mhz> hehehe
<mhz> dulia?
<highvoltage> edoo: karma highvoltage 
<edoo> highvoltage: highvoltage has neutral dulia
<mhz> hehe, what's that?
<jsgotangco> dulia
<highvoltage> i think that's indian karma philosophy
<jsgotangco> ?
<jsgotangco> ahhh
<mhz> IRC starts sounding like RPG
<jsgotangco> well i gotta catch some zzz
<jsgotangco> its almost 3am and i have a docteam meeting at 7am
<jsgotangco> hehe
<mhz> nap well
<highvoltage> goodnight, jsgotangco 
<jsgotangco> obviously green tea didn't help at all
<mhz> LOL
<mhz> jsgotangco: at leat got sense f humour
<mhz> :)
<jsgotangco> mhz: obviously i exceeded my daily caffeine intake
<mhz> indeed, see ya at 22 here
<mhz> highvoltage: thanks for your nice sense of humour
<highvoltage> mhz: any time
<mhz> but I think I'll obey my tired head and just idle at the sofa
<highvoltage> ok. have a good evening.
<mhz> for a little while b4 I get to wiki some stuff
<mhz> highvoltage: we could count wiking on karma
<mhz> and dulia
<mhz> highvoltage: what's the emaning of Ubuntero:  Yes
<mhz> that sunds spanish
<highvoltage> Ubentero seems to be the new name for Ubuntite
<highvoltage> i think some people must have complained that Ubuntite sounds too gay.
<mhz> lol
<mhz> well..... it kind of does
<mhz> petite ubuntu
<highvoltage> hehe
<highvoltage> i can see the hands waving "are you an ubuntite too, darling!"
<mhz> lol!!!!!!!!!
<mhz> lol!!!!!!!!!
* mhz toilette
<mhz> re
<mhz> highvoltage: thx and BBL
<highvoltage> mhz: bye!
<mhz> BTW, how much is a tkt from southafrica to Chile?
<mhz> dont' need to google, just wondering
<highvoltage> edoo: goodbye
<edoo> see you again, highvoltage
<IxR> edoo: hello
<edoo> wassup, IxR!
<looplooploop> edoo: seen dade
<edoo> I haven't seen dade, looplooploop
<flint> sabdfl gave a very good talk at the LTSP....
<highvoltage> flint: what about? ltsp?
<francoisb> Bonjour, je teste Edubuntu en version franaise et j'ai deux petits soucis.
<bluefrog-10> je peux peut-etre t'aider
<francoisb> Super! Un : le gestionnaire de connexion sur les clients ltsp ne semble pas ragir au changement de langue et le clavier est en mode qwerty.
<bluefrog-10> quelle est la langue du serveur?
<bluefrog-10> je veux dire le le layout du clavier sur le serveur
<francoisb> fr, et en azerty sur le serveur
<bluefrog-10> essaye de forcer le layout fr dans /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf
<bluefrog-10> un instant...
<bluefrog-10> XkbLayout    		= "fr"
<ogra> francoisb, http://wiki.edubuntu.org/LTSPClientKeymap
<ogra> ;)
<juliux> hi ogra 
<francoisb> Ok, avec cela je vais pouvoir tester. Deux : le CD Edubuntu ne contient pas tout le franais, ce qui oblige  avoir une connexion adsl au moment de l'i nstallation. Est-ce que l'on peut tlcharcher le pack fr sur un CD ou bien tlcharger une image "fr"
<bluefrog-10> non
<bluefrog-10> mais..
<bluefrog-10> enfin oui tu peux telecharger tout ca
<juliux> ogra, can you bring a edubuntu banner to essen?
<bluefrog-10> en fait si tu as fait toute l'installation du serveur en francais les paquets sont dans /var/cache/apt/archives
<ogra> juliux, we dont have such a thing
<bluefrog-10> maintenant le plus simple a mon avis est d'installer apt-proxy qui te permettra d'avoir un mirroir partiel sur ton disque dur et y acceder en reseau
<juliux> ogra, hm then i will look if we can print some for you
<francoisb> Je vais essayer cela aussi. 
<bluefrog-10> ou de graver ce mirroir partiel sur un dvd
<bluefrog-10> apt-proxy est ds universe
<bluefrog-10> un instant...
<francoisb> Je veux installer edubuntu dans des coles ou il n'y a pas toujours l'adsl.
<bluefrog-10> ogra, Is there an Edubuntu DVD?
<juliux> bluefrog-10, yes there is one
<bluefrog-10> ogra, will all language file then I presume?
<juliux> bluefrog-10, on the dvd is everything from main
<bluefrog-10> k ty, any url for it?
<bluefrog-10> or torrent?
<juliux> torrent is the fastest one
<ogra> bluefrog-10, sure :)
<francoisb> Question bte : comment on imprime le contenu d'un chat pour garder les pistes?
<ogra> sadly the language packs get installed in the end of the install process (after reboot) 
<bluefrog-10> fenetre sauvegarder texte
<ogra> so it would be required to put in the dvd during the second stage of the install (need to document that somewhere)
<francoisb> bien vu.
<ogra> (else it tries to fetch them from the net)
<bluefrog-10> ogra, not a problem, the guy needs the file cause the schools where he wants to put edu may not have adsl
<ogra> if all goes fine, we'll have a second CD in dapper with all the languages
<ogra> ok, i have to change rooms again... next meeting pending
<francoisb> It'll be fine.
<bluefrog-10> ogra, have a link handy to give francoisb to download dvd?
<francoisb> Can I get the language pack from my ubuntu?
<bluefrog-10> oui, si tu as installer ton serveur en francais tu l'as deja ds ton cache
<juliux> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/dvd/current/ there you can download the dvd
<bluefrog-10> juliux, ty
<juliux> i also have the i386 dvd iso on my server
<francoisb> Merci  tous. Je donne des nouvelles ds que j'ai test tout cela.
<bluefrog-10> francoisb, tu es d'ou?
<francoisb> Blois
<bluefrog-10> un peu loin, pour moi, suis de lyon mais..
<francoisb> Je suis content de dcouvrir une communaut ubuntu edubuntu.
<bluefrog-10> comme je cherche du boulot eventuellement tu peux me trouver ici si t'as besoin d'aide,
<bluefrog-10> je te conseille de telecharger le dvd, car recuperer les paquets de ton cache pour les utiliser apres ailleurs est un peu tire par les cheveux..
<francoisb> Ok, J'ai test Abuledu, Je suis de prs Skolelinux et je suis plutot emball par la simplicit de edubuntu. J'utilise ubuntu sur mon portable depuis 3 mois.
<bluefrog-10> oui pour l'instant c une des meilleures que j'ai vu
<francoisb> Je vais tenter de tlcharger le DVD.
<bluefrog-10> tu sais te servir du torrent?
<francoisb> J'ai essay pour edubuntu mais cela ramait.
<bluefrog-10> oui c pareil pour moi
<bluefrog-10> enfin je vois qu'il y a les deux, je n'avais pas fait attention...
<francoisb> finalement c'est le tlech direct qui a march.
<mhz_idle> re
<francoisb> Je lance le tlchargement : http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/dvd/current/      2,3 Go : bigre!
<bluefrog-10> bon il est l'heure dormir, salut, bye all time to hit the sac.
<francois_b> Bonne soire  tous
<mhz> JaneW: any special reason why on www.edubuntu.org, the manifesto talks about edubuntu except on the last paragraph?
#edubuntu 2005-11-10
<mhz> ogra: any special reason why on www.edubuntu.org, the manifesto talks about edubuntu except on the last paragraph?
<mhz> ogra: any special reason why on www.edubuntu.org, the manifesto talks about edubuntu except on the last paragraph?
<dabaR> hehe, doesnt look like it.
<mhz> dabaR: hi. What you mean?
<dabaR> mhz: hey. does not look like there is  a reason for it.
<mhz> oohh
<mhz> :)
<dabaR> mhz: nice to talk to you.
<mhz> hehe, same from here
<dabaR> what are you up to right now, what are you working on?
<dabaR> it sounds misteriously interesting...
<mhz> editing EdubuntuCommunity
<mhz> wiking a tiny how to IRC
<dabaR> writing, or wiking?
<mhz> any diff? :)
<dabaR> a typo diff.
<dabaR> what are you writing? pastebin it, or publish what you had written so far, plz
<dabaR> mhz: I work on ubotu's factoids sometimes, and Im doing school now.
<dabaR> edubotu:))
<dabaR> with a ruler
<dabaR> ogra is mr edubuntu?
<mhz> yes
<mhz> indeed
<dabaR> so are you going to publish?
<mhz> you can visit http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuCommunity
<dabaR> thanks
<mhz> and i need to finish it but I 1st gotta take my dauther to bath
<mhz> :)
<dabaR> are you going to write GnuLinux too?
<mhz> of course :)
<mhz> or you can go ahead
<dabaR> why not just link to gnu.org?
<dabaR> there is already enough info on the net
<mhz> god point
<mhz> feel free
<mhz> i agree
<dabaR> good:)
<mhz> please, if you do it, link it to some gnulinux self explanatory url :D
<mhz> gotta run now or wife will kick my Chilean butt
<mhz> :)
* mhz BBL
<dabaR> what this --> http://www.gnu.org/gnu/why-gnu-linux.html ?
<dabaR> janew is on Comcast.
<jsgotangco> heya kjcole 
<jane_> Comcast? what where?
<mhz_shower> re
<arkan0x> mhz, ? ping 
<mhz> pong
<mhz> arkan0x: estoy ordenandome con varias cosas para ir manana
<mhz> arkan0x: please visit this page ans see if your WiFi Card is listed http://wiki.edubuntu.org/HardwareSupportComponentsWirelessNetworkCards
<mhz> si no lo esta, dime para agregarla o agregala tu mismo. Claro que para wikiear paginas debes estar insrito primero en LaunchPad
<arkan0x> mhz, ;D , no problem si no puedes ir mannana , osea igual la family primero :P , yo te cuente despues XD ,y por lo switch , yo voy a llebar el mio igual pa testear 
<arkan0x> mhz,  D-Link
<arkan0x> 
<arkan0x> DWL-650  esa teno yo
<arkan0x> y funca altiro , segun mi experiencia y la del wiki
<mhz> pero la viste en la lista ya?
<arkan0x> sep
<mhz> perfecto!
<arkan0x> mhz ,tengo una duda ... :P
<mhz> re CDSL/ en una de esas si es factible que aparezca cerca de las 12 y despues me vaya a buscar a Lucas (mi hijo) para llevarlo a la casa (aloja alla)
<mhz> alla = aca en Maestranza :)
<mhz> arkan0x: shoot
<arkan0x> aa okis
<arkan0x> mhz , eske el otro dia estaba testeando edubuntu contra mi notebook antiguo , que en la bios sale pa botear desde nic cardbus(osea desde la red) y googleando piye que ltsp no peskaba muy bien las pcmcia
<arkan0x> y en etherboot tampoko encontre imagenes pa mi pcmcia , ke es un xircom 
<arkan0x> una xircom
<mhz> arkan0x: aahhhh, re buen punto!!
<mhz> en una de esas... tu estas en edubuntu mailing list?
<arkan0x> mmm nu
<arkan0x> me le voy a suscribir
<arkan0x> al vuelo
<mhz> de mas
<mhz> rlz
<mhz> hehe
<arkan0x> mhz, seria edubuntu-devel ?
<mhz> yep
<arkan0x> mhz, tengo consultas sobre moin , voy pal canal moin ?
<mhz> nos vemos alla?
* mhz joined #moin
<JaneW> who is raven / ubuntun?
<jsgotangco> heya JaneW 
<juliux> hi JaneW 
<highvoltage> hi JaneW, jsgotangco and juliux 
<juliux> hi highvoltage 
<JaneW> hi all
<highvoltage> JaneW: what's the time there?
<jsgotangco> probably around 11am
<ajmitch_> 9:43am :)
<jsgotangco> ahhh
<jsgotangco> still ealry
<JaneW> jsgotangco: what's the time where you are?
<jsgotangco> almost 11pm
<JaneW> wow, big difference
<highvoltage> 16:50 here.
<jsgotangco> well im on the other side of the world in the first place
<highvoltage> JaneW: how is UBZ treating you?
<jsgotangco> but for me, 11pm is only the start of the night :)
<highvoltage> i've been wondering a lot.
<jsgotangco> JaneW: is UBZ more fun?
<mhz> hi
<pitux> hello mhz
<mhz> holas
<mhz> voy saliendo al CDSL en uno 20 mins
<pitux> que hay ahi?
<pitux> install fest?
<mhz> nop
<mhz> asamblea
<pitux> aahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
<pitux> no tenia idea
<pitux> oye tengo que hablar algo super importante contigo
<mhz> juega
<pitux> que tiene que ver con la generacion de contenido matematico libre y su incorporacion a distros educativas como edubuntu
<mhz> juega
<mhz> y por que no nos vemos en el CDSL?
<mhz> o prefieres por aca?
<pitux> hoy en la ma~nana estuve viendo que el proyecto matematicas libre a nivel nacional va muy lenteja nadie se pone las pilas y por mas esfuerzos que se hace no se ha podido concretar mucho
<mhz> o me llamas al 3129513?
<pitux> lo que pasa es que debo lavar ropa
<mhz> o me llamas al 3129513?
<mhz> lo hacemos mas rapido y corto
<mhz> :D
<pitux> a que hora es la reunion en el Cdsl?
<mhz> ya empezaron :)
<mhz> yo voy a ayudar
<pitux> ahhhhh y hasta que hora es
<mhz> ni idea
<mhz> pero me llamas al tiro?
<pitux> lo que pasa es que no te puedo llamar
<mhz> ahh
<pitux> tengo un plan y ya estoy pasado en minutos
<mhz> hehehehee
<mhz> te llamo yo?
<mhz> dame #
<mhz> casa, supongo?
<pitux> igual me da lata pero filo
<mhz> ok, entonces dale por aca nomas
<pitux> si pos
<pitux> 5275544
<mhz> pero no te da lata que te llame me digiste?
<mhz> dijiste?
<pitux> ya filo
<pitux> la cuestion
<pitux> es que conozco gente de Peru, Colombia argentina, ecuador y venezuela que trabaja con software libre y matematica
<pitux> ademas de Chile obvio
<mhz> ya
<pitux> asi que quiero empezar a motivarlos para formar matematicaslibre.org
<mhz> ya
<pitux> y se que se va a mover mas el asunto
<mhz> te propongo algo
<jsgotangco> no habla espanol
<jsgotangco> hehe
<pitux> esto estaria directamente ligado a que se quiere conseguir a nivel latinoamricano respecto a educacion matematica
* jsgotangco goes back to idle mode
<mhz> jsgotangco: sorry, does it bother you? (we can use pv but we thought this may be interesting for other as well)
<pitux> que me propones?
<jsgotangco> mhz: no just teasing :)
<jsgotangco> but we're logged
<mhz> que tal si hablamos con JaneW y le contamos lo que deseamos hacer como Edubuntu LoCo team or algo
<mhz> jsgotangco: hehe, thx
<JaneW> mhz: huh? ;)
<mhz> hehe
<mhz> JaneW: hi ther
<JaneW> hi mhz
<pitux> ok cool
<pitux> your helpme in the traslation
<jsgotangco> hey JaneW again
<pitux> please mhz
<mhz> JaneW: pitux and I are discussing about matematicaslibre (free math content for education)
<mhz> we thought that 'maybe' you'd (we the edubuntors) may be interested
<mhz> JaneW: what if we had edubuntu subprojects regarding contents
<JaneW> such as?
<mhz> i.e. free math contents
<JaneW> sure
<mhz> I mean,
<mhz> Edubuntu is the distro and apps
<mhz> but what if we had some repos. or something that teachers , students and communitiy in general could get content from
<mhz> history, language, math, etc
<mhz> Keduca, i.e., has the ability to get tests from http
<JaneW> yes absolutely that would be great
<JaneW> if we could get community input for that it would REALLY help
<mhz> or maybe ATP-GET math_content
<mhz> exactly
<mhz> thats our point
<pitux> build a package with content maths contents
<mhz> tool + content + cross curricular activitiies
<pitux> for primary secundary university etc
<mhz> yep
<mhz> jsgotangco: what do you think?
<mhz> JaneW: i think that we would kick some butts with stuff like that 
<jsgotangco> are you talking about meta packages?
<mhz> we add much more value
<mhz> jsgotangco: don't know
<mhz> jsgotangco: you are the developer
<mhz> i am just a person with ideas
<mhz> :)
<jsgotangco> if i get it right, if one guy does apt-get install math_content, all math related apps are installed?
<JaneW> mhz: seriously we'd LOVE that cos it's the kind of stuff we have spoken about but haven't had the time to look at it at all...
<mhz> jsgotangco: hmm, nop
<mhz> JaneW: is that a Yes let's go for it?
<jsgotangco> mhz: i don't get the idea then
<jsgotangco> mhz: afaik, some people outside ubuntu make their own repos to work with ubuntu
<mhz> jsgotangco: you have edubuntu. Now, if you want/need content for the tools you already installed, then get them from an edubuntu repository, ie
<jsgotangco> mhz: for exaple, i saw a university guy made his own repo for forensic science packages for ubuntu in his own server
<pitux> the wiki is a recommendable tool for build collaborative content
<jsgotangco> ahh content say, curriculum?
<mhz> jsgotangco: you'e talking about apps or contents?
<mhz> jsgotangco: yes, excercises, tests, etc
<pitux> contents for apps
<pitux> for example
<pitux> kig 
<jsgotangco> both
<pitux> generate content about geometric constructions for kig
<jsgotangco> mhz: the problem i forsee here is
<pitux> for prmary and secundary
<jsgotangco> a. curricula is diffeerent between nations
<mhz> In Chile, we are trying to design a kind of survey that will help us identify teachers profiles, in terms of what teachers would be rady to start using ICT, who feels reticent to, who will definately be an obstacle , etc
<jsgotangco> b. i don't think we can host them on ubuntu servers
<pitux> yes but shared nore tipocs
<pitux> yes but shared more topics
<pitux> mhz: quiero decir que hay en los curriculos hay muchos topicos en conjunto
<mhz> jsgotangco: also, edubuntu provides the tools, But, some teachers have already asked me.. now what? How do i give this better use based on the ministry plan
<pitux> mhz: muchos topicos comunes 
<mhz> pitux: cross-curriculum contents
<jsgotangco> mhz: if you would pick up my brain on the Edubuntu matter, Edubuntu provides a framework but won't spoonfeed everything, its up to you people/users to decide on how to harness that infrastructure provided, much like how launchpad is thriving at the moment.
<mhz> jsgotangco: is that the only problem you see? any other?
<mhz> jsgotangco: yes, i agree what edubuntu is
<jsgotangco> mhz: not much, but definitely showstoppers in my opinion
<mhz> jsgotangco: the point is 'motivation'. Last thursday, on this seminar on ICT for education, all the expertes were talking about edutools and stuff, and in the end they all got to the same conclusion: How can you make teachers see this tools are available but we need their help to give them value
<mhz> jsgotangco: any sinonim for showstoppers
<mhz> ?
<juliux> JaneW, hi  can we calculate with the conference packs for essen/germany ?
<jsgotangco> mhz: dude, Edubuntu is a framework, in Chile, you have your educational system that is entirely different from say, ZA, USA and PH, I don't think if I do content/curricula for Edubuntu, say im an educator in ZA, won't be usable in Chile
<jsgotangco> mhz: you're in Chile, you're the most visible Edubuntu person there in my opinioin, you have the ideas, you're more likely to know what to do and how to execute it in an Edubuntu framework
<mhz> jsgotangco: hmmm
* mhz thinking
<JaneW> mhz: sure go ahead - discuss tech detaiks with ogra please.
<JaneW> juliux: huh?
<mhz> jsgotangco: I'd agree, except that i.e. Math is universal
<juliux> JaneW, i have send two times a e-mail but no response
<mhz> science in general, I'd say.
<JaneW> juliux: mail it again to marilize@canonical.com
<juliux> ok i will do
<juliux> JaneW, thanks
<jsgotangco> mhz: sure but methodoligies of teaching aren't
<mhz> jsgotangco: and cross-curriculum contents on those areas may add very cool value. Mayb even seduce more people to use Edubuntu, and so we may need less resources to "evagelize" them :)
<mhz> jsgotangco: that i agree 100%
<mhz> methodologies will vary
<mhz> jsgotangco: taking apart the pros and cons, or if this fits or not on the objectives... d'u think is technically possible? what would be the diffiulties?
<jsgotangco> sure its possible
<jsgotangco> its only content
<jsgotangco> you tie up an app with your content
<jsgotangco> ill come back later
<jsgotangco> brb
<mhz> by
<mhz> bye
<mhz> JaneW: thanks for your help.
<mhz> JaneW: BTW, next thursaday, I have one of the key meetings regarding Edubuntu Chilean Tour, esp. for funds
<JaneW> mhz: great I will be able to chat to you on monday I think - if you need me to
<JaneW> have a good w/e
<mhz> you too
<highvoltage> edoo: JaneW 
<edoo> JaneW is Jane Weideman
<highvoltage> edoo: ogra
<edoo> ogra is Oliver Grawert
<highvoltage> edoo: mdz
<edoo> mdz is Matt Zimmerman
<highvoltage> edoo: mdz
<edoo> mdz is Matt Zimmerman
<highvoltage> edoo: mdz
<edoo> mdz is Matt Zimmerman
<highvoltage> weird.
<JaneW> edoo: highvoltage
<edoo> highvoltage is Jonathan Carter
<JaneW> heh
<highvoltage> edoo: mdz
<edoo> mdz is an oppertunistic troublemaker
<highvoltage> that's better :)
<JaneW> LOL
<JaneW> opportunistic btw
<highvoltage> got that from https://launchpad.net/people/mdz
<highvoltage> but yes, i did spell it wrong..
<Karbonade> hellow ? i need some help with my wirless :)
<highvoltage> Karbonate's "h" was about 17 characters to early.
<highvoltage> edoo: goodnight
<edoo> goodnight, highvoltage. I'll keep an eye out for the MS spies while you sleep.
<highvoltage> edoo: edoo++
<bluefrog-10> how do you capitalize words in bash command line, pls?
<highvoltage> what do you mean?
<bluefrog-10> i need to transform test in TEST
<bluefrog-10> have been googling, found a lot of stuff, but not able to apply what's explained, and nobody answers on #bash
<bluefrog-10> got an answer, its' tr
<signifer123> howdy ya'll
<signifer123> jk
<Archeo> hello
#edubuntu 2005-11-11
<roxville> hello :) i'm looking for mhz, anybody seen him lately?
<roxville> ok... silly me... i just did a whois, and he's not online, so... nice channel... clean and tidy... like a classrom :)
<hero23123123> hello
<hero23123123> can I install eubuntu/terminal server in my office for some sales people ?
<hero23123123> they only need firefox / openoffice
<hero23123123> there are around 4 terminals and the server is p3 with 128 ram, shoul;d be ok ? or need more ram
<highvoltage> you will need more RAM.
<highvoltage> you'll need +/- 128MB (100MB minimun) for every client that connects.
<hero23123123> hmm
<hero23123123> how easy is eubuntu terminal server to setup ?
<hero23123123> all needed packages are available on the cd ?
<dabaR> yes, it is inclided, if you are asking about ltsp
<Matze29> hm hello ? ^^
<Matze29> anyone there ?
<highvoltage> 20:01 < highvoltage> jammcq_ubz: any exciting new developments with ltsp and ubuntu planned?
<highvoltage> 20:02 < jammcq_ubz> more better, that pretty much covers it
<highvoltage> seems like I didn't miss that much at UBZ then? :)
<magnon> hehe
<magnon> we have loads of nice stuff coming up
<magnon> but the ubuntu parts will be mostly polishing up to dapper
<magnon> although sound and local devices will work better than ever before, and we will have faster startup and less mem usage
<magnon> ;)
<Yagisan> heh - I realised today just how overpowered my server is
<highvoltage> nice
<Yagisan> I was logged in at the server building debs for breezy, and play testing the current beta of doomsday
<Yagisan> when clients logged in
<Yagisan> I didn't get any frame drops
<highvoltage> how many clients? how were their speeds?
<Yagisan> I only noticed they where logged in and *working* when I went to get a coffee
<Yagisan> highvoltage: just a few pcs, they were running at full speed
<Yagisan> just a nice constant 149fps with all jpacks enabled :)
<Yagisan> highvoltage: you can grab the current breezy debs from http://www.eyagiconsulting.com
<Yagisan> highvoltage: webpage needs to be updated soon to include the extra jpacks added
<highvoltage> cool! i'll queue it at work tomorrow.
<Yagisan> highvoltage: just a warning, that my end is only 512k up, so grab the small packs first if you want to play soon
<highvoltage> Yagisan: the connection at work is max 512k down, so that's fine :)
<highvoltage> 512k in .za is about as much as it gets.
<Yagisan> highvoltage: there is something like 500MB in that repo!
<highvoltage> i'm sure it will download overnight :)
<Yagisan> highvoltage: out of curiosity, how will you queue it at work ?
<aveline> hm anyone alive?
* aveline guesses not
#edubuntu 2005-11-12
* aveline wonders if arkan0x is alive 
<cafuego> Is there a known problem with using Edubuntu on vmware5?
<cafuego> Anyone awake today?
<juliux> cafuego, yes
<highvoltage> yep, more or less.
<newbiewLTSP> please help
<newbiewLTSP> had problem with the LTSP display manager
<newbiewLTSP> can't login username and password
<Velmont> newbiewLTSP: Made a user on the server with ssh-axx etc? 
<Velmont> I didn't manage to get it to work, but then I did something and it worked. Don't remember what though :p Think it was more like a "wait some minutes, try again"-thing... Hm.
<gand_> hi all
<gand_> I wish to install moodle on edubuntu
<gand_> I see that is not among synaptic package list, I'm right?
<gand_> ok thank see you later
<chilenoneto> hi
<chilenoneto> anybody there?
<chilenoneto> join #ubuntu
<apokryphos> chilenoneto: no-one!
<chilenoneto> heheh
<apokryphos> no, there are :)
<chilenoneto> im looking for someone to ask 
<apokryphos> no point asking to ask; just ask =)
<jsgotangco> hi all
<pitux> hello chilenoneto
<pitux> i from Chile too
<chilenoneto> i have some questions about the availability of Edubunto in the ship-it program on UBUntu
<chilenoneto> heheh 
<jsgotangco> chilenoneto: its not yet available in shipit
<chilenoneto> espaol para nosotros, english to the rest
<chilenoneto> there is no plan for it to be shipped?
<chilenoneto> i have a huge project involving public schools here in asuncion paraguay (where i'm living)
<jsgotangco> chilenoneto: none at the moment, probably a few hunderd cds by next year (dapper)
<jsgotangco> we'd like to polish it further
<chilenoneto> put me on the list
<chilenoneto> hehehe
<chilenoneto> i knew the ubuntu some time ago , i liked to get it on the schools here, talked with some government people and now we are working to shape a projhect involving linux, and opensource
<pitux> chilenoneto cool ;D
<apokryphos> nice
<chilenoneto> project
<chilenoneto> so i'm downloading the edubuntu 5.10 for testing porpouses
<chilenoneto> there is a lot to do here in paraguay, cause the technology adoption it's more than poor
<apokryphos> cool; let us know what you think of it after
<vincenzio> today is the day we set up edubuntu with my tenth grade.
<JaneW> vincenzio: great, good luck and enjoy
* JaneW is now a proud edubuntu user too
* JaneW is loving it
<vzl> hi!
<vzl> I have a new edubuntu setup running, and the client cannot log in with either the admin user or a non-admin user.
<vzl> lil help?
<vzl> I have a new edubuntu setup running, and the client cannot log in with either the admin user or a non-admin user.
<vzl> any advice, ogra?
<ogra> vzl, check /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/ssh/known_hosts
<ogra> it should contain a key
<vzl> you mean ssh_known_hosts?
<ogra> if it doesnt, run "sudo ltsp-build-sshkeys" on the server and make sure the ssh server runs
<ogra> yes, sorry
<vzl> there are four lines of keys there.
<vzl> but they're all for my eth0, not my eth1
<vzl> (nat)
<vzl> (two nic setup)
<ogra> hmm, how did you install edubuntu ? 
<vzl> from the cd?
<vzl> it asked for which nic would be the primary nic, and I said eth0 and gave it a static ip, and then once installed, went and gave eth1 192.168.0.1 and activated it.
<vzl> clients on 0.1, internet on eth0
<ogra> ah, k the static ip should be for the thin clients
<vzl> okay, how badly am I doing here- did I issue dhcp over the interface that's going to the internet?
<ogra> just wipe the file and run the above command again while the interface is up, that should be enough
<ogra> nope, if your thin clients boot, all is fine with dhcp
<vzl> ltsp-build-sshkeys is not a found command.
<vzl> do you mean update?
<vzl> instead of build?
<ogra> err, yes...
<vzl> ok, my admin user can log in froma client. but a non-admin user cannot.
<vzl> i lie, it just worked on the third try
<ogra> :)
<vzl> now, how to do both pxe and etherboot?
<ogra> use a rom-o-matic etherboot image, they have a pxe mode for that...
<vzl> oh good.
<ogra> there is some info somewhere on wiki.edubuntu.org 
<ogra> but the rom-o-matic creator is very straight forward, doesnt really require instrucions imho...
<vzl> you say that now...
<vzl> ;)
<vzl> this is excellent.
<vzl> now, how bad would it be to do this over 802.11b ?
<vzl> or g?
<ogra> there is a wireless bootimage mentioned somewhere on the ltsp wiki, you can try that, i have no experience with wlan ltsp to be honest :)
<ogra> but you will need a bootdevice for that (cdrom, floppy, whatever)
<vzl> sure, sure
<magnon> ogra: oh, my colleague made a wlan boot once
<magnon> but it's not very sexy.
<juliux> ogra, ping
<vincenzio> magnon: it isn't?
<vincenzio> uses a lot of network resources?
<magnon> vincenzio: no, just the process it uses to boot wlan could be nicer
<vincenzio> I wonder, is that process documented anywhere?
<magnon> probably not
<magnon> my colleague is a slacker :p
<vincenzio> where do you work, may I ask?
<magnon> own business
<magnon> me, him, and a third slacker :)
<vincenzio> nice.
<vincenzio> two slackers?
<magnon> thre
<magnon> e
<magnon> I slack as well :)
<vincenzio> right.
<vincenzio> what line of work is it where you can slack and own your own business for any length of time, I wonder.
<magnon> depends how much profit you want
<vincenzio> so, how much do you want? ;)
<magnon> right now, more than I have :D
<magnon> actually we're just slacking because I was going to UBZ and that wasn't a good time to get new projects
<magnon> when I stop jetlagging I will work a lot
<jelkner> highvoltage: how are you?
<magnon> hello, elkner
<jelkner> magnon: do you have a minute to answer a question or 2?
<magnon> sure
<jelkner> i've a few issues with this edubuntu system, and only 20 minutes before i have to leave for my next class
<jelkner> first problem:
<jelkner> W: GPG error: http://us.archive.ubuntu.com breezy-updates Release: The following signatures were invalid: BADSIG 40976EAF437D05B5 Ubuntu Archive Automatic Signing Key <ftpmaster@ubuntu.com>
<magnon> ouch. on breezy? not good
<magnon> but it's only a warning, it shouldn't be a problem
<jelkner> yeah, but i don't get that on the other systems, why?
<magnon> I saw some other people having the same problem, but can't remember anyone saying why
<jelkner> ok, more important problem
<ogra> jelkner, because the mirror you use is just in the middle of an update...
<jelkner> ahh, thanks!
<highvoltage> jelkner: good thanks, and you?
<jelkner> more serious problem: no can log in
<ogra> run apt-get update again / reload in synaptic to get the fixed key ...
<jelkner> ok
<jelkner> Nov  7 13:07:01 localhost gconfd (root-7916): Resolved address "xml:readonly:/etc/gconf/gconf.xml.defaults" to a read-only configuration source at position 3
<jelkner> Nov  7 13:07:01 localhost gconfd (root-7916): Resolved address "xml:readonly:/usr/share/gconf/local.defaults" to a read-only configuration source at position 4
<jelkner> Nov  7 13:07:01 localhost gconfd (root-7916): Resolved address "xml:readonly:/usr/share/gconf/cdd.defaults" to a read-only configuration source at position 5
<jelkner> Nov  7 13:07:01 localhost gconfd (root-7916): Resolved address "xml:readonly:/usr/share/gconf/debian.defaults" to a read-only configuration source at position 6Nov  7 13:07:01 localhost gconfd (root-7916): Resolved address "xml:readonly:/var/lib/gconf/defaults" to a read-only configuration source at position 7
<highvoltage> i just bought my first car.
<jelkner> congratulations!
<magnon> jelkner: oh, that's normal
<ogra> check /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/ssh for a valid known_hosts file and check that sshd is running
<highvoltage> jelkner: thanks :)
<ogra> the above messages are normal login messages
<jelkner> but it won't let me log in
<jelkner> or anyone
<ogra> have you read what i wrote above ? 
<magnon> I doubt that gconf is the error then
<jelkner> yes, hold on...
<ogra> if the file is empty or the interfaces changed since install it wont hold the right keys
<jelkner> ahh, there is no known_hosts file
<ogra> just run sudo ltsp-update-sshkeys 
<ogra> it should (re)generate it
<vincenzio> jelkner: it's ssh_known_hosts anyway
<ogra> yup
<jelkner> ok, let me try to log in...
<jelkner> great, everything works!
<jelkner> i just setup an hp laserjet printer on the net using directjet... worked like a charm
<magnon> oh good :)
<magnon> printers are becoming less crap
<jelkner> ok, the customer is happy, time to go back to teaching... ;-)
<jelkner> see you all later.
<jelkner> thanks!
<ogra> bye
<magnon> what customer :D
<vincenzio> he's in a school environ. I imagine the customer was a teacher.
<magnon> I know who he is ;)
<vincenzio> I'm also teaching a class at the moment
<highvoltage> ogra: howdy.
<ogra> highvoltage, what is this jonathan launchpad team for ?
<ogra> hi, btw
<highvoltage> it's a secret among the jonathan's of Ubuntu.
<highvoltage> we have to keep the mystery up :)
<highvoltage> ogra: are you back at home?
<ogra> nope...
<highvoltage> how are you doing? canada nice?
<ogra> trying to come over my hangover from yesterday night and wait for time to pass for grabbing my taxi
<highvoltage> sounds amasing.
<highvoltage> it's been a long while since i had a hangover.
<highvoltage> i've come to some realisations the past few weeks. i thought that i have to wait until i have a long period of leave before getting involved in motu, and doing gym regularly, taking guitar lessons... etc.
<highvoltage> but then i realised i should just learn to schedule all the things i want to do in my regular routine.
<highvoltage> so i'm going to do some planning this week and get my time management sorted out.
<ogra> the weather is intrestingly springlike
<highvoltage> how so?
<ogra> sunny and warm
<highvoltage> here the spring is only giving us hayfever.
<highvoltage> ah, right, it's "fall" there :)
<ogra> they lock the room for lunch...
<ogra> so i have to leave...
<highvoltage> are you outside?
<ogra> brb
<juliux> ogra, here it something about the workshop in essen http://www.poweroftwo.de/wiki/index.php/Edubuntu  what dou you think about it?
<cafuego> Anyone still awake?
#edubuntu 2005-11-13
<mhz> hi
<mhz> http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuCdAndSlip Has been updated based on the opinions and suggestions gotten in IRC
<mhz> JaneW: hi there
* cafuego is getting an 'rpc failed' on booting a thin client (it gets an IP and a kernel)
<cafuego> specifically: 'rpc failed: 2' in between /scripts/nfs-premount and /scripts/nfs-bottom
<mhz> I actually never payed attention to errors as long as clients do boot
<mhz> IIRC, Oliver mentioned some errors as 'normal' for this version
<mhz> :)
<cafuego> This plonks me in a busybox shell, no joy on the booting :-(
<mhz> ooohhh
* mhz dislikes busybox
<cafuego> The scripts all report 'Done.' but then I end up with: mount: Mounting /root/dev on /dev/.static/dev failed: No such file or directory
<mhz> oooh
<mhz> well, you got me there.
<mhz> and had your installation worked ok before getting this errors?
<cafuego> Can you tell me the cfg in your  inetd (fopr tftp) and pxelinux.0/default?
<cafuego> argh /me lags
<mhz_cooking> cafuego: yes, gimme 2 mins
<cafuego_> Ack
<cafuego_> Any chance you could give me your tftp config line and pxelinux config?
* P3L|C4N0 saludos
<mhz_cooking> cafuego_: ping
<cafuego_> mhz: pong
* P3L|C4N0 Hello friendes - Hola amigos - Buna prietens
<Arago> hello all
<Arago> I have a question. Can I ?
<bluefrog-10> what about?
<Arago> I'm looking for a software like the DERIVE(tm) one
<bluefrog-10> sry don't know what it is
<Arago> it's a matematical soft used to resolve equation, disequation. Also plot a graph for the function
<bluefrog-10> u're runnning ubuntu i suppose?
<Arago> yes
<bluefrog-10> open applications > add applications and have a look in the edutainment menu 
<bluefrog-10> i can see kmplot which could be useful to u maybe
<Arago> i'll do it now
<Arago> thank
<bluefrog-10> you can also use synaptic
<bluefrog-10> and use it's sections sorting ability to trace something
<bluefrog-10> in both case u should enble the universe repository
<bluefrog-10> and eventually muliverse
<bluefrog-10> multiverse
<Arago> ok thanks for now !
<mhz_breakfast> bluefrog-10: also, maybe he could look at http://wiki.edubuntu.org/UbuntuScientists
* mhz_breakfast bbl
<mhz_breakfast> re
<zakame> hey mhz :)
<mhz> zakame: nice to cya
<mhz> has anyone here helped ogra with the recipe of current 5.10?
<zakame> recipe?
<mhz> zakame: hmmm, with the knowhow and actually making all the components work together well for the release
<zakame> mhz: ah
<mhz> :)
<mhz> sorry, I feel a little lazy lately and didnt want to write all that :D
<zakame> no problem, just asking as I'm also new too :D
<mhz> okidoki
<mhz> highvoltage: hi, did you?
<mhz> JaneW: ping
<highvoltage> mhz: sorry, did I?
<mhz> has anyone here helped ogra with the recipe of current 5.10?
<highvoltage> ah, sorry. catching up noe.
<mhz> recipe= hmmm, with the knowhow and actually making all the components work together well for the release
<highvoltage> now.
<highvoltage> mhz: i think it's all ogra, really.
<mhz> ok
<highvoltage> he did the whole edubuntu by himself.
<mhz> highvoltage: ever done a customized LiveCd
<mhz> ?
<highvoltage> yep.
<mhz> highvoltage: duh! that's why he's Mr. Edubuntu
<highvoltage> i've done a livecd from scratch, and customised knoppix a few times.
<mhz> highvoltage: could you help me with some details?
<highvoltage> mhz: yes :)
<highvoltage> sure.
<mhz> thx
<highvoltage> edoo: ogra
<edoo> ogra is Oliver Grawert
<highvoltage> edoo: ogra
<edoo> ogra is Oliver Grawert
<highvoltage> hmmm..
<mhz> I have a meeting tomorrow with one of the important universities here in Chile. Some math teachers have asked to think how to make customized Edubuntu LiveCd's for each carrier
<mhz> highvoltage: is edoo a bot?
<highvoltage> yep.
<highvoltage> edoo: mhz
<edoo> highvoltage: I'm not following you...
<highvoltage> ok. thought he knew your name too.
<mhz> hhehe
<highvoltage> edoo: choose highvoltage is stupid or highvoltage is clever
<edoo> I choose highvoltage is clever, highvoltage
* highvoltage is surprised
<mhz> LOL
<highvoltage> edoo: google for edubuntu
<edoo> highvoltage: Google found 'Edubuntu - Linux for Young Human Beings', at "http://www.edubuntu.org/"
<zakame> haha
<highvoltage> edoo: slashdot
<edoo> highvoltage: Slashdot - Updated 2005-11-08 12:35:00 | Vertical Axis Wind Turbine With Push and Pull | Morfik and Rapid Development of Modern Web Apps | No More Science on the ISS Until Further Notice | YouTube Receives $3.5M Funding from Sequoia
<mhz> edoo: google for edward ubuntu
<edoo> mhz: Google found 'Edward&#39;s Weblog', at "http://blogs.sun.com/roller/page/edward?entry=nis_auth_and_ubuntu_group"
<mhz> :D
<highvoltage> it has karma too.
<highvoltage> edoo: mhz++
<highvoltage> edoo: karma mhz
<edoo> highvoltage: mhz has karma of 1
<mhz> nha
<mhz> I should have at least 10
<mhz> highvoltage: sorry to interrupt your delightful entretainment but..
<mhz> I have a meeting tomorrow with one of the important universities here in Chile. Some math teachers have asked to think how to make customized Edubuntu LiveCd's for each carrier
<mhz> so,
<mhz> I gotta make a list how much effort that would mean
<mhz> what kind of infrastructure they should have to do so
<neurogeek> mhz, good morning!
<mhz> neurogeek: guten morgen
<highvoltage> hmmm...
<mhz> neurogeek: you speak spanish, right?
<highvoltage> i usually worked off the customising knoppix guides.
<highvoltage> i wonder if there's a similar one for ubuntu.
<highvoltage> that might be the best bet.
<highvoltage> edoo: google for customise ubuntu livecs
<highvoltage> edoo: google for customise ubuntu livecd
<edoo> highvoltage: ERROR: No matches found
<edoo> highvoltage: Google found 'Ubuntu - Linux for Human Beings', at "http://www.ubuntulinux.org/"
* highvoltage uses big google instead
<mhz> hehehe
<mhz> highvoltage: I can google as well, but I was wondering if you could have some ideas
<neurogeek> mhz, si.. jeje
<mhz> neurogeek: are you participating in this maracaibo congress?
<mhz> highvoltage: ie. how much do you usually take on making your own livecd from scratch and what implements you used
<highvoltage> mhz: seen http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/LiveCDCustomizationHowTo?
<jelkner> anyone here who could help fix a broken idle?
<highvoltage> mhz: they were small ones, mostly for my own education. the one i worked hardest at was for a generic gnu/linux installer i want to finish one day.
<highvoltage> jelkner: i'm not very good with cars, but i can try?
<jelkner> lol, great!
<jelkner> a bit of background
<jelkner> idle will not start on this system
<mhz> jelkner: hi there, let's try
<jelkner> it works on the newer edubuntu systems i've setup
<jelkner> but this one was a prerelease that has been upgraded
<mhz> highvoltage: and in average, how many hours?
<jelkner> i've tried uninstalling and reinstalling, but no luck
<jelkner> here is the error message:
<neurogeek> mhz, yes.. we'll be there talking about Cuaima and about the Venezuelan linux distro :)
<highvoltage> i think you could customise and ubuntu livecd in a day or two, if you have the time.
<jelkner> jelkner@edubuntu:~$ idle
<jelkner> Traceback (most recent call last):
<jelkner>   File "/usr/bin/idle", line 5, in ?
<jelkner>     main()
<jelkner>   File "/usr/lib/python2.4/idlelib/PyShell.py", line 1350, in main
<jelkner>     root = Tk(className="Idle")
<neurogeek> mhz, are you going??
<jelkner>   File "/usr/lib/python2.4/lib-tk/Tkinter.py", line 1569, in __init__
<jelkner>     self.tk = _tkinter.create(screenName, baseName, className, interactive, wantobjects, useTk, sync, use)
<jelkner> _tkinter.TclError: this isn't a Tk applicationunknown color name "Black"
<highvoltage> mhz: i would also try to get in contact with the ubuntu guys who put together the livecd, perhaps they have some scripts that will help you get it down to just a few hours.
<highvoltage> jelkner: how did you install idle? apt-get install idle?
<mhz> neurogeek: I have no money to yet, but YES! I'd love to go and talk about many stuff, esp. our intent to do the Inst. Tecnologias Libres para L.A.
<jelkner> yup
<jelkner> and when i removed it, it did --purge
<highvoltage> i'm just installing idle too... just a moment...
<jelkner> yours will probably work
<jelkner> i've only had this problem in this system
<mhz> jelkner: sorry, I can't install idle right now so I can reproduce errors :(
<mhz> oh
<jelkner> which we setup at the end of august and then upgraded
<mhz> ohh
<mhz> jelkner: is idle a devel app?
<jelkner> mhz: yes
<neurogeek> mhz, great idea!! i hope you can go and we get a time to talk about stuff
<highvoltage> jelkner: apt-get install python-tk
<mhz> neurogeek: so far.. funds are tending to zero :)
<jelkner> highvoltage: let me try...
<highvoltage> that *might* help. as far as i can deduce it looks like you don't have that installed.
<neurogeek> mhz, oopps!!
<highvoltage> jelkner: no, seems i'm wrong, ignore me :)
<mhz> neurogeek: however, I can get to convince one of the institutions here to support us, maybe I can get there
<highvoltage> i think that might be one for #ubuntu
<highvoltage> or the lists
<jelkner> highvoltage: no change
<mhz> jelkner: have you installed python-dev ?
<jelkner> hold on...
<neurogeek> mhz, good luck.. i do hope so!!
<mhz> neurogeek: thx
<mhz> me too
<jelkner> mhz: it shouldn't matter, i installed idle through apt
<jelkner> so there shouldn't be missing dependencies
<jelkner> i would file a bug report
<jelkner> only it is not a general problem
<jelkner> a new edubuntu install won't have it
<jelkner> but this was an august prerelease that has been upgraded
<zakame> jelkner: do you have python2.4-tk installed?
<jelkner> zakame: yes, idle depends on it
<zakame> jelkner: can you apt-get --reinstall install python2.4-tk and try idle again?
<jelkner> zakame: i did that, i even uninstalled idle, python2.4-tk and reinstalled both
<jelkner> same problem
<mhz> jelkner: weired that problem indeed is :)
<zakame> how about updating {tcl,tk}8.4?
<jelkner> mhz: i'm going to uninstall all python and tk related stuff that won't break other things
<jelkner> then i'll try reinstalling idle
<jelkner> let me see how that goes
<mhz> jelkner: are you using AMD, x86 or PPC?
<jelkner> mhz: x86
<jelkner> dual xeon
<mhz> ok
<mhz> jelkner: tried #python ?
<mhz> jelkner: neurogeek manages python very well (IIRC he's a developer on python)
<mhz> neurogeek: any ideas with jelkner's issue?
<neurogeek> mhz, let me read to see i can be of any help
<neurogeek> jelkner, what have you installed so far and what ubuntu version are you running?
* mhz will leave and BBL
<mhz> highvoltage: thx
<highvoltage> ok, catch you guys a bit later.
<highvoltage> bye!
<jelkner> any python hackers here at the moment?
<jelkner> i'm trying to follow this traceback that is preventing idle from running
<jelkner> i've tried uninstalling *all* python packages i could, including idle an tk, but after reinstalling idle, the problem persists
<zakame> well, dump idle, use another editor instead :p
<neurogeek> jelkner, tell me
<neurogeek> jelkner, whats the error??
<jelkner> jelkner@edubuntu:~$ idle
<jelkner> Traceback (most recent call last):
<jelkner>   File "/usr/bin/idle", line 5, in ?
<jelkner>     main()
<jelkner>   File "/usr/lib/python2.4/idlelib/PyShell.py", line 1350, in main
<jelkner>     root = Tk(className="Idle")
<jelkner>   File "/usr/lib/python2.4/lib-tk/Tkinter.py", line 1569, in __init__
<jelkner>     self.tk = _tkinter.create(screenName, baseName, className, interactive, wantobjects, useTk, sync, use)
<jelkner> _tkinter.TclError: this isn't a Tk applicationunknown color name "Black"
<jelkner> not much in /usr/bin/idle
<jelkner> i don't know where "Black" is coming from
<jelkner> so the error is actually coming from tk, yes?
<neurogeek> yes
<neurogeek> thats the main problem.. 
<neurogeek> what version of TK are you using??
<vzl> better.
<jelkner> neurogeek:  tk8.4 
<jelkner> neurogeek: here is the strange part, on an fresh edubuntu install, this problem does not occur
<jelkner> this system was an august prerelease install that was updated
<jelkner> so there is something that wasn't removed during the upgrades that is causing the problem
<jelkner> i've tried uninstalling and reinstalling tk8.4 several times
<jelkner> but i can't get rid of the problem
<Yagisan> G'day All
<zakame> heya Yagisan 
<neurogeek> jelkner, lets see.. it shouldn't matter because you are using the same packages
<neurogeek> jelkner, sounds you are still missing some deps
<Yagisan> So whats up ? I had a rather nice 3 day weekend, which was finished off with terrorist raids a few suburbs away =-O
<neurogeek> jelkner, or your libraries are way too wrong
<jelkner> neurogeek: so, what can i do?
<bluefrog-10>  hi folks, is that ok if I publish an (U/Edu)buntu management script on edubuntu wiki under the following license? http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/2.5 
<jelkner> i could bite the bullet, and reinstall edubuntu
<neurogeek> not yet.. lets see if we cabn work it out
<jelkner> moving home directories and getting the info i need from /etc/passwd /etc/group /etc/shadow
<jelkner> yes, i would rather not have to reinstall
<neurogeek> jelkner, did you apt-get update??
<jelkner> yes
<jelkner> many, many time, since august
<neurogeek> jelkner, Ok
<jelkner> s/times/time
<neurogeek> i would do this then.. i would download tk source code and idel source code to see if it works... 
<jelkner> hmm... but that would mean i still have a broken tk on the system
<jelkner> which will probably cause other problems in the future
<Yagisan> bluefrog-10: IIRC the wiki already is all covered by http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/2.5/
<jelkner> i'm open to trying to get rid of the current tk in a more complete way (did apt-get remove tk8.4 --purge still leave artifacts that are causing this?)
<jelkner> but i would prefer to reinstall then to try messing around with source installs
<Yagisan> hmm, that reminds me, I need to ask mhz about restoring authorship credits on the wiki
<Burgundavia> Yagisan, what do you mean restore?
<Burgundavia> bluefrog-10, the wiki is currently under an ambigous license, but is most likely the doc team ones. They are GFDL and CC-by-sa 2.0
<Yagisan> Burgundavia: Simply, I wrote a document with my authorship, added stuff from another author that privately mailed me, edited it and fixed some mistakes
<Yagisan> Burgundavia: and stuck it on the wiki, while cleaning up the formating, mhz removed the authorship in favour of a community doc
<neurogeek> jelkner, Ok.. my thoughts were to compile/install tk and idle in a non-standard dir so you could test if thet problems remained in your packages
<Burgundavia> Yagisan, hmm...
<Yagisan> Burgundavia: I wish to speak to him first, then revert the removals (and keep the cleanups)
<Burgundavia> Yagisan, if you mean a page that lists what you have written, your Homepages is great for that
<Burgundavia> any other place is not good
<Yagisan> Burgundavia: No, check history on http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/BootingClientsWithoutPxe
<Burgundavia> Yagisan, we don't put any credits on the wiki
<Burgundavia> so I would have removed them as well
<Yagisan> Burgundavia: hmm, can you point me to policy on that
<Burgundavia> hmm, don't know if we ever wrote it down
<Burgundavia> likely the style guide might mention it
<Yagisan> Burgundavia: I never saw it anywhere, and I would have taken it into consideration
<Burgundavia> the pratical reason we don't do it that a lot of docs have a number of authors
<Burgundavia> plus we avoid the whole "thats my doc" thing
<Yagisan> Burgundavia: Then you have a bad license for the docs.
<Burgundavia> why do you say?
<Burgundavia> the attribution part of CC and the GFDL?
<Burgundavia> it is there, look in the history
<Burgundavia> the license doesn't say you have to identify in the main doc who wrote what, you just have to be able to tell
<Yagisan> Burgundavia: the attribution part can cause confusion. confusion is bad
<Burgundavia> regardless, those are the licenses we release it under
<Yagisan> Burgundavia: I'd rather had been commented out then deleted
<Burgundavia> that just means that editors get to read it, yay
<Burgundavia> Yagisan, I understand where you are coming from but I have to say I don't agree with you
<Yagisan> Burgundavia: That's fine. I just want to discuss the whys, and get it into a formal policy
<Burgundavia> sure, join #ubuntu-dco
<Burgundavia> doc
<Burgundavia> better actually is to write an email to the ubuntu-doc list
<Burgundavia> because I am about to leave for work, so will not able to continue this
<Yagisan> Burgundavia: because, under my understanding of the license, it was broken by deleting the authorship creditsm without substantial changes in content
<Yagisan> Burgundavia: 2:30am here, I'll be in bed soon
<Burgundavia> fire that email and we can talk
<jelkner> neurogeek: thanks for your help... gotta run...
<bluefrog-10> Burgundavia, Yagisan, y for your replys, sry was at school to get my kid...
<JaneW> hi all
<bluefrog-10> hi
<bluefrog-10> have a question for you regarding document licensing on edubuntu wiki if you have time
<bluefrog-10> JaneW, sry the previous sentence is directed to you :)
<jsgotangco> bluefrog-10: try to email the list too
<bluefrog-10> !list
<bluefrog-10> edoo list
<edoo> bluefrog-10: huh?
<JaneW> bluefrog-10: yes
<bluefrog-10> so far doc on edubuntu are under by-sa/2.5
<bluefrog-10> what if i want to publish something under by-nc-sa/2.5?
<JaneW> bluefrog-10: are you wanting to publish your content on our wiki under by-nc-sa/2.5?
<bluefrog-10> JaneW, I'd like to, yes
<JaneW> bluefrog-10:  why would you not want to use  by-sa/2.5?
<bluefrog-10> JaneW, selfishness I presume :), I explain myself...
<bluefrog-10> I am currently unemployed and spending an awful lot of time on that script of mine (I am no programmer to start with but doing my best) and I don't like the idea of someone just taking the script as it is and publishing it in paper for example...
<JaneW> bluefrog-10: script?
<bluefrog-10> JaneW, bash script with menus to ease the installation and management of various programs targeting IT guys and non IT people (teachers...)
<bluefrog-10> JaneW, programs such as Samba-ldap, changing  skeletons depending of grooup membership and so on...
<JaneW> bluefrog-10: we are not actually comfortable with the nc license, and make a point of making all of our content available via GPL and  cc-sa/2.5
<bluefrog-10> JaneW, or maybe I can just create a page with a link to my website or would that be considered as being impolite/misconduct?
<JaneW> bluefrog-10: I would suggest that a good way to handle this would be for you to publish your script (or whathaveyou) on your own site and we can link to it from our wiki.
<JaneW> snap :)
<bluefrog-10> JaneW, ok :)
<bluefrog-10> JaneW, ty for answering
<JaneW> np
<bluefrog-10> JaneW, sry what' the cc-sa for, I don't seem to find it on creative commons page
<vmarks> hi~
<vmarks> mysteriously, my edubuntu machine has stopped booting clients.
<vmarks> yet dhcp is on
<vmarks> any suggestions are welcome
<neurogeek> vmarks, booting clients?? as in thin-clients??
<vmarks> yes
<vmarks> it's a two-nic server also doing thinclient NAT, and both nics are configured, and it worked only a few hours ago.
<neurogeek> vmarks, did you check your ftfp server??
<vmarks> no, I didn't.
<vmarks> earlier I had some thinclients that could get DHCP but didn't find pxelinux.0 to be a valid image file.
<vmarks> since then, I haven't had a thinclient that has worked in the past, working now
<neurogeek> when you boot pxe.. you have to check three things.. DHCP server (dhcp conf), TFTP server and pxelinux.cfg files
<neurogeek> its probably not finding the right configuration for booting up
<vmarks> sure, but the client (known to work
<vmarks> )
<vmarks> doesn't even get a dhcp address
<vmarks> yet dhcp is running.
<bluefrog-10> get rid of the leases
<vmarks> /usr/sbin/dhcpd3 -q -pf /var/run/dhcp3-server/dhcpd.pid -cf /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
<vmarks> stopping and restarting dhcpd hasn't helped.
<neurogeek> vmarks, check your dhcp.conf file.. make sure everything is alright there
<vmarks> looks correct.
<bluefrog-10> don't have anything in the server log about dhcp?
<neurogeek> check logs as bluefrog-10 suggests
<vmarks> bah humbug.
<vmarks> so much for placing this in the science lab this week.
<vmarks> okay, the very bottom of the syslog says no free leases on DHCPDISCOVER.
<vmarks> so, how to unlease those?
<bluefrog-10> as for tftp, I assume that ltsp files are /var/lib/tftpboot/ (or something similar) and not in /tftpboot/lts. If this is the case delete the all dir /tftpboot/lts
<vmarks> and, what setting to change in order to prevent this in the future?
<bluefrog-10> rm dhcpd.leases
<bluefrog-10> in dhcp.conf try to lower the lease release
<bluefrog-10> after erasing dhcpd.leases you might have to restart dhcpd
<vmarks> dhcp.conf or dhcpd.conf?
<bluefrog-10> the one used by edubuntu, hang on having a look
<bluefrog-10> must be /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
<vmarks> I see no mention of leases, only the range.
<bluefrog-10> add some
<vmarks> 192.168.0.20 192.168.0.250
<bluefrog-10> default-lease-time 600;
<bluefrog-10> max-lease-time 7200;
<bluefrog-10> and see what it does with that
<bluefrog-10> if still not good, lower them
<vmarks> those belong inside the { } with all the other options?
<vmarks> and they don't need to be prefaced by the word 'options' ?
<bluefrog-10> add them at the beginning of the file
<bluefrog-10> underneath authoritative;
<vmarks> inside or outside the { }?
<bluefrog-10> outside just underneath authoritative;
<bluefrog-10> and don't forget to erase  the .leases file
<vmarks> thank you
<vmarks> it's working better now since the leases have been deleted.
<bluefrog-10> sur
<vmarks> hopefully adding those lines will help too
<vmarks> what could be wrong that some old clients using etherboot wouldn't like the pxelinux.0?
<bluefrog-10> if your clients are booting very often you may have to lower the release time
<bluefrog-10> not sure if the pxelinux.0 is the file needed to boot ehterboot client
<bluefrog-10> in my mind shouold be more a vmlinuz file but I don't know how ogra made his stuff regarding that
<bluefrog-10> ogra's the man for you on that one I think 
<vmarks> thank you
<bluefrog-10> u're welcome
<vmarks> that's one step I have to have in place- there are various compaqs and dells in the science lab all with etherboot on them
<vmarks> I'd like to reuse them since they've booted k12ltsp in the past without issue
<vmarks> on ancient fedore core1
<vmarks> (shudder)
<bluefrog-10> hang on got something for you
<bluefrog-10> http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/BootingClientsWithoutPxe
<vmarks> I wonder if there's a way to have both working, pxe and non?
<bluefrog-10> sure no problem
<bluefrog-10> after a quick look at the link i sent u, it seems that both are using same pxelinux.0 file
<bluefrog-10> certainly because of the PXELOADER_KEEP_ALL option used to generate the boot floppy
<bluefrog-10> as for K12 i think u're out of luck
<bluefrog-10> cause K12 is keeping 2 different files. one for pxe the other one for etherboot
<bluefrog-10> I think...
<bluefrog-10> well apparently there is a vmlinuz file in /var/lib/tftpboot
<bluefrog-10> so i guess you should try your K12 floppies
<bluefrog-10> you will have to add some stuff in your dhcpd.conf though
<bluefrog-10> still with me vmarks ?
<vincenzio> vmarks is going to have to pick this up tomorrow
<vincenzio> thanks again bluefrog-10
<\sh> btw...
<\sh> guys...if anyone needs cds..and does not fear to pay a bit for it...
<\sh> http://www.linuxshop.de/shop/catalog/index.php?cPath=70&osCsid=2da56936675293cbc3cc8eee6e01c575
<\sh> aehm
<\sh> this is better http://www.linuxshop.de/shop/catalog/index.php?cPath=70
<signifer123> i thoguht you offered free ones?
<\sh> signifer123: i don't offer at all..
<\sh> signifer123: but it
<\sh> 's an efford from an kubuntu guy
<signifer123> ohh
<signifer123> edubuntu hold develpment meetings?
<signifer123> and do you guys a have a forum?
<\sh> http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuCommunity
<signifer123> ok so no forum jsut a mialing list?
<cafuego_> I get "Mounting /root/dev on /dev/.static/dev failed: No such file or directory" (default edubuntu install). /root/dev does indeed not exist. Am I missing some kernel parameter perhaps?
<cafuego_> ... and the NFS server never gets as much as a single mount request.
#edubuntu 2006-11-06
<sbalneav> Evening all
<cbx33> mornin all
<highvoltage> morning cbx33 
<cbx33> highvoltage: hey
<highvoltage> howzit going?
<cbx33> got a problem at the mo :( - apt-get remove nvidia-glx tries to remove ubuntu-desktop and the entire set of xorg pacakges
<cbx33> other than that...
<cbx33> my office is a mess
<highvoltage> heh
<highvoltage> well, last night I couldn't sleep, I got a big bunch of exciting ideas and couldn't stop thinking about them.
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> that's gotta be good
<highvoltage> only got to sleep 1am, then woke up at 2am and got more ideas.
<highvoltage> eventually got to sleep 4am again
<cbx33> my initial musings with gstreamer are working well
<highvoltage> and when I woke up, I totally forgot what kept me up last night.
<cbx33> so you forgot all your ideas?
<highvoltage> yes :(
<highvoltage> i remember thinking up huge amounts of code in my head too, and even troubleshooting it :)
<highvoltage> my new policy is that if I get inspiration late in the evening, I'm going to work instead, not try to sleep.
<highvoltage> because now I've lost a nights sleep, and I'll be useless during most of today- double loss. I should've worked instead and slept late this morning.
<cbx33> awww
<highvoltage> at least my office space is clean for a change :)
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> yeh I really gotta sort that today
<cbx33> highvoltage: you don;t have any nvidia machines handy do you?
<pygi> wb cbx33 ;)
<JonathanFerguson> I've got a problem with sqlite, enenthough there isn't sqlite per se, in 6.06.1
<JonathanFerguson> The program I run under Mono, has it's own sqlite in it.
<JonathanFerguson> Can Edubuntu be confusing sqlite for sqlsharp?
<pygi> JonathanFerguson: no :)
<JonathanFerguson> The alternative is to use MySQL, but it's been very painful, unlike version 5 under Apple 10.3.2 which was straight forward.
<cbx33> do I see that the SCP spec is being discuss today or has already been discussed
<cbx33> if it's already been discussed I'll throw a hissy fit ;)
<highvoltage> oh dear.
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> http://people.ubuntu.com/~mdz/uds-mtv/2006-11-05/
<cbx33> is a little misleading
<[118] Gatekeeper> hi 
<[118] Gatekeeper> can someone answer some questens about edubunto 
<cbx33> we can try
<[118] Gatekeeper> i have get a pc from a customer 
<[118] Gatekeeper> he say install edubunto 
<[118] Gatekeeper> so i insert the cd a bott 
<[118] Gatekeeper> and boot 
<[118] Gatekeeper> bot after loading kernel and initrd the system hangup 
<edubuntugirl> [118] Gatekeeper: excuse me?
<[118] Gatekeeper> yes ?
<Kamping_Kaiser> any errors?
<[118] Gatekeeper> yes 
<[118] Gatekeeper> the pc acer aspire E500
<cbx33> is there no disk activity at all
<[118] Gatekeeper> http://acer.de/acereuro/page9.do?sp=page4&dau34.oid=11670&UserCtxParam=0&GroupCtxParam=0&dctx1=9&CountryISOCtxParam=DE&LanguageISOCtxParam=de&ctx3=-1&ctx4=Deutschland&crc=2231436766
<[118] Gatekeeper> ne 
<[118] Gatekeeper> nothig 
<[118] Gatekeeper> i have 2 disks: ubunto server; knoppix 5
<[118] Gatekeeper> i have 2 disks: ubunto server; knoppix 4
<[118] Gatekeeper> the customer dont give me the root passwd, so i have started with knoppix and chroot to primary disk and than passwd to change rott password 
<cbx33> ok
<[118] Gatekeeper> and now the system hang up @ boot 
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> does it use grub?
<[118] Gatekeeper> yes 
<cbx33> what version of edubuntu is it?
<[118] Gatekeeper> mom i will start with knoppix and have a look @ the release file 
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> ok you could try starting the machine
<cbx33> and at the grub prompt, edit the grub kernel line and remove splash
<cbx33> it's all done with keys..... e to edit
<cbx33> etc 
<cbx33> and it's all documented in grub if you've never done it before
<[118] Gatekeeper> okay i am wrong 
<[118] Gatekeeper> grub is installt but i cant insert something in the command line cause the time is 0
<[118] Gatekeeper> now i can see: the edubunto logo
<[118] Gatekeeper> Loading essentiel drivvers .... OK
<[118] Gatekeeper> mounting root filesystem .... <HANG UP>
<cbx33> it does sit there for a while
<cbx33> give it time
<[118] Gatekeeper> okay 
<[118] Gatekeeper> "/dev/sda1 = 310 GB
<[118] Gatekeeper> ext3
<cbx33> ok
<[118] Gatekeeper> there is no hdd act.
<cbx33> act?
<[118] Gatekeeper> activity
<cbx33> ah...
<cbx33> hmm...
<cbx33> that is odd
<[118] Gatekeeper> jo
<cbx33> I've had it take a few minutes before
<cbx33> but never that long
<[118] Gatekeeper> can i hide the splash wit <tab> or <esc>
<[118] Gatekeeper> *still waiting 
<cbx33> hmmm
<[118] Gatekeeper> *kick
<cbx33> yeh I think we've established a problem here ;)
<cbx33> the trick is going to be finding what's wrong
<cbx33> what about rebooting...bott with knoppix mount the drive and look for a ny logs
<[118] Gatekeeper> okay 
<[118] Gatekeeper> its edubunto = ubuntu 6.06 dapper
<[118] Gatekeeper> i can found the last clear shutdown only in the logs
<[118] Gatekeeper> i changed same valuse in /boot/grub/menu.list 
<[118] Gatekeeper> i changed some values in /boot/grub/menu.list 
<[118] Gatekeeper> do i nedd grub-install or tkes effect at next startup 
<[118] Gatekeeper> i have disabled the usb 
<[118] Gatekeeper> now the system is up 
<cbx33> yikes....am I still here?
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol
<highvoltage> indeed.
* Kamping_Kaiser hugs edubuntugirl highvoltage and cbx33 
<cbx33> excellent
<cbx33> sorry just changed proxy servers and back
* cbx33 hugs Kamping_Kaiser highvoltage and edubuntugirl 
<Kamping_Kaiser> :)
<[118] Gatekeeper> @cbx33 i have disabled the usb 
<[118] Gatekeeper> i have disabled the usb 
<cbx33> anything?
<[118] Gatekeeper> now the system is up
<cbx33> wow
<cbx33> what did the ogs say
<cbx33> logs
<[118] Gatekeeper> system hung up when start ohci host contoller 
<cbx33> ahhh
<cbx33> well at least you know
<[118] Gatekeeper> nice ^^
<[118] Gatekeeper> how can i tell edubuntu to leech fiels (apt-get install g++) freom the internet 
<[118] Gatekeeper> he try to use the cd 
<Kamping_Kaiser> system -> administration -> software propreties
<[118] Gatekeeper> but cd ist everywhere in hamburg 
<[118] Gatekeeper> there is a password required 
<[118] Gatekeeper> root password ?
<Kamping_Kaiser> no. admin
<Kamping_Kaiser> your password
<[118] Gatekeeper> it doesent work 
<[118] Gatekeeper> okay can i try passwd admin ?
<Kamping_Kaiser> try with the password you made during install
<[118] Gatekeeper> i dont istall this system :(
<[118] Gatekeeper> dont have instaled 
<Kamping_Kaiser> huh?
<[118] Gatekeeper> i am administrator in a small company 
<[118] Gatekeeper> a customer comes to me and ask for help 
<cbx33> I thought you chrooted and changed the password?
<cbx33> oh btw
<cbx33> there is no root password on a default ubuntu install
<[118] Gatekeeper> yes but not for "admin"
<cbx33> the account is locked out
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> well
<cbx33> it depends what user they created first
<cbx33> you still on knoppix?
<[118] Gatekeeper> no dapperdrake
<cbx33> but you can't login right
<cbx33> ?
<[118] Gatekeeper> yes
<cbx33> boot up off the knoppix cd 
<cbx33> then you can see what the user name was that was created
<kihai> Hi there! I'm having a small problem after upgrading from dapper to edgy. The packages acpid, acpi-support and edubuntu-desktop are somehow wrongly configured. When I try to dpkg-reconfigure one of them, I get an error saying acpid is not nocfigured correctly. Apart from that the current kernel doesn't seem to be installed . uname -a gives me: Linux edubuntu 2.6.15-27-386 #1 PREEMPT Sat Sep 16 01:51:59 UTC 2006 i686 GNU/Linux Anyone any ideas on how to fix 
<Kamping_Kaiser> kihai, has your upgrade finished?
<kihai> Yes, but with errors. Everything boots up and there don't seem to be any problems, even the ltsp works (Though it's not yet updated) and 15 clients boot happily from the updated server
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> are you loggin into the server
<cbx33> or via a client?
<kihai> What about reinvoking the update-manager? Could that help or shouldn't I bother?
<cbx33> have you rebooted?
<kihai> yes
<cbx33> surely you should have a 17.10 kernel
<Kamping_Kaiser> kihai, have you run `sudo apt-get install edubuntu-desktop`?
<kihai> edubuntu-desktop is already installed. I uninstalled it because of the dependency conflict with acpid
<cbx33> how did you upgrade?
<cbx33> with update manager?
<kihai> yes, update-manager -c
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> try update-manager -c -d
<[118] Gatekeeper> problem sovlved 
<[118] Gatekeeper> the "use-the-right-password-botton"
<kihai> update-manager -c -d tells me my system is up to date... :(
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> tried an apt-get install --reinstall ?
<kihai> yes, doesn't help though...
<Kamping_Kaiser> having removed edubuntu-desktop have you reinstlaled it?
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> what about a manual install of the latest kernel?
<Kamping_Kaiser> wont unbreak him
<kihai> edubuntu-desktop is dependent on acpi-support, acpi-support depends on acpid and acpid can't be reinstalled nor reconfigured...
<Kamping_Kaiser> why cant it?
<Kamping_Kaiser> whats the error?
<cbx33> Kamping_Kaiser: you sure it can't confiugre it cos the latest kernel isn't available?
<cbx33> seeing as acpi relies heavily on kernel?
<cbx33> I'm not sure
<kihai> The error comes from dpkg and it leaves the packages unconfigured
<cbx33> does it givce any more info
<Kamping_Kaiser> kihai, dpkg -i /var/cache/apt/archives/acpi*deb
<kihai> dpkg: Abhngigkeitsprobleme verhindern Konfiguration von acpi-support:
<kihai>  acpi-support hngt ab von acpid (>= 1.0.4-1ubuntu4); aber:
<kihai>   Package acpid is not configured yet.
<Kamping_Kaiser> so install the failing package on its own.
<kihai> It's already installed.
<Kamping_Kaiser> whats apt-cache policy acpid give?
<kihai> just not configured and dpkg-reconfigure acpid brings the same errors about dependencies
<kihai> acpid:
<kihai>   Installiert:1.0.4-5ubuntu4
<kihai>   Mgliche Pakete:1.0.4-5ubuntu4
<kihai>   Versions-Tabelle:
<kihai>  *** 1.0.4-5ubuntu4 0
<kihai>         500 http://de.archive.ubuntu.com edgy/main Packages
<kihai>         100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
<Kamping_Kaiser> ok. sudo dpkg --configure --pending
<kihai> same errors...
<Kamping_Kaiser> drat. its my bedtime. did it configure anything?
<Kamping_Kaiser> also give `sudo apt-get -f install` a whirl. it should try and fix the install for you (to the best it can)
<kihai> just like that or sudo apt-get -f install edubuntu-desktop ?
<cbx33> just sudo apt-get -f install
<kihai> It showed a lot of unmet dependencies and at the end the same three errors about acpid, acpi-support and edubuntu-desktop appeared...
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> can you possibly sort of the unmet deps?
* Kamping_Kaiser goes to bed. sorry, its midnight, and i need to be up at 8. wish i could have stayed and helped :(
<SimonAnibal> it's 8:30 AM, wake up!
* cbx33 is gonna be dashing off too, but onyl for a short while
<cbx33> 13:30 here ;)
<SimonAnibal> :)
<kihai> Hmm, now I tried dpkg-reconfigure --force acpid. It said: Stopping ACPI services, Loading ACPI Modules, Starting ACPI services, all with [OK] , but aptitude -f install after that brings the same error about acpid not being configured
<cbx33> argh
<cbx33> i hate it when this happens
<cbx33> I'll bbiab
<bddebian> Heya
<highvoltage> *sigh*. they broke into my car again today :(
* pygi dances around
* pygi pokes highvoltage to look into -burning ^_^
<jsgotangco> ?
<pygi> jsgotangco: what? :)
<jsgotangco> :P
<pygi> libburn can now burn first session, hehe :)
<jsgotangco> ohhh
<pygi> I know it means nothing to you, but oh well :P
<jsgotangco> burn first session
<jsgotangco> do you mean multisession cd?
<pygi> yup
* jsgotangco sorry for his non-techie knowledge
<pygi> don't worry :)
<jsgotangco> i gotta sleep
<jsgotangco> will catch up later
<pygi> night
<cbx33> ogra, hi dude
<cbx33> am I right in thinking that there is an SCP meeting in about 5 and a half hours
<pygi> scp?!
<pygi> ah, student control panel
<cbx33> yeh...the spec 
<cbx33> hence why I did it in capitols ;)
<ogra> thats only a drafting session, we had our discussions yesterday ...
<cbx33> argh that's what I thought
<cbx33> damn
<cbx33> there was no schedule on the wiki yesterday
<cbx33> I checked
<cbx33> the dates on the schedule are very misleading
<cbx33> how did it go?
<ogra> the schedule was there
<cbx33> well I couldn;'t see it
<ogra> it went nicely ... a bunch of stuff will be added ... wait for my wiki edit ... i have to collect all the notes first (thats what the drafting session is for)
<cbx33> I kept checking up till about 4pm my time
<cbx33> ok 
<cbx33> is it worth me being present togniht/today
<ogra> well, we start at 5pm your time  (which is about 8am here)
<cbx33> yeh.....I had to go out....unfortunately
<cbx33> so I am really sorry
<ogra> but the schedule for yesterday was generated a day in advance
<cbx33> but it wasn't present on the wiki
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> what time is todays drafting session...and would you like me to be present?
<ogra> not needed, its only me sitting in a corner and adding the notes from the discussion to the wiki
<cbx33> http://people.ubuntu.com/~mdz/uds-mtv/2006-11-05/ - the title in one place says 06 and in another 05
<cbx33> so I missed out then
<ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~mdz/uds-mtv/ is the right link ....
<ogra> the daily schedules will show up there 
<cbx33> yeh and taht links to that page
<cbx33> if you see the title it's wrong
<cbx33> well the H1 tag
<cbx33> well....I'm really sorry nd majorly dissapointed - I really wanted to attend
<cbx33> but i guess it can't be helped
<cbx33> too late now any way
<cbx33> was my drafted spec ok?
<ogra> we went over it quickly ... there is not really a need to spec ui beautification and bugfixes, so that part will boil down to the vnc part
<ogra> - multiple server control
<ogra> - filter functionallity of the userlist 
<ogra> - forced filter per teacher
<ogra> - sharing screen -> exec vnc on the clients desktop connected to your session
<ogra> - mini vnc preview in teh userlist 
<ogra> - tiled vnc overview of the complete class on demand
<cbx33> I'm looking forward to your updates to the wiki
<ogra> is waht i will add today ...
<cbx33> nice
<cbx33> who is implementing?
<ogra> doesnt matter yet
<ogra> for now only the spec is important ...
<cbx33> I was just curious whether anyone else had tipped their hats towards it
<cbx33> brb
<cbx33> back
<pygi> Seveas: got a question for you :)
<theresa> hello everyone! i have a problem, I downloaded the Live CD of 6.10 today and burned the image and when i booted it i got the following error "I/O error: Error reading boot cd"
<pygi> your hardware is ok theresa ? :)
<theresa> pygi: yes it is, because my dad tried it at his pc at work as well
<tideline> theresa: did you check MD5 after downloading?
<theresa> nope, how do I do that? I've still got the iso that I downloaded
<tideline> I take for granted you are using windows to download?
<theresa> yes
<theresa> well, I'm on Kubuntu now, but the iso was downloaded from a windows machine
<tideline> if you have the iso on the kubuntu box you can check it with the md5sum command - md5sum -c filename
<tideline> iirc
<theresa> tideline: thank you very much, I'll give it a try
<tideline> there should be a md5sums file you could download from a mirror that will have the value you should be getting for compairson
<tideline> theresa: no problem let us know if you need more help
<theresa> hmmm i've cd'd into the directory where I downloaded the MD5SUM file and where the edubuntu iso exists...but it says md5sum: command: No such file or directory
<tideline> theresa: are you on a live cd machine or an install
<Seveas> pygi, mail is better for that these days, I'm at uds
<pygi> Seveas: oki, just wanted simple question :)
<bddebian> pygi: Did you get my e-mail?
<theresa> tideline: i have kubuntu installed here.....
<theresa> tideline: runs smoothly since 3 months....
<pygi> bddebian: yup, but haven't got the time to look yet, thank you very much :)
<bddebian> NP
<tideline> theresa: odd - have you install the build-essentials package?
<tideline> i dont know if you need that though
<tideline> i would think that md5sum would be a normal part of the distro
<highvoltage> it is
<pygi> yay, highvoltage ^_^
<highvoltage> :)
<pygi> highvoltage: can you read -burning about news ? ^_^
<pygi> also write some blog post, nothing important tho on planet :)
* highvoltage switches to burning
<tideline> theresa: did you try it with the -c like I said - if so try it without
<pygi> highvoltage: about the multi session stuff :P
<theresa> my iso cd contains the following stuff: isolinux / casper / install / ubuntu / pics / .disk / preseed / dists / pool / md5sum.txt / README / cdromupgrade
<tideline> theresa: wait - cd into the directory where the iso is stored, not the iso itseld
<theresa> tideline: what do you mean where it is stored? i have the .iso currently on my desktop and the burned iso image in my cd drive
<tideline> ok so cd to your desktop cd ~/Desktop
<theresa> ok
<tideline> now at the command prompt typr md5sum filename - where filename is the name of the iso
<theresa> takes a while
<tideline> yup
<theresa> hmm they're both different :(
<tideline> so the md5 from the command and the one in the md5sums file are not the same - that means the hash has changes so the iso is not good.  You should probably download another copy and try it.
<theresa> hmm ok, maybe from another server as well?
<tideline> couldn't hurt
<theresa> tideline: thanks for all your help and effort!
<cbx33> hey RichEd 
<RichEd> mr savage ... how are ?
<cbx33> good good
<cbx33> you
<bronze> cbx has a tan?
<bronze> re: cbx|savage http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doc_Savage
<cbx33> hehehe
<stgraber> RichEd: Are you in room 210 ?
<stgraber> Looks like there is nobody in this room (at least on VOIP)
<stgraber> hmm, fixed now, fine
<pygi> sbalneav: hey
<sbalneav> Hello pygi
<grahamldlw> cbx33 u there?
<cbx33> yup
<grahamldlw> how can i run and compile pascal code on here?
<grahamldlw> i downloaded some gpc thing and it hasnt done anything and i cant find it or anything
<cbx33> you need to run
<cbx33> in a terminal window
<cbx33> gpc pascalfile -o outputfile
<grahamldlw> i tried it i cant get it to, i have the source code minus the wincrt on my desktop
<grahamldlw> huh?
<grahamldlw> i'd type that in on the terminal?
<grahamldlw> ok i get that now, is there anyway to get a seperate program on linux that dosent do it in the termianl
<cbx33> nope
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> ...oh you coud always write one
<cbx33> ;)
<grahamldlw> ha..yeh, i've finished a naughts and crosses game for pascal, and i wanted to play it :( lol, doing visual basic next
<grahamldlw> and we finished doing arrays, she was gonna show me how to do 2D arrays whatever that is but i was concentrating too much, im first in class to finish naughts and crosses and we started it this morning
<cbx33> coool
<cbx33> oh btw M$ have dropped support for some of VB
<cbx33> heheh
<grahamldlw> hu has?
<grahamldlw> microsoft?
<cbx33> microsfot
<grahamldlw> im not using microsoft products so im sure thats not a problem lol
<grahamldlw> syntax error and it wont run :(
<cbx33> hehe
<grahamldlw> maybe i shud learn python next considering i've now learnt a full/ish programming language
<grahamldlw> anyway im going adios
<theresa> my heart beats for edubuntu :D
<cbx33> ahh
<cbx33> awww
<cbx33> hehe
<pygi> theresa: ^_^
<nixternal> mine beats for KDE, but it pumps Edubuntu blood ;)
<stgraber> nixternal: ping
<nixternal> fdjlajfldsajlj$*#@)($)@
<nixternal> ok
<nixternal> yo yo
<stgraber> can you join 5000, I just want to be sure that I don't do any noise (My laptop microphone is buggy, so I use a dummy input)
<nixternal> sure
<nixternal> i hear some ticking
<stgraber> and now ?
<nixternal> it stopped
<nixternal> i hear the popping and crackling, but very faint
<cbx33> echo cancellation ;)
<cbx33> that was annyoing mine
<stgraber> I really have the worst laptop soundcard :)
<stgraber> I can use my microphone input but only during 5 minutes
<stgraber> after that the sounds enter something like a loop and I have to restart the driver (stop X, reload it and start X)
<stgraber> really annoying :)
<stgraber> the only way I have found, is to use dummy as the input and then I got no crash (but no mic :( )
<stgraber> nixternal: thx
<nixternal> no prob
* stgraber hopes alsa-devel guys will found how to fix this annoying sound card stuff
<theresa> pygi: i simply love it....but again I fear that at the moment it's only suited for kids below 10 years....
<stgraber> Anyone of you tried one of these USB soundcard (or headset) ?
<pygi> theresa: will be there, don't worry for all the rest
<pygi> theresa: and if you know how, you can customize for needs of older children
<theresa> pygi: cool :)
<theresa> pygi: hehe, that's it....I'm a noob when it comes to writing programs...
<pygi> theresa: no, no writing programs :) Just installing different set of software
<theresa> i've found these links.... edu.kde.org and http://www.gnomefiles.org/subcategory.php?sub_cat_id=49 seems to be the only edu-programs so far?!
<pygi> edu.kde.org is KDEedu, we have that ^_^
<pygi> theresa: there are no a LOT of edu apps, that much is true
<theresa> hehe ok, i'm relieved, i just need to find them haha ;)
<pygi> theresa: don't use some random thingies :)
<pygi> Feel free to explore synaptic
<theresa> i much rather prefer adept instead of synpatic ;) it's the same basically, isn't it?
<theresa> but if it's necessary, i'll use synpatic as well :)
<pygi> use adept if you really like it :P
<cbx33> hey Fujitsu 
<Fujitsu> Hi cbx33.
#edubuntu 2006-11-07
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<bddebian> Heya gang
<juantao> Hello. Do you know of any application that would help a spanish speaker learn english ?
<juantao> ESL /GPL
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: tell ogra glad to see that the 2nd cd as repo is kind of panning out :)
<edubuntugirl> Righto, highvoltage!
<ulinskie> j #iosn
<ulinskie> shit heheh
<ulinskie> sowwy
<kihai> Hi guys. I need some help here: After upgrading to edgy with update-manager I got a faulty ltsp installation. sudo ltsp-build-client gave me: perl: warning: Falling back to the standard locale ("C").
<kihai> Leaving `diversion of /etc/mtab to /etc/mtab.real by ltsp-client'
<kihai> `/opt/ltsp/i386/etc/apt/sources.list' -> `/opt/ltsp/i386/etc/apt/sources.list.old'
<kihai> ln: creating symbolic link `/dev/fd' to `/proc/self/fd': File exists
<kihai> error: LTSP client installation ended abnormally
<kihai> Any help on this?
<Burgundavia> kihai: I would try back later
<Burgundavia> all of our LTSP experts are currently at the developer summit, and it is 1am there
<kihai> I'm having a lot of people waiting for the clients to work again....
<Burgundavia> right
<kihai> hmm, looks like bad luck then... :)
<Burgundavia> try the mailing list
<Burgundavia> sorry I cannot be more help
<kihai> OK, I'll try to update the ltsp chroot again and if that doesn't work I will delete it and try to build it again. Does anyone know if the packages downloaded by ltsp-build-client will be saved so that I don't have to down them again?
<Kamping_Kaiser> afaik not
<Kamping_Kaiser> but maybe they are saved in the chroot
<kihai> Just tried it. They don't get saved. I'll have to download them again...
<Kamping_Kaiser> :(
<cbx33> anyone had any experience opening power supplies
<cbx33> I have one with no screws
<cbx33> and can't get it to open
<Kamping_Kaiser> never seen one with no screws
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> well this one has no screws not even under stickey labels
<Kamping_Kaiser> cool. wish i could break it
<kihai> Can anyone help me with this error message from update-notifier: Error: Opening the cache (E:Could not open file /var/lib/apt/lists/de.archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_edgy-updates_Release -open (13 Permission denied), E: the package lists or status file could not be parsed or opened.)
<kihai> When I open Synaptic, I don't see any errors or broken packages, though
<Kamping_Kaiser> hm.
<Kamping_Kaiser> i'm not sure.
<kihai> ...and the ltsp-build-client failed, too, somehow. There'S an error about locale settings and it says that pxe is not configured. First the clients could find an operating system, then I changed the path of the linux image in /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf. Now the clients boot up until the graphic bootscreen but then I get a lot of "syslogd: /var/log/... read only filesystem" errors...
<Kamping_Kaiser> kihai, do you have 'ltsp-server' isntalled?
<kihai> yes
<kihai> I had edubuntu dapper with a working ltsp and did the upgrade to edgy. Then I deleted the chroot tree and rebuilt it again, but that failed because of the wrong locale settings
* Kamping_Kaiser hasnt used edgy i'm afraid
* cbx33 is on edgy...
<cbx33> but i did a fresh install
<kihai> I guess when this attempt fails as well, I'll do a clean install, too. It should be OK to just copy the home dirs and the passwd, group and shadow, shouldn't it?
<cbx33> hey LaserJock 
<kihai> Hi again! I hope someone can help me on this: After upgrading to edgy update-notifier tells me: Error: Opening the cache (Could not open file /var/lib/apt/lists/de.archive...edgy_Release - open(13: Permission denied) The package lists or status file could not be parsed or opened. 
<kihai> Is there a way to reinstall those apparently broken packages?
<kihai> I tried to rename the file, but after  a while update-notifier gave me the same error
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> I really don't have much of a clue there
<LaserJock> have you tried using a different mirror?
<kihai> Yes, but to no avail...
<aze> hi all
<theresa> the "gettingstarted" link on the edubuntu wiki doesn't work.... http://proto.edubuntu.org/gettingstarted
* willvdl wonders what the proto subdomain is
<willvdl> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/GettingStarted
<willvdl> woops wait a sec
<highvoltage> proto.edubuntu.org is where the current website lived for a while
<highvoltage> the wiki pages is in seious need of update :)
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<jsgotangco> hey
<highvoltage> hey mr gotangco
<willvdl> where is the gettingstarted node?
* willvdl scratches head
* highvoltage checks for willvdl 
* jsgotangco shows highvoltage his shiny new USA call-in number courtesy of work as well as 1c/minute calls to US mainland
<jsgotangco> wehehehe
<highvoltage> willvdl: http://www.edubuntu.org/GettingStarted
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: wow
<jsgotangco> ive been saying that for 2 days already
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: sorry, haven't been listening
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: i meant "wow"
<jsgotangco> hehe
<willvdl> ah www, not wiki
* jsgotangco checks rate to ZA
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: aaah :)
<willvdl> highvoltage, familiar with autopackage?
<jsgotangco> willvdl: yuck?
<highvoltage> willvdl: nope
<willvdl> yuck? why?
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: google autopackage
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: wow its 0.07/minute on landline
<edubuntugirl> highvoltage: Google found 'Autopackage : Easy Linux Software Installation', at http://autopackage.org/
* willvdl is trying to determine best build process to advocate for content providers
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: but 0.23 for mobile jeezz
<willvdl> jsgotangco, what service is this?
<willvdl> sounds neat
<jsgotangco> sipphone
<highvoltage> autopackage doesn't seem to use dpkg as a backend :-/
<jsgotangco> nahh
<jsgotangco> its a bunch of bash scripts
<jsgotangco> but autopackage seems to get the favour of some upstream projects
<highvoltage> willvdl: I would suggest taking a look at the ubuntu packaging guide, and then using a debian package with gdebi or something similar
<willvdl> this is why I am curious
<highvoltage> willvdl: I'm currently working on a tool called 2-Pack, which will be a gdebi-like tool for .deb files
<willvdl> highvoltage, looking into this after our last discussion
<jsgotangco> willvdl: well for content providers who do not want to be package specific, autopackage seems to be a nice sell
<jsgotangco> since it will basically work on any distro
<highvoltage> willvdl: I'll send you a tuxlab cd next week, you could get it off the disc and investigate if you want
<willvdl> awesome
<highvoltage> you can then get the latest xola, j-zee and 2pack from there
<willvdl> excellent
<willvdl> j-zee?
<jsgotangco> willvdl: but its been criticised to be a bit of a mess and installing stuff where its not supposed to
<highvoltage> j-zee tracks software usage, and makes sure that kids can only run one instance of gcompris, ktuberling, etc at a time
<willvdl> jsgotangco, hmmm, I'm tempted to tell people to produce rpm and dev and leave it there
<highvoltage> j-zee is just a wrapper
<highvoltage> but it works well.
<willvdl> highvoltage, nice
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: that's pretty neat
<willvdl> can see where that's going
<willvdl> all yours? or are you working on it with someone
<jsgotangco> willvdl: ive used it, it looks nice, but i dunno if its clean
<willvdl> jsgotangco, you mean autopackage no doubt
<jsgotangco> willvdl: yes
<highvoltage> willvdl: at the moment just me, there's some other stuff I'm working on too, but I'll open it up to wider people soon to get wider testing/feedback/contributions
<jsgotangco> like i said, some upstream projects who do not want to do specific pckages seem to like it
<willvdl> the "Smart" board people are working on linux support
<willvdl> http://www.smarttech.com/support/software/linux.asp
<willvdl> which is where I saw it
<jsgotangco> yeah
<jsgotangco> even Xara has an autopackage listed
<willvdl> highvoltage, that's something I'd like to play with too (if there's ever time)
<willvdl> hmm, food for thought
<highvoltage> cool. does the schools you work with have smartboards?
<highvoltage> btw, anyone know if a quad-opteron machine will work with a 686-smp kernel?
<willvdl> highvoltage, smart are on of the consortium members
<willvdl> they're on HP, Cisco and M$ consortiums
<highvoltage> aaah
<willvdl> but have really done only a bit on NEPAD
<willvdl> they supplied Khanya
<willvdl> highvoltage, I thought the 686 kernel had smp built in? 
<highvoltage> willvdl: it does
<highvoltage> willvdl: but will it support all the cores in an AMD?
<willvdl> why would there be a 686-smp kernel as well then?
<highvoltage> oh, there isn't :)
<highvoltage> the -generic kernel /is/ the 686-smp kernel :)
<willvdl> ah...sigh, only ever had a K6 to play with
<highvoltage> I could've just said the -generic kernel, but I'm being explicit
<willvdl> that noisy thing that used to sit on my tsf desk
<highvoltage> because 686 will work on it, but I'd like to know if I can use all cores without installing a special kernel for it
* highvoltage asks on ubunu-kernel
<highvoltage> willvdl: aaah
<willvdl> ask Jason
<willvdl> I think he has one
<highvoltage> willvdl: I'm interested in quad opteron servers for the schools, they should perform quite well as ltsp servers
<highvoltage> I had a K6 *ages* ago. It felt so fast the day I bought it... that was probably the one chip I owned that got obsolete the fastest.
<highvoltage> (not like my 386 that I used for 5 years)
<willvdl> the Sun machines he was given for freedom toaster I think have quad opterons
<willvdl> what's the cost benefit like?
<willvdl> sorry K7
<highvoltage> I think those that jason has are dual opterons
<willvdl> hmm, probably
<highvoltage> willvdl: I haven't looked at the prices yet, but apparently they are coming down fast, I think they're still slightly more expensive than the Intel servers we use
<highvoltage> but the performance should be remarkably better.
<highvoltage> (if you can use all the cpus/cores properly)
<willvdl> as long as they can handle the environment... heat etc.
<willvdl> how many seats you want to drive off of it?
<highvoltage> this isn't for a specific project, I'm just wondering, I actually need to buy myself a new machine and I thought of getting a quad-opteron to play with, and then investigate it as our new standard server
<kihai> Could anybody help me? I just made a fresh edgy edubuntu install and after I booted the first client, the next one doesn't receive a dhcp offer, although the dhcp server is running
<bddebian> Heya
<aze> hey you
<stgraber> nixternal: ping
<nixternal> pongers
<stgraber> can you come on 5000 ? I just bought an USB headset and I absolutely don't know if my mic volume is correct
<nixternal> lemme boot up my voip box
<nixternal> ok, it says im connected to 5000
<migi> hello
<stgraber> ok
<nixternal> talk
<nixternal> i can hear you, you need to tweak some settings..it sounds like a lot of bass, or echo yes
<nixternal> still some echo
<stgraber> ok, I hope that's cause of the room I'm currently in, it's a quite small room
<nixternal> i wish there was a way that you could mute and umute when you use the mic
<nixternal> stgraber: thats exactly what it sounded like..like you were in a small room
<nixternal> maybe move the mic closer to you?
<nixternal> big difference
<stgraber> I'm in my room, with a lot more space :)
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> does that mic have a mute button on it?
<stgraber> no, only a volume changer thing that doesn't work :)
<nixternal> hehe
<stgraber> and a led that's flickering all the time (ugly blue led)
<nixternal> it seems whenever there is an open mic on the network, there is a crackling sound
<nixternal> blue is not ugly ;)
<stgraber> mine is muted
<nixternal> you disconnected
<nixternal> you are back
<stgraber> yes
<stgraber> still these crackling sounds ?
<nixternal> nope
<stgraber> and now ?
<nixternal> nope
<nixternal> i don't hear anything
<nixternal> a very slight high pitched sound, but nothing that would distrub a conference
<nixternal> and i only hear that because of the network silence
<stgraber> good, but I didn't change anything :)
<nixternal> are you still muted?
<stgraber> yes
<nixternal> i hear no talking at all
<nixternal> oh ok
<nixternal> now i hear you
<nixternal> that mic picks up everything..i hear you breathing
<stgraber> yes, good thing that means I'm still alive :)
<nixternal> you sounded good there, however i couldn't pick up what you were saying...very strong accent, or you were speaking a language other than english ;)
<nixternal> hahahahahhahaha
<stgraber> hehe :)
<nixternal> i can barely understand english as it is
<stgraber> My english prononciation isn't good at all, I got some frenglish speakers and then that's hard to learn a good one :)
<nixternal> lol
<nixternal> ok, i knew it was french...
<nixternal> i disconnected...i need to go and vote for some more idiots to run this oh so great country ;)
<stgraber> :)
<stgraber> btw, I also disconnected : "Your laptop is out of power and will shutdown now"
<kihai> Hi guys! Any LTSP experts around???
<cbx33> there is at least one
<kihai> OK, does anyone know what could cause my prob with the dhcpd of ltsp? The server is running and I can boot up one client. When I try to boot the next client, it doesn't receive an IP address from the dhcp server. Everything is freshly installed
<kihai> ...I'm using edgy
<azenux> there's something in the log ?
<kihai> Ahem, in which log should I look? in /var/log/messages I don't find anything. Or do I have to look in the chroot logs?
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<highvoltage> running out of memory--
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<azenux> kihai both
<cbx33-gilbert> hey highvoltage 
<highvoltage> hey cbx33-gilbert 
<highvoltage> gilbert?
<cbx33-gilbert> heh
<cbx33-gilbert> It looks like i may have found out what causes my sleepiness
<cbx33-gilbert> it's called Gilberts Syndrome
<highvoltage> cbx33-gilbert: oh? what's that?
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: google for gilberts syndrome
<edubuntugirl> highvoltage: Google found 'GILBERT'S SYNDROME - a patient's guide', at http://www.medic8.com/healthguide/articles/gilbertsyn.html
<highvoltage> I wonder why they make medical terms so complicated.
<bronze> "guild rules"
<bronze> "whoever has the guilders, makes the rules"
<highvoltage> 1
<stgraber> RichEd: still no stable wireless connection ? :)
<RichEd> If you mean my wireless. it's fine. I keep on hibernating my notenook when moving from room to room and that's why you see me dropping in and out.
<stgraber> a ok :)
<RichEd> stgraber: walking around with an open notebook, and the potential for dropping and damage is more of a hassle than restarting from hiernate
<stgraber> Did you have a BOF about Student Control Panel update today ?
<stgraber> RichEd: You are lucky to have a working hibernate :)
<RichEd> stgraber: hibernate is a.ok for me. suspend is dodgy and hangs around 1 in 5 times
<aldwin> can anyone help with my problem with linux ubuntu. here's how it go: i hav an amd x2 (dual core) 64bit 3.8ghz pc and i did download and tried both the desktop 6.10 for amd64 and the 6.10 alternate for amd64bit but both didn't work. i just endup with starting the cd and it did boot me up to the main menu of the disk. when i tried the install option. nothing happens... (just the splash screen of a black and white ubuntu logo, nothing more).
<stgraber> I saw a BOF for SCPU scheduled but not on VOIP, did it happen or is it rescheduled ?
<RichEd> stgraber: i was just looking that up for you. it is a drafting session only. ogra will be doing that on his own. laserjock had to leave last night.
<stgraber> ok
<RichEd> aldwin: ubuntu or edubuntu ?
<stgraber> Nothing really interessting from my POV today (or at least for the less I can see on the VOIP schedule)
<aldwin> Riched: ubuntu
<stgraber> aldwin: When you have the splash screen, try to see the text output by pressing ESC or F2 (I can't remember)
<stgraber> aldwin: anyway, here that's the edubuntu channel, not the Ubuntu one
<RichEd> aldwin: i suggest you also ask in #ubuntu then ... both channels may a bit quiet as the main players are all at a developer summit
<stgraber> aldwin: and if that's for a personnal use, I would recommend you to switch to a 32bit OS (to have flash and other binary softwares working)
<stgraber> good bye
<stgraber> :)
<RichEd> nice polite exit
<RichEd> not
<floydwilde> How to set lcd xorg settings on thin client w/ edubutu?
<stgraber> Hi
<stgraber> I don't really understand your question, can you reformulate it ?
<stgraber> What kind of settings do you want to set (resolution ?), what's the current problem (for instance unusable resolution on a thin client), ... ?
<floydwilde> Yes the resolution came up 640x480 and 60 hz
<floydwilde> No option to change in preferences
<floydwilde> it's a ViewSonic VG700
<stgraber> ok, there is an option in the lts.conf you can set to change the resolution on a specific thin client (by MAC address) or on all of them
<stgraber> (just let me boot my edubuntu computer :) )
<stgraber> is that only for one thin client or for all of them ?
<floydwilde> we are switching to lcd, I have a fiew viewsonic and another model
<stgraber> ok, the system is done this way, there is a default value and then some exceptions
<stgraber> so choose the resolution you have the most as default
<stgraber> and get a list of all the other computers MAC addresses
<floydwilde> whats the path to lts
<stgraber> /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf
<floydwilde> yep there it is
<floydwilde> wait, I don't have one there
<floydwilde> using defaults never made an lts.conf, this is muekow right?
<floydwilde> /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/doc/ltsp-client/examples/lts.conf
<floydwilde> should I create one from this file? 
<stgraber> hmm, just a small question What version of Edubuntu are you using ?
<floydwilde> dapper
<stgraber> no, you can simply create an empty one, I will give you the few lines I have here in mine
<floydwilde> awesome!
<stgraber> ok, that's why you don't have one by default
<stgraber> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/30542/
<stgraber> that's the default edgy one
<stgraber> it should also work on Dapper
<stgraber> then you can add (in the [default] ) section : X_MODE_0=800x600 (or any other resolution)
<stgraber> it will be the default resolution on your LTSP network (just try with a client if you can to check that the lts.conf file works correctly)
<floydwilde> do you have localdev working on edgy?
<stgraber> yes
<floydwilde> it doesn't work in dapper from what I understand
<stgraber> sound and localdev works from the begining, nothing to set (at least for me)
<stgraber> yes, there was a lot of work for that in Edgy
<floydwilde> do you have to restart anything or just reboot client?
<stgraber> now, you plug your USB key, a cdrom, or any mass storage thing and it appears in Nautilus and on the Desktop as it was local
<stgraber> just reboot the client
<floydwilde> hmm still to big, there is a ViewSonic VGA700b that works okay though
<floydwilde> Unfortunately mostly we just have VGA700 
<floydwilde> I mean VG700
<nixternal> floydwilde: !!!!
<nixternal> wasabi homer
<floydwilde> Helloooo
<nixternal> creating tension in the LUG i see ;)
<floydwilde> Hey I gots to be me
<nixternal> hahahaha
<nixternal> how much are you looking at spending ona  lappy btw?  tiger direct in naperville has some sub 500 deals, refurbs that might work out well
<floydwilde> I just scored some LCD screens tryingto make them play nice w/ ltsp
<nixternal> nm, this is the edubuntu chan btw ;)
<stgraber> Another ubuntu-chicago member ? :)
<nixternal> i thought this was codlug for a sec, then i noticed all the wonderful people
<floydwilde> yeah talk in cod(g)lug
<nixternal> stgraber: we goto school and CoDLUG together ;)
<stgraber> ok :)
<stgraber> nixternal: You are lucky to have some other Ubuntu users @ school :)
<nixternal> i forgot he was in #edubuntu as well, and i thought it was members of the LUG talking ;)
<stgraber> here, as soon as you don't use Windows you are an alien :)
<nixternal> floydwilde uses it more than I do, and he found out about it at the courthouse as well
<floydwilde> Yeah didja ever hear anything about that
<floydwilde> They weren't using ltsp, but some vnc type setup
<nixternal> no, i talked to the admin there and he has no idea about Linux
<lucasvo> omg another edu-distro
<lucasvo> >http://www.lerntux.de/
<stgraber> floydwilde: ok, so set the X_MODE_0 to the value that's used the most on your network, then set some other sections (like the default one)
<stgraber> [IP-OF-THE-CLIENT]  or [MAC-OF-THE-CLIENT] 
<stgraber> and then set a custom X_MODE_0 for it
<floydwilde> X_MODE_0 got it
* stgraber finds today less intersting than the two previous days @ UDS MTV
<nixternal> ya same here
<floydwilde> I added X_MODE_0 and X_Color_Depth settings to lts.conf but no luck
* stgraber really likes his small pastebin client software : "pastebin thefile" or "ps aux | pastebin -" and it's on the web :)
<stgraber> floydwilde: where did you put them ? in the [default]  section ?
<floydwilde> yes
<floydwilde> oh do i have lts.conf in the wrong place, /opt/ltsp/i386
<floydwilde> should it be: /opt/ltsp/i386/etc
<stgraber> at least in edgy it's in the etc directory yes
<stgraber> I can't remember for Dapper
<stgraber> just try :)
<floydwilde> hmm still no dice
<floydwilde> I think it read the config file though
<floydwilde> what about editing the x config in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/X11?
<stgraber> you can but I'm not sure LTSP really read this part (because of the X_MODE_0 option)
<floydwilde> Ok a googling I shall go
<stgraber> the LTSP lts.conf do is here http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtsConf
<stgraber> but I don't know (and can't find) the list of the implemented lts.conf options in Dapper
<floydwilde> had to set the horzsync and vert settings, but now resolution is at 1024x768
<leManu> hi all, does anybody know who's maintaining edubuntu wiki ?
<LaserJock> well, the edubuntu wiki is just a theme on the Ubuntu wiki
<leManu> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/ ?
<LaserJock> yeah, it's the same as wiki.ubuntu.com
<leManu> ok
<LaserJock> it's just got some redirect and theming magic
<leManu> the page behind Download on top needs updating, right ? talks about 5.10
<LaserJock> leManu: yep, good catch
<LaserJock> leManu: do you want to fix it?
<leManu> LaserJock: the page is locked
<LaserJock> oh sorry, I didn't see that
<LaserJock> leManu: ah, I think you just need to login
<LaserJock> from the Edubuntu side
<leManu> think so, but don't know where and how...
<LaserJock> leManu: there's a little login link
<LaserJock> leManu: at the top of the search box
<leManu> LaserJock: thx
<jelkner> could anyone here help with a dhcp server problem?
<jelkner> i keep getting "No subnet declaration for eth0 (192.162.42.254)"
<jelkner> but i think i have /etc/ltsp/dhcp.conf configured correctly.
<jelkner> s dhcp.conf dhcpd.conf
<stgraber> jelkner: can you paste.ubuntu-nl.org your dhcpd.conf and a result of the ifconfig command ?
<jelkner> stgraber: done
<jelkner> i got the server started
<jelkner> turns out i need a subnet declaration for each interface
<jelkner> not just the one i want to listen on
<jelkner> so i added:subnet 192.168.0.0 netmask 255.255.255.0 {
<jelkner> }
<jelkner> and it worked
<jelkner> but the clients are still not getting an address
<jelkner> No DHCP or proxyDHCP offers were received
<stgraber> It should work with your file (the one on pastebin) if you have one of the server interfaces inside this subnet
<stgraber> then /etc/init.d/dhcpd restart should work
<stgraber> there is no need to create an empty subnet
<diplomat> I am about to install edubuntu on a computer for my daughter (almost 3), when she is 3 I plan to start teaching her to use the computer, have many of you had experience doing this at this age?
<jelkner> stgraber: thanks, i had the wrong address on the interface 162 instead of 192 in the second octet
<jelkner> thanks again
<LaserJock> hi RichEd and ogra_ 
<RichEd> hi LaserJock ... safe trip back ? no major fires on the work or domestic front ?
<LaserJock> oh, it was pretty interesting
<LaserJock> I haven't been that stressed in a long time
<RichEd> the trip or the welcom ?
<RichEd> *welcome
<LaserJock> we got home at 1:00am
<LaserJock> and then I worked on data analysis, etc. until 5:00am
<RichEd> we ? who did you have with you ?
<LaserJock> my wife
<LaserJock> she was visiting her family (who we were staying with)
<LaserJock> then I got to work at 9:30 and my boss wasn't so happy
<RichEd> stgraber & nixternal : it's less interesting today because we have got the major requirements under control & on track yesterday. ogra and I are very pleased
<LaserJock> but we did some last minute work and the presentation went off pretty well
<RichEd> LaserJock: did you not have permission to be here AWOL or did your boss change his mind ?
<LaserJock> heh, well since I was only taking 1 day off I didn't even ask him
<LaserJock> we're usually pretty flexible here
<LaserJock> in hindsight I probably should have just to let him know
<LaserJock> anyway, it's all better now
<LaserJock> the presentation is done
<LaserJock> and we can get back to work
#edubuntu 2006-11-08
<highvoltage> meh
<LaserJock> highvoltage!
<LaserJock> hi
<highvoltage> hi LaserJock 
<LaserJock> what's up?
<highvoltage> still waking up :)
<highvoltage> reading through the wiki changes and LP notifications
<highvoltage> it seems like the easiest way to keep up atm.
<LaserJock> ah, yes
<LaserJock> I'm doing the same
<LaserJock> although my email situation is pretty bad
<highvoltage> mine too, not because of technical problems, but with overflow of email
<LaserJock> until an LP admin switches my @ubuntu.com redirect I'm getting mail at 2 different accounts
<LaserJock> and right now none of it's filtered
<highvoltage> each e-mail has a 5-10 minute task assosiated with it, and with deadlines looming it's not top priority atm.
<highvoltage> ah I see :/
<highvoltage> I stopped filreting LP and the wiki, otherwise I'd never read them :)
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: tell jono http://xkcd.com/c181.html
<edubuntugirl> Righto, highvoltage!
<mcksean> exit
<willvdl> morning
<Kamping_Kaiser> gday
<highvoltage> morning willvdl and Kamping_Kaiser 
<Kamping_Kaiser> evening highvoltage 
<willvdl> hey, didn't see you there :)
<highvoltage> I was sitting in the corner.
<highvoltage> well, more like, curled up in the fetal position.
<highvoltage> so I can understand that you didn't see me :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> hehe
<kwak> hi everybody. how do i do a dual boot beside my k12ltsp 5
<kwak> i will install edubuntu
<Kamping_Kaiser> the cd lets you dual boot
<Kamping_Kaiser> *install cd
<kwak> the edubuntu install CD right?
<kwak> ok.
<highvoltage> yes, it does.
<highvoltage> are you using the livecd or alternate cd?
<kwak> ok will try now
<kwak> the alternate CD i guess
<highvoltage> ok, it will ask you if you want to erase the entire disk, or shrink your current partition, or do custom partition
<highvoltage> you can choose the shrink option and it will do all the hard work for you.
<Kamping_Kaiser> it defaults to shrinking (ie dual boot)
<kwak> ok
<kwak> ok i have three options for installation
<kwak> 1. install to the hard disk
<kwak> 2. install a workstation
<kwak> 3. install a comand-line system
<Kamping_Kaiser> 1 (iirc)
<Kamping_Kaiser> for the terminal server
<kwak> it's "scanning CD-ROM" now
<kwak> i have 2 GB NICs, both broadcom i think, which one is for terminal server, eth0 or 1
<Kamping_Kaiser> either, as long as you dont care
<kwak> 1 NIC will have this network 192.168.0 (TS), 192.168.1., local lan
<kwak> the other
<Kamping_Kaiser> does it matter to you which nic is on which network?
<kwak> well, not really. :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> then it doesnt matter to the server :)
<kwak> well i think my question was wrong.
<Kamping_Kaiser> (theres probably a rule of thumb, but i dont know one)
<kwak> since it's both broadcom, i have to figure out which is which.
<Kamping_Kaiser> run 'lspci' in a terminal
<Kamping_Kaiser> eth0 is usualy the first one on the pci bus
<kwak> noted
<kwak> im on the partition screen now, in K12ltsp i set it as LVM. now it sees it as sda and sdb
<Kamping_Kaiser> i dont know anything about lvm, so i cant help there
* Kamping_Kaiser dislikes lvm/evms
<kwak> o i guess not LVM
<willvdl> cbx33 woot
<cbx33> hey willvdl 
<willvdl> cbx33, do you use smart boards at all?
<cbx33> yes, but not "Smart" boards
<cbx33> which is a bugger
<cbx33> I saw something about developing drivers and stuff
<cbx33> but they won't work on our hitachi cambridge boards
<willvdl> http://www.smarttech.com/support/software/linux.asp
<willvdl> yeah been talking to some local partners about it
<willvdl> want to get some NEPAD guys playing with it to see haw far it can go
<willvdl> are the hitachi boards nice?
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> we really like them
<willvdl> and cheaper no doubt
<cbx33> they are a lot cheaper too
<cbx33> ;)
<willvdl> rear projection?
<willvdl> do the hitachi's not need projectors?
<willvdl> urk ahead ofmyself. must be the decaff they jsut gave me
<cbx33> no they need projectors
<cbx33> but they work pretty good
<kwak> Kamping_Kaiser: i need your advise on partition, i will shrink / so that if in case im satisfied with edubuntu better than k12 i will totally erase k12. is this possible.
<Kamping_Kaiser> kwak, if your using LVM it may not be so easy to shrink them
<willvdl> cbx33, do you use tablets or slates as well?
<kwak> i mean, will it affect the files in /. i checked it, im not using LVM. my /home is solely sdb1
<kwak> i have 3 partitions on sda /boot, swap, /
<Kamping_Kaiser> no, it wont affect those files then.
<cbx33> willvdl: no, just the pc 
<kwak> i chose resize the partition, and it says it's not possible to resize it.
<willvdl> looking at the whole smart product options. looks kinda nice. they can connect all kinds of devices to the boards etc. (synchroneyes etc.)
<willvdl> I'm hoping the same is possible on linux 
<Kamping_Kaiser> kwak, does it give a reason?
<kwak> the same is true with other partitions: got this error "The resize operation is impossible: beucase of an unknown reason it is impossible to resize this partition"
<kwak> that's because
<cbx33> willvdl: yeh.....I'd say the smarts are what is in use in the most cases
<cbx33> if I was clever I could write the driver for a hitachi board ;)
<cbx33> wouldn't take much
<cbx33> surely it's just a mouse driver really
<cbx33> with pressure as well
<Kamping_Kaiser> kwak, hm. i havent tried it before, so i'm not sure what could be going on. perhaps someone else here has some ideas
<willvdl> well exactly.
<willvdl> the trick comes in with the value add stuff like remote desktops, whiteboard sharing etc.
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> which is a more advanced step
<cbx33> I wonder who would know about writing a usb HID driver?
<cbx33> maybe I'll investigate into that
<willvdl> can't be too hard to modify like a usb mouse driver or something
<cbx33> well that's what I thought
<cbx33> would need to handle calibration
<cbx33> although surely that would just be an offset to an operating range
<cbx33> not sure it it handles keystone errors?
<willvdl> hopefully we can get smart's software...
<cbx33> that'd be cool
<willvdl> it would make so much sense for them to open their software
<willvdl> it's free anyway
<cbx33> yeh
<highvoltage> willvdl: you need to do some advocacy there ;)
<willvdl> highvoltage, dude, no doubt. I'm getting an intro to their developers soon.
<cbx33> hmm....
<cbx33> It may be that this board already has a driver ;)
<cbx33> the standard usbhid maywork
<cbx33> I'll chav a board at lunch and try it out
<kwak> ok
<kwak> thanks
<cbx33> join #ejabberd
<cbx33> rats
<kwak> r u still there Kamping_Kaiser?
<Kamping_Kaiser> kwak, i'm here
<kwak> im thinking of just installing edubuntu on top of k12, but preserving /home which is on a separate partition.
<kwak> i have at least almost 200 students, they don't have much files in there, but i have to create their usernames again right?
<kwak> i just restarted k12 and it hanged again
<Kamping_Kaiser> yes, you have to recreate the users. if the usernames are the same as their home dirs, you can script that though
<Kamping_Kaiser> and save /etc/[shadow,passwd]  - you can sed in the old passwords if your keen as well
<kwak> the passwords will be easy, but if there's a way not to redo the individual usernames, that might be better
<Kamping_Kaiser> you can recreate the usernames from tehir home dirs - or do you call users different to homes?
<kwak> their usernames and homes are the same
<Kamping_Kaiser> then you can use a for loop to script it.
<Kamping_Kaiser> back in 30 min though :|
<Kamping_Kaiser> brb
<kwak> k
<Kamping_Kaiser> kwak, back
<cbx33> anyone got experience with ejabberd
<kwak> ok.
<highvoltage> I've installed it a few times and it just worked, so I'm not an expert.
<highvoltage> iirc, all I needed to do was change the address in the config file so that it would listen on the right ip address, as apposed to localhost
<cbx33> yeh it's working now
<cbx33> except I can't get admin access through gaim
<cbx33> which sux a little
<cbx33> why is this not working
<cbx33> grrr
<cbx33> mplayer codecs
<cbx33> ive installed them into the directories but mp3's still dn;t play
<Kamping_Kaiser> cbx33, whats up?
<cbx33> i can't get the codecs to work for mplayer
<Kamping_Kaiser> so apt-get mplayer, and downloaded the tar from mplayers home?
<cbx33> yeh i did that
<cbx33> where do I untar them
<cbx33> I tried all three locations and it still doesn't work
<Kamping_Kaiser> just untar to ~/stuff
<Kamping_Kaiser> the readme tells where to mv them to, iirc /usr/local/codecs
<cbx33> ysh I tried all those locations it didn't work
<Kamping_Kaiser> have you restarted all mplayers?
* Kamping_Kaiser has never had issues
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> neither have I
<cbx33> guys is there a JRE plugin for firefox in ubutnu on amd64?
<Kamping_Kaiser> not sun, perhaps the gnu java...? (??)
<cbx33> hmmm can't find anything
<cbx33> there is a sun-java5-plugin pacakge
<cbx33> but it's not available here
<cbx33> Package sun-java5-plugin is not available, but is referred to by another package.
<Kamping_Kaiser> got multiverse?
<cbx33> i sorted it
<cbx33> it's not present on amd 64
<cbx33> liek a lot of stuff
<jsgotangco> well
<jsgotangco> :)
* Kamping_Kaiser hugs his freedom
<jsgotangco> yeah
<jsgotangco> this is funny
<jsgotangco> i use gizmo
<jsgotangco> it works wayy wayyy better in linux than in windows
<cbx33> pete savage : I was #1 on google yesterday
<cbx33> darn it I've slipped to 2 now
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> gizmo
<cbx33> ahhh voip
<jsgotangco> yep
<jsgotangco> well i have a call-in number
<Gatekeeper> hi 
<Gatekeeper> what the difernt between ubuntu und edubuntu ???
<Kamping_Kaiser> edubuntu has a more 'children' oriented pacackages
<Kamping_Kaiser> and a default instlal installs an LTSP server
<Gatekeeper> right i try apt-get install joe 
<Gatekeeper> package not found 
<Kamping_Kaiser> its in universe
<Kamping_Kaiser> you will have to enable the repository
<Gatekeeper> where
<Kamping_Kaiser> system -> admin -> software properties
<Gatekeeper> okay thx 
<Kamping_Kaiser> np
<stgraber> RichEd: good morning
<jsgotangco> hi
<RichEd> gi 
<RichEd> hi guys 
<RichEd> just getting my day under way ... time to get ready for brekkie & the bus ...
<jsgotangco> ?
<jsgotangco> oh you need to take a bus to go to the place
<jsgotangco> jeezz
<jsgotangco> wow
<jsgotangco> Nuffing: hey there
<Nuffing> hi, just connecting up, I am on my way out but will bbl (in a few hours)
<jsgotangco> hi, bye!
<Nuffing> see ya
<RichEd> hi nuffing ... are you having trouble installing edubuntu ?
<stgraber> RichEd: I read the wiki page about Student Control Panel and I just had a question, what happens if we have two teachers ? (for example for the info messages when a student ask a question)
<RichEd> good point stgraber : i will ask oliver
<stgraber> that's more a technical question, but it could be interesting to handle having two teachers
<bddebian> Howdy
<stgraber> hi
<aze> hi all
<cbx33> hey all
<stgraber> hi
<stgraber> Will the Student Control Panel BOF (11-12) be on VOIP ?
<juliux> http://people.ubuntu.com/~cmsj/voip/2006-11-08.html
<juliux> stgraber, there you can see the timetable
<stgraber> I know, but 11-12 isn't on it
<stgraber> (not yet)
<stgraber> And I don't know if that will be like yesterday where there was only some drafting and then nothing on VOIP
<Burgwork> stgraber: the schedule for the next day is only made up the night before
<cbx33> stgraber, I'd be interested in finding that out
<cbx33> ogra, can you shed any light?
<ogra> cbx33, there are no discussion sessions any more if a spec is in drafting
<edubuntugirl> ogra: by the way, highvoltage told me to tell you 'glad to see that the 2nd cd as repo is kind of panning out :)' 1 day, 12 hours, 48 minutes and 40 seconds ago (on Tue Nov  7 07:45:08 2006)
<cbx33> ogra, that's what I thought
<ogra> edubuntugirl, tell highvoltage i'm glad as well :)
<edubuntugirl> Righto, ogra!
<Burgwork> ok, our bot rocks
<cbx33> indeed
* ogra holds some edgy edubuntu CDs in his hands btw 
<cbx33> oooh
* cbx33 thinks everyone who contributed should get one ;)
<cbx33> ogra, http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/?p=155
<cbx33> see comment ;)
<ogra> nice ! :)
<cbx33> I'm hoping to get some more great feedback on that
<cbx33> I've never done anything like that before
<cbx33> but boy would it be useful to us
<cbx33> right I'm off, back later
<sbalneav> morning LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi Scotty!
<Nuffing> edubuntugirl, tell RichEd Hi, and stop running away every time I log on :P
<edubuntugirl> Righto, Nuffing!
<Nuffing> edubuntugirl, thanks
<edubuntugirl> no worries, Nuffing
<LaserJock> haha
<LaserJock> how's it going Nuffing?
<stgraber> ogra: I read the wiki about StudentControlPanelSpec this afternoon, I have 1 suggestion and 1 question
<stgraber> suggestion : A very often used functionnality here on Windows is to shutdown all the computers (actually we can only disconnect with the SCP)
<stgraber> question : What happens if we have two teachers ? (about the "ask a question" thing, will they both receive the message ?)
<LaserJock> hi RichEd 
<Burgwork> hey RichEd
<bimberi> g'day RichEd
<juliux> hi RichEd 
<LaserJock> sbalneav: quick question if you're here, how is the ltsp-management-gui different from SCP?
<LaserJock> sbalneav: nvm
<sbalneav> :)
<LaserJock> I hate not being there not that I was there for a little bit
<LaserJock> s/not/now/
<RichEd> hi LaserJock Burgwork bimberi juliux ...
<edubuntugirl> RichEd: by the way, Nuffing told me to tell you 'Hi, and stop running away every time I log on :P' 1 hours, 4 minutes and 42 seconds ago (on Wed Nov  8 21:07:41 2006)
<LaserJock> hehe
* RichEd rolls eye's : damn now I am being naged by proxy - these wimmin all stick together !
<RichEd> *nagged
<RichEd> brb
<LaserJock> haha
<RichEd> LaserJock: how do I give the electronic nag a nag to send back to the real world one ?
<RichEd> and will edubuntugirl pipe up if Nuffing changes her away status, or only on rejoin ?
<LaserJock> do: edubuntugirl, tell <user> <message>
<LaserJock> RichEd: I think it might only do it if the person says something
<LaserJock> but I'm not really sure
<RichEd> edubuntugirl, tell Nuffing 'I was online waiting for you this morning (your evening) when you signed on and you spoke to the channel and then ingored me and ran away ... so brpthhhhhhhh !'
<edubuntugirl> Righto, RichEd!
<RichEd> thanks edubuntugirl 
<LaserJock> haha
<LaserJock> ogra: are you planning on changing user/group management in Feisty?
* HedgeMage peeks in
<HedgeMage> RichEd: still about?
* highvoltage pops in before falling over
<edubuntugirl> highvoltage: by the way, ogra told me to tell you 'i'm glad as well :)' 2 hours, 29 minutes and 49 seconds ago (on Wed Nov  8 20:34:21 2006)
<highvoltage> :)
<highvoltage> RichEd: edubuntugirl will tell nuffing when she says something again
<highvoltage> LaserJock: edubuntugirl is a she, not an it :)
<highvoltage> goodnight HedgeMage 
<LaserJock> highvoltage: whatever
<highvoltage> and hello pygi!
<highvoltage> :)
<highvoltage> goodnight LaserJock 
<LaserJock> highvoltage: that's what I get for trying to be politically correct ;-)
<pygi> hey highvoltage 
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: going to bed?
<pygi> hey HedgeMage 
<HedgeMage> hi pygi 
<highvoltage> heh. well, I would've made a stab at Americans, but the Americans' ratings have gone up a little with me so I'll leave it :)
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: yep
<HedgeMage> lol
<HedgeMage> sweet dreams highvoltage 
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: it's 11pm and I've been working since 5am
<HedgeMage> awww
<highvoltage> thanks. goodnight!
<highvoltage> it's cool though, been super productive and I love it... keep an eye on slashdot next week ;)
<pygi> highvoltage: if I manage to convince my laptop to connect to internet, you'll get libburn-enabled brasero
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: good for you!
<Nuffing> hello
<edubuntugirl> Nuffing: by the way, RichEd told me to tell you ''I was online waiting for you this morning (your evening) when you signed on and you spoke to the channel and then ingored me and ran away ... so brpthhhhhhhh !'' 42 minutes and 1 seconds ago (on Wed Nov  8 22:26:40 2006)
<Nuffing> Thanks edubuntugirl 
* Nuffing *thwaps* RichEd 
<Nuffing> nagging indeed *pout*
<Nuffing> ;)
<LaserJock> haha
<mario_> I'm back
<mario_> now lets see what I can do with a package :)
<mario_> ergh, why wont it sign the package!!!@#!
<LaserJock> mario_: are you using -k<keyid>?
<mario_> LaserJock, nah, using nothing, it defaults to my key
<LaserJock> ok
<LaserJock> and you have the right name and email address in debian/changelog?
<mario_> ofcourse
<mario_> LaserJock, dunno what's happening, I'm being confused as always:)
<mario_> LaserJock, any sensful idea? :)
<LaserJock> can you sign other things?
<mario_> didn't try really, but it would help if this debsign thingy was a bit more verbose :)
<mario_> brb in a sec
<pygi> Laser:
<pygi> debsign: gpg error occurred!  Aborting....
<pygi> debuild: fatal error at line 1151:
<pygi> running debsign failed
<LaserJock> hmm :/
<pygi> it still creates the files!!!
<pygi> right
<Nuffing> gah
<ace> ping ogra
<pygi> ace: I dont think ogra is here now :)
<ace> pygi: ah okay
<ace> pygi: why ?
<pygi> ace: may anyone else help you? :)
<ace> pygi: I just wanted some reassurance on edgy
<ogra> i am here but way to busy finishing specs to answer questions ... probably on the weekend
<ogra> mail me ...
<pygi> ace: me and others can probably answer question ^_^
<pygi> or as ogra said, mail :P
<ace> ogra: okay good luck, I'll mail you!!!
<ace> pygi: thanks
<ace> pygi: did you have so many problems with edgy as I had ?
<ace> pygi: or am i some freak of nature ?
<pygi> ace: I dont know how much problems you had :)
<LaserJock> I didn't have any problems, but certainly some people have
<ace> pygi: just check the bug reports on launchpad for reported by ace at suares point an
<ace> LaserJock: did those problems get solved or are there still issues ?
<ace> I had OO crash on me twice since clean install of edgy - hard crash, no way out but reboot!
<LaserJock> hmm, haven't heard of that one
<ace> I can't use the right square bracket, but before, I couldn't use the 'p' !
<ace> I had almost no problems with dapper ! I was quite happy.
<ace> I upgraded to RC2 and one of my 3 screens went black (with the i810 driver).
<ace> Then that wasn't fixed. no one seemd to know what to do, so I did a clean install
<ace> the install couldn't mount my reiserfs /home whihc was part of a mdadm raid1 array
<ace> I didn't know what I saw
<ace> I was baffled
<ace> I needed to install with a home on the root partition, install mdadm and from then on it worked fine.
<ace> anyway
<ace> Of course I am still very happy with ubuntu and gnu/linux in general
<ace> but the last week have been the closest to 'windows' experience I have been in a couple of years
<LaserJock> yeah, edgy's been somewhat odd
#edubuntu 2006-11-09
<pygi> LaserJock: including my "gpg" problem :(
<pygi> *not related to edubuntu*
<LaserJock> many people, like myself,  had wonderful upgrades and edgy is stable and great
<ace> I installed ubuntu by the way not edubuntu but later I added edubuntu
<LaserJock> for other people it seems to be the worst release ever or something
<ace> LaserJock: isn't that funny ? That a certain people are having night mares (and they don't stop !)
<ace> and others go smoooooth ?
<ace> That's so weird !
<ace> And i really can't believe it's hardware related.
<Kamping_Kaiser> hi RichEd 
<RichEd> hi Kamping_Kaiser 
<Kamping_Kaiser> :)
<ace> I can't get bluetooth to work - yest, hcitool works and sees the device, but I can't find a suitable program that let's me transfer files 
<ace> and on and on.
<LaserJock> ace: yeah, I think there is going to be a lot more testing for feisty to eliminate some of that
<LaserJock> but it's difficult
<ace> maybe the need to conform to the cycle was to great pressure... i don't know. lots of great things in 6.10 but man.. so many problems..
<LaserJock> it just depends
<ace> if OO hangs my machine good and hard... it's dangerous ! I don't want the feeling that I can't trust my machine like I had in windows.
<LaserJock> that's the biggest problem
<LaserJock> for the stuff I do edgy is in much more stable and better then even dapper
<ace> RichEd!!
<ace> LaserJock: what do you do ?
<LaserJock> science stuff
<ace> Unfortunately, I am not a developer 
<ace> and I can't fix stuff myself
<ace> I can complain hopefully in a usefull way
<LaserJock> I'm a developer and I can't fix stuff much either ;-)
<LaserJock> but with edgy I haven't had any snags
<ace> LaserJock: yes I do develop things - php websites and such :-) but no c(++) java pythion perl etc
* ace envies KaserJock
<LaserJock> cool, I don't know any PHP, but I'm trying to learn Python and C++
* RichEd is a bit tied up ... busy with a meering guys
<RichEd> *meeting
* LaserJock wishes he could offer some good advice and a working machine to ace 
<ace> I am trying to lear ruby but that will take even longer after the wrestles with edgy.
<ace> Anyway, just goes to show that there are many, many difficulties for an OS that wants to run on millions of computers !
<LaserJock> yes
* ace wishes RichEd a nice meeting
<LaserJock> that's definitely the advantage Apple has
<ace> LaerJock: that it doesn't run on millions of computers :-)
<ace> anyway, gotta cook some salmon
<ace> bye for now !
<LaserJock> cya
<cbx33> hey ogra, great work on the spec
<ogra> cbx33, i just set it to review ... lets see if the reviewer agrees 
<LaserJock> ogra: are you here?
<LaserJock> well bummer
<LaserJock> gnome menus doesn't handle URLs
<LaserJock> RichEd: you actually here?
<RichEd> now I am 
<LaserJock> k
<LaserJock> I was just looking into URL links in menus
<LaserJock> and I found out that gnome-menus doesn't read them
<LaserJock> you have to actually make an application link to firefox <url> 
<RichEd> okay ... you mean they won't appear or won't load
<LaserJock> won't appear
<LaserJock> the freedesktop spec has Type=Link
<LaserJock> which works on the desktop
<LaserJock> but it won't show up in the menus
<LaserJock> so we'd have to use Type=Application
<RichEd> okay ... are you saying it would work if we had a menu item "open firefox and load this url on load"
<LaserJock> which is not very obvious to the user that they would have to type in firefox http://www.google.com for instance
<LaserJock> right
<LaserJock> with Type=Link you just give URL=http://www.google.com
<LaserJock> with Type=Application you have to give Exec= firefox http://www.google.com
<RichEd> mmm and could we have that "complex load"? hidden with the item description being just the link title "
<RichEd> (excuse the typing working on my lap)
<RichEd> is there anywhere I could find a decent explation of how the menus work to get myself a better understanding ?
<LaserJock> sure
<RichEd> (as opposed to asking you dumb questions in vague language)
<LaserJock> desktop spec: http://standards.freedesktop.org/desktop-entry-spec/latest/ 
<RichEd> thanks ... loading
<LaserJock> menu spec: http://standards.freedesktop.org/menu-spec/latest/
<LaserJock> gnome stuff: http://www.gnome.org/learn/admin-guide/latest/menustructure-0.html
<RichEd> stgraber: to answer your earlier SCP question ... Jim McQuillan says that multiple teachers can be added to an admin group, and any admin level person can control workstations 
<LaserJock> RichEd: I think bookmarks would be really cool to have
<LaserJock> I just don't see how we could do it in the menus without hacking in gnome-menus
<ogra> i think it was delibarately ripped out 
<ogra> (even i agree its silly as it is now)
<RichEd> LaserJock: yep ... i am a firm believer that for the younger kids they need to think about the subject first, and the application second. that is the way the human brain works.
<LaserJock> even a separate book marks menu would be kinda cool
<Burgwork> RichEd: do you have a quick moment to talk bout Edubuntu vs ubuntu-education?
<RichEd> like when you are exploring a folder, or even a web page, you see what you want and click the title, the os should recognise the required application launch for the apropriate content
<LaserJock> I saw that somebody did a bookmarks applet a while ago but it was browser specific and showed all the browsers bookmarks
<Burgwork> that is mime types
<RichEd> LaserJock: we've got our combined brains on the problem, we'll make a conceptual breakthrough i think
<Burgwork> .desktop files tell the system what to open with what
<LaserJock> in this case we have Type=
<RichEd> Burgwork: sure
<LaserJock> in the .desktops
<LaserJock> but gnome-menus don't show Type=Link .desktops
<RichEd> Burgwork: as in yes I have a moment
<LaserJock> s/don't/doesn't/
<Burgwork> RichEd: little bit concerned about the split. I would like to expand the scope of Edubuntu to include anything that involves Ubuntu in Education, regardless of whether it is fat or thin client, etc.
<RichEd> Burgwork: we are very aware of the possible risks of split, and are keeping it top of mind. the primary issue is around getting the kubuntu and ubuntu and xubuntu people into our education community. lot's of discussion here with all of the above at UDS have shown that they want to be part of a *buntu education community, but they do not see #edubuntu as a space which applies to them
<Burgwork> RichEd: part of Ubuntu is making technology choices
<Burgwork> that being said, I think having -education and Edubuntu is going to muddy the waters considerably
<RichEd> not sure what you mean by that comment w.r.t. mine above ?
<Burgwork> Edubuntu has chosen the GNOME desktop
<RichEd> ^^ RichEd: part of Ubuntu is making technology choices <- that one
<Burgwork> that means we are not going to get some of the Kubuntu people
<RichEd> yes ... and if someone choses kde does that mean they are not part of Ubuntu and Education ?
<Burgwork> no, far from it
<Burgwork> but they are probably also not going to be part of ubuntu-education
<Burgwork> they are going to be part of Kubuntu
<RichEd> yes they are ... they are asking me about it right here
<RichEd> the kubuntu technical conversations stay in kubuntu, the kubuntu and education conversations find a natural home in ubuntu and education
<RichEd> the ubuntu technical conversations stay in ubuntu, the ubuntu and education conversations find a natural home in ubuntu and education
<Burgwork> sorry, I don't understand your last statement
<RichEd> the edubuntu technical conversations stay in edubuntu, the edubuntu and education conversations find a natural home in ubuntu and education
<Burgwork> I still don't get it
<pygi> neither do I :P
<Burgwork> and that doesn't really help anybody
<Burgwork> I see two choices: disolve Edubuntu and move it into ubuntu-education
<Burgwork> or widen the scope of Edubuntu
<Burgwork> anything else is going to needlessly split a very small resource and further delay our plans for futher world domination
<Burgwork> here is what I would say:
<LaserJock> well, Edubuntu is a specific product, a Gnome based LTSP server distro, etc.
<Burgwork> LaserJock: no, no it is not
<Burgwork> that is its *current* focus
<LaserJock> but I doubt that it can seriously say it covers all Education
<Burgwork> because that was the low hanging fruit
<Burgwork> ogra and I have chatted about it
<LaserJock> wouldn't it muddy things too if there were 5 different Edubuntu flavors
<RichEd> edubuntu is a product based on ubuntu. some issues revolve around the product. some education issues revolve around say an education appplication which is available under kubuntu and edubuntu
<LaserJock> here's the KDE Edubuntu flavor
<Burgwork> ssh, listen to my idea
<Burgwork> we have a project, called Edubuntu, which is education and ubuntu
<RichEd> be back in afew minutes
<Burgwork> anything and everything. This is what ubuntu-education currently is
<Burgwork> then we say: We will help you support any ubuntu product, but our first class product is the GNOME-based desktop currently called Edubuntu
<Burgwork> because if you look outside the Education/Linux community, who care aobut with DE, we need a first class product to sell them
<Burgwork> those people are going to be needlessly confused by having two similarly named projects
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> but I'm just seeing the fact that people want to use more then just Edubuntu
<Burgwork> because there are a lot more teachers out there who don't use linux than who do
<LaserJock> so is it easier to expand the Edubuntu "brand"
<Burgwork> and those that don't don't really give a hoto about which DE
<LaserJock> or create a new "Ubuntu Education" brand
<Burgwork> but that is exactly what we have now
<Burgwork> and it isn't going to help
<Burgwork> somebody who doesn't know either is going to get terribly confused. What do I use?
<LaserJock> they idea would be that you go to Ubuntu Education first
<LaserJock> that tells you the available solutions and products
<Burgwork> then let that first place they go is Edubuntu
<LaserJock> except Edubuntu is also a specifc product
<Burgwork> where we tell them "If you are new, use Edubuntu. If not, use U/K/X"
<Burgwork> Ubuntu is both a project and product
<LaserJock> exactly
<LaserJock> and people get really confused by that
<Burgwork> the same confusion is going to lay with an "ubuntu education"
<Burgwork> they are going to think that ubuntu education is a product
<LaserJock> well, except there isn't a product
<LaserJock> just information and community
<Burgwork> but how does that help anybody?
<LaserJock> because it gets educators together
<Burgwork> when you go to sell/market something, you are selling something, not a project
<LaserJock> regardless of what .iso they are using
<Burgwork> that place can be Edubuntu
<Burgwork> with a bit of thinking
<LaserJock> perhaps
<LaserJock> but it just seems confusing to me to do that
<Burgwork> and I see it as confusing the other way
<LaserJock> do we want people using Kubuntu in education to use edubuntu-users as a discussion forum?
<Burgwork> sure, if it is education related
<LaserJock> but that is our edubuntu support forum
<Burgwork> or make an edubuntu-general for that kind of communication
<Burgwork> or edubuntu-education
<LaserJock> right
<LaserJock> so why not ubuntu-education as it is project wide
<Burgwork> the other issue is thus: we have a growing name recognition with Edubuntu
<Burgwork> we throw that away with ubuntu education
<LaserJock> I wouldn't say throw out
<LaserJock> we might make it bigger, I'm not sure
<Burgwork> becauase ubuntu-education implies ubuntu (as a product) in education
<LaserJock> well, it might, that's true
<Burgwork> LaserJock: I sell things all day. I deal with brand recog all day. trust me on this one
<LaserJock> the hope that it would me ubuntu as in project
<LaserJock> ba
<LaserJock> h
<Burgwork> either way, we have confusion
<LaserJock> I hope that it would mean ubuntu as in project
<Burgwork> and the ubuntu-education way throws away a lot for little gain
<LaserJock> gaining users and community
<LaserJock> look, I can certainly understand the idea here
<LaserJock> and ideally Edubuntu would be the one-stop-education-shop
<LaserJock> but I honestly just don't see that happening
<LaserJock> perhaps going to 2 cd's would hellp
<Burgwork> Edubuntu as a one-stop-shop is undermined by this ubuntu-education
<LaserJock> I can see that
<LaserJock> I just wonder if we are trying to force Edubuntu to be something it isn't and perhaps can't be
<Burgwork> I think it is due to lack of clarify upon project commencement
<Burgwork> ogra has always thought it to be larger than LTSP
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> but in the current state it is basically just that
<LaserJock> Ubuntu+LTSP
<LaserJock> now perhaps the 2nd CD will change a lot of that
<Burgwork> yes
<LaserJock> maybe we can add an edubuntu-kde task or something
<Burgwork> I run into this with DiscoverStation all the time 
<LaserJock> and more educational apps
<Burgwork> as we are the "multi seat people", but we also do fat clients
<RichEd> Burgwork: there is a genome project at Harvard University, using Ubuntu on HPC boxes ... will we produce an edubuntu for them ?
<RichEd> after all, that is ubuntu in education ?
<Burgwork> that is more likely a HPC issue
<Burgwork> they don't reallly see themselves as education
<LaserJock> I'm not sure about that one
<LaserJock> in a sense they probably don't
<LaserJock> In my case, Chemistry department at a mid-sized US research university
<RichEd> but would we not would we want to produce a news article in an education area on what they are doing to (1) show the quality of our software base, and (2) inspire some kids using edubuntu to finish science at school and go study in that field ?
<LaserJock> we fell like half education, half research/professional
<LaserJock> *feel
<Burgwork> that si a bit of a strawmen and not a huge market
<Burgwork> RichEd, your comment, I mean
<Burgwork> the far larger market is school classrooms, people who are going to be confused by this naming stuff
<Burgwork> HPC people are probably already computer people
<LaserJock> perhaps Edubuntu could be expanded in the way Ubuntu has (product and project)
<LaserJock> but either way it's confusing I suppose
<RichEd> And do we not want to influence the Minister of Education to beleive that Ubuntu and its variants could be used across all schools and universities, from refurb boxes to Sun Niagra boxes, across his $ 25 million budget for ICT in education under his control ?
<Burgwork> yes we do
<Burgwork> but how is that goal disserved by a broadening of the Edubuntu name?
<LaserJock> I guess because they would probably be using all flavors of Ubuntu
<LaserJock> and so then you wonder, well am I dealing with Ubuntu or Edubuntu
<LaserJock> because I'm running Kubuntu over here
<Burgwork> we are always going to have that confusion because of our naming
<LaserJock> and an LTSP server running Edubuntu
<RichEd> we are not broadening the edubuntu name ... we are stepping *backwards* to the common layer below edubuntu, across all ubuntu variants, and also forwards to the issues like applications and tools and content that work across all variants in the teaching space
<Burgwork> I say it is better to have that confusion with the Edubuntu name
<Burgwork> but RichEd, you are still making the assumption that Edubuntu should always be a single product
<RichEd> Burgwork: it is
<Burgwork> think Edubuntu as beyond LTSP, as ogra and I have always thought
<RichEd> it is an eduction product focused on the classrom desktop
<Burgwork> that was its early mandate, now it is time to make that bigger
<RichEd> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel
<RichEd> Edubuntu aims to be an Ubuntu variant suitable for classroom use. The aim is to deliver a turnkey solution that enables time-poor educators with mid-range technical skills to set up a computer lab and/or establish an online learning environment with as few clicks as humanly possible, then administer that environment without having to significantly expand their technical skills. Centralized management of configuration, users, a
<RichEd> nd processes together with facilities for working collaboratively in a classroom setting are its principal design goals. Equally important is the gathering together of the best available free software and digital materials for education under one distro.
<RichEd> Edubuntu and Ubuntu are not meant to be seen as distinct projects; Edubuntu is part of the Ubuntu project, and they are both part of one development team that contributes to the whole. Edubuntu is Ubuntu with a different default setup.
<Burgwork> as I said, that was its old mandate
<Burgwork> ogra and I have always seen beyond that, realized that there is more than just LTSP
<Burgwork> let me back up one step
<Burgwork> part of why I bring this up is thus: I sell a product called DiscoverStation
<RichEd> I was speaking to Guadelinux people today, with 1,100 schools and 11,000 desktops, based on Ubunbtu. They would like to be part of an Ubuntu and Education community. What do they share in common with Edubuntu ?
<Burgwork> DiscoverStation comes in two variants: DiscoverSTation (our traditional multiseat syste) and DS SingleUser, our fat client system
<Burgwork> we sell all of it as DS
* RichEd is listening
<Burgwork> we find that selling it all as DS is good, because that there is a enough commonality that it doesn't matter when peopel are making initial decisions
<Burgwork> whether they choose multi or single comes down a discussion from the sales person (me) to them, finding out their needs
<Burgwork> I say we do the same for Edubuntu
<Burgwork> do we see what I mean?
<Burgwork> I am saying these things out of experience
<RichEd> give me a minute ...
<LaserJock> I'm a little hesitant though to sell Edubuntu but then provide {K,X,}ubuntu
<LaserJock> it seems a little bit different then your'e DS analogy
<Burgwork> I don't see it as that
<RichEd> Ubuntu comes in four variants: Ubuntu, (our traditional operating system) and Edubuntu, Kubuntu and Xubuntu
<RichEd> We sell all of it as Ubuntu
<RichEd> We find that selling it all as Ubuntu is good, because that there is a enough commonality that it doesn't matter when people are making initial decisions
<RichEd> Whether they choose Ubuntu or Edubuntu or Kubuntu comes down a discussion from the sales person (me) to them, finding out their needs
<RichEd> :)
<Burgwork> hmm
<RichEd> Burgwork: I do not want to say that there is a 100% right or wrong either way ... both have risks and rewards
<Burgwork> yes
<RichEd> I have spoken to at least 40 people across all spectrums, and it makes sense to them from their perspective, where they are education users of Ubuntu but not Edubuntu 
<RichEd> I would say that the ratio of views is 5:1 ubuntu-education vs edubuntu
* RichEd needs to move out for a bit ... will try to be back later
<LaserJock> we can still push Edubuntu so that it has a bigger share in the ubuntu education market I suppose
<Burgwork> yep
<Burgwork> I need to go home as well
<Burgwork> cya in a bit
<LaserJock> me too
<RichEd> Perhaps I can offer one bit of statistical results ... look at the number of people in this channel. It is growing weekly. I would like to think that some of that growth is as a result of the debate and approach
<ace> hiya
<ace> Burgwork, LaserJock, RichEd, still here ?
<ace> apparently not, okay, so later. Interesting discussion though. I think you should sell BUNTU and then start the live dvd with 4 big icons: U, Ku, Xu and Edu. 
<ace> And then have an icon on tjhe menu somewhere: install other Buntu's. 
<ace> For instance, I installed ubuntu edgy, and now I am stuck with rhytmbox as mp3 player. I want amarok. I hit amarok in the installer and all kinds of
<ace> stuff starts happening. Then I want digikam. More stuff is happening.
<ace> then kmail. But kmail under gnome works, but not pop3-ssl that it needs. So in last despair, I installed kde.
<ace> Now I want some games for my kids, they are not in the ubuntu gnome menu. I want them all, I don't want to handpcik them. best way to do that is 
<ace> to install Edu. 
<ace> Make those choices sepearate from the low level packages. And when you select individual packages, ASK if they instead want the entire K or X or U or Edu !
<ace> At this moment, I am SURE that I have Ubuntu on my machine. I have most of the KDE stuff but I am not sure of I have Kubuntu on my machine. 
<ace> Since some days, suddenly, my splash screen is Edubuntu. But I am sure I never installed edubuntu (maybe
<ace> one or two games, but not a 'package' edubuntu and soitanly not the artwork....
<ace> Riched
<ace> Laserjock
<ace> Burgwork
<ace> And as for Edubuntu as educational... I think a LOT of work can and should be done to make more educational stuff available. If I put my two kids 6 and 8 yrs
<ace> in fromt of edubuntu, they won't have much fun. Instead, I run win4lin with win98 and the entire digikidz.nl suite, now that's some software.
<ace> What would help already would be bookmarks to games/edu sites like BBC flash site (and make sure flash will work too)
<ace> educational distro without flash is almost a shame
<ace> anyway
<ace> enough rant for today
<ace> see ya
<mhz> hi all
<ace> hi
<mhz> Does Edubuntu ships any default SMTP server config?
<ace> sorry, no idea
<Burgundavia> mhz: nope
<ace> I think you can install postfix or exim very easy though
<mhz> Burgundavia: okis, you recommend any
<mhz> ?
<mhz> ace: thx
* mhz is implementing a 13 pcs Edubuntu Lab, finally, and the admin wants some network manager "eye" and so, smtp is requested for sending logs
<ace> mhz: you don't need an smtp server for sending mail, per se
<ace> you can also use a smarthost or the smtp server from the provider
<ace> you can make sure your email client is configured okay
<ace> !smtp
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about smtp - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<Volodya> hi!
<RichEd> ping highvoltage 
<LaserJock> I'd think it was still a little early for him
<Burgundavia> 8am there
<highvoltage> RichEd: pong
<highvoltage> 4
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: hi
<edubuntugirl> buon giorno, highvoltage!
<DanielC> Howdy. Is Edgy stable? I know it was supposed to be "edgy" but I've heard that it didn't come out very edgy at the end.
<cbx33> does network-manager run on xfce?
<cbx33> someone just said wpa is broken in edgy
<cbx33> is this right?
<ulinskie> anybody got a good tutorial on scribus?
<bddebian> Howdy
<SimonAnibal> Howdy!
<bddebian> Hello SimonAnibal
<SimonAnibal> How are you, bddebian 
<SimonAnibal> ??
<bddebian> Swamped at work :-(  You?
<SimonAnibal> bddebian: Does my delay answer your question?
<SimonAnibal> bddebian: I'm in the same boat
<bddebian> SimonAnibal: Aye ;-)
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: translate from german halt! hammerzeit
<edubuntugirl> highvoltage: The 'fish gave: stop! hammer time
<jsgotangco> hmm?
<SimonAnibal> highvoltage: ???
<highvoltage> SimonAnibal: yes?
<Kamping_Kaiser> !!!
<SimonAnibal> highvoltage: Should I go get my hammer, MC?
<highvoltage> SimonAnibal: :)
<highvoltage> SimonAnibal: I just wanted to test edubuntugirl's babelfish :)
<highvoltage> "halt! hammerzeit" is nearly the only German I know :)
<SimonAnibal> highvoltage: You know, that might be a good phrase the next time I get called down to do tech support on an XP box
<highvoltage> heh :)
<highvoltage> it's used in pizza commercials here
<SimonAnibal> huh?
<highvoltage> so each time I see any reference to that song I think about pizza.
<highvoltage> 'stop, pizzatime'
<SimonAnibal> Did M.C. Hammer get into the pizza business?
<SimonAnibal> oh
<SimonAnibal> oic
<SimonAnibal> Print cartriges call...*sigh*...
<ukubuntu> Hi all, has anyone considered GRAMPS for the Edubuntu core? Its a geneology package
<Burgwork> ukubuntu: the issue currently is lack of space on the cd
<ukubuntu> True, I thought of that after I wrote it :$
<ukubuntu> Does Edubutu hold a recommended educational programs list, and then maybe this could be linked to from the desktop of a new install or the bookmarks?
<ukubuntu> perhaps we should have a software review site. I know there are otheres out there but perhaps it better coming from the base, so to speak
<Burgwork> ukubuntu: there are ones out there, and a generic plan to make LP that, but nothingyet
<evilmercer> is there an edgy alternate install cd for edubuntu? I have some computers without internet access im trying to upgrade
<Burgwork> yes
<evilmercer> Wheres it located? I dont see it on the edubuntu site
<ukubuntu> Thx Burgwork, perhaps I should consider making some reviews myself? :)
<Burgwork> sure, that would rock
<cbx33> hey ukubuntu 
<cbx33> are you in the uk?
<ukubuntu> I am CB33, near Stonehenge (says alot!)
<evilmercer> does anyone know where I can find an edubuntu 6.10 alternate installation iso?
<ukubuntu> cbx33 any reason?
<cbx33> I'm in the uk that's all
<cbx33> ;)
<LaserJock> morning Pete
<ukubuntu> okey doke, my nic says it all I hope :)
<cbx33> LaserJock, !!! dude hi
<ukubuntu> evilmercer do you mean here http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/6.10/ the install only CD as the other is the live cd
<evilmercer> guess they dont have one, for ubuntu they have a ubutu-6.10-alternate-i386 i was looking for an edubuntu version, maybe the install and not the live will have what im looking for
<ukubuntu> I think the thing is that the alternate requires less ram to install as you do not install with the LIVE actually running. Is that why you want the alternate?
<jsgotangco> the default of edubuntu is an installer CD
<jsgotangco> because it has ltsp
<jsgotangco> the livecd doesn't have it
<ukubuntu> I see
<evilmercer> ok
<jsgotangco> its a bit confusing from the norm but we'll change the naming convention for feisty
<evilmercer> edubuntu is pretty sweet looking when you add the newest version of beryl with its fire effects
<Nuffing> RichEd, PING
<LaserJock> Nuffing: you guys are just having a terrible time
<Nuffing> I'm telling you he is hiding!
<pygi> Nuffing: hey ho 
<cbx33> hey all
<stgraber> RichEd: Do you know if anyone made ltsp-manager working on Edgy ?
<stgraber> I just installed it and it can't find the .glade file (which is located in /usr/share/ltsp-manager/)
<RichEd> i can check with ogra in an hour
<LaserJock> I thought he said it was non-functional or something
<stgraber> ok, looks like it is searching the .glade file in the current directory instead of the /usr/share one
<RichEd> hi LaserJock ...
<LaserJock> hi RichEd 
<stgraber> gtk.glade.xml("./ltsp-manager.glade"), so it's meant to start from /usr/share/ltsp-manager/
<cbx33> stgraber, ltsp-manager doesnt actually work yet i don;t think
<cbx33> ie it's totally not finished
<cbx33> just a front screen
<cbx33> hey LaserJock
<stgraber> cbx33: Indeed, btw the GUI really looks nice and is easy to use (it just doesn't save the changes)
<cbx33> stgraber, it doesn't do anything yet
<cbx33> I hoped to help ogra on that last release but got too caught up in Student Control Panel
<stgraber> cbx33: Yes, I was just trying it to see how it looks (I was at both student control panel and ltsp-manager bof (by voip))
<cbx33> excellent
<cbx33> hey pygi 
<pygi> hi cafuego 
<pygi> cbx33 even :P
<stgraber> hi
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> hows it all going
<stgraber> auto-completition :)
<cbx33> Mr pygi 
<pygi> how may I help you cbx33 ? :)
<cbx33> just saying hey
<pygi> oh, oki :P
<pygi> how are you?
#edubuntu 2006-11-10
<cbx33> how do i install xfce
<cbx33> can i just install xubuntu-desktop
<cbx33> so I can boot gdm into either gnome or xfce?
<willvdl> cbx33, think so
<crimsun> depends how much of xubuntu-desktop you want.
<crimsun> I normally use just 'xfce4'
<crimsun> that way it doesn't remove some of the gnome-specific things
<cbx33> ok it didn;'t say it had removed any pacakges
<cbx33> which is good i suppose
<cbx33> brb
<ulinskie> http://thinkature.com
<stgraber> hi
<ulinskie> hello there
<bddebian> Heya
<stelis> Hi
<stelis> It's a bit empty and echoey in here today
<bddebian> Aye, apparently :-)
<jsgotangco> heh
<stelis> I guess that the weather's nice in California
<jsgotangco> it'll get chatty next week
<jsgotangco> its still pretty early on their side
<highvoltage> j to the s to go to the tangco
<jsgotangco> hehe
<jsgotangco> this is the UDS that i have no idea what has been happenning
<jsgotangco> it seems to be very very productive but i feel isolated lately
<juliux> hi all
<jsgotangco> hey
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: are you busy?
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: hectically so
<juliux> there is a guy in germany who think about to write is master about edubuntu and education software under linux;)
<jsgotangco> oh ok, i was thinking of calling you up
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: we're releasing our first public release of tuxlab next week
<jsgotangco> gimme your number let's talk this weekend
<highvoltage> 078 108 2588
<highvoltage> ugh, sorry..
<highvoltage> +27 78 108 2588
<jsgotangco> there
<jsgotangco> is this mobile? does it do sms?
<highvoltage> yes, it does sms
<jsgotangco> alright i'll just sms you first and ask if you're free and then i'll call
<highvoltage> ok, great. I should be free for call most of the weekend, although I want to get to the gym for a change, so that would be the only time i won't be taking calls
* highvoltage still wonders what jsgotangco posted him
<jsgotangco> oh it'll com
<jsgotangco> muhahah
<willvdl> jsgotangco is obviously not familiar with the SA postal service :)
<SimonAnibal> http://www.tangent.com/news/hecc2006/ <- A conference I'm going to...Wow...
<jsgotangco> hecc that's nice ;)
<jsgotangco> im gonna sleep
<jsgotangco> ciao
<highvoltage> willvdl: tangent.com? :)
<willvdl> not me ;)
<highvoltage> willvdl: that's quite strange eh?
<highvoltage> aaah I see
* highvoltage went a bit cross-eyed there
<SimonAnibal> HECC
<SimonAnibal> is Hoosier Educational Computing Conference or something
<SimonAnibal> it's a conference for Technology People in Education here in Indiana
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> brown.freenode.net
<willvdl> Can anyone think up a nice blurb/phrase for an Edubuntu poster?
<SimonAnibal> Educational Computing for Human Beings
<SimonAnibal> *shrug*
<stelis> willvdl: Is there a target audience?
<stelis> e.g. Primary ed, secondary ed, teachers?
<willvdl> going into a high school, but should be a generic audience
<willvdl> the linux for human beings line is good but needs an edubuntu tinge to it
<stelis> I admit that that the "Linux" part of slogan bothers me slightly...linux is a technical detail
<willvdl> yeah but the psoter is advertising edubuntu which is an Ubuntu variant
<nixternal> willvdl: you know those "don't be a fool, stay in school", well how about "don't be a fool, get edubuntu", it is corny, silly, half way e.tarded, but it does rhyme just a little bit ;)
<willvdl> don't be a noonoo, get edubuntu
<nixternal> whatever a noonoo is, im almost affraid to ask
<nixternal> hehe
<willvdl> the blurbs we have on "about edubuntu" are too long-winded for a poster
<nixternal> Edubuntu: Freely control your education
<stelis> "All that you need"
<stelis> I like the fact that it gives you basically everything straight out of the box
<nixternal> what is the hot show for highschoolers these days?
<nixternal> what makes them little jerks go "oooh" and "aaaah" besides their inflamed hormones?
<nixternal> haha
<SimonAnibal> Beryl or Compiz
<nixternal> hahahaha
<stelis> "Pretty is a Feature"
<nixternal> SimonAnibal: i hate to admit, but i am seeing that with my loco
<SimonAnibal> You could have the poster be a 3-d cube of the Edubuntu desktop running various apps
<nixternal> that would be cool
<stelis> I thought it was overated until I actually saw it
<SimonAnibal> nodnod, it is pretty impressive
<nixternal> it is over rated once you use it
<willvdl> The poster layout is already designed etc. by canonical.
<willvdl> based on the cd covers
<SimonAnibal> yeah, but the discovery of it is exciting
<willvdl> I just have to add current screenshots, some blurbs under the screenshots
<SimonAnibal> after using it for a while you go "hum dee dum", but the first few times it's like "Whoah! That's fun!"
<willvdl> and some kind of eye-catching master phrase by the logo which has me stumped :/
<stelis> I guess the important is that Edubuntu just works, without having to worry about the system falling over, or getting viruses
<willvdl> "just use it"
<stelis> Yeah :)
<highvoltage> eish. who knew that lots of hard work can make you this tired? :)
<stelis> Nike wouldn't like it, something along those lines sounds right to me
<stelis> (Though)
<SimonAnibal> highvoltage: Some mysteries are never to be grokked
<highvoltage> :)
<SimonAnibal> "Freedom in Educational Computing, that works"
<willvdl> stelis, agreed but I'd like to add an "Education" tinge to it somehow
<stelis> Learn the New Way
<SimonAnibal> New sounds Unstable
<willvdl> this is Limpopo...there is no Old Way :)
<stelis> hahaha
<stelis> I was thinking of rows of Win98 desktops
<LaserJock> What about something along the lines of "Edubuntu: Free your education"
<SimonAnibal> Oooo
<SimonAnibal> I like
<willvdl> Okie, "free" or "freedom" is definatel something to include.
<stelis> Edubuntu: the World is Open
<SimonAnibal> Open up you Education
<willvdl> Freedom to learn...
<willvdl> Freedom in Education
<SimonAnibal> Connect to a World of Free & Open Education
<stelis> Learn without Limits
<SimonAnibal> Oooo, I like Learn without Limits, too
<stelis> Thinking about it, I like the word "Learn" more than "Teach", or "Education"
<willvdl> The problem is that not all the content/curriculum is provided for free
<willvdl> but the platform is
<willvdl> moot point
<SimonAnibal> Well, but the simple act of accepting Edubuntu brings them to a world where there IS free and open content
<SimonAnibal> As opposed to where they are right now
<SimonAnibal> most of them
<SimonAnibal> It's opening a possibility
<SimonAnibal> It's showing a "Better Way"(tm)
<stelis> I guess I was thinking about the freedom to access the Internet, without fear.
<SimonAnibal> :) Is that cheesy
<SimonAnibal> ?
<willvdl> stelis, agree with "learn" rather than "education"
<willvdl> stelis, connectivity is a seperate issue
<stelis> I suppose so
<willvdl> where these posters are going, there is little BW
<willvdl> okay, "freedom", "learn"... what else can we throw in the mix?
<SimonAnibal> BW?
<SimonAnibal> bandwidth?
<willvdl> bandwidth
<stelis> OK. I guess it would be interesting to know what they hope to gain from using computers
<SimonAnibal> nodnod
<SimonAnibal> "Free Your Mind, Neo"
<willvdl> exposure to ICT
<SimonAnibal> "And You Will Free Your Learning"
<willvdl> ICT enhanced educational delivery
<willvdl> where there previously was none
<highvoltage> SimonAnibal: that last one is interesting :)
<stelis> So being "modern" is important here?
<willvdl> brb
<willvdl> stelis, not too sure really
<willvdl> want to keep it "generic" if that helps?
<SimonAnibal> "Free your Learning"? Simple, sweet & memorable
<stelis> I'm genuinely unsure what the killer app for a computer without connectivity is, if you see what I mean
<willvdl> limited connectivity
<SimonAnibal> That totally depends on the goals of the community
<stelis> Open the Door
<willvdl> where we pop loads of offline media onto it
<highvoltage> stelis: in areas where there is close to no computing at all, even something as simple as a simple word processor is a killer app
<SimonAnibal> Edubuntu is a base platform upon which to build functionality, it's a means not an end
<willvdl> stelis, the killer app is learning to use the thing
<highvoltage> edubuntu is a great base to build on though
<willvdl> agree with highvoltage
<SimonAnibal> DEFINATELY
<willvdl> we digress :)
<highvoltage> yeah, I agree with willvdl too :)
<SimonAnibal> I wouldn't be here otherwise
<SimonAnibal> errrrr definItely
<SimonAnibal> I always do that...
<SimonAnibal> Which is strange considering I come from Spanish
<SimonAnibal> and it would be definitivamente
<SimonAnibal> so I can't blame that
<willvdl> sorry, don't mean to drag the context of the poster into it. Just looking for a nice generic blurb
<willvdl> the "free your learning" is interesting but sounds funny :)
<SimonAnibal> "Freedom to Learn"
<SimonAnibal> Which is a freedom that proprietary software denies
<stelis> "Start Here. Learn to Go Anywhere"
<stelis> Doesn't sound quite right
<LaserJock> "Freedom to Learn, Freedom to Explore"
<SimonAnibal> "What do you want to Learn today?" :-P
<SimonAnibal> I am unilaterally not endorsing what I just said, btw
<stelis> "A computer on every desktop" :)
<stelis> *cough*
<SimonAnibal> That's our goal here, with Indiana ACCESS
<willvdl> highvoltage, do you think "Freedom to LEarn" might be too _political_ for Limpopo?
<willvdl> I gotto run. Thanks folks, I think this is something we can thrash out again in future
<willvdl> Fortunately, this is only for 6 posters
<stelis> willvdl: If you drop a mail on the list then people could chew on it for a bit
<willvdl> definately
<stelis> (If time permits)
<willvdl> but I'll go with a "freedom to learn" idea or "opening education" 
<stelis> Opening education sounds very close to it
<willvdl> seem to be the most popular ideas suggested
<willvdl> Thanks a million people. I'm very late :) chat later.
<SimonAnibal> willvdl: l8r
<Loculi> Hi, I was wondering if there was someone here I could bounce a couple of questions off re: contributing content to EduBuntu
<SimonAnibal> What do you mean by content?
<Loculi> well, educational application(s) or something perhaps like a Flash framegame
<SimonAnibal> :) Well, to be included directly with Edubuntu it would need to be in a format that could be run out of the box, I'd guess
<Loculi> I work for a company that creates educational software, and was interested in seeing how we might be able to release something under open source to contribute to EduBuntu
<happy-and-lost> What type of install does the EduEdgy CD provide?
<SimonAnibal> a free format, or something that works with the default edubuntu settings
<SimonAnibal> But don't quote me, I'm just stating what I assume
<Loculi> I see, yeah the bulk of our applications are flash based
<SimonAnibal> You'd still be useful to the education community, I'm sure, but reading flash requires non-free stuff right now
<Loculi> I think I'll jump onto one of the mailing lists, see what I can discover :)
<SimonAnibal> Maybe if Gnash can play them...
<Loculi> yeah, was just thinking about how Adobe is finally beginning to open it up
<SimonAnibal> You should look up the Gnash project and see how far along they are compared to your content
<Loculi> not sure if it's premature though to start thinking along these lines but thought I'd check nonetheless
<SimonAnibal> Last I heard they could do most everything besides the movie content
<SimonAnibal> But my advice is to try it out and see for yourself
<Loculi> cool thanks for the tip
<ogra> happy-and-lost, could you rephrase the question ?
<SimonAnibal> :) We appreciate your enthusiasm to help out, though
<SimonAnibal> er, not though, we just do
<Loculi> basically I was just trying to come up w/ some ideas on how our company might be able to contribute, we've got so many apps :P
<Loculi> thanks again
<SimonAnibal> Might I suggest running that by RichEd
<happy-and-lost> Is the EduEdgy CD text or graphical install?
<SimonAnibal> you can probably private message him about it, I think he might be interested in what you're proposing
<SimonAnibal> I believe all Edgy CDs besides the Alternative CDs are Live CD installs. I could be wrong.
<Loculi> nice thanks, now to see how GAIM handles private tells ;)
<ogra> happy-and-lost, the one we ship is the text install ... but you can download the liveCD that has a geaphical install (but only installs a workstation setup)
<SimonAnibal> try "/msg Nickname Message"
<SimonAnibal> :) ogra is the man to trust on this
<happy-and-lost> So when it says that Edu live doesn't contain server elements... will it still be able to browse and access Windows shares via samba?
<stgraber> happy-and-lost: the Edgy live cd can't install an Edubuntu LTSP server
<stgraber> happy-and-lost: but it installs a classical edubuntu workstation
<stgraber> with everything
<happy-and-lost> Thanks, that's what I'm after
<pips1> edubuntugirl: tell RichEd I sent you a mail with notes on building a community website
<edubuntugirl> Righto, pips1!
<pips1> thanks and bye bye
<pips1> :)
<RichEd> edubuntugirl
<edubuntugirl> RichEd: by the way, pips1 told me to tell you 'I sent you a mail with notes on building a community website' 53 seconds ago (on Fri Nov 10 23:43:30 2006)
<RichEd> cool
<stgraber> Anyone around knows a little about packaging ?
<stgraber> I followed the packaging guide but I have a small problem when finally generating the .deb
<stgraber> dpkg-deb: building package `pastebinit' in `../pastebinit_0.0.1-1_all.deb'.
<stgraber> tar: -: file name read contains nul character dpkg-genchanges
<LaserJock> stgraber: did it error out?
<LaserJock> I'm not sure that that would be a problem
<stgraber> no deb are generated ...
<LaserJock> do you know that?
<LaserJock> how are you building them? pbuilder?
<stgraber> yes
<stgraber> oo, I have found them (or I think at least ...)
<LaserJock> so you looked in /var/cache/pbuilder/result/
<stgraber> nope, and that was the problem :) I just did a *.deb search on my home directory not on the whole system :)
<stgraber> btw, it should be precised in the packaging guide
<stgraber> (or I didn't read it correctly)
<LaserJock> I thought I clarified that :/
* LaserJock goes to check
<LaserJock> stgraber: where are you reading the packaging guide from?
<stgraber> the one installed with Edgy
<LaserJock> yeah, there is this, "The resulting .debs and source packages can be found in /var/cache/pbuilder/result/ (which can be changed with the --buildresult flag)."
<LaserJock> maybe I should put it in a warning box :-)
<LaserJock> you certainly aren't the first person to run across that
* stgraber still didn't find on which page this indication is :)
<LaserJock> https://help.ubuntu.com/6.10/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/gs-pbuilder.html
<LaserJock> in the Using pbuilder section
<stgraber> ok, maybe writing it once again in the "Packaging with Debhelper" could be useful
<LaserJock> hmm, good point
<LaserJock> they are a bit far removed
* LaserJock makes a note
<Nix> hello! :)
<stgraber> hi
<Nix> I'm searching of software of the crosswords that run web
<Nix> stgraber, hi! :)
<Nix> I have a maker crosswords, but this program show error... so, I'm finding a new solution...
<Nix> sorry... my English isn't very good :(
<stgraber> Are you looking for a crossword generator that generates a webbased crossword, or a webbased crossword generator ?
<Nix> stgraber, I looking a crossword generator a webbased :)
<stgraber> LaserJock: oh, and I forgot thank you :)
<LaserJock> np
<Nix> stgraber, I found a software, in this site http://www.tesol.net/scripts/
<Nix> but the program does not function correctly
<pygi> hey HedgeMage 
<Nix> stgraber, thank you... I need to leave now
<Nix> kisses and hughes for all :*
<HedgeMage> hi pygi 
<RichEd> hey pgyi and HedgeMage :)
<HedgeMage> hi RichEd :)
#edubuntu 2006-11-11
<LaserJock> RichEd: ping
<cbx33> hey Las
<cbx33> oh
<cbx33> :(
<RichEd> pong las
<RichEd> cbx33: hey there
<cbx33> hey RichEd 
<cbx33> howz ti going
<cbx33> http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/?p=158
<cbx33> hehe
<RichEd> well ... we should have 8-10 new features for fiesty :)
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> everyone tired?
<RichEd> quite knackered now ... about to wind down into the last dinner
<RichEd> cbx33: just read the blog ... it's not clear as to what happened to wet the keyboard ?
<cbx33> it went in the dishwasher ;)
<cbx33> yeh I'll add a little something
<RichEd> oh .... and what is the standard recommended drying time for a dishwashed keyboard ?
<crimsun> a day
<crimsun> probably shorter if you leave it in a warm (not hot), sunny area
<crimsun> or you can use the hairdryer method for an hour
<cbx33> it was in the airing cupboard.....but that obviously wan't enough ;)
<RichEd> oh ... and i hope it was a coffee spil and not some sort of web surfing nocturnal emission that fouled it up in the first place ;)
<cbx33> no...just got mucky apparently
<cbx33> ;)
<cbx33> bbl
<RichEd> k
<juantao> Hello, do you know of any application that would help a Spanish speaker learn English? ESL for Linux?
<pygi> morning all
<pygi> highvoltage: poke?
<highvoltage> pygi: pongk
<pygi> highvoltage: wanna burn multi-session cd? :)
<highvoltage> not really.
<highvoltage> I want to burn DVD's!@!
<highvoltage> ^_^
<pygi> uh, well, we didn't implement dvd yet ^_^
<highvoltage> yet...
<pygi> well, ofcourse :P Everything will be here one day, especially if I can get some books (which I doubt, but oh well)
<highvoltage> I can't remember when last I needed to burn a multi-session disc. why do people still do it?
<highvoltage> like yellow books and orange books? ;)
<pygi> highvoltage: indeed :P
<pygi> highvoltage: get me one :P
<pygi> highvoltage: actually, entire set of rainbow books is even better =)
<pygi> highvoltage: for example, sivang wanna use multi-session for backup storing in HUB
* pygi pings to see if he's online ?!
<pygi> everything is so quiet
* Kamping_Kaiser waves to pygi 
<pygi> oh, nice, thanks :P
<Kamping_Kaiser> :P
<highvoltage> pygi: sorry, busy with other work atm, not meaning to ignore you!
<pygi> highvoltage: don't worry ^_^
<highvoltage> pygi: isn't the rainbow books publicly available?
<highvoltage> or can't you buy them somewhere?
<pygi> highvoltage: well, I can probably buy them, but 5000$ is a lot for just red book for example ^_^
<highvoltage> wow
<highvoltage> perhaps you should get all the pricing and have a fundraiser for all the books.
<pygi> heh, I doubt anybody would donate anything :P
<highvoltage> a lot of people are interested in libburn, I'm sure many would sponsor
<highvoltage> perhaps you could even ask FSF to help out. you might have to call it gnu libburn :)
<pygi> lol 
<pygi> it's interesting actually, altought many people seem to be interested in libburn, none wants to get involved with anything
<highvoltage> I think it might be because the type of people who would be interested in it, are already hectically busy in so many other projects
<pygi> dunno really, but it's already going very nice
<pygi> but I'm constantly rushing into points where I really need those books
<pygi> currently I'm reading MMC specs drafts, and such things which at some points aren't even correct
<highvoltage> pygi: if I install a new usplas theme, do you know what I need to do to get it in my initrd too? i installed a new usplash theme but the old one still shows when I boot up.
<highvoltage> and somehow i forgot how to use mkinitrd :/
<pygi> you can use that tool that Seveas wrote for changing usplash themes
<pygi> highvoltage: http://www.kaarsemaker.net/files/Software/usplash-switcher.c
<highvoltage> At the time of writing, the cost as per the relevant Philips order form (document no. 28/10/04-3122 783 0027 2) is US$5000.
<pygi> update-alternatives and update-initramfs otherwise, I think
<highvoltage> omg
<pygi> highvoltage: and that is only one book :-/
<highvoltage> pygi: aaah, update-initramfs is what I'm looking for, I was still looking for the old fasioned tools
<highvoltage> perhaps you should write to philips and explain them what you are working on, and that sending the books to you would be seen as a sponsorship of the project?
<highvoltage> while you're at it, ask them to send you a bunch of drives too ;)
<pygi> I can try, that's true, but I'm not Joerg or anyone else so I could do that
<pygi> Andy and Joerg have access to pre-pre-pre prototype drives, all the specs, etc., etc.
<highvoltage> wow
<pygi> that's how andy implemented blu ray support :P
<highvoltage> geez, that's quite cutting edge.
<highvoltage> I think you should perhaps still draw up a budget of the materials you would need.
<highvoltage> s/would/do
<pygi> I can try yes, but the amount will be rather big
<highvoltage> I think you should write philips and if they can't sponsor a copy, then ask if they could at least provide some kind of discount (that would also be seen as sponsorship) and then you could get the remainder somewhere else.
<highvoltage> I know these companies are heavy on keeping their specs close to them, but sometimes you're just lucky.
<highvoltage> if you have a bunch of philips drives you could also assure them that any philips drive will work well becuase it's been tested.
<pygi> indeed, and phillips is especially hard on their lightscribe spec
<pygi> we'll see how it goes, but I really hope libburn will mature into something really usable in next couple of years
<highvoltage> well, it seems that it might be used to burn cd's over ltsp in the next year or so, that's already a nice application for it, even though a niche application.
<pygi> I'm neither as good developer as Andy or Joerg, and I don't have the books, but I'm willing and things are looking nice so far ...
<highvoltage> if it could burn dvd's I'd be very happy :)
<pygi> right, well same here, but I don't even know which book defines dvd standard :)
<pygi> but I hope you'll see it in a year or so 
<highvoltage> for sure.
<pygi> highvoltage: I'll stop bothering you now, sorry :)
<highvoltage> no, no problem. I talk to you while I wait for things to build :)
<pygi> highvoltage: oh, oki then ^_^
<pygi> I can't build things because my system refuses to sign the packages :-/
<bddebian> Heya
<highvoltage> hey mr debian
<bddebian> Heh, hi highvoltage
<jsgotangco> hey whats up
<highvoltage> busy hacking ubiquity... not sure if it's more bravery or stupidity that led me to it :
<highvoltage> )
<jsgotangco> hahaha
<bddebian> Hi jsgotangco
<jsgotangco> hey bddebian
<jsgotangco> so what's happening at UDS now
<jsgotangco> heh
<highvoltage> UDS still going?
<jsgotangco> oh yeah, its saturday already
<jsgotangco> hehe
<jsgotangco> i forgot
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
* stgraber is happy :)
<stgraber> My pastebin client script can now handle a lot of different pastebin
<highvoltage> :)
<highvoltage> link?
<stgraber> (and is shorter) :)
<stgraber> http://www.stgraber.org/download/projects/pastebin/pastebinit.py
<stgraber> I will just have to update the "usages" part because now you can put as second argument the URL of the pastebin
<stgraber> My first python script/software, but it's a really easy to use/learn language
<highvoltage> nice. how does it work? you pipe something to the script and it pastes it for you?
<nixternal> oy
<stgraber> two way
<stgraber> 1) a command | ./pastebinit -
<stgraber> 2) ./pastebinit /etc/X11/xorg.conf
<stgraber> and it simply returns the URL
<stgraber> you can also add as a second argument the URL of a pastebin (the default one is http://ubuntu.pastebin.com)
<highvoltage> that looks quite useful.
<highvoltage> *especially* when working on thin clients
<highvoltage> it's always a hassle redirecting the output to a file first, then scp'ing it to my real machine, and then finally pasting it.
<highvoltage> if my thin client is natted, and I have this installed in my chroot, it could be useful.
<stgraber> http://www.stgraber.org/download/projects/pastebin/pastebinit_0.3_all.deb
<stgraber> The .deb version
<willvdl> hey all
<highvoltage> hey willvdl 
<willvdl> dood. sitting at airport. already bored and haven't even boarded yet
<highvoltage> :-/
<highvoltage> from where to where?
* highvoltage has no idea where willvdl is at the moment
<willvdl> going to San Fran for Allhands
<highvoltage> ah, of course.
<willvdl> really looking forward to putting faces to names
<highvoltage> the real life meetings are quite useful for that :)
<highvoltage> and launchpad doesn't do most people justice...
<willvdl> true. hackergotchis are also not quite the representative 
<willvdl> highvoltage, is there a spot on the edubuntu web where I can get decent sized screenshots?
<willvdl> http://www.edubuntu.org/images/tour/*.png ?
<highvoltage> probably
<highvoltage> i must admit the screenshots are slightly outdated
<highvoltage> I took a bunch of screenshots yesterday, some of it would be the same in edubuntu
<highvoltage> just a sec...
<willvdl> cool
<willvdl> well, not really that outdated. they're dapper screenshots...
<highvoltage> willvdl: http://www.tuxlab-os.co.za/screenshots
<willvdl> shweeeet
<highvoltage> that site isn't really launched yet, so it's a bit uncomplete, but the screenshots are from edgy
<willvdl> nice, like the rounded edges and drop shadows (a favourate of mine)
<willvdl> is that a drupal site?
<willvdl> nice theme
<highvoltage> yes, drupal site
<willvdl> urk. need to find a power point.
<highvoltage> what is that?
<highvoltage> :)
<willvdl> more hamsters more hamster
<willvdl> okie outa here.
<willvdl> ciao bene
<highvoltage> bye
<hal9k2010> hello all 
<highvoltage> hello hal9k2010 
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: be hal
<edubuntugirl> I can feel my mind going...
<hal9k2010> need some help with unbuntu in a mac 
<hal9k2010> anyone with exp. in instaling enbuntu in a mac ?
<stgraber> I have done that several time on a G3 mac
<stgraber> maybe I can help
<hal9k2010> i have a powerbook wallstreet and i was thinking in trying linux in that mac need info how to do it 
<hal9k2010> i will apreciate the help 
<hal9k2010> powerbook wallstreet running mac os 8.6 and 64 mgs of ram 
<stgraber> ok, what did you try until now ?
<hal9k2010> i download from the website the cd data but never mounted in the mac... i transfer the image to this mac i am using now, is a b/w power mac  i dont know what i need for the powerbook to mount the data 
<hal9k2010> sorry i am totally ignorant about linux and how to install in the mac 
<stgraber> first, do you have a cdrom reader on the mac ?
<hal9k2010> if you mean that if i have a cd rom in the powerbook .. yes
<hal9k2010> yes i do  have a cd rom 
<stgraber> ok, so once you have burned your ubuntu install cdrom (simply burn the image, not extract it on the CD)
<stgraber> you should be able to boot it by :
<stgraber> Putting the CD in the cdrom reader
<stgraber> Shutdown the Mac
<stgraber> Power on the mac while pressing the "c" key until the CD-Rom boot
<hal9k2010> ok so i need a cd burner...  i guess i have 2 look 4 one now and try that way 
<hal9k2010> thanks stgraber... hope works this time 
<sbalneav> Afternoon all
<pygi> hey sbalneav 
<stgraber> hi
<pygi> I saw we didn't get a session for ltsp burning
<pygi> too bad
<pygi> sbalneav: wanted to tell you we implemented multi session support in libburn
<pygi> and it freakin' rocks :)
<pygi> (dunno if you read planet ubuntu)
<pygi> sbalneav, you alive? :P
<mario_> edubuntugirl, tell sbalneav I'm very sad that we didn't got the ltsp burning bits session, but oh well, stuff happens. On the other note, -multi now works under -tao in libburn.
<edubuntugirl> Righto, mario_!
#edubuntu 2006-11-12
<ace> goodnight. all
<jared555> I followed the guides on the site, the thin client boots, but it is impossible to log in (even if I manually add users to the thin client's passwd, shadow, group files)
<jared555> any ideas how to fix it?
<Burgundavia> not off the top of my head
<Kamping_Kaiser> darn, jar left
<Burgundavia> hey highvoltage
<pygi> hey Burgundavia highvoltage others :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> hi :)
<Burgundavia> hey pygi and Kamping_Kaiser
<highvoltage> hey pygi and burgs
<Kamping_Kaiser> hi Burgundavia 
<Kamping_Kaiser> :(
<Burgundavia> do either or you have amd64 with webbrowers available?
<highvoltage> and mr Kaiser
<Burgundavia> or ppc
<Kamping_Kaiser> :)
* Kamping_Kaiser shakes head
<highvoltage> I'm boring, I only have i386.
<pygi> Burgundavia, why not run qemu? :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> i have PPC's, but they are old world, and not fun to install
<Burgundavia> hmm, interesting
<Burgundavia> I am testing out a user agent sniffing string for our downloads
<Burgundavia> ubuntu.ca/test.html
<techNiKal> hi is there any software to create your own cbt in your own languages ? i want to create cbt for my language can anyone guide me about it please ? 
<Burgundavia> cbt?
<crimsun> computer-based training, probably
<Burgundavia> ah, right
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: btw, after reading your blog comment I just want to say again that I appreciate and enjoy your stance on free software, and that you continue to make a stand
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: been meaning to say it about the launchpad stuff too
<Burgundavia> thanks for the kind words
<Burgundavia> sometimes it is hard, thinking you are alone
<highvoltage> no, you're not alone.
<crimsun> heh, several years ago I stopped using 'nvidia' in favour of 'nv' just because of that
<crimsun> sure, lost some functionality, but I enjoy being able to fix issues
<crimsun> and of course now I don't use 'nv' at all but instead the modesetting branch of 'i810'
<Kamping_Kaiser> Burgundavia, when you fight that battle, you are not alone
<highvoltage> all hail Burgundavia, leader of the ubuntu-freedom-fighters! :p
<Burgundavia> heh
<stgraber> Burgundavia: I have a G3 laptop running Kubuntu, what do you want me to try ?
<Burgundavia> stgraber: sure, thanks
<stgraber> "Download now for PPC"
<Burgundavia> perfect
<stgraber> and the same with konqueror
<Burgundavia> does that run OS X as well?
<stgraber> Yes
<Burgundavia> would you mind testing with that as well/
<Burgundavia> ?
<stgraber> ofc
* stgraber is trying to boot all the partitions one by one to find which one is the MacOSX boot one (10 partitions)
<stgraber> yee, I got the good one this time :)
<stgraber> "Download Now for power PC" with safari
<Burgundavia> perfect
<Burgundavia> now I just need to figure out why this function calling is not working
<stgraber> same result with Firefox
<gsuveg> re
<highvoltage> Burgundavia: do you know if it's a different process in edgy to make a usplash screen?
<highvoltage> i just end up with a completely black screen somehow :/
<Burgundavia> no idea, sorry
<pygi> highvoltage: what's the problem?!
<highvoltage> pygi: i make a usplash image, and when I install it it boots fine, but the splash screen is just completely black
<pygi> highvoltage: with update-initramfs?
<highvoltage> yep
<pygi> highvoltage: that's weird
<highvoltage> pygi: I hope you didn't spend the entire 41 minutes pondering before you said that ;)
<stgraber> :)
<bddebian> Howdy
<ace> hi all
<Kamping_Kaiser> gday
<bddebian> Hello ace, Kamping_Kaiser
<Kamping_Kaiser> :)
<ace> hi there... wassup...
<ace> anyone know why gcompris has no sound under ltsp ? and hydrogen neither ?
<Kamping_Kaiser> do you have remote device support enabled?
<ace> no, just the sound
<ace> as in 'Sound=True' in lts.conf
<pygi> highvoltage: ofcourse I have :P
<highvoltage> ^_^
<stgraber-ipv6> yeah, ipv6 rocks :)
<pygi> highvoltage: just reinstalled ubuntu, gotta see if packaging will now work
* stgraber-ipv6 likes the @laptop.lan.stgraber.org :)
<highvoltage> loom loom loom
<highvoltage> hmmm...
<bddebian> Why are some like this:
<bddebian> boolean_t untimeout(fcn, param)
<bddebian>     register int    (*fcn)(/* char *param */);
<bddebian>     register char * param;
<bddebian> While others just do this:
<bddebian> void timeout(fcn, param, interval)
<bddebian>     int (*fcn)(/* char * param */);
<bddebian>     char *  param;
<bddebian>     int interval;
<bddebian> Shit, sorry wrong window
<highvoltage> it's ok. I've confused vim for irssi too sometimes.
<highvoltage> that's why you'll find loooong irellevant conversations in tuxlab code.
<bddebian> heh
<Yagisan> :)
<RichEd> edubuntugirl: Tell Nuffing I was looking for her to say Happy Birthday to Griffin and that RichEd loves and misses them all the way from the US of A back to the Z of A
<edubuntugirl> Righto, RichEd!
<RichEd> edubuntugirl: seen Nuffing
<edubuntugirl> Nuffing was last seen on #edubuntu 3 days, 38 minutes and 49 seconds ago, saying: I'm telling you he is hiding! [Thu Nov  9 20:59:20 2006] 
<highvoltage> sounds like she's hiding :)
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: seen JaneW
<edubuntugirl> JaneW was last seen on #edubuntu 185 days, 22 hours, 14 minutes and 24 seconds ago, saying: thwaps edubuntugirl  [Wed May 10 23:24:14 2006] 
<highvoltage> shoe
<highvoltage> RichEd: goodnight
<pygi> highvoltage, ok, now I'm in a mess :)
<pygi> what permissions should be set on random_seed?
<pygi> and have you managed to do anything with usplash?
<highvoltage> pygi: nope, haven't figured it out, just get a blank screen :(
<highvoltage> pygi: where do I find that file? I don't seem to hav ie installed
<highvoltage> i thought it would be in /etc/random_seed :/
<pygi> highvoltage, in /home/username/.gnupg/
<highvoltage> afaik everything in .gnupg should only be readable by it's owner
<highvoltage> (and everything above it too, up to your home directory)
<pygi> highvoltage, for me everything in that dir is owned by root :-/
<pygi> well, that's fine actually, dont wanna anyone mess with my keys
<pygi> hmfa,afh :-/
<pygi> highvoltage, can you tell the ownership of files in that dir at your place?
<pygi> It seems I messed something badly again :P
<pygi> right, all should be owned by me :-o
<pygi> bleh, I'm getting rusty
<pygi> highvoltage, now for the usplash problem ...
<pygi> have you tried that tool seveas made? perhaps it can help
<pygi> bddebian, ping?
<bddebian> pygi: Sorta here, what's up?
#edubuntu 2007-11-05
<jvess> I'm having trouble booting ltsp clients, is anyone experienced with that?
<highvoltage> ogra: I've changed the mailing list rules to get rid of spam instead of keeping it for approval, spamassassin is quite acurate, I don't think we'll have false-positives
<highvoltage> ogra: the lists should be a bit more managable now, and there should be less admin requests
<test___> hi
<test___> help me plz
<highvoltage> test___: feel free to ask if you ned help with something
<test___> http://www.vguard.net/E_download_vgcard.htm <---- this system on windows based how to run on edubuntu?
<test___> this system use dll on windows system32 /. dll and mplayer - but how do run dll or other components on edubuntu?
<highvoltage> test___: you might be able to run it under wine, but Windows software is not supported under edubuntu
<test___> ok thank?
<fja> i've just installed edubuntu 7.10 and the clients (with i810 video) boot up and starts x. But when a user logout clients can not start X/gdm again. I've got the following error msg: [drm:i810_wait_ring] *ERROR* lockp [drm:i810_wait_ring] *ERROR* space: 65520 wanted 65528
<fja> are there known fixes/workarounds to this problem?
<fja> earlier we ran debian and ltsp4.2 and it worked great except sound...
<fja> i've tried X_VIDEORAM in lts.conf and XSERVER both auto and i810
<fja> different X_MODES...
<popey> use intel video instead of i810
<fja> i've got same error messages with XSERVER = intel
<cberlo> Hi folks.  I'm having a problem upgrading from Feisty to Gutsy.  I can't seem to rebuild my client chroot.  Can anyone help with this?
<cberlo> David, how's the lab?
<bddebian> Heya
<stgraber> hi ogra
<stgraber> I contacted iTalc's upstream, he told me that the VNC crash is a known problem with QT and will be fixed in .4 which will be released "really soon"
<stgraber> so I'm just waiting for this one to be out, then update my patches and we should have something working :)
<Goosemoose> can anyone tell me why my ubuntu machine can ping others on the domain using 'ping computer' but not 'ping computer.domain.local' ?
<ogra> stgraber, yay!
<musashi1> can anyone point me to a good how to for setting up things like the firefox home page, available apps and such for clients? I'm not finding anything on the edubuntu wiki (course i may not be searching well either).
<johnny_> howdy edubuntu peeps
<johnny_> i upgraded my ubuntu from feisty to gutsy, and for some reason they aren't keeping their hostnames anymore
<johnny_> previously it didn't work either, but i got around it by chmod 000 /etc/hostname in the chroot
<stgraber> is it taking the hostname from the DHCP server ?
<johnny_> pretty sure
<johnny_> lemme do one last verify
<johnny_> brb
<stgraber> ok, so you can probably fix that by changing /etc/dhcp3/dhclient.conf
<johnny_> it's getting the IP assigned in /etc/hosts
<johnny_> but i don't see the IP
<johnny_> i can ping them
<johnny_> by name
<johnny_> but they don't come up with the right name :)
<scrapbunny> is there any way to make the fonts look better on thin clients?
<johnny_> did you mean on the clients? or the host stgraber /
<scrapbunny> both
<johnny_> they both have send host-name "<hostname>";
<johnny_> ok screw this.. i'm chattr +i /etc/hostnamet
<johnny_>  /etc/hostname  in the chroot
<johnny_> ok next issue
<johnny_> audio
<johnny_> for some reason it allows one to change the server's volume
<pvangundy> hey all
<musashi1> can anyone point me to a good how to for setting up things like the firefox home page, available apps and such for clients? I'm not finding anything on the edubuntu wiki (course i may not be searching well either).
<johnny_> musashi1, try something like pessulus and sabayon
<musashi1> johnny_: not sure i understand.
<johnny_> you can use that set all sorts of defaults
<dtrask> hey edubuntu folks!  Check my latest blog post about the kids reaction to the CMPC today!  Complete with pics   http://dtrask.wordpress.com
<dtrask> ogra_cmpc: figured you might like to see the pics
<dtrask> ogra_cmpc: figured you might like to see the pics
<johnny_> is there a way to get unpartitioned memory sticks to work?
<johnny_> because that's somewhat of a deal breaker around here, plus does that affect cdrom drives?
<Burgundavia> johnny_: umm, can you buy unpartitioned memory sticks?
<Burgundavia> by default, they should be fat32
<johnny_> i thought the description meant single partitioned memory sticks
<johnny_> it's not very clear
<johnny_> in the DebugLocalDevices wiki page
<johnny_> so.. ok then issue is elsewhere
<Burgundavia> oh, that
<Burgundavia> hmm
<johnny_> it uses the word mounted
<Burgundavia> right
<johnny_> and a drive without a filesystem wouldn't get mounted in any case
<Burgundavia> yep
<Burgundavia> that isn't the clearest
<johnny_> i'm trying to debug why none of the usb drives are working  getting odd errors about /tmp i think
<johnny_> somebody jumped on that machine while i walked away
<johnny_> :(
<Burgundavia> do the drives work in a standard ubuntu machine or on the server?
<johnny_> we have a total of 4 terminals
<johnny_> two of them still have feisty installs
<johnny_> ie: still have a hard drive
<johnny_> and it gets detected on that
<johnny_> and i checked the dmesg on the client and the drive does get detected
<johnny_> it just doesn't get mounted
<johnny_> plus, a disc in the server cdrom drive is showing up on the clients
<johnny_> and the volume control on the client affects the servers
<Burgundavia> hmm, I don't know enough about the LTSP moving bits to tell you
<Burgundavia> but as a simple test, make certain that any drives work under non-LTSP
<johnny_> yes
<johnny_> they do
<johnny_> or rather.. this one doe
<johnny_> does*
<johnny_> this is the problem i'm having exactly https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/158989
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 158989 in ltsp "local device not working on some client" [Undecided,New]
#edubuntu 2007-11-06
<osl> i have a question about LTSP-5 that comes with edubuntu ... is it identical to LTSP-5 that is installed manually ? or edubuntu has its touches and modifications on LTSP-5 ??
<Bauer> is it possible to force edubuntu to write to usb-drives when you copy a file? Now it doesn't write everything to the drive unless you unmount it, and i think this would confuse the students..
<ffm> What is the procedures for upgrading LTSP thin client server to gutsy so that if somthing breaks, it can be undone?
<bddebian> Heya
<ronalde> we're running gutsy (upgrade from feisty) with HP t5725 thin clients. Since a few days we get a boot timeout after the loading of vmlinuz and initrd. The terminal on the clients says "Negotiation:" a waits for 100-200 seconds before actually loading the nbd-root
<ronalde> we tested it with a dell notebook: same behaviour
<scrapbunny> hello i am having i problem with applications freezing when students try to exit them, any fixes for this?
<bazz> hello
<bazz> anyone here?
<LaserJock> bazz: yes, there are people here
<bazz> cool was wonerining if anyone could give me some infi
<bazz> info
<bazz> I made a post on the dev mailing list here https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-devel/2007-November/002436.html and here https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-devel/2007-November/002437.html
<bazz> I was wondering if this was a knowen problem
<LaserJock> I'm not really sure
<LaserJock> right now most of the knowledgable people are at a conference or coming home from one
<bazz> oh
<LaserJock> it might take a bit to get a response to your emails but you should get one
<bazz> was it for edubuntu?
<LaserJock> Ubuntu and then for LTSP
<bazz> cool
<LaserJock> planning the next release
<bazz> any word as to what would be updated on LTSP? or thats what they are talking about?
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> I think local devices was one
<LaserJock> sorry local apps rather
<LaserJock> we already have local devices
<LaserJock> figuring out what to do with Thin Client Manager
<bazz> what is local apps?
<LaserJock> a gui frontend for ltsp-tools
<LaserJock> bazz: running programs on the thin client itself
<bazz> now that would be helpfull
<bazz> what is the point of a thin client then??
<bazz> would that be a fat client?
<LaserJock> well, in between I'd say
<bazz> so how would that work?
<LaserJock> the point is to use the CPU of the client to help the server do some work
<bazz> you havd a hard drive with an os installed?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> it's in the client chroot
<bazz> ahhh
<LaserJock> so basically if you wanted to say have Firefox as a local app
<LaserJock> you have that in the chroot and it'd get sent over
<bazz> wait but isnt the chroot still on the server side?
<bazz> so its like remote...local?
<LaserJock> yeah, but it get's sent to the client
<stgraber> yes, storage is still on the server but the CPU is the client's one
<bazz> thats cool
<LaserJock> so the app would be running of the client and communicate with the server
<bazz> I'm using this for an automation lab
<bazz> so I have a big interest in all this stuff
<bazz> I was at one point thinking of trying to make an automation distro based off ubuntu and ltsp but have no idea how to go about it
<bazz> so is it the developers that hang in here?
<scrapbunny> hello?
<bazz> hi
<scrapbunny> i am setting up an edubuntu thin client lab with dell gx110's as clients and the programs keep freezing when students try to close them. any fixes for this?
<LaserJock> scrapbunny: any program or just certain ones?
<scrapbunny> i thought last week it was just tux paint but i now have 11 clients up and it seems like all programs especially firefox and tux kids programs
<LaserJock> hmm, that's weird
<bazz> did you try to do a system update with the pre-release updates repository enabled
<bazz> I had a bunch of different problems with my set up. once i did that it fix some of them
<scrapbunny> do i ned to have everyone log off before i do that or will changes take effect after reboot?
<bazz> I dont know. I did the update and did a reboot.
<Goosemoose> can someone please tell me why I can ping a domain computer from ubuntu using 'ping computername' but not 'ping computername.dhs.local'? usually its then other way around!
<scrapbunny> thanks bazz i'll try it and see what happens
<bazz> I dont know if it will work, but like I said...it helped me with some of my problems
<scrapbunny> one other question, is there a way the change the default home page and desktop for all users?
<bazz> I'm sure there is, but I dont know how...sorry
<scrapbunny> thanks
<bazz> Goosemoose.....could it be becaue of the .local?
<Goosemoose> i dont know why it would be a problem, its an internal domain name
<bazz> .local is usualy a loopback i thought
<Goosemoose> bazz, no at least no when dealing with a windows domain
<musashi1> is there a good how to for setting up the default wallpaper, firefox home page, what apps are on the menu, etc for the clients? I'm not having much luck.
<bryang> musashi1: partial answer - http://szone.berlinwall.org/node/112
<musashi1> thanks. trying
<musashi1> okay set up the default home page (tho haven't tested). any suggestions of the other configs? if i can figure this out maybe i need to add something to the wiki.
<bryang> the pam stuff we setup creates the home dir and copies /etc/skel, so you could potentially pre-populate a lot of stuff that way
<bryang> altho users can still override after login
<bazz> anyone in here from the edubuntu team?
<bazz> any one here?
<bazz> hello?
<LaserJock> hi bazz
<bazz> anyone back yet?
<LaserJock> ogra and sbalneav aren't here
<LaserJock> they are the best guys to talk to
<bazz> off topic question...?
<bazz> you know anything about compiz?
<LaserJock> not a ton no, I don't have a lot of hardware that'll run it
<bazz> ok was wondering about on of the effects
<bazz> I cant wait to talk to someone about the ltsp stuff
<LaserJock> you could try asking in #ltsp and see if anybody is around over there
<bazz> cant find much documentation out there for how I'd like to use it
<bazz> well I think this would be more based toward the edubuntu set up
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> but many of them are pretty familiar with Edubuntu
<bazz> I wish there was an easer way to have the screen viewer and ssh set up
<bazz> cool I will have to check there too
<bazz> where are you from?
<LaserJock> Reno, Nevada, USA
<bazz> cool
<bazz> how is it out there. New Hampshire here
<LaserJock> dry and cold :-)
<bazz> well better than wet and cold lol
<LaserJock> well, actually in the sun it's not bad
<LaserJock> New Hampshire eh? We've got a number of new englanders it seems
<bazz> I'm guessing because of the boston area...?
<LaserJock> well, moquist is from New Hampshire
<LaserJock> and I thought dtrask was from Maine, but I'm not positive
<bazz> hmm interesting
<LaserJock> people from all over
<LaserJock> Germany, Switzerland, South Africa, Canada, etc.
<bazz> Gotta love opensource!!! It brings the world together
<bazz> I think more of life should be like opensource lol
<LaserJock> that it does
<bazz> well the  community anyway
<LaserJock> I wouldn't mind a version control life
<LaserJock> oopss, that was a mistake, let's go back to revision 2839
<bazz> lol
<amirman> hi everyone
<bazz> hello
<amirman> i've been taking apart computers and mixing and matching pieces all day and i finally have a stable computer ready for an OS, i'm fixing this computer up for some kids i know and i noticed that edubuntu has a requirement of 1 ghz processor, the computer i have set up only has 400 Mhz, i was wondering if there's anything like an edubuntu-lite, or an old version of edubuntu that i coul use out there, any help would be much appreciated
<LaserJock> amirman: what are you planning to do with it?
<amirman> i want to give it to these kids i know
<bazz> Well you could try xubuntu...lighter interface.....not shure if its light enough though
<LaserJock> amirman: but do you have any idea of what they'll be using it for?
<LaserJock> bazz: you can install xfce from Edubuntu
<amirman> is there a way to maybe mix xubuntu and have the packages from edubuntu?
<LaserJock> amirman: sure
<amirman> i think all they'll be doing with it is playing games
<amirman> and they are the opposite of spoiled so even really lightweight simple games would make them happy
<amirman> they are 4 and 6 years old
<bazz> oh yeah...sorry you could do that too
<LaserJock> amirman: how big of a hard disk?
<amirman> laserjock: how would i install xfce from edubuntu? how does that work, i'm a linux newbie
<amirman> the hard disk is 80 gigs
<amirman> 256 MB RAM
<LaserJock> oh nice
<LaserJock> ok, cool
<amirman> but the processor is pretty weak
<LaserJock> no problemo
<bazz> should be fine with xfce i would think
<LaserJock> I would grab the Edubuntu Classroom Server CD
<LaserJock> and also the Classroom Server Addon CD
<bazz> they are 4 and 6. I dont think they are going to care too much for speen
<amirman> what's the benefit of the classroom server cd and addon over the regular version?
<LaserJock> amirman: that is the regular version
<amirman> speen?
<amirman> oh sorry
<LaserJock> but when you boot the Classroom Server CD want to select a Workstation install
<amirman> so what's speen?
<LaserJock> speed I assume
<amirman> oh sorry i should have figured that out
<LaserJock> amirman: now, that will install a normal Edubuntu desktop
<amirman> i thought it was some special xfce thing
<amirman> ok
<amirman> will it work without the 1 gb processor up to that point?
<LaserJock> amirman: then you can put in the Addon CD and install more kid stuff and also Xfce (I think under Light Desktop)
<LaserJock> amirman: it'll be slow, but yes
<amirman> awesome
<LaserJock> so the short answer is, yes, you shouldn't have too much problems
<LaserJock> but it's gonna take some time
<amirman> i'm going to try it out, i'm going to stay logged in to this room, i'll let you know how it goes, i'm sure i'll be back with more questions before too long
<amirman> thanks again
<LaserJock> I've seen people install Ubuntu on like 333MHz machines with less ram
<LaserJock> amirman: will it have a internet connection?
<LaserJock> at least while being set up
<amirman> i have a wireless card in there
<amirman> and i have wireless in my house
<amirman> so i hope so
<LaserJock> hmm, hopefully, some cards are a bit of a pain
<ogra_cmpc> 80 gig.... what a luxury :)
<LaserJock> yeah
<amirman> i noticed, i used to have openSUSE on this machine but the wireless card never worked with it
<LaserJock> I was expecting 5GB
<amirman> well i also have a laptop with 1.3gb
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: you gonna be around for a sec?
<amirman> and a 300 MHz processor
<LaserJock> amirman: Ubuntu Server would work on that
<ogra_cmpc> LaserJock: yep
<amirman> the problem with the laptop is that it won't boot from the CD drive
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: bazz sent an email to -users I think about ssh/vnc/TCM
<amirman> i can only use the floppy drive to boot
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: I have no clue and I wondered if you might have some advice for him
<amirman> i can't even install freeDOS on it
<ogra_cmpc> i'm way behind on email (one thing i still got not proper on the classmate)
<amirman> because it won't find the cdrom
<ogra_cmpc> i'll try to look into that
<LaserJock> ogra_cmpc: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-devel/2007-November/002436.html
<LaserJock> oh, -devel actually
<LaserJock> bazz: you still around?
<LaserJock> amirman: does it have a network card?
<bazz> yes sorry
<bazz> I'm back
<LaserJock> bazz: awesome, ogra_cmpc is here, he's the leader of Edubuntu and works a lot on LTSP
<amirman> it has a superold kind i've never seen before
<amirman> i have no idea how it even works
<LaserJock> amirman: hehe
<bazz> cool hey
 * ogra_cmpc has actually to go to another meeting soon ... sorry, busy day here at the canonical conference
<ogra_cmpc> i have about 5min
<bazz> thats ok
<bazz> did you happen to see my post on the mailing list?
<ogra_cmpc> next week i'll be back to normal though
<bazz> about vnc/ screen viewer and ssh?
<ogra_cmpc> sadly i'm heavily behind on mail due to the two confs in a row
<bazz> k
<ogra_cmpc> (we had ubuntu developer conf last week, canonical company meeting this week)
<amirman> laserjock: it is a 33.6 mhz ethernet modem with xjack connector, 10 mbps LAN adapter
<bazz> to get screen viewer I had to get it woring as the the same way as in feisty
<ogra_cmpc> i'll look for it today and try to help you out
<bazz> tok cool
<bazz> just wondering if there is a few bugs with it
<amirman> what the heck is an xjack?
<ogra_cmpc> did you run ltsp-update-image after installing stuff in the chroot ?
<bazz> yes
<ogra_cmpc> thats a new command you need in gutsy for every change in there
<ogra_cmpc> ok
<bazz> I had to do a system update with pre-release res. enabled the the viewer worked
<ogra_cmpc> hmm, i need my HW around and try to follow the same procewss you did to see whats wrong actually
<bazz> ok
<bazz> I posted it all to the mailing list so when you have time
 * ogra_cmpc only has the classmate with him
<ogra_cmpc> ... and have to go afk now ... bbl
<bazz> have a good one
<bazz> hmmm
<bazz> update image in chroot???
<bazz> I think i did it as sudo ltsp-update-image...
<bazz> thats right....right?
<bazz> should it have been chroot /opt/ltsp/i386
<bazz> ltsp-update-image?
<bazz> ahh anyway
<Goosemoose> ok im going nuts here. i can type 'ping r2d2' and geta response that says 'from r2d2.dhs.local....' BUT if i type 'ping r2d2.dhs.local' i get unknown host!
<Goosemoose> bulmer, any other ideas then?
<baz> you have a host file?
<Goosemoose> yes
<Goosemoose> it has one hosts line in it
<Goosemoose> file mdns4.minimal [NOTFOUND=return] dns mdns4
<Goosemoose> actually says files
<baz> comment out the line?
<baz> I think i has something like this
<Goosemoose> didnt try that
<Goosemoose> trying now, do i need to do anything after i comment it out? reset anything?
<baz> I think the proble had to do with dns
<drx0drx0> anyone know how to copy directories from a Linux box to a Windows 2000 or XP system OR a Novell server OR a hybrid drive that supports Windows & Mac OS?
<baz> did you try a nslookup?
<baz> ahh how do ya mean?
<Goosemoose> but why would nslookup work?
<Goosemoose> yes
<Goosemoose> nslookup r2d2.dhs.local worked fine!
<baz> just copy them over
<Goosemoose> so did ping r2d2
<baz> what if you nslookup r2d2
<drx0drx0> baz, how do I get Linux to see the Windows share, by just using a URL as in //windowspc/sharename  in the copy command?
<baz> is it a share? or a mounted drive?
<baz> drx0drx0 you using ubuntu
<Goosemoose> baz, nslookup r2d2 returns r2d2.dhs.local 10.0.0.5
<Goosemoose> if i add r2d2.dhs.local to the hosts file then i can ping it with fqdn
<Goosemoose> but i cant ping anything else the domain unless i drop the .dhs.local
<drx0drx0> baz, it's a Windows Share
<baz> drx0drx0  you using ubuntu? kubuntu?
<drx0drx0> baz:  ubuntu and SUSU
<drx0drx0> baz, ubuntu & SUSE
<baz> under places I think there is a thing call servers..or connect to server...?
<baz> click on that then click network
<drx0drx0> Network Servers and then Windows Servers, yes, but it's MT
<baz> enter your workgroup or whatever, user name and pass
<drx0drx0> baz, where?
<baz> you using feisty, or gusty?
<baz> MT?
<drx0drx0> empty
<baz> so your network is empty?
<baz> what windos os are you trying to connect to/
<drx0drx0> baz, XP Pro
<baz> if your network is showing empty then it could be the firewall on xp
<drx0drx0> I turned it off
<baz> wait a few befor trying again
<drx0drx0> I can't ping the client, it pings the Windows client 1 x then it pings the gateway
<baz> xp can delay sometimes
<drx0drx0> it's been about 1/2 hour
<baz> you pinging the ip or the host name?
<drx0drx0> ip
<baz> hmm strange
<drx0drx0> baz, i know, & I can totally ping the gateway (router)
<baz> but you cant ping the xp machine?
<baz> is it on the same network?
<drx0drx0> baz, actually, I can't ping anything besides my own Linux server IP
<baz> from the ubuntu machin or the xp machine
<drx0drx0> baz, now I can ping the XP box
<baz> it was the firewall
<drx0drx0> baz, maybe, but I can't see anything in Network Servers & when I put in the ip address it shows nothing
<drx0drx0> baz, so I went with smb://<ip> & that worked, thanks!
<baz> just clik on the network button
<drx0drx0> baz, just curious, why can't i browse?
<baz> k
<baz> brows the network..?
<drx0drx0> y
<baz> sometime the windows service take a few for machins to see
<baz> what is the protocal netbui..? or something
<baz> ok i need to do some stuff
<drx0drx0> baz, I think it's TCP/IP + smb, but netbui is generally used by windows shares
<drx0drx0> baz, ok thanks!
<baz> have fun
<drx0drx0> baz, one last ?, is writing to an NTFS volume via a windows client share reliable (I know they say writing directly to NTFS from Linux is not)?
<baz> I do it all the time
<drx0drx0> ok, cause this data is worth $$$$$$
<baz> havent had problem yet
<baz> the i would not chance if it $$$$
<drx0drx0> baz, so what should I do then?
<baz> remeber to always back up!!!
<baz> then transfer
<drx0drx0> baz, what u mean?
<drx0drx0> baz, u mean backup into the ext3 filesystem using some backup utility and then xfer the resulting single file containing all my target files to the NTFS share?
<baz> drxodrx0 you could do it that way
<baz> drxodrx0 or you could just copy and paste that way you keep the orignal
#edubuntu 2007-11-07
<smile> How do I see what's causing Error:  "Unsupported operation" while copying "/etc/xen/auto/sql". Would you like to continue?"
<amirman> well it's been a big pain in the butt and i've gotten nowhere
<LaserJock> amirman: ?
<Burgundavia> LaserJock: are you not supposed to be finishing your PHD?
<LaserJock> Burgundavia: umm, yeah
<Burgundavia> indeed
<amirman> its confusing
<Burgundavia> amirman: what is confusing?
<amirman> i dont have a linux boot disk right now because the only computer i have with a cdrom drive and a floppy drive is the one i'm trying to install an OS on
<amirman> so i've been using a win95 bootdisk that i had here because it loads the drivers for my cdrom drive and it gets my hard drive to work
<amirman> but when i try to format the harddisk it wont do it
<amirman> when i try to install the smart boot manager to a floppy to make a boot disk i cant do it because the command.com file thats needed to copy the files is on the disk in the drive that i need to copy to
<amirman> its complicated as hell
<amirman> i have no idea what to do
<Bambi_BOFH> why are you trying to do anything with ubuntu and a dos boot floppy?
<amirman> when i set the BIOS to boot to the cdrom drive it wont read it but the win95 boot disk sees it
<amirman> and when i try to run some programs it says theres not enough memory to run it
<Bambi_BOFH> are you saying sbm doesnt start?
<amirman> i cant even make an sbm disk
<Bambi_BOFH> why cant you make one?
<amirman> because the command.com file which is needed to copy files from the cd to the floppy drive is on the floppy drive
<Bambi_BOFH> not sure i follow... why do you need command.com to make an sbm floppy
<amirman> i haven't tried installing the sbm to the hard drive yet though
<amirman> i'm going to try it i'll be right back
<amirman> i dont know why i need it
<amirman> but it says i do
<Bambi_BOFH> you dont install sbm (well, not in my experiance)
<Bambi_BOFH> you image it onto a floppy disc
<Bambi_BOFH> what instructiosn have you been following?
<amirman> if i change disks it asks to be directed to command.com and i can't exit out of it all i can do is restart
<amirman> well the instructions i read talked about images but when i went to the sourceforge page to get the latest versions image all that was there was a self extracting exe
<amirman> sbminst.exe
<Bambi_BOFH> isnt sbm still on the ubuntu cd?
<Bambi_BOFH> before i continue - whats the specification of the system your trying to intall on by the way, it sounds... old
<amirman> it is very old
<amirman> 256 mb ram 400 mhz processor
<amirman> 80 gb
<amirman> i installed sbm to the harddrive, but now i have to figure out what i'm doing in there
<Bambi_BOFH> cpu is a bit slow, but thats an ok system.
<LaserJock> amirman: what CD did you download?
<amirman> i have the edubuntu server cd
<amirman> and the addon
<amirman> which selection should i choose
<amirman> the regular install or a workstation
<amirman> probably a workstation right?
<LaserJock> workstation
<amirman> the cpu is slow but i was advised that i could install a lighter window manager or something like that
<amirman> i've run into trouble detecting a network interface
<amirman> hopefully i wont need it
<Bambi_BOFH> what chipset is the nic?
<amirman> i don't know what that means
<amirman> <----newbie
<Bambi_BOFH> nm
<amirman> :(
<amirman> nic=network interface card?
<Bambi_BOFH> yeah :)
<amirman> well it's an airlink and it's wireless
<amirman> thats all i know about it
<amirman> i told it that my system clock is not set to UTC
<amirman> because my bios thinks is 1980 sometimes and 1999 sometimes
<amirman> was that the right thing to do?
<amirman> when i was in sbm i used the thing thats supposed to fix the bios date but when i started installing it said something about how my bios was set at 1999
<amirman> this is installing a lot faster than i expected it to
<Bambi_BOFH> if your not dual booting set to UTC
<Bambi_BOFH> it probably reverts to 1980 if your cmos battery goes flat
<amirman> "debootstrap warning"
<amirman> failure while installing base packages
<amirman> i attempted it 5 times then skipped it
<amirman> ooooh errors
<Bambi_BOFH> yeah, debootstrap errors=bad
<amirman> black stripes going up and down the screen behind the stripes there is a white box with some black squares on it and a red square at the bottom
<amirman> and a blue background
<amirman> now i cant read anything
<amirman> i started at the first step of the installation and i'm just going to keep pressing enter
<amirman> hmm looks like i'm just going to have to install freeDOS
<amirman> if it works
<amirman> hah :)
<amirman> :(
<amirman> what's acpi?
<Bambi_BOFH> :(
<Bambi_BOFH> advanced control and power interface
<amirman> well something came up about it being forced or something because the year on the bios was before 2000
<amirman> very confusing
<amirman> i'm retrying the installation
<Bambi_BOFH> i've seen that message before, dont remember the details
<amirman> whats the debbootstrap stuff all about?
<Bambi_BOFH> its the tool the installer uses to setup the OS
<amirman> also which partitioning method should i choose? i chose "guided - use entire disk" last time, and what is LVM?
<Bambi_BOFH> guided is fine.
<Bambi_BOFH> !lvm
<ubotu> Tips and tricks for RAID and LVM can be found on https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RaidConfigurationHowto and http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/LVM-HOWTO
<Bambi_BOFH> not for beiners, imo ;)
<amirman> logical volume management.... is that like a drive where you can resize the partitions whenever you want?
<amirman> just a guess
<Bambi_BOFH> yep
<amirman> cool
<amirman> i'm picking the same one
<amirman> use entire disk
<amirman> i wish i could make the swap partition bigger
<amirman> i have a feeling the installation is messing up because the ram and swap partition are overloaded
<amirman> i would be willing to dedicate about 10 gigs to the swap haha
<amirman> does anybody in here know a very lightwieght linux distro or any OS i could use that is kid-friendly (if i can't get edubuntu installed of course)
 * Bambi_BOFH shrugs. dont have much experiance
<Bambi_BOFH> in that area
<amirman> this is totally failing here
<amirman> its asking me if i want to continue without installing a kernel
<amirman> it says i could end up with a machine that doesnt boot
<amirman> that sounds really bad
<amirman> unless they just mean the hard disk doesnt boot because i've been dealing with that already
<Bambi_BOFH> no, it wont boot at all
<Bambi_BOFH> sorry i cant help much - im at work ;|
<amirman> understandable
<mcdeaglesandwhic> YY
 * Netham45 is off to bed
<Nubae> hi there... I-m trying to debug local device support on ubuntu gutsy...
<Nubae> Im following the document scott belnaeves (sp) wrote and get to the last step where it says to manually try mounting the device in question in this case a usb thumbdrive
<Nubae> I get X connection to localhost:10.0 broken
<Nubae> explicit kill or server shutdown
<Nubae> then /tmp/.sysadmin-ltspfs/tmp is not mounted
<Nubae> anyone...
<Nubae> ok, I tried that from the alt cntrl f1 but obviously it needs to be done from the thin terminal itself
<Nubae> so I did that
<Nubae> and still get /tmp/.sysadmin-ltspfs/tmp is not mounted, even though that directory exists
<Nubae> and I can see a directory for the usb stick too
<bazz> Ogra_cmpc you there?
<nubae> is sbalneaves around?
<bddebian> Heya
<groovedreamer> hi everyone
<groovedreamer> i have a question
<groovedreamer> i am afraid of lack of space on my hdd
<groovedreamer> only 3.2 GB
<groovedreamer> if I connect another one does edubuntu know to write on this additional?
<groovedreamer> should I be afraid of system crash when there will be lack of phisical memory on hdd?
<musashi> i'm trying to figure out why flash drives are not working. I found this comment "One of the most common reasons for USB storage devices not to work is the user needs to be in the fuse group." how can i make sure that all users get added to this? our users log in with active directory authentication. (v7.04)
<musashi> i'm trying to figure out why flash drives are not working. I found this comment "One of the most common reasons for USB storage devices not to work is the user needs to be in the fuse group." how can i make sure that all users get added to this? our users log in with active directory authentication. (v7.04)
<scrapbunny> so i check marked the prerelease updates on my edubuntu server and now have xfce instead of gnome. should xfce run better on thin clients then gnome?
<groovedreamer> there an error occurs during download
<groovedreamer> something with pci
<groovedreamer> how can I do bootload clean?
<groovedreamer> so quiet here
<bazz> So anyone awake in here?
<RichEd> ping highvoltage
<bazz> hello out there?
<RichEd> 'lo bazz
<bazz> ahh there is life out there....
<bazz> Doesnt seem to be to much action in here
<bazz> most people in here developers? users?
<Kamping_Kaiser> bazz, bit of both
<ogra> bazz, we had our semi annual developer conference last week and this week we have the canonical company get together ... so everyone is travelling or recovering from jetlag
<bazz> I bet its fun.....
<bazz> Well I think I would think its fun
#edubuntu 2007-11-08
<roberto> I am installing edubuntu 7.10 but the process "Compresing Thin Client Image" reached 94% about an hour ago. It seems no progress anymore. Any hint?
<sbalneav> evening all
<mwright1> hi anyone home
<sbalneav> mwright1: Yep
<sbalneav> mwright1: If you've got a question, ask quick, I'm not gonna hang around long.
#edubuntu 2008-11-03
<generalsnus> using edubuntu 8.10 ltsp server, when thin clients boots, they halt at this message: ltsp disconnecting: que, disconnect, sock, done
<generalsnus> using edubuntu 8.10 ltsp server, when thin clients boots, the booting stops at this message: "ltsp disconnecting: que, disconnect, sock, done"  whats wrong?
<kwak_> anyone awake. i need to reinstall my server after failed attempts with xubuntu. which one should i get ubuntu-server or desktop. before i used alternate. does it matter?
<Nubae> use alternate
<Nubae> then hit F4 on start
<PerSeL> hello I'm new to ubuntu and need some help if possible
<mib_v9xpgh54> anybody here
<PerSeL> i'm here
<sbalneav> Morning all
<Mip5> hi - running edubuntu 8.04.1 and having my client hang on boot up
<sbalneav> Where's it hanging?
<Mip5> Before the login screen
<Mip5> I see an item in my syslog about tftp client not accepting options
<sbalneav> So, does the graphical kernel boot screen come up?  It's just when it switches to the login screen it juet goes black?
<Mip5> I have changed the pxe default so that it's not quiet, and nosplash
<sbalneav> So, does the kernel actually load and boot?
<Mip5> I don't think so - it just hangs, and when I try to ctrl-alt F2, etc I just get a blinking cursor in teh upper left hand - no login prompt
<Mip5> If you can tell me how to get to the logs of the my client, I can post them
<Mip5> Would they be available in the chrooted environment?
<Mip5> As you can tell - I'm pretty new to ltsp stuff - though I've been using linux for a few years
<sbalneav> When you turn on the terminal, does the kernel come down, and do you see the kernel messages?
<sbalneav> I'm still not clear on this point.
<Mip5> Sorry - yes, I believe that the kernel begins to come down.
<Mip5> I get an address, it then runs through the pxe configs, and begins to load, and then it hangs
<Mip5> There are numbers on the left of the screen as it scrolls, and it gets to about 18.xxx and hangs
<sbalneav> What's the last thing it prints out?
<Mip5> It's across the hall - I'll go and write it down (unless there's another way for me to get it - )
<sbalneav> If the kernel's not booting, then no, there's no other way to get it.
<Mip5> okay thanks - Here's what I see
<Mip5_> Here's what I see as the client boots:  [ 18.649040] /build/buildd/linux-2.6.24/drivers/hid/usbhid/hid-core.c: v2.6:USB HID core driver
<sbalneav> that's where it hangs?
<sbalneav> Then the kernel doesn't like something with your usb port
<sbalneav> You using any USB devices?
<Mip5_> okay - but it also hangs (sooner) when the usb mouse is not connected
<Mip5_> USB mouse is the only usb device
<Mip5_> shere
<Mip5_> here's what I get when the usb mouse is not connected:
<sbalneav> Disconnet the usb mouse, and disable the usb port in bios.
<Mip5_>  [  18.120205] eth0: link down
<Mip5_> This error seems strange to since the link us up and working fine during the preceding part of the boot process
<sbalneav> Try disabling the usb port: it and the ethernet device might be on the same interrupt
<sbalneav> Could be an ACPI issuce.  Might need something like acpi=force or noacpi on the pxe command line.
<Mip5_> okay - I'l try that. FWIW, disabling USB didn't have any effect on the eth0 link down issue
<sbalneav> Did you disable it in the bios before, or just umplug the mouse?
<Mip5> I disabled it in the BIOS (I had previously unplugged the mouse)
<Mip5> Anyway - the idea of acpi=force did the trick
<Mip5> It booted all the way, got the login prompt and was able to login.
<Mip5> I'd like to try it with the usb mouse
<Mip5> thanks for your help - this is great!
<sbalneav> Betcha it works.  Lots of times ACPI issues cause problems.
<sbalneav> What kind of mobo's are in the thin clients.  They're not Via EPIA 1ghz's are they?
<sbalneav> EPIA-LN
<Mip5_> It's an nvidia m2npv-vm
<sbalneav> Not familiar with that.  Anyway, nice to know it's working now.
<Mip5_> and I think the chipset is 6150
<Mip5_> Yeah - it's great.
<sbalneav> Okiedoke, I'm heading home in a few minutes, be on again thisevening.
<sbalneav> good luck
<Mip5_> Do you think I have to take extra steps to get nvidia drivers installed? Are these restricted?
<Mip5_> Cool - thanks again for your help
<sbalneav> Dunno, I've never used the nVidia drives.
<sbalneav> Another place to check would be #ltsp
<sbalneav> the LTSP developers hang out in there (I'm one), you may find more people who may help.
<Mip5_> okay - thanks
<sbalneav> #ltsp and #edubuntu have a lot of the same people in them, but #ltsp's usually more actively watched :)
<Mip5_> You know, I wonderd about that. I'll tune in there.
<Mip5_> Thanks again!
<thismamacooks200> I'm trying to transfer my home directoy to an external (windows) drive so I can install linux on my a bigger internal hard drive
#edubuntu 2008-11-04
<sbalneav> Evening all
<zerothis> I'd like to make our organization's computers act enough like other operating systems that volunteers are not scared away from operating them. Similar look, same shortcut keys, menu layout, similar names for it all ("Stuff" menu instead of Start Menu, Contortion Panel, Finger instead of Finder, etc). I know how to do all that, but, can I then setup several "new user profiles", one themed mac, one themed XP, one themed vista. 
<zerothis> setup several "new user profiles", one themed mac, one themed XP, one themed vista. Then when a new user is created, easily select one; ideally the new user would select it?
<sbalneav> zerothis: are you planning on using separate window managers to accomplish this?
<zerothis> sbalneav:in an ideal word, I'd use only one display manager. but I need passable vista eye-candy, widgets, and start menu searcher (KDE4); that all-in-one-top-o-the-screen menu and application searcher thingy from mac (GNOME does it), and the hotkeys and other behaviors (KDE and GNOME).  xfce does the looks great but I don't know about the behviors, and if I start hacking in KDE and gnome elements into Xfce, things will proba
 * zerothis is afk
 * zerothis is bak
<kwak> has anyone tried upgrading edubuntu 8.04 to 8.10 and no problems?
<sbalneav> Morning all
<Net_> Where is going to be hold the Edubuntu meeting?
<ogra> Net, likely in #ubuntu-meeting (thought LaserJock or stgraber might know more here)
<Net_> Thank you ogra!
<Net> hi
<Net> If I would like to try Edubuntu first I'll need an Ubuntu and then the Edubuntu Addon CD?
<nubae> right
<nubae> edubuntu is basically the addon cd now
<Net> Thanks.
#edubuntu 2008-11-05
<kwak> hi anyone awake. im using hardy and some of my clients are not receiving DHCP response from the server.
<kwak> i have 25 client, so far i have 7 thin clients which booted
<neil_d> With LTSP and local apps. is there any operation difference between local and remote apps?   Do both display on the same screen ?
<stgraber> neil_d: yes they do, though localapps may require some tweaking (especially the ones relying on dbus/gconf)
<neil_d> stgraber: ok, is there a step by step guide on how to setup local apps.  especially firefox ?
<neil_d> stgraber: I haven't found one yet.
<stgraber> neil_d: not really, localapps are pretty new and not yet really well integrated
<stgraber> neil_d: you'll need firefox (without ubufox) installed in the chroot and a launcher on the application server to trigger it
<stgraber> (sorry, can't help much, I'm in a meeting :))
<neil_d> stgraber: ok thanks for the info.
<LaserJock> hi all
<stgraber> hi LaserJock
<highvoltage> hi
<LaserJock> you guys read over the agenda yet?
<stgraber> sort of, I'm following the QA meeting at the same time :)
<stgraber> oh, and having lunch too
<highvoltage> LaserJock: ah, is it in here?
<LaserJock> lol
<LaserJock> highvoltage: the meeting? no, it's supposed to be in #ubuntu-meeting in 36 min
<highvoltage> ah
<LaserJock> just wanted to get the creative juices flowing
<highvoltage> just looking over the agenda now trying to do the same thing
<LaserJock> ok, Edubuntu meeting in 2 minutes
<LaserJock> Edubuntu meeting is right now in #ubuntu-meeting
<juliux> ogra: do you know somebody else? http://wiki.ubuntuusers.de/LocoTeam/UbuntuMember
<ogra> not on first look
<ogra> i'll ping you if someone strikes me
<juliux> ogra: thxs
<highvoltage> and thanks to LaserJock for organising that much needed meeting
<Lns> Yes, thank you LaserJock
<nubae> yups
<LaserJock> no problem
<LaserJock> I'm just glad some people showed up
<Lns> Is there anyone here interested in creating a YouTube campaign for Edubuntu and/or LTSP for demonstration purposes?
 * nubae nominates Lns
<highvoltage> LaserJock: when you've got a draft together of the plan (I'll do my best to help there), then we should blog the next meeting so that it gets some more exposure
<Lns> lol thx nubae
<highvoltage> Lns: I'd like doing some technical ones. Like how to set up LTSP, etc.
<LaserJock> I think we have a wiki spot for those, one sec
<highvoltage> it could also be a directory on http://video.ubuntu.com
<Lns> oh wow
<Lns> I never knew of that link
<nubae> what would be a good edu video is using sabayon and pessulus to make profiles
<LaserJock> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuVideoIntroduction is something to look at
<highvoltage> Lns: there's also a youtube channel that contains all those videos (and more) relating to ubuntu
<Lns> nubae: are those tools stable yet?
<nubae> the documentation on it is very very minimal
<nubae> no, but its ok to create the profiles with
<LaserJock> sabayon and pessulus have been around for quite a while
<nubae> its not running after the profiles are made
<Lns> I don't think we should be spending time (yet) on something that's not stable enough to use on a day to day basis
<LaserJock> but sabayon at least has suffered from Red Hat pulling it's people off
<Lns> at least as far as demo videos
<LaserJock> so it lacks developers
<nubae> its necessary though, and it has no documentation
<Lns> highvoltage: what's the yt channel url?
<nubae> its such a powerful tool
<Lns> nubae: I agree.. but for now I think we should focus from the ground up, get some videos demoing LTSP/Edubuntu in general, a very broad overview of benefits and use cases
<LaserJock> I think sabayon/pessulus could be huge in Education
<Lns> and get more specific from there
<LaserJock> but they have to be rock solid to do it
<LaserJock> and it's tricky business, some of the stuff seems pretty hackish
<Lns> I agree... it needs more work
<Lns> I've never been able to use it reliably
<LaserJock> *but* if we can funnel interested parties their way and help then thats a win for everybody
<highvoltage> Lns: http://www.youtube.com/ubuntudevelopers
<highvoltage> Lns: please excuse the colour scheme :)
<Lns> highvoltage: ah, yes i'm subbed to that chan
<Lns> I think Edubuntu and/or LTSP should get its own YT channel though
<Lns> and maybe link to the others through friends/subscribers
<Lns> get a whole "network" of Ubuntu related YT channels
<highvoltage> Lns: are you on IRC often? I'd love to discuss this, but I'm having trouble keeping my eyes open
<Lns> highvoltage: yep...almost always on #edubuntu, #ltsp
<Lns> during the day anyway, PST
<Lns> (it's noon here now)
<highvoltage> cool. don't let me stop you though, I'm just going to get some sleep now
<Lns> highvoltage: np. Have a good rest!
<highvoltage> cool. goodnight Lns
<Lns> night
<LaserJock> one thing I wanted to kind of bring up in the meeting but didn't is the age scope of Edubuntu
<LaserJock> the Edubuntu motto is "Linux for Young Human Beings"
<LaserJock> but I've always pushed for getting into secondary/uni education
<nubae> yeah
<nubae> in fact... its more sugar that is for young human beings
<Lns> LaserJock: So what's the current view on it?
<nubae> and it will with time totally take over that niche
<LaserJock> Lns: currently we mostly have stuff for younger people
 * Lns thinks the term "Edubuntu" is best geared toward children ages 1-12 yrs
<nubae> should be Educational Linux for human beings
<nubae> Lns: u mean the themes
<Lns> nubae: themes and a lot of apps too such as gcompris
<nubae> yeah true, lots of the apps are for kids
<LaserJock> currently though, I think we ship most of the decent apps for kids
<Lns> yes
<LaserJock> but for instance, there are lots of secondary/uni apps we could ship
<nubae> yep
<nubae> some of it is... like the math stuff
<nubae> language stuff
<nubae> thats no longer for kids
<LaserJock> right
<Lns> Maybe the thing is, we need to really grind in, especially after the past couple years of confusion between Edubuntu, LTSP, etc.. is that Edubuntu is for a subset of children aged N to O
<LaserJock> I'm a Chemist and a university educator
<LaserJock> so I gravitate that way
<nubae> so how about we make a matrix on the site
<nubae> describe the software and what age groups its for
<Lns> nubae: good idea
<LaserJock> at one point I wanted to tie it all together
<LaserJock> so you installed some metapackage
<nubae> and links to the youtube videos ;-)
<Lns> What about splitting packages for certain agegroups/use cases?
<LaserJock> that installed age-appropriate packages *and* themes *and* menues
<Lns> LaserJock: I think that's a great idea
<LaserJock> it's a lot of overhead in terms of maintenance
<nubae> yeah, edubuntu for me needs to be something easily grabable for the use case scenario I want
<Lns> apt-get install edubuntu-ages-1to12
<nubae> right now doing apt-get install edubuntu-desktop is just not feasable for a whole school scenario
<nubae> Lns: right
<Lns> If we do that, I think a lot more devs will come into play for certain use cases
<LaserJock> we, at one point, had groupings like young, elementary, secondary, university
<Lns> they know what they want to work on
<nubae> LaserJock: Im sure we lose users because they find the packages inappropriate for all levels
<nubae> LaserJock: perfect, can we use that split again?
<LaserJock> we never really accomplished it
<nubae> maybe with elementary, middle, secondary and university
<LaserJock> I mean, we've had different themes in the past
<nubae> young is elementary
<LaserJock> well, there is pre-school stuff
<ogra> right it was only themes
<Lns> nubae: well think about after-school clubhouse type setups, too. I work for a couple different Boys & Girls Clubs in California
<ogra> i think the preseed option is stil in edubuntu-artwork
<ogra> dpkg-reconfigure -pcritical edubuntu-artwork
<nubae> the artwork is attractive to people
<Lns> I think age groups might be the best way to categorize it, not "1st grade" "University" etc
<LaserJock> well, on thing we have to consider is that different parts of the world have different terminology
<Lns> exactly
<LaserJock> generally elementary, secondary, university sort of work
<LaserJock> but we can change the name to be whatever
<nubae> yeah but uni, secondary, primary are pretty universal
<nubae> at least those 3 groupings would already help a great deal
<LaserJock> yeah, primary instead of elementary
<LaserJock> *but* as I keep harping on, we gotta have people to maintain this stuff
<LaserJock> we can easily get a real mess on our hands
<Lns> I'm not familiar with package management at all (yet).. i might not be a good candidate for that
<LaserJock> Lns: you can learn ;-)
<Lns> although I can definitely give my opinion on it :)
<nubae> yeah I'm working on MOTU
<nubae> but damn thats a beast and a half
<Lns> I can, but i might be better at youtube collaboration / exposure
<nubae> I cant wrap my head around it yet
<ogra> its trivial once you are over the hump
<alkisg> I don't think bandwidth is a problem for most teachers, but menu editing (for all users) is. So if there was an easy way to modify the Education menu based on a user group (e.g. class A/B/C), or at least have 3 menus instead of the Education menu (again, Educational apps for class A/B/C) it would be easier for the students. So I propose no different packages, just menu editing.
<nubae> ogra: where is the hump?
<nubae> :-)
<ogra> ahaead apparently :)
<Lns> alkisg: did you look at edubuntu-menus ?
<alkisg> Lns, no  :)
<Lns> alkisg: apt-cache show edubuntu-menus
<Lns> it's not completely together yet but that's the start of what you're talking about
<nubae> alkisg: yeah thats important for my use cases too
<ogra> alkisg, bandwith is a huge prob in moust countres where edubuntu gets used
<alkisg> ogra, one can download a DVD and make many copies for other teachers
<ogra> edubuntu has many users in south america, africa asia
<nubae> as is ease of use... if we had 3 groups that are easily installable, like apt-get edubuntu-primary
<nubae> or edubuntu-uni
<ogra> alkisg, ever downloaded a DVD over 56k dialup ?
<nubae> that would be soooo easy and nice
<ogra> alkisg, in a country where you dont devn find DVD readers (not to talk about writers)
<ogra> *even
<Lns> ogra: heh, what's that debian app for cases like that? Some dpkg app that could resume sessions and build an ISO or something over very unreliable connections
<nubae> ogra: right, people forget the ease with which we get internet
<ogra> right
<nubae> I was in Nepal... we'd be lucky to have 2k per sec
<ogra> the existing edubuntu users even rarely have connection
<nubae> there was absolutely no way to download a cd
<nubae> let alone a dvd
<alkisg> ogra, I installed edubuntu in a school with 56k dialup. I never even bothered to update. Every time there was a distro update, I downloaded a DVD from my home and use this in school...
<LaserJock> ogra: kinda going off of that, do you have any idea why shipit was dropped for Edubuntu? too much cost and not enough interest?
<nubae> alkisg: what makes u think these users have internet at home?
<ogra> LaserJock, the latter i think
<LaserJock> ogra: k
<alkisg> nubae, not the users, the central school administration
<nubae> I can tell u that the only internet connection to remote locations is for email only, with no one having internet at home
<nubae> ditto
<ogra> LaserJock, though i think only after the CD split
<nubae> in Nepal, only the main ISP had the bandwidth (1mb share for the entire country) to download stuff in the middle of the night
<alkisg> nubae, e.g. in my town we have ~50 schools and a central ...administrator (I don't know how it's called in english)
<nubae> its not a usable scenario
<alkisg> nubae, shipit.ubuntu.com :)
<nubae> right
<ogra> alkisg, your country isnt in south america, asia or africa :)
<Lns> I think Edubuntu is in a real identity crisis right now with the LTSP split. THUS it's a great time to redefine it on a fundamental level (such as what I think would be good w/different use-case packages/metapackages)
<nubae> Lns: LaserJock realised this thus organised the meeting :-)
<Lns> nubae: i know i know.. :)
<Lns> but we never really came to a solid decision did we ?
<nubae> yeah we did
<LaserJock> well, we decided we're moving forward
<LaserJock> it's difficult to change everything in a single IRC meeting
<nubae> no mention of ubuntu in education unless specifically instructed by RichEd or Canonical
<nubae> ie, edubuntu is the community and shouldnt be confused with ubuntu in education
<Lns> I don't think we *need* to mention it anyway, they're all a part of that marketing anyway
<Lns> we need to focus on our specific projects
<nubae> with the edubuntu add on cd developed and maintained by the community
<nubae> that makes things much easier to understand
<nubae> Lns: right
<Lns> ok
<nubae> so I've offered to help with the edubuntu.org website
<nubae> you've offered to do the youtube videos
<Lns> Is there room to restructure the add-on cd? What exactly does it consist of, other than the packages (and an installer?) for edubuntu themes/apps ?
<nubae> and I guess we should both go for MOTU too, so we can be more involved with the packages that make up the edubuntu cd
<LaserJock> not much
<LaserJock> Lns: ^^
<LaserJock> the CD currently has ~ 500MB out of 700MB total
<LaserJock> we have plenty of room for things
<Lns> ok...i've never used the addon cd, is there a good installer?
<ogra> it still has 500 ?
<Lns> clickie clickie? :)
<ogra> it should be far less
<LaserJock> ogra: let me look
<nubae> edubuntu.org
<ogra> WINFOSS was dropped last minute
<nubae> explanations abound there
<Lns> nubae: ko
<ogra> that should have freed another 2-300
<Lns> ok*
<LaserJock> oh geeze yeah
<LaserJock> it's like 330MB
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> add as you like
<nubae> wow lots of room to play with
<LaserJock> so wow, yeah, lots of room
<ogra> thats why i said it should be universe based
<nubae> agreed
<Lns> I think some demo videos (and other non-software related content) should be put on there
<ogra> makes contribution easier as well
<LaserJock> ogra: would that kill Canonical's support do you think?
<ogra> any motu can help
<ogra> LaserJock, RichEd matter
<nubae> what support?
<ogra> i'm not edu at all anymore, he makes the decisions
<LaserJock> yeah, yeah :-)
<LaserJock> nubae: Canonical officially provides support for Edubuntu
<nubae> how?
<ogra> nubae, currently all apps on the addon are officially canonical supported
<ogra> you can buy support contracts
<nubae> I thought all that moved to ubuntu in education
<nubae> for edubuntu specifically?
<nubae> or are we talking about ubuntu in education now?
<ogra> no, for ubuntu in education
<LaserJock> nubae: currently "ubuntu in education" is not a product
<ogra> but the set of apps is currently defined by the edubuntu apps
<nubae> right, so then again, how does canonical support that?
<ogra> s/set of apps/set of supported edu apps/
<nubae> the apps themselves are supported?
<Lns> nubae: yes
<nubae> really=
<nubae> ?
<ogra> the list on the ubuntu.com page is
<LaserJock> for instance, the apps get security support via people Canonical employees
<nubae> I would have thought that was totally upstream
<ogra> right
<nubae> not upstream?
<LaserJock> you can by support contracts for it too
<nubae> for ubuntu in education I take it
<ogra> and perople buying support contracts can get paid help on them
<LaserJock> nubae: upstream writes code, we ship the code and make sure it all works
<LaserJock> sometimes that means writing patches
<ogra> and integrates
<nubae> I see how canonical supports the ubuntu in education concept...
<nubae> but arent the packages that make up edubuntu available seperately
<nubae> so they actually fall under ubuntu support
<LaserJock> well, it's all the same pool of packages
<nubae> right, so how could they drop support then?
<LaserJock> but certain sets of packages get enhanced support by Canonical
<nubae> ahh...
<nubae> ok
<ogra> and the set of apps is atm defined by edubuntu-desktop
<LaserJock> that is to say, *somebody* has to fix stuff
<LaserJock> Canonical employees people to make sure it gets done for supported packages
<ogra> a switch needs to be made so canonical defines the apps
<LaserJock> *employs
<ogra> and edubuntu cn be free to build from universe
<nubae> ok gotcha now
<ogra> that switch can only come from riched
<LaserJock> ogra: well, with the archive reorg plan wouldn't it work?
<ogra> no
<ogra> the reorg plan is bound to seeds
<LaserJock> that is we'd have our seeds and all we'd need to do is define the set of people who can upload to those seeds
<ogra> right
<LaserJock> that would lower the bar
<ogra> but that still doesnt make rich happy
<LaserJock> at least I think it would
<ogra> he needs to define the supported set still
<LaserJock> sure, but that's his problem, not mine ;-)
<nubae> heh, well it affect edubuntu being universe or not
<LaserJock> well, I'm not sure how long Universe/Main will exist
<ogra> well, he needs to also agree on building from universe as long as he depends on edubuntu-desktop
<ogra> still for a while i bet
<LaserJock> past Jaunty you think?
<ogra> probably
<ogra> its a big change
<LaserJock> ah, then that makes sense
<LaserJock> well, I thought we had most of the Launchpad bits
<LaserJock> but I guess the CD building would get messed up
<LaserJock> in any case, we should start discussing it with RichEd
<LaserJock> it would certainly be better for getting new developers if it was Universe
<nubae> and more packages too right?
<LaserJock> potentially
<LaserJock> we wouldn't have to do the dreaded MIRs ;-)
 * nubae runs to eat something
<ogra> LaserJock, so on another topic, do we see a post election post from you ? (/me found it intresting to see your perspective on politics (even though i dont agree with it but wouldnt even remotely be qualified to judge internals of a foreign country))
<LaserJock> ogra: oh man, I don't know
<LaserJock> ogra: I'd like to do one, but I'm a bit tired  of  the "you're and idiot and I have  no respect for you" comments
<ogra> yeah, i can truely understand
<rockstar> ogra, critiquing other people's countries is still quite okay.  :)
<rockstar> LaserJock, you might want to turn off comments.  :)
<ogra> rockstar, sure
<ogra> i would simply find it intresting to see the other side of the medal post election
<LaserJock> yeah, it's been interesting to see how seemingly interested and invested people  from other nations have been in our elections
<ogra> well, bush has put you in a very bad light over te years
<rockstar> Yea, I was in London for the last two and a half weeks.  It was amazing how much coverage there was.
<LaserJock> jerome said in the Philippines it was front page news in the local newspapers
<LaserJock> seems weird to me
<LaserJock> but makes it all that more weighty and serious to me
<rockstar> Especially because the US has absolutely no coverage of other countries' elections.
<LaserJock> exactly
<rockstar> ...unless it's a coup  :)
<ogra> heh, yeah
<ogra> i think it was looked at all over the world
<LaserJock> although I do remember some reporting about Germany, Canada, and Britian
<LaserJock> but it wasn't a lot
<ogra> i kept up myself until 6am
<ogra> but thats surely shows how bad of a reputation your country had thanks to bush in the rest of the world
<Lns> The US media is completely egocentric
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> world ends at the shore :)
<Lns> We *never* hear about other countries unless it's something that involves us, or something we can mock them for
<Lns> It's absurd
<ogra> but you are simply so big
<Lns> the world is bigger :)
<LaserJock> well, to some degree though I would expect US media to talk primarily about the US
<ogra> and i met many many people in your country that had never left ther small village
<LaserJock> I just don't expect other nation's media to talk about the US so much
<ogra> and are scared to do so
<rockstar> Lns, for the most part, other countries are mocking us back.  :)
<LaserJock> to some degree I just wish the rest of the world would just ignore us :-)
<Lns> rockstar: yeah, but we seem to instigate a lot of it
<Lns> seriously
<rockstar> ogra, that's a different problem.
<rockstar> But those kinds of people are in every country.
<ogra> yeah
<LaserJock> ogra: after going to Paris i didn't want to leave *my* little village ;-)
<ogra> heh
<LaserJock> that food, uggg
<Lns> I couldn't believe how many people outside the US know Obama/McCain and our election status...and I probably don't even know WHERE their country is on a globe
<LaserJock> and getting pick-pocketed, no fun at all
<ogra> LaserJock, but you still look over the edge ...
<ogra> and dont hide behind the fence
<LaserJock> if it wasn't for my good Ubuntu friends I would never leave the US again
<rockstar> LaserJock, aren't you in Vegas?
<LaserJock> rockstar: Reno
<LaserJock> not exactly a village I suppose ...
<Lns> Go Reno 911!
<rockstar> LaserJock, I watch Reno 911.  I know all about Reno.  :)
<LaserJock> lol
<LaserJock> I've seen a few episodes
<LaserJock> it's really weird
<LaserJock> it's like "oh yeah, I know that store"
<Lns> hehehe..rockstar, did you ever watch "The State" ?
<rockstar> Lns,  nope.
<rockstar> I don't watch a lot of TV honestly.
<Lns> rockstar: a lot of people from R911 were on The State...a skit comedy show a long time ago
 * Lns tries to stay away from the TV as well
<rockstar> LaserJock, could you and I find some way that I could watch your process of doing MOTU related stuff?
<LaserJock> rockstar: in what way?
<LaserJock> like a "ride along"?
<rockstar> I don't really like the whole "So you want to be a MOTU, here's a link.  Read it" only to find that I've now started reading one of those choose your own adventure books.
<LaserJock> lol
<rockstar> It'll be nice when all packages are bzr branches.  I know how to do that.  :)
<LaserJock> I've created bzr branches for many of the edu apps
<rockstar> In fact, I wrote some of the code that serves bzr from lp
<rockstar> LaserJock, which ones?
<LaserJock> if people get interested we can start doing more bzr related maintenance, when it's just me I don't find it as useful
<LaserJock> rockstar: have a look at https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~laserjock
<rockstar> LaserJock, it also helps me to see how source package branches really need to be.
<ogra> LaserJock, it definately makes sense for all native packages
<LaserJock> rockstar: if you have particular packages you're interested we could do a collaborative bzr setup
<rockstar> LaserJock, are you an upstream developer as well?
<LaserJock> rockstar: nope, not of any of those
<rockstar> LaserJock, or maybe we create a team?
<LaserJock> I do some upstream work on chemistry apps
<LaserJock> here's one scenario, and perhaps ogra can chime in here
<rockstar> That might help workflow a bit.  There's a team that does the work, and then you just mentor it into main
<LaserJock> we could create an edubuntu-packaging team that could hold bzr branches for the most common edubuntu packages
<LaserJock> it could also then house a testing PPA
<rockstar> +1 already.  You don't have to keep going.  :)
<rockstar> Then you could do the syncs with main, all the while not blocking continued work.
<LaserJock> in that way people can have fun learning to package in Edubuntu, and its a bit easier for  me to sponsor stuff if it's in a bzr branch
<LaserJock> ogra: think that's doable, practical?
<rockstar> syncs to the packaging team's bzr branch could be done through merge proposals.
<ogra> surely
<ogra> that works very well if upstream is in bzr
<LaserJock> in reality we currently don't have a lot of apps to worry about
<ogra> which a lot is on LP
<LaserJock> many of our apps come straight from Debian
<LaserJock> and we work fairly hard to keep it that way
<rockstar> ogra, I assume you know this is where all of Ubuntu's packages will be in 6 months anyway.
<LaserJock> but anything where we are upstream or where we need to maintain a common diff
<LaserJock> it could help
<ogra> rockstar, indeed
<LaserJock> I'm honestly not a huge bzr fan for packaging
<rockstar> Edubuntu could really help me during the day if we started a flow like that.
<LaserJock> I've done some experiments, etc. to get used to it
<ogra> me neither ... but if source packages go away i will be
<rockstar> LaserJock, resistance is futile.  :)
<ogra> currently you have a lot of duplication
<LaserJock> james_w in particular has been creating some good tools to help at least
<rockstar> Imagine apt-bzr, where you can pull the latest source, build a package, and install it.
<LaserJock> yeah, and it seems like you end up having to track more stuff
<ogra> if packages can build directly from bzr branches then its cool
<rockstar> You can be ever more bleeding edge than debian unstable!
<ogra> not that  would want to :)
<LaserJock> heh, yeah
<ogra> the thing is that for package maintenance bzr currently adds a massive overhead
<LaserJock> yeah
<rockstar> LaserJock, so do you want to create a team?
<ogra> i need to apply my changes to the bzr branch, pull them again, make a source package out of it and puch that
<LaserJock> I've locally got bzr imports of all Debian and Ubuntu packages for ~ 10 Edubuntu apps
<LaserJock> took a long time to do and takes up a lot of space
<ogra> with sourcepackages only i can have my source, make my changes and just push
<rockstar> LaserJock, push them plz
<LaserJock> *but* seems like a more collaborative way of working for sure
<ogra> the thing is that you need to make the sourcepackage go away in that setup
<rockstar> And the current model is much less collaborative, IMHO
<ogra> so you have only a bzr branch and a "build now damnit !" button next to the branch in LP
<LaserJock> ogra: yep, that would work
<rockstar> ogra, invent a time machine and go forward a year.  :)
<LaserJock> I just don't like how easily bzr and uploads can get out of sync
<ogra> rockstar, nah, i can wait :)
<LaserJock> you gotta really stick to the bzr to make it work well
<rockstar> LaserJock, if you're doing the uploads, then they won't.
<ogra> the thing is that until this is here we have a lot of duplication doing packaging
<rockstar> ogra, agreed.
<LaserJock> *but* I'm also using git and svn for maintaining in Debian and they work decent enough
<LaserJock> the real bugger for us is that we have Debian to deal with
<LaserJock> so I need to track upstream, debian, and my changes
<ogra> well, not if debian gets puled into lp bzr branches
<ogra> yu just merge two branches
<LaserJock> hopefully yes
<LaserJock> but currently
<LaserJock> bit of a pain
<rockstar> LaserJock, do you have stockholm syndrome?
<ogra> https://code.launchpad.net/gcompris
<LaserJock> most probably i do for sure
<ogra> have a look
<rockstar> LaserJock, :)
<LaserJock> ogra: I got tuxpaint and tuxpaint stamps vcs imports going
<ogra> https://code.launchpad.net/tuxpaint :
<rockstar> If you need any other vcs imports, just set them up and ping me.  I'll approve them immediately.
<ogra> :)
<LaserJock> I've been slowly working on getting the Edubuntu upstream projects registered in LP and getting vcs imports
<ogra> i see
<LaserJock> so upstreams are fairly easy
<LaserJock> the packaging is the difficult part
<LaserJock> and I'm not sure how much I want to mess up LP :-)
<LaserJock> I have Debian imported locally
<LaserJock> but I'm not sure if I want to make a branch jungle :-)
<rockstar> LaserJock, mess up what?
<LaserJock> well, mostly I'm concerned about confusing people with too many branches
<rockstar> Branch jungles are easily avoided with release branches
<rockstar> Er, series branches
<LaserJock> and if I go and put up my own imports, then LP does imports, then I do Edubuntu imports
<LaserJock> then we all get confused, give up, and go back to the "old fashioned" way
<LaserJock> :-)
<LaserJock> rockstar: do you have particular apps you're interested in?
<rockstar> LaserJock, well, I don't really know.  I'd like to be more involved in educational content on a whole, but anything to get started.
<LaserJock> ok
<LaserJock> so it looks like gpaint, tuxmath, and tuxpaint-stamps are the only edubuntu apps that we get straight from Debian
<nubae> LaserJock: what did u think of the moodle idea?
<LaserJock> 18 have Edubuntu modifications
<LaserJock> and 4ish are Edubuntu-specific
<LaserJock> nubae: well, it's something that would be fun, but I'm afraid that it probably isn't feasible
<nubae> is there such a thing as install on click for ubuntu
<nubae> LaserJock: why not?
<LaserJock> nubae: I doubt that the Canonical IS team would allow moodle on any of their machines
<LaserJock> nubae: yes, there is an install-on-click thing. it's called apturl
<nubae> ah... and if we host it some place else?
<nubae> my thinking is, we could store all the apps there for easy demoing
<LaserJock> that's got a lot of problems as well
<nubae> a database with links to all the apps
<nubae> with explanation, etc
<LaserJock> oh, well we can certainly do that kind of thing
<LaserJock> just not with moodle
<LaserJock> edubuntu.org is drupal
<nubae> well, moodle is what I know best
<nubae> yeah I know
<nubae> its just not as friendly
<LaserJock> we could also use a wiki page
<nubae> would be nicer in a db, but yeah
<LaserJock> well, some time ago
<LaserJock> we had a spec about creating a full application database engine and webapp
<nubae> but apturl is a good idea, it would bring a certain front to edubuntu... u would see what u get
<LaserJock> it was a nice spec, just nobody to implement it
<nubae> right now there is no place that defines whats in edubuntu
<nubae> kind of important
<LaserJock> yep, just not always easy to do/maintain
<Lns> Anyone here wanna try running tuxpaint from a thinclient with the --nosound switch to see if it still pegs out the CPU and doesn't exit cleanly? See https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tuxpaint/+bug/269082
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 269082 in tuxpaint "tuxpaint and other tux SDL driven apps slow down and/or freeze thin client terminals (ltsp)" [High,Confirmed]
#edubuntu 2008-11-06
<Trailbrain> I'm looking for an xcf version of the edubuntu logo
<Trailbrain> Does anyone know where I can find an xcf version of the edubuntu logo?
<ThinkMinus> Hello,
<ThinkMinus> It looks edubutu is not shipping free CDs for 8.10
<ThinkMinus> I have a question.....
<ThinkMinus> How can Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Edubuntu send CDs free of cost? Where the money comes from?
<jc2it>  clear;for x in {0..150}; do y=`echo "12+6*s($x/6)"|bc -l|cut -d. -f 1`;echo -en \\e[$y\;"$(($x/2))"HX; sleep .1;done
<jc2it> what the ?
<jc2it> I want to modify my lts.conf to boot certain Thin clients to a Terminal login.  I think I have to do this by MAC Address. Is this the best/only way?
#edubuntu 2008-11-07
<VanaViru> hi!
<sbalneav> Morning
<VanaViru> had a couple of questions
<VanaViru> about edubuntu
<VanaViru> the thing is
<VanaViru> i want to install irc on it
<VanaViru> i mean a irc-chat-program
<VanaViru> like windows has mIRC
<VanaViru> which would suit the best
<VanaViru> for edubuntu
<sbalneav> Well, it comes with Pidgen, which can do irc.
<VanaViru> pidgen?:o
<VanaViru> where can i find it
<VanaViru> on edubuntu
<VanaViru> i mean, im new to linuxes
<VanaViru> and i just happen to have them
<VanaViru> in our school
<sbalneav> Applications -> Internet -> Pidgin internet messanger
<VanaViru> oh
<VanaViru> and it works good? so for instance
<VanaViru> i can login here
<VanaViru> with pidgin
<sbalneav> Sure.  I use a text-based irc client called irssi, which runs in a terminal window, but pidgin would allow you to log in here.
<VanaViru> oh irssi
<VanaViru> i tried to install irssi
<VanaViru> but it only told me
<VanaViru> "this incident will be reported to the adminstrator" or something
<VanaViru> :S
<VanaViru> so i talked with the admin..and he just said
<VanaViru> that i would have to find some soft that would run irc
<VanaViru> and mail it to him
<VanaViru> but if pidgin already is
<VanaViru> available then
<VanaViru> :)
<sbalneav> Well, pidgin's already installed.  So that would do what you need.
<VanaViru> nice!
<VanaViru> thanks
<VanaViru> they installed the boxes in our buffet now..so i can eat while chat on irc
<VanaViru> gr8
<VanaViru> :)
<VanaViru> cya!
#edubuntu 2008-11-08
<Ahmuck> hi.  if the server motherboard does not have sound, does the ltsp client that does have onboard sound produce sound ?
<stgraber> Ahmuck: should be
<Ahmuck> stgraber: thx.  found the anser ealier in #ltsp
<Ahmuck> my final question.  i'd like to offer ubuntu, kubuntu and opengeu as desktops, perhaps xubuntu as well.  these all have sepearate menus.  in my testing after "sudo aptitude install kubuntu" i noticed kubuntu items with ubuntu items.  is there a way to isolate menus
<Ahmuck> well, next to final.  i assume there is a way to "strip" out menu items that require super user access?
<Ahmuck> i assume that i can do normal partitioning, (/, /home, /var, /tmp, /usr/local)?
<HedgeMage> Ahmuck: they are only presented to people in the sudoers file anyway
<Ahmuck> HedgeMage: thx u, thx u
<Ahmuck> i was logging in as a sudoer and noticed the menu selection, have not got as far to test with a  normal user
<HedgeMage> np
<Ahmuck> is the wiki a comprehensive manual?
<Ahmuck> that is what i'm looking for now.  reading on adding users, etc.
<helpme> hi sorry if i wrong. i want to ask about ltsp 5. problem with old machine ACPI: DMI BIOS year==0, assuming ACPI-capable machine, somebody help?
<Ahmuck> helpme: always just ask/state your question/problem
<helpme> my problem how to set acpi off, in etherboot enviroment?
<helpme> anybody using etherboot?
<Ahmuck-Jr> can user and groups be managed via a thin terminal?
<helpme> can
<Ahmuck-Jr> under "System --> Administration --> Users and Groups" the "Add User" is grayed out.  I'm confused
<Ahmuck-Jr> www.adobe is causing a hard lockup of the client.  requires a reboot.
<Net_> Did you have a meeting on Wednesday?
<mssmss> hi there
<mssmss> I can't seem to get more than 2 thin clients boot at once on 8.04.01. looks like dhcp is crawling
<mssmss> looks like other people had the same problem
<mssmss> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-devel/2008-September/002649.html
<mssmss> but could not find any solution ...
<mssmss> anyone know about this ?
<mssmss> I can get multiple clients to work if I turn on one, wait until it is completely booted, then turn on the next one...
<mssmss> logs show dhcp DISCOVER/OFFER messaged long after the client has booted, coming in at 15 s intervals
<mssmss> anyone here ?
<mssmss> anyone familiar with ltsp edubuntu 8.04.1 ?
<nubae> familiar, yes, but your problem doesn't sound familiar
<nubae> mssmss: do you have remote logging enabled?
<mssmss> you mean for the log files ?
<nubae> yes
<mssmss> not sure .. did not touch a thing on the server .... standard installation 8.04.1 of Edubuntu with only network config done ...\
<nubae> then it should be ok... did u try upgrading to the latest sets of packages
<mssmss> other people have seen the same issues with dhcp ...link I posted above
<nubae> enabling hardy-updates
<mssmss> no.....don't have internet in the location yet .. installed from a CD ..am in India ...but the school is in a rural area with scant internet connectivity
<nubae> hmmm, I would advise ordering the intrepid ibex CD
<nubae> hardy is known to have some issues, and without updates, it could be anything...
<mssmss> but does it not have a shorter support cycle ? also is it an upgrade from Hardy or should I do a completely new install ?
<nubae> u can upgrade I believe... it does have a shorter support cycle, but if you cannot do upgrades from the internet, I dont think you have to worry about that ;-)
<nubae> anyway intrepid is supported for 18 months
<mssmss> :-)
<mssmss> hopefully it's only a short term issue ...hoping to see some connectivity within the next six months
<Ahmuck> good morning.  i'm looking for "boot rom?".  is anyone familiar with this method?
<Ahmuck> i understand i can install a chip on the nic.  does the chip have boot rom already on it or does one flash the nic to get the boot rom there?
<sbalneav> Morning all
<Ahmuck> good morning
<sbalneav> Morning
<Ahmuck> nubae: on a fat client setup does one need the same amount of memory on the server?  processing power?  or is that all offloaded to the client?
<Ahmuck> i'm getting ready to ditch the server idea if i can offload to 1Ghz clients
<Ahmuck> and make them fat clients.  the 1Ghz clients will only cost me 50.00/machine
#edubuntu 2008-11-09
<Ahmuck> can one "sudo aptitude install gos" and get GoS installed ?
<Ahmuck> could someone point me to "imac" ltsp client setup and configuration
<Ahmuck> documentation
<TeknoPhil> Hi all ... I have a question regarding local apps on LTSP 5 ... Is it working on Ubuntu 8.04 ? Any pointers would be appreciated
#edubuntu 2009-11-02
<sbalneav> evening all
<foxbuntu> Hey all, working with an older laptop trying to install edubuntu, however i get "Authentication Falures" wth the LiveCD on the laptop but using the same disk for a VM it boots fine
<foxbuntu> ...the auto login is not working and dropping to a terminal revealed the errors
<Classic> i get this error when ever i try installing mysql
<Classic> errors were encountered while processing: fuse-utils, gvfs-fuse
<Classic> how do i fix this? i'm going crazy ;-; i've been trying to fix this for over 7 hours
<alkisg> !info usermode
<ubottu> usermode (source: usermode): Graphical tools for certain user account management tasks. In component universe, is optional. Version 1.81-3.2 (karmic), package size 78 kB, installed size 312 kB
<sbalneav> Morning all
<kuya_> i have a problem setting up ltsp
<alkisg> !ask
<ubottu> Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
<kuya_> i'm following this book by osborne - ubuntu server administration where instead of using the default base directory "/opt/ltsp/i386" the book uses "/var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386"
<kuya_> problem is when i do ltsp-update-image i get this error: chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 doesn't exist
<kuya_> sorry i'm new to linux but i wanted to do this too.
<sbalneav> Book's wrong.
<sbalneav> All you should (normally) have to do is:
<sbalneav> ltsp-build-client
<sbalneav> ltsp-update-sshkeys
<sbalneav> ltsp-update-image
<sbalneav> ltsp-update-kernels
<sbalneav> You should be bootable at that point.
<kuya_> well that's what is normally done. but what i think the book is trying to do is to associate the client with a TFTP server. or is the book wrong too in doing so?
<sbalneav> Without seeing the book, I can't say.
<sbalneav> but that's not the way it's normally done.
<jbicha> doesn't that work automagically in Ubuntu these days?
<sbalneav> yup
<jbicha> I was surprised by how easy it was to get LTSP working for me (....except for that one upside-down screen issue but that's NVIDIA's fault)
<kuya_> what did you do?
<alkisg> kuya_: maybe you misunderstood what the book says (I haven't seen the book, I'm just guessing). /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386 is the tftp directory, while /opt/ltsp/i386 is the "virtual client disk" directory. So both of those paths are used.
<jbicha> I just installed ltsp-server-standalone , then ran ltsp-build-client
<jbicha> and then I had to change all the 192.168.0 in /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf to 192.168.1 to match my actual network
<kuya_> setting up the DCHP configuration file: From the book >>> "The directives that follow actually point the PXE network boot systems to the appropriate files and directories. The default is associated with the --base directory configured with the ltsp-build-client command. option root-path "/opt/ltsp/i386"; But for the client configuration associated with a TFTP server, youâll need to change the path to option root-path "/var/lib/
<kuya_> then create an NFS share pointing to "/var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386"
<alkisg> Urm yeah that doesn't sound right for any distro I know... :-/
<sbalneav> that's just plain wrong.
<sbalneav> kuya_: http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtspDocumentationUpstream
<sbalneav> That's the docs I work on.
<kuya_> then sudo ltsp-build-client  - -base  /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp
<sbalneav> I'm upstream for LTSP.
<sbalneav> yeah, just ignore the book.
<sbalneav> rip that chapter out :)
<kuya_> haha
<kuya_> ok
<sbalneav> Did you buy it for the ltsp part?
<kuya_> what do you mean?
<kuya_> there's just one thing i'm curios about
<sbalneav> Did you buy the book because of the ltsp chapter?
<kuya_> no
<sbalneav> Good
<kuya_> i'm following the book to learn linux
<sbalneav> OK, that's great.
<jbicha> kuya_: yeah, it seems like your book isn't as helpful, I used the link sbalneav gave you and it was pretty helpful, see also the quickinstall guide & other stuff on https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP
<kuya_> i got bored so i jumped straight to that chapter
<sbalneav> Welcome to the circus! :)
<kuya_> anyway theres something i'm just curious about
<jbicha> books are good though, there's a lot to learn in Linux :-)
<sbalneav> kuya_: Ask away.
<kuya_> wait i'm thinking how to ask it
<kuya_> hehe
<kuya_> is the location /opt/ltsp/i386 hardcoded when i use the command ltsp-update-image?
<sbalneav> it's the default, yeah
<kuya_> how do i change it?
<sbalneav> Why would you?
<kuya_> because i want to
<sbalneav> 99.99% of all people running LTSP run it from there.
<kuya_> :-)
<kuya_> isn't that what linux is about?
<sbalneav> It's the "standard" place where ltsp lives.
<sbalneav> Sure.
<kuya_> well is it hard to change?
<sbalneav> then you have to specify --base every time you run any of the ltsp maintenance commands.
<kuya_> oh
<sbalneav> ltsp-build-client --base
<kuya_> ok i get it now
<kuya_> thanks
<sbalneav> ltsp-update-sshkeys --base
<sbalneav> so unless you want a lot of extra typing :)
<kuya_> well i might need this little bit of knowledge some day
<sbalneav> Unless you're doing something very special, and know exactly why you're doing it, you're best to go with defaults.  If you're still learning linux, then that day won't be for a while :)
<kuya_> yes sensei
<kuya_> but like i said... i got bored
<kuya_> thanks
<kuya_> i'll be back soon
<sbalneav> NP
<sbalneav> we'll be here :)
<kuya_> aight... that's good to know.
<Ahmuck-Sr> Last, but certainly not least, the release of Ubuntu is creeping even more in the "commercial" direction, with the addition of things like Ubuntu One, the Software Soure (or whatever it is called), and the likes. If you are a Linux/FOSS "purist", you really need to think very carefully before installing Ubuntu, and look at some of those things. - http://community.zdnet.co.uk/blog/0,1000000567,10014347o-2000498448b,00.htm
<Ahmuck-Sr> i'd wondered if this is why support for edubuntu/ltsp had been dropped and ubuntu was promoting thier own version of server/client/puppet thingy ealier this year
<ogra> what makes your think support for ltsp has been dropped ?
<sbalneav> ubuntu has their "own" thin client puppet thingy?
<sbalneav> buh?
<jbicha> ooh, my Moodle fix for Hardy & Jaunty is in the proposed repository, please test and leave feedback at https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/378726
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Ubuntu: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/378726)
<sbalneav> \o/
<sbalneav> http://git.gnome.org/cgit/sabayon/commit/?id=0b2ad90e6e1df25595ddbfca6fb51a8c90650036
<sbalneav> We'll have sabayon group apply by lucid!  Kaloo kalay oh frabjous day!
<jbicha> Ahmuck-Sr: I don't think the Software Store is evil...and the Ubuntu One client is open-source
<sbalneav> Yeah, I don't think Ubuntu One's any more inherently evil than say gmail.
<Ahmuck-Sr> ogra, as i understand it, conical pulled devs completely from the edubuntu project
<Ahmuck-Sr> sbalneav: i dont' use gmail :)
<sbalneav> there was only one "full time" dev for ubuntu
<sbalneav> ogra :)
<ogra> Ahmuck-Sr, what makes you think canonical dropped support for LTSP ?
<ogra> did you read that anywhere or is it jusr speculation ?
<ogra> *just
<Ahmuck-Sr> iirc, conical was offereing a type of server/client after they pulled resources
<ogra> Ahmuck-Sr, and as scott said, there was only one dev ever
<Ahmuck-Sr> iirc, it was mentioned here by some of the members.  i'd have to search logs
<sbalneav> Ahmuck-Sr: So, don't use Ubuntu One :)
<Ahmuck-Sr> sbalneav: it's not about ubuntu one actually
<sbalneav> AFAIK, there's NO other thin client solution offered by canonical.
<ogra> software store is just a polished version of add/remove
<ogra> and is supposed to replace all packaging gui tools over time
<ogra> there is definately no other thin client solution pffered by canonical
<ogra> and LTSP is still on the default CD installation
<ogra> *offered
<Ahmuck-Sr> sbalneav: i'm looking for the name
<sbalneav> I don't see any problem with giving people the option of buying software for GNU/Linux.  "Purists" can just not buy anything, and others now have the option of buying an app if they can't find a free one to suit their needs.
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> though software store is a completely new approach to handle package management
<ogra> and will replace synaptic, gdebi and all the fragmented pieces of gui tools over time
<Ahmuck-Sr> i think the concern of some (quoted article aside) is that Linux, GNU, and GPL may soon be so tied up in commercial interests and commercial software that soon an individual won't be able to simply download anything without a paid fee tied to it, similar to mp3 and gif
<ogra> nonsense
<sbalneav> The GPL prevents this from happening.
<sbalneav> If you license something with the GPL, it's free.
<ogra> Linux, GNU, and GPL was always produced in a manner that you could build commercial services around itr
<sbalneav> Exactly.  That was the intent of the GPL.
<jbicha> and the Software Store is completely open source...Fedora or whoever could tweak it and release it with there next version
<sbalneav> To keep the code free, but allow people to make money using the code.
<sbalneav> Sure.
<ogra> and i bet many people would be happy if they could just install skype with a single click
<sbalneav> Making money with free software is a GOOD thing
<sbalneav> for ALL of us.
<Ahmuck-Sr> landscape
<sbalneav> Landscape's a management tool, like the red hat thing.
<sbalneav> manage all your pool of servers, updates, etc.  As I understand it.
<ogra> right
<ogra> its a service you can buy if you like ... totally optional
<sbalneav> http://www.canonical.com/projects/landscape
<sbalneav> right, instead of ssh-ing in to 55 machines and running apt-get update && apt-get upgrade, you can do it all from one "web based control panel"
<Ahmuck-Sr> With good machines, (TARP money) one no longer needs ltsp, rather landscape.
<Ahmuck-Sr> Software as a service
<sbalneav> Buh?
<ogra> ???
<Ahmuck-Sr> perhaps i need to compare differences between the tow
<Ahmuck-Sr> tow/two
<sbalneav> I think so.
<ogra> yes, there is no relation at all
<Ahmuck-Sr> i find ltsp clunky
<Ahmuck-Sr> landscape is very ... unclunky
<sbalneav> Ahmuck-Sr: If you don't like ltsp, then don't use it :)
<ogra> landscape does not offer any thin client technology
<sbalneav> off for lunch
<Ahmuck-Sr> the purpose of ltsp is central managment, correct?
<ogra> i dont get why you compare a network management software with a thin client server
<ogra> the purpose of ltsp is to run diskless thin clients
<ogra> the purpose of landscape is management of huge networks
<Ahmuck-Sr> and i would want to run diskless clients over a landscape client because?
<ogra> ??
<Ahmuck-Sr> is ltsp not scalable to huge networks?
<ogra> landascape is a plain management service
<ogra> it has *nothing* to do with thin clients
<Ahmuck-Sr> is there a difference between a thin client and a managed client.  in the end they perform the same thing
<Ahmuck-Sr> same duty
<ogra> you can buy the landscape service at canonical ... you can then monitor and maintain all systems that have a landscape client installed in your network
<ogra> no
<ogra> landscape doesnt manage netbooting of diskless clients, doesnt manage that they connect to a central server etc
<ogra> landscape is for remote package and user management as well as monitoring
<Ahmuck-Sr> perhaps i asked the wrong question, the end result is the same?
<ogra> no
<ogra> its like comparing a car and a helicopter ...
<ogra> nothing incommon
<jbicha> LTSP is a real good option for libraries, schools, computer labs where you can save money by using minimal computer hardware
<ogra> they are competely distinct things for completely different purposes
<ogra> with no overlaps anywhere
<jbicha> launchpad is for a large company who wants a tool to make sure all of the computers have a baseline of installed software with all of their updates, etc.
<ogra> you can use landscape to maintain an LTSP server though
<Ahmuck-Sr> putting aside money as a limitation ...
<jbicha> Ahmuck-Sr: stop thinking outside of the box! :-)
<ogra> you could compare landscape and webmin or landscape and ebox or landscape and whatever redhat calls their commercial service of the same kind
<ogra> but you definately cant compare ltsp and landscape
<Ahmuck-Sr> with grant funding drying up, community based resources are getting harder to fund.  one then looks at management, and wonders if it's easier to use ltsp or use a landscape type of based service.  those considerations come down to performance, ease of use (time), etc.
<Ahmuck-Sr> if the end result is the same, most often people will pick the easier road.
<ogra> again
<ogra> landscape != ltsp
<ogra> they have nothing in common
<ogra> you wont be able to run or manage thin clients with landscape
<jbicha> and ltsp is not about remote management
<ogra> right
<Ahmuck-Sr> fwiw, i have seen the one thingy, and agreed it was a better way to install software.
<ogra> which "one thingy"
 * alkisg loves the Karmic `add-apt-repository` command :)
<Ahmuck-Sr> btw, were testing karmic upgrade today on the thin clients
<Ahmuck-Sr> putting it through it's paces
<highvoltage> good evening
<ogra> highvoltage, congrats to the new job !
<ogra> you should have gone to BTS
<highvoltage> ogra: thanks!
<highvoltage> ogra: I will as soon as my work visa is sorted out!
<highvoltage> ogra: well, when it happens again anyway :)
<ogra> so we'll see you next time then :)
<highvoltage> ogra: yep!
<sbalneav> Ahmuck-Sr: Landscape is a tool for managing the functioning of servers.
<sbalneav> So, lets take a typical scenario.  You're a school, with a pile of old pentium 3 dells with 256 megs of memory, and maybe $5000 in the budget for the lab.
<sbalneav> ltsp choice:
<sbalneav> You yank the the hard drives from the old dells, and go out an buy youself 1 good server, with 2 dual core cpu's or one quad core.
<sbalneav> you set the lab up as a series of thin clients.
<sbalneav> landscape choice.
<sbalneav> you keep the lab as it is, with no shared data/homedirs, and run a full ubuntu desktop on each box.
<sbalneav> landscape just allows you do keep the packages up to date on all the desktops.
<ogra> slow and clunky for sure
<sbalneav> Or the third way
<sbalneav> install LTSP and for the 3 labs you've got in the school, you buy 3 landscape licenses for the monitoring/update functioality it provides you :)
<sbalneav> ltsp boots diskless thin clients
<sbalneav> landscape allows you to do performance monitoring/package management.
<sbalneav> they're two different tools.
<ogra> but go together very well :)
<ogra> side by side
<sbalneav> sure
 * ogra dances ... 
<ogra> i found the perfect SSD for my lappie :)
<sbalneav> Oh?
<sbalneav> do tell
<Ahmuck-Sr> one could set up landscape and then use ndb and ldap for central login/user directory?
<ogra> 220MB/sec reading, 200MB/sec writing ... 128GB
<ogra> Samsung SSD PB22-J
<ogra> 299â¬
 * ogra just ordered
<sbalneav> PB*J?
<sbalneav> You're putting a peanut butter and jelly sandwitch in your laptop? :)
<ogra> lol
<sbalneav> That'll muck up the dvd drive for sure.
<sbalneav> Nice looking unit.
<ogra> well, i wont see it
<ogra> it will live inside its cage in my laptop ...
<ogra> rattling the bars from time to time i guess :)
<ogra> it will be incredible fast though
<ogra> my 7200rpm HDD currently does 50MB/sec
<ogra> at most
<ogra> the SSDs start at 150MB/sec ... that one specifically goes up to 220MB/sec
<sbalneav> I'm looking at this:
<sbalneav> http://store.sansdigital-shop.com/cocscoflcfto.html
<Ahmuck-Sr> does the upgrade overwrite the ltsp settings?
<sbalneav> Your lts.conf?  Shouldn't
<sbalneav> but with the upgrade, you should back up your lts.conf, /etc/ltsp directory, and build a new chroot.
<sbalneav> Otherwise you're running a karmic server with a jaunty chroot.
<ogra> CF to SATA ?
<sbalneav> yeah
<sbalneav> cool little dingus
 * ogra only owns one CF card
<Ahmuck-Sr> ah, i wonder if that's my problme
<ogra> and thats not really impressing if it comes to performance :)
<Ahmuck-Sr> the jaunty chroot
<sbalneav> Possibly, yes.
<Ahmuck-Sr> this is beyond the ltsp-build-client
<Ahmuck-Sr> i'll look at it then
<Ahmuck-Sr> i'm having problems with firefox/flash, locking up the firefox window
<Ahmuck-Sr> sound is staying on though
<Ahmuck-Sr> which is why i asked
<sbalneav> Is flash what's doing the locking up?
<sbalneav> i.e. if it's just normal web pages, it's fine?
<Ahmuck-Sr> i'll test some more and see
<sbalneav> Flash is getting more and more ill behaved, it seems.
<Ahmuck-Sr> time for silverlight?
 * Ahmuck-Sr grins onerously
<ogra> well, silverlight is supposed to run on android ... wont be long until you see a native linux version after that i guess
<sbalneav> Sure, if Microsoft produces a linux version of it.
<Ahmuck-Sr> i think mono has something that works like that
<ogra> sbalneav, android is linux ..
<ogra> sbalneav, and they want the market share ;)
<sbalneav> Both flash and silverlight are commercial pieces of software. If they don't work correctly, I highly recommend filing a bug in the bugtrackers of their respective authors companies.
<ogra> yeah
<Ahmuck-Sr> heh, that'd be interesting
<mhall119|work> sbalneav: lol
<Lns> +1 sbalneav
<Lns> I'm so sick of flash being the main reason people complain about ltsp with ff not being a localapp
<Lns> and shockwave not having a linux version..i had no idea how many schools use shockwave until i started doing ltsp
<Ahmuck-Sr> Lns: does that tell you something about your clients?
<Lns> Ahmuck: uhm... that they want to be able to do anything in linux as they can in windows?
<highvoltage> ogra: that's crazy fast
<sbalneav> I haven't had a chance to look at gnash lately.  Is it coming along?  If it's just flash VIDEOS people want (i.e. youtube) I keep recommending the greasemonkey script hqtube at userscripts.org, unfortunately, greasemonkey doesn't have support for shared scipts.
<sbalneav> so you can't just drop something in, say, /usr/share/gm_scripts, and have it show up on everyone's firefox.
<highvoltage> sbalneav: gnash can play youtube now, but even so it has some quirks, I guess for typical production use adobe flash is still the way to go
<highvoltage> sbalneav: but it seems that by the time that a free flash player is finished, no one will care anymore since improvements in html5/svg/javascript/etc
<sbalneav> Well, except for things like flash games, etc.
<sbalneav> but I agree the video problem may go away.
<sbalneav> Ahmuck-Sr: here's a test for you:
<alkisg> I think it should be possible to make a seperate extension out of that HQtube plugin, one that won't even depend on greasemonkey... That way it would be available to all users
<sbalneav> alkisg++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
<sbalneav> I just wish I knew about firefox extentions :(
<sbalneav> I'd write one now
<alkisg> I'll give that a go whenever I have time - but it *will* require a PPA for constant updates
<Lns> You guys see this? http://yro.slashdot.org/story/09/10/31/128236/Adobe-Pushing-For-Flash-and-PDF-In-Open-Government-Initiative?from=rss
<sbalneav> PDF's ok
<sbalneav> flash, eugh
<alkisg> Flash would be fine if we had a decent player. E.g. if flash was open sourced, so that the community could build on it.
<sbalneav> right.
<sbalneav> problem is, it's a closed "standard"
<alkisg> E.g. we're on flash version 10, and it doesn't yet support utf8!
<alkisg> Nah, the swf standard is open. It's the tool that is closed...
<alkisg> (afaik)
<Lns> alkisg: then how come gnash is still having so many issues?
<sbalneav> Really? The flash standard's PUBLISHED somewhere?
<alkisg> I think so
 * alkisg looks..
<sbalneav> I'd be shocked and awed.
<alkisg> http://www.adobe.com/devnet/swf/
<alkisg> "The SWF file format is available as an open specification..."
<Lns> i think there should be a law that any government standards should be open source. whether bsd, gpl, or whatever. we need that to progress and not feed the "proprietary" animals any more
#edubuntu 2009-11-03
<sbalneav> Evening al
<HedgeMage> hi :)
<sbalneav> Hey HedgeMage
<HedgeMage> what's up, sbalneav ?
<sbalneav> Got a bug to fix in LTSPFS, got a new piece of software to package, and more improvements for sabayon needed :)
<sbalneav> busy busy buys
<sbalneav> er
<sbalneav> busy
<HedgeMage> heh
<HedgeMage> I know the feeling
<sbalneav> HedgeMage: You're a motu, right?
<HedgeMage> Nope.
<HedgeMage> I haven't been terribly involved since I moved, and I'll be moving again in December.
 * HedgeMage has almost no free time.
<sbalneav> heh
<mrpogi> i just got ltsp working. now how do i restrict a user from logging in from two client stations simultaneously?
<sbalneav> mrpogi: Not sure, I don't think we've got anything in ltsp to stop that, but I'm checking the source code...
<sbalneav> Ah, no, I think stgraber added that.
<sbalneav> LDM_LIMIT_ONE_SESSION_PROMPT = True
<sbalneav> in your lts.conf file.
<sbalneav> Whoops, sorry
<sbalneav> LDM_LIMIT_ONE_SESSION = True
<mrpogi> sbalneav: thanks. by the way im just wondering why my lts.conf file is in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc instead of /opt/ltsp/i386. i used xubuntu 9.04. just curious
<sbalneav> The best place to put it in /var/lib/tftboot/ltsp/i386/
<sbalneav> then you don't have to rebuild the chroot
<mrpogi> yup i saw in your upstream where i'm supposed to find the file. which is why i'm wondering why it's not in /var/lib/tftpboot/..../i386/. so i googled and they pointed me to /opt/ltsp/i386/etc. anyways can i just copy the file from it's present location to /var/lib/.../i386 with no problems?
<sbalneav> yeah, by default it's not there, since most things autoconfigure.
<sbalneav> just copy it and reboot.
<mrpogi> ok thanks
<Ahmuck-Sr> nn
<pangerankadal> is it fine to put 'ibus-daemon' in /etc/bash.bashrc?
<Guest93934> Hi, I would like to create a multi-boot DVD of Ubuntu 9.10.
<Guest93934> I got everything working (Ubuntu as base /, /kubuntu, /mythbuntu, /xubuntu) by just changing each initrd scripts/casper file to include the subdirectory.
<Guest93934> But when I try to do the same with /edubuntu, the DVD start fails.
<Guest93934> isolinux:   kernel /edubuntu/casper/vmlinuz     append  file=/cdrom/edubuntu/preseed/edubuntu.seed boot=casper initrd=/edubuntu/casper/initrd.lz --
<Guest93934> The error message is "Kernel panic - not syncing: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on unknown-block(8,1)" and it is suggested to append a correct root= boot option.
<Guest93934> Does someone know what is needed to boot the Edubuntu 9.10 LiveDVD from a subdirectory?
<sbalneav> Guest93934: No idea.
<sbalneav> Morning all
<Guest93934> sbalneav: good morning and thanks. do you know someone who could know it? ;)
<Guest93934> sbalneav: i tried for hours to get it to work but without luck
<sbalneav> I have no idea.  Probably not many people in here.  You're kind of doing your own thing there, outside of the scope of what we deliver, and the person who used to roll our dvd images has now retired.
<sbalneav> I'm supposed to take on the role, but I'm not up to speed yet.
<Guest93934> sbalneav: ah, ok, thanks for the info, then I got lucky and not so lucky at the same time ;)
<Guest93934> sbalneav: but because the new DVD is so big, do you know what packages (besides the edubuntu-desktop metapackage) are needed to change an Ubuntu destop to a hopefully full Edubuntu?
<sbalneav> Well, if you look at the recommends for the edubuntu-desktop package, that will tell you
<sbalneav> I won't bother to type them out here.
<Guest93934> sbalneav: ok, then I will just forget that there is now an Edubuntu ISO available and do like I did last time with 9.04 ;)
<Guest93934> sbalneav: edubuntu-desktop shows no dependency to LTSP, so it is already included and a LTSP server installable with just the dependencies of edubuntu-desktop?
<sbalneav> I beleive if you press f4 on bootup of the dvd, you get the option to install ltsp-server.  I veleive it's implemented as a tasksel.
<Guest93934> you're right. but I think without the proper knowledge I will wait for 10.04 to build a Edubuntu with more features.
<jbicha> alkisg: this sounds like an interesting idea https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/Multiseat and http://wiki.c3sl.ufpr.br/multiseat/index.php/Mdm and https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MultiseatX
<alkisg> jbicha: I tried that 2 years ago, it's rather unstable, but when it works, it's much, much faster than ltsp
<Ahmuck> alkisg: ?
<alkisg> jbicha: and also the karmic gdm dropped multiseat support, so I guess it'll take some time for multiseat to be production ready
<alkisg> ...and there's also the problem with finding compatible hardware...
<jbicha> oh, so it's kinda complicated then?
<Ahmuck> alkisg: i'm late to the conversation.
<Ahmuck> what did you try?
<jbicha> jbicha: alkisg: this sounds like an interesting idea https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/Multiseat and http://wiki.c3sl.ufpr.br/multiseat/index.php/Mdm and https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MultiseatX
<jbicha> alkisg: thanks for your feedback, it's probably not much cheaper for schools and such and most computer graphics cards only support one monitor, right?
<alkisg> jbicha: theoretically, you could put 2 sli cards and have 4 seats
<sbalneav> multiseat's been around for quite some time.
<alkisg> jbicha: but that setup is mostly used for gamers, so it's expensive... :(
<jbicha> sbalneav: yeah, there's a lot I've never heard of...I had never personally tried LTSP until last weekend
<alkisg> There are some companies which sell such "labs" with multiseat computers
<sbalneav> It's an interesting idea, but the problem is, with ltsp, you're limited by the length of a network cable
<sbalneav> with multiseat, you're limited by the length of a video cable.
<sbalneav> yeah, some people were really pushing LTSP to support multiseat.
<sbalneav> "Why don't you guys add..."
<alkisg> The good thing with multiseat is that you have 3d acceleration etc, so you can run any app.
<sbalneav> the idea being that you'd only need 1 thin client for 4 people.
<sbalneav> As usual, our response was: "we greatfully accept patches" :)
<sbalneav> In principle, it's a fine idea.  Especiialy for someone with a home office.  Nice way to add another seat for the kids.
<sbalneav> problem is, all linux development these days seems to be going the "Ein CPU, Ein Keyboard, Ein mouse, Ein user" philosophy.
<sbalneav> it's hard enough within the ltsp communty to remind people like gnome and kde that "hey, there may be more than one user per machine"
<sbalneav> Flash is a symptom of this.
<sbalneav> it's an application with the "one user sitting at a powerful full desktop" philosophy.
<Ahmuck> actually i'm interested in multi-seat
<Ahmuck> i've been looking at alternatives to ltsp
<Ahmuck> i can't quite get ltsp to work like i'd like to
<sbalneav> Yeah?  What doesn't work the way you want?
<Ahmuck> in 9.04, sound was non-existant after about 7 min
<Ahmuck> in 9.10, firefox is locking up hard
<sbalneav> You were going to test and see if it was flash causing the problem
<sbalneav> was it?
<sbalneav> Have you enabled NBD_SWAP?
<Ahmuck> i've not tested yet
<Ahmuck> iirc, i have
<Ahmuck> i've considered using the local hard drive for swap
<sbalneav> that works too.
<sbalneav> I don't know your setup.  Could be a video card problem.  Could be a flash problem
<sbalneav> From the "multiseat X" ubuntu page:
<sbalneav> "In theory, there are several different ways to achieve multi-seat; in practice there are very few approaches which are both simple and stable."
<sbalneav> So, if you'd like, you could develop a way to do it that's simple and stable :)
<alkisg> For non-developers, I don't think multiseat is workable right now (for production that is - for testing it's doable)
<jbicha> I have two college classes I registered for that start Sunday towards a Bachelor's in Computer & Information Science but I'm considering dropping them...
<jbicha> college seems a bunch of busywork that I don't have time for, especially with my job
<sbalneav> Ahmuck: I would say your BEST bet would be to work with me and/or other LTSP developers to find out why your firefox is having trouble, but feel free to head off in another direction...
<alkisg> Are you guys able to see that? http://www.bbc.co.uk/schools/teachers/offbyheart/video/luke_wright_daffodils.shtml
<alkisg> For me it says "not available in your area..."
<jbicha> alkisg: yeah, not available here either
<jbicha> find a UK proxy :-)
<alkisg> Urm I guess it's only available ... yeah :-/
<sbalneav> I can see it.
<sbalneav> But I'm from Canada, and a member of the Commonwealth.
<sbalneav> Membership has it's priviledges.
<sbalneav> :)
<alkisg> OK, so it's either UK or Canada proxy :D
<sbalneav> heh
<jbicha> oh, psiphon is an awesome Canadian proxy
<jbicha> but the embedded video doesn't work in it
<alkisg> Got it ;)
<Ahmuck> ok, back
<Ahmuck> iirc, there was an edubuntu meeting in which Mark for kdeedu was using multi-seat on large platforms
<sbalneav> Ahmuck: Ping me if you'd like help with your firefox problem.
<Ahmuck> btw, alkisg, i can see it
<Ahmuck> use noscript
<alkisg> To disable javascript? ty, I'll try...
<Ahmuck> i can access anything from that site.  i'm US bound
<Ahmuck> i've got noscript & yesscript
<Ahmuck> works great
<Ahmuck> sbalneav: i'd love to get a very stable, and usable ltsp installation
<alkisg> Ahmuck: and without noscript, you get "not available in your area"?
<Ahmuck> i'm going to have to do it in steps over a couple of weeks
<Ahmuck> alkisg: nope
<alkisg> Ahmuck: then it just allows US to view the content..
<alkisg> I'm not in the US, so I can't see it.
<Ahmuck> alkisg: nm
<Ahmuck> noscript was blocking the video portion of it
<Ahmuck> so i wasn't seeing the video window
<Ahmuck> and now it does say "not available in my area"
<alkisg> Heh
<Ahmuck> though the poems are available in pdf form
<sbalneav> Ahmuck: I have a very stable and usable LTSP installation.
<sbalneav> But you sometimes have to do some debugging.
<sbalneav> Remember, LTSP relies on a lot of different packages.  And excercies parts of those packages that don't normally get excercied on a single desktop box.
<sbalneav> Did you do any testing of 9.10 before it came out?
<sbalneav> Ahmuck: I'm on my lunchhour now.  If you'd like some help, now would be the time to work on it.
<Ahmuck> r u CST ?
<Ahmuck> sbalneav: unfortunately, i'm unable to today, i've got a publication deadline i'm trying to meet
<sbalneav> CST yes.
#edubuntu 2009-11-04
<sbalneav> Well, tonights the night to convert over my main box.
<sbalneav> back
<alkisg> On karmic?:)
<sbalneav> Apparently
<ogra> bug 432598
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 432598 in gnome-power-manager "can_suspend and can_hibernate values aren't respected" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/432598
<Nokio> Hi all i have a edubuntu that i upgrade from 8.04 to 8.10. The upgrade seems to have been okay. But now when i boot i can get to grub normaly and then the edubuntu start and finaly when i should have a login screen i have a black screen with white and green line..... Any idea ?! :p
<alkisg> !info ldm
<ubottu> ldm (source: ldm): LTSP display manager. In component main, is optional. Version 2:2.0.48-0ubuntu1 (karmic), package size 60 kB, installed size 504 kB
#edubuntu 2009-11-05
<Ahmuck> is there a way to audit user accounts on a system?
<Ahmuck> under a multi user system, isn't the user's directories supposed to be in-accessible from other users?
<mhall119> Ahmuck: no
<mhall119> they're usually not writable by other users
<Ahmuck> readable by others?
<mhall119> the base of the folder is, yeah
<Ahmuck> opening individual images/documents?
<Ahmuck> opening of ?
<sbalneav> Evening all
<Ahmuck> ok, back to user directories.  should user directories be "locked" to prevent traversing them?
<sbalneav> Ahmuck: Depends.
<sbalneav> How are you planning on sharing files?
<sbalneav> Are you going to create separate "shared areas" for your people to share documents?
<Ahmuck> well, isn't "Public" a shared folder for public?
<sbalneav> Public, where?
<Ahmuck> my concern is students traversing home directories and "snooping" in other student's files
<sbalneav> In a users home dir?
<Ahmuck> yes, it's here on our system by default
<Ahmuck> each user's home directory has a "Public" folder
<sbalneav> yeah.  In my view, it's kinda dumb.
<sbalneav> here's how we do it.
<sbalneav> Each user has their own primary group
<sbalneav> so I'm sbalneav:sbalneav
<sbalneav> my home dir is mode 770
<sbalneav> and I set the umask on the system to be 007
<sbalneav> I create a /home/share
<sbalneav> owned by nobody:share, which is a group I create, gid > 10000
<sbalneav> In the members of the group, I list all the userid's who need access to the share.
<sbalneav> the mode on the share directory is 2770
<sbalneav> i.e. the setgid bit is set.
<sbalneav> that way, any user who creates a file in that dir, the file is created group owned "share"
<Ahmuck> understood, that i agree with
<sbalneav> That's how I've been sharing files at Legal Aid for 15 years.
<sbalneav> it's always worked like a charm
<Ahmuck> i'll probally make it "public" rather than share
<Ahmuck> so, can your users drop into each other's directory and see their files? open jpgs, etc.?
<Ahmuck> can they view what's in each other's directory?
<sbalneav> no
<Ahmuck> ie, my love letter to Daniel, etc.
<Ahmuck> hrm, i must have something wrong on my system then
<sbalneav> No you dont
<Ahmuck> created a new user today, and that user can traverse any directory
<Ahmuck> and view, open files, etc.
<sbalneav> Sure
<sbalneav> by default, the umask's set to 002
<Ahmuck> so ur saying that the procedure above is what you use to restrict that?
<sbalneav> and /etc/skel's got too wide a permission.
<sbalneav> Well, I don't use the graphical user creator
<Ahmuck> neither do i
<Ahmuck> i use "adduser someuser"
<sbalneav> since I use LDAP for my account creation, I have custom scripts for adding users.
<Ahmuck> ah
<Ahmuck> well, i'll touch base with you tomorrow, i'm exhausted today
<Ahmuck> fell asleep on the floor at work today, napping
<sbalneav> lsbalneav@phobos:/etc/pam.d$ ls -la /etc/skel
<sbalneav> total 32
<sbalneav> drwxr-xr-x   2 root root  4096 2009-10-28 18:55 .
<sbalneav> you'll want to start by toning down the permissions on /etc/skel, iirc
<sbalneav> since it uses those to creat the home dir.
<keffie_jayx> highvoltage: ping
<highvoltage> keffie_jayx: pong
<highvoltage> keffie_jayx: how are things?
<sbalneav> Morning all
<highvoltage> morning sbalneav
<highvoltage> sbalneav: I saw lts.conf.xlm for the first time yesterday... wow
<sbalneav> which? In the docs you mean?
<sbalneav> yeah
<sbalneav> I've put a bit of work into that.
<sbalneav> highvoltage: So, you in Canada yet?
<highvoltage> sbalneav: not yet, it will probably be another month or so before I'm there
<jbicha> is it cold in S Africa?
<sbalneav> highvoltage: excellent!  We should be deep in winter by that time :)
<sbalneav> Ping me when you're here, I'll gve you a buzz
<highvoltage> sbalneav: I'll do so! I'm actually quite scared about the cold :)
<highvoltage> jbicha: it's summer in south africa atm, so it's quite warm
<jbicha> oh, I forgot
<sbalneav> Well, it doesn't get down to -40C in Montreal like it does here.
<highvoltage> jbicha: :)
<sbalneav> Maybeeee -15 to -20
<highvoltage> yeah coldest it gets in Cape Town is about 5C. coldest I ever experienced was about 1C when I was in Johannesburg last year
<jbicha> it's still around 30C/90F this week here
<highvoltage> jbicha: where is 'here'?
<jbicha> Bahrain
 * highvoltage loves Bahrain
<jbicha> my parents live in northern Alberta though
<jbicha> do you still plan on visiting Bahrain in a few months
<highvoltage> jbicha: if there's time and if I can afford it
<highvoltage> jbicha: I'd love to be able to take my father to a grand prix race, he's a big fan but has never been to one
<jbicha> I expect to be living in the DC area next August so the climate should be more "normal" there
<effie_jayx> highvolt1ge: ping
<highvolt1ge> effie_jayx: pong
<effie_jayx> highvoltage: did you ever find that guide on teaching kids about free software?
<highvoltage> effie_jayx: no I didn't, at some point I'll have to do a thorough search on some old backups and get in contact with some people to see if they have it, I'm slightly worried that it might be gone forever
<effie_jayx> highvoltage: I should show you what my daughter is learning at school
<effie_jayx> the book is filled with WIN XP screenshots
<effie_jayx> nothing against WIN XP SSs
<effie_jayx> but even if she tried any other product from microsoft she would be so lost with the ui changes
<effie_jayx> she is only 7
<highvoltage> effie_jayx: ouch
<highvoltage> effie_jayx: yeah it's been a big topic in some places, should you teach someone how to use a specific OS, or should you rather teach them general concepts that are universal that they can use everywhere?
<highvoltage> effie_jayx: it's also a similar issue with openoffice vs ms office
<highvoltage> effie_jayx: in some institutions they spend lots of time teaching very specific parts of specific versions of ms office, then one day when the user has to move to another version or to another office suite, they're not sure how to figure out where to find the features
<LaserJock> it's really hard even with different versions of MS Office
<LaserJock> I've got MS Office 2007 here at work and I have no idea how to run the thing
<keffie_jayx> yeah, but it is just scary how fosilized that can get
<keffie_jayx> m dughter has been using linux as long as I have
<highvoltage> keffie_jayx: just saw your private dents... did you perhaps mean http://jonathancarter.co.za/files/static/docs/cookbook.html ?
<highvoltage> keffie_jayx: that was more meant towards teachers than kids :)
<keffie_jayx> highvoltage: right right
<keffie_jayx> highvoltage: right... but it is still good quality material
<highvoltage> wow, welcome to everyone who joined!
<stgraber> great to see more people in that room ;)
<ewaldmire> I hope the group doesn't mind a follow-up question about LTSP-Cluster.... I'm just having a hard time finding more info about it:  Is it ready for production use?  Is there a place with screenshots/more info?
<highvoltage> I wonder if there's already any software packaged that we should include for special-needs students
<stgraber> it's deployed and used by over 60000 users mostly in Canada and it's getting to be used in companies as well
<stgraber> documentation is mostly available on http://wiki.ltsp-cluster.org
<stgraber> you have a guide here "OpenVZ installation guide" on how to install it with OpenVZ, the same can be applied to physical servers
<stgraber> the code and bug tracking is done on Launchpad at https://launchpad.net/ltsp-cluster
<stgraber> and we unfortunately don't have screenshot of our web UI (maybe because I'm not exactly proud of it ;)) but we probably should have some
<stgraber> of both the current web interface and the new one on which highvoltage is working at the moment
<ewaldmire> stgraber:  Got it - that's what I was looking for.  Sounds like I just need to install it and check it out.  :-)
<stgraber> the howto refers to the PPA as it was done for Jaunty, if you do it on Karmic, then you can simply use the regular package archive
<stgraber> highvoltage got all the packages in the archive with karmic
<rodneyorpheus> who should I talk to about getting a new package added to Edubuntu?
<stgraber> rodneyorpheus: what software would that be ?
<stgraber> I don't think we have a clear process there though we should establish a list of candidates and packages to work on during UDS
<rodneyorpheus> Sandbox, it's a 3D game design environment for kids
<highvoltage> rodneyorpheus: it's the same process as getting a package into Ubuntu, although you could bring it to our attention by filing a needs-packaging bug in launchpad and subscribing us to it
<stgraber> so sending me a list before UDS is probably the easiest
<highvoltage> rodneyorpheus: ah :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: sounds like a great way of handling needs-packaging for education
<stgraber> so just do as highvoltage said and I'll look at that list of bugs ;)
<LaserJock> Sandbox has been around for a while
<highvoltage> rodneyorpheus: they send us announcements to our lists when they make new releases, it's been on my radar for packaging work for a while
<LaserJock> last time I looked at it needed some work to get it ready for packaging
<rodneyorpheus> yeah, I was helping the devs and the GetDeb people make a debian package of the new version
<highvoltage> rodneyorpheus: I've only become a motu last week, I'll add it to my list of things to package, but if anyone wants to beat me to it they are welcome :)
<rodneyorpheus> so that's done now
<rodneyorpheus> oh it's done
<Jesi-Idle> there is going to be a web interface to?
<rodneyorpheus> and working wel
<LaserJock> rodneyorpheus: so you have a source package?
<rodneyorpheus> source is available, and c_korn from GetDeb already made a working ubuntu package
<stgraber> rodneyorpheus: I don't see the package in Debian itself so it won't get imported automatically, though if you have a source package, that'll help us include it in Ubuntu directly
<rodneyorpheus> please have a look here
<rodneyorpheus> https://bugs.launchpad.net/getdeb.net/+bug/256665
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/256665)
<rodneyorpheus> sandboxgamemaker (2.4-1~getdeb1) jaunty; urgency=low Â Â * New upstream version. (LP: #256665) Â -- Christoph Korn <c_korn@gmx.de>  Sat, 17 Oct 2009 16:05:28 +0200
<rodneyorpheus> if that's any help?
<rodneyorpheus> it's an excellent program, I'd really like to see it more widely known
<stgraber> I'm adding an Ubuntu task
<stgraber> done
<rodneyorpheus> thanks!
<Jesi-Idle> Question: I'm a guy and I support what your doin, I'm not really sure what to say for this session, and I think that goes for most here and is why you're not getting many replies, I've never had a problem when it comes to gender equality and it's something I promote,   but I know that allot of my male friends really aren't that sensitive here, but they often don't realize it, what steps can one take to make sure the eviro
<Jesi-Idle> nment doesn't seem so male-dominated, because I garuntee you many guys are completely oblivious
<Jesi-Idle> sorry wrong channel
<HedgeMage> rofl
<Ahmuck_> anki would be a good one to package
<Lns> lol
<Lns> Ok, do you need anything else from the store besides milk and bread? Oh, sorry wrong channel ;)
<Ahmuck_> is everybody lost today?
<Lns> Ahmuck: have you seen my baseball?
<Sarten-X> I'm trying to prepare a set of disks for use in a school in rural Africa. The donated machines there have only CD drives, not DVD. Is there a smaller version of edubuntu available, or an easy way to produce one?
<LaserJock> Sarten-X: would USB sticks be available at all?
<Sarten-X> Possibly, but i'm not sure
<Jesi-Idle> is you cant use any kind of USB/Thumb Drive.... I would suggest putting Ubuntu on a CD, installing it and then have them install the Edubuntu packages
<LaserJock> the DVD image can be burned to a USB stick using USB Startup Disk Creator
<Jesi-Idle> provided they have internet
<LaserJock> and if not you might have to do something like AptOnCD
<Sarten-X> What made Edubuntu so big? As I recall, 8.10 was only 300 megs or so...
<LaserJock> Sarten-X: it was just an addon Cd with the educational apps
<LaserJock> Sarten-X: it's now a full installation disk,so like Ubuntu + all the apps and language packs + LTSP rolled together
<Jesi-Idle> hopefully it wont get so big we'll need to go blue-ray....... I'd like to see allot of stuff added....  but that may cause headaches
<Sarten-X> oh... so it no longer needs a separate ubuntu install first?
<LaserJock> well
<LaserJock> Sarten-X: exactly
<LaserJock> it's all in one
<LaserJock> Sarten-X: we also added a Live session too where you can play around with it from the DVD without installing
<LaserJock> similar to the Ubuntu Desktop CD
<Sarten-X> can it still use a separate installation? Most of the machines wouldn't even run the desktop installer, and needed the alternate.
<LaserJock> Sarten-X: the alternate is there too
<LaserJock> the DVD has both
<LaserJock> which is part of why it's so big
<Sarten-X> ah... this is going to take more preparation than I was expecting...
<LaserJock> well, we made the DVD so that hopefully it would need *less*
<Sarten-X> oh
<Sarten-X> no no no...
<Sarten-X> it'll be less work for the person going over there...
<Sarten-X> just I need to figure out logistics again
<Jesi-Idle> I think the Live CD feature is going to be very important in getting people to try it.... is there/ will there be a WUBI version of Edubuntu?
<rodneyorpheus> yes, WUBI would be great!
<rodneyorpheus> the biggest problem is getting people to do that first install
<rodneyorpheus> once they've crossed that barrier you're halfway there
<rodneyorpheus> and WUBI is really good for that
<Sarten-X> heh
<Sarten-X> wubi is awesome
<Sarten-X> it has only one problem...
<Sarten-X> when I demonstrate it, I can only describe it as "magic"
<rodneyorpheus> hehe, so true
<rodneyorpheus> I use it to teach my students about alternative operating systems, and they honestly can't believe  that it will work
<rodneyorpheus> good talking to you all - bye!
<wiehan> where can I get an add-on iso for 9.10?
<LaserJock> you can't
<wiehan> LaserJock: that isn't cool
<LaserJock> you need to either download the Edubuntu DVD or install via internet
<wiehan> LaserJock: If I download the Edubuntu package from ubuntu 9.10 - How large download would that be megabyte wise?
<LaserJock> wiehan: hmm, maybe 200MB
<wiehan> I do not understand that, because Ubuntu is ~700mb + 200mb for edubuntu package, Edubuntu is 3.3gb?
<LaserJock> well
<LaserJock> there's a lot more to it
<LaserJock> the Edubuntu DVD includes both text-based and graphical installers
<wiehan> LaserJock: I understant that more stuff is on the DVD so that you don't have to download it.
<LaserJock> and there are a whole lot of language packs
<LaserJock> Ubuntu + educational apps is ~ 1GB
<LaserJock> but we have both graphical and text-based installers, which doubles that
<LaserJock> 2GB
<LaserJock> then we have about 1GB worth of language packs
<LaserJock> 3GB
<wiehan> Ok, would there really be any other advantage than downloading the DVD versus downloading the edubuntu package (Except for not having to download stuff I want later)
<LaserJock> well, if you already have Ubuntu installed, no, not really
<LaserJock> with the DVD you can install everything together pretty quickly and you can also run the educational apps from the DVD itself (for demos)
<wiehan> what does the "not really" part implies? Because I really can't download that much now, but I really want the best for the kid I'm doing this for?
<LaserJock> wiehan: I can probably cut it down
<LaserJock> wiehan: what age?
<wiehan> LaserJock: I really do not mind for the stuff you just mentioned
<wiehan> Age 12
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> you might try just installing ubuntu-edu-primary
<LaserJock> I my machine that takes 218MB to download
<LaserJock> unfortunately a lot of that is because of the KDE dependencies of KDE Edu
<LaserJock> but it's a very nice suite of software
<wiehan> I would just use gnome?
<wiehan> Are there some default KDE apps bundled with the standard gnome edubntu?
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> the KDE Edu suite comes with Edubuntu
<wiehan> I understand
<LaserJock> it's a lot to download but Gnome doesn't really have equivalent apps
<LaserJock> if it was me I'd probably just install ubuntu-edu-secondary
<wiehan> Can I just deliver one interesting comment: Edubuntu is Free, and Free is GREAT. Where does free-software have the most 'value'? The answer is simply put - in "poor" countries. "Poor countries" have expensive internet - then why only the DVD image? It makes no sense to some, like me, from where I come.
<LaserJock> wiehan: well, its a complicated issue
<Jesi-Idle> the dvd image is great for that very reason, if internet isn't an option you need another method....the DVD is that method.... that hope usually is the CD
<Jesi-Idle> or DVD can be sent to you
<LaserJock> wiehan: we hope that people can share DVDs as much as possible
<Jesi-Idle> if you cant download it
<Jesi-Idle> it's complicated
<wiehan> Jesi-Idle: That is easy to say if internet has never been a problem.
<LaserJock> the addon CD was causing use quite a bit of issues
<LaserJock> one problem was basically stigma, people didn't think Edubuntu was a distro because it was an add-on
<LaserJock> for instance, DistroWatch dropped us
<wiehan> So why not create specialzed downloads: Like Edubuntu-9.10-English
<LaserJock> we don't have bandwidth for it
<LaserJock> internet is not just an issue for poor countries
<LaserJock> we have only enough "hosting" space for 1 .iso file
<LaserJock> we decided to make the most of it we could
<wiehan> Doesn't the same amount for of smaller downloads equal less than the same amount times 3.3gb of downloads?
<LaserJock> no
<wiehan> LaserJock: Ah, but isn't hosting space a difference issue than bandwaith?
<LaserJock> because we currently ship ~ 100 languages worth
<Jesi-Idle> wiehan: you can install the packages on top of Ubuntu, provided language isn't an issue.... that's 200some MB yeah but have you seen an Ubuntu ISO less than 200Mb?
<LaserJock> if we made a CD for each
<LaserJock> it's something like 50GB easily
<wiehan> LaserJock: I understand, just curious
<LaserJock> yeah, we put off doing a DVD for years
<LaserJock> *specifically* because of poor countries
<LaserJock> it was not an easy decision to make
<LaserJock> another big issue was that there was no way to demo Edubuntu using a Cd
<Jesi-Idle> LaserJock: what is the storage and bandwidth limit you have to deal with?
<wiehan> It still is tough for so many people to download 3.3gb (it takes for ages and it's expensive) - it really is tough to understand if you live in a first world country an Internet in an legal right even...
<LaserJock> Jesi-Idle: Canonical will only host us if we limit ourselves to 1 .iso
<LaserJock> wiehan: I understand
<LaserJock> wiehan: hopefully if things progress we can do something better for people
<Jesi-Idle> internet isn't a legal right here, were I live....  USA
<wiehan> Jesi-Idle: Well, it still is dirt cheap and hell fast there
<LaserJock> we don't often have usage caps in the US, which is a real issue in a lot of countries
<LaserJock> even if it is slow here, we can just leave it downloading for however long it takes without a problem
<LaserJock> my parents have a 2GB cap/ month I think
<LaserJock> so they couldn't download it
<Jesi-Idle> Wiehan: most of the time, like he said usage caps are the big difference......
<LaserJock> anyway, I gotta run home
<wiehan> but your "slow" is really different than ours
<LaserJock> not always, you'd be suprised
<wiehan> I still really appreciate what you guys are doing
<wiehan> keep it up
<Jesi-Idle> LaserJock: have you considered using other places to store filkes as well, like a mirrorbut a "mirror" per sey?
<LaserJock> the US can have some of the worst internet connections on the planet
<LaserJock> Jesi-Idle: well, we'd love to have just plain mirrors
<Jesi-Idle> yep, when I had SB Yahoo, it went out all the time
<wiehan> LaserJock: Do you often download stuff at a rate of 5kB/s
<LaserJock> the problem is with the Addon Cd nobody was taking Edubuntu seriously
<LaserJock> wiehan: my parents do, usually 3kB/s
<wiehan> Well..
<LaserJock> they just upgraded last week to a satellite internet thingy so they're no beyond a 28.8 modem :-)
<Jesi-Idle> the internet, one of our biggest resources yet one of our biggest limitations
<LaserJock> wiehan: it depends on where in the US you are
<LaserJock> wiehan: some places are very fast, but some places have horrible horrible phone lines that can't take DSL, etc.
<LaserJock> Japan has some screaming fast internet
<LaserJock> man I wish I had their connections
<wiehan> And I wish I had yours
<Jesi-Idle> same, Japan has allot of the cool tech as well
<wiehan> Anyways, I also need to go
<LaserJock> a friend in Tokyo gets a 100MB/s optical T1 straight to his house for < $50 USD
<Jesi-Idle>  LaserJock: are you serious? that would be so expensive in the US
<LaserJock> wiehan: thanks for stopping by
<LaserJock> Jesi-Idle: crazy I know, he has full mirrors of everything *buntu (archives, isos, etc.)
<Jesi-Idle> I plan to set up a home server, if Fiver Oprics come out here, I'd be so happy.....
<Jesi-Idle> I would to if I had that kind of connection :), what about Australia and China, do you know?
#edubuntu 2009-11-06
<sbalneav> Evening everyone
<petsounds> hi, good afternoon. i want to ask if there's videos or documents (pdf) that i can use to promote edubuntu usage in my campus. thanks
<wima1> since we upgraded our application servers to 9.04, we have some issues with pulse. The pulse daemon on the client seems to die quite often.
<wima1> Is this problem familiar to anyone?
<msaul_> I installed LTSP Ubuntu 9.10, and DNS is not working  could anyone offer suggestions for fix?
<msaul_> I can ssh into a system with static IP address
<msaul_> When I use "dig" tool, it indicates "Connection Timed Out: no servers could be reached...
<alkisg> DNS? LTSP doesn't handle dns... it's your responsibility..
<alkisg> Do you mean the thin clients? the server? How do you get your ip addresses? etc etc...
<msaul_> the server
<alkisg> 2 nic server?
<msaul_> wasn't able to update software on server
<msaul_> yes 2 nic server
<msaul_> not worried about thin client right now..
<alkisg> Well, the nic that is facing the internet is not handled by ltsp at all
<msaul_> I know that
<alkisg> How is that managed? with network manager?
<msaul_> I was able to SSH to another server with static IP address
<msaul_> It is a wired ethernet card
<msaul_> I think it is the network manager (applet on panel)
<alkisg> OK, but how does it get an ip address? With network manager? with /etc/network/interfaces? with a static ip? with dhcp?
<msaul_> dhcp
<alkisg> Then it's a problem with your "outer" dhcp server, it's not sending a dns setting
<msaul_> What would be the fix? Is there a file to edit?
<alkisg> Where is the dhcp server? is it a router?
<msaul_> Yes, I have a router
<alkisg> Then it may be a setting on the router
<msaul_> How come, when I install Ubuntu 9.10, Mythbuntu 9.10 no problem, but now a problem when I install alternate Ubuntu with LTSP/
<msaul_> SHould I just reinstall the alternate Ubuntu CD with LTSP?
<alkisg> Can you describe your network setup?
<alkisg> No, don't reinstall for a simple ip problem...
<alkisg> E.g. do you have both server nics connected to the same switch?
<msaul_> no
<msaul_> This was fresh install, nic card to Internet, other nic card (eventually connected to switch) not connected yet
<alkisg> router => switch => server eth0 => server eth1 => switch => thin clients ???
<msaul_> eth0
<msaul_> for the internet connection
<alkisg> Can you upload some files to pastebin?
<alkisg> cat /etc/network/interfaces
<msaul_> and remember, I can still connect to outside server using static IP address!
<msaul_> which ones would you like me to upload?
<alkisg> ls  /etc/NetworkManager/system-connections/
<alkisg> cat /etc/resolv.conf
<alkisg> (the output of the instructions I'm typing)
<alkisg> sudo ifconfig -a
<alkisg> sudo dhclient eth0
<msaul_> I forgot how to upload to pastebin...
<alkisg> Go to pastebin.ubuntu.com and paste the output there..
<alkisg> and then paste the URL here
<msaul_> OK, well get back to you (will take some time)...
<alkisg> sure :)
<alkisg> msaul_: ah, to temporarily solve the problem,
<alkisg> you can do: sudo gedit /etc/resolv.conf
<alkisg> and put a dns server there
<alkisg> That way you'll be able to copy/paste stuff...
<msaul_> There was one there already, and matched what was on my other Ubuntu system that is correctly using DNS...
<msaul_> i.e. relating to the /etc/resolv.conf file
<alkisg> Ah. OK, we'll troubleshoot it after you post the output of the commands...
<alkisg> msaul_: would you prefer remote access, i.e. giving me a shell in that pc? it'll be faster for both of us :)
<sbalneav> Morning all
<msaul_> OK, I will start uploading to pastebin (note: command ls /etc/NetworkManager/system-connections/ had no stdout)...
<alkisg> msaul_: ok no problem there, you just don't have any system connections set
<msaul_> What would be the procedure for that?
<alkisg> Right click on the network manager, manage connections, make a connection, click "available to all users", and save
<msaul_> OK, I will try that OK, back in a few...
<alkisg> msaul_: no don't try it, just send the output of the commands...
<msaul_> I assume network manager should be an applet on the panel - correct?
<msaul_> I just see one applet for the connection, and when I double-click it, it shows that wired network is not being managed...
<msaul_> I don't see the network manager as an applet to add into the panel...
<msaul_> I remember from other verions there are two applets, one being the network manager... doesn't seem to appear on my panel...
<msaul_> (by default anyways)...
<msaul_> alkisg - I went to network manager, there was already a connection labelled auto eth0 that had "avaialble to all users".
<msaul_> Do you want me to still add in other connection?
<alkisg> msaul_: I'm waiting for the files :)
<alkisg> Don't add any connections...
<alkisg> (05:11:07 Î¼Î¼) alkisg: msaul_: no don't try it, just send the output of the commands...
<msaul_> I already posted them... or I though I did...
<msaul_> You mean the several commands that you asked me to upload to pastebin? I did that 8 minutes ago...
<msaul_> Do you want me to upload again?
<alkisg> No, but you should paste the URL here so that I can see the output...
<alkisg> E.g. http://pastebin.com/qeworjiqw
<msaul_> Sorry, getting confused, that URL doesn't work... I posted to http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/ as instructed... (poster: msaul)
<alkisg> (04:49:09 Î¼Î¼) alkisg: Go to pastebin.ubuntu.com and paste the output there..
<alkisg> (04:49:14 Î¼Î¼) alkisg: and then paste the URL here
<alkisg> It's the second step :)
<msaul_> I copied and pasted output from those commands to the pastebin and posted...
<alkisg> msaul_: I can't see the output if I don't know the link...
<alkisg> When you paste something to pastebin, it replies with a URL
<alkisg> You give that URL to the person you're talking with (=me), so that he can see the output
<alkisg> Let me demonstrate
<alkisg> Here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/311607/
<alkisg> I'm giving you this URL, where you can go and see my "output"
<alkisg> If you don't give me the url of the things you've posted, I can't see them...
<msaul_> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/311608/
<alkisg> msaul_: Nice. What was the output of "dhclient eth0" ?
<msaul_> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/311610/
<msaul_> That may have been issuing just dhclient instead of dhclient eth0 .... but seems to display same type of information...
<alkisg> msaul_: so both of your subnets are at 192.168.0.x ?
<msaul_> yes
<alkisg> That's the problem
<sbalneav> Ooooh
<sbalneav> that's bad :)
<alkisg> You need to change either the router subnet or the thin clients subnet
<msaul_> Which file is that again to edit? (It's been a while...)
<alkisg> You can do that from the router web interface
<sbalneav> OK, off for a doctor's appointment. :(
<msaul_> Will this happen, even if there is no cable connected up to eth1?
<msaul_> Can't this be edited in the dhcpd.conf file?
<msaul_> I'm wondering why this is happenning from a simple install of Ubuntu 9.10 LTSP when I haven't even hooked up the thin clients?
<alkisg> Because you use the same subnet in both NICs
<msaul_> But I didn't set anything, the system must have be default...
<alkisg> If you want to change the ltsp-facing interface, you'll need to edit /etc/network/interfaces and /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
<alkisg> Yes, you happen to have the same default in your router as the ltsp default
 * alkisg has some work to do now, bbl...
<msaul_> Is that a mistake, or is that just the way it comes by default?
<alkisg> It's the way it comes by default
<alkisg> It isn't a bug
<alkisg> You're welcome
<msaul_> thanks
<msaul_> just juggling
<alkisg> ;)
<msaul_> (my son's at home with flu)
<msaul_> daughter had H1N1, but better...
<alkisg> Ooops
<msaul_> that's OK... dont' worry about it you did know...
<alkisg> How long did she took to get better? A week?
<msaul_> You are being very patient with an oldtimer :)
<msaul_> I'm going to send up to paste bin contents of files to (before/after) to see if you agree for me to set correct subnet, then I will make fix and see if that works...
<msaul_> OK, here is the current /etc/network/interfaces file: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/311630/
<msaul_> I should modify it to something like this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/311632/ - am I correct?
<msaul_> I should change it to something like this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/311634/  - am I correct?
<msaul_> alkisg - yes. It took a week for her to get better
<msaul_> If all goes well, I will be able to get my shot in March 2010...
<msaul_> A lot of lines and confusion regarding the flu shots up here in Canada...
<msaul_> That did the trick - thanks!
<msaul_> Thanks for the great support! This is a good IRC resource. Just another reason I love to use Ubuntu.
<msaul_> I have created some resources FYI: Ubuntu Guide (teaching point of view): http://zenit.senecac.on.ca/wiki/index.php/Ubuntu_Guide
<msaul_> This is my blog: http://murraysaul.wordpress.com/       (including my hobbies...)
<msaul_> The only thing I notice in my LTSP version of Ubuntu 9.10 is that the desktop is "black" regardless of the background art, but when I set the panel to "transparent", they display the correct background art (not black like the main desktop)...
<msaul_> bye..
<Ahmuck_> someone needs to plug the Aaport bug
<Ahmuck_> it's getting annoying to get those messags
<jbicha> um, which messags?
<Nokio> Hi all i am Installing Edubuntu 9.10 ltsp mode, I am at the "constructing ltsp chroot environement" and it says that an error occured that prevent him from building the chroot environement. Thanks in advance for the help
<jbicha> does the rest of the installation still complete?
<Nokio> well i can move pass that part of the install and yes the rest of the installation would complete
<Nokio> but why would the chroot environement fail to build at the install.... and will it fail post install ?!
<jbicha> I think others in this channel have more experience with this bug than me, but I think that's a known error but doesn't necessarily mean that the chroot won't work
<Nokio> okay so passing over it during the install and try to rebuild it post install would work.. ill try that thanks
<Nokio> If anyone else in the channel as an idea in the mean time ill listening :p
<Nokio> thanks jbicha
<jbicha> np, the only time I installed ltsp was from an already installed Ubuntu
<Nokio> ok
#edubuntu 2009-11-07
<sbalneav> Evening all
<Ahmuck_> ogra
<sbalneav> He's probably off for the weekend.
<Ahmuck_> k, nm, i think i found what i needed
<Ahmuck_> good thing he's getting a weekend off.
<Ahmuck_> my weekend is filled with cattle
<Ahmuck_> :)
<sbalneav> My dinner was filled with cattle
<Ahmuck_> heh
<Ahmuck_> a good meal is ... provided your not a vege, grilled onion, zuccini, beef, chop, hollow out a long bun, and place inside with some spices, cheese on top, and put a topper on it. :)
<Ahmuck_> 9.10 is a lts release?
<sbalneav> No
<sbalneav> regular release
<sbalneav> 10.04 will be LTS
<sbalneav> That's why we REALLY need to work on the spit-n-polish for this time around.
<Ahmuck_> 9.10 was a regular release for all of ubuntu?
<Ahmuck_> i'm impressed with 9.10
<Ahmuck_> any chance of getting anki packaged for ubuntu?
<sbalneav> Sure.  Go ahead and package it :)
<sbalneav> I'm meeting up with LaserJock this weekend to learn packaging.
<papajones> Hello, I think I have installed Edubuntu but am a little confused.  I keep seeing it referred to as a "desktop", but other than a few new programs appearing in my Applicatoins menu, I'm not sure i've installed this correctly...
<papajones> Still seems just like a regular ubuntu desktop
<HedgeMage> papajones: All that edubuntu is is a bunch of apps and art for educational uses. :)
<papajones> I also see mention of different themes on this page http://www.edubuntu.org/Screenshots - but I don't see thse anywhere to choose from
<papajones> where is the art installed/
<papajones> ?
<HedgeMage> hmmm... I think in Gnome you right-click the background (desktop) then choose "change image" or something like that, and theme should be a tab.
<HedgeMage> (I use Xfce lately, so I'm not 100% sure where things are in Gnome)
<papajones> I tried that, but I only see the same old stuff that came with Ubuntu
<HedgeMage> Hmmm.
<papajones> Well, the apps I've looked at seem nice, I had just thought there would be some main launcher or "desktop" to bring them all together
<HedgeMage> papajones: If you hang around a bit, someone who actually uses Gnome will show up eventually.
<Ahmuck_> papajones, you can create one
<Ahmuck_> a application launch bar
<Ahmuck_> in regards to art, what are you looking for?
<sbalneav> papajones: Edubuntu = Ubuntu + Educational apps + LTSP thin clients all in one big package.
<papajones> I will look into creating an applicatoin launch bar
<sbalneav> It won't look much different.
<papajones> Ah, OK. This page here http://www.edubuntu.org/FAQ keeps referring to Edubuntu as an O.S.
<sbalneav> it is
<papajones> hence my confusoin, as nothing seems to have changed (other than the apps)
<sbalneav> It is an os.  One based on Ubuntu.
<sbalneav> it's no different from Kubuntu, or Xubuntu
<Ahmuck_> sbalneav: sorta.  qimo does this
<papajones> Ahmuck_, not looking for any art in particular, other than to confirm it got installed. I can't the backgrounds that are shown on tihs page http://www.edubuntu.org/Screenshots
<Ahmuck_> http://www.qimo4kids.com/Images/Screenshots/WhatIsQimo.jpg - papajones i think that bar at the bottom is what your looking for
<sbalneav> papajones: Those are older screenshots.  They should be replaced.
<sbalneav> But we don't have anyone to mind for the web site right at the moment.
<papajones> One last thing that was confusing, was in the Ubuntu Software Center, when I was looking to install it, the description says "This package depends on the complete set of Edubuntu-supported packages..." -- thus, not sure if there were other dependencies I needed to install beforehand...
<sbalneav> No, you can always just install software, the packaging will take care of any dependancies you need.
<papajones> You have all been a great help, thank you!
<Ahmuck_> nobody to mind the website?
<papajones> The qimo4kids looks interesting.... But not a part of edubuntu, no?
<Ahmuck_> no
<Ahmuck_> edubuntu, qimo, is a themed ubuntu install with a set of pre-selected applications
<Ahmuck_> more recently, (have not tried 9.10 yet) edubuntu may also come with some ltsp server and management utilities
<papajones> i do see mention of that on the site, not anything I'm going to be interested in at the moment
<papajones> I was looking to just get something point-n-clickable for my kids
<Ahmuck_> add a bar at the bottom of the screen.  i've tested this type of installation, and it works far better than an application menu.  kids are drawn to it
<Ahmuck_> add your apps that you want them to use, and you'll have a great time :)
<papajones> still getting used to GNOME, will be looking into that shortly, thank you!
<sbalneav> Ahmuck_: No, we need a website maintainer.
<papajones> Ahmuck_,  do you mean a "Lanucher" ?
<papajones> Launcher i mean
<Ahmuck_> sbalneav: i won't volunteer for the job, but i might be interested in looking into it
<Ahmuck_> papajones: want step by step instructions?
<Ahmuck_> right click an empty area on the menu bar
<Ahmuck_> select "new panel
<papajones> ah i see
<papajones> then orient it
<Ahmuck_> correct
<Ahmuck_> then add to panel
<Ahmuck_> application launcher
<sbalneav> I beleive the website's a drupal instance.
<Ahmuck_> select your apps
<Ahmuck_> then you can customize the new panel so that it only fits the lenght of the icons on it
<Ahmuck_>  as well as increase the hieght
<papajones> Looking good!
<Ahmuck_> sbalneav: well, i've been meaning to get down into the dirt of drupal, so i guess this is just yet another reason
<papajones> I think this looks like it will fit the bill, Ahmuck_
<Ahmuck_> :)
<papajones> It will be another matter to perhaps just set this up once under my login, then copy the same panel to my kids' logins?
<papajones> i think i've alreday got that figured out now too
<sbalneav> Well, I've got packaging class tomorrow
<sbalneav> see you all
<papajones> i'm gonna head out too for the night; thanks again for the help getting started!
<Ahmuck_> np
<Ahmuck_> nn for me as well
<calimer> Hi, I'm from Platinum Arts Sandbox free 3d Game maker, and I just wanted to mention that I set up a channel on freenode #sandbox if there are any questions or anything I can help with for SB going into edubuntu
<jbicha> calimer: I don't think the license used by Platinum Arts Sandbox is compatible with Debian/Ubuntu
<calimer> I would hope the debian free one is
<jbicha> calimer: http://www.mail-archive.com/debian-legal@lists.debian.org/msg40350.html
<calimer> that's obviously not the debian free version
<jbicha> once sandbox is in Debian, it should be easy to get it in the Ubuntu repositories
<LaserJock> sbalneav: around?
#edubuntu 2009-11-08
<sbalneav> Evening all
<juliux> exit
<dolce_mente> buonasera
<dolce_mente> c'Ã¨ nessuno che puo aiutarmi
<jbicha> oh, that's how you spell buonasera
<JBSchool> i am trying to get a package into ubuntu which is a program that goes along with a college textbook so it would probally be great for edubuntu as well is there anything special i need to do for edubuntu?
<jbicha> JonyBlaze: which program?
<JonyBlaze> pep8
<JonyBlaze> http://code.google.com/p/pep8-1/
<JonyBlaze> i already packaged it and sent it to REVU
<jbicha> oh, how confusing, I thought you meant this: http://packages.debian.org/unstable/main/pep8
<JonyBlaze> oh wow...
<JonyBlaze> thats what i called my package >.<
<JonyBlaze> i might have to change that
<jbicha> yeah, one of the two has to be different at least
<jbicha> no, there's nothing special that needs to be done for edubuntu since we use the same repositories as ubuntu
<JonyBlaze> great
<JonyBlaze> thats what i like to hear :) no extra work!
<jbicha> is Jony a nickname?
<JonyBlaze> no, ive used this nick for the past 12 years, i dont really like it now but ive used it for so long...
<jbicha> it's too late for your package to be included in the Karmic repositories, you'll have to build it for Lucid
<jbicha> (of course, it can be available also in your PPA for Karmic or whatever)
<JonyBlaze> yeah
<JonyBlaze> i already put it on a PPA
<jbicha> neat, your package installed for me
<jbicha> I have almost no experience with packaging so I can't really help you very well with improving your packaging, you could try #ubuntu-motu
<JonyBlaze> heh you found it?
<JonyBlaze> thats what REVU is for the motu's will tell me what needs to change etc
<jbicha> yes, you're a teacher?
<JonyBlaze> no im a student
<JonyBlaze> we use that in one of my classes and the version that they have on the site didnt run for me
<JonyBlaze> i really like that program so i decided to package it
<jbicha> that's a good idea, some day I'll find something to package from scratch, everything I've found so far is too complex
<JonyBlaze> have you went through the needs packaging bugs?
<JonyBlaze> might be able to find something in there
<lilyshu> hi, is there any available video/pdf documents that i can use to promote edubuntu desktop in my campus? thanks
<mhall119> Ahmuck: around?
<mhall119> Ahmuck: you can get the artwork here: https://launchpad.net/~mhall119/+archive/ppa
<mhall119> just be warned, the GDM package isn't setup right, it'll over-write your existing configs
<sbalneav> Afternoon all
<Ahmuck> mhall119 overwrite existing configs?  u were aware they changed gdm in 9.10?
<mhall119> Ahmuck: oh yes, I don't know what of these packages will even work in 9.10
<mhall119> the GDM for sure won't work
<mhall119> the USplash probably needs to be compiled
<mhall119> I'm working on making them work with in 9.04
<mhall119> once that happens, I can think about making them work in 9.10
#edubuntu 2010-11-08
<tuxnix64> anyone know where to place an environment variable script,  like in /etc/environment?
<sbalneav> Morning all
<charlie-tca> Good Morning
<mhall119> morning
<sbalneav> .win 2
<highvoltage> morning sbalneav, charlie-tca and mhall119!
<djs> I was reading http://fsmsh.com/3465 and it says "big Edubuntu deployments are based on Xâs network transparency." What does that mean? Where can I find information on where Edubuntu has been officially deployed?
<djs> It says deployments based on X's network transparency; from what I understand 'network transparency' is X.org server's ability to display the output on a separate monitor than where the server is running -- or something like that
<djs> What are they doing with Edubuntu that requires that? Sounds cool and I'd like to read about it.
<cprofitt> the issue for Edubuntu is likely LTSP
<cprofitt> and iTalc
<cprofitt> djs: the LTSP is a terminal server -- one 'powerful' computer can serve up many sessions to less powerful or even terminal boxes
<cprofitt> iTalc may also require X
<cprofitt> and that works in a normal lab environment and allows control of the workstations
<djs> Does the powerful computer run multiple instances of X server? One one each session that's logged in?
<cprofitt> no, I would not even think it has to run X server
<cprofitt> in LTSP
<cprofitt> each client needs to
<cprofitt> the server just has to be able to process the applications -- which due to dependencies might require X libs on the server
<cprofitt> http://www.ltsp.org/
<djs> Another good link, thanks!
<cprofitt> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP
<cprofitt> that is the Ubuntu specific information
<djs> Dense (:
#edubuntu 2010-11-10
<alkisg> Meeting in 1.5h ?
<highvoltage> alkisg: if I'm not mistaken, in 0.5h
<alkisg> Nice
<highvoltage> (I've gone through my first ever DST shift recently so I might be confused)
<highvoltage> well, double-checked and by all accounts it seems like it will be 19:00 UTC in around 30 minutes :)
<alkisg> Ah right we're in winter time now, utc+2, heh :)
<alkisg> (in greece, i mean)
<highvoltage> ah :)
<highvoltage> * Edubuntu Meeting in 5 minutes
<highvoltage> ok it is time
<wideyes> hi folks!
<wideyes> anyone available to give me a little help with ltsp setup in my dhcp.conf?
#edubuntu 2010-11-12
<jadarite> I have a D-Link DWL-132 USB wireless adapter.  It works fine in windows, but I would like to install it through edunbuntu.  Does anyone know how?
<charlie-tca> Natty 64bit image is available today
<stgraber> charlie-tca: doesn't it have the same aufs issue as yesterday's ubuntu images ?
<charlie-tca> I am hoping cjwatson got the unionfs instead.
<charlie-tca> I am still downloading here. about 4 hours left
<shazzr> Hi. Have installed Edubuntu @ work, and trying to get a Smartboard to work. If I don't install the Smartboard driver, I can use the SB as a giant trackpad. The drag is that if I try to install them to get all of the goodies out of it, I can't use it at all. It works on win. Anyone with any experience in this field?
<vmlintu> I've got Smartboards working on Ubuntu
<vmlintu> shazzr: which Ubuntu version are you using?
<shazzr> vmlintu: 10.10
<vmlintu> shazzr: that's something I've never tried, only 8.04 and 10.04. 10.04 had quite a few problems when it came out and it took SmartTech several months to fix it
<shazzr> vmlintu: Crap. I think I had it working on 10.04 actually....but you know...one allways want the latest and best. ;)
<vmlintu> heh, that's how life goes.. ;)
<shazzr> vmlintu: So I guess I have three options. 1) Downgrade to 10.04 2) Wait a couple of months, and hopefully....3) Switch back to Windows.
<vmlintu> It seems like smart doesn't officially support 10.10 yet
<vmlintu> http://smarttech.com/us/Support/Browse+Support/Download+Software/Software/SMART+Notebook+collaborative+learning+software/SMART+Notebook+software/SMART+Notebook+for+Linux
<shazzr> How can you tell?
#edubuntu 2010-11-13
<racc> good day
<racc> I just did an installation of edubuntu and I take the internet connection
<racc> hasta ahora estoy realizando la instalacion
<racc> so far I'm doing the installation
<racc> installation is complete and does not take the broadband connection, when I installed ubuntu there was no problem
<mhall119> highvoltage: trying to test the Ubuntu daily ISO and it won't fully load the desktop, have you gotten it working?
<alkisg> racc: you installed edubuntu and you can't connect to the internet, while you could when you had installed ubuntu?
<alkisg> mhall119: let's switch here much easier to keep track :)
<mhall119> ok
<mhall119> alkisg: it shows the text-mode alternative to plymouth, then the smbus error
<alkisg> mhall119: try ps -ef to see at what point it's stuck
<alkisg> E.g. is the ubuntu user created?
<alkisg> Any user processes running? Anything in ~/.xsession-errors? etc
<mhall119> it got through all the casper scripts okay, I saw those when I disable slash
<mhall119> no .xsession-errors
<alkisg> mhall119: try `sudo killall -u ubuntu` and then try logging back in
<alkisg> (if you see gdm, that is)
<alkisg> Ah you'll also need to set a password for ubuntu
<mhall119> killall didn't seem to do much, I just did sudo service gdm restart
<mhall119> it switched video modes, and now I have the mouse cursor but not wallpaper, just black
<mhall119> hmm, now ps -ef |grep is giving me a "too many open files" error
<mhall119> this must be a problem with the daily build
<alkisg> Probably
<mhall119> I'll just wait for the next one
<mhall119> this got further than the one a couple days ago with the aufs error anyway
<alkisg> Anything new in natty so far?
<mhall119> I don't know, it won't finish booting
<mhall119> I was hoping the gnome3 stuff would be there so I can work on my qimo session
<alkisg> Ah, it's not even in alpha 1 yet, ok...
<mhall119> it seems to be having a problem closing filehandles
<mhall119> which would explain the "too many open files" error
<mhall119> I wonder if this is a squashfs or unionfs bug
<mhall119> I can get xterm running in vt7, but metacity seems to be busted even though it's running
<mhall119> okay, I have .xsession-errors now, and it's all either too many open files or cannot close file descriptor errors
<mhall119> oh well, looks like it's still gnome2 anyway
<racc> tengointernet already, I installed xampp but do not know which is the key SU
<racc> and I have internet, I installed xampp but do not know which is the key to ySU
<alkisg> racc: I don't think people here know how to answer xampp problems, maybe search for a xampp channel
<alkisg> Usually lamp is installed on ubuntu systems, not xampp
<racc> my problem is I need to unzip the installer zampa, and need to enter SU
<racc> in the shell
<alkisg> Ah
<alkisg> Try `sudo -i` instead
<alkisg> su is not appropriate for ubuntu systems. `sudo -i` or `sudo su` work.
<jasonluke1234567> any one here now were i can find software that i can use for making gift cards, banners, gift certificates, ect
<jasonluke1234567> any one here
<mhall119> well he didn't stick around long
 * mhall119 is installing 10.10 in vbox instead, and will try update-manager -d
<highvoltage> mhall119: haven't tried yet
<mhall119> highvoltage: I finally got a 10.10 VM upgraded to 11.04, but not without it's issues
<mhall119> the new kernel is panicing on boot, so I'm going to see how far I can get on the previous one
<mhall119> but I'm getting package errors galore
#edubuntu 2010-11-14
<mhall119> on gcc no less
<highvoltage> mhall119: natty is indeed very rough atm :)
<mhall119> today's daily iso at least boots and installs
<highvoltage> cool, stgraber just told me that aufs is now fixed
<mhall119> yeah, it was fixed yesterday, but the kernel was panicing
<mhall119> now everything but compiz works
<mhall119> compiz fails because I'm running in vbox, but it doesn't fail over to metacity
<mhall119> the open file handle error seems to be gone too
<mhall119> but now my install is hung at about 75%
#edubuntu 2011-11-07
 * highvoltage checks
<highvoltage> mhall119: doesn't seem like they can add, but they can at least read the reviews added by SC, I guess that's good enough to give someone an idea of how good it is
<mhall119> yeah
<jbicha> mhall119: I'm not sure how I made it though uds without meeting you but hi anyway :)
<mhall119> hi jbicha, I thought we said hi at some point
<jbicha> could be, I don't remember your name tag at least
<miks> Hey all!
<miks> I'd like to implement Edubuntu 11.04 in my school computer lab, but I'm having trouble getting the Menu Editor to work. I create the custom menu, and apply it to a certain group, but when that group logs in to a thin client, the menu doesn't take effect. Interestingly, if that user logs in on the SERVER, it does work.
<miks> So the custom menu is only being applied at the server level, and not to the thin clients. Any ideas on what I'm doing wrong?
<highvoltage> stgraber: you're not in the emea channel!
<highvoltage> stgraber: do you have any conflict if we do an RMB meeting this thursday at 16:00 local time?
<stgraber> highvoltage: I think so, let me check
<stgraber> highvoltage: hmm, actually the meeting I thought I had doesn't show up on my calendar so I might be fine
<highvoltage> ok
#edubuntu 2011-11-08
<stgraber> highvoltage: https://plus.google.com/u/0/b/108898409379097967594/welcome
<highvoltage> stgraber: https://plus.google.com/u/0/106512410045218522565/posts
<highvoltage> stgraber: did you create the other one?
<stgraber> highvoltage: yes, I'll remove it. Weird that google didn't show me that one and very weird that they let me create a duplicate :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: ok, I "think" it's "gone" :)
<highvoltage> yeah at least I get a 404 for it :)
<highvoltage> â¬ Google+ status updates yeah â¬
<alkisg> â¬ Nice tune! â¬
<alkisg> Btw stgraber: http://packages.debian.org/experimental/epoptes
<stgraber> alkisg: I know, it's in Ubuntu already
<stgraber> alkisg: I synced it a few minutes after it got in Debian
<alkisg> Wow, cool! When will we see it in http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=epoptes ?
<stgraber> stgraber@castiana:~$ rmadison epoptes epoptes |    0.3.1-1 | precise/universe | source, all
<stgraber> stgraber@castiana:~$ rmadison epoptes epoptes |    0.3.1-1 | precise/universe | source, all
<stgraber> stgraber@castiana:~$ rmadison epoptes epoptes |    0.3.1-1 | precise/universe | source, all
<stgraber> ... broken copy/paste :)
<alkisg> :)
<stgraber> I guess it'll show up on packages.ubuntu.com whenever that thing gets updated (can take a few days)
<highvoltage> whohoo
#edubuntu 2011-11-10
<highvoltage> stgraber: I just want to double-check that we're more or less in agreement, we're only applying for 5 years LTS if Kubuntu gets 5 years LTS, right?
<stgraber> highvoltage: yes
<highvoltage> stgraber: I've added that on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/12.04/LTS-Proposal and will flesh it out a bit during the day, feel free to add
<alkisg> Guys how would I learn if indeed reminna will replace vinagre as the default precise vnc client?
<stgraber> probably on the desktop team mailing-list
<alkisg> ty
<alkisg> ...and btw, when will the main UDS photo be published? I'm waiting for this to write a blog (forum anyway) entry... :D
<highvoltage> alkisg: I was wondering about that too!
#edubuntu 2012-11-05
<ksteffensen> Hi all.  I'm supporting a school in Tanzania from the US.  (I lived there in 2006-2007 and set up Edubuntu then.  I've been working with their Principal to keep it going since then.)  We just set up a new server with an i7 and 16 GB of RAM.  It's doing great with one exception.  Some software that ran fine on an older slower server with less ram under 10.04 is now bogging the system down to...
<ksteffensen> ...be unusable under 12.04.  Specifically KTouch, KTurtle, and Scribus.  Has anyone else seen this?  Top shows that the CPU is only at 15% and only 9 GB of RAM is being used when the multiple users are using KTurtle and bogging down the system.  Other programs like Libre Office work fine with multiple users.
<ksteffensen> Thanks in advance for any insight.
<highvoltage> hey ksteffensen
<ksteffensen> Hi, highvoltage
<highvoltage> hmm, I can't think of anything that's detoriated performance-wise with KDE apps, and ktouch and kturtle aren't /that/ graphics intensive.
<highvoltage> ksteffensen: could it perhaps be that they had LDM_DIRECTX enabled in the old setup and not in the new one?
<highvoltage> (that makes quite a performance difference in LTSP setups)
<ksteffensen> I'll check.  Could be.
<ksteffensen> thanks.
<highvoltage> I sometimes run "ethstatus" as well (not part of the default installation but quick to install) just to see what the network is doing when the system is slow
<ksteffensen> the school has found alternatives to ktouch and kturtle that are working, but it would be good to figure this out.
<ksteffensen> thanks.  I'll install that, too.
<highvoltage> also do an 'ifconfig' and check that the 'lo' interface is up and has an ip address of 127.0.0.1
<highvoltage> it's very rare but I've seen some people mess up their networking somehow so that it's not configured anymore
<highvoltage> and that has a big impact on KDE applications specifically
<ksteffensen> localhost is 127.0.0.1 on the server.
<highvoltage> ok good
<ksteffensen> highvoltage: the old server is powered off.  I've asked the principal to walk over to the school and power it on.  In the mean time, it sounds like I should add LDM_DIRECTX=True to lts.conf in any event, right?
<highvoltage> ksteffensen: it depends, that comes at a security cost, since UI input/output goes over the network unencrypted. so if the users have to type any sensitive passwords, for example, then it's a good idea not to enable it
<highvoltage> ksteffensen: quite often that's not a problem in classrooms
<ksteffensen> thanks.  it's all kids without sudo on a non-routable subnet, so I don't think it will be a problem.  But I can see how you wouldn't want to use it in an internet cafe or the like.
<highvoltage> ksteffensen: another thing to check, perhaps a few apps were local apps in the previous setup. I usually set up gcompris as a local app since it tends to take up a lot of server resources very quickly and bog things down
<highvoltage> (we actually kind of need a "I have LTSP working, what do I do now" kind of guide)
<ksteffensen> i'm 95% sure that all were running on the server in the old setup, but I'll double check.  I hadn't thought about moving any apps to be local.  does it still use LDM for login, etc, but then just use local resources for running that specific app?
<lmk> ksteffensen: check out the mailing list, kde performance was discussed just recently
<ksteffensen> thanks.  checking  it now.
<lmk> Qt changed some backend setting causing increased X network traffic
<ksteffensen> (I had actually just subscribed to it and was going to send a note to it if no one on here had any ideas.  Thanks for the pointer.  I hadn't checked the archives yet.)
<lmk> http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_id=30046932
<ksteffensen> lmk: outstanding!  Thanks.  I'll get them to try it asap.
<lmk> np :)
<alkisg> Wow... "FWIW, Qt 5 will not support "native" at all. :-("
 * alkisg thinks LXDE will probably be the only working DE with LTSP in the near future... :(
<stgraber> yeah and as long as you don't run any app on it
<alkisg> Hehe, possibly :D
<stgraber> because everything will blow up as soon as you try to run any of the kdeedu games, firefox, ...
<alkisg> Btw, I've seen some huge regression with GTK xorg cpu usage recently
<alkisg> I.e. thin clients with enough RAM but slow CPU are unusable in 12.04 while they were working fine in 10.04
<alkisg> Xterm scrolls really fast; dillo too; other apps really suck, 1 fps
 * alkisg wants to check for any gtk options similar to that "native" one for Qt... maybe something with caching or backingstores etc
<alkisg> I'm really thinking about using Win 98 + rdp to XP pro machines to revive some of those old computers :-/
<ksteffensen> alkisg: I just found the note about "FWIW, Qt 5 will not support "native" at all. :-(" too.  That really stinks.  A lot of the good programs for education are in the KDE world.  (Or at least the ones that we're used to using...)
<alkisg> ksteffensen: I've also noticed that KDE reads about 600mb from the disk on logins... very unfriendly for multi-user setups
<alkisg> Fortunately we only use a single KDE app here, kolourpaint, and that only in some of the schools
<ksteffensen> alksig: we're using the default LDM for login and gnome-fallback for the user sessions.  does launching a single KDE app load all of that 600mb?  or is that only for using plasma or the like as your session?
<alkisg> We have the same setup, I think it depends on the app, but no, not all the 600 mb
<ksteffensen> got it.  thanks.
<ksteffensen> lmk: and higvoltage: kturtle, ktouch, and scribus are all working correctly now.  The specific reason solution sounds like switching QT back to native mode.  But I also added in LDM_DIRECTX=True for overall better performance.  Thank you very much for pointing us in the right direction!
#edubuntu 2012-11-06
<DrLinux> Are Edubuntu only for younger kids or is there programs which help older kids also?
<holstein> DrLinux: what i have read and tested has package sets for several different age groups... i would suggest just downloading the live CD and trying it :)
<XRS1> Ri-Li is addicting  :p
<highvoltage> DrLinux: for older kids too, our current focus is on making all the systems stuff better though to make edubuntu a great generic system for schools and home
<highvoltage> XRS1: hehe :)
<vmlintu> highvoltage: hi
<vmlintu> highvoltage: back home yet?
<DrLinux> Perhaps I should try the live CD and see
<highvoltage> vmlintu: will be on thursday. how is it going?
<vmlintu> highvoltage: everything's good over here - winter is coming
<vmlintu> we've been busy trying to figure out how to improve the ltsp build process
<vmlintu> and with smarboards..
<vmlintu> Which made me wonder - how do you manage desktop settings in your systems?
<highvoltage> vmlintu: at revolutionlinux? we use bcfg2
<vmlintu> I've never tried bcfg2 myself
<vmlintu> so you have all packages listed and it configures application defaults etc?
<vmlintu> Do you use it for ltsp fat clients also?
<vmlintu> We've been using puppet for quite a few things
<highvoltage> vmlintu: it's similar in how it does things to puppet
<highvoltage> vmlintu: in the chroot, yes, but on live fat clients it's probably not a good idea (at least in terms of memory usage, etc)
<vmlintu> so you run bcfg2 during the chroot creation?
<vmlintu> We've been running puppet as a ltsp-build-client plugin to install the packages and the same rules have been applied to laptops etc. Now we've been trying to figure out how to make the rules available for others too
<highvoltage> vmlintu: yeah or from a cron job on the host
<vmlintu> Do you see that something like this could work if it was in normal vanilla-ltsp? http://marc.info/?l=ltsp-discuss&m=135187945718299&w=2
<vmlintu> Of course one could create a similar plugin for bfcg2
<vmlintu> The idea being that if ltsp-build-client would support puppet/bfcg2 plugins by default, one could share recipes for common tasks
<highvoltage> vmlintu: yes it seems reasonable to have a way to plug in a configuration manager via ltsp plugin
 * highvoltage brb
#edubuntu 2012-11-07
<alkisg> stgraber: `scratch` fails to load on thin clients because the /usr/bin/scratch launcher is forcing -xshm:
<alkisg> /usr/lib/squeak/4.4.7-2357/squeakvm -encoding UTF-8  -vm-display-x11 -xshm -plugins  /usr/lib/scratch/plugins/:/usr/lib/squeak/4.4.7-2357/  /usr/share/scratch/Scratch.image
<alkisg> One hack would be to check for LTSP_CLIENT/LTSP_FATCLIENT in the launcher, but I don't think the scratch packagers would want that
<stgraber> yeah, sounds pretty hackish. Do we know why -xshm doesn't work with LTSP?
<alkisg> It's a remote display... no memory shared between client and server
<alkisg> Another method is to check if the active display is a local or remote one, and I was wondering if you are aware of any better methods to detect that than ck-list-sessions
<stgraber> oh, that actually makes sense ;)
<stgraber> I think it'd be best to parse $DISPLAY to avoid relying on consolekit
<stgraber> basically if $DISPLAY is set and contains something before the :, then it's remote (except for 127.0.0.1 but I haven't seen anyone use that yet)
<alkisg> Local: :0.0, ssh -X: localhost:13.0 (-xshm should work there), let me check fat clients...
<alkisg> Fat: :7.0, Thin: ip:7.0
<alkisg> So it sounds ok, with the downside that ssh -X won't use shared memory, which is pretty minor... I'll propose that in a scratch bug report
<alkisg> Ty
<stgraber> right, if you want the code to be absolutely right, you'd need to check for localhost/127.0.0.1/<any ip set on the machine> but that'd make the code quite a bit more complicated
<alkisg> It does sound strange though that X shm functions are not automatically enabled/disabled... X could surely know if the server is remote or local to the client...
<alkisg> But anyway what can we do :)
<alkisg> stgraber: which way would be faster to get a precise backport? (1) fix it in debian, wait for R sync, then file SRU, or (2) fix it in R, file SRU? (and then file a bug report in debian, where I don't really care how much log it will need to be committed)?
<alkisg> *long
<stgraber> alkisg: fixing in R and then SRU is faster
 * alkisg just sent the debian bug report
<alkisg> I'll make an R bug report as well
<alkisg> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=692587 (will be available in a bit..)
<ubottu> Debian bug 692587 in scratch "Don't use -xshm for remote displays" [Normal,Open]
<alkisg> https://bugs.launchpad.net/debian/+source/scratch/+bug/1076036
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1076036 in scratch (Ubuntu) "Don't use -xshm for remote displays" [Undecided,New]
#edubuntu 2012-11-08
<jbicha> stgraber: hey, could I get my own queuebot?
<stgraber> jbicha: sure, you can either run it yourself (lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/+junk/queuebot/) or if it's just for the usual set of plugins, let me know what channel and what you're interested in having posted there and I'll just reconfigure the main instance
<stgraber> (queuebot appears to be pretty stable lately but I still wouldn't recommend running your own instance as it tends to hammer LP quite a bit and uses a lot of memory, so it's best if we can use a single instance)
<jbicha> stgraber: I think I just want the packageset notifications, does it need to be an official package set?
<jbicha> maybe I don't need it after all actually
<stgraber> jbicha: yeah, it needs to be a proper packageset in LP so queuebot can monitor it.
#edubuntu 2013-11-04
<tbird> where can i find the edubuntu wallpapers? i installed them from software center but they are not in my xfce desktop properties. where can i find them?
<highvoltage> tbird: I think they're in /usr/share/backgrounds
<highvoltage> (possibly in an edubuntu subdirectory can't check atm)
<tbird> thnx
#edubuntu 2013-11-05
<bram__> hey, i would like to set up a mixed eviremont on a school...
<bram__> i would use edubuntu
<bram__> what's the best way to have a central management (samba4 and rsync) or a other way?
<highvoltage> bram__: samba4 looks great and the plan is to have it integrated by default in the next version of edubuntu
<bram__> so i need to connect my linux-client to samba and my windows-clients
<bram__> ?
<bram__> or is there a simple way to manage my linux-clients...
<bram__> lockdown edubuntu for end users, manage users on central place?
<highvoltage> bram__: ah lockdown is a bit more thorny subject at the moment, especially if you use unity. I don't have good answers on that topic myself unfortunately
<bram__> ok... i set up a test environment and see how thinks work out ;)
<bram__> thx
#edubuntu 2013-11-06
<alkisg> highvoltage: the gnome-flashback applications menu is a bit of a mess, was that deliberate? Should I file bug reports for the applications that are not in the "correct" submenu?
<alkisg> (or stgraber ^)
<alkisg> Accessories, Utilities, Other, Sundry..?
<highvoltage> alkisg: yeah, I noticed it too late in the cycle :-/
<highvoltage> alkisg: well, I think it changed relatively late in the cycle too
<alkisg> np for 13.10, I'm alpha-testing Trusty
<highvoltage> the menus were just getting into shape and then they had to change things again heeh
<alkisg> Hehe... my googling doesn't tell me much about why those changes were introduced, though, do you have any links handy?
<alkisg> Or more generaly, where could I help?
<alkisg> Meh, the changes in the menus didn't all come from changes in .desktop files...
<alkisg> I wonder where the actual problem is
<alkisg> E.g. gedit.desktop and gnome-terminal.desktop are the same in 12.04 vs 14.04, yet in 14.04 they are in different submenus
<alkisg> Ah, same problem in gnome shell too... https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-1VnoPvYFny0/UmrGBQJwneI/AAAAAAAAI4E/BPOoQpGp5AY/s512/Screenshot%20from%202013-10-20%2019_39_06.png
#edubuntu 2013-11-07
<glad> hi guys i'm new here and i've no sound on edubuntu 13.04 any help pls
#edubuntu 2013-11-08
<stgraber> highvoltage: I'm dealing with the OIN stuff
#edubuntu 2014-11-03
<highvoltage> stgraber: around?
<stgraber> highvoltage: yep
#edubuntu 2014-11-04
<shazzr> kdenlive
#edubuntu 2014-11-05
<LinusTorvaldII> hell everyone
<LinusTorvaldII> hello*
#edubuntu 2014-11-09
<nith1210> edubuntu.org is down?
<highvoltage> yes. canonical IS ares gradually updating sites that were affected by a severe drupal bug
<highvoltage> it will be back, I've been meaning to put up a page that at least says we'll be back, haven't had a gap
#edubuntu 2015-11-04
<sufiplayboy> is there a way to convert an existing ubuntu vers (12) to edubuntu via the terminal?
#edubuntu 2017-11-08
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxcfs (artful-proposed/main) [2.0.8-0ubuntu1~17.10.1 => 2.0.8-0ubuntu1~17.10.2] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxcfs (zesty-proposed/main) [2.0.8-0ubuntu1~17.04.1 => 2.0.8-0ubuntu1~17.04.2] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxcfs (xenial-proposed/main) [2.0.8-0ubuntu1~16.04.1 => 2.0.8-0ubuntu1~16.04.2] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2017-11-09
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxd (xenial-proposed/main) [2.18-0ubuntu3~16.04.2 => 2.0.11-0ubuntu1~16.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2018-11-07
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxcfs (xenial-backports/main) [3.0.1-0ubuntu2~16.04.1 => 3.0.2-0ubuntu1~16.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxd (xenial-backports/main) [3.0.1-0ubuntu1~16.04.4 => 3.0.2-0ubuntu1~16.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2018-11-08
<jp_> Hello! I'm having a bit of trouble running LTSP with Ubuntu 18.10. The client crashes  at Loading snappy daemon.
#edubuntu 2018-11-09
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: libpodofo [amd64] (disco-proposed/universe) [0.9.6+dfsg-3] (edubuntu, ubuntustudio)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: libpodofo [i386] (disco-proposed/universe) [0.9.6+dfsg-3] (edubuntu, ubuntustudio)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: libpodofo [s390x] (disco-proposed/universe) [0.9.6+dfsg-3] (edubuntu, ubuntustudio)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: libpodofo [ppc64el] (disco-proposed/universe) [0.9.6+dfsg-3] (edubuntu, ubuntustudio)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: libpodofo [arm64] (disco-proposed/universe) [0.9.6+dfsg-3] (edubuntu, ubuntustudio)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: libpodofo [armhf] (disco-proposed/universe) [0.9.6+dfsg-3] (edubuntu, ubuntustudio)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: libpodofo [ppc64el] (disco-proposed/universe) [0.9.6+dfsg-3] (edubuntu, ubuntustudio)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: libpodofo [s390x] (disco-proposed/universe) [0.9.6+dfsg-3] (edubuntu, ubuntustudio)
#edubuntu 2018-11-10
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: libpodofo [ppc64el] (disco-proposed/universe) [0.9.6+dfsg-3] (edubuntu, ubuntustudio)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: libpodofo [ppc64el] (disco-proposed/universe) [0.9.6+dfsg-3] (edubuntu, ubuntustudio)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: python-x2go [amd64] (disco-proposed/universe) [0.6.0.1-1] (edubuntu)
#edubuntu 2019-11-06
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: open-vm-tools (bionic-proposed/main) [2:10.3.10-1~ubuntu0.18.04.2 => 2:11.0.1-2ubuntu0.18.11.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: open-vm-tools (disco-proposed/main) [2:10.3.10-1ubuntu0.19.04.1 => 2:11.0.1-2ubuntu0.19.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-desktop, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: open-vm-tools (eoan-proposed/main) [2:10.3.10-3ubuntu1 => 2:11.0.1-2ubuntu0.19.10.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-desktop, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2019-11-08
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: babl [amd64] (focal-proposed/universe) [0.1.72-3] (edubuntu, ubuntugnome, ubuntustudio, xubuntu)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: babl [i386] (focal-proposed/universe) [0.1.72-3] (edubuntu, ubuntugnome, ubuntustudio, xubuntu)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: babl [ppc64el] (focal-proposed/universe) [0.1.72-3] (edubuntu, ubuntugnome, ubuntustudio, xubuntu)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: babl [s390x] (focal-proposed/universe) [0.1.72-3] (edubuntu, ubuntugnome, ubuntustudio, xubuntu)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: babl [arm64] (focal-proposed/universe) [0.1.72-3] (edubuntu, ubuntugnome, ubuntustudio, xubuntu)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: babl [armhf] (focal-proposed/universe) [0.1.72-3] (edubuntu, ubuntugnome, ubuntustudio, xubuntu)
