#ubuntu-discuss 2013-05-06
<hggdh> closed-off? Why?
 * genii-around scrolls back a week to see who hggdh might be talking to
<IdleOne> heh
<hggdh> oh, I am off by a whole day...
 * hggdh pins a note to remember to look at day changes messages
<geezy> hello. can you explain why ufw, and apparmor for firefox are disabled by default?
#ubuntu-discuss 2013-05-07
<jussi> does anyone have any opinions on whether canonical will fail or succeed with the phone? and can you back up these opinions?
<IdleOne> jussi: I don't think it can be considered a success until major phone companies start selling phones with ubuntu touch preinstalled.
<IdleOne> as long err ubuntu phone/touch
<jussi> IdleOne: I tend to agree - Im asking for opiniions if that could happen and why do you think it might happen.
<Calinou> firefox OS targets low end
<Calinou> and guess what are the best sellers? nexus 4 and GS3/GS4
<Calinou> two insanely expensive phones :P
<IdleOne> as long as it remains a geek thing, meaning that the end user needs to flash his phone, it will stay just on the edge of success
<Calinou> wait
<Calinou> WTF brain
<jussi> IdleOne: I agree
<Calinou> well, when you said ubuntu touch I thought of firefoxc OS
<Calinou> -c
<jussi> IdleOne: although, I can see phones with multiple UI's being potentially shipped, and the user chooises the UI at startup....
<jussi> err, initial startup
<IdleOne> jussi: if the carriers see a potential for profit they will.
<jussi> because, lets face it, underneath it is now very much the same (at a lernel level)
<IdleOne> that might be a good idea, a dual boot phone.
<jussi> kernel*
<IdleOne> but the carrier needs to be able to market a reason for having dual boot which means ubuntu will need to fill a specific task that isn't already by existing phone OS.
<Calinou> jussi: that will never happen
<Calinou> dualbooting is so sketchy already
<Calinou> thanks to UEFI
<jussi> IdleOne: or they may head towards simply Galaxy S5U, S5A, S5J, S5T (Ubuntu, Android, Jolla, Tizen)
<jussi> so same HW, choose your software
<jussi> "best of all worlds" so to speak
<IdleOne> I'm don't own a cell phone or tablet, for me there is no need to own one. But I do sometimes think I would like a nice tablet I can use as a "main" computing device, but I would want to be able to do pretty much everything I can on my desktop.
<jussi> IdleOne: you need a keyboard, no matter what people tell you...
<IdleOne> screen size is a big issue for me, I don't have problems with my vision, I just don't like looking at a small screen. 7-9-10 inches is too small IMO
<Calinou> lol jussi
<jussi> its frustrating though, Ubuntu touch was getting very good reviews, but I found it unuseable tbh
<Calinou> IdleOne: desktop ftw
<Calinou> tablet as main computing, lol
<IdleOne> jussi: it is still very new
<jussi> I have 8 mins till train arrives, so if I disappear...
<IdleOne> Calinou: what I meant by main device was when I am away from my desktop I want to be able to do everything I do on my desktop.
<jussi> IdleOne: still, with the level of advertised useability, I expect bugs, not showstopper bugs.
<jussi> IdleOne: I have the most compatible device (Nexus 4) and the experience was very poor
<IdleOne> I can't comment on that because I haven't tried it.
<jussi> IdleOne: the gmail app for example wouldnt load. the browser was very poor. other apps didnt load at all.
<IdleOne> I do like the idea of being able to dock a phone or tablet and using it as a desktop.
<IdleOne> I think I could then live with the smaller screen size when I am on the go.
<jussi> IdleOne: that said, the system and ideas are very nice, although some of them are somewhat confusing.
<jussi> anyway, station coming up... talk laters
<IdleOne> That is just a question of learning to use a different UI
<IdleOne> later dude.
<Calinou> IdleOne: well you can't
<Calinou> performance is very bad compared to a desktop
<Calinou> and you don't have physical keyboard/mouse
<IdleOne> performance on phones and tablets is improving and will soon be comparable to desktop
<Calinou> lol no
<Calinou> celeron G1610 = 5 times as fast as tegra 3
<Calinou> 40 euro CPU
<Calinou> you have now idea how slow ARM is at heavy tasks :P
<Calinou> 20 minutes to compile a game
#ubuntu-discuss 2013-05-12
<belal122> Hi,  I'm trying to learn programming with python (never programmed before) but would like to join a project so I can learn as I go.  Can someone point to a good project that is easy for non-programmers like me to look into?
<IdleOne> belal122: most people will tell you to pick your favorite application and then see if you can help fix/improve that app.
<IdleOne> if you search for Python for beginners, it should give you a bunch of sites to start learning.
<belal122> I'm actually using codecademy which is pretty cool.  but yes I would like to start with an application.  i'm having trouble finding an app that is made with python
<IdleOne> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneHundredPaperCuts
<IdleOne> you could start here ^
<IdleOne> papercuts are small bugs, good for beginners
<belal122> Thanks!
#ubuntu-discuss 2014-05-06
<Timberwolf> Where would I go to submit a codename suggestion?
<Timberwolf> Where would I go to submit a codename suggestion?
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-05-04
<daftykins> uuuuuuuuuugh why did i click =|
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: morning
<daftykins> o/
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: hellow :p
<daftykins> morning sir
<daftykins> ugh you missed one of the lower points of the channel =|
<daftykins> a bloody spammer linked to child porn again =|
<lotuspsychje> what happened
<lotuspsychje> ouch
<lotuspsychje> who banned him?
<daftykins> i did an !ops and thankfully Flannel showed up
<lotuspsychje> why they always choose ubuntu to spam lol
<daftykins> it's weird isn't it? ##windows i can imagine
<daftykins> something genuinely hated
<lotuspsychje> lol
<daftykins> but volunteers helping for free for a Linux distro, just don't get it
<lotuspsychje> maybe MS hired freaks to spam haha
<daftykins> there are those who don't like the way the channel is run, of course
<daftykins> XD
<lotuspsychje> we are getting power worldwide with ubuntu now
<lotuspsychje> some might not be happy about that
<daftykins> the pretentious might have a problem with the masses using Linux yeah
<daftykins> i've attracted a few fans in my time that come in just trying to troll me, that's for sure
<lotuspsychje> lolz
<daftykins> it's funny, sometimes you can spend 3 hours straight helping someone get ubuntu installed on their machine
<daftykins> but a next user comes in and you call them out for being too lazy to even google their problem - and you get a fan for life :P
<lotuspsychje> yeah i never get that
<lotuspsychje> loool
<daftykins> not sure if you have this phrase us Brit-ish types do, "no good deed goes unpunished"
<lotuspsychje> well at the end we have a good felling upon ourselfs thats the only thing that matters to me
<daftykins> mmm, puzzle solving can be ace
<lotuspsychje> and we learn much ourselfs
<daftykins> definitely - i mean i don't even USE ubuntu 8D
<lotuspsychje> oh really
<daftykins> desktop anyway ;D
<lotuspsychje> wich distro?
<daftykins> *cough* Windows
<lotuspsychje> :p
<daftykins> my ubuntu exposure is primarily servers
<lotuspsychje> you game?
<daftykins> mostly on consoles as i have friends too poor to buy PCs :)
<daftykins> nah the majority of my work remains on Windows desktops so that's where my skills must stay
<lotuspsychje> ic
<daftykins> although it's a little worrying that i can still suggest reasonable solutions to Linux desktop queries people in other channels have, even when surrounded by people who use Linux desktops 24/7
<daftykins> e.g. someone installed Linux for their mother back home, wanted to setup remote access... but that mother still took her laptop out and about occasionally
<daftykins> so i said configure a static IP for the home wifi network via network manager
<daftykins> nobody else had a clue :(
<daftykins> i feel bad for kind of "ringing my own bell" there as we say, but it just shocked me that 24/7 Linux desktop types had no idea how to tackle that problem
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> i try a mix of windows and ubuntu, but prefer to install ubuntu as its a long term solution
<daftykins> there is that, all the people i help are locked into some proprietary software or another though
<daftykins> and i would never put ubuntu in for anyone because i simply couldn't support it without using it myself
<lotuspsychje> some ppl also dont understand ubuntu
<lotuspsychje> but most multimedia use, have no troubles
<lotuspsychje> my dad is 78 and never managed to crash ubuntu desktop yet :p
<lotuspsychje> before i had to come fix windows every month
<daftykins> i just remember back in the gnome 2 era, pre unity, when ubuntu couldn't even keep panel elements in the same places between boots
<lotuspsychje> lol
<daftykins> bit shocking :/
<lotuspsychje> we come a long way indeed
<lotuspsychje> i remember strugling on old redhat cdroms to get my internet working
<lotuspsychje> but it fascinated me alot
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> shared internet connections behind routers with wired or wifi definitely made it way easier for the modern generations
<lotuspsychje> yeah true
<daftykins> i think the first Linux i played with i was just missing my music collection
<lotuspsychje> amarok :p
<daftykins> i think it was stick on separate disks at the time
<daftykins> and being too newb i would've had no idea how to mount some NTFS volume, if you even could back then
<lotuspsychje> lolz
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/The-World-s-First-Ubuntu-Powered-Drone-is-Here-Video-480010.shtml
<lordievader> Good morning.
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-05-05
<daftykins> heh i just stumbled upon some flash drives online - Â£2.74 GBP for 8GB USB 3.0
<lotuspsychje> morning to all
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/05/ubuntu-15-10-name-announced
<cfhowlett> lotuspsychje, I was rather hoping for Wiley Coyote but what the hey ...
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> meep meep
<lotuspsychje> now its that wolf from dragonball Z
<lordievader> Good morning.
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-05-06
<daftykins> damn we have a pair of jokers in this evening
<EriC^^> hehe
<EriC^^> yeah
<EriC^^> insit.
<EriC^^> :P
<lotuspsychje> morning to all
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/05/new-ubuntu-laptops-available-from-ebuyer-2-2
<lordievader> Good morning.
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<lordievader> o/
<lotuspsychje> hi BluesKaj and lordievader
<lotuspsychje> what you guys think of this:
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/05/new-ubuntu-laptops-available-from-ebuyer-2-2
<lordievader> Hey lotuspsychje
<lordievader> Specs are a bit disappointing.
<lotuspsychje> cheap hp indeed, but prices are good no?
<lotuspsychje> and atheros wifi chipset isnt my dream scenario either :p
<lordievader> They are a bit cheaper (about 100 euros).
<lotuspsychje> i think with intel wifi and samsung pro 850 ssd, those machines would rock
<BluesKaj> the specs are only slightly disappointing for the price points IMO, if they offerd intel cpu and graphics instead of amd then they'd be spot on.
<BluesKaj> and BCM wifi
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<lotuspsychje> well i dont like broadcom chipsets neither
<lordievader> The only Broadcom I have supports master mode, quite happy with that :)
<BluesKaj> I paid $500 Canadian in Dec 2013 for a Lenovo G500 with intel i3 and their gpu with BCM wifi and I'm very happy with it's performance
<lotuspsychje> my broadcom keeps dropping wifi
<lotuspsychje> no matter wich firmware/driver i try
<BluesKaj> haven't had a problelm with the BCM4313 driver wise on Kubuntu
<lotuspsychje> on a cheap aspire one netbook that is
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: wich module loaded for you?
<lotuspsychje> here's mine:
<lotuspsychje> *-network
<lotuspsychje>        description: Wireless interface
<lotuspsychje>        product: BCM4313 802.11bgn Wireless Network Adapter
<lotuspsychje>        vendor: Broadcom Corporation
<lotuspsychje>        physical id: 0
<lotuspsychje>        bus info: pci@0000:07:00.0
<lotuspsychje>        logical name: wlan1
<lotuspsychje>        version: 01
<lotuspsychje>        serial: 38:59:f9:4f:cd:d7
<lotuspsychje>        width: 64 bits
<lordievader> !paste
<ubot5> For posting multi-line texts into the channel, please use http://paste.ubuntu.com | To post !screenshots use http://imgur.com/ !pastebinit to paste directly from command line | Make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic.
<lotuspsychje>        clock: 33MHz
<lotuspsychje>        capabilities: pm msi pciexpress bus_master cap_list ethernet physical wireless
<lotuspsychje>        configuration: broadcast=yes driver=wl0 driverversion=6.30.223.248 (r487574) ip=192.168.1.2 latency=0 multicast=yes wireless=IEEE 802.11abg
<lotuspsychje>        resources: irq:19 memory:f0100000-f0103fff
<BluesKaj> lotuspsychje, what command generated that output?
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: sudo lshw -C network
<BluesKaj>  pastebin.ca/2997245
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: think you got a wrong paste
<lotuspsychje> ah nvm
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: also same driver=wl0 driverversion=6.30.223.248 (r487574
<lotuspsychje> my wifi drops out every 5min i have to recconect, but strange thing is irc keeps connected
<lordievader> lotuspsychje: Irc has a rather long timeout ;)
<lotuspsychje> yeah that might be it
<lotuspsychje> syslog and dmesg show nothing usefull on my wifi drops either..
<lotuspsychje> its weird
<BluesKaj> lotuspsychje, then i suspect you have a network manager indicator problem ..perhaps you're wifi isn't dropping out at all
<lordievader> lotuspsychje: wpa_supplicant \o/
<lordievader> Get down to the nitty gritty :D
<lotuspsychje> hmm that sounds logic
<lotuspsychje> bbl guys
<BluesKaj> greetings cfhowlett
<cfhowlett> BluesKaj, yowza^2
<BluesKaj> what's up ?
<lotuspsychje> cfhowlett: nihao!
<cfhowlett> lotuspsychje, greetings!
<lotuspsychje> cfhowlett: did you see new omgubuntu article: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/05/new-ubuntu-laptops-available-from-ebuyer-2-2
<cfhowlett> lotuspsychje, I did see that.  I still prefer to avoid AMD stuff ...
<lotuspsychje> yeah i know its rather cheap stuff, but its HP
<lotuspsychje> and its cheap :p
<lordievader> HP has two lines of laptops that are excellent.
<lotuspsychje> lordievader: wich ones?
<lordievader> The Probook and Elitebook lines.
<lordievader> None of that crappy plastic stuff.
<lotuspsychje> ill keep that in mind for the future
<lotuspsychje> never had an email back from hp : (
<cfhowlett> I want to like and trust HP but ...
<lotuspsychje> but?
<cfhowlett> My one and only laptop crapout was an hp/compaq.  bad taste in mouth remains.
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> ablest1980: howdy
<lotuspsychje> ablest1980: set to your favs :p
<ablest1980> lotuspsychje howdy
<ablest1980> done
<ablest1980> XP
<lotuspsychje> cool
<ablest1980> i was just playing cs i said to them bbl i uninstall cs and steam lol
<lotuspsychje> okay
<ablest1980> do you play chess?
<lotuspsychje> no i play Go online
<lotuspsychje> dont like chess too much
<ablest1980> ok
<lotuspsychje> i was an oldskool gamer
<lotuspsychje> sof2 back in the days :p
<ablest1980> i had that game
<ablest1980> i mostly play rtcw then
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> played a lot of UT2003 also
<ablest1980> cool
<BluesKaj> yeah, I had an acer laptop with amd processorsand it ran ok till it physically fell apart after 3 yrs ...learned my lesson, it was inexpensive ...pay the extra 100bucks or so for better quality
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: thats smart indeed, invest in better hardware
<ablest1980> i order ram from amazon im waiting confirmation of shipment
<BluesKaj> lotuspsychje, for sure
<lotuspsychje> thats the reason i like those samsung ssd's
<BluesKaj> ablest1980, I'm very happy with the RAM deal i got on Amazon
<ablest1980> XD
<lotuspsychje> ok showertime here
<lotuspsychje> bbl
<ablest1980> ok
<lotuspsychje> see u tonightz
<ablest1980> ok
<BluesKaj> upped our old desktops from 4 to 6G each...definitely makes a difference
<ablest1980> ill be 4 to 8gb
<ablest1980> two 4gb
<BluesKaj> ablest1980, right
<BluesKaj> that little bit extra headroom in our case
<ablest1980> XD
<ablest1980> hello how do i use gnome after installation
<ablest1980> !gnome
<ubot5> GNOME was the default desktop environment on Ubuntu up to 10.10. To install the GNOME Shell, type [ sudo apt-get install gnome-shell ] in a !terminal. For the GNOME-based !flavor of Ubuntu, see !ubuntu-gnome
<ablest1980> !ubuntu-gnome
<ubot5> Ubuntu GNOME is a supported !flavor of Ubuntu that uses !GNOME as the default desktop environment instead of Unity. For more info or to download, see http://www.ubuntugnome.org/ or https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuGNOME/OneStopPage
<lordievader> ablest1980: Support is in #ubuntu ;)
<ablest1980> oops wrong room
<ablest1980> lol
<ablest1980> eric only thing change was login screen it gnome now but after system logo i see purple screen purple passphrase screen and purple desktop wallpaper
<ablest1980> oops
<ablest1980> wrong channel
<lotuspsychje> :p
<ablest1980> wb
<lotuspsychje> tnx
<lotuspsychje> eric is in this channel sometimes also
<lotuspsychje> he also might forget to add to favs
<ablest1980> XD
<ablest1980> i installed gnome
<ablest1980> i still see some unity though
<ablest1980> do you know how to fix this?
<daftykins> ablest1980: this is not the support channel, so please don't use it as such.
<ablest1980> ok
 * daftykins looks at the topic
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: ellow :p
<OerHeks> hoi lotus
<lotuspsychje> how was openstack
<OerHeks> Nice presentation :-)
<lotuspsychje> what they say about snappy?
<OerHeks> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6885560/2015-Openstack-amsterdam.JPG
<lotuspsychje> lets c :p
<OerHeks> Nothing about snappy, just MAAS, JUJU, CHEF, Openstack
<lotuspsychje> markyyyy :p
<OerHeks> :-D
<lotuspsychje> interesting?
<OerHeks> And me https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6885560/2015-Vondelpark-boompje.JPG
<lotuspsychje> cool pic
<lotuspsychje> dutch speakers also?
<OerHeks> Vondelpark, long time beeing there.
<OerHeks> Very few, allwas in English
<lotuspsychje> kk
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: did you see those on omgubuntu? http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/05/new-ubuntu-laptops-available-from-ebuyer-2-2
 * OerHeks seen that, awesome
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: how many hours presentation?
<OerHeks> 9:30-11:45
<lotuspsychje> not so bad then
<OerHeks> 50 km trip on my bicycle
<lotuspsychje> wow
<lotuspsychje> you had to waky waky at 5?
<OerHeks> 6, on the bike on 7
<lotuspsychje> nice ride :p
<daftykins> lotuspsychje: yeah, super low end craptops though
<OerHeks> Going by bus/train didn't save me time.
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: yeah but very cheap and ubuntu!
<daftykins> AMD :(
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: good ol bike is the best :p
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: i know mate, but better this then a craptop chromebook
<daftykins> :D
<lotuspsychje> if you go intel i3 or i5 that will turn the price up
<OerHeks> AMD A10 is not that bad.
<lotuspsychje> i think if you plugin samsung 850 pro in those laptops, they will rock
<daftykins> ebuyer are still doing the Lenovo B50-70 that i got for Â£208 delivered with a free inkjet printer 0o
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> cheap stuff
<daftykins> Â£21 to double the RAM to 8GB, then pop in an SSD and weeeee
<daftykins> only downside is 15" but still 1366x768
<daftykins> i really can't stand that res anymore
<lotuspsychje> netbook res :p
<daftykins> mmm not quite so bad
<daftykins> true netbooks were more 1024x600 iirc
<lotuspsychje> oh right
<lotuspsychje> lotuspsychje@R00TB0X:~$ xrandr --current
<lotuspsychje> Screen 0: minimum 320 x 200, current 1366 x 768, maximum 8192 x 8192
<lotuspsychje> LVDS connected primary 1366x768+0+0 (normal left inverted right x axis y axis) 256mm x 144mm
<lotuspsychje>    1366x768       60.0*+
<lotuspsychje> my acer aspire one netbook :p
<daftykins> i did get an 11" Asus one for an ex that was this res too, pretty sure it was the minority though
<lotuspsychje> hi daffykans!
 * daftykins is now known as daffykans
<lotuspsychje> wahaha
<lotuspsychje> thats for all your good support
<daftykins> i think my other favourite was draftykins
<daftykins> very apt in winter
<lotuspsychje> lolz
<daftykins> this guys general idiocy is angering me
<daftykins> "it dun work, halp" =|
<daftykins> sometimes they lure you in with minor config edits, then suddenly you're neck deep in package management woes D:
<OerHeks> first "VividVervet> I was having trouble mounting Windows partition in read only mode. " now it readonly ...
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-05-07
<ablest1980> hello
<lotuspsychje> ablest1980: hi mate
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/Playing-Windows-Games-on-Linux-Is-Easier-with-PlayOnLinux-4-2-7-480393.shtml
<ablest1980> Last failed attempt from: TheCholbs!~TheCholbs@107.152.104.42 on May 06 23:48:50 2015.
<lotuspsychje> whats that
<ablest1980> i seen that when i identify my nick
<ablest1980> someone tried my nick
<lotuspsychje> maybe ask in ##freenode
<ablest1980> done
<ablest1980> <ablest1980> i got Last failed attempt from: TheCholbs!~TheCholbs@107.152.104.42 on May 06 23:48:50 2015. when identifying my nick
<ablest1980> <Grundy> a lot of people do ablest1980
<ablest1980> <Grundy> thecholbs has been trying to hijack accounts it seems
<lotuspsychje> :o
<ablest1980> lol
<ablest1980> bbl
<lotuspsychje> kk
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: hello mate :p
<lotuspsychje> how are you
<EriC^^> great you?
<lotuspsychje> fine tnx
<lotuspsychje> early support :p
<EriC^^> :D
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: did you see those machines? http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/05/new-ubuntu-laptops-available-from-ebuyer-2-2
<EriC^^> nice
<EriC^^> pretty cheap too
<lotuspsychje> yeah, not the greatest hardware, but still cheap :p
<lotuspsychje> its a good thing to make ubuntu boxes cheaper then windows ones
<EriC^^> yeah true
<EriC^^> needs a smaller ssd instead of the 1tb hdd and it would be almost perfect
<lotuspsychje> i also thought so, samsung pro 850 and those boxes would rocknroll!
<EriC^^> :D
<lotuspsychje> i find it real weird, so many manufacturers still use mechanical hd's
<EriC^^> yeah
<lordievader> Good morning.
<daftykins> o/
<BluesKaj> Howdy folks
<daftykins> o/
<daftykins> adsjlkdk is a known troll, FYI
<OerHeks> i remember that ip thanks
<daftykins> :)
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-05-08
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/Ubuntu-16-04-LTS-to-Use-Systemd-s-Networkd-Instead-of-Ifupdown-480536.shtml
<lotuspsychje> cfhowlett: nihao :p
<cfhowlett> lotuspsychje, greetings!@
<lotuspsychje> how are you mate
<cfhowlett> lotuspsychje, enjoying life.  you?
<lotuspsychje> great here tnx
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<daftykins> oh my Tux what a complete idiot
<daftykins> O_O
<daftykins> supply answer, "no i won't do it"
<daftykins> wat?
<ki7mt> man, that dude must have a comprehension issue :-)
<daftykins> i'm really getting so frustrated
<ki7mt> LOL .. been there too  :-)
<daftykins> i've said exactly what's been needed first time every time and instead we get these hour long breaks of him/her going off on massive tangents
<daftykins> EriC^^: ah there you are :P
<daftykins> this guy is a nightmare
<ki7mt> I ahve like 10 RPI2 boxes, he's be better off just re-imaging the thing and start over, and copy the small number of files in /home/$USER that he wants to restore.
<daftykins> yeah i didn't realise it was just user data he was after
<daftykins> due to the... breaks in communication
<daftykins> the thing is, we can't get the damned parted output out of him
<daftykins> so he's making this an absolute misery
<ki7mt> Yeah, you asked for the partd data like 5 times  he wont pastebinit
<daftykins> "oh noes mah super secret dataz"
<EriC^^> :D
<ki7mt> Porn :-)
<daftykins> EriC^^: http://techblo.gg/stuff/blargh.PNG
<daftykins> bearing in mind that was an hour ago :(
<EriC^^> :D
<daftykins> much facepalm
<OerHeks> daftykins, our best friend is back
 * daftykins looks
<ki7mt> I don't understand how burning a Raspbian image to an SD card is a Ubuntu support issue
<daftykins> it's not, but we're a charity after all ;)
<ki7mt> lol .. indeed
<daftykins> oh my Tux that was a bombshell
<OerHeks> because there is always a fool who answers, i really understand some early helpers now.
<EriC^^> i dont know anything about raspberry pi's
<daftykins> hmm? :)
<EriC^^> i dont get why he has to backup his hdd to fix the router issue then dd it back
<daftykins> nah there's nothing about router from what i understand, though i've been ignoring him for a while now
<daftykins> just wants to backup the SD card that raspberry pis run from
<EriC^^> oh ok
<ki7mt> The Raspbian image is a Debian compressed image file burned to a FAT32 SD card. I think there is a Ubuntu-MATE image for it now also.
<ki7mt> All he really needs to do is SCP his $HOME directory, re-image the SD card, and copy it back.
<daftykins> and now we know he won't due to laziness :(
<daftykins> MTP still seems to be an ongoing joke in Linux land, eh?
<daftykins> always someone coming in with an android device that can't mount it
<ki7mt> Yes, that's the whoel thing in a nushell, he "didn't want to SSH" to the RPI box.
<daftykins> why does lsfret seem to have half a clue now 0o
 * daftykins blinks
<OerHeks> Someone should make a startx script to avoid these issues ..
<OerHeks> * as standard.
<daftykins> haha
<OerHeks> or make an ubottu factoid for it
<daftykins> the ops have ignored every single edit and every single factoid creation i've suggested.
<daftykins> i don't know who is in charge of it
<OerHeks> i think we need to go to #ubot93 ?? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Bots
<ki7mt> I'm not sure who is in charge of Factoids these days.
<daftykins> i've wanted to replace !ati with !amd for months
<ki7mt> I think your RPI image friend is back daftykins  :-)
<daftykins> HOLD ME BACK, BOYS
<daftykins> :D
<OerHeks> "didn't you get a hamer with that rPI ?"
<ki7mt> fgrew is the guy you were working with earlier daftykins :-)
<ki7mt> but using a different name
<daftykins> *nod*
<daftykins> could tell due to the utterly terrible English
<ki7mt> Yeah, and the Raspbian image name "image'+date'+.img gave it away
<ki7mt> That'w why I backed off it real quick, was not going down that rat hole again.
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> hrmm i am really not keen on this idea of snappy replacing all .deb packages
<daftykins> granted it may be far away, but it doesn't sound wise
 * ki7mt thinks It's gonna cause allot of folks to run from Ubuntu 
<daftykins> i agree
<ki7mt> I like Snappy, for mobi apps, but I'm not so sure about desktop use. The again, I just started playing with it.
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-05-09
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<OerHeks> huh, is it morning again?
<OerHeks> hi lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: hello mate :p
<daftykins> yep - a sign i should not be here
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/Ubunchu-Is-the-Only-Ubuntu-Manga-Out-There-and-It-s-Quite-Good-480581.shtml
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: goto bed! :p
<daftykins> yes sir
 * daftykins heads upstairs
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/Dell-Precision-M3800-Is-a-Very-Powerful-Laptop-That-Ships-with-Ubuntu-14-04-LTS-480628.shtml
<OerHeks> ohh Price starts from Â£1,978 ... without windows 2
<lotuspsychje> pricy stuff
<OerHeks> 1 year guarantee .. we Dutch do not take that, we have the right at least 3 years
<OerHeks> :-D
<lotuspsychje> yeah indeed
<lotuspsychje> hardware in belgium is 2 years garantuee
<OerHeks> mr Kim flushed the toilet on his sub: missile away! http://edition.cnn.com/2015/05/08/asia/north-korea-missile-test/index.html
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon guys
<BluesKaj> Hey lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: hey mate
<lotuspsychje> how are you today
<BluesKaj> fine thanks lotuspsychje , and how are you doing?
<lotuspsychje> great thank you
<lotuspsychje> ubuntu is so good, nobody has issues anymore in main :p
<cfhowlett> well, unless they do something radical like switch the location of buttons or something equally provocative.
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> yeah the most troubles occur by trying something they should not
<ablest1980> hello lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> ablest1980: hi there
<ablest1980> im back on unity
<lotuspsychje> unity is nice :p
<ablest1980> yes
<ablest1980> i dont like gnome
<cfhowlett> ablest1980, no likes gnomes
<ablest1980> lol
<ablest1980> XD
 * BluesKaj remains a KDE guy despite all the eye candy available on ubuntu :-)
 * lotuspsychje loves eyecandy
<BluesKaj> KDE has some nice themes. but I like simple and easy to read settings
<BluesKaj> I'm a bit old fashioned
<OerHeks> i wanna be a server-hippy, beng beng
<OerHeks> daftykins, i have a typing degree, but you are too fast :-D
<daftykins> lol
<daftykins> i'm on my sketchy laptop too
<daftykins> sorry if it's a bit frustrating, me treading on your toes :)
<OerHeks> np, people like multiple answers that look the same
<daftykins> ^_^
<daftykins> attitude on these mac owners, dear me
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-05-10
 * daftykins shakes his head
<OerHeks> yes or no ?
<daftykins> :P
<OerHeks> Obriendave is a spoiler, grrrr
<daftykins> i don't even see the point in pasting that info
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<daftykins> o/
<daftykins> i'm up late again :(
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: hello mate :p
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: is weekend dont worry
<daftykins> ^_^
<lotuspsychje> late night irc is the best :p
<daftykins> hehe it's the only kind!
<daftykins> kill me now.
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> cfhowlett: morning :p
<cfhowlett> I'm missing all the fun --- already /ignored
<cfhowlett> hey lotuspsychje
<daftykins> ^_^
<ubuntu-discuss> HEEEEEEEEEELOOOOOOOOOOOO >)
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-05-09
<OerHeks> We love to do your homework, k1l is silly!
 * OerHeks grinds coffeebeans
<Bashing-om> But for a refreshing once, there was an honest response that it is homework .
<OerHeks> Yes, that is why i appreciate it.
<daftykins> did someone come in asking for their school work to be done? :D
<OerHeks> yes, "someone told me to run this command" yaba yaba
<daftykins> :>
<OerHeks> Drabber wants to sleep, so i have to go to bed too ..
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> g'night \o
<OerHeks> have fun!
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon to all
<lotuspsychje> rilleh: http://mixing.dj/2016/livesets/adam-beyer-drumcode-301-live-swg3-glasgow-06-05-2016/
<rilleh> Hey
<rilleh> Cheers
<rilleh> I'll give it a listen
<lotuspsychje> crazy set
<lotuspsychje> tonyt: welcome
<lotuspsychje> bye
<BluesKaj> hi lotuspsychje, rilleh
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
<lotuspsychje> p4nama papers go online in 3 hours
<juser> hello
<juser> anyone here?
<lotuspsychje> juser: hi
<juser> ah, someone is alive
<juser> I been sitting here for a while and the channel has been dead.
<lotuspsychje> juser: we have users from all over the world
<lotuspsychje> juser: other times can be more crowdy
<juser> I just started using ubuntu a few days ago.
<lotuspsychje> welcome to the community!
<juser> thanks
<juser> I got fed up with windows update problems and installed ubuntu.
<lotuspsychje> great choice
<lotuspsychje> juser: wich version did you install?
<juser> I used slackware years ago when it first came out.
<juser> I installed latest one  16.4 ?
<lotuspsychje> great
<juser> dual boot with win 7
<lotuspsychje> im also on it
<juser> I need to keep windows around because there are a few things I can't do in linux
<lotuspsychje> wich are?
<juser> ripping DVDs,  photoshop stuff like that.
<lotuspsychje> !info handbrake | juser
<ubot5> juser: handbrake (source: handbrake): versatile DVD ripper and video transcoder (GTK+ GUI). In component universe, is optional. Version 0.10.2+ds1-2build1 (xenial), package size 5449 kB, installed size 10491 kB (Only available for any-amd64; any-i386; powerpc)
<juser> I've used it.
<lotuspsychje> juser: for photoshop alternative: krita & gimp
<juser> never used krita
<lotuspsychje> juser: some version of photoshop can be run from wine or playonlinux
<lotuspsychje> juser: krita is very pro stuff
<lotuspsychje> !info krita | juser
<ubot5> juser: krita (source: calligra): pixel-based image manipulation program for the Calligra Suite. In component universe, is optional. Version 1:2.9.7-0ubuntu12 (xenial), package size 7975 kB, installed size 31997 kB
<juser> for the rare occation I need photoshop, I'll just boot windows.   not a big deal.
<juser> I looks like a lot of people do dual boot.
<lotuspsychje> juser: another big part single boot ubuntu aswell
<lotuspsychje> i dont use win for years now
<juser> ubuntu does almost everything I need to do.  I just do surfing, watch movies, email and play around.
<lotuspsychje> juser: glad you like it!
<lotuspsychje> many handy packages out there for ubuntu, to make your life easy
<juser> I'll see how it goes.
<juser> yes, I didn't expect ubuntu to be so well developed.
<lotuspsychje> juser: many stuff changed over the years
<juser> I have used other using systems at work.  solaris and freebsd
<juser> other unix systems
<lotuspsychje> cool
<juser> a lot of VMS
<juser> pdp-11 and VAX
<lotuspsychje> hggdh: good evening
<hggdh> lotuspsychje: good morning :-)
<lotuspsychje> :p
<juser> what is the best irc client?  I'm using HexChat.
<dax> hexchat for GUI, weechat for terminal
<juser> ok thanks
<juser2> trying weechat
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2016/05/what-to-expect-ubuntu-16-10-unity-7
<lotuspsychje> hi baizon & pauljw
<lotuspsychje> rilleh: one from my country http://mixing.dj/2015/livesets/adam-beyer-drumcode-281-live-fuse-brussels-18-12-2015/
<baizon> ho ho ho lotuspsychje :D
<lotuspsychje> :p
<juser2> can I get rid of timestamps in weechat?  I searched the docs and no luck.
<lotuspsychje> juser2: the #weechat channel might know?
<juser2> ok thanks
<juser2> sorry, this was a bad place to ask.
<pauljw> hi lotuspsychje, everyone.
<lotuspsychje> dax: would it be handy to add ubuntu version and hardware chipset to !details ?
<dax> !details
<ubot5> Please elaborate; your question or issue may not seem clear or detailed enough for people to help you. Please give more detailed information, errors, steps, and possibly configuration files (use the !pastebin to avoid flooding the channel)
<dax> !-details
<ubot5> details is <alias> elaborate - added by LjL on 2008-11-06 23:26:49 - last edited by knome on 2014-03-19 19:47:38
<dax> !-elaborate
<ubot5> elaborate aliases: error, details - added by somerville32 on 2006-12-14 20:17:34 - last edited by rww on 2014-03-19 19:48:08
<dax> ./msg ubottu !no, elaborate is <reply> Please elaborate; your question or issue may not seem clear or detailed enough for people to help you. Please give more detailed information; for example, we might need errors, steps, relevant configuration files, Ubuntu version, and hardware information. Use a !pastebin to avoid flooding the channel.
<dax> not a huge fan of that factoid, but voila ^
<OerHeks> :-)
<OerHeks> dax, oke, so if we have strong suggestions for factoids, you can help us out?
<dax> Yep, or issuing edit commands to ubottu as a non-admin sends the suggestion to -ops. Either works.
<OerHeks> nice
<rilleh> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ey68uVUuyvs
<rilleh> Woops, sorry
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-05-10
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<rilleh> Morning
<lotuspsychje> hey rilleh
<lotuspsychje> rilleh: how did you like the newest set
<lotuspsychje> morning de-facto
<de-facto> Morning guys... im here via bluetooth tethering over my mobile (works like a charm with network manager) because my ISP got his PPPoE server screwed up so badly that they are "working on it" for almost a day now :-/
<lotuspsychje> ouch
<de-facto> yup they are like "quadruplefacepalm" lol
<lotuspsychje> lolz
<rilleh> lotuspsychje: Haven't had the time to listen through it yet
<lotuspsychje> no sweat mate
<rilleh> I've been afk since wednesday
<lotuspsychje> its a housy set :p
<rilleh> So I'm about to listen to DCR300 now
<lotuspsychje> yay
<rilleh> 4 hours
<lotuspsychje> huh
<lotuspsychje> rilleh: thats the set ive shared from mixing dj
<lotuspsychje> rilleh: you found the full?
<de-facto> maybe someone should suggest them using ubuntu lts server instead of whatever unreliable "server" they are using there right now hahaha
<rilleh> lotuspsychje: https://soundcloud.com/adambeyer/dcr300-adam-beyer-bart-skils-ida-engberg-paul-ritch-sam-paganini-live-from-awakenings-antwerp
<de-facto> yay soundcloud rocks ;)
<lotuspsychje> rilleh: tnx
<lotuspsychje> morning EriC^^
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> all ok?
<lotuspsychje> rainy weather here
<EriC^^> yeah all good thanks
<EriC^^> you?
<lotuspsychje> fine here :p
<EriC^^> sunny weather here
<EriC^^> was a little chilly last week though
<EriC^^> the weather is all over the place these days
<EriC^^> ozone and shit
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<lotuspsychje> http://fossforce.com/2016/05/surprise-microsoft-ending-free-upgrades-windows-10/
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> $$$$$
<EriC^^> lol
<EriC^^> no surprise there :p
<lotuspsychje> sudo apt $$$$
<EriC^^> hehe
<lotuspsychje> now everyone has the free Win10
<de-facto> sudo apt-get $ms-contract # sell your soul
<lotuspsychje> they gotta start paying updates
<lotuspsychje> hahaha
<lotuspsychje> good news for the year of the linux desktop
<de-facto> well actually the numbers of users in #ubuntu already raised with the release of xenial
<lotuspsychje> yeah before we dropped at 1600
<lotuspsychje> seen the channel raise to 2000 lately
<de-facto> yup seen that too, and still it works pretty well :)
<lotuspsychje> last 10 years have already been the years of the linux desktop :p
<lotuspsychje> all those lame articles spreading the web...saying otherwise
<de-facto> actually i had dual boot for years, but just did not use windows anytime, so i was lazy to reinstall/update that and now i dont miss anything (especially when seeing all those w10 crazy-mess )
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> what you guys think about adding: ubuntu version and hardware chipset to !details?
<lotuspsychje> !details
<ubot5> Please elaborate; your question or issue may not seem clear or detailed enough for people to help you. Please give more detailed information; for example, we might need errors, steps, relevant configuration files, Ubuntu version, and hardware information. Use a !pastebin to avoid flooding the channel.
<lotuspsychje> oh!!!
<lotuspsychje> dax changed it already
<lotuspsychje> nvm :p
<lotuspsychje> dax: great work :p ^
<de-facto> !termbin
<lotuspsychje> !pastebinit | de-facto
<ubot5> de-facto: pastebinit is the command-line equivalent of !pastebin - Command output, or other text can be redirected to pastebinit, which then reports an URL containing the output - To use pastebinit, install the Â« pastebinit Â» package from a package manager - Simple usage: command | pastebinit -b http://paste.ubuntu.com
<lotuspsychje> de-facto: or is the termbin method more handy?
<de-facto> yeah thats also nice can it take stuff from a pipe?
<EriC^^> yeah
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^ might know that
<EriC^^> something | nc termbin.com 9999
<EriC^^> there's also sprunge which uses curl
<de-facto> not sure but i guess something like "dmesg | nc termbin.com 9999" is kinda usefull
<EriC^^> something |& curl -F "sprunge=<-" sprunge.us
<EriC^^> quick and dirty pastebins
<EriC^^> :D
<EriC^^> have they fixed the ubot5 vulnerability yet?
<ubot5> <EriC^^> wants you to know: Package is-this-fixed-yet does not exist in xenial
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> not yet
<EriC^^> if the freenode flooder gets ahold of it
<EriC^^> god help us all
<EriC^^> :p
<EriC^^> better get it patched soon!
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: remind them in #ops
<EriC^^> who is the freenode flooder btw?
<lotuspsychje> not sure
<EriC^^> i wonder what's the backstory on that
<EriC^^> what a waste of a botnet :P
<EriC^^> probably could makes lots of monies with ad revenue or something
<lotuspsychje> lol
<EriC^^> and he's flooding #ubuntu smh
<EriC^^> would be funny to remind them from outside the channel using ubot5 or ubottu
<EriC^^> they'll be like what the..
<EriC^^> O.o
<EriC^^> to #ubuntu-ops
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: yeah remind them
<lotuspsychje> its your found :p
<lotuspsychje> bbl
<de-facto> !ltsupgrade
<ubot5> Users of 14.04 LTS will be offered the automatic upgrade when 16.04.1 LTS is released, which is scheduled for July 21st.
<TJ-> EriC^^: sat in a hotel with sruli right now; good job you've done helping him.. seen the chat log notes he's kept so he doesn't forget
<EriC^^> aha
<EriC^^> thank you
<TJ-> You'd love (not!) some of the many bugs/issues we've been tackling ... reall brain-teasers
<EriC^^> :D
<TJ-> best one for comedic value so far ... take a look: bug 1574317
<ubot5> bug 1574317 in lubuntu-artwork (Ubuntu) "Prompt to decrypt LVM device is hidden behind (blank) splash screen" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1574317
<EriC^^> hehe
<TJ-> also, seeing as you just mentioned holding down Shift for GRUB... best to see this bug report I've taken over since it is extremely relavent: bug 425979
<ubot5> bug 425979 in grub2 (Ubuntu) "[UEFI boot only] Holding shift fails to display grub2 menu" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/425979
<TJ-> I shall be investigating if UEFI v2.4 does support modifier detection and if so will add patches for Ubuntu sometime in the next month. Was talking to Colin Watson about it last night
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: gonna re-watch showdown little tokyo in a bit
<EriC^^> what's that?
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: movie from 91
<EriC^^> never heard of it O.o
<EriC^^> ah
<EriC^^> i know the actor
<EriC^^> both actually, is that the guy from hmm
<EriC^^> looks familiar first i thought he was the guy from honey i shrunk the kids
<lotuspsychje> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KzasJPXef0E
<EriC^^> nah not him definitely, i've seen him though
<lotuspsychje> lol that trailer looks old
<BluesKaj> Howdy folks
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hi lotuspsychje
<EriC^^> hi BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hi EriC^^
<BluesKaj> back on Xenial, my adventure with plasma 5.6.3 on Yakkety yesterday ended in chaos, too much work to fix. Looks like I'll have to start over
<lotuspsychje> im sticking to xenial for few :p
<BluesKaj> Xenial is my stable fallback
<rilleh> lotuspsychje: DCR300 is a real banger
<lotuspsychje> rilleh: yeah
<rilleh> Did you attend Awakenings?
<lotuspsychje> rilleh: go or listen?
<rilleh> Were you there?
<lotuspsychje> no
<rilleh> At the festival
<rilleh> Too bad
<lotuspsychje> rilleh: the set from fuse, Brussels is also very neat
<rilleh> 301?
<lotuspsychje> no
<lotuspsychje> an older one
<rilleh> Ah
<rilleh> The one you posted
<rilleh> I've heard it allready
<rilleh> But I'll give it a listen again
<lotuspsychje> rilleh: ive heard so many of them, hard to keep em apart sometimes
<de-facto> Ah there, my ISP finally managed to fix his stupid PPPoE "server", lol i dont understand why they dont have a replicated slave waiting for a hot swap on such central points :-/
<de-facto> btw if you like that kind of music http://uzic.ch/ has got quite some nice sets sometimes and streamed without any adds :)
<lotuspsychje> lets c
<de-facto> always depends on their dj currently online
<lotuspsychje> cool, but im big fan of adam beyer :p
<lotuspsychje> hard to beat
<rilleh> I think Ida is better when she's at her peak
<rilleh> Her Techno set in DCR300 is off the walls
<rilleh> Sadly, she usually plays mostly Tech-House
<de-facto> you can see their artits list (and ratings) here http://uzic.ch/artists/
<lotuspsychje> rilleh: i love the way adam adapts to his crowd/club-style
<rilleh> lotuspsychje: That's kinda in his job description :D
<rilleh> But he's a good DJ, not arguing about that
<pauljw> hi everyone
<lotuspsychje> rilleh: the paul ritch part is amazing on dcr300
<lotuspsychje> dax: can we have a !releasenotes for 16.04 please?
<dax> !releasenotes
<ubot5> Ubuntu 15.04 (Vivid Vervet) release notes can be found here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/VividVervet/ReleaseNotes
<dax> lol. k
<OerHeks> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseNotes#Ubuntu_Desktop
<lotuspsychje> tnx :p
<dax> ugh there's no variable to give the long-name with no spaces
<dax> !releasenotes
<ubot5> Ubuntu 16.04 (Xenial Xerus) release notes can be found here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseNotes
<lotuspsychje> nice one
<lotuspsychje> ty dax
<lotuspsychje> and for the !details also :p
<lotuspsychje> pretty handy
<rilleh> lotuspsychje: Indeed
<lotuspsychje> bbl
<dax> http://mhall119.com/2016/05/dogfooding-unity-8/
<tsimonq2> I actually just saw that, dax
<tsimonq2> I'm getting a dual-boot setup ready now :D
 * tsimonq2 wants to try it as well
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-05-11
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> morning baizon
<baizon> morning lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/05/show-us-your-ubuntu-desktop
<baizon> https://i.imgur.com/CDIpWyo.gifv
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: got a new tv yet?
<EriC^^> nope
<EriC^^> kind of decided it was pretty useless
<lotuspsychje> we still happy with our 40"
<EriC^^> yeah the 32" is ok
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: well if you can watch movies on your lcd pretty nice its also nice
<EriC^^> plus the salon isn't that comfortable to sit in and stuff to watch movies in
<EriC^^> we pretty much never use it
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: i always wanted like a multimedia corner instead of classic tv
<lotuspsychje> like where you can browse web and watch movies togheter
<lotuspsychje> with keyboard on the salon table
<EriC^^> yeah that'd be sweet
<lotuspsychje> i wonder how mythtv is recently
<EriC^^> what's mythtv
<lotuspsychje> !mythtv
<ubot5> mythtv is a TV framework for Linux - Instructions for using with Ubuntu at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MythTV - For discussion and specific support, try #ubuntu-mythtv
<EriC^^> cool
<lotuspsychje> morning de-facto
<de-facto> Morning guys :)
<lotuspsychje> oh, dax made a !releasenotes for xenial
<EriC^^> morning de-facto
<lotuspsychje> if you guys need to show users whats xenial is about
<EriC^^> cool
<lotuspsychje> upgrade to xenial is also described
<lotuspsychje> !releasenotes
<ubot5> Ubuntu 16.04 (Xenial Xerus) release notes can be found here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseNotes
<de-facto> Any of your guys ever used USB LTE devices?
<lotuspsychje> wb
<EriC^^> thank
<EriC^^> *thanks
<lotuspsychje> dax: awake?
<EriC^^> crazy how many people have unallocated space
<lotuspsychje> i dont get that either..
<EriC^^> yesterday a guy had 150gb unallocated, now this guy has oddest partition scheme with about 20gb unallocated
<lotuspsychje> i never liked partitions myself
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> a hd should be used fully in my opninion
<EriC^^> me too
<EriC^^> such a waste
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: well there are articles mentioning unallocated space can speed up things but...
<lotuspsychje> i dont buy that
<lotuspsychje> like when ssd's came out, some articles mentioning use only half the ssd to speedup
<OerHeks> maybe an article, writen on friday @ 17:59
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> hi hi BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<BluesKaj> Hey lotuspsychje
<EriC^^> hi pauljw
<pauljw> hi EriC^^ :)
<EriC^^> how's it going?
<pauljw> going well EriC^^ , so far.  early yet. :)  how about you?
<EriC^^> it's ok, weather is nice today :)
<OerHeks> flower here are growing like weeds
<pauljw> that's a plus, we're getting a break in the storms this morning, more on the way tonight.  water laying everywhere.  much better than no water though...
<EriC^^> pauljw: which country are you from?
<pauljw> US
<EriC^^> aha
<pauljw> Indiana
<BluesKaj> Hi pauljw, EriC^^, yeah nice here too, actaully didsome BBQ yesterday ;-)
<EriC^^> hi BluesKaj
<pauljw> hi BluesKaj , ummm BBQ
<BluesKaj> real coals , no gas
<pauljw> :)
<pauljw> i cheat, mine is gas.
<OerHeks> lotus, you have a groupie
<OerHeks> :-D
<OerHeks> someone talks about sleeping with you, or something like that
<pauljw> uh oh...
<BluesKaj> stalker
<OerHeks> no no pauljw i am not jealous
<pauljw> oh, okay, thought there might be some issues on the horizon... lol
<OerHeks> pauljw, you don't have groupies?
<pauljw> just wife and daughter...
<OerHeks> see ..
<pauljw> and i am jealous
<BluesKaj> ok here goes , just installed the nvidia driver, we'll see if it breaks X on activities again
<lotuspsychje> hi pauljw
<OerHeks> lotuspsychje, you missed your groupie
<lotuspsychje> who what?
<lotuspsychje> @what time?
<OerHeks> mei 11 14:29:23 <R0binh00d>	lotuspsychje, When do you sleep man? :-)
<OerHeks> mei 11 14:29:43 <R0binh00d>	cat /dev/some_sleep > lotuspsychje  :-)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> robinhood is haunting me :p
<OerHeks> guy from Gent?
<lotuspsychje> not sure i dont even know him
<lotuspsychje> he started to speak to me yesterday
<OerHeks> i guess he loves flowers
<OerHeks> i seen him before this week, also wondering about your sleeping
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: welcome :p
<ducasse> thank you :)
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: here we share some recent ubuntu topics, to serve #ubuntu better
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: the idea is we never really have the chance to speak to each other, so here we are
<ducasse> still not familiar with all the #ubuntu-channels, there are quite a few...
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: if you looking for something let us know
<ducasse> ok, thanks :) i'm trying to get more familiar with the wiki, i've been hoping to help with updating some of the more outdated pages...
<lotuspsychje> oh cool!
<lotuspsychje> !contribute
<ubot5> To contribute and help out with Ubuntu, see http://community.ubuntu.com and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributeToUbuntu
<ducasse> there are *many* to choose from :)
<lotuspsychje> yeah, 16.04 wiki's being nicely updated now
<daftykins> from what TJ has been saying it'll need write ups for all the bugs :(
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: bugs of what?
<daftykins> not sure what afflictions he was referring to, but he seemed to think it's been the worst release so far despite being an LTS
<daftykins> which is quite the scathing remark!
<JanC> "worst" often depend on if they affect you
<JanC> depends
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: oh tj was saying he didnt like where unity going
<lotuspsychje> all the touch apps,snaps,mobile and such
<daftykins> not sure it would've been unity focussed, as i don't think he uses it so i doubt he'd put in any time to fixing bugs with it
<lotuspsychje> lucky for us mark says he wont make the mistake twice :p
<lotuspsychje> and let us choose for unity7 or 8
<daftykins> o0
<lotuspsychje> if the largest mass votes unity8, so it will be
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2016/05/mark-shuttle-worth-talks-ubuntu-phone-snappy
<OerHeks> one can test unity 8 on mir, this is discusses here some hours ago
<lotuspsychje> Lessons learned. And I think the right way to deal with that is make a great unity 8 desktop, use it ourselves, then let people vote, essentially, and signal: âthis is what we want as the default unity for Ubuntuâ.
<lotuspsychje> 'mark'
<OerHeks> http://mhall119.com/2016/05/dogfooding-unity-8/
<lotuspsychje> im not gonna experiment with non-default stuff anymore
<lotuspsychje> sticking to the LTS road
<lotuspsychje> we will see what 18.04 bring us :p
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: didnt know there was a #ubuntu-unity :p
<OerHeks> oh, me too
<lotuspsychje> !info linux-image-generic yakkety
<ubot5> 'yakkety' is not a valid distribution: kubuntu-backports, kubuntu-experimental, kubuntu-updates, partner, precise, precise-backports, precise-proposed, stable, testing, trusty, trusty-backports, trusty-proposed, unstable, utopic, utopic-backports, utopic-proposed, vivid, vivid-backports, vivid-proposed, wily, wily-backports, wily-proposed, xenial, xenial-backports, xenial-proposed
<lotuspsychje> oh
<lotuspsychje> Version 4.4.0.22.23 (yakkety), package size 2 kB, installed size 11 kB
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: all ubuntu versions had recent kernel security issues right
<lotuspsychje> !usn
<ubot5> Please see http://www.ubuntu.com/usn for information about recent Ubuntu security updates.
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: perhaps new kernel doesnt get the wifi right?
<lotuspsychje> or network card
<daftykins> o0
<ducasse> no, previous kernel doesn't work either. it did, and this is an *old* driver.
<lotuspsychje> oh
<ducasse> rtl8169
<lotuspsychje> but it happened after an update?
<lotuspsychje> wb BluesKaj
<ducasse> yes, i was thinking maybe dhclient, because that is what seems to fail.
<BluesKaj> thanks lot
<BluesKaj> lotuspsychje: :-0
<lotuspsychje> !info dhclient trusty
<ubot5> Package dhclient does not exist in trusty
<ducasse> sorry, i meant dhcp clients in general. whether baked into nm or wherever they may be.
<lotuspsychje> kk
<ducasse> i had her add an entry for dhcp in /e/n/i, and it fails to get an address.
<daftykins> !info isc-dhcp-client trusty
<ubot5> isc-dhcp-client (source: isc-dhcp): ISC DHCP client. In component main, is important. Version 4.2.4-7ubuntu12.4 (trusty), package size 609 kB, installed size 1939 kB
<lotuspsychje> realtek smells like realtek driver failing
<daftykins> not sure if that's the active one
<daftykins> but i have it :D
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: yeah looks that
<ducasse> daftykins: that's where dhclient comes from, i would guess :)
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: but that driver is very old, and the previous kernel worked before the update.
<daftykins> yes that's what i gathered was being pondered
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: i recall some fiddling on trusty with realtek cards with linux-firmware
<lotuspsychje> many cases such a mess bah
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: ok, that might be relevant. thanks, it could show up in the logs if she posts them.
<lotuspsychje> yeah im curious
<ducasse> i have a card that uses that exact driver here, but that machine is on xenial. i can test, though...
<daftykins> who's the user? rings a bell as to a regular :P
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: judy
<daftykins> hmm ok nope
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: after a trusty update realtek card not working anymore
<daftykins> is it not as simple as a user that followed a guide to make a module and load it, kernel update breaks that, so needs it rebuilt?
<daftykins> ho-hum i won't chinese whispers support ;D
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> lets wait for the logs :p
<daftykins> ducasse: no pressure! XD
<lotuspsychje> opensource brainstorm is the best
<ducasse> daftykins: :)
<daftykins> i dunno, i much prefer find driver -> download driver -> things work, move on with life! :D
<lotuspsychje> if its driver related
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: we can do teleport support to here lol
<daftykins> :D
<lotuspsychje> user: judy==>trusty realteak card dont work after update==> http://paste.ubuntu.com/16364447/
<OerHeks> daftykins, you don't speak chinese?
<lotuspsychje> nihao
<daftykins> not last i checked sir, no
<OerHeks> nr 41 with rice
<OerHeks> oh ..
<daftykins> :)
<lotuspsychje> kernel: [434872.942879] r8169 0000:06:00.0 eth0: link down
<daftykins> oh man it's a desktop, what
<daftykins> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883114107
<lotuspsychje> NetworkManager[872]: <info> (eth0): device state change: unavailable -> disconnected (reason 'carrier-changed') [20 30 40]
<daftykins> actually ignore my link, there is talk of an acer EFI in that pastebin... so the hostname is a misnomer
<daftykins> a RED HERRING!
<daftykins> oh no
<daftykins> it actually is the emachines
<lotuspsychje> kernel: [    2.869070] r8169 0000:06:00.0: can't disable ASPM; OS doesn't have ASPM control
<lotuspsychje> whatever that means
<daftykins> power management perhaps
<daftykins> yep https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_State_Power_Management
<daftykins> 10 points \o/
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2280579
<lotuspsychje> off for coffee :p
<daftykins> mines a caramel lattÃ©, thanks!
<pauljw> you have go off for coffee... my coffee maker is right behind me.
<OerHeks> pauljw, not all of us have employees :-D
<pauljw> :)
<OerHeks> i should get married too ..
<pauljw> heh, i'm the one that makes the coffee most of the time.
<OerHeks> oh oke, misunderstood
 * OerHeks removing the ad
<pauljw> i meant the actual device is right behind me... ;)
<pauljw> now i must run to the basement and retrieve the laundry from the dryer... brb.
<daftykins> OerHeks: just train Drabber!
<de-facto> Any of you guys ever played around with cdc_ncm.ko for usb lte modems?
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: driver=r8169 driverversion=2.3LK-NAPI duplex=full firmware=rtl8168e-3_0.0.4 03/27/12 ip=10.10.10.124 latency=0
<lotuspsychje> hi nicomachus
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/italian-military-to-save-up-to-29-million-euro-by-migrating-to-libreoffice-503945.shtml
<lotuspsychje> i think they will give the 29 million to us now :p
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: what will you buy?
<OerHeks> i would buy a huge building, to start an opensource-shop
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> can i come work for you then?
<OerHeks> with at least 3 rooms where i can put 100 people in
<OerHeks> sure
<lotuspsychje> awesome!
<OerHeks> then we invite pauljw daftykins BluesKaj Ben64 dax DJones EriC^^ and such fine people to give seminars
<lotuspsychje> :p
<OerHeks> sorry for highlighting you ..
<lotuspsychje> the whole world should migrate to opensource like this
<lotuspsychje> saving $$$$
<lotuspsychje> nice example for starters
<lotuspsychje> this is just how we can defeat the dirty politics
<OerHeks> yes, communist-revenge
<lotuspsychje> our names arent showing in those panama papers :p
<BluesKaj> heh, i'd better brush up on my libreoffice chops :-)
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: :p
<OerHeks> i'll be standing at the door, checking for legal windows and such
<lotuspsychje> hahaha
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: the building will have no windows?
<OerHeks> only backdoors ..
<lotuspsychje> roflol
<OerHeks> actually, this is how i get easy to sleep at night
<lotuspsychje> how?
<OerHeks> dreaming of a huge building for free, etc
<lotuspsychje> everyone needs a big dream...im tired of counting thoe sheep!
<lotuspsychje> *those
<pauljw> :)
<lotuspsychje> http://www.canonical.com/careers/all-vacancies
<DJones> OerHeks: with my state of mind at the moment, I'd be in no state too give a seminar on anything :)
<OerHeks> oh oke .. but we need painters too
<OerHeks> just joking, but really, such place would be awesome
 * OerHeks is in between jobs at the moment
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: what are you looking for?
<lotuspsychje> im also still looking for a temporary job to combine the business with
<DJones> OerHeks: me too, plus long term sickness waiting for diagnosis, stroke/epilepsy/blackouts etc
<OerHeks> i read a lot in our newspapers, about oensource guru's are wanted..
<OerHeks> *opensource
<OerHeks> http://webwereld.nl/open-source/93441-open-source-helpt-je-bij-het-vinden-van-een-baan
<OerHeks> .. but not :-(
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: linux torvalds also advising linux IT jobs
<OerHeks> they all want itil and such .. canonical too
<lotuspsychje> yeah the skills are crazy...
<pauljw> the quarry i retired from is always looking for good help... come on over!!
<lotuspsychje> pauljw: you had an IT job also?
<pauljw> not there, i was a laborer, a truck driver the a plant operator.  using shovels, sledge hammers, pick axes and my back
<lotuspsychje> ah
<pauljw> IT was a decade ago
<OerHeks> oh, then i failed because i have no driving license ..
<lotuspsychje> i worked at truck & trailer plant for 18 years
<OerHeks> or having no smartphone ..
<lotuspsychje> you get refused because no mobile?
<lotuspsychje> wth..
<OerHeks> "you should own a smartphone for our time schedule app" meh
<lotuspsychje> evening baizon
<lotuspsychje> dear lord..
<pauljw> oh boy
<pauljw> then they should supply the phoone
<pauljw> phone even
<OerHeks> well, i am unemployed for some time now, 48 yrs, it is getting tough
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: give me a smartphone, and then ill consider a job at your company...
<OerHeks> i refuse an android blob
<lotuspsychje> neither here
<OerHeks> but starting my own business, i think it is a little risky ..
<OerHeks> little big risky
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: yeah its not a great time to invest money
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: if you start a business, stay very low
<OerHeks> i would need employees, i guess
<OerHeks> maybe someone from ccanonical is reading this, and has an idea..
<pauljw> not really, you can be the owner/operator until you grow too big for one employee.
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<OerHeks> i think that happens fast.
<OerHeks> unless i win the lottery ..
<OerHeks> then i would surely invest.
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: how are entries added to ubottu? the 'can i have / on zfs in 16.04?' thing seems to come up a lot...
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: a trustable accountant is halfway a good busines
<lotuspsychje> !zfs
<ubot5> For information concerning ZFS and Ubuntu, see: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ZFS
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: talk to dax if you have a new suggestion, he will look into it
<OerHeks> lotuspsychje, accountant/taxman/legal, all in house :-)
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> !releasenotes | ducasse mentions zfs
<ubot5> ducasse mentions zfs: Ubuntu 16.04 (Xenial Xerus) release notes can be found here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseNotes
<lotuspsychje> og for ibm
<lotuspsychje> oh
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: there's nothing on zfs in there afaict.
<lotuspsychje> sorry confused with zfsdump
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: is this relevant? edited 2016 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/Reference/ZFS
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: yes, but it doesn't point out that it's just for data pools.
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: it says 'will be fully supported in xenial', so i can see why people are confused.
<lotuspsychje> dax: wanna take care of this ^
<lotuspsychje> https://insights.ubuntu.com/2016/02/16/zfs-is-the-fs-for-containers-in-ubuntu-16-04/ also redirects the kernel reference url
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: dax: i know it's not officially supported, but here's a guide from the zol people - https://github.com/zfsonlinux/pkg-zfs/wiki/HOWTO-install-Ubuntu-16.04-to-a-Native-ZFS-Root-Filesystem
<lotuspsychje> confusing stuff, 16.04 beta1 ?
<lotuspsychje> isnt xenial supposed to have zfs baked in?
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: it has the zfs kernel module by default, the tools are in main, but it
<ducasse> it's only supported on data pools.
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: so you suggesting we mention this only for data pools in a trigger?
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: yes, something like that.
<lotuspsychje> kk
<lotuspsychje> lets wait until dax is awake :p
<BluesKaj> ok, learned a new way to use nmcli to connect to my vpnserver ..quite simple actually ...the nm widget is erroring in my panel
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: np :) i'm about to call it a night anyway :)
<lotuspsychje> soupertime here also :p
<lotuspsychje> laterz guys
<OerHeks> it worked, lotus !!
<OerHeks> oh
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-05-12
<kmoss> Hi, everyone.  I'm wondering which desktop environment is best to use for minimizing mouse usage.  Basically, I have decided the mouse is evil, ever since I got a wrist injury.  So I'm looking for good suggestions.
<daftykins> perhaps you should try a trackball first
<kmoss> I hate those things
<tsimonq2> kmoss: i3 is the best I've seen
<daftykins> me too, but i had a client who switched after some injury
<kmoss> tsimonq2: never even heard of that one, any particular advantages to it?
<Bashing-om> kmoss: I like xfce .
<daftykins> anything can be keyboard if you learn it well enough
<tsimonq2> kmoss: it's basically very keyboard-oriented
<tsimonq2> i3 window manager
<tsimonq2> https://www.linux.com/learn/how-use-super-fast-i3-tiling-window-manager-linux%20 and http://i3wm.org/ might help
<JanC> the default unity is pretty good with a keyboard...
<daftykins> most let you alt+F2 -> program -> enter
<LambdaComplex> kmoss: i3 or bspwm
<LambdaComplex> or possibly hlwm
<kmoss> So far I'm watching the videos on i3, I'm loving what I see so far.
<kmoss> anyone know if you can make the terminal windows/vi/emacs transparent in i3?
<LambdaComplex> probably, if you have a compositor (like compton) running
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon to all
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: did judy come back yet?
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: not that i've seen, but i'm only halfway paying attention :)
<lotuspsychje> kk :p
<lotuspsychje> http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2016/05/ubuntu-16-04-proves-even-an-lts-release-can-live-at-linuxs-bleeding-edge/
<lotuspsychje> nice article here, also mentions zfs only for servers as you said ducasse
<ducasse> thanks, i'll have a look.
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> hey lotuspsychje
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<BluesKaj> hi pauljw
<pauljw> hey BluesKaj
<lotuspsychje> hi pauljw
<lotuspsychje> welcome akik
<pauljw> hi lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> http://www.zdnet.com/article/the-linux-in-your-car-movement-gains-momentum/#ftag=RSSbaffb68
<lotuspsychje> fasten your seatbelts lol
<pauljw> :)
<EriC^^> hi lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
<OerHeks> i am back :-)
<lotuspsychje> wb OerHeks
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: LP fixxed?
<OerHeks> lotuspsychje, almost all sites indeed!
<lotuspsychje> great
<OerHeks> you wicked fixer!
<lotuspsychje> lol
<BluesKaj> hey OerHeks
<OerHeks> hi BluesKaj
<OerHeks> not sure what went wrong, or how it got reset
<lotuspsychje> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=intel-driver-change&num=1
<OerHeks> all i know is that my yubikey is now EOL, and i use an other OTP now.
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: your back that matters :p
<OerHeks> you are my favorite resetter, grinn
<lotuspsychje> hehe
<BluesKaj> hope it doesn't need pulseaudio for flash/web audio linkage to alsa like other audio drivers do
<lotuspsychje> alot of stuff changing
<lotuspsychje> driverwise
<BluesKaj> platform agnostic code sounds workable tho ....I think
<lotuspsychje> nice article, posted earlier: http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2016/05/ubuntu-16-04-proves-even-an-lts-release-can-live-at-linuxs-bleeding-edge/
<lotuspsychje> explaining the snap part well
<lotuspsychje_> oO
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/ubuntu-touch-ota-11-delayed-by-a-week-work-on-ota-12-should-start-soon-503970.shtml
<lotuspsychje> \9: welcome
<\9> hi
<dbz2k> hi
<lotuspsychje> \9: we share some ubuntu articles and recent news here, to be able to help best in main
<lotuspsychje> dbz2k: hello
<\9> ah, cool
<OerHeks> some new users help old users, anything can happen here
<OerHeks> !coffee
<lotuspsychje> cheers OerHeks
<lotuspsychje> http://www.datamation.com/open-source/how-long-will-desktop-linux-last.html
<lotuspsychje> another lame article that says linux will vanish lol
<\9> I've only seen linux desktop grow, there's new desktops in an IT class in our uni and they all run Kubuntu
<\9> or at least KDE. I think it's Kubuntu
<lotuspsychje> \9: we found an article yesterday, italian military dropped ms office for libreoffice, saves them 26 million euros..
<lotuspsychje> \9: nice1
<\9> yeah I've never understood how MS office has a market when there's a free alternative
<tgm4883> \9: because it costs money to switch
<tgm4883> \9: because by the time people reach working age they've already been taught office (which bring s it back to point #1)
<\9> ah, right
<lotuspsychje> well if you can save 26 million, i think you can handle the converting price aswell :p
<Hesulan> I can't remember where, but the other day I read a good article that pretty much summed up Linux on desktops. IIRC, it said something along the lines of: Since those of us who develop Linux do so primarily for their own use rather than as a product to sell to a consumer, we don't really care if *everyone* uses it - only that *we* are able to. Having more end-users only provides indirect benefit to us through
<Hesulan> bug reports, etc. So it's never been a huge priority.
<tgm4883> lotuspsychje: how many employees?
<lotuspsychje> tgm4883: not sure, lemme refind the url
<lotuspsychje> tgm4883: http://news.softpedia.com/news/italian-military-to-save-up-to-29-million-euro-by-migrating-to-libreoffice-503945.shtml
<\9> yeah Linux desktop has always been a niche and likely always will be
<\9> nothing wrong with that IMO
<tgm4883> so 100,000
<tgm4883> somethings not quite right with that math
<tgm4883> office doesn't cost 260/user
<lotuspsychje> depends wich office?
<lotuspsychje> i know a person got ripped off from a pc store for 500$ for MS office full package
<tgm4883> lotuspsychje: no, it really doesn't. You get huge discounts for buying 100,000 seats
<lotuspsychje> true
<tgm4883> hell, you get huge discounts buying 1,000 seats
<lotuspsychje> but we dont know the full story perhaps from the military
<lotuspsychje> anyway a lot of .gov and big companys have moved to linux
<lotuspsychje> its a good thing
<tgm4883> oh I agree, it's a good thing
<tgm4883> I just find some of the numbers a bit, interesting
<lotuspsychje> yeah lol
<lotuspsychje> perhaps some of the ammount $$$ will fall off the boat somewhere
<lotuspsychje> wb BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> thanks lotuspsychje ,installed kodi, but it crashes after a few mins
<lotuspsychje> oh
<BluesKaj> freezes everything
<BluesKaj> not running the nvidia driver due to a kernel module error with it.
<daftykins> mmm Kodi will most likely not run on nouveau
<daftykins> it needs proper OpenGL acceleration
<lotuspsychje> ah
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: cant you load another driver?
<daftykins> older version number or something?
<lotuspsychje> sudo ubuntu-drivers list
<BluesKaj> daftykins:  I tried the driver with both 3.1 and 2.0 opengl , but it was a mess . flickering , crashing wallpapaer below the panel etc
<daftykins> is that on a 16.04 install? what's the card?
<lotuspsychje> and driver version?
<BluesKaj> nvidia-340 is a problem on yakkety
<lotuspsychje> ah your on 16.10?
<BluesKaj> nouveau works well with xrender most of the time
<OerHeks> BluesKaj, missing linux-headers-generic ??
<lotuspsychje> i think stuff wil get fixxed when yakkety moves to 4.6 kernel also
<lotuspsychje> dax: did you see ducasse 's sugestion for zfs?
<BluesKaj> OerHeks:  headers are installed
<OerHeks> :-(
<dax> lotuspsychje: zfs stuff is probably best off going to another op, i don't know anything about it or support it :c
<lotuspsychje> dax: ok thank you, can you talk about it in ops perhaps?
<lotuspsychje> dax: also EriC^^ mentioned the ubottu bug still open for abuse
<dax> do a factoid suggestion (/msg ubottu !no, zfs is <reply> factoid text goes here) and see if someone else from -ops pops up
<dax> bug thing is a Pici thing
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: for you ^
<ducasse> ok, i'll do it rsn.
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: highlight pici for the echo ubottu bug :p
<EriC^^> ok :p
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: zfs suggestion is sent.
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: great
<lotuspsychje> evening baizon
<lotuspsychje> bbl guys dinner
<DaniKitten> Hi
<DaniKitten> I found a way for still using Ubuntu on my slow netbook: using almost only true CLI
<daftykins> *facepalm*
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Beats head {DaniKitten} on desk .... hard .
<daftykins> :)
<daftykins> Bashing-om: only in the most pleasant and polite way!
<Bashing-om> Yeah, otherwise - we become the guilty . I have a soft conscious .
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-05-13
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Hey just in time to see my back side .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: sleep tight mate :p
<lotuspsychje> morning EriC^^
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<Bashing-om> K, take care of them all .. I will return .
<lotuspsychje> we will!
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/canonical-pushes-new-features-into-the-snappy-integration-for-ubuntu-16-04-lts-504014.shtml
<lotuspsychje> iulian: morning
<ducasse> morning! *groan*
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse :p
<lotuspsychje> have a warm ubuntu-coffee
<ducasse> barely awake :)
<lotuspsychje> hehe
<lotuspsychje> !zfs
<ubot5> For information concerning ZFS and Ubuntu, see: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ZFS
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: perhaps you should find the kirkland guy to edit :p
<lotuspsychje> edited in 2016 so thats promising
<ducasse> there are things that could be clearer still on the wiki :)
<lotuspsychje> i agree
<ducasse> although i'm *really* happy zfs is now supported!
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: https://bugs.launchpad.net/~kirkland
<lotuspsychje> thats the guy that blogs on insights
<ducasse> yes, i've read many of them. smart guy :)
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: the ars technica article on xenial was good, 'the best ubuntu release to date'!
<lotuspsychje> yeah, i really like it aswell
<lotuspsychje> finaly some good review
<lotuspsychje> that also looks under the hood
<lotuspsychje> many users only search for the GUI changes
<ducasse> yes, there are big things in xenial - zfs, snap, lots of new software, lxd...
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<lotuspsychje> im sticking to xenial for few years
<lotuspsychje> until 18.04 to bug out again
<lotuspsychje> dax: tgm4883 found the ppa format wrong on !ppapurge, ppa:owner/repo can you change?
<lotuspsychje> hey TJ-
<TJ-> morning
<lotuspsychje> http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-05-13/apple-invests-1-billion-in-uber-s-china-competitor-didi
<lotuspsychje> holy cow
<TJ-> when you've got over US$200 billion offshore burning a hole in your pocket, buying a few trinkets is a good idea
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> morning de-facto
<lotuspsychje> bbl breakfast time
<lotuspsychje> re
<de-facto> Good morning :)
<lotuspsychje> hey de-facto good noon :p
<lotuspsychje> de-facto: wich timezone your on?
<de-facto> gmt+2
<de-facto> same as you i guess
<lotuspsychje> 12h18 brussels timezone here
<de-facto> yup
<lotuspsychje> : )
<de-facto> im in the south of germany, near frankfurt :)
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> german is a cool country
<de-facto> yeah i like it here, but actually most of europe is pretty nice imho, it just has to find its common vision again ;)
<de-facto> id like to know how many of the ppl in #ubuntu originate from european countries, it seems there is quite a cyclic change in activity as well as competence which could indicate many come from EU
<lotuspsychje> usa pretty active aswell
<lotuspsychje> i love the worldwide activeness of #ubuntu
<de-facto> yeah its pretty neat :)
<lotuspsychje> http://hackerboards.com/35-dollar-open-source-rk3288-hacker-sbc-hits-indiegogo/
<EriC^^> as well as competence
<EriC^^> lol, calling americans dumb? :p
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: :p
<lotuspsychje> hey pauljw
<pauljw> hi lotuspsychje
<pauljw> everyone
 * lotuspsychje is listening @ http://mixing.dj/2015/livesets/adam-beyer-drumcode-274-live-awakenings-amsterdam-30-10-2015/
<lotuspsychje> wb
<lotuspsychje> afternoon DArqueBishop
<DArqueBishop> Morning/afternoon/evening, lotuspsychje. :)
<lotuspsychje> snap find is growing by the day
<lotuspsychje> oh cool! telegram...im gonna try that
<lotuspsychje> lotuspsychje@RooTBooK:~$ sudo snap install telegram-sergiusens
<lotuspsychje> sweet!
<BluesKaj> hiyas all
<Armadillos> Morning!
<BluesKaj> 'Morning Armadillos
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> hey lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: got kodi to work?
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/apt-1-3-now-in-development-promises-support-for-multiple-fingerprints-bugfixes-504034.shtml
<lotuspsychje> evening baizon
<baizon> hi lotuspsychje
<BluesKaj> lotuspsychje:  yes but it crashes after about 30 mins and freezes the desktop on 16.10...haven't used it on 16.04 lately
<lotuspsychje> kk
<BluesKaj> was called to the phone
<lotuspsychje> no sweat :p
<lotuspsychje> soupertime guys
<lotuspsychje> have a nice one
<lotuspsychje> lots of users with network issues
<OerHeks> noticed yes.
<lotuspsychje> !info network-manager trusty
<ubot5> network-manager (source: network-manager): network management framework (daemon and userspace tools). In component main, is optional. Version 0.9.8.8-0ubuntu7.3 (trusty), package size 481 kB, installed size 1988 kB (Only available for linux-any)
<lotuspsychje> didnt notice myself on xenial
<lotuspsychje> wb pauljw
<pauljw> ty :)
<OerHeks> :-)
<OerHeks> some users want a fresh chromium-browser too ..
<pauljw> hi OerHeks
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: howso fresh?
<OerHeks> The stable channel has been updated to 50.0.2661.102 for Windows, Mac, and Linux.
<lotuspsychje> ah
<pauljw> it would be refreshing it folks would spend some time understanding the philosophy behind stable repos rather than this constant frenzy to have the newest release of everything.
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<lotuspsychje> !latest
<ubot5> Packages in Ubuntu may not be the latest. Ubuntu aims for stability, so "latest" may not be a good idea. Post-release updates are only considered if they are fixes for security vulnerabilities, high impact bug fixes, or unintrusive bug fixes with substantial benefit. See also !backports, !sru, and !ppa.
<pauljw> ;)
<OerHeks> sure, but not for ssh and a browser
<OerHeks> but, that is my opinion
<OerHeks> i know what you want to say ;-)
<pauljw> my firefox is constantly updated
<pauljw> the openssh update of a few days ago might be the culprit in my known_host file issue.  so newest isn't always best.
<lotuspsychje> Instellen van network-manager-gnome (1.2.0-0ubuntu0.16.04.1) ...
<lotuspsychje> seems like nm also updated on xenial here
<lotuspsychje> quick reboot to check
<lotuspsychje> working
<OerHeks> on a laptop?
<OerHeks> i see a relation to laptops and wifi issues
<lotuspsychje> yep netbook
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: perhaps on specific kernels?
<lotuspsychje> alot of kernel exploits recently on usn also
<lotuspsychje> !info network-manager
<ubot5> network-manager (source: network-manager): network management framework (daemon and userspace tools). In component main, is optional. Version 1.1.93-0ubuntu4 (xenial), package size 2064 kB, installed size 10744 kB (Only available for linux-any)
<lotuspsychje> tv night cheers to all
<dbz2k> hello
<Bashing-om> WE being pounded from the 14.04 updates breaking network-manager ?
<OerHeks> something like that yeah
<daftykins> what's happened o0
<OerHeks> hmmm
<OerHeks> systemctl enable NetworkManager.service
<OerHeks> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1434986
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1434986 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "Not working network connection after boot" [Critical,Triaged]
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Update in 14.04 breaking metwork-manager ... loosing network connectivity . Seems so far the easier resolution is RE-installing network-manager . A trick with no connectivity . One possibility is from "recovery mode" .
<daftykins> yee-ouch!
<Bashing-om> Uh Huh .. started seeing this last night here on the channel .
<daftykins> exciting new things! hmm looks like i might even have a candidate just now in -uk
<Bashing-om> daftykins: http://askubuntu.com/questions/771627/14-04-network-manager-stopped-working/771841#771841 ; https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1539634
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1539634 in network-manager (Ubuntu Trusty) "network-manager crashes when using libnl-3-200-3.21.1-1ubuntu1" [High,Fix released]
<daftykins> ty sir
<Bashing-om>  currently " This bug was fixed in the package network-manager - 0.9.8.8-0ubuntu7.3 " and that package is now in the repo : " sysop@1404mini:~$ apt list
<Bashing-om>                     network-manager >> network-manager/trusty-updates 0.9.8.8-0ubuntu7.3 amd64 " .
<Bashing-om> daftykins: confirmation that : http://askubuntu.com/questions/771627/14-04-network-manager-stopped-working/771841#771841 is indeed effective .
<daftykins> neat :D
<OerHeks> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libnl3/+bug/1511735
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1511735 in libnl3 (Ubuntu Trusty) "libnl: fail to bind() netlink sockets" [Medium,In progress]
<OerHeks> so, are all those affected, on proposed??
<OerHeks> just asking, i cannot get that clear
<Bashing-om> OerHeks: I think that 'proposed" is open to debate . sevral bugs being opened : https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1539634 .
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1539634 in network-manager (Ubuntu Trusty) "network-manager crashes when using libnl-3-200-3.21.1-1ubuntu1" [High,Fix released]
<Bashing-om> IRT ^^ " Launchpad Janitor (janitor) wrote 41 minutes ago: : .. >> status:New â Confirmed .
<dax> one wonders how that made it past QA
<Bashing-om> dax: Did haste make waste ? in the original fix, now more problems from the fix ? Maybe now also effecting WIFI connections (??) .
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-05-14
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/zfs-for-linux-0-6-5-7-released-with-support-for-linux-kernel-4-6-and-4-5-504053.shtml
<brushdemon> alright
<brushdemon> and here we are
<lotuspsychje> you can use the channel here for conversations
<brushdemon> Thanks
<brushdemon> I was thinking about getting one of the new ubuntu based tablets
<lotuspsychje> M10?
<brushdemon> errrr, well I got heaps of emails about it since I signed up for the pre-order for it
<brushdemon> I got destroyed by bills when the pre-order window was open though ;~;
<lotuspsychje> i would wait until unity8 comes out
<brushdemon> oh, why's that?
<brushdemon> wayland?
<brushdemon> wait
<brushdemon> I haven't kept in the loop for a while, is Ubuntu going with wayland or mir for unity8?
<lotuspsychje> well then you would be able to install ubuntu-desktop + unity8 on windows based tablets also
<lotuspsychje> brushdemon: unity8 will come, but canonical will leave the choice to users
<lotuspsychje> if they prefer unity7 or 8
<brushdemon> It's so menial but simply giving users the choice to move the bar from the left hand side of the screen to the bottom would probably make unity a little more popular
<brushdemon> that's in my opinion though
<lotuspsychje> unity is already very popular
<brushdemon> and it's the one complaint I have heard about unity time and time again
<lotuspsychje> but also all the ubuntu flavors
<brushdemon> yeah, ofc
<baizon> brushdemon: http://www.webupd8.org/2016/03/ubuntu-1604-xenial-xerus-gets-option-to.html
<brushdemon> FUCK YES
<brushdemon> My whole past year has been messed up and I've missed out on so much news
<brushdemon> unity-dev team, I salute you
<lotuspsychje> and also snap packages coming our way
<lotuspsychje> ive installed telegram with snap yesterday
<lotuspsychje> on 16.04
<brushdemon> oh, I remember hearing about discussion of them in 2014
<brushdemon> they're actually a thing now?
<brushdemon> well
<lotuspsychje> yep
<brushdemon> you just said you used one :x
<brushdemon> wow, I've lived under a rock for a year
<brushdemon> like.... I don't even know how
<lotuspsychje> snap find
<lotuspsychje> in terminal
<brushdemon> lemme upgrade first haha :p
<lotuspsychje> then sudo snap install your-snap-package
<brushdemon> so the user tool is pretty much like using apt?
<lotuspsychje> snap packages also showing in ubuntu-software
<brushdemon> very nice
<brushdemon> so what packages are supported by the new format?
<brushdemon> I'm going to guess all of ubuntu-core by now at least
<lotuspsychje> the ones newly created
<ducasse> morning all
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
<brushdemon> ah, so it'll be a slow process to move everything over to it?
<brushdemon> heya ducasse
<lotuspsychje> brushdemon: its not meant to move all things over, classic .debs will continue to exist
<lotuspsychje> brushdemon: snap brings more possibilities
<lotuspsychje> and no dependecie nightmares anymore
<brushdemon> YES!
<lotuspsychje> we had telegram-desktop for ubuntu-desktop aleady
<brushdemon> is there a good article/blog/anything that highlights snap that you'd recommend?
<lotuspsychje> but inside a package still
<ducasse> i hope snap gets an option like apt show for more info on a snap, the descriptions are really brief.
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: snap find from terminal
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: sudo snap install your-snap
<lotuspsychje> and shows snap in ubuntu-software also
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: yes, but those descriptions are very short afaict
<brushdemon> I think adding a longer description would be a trivial thing really
<lotuspsychje> like manpages?
<ducasse> oooohh, better manpages too, yes!
<lotuspsychje> well i also think snap packages are good to run from tablets that will run unity8 etc
<brushdemon> haha, upgrading a vm atm to 16.04 and it's funny once it gets to dovecot and postfix
<lotuspsychje> so now a user could install the nmap snap package on his tablet
<brushdemon> the number of times it flashes, "Would you like to merge your config files"
<brushdemon> NOPE
<brushdemon> I'm good thankyou apt
<ducasse> absolutely, snap looks wonderful for tablets etc.
<brushdemon> ^ this
<lotuspsychje> but also on desktop, for specific stuff
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: sure, but i still love you, apt;)
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<lotuspsychje> im just wondering who checks the new incomming snaps for security?
<lotuspsychje> can a malicious user suggest a dark snap easy or not?
<ducasse> hmm. i hope they are vetted.
<lotuspsychje> telegram/about looks neat
<brushdemon> ahh, now I see what snaps are
<lotuspsychje> GNU GPL 3
<lotuspsychje> brushdemon: its a bit like a ubuntu-touch app sort of
<brushdemon> yuh, it's nicely self-contained
<brushdemon> It makes me think of chroots
<ducasse> what is the 'x11-apps' snap?
<lotuspsychje> not sure
<lotuspsychje> didnt test
<lotuspsychje> bbl breakfast here
<lotuspsychje> have a nice one
<brushdemon> well
<brushdemon> that's one vm upgraded
<brushdemon> oh wow, great work with the apt documentation
<brushdemon> this is actually awesome!
<ducasse> i upgraded a vm all the way from 14.10 to 16.04 the other day, took less than an hour and went perfectly :)
<brushdemon> hehe, I did that a while back
<brushdemon> well from 13.10 up to 15.04
<brushdemon> no issues either
<brushdemon> well... actually there is always an issue with mysql but you just read the notes on it
<brushdemon> it's not super hard to work out
<de-facto> haha they released ZFS for linux on Friday, 13th of May? seriously?
<ducasse> if you're talking about ZoL 0.6.5.7, it was released May 12th.
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<BluesKaj> Hi pauljw, how goes it today ?
<pauljw> hey BluesKaj, so far so good, still getting the sleep out of my eyes.  :)  how about you?
<BluesKaj> same, allergies I had as a child have sprung up again ...watery itchy eyes etc....drops help tho
<pauljw> oh, allergies are a bear, good that drops help out.  i take claritan(sp?) and that helps me some.  seems this part of the country everyone has allergies.  always damp, everything grows.  :)
<DJones> Afternoon all
<pauljw> hi DJones
<BluesKaj> hey DJones
<DJones> Hi pauljw BluesKaj
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon to all
<pauljw> hey lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey pauljw
<DArqueBishop> Howdy lotuspsychje.
<lotuspsychje> hi there DArqueBishop
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: those 16.04 help wiki's are pretty nice made
<OerHeks> just found them
<OerHeks> i cannot test BT issues, as i am on 15.10
<lotuspsychje> and i dont have BT
<OerHeks> i do, apple magic trackpad and a bt keyboard somewhere ..
<EriC^^> sup
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: you see triple 9 yet mate?
<EriC^^> nope
<lotuspsychje> gotta see!
<EriC^^> first time i hear about it
<lotuspsychje> best movie so far
<EriC^^> nice
<lotuspsychje> bit like HEAT
<EriC^^> watching trailer now
<EriC^^> kate winslet hmm
<lotuspsychje> http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1712261/
<lotuspsychje> 120min big suspense :p
<pauljw> hey EriC^^
<EriC^^> hi pauljw :)
<EriC^^> lotuspsychje: black guy is the bad guy right
<lotuspsychje> i cant tell you nothing :p
<EriC^^> hehe
<lotuspsychje> i can only say its a movie where its hard to say who's good and not
<lotuspsychje> wb
<EriC^^> thanks
<EriC^^> damn torrents are quick
<EriC^^> almost 1mb d/l
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: shhh :p
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: your going to the theaters to watch this evening?
<EriC^^> lol
<EriC^^> no
<lotuspsychje> lol
<EriC^^> i'm d/ling it right now
<lotuspsychje> http://www.cio.com/article/3070434/linux/linux-cant-keep-you-safe-if-you-dont-update-it.html
<OerHeks> ohhh never new that!
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> sudo apt-get drop updates
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: the ammount keeps rising...http://fossforce.com/2016/05/italian-military-goes-libreoffice-hbo-abuses-dmca/
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: did they buy you that building perhaps?
<EriC^^> damn ps4 games are HUGE
 * lotuspsychje sends popcorn & soda to EriC^^ with ubuntuDr0ne
<EriC^^> fallout4 18gb
<lotuspsychje> oO
<EriC^^> imagine how much work is put into that game O.o
<lotuspsychje> its crazy, if you think of the detailed graphics and levels
<EriC^^> yeah
<lotuspsychje> game devs are earning more then you and me togheter
<EriC^^> yeah games are like $60-$80
<OerHeks> oh i seeded 15x that size by now
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> bluray's even more crazy
<lotuspsychje> 80-100gig per dvd
<EriC^^> wow
<lotuspsychje> imagine the time you need to rip one with handbrake lol
<EriC^^> we should make those shirts
<EriC^^> fuck the computer store
<EriC^^> lol
<EriC^^> we'll be richhhhhhh
<EriC^^> :p
<lotuspsychje> lol
<OerHeks> noo, leave the stores alone.. all i can do now is ordering online, i hate that
<OerHeks> i want to feel the package before buying
<EriC^^> that's what she said
<OerHeks> if the package feels solid, it gains my trust
<EriC^^> xD
<lotuspsychje> http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/61BP42vjKZL._UX385_.jpg
<OerHeks> and if the salesperson smells nice, i will come back
<baizon> nice t-shirt :D
<baizon> i got one old lenovo with windows that im trying to sell :D
<lotuspsychje> http://www.icu-it.nl/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/LinuxTshirt3.jpg
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> one to go out @ night
<OerHeks> baizon, "almost free door-stopper: .. "
<baizon> damn this shirt is even better
<EriC^^> gasp?
<EriC^^> wth
<EriC^^> !find gasp
<ubot5> Found: python-gasp, W:, W:, W:, W:, W:, W:, W:, W:, W: (and 12 others) http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=gasp&searchon=names&suite=xenial&section=all
<baizon> hmm, no gasp command for me
<lotuspsychje> http://i.imgur.com/5RAM3Rm.png
<lotuspsychje> lol
<baizon> ok... gasp - a preprocessor for assembly programs
<lotuspsychje> hi BluesKaj
<EriC^^> they should have used fsck in it
<EriC^^> must have thought it was too inappropriate or something
<EriC^^> stay calm and root boxes
<EriC^^> we should get into the shirt business lotuspsychje
<OerHeks> http://imgur.com/gallery/g2wOPn9
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: you are the 53's user, you have won this tshirt today: http://g01.a.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1VUEKIpXXXXccXXXXq6xXFXXXJ/2015-Summer-Style-100-Cotton-T-font-b-Shirt-b-font-Man-OZF-UBUNTU-font-b.jpg
<BluesKaj> hey lotuspsychje, EriC^^, OerHeks
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: lol
<EriC^^> hey lotuspsychje
<EriC^^> i mean
<EriC^^> hey BluesKaj
<EriC^^> :p
<baizon> no need to piss on windows, it sucks anyway, no need to bother :D
<lotuspsychje> lol
<baizon> windows will die anyway
<lotuspsychje> of course not, we have ubuwin now!
<OerHeks> hi BluesKaj
<baizon> with such M$ CEOs :)
<lotuspsychje> baizon: and they stopped free updates on w10 now...sweet!
<lotuspsychje> its the year of the paying and privacy corrupting desktop :p
<OerHeks> everybody gets a free copy of win10, but not this ol' witch .. should i start a lawsuit?
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: you need to buy a prvious one first :p
<pauljw> hi BluesKaj
<baizon> 3 friends of mine had an automatic 7 -> 10 upgrade
<baizon> all failed and their system is now broken
<lotuspsychje> wow
<EriC^^> ok movie time
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: enjoy mate :p
<baizon> they got a nice "do you want to upgrade to 10?", they all clicked "no, thank you"
<baizon> and all got 10 after reboot :D
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> only good news for ubuntu such scenario's
<baizon> i personally dont care, havent used windows for a year now. I dont even know how windows 8 and 10 works
<BluesKaj> lotuspsychje:  too bad about the shirt, ...not exactly slim anymore :-)
<lotuspsychje> we have seen some users really mentioning this in main, they tired of their techniques
<lotuspsychje> baizon: xp and 7 were ok...all the rest is a big nightmare
<baizon> the best short clip i saw last time with windows 10... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eP31lluUDWU
<lotuspsychje> lets c
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> blue screen of death updates
<baizon> heheh
<de-facto> lotuspsychje apropos telegram, Signal from OpenWhisperSystems has a chrome app which syncs almost in realtime with the android app: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/signal-private-messenger/bikioccmkafdpakkkcpdbppfkghcmihk
<lotuspsychje> lets c
<lotuspsychje> de-facto: looks coll, does that work on chromium aswell
<lotuspsychje> tinoco: welcome
<de-facto> lotuspsychje yes im using it on chromium-browser from xenial repo
<lotuspsychje> great
<de-facto> just does not work if you default to incognito mode (cost me some time figuring that one out)
<lotuspsychje> ive tested that telegram snap package yesterday from xenial==>bq ubuntu phone
<lotuspsychje> working like a charm here
<de-facto> nice, how do they provide that snap? is it a closed binary?
<lotuspsychje> de-facto: snap find from terminal
<lotuspsychje> de-facto: its based on snappy core right
<lotuspsychje> de-facto: works sort of like ubuntu-touch apps
<lotuspsychje> de-facto: and they show in ubuntu-software aswell
<lotuspsychje> sudo snap install your-snap-package
<de-facto> actually that snappy apps will open a lot of possibilities for commercial apps to land on ubuntu, which is pretty nice on one side, but open source ones are even nicer :)
<lotuspsychje> yep
<lotuspsychje> de-facto: and also for tablets on unity8 etc
<de-facto> yup this could be big :P
<lotuspsychje> the only thing im wondering is , who test this for security
<lotuspsychje> can a malicious app creator add snaps easy or not?
<de-facto> thats a very good question
<lotuspsychje> we dont wanna endup like android store apps
<lotuspsychje> hmm perhaps ubuntu isolating it already somehow
<lotuspsychje> after your first install there is a /snap
<de-facto> dont those run in some kind of lxc/lxd env?
<lotuspsychje> https://insights.ubuntu.com/2016/05/04/security-confinement-in-ubuntu-core/
<de-facto> if so i guess the black market prices for such 0days just raised :P
<de-facto> ooh well and the "good" old X11 :-/
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> we will also follow all this evolution and see hwo it goes
<lotuspsychje> so even if mark lets us choose between unity7 and unity8, snap packages can be installed on both worlds
<de-facto> didnt the fedora guys had some efforts on X11 isolation with selinux? there also is quobes OS which seems to emplay XEN for isolating X apps
<lotuspsychje> could be, i didnt came across an article on that yet
<de-facto> Joanna Rutkowska explained some of it on her site http://invisiblethingslab.com/itl/Resources.html
<lotuspsychje> lemme read
<de-facto> she and her team are behind quobes os
<OerHeks> great person indeed, she explained the intel flaws to me.
<lotuspsychje> think snappy team did a great job
<lotuspsychje> all the devices it can be installed on or developed
<lotuspsychje> bbl guys souper + movies
<lotuspsychje> have a nice saturday
<OerHeks> :-)
<OerHeks> i am waiting for my mom, she brings the dogs overhere, as she has difficulties walking now.
<de-facto> if you google her name and x11 security things like this show up http://theinvisiblethings.blogspot.de/2011/04/linux-security-circus-on-gui-isolation.html
<OerHeks> No, thank you, i already have a Rolls Royce
<OerHeks> oops, wrong car
<OerHeks> heh, if an 64 bit iso can do a 32 bit install, after boot you could end up with 128 bits
<Bashing-om> and you still get to keep the parts ?
<OerHeks> Sure, only the floppy says -1
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-05-15
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: Any experience with python2.7 : http://pastebin.com/v4d0evyv . Installed local ??
<OerHeks> maybe python is in your path\
<Bashing-om> OerHeks: What we have is an older version of python2.7 is installed . prohibiting installing other packages . I am scared silly to mess about with it .
<pauljw> gnite all
<Bashing-om> web browser has crashed on me .. gonna reboot . be back (soonest ? ).
<Bashing-om> Ouch I am back .. hardware pronlems ! " ata1.00: hot unplug
<Bashing-om> May 14 20:08:54 1404mini kernel: [18354.151934] ata1: SError: { PHYRdyChg LinkSeq TrStaTrns }
<Bashing-om> May 14 20:08:54 1404mini kernel: [18354.151942] ata1.00: failed command: WRITE FPDMA QUEUED " Ouch !
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Bashing-om> Hey lotuspsychje , Welcome back . It has it bumps this eve .
<lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om
<lotuspsychje> yesterday was wild also
 * Bashing-om with hrdware problems. system drive getting " ata1.00: hot unplug " ! ouch !
<lotuspsychje> oh oh
<Bashing-om> Going to be an interesting day tomorrow chasing this down .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: what happens exactly
<EriC^^> Bashing-om: hi was sleeping
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: morning mate
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> how did you like the movie?
<EriC^^> didn't continue it
<lotuspsychje> didnt like?
<EriC^^> just watched like first 10mins or so
<EriC^^> nah i had to do something
<lotuspsychje> kk
<EriC^^> i'll watch today probably
<lotuspsychje> cool
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: 1st indicatioon I get is google-chrome crashing .., then in terminal .. commands return " buss error " . syslog reflects hard drive 'hot unpluged' and numerios enable/disables afterward . File system protecting it's self by going read only . Maybe I clean the box, boot an older kernel and see what transpires .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: what hd brand is this?
<lotuspsychje> morning dax
<Bashing-om> Western Digital . 500 Gigs .
<lotuspsychje> dax: you might know whats going on ^
<lotuspsychje> WD like your work brand :p
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: hmm cant find much on that error
<Bashing-om> Could be controller issues .. As I have another drive gone flakey, spins down and may not spin back up , Maybe time to switch boxes !
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: I then get spammed in the log with " failed command: WRITE FPDMA QUEUED " . understandable as it is likely write protected at that point .
<lotuspsychje> lets c
<dax> hi lotuspsychje
<dax> smells like controller or hard drive failure to me, indeed
<dax> could also be the drive losing power for whatever reason
<dax> first thing i'd do would be opening up the computer, getting rid of dust, checking cables are secure. if that doesn't help, time to start swapping components to see which part of the pipeline is breaking
<lotuspsychje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/550559
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 550559 in linux (Ubuntu) "hdd problems, failed command: READ FPDMA QUEUED" [Undecided,Invalid]
<Bashing-om> dax: Yeah .. could be a lot of things .. Now be a good time to replace my failed voltage meter .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: perhaps also tail syslog in a liveusb first? see if your hd spams also?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: That is a good thouhgt ! .. I had seen that bug report .. back in the lucid days .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: some of those guys fixxed with a reinstall hmm
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: SMART test from ubuntu also good idea?
<EriC^^> hot unplug sounds like the cable was removed or something
<lotuspsychje> also good idea EriC^^ or bad sata cable?
<Bashing-om> It is past my beddy bye time here .. will see what I can work up on this tommorrow . Maybe then I will not be so aggravated, huh ?
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: I recently - a couple months back - replaced the sata cables with good locking type. Power supply failing .. could be .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: a good night sleep always solved everything
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: ran SMART .. passed short .. failed on long with no report .. then I ran fsck . failed with bad superblock . spared it off . system booted up and ran fine for several hours .. then started crashing again . been up now on a re-boot for about 45 minutes .. see no problems . lemme take a peek again at syslog .
<lotuspsychje> tail -f /var/log/syslog
<Bashing-om> syslog still happy :)
<lotuspsychje> bad superblock isnt very amusing :p
<lotuspsychje> i would go for the liveusb, if you see still bad superblock
<Bashing-om> My computer is sick. I am NOT a happy camper .
<lotuspsychje> might be WD to TIP
<lotuspsychje> RIP
<Bashing-om> well .. was going to do a SSD this month .. but finances are a bit tight ( already ) .
<lotuspsychje> perhaps the samsung evo 850, those are cheaper
<EriC^^> shirts .. ;)
<lotuspsychje> i payed 90 euro for the 850 pro 128gig
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: :p
<lotuspsychje> linuxtshirts.com
<Bashing-om> That too is the one I have my eye on . Rhier spiel for th new controllers sure is convincing . Samsung 850 EVO 250GB $84.58 .
<lotuspsychje> you need it so big on linux?
<lotuspsychje> or dualboot with win?
<lotuspsychje> ./dev/sda1          114G      21G   88G  19% /
<lotuspsychje> this is my 850 pro
<lotuspsychje> plenty
<EriC^^> stay calm & /join #ubuntu
<lotuspsychje> lollll
<EriC^^> stay calm & dmesg | tail
<EriC^^> :p
<lotuspsychje> lol my snaps are showing in df
<lotuspsychje> ./dev/loop1          22M      22M     0 100% /snap/telegram-sergiusens/2
<lotuspsychje> ./dev/loop0          65M      65M     0 100% /snap/ubuntu-core/109
<lotuspsychje> morning nicomachus
<nicomachus> errr... yea, I suppose it is. haha
<nicomachus> 00:14 here
<lotuspsychje> oO
<lotuspsychje> 7h14
<nicomachus> working on my music library. all the tags got all messed up at some point...
<lotuspsychje> wich player
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: I run even tighter ,http://paste.ubuntu.com/16430616/ .
<nicomachus> well, it's the tags on the files themselves. but working with ncmpcpp right now because I'm doing it via ssh
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: so lower a new ssd to the 120gig evo 850 model perhaps for $$$?
<lotuspsychje> http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-2-5-Inch-Internal-MZ-75E120B-AM/dp/B00OAJ5N6I
<lotuspsychje> 66.80
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Well, yeah . I had considered .. my data partitions could reside on spinners . But the excess space might be nice for whatever comes in the future .
<nicomachus> !info ncmpcpp
<ubot5> ncmpcpp (source: ncmpcpp): ncurses-based client for the Music Player Daemon (MPD). In component universe, is optional. Version 0.7-1 (xenial), package size 676 kB, installed size 2573 kB
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: nice
<nicomachus> this says 0.7-1, my version is 0.7.3-1
<lotuspsychje> hmm
<nicomachus> I don't understand version numbering sometimes though
<lotuspsychje> !info ncmpcpp yakkety
<ubot5> 'yakkety' is not a valid distribution: kubuntu-backports, kubuntu-experimental, kubuntu-updates, partner, precise, precise-backports, precise-proposed, stable, testing, trusty, trusty-backports, trusty-proposed, unstable, utopic, utopic-backports, utopic-proposed, vivid, vivid-backports, vivid-proposed, wily, wily-backports, wily-proposed, xenial, xenial-backports, xenial-proposed
<nicomachus> ubottu needs an update
<lotuspsychje> dax: yakkety packages dont show correct here besides #ubuntu+1 ?
<nicomachus> odd, it does show on +1
<nicomachus> but we have ubot5, not ubottu
<lotuspsychje> yep
<nicomachus> I'm on xenial anyway
<lotuspsychje> bot might need a sync perhaps
<Bashing-om> spoke too wuick .. drive is going down " ata1.00: exception Emask 0x10 SAct 0x3fff80 SErr 0x1910000 action 0xe frozen
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: on a live?
<Bashing-om> going to shut down ,, and play with it tomorrow . night y guys . // maw this on the system at present on hard drive ." May 15 00:18:06 1404mini kernel: [ 6973.557635] ata1.00: failed command: WRITE FPDMA QUEUED " !
<nicomachus> hmmm.. can't get ncmpcpp to load my library.
<nicomachus> may just have to restore from a backup to get the tags sorted.
<EriC^^> nicomachus: try to just get the tag info and set it to the ones without tags
<nicomachus> It's all there... it just got a bit mixed up. So the track number is now the track title, the title is the album name, etc.
<nicomachus> a bit odd.
<nicomachus> ncmpcpp can fix it real easy, just gotta figure out why my library won't load up
<nicomachus> I've always had a bit of trouble getting it configured just right.
<nicomachus> version on my 15.10 laptop: 0.6.4
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<EriC^^> hi pauljw
<EriC^^> how's it going?
<pauljw> not bad EriC^^ , you?
<EriC^^> i'm ok
<EriC^^> it's crazy hot here today
<EriC^^> 34'c O.o
<EriC^^> it barely ever gets that hot during summer usually
<DJones> Sheesh, that'd kill me now, used to love heat, but now anything over about 10C starts causing problems
<pauljw> hope you can stay cool, we're having unseasonable cold here, 45F at the moment.
<EriC^^> yeah i have the a/c blasting full speed, i really wanted to work on the car though, planned to raise the front and put the front sway bar in
<EriC^^> i think it's called a strut brace
<EriC^^> i've had it on but not actually fit for a couple years and the strut is starting to crack, e30 bmw's are notorious for these
<pauljw> ahh, sounds like quite a project
<pauljw> i have so many garage projects that i need to do, first of which is clean the dang garage.  :)
<EriC^^> :)
<OerHeks> I really like the rain & snow, otherwise those garage projects litter outside
<OerHeks> good-morning or afternoon!
<pauljw> hi OerHeks
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<DaniKitten> Hi
<DaniKitten> Hello
<daftykins> bullet dodged.
<EriC^^> howdy daftykins
<daftykins> allo sir \o
<EriC^^> how's it going?
<daftykins> not bad thanks! i picked up a fancy new game for my PC today, didn't expect it to run too well until i replace my 2011 graphics card but wow, 14fps on all the low settings! :)
<EriC^^> cool
<daftykins> thankfully the latest generation nvidia cards get reviews out on Tuesday so i'll be excited to see those!
<EriC^^> which game?
<daftykins> Hitman :D
<EriC^^> cool
<EriC^^> that's an awesome series
<daftykins> yep! this new one looks amazing on the twitch streamer i've been watching play it, too
<BluesKaj> hey daftykins, EriC^^ hitman on ubuntu ?
<EriC^^> hey BluesKaj
<daftykins> BluesKaj: haha no, i don't run desktop Linux - Windows only game i think
 * tsimonq2 is on Unity 8 :D
<daftykins> DirectX 12 once i get a good card, too
<BluesKaj> just curious how fast some games are getting ported to linux after release
<BluesKaj> sticking with W7 on the laptop ...W10 is awful to look at
<daftykins> i like it! once i've tweaked it a bit :)
<daftykins> have to run 10 to get DirectX 12
<BluesKaj> what tweaks ? you must have the pro version
<Switches> daftykins: Windows! really, and I thought you were cool :p
<daftykins> Switches: i am! that's why i spend money on hardware and games, then don't cripple it with an OS that doesn't work with them, only to complain!
<BluesKaj> I keep windows around to help wife if she has a problem, replication helps fix it in most cases
<tsimonq2> daftykins: come on, at least dual-boot :P
<daftykins> BluesKaj: oh only personalisation stuff, like i'm not into the whole taskbar tile rubbish
<Switches> lol
<daftykins> but yeah my clients are mostly Windows based so it makes sense to stay where i need to support things :P
<tsimonq2> Grandma's computer upgraded to Windows 10, she was complaining so I put Kubuntu 16.04 on there :D
<BluesKaj> daftykins,  understood
<daftykins> i'm probably going to drop Â£300+ on a graphics card in the next 4 weeks or so, wouldn't make sense to cripple that with Linux ;)
<BluesKaj> how does Grandma like it
<Switches> daftykins: You just settle to "cripple" your hardware then, only messing mind you. Aslong as you enjoy it each to their own. I prefer gaming on Linux so don't buy games that don't support it.
<BluesKaj> tsimonq2,^
<tsimonq2> BluesKaj: she thinks it's better than Windows 10 XD
<Switches> You know the best thing that could happen... Halflife3 being made as SteamOS exclusive.. I can hear the Windows users screaming already xD
<BluesKaj> tsimonq2, great , wish i could talk wife into Linux. However the drawback is LOTRO won't work too well in wine despite the experiences some linux users     experiences
<daftykins> now that's a dead franchise, can't see Valve making anything decent if it ever did see the light of day
<tsimonq2> but yeah, I'm running Unity 8 right now, so I can write a review to put on my blog, my notes document is already up to 4 pages for thep ast 3 days I've been using it XD
<daftykins> Switches: understood, but i get annoyed by Linux community users who hold themselves back from choice solely down to these funny values
<Switches> Well it's more down to my dislike of MS ethics and business practices, spending 15yrs as an oem for them you get a not so nice wake up call
<tsimonq2> daftykins: one, I don't game, two, Linux is free, three, I can contribute
<tsimonq2> simple as that
<EriC^^> i'm helping this guy with his post windows install
<daftykins> o0
<EriC^^> grub-reinstallation
<daftykins> h
<daftykins> *ah
<EriC^^> apparently the uuid in fstab for the efi partition is different, i guess windows formatted it
<EriC^^> :D
<nicomachus> I thought ncmpcpp with mpd was supposed to be easy
<tsimonq2> daftykins: the only game I play when I'm really really REALLY bored is Minecraft, and they support Linux :D
<daftykins> sigh, my mechanical keyboard is no longer letting vowels work at random on different days
<Switches> But thats me personally. Others have faired way better. Plus until Vulkan becomes a "stable" reality a lot of AAA publishers wont look twice at linux
<BluesKaj> not a gamer either so my my time waster is fixing breakage on test OSs and support when I can
<daftykins> i am wondering when Doom will work with Vulkan
<tsimonq2> but don't get me started on FreeBSD :P
<Switches> daftykins: it already does, but its more a "tech demo" kind of thing, although from what i read it is totally playable
<BluesKaj> looks to me like the only thing that will keep MS alive 5 yrs from now is games
<daftykins> Switches: i really meant when it'd actually release with it
<Switches> Ahh
<daftykins> think i saw a Linux user in another channel whinging that ID didn't realise with it ;)
<Switches> daftykins: Well the basis is there so I would guess they just have to "switch it on" as it were
<tsimonq2> +1 BluesKaj
<Switches> id wont release anything for Linux aslong as Bethesda and Zenimax are pulling the strings
<Switches> They don't see a reason to do it. Which is understandable although a bit of a downer as I still play a lot of Doom3 and Quake lol
<BluesKaj> tsimonq2, and insitutions committed to server 2k and XP , like banks and  slow to adopt corporations
<tsimonq2> BluesKaj: yep
<daftykins> heh, i saw someone playing through doom3 before release of the latest recently... i was blown away by how bad it now looks in hindsight
<BluesKaj> my bank still runs W2k
 * tsimonq2 reminds everyone of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Qj8p-PEwbI
<Switches> Although I will admit I'm more interested at the moment in unreal tournament as that is already on Linux and playable
<daftykins> mmm i've had a couple of plays with the alpha
<Switches> The new UE4 engine Unreal Tournament that is
<Switches> yeah its great fun
<Switches> although the double jump has been changed a bit and feels weird to me
<BluesKaj> oops forgot to purge pulse ...brb
<DaniKitten> Hi
<DaniKitten> Hi
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-05-08
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<shrewdu> morning
<lotuspsychje> morning shrewdu
<Bashing-om> Good nite \o
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> working day guys
<lotuspsychje> have a nice one EriC^^ ducasse
<lotuspsychje> ; )
<ducasse> morning
<EriC^^> morning ducasse
<ducasse> \o EriC^^ - what's up?
<ducasse> everything well?
<EriC^^> not much, you?
<ducasse> watching a documentary on snowden, the 'escape to russia' thing.
<EriC^^> all good thanks
<EriC^^> cool
<ducasse> that documentary says some scary things about the kind of world we live in :-/
<EriC^^> yeah governments and such
<ducasse> mostly, having to rely on russia for protecting somebody's freedom :)
<ducasse> EriC^^: have you tested the artful isos yet?
<ducasse> (to get back nearer topic)
<EriC^^> nope what are those?
<EriC^^> ah the new release?
<EriC^^> !17.10
<ubot5> Ubuntu 17.10 (Artful Aardvark) will be the 27th release of Ubuntu.  It is due to be released in October 2017. Discussion in #ubuntu+1
<ducasse> yep.
<ducasse> i like the codename, best in a while :)
<Ben64> ooh
<Ben64> 18.04 breezy badger
<ducasse> :)
<lordievader> Good afternoon
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<lotuspsychje> good evening to all
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> hi lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey nacc
<nacc> morning
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/05/chuwi-lapbook-12-3-laptop-price-specs
<lotuspsychje> ubuntu showing up everywhere on devices
<\9> why must the laptops be so thin nowadays
<\9> o
<BluesKaj> cool factor promo...think it's silly
<\9> i'd prefer a bit sturdier design that doesn't require me to violently disassemble it to get the hard drive out
<lotuspsychje> for those business men that need leightweight :p
<\9> wimps
<lotuspsychje> but businessmen prob dont need ubuntu on it
<BluesKaj> they wouldn't know what ubuntu is anyway....they're so mainstream focused
<BluesKaj> they're just computers ...computers use Windows :-)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<\9> or they use macs instead of computers
<BluesKaj> follow the logic "-)
<BluesKaj> most business ppl use Windows afaik , macs are for the "creative crowd"
<lotuspsychje> is that still valid BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> who think paying thru the nose for all that proprietary stuff is cool because it's a mac
<lotuspsychje> have a mac for graphics design and moviecuttin?
<BluesKaj> drank the kool-ade
<lotuspsychje> whole world owns an iphone though
<BluesKaj> not here
<lotuspsychje> me neither
<BluesKaj> they're still phones to me .. all that software on a dinky screen
<lotuspsychje> handy for a fast google
<lotuspsychje> but danger for storing your whole life on it...
<lotuspsychje> https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/05/05/linux_alternatives_to_ubuntu/
<lotuspsychje> have a nice1 guys laterz
<nacc> Bashing-om: warning, they are a troll
<Bashing-om> nacc: Thanks for that heads up !
<nacc> Bashing-om: np
<nicomachus> uhhhhhh.... http://www.zdnet.com/article/canonical-starts-ipo-path/
<Bashing-om> This ^^ I gotta know !
<Bashing-om> so much for ubuntu always being "Free" - investors will want a return .
<ducasse> ugh :(
<akik> they're no longer trying to create their own ui, and then choose gnome shell as default?
<akik> i hope they give the DE choice during the install
<ducasse> why? they don't now - just use another installer.
<akik> it would make it easier for users
<ducasse> users having to make more selections make it easier?
<Bashing-om> I had no seen gnome in a while , was pleasantly surprised with gnome3 in 17.04 . Smooth .
<akik> yes
<tgm4883> lol
<tgm4883> no, giving users more options is not easier
<akik> it's just one more screen, select the ui you like the best
<tgm4883> which by definition, it 1 more choice than they have now in teh installer
<ducasse> akik: new users have no idea what that means or what the differences in those uis are
<tgm4883> I'd argue that adding a one page option in the installer is doing a disservice to all the DEs
<akik> "We're no longer trying to create our own interface. We'll support the existing ones -- KDE, MATE, Lxde -- but while all these desktops are great, GNOME presents the least change for users."
<tgm4883> I mean really, we're going to pick DEs based on a single screenshot now?
<akik> tgm4883: most of the users already know what they are
<ducasse> if you like kde more than gnome, then just use the kubuntu image - done. should that also have a page to select the ui?
<tgm4883> akik: then they can download the correct installer rather than have a ubiquity chooser
<akik> ok just my 0.02
<tgm4883> It seems silly to me to have the default ISO be 3GB because we want a DE chooser in the installer
<ducasse> making the installer more complicated in the process. the easy installer is a large part of why newbies use ubuntu.
 * Bashing-om recalls the shock and dismay that a lubuntu .iso would not decompress to a CD .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: the alternate should fit on a cd afaik
<Bashing-om> Uh Huh .. and the minimal is still doable .
<ducasse> for now, yes. dunno what will happen there with the new server installer etc...
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-05-09
<Bashing-om> nacc: IRT pilatus421 "status half-installed linux-headers-4.4.0-77-generic" have a bearing on configuring libapache2-mod-php7.0 ?
<nacc> Bashing-om: i think that it might have stopped apt, but i'm not sure
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> morning xangua Bashing-om
<xangua> Midnight ð
<Bashing-om> Hey lotuspsychje \o / Morn'n tes ?
<lotuspsychje> yeah coffee
<Bashing-om> coffee is GooD :)
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/05/mark-shuttleworth-on-state-of-ubuntu
<EriC^^> morning guys
<ducasse> morning, guys
<xangua> Why really and not very?
<lordievader> Good morning
<akik> shuttleworth said that canonical failed with ubuntu in personal computers :P
<akik> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/05/mark-shuttleworth-on-state-of-ubuntu
<ducasse> yep, lotus posted it this morning. i doubt that this is a good thing for desktop linux.
<akik> i got the same vibe from that as stephen elop's burning platform comment at nokia
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<ducasse> hi BluesKaj EriC^^
<BluesKaj> hi ducasse
<EriC^^> hi ducasse
<ducasse> we really need a new snap factoid
<Bashing-om> There's no place like home there's no like home; There's no place like Home .
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-05-10
<nacc> tgm4883: good luck with all the noise, i'm going outside ;)
<tgm4883> nacc: ha, trying to take advantage of this good weather?
<nacc> yep
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/05/ubuntus-default-gtk-theme-now-looks-better-gnome-shell
<lotuspsychje> morning ducasse
<ducasse> morning all
<jink> Morning, ducasse.
<jink> Hoi lotuspsychje. :)
<lotuspsychje> hey jink
<lotuspsychje> whats up?
<jink> Not much. :)
<ducasse> \o jink
<lotuspsychje> welcome Brokenoz
<Brokenoz> Hi there
<lordievader> Good morning
<ducasse> hi lordievader
<lordievader> Hey ducasse, how are you?
<sebsebseb> lordievader: hi
<ducasse> good thanks. how are you guys?
<ducasse> \o sebsebseb
<lordievader> Hey sebsebseb
<lordievader> Doing good here :)
<sebsebseb> ducasse: lordievader hi
<ducasse> lordievader: much to do today? i'm considering if i should order some more ram for this old laptop or just replace it.
<lordievader> Nah, the usual.
<lordievader> How much ram does it have?
<ducasse> just 4, i really need 8. i don't use it for much, but still.
<ducasse> my desktop has 32, so i've picked up a few bad habits ;)
<lordievader> How many times does it swap out stuff?
<ducasse> well, as of now i'm constantly having to consciously do something so it won't do just that.
<ducasse> if i just use it without considering memory use, it swaps all the time.
<EriC^^> hey guys
<ducasse> hi EriC^^
<EriC^^> ducasse: how's it going?
<ducasse> good thanks, and you?
<EriC^^> good thanks
<ducasse> plans for the day?
<EriC^^> trying to buy some bitcoin to get a vps and other stuff
<EriC^^> and going to change the fuel filter in my car and check the fuel pump's pressure
<EriC^^> you?
<ducasse> ah, nice. can't you just use paypal or something, though, or don't you want it traceable? ;)
<EriC^^> no paypal for us lebanese i'm afraid
<EriC^^> :D
<ducasse> got a visitor coming in ~1 hour, writing a script at the moment.
<EriC^^> i dont have a bank account in my own separate name yet too
<EriC^^> cool, i've finished that ppa thing last time
<lordievader> ducasse: Ah, I see. So you have the choice, change the habit or spend cash :P
<EriC^^> i might test it a lot more
<ducasse> oh, nice. does it work well?
<EriC^^> seems ok i guess, i did a little testing
<EriC^^> https://github.com/ej-112/ppa-tool.sh
<EriC^^> i've put some screenshots
<ducasse> lordievader: i've been offered a really cheap older thinkpad that would be perfect, with new battery and ssd.
<ducasse> lordievader: i think i'll just get that, it has 8gb.
<lordievader> The rest of the specs of your current laptop are too slow?
<ducasse> borderline. it has other issues also, like almost utterly dead battery.
<ducasse> EriC^^: looks good, i'll look closer at it later. :)
<EriC^^> ducasse: ok, cool :)
<sebsebseb> Really xchat or xchat Gnome is not in 17.04  repos? well not coming up in software anyway
<sebsebseb> wrong chan
<ducasse> been replaced by hexchat long ago.
<oerheks> yay, indeed, both xchats are gone
<lordievader> ducasse: Ah, yes. That is not very useful.
<sebsebseb> oerheks: you put yay as in you dont like them?
<oerheks> sebsebseb, no, i used xchat for years, but unmaintained, it should not be in the repos
<sebsebseb> oerheks: well its not anymore
<oerheks> downside of hexchat is you cannot block PM's
<sebsebseb> oerheks: i remember when it was like xchat sucks, konversation is better :d
<sebsebseb> oerheks: but various fanboys and ususlly newbies as well would be like no., so noob chat, i am talking 2009 or something here btw
<oerheks> 2009, that year i made the switch
<sebsebseb> to linux?
<oerheks> sebsebseb, jups
<sebsebseb> oh
<sebsebseb> 2004 for me
<sebsebseb> before ubuntu
<oerheks> as in switch to linux on my best pc
<sebsebseb> oerheks: ok
<riidom> Hi, what is a good launcher replacement for unity? I would like to have it either left or right side (no bottom or top), and it should allow nesting (e.g. one icon for "browsers", then all browser icons in a sub-window/-panel or alike), big plus would be: easy to config
<riidom> I'm basically happy with the default, just writing all these .desktop files feels cumbersome
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon to all
<EriC^^> afternoon lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
<EriC^^> what's up?
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: had a nice day at the beach
<EriC^^> nice
<lotuspsychje> sunny and shopping
<EriC^^> cool
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: you had plans today?
<EriC^^> not much bought some stuff for the car
<lotuspsychje> nice
<CoderEurope> https://www.fsf.org/resources/jobs/system-administrator-at-software-heritage-paris
<lotuspsychje> http://www.deviantart.com/art/E17-default-Shotscreen-on-UbuntuStudio-17-04-679243504
<lotuspsychje> evening baizon
<lotuspsychje> laterz guys
<immu> BluesKaj, ducasse
<immu> hi
<ducasse> \o
<immu> whats up
<Bashing-om> tgm4883: Did he have to loose sleep in order to come up with this means to annoy you ?
<tgm4883> lol
<tgm4883> This is precisely why we need to keep children away from eating paint
<Bashing-om> tgm4883: One good explanation then is also, huffing gas . ( no good deed goes unpunished ??)
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-05-11
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Bashing-om> Too slow to hold my attention . g nite all
<ducasse> hi everyone
<lordievader> Good morning.
<jink> 'sup, kids? :)
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse lordievader jink
<ducasse> \o lordievader, jink
<jink> Lekker geslapen? :)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> yes i did
<jink> Good for you. :)
<ducasse> morning, lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> going out for breakfast
<lotuspsychje> laterz guys
<jink> Heh.
<oerheks> jink.net
<oerheks> jink.net
<oerheks> oops, paste
<lordievader> Hey ducasse
<lordievader> Hey jink
<lordievader> Hey oerheks
<lordievader> How are you all?
<oerheks> Still ugly, but fine
<ducasse> enjoying a quiet morning with my tea here, trying to find some music
<jink> oerheks: Paste away. :P
<ducasse> oerheks: have you tried the free landscape service?
<oerheks> ducasse, nope, still have no usercase or test for that, nor enough hardware :-(
<ducasse> i was just wondering if it can be set up for non-lts clients, or if everything has to be lts only...
<oerheks> good question, not sure about that
<oerheks> i would say it does not matter
<oerheks> maybe a mix can give troubles, or maybe that is allowed too
<ducasse> it would be nice to be familiar with it, at the very least enough to help people with basic questions. like mine :)
<ducasse> was thinking of setting it up on the server and have a few vm clients.
<oerheks> Same here, openstack, juju, landscape, chef/puppet and more
 * oerheks has got a server ready with 7 hdd's and 4 sataports
<oerheks> :-(
<ducasse> i had the exact same problem, and found some very nice pcie sata controllers in a webshop here
<oerheks> just a luxury problem :-D
<oerheks> had a lot of spare disks
<ducasse> indeed :)
<oerheks> running to the store to get soap for cleaning windows, brb
 * lordievader only has 5 drives in his server
<lordievader> That it accounts for ~9Tb is something else ;)
<oerheks> This is my added software list, any suggestions? http://paste.ubuntu.com/24553547/
<oerheks> oh, i have 2x 500, 2 x 400 and some 250 disks
<oerheks> I planned to do some experience with LVM, i think it is ideal wit this bunch of hdd's
<lotuspsychje> good noon to all
<EriC^^> afternoon lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
<EriC^^> how's it going?
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: great, been out on breakfast watching some trailers now
<EriC^^> cool
<lotuspsychje> sleepless playing in our theaters
<lotuspsychje> but imdb shows 5.6
<lotuspsychje> and fast n furious 8..not for me
<EriC^^> aha
<EriC^^> lol there's a movie, the fast n the ...
<EriC^^> fierce!
<EriC^^> imdb 2.8 :D
<lotuspsychje> yeah saw that somewhere lol
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: did you see assasins creed?
<EriC^^> nope
<lotuspsychje> me neither
<lotuspsychje> hmm 6/10
<lotuspsychje> when are they going to make decent movies again
<lotuspsychje> hey brunch875
<EriC^^> yeah not much coming out lately
<brunch875> g'morning lotuspsychje!
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: horrible
<lotuspsychje> !info linux-image-generic xenial
<ubot5> linux-image-generic (source: linux-meta): Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version 4.4.0.77.83 (xenial), package size 2 kB, installed size 13 kB
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
<EriC^^> hi BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hi lotuspsychje, EriC^^
<lotuspsychje> !info cockpit
<ubot5> Package cockpit does not exist in xenial
<lotuspsychje> !info cockpit zesty
<ubot5> cockpit (source: cockpit): User interface for Linux servers. In component universe, is optional. Version 138-1 (zesty), package size 13 kB, installed size 48 kB
<lotuspsychje> http://phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-Cockpit
<lotuspsychje> looks pretty neat
<lotuspsychje> one for you BluesKaj http://www.deviantart.com/art/Debian-9-Testing-AMD64-KDE-Plasma-5-679843492
<ducasse> "excellent! now i no longer need to rtfm!" <-- a dumb user deciding he's now an admin
<lotuspsychje> lol
<ducasse> the problem with those webuis is that they make any idiot think he can admin complex services, so any idiot decides to do so.
<ducasse> and we end up with an internet full of wide open, unsecured web and mail servers
<BluesKaj> lotuspsychje,  this is one of my desktops on debian 9 http://imgur.com/0Dddaoo
<lotuspsychje> lets c
<BluesKaj> no icons on the desktop , prefer quicklaunch for my favs
<lotuspsychje> nice1 BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> lotuspsychje,  well, it works :-)
<lotuspsychje> thats good :p
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/05/libreoffice-5-3-3-released-works-better-microsoft-office-documents
<lotuspsychje> if users can get a 'latest' snap, it means our !latest policy is not very true anymore?
<lotuspsychje> someonce could install a latest snap lets say on an 'older' ubuntu version
<lotuspsychje> and still remain 'stable'
<oerheks> someone has to build the snap, maybe the source is not the latest too
<nacc> sorry, lost internet, what's the discussion snaps?
<nacc> *on snaps
<lotuspsychje> nacc: <lotuspsychje> if users can get a 'latest' snap, it means our !latest policy is not very true anymore?
<nacc> lotuspsychje: correct
<nacc> and a confined snap contains all its dependencies by default
<oerheks> "LibreOffice Works Better with Microsoft Office Documents"  .. emacs, here i come
<lotuspsychje> hehe
<nacc> classic snaps are a bit of a hodgepodge
<lotuspsychje> whats hodge mean?
<nacc> lotuspsychje: hodgepodge = confusing mixture
<nacc> i think classic snaps have fewer rules
<lotuspsychje> right
<lotuspsychje>  <lotuspsychje> !ubports is UBports is a team of developers and a meeting place for developers that wish to port Ubuntu Touch to as many devices as possible. Visit https://ubports.com/ for more info
<lotuspsychje> <lotuspsychje> <ubottu> Your edit request has been forwarded to #ubuntu-ops.  Thank you for your attention to detail
<lotuspsychje> requested this trigger, good idea?
<Mr_0> (j #ubuntu
<Mr_0> ...
<Mr_0> testing out irssi after many years abstinence... :) and typing too fast
<Mr_0> hi all
<Mr_0> 0/
<lotuspsychje> hey Menzador
<Menzador> What's up
<lotuspsychje> nothing much
<Menzador> I'm surprised there's no indignation over Canonical's IPO
<nacc> full disclosure, i'm a canonical employee, but is it really that surprising? rh is also public
<Menzador> I'm not, and, frankly, I'm surprised that until now Canonical wasn't a publicly traded company from the out-and-out
<nacc> Menzador: yeah
<nacc> at least in the US, it's also sort of the goal for many companies/startups
<Menzador> UK Ltd. == US LLC in most cases
<Menzador> Generally publicâ companies are plc's over there
<nacc> Menzador: ah makes sense
<Menzador> So basically Canonical Ltd. become Canonical plc in legal terms
<lotuspsychje> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om baizon
<baizon> ;(
<lotuspsychje> baizon: no ryzen?
<baizon> no :(
<baizon> and no info about the status :(
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: I be in that process of getting my support act together :)
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: prepare, as the questions of a lifetime comming up!
<Bashing-om> Oh Yes ! Boy Scout motto applies :P // ubuntuforums looks down to me . any info on the outage ?
<lotuspsychje> baizon: once day..a package at your door :p
<baizon> i really hope
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: we had all kinds of issues today
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: specific and random problems
<Bashing-om> Well, I be in the saddle shortly .. I be ready to ride em out .. see what my day brings :)
<ducasse> hi Bashing-om, wb :)
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Is good to be here and in such good company :)
<EriC^^>  #linux
<immu> BluesKaj, ducasse hi
<immu> https://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-is-bringing-ubuntu-suse-and-fedora-to-the-windows-store
<oerheks> What is next? windows supporting ext4?
<immu> oerheks, maybe :)
<ducasse> oerheks: 'ms ubuntu 18.04 big bucks' ;)
<immu> what about Suse & Fedora
<ducasse> what about them?
<immu> they two be available along with Ubuntu but in what form thats not know yet @ducasse
<Bashing-om> !de
<ubot5> In den meisten Ubuntu-KanÃ¤len wird nur Englisch gesprochen. FÃ¼r deutschsprachige Hilfe besuche bitte #ubuntu-de, #kubuntu-de, #edubuntu-de oder #ubuntu-at. Einfach "/join #ubuntu-de" eingeben. Danke fÃ¼r Dein VerstÃ¤ndnis!
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-05-12
<JanC> it's just different userlands for their linux subsystem, I'm sure
<JanC> which in Windows 10 is replacing their older UNIX/POSIX subsystem
<Mr_0> mornin'
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Mr_0> mornin' lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey Mr_0
<lotuspsychje> Mr_0: what timezone are you in?
<Mr_0> hmm...gmt +2? Norway anyways..same as Amsterdam
<Mr_0> and you lotuspsychje ?
<JanC> CEST
<Mr_0> ah
<JanC> (aka Central European Summer Time)
<Mr_0> yep you got it
<Mr_0> morning JanC :)
<lotuspsychje> Mr_0: cool! im brussels timezone
<lotuspsychje> Mr_0: ducasse is also from norway
<Mr_0> ah hello fellow european :)
<lotuspsychje> morning wafflejock and JanC
<Mr_0> ah cool
 * Mr_0 sips more coffey, waiting for kids to wake up
<Mr_0> a bit to early here....should be coffee ;)
<lotuspsychje> coffee & irc mmm perfect!
<Mr_0> indeed :D
<lotuspsychje> Mr_0: what do they kids think of dad on linux?
<lotuspsychje> they think its cool?
<Mr_0> also some pianosessions from Nils Fhram
<Mr_0> heh...not my kids...tho I have one on the way. They are mesmerized by the scrolling text in irssi and my dual screens lotuspsychje ;)
<lotuspsychje> haha
<Mr_0> :)
<lotuspsychje> congrats with the new kid Mr_0
<Mr_0> thanks lotuspsychje :) we are pretty exited ;)
<Mr_0> you got any kids lotuspsychje ?
<lotuspsychje> Mr_0: no
<Mr_0> I'm 37 so it was about time ;)
<lotuspsychje> 40 here
<Mr_0> ah oldie linux user?
<Mr_0> hehe ;)
<lotuspsychje> yep
<Mr_0> :)
<lotuspsychje> started with an old redhat something on gnome
<Mr_0> i started with redhat around 2002
<Mr_0> snap
<Mr_0> :)
<lotuspsychje> hehe
<Mr_0> cool lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> had to fight hours to get internet working at that time
<Mr_0> yep
<lotuspsychje> but the coolness of linux triggered me alot
<Mr_0> yes same here, always liked it :)
<Mr_0> tho it was a bigger struggle back then
<lotuspsychje> it had something 'spacy'
<Mr_0> ;)
<lotuspsychje> like a cockpit of a spaceship lol
<Mr_0> haha yes
<lotuspsychje> Mr_0: these days i got ubuntu installed on all my machines, and started an ubuntu business
<Mr_0> wow cool lotuspsychje  :)
<lotuspsychje> Mr_0: what distro are you on?
<lotuspsychje> check your invite Mr_0
<Mr_0> well...ubuntu really..but it is peppermint...just installed the pkg's so it works as ubuntu
<wafflejock> hiya lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> Mr_0: nice
<lotuspsychje> 85mb update this morning guys
<lotuspsychje> !info firefox xenial
<ubot5> firefox (source: firefox): Safe and easy web browser from Mozilla. In component main, is optional. Version 53.0.2+build1-0ubuntu0.16.04.2 (xenial), package size 47133 kB, installed size 111982 kB
<lotuspsychje> !info childsplay | Mr_0 for the kid(s)
<ubot5> Mr_0 for the kid(s): childsplay (source: childsplay): Suite of educational games for young children. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.6.5-1 (xenial), package size 19818 kB, installed size 27323 kB
<lordievader> Good morning
<lotuspsychje> morning lordievader
<ducasse> morning, guys
<lordievader> Hey lotuspsychje, ducasse. How are you two?
<ducasse> barely awake, overslept a bit today :) and you, lordievader?
<lordievader> Bit tired, but nothing coffee cannot fix.
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
<lordievader> Though of trying out Matrix's home server.
<lotuspsychje> rainy day here
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: that looks interesting, just looked it up
<ducasse> lordievader: ^^
<lordievader> The talk at FOSDEM was quite interesting.
<ducasse> i assume they hope this will be a major player in both text chat, video calls etc? any other interesting functions?
<lotuspsychje> breakfast bbl
<ducasse> enjoy
<lordievader> From what I've heared yesterday it is growing quite rapidly. The main matrix channel, when compared to IRC channels, is the third largest or so.
<lordievader> The main thing is that it connects different protocols together.
<lordievader> For the user the different protocols become transparent.
<ducasse> i see, so a new protocol is just a plugin?
<lordievader> Sort of, I don't know the full details, but that is how I understood it.
<lordievader> You can try it out here: https://riot.im/app/
<ducasse> i was looking at it now :) also checking out the homeserver, this is interesting stuff. they even have a weechat plugin! \o/
<lordievader[m]> Hello
<lordievader> \o/
<lotuspsychje> oi
<lotuspsychje> matrix shell
<lordievader> Cool, that works :D
<lotuspsychje> welcome tarzeau
<tarzeau> re
<lotuspsychje> welcome fr0tzed
<fr0tzed> hi
<lotuspsychje> welcome scythefwd
<scythefwd> hola
<tarzeau> fr0tzed: is that my? desktop?
<lordievader[m]> ducasse: the nice thing is that it gives you push notifications to your phone
<fr0tzed> no the cannel
<tarzeau> fr0tzed: nope, my desktops look like this: http://www.aiei.ch/gnustep/screenshots/ and http://www.aiei.ch/gnustep/www.levenez.com/
<lordievader[m]> We were talking about that yesterday, that 'normal' irc bouncers don't do that.
<tarzeau> no i don't have any channels
<scythefwd> I keep trying to get lighter and lighter with my wdm.. right now I keep going back and forth between cinnimon and mate for my dm
<fr0tzed> you always upload ss of your desktop
<tarzeau> fr0tzed: the one with ubuntu/unity is the one for @work, for our users (~1200)
<fr0tzed> ah ok
<tarzeau> that's what they get when they get their account sheet, and login by default
<scythefwd> so you're using it in an enterprise environment?
<tarzeau> (meanwhile it's a single icon for system stuff (with right mouse button, context menu) and one for science)
<fr0tzed> im not using ubuntu on this laptop :$
<scythefwd> how are you maintaining sw baselines for patching?
<tarzeau> scythefwd: yes
<tarzeau> scythefwd: we run dphys-config and aptitude-robot for the configuration and security updates
<tarzeau> and maintain a /opt with scientific software (mathematica, maple, matlab, nonfree stuff) and the rest gets packaged into debian, then moves to ubuntu
<tarzeau> (largetifftools, gnudatalanguage, form, lie, just to name a few)
<tarzeau> about 120 workstations
<scythefwd> oh, thats not that bad then..
<scythefwd> I wasnt the admin of it, but we used puppet.. and it looked like a lot more work than it should have been
<tarzeau> no, especially we have some very powerful machines (one with 512 GB memory :)
<scythefwd> thats not bad.. virtualization host?
<fr0tzed> that is some fast shit right here
<tarzeau> yeah we also looked at puppet, and it's not like unix, easy and simple
<tarzeau> puppet is like samba configuration, and the real unix way would be nfs /etc/exports
<scythefwd> we had it on a hadoop cluster with something like 120 nodes
<tarzeau> dphys-config was done with the unix way in mind
<lordievader[m]> Puppet is quite nice though, especially  when combined with Foreman.
<tarzeau> one line, one thing. just works(tm)
<lotuspsychje> !info puppet
<ubot5> puppet (source: puppet): configuration management system, agent. In component universe, is optional. Version 3.8.5-2ubuntu0.1 (xenial), package size 12 kB, installed size 59 kB
<tarzeau> !info dphys-config
<ubot5> dphys-config (source: dphys-config): Tool to distribute config files. In component universe, is optional. Version 20130301~current-1 (xenial), package size 42 kB, installed size 182 kB
<fr0tzed> hey thats a nice bot
<tarzeau> !info aptitude-robot
<ubot5> aptitude-robot (source: aptitude-robot): Automate package choice management. In component universe, is extra. Version 1.4-1 (xenial), package size 23 kB, installed size 79 kB
<tarzeau> and we're monitoring actively services/hosts https://xymon.phys.ethz.ch/xymon/xymon.html
<tarzeau> and the installation of a computer is fully automatic, from netboot with pxe, meanwhile ipxe, and preseeding and disk configuration, filesystems, os install...
<tarzeau> gbit internet connected, no firewall
<fr0tzed> no firewall?
<tarzeau> unfortunately we don't get 10gbit in the offices, only server rooms
<tarzeau> yes, no firewall. we want to work :)
<tarzeau> all with public ips
<scythefwd> we had a few hosts that were running 32 procs with 256 gb of ram on em
<fr0tzed> opsec opsec opsec
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/05/ubuntu-is-coming-to-windows-store
<fr0tzed> ubuntu in windows wtf
<scythefwd> yeah, is that like a vm or more of teh bash on windows .. haven tfound any more info on it
<fr0tzed> ah ok, not using windows at all
<scythefwd> I go back and forth.. I'm a windows sys admin for a living, and for some things I feel it has it right, other things.. not so much
<lotuspsychje> i dont like that MS loves linux story at all
<lotuspsychje> surely a comerical trick to gain popularity
<tarzeau> i wonder when people start using swift on linux...
<scythefwd> they've had a linux team for years..
<fr0tzed> ms win10 is the shittiest of them all
<scythefwd> like pre sco unix trying to rape ibm days
<scythefwd> why do you say that fr0tzed?
<fr0tzed> have you worked with it scythefwd ?
<scythefwd> yeah, I have
<fr0tzed> well than you knonw what im talking about
<fr0tzed> first of all lets start with the privacy policies
<scythefwd> both in a small environment of about 2k hosts.. and were looking at deploying to a 20k user environment
<scythefwd> hehe.. we lock that down by policy.. drop it on the domain and the security software gets installed..
<fr0tzed> may the lord be with u
<scythefwd> lol
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
<fr0tzed> win7 is the best in my opinion
<EriC^^> hey lotuspsychje
<fr0tzed> no marketing bullshit
<scythefwd> they were "smart" about it.. using port 80 for a lot of the comms
<fr0tzed> really smart
<scythefwd> you mean the ads?  Those are easy to shut off man
<fr0tzed> not the only the ads
<scythefwd> I'd walk ya through it.. but I'm not on my windows boxen
<fr0tzed> they sell your shit
<lotuspsychje> fr0tzed: keep the channel familly friendly plz
<fr0tzed> lotuspsychje, i am frinedly :)
<scythefwd> true.. I'm guessing your not running an android phone, done use google or bing or yahoo search and wont touch apple devices right?
<fr0tzed> i am that guy yes hahaha
<fr0tzed> well i have a iphone because its more secure than android phones :)
<scythefwd> I'm the guy with a 32gb card in my phone.. have less than 10 aps on it lol
<fr0tzed> haha
<fr0tzed> Dont trust those companies
<scythefwd> I'm using.. .. 10 gb storage lol
<fr0tzed> 32 storage on my phone thats enough
<scythefwd> ok..brain farting. human readable disk utilization in cli?
<fr0tzed> Sinds i read the books of  glenn greenwald and others. getting a bit paranoide
<fr0tzed> hehe
<scythefwd> and how do I interrupt and kill a program in cli vs. just moving it to a background process?
<fr0tzed> pkill pgrep
<scythefwd> I know kill -9 pid..
<scythefwd> thought there was a simpler way than doing a ps -e |grep  .. especially when I dont know the process name .. just what the gui says it is
<fr0tzed> best way to kill ur process is rm -rf /
<fr0tzed> :)
<lotuspsychje> fr0tzed: dont paste such commands in here plz
<scythefwd> got to do that once.. wasn't nearly as fun as I thought it was
<fr0tzed> lotuspsychje, we all know that its a joke right
<scythefwd> had to blow the box away anyways.. it didnt touch /boot or the kernel
<fr0tzed> rip
<fr0tzed> gotta go boys, back in 15 min
<ducasse> fr0tzed: it's still not allowed, everyone might not know that
<fr0tzed> Ah ok srry
<scythefwd> the funny thing was.. we had a bunch of linux admins around me.. I was like guys... I always wanted to try this.. I'm gonna do the forbidden command.. and next thing i know.. 5 admins hovering.. they never saw it done either
<scythefwd> so.. I've been test driving linux for a week this time.. only booting into windows to access sites that required my pki certs.. to dl the installer to get my linux using my pki (hows that for irony.. usually I boot into linux to get my windows running)
<scythefwd> and I'm satisfied the gui is mostly sufficient for the grandma and grandpa type home user.. where do I go now to play with it cli only.. any suggetions? (yes, I know, yall are biased .. obvious answer is ubuntu server right?0
<fr0tzed> yeah ubuntu server
<fr0tzed> or boot desktop into cli
<fr0tzed> get cheap vps and play with it
<scythefwd> vps?
<fr0tzed> virtual private server?
<scythefwd> ah, a vm
<fr0tzed> or get a raspberry pi
<fr0tzed> i use raspberry pi alot for testing stuff and exploring new things
<scythefwd> I'll spin up a vm on my desktop.. it should be sufficient to handle the load
<fr0tzed> or a vm indeed
<scythefwd> I think I can spare a core or two and 16gb of ram.. that will work for a core install right? O:-)
<fr0tzed> how much ram you got jesus
<scythefwd> 32 gb
<scythefwd> specifically for doing vm's
<fr0tzed> 4x8 nice
<scythefwd> I'll drop down my running services to pretty much bare minimum, then fire up two or 3 vms to play with
<fr0tzed> what are you running? windows right
<scythefwd> the os claims I have 8 cpus.. really just 4 with HT
<scythefwd> depends on my mood
<fr0tzed> dual boot?
<scythefwd> but I generally run windows on that box, linux or windows on the laptop
<fr0tzed> ah ok
<scythefwd> osx on another
<scythefwd> I try to stay os agnostic for the most part
<scythefwd> had a server for a while that was running ms hyperv server.. its like an esxi server.. but windows based lol
<scythefwd> had an install size of a whopping 125mb? or was it 225?
<fr0tzed> havent work with hyperv for a long time mostly use esxi
<fr0tzed> https://gfycat.com/SecretSimilarDuckbillplatypus
<scythefwd> has come a long way from version 2 to version 3.. massive improvement, still has some work to do
<fr0tzed> switching like every week from os on my pc
<scythefwd> lol.. wonder what interface he had on the backgroun lighting
<fr0tzed> looks pretty cool
<fr0tzed> but I wont use it
<fr0tzed> seems anoying
<scythefwd> yup.. the flashing would be annoying.. just wondering if hes using one of the smart led bulbs.. the ones that had the bash vulnerability in them
<fr0tzed> maybe
<immu> ducasse, EriC^^
<lotuspsychje> !info linux-image-generic xenial
<ubot5> linux-image-generic (source: linux-meta): Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version 4.4.0.77.83 (xenial), package size 2 kB, installed size 13 kB
<lotuspsychje> hey brunch875
<brunch875> good late morning!
<brunch875> almost half may already, time surely flies
<lotuspsychje> yeah almost summertime
<scythefwd> man.. I'm gonna be hurting today.. gotta be at work in 3.5 hours
 * lordievader[m] has just updated his kernel to 4.11.0
<scythefwd> peace folks.. gonna go try and sleep for a couple before I have to adult
<brunch875> what's new in 4.11?
<lordievader[m]> Haven't really looked. Hoped it would solve my random locking problems.
<CoderEurope> lordievader[m], what locking problems ? What os / DE you usin' ?
<CoderEurope> lordievader[m], hello ?
<lordievader[m]> Gentoo/Plasma5, from one moment to the other, poof. frozen.
<lordievader[m]> Must say I have not done any investigation ;)
<CoderEurope> gentoo - is sabyon .
<CoderEurope> plasma 5 is kde neon
<lordievader[m]> I believe it is the other way around.
<CoderEurope> how to kde neon plasma 5 ?
<lordievader[m]> No, plasma 5 is the name of the DE. KDE Neon is an implementation.
<CoderEurope> lordievader[m], your complicating things.
<lordievader[m]> Erm, no?
<CoderEurope> use sabyon - or ubuntu
<lordievader[m]> No, have used Kubuntu in the past, switched for good reasons.
<lordievader[m]> I'm satisfied with Gentoo.
<lotuspsychje> welcome TomyWork
<TomyWork> hi
<brunch875> lordievader[m], is much knowledge required to use Gentoo?
<lotuspsychje> some ops are active in here also TomyWork
<brunch875> I might give it a go some day
<CoderEurope> lordievader[m], https://youtu.be/37mWf_MAeJM?t=1m5s
<lordievader[m]> brunch875: At first it might be a bit daunting, but you do learn a lot about how Linux works.
<lordievader[m]> CoderEurope: ?
<lordievader[m]> brunch875: The documentation is quite well written, so if you follow that you should be fine.
<brunch875> lordievader[m], I'm fine as long as stuff doesn't break all the time and it doesn't need constant hackery
<lordievader[m]> brunch875: It ain't arch :P
 * brunch875 chuckles
<ducasse> lordievader[m]: as a long-time bsd user, gentoo is nice :) i still prefer arch now, though.
<lordievader[m]> ducasse: To each their own ;)
<brunch875> I was wondering if I should do LFS first
<lordievader[m]> Haven't done LFS myself, but I see the installation as the Gentoo install without the nice tools.
<lordievader[m]> ducasse: if you do try it out, let me know of your experience
<ducasse> lordievader[m]: try out what - lfs?
<lordievader[m]> Yes, I'd like to know how difficult it is/how much you are left to yourself.
<lordievader[m]> Hihihi: https://imgur.com/gallery/YPEpj
<ducasse> hehe - nice :)
<BluesKaj> Howdy folks
<ducasse> lordievader[m]: i tried lfs out years ago, you are really on your own. imo i wouldn't use it on anything i intend to use daily, but it's interesting for building a specialized system etc.
<ducasse> \o BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> hi ducasse
<lordievader[m]> ducasse: I see
<lordievader[m]> Hey BluesKaj
<lordievader[m]> How are you doing?
<BluesKaj> hi lordievader[m] , ok here, and you?
<lordievader[m]> Doing good here :)
<ducasse> lordievader[m]: it's not really difficult as long as you either know what you're doing or are willing to read docs, but it can be a bit fiddly (if you understand what i mean).
<lordievader[m]> Oh yeah.
<ducasse> lots of little things you need to think about that would normally be invisible, more or less.
<lordievader[m]> Little things like?
<ducasse> lordievader[m]: take a look at the index here, it's a ton of things. http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/lfs/view/stable/
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
<lordievader[m]> Uch, the menu alreadly looks like too much work.
<ducasse> you normally don't think about what options to build ncurses with, for example
<lordievader[m]> True, in Gentoo the default use flags are usually sufficient.
<ducasse> right. this is what you do if you need to tune every little thing, and that's what i meant by 'fiddly'
<lordievader[m]> Right, I get it now.
<ducasse> it's not really well suited for a daily driver, imo. for that custom box in a closet that monitors whatever, sure.
<ducasse> oerheks: how relevant do you think that bug report is now, will the desktop continue to be a first-class citizen at canonical? i'm not entirely convinced of that...
<oerheks> me too, i asked SABDFL about adding android to that bugreport, it is declined
<ducasse> lol
<ducasse> oerheks: out of the areas they said are now the focus it seemed to be almost all server stuff, with iot as a footnote
<CoderEurope> maybe i shouldn't ask toddy
<lotuspsychje> https://arstechnica.com/security/2017/05/the-hijacking-flaw-that-lurked-in-intel-chips-is-worse-than-anyone-thought/
<lotuspsychje> the whole world is one big backdoor
<fr0tzed> sup
<EriC^^> j #ubuntu
<lordievader[m]> Hey EriC^^
<EriC^^> hey lordievader[m]
<lordievader[m]> How are you doing?
<EriC^^> good thanks, yourself?
<lordievader[m]> Bit tired, other than that doing good :)
<EriC^^> good :)
<immu> ducasse,hi
<CoderEurope> dell lappies are trending again on feebay [ 05Dell ] | https://www.ebay.co.uk/trending
<CoderEurope> dunno if people shall wake up the dell PPA again thru this ?
<immu> .
<CoderEurope> Kubuntu testing day | 20:00 UTC today | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHZAH8SZD4E freenode #ubuntu-on-air
<immu> .
<EriC^^> hey immu
<EriC^^> how's it going?
<immu> hey eric
<immu> i am cool
<immu> watchig tv
<immu> ducasse, hi
<scythefwd> anyone use docky?
<lotuspsychje> not me
<Bashing-om> nor me ^
<lotuspsychje> !info docky | scythefwd mean this right?
<ubot5> scythefwd mean this right?: docky (source: docky): Elegant, powerful, clean dock. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.2.1.1-1 (xenial), package size 609 kB, installed size 3329 kB
<scythefwd> yes
<lotuspsychje> scythefwd: what about it?
<scythefwd> installed it, no docklets installed
<lotuspsychje> scythefwd: okay?
<scythefwd> trying to find out how to install them
<lotuspsychje> scythefwd: for ubuntu questions you can join #ubuntu right
<scythefwd> didnt think this was as much ubuntu related as its not part of the default distro install
<lotuspsychje> scythefwd: well if docky hasnt a special channel or so, it still is an official ubuntu package, so its supported
<scythefwd> gotcha
<lotuspsychje> scythefwd: but maybe this can help? http://wiki.go-docky.com/index.php%3Ftitle%3DList_of_docklets
<scythefwd> lists them, but doesnt show how to install them
<lotuspsychje> its been a long time i played with it
<ducasse> scythefwd: did you look in /usr/share/docs/docky, for instance? might be something there. or search for a homepage or archive of it. but lotus is right, this isn't a support channel.
<scythefwd> thats what I'm doing now is pouring over the wiki
<scythefwd> well, off to #ubuntu
<lotuspsychje> evening xangua
<xangua> Hey
<xangua> No word on #yunit for days
<lotuspsychje> xangua: #ubports pretty dead calm aswell...
<lotuspsychje> hmmm alot of flickering issues these days in main
<ducasse> seems to be with later intel systems, often
<lotuspsychje_> we had an amd guy this morning also
<lotuspsychje_> with an R9 card
<lotuspsychje> nite
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-05-13
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> working day guys
<lotuspsychje> have a nice1
<ducasse> morning, everyone
<lordievader[m]> Morning
<EriC^^> morning lorde
<EriC^^> lordievader[m] :)
<EriC^^> how are you doing?
<lordievader[m]> Hey Eric^^, doing good here. How are you?
<EriC^^> doing good thanks
<lordievader[m]> Cool :)
<EriC^^> :)
<ducasse> morning EriC^^ lordievader[m]
<EriC^^> morning ducasse
<ducasse> need more tea, brb :)
<ducasse> seen this? https://arstechnica.com/security/2017/05/hp-laptops-covert-log-every-keystroke-researchers-warn/
<EriC^^> yikes
<ducasse> we need to remember what these companies are willing to do to us, their customers, the next time we need to buy a laptop.
<EriC^^> i think it's a stupid mistake in this case
<EriC^^> it's supposed to wait for some keyboard input to do something, it erases the log at reboot, it's still dumb though
<ducasse> it's either utterly braindead and the developers who are responsible should be fired, or pretty sneaky.
<ducasse> but it's not as bad as the superfish thing, no.
<EriC^^> what superfish?
<ducasse> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superfish#Lenovo_security_incident
<EriC^^> lol
<ducasse> _that_, my friend, is how you do dumb :)
<immu> ducasse, hi :) again
<ducasse> \o
<CoderEurope> ducasse, goo-afternoon duders !
<ducasse> hi CoderEurope :)
<immu> what is the state of Ubuntu 17.10?
<ducasse> 'under development'
<CoderEurope> would Artful Aaardvark be in development, then ?
<ducasse> that's 17.10, yes
<immu> its to early, say two weeks in development
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<CoderEurope> BluesKaj, oh hai o/
<BluesKaj> CoderEurope,  Hi
<CoderEurope> BluesKaj, what are you listening to at the moment ?
<BluesKaj> nothing
<CoderEurope> bye then :(
<BluesKaj> I don't listen much when I'm online
<ducasse> \o BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> hi ducasse
<ducasse> what's up? everything well in your corner of the world?
<oerheks> heya ducasse BluesKaj
<oerheks> just tried to buy flowers for mothersday tomorrow,.... all nice flowers are sold out :-(
<BluesKaj> well, sort of..fighting a cold atm, but otherwise ok
<BluesKaj> hi oerheks
<BluesKaj> ducasse,  how about you?
<ducasse> afternoon, oerheks - find a nice present instead?
<oerheks> ducasse, nope, so i'll go to the other side of town, with my neighbour, soon.
<oerheks> But my mom does not really care about mothersday/birthday anyway
<ducasse> BluesKaj: good, thanks, keeping busy.
<ducasse> oerheks: nor does my mother, and she lives far enough away that i can't easily get there with flowers/present anyway.
<oerheks> oh, fleurop delivery is an option too
<oerheks> good thinking !
<EriC^^> o/ ducasse BluesKaj oerheks
<BluesKaj> Hi EriC^^
<ducasse> not an option for mine, unfortunately, this is deep boondocks territory.
<EriC^^> how are you doing?
<ducasse> hi EriC^^
<DJones> oerheks: Hopefully the bot will stay gone, I've removed & set +q on the ip address
<oerheks> DJones, thank you
<DJones> If you see it again, doen't hesitate to  shout up, I may be gardening but somebody else should spot it
<oerheks> i reported this hours ago in -ops ... i forgot about it as ubottu is not frequently used
<DJones> I only saw it about an hour later, thought somebody had dealt with it
<DJones> Ah well, better go kill some weeds
<oerheks> :-)
<oerheks> DJones, harvest the common dandelion first, it is a nice lettuce replacement
<oerheks> also known as spring-salad ( translated from dutch)
<ducasse> EriC^^: what do you think of guardians of the galaxy? debating if i should watch it tonight...
<BluesKaj> ducasse,  if you like shootem-ups and martial arts watch "the accountant"
<EriC^^> ducasse: haven't seen it, seems so-so
<BluesKaj> or the wall street crash of 2008, 'the big short'
<EriC^^> i've seen the accountant, it was kind of cool
<ducasse> i was just told yesterday to see the accountant, it's also on the shortlist :)
<BluesKaj> EriC^^, it was a fun watch despite the reviews
<EriC^^> yeah
<ducasse> i'm normally not a big fan of action films, but both of these seem to have potential
<BluesKaj> any other recommends, I'm looking , but I don't see much that appeals
<EriC^^> there was a movie about alien contact lately, it was alright
<EriC^^> i cant remember the name, something like A....
<EriC^^> not much help i know, hmm
<BluesKaj> yeah, arrival, didn't klive up to the hype
<BluesKaj> it was worth watching tho
<EriC^^> Arrival, yeah!
<EriC^^> yeah, it was so-so, kind of nice
<EriC^^> ducasse: you should watch it if you haven't yet
<ducasse> next week is the premiere of alien: covenant
<EriC^^> nice
<ducasse> i can hardly wait :) first movie i've been excited about in _years_
<EriC^^> an ubottu contender! wt..?!
<EriC^^> what's fpbot? :D
<EriC^^> wow it left
<ducasse> EriC^^: i wish all bots were as cooperative :)
<EriC^^> yeah, it was very polite
<EriC^^> :D
<oerheks> EriC^^, that was the 2nd time, put a ban on it ( now ipv6, other instance was ipv4)
<EriC^^> hey immu
<EriC^^> o/ Bashing-om
<EriC^^> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: EriC^^ He's our man .
<EriC^^> Bashing-om: :D
<EriC^^> how are you doing?
<oerheks> Â¡pang
<immu> EriC^^, u are here? i was looking at ubuntu :)
<immu> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<immu> !hi
<EriC^^> hey immu
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: I do well .. your self ?
<immu> hows you doing?
<EriC^^> Bashing-om: also well, thanks
<immu> EriC^^, Bashing-om i am also ok
<Bashing-om> immu: That is a good thing , too .
<immu> Bashing-om, how are you doing? nice to see some activity
<Bashing-om> immu: Just open to what I can learn 'buntu this day .
<immu> 17.04 is stable nothing to do fancy, waiting to see what cooking in 17.10 :)
<immu> their is trouble in Windows land
<Ben64> still not enough to get people to care
<baizon> yep
<baizon> they did even release a windows xp hotfix :D
<Ben64> "but this app only works on windows 3.1!"
<immu> oh u their Ben64 :)
<Ben64> i was talking to a guy who works at a place that got hit
<immu> brb reinstalling ubuntu :)
<Ben64> it would be "too hard" to upgrade things
<Ben64> in other words, let's do nothing and hope the problem gets fixed
<immu> hey Ben64 ducasse EriC^^ installing ubuntu again :)
<EriC^^> :)
<EriC^^> wb
<EriC^^> 17.10?
<EriC^^> i mean 17.04
<immu> 17.04 still
<immu> hi all i amback
<immu> has anyone of you all installed ubuntu in UEFI mode
<Bashing-om> immu: sure many have - but you are leading up to a support question .
<immu> while installing ubuntu, it warned me of installing in UEFI mode
<Bashing-om> immu: That is a good thing, no ? I assume that you booted the installer in that mode ?
<immu> could be as i was warned, so i clicked on Gobackk and proceeded to install ubuntu
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-05-14
<Bashing-om> How about another confirmation that this drive has issues : http://paste.ubuntu.com/24570930/ .
<Ben64> 2 years powered on? doesn't sound bad
<Bashing-om> Ben64: What has my attention is the counts on Unexpect_Power_Loss_Ct and Runtime_Bad_Block . I know little of what to expect on a SSD .
<Ben64> best to google that, sometimes manufactures use different default values
<Ben64> not sure how to read that write data either
<Bashing-om> Ben64: :)
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> quick jump in before work
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Noted, we do what we can to get your day off to a good start :)
<lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om :p
<ducasse> morning all
<lordievader[m]> Good morning
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<EriC^^> hi BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> hi EriC^^
<immu> ducasse, BluesKaj EriC^^
<EriC^^> hey immu
<BluesKaj> immu, hi
<immu> how di amigos
<immu> njoying installing apps via snap :)
<immu> you all?
<lotuspsychje> good evening to all
<ducasse> hi lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
<lotuspsychje> found this a cool article: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2017/05/ubuntu-17-04-review-this-is-unitys-true-swan-song/
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: article says gnome3 shell works faster then unity?
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: i have no idea, i've hardly tried either of them, and it was on different hardware. sorry.
<lotuspsychje> downloading 17.10 for a spare laptop i have here
<lotuspsychje> gonna be me devbox :p
<lotuspsychje> ready to heavy bug-out alpha2 gnome
 * lotuspsychje is ready to attack
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Ouch ! My dev is on 17.04 - I forgot to update it this AM > Shame on me .
<lotuspsychje> burning to usb..
<Bashing-om> Maybe I f I get bored .. will reboot and upgrade that 17.04 ( stable !) to 17.10 and see the effect on this old hardware .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: dont forget to bug out right
<lotuspsychje> we need a clean 18.04!
<Bashing-om> To my great pleasure, I have yet to !bug out . KISS and always it "just works" .
<lotuspsychje> the community thanks you Bashing-om :p
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Presently : http://termbin.com/1tjh - with 2 drive unplugged .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: wow :p
<lotuspsychje> booting 17.10 :p
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Hey I test :) ! and have been testing for some time . And in all this testing, all I can say is it works on old AMD/nvidia hardware .
<lotuspsychje> cool
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: 17.10 workie ??
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: yep, installing
<lotuspsychje> wb ducasse :p
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: hmm, odd. something killed the connection...
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: netsplit
<lotuspsychje> ducasse has quit (*.net *.split)
<immu> hi
<lotuspsychje> hi immu
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: right, it just suddenly timed out here.
<immu> i need the IRC channel name for snaps
<Bashing-om> !alis | immu
<ubot5> immu: Alis is an IRC service to help you find channels. For help on using it, see "/msg Alis help list" or ask in #freenode. Example usage: "/msg Alis list http"
<ducasse> immu: it's #snappy, but ask these things in #ubuntu
<immu> as my hexchat snap app keeps freezing ducasse yeah
<ducasse> immu: then you need to talk to whoever packaged that snap, or the developers
<immu> its fine now wait
<immu> had to remove snap hexchat and install the regular one
<daftykins> doesn't really make sense you using anything snap.
<lotuspsychje> hey hey daftykins
<daftykins> \o hi there :>
<ducasse> hi daftykins :)
<immu> daftykins, meaning? its part of ubuntu right?
<daftykins> nevermind immu - i called your level of user a long time ago XD
<daftykins> far be it from me to be teacher
<daftykins> ducasse: \o
<ducasse> daftykins: how's work in bathroom going?
<immu> daftykins, lets see if you can shed some light instead of cryptic talk
<daftykins> immu: like i just said, not up to me to teach - plenty of resources at your disposal.
<immu> daftykins, as you wish
<daftykins> yep, for more - consult your favourite search engine
<immu__> already did so
<immu__> Â¯\_(ã)_/Â¯
<immu__> goodnite
#ubuntu-discuss 2018-05-07
<oerheks> Cosmic Chihuahua
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<tsimonq2> Hai.
<lotuspsychje> hey tsimonq2
<krytarik> Hy!
<lotuspsychje> hey krytarik
<lordievader> Good morning
<ducasse> good morning
<lordievader> Hey ducasse
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<ducasse> i'm good, thanks - how about you, lordievader?
<lordievader> Doing good here :)
<lotuspsychje_> morning lordievader ducasse
<lordievader> Hey lotuspsychje_ How are you doing?
<lotuspsychje_> fine tnx lordievader
<lotuspsychje_> enjoyed a very sunny weekend
<lordievader> Yes, was very nice weather ð
<ducasse> morning lotuspsychje_ - all going well?
<lotuspsychje_> yeah tnx ducasse and you?
<ducasse> all good here, quiet morning
<lotuspsychje_> great :p
<lotuspsychje_> bbl worktime
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<LtWorf> hey BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hi LtWorf
<LtWorf> there is a blues band here called folks
<BluesKaj> really?
<LtWorf> yeah
<LtWorf> stupid choice of course
<LtWorf> can't find a single hit on google :D
<LtWorf> since it's a common word in swedish too
<BluesKaj> lots of bands aren't found on google
<LtWorf> well https://billetto.se/en/e/the-howling-owl-releasefest-folks-the-abyss-tickets-278353
<LtWorf> u can buy tickets for the next gig :D
<BluesKaj> yeah, my  family language was Swedish...after a few yrs it became English after emigrating to Canada
<LtWorf> BluesKaj: i guessed, i have a friend here who moved here from USA, named Kaj. He did because he is a swedish citizen even though he had never lived here. And here he could study for free
<BluesKaj> from Finland...family is Swedish- Finn
<LtWorf> hehe like linus torvalds
<BluesKaj> yup
<LtWorf> italy gives citizenship if you have 1 italian grandparent
<LtWorf> some brazilians get it to come to study/live in europe
<EriC^^> i make a mean pizza, i want citizenship!
<LtWorf> hehehehehe, once i met a swedish guy claiming that only in naples they are capable of producing proper pizza
<lordievader> Do they ship from Naples to here?
<LtWorf> i don't know where here is
<LtWorf> i'm italian btw, living in sweden
<lordievader> Holland.
<LtWorf> i would imagine it might be a bit cold and soggy by the time it reaches
<BluesKaj> I feel for those guys who don't investigate before buying an Optimus equipped laptop
<lordievader> Hmm, yes... How about express-express delivery? ð
<lordievader> BluesKaj: If you want a bit of performance you quickly end  up with such a dual-video card setup... unfortunately.
<JanC> I'm sure there are good pizza places in The Netherlands
<BluesKaj> laptops aren't meant for video performance IMO
<JanC> and obviously they only make Napoli-style pizzas in Napoli
<JanC> I'm pretty sure Sicilian style pizzas are best in Sicily, etc.  ;)
<lordievader> JanC: There are. But now I'm curious as to how good those Naples ones are ð
<LtWorf> JanC: pizza siciliana is deep fried and enclosed like calzone, but with different dough, i don't know why they call it pizza at all :D
<JanC> because it's pizza
<LtWorf> http://blog.giallozafferano.it/passioneperilcibo/la-siciliana/
<LtWorf> or, it can also be a regular pizza with capers and anchovies on top
<LtWorf> going to eat, btw :D
<LtWorf> i went to eat and it became silentâ¦
<BluesKaj> yeah, just finished an onion, mushroom and cheese omelette with toasted multi grain bread
<JimBuntu> GM BluesKaj ... and NOM NOM NOM
<BluesKaj> 'Morning JimBuntu, still teaching myself how to cook tho
<BluesKaj> omelettes are easy ...been doing them for a while now
<JimBuntu> Ever tried cloud eggs?
<BluesKaj> not familiar with that term
<JimBuntu> crack your eggs, isolate whites from yolks. Whip the whites for a few minutes on low with mixer. Put some dollops of the whites on bread as though they were mashed potatoes.
<BluesKaj> ok , googled, looks good
<JimBuntu> yeah, google will answer faster than I can, lol
<BluesKaj> dunno how good I would be at yolk separation
<JimBuntu> It is pretty easy and there are "hacks" for ways to do it with things like a plastic water bottle... using it as a suction-bulb. I simply cradle the yolk in my hand and change the gap sizes between my fingers until that white+gravity pull it all off the yalk
<LtWorf> JimBuntu: i use the egg shell itself to do it
<JimBuntu> That's another way, especially if you don't want to waste the egg that sticks to your hands.
<EriC^^> i usually put it in a glass, then remove the yolk with a spoon
<lotuspsychje> good evening to all
<kostkon> gOoD eVeNiNg SiR
<lotuspsychje> hey kostkon
<kostkon> Ä§ey
<lotuspsychje> hey krytarik
<krytarik> Howdy!
<ducasse> evening all
<ducasse> heyup, lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse how was your day :p
<lotuspsychje> 30 degrees in belgium...why o why did i have to work :p
<ducasse> great day here, did some housework and took a nap :)
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: sound great :p
<lotuspsychje> !info limnoria | SlidingHorn
<ubot5> SlidingHorn: limnoria (source: limnoria): robust and user-friendly Python IRC bot. In component universe, is optional. Version 2017.08.18-1 (artful), package size 553 kB, installed size 4364 kB
<Squarism> how do I upgrade from ubuntu 17.04 to 18.04?
<ducasse> !eolupgrade
<ubot5> End-Of-Life is the time when security updates and support for an Ubuntu release stop, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases for more information. Looking to upgrade from an EOL release? See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EOLUpgrades
<ducasse> but support is in #ubuntu
<lotuspsychje> aha !usn has changed to https
<Squarism> generally speaking, what are the most common type of bugs for a new LTS release? Driver problems or just ubuntu/linux core functionality?
<daftykins> in server edition, a new installer is being developed - and that has many issues right now
<Squarism> when did the unity -> gnome switch happen? I mean in what release
<wirehunter> Squarism, I think the LTS releases are not really new releases. Like:
<daftykins> unity has always been gnome based technically
<wirehunter> 18.04 is not LTS yet, that will be 18.04.1 right?
<daftykins> wrong
<xangua> wirehunter: it is
<daftykins> it's LTS from the outset, once it hits the first point release - direct upgrades from 16.04.x will be enabled
<daftykins> that's how it usually works
<wirehunter> Ah, okay
<oerheks> the .1 release triggers the global upgrade
<oerheks> so yes, current 18.04 users are beta testers :-D
<Squarism> It sure sounds like that
<oerheks> i am still on 17.10, seeding
<xangua> 16.04/unity for ever ð¤
<wirehunter> I never liked Unity
<Squarism> wish me luck. Upgrade from EOL 17.04->17.10 completed apart from restart. Now i just hope machine will come back up.
<wirehunter> I was a ubuntu-gnome user :)
<xangua> Or at least some more years
<pragmaticenigma> Unity to Gnome switch started in 17.10 I believe
<xangua> I was a gnome 2 user
<wirehunter> I used to be one too
<wirehunter> Before I switched to mac for a while :p
<Squarism> *I survived!*
 * pragmaticenigma hands Squarism a t-shirt
<wirehunter> Squarism, Even your Xorg started again?
<daftykins> now upgrade again (:
<oerheks> started @ KDE ..
<JimBuntu> !cookie | Squarism
<ubot5> Squarism: Wow! You're such a great helper, you deserve a cookie!
<wirehunter> My X server didn't start after upgrading to 18.04
<wirehunter> Always something
<Squarism> wirehunter, how do i tell? "ps auxf | grep Xorg" shows nothing
<Squarism> JimBuntu, pragmaticenigma - thanks. Its really ducasse who deserves credit though
<Squarism> must say i like gnome better than unity
<JimBuntu> Squarism, but I have ducasse on a treat diet... do you know how many cookies they would get?! It would be a lot :-D
<daftykins> xD
<wirehunter> Squarism, Basically, if you can log into your desktop, your x server is running fine.
<JimBuntu> I would expect your command to have returned that there was an Xorg running though...
<wirehunter> Squarism, My login shell didn't load and could only go into a tty to fix things :)
<wirehunter> Or you're on Wayland?
<Squarism> wirehunter, i dont think so. Just logged in wo configuring anything
<Squarism> hmmm..
<Squarism> gdm       1146  0.0  0.0 194856  5508 tty1     Ssl+ 22:13   0:00  |   \_ /usr/lib/gdm3/gdm-wayland-session gnome-session --autostart /usr/share/gdm/greeter/autostart
<Squarism> gdm       1233  0.0  0.1 566536 52584 tty1     Sl+  22:13   0:00  |           |   \_ /usr/bin/Xwayland :1024 -rootless -terminate -core -listen 4 -listen 5 -displayfd 6
<Squarism> maybe i am?
<wirehunter> Squarism, You don't really have to. You can switch from the login-shell using the gear icon
<Squarism> does above imply im on wayland?
<wirehunter> I think so
<wirehunter> Ah apparently 17.10 defaults to Wayland
<wirehunter> Forgot about that
<Squarism> so is it recommended to run wayland?
<Squarism> thought it was in a very beta state
<wirehunter> It's missing a lot of features that you might not be using
<oerheks> depends, on your GPU mostly
<Squarism> oerheks, in what way? Does it require more of the GPU?
<oerheks> Fedora runs it for years now, since 2015
<wirehunter> I had to switch back to xorg to do stuff like screen capture
<oerheks> no, depending on open drivers, openradeon/ open AMDgpu are pretty good
<wirehunter> I couldn't add screen resolutions for my ultra wide screen monitor
<oerheks> downside are some tools that do not work well @ wayland, synaptic for example
<Squarism> oerheks, hmm that feels kind of imporant
<Squarism> important
<oerheks> i would like to see that integrated in softwarecenter, metapackage <> detailed view
<Squarism> oerheks, you mean the UI isnt working properly or that "apt" command?
<oerheks> UI
<oerheks> there is a trick to get around, but i refuse to do that. maybe this si fixed in 18.04 now..
<oerheks> 17.10 not
<Squarism> i mostly use apt so i hope ill manage
<Squarism> So what features should one check out? New window manager, new xserver
<oerheks> "Wayland does not allow gui applications to run in superuser mode like Synaptic." http://ubuntuhandbook.org/index.php/2017/10/ubuntu-17-10-tip-graphical-apps-doesnt-launch-via-root-sudo-gksu/
<Squarism> what can i do that i couldnt do before?
<Squarism> ah ok
<Squarism> damn, 17.10 with pop theme. Im in love. Ubuntu has never looked this awsome
<nacc> Squarism: ... you do know you need to upgrade in hte next few months, right?
<Squarism> nacc, im gonna wait for 18.04.1 i think. Dont wanna be some beta tester =D
<daftykins> given the OS you use, you always will be ;)
<nacc> Squarism: no, 17.10 goes EOL in July
<nacc> Squarism: so it doesn't really make sense (to me) to fall in love with something you have to upgrade :)
<daftykins> :D
<Bashing-om> sneak peek for UWN : https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2391254 . Publishing now .
<Squarism> nacc, well I assume i wont get less in 18.04. Its not like we are backgrading to ubuntu 12.10 right
<nacc> Squarism: you are using wayland, right?
<nacc> default is not wayland in 18.04
<nacc> that will be 'less'
<nacc> hence my point :)
#ubuntu-discuss 2018-05-08
<Squarism> Are there big diffrences between xorg/wayland gnome? If so, in what way?
<daftykins> do you mean 'xorg and wayland' or do you mean 'gnome under xorg _and_ gnome under wayland' or some other combo?
<nacc> Squarism: xorg and wayland are very different; in theory you shouldn't notice a different, but that has not been my experience, minimally because wayland is more limited
<Squarism> daftykins, the latter i meant.
<Squarism> nacc, okej thanks
<nacc> Squarism: limited enough that at a late moment, it was decided to *not* make it the default in 18.04
<nacc> late-ish moment
<Squarism> yeah, i read the statement.
<Squarism> Sounded as if the got cold feet about supporting it LTS level
<nacc> and a fair amount of stuff that should just work, doesn't
<nacc> e.g. you can't, architecturally, do remote desktop
<daftykins> some folk just like to chase 'new and shiny' a bit too much :>
<Squarism> Ive never been so up to date now running a 6 month old release. At home im running 14.04.
<daftykins> where are you now if not home?
<daftykins> i have a VPS i need to move off 14.04 soon
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<SlidingHorn> morning
<lotuspsychje> hey SlidingHorn
<lotuspsychje> !usn
<ubot5> Please see https://usn.ubuntu.com/ for information about recent Ubuntu security updates.
<lotuspsychje> neat :p
<lordievader> Good morning
<lotuspsychje> hey lordievader
<lotuspsychje> another warm day comming up :p
<lordievader> Indeed
<ducasse> good morning
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
<lordievader> Hey ducasse
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<ducasse> hi lordievader, lotuspsychje
<ducasse> all well, thanks - and you?
<lordievader> Doing good here ð
<lotuspsychje> everybody going to the pool today haha
<lotuspsychje> someone takeover my work, so i can go too
<lordievader> +1
<lotuspsychje> i think oerheks has nothing to do today, he might jump in for me
<daftykins> drabber could do it
<lotuspsychje> heavy kitchen work without airco while its sunny outside
<lotuspsychje> lol
<daftykins> no AC D:
<daftykins> what are they running there, a forced labour camp? ;)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> just a turnable window, to bring more heat inside
<jink> MORNING, LOVELY PEOPLE (and lotuspsychje).
<lordievader> Hey jink
<jink> ^__^
<jink> Bijna weekend \o/
<lordievader> daftykins: AC is quite rare here. But then again hot days are too.
<jink> ACs are for offices and shops.
<lordievader> Ha, this office doesn't have AC ð­
<jink> This one doesn't either.  It's a broken top-cooling.
<daftykins> yeah we don't have it in homes typically either, but i'm not sure if you are both in the same country
<lotuspsychje> bbl work, have a nice one
<jink> I'm in The Netherlands.
<jink> Oh, so is lordievader, apparently.
<lordievader> Yes
<oerheks> Yes, this irc are dutch only :-P
<oerheks> goto sleep, daftykins
<jink> :D
<jink> Dutch speaking, not Dutch native, per se.
<wirehunter> Dinsdag... Bijna weekend... Yeah right.
<lordievader> Well... thursday off, friday off... almost weekend.
<wirehunter> Oh right, Forgot about that.
<wirehunter> even though I'm going on a trip
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<pragmatic_enigma> morning BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> 'Morning pragmaticenigma
<pragmaticenigma> How goes the day BluesKaj ?
<BluesKaj> pragmaticenigma, fine, just had a late breakfast. how about you?
<pragmaticenigma> Just working on making it through the day
<pragmaticenigma> and watching the blind lead the blind in chat
<BluesKaj> heh
<pragmaticenigma> anyone catch what <94KAAADA7>'s issue was?
<lotuspsychje> good evening to all
<lotuspsychje> !cosmic
<ubot5> Ubuntu 18.10 (Cosmic Cuttlefish) will be the 29th release of Ubuntu.  Release annoucement at https://markshuttleworth.com/archives/1521
<BluesKaj> hey lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> heya BluesKaj all good on bionic?
<BluesKaj> lotuspsychje, yup, so far at least
<lotuspsychje> same here cant complain
<ducasse> evening BluesKaj, lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse how was your day?
<BluesKaj> Hey ducasse
<ducasse> all quiet lotuspsychje, just came home from the city, walked along the river
<lotuspsychje> cool ducasse nothing can beat some outside air, did it rain?
<BluesKaj> sounds nice
<ducasse> no rain, beautiful weather.
<lotuspsychje> neat
<JimBuntu> All I can hear right now is birds singing and someone in the distance with a chainsaw
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> first rabbit hunting, now eat birds JimBuntu
<JimBuntu> They are little song birds, not worth any effort. I did think about taking my screen out this morning though ;-D
<lotuspsychje> hehe
<ducasse> song bird hunting with a chainsaw? sounds interesting...
<lotuspsychje> now plot for 2018 horror
<lotuspsychje> starring JimBuntu
<JimBuntu> lol
<JimBuntu> The chipmunks are out digging around by the window too... also not worth the effort.
<kostkon> both terrifying and calming i like it
<ducasse> JimBuntu: come running around the corner with the chainsaw raised, make them feel like they're alive
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> i like mint, in my mojito :p
<JimBuntu> Anyone seen Dale and Tucker VS. Evil? hilarious
<lotuspsychje> hmm that rings a bell
<ducasse> JimBuntu: yep, +1
<JimBuntu> It's about 2 good'ol boys trying to mind their own business and be helpful, truck of preppy college kids comes into the woods to camp... wind up thinking the locals are killers
<lotuspsychje> nice plot
 * BluesKaj plays dueling banjos :-)
<JimBuntu> lotuspsychje, it's hilarious
<lotuspsychje> hey krytarik morning
<lotuspsychje> JimBuntu: dont think i saw it
<krytarik> Mornin'
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: watch it, it's excellent
<SlidingHorn> is there a better channel for steam issues than #ubuntu-steam?
<lotuspsychje> !steam
<ubot5> Valve have officially announced that they are developing Steam and are working with !ubuntu during their development, see http://blogs.valvesoftware.com/linux/steamd-penguins/ for further details, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Valve for install instructions, you can also join #ubuntu-steam for discussion.
<lotuspsychje> oh SlidingHorn do you know #gamingonlinux channel?
<lotuspsychje> those guys are crazy up to date
<SlidingHorn> I haven't been there
<kostkon> also same channels on IRC TNG
<SlidingHorn> I'll check it out
<kostkon> aka Discord
<SlidingHorn> I'm in the Linux Gamers Group discord - Guess I could ask there too
<kostkon> SlidingHorn, there's a gamingonlinux server as well
<SlidingHorn> my concern there is that they almost always just say to install from a PPA or steam itself
<kostkon> well depends on what your problem actually is
<SlidingHorn> launchpad bug 1768669
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1768669 in steam (Ubuntu) "multiverse package steam recommends nvidia-driver-lib-i386:i386 which is not in repositories" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1768669
<kostkon> i'm getting some wine vibe here
<kostkon> https://uappexplorer.com/snap/ubuntu/prat
<kostkon> snaps are becoming too popular :P
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> bbl bit tv
#ubuntu-discuss 2018-05-09
<Squarism> So the these lacking features of wayland, are there some clear plan to address those? Or is wayland like "-Screen sharing? REmote desktop? Won't fix."
<daftykins> it's a sign it shouldn't be used yet :>
<daftykins> if something is just struggling to try and reach feature parity with what it replaced, then there's no point
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lordievader> Good morning
<ducasse> good morning
<lordievader> Hey ducasse
<lordievader> How are you all doing?
<lotuspsychje> hey lordievader ducasse
<ducasse> hi lordievader - i'm fine, thanks. and you?
<lordievader> Doing okay here, haven't had coffee yet.
<lotuspsychje> bbl prepare for work
<Bugzie> Hmmm
<Bugzie> You know, you people toterlate people give the wrong infromation.. That, you give worong avdive was the indicator that I need to pay attention to
<lordievader> People don't like confrontations. Telling people they give out wrong information is a confrontation.
<BluesKaj> Howdy folks
 * JimBuntu is confrontational.
<JimBuntu> GM BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> 'Morning JimBuntu...confrontational, about?
<JimBuntu> whatever Bugzie was talking about.
<JimBuntu> T-Minus 1d 13h 31 minutes until Friday (UTC)
<BluesKaj> he's a shit disturber, wants to see himself in print
<BluesKaj> he'll be banned again ,using a different nick and possibly a vpn to rejoin the chat ...aka bugsbunny
<JimBuntu> yup. That's the expected behavior. VPN or proxy, you can't get rid of people very easily when they don't have to purchase their username
<chu> BluesKaj: are you an op in #u?
<JimBuntu> You can, sometimes, scare proxy owners into releasing info about their users... you can sometimes steal that info too.
<BluesKaj> chu, nope
<chu> Grab me in here if you want help then
<BluesKaj> not encouraging his offtopic comments is all, not answering him
<chu> Yep
<BluesKaj> heh, ikonia is on his case now :-)
<chu> :)
 * BluesKaj heads to the kitchen for another coffee
<BluesKaj> ikonia took care of the problem child
<chu> Yep
<JimBuntu> ... for now.
<BluesKaj> just silenced not banned
<JimBuntu> adding "/sys/block/<device>/queue/rotational" to my notes.
<BluesKaj> odd that users don't know the size or make and model of their ssds and hdds..just need to look in th euefi/bios
<JimBuntu> "users", heh
<BluesKaj> which term would you use JimBuntu ? :-)
<JimBuntu> No BluesKaj , I like "users"... especially in this instance ;-
<JimBuntu> ;-D
<BluesKaj> heh
<BluesKaj> there's a lot of 'em
<JimBuntu> I would dare say it's the vast majority
<BluesKaj> oh yeah
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<JimBuntu> Hiya pauljw
<pauljw> hey JimBuntu :)
<BluesKaj> Hey pauljw
<pauljw> hey BluesKaj, how's things?
<BluesKaj> doing ok here pauljw, how bout you?
<pauljw> great here, thanks.
<BluesKaj> finally some nice weather here ...problem is now i have yardwork to do  :-)
<pauljw> :D same here, just now talking myself into heading out with weed eater...
<BluesKaj> yeah, I have to rescue my lawn ...guess some fresh grass seed and fertilizer won't hurt
<pauljw> :)
<BluesKaj> I need to find a decent universal remote control for my media devices. So called programable remote  I got from my TV cable co provider isn't able to control my audio receiver so I'm stuck with 3 remotes to control my devices :/
<JimBuntu> BluesKaj, I suggest looking for one that has a "learning" mode... where you point the two remotes at each other and the "universal" one reads the IR from the OEM remote. That's the best way to go... next up, is one that you can interface with your computer and actually write the command codes... that's how I used to do it back in the day of Palm Pilots/etc.
<BluesKaj> yeah, was looking for the learning type , but I've yet to find one of those that has info about which codes/brands it accepts and controls
<JimBuntu> The learning type don't generally detail this, since they read/learn the command codes. They are basically universal. I don't think I ever found an OEM remote that I couldn't duplicate.
<JimBuntu> If you want to save some cash, but a used Palm Tungsten (or similar Palm PDA) for <$50 USD once you locate the IR remote app... way better than a Harmony remote and possibly ~25% the price.
<pauljw> bbl... heading for the yard. :)
#ubuntu-discuss 2018-05-10
<ducasse> good morning
<xangua> Good midnight
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<SlidingHorn> mornin BluesKaj
<JimBuntu> Greetings. Wow, it's Thursday already.
<BluesKaj> 'Morning SlidingHorn, JimBuntu ....foggy and rain here, but it's "much needed"
<JimBuntu> We had our rain yesterday. I can't see a cloud in the sky this morning :-D
<SlidingHorn> had a light thunderstorm overnight - overcast this mornin
<JimBuntu> We had an interesting and powerful storm about a week ago... I went outside and watched it for a while. Tons of lightning and thunder, as far as I could tell though, it was all cloud to cloud.
<BluesKaj> trying to rescue my lawn and I seeded the bad patch in the front yard, so I'm glad the rain came
<BluesKaj> we had some thunder and lightning last night
<JimBuntu> We had to have a bunch of the front yard ripped up last year, needed to seed/etc. It's filling in very nicely now. Didn't expect the tulips to pop up in various places... that they would have been killed off.
<BluesKaj> yeah JimBuntu, I may have to do the same if my efforts don't work
<JimBuntu> BluesKaj, I had a few patches that didn't grow well in the past... putting seed didn't seem to work... yet now that a bunch of it has been tilled, the area of those patches are fine. Somewhat odd. I guess the key for us was that the soil was turned.
 * BluesKaj nods
<BluesKaj> lucky a close friend owns a tiller...has a large garden every yr
<JimBuntu> I had simply not thought of it, I already have a tiller. I can be stupid some times, lol. Speaking of which, that tiller is going to get a workout this weekend... as it's time to get the garden going! woohoo!
<BluesKaj> probly need to add some top soil as well
<BluesKaj> here
<JimBuntu> The garden area I am working with this year... has had 2 years off, being used mainly as a compost area. I have some perlite and worm castings to add, that's about it though.
<BluesKaj> nice to have good "tools", but unfortunately I've never had much of a green thumb
<JimBuntu> 366 days ago, I found morel mushrooms growing here. One was 8 inches tall! None so far this year though :(
<BluesKaj> heh
<JimBuntu> This weekend is right around the peak for them... want to go deep into the forest Saturday.
<JimBuntu> I wouldn't say I have a green thumb, it's more that I am stubborn. Either way, I grew up with a garden, have always had a garden and would prefer to keep it that way.
<BluesKaj> nice ;-)
<pragmaticenigma> always a bonus when the impatient close the window
<SlidingHorn> is qwefytuiityty talking to anyone or just rambling?
<pragmaticenigma> rambling
<pragmaticenigma> SlidingHorn: They're rambling
<pragmaticenigma> They arrived around 12:41 America/Chicago time
<pragmaticenigma> I swear it's the same guy from yesterday around this time it was something KIRISHA_RASPBERY or something similar
<pragmaticenigma> beat ya to it leftyfb  :-)
<leftyfb> yep
<SlidingHorn> well...they told you!  :P
<pragmaticenigma> wehre is an op when you need one
<leftyfb> pragmaticenigma: think of the effort that will be put into that bug report if he reports it. There's really no point in going forward with it
<leftyfb> pragmaticenigma: again, think of the lack of information an follow-up that's going to happen. A developer might see the bug and ask for more information from them. Then ...
<leftyfb> unless you have a "make work" button for them, they're not going to do anything ... regardless of how easy you make it for them
<pragmaticenigma> I get it... I'm trying to discourage him from filing the bug report
<pragmaticenigma> leftyfb: I had them pegged from the beginning that they were looking for an easy button. I have learned with Linux/Gnu that if it doesn't work, it's not meant to be. Apps crash all the time for me, I think i've only let it post one bug report via apport
<pragmaticenigma> Most of those crashes were me doing something the program wasn't mean to do... and over sensitive crash monitoring picked up on it
<pragmaticenigma> (usually bad apache configs)
<leftyfb> my of the bugs I've reported over the years have either got ignored, set to "won't fix" or got marked as a duplicate of a newer report with less information that also didn't get fixed
#ubuntu-discuss 2018-05-11
<EriC^^> morning all
<Bashing-om> WB EriC^^ :)
<EriC^^> thanks Bashing-om :)
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: Good to have ya back ,., good help is so hard to come by :P
<EriC^^> :P
<ducasse> good morning
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Ahhh .. the morning crew is arriving :)
<ducasse> hi Bashing-om, how have you been? still going well with the non-smoking?
<Bashing-om> ducasse: I had hoped by now to be at least down to the 4 hits .. but NOooooo. still at 6 at 2 hours or so :( Nasty habit !
<Bashing-om> ducasse: The good is that when I leave the house, I do not carry my smoking with me and I do not get stressed out if I am away for more than the 2 hours :D
<JimBuntu> Bashing-om, you can do it. Do not give up.
<ducasse> Bashing-om: i'm impressed you're still going :) well done, keep it up and you'll get there
<ducasse> hi JimBuntu
<ducasse> all well this morning?
<JimBuntu> hi ducasse . Good morning to you and to Luna.
<Bashing-om> ducasse: ya gotta want to ! ,, and the rest is will power .
<Bashing-om> ducasse: sadly .. I like to smoke - just because  I need to does not mean I want to :(
<ducasse> Bashing-om: exactly the same here, i'm under doctor's orders to quit, but i just don't want to. makes it difficult to build up motivation.
<JimBuntu> Bashing-om, I worked in tobacco for years... so did my wife, that's where I met her (work related). I quit smoking accidentally... I tried vaping as a new way to add to my tobacco use,,, wound up not wanting cigarettes within a week, It has been this way for about 5 years now.
<EriC^^> do you still vape?
<JimBuntu> I do still vape. ( I don't consider that smoking)
<Bashing-om> JimBuntu: I have tried all the diversions .. and though I have bad COPD I still want my pipe .
<EriC^^> JimBuntu: i watched infinity chamber, nice movie
<JimBuntu> Bashing-om, Ah, you use a pipe. I did too, much harder to break than cigarettes. I will say, they make special vape equipment for pipe smokers. I have some and it is different from normal.
<EriC^^> i feel like it could have been way 'huger' if it had like a production stuff kinda thing going
<JimBuntu> EriC^^, +9000. I am watching that again this weekend, already planned it. I doubt it will be as good as the first time, but I don't mind.
<EriC^^> there's a movie that reminded me of it a little, it's totally different but has similar concept 'source code'
<JimBuntu> I *think* I have seen that move too,need to check
<EriC^^> it's about a guy who has to relive the last 8 minutes of somebody's life over and over til he finds out who is trying to bomb the train
<JimBuntu> Oh, yes... I liked that movie!
<JimBuntu> He winds up figuring out how to stay alive in the 'alternate' reality
<EriC^^> there's an old movie i just reminded of.. hmm let me see the name
<EriC^^> 'The jacket'
<JimBuntu> 'The Jacket' has Kris Kristofferson ... basically assured to be good, in my book.
<EriC^> JimBuntu: have you seen the jacket? https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0366627/
<JimBuntu> I don't think so. Since it was mentioned, it's now on my list.
<EriC^> it's very good, it's about a soldier who comes back from war, and he wounds up by mistake in some mental ward where they're making experiments by putting people in those chambers where you see and hear nothing for long periods
<EriC^> and he goes on a bunch of stuff in time and stuff like that, it's very good, the lead actor is adrien body
<JimBuntu> Sensory deprivation, yup, sounds interesting.
<EriC^> soundtrack is pretty amazing too, very soothing
<JimBuntu> Soundtracks make all the difference. Have you seen "Drive" (2011) ?
<EriC^> nope i dont think so
<EriC^> insta-downloading :D
<JimBuntu> That one is really good too, in my book. Stars Ryan Gosling, before he was big and famous
<EriC^> looks good and ryan gosling so good actor
<JimBuntu> It's basically a drawn out version of an Aesops Fable ( Toad and the scorpion)
<JimBuntu> Although, I would say it's told in a way that even Aesop would adore.
<EriC^> aha
<JimBuntu> I find that I am drawn to the retelling of the old stories, don't even have to be that old...
<EriC^> you mean like true stories
<EriC^> ?
<JimBuntu> Well, I mainly mean 'the classics'. Mostly, the stories that were once told my mouth only, eventually written down... the kind of stuff that a grandparent tells to their grandchildren at bed time.
<EriC^> ah i see
<EriC^> can you give an example?
<JimBuntu> A toad is walking by a river, notices a scorpion. They begin to discuss the weather, The Toad says goodbye and declares it is going to the other side of the river... the scorpion asks the toad if it will help him.
<JimBuntu> The scorpion tells the toad that it too would like to cross the river.
<JimBuntu> The toad says "No. You are a scorpion, you will sting me!".
<JimBuntu> The scorpion tells the toad, that if it lets it ride on the toads back, to the other side of the river, then it would surely not sting the toad.
<JimBuntu> The toad thinks about this and agrees... while crossing the river, the two talk of many things... at some point the toad feels the sharp pain of being stung.
<JimBuntu> As they are sinking, due to the sting... the toad turnds it's head a bit to look at the scorpion and asks "Why?".
<JimBuntu> The scorpion replies as it only knows how... "Because, I am a scorpion, my friend."
<JimBuntu> ^^ very short version
<JimBuntu> Once the toad begins to die, they both sink into the water. All is lost.
<ducasse> those fables are excellent, been a while since i read them.
<JimBuntu> I have an old copy in print. They are the things religions are made from.
<EriC^> interesting
<EriC^> i dont agree with it, but it's interesting
<EriC^> i think i've heard it before as a child or something
<EriC^> the premise is that people dont change? that's the moral of the story?
<JimBuntu> It's odd, how different we are today. I have read these stories to my children. The children are more stuck on all kinds of small details than they are on the 'big picture'. I figure it's something that requires a certain amount of experience to understand. That is OK. I will keep reading them, until they understand the true meanings.
<JimBuntu> EriC^, it requires interpreting, and while there are many interpretations, I don't think there is a 'right' or 'wrong' answer.
<EriC^> hmm, to me it seemed like he's saying 'i did this because i'm a scorpion' it means that it's his nature and he doesnt change
<EriC^> whether what he did is 'bad' or 'good' is a whole other debate
<JimBuntu> The way I take it, the scorpion is a predator and a killer. It is meant to kill things, and most know this. It's in it's nature. To ask it to not kill, is an abomination of the natural order.
<EriC^> but i dont agree, i think the scorpion could befriend the toad and at least not sting him since they are cooperating
<EriC^> lions tigers and bears have known to become friends (all 3 at once even)
<JimBuntu> I agree EriC^ and in reality this is how things work, we resist our natural calling, for self-benefit.
<ducasse> this is a fable, you goy to take it as such.
<ducasse> *got
<JimBuntu> I think the point of the story isn't about this, it's about knowing that if you are asking nature (or a person/etc) to change, be prepared for them not to.
<JimBuntu> In the print version, the toad and the scorpion dwell on if the scorpion might sting the toad... and the scorpion always re-assures they it will not.
<EriC^> but that's just propagating fear and prejudice and generalization and ill knowledge
<JimBuntu> "prejudice and generalization and ill knowledge" like I said,... this is the stuff religions are made of.
<JimBuntu> lol
<EriC^> yup exactly :D
<JimBuntu> These fables are meant to teach lessons, not to be taken literally. The point is, learn from mistakes, don't expect others to change... even if your life is at risk, Do for others, despite the risk,
<JimBuntu> My family has a saying, "Those who can..., MUST, for those that can't."
<EriC^> that's kind of opposite
<EriC^> that's a nice saying
<EriC^> so do good with others despite the risk, but dont expect people to change cause you cant control what they do
<JimBuntu> Thanks, it's a lot better than the previous family motto... that was basically, "Enjoy the beautiful prairie"
<JimBuntu> Yes, help others, while not expecting them to appreciate it or to not attack you
<EriC^> but doesn't it suck to be the toad sinking in the water after getting stung?
<Bashing-om> JimBuntu: ^^ sounds like support :)
<JimBuntu> Do "good", simply to do so, despite any risks.
<JimBuntu> Bashing-om, lol, yes, it does sound like volunteer support.
<EriC^> assuming i'm helping someone online, and he needs my ssh login to be helped, and he's done some naughty stuff, i should still help him?
<EriC^> by giving my ssh login and then not expect him to delete my entire family photos and such and delicate info
<EriC^> that doesn't seem practical, if a person does that many times in a row he'll surely get pretty devastated
<JimBuntu> EriC^, all decisions rest upon your soul. At the same time, to do something that risks your own well-being, is also a risk that may prevent your future support of others... scales are meant for many things, even though risks and rewards can be difficult to measure in this physical realm
<EriC^> well the number one priority is survival of the self and well being
<JimBuntu> Yes, our primary task must not be forgotten or negated.
<EriC^> if i do something with that magnitude of risk it'd be stupid and as you said might devastate my own self
<JimBuntu> Task #2, caring for our family and beloved, must also not be forgotten.
<JimBuntu> For the few, they place the care of others above all else. This is OK, over-all, as without these few people, we would not be here. It is not something the majority are asked to do though. This i why we call them saints, and give them a special place.
<EriC^> hmm i think sainthood is a psychological problem
<JimBuntu> Eh, what do I know... the child of farmers, the lover of technology.
<EriC^> sainthood itself, i'm not talking about somebody having to diffuse a bomb to save a village and knows he's going to die in the process
<EriC^> that's just the right thing to do in that situation
<EriC^> but i think saints are people who've had some kind of hardship, or lack of something, and then go the sainthood route
<JimBuntu> Exactly. When presented with a problem that requires sacrifice for the "greater" good... not all will make the right choice. Many "today" ignore the problem instead of solving it.
<EriC^> hmm maybe
<LtWorf> EriC^:
<LtWorf> *defuse
<EriC^> how many people wouldn't do it though, i think we all have it in us to do that
<EriC^> LtWorf: :D
<JimBuntu> LtWorf, hmmm... bomb designs should include more fuses... the in-case of overload, physically degrade, kinds.
<JimBuntu> EriC^, sadly, while we may all have it within us, most flee rather than fight. This is shown day in and day out, by how many bystanders allow for things to happen.
<EriC^> hmm
<EriC^> yeah they do it for many reasons, one being what we mentioned earlier, the primary mission
<EriC^> could be a million reasons why they just stand
<LtWorf> mostly it's too sudden for them to process it
<JimBuntu> Yes, back to the "scales"... we all have them, some of us lean on one side or the other.
<JimBuntu> I do not "blame" them for acting in one way or another, they are not obliged to help everyone.
<JimBuntu> I will reward those that choose to help though.
<EriC^> yeah blame can't be had, in reality for them it would be the better choice, so they are actually doing what's worse for them, as human beings
<JimBuntu> This is our struggle. Help and risk much, or ignore and risk less... eventually though, we will possibly be the ones on the other side of the decision and be asking for help.
<EriC^> that's true
<EriC^> we ultimately do it for ourselves, doing good feels good in the end
<EriC^> when the scales are off it's due to other problems
<EriC^> cause nobody would knowingly do that, they dont know how to solve a problem etc and they're doing that instead
<JimBuntu> Doing good feels good, is contagious and such,... many, even the non-religious, still expect some kind of balance in the world. "If I do good now, then good should be done for me later"
<JimBuntu> The reality is that there is no balance, we have to create that.... as interactive entities. imho
<EriC^> yup
<Bashing-om> Off to bed ,, back on in about 12 hours . \o
<ducasse> sleep well Bashing-om
<Gargravarr> did SegFault1 really just ask us to help them cheat on an exam?
 * Gargravarr shakes head
<guiverc> :)
<guiverc> Howdy JimBuntu, thanks.
<BluesKaj> Howdy folks
<BluesKaj> BBL
<SlidingHorn> quiet in main...not sure if that's a good thing or a bad one lol
#ubuntu-discuss 2018-05-12
<JoeD> Need help with sed command
<ducasse> good morning
<guiverc> Howdy ducasse
<JimBuntu> Happy Saturday!
<ducasse> morning guiverc - having a good weekend, i hope?
<ducasse> and the same to you, JimBuntu :)
<guiverc> thanks & yeah (of course!) ducasse.  :) JimBuntu
<JimBuntu> ducasse, The weekend is going OK so far. Rain yesterday prevented my planned outdoor festivities (fire and food), and looks like the same for today. You?
<ducasse> was raining here too yesterday, but not today. trying to make plans for the day, possibly taking a walk on the woods.
<ducasse> any plans for the day, JimBuntu?
<JimBuntu> Possibly grocery shopping, since Sunday is Mothers Day and am going to the in-laws. Hope to have a fire tonight, with or without cooking over the fire... I should swap out a magnetic drive for SSD on a machine but I'll probably prove too lazy.
<ducasse> i know how that is, if it's not a full alarm it's far too easy to put off
<JimBuntu> Yup, and other than the expected speed improvements, I have no need to replace the HDD... so it sits. If I go shopping, then I think I will look at picking up a new KB, even though I know I will probably decide NOT to buy it locally and instead opt for Amazon.
<ducasse> i can heartily recommend das keyboard, very happy with mine
<JimBuntu> Looks nice - https://www.daskeyboard.com/daskeyboard-4-professional/
<JimBuntu> I have not had a USB KB with USB-A ports in so long
<ducasse> that's the model i have
<JimBuntu> das 4 ultimate, in all black, no lettering, lol. That actually has a nice look to it
<ducasse> i thought about getting it with no lettering, but thought it was a bit much :)
<JimBuntu> $20 USD more, for no lettering, meh. Looking at the 5Q.... I could either buy that or buy a cheap recliner... while I would use the snot out of the connectivity of the 5Q... I would prefer a new recliner
<JanC> just buy a decent keyboard
<JanC> seems like DAS Keyboard finally designed a somewhat usable keyboard though
<Tegu> keyboards with analog sensors are the thing now
<JimBuntu> lol, I literally have a huge box of keyboards in the attic... they are mostly PS2 (with some AT) though
<JanC> I looked at DAS Keyboard in the past, and they used to lack basic features in the past
<JanC> seems like nowadays they finally support volume keys and such  :P
<JimBuntu> now they have a volume roller
<JimBuntu> knob
<Tegu> this one has analog keys  https://www.wooting.nl/
<JanC> yeah, that's a way to support that
<JimBuntu> The volume knob sure isn't new, in general
<JanC> I think older DAS keyboards didn't have volume keys
<JanC> or maybe last time I looked :)
<JimBuntu> While I like the wooting one... it lacks the numpad... even if I do have a USB one laying aroung somewhere.
 * JimBuntu wonders if the external USB numpad will work correctly for CTRL+ALT+1/2/3/etc window positioning
<JanC> lacking a numpad is another failure of course
<JanC> I used to pay more for Cherry keyboards, but nowadays their regular keyboards aren't as good any more  :-/
<JimBuntu> Is it bad of me to be picky about the Enter vs. Return symbolism? lol
<JanC> as long as it uses 2 rows  :P
<JimBuntu> a 2-row key... sounds like a carriage return
<JanC> no, it's named Enter here  :)
<JanC> and that's on a cheap Logitech keyboard even
<JimBuntu> CR's were traditional 2-row, while Enter keys were traditional single row, not that it really matters much today. Only select software even recognizes the difference between the two types.
<Tegu> some sciense behind activation point.  http://userinterfaces.aalto.fi/impact_activation/resources/impact-activation_CameraReady.pdf    quite interesting and surprising to me. but I guess I'd wait for further research
<Tegu> science*
<JanC> it's actually a US vs. Europe thing AFAIK  :)
<JimBuntu> Nah, they are different keys. CR are carry-over from type-writers
<JanC> you might want to consider international typewriter differences  :)
<JimBuntu> That's true too, even in the same language... worse in differing languages
<JanC> we've always had two-row enter/return
<JimBuntu> I always remembered it as 2-row = \r\n, 1-row = \n  ... but again, that's not how things play out in reality
<JanC> definitely not on any keyboard AFAIK
<JimBuntu> JanC, that's where things get complicated... the keyboard is only input, the OS decides what to do with the input
<JimBuntu> s/OS/kernel-and-etc
<JanC> oh, of course
<JimBuntu> lol, I can see it now... I'm at the big-box-store with a special USB device checking each keyboard for the signals being sent by the enter button... yup, sure wont lead to me being banned from another store, not in the slightest
<Tegu> aka a keylogger? :D
<Tegu> not any suspicious to walk around with one
<JanC> USB keyboards should work correctly, or otherwise you can return them
 * JimBuntu used to take SD cards so they could check out PDAs... 
<JanC> remember USB has a standardised HID API
<JimBuntu> I would need to check the HID, but it should still remember /r and /n as being distinct
<JanC> eh
<JimBuntu> HID has Return and Enter, I would have to cross-check that the enter listed isn't specifically the numpad enter
<JimBuntu> ooooh, it has a XOR key
<JimBuntu> HID allows for a Return, an Enter and an ambiguous "Return(ENTER)", lol
<JimBuntu> Note to self: Appendix A references Appendix A.
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<Lin-Buo-Ren> I'd like to share my shell script template project: https://github.com/Lin-Buo-Ren/GNU-Bash-Shell-Script-Template
<Lin-Buo-Ren> It can be integrated with XDG-complianted desktop's "New Document" submenu
<Vinocamp> question, i have a server with dual xeon 5690 cpy, 96 gig of ram, should i install ubuntu server basic then all other machine/lamp be running on vm?
<oerheks> grinn, vlc 3.0.1-0-gec0f700fcc ..
<kostkon> ppa?
<oerheks> no, arch/manjaro version
<kostkon> really? wtf
<oerheks> not ubuntu, the snap version gives VLC media player 3.0.1 Vetinari (revision 3.0.1-4-g14a4897)
<bugzie> leftyfb: I've been reading, do you tell others to be off-topic for sake of giving you room to be off-topic?
<SlidingHorn> el: *that's* the "solution"?  Someone is consistently a problem, disregarding the rules & CoC and your response - instead of removing them - is "stop engaging them"?
 * SlidingHorn is beginning to think the ops just don't care anymore
<el> i'm not disregarding the situation
<el> we're not just going to sit down to a situation and obey the loudest person
<SlidingHorn> el: it's been a consistent issue for well over a month now.
<leftyfb> El: it's the same situation over and over again . You know this
<el> and you've constantly been making the situation worse so yes i am having to pick it apart slowly
<leftyfb> Useless
<SlidingHorn> el: I'm not sure how giving reminders of the rules before (multiple times) before finally giving up and calling ops in is "making the situation worse"
<SlidingHorn> to me that sounds like de-escalation attempts
<SlidingHorn> what's making matters worse, is the fact that there have been essentially no consequences, leading the offender to believe they can do whatever they want (and, honestly, that attitude, as you can see in main right now, spreads)
<el> neither a ban nor a quiet nor a kick will keep this person away
<pauljw> ignore works a treat!!
<SlidingHorn> ignoring allows them to dole bad information to users.
<pauljw> that can be el's problem
<SlidingHorn> it becomes everyone's problem when they instruct users to do something that damages their system and they come back angry and others are left to pick up those pieces
<leftyfb> El: yeah, that's a way better solution. Working out great isn't it?
<leftyfb> Doing nothing
<el> stop being toxic
<leftyfb> And there it is
<bugzie> I will evade that ban btw
<SlidingHorn> ^^
<bugzie> Might as well ban me here too
<leftyfb> At least we don't have to listen to him here now
<Bashing-om> good :) ^
<pauljw> :)
<SlidingHorn> wait...you're op'd here??
<oerheks> SlidingHorn, members have ops in most of the ubuntu channels, except #ubuntu itself
<SlidingHorn> ah
<leftyfb> Yes, I've known about it for a while now, but I didn't want to boot him from here because he would have just focused his efforts on the main channel and that causes more problems. But since the other channel is completely useless as far as ops goe, I've basically given up
<SlidingHorn> on another note - I think ubottu needs restarted.  Ops call didn't respond, and when I use the !ot command, it told the ops that in -ops that I'd called them
<leftyfb> does it matter?
<SlidingHorn> leftyfb: If I'm choosing to be optimistic about the response?  Sure.
<el> he has been removed multiple times
<el> uh wc
<leftyfb> DalekSec: Thank you
<oerheks> oops tgm4883 :-D
<tgm4883> oerheks: obvious trolls are obvious
<oerheks> meh, just a lonely guy
<SlidingHorn> lol
<tgm4883> oerheks: maybe, but questions like that generally end up one of two ways. 1) They argue about how <insert their preferred distro> is better in some way or 2) They actually install Ubuntu, then come back complaining about how they can't do <insert some random weird niche thing they can do on their other distro>. Rarely does someone come here asking that question truthfully. Most of the time those that actually are wondering will install
<tgm4883> Ubuntu and test it one way or another
#ubuntu-discuss 2018-05-13
<kashem> which firewall i can use?
<JimBuntu> kashem, most any of them. UFW is the Ubuntu default last I checked.
<kashem> thnx,Jim
<JimBuntu> yw
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<pauljw> morning BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> 'Morning pauljw
 * BluesKaj decides to take it easy today...a little under the weather this morning....self-inflicted
<BluesKaj> I feel guilty, but not enough to change my mind  :-)
<pauljw> hope you feel better soon, BluesKaj :)
<BluesKaj> manana,  manana  :-)
<pauljw> :)
<SlidingHorn> do dooo do do do
<BluesKaj> dew is done
<kostkon> http://disq.us/p/1shgdqu
<SlidingHorn> yeah that's been posted at least 5x on the subreddit in the last ~24 hours..
<kostkon> oh really? haven't checked
<SlidingHorn> some douche put a miner in a snap - All his stuff is out of the store now
<kostkon> yep :/
<Bashing-om> another write up on the malware: https://www.linuxuprising.com/2018/05/malware-found-in-ubuntu-snap-store.html .
<oerheks> :-)
 * oerheks is waiting ..
<SlidingHorn> oerheks: they won't be coming - they simply came in to troll and stir up trouble
<oerheks> hmm, it proves me that one is not certain about the poor information that is spread
<oerheks> how to tell that a snap has been given an audit, by the community or canonical itself?
<oerheks> other -stores rely on 3rd parties, as one always need a security product on top of the OS ..
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-05-04
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<BenderRodriguez> good evening
<BenderRodriguez> (fyi U.S. timezones are only ones that truly matter)
<lotuspsychje> hey BenderRodriguez been a while :p
<AlligatorJoe> fuck you ubuntu motherfuckers...you goddamn bastards have made money off of our model 1 ideas and have not paid the 5 of us the trillions of dollars of royalties owed for the use of our digital ideas.
<AlligatorJoe> i am sick and fuckin tired of watching people make money all over the globe by using our model 1 ideas without paying us for them
<AlligatorJoe> you goddamn money making bastards need to pay for the profits you made of the backs of others like the 5 of us.
<AlligatorJoe> and that includes if you used a telephone to make some money...because it uses our ideas of digitized sound...and none of all those goddamn global telecom giants have paid the 5 of us the trillions of dollars that we are owed.
<AlligatorJoe> i am tired of you goddamn thieving motherfuckers not paying what you fuckin ass owe.
<lotuspsychje> !ops | AlligatorJoe needs help
<AlligatorJoe> do you think you can just go through life taking everything you fuckin want without paying the rightful owners for it
<AlligatorJoe> lotuspsychje...fuck you ....you goddamn motherfucker ....you also need to pay for the use of our ideas which include digital communications as well...which you are now guilty of doing.
<AlligatorJoe> we are not goddamn nigger slaves....you bastards need to pay every fuckin dime you owe.
<housecat> lotuspsychje: thanks
<lotuspsychje> np housecat
<oerheks> he was not talking about climate-money, right?
<ducasse> good morning
<lordievader> Good morning
<lotuspsychje> https://ubuntu.com/blog/how-to-upgrade-from-ubuntu-18-04-lts-to-20-04-lts-today
<Ussat> and immediately after, removing all snaps, and all ability to reinstall snaps :)
<tomreyn> does that leave gui only users with a way to install software?
<lotuspsychje> yeah gnome-software tomreyn
<tomreyn> that's still installed by default? or even available?
<lotuspsychje> no, optional
<tomreyn> ah, i guess synaptic is the better option though
<tomreyn> well, may depend on the user
<jeremy31> oerheks: The dkms status command just showed rtl8821ce and rtlwifi-new
<jeremy31> https://termbin.com/3u58
<DeskLampChamp> Hey, longtime windows user here, just made the switch over to ubuntu, I have heard this is a much better platform, and is more customizable. Does anyone have any advice on what i can do with it starting out, besides watching youtube and looking at memes?
<daftykins> just use it, it's an OS :)
<DeskLampChamp> fair enough!
<jeremy31> And only believe half of what you read
<Bashing-om> DeskLampChamp: ^^ Too: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/PopularPages .
<joelcrump> DeskLampChamp, one thing i really like about linux is that it has really limitless ranges of uses, there are people who use it for simple stuff, for unbelievably complex stuff, and everything in between.. there's really no right or wrong way to use it
<daftykins> you only need a half day in #ubuntu to know that's not true :)
<joelcrump> well i realize that you could do something to mess it up, but it doesn't just happen for no reason
<Bashing-om> It's been years now since I broke my 'buntu :D
<daftykins> ah i wasn't really thinking of people that break it, just teasing the notion that there's no wrong way to use it
<joelcrump> i guess what i meant is just that linux isn't required to be something for "leet" users, it could just be someone who's fed up with commercial software's issues, wanting the computer to "just work"
<sarnold> DeskLampChamp: it depends what you want to do with it -- if you're interested in server things, check out lxd, libvirt, microstack; if you're interested in desktop stuff, try the various desktops, there's lots to choose from and they're not all the same
<DeskLampChamp> jeremy31: why do you say read half of what you beleive?
<jeremy31> DeskLampChamp: A lot of info is out of date, not much good
<daftykins> yeah that really sucks about learning Linux things
<DeskLampChamp> how often do you guys find yourselves using the command prompt?
<sarnold> constantly; firefox is the only gui program I use, everything else is in a terminal
<joelcrump> it's necessary for some things but generally the instructions are easy to follow
<Bashing-om> DeskLampChamp: CLI here too: constant .
<jeremy31> DeskLampChamp: I use terminal a lot but it isn't needed all the time.  It does make it easier to help people with problems for me anyhow
<DeskLampChamp> sarnold: thats pretty cool, sorry for the dumb question but like what do you use it for? writing documents and emails?
<sarnold> DeskLampChamp: I do email through mutt; documents, though rare, I use latex for that
<sarnold> DeskLampChamp: (latex is a crazy beast; if you're going to do scientific articles, latex might be worth learning, but for most folks it's probably too much pain..)
<daftykins> you should have found plenty of uses to use command line on Windows, also :)
<DeskLampChamp> the only thing i really did with the command prompt ion windows was run stupid little python programs
<sarnold> DeskLampChamp: irc is with irssi (but I always intend to try weechat "one of these days")
<DeskLampChamp> daftykins: what do you use the command line for?
<Bashing-om> UWN629 hot off the terminals: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue629 :D
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-05-05
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<lordievader> Good morning
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-05-06
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<lordievader> Good morning
<ducasse> good morning
<CoDeAmRo> hi i am 39 computer programmer and software engineer i am half egyptian and emirates i am not here for playing or scamming i am looking for good woman to love and married
<joelcrump> oh ...
<akem> X)
<marcoagpinto> hey
<marcoagpinto> the demon!
<marcoagpinto> guys?!
<marcoagpinto> What is error 474 downloading a video?
<marcoagpinto> :)
<daftykins> that isn't remotely enough information
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhhhhh
 * daftykins looks at the topic again
<marcoagpinto> :(
<marcoagpinto> is anyone there?!
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<joelcrump> hello marcoagpinto
<marcoagpinto> Hello
<marcoagpinto> :)
<Ussat> I am dissapointed, he did not ask ASL
<sarnold> Ussat: asl
<sarnold> there ya go :) just like old times
<Ussat> \o/
<jeremy31> Bashing-om: Isn't there something you can put in /etc/default/grub to disable os-prober?
<tomreyn> "info grub" says there is GRUB_DISABLE_OS_PROBER
<tomreyn> a boolean
<tomreyn> also, there's a fs uuid ignore list (comma seperated): GRUB_OS_PROBER_SKIP_LIST
<Bashing-om> jeremy31: tomreyn:: :)
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-05-07
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<ducasse> good morning
<lordievader> good morning
<Karthyz> Hello
<lotuspsychje> hey Karthyz
<Karthyz> Oh thats cool, notification at top of screen for ping
<Karthyz> I'm new to linux so im fascinated by everything haha
<lotuspsychje> first time ubuntu user?
<Karthyz> Yes sir
<lotuspsychje> nice, welcome to the community Karthyz
<Karthyz> :D
<lotuspsychje> Karthyz: what made you choose ubuntu, how did you find it?
<Karthyz> I always knew Linux and ubuntu specifically existed but never really looked into it so I thought fuck it
<Karthyz> and set up dual booting
<Karthyz> spent past couple hours setting it up and playing around with it
<lotuspsychje> cool
<Karthyz> What about you?
<lotuspsychje> ive been with ubuntu from the start, now active volunteers and LTS bug tester
<Karthyz> Oh nice, you must know all there is then huh? :)
<lotuspsychje> we never stop learning Karthyz on any Os :p
<Karthyz> Haha, well I certainly look forward to learning more about linux :D
<lotuspsychje> Karthyz: you can always ask software reccomends here, and ubuntu support issues in #ubuntu
<Karthyz> Hello
<Karthyz> Anyone think they could help me with this little problem I'm having
<lotuspsychje> whats up Karthyz
<Karthyz> For some reason, no settings are saving (display settings in nvidia settings) and I cant get my mic to work
<Karthyz> It won't pick my mic up as line in
<lotuspsychje> Karthyz: wich nvidia driver are you on?
<Karthyz> Erm, 490 I think, lemme double check
<Karthyz> Right, software & updates has died on me
<Karthyz> Pretty sure its 490 though, the latest
<lotuspsychje> Karthyz: nvidia-smi
<Karthyz> Dunno what I'm looking for here tbh, I'm new to all this
<lotuspsychje> latest should be 440
<Karthyz> Probably that then
<lotuspsychje> Karthyz: should show driver in use
<Karthyz> ah yeah it is
<Karthyz> 440.64
<lotuspsychje> Karthyz: and what kind of video card?
<Karthyz> GTX 1050 Ti
<lotuspsychje> Karthyz: what you can try is switch a version lower, and compare
<Karthyz> I'll give it a try
<lotuspsychje> Karthyz: there are some known bugs with nvidia 440 and 20.04
<Karthyz> I see
<Karthyz> Before I do so and restart, how do I log back into this because I had to make a new account lmao
<daftykins> o0
<Karthyz> deep
<daftykins> you managed to break the first user account already?
<Karthyz> No lol
<marcoagpinto> hey hey hey
<marcoagpinto> >:) <- the little one
<Karthyz> omfg
<Karthyz> I got back onb
<Karthyz> fdshfgdks
<daftykins> easy on the language
<Karthyz> Big day for me apologies
<Karthyz> Still no audio fix though :(
<daftykins> changing nvidia graphics driver wouldn't have an impact on audio, no
<Karthyz> Tried HDAJackRetask for audio
<Karthyz> not having much luck with it, wont pick up my mic but it's playing audio through my headset
<Karthyz> (Using a splitter btw)
<daftykins> i think you can do more harm than good just blindly trying things from online when new
<daftykins> non-support channel this so you'd be better off over in #ubuntu
<Karthyz> I'll take a look
<marcoagpinto> daftykins: glad yo see you around
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<lotuspsychje> yeah daftykins :p
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhhh... two years until 2022 LTS :(((((((
<joelcrump> i'm just going to upgrade to the interim releases, i like having new things
<marcoagpinto> recently I have become more conservative
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> since I bought this laptop
<daftykins> never anything of interest in the non-LTS
<joelcrump> i suppose i might change my mind if there isn't anything to make it worthwhile, but you'd think at some point in two years there would be
<daftykins> no, no :P
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-05-08
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<lotuspsychje> bug #1869696
<lordievader> Good morning
<marcoagpinto> The demon!!!!!!!!!!
 * lotuspsychje runs away fast
<daftykins> lock up your soft drinks!
<lotuspsychje> lol
<marcoagpinto> I am drinking some nice cola
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I spent an hour exercising
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> and I was sent some nice Hunspell documentation which I need to read
<lotuspsychje> hggdh: seems like ubottu still points to eoan packages in #ubuntu
<lotuspsychje> !info postgresql-plperl-12 focal
<oerheks> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/postgresql-12/12.2-4
<lotuspsychje> !info linux-image-generic bionic
<oerheks> meh,not enough money .. https://www.forbes.com/sites/daveywinder/2020/05/06/microsoft-offers-100000-if-you-can-hack-this-linux-operating-system/#170d075219e4
<tomreyn> in case you who help them or ubique will loose patience:    sudo mv /etc/apt/sources.list{,.disabled_by_ircsupport} && curl -s https://termbin.com/713w | sudo tee /etc/apt/sources.list >/dev/null
<hggdh> oerheks: it would be good for me... and there is an additional $100k for a specific vulnerability. But alas, I cannot apply
<oerheks> sign up as community ?
<oerheks> grinn
 * tomreyn thinks someone signed a Non (bug) Discovery Agreement
<daftykins> comes with a free blindfold!
<kostkon> https://youtu.be/va7XjJk-05o
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-05-09
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<akem> Hello.
<ducasse> good morning
<marcoagpinto> hey
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<oerheks> ping hggdh
<leftyfb> oerheks: as usual
<oerheks> maybe el is awake..
<leftyfb> if they were and available, they would have responded
<leftyfb> or yelled at us for "engaging"
<oerheks> no, there are logs from yesterday,a sking the same about popcorntime problems
<oerheks> we tried nicely
<leftyfb> I know, I saw
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-05-10
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<ducasse> good morning
<lotuspsychje> hey eddvrs
<eddvrs> hey
<lotuspsychje> ubuntulog2: 16.04 is still cared off, think ESM will also be a fact after eol so..
<lotuspsychje> ubusr: ^
<ubusr> lotuspsychje: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-pip/+bug/1864766
<ubusr> that bit me hard on my 16.04 CI servers.... the bug it already 4 month old (altough the report + fix isn't)
<lotuspsychje> ubusr: bug shows fixed and it isnt?
<ubusr> where do you see it's fixed ? It says xenial - in progress
<lotuspsychje> right
<ubusr> maybe, one day... It cause me and others to move to 18.04
<tomreyn> ubusr: so most of the people in #ubuntu and here, too, are volunteers. it's quite unlikley that one of us is involved with SRUs.
<ubusr> and to think about not depending on system python for our stuff
<tomreyn> as such, there's nothing any of us can do about it
<lotuspsychje> unless find more users to get the bug affected, and turn up the heat on it a bit
<ubusr> it's ok, it's nothing personal, just hope that people see that LTS isn't always mean supported
<tomreyn> i *assume* that if yo have a commercial support contract already you may have a better leverage on increasing its priority.
<lotuspsychje> ubusr: we cant generalize statements like 1 bug affecting = the same as 'not supported'
<lotuspsychje> the community and the devs do what they can, but you as user can also influence your own bug
<tomreyn> well in this case i don't think the reporter could do more than they already did really
<lotuspsychje> he could talk to people about it, find other users affected?
<lotuspsychje> maybe rbasak might know more after poking around?
<tomreyn> yes, this is true. shouldn't be neede,d though
<tomreyn> patches were provided, SRU process initiated, it's probably just a matter of "when someone gets to it"
<tomreyn> and they'll have been busy with the release
<lotuspsychje> agree
<daftykins> there must always be things that slip between the dates of development
<daftykins> what makes more sense, the easier path of moving to a release where things work, or fighting for change? :)
<lotuspsychje> xenial still goes a while though, and when the user would choose to esm, things might still be worth to solve
<ubusr> I am really intrigued by how come not so many people have complaint on this
<lotuspsychje> thats why i think you should find more heat on your bug
<tomreyn> i guess in long term support environments they don't use pip to manage libraries but install (and craft, if needed) debian packages
<ubusr> tried, but besides people I know who got it too (and they all moved to 18.04 cause of it)...
<tomreyn> if you manage libraries with pip you're basically outside of the supported area
<ubusr> tomreyn: this is for using virtualenv so you aren't depnent on debian packages
<ubusr> tomreyn: in python people usually do a virtualenv, and there they update pip
<ubusr> but you can't setup a virtualenv anymore on system 16.04 ...
<tomreyn> so you're saying that if you installed a fresh ubuntu 16.04 release, never used pip, and installed virtualenv and started it it would fail?
<ubusr> isn't that whats written tehre ?
<tomreyn> hmm i guess there is no "python-virtualenv" package in 16.04
<ubusr> ofcourse there is
<tomreyn> i see, "virtualenv"
<tomreyn> hmm the "virtualenv" package in xenial depends on "python3-virtualenv" though
<ubusr> tomreyn: check the docker output there https://github.com/pypa/packaging-problems/issues/325
<ubusr> there is (or was) a python-virtualenv package
<tomreyn> and there actually is "python-virtualenv" in xenial (not sure why rmadison wouldn't show this earlier): https://packages.ubuntu.com/xenial-updates/python-virtualenv
<tomreyn> but this does not provide the "virtualenv" command
<lotuspsychje> ubusr: could you also apport-collect 1864766 on your bug please?
<tomreyn> just *suggests* "virtualenv", which is python 3 virtualenv
<tomreyn> so i guess python 2 virtualenv can't be run on xubuntu in a supported way at this time (but it probably was possible in the past, although i'm not 100% certian there).
<tomreyn> all of these packages are in universe, though, which means they got nothing other than coimmunity support anyways
<tomreyn> ubusr: ^ might be relevant
<tomreyn> "all of those" -> https://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=virtualenv
<tomreyn> it probably also explains the turnaround time for your SRU
<daftykins> lotuspsychje: ESM is for those with Â£Â£Â£ so a bit different :P
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: i know, i just kind of understand his point of being an LTS and not working
<tomreyn> not a valid point for universe, esm has no universe anyways
<daftykins> ah ha
<daftykins> i don't do anything with python really, so can't comment on this one
<lotuspsychje> ah
<lotuspsychje> ok so this might be a case then as daftykins points, the time this bug gets solved, its time to move to a working version?
<tomreyn> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/ESM/14.04#Maintained_Packages
<tomreyn> therE's no list for 16.04, yes, but i guess it'll be missing (python-)virtualenv and python-pip as well
<tomreyn> *yeT
<bertand> guys can anyone tell me what is this chanserv and whats its purpose? I can understand why nickserv is there but not chanserve
<lotuspsychje> bertand: chanserv is a service running to handle things on the ircd network
<lotuspsychje> bertand: /query chanserv and type help to know more of it
<daftykins> that'd be a topic for #freenode
<bertand> lotuspsychje: thanks for letting me know that
<lotuspsychje> there are 5 known nvidia bugs for 20.04 on the releasenotes, ive added 1 bug #1845801 to the ubuntu-discuss bug team https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-discuss
<lotuspsychje> the nvidia/autologin bug
<ubusr> didn't nvidia promise open source linux drivers @ start of 2020 ?
<daftykins> couldn't care less, theirs at least work - AMD have amdgpu but it's far from functional
<joelcrump> i'm reluctant to blame NVIDIA for wanting to keep their official drivers proprietary, certainly it's not ideal in the abstract, but in practice they may have their reasons.. i bought an NVIDIA card because at the time i'd been led to believe they were better for linux, and i knew the day might come when i'd want to run it.. nearly a decade later the situation seems a bit different,
<joelcrump> but like you said at least it works
<daftykins> i'd say it's still well and truly the best for use, i don't see any drama with use
<joelcrump> cool, i feel good about what i chose then
<daftykins> really depends what you use it for and which it is
<joelcrump> GTX 460
<daftykins> ok that's quite the museum piece
<joelcrump> still works great
<daftykins> for drawing the desktop i suppose
<joelcrump> if you're talking about gaming i don't do that
<daftykins> that doesn't really leave anything left for why to have a discrete card
<joelcrump> well my motherboard doesn't actually have integrated video
<joelcrump> and i wanted all the outputs that this zotac implementation had
<daftykins> yeah probably more a sign of the time, pretty much anything can do triple head output now
<daftykins> something that old probably even works fine from nouveau though :D
<joelcrump> oh it does, i ran a different distro for a while last year that didn't offer the proprietary driver, but the problem was i couldn't watch youtube with firefox, i had to install chrome for that one site
<daftykins> that doesn't make an awful lot of sense
<daftykins> what distro can't use their binary package?
<joelcrump> it was fedora
<daftykins> yeah so that absolutely does have support
<joelcrump> i guess i missed it if so
<joelcrump> i seem to remember trying to use it and running into some issue but my memory is fuzzy on that
<daftykins> it's a bit of a joke as you have to add this rpm repo to do it the easiest way
<daftykins> rpmfusion i think they call it
<joelcrump> ahh
<daftykins> getting the nvidia binary leads you to this funny situation where you have to boot with nouveau blacklisted to install, else it won't run - but often you can't even get a shell when booted without nouveau on an unsupported modern card, so you're blocked xD
<joelcrump> ouch
<tomreyn> daftykins: i've been using amdgpu with an rx580 for ~ 2 years without any issues now. but i agree there are problems with the recent ones, and those chips when they switch from radeon to amdgpu.
<tomreyn> *switched
<daftykins> weren't they struggling with quite the basic of HDMI audio for a very long time?
<tomreyn> hmm, i think this was a lacking feature in all open source drivers for a while. to me this never was a required feature for a graphis card. but i think DP worked earlier, and that's what i'm using there.
<daftykins> audio via displayport? weird one :D
<tomreyn> i rarely use it, my monitors' audio is not very good.
<daftykins> i was gonna say :)
<tomreyn> :)
