#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-15
<ogra> the other one is a broadcom based linksys card... running with ndiswrapper on amd64 ....
<ogra> and the built in card of my lappie doesnt work at all (no drivers)
<ajmitch> you can use ndiswrapper on amd64?
* ajmitch has a prism2 card, and a madwifi card
<Nafallo> debians kismet defaults to have gps and all files in /usr/local/* right now :-P
<ajmitch> that sounds very broken
<Nafallo> indeed
<ajmitch>  2005.06.r1-1 ?
<Nafallo> yes
<Nafallo> I debdiff against us and got afraid ;-)
<Nafallo>  # User to setid to (should be your normal user)
<Nafallo> -suiduser=your_user_here
<Nafallo> +#suiduser=your_user_here
<Nafallo> yay! :-P
<ajmitch> well it's a new upstream, of course there'll be lots of changes :)
<Nafallo> debian is - ;-)
<ogra> ajmitch, yes, you can use ndiswrapper on amd64 , since v1.1 and only with broadcom cards with win64bit driver.... but i'm fighting for a change in the package so it builds for amd64 too for breezy ...
<ajmitch> a shame my old AP is dead..
<ajmitch> at least the airport express downstairs still works :)
<Nafallo> hmm, let's see.
* Nafallo plays with man uupdate *
<Nafallo> why is backports bad == because of 1h chatting with people that thinks guifications should go in hoary-updates cause 2.10 didn't work properly when you click on the notification.
<Nafallo> *sigh* I hate users :-P.
<Nafallo> (hoary has 2.9-1 btw)
<ajmitch> hey dholbach
<dholbach> thanks for the good reviews on prefixsuffix and istanbul :)
<dholbach> hi ajmitch
<Burgundavia> why is it that as soon as I run a program in gdb, it doesn't crash?
<ajmitch> heisenbug
<ajmitch> or often a race condition or similar :)
<Burgundavia> this is a random synaptic crash. very frustrating to figure out
<Nafallo> Burgundavia: yay! please fix it :-)
<Burgundavia> Nafallo, I don't code
<Burgundavia> I am just looking to see if it is same as the existing bugs
<Nafallo> my mouse feels like a magic wand when I'm close to that window. it just vanishes :-).
<Burgundavia> yes
<Lathiat> Burgundavia: need a faster computer :)
<Burgundavia> faster debugging by have the program crash faster?
<Lathiat> no
<Lathiat> then at debug speeds
<Lathiat> it'l run as fast as normal on your computer now
<Lathiat> so it'l work. :)
<dholbach> Burgundavia: try to build it as a debug package and try again
<Burgundavia> dholbach, synaptic works in gdb, unlike other stuff
<dholbach> Burgundavia: at the end of wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingTips is a brief description
<Burgundavia> I just can't make it crash
<dholbach> Burgundavia: maybe it crashes with debugging symbols :-p
<Burgundavia> rofl
<sistpoty> hm... i just tried to build kaffe (UniverseUnmetDeps) and it seems that in debian all issues have been adressed... (http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=318785)... should i put kaffe to the sync from debian-section?
<ajmitch> might as well
<ajmitch> does it break UVF?
<sistpoty> hm... well kaffe is currently broken, and imo a debian sync would fix it
<ajmitch> right
<sistpoty> I'll try to build with latest sid source... if it succeeds, i'll put it to sync from debian, ok?
<ajmitch> ok
<sistpoty> but I'll do that tomorrow ;) (took an eternity to build with sid-sources)
<sistpoty> err with breezy-sources
* Burgundavia hugs dholbach 
<dholbach> :-)
<SloMoSnail> good night everybody :)
<sistpoty> gn8 SloMoSnail
* sistpoty needs some sleep... gn8 folks
<Nafallo> night all
<Burgundavia> tseng, muine also crashes after finishing the last song in the queue
<tseng> im not sure what you want me to tell you
<Burgundavia> nothing
<tseng> it doesnt crash that often here
<Lathiat> Burgundavia: what plugins are you using?
<tseng> Burgundavia: nothing.
<Burgundavia> Lathiat, only the notty area one
<Lathiat> whats that?
<tseng> trayicon
<Burgundavia> ya
<Lathiat> oh right
<Lathiat> well
<Lathiat> works for me
<tseng> exactly
<Burgundavia> why I am only bothering you here and not with a bug report
<tseng> ok, as long as you dont expect me to take action
<Burgundavia> I realize that there is little you can do
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> does mono have a working debugger?
<tseng> what did I say yesterday
<tseng> and debugging gstreamer apps
<Lathiat> i have no idea i wasnt watching yesterday :)
<tseng> its useless
<Lathiat> right
<tseng> in my experience
<Lathiat> yay :(
<Lathiat> debug it on windows ;p
<tseng> a few times a second
<tseng> you get timer events from gst
<tseng> if you try and step through it
<tseng> you will be there all day
<tseng> if you try and step in bigger blocks, you throw SIGPOWER all over the floor
<Lathiat> hrm :\
<Lathiat> avahi_set_errno (client, AVAHI_ERR_DBUS_ERROR);
<Lathiat> oops
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, why are you subscribed to the entire wiki?
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: a lack of sanity
<Burgundavia> ok, just wondering
<ajmitch> I should try & restrict the regex to motu related topics
* dholbach doesnt mind
<dholbach> :)
<ajmitch> dholbach: as I said, lack of sanity ;)
<dholbach> merci beaucoup
<ajmitch> hehe
<Burgundavia> well, I have been filled your inboxes with crap recently
<ajmitch> I don't mind
<ajmitch> it's a drop in the bucket compared to the other crap I get :)
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, are you also crazy enough to suscribe to the entire of the bugzilla?
<ajmitch> oh no
<ajmitch> I'm not that silly
<Burgundavia> there can't be that many (I am one of them)
<ajmitch> heh
* ajmitch will bbl
<dholbach> hm a 60k apt/sources.list doesnt seem to work
<Lathiat> 60k?
<dholbach> yes
<ajmitch> dholbach: apt-get.org ?
<dholbach> yes :)
<dholbach> i have to finish something for feature freeze
<dholbach> so i'm further automating that crack via python-apt
<ajmitch> ah great :)
<ajmitch> how's that going?
<dholbach> awfully slow
<ajmitch> makes sense
<ajmitch> I have a script that works on parsing source lists
<ajmitch> probably written the slowest way possible though
<dholbach> same for me :)
<ajmitch> it's what I used for the rfp list, zope lists etc
<ajmitch> not using python-apt, though :)
<dholbach> WOW, it now downloads NEW source packages
<dholbach> ROCKNROLL
<ajmitch> great! :)
* ajmitch is trying to get his laptop working again
<ajmitch> after a bad test of initramfs
<dholbach> ouch
<dholbach> now i need to figure out, if pbuilder works nicely with it, and i'm happy
<ajmitch> I just had to get grub using initrd again
<ajmitch> ok, off to lunch, back to work, bbl ;)
<dholbach> see you
<bddebian> Ah, this channel is so exciting this time of day :-)
<bmonty> bddebian, you make it exciting :)
<bddebian> Well I have to be good for SOMETHING :-)
<bmonty> looks like I have a nice thunderstorm heading my way
<bddebian> We had ours yesterday
<bmonty> I hope it is decent so I won't have to go out and water the yard tonight
<bddebian> Damn I hate job hunting :-(
<comadreja> hello all
<bddebian> Heya comadreja
<bmonty> hey comadreja
<comadreja> how are you all
<comadreja> sorry for not being visible last days
<comadreja> I'm having some terrible job pressure
<bddebian> Heh, I know that feeling :-)
<comadreja> We need to finish some software and we have not enough people
<comadreja> it's like we'd like to have ten hands
<bddebian> I'd be happy if I worked with people that had 1 brain.. ;-)
<comadreja> hehehe really ? that bad ?
<bmonty> so if I have a debdiff file, how do I apply it against an unpacked source tree?
<bddebian> comadreja: Yes
<bddebian> bmonty:  patch -p[patch level]  < foo.debdiff I think
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> kornbluth.freenode.net
<bmonty> bddebian: yeah, that worked, thanks
<bddebian> NP
<ajmitch> hi bmonty, bddebian
<bmonty> hi ajmitch
<ajmitch> bddebian: job hunting? again?
<comadreja> hey ajmitch :)
<ajmitch> hi comadreja
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch, yeah, unfortunately
<bddebian> ajmitch: Well I didn't get fired this time if that is what you mean :-)
<comadreja> I'm looking for a new job too...
<comadreja> this one is too stressing
<ajmitch> bddebian: well that's an improvement :)
<bddebian> :'-(
<ajmitch> what's wrong with your current job?
<bddebian> It sucks
<ajmitch> that's very descriptive
<bddebian> Over 2 hours to get to work this morning.  Stupid people.  Ignorant / non-involved management. Windows ;-) Ad nauseum :-)
<Lathiat> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5791782530
<ajmitch> bddebian: ah, I use windows, but it's a <10 minute walk to work for me :)
<bddebian> Lathiat: :-)
<bddebian> ajmitch: I think I'll try the FSF admin job.. ;-P
<ajmitch> good luck
<ajmitch> don't let them catch you installing non-free software on there ;)
<bddebian> Bah, they're in Boston.  Screw that. :-)  Not to mention about 1/2 of what I make currently :-)
<Lathiat> haha
<ajmitch> you're meant to work for them for the love of The Cause
<bmonty> Boston rules
<bddebian> ajmitch: Not hardly d00d :-)
<bddebian> I don't think they'd appreciate me pummeling RMS ;-P
<ajmitch> bddebian: RMS would be your boss
<bddebian> bmonty: Well it would be a little bit of a drive and I'm not moving for half my current pay ;-)
<bmonty> you could try it out, and then get a higher paying IT job....there are plenty of them in that area
* bddebian pulls the cotton from bmonty 's ears
<bmonty> hey I like that cotton!
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> kornbluth.freenode.net
<bddebian> Hmm, yeah going from Director of IT at a Nike Division to IT Manager at my current company to "sysadmin" at the FSF looks really good on the CV/Resume ;-P
<ajmitch> bddebian: hey, you can put 'MOTU' on there soon ;)
<bddebian> No apparently I can't since no one shows up to meetings and Mez says I need "someone to vouch for me" ;-P
<ajmitch> yes, you do need a couple of people to speak up for you
<ajmitch> and this week's TB meeting was unfortunate
<bmonty> bddebian: :P
* bddebian stops doing shit until he finds his "voucher" ;-P
* bddebian hides
<ajmitch> if you stop, noone will speak up for you ;)
* dholbach has a dj-vu :)
<bddebian> Sounds like a chicken and egg problem to me.. :-)
<bddebian> dholbach: ?
<dholbach> looks as we had that conversation already earlier today :)
<bddebian> Oh, sorry
<dholbach> don't worry
<bddebian> ajmitch didn't get to hear my whining ;-)
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> kornbluth.freenode.net
<dholbach> ah ok :)
<ajmitch> bddebian: I think I can live without hearing it
* bmonty starts tuning his violin
<bddebian> dholbach: See, I get no love.. ;-P
<dholbach> bddebian: me neither - python hates me
<ajmitch> dholbach: python is lovely
<ajmitch> dholbach: when do you need this script working?
<dholbach> feature freeze is ... erm tomorrow?
<dholbach> and i need to have it working/building/... :)
<ajmitch> ok, I can help out if you want :)
<dholbach> right now i'm trying to do something simple
<ajmitch> I understand mdz wanted a list of packages to import by freeze time?
<ajmitch> or at least packages to review
<dholbach> yes and that (for me) depends on building a huge load of packages, which could be reviewed
<dholbach> and a list of stuff that doesnt build, but might be working after a bit of fiddling
<dholbach> (and sorted out all the crack that we have)
<dholbach> you don't want to do that manually
<ajmitch> certainly true
<dholbach> right now, i want something like    pbuilder build bla*.dsc     (bla is in a string i have)
<dholbach> and i'm crying over Popen
<ajmitch> I've got a little bit of spare cpu power here for building & I can run scripts ;)
<dholbach> i'm sure that's crackful
<ajmitch> hmm, I used popen, I'm sure..
<dholbach> ok
<dholbach> problem is bla*.dsc has to process by another command
<ajmitch>         if os.system("/usr/bin/dpkg --compare-versions %s %s %s" %
<ajmitch>                      (versions[0] ,
<ajmitch>                       operator,
<ajmitch>                       versions[1] )):
<ajmitch> nope, I used that
<ajmitch> the shell needs to expand * ?
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> i got an error
<dholbach> "bla*.dsc is no suitable" candidate or something
<ajmitch> can your python program not write this into a script & then exec /bin/bash ?
<ajmitch> evil, I know
<dholbach> hm
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> it could
<dholbach> *clickediclack*
<ajmitch> but this doesn't have to be nice, it just has to work
<bmonty> what is the purpose of the script?
<ajmitch> bmonty: take a *large* list of apt sources, get the src packages contained there, and build them, afaik
* bddebian still says "throw them to the buildds" :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: that's crazy - these packages are often full of crap, to put it mildly
<bddebian> ajmitch: The UniverseUnmetDeps packages?
<ajmitch> apt-get.org
<bmonty> if the packages are full of crap, why build them?
<dholbach> ajmitch: you rock
<ajmitch> unmet deps are different
<dholbach> os.system did it
<bddebian> Oohh, sorry
<ajmitch> dholbach: excellent
<dholbach> i used subprocess.call() before
<dholbach> rock AND roll
<bddebian> Don't we have enough work to do without apt-get.org? :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: yes, we do
<comadreja> dholbach : glob ?
<ajmitch> and I feel bad about not doing my share
<bddebian> As well you should :-)
<dholbach> comadreja: glob?
<comadreja> dholbach : glob.glob ("*.dsc")
<seth_k> bddebian, the buildds eat children if you make them unhappy :D
<dholbach> ajmitch: don't worry
<comadreja> will return a list of *.dsc files
<Lathiat> seth_k: heh
<bddebian> seth_k: Well as long as they aren't MY children :-)
<dholbach> comadreja: oh cool... next time :)
<dholbach> ok it works
<dholbach> runs
<dholbach> makes sleep badly
<dholbach> but it runs
<ajmitch> hehe
<ajmitch> dholbach: so it's building all of apt-get.org now?
<dholbach> it tries to
<dholbach> all the stuff we don't have
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> if there's any other scripting needed, I can probably supply :)
<ajmitch> I've still got to get the source for unmet deps
<bmonty> is packages.ubuntu.com, the latest and greatest on packages that are available?
<dholbach> i'll see what the output is tomorrow
<dholbach> ok... have a good night
<dholbach> i'm off
<bmonty> nite dholbach
<dholbach> it's !!!! 4 !!!! already
<bddebian> Later dholbach
<ajmitch> dholbach: good work, night
<dholbach> night bmonty, ajmitch, comadreja, Lathiat, bddebian - you guys rock!
<ajmitch> bddebian: are there any packages that just need a rebuild that I can upload?
<bmonty> ajmitch: doodle is ready to go, there is a link to the debdiff on unmet deps page
<bddebian> ajmitch: There were, but I think Nafallo may have hit them today
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> I see you have vipec listed as needs love, there's a patch in debian's BTS that I'll apply
<bmonty> BTW, whats the deal with gcc 4.0 not building packages?
<bddebian> bmonty: A lot of it are just more strict C rules
<ajmitch> gcc 4.0 is a lot stricter
<ajmitch> bmonty: doodle is just a rebuild?
<bmonty> k, makes sense
<bmonty> ajmitch: I had to change the control file
<ajmitch> then you have to change the version to reflect that
<ajmitch> you can't just have a build1 version if you change anything else
<bmonty> so should it be 0.6.2-ubuntu1?
<ajmitch> next debian upload that MoM synced would overwrite that
<ajmitch> 0.6.2-3ubuntu1
<bmonty> k, I'll fix that
<ajmitch> * change libdoodle dependency to libextractor1c2
<ajmitch> makes no sense
<bddebian> Goddamn, everyone wants programmers.. :'-(
<bmonty> it was libextractor1c which is now libextractor1c2
<ajmitch> then say that :)
<ajmitch> I can see that when I look at the control file, but not at the changelog
<bmonty> ok
<ajmitch> and mention the build-dep change as well
<ajmitch> and add the fam dep back in
<ajmitch> when you asked the other day, you said that libfam0 depends on it
<ajmitch> it only recommends
<ajmitch> bddebian: see, I'm this picky with other people, not just you ;)
<bmonty> ok, got it
* bddebian feels better :)
<bmonty> ajmitch: where did you see a build-dep change?
<ajmitch> sorry, not build-dep, but depends for doodled
<bmonty> ok, I got that
<crimsun> hum.
<ajmitch> hey crimsun
<crimsun> hey ajmitch, bmonty, bddebian
<bmonty> hey crimsun
<crimsun> strange, i386 failed pyxmms
<ajmitch> why is that strange?
<chillywilly> hi
<crimsun> ajmitch: python2.3 is uninstallable on i386?
<ajmitch> crimsun: it shouldn't be, let me check
<ajmitch> zope still depends on it
<bmonty> ajmitch: new debdiff is at http://www.montynet.org/ubuntu/debdiff/doodle_0.6.2-3ubuntu1.debdiff
<crimsun> the other three arches built it just fine, so it should have built on i386
<crimsun> looks like a chroot issue
<bddebian> Heya crimsun
<ajmitch> crimsun: definitely, apt-get update must have failed
<bddebian> chillywilly!!!!!!!!
<ajmitch> see the 'could not stat..' lines
<crimsun> yep
<chillywilly> bddebian!!!
<ajmitch> bmonty: much better :)
<bmonty> thanks :)
<ajmitch> getting build-deps, this could take awhile
<chillywilly> ajmitch: did you get your net connection upgrade yet?
<ajmitch> chillywilly: of course not
<ajmitch> I live in NZ
<chillywilly> bah...
<chillywilly> well that sucks
<bmonty> so, I'm looking at the package drip and it build-depends on libavifile-0.7 which apt says is uninstallable, but ubuntu.packages.com has it....what gives?
<chillywilly> maybe you should switch the IP over carrier pigeon ;)
<bddebian> bmonty: "apt-cache policy libavifile"
<ajmitch> chillywilly: it'd probably be faster
<chillywilly> HEH
<ajmitch> get them to carry DVDs
<ajmitch> jumbo packets
<chillywilly> hehe
<bmonty> bddebian: ok, but I can download the package from packages.ubuntu.com, thats why I'm confused
<chillywilly> anyone know if the linux kernel went with the 4 digit version number thingy?
<crimsun> yes
<chillywilly> cause kernel.org show 2.6.12.4 being the latest stable version, so I was thinking they did
<chillywilly> ok
<crimsun> ubuntu uses the fourth number to denote the kernel abi
<crimsun> (in the revision)
<bddebian> bmonty: What repo does it say it's in?
<bmonty> http://packages.ubuntu.com/breezy/libs/libavifile-0.7
<bddebian> Hmm
<ajmitch>   Version table:
<ajmitch>      1:0.7.43.20050224-1ubuntu4 0
<ajmitch>        1200 http://10.18.1.1 breezy/universe Packages
<ajmitch> that is annoying - I had libavifile0.7 installed (no - )
<bmonty> The following information may help to resolve the situation:
<bmonty> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<bmonty>   libavifile-0.7-dev: Depends: libavifile-0.7 (= 1:0.7.43.20050224-1ubuntu4) but it is not going to be installed
<bddebian> Hmm, I already have it installed it seems :-(
<crimsun> wasn't libavifile-0.7 transitioned?
<bddebian> There is a c2 but it's an older rev
<bddebian>  .38 vs .43
<ajmitch> crimsun: from c102, iirc
<bmonty> bugzilla says it was renamed to libavifile-0.7
<DoNnInHa> oi BIGBRUNO :)
<BIGBRUNO> DoNnInHa: Hi
<DoNnInHa> BIGBRUNO; :P
<DoNnInHa> todo mundo aqui fala ingles11255
<DoNnInHa> todo mundo aqui fala ingles?
<bmonty> dvr source package has the same issue
<bddebian> Someone please kill me
* Lathiat kills bddebian 
<bddebian> Thanks Lathiat :-)
<ajmitch> bmonty: doodle uploaded
<bmonty> ajmitch: just same it on the RSS feed, thanks
<bmonty> r/same/saw
<ajmitch> bddebian: marks the debian bug for vipec, will fix soon :)
<ajmitch> s/marks/marked/
<bddebian> ajmitch: ?
<DoNnInHa> noh
<DoNnInHa> esse treim eh mto ruim
<ajmitch> DoNnInHa: english in here, please
<ajmitch> bddebian: on the wiki, I put a link to the debian bts entry for vipec..
<bddebian> ajmitch: Ah, cool
<DoNnInHa> quero ir pra brasnet :P nao sei falar ingles
<DoNnInHa> bye
<bddebian> Ohh, VP of IT and CIO for $200,000+.  That'd do ;-)
<ajmitch> go for it
<bddebian> Hell I'd buy ya a new laptop for that one ajmitch ;-P
<DoNnInHa> fui
<ajmitch> bddebian: that'd be nice ;)
<ajmitch> sigh, a 1-line patch, which patch system should I use today?
<chillywilly> debdiff ;)
<ajmitch> chillywilly: useful comments, thanks :P
<bddebian> write something in perl to patch it.. ;-P
<chillywilly> oh crikey...
<ajmitch> I mean like quilt, dpatch, etc
<chillywilly> write a python script
<bddebian> ajmitch: Be creative ;-P
<chillywilly> that calls one of those and downloads pr0n
<bddebian> Hehe
<LaserJock> Is anybody familiar with the UniversePackageWithoutDesktopFile wiki page?
<chillywilly> it's probably the page where there are univer packages without desktop files
<chillywilly> universe too
<chillywilly> :)
<bddebian> Yep, that'd be it :-)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yes, it's out of date, needs to be refreshed for breezy
<LaserJock> well, yeah I know that :-)
<LaserJock> I have some questions about it
<LaserJock> I was wanting to help get some of those .desktop files made
<LaserJock> but some of the packages listed don't seem to need .desktop files
<ajmitch> LaserJock: great
<ajmitch> that's why the list needs updated :)
<ajmitch> I think it was made from packages that have a .menu file but no .desktop
<LaserJock> do they all really need .desktop files though
<LaserJock> ?
<LaserJock> for instance, does vim-python need to be in the menu?
<bddebian> Damn, $90,000/yr for a Sr. Linux Admin.. Sheesh
<ajmitch> maybe not, but I'm not one to make that call :)
<LaserJock> while that clutter users' menus?
<LaserJock> *will
<ajmitch> yes
<chillywilly> bddebian: looking for a new job?
<bddebian> chillywilly: Aye
<ajmitch> we have to find some balance between making programs visible & not cluttering up the menus with hundreds of entries
<LaserJock> well, is there other uses for the .desktop files beside menus?
<LaserJock> I saw on the freedesktop.org site that it looked like their use for mimetypes is depriciated
<ajmitch> not sure, there was talk of using them for a new gnome-app-install
<ajmitch> I think the usage is just menu
<LaserJock> well, it looks like we could use the NoDisplay key to keep non-gui type apps out of the menu, but still have the flexability to use it in the future
<ajmitch> Amaranth is the menu man here
<Amaranth> hihi
<Amaranth> what's up?
<Amaranth> NoDisplay is what smeg uses
<ajmitch> UniversePackageWithoutDesktopFile
<Amaranth> so it'll work
<Amaranth> if you use Hidden smeg won't see it and it's mime type info will be ignored
<LaserJock> but is it worth the effort for a lot of the CLI type stuff?
<ajmitch> Amaranth: aside from smeg, we're talking about making .desktop files for those packages that don't have them
<Amaranth> ajmitch: i know, i was just telling him NoDisplay is the solution for hiding things
<ajmitch> right
<LaserJock> so should the focus be on Breezy and not Hoary?
<bddebian> Yes
<bddebian> I wonder if I can lie well enough for the Sr. Linux Admin job (RedHat and SuSe, yuck)
<ajmitch> certainly
<Amaranth> .desktop files are a nice low hanging fruit
<bddebian> So is UniverseUnmetDeps
* bddebian pokes
<ajmitch> Amaranth: we need someone to collate .desktop files that people contribute
<ajmitch> sincenot everyone can fix up & patch a package to include them
<LaserJock> well, that was what I was wondering
<Amaranth> i don't know how either :P
<Amaranth> i can tell you a .desktop file is valid, but so can desktop-file-validate
<ajmitch> right, I'll volunteer for now & hand it off to someone else who's worthy :)
<ajmitch> it's mainly including it in the packaging, which I can do well enough
<Amaranth> one of these days i'm going to start spamming bugs for invalid .desktop files
<bmonty> ajmitch: I could help out with that also
<ajmitch> bmonty: great, thanks
<Amaranth> i've never added a file to a package, just edited existing files
<ajmitch> we just need people to start submitting them
<ajmitch> maybe Amaranth can spam the forums for contributions ;)
<Amaranth> and there is the intltool scripts that need to be done that i don't know about
<LaserJock> well, I'm not much of a packager, but the .desktop files are easy enough to make
<bmonty> ajmitch: I'm working on a package called amsynth, it is copying in config.guess and config.sub from /usr/share/misc/config and causing the debdiff to be rather large with all the changes, is that cool for a package that only needs a rebuild?
<LaserJock> what if we made a thread in the UbuntuForums Breezy Badger form where people could just post the .desktop files?
<bddebian> bmonty: No, ignore that crap :-)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: good idea
<LaserJock> I think first off, the list of packages needing .desktop files needs to be updated
* ajmitch doesn't like the diff getting messy 
<Amaranth> ajmitch: basically anything i could do for you is covered by a shell script
<ajmitch> sure
<ajmitch> Amaranth: ok :)
<Amaranth> unless you need help figuring out what category to put something in
<bmonty> bddebian: so...just cut it out of the debdiff?
<bddebian> bmonty: I would but I'm probably the wrong person to ask :-)
<ajmitch> bmonty: yeah, it's the easiest way for now
<bmonty> too easy :)
<LaserJock> so, would it be OK if I found the packages that needed .desktop files in Breezy and updated the wiki?
<ajmitch> gah, what is mcs 1.0.5 source still doing in breezy?
<bmonty> ajmitch: I added a debdiff for amsynth, just needs a rebuild
<bmonty> and with that....good night everyone
<bddebian> Good night bmonty, good work
<ajmitch> bmonty: thanks, night
<bddebian> Howdy ogra
* ajmitch removes mcs from unmet deps
<ajmitch> that should never be on there, and mono-assemblies-arch should be gone from the archive
<bddebian> So fix it d00d
<ajmitch> umm, what do you think I'm doing?
<bddebian> Yapping ;-P
<Lathiat> haha
<LaserJock> ajmitch: is there something I should do for this .desktop thing or should I let you (MOTU) take care of it?
<ajmitch> write .desktop files? :)
<ajmitch> we'll sort out what packages need them asap
<LaserJock> who should I give them to?
<LaserJock> should I just start posting them in the Ubuntu Forums?
<LaserJock> or would the wiki be more appropriate?
<ajmitch> wiki is where we will see them quicker
<LaserJock> oh, ok
<LaserJock> ok, another question, are the packages on the UniverseUnmetDeps wikipage for Breezy?
<bddebian> Yes
<LaserJock> only Breezy?
<bddebian> Yes
<LaserJock> cool, thanks
<bddebian> NP
<seth_k> speaking of .desktop files, someone want to figure out why this .desktop file refuses to show in the KDE menu?
<bddebian> Time for me to head for bed.  Gnight folks, thanks LaserJock and good work as always ajmitch ;-)
<seth_k> night bddebian
<bddebian> Gnight seth_k :-)
<LaserJock> goodnight
<seth_k> http://sethkinast.com/ubuntu/breezy/kmobiletools/ << I patched this to install its .desktop file to /usr/share/applications/kde, but it just will not show up in the K menu and I don't know why.
<seth_k> after I can figure out this issue it gets to go on revu
<LaserJock> seth_k: have you tried taking out the X-KDE and X_DCOP lines?
<seth_k> LaserJock, not sure, I've tried so many things... I'll try that now :)
<seth_k> I think I just cheated off of kandy's .desktop file or something
<seth_k> okay, changed and building
<seth_k> cross fingers!
<Amaranth> X-* things are extensions to the spec and shouldn't make a difference
<Amaranth> seeing how kde and gnome both ignore keys they don't understand
<LaserJock> seth_k: looking at http://standards.freedesktop.org/desktop-entry-spec/latest/ar01s04.html it says that you could use just StartupNotify=true and I would think you would want OnlyShowIn=KDE
<Amaranth> wrong
<Amaranth> if these could possibly have any use at all in GNOME or XFCE do not use OnlyShowIn=KDE
<Amaranth> kmobiletools.desktop doesn't have a Categories key
<Amaranth> so kmenu doesn't know where to put it
<seth_k> yeah it does... at the bottom?
<Amaranth> in your diff?
<Amaranth> ah, ok
<seth_k> removed the two X- lines, still not showing up
<seth_k> I've verified that the file does exist at /usr/share/applications/kde/
<Amaranth> you ran desktop-file-validate on the final .desktop file?
<seth_k> yes
<seth_k> no output
<Amaranth> dunno what to tell you, it should be showing up in the 'Utilities' menu
<seth_k> I know :(
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> kornbluth.freenode.net
<seth_k> could it be an external bug?
<seth_k> or is there some sort of update menus call I need to make in debian/rules ?
<Lathiat> nope
<Lathiat> but
<Lathiat> your gnome-panel might suck
<seth_k> I'm using KDE :P
<Amaranth> it shows up here?
<seth_k> ??
<seth_k> it shows up in your menu?
<Amaranth> it shows up in gnome-menus and kmenu
<seth_k> O__O
<Amaranth> well, my simplified version of it (stripped translations)
<Amaranth> let me try to install the package
<seth_k> thanks, Amaranth
<Amaranth> it is showing up here
<Amaranth> with the package
<Amaranth> in kmenu and gnome-menus
<seth_k> wow
<seth_k> so all this time
<seth_k> it's just been my kde that sucks
<seth_k> hmmmmm
<Amaranth> it's in utilities
<seth_k> that's another problem for another day I guess
<LaserJock> Amaranth: would it be possible to have smeg put OnlyShowIn=KDE in the .desktop files in /usr/share/applications/kde/ as sort of a "on/off" flag?
<Amaranth> LaserJock: it puts NoDisplay=true
<LaserJock> aww, ok
<Amaranth> and/or uses an <Exclude>, i can't remember what pyxdg does now
<Amaranth> i follow the spec, not some hack :p
<LaserJock> does it do that for all of the kde files or do you have to manually pick each one?
<seth_k> I wonder why it wouldn't be showing up for me...
<seth_k> Amaranth, are you running Breezy?
<Amaranth> it does that for every file
<Amaranth> LaserJock: i don't touch files in /usr/share/applications/kde directly and i don't make a user copy with NoDisplay=true unless the user chooses to hide it
<Amaranth> LaserJock: i don't make smeg systematically hunt for all KDE apps and hide them, that's stupid
<LaserJock> yeah, that makes sense
<Amaranth> seeing how KDE users use smeg
<LaserJock> I just thought it would be cool to have a KDE "on/off" switch
<LaserJock> same would apply to Gnome apps
<Amaranth> bleh
<Amaranth> users don't care
<Amaranth> real users, not biased developer-users
<Amaranth> kde app, gnome app, whatever, as long as it works
<seth_k> Amaranth, are you running Breezy or Hoary?
<LaserJock> sure, that makes sense8-)
<Amaranth> seth_k: breezy
<seth_k> thanks
<seth_k> still odd, but oh well :)
<LaserJock> heah Amaranth, I was wondering how did your hard drive overheated?
<Amaranth> fsck
<Amaranth> two HD sitting on top of each other and an auto-fsck
<LaserJock> really?
<Amaranth> stupid auto-fsck-after-30-mounts
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> i hate that
<LaserJock> what filesystem?
<Lathiat> whatd rock
<Lathiat> is online fscking
<Amaranth> ext3
<Lathiat> like ufs on freebsd has
<Lathiat> -> win
<Amaranth> the partition table was gone
<Amaranth> every tool i could find that would read it said it was a new drive
<LaserJock> hmmm, I've heard of using dd to copy the contents of a disk when other tools can't read it, but I've never tried it
<Amaranth> i had two choices: sit without a computer and no way of repairing it for a month or repartition
<Amaranth> and when that month was up i'd be somewhere where i won't have internet access
<Amaranth> not often, anyway
<Amaranth> college sucks
<LaserJock> no internet access at college?
<Lathiat> hrm, our colleges tend to have rathert good internet access
<Amaranth> they don't have dorms, i'm living with an uncle until i get a place
<Amaranth> it's a community college thing
<LaserJock> where?
<Amaranth> sioux city
<LaserJock> cool, I'm in Reno, NV
<Amaranth> (google, only one of those in the US)
<Amaranth> iowa
<LaserJock> never been to iowa, I've stayed to the Rockies or west :-)
<Amaranth> *shrug*
<Amaranth> anyway, game time, bbl
<LaserJock> yeah, time to go to bed for me
<LaserJock> good night all and thanks for the info ajmitch
<cat> hey people
<siretart> hi folks
<\sh> hey siretart
<siretart> huhu \sh, nice to soo read you :)
<siretart> s/soo/ *g*
<\sh> siretart: ah...I'm not trying to become mad ,-) right now I have too much workload here (!= ubuntu stuff)
<siretart> oh, I feel with you. I had this the last 2 weeks :/
<\sh> siretart: and my result was: uploading a new version to main without a permission *peinlich*
<siretart> \sh: well, daniels gave you permission, dind't he?
<\sh> siretart: but not kamion or matt...
<\sh> hey ogra
<Burgundavia> ogra, aside from ndis guid, what was the other tool your student was working on?
<jstr> hey guys
<jstr> I want to join up and write code for you
<siretart> jstr: cool!
<siretart> jstr: any special in mind?
<jstr> well thats it... i dont know
<jstr> i really like using c
<jstr> im an undergraduate comp sci student with no actual programming experience in the work place, however i have completed heeps of units in the field
<siretart> well, we seldom do actual coding. more often, we package programs, and have to fix compilation errors from software, which doesn't built with newer compilers like gcc-4.0
<jstr> i have done units in C (in a UNIX environment), C++, to many java units :(, UML, project management
<jstr> well, i know how to make MAKE files at least :)
<siretart> :)
<siretart> jstr: well, have a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUTodo
<siretart> jstr: we really need every helping hand, there are tons of stuff to do
<jstr> well im prepared to put in at least an 8 hour day a week for the rest of the year
<ajmitch> we don't do so much programming as packaging
<ajmitch> that's good
<jstr> its just so when i graduate i have some nice things to write on my resume
<ajmitch> not because you want to help the community? ;)
<jstr> that aswell.
<ajmitch> we do a lot of fixing packages that are broken, creating new packages, etc
<jstr> i have never done anything like that before so it will be something new for me to learn
<sistpoty> hi all
<janimo> hi sistpoty
<ajmitch> hi sistpoty
<\sh> mmm
<\sh> hmmm
<\sh> I should create a new ejabberd package
<\sh> some good new features
<janimo> \sh did the voip goal for breezy get deffered?
<janimo> Isee you were on the team initially
<ajmitch> you'll have to pass the motu review gauntlet first ;)
<ajmitch> janimo: I think so
<ajmitch> there are a few deferred goals, sadly
<janimo> that shtoom one was very appealing though..
<janimo> I guess upstream didn;t move fast enough
<Lathiat> shtoom has a 2 second audio delay for me :\
<\sh> janimo: yes...looks like...cause there r some issues twisted...
<\sh> janimo: I tried twisted 2.x and shtoom but didn't work
<Lathiat> \sh: it worked for me last check
<Lathiat> always has really
<Lathiat> for me anyway
<\sh> Lathiat: I have to check it again
<\sh> and I need to renew the SIP Express Router packages....
<\sh> remove the provided debian/ dir and create a new one
<janimo> I think the voip goal also dependen on some central ubuntu.com ids for users which is not in place right?
<\sh> janimo: first of all, there must be a running environment of software
<\sh> janimo: then we can implement some things like single sign on
<janimo> \sh I know, I meant it's not only the technical issues that deffered the goal
<\sh> janimo: time, workload, ressources
<ajmitch> fun, new tomboy release out for tseng
<\sh> janimo: yes
<sistpoty> cu later
<siretart> woah, revu backlog finally decreasing :)
<Lathiat> yay
<Lathiat> siretart: hrm, if i try to access the pingus .changes it gives a no permisison
<siretart> Lathiat: the changes file are not meant to be downloaded
<Lathiat> heh ok
<siretart> Lathiat: I should perhaps delete them, but then I cannot reimport them in case of failure
<siretart> Lathiat: the problem is: uploads made by motus could be uploaded by anyone to ubuntu, since our keys are also in the ubuntu keyring
<siretart> Lathiat: I don't want this
<Lathiat> ah right
<Lathiat> i see
<siretart> Lathiat: e.g. I just uploaded qemu to revu to get it tested for real x86. I'm not sure if that package is ok, so I don't want to have it in universe right now
* Lathiat nods
<ajmitch> argh, vegastrike dies
* ajmitch think it need a sync from debian
<SloMoSnail> siretart: is the new ppc patch included with that qemu upload? (sorry, don't have much time atm... learning maths)
<siretart> SloMoSnail: I took the latest debian version which could be built in debian
<siretart> for ppc, that is
<SloMoSnail> siretart: wonderfull :) i'll test it on x86 and ppc in a few minutes
<ajmitch> sigh, vegastrike FTBFS
<ogra> bah games...
<ajmitch> ogra: they can be fun :)
<ajmitch> also a waste of time
<ogra> heh... yes...and the eat development tme :)
<ogra> time
<ajmitch> yes, I shouldn't do anything that would eat into MOTU time ;)
<SloMoSnail> siretart: builds fine on x86
<janimo> siretart using gcc-4?
<janimo> cause that does not work with qemu AFAIK
<SloMoSnail> janimo: nope... it is build with 3.4
<janimo> I am looking now
<janimo> built fine here on x86
<janimo> and installedd too
<SloMoSnail> janimo: same for me... and on ppc it is built fine in a few seconds it seems ;)
<janimo> on x86 it took about 5mins
<musicistaCont> i have a problem with kdevelop 3.2.0 code completion don't work only whit libstdc++ i make new PSC database but nothig what i have to do?
<siretart> SloMoSnail: great, then I'll upload that qemu upload in a minute
<janimo> easy way to clone a page in the wiki?
<janimo> do a large page similar to an existing one so a new title basically
<SloMoSnail> janimo: make a redirect... put just this in the new page: #REDIRECT OldPage
<janimo> SloMoSail thanks
<janimo> slomosnail, I want to clone the page but then heab=vily modify it, I want a template, not just an alias
<janimo> is your suggestion still valid?
<SloMoSnail> no... my suggestion was a plain redirect... no idea how you can achieve what you want...
<janimo> hmm there are templates but not for maininclusionreports as I want to write
<janimo> wikis are primitive :)
<SloMoSnail> just take one of the other maininclusionreports and copy the stuff ;) that's how i made mine...
<SloMoSnail> what package do you want in main?
<ajmitch> night all
<SloMoSnail> gn8 ajmitch
<sistpoty> gn8 ajmitch
<janimo> slomo, xfce4 & co
<janimo> about 20-30 packages
<janimo> I see edubuntu inclusion is nicely colored, I want that too :)
<DanielN> someone around?
<SloMoSnail> hi DanielN
<DanielN> hi to all first :)
<mbreit> hi all
<Mez> what was the replacemtn for xlibmesa-gl ?
<janimo> libgl1-xorg
<janimo> apt-cache search xlibmesa-gl :)
<pef> hello
<mbreit> hi pef
<SloMoSnail> is this new gnome clipboard daemon already in breezy? and what is it called?
<mbreit> SloMoSnail: do you mean gcm?
<mbreit> http://gcm.sourceforge.net/ ?
<Lathiat> isnt it integrated into gnome-session-manager or somethign
<SloMoSnail> no idea... i heard gnome 2.12 would have some kind of clipboard manager ;)
<Amaranth> it does
<Amaranth> gnome-clipboard-daemon isn't needed, it's been rolled into gnome-settings-daemon
<Lathiat> right
<Lathiat> as i thought
<SloMoSnail> Amaranth: settings or session?
<Amaranth> settings
<SloMoSnail> hmm... session seems to be more natural to me ;)
<Amaranth> i remember this because when the bugs were getting worked out it was dying all the time
<Amaranth> and you lose your theme and everything when it dies
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> yeh
<Lathiat> SloMoSnail: yeh cept its not a session daemon :)
<tseng> Lathiat: sneaking in my first rails app at work
<tseng> Lathiat: :D
<Lathiat> tseng: haha
<Lathiat> tseng: cool
<Lathiat> i havent had much chance to play with it lately
<Lathiat> busy on avahi and stuff
<Lathiat> now my address is whitelisted i can go about getting these packages uploaded i've been fixing
<SloMoSnail> tseng: can you upload the new cowbell from debian? ;)
<tseng> no, but i can sync it
<tseng> SloMoSnail: mail elmo, request cowbell sync from debian
<tseng> james.troup @ C.com
<SloMoSnail> isn't it just james?
<tseng> james.troup WFM
<SloMoSnail> ok, you're right
<SloMoSnail> done
<mbreit> btw: what happened to the i386 buildd? did it build EVER package? or just the ones that failed the last time?
<mbreit> and i am going to update the unmet deps list.... since i think that all the rebuilds on the buildd could have changed a lot
<crimsun> A good number of those unmet will need to be given back yet again due to i386 buildd screwage, it seems.
<mbreit> it seems that the buildd is still rebuilding everything...
<janimo> ogra do you know how can I steal EdubuntuMaininclusion page with minimal effort and use it a a template?
<janimo> for xfce inclusion page
<ogra> janimo, sure...
<janimo> anything more intuitive than copy-paste the sources
<ogra> janimo, but there also is a template page somewhere
<janimo> could not find one with so many nice colors ;)
<ogra> and a process description what is required and how to do it
<janimo> I know the process but I wonder how do I say in the wiki: 'fork this page'
<janimo> IOW edit the text inside the tables and leave the appearance
<janimo> but a new copy not inplace over yours :)
<ogra> click on a nonexistent report, change the url to your name and click on "create page"
<janimo> yes but the new page will be blank w/o tables and other niceties
<janimo> oh well
<janimo> I guess I'll copy paste the source
<Amaranth> hmm
<Amaranth> why doesn't muine just use inotify through gamin through gnome_vfs_monitor_add?
<Lathiat> cus gamin sucks? :)
<Amaranth> ..
<Amaranth> gamin doesn't suck, seb just didn't have the dependencies for gnome-menus setup right :p
<Amaranth> ooh, that reminds me
<Amaranth> gnome-menus 2.11.91 actually cleanly builds and runs on hoary, it's going into backports
<Lathiat> heh
<SloMoSnail> Amaranth: better question: why doesn't muine use gst, taglib or this c# tag-thingie to read the tags? and why has it the formats it can play hardcoded... now it can't play musepack although gst supports it...
<Amaranth> no <Layout> (dunno why) but since the breezy package depends on libgamin-dev it actually fixes the autoupdating
<Amaranth> SloMoSnail: it came before all of that :P
<pef> I've modified a home made deb package to be compliant with ubuntu, how should I submit it ? revu doesn't seems to be a good solution (no .diff)
<pef> http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=335
<SloMoSnail> pef: how have you created this package? dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa? then put the original source tarball in the parent directory (of the source directory) and name it kvpnc_0.7.2.orig.tar.gz
<SloMoSnail> then you'll get a diff
<pef> SloMoSnail: no, package made by the author
<SloMoSnail> so the debian stuff was already in the upstream tarball?
<pef> yes
<pef> exactly
<Amaranth> ick
<SloMoSnail> wonderfull ;)
<pef> :)
<SloMoSnail> but then just do it as i said... should work ;)
<Amaranth> linda output is awesome
<Amaranth> This package appears to conform to a newer Standards-Version that has been released. One of us is incorrect.
<Lathiat> haha
<DanielN> hrmpf
<pef> Amaranth: I've set Standards-Version to 3.6.2 in debian/control
<DanielN> isn't it possible to debootstrap breezy from hoary?
<Amaranth> linda is kind of a bitch, someone must not have liked their wife/girlfriend/mother
<SloMoSnail> pef: when you've uploaded the version with the diff against the upstream tarball i'll look at it... from the changelog your changes sound sane ;)
<pef> nice :)
<SloMoSnail> hmm... Recommends: vpnc | freeswan
<SloMoSnail> better Depend on it... at least it seems to be needed at runtime, right?
<Amaranth> oh no, not another one of those
<Amaranth> apt-file's package is like that too
<Amaranth> supposedly it's a feature, not a bug
<pef> SloMoSnail: freeswan is only usefull if you work on a freeswan vpn, otherwise useless depend
<SloMoSnail> Amaranth: hm what's it with apt-file? does it recommend curl although it needs it? ;)
<Amaranth> yeah
<Amaranth> curl or something else
<SloMoSnail> pef: but i assume it doesn't work without one of these two...
<pef> SloMoSnail: if freeswan isn't installed, only the protocol freeswan won't be available, but others yes
<SloMoSnail> pef: and for copyright... it's GPL2 so change the path at the end to /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL-2
<SloMoSnail> pef: but does anything work with it when neither freeswan and vpnc are installed?
<pef> SloMoSnail: You can use openvpn :) I have to check this field more carefully
<SloMoSnail> pef: but then you must have openvpn installed ;) that's exactly the problem...
<SloMoSnail> pef: and maybe use dh_install instead of install for the desktop file... but that shouldn't matter much :)
<SloMoSnail> pef: other than that i'm ok with this package
<pef> SloMoSnail: I think putting Depends: openvpn | freeswan | foo, so the package can be used and all "protocol" packages as Suggest ?
<SloMoSnail> what are protocol packages?
<pef> SloMoSnail: openvpn, vpnc, pptpclient, freeswan (to use the protocol in the program)
<SloMoSnail> ah ok... so a depend on one of those and a suggest for all of them? hmm, could be ok but better ask someone else for that
<SloMoSnail> but just notice me when you've uploaded a new version... i'll look through it then and maybe you get a vote ;)
<pef> SloMoSnail: I had the same problem with datakiosk (databases utility), does I must include all qt db drivers ? (sqlite, mysql, pgsql, ...)
<pef> SloMoSnail: just have this problem to solve and it will be uploaded
<SloMoSnail> for me it sound correct to depend on one of the possibilities (a | b | c | ...) and Suggest all of them (a,b,c,...)
<gary_> Hi there - is it okay for me to bring up an issue with a universe package here?
<gary_> a missing dependency rather than a bug in the package, as such
<pef> gary_: what's the problem ?
<gary_> well I upgraded to breezy yesterday, and uim-common depends on (non-existent package) im-switch
<gary_> im-switch is in debian unstable and experimental
<gary_> I'd be happy to port the package, but I haven't reviewed the universe guidelines, and have only worked on packaging for one or two things before
<gary_> and it might be too late for breezy now?
<pef> how can I manage long debian/control fields ? (Suggests: longer than 80 characters)
<Amaranth> pef: \n\t?
<gary_> pef: debian-installer has a Build-Depends 1021 characters long
<Nafallo> siretart: ping
<siretart> Nafallo: pong
<SloMoSnail> pef: just make it as long as it needs to be... only for description there's a limit of 80 chars
<pef> thanks :)
<Nafallo> siretart: what to do with im-switch? bring in a new package tweaked for xorg? :-)
<pef> gary_: I think you should fill a bug report on malone
<Amaranth> gcc-4.0's build-depends line is 2181 characters
<siretart> Nafallo: erm, sorry. what is im-switch?
<Amaranth> and vlc build-deps on 56 (!) different packages
<Nafallo> siretart: ahh, you wasn't following :-). uim is on UniverseUnmetDeps, uim-common deps on im-switch. im-switch is in debian but not in ubuntu and deps on xfree86-common :-).
<SloMoSnail> Amaranth: what about gst-plugins and mplayer? ;)
<Amaranth> they don't come close according to this shell script written by a debian guy
<Nafallo> siretart: the right solution would be to take im-switch from debian, modify and upload to REVU to fix uim?
<siretart> Nafallo: does im-switch really need xfree86-common? I mean, can't the package be modified to work with xorg?
<Amaranth> oh, gst-plugins0.8 is 51
<Amaranth> mplayer isn't in the top 10
<siretart> Nafallo: yes, that way we could have a look at it
<Nafallo> siretart: oki, I'll see what I can do about it then :-)
<Amaranth> vlc is tied with debian-installer
<gary_> Nafallo: im-switch works fine for me just with the depends on xfree86-common replaced by xorg-common
<gary_> Nafallo: and the postinst and prerm look safe enough with that dependency
<Nafallo> gary_: oki, I'll upload to REVU then and hopes the acks from three other MOTUs goes quick ;-)
<gary_> Nafallo: thanks! I'm sure the other IM frameworks are good, I'm just used to that one.
<Nafallo> gary_: np :-)
<siretart> Nafallo: I think you just uploaded a native package, was this intentional?
<Nafallo> siretart: seems to be native in debian, not sure if we should follow that?
<siretart> ok
<Nafallo> siretart: I'll see what the comments gives ;-)
<bddebian> Morning
<\sh> grmpf
<\sh> I wanted to go home..and now I'm sitting here and fixing eit streams for turkish dtv services
<bddebian> Sounds fun :-)
<bddebian> Hello \sh
<\sh> it's bar ,-)
<\sh> hey bddebian
<\sh> it's a foobar situation
<\sh> ok..next try to go home: -22 min
<bddebian> \sh: Isn't everything foobar? :-)
* chillywilly snuggles with bddebian ;)
<pef> using cdbs, which target should I use to delete admin/config.(guess|sub) ?
<pef> clean:: and cleanbuildir won't work
<bddebian> chillywilly: :-)
<pef> :)
<\sh> delete ?
<\sh> and then copy it back from /usr/share/misc?
<pef> \sh: it's autotools temp files no ?
<infinito> \sh: excuse me... i know i'm sooo tiring, but can u give any idea about howto get gcfilms synced??
<infinito> \sh: i've talked with elmo yesterday and he told me wiki was not the way to do it...
<\sh> pef: autotools-dev
<pef> infinito: I think the package needs a review before being integrated
<\sh> pef: normally it's delivered
<pef> \sh: I just want to delete them from my .diff.gz ;) another method than moving debian folder ?
<\sh> config.{guess,sub} is in $(CURDIR)...you could backup the old ones, put the new ones during configure, and after installing you can put the old ones back in place
<pef> \sh: I have them in curdir and in curdir/admin too
<\sh> pef: kde stuff?
<pef> \sh: yep
<\sh> pef: hmm...u don't do a autogen.sh?
<\sh> infinito: hmm....
<\sh> infinito: I'll try another way later this evening...
<infinito> \sh: thanks a lot
<infinito> \sh: feature freeze is tomorrow, so maybe we're on time to make it into breezy....
<\sh> infinito:hmmm
<\sh> ogra: ping
<ogra> \sh, ?
<pef> infinito: feature freeze means no new packages into universe, too ?
<\sh> ogra: feature freezy will affect universe as well as hard as main?
<\sh> lol...freezy
<\sh> breezy
<infinito> pef: not sure... maybe im wrong
<\sh> I'm really tired
<koke> siretart: have you seen http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=319527 ?
<koke> do you now if it already builds on breezy ppc?
<ogra> i dont think we will handle it as serious
<ogra> \sh, ^^
<koke> I can try this night at home
<ogra> as well as we dont handle UVF as serious...
<\sh> ogra: I'm really ashamed what happened yesterday with xterm...i was somewhere else with my brain and didn't think about upstream freeze *grrrr*
<SloMoSnail> koke: the qemu version siretart uploaded today builds on amd64, x86 and ppc ;)
<ogra> yup... i saw it
<\sh> ok...another try to go home...later guys
<koke> I must be blind :)
<koke> I just looked at packages.u.c
<WaterSevenUb> is anyone here using firestarter? I need to confirm a bug... in outbound connection events tab, click with the right button of the mouse. In my case, appears the same options as in an inbound event
<WaterSevenUb> at least using a translated firestarter.. not sure if the same happens in pure english. In other words, select "outbound event" - "select with right button of the mouse" , compare the options with those of an "inbound event
<koke> WaterSevenUb: you can launch it untranslated running from a terminal
<koke> LC_ALL=C firestarter
<koke> or whatever the command is called
<WaterSevenUb> Ok... it doesn't happen in pure english. I've checked the PO file and the strings are correctly translated. What is happening?
<WaterSevenUb> koke: in the translated firestarter there is the problem although the strings in the PO file are correctly translated.
<koke> WaterSevenUb: check it at https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/breezy/+sources/firestarter/+pots/firestarter/pt
<WaterSevenUb> koke: ? (I am using that POT)
<WaterSevenUb> koke: and with that POT, the "outbound events" options behave like "inbound events" even the translation is correct for the strings of the "outbound events" options.
<mbreit> hi guys
<bddebian> Heya mbreit
<mbreit> hey bddebian
<sistpoty> hi mbreit
<mbreit> hey sistpoty
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty
<mbreit> grr.... i hate those segfault on the buildds
<mbreit> they prevent me from watching tv :(
<bddebian> Heh
<pef> SloMoSnail: ping
<SloMoSnail> pef: pong
<pef> SloMoSnail: kvpnc uploaded http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=335 :)
<SloMoSnail> pef: where's the diff?
<pef> SloMoSnail: wrong link, sorry http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=337
<SloMoSnail> pef: maybe call dh_desktop at the end of install
<pef> SloMoSnail: right (It's my first cdbs package ;)
<SloMoSnail> i wonder why the kde class doesn't call dh_desktop... the gnome one does...
<SloMoSnail> are the buildds broken atm? there are so many weird errors...
<SloMoSnail> pef: reuploaded with dh_desktop?
<pef> SloMoSnail: I have others comments in #kubuntu-devel ;)
<SloMoSnail> ok ;)
<SloMoSnail> siretart: do you know what happened your liferea upload yesterday? i got the accept mail but it haven't reached the buildds yet...
<SloMoSnail> pef: what are the remaining problems the kubuntu people found?
<pef> SloMoSnail: things like s|/usr/bin||g in debian/menu, s/vpn/VPN (virtual private network)/ and others things making a package _very_ nice :)
<pef> SloMoSnail: http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=338
<SloMoSnail> ok, looks better ;) any other things remaining?
<pef> SloMoSnail: I think no
* sivang --> back
<SloMoSnail> pef: but i have some... in the debian directory are some files which should be cleaned... for example the stamps
<tritium> bddebian, hey man
<pef> SloMoSnail: where ? I can't see theme here http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/incoming/kvpnc-0508101930/kvpnc_0.7.2-1ubuntu1.diff
<SloMoSnail> http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/incoming/kvpnc-0508101930/kvpnc-0.7.2/debian/
<SloMoSnail> omg... they're in the upstream tarball...
<SloMoSnail> ok, then everything's fine ;)
<bddebian> tritium!!  Where you been man?
<bddebian> tritium: All moved?
<tritium> bddebian, dude, moving
<pef> SloMoSnail: and I can't delete them from orig tarball :/
<tritium> bddebian, Yeah, we arrived in Albuquerque Sunday night.  It'll be a few more days before I have broadband up.
<SloMoSnail> pef: yeah... doesn't matter... ok, now lets see if this builds ;)
<pef> I really have to go
<bddebian> tritium: Ah, cool
<pef> SloMoSnail: don't forget to add any comments to revu
<tritium> bddebian, anyway, I'm at a coffee shop getting wireless for a few minutes.  I got an email regarding your attempted upload.  Did you fix it?
<mbreit> pef: why do you put the desktop-file in debian/usr/share/applications/kde/kvpnc.desktop?
<SloMoSnail> pef: don't worry :) when everything's fine you get a vote from me
<SloMoSnail> mbreit: i wanted to ask this :P
<bddebian> tritium: For which?
<tritium> bddebian, python-pyrtf
<bddebian> Hmm, I dunno if I saw that
<mbreit> from debian/rules: mv debian/kvpnc/usr/share/applnk/Internet/kvpnc.desktop debian/kvpnc/usr/share/applications/kde/
<pef> the file is automaticaly copied to the right location
<tritium> bddebian, from katie
<mbreit> pef: you should put it in debian/kvpnc.desktop and move it in debian/rules to the right location
<tritium> well, I need to get going here.  I'll be in touch as soon as I can.  Give me a few more days to get settled before I'm online more regularly
<mbreit> debian/kvpnc should be deleted in the clean-target, so there shouldn't be any important files
<bddebian> tritium: I just got whitelisted a couple days ago
<tritium> ago :)
<bddebian> tritium: Oh, enjoy :-)
<SloMoSnail> mbreit: yes... and currently the original desktop file in src is copied over there... and not the one in debian/
<SloMoSnail> pef: are they the same?
<tritium> bddebian, okay, have a good day.  I'll be in touch soon.  bye
<pef> SloMoSnail: no
<mbreit> then it should just be deleted in clean...
<SloMoSnail> pef: here they are the same ;)
<mbreit> pef: otherwise it looks very nice... to bad that i have no voting rights on revu, you would get my vote besides that issue above ;)
<pef> very proud to hear this :)
<SloMoSnail> pef: i would suggest to just remove the desktop file from the debian directory... you aren't using it anyways ;)
<SloMoSnail> pef: just solve this small issue and you get the vote
<SloMoSnail> pef: (builds fine here)
<pef> SloMoSnail: adding a rm desktop file to clean target ?
<SloMoSnail> nope... just remove the debian/usr directory from the diff
<mbreit> SloMoSnail: the desktop file should be deleted with the clean target...
<pef> mbreit: rm -rfd debian/usr to clean target is ok ?
<mbreit> pef: well, _should_ be, but better ask a motu with some experiences (i am not a motu)
<SloMoSnail> pef: debian/usr isn't created by the build process... seems like you created it ;) just remove this directory from your diff and everything will be cleaned correctly
<mbreit> oh, okay, i see
<mbreit> i thought it was debian/kvpnc/... and that is generated during the build
<mbreit> pef: believe SloMoSnail, he's right ;)
<SloMoSnail> mbreit: yes... but cdbs removes this stuff itself while cleaning ;)
<mbreit> SloMoSnail: that's the point which was striking me ;)
<SloMoSnail> ok, fine :) now everybody is happy and i'll get something to eat :) brb
<SloMoSnail> re
<mbreit> wb
<bddebian> wb SloMoSnail
<SloMoSnail> hey bddebian :)
<pef> SloMoSnail: I really have to go, will make the lasts changes tomorow morning :)
<SloMoSnail> pef: no problem :) just send me a note when you've uploaded that version
<pef> SloMoSnail: of course :)
<mbreit> btw: pef, SloMoSnail: just a hint: md5sum ;)
<pef> bye !
<mbreit> oh, forget it ;)
<SloMoSnail> mbreit: you're just blind ;P the orginal tarball was bz2... this one is exactly the same with gz ;)
<mbreit> SloMoSnail: yes, that was my problem ;)
<mbreit> SloMoSnail: but anyway different packages
<SloMoSnail> mbreit: i ran diff over them and they were the same
<mbreit> but if i unzip them both, they have different md5sum
<mbreit> so the tarballs are not the same
<mbreit> maybe just repackaged..
<SloMoSnail> maybe... well i haven't tested that... i unpacked them completly and ran diff over the resulting directories
<SloMoSnail> imho no problem
<sistpoty> <- in method getFood() : undefined reference to fridge...
<sistpoty> cya later
<SloMoSnail> wahh... missed Mez :/
<bddebian> SloMoSnail: There he is :-)
<SloMoSnail> ...and there he goes...
<bddebian> hehe
<danb> Is it too late for sane 1.0.16 to get into breezy?
<ajmitch> libsane is in main, the cli tools are in universe
<ajmitch> so you'd need to convince mdz/Kamion about libsane
<danb> ajmitch: what version of libsane is in breezy now?
<danb> 1.0.15 or 1.0.15cvs?
<ajmitch> the package version is 1.0.15-9ubuntu5, so I'd need to loko at the changelog to see if patches have been grabbed from cvs for it
<danb> ajmitch: so you don't think its too late to get 1.0.16 in then?
<ajmitch> maybe not, but you'd have to justify breaking the freeze for it
<danb> ajmitch: Could I upgrade just that package in Hoary, or would I have to update all of KDE to breezy just to get a new libsane?
<ajmitch> I wouldn't know
<danb> In fact I'm running KDE 3.4.2 ontop of kubuntu, if that helps?
<ajmitch> you'd have to look at the dependencies
<danb> aj: you running breezy?
<ajmitch> yes
<danb> how (un)stable is it now?
<danb> is it useable yet?
<ajmitch> quite usable
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> kornbluth.freenode.net
#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-16
<paolo> Hi!  darcs is broken because of the cpp migration: could you build satisfying: libgmp3 now renamed libgmp3c2 ?
<ajmitch> paolo: no, we can't just rebuild it due to other build-depends
<ajmitch> ghc6 needs to be fixed before we can rebuild darcs
<ajmitch> unless I'm mistaken, ghc6 isn't done yet
<paolo> ajmitch, fixed in what ways.
<paolo> I mean "?"
<paolo> aww, too bad.  OK :-(
<ajmitch> fixed, in that it doesn't build
<ajmitch> and it build-depends on itself
<paolo> Hmm, ubuntu has 6.2.2...
<paolo> ajmitch, are there any hopes to get 6.4.1 for the time it is released?
<ajmitch> upstream version freeze was a month ago, so there'd need to be reasonable justification
<ajmitch> I see that 6.4 was in debian 2 months ago, so it may be possible
<paolo> ajmitch, it would be great, IMO.
<paolo> But it is not a reasonable justification :-)
<ajmitch> sorry.. 6.4 source is in ubuntu..
<tseng> hi
<paolo> Ah, cool.  Do you mean I could compile it and darcs on my workstation, from ubuntu packages?
<ajmitch> 6.4 is the one that is not building
<ajmitch> hello tseng
<paolo> ajmitch, is there a place to see what's wrong with it?
<ajmitch> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/g/ghc6/6.4-4/
<ajmitch> hmm, looks like the current ghc6 *may* fulfill the build deps for darcs
* ajmitch tries
<paolo> Cool!
<ajmitch> sorry, that won't work..
<ajmitch> so we do need to get ghc6 fixed & building before darcs can build
<paolo> Thanks for trying
<paolo> I wish I could help
<ajmitch> paolo: I think that once 6.4.1 is released, we'll put it in
<ajmitch> since it appears to solve the gcc 4.0 problems with 6.4
<paolo> ajmitch, that's the best news of today, and today just started 50 mins ago here :-D
<ajmitch> :)
<ajmitch> ah, looks like the f-spot changes for sid will need synced for breezy
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> kornbluth.freenode.net
<pef> hello
<siretart> morning
<Burgundavia> hello
<siretart> ajmitch: ping
<ajmitch> siretart: pong
<ajmitch> what have I broken?
<ajmitch> ;)
<siretart> ajmitch: nothing ;)
<ajmitch> ok, about ghc6 then?
<siretart> ajmitch: I just wanted to ask about the status of ghc6, I read something in the backlog ;)
<ajmitch> ah right
<ajmitch> well 6.4.1, when it comes out, is meant to build with gcc 4.0
<siretart> ah, I thought either debian or you already have packaged the preview release
<siretart> and then still the package will have to be bootstrapped by the buildd admins, if I got it right, but compiling is a premise ;)
<ajmitch> no, debian still has 6.4-4
<ajmitch> but we can borrow packages from there to get 6.4.1 building, if needed
<cat> hey
<ajmitch> hello cat
<cat> if i want to help around with ubuntu what can i do?
<ajmitch> you want to help with packaging?
<cat> sure i will love to
<ajmitch> well we've got a lot to do ;)
<siretart> cat: woooho, great! :)
<ajmitch> mostly fixing existing packages
<cat> such as?
<ajmitch> sometimes creating new ones
<ajmitch> wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseUnmetDeps
<ajmitch> wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUTodo
<siretart> cat: we still have tons of work in universe to do, like these UnmetDependencies
<cat> well i can help around by rebuilding the packages
<siretart> cat: there is still a lot of work for any level of difficulty ;)
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> kornbluth.freenode.net
<cat> well
<cat> i can star some where (:
<ajmitch> rebuilding packages is fairly basic, we just get the source & semi-autobuild them
<cat> so what can i do
<cat> for example any ideas ajmitch ?
<ajmitch> the unmet deps page has a number of packages that need done - a few of them need packaging changes
<cat> can u point me to one?
<cat> if it's possible
<ajmitch> sorry, I don't know just by looking at the package name
<cat> Just Need A Rebuild
<cat> This list are packages that just need a rebuild and have been verified/tested by either an MOTU or those of us wanting to be MOTUs.
<cat> that?
<ajmitch> no, those are ones that we will upload
<cat> then i'm los t=)
<ajmitch> I mean the  'These need love' section, taken by NOBODY
<cat> oh ok
<cat> so if i wanted to take over a packaged what do i do?
<cat> just rebuild it?
<cat> or what?
<ajmitch> these are packages that don't install properly due to missing dependencies
<ajmitch> so get the source, try build it
<cat> PL
<ajmitch> see if the packages install
<cat> Ok for example i want to build sawfish
<cat> when i'm done with it what do i do?
<ajmitch> if it builds & everything is correct, note that in the wiki
<cat> ok
<cat> ok i'm back with debian
<ajmitch> why debian?
<ajmitch> never mind, I have to leave
<ajmitch> bbl
<pef> SloMo_: hi, I've uploaded the last (I hope) correction of my package http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=341
<DanielN> hi guys :)
<siretart> hi DanielN, hi pef
<siretart> DanielN: I hope you don't take my comments to openttd in revu personally..
<ajmitch> I hope noone takes my comments personally ;)
<siretart> :)
<ajmitch> I wonder if I've got enough diskspace for building all these unmet deps packages :)
<pef> siretart: hi, which parameters do you use in REVU for lintian/linda ?
<siretart> pef: -v
<pef> siretart: I run it and don't have same results as on revu
<pef> siretart: http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=341 in local I don't have the error
<siretart> lets see
<siretart> pef: I run lintian on the changes file, how do you invoke lintian?
<pef> in the deb file :)
<siretart> ah
<\sh> fixing kwave
<siretart> thats intresting, too, it catches other errors, then
<\sh> morning guys :)
<pef> siretart: the file it complains about is the diff file in debian/patches, right ? or it is another problem ?
<pef> \sh: hi
<siretart> pef: I understand lintian complains about this file: http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/incoming/kvpnc-0508111115/kvpnc-0.7.2/debian/files
<pete> morning
<DanielN> siretart, oh no not at all :)
<pef> siretart: I haven't any idea where this file comes from :/
<siretart> DanielN: if you really want openttd, I think you should collaborate with the debian guys already working on it. we can sync that afterwards into ubuntu
<ajmitch> baobab is moderately useful for identifying junk to cleanup :)
<SloMoSnail> pef: what files?
<pef> SloMoSnail: I don't know, it's an error reported by lintian/linda
<DanielN> siretart, it's important for me, cause i don't play it
<DanielN> but i just wanted to help blathis, the guy how created the debian package
<DanielN> not important i mean
<pef> SloMoSnail: http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=341
<SloMoSnail> pef: ah... just remove debian/files and maybe also remove the stamps and the substvars file... they will be deleted by the diff then...
<pef> SloMoSnail: they are in the orig.tar.gz :/
<SloMoSnail> pef: but they don't belong there ;) so just delete them and they will get deleted by the diff
<pef> SloMoSnail: in the clean target ?
<SloMoSnail> pef: yes... but afaik cdbs should already handle that...
<pef> SloMoSnail: theorically for config.{guess,sub} too, but it seems not to work
<SloMoSnail> pef: so just do it by hand ;)
<SloMoSnail> siretart: do you know what happened to the liferea upload? simply disappeared it seems...
<pef> SloMoSnail: I was afraid to miss something, but if it's a cdbs "feature", it's ok
<DanielN> has no one a debootstrap script for breezy?
<Lathiat> my debootstrap is happy with a breezy target...
<\sh> ogra: ubuntu-express? ubuntu on a usb stick?
<ogra> nope... live installer
<Lathiat> \sh: installing ubuntu from the livecd
<\sh> ah...so i need to invent ubuntu for an usb stick ,-)
<ajmitch> \sh: not hard to do :)
<pef> SloMoSnail: adding rm -f debian/files to clean target doesn't changes anything
<ajmitch> d-i has run from usb for quite awhile
<\sh> ajmitch: nice I don't have any clue how to do it...I mean, I can build a gentoo live cd with everything, but not an ubuntu usb image ,-)
<\sh> ok...lunch
<pef> can I do something for new upstream versions in main, like http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10890 ? or must I wait ?
<siretart> re
<siretart> SloMoSnail: you don't talk about this one, do you: http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=324
<SloMoSnail> yes... this one
<DanielN> anyone around ??
<\sh> jesus
<\sh> I got my laptop
<\sh> claire was sending out the email to me, that I will receive it around the 17th...but it came today
<SloMoSnail> \sh: what laptop did you get? :)
<\sh> toshiba portege r200
<\sh> small...slim...
<\sh> lightweigt (1.2kg)
<\sh> 12.1"
<\sh> no cdrom/dvd
<DanielN> setting up breezy badger as main webserver here at the office :P
<\sh> 512mb
<Lathiat> damn
<Lathiat> nice
<Lathiat> i want one of those :\
<\sh> bluetooth, wifi, irda, usb, sd cards, bla bla
<Lathiat> im hoping for somethign small
<Lathiat> i'd love a 12"
<\sh> english keyboard layout
<DanielN> "Couldn't download libiw27"
<DanielN> broken package?
<Lathiat> \sh: friend of mine has one of those
<Lathiat> there very nice
<Lathiat> oh well, thats 1 12" i wont be getting. :)
<Lathiat> heres hoping from an ibm x41 or dell x1 :P
<DanielN> ok ok
<DanielN> i'm in wrong chan
<Lathiat> that or an amd64 laptop would be nice
<Lathiat> but i dont think any major vendors make those :)
<jbailey_> Lathiat: HP does
<Lathiat> jbailey_: yeh?
<Lathiat> well maybe then :)
<jbailey_> Lathiat: They're not mobile CPUs, though, so they're quite hot and hard on the batteries.
<jbailey_> But I was looking at one a few months ago.  Decided not to spend the $1200CAD =)
<Lathiat> well
<Lathiat> athlon64s tend to be coolish compared to most desktop cpus
<Lathiat> but yeh
<Lathiat> i wouldnt expect any more than 2 hours battery
<\sh> ok..now I have to setup my other notebook to serve as a LocalNetworkJumpstart Server ,-=)
<Nafallo> tseng: ping
<kiko> MOTU OF THE WORLD
<kiko> UNITE
<rbelem> :)
<Nafallo> kiko: :-)
<Lathiat> dyslexics of the world
<Lathiat> UNTIE
<kiko> you slackers
<kiko> where's ogra the ogre?
<Nafallo> kiko: ogre is my server :-)
* ogra yawns in a corner
<ogra> hey kiko
<kiko> ogra!
<kiko> I want to introduce to you rbelem
<ogra> :)
<ogra> hi rbelem
<kiko> he's a hacker from manaus whom we met on saturday
<rbelem> ogra, hi ;)
<kiko> he's done packaging work and even has a couple of packages prepared to push into the revu process
<kiko> can you or someone else give him some assistance
<ogra> rbelem, yay, go ahead....
<ogra> rbelem, first get an account from siretart
<SloMoSnail> hi rbelem :)
<ogra> then you can upload your stuff to revu for reviews
<ogra> rbelem, do you know the process to become a motu...
<ogra> ?
<rbelem> :) great
<kiko> ogra, ah, so siretart assigns revu accounts?
<rbelem> ogra, i was reading the wiki, i understand i little bit
<ogra> its on his server ....
<rbelem> SloMoSnail, hi :)
<ogra> rbelem, start with creating a wikipage about yourself... describe who you are and what you work on (and plan to work on) in ubuntu...
<chillywilly> morning guys
<ogra> you will need to become a member first... this page is the base of all approval from the two councils, so make it nice :)
<rbelem> ogra, i created, but only a link to my page at ubuntu-br.org. I'll transfer the things from there
<ogra> yup....
<ogra> thats a good start :)
<rbelem> ogra, I see that i need to mail my key to siretart
<ogra> if you have made a valuable contributon of any kind (howto wikipages, creating artwork, fixing/building packages etc...) you sign the code of conduct, send it to mako@canonical.com and put a link to your page on the CommunityCouncilAgenda
<ogra> rbelem, yup
<ogra> you should show up in the meeting and will get approved as a member....
<rbelem> ogra, cool ;)
<rbelem> ogra, when will be the next meeting?
<ogra> the next stop after this already is MOTU ;)
<ogra> look on wiki.ubuntu.com/Calendar
<Nafallo> 16th IIRC
<Nafallo> rock! I was right :-)
<rbelem> uau it's so closer
<kiko> you said it man
<ogra> :)
<rbelem> ogra,  I'll follow these steps now
<ogra> oki...
<ogra> just hang around here in the channel, if you got questions etc nearly everyone can help you in here :)
<Nafallo> tseng: muine uploaded without changes. needed a rebuild due to new dbus.
<rbelem> uau... it's very nice to meet you, and if i got questions i'll ask for your help
<ogra> yeah :)
<\sh> actually u can ask everyone here, we're all nice :) and friendly :) but ogra looks much better then anybody of us *eg*
<SloMoSnail> lol
<rbelem> :D
<ogra> *grin*
<ogra> not today though
<\sh> ogra: well...I only said it, cause I think you will be jealous when u see this small, thin little baby here ,-)
<\sh> ogra: I think I will give it back...cause it's to small for my fingers
<ogra> heh
<ogra> but handy... you can take it everywhere
<\sh> ogra: and the other isp guys are waiting that I'm leaving my place...they want to grab it directly from this desk now...
<ogra> heh
<ogra> get a ball and chain for it :)
<\sh> ok..just preparing to launch my localnet ubuntu hoary install
<\sh> ogra: it has a fingerprint reader ,-) I hope it will work on hoary ,-)
<ogra> bionic fingers ;)
<\sh> ok...just cutting my network now...i
<\sh> to install ubuntu
<mbreit> okay, now i _really_ need some help with dh_makeshlibs now!
<SloMoSnail> mbreit: just ask
<mbreit> SloMoSnail: you now the problem...
<mbreit> s/now/know/
<SloMoSnail> libicq2000?
<mbreit> compiling ickle against libicq2000c2 but it depends on libicq2000
<Nafallo> mbreit: fix libicq2000 debian/rules :-)
<mbreit> Nafallo: what's wrong there?
<mbreit> /var/lib/dpkg/info$ cat libicq2000c2.shlibs
<mbreit> libicq2000 3 libicq2000c2
<Nafallo> mbreit: let me get the source
<mbreit> and that _seems_ right to me, but i have no idea how dh_makeshlibs work ;)
<SloMoSnail> mbreit: try makeshlibs with -V"libicq2000c2"... but the shlibs file looks ok for me so no idea...
<mbreit> SloMoSnail: i looked at other libxxc2 packages, and they called makeshlibs without -V... as well....
<SloMoSnail> mbreit: i know... but it doesn't work as it is now ;) that's just a wild idea, don't know whether that works... i'll look at it further after the math exam tomorrow when you haven't fixed it until then
<mbreit> SloMoSnail: thanks...
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> mbreit: do we need ubuntuX on libicq2000?
<mbreit> Nafallo: i don't know... i have not touched that package
<mbreit> doko: ping
<doko> mbreit: pong
<mbreit> doko: you know https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseCandidates ?
<mbreit> doko: cause it says that i am working on a spe package ;))
<doko> mbreit: then you surely know the Debian report #268101 and sent a followup on the report?
<kiko> hey doko
<mbreit> doko: oh, i did not know that ;)
<kiko> we got a question when we were doing a talk in brasilia
<kiko> the kid asked why the new kde packages in breezy ended in c2
<doko> kiko: only one? ;-P
<mbreit> doko: well, it does not really matter cause i have just started ;) just have a look at the list next time *g*
<kiko> mark was surprised at it :)
<kiko> we got several but this one was particularly interesting
<doko> kiko: C++ ABI version 2
<ogra> kiko, only the libs...
<siretart> who is Rodrigo Belem?
<kiko> yeah, I know
<kiko> siretart, rbelem
<kiko> I'm presenting him
<kiko> hacker from the amazon
<rbelem> siretart, me :)
<doko> mbreit: maybe you can add a link to http://bugs.debian.org/wnpp ?
<mbreit> doko: i don't think i can do that, but it would definitly be a good idea ;))
<mbreit> doko: and it was my fault not having a look there, so sorry ;)
<doko> mbreit: I think you can do that (ogra?)
<mbreit> doko: ??
<ogra> err ?
<ogra> whats worng ?
<pef> ogra: hi
<ogra> hey pef
<pef> ogra: can I bother you about a packaging problem ?
<ogra> sure
<mbreit> SloMoSnail, Nafallo: adjusting dh_makeshlibs in debian/rules in libicq2000 did not help...
<pef> ogra: I don't know ho to resolve this lintian's error http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/incoming/kvpnc-0508111115/lintian
<SloMoSnail> pef: the files one? just remove debian/files as i said this morning ;)
<ogra> yes, as SloMoSnail says
<pef> SloMoSnail: this file is only on  .orig.tar.gz
<ogra> you can ignore the two errors on the top
<mbreit> pef: then remove it from debian/rules clean target
<mbreit> ... remove it IN the debian/rules clean target...
<pef> mbreit: have add rm -f debian/file to clean:: target, but dpkg-source says : dpkg-source: warning: ignoring deletion of file debian/files when I make dpkg-buildpackage
<mbreit> uh? hmm... but the lintian-error remains?
<pef> yep
<bddebian> Howdy
<mbreit> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Morning mbreit
<pef> mbreit: a problem with cdbs .
<pef> ?
<mbreit> pef: i don't know... i have to pass your question to some other motu
<mbreit> s/some other motu/some motu/ ;))
<pef> :)
<rbelem> hey ogra
<ogra> hey rbelem
<rbelem> ogra, i started to create some packges
<rbelem> ogra, and some meta-packages...
<ogra> aha :)
<rbelem> rbelem, the first is muse muse.dyne.org
<rbelem> ops
<rbelem> ogra, which will be called muse-streamer
<rbelem> ogra, because already a package called muse which is a sequencer
<rbelem> ogra, then i see that i have to do some changes in the package, like name
<rbelem> ogra, add ubuntuX as a suffix
<ogra> you should also always check the source and binary packages with lintian
<ogra> that depends...
<ogra> you normally only add ubuntuX to packages that come from debian and you made a ubuntu specific change
<rbelem> ogra, :) this package is not in debian yet
<ogra> you should also always build the package ina pbuilder (see PbuilderHowto on the wiki)
<bddebian> So get it in Debian first, then call us.. ;-P
<ogra> even more important, if debian wants to adopt it, they can grab it as is and just recomplie...
<SloMoSnail> bddebian: you mean in 2 months? ;)
<ogra> bddebian, nah
<bddebian> SloMoSnail: Yep, sounds about right ;-P
<kiko> no need to wait for debian, just get it in ubuntu and give somebody at debian a hint :-)
<bddebian> I WAS KIDDING..  Man you people need to grow senses of humor. :-)
<rbelem> ogra, i mailed the upstream developer and he said that is very cool and I can upload to ubuntu after that to debian if i want
<kiko> that was a pretty subtle hint then
<ogra> rblesure, up to you....
<ogra> rbelem, ^
<rbelem> ogra,  he cc the the filippo@debian.org
<rbelem> ogra, he plans to upload muse to debian at the next upstream release
<ogra> ah...
<rbelem> ogra, there are another changes to do in package that comes from debian? and there is another software called darksnow, a front end to darkice, that i want to package...
<pef> re
<SloMoSnail> pef: this is a problem with the upstream tarball... so mail the author to remove this stuff... as it is removed by clean atm you probably can ignore this warning
<pef> SloMoSnail: if it's removed by clean, why this warning ? I don't understand
<SloMoSnail> because it isn't deleted by the diff for some reason... the ignoring deletion of debian/files warning before creating the diff
<pef> ok, contacting the author seems to be the clever way :)
<pef> SloMoSnail: debian/{files,stamp*,kvpnc.substvars}, do you see anothers useless files ?
<pef> a program not yet packaged, will be integrated to Debian once uploaded to universe ?
<SloMoSnail> pef: give me the url again
<pef> http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=341
<SloMoSnail> pef: and no... when it's in ubuntu someone has to get it into debian... that doesn't happen from itself :(
<pef> SloMoSnail: like a review ?
<SloMoSnail> pef: well... the *.cdbs-orig files are useless...and the ones you said
<SloMoSnail> pef: no... you have to find someone who sponsors your package, some debian developer... and i don't think this package gets accepted by one with this source tarball ;)
<pef> dirty tarball :/
<pef> but the author has to release a new version, or simply delete the useless files ?
<SloMoSnail> a new version would cause less confusion... when he just releases a new tarball with the same version the md5sums change and some people (at least the gentoo users) will get mad ;)
<pef> SloMoSnail: I think he will delay this cleanup to next release to avoid confusions, but I'm not very enthousiastic to wait weeks or months
<SloMoSnail> pef: well ask ogra if it's ok for him to ignore this warning in this case
<pef> ogra: ping
<ogra> is it a NEW package ?
<SloMoSnail> ogra: it is
<pef> yes, i've made modifications to the home made deb package provided by the author
<ogra> hmm, then you should ask elmo, he's the last person who looks at it and the one who counts for NEW approvals
<pef> ogra: can you add a comment to my package ?
<ogra> i havent even an account :) (i must fix that for the next review day...)
<pef> ogra, SloMoSnail : so for you this package is ok ?
<ogra> i'd lke to see the actual package you talked about... when i looked in revu the rm in the clean target wasnt there ...
<SloMoSnail> pef: except the upstream tarball it's ok for me ;)
<pef> ogra: I can upload it now if you want
<Nafallo> hmm, is dirac correct in -doc depending on -dev?
<SloMoSnail> pef: isn't it uploaded? http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=341
<SloMoSnail> Nafallo: no idea... but what do you want to do with the docs when you don't have the dev-stuff?
<pef> SloMoSnail: there is no the rm in the clean target (but since it's useless, is it really important ?)
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: read them on my laptop while I has the actual packages on my server for example :-)
<SloMoSnail> Nafallo: hmm... so what is the regular way for doc packages? Suggest or Recommend the -dev?
<ogra> Moved desktop file from usr/share/applnk to /usr/share/application
<ogra> pef, the missing s is a typo i the changelog i hope :)
<pef> ogra: of course :)
<ogra> its good... take it as signed from me
<pef> thank you :)
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: postfix-doc suggests postfix, apache2-doc count on the users intelligence :-).
<SloMoSnail> Nafallo: ok, i'll change it to a Suggest then ;)
<SloMoSnail> pef: you got a vote from me ;)
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: ah. nice. didn't realised you owned the package :-)
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: btw, dirac doesn't need libdirac0 installed?
<SloMoSnail> Nafallo: funnily it doesn't... it's compiled in statically
<pef> SloMoSnail: thank you ! I had to upload a new version to correct a type s/application/applications/ in debian/changelog
<SloMoSnail> Nafallo: don't ask me who had this idea...
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: I was just about to ;-)
<SloMoSnail> Nafallo: well... when it's changed later the dependency gets pulled in automatically ;)
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: :-)
<SloMoSnail> Nafallo: ok, new dirac uploaded with the change... other than that the package was ok for you?
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: yepp
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: you're on amd64, no?
<SloMoSnail> nope... ppc and x86
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: then I rebuild it here just for fun :-)
<SloMoSnail> good idea... as amd64 tends to collaps on everything ;)
<Nafallo> hehe
<Nafallo> built before the -doc change so... ;-)
<pef> SloMoSnail: perfect synchronisation :D
<SloMoSnail> pef: thanks ;)
<SloMoSnail> Nafallo: thanks :) maybe we get this and gst-plugins-multiverse in at the next review day ;)
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: that's why I looked at dirac ;-)
<pef> can modify a package from mentors.debian.org ? it doesn't seems to be integrated in the officials repositorys
<pef> (for integration into universe)
<SloMoSnail> Nafallo: so you already looked at g-p-m? any big mistakes?
<SloMoSnail> pef: depends i think... is the maintainer still trying to get it into debian? or has he given up? i would mail him und ask him about that...
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: dunno yet. didn't build because dirac isn't in yet. looks like the dependencies is way off though.
<Nafallo> +Package: gstreamer0.8-faad
<Nafallo> +Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, gstreamer0.8-misc (>= 0.8.10)
<Nafallo> this would bring in what libfaac-dev (>= 1.24), libfaad2-dev (>= 2.0.0), liblame-dev (>= 3.90), libwavpack-dev, libdirac-dev, libxvidcore4-dev gives.
<SloMoSnail> Nafallo: yes... dirac is the last dependency missing...
<pef> SloMoSnail: not in wnpp and doesn't have a itp entry
<SloMoSnail> with g-p-m we get a aac/mp4 decoder/encoder, mp3 encoder, wavpack decover, dirac decoder and xvid/mpeg4 encoder plugins for gst... ;) most of this seems to be stuff many users want
<SloMoSnail> pef: wnpp?
<Nafallo> Depends: libfaad2, gstreamer0.8-misc <-- should be better
<Nafallo> :-)
<pef> SloMoSnail: sorry, being packaged
<Nafallo> or libfaad2 (>= 2.0.0) even
<SloMoSnail> Nafallo: why? what change do you suggest? changing the order of them or removing the version from gst-misc?
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: s:{$shlibs:Depends}:libfaad2 (>= 2.0.0): etcetera.
<SloMoSnail> ah ok... but why?
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: I'll try it first, hold.
<SloMoSnail> Nafallo: ok... but exactly this dependency gets pulled in by dh_shlibdeps so i don't see your point ;)
<janimo> hello all
<SloMoSnail> hi janimo
<pef> bye !
<janimo> does REVU only show  MOTU votes in the advocates column?
<tseng> if it doesnt, its wrong
<janimo> and if only MOTUs can vote what is the point of others advocating?
<tseng> there is none?
<kiko> you can advocate and tseng will hear you
<Amaranth> if you advocate that means you think it should be uploaded, right?
<Amaranth> if so, that's used for the 3 MOTU review needed before a NEW package is uploaded
<Amaranth> cool, gst-plugins-multiverse has the 3 plugins i had to snag from hoary-extras (faad, faac, and lame)
<tseng> g-p-m will be awesome
<tseng> and not that marillat binary silliness
<tseng> kiko: id still review it myself anyway, its pointless
<Amaranth> now i just need libfasttrack-gift and bittorrent 4 to clear out my locally installed package list :)
<tseng> kiko: but hi :)
<tseng> oh man fasttrack-gift is bogus
<Amaranth> ?
<tseng> the network is a cesspool of filth
<tseng> the efnet of p2p
<tseng> or something.
<kiko> it's horrible
<kiko> at least you can filter audio
<Amaranth> tseng: it has the most people though :)
<tseng> signal:noise :)
<paolo> do you know how to get the font-string of an X window (an xterm for be precise) ?  xprop doesn't list it, but IIRC there is a tool which does - I don't remember what is it, tough :-(
<Amaranth> but i use gift so little these days i dunno why i even keep it installed
<tseng> paolo: how does xrdb -query strike you
<tseng> URxvt.font:	xft:Bitstream Vera Sans Mono:pixelsize=12
<tseng> is an example
<paolo> hmm it is a gnome-terminal in fact, I can't see it there.
<tseng> er
<tseng> gnome terminal doesnt get fonts from X
<tseng> at least not in the way I think you are thinking
<paolo> too bad
<tseng> it has its own preferences
<tseng> or global gnome prefts
<paolo> without xfontsel I can't understand how to use terminus
<paolo> in fact terminus work in gnome-terminal, but Emacs for example needs an -fn string !
<tseng> emacs.. or xemacs?
<paolo> GNU Emacs
<tseng> beats me
<paolo> why?
<tseng> probably because I use vi
<tseng> it doesnt much care what font I use
<paolo> i can't code without terminus in my emacsen :(
<bddebian> Switch to nano ;-)
* paolo cries loudly
<paolo> thanks for the help, tseng
<tseng> yeah it sounds like an emacs question, which i surely cant answer
<paolo> it is a xorg question in fact - breezy misses xfontsel and other binaries at the moment :(
<paolo> ... but I think that even with it terminus isn't really usable
<SloMoSnail> hm, can someone test pkg-config --help on x86? it gets in an infinite loop here ;)
<paolo> SloMo_, pkg-config has some f*cked code
<paolo> try "pkg-config foo --help"
<paolo> (foo is just a random string, it segfaults here)
<SloMoSnail> yes... and without foo it prints one line over and over again ;)
<SloMoSnail> on ppc it works for me
<paolo> so, talking of xorg and fonts.. :-(
<kiko> siretart, for the record, this is what rbelem looks like: http://www.comunidadesol.org/gallery/mark/dsc02976
<kiko> he's not the pengiun, btw
<kiko> penguin, agh.
<rbelem> kiko, ihihihihihi
<cat> alright i'm back
<ajmitch> tseng: I've got a debdiff here for beagle & gaim indexing
<cat> hey mr ajmitch
<ajmitch> hello
<cat> how is it going
<tseng> ajmitch: uh
<tseng> ajmitch: ok.
<tseng> Nafallo: why are we rebuilding muine, out of curiosity
<ajmitch> tseng: malone 1739, if you care
<tseng> ajmitch: i am hoping to get 0.13 anyway
<tseng> ajmitch: but you can upload as many debdiffs as you see fit
<ajmitch> http://ajmitch.meta.net.nz/debuild/ubuntu/mono/beagle_0.0.12-0ubuntu4.debdiff
#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-17
<Nafallo> tseng: stopped working after I upgraded dbus, worked again after rebuild.
<ajmitch> is beagle in main? apt is acting up here, so I can't check
<tseng> its not (yet)
<ajmitch> right
<tseng> that patch is fine with me, obvious
<ajmitch> ok
<tseng> we need working inotify
<cat> yeah looks okay
<tseng> if we dont get 0.13
<ajmitch> is it not working in the latest breezy 2.6.12?
<tseng> +ly
<tseng> no
<tseng> cvs works
<tseng> inotify went from device -> syscall
<ajmitch> ah
<tseng> but its finally in mainline
<ajmitch> I've got f-spot fixed in svn, need to test, upload to sid & sync for breezy
<tseng> fixed how
<tseng> i didnt catch that one
<ajmitch> libexif, new maintainer, etc
<ajmitch> it's on the unmet deps list at the moment
<ajmitch> has RC bug in debian dur to libexif
<rbelem> hey ogra
<rbelem> which way is better to create meta-packages? cdd-dev?
<ogra> i never worked with that.... ubuntu uses a tool called germinate... but thats overkill if you only want one metapackage... i'd just create a empty package with dependency informations...
<ajmitch> hi ogra
<rbelem> ogra, cool ;)
<Nafallo> rbelem: I would do what ogra would do :-)
<rbelem> :D
<rbelem> Nafallo,  nice... if i have some question, i'll ask to you
<Nafallo> rbelem: oki. if you go without answer for about 5 minutes, I've fallen asleep :-).
<rbelem> hihihihihihi
<rbelem> :)
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: well done on getting inkspace 0.42 in :)
<cat> alright,
<cat> at was reading some book,
<Nafallo> yippi! debian has not the same size on there kismet_2005.06.R1.orig.tar.gz as we do
<ajmitch> that makes for exciting merges
<Nafallo> I'm keen to package up 2005.07.R1a just for the sake of it.
<ajmitch> and then try & justify breaking UVF for universe :)
<ajmitch> if there are problems with the current version, then it's possible
<Nafallo> ajmitch: should fix a segfault... ;-)
<ajmitch> ok, I'd probably approve that
<Nafallo> anyway, I bump what we got soon for the move-out of libdps1. I'll try to sync up depends and stuff with debian while I'm at it :-).
<ajmitch> Nafallo: great
<Nafallo> yes! ethereal-dev bails out cause it can't find python2.3 ;-)
<ajmitch> some of the buildds are on crack still, I think
<Nafallo> that was on my pbuilder though
<ajmitch> right..
<ajmitch> I see that the last buildd run for it was successful
<ajmitch> Nafallo: so add the dep in..
<ajmitch> :)
<Nafallo> should be better to make ethereal honour python2.4 :-
<Nafallo> :-)
<ajmitch> certainly
<Nafallo> almost done downloading the source ;-)
<Nafallo> ajmitch: why would ethereal-dev need to dep on cdbs, debhelper, automake1.7, autoconf?
<Nafallo> ... and other.
<Nafallo> others even
<ajmitch> Nafallo: dep, not build-dep?
<Nafallo> ajmitch: yes, dep :-)
<ajmitch> right, that is crackful
<Nafallo> ajmitch: there are build-deps to. but ethereal-dev deps on them.
<ajmitch> I think you'll find that the debian maintainer needs a beating
<ajmitch> I guess he means it for those poor people who'd want to write ethereal plugins
<ajmitch> which still doesn't mean it makes sense :)
<Nafallo> :-)
* ajmitch is currently throwing all the unmet deps at his pbuilder
<ajmitch> which will take quite awhile
<Nafallo> ajmitch: yay! :-)
<ajmitch> I should really setup sbuild instead
<ajmitch> & I've started on the zope changes review
<ajmitch> http://ajmitch.meta.net.nz/debuild/ubuntu/tmp/zope/REVIEW
<ajmitch> lots of packages for me to look over & feed to the pkg-zope debian team :)
<Nafallo> :-)
<ajmitch> hmm, looks like I really need more diskspace to do this
<Nafallo> prune the porn ;-)
* ajmitch has none :)
<ajmitch> apt-get autoclean cleared up a bit of junk
<whiprush> Burgundavia: awake?
<ajmitch> yo whiprush
<whiprush> hi aj
<ajmitch> what's up?
<whiprush> you see that Ubuntu Bus thing I just blogged about?
<whiprush> it's awesome.
* ajmitch looks
<ajmitch> hah, cool
<whiprush> how are things here in motu-land?
<ajmitch> rocking as always
<Nafallo> pbuilder burning my laptop :-)
<whiprush> sweet. :)
<ajmitch> we've got a bunch of new people involved
<ajmitch> Nafallo: I'm building remotely :)
<whiprush> yeah I know, I barely recognize a lot of them
<whiprush> yay ExpandingUniverse!
<Nafallo> ajmitch: my laptop is my fastest computer with most of everything except discspace ;-)
<ajmitch> yeah, revu is going well, we're planning regular review days
<ajmitch> Nafallo: my current laptop is a p2, so no building there
<Nafallo> :-)
<Nafallo> my server is an amd-k6-2 450MHz :-)
<Nafallo> my laptop is an mobile amd64 2800+
<Nafallo> :-)
<ajmitch> nice..
<ajmitch> my desktop is an xp 1800+
<Nafallo> hehe, then I understand why you do it remotly ;-)
<ajmitch> no, I'm building on that ;)
<ajmitch> I'm not at home at the moment
<Nafallo> ajmitch: have you got the time to review what I did to ethereal?
<ajmitch> well, I'll have more time in 3-4 hours..
<Nafallo> ajmitch: I hope to be asleep by then ;-)
<Nafallo> http://www.magicalforest.se/tmp/ethereal_0.10.12-2ubuntu1.debdiff
<Nafallo> it's a rather small diff
<Nafallo> the stuff I'm not sure about it ethereal-dev :-P
<ajmitch> any good reason to remove libpcap0.8-dev, etc from depends?
<Nafallo> it doesn't belong there? :-)
<ajmitch> I suspect that people using ethereal-dev will want some of those depends
<Nafallo> I'll follow you command on which ones to keep :-).
<ajmitch> how well does kismet work without the libpcap0.8-dev & glib?
<Nafallo> that's kismet's problem
<ajmitch> as that's the only package in universe that build-deps on ethereal-dev
<Nafallo> and should be solved in there
<Nafallo> IMHO
<ajmitch> "http://www.magicalforest.se/tmp/ethereal_0.10.12-2ubuntu1.debdiff
<ajmitch> sorry
<ajmitch> " The -dev package should depend on all -dev packages for libraries that the library package directly depends upon, with the specific (so)version that the library package is linked against. This includes libc-dev."
<ajmitch> http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html#id4685364
<Nafallo> ahh, oki
<ajmitch> that is for shared libs, but I'd say it can extend to this case
<Nafallo> libpcap and libglib then. anything more that will have to be there?
<Nafallo> maybe I should just remove the last four?
<Nafallo> morning bddebian
<bddebian> Howdy Nafallo
<Nafallo> bddebian: how's life?
<bddebian> Pretty shitty lately.  How about you? :-)
<ajmitch> hello bddebian
<ajmitch> Nafallo: that's probably safe to remove those others
<ajmitch> you could always ask the debian maintainer :)
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<Nafallo> bddebian: working, time is 3:45, I'm still using my pbuilder and have the fan on speed 2/3.
<Nafallo> ajmitch: I'll remove the last four for now. those should be safe :-).
<Nafallo> ajmitch: thanx :-)
<Nafallo> bddebian: make that 3/3
<ajmitch> bddebian: I've started throwing all the unmet deps at pbuilder
<ajmitch> assuming I don't run out of diskspace, they should get processed & I'll look over logs, installable packages, etc
<bddebian> ajmitch: Cool
<bddebian> Nafallo: A little hot is it? :-)
<Nafallo> bddebian: naah; more like... BURNING :-)
<bddebian> Heh
<ajmitch> still winter here :)
<Nafallo> ajmitch: hehe, and you're upside down to ;-)
<cat> hey everyone
<bddebian> Hello cat
<cat> hey bddebian
<Nafallo> hmm, debdiff updated ;-)
<cat> hey people can someone leed me to the right path i want to be an ubuntu developer where do i star from?
<bddebian> cat: You can check out: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU I suppose
* Nafallo yawns *
* ajmitch takes another unmet dep off the list :)
<bddebian> Just one? ;-P
<ajmitch> well, two so far this afternoon
<bmonty> ajmitch: nice
<bddebian> Weak
* ajmitch /ignores bddebian 
<bddebian> :-)
<bmonty> so is it worth it to keep working on the unmet deps?
<bddebian> Hehe
<bddebian> I asked that same question a couple of days ago
<ajmitch> depends, what else do you want to work on?
<bmonty> I was looking at automating the build of the packages on the unmet dep page, but it sounds like ajmitch alredy did that :)
<ajmitch> bmonty: yeah, started doing that just before
<bmonty> ajmitch: whatever needs working on
<ajmitch> bmonty: take a look at malone bugs :)
<ajmitch> I think we've got enough to work on for awhile
<ajmitch> review packages, put comments up
<ajmitch> only MOTUs can advocate, but anyone can give comments
<bmonty> any specific malone bugs to look at?
<ajmitch> any & all ;)
* ajmitch can't really spend time at the moment identifying what we need to work on
<ajmitch> I think I'll overhaul MOTUTodo tomorrow for that
* ajmitch wishes he had a nice fast amd64 for building
* Nafallo *wissles*
<Nafallo> hmm, libdps1 has rdepends that should be rebuilt :-)
<bddebian> Nafallo, that's whistles ;-P
<Nafallo> bddebian: indeed :-). thanx
<Nafallo> 4:23
<Nafallo> I wonder when ethereal is built ;-)
<cat> hey i have a question does someone have the packaged bitchx on ubuntu
<cat> because i'm building it (:
<Nafallo> bitchx | 1:1.0-0c19.20030512-2 | http://localhost breezy/universe Packages
<cat> oh
<cat> so it's already there?
<ajmitch> yes
<cat> how about irssi?
<ajmitch> of course
<Nafallo> same version as in warty :-)
<cat> darn it
<Nafallo> irssi is in main
<ajmitch> irssi is in main, I believe
<Nafallo> I know :-)
<ajmitch> cat: why are you wanting to build those packages which exist?
<cat> so what can i build then (:
<cat> well at was just asking so i can build something
<ajmitch> are you wanting to create a new package?
<cat> yeah
<cat> for ubuntu
<ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseCandidates
<ajmitch> that page probably has a few entires that can be removed now, but most of them are request from users
<Nafallo> hmm
<cat> so what can i do ajmitch ?
<Nafallo> I should remove my entries ;-)
<ajmitch> cat: if you're intent on building a new package, choose one & build it
<cat> but the one i choosed was already in the ubuntu =(
<ajmitch> I'd suggest fixing existing packges first
<cat> alright like? what packages
<ajmitch> ask Nafallo or bddebian
* ajmitch has to get some work done today
<Nafallo> ajmitch: I wish you could teach me that someday ;-)
<Nafallo> it's 4:37 here and I'm still rebuilding stuff :-P
<ajmitch> teach you what?
<Nafallo> to do the work on days, rather than nights ;-)
<ajmitch> heh
* ajmitch is about ready to kill apt-proxy
<ajmitch> md5sum errors, again..
* Lathiat uses debmirror. :)
<ajmitch> Lathiat: does that cache only the packages you download? :)
<Lathiat> ajmitch: nope :)
<ajmitch> then it's fairly uselss for me
<ajmitch> I live in NZ, remember
<Lathiat> and?
<ajmitch> you've heard the horror stories of connectivity here..
<Lathiat> not really
<Lathiat> is it worse than AU?
<ajmitch> where 256Kbps is considered broadband :)
<ajmitch> oh yes
<Lathiat> hrm
<Lathiat> well i have 1.5mbit
<ajmitch> I have 256/128, 10GB data cap
* Lathiat remembers 6 months ago when he had 256kbps
* Lathiat shudders
<jsgotangco> hmm
<Lathiat> wow 128 up, i had 64 :)
<jsgotangco> that's the same situation that i am in
<ajmitch> and I only moved to 256 a few months ago
<ajmitch> from 128/128
<jsgotangco> but then i live in a 3rd world country
<Lathiat> i was on 28.8k up until 6 months ago
<ajmitch> yeah but that's just crap ;)
<Lathiat> well, up until a year ago, then for 6 months i had no net access.. then i got 256 dsl.. then upgraded through 512 and 1.5 :)
<Lathiat> since i had money now
<ajmitch> I'm supposedly going to 2Mbit next week
<Lathiat> what do you pay for 256 ?
<ajmitch> still with a 10GB cap
<Lathiat> well i have a 20G cap
<ajmitch> $60 NZ/month
<Lathiat> i synced my mirror up initally at uni
<Lathiat> hm thats kinda ouch i was paying 40
<Lathiat> NZ ~= AU ?
* Nafallo has no cap, no closed ports, no nothing 512/512kbps
<ajmitch> sorry, $50
<Lathiat> handy thing tho is i get free traffic to the WAIX network
<ajmitch> probably about 1 NZD = 0.9 AUD
<Lathiat> which includes mirrors for lots of things
<ajmitch> that's useful
<ajmitch> they're moving away from that sort of thing here
<Lathiat> i can get most distros, etc
<ajmitch> stupid telcos
<Lathiat> funnily enough
<Lathiat> about the only isps not on waix
<Lathiat> is telstra and optus
<ajmitch> telstra have de-peered here
<Lathiat> for every other isp its a big cost saving
<Lathiat> because they pay about $250/month for 100mbit
<ajmitch> traffic to .au can go via the US at times
<Lathiat> unlimited
<Lathiat> where as 1mbit of of a tesltra pipe is like $800
<ajmitch> DSL here is a joke
<Lathiat> well before
<Lathiat> when i used to go from perth
<Lathiat> to other parts of perth
<Lathiat> i'd go perth -> sydney->melbourne->adelaide->perth
<ajmitch> ISPs have a layer 2 tunnel to telecom, who runs all the hardware
<Lathiat> thats what happens here in most cases
<Lathiat> only just started to have DSLAM rollouts
<Lathiat> lsat year or so
<ajmitch> you at least have some unbundling
<Lathiat> so now you can get 8mbit dsl, 12mbit on some
<Lathiat> telstra locks you to 1.5 max
<Lathiat> but to get 8mbit dsl
<Lathiat> i need to bundle in aphone service
<Lathiat> with rental twice as much
<ajmitch> you can get 8Mbps from telecom, if you pay 15c/MB
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> you guys still have 'telecom' there ?
<ajmitch> telecom NZ
<Lathiat> ours used to be telecom.. along.. long time ago, then it was partly privatised and went to 'telstra'
* jsgotangco remembers those expensive telstra overseas calls
<ajmitch> and the only other big player is 'telstraclear'
<ajmitch> since they bought out clear communications :)
<Lathiat> heh
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> amd64 gone? :-P
<ajmitch> buildd, you mean?
<Nafallo> yepp
<ajmitch> probably
<ajmitch> they've been having a few issues lately
<Nafallo> yea, I know.
<Nafallo> tomorrow will be a massive give-back ;-)
<Nafallo> hopefully ethereal is built then
<ajmitch> apt-proxy issues have halted my pbuilder fun for now
<ajmitch> as it's doing apt-get update & breaking on each build
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> apt-get update on each build?
<Nafallo> mine doesn't do that :-P
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> I've got a hook to do that
<Nafallo> I thought so
* ajmitch can probably comment it out for this run
<Nafallo> anyway. time for sleep.
<Nafallo> 05:13 here
<ajmitch> night
<ajmitch> :)
<Nafallo> morning ;-)
<bmonty> is it OK to assign bugs in malone to myself or does someone else control that?
<ajmitch> no, go ahead
<ajmitch> which bug is it, btw?
<bmonty> I've been playing with the desktop files...bug is #246
<ajmitch> ok, great
<bmonty> when I make the desktop file, do I add it to malone as a patch, or make a new version of the package and upload it to REVU?
<ajmitch> upload to REVU, I think
<ajmitch> we'll put this info on a wiki page, so you can link from there
<bmonty> ok
<bmonty> apt-spy is wierd the package has a mirrors list for debian instead of ubuntu....kinda useless like that
<ajmitch> that's because it's an import from debian, of course :)
<bmonty> yeah I know
<bmonty> I'll add a useful mirrors list to it
<ajmitch> ah, isdnutils needs sync..
<ajmitch> that will cause a few others to build
<bmonty> as long as xmkmf is back in the xorg packages
<bmonty> I put a list of some of the packages I found that depend in isdnutils on the unmetdeps page
<ajmitch> ah, thanks
<bmonty> how does the menu system know when it needs to run sudo? (for like synaptic, gnome-system-tools, etc)
<Amaranth> it's coded into the .desktop file
<Amaranth> they have Exec=gksudo synaptic
<bmonty> ok, thanks
<chillywilly> shorewall package is breezy is rather old people
<chillywilly> s/is/in/
<Amaranth> chillywilly: make up a newer one and submit it?
<chillywilly> I don't have time right now
<ajmitch> so you prefer to complain, and do nothing? :)
<chillywilly> um, yes
<Amaranth> SloMo: what's up with g-p-m?
<chillywilly> at least debian sid has 2.4.1 for crying out loud ;)
<ajmitch> chillywilly: there are nicer ways to ask than how you did :P
<ajmitch> chillywilly: if you can give adequate reason for breaking the upstream version freeze, we will consider syncing with sid
<chillywilly> when was there an upstream version freeze?
<ajmitch> early july
<ajmitch> feature freeze was today
<chillywilly> 2.0.13 is very old
<chillywilly> 2.2.5 too
<ajmitch> well 2.4.1 was uploaded into sid 10 days after the breezy freeze
<ajmitch> rather than saying "it's old", give a reason
<chillywilly> think I'll just compile it then
<ajmitch> bah
<chillywilly> it fixes some vunerability and adds some features
<ajmitch> ok, that's getting a little better :)
<ajmitch> does it build cleanly? are there packages depending on it?
<chillywilly> no idea
<chillywilly> all I know is that it would be nice to have the latest package :)
<ajmitch> we'll take your position into consideration :P
<chillywilly> Depends: iptables (>= 1.2.7a), iproute, debconf
<ajmitch> reverse depends are what matters in this case
<ajmitch> the main one I see is webmin-shorewall
<chillywilly> ic
<chillywilly> no one uses webmin anyway ;)
* chillywilly ducks
<ajmitch> syncing one package but breaking others is bad form
<chillywilly> fooey ;)
<ajmitch> looks like we have to get either 2.4.1-3 or a new 2.2.6 in anyway, for that MACLIST vuln
<ajmitch> so you might get your wish on a technicality :P
<chillywilly> that's what I was referring to
<chillywilly> MACLIST is fixed in 2.4.2
<ajmitch> and 2.4.1-3, in sid
<chillywilly> so they pactched it?
<ajmitch> yes
<chillywilly> why not change the version number?
<chillywilly> they just patched it to fix the vuln?
<ajmitch> yes
<chillywilly> bleh ;)
<ajmitch> because building a new upstream package can be a bit more work
<ajmitch> go complain to the debian developer then
<chillywilly> so you guys only just use stuff that's already been packaged by the debian ppl?
<ajmitch> no
<ajmitch> but forking is a bad thing, that causes a lot more pain
<chillywilly> ic
<ajmitch> when there's ~20 MOTUs for a few thousand packages, do you think we'll do everything from scratch?
<ajmitch> 2.4.1-3 came out a couple of days before 2.4.2
<ajmitch> sorry, 2.4.1-2 did (which had the patch)
<chillywilly> well, I just thought I would mention it at least ;)
<chillywilly> I can take the sid source and build a package if I get desparate
<chillywilly> the shorewall author told me it was soe italian grad student that maintains is and this time of year he is on holiday and is not very likely to be making packages since this is one of the few times he's not on campus
<chillywilly> s/is/it/
<chillywilly> he told me that earlier in the day
<ajmitch> right
<chillywilly> 2.0.13 is from Dec 2004 ;)
<ajmitch> 2.0.13 is in which distro?
<chillywilly> Hoary
<ajmitch> you know that we can't stick new versions into hoary
<chillywilly> I know
<ajmitch> hoary froze around that time, december 2004 really isn't that long ago
<chillywilly> it's eons in the FOSS world :)
<ajmitch> actually I can't recall when UVF was for hoary
<ajmitch> so do something about it, instead of complaining just how antique things are
<ajmitch> you're complaining that software was released about 3 months before hoary was, what a disaster :)
<ajmitch> there might have been 10 of us working on universe at the time, do you think we could have made sure everything was up to date & working?
<Amaranth> ajmitch: universe didn't do UVF for hoary
<ajmitch> Amaranth: we didn't have an official freeze, but the autosync stopped
<ajmitch> which is what matters
<ajmitch> now we have no auto syncs, and we have to justify manual syncs
<ajmitch> I know we're going to get complaints for the whole breezy lifetime that packages are too old :)
<ajmitch> Amaranth: remember, when smeg is in main, that's 18 months support for that version ;)
<Amaranth> yeah
<Amaranth> that's why it's going to be 0.7.5 and not 0.8, even if i did finish it soon enough
<Treenaks> http://www.mugglenet.com/viewer/?image_location=krumstudent2.jpg -> is that jdub on the right?
<ajmitch> almost :)
<ajmitch> bbiab
<chillywilly> does debin sid have a cvs repo?
<chillywilly> debian*
<Treenaks> chillywilly: what do you mean?
<Treenaks> some packages in sid do
<Treenaks> there's not one tree you can checkout to get debian sid source, if that's what you mean
<Treenaks> you could apt-get source
<chillywilly> ok
<chillywilly> I suppose the size of such a thing would be massive
<chillywilly> :)
<ajmitch> back
<chillywilly> forth
<Amaranth> chillywilly: just the binary packages in sid are 11001 MB
<Amaranth> double or triple that and you might have the source size
<ajmitch> and when it's in revision control, you have the additional space from revisions
<chillywilly> sure
<Lathiat> for breezy i386 is 11G, with source its 25G or so i think
<Amaranth> ok, so sid is about 25G
<Lathiat> start a debmirror
<Lathiat> it'l calculate it at the start
<Amaranth> that first mirroring must suck
<Lathiat> well see
<Lathiat> i did it at uni :)
<Lathiat> took 2 hours
<Lathiat> 4M/s goodness
<Lathiat> if i went to the other uni i could do it at 11 :)
<ajmitch> and if I went to uni I could do it at 64Kb/s
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> well partially tahts because
<ajmitch> behind a proxy that only allows http/https
<Lathiat> said mirror is on the second uni
<ajmitch> right
<Lathiat> and the first uni has $fast access to the second uni, because its not far away
<ajmitch> otago uni doesn't mirror sid
<Lathiat> said uni (ftp.uwa.edu.au) mirrors all of ubuntu and debian
<Lathiat> which is v. handy
<Lathiat> its also on waix as mentioned earlier
<chillywilly> where's bddeian's beginner's wiki page?
<chillywilly> doh, too many 's ;)
<ajmitch> MOTUWannabeTips
<pef> hello
<mdke> is anyone working on fixing this: https://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/446/
<mdke> or is it already fixed?
<siretart> hey folks
<mdke> did anyone see my post ^^
<HiddenWolf> Is there any interest here to package / fix freevo?
<torkel> mdke: I have osd working in tpb, with current breezy
<ajmitch> torkel: right, I don't see where in the changelog it says it is disabled
<ajmitch> it compiled with xosd support as-is
<torkel> ajmitch: yeah, I can't find it either
* ajmitch will close bug :)
<ajmitch> morning \sh!!
<ajmitch> so far I've thrown about 100 packages of unmet deps at pbuilder ;)
<\sh> hehe
<ajmitch> uploaded a few
<\sh> I'm just fighting with the toshiba sk98lin module
<ajmitch> so I've got a bunch of logfiles & debs that I'll go through tomorrow, pick out those that can be done
<ajmitch> yay for pbuilder's --logfile option
<\sh> ajmitch: are u experienced with the debian/ubuntu-installer thing?
<ajmitch> nope
<\sh> which package I have to install, to generate these type of initrd
<\sh> s
<ajmitch> what's the issue? trying to get the LaptopTesting done?
<\sh> yeah
<ajmitch> hoary, or breezy?
<\sh> breezy
<\sh> colony 2
<ajmitch> since initrd is deprecated as of yesterday
<ajmitch> ah
<\sh> hu
<ajmitch> jbailey got initramfs in
<\sh> is daily iso installable?
<ajmitch> should get buildable real soon now
<ajmitch> mdz & others went insane trying to get the desktop & live cds workable
<\sh> ah wait
<\sh> I could use a linux-sources-2.6.12-3-i386
<\sh> to get it running
<\sh> lemme fetch it
<mdke> thanks for closing that tpb bug ajmitch
<ajmitch> mdke: my pleasure
<SloMo> good morning
<\sh> hey SloMo
<ajmitch> morning SloMo
<ajmitch> hopefully by the time I get a laptop colony 3 will be out
<Treenaks> same for me
<ajmitch> I think kamion wants it out in the next week or so
<SloMo> woah... the math exam was really easy :) now i can get to more important work ;)
<\sh> ok...laters...I have to try again :)
<\sh> cheers
<ajmitch> SloMo: great! :)
<SloMo> hm, who to ask to get something out of the dep-wait queue? lamont?
<ajmitch> infinity, I think
<ajmitch> wb Mez :)
<Mez> ty
<Mez> ajmitch, it was hotplug that went tits up
<ajmitch> ah,  makes sense
<ajmitch> hi mbreit
<mbreit> hi all
<mbreit> hi ajmitch
<Mez> ajmitch, hotplug was meant to bring up eth0 but it doesnt
<SloMo> hmm does anybody else have problems with gamin (gam_server) on x86? it consumes up to 26% of all memory after running one day...
<ajmitch> SloMo: it just goes a bit slow for me at tiems
<ajmitch> only using a couple of MB though
<SloMo> ajmitch: hmm... maybe i'm running an too old version... well i have to reboot anyways, new kernel ;)
<ajmitch> beagle is nice with the gaim indexing now :)
<torkel> :-)
<torkel> now we just need a rebuild of tomboy so it works with dbus 0.35.2 :-9
<ajmitch> torkel: it's in main, so tseng will handle it
<torkel> ajmitch: yeah I noticed after I filed a bug in malone...
<ajmitch> torkel: you marked the bug as against upstream tomboy..
<torkel> ajmitch: *sigh* I just clicked on "File New Bug" and never noticed that it was for upstream... :-(
* ajmitch waits patiently for his box to compile stuff
<ajmitch> sigh, I hate wiki conflicts..
<mbreit> who works on the wxpython packages?
<ajmitch> mbreit: I've done a few
<ajmitch> mbreit: or do you mean wxpython itself?
<tseng> yay no more file chooser crash
<mbreit> yes, i mean wxpython itself....
<mbreit> wxpython2.4-1:
<ajmitch> doko touched that last
<mbreit> Replaces: libwxgtk2.4-python
<ajmitch> mbreit: as it should..
<mbreit> Depends: libwxgtk2.4-1-python
<ajmitch> packages should depend on python-wx2.4 or python-wx2.6 if they want a specific version
<ajmitch> mbreit: so what's the problem?
<mbreit> wxpython2.4-1 is not installable on breezy...
<mbreit> oh... okay, just have to change one package's dependency.... there was just a conflict ;)
<doko> wxpython is perfect :-P
<mbreit> ajmitch: so should i depend on wxpython2.4-1 or python-wx2.4?
<mbreit> doko: yes it is ;)
<ajmitch> doko recommended python-wx2.4
<mbreit> doko: but i am not ;)
<ajmitch> hehe
<doko> ouch, hmm, but there is a bug ... ok, will fix ...
<ajmitch> 'unplanned feature'
<mbreit> but python-wx2.4 as a dependency is correct?
* jamessan|work will remember to call bugs 'unplanned features' in his next meeting  ;)
<doko> mbreit: yes
<slomo> jamessan|work: fine ;) i had some unplanned features last reboot... very funny easter eggs which kept me from beeing bored ;)
<jamessan|work> excellent. I should remember to add more of those
<torkel> tseng: can you please do a rebuild of tomboy so that it works again (with dbus 0.35.2)?
<ajmitch> slomo: part of what makes breezy so fun
<mbreit> okay, who wants to upload my patch?
<mbreit> (fixed thuban package for gcc4 and wxpython)
<ajmitch> sure, provide debdiff
<mbreit> http://ubuntu.mobr.de/sources/debdiffs/thuban_1.0.0-1ubuntu3.debdiff
<ajmitch> mbreit: it uses simple-patchsys?
<mbreit> yes...
<mbreit> ajmitch: please wait with uploading
<mbreit> i just saw a possible bug
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> I was reviewing & building before I upload :)
<mbreit> ImportError: No module named wxPython.wx
<mbreit> ...
<ajmitch> see wxpython changelog, if it needs 2.4 specifically
<ajmitch> "      import wxversion
<ajmitch>       wxversion.select('2.4')
<ajmitch>       import wx
<ajmitch> "
<mbreit> thanks..
<mbreit> i'll patch that
<Amaranth> that's kinda like pygtk, but less broken
<ajmitch> some packages don't like wx 2.6 still
<Amaranth> since something written for 2.0 will run on 2.8 it only has to decide whether or not to load a 1.x or 2.x binding
<ajmitch> yay, editex is dead & gone
<mbreit> oh.... there are lots of files with "from wxPython.wx import *"
<mbreit> how do i import wxPython.grid then? just import grid?
<ajmitch> mbreit: as long as you do the wxversion part first, it should work
<mbreit> okay, i'll try
<ajmitch> I _think_, ask doko for clarifications :)
<doko> mbreit: just the first two lines ...
<mbreit> doko: ?
<mbreit> doko: what do you mean?
<doko> import wxversion
<doko> <ajmitch>       wxversion.select('2.4')
<doko> import wxPython.grid
<bddebian> Hello
<mbreit> hey bddebian
<ajmitch> hello bddebian
<mbreit> doko: it's wxPython.grid but wx without wxPython?
<bddebian> Heya mbreit, ajmitch
<doko> mbreit: ?
<mbreit> doko: the wxpython changelog tells me to import wx, not wxPython.wx... and you say i should import wxPython.grid
<doko> mbreit: don't change the imports, just execute the two lines, before the first import
<mbreit> doko: okay, thanks... i was changing every wxPython.wx to wx ;)
<mbreit> ajmitch: it works now... the debdiff is at the same url
<ajmitch> ok
<slomo> mbreit: better number the patches in the order they must be applied... for this 2 patches it doesn't matter but anyways...
<mbreit> slomo: there have been other patches in there, and they were not numbered as well...
<slomo> mbreit: well... then ignore me ;)
<mbreit> *g*
<slomo> but for your packages and packages without patches number them ;)
<mbreit> slomo: i did some packages with patches and i numbered them all ;)
<Nafallo> slomo: could you find out what went wrong with liferea? the version on REVU was uploaded, but never did hit the archive.
<slomo> Nafallo: it's in dep-wait because of a much older version... i contacted infinity but got no answer yet..
<Nafallo> slomo: oh, joy! :-)
* Nafallo should definitly start working on a local repo :-P
<ajmitch> yay, f-spot fixed & ready to upload\
<slomo> Nafallo: why?
<Nafallo> ajmitch: shall I test it on amd64 for you? :-)
<Nafallo> slomo: I could build it, put it there and continue to like my life :-).
<Nafallo> slomo: or something.
<Mithrandir> Nafallo: if you care, could you test ooo2 on amd64 for me?
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: sure.
<Mithrandir> great. :-)
<slomo> Nafallo: good idea ;)
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: just tell me what you want me to do with it :-)
<mbreit> yay... ooo2 on amd64 would be great ;)))
<Mithrandir> Nafallo: test whether it works properly and if not, what's broken
<Mithrandir> mbreit: it's in the archive.
<mbreit> Mithrandir: but does not work
<mbreit> does not find the 32 bit libstlport
<ajmitch> Nafallo: ready to upload to sid - I'll ask for a sync to breezy tomorrow
<mbreit> Mithrandir: /usr/lib/openoffice2/program/javaldx: error while loading shared libraries: libstlport_gcc.so.4.6: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
<mbreit> /usr/lib/openoffice2/program/soffice.bin.real: error while loading shared libraries: libstlport_gcc.so.4.6: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
<Mithrandir> mbreit: does it work if you install ia32-libs-openoffice.org?
<Nafallo> ajmitch: oki
<mbreit> Mithrandir: it is already installed
<Mithrandir> mbreit: what does dpkg -S libstlport_gcc.so.4.6 tell you?
<ajmitch> Nafallo: I have the fun of working on 2 distros at once - it's much better to have this work in debian as well
<mbreit> Mithrandir: ia32-libs-openoffice.org: /usr/lib32/libstlport_gcc.so.4.6
<mbreit> LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/lib32/ oowriter2 gives me the same error...
<mbreit> lol... there is no /usr/lib32/libstlport*
<Mithrandir> so something has nuked it.  Try tracking that down. :-)
<mbreit> YAY.... ooo2 runs ;)
<Mithrandir> please also test whether printing and such works
<mbreit> Mithrandir: apt-get --reinstall install ia32-libs-openoffice.org ;))
<Mithrandir> ok
* ajmitch wants an amd64 now :)
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: it's just the 32 bit version repackaged, though
<Mithrandir> the 64 bit version is waaay too unstable
<ajmitch> Mithrandir: oh but any amd64 would speed up the compiling I'm doing today :)
<mbreit> Mithrandir: is there a possibility of using another gtk-theme with the 32 bit gtk? (and ooo of cause)
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: well, that might be true. :-)
<ajmitch> xp 1800+ isn't too bad, but it could be faster :)
<Mithrandir> mbreit: you need to have a 32 bit theme engine lying around for that to happen, but yes, it's doable.  It's not a priority for me at the moment, though.
<mbreit> Mithrandir: printing gives me an error message
<mbreit> Mithrandir: but it prints anyway
<mbreit> Mithrandir: besides that, everything seems to work well... are there any other things i should test?
<Mithrandir> mbreit: just check whether it generally works, I guess.  :-)
<Mithrandir> what is the error message you got from printing?
<mbreit> Mithrandir: it says "Error while printing"
<mbreit> on stdout/err it says "ERROR: ld.so: object '/usr/lib32/libpangohack.so.0.0' from LD_PRELOAD cannot be preloaded: ignored." three times
<Nafallo> hmm
<mbreit> and lots of "Gdk-WARNING **: Error converting from UTF-8 to STRING", but these are not only when i want to pring
<mbreit> ... print
<Mithrandir> mbreit: yeah, those should be fairly harmless
<mbreit> Mithrandir: ooo2 seems to be very stable... i had no other problem until now
<Mithrandir> goodie
<mbreit> Mithrandir: there is a bug... but i have the same but on x86...
<mbreit> s/but/bug/
<mbreit> if i export graphics as pdf, all the lines are missing...
<Mithrandir> I'm not too interested if it's not amd64-specific. ;-)
<mbreit> Mithrandir: then i have nothing for you ;)
<slomo> waahh... i killed my rhythmbox ;) i crashed while importing my whole music collection... and when i start it now nothing happens... it just hangs, even when i delete the database... anybody else here with this problem?
<mbreit> Mithrandir: i think there is a missing dependency on lib32stdc++6... i installed that by hand yesterday... or is that already fixed?
<Mithrandir> mbreit: yes, it's missing and I just asked Nafallo to report it
<\sh> grmpf
<mbreit> Mithrandir: is lib32gcj6 needed as well? i don't see a dependency to that, too
<mbreit> hey \sh
<\sh> hey mbreit
<\sh> I'm getting really confused
<bddebian> Heya \sh
<\sh> I'm trying to load a stupid module for the colony kernel
<\sh> colony 2 kernel...and every single time, it complains about wrong / unknown symbols and refuses to load
<ajmitch> trying to get the installer to work?
<ajmitch> or are you past there?
<\sh> ajmitch: colony 2....with normal initrd
<\sh> the driver I put inside the initrd now...but the kernel module symbols are wrong
<ajmitch> where'd you get the driver from?
<\sh> and I don't find any hints how the colony 2 kernel is compiled...what version i should set etc.
<\sh> http://www.syskonnect.com/syskonnect/support/driver/d0102_driver.html
<\sh> the explanation is on http://glozer.net/dynabook/dynabook.html#ethernet
<ajmitch> if you compile the module, you have to compile against the colony 2 kernel headers
<ajmitch> compiling kernel modules can still be pretty evil
<\sh> it's a patch for the kernel
<ajmitch> oh, nasty
<Mithrandir> mbreit: yes, for some stuff.  Please file a bug and assign to me.
* ajmitch wanders off to sleep :)
<ajmitch> be back in a few hours :)
<\sh> hmmmm....one more try
<\sh> bbl
<siretart> Nafallo: I think that liferea is still in dep-wait and needs manual interverntion from buildd admins
<slomo> hi siretart :)
<siretart> huhu slomo
<Nafallo> siretart, slomo: anyone pinged them? :-)
<slomo> Nafallo: you can also ping infinity or lamont for liferea ;) maybe they don't listen to me or maybe it just gets faster then
<Nafallo> slomo: :-)
<Nafallo> slomo: !
<slomo> Nafallo: ?
<Nafallo> slomo: #ubuntu-devel ;-)
<Nafallo> slomo: dep-wait on dbus-glib-1-dev
<Nafallo> hmm, that was fast :-)
<slomo> yeah... seems like he doesn't respond to queries ;)
<siretart> finally :)
<Nafallo> hehe
<Nafallo> ping is more powerful indeed :-)
<\sh> grmpf
<slomo> \sh: what's the matter?
<\sh> my driver
<\sh> I can't get it incorporated into colony 2
<\sh> but I need this stuff
<\sh> hmmm
<\sh> anybody has a clue about initrd-netboot-tools?
<Amaranth> nothing like hacking up Ruffle just so you can listen to music again
<slomo> Nafallo: why don't you ask for a sync for im-switch and change the build-depend after that? i don't know whether we get automated syncs this way...
<slomo> Nafallo: ping?
<\sh> YES
<\sh> i screwed colony 2
<ajmitch> hah
* ajmitch can't sleep, reviewing instead :(
<\sh> i have my driver
<bddebian> ajmitch: Bah, who needs sleep? ;-)
<jsgotangco> i kinda feel sleepy already
<siretart> ogra: I created an revu account for you. use 'ogra@ubuntu.com' and use the recover link to learn your password
<ajmitch_> pef: debian/copyright should have name & year(s), rather than just name imho
<Lathiat> siretart: that gpg thing is rather nifty
<Lathiat> for the password
<Nafallo> slomo: pong
<Nafallo> or semi-pong :-)
<siretart> Lathiat: well, it is was a quick hack.
* Lathiat has switched to mrxvt
<Lathiat> so much better than gnome-terminal
<Lathiat> and all the features i want :)
<Lathiat> had to hack up http://bur.st/~lathiat/Xresources
<Lathiat> but otherwise good
<slomo> Nafallo: why don't you sync im-switch from debian and change the build-depends after that? i don't know if we can get automated syncs this way... other than that you get my vote ;)
<siretart> Lathiat: does is has a url parser?
<Lathiat> now when im scrolling around a file in vim it doesnt do 1 line per second :)
<Lathiat> siretart: no :(
<siretart> does it have
<Lathiat> thats the only thing i want
<Lathiat> thats annoying me
<Nafallo> slomo: good idea. I'll nag elmo :-)
<slomo> Nafallo: but first ask someone else ;) maybe it's ok this way... don't know
<pef> ajmitch : like this ? Copyright Holder: 2004-2005 Christoph Thielecke <crissi99@gmx.de>
<Nafallo> slomo: to late ;-)
<koke> \sh: BTW, nice laptop :)
<slomo> Nafallo: lol ok
<ajmitch_> pef: Copyright (C) 1985-2003 Name Here
<ajmitch_> I believe that is the suggested format
<jsgotangco> good night
<\sh> koke: it is :) but it's a pain in da ass to install breezy ,-)
<koke> :D
<ajmitch_> \sh: ah well, you'll  have fun installing all the preview releases ;)
<slomo> \sh: report (or better fix) all the bugs and you get an easy job next release ;)
<\sh> slomo: i will...I just managed to include this bloody driver for this laptop ,-)
<\sh> ajmitch_: yes :)
<\sh> ajmitch_: u have to do it as well
<ajmitch_> \sh: hopefully the one I get will have a cd drive & working ethernet ;)
* ajmitch_ doesn't know what sort it will be yet
<\sh> ajmitch_: hahahq
<\sh> ok...another try to install :)
<\sh> bbl
<Nafallo> slomo: it's in NEW ;-)
<ajmitch_> pef: I'll test & finish up the review tomorrow
<slomo> Nafallo: it's _in_ NEW? is that good? ;)
<pef> ajmitch : nice :) i've added the copyright year and uploaded the package
<siretart> pef: what about this file? http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/incoming/kvpnc-0508121820/kvpnc-0.7.2/debian/files
<siretart> lintian mocks about it
<Nafallo> slomo: yea :-). atleast after elmo pushed it through ;-)
<pef> siretart: in upstream tarball
<pef> siretart: dpkg-source doesn't want to delete it
<siretart> pef: you aren't serious, are you?
<pef> siretart: there is already a debian layout in the orig tarball
<siretart> another upstream wanting to include a debian/ directory? ARGL :/
<pef> siretart: http://download.gna.org/kvpnc/kvpnc-0.7.2.tar.bz2
<slomo> Nafallo: wonderfull :) now it will land in dep-wait... and you can directly upload the new version
<siretart> pef: delete that file in clean target, as lintian suggests
<Nafallo> slomo: :-)
<slomo> siretart: it is deleted in clean ;) and that's not the only ugly thing in that upstream tarball...
<siretart> oh damn
<pef> siretart: have tried, but dpkg-source doesn't want : dpkg-source: warning: ignoring deletion of file debian/files
<pef> siretart: the upstram tarball is dirty
<slomo> hmm... who is muszilla@users.sourceforge.net?
<siretart> pef: can you try to hit upstream with something hard?
<Nafallo> slomo: mail and ask :-)
<pef> siretart: :D
<slomo> Nafallo: hmm... too much work ;) it isn't that important... he can read the comment to his package in revu then ;)
<pef> siretart: if I ask them to clean this, I think they will delay this cleanup to next release, in order to avoid confusions with differents tarball md5 of the same version
<siretart> pef: yes, thats what I would expect :)
<pef> slomo, siretart : can I have your vote again ? I've made a little change to the package
<slomo> pef: done
<siretart> pef: there are a lot of other packages in the queue before you ;)
<siretart> I must admit that this lintian warning abou debian/rules makes me nervous
<siretart> I'd rather rebuild the upstream tarball, I think..
<slomo> and as you already have to recompress it because of bz2 it shouldn't be that problematic i think...
<siretart> right
<pef> deleting files from the upstream tarball like this is strange, no ?
<siretart> it is sometimes necessary
<siretart> mostly because of undistributable parts
<Nafallo> yay! im-switch accepted
<pef> siretart: have I to mention this somewhere ?
<siretart> pef: see http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-source.html#s-debianrules the part about the get-orig-source
<siretart> pef: yes, in the changelog
<slomo> hmm... does anybody know about a gtkhtml documentation?
<pef> siretart: ok, will use this target
<siretart> woah. what happened to bugs.debian.org?
<Lathiat> facelift apparently
<siretart> juck. looks lovely :)
<pef> siretart: what happens ? no problem here
<siretart> pef: I mean the look of the bug reports
<Treenaks> siretart: whoa.. they CSS'ed it!
<Treenaks> (I hope)
<Treenaks> and they discovered header-filtering
<siretart> header filtering is done for some time
<Treenaks> siretart: like, a week maybe
<siretart> http://bugs.debian.org/css/bugs.css
<siretart> thats the css debian is using
<Treenaks> Not rocket science
<pef>  extraneous shit added by erinn
<pef> huhu
<Treenaks> so THAT's what debian-women is for *duck & run*
<siretart> Lathiat: still here?
<Lathiat> siretart: yep
<siretart> Lathiat: I think the list on MOTUGLUTransition is quite out of date, many packages from that list have already been fixed
<Lathiat> yeh
<Lathiat> it hasnt been touched
<Lathiat> for a while
<Lathiat> because we were never sure
<siretart> Lathiat: do you think we can update that list or should we drop it and handle that together with UnmetDeps?
<Lathiat> umm
<Lathiat> i'd be interested in specifically knocking off a heap of glu ones
<Lathiat> so a list would be nice
<siretart> Lathiat: ok. now that the dependencies are clear, could you please update that list, when you find some time?
<Lathiat> ok
<siretart> thanks
<siretart> Lathiat: you arn't MOTU yet, are you?
<Lathiat> siretart: nope
<Lathiat> didnt really think i'd personally done enough yet to apply :)
<siretart> Lathiat: if you need some uploads for GLU Transition, feel free to ping me
<Lathiat> ok
<Lathiat> what do you want them in
<Lathiat> debdiff or sources?
<siretart> depends. debdiffs are easier for me to review, when they are small enough
<Lathiat> ok well
<Lathiat> if its just deps
<Lathiat> i'll give you a debdiff
<siretart> exactly
<Lathiat> much else i'll give sources
<Lathiat> stick em all in a dir and you can go over em whenever :)
<siretart> that'll be great
<Lathiat> should i just put this list in
<Lathiat> a oneliner
<Lathiat> instead of a big table like last time?
<Lathiat> its not that big now
<Lathiat> excluding gcc4 issues
<Lathiat> shoudlnt be much work
<Lathiat> its liek 109
<Lathiat> thats checking for xlibmesa-gl{u,}-dev
<Lathiat> siretart: so those values are definitie
<Lathiat> libgl1-xorg-dev | libgl-dev, libglu1-mesa-dev | libglu-dev
<siretart> Lathiat: I got confirmation from infinity a few hours before, with daniels listening
<siretart> Lathiat: So I would take them definite
<Lathiat> ok
<Lathiat> what would a good changelog entry be?
<siretart> 'adepted gl/glu dependencies for current xorg in breezy' should be quite clear, I think
<pef> siretart: get-orig-source has to be used "by hand" ? like fakeroot debian/rules get-orig-source ?
<Lathiat> Adapted GL/GLU dependencies for Xorg in breezy
<Lathiat> good ?
<siretart> pef: I understand debian policy, that this target is just a convinience target for users, so not even fakeroot should be required
<pef> siretart: ok, so it's never used by dpkg-buildpackage or so
<siretart> pef: nope. because it is optional
<Lathiat> siretart: for thigns with no ubuntu version
<Lathiat> ubuntu1 or build1?
<Lathiat> ubuntu1 since we're changing deps?
<Lathiat> and as such needs to be merged in future etc i assume
<siretart> Lathiat: in doubt, always ubuntu1
<siretart> Lathiat: build1 is quite a hack and only to be used if only debian/changelog is touched
<Lathiat> ah ok
<Lathiat> siretart: im working from the end backwards
<Lathiat> siretart: if you want to work on them work from the start :)
<siretart> Lathiat: ok :)
<pef> have to go, bye !
<Lathiat> siretart: hrm
<Lathiat> is ubuntu1 > build1
<Lathiat> i suppose it is
<siretart> Lathiat: yepp.
<Lathiat> poor laptops getting a workout :)
<Lathiat> had like 4 pbuilders going at once. :)
<bddebian> Lathiat: As far as I understand it, build1 versions will get ignored when trying to sync or merge with Debian.  ubuntuX versions will try to get merged.
<Lathiat> xlibmesa-glu-dev | libglu1-mesa-dev | libglu-dev, xlibmesa-gl-dev | mesag-dev | libgl-dev
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> thats what this package has now
<Lathiat> almost sane
<Lathiat> ooh yeh
<Lathiat> this package is broken
<Lathiat> make -C source clean
<Lathiat> ...
<Lathiat> Please enter the name of the directory where libtiff.a can be found:
<Treenaks> Lathiat: interactive configure!??!
<Lathiat> Treenaks: in the clean stage!
<Treenaks> *shudder*
<Lathiat> thats 'viewmol
<Lathiat> '
<Lathiat> i figure its libtiff handling needs to be fixed
<Lathiat> my laptop hard drive isnt appreciating this. :)
<Nafallo> mbreit: fityk uploaded
<\sh> welcome to the world of toshiba r200 :)
<\sh> it
<Treenaks> \sh: it works? :)
<mbreit> Nafallo: thanks!
<Lathiat> hrm hope i get something cool liek an r200
<\sh> yes
<\sh> took me half a day
<\sh> and a lot of tricks
<\sh> replacing the kernel of colony 2, tweeking the initrd of colony 2
<\sh> but in the end
<\sh> it works...with a special driver for this bloody NIC
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> yeh
<Lathiat> davyd found that too
<\sh> Lathiat: problem is, it doesn
<\sh> doesn't have a cdrom or somethine..so i need to use my nc6000 to play network install server
<Lathiat> ah
<\sh> Lathiat: that was the problem at all to install this nifty bitch :)
<ogra> hmm, had no usb CDrom around ?
<\sh> no
<\sh> and booting from usb hd wasn't possible at this time..
<\sh> so we should bring this driver into 2.6.12 for breezy...it doesn
<\sh> 't break anything
<ogra> yep
<\sh> and i have to play with this funny uk keyboard ;)
<\sh> it's so damn small...like it..love it...pet it
<\sh> but...
<\sh> another pitfall
<ogra> heh and you complained about the size at the start
<\sh> i had to remove the windows installation at all...cause the resizing didn
<\sh> 't work
<ogra> meh
<ogra> did you tell Kamion ?
<\sh> now I can't reinstall windows without a usb dvd
<ogra> dvd ?
<\sh> yes...recovery dvd
<ogra> how silly
<\sh> with windows xp prof, office
<\sh> etc.
<\sh> but I tested the wifi, irda, bluetooth and all...even the fingerprint sensor
<\sh> so on windows everything is working
<\sh> on breezy/linux...wifi should work with madwifi drivers...and bluetooth i have to check, sd card reader won't work
<\sh> irda will work
<ogra> sd wont ?
<\sh> graphics card can run with vesa or i810
<ogra> why that ?
<\sh> no..same problem as with the hps
<ogra> hmm, bad....
<\sh> no specs no drivers
<Lathiat> its not that
<ogra> acer puts  pcmcia reader to their laptops... works out of the box
<Lathiat> its that the sd card assoc specs are closed
<Lathiat> altho someone made an ipaq driver
<Lathiat> no idea on the legality
<\sh> na..it should be mounted as scsi
<\sh> like the external ones...it
<ogra> mine hets munted as hde
<\sh> 's normally a minipci card (sort of)
<ogra> gets even
<\sh> ogra: external or internal?
<ogra> acer pcmcia reader
<\sh> ogra: well...just like the usb stuff
<\sh> ah...ok
<ogra> its a pcmcia adapter.....
<\sh> but i will get more infos
<\sh> sound is working out of the box
<Lathiat> \sh: so you cant get windows on?
<Lathiat> that seems a bit silly
<\sh> no..not without a usb dvdrom
<Lathiat> ah
<Lathiat> you could install off a usb dvdrom?
<Lathiat> neat
<\sh> yepp...usb stick, usb hd, usb dvd
<\sh> same for hp
<Lathiat> ah
<Lathiat> cool
<\sh> anyways...actually it
<\sh> 's running
<\sh> ok..guys...this little bitchy thingy is updating to actual breezy and I will go to my girl ;)
<ogra> have fun
<\sh> ogra: later more
<ogra> :) just enjoy your evening :)
<\sh> hehe
<\sh> refueling is good >()
<ogra> yep
<janimo> hey all
<sistpoty> hi folks
<Nafallo> sistpoty: morning
<sistpoty> Nafallo: good evening ;)
<Nafallo> sistpoty: baah
<Nafallo> sistpoty: it's always morning :-)
<sistpoty> hm... good point =)
<siretart> Lathiat: still there?
<siretart> huhu sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi siretart
<siretart> sistpoty: are the changes on the Makefile.in files on purpose? (packages nvclock)?
<sistpoty> siretart: no, they have already been there
<siretart> sistpoty: ah i see.
<siretart> having a closer look
<sistpoty> :)
<sistpoty> i think i got dpatch now working as it should *g*
<siretart> :)
<sistpoty> don't look at the debdiff, i apt-get sourced fresh again *g*
<siretart> dh_movefiles: debian/tmp/usr/bin/nvclock_gtk not found (supposed to put it in nvclock-gtk)
<siretart> sh: /tmp/buildd/nvclock-0.7/debian/movelist: No such file or directory
<siretart> hm. doesn't build in my pbuilder :(
<sistpoty> I'll recheck...
<sistpoty> lol: in my pbuilder: E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg received a segmentation fault.
<siretart> whops
<sistpoty> but it's still going
<sistpoty> grr... still didn't get dpatch right
<sistpoty> i'll try again ;)
<Burgundavia> whiprush, pong
<siretart> does anyone here know how network-manager is supposed to work?
<Nafallo> siretart: not entirely, no :-)
<Burgundavia> siretart, pure crack, all the way through
<siretart> Burgundavia: well, I just upgraded to breezy and want to see the crack :)
<Burgundavia> ok
<Burgundavia> add nm-applet to your session
<Burgundavia> then restart
<tseng> Burgundavia: nm-applet actually starts for you?
<Burgundavia> tseng, not currently. I removed network manger, but it did start with the old version
<siretart> nothing happened :(
<Nafallo> tseng: latest-thom works for me, except that nm-applet hangs now and then ;-)
* Burgundavia is currently running through the first time wizard on his new laptop
<Nafallo> first time wizard?
<tseng> Nafallo: someone clobbered thoms
<tseng> do you have the deb?
<Nafallo> tseng: no, sorry. just downgraded from what I had in the archive at the time.
<Burgundavia> Nafallo, when you first turn on an OEM machine
<Nafallo> Burgundavia: hmm, you mean they have that stuff on the latest daily-install now? ;-)
<Burgundavia> indeed
<siretart> did you also had to invoke gst-register-0.8 manually to revive the volume applet?
<siretart> sistpoty: uploaded
<sistpoty> :)
<siretart> sistpoty: btw, you don't need to state 'non maintainer upload'
<sistpoty> siretart: ack
<siretart> sistpoty: in ubuntu, we don't really have the concept of maintainers like in debian. we mostly do what debian calls 'NMU'
<sistpoty> good point
<sistpoty> hm... i just tried to build moagg, which makes no trouble, however it depends to moagg-data (= ${Source-Version})
<sistpoty> should moagg-data be rebuilt for this or the dependency in moagg loosened?
<siretart>  isn't it the same source package?
<sistpoty> nope
<sistpoty> 2 different source packages
<siretart> gnarf
<siretart> ah, I think I understand. the maintainer wanted to avoid circulat builddeps.. hm
<siretart> sistpoty: I'm not sure if its worth the efford of diverging more from debian as really needed
<sistpoty> siretart: so you suggest to upload moagg-data with 0.18-1build2 (would be the new version for moagg)
<sistpoty> ?
<siretart> sistpoty: yes.
<sistpoty> should i put this to revu?
<sistpoty> or do you want to handle this directly ;)
<siretart> if the debdiff is small enough, place the debdiff somewhere else
<sistpoty> ok, i
<sistpoty> + ll do so ;)
<siretart> yay!
<siretart> London Law is in the gnome app tool :)
<sistpoty> cool :)
* siretart wonders who decides what goes in and what not
<sistpoty> just another stupid question: should it be "debdiff old new" or "debdiff new old"
<siretart> ah. thats based on the .desktop file
<siretart> old new
<Mithrandir> siretart: old new
<sistpoty> thanks
<Mithrandir> siretart: anything else gives you a reversed diff. :-)
<siretart> and it's best if you could encode both versions in the filename
<siretart> Mithrandir: I know :)
<sistpoty> i think siretart is the first si-completion ;)
<siretart> hehe
<Burgundavia> siretart, sistpoty one of you must change your nick. They are both the same length with the first 3 letters the same
<sistpoty> hm... i think i should first test moagg... it said something about 2d shooter :)
<sistpoty> hehe
<Burgundavia> s/3/2
<siretart> Burgundavia: that are our logins at university
<Burgundavia> siretart, ah
<Mithrandir> use pwgen to get a new nick. :-P
<siretart> lol
<Mithrandir> I use it for naming hosts, works fine
#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-18
<siretart> remembering could get hard
<Mithrandir> nah, you need to use it as some kind of inspiration
<siretart> and not to mention confusion of gf
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: naming hosts? :-)
* siretart loves this gnome-app-install :)
<Nafallo> siretart++ :-)
<Mithrandir> Nafallo: vawad, aija, aine, thosu, yiwaz are some of the names I've come up with
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: from pwgen?
<Mithrandir> yeah
<Nafallo> lol
<Nafallo> I thought they had deeper meaning ;-)
<niran> siretart, glad to hear it :)
<siretart> niran: this was your job?
<niran> yep
<siretart> niran: YOU ROCK!!
<niran> :) thanks
<siretart> niran: just a small question, I wondered why londonlaw is in the list. the readme tells, that the .desktop file needs to have an entry X-AppInstall-Package
<niran> i add those fields
<siretart> niran: londonlaw doesn't have that in .desktop file, but is selectable
<siretart> ah
<niran> i make a local mirror then run a script to get all the icons and .desktop files, and add the appropriate fields
<siretart> niran: and another remark: I see mplayer in the list, but only the version for athlon, not for pentium. is this intended?
<niran> i saw that and never really thought about it, but i think i recognize the problem now
<niran> multiple packages have the same .desktop filename
<niran> so it's being overwritten
<niran> with the last one being the athlon version
<sistpoty> http://studhome.rrze.uni-erlangen.de/~sistpoty/ubuntu/moagg-data_0.18-1_0.18-1build1.debdiff (moagg doesn't need to be rebuilt at all)
<niran> why is mplayer packaged like that anyway? i don't think there's a good solution to this problem, other than putting different .desktop files for each arch
<siretart> niran: mplayer was imported from marillat
<niran> siretart, ah. i think i'll probably end up having to remove it from the list
<sistpoty> and it's currently broken, at least for me
<siretart> niran: I think that would be the best solution anyway for the moment. we have totem and xine as alternatives
<Tonio> hi everyone
<sistpoty> hi Tonio
<siretart> wah londonlaw isn't installable atm anyway. :(
<siretart> niran: just another suggestion, I find the error message of gnome-app-install quite confusing when it comes to installing packages with unmet deps
<niran> siretart, what does it say?
<siretart> niran: its localized. It tells that changes could not be applied, please fix problems with defective problems for yourself
<siretart> niran: the thing is, that packages with unmet dependencies are always a bug, which needs to be fixed by us
<siretart> and, well. for the case of londonlaw, I'm on my way fixing it. so that message was indeed appropriate for me :)
<sistpoty> hehe
<Nafallo> hehe
<rbelem> hi Nafallo
<Nafallo> hi rbelem :-). how's life? :-)
<rbelem> Nafallo: heeheh it's going nice
<Nafallo> same here :-)
<rbelem> Nafallo: ,-)
<Nafallo> I might have just sold my router :-)
<rbelem> Nafallo: here... i take internet conection from my neighboor a cable with 30 meters hehehehe
<Nafallo> :-P
<Nafallo> adslmodem <-> server/router/firewall <-> switch <-> clients/ap
<Nafallo> :-)
<rbelem> Nafallo: :-)
<rbelem> Nafallo: I have two questions ...
* tseng has modem - cisco firewall - router- switch
<rbelem> Nafallo: the first is about MuSE and its integration with lame
<Nafallo> hmm, what's MuSE?
<rbelem> muse is "Multiple Streaming Engine"
<rbelem> muse.dyne.org
<rbelem> Nafallo: it do not depends lame that is in multiverse
<tseng> anyone seen mez
<rbelem> Nafallo: but for mp3 streaming lame is needed
<rbelem> Nafallo, tseng: internet connection here is very expensive...
<Nafallo> tseng: just popped up on jabber
<Nafallo> I'm not sure about that question
<Nafallo> I believe we can dep on stuff from multiverse
<Nafallo> just as main can dep on restricted
<tseng> hm it can?
<rbelem> cool ;)
<siretart> gn8, folks
<Nafallo> tseng: not sure. not build-dep, but dep?
<tseng> either sounds bad
<Nafallo> hmm
<tseng> but what do I know
<Nafallo> rbelem: no one knows ;-)
<rbelem> heheheeh ;)
<rbelem> Nafallo: i think it's better to build whithout lame support
<Nafallo> rbelem: you could always change it later :-)
* sistpoty is off to bed... gn8 all
<Nafallo> rbelem: or put muse in multiverse?
<rbelem> Nafallo: hum... i'll ask some friends that use muse for streaming, it they really need mp3 support
<Nafallo> rbelem: they can use ogg or something :-)
<rbelem> Nafallo: it's better for their ,-)
<rbelem> Nafallo: and the other question is about upstream version number...
<rbelem> Nafallo: sometimes the upstream version is only -1
<rbelem> Nafallo: and the next release -1.1 and the next is only -2
<Nafallo> yes?
<rbelem> Nafallo: what version can i put... 2.0.0? or just 2.0?
<rbelem> oh... and another version was 1.1-1
<Nafallo> they use - upstream?
<rbelem> yes
<Nafallo> I guess 1.1-1-0ubuntu1 or something, but you should ask tseng or someone :-)
<Nafallo> what I said looks damn crackful :-P
<Mithrandir> - in upstream versions is just fine
<Mithrandir> 1.1-1-0ubuntu1 is fine
<tseng> it looks crackful, but it could be worse
<Mithrandir> it's an upstream version of 1.1-1 and a revision of 0ubuntu1
<rbelem> heheheh
<tseng> such as making up your own version
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: hi mentor! I thought you where asleep ages ago ;-)
<tseng> Nafallo: Mithrandir is immortal.
<Mithrandir> Nafallo: I'm just trying to make up my mind wrt what monitor to buy.
<rbelem> :D
<Mithrandir> tseng: even if I were, I'd still need to sleep. ;-)
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: monitor? wasn't it a case you wanted? ;-)
<Mithrandir> Nafallo: I've decided on that, now I'm onto the LCD.
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: hehe :-)
<tseng> i love the Apple
<tseng> but being pure digital causes a few niggling issues
<Mithrandir> I'm going to get dualhead.
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: you will have to show me the complete spec when you're finished ;-)
<Mithrandir> Nafallo: obviously
* Nafallo misses Oslo :-P
<niran> siretart, that error that you got was from synaptic
<niran> siretart, the actual package installation is done by synaptic
<Burgundavia> tseng, I cannot seem to gdb blam
<tseng> Burgundavia: its a challenge, for sure.
<Burgundavia> tseng, is it possible?
<tseng> possible, yes
<tseng> useful, the jury is out
<tseng> its probably not as bad as muine
<tseng> try
<tseng> exec-file /usr/bin/mono /usr/lib/blam/blam.exe
<tseng> run
<tseng> and go from there
<Burgundavia> says "usage is mono ....." but doesn't accept mono and "Program exited with code 01.
<Burgundavia> "
<tseng> works for me?
<Burgundavia> gah
<tseng> oh until there
<tseng> hth did I do this
<tseng> did you try dumping core
<tseng> and running on that?
<Burgundavia> nope
<Burgundavia> that would be one of those things I have never learned how to do
<tseng> ulimit -c unlimited allows dumping core
<tseng> trigger segfault, core will be dumped in pwd
<tseng> then gdb the corefile
<Burgundavia> ok
<ajmitch_> morning
<tseng> hi andrew
<ajmitch_> I hate waking up to find that DSL was down
<Burgundavia> ajmitch_, morning. I had to fight hard to get inkscape. Glad it built!
<SloMoSnail> good night everybody :) and good morning ajmitch_
<tseng> oh wow you really cleaned my mess in f-spot trunk
<tseng> I suck
<ajmitch_> I've got this bad habit of writing verbose changelogs now
* Mez will be away for the next 3 weeks
<ajmitch_> never used to
<Mez> (aka I just bought World of Warcraft)
<ajmitch_> Mez: holiday?
<ajmitch_> haha
<tseng> oh man
<Mez> :D
<tseng> Mez: whats up with ifolder?
<Mez> tseng ... ?
<tseng> Mez: news?
* Burgundavia is worried that they has a windows install he has to keep...
<Mez> tseng: apparently, we wont be able to build it and distribute it anyways
<tseng> right
<ajmitch_> Mez: reasons?
<tseng> id sort of like to ahve packages, in some form
<tseng> ajmitch_: gpl code linking to non gpl libs
<Mez> libflaim = non-distributable via novells licence
<ajmitch_> ah
<Mez> Burgundavia,  ... ?
<ajmitch_> evil
<Mez> yip
<Mez> someone mailed me bout it IIRC
<tseng> I did
<Burgundavia> Mez, I have one of the laptop testing machines. I currently don't dual boot on my home machine
<Mez> Burgundavia, why do you have windows at all?
<Burgundavia> Mez, canonical wants it for baseline
<ajmitch_> tseng: a pity that I didn't get f-spot ready & a main inclusion report written by freeze
<ajmitch_> Mez: dual-boot & installation testing
<tseng> ajmitch_: hm im not sure its stable enough on all platforms
<tseng> still
<ajmitch_> probably not, looking at the debian bugs
<Mez> tseng: it was you who told me about flaim
<tseng> Mez: yes
<ajmitch_> I haven't come across the crashes that are reported
<tseng> im not a heavy user
<tseng> but ive not crashed it recently
<tseng> hm pbuilder clean wreaks havoc on beagled
<tseng> nice
<ajmitch_> hah, kaffe has that __libc_stack_end issue as well, according to #d-d
<tseng> we fixed that with just a rebuild, iirc
<tseng> no?
<ajmitch_> yeah, they use it in the source
<tseng> oh rock on
<ajmitch_> they can probably get away with a rebuild as well
<tseng> no mail back from jose yet
<ajmitch_> damn, dsl line has been upgraded, but the ISP hasn't caught up
<thierry> where can I add suggestions for some new packagings?
<ajmitch_> UniverseCandidates page on the wiki
<thierry> k thanks
<tseng>  2104 brandon   16   0  708m 352m 3852 S 97.1 69.9  11:19.44 mono
<tseng> GO BEAGLED
<ajmitch_> nice
<ajmitch_> I haven't seen mine go above 150MB for awhile
<tseng> well, dont remove a few thousand files on inotify backend
<ajmitch_> it makes you feel better about deferring for main
<tseng> it will trigger an event on every one
<tseng> it does, i can do more work now
<tseng> deliver a better product
<ajmitch_> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=320867
<ajmitch_> nice, debian bts tracks blocking bugs now
<tseng> hm they file bugs for transitions
<ajmitch_> yes, to keep the packages out of testing until fixed
<ajmitch_> and it's a good way of notifiying package maintainers
<ajmitch_> Burgundavia: ah, good idea to rearrange the laptop testing team page :)
<Burgundavia> ajmitch_, it needed to be done. Glad I get some good feedback on it
<ajmitch_> I think that people were going to just keep adding their name to it
* ajmitch_ added his name the other day, just for completeness :)
<Burgundavia> I dont want to add a big warning about not adding names, as Canonical might do another round for Breezy+1
<Lathiat> siretart: nope but am now
<whiprush> hey everyone!
<tseng> hi
<Burgundavia> whiprush, salut, you wanted me?
<whiprush> ?
<whiprush> ah, yes.
<whiprush> I was wondering how you felt about putting something in the breezy forum, something like "Instead of writing a 45 minute diatribe on what you think needs to be fixed, please file it in bugzilla instead."
<Burgundavia> sure
<Burgundavia> and point to ideapool as well
<whiprush> I get the feeling people think that devs read that forum.
<Burgundavia> yes
<Burgundavia> I am trying to dispel that, but it doesn't work
<whiprush> sometimes people post like 3 page things
<whiprush> I want to be a smartass and say "Who are you talking to?"
<whiprush> heh
<Burgundavia> that just makes us look bad
<whiprush> I just end up closing the tab.
<whiprush> also, a link to the schedule and goals page wouldn't be bad.
<Burgundavia> we need to cleanup the idea pool before we do that
<whiprush> might curb those "how is featureX coming along?"
<Burgundavia> also to UniverseNewWhatever
<Burgundavia> goals is often wrong though
<whiprush> it's general enough to answer some of those questions.
* Burgundavia trying to resist the urge to boot into windows on the new laptop and play games
<Lathiat> haha
<thierry> Burgundavia : play ut2004 on linux with an nvidia card...
<jsgotangco> whiprush: THE FRIDGE
<jsgotangco> :)
<whiprush> jsgotangco: things are falling into place.
<whiprush> Got a server, etc. etc.
<whiprush> [ WIP ] 
<Burgundavia> thierry, nah, I am a Civ 3 kinda guy
<tseng> civ 2 >> civ 3
<jsgotangco> Westnoth owned me last night
<Burgundavia> whiprush, as soon as you have a fridge, I have stuff to put in it
<whiprush> Burgundavia: yes, I need to round up newshounds like yourself.
<whiprush> So we can have a nice consistant flow of news.
<Burgundavia> whiprush, how did you know I was a newshound?
<whiprush> Burgundavia: I see you post everywhere.
<Burgundavia> whiprush, that isn't true. There are some mailing lists I don't follow
<whiprush> what timezone are you in?
<rbelem> bye... thanks... good night ;-)
<Burgundavia> whiprush, -7, Canada, West Coast
<whiprush> k
<ajmitch_> hey whiprush
<whiprush> hey aj
<jsgotangco> bye dentist time
<Lathiat> siretart: so... if it says xlibmesa-gl-dev, they dont need to be changed?
<thierry> anyone could check ubuntu bug 13416 ?
<thierry> I've just opened it with a patch and this touch pbuilder (in touch with the MOTU team)
<Lathiat> siretart: among other things libgl1-xorg-dev and xlibmesa-gl-dev conflict which i sa bit ugly if you wanted to have build-deps for both installed at the same time
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: isn't libgl1-xorg-dev deprecated now for breezy?
<jabra> hey guys
<ajmitch_>  hi jabra
<jabra> working on updating my wireless tool before I get it packaged for ubuntu
<jabra> the wireless tool I am working on is getwifi
<Lathiat> nah
<Lathiat> we talked to daniels/infinity yesterday
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: right, and I thought it went to libgl1-mesa-dev now?
* ajmitch_ could be quite wrong, of course
<Lathiat> nah thats glu
<Lathiat> libglu1-mesa-dev, libgl1-xorg-dev
<ajmitch_> crackful
<Lathiat> yeh
<Lathiat> apparently its all going to change again
<Lathiat> but we're supposed to do this one step at a time in case we dont get there
<Lathiat> or something
<ajmitch_> ah right, I remember infinity saying that it would all change
<ajmitch_> lots of fun for us
<Lathiat> yeh
<Lathiat> but now im confused
<ajmitch_> heh
<Lathiat> cus siretarts saying not to change the xlibmesa-gl-dev ones
<Lathiat> and im not sure thats right
<Lathiat> while they still build
<ajmitch_> look over the logs
<thierry> ok, just installed pbuilder and I'd like to get on an easy job : first time with packaging and all that stuff, could anyone point me something?
* Mez may just install w9x
<thierry> mez : what is that?
<Mez> thierry, Windowz 98
<bmonty> ajmitch_: question...do you think it makes any sense at all to have apt-spy in the gnome menu?
<thierry> Mez : and why would I want the ugly windowz 98 when I got this beautifull ubuntu!
<Mez> thierry, because cedega doesnt like me
<thierry> Mez : ho but I don't like cedega ;) no seriously I don't have w9x so any other idea?
<ajmitch_> bmonty: not really
<Mez> thierry, wha?
<Mez> I was on about me installing it not you
<bmonty> ajmitch_: so it would be correct for the desktop file to just say "hidden=true" woudn't you think
<bmonty> also the program is kinda useless without a list of ubuntu mirrors to go with it, and ubuntu doesn't supply the list in the format that apt-spy wants :(
<thierry> Mez : sorry
<ajmitch_> bmonty: yeah
<bur[n] er> anyone know if there's an ubuntu backports irc channel?
* bur[n] er is hoping for rhythmbox .9 :)
<thierry> I'll try fixing the dependencies for ace
<bmonty> is there a syntax for changelogs to close bugs in malone?
<ajmitch_> bmonty: nope, no auto closing yet
<dandelion> hello
<siretart> morning
<ajmitch_> hi siretart
<siretart> Lathiat: ajmitch_: ah, the gl/glu transition. The thing is, there are many packages which build as they are. I don't think we should touch them, because the cause unnecessary merging work later
<ajmitch_> siretart: agreed, merge work is tedious & a waste of time if it wasn't necessary
<Lathiat> siretart: wrong
<Lathiat> siretart: xlibmeas-gl-dev is no longer in the archives
<Lathiat> siretart: infinity said its wrong
<Lathiat> siretart: my understanding is that it wont build in the buildd
<siretart> thats right
<siretart> those really need to be rebuilt
<Lathiat> so it needs changing
<Lathiat> from xlibmesa-gl-dev
<Lathiat> because that no longer exists
<ajmitch_> the buildd doesn't handle only virtual build-deps, iirc
<siretart> right
<Lathiat> and having a pure virtual package upsets them
<siretart> lets take an example package: alsaplayer
<siretart> it has builddeps "xlibmesa-gl-dev | libgl-dev"
<siretart> yesterday, it could be built in by amd64/pbuilder, because there is a package in the archive which provides libgl-dev
<ajmitch_> siretart: pbuilder != buildd
<ajmitch_> that's the issue we have
<siretart> hm, right
<siretart> so you think we should touch them even when there is a binary package in the archive?
<ajmitch_> if the binary is there, it might be good to leave them until after the next round of changes
<siretart> ok. exactly that was what I ment with 'Packages which are ok
<siretart> will improve the headline, then
<siretart> this more clear/better?
<SloMo_> good morning
<ajmitch_> hi SloMo_
<siretart> hi SloMo_
<Lathiat> siretart: so we want to leave xlibmesa-gl-dev for now?
<herve> hello
<siretart> Lathiat: I'd suggest that we concentrate on broken packages. We can 'fix' the remaining packages later, when we have time
<siretart> left
<Lathiat> generating a good list now
<siretart> ok
<siretart> say, does anyone noticed something weird with sdl?
<siretart> I get a error SDL.h not found, but it is in /usr/lib/SDL/SDL.h
<siretart> Include path seem to be sane, too
* siretart confused again :/
<Lathiat> none of them are unintsallable due to gl deps
<Lathiat> might be some without a new built version tho
<Lathiat> and a handful that have other unmet deps
<Lathiat> http://bur.st/~lathiat/glutrans
<Lathiat> anything not on that list installs
<siretart> ok. so we should concentrate on the packages in the list below
<Lathiat> right
<Lathiat> ill work from the bottom
<Lathiat> its really just unmet dep stuff
<Lathiat> in general
<Lathiat> so after these i'll go tearing through whatever else i can find, i'll start with libgmp3 as there seems to be alot of those
<siretart> libgmp3 has been renamed to libgmp3c2
<siretart> because of cxx transition
<Lathiat> yeh which is just a rebuild
<Lathiat> so this package has a build1 for c++ abi, if i rebuild without any changes for fltk should i do build2 /
<siretart> the problem is with ghc6, that it needs to be bootstrapped, which is rather difficult, because ghc6 is not installable anymore :/
<Lathiat> yeh
<siretart> and ghc6 needs gcc-4.0 love :/
<Lathiat> ah
<Lathiat> fark
<siretart> which reminds me, is ghc6.1 already released?
<Lathiat> fedora might have patches?
<siretart> no, they compile with gcc-3.4
<siretart> debian waits for new upstream release
<Lathiat> oh i thought they went to gcc4
<siretart> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=319222
<Lathiat> siretart: fc4 uses gcc4
<siretart> Lathiat: huh? interesting. how did they manage that?
<Lathiat> whats difficult about it?
<siretart> there are build failures
<Lathiat> oh you mean in this specific case
<Lathiat> they might have patched it
<Lathiat> i dont know
<Lathiat> maybe they dont have ghc
<siretart> http://haskell.org/fedora/haskell/4/x86_64/repodata/repoview/ghc-0-6.4.1.20050626-0.html
<siretart> Lathiat: where do you read fedora uses gcc4 for ghc6? this pages rather tells they are using gcc3.2!
<siretart> *cough*
<Lathiat> i didnt say they were using it for ghc6
<Lathiat> i meant in general
<siretart> in general, yes
<Lathiat> hence i said they *might* have patches. :)
<Lathiat> i guess they dont :)
<siretart> :)
<Lathiat> damn
<Lathiat> scorched3d is a 25M source package
<siretart> I hope not native
<siretart> but thats a great game, we definitly should have it :)
<Lathiat> dunno
<Lathiat> find out soon
<Lathiat> when it gets past downloading this 24.3M tar :)
<Lathiat> damn and poker3d is 27.1M
<Lathiat> ffs how much can you put into a poker game
<Lathiat> wtf
<Lathiat> when i debuild -S poker3d
<Lathiat> it runs configure
<Lathiat> and bails out because it cant find glEnable in -lGL
<siretart> I running in even more interesting problems with sdl!
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> maybe nvidia-glx is interfering
<Lathiat> yeh
<Lathiat> that was it
<Lathiat> usually not a problem cus packages usually dont run configure outside of pbuilder, grr. :)
<pef> morning
<Lathiat> siretart: 10 bucks my debdiff has crap all over it nwo :)
<Lathiat> oh yeh
<Lathiat> 24720 line debdiff
<Lathiat> and i dont think i can do anything about it :\
<Lathiat> bah and it fails to build
<Lathiat> +  * Rebuild for new underware.
* Lathiat laughs
<Lathiat> ooh
<Lathiat> it worked that time
<Lathiat> siretart: hrm, lesstif needs tending to, blocks grass
<Lathiat> lesstif2, specifically
<Lathiat> siretart: hrm.. the apt-geet source of lesstif got be ubuntu1, lamont buildlogs show up to ubuntu3 sucesffully built, is that being held back by something?
<Lathiat> siretart: (apparently ubuntu1 fixed the problem im lookign at)
<Lathiat> siretart: blah, ignore that
<Lathiat> siretart: ok i knocked that whole list off. :)
<pef> can someone help me for debugging a shell script ? (debian/rules)
<Lathiat> pef: maybe, whats the problem
<Lathiat> tho isnt debian/rules a makefile
<pef> I try to write a get-orig-source target, but I have problem with $(shell )
<pef> http://pastebin.com/335905
<pef> don't know how to use UPVERSION, I always have an error
<pef> ./debian/rules:9: *** unterminated call to function `shell': missing `)'.  Stop.
<SloMo_> pef: what are you trying to do with the version? ;)
<SloMo_> pef: look here for an example... http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/incoming/dirac-0508111825/dirac-0.5.2/debian/rules
<pef> SloMo_: gettting the current version in order to download the upstream tarball
<SloMo_> pef: why do you want to download it in your rules?
<ajmitch_> pef: your sed expression looks to be missing a ) ?
<pef> SloMo_: to use get-orig-source target to download the tarball, and delete junk inside (debian/files, if you remember ;)
<pef> ajmitch_: using shell to test it it works :/
<Lathiat> interesting approach
<ajmitch_> pef: there's a ( before \(, but no other
<Lathiat> why not whack the tarball in it?
<SloMo_> pef: why don't you just change the tarball and upload the changed one? someone said it would be ok in this case
<Lathiat> and yeh there is a ) missing
<SloMo_> pef: and when you need the upstream version use this: $(shell dpkg-parsechangelog | egrep '^Version:' | cut -f 2 -d ' ' | cut -f.1 debian/-d '-')
<pef> SloMo_: but someone else advice me to delete the lintian error :)
<SloMo_> pef: the lintian error will be away after you changed the tarball... and this seems the cleaner solution for me
<Lathiat> hrm
<Lathiat> can i get pbuilder to install some alternate .debs
<Lathiat> (ive go ta new version of 1 deb thats needed to build something else)
<Lathiat> siretart: http://bur.st/~lathiat/ubuntu/gnomemm.diff can you push that, its needed to fix glademm and a bunch of other stuff
<SloMo_> Lathiat: 404
* ajmitch_ tries the long vegastrike rebuild with gcc 3.4
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: ermm
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: i have a vegastrike here buitl with gcc4
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: does it miscompile it or something?
<ajmitch_> no, it ftbfs when I tried it a couple of days ago
<Lathiat> well it worked for me last night
<ajmitch_> odd
<Lathiat> (afte rmodifying the GL/GLU deps)
<ajmitch_> right, I might have tried it more than a week ago, and it broke then..
<SloMo_> is hub@figuiere.net here?
<ajmitch_> but I see the current sid version has a gcc4 patch
<Lathiat> http://bur.st/~lathiat/ubuntu/vegastrike.debdiff is all i had
<Lathiat> SloMo_: reget
<SloMo_> Lathiat: looks ok for me... i would upload it when i finally had upload rights ;)
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> its a rebuild, if it was broken before it wasnt my fault. :)
<SloMo_> Lathiat: it doesn't build?
<Lathiat> SloMo_: no, it just has an old dep on gtkmm before cxx-transition
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: so vegastrike 0.4.3-1ubuntu1 was compiling for you once you changed build deps?
<ajmitch_> hmm, I see that version had gcc 3.4 in the build deps anyway
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: yes
<ajmitch_> so it didn't build with 4.0
<Lathiat> oh well, i didnt touch it
<ajmitch_> I was looking at 0.4.3-2 :)
<Lathiat> oh ok
<Lathiat> indeed it did
<ajmitch_> -2 has "* Rebuild for CXX transition (also, removed explicit dep on g++-3.4)"
<ajmitch_> with a gcc4 patch
<Lathiat> cool
<ajmitch_> so if it builds, I'll integrate your patch & upload
<Lathiat> ok
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: any chance of looking at that gnomemm?
<Lathiat> its just a rebuild to get the new gtkmm
<ajmitch_> ok, will grab & look
<ajmitch_> 404
<Lathiat> err
<Lathiat> http://bur.st/~lathiat/ubuntu/gnomemm.diff
<Lathiat> so it is
<Lathiat> hangon
<Lathiat> oh
<Lathiat> http://bur.st/~lathiat/ubuntu/gnomemm.debdiff
<ajmitch_> grabbing build deps, building now
<SloMo_> automated control managment (by cdbs) is forbidden for new package, right?
<ajmitch_> not forbidden, but some frown upon it :)
<Treenaks> s/some/most people/
<SloMo_> ok... then i'll add a advice to remove it to the revu uploads which use it ;)
<Yagisan> G'day
<Yagisan> I've been maintaining some unofficial packages for hoary, and my users have requested I make the packages official.
<Yagisan> However, due to license issues, the are only suitable for multiverse
<SloMo_> Yagisan: what packages are this?
<Yagisan> http://eyagi.bpa.nu/~jamie/doomsday.html
<Yagisan> Non-Commerical use clause
<Yagisan> Could someone give them a once over and suggest what I need to fix
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: uploading gnomemm
<SloMo_> Yagisan: can you give me a direct link to the source package?
<Yagisan> SloMo_ just a sec
<Amaranth> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/s/smeg/ <--yay!
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: well, uploading in between watching the all blacks beat the wallabies :)
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: err
<Lathiat> it just told me that already exists
<Lathiat> blah
<ajmitch_> uh?
<Lathiat> maybe somethign failed to build
<Lathiat> that i didnt see
* Lathiat looks
<ajmitch_> unless someone uploaded before that, since I ran apt-cache policy before uploading
<ajmitch_> to make sure it was universe
<Lathiat> nothign in buildlogs
<Yagisan> SloMo_ : Engine Package:
<Yagisan> http://eyagi.bpa.nu/~jamie/ubuntu/dists/hoary/multiverse/source/games/deng_1.8.9+1.9.0beta2-5.dsc
<Yagisan> http://eyagi.bpa.nu/~jamie/ubuntu/dists/hoary/multiverse/source/games/deng_1.8.9+1.9.0beta2-5.diff.gz
<Yagisan> http://eyagi.bpa.nu/~jamie/ubuntu/dists/hoary/multiverse/source/games/deng_1.8.9+1.9.0beta2.orig.tar.gz
<Yagisan> Debian Helper Package
<Yagisan> http://eyagi.bpa.nu/~jamie/ubuntu/dists/hoary/universe/source/games/deng-debian_1.0-7.dsc
<Lathiat> Rejected: libgnomemm2.0_2.0.1-2ubuntu4_source.changes: a file with this name
<Yagisan> http://eyagi.bpa.nu/~jamie/ubuntu/dists/hoary/universe/source/games/deng-debian_1.0-7.tar.gz
<Lathiat> +already exists in the Done directory.
<Lathiat> maybe siretart uploaded it without saying anything in the channel?
<ajmitch_> perhaps
<ajmitch_> check the gpg sig on the changes list
<Yagisan> SloMo_ That's on my ADSL line, so it may be a bit slow
<SloMo_> Yagisan: thanks... i'll have a look at it... can you ask siretart for a revu account and upload it there?
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: where do i get them from?
<ajmitch_> umm.. gmane has archives, if you're not subscribed
<ajmitch_> shoudl be ubuntu archives as well
<Amaranth> hey, anyone wanna help me test a new thing for smeg?
<Amaranth> drag-and-drop of .desktop files from nautilus to smeg
<Amaranth> need someone to try to break it :)
<Amaranth> ook, it's not in gnome anoncvs yet i don't think, never mind
<Lathiat> my archivves only show ubuntu3
<ajmitch_> so it was uploaded recently
<Yagisan> SloMo_ OK. I'll follow the instruction in the wiki (You would want just the core packages right, There are a lot of packages on my repo)
<SloMo_> Yagisan: core packages? but for deng... can't you just integrate deng-debian into the deng package? seems to be nothing which justifies a new package ;)
<Lathiat> err
<Lathiat> right
<Lathiat> adam conrad just uploaded it
<Lathiat> as we did
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: infinity uploaded it
<ajmitch_> yeah :)
<pef> SloMo_: thanks for the dpkg-parsechangelog tip :)
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: can do glademm then ;p
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: ok, I'll be asleep, so someone else can upload :)
<Yagisan> SloMo_ Deliberately separated out to ease maintenance of  jpacks. It wasn't part of upstream.
<SloMo_> Yagisan: well i would add it to the deng package... just copy the stuff in the debian/ directory and copy them where they belong in install
<Yagisan> SloMo_ That would require a new compile and upload each time upstream releases a new data file
<SloMo_> Yagisan: also don't change anything other than stuff in the debian directory with your diff.gz... when you need to change something add a patch and apply it at build-time with dpatch for example
<Yagisan> SloMo_ I'm not familiar with dpatch, I've made a one line edit to a text document to make deng-debian work but that should be it
<SloMo_> Yagisan: but isn't deng-debian just a really small package which copies some small files somewhere? or may this files change while the deng package don't change?
<SloMo_> Yagisan: yeah but better use dpatch for such stuff... http://tseng.ath.cx/log/?p=7
<pef> SloMo_: new upload of kvpnc, if you are still interested :)
<SloMo_> Yagisan: other than that the package looks ok (but i haven't looked that hard... will do that later, maybe it's already in revu then ;) )
<Yagisan> SloMo_: The data files may change, but deng does not care if they do. deng-debian copies 4 files, and sets up controls that disable data packs where they are known to cause conflicts. Thank you for the link.
<Yagisan> SloMo_ Well it's known not to work on amd64
<SloMo_> Yagisan: ok, i'll think about deng-debian later *makes a note* :)
<SloMo_> pef: woah... what a hack =) add wget to build-depends
<pef> ohh right
<SloMo_> pef: but well... i wouldn't do this hack... just remove the dirty files directly from the upstream tarball as you had to repackage it anyways
<Yagisan> SloMo_ Please do take a look at deng-debian (deng has a habit of dumping savegames in the current working directory without it)
<SloMo_> Yagisan: you mean the shell script?
<Yagisan> SloMo_ Yeah, deng-debian also provides a "doghouse" for deng.
<pef> SloMo_: but siretart advice me to do like this, and this method is conform to debian policy I think
<Yagisan> SloMo_ I'm sure you can guess what platform deng was written for
<SloMo_> pef: fine... then it's ok for me :)
<SloMo_> Yagisan: ok... but i don't understand why you can't supply the stuff in deng-debian with the deng-package... it doesn't look like something version dependend... just an image, a wrapper script and the 3 ded files... i would advice to copy them over to the debian directory of the deng package and install them there... sorry when i'm suggesting something stupid here ;)
<Yagisan> SloMo_ What you suggest doesn't sound stupid, I assume you looked at my website and seen that long list of files
<SloMo_> Yagisan: which long list of files?
<SloMo_> Yagisan: deng-iwad-doomu-installer and the other installers?
<Yagisan> SloMo_: the resource packs. They tend to change somewhat often. By separating there dependencies to deng-debian I could keep the engine, and change resource packs at will.
<SloMo_> pef: your new kvpnc doesn't build in pbuilder
<Yagisan> SloMo_: I don't think my solution was the most elegant, but it does work well.
<SloMo_> Yagisan: you mean the recommends line in deng-debian?
<Yagisan> SloMo_: I'll do up a test package with dpatch and merge deng-debian in as a tester a bit later
<Yagisan> Slo_Mo_: yep, thats it
<pef> SloMo_: ok, will check
<Yagisan> SloMo_: Do you have any of the doom wads ?
<SloMo_> Yagisan: ok, now i finally understand your problem ;) but i would add all of it to the deng package... and when something changes with the deps just upload a new version... as the tarball stayed the same you just have to upload the diff.gz and dsc file so that would be no problem
<SloMo_> Yagisan: nope... can i get one for free somewhere? ah and btw... when it doesn't work on amd64 say this in the control file (i.e. change Architecture from any to something else)... btw i'll test it on ppc later
<Yagisan> SloMo_: OK. Click on the email link re wad file. The control file I know (I have the amd64 that broke deng :). Thanks for the ppc test. You'll need a wad installer file too.
<siretart> re
<siretart> oh, so many hilights...
<SloMo_> Yagisan: just send me a notice when you merged deng and deng-debian and uploaded it to revu :) what email link?
<siretart> Yagisan: are you Jamie Jones?
<Yagisan> siretart: Yes
<siretart> Yagisan: I added you to the keyring, you may proceed with uploading now
<SloMo_> Yagisan: and the LICENCE file of deng says it's just GPL-2... what files are under another licence?
<Yagisan> siretart: Thank you.
<siretart> no matter
<SloMo_> Yagisan: s/licence/license/g ;)
<Yagisan> SloMo_: I'm in the process of documenting those: Some are Raven Hexen
<Yagisan> SloMo_: email is at bottom of my website
<SloMo_> Yagisan: ok, fine :) well just send me the note when the merged and correctd version is in revu ;) i'll take a closer look then... btw, are there any other packages related to deng we can distribute (i.e. they have a nice license ;) )?
<Yagisan> SloMo_: Most of it fits in multiverse because of non-commercial clauses
<Yagisan> SloMo_: Some ebay scammers were selling deng and the resource packs
<SloMo_> Yagisan: ok, then upload the other packages after we got deng into multiverse :)
<Yagisan> SloMo_: now the resource pack authors forbid commercial use
<Yagisan> SloMo_: OK - 1st Merge deng and deng-debian. 2nd upload merged file.
<SloMo_> :)
<Yagisan> SloMo_: Upload my wad installers too ?
<thierry> I'm trying to fix the missing dependencies of ace
<thierry> first time with packagagin, so I built it with pbuilder and then what?
<SloMo_> Yagisan: sure... but i would wait until deng got approved :)
<Yagisan> SloMo_: sure, but you can't play it without them (menu entries, puts the wad in the right place)
<thierry> anyone could show me the way to get this working?
<SloMo_> Yagisan: hmm... well upload everything you want ;) but as it needs deng it can't get approved before deng anyways
<siretart> do we only have 2 autoconf version in breezy?
<SloMo_> siretart: yes... 2.13 and 2.54 or something similar... you shouldn't need any other version
<siretart> CFLAGS="-I $x_includes"
<siretart> how does autoconf / configure learn about that $x_includes?
<Yagisan> SloMo_: I'll upload once I test some successful migrations in hoary i386.
<SloMo_> siretart: see query ;)
<thierry> could anyone show me how to verify unmet dependencies and fix it?
<siretart> not quite
<thierry> I've build ace with pbuild and now I don't know how to be sure it's all right
<SloMo_> thierry: try to install it and try whether it works ;)
<SloMo_> btw... you fixed ace?! good work :) if i remember correctly this was a rather difficult package
<thierry> ok but I have like 20 packages in the directory... and none named just ace... I have libace, mpc-ace
<thierry> SloMo_ : didn't fix it, just build it... it worked... strange
<SloMo_> thierry: that's really strange... it failed for me in the past (and the package names are ok afaik...)
<thierry> mmmm I think I'll work on an easier package
<thierry> by the way I did opened a bug to fix a little something in pbuilder package : ubuntu bug 13416
<thierry> if you could check it...
<thierry> and could you suggest an easy first package to work on?
<SloMo_> thierry: from the unmet deps wikipage?
<thierry> well if there's some easier stuff somewhere else I'd prefer it
<thierry> SloMo_ : I just want to get started with one to know the entire procedure, then I could get on harder bugs
<SloMo_> thierry_eating: hmm, maybe gnunet
<thierry_eating> SloMo_ : ok I'll check that after breakfast, I come back in 15 minutes
<pef> SloMo_: gnunet is a daemon, isn't it ?
<SloMo_> pef: iirc yes
<thierry> SloMo_ : ok I'm back
<thierry> I'll try gnunet
<tseng> hi
<SloMo_> hi tseng
<siretart> Lathiat: I just uploaded asterisk-oh323 and isakmpd for you
<Lathiat> ah cool thanks
* Lathiat takes them off his list
<Lathiat> siretart: t38modem is simple
<Lathiat> just a rebuild
<Lathiat> http://bur.st/~lathiat/rebuilds
<thierry> Lathiat : when there's only a rebuild needed, what do you do after the build? where do you send the package?
* siretart is on your kmatplot
<Lathiat> siretart: okie
<siretart> perhaps I should write a small script to automate.
<Lathiat> rebuilds of things?
<Lathiat> yeh i was thinking about that
<Lathiat> need to make it bump the version correctly
<thierry> is there a motu mailing list?
<siretart> thierry: no, we use ubuntu-devel
<siretart> thierry: wen we make enough traffic, we get our own list ;)
<Lathiat> wtf
<Lathiat> libextractor1-dev wont install on my pbuilder but does locall
<Lathiat> y
<siretart> pbuilder update
<Lathiat> i did
* Lathiat tries again
<siretart> Lathiat: I tried to build kmatplot, but I get this one in pbuilder:
<Lathiat> ah because it wants a package that no longer exists but i still have installed manually
<siretart> ../interface/libkmatplot_interface.a: could not read symbols: Bad value
<siretart> collect2: ld returned 1 exit status
<Lathiat> err
<Lathiat> weird
<siretart> jo
<Lathiat> amd64/ppc ?
<siretart> amd64/pbuilder
<Lathiat> might make a difference im x86
* Lathiat tries with that debdiff 
<siretart> /usr/bin/ld: ../interface/libkmatplot_interface.a(common.o): relocation R_X86_64_32 against `a local symbol' can not be used when making a shared object; recompile with -fPIC
<Lathiat> oh
<Lathiat> i saw pitti talking about that
<Lathiat> yesterday
<Lathiat> in somethign else
<Lathiat> and
<Lathiat>  using -fPIC worked
<siretart> Lathiat: that I forgot. Libraries have to be compiled with -fPIC
<siretart> it's just x86, which dont cares
<SloMo_> iirc ppc too
<Lathiat> siretart: you going to fix or?
<siretart> ok. I try
<Lathiat> i cant really test it
<siretart> sure thing
<siretart> I have to leave, soon :/
<Lathiat> ah ok
<Lathiat> mm i have like 2G of sources in my devel dir now
<SloMo_> Lathiat: i'm at 3,9 gb ;)
<Lathiat> heh
<thierry> while building gnunet I get this : dpkg-shlibdeps: warning: could not find path for libgnunetutil.so.0 does this means that libgnuneutil is missing as dependencie?
<thierry> And if it is, how do add it in the dependencies?
<Lathiat> erm
<Lathiat> sound slike its own build is messed up
<thierry> then what should I do?
<Lathiat> not sure
<thierry> I also get this very frequently : dpkg-gencontrol: warning: no utmp entry available and LOGNAME not defined; using uid of process (0)
<Lathiat> yeh i dont think that matters i get it all the time too
<thierry> k
<thierry> and how do you know the build failed or not?
<Lathiat> after upload or when testing?
<thierry> well after the build
<Lathiat> you mean once its been uploaded, see if it fails then?
<thierry> All I know right now is how to build a package (from the pbuilder howto) that's all
<siretart> Lathiat: lesstif1 uploaded
<Lathiat> you'll see an error ont he end
<Lathiat> siretart: thanks
<Lathiat> siretart: thatl unbreak a few things
<thierry> Lathiat : so if there's none the package is ok?
<siretart> Lathiat: check the buildlogs. I hope so, too
<Lathiat> i cant remember what it was breaking now
<Lathiat> i should write these things down
<siretart> tomboy is ideal for this kind of notes ;)
<Lathiat> indeed
<Lathiat> thierry: im not sure that warning is fatal
<Lathiat> thierry: in fact it quite possibly doesnt matter, but im not 100% sure on that
<Lathiat> (only because its referring to itself)
<siretart> wah. scorched3d ftbfs on amd64 :(
<Lathiat> hrm
<Lathiat> sigh
<thierry> Lathiat : so if I try to install the package and that it works, it would be ok?
<siretart> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=288578
<Lathiat> wonder why libdps1 disappeared
<Lathiat> need to rebuild kismet for that as well, bleh
<Lathiat> stupid libraries disappearing. :P)
<Lathiat> siretart: hrm
<Lathiat> siretart: sounds like we need to wait?
<siretart> *sigh*. I think yes :(
<Lathiat> bah
<siretart> this is very very sad :(
<Lathiat> wtf is with these packages that change config.guess
<thierry> where do I add new dependencies???
<siretart> thierry: add them to debian/control
<thierry> k
<siretart> Lathiat: kmaptplot is btw http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=286533
<Lathiat> man so much to keep track of :)
<Lathiat> i need to write some kind of tool that you give a package and it goes off and checks for bugs, recent builds, failed builds, etc. :)
<Lathiat> hrm, that might not be such a bad idea
<siretart> Lathiat: sounds great :)
<Lathiat> i think its feasible
<Lathiat> can search debian bugs by source package easily
<Lathiat> ubuntu bugs might be a little harder
<Lathiat> checking in to-merge and buildLogs shouldnt be too hard
<siretart> it's harder to filter the data to get usable information
<siretart> in the case of kplot, I think that would be a good target for a debian bsp or nmu
<Lathiat> bsp?
<Lathiat> wah yeh that bug is old
<siretart> bsp = debian bug squashing party
<Lathiat> ah
<Lathiat> that
<Lathiat> ive updated my rebuild sfile when you want to continue looking
<thierry> once I have changed the dependencies and did "dpkg-buildpackage -uc -us -S" to get a new .dsc , I rebuild the whole thing?
<Lathiat> thierry: yep
<Lathiat> thierry: what did you change?
<thierry> Lathiat : added three packages (2 new and one with an higher version) in dependencies
<thierry> if this works after that? what do I do? do I create a patch? where do I send it?
<pef> siretart: hi
<pef> SloMo_: new version uploaded :)
<pef> siretart: I've used get-orig-source like you advice me yesterday, and all it works well, no longer lintian error http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=354
<siretart> pef: cool! :)
<pef> I hope my target isn't too dirty :[
<siretart> no, I think its ok
<siretart> what are these debian/stamp-* files?
<pef> ouch
<pef> upstream tarball too, will delete them using get-orig-source
<siretart> pef: if you are preparing a new upload, better rm -rf kvpnc-$(UPSTREAM)/debian
<thierry> mmm I added the missing dependencies and I still get error for 2 of them...
<siretart> pef: that way, all debian stuff gets completely in the diff.gz, which is generally easier to review
<pef> and a smaller diff, you're right
<siretart> ok. I'm off for gf for today
<siretart> I'll be back tomorrow afternoon. cu folks!
<pef> bye !
<thierry> bye
<thierry> Lathiat : I have a problem, when I build and try to install gnunet it says that libgmp3 and libtdb1 are needed and not installed but I just added them in dependencies!! do they have an other name?
<Lathiat> hold a se
<Lathiat> c
<Lathiat> thierry: they have dependencies
<Lathiat> thierry: install pbuilder
<Lathiat> and run sudo /usr/lib/pbuilder-satisfydeps
<Lathiat> in the package dir
<Lathiat> and it will install them all for you
<thierry> pbuilder is installed and I get this : thierry@modemcable050:/var/cache/pbuilder/result$ sudo /usr/lib/pbuilder-satisfydeps
<thierry> sudo: /usr/lib/pbuilder-satisfydeps: command not found
<Lathiat>  err
<Lathiat>  /usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydeps
<Lathiat> also
<Lathiat> thats not where you want to do it
<Lathiat> you want to do it in the source dir
<thierry> ok so not on the package but on his source
<Lathiat> yes
<Lathiat> you shouldn't need ot add manual depends: for libraries etc
<Lathiat> they shoudl be handled by shlibs if you have the right build-dep
<Lathiat> and that command will install all the build-deps for you
<thierry> sudo: /usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydeps: command not found
<Lathiat> blah
<Lathiat>  /usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydepends
<thierry> Lathiat you mean the dependencies will add themselv automatically with this?
<thierry> ok it says that the two package have unsatisfied dependencies... so I should try to fix the dependencies of those two before?
<Lathiat> paste the output in private message
<thierry> ok but it's in french...
<Lathiat> err
<Lathiat> can you put it in english? :P
<Lathiat> LANG=en_AU /usr/lib/pb... :P
<thierry> could you open the private message window (send me a message) I'm not familiar with x-chat
<pef> thierry: /query Lathiat
<thierry> k
<pef> bye
<Yagisan> Does a new package (that has been in a 3rd party repo for some time, with several updates) and is not in debian require -ubuntu in it's version number ?
<thierry> gnome-chemistry-utils package works without any problems, build is allright... what do I do now? (it's in the unmet dependencies page)
<thierry> Yagisan : don't know... I would say like https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUWannabeTips?highlight=%28motu%29 : -0ubuntu1
<slomo> hm, who is anthony.mercatante@laposte.net?
<tseng> rock on, breezy kernel is "freezing" my desktop
<tseng> music will start playing like a broken record, cursor  moves but clicking anything is useless
<mbreit> hi all
<SloMoSnail> hi mbreit
<thierry> hi, I've been building gnome-chemistry-utils
<thierry> without any problem and it is in the missing dependencies thing...
<seth_k> SloMoSnail, is it okay for config.guess and config.sub to be modified in the original tarball? I moved everything else out to cdbs patches, but the compile is changing those two files itself
<seth_k> and if not, how do I fix it ;)
<shawarma> Hi...If I wanted to start working on ubuntu (bugfixing, packaging etc.)I think it'd make good sense to upgrade to Breezy, right? How close it is to functional? If it mostly works, that's excellent. That's what makes me the most productive.. Is X working for instance?
<mbreit> shawarma: it mostly works ;)
<SloMoSnail> seth_k: why are these in the tarball and not in the diff?
<shawarma> mbreit: Sounds excellent.
<mbreit> shawarma: and using breezy makes really sense (but you can do it in a chroot as well if you want)
<seth_k> SloMoSnail, they aren't in the tarball. They're being created by the configure, and thus show up in the diff
<seth_k> that's okay?
<mbreit> shawarma: but in some cases, you will have to fix some issues per hand...
<shawarma> mbreit: As I said: I'm SO much more productive when I need the bugfixes myself during my daily work.
<mbreit> shawarma: then upgrade to breezy ;)
<SloMoSnail> seth_k: hmm, i don't like them there... but well, shouldn't hurt too much ;)
<shawarma> mbreit: An apt-get dist-upgrade should mostly do it?
<mbreit> shawarma: it should _mostly_ do it, but it will delete some packages because of dependency problems
<mbreit> but you will be able to reinstall them after dist-upgrade
<shawarma> mbreit: No biggie.
<mbreit> shawarma: you will also have to upgrade some packages per hand with apt-get install packagename
<seth_k> SloMoSnail, ok. Any ideas why dput would be refusing to upload my fixed package to revu?
<mbreit> seth_k: not signed all files? (dpkg-buildpackage options -sa)
<shawarma> mbreit: Hmm.. That's something that should be fixed, too.. apt-get dist-upgrade should really be all there is to it.
<SloMoSnail> seth_k: depends... does it say something about already uploaded? add -f
<seth_k> SloMoSnail, ah ha
<seth_k> thanks
<seth_k> yeah, it said already uploaded
<mbreit> shawarma: well, it should ;) but breezy is not yet released, and there are many things to fix ;)
<shawarma> mbreit: Sure thing. Damn, I can't wait to get started.
<mbreit> shawarma: getting started to work on breezy?
<shawarma> mbreit: Yes.
<mbreit> shawarma: did you look around in the wiki a bit?
<mbreit> shawarma: there are a lot of nice pages on how to get started
<shawarma> mbreit: Nah, not really yet.
<seth_k> thanks for the help Sebastian
<SloMoSnail> seth_k: np :) did you solved the other issues with that package?
<mbreit> shawarma: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUWannabeTips
<shawarma> mbreit: I know about packaging and that sort of thing, so I should be able to get working right away.
<seth_k> SloMoSnail, yes I did :) just little things so it wasn't hard
<SloMoSnail> seth_k: fine :) reupload and you get a vote ;)
<shawarma> mbreit: Doing the apt-get dist-upgrade now. I just need to put "Welcome to the jungle" by Guns'n'Roses on. I always do that when I dist-upgrade like this. :-D
<mbreit> shawarma: and, if you don't know what you can do, look at UniverseUnmetDeps, pick some packages in the "nobody" category and fix them ;)
<seth_k> cheers :D
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: rock, vegastrike builds with a modified patch, -1biuld1 segfaulted on started, which is why I wanted -2 :)
<mbreit> ajmitch_: did you want to upload my thuban patch (or was it someone else??)
<ajmitch_> mbreit: yeah, I can be not right now, I've got to leave in ~2min :)
<ajmitch_> just wanted to tell Lathiat about my vegastrike issues ;)
<mbreit> ajmitch_: okay... i just thought you forgot it
<marcin> hi all
<marcin> could someone help me and tell how to build package from source which is just one single file?
<tseng> a C file?
<marcin> do I need to tar this file into something like somefile.orig.tar.gz?
<tseng> what kind of file
<marcin> tseng: nope
<marcin> tseng: it is .el file
* tseng boggle
<marcin> tseng: why ;) ?
<SloMoSnail> el? what's that? lisp?
<marcin> SloMoSnail: yes
<tseng> sounds like e-lisp
<marcin> tseng: right it is someting for emacs
<marcin> anyway I can deal with all these emacsen-common
<marcin> etx.
<marcin> etc.
<marcin> I just don't know what to do with this file when I got this downloaded
<marcin> I got css-mode*.deb as an example
<marcin> because this package contains source which is just .el file and there is single .html file
<marcin> and these files are in *.orig.tar.gz - while in fact this isn't something 'original'
<marcin> because css-mode isn't available online as tar.gz
<marcin> so my question is - if I got single .el file as source for package - do I need to put this file into .tar.gz?
<Mithrandir> marcin: if there's no .orig.tar.gz, just make one
<Mithrandir> marcin: yes, it needs to be a .tar.gz
<marcin> Mithrandir: and what about cvs snapshots?
<marcin> I need to tar.gz them too?
<tseng> use the most recent version number + date or revision
<Mithrandir> yes
<tseng> 0.1+cvs20040203 or something like that
#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-19
<torkel> tseng: ping
<tseng> yes?
<tseng> torkel: hi
<torkel> tseng: hi
<torkel> can you please do a rebuild of tomboy. The one in the archive does not work with the current version of dbus in breezy without a rebuild
<tseng> done
<torkel> tseng: thanks a lot
* xhaker is away (Away, bnc logging)
<sh> Hi... I just installed Breezy and now X doesn't work.. I get this weird "*** glibc detected *** double free or corruption (fasttop)" error thing. Sound familiar?
<sh> It happens almost immediately after starting X (before it actually shows anything) and is apparantly killed by a SIGABRT.
<sh> Hmm... I changed to the vesa driver, and now it works.
<sh> Just a sec, I'll just go to X.
<whiprush> dbus-o-the-day
<whiprush> witty!
<tseng> its a rerun
<whiprush> oh
<tseng> last time i called it "this weeks dbus api" or something
<tseng> but glad you are all still ammused
<whiprush> it made my day
<whiprush> (not really)
<shawarma> Where has glxinfo gone in Breezy?
<thierry> I've build gnome-chemistry-utils without any problem and it's in the unmet dependencies list... what should I do now?
<bmonty>  thierry: add it to the "just needs a rebuild" table in the wiki
<bmonty> ajmitch_: ping
<ajmitch_> bmonty: ?
<bmonty> ajmitch_: working on making a script to create a list of mirrors for apt-spy
<ajmitch_> ok..
<bmonty> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Archive, this is the only place mirrors are listed, right?
<ajmitch_> I don't know
<bmonty> I've asked in a lot of the ubuntu channels, and noboy knows
<ajmitch_> :)
<desrt> crimsun; sup
<cat> hey people
<herve> hello
<siretart> hi folks
<siretart> does anyone happen to know who Johan Svedberg is?
<ajmitch_> siretart: he maintains blam in debian, for one
<siretart> hi ajmitch_
<siretart> ajmitch_: ah, I see. he requested an reviewer account
<ajmitch_> aha
<siretart> hm. new upstream version of scorched3d
<siretart> perhaps it fixes some ftbfs on amd64? lets try
<Lathiat> ah nice
<siretart> hi Lathiat
<Lathiat> yo
<siretart> this is a joke
<siretart> 50mb sources?!
<siretart> wtf?!
<Mithrandir> 50MB isn't that bad.
<siretart> puh, thats only for windows, the unix source is 'just' 35MB ;)
<Lathiat> haha
<siretart> Mithrandir: perhaps you can give advice: upstream of scorched3d recommends compiling on amd64 in 32bit mode for ensuring compatibility of the network code
<Lathiat> thatd be really hard to do wouldnt it?
<siretart> Mithrandir: do you think that we and/or debian should do that?
<Lathiat> then you need 32bit installs of sdl, wxwindows,
<siretart> indeed
<Lathiat> i dont think thats reasonable
* ajmitch_ has confirmed through rigourous testing that his modified patch for vegastrike works ;)
<Mithrandir> siretart: no.
<Mithrandir> siretart: the network code should be fixed to use fixed sizes rather.
<siretart> Mithrandir: upstream says they have not access to a 64bit machine for developing/testing
<Amaranth> this is one of those things a distro is supposed to patch and send upstream ;)
<siretart> Amaranth: well, there exists a patch in debian bts, upstream says, that the patch breaks network compatibility
<Mithrandir> siretart: if they don't need physical access, I can provide them with access to one.
<ajmitch_> Mithrandir: it's a GL game, so physical access is proably best
<ajmitch_> I'd happily do it if I had the ox, I quite like the game :)
<ajmitch_> s/ox/box/
<siretart> the game is great, indeed..
<Mithrandir> I have the hardware, but not the time. :-)
<siretart> I'm just trying to build new upstream version
<Amaranth> worms armageddon is better
<siretart> Amaranth: but it doesn't have the nostalgic feeling of scorched earth ;)
<Mithrandir> Amaranth: that's not free, though?
<Amaranth> no
<siretart> it needs openal headers? wtf?
<Amaranth> it's windows only
<ajmitch_> siretart: why the surprise?
<siretart> never heard of that. configure bails out because cannot find openal-config
<ajmitch_> siretart: strange, vesastrike worked ok with libopenal-dev
<siretart> hm. apt-file is still broken :(
* ajmitch_ has no openal-config installed from packages here
<siretart> hm
<siretart> :(
<ajmitch_> hmm, keyboard on this laptop needs cleaned or something, some keys don't work right :)
<Lathiat> apt-file is broken because Contents isnt updated.
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: heh i vacuum my keyboard regularly
* ajmitch_ uses dlocate
<ajmitch_> but dlocate only looks in installed packages, iirc
<Lathiat> largely cat/dog hair
<Lathiat> but other cruft gets in their
<ajmitch_> heh
<Lathiat> keeps it nice and clean
<siretart> ajmitch_: does it also work with packages not installed yet?
<ajmitch_> don't think so
<Lathiat> siretart: feel free to go through http://bur.st/~lathiat/rebuilds at will. :)
<siretart> Lathiat: :) - will soon, I'm still at openal
<siretart> hm
<siretart> debian has uploaded a newer openal
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: great, want to see my massive unmet deps rebuild list? ;)
<siretart> but misses to install openal-config
<ajmitch_> bah, 'b' isn't working properly
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: the to be done list?
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: yeah, I threw the 'apt-cache unmet' list at pbuilder
<Lathiat> i have my own im working through ;p
<ajmitch_> got logs of everything
<Lathiat> ah
<Lathiat> what did that achieve?
<Lathiat> the list of things that just need a rebuild?
<ajmitch_> yeah, once I process the list properly
<Lathiat> ah ok
<ajmitch_> I'll sort out the just-need-rebuild, script the changelog adding & upload the lot
<Lathiat> well im just working through apt-cache atm
<Lathiat> unfortuately simple rebuilds suck a bti because i cant upload
<Lathiat> and sending a debdiff with a changelog entry si almost pointless :)
<Amaranth> a package shows up in unmet if it's suggests don't exist?
<Lathiat> Amaranth: yeh, but it does tell you its a suggest
<ajmitch_> Amaranth: yes, which is why the list needs processing
<siretart> wah great
<siretart> openal is unbuildable in debian atm, because arts has unmet deps :/
<Lathiat> heh
<ajmitch_> ah yes
<ajmitch_> that evil
<siretart> lets try to build in breezy
<Lathiat> bah i hate things that dont compile
<ajmitch_> 752 upgraded, 220 newly installed, 36 to remove and 7 not upgraded.
<ajmitch_> yay, I haven't upgraded this breezy laptop for awhile :)
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> i found alot more worked when i reinstalled
<Lathiat> a few weeks back
<ajmitch_> probably not since UDU, in fact
<Lathiat> _host_sockaddr.sin_port = g_htons(cport);
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: well my main breezy box was dist-upgraded from sid
<Lathiat> wtf is wrong with that :\
<Lathiat> TCPTransmitter.cc:179: error: expected `(' before 'const
<Lathiat> how the hell
<ajmitch_> g_htons isn't something weird & crackful?
<Lathiat> i was just looking
<Lathiat> GUINT16_TO_BE
* Lathiat finds that
<siretart> ajmitch_: would you consider updating openal for breezy?
<ajmitch_> siretart: I'd consider it, if it helps things compile & doesn't break others :)
<siretart> I hope the newer openal doesn break too much. there are some reverse depends..
* Lathiat cant find a GUINT16_TO_BE
* Lathiat wonders where glibconfig.h comes from
<siretart> waaah
<ajmitch_> siretart: breakage?
<Lathiat> ah its in /usr/lib/glib-2.0/include
<Lathiat> crack
<siretart> debian maintainer should be also be hit by something hard
<siretart> he just forgets on accident installing openal-config :/
<ajmitch_> hehe
<Lathiat> #define GUINT16_SWAP_LE_BE_CONSTANT(val)    ((guint16) ( \
<Lathiat>     (guint16) ((guint16) (val) >> 8) |  \
<Lathiat>     (guint16) ((guint16) (val) << 8)))
<Lathiat> is that it ends up being
<Lathiat> i see nothing fishy
<Lathiat> i get the feelign gcc4 might be mixing up my line numbers
<Lathiat> after preprocessing
<siretart> what do you know, the fix is a two liner :/
<ajmitch_> siretart: massive patch
<siretart> does anyone happen to know Dan Helfman? Does he irc?
<siretart> (openal maintainer)
* highvoltage just built his first debian package. ever. :)
<ajmitch_> highvoltage: great :)
<highvoltage> ajmitch_: :)
<Lathiat> what does 'unrepresentable changes to source' actually mean
<Mithrandir> "you have binaries which aren't in the orig.tar.gz"
<Lathiat> uh
<Lathiat> scary
<ajmitch_> the clean target didn't really clean it
<Lathiat> how did that happen?
<Lathiat> except i didnt build it
<Lathiat> i just edited a source file since my last debuild -S
<Mithrandir> it will tell you what files it's complaining about
<ajmitch_> it's a real pain on packages with a broken 'make distclean'
<Lathiat> pkg-source: warning: ignoring deletion of file po/zh_TW.gmo
<Lathiat> dpkg-source: building gabber in gabber_0.8.8-5build2.dsc
<Lathiat> dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source
<Lathiat> debuild: fatal error at line 765:
<Lathiat> dpkg-buildpackage failed!
<Lathiat> it does?
<Lathiat> oh
<Lathiat> i see further up
<Lathiat> oh heh
<Lathiat> i had a copy of vim open
<Lathiat> and it whinged about the swap file
<ajmitch_> heh
<siretart> ok out for lunch
<siretart> cu later!
<Lathiat> bye
<shawarma> Hi! Where do I report Breezy-bugs? Malone?
<ajmitch_> for universe, in malone
<ajmitch_> packages in main still use bugzilla for now
<shawarma> Ok.
<shawarma> Thanks
<shawarma> Hmm... What do I do if it's a package that's only available in Breezy? I can't choose it in the bugzilla interface.
<shawarma> Is anyone here using breezy and using the i810 driver for X?
<sistpoty> hi folks
<slomo> hi sistpoty
<highvoltage> how do i get md 5 sums for all the files in a directory recursively? I thought of trying ls -1R | md5sum, but obviously that only gives me the md5sum of the output.
<Lathiat> find . -type f -exec md5sum {} \;
<highvoltage> Lathiat: thanks
<Lathiat> nps
<Mithrandir> use -print0 | xargs -0 md5sum instead, it won't spawn md5sum for each and every file.
<Mithrandir> (a new md5sum)
<highvoltage> Mithrandir: ok. thanks to you too.
<Lathiat> tseng: in the search & index prefs, the options go off the edge at higher DPIs
<Lathiat> (i think its broken and not inside the tba or something)
<tseng> Lathiat: you are using cvs?
<Lathiat> tseng: package
<tseng> uh
<tseng> im at 96dpi
<tseng> i dont know what you consider "high"
<Lathiat> put it to 120
<Lathiat> basically the window doesnt size to fit the widgets
<Lathiat> (and its not resizable to make it worse)
<tseng> works for me
<Lathiat> at 120dpi?
<tseng> oh
<tseng> there is a tiny bit of overhang
<Lathiat> yeh
<tseng> the s in folders
<tseng> meh?
<Lathiat> at 120 you almost cant hit the text box
<Lathiat> nah
<Lathiat> the uh F12 textbox
<Lathiat> i can only see half of it
<tseng> i can
<tseng> see the whole line
<tseng> what kind of monitor are you running 120dpi anyway
<Lathiat> 1680x1050 @ 15.4"
<Lathiat> (dell widescreen laptop)
<tseng> < 1680x1050 @ 20"
<Lathiat> heh
<tseng> i guess that explains why I can see it all
<tseng> or something
<Lathiat> so make it 150 dpi then
<Lathiat> :)
<tseng> this seems stupid big
<tseng> are you blind :P
<Lathiat> http://bur.st/~lathiat/prefs.png
<Lathiat> tseng: yeh dude i have 5 less inches to put that resolution in
<tseng> yes 150 managed to pretty well screw it
<Lathiat> and yeh 96dpi was start to annoy me
<Lathiat> dont wanna screw my eyes :)
<Lathiat> 120 is nice
<tseng> hm i run 1440x1050 @ 14.1"
<tseng> with 75 dpi
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> thats basically by resolution
<tseng> oh the laptop lcs
<tseng> lcd
<Lathiat> but 1" less
<tseng> yeah
* Lathiat sets 75dpi
<tseng> do you have a gnome bugs account?
<Lathiat> damn ;p
<Lathiat> yes
<Lathiat> want me to file one?
<tseng> yeah
<tseng> im not sure if its even valid
<Lathiat> why isnt it valid?
<Lathiat> every other application works fine at this dpi :) the window should resize itself
<tseng> hm is that gtk or beagle?
<tseng> i really have no idea
<Lathiat> well i assume its just the way the window is put together
<Lathiat> tho gnome apps in general handle dpi a bazillion times better than windows
<Lathiat> on windows setting a higher dpi is pain
<Lathiat> breaks everything
<highvoltage> so, the templates file contains those questions that debconf asks when i install new packages? what's the best way to learn about templates? should i look at other packages for examples?
<\sh> g'afternoon gentlemen
<sistpoty> hi \sh
<highvoltage> afternoon, \sh
<sistpoty> highvoltage: install debconf-doc, there are pretty good examples in there
<highvoltage> sistpoty: ok, thanks.
<\sh> hmm...i just wanted to write my installation report for this laptop but somethings wrong with my X
<\sh> or kde or gnome...don't know..have to investigate
* ajmitch_ hasn't heard of his laptop being sent yet
<Lathiat> neither
<Lathiat> fingers crossed for 12" or amd64 ;p
<ajmitch_> hah
<Lathiat> probably wont be :(
<Lathiat> i want \sh's portege r200
<ajmitch_> UK->NZ can take awhile, anyway :)
<sistpoty> hm... about motuglutransition: what if a package doesn't directly use gl/glu, but uses gl[u]  from sdl... should it build-depend on sdl only?
<ajmitch_> sistpoty: I think so
<ajmitch_> let me check sdl deps
<ajmitch_> libsdl1.2-dev depends on libglu1-xorg-dev | libglu-dev
<sivang> howdy folks
<sistpoty> thanks ajmitch_
<\sh> grmpf
<sistpoty> hi sivang
<\sh> ok..compiling the sk98lin driver as kernel module only with linux-kernel-headers doesn
<\sh> 't wokr
<ajmitch_> \sh: is the driver updated in the latest breezy kernel?
<\sh> no
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: are you sure you want \sh's laptop? ;)
<Lathiat> yes
<Lathiat> because i know someone who has it workign perfectly :)
<\sh> skfp is the old driver...doesn't work...we should get the correct driver into the kernel...doesn't break anything
<ajmitch_> hehe
<Lathiat> \sh: ask davyd on gimpnet about it...
<Lathiat> \sh: he has it all working on .. maybe hoary
<\sh> Lathiat: it's working :(
<Lathiat> might be breezy
<\sh> aeh
<\sh> :)
<\sh> Lathiat: the problem is only the installation
<Lathiat> ah right
<ajmitch_> you need to do a net install?
<Lathiat> he borrowed my pcmcia card
<\sh> Lathiat: the install kernel on colony cd 2 doesn't have the driver...so u have to adjust the install media
<Lathiat> right
<\sh> ajmitch_: jepp
<\sh> Lathiat: i did it with some tricks
<Lathiat> should get them merged in :)
<ajmitch_> only pcmcia network card I have here is a dodgy 10Mbps 3com :)
<\sh> yepp
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: yeh well mine was a
<Lathiat> real... something
<Lathiat> those red ones
<Lathiat> no
<Lathiat> xircom
<Lathiat> thats it
<Lathiat> 10M xircom pcmcia
<ajmitch_> heh
<\sh> but the rest..bluetooth wifi is working out of the box
<Lathiat> \sh: apparently bluetooth needs an acpi patch
* ajmitch_ has a 33.6k xircom modem lying around
<ajmitch_> \sh: great :)
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: ve got like 3 of those but missing the dongle
<Lathiat> couple dual modem/network, couple network, 1 modem
<Lathiat> i think
<Lathiat> only got 1 network dongle
<Lathiat> it was quite funny actually my aunty baught home this computer stuff from her work for me
<Lathiat> mostly junk but she accidentally bought a box of papers
* ajmitch_ wouldn't mind trying bluetooth+gprs if it weren't so ****ing expensive
<\sh> actually i can't really test bluetooth cause i don't have another bluetooth device...and my mobile is only looking for audio devices
<Lathiat> so she went to take that back and i chceked in the box first and right in the bottom was a xircom network dongle
<Lathiat> so i was happy :)
<ajmitch_> \sh: you could borrow my phone that I got a couple of weeks ago :)
<\sh> ajmitch_: hehe
<\sh> ajmitch_: but I should be able to detect the bluetooth devices in my area somehow
<ajmitch_> bluetooth works nicely with my desktop box (usb dongle)
<ajmitch_> so I hope the laptop I get has bluetooth to test
* ajmitch_ wants decent sync out of the box
<\sh> i wrote 3 pages how to get this nice little bitch flying...and it's really eyecandy
* ajmitch_ is jealous ;)
<\sh> ajmitch_: it cost me half a day
<\sh> to come to terms how to break the install media of colony cd2
<\sh> mount the iso as loop, rsync it to another dir, compile a new kernel on another box, replace the modules of the initrd, replace the kernel on the install media etc....
<ajmitch_> how evil
<\sh> kick windows from the harddrive, cause resizing wasn't working
<ajmitch_> no?
<\sh> no
<ajmitch_> resize should always work
<ajmitch_> very serious if it doesn't
<\sh> the default install is 60gb windows xp ntfs
<ajmitch_> as most new users will be dual-booting
<\sh> i just started up..and I was w8ing for one hour
<ajmitch_> & most people will have winXP, ntfs install
<\sh> nothing was showing up in the syslog, messges etc.
<\sh> tomorrow i check on ebay for a cheep external usb dvdrom
<ajmitch_> bugzilla'ed it?
<\sh> ajmitch_: no I want to reproduce it
<\sh> cause i think I made a mistake with the install
<sivang> so guys, where is still help needed around in MOTU land?
<ajmitch_> with the amount of hardware in this flat, I should have no issues getting stuff installed ;)
<ajmitch_> sivang: everywhere ;)
<ajmitch_> sivang: look at MOTUGLUTransition, UniverseUnmetDeps
<sivang> ajmitch_: ah the transition still continues? :)
<siretart> re
<ajmitch_> sivang: of course
<sivang> ajmitch_: and does ti expemt FF ?
<ajmitch_> and it will be ongoing ;)
<ajmitch_> sivang: in a sense
<ajmitch_> since it's not really a new feature
<siretart> ajmitch_: I 'fixed' openal and already submitted a patch to debian: #323054
<ajmitch_> siretart: excellent!
<\sh> the strange thing is...toshiba delivers only a dvd recovery media..so if u want to install windows...everything is gone from your previous install
<ajmitch_> \sh: I think my flatmate has a very similar laptop
<ajmitch_> if not the same model
<siretart> ajmitch_: I'd like to upload and fixed version of openal with this patch to ubuntu, but I'll first test the reverse dependencies
<sistpoty> huhu siretart
<ajmitch_> siretart: ok, I'll test vegastrike :)
<\sh> there r different portege r200 models around as I saw...and this one is not even mentioned on toshibas page
<ajmitch_> since that's on my list of packages to upload
<siretart> huhu sistpoty
<siretart> ah, that would be great
<siretart> then I
<\sh> guys I just switch to X una momenta :)
<siretart> 'd test other one
<ajmitch_> vegastrike has build-dep changes from Lathiat, gcc4 fix from me, and debian patches to merge
<ajmitch_> plus it's fun to test :)
<ajmitch_> \sh: no-go?
<\sh> back
<\sh> working now
<ajmitch_> ah great
<\sh> I think i have some troubles with kde and gnome when no network device is there
<\sh> no real network device ...
<ajmitch_> \sh: interface 'lo' has to be up
<ajmitch_> but nothing else needs to be
<sivang> ajmitch_: that's the two main tasks that need be completed for breezy?
<ajmitch_> as long as 127.0.0.1/localhost resolve
<\sh> it is....but when I disable the wifi (when I was in the train just now)
<ajmitch_> sivang: I'm sure there's *lots* of other tasks, like packages that FTBFS
<siretart> sivang: they are always important goals! :)
<\sh> completly, even wireless-tools were segfaulting
<ajmitch_> sivang: and don't forget reviewing! ;)
<\sh> strange thing
<\sh> s
<siretart> \sh: oh. that sounds like major breakage..
<ajmitch_> ok, can people please write up everything they know needs done on MOTUTodo, please?
<\sh> siretart: I have to reproduce it...again
<sivang> ajmitch_: well, I can't review yet :) Have to get a couple of my own pkgs in before that I assmue ...
<\sh> but first I will write my installation report
<ajmitch_> and we can also discuss what needs done in the next few weeks at the next MOTU meeting (which is on 24/8 )
<sivang> ajmitch_: that would be great, so each time I get some time on hands I won't have to ask around :)
<ajmitch_> sivang: ok, but you can still add comments to other's packages :)
<ajmitch_> sivang: yeah, I don't know everything that needs done, so we need to keep track of it
* ajmitch_ wishes debian development was often as fun as MOTU work ;)
<highvoltage> ajmitch_: what's the difference?
<ajmitch_> highvoltage: usually less teamwork in debian, more flames :)
<ajmitch_> although that depends on the area that you work in
<highvoltage> sounds like some debian guys just need to ligthen up a bit.
<ajmitch_> oh sure
<ajmitch_> debian can still be a lot of fun though
<ajmitch_> any suggestions from the channel on what needs to go on the MOTUTodo list?
* ajmitch_ hears the deafening silence
<highvoltage> *cough*
<sivang> what's MOTUToMerge all about?
<highvoltage> ajmitch_: i would contribute, if i understood myself what needs to be done.
<ajmitch_> highvoltage: any ideas about what we might be missing from universe that needs fixed?
<ajmitch_> things you may have come acrss
<siretart> ajmitch_: I'm thinking of adding the ghc6 stuff to MOTUTodo
<highvoltage> not recently. i'll have to rack my brain a bit.
<siretart> ajmitch_: but it consists mainly of waiting on upstream releasing a new version or someone willing to test the preview release
<Lathiat> hrm, if you remove the login sound
<Lathiat> it still plays
<ajmitch_> siretart: yeah, they said 6.4.1 'real soon now' on the list
<ajmitch_> so we'll have to get that bootstrapped on the buildd
<siretart> whatever 'RSN' means to them..
<ajmitch_> :)
<ajmitch_> for some upstreams, 'RSN' means 6 months ;)
<siretart> ajmitch_: for some distributions, it means nearly 12 months ;)
<siretart> just joking..
<ajmitch_> siretart: except debian :)
<\sh> hmm
<ajmitch_> sarge was slated for release in december 2003, iirc ;)
<siretart> IIRC, that was the date predicted by aj back then..
<siretart> after that GR, it was clear that sarge had to be delayed..
<ajmitch_> yup
<tseng> siretart: is there a good reason to have archived uploads show up on the main page?
<ajmitch_> morning tseng
<tseng> hi
<siretart> tseng: you want them on a different page?
<ajmitch_> "This proposal has made me put some faith back into Debian. I hope the release manager can enforce this plan and we'll see Sarge in 2003, not 2005."
<tseng> the main page is huge now
<ajmitch_> hah
<tseng> just an idea
<siretart> well. hm
<siretart> I'm quite quick with archiving, ppl would be confused why their uploads have dissappeared..
<tseng> i see
<sistpoty> yep, archiving was also planned for packages needing work... revu2 will differentiate here ;)
<tseng> ok
<sistpoty> we just should get started coding on it ;)
<tseng> what are the big changes?
<sistpoty> package lifecycle, different pages if you are a reviewer or contributor...
<siretart> sistpoty: right :)
<sistpoty> many things are listed on REVUDevelopment (wiki)
<ajmitch_> ah, if only all those issues raised on the forums were filed as bugs...
<siretart> sistpoty: did you actually try to build scorched3d?
<siretart> sistpoty: I'm currently on it. it FTBFS on amd64 in current form for me :(
<ajmitch_> siretart: FTBFS in what way?
<ajmitch_> if it's openal related...
<siretart> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=288578\
<sistpoty> siretart: yep
<siretart> without '\'
<ajmitch_> oh evil int/pointer stuff
<sistpoty> siretart: didn't fail on i386
<siretart> very evil
<ajmitch_> sistpoty: it doesn't fail because the datatypes are the same on i386
<ajmitch_> but not on amd64
<highvoltage> why do the debian scripts use #!/bin/sh -e? What does the "-e" switch do? I couldn't find it in the sh/bash man page.
<sistpoty> highvoltage: exit on error
<siretart> highvoltage: the script will abort if any command fails
<siretart> highvoltage: handy for debugging and for getting users to report usable bugs
<siretart> reports
<sistpoty> hm... this is strange, i didn't see any warnings in the buildlog of scorched3d
<ajmitch_> highvoltage: it's about 2400 lines into the manpage, which is why you didn't see it ;)
<pef> hi
<sistpoty> hi pef
<highvoltage> ah ok, thanks :)
<siretart> hm. first patch for scorched3d.. hmm
<ajmitch_> hello pef
<siretart> but this one seems to have no problems with amd64/gcc-4.0 :)
<siretart> so updated openal would be a benefit
<ajmitch_> what is the current version of openal in breezy, and what is the new version?
<siretart> ajmitch_: see http://packages.qa.debian.org/openal
<ajmitch_> yeah, quite a version change between the 2
<siretart> jupp
<ajmitch_> are they API/ABI compatible?
<siretart> but it seems required for scorched3d
<siretart> not sure..
* ajmitch_ installs latest openal in sid
<ajmitch_> different SONAME, so anything depending will need rebuilt
<ajmitch_> why doesn't scorched3d list it as a build dep?
* ajmitch_ counts 8 packages otherwise that would need rebuilt
<siretart> ok. at least it has a .shlibs file (there was a bug about this)
<siretart> ajmitch_: scorched3d version 39 (the new upstream version) needs that
<ajmitch_> right
<siretart> ok, -39 build succeeded, segfaults instantly :(
<siretart> in 32bit chroot
<ajmitch_> which isn't in sid
<siretart> jepp
<siretart> I upgraded locally here for testing
<sistpoty> hm... dou you have a buildlog of the current version?
<\sh> ok...writing my installation report...bbl
<siretart> sistpoty: sure: http://siretart.tauware.de/scorched3d_39-1_i386.build
<sistpoty> siretart: erm... i mean amd64 ;)
<sistpoty> siretart: and the current version, not the new one
<siretart> sistpoty: no, I want to concentrate ind i386 first. here, it segfaults instantly :/
<sistpoty> ok
<sistpoty> cya later
<highvoltage> is a debian-metapackage just a package that contains no files, but with dependencies, or is there another way that it should be done?
<sivang> highvoltage: I thnk you are right for most o fthe cases
<ajmitch_> highvoltage: generally, yes
<sivang> ajmitch_:  :)
<sivang> ajmitch_: however, I can imagine a meta pakcage that does has some sort of files, conffiles maybe ?
<ajmitch_> sivang: I don't think it would be very meta then
<sivang> ajmitch_: right sorry, I was more thinkg in an OOP way :)
* ajmitch_ wonders how the laptop upgrade went
<ajmitch_> stalled on conffile question.. still got a bunch of packages to go :)
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> i love that
<ajmitch_> aha, thuban finally uploaded, mbreit can be happy now :)
<highvoltage> ajmitch_: i just found something that needs to be packaged, although it's a bit soon atm.
<highvoltage> ajmitch_: http://pc.ign.com/articles/641/641567p1.html
<ajmitch_> highvoltage: is it on UniverseCandidates?
<ajmitch_> if not, put it there :)
<ajmitch_> and the game engine alone isn't useful
<ajmitch_> perhaps for breezy+1 it could be packaged
<highvoltage> true.
<highvoltage> i think it's great though. it might open the door to future gpl games.
<ajmitch_> possibly
<ajmitch_> but that's a future thing to look at :)
<ajmitch_> we only have ~8-9 weeks until release
<ajmitch_> herve: the debdiff of zope 2.7 looks a lot lot bigger between debian & ubuntu than the changelog would indicate - have a number of ubuntu changelog entries been dropped?
<ajmitch_> herve: I'm writing up summaries of the debdiffs that there are (currently 44 of them)
<herve> the point is that the debian one makes changes directly into the source
<herve> doko and I moved them to dpatches
<herve> also the package from unstable doesn't use zope-common and debhelper-zope yet
<ajmitch_> alright, that's good
<herve> this makes drop debconf templates and alike
<ajmitch_> yeah, and prerm scripts
<ajmitch_> & postrm, etc :)
<herve> yada yada -:)
<ajmitch_> http://ajmitch.meta.net.nz/debuild/ubuntu/tmp/zope/REVIEW for what I've started on
<ajmitch_> talked with madduck, kobold, etc and will post this to the list ASAP
<ajmitch_> get some integration discussion going :)
<herve> most of the ubuntu versions will be dropped in the near future
<herve> I mean after breezy :-)
<ajmitch_> of course
<ajmitch_> that's what I'm trying to do ;)
<herve> I don't know when fabio will upload to unstable
<ajmitch_> no point duplicating the work in debian, just use the ubuntu changes if possible
<HostingGeek> can xchat-gnome be rebuilt
<HostingGeek> preferbly use xchat-common for the common files
<HostingGeek> it only needs the stuff in the folder fe-gnome
<Lathiat> your welcome to fix it
<HostingGeek> Lathiat: yea it takes more time for one of you to review it...
<HostingGeek> Lathiat: all it is a simple change in configure.in
<Lathiat> so patch it and give it to someone
<HostingGeek> and some dependces changes
<Lathiat> feel free to give it to me
<ajmitch_> you'd have to give us more than those vague answers
<ajmitch_> 'some dependces changes' really doesn't tell us much
<HostingGeek> and can we make work with ubuntu-desktop
<ajmitch_> no
<HostingGeek> I am thinking of making xchat a dummy package
<ajmitch_> it would need to be seeded to main for that
<HostingGeek> change the current xchat into xchat-gtk
<HostingGeek> anyway I need to stab seb128
<HostingGeek> brb
<Lathiat> bah i just remembered why i stopped using gnome-terminal apart from the speed
<HostingGeek> --- seb128 :No such nick/channel
<Lathiat> that stupid irssi/screen bug
<Lathiat> HostingGeek: yes he didn't want to be stabbed
<HostingGeek> Lathiat: so you use x-g?
<Lathiat> no
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: which bug was that?
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: the screen goes all black or all blue
<HostingGeek> Lathiat: I don't want my changes to be ubuntu only... they should be added to debian
<Lathiat> used to happen all the time
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: ah
<Lathiat> these days usually only starts happening after you change the theme/size/open a tab/font dpi
<Lathiat> but i just had a similar issue with vim
<Lathiat> its gotten worse :\
<Lathiat> i was using mrxvt
<HostingGeek> Lathiat: if not we will make Ian Murduk very anrgy!!!
<Lathiat> which is great but you cant shade the transparent background
<ajmitch_> HostingGeek: so talk to the debian maintainer
<Lathiat> and it doesnt do utf8
<HostingGeek> ajmitch_: hehehe
<herve> Lathiat, gnome-terminal lately got a real speed improvement
<HostingGeek> Davide Puricelli (evo) <evo@debian.org>
<HostingGeek> evo is not on this network
<herve> and I use it everyday, I don't have to complain about the speed
<ajmitch_> HostingGeek: so what? use email, like other people do
<herve> though I don't watch DVDs using ascii art ;-)
<Lathiat> herve: yeh its not too bad
<Lathiat> sucks if your scrolling line by line
<HostingGeek> ajmitch_: I am no email user
<Lathiat> on  afullscreen terminal
<Lathiat> tho
<HostingGeek> ajmitch_: I will never use email
<Lathiat> but its the irssi bug that annoys me really
<HostingGeek> ajmitch_: its got to many problems
<Lathiat> HostingGeek: Go away
<ajmitch_> HostingGeek: well then don't complain that your pet changes don't get adopted, if you're not willing to communicate
<HostingGeek> ajmitch_: its not my changes... anyone would of thought of them they are the make whats insane... sane
<ajmitch_> whatever
* ajmitch_ gets back to debdiff summaries
<ajmitch_> herve: I wonder if we can justify getting zope 2.7.7 in :)
<herve> with Zope always, because there are always ZODB fixes
<herve> but a freeze is a freeze
<herve> and never freeze again what has been unfreezen ;-)
<ajmitch_> hehe
<herve> now it's b***p***s concerns
<ajmitch_> I'm more concerned with being able to use plone 2.1, etc
<herve> plone 2.1 won't enter breezy anyway
<ajmitch_> universe UVF is more flexible than main, but we'd still have to get approval from someone
<ajmitch_> I know it won't, but people will want to run it on breezy
<ajmitch_> so they'd need to run zope from source as well
<herve> and plone 2.1 has strong requirements for Zope 2.7.7?
<ajmitch_> no big pain for them
* herve wishes for a Zope package using pyton 2.4
<ajmitch_> yes, plone 2.1 requires 2.7.7 according to #321405
<ajmitch_> I haven't checked it myself
<herve> this is a debian bug number,
<herve> ?
<ajmitch_> yes :)
<ajmitch_> ubuntu doesn't have quite that many bugs yet ;)
<herve> hey! there's a stylesheet on the bugs page!
<ajmitch_> "requires Zope 2.7.7 or 2.8.1 and Python 2.3.5 installed"
<ajmitch_> yeah, it's a good improvement
<ajmitch_> plone 2.1 is only at rc2 anyway
<herve> I'm looking for the "why"
<ajmitch_> so I guess it's not too urgent
<herve> wow! 7.6 MB for a plone tarball
<ajmitch_> it's getting heavy
<ajmitch_> you're right, I'd say that with plone 2.1 being a way off, then we don't want to break freeze
<ajmitch_> http://www.zope.org/Products/Zope/2.7.7b1/CHANGES.txt doesn't have enough compelling reasons :)
<herve> as I told you, I focus on ZODB bugfixes
<ajmitch_> right
<ajmitch_> I mainly care about zope upgrades for memory issues, and plone compatibility
<herve> ok I admit, I mainly care to move over from zope ;-)
<herve> that was the beta1 changes
<ajmitch_> heh
<herve> zope 2.7.7 final removes a possible zodb fscking
<ajmitch_> ok
<ajmitch_> that changes list was linked from the 2.7.7 folder
<herve> maybe after having drunk too much at a zope sprint ;-)
<ajmitch_> :)
* ajmitch_ remembers the week-long mini-sprint at a friend's place last year in .au :)
<herve> I couldn't find the reason
<herve> there is a reference to a hidden feature of zpt
<herve> but the change doesn't seem to have been accepted
<herve> or it was but this feature only works since zope 2.7.7
<herve> but still undocumented
<ajmitch_> ok, we'll stick with 2.7.4 then?
<herve> we'll stick with zope ;-)
<ajmitch_> herve: what, you don't want to move everything to ruby on rails? ;)
<herve> no, no
<herve> I'm not keen on buzzwords :-)
<ajmitch_> hehe
<ajmitch_> 3am, I'd better go to bed if I can sleep :)
<herve> sure thing :-)
<herve> good night
<ajmitch_> night
<slomo> hmm... python-gtk2 is missing a depend to python-cairo...
<herve> I saw that yes
<Lathiat> yeh
<herve> but I don't know if it's a real dependency
<Lathiat> i emailed seb128 about it
<Lathiat> it is
<slomo> herve: at least it doesn't work without it ;)
<herve> or because scripts use "from gtk import *" :-)
<slomo> Lathiat: ok, fine :)
<Lathiat> herve: nah, you need it
<Lathiat> import gtk fails too
<Lathiat> as gtk imports it
<herve> ha ok, good reason then -:)
<slomo> ...and libid3 or easytag is broken... ;) nice
<tseng> good thing there is cowbell
<Lathiat> bling
<slomo> tseng: yes... but it currently is missing a function i need ;) filling the tags by parsing the filename
<tseng> mmm file bugs
<tseng> he fixed mine in no time
<slomo> yeah later... first i try to fix id3lib or easytag ;)
<slomo> ok, we need to sync easytag from debian ;) elmo doesn't work on weekends?
<herve> rarely
<slomo> hm... well i sent him a mail ;)
* slomo wonders why seb128 hasn't requested a resync as he's the maintainer in debian and should know this problem
<Lathiat> because hes been busy?
<pef> how can I remove config.{guess,sub} from my .diff.gz ? deleting them from debian/rules clean target doesn't work
<sivang> pef: When I have my patchesd ready (using simple-patchsys or dpath) I just get a freash source pkg,
<sivang> pef: then drop the patches into debian/patches
<sivang> pef: and debuild -S
<sivang> pef: works every time
<sivang> pef: so usually I have one source tree where I produce diffs/patches in, and one for creating the source pkg for "shipping" :)
<herve> hmm... I use a single tree for that
<pef> sivang: will try this, thanks for the tip
<pef> sivang: have you the gpg error with debuild ? "gpg: problem with the agent - disabling agent use"
<highvoltage> i have a directory full of .deb files, how can I get a list of all the package names without the _0.0.0-1ubuntu_arch.deb part?
<Lathiat> |cut -d_ -f1 ? :)
<herve> basename maybe
<highvoltage> Lathiat: wow, I never new about the cut command. thanks!
<sivang> pef: I never paid attention to the GPG waring/error messages while debuiling, I lost my signed key, so when I'll get a new one I will start tackeling this :)
<sivang> pef: but I don't recall this error from the builds I've done
<pef> sivang: It seems to ba a known bug http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=322208
<sivang> pef: maybe because I havn't entered my GPG Key I don't get this error
<pef> sivang: debuild put config.{guess,sub} in diff.gz too :/
<sivang> pef: that's weird, have you tried deblcean ?
<sivang> pef: sorry, debclean ?
<pef> sivang: already have theses files... probably a problem in upstram tarball _again_ (already a debian layout)
<pef> but thanks for the info :)
<pef> have to leave
<pef> bye !
<Seveas> Hello masters :)
<Seveas> can anybody help me getting rid of a pbuilder error?
<Seveas> Hi Mez
<Mez> hyey
<Seveas> Do you know your way around pbuilder?
<Mez> pretty much
<Mez> why
<Seveas> I'm new to it and getting an error
<Seveas> just did a pbuilder create
<Seveas> and now a pbuilder build
<Seveas> and this happens: http://paste.ubuntulinux.nl/1232
<Seveas> Any clue on what to do?
<Mez> probably a new apt version gone wrong
<Seveas> hmm
<Seveas> what to do..?
<Mez> no idea
<Seveas> dang
<sivang> Seveas: you need to force installation of un authenticated pakcages, so it seems
<Seveas> how can I do that with pbuilder? -y --force-yes does it for apt outside pbuilder
<sivang> Seveas: you need to try to pass the suggested comand line args, if it didn't ask you to confirm installation of the unauthenticated packagtes - like it did for me
<Seveas> ok, so if I say pbuilder -y --force yes, it will pass these arguments on to apt?
<sivang> let's try :)
<sivang> usually, that's the way you give pbuilder args to pass to apt?
<Seveas> it does not work
<Seveas> and I'm new to pbuilder (I didn't use it until an hour ago) so whatever you tell me I take for granted :)
<sivang> Seveas: oh, then let me check around a bit more, I know it alwasy asked me ti say "yes" on the untrusted packages. :)
<Seveas> it does not even ask me
<Seveas> it simply fails
<Seveas> the manpages for pbuilder and pbuilderrc have not helped me yet
<Seveas> OVERRIDE_APTLINES=no
<Seveas> pbuilder dumpconfig says that
<Seveas> maybe that can do something? (I hate undocumented features :))
<Lathiat> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<Seveas> but of course
<Seveas> how stupid of me
<Seveas> thank you
<Lathiat> nps
<HostingGeek> OMG!!!!
<HostingGeek> we need google browser packages ASAP
<HostingGeek> http://sourceforge.net/projects/gbrowser/
<HostingGeek> lets be the first distro to get it
<HostingGeek> you got 23min to package build and post in the reps
<HostingGeek> I am submittiing it to slashdot now saying ubuntu is getting a package as we talk
<thierry> and to who are you talking?
<Lathiat> Feel free to throw yourself off a cliff at the first available oppurtunity.
<thierry> ho ok sorry
<Lathiat> (i was talking to HostingGeek, not you thierry)
<sivang> Lathiat: lol
<thierry> Lathiat : I've been building gnome-chemical-utils and it build nicely and install great and it's in the unmet dependencies list... what do I do now?
<thierry> Lathiat : that's alright
<Lathiat> thierry: What changes did you make? just a rebuild?
<Lathiat> sivang: you think im joking? :)
<HostingGeek> ITS GOOGLE!!!!
<HostingGeek> we packages for them!
<sivang> HostingGeek: not everybody like google, you know :)
* HostingGeek goes off rotfl
<thierry> Lathiat : yes and the /usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydepends you've learn me yesterday
<Lathiat> and your annoying, i retract my previous comment, and ask that you make the time to do it now.
<Seveas> (note: there is a reason that HostingGeek is banned on #ubuntu)
<Lathiat> thierry: Cool, so you could provide a debdiff to someone to review
<Lathiat> Seveas: yeh i wish he was klined
<thierry> Lathiat : a debdiff of what? I didn't change anything! If I do a changelof what should I write? rebuilded and works fine ?
<Lathiat> thierry: what were the unmet deps?
<thierry> don't know I didn't changed anything... I just did /usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydepends and everything worked
<Lathiat> i mean
<Lathiat> whats on the unmet list
<Lathiat> let me look
<thierry> k... tell me when you'll find it because I really don't know what you're talking aboutr
<Lathiat> ok in this case it was due to libopenbabel's C++ transition
<Lathiat> so an appropriate changelog entry si
<Lathiat>  * Rebuild to complete C++ transition.
<Lathiat> and make sure the version is Xubuntu1
<Lathiat> and not X+1
<thierry> k
<thierry> Lathiat : but how did you see that it was due to libopenbabel's C++ transition?
<Lathiat> thierry: because i looked in apt-cache unmet, and the reason it wouldnt install was due to a missing libopenbabel package
<Lathiat> so i did a apt-cache search libopenbabel
<Lathiat> and saw there is now libopenbabel0c2
<Lathiat> and the c2 stuff on packages means they were C++ and had to be changed/rebuilt for GCC4s new C++ ABI
<Lathiat> but that package hadnt been rebuilt against it yet
<slomo> HostingGeek: where do you read that gbrowser is something made by google?
<HostingGeek> hehehe
<HostingGeek> slomo: gbrowser.com is probberly owned by this project and they changed the whois info for fun lol
<Lathiat> slomo: He's being his usual self, just ignore him
<Seveas> Lathiat, yeah! after the wiki instructions it works
<Seveas> thanks again :)
<Lathiat> Seveas: :)
<Seveas> MOTU here I come *g*
<thierry> Lathiat : I have a problem , when I do "sudo dpkg-buildpackage -uc -us -S" to get my new .dsc with gnome-chemistry-utils , I get an error
<Lathiat> thierry: which is
<thierry> Lathiat : I'll paste it in a private message
<HostingGeek> you can use #flood
<Lathiat> private message works fine
<Seveas> I just completed my first real package ever, hug me :)
<tseng> slomo: are there any more deps pending for gst-plguins-multiverse?
<Yagisan> Seveas: What did you build ?
<slomo> tseng: dirac
<slomo> but that's it
<Seveas> Yagisan, gnome-sudoku
<tseng> slomo: hm rock on
<slomo> tseng: please look at dirac and vote ;) there are just 2 votes missing...
<tseng> i did
<Yagisan> Seveas: What's that ? a replacement for gnome-sudo ?
<slomo> tseng: thanks :)
<Seveas> Yagisan, I packaged gnome-sudoku
<Seveas> lol :)
<Seveas> no, it's a japanese puzzle game
<Yagisan> what's sudoku ?
<Seveas> 9x9 number puzzle
<Seveas> every line and row should contain all numbers 1--9 exactly once
<Seveas> and every 3x3 subsquare (so 9 of them) should also fulfull that requirement
<Seveas> really cool, i'm completely addicted to it :)
<Yagisan> Ah, I understand now.
<Seveas> http://paste.ubuntulinux.nl/1234 <-- screenshot
<Yagisan> I have a really dumb question, but I'll ask anyway. How would I fix this lintian error
<Yagisan> E: deng: shlib-with-executable-bit usr/games/deng/lib/libjdoom.so.0.0.0 0755
<tseng> chmod -x it in rules
<tseng> binary-predeb maybe
<Yagisan> I put chmod 644 debian/deng/usr/games/deng/lib/* into debian/rules but it didn't work
<Yagisan> binary-predeb ?
<tseng> the target
<shawarma> Hi! When I use one of the 2.6.12 kernels, during boot it switches to a screen with a Ubuntu heading and a white box in the bottom half of the screen. I guess that box is supposed to contain boot mesages and such, but is it supposed to work now?
<shawarma> On my system it doesn't change, but after a while (7-8 seconds, I guess), it goes away and boot continues normally.
<shawarma> ...or is that just another thing that's weird about my install?
<\sh> re
<shawarma> Ok, what I'm seeing is apparantly the usplash thing.. Who is working on that?
<sladen> shawarma: mjg59
<shawarma> sladen: Thanks
<\sh> sladen: I just red your report on your thinkpad r52
<\sh> s/red/read/
<sladen> \sh: any useful comments?
<\sh> it's very complete :) did u try a breezy colony install?
<Seveas> Lintian is puzzling me, can anyone explain this:
<Seveas> E: gnome-sudoku: python-script-but-no-python-dep ./usr/bin/gnome-sudoku
<Seveas> And I have this in debian/control
<Seveas> Depends: ${python:Depends},  python2.4-gtk2 >= 2.3.93, python2.4-glade2, python2.4-gnome2, python2.4-gnome2-extras, python2.4-imaging
<\sh> what about python2.4 as dep?
<Seveas> python:Depends=python (<< 2.5), python (>= 2.4)
<Seveas> wouldn't that do it?
<\sh> should work
<Seveas> (it's wat dh_python gave)
<\sh> jesus...this baby is getting hot...wow..
<slomo> \sh: don't burn you legs ;)
<Seveas> puzzle 2: debian/$package/DEBIAN/control contains no Depends: line at all :S
<\sh> slomo: hehe
<\sh> hmm...and it doesn't have any stereo output possibility this baby.
<slomo> hm i think i'll make a new package this evening... fatsort ;)
<Seveas> OK, linda shuts up now, but can someone help me with this weird error?
<Seveas> No Depens: line in .dsc even though there is one in debian/control
<Seveas> No MOTU awake I guess :(
<Seveas> ah well, I'll try again later :)
<sivang> ok guys, I'm at home now - anything quick I can help with?
<Seveas> well, I need a bit help :)
<sivang> Seveas: yeah, shoot
<Seveas> OK, linda shuts up now, but can someone help me with this weird error?
<Seveas> No Depends: line in .dsc even though there is one in debian/control
<Seveas> http://paste.ubuntulinux.nl/1239 debian/control and debian/$package/DEBIAN/control
<Seveas> I don't see where it goes wrong
* sivang would like to warn that he is no packaging guru, will try best to helo though
<Seveas> I appreciate any help, this is my first package :)
<sivang> ! there's already a sudoku game for gnome??
<Seveas> yeah
<Seveas> I'm so addicted to it :)
<sivang> Seveas: where is the source package?
<Seveas> gnome-sudoku.sf.net
<Seveas> It's a simply python distutils package, I'm using cdbs for the debfile
<sivang> Seveas: Do you mind if I give it a try?
<Seveas> of course not, I can give you what I tried so far
<Seveas> http://blackbird.kaarsemaker.net/~dennis/sudoku.tar.gz
<sivang> Seveas: Ok, I will try with that since I don't know what cdbs foo you need to add in order to package python stuff - I'll copycat fro your rules file :)
<sivang> Seveas: all I did for now was mostly gnome GTK packaging
<Seveas> it's simply adding the manpage (which i wrote) and commenting out some stuff in setup.py
<sivang> Seveas: I've unpacked your source pkg , let's se the debuild error
<Seveas> pbuilder goes fine
<Seveas> only lintian borks
<sivang> Seveas: ah, ok, sec
<Seveas> given that there is no Depends:, i can see why :)
<Seveas> any luck yet?
<sivang> Seveas: second, sorry
<Seveas> I'm not in a hurry, just eager to know what I did wrong :)
<sivang> 'build/bdist.linux-i686' does not exist -- can't clean it
<sivang> ^^ ?
<sivang> Seveas: you have any idea what is this? :)
<Seveas> yeah, crapola from setup.py
<Seveas> I still need to clean that thing out
<sivang> Seveas: so how did you build it? :)
<Seveas> But I found a better errordescription by running dpkg-gencontrol manually:
<Seveas> dpkg-gencontrol: warning: unknown substitution variable ${python:Depends}
<sivang> Seveas: ah you see, you can already teach me pacakging
<Seveas> that build/bdist stuff is not fatal
<sivang> Seveas: k
<ajmitch_> morning all
<sivang> mornign ajmitch_
<sivang> Seveas: mayeb you need to wrtie python as Python ?
<sivang> Seveas: it does not recognize the subst var
<Seveas> ok, adding a -T to dpkg-gencotrol (which presumably dh_* does) worked
<Seveas> but did not solve the original error
<Seveas> still no Depends: line in DEBIAN/control or .dsc
<ajmitch_> you are using dh_python, right?
<sivang>  Seveas: I have a feeling ajmitch_ can be of more help to you :)
<ajmitch_> cdbs... show us your debian/rules
<ajmitch_> sivang: not much, I have to leave for work 'real soon now; ;)
<Seveas> DAMNIT
<Seveas> sorrym I just found the error
<ajmitch_> Seveas: oh? :)
<Seveas> very stupid mistake
<ajmitch_> mistakes usually are
<Seveas> Depends: ${python:Depends}, python2.4-gtk2 >= 2.3.93, python2.4-glade2, python2.4-gnome2, python2.4-gnome2-extras, python2.4-imaging
<Seveas> try to spot it
<ajmitch_> the missing brackets for the version?
<Seveas> yup
<Seveas> been searching for that error for quite some time now
<sivang> Seveas: what missing brackets?
* ajmitch_ must have glanced at it far too quickly :)
<Seveas> Depends: ${python:Depends}, python2.4-gtk2 (>=2.3.93), python2.4-glade2, python2.4-gnome2, python2.4-gnome2-extras, python2.4-imaging
<Seveas> sivang, spot the difference
<sivang> Seveas: ah :)
<sivang> Seveas: got it now
<sivang> Seveas: I guess I'm too tired after a day's work to be helping anyone ;-)
<Seveas> hehe
<Seveas> W: gnome-sudoku source: native-package-with-dash-version
<Seveas> W: gnome-sudoku source: build-depends-without-arch-dep
<Seveas> last 2 lintian messages to solve
<ajmitch_> Seveas: make sure you have an orig.tar.gz, *not* just a tar.gz
<ajmitch_> and you  have no Build-Depends line at all
<Seveas> shouldn't dh_make do that?
<Seveas> I have a build-depends line
<ajmitch_> s/Build-Depends/Build-Depends-Indep/
<Seveas> right...
<ajmitch_> dh_make? you're using cdbs...
<Seveas> dh_make os for the initial debianization...
<Seveas> s/os/is/
<ajmitch_> ugh
* ajmitch_ doesn't like using that now :)
<tseng> cp -a tomboy-0.3.2/debian .
<tseng> edit
<tseng> debianization :)
<ajmitch_> ok, I've got to run to work, I'll be back later
<Seveas> (maint-guide quote)
<ajmitch_> Seveas: just change Build-Depends to Build-Depends-Indep
<Seveas> how to solve the other one?
<ajmitch_> use the upstream tarball as orig.tar.gz
<Seveas> ah wait, got it
<sivang> Seveas: I'm leaving as well. Bed time :-/
<sivang> (work tommorow)
* \sh goes as well to bed...
<\sh> cu tomorrow
<Seveas> yeah!
<Seveas> no more linda/lintian messages :)
<Seveas> thanks sivang & ajmitch_
<sivang> Seveas: hey, I didn't help at all :)
<Seveas> the mental support was good :)
<Seveas> wanna have the deb?
<Treenaks> Seveas: omg.. you're creating debs now? :P
<Seveas> Treenaks, yes :)
<Seveas> Well, just one actually
<Seveas> and ogra will be mad - he prefers not tu use cdbs :)
<Treenaks> sivang: </serious> I tried to stop him, and you helped him?!
<Treenaks> Seveas: CDBS _is_ arse. use dpatch
<tseng> wait what?
<Treenaks> tseng: cdbs is arese
<Treenaks> whoa..
<tseng> apples + oranges = pears
<Treenaks> arse, even
<Seveas> ehrm cdbs and dpatch are different things...
<Treenaks> Seveas: yes
<tseng> what does dpatch have to do with anything
<Seveas> cdbs made my rules file 10 lines long
<Treenaks> tseng:
<Seveas> I take that as a big plus
<sivang> Seveas: heheh, I didn't! I tried to fidn out the problem he ws having, and didn't get it at all :)
<Treenaks> tseng: "dpatch is similar to dbs" according to its description
<sivang> Treenaks: daniels thinks cdbs is plain evil
<sivang> :)
<tseng> dude come ON
<Treenaks> tseng: isn't cdbs a "version" of DBS then?
<tseng> cdbs = abstraction for debian/rules makefile
<tseng> dpatch = patch management system
<Treenaks> tseng: inclusing abstraction for debian/rules
<Treenaks> including
<Seveas> Treenaks, http://paste.ubuntulinux.nl/1242
<Seveas> my debian/rules
<Treenaks> Seveas: yes, which makes it less transparent for people who don't know a lot of cdbs
<Seveas> well, they should learn it :)
<Treenaks> (or about it)
<tseng> Treenaks: no, dbs has nothing to do with it
<Treenaks> tseng: Make an inheritance diagram then
<tseng> ok
<tseng> dpatch > dbs
<tseng> and on the other side of the page
<tseng> cdbs
<tseng> with absolutely no connection
<sivang> Seveas: cdbs is ok, if you know the underlying stuff to solve when things go rough beneath
<Seveas> tseng, no connection other than that cdbs can use dpatch :)
<Treenaks> tseng: then $they shouldn't have given it such a similar name
<Seveas> sivang, true, but that's the same for debhelper or $whatever
<tseng> Treenaks: uh. right.
<Seveas> I'm new to packaging, but I could find this error searching through manpages and cdbs files
<Treenaks> tseng: I mean.. cdebconf is like debconf right? so why isn't cdbs like dbs?
<Seveas> so it's not that hard :)
<Seveas> cdebconf = c implementation of debconf
<Seveas> cdbs = common debian build system
<ajmitch_> Treenaks: cdbs is *like* dbs in that it helps you build debian packages
<tseng> Treenaks: because its entirely possible for short acronyms to overlap in potentially confusing ways?
<tseng> especially when they share one or more letters
<Treenaks> tseng: make them longer :)
* tseng gives up
<Seveas> anyway, sorry for raising the temperature in here
<Seveas> i'm going to sleep
<Seveas> g'night all
<Treenaks> you're not using control.in are you? :P
<sivang> Seveas: I was thinking of dh_* as the underlying beneath :)
<sivang> Seveas: night!
#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-20
<tseng> wow beagle actually works 100% out of the box
<ajmitch_> is user_xattr set, or does it not need to be now?
<tseng> its not a hard requirement now
<ajmitch_> great
<tseng> its more like "you really want this"
<tseng> it falls back on sqlite and is slow
<ajmitch_> might be good to put something in README.Debian or even NEWS.Debian about that
<tseng> well it soon wont be my package anymore
<tseng> we get to complain to someone else
<ajmitch_> you'rr going to use the debian package?
<tseng> sure, after a few swings of the cluebat
<tseng> oh how about that, he just responded
<ajmitch_> hopefully he can put it under group maintenance
<ajmitch_> or at least in svn
<tseng> yeah he mentioned putting it in arch for him and me
<tseng> i will propose pkg-mono
<tseng> oh you did mail him the gaim fix right?
<ajmitch_> no I haven't sorry
<tseng> ok
<ajmitch_> will file that as a bug
<tseng> hm right
<tseng> debugs baffles me
<ajmitch_> I've had a few years to get used to it
<tseng> when is a web interface not a web interface?
<ajmitch_> when it doesn't let you interface with it
<tseng> a: dbs
<tseng> hm i thought id fixed f-spot in ubuntu
<tseng> i guess not
<tseng> i should just sync yours
<tseng> that is uploaded, right?
<tseng> mailed
<ajmitch_> yes, thanks
<ajmitch_> was going to ask elmo for sync
<ajmitch_> got distracted (again)
<tseng> is it wrong that i want a *second* $800 lcd?
<ajmitch_> no, it's wrong that you have *one* & I don't
<Burgundavia> tseng, where did you get those beauties?
<ajmitch_> although I do have a 21" & a 17" crt on my desk at home
<tseng> Burgundavia: apple.com
<ajmitch_> dual-head goodness
<Burgundavia> tseng, lucky bastard
<tseng> i dont know about that
<tseng> i do have to work for it :)
<Burgundavia> right
<ajmitch_> only new hardware I've bought recently is a phone
<tseng> im feeling pretty good about breezy now that ive just done a clean install
<tseng> pretty much everything is working
<tseng> even my stuff
<tseng> :P
<ajmitch_> that's a good sign
<ajmitch_> even universe is in a fairly good shape, which is a surprise :)
<tseng> i wish i knew what to do with mythtv
<tseng> i miss it
<Burgundavia> geez, the buildlogs are all green
<Burgundavia> you think we actually produce working code around here or something
<hub> " -automated control managment... remove this please ;)"
<hub> what does that mean ?
<hub> I'm not allowed to regenarte control from control.in ?
<ajmitch_> hub: yes, that's what it says, a number of people don't like control.in, and others, like debian gnome team, use it a lot
<bmonty> is there other things besides the cdbs build-depends that the control.in buys you?
<hub> well, that's what the cdbs tells to use
<hub> btw, I was just asking
<ajmitch_> bmonty: for debian, the Uploaders field
<bmonty> hub: I'm curious myself :)  but it doesn't sound like control.in really gets you much, is that why people don't like it?
<bmonty> seems like it would make the build process a little more complicated without much gain
<hub> well, no really
<ajmitch_> it's not nearly as evil as modifying debian/rules at build time ;)
<bmonty> who modifies the rules at build time?
<ajmitch_> noone sane
<ajmitch_> and I doubt it would work
<bmonty> BTW, for breezy packages is cdbs or debhelper prefered?
<ajmitch_> bmonty: what do you mean, 'or'?
<ajmitch_> cdbs uses debhelper for a lot of tasks
<bmonty> ok....to use or not to use cdbs :)
<ajmitch_> depends on the package, but we recommend using cdbs once you understand what is going on :)
<bmonty> I like the fact that I don't have to create long lists of debhelper scripts in the rules file
<ajmitch_> yes, btu it does mean that you can package stuff without knowing what is going on underneath
<ajmitch_> which can be dangerous
<bmonty> you could say the same thing of debhelper....I felt that way the first time I messed with it
<ajmitch_> that's why some AMs in debian require their NM candidates to package shomething without debhelper
<ajmitch_> my typing has really gone downhill lately :)
<ajmitch_> nasty, someone still having issues with bugzilla #6805 (muine/ppc)
<ajmitch_> tseng: I'll test it out on the ppc box at home & see if it's still valid
<sol> hello
<sol> running hoary amd64, installed seagate sata, fdisk freezes
<sol> something about...  deprecated SCSI ioctl, please convert it to SG_IO
<sol> is there an existing kernel that will allow me to use the sata with hoary?
<sol> kernel pkg that is
<crimsun> sol: default Hoary kernel should, unless your SATA chipset is too new. In that case you can try recompiling Breezy's kernel. (Btw, this is better asked in #ubuntu.)
<sol> i did ask in ubuntu, sorry
<sol> thanx
<crimsun> np, I've only now reattached.
<sol> crimsun: is breezy's kernel a deb package?
<sol> oh
<sol> breezy the ubuntu release?
<Lathiat> indeed
<sol> should i only grab the kernel? or go forward with distro upgrade?
<Lathiat> well
<Lathiat> ... an upgrade might work ;p
<sol> lol
<sol> right
<Lathiat> fdisk shoudlnt break with that error tho
<Lathiat> thats just a warning
<Lathiat> not an error
<Lathiat> tried cfdisk?
<sol> it never breaks
<sol> that is dmesg
<Lathiat> you said it freezes
<sol> cfdisk and parted same thing
<sol> freezes yes
<Lathiat> its not from that
<sol> may i paste two lines here?
<Lathiat> sure
<sol> sorry
<sol> here is the dmesg line upon parted attempt
<sol> Aug 14 17:03:58 localhost kernel: program gparted is using a deprecated SCSI ioctl, please convert it
<sol> to SG_IO
<sol> er, messages
<Lathiat> like i siad, its just a deprecation warning
<sol> there are no other meaningful messages i can find other than ata1 being busy at shutdown
<sol> etc...
<Lathiat> well that sucks :)
<sol> lol
<Lathiat> sure the disk isnt bad or something?
<sol> i have no way of checking really
<sol> brand new
<chillywilly> bah, old openvpn package in hoary
<crimsun> hoary-backports should have 2.0-3 built from breezy
<crimsun> (yes, I know 2.0-4 is in sid)
<chillywilly> hmmm, I have backports added thoguh
<chillywilly> oh, backports does not cover my architecture
<chillywilly> will have to rebuild the package anyway
<chillywilly> this is a dual amd64 box :)
* chillywilly doubts there's much difference between 2.0-3 and 2.0-4
<chillywilly> 2.0-3 should be good enough ;)
<chillywilly> hey, what version can I give a package that I built from sid sources for my own personal use so that if breezy gets the newer version it will then be upgraded?
<crimsun> 2.0-4 from sid?
<chillywilly> yea :)
<crimsun> try 2.0-4~3ubuntu1
<chillywilly> why 4~3...?
<crimsun> so -4 is higher than what's currently in breezy (-3) [presuming 2.0-4 goes in OR 2.0-4ubuntuX goes in] , but your local (-3ubuntu1) is higher than what's in hoary
<crimsun> at the same time it attempts to retain the original sid versioning
<crimsun> you don't have to mark it ubuntu1; you can use chillywilly1 or whatever
<chillywilly> ok
<sivang> hello everyone
<cat> hello sivang
<sivang> hey cat , how is it going?
<cat> here fixing my bugs on bx
<cat> and you'r self
<HostingGeek> hmmm
<HostingGeek> who said they will fix x-g
<HostingGeek> oh yea
<HostingGeek> me
<HostingGeek> /slap HostingGeek
<ajmitch_> tseng: malone #1770 looks odd, as muine has deps on mono-classlib-1.0, perhaps not tight enough?
<\sh> ogra: pingeling
<ogra> pongelung
<cat> darn it,
<\sh> ogra: do u have any objections for having special not official main supported kernel packages in universe?
<\sh> ogra: what I'm thinking about is having kernel images for different computer models, with patches applied, which will never make it into main
<\sh> or vanilla kernel
<ogra> \sh, please contact the kernel team about that... i.e. fabbione :)
<ogra> i fthey have no objections its fine with me... but remember the many people that installd the totally broken bitkeeper snapshot fromuniverse in hoary
<ogra> just because it was 2.11
<cat> hey ogra listen i'm a bitchx developer is there any way i can take the bx packaged on ubuntu?
<\sh> ogra: well..actually I'm thinking about providing special kernels for installation media and running kernels for things like these crappy toshiba drivers
<\sh> cat: we don't know something like maintainers...in ubuntu. so if you want to change something on the package...please do and provide patches, become a motu and help us
<ogra> cat, you are upstream maintainer or debian maintainer for it ?
<cat> i'm just a bitchx developer ogra
<ogra> so upstream ...
<cat> yeah
<ogra> and the 1.0 version we ship is to old ?
<cat> naw
<ogra> hmm, then i dont understand the question i fear
<cat> well i wanted it to take over the bitchx packaged for ubuntu but i fear someone has it (:
<\sh> ogra: he wants to maintain the package in ubuntu
<\sh> cat: again...we don't have maintainership in ubuntu..
<ogra> cat, we dont have personalized packages
<cat> aj
<cat> *oh
<ogra> cat, we do everything as a team... even if some have their favorite packages ....
<cat> oh ic
<cat> damn there's nothing i can do on ubuntu =)
<cat> hehe
<\sh> cat: we have enough to get u working for ubuntu :)
<cat> such as \sh ?
<ogra> and indeed you could maintain the bitchX package.... (if ubuntu specific changes are required)
<ogra> we all have ur favorite packages nobody else would touch without asking... but unlike debian you dont get a flamewar if you really touch someone elses stuff :)
<cat> true,
<cat> well my main goal is to worked, on ubuntu doing something
<cat> but i still haven't find anything
<siretart> cat: if you think, something needs to be done on the ubuntu bitchx package, just go on and improve it. we appreciate every contribution :)
<siretart> hi folks
<ogra> cat: wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUTodo
<ogra> (assuming thats up to date)
<cat> siretart: well there's nothing to be changed (:
<ogra> morning siretart
<siretart> hi ogra
<ogra> cat, look at "How to help / Ongoing tasks"
<herve> hello
<\sh> herve: nice to see u :)
<herve> yeah, sometimes my life gets back to normal :-)
<herve> though it's hard to type with a cat in your arms
<herve> ho, there will be a xorg 6.9
<herve> I though 7.0 was the next one
<Mithrandir> 6.9 and 7.0 are equivalent, except for the build system
<Mithrandir> 6.9 is the last monolithic
<herve> ho, we really are heading the 7.0
<\sh> ok...lets try to build something in this baby
<jsgotangco> ooohh portege toy...
<ajmitch_> jsgotangco: you got your laptop now?
<ajmitch_> or is it still held up in customs? :)
<jsgotangco> oh i love those customs people
<\sh> jsgotangco: what u r getting?
<ajmitch_> heh
<jsgotangco> im getting the Tecra M2 tommorow
<ajmitch_> nice
<jsgotangco> ajmitch_, are you getting one as well?
<Treenaks> I'm getting "a HP", but I don't know which one yet
<ajmitch_> jsgotangco: dell inspiron 710m
<ajmitch_> that's what I heard, anyway
* jsgotangco checks that
<jsgotangco> i think the dells are a bit delayed
<ajmitch_> 510m, sorry
<ajmitch_> wouldn't surprise me if they were
<jsgotangco> nice review on the 510m though
<ajmitch_> yep
<Treenaks> I have no idea what to expect yet :)
<Treenaks> so I've started filling the template for my old 600MHz craptop :)
<ajmitch_> heh
* ajmitch_ could do the same for his 400MHz beast
<Treenaks> \o/ https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LaptopTestingTeam/AsusL7300G
<herve> I have a 386SX 16 MHz, now beat this :-)
<Treenaks> herve: that won't run ubuntu afaik
<ajmitch_> herve: laptop? :)
* ajmitch_ would have to reinstall hoary on his laptop to check things out there
<herve> portable at least :-)
<jsgotangco> CGA graphics? :)
<herve> no vga, but gray
<Treenaks> MCGA 8)
<jsgotangco> talk about vintage on the wiki :)
<herve> I see this: "the laptop when I didn't even know how to walk"
<Treenaks> herve: my parents have one of these: http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Lakes/5705/p70.html
<Treenaks> herve: and one of these: http://www.computercloset.org/IBMPortablePC.htm
<herve> ho no, it's not that old
<Treenaks> herve: then you're too young ;)
<jsgotangco> we used to have a portable trs 80 then
<herve> no I exagerated, I don't even know its year
* jsgotangco lol on the links
<ajmitch_> Treenaks: I want one!
<ajmitch_> ooh, nice usplash
<\sh> ajmitch_: usplash? if this is the thing what I'm looking at when I'm booting up the actual dev kernel...then it's shiddy ,-)
<ajmitch_> \sh: it's a start ;)
<ajmitch_> hmm
<ajmitch_> laptop not booting, I wonder what's wrong now...
<ajmitch_> ah, 180 days without fsck
<\sh> ajmitch_: we should have something like the gentoo splash...this was really nice...and a windowed vga console ,-)
<ajmitch_> \sh: and we're limited to vga16fb, of course :)
<Treenaks> ajmitch_: what? an IBM Portable?
<ajmitch_> Treenaks: sure
<\sh> ajmitch_: change it ,-)
<ajmitch_> \sh: change what part?
<ajmitch_> yay, xkb complaints on login
* ajmitch_ upgrades to x -49
<tseng> ajmitch_: luis did the same thing
<tseng> ajmitch_: there was some kind of upgrade issue
<ajmitch_> tseng: right, that's a worry
<ajmitch_> since the Depends look fine
<tseng> i just did a clean install yesterday and its fine
<jsgotangco> brb
<tseng> is there a known issue with no sound in clean breezy installs, btw?
<tseng> ajmitch_: sounds like beagle et al will be in baz to start
<tseng> ajmitch_: he is really excited about giving us power to branch and merge
<ajmitch_> yeah, baz is pretty nice for that
<tseng> buh at ppc mono bug
<ajmitch_> madduck just held a baz & debian packaging session the other day on irc
<tseng> right
<ajmitch_> tseng: yeah I'll try & get the downstairs imac booted up & test it
<tseng> i think i had this bug filed a year ago
<ajmitch_> installed hoary on it a few weeks back
<tseng> and invalidated it after a few ppc tests
<tseng> and upstream says fixed
<ajmitch_> yes, and it only seems to show up on a few boxes - now after a few months someone has it again
<tseng> $ mcs --version
<tseng> &#65279;Mono C# compiler version 0.91.0.0
<tseng> i mean
<ajmitch_> ancient..
<tseng> thats ancient history
<tseng> the bug is from 05/2004
<ajmitch_> then why does someone see it on a current hoary box?
<ajmitch_> it just doesn't make sense
<tseng> yheah
<tseng> not that we can do much about hoary anyway
<tseng> oh this is the same bug
<tseng> that i closed
<ajmitch_> yep
<ajmitch_> ok, on the mac now
<ajmitch_> looks like it'll take a few minuts
<ajmitch_> tseng: wonderful, I get the SIGILL on hoary
<ajmitch_> brb
<Q-FUNK> who maintains the bazar branch of planner/main?
<Q-FUNK> is that ever merged back into the Ubuntu packages?
<Q-FUNK> http://arch.ubuntu.com/planner@bazaar.ubuntu.com/planner--MAIN--0/
<Mithrandir> that's probably a mirror of the planner CVS.
<Q-FUNK> hmm. ok
<shawarma> Question: I've upgraded to Breezy (and hence firefox 1.0.6) and the fonts in firefox are QUITE a bit larger than before.... Can anyone tell me why?
<shawarma> Ok, let me rephrase: Does anyone else have larger fonts in firefox after upgrading to Breezy?
<ogra> shawarma, this is not a support channel and i'm sure there are some bugreports open about it
<shawarma> The topic of #ubuntu says not to use Breezy and I figured there would be more people actually running Breezy in here. I'm asking because I'm willing to work on fixing it, and it helps a lot to know if it's a common wellknown problem or something specific to my system..
<ogra> this is the channel for universe package development... we dont even touch firefox if you want to help fixing, go to #ubuntu-devel ...
<ajmitch> ah, faster DSL finally :)
<ogra> shawarma, it helps a lot if you look in bugzilla first, thats an ancient cairo/ff bug.... ;)
<ogra> there must be several reports
<shawarma> ogra: Cairo?
<shawarma> ogra: Oh, and I can't seem to find any bug report about it in bugzilla? Do you have a link available?
<Yagisan> ajmitch, whats DSL like over in NZ ?
<Yagisan> Odd. Is there anyway I can force my package to uninstall the previous version BEFORE installing my new one ?
<Yagisan> it is causing some issues with leaving files behind. I could rm them, but that seems like a hack
<ajmitch> Yagisan: DSL in NZ is bad
<ajmitch> nearly as bad as .au :)
<ajmitch> I'd say worse, but we *just* got 2Mbps available
<ajmitch> Yagisan: w.r.t your packages, use Conflicts/Replaces fields in debian/control
<ajmitch> if files are moved between packages.. otherwise I'm not sure what you mean?
<Yagisan> Sorry ajmitch - had to feed bub.
<Yagisan> WRT my packages, a dpkg-divert moved packages, and became policy compliant at the same time
<Yagisan> DSL does look better in NZ :(
<ajmitch> Yagisan: that's funny, I was on 256/128 until yesterday
<ajmitch> I wouldn't call that better :)
<Yagisan> I had dialup until I went to UDU
<Yagisan> I pay for 1500/256 but I wouldn't say its reliable
<Yagisan> and I know the copper cables could do better
<Yagisan> WRT my packages - go with a rm hack ?
<Yagisan> I have replaces, but no conflicts in my control. I'll rebuild a see if I still need a rm hack
<ajmitch> rm hacks are not good to do
<ajmitch> ah, you were at UDU as well?
<Yagisan> I know - I'll find out in 10mins if I still need to do it
<Yagisan> yeah, I met you andrew
<ajmitch> yeah sorry, I don't recognise irc nicks I don't see often :)
<Yagisan> I signed your key and 6days later had my machine die taking my old key down with it :(
<ajmitch> ouch :)
<Yagisan> lesson to self, never store backups on cheap cds - when you need them they don't restore
<Mithrandir> or verify your backups.
<Yagisan> verified yes, but that was 4 weeks prior
<Yagisan> moved to a RAID5 for hdd, and DVD+RW for backups now
<Yagisan> anyone ppc here ?
<ajmitch> yes, I've got ppc running at the moment
<Yagisan> after I've finished with my package, could you see if it builds in ppc for me
<ajmitch> ok, it's only got hoary at the moment
<ajmitch> but I can test
<Yagisan> that's fine - it's targeted at hoary while I develop it.
<ajmitch> ok
<Yagisan> hooray - succesfull migration
<bddebian> Howdy
<Yagisan> G'day
<ajmitch> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> Heya \sh
<\sh> re
<\sh> grmpf
<\sh> why are they delivering a dvd rom for recovery when there is no dvd rom..
<\sh> stupid
<\sh> i can't even pxe this image
<ajmitch> bzr is certainly interesting, just playing with it for packaging some of my stuff
<mbreit> hi
<bddebian> Heya mbreit
<bddebian> Heya ogra
<Nafallo> yay microsoft centered supports!
<bddebian>  ?
<Nafallo> I just talked to my laptops supportcentre after my optical unit acting up
<Nafallo> they can't ensure things will work on linux
<Nafallo> so I told them I can, I got a log of the errors the kernel tell me when I insert a CD, I'm in the developteam for the operative system I'm using and their hardware just turned crappy.
<Nafallo> they'll send me a new burner this week :-).
<bddebian> Ahh :-)
<Nafallo> I knew something was up when I couldn't use one of those hoary livecds I got with the mail ;-)
<Nafallo> seems to work with one of my burned CDs though
<Nafallo> but not with a blank one
<Nafallo> anyway, odd, and I'll get a new drive ;-)
<Seveas> Nafallo, lol :)
<mbreit> can someone upload my passepartout-fix for me?
<tseng> ajmitch: "wonderful" indeed
<tseng> ajmitch: tried breezy?
<Yagisa1> Anyone here with experience in putting a shell script "doghouse" around a badly designed program ?
<tseng> like a chroot?
<Yagisa1> more like a diversion
<Yagisa1> the app in question, craps in the CWD
<Yagisa1> I set up a doghouse to contain it to $HOME/.deng
<Yagisa1> but I seem to have made a mistake in setting up dpkg-divert
<Yagisa1> in my preinst
<Yagisa1> I set up two diverts, one to move the app to .real, and one to move my .sh to the original command location
<Yagisa1> but it errors on install, so this is a bad thing
<Yagisa1> OK. I'll go with one divert, and symlink. See if it works better like that.
<Nafallo> what's wrong with kazehakase?
<ogra_ltsp> is there something wrong ?
<ogra_ltsp> except the strange name
<Nafallo> Build-Dep: mozilla-dev (<= 2:1.7.8)
<Nafallo> Build-Conflict: mozilla-dev (<= 2:1.7.9)
<Nafallo> the binary deps mozilla-browser and conflicts with the same versions
<ogra_ltsp> ouch
<Nafallo> ogra_ltsp: I take care of it though. I'll ask the user to file a bug on malone :-).
<Nafallo> karma, here we come! :-)
<ogra_ltsp> :)
<highvoltage> ogra_ltsp: you're on ltsp?
<ogra_ltsp> zup
<ogra_ltsp> with breoken kezmap as zou can see :)
<ogra_ltsp> tried the edubuntu daily..... but its still to broken ... you cnt easily work wround the breakage yet
<Nafallo> ogra_ltsp: what steps shall I take when I want to book #ubuntu-meeting? ;-)
<ogra_ltsp> just look at the Calendar... if nothing is scheduled, grab it
<Nafallo> oki :-)
<siretart> re
<siretart> Does anyone know if Andrew McMillan does irc?
<siretart> and more importantly, do DD cound as reviewer fuer REVU purposes?
<siretart> I'd say yes, but wanted to hear a second opinion
<ubuntuguy> anyone: ndiswrapper will not modprobe insert. Modprobe reports a fatal error. Does anyone know how to fix this?
<jabra> what is the error?
<ubuntuguy> the error is not specific
<ubuntuguy> it simply states fatal error can not insert
<ubuntuguy> or something real close to that
<ogra> can you carry that to a support channel like #ubuntu please ?
<ogra> this is one for universe development...
<ubuntuguy> ogra: sorry, I tried there, I'm desperate.
<ubuntuguy> several people have reported this error on a thread on the ubuntuforums.org
<ubuntuguy> thanks anyway
<ogra> someone should tell the people that forums are not the place to report bugs if they want them solved *sigh*
<zul> yeah especially when the kernel-team doesnt really read the forums :)
<Nafallo> does any team? ;-)
<Treenaks> maybe the docteam?
<Treenaks> speaking of the kernel team, *points at bugzilla#2129*
* ogra guesses the Burgundavia team reads forums...
<bddebian> heh
<siretart> ok, bye folks. cu tomorrow
<bddebian> Later siretart
<Treenaks> ogra: there is a "Burgundavia team"?
<bddebian> Hehe
<Treenaks> I mean.. fanboys OK, but a whole team?
<ogra> Nafallo, https://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/1775 ;)
<Nafallo> ogra: thanx :-). I assigned it to me and marked it accepted. dep-wait on eveything else I have to do (meeting in 2h and aspell transition) :-)
<ogra> dylis in #ubuntu-bugs is very helpful ;)
<ogra> err dilys
<zul> what is the url for the package search?
<bddebian>  packages.ubuntu.com
<zul> thanks bddebian
<Treenaks> "Configuring bicyclerepair" ??! WTF?
<ogra> whats wron with that Treenaks ?
<tseng> http://packages.debian.org/unstable/devel/bicyclerepair
<Treenaks> ogra: It's a laptop, not a bicycle :)
<Treenaks> tseng: oh cool
<\sh> i can't use the laptop as phone
<Treenaks> \sh: why not?
<\sh> cause no mic jack
<Treenaks> \sh: most laptops have builtin mics
<\sh> only internal one
<\sh> but's bull**** cause of my headset
<\sh> a external mic is even better
<ogra> hey, dont complain, at least it can fix your bike :)
<\sh> what?
<\sh> the other things like bluetooth can only be enabled via acpi call...and without a kernel patch nothing happens
<\sh> the applies to suspend and hibernate
<\sh> there i have to patch acpid
<\sh> all patches even the NIC driver are refused from upstream
<\sh> so I have to build my own kernel and acpid for this laptop
<\sh> and provide some experimental install media
<\sh> let me all document this with coreys new template
<\sh> so..this laptop is not ubuntu compatible at all
<\sh> ,-)
<Tonio> hi everyone
<Tonio> I have a little problem complying with md5sum with a package
<Tonio> can someone give me just 2 minutes ?
<bddebian> Heya Mez
<\sh> Mez: did fabbione reached u?
<Mez> er, no
<Mez> sup?
<\sh> Mez: somebody backported the kernel
<Mez> what the fuck?
<bddebian> Such language.. :-)
<Mez> sorry..
<bddebian> I'm kidding :
<bddebian> )
<Mez> \sh: unofficial?
<\sh> Mez: he just mentioned it...and wanted to assign some bugs to the backport SPOC :)
<Mez> \sh: the kernel shouldnt have been backported
<\sh> Mez: thats what he said
<Mez> Looking at this, it's only been backported for warty
<Mez> and thats only 2.6.10
<\sh> email him..
<Mez> \sh - It's not backports..
<Treenaks> \o/ -> foodfight.org/log (now all I need is syndication on planet)
<ajmitch> morning all
<bddebian> Morning ajmitch
<jdong> hey, why's breezy's clamav not in sync with debian?
<ajmitch> jdong: because it's after upstream version freeze & noone has requested an exception?
<ogra> ajmitch, after feature freeze even .... which is more strict
<ajmitch> true
<ajmitch> ogra: so do you think I can get f-spot 0.1.0 into breezy?
<ogra> i'd like to hear tsengs opinion, but if it works on amd64 i'll vote for it *g*
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> I'll do a pkg-mono upload for debian & see how it goes
<whiprush> that photo import from the camera for fspot
<whiprush> need it so ... badly ...
<ajmitch> whiprush: don't worry, we can feed your addiction..
<whiprush> <3
<whiprush> then next cycle we can argue about media players all day
<StoneTable> rol
<ajmitch> ah, f-spot_0.1.0-1_i386.deb built
<ajmitch> bbiab
<tseng> ogra: im cool with f-spot, after i look at it
<ogra> oki, go for it then :)
<ogra> to make whiprush happy ;)
<tseng> i have been using cvs
<tseng> nice
<tseng> crasher
<tseng> help - about
<ajmitch> ah this work box is unbearably slow in the morning
<mbreit> hi all...
<mbreit> could somebody upload my passepartout-fix?
<crimsun> url?
<mbreit> http://ubuntu.mobr.de/sources/debdiffs/passepartout_0.6-1ubuntu1.debdiff
<mbreit> (and yes, i hate those config.sub/.guess things in a debdiff...)
#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-21
<crimsun> mbreit: done. You should have received the e-mail.
<mbreit> crimsun: thanks!!
<thierry> Lathiat : what is going on with gnunet and gnome-chemistry-utils, have they been fixed?
<dabaR> if anyone is an op on #ubuntu, please come and devoice this one guy that is just totally annoying with his public away every 5 minutes.
<ajmitch> hey jsgotangco
<ajmitch> how's it going?
<jsgotangco> hey
<jsgotangco> not bad just checking the lists at the moment
<jsgotangco> i should get my laptop today
<ajmitch> great
<ajmitch> I haven't heard if mine has even been sent yet
<jsgotangco> robitaille also gets a dell but no word on shipment either
<ajmitch> ah so you know what others are getting?
<jsgotangco> only some people
<ajmitch> right
<ajmitch> how's the docteam going?
<jsgotangco> i've been busy on edubuntu lately, mgalvin is helping out on the packaging
<jsgotangco> we could probably ship at least 2 references
<jsgotangco> then plan ahead instead of cramming midway
<ajmitch> hey mgalvin
<jsgotangco> speak of the devil
<ajmitch> heh
<jsgotangco> here is our packager
<ajmitch> for a moment I thought you just invited him in :)
<jsgotangco> he's been working with enrico
<ajmitch> ok
<mgalvin> hey ajmitch
<mgalvin> hey all
<mgalvin> mwahahaha
<ajmitch> I'll look forward to some good docs for breezy then :)
<jsgotangco> yeah we'll eventually move into baz later on
<ajmitch> I've started using bazaar-ng, which is looking a lot nicer to use
<mgalvin> yea enrico and i went over the ubuntu-docs package and it works, only thing left is finial decisions on what docs to include and make sure the install location is ok with the dev team
<ajmitch> ie, less than 100 commands :)
<ajmitch> bazaar-ng is still missing a few things, but is certainly good enough for real work
<jsgotangco> baz-ng is going to be baz 2.0 right?
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> I'm glad there are daily snapshot debs available
<marcin> hi all
<marcin> I got a question about debian vs ubuntu repository
<ajmitch> ok
<marcin> afaik when I want to prepare some package for ubuntu
<marcin> then if there already is simmilar package for debian
<ajmitch> similar, as in the same software?
<marcin> then I should refer to this package
<marcin> yes
<ajmitch> yes, that is generally how we work
<marcin> somepackage-1.0-1.deb
<ajmitch> there are some exceptions, but we try to minimise the changes from debian
<marcin> and then I should name my package somepackage-1.0-1ubuntu1.deb
<marcin> right?
<ajmitch> marcin: only if you're making changes to that debian package with version 1.0-1
<ajmitch> which I assume is what you're asking about
<marcin> ajmitch: not exactly
<marcin> ajmitch: in fact my question is - to what debian repository I should refer to?
<ajmitch> we work off unstable
<marcin> ajmitch: ok
<ajmitch> marcin: what package is it, and what changes are you wanting to make?
<ajmitch> hey siretart
<marcin> ajmitch: well currently it is color-theme for emacs
<marcin> ajmitch: color-theme.el
<ajmitch> right
<marcin> ajmitch: and there is no such package in debian (afaik)
<marcin> ajmitch: but I found this package in http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool
<ajmitch> ah, mentors.debian.net is quite unofficial
<ajmitch> and can't be called 'debian' in that sense
<ajmitch> I'd say that the package is badly named there, too
<marcin> and this is why I ask here
<jdong> ok, then I'd like to request clamav 0.86.2's inclusion in Breezy -- 0.86.1 will not detect a couple sigs because of an old engine...
<marcin> ajmitch: why?
<ajmitch> because it doesn't mention emacs at all - greater chance for namespace collision
<ajmitch> jdong: sure, I'll request a sync from elmo
<ajmitch> jdong: I think this is a reasonable package for UVF breaking, due to being so volatile
<marcin> ajmitch: well that's another question
<ajmitch> ah, 0.86.2 also fixes security holes..
<marcin> ajmitch: is there any 'official' naming convention for emacs packages?
<ajmitch> will have to make sure that the data & other reverse depends aren't adversely affected
<ajmitch> marcin: I don't know, as I'm not involved in emacs packaging
<ajmitch> I'd assume there'd be at least some standard
<marcin> ajmitch: an easy way is to name every emacs related package with 'emacs' prefix
<marcin> ajmitch: but currently it doesn't work in this way in ubuntu
<ajmitch> ubuntu packages are just debian packages, I don't think there's anything new we've introduced
<marcin> ajmitch: we got jde, css-mode, gnus etc.
<ajmitch> yep
<marcin> ajmitch: so this is why color-theme is not something unusual
<marcin> ajmitch: in fact emacs-color-theme could be
<ajmitch> color-theme-el wouldn't be, afaik
<marcin> ajmitch: well I really don't like this convention at all
<bmonty> the ubuntu wiki says that hoary can "automagically" detect the best download mirror and use it, anyone know if hoary has that capability?
<marcin> ajmitch: so, if I want to prepare color-theme package for ubuntu and this package is not available in debian unstable
<marcin> ajmitch: then how should I name this package?
<marcin> ajmitch: current version number is 6.5.5
<marcin> ajmitch: color-theme_6.5.5-1ubuntu0.all.deb ?
<marcin> ajmitch: color-theme-el_6.5.5-1ubuntu0.all.deb?
<ajmitch> 0ubuntu1, not 1ubunt0
<marcin> ajmitch: ok
<marcin> ajmitch: and what about name?
<marcin> ajmitch: emacs-color-theme? color-theme? color-theme-el?
<ajmitch> I don't know
<ajmitch> I'd suggest using the -el suffix, just because that is what I've seen other packages use
<mgalvin> does revu send emails to the MOTU's when uploads are made?
<marcin> ajmitch: ehh ok but it sucks extremely
<marcin> ajmitch: almost every other package which belongs to some 'family' uses prefix instead of suffix
<marcin> ajmitch: like python, zope, gnome, php, perl etc.
<ajmitch> most perl libs use a suffix
<ajmitch> as do mono libs
<mgalvin> at any rate, i just uploaded a gperfection2 icon theme package in case anyone can take a peek at it (and tell me how bad it is ;))
<marcin> ajmitch: most perl libs - because they are libs - so they have names like libsomething-something-perl
<ajmitch> I honestly don't see why we're debating debian's naming policy for something that I'm not involved in
<marcin> well right but question is if we could drop debian policy
<marcin> (in fact I cannot see any policy in these package names - jsut mess and chaos but anyway)
<marcin> and we could just use someting different for ubuntu
<jsgotangco> i dont think that's universe's job
<marcin> jsgotangco: so if not here then where can I ask about this?
<jsgotangco> marcin, mdz is your best shot
<ajmitch> marcin: forking packaging from debian can cause unimagineable pain in the long run for the MOTUs
<ajmitch> both in terms of work required & future cooperation with debian
<marcin> jsgotangco: mdz?
<mgalvin> mdz will most likely flat out say no, not adhearing to the debian policy is not an option
<jsgotangco> of course
<ajmitch> for the reasons I listed, mainly
<jsgotangco> if such was in our roadmap, it would have been done early on
<mgalvin> yea, sorry for butting in half way through
<marcin> jsgotangco: I'm not so sure - I don't think that emacs packages are in ubuntu road map at all
<marcin> and I agree that these packages could conflict with debian packages
<marcin> but it in debian there is an incredible mess than why just copy this mess to ubuntu?
<ajmitch> because someone would have to clean up & maintain that mess in ubuntu
<jsgotangco> marcin, ubuntu basically integrates what is currently available, if there is a mess in debian, its best be worked upstream
<ajmitch> that is, being responsible for all the bug reports, upstream updates, etc
<marcin> so you just need more 'manpower' ?
<ajmitch> sure, ubuntu 'could' fork everything that debian does, given enough manpower
<ajmitch> bit it's also a matter of whether we should
<marcin> right but short question - why not?
* ajmitch sighs
<jsgotangco> im going to lunch :)
<ajmitch> :)
<ajmitch> ok, I'll try & get some work done :)
<marcin> ok, not I need to go to bed but anyway - lack of 'menpower' is not real reason for me
<jsgotangco> marcin, if you think what you believe is the right track, then there is no one stopping you from advocating it, its best that you get involved
<jsgotangco> brb
<ajmitch> ah, the downside of bzr daily snapshots - they sometimes break :)
<ajmitch> hi jbailey
<jbailey> Heya Andrew
* ajmitch has just been playing with bzr
<ajmitch> running into a few very odd problems :)
<jbailey> ajmitch: The #bzr channel is probably the best place to talk about it.
<ajmitch> yeah, I've been trying to narrow down to a testcase, but no joy yet
<jbailey> Ugh. =(
<ajmitch> :0:> ~/bin/bzr merge ../../debian/gnue-forms-0.5.12/
<ajmitch> bzr: warning: Conflict in newly added file /mnt/new-home/ajmitch/debian/gnue/tmp/integration/gnue-forms-0.5.12/debian/rules
<ajmitch> bzr: [Errno 21]  Is a directory
<ajmitch> that sort of exception is *really* weird
<ajmitch> it's just a file.read() call which is failing :(
* ajmitch will play with it some more tomorrow
<Burgundavia> Treenaks, nah there is just me, but I am pretty much everywhere
<Treenaks> Burgundavia: ok :)
<siretart> morning
<siretart> Burgundavia: around?
<Burgundavia> siretart, yes
<siretart> Burgundavia: is it possible to add inter wiki to ubuntu's wiki? or is this only available for administrators?
<siretart> just curious
<Burgundavia> siretart, I have no idea. best to ask hendrik
<siretart> ok
<ajmitch> isn't it already there?
<siretart> Burgundavia: I just saw https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LaptopTestingTeam/Template - just one remark
<jsgotangco> i dont think henrik has admin rights to the moin wiki either
<siretart> Burgundavia: wouldn't it be better to create for each distribution/release such a report in an own page?
<siretart> the template seems to be intended as a general summary
<Burgundavia> siretart, mjg59 and myself discussed it. We only need the current stable and a rolling report for the current Colony/Array/whatever Breezy+1 is
<Burgundavia> thus we only need one page
<siretart> Burgundavia: ah, so you expect 2 pages. Stable and rolling?
<Burgundavia> siretart, no
<Burgundavia> a single page, with both on it
<siretart> ah. I see. will do
<Burgundavia> siretart, cheers. #ubuntu-laptop for further discussin
<siretart> right. sorry
<siretart> I'm not used to that channel yet *g*
<Burgundavia> yes
<pef> morning
<Yagisa1> G'day
<pef> why cdbs doesn't update cleanly config.{guess,sub} files ?
<pef> It bloats my diff.gz file with diff between upstream tarball and system config.{sub,guess} files :/
<\sh> cdbs is evil
* siretart looks at http://bugs.debian.org/cdbs
<siretart> jupp
<pef> \sh: upstream tarball sometimes too ;)
<pef> especialy when they have already a "home-made" debian layout
<siretart> pef: upstreams often have no clue of packaging
<siretart> pef: if they had, they would most probably don't include debian/* into upstream tarball
<pef> siretart: it's not very easy (for non-developer) to fill an bts for requesting packaging
<siretart> pef: it consists mainly writing an email to submit@bugs.debian.org. format of this email is described on http://bugs.debian.org, espc. the part about wnpp
<siretart> but well, I see your point
<pef> when authors are bored with "and debian package ?" they put a primitiv debian layout into their tarball, and voil
<pef> I saw this on some sourceforge forums
<Burgundavia> ogra, "Team Burgundavia" indeed
<ogra> hehe :)
<ogra> you work like 3 at least
<Burgundavia> on Wednesday I start work
<Burgundavia> thus I will have less time
<mbreit> hi all
<pef> siretart: how did you get a directory like http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/incoming/kvpnc-0508131655/kvpnc-0.7.2/debian/ from the upload ?
<ajmitch> pef: that's after it was built, I believe?
<ajmitch> wb jsgotangco
<ajmitch> hi mbreit
<mbreit> hi ajmitch
<jsgotangco> thanks
<jsgotangco> hmm
<jsgotangco> desktop froze
<siretart> pef: err, I 'just' do a dpkg-source -x *.dsc after an upload
<ajmitch> siretart: ah, so the stamp-* files are a mistake then? :)
<siretart> err, sorry?
<ajmitch> stamp-autotools-files & stamp-makefile-build don't appear to be in the original diff
<ajmitch> I could be quite mistaken..
<siretart> ajmitch: that because the were in the .orig.tar.gz
<ajmitch> pef: was this one that had an existing debian/ directory?
<ajmitch> oh evil
<siretart> http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/incoming/kvpnc-0508161105/kvpnc-0.7.2/debian/ doesnt show them anymore, because orig.tar.gz was repackages
<siretart> which is right in this case, I think
<ajmitch> ok
<pef> ajmitch: yes
<pef> because of dh_make bug with bzip2 archives #12618, should I use get-orig-source target to recreate a gzipped tarball, or simply doing this by hand ?
<pef> does a call to dh_desktop is really usefull when there are no MimeType registered in .desktop file ?
<\sh> ogra: ping
<ogra> \sh, pong
<ajmitch> hey ogra :)
<ogra> did everybody notice the CC meeting starts in 15min
<siretart> re
<ajmitch> yes
<\sh> argl
<\sh> no
<\sh> ,-)
* ajmitch is there
<\sh> ogra: i got mail from infinito about gcfilms
<ogra> i just recognized it myself
<siretart> \sh: do you have the wiki name describing NetworkInstalls?
<\sh> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Installation/LocalNet
<ajmitch> is there anything we need be available for the meeting?
<\sh> ogra: do we get it synced into breezy for universe even after feature freeze?
<ajmitch> ah, mbreit on member candidates
<siretart> \sh: ah, thanks
<ogra> \sh, synced from ?
(ajmitch/#ubuntu-motu) hmm
(\sh/#ubuntu-motu) ogra: debian...i mean, i have to check it again if it's fixed in debian..but I don't want to have another package to care for right now
(ajmitch/#ubuntu-motu) reminds me that I need to ask elmo to sync clamav
(ajmitch/#ubuntu-motu) & f-spot once I get it tested ;)
<ajmitch> sigh, I'd really like to break the freeze for other packages as well, if possible :)
<\sh> actually I want to spend the time to polish the other packages then to sync new stuff in
<ajmitch> \sh: all the packages I want are updates (including upstream fixes)
<ajmitch> nothing NEW
<ajmitch> mbreit: how many of those still need looked at/uploaded?
<mbreit> ajmitch: none atm....
<ajmitch> ok, great
* ajmitch remembers - please start putting stuff on the agenda for next weeks MOTU meeting
* ajmitch is glad that MOTU meetings start far quicker than CC meetings :)
<Nafallo> ajmitch: ;-)
<pef> how should I named a newly packaged apps like foo-0.2 ? foo-0.2-0ubuntu1 ?
<ajmitch> pef: yep
<pef> thanks !
<ajmitch> well you put 0.2-0ubuntu1 in the changelog anyway :)
<pef> in debian/control, if I use copyrighted names, like Windows or neroBurningRom, should I add (c) or something ?
<ajmitch> they're registered trademarks, not copyrighted
<ajmitch> so I _think_ it'd either be (R) or (TM)
<pef> oups
<siretart> I would avoid them if possible, because I don't understand the legal consequences either
<ajmitch> but I haven't seen them used
<ajmitch> do as siretart says ;)
<Mithrandir>  is for registered marks.
<Mithrandir> it doesn't really matter, but just avoid them, probably no use in mentioning them
<siretart> ah. utf-8 :)
<pef> siretart: I'm packaging a tool wich converts a proprietary format (cdrom image files) to ISO format, the program name is CloneCD
<siretart> pef: why not write '.. converts images in .foo format (used by some comercial sofware) into .iso images...'
<siretart> what format is that? is that somewhat common?
<pef> siretart: proprietary format like .doc
<siretart> pef: everyone knows .doc format. we are beeing terrorisated very often with that
<pef> me too :)
<pef> but if I don't include the apps'name into description, a personn who seeks for "clonecd"  will not find anything :/
<ogra> but someone whoi searches for cloning CDs will find it if you write "an app for cloning CDs"
<siretart> pef: they will find it when they search for the filename extension
<siretart> pef: and when they have been given a hint in the forum, of course
<pef> ogra: it's just a format converter tool
<ogra> pef, you talked about clonecd
<pef> ogra: the output format of clonecd ;)
<mgalvin> hi all
<rbelem> mgalvin, hi ;-)
<mgalvin> hi rbelem
<HiddenWolf> Hey guys
<Treenaks> HiddenWolf: hey, I thought you couldn't code?
<Treenaks> ;)
<HiddenWolf> Treenaks, I can't
<HiddenWolf> Yet
<ajmitch> hi HiddenWolf
<ajmitch> Treenaks: what, you need to be able to code to be in here? :)
<HiddenWolf> Treenaks, but I'm getting fed up with myself, I'd like to fix those stupid bugs myself, really. :P
<Treenaks> ajmitch: no, but we had a discussion about it yesterday in #-nl :)
<Treenaks> HiddenWolf: first, upgrade to breezy.. :)
<Treenaks> HiddenWolf: second, ...
<Treenaks> HiddenWolf: third, profit!
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> Treenaks: step 2 is pull hair out ;)
<HiddenWolf> Treenaks, you are aware that my pc is currently without an harddrive, right? ;)
<Treenaks> ajmitch: It is?
<ajmitch> oh, breezy on usb stick! there's an opportunity for you, HiddenWolf ;)
<HiddenWolf> ajmitch, I'm hoping to have a new drive by the time I drag my tanned ass back to Holland from Rome. ;)
<Lathiat> thatd be cool
<ajmitch> mm, I'd love to visit Rome some day
* Treenaks suggests a conference in Rome :)
<ajmitch> my flatmate got to go to rome last year on only a day or two's notice, for a few weeks :)
<jamessan|work> yes, Rome is awesome
<Treenaks> My next destination is Berlin
* HiddenWolf blinks
<Treenaks> HiddenWolf: ?
<ajmitch> furthest I've managed to get so far is australia
<HiddenWolf> is this a redirect to #ubuntu-travel? ;)
<jamessan|work> return visit to Rome aside, I'd love to go to Belgium
<Treenaks> ajmitch: can't get much further from here :)
<ajmitch> Treenaks: well I'm in NZ, so Australia is fairly close :)
<\sh> Treenaks: I will send you my mobile number..so we can catch up in berlin...looks like I will sleep at dholbachs place
<HiddenWolf> Treenaks, sabdfl managed. ;)
<jamessan|work> HiddenWolf: yup. should I put you in contact with my travel agent?  ;)
<ajmitch> HiddenWolf: sure, suggest Rome for the next ubuntu conference :)
<Treenaks> \sh: PM it :) I'll add you to my phone immediately
<kiko> hey haxors
<tseng> morning kiko
<kiko> what's going on up north?
<tseng> its hot and stuff
* ogra looks north
<HiddenWolf> jamessan, I'm a poor student. :)
<jamessan|work> yeah, I was just joking
<ogra> kiko, looks like every day there
<HiddenWolf> jamessan, I figured. :)
<siretart> no smoke signs? ;)
<ogra> siretart, not since \sh finished the cigarette
<siretart> hehe
<\sh> yes...I just saw a shocked treenaks ,-)
<ajmitch> hi kiko, tseng
<HiddenWolf> ajmitch, I'd happily suggest it, but I'm nobody. :P
<pef> when is the next review day ?
<ajmitch> 18th
<ajmitch> all timezones
<Treenaks> ajmitch: whee @ 36-hour days :)
<ajmitch> only 36? :)
<Treenaks> ajmitch: 24 + 12
<pef> thanks
<ajmitch> Treenaks: NZ is UTC+12, some pacific islands are UTC-12, iirc
<Treenaks> ajmitch: yes (like the islands I work for, .tk :))
<ajmitch> so NZ can be 24 hours ahead of them (maybe 23)
<ajmitch> already the 17th here :)
<ajmitch> so I'll start my review day in < 24 hours
<pef> have to go, bye !
<ajmitch> bye pef
<Treenaks> ajmitch: hm yes
<Treenaks> ajmitch: 48-hour days.. don't tell my boss
<ajmitch> haha
<Nafallo> is sistpoty a member yet?
<Nafallo> is there anyone proposed on this list: https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntumembers that is already a member?
<Nafallo> siretart: ping ^
<siretart> Nafallo: whats up?
<Nafallo> siretart: above :-) is sistpoty ubuntu member?
<Nafallo> IIRC he is for the work on REVU
<siretart> Nafallo: Yes, he is member, but not MOTU yet
<Nafallo> siretart: oki, sorting out launchpad with sabdfl ;-)
<siretart> ah. i see :)
<ajmitch> gar
<ajmitch> vegastrike build fail :(
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> i wa sjust looking at the build log
<Lathiat> err
<Lathiat> email
<ajmitch> yeah, not 64-bit clean
<Lathiat> ah
<ajmitch> int/pointer issues again
<Lathiat> give up, amd64 sucks ;p
<ajmitch> error: cast from 'Unit*' to 'int' loses precision
<ajmitch> I don't use amd64 :)
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> em64t then ;p
<siretart> ajmitch: try to cast it to long
* ajmitch uses i386
<Lathiat> as do i :)
<ajmitch> this is just pasted from the amd64 build log
<ajmitch> I'm hoping that it builds for i386 at least :)
<siretart> most probably
<ajmitch> that's all that matters for me ;)
<bddebian> Howdy
<ajmitch> hello bddebian
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> ajmitch: "Borrowed" an additional battery last night so it's ready to ship.. :-)
<ajmitch> oh?
<bddebian> Yeah if I can get my lazy ass to label it, tape it up, and take it to the post office.. ;-)
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> and in 2 months, it might show up? :)
* ajmitch has had books ordered from the US that took 10 weeks to arrive
<bddebian> ajmitch: No, I am going to expedite it if possible
<ajmitch> it's not urgent
<ajmitch> great, vegastrike built ok on i386 & ppc
<Lathiat> cool
<persia> I'm curious about Malone: if a bug is entered there, is anyone alerted automatically?
<ajmitch> #ubuntu-bugs is notified, I don't think there's automatic assignment to anyone at the moment
<persia> OK.  Thanks.
<persia> ajmitch: Does this also apply to universe packages?  I'm not finding info on one of my submissions (with a patch, even).
<ajmitch> persia: malone is meant for just universe at the moment
<ajmitch> what bug did you file?
<persia> ajmitch: 1696: insufficient joystick button support in vegastrike (there's also an FTBFS right now - yet unfiled).
<ogra> an ftbfs ? i thought ajmitch just solved that one
<persia> ogra: it's a different FTBFS: it gets further along in the process...
<ogra> ah...
<ogra> i wasnt sure anyway if "miscompilation" would translate to ftbfs ;)
<ajmitch> ogra: sorry, I did fix FTBFS on i386
<ajmitch> should have written FTBFS in changelog :)
<ogra> ajmitch, i guessed so...  :=
<ogra> :)
<ajmitch> 33 joystick buttons? now that's just getting excessive :)
<persia> ajmitch: Yeah, well...  It glows blue too!
<ajmitch> hehe
<ajmitch> I don't have a joystick, so I wouldn't be able to test the patch
<ajmitch> I can apply & upload tomorrow though, and hopefully it will work, as you say :)
<persia> ajmitch: If you can help me to get it to compile on 64-bit machines, I'm happy to test :)
<ajmitch> persia: ah, you have 64-bit machine?
<persia> I'm also happy to try to get it to compile.
<persia> ajmitch: Well, AMD64: I'm not sure it doesn't drop into 32-bit every once in a while.
<ajmitch> yeah, it just FTBFS on amd64, I'll have to write up a patch for that
* ajmitch might borrow an account off someone to test compiles
<persia> ajmitch: ia64 as well, from lamont's logs, although I can't verify.
<ajmitch> it'll be the same error, trying to fit a pointer into an int
<ajmitch> void AggressiveLoopAround(Order* aisc, Unit * un) { Order* broll = new Orders::LoopAround(true,true,false,(int)un);
<ajmitch> should not be done on a 64-bit box
<ajmitch> easy enough to fix, it's just a matter of how widespread it is through the source
<persia> Is it just a case of changing "int" to "long" for each call, and running the compilation again?
<ajmitch> yeah, changing the casts
<persia> OK.  I'll see about a patch, although if something gets too odd, I've not programmed in long enough I'll have to give up.
<ajmitch> :)
<ajmitch> thanks
<persia> OK.  Vegastrike now compiles for 64-bit machines: only 5 files changed.  Any suggestions on making a nice patch from my edits?
<ogra__> use dpatch-edit and attach the patch to a bug :)
<Lathiat> persia: compiles=works right? :P
<Lathiat> also, it still compiles+works on x86? :)
<persia> "No manual entry for dpatch-edit" :)
<ogra__> persia, http://tseng.ath.cx/log/?p=7
<tseng> at least i did one thing useful
<persia> Lathiat: No guarantees of that: given a script, I'll make a patch, and test against the current source for my machine.  After that, someone else will have to test for 32-bits.
<ogra__> tseng, <tired sounding>ha ha ha </tired sounding>
<persia> ogra__: Thanks.  I'll look there.
<ogra__> tseng, nobody takes such statements serious from you ;)
<tseng> haha
* bddebian always takes tseng seriously
<persia> Ummm...  I'm looking for something a bit more basic.  I know I can generate a patch for a single file with `diff -urN` original.file new.file, but I'm hoping there's an easy way to get the differences from a full build tree (vegastrike patches are all raw diffs).
<Lathiat> dpatch-edit-patch
<Lathiat> :)
<persia> Lathiat: vegastrike doesn't use dpatch.
<Lathiat> cdbs? :)
<Lathiat> heh
<\sh> cdbs-edit-patch
<ogra__> persia, its no prob to add dpatch (one line in debian/rules)
<ogra__> err, and one dependency in debian/control indeed
<ogra__> as the howto says
<persia> ogra__: Yes, but it makes the package less clean: there are already a number of raw diffs.  I'll just make 5 patches for this: at least that way I can test the changes :)
<\sh> persia: cdbs-edit-patch is your friend
<\sh> it does the same job as dpatch-edit-patch but only with raw diffs..but sometimes it's nasty
<persia> \sh: OK.  I'm willing to make freinds.  I've five modified files, and would like to generate a single raw diff for test application to the patch directory.  Any generic suggestions that can help me?
<Lathiat> persia: get a copy off the old dir then diff -Nru it?
<\sh> persia: i do it like this..
<persia> Lathiat: That's my current activity...
<\sh> untar orig.tar.gz and patch it with the provided patches in debian/patches
<\sh> cp orig-dir orig-dir.patch
<\sh> modify your source in orig-dir.patch
<\sh> and du diff -ur orig-dir orig-dir.patch
<\sh> s/du/do/
<persia> \sh: That makes sense: I'll probably do that next time, but this being my first time, I had not set up the parallel directories, and just edited files in ./work/... until it compiled.  I'm copying files into parallel structures now.  Thanks anyway.
<\sh> use pbuilder :) or create a chroot for such things...
<persia> I've now a patch that allows vegastrike to compile on amd64.  Anyone willing to test against i386 or ppc (the current working architectures)?
<Lathiat> i can try i386 later
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> email it to lathiat@bur.st
<Lathiat> your dcc is b0rked
<Lathiat> coming from an internal ip
<persia> Yeah, well, it works sometimes...
<Lathiat> well it wont now because its coming from 192.168.92.6 :)
<persia> My NAT is a little funny.  No worries.
<Yagisan> persia: why don't you use an i386 chroot to test ?
<persia> Yagisan: Because I7ve not set up a chroot before, and it's 2am for me :)
<persia> Looking at the powermanga build failure: it also looks to be 64 bit cast problems.  Is there a patch in the works, or would one be appreciated?
<Yagisan> persia: 3am for me :)
<slomo> hi everybody :)
<highvoltage> hi slomo
<\sh> hey slomo
<Yagisan> G'day slomo
<tseng> hi
<bddebian> Heya slomo
<siretart> huhu slomo
<siretart> has anyone in here already worked with yada?
* siretart is just trying to fix lyx, which uses yada. I'm rather scared..
<bddebian> siretart: Bah, fear nothing :-)
<siretart> waah. lyx has gcc4 issues :(
<tseng> bddebian: did you ever get mythtv to build?
<bddebian> tseng: Yes but you yelled at me for pulling updates from CVS so I didn't do anymore.
<tseng> hm but it builds with cvs?
<bddebian> I just pulled the updated cvs code and used the same debian/* stuff yes.  Although, I think there could be a couple of simplified rules.
<tseng> ok..
<tseng> huh
<bddebian> The configure stuff in the newer code is better
<\sh> ok...bittorrent package is working again
<bddebian> \sh: You still rock.. ;-P
<\sh> now for bittornado
<siretart> \sh: woooho
<\sh> yes
<\sh> back from phoning with amu :)
<mbreit> hi all
<Yagisa1> G'day
<siretart> err.
<siretart> wtf is this yada?!
<ajmitch> siretart: ?
<siretart> ajmitch: I didn't read to docu yet, it just overwrote my modifications to debian/rules
<ajmitch> that doesn't sound good
<siretart> hm. the auther seem to have a strange sense for humor :/
<siretart> 'yada yada'  - creates template configuration for yada
<bddebian> heh
<\sh> MOTUS! name a good wifi scanner application
<slomo> kismet
<\sh> slomo: running as well with madwifi drivers?
<slomo> i think so... just try it ;)
<mbreit> \sh: runs perfectly with madwifi
<ajmitch> worked for me
<mbreit> \sh: have used it on my thinkpad with madwifi... no problems
<ajmitch> if it doesn't install, ask Nafallo about it
<Nafallo> mememe :-)
<Nafallo> what? :-)
<ajmitch> Nafallo: you fixed & uploaded kismet, right/
<Mez> kwifimanager
<ajmitch> or was that a 'not yet' due to UVF?
<Nafallo> ajmitch: not yet. I'll have to solve libdps1 first. and I'm out of time :-/
<ajmitch> ah ok
<Mez> anything new for me to do?
<Mez> I'm getting a bit annoyed at my comp now
<Mez> not in the mood for gaming
<ajmitch> Mez: probably plenty :)
<Mez> so, thought I might try going back and doing some MOTU stuff
* ajmitch has to go off to work today - got to fit about 12 hours work in 6 hours :)
<Mez> once I've fixed the breakage
<Nafallo> Mez: you could do the libdps1-is-moving-out transition ;-)
<Mez> huh?
<Mez> brb
<Mez> reboot
<Nafallo> haha
<Nafallo> :-)
<Nafallo> ajmitch: jdub here soon? ;-)
<ajmitch> what?
<Nafallo> ajmitch: you always no where he is :-)
<Nafallo> ajmitch: or rather when he is ;-)
<ajmitch> no, I don't
<ajmitch> *if* he's back in sydney, it's not yet 7am there
<Nafallo> hehe, oki :-)
<ajmitch> as sydney is only 2 hours behind nz
<Nafallo> he usually greet people when he gets online :-)
<ajmitch> bbl
<\sh> ok...what source do i need for kismet and atheros card (madwifi driver)
<ogra> \sh, isnt that already in breezy ?
<\sh> ogra: yeah...i mean in kismet.conf ;)
<allee> \sh care to try wlassistant? (has a simple scanner)
<Mez> \sh, why not use kwifimanager?
<slomo> \sh: look at the kismet readme ;)
<\sh> slomo: got it :)
<\sh> ok..no networks open anymore
<Mez> is that good or bad \sh ?
<\sh> Mez: for the test it
<\sh> 's bed
<\sh> bad
<\sh> even
<allee> wlassistant, works in hoary.  Someone wants to try in breezy? (before revu upload)  deb-src http://www.mpe.mpg.de/~ach/kubuntu/hoary-experimental ./
<\sh> anyways...now I no why I don't like gnome...grmpf..
<Mez> \sh :P
<\sh> changing desktops with ctrl+alt+<left> or <right> is not usable for me
<Mez> QOTD: <Keybuk> sweet, I managed to really annoy X by unplugging the mouse during a click
* Mez giggles to himsel
<mbreit> \sh: could you upload a passepartout ftbfs fix for me?
<\sh> url
<mbreit> http://mo42.ath.cx/passepartout_0.6-1ubuntu2.debdiff
<\sh> mbreit: on it's way
<mbreit> \sh: thanks!!
<\sh> mbreit: done...katie should praise u
<mbreit> thanks again
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-14
<bmonty> hi LaserJock
<Sacrafice> is anyone here an admin in #ubuntu?
<Burgundavia> Sacrafice: yep. What's up?
<Sacrafice> i just got banned from #ubuntu and i was only in there for 3 seconds
<Sacrafice> im sure it was a mistake but i would like to get bak in
<Burgundavia> Sacrafice: lets move to a pm
<Sacrafice> ok
<ajmitch> morning
<zul> evening
<tomveens> night
<bmonty> hi ajmitch
<LaserJock> hi bmonty
<zul> hey lj
<LaserJock> hi zul
<zul> how goes the battle?
<LaserJock> well, trying to work on some Ubucon presentations
<LaserJock> and I need to work on the transcript from my MOTU School sessions
<LaserJock> :/
<LaserJock> zul: how about you?
<bmonty> ajmitch: are you using libnss-ldap on your system? if so, are you able to run vmware-player?
<ajmitch> bmonty: I only use vmware server
<ajmitch> but that's mainly on my desktop box
<ajmitch> I'll try on the laptop with libnss-ldap
<bmonty> ajmitch: is your desktop box using LDAP to store user info?
<ajmitch> no
<bmonty> oh ok, vmplayer won't work since the libs that vmware ships with their package don't do ldap
<ajmitch> excellent
<ajmitch> though that should be handled by libc
<bmonty> ajmitch: you would think so, except that vmware ships their own copies of all the libs
<ajmitch> quite annoying
<bmonty> yes, very annoying
* ajmitch never found player that useful compared to server
<bmonty> yeah, except there isn't a package for server
<ajmitch> that's true
* ajmitch has to head out
<ajmitch> back in a couple of hours or so
<bmonty> bye
<LaserJock> is vmware server free?
<Burgundavia> LaserJock: in the beer sense, yes
<bmonty> LaserJock: downloading it now :)
<zul> afaik
<zul> *ahem* xen
<bmonty> I think you have a limited trial
<bmonty> zul: only good for certain OSes
<zul> oh you wanna do windows
<bmonty> yup
<bmonty> and others
<TheMuso> What advantage does server have over player?
<LaserJock> oh wow, they have a beta for OSX!
<LaserJock> or will have
<LaserJock> that would be great
<LaserJock> I've been trying qemu and parallels on my iMac
<LaserJock> but neither works real well
<bmonty> I've been messing with the qemu package this afternoon and it is super slow
<bmonty> since it doesn't install the kernel module
<LaserJock> zul: is xen strictly working for Linux kernels? I wondered if Xen might be made to work on these intel Macs eventually
<zul> LaserJock: what do you mean by strictly working?
<LaserJock> zul: I mean, does it only work on Linux kernels
<zul> yes
<bmonty> zul: I thought it worked for any kernel as long as it understands xen, and that has been done for other OSes
<zul> bmonty: i think in laserjock's case he wants to run an osx guest in xen
<bmonty> zul: right, and he might not be able to do that, but I think he could run FreeBSD
<zul> true..
<LaserJock> you're guest and host need to have the same type of kernel?
<LaserJock> *your
<zul> no it doesnt
<LaserJock> in the end, I'd love to be able to run Ubuntu virtuallized from OS X
<zul> i dont xen has been ported to osx
<LaserJock> as OS X probably should stay as the primary OS on this computer
<LaserJock> but it's feasible? I just needs to be done?
<zul> i think there is ppc port under way
<LaserJock> I just wondered if there was a technological reason that Xen was only for Linux
<LaserJock> yuck, who wants ppc ;-)
<zul> ibm
<LaserJock> sure sure
<LaserJock> but I have no access to ppc really
<LaserJock> :-)
<zul> neither do i
<LaserJock> ah, it seems there is a SoC project for getting Xen working on an intel mac
<visik7> zul: are you chuck ?
<zul> visik7: yep
<visik7> I'm trying to backport xen-3.0 3.0.2+hg11127-7 but I've some problem with it
<visik7> backport to dapper
<visik7> cc1: error: unrecognized command line option "-fno-stack-protector"
<zul> remove the -fno-stack-protector from the Makefile
<visik7> and this is strange 'couse plain xen recognize that gcc 4.0 of dapper hasn't that feature
<visik7> shouldn't the makefile take care of it testing gcc ?
<zul> because edgy has ssp and xen doesnt compile with -fno-stack-protector so just remove it from the Makefile
<visik7> grepping inside the sources only ./xen/arch/x86/Rules.mk has something refer to -fno-stack-protector
<visik7> ah in patches
<visik7> ok works thanks
<visik7> what is ssp ?
<tseng> stack smashing protection
<bmonty> ssp = stack smash protection
<tseng> i gave a talk on it a fewy years back
<tseng> but i dont think its online
<tseng> but believe me, it was top notch
<visik7> mmm
<visik7> ok nor the sid version of xen-3.0 neither the edgy one build package cleanly on dapper
<imbrandon> 
<ajmitch> imbrandon: eloquently said
<ajmitch> of course it shows up as a complete mess of characters here
<imbrandon> heh , damn keymap messed up somehow
<imbrandon> that started off as a alt+2 to changes windows in irssi
<imbrandon> lol
<ajmitch> impressive
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ajmitch> good day bddebian
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> Hmm, what to do tonight
<ajmitch> fix bugs
<bddebian> ajmitch: I don't know how :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: you know I feel like ignoring you for the next week when you say such things
<welshbyte> good _("evening")
<bddebian> OK
<Burgundavia> ajmitch: *grin*
<bddebian> Heya welshbyte
<welshbyte> i've just signed the CoC, do i get cake?
* bddebian hands welshbyte a cake
<welshbyte> mmm virtual flavour :)
<bddebian> Hehe, nice changelog entry:
<bddebian>  * Recompile due to what might be the stupidest transition plan I have
<bddebian>      ever seen in debian (Closes: #362693)
<welshbyte> heh, what package?
<bddebian> xlockmore
<bddebian> Damn, why does it seem that all free RPG games stopped development in 2003? :-)
<Hobbsee> hi all
<TheMuso> Hey Hobbsee.
<bddebian> Heya Hobbsee
<Hawkwind> Hey Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> :)
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee
<imbrandon> heya everyone
<Hawkwind> Hey there imbrandon
<LaserJock> hi imbrandon
<imbrandon> moins Hawkwind
<imbrandon> ;)
<bddebian> Hi imbrandon
<imbrandon> heya bddebian and LaserJock
<bddebian> Oh and Hi LaserJock
<ajmitch> ah, LaserJock
<Burgundavia> hey LaserJock
<Hobbsee> oh crap
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: forgot something?
<Hobbsee> there's an assignment due in 2 days, and i'v eonly just found out about it.
<ajmitch> ouch
<TheMuso> That happened to me a few times, its a horrible feeling.
<ajmitch> what's it on?
<Hobbsee> physics
<Hobbsee> and the lecturer is crap, so i understand nothing
<ajmitch> what area of physics?
<Hobbsee> waves, i think
<ajmitch> ah
* ajmitch has a text book here, but it wouldn't reach you in time :)
<Hobbsee> heh
* Hobbsee has a textbook too.  at home.
<ajmitch> waves in 1st year physics should be fairly easy though
<Hobbsee> true that
<ajmitch> I'm sure enough people here can help you if you're stuck :)
<imbrandon> james troup == elmo ?
<ajmitch> yes
<crimsun> (yes)
<imbrandon> kk thanks
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: good point.
* TheMuso only knows a little bit about sound waves, and thats it. :)
<ajmitch> I'm sure LaserJock has enough physics background to confuse us all
<Hobbsee> true that
<bddebian> heh
<imbrandon> haha
<imbrandon> whoohoo chineese spam
<imbrandon> leaste if they want me to buy something sell it to me in english
<Hobbsee> oh, so i'm not the only one who gets that...
<ajmitch> heh
* ajmitch gets more than enough foreign spam
<imbrandon> hehe Hobbsee i get alot of chineese and french spam, no idea why but MOST of my spam is french or chineese
<Hobbsee> heh
<imbrandon> this one sliped past spamassissan though lol
<LaserJock> physics? did somebody say physics? :-)
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: yes.  you can do my physics assignment and get it shipped to my by 5pm wednesday, if you want.
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yes
<ajmitch> LaserJock: Hobbsee will repay you with eternal gratitude
<Hobbsee> heh
<ajmitch> and the bite of her whip
<LaserJock> depending on what exactly it is you might be better off doing it yourself
<LaserJock> I haven't done general physics for  a long time
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: show us the assignment
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: it's questions from the textbook i'm afraid - i dont know of them being online
<ajmitch> ah
* Hobbsee doesnt even have her textbook at uni to see what the questions are yet.
<ajmitch> you need a scanner :)
<ajmitch> that's inconvenient
<Hobbsee> flatbed scanners dont scan big books :P
<ajmitch> page at a time
<imbrandon> all 234235252342 of them ;)
<ajmitch> only the ones with questions for the assignment..
<Hobbsee> haha
<imbrandon> ;)
<Hobbsee> er, sorry.  not a flatbed scanner.  the other type that doesnt do books
<ajmitch> page feed scanner?
<Hobbsee> tht'a the one
<imbrandon> hahah LaserJock those pics of IE on your blog are priceless
<Burgundavia> imbrandon: link?
<imbrandon> http://laserjock.wordpress.com/
<imbrandon> " Forget it , I'll just watch TV " <---- heh we need one of those buttons in our errors LOL
<LaserJock> hehe
<Hobbsee> hahaha...now that would be fun
<imbrandon> esp if it made MythTV pop up ;)
<imbrandon> ohhh more storms outside , glad i put everything on UPS's the other day ( watch the power go out for longer than the bateries last now )
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<lifeless> hey whos around ?
<lifeless> I've a new package, and its my first python-support one
<Hobbsee> lifeless: i'm not around.
<lifeless> so I'd like someone to do a revu before I upload it
<Hobbsee> okay, i'm definetly not around then.
<lifeless> heh
<lifeless> ajmitch: ?
* lifeless stabs in the dark
<Hobbsee> lifeless: you're trying to stab a brick wall.   it's not working.
<Hobbsee> lifeless: is it main or universe?
<lifeless> universe, I can't upload straight to main, nor has it had a main inclusion report done ;)
<Hobbsee> lifeless: point.  i'd subscribe either of the groups listed in https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2006-August/019922.html asking them to check it out for you
<imbrandon> lifeless: did you upload to revu already ?
<lifeless> I'm not looking for sponsors
<lifeless> Hobbsee: I'm a MOTU, this is just extra surety
<imbrandon> just someone to eyeball it
<lifeless> imbrandon: no, I haven't
<Hobbsee> lifeless: i realise that, but you could ask them to look through and see if it's right.
<Gloubiboulga> lifeless, I can have a look
<Hobbsee> lifeless: then i suggest you say that in a bug report?
<Hobbsee> ah, there you go
<lifeless> imbrandon: I've never used REVU, so I doubt my key is there
<imbrandon> ahh got it somewhere "accessable" hehe me and Gloubiboulga can look it over heheh
<Hobbsee> lifeless: basically, that's for "if it cant be done over irc, or email, or in real time, use that"
<lifeless> Hobbsee: oh sure. though actually my fallback would be kinda different
<Hobbsee> lifeless: true
<lifeless> ok, let me put it on people
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: thats what revu's for , those are for sponsors ;) hehehe
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: no...that's just a random place to throw stuff :P
<lifeless> I just need to make an artificial upstream tarball one, sec
* Hobbsee hands imbrandon the concept of a debdiff
<imbrandon> revu == place for new packages , LP teams == seeking sponsors
<lifeless> imbrandon: Gloubiboulga: sorry for the delay
<lifeless> ELOCAL
<cbx33> Hi all, If I want a topic to be discussed at the CC meeting thisafternoon am I allowed to edit the wiki?
<lifeless> its up at http://people.ubuntu.com/tickcount
<imbrandon> lifeless: 404
<lifeless> http://people.ubuntu.com/~robertc/tickcount/
<imbrandon> ;)
<Toadstool> 'morning everybody
<imbrandon> lifeless: other than the obvious versioning for edgy looks ok to me
<imbrandon> moins Toadstool
<Toadstool> hi imbrandon
<allee> cbx33: IMHO yes
<zakame> lifeless: need a motu?
<imbrandon> he just wanted some other eyeballs to look at that package before he uploaded
<imbrandon> zakame: ^^
<lifeless> zakame: am a motu :)
<zakame> ah, /me checks
<lifeless> imbrandon: by obvious you mean an ubuntu0 marker ?
<Toadstool> lifeless: did you put tickcount_0.1-1.dsc in the package on purpose? :)
* imbrandon is too ( a rather new one but , one heheh )
<lifeless> Toadstool: hmmm, good catch
<imbrandon> lifeless: yea the ubuntu0 and edgy dist target
<imbrandon> err ubuntu1
<lifeless> I thought ubuntuX was only needed if the package was different ?
<zakame> hmm version 1
<lifeless>  - and this is not different, and not in debian at the moment anyway
<imbrandon> yea if its exactly the same ( ie sync ) it dont need it
<zakame> it would be safe to use 0ubuntu1 though
<imbrandon> if its not in debian then it needs -0ubuntu1
<lifeless> right. so its not in debian cause I haven't filed a ITP yet
<lifeless> being a little slack
<lifeless> ok, ubuntu 0 and a changelog dist change
<lifeless> thanks gents
<imbrandon> ie tickcount_0.1-0ubuntu1 , then when it gets in debian sync 0.1-1
<imbrandon> hehe
<zakame> great
<ajmitch> lifeless: you were looking for me?
<lifeless> nah, see above
<lifeless> thanks though
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> lifeless: if you haven't uploaded already, there's still 1 or 2 things..
<lifeless> I have, but thats what multiple uploads are for
<ajmitch> just debhelper version in Build-Depends
<ajmitch> should be >= 5.0.37.2
<lifeless> doh
<lifeless> ok
<lifeless> if it bounces, I'll fix it :)
<ajmitch> won't make a difference
<ajmitch> mainly an indication if it was going to be backported
<lifeless> yeah
<lifeless> I've fix it locally
<lifeless> will get fully fixed when I upload 0.1-1 to debian
<lifeless> brb
<imbrandon> why would i get this http://pastebin.ca/131088
* imbrandon looks puzzled
<ajmitch> imbrandon: simple - libxft is the source package
<ajmitch> apt-cache showsrc libxft
<ajmitch> Binary: libxft-dev, libxft2, libxft2-dbg
<imbrandon> ahh
<ajmitch> you want one of them
<imbrandon> is there a progmatic way to check if all its dependancies are in main easy ?
<imbrandon> or would sometihn like apt-cache madison libfontconfig1-dev libfreetype6-dev x11proto-core-dev libx11-dev libxrender-dev zlib1g-dev|grep universe
<imbrandon> work just as well
<ajmitch> germinate is the correct way
<ajmitch> since you have to check the dependencies down the chain, not just direct ones
<ajmitch> it's not really intended for direct commandline use though :)
<imbrandon> right , ok yea i'm doing a main incl report for , ipodslave and i found two of its deps in universe
<ajmitch> and so there's probably a better way
<imbrandon> so i';m trying to check those down the line too
<ajmitch> right
<imbrandon> but if all its deps are in main they cant depend on someinth g in universe can they ?
<imbrandon> so that SHOULD work ?
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> imbrandon: is there a good reason why you want libxft in main?
<imbrandon> no, i figured out i was wrong looking at something
<ajmitch> do 'apt-cache madison libxft2'
<imbrandon> its not neeeded
<ajmitch> right :)
<imbrandon> yea i realized that later heheh
<ajmitch> removed the wiki page?
<imbrandon> yup
<ajmitch> ok
<geser> hello
<geser> does pbuilder use an other shell than bash?
<Kamping_Kaiser> oh, great and wise motu - i tried putting the 'long text' into a packages controll file, and i get "debian/control at line 12: line with unknown format (not field-colon-value)" back. is there something special i need to do to get a multiline comment in that file?
<Hobbsee> Kamping_Kaiser: use tabs, not spaces?
<Kamping_Kaiser> Hobbsee, i'll give it a shot.
<Kamping_Kaiser> tabs where :S
<Hobbsee> beginning of the lines that you're wanting to indent
<Kamping_Kaiser> i just hit enter - htere isnt a space there. perhaps indent... *tires*
<neutrinomass> Could someone more knowledgable check if passivetex should be removed from universe? It has already been removed from testing ( debian bug 337436 - although it is still in unstable) and has several serious bugs (listed in the bug report - append bug 25010 to those )
<Ubugtu> Debian bug 337436 in passivetex "passivetex: destroys local configuration" [Serious,Open]  http://bugs.debian.org/337436
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 25010 in passivetex "passivetex: destroys local configuration" [Unknown,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/25010
<neutrinomass> (Bah sorry, tis the same bug - imported from debian )
<Kamping_Kaiser> Hobbsee, ah, needed to indent the lines... thanks
<Hobbsee> Kamping_Kaiser: :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> :)
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: see apt-cache rdepends passivetex.  fix all of them first.
<neutrinomass> Hobbsee: No Depends, only Suggests and Recommends - the debian bug lists a build dependency with gstreamer0.8 which has been sorted out (turned out that it could be simply dropped)
<Kamping_Kaiser> grr.
* Kamping_Kaiser goes to set up pbuilder. how can i forget that before i start :S
<Kamping_Kaiser> (hi ogra )
<neutrinomass> It's considered an RC bug by debian ... that's why they removed it
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: right
* Hobbsee wonders what RC is
<Hobbsee> hi ogra
<neutrinomass> Release Critical
<Kamping_Kaiser> Hobbsee, 'zomg thats bad' ;)
<neutrinomass> They said that it actually contains 2 RC bugs and apparently the debian developer no longer maintains it (they've been open for years )
<neutrinomass> I'm in no position to take decisions over this but I thought I should draw attention to it ....
<Hobbsee> ah
* neutrinomass goes back to prentending being busy
<Sp4rKy> hi
<Sp4rKy> please what lib need i add to debian/control for opengl support ?
<sladen> Sp4rKy: libgl-dev
<sladen> Sp4rKy: in the build-dep
<Sp4rKy> thx
<sladen> Sp4rKy: the dependancy on gl should be put there by the shlibs magic
<Sp4rKy> k
<Sp4rKy> thx
<ZuZuu> je voudrais savoir comment on docmpress par la console un fichier .rar et .ace
<ZuZuu> merci
<Sp4rKy> ZuZuu, isn't it an english room here  ?
<Sp4rKy> !fr
<ubotu> Allez a #ubuntu-fr ou #kubuntu-fr pour de l'aide et de la discussion en francais.
<zul> ZuZuu: apt-get install rar
<phanatic> afternoon
<bddebian> Heya gang
<cbx33> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya cbx33
<cbx33> hehehe
<Sp4rKy_> checking whether QTDIR environment variable is set... no
<Sp4rKy_> configure: error: QTDIR must be properly set.
<Sp4rKy_> what could i do
<Sp4rKy_> i've wrote "export QTDIR=/usr/include/qt3" in debian/rules
<Sp4rKy_> and added  libqt3-mt-dev to debian/control
<lfittl> bddebian: about attal, still had no time for the cleanup and debian upload, sry, just had an awful lot of stuff to do the last weeks, upload it to ubuntu if you want to have it done now ;)
<bddebian> lfittl: Well I'd like someone to at least look it over first..
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<cbx33> hi LaserJock
<lloydinho> hey LaserJock,
<lfittl> bddebian: k, I promise I will look at it some time this week, really
<bddebian> Suuure.. ;-)
<lfittl> :P
<slomo> crimsun: did you get everything finished for snd-ymfpci and have something to test for me?
<bddebian> slomo: Get someone to get libieXXX out of new, so I can look at mythtv* will ya? ;-P
<LaserJock> hi bddebian cbx33 and lloydinho
<slomo> bddebian: gst-plugins-good is waiting on it too, don't worry :)
<lloydinho> LaserJock: come cheer on me for the Community Council meeting, please? :-)
<slomo> bddebian: pitti is already (will soon be) looking at the MIR for it, etc ;)
<lloydinho> I'll let you know when I'm up if you're busy..
<LaserJock> lloydinho: when is that?
<bddebian> slomo: Cool thx
<bddebian> LaserJock: Right now ;-)
<LaserJock> oh
<lloydinho> LaserJock: it is on now! :-)
<Sp4rKy> please does anyone could help me
<Sp4rKy> what can i do when i've "checking whether QTDIR environment variable is set... no" during pbuilding
<LaserJock> do you have QT build deps?
<Sp4rKy> i've added libqt-mt-dev
<crimsun> slomo: no, $work atm.
<neutrinomass> can stuff in universe depend on stuff in multiverse ? bug 56358
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56358 in comix "Missing unrar from dependencies" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56358
<crimsun> no, I've already rejected it.
<neutrinomass> ok, thanks
<Sp4rKy> LaserJock, any idea ?
<LaserJock> hmm, not sure
<LaserJock> you might ask kubuntu-devel though as I'm not sure
<Sp4rKy> k
<Sp4rKy> E: Couldn't find package libjack0.100.0-dev
<Sp4rKy> W: Unable to locate package libjack0.100.0-dev
<Sp4rKy> ...
<geser> libjack0.100.0-dev |  0.101.1-1 | http://archive.ubuntu.com edgy/universe Packages
<Sp4rKy> yes i know
<Sp4rKy> but my pbuilder doesn't
<geser> sudo pbuilder update --override-config --othermirror "deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ edgy universe"
<Sp4rKy> k
<bddebian> crimsun: Around?
<bddebian> or ajmitch
<Sp4rKy> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<Sp4rKy>   libjack0.100.0-dev: Depends: libjack0.100.0-0 (= 0.101.1-1) but it is not going to be installed
<Sp4rKy> E: Broken packages
<Sp4rKy> E: Could not satisfy build-dependency.
<Sp4rKy> E: pbuilder-satisfydepends failed.
<Sp4rKy> new error
<bddebian> Works For Me(TM)
<crimsun> $ grep -i ^components ~/.pbuilderrc
<crimsun> COMPONENTS="main restricted universe multiverse"
<crimsun> pbuilder update --override-config
<Sp4rKy> Sp4rKY-laptop%  grep -i ^components ~/.pbuilderrc
<Sp4rKy> COMPONENTS="main restricted universe multiverse"
<crimsun> $ dpkg --print-architecture
<Sp4rKy> i'd forgot --override-config , maybe ...
<crimsun> you _must_ use --override-config
<Sp4rKy> k
<Sp4rKy> i'm doing
<ajmitch> bddebian: yes?
<bddebian> ajmitch: When would a package not have an orig.tar.gz?
<ajmitch> when it's a native package
<bddebian> Aye, native meaning it was written just for Ubuntu?
<ajmitch> or debian
<bddebian> Right
<bddebian> Thx
<ajmitch> ie, don't do it without a real good reason
<ajmitch> why are you asking?
<bddebian> ajmitch: Nah, I'm looking at more REVU packages
<ajmitch> ok
* bddebian wonders if the uploaders even care about some of these packages on REVU anymore
<Sp4rKy> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<Sp4rKy>   libjack0.100.0-dev: Depends: libjack0.100.0-0 (= 0.101.1-1) but it is not going to be installed
<Sp4rKy> E: Broken packages
<Sp4rKy> E: Could not satisfy build-dependency.
<Sp4rKy> E: pbuilder-satisfydepends failed.
<Sp4rKy> bddebian,
<Sp4rKy> always the same error
<Sp4rKy> after my pbuider update --overide-config
<Sp4rKy> +r
<plugwash> normally the way to debug theese problems is to specify the package it says is not going to be installed on the command line along with the ones you originally specified
<plugwash> that then changes the error message
<plugwash> not sure how you could do that in a pbuilder though
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: ``pbuilder login'', then ``apt-cache policy libjack0.100.0-0''
<Sp4rKy> libjack0.100.0-0:
<Sp4rKy>   Installed: (none)
<Sp4rKy>   Candidate: 0.101.1-1
<Sp4rKy>   Version table:
<Sp4rKy>      0.101.1-1 0
<Sp4rKy>         500 http://archive.ubuntu.com edgy/universe Packages
<geser> and when you try to install libjack0.100.0-0 ?
<crimsun> and for libjack0.100.0-dev?
<Sp4rKy> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<Sp4rKy>   libjack0.100.0-0: Depends: libc6 (>= 2.4-1) but 2.3.6-0ubuntu20 is to be installed
<geser> doesn't this "...but it is not going to be installed" normally point to an error further down the depends?
<geser> is your puilder dapper or edgy?
<Sp4rKy> edgy
<Sp4rKy> i have to sleep
<Sp4rKy> i come back tomorrow
<bddebian> Gnight Sp4rKy
<Sp4rKy> thx for your help
<Sp4rKy> thx bddebian
<bddebian> No, Thank YOU :-)
<Sp4rKy> :D
<plugwash> geser yes it does, so you have to trace down the dependency chain until you find the real problem
<plugwash> and afaict the easiest way to do that is to try to install each package in the chain as apt reports it
<crimsun> To what package was Sp4rKy referring?
<crimsun> [source] 
<geser> I don't know which package he was trying to build
<geser> I looks like his pbuilder is a mix between dapper and edgy
<ajmitch> looks like he needed to do pbuilder upgrade
<crimsun> heh, I assumed he was doing that.
<crimsun> (so much for assuming)
<bddebian> :-)
<bddebian> djplay apparently
<bddebian> wb LaserJock :-)
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Time to head home, later gang
<LaserJock> cya bddebian
<bddebian> :-)
<Lutin> Hey
<LaserJock> hi
<Lutin> I have that message when compiling a package : /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lX11
<Lutin> do you know what is the missing lib ?
<crimsun> libX11-dev, for starters.
<LaserJock> thats the xorg dev
<crimsun> sorry, libx11-dev
<Lutin> ok, thanks
<zul> hey
<LaserJock> hi zul
<zul> hey lj how goes it?
<ajmitch> hi zul
<LaserJock> zul: it's going
<zul> good good
<LaserJock> I'm trying to figure out a reply to "Why in the world doesn't this bug have an assignee?"
<LaserJock> :-)
<zul> because no one cares? :)
<cbx33> which bug LaserJock ?
<LaserJock> Bug #43150
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 43150 in wxmaxima "wxmaxima fails with error, can't connect to maxima" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/43150
<zul> ah yeah i remember seing that oone
<LaserJock> the problem is that people can pretty easily fix it for them
<LaserJock> but I'm not sure why the bug even exists and how to go about fixing it
<zul> i dont use the software so i might end up breaking it
<LaserJock> zul: well it's interesting because it works fine in Debian
<zul> library issue?
<LaserJock> I don't know
<LaserJock> I don't even know how to tell
<LaserJock> maxima opens a port for GUIs to connect to
<LaserJock> in Debian it works
<LaserJock> in Ubuntu it can't connect
<LaserJock> apparently recompiling using a different LISP compiler works
<LaserJock> and I think somebody even mentioned that maybe recompiling using the same LISP compiler works
<LaserJock> not sure
<LaserJock> but we haven't touched the package or the compiler
<zul> ick lisp :)
<LaserJock> yes, the language of champions
<zul> heh...
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-15
<imbrandon> havent seen one of those in a while
* ajmitch returns
<LaserJock> hehe, are we supposed to clap or something? ;-)
<ajmitch> or run away screaming
<ajmitch> take your pick
<LaserJock> lol
<ajmitch> how are you?
<LaserJock> ajmitch: hangin' in there
<ajmitch> it's a start
<LaserJock> after this week I should hopefully be a tad less busy
<LaserJock> I'm trying to work on landscaping in the back yard a bit
<LaserJock> and doing some research
<LaserJock> but Ubuntu stuff is more fun most of the time
<welshbyte> good _("evening")
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yeah, I just met someone about some work - I'll be working part-time from next week
<ajmitch> leaving a bit of time for ubuntu
<TheMuso> Hey all.
<LaserJock> ajmitch: cool
<ajmitch> yeah, it should work out fairly well
<ajmitch> doing some sysadmin work on debian, and some coding
<LaserJock> cool
<bddebian> Heya gang
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<ajmitch> hello bddebian
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> More critiques on my critiques? :-)
* ajmitch hasn't been looking
<ajmitch> sigh
* ajmitch looks for the bug number to mark this one as a duplicate
<bddebian> Uh oh
<ajmitch> it's annoying when it's a duplicate of a fixed bug
<ajmitch> but the fix is only in edgy so far
* LaserJock wonders if his "production" box will survive the update-manager dist-upgrade to edgy
<LaserJock> it's telling me now it will take over 1hr just to install the packages
<LaserJock> surely that can't be right
<bddebian> Always a joy :-)
<LaserJock> hmm, that seems weird
<lfittl> bddebian: welcome back :)
<bddebian> lfittl: Thx :-)
<lfittl> bddebian: have started working on attal, may I ask what exactly you have changed in the diff?
<lfittl> bddebian: because it seems you added several files, I didn't dig deeper into it, but rather tried a clean cvs export + debian dir
<bddebian> lfittl: The entire data branch
<bddebian> lfittl: The build system expects themes to be in the tree now
<lfittl> bddebian: I know, I tried it with exporting the modules src2 and themes, and putting themes into the src2 directory, fixing the paths should work
<bddebian> Fixing the paths?
<lfittl> attal looks for the themes in /usr/local, I somehow have to set ATT_PREFIX, but it simply won't work
<bddebian> Oh.  Mine doesn't work?
<lfittl> yours does work, but as I said, I tried a clean export + debian dir
<lfittl> as I wanted to avoid the big diff
<bddebian> How would it be any less big since you have to include the themes trunk?
<bddebian> Or did you make your own orig.tar.gz?
<lfittl> I created my own orig.tar.gz, I know its bad, but simply works better in this case, as we are already doing a cvs checkout and creating our own orig tarball anyway
<bddebian> Aye
<lfittl> so you haven't changed any paths?
<bddebian> I'm checking, now that you mention it :-)
<bddebian> It's been so long ago ;-P
<lfittl> :)
<lfittl> I will try to get the upload to ubuntu done first, as I have a sponsor for all the debian packages, and I want to send them to him in one batch
<lfittl> and it will take some time until I have prepared my other packages for debian
<LaserJock> wahoo, 45 min to go
<LaserJock> I sure wish dpkg could be speaded up
<bddebian> lfittl: Hmm, it appears I did hack attalCommon.cpp
* lfittl takes a look
<lfittl> bddebian: seems like ATT_PREFIX is the way to go though, any idea how I can set this one? Environment vars don't seem to work, and I want to avoid modifying the makefiles if possible
<bddebian> Hack config.pro or create a devel.pro?
<lfittl> hmm
<lfittl> no way to set this by using a parameter to qmake-qt4?
<bddebian> Hey, I'm the dumb one here.. :-)
<lfittl> me too, have never used qmake before ;)
<lfittl> so its too dumb ones hacking around, that will give a nice package :D
<bddebian> :-)
<lfittl> s/too/two..
* bddebian breaks out the qmake manual
<lfittl> I start to hate this package again, I have been working 2 hours on it now, I somehow knew this would happen
<bddebian> :-)
<lfittl> btw., I dediced to not create a package for the cyberpunk theme, it is not usable yet
<lfittl> the reason for updating to a cvs snapshot were build fixes, right?
<lfittl> s/build/build system/
<LaserJock> anybody think it's ok to reject a bug that only happens with the fglrx drivers?
<lfittl> LaserJock: which bug exactly?
<LaserJock> Bug #46660
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 46660 in maxima "broken" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/46660
<gnomefreak> i think it should be changed to fglrx maybe
<lfittl> LaserJock: try to find out what exactly breaks, and then assign it to fglrx
<LaserJock> lfittl: cool, thanks
<bddebian> lfittl: qmake-qt4 ATT_PREFIX=/foo/bar Makefile.pro doesn't work?
<lfittl> bddebian: tried that one, but there is a slight possibility I had some changes applied with that, trying again
<lfittl> LaserJock: the chance that it will get resolved is still minimal, but at least its reported somewhere ;)
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> and if it moves from maxima to fglrx it makes my bug count go down ;-)
<lfittl> :)
<lfittl> bddebian: interesting, compilation now always fails with some error about ATT_PREFIX, hmm
<bddebian> sweet
<lfittl> building again with original tarball + debian dir..
<bddebian> Will fail on gcc 4.1 iirc
<lfittl> why do you think that?
<lfittl> attalCommon.cpp:63: error: 'ATT_PREFIX' was not declared in this scope
<lfittl> same error I had with the previous ones, I hate that
<bddebian> lfittl: I think I pulled from CVS because of some gcc 4.1 issues
<lfittl> bddebian: ah, good to know, as I somehow have to mention the cvs snapshot in the debian/changelog ;)
<lfittl> building now works again, I removed dE
<lfittl> argh
<bddebian> Removed what?
<lfittl> I removed the DEB_MAKE_INVOKE line from debian/rules to test something, and forgot to add it again
<lfittl> sry, pressed the enter key too early
<bddebian> :-)
<lfittl> now it works, with ATT_PREFIX added to the qmake-qt4 line, stupid me for removing DEB_MAKE_INVOKE, could have saved me lots of time not doing it ;)
<lfittl> do you want to take a final look at the packages before I search for somebody to upload? (don't you also have upload rights for universe? that would make this part easier)
<bddebian> Yeah, I can upload to Universe
<slomo> bddebian?
<bddebian> slomo: Sorry, that was for lfittl :-)
<lfittl> bddebian: REVU or upload somewhere else?
<bddebian> lfittl: Doesn't matter
<lfittl> bddebian: k, one last pbuilder test build, then I will upload to REVU, finally we will have updated attal packages :)
<bddebian> Sweet, thanks lfittl
<lfittl> thanks too :)
<slomo> crimsun: ping?
<crimsun> hi
<slomo> ah :) was your backporting yesterday successful and do you have something to test for me? :)
<crimsun> I haven't looked at the init code (non-alsa)
<crimsun> I'm fairly certain (95% confidence) it's not an alsa issue, and I _think_ I have a similar methodology for testing on the hardware here (laptop, however)
<lfittl> Is there a good reason why I would want to use my @ubuntu.com address, instead of my @fsfe.org one? just wondering if this affects any tools ;)
<lfittl> for maintainer fields and changelog entries
<crimsun> the former are whitelisted-ACCEPT
<crimsun> well, I guess it's moot now that we have soyuz
<lfittl> soyuz manages this with the launchpad teams, right?
<crimsun> so no, I guess there's no real incentive
<lfittl> k, thanks :)
<lfittl> bddebian: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2880
<hub> my upload got rejected
<hub> no reason
<hub> *sigh*
<hub> how can I know?
<crimsun> it normally states the reject reason
<crimsun> is the e-mail blank, or did you simply get no notification?
<lfittl> bddebian: I hope the credits in the changelog file are ok this way, if you want specific changes attributed to you, tell me ;)
<hub> crimsun: it doe snot
<hub> the mail says
<hub> Rejected:
<hub> hugin 0.6-0ubuntu1 was REJECTED.
<hub>         Component: main Section: graphics
<hub> ah crap.
<hub> wtf is "main"?
<crimsun> it's the main component
<crimsun> are you in core-dev?
<hub> yeah but why is it?
<hub> I'm supposed to upload to universe
<hub> or is that an error from the NEW queue processor
<hub> because it is not an automatic reject
<hub> the pacakge with dput a while ago
<crimsun>  hugin [Source]    0.6-0ubuntu2  Release  2006-08-10 16:50:05 EDT
<crimsun> that's in the NEW queue
<hub> ah right
<hub> there havebeen a 2 later
<crimsun> 1) it's still in NEW; 2) your version number is _lower_ than what's in the queue
<hub> crimsun: where can I see the queue?
<hub> crimsun: I uploaded 1 and 2
<hub> make sense, I'll wait then
<crimsun> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/edgy/+queue
<crimsun> not so mysterious :)
<hub> yeah
<hub> I keep that in mind
<hub> crimsun: is it real time?
<slomo> yes
<slomo> hub: libccc? do you have a upstream url? :)
<hub> http://live.gnome.org/Criawips/CriaCanvas
<slomo> thanks
<hub> it is missing the download link
<hub> I think it was on herzi blog
<bddebian> crimsun: Am I going to need a second nod before uploading attal?
<slomo> hub: svn is fine too :) i was just curious what it is and can do
<bddebian> do be do be doo
<lfittl> bddebian: will go to bed now, if there are any problems with attal, ping me or write mail, thx ;)
<lfittl> gn8 motu world
<bddebian> lf.. gah
<zul> do do do
<bddebian> Anyone?  Do I need a second nod for attal to upload?
<slomo> bddebian: is it a NEW package not synced from debian or somewhere else?
<bddebian> slomo: It's a new release from Upstream
<slomo> then get it up :)
<bddebian> Uhm.. ;-)
<imbrandon> ugh , how can this DD be getting diffrent lithian output than me ...... *thinks*
<tseng> different lintian version?
<tseng> runing it on different files?
<imbrandon> he is using sid, and i'm using a sid chroot, should be the same
<tseng> i think you can urn it on dsc or changes
<bddebian> Or .deb
<tseng> or .deb
<imbrandon> hrm i'm running it on *_source.changes he is running it on _i386.changes
<imbrandon> does that matter ?
<ajmitch> yes
<imbrandon> doh ok
<imbrandon> thats the problem then
* bddebian pulls down mythtv 0.19
<tseng> oh!
<bddebian> crimsun: Still around?
<imbrandon> ajmitch: i talked to the upstream of apt-mirror again today , he dident understand the debian/ubuntu versioning so i got him all streight and he liked my patches enough to give me svn commit access , yay \0/
<ajmitch> good
<zul> ...you can break it
<tseng> imbrandon: woo
<imbrandon> hehe
<bddebian> If mythtv is GPL, why is it in Universe?  Because of the plugins?
<tseng> read that line again
<tseng> and tell us what you meant
<imbrandon> so soon-ish i should be able just to sync it from debian to ubuntu ( with only one outstanding delta for the conf that will remain ) and upstream --> debian --> ubuntu will all finaly be in sync hehe
<bddebian> debian/copyright says mythtv is licensed under GPL
<tseng> you meant multiverse
<bddebian> Oh, heh, yeah
<bddebian> None of the deps/build-deps jump out at me as being non-free either?
<imbrandon> dumb question , has it ALWAYS been gpl ?
<imbrandon> dunno i've never used it so i have no idea, just shooting at the dark
<bddebian> Hmm, it has to be something with the encoders?
<imbrandon> s/at\ the/in\ the/g
<bddebian> Dunno
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<crimsun> bddebian: yes, the encoders.
<crimsun> bddebian: (and no, I'm not around still.)
<LaserJock> hmm, well getting kubuntu and xubuntu off is not working as well as I had thought :-)
<crimsun> as in purging?
<LaserJock> kubuntu-desktop and xubuntu-desktop that is
* bddebian gets no love :'-(
<bddebian> ;-P
<imbrandon> removing KUBUNTU , blasphmey , lol just teasin
<LaserJock> as in going back to stock ubuntu
<crimsun> that's straightforward. Remove libartsc* and libxfce*
<LaserJock> imbrandon: well, it's just to dist-upgrade to edgy, then it''l be back
<imbrandon> LaserJock: or remove kdebase*
<LaserJock> crimsun: hmm, maybe that would have been a good idea
<LaserJock> instead I found a long apt-get remove line on the web
<imbrandon> heh
<LaserJock> but for some reason it is uninstalling way more than just kubuntu and xfce stuff
<LaserJock> http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/puregnome.php
<imbrandon> hrm where can i get info on getting rid of this warning http://pastebin.ca/132052
<crimsun> well, what's in your postinst?
<crimsun> LaserJock: the libavahi-core4 part.
<imbrandon> crimsun: http://pastebin.ca/132056
<LaserJock> crimsun: you're talking to me?
<bddebian> LaserJock: Well he doesn't talk to me.. ;-P
<imbrandon> lol bddebian
<crimsun> LaserJock: you seem surprised that it's removing "way more than just kubuntu and xfce stuff"
<LaserJock> yeah, like latex, science apps, thunderbird, etc.
<ajmitch> LaserJock: you're better off without kubuntu, honestly
<zul> night
<LaserJock> all I want to do is get down to a system I can dist-upgrade with
<ajmitch> night zul
<ajmitch> LaserJock: this is why I was careful
<LaserJock> I can't seem to do it with both ubuntu and kubuntu on there
<ajmitch> and avoided dist-upgrade for most of it
<ajmitch> probably due to the apt upgrade
<LaserJock> well, I'm using update-manager
<ajmitch> recent apt ABI change, adept needs rebuilt iirc
<LaserJock> as mdz said to try it out
<ajmitch> fun
<ajmitch> it does require the archive to be somewhat consistent with regards to installable packages
<LaserJock> it seems to work, you just can't have both kubuntu and ubuntu on there or it can't resolve dependencies
<ajmitch> as I said
<LaserJock> anyhow, it's off and running now
<ajmitch> uh oh, rob's here :)
<LaserJock> took ~2hr on the computer at work :/
<welshbyte> imbrandon: i'm just a newb but at a guess it looks like lines 33 onwards aren't needed *duck*
<LaserJock> 30 min to download and 1 1/2 hr to install
<rob> :)
<bddebian> Hobbsee: So you going to be the new Kubuntu Queen? ;-)
<Hobbsee> hi all
<Hobbsee> bddebian: i've yet to read the meeting logs.
* Hobbsee is most curious to see what was said
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch
<nictuku> hi, I'm makign a python package with cdbs and python-central, but oddly it's only running dh_python and dh_pycentral for one of the binary packages, skipping the other
<LaserJock> mostly like "hmm, ok. whatever"
<nictuku> what could I be missing here?
<bddebian> nictuku: What's your build and/or install target look like in debian/rules?
<ajmitch> nictuku: you're missing the magic to make it work on all packages?
<crimsun> I'd override the binary-install target for each binary package that the source generates.
<ajmitch> http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy
<ajmitch> has how to do that manually
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: I though it was a little odd, but whatever :-)
<ajmitch> nictuku: does it use distutils?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: ah right
<nictuku> ajmitch, that way I would follow "the hard way".
<nictuku> yes it uses distutils
<nictuku> is this needed? include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/simple-patchsys.mk
<ajmitch> no, it's not
<ajmitch> with distutils it *ought* to work for each package
<LaserJock> if you are using simple-patchsys it is isn't it?
<crimsun> /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/simple-patchsys.mk is not necessary unless you're using it. You should not need to override binary-install if your package uses distutils.
<nictuku> maybe my setup.py is borked
<Hobbsee> hah.  it seems firefox really broke, looking at this meeting.
<ajmitch> looking at python-distutils.mk, it doesn't appear to run dh_pycentral multiple times
<nictuku> hmm
<ajmitch> to get that, we need cdbs 0.4.45
* ajmitch checks the current cdbs
<ajmitch> right, looks like we need to resync with debian
<ajmitch> requires UVF exception, of course
<DrkLrd> how do u become a maintainer?
<LaserJock> you learn how to package, and when you know what you are doing you can ask the Technical Board for upload rights
<DrkLrd> ah thanks LaserJock
<LaserJock> that's the short version
<imbrandon> short short version ;)
<imbrandon> hehehe
<DrkLrd> lol
<nictuku> I'll call dh_python and dh_pycentral manually for now, then
<imbrandon> brb more mt dew
<nictuku> ajmitch, thank you
<LaserJock> but you can help out all you want without becoming an uploader
<ajmitch> nictuku: I'll follow it up with mdz
<LaserJock> you just have to have your work sponsored
<DrkLrd> sponsored by whom?
<LaserJock> a MOTU
<imbrandon> any MOTU
<LaserJock> a person with upload rights
<DrkLrd> no one will sponser me cos i am very irregular here :D
<LaserJock> that's not a problem exactly
<crimsun> the source code speaks for itself.
<imbrandon> DrkLrd: you can do it via LP and REVU also
<kjm> How do you go about starting to help out?  Is there a maintained ToDo list?
<Hobbsee> !ping
<ubotu> pong
<LaserJock> as long as you do good work
<DrkLrd> !pong
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about pong - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<DrkLrd> lol
<imbrandon> kjm: in the /topic is a good place to start
<kjm> :) ty
<LaserJock> yeah, it's really hard to maintain a ToDo list
<DrkLrd> anyone here on edgy?
<LaserJock> but right now we are doing merge/sync to get Edgy update to Debian unstable
<ajmitch> nearly everyone
<imbrandon> DrkLrd: most of us
<DrkLrd> cool
<LaserJock> and doing bug fixes
<DrkLrd> i am still with dapper
<DrkLrd> finding bugs
<DrkLrd> :D
<LaserJock> I'm even bitting the bullet, I wasn't going to do it
<LaserJock> but it's nice to actually try the release you are working on ;-)
<DrkLrd> i thought of starting Teen ubuntu project
<imbrandon> easier to see what needs fixed too
<DrkLrd> so that teenagers can help a lot
<DrkLrd> u know provide them with a OS that does everything
<DrkLrd> customized ubuntu
<LaserJock> I thought that was Ubuntu ;-)
<imbrandon> DrkLrd: there are teen MOTU's age dosent matter much as long as you can do the work ;)
<DrkLrd> i know that mate
<DrkLrd> but this was other project i was goint o start :P
<kjm> bbl - just reinstalled XfCe, wanna check it out / config away
<DrkLrd> LaserJock, it doesnt have ROCK stars wallpapers dont play mp3 and vids by default
<DrkLrd> but ITS COOL
<imbrandon> cool i'm all for people helpnig but you might look into if its really needed or if you can just help ubuntu as a whole ;)
<bddebian> Except for us old farts :-)
<DrkLrd> imbrandon, am helpin ubuntu as much as i can
<DrkLrd> :)
<LaserJock> hmm, well I don't know that mp3's and vids matter, but perhaps theming might work
<DrkLrd> LaserJock, teen want mp3 and vids mate
<LaserJock> although I'm partial to the Ubuntu wallpaper
<LaserJock> DrkLrd: so does everybody else
<DrkLrd> LaserJock, there is a school exhibition mate and i cam showcasing edubuntu there  :)
<LaserJock> ah very cool
<DrkLrd> and will give away cd too :D
<LaserJock> great
<DrkLrd> damn am having problems
<LaserJock> I'm trying to get Edubuntu at my university
<DrkLrd> i updated
<DrkLrd> and then mplayer and totem play a vid fine for the first time and then go haywire when i play next movie
<DrkLrd> colours are all washed :(
<DrkLrd> LaserJock, u on ubuntu or kubuntu?
<imbrandon> DrkLrd: most of us use {both,all} to some extrent to test etc, we may focus in our own areas of intrest but at some point most MOTUS run them all
<DrkLrd> cool imbrandon
<imbrandon> s/MOTUS/MOTUs/g
<DrkLrd> i got all 4 of em on my lappy now
<DrkLrd> but i dont use kubuntu dunno why :)
<imbrandon> its all personal prefrence , i personaly run kubuntu most/90% of the time
<imbrandon> but like i said its personal prefrence
<DrkLrd> Oo
<DrkLrd> :)
<LaserJock> DrkLrd: I use both
<DrkLrd> edubuntu ?
<LaserJock> I don't really use edubuntu as I don't have a need for LTSP
<LaserJock> but I work on it
* bddebian does nothing
<Hobbsee> bddebian: get to it
* Hobbsee cracks her whip
<crimsun> (so I'm not sure what barry was asking about, since he hasn't actually addressed it? ;)
<bddebian> crimsun: ?
<crimsun> bddebian: what am I ignoring?
<bddebian> I forget now :-)
<ajmitch> senility...
<bddebian> Heh, no kidding
<ajmitch> I love cdbs
<ajmitch> it's so much fun
<DrkLrd> carthik, sup mate
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: exactly :D
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: I'm just trying to merge in the changes from debian that we need
<carthik> hey DrkLrd
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: ahhh...fun...
<ajmitch> as I said
<LaserJock> \o/ only 10 min of downloading left :-)
<ajmitch> yay
<ajmitch> ok, cdbs patches ported forward to 0.4.46
<bddebian> Bed time for this old man.  Gnight folks
<ajmitch> night bddebian
<imbrandon> gnight
<LaserJock> doh
<LaserJock> not fast enough, again
* ajmitch is glad to have 2 monitors for this
<ajmitch> makes compared patch hunks & applying them a lot easier
<ajmitch> s/compared/comparing/
<imbrandon> yup , exactly ajmitch
<imbrandon> i love dual monitors, once i got used to them i dunno how i did without them
<crimsun> the same way the rest of us poor folk do, vimdiff -g or its $EDITOR equiv.
<LaserJock> I'm still on a 17" CRT here at home :/
* imbrandon has a 20"crt and a 17" crt 
<kjm> kjm has 2 23" http://www.apple.com/ca/displays/specs.html
<LaserJock> nice
<kjm> got one from work to compliment.  They are gorgeus.
<kjm> Upgraded from a 17" CRT.  The difference was insane
<crimsun> hmm, my key for -security stills seems to be borked
<crimsun> anyone free to apply a debdiff?
<crimsun> (universe source, of course)
<imbrandon> crimsun: sure
<Gloubiboulga> crimsun, I'd be happy to sponsor your upload ;)
<imbrandon> you cant uplaod ?
<Gloubiboulga> ah, imbrandon, you're faster than I am
<imbrandon> heh
<crimsun> oh I can upload, but -security will silently reject it because it has a cached copy of my expired key
<crimsun> essentially "no, I can't upload"
<imbrandon> kk
<crimsun> imbrandon: http://www.trilug.org/~crimsun/oprofile_0.9.1-8ubuntu0.1.debdiff
<crimsun> dput stanza for -security:
<crimsun> [security] 
<crimsun> fqdn = security.upload.ubuntu.com
<crimsun> incoming = /
<crimsun> login = anonymous
<imbrandon> do i need to get the dapper source ?
<crimsun> yes
<imbrandon> k
<crimsun> thanks
<imbrandon> hrm ok patch applied so now i need to debuild it with my key so it uploads in my name right since your key wont work?
<crimsun> correct, dsc+source.changes+diff.gz will need to be signed with your key
<crimsun> I don't mind, obviously, if you want to change the e-mail attribution in debian/changelog , too
<imbrandon> kk done
<crimsun> I've already OKed it by pitti, so it doesn't matter who "gets credit for the upload"  [https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/security-review/2006-August/000425.html] 
<imbrandon> kk yea uploading now ...
<imbrandon> oprofile (0.9.1-8ubuntu0.1) dapper-security; urgency=low
<imbrandon>   * Sponsored upload for Daniel T Chen <crimsun@ubuntu.com>
<imbrandon> i put that at the top
<imbrandon> above what you added
<crimsun> no need, really, but ok
<imbrandon> heh wasent sure and had it done by the time you asaid so ;)
<imbrandon> ok upload done, i dunno what ML it comes accross but you might check it as i've never uploaded to -security before
<crimsun> you'll get an e-mail (your key)
<imbrandon> ohh yea
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> hrm no mail yet, hopefully it dosent silently die , http://pastebin.ca/132337
<crimsun> I'll just have to ping elmo again. Thanks anyway.
<imbrandon> np , sorry bout that , figured it would work heh
<imbrandon> unless it has i dunno how to tell without the ML or a email confromation
<imbrandon> but somehow i think it silently died
<crimsun> I dunno (-security uses a completely different workflow).
<StevenK> Yay!
<StevenK> My Dapper CDs turned up!
<crimsun> hoo-rah
<imbrandon> okies time for bed, gnight fellas ( any ladies if any are {arround,awake} )
<Sp4rKy> hi
<geser> hi
<Sp4rKy> i've some issue with libjack0.100.0-dev
<geser> it looks like you pbuilder is messed up as the version of libc6 listed yesterday points to dapper and not edgy
<geser> or not uptodate
<Sp4rKy> strange
<Sp4rKy> i've done a pbuilder update --override-config yesterday
<Sp4rKy> Sp4rKY-laptop% grep -i edgy ~/.pbuilderrc
<Sp4rKy> DISTRIBUTION=edgy
<Sp4rKy> Sp4rKY-laptop% grep -i dapper ~/.pbuilderrc
<Sp4rKy> Sp4rKY-laptop%
<Sp4rKy> do you have a edgy pbuilder ?
<geser> yes
<geser> have you tried to recreate the pbuilder?
<Sp4rKy> no
<Sp4rKy> just update
<Sp4rKy> go for recreate
<Sp4rKy> root@Sp4rKY-laptop:/# apt-cache policy libc6
<Sp4rKy> libc6:
<Sp4rKy>   Installed: 2.3.6-0ubuntu20
<Sp4rKy>   Candidate: 2.3.6-0ubuntu20
<Sp4rKy> is right ?
<Sp4rKy> do you have the same ?
<geser>      libc6 | 2.4-1ubuntu8 | http://archive.ubuntu.com edgy/main Packages
<Sp4rKy> oups
<Sp4rKy> strange
<Sp4rKy> recreating ...
<geser> I created my edgy pbuilder with sudo pbuilder create edgy
<Sp4rKy> i'm doing the same
<Sp4rKy> i hope it 'll work
<Sp4rKy> thx
<Sp4rKy> geser, works :D thx !!!
<Lutin> Hi
<Sp4rKy> hi Lutin
<Sp4rKy> ask you question and wait for an answer
<Seveas> neutrinomass, please join #ubuntu-bugs
<Lutin> do you know what is the library linked with the -lm flag ?
<thom> maths iirc
<StevenK> The math library
<Lutin> ok, thanks :)
* Hobbsee wavse
<Hobbsee> *waves
* ogra lols about Seveas' last mail to -users ...
* Fujitsu waves to Hobbsee.
<Seveas> ogra, hehe
* Hobbsee wonders what it was
* Hobbsee wants a laugh, after everything that's happened tonight.
* StevenK tickles Hobbsee.
<Seveas> Hobbsee, it actually was about you
<Seveas> Hobbsee, what happened tonight?
* Hobbsee tickles StevenK 
<Hobbsee> Seveas: car died, called up the onroad assistance, they took about 60 min to show up, they got my car down to be somewhere where it could be towed, tow truck was supposed to come in 60 mins, so i called htem again in an hour and 40 mins.  they were lost, everything was in a shambles, they didnt want to come tow my car, etc ("you've got heaps of government busses coming thru here, you can fit a tow truck!"), they eventually came, had mum hackin
<Hobbsee> to the dealer, etc,etc,etc....oh yeah.  and i almost walked in front of a bus in the process.  i finally got home 4 hours and 20 mins after i'd intended to.
<Seveas> woah...
* Seveas hugs Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> and my phone credit ran out in the process.
* Hobbsee hugs Seveas 
<Hobbsee> oh yeah.  and mum went thru my room as well.  grrr.
* ogra hugs Hobbsee 
* Hobbsee hugs ogra in return
<Fujitsu> Poor Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> oh yeah.  and they gave us an assignmetn to do in 51 hours.
<Hobbsee> deadline is tomorrow, 5pm
<Fujitsu> Terrific.
<Hobbsee> it was up earlier, they just didnt actually bother to go and *tell* anyone about it.  or when it was due.
<Hobbsee> just that "there is a physics assignment due sometime"
<Seveas> Hobbsee, this was the mail ogra lol'ed about: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-users/2006-August/090730.html
<Hobbsee> Seveas: hehe!  it really was about me!
<Seveas> Would I lie to you?
<Hobbsee> Seveas: make sure you add in there that i dont actually use gnome at all
<Hobbsee> true that
<Hobbsee> i thought you were joking
<Hobbsee> Seveas: a) i dont use gnome b) i rarely use dapper.  :P
<Hobbsee> oh yeah.  and with the stuff earlier, the fire alarms at the uni went off too.
<Goshawk> hi
<Sp4rKy> hi Goshawk
<phanatic> afternoon
<LaserJock> grr
<LaserJock> I can't seem to get edgy upgrades to work well
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: how so?
<LaserJock> I've tried 3 and I usually have major problems
<LaserJock> last nights try now won't boot
<Hobbsee> ah
<LaserJock> I mean, obviously it's Edgy and all
<LaserJock> but it'd be nice to actually be able to try it out sometime
<selinuxium> Hi all, I have just changed jobs which has freed up some time. So I want to get more involved. Is there a London LUG or something where I can get some mentoring? Or can I do that online>
<selinuxium> ?
<LaserJock> online is probably best for MOTU work
<Hobbsee> there's definetly a London LUG, i expect
<selinuxium> Hi LaserJock, I think I spoke to you about a year ago on this subject!
<thom> Hobbsee: there is, but i doubt GLLUG will be too interested in ubuntu mentoring
<selinuxium> Possibly less. I keep wanting to get more involved but the world gets in the way....
<Hobbsee> ah
<selinuxium> Hi Hobsee, The UK edition of Linux Format Magazine is nearly 50% Ubuntu with pics of dholbach and sabdfl !
<selinuxium> So is the easiest way to help still to do some packaging?
<LaserJock> work on bugs, merge packages from Debian into Edgy
<selinuxium> OK I now have a laptop that I can use in the lounge so the other half complains less that she doesn't see me! I will go through the Motu pages in the wiki again.
<QuestionMarkCoun> Hello *, can anybody here give me a hint, how to setup gpg for signing my own ubuntu cd images?
<Chons> QuestionMarkCoun: Why don't you take a look at the wiki?
<jdong|coreduo> can pbuilder use makeopts like -j2? I want things to be a bit more utilized on my multi-core box
<trygg> Heh, anyone know why i cant find anything when i 'apt-cache search gtk+-2.6'?
<Gloubiboulga> search for gtk2.0 :)
<QuestionMarkCoun> Chons: Ok, can you tell me where in the wiki?
<trygg> Gloubiboulga: I cant find anything thats 2.6 there either. I find libgtk-something and thats already newest version
<Gloubiboulga> trygg, are you trying to find the version 2.6 of gtk2?
<trygg> Gloubiboulga: Heh, 'Checking for gtk+-2.0 >= 2.6... failed'
<Gloubiboulga> trygg, the package you need is libgtk2.0-dev
<trygg> Ooh. :)
<Gloubiboulga> the 2.0 in the package name is not the version ;)
<trygg> Yeah i get that, but i didnt know which of the libs i needed. B)
<trygg> Thanks.
<LaserJock> jdong|coreduo: I think it can, just man pbuilder
<LaserJock> QuestionMarkCoun:
<LaserJock> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/GnuPrivacyGuardHowto
<trygg> Gloubiboulga: while were on the subject, is not mplayer supposed to be apt-getable? I only find kmplayer.
<Gloubiboulga> trygg, when you compile something, you usaully want to install -dev packages, they contain the .h files needed to buil, and informations about the library (such as CFLAGS)
<QuestionMarkCoun> LaserJock: thank you
<Sp4rKy> i need some help with lintian overiting
<penguin42> hi, I'm interested in what automated testing is performed prior to release for Ubuntu releases - I've seen the wiki/Testing page, but I'm more interested in automatic tests and things like memory use stats, and torture tests - is this the right place to ask?
<Sp4rKy> i've wrote "audacious source: package-name-doesnt-match-sonames libaudacious3.0.0" to debian/source.lintian-overrides but i've always my error with lintian
<bddebian> Heya gang
<welshbyte> yo bddebian
<bddebian> Hi welshbyte
<Sp4rKy> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hi Sp4rKy.  Any luck?
<Sp4rKy> just a few issue with audacious
<Sp4rKy> and djplay doesn't working at all
<bddebian> No? :-(
<Sp4rKy> bddebian, if you have a few minutes, could you help me with lintian ovverides ?
<bddebian> I can try
<Sp4rKy> no, at all :(
<Sp4rKy> thx
<Sp4rKy> i've this !
<Sp4rKy> s/!/:/
<Sp4rKy> Sp4rKY-laptop% cat debian/source.lintian-overrides
<Sp4rKy> audacious source: package-name-doesnt-match-sonames libaudacious3.0.0
<Sp4rKy> but when i use lintian with the /deb, i've always this warning
<Sp4rKy> bddebian (or other), any idea ?
<bddebian> Sp4rKy: Sorry, give me a sec
<bddebian> Sp4rKy: Did you add dh_lintian?
<Sp4rKy> nop :|
<Sp4rKy> how should i add it ?
<Sp4rKy> before dh_installdeb ?
<bddebian> Sp4rKy: Oh, it doesn't exist, nevermind
<Sp4rKy> :)
<bddebian> Sp4rKy: But I believe that you do have to install it into /usr/share/lintian/overrides/<package>
<Sp4rKy> ok
<Sp4rKy> but lintian will always say the same error even if i install it, right ?
<Toadstool> hi everybody
<Sp4rKy> hi Toadstool :)
<Toadstool> Sp4rKy: if you install your override file to /usr/share/lintian/overrides/<package> as bddebian said, lintian will read this file and ski the tests listed in it
<Toadstool> *skip even
<penguin42> if no one has any thoughts on my testing question, any suggestions where eles to ask?
<Sp4rKy> Toadstool, k
<carthik> penguin42, memory use tests and torture tests are generally to see the breaking point of hardware - may I ask why you are interested in that? In any case, you are welcome at #ubuntu or #ubuntu-bugs to ask questions regarding these. This is a just a channel for packagers, sort of.
<penguin42> carthik: I'm more interested in torture tests of the kernel - e.g. how it handles low memory; torture testing for filesystem or networking bugs; memory useage tests to know whether edgy will use more RAM than Dapper for example
<carthik> penguin42, not so sure this is the right place to continue the conversation. Please ask at #ubuntu or #ubuntu-bugs. Thanks.
<penguin42> ok, I've tried #ubuntu - I'll try #ubuntu-bugs
<penguin42> thanks
<kagou> hub, around ?
<hub> here
<hub> kagou: what was your question?
<kagou> hub, i can not found hugin on launchpad or on revu.tauware.de ?!
<kagou> hub, is it normal ?
<hub> kagou: still in the NEW queue
<hub> kagou: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/edgy/+queue?start=0
<hub> kagou: so it will have to wait until made available
<hub> kagou: as for REVU, make sure you displayed "Archived" uploads
<kagou> ok thanks hub
* thom supposes he should file a sync request for apache
<Goshawk> in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU?action=show&redirect=REVU i read: Be sure that you have a [WWW]  Launchpad account and that you have added your GPGKey to it. Then ask to [WWW]  be added to the Ubuntu Universe Contributors team. One of the REVU admins will add you then to the group (== Upload rights for REVU). i read this: To add your key, send a signed email with your GnuPG key ID asking to be added to the REVU keyring to
<Goshawk>  <keyring@tiber.tauware.de>. One of the REVU admins will add you to the uploaders keyring and reply to your email. You don't need a password to upload packages, only to log in to the website and to reply to comments. at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/ubuntu-upload.html . What should i do to have upload rights?
<Goshawk> sorry for this long message
<LaserJock> you  need a gpg key
<LaserJock> and you need to join the ubuntu-universe-contributors Launchpad team
<Goshawk> LaserJock: already done
<LaserJock> then upload something and see if it works
<LaserJock> :-)
<Goshawk> ok... so i don't need to mail the REVU admins
<LaserJock> no
<welshbyte> can i join that team on the off-chance that i'll be uploading something to REVU in the nearish future? :)
<LaserJock> it's open to anybody
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<welshbyte> groovy
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<welshbyte> now i just need to wait for the cd burning bug to get fixed so i can test my package on edgy
<DrkLrd> sup LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi DrkLrd
<LaserJock> yes, I think a BddebianForXGod page might be appropriate ;-)
<mc44> ha
<bddebian> I truly appreciate the love and admiration I get around here... ;-P
<LaserJock> that's good
<LaserJock> we don't want you to feel like we hate you or anything
<bddebian> heh
<mc44> I just hope they are expanding the dev team rather than iwj, doko and BenC having quit :-/
<thom> mc44: those three people have far bigger roles than just the stuff listed on the jobs page
<thom> so no worries there i think
<mc44> excellent :)
<Sp4rKy> Toadstool, doesn't works :/
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> zelazny.freenode.net
<lfittl> Somebody have some time to approve 4 sync bugs? (bug #56451, #56453, #56454, #56455)
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56451 in gnustep-examples "[Sync Request]  gnustep-examples 1:1.0.0-2" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56451
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56453 in gtamsanalyzer.app "[Sync Request]  gtamsanalyzer.app 0.42-2" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56453
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56454 in gworkspace "[Sync Request]  gworkspace 0.7.0-1.2" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56454
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56455 in helpviewer.app "[Sync Request]  helpviewer.app 0.3-3" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56455
<crimsun> lfittl: done.
<lfittl> crimsun: thanks :)
<bddebian> lfittl: Aren't you an MOTU yet? :-)
<lfittl> bddebian: not yet, I know Technical Board Meeting is now, but I don't think I have enough recent work, will apply when the next meeting comes ;)
<lfittl> bddebian: basic problem is, although I have those 10 packages maintained (and now 11 with attal), most of them did not have an upload except the initial one, because there were no bugs or new upstream versions
<crimsun> there are a dozen or so -dev applicants I've never heard of
<lfittl> bddebian: and that makes it look like I am not doing that much packaging work ;)
<lfittl> is there no cleanup script that removes them after some time?
<phanatic> lfittl: is your bzr management tool available for download?
<lfittl> phanatic: there is not much there yet, just calling some bzr stuff from PHP, I could make a bzr branch of it though if you are interested
<bddebian> lfittl: Ah
<phanatic> lfittl: i'm really interested, so if you have a little time, please put up a branch somewhere. thanks :)
<lfittl> phanatic: k, give me 20 mins to add licenses and stuff :)
<phanatic> lfittl: k :)
<lfittl> phanatic: are you also interested in the database structures that are needed for it to run? (basically user auth table + branch information, postgresql)
<phanatic> lfittl: of course, since i'd like to test it, too :)
<Toadstool> re
<bddebian> Bah, no better test than production ;-P
<bddebian> wb Toadstool
<lfittl> :)
<lfittl> phanatic: hmm, sshfs won't work, add another 10 min to that
<Toadstool> hey bddebian
<phanatic> lfittl: okay, i'll be here till midnight (i'm pretty sure we're in the same tz)
<lfittl> phanatic: good, and you're right, we are in the same tz :)
<Toadstool> gnomefreak: around?
<gnomefreak> yep
<Toadstool> hi
<gnomefreak> hi :)
<Toadstool> have you seen that the sync for gnomebaker's been rejected?
<gnomefreak> yeah
<Laser_away> so was there a TB meeting or no?
<gnomefreak> Laser_away: not really
<sander_> Hello. I'be been waiting over a month now for a sync from Debian for my package. Could anyone take a look at it? I think it's fallen though the cracks :-)
<Toadstool> gnomefreak: d'you want to prepare a "merge"?
<gnomefreak> Toadstool: im not sure how to doa  manual merge
<lfittl> phanatic: oh, and you will need some rewrite rules too, I will add mine for lighttpd, but if you use apache you have to write them yourself ;)
<gnomefreak> and im leaving town til sunday tomorrow morning
<phanatic> lfittl: i hope that will be the biggest issue ;)
<Toadstool> hi LaserJock
<lfittl> phanatic: me too ;)
<gnomefreak> is there any docs on how to do a manual merge that i can look at see if i have time tonight to run through it
<Toadstool> gnomefreak: crimsun's MOTU School session ;)
<Toadstool> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/Merging-and-Syncing
<gnomefreak> yeah i got lost in that
<Toadstool> gnomefreak: basically, you just have to get the magical script on merges.ubuntu.com, have it grab the different package version for you and then merge-buildpackage the merged package
<LaserJock> I also have a bit of a merge tutorial in the packaging guide
<LaserJock> but it's a bit outdate
<LaserJock> d
<gnomefreak> thats it?
<gnomefreak> i dont have to manually go into files change things rebuild than merge?
<LaserJock> well, you have to figure out why an ubuntuX package was there in the first place
<Toadstool> yep
<LaserJock> and make any changes necessary to keep that
<gnomefreak> the report tells me that i thought
<gnomefreak> let me grab the packages real fast
<bddebian> sander_: What is it?
<Toadstool> gnomefreak: hmm, if they are conflicting diff between the ubuntu and debian versions, you'll have to check whether you want to keep ubuntu specific changes in the package (which I doubt since you and I have already checked the package for the sync)
<sander_> it's gnome-hearts. It hit debian on July 5 before UVF and it's still not in edgy. See bug 53544
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 53544 in Ubuntu "Please sync gnome-hearts from Debian" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/53544
<bddebian> sander_: I'll try to take a look
<sander_> Thanks :-)
<Toadstool> gnomefreak: if you want to "justify" the sync, merge the icon path thing in the desktop file ;)
<Toadstool> s/sync/merge/
<kagou> hub, i can't find information on "iie". Do you have a link for ?
<gnomefreak> im having issues runnign the script atm
<gnomefreak> ok its grabbing the files
<hub> kagou: somewhere
<hub> kagou: http://dev.mmgsecurity.com/projects/iie/
<hub> found with google
<LaserJock> ok, so I'm 0 for 2 today with edgy upgrades :/
<kagou> thnx hub (i'm doing modifications on photo team page)
<hub> where is the best place to ask about adding thieself to Planet? mostly a bzr issue
<gnomefreak> LaserJock: do you have your how to on merges handy?
<LaserJock> gnomefreak: it's in the Packaging Guide (look on help.ubuntu.com)
<gnomefreak> k i think i have that page
<gnomefreak> ty
<Toadstool> good night everybody
<bddebian> Whoa, just booted DSL on my Windows machine.. Pretty cool
<bddebian> Gnight Toadstool
<gnomefreak> Toadstool: since we both looked at it and decided that debians is newer all i really have to do is merge-buildpackage?
<gnomefreak> night
<lfittl> phanatic: just doing some quick bug fixes, expect it in 15 mins ;)
<phanatic> lfittl: great :)
<bddebian> Later folks
<lfittl> phanatic: creating the branch now, that takes some minutes again, sry
<phanatic> lfittl: no problem, i can wait :)
<lfittl> phanatic: good :)
<lfittl> phanatic: http://projects.ixios-software.com/bzr-wmt
<phanatic> lfittl: thanks a lot :)
<lfittl> phanatic: no problem, please report bugs, there is a good chance there is a lot of them still in there, and remember its in early development ;)
<lfittl> phanatic: will create a launchpad product for it, makes the bug reporting part easier :)
<phanatic> lfittl: great, expect to hear some stuff from me :) i'll have something to play around for the trip tomorrow :)
<lfittl> phanatic: perfect, mail me if you have questions and I am not online
<phanatic> lfittl: k
<lfittl> phanatic: one last note, GeSHI is only required if you want to use view.php, and you need the development version, not the stable one
<phanatic> lfittl: what's GeSHI btw? :)
<lfittl> phanatic: Generic Syntax Highlighter -> http://qbnz.com/highlighter/ ;)
<lfittl> phanatic: useful tool if you want to highlight something in PHP
<phanatic> lfittl: oh, good to know, thanks :)
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-16
<lfittl> phanatic: launchpad product is bzr-wmt (https://launchpad.net/products/bzr-wmt)
<phanatic> lfittl: subscribed ;)
<lfittl> :)
<phanatic> oh, ubuntu bug day again... i'm away again...
<lfittl> and I have to work :/
<lfittl> why aren't there bug days on the weekend, that would be nicer..
<lfittl> should go to bed, gn8 everybody
<phanatic> lfittl: me too, good night :)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<imbrandon> heya bddebian
<bddebian> Hi imbrandon
<LaserJock> hi bddebian and imbrandon
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<imbrandon> heya LaserJock
<imbrandon> content lacking atm ( havent re-imported all my old stuff from my old blog yet ) can i get some opinions on my {gimp,photoshop} and layout work on the new wordpessized http://www.imbrandon.com
<imbrandon> LaserJock , bddebian ^^ ( and anyone else that cares to waste 5 minutes )
<crimsun> wordpressed, you mean?
<imbrandon> heh yea
<crimsun> heh, I was wondering what "wordpessized" entail
<crimsun> +ed
<bddebian> Nice :-)
<bddebian> crimsun: I remember what I was going to ask you.  What issues should I look for in mythtv from Marillat?
<imbrandon> heh well it was ahome grown php solution before , i decided i was spending more time coding the blog then bloging so i installed wordpress and am converting my old db posts ;)
<trygg> Heh, why cant i apt-get mplayer? I only find kmplayer.
<imbrandon> trygg: you need universe and multiverse enabled
<imbrandon> !repos
<ubotu> The packages in Ubuntu are divided into several sections. See http://www.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/components https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Repositories and !easysource
<trygg> imbrandon: i have them enabled!
<trygg> Thats the wierd thing.
<LaserJock> make sure you have updated
<LaserJock> because it's in there
<imbrandon> brandon@voyager:~$ apt-cache madison mplayer
<imbrandon>    mplayer | 2:0.99+1.0pre8-0ubuntu4 | http://192.168.1.5 edgy/multiverse Packages
<imbrandon>    mplayer | 2:0.99+1.0pre8-0ubuntu4 | http://archive.ubuntu.com edgy/multiverse Packages
<crimsun> bddebian: "everything".
<trygg> madison mplayer?
<LaserJock> madison gives you information about a package
<trygg> Even if i update it wont find it, it says it has no installation candidate
<bddebian> crimsun: Well it looks pretty clean afaict
<imbrandon> trygg: pastebin your sources.list and lets take this to #{k}ubuntu
<crimsun> lin{tian,da}-clean?
<bddebian> crimsun: Me?  I haven't checked that yet.  I'm test-building it now
<trygg> imbrandon: they said i should go here. :p
<imbrandon> trygg: well this isnt a support channel but i'll be more than happy to help you in #kubuntu if you pastbein your sources.list and give me the url in there so we do not clutter up this channell any further
<trygg> Gotcha.
<imbrandon> i think that was the shortest TB meeting ever
<imbrandon> heh
<crimsun> did any candidates even bother to show?
<TheMuso> Were there any?
<imbrandon> no it was a whole 8 minutes .... hold on
<crimsun> TheMuso: a couple iirc, but I didn't recognise them
<imbrandon> http://pastebin.ca/133614
<imbrandon> one whole screen , not even that
<imbrandon> heh
<TheMuso> heh
<crimsun> lovely. :D
<jsgotangco> lol
<TheMuso> Hahahahaha!
<bddebian> When was the meeting?  I tried to join.
<jsgotangco> that was tight and intense
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> bddebian: you came in after I did I think
<bddebian> Hmm
<TheMuso> Yow! The latest alternate i386 image is big.
<heras> Hi everyone, I've got a question about MOTU-School so I thought I'd ask here. Afew days ago I joined a session on packaging, hosted by Laserjock.
<bddebian> Hi heras
<bddebian> Shoot
<imbrandon> ok heras ask away
<heras> Now I want more. Is there an announce list of what, where and when on MOTU-School? Couldn't find it on the wiki page ...
<imbrandon> bddebian: it was about 4 hours ago from ym logs
<LaserJock> heras: it will be on the MOTU School wiki page
<imbrandon> heras: they are announced on the Fridge and on the Fridge Calendar and also ..... /me looks for the mailing list
<LaserJock> we just need teachers to sign up
<LaserJock> it's a lot of work
<LaserJock> wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/Requests is the list of requested topics
<heras> Yes, and it's very much appreciated :)
<imbrandon> heras: seems they are sent to ubuntu-motu, ubuntu-devel, kubuntu-devel
<imbrandon> Mailing list also
<heras> wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/Requests: excellent!
<LaserJock> I just need to poke somebody to sign up for next week
<LaserJock> *cough*bddebian*cough*
<imbrandon> ;P
<heras> I may end up contributing a package yet :D
<LaserJock> good
<LaserJock> we are also getting a sticky on the ubuntu forums
<imbrandon> you can help with existing packages , merges, and syncs too ;)
<heras> MAybe Ubuntu_demon can make a subforum for it. I'll ask him.
<LaserJock> I don't know that we need a subforum
<LaserJock> most of the actual material should stay on the wiki
<LaserJock> but a sticky for announcements is good
<imbrandon> yea
<heras> Well, The fridge posted your session after it was done (the fisrt session)...
<LaserJock> well, we just need to get better about annoucements
<LaserJock> and plan before hand
<LaserJock> but this is a significant time drain so it's not always easy to do
<heras> Anyway, I think MOTU-School is really cool, I'll be joining as often as I can. Thank you for your effort and time!
<LaserJock> thanks for joining in
<LaserJock> we're glad that people appreciate it
<heras> Ok :) thanks again and good night. Bed time for me.
<ajmitch> hi
<imbrandon> heya ajmitch
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<gnomefreak> hey does anyone feel like merging gnomebaker? im heading out of town in like 8 hours (my night time here) and i wont be back for a week or so? oh and it cant be synced its a manual merge(if that makes sense)
<gnomefreak> after about an hour fighting with merge-buildpackage i threw up hands for now. so if someone wants it take it
<bddebian> I don't do gnome packages anymore since I get in trouble :-)
<crimsun> I'll look at it, assign it to me please.
<gnomefreak> wtf just happened
<crimsun> (I already got the rejected sync request)
<gnomefreak> crimsun: i dont know how to assgin it siretart let me have it to learn on
<crimsun> which bug?
<crimsun> (no access to my e-mail atm)
<gnomefreak> k hold on
<gnomefreak> crimsun: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gnomebaker/+bug/56001
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56001 in gnomebaker "[Edgy MoM]  Please sync gnomebaker" [Untriaged,Rejected] 
<imbrandon> anyone know what would cause this on an apt-get upgrade ? http://hashphp.org/pastebin.php?pid=8143  <-- a friend at my lug is getting it
<gnomefreak> wth is happening here :(
<crimsun> gnomefreak: click the name of the source package under Affects, then change Assigned to
<gnomefreak> k
<ajmitch> imbrandon: yes
<tseng> bddebian: < sigh
<imbrandon> ajmitch: and that is ?
<tseng> bddebian: please hurt him
<ajmitch> imbrandon: your friend has source that's most likely python 2.4-specific
<ajmitch> Five is a zope product meant to provide zope 3 stuff on zope 2.x
<imbrandon> in his sources.list ?
<bddebian> tseng: :-)  Well I am curious what to do with snort
<ajmitch> imbrandon: I've seen this error before :)
<ajmitch> imbrandon: no, I mean the python source
<gnomefreak> k its yours crimsun
<imbrandon> mind if i ask him to pop in here or do you mind joining #kclug to help us get this fixed up ?
<crimsun> gnomefreak: k.
<imbrandon> ajmitch: ^^
<ajmitch> imbrandon: is he trying to upgrade to dapper?
<gnomefreak> ok i just had my backgrounds die on me brb
<bddebian> crimsun: Well mythtv seems pretty linda/lintian clean
<crimsun> ok, have you checked with funnyhat/whomever and the rest of the motumedia team for mythtv 0.19x plans?
<crimsun> (frankly I don't know of any plans, so afaic, go nuts and upload it)
<imbrandon> ajmitch: thanks for heling him ( or trying to ) , bbiab
<imbrandon> s/heling/helping
<welshbyte> re: https://launchpad.net/+builds/+build/236934 when do these builds happen then? does it need someone to tweak the package first?
<ajmitch> they happen automatically
<ajmitch> there's a queue of packages that need built
<welshbyte> ah ok
<ajmitch> of course, you can usually view some of these queues when launchpad isn't breaking & complaining
<welshbyte> i guess i'm still not sure of how the initial packaging --> binary package propagating to repositories flow works... is there a wiki page?
<bddebian> crimsun: FunnyLookinHat was looking at it but didn't have time I guess
<ajmitch> welshbyte: we upload source packages, they go into a queue for building if there are no new source/binary packages
<ajmitch> it can take a little while
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: you mean there are times when it isnt broken?  :P
<ajmitch> https://launchpad.net/+builds <- we can see that the buildds are busy doing stuff
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: so they claim
<Hobbsee> hah
<welshbyte> heh another nook of launchpad i've never seen before.. that thing needs a sitemap
<ajmitch> it's a house that keeps getting rooms tacked on
<zul> or when people ask to sync cdbs
<ajmitch> you should be able to look at https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/edgy/+builds
<ajmitch> except that it probably gives a timeout
* ajmitch ignores zul 
<zul> heh
<Hobbsee> yay for gnomebaker.  manual merge
<bddebian> Anyone have any thoughts/cares about snort?
<welshbyte> i try to stay off the coke, myself :)
<TheMuso> lol
* welshbyte crawls into a hole
<Hobbsee> hehe
<ajmitch> bddebian: go ahead & do it, noone's stopping you
<bddebian> ajmitch: That isn't the point
<TheMuso> Anybody know how such a problem like what is shown in this build log: http://librarian.launchpad.net/3916301/buildlog_ubuntu-edgy-powerpc.xawtv_3.94-1.2ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz can be solved?
<TheMuso> Package built ok on amd64, i386, and sparc. Needs building on ia64, but when the first attemt was made, the same error occurred.
<TheMuso> I am trying it in a powerpc pbuilder again to see what happens here.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: console/fbtools.c:427: error: 'PAGE_MASK' undeclared (first use in this function)
<Hobbsee> correct header file not included, or something?
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I don''t know. I am waiting for my powerpc pbuilder to finish to see what happens.
<TheMuso> It is still working out deps. :)
<Hobbsee> hah
<Hobbsee> yeah
<TheMuso> It is only a powermac G3 300 after all.
<DarkMageZ> could someone have alook @ this .diff, patch is crying about line 286 and i just have no idea why http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20724
<ajmitch> DarkMageZ: explain what patch is doing - is it rejecting that patch hunk?
<DarkMageZ> " **** malformed patch at line 286: --- rhythmbox-0.9.5.orig/debian/rules
<DarkMageZ> "
<ajmitch> fun
<ajmitch> how are you trying to apply this?
<bddebian> Heya DarkMageZ
<bddebian> Damn I hate outdated packages :-(
<DarkMageZ> patch -p1 -i ../*patchname*
<welshbyte> is it line 286 of the patch or the rules file?
<ajmitch> against a clean upstream tarball?
<ajmitch> unpacked tarball, that is
<DarkMageZ> i'm trying to apply it against cvs, it was working last night (but other things wern't working then) so i ditched all my work and started again
<bddebian> If we jump Debian from Upstream, do we automatically become the "Ubuntu maintainer"?
<ajmitch> generally not
<DarkMageZ> the cvs version of that file i'm trying to change hasn't changed in 2 years. i'm guessing i've just made some stupid mistake in the patch... tho i was very very careful
<bddebian> Damn I hate not knowing what the "right" thing to do is
<DarkMageZ> i've probably spent about 6 hours trying to build this package in total... and the patch only changes things in the /debian/ directory which hasn't changed in 2 years
<LaserJock> bddebian: the right thing to do is help me figure out what the heck happended to edgy to make it not boot for me :-)
<bddebian> LaserJock: What's happening?
<LaserJock> I get this weird thing were it can't find / when booting
<LaserJock> apparently it's happend in dapper to a lot of people
<bddebian> LVM?
<LaserJock> on 1 yes, on the other no
<bddebian> Hmm
<LaserJock> I've tried 2 today and got the same problem
<bddebian> Doh
<LaserJock> one I was able to edit grub to point to /dev/mapper/ubuntu-root
<LaserJock> for LVM and it seems ok
<LaserJock> but the other one I just have no idea
<LaserJock> and I ended up having to reinstall dapper
<bddebian> The non-lvm one is the one that doesn't boot?
<LaserJock> well, I wiped the hard drive and installed dapper
<LaserJock> but I'd like to try edgy again
<ajmitch> did the initramfs have the appropriate drivers in it?
* ajmitch has seen initramfs with no drivers occur on edgy
<bddebian> Aye
<LaserJock> I think so
<welshbyte> i've heard of people having trouble with the UUID's in the grub config but that was in the context of RAID arrays
<LaserJock> it just hangs on "waiting for  root filesystem"
<LaserJock> welshbyte: yeah, something like that
<welshbyte> could try replacing the UUID with /dev/hdX
<ajmitch> LaserJock: quite usual if the drivers aren't there or LVM isn't initialised
<ajmitch> also quite annoying
<LaserJock> welshbyte: tried that
<ajmitch> LaserJock: dapper or edgy?
<LaserJock> edgy
<LaserJock> dapper worked fine, on both machines
<LaserJock> the current problem one doesn't use LVM
<ajmitch> tried with /dev/sdX then?
<LaserJock> yes
<ajmitch> great
<welshbyte> hmm
<ajmitch> it woud have eventually dropped you to a shell
<LaserJock> tried all combinations of /dev/sdX and /dev/hdX I could think of
<ajmitch> where you could check what's there
<welshbyte> no need to think, grub has tab complete ;)
<LaserJock> it didn't work
<LaserJock> it couldn't find anything
<ajmitch> welshbyte: tab completion is useless there
<welshbyte> oh :/
<welshbyte> oh yeah, only works with the (hdx,y) format doesn't it
<ajmitch> LaserJock: are you currently using that machine, or do you have it with you?
<LaserJock> I'm not using it right now
<LaserJock> it's about 4 ft from me ;-)
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> can you start it & let it drop to busybox after the timeout?
<LaserJock> well, I'm dist-upgrading so it'll take a bit ;-)
<LaserJock> I'll let you know when I'm ready
<jsgotangco> lol Redhat network is not available at the moment grrrr
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> hrm i need to find a good regex primer /me google's
* welshbyte trundles off to get some sleep
<FunnyLookinHat> bddebian, were you looking into the new marillat package for mythtv 0.19 or was that someone else?  I cannot recall
<FunnyLookinHat> I'm about ready to get back into the swing of things this weekend after my move and wanted to catch up on the progress of that
<ausimage> I was wondering what is the status of updating Deps on Pysol and Scribus to the current Edgy Python packages. It has been stalled for weeks.
<FunnyLookinHat> ausimage, is there a bug out for it?  there may be comments pending it's status
<ausimage> I filed bug #56281 for pysol
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56281 in pysol "Edgy Dependency Issue" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56281
<ausimage> though I forgot for scribus
<bddebian> FunnyLookinHat: I filed a sync request for it :-)
<FunnyLookinHat> bddebian, oh awesome, sweet.  Now I don't have to make my first package submission that horrible project  ; )
<ausimage> bddebian both Pysol and Scribus?
<FunnyLookinHat> ausimage, he was referring to mythtv I believe
<ausimage> oh
<FunnyLookinHat> ausimage, that bug hasn't yet been confirmed nor triaged...  hopefully the team will get to it in the next day or so, they are about to begin a huge bug sorting event tomorow
<bddebian> ausimage: Scribus is in main
<ausimage> K... then I will make it is noted then
<ajmitch> looks like pysol needs remerged anyway
<bddebian> Aye but he left :-)
* ajmitch is surprised Hobbsee hasn't done it already
<Hobbsee> why would i?
* Hobbsee is currently dealing with kopete
<ajmitch> because you're doing every other merge there?
<bddebian> Every other merge where?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: far from it.
<ajmitch> mmm
<ajmitch> 24" panel for $1300 NZD
<ajmitch> if only I could..
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> hrm am i doing this right ..... will " ^Subject. \[Bug.+\]  " match something like "Subject: [Bug #3534532]  dfgdftw sdfs sdf"
* imbrandon hates regex sometimes
<imbrandon> fskin mail filters gonna kill me sooner or later
<imbrandon> ^Subject. \[Bug.+?\]  .... hrm i need a way to check these against strings before i put them in .procmailrc
<ajmitch> grep
<ajmitch> or egrep, as the case may be
<imbrandon> egrep?
<imbrandon> hrem grep dosent like ^ or $
* TheMuso notices an update for xawtv, and goes to merge.
<TheMuso> Which will hopefully fix the ia64/powerpc problems.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: it ftbfs or is complicated.  either one.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: ?
<TheMuso> You mean the build log I pasted earlier?
<TheMuso> Well it matters not now.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: xawtv - i actually meant the merge of it
<TheMuso> Tis actually not very complicated at all, but a lot has changed in the debian version.
<Hobbsee> ah
<Hobbsee> right
<Hobbsee> that was probably it, whihc is why i didnt merge it myself
* TheMuso executes a pbuilder session for xawtv on two machines simultaneously, i386, and powerpc.
<Laser_away> ajmitch: hmm, it didn't happen the second time
<Laser_away> but I gotta get going, so I'll have to fight with nvidia tomorrow, at least I can boot now
<ajmitch> have fun
<jsgotangco> fight nvidia?
<jsgotangco> good luck!
<TheMuso> phew. Merged version of xawtv builds fine on i386.
* TheMuso waits for powerpc.
<TheMuso> Damn! Same error on powerpc as previous version.
* TheMuso decides to wait until tonight, and probe some devs about the build probs with xawtv on powerpc.
<bddebian> Gnight folks
* hub found some new food to package
<Sp4rKy> hey
<LaserJock> wow, it's a party place in here tonight :-)
<Hobbsee> hi Sp4rKy
* Hobbsee explodes a party cracker over LaserJock's head
<Sp4rKy> :)
* Sp4rKy working on audacious packaging ...
* LaserJock launches a bottle rocket in Hobbsee's direction
<Hobbsee> yay :)
<LaserJock> but it fails miserably and lands in the Pacific ;-)
* Hobbsee diverts it so that it attacks ajmitch 
<Hobbsee> haha
* Fujitsu saves ajmitch.
<LaserJock> taken one for the team
<Sp4rKy> if i change OBJECTIVE_SONAME_SUFFIX in Makefile.in , that will change the real name of the library or only is soname
<LaserJock> taking
<LaserJock> I meant
<Sp4rKy> ??
<LaserJock> taking one for the team, regarding Fujitsu's attempt to save ajmitch
<Fujitsu> Yep, there are few enough of us....
<Sp4rKy> and nobody could take a few second to help a desperate packager ?
<Hobbsee> Sp4rKy: probably just that we dont know, or something
<Toadstool> 'morning everybody
<Sp4rKy> heya Toadstool :)
<Toadstool> hi Sp4rKy
<Sp4rKy> Hobbsee, rhoooo :(
<Sp4rKy> Toadstool, i'm (re)building audacious
<imbrandon> would i be out of line asking bluefoxy to tone down the language a bit, we all slip now and then but it seems almost more from him and almost intentional at time , just to see if he can push the limits of -devel
<imbrandon> nvm
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: no, i doubt it.  but you'd probably need to be prepared for any responses you get.
<LaserJock> imbrandon: it would be nice at some point
<TheMuso> hehe imbrandon that was very well worded. :)
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> cept for the normal typos from me ...
<imbrandon> lol
<TheMuso> Did he PM you?
<imbrandon> no
<TheMuso> Might have gone to bed.
<TheMuso> I would be sure he would respond.
<imbrandon> dunno heh
<TheMuso> I thought he would anyway
<Hobbsee> more likely to respond via a blog post,i expect
<TheMuso> heh true tha.
<TheMuso> that
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> anyhow, so whats new in the MOTU world ? anything ?
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: you on the -motu mailing list?  there's some stuff there, i think
<imbrandon> yea
<imbrandon> woot , i just realized my nick was over a year old on freenode ;) Registered: 1 year 4 weeks 1 day (3h 3m 5s) ago
<imbrandon> not that that matters i guess heh ;)
<Amaranth> 3 years 18 weeks 1 day (6h 59m 39s) ago
<imbrandon> Amaranth: nice ;)
<imbrandon> heh
<Amaranth> i had another nick for about a year, can't remember what it was
<imbrandon> yea i had another nick on here  a long while back but i forgot it also
<imbrandon> never used it much
<imbrandon> on this netwrk that is
* Hobbsee got registered 49 weeks ago.
<imbrandon> hehe
<imbrandon> beat ya by ~7 weeks lol
<Hobbsee> true
<imbrandon> just barely hehe
<Hobbsee> actually, the scary thing is that means i've only been using linux a bit longer than that.
<imbrandon> heh
<Hobbsee> and am already a dev
<imbrandon> ;)
<imbrandon> heh i think ajmitch has most of us beat with almost 6 years ;)
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: But you're one of those people who just picks things up quickly.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: that is true.
<LaserJock> imbrandon: how do you figure that out?
<imbrandon>  /msg nickserv info LaserJock
<imbrandon> ;)
<imbrandon> looks like you and Hobbsee are almost dead even ;)
<ajmitch> imbrandon: so I'm a slow learner..
<imbrandon> hehehe
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: mwuahahaha
<LaserJock> beat hear by 2 days
<LaserJock> her
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: sorry mate.
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: hehe
<TheMuso> Registered: 1 year 43 weeks 1 day (20h 49m 45s) ago
<LaserJock> but I've been using Linux for longer so I guess it evens out
<imbrandon> yea i started my linux trek sometime in 95 and started actualy USING it pretty much full time at work 97ish and on the desktop in 2001ish
<ajmitch> oh joy, Hobbsee is going nuts again in other channels
<imbrandon> lol
<LaserJock> sabdfl's got 2 years
<imbrandon> ajmitch: u-o ?
<ajmitch> imbrandon: of course
<imbrandon> heh
<ajmitch> I got booted from there with no reason
<imbrandon> i took that off my autojoin last week , too many tabs
<imbrandon> if i could just get used to irssi hehe
<ajmitch> no point me rejoining, I'll just get booted
<imbrandon> lol
<Amaranth> ajmitch: Bad aim. :)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: sorry about that mate - bad nick completion.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: excuses
* Hobbsee hugs ajmitch 
* imbrandon hands ajmitch a pointy stick ( just in case )
<ajmitch> imbrandon: I'm not going to use that on her
<imbrandon> heh
<TheMuso> hahahaha
* Hobbsee knows where ajmitch lives.  quite wise.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you know a general area
<crimsun> we've been through this before ;)
<imbrandon> actualy i seen ubugtu clue-by-four someone the other day, i about fell out of my seat laughing litterly
<ajmitch> crimsun: only a few hours ago
<imbrandon> i know the general areat too, its on the ubuntu-dev world map ;)
<imbrandon> area*
<imbrandon> ajmitch: is the only circle on the whole island ( leaste on that map )
<ajmitch> horrendously inaccurate thing
* Hobbsee did have an address, but didnt write it down.
<Laser_away> good night guys, and Hobbsee
<ajmitch> night
<imbrandon> night
<Hobbsee> night Laser_away
<ajmitch> imbrandon: besides, I haven't had anyone come & visit me yet :)
<imbrandon> hehe
<ajmitch> apart from LCA at the start of the year, of course
<imbrandon> lca ?
<ajmitch> linux.conf.au
<imbrandon> ahh cool
<imbrandon> yea i wanna make it to one of those here in the US sometime, probably not this year though obviously
<imbrandon> ubucon would be cool too
* ajmitch wonders if he'll bother with dinner tonight
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: yes you will.
<ajmitch> I will?
<ajmitch> are you going to force-feed me or something?
<imbrandon> would be a good idea ( to bother with it )
<imbrandon> heh
<ajmitch> considering the fun of trying to get to dunedin, I think you won't
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: no...i dont think so...
* imbrandon considers bed .........
<Kaleo> hello
<tseng> imbrandon: sigh @ hackergotchi
<engla> I made an app that I want to be included in universe
<engla> and an ubuntu package.. how do I know if the package is good enough?
<Gloubiboulga> engla, we use REVU to check new packages
<Gloubiboulga> !revu
<ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<imbrandon> tseng: heh you dont like it ? its just temp anyhow untill i photoshop a real mugshot
<tseng> imbrandon: ok
<\sh> moins
<zul> hey sh
<ajmitch> hi \sh
* tseng hugs Hobbsee, wireshark
<\sh> how are the motus doing?
<Hobbsee> hi all!
<Hobbsee> wireshark?
<ajmitch> \sh: good to see you still alive
* Hobbsee hugs tseng 
* Hobbsee is here to take over the world!
<\sh> I'm fighting with a compaq smartarray p600 sas raid controller in a hp dl360g4p...and grub from ubuntu is not working, strange
<zul> \sh: is it using a special device?
<\sh> zul: /dev/cciss/c0d0 as BOOT_DEVICE, /dev/cciss/c0d0p3 as boot_partition
<\sh> zul: with SuSE Enterprise Linux Version 9 it works
<zul> dapper or edgy?
<\sh> zul: dapper
<zul> hmmm...lemme check something..
<\sh> error message is : GRUB hard disk error...regarding the documentation of grub, it tells me: wrong disk geometry from the bios
<zul> it might be a patch in grub that isnt working correctly have you tried edgy on it?
<\sh> zul: no...I can't use edgy
<zul> ergh..
<zul> i dont have an dapper box to look at the source :(
<zul> wait...never mind...gimme a sec
<zul> grub is looking for the /dev/cciss/c%dd%d where %d and %d is controller and drive
<zul> \sh: can you extract the rpm source for suse and look for their raid_ccis patch?
<\sh> zul: that's what I'm doing now :)
<zul> ah
<\sh> zul: they don't have any patches for raid_cciss...but they have a force-lba=off patch, initaddr patch etc.
<zul> i thought they did..
<\sh> zul: their version is 0.94 ... Im looking into the source ;)
<\sh> we have cciss patches to grub, and in grub-0.94 is nothing to find about cciss
<Lutin> Hi
<Lutin> I don't know why, but the flags given in DEB_CONFIGURE_EXTRA_FLAGS are not used when running pbuilder
<Lutin> would you know how to fix that ?
<Lutin> no ideas ?
<azeem> so they are used when not running pbuilder?
<bluefoxicy> is there any chance of getting a new wine by edgy
<bluefoxicy> 9.9 vs 9.19 you know, although I guess debian could be lagging *looks*
<bluefoxicy> 9.15 is in debian
<bluefoxicy> how do I request a merge from debian?
<azeem> did you do the merge already?
<bluefoxicy> azeem:  no, I mean debian unstable has wine 0.9.15, Ubuntu has 0.9.9, and 0.9.19 is out.  How do I request the package from Debian Unstable be merged into Edgy universe, if possible?
<bluefoxicy> (which seems to be what most of the changelogs for stuff I'm getting say-- "sync from debian unstable" or "merged from debian unstable" or whatnot)
<azeem> bluefoxicy: what do you mean, "request"?
<azeem> this is a developer channel, I assume you want to do the work yourself
<bluefoxicy> azeem:  Well.. I'm not ubuntu's wine maintainer, and somebody's doing it, I figured somebody else was in charge of it o_o
<azeem> bluefoxicy: you should check what changes in the Ubuntu package are still needed and how to merge them
<bluefoxicy> okay... is there a way to do that?
<azeem> if somebody is already in charge, requesting it does not make sense
<bluefoxicy> wow, it looks like nobody is in charge of it :)
<bluefoxicy> all the changelog entries are from different people
<azeem> MOTU is in charge
<bluefoxicy> well I'll have to look at it later
<bluefoxicy> I have to get ready to go take the security+
<bluefoxicy> so maybe when I get back.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Lutin> azeem: actually the flags are not used whether I use pbuilder or not
<azeem> Lutin: paste your debian/rules to a pastebin
<Lutin> ok
<lfittl> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya lfittl
<Lutin> azeem: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20776
<azeem> Lutin: try putting that below the include directives
<Lutin> azeem; trying right now
<Lutin> azeem, right, that works
<Lutin> thanks alot
<azeem> cheers
* bddebian cheers azeem
<azeem> bddebian: you mean I'm late for the beer hall? *g*
<bddebian> Heh
<LaserJock> morning guys
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<bddebian> azeem: I know someone in Debian is working on bkchem but do you have any interest in looking at what I put on REVU?
<asimon> Wow, lintian not only detected that the FSF address in my copyright file was obsolete and gave me the new address, it even detected a spelling error in the description. Very cool. :-)
<bddebian> heh
<LaserJock> hmm, I can't figure out why X won't show up in edgy
<LaserJock> anybody seen where X just doesn't show up?
<bddebian> I have a box where it seems to have whacked the h and v refresh so I get a monitor error with no display :-)
<LaserJock> that's the thing
<LaserJock> I haven't been able to find an error
<LaserJock> it just drops me to a tty
<bddebian> Well I was getting that for a while before the i810 driver got fixed
<LaserJock> well, this is on an nvidia card
<azeem> bddebian: I'm off to the beer hall now :)
<azeem> Debian birthday party
<bddebian> azeem: Enjoy
<bddebian> Thanks for the response on bkchem btw ;-P
<azeem> bddebian: well, Daniel packaged it
<azeem> bddebian: what was your motivation to package it?
<bddebian> I didn't know someone had already done it and LaserJock mentioned he would like it
<azeem> ok
<LaserJock> doh, blame it on me
<LaserJock> I said *I* was going to package it
<LaserJock> that's what you get for stealing other people's packages ;-)
<bddebian> Heh
* bddebian was just trying to help :'-(
<LaserJock> you still get like 10 times more MOTU work done than me so...
<azeem> I'm off now for real, laters
<bddebian> Later azeem
<zul> what are those icons in forums called again?
<phanatic> good evening
<chanakya> Hi, I want to join MOTu/Games team , tell me how i can help
<crimsun> what's your LP username?
<chanakya> crimsun, gauravtechie
<chanakya> crimsun, ???
<crimsun> chanakya: have you read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Teams/Games ?
<chanakya> crimsun, yep, Would like to help in packaging , But can`t have access to IRC at workplace
<chanakya> crimsun, would love if we have a mailing list , it`s easier to follow
<lfittl> hey phanatic, found some time to look at bzr-wmt? :)
<chanakya> crimsun, top of all would like to know whom do i approach for help ?
<phanatic> lfittl: not yet :( i was hunting laptops all day
<lfittl> phanatic: k, just ping me when you found time, would be interested in your feedback ;)
<phanatic> lfittl: sure :)
<crimsun> chanakya: any of the MOTU listed at the top of that page
<chanakya> crimsun, thanks
<chanakya> crimsun, My request to Join Motu-games at Launchpad has not yet been answered
<crimsun> chanakya: it will be when the admins have free time
<chanakya> crimsun, Lathiat is the Owner
<chanakya> crimsun, ok
<crimsun> since the vast majority of us are volunteers with real non-Canonical-paid jobs, it behooves us to be patient :)
<chanakya> crimsun, :)
<chanakya> Cya all
<ajmitch> morning
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<lfittl> morning ajmitch
<zul> eveninig
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch et al.
<zul> hey lj
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock, lfittl, zul :-)
<LaserJock> and that's what seperates the scientists from the the common folk ;-)
<LaserJock> j/k
<ajmitch> harsh
<zul> that scientists make smartass jokes ;)
<bddebian> Later folks
<LaserJock> piled higher and deeper
<zul> hehe
<LaserJock> pin-headed dope
<LaserJock> I've heard them all
<ajmitch> I've heard the first one
* ajmitch has a few friends that have done phds
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-17
<imbrandon> moins / evening everyone
* imbrandon yawns
<imbrandon> ugh who is John Dong
<zul> he was the backport guy
<ajmitch> morning Hobbsee
<ajmitch> you're up insanely early today
<Hobbsee> morning all
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch
<zul> imbrandon: what happened?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: i'm at uni insanely early.  i have no working car.
<imbrandon> did i miss something or is there s specific reason he rejected my backport request filed against package source , and refiled the EXACT some request agains a "ubuntu-backports" project
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: how unfortunate, what broke?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: the automatic transmission
<ajmitch> ouch
<zul> copy cat..
<ajmitch> so you had to catch an early bus in?
<imbrandon> zul : https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/kbfx/+bug/56527 to see what i mean
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56527 in dapper-backports "[backport]  request for kbfx 0.4.9.1+20060611cvs-1 from edgy -> dapper-backports" [Medium,In progress] 
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: you mean a bus, train, and another bus.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: no, i got dad to give me a lift
<ajmitch> imbrandon: I guess it's his way of tracking stuff
<zul> that must be a fun ride
<imbrandon> afaik it should be filed against the package source, that make sense, so you get the other information, is this a documented change somewhere ?
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: I guess it gives you more time to work on that assignment :)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: true that...
<Hobbsee> which assingment :P
* Hobbsee seems to have about ten of them.
<Hobbsee> okay...3....one with two parts, so that makes 4...
<ajmitch> the physics one you were worrying about
<Hobbsee> oh.  that was due yesterday, and i did that in my broken car while waiting for the towtruck.
<zul> imbrandon: no idea
<ajmitch> ah
<ajmitch> you got it done though?
<imbrandon> hrm he put it "in progress to" wth is that? is it building now ? so theres soyuz support? i love chnges when no one says WTH they are doing
<ajmitch> imbrandon: I'd say it means he's checking it out - nothing to do with soyuz
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: yeah
<imbrandon> ajmitch: rember the convo last night about age of nicks on IRC, check this, i think he has everyone beat ( 136 years ) http://www.thedailywtf.com/images/200608/gaim-wtf.gif
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ajmitch> hello
<imbrandon> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hi ajmitch, imbrandon
<Laser_away> hi guys
* StevenK waves to *
<bddebian> Heya Laser_away, StevenK
* Laser_away goes to hunt down some food somewhere by campus
<Laser_away> I hate how most of the on-campus food places shut down for the summer :(
<imbrandon> wendys ;)
<bddebian> Taco Bell!
<Laser_away> well yeah, if I could walk there
<Laser_away> but the wife has got the car
<zul_> subway
* StevenK ponders food, and decides against it.
<Laser_away> mmmm, now you guys are making me even more hungry
* bddebian is eating ice cream
<Laser_away> doh
<zul_> im having a slurpee
<imbrandon> lol yo quero taco bell ?
<StevenK> Laser_away: One word can take away your apitite.
* ajmitch should consider having some breakfast as well
<imbrandon> mmmm slurpee , /me loves 7-11 slurpees
<bddebian> Heh
<StevenK> Laser_away: "McDonalds"
<ajmitch> StevenK: bad
<Laser_away> Big Mac!!
<imbrandon> heh i like mcdonalds ;)
* ajmitch shudders
<Laser_away> guess what I ate when I went to Paris?
<bddebian> A Royale with Cheese ? ;-P
<imbrandon> hahahah
<ajmitch> Laser_away: please don't
<Laser_away> no, highvoltage ate the Royale
<jsgotangco> haha
<Laser_away> I had the bigmac
<jsgotangco> he ate le big mac
<bddebian> hehe
<bddebian> Mayonaise on your fries?
* imbrandon is reminded of pulp fiction
<tseng> ugh
<StevenK> Damn, now look what I've done.
<tseng> mcdonalds
<Laser_away> and then latter I went to a nice Subway shop across the river from Notre Dame ;-)
<bddebian> imbrandon: Exactly why I said that ;-P
<imbrandon> bddebian: hehe yea i caught it ;)
<jsgotangco> Laser_away was sick of eating fish and non-american food
<imbrandon> i love that movie
<jsgotangco> i think the raw beef was clincher
<Laser_away> well, after that hotel food McDonald's was a God-send
<imbrandon> lol
<bddebian> imbrandon: That whole sequence is one of the funniest things I have ever seen
<tseng> hotel at ubuntu paris?
<Laser_away> I thought I was going to die of starvation
<jsgotangco> yea
<Laser_away> or worse
<tseng> australia was the same deal
<tseng> a bunch of green stuff
<bddebian> ugh
<ajmitch> and far too much fish
<jsgotangco> this was worse
<tseng> i had to get all my calories in with the english breakfast
<ajmitch> fish every single day at UDU
<Laser_away> I would have taken salad any day
<bddebian> What, no vegemite?
<ajmitch> bddebian: of course there was
<tseng> Laser_away: this wasnt lettuce like we have in america
<ajmitch> bddebian: I've got a jar of it here if you want some
<jsgotangco> they totally ignored vegans/vegetarians
<tseng> with real big pieces of lettuce
<tseng> it was all kinds of funny little things
<imbrandon> heh
<Laser_away> well, we had raw beef and pate (sp?)
<bddebian> ajmitch: Uhm, no thanks :-)
<tseng> raw beef?
<tseng> wtf
<jsgotangco> yeah
<imbrandon> raw beef ?
<Laser_away> I thought maybe there was a natural gas outage or something
<ajmitch> bddebian: uncultured...
<Laser_away> nothing was cooked
<jsgotangco> its france!
<Laser_away> steak tartar
<Laser_away> or something
<bddebian> ugh
<Laser_away> a big plate of thin sliced raw beef
<bddebian> ajmitch: I don't deny that :-)
<zul_> mmmmm....pate
<jsgotangco> green avocado which is spicy
* ajmitch prefers his steak to be cooked
* imbrandon thinks of all the deseases from raw meat 
<tseng> i eat sushi
<jsgotangco> sushi is good
<Laser_away> ajmitch: oh man, what I would have given for a steak
<tseng> or even a full sized sushi-grade tuna filet
<tseng> cooked rare
<ajmitch> sushi & raw beef are a bit different
<tseng> raw beef
<tseng> not so much
<imbrandon> tseng: only with lots of umm hell whats that green hot stuff
<imbrandon> heh
<tseng> imbrandon: wasabi
<ajmitch> imbrandon: wasabi
<imbrandon> YEA
<jsgotangco> Laser_away: at least we got to eat in a real brasserie
<imbrandon> i love that stuff
<tseng> its ok
<tseng> it kills germs
<Laser_away> jsgotangco: yeah
* ajmitch doubts he'll be at the next developer summit
* bddebian only eats meat, potatoes, bread, and ice cream ;-)
* tseng doubts he'll be at any future summit
<Laser_away> fortunately my view of France wasn't totally ruined
<imbrandon> and SLURPIEES
<jsgotangco> imbrandon: have you tasted green peas deep fried in wasabi
<imbrandon> jsgotangco: cant say i have
<imbrandon> ugh phone
<imbrandon> brb
<ajmitch> jsgotangco: the ones we get tend to be fairly bland
<Laser_away> jsgotangco: are they good, I think I've seen them in the store here?
<jsgotangco> Laser_away: yeah just dont eat a lot of it
<Laser_away> ah, ok
<jsgotangco> it goes through your nostrils
<jsgotangco> the feeling that is, not the pea
<Laser_away> my uncle was in the Army for a while and was stationed in South Korea
<Laser_away> he got a taste for that nasty cabbage stuff
<Laser_away> can't think of the name
<jsgotangco> its callled kimchi
<tseng> cole slaw?
<jsgotangco> its delicious!
<Laser_away> yeah!!
<Laser_away> when he came back it was all he would eat
<Laser_away> but my grandpa wouldn't let him come over to his house cause he smelled so bad ;-)
<jsgotangco> Laser_away: there's actually a kimchi museum in seoul, you can look it up at the web
<jsgotangco> well kimchi is a way to increase the storage life of vegetables back then in the long winter
<jsgotangco> they made is spicier to heat up the body as well
<Laser_away> ok, I'm off on a hunt. I think it'll either be Jimmy John's or Jim Boy's
<Laser_away> jsgotangco: good to know if I'm ever deserted in the middle of Korea ;-)
<jsgotangco> asian food is generally way better compared to european imho
<tseng> jsgotangco: yes
<tseng> jsgotangco: god yes
<zul_> im a steak and potatoes kind of guy
<tseng> i almost nearly killed myself in Spain
<tseng> I could not get a fucking steak to save my life
<tseng> or a hamburger
<tseng> everything had mussels
<zul_> macdonalds?
<jsgotangco> you get blood sausages or something as well
<tseng> i asked a guy how to get to mcdonalds
<tseng> no fucking se
<ajmitch> hah, only time I had mussels recently was having dinner at mpt's place
<tseng> ajmitch: if i never see another mussel again..
<tseng> the only thing on menus we could recognize most places was paella
<tseng> rice, mussels, shitty prawn
<tseng> i am spoiled for life by australian prawn
<zul_> heh every summer when we came back from kenya the first thing we do is head to a macdonalds
<tseng> zul_: mcd is inedible
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee
<zul_> tseng: its ok
* bddebian covers his virgin ears from tseng's swearing
<tseng> zul_: i like burgers made of beef
<bddebian> Heya Hobbsee
<zul_> hey Hobbsee
<tseng> bddebian: oh, you've seen nothing
* Hobbsee waves to all
<ajmitch> tseng: rather than playing pick-that-animal?
<Hobbsee> yay for simple programming exercises as quizzes.
<bddebian> tseng: ;-P
<zul_> tseng: so do i, but when you need grease you need grease
<tseng> ajmitch: is it an animal?
<imbrandon> [20:10]  <jsgotangco> its callled kimchi  <-- that stuff rocks
<ajmitch> not entirely sure
<tseng> ajmitch: vegitable oil in meltodextrin?
<tseng> ajmitch: who knows.
<tseng> all of the above is my guess
<tseng> but very little came from a cow
<ajmitch> I should get pizza tonight or something
<tseng> you should have seen it
<jsgotangco> Laser_away: i should send you a box of duck eggs soon :D
<tseng> me, davyd, desrt trying to order a pizza in catalan
* bddebian eats no seafood whatsoever
<ajmitch> heh
<tseng> what a joke
<ajmitch> you didn't have jordi along to translate?
<tseng> no
<jsgotangco> heh
<tseng> people spoke enough spanish to talk to them
<jsgotangco> bddebian: landlubber!
<tseng> which was the path i tried
<ajmitch> jsgotangco: he's obviously not asian
<tseng> next time, I am not going more than 2 feet from Miguel
<bddebian> jsgotangco: I don't eat anything that swims around it it's own shit all it's life ;-P
<jsgotangco> haha
<imbrandon> lol
<jsgotangco> i guess you haven't tasted octopus or shark even
<tseng> bddebian: pork?
<ajmitch> jsgotangco: some of us have
<tseng> man, spain did have great calamari
<imbrandon> tseng: i was thinking the same thing
<zul_> zebra meat is pretty good
<ajmitch> kangaroo meat is pretty interesting
<jsgotangco> is it the same as horse?
<tseng> lightly fried with some lemon
<imbrandon> zebra is the same as horse meat isnt it
<bddebian> tseng: pork is good
<tseng> of course it is
<ajmitch> Hobbsee can tell you all about eating kangaroo..
<tseng> but they life in their own dirt
<bddebian> "pigs are filthy animals"
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: so can you
<bddebian> tseng: They don't breath it :-)
<tseng> bddebian: no, they eat it
<imbrandon> bddebian: nah they just eat it
<bddebian> No they don't
<imbrandon> yea they do , right along with the slop
<tseng> have you seen the movie Snatch?
<tseng> like dags?
<ajmitch> yeah
<bddebian> Uhm, my neighbors raised pigs
<imbrandon> i'm sorry
<tseng> they eat disgusting things
<jsgotangco> yeah the key to raising pigs is to make sure their den is always clean
<jsgotangco> and always have clean water too
<bddebian> So do chickens if given the chance
<bddebian> In fact there are no nastier creatures than chickens
<tseng> I like dags.
<jsgotangco> ive seen chicks kill each other and peck entrails
<tseng> yum
<bddebian> Oh yeah, if Chickens taste blood, they go nuts
<tseng> at least it isnt just me that things international food blows
<tseng> thinks
<tseng> America wins again
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> some international food is good, special after its been "american ized" hehe
<ajmitch> americans..
<imbrandon> kimchi , mexian food ( all the same ingrediants just presented diffrent )
<jsgotangco> kimchi got americanized?
<imbrandon> lots of other stuff i cant think of right now
<bddebian> Some real mexican food is frightening
<ajmitch> jsgotangco: how else could they eat it?
<jsgotangco> pig brain taco
<imbrandon> jsgotangco: most here prepare it a bit diffrent than the koreans i have seen prepare it
<bddebian> I had some chicken thing in Mexico city that I swear they just threw the entire chicken in blender and stuck it on a tortilla
<imbrandon> bddebian: hahaha probably
<jsgotangco> when i was in seoul, the local Golden Arches had Bulgogi burger with kimchi siding
<imbrandon> ;)
<bddebian> I would definetly starve to death in an Asian country
<imbrandon> korean kimchi is alot spicier from what ive seen
<bddebian> Too many vegetables and seafood
<ajmitch> poor bddebian
<jsgotangco> that's why we probably live longer
<jsgotangco> ;)
<imbrandon> heh
<jsgotangco> bddebian: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balut
<bddebian> jsgotangco: Aye :-)
<imbrandon> native american food is good to ( well the way myt wife makes it ) , alot like mexian food
<imbrandon> s/myt/my
<welshbyte> i used to pretty fussy about food.. these days i eat just about anything put in front of me except any kind of curry
<bddebian> OK, I have like 4 or 5 packages now that are outdated in Debian too :'-(
<jsgotangco> curry is ok it just seeps in your pores if you have too much of it
<welshbyte> makes me hurl :)
<LaserJock> oh man guys, I'm trying to eat here ;-)
<bddebian> haha
<imbrandon> lol
* ajmitch was thinking about getting curry for lunch
<bddebian> ack
<welshbyte> heh
<welshbyte> "can i get some food in my additives please?"
<LaserJock> I've got an italian sub and chips right now
<welshbyte> mmm
* ajmitch still hasn't eaten today
<imbrandon> sounds good, with some oil and vinigar dressing to go on it
<LaserJock> yep
<Hobbsee> bad ajmitch
<LaserJock> had smoked salmon and havarti cheese pizza for lunch
<LaserJock> my wife thought it would be fun
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: you're supposed to eat, you know!
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: can't I just say it's your fault?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: nope
* bddebian whips up a Prime Rib milkshake ;-P
<ajmitch> darn
<imbrandon> heh your makin me hungery now, mmmm pasta sounds good tonight
<StevenK> ajmitch: No, because it's yours
<ajmitch> StevenK: that's beside the point
<LaserJock> bddebian: dude, that reminds me
<welshbyte> oh great, 2:35am and i'm hankering for steak
<LaserJock> the undergrad in my lab found a forum post of worst cooking ideas
<imbrandon> lol
<LaserJock> the worst I saw was a guy decided to make a burrito smoothie
<ajmitch> uh oh
<LaserJock> but it came out kinda thick
<imbrandon> hahahahahahahahah
<ajmitch> a bit lumpy?
<bddebian> LaserJock: D00d, that is nasty :)
<LaserJock> so he looked around for something Mexican to thin it out
<LaserJock> so he found some tequila
<imbrandon> LOL
<imbrandon> sour cream
<ajmitch> that'd be one tasty drink
<LaserJock> so it became a burrito and tequila smoothie
<bddebian> Oh man
<bddebian> I had beer on corn flakes in college once
<bddebian> Only things I had in the apartment
<imbrandon> roflmao
<ajmitch> sick man
<bddebian> It was pretty nasty
<ajmitch> I'm surprised you still had beer left
<LaserJock> I knew a guy in college who was previously in the Army
<LaserJock> and developed a Mt. Dew in cereal habit
<bddebian> eww
<imbrandon> ahhh now THAT sounds good ;)
<jsgotangco> ugghh
<StevenK> LaserJock: Ewwwwww
<LaserJock> that was for you imbrandon ;-)
* ajmitch revises what he should do for lunch
<imbrandon> mt dew in fruity pebbles ;)
<ajmitch> jsgotangco: mt dew & mentos?
<bddebian> Oh yeah, you definetly need more sugar with your Mt. Dew :-)
<imbrandon> lol
<jsgotangco> ajmitch: they explode
<ajmitch> jsgotangco: it'd be fun though
<bddebian> Even though Mt. Dew is the nectar of the Gods ;-P
<imbrandon> http://www.imbrandon.com/misc/mt_dew.jpg
<ajmitch> not like you haven't seen enough of them
<ajmitch> imbrandon: very very wrong
<zul_> heh...we get crippled mt dew
<jsgotangco> what a waste of fridge space
<bddebian> imbrandon: Nice :-)
<ajmitch> decaf mt dew?
<imbrandon> crippled mt dew ?
<zul_> yeah...
<Yagisan> G'day all
<imbrandon> heya Yagisan
<ajmitch> hello Yagisan
<LaserJock> no  way!!!
<bddebian> Decaf Mt. Dew?  WTF??
<LaserJock> sorry, that was to zul_, not Yagisan
<ajmitch> zul_: that just takes away the whole reason for the drink
<zul_> ajmitch: yep...thats why i dont drink it
<imbrandon> [20:40]  <jsgotangco> what a waste of fridge space  <-- yea i still have room at the bottom for more huh ?
<bddebian> That's like non-alcoholic beer, or decaf coffee
<StevenK> As a matter of fact, Australian Mountain Dew doesn't have caffeine.
<jsgotangco> imbrandon: put lots of cup noodles heh
<LaserJock> I could sorta see diet mt dew cause you drink so much
<imbrandon> StevenK: WOW
<StevenK> So they doubled the amount of sugar.
<ajmitch> StevenK: that's worrying
<ajmitch> I'm sure that it has caffeine in NZ
<Yagisan> can anyone think of an opensource alternative to FMOD. I'm running a argument to get it dropped from some code that I'd like to see in Ubuntu
<jsgotangco> there was a local craze here a decade ago mixing raw egg with rootbeer
<StevenK> ajmitch: Does it have a slightly bitter aftertaste?
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: oh yeah, mt dew + ramen!!!!
<ajmitch> StevenK: I don't know, I don't drink it
<bddebian> So you don't stay up but your teeth rot faster?
<StevenK> Heh
<Yagisan> aussie mt dew is nice :)
<StevenK> Yagisan: I prefered the Mountain Dew I drank in Finland.
<imbrandon> + cafeine is good
<Yagisan> StevenK, I eat suger from the pack - sweet is nice
* StevenK blinks.
<bddebian> I prefer Mt. Dew + vodka or so :-)
<jsgotangco> unprocessed 7-11 slurpee
<jsgotangco> heh
<jsgotangco> pure sugar
<LaserJock> well, I'm down to pretty much just diet soda because of my teeth :(
<welshbyte> Yagisan: umm, you mean something like gstreamer?
<imbrandon> bddebian: mt dew and everclear is GOOOOOOOD
<imbrandon> everclear and pineapple juice is better ;)
<Yagisan> welshbyte, something that supports all those useless formats no one uses, and is on *NIx, OSX and Win32
* Yagisan checks gstreamer
<welshbyte> if no one uses them, what's the point? :)
<jsgotangco> what is everclear?
<imbrandon> jsgotangco: 190 proof grain liquor
<ajmitch> imbrandon: sounds dangerous
<jsgotangco> ahh ethanol
<Yagisan> welshbyte, I tried that argument - it's not getting far - that's why I popped in to see my mates here
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: dude, I don't even drink and I know what everclear is ;-)
<jsgotangco> 190 proof? isnt that like fuel quality?
<ajmitch> jsgotangco: ethanol with a touch of flavouring & other additives
<LaserJock> I've got some 200 proof in the lab ;-)
<imbrandon> jsgotangco: pretty much, we drove a motocycle on it one time for a few miles, but the spark plugs needed replaced after that
<ajmitch> LaserJock: that's just not as tasty
<welshbyte> Yagisan: fair enough, well i'm no expert so maybe someone with more experience can help after they've finished discussing beverages ;)
<LaserJock> ajmitch: I doubt it, and you can only get it in small quantities
<jsgotangco> youll die drinking it straight right?
<imbrandon> LaserJock: 200 proof == 100%  hehe
<LaserJock> imbrandon: exactly
<LaserJock> we have to do special purchasing to get it
<bddebian> Oh Everclean, nice
<imbrandon> jsgotangco: everclear ? nah you can drink it streight but it taste nasty by its self
<LaserJock> because normal research ethanol they but nasty tasting additives so grad students won't drink it ;-)
<bddebian> Yeah, it burns like hell
<jsgotangco> ahh so you make cocktails with it
<imbrandon> jsgotangco: yea normaly 1oz to a drink 8oz drink ;)
<imbrandon> after 3 or 4 you forget your name or why you were drinking ;)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: shocking, as if grad students would ever drink it ;)
<jsgotangco> hmm they are good for mountain treks then
<jsgotangco> you use some to cook, then use a part to mix with cocktails
<LaserJock> ajmitch: no, they do mt. dew and ramen instead
<LaserJock> :-)
<imbrandon> n the United States, Everclear is a brand of grain alcohol (ethanol), available at concentrations of 95% alcohol (190 proof) and 75.5% (151 proof) [1] . By contrast, hard liquors such as rum and vodka generally contain 40% alcohol (80 proof). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Everclear_(alcohol)
<imbrandon> i dident know they made the 151 proof kind , hehe
<jsgotangco> its this like moonshine?
<bddebian> jsgotangco: Pretty much yes
<imbrandon> stronger normaly but same taste
<LaserJock> well, more than moonshine
<LaserJock> everclear is like research grade ethanol
<imbrandon> moonshine is normaly about 75-80%
<LaserJock> we use 95% for most research
<imbrandon> hehe
<imbrandon> its still good with mt dew ;) one shot per glass ;)
<LaserJock> bah
<LaserJock> I think that destroys the purity of the mt. dew :-)
<imbrandon> heheh
<LaserJock> I don't mix my mt dew with anything ;-)
<imbrandon> mt dew should be the offical ubuntu drink ;)
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> UbuntDew
<StevenK> LaserJock: What sort of research uses 95% alchol?
<imbrandon> lol
<Hobbsee> nooo!  coke!
<StevenK> "I wonder how long it will take us to get pissed today" ?
<LaserJock> I'm a chemist
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: more dev's and ppl in general drink mt dew ( everywhere but mexico ) heheh
<StevenK> My question still stands. ;-P
<bddebian> StevenK: Research into getting drunk ;-P
* StevenK high fives bddebian.
* Hobbsee will avoid getting drunk, thanks :P
<LaserJock> ethanol is a really good solvent
<Hobbsee> can you imagine a drunk hobbsee?
<LaserJock> that's why it's not good for your body
<imbrandon> LaserJock: at UNR i wouldent be suprised ;)
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Not with any weapons nearby ;-)
<LaserJock> you kinda end up dissolving your body in a way
<imbrandon> or pointy sticks
<Hobbsee> heh
<StevenK> My father told me once that I was silly enough sober, and he never wanted to see me drunk.
<imbrandon> LaserJock: dosent it work becouse its a poison ( all liquors )
<LaserJock> anyway, we use ethanol in my lab as a general purpose solvent and for cleaning optics
<LaserJock> kinda yeah
<LaserJock> we use a lot of methanol to (wood alchol)
<LaserJock> it'll make you go blind
<imbrandon> heh
<LaserJock> so don't drink that
<jsgotangco> im not going to doubt a chemist
<jsgotangco> ;)
<Yagisan> I see. after someone pukes after drinking it, you disolve the evidience with what's left over ;)
<LaserJock> attacks your optical nerves or something
<StevenK> Yagisan: Bwahaha
<LaserJock> eewww
<imbrandon> heh
<LaserJock> I just never did understand the point of drinking alchol when such nice things a mt dew and pepsi existed
<imbrandon> s/pepsi/more\ mt\ dew/g
<LaserJock> whatever
<imbrandon> hehe
<StevenK> LaserJock: But Pepsi is *vile*.
<jsgotangco> we have a local concoction here called royal rumble, its fanta orange with rhum nasty stuff
<bddebian> ugh
<LaserJock> pepsi is one of God's greatest gifts to humanity
* StevenK kills LaserJock.
<LaserJock> sorry StevenK, it's a know fact
<LaserJock> smart people drink pepsi
<LaserJock> ;-)
* TheMuso prefers ginger beer if it has to be any softdrink.
<StevenK> Not in this house, it isn't.
<imbrandon> jsgotangco: we drink that here too, and another called "float your boat" something with root beer and captian morgan ( spice rum ) , its GOOOD too
* Hobbsee waves to TheMuso 
<TheMuso> Hey Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: i believe that killing is against the CoC :P
<TheMuso> How is your day?
<bddebian> Shit, I had prismstumbler building now it doesn't :-(
<LaserJock> they thing for me is that all the alchoholic drinks try to be something else
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Hrm.
<LaserJock> my friend was like "Kahlua + milk is like chocolate milk"
<LaserJock> and I'm like, "
<LaserJock> "why not just drink chocolate milk?"
<imbrandon> no drunkie after a few ;)
<Yagisan> speaking of Gnger Beer, the Bundaberg stuff is good (real giner) buy the imitation stuff tastes like crap
<LaserJock> hmm, not time for that, I"ve got Quantum Mechanics to study ;-)
<TheMuso> Yagisan: Saxby's is nice too.
<StevenK> Quantum mechanics hurts my head.
* Yagisan will learn to type one day. Today is not that day however
<LaserJock> StevenK: yes, it hurt mine the first few times as well
<LaserJock> you just have to stick with it ;-)
<Hobbsee> pepsi is vile though.  diet pepsi, doubly so.
<imbrandon> yea so is coke though too
<bddebian> Diet anything is the work of Satan
<imbrandon> mt dew > *
<TheMuso> Go the soda water with cordial, or ginger beer I say!
<jsgotangco> ugghh i hate ginger beer
<imbrandon> man you all are gonna make me put a poll up for ubuntu devs/users on my blog about soda hehehe
<TheMuso> IT doesn't bloat you nearly as much as soft drink like coke/pepsi
* StevenK hasn't tried soda water with cordial.
<Yagisan> jsgotangco, you probally never had a real one then
<LaserJock> pepsi > mt dew > dr pepper > everything else on the planet
* StevenK usually drinks water, actually.
<TheMuso> Soda water with lime/lemon cordial/lemon barley water is beautiful, especially in summer.
<jsgotangco> Yagisan: i had the one by blue tongue, it doesn't really jive welll with me but that's the only one i got
<TheMuso> StevenK: So do I.
<LaserJock> yikes, now there's 2
<StevenK> Heh
<imbrandon> lol
<Hobbsee_> two?
<TheMuso> hah
<imbrandon> two you
<Yagisan> jsgotangco, if I see you in Aus, remind me, and I'll get you a real one
<Hobbsee_> what'd i miss?
<LaserJock> now we are really in for a beating
<StevenK> We're partiarly surrounded!
<jsgotangco> i'll be in LCA
<LaserJock> mhm
* Hobbsee_ gets out her long pointy stick
* Yagisan usually drinks tea (english) or japanese tea
<LaserJock> I just haven't warmed up to tea :-)
<imbrandon> indian ( native american ) tea is great, best tea i've ever had
<jsgotangco> the ones we have here now are gree tea ice filtered
<TheMuso> Right. Lets try again to get a cat out of our yard that got stuck there two days ago. :)
<TheMuso> bbs
<Hobbsee> hhe
<imbrandon> heh
<Hobbsee> yay, a prac on how to write html.
<StevenK> Hah
<StevenK> I got one of them two weeks ago.
<imbrandon> <html>junk</html>
<Yagisan> I did an exam over the internet a few days ago o_O
* LaserJock wonders what a computer science exame would look like
<LaserJock> seems odd to me
<bddebian> <H1>Bigger Junk</H1>
* Hobbsee is hiding against one of the walls of one of the prac labs.
<LaserJock> I'd probably flunk
<Hobbsee> next to....a powerpoint :D
<Hobbsee> come on....
<Hobbsee> !ping
<jsgotangco> essay type lol
<ubotu> pong
<Yagisan> I thought I had died and gone to heaven
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: if it's anything like the last quiz...very easy
<StevenK> Yagisan: There is no latency in heaven.
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> StevenK: i dunno the voyager1 is pretty close to what some would call heaven and an icmp ping takes 28+ hours to reply ;)
<Yagisan> StevenK, it was wonderful. It like one big open-book exam
<StevenK> Heh
<Yagisan> StevenK, I'm looking forward to the next 2 exams too :) (I shall try and do it faster next time)
<LaserJock> has anybody done a presentation via Impress on an Ubuntu laptop?
<LaserJock> I've always used Powerpoint and Windows and I'd like to not have any suprises
<jsgotangco> sure
<jsgotangco> just make sure your video can actually be used with a projector
<jsgotangco> some laptops can't do it
<LaserJock> hmm, if it works with Windows should it?
<jsgotangco> unless you reboot with the projector attached
<jsgotangco> well its a video card issue
<LaserJock> I've done it before with Windows
<LaserJock> but I'd like to do it in Ubuntu
<jsgotangco> who hasn't heh
<LaserJock> since this will be at an Ubuntu conference
<jsgotangco> its best to try it with a projector before the event
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> I should be able to get there early
<jsgotangco> because mine doesn't just work if i plug in the projector
<jsgotangco> unless i reboot
<LaserJock> hmm
<StevenK> jsgotangco: What laptop?
<jsgotangco> Tecra M2 with Nvidia
<StevenK> Free or restricted drivers?
<jsgotangco> both doesn't work
<StevenK> Interesting.
<jsgotangco> yep mjg59 said its upstream
<jsgotangco> i met on of the xandros people before with the same laptop and it frustrates him as well
<StevenK> My Sony Vaio only spoke to a projector if I plugged it before booting.
<LaserJock> hehe, I just crashed bug buddy ;-)
<StevenK> LaserJock: I wonder if it respawns itself to report that bug.
<LaserJock> kinda
<jsgotangco> StevenK: you still get both displays?
<LaserJock> it got a few things and then some force quits
<StevenK> jsgotangco: From what I recall, yes.
<jsgotangco> mine only displays on the projector and the lcd is blank
<StevenK> jsgotangco: The Vaio in question died, and I bought an X40.
<jsgotangco> it just works in X40 right?
* StevenK nods.
<StevenK> I haven't checked in Ubuntu, but I made it work under Debian.
<jsgotangco> yeah its probably the most compatible unit you can find for linux generally
<StevenK> Most of IBM laptops just work.
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: how many slides do you do roughly for a 1 hr  presentation?
<jsgotangco> 1 hour that;s a long time
<jsgotangco> depends on your discussion
<jsgotangco> the key is not to put everything on a slide
<imbrandon> please tell me this is a joke https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/apt/+bug/56125
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56125 in apt "doesnt look like a cow" [Unknown,Unconfirmed] 
<jsgotangco> we actually have a cow in apt
<ajmitch> imbrandon: no, it's quite a serious bug
<bddebian> apt has super cow powers
<jsgotangco> but gentoo whips our arse
<bddebian> Fsck Gentoo
<jsgotangco> in the cow department
<LaserJock> yeah, larry is awesome ;-)
<jsgotangco> its worth confirming as a wishlist =)
* StevenK prefers what aptitude does.
<imbrandon> brandon@voyager:~$ aptitude moo
<imbrandon> There are no Easter Eggs in this program.
<jsgotangco> heh
<jsgotangco> wonder if smartpm has one
<jsgotangco> :D
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: mind taking a look at http://chem.unr.edu/~mantha/ubuntu/ubucon.odp and seeing if it looks retarded or not?
<jsgotangco> ok
<StevenK> imbrandon: Add a -v
<jsgotangco> im honored to help a FOSS superstar like LaserJock
<LaserJock> lol
<LaserJock> whatever
<imbrandon> StevenK: hahaha
<imbrandon> brandon@voyager:~$ aptitude -v moo
<imbrandon> There really are no Easter Eggs in this program.
<jsgotangco> haha
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: keep adding more -v's
<StevenK> imbrandon: Keep adding -v
* StevenK high fives Hobbsee.
<jsgotangco> bwahahaha
<LaserJock> oh man, we are geeks
<LaserJock> :-)
<imbrandon> hahahahahaha
<jsgotangco> hahahahaa
<imbrandon> too cool
<StevenK> steven@liquified:~% for i in "" -v -vv -vvv -vvvv -vvvvv -vvvvvv ; do aptitude $i moo ; done
<jsgotangco> wth is that?
<StevenK> ....
<ajmitch> too often projectors are an issue - we had quite a few problems at LCA this year
* Hobbsee highfives StevenK :)
<imbrandon> brandon@voyager:~$ aptitude -vvvvvv moo
<StevenK> jsgotangco: Add another -v
<imbrandon> What is it?  It's an elephant being eaten by a snake, of course.
<jsgotangco> an elephant eaten by a snake
<jsgotangco> heh
<imbrandon> someone had too much time on their hands
<Yagisan> nice :)
* StevenK wonders if he can compress his for loop.
<Yagisan> people are looking at me odd because i laughed at that
<Hobbsee> StevenK: dont remind me of the assignment i'm supposed to be writing
<imbrandon> haha
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: i guess the best presentation on inviting people to participate in Ubuntu is share your experiences as well
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: the slides are ok, but adding a personal touch makes wonders
<Yagisan> Hobbsee, I've an assignment due tommorow. I should start it today
* StevenK remembers the first time he joined -motu
<jsgotangco> stuff that people don't normally read on the websites
<Hobbsee> hah
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: yeah, I kinda planned on a doing a little more with the MOTU part and a little about why I was talking in the first place
<jsgotangco> yeah
<Hobbsee> StevenK: what happened then?
<jsgotangco> add pictures of yourself during paris
<ajmitch> StevenK: scary place?
<jsgotangco> to make things interesting
<StevenK> Oh, I didn't think people were interested. :-)
<LaserJock> hehe, yeah
<StevenK> Um, ajmitch and I talked for a while, and I started doing universe merges.
<jsgotangco> that we're not all about doing gdb but talkign about moonshine and ethanol as well
<StevenK> And easter eggs.
<jsgotangco> a lot of slides in guadec focused on people having fun
<Yagisan> I think I first came here *after* i turned up unannounced at UDU
* ajmitch can't remember talking to StevenK 
<ajmitch> but that's no surprise
<ajmitch> irc is one long blur
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: like eating raw beef
<StevenK> "IRC is just one long line of text"
<LaserJock> hehe, I think the first time I came to -motu bddebian and bmonty were hard at work getting Breezy out the door
<Hobbsee> nwo come on....it's thursday lunch time....where are the freaking tutes????????????????
<Hobbsee> it's surely not *that* hard to put them up more than 4 days before they're due!
<StevenK> That's the challenge.
<StevenK> You need to find them and then do them.
<Hobbsee> my uni is bloody incompetent.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: that's the way of university life
<StevenK> It's a feature.
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: you don't think the logos are weird? I kinda wanted to give it a community feel
<ajmitch> just like launchpad is one big collection of features
<jsgotangco> well
<Hobbsee> hah
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: let's just say art isnt your biggest strength, but then again, clean slides are much easier on the eyes for the audience instead of thiking of adding palettes
<jsgotangco> ;D
<LaserJock> doh
<bddebian> LaserJock: Pshaw, I'm never hard at work ;-P
<LaserJock> :-)
* ajmitch refrains from commenting
<jsgotangco> because when you pipe your laptop to a projector, the palette will look different
<bddebian> Yeah, yeah, I know ajmitch
<LaserJock> well, I'm used to science presentations where you get a white background, black text, and equations
<jsgotangco> yeah
<LaserJock> I saw a few presentations on the wiki but they seemed hard to read
<jsgotangco> also make sure your final slides have all formats
<jsgotangco> odp, ppt, pdf
<jsgotangco> just in case you are forced to use another guy's laptop
<LaserJock> mmm, good point
<LaserJock> I was going to do dop and ppt
<LaserJock> odp
<jsgotangco> dont forget ppt
<LaserJock> but pdf is good too
<LaserJock> I"m not used to being able to make pdf's so easy ;-)
<jsgotangco> i know its strange to use it on a FOSS conference but things happen
<LaserJock> yeah, I know that about conferences
<jsgotangco> when i was in seoul, i couldn't use my laptop we had to use one running windows that didnt have office
<jsgotangco> but had acrobat reader
<jsgotangco> good thing i made a pdf
<ajmitch> yes, never rely on being able to use your own laptop
<LaserJock> well, I'm used to having to print out transparencies
<LaserJock> there's nothing like a good wet-erase talk by a nobel prize winner ;-)
<jsgotangco> well thats the extreme option
<jsgotangco> but generally having the 3 formats on had on a keyfob will work
<ajmitch> LaserJock: when are you getting your nobel prize?
<LaserJock> years from now
<LaserJock> most Nobel prizes get awarded like 20 years after the work has been done
<ajmitch> at least we can say that we knew you when you were slacking off with ubuntu :)
<LaserJock> so I've got a little while to wait ;-)
<bddebian> hehe
<LaserJock> well, nobel prizes are cool, but you sure don't get much money anymore
<LaserJock> you get USD$1 million
<LaserJock> but if more than one person gets the prize (which happens a lot) you have to split it
<jsgotangco> at least you get to be on the history books
<ajmitch> the money probably isn't meant to be the main benefit now
<LaserJock> yes, that's the real fun
* TheMuso returns
<LaserJock> and you get to go around giving presentations with wet-erase markers
* bddebian turns his badge in to ajmitch
<LaserJock> and everybody loves it
<ajmitch> bddebian: ?
<bddebian> ajmitch: I'm getting my arse kicked by a stupid little package
<ajmitch> right
<bddebian> Should configure be called before or after patch
<ajmitch> so fix the package
<ajmitch> depends what you're patching - generally after
<bddebian> Thx
<ajmitch> up to you, really
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: yay :)
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: di dyou succeed?
* Hobbsee pinches the easy merges.
<bddebian> You mean you don't have them all done YET? ;-P
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: leave some for the rest of us poor people who struggle along with stuff
<LaserJock> yeah
<bddebian> Yeah, I haven't done any yet.. :-)
<Hobbsee> hah
<Hobbsee> get going, bddebian
<bddebian> Nah, I'm useless
<LaserJock> if I ever get to do MOTU work again I'll want some decent merges to do ;-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: weren't you told that it's bad to lie?
<bddebian> ajmitch: What am I lying about? :-)
<Hobbsee> yay.  something broke on LP
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: hmmm, how about doing a MOTU School session? or are you busy with uni stuff?
<ajmitch> wow, there's a surprise
<Hobbsee> !ping
<ubotu> pong
<ajmitch> yes, teach us, Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: busy with uni stuff, and i wouldnt make a good teacher with that sort of stuff
* Hobbsee couldnt teach ajmitch anything.
<bddebian> w00t, frickin' A
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: well you don't have to teach ajmitch, just people like me
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you're funny
<Hobbsee> heh
<LaserJock> but if your'e busy I'll let you go, this time
<Hobbsee> yay.  LP really did break.
<LaserJock> I need somebody to teach me CDBS
<bddebian> Don't we all? ;-P
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: i am rather, at the moment.  what would it be on?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: good luck finding someone to teach that
<welshbyte> i don't even know what CDBS stands for :/
<Hobbsee> hah
<bddebian> Common Debian Build System
<bddebian> I think
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: sure i cant teach yada?
<welshbyte> now i do :)
* Hobbsee ducks
<ajmitch> LaserJock: hobbsee has patched cdbs in the past, get her to teach it
* Hobbsee runs away very quickly
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: you merged it.
<LaserJock> ajmitch: that was my point ;-)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: you should do it.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: never
* Hobbsee has crappy timezones.
<ajmitch> do you see any uploads by me?
<LaserJock> actually, we need crappy timezones
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: nope.  i'll teach yada :P
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: that shall be an easy lesson
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: true, no
<Hobbsee> didnt look
<ajmitch> do you see any packages of mine that actually use cdbs?
<Hobbsee> havent looked at them either
* bddebian builds zope with CDBS ;-P
* welshbyte makes a note to not use "will you teach me CDBS?" as a pickup line next time he's at a bar
<ajmitch> you do that, bddebian
<bddebian> welshbyte: ;-)
<ajmitch> welshbyte: depends on what sort of bar it is
<Hobbsee> hah
<welshbyte> hehe
<LaserJock> it might work at a Debian bar
<welshbyte> unfortunately there aren't any bars in this city where that line would work :(
<ajmitch> LaserJock: we have our LUG meetings in a bar
<LaserJock> hmmm
<LaserJock> mine starts at an ISP and ends in a bar
<ajmitch> heh
* Hobbsee tries again, to imagine herself drunk
* ajmitch doesn't want to imagine that
<bddebian> mine starts at home and ends at home :-)
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you're bad enough sober :)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: hah
* Hobbsee gets out her whip
<Hobbsee> say that again....
<ajmitch> it would be funny though
<Hobbsee> indeed
<ajmitch> that's ok, you're not in NZ
<Hobbsee> maybe i'll have to get drunk at StevenK's or something.
* Hobbsee has a very very long whip :P
<ajmitch> hah
<LaserJock> I'd love to see a video of a drunk Hobbsee
<ajmitch> poor StevenK
<LaserJock> I bet she gets giggley
<Hobbsee> like i dont anyway :P
<ajmitch> LaserJock: she's giggly enough as it is
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: now be fair.  you have seen me non-giggly, too
* Hobbsee might have just been drunk all the time that ajmitch was here.
<ajmitch> true
<ajmitch> though you were driving
<ajmitch> and that scares me, the thought of you driving through sydney while drunk
<Hobbsee> just think...you were in the car with me a lot...
* Hobbsee contemplates driving while drunk.
<Hobbsee> !ping
<ubotu> pong
<ajmitch> stop abusing the poor bot
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: haha
* Hobbsee has a dodgy uni connection today, it seems
<ajmitch> you mean a connection via a dodgy uni?
<LaserJock> hmm, is ubuntu-bugsquad LP team still used?
<LaserJock> or is it just ubuntu-qa
<Hobbsee> i more meant that i'm at uni, and have a dodgy connection
<ajmitch> bugsquad is still there, not sure what practical use it has
<Hobbsee> boo
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: i think it is for meetings, and for a place to subscribe bugs
* Hobbsee steals a merge, and rebuilds a section of *gasp* nautilus.
<imbrandon> oh i wish i would win the lottery
<imbrandon> lol
<LaserJock> hehe, make sure you don't get sucked into the dark side why you are doing it
<LaserJock> imbrandon: hmmm, and you lived in Reno, right? ;-)
<imbrandon> nooooo Hobbsee put the gtk program down ......
<imbrandon> LaserJock: yup
<imbrandon> lol
<Hobbsee> haha
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: yeah, no danger of that
<Hobbsee> i'd only need to get 175MB of archives, too...
<LaserJock> heh, well I installed kubuntu today
<imbrandon> ;) welcome to the light LaserJock
<LaserJock> and then edubuntu-desktop
<welshbyte> bah i didn't realise inheriting an open source project would be so much work.. and i haven't even started coding yet
<LaserJock> hahahahaha
<imbrandon> heh i might put edubuntu on box here to ltsp into it from my lappy just too see how it works
<LaserJock> welcome to our world, welshbyte ... mwhuauauaua
<welshbyte> hehe
<LaserJock> imbrandon: ogra brought a thin client to Paris with him, it was pretty cool
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Unfortunately not.
<LaserJock> we set it up with highvoltage's laptop as the server
<welshbyte> just setting up the web pages and trac/svn how i want them *sweat*
<imbrandon> you i just realized that the DD that agreed to review apt-mirror on mentors.d.n idles in here ;) hehe ( even though i've never seen him speak )
<bddebian> Anyone here use prismstumbler?
<imbrandon> s/you/you\ know/
<LaserJock> hmmm
<imbrandon> LaserJock: nice
* LaserJock pokes around -motu looking for DDs
* bddebian points at ajmitch
<imbrandon> he i dont know if he wants to be pingd or not , but its not hard to figure out i would imagine ( and no not ajmitch becouse like i said i've never seen this person talk in here )
<imbrandon> just idle
* ajmitch idles
* Hobbsee points at StevenK, but he's afk
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: is a good target, looking for  DD>
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: who, StevenK ?
<bddebian> StevenK is a DD?
<Hobbsee> yeah
<Hobbsee> i think so
* Hobbsee considers installing gnome.
<ajmitch> bddebian: what do you think?
<bddebian> Hobbsee: traitor
<Hobbsee> guess there's not much point on this uni connection.
<bddebian> ajmitch: My opinion means nothing
* imbrandon notes its the only person with a DD cloak that he see's , definately the first on the list
<ajmitch> imbrandon: there are a number of DDs to lurk here
<bddebian> azeem is a DD but don't know if he's around or not
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: *are* we still here?
<Hobbsee> do we want to still be here?
<TheMuso> Where is here?
<ajmitch> imbrandon: I count at least 8 DDs currently in the channel
<ajmitch> there are probably more
<imbrandon> with DD cloaks ?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: a guy is asking in #ubuntu+1 if either of us are here
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: no
<TheMuso> I see it.
<LaserJock> odd
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yes?
<LaserJock> somebody wants to know if Hobbsee or ajmitch is there?
<imbrandon> Hobbsee , ajmitch : you all arround ? hehehe
<imbrandon> ugh , i'm getting tired of kmail , anyone got a sugestion for a GRAPHICAL email client they prefer ? i need to try something new
<imbrandon> maybe evolution
<TheMuso> What about mutt?
<Hobbsee> hah.  i'm definetly not there then
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: thunderbird's not too bad
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: thunderbird likes to eat my imap mail for some reason
<imbrandon> 'kmail just isnt stable
<TheMuso> Use something like offlineimap then.
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: ahh...
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: yeah, exactly
<imbrandon> mutt/pine is console and i'd prefer not to use a console email app
* Hobbsee has never found that thunderbird has eaten her imap mail
* Hobbsee hugs imap
<LaserJock> imbrandon: really, evo always eats my imap
<LaserJock> thunderbird usually handles it fine
<imbrandon> TheMuso: well i have a semi complicated setup as is, all my mail forwards to a gmail account then i grab it on the file server via fetchmail and use procmail to filter it into folders and connect to my local fileserver via courior imap
<TheMuso> eeeeeeeeeeeeeew
<imbrandon> best way i've found for me to get my mail anywhere from all my accounts without using a webmail interface ;)
<welshbyte> i use thunderbird with a *lot* of config tweaks to get it close to how i want it
<LaserJock> I just use whatever's handy
<imbrandon> welshbyte: then i would have to tweak the config on every system i use here at home , i like to do all the configs ( main ones ) server side so i can use virtualy any client
<imbrandon> but alas i havent found a client i like heh
<imbrandon> although mail.app is nice but osx only heh
<LaserJock> I still use thunderbird on OS X
<LaserJock> mail.app is nice but it chokes on my imap at school
<imbrandon> i use ff but not tb
<imbrandon> yea mail.app chokes on large accounts
<imbrandon> it seems
<LaserJock> I even tried MS Entourage or however it is spelled
<welshbyte> oh i usually just scp the prefs.js to any new setups i have
<imbrandon> welshbyte: thats a pita heh i used to do that, i even had a .thunderbird maped via nfs too and tried that way, simplest to do the tweaks via procmail
<Hobbsee> gah.
<imbrandon> plus one good thing about that is i can ssh into my home box when i'm on the road and use mutt is i HAVE to
<imbrandon> s/is/if
<Hobbsee> is this still the email discussion?
<welshbyte> imbrandon: yeah i use procmail serverside for the email filtering stuff too, but i tweak the thunderbird prefs to get it to use plain text everywhere, insert the right "on foo, bar said:" line and lots of other stuff
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: nope talking about quantom physics
<Hobbsee> ah right
<LaserJock> imbrandon: oh goodie
<Hobbsee> hah
<LaserJock> I was hoping for that
<Hobbsee> you should have known better to mention such thigns with LaserJock around.
<imbrandon> if evolution was avail in osx it would be nice, i wonder if its in fink
<LaserJock> did you know that everything about an atom is described by an imaginary equation?
<imbrandon> LaserJock: yup pretty much
<imbrandon> LaserJock: have you ever read God Debris ?
<LaserJock> everything there is to know about a molecule is described by a non-real wave
<imbrandon> its fiction but very well thought out story touching such things
<LaserJock> hmm, no
<LaserJock> I'll have to look it up
<imbrandon> its a free book ( pdf ) from the author of dilbert, you can read it all in one evening
<imbrandon> but dosent have anything remotely to do with dilbert
<imbrandon> heh
<LaserJock> and oddly many problems in Quatum Mechanics take pages and pages to write out and end up with = pi/2
<imbrandon> lol
* imbrandon loves the fraction of a percent about what he knows about quantum stuff
<LaserJock> and much of the math is totally "hand waving" as we call it
<LaserJock> but in the end it works out and the universe is preserved, phew
<imbrandon> yea there are 99.9999999% unknowns used in quantom stuff
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> you ever read the book "timeline" ? not the movie
<imbrandon> it has some very cool "based on real" fiction too
<imbrandon> about quantom stuff
<welshbyte> *hand wave* light does travel as discrete packets of energy... these aren't the droids you're looking for
<LaserJock> and matter really is a wave, it just doesn't look like it ;-)
<imbrandon> its by michael creighton ( sp ? )
<welshbyte> crichton, i believe
<imbrandon> yea
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> another weird thing in quantum physics, to me anyway, is time reversal symmetry
<imbrandon> y?
<imbrandon> err like ?
<Hobbsee> screen -R
<Hobbsee> oops
<LaserJock> well, in the math used for quantum mechanics you have to look carefully at the symmetry of the equations
<LaserJock> like if you replace x with -x do you get the same thing?
<LaserJock> well, time is a funny thing
<LaserJock> it isn't symmetric
<bddebian> Anyone have a suggestion for what .desktop categories prismstumbler would belong to?
<bddebian>  Network;Utility ?
<imbrandon> yea time is messy
<imbrandon> hard to explain it with math ( leaste in terms i can semi comprehend )
<imbrandon> bddebian: i would say so
<imbrandon> bddebian: look what cate kismet is in , i would stick it in the same category
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: some people like to complain about lack of docs, don't they?
<bddebian> thx imbrandon
<bddebian> imbrandon: It doesn't have any :-)
<imbrandon> LaserJock: http://www.andrewsmcmeel.com/godsdebris/  <-- theres the link , very light ~150 pages or so, like i said its short but will make you think more about some of einsteins theorys and quantom stuff, well really look at it diffrent
<imbrandon> bddebian: ouch hrm well yea network:utils would be a good place
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: that they do
<imbrandon> dont worry the name is misleading its not about God or religon though ;)
<LaserJock> imbrandon: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_reversal for some light reading ;-)
<imbrandon> cool , kk
<LaserJock> imbrandon: actually maybe http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrow_of_time is an easier read
* Hobbsee tests to see if the suspend breaks again
<imbrandon> crazy
<ajmitch> imbrandon: correct
<Hobbsee> (die hobbsee, die!)
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you didn't know infinity was in .au?
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: You should have. :p
<bddebian> What permissions should dpatch files have?
<Hobbsee> i vaguely knew
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: heh, never met him
<bddebian> Well dx has 0755 but I just made two for prismstumbler and pbuilder is complaining about them having 0755
<TheMuso> Its nice to see that launchpad plays a doesn't chuck some weird error message with elinks any more.
<TheMuso> Used to get very annoying.
<bddebian> Oh crap, that's not my problem, I get this:
<bddebian> ./configure --prefix=/usr
<bddebian> make: execvp: ./configure: Permission denied
<bddebian> make: *** [configure]  Error 127
<imbrandon> heh
<bddebian> heh?
<bddebian> I didn't get that until I added my dpatches :-(
<Laser_away> ok, the wife is waiting with the car, good night MOTU land
<ajmitch> night
<bddebian> Gnight Laser_away
<bddebian> ajmitch: Any suggestions? ^^
<bddebian> Anyone?
<hub> bddebian: are you sure that configure is runing the right shell
<hub> bddebian: or is +x
<bddebian> It was fine until I added two patches
<Hobbsee> bddebian: you're not supposed to break things...
<bddebian> It doesn't make any sense
<tritium> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Heya tritium
<tritium> bddebian: anything new on the mythtv front?
<bddebian> tritium: I have requested a sync of 0.19 from Debian Multimedia
<tritium> bddebian: ooh, fantastic
<tritium> bddebian: debian-multimedia is the new marillat repo name?
<bddebian> Aye
<tritium> Cool
<tritium> bddebian: hopefully that will happen, then.  Even backporting that to dapper would be a good thing
<welshbyte> eep it's getting light
<welshbyte> bed time
<bddebian> Aye
<bddebian> Gah, I give up.  Gnight folks
<imbrandon> gnight folks its time for bed
<ajmitch> nice
<ajmitch> someone broke soyuz well, it's spammed edgy-changes nicely
<StevenK> Nice!
<StevenK> doko's upload for glib-java seems to be the first.
<Seveas> ajmitch, StevenK: urgh indeed -- we now get source AND binary upload mails
<StevenK> Do we have to?
* StevenK much prefered getting a source upload mail, and then checking build logs on LP.
* StevenK buggers to have dinner with his wife.
<imbrandon> hrm whats up with edgy-changes showing all the diffrent arches for uploads now
<Toadstool> 'morning everybody
<StevenK> imbrandon: Yes, I wish it would stop.
<asimon> I wonder if revu.tauware.de is operational. I uploaded two packages yesterday but they didn't appear in the list. When I try to recover my password I get a python backtrace (global name 'REVUBASE' is not defined). I suppose something went wrong.
<ajmitch> asimon: before uploading, were you in the ubuntu-universe-contributors team on launchpad, and after joining, did you ask for the keyring to be resynced on revu?
<asimon> ajmitch: Yes I am in the contributers group. I added a gpg key to my launchpad accound. What do I need to do to get the keyring on revu synced?
<ajmitch> you need to ask a revu admin to do it, before you upload
* ajmitch is doing it now
<asimon> ajmitch: Okay, thank you very much.
<ajmitch> asimon: what were the packages you uploaded?
<asimon> It looks like the part of asking for the keyring to be synced is missing on wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU  ;-)
<asimon> ajmitch: gtk2-engines-qtcurve_0.41.1-0ubuntu1  and  kde-style-qtcurve_0.41.1-0ubuntu1
<ajmitch> ok, packages should be listed now
<asimon> ajmitch: Great, thank you.
<siretart> asimon: where did you get the error about 'REVUBASE'?
<asimon> siretart: When I click 'recover' to recover the password, i.e.  http://revu.tauware.de/lostpw.py?email=andreas.w.simon@gmail.com
<asimon> siretart: See also here for the backtrace: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20862
<siretart> asimon: ok. lostpw.py is seriously fucked up. need to investigate that
<asimon> siretart: Yes, such things happen ;-)
<siretart> asimon: thanks for reporting anyway
<asimon> siretart: you're welcome
<tepsipakki> preview-latex should be deleted from edgy, auctex replaces it now (and conflicts with it)
<tepsipakki> does motu-powers suffice to do that?-)
<tepsipakki> ok, filed a bug about it
<geser> hi
<geser> is here someone familiar with gcj?
<geser> I tried to rebuild pdftk against libgcj7-0 and it failed at the linking stage
<geser> a log is attached to bug 56580
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56580 in pdftk "[Edgy]  Please rebuild against libgcj7-0" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56580
<TheMuso> Hey Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso
<ajmitch> hello TheMuso, Hobbsee
<TheMuso> Hey ajmitch.
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: debsign -r looks cool :)
<TheMuso> Night folks.
<Hobbsee> night TheMuso
* TheMuso retires a little early.
* asimon is away: I'm busy
<Hobbsee> asimon: please turn off the away messages
<zul> but how do we know if he is truely away :)
<Hobbsee> zul: hah
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Aren't you supposed to tell him that in a kick reason? :-P
<Hobbsee> StevenK: i did think of that.  in both channels.
<Hobbsee> make that in all three
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Gloubiboulga> heya bddebian :)
<bddebian> Hi Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> siretart, hello, are you around?
<siretart> Gloubiboulga: yes, but busy
<Gloubiboulga> siretart, ok, I have a Permission issue on tiber, but it's not urgent
<bddebian> siretart!!
<siretart> Gloubiboulga: please /query me the issue
<siretart> huhu bddebian
<bddebian> siretart: Hey, can I hack up the MOTUGames page a little?  For example the GL/GLU translations link should be dropped.
<siretart> bddebian: just go on! i didn't have time lately to do anything on MOTUGames (besides fixing scorched3d)
<bddebian> I've been trying but failing as usual :-(
<siretart> scorched3d should be in quite reasonable state now. It still segfaults on amd64 on exit and with bird sound enabled
<bddebian> OK, this error is still killing me.. :-(
<bddebian> ./configure --prefix=/usr
<bddebian> make: execvp: ./configure: Permission denied
<bddebian> make: *** [configure]  Error 127
<siretart> bddebian: chmod +x configure
<bddebian> It is 0755 already
<Kyral_Laptop> hmm I should start coding again
<siretart> ro filesystem perhaps?
<bddebian> In pbuilder
<bddebian> ?
<zul> i just thought of something when you enter a username in the installer what if you choose root what would happen?
<josesanch> hello
<josesanch> i have uploaded a new version of gnomecatalog http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1560 a couple of times.
<josesanch> But the new versions is not in motu
<bddebian> josesanch: Have you fixed the issues raphink commented on?
<josesanch> yes..
<josesanch> the problem is that i did a dput. Everything seens ok. But the new version is not there
<josesanch> bbdebian: do you know why?
<bddebian> josesanch: Oh, sorry.  No, you need to ping a REVU admin.
<josesanch> by e-mail?
<josesanch> ok.. i'm going to search in wiki
<bddebian> josesanch: No, usually there are some around
<josesanch> ahh.. ok.. I'll wait
<josesanch> bddebian: thanks a lot
<bddebian> siretart: Still around?
<welshbyte> good evening
<bddebian> Heya welshbyte
<lfittl> Lathiat: ping
<AnAnt_> I was wondering why didn't u guys try mutt-ng since it is on debian
<lfittl> siretart: ping
<welshbyte> AnAnt_: looks like mutt-ng is in debian experimental... ubuntu gets its debian packages from debian unstable
<AnAnt_> welshbyte: ic
<AnAnt_> thanks
<micahcowan> There is a user having trouble with a particular program (tuxpaint) on a particular printer (Brother HL 2700CN). I have a few ideas as to how this might be fixed, but as I don't have that printer, I'd need the bug reporter to check them out. What is the approved way to do this? Should I give them a debdiff, and tell them how to build a .deb from it, or is it permissible to give them a .deb in their architecture, and ask them to install it (possibl
<micahcowan> y trusting me not to do something nasty while my .deb's install gets root...)?
<AnAnt_> bddebian: you there ?
<bddebian> Yessir
<AnAnt_> bddebian: I just checked your comment on kchmviewer
<AnAnt_> bddebian: I don't understand  what should I do regarding that ?
<bddebian> AnAnt_: the version?
<AnAnt_> bddebian: yes
<AnAnt_> bddebian: it is version 2.6
<AnAnt_> bddebian: and that raises another question too
<AnAnt_> bddebian: I added a package (that doesn't exist on debian) called acon, which is to enable reading/writing arabic in virtual console. So does its NON-existance in debian make a problem ?
<bddebian> AnAnt_: I think I commented on that too :-)
<AnAnt_> oh you want me to just change the version names, I didn't realize that
<AnAnt_> ok, that's it ?
<bddebian> AnAnt_: No it's not a problem.  But if the version is newer in Ubuntu or it doesn't existing in Debian, the release number should be -0ubuntu1
<AnAnt_> other than that, the acon & kchmviewer are fine ?
<bddebian> That way if it does get to debian and they make foo 1.0.1-1 we can sync it :-)
<AnAnt_> other than that, the acon & kchmviewer are fine ?
<bddebian> kchmviewer yes.  Acon, you don't need the entire GPL text in debian/copyright. Other than that and the version, it looks OK to me.
<AnAnt_> well, so what do I put in debian/copyright ?
<Laser_away> micahcowan: did you get your question answered?
<micahcowan> Not yet... :(
<Laser_away> micahcowan: sure, send them a .deb
<Toadstool> heya folks
<AnAnt_> ok, I found an example
<welshbyte> hm i might need a reminder here
<welshbyte> i have a package that isn't in debian and i'm packaging it. it's currently version 0.4.2 ... does it go to 0.4.2-0ubuntu1 ?
<crimsun> (yes)
<bddebian> AnAnt_: Oh.. If you want more info, you can also read this page in the licensing section: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Reviewing
<bddebian> welshbyte: Yes
<welshbyte> woo i got it right :)
<AnAnt_> bddebian: ok, I just uploaded them now
<bddebian> AnAnt_: I'm at work now but I'll try to check tonight.  Of course we still need a second reviewer too :-)
<AnAnt_> is there something wrong with the password recovery on REVU ?
<bddebian> That I don't know
<bddebian> sorry
<LaserJock> AnAnt_: at times
<LaserJock> it's always worked for me
<LaserJock> but other people have reported it just coming up empty
<AnAnt_> yup, that's what happened
<AnAnt> is there a way to build several .dsc files in the same pbuilder command (to avoid delay of unpacking pbuilder environment for every package) ?
<LaserJock> well, you unpack the pbuilder to keep it clean
<AnAnt> LaserJock: btw, what browser are you using ?
<AnAnt> I tried lynx & elinks, both failed in password recovery
<LaserJock> right now?
<LaserJock> firefox
<AnAnt> ok
<AnAnt> sometimes it gives my a python error !
<AnAnt> well, anyways, thanks for the help
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-18
<Lutin> Hi
<Toadstool> hi Lutin
<Lutin> hi Toadstool
<Lutin> Could you tell me what to do to have the package from my own repo considered as coming from an authenticated source by apt ?
<Laser_away> it needs to be signed
<Laser_away> and the users need to import your key
<Lutin> Laser_away, what files have to be signed ?
<Laser_away> Lutin: the packages at least
<Laser_away> you might also have to sign the Packages.gz file, but I"m not sure about that
<Lutin> Laser_away, ok, thought signing Release was enough
<Lutin> So I have to sign _all_ the pacakges ?
<Laser_away> I think so
<Laser_away> as the packages are what is being installed
<Laser_away> s/is/are/
<Lutin> Laser_away, how should I sign them ? using gpg --clearsign ?
<Laser_away> I'm guess no
<Laser_away> There should be a tool that does that
<Laser_away> perhaps debsign or something
<Laser_away> how do you make your .debs?
<Lutin> pbuilder
<TheMuso> Release is the only file that gets signed afaik
<Lutin> TheMuso, is it correct to sign it using gpg --ba -o Release.gpg Release ?
<Laser_away> hmm, I guess Release does have the md5sum of the rest
<TheMuso> Lutin: Not sure. Can't remember, as its a while since I did it.
<Lutin> TheMuso, ok. I did sign the release file and put the key into apt using apt-key add, but the pacakges are still not authenticated :(
<Lutin> I should have missed smthg
<TheMuso> Lutin: How did you create the Release file?
<Lutin> TheMuso: using apt-ftparchive
<TheMuso> ah ok
<Lutin> is it a problem ?
<TheMuso> No not at all
<Lutin> can't find out what I did wrong
<Lutin> TheMuso, should the kay have an expiration date ?
<Lutin> s/kay/key
<bddebian> Heya gang
<nictuku> hello
<bddebian> Hi nictuku
* welshbyte takes a heavy beating from rdiff-backup
<bddebian> Heya welshbyte
<welshbyte> ello bddebian
<welshbyte> how goes it?
<bddebian> OK, thanks you?
<crimsun> remember, barry's now ranked in the top contributors to Ubuntu, so make sure you refresh BdDebianIsAGod. Thanks.
<bddebian> crimsun: You truly are an ass :-)
* bddebian needs a minion
<bddebian> Hello freeflying, imbrandon :-)
<imbrandon> heya bddebian
<bddebian> Who is Jeff Bailes?
<nictuku> I wonder why aptitude is taking soooo long to startup
<welshbyte> bddebian: stressed, thanks :)
<welshbyte> nictuku: it could be running out of supercow powers :)
<Riddell> does gnome-app-install have a sources.list editor?
<imbrandon> i dont think so, i think it uses synaptic sources.list editor
<imbrandon> moins Riddell
<Riddell> imbrandon: so to get at universe programmes you have to click Advanced, launch synaptic and edit sources from there?
<imbrandon> afaik, hold on i'll check on my gnome box
<welshbyte> imho repo selection should probably be integrated into the installation.. i only ever change them (i.e. select all of them) once unless i need to dist-upgrade
<imbrandon> Riddell: yea i dont see an editor anywhere in it
<Riddell> interesting
<imbrandon> you can choose a componet to only show apps from
<Riddell> I wonder if it automatically enables universe if you tick that box
<imbrandon> but it just ues what you have in your sources as far as i can tell
<imbrandon> i dunno , i could do a clean install here in a while in a VM and test it if you want
<imbrandon> not enabling anyting and testing it
<imbrandon> etc
<imbrandon> s/anything/univserse/g
<Riddell> well, seems gnome-app-install doesn't want to install at the moment, else I'd test it myself
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> well i'll plan to try it in a vm after i finish dinner , if nothing else just to know
<bddebian> Anyone want to do some dirty work for me? :)
<bmonty> in return for what?
<bddebian> What do you want? :-)
<welshbyte> bddebian: define "dirty work" ;)
<bddebian> Writing a man page :-)
<welshbyte> for prismstumbler? :P
<bddebian> Yes :-)
* bddebian listens to the crickets :)
<welshbyte> bddebian: ok i'll bite
<welshbyte> bddebian: it'll be my second ever man page though so you might want to check it over when i'm done ;)
<bddebian> welshbyte: YOU ROCK! :-)
<welshbyte> tell a friend ;)
<bddebian> welshbyte: Definetly :-)
<bddebian> OK, what to do tonight.  Merges, revu, or bug "fixing"
<ajmitch> bddebian: d) all of the above
<bddebian> ajmitch: :-)
<bddebian> I have to pick a "mode" or I get confused easily :)
<imbrandon>  /set mode ubuntu-demi-god-fix-everything-all-at-the-same-time
<ajmitch> imbrandon: demi?
<bmonty> bddebian is definately a full-fledged god
<imbrandon> ;)
* welshbyte pokes the wiki page of the almighty one
<bddebian> You folks are on crack
* imbrandon puts the crackpipe down and decides to sift though his email before he starts anything tonight
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> I can't figure out why lsb-base was added to ddclient?
<ajmitch> lsb_release
<ajmitch> maybe it used to be in there
* ajmitch shrugs
<bddebian> ajmitch: lsb_release?
<welshbyte> hm this might be easier if prismstumbler actually worked
<bddebian> welshbyte: I have one that works
<bddebian> You on dapper?
<welshbyte> edgy at the moment
<welshbyte> got dapper on my laptop though
<bddebian> Ack, give me a sec and I'll throw up an edgy .deb.  I'd actually like to know that it works anyway ;-P
<welshbyte> hehe
<bddebian> welshbyte: http://www2.bddebian.com:8000/packages/ubuntu/prismstumbler/edgy_deb/
<bddebian> Hmm, where's dholbach.. :-)
<welshbyte> guess i should've mentioned i'm on an AMD64 box ;)
<bddebian> Ack
<ajmitch> heh
<slomo> bddebian: vacation
<bddebian> I think my source package is in the prismstumbler dir
<bddebian> slomo: Oh, thx
<slomo> why? :)
<bddebian> He is the one that added lsb-base to ddclient back for Hoary
<bddebian> Damnit I'm getting nothing done..
* welshbyte waits for pbuilder
<welshbyte> hehe, it failed
<bddebian> welshbyte: Permission denied?
<welshbyte> bddebian: yep
<bddebian> welshbyte: For right now just add chmod +x configure and chmod +x src/gpsd/configure  right above the ./configure line in debian/rules and see if it builds.  If you don't mind
<bddebian> Holy crap does wine have a lot of bugs in Debian
<fbond> midisport-firmware, anyone?
<fbond> on revu?
<fbond> arguably not very useful to test if you don't own midisport hardware...
<fbond> but atleast the packaging can be inspected?
<bddebian> fbond: Didn't I look at that one?
<fbond> don't think so, lemme double check...
<fbond> bddebian, nope, 5 uploads, no comments
<fbond> :)
<fbond> you probably passed over it several times, though...
<bddebian> Give me a few minutes and I'
<bddebian> ll take a look
<welshbyte> um, remind me how to get the ubuntu-ised source out of the deb source files?
<bddebian> welshbyte: ?  dpkg-source -x foo.dsc
<welshbyte> thanks
<bddebian> No, THANK YOU :-)
<fbond> bddebian, thanks
<bddebian> fbond: Well the first thing I see is that you have debconf templates but don't use po-debconf
<fbond> damn
<fbond> it's such a trivial question, too
<fbond> k, mind leaving a comment after full inspection, and I'll re-upload tomorrow?
<bddebian> fbond: I'm doing so.  However, why do you wget the firmware files on build?
<fbond> license
<fbond> The firmware is not open source
<fbond> But MidiMan released the firmware in binary form
<fbond> it can be distributed only as part of the original source package
<fbond> I tried to clarify/confirm with the upstream maintainer, but he was not very friendly to my request
<fbond> I think he thought I was patronizing him over the situation.
<bddebian> Why didn't you just include them in the tar.gz if you regenerated that anyway?
<welshbyte> bddebian: working at last :)
<bddebian> welshbyte: Awesome, thx
<fbond> I thought about that, but it didn't seem quite clean, license-wise
<bddebian> How would it be different that what you are doing? I am far from a license expert by the way :-)
<fbond> Hmm....
<fbond> this is why I tried to clarify the license
<fbond> thing is, the binary .deb cannot contain the firmware
<fbond> only the source tarball
<fbond> so you would still have to download at install time...
<fbond> you would download from the ubuntu repo instead of upstream ...
<fbond> but it's not possible to have firmware in orig.tar.gz and not in binary .debs, is it?
<fbond> yes, I guess it would be: rm them in debian/rules, or explicitly remove them prior to debdiff
<fbond> ?
<bddebian> How is it not in the .deb the way you are doing it?  Or are you just pulling them to build with and then removing?
<fbond> exactly
<crimsun> fbond: you need to fix the udev rules to work with Edgy.
<bddebian> Ah
<crimsun> (I said as much about a month ago on irc.)
<ajmitch> it's not possible to download anything at build time
<fbond> crimsun, don't recall speaking about this previously
<ajmitch> so it'd have to be at install
<fbond> what needs to chagne?
<fbond> ajmitch, not possible to download at build time?
<crimsun> location and syntax
<fbond> ok i'm not up to speed on this (don't hit me too hard over it)
<fbond> where can I refer to for new info?
<crimsun> /etc/udev/rules.d/README
<bddebian> Damn, I need about 4 or 5 more machines to build on :-)
<ajmitch> while others struggle along with 1 old machine
<zul> some struggle with 3
<bddebian> ajmitch: Well I only have 1 ubuntu machine here at home to build on :-(
<zul> slow?
<zul> anyways...im going to go relax
<bddebian> Enjoy
<bddebian> Wow, wine is a pig
<welshbyte> bddebian: http://andrewprice.me.uk/dropoff/prismstumbler.1
<welshbyte> need any more detail than that?
<bddebian> welshbyte: YOU FREAKIN' ROCK!!!!!!
<welshbyte> :)
<bddebian> welshbyte: BTW, did it run from the Gnome menu?
<welshbyte> bddebian: it did indeed
<bddebian> Kick ass..  Thanks a million for all your time!
<welshbyte> you're welcome :)
<bddebian> welshbyte: Still bored? ;-)
<welshbyte> heh, more dirty jobs to do?
<bddebian> Hmm, I was going to have you try tulip from Debian on your AMD64 but it has an RC bug that needs patching first :-(
<welshbyte> shame :)
<bddebian> welshbyte: Unless you want to try to patch it and build it? ;-P
<welshbyte> looks a bit over my head at the moment, i'm afraid
<welshbyte> plus it's 4:20am and i should probably get some sleep before it gets light ;)
<bddebian> Ack, get to bed man
<welshbyte> will do, just catching up on my feeds
<bddebian> Heh
<welshbyte> right then, good night :)
<bddebian> welsh... grr
<bddebian> Hmm, interesting "license"
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<siretart> morning
<ajmitch> hi siretart
<imbrandon_> moins siretart ajmitch
* imbrandon_ yawns
<ajmitch> hello imbrandon_
<siretart> huhu ajmitch, morning imbrandon_
<imbrandon_> hum i wonder if a dapper --> sid upgrade would go semi smooth
<Lathiat> i highly doubt it
<imbrandon_> me too lol
<jsgotangco> heh
* jsgotangco should take time to burn his sarge dvds
<imbrandon_> ;)
<AnAnt> how do I remove a file that was wrongly uploaded ?
<AnAnt> anyone here ?
<imbrandon_> uploaded to where ?
<AnAnt> to REVU
<imbrandon_> put in the comments of it you would like it NUKED and ping a revu admin
<AnAnt> I can't login to REVU webpage, the recover password isn't working
<AnAnt> and who are REVU admins ?
<imbrandon_> i thnik ajmitch  and siretart are, if they arent busy
<imbrandon_> there is a list of them on the wiki
<AnAnt> isn't there a way to resume the upload ?!
<imbrandon_> remove your *.upload file and reupload it if thats what you mean
<AnAnt> imbrandon_: what happened is that the upload got interrupted, so only the DSC file got uploaded, yet the orig & diff files weren't uploaded
<AnAnt> imbrandon_: now I try to upload again, but it won't work, because the DSC file exists
<imbrandon_> remove the .upload file it created localy and try again
<AnAnt> it did not create any upload file
<imbrandon_> ok whats the error when you try to upload again then >?
<ajmitch> AnAnt: what's the package name?
<AnAnt> ajmitch: kchmviewer
<ajmitch> cleared
<AnAnt> thanks
<imbrandon_> thanks ajmitch  ;)
* ajmitch wonders who is uploading tunapie
<imbrandon_> heh what a name
<AnAnt> hungry ?
<AnAnt>  /qui
<Lutin> hi
<Lutin> could someone tell me exactly what to do to sign a repo ?
<Toadstool> heya everybody
<Lutin> no one can tell me how to sign a repo ?
<LaserJock> heh, well we already have our repo signed for us
<LaserJock> it's not something we commonly do
<Lutin> that's right ...
<Toadstool> hehe
<Toadstool> hi LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi Toadstool
<animimotus> hello
<animimotus> someone know Transmission ? A BitTorrent client. It features a simple, intuitive interface on top on an efficient, cross-platform back-end.
<animimotus> http://transmission.m0k.org/
<animimotus> it'll nice to see it packed in universe or another deposit, I don't know how to do a paquet ^^
<Riddell> Lutin: http://kubuntu.org/packages/amarok-141/ARCHIVE
<HiddenWolf> Hey guys
<Riddell> animimotus: https://help.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html :)
<Lutin> Riddell, thanks a lot :)
<Riddell> Lutin: there may be better ways to do it, but that works for me
<Lutin> Riddell, and then add the key used for signing with apt-key add, right ?
<Riddell> Lutin: yes
<animimotus> Riddell, I don't want to be a geek :)
<animimotus> I'm a basic user :|
<Riddell> animimotus: there's a wiki page somewhere under MOTU for suggesting packages to be made
<animimotus> ah ok, I will search
<Toadstool> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Candidates <-- this one
<Toadstool> but it's a bit outdated and messy...
<animimotus> merci Toadstool :)
<Toadstool> de rien ;)
<Lutin> Riddell, thanks alot, that works for mee too :)
<Lutin> s/mee/me
<HiddenWolf> Right. I'm trying to build gossip 0.14 for dapper, but I get an error that it can't find galago.
<HiddenWolf> is there any way I can get around that, and if so, how?
<slomo> HiddenWolf: are the galago build-depends fine?
<slomo> could you paste the configure output somewhere?
<slomo> oh wait, dapper...
<slomo> --disable-galago maybe :)
<HiddenWolf> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20964
<HiddenWolf> slomo: how would I pass that option?
<HiddenWolf> slomo: nm, fixed. :)
<neutrinomass> I just ran into the following problem: http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/contrib/s/snes9express/snes9express_1.42-5/changelog lists a different changelog for 1.42-4 than https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/edgy/+source/snes9express/+changelog . Probably the person that fixed it did dch -i without changing to ubuntuX ....
<azeem> yes
<neutrinomass> ... so what do we do now? Could it be that this prevented a sync of debian's 1.42-4 (which contains a fix for a bug) ?
<zul> couldnt you extract the fix from debian's 1.42-4?
<tseng> you could make 4ubuntu1
<tseng> and merge the debian changes by hand
<tseng> and all would be well
<tseng> when 5 is in debian, sync over ubuntu changes
* tseng pokes Hobbsee 
* Hobbsee drops a large boulder on tseng 
<Hobbsee> heya
<tseng> Hobbsee: how much do you know about wv?
<Hobbsee> tseng: not much, why?
<neutrinomass> That could be done, but the ubuntu changes are included in the debian changes so maybe it would be more appropriate to sync -5 from debian (which is basically debian's -4 but adds a debian/watch file as well )
<tseng> Hobbsee: because beagle uses wv1, kde (kword) uses wv2
<tseng> Hobbsee: pitti doesnt want both
<Hobbsee> ah
<Nafallo> neutrinomass: if debian has our changes, then yes. that would be a sync.
<neutrinomass> Nafallo: Great - so I file a bug report and wait for a MOTU to ack it ?
<Nafallo> yea, something like that :-)
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: subscribe the universe-upload-sponsors group, or whatever it is.
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: make sure you actually let someone know about it
<Hobbsee> or ask for a MOTU to ack it in here
<Hobbsee> tseng: reading description.  i only did the merge because i could, not based on what it was about
<tseng> Hobbsee: ok.
<neutrinomass> It's bug 56806 if anybody feels like ack'ing it ...
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56806 in snes9express "Please sync 1.42-5 from debian unstable" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56806
<neutrinomass> Hobbsee: Did you by any chance mean "ubuntu-universe-sponsors" ?
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: am i the admin of it?  yep
<Hobbsee> zul: snes9express hey?
<zul> wha?
<Hobbsee> zul: you uploaded it to ubuntu with a debian version number?
<Hobbsee> snes9express (1.42-4) dapper; urgency=low
<Hobbsee>   * s9xskin.h
<Hobbsee>     - GCC 4 fixes
<Hobbsee>     - Added desktop file (Closes: Malone #45457)
<Hobbsee>  -- Chuck Short <zulcss@gmail.com>  Tue, 23 May 2006 19:32:00 -0400
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 45457 in snes9express "No .desktop file." [Unknown,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/45457
<zul> yeah i might have made a mistake sorry :(
<Hobbsee> zul: not a problem.  was more wondering if there was a reason for it
<Hobbsee> zul: everyone makes mistakes, it's okay :)
<zul> Hobbsee: i might have forgotten, it was probably one of my first uploads
<Hobbsee> zul: ah, fair enough
* Nafallo hugs dch -i
<Hobbsee> Nafallo: yeah.  that's where the problem can be.
<Hobbsee> Nafallo: if the last release was debian's, it defaults to be debian, rather than the release that you're on
<Nafallo> nope, the earlier version was ubuntu3 :-)
<Nafallo> but yeah, I've had those aswell :-)
<Nafallo> it saves more than it spoils for me anyway ;-)
<Hobbsee> true that.  devscripts is great.
<lfittl> siretart: ping
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Gloubiboulga> hey bddebian !
<bddebian> Heya Gloubiboulga
<lfittl> evening bddebian :)
<bddebian> Hi lfittl
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, nice work on the prismstumbler package :)
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Seriously?
<siretart> lfittl: pong
<lfittl> siretart: I would be interested in joining the MOTU Games Team, what is the proper way to do that?
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, of course
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Thx.
<siretart> lfittl: just do work and ask me to get added :)
<bddebian> heh
<lfittl> siretart: work already done, 2 games maintained in universe, and packaging some others now :)
<bddebian> Oh yeah, games
<lfittl> siretart: what was the team name on launchpad again?
<lfittl> or is there no launchpad team? then let's change this to "please add me" ;)
<siretart> lfittl: afaik there is no launchpad group yet, mainly because I didn't see the necessity
<bddebian> I was looking at glest but the data license looks questionable
<lfittl> siretart: k, then, should I just add myself on the wiki page?
<lfittl> bddebian: I guess the license of the data files?
<lfittl> argh, sry, overread the data part..
<bddebian> lfittl: Aye.  It claims to be redistributable but it's not exactly spelled out well :-)
<bddebian> The game itself is GPL
<bddebian> But the build system is, let's say "lacking" :-)
<bddebian> Looks like a neat game though
<lfittl> bddebian: custom license or a well-known problematic one?
<bddebian> Custom.  Self made :-)
* lfittl takes a look at it
<bddebian> Unlike scourge which they have no idea where half of their art code comes from :-)
<siretart> lfittl: yes, no problem
<siretart> bddebian: I remember some activity in the debian games team regarding glest
<lfittl> bddebian/siretart: do you know of any attempts in the past to package FMOD (yeah I know it's proprietary and most parts are not-distributable, but some nice games use it)?
<siretart> bddebian: you might want to read the archives first to learn about the status  of glest in debian
<siretart> lfittl: FMOD?
<lfittl> siretart: http://www.fmod.org/ (sound system)
<lfittl> like OpenAL
<siretart> hm
<siretart> I didn't hear anything about it yet
<bddebian> lfittl: I have tried to stay away from the engine crap.  I want a game :-)
<siretart> lfittl: but if its non-free, I don't see why one should put efford in packaging it
<lfittl> siretart: I have working packages here, but if I read the license correctly you are allowed to distribute the .so, but nothing else..
<siretart> better convince authors of games to stay away from it and educate them about free software
<siretart> so they allow you to ship a precompiled .so?
<siretart> for which architectures?
<lfittl> siretart: x86 only for 3.75, x86 and x86_64 for 4.04
<siretart> hm.
<siretart> I'd stay away from it
<siretart> debian/ubuntu is about free software, you know. free as in speech
<lfittl> siretart: yeah I know, but sadly there is still multiverse ;)
<lfittl> (and restricted of course)
<lfittl> siretart: I don't want to encourage people to use it (put a big "stay away" warning into the description), but I would still say the more things we have packaged for Ubuntu the better, and sadly there are some games that make use of FMOD
<lfittl> siretart: and replacing it with OpenAL is not that easy, I would do that for 1-2 simple games, but most are bigger projects
<lfittl> didn't want to turn that into a discussion about free software though, just wanted to know if there have been efforts in the past ;)
<siretart> lfittl: tell me some projects which are using FMOD, and how are they licensed?
<lfittl> siretart: 2 of the games I am creating packages for: FreeOrion, Dark Oberon
<lfittl> GPL both
<siretart> and they are linking against FMOD? how does this not violate the GPL?
<lfittl> siretart: don't know, isn't the rule the other way around? you are not allowed to link proprietary stuff against GPL stuff, but linking GPL against proprietary is allowed? (not sure on that subject though)
<lfittl> siretart: and linking against FMOD is optional, you can disable it, but then you won't have any sound output, which is not that nice for games
<siretart> lfittl: better make the programs check for presence of the FMOD shared object, and use dlopen if its there
<lfittl> siretart: hmm, that could work
<bddebian> lfittl: Check on scourge for me, it looks pretty cool and apparently the community did look at making sure all of the artwork/data stuff is GPL'd :-)
<lfittl> will have to investigate how much work it is to get that working, but it definitly sounds better than depending on multiverse stuff (which would have meant that the games must be in multiverse too, not exactly what I want)
<lfittl> bddebian: sure :)
<lfittl> siretart: but still, do you think it is acceptable, although not the nicest thing to have, to include the FMOD package?  (just to avoid me having to redirect users to 3rd party packages/repositories)
<siretart> lfittl: you might want to read this: http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#GPLIncompatibleLibs
<siretart> lfittl: it might make sense to have a FMOD package in multiverse, if (and only if) a) the FMOD authors want it, and b) there is really interest for other package to have that around
* bddebian wonders if he should officially join the MOTUGames team..
<lfittl> siretart: thanks, so this means either getting that note integrated upstream or patching the games to use OpenAL?
<siretart> bddebian: if you like touching gameing related packges, sure, why not
<siretart> lfittl: that not is absolutely necessary if upstreams want to permit others to redistribute binaries at all. unfortunately, upstreams are often clueless
<siretart> lfittl: I don't know of openal can do the same job as FMOD.
<bddebian> siretart: Because I'm stupid and useless? :)
<siretart> lfittl: if OpenAL is really an alternative, porting them to use OpenAL is probably the best solution
<siretart> bddebian: who said this?
<Hobbsee> siretart: only he says that to himself.
<bddebian> siretart: I do :-)
<siretart> bddebian: nah, rather because I'm lazy and have done more work in the debian games team lately
<bddebian> Grrr, traitor ;-P
<Prezu> Hi
<Prezu> I'm currently preparing a Kadu (http://kadu.net) packages.
<Prezu> I'm almost done. However, I have a question about a version number.
<lfittl> siretart: will take another look at the FMOD problem this weekend, and will try to get the OpenAL solution working ;)
<siretart> bddebian: why traitor? ubuntu profits directly. e.g. from a working scorched3d
<azeem> siretart: he put a smiley behind it
<siretart> lfittl: I think you should communicate with upstreams and tell them about the problem. Perhaps they already discussed it
<siretart> azeem: ah. ok
<Prezu> I'm packaging currently (but almost done) development version. It's 0.5.0. So my question is: is 0.5.0-0svn20060818 correct? 0.5.0 is not yet released.
<bddebian> siretart: I know man, thanks, I'm only kidding
<lfittl> siretart: I know there is an incomplete patch floating around for FreeOrion, don't know about Dark Oberon, will add it to my todo
<Riddell> 0.5.0~svn20060818
<Riddell> Prezu: ^^
<bddebian> Prezu: as Riddell, and I would add -0ubuntu1
<Prezu> Aa, ok. But is "~" already acceptable?
<Prezu> It's still work in progress as far as I recall.
<Riddell> Prezu: it's been usable in ubuntu for a while
<lfittl> siretart: concerning the debian games team, is there an easy way to get Ubuntu games packages sponsored in Debian? (as I am also interested in adding my packages to debian)
<siretart> Prezu: no. its now even usable in debian
<Prezu> Ok, thanks a lot. :)
<siretart> lfittl: I'd suggest joining the debian games team, and maintain your game package in the debian games svn
<siretart> lfittl: you don't need to be a DD for that. you'll need a DD to get the package uploaded, though
<lfittl> siretart: k, yet another point to add to my todo :)
<lfittl> siretart: thanks for all the information, and the discussion about fmod
<Riddell> Prezu: are you using the existing package from upstream?
<Prezu> Riddell: Yes, I'm using a svn repository sbapshot as .orig.tar.gz
<Riddell> Prezu: let me know when you need a review
<Prezu> Riddell: Ok, thanks. :)
<lfittl> bddebian: scourge download doesn't work, sourceforge link is either to slow or not responding at all
<bddebian> Hmm
<lfittl> trying again with firefox, epiphany behaves weird sometimes, must be related to firefox 2.0 beta 1
<lfittl> bddebian: download worked with firefox, where can I find the data license? there doesn't seem to be a COPYING file
<lfittl> bddebian: I know the problem was with the other one, but I would still be interested how scourge declared the license
<lfittl> bddebian: and yes, scourge looks quite nice, can't wait to play it when you created the packages :)
<lfittl> siretart: do you have some time to discuss another game packaging problem? (concerning planeshift)
<siretart> lfittl: I need to go soon, but go on
<lfittl> siretart: first problem, planeshift needs certain cvs snapshots of the libraries it uses, whats the best way to solve this?
<siretart> lfittl: are the libraries we already have too new or to old?
<lfittl> siretart: too old
<siretart> lfittl: obvious solution: update the libraries, and check, that nothing else breaks
<siretart> 2nd solution, see if planeshift can be fixed to use 'our' libraries
<siretart> lfittl: you are talking about the 'sear' package, no?
<lfittl> siretart: upstream updates the required cvs dates of these libraries constantly, and these libraries change ABI/API, so updating is not possible
<lfittl> siretart: no, I am talking about packaging planeshift, which requires libcal3d, and some crystalspace stuff
<bddebian> lfittl: There isn't one in the data tarball.  Hence the problem :-)
<siretart> is it already packaged?
<lfittl> siretart: no, just an installer for linux available
<siretart> lfittl: hm. this sounds to me that upstream was too unstable for packaging
<lfittl> siretart: upstream is unstable thats true, but they won't go stable for another year IMHO, and users might be interested in it (free MMORPG that works ;))
<siretart> I see
<siretart> it really depends on how you want to proceed from this point
<lfittl> siretart: is it possible to simply integrate the cvs snapshots into the package, build them with the package into a package "planeshift-libs"", install them to /usr/lib/planeshift, and create a wrapper that uses LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/lib/planeshift?
<siretart> unstable libraries are a PITA to package
<siretart> lfittl: do these libraries really need to be linked dynamically?
<siretart> lfittl: I'd perhaps rather link them statically, but see that with this supporting them security wise becomes a nightmare
<lfittl> siretart: hmm, don't think so, is there a way to say "link only libx and liby statically" when calling gcc/ld?
<siretart> sure
<siretart> static libraries look like this: libFoo.a
<siretart> if you want to link against them, don't use -lFoo, but /path/to/your/libarary/libFoo.a
<lfittl> oh, thanks, despite programming for some time now I have not known that :)
<siretart> (in fact, there are other ways to achieve the same as well. I told you the obvious way)
<lfittl> siretart: security won't be an issue, the libraries aren't interesting concerning attacks
<siretart> everything which reads foreign data are interesting concerning attacks. libraries tend to do that
<lfittl> siretart: k, but I have never heard anybody talking about a security issue with these libraries ;)
<lfittl> siretart: first problem solved, second one: data might be non-distributable, upstream has its reasons, is it ok for the game to fetch the data after package install?
<siretart> lfittl: this indicates that nobody has taken a closer look at them security wise.
<siretart> lfittl: I'd consider this ugly. better convince upstream to release their data under a free license. this solves many trouble
<siretart> lfittl: if they insist on non-free data for whatever reasons, better look for another package
<bddebian> heh
<lfittl> siretart: they won't, they want to avoid forks of the projects that use their data
<siretart> lfittl: but they don't want to avoid forks that use their code? strange reasoning...
<siretart> serious. you'd have to code some 'non-free data installer', which fetches the data from somewhere
<siretart> there are installers for commercial games like quake and dooms for that
<siretart> I read that there are ppl working on unifying such installers in the debian games group
<lfittl> siretart: no, they integrate that already in the updater application that is launched when starting the game the first time
<siretart> lfittl: hm.
<lfittl> siretart: think of it like fetching the data from the server you want to play on, because the server manages the world
<siretart> lfittl: this sounds to me like that we don't need to redistribute the data at all, no?
<lfittl> siretart: exactly, it is just about the user getting a big download after the package download
<siretart> in this case, I don't see much problem, since we don't redistribute anything illegal.
<lfittl> good :)
<siretart> we don't even depend on non-free data, if you say that the purpose of the program is to download data
<siretart> which is a quite strange interpretation, though
<siretart> well, you know what I mean
* siretart is in a hurry
<lfittl> siretart: yep
<lfittl> siretart: one last problem?
<siretart> sure
<lfittl> siretart: the server requires an up-to-date version of the client to play, can we update them through dapper-updates for stable releases?
<lfittl> s/dapper/edgy-whatever/
<siretart> probably. but you'll need to talk to the release managers about that. I cannot answer you this question
<siretart> I could imagine that they'd agree for universe packages
<lfittl> siretart: k, will do when the package is ready, thanks again for your time :)
<lfittl> bddebian: have you talked with glest upstream already about the data licensing?
<bddebian> lfittl: Not yet, though I did get a response from the scourge folks
<lfittl> bddebian: and what exactly was their response?
<siretart> ok I'm off. probably until monday cu folks
<lfittl> bye siretart
<lfittl> have a nice weekend
<bddebian> lfittl: http://pastebin.us/3351
<bddebian> Later siretart
<lfittl> bddebian: which means you have to wait for these folks in the forums to get the work done?
<bddebian> lfittl: Dunno, I haven't tried the forums yet
<lfittl> well, good luck, seems pretty unfortunate for such a nice game :/
<bddebian> Aye
<bddebian> What do you mean, good luck?  I'm passing the torch to you.. ;-P
<lfittl> heh, that might take some weeks to finish ;D
<hub> is there a way in a .install to EXCLUDE some files?
<bddebian> Don't put them in the .install file? :-)
<hub> bddebian: /usr/bin/* but 2 files
<hub> :-/
<hub> I just don't want to have to optin ALL the files
<hub> so it not possible
<hub> crap
<azeem> hub: if it is too much hassle, you could move away those two before calling dh_install
<bddebian> hub: Just rm them
<hub> I used CDBS
<hub> -d
<azeem> hub: there should be a "after-install-but-before-binary" rule
<azeem> install/foo::
<azeem>    cp debian/tmp/myfoocmd debian/foo/foocmd
<azeem> hub: ^^ try something like that
<azeem> (from https://perso.duckcorp.org/duck/cdbs-doc/cdbs-doc.xhtml )
<hub> I have 34 binaries total
<hub> I want to remove 2  because they go in the GUI package
<azeem> hub: do you build the GUI package from the same build tree?
<hub> yeah
<azeem> hrm
<azeem> hub: maybe it is easiest to remove them from the main package after dh_install then
<azeem> put the two into debian/foo-gui.install
<azeem> and usr /usr/bin/* for the main package
<hub> that's whjat I'm doing
<hub> will use the rule to delete the unwanted one
* hub wish there was a debian packaging bible
<azeem> the above URL is pretty good for CDBS
<hub> yeah
<hub> that should work out
<hub> thanks
<hub> I just which I could put a ! in .install to exclude
<hub> azeem: actually it does not work
<hub> the rule is too early
<hub> the only alternative is to cp them manually and not use .install
<azeem> hub: yes, the above rule I pasted is before dh_install, sorry
<azeem> that was back when I suggested to move it away before it, not to remove afterwards
<AnAnt> bddebian: did you get my message ?
<bddebian> AnAnt: Aye, but I haven't had a chance to look at it yet, sorry
<bddebian> The package I mean
<AnAnt> ok
<bddebian> AnAnt: What was your question about the changelog entry
<hub> azeem: I found my way
<AnAnt> bddebian: you said that changelog shold only " state the initial packaging and any changes you made to the original tarball."
<azeem> sounds right
<AnAnt> bddebian: how does the changelog in kchmviewer violate that ?
<bddebian> AnAnt: I'll tell you when I pull the package again, but don't you have two entries in there?
<azeem> 6
<bddebian> Eeks
<azeem> kchmviewer (2.6-0ubuntu1) unstable; urgency=low
<azeem> version and distribution do not match
<zul> whee...kablooie
<bddebian> heh
<AnAnt> bddebian: yup, 2 or 3 entries
<azeem> AnAnt: well, it's not an intial packaging, so the above rule does not apply
<AnAnt> azeem: I don't understand
<azeem> it's a modification to the Debian package
<AnAnt> azeem: I got d/c
<bddebian> Oh, it's already in Ubuntu?
<AnAnt> azeem: you said: "version and distribution do not match", what do you mean ?
<AnAnt> what's in Ubuntu ?
<azeem> kchmviewer?
<AnAnt> yes, but version 2.5
<Kyral_Laptop> Well, that was fun
<AnAnt> now I am mixed up !
<AnAnt> azeem: you said: "version and distribution do not match", what do you mean ?
<bddebian> AnAnt: He means it should be Edgy, not unstable for the distribution
<welshbyte> good evening
<bddebian> Heya welshbyte
<azeem> AnAnt: what do you need kchmviewer-nokde for?
<AnAnt> bddebian: in the changelog there are 2 or 3 entries, yes
<welshbyte> ello bddebian
<AnAnt> azeem: for those who don't want KDE
<AnAnt> azeem: like myself
<AnAnt> oh ok
<bddebian> Bah, where'd he go?
<hub> what is wrong with KDE?
<hub> beside the fact that their architecture is way better than gnome
<Kyral_Laptop> did everyone survive?
<bddebian> TheMuso_: ping?
<hub> GFDL 1.2 with no invariant is dfsg compliant?
<azeem> and no front/cover texts, AFAIK
<welshbyte> bddebian: get anywhere with tulip?
<hub> azeem: and these too
<hub> azeem: they are mentionned
<hub> so I can package the doc
<hub> cool
<bddebian> welshbyte: No, I was looking at it again last night but I don't remember all the problems
<welshbyte> bddebian: oh well, some you win...
<bddebian> Nah, I never win :-(
<bddebian> Grr @ gwget2
<bddebian> This makes no freakin' sense..
<bddebian> elif test $EPHY_VER = "2.14"; then
<bddebian>           AC_DEFINE_UNQUOTED(EPHY_VERSION, 214, [Define to the Epiphany version$
<bddebian>           EPIPHANY_PKGCONFIG=epiphany-2.14
<bddebian>           EPIPHANY_REQUIRED=1.7.0
<welshbyte> that might not look out of place on the daily wtf
<bddebian> Heh
<micahcowan> where's the end-quote (] )?
* crimsun pushes micahcowan 
<crimsun> that'll teach you to file bugs on alsa kthx.
<bddebian> micahcowan: It's part of a big ugly if
<micahcowan> aw.... what's that for, the stupid nforce "bug"? :-)
<micahcowan> Ah, it was. :-)
<micahcowan> bddebian, unfortunately, it looks nearly par-for-the-course in a configure.ac...
<micahcowan> Except, I would've expected a ] ) instead of the $...
<bddebian> Damn, this thing is all f'd up
<bddebian> ./configure: line 2466: syntax error near unexpected token `0.29'
<bddebian> ./configure: line 2466: `AC_PROG_INTLTOOL(0.29)'
<bddebian> ??
<Amaranth> that looks like a configure.ac
<azeem> bddebian: aclocal did not expand that macro it seems
<bddebian> is 0.29 supposed to be the version of intltool?
<bddebian> Duh, forgot to reconfigure
<AnAnt> back !
<bddebian> Oh no.. :)
<Lutin> Hi
<AnAnt> I fixed the distribution to edgy, uploading it now
<Lutin> when you add a doc-base file in your debian tree, do you need to register it using install-docs in postinst or not ?
<bddebian> w00t it freakin' built
<AnAnt> bddebian: ok, it is uploaded
<bddebian> AnAnt: OK.  I'm getting ready to head home so I will check it tonight
<AnAnt> thanks
<bddebian> Unless, of course, I am drunk :-)
<geser> hello
<geser> python-dbus provides python2.4-dbus
<geser> a package which depends on python2.4-dbus (>= 0.60) should it depend now on python-dbus (>= 0.60) or python2.4-dbus?
<bddebian> geser: It should use the new python policy most likely.  And let python-central or whatever deal with that
<crimsun> to be correct, the former.
<crimsun> however it does provide that as a transition, so in the short-run you're ok
<geser> the package is gnome-osd
<geser> the Depends-line in debian/control is currently ${misc:Depends}, ${python:Depends}, python2.4-dbus (>= 0.60), python2.4-pyorbit-omg, py
<geser> thon2.4-gnome2, python2.4-gtk2
<geser> I will look now in the python policy
<crimsun> again, fine in the short-run
<bddebian> FIX IT! :-)
<crimsun> python-gtk2, python-gnome2, and python-pyorbit-omg all provide their 2.4 counterparts
<crimsun> my suggestion, along with barry's, is to fix it now
<bddebian> Ah but you are so much more eloquent than I :)
<geser> I will do a short fix now
<geser> the debian package should be fixed soon (according to a bug)
* shawarma returns from holiday in sunny Italy
<shawarma> Hi guys!
<AnAnt_> if a package needs python, what should I put in build depends ?
<bddebian> python-dev
<bddebian> Heya shawarma
<Lutin> when you add a doc-base file in your debian tree, do you need to register it using install-docs in postinst or not ?
<AnAnt_> k, then
<shawarma> hi, bddebian!
<bddebian> AnAnt_: Check the python policy though if you need to be able to support multiple python versions (Actually you should use the policy regardless)
<AnAnt_> what python policy ?
<shawarma> is there any way I can figure out who sponsored a certain upload for me?
<bddebian> http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy
<bddebian> or http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPythonFAQ
<AnAnt_> ok, thanks
<geser> shawarma: check the signature on the changes mail
<bddebian> Damn I hate packages that take longer to get all the build deps than to just build the dang thing :-)
<shawarma> geser: Good one!
<shawarma> I need a MOTU for this merge: http://www.linux2go.dk/edgy-merges/asterisk-merge.diff
<shawarma> pretty please?
<bddebian> shawarma: Can you ping me when I get home if someone doesn't get to it before then?  I have GOT to get home.
<shawarma> bddebian: When would that be?
<bddebian> Not for an hour or more :-(
<shawarma> bddebian: Ok. Thanks.
<bddebian> Send me an e-mail at bddebian at comcast.net if someone doesn't catch it for you first
<bddebian> Anyway, later gang
<zul> later
<truzak> libswt3.1-gtk-java depends on mozilla-browser, so now I have both firefox and mozilla installed.. was that really necessary? what does mozilla offer that firefox lacks?
<crimsun> truzak: change the {build-,}dependency, then
<crimsun> shawarma: against which source revision is that debdiff?
<crimsun> shawarma: and since you're going to have to merge it, go ahead and pull in the changes covered in -3 [http://packages.qa.debian.org/a/asterisk/news/20060818T070230Z.html] , please
<shawarma> crimsun: Current debian unstable.
<shawarma> crimsun: er.. sorry. i should really read both your lines before responding.
<shawarma> crimsun: I'll do -3. Hang on.
<shawarma> crimsun: Hmm... Where can I find the source for -3?
<crimsun> shawarma: it's currently being synced to mirrors
<shawarma> crimsun: Ah, so it's nowhere to be found yet?
<crimsun> I'm sure either infinity, keybuk, or kamion would know a place
<Toadstool> re
<shawarma> crimsun: I asked Keybuk, who knew about incoming.debian.org, but it's not there either. He figured it must be somewhere between the mirrors and incoming, so it actually is nowhere to be found right now. :-)
<crimsun> well, it's definitely on the master, but I don't have access to it. I figured at least one of those three would know another method.
<hub> what is the CDBS rule to generate the Makefile?
<hub> update-config
<hub> that would be it
<shawarma> crimsun: Well, never mind. I'll do a new merge the day after tomorrow. I've got a busy, off-line weekend ahead of me.
<crimsun> shawarma: sure
<shawarma> crimsun: But well spotted! You just saved me a bit of trouble. :-)
<crimsun> geser: it makes sense to change _all_ the build-dependencies
<crimsun> geser: python2.4- -> python- , that is
<geser> will made an updated debdiff
<crimsun> thanks.
<Goshawk> hi, this is a package creation question about the ubuntu policy: is it legal that a package replaces or changes a configuration file of another package?
<crimsun> Ubuntu follows Debian policy, meaning that's illegal.
<crimsun> what you _can_ do is invoke a conffile manager provided by that other package
<Goshawk> thanks crimsun
<geser> crimsun: should the package build-depend on python2.4 or python?
<tseng> python-all-dev
<geser> crimsun: I've attached an updated debdiff to the bug
<crimsun> geser: the python-all-dev b-d is unnecessary.
<crimsun> (walk the dependency stack for python-gnome2-dev)
<geser> should I make a new debdiff?
<crimsun> no need, I'll adjust it.
<geser> thanks
<crimsun> geser: upon closer reading, just request a sync from Sid; a merge is wrong.
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-19
<geser> as far as I see it, a sync wouldn't help much
<geser> from http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/g/gnome-osd/gnome-osd_0.11.2-3.diff.gz:
<geser> Depends: ${misc:Depends}, ${python:Depends}, python2.4-dbus (>= 0.60), python-pyorbit-omg, python2.4-pyorbit-omg, python-gnome2, python2.4-gnome2, python-gtk2, python2.4-gtk2
<geser> the versioned depends on python2.4-dbus is still there
<crimsun> that's purportedly a bug in the python policy.
<geser> in edgy python2.4-dbus is only provided by python-dbus not a real package
<crimsun> right, you'll just have to remerge it.
<crimsun> well, I mucked up the assignment, so I'll handle it.
<crimsun> geser: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edgy-changes/2006-August/004097.html
<bluefoxicy> ...................................................
<bluefoxicy> is sounder ubuntu-sounder@ or just sounder@
<bluefoxicy> I tried google.  Mark Shuttleworth has now confirmed on the ubuntu-sounder mailing list > that he has not eaten a lot of babies.
<crimsun> sounder@
<bluefoxicy> thanks.
<geser> is some here familiar with gcj and g++?
<|Prezu|> I've just uploaded a Kadu package to REVU, but I forgot to add a "-sa" option to dpkg-buildpackage, so... there's no .orig.tag.gz...
<|Prezu|> Could someone please help me with that?
<crimsun> regenerate the _source.changes, and dput -f
<|Prezu|> crimsun: http://kadu.net/~patryk/tmp/dput.log
<|Prezu|> crimsun: Do I have to remove existing .dsc with dcut somehow?
<crimsun> no, just dput -f
<ajmitch> morning
<crimsun> hi ajmitch.
<crimsun> |Prezu|: ajmitch is a revu admin; he may can help.
<ajmitch> |Prezu|: if you interrupted the upload, it needs deleted manually
<ajmitch> do you want the partial upload removed?
<|Prezu|> ajmitch: Yes, please. :)
<ajmitch> done
<|Prezu|> thanks. :)
<imbrandon> heya everyone
* imbrandon yawns to wakeup
<geser> when a package needs only a rebuild to get the depends uptodate, all I need to change is the changelog mentioning the rebuild?
<Toadstool> g'night
<imbrandon> gnight Toadstool
<ajmitch> imbrandon: how could you?
<ajmitch> making people think that they'll get kde 4 in edgy...
<imbrandon> huh ?
<imbrandon> ajmitch: Riddell said its a possibility in universe for a preview
<imbrandon> heh, i'll edit it, hold on
<imbrandon> "just in case"
<imbrandon> ajmitch: heh changed, give it 5 minutes to show up on planet
<imbrandon> ajmitch: what do you have a constant rss notifier for planet ? heh , i couldent have posted that a minute before you said something ;)
<ajmitch> imbrandon: mugshot
<ajmitch> pops up on the desktop for fridge & planet articles
<imbrandon> mugshot ? mine or a program ?
<imbrandon> ahh
<imbrandon> cool
<ajmitch> so when will kde 4 be released? 12 months?
* ajmitch mutters
<imbrandon> heh the final rc should be late oct
<ajmitch> people that file wishlist bugs as specs
<ajmitch> imbrandon: and how much work still needs done on things like plasma?
<imbrandon> afaik a ton but a ton has been done too
<imbrandon> plasma is probably the laste developed so far
* ajmitch would say late oct is quite ambitious then
<imbrandon> solid is lookin good though
<imbrandon> yea its ambitious all right but i dont think it will be THAT late
<ajmitch> heh
<imbrandon> personaly i'm thinking by the end of the year
<imbrandon> just from what i've seen
<ajmitch> from what I've read, there hasn't been nearly enough done on plasma to release it in ~2 months
<imbrandon> true , heh i just knew thats what they "said" on the ML and other places hehehe like i said end of the year is more likely
<ajmitch> though kde are probably another project that abuse the term RC
<imbrandon> hahah yea
<imbrandon> ohh 200th episode of sg-1 is on tongiht
<imbrandon> looks like i need to bust out the lappy
<imbrandon> fskin wireless stoped working on it the other day
<ajmitch> haha
<imbrandon> well wireless in linux
<ajmitch> reading the mailing list - no roadmap because of aseigo continually getting asked about status
<imbrandon> osx still works so its something with the driver i'm sure
<imbrandon> hahaha
<ajmitch> seems to be a continual stream of 'are we there yet?' posts on the panel-devel list
<imbrandon> yea thats why alot of them stoped being anwsered
<imbrandon> but alot of that is becouse there is no set road map
<ajmitch> which aseigo refuses to provide
<ajmitch> with good reason, it seems
<imbrandon> yup, catch 22 thats good i ways ;)
<imbrandon> in*
<ajmitch> who knows, there may be kde 4 in time for edgy+1 then
<imbrandon> yea i think so
<imbrandon> it should build fine in edgy ( thats one of our goals is to make it compile clean by edgys release ) but probably wont hit the repos till edgy+1
<ajmitch> you're still asking for pain
* ajmitch was one of these people that ran kde from cvs from about 1.8x-1.90 onwards
<imbrandon> hehe hold on , lemme grab my lappy, show's comming on
<imbrandon> i ran kde from cvs in the 2.x days
<imbrandon> on redhat
<imbrandon> heh
<ajmitch> yes, I was doing this on mandrake
<imbrandon> i rember DAYS to compile
<imbrandon> lol
<ajmitch> I still have that box here
<ajmitch> not that it works
<bddebian> Heya gang
<imbrandon_> ...
<bddebian> Heya imbrandon
<imbrandon_> heya bddebian
<bddebian> shawarma: Still around?
<imbrandon_> heh i'm in Stargate mode tonight, the "Behind" SG-1 is on right now, and SG-1 200th epsidode is on after that and the new Stargate Atlantis is on after that heh
<bddebian> Oh joy :-)
<imbrandon_> stargate is almost as good as st:tng ;)
<bddebian> Anyone have any requests before I get to "work"? :-)
<imbrandon_> not i bddebian ;)
<bddebian> Bah, you're no help :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: fix the universe
<bddebian> ajmitch: Merges, bugs, what? :-)
<bddebian> crimsun: Did you already do openct?
<crimsun> bddebian: no
<bddebian> How do we even stuff in to dapper-updates?
<crimsun> bddebian: oh, you meant the triaging part? Yes, I did that.
<ajmitch> talk to mdz
<crimsun> I generated a debdiff and subbed ubuntu-release
<ajmitch> or prepare a well-tested update & subscribe ubuntu-release
<bddebian> crimsun: Ah, OK
<bddebian> thx
<ajmitch> getting a response is another matter
<bddebian> Hmm what to do then..
<bddebian> Damn I swore I already did something with libnss-ldap
<ajmitch> quite probably
<StevenK> bddebian: Purged it like the POS it is?
<bddebian> Heh, no requested a sync or so
<bddebian> StevenK: Speaking of which, are you going to merge pygtkmvc StevenK?
<crimsun> hmm, interesting UI change in quod libet 0.23
<ajmitch> bddebian: bug 55737
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 55737 in libnss-ldap "[Sync Request]  libnss-ldap 251-5" [Untriaged,Rejected]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/55737
<bddebian> OH yeah, thx ajmitch
<bddebian> ajmitch: How did you find that rejected bug?  When I did a search for bugs on libnss-ldap it didn't show up
<ajmitch> simple
<ajmitch> the little link that says 'All bugs ever reported'
<bddebian> Uhm.. hmm
<bddebian> Oh
<bddebian> Hmm, I wonder why she rejected xbvl?
* welshbyte ponders what to do next
<StevenK> bddebian: I'd like to, but it was NMU'd, which makes it harder.
<StevenK> bddebian: It can probably be synced, but 0.9.2-1.1 < 0.9.2-1ubuntu1
* bddebian looks for work for welshbyte ;-)
<welshbyte> bddebian: well suggestions are welcome :)
<bddebian> welshbyte: See if you can package a newer gnu-smalltalk from upstream? :-)
<bddebian> OK, what am I doing wrong here? dpkg --compare-versions 0.9.2-1.1 > 0.9.2-1ubuntu1
<ajmitch> > is special
<ajmitch> you just created a file called 0.9.2-1ubuntu1
<welshbyte> hehe
<bddebian> Oh yeah, hehe
<welshbyte> bddebian: sounds like a challenge... *gulp*
* bddebian feels stupid as always
<bddebian> ajmitch: OK, how do I grab what --compare-versions outputs?
<StevenK> dpkg --compare-versions 0.9.2-1.1 gt 0.9.2-1ubuntu1 && echo 'yes'
<StevenK> Or use a shell that actually tells you when things exit non zero.
<StevenK> steven@liquified:~% grep notfound debian/linda/trunk/debian/changelog
<StevenK> zsh: exit 1     grep notfound debian/linda/trunk/debian/changelog
<bddebian> StevenK: Well according to that -1.1 is gt 1ubuntu1
<ajmitch> bddebian: which is what StevenK said several minutes ago
<ajmitch> actually no
<StevenK> I tested this before, I'm sure of it.
<StevenK> Maybe it was for a different NMU.
<bddebian> Well I didn't think 1.1 was lt 1ubuntu1
<bddebian> But I'm not so smart ya know
<ajmitch> character strings are meant to be less than nearly everything
<StevenK> bddebian: Anyway, you're right, I'll look it soonish.
<bddebian> NP
<StevenK> at it, damn it all
<bddebian> StevenK: And what about inn2?
<StevenK> Which doesn't appear on the MoM page.
* bddebian breaks out the whip
<bddebian> inn2?
<StevenK> Heh, I don't remember merging/syncing inn2.
<bddebian> hehe
<bddebian> I can look at it if you want
<welshbyte> bddebian: were you referring to bug #887 ?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 887 in gnu-smalltalk "blox-tk was not built because of bad tkConfig.sh" [Unknown,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/887
<bddebian> welshbyte: Well sort of.  That actually needs a rebuilt tcl8.3 or some such.  I just noticed that gnu-smalltalk is out of date in Debian and Ubuntu
<welshbyte> ah i see
<StevenK> bddebian: I'm more than happy to, but I'd just like to know why you know it needs looking at.
<bddebian> StevenK: http://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html
<StevenK> Ah.
* StevenK adds that to the list.
* bddebian doesn't know if he wants to touch debian-edu
<bddebian> Ack, it hasn't been updated since hoary
<bddebian> Hi Hobbsee
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Why did you reject your xbvl sync request?
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian
<Hobbsee> bddebian: ah, because at the time, it ftbfs, iirc?
<bddebian> Hmm, OK
<Hobbsee> bddebian: did you make it build?
<bddebian> Hobbsee: I didn't try yet because you had requested it :-)
<bddebian> If debian-edu is 0.806 is 0.806-0ubuntu1 appropriate or 0.806ubuntu1 as dholbach did?
<Hobbsee> bddebian: ah yes, but i hit reject
<welshbyte> if it came from debian then i guess it ould be thought of as 0-0.806 with the 0- chopped off so i'd go with 0.806ubuntu1 :)
<welshbyte> s/ould/could/
<Hobbsee> bddebian: it's annoying to do it that way
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Which way?
<Hobbsee> bddebian: it messes with the version numbers, for the next sync
<Hobbsee> 0.806ubuntu1
<Hobbsee> seeing as u will beat -
<Hobbsee> so the debian version cant be synced across, as the ubuntu version is newer
<Hobbsee> unless it moves to 0.807
<ajmitch> which is likely
<Hobbsee> true that
<ajmitch> since it's intended to be a native package
<bddebian> Well it will never be syncable anyway since it uses Debian sources.lists :-)
<bddebian> So, what's the consensus, 0.806ubuntu1?
<Hobbsee> bddebian: ah right, that's okay then
<Hobbsee> bddebian: why not send our changes to them?
<Hobbsee> maybe send our apt-setup to them :P
<Hobbsee> oh dear, a lot more people running ubuntu now :P
<Fujitsu> Haha.
<bddebian> How the hell does bluefoxicy pass me on Top Contributors?  Does he actually contribute anything? ;-P
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> bddebian: i think i beat you too?
<Hobbsee> it's probably on crack though.
<bluefoxicy> bddebian:  when the hell DO I contribute anything
<bddebian> bluefoxicy: That's what I'm asking :-)
<bddebian> Hobbsee: What's on crack?
<Hobbsee> bddebian: those stats
<bddebian> Ah
<Hobbsee> bddebian: i dont remember who did them, but they warned at the time, that hte first version was a bit crazy, and likely wasnt right
<Hobbsee> it looks like bits have been added to it now though
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Are you implying that it isn't possible that I'm ahead of you? :-)
<Hobbsee> bddebian: no, not at all :P
<bddebian> I don't even know who Jeff Bailes is :-)
<welshbyte> is feature freeze the deadline for syncing from debian or universe freeze?
<ajmitch> universe freeze
<ajmitch> after that you need exceptions for new upstream releases
<welshbyte> good good
* Hobbsee wonders what the purpose of feature freeze is then.
<Hobbsee> oh yeah, fo rmain
<ajmitch> yes, the important parts of the distro, where features generally get developer time
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Ah yes, xbvl wants GLw and we don't ship those anymore..
<bddebian> How can you figure out what FEATURES are available to /configure --disable-FEATURE ?
<ajmitch> look in configure.ac or configure.in
<bddebian> Aye but what do I look for?
<Hobbsee> bddebian: that's the one
<ajmitch> stuff
<bddebian> Wow, thx
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> useful
<ajmitch> seriously, just have a look
<bddebian> But what am I looking FOR?
<welshbyte> "--disable"
* welshbyte ducks
<Hobbsee> GLw?
<Hobbsee> :P
<bddebian> Well GLw gets added if MESA is enabled, it's not seperate afaict
<Hobbsee> guess you shouldnt disable mesa?
<bddebian> I was wondering about that
<bddebian> I thought about just removing -lGLw but I am not quite sure what that would break
<crimsun> bddebian: / bluefoxicy: spec-tracking.
<bddebian> Ah, well for Edgy+1 I'm doing nothing but specs.. ;-P
<crimsun> what's the problem with GLw?
<bddebian> They were removed from the mesa-swx package in main
<bluefoxicy> oh
<bluefoxicy> yeah
<bluefoxicy> I actually have like 6 specs I didn't actually submit as specs
<bluefoxicy> because I'm quite well aware it won't happen.
<bluefoxicy> also tseng will come to my house and nail me to the wall
<bddebian> Sweet, can I watch :-)
<crimsun> bddebian: mesa now provides libgl1-mesa-swx11-dev and mesa-swx11-source
<bluefoxicy> with a hammer and nails >.>
<bluefoxicy> geeze bddebian :P
<crimsun> bluefoxicy: just remind him of BdDebianIsAGod.
<bddebian> crimsun: Aye but the GLw lib files were removed
<crimsun> it's humourous, because everything he does contradicts his protests. :-p
<bluefoxicy> heh
<bddebian> crimsun: What?
<bddebian> My protests?
<bluefoxicy> crimsun:  i'm thinking of looking to see if there's a fast reboot/kexec spec yet
<tseng> h/me wakes up
<bluefoxicy> if you saw my post on -devel@
<crimsun> bddebian: e.g., your current karma rank as a Ubuntu contributor nullifies your claim that you don't do anything
<bddebian> bluefoxicy: Why not build or fix some packages instead?
<tseng> i am too busy upgrading my 770 to fool around with bluefoxicy
<bddebian> Heya tseng
<tseng> hi
<bddebian> crimsun: Well apparently I don't do anything "worthwhile"
<tseng> 770 rules
<bluefoxicy> uh
<bluefoxicy> I am not even going to try to read what he just said.
<crimsun> bddebian: except for hoard karma points ;-p
<bluefoxicy> bddebian:  I do stuff like http://lwn.net/Articles/192082/ to try to get useful stuff on the devs' screens :P
<bluefoxicy> and let them figure out how to make it happen
<bddebian> crimsun: Oh yeah, that's worhtwhile
<bddebian> So are Mesa and OpenGL different "things" or is Mesa an implementation of the OpenGL standard?
<tseng> mesa is a version of opengl
<tseng> in software
<ajmitch> that can use DRI for hardware acceleration
<ajmitch> unlike nvidia who decide to supply a full GL implementation with their drivers
<tseng> (nvidia-glx)
<bluefoxicy> mesa is opengl using whatever's around.  If nothing's around it uses software.
<bluefoxicy> on various platforms Mesa uses various things; on Linux, it uses DRI in X.
<bddebian> Ah, thx
<bluefoxicy> Hopefully somebody standardizes some sort of OpenGL "is this feature here" function like in DirectX
<bddebian> Sacriledge :-)
<bluefoxicy> OpenGL is super-abstract.  If a feature isn't around, it emulates it in software.
<bddebian> shawarma: You really there or just a re-connect?
<bluefoxicy> You can never know if a feature isn't there
<bluefoxicy> so you just shoot and hope you hit hardware instead of software.
<bluefoxicy> directX has a command that lets you ask it if a particular feature is available; if it's not, then you can work around it, just not enable it
<bddebian> Damnit, it actually uses GLw functions :-(
<bddebian> sudo rm -rf xbvl
<ajmitch> excellent, more broken backports
<ajmitch> how I hate it what that happens
<ajmitch> nexu: no, it's not your fault this time - in this case it's compiz-related :)
<nexu> lol
<ajmitch> someone decided it'd be a great idea to backport vte
<ajmitch> except there's an SONAME change, which breaks any app that uses it
<Yagisan> nice.
<Gloubiboulga> so this is what breaks synaptic
<bddebian> Heya Gloubiboulga
<Yagisan> I thought backports are supposed to be tested first
<ajmitch> Gloubiboulga: yep
<ajmitch> Yagisan: third-party backports
<Gloubiboulga> there's been a lot of "bug reports" in the fr community
<Gloubiboulga> hello bddebian
<Yagisan> ajmitch, ah, like if someone is dumb and grabs my mplayer for dapper
<bddebian> I wonder if janimo would get upset if I tried xfce4-goodies
<Yagisan> ajmitch, complete with inablity to play dvds ;)
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, go ahead
<tseng> hello Yagisan
<welshbyte> bddebian: did we fix bug #43359 yesterday?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 43359 in prismstumbler "no man page" [Unknown,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/43359
<crimsun> bddebian: if you break it, I'll kill ALL your cows.
<Yagisan> G'day tseng
<bddebian> welshbyte: Yes, did I not close that one?
<welshbyte> bddebian: still on "confirmed"
<bddebian> welshbyte: Ah, please close
<bddebian> Heya bmonty
<bmonty> hey bddebian
<bddebian> crimsun: Fine I won't touch it then, thanks
<Yagisan> hey guys, is there an idiots guide to contest so I can add some amd boxes to the Optimised kernel thread ?
<bddebian> OK obviously popplerkit.framework is fsckd
<Fujitsu> Yay for fscked things.
* Fujitsu kicks Edgy a bit.
<crimsun> 15:41 < bddebian> FIX IT! :-)
<crimsun> so bddebian, fix it.
<Fujitsu> Anybody got an idea why my Dell Inspiron 630m's CD drive won't automount when inserted, nor detect an audio CD at all?
<Fujitsu> Silly Edgy...
<Fujitsu> Works fine with Hoary->Dapper.
<crimsun> did you disable the automount options in g-v-m (presume you're using gnome)?
<Fujitsu> No, they're all enabled, and yes I'm using Gnome :)
<Fujitsu> I don't use the CD drive much, so I didn't notice when it broke.
<bddebian> crimsun: I was looking but afaict it's gone from upstream :-(
<welshbyte> bddebian: um, looks like the man page doesn't get installed... doesn't dh_installman need to be told which file to install?
<bddebian> welshbyte: Uhm yeah.  In my excitement I think I forgot to actually install it :-(
<Fujitsu> It seems that gstreamer 0.10 has issues with reading audio CDs, whereas 0.8 works fine... Presumably 0.10 utilises some part of the thing that's not detecting the CDs, whereas 0.8 doesn't...
* Fujitsu files a bug.
<welshbyte> bddebian: oh well, no harm done :)
<welshbyte> right i'm off to bed, good night all
<bddebian> WTH is diff --git ?
<lwylie> hello everyone
<bddebian> Hello lwylie
<bddebian> Ggaaaahhh
* Fujitsu calms bddebian down.
* bddebian pokes ajmitch or crimsun
* ajmitch isn't here
<bddebian> ajmitch: C'mon man, I need help :-(
<ajmitch> then ask a question
<bddebian> I did
<bddebian> WTH is diff --git ?
<ajmitch> and you mentioned that it was from debian/patches
<bddebian>  tulip has .diff files in debian/patches that start with diff --git which isn't even a valid option
<ajmitch> which implies that it's in the patch header, and is ignored when applying patches
<ajmitch> so what is the actual problem?
<bddebian> I need to add a patch and I'm not sure how to do it
* ajmitch would assume that upstream or debian have been using git
* ajmitch grabs tulip source
<ajmitch> so where do you see this? in current edgy source, or debian?
<bddebian> Latest debian
<ajmitch> ah yes, changelog does have the details
<ajmitch> grab stgit
<ajmitch> though you can probably manage fine just creating a patch the usual way
<ajmitch> patches seem to be applied already, and are in debian/patches just for documenting the changes
<ajmitch> it doesn't appear that the maintainer ships the necessary git tree
<bddebian> Aye, I was just reading the bug
<bddebian> Apparently they are supposed to be packaging 2.0.5 EVENTUALLY so I may bag off of it
* ajmitch likes it when packages ship with at least the info about where to get the appropriate branches
<ajmitch> which I should really add to mine
<bddebian> :-)
<bddebian> Damnit, now I'm demotived :-(
<bddebian> Sorry to bug you ajmitch
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<Plug> Hi all
<ajmitch> hi Plug
<Plug> you're the only person whos ever awake here in NZST :)
<Plug> I'm just heading out for the evening, but anyone interested in PPTP might want to have a look at http://craig.dubculture.co.nz/blog/
<Plug> i'm in the process of pushing it towards REVU tomorrow, all goign well
<ajmitch> 'out for the evening' means off to watch the rugby? :)
<Plug> not really, going to a bbq.  unsure if the rugby will be on, I don't care all that much about the sport personally
<Plug> Cricket is where my head is at
<StevenK> Oh, that reminds me.
* StevenK checks to see when the footy is on.
<ajmitch> Plug: yeah, might as well push it to REVU
<ajmitch> it'll be easier to check over then
<Arbiter> heya all!
<Arbiter> i'm finally back from my 21-days vacation :)
<imbrandon> wb Arbiter
<imbrandon> heya TheMuso
<Arbiter> :)
<imbrandon> ajmitch or StevenK care to look over http://pastebin.ca/138530 before i submit it to my DD to check again
<imbrandon> ( or if your feeling like it go ahead and sponsor me LOL )
<imbrandon> wb Hobbsee
<Arbiter> Hobbsee!!! :D
<Burgundavia> hey Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey imbrandon, Arbiter :)
<Hobbsee> hi Burgundavia :)
<sladen> Burgundavia: give us the low-down on Ubucon
<Arbiter> uhm... kdocker was approved but not added to the NEW queue
<sladen> Burgundavia: what's happening today?
<Burgundavia> sladen: it was good and will be good tomorrow. I will blog tomorrow
<Burgundavia> we talked
<Burgundavia> Jane gave out tshirts. Drank free google beer
<Arbiter> ah... uhm... a build failure...
<imbrandon> Burgundavia: nice
<Burgundavia> whip|lwe talked about large deployments
<Hobbsee> Arbiter: heh.  that'd be why
<Burgundavia> google has nice headquarters
<imbrandon> did whip|lwe finaly blog ?
<Burgundavia> not yet
<imbrandon> hehe ;)
<Burgundavia> he has gone to bed
<sladen> Burgundavia: what do the new t-shirts look like?
<Burgundavia> on the front, ubuntu logo over the name
<Burgundavia> on the back "Do you Ubuntu?'
<Arbiter> Hobbsee: i'll try the build in an updated pbuilder
<Burgundavia> I got asked in the bar last night about what ubuntu was
* imbrandon wants a T ;)
<Burgundavia> they are a light tan colour
<imbrandon> hahah cool Burgundavia
<sladen> Burgundavia: "wanna find out, nudge, nudge, wink, wink"
<Hobbsee> Arbiter: you mean you werent already?
<Burgundavia> given I was seriously pissed, I have no idea if I was coherent
<Arbiter> Hobbsee: yup
<imbrandon> lol
<Hobbsee> Arbiter: what was the build log?
<Arbiter> i've alredy tested it in pbuilder
<Hobbsee> s/what/where/?
<sladen> "it's like a pirate copy of MS Windows, but legal.  BTW, *you* are legal, aren't you?"
<Arbiter> but i didn't have that problem (read kdocker comments)
<Burgundavia> and then mdz sang with the transexual bar singer
<Burgundavia> it was great
<Arbiter> i can't reproduce that error.... my last build in the pbuilder environment worked
<sladen> Burgundavia: got any memories from the Penguin Bowl?
<Burgundavia> yes, we handed Novell their asses. It was hilarious
<sladen> Burgundavia: any favourite questions?  Or can you remember the final score?
<Burgundavia> 25000k to 21000k
<Burgundavia> they did well in the final question
<Burgundavia> it was 14000 to 9000 going into that one
<Burgundavia> the novell guys were shocked whip|lwe and I were community members
<imbrandon> yea thats what whip|lwe said earlier
<sladen> Burgundavia: they didn't think anyone else would do it for free?
<Burgundavia> no idea
<imbrandon> lol
<Burgundavia> malcolm was brilliant
<Burgundavia> he got all the old scifi questions
<Burgundavia> plus we got all the novell questions
<Burgundavia> including the "what does Suse stand for"
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> lol
<Burgundavia> and the "what is not a Novell linux product?"
<imbrandon> what DOES it stand for ?
<Arbiter> Hobbsee: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2801
<sladen> Burgundavia: did they manage to get "what does 'Ubuntu' mean"?
<Burgundavia> imbrandon: software and something
<Burgundavia> sladen: hmm, don't remember if they asked such a question
<sladen> Burgundavia: well, you did have mdy on the team, I think he'd know a bit about Suse ;-)
<Burgundavia> did have a mark one
<Burgundavia> just a tad
<sladen> Burgundavia: what was the Mark one?
<Burgundavia> mdy also got the os/2 questions, have worked as product manager on it
<Burgundavia> who is this man
<Hobbsee> Arbiter: looks like bddebian's pbuilder is borked - it should be building with fakeroot
<Burgundavia> oh, and then there is a the Ipod dance
<Burgundavia> I got the steve jobs question right "who is this man: picture"
<nixternal> [02:30]  <sladen> Burgundavia: they didn't think anyone else would do it for free?
<imbrandon> heh
<nixternal> my family thinks im nuts for this ;)
<Burgundavia> then for the bonus we got "steve jobs turtlenecks" and had to dance the ipod dance
<Burgundavia> you know, the black silohuette one
<imbrandon> hahahah
<sladen> Burgundavia: oh, not the Steve Balmer one?
<Burgundavia> no, no ballmer questions
<imbrandon> no one thew chairs ? heh
<Burgundavia> but they did have the gates quote about os/2 "this is the most significant os in our time"
<imbrandon> threw*
<Burgundavia> mdy got that one
<Burgundavia> I missed the Serenity/Firefly question "what is the name of this ship"
<Burgundavia> which apparently nobody is letting me live down
<imbrandon> ouch
<sladen> "firefly" ?
<imbrandon> tv show
<Burgundavia> I said Firefly .... :(
<Burgundavia> us sci fi series, very good
<Arbiter> Hobbsee: uhm? so it's a bddebian's problem?
<Hobbsee> Arbiter: i'd say so
* sladen hides out of embarassment for not knowing anything about the show or the name of the ship except that it was cancelled
* Hobbsee might test build that here.
<Burgundavia> sladen: at least you didn't answer the question wrong out in front of 100+ people and a video camera
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: your machine stil building?
<Burgundavia> there is a video somewhere
<Arbiter> i did 3 pbuilder builds (i use fakeroot) and it works
* Burgundavia wonders if I should be telling you this
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: yup kde4 is takin forever, probably will be building all night
<Burgundavia> anyway, I need to crash, I am tired and it is 1am
<Burgundavia> sorry for taking over the channel
<imbrandon> Burgundavia: hehe cool later
<Arbiter> i have a kdocker .deb produced by pbuilder
* imbrandon wants to see some video of ubuntu crushing novell
<sladen> Burgundavia: fantastic.  Sleep well!  Happy Ubuconning
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: cool, okay
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: of course you should
<Arbiter> maybe i need to update the pbuilder... wait a sec...
<imbrandon> i can test build on my lappy ( as long as it compiles on ppc though )
<imbrandon> what ya need tested ?
<Arbiter> mhmhmh
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: nothing.  test build
* Hobbsee will build locally
<Arbiter> build fails with an updated pbuilder env...
<Arbiter> ARGH!
<Arbiter> :P
<Arbiter> (my last build was 24 days ago)
<Hobbsee> Arbiter: heh.  i hate that.
<Hobbsee> Arbiter: i believe that's pitti's, or someone else's bug
<Arbiter> maybe a buildd bug?
<Arbiter> (i don't know)
<Fujitsu> Pitti's or somebody else's? How descriptive :P
<Arbiter> heh :)
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: bddebian was talking about that yesterday
<Hobbsee> i dont remember who did that bug
<ajmitch> Arbiter: it's a broken makefile in your package, not a broken pbuilder or buildd
<Hobbsee> ah
* Hobbsee remembers seeing something similar in another of bddebian's builds
<Arbiter> ajmitch: broken makefile? my 23-days-old edgy pbuilder environment compiled the package with no problems
<Arbiter> i have a .deb file created by pbuilder after a successful build
<Arbiter> now i update my pbuilder env and the package doesn't build
<imbrandon> Arbiter: what error do you get on build, i just updated my pbuilder to make sure it iwas upto date and everything compiled fine
<imbrandon> dpkg-deb: building package `kdocker' in `../kdocker_1.3-0ubuntu1_i386.deb'.
<Arbiter> same error as bddebian...
<imbrandon> dosent know what bddebian got
<Arbiter> mkdir: cannot create directory `/usr/share/applications': Permission denied
<Arbiter> make[1] : *** [install_desktop]  Error 1
<Arbiter> blah blah blah
<Fujitsu> Sounds like it's not using fakeroot.
<Arbiter> (blah blah blah => more error messages)
<imbrandon> sounds like no fakeroot in the pbuilder env
<Arbiter> I: using fakeroot in build.
<Fujitsu> fakeroot's broken?
<Arbiter> don't know... :(
<ajmitch> the build log for a successful build shows it sticking the file in the wrong place anyway
<ajmitch> so no matter whether the build succeeds or fails, it needs fixed
<Arbiter> aw..
<crimsun> I'm pretty sure I'm not supposed to be able to see the checkboxes and accept and reject submissions on the edgy queue.
<imbrandon> crimsun: heh
<imbrandon> might poke them in #lp
<imbrandon> ;)
<Arbiter> found
<Arbiter> desktop.path = /usr/share/applications
<Arbiter> in kdocker.pro
<Arbiter> pfff :D
<Arbiter> patch patch patch! :D
<Hobbsee> crimsun: hah.  i suspect not
<Arbiter> kdocker fixed
<Hobbsee> Arbiter: yay :)
<Goshawk> hi
<Arbiter> ;)
<Arbiter> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2907 <- fixed kdocker
<Arbiter> it should work now :)
<Goshawk>  why the file /etc/lsb-base-logging.sh is part of lsb-base in ubuntu ( http://packages.ubuntu.com/cgi-bin//search_contents.pl?version=edgy&arch=amd64&case=insensitive&word=lsb-base&searchmode=filelist ) while in debian it's part of the package usplash? ( http://packages.debian.org/cgi-bin/search_contents.pl?searchmode=filelist&word=usplash&version=unstable&arch=amd64 )
<Goshawk> i'm saying that because that /etc/lsb-base-logging.sh contains functions just to help usplash
<imbrandon> brandon@voyager:~/sunuo$ mcs --version
<imbrandon> Mono C# compiler version 1.1.16.1
<imbrandon> gah
<Arbiter> ?
<imbrandon> dident mean to paste in here
<Arbiter> :
<Arbiter> ehm
<Arbiter> :)
<ajmitch> crimsun: don't worry, you can see it but it's not plugged in
<Toadstool> 'morning
<Tonio_> hello*
<Prezu> I've uploaded Kadu package to REVU yesterday, but it hasn't appeared since now. No info on motu-reviewers@tauware.de neither. Is it normal? This is my first contribution to Ubuntu.
<ajmitch> depends - are you in the launchpad group, and did you ask a revu admin about syncing the keyring?
<Prezu> ajmitch: I'm have an account on launchpad. but I haven't ask a revu admin about a key syncing.
<Prezu> ajmitch: Are You speaking about this? https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-universe-contributors/+join because I'm already a member of this group.
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> and then you needed to ask a revu admin
<Prezu> ajmitch: I can see, that You're a REVU admin. Could You please sync the keyring? :)
* ajmitch was already doing so when telling you about it
<Prezu> ajmitch: Thanks a lot. :) Do I have to upload with dput again?
<ajmitch> no
<Prezu> ajmitch: Ok. Thanks agani. Bye then. :)
<ajmitch> if you look on revu now you'll see the package listed
* ajmitch just had to unreject the .changes
<imbrandon> ajmitch: whats mugshot part of ?
<imbrandon> sudo apt-cache search mugshot
<imbrandon> shows nothing
<ajmitch> mugshot.org
<imbrandon> oh heh
<Hobbsee> crimsun: any idea why i would get http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/21066?
<Hobbsee> argh
<Hobbsee> how do i get around this?
<Hobbsee> Upload package to host ubuntu
<Hobbsee> Checking Signature on .changes
<Hobbsee> gpg: Signature made Sat 19 Aug 2006 05:54:54 AM CDT using DSA key ID 7D2BCE85
<Hobbsee> gpg: Can't check signature: public key not found
<Hobbsee> Error verifying signature on /home/hobbsee/merges/gnunet_0.7.0e-2ubuntu1_source.changes.
<Hobbsee> oh
<Hobbsee> found it :)
* Hobbsee misread public as private
<AnAnt> may someone clear a bad upload that I made
<AnAnt> kchmviewer
<Hobbsee> AnAnt: ajmitch: or siretart can
<Hobbsee> hi \sh
<\sh> good morning motus :) hey Hobbsee :)
<DarkMageZ> how would i add a repository to my pbuilder setup?
<Hobbsee> DarkMageZ: add it to /etc/pbuilder/apt.config/sources.list and run sudo pbuilder update --override-config
<DarkMageZ> ty Hobbsee :)
* Hobbsee wonders why DarkMageZ wants to do this
<\sh> ajmitch: awake?
* DarkMageZ is backporting edgy's gstreamer to dapper
<\sh> btw..I'm close to uploading latest wine packages...
<DarkMageZ> and requires the newer libgstreamer-dev which i compiled to build one of the other packages
<\sh> need to change my laptops in a few :)
<DarkMageZ> i have my own local repo :)
<DarkMageZ> hmm, very odd.. apt.config/sources.list doesn't exist
<AnAnt> what is apt.config ?
<AnAnt> should autoconf be run before or after automake ?
<Hobbsee> DarkMageZ: ah
<ajmitch> \sh: yes?
<Hobbsee> right, so you didtn follow the pbuilder guide...
<\sh> ajmitch: are you still in NZ? :)
<ajmitch> \sh: yes
<DarkMageZ> i followed http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/gs-pbuilder.html
<\sh> ajmitch: I'll query you :)
<AnAnt> ajmitch: could you delete  a bad upload that I made , kchmviewer
<DarkMageZ> might not have been correctly, but i followed it :)
<ajmitch> AnAnt: done
<AnAnt> thanks
<AnAnt> isn't the recover in REVU going to be fixed ?
<\sh> I wonder where the laptoptestingteam page disappeared and why
<Fujitsu> Did it?
<Fujitsu> It was there an hour ago...
<Fujitsu> It's there...
<\sh> yesterday evening it was gone
<Fujitsu> LaptopTestingTeam on the wiki, you mean?
<\sh> yes...
<siretart> Hobbsee: huh?
<Hobbsee> siretart: dont worry, it got fixed :)
<siretart> Hobbsee: okay
* \sh is taking a nap and uploads new wine this evening...
<\sh> cu later
<phanatic> afternoon
<Fujitsu> Hi phanatic.
<phanatic> hi Fujitsu
<zul> imbrandon: pong
<imbrandon> hey , umm that was a few hours ago , let me rember what i needed ;)
<imbrandon> heh ;)
<zul> a big hug
<imbrandon> ;P
<zul> heh
<zul> i just woke up
<jpatrick> s/hug/bug
<imbrandon> i should realy use knotes lol
<zul> or you could just remember
<imbrandon> i've been at the keyboard ~12 hours , heh
<zul> lemme guess something xen related
<imbrandon> yea it was, just dont rember what heh
<zul> something amd64 related
<imbrandon> nope
<imbrandon> havent formated the 64 yet
<imbrandon> i will to that sunday probably
<zul> okie dokie
<imbrandon> hrm what was that wiki link again with the basic setup ? i might try to conver this box today
<imbrandon> convert*
<imbrandon> got nothing better to do while i wait for kde to compile
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> oh i rember , how hard is it to setup a DIFFRENT distro ( non debian based  ) on a DomU domain
<imbrandon> if possible at all
<zul> which distro?
<imbrandon> gentoo / suse
<imbrandon> suse first probably
<zul> gentoo is not that hard you can use xen-tools in universe i think there is a tool out there fro suse
<imbrandon> cool, ok yea i think i'm gonna start converting this box to xen based now and try ti out, worse case i bork it and format ;)
<imbrandon> no loss ;)
<zul> besides im always around for help
<imbrandon> true ;)
<zul> well most of the time
<imbrandon> Sysinfo for 'voyager': Linux 2.6.17-6-686 running KDE 3.5.4, CPU: Intel(R) Celeron(R) CPU 2.93GHz at 2933 MHz (5874 bogomips), HD: 42/184GB, RAM: 990/1003MB, 124 proc's, 16.38h up
<zul> ...before i go see snakes on a plane
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> sudo apt-get install xen-* LOL
<zul> yeah i should do a meta-package
<zul> im playing with 2.6.18-rc4 this weekend though
<imbrandon> gah there are 15 wiki pages with xen in the name, what one is it
<zul> XenonEdgy
<imbrandon> if you just want to make a meta of the packages needed from on the wiki i can help with that
<imbrandon> would give you time to mess with the "meat" ;)
<zul> ok that would be good
<imbrandon> before i start are the version numbers listed on the wiki upto date ? or should i just grab the latest version in the repo ?
<zul> latest version
<imbrandon> IE xen-hypervisor-3.0-i386
<imbrandon> ok
<imbrandon> pae is for amd64 chips running in 32bit mode right ?
<zul> i believe so
<imbrandon> yea
<zul> grrr...i hate kernel makefiles sometimes
<imbrandon> heh
<zul> if you dont remember to change it, if you  do a fakeroot debian/rules clean it removes the debian/directory
<imbrandon> ugh -4 -5 -6 all are in the repo , dont those get purged ?
<zul> yeh
<zul> 8 is latest
<imbrandon> xen-image-xen0-2.6.16-6-686 shows as the latest to me
<zul> grrr...
<imbrandon> did the other not ftbs
<zul> yeah..
<zul> amd64 problems
<zul> ill have a fix uploaded today
<imbrandon> hehe np
<imbrandon> i can still get it working with this and upgrade later
<zul> true..
<zul> lemme see if i have -8 lying around ill put it somewhere for you
<zul> x86 correct?
<imbrandon> yup
<zul> gimme a sec.
<imbrandon> on the box i'm doing this on here are the specs
<imbrandon> [08:59]  <imbrandon> Sysinfo for 'voyager': Linux 2.6.17-6-686 running KDE 3.5.4, CPU: Intel(R) Celeron(R) CPU 2.93GHz at 2933 MHz (5874 bogomips), HD: 42/184GB, RAM: 990/1003MB, 124 proc's, 16.38h up
<zul> .ok
<zul> gr i dont ill upload one for you
<zul> er...i mean ill upload the fix later today
<imbrandon> np ;)
<imbrandon> i'm in no rush ;)
<zul> good ;)
<imbrandon> mkinitramfs -o /boot/initrd.img-2.6.16-6-686 2.6.16-6-686
<imbrandon> err
<zul> hmm?
<imbrandon> pasted wrong window
<imbrandon> hrm can you explain #7 on the wiki a bit, i dont quite get whats its wanting me to edit ( not the file , what IN the file )
<imbrandon> everything else so far went smooth
<imbrandon> hrm can you explain #7 on the wiki a bit, i dont quite get whats its wanting me to edit ( not the file , what IN the file )
<imbrandon> zul: ^^
<bddebian> Heya gang
<imbrandon> heya
<bddebian> Hi imbrandon
<Nafallo> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi Nafallo
<Nafallo> so how's it going?
<bddebian> Just bueno. You?
<Nafallo> not much. trying to figure out which pizza I want :-P. woke up with an awful headache, otherwise I would still be on work now.
<bddebian> Hangover? :-)
<Nafallo> nope
<Nafallo> sickness or something :-(
<Nafallo> have been home all week, after having to leave early last tuesday.
<bddebian> Bummer :-(
<Nafallo> indeed
<Nafallo> but I got paid yesterday so :-P
<bddebian> :-)
<Nafallo> have bought computerparts for more than a 1/3 of what I got the same day I got them ;-)
<Nafallo> well, atleast my server will have new big chassi, more harddrives, more fans and 2 100Mbit 3Com and 1 1Gbit 3Com NICs ;-)
<Nafallo> http://www.nafallo.info/~nafallo/stacker.pdf <-- the chassi FWIW ;-)
<bddebian> Man that is taking forever to download..
<Nafallo> hmm, maybe http should have more prio than the darknet then :-P
* Nafallo rewrites ;-)
<bddebian> Gah, I wish I understood all this libfoo vs libfoo0 vs libfoo0c2a crap
<Nafallo> there. that should get better performance :-)
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> but my IPv6 tunnel has bad prio now...
* Nafallo goes to ponder some more ;-)
<imbrandon> zul ping
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> i got good news and bad news ;)
<Nafallo> bddebian: hope you get better speeds now :_)
<Nafallo> :-)
<Toadstool> re
<bddebian> Heya Toadstool
<bddebian> Nafallo: Ah yes much better :-)
<imbrandon> good news it all worked the first try ( i'm booted into a xen DomU now, bad news is i had to boot into single user mode and run init 5 for x to come up for it to work ;(
<imbrandon> Zul ^^
<imbrandon> err he's gone
<imbrandon> heh
* bddebian does the summon crimsun dance
<Nafallo> bddebian: I had my looks on that chassi for a year or so now ;-)
<bddebian> heh
* bddebian has his eyes on a sparc an amd64 and a ppc ;-P
<imbrandon> hehe
<imbrandon> nce
<imbrandon> nice
<Nafallo> bddebian: ;-)
* imbrandon now just needs to figure out how to run more than one DomU now ;)
<bddebian> OK apparently trying openscenegraph was a mistake :-)
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, I tried to build the debian deb a few months ago for a friend, it was a really bad idea ;)
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Aye, my machine is choking on it :-)
<Gloubiboulga> hehe, I wonder what kind of machine can build this thing
<Gloubiboulga> mine almost died and never gave me a .deb
<Arbiter> Gloubiboulga!!! :D
<Gloubiboulga> hi Arbiter
<Arbiter> bddebian: the kdocker build bug should be fixed
<Arbiter> the updated version of the package is here: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2907
<bddebian> Arbiter: OK, I'll check it out if my machine ever recovers from openscenegraph :)
<Arbiter> hehehe
<Arbiter> no problem
<bddebian> Oh segfault, nice
<Arbiter> heh :D
<bluefoxicy> how long's it normally take between upload and hitting the repos?
<bddebian> Depends on several things
<bluefoxicy> bddebian:  days, weeks?
<bddebian> NO, usually a day or so
<bluefoxicy> ah, I'll give it a couple more then
<bddebian> bluefoxicy: What package?
<bluefoxicy> I got a mail thursday that said pax-utils was uploaded, I'm just waiting to see it hit the repo so I can swap out my "local or obsolete" with universe.
<bluefoxicy> it's low priority so all the important stuff is probably pushing it back :P
<bddebian> bluefoxicy: 1:5-15?
<bluefoxicy> what does THAT mean
<bddebian> That's the version that is in Edgy
<bddebian> Err 1.5-15
<bluefoxicy> synaptic is telling me the available versions are 0.1.13-0ubuntu1 (now)
<bluefoxicy> you're looking at pax, the archiver
<azeem> then it's probably in NEW and needs manual attention
<bluefoxicy> azeem:  oh, I thought it was stuck in a queue that goes up automatically
<azeem> goes up
<azeem> ?
<bluefoxicy> "I've uploaded your pax-utils package.\nForwarding you the NEW mail from soyuz."
<bddebian> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/edgy/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=pax
<bluefoxicy> ah, cool, I can view the status online :)
<bluefoxicy> so it hasn't hit the buildd yet
<bluefoxicy> bddebian:  do you have any friggin'  idea how to figure out the latest binutils upstream release
<azeem> figure out what?
<bluefoxicy> I see numbers like 2.17.50.0.2
<bluefoxicy> and I can only find "binutils 2.17" on sources.redhat
<azeem> the former are H J Lu's releases I think
<azeem> while the latter are the official GNU tarballs
<bluefoxicy> http://sources.redhat.com/binutils/  Re
<azeem> (I'd guess)
<bluefoxicy> http://sourceware.org/ml/libc-alpha/2006-06/msg00095.html  "Attachment: binutils-2.17.50.0.2-hash-style.patch"  Well, the RedHat developers seem to be aware of the latter
<bluefoxicy> I'm trying to figure out if upstream has released binutils w/ --hash-style yet (it went into ld in CVS 2 merges ago) or if I'll have to bribe doko or whoever to patch it into our binutils/glibc after edgy
<AnAnt> bddebian: I fixed the kchmviewer problem (that it wasn't been put in /usr/bin)
<AnAnt> anyone here ?
<azeem> AnAnt: 101 people
<AnAnt> azeem: ok, isn't the recover page on REVU going to be fixed ?
<azeem> no idea
<AnAnt> k
<azeem> AnAnt: just ask your questions, don't wait for random people without clue to react first :)
<azeem> it's the weekend, this chan is pretty low traffic
<AnAnt> well, that was the question
<AnAnt> oh ok
<AnAnt> well, that was it
<AnAnt> gotta go
<bddebian> Shoot, who else asked me about a review last night.. :-(
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, me!
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, you haven't advocated gnome-translate ;)
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: I don't think it was you but I'll take a look at it
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, no it wasn't me :)
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: OK advocated but someone else has to look at it :)
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, sure
<Gloubiboulga> thanks bddebian :)
<bddebian> Sure
<bddebian> Hmm, it would be nice if I could search REVU for all packages I have commented on..
<azeem> or those you have *not yet* commented on :)
<bddebian> Well there's plenty of those.. :-)
<bddebian> I'm just one man.. And not the greatest reviewer at that.. :-(
<bddebian> Uhm, how can libbuffy have /usr/include/python-2.3 in a Makefile but not have a build-dep on any python stuff?
<crimsun> (does it actually require python2.3-dev to compile, though?)
<bddebian> crimsun: No but the changelog isn't exactly helpful either.  In 0.2.x it says added build-dep for python, etc but never mentions dropping it later
<bddebian> I guess I'll just sync it, it just seems strange
<bddebian> OH, crimsun.  Wanna help me understand osgcal
<bddebian> Oh, they seem to have removed the python-libbuffy binary
<bddebian> Err python-buffy even
* bddebian takes that as a no
<crimsun> sorry bddebian, you don't get priority response time (on the phone) since you misrouted my pony.
<crimsun> bddebian: what's the issue w/ osgcal?
<bddebian> crimsun: The whole 0c2a transition thing
<crimsun> ah, to 0.1.39-1?
<bddebian> Aye
<crimsun> it'll have to be a merge regardless since we have libosgcal0c2a
<bddebian> Aye, I just didn't want to screw it up
<crimsun> I doubt you will; you've done enough of them to know the proper C/R. :)
<bddebian> Actually I really haven't for transitional packages
<ajmitch> you should have
<bddebian> The question is, should libosgcal stay libosgcal0 from Debian?
<crimsun> it doesn't look like it ever transitioned on the Debian side
<bddebian> Aye
<ajmitch> does it export a C or C++ interface?
<crimsun> yep, and it was part of the libstdc++ allocator change [https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2005-November/000016.html] 
<crimsun> bddebian: it would be worthwhile merging openscenegraph first
<bddebian> openscenegraph segfaults on build
<bddebian> Not to mention it's a pig :-(
<crimsun> ah, that should make for an exciting weekend evening.
<bddebian> For whom? :-)
<crimsun> I'll look at it.
<bddebian> crimsun: openscenegraph or osgcal?
<crimsun> the former.
<crimsun> doesn't make much sense to proceed with the latter until the former is merged
<bddebian> Oh, aye
<bddebian> Who is gborzi?
<bddebian> lfittl: ping?
<bddebian> Heya Amaranth
<Amaranth> hey
<Amaranth> public wifi at libraries ftw
<lfittl> bddebian: pong
<crimsun> .oO( you identified over a public wifi? )
<tseng> crimsun: oh no, freenode botnets will take over!
<crimsun> ohnoes!
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> lfittl: Hey, I just realized someone has a package for glest on REVU, did you know that?
<lfittl> bddebian: oh, no, but I guess this package still has the licensing problems
<bddebian> Aye
<bddebian> Well the data package anyway
<lfittl> bddebian: I looked at the forum thread about scourge data licensing, but this thread is a little old and there doesn't seem to be much interest in it anymore :/
<lfittl> something different, whats the best solution to the following problem: one of my to-be-packaged games, freeorion, links directly to some graphviz libs that are located in /usr/lib/graphviz, which means it won't find them on startup without modifying LD_LIBRARY_PATH
<lfittl> my approach would be to write a simple wrapper that sets the correct LD_LIBRARY_PATH, anybody have a better idea?
<bddebian> lfittl: At runtime?
<bddebian> lfittl: Do you happen to have a URL for the scourge forum discussion?
<lfittl> bddebian: what at runtime?
<bddebian> LD_LIBRARY_PATH?
<lfittl> bddebian: will search it again, easy to find
<crimsun> where are they in fact installed, /usr/lib/ ?
<lfittl> bddebian: http://scourge.sourceforge.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=46
<crimsun> it smells of rpath
<lfittl> the needed graphviz libs are in /usr/lib/graphviz, and freeorion searchs for them in /usr/lib
<lfittl> rpath?
<lfittl> crimsun: ah, rpath, that could work (didn't know that something like this existed) :)
<bddebian> lfittl: Is the scourge data not even a candidate for multiverse?
* bddebian is far from knowledgeable about licensing issues
<lfittl> bddebian: don't know, problem is we don't have a defined license, and don't even know all the copyright holders
<bddebian> Ah, OK
<lfittl> as upstream has taken some models from various "free models" websites, and the creator of some old music files didn't specify a license and is now gone (if I remember correctly)
<lfittl> although we could propably work around the music file problem be simply not including them, missing music is not the worst thing, missing models are more problematic
<bddebian> Well I posted a question, though it is probably too vague :-)
<lfittl> bddebian: lets hope there is at least one artist interested, that would be enough to get the license problem into their heads again :)
<bddebian> Aye
<Amaranth> crimsun: it's a junk password
<Amaranth> crimsun: i only use it on freenode
<crimsun> Amaranth: (was being facetious ;)
<Amaranth> and, uh, i live in sioux city, iowa. wifi is magic to like 99.9999% of the population
<Amaranth> heh
<Amaranth> There are probably only about a dozen guys in this town who would even know how to do something like that and I know all of them. :)
<Amaranth> damn, dist-upgrade is slow
<Toadstool> bddebian: hi (about 5h30 later :)
<Toadstool> and hi everybody
<crimsun> 'lo
<Toadstool> hey crimsun
<bddebian> Heh, hi Toadstool
<Toadstool> I hate that, I have to run everywhere to prepare my trip and can't stay more than 5 minutes in front of my computer :p
<crimsun> bddebian: bug 56935
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56935 in openscenegraph "[Edgy MoM]  Please sync openscenegraph 1.0.0-9 from Debian Sid" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/56935
<bddebian> OH, hehe
<bddebian> Might be interesting though
<crimsun> bddebian: took a while to build, but it built successfully on i386 and amd64.
<bddebian> Oh, you did that?
<crimsun> yes, I just filed it a minute ago
<bddebian> Rockin'
<Toadstool> you guys have to be insane to try to build that piece of software :p
<crimsun> took a solid hour of build time
<Toadstool> crimsun: about mldonkey in dapper, I uploaded an updated package a few weeks ago to dapper-updates but the package "disappeared"... I wonder whether I did something wrong :/
<crimsun> Toadstool: w/ approval from mdz/kamion?
<Toadstool> huhu nope
<Toadstool> I have to ask mdz/kamion before uploading?
<crimsun> right, infinity/keybuk will blackhole them (approximately) unless you have approval
<crimsun> yes
<Toadstool> ok, understood
<Toadstool> I should have asked before doing anything
<\sh> re
<crimsun> 'lo \sh
<Toadstool> hi \sh
<\sh> how's live?
<crimsun> crazy, and yours?
<\sh> too much work :)
<\sh> just preparing new wine
<crimsun> nice :)
<\sh> argl...it's always a pain to switch between a uk layout and a german layout....
<bddebian> \sh!
<\sh> bddebian:  :)
<\sh> I wonder if bluetooth is still working on this t43 after upgrading to edgy....or is it just disappearing like on the r200?
<ajmitch> hi \sh
<\sh> re ajmitch
<asimon> Greetings. If upstream only offers the source as a bz2 archive, I unpack, and 'gzip -9' it to get a orig.tar.gz. Is this the right way?
<crimsun> it's the "least worst"
<crimsun> if you do that and Debian does that, then you'll likely end up with *sum mismatches for the orig.tar.gz, which is, well, a PITA
<asimon> crimsun: So what's the most elegant way to handle it?
<crimsun> asimon: is said package in Debian already?
<\sh> didn't dpkg work with bz2?
<asimon> crimsun: No, not in Debian or Ubuntu so far.
<crimsun> asimon: do you plan to submit it to Debian? (Hopefully you do.)
<asimon> crimsun: The plan was to first upload it to revu
<crimsun> asimon: sure. Well if there's no ITP (see bugs.do/wnpp) for it, then I suppose you'll have to go the route you just described.
<asimon> crimsun: No ITP so far.
<asimon> \sh: When I run dpkg-sources with a bz2 instead of a gz tarball it generates automatically a tar.gz file but without the 'orig' part and the source won't appear in the dsc file.
<asimon> crimsun: Thank you.
<\sh> asimon: yeah...just tried...
<\sh> crimsun: what would you do to debug a strange grub behaviour...which is only shown on dapper?
<\sh> crimsun: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/grub/+bug/56780
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56780 in grub "grub doesn't work with Compaq SmartArray P600 SAS Controller" [Medium,Unconfirmed] 
<zul> \sh: a picture might help
* crimsun hoorays for zul :D
<\sh> zul: well..."GRUB Hard Disk Error" ;) that's all what is shown during boot up
<zul> ok maybe not..
<zul> \sh: what are the disks again?
<\sh> zul 4 disks as raid0 configured (hw raid) sata
<zul> /dev/dsk/c or something
<\sh>  /dev/cciss/c0d0
<zul> ah yes..
<\sh> ubuntu grub has some patches for it...to recognize them...but sles9 grub doesn't have any patches for this...but sles9 version works
<zul> weird..
<\sh> yepp
<zul> can you put up the source rpm somewhere?
<\sh> zul: on monday when I'm back in the office..
<zul> ok..remind me on monday then
<\sh> zul: kk
<\sh> and it's just not working on this piece of hw
<\sh> areca 16 channel raid6 sata controller just works. non sata smartarrays are working too.
<zul> just the ccis crap
<zul> you might want to put in some printk to see what is happeneing
<\sh> zul: if I could I would have done it already =
<\sh> grmpf
* \sh is to stupid to change from uk layout to german layout 
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-20
<\sh> uploading wine_0.9.19-0ubuntu1
<bddebian> Uhm, I asked for a sync of wine
<\sh> bddebian: we are using winehq packages for wine...which is 0.9.19 and not 0.9.15 :)
<bddebian> Ah
<\sh> debian has old stuff ;) and I trust scott very much :)
<bmonty> hi \sh
<bmonty> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Heya bmonty
<\sh> moins bmonty
<bmonty> \sh: does the new version of wine build for amd64?
<\sh> Rejected:
<\sh> Not permitted to upload to the RELEASE pocket in a release in the 'CURRENT' state.
<\sh> it will not build at any time with this message...wtf
<\sh> bmonty: I can't test on amd64 anymore..I gave away my amd64 to my son who is now in NZ :)
<bmonty> \sh: I can test on amd64
<\sh> universe is still open for merges
<\sh> oh I'm stupid
<\sh> edgy not dapper lol
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<lfittl> crimsun: -rpath worked, thanks (took some time, I really hate scons..)
<\sh> going to bed...good night folks :)
<bddebian> lfittl: scons is fun man.. ;-P
<lfittl> bddebian: simple makefiles, and nothing more, thats the best build system ;)
<lfittl> but on the positive side I was able to replace FMOD with OpenAL for FreeOrion, turned out they already have support, its simply not activated :)
<bddebian> Nice
<bddebian> OK, what do I do about an ambiguous reference to a function?  I assume it should be something like foo::get_action()?
<Plug> Stupid question time.
<Plug> I am not an MOTU, and I have built a package that I want MOTUs to look at and potentially sponsor
<Plug> so I read REVU is the place for this
<bddebian> Yes
<Plug> and I also read that you have to SSH somewhere as a MOTU to build things on REVU?
<bddebian> Not required
<Plug> And I also also read you should be able to upload things from the web :)
<bddebian> Upload things from the web?
<Plug> well, I assume there is a web interface to get my package onto the REVU site\?
<bddebian> No, dput
<bddebian> plug: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU?action=show&redirect=MOTU%2FHopeful%2FREVU
<Plug> thanks, some of the pages contradict themselves a little
<Plug> right!  one package hopefully there at the next build :)
* Nafallo plays with his mailserver ;-)
<Nafallo> all emails for all domains is found through postgresql :_)
<Nafallo> :-)
<Nafallo> and all auth is against postgresql :-)
<Plug> ...nothing has happened.  any REVU ppl about?
* Plug pings ajmitch 
<bddebian> Plug: Have you already sent your key and got a response?
<Plug> To Launchpad, yes
<bddebian> No, for REVU
<bddebian> Or can that be done on LP now?
<Plug> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU again is ambiguous
<Plug> upload your key, join the 'ubuntu universe contributors' team
<Plug> which is just a click
<Plug> chat here yesterday sounded like revu synced against that every now and then
<crimsun> Plug: it's manually synced now and then, yes.
<crimsun> so unless an admin has synced it by hand recently...
<Plug> right
<bddebian> crimsun: !!  What do I do about an ambiguous reference to a function?
* Plug pings ajmitch again ;)
<crimsun> bddebian: make it unambiguous? :)
<crimsun> sorry, I'm fighting to back up my HD before it dies completely
<crimsun> the SATA HD on this X41 is about to die (spewing lots of medium and autoreallocate failed errors via dmesg)
<bddebian> Ugh
<Plug> Any other REVU key-syncin'-admins about?
<crimsun> guess I know what my paycheck is going to, heh
<bddebian> How do I make a C function unambiguous in in C++?  It comes from gtkmm.
<bddebian> Heya Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian
<sladen> bddebian: extern "C" {} ?
<Yagisan> lfittl, heh, I'm converting fmod to sdl_mixer in an app I want in Ubuntu. Why do they pick fmod in the first place, I wonder.
<lfittl> Yagisan: believe me, I don't know, there is no good reason to choose FMOD over OpenAL (or sdl_mixer if you need simpler stuff), but some projects simply don't think about it and are then to lazy to change..
<Yagisan> lfittl, well, I got svn access to my one, and am demonstrating that the users don't need fmod, as I rip it out
<lfittl> :)
<lfittl> anyway, after having spent 2 hours debugging freeorion (throws an exception every time you actually want to play..) without finding the problem, I am tired, gn8 everybody
<imbrandon> moins MOTU's ;)
<bddebian> Heya ibm
<bddebian> Err imbrandon
<imbrandon> hehe ;)
<imbrandon> bddebian: hey working on anything atm? mind if i query you ?
<bddebian> Nah, I am never working on anything :-)
<imbrandon> hahah shush LP says diffrent hehe
<imbrandon> ok lemme grab a soda, then i'll brb
<bddebian> OK
<LaserJock> hi imbrandon
<LaserJock> oh man, more mt. dew
<bddebian> Ack, don't start that again :-)
<imbrandon> hahah
<imbrandon> heya LaserJock
<imbrandon> ok actualy i could ask the stuff in here since others might benifet heh
<bddebian> People could benefit from me showing my ignorance? :-)
<imbrandon> bddebian: basicly i'm taking the SoC that Riddell mentiond a few minutes ago that needs packin and trying to pack it, cept there are a fwe things i have never done before and dunno where to look for answers , so guess what ;)
<imbrandon> main thing being it dosent use autotools , i've never done a package from scratch that dont use auto tools
<imbrandon> bddebian: hehe or LaserJock and others can chime in too ;)
<bddebian> OK, what's the build system?  Is there one at all?
<imbrandon> a home grown ./install file
<LaserJock> cool
<imbrandon> http://www.micoulou.info/kformat/KMFormat0.1beta.tar.gz  <- thats the orig , i untared it and make a kmformat_0.1+0.1beta.orig.tar.gz
<bddebian> imbrandon: It's no problem.  Basically you just replace the ./configure and/or make lines with the appropriate commands
<imbrandon> and then got to looking and i'm like ummmm hell i dunno what to do, so i figured this would be a good chance to learn ;)
<imbrandon> umm there isnt a ./configure and no top level makefile either, hehe lemme pastbin the install file
<bddebian> imbrandon: Does the install do the build and install?
<imbrandon> yea
<imbrandon> and doc install and everything
<imbrandon> its a bash script that does everything by hand incluging chekinmg the libs are installed
<imbrandon> one sec pastbining it
<imbrandon> http://pastebin.ca/139592
<imbrandon> i dont think dh_make will help much as thats the only way i've ever done one from scratch heh but i guess its time to learn ;)
<bddebian> Oh, that's ugly
<imbrandon> heh its a SoC project lol
<bddebian> Basically you will have no configure or build targets
<bddebian> dh_make will be fine, you will just need to rip out a lot of stuff
<imbrandon> k
<imbrandon> single bin dh_make done
<imbrandon> Skipping creating ../kmformat_0.1+0.1beta.orig.tar.gz because it already exists
<imbrandon> Currently there is no top level Makefile. This may require additional tuning.
<imbrandon> Done. Please edit the files in the debian/ subdirectory now. You should also
<imbrandon> check that the kmformat Makefiles install into $DESTDIR and not in / .
<imbrandon> ^^ foreign to me
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> so realy i need to redo what he does in debian/rules ? or do i just call his script from debian rules ?
<bddebian> Meaning you want to install in debian/kmformat/foo not /
<bddebian> Call install from install:
<bddebian> Remove build: and/or configure: if they exist
<bddebian> Basically instead of calling ${MAKE} install, you will call ./install
<imbrandon> clean: ?
<bddebian> Clean you will need
<bddebian> Because you will have to make the resulting dir structure look like it did/does from the tarball
<imbrandon> k
<imbrandon> http://pastebin.ca/139610
<imbrandon> and now i need to go into his src/Makefile and change the stuff to $DESTDIR ?
<bddebian> imbrandon: Right but you would have to see if ... exactly :-)
<imbrandon> or the install
<imbrandon> or both
<imbrandon> heh
<bddebian> install: build, you need to drop "build" since you have no build target anymore
<imbrandon> ahh right
<imbrandon> so does it even need the binary-*: stuff ?
<imbrandon> with no build target ?
<bddebian> I believe you at least need the binary-arch: but drop the "build" of course
<imbrandon> bddebian: ok hows this lookin, got it all ripped out
<imbrandon> http://pastebin.ca/139617
<imbrandon> hrm what about -$(MAKE) clean in clean: since there is no toplevel makefile
<bddebian> Does he have a Makefile at all?
<imbrandon> src/Makefile ( called from ./install )
<imbrandon> and a Makefile.am in the top dir
<bddebian> You could try ${MAKE} -c src clean
<imbrandon> k
<imbrandon> so with the DESTDIR do i cange the ./install or src/MakeFile or both ?
<imbrandon> change*
<bddebian> Check src/Makefile to see if it already handles DESTDIR
<imbrandon> QMAKE_TARGET  = KMFormat
<imbrandon> DESTDIR       =
<imbrandon> TARGET        = KMFormat
<imbrandon> yup but blank
<bddebian> That's OK, you are passing it
<imbrandon> k so no change needed
<bddebian> Nope
<imbrandon> whew
<imbrandon> heh
<bddebian> Obviously his install file may have path issues for you to look at though
<imbrandon> ok as far as debian/rules this should be ok then
<imbrandon> ok ./install now heheheh /me looks
<bddebian> hard to say yet but worth a try :-)
<imbrandon> hehe right right
* imbrandon should talk him into using autotools for 0.2 ;)
<bddebian>         cp KMFormat /usr/bin/X11
<bddebian>         mkdir /usr/bin/X11/kmformat
<bddebian> Like that stuff will probably need to be mkdir debian/kmformat/usr/bin/X11...
<imbrandon> ugh why is this going in X!! ?
<imbrandon> X11 i mean heh
<bddebian> Yeah, that doesn't look right to me but I'm an idiot
<imbrandon> heh i'll package it this way and show Riddell tomarrow about it , i think he is his mentor
<imbrandon> i'm just going off of .... [19:33]  <Riddell> well, as it happens, we do need someone to package SoC project kmformat http://www.micoulou.info/kformat/KMFormat0.1beta.tar.gz
<imbrandon> ;)
<bddebian> :-)
<imbrandon> ok http://pastebin.ca/139632
<imbrandon> so in that does the cp README blah need to be cp debian/...../README too ?
<bddebian> Probably not the best solution but should work
<imbrandon> k
<imbrandon> so basicly all the patch in that prefix with debian/.......
<imbrandon> paths*
<bddebian> Yeah
<imbrandon> heh ok i'm dumb but even the cd src to cd debian/kmformat/src ?
<bddebian> Where's that?
<imbrandon> if  [ "$USER" = "root" ] 
<imbrandon>         then
<imbrandon>         cd src
<imbrandon>         make
<bddebian> Oh, no, that stays
<imbrandon> k
<imbrandon> ok i guess time to test it ( then i can worry about the copyright etc if it works hehe
<imbrandon> )
<imbrandon> bddebian: ok well i guess that answers that
<imbrandon> heh lots of errors
<imbrandon> it dident like the -c src clean for one, i can change that ........ next
<imbrandon> /usr/bin/make -c src clean
<imbrandon> /usr/bin/make: invalid option -- c
<imbrandon> needed to be -C , hehe my bad ;)
<imbrandon> http://pastebin.ca/139645
<imbrandon> bddebian: ^^ i guess that menas it needs qmake in deb control ?
<imbrandon> err not
<bddebian> Whoops, my bad, I should have specified -C
<imbrandon> hehe no prob
<imbrandon> you see that last paste
<ajmitch> Plug: source-only uploads please
<bddebian> imbrandon: Yeah, it's still trying to call build somewhere in debian/rules
<imbrandon> hum i dont see it anywhere http://pastebin.ca/139651
<bddebian> Hmm, maybe build: has to be there, just leave it empty?
<imbrandon> bwhahaha that was that
<imbrandon> ok now lets see how this works
<ajmitch> bddebian: yes, as stated in policy
<imbrandon> OMG lintian go's nuts but it atleaste builds now heh
<bddebian> ajmitch: Policy, what's that? ;-P
* ajmitch gives up
<imbrandon> heh
<Nafallo> haha
* Nafallo ponders what might be the best way to have postfix use procmail for virtual users ;-)
<Nafallo> @4:18 AM :-P
<ubuntu-es> Nafallo: Error: "4:18" is not a valid command.
<Nafallo> ehm... wtf
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> @now us/central
<ubuntu-es> imbrandon: Error: "now" is not a valid command.
<Ubugtu> Current time in US/Central: August 19 2006, 21:18:50
<imbrandon> @time us/central
<Ubugtu> Current time in US/Central: August 19 2006, 21:18:56
<ubuntu-es> imbrandon: Error: "time" is not a valid command.
<imbrandon> ugh two bots that respond to @
<ajmitch> Tonio_: ping
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch
<ajmitch> hello LaserJock
<bddebian> Holy cow k3d is a pig
<Nafallo> oh my donkey, bddebian will soon have a farm ;-)
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> I don't have a donkey yet, so watch out.. ;-P
<bddebian> Though I do have crimsun's pony
<bddebian> *whoops*
<Nafallo> I have a donkey :-)
<Nafallo> donkey.magicalforest.ebn has address 192.168.66.6
<Nafallo> donkey.magicalforest.ebn has IPv6 address 2001:16d8:ff96:1:250:fcff:fe89:efe1
<Nafallo> :-)
<Nafallo> or rather, my girlfriend has :-)
<bddebian> heh
<LaserJock> ''
<Nafallo> LaserJock: EYES! :-D
<LaserJock> sorry, that's my niece
<LaserJock> she's 1 1/2
<Nafallo> ah, how friendly of her to give you eyes :-)
<imbrandon> heh
<LaserJock> heh, that was fun
<LaserJock> she was running the mouse
<LaserJock> loved the scroll wheel
<Plug> ajmitch: I didn't get a source-changes file
<Plug> (when I built the package)
<trpr_> dang. it doesn't seem like its going to be easy to package my source afterall :( it requires a shared library that isn't currently provided by any other package
<hub> trpr_: package that lib too
<hub> :-)
* hub has a package here that needs clear licensing from upstream :-/
<LaserJock> licensing isn't fun
<trpr_> hrm. well. a package exists, the lib is just missing from it. i need a shared library of the koala.jar file (libkde3-java).. i would expect to find it in libkde3-jin, by its description
<trpr_> libkde3-jni that is
<trpr_> according to rdale, there is a bug in the kde libtool which prevents these shared libraries from being created during compilation of the bindings... explains why the library doesn't exist in the package :\
<ajmitch> Plug: debuild -S -sa
<Plug> thanks, I'll do that now
<Plug> is my key synced to rEVU?
<ajmitch> should be now
<Yagisan> Do we have any packages in universe (preferably games) that use cmake rather then autotools ?
* Yagisan need to brush up cmake style packaging
<Plug> trying again.
<Plug> I think the version number is probably wrong
<freeflying> crimsun: hi
<freeflying> crimsun: I wanna split a package in sid into three packages ,so what shall I do
<crimsun> freeflying: please rephrase?
<freeflying> crimsun: scim-bridge in sid goes into one binary package, since there are great changes in new upstream release, so I wanna split it into three binaries, then what shall I do for it
<bddebian> Add three the two other binary packages to debian/control and adjust build system accordingly? :-)
<bddebian> -three
<freeflying> crimsun: shall I discuz with my sponsor?
<crimsun> freeflying: right, it seems a fairly straightforward approach.
<freeflying> bddebian: I see
* bddebian still needs a sponsor
<LaserJock> bah, who needs sponsors? ;-)
* imbrandon does too
<freeflying> LaserJock:  me  :)
<LaserJock> bddebian: I didn't think dieties needed sponsors
<freeflying> crimsun: thanks
<crimsun> np
* bddebian pokes LaserJock
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> darn, I should have slipped a certain wiki page into my Ubucon talk
<bddebian> Don't make me break out the lasers
<LaserJock> "And this is what happens when you contribute a lot" ;-)
<crimsun> it's much too late; you're already in the list of LP's top Ubuntu contributors.
<bddebian> Holy crap, k3d finally finished
<Burgundavia> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hi Burgundavia
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<AnAnt> I need help
<AnAnt> what is NMU thing ?
<Burgundavia> AnAnt: a debian term meaning "non-maintainer upload"
<Burgundavia> ubuntu really doesn't have that concept, as all packages are more or less group maintained
<AnAnt> ic
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: thank goodness for that :P
<AnAnt> Burgundavia: ok, can you tell me what is wrong with this Lintian output as far as Ubuntu is concerned ?  http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/kchmviewer-0608190710/lintian
<Burgundavia> AnAnt: sorry, nope
<AnAnt> so far I got the svn-commit.tmp file problem
<Burgundavia> Hobbsee: indeed. I saw you touched a gnome package. Did you need to take a shower after that ;) ?
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: more than one.  and i was severely tempted.
<Burgundavia> I am truly sorry
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: i can cope with doing various packaging bits on them, as long as i dont have to use them :P
<Hobbsee> hehe
* Hobbsee was considering installing ubuntu-desktop yesterday
<Burgundavia> I gather you resisted the urge?
<Gloubiboulga> hello world
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: so far, yes
* ajmitch rejects yet another bug related to the vte backport
<AnAnt> I have a question
<AnAnt> I get a warning that there is an svn-commit file
<AnAnt> what should I do to fix that ?
<AnAnt> I tried deleting it, but that won't fix anything !
<AnAnt> I think because the .orig tarball has that svn-commit file
<AnAnt> oh, he meant that I should run linda/lintian on the binaries !
<AnAnt> ok, nevermind fellas !
<imbrandon> heh i put ubuntu on the laptop and kubuntu on the desktop, thats about as far as i'm gonna take it ( as i dont use the laptop much , and when i do its to ssh into the desktop or vnc )
<bluefoxicy> how fast would it get rejected if I uploaded a package with package name 'retard'?
<Burgundavia> bluefoxicy: do you need to even ask?
<bluefoxicy> Burgundavia:  yes~
<bluefoxicy> Burgundavia:  I just had about the coolest (and probably evilest) idea ever
<bluefoxicy> I have a game shark for my game boy
<bluefoxicy> and it has this thing where you play and then hit a button and it goes back to the shark; then you enter the game again, play, hit the button again, goes back to the shark again
<bluefoxicy> and shows you a line-up of all memory addresses and which ones are different; and you can search for a value
<bluefoxicy> so I am thinking about writing a reverse engineering tool that does exactly that, on Linux programs; but the only title I can come up with is Reverse Engineering Tool for Analysis and Reverse Development (RETARD)
<carthik> From #ubuntu : " flubs: dpkg -l | grep '^ii' | awk '{print $2}' | xargs apt-get install --reinstall --force-yes -y " -> doesn't htat look evil?
<bluefoxicy> Burgundavia:  if you have any better names to contribute I'm open.
<ajmitch> carthik: yes, but I've done that before
<Burgundavia> bluefoxicy: I would honestly not even tread there
<Burgundavia> hey ajmitch
<ajmitch> carthik: using the -n option with xargs tends to make it run smoother :)
<ajmitch> hello Burgundavia
<StevenK> COLUMNS=150 dpkg -l | grep '^ii' | tr -s' ' | cut -d\  -f2 | xargs -n apt-get --reinstall install
<ajmitch> or something like that
<bluefoxicy> Burgundavia:  not into programs that can only be used for purposes illegal in most significant places in the world?
<carthik> hi ajmitch, channel displacement calculation error on my part. Was meant for #u-offtopic :) Thanks for the info.
<ajmitch> passing --force-yes is generally a bad thing
<ajmitch> StevenK: wasn't dpkg fixed to not require COLUMNS set?
<StevenK> Maybe. I keep passing it because my muscle memory says so.
<imbrandon> bluefoxicy: good idea , bad name ;)
<bluefoxicy> imbrandon: I know.  It's the only thing I can branch off "reverse engineering tool" that makes sense and is obviously not the name of any other tool
<bluefoxicy> I was gonna call it "REShark" after the GameShark, but .... um.  trademark <-> anal rape
<imbrandon> gnushark ;)
<bluefoxicy> lol
<imbrandon> LinFish
<bluefoxicy> I've seen a hardware PCI gameshark!
<bluefoxicy> I think they're illegal now because of what you can do with them
<bluefoxicy> but it was actually GameShark brand
<imbrandon> heh , i have a snes and gb rom image of the shark here somewhwere, i had a ps1 rom images too but they got corrupted when i tried to patch them for the xbox ps1 emu
<bluefoxicy> imbrandon:  I loved the damn thing either way.  I never carried a code book; when I wanted infinite lives I'd juts play the game twice, die once, scan for the number of lives i had before and after to match in the appropriate snapshots, and then try out ~5 addresses
<bluefoxicy> and bingo.  Infinite lives.
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, imbrandon, Hobbsee: suggestions for UWN packages (or other things)
* imbrandon thinks *
<imbrandon> bluefoxicy: yea you can do that with the current emu's they have the genie and shark built in
<imbrandon> and let you pause and watch mem registers realtime in a sep window
<bluefoxicy> oh holy crap sweet.
<bluefoxicy> imbrandon:  if you're into stuff like that elfsh is probably the coolest thing in existence right now
<imbrandon> cool, whats that ?
<bluefoxicy> an elf shell :)
* Hobbsee think stoo
<bluefoxicy> it lets you do things like inject code into running programs, load random libraries, muck around with variables, the usual debugger stuff
<imbrandon> ahh very nice
<bluefoxicy> http://elfsh.segfault.net/
<imbrandon> sounds like an easy way to segfault something though given the fagile nature of elf bins though ;)
<imbrandon> hahaha just happens to be on segfault.net after i say that
<bluefoxicy> yeah, solar loves it.
<imbrandon> plain C injection , now /thats/ nice^Wnasty
<bluefoxicy> lol
<imbrandon> we did some code for RunUO that let us wrap a windows exe and do dll injection into the running process , THAT was fun
<bluefoxicy> hah
<bluefoxicy> I did a practice DLL injection the other day
<bluefoxicy> had to dig up some old, old stuff
<imbrandon> yea you can end up doing some neat stuff what that if you take the time
<imbrandon> yea most of the info on it is ancient
<bluefoxicy> except this DLL injection was across a network and threw a VNC DLL into RPC using MS03-026 (that really old vuln that Blaster used) and got me remote vnc
<imbrandon> we did that in ummm 2002 and it was old then
<bluefoxicy> I never got around to porting a milw0rm .c file onto metasploit
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: oh!  new login screen for kubuntu!
<bluefoxicy> wanted to gather some data to write a book about hacking up
<Burgundavia> Hobbsee: right, can you pm me the dtails?
<imbrandon> ahh yea Burgundavia new kdm screen ;)
<bluefoxicy> (black AND white)
<imbrandon> bluefoxicy: heh
<bluefoxicy> I figure if we train security professionals to be blackhats, they can figure out what the blackhats are doing and more effectively set up strategic roadblocks
<bluefoxicy> I expect most of the real world to react.......... the same way they did back in the dark ages.
<imbrandon> heh never, they will never take the time to be true blackhats as long as they are only learning it to "prevent"
<bluefoxicy> This one guy during a war a long time ago was developing strategy for his country's army
<bluefoxicy> and what he was doing was conjecturing how barbaric armies would likely invade, and designing defenses against those tactics
<bluefoxicy> and people usually would just try to figure out defenses
<bluefoxicy> and they were like, "HOLY CRAP, YOU ARE SICK, YOU THINK ABOUT EVIL THINGS!"
<Yagisan> bluefoxicy, you missed the grey hats.
<bluefoxicy> Yagisan:  I thought grey hats were flip-flops that did bad things on the side :(
<Yagisan> bluefoxicy, nope, my definition is a white hat that makes sure he gets paid >:)
<bluefoxicy> anyway, it's 3am, I should sleep and let the SNR get back to normal
<Yagisan> what's "normal" ?
<imbrandon> heh gonight, thanks for the link, i'll check it out later when i have some free time ( yea right ! ) lol
<bluefoxicy> "normal" is when I'm not flooding the channel with offtopic crap :P
<bluefoxicy> also when i'm not being recognized by an automated system as being a bigger contributor than bddebian ever though I do basically nothing.
<bluefoxicy> s/ever/even/
<bluefoxicy> imbrandon:  np
<Burgundavia> imbrandon: you able to get that picture too me in the next half hour?
<imbrandon> Burgundavia: yea let me finish this svn checkout then i'll restart kde
<Burgundavia> sounds good
<imbrandon> or hrm i guess i could just xnest it, heh since i have to use ksnapshop to grab a pic anyhow ;)
<imbrandon> s/shop/shot/g
<Burgundavia> yep
<imbrandon> eww i dunno if it shows up in Xnest as intended , look ......
<imbrandon> http://imbrandon.sytes.net/ss6.png
<Burgundavia> imbrandon: hmm, nothing to compare that too
<imbrandon> uptill now it looked like the dapper kdm
<imbrandon> but it looks like its missing images
<imbrandon> the buttons shouldnt be purple and the middle stripe shouldent be purple
<imbrandon> they both should be black
<Burgundavia> imbrandon: I need that screenshot now
<imbrandon> well i onestly cant get it to behave right, still looks broke
<Burgundavia> ok, no worries
<imbrandon> and kwwii isnt on
<Burgundavia> we can cover the new theme next week
<Burgundavia> can you write that?
<imbrandon> yup
<Burgundavia> thanks
<imbrandon> GAWD pbuilde is slow at times
<imbrandon> more time satisfying deps then compiling
<DarkMageZ> that's soo true :) it gets really annoying when you n00b things up over and over for 12 hours =D
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> jesus building a chroot fresh each time would be faster
<imbrandon> why is it soo much slower ?
<DarkMageZ> not sure, but after 12 hours of learning and working, i think my rhythmbox package is going to build :)
<\sh> moins
<\sh> bmonty_away: I adjusted the wine package to build as well on x86_64
<ajmitch> hello \sh
<\sh> moins ajmitch
<phanatic> morning
<\sh> ajmitch: did you ever pushed some bazaar branches to bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ ?
<ajmitch> \sh: yes
<\sh> ajmitch: I did it yesterday evening , and I don't find it under http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/kubuntu-konqueror-shortcuts/ubuntu
<ajmitch> because it probably wasn't pushed properly
<ajmitch> you did it with --create-prefix ?
<ajmitch> it's definitely not there under sftp either, so it doesn't look like it got pushed
<\sh> ajmitch: i followed the howto of scott...
<\sh> even with create-prefix
<Tonio_> ajmitch: pong ? a bit late I must say ;)
<Tonio_> hi everyone
<ajmitch> \sh: it really doesn't look to be there
<ajmitch> Tonio_: MOTU UVF team is really the wrong people to assign to to get UVF exception approved for main
<Tonio_> ajmitch: okay, I didn't find another group and nobody was online for this
<Tonio_> what is the correct gropu plz ?
<ajmitch> see wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources
<ajmitch> subscribe (don't assign) ubuntu-release
<\sh> ajmitch: i'll have another look later...
<\sh> cu later...need to do some real life work :)
<Tonio_> ajmitch: thanks for the info, will do !
<No1Viking> Fglrxinfo is ok but screensaver is slow, what is wrong?
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch
<Tonio_> hey Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi Tonio_
<Hobbsee> hi Fujitsu
<Fujitsu> Hi.
<No1Viking> Fglrxinfo is ok but the screensaver is slow, what is wrong?
<fbond|away> crimsun, re: midisport-firmware, i've looked over edgy's /etc/udev/rules.d/README, and, by a stroke of luck it looks like my udev rules file already has the right int prefix
<fbond|away> am I missing something?
<fbond|away> 80: rules that run programs, + 5 = 85
<fbond|away> I will install my rules file directly in rules.d, not as a symlink.  I assume that will resolve any current issues.
* tseng wonders if it wouldnt be more important to make a gtk theme that didnt blind me
<derjohn> bcm43xx crashed on my HP notebook , because I doesnt know about my particular chip ID. Is there a way to exclude the loading of the module with an append line option? I tried to google for "apprend module blacklist" etc. but couldnt find aynthing ..
<Hobbsee> derjohn: add the name of the module to /etc/modules on a new line
<derjohn> eh: crashed during install, so I talk abiut the installer (sorry for being not precise)
<derjohn> besides that:  /etc/modules _includes_ a module ... I am looking for the case vice versa :/
<StevenK> Hobbsee: That *loads* it.
<Hobbsee> oh.  do i mean /etc/blacklist or /etc/modules/blacklist or something?
<Hobbsee> it's been a while since i've set up ndiswrapper
<Hobbsee> the old way
<StevenK> derjohn: ls: /etc/blacklist: No such file or directory
<StevenK> ls: /etc/modutils/blacklist: No such file or directory
<StevenK> s/derjohn: //
<derjohn> well, I hoped for a solution without the need to remaster the installer
<StevenK> derjohn: There is probably one.
<StevenK> I can't think of it, however.
<derjohn> i have two NIC in the norebook, could live without WLAN druing install .. just something like "append blacklist=bcm43xx" or such .. ?
<derjohn> 'who' does load the module? udev? hardcoded in initrd?
<StevenK> udev, I suspect.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bddebian> Whew, I thought I lost my build box there for a minute..
<Gloubiboulga> openscenegraph again ? ;)
<bddebian> No, k3d, just about as bad :-)
<AnAnt> bddebian: thanks for the comments, I didn't know that linda/lintian can be used on binary debs
<bddebian> NP
<bddebian> I'm test building again now :-)
<AnAnt> bddebian: thanks
<bddebian> NP
<TLE> Can I ask a question about patching and re-packaging Ubuntu software here ?
<bddebian> TLE: Shoot
<TLE> Great. The question is: If I download the source-code for a Ubuntu package, say metacity with apt. Then patch, compile and package it, then, will this package have all the dependencies of the original package, and will other people be able to use it without doing anything else ?
<bddebian> Yes
<TLE> Greeeat, that's why I love Linux, thanks a lot
<geser> in edgy you can have slight different dependencies because a library changed so-names between the last compile and now
<TLE> ok thanks,  but I'm only targeting the patch at Dapper for now, I'm kind of new at this
<geser> then the dependencies shouldn't change
<TLE> ok thanks
<Prezu> Could someone please explain me what's the /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/tarball.mk for? There's very brief explanation in cdbs-doc.html, so it's not clear for me.
<asimon> Prezu: Good question, the answer would interest me too. I haven't yet seen any good example where it's used.
<bddebian> Prezu: Is it for packages that have a tarball inside the source package instead of a build tree?
<geser> as far as I understand it: you can include the upstream tar.gz in your orig.tar.gz (tar in tar) and tarball.mk unpacks those included tar.gz so you can use it
<Prezu> As I understand it, geser is right. See the xerces27 package. It uses the tarball.mk. I'm just not certain why it should be used anyway.
<asimon> Prezu: Yes, this xerces package contains the upstream tarball inside a orig.tar.gz, thus the md5 sum of orig.tar.gz is not equal to the upstream md5sum. I thought that was not good practice?
<Prezu> asimon: Well, it's not. If upstream releases the .tar.gz, it should just be renamed. But if it's e. g. tar.bz2 it has to be bunzipp2ed and gzipped.
<Prezu> So i've got no idea why the md5sum is different. Maybe regzipped with -9?
<plugwash> have you compared the MD5s of the two versions after ungzipping?
<asimon> Prezu: Well the md5sum is different because the upstream tarball is wrappend in an other tarball, which changes the md5sum.
<imbrandon> [10:42]  <Prezu> asimon: Well, it's not. If upstream releases the .tar.gz, it should just be renamed.  <-- not always it may not unzip to the correct dir name format if just renamed
<Prezu> asimon: I thought you're taking about a wrapped xerces-c-src_2_7_0.tar.gz's md5sum.
<asimon> imbrandon: Okay, so this xerces27 package is probably just not a very good example where cdbs's tarball.mk is really useful.
<asimon> Prezu: No, that one is identical to upsteam. I meant the orig.tar.gz.
<Prezu> asimon: I think xerces27 is a good example. Take a look at tar tvzf  xerces-c-src_2_7_0.tar.gz. It unpacks the sources to the xerces-c-src_2_7_0. And it shound be xerces27-2.7.0 for Debian/Ubuntu.
<toddobryan> I installed a Debian package by compiling from source, but the menu item it adds isn't showing up.
<toddobryan> I'm thinking that /usr/share/menu has little relationship to the menus at the top of my screen (because hints and such are different).
<toddobryan> Where do the menus I can see come from?
<geser> /usr/share/applications
<asimon> Prezu: But that could be handled by a simple renaming of the tarball, couldn't it?
<Prezu> asimon: Well, I thought so all the time. But why to use /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/tarball.mk then? And here we come to my first questoin again. :)
<toddobryan> So, to Ubuntify the package, I should add a .desktop file and have it copied to /usr/share/applications?
<zul> yep..
<asimon> Prezu: Exactly :-)
<TLE> I'm trying to follow the lesson in MOTU school https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/PatchingSources and the irc log. I'm in the udev: "separate patches, but no patch system" part. But when I execute the "debian/rules patch" command I get an error: make: dh_testdir: Command not found
<asimon> Prezu: I just tried it. Renamed the tarball to standard orig.tar.gz format, removed the tarball.mk rule and it works. So at least in this case I see no good reason to use tarball.mk.
<TLE> make: *** [patch-stamp]  Error 127.
<TLE> What am I doing wrong
<asimon> TLE: Do you have debhelper installed? dh_testdir is part of that package.
<TLE> No i didn't. I searched for it in synaptic but didn't get a hit. Thanks
<Goshawk> hi
<toddobryan> I just installed ibmj2sdk1.5 this morning, and now I get an error every time I
<toddobryan> try to run java.
<toddobryan> It says it can't find "libjvm.so".
<sladen> toddobryan: that you done update-alternatives to select /which/ Java you want?
<sladen> s/that/have/
<toddobryan> Yes, I have.
<Bazzi> hm, dapper or edgy?
<toddobryan> Dapper.
<Bazzi> let me try
<toddobryan> I have a PPC, so that's really my only choice.
<Bazzi> oh, thats ppc stuff, oh
<Bazzi> so it wont be in x86 repos?
<toddobryan> Oh, one thing I should have mentioned: I installed it manually following the instructions on the Wiki and it worked.
<toddobryan> Nope...probably not x86.
<toddobryan> But I kept getting bothered by Update Manager, saying I needed to update.
<toddobryan> So I did. And it broke.
<Goshawk> Uploading via ftp splashy_0.1.8.1-3ubuntu1.dsc: Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of splashy_0.1.8.1-3ubuntu1.dsc
<Goshawk> i got this error running: dput revu *.changes
<Goshawk> hi, i've this error: Uploading via ftp splashy_0.1.8.1-3ubuntu1.dsc: Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of splashy_0.1.8.1-3ubuntu1.dsc
<Goshawk> during uploading to revu
<crimsun> you need an admin to remove the upload if dput -f doesn't work
<Goshawk> googling i found that it is possible that an admin didn't run the import-keys-from-launchpad-script. can someone do it please?
<crimsun> it was done yesterday; were you already part of that group yesterday?
<Goshawk> ok trying dput -f
<Goshawk> yep i was
<Goshawk> i registered on 14th
<Goshawk> same error with dput -f revu *.changes
<Goshawk> uhm...
<Goshawk> running dcut
<crimsun> dcut doesn't work
<Goshawk> ok finding another way
<crimsun> you'll need an admin to remove the upload.
<Goshawk> crimsun: should i find him on #ubuntu?
<crimsun> Goshawk: raphink seems to be one with the lowest recent idle indicator
<Goshawk> crimsun: thanks
<raphink> crimsun: how do you mean?
<raphink> what idle indicator?
<crimsun> raphink: (revu admin)
<Goshawk> hi raphink
<raphink> I'm there when needed for revu admin
<crimsun> raphink: /wi raphink raphink  (in irssi)
<raphink> just busy on my projects lately
<Goshawk> i need your help, can you remove the splashy dsc file in ftp://revu.tauware.de/incoming
<Goshawk> ?
<Goshawk> thanks
<raphink> I don't have /wi
<raphink> sure I can Goshawk
<raphink> give me one minute
<Goshawk> raphink: thanks
<crimsun> raphink: (i.e., pointing him to Andrew would probably be futile given his timezone and idle indicator :)
<raphink> done Goshawk
<Goshawk> thanks
<raphink> hehe ok
<Goshawk> tring... dput revu *.changes
<raphink> Goshawk: did you sign with -S -sa ?
<raphink> just to be sure
<Goshawk> raphink: sure
<Goshawk> :d
<Goshawk> :D
<raphink> good :)
<Goshawk> gpg: Good signature from "Vincenzo Ampolo <vincenzo.ampolo@gmail.com>"
<raphink> I'm surprised we don't have splashy yet
<raphink> ok
<Goshawk> raphink: this is why i'm here :D
<AnAnt> bddebian: thanks !
<raphink> it's coming up Goshawk
<Goshawk> Successfully uploaded packages.
<raphink> yes, I can confirm
<raphink> now let's see if the package is accepted ;)
<raphink> we'll see that in 5 seconds
<raphink> yep it's on :)
<raphink> good work Goshawk
<Goshawk> thanks raphink
<Goshawk> hope it will be added to edgy
<raphink> hope so
<raphink> you have to find reviewers now :)
<Goshawk> ok thanks for your help... good coding :D
<AnAnt> raphink: when does a package get reviewed ?
<raphink> AnAnt: usually when you find a reviewer to look at it
<AnAnt> raphink: do reviewers review packages that have comments yet are not Advocated ?
<AnAnt> raphink: you mean I should ask someone to review it ?
<raphink> AnAnt: theorically yes, but if you look at the queue on REVU, you understand that you actually have to find reviewers
<raphink> AnAnt: yes, it's the best way if you want to get there fast
<AnAnt> oic
<raphink> try to poke developers on here
<raphink> and paste the url to your package
<AnAnt> lionelp: remember the elinks package that you commented about in July ? I did some fixes to it
<Goshawk> http://revu.tauware.de/lostpw.py?email=vincenzo.ampolo@gmail.com ----> there is no text to pass to gpg for me
<raphink> hmmm
<raphink> let me see
<AnAnt> Goshawk: yeah, I dunno when they will fix that
<Goshawk> -__- and so how can i find my password?
<asimon> Goshawk: to quote an admin 'lostpw.py it totally fucked up'.  ;-)
<Goshawk> ;)
<AnAnt> Goshawk: duno, but if you find out, please tell me :)
<raphink> asimon: yes I know :(
* Goshawk tries to view the lostpw.py code...
<AnAnt> someone said that it works fine with him about 2 days ago
<raphink> hmm
<AnAnt> LaserJock
<Goshawk> raphink: i don't want to disturb you, but if you can mail me that py script at vincenzo.ampolo@gmail.com , i can spend one hour on it this night
<Goshawk> thanks
<Goshawk> now i must go
<Goshawk> see you guys
<AnAnt> maybe its not the code
<raphink> siretart has changed some things in revu lately
<raphink> I wonder if it's not using the LP identification now
<raphink> did you try that?
<AnAnt> LaserJock said it worked for him on Aug 17th
<AnAnt> what is LP ?
<tseng> launchpad.net
<raphink> launchpad
<raphink> you have to have an account on launchpad
<AnAnt> yeah
<raphink> otherwise you wouldn't be able to upload to REVU
<raphink> hi tseng
<AnAnt> I can upload to REVU
<Goshawk> raphink: me too
<tseng> hi
<AnAnt> the problem is that if I need to put a comment on my upload I can't without logging in
<Goshawk> AnAnt: same problem here... time to go, bye
<AnAnt> well, gotta go too
<zul_> heh...i even have a blog now..
<tseng> zul_: oh?
<zul_> yeah..
<crimsun> well you're hacking on xen, so that's conceivably bloggable imo
<zul> true..
<bddebian> Plus the fact that you are such a stud :)
<zul> hmm...i wanna beat someone now :)
<fbond|away> bddebian: no rush, just uploaded fixed midisport-firmware package, thanks again for your time
<bddebian> fbond|away: OK, I'll check it out
<bddebian> Gah, I think my laptop is dying :'-(
<crimsun> welcome to the club.
<bddebian> fbond|away: around?
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-13
<bddebian> This bzr shit is going to push me over the edge
<AndyP> bddebian: hang in there, you can do it
<bddebian> Heya AndyP
<AndyP> ello bddebian, how're things?
<Toadstool> oh bddebian, you here!
<bddebian> Uh oh
<Toadstool> how have you been doing?
<Toadstool> :)
<bddebian> AndyP: OK thanks, you?
<bddebian> Toadstool: Getting back to normal thanks. You?
<Toadstool> trying to get back to normal
<Toadstool> not much success so far
<AndyP> bddebian: not too shabby
<bddebian> Toadstool: Heh, I hear that
<bddebian> So now we have to check every package to see if it's maintained in bzr before making any changes??
<Toadstool> er screw that, I hate the new all-in-bzr frenzy :/
<bddebian> Amen brother
<jmg> eww
<jmg> is this as a result of no-source-packages?
<jmg> doesnt that raise the barrier of entry for importing into debian?
<jmg> is there no compatability layer?
<jmg> will apt-get source still work?
<jmg> will somebody please think of the children????
<jmg> what kind of smartie pants came up with this anyway?
<ajmitch> geser: that's an evil version number
<ajmitch>  haskell-http (30000000-1build1) gutsy; urgency=low
<jmg> ewwwwwww
<Fujitsu> Ew.
<Fujitsu> !info haskell-http sid
<ubotu> Package haskell-http does not exist in sid
<Fujitsu> Bah, stupid lack of sources.
<Fujitsu> !info haskell-http-doc sid
<ubotu> haskell-http-doc: Haskell HTTP client library documentation. In component main, is optional. Version 30000000-1 (sid), package size 24 kB, installed size 276 kB
<StevenK> What, the Maintainer is *trying* to annoy people?
<jmg> o_O
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Probably.
<jmg> http://hackage.haskell.org/cgi-bin/hackage-scripts/package/HTTP
<jmg> unfortunately that version appears to be valid albeit with some superfluous zeroes
<Fujitsu> The versions have all been dates before.
<Fujitsu> Did we hit the year 3000 without me noticing?
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: yes
<Nafallo> :-P
<RAOF> Where are debian packages after they're accepted but before they're published?
<bashelier> RAOF: in the ftp master queue
<StevenK> RAOF: http://inncoming.debian.org/
<StevenK> incoming, sigh
<RAOF> Heh.  Thanks.
<RAOF> Man, people *really want* the new deluge version :/
<StevenK> Enough to pull it from incoming?
<bddebian> Isn't there a bzr branch yet?
* bddebian hides
<RAOF> Rather than reject the incorrect sync bug, I'll just fix it up and attach a debdiff.
<RAOF> Ah, Ok.  I won't unsubscribe u-u-s, then :)
<AndyP> bddebian: so what's this about checking if bzr branches exist? i have a feeling i missed something
<bddebian> I was chastised for the gnash stuff because it is in bzr apparently
<AndyP> bddebian: oh ok, i thought we were meant to be using XS-Vcs-Bzr or something for that
<bddebian> We are apparently but that is what I am saying
<AndyP> gotcha :)
<bddebian> So now I have to check every package that I apply a patch to to see if it has that bullshit?
<AndyP> i guess so :/
<bddebian> Am I now also responsible for getting that patch in the bzr branch?
* AndyP shrugs
<RAOF> bddebian: It'd be nice, I believe.
<RAOF> i
<RAOF> If you're on gutsy, apt-get source will warn you if the source package is maintained in an RCS.
<bddebian> Good, I'll know to ignore those then
<ScottK> RAOF: I believe that change was reverted.
<ScottK> Now it's just supposed to give you a notice.
<bddebian> Oh, ScottK
<bddebian> I had a question for you now I can't remember which package.  libmetakit maybe?
<ScottK> Some old curmudgeon who doesn't understand how inherently wonderful this vcs stuff is whined aboutit.
<ScottK> bddebian: Probably either not that package or it's StevenK you're thinking of.
<jmg> ScottK: you're a curmudgeon
<ScottK> And bitter too.
<bddebian> ScottK: It was a merge you did and there's a new version.. Grr
<ScottK> Hmmm
<bddebian> Oh screenkast?
<jmg> shouldnt apt-get source pull the latest version?
<bddebian> It "should"
<ScottK> jmg: From the repository, yes.
<jmg> ok
<ScottK> Not from some semi random other place on the internet.
<mruiz> hi all. I have a package ready for review (is an upgrade). Which packages must I upload to my server? (while REVU is offline)
<jmg> that would be the source package
<mruiz> %s/packages/files/g
<ScottK> mruiz: tarball, diff.gz, and .dsc are sufficient.
<jmg> is LP getting some revu-a-lie function?
<Nafallo> *s* vim :-)
<jmg> like*
<mruiz> thanks ScottK
<jmg> ah, PPA?
<Nafallo> mruiz: also upload orig.tar.gz to make things easier.
<bddebian> Oh it was screenkast but that's StevenK too
<StevenK> Hum?
<ScottK> That lets you build stuff, but doesn't have the commenting stuff the REVU has.
<jmg> i built elisa 0.3 last night
<jmg> and pigment
<Nafallo> oooh
<ScottK> bddebian: I don't think screenKast is me.
<Nafallo> kinky
<bddebian> StevenK: You still aboot?
* StevenK curses his uni's inability to manage a Windows network.
<bddebian> heh
<StevenK> bddebian: aboot got removed. :-P
<jmg> :(
<bddebian> hehe
<StevenK> bddebian: What's up?
<bddebian> StevenK: No, screenkast needs another merge.  Do you know if your changes need to stay?
<StevenK> bddebian: I'd need to check. Do you mind holding off for about 30 minutes while I sort out what I'm in the middle of?
<bddebian> Of course not, thanks
<RAOF> Hm.  Why has sbuild stopped sending me buildlogs by mail?
* StevenK has never gotten sbuild to mail him.
<RAOF> It was working fine until yesterday, now it's stopped.
* RAOF is sad.  That was the best feature of sbuild
<ScottK> So if a package (source and binary) has been removed from Gutsy, but it still shows a queued build for lpia (status Needs Building) is that something I should mention to an archive admin?
<johanbr__> RAOF: Maybe mail doesn't get delivered on weekends where you live? :)
<RAOF> johanbr__: Or maybe gmail has suddenly decided to classify those buildlogs as spam :(
<StevenK> ScottK: No, lpia is getting slowly sorted out by infinity.
<ScottK> OK.  Thanks.
<StevenK> ScottK: You could mention it to him, but I doubt he'd do anything.
<ScottK> When I kill stuff off, I just want to make sure I've got it completely dead.
<ScottK> I guess even if it got built, it'd just get nds'ed eventually anyway.
<ScottK> nds/nbs
<ajmitch> good afternoon
<bddebian> Hmm, I wonder if freemind would build with gcj
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> Hmm, well freemind builds with gcj but I don't know if it works
<ScottK> bddebian: Building is progress.
<bddebian> ScottK: Nice delayed response.. :-)
<bddebian> Oh and StevenK obviously forgot about me ;-P
<ScottK> Well it's easier to type responses when I'm actually sitting here.
<bddebian> :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: you should be fixing stuff, not worrying about people forgetting you
<bddebian> ajmitch: I'm trying
<bddebian> ajmitch: Wanna REVU something for me to fix a bug? :-)
<ajmitch> no
* ajmitch is trying to get some code at work going
<bddebian> pfft, work, schmurk
<ScottK> It's probably php.  It's not like anyone actually expects php code to do anything useful...
<bddebian> hehe
<bddebian> Damn, to upload or not to upload...
<bddebian> ScottK: You have time to look at a package quick?
<ScottK> An entire package, no, but if there's something specific....
<bddebian> New upstream of xmlrpc-c
<ScottK> Sound scary.  Two entire scary three letter acryonyms in 6 letters of packagename.
<bddebian> Gah
<ScottK> New upstream you can upload yourself anyway.  It doesn't need an ack.
<bddebian> It's not my packaging.  It's too clean to be mine. ;-P
<ScottK> OK.  Then advocate it and upload it.
<bddebian> OK, when I get bitched at I'm telling them you told me too ;-P
<ScottK> Hey, I just work here.
<StevenK> bddebian: Didn't forget, had to leave where I was, sorry.
<bddebian> StevenK: NP, I'm just giving you a hard time.  I have a bad tendency to do that
<mruiz> bye all
* ajmitch needs food asap
<DarkSun88> Good Morning
<ajmitch> hi
<DarkSun88> Hi Andrew
<pschulz01> Greetings.. I'm trying to install the package 'scsh'.. it installs on i386, but not in 64bit.. apt-cache search scsh on my 64bit laptop shows scsh-06 package is missing which scsh depends on.
<pschulz01> Hmm.. getting segfault when I try to build scsh
<rulus> Is this the right channel to ask about how to make deb packages?
<pschulz01> rulus: You can ask :-)
<rulus> ah, well, I have a bzr branch with a Python application. Is there a guide somewhere to tell me how to make a .deb package out of it?
<pschulz01> rulus: Um.. I'm struggling with something similar. I have managed to make some progress, but I don;t know if it's the correct way to do stuff.. hopefully someone else here will know more.. otherwise I can give you some hints.
<pschulz01> Install the 'debhelper' package.
<pschulz01> rulus: Have a look at the 'dh_make' script..
<rulus> ok
<norsetto> morning all
<marcin_ant> hi guys
<marcin_ant> I got a question - how is it possible that product that is not free for commercial usage is available as package in universe?
<marcin_ant> and there is no word in package description that it's downloading for commercial usage is restricted? The package is: dansguardian
<geser> good question
<norsetto> the license in the tarball is GPL, so, where is it specified that this is not free for commercial usage?
<geser> on the homepage
<norsetto> and why should we care about the homepage?
<geser> http://dansguardian.org/?page=copyright2
<norsetto> Imean, if they package the tarball with GPL (also in the README)
<geser> I couldn't find this restriction in the tarball on Ubuntu archive and neither in the last beta tarball
<norsetto> exactly ....
<geser> see also the last question on this page
<geser> so it's ok to be in universe
<norsetto> I checked some headers, they are all GPL
<\sh> he has to dua-license it, like qt
<\sh> s/dua/dual/
<ogra> \sh, why, he has given it a licence when he rolled the tarball ... no matter what else he writes on any webpages
<ogra> if he wants to restict usage he can relicense the source ... but until that happens its GPL software
<\sh> ogra: yepp...that's what I mean
<ogra> :)
<marcin_ant> pretty confusing...
<marcin_ant> especially if you need to be sure if it's safe to use in company
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
<Riddell> is https://launchpad.net/~motu-uvf/+members up to date?
<Riddell> no, doesn't seem so
<geser> dholbach is on holiday
<Riddell> geser: any idea when to?  it isn't mentioned in canonical's internal calendar
<geser> his blog mentions he'll be back on Aug 20th
<Riddell> hmm, so the team won't be updated in time
<\sh> Riddell: no second general at hand? ;)
<Riddell> not for that team
<\sh> well, SPoF then ... can happen needs to be fixed
<Riddell> groovy, I 0wned the team
<\sh> lol
<\sh> just installed tribe4 from gutsy...nice to see aixgl is enabled by default :)
<pygi> asac, ok, it doesn't
<pygi> (that was supposed to be in -devel :P)
<Kmos>  2.1.8-release-1
<Kmos> if I want to modify this one, what's the name for ubuntu ?
<Kmos> 2.1.8-release-1ubuntu1 ?
<asac> Kmos: yes
<Kmos> asac: thanks
<geser> RAOF: about your deluge-torrent merge: what's the reason to build it only for python2.5 and not python2.4 and python2.5?
<zul> hey Hobbsee
<geser> Hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> heya
<pygi> o no, it's Hobbsee :)
<ScottK> Good morning all.
<ScottK> norsetto: I'm here if you want to discuss.
<Hobbsee> it is.  hear me roar!
<norsetto> ScottK: Hi
<ScottK> Hey
<ScottK> To answer your question, I don't remember about lintian warnings.
<ScottK> The upload I did I was fixing a bug and so just focused on making it work.
<norsetto> ScottK: ok, so what can we do beside alerting the debian devel? Should we fix those ourselves? Can the package be uploaded?
<ScottK> Would you pastebin me the warnings?
<norsetto> ScottK: sure; I worked some of them out mysef, just for fun
<ScottK> Well if you worked some out, I'd go ahead and include that resolution in the upload.
<norsetto> ScottK: http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/m3f0b7166
* ScottK looks
<ScottK> norsetto: Are those the ones you have not fixed yet?
<norsetto> ScottK: no, these are all the original ones
<norsetto> ScottK: I worked out the easy ones ;-)
<ScottK> OK.  Which of those did you come up with resolutions for?
<ScottK> You and I may have different definitions of easy.
<norsetto> ScottK: Yes, easy for me of course ...missing-debconf-dependency-for-preinst
<norsetto> ScottK:  The font /usr/share/poker-network/poker2d/fonts/FreeSerif.ttf in package ttf-freefont is considered to be a duplicate
<norsetto> File /usr/lib/pkgconfig/poker-network.pc contained in /usr/lib of Architecture: all package
<norsetto> ScottK: postinst/postrm-has-useless-call-to-ldconfig seems to be debhelper related
<ScottK> I'd expect it is.
<ScottK> Since the call is described as useless, I expect it's not particulalry harmful.
<norsetto> ScottK: postinst-uses-db-input is perhaps a  candidate for override; I actually don't understand the logic behind it (its a server reset)
<ScottK> Right.
<norsetto> ScottK: And then the .la files I don't really know what to do
<ScottK> That and the preinst debconf call are ones I wouldn't touch without a dialogue with the Debian maintainer.
<norsetto> ScottK: agree
<ScottK> I don't either.  I wonder if they even actually get used (if they lack path information, I'd expect it's either hard wired in somewhere else or they aren't used).
<pschulz01> What happens if a package doesn't build for a particular archtecture?
<ScottK> I'd say go with what you've fixed and mail the Debian maintainer about the others.
<ScottK> norsetto: There's also a request for a Feisty SRU for that package.  Interested?
<norsetto> ScottK: already emailed him; still waiting for feedback
<ScottK> norsetto: Great.
<ScottK> pschulz01: Not sure what you mean?
<pschulz01> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/scsh-0.6/+bug/62293
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 62293 in scsh-0.6 "Depends: scsh-0.6  but it is not installable - se.archive.ubuntu.com seems broken." [Undecided,Incomplete] 
<pschulz01> ScottK: The 64bit package doesn;t build
<ScottK> OK.  Then what happens is you have no binary for that arch.
<xxxxx1> mornin' people
<xxxxx1> :)
<ScottK> Morning xxxxx1.
<xxxxx1> ScottK!
<ScottK> pschulz01: Whoever uploaded the package should try to fix it.
<pschulz01> ScottK: The bug has been labeled against the 'Ubuntu Mirror Admin' but I don't think that's right.
<ScottK> pschulz01: What bug?
<pschulz01> ScottK: I was able to build it on all the arch I have (i386,powerp) except for x36_64.
<pschulz01> ScottK: Bug 62293
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 62293 in scsh-0.6 "Depends: scsh-0.6  but it is not installable - se.archive.ubuntu.com seems broken." [Undecided,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/62293
<white> !info emacs gutsy
<ubotu> emacs: The GNU Emacs editor (metapackage). In component main, is optional. Version 22.1-0ubuntu4 (gutsy), package size 4 kB, installed size 36 kB
<white> !info emacs21 gutsy
<ubotu> emacs21: The GNU Emacs editor. In component main, is optional. Version 21.4a+1-5ubuntu1 (gutsy), package size 1977 kB, installed size 5928 kB
<white> the security patch is probably included, but someone might want to check
<pschulz01> ScottK: I don;t think it's a Mirror admin issue... I see the exact same problem though.
<ScottK> pschulz01: I agree.
<ScottK> The IA64 binary if FTBFS for Dapper, Edgy, Feisty, and Gutsy.
<white> reference debian bug #408929
<ubotu> Debian bug 408929 in emacs21 "emacs21: crash on spam" [Important,Open]  http://bugs.debian.org/408929
<pschulz01> ScottK: FTBFS?
<ScottK> pschulz01: I'd suggest rewrite the bug.
<ScottK> Fail To Build From Source
<pschulz01> ScottK: :-)
<pschulz01> ScottK: :-(
<ScottK> pschulz01: Then look in Debian and upstream to see if they have any 64 bit fixes.
<white> !info eggdrop gutsy
<ubotu> eggdrop: Advanced IRC Robot. In component universe, is extra. Version 1.6.18-1ubuntu1 (gutsy), package size 462 kB, installed size 1136 kB
<white> someone might want to check, if the security patch from the 1.6.18-1.1 version (which is in incoming.debian.org) is included
<ScottK> norsetto: You've been looking for stuff to do, so white's suggestion is a good one.  Will you take it?
* norsetto scans the log
<ScottK> norsetto: Do you want the Feisty SRU for poker-network?
<white> !info freeradius gutsy
<ubotu> freeradius: a high-performance and highly configurable RADIUS server. In component universe, is optional. Version 1.1.6-2 (gutsy), package size 736 kB, installed size 2764 kB
<pschulz01> ScottK: Bug in Debian... Not portable to 64bit platforms .. 5 years and 353 days old.
<norsetto> ScottK: well, since I 'm doing the gutsy one, I can as well do the SRU for feisty
<ScottK> What does upstream say?
<white> !info xfce4-terminal gutsy
<ubotu> xfce4-terminal: Xfce terminal emulator. In component main, is optional. Version 0.2.6-2ubuntu2 (gutsy), package size 991 kB, installed size 2964 kB
<white> someone might want to check xfce4-terminal as well. I am not sure, if the fix is in the 0.2.6-3 version, i did not work on it
<white> I think that's it for today, not much though
<norsetto> white: do you remember the ITA for turkey?
<white> norsetto: -v please
<ScottK> norsetto: SRU for Bug #95836 assigned to you then.  Remember that for SRU we want the minimally invasive fix.  I just assigned one bug for the SRU, but look at all 3 that I closed.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 95836 in poker-network "[apport]  twistd crashed with OperationalError in __init__()" [Medium,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/95836
<siretart> Riddell: oh, you kicked me out of UVF?
<norsetto> white: a week ago you asked if I could issue an ITA for turkey (orphanesd in Debian since a while); I did fix it for gutsy
<white> norsetto: so you want it?
<norsetto> white: well, I sent it out to l.d.o. and the java group 'cause I need a sponsor
<norsetto> white: nobody answered, so I can't do nothing, sorry
<white> norsetto: hmm http://qa.debian.org/developer.php?login=packages@qa.debian.org does not show me that there is a ITA for that package
<white> norsetto: you need to write a ITA bug against wnpp
<RainCT> hi
<norsetto> white: no, I checked for a sponsor before
<white> norsetto: there are 3 rc bugs against the package in debian
<white> norsetto: did you fix them all?
<Riddell> siretart: you don't seem to be in the team for this release
<norsetto> white: at least 2; but one the fixes might not be welcome in debian
<siretart> Riddell: I'm not? - well, okay.
<white> norsetto: why is that?
<norsetto> white: 'cause it requires to use the sun jvm, so the package ends up in non-free
<Riddell> siretart: new team here https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2007-July/023974.html
<white> norsetto: well i am not totally familiar with java, so i would not sponsor the package atm. But if you end up writing an ITA and mail debian-mentors@l.d.o. with the new packages, then I am sure that you will find a sponsor
<white> norsetto: if you did not end up finding one afterwards, then ping me and i will find one for you
<siretart> Riddell: ah, must have missed that mail. thanks for the link
<norsetto> white: roger
<white> norsetto: thanks
<ScottK> norsetto: You should ping man-di (who is usually here) as he does lots of Java stuff in Debian.
<norsetto> ScottK: thanks, I will
<Kmos> StevenK: bug 131795
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131795 in dapper-backports "Please backport clamav 0.91.1 from Gutsy" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131795
<Kmos> updates are not working..
<ScottK> Kmos: Can't do it yet.
<ScottK> Clamav 0.9x changed it's interfaces with other applications and so we have to backport them all at the same time.
<ScottK> Working on it.
<Kmos> ScottK: ok.. thanks =)
<\sh> wow...i just read that for the first time
<\sh> "
<\sh> Community Hosted Servers Compromised
<\sh> This last week, 5 of the 8 servers that are loco hosted but Canonical sponsored, had to be shut down due to reports that they were actively attacking other machines.
<\sh> "
<\sh> how did that happen?
<Nafallo> \sh: well. TBH I think there was lack of administration etc...
<Nafallo> and not up-to-date for security fixes.
<ScottK> \sh: Where did you read that?
* ScottK has heard, but not read ...
<\sh> Scott: latest uwn
<\sh> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue52
<ScottK> Thanks
<Fujitsu> ROFL
* Fujitsu just checked SCOX's stock price.
<\sh> Nafallo: lack of administration == are those admins "sysadmins from canonical" or "those community admins from the locos"?
<Fujitsu> Down 74.36% since the market opened a short time ago.
<AndyP> Fujitsu: hehe, i thought it would drop a bit but not that much :)
<Nafallo> \sh: when I was admin for vistula it was a service provided by the locos. I would think that is still true.
<Fujitsu> Down to $0.40
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: nice :-)
<Nafallo> they screwed up, and now they're paying for it...
<\sh> Nafallo: so the loco admins were responsible for the servers
<StevenK> Fujitsu: I wonder why that is. :-P
<Nafallo> \sh: at least some year ago.
<\sh> I wonder what the users tell them, when the server is compromized...regarding the user data
<Fujitsu> The LoCo servers are primarily community maintained at the moment (I'm an admin on mekong).
<Nafallo> I think vistula is still up
<Nafallo> I get ICMP ECHO replies anyway.
<Ng> \sh: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/loco-contacts/2007-August/001510.html has more detail, fwiw
* \sh shakes his head...
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> I think point c is damn valid in this.
<Nafallo> that's why I let someone else take over the duty of vistula.
<Nafallo> that and work.
<Fujitsu> Mekong is all Dapper but the kernel, but that's not very useful.
<\sh> hmm...how can someone change the number of virtual desktops these days?
<\sh> (gnome)
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: I think vistula is the same.
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: at least I left it in that stage :-)
<Nafallo> state even
<Kmos> \sh: preferences ? with right button on little windows
<Nafallo> \sh: right click the applet?
<Kmos> can someone look at bug 132179 , it has a debdiff that needs to be uploaded, before remove this package.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 132179 in workbone "[Remove]  Please remove workbone from Gutsy" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132179
<Fujitsu> \sh: Using Compiz Fusion, you mean?
<Fujitsu> Kmos: Erm... why the heck would you upload a fix immediately before removal?
<Fujitsu> That's clinically insane.
<Kmos> Fujitsu: that package will provide and replace workbone in the future
<Kmos> Fujitsu: upgrade stuff..
<geser> \sh: start ccsm again -> General Options -> "Desktop Size" Tab
<geser> \sh: for a cube I have there: Horizontal Size = 4 ; Vertical Size = 1 ; Num of Desktops = 1
<\sh> ah...so it's configured with ccsm
<geser> \sh: compiz uses gtk-window-decorator which looks like metacity
<\sh> geser: hmm...I setup 8 desktops
<\sh> ah...now I get it
<\sh> it's totally different then from the normal virtual desktop setup
<bddebian> Heya gang
<\sh> moins barry
<bddebian> Heya \sh, how have you been?
<\sh> bddebian, well, at least i'm free of doing merges ,-)
<bddebian> hehe
<pygi> \sh, then you have a free pbuilder? :)
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya geser
* pygi needs something built since his computer is behaving xD
<bddebian> StevenK: Thanks for hitting screenkast!
<norsetto> ScottK: I checked eggdrop and the latest security patch from the 1.6.18-1.1 version is NOT included
<ScottK> norsetto: Get to work then.
<norsetto> ScottK: don't we wait for a merge? OK, will fix it
<ScottK> norsetto: If you have -1.1, go ahead and do the merge.
<norsetto> ScottK: bug 132222 subscribed to u-u-s
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 132222 in eggdrop "Please merge eggdrop (1.6.18-1.1) from Debian Unstable" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132222
* ScottK looks
<bddebian> Uhm, what is wildcard in this code?
<bddebian> ifneq "$(wildcard /usr/share/misc/config.sub)" ""
<bddebian>   cp -f /usr/share/misc/config.sub config.sub
<bddebian> endif
<geser> I guess a make function
<geser> bddebian: http://www.gnu.org/software/make/manual/make.html#Wildcard-Function
<bddebian> dumb :)
<bddebian> Thx geser
<AndyP> i saw that snippet in fceu's rules file the other day
<bddebian> fugly :-)
<AndyP> yeah, they should be using cdbs ;)
* AndyP ducks
<bddebian> heh
<ScottK> norsetto: You've got the attention of the right guy on eggdrop.
<norsetto> ScottK: :-)
<luisbg> how do I uncompress a .deb?
<bddebian> dpkg-deb -x or something like that
<pygi> dpkg-source -x *.dsc
<pygi> ups, that's for a source
* pygi hides
<luisbg> pygi, LOL no problem
<luisbg> want to give it a second try?
<bddebian> dpkg-deb -x <deb> <dir>
<pygi> yup, bddebian is right
* bddebian wonders if he needs to repeat a third time
<pygi> bddebian, shhh :)
<bddebian> :-)
<luisbg> heh
<luisbg> the output directory has a etc and usr folder?
<luisbg> I was expecting something else
<luisbg> LOL
<bddebian> Are you looking for the source?
<simu> like "right-click the file an choose Open with Archive Manager"
<luisbg> yes
<bddebian> pfft gui is for sissy's ;-P
* bddebian didn't even know that worked :-)
<geser> luisbg: what did you expect?
<luisbg> geser, I wanted the source
<luisbg> and I just have the .deb file
<geser> that won't work as the deb doesn't contain the source code
<luisbg> I redid most of what I had done
<luisbg> thanks geser =)
<pygi> apt-get source blablabla
<pygi> :)
<pygi> ah, /me didn't read again xD
<Ng> siretart: ping
<siretart> Ng: sorry, I'm about to leave ;)
<Ng> siretart: ok, never mind
<Ng> siretart: is there anyone else I can pester about revu?
<siretart> Ng: maybe sistpoty, ajmitch, raphink, choose one :)
<ScottK> Ng: It's down for sometime.
<ScottK> Pestering won't help.
<Ng> ScottK: I don't want to use it, I want to talk to someone about how it works. I'm a Canonical Sysadmin working on the machines that the down loco services will be using :)
<ScottK> Ah.
<ScottK> Sorry.
<Ng> np :)
<siretart> Ng: can we chat tomorrow about it?
<Ng> siretart: certainly, thanks
<siretart> Ng: basically, it is a 'mod-python' application
<ScottK> He's probably sleeping now, but IIRC StevenK would be another one.
<siretart> Ng: and it needs postgres
<Ng> siretart: ok, that's cool
<Hobbsee> ScottK: he's also sleeping too
<geser> Ng: so it depends on you when revu will be up again?
<siretart> Ng: it is deployed via bzr
<Hobbsee> ScottK: it's 3am here, remember?
<Ng> geser: not just me, but yes
<siretart> Ng: feel free to write me an email with further questions, I'll answer them tonight or tomorrow morning, okay?
<Ng> siretart: that's great, thanks very much
<geser> Hobbsee: if you're still awake, then it can't be late/early :)
<Hobbsee> geser: oh yes it can be.
<norsetto> keescook: ok, debdiff u-u is uploaded :-)
<keescook> norsetto: cool, thanks!
<norsetto> keescook: nog een vraag .... sprekt u nederlands?
<keescook> norsetto: I only know how to swear.  ;)
<norsetto> :-D
<geser> keescook: that's enough ;)
<keescook> geser: hehe
<norsetto> ScottK: little problem about the SRU; the feisty libray is too old, we need to backport it too
<ScottK> Ahhh
<ScottK> What do you mean?
<norsetto> ScottK: it requires >1.0.22 and we only have 1.0.20 in feisty
<ScottK> Ah.  Well then we need to figure out if there's a subset we can use for the SRU then.
<norsetto> ScottK: its not just a question of dependancy; its hardcoded in the config
<ScottK> Hmmm
<norsetto> ScoTTK: sorry, forgot to mention which library; its python-poker-engine
<ScottK> Ah.
<ScottK> Well then is it something broken in python-poker-engine that we need to SRU for too?
<norsetto> me always forget the little details
<ScottK> Dunno.
<norsetto> ScottK: In debian they have 1.0.19 or 1.025; in gutsy its 1.0.25; guess that would fix some bugs too.....
* norsetto wonders how many new bugs it will bring too.....
<norsetto> ScottK: its the only one by the way, all the rest seems to be fine
<ScottK> Well we really can't SRU a new library, so we need to figure a finer grained solution.
<norsetto> ScottK: are u also looking at the changelog? Its depressing ....
* ScottK is multitasking right now and desperately hoping norsetto will figure it out.
* norsetto is considering issuing a SIGTERM and going to have dinner
<cbx33> BOOOOO-YA
<cbx33> ping imbrandon
<_MMA_> cbx33: good luck with that. Ive been poking for about 5 days now. :(
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> try about 4 weeks
<_MMA_> :(
<afflux> correct me if I'm wrong but packages in debian depending on inet-superserver need to work with inetutils-inetd, openbsd-inetd and rlinetd. In ubuntu inet-superserver is also provided by xinetd. What to do with packages that use update-inetd which works for the three inet-superserver packages in debian but not xinetd?
<afflux> Change the dependency to netkit-inetd | rlinetd?
<geser> afflux: have you read the discussion on the debian-devel ML?
<DarkSun88> geser: Thanks for upload. :)
<afflux> geser: I don't think so.
<geser> DarkSun88: thank you for noticing that it's a merge now and providing the debdiff
<zul> Fujitsu: ping
<DarkSun88> geser: No problem. :)
<geser> afflux: IIRC the result was that nothing should depend on update-inetd directly (only the inetservers using it) and package should depend on the inet-superserver virtual package
<geser> afflux: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2007/07/msg01013.html ff.
<afflux> geser: yes, the problem is, the package I have to merge doesn't depend on update-inetd, but it uses it in the postinst/postrm files. But it depends on inet-superserver (which is in ubuntu provided by xinetd, which doesn't support update-inetd)
<afflux> ah, wait, i'll read it ;)
<geser> afflux: does caling update-inetd something usefull when xinted is installed?
<afflux> no, since xinetd doesn't contain an own implementation of update-inetd and the update-inetd package doesn't work for xinetd.
<afflux> (different config files and different format)
<geser> I'd suggest to call update-inetd only when it's available and install a config snippet for xinetd
<geser> that seems to be the most sane solution now
<cbx33> hey pygi
<pygi> cbx33, omg, you are alive!
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> howz it going
<cbx33> you should know I'm alive as i've been blogging alot
<pygi> cbx33, not so well
<pygi> cbx33, well, no time to read stuff :(
<cbx33> oh what's up?
<cbx33> pm?
<pygi> sure
<afflux> geser: I see another problem coming up here. If someone has xinetd and another inetd, that uses /etc/inetd.conf, installed, and the package installs an xinetd snippet and installs itself to inetd.conf, we would have a conflict there. Suggestions?
<afflux> geser: one possibility would be to set the xinetd snippet to disabled and warn the user on installing the package that he could need to enable it.
<geser> afflux: looking at the other inet-superserver packages: they conflict with inet-superserver so that only one inet-superserver should be installed
<geser> but xinetd is missing that conflict
<geser> should perhaps xinetd and openbsd-inetd add a conflict to inet-superserver? that way only one inet-superserver can be installed at a time
<afflux> geser: sounds sane.
<Skiessi> is there/shouldn't there be a list in the wiki about the stuff wanted to Universe?
<DktrKranz> Skiessi, http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO is not sufficient?
<jrib> !packaging | Skiessi
<ubotu> Skiessi: The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
<jrib> Skiessi: the wiki page method was replaced, now people should file 'needs-packaging' bugs
<jrib> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New links to the old page I think
<Skiessi> what if the tar-file already contains the files in debian-folder?
<Skiessi> do I have to edit them?
<bddebian> So if a package is maintained in Debian in svn is it still OK for us to add fixes?
<ScottK> Absolutely.
<ScottK> Debian SVN has nothing to do with Ubuntu.
<bddebian> Well I don't want to get bitched at again.  I'm thinking I just avoid it :)
<ScottK> bddebian: If the svn happens to be the Debian Python Modules Team one, let me know and I'll put the fix in there too.
<ScottK> Nah.  Go for it.
<bddebian> Just adding a .desktop to openttd
<ScottK> Shouldn't be a problem.
<ajmitch> Ng: if you're still alive, I'm here now :)
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<vil> hi ScottK, I have just read your announcement of zekr
<ScottK> Yes.
<vil> I gave a few comments on that to Mohammad
<ScottK> OK.
<vil> pls, where can I see the latest version?
<vil> revu is off currently
<ScottK> Except for a couple of minor nits (nothing to do with Java), http://www.kitterman.com/test/zekr_0.5.1.dfsg-0ubuntu1.dsc is it.
<ScottK> All of the REVU comments had, I think, been resolved befor REVU took a break.
<vil> thanks
<vil> ScottK, well how can I DL rest of it?
<vil> besides .dsc
<ScottK> dget -x http://www.kitterman.com/test/zekr_0.5.1.dfsg-0ubuntu1.dsc
<vil> excellent, thanks again
<vil> ScottK, all my comments fixed :)
<vil> nice job
<ScottK> vil: Great.
<ScottK> Glad to hear it.
<vil> ScottK, the last point I was suggesting is that it sets the menu language inside the app instead of using locales settings
<vil> but that is upstream issue
<ScottK> Yes.  Persia had the same comment.
<ScottK> IIRC
<ScottK> We got it to packaged correctly and minimaly works.
<ScottK> minimaly/minimally
<ScottK> Which is as far as our gatekeeper role extends IMO.
<vil> yeah
<vil> interresting that you covered all my ideas :) nothing left
<ScottK> man-di_ reviewed it for Java stuff, so much credit goes to him.
<ScottK> All I know about Java is when someone says Java, I run.
<vil> looking forward man-di_ being the MOTU
* ScottK imagines he does not share the feeling.
<ajmitch> sigh, 30 mounts since last fsck
* ajmitch waits for laptop to start
<ajmitch> nvidia drivers killed my desktop this morning as well
<calc> yipee i'll be a core dev tomorrow :)
<calc> wrt OOo issue we think we have found the offending call and I sent an email to the patches author to have him review it
<calc> er patch's
<ajmitch> yay!
<calc> hopefully the patch's author can fix it quickly, so i can do another upload without breaking font support
<Fujitsu> zul: Pong.
<crimsun> bddebian: you can't unsub u-a unless you're a member or have LP supapowah.
<bddebian> Fruck..  Stupid freakin' packages
<bddebian> dh_install -ppython-vipscc
<bddebian> cp: cannot stat `./debian/tmp/usr/lib/python2.4': No such file or directory
<bddebian> dh_install: command returned error code 256
<jmg> bddebian: edit the .install files and make them not suck so much
<ajmitch> hello crimsun, good to see you still alive
<crimsun> ajmitch: hello
<bddebian> jmg: Aye but wtf belongs in there.  He's using pycentral so I'm not sure why that's even in there
<jmg> bddebian: chec out the tmp directory and see what's there?
<norsetto> ScottK: got bad news mate
<RainCT> good night
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-14
<zul> Fujitsu: i dont think we should sync the rt2400 drivers from debian since its alread in the kernel
<Nafallo> zul: there is a graphical interface in that source as well I think?
<Nafallo> zul: but the binary rt2400-source or whatsitsname should not be in Ubuntu, agreed.
<norsetto> Is there a problem with the rt2500 package?
<mohammad> regarding http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/x11/ttf-scheherazade I had uploaded, Nicolas Spalinger (a member of Debian pkg-fonts team) asked me to rename the package to ttf-sil-scheherazade.
<mohammad> Is it possible to change the name?
<RAOF> geser: It's not built against just 2.5 - it's built against anything <= 2.5
<RAOF> See debian/pyversions (2.5- vs 2.4-)
<RAOF> geser: Obviously my changelog entry is misleading, then :(
<mohammad> is any motu online?
<tonyyarusso> Could someone clarify the difference between Upstream Version Freeze and Universe New Package Freeze?  I think the latter is what I'm concerned with, but as it's the later one I want to make sure not to miss the former by mistake.
<Toadstool> tonyyarusso: UVF means no new upstream versions for already existing packages and Universe New Package Freeze means no NEW packages, ie packages which don't have any previous version in the archive and need to go through the NEW queue
<tonyyarusso> Toadstool: okay, good.  So August 30th is my deadline.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<mohammad> there is an issue in naming of one of the packages I had uploaded before http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/x11/ttf-scheherazade. it should be change to ttf-sil-scheherazade. please let me know how I can fix it?
<bddebian> I think you would have to build a new package and add a Replaces: for the existing
<bddebian> cripes who's filing all the sync and merge requests??
<mohammad> bddebian: in the changelog should I mention anything more than initial release? (like the previous name or previous changelog entry)
<ajmitch> bddebian: what's wrong with the syncs?
<bddebian> I would use the original package's changelog and add another changelog entry stating the rename and the replaces.  But I'm no expert on the subject
<bddebian> ajmitch: Nothing, just making hard to keep the list down ;-)
<mohammad> bddebian: thanks :)
<ajmitch> bddebian: are these sponsor requests?
<bddebian> ajmitch: Aye
<ajmitch> a lot of fairly minor stuff there
<bddebian> Yeah but I wonder if the person is at least test building them
<ajmitch> he hasn't in the past
<bddebian> Do we just ack them or test build them before ack'ing?
<ajmitch> you never 'just ack' stuff
* jdong finall starts looking at RAOF's xserver-xgl packaging....
<jdong> oops :)
<jdong> slightly sidetracked
<bddebian> So what's the point of someone filing these? :-)
<ScottK> bddebian: Who is filing them?
<ajmitch> ScottK: your friend
<ScottK> Ah.
<ScottK> bddebian: I'd either ignore them or check them very closely.
<ScottK> If you think he's being abusive of the process, feel free to complain to jono.
* ScottK is done complaining and getting no where.
<ajmitch> bddebian: if you want other work to do, there's still a bunch of debian bugs on http://django.ajmitch.net.nz/rcbugs/ to see if they can be synced
<ajmitch> we managed to get a number of sync requests filed from there, but the debian rc bugs don't always apply
<jdong> Q: what's slower than bzr's initial branch...
<jdong> A: Launchpad!
<jdong> oops
<jdong> I mean... nothing. bzr is blazing fast
<bddebian> ajmitch: Holy crap d00d
<bddebian> jdong: hehe
<ajmitch> bddebian: what?
<bddebian> Big list :-)
<ajmitch> yeah, it was bigger a week ago
<ajmitch> a comments field was added the other day to make coordinating it a bit easier
<bddebian> Yeah, I see the yaird serious bug is waiting on another
<ajmitch> most of the comments were of the type  'sync requested'
<jdong> whoo! it's branched
<jdong> RAOF: hey dude, you around? got an xgl thing to discuss (wrt. keymapping shift+bksp zapper)
<RAOF> jdong: Yup.  Fire away.
<jdong> RAOF: as you are probably aware, Xgl maps SHIFT+Bksp to zap the Xgl server...
<RAOF> It did.  Does it still?
<jdong> RAOF: this is pretty irritating because it's extremely easy to accidentally trip
<RAOF> Indeed.
<jdong> RAOF: err... well I think it still does
<RAOF> Ok, I'll just check.
<RAOF> But I thought it didn't, because the ubuntu packages stopped doing that :)
<jdong> RAOF: at any rate, the command xmodmap -e "keycode 22 = BackSpace" within the Xgl server will disable that mapping...
<jdong> RAOF: might be a good idea to apply at bottom of debian/Xgl-session anyway
<RAOF> jdong: Totally, if it kills Xgl now.
<RAOF> jdong: Running my Xgl package now.  Shift-backspace doesn't kill Xgl for me.
<jdong> RAOF: very interesting, let me try it too...
<RAOF> Neither does Ctrl-backpace, nor alt-backspace... ;)
<jdong> RAOF: here's the deal... something happens after GNOME/compiz starts up that inhibits shift+bksp...
<jdong> RAOF: but if I just boot up to a plain Xgl minimalist environment, shift+bksp still zaps the server
<RAOF> Maybe setting my keymap.  Ok.
<jdong> right
<jdong> setting your keymap will reset the bksp key
<RAOF> So, will the xmodmap have any annoying side-effects?
<jdong> RAOF: nope, this only remaps the backspace key to exclude terminate_server
<jdong> RAOF: it doesn't have any other side effects
<RAOF> Excellent.  I'll fix that then.
<jdong> spectacular, thanks!
<bddebian> Anyone else having an issue uploading?
<jose244> hey guys im interested in helping in developement
<RAOF> Yay!
<RAOF> What would you like to do?
<jose244> im really confused on the categories i can choose can u tell me the diffrences?
<jose244> theres core developers and MOTU right?
<RAOF> Yes.
<jose244> wat are the differences?
<RAOF> And "MOTU hopefuls", and Bug Team, and... :)
<RAOF> Core devs can upload anything, MOTU can upload to universe.=
<RAOF> Hopefuls can't upload at all, and do so through a sponsor.
<jose244> ill be MOTU dev. to start out
<RAOF> As far as the packaging side of contributing goes, you pass from Hopeful -> MOTU -> Core Dev.
<jose244> so i gota start from hopeful i suppose?
<RAOF> Although you don't have to take any of those steps; you can remain a hopeful, or a MOTU.
<jose244> ok now i understand
<RAOF> Yup.  You don't get upload privileges until we're sure you know what to do with them :)
<jose244> alright so im ready lol
<jose244> wat version do i need to use?
* RAOF doesn't have upload privileges, for example.
<pygi> :D
<RAOF> jose244: Generally, the latest dev release.  Almost all development goes on there.
<RAOF> So, at the moment, Gutsy.
<RAOF> The easiest way to start helping is to find a bug that you care about, and see what can be done to fix it.
<jose244> ok
<RAOF> If you don't have a pet-peeve, there are a bunch of bugs on launchpad marked as "bitsize".  Those would also be good.
<jose244> ill look into that
<jose244> so theres a special dev release or just use normal one?
<RAOF> It's just the normal Gutsy release.
<jose244> alright thx
<RAOF> You probably want to look at wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU if you haven't already.
<RAOF> Particularly https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO
<pygi> RAOF, you should probably give him link to packaging guide :)
<RAOF> Heh, yes.
<RAOF> !packagingguide | jose244
<ubotu> jose244: The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
<jose244> so many links lol
<RAOF> There's a lot of information, yes.
<RAOF> If you don't know packaging, then the packaging guide is probably a good start.
<RAOF> Maybe read it in conjunction with a bitesize bug?
<jose244> ok will try
<jose244> lets say i want to package a new software i found or made i would have to go threw the process?
<RAOF> If the packaging guide seems too much, there are other ways to help.
<RAOF> jose244: Yes.  The MOTU page has the process you need to follow to get a new package into Ubuntu
<jose244> ok thx,wat are the other ways of help i can do?
<RAOF> jose244: Well, you can help triage bugs.  We always have plenty of them! https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs
<RAOF> If you know more than one language you can help translate Ubuntu.  You can contribute artwork or documentation.  These are all helpful, and important.
<jose244> o o i know spanish
<RAOF> jose244: then you might be interested in !rosetta
<jose244> !rosetta
<ubotu> rosetta is a Web-based system for translating open source software into any language.  See https://launchpad.net/rosetta/+about
<jose244> ok thx ill try to do little of each to help out the community has much has i can
<RAOF> Great!
<jose244> im at one of the ftp mirrors i go into the main folder next?
<jose244> http://mirrors.kernel.org/ubuntu/dists/gutsy/ im here
<RAOF> I'm not sure what the question is.
<jose244> where i downlaod gutsy lol
<jose244> i think im at the wrong place...
<RAOF> Ah.
<RAOF> Right.  So that would be...
<jose244> yea im asking where i can downlaod gutsy...anyways ubuntu looks like a promising os
<RAOF> jose244: http://www.ubuntu.com/testing/tribe4
<jose244> o god lol 700mb
<jose244> yay 3 hour download
<jose244> ill be testing in a few hours
<jose244>  can i install it in vmware workstation 6.0?
<RAOF> Yes
<jose244> alright thx
<jose244> woot 1hour and 18 mins left to finish gusty downlaod
<\sh> hmmm..does anyone run tribe4 on more then one screen with desktop-effects?
* RAOF wills miro to build
<Hobbsee> it wont
<Hobbsee> contains too much crack to build.
<RAOF> But I've been carefully patching the crack with stickytape and bubblegum!
<Hobbsee> haha
<Hobbsee> sticky tape wont cut it.
* Hobbsee hands RAOF the gaffer.
* jmg hands Hobbsee the VHB.
<Hobbsee> jmg: VHB?
<Hobbsee> bah
<jmg> Very High Bond tape
<jmg> used to stick together aeroplanes. :)
<Hobbsee> :)
<Hobbsee> we never ended up using them for sound/technical stuff
<\sh> I really wonder if desktop-effects works with two screens...
<jmg> \sh: not xinerama
<jmg> twinview should be ok
<\sh> twinview ? you mean the two screens are displaying the same?
<jmg> no - twinview the nvidia technology
<\sh> ah..no just plain radeon oss driver...
<jmg> the equivalent in ati speak is hydravision
<jmg> so what video players work in compiz?
<RAOF> Anything.  As long as your drivers aren't broken.
<jmg> i cant make totem display anything.
<RAOF> Fully up to date gutsy?
<jmg> yes
<RAOF> A recent ati driver update should've fixed it.
<jmg> <- nvidia
<jmg> mplayer works
<RAOF> Oh.
<RAOF> Um, Totem should, too.
<jmg> s'what i thought.
<RAOF> I've never had any problems.
<jmg> hmm.
<jmg> is xv still the right option to use?
<\sh> xv as image viewer? ,-)
<stgraber> RainCT: ping
<jmg> xvideo
<stgraber> RainCT: --binary-arch isn't in fact the correct option to select a custom arch, you should replace it by : --debootstrapopts "--arch" --debootstrapopts "$BINARCH"
<stgraber> RainCT: sorry, I didn't have the time to test it before (pbuilder creation worked but I didn't notice it was amd64 as well :))
<RAOF> jmg: Yes?  Although it might not work on a second monitor.
<jmg> i see
<jmg> well, id better go if i want to make tomorrows UMC meeting. :)
<jmg> bye
* jmg &
<RainCT> stgraber: pong
<RainCT> stgraber: thanks :)
<infinito> is it possible to get a debian sync yet??
<ogra> infinito, its possible all the time ... the amount of paperwork you have to do for requesting one just gets higher towards the end ;)
<Hobbsee> greetings, ogra
<ogra> hey Hobbsee
<white> Hobbsee: hey :)
<white> and all the nothers as well :)
<white> s/nothers/others/
<infinito> ogra: i've filled a requestsync, that's enough now?
<ogra> infinito, shuld be until thursday ... after that you need a UVF exception
<white> Hobbsee: i have read that you are release manager for universe (or something like that), are you still talking to common mortals like me? :P
<Hobbsee> white: i'm a common mortal, trust me.
<Hobbsee> infinito: did you use -s?
<white> Hobbsee: you happen to live too far away though :/
<Hobbsee> white: yeah.  i do have plans to move, eventually, though
<white> come here come here
<white> (i mean Melbourne)
<infinito> Hobbsee: i've filled the bug manually, as requestsync changes the status to Confirmed, and i'm not a MOTU, so dont have permissio n to do that
<Hobbsee> infinito: you can change it to confirmed as a non-motu, and you can use -s whicih will subscribe teh sponsorship team, not the archive
<Hobbsee> white: i'm not release manager for universe
<Hobbsee> white: i'm on the UVF team, though
<Hobbsee> white: i wanted to do the RM for ubuntu :(
* Hobbsee is on that team, at the moment, incidently
<white> Hobbsee: where is the difference between UVF and RM for universe?
<white> as i suspect that RM for main is canonical
<infinito> Hobbsee: i tried to subscribe the sponsorship team by hand, but launchpad says ubuntu-archive-sponsors team doesn't exist
<Hobbsee> white: release manager for ubuntu is more main stuff, but also does tribe images and whatnot.  and pokes people about bugs.
<Hobbsee> infinito: it's ubuntu-universe-sponsors
* Hobbsee points to the second link in the topic
<white> are there RMs, which are not employed?
<white> Hobbsee: well you are RM for universe then ;)
<Hobbsee> white: tehre's a release management team, but there's an employed RM, yes.
<Hobbsee> white: it all gets convoluted and confusing
<Hobbsee> white: and i'm not - univeres is a team, done by votes
* white does not get his head around it
<Hobbsee> heh, i'll explain elsewhere
<white> Hobbsee: well there is normally always more than one release manager :)
<infinito> Hobbsee: so is this enough? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pyrenamer/+bug/131991
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131991 in pyrenamer "Please sync pyrenamer 0.4.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] 
<Hobbsee> white: not in ubuntu, per se
<Hobbsee> white: at least, not until gutsy
<RAOF> Ha!  Miro builds!
<Hobbsee> RAOF: please read the backscroll, and dont give out incorrect information
<Fujitsu> RAOF: Lies, all lies.
<Hobbsee> er, Kmos, not RAOF
* Hobbsee curses all these 4 letter, non-word nicks.
* RAOF is an acronym, does that help?
* Kmos oh good
* Kmos oh god
<Hobbsee> no
<Kmos> lol
<Kmos> http://kmos.homeip.net/~kmos/ddclient -> if someone want to upload/fix the package. it's a merge with some fix.. the debian maintainer doesn't answer me.
<Hobbsee> Kmos: you cant approve your own sync requests.  this means you cant use confirmed, and subscribing u-a yourself.  infinito, if you use -s for requestsync, it will automatically set the status to new, and subscribe the sponsorship team
<Hobbsee> Kmos: but seriously, why do you want to sync the world *again*?
<Hobbsee> Kmos: work on some bugs for a while
<Hobbsee> Kmos: we have the autosync turned off for a reason, and it's not so that we can get kicks out of manually filing sync requests
<Kmos> Hobbsee: my sync request's have fix/upstream version
<Kmos> i'm not syncing the world
<Kmos> just a few packages before thursday
<StevenK> A few != 16
<Kmos> StevenK: check if they aren't important
<StevenK> Which involves wasting time.
<Kmos> Hobbsee: i don't have subscribed U-A, i've used -s
<Hobbsee> Kmos: great!
<Hobbsee> Kmos: else i'd have to kill you.  in a COC-approved fashion, of course.
<Hobbsee> :)
<Kmos> i've ask for xterm, that's a good sync.. tasks for gnome, xdialog, xmoto and tmw are games
<Hobbsee> Kmos: you have considered that the new upstream versions may contain more bugs, havent you?
<Kmos> and others I've already done for other packages of gnu the r-cran-* ones
<Kmos> Hobbsee: yes.. but it will fix bugs too, that's the life of software
<Hobbsee> Kmos: but still, the autosyncer is off.  the point is not to grab every piece of software with a new upstream version.
<Kmos> Hobbsee: i don't have done it randomly..
<StevenK> Then list which bugs you fix or your rationale for filing them and you won't get questioned.
<StevenK> s/you fix/the sync will fix/
<RAOF> Wow, miro is down to only one "fix your crap" message on startup
* RAOF wonders idly why the miro-0.9.8.1 tarball he downloaded reports itself as "miro 0.9.8-svn"
<Hobbsee> RAOF: high proportion of crack.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: makes all sorts of insane things happen
<RAOF> Maybe I should just leave the xine renderer as default.  Gstreamer is less tested, and I don't actually *want* to fix broken crap.
<white> anyone here knows, if it is possible to work on some pictures with a free program so that it is also possible to keep working on it afterwards in photoshop (non-free ugly stuff) ?
<RAOF> Lossless png?
<white> RAOF: i don't even know photoshop. I just try to do my ex-girlfriend a favour
<Ng> white: if you use a lossless format, yes. if you want to preserve layers and stuff it might be quite tricky, in that I'm not sure gimp can save .psd
<Ng> but you could always save the layers as PNGs and then re-composite them in photoshop
<white> Ng: not quite sure, if she will understand that, but i will try to forward it. Thanks
<ogra> white, afaik gimp can edit and store .psp files
<Fujitsu> ogra: I think so too.
<Fujitsu> I think it can also do .psd, but not quite sure.
<ogra> err, thats what i meant actually, .psd
<stgraber> http://finance.google.com/finance?q=SCOX <-- SCO after the weekend :)
<Fujitsu> stgraber: I pointed that out almost 24 hours ago now... rather impressive, yes!
<stgraber> Fujitsu: oh, didn't read my backlog that far sorry :)
<RAOF> So, should I patch miro to get it to print out the right version?
<xxxxx1> mornin' people
<zul> hey if you want to buy scox stock now is the tie
<zul> time even
<Nafallo> zul: you think they will rise again?
<zul> Nafallo: you never know if someone buys them out
<Nafallo> true
<RAOF> Damn this lack of REVU.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: find a server somewhere?
<RAOF> Yeah.  Well, I've got one of my own, kinda.
<RAOF> It's just nicer on revu :)
* TheMuso pats his bur.st webspace.
<sacater> hey guys who makes the wireless drivers for the rt2500?
<TheMuso> Any Australian who is willing to donate a few bucks to them can get 1GB of space, and assign a domain to it etc.
<TheMuso> RAOF: ^^ :p
<Nafallo> sacater: the rt2x00 project :-)
<TheMuso> And its only open to Aussies.
<RAOF> TheMuso: That's pretty cool.
<sacater> Nafallo: well my mate cant get his wireless to work
<RAOF> I don't suppose the domain comes with that donation? :)
<TheMuso> RAOF: Indeed.
<TheMuso> RAOF: Unfortunately, no.
* TheMuso has themuso.id.au pointing to his.
<RAOF> Eh, got my own, anyway.
<Nafallo> sacater: gutsy?
<sacater> Nafallo: Feisty
<sacater> Nafallo: with updates
<RAOF> Hm.  I suppose I'll kill the RPATH, then call it a night.
<Nafallo> sacater: the support is much better in gutsy IMHO.
<sacater> Nafallo: hmm
<sacater> Nafallo: well he cant even get a wireless connection
<Nafallo> sacater: I'm not surprised... receiving upstreams CVS commits and all ;-)
<sacater> Nafallo: hmm
<sacater> Nafallo: so may he have a better change?
<sacater> chance*
<Nafallo> sacater: he could always try the desktop cd from Tribe-4? :-)
<Nafallo> sacater: see if there is any luck etc...
<sacater> hmm
<sacater> he says he cant see tribe 4, with update-manager -d
<Nafallo> sacater: let him check if it works with a desktopcd first rather.
<Nafallo> sacater: http://ftp.acc.umu.se/mirror/cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/tribe-4/ I think
<sacater> wha
<sacater> cant he just upgrade off of feisty
<Nafallo> sacater: does he want instability even if it does not work then? :-)
<sacater> Nafallo: i think he wouldnt really mind
<Nafallo> sacater: sure. update-manager -c -d should be the command then I think.
<sacater> hi
<illustroflamma_> hi
<sacater> Nafallo: illustroflamma_
<sacater> hes the one with the trouble
<Nafallo> hi illustroflamma_ :-)
<illustroflamma_> Hi :D
<sacater> Nafallo: does update-manager -c -d need sudo behind it
<Nafallo> sacater: no, in front.
<sacater> Nafallo: lol
<illustroflamma_> Nafallo: nothing :S
<sacater> Nafallo: why isnt it showing up
<Nafallo> no idea. I'm already running gutsy, so can't check either.
<sacater> let me try
<sacater> sudo update-manager -c -d
<Nafallo> should be correct.
<sacater> worked for me
<RAOF> Is a u-u-s bug with a link to a source package acceptable?
<Hobbsee> RAOF: sure
<RAOF> Welcome to the dawning of a new, miro, age then
<Hobbsee> RAOF: miro, and other crackful things are banned :P
<Amaranth> Miro is so fscking broken
<RAOF> A bit, yeah.
<RAOF> They probably shouldn't be re-implementing internal DBus functionality, for example.
<Fujitsu> RAOF: Aw, why not? That'd be boring.
<RAOF> Anyway, for those who want first-hand experience of crack, bug #129043 is available for you crackification
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 129043 in democracyplayer "democracy-player has a new version and a new name, please upgrade package in Gutsy" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/129043
<sacater> is there any way i can remotely connect to illustroflamma's machine
<RAOF> I'll also take this parting shot to say that there are a couple of xserver-xgl bugs someone could fix with my xgl branch :P
<RAOF> Night all!
<sacater> ?
<sacater> so there is no way for me to connect to illustroflamma's machine
<sacater> ?
<Hobbsee> sacater: ssh would be the usual answer.  and #ubuntu would be the usual asking place
<sacater> Hobbsee: yeah i know, but illustroflamma doesnt have a domain name
<sacater> so ssh is not very practical
<\sh> sacater, you need just an ip for ssh...no hostname needed
<sacater> all i have is his router IP
<sacater> but i cnat even ping it
<\sh> sacater, so he has  to open the ssh port towards his machine...if you are not allowed, you have bad luck
<sacater> he cant even log into his router
<sacater> it was set up by BT
<\sh> bad luck...
<jono> hey all
<ScottK> Hi joo
<ScottK> jono even
<jono> hey ScottK
<jono> where can I find a list of all approved motu in launchpad?
<Fujitsu> jono: ~motu/+members
<Nafallo> jono: ~ubuntu-dev I should think :-)
<jono> thanks
<Fujitsu> No, ~ubuntu-dev is deprecated.
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: oh. thanks :-)
<ScottK> https://launchpad.net/~motu
<Fujitsu> And not consistent with ~motu any more.
<Nafallo> aha :-)
<zul> hi jono
<jono> hey zul
<StevenK> RAOF: Still here?
<\sh> jono: what about an ubuntu community team with sysadmin experience? ,-)
<jono> \sh: this is being discussed :)
<\sh> jono: cool...as requirement should be "more then 2 years experience" and "unix [not only linux]  know how"
<Hobbsee> \sh: what's this for?
<\sh> Hobbsee, most sysadmins who are working in serious dc environments and knowing their business have more then linux knowledge...you can filter the good ones from the semi-amateurs
<Hobbsee> \sh: true.  i think i'm missing the context here at all.
<Hobbsee> oh well
<\sh> Hobbsee, tbh, those things should never happen like reported in UWN / jonos email
<Hobbsee> indeed
<\sh> Hobbsee, just because it gives the brand "ubuntu" the feeling of being unsecure, because nobody reads about "no clue about sysadmin-work and system security"
<Hobbsee> true
<Hobbsee> does someone feel generous, and want to go thru the sponsorship queue?
<Kmos> Hobbsee: I do it if I can :)
<Kmos> hehe
<Hobbsee> Kmos: no way :P
<Hobbsee> on the other hand, i can try by using the email interface
<\sh> ok..time to go home and finishing the "\sh" buildserver for packaging amarok...yeah
<\sh> cu later
<Hobbsee> siretart: why did you use -s for a sponsorship request?
<Hobbsee> siretart: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/live-initramfs/+bug/131552
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131552 in live-initramfs "Please sync live-initramfs (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Incomplete] 
<Hobbsee> siretart: in fact, see the comments on the bug
* Hobbsee dumps one bug that isnt worth syncing
<siretart> Hobbsee: err
* Hobbsee dumps another one
<siretart> Hobbsee: I didn't use requestsync.py, I filed it by hand
<Hobbsee> siretart: :)
<Hobbsee> siretart: no?  weird.
<siretart> Hobbsee: for the question: this is a new upstream release
<siretart> Hobbsee: I want the new upstream in gutsy. I talked to panthera, and he prepared the package so it is usable in ubuntu
<siretart> Hobbsee: why do you want to prevent the sync after all?
<Hobbsee> siretart: i'm more wondering why you subscribed u-u-s at all, instead of u-a
<Hobbsee> siretart: i didnt drop your bug.  i'm just wondering why you did what you did
<Hobbsee> siretart: and no mention of why we can drop the ubuntu changes, which keybuk may well eat you for
<Hobbsee> and i dont think you want keybuk yelling at you
<Hobbsee> :)
<siretart> Hobbsee: I didn't subscribe u-u-s
<siretart> Hobbsee: check the activity log, some guy called Marco Rodrigues did
<Hobbsee> Kmos: ping
<Hobbsee> siretart: that's kmos.  we've been having discussions like this already.  thanks
<Kmos> hi :)
* Hobbsee unsubscribes u-u-s again
<Hobbsee> Kmos: can you explain why you touched https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/live-initramfs/+bug/131552 please?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131552 in live-initramfs "Please sync live-initramfs (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] 
<Kmos> i found it without package
<Kmos> and New for long time
<Kmos> after i subscribe U-U-S i see he's reported by siretart
<Hobbsee> Kmos: if it's a sync request, you can leave it alone
<mruiz> hi all. I'm waiting for a review : https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/alleyoop/+bug/80885
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 80885 in alleyoop "Upgrade Alleyoop to 0.9.2" [Wishlist,In progress] 
<Kmos> and after I check.. U-A was subscribed
<Hobbsee> Kmos: they're done specially
<Kmos> so after I can't remove U-U_S
<Kmos> U-U-S
<Hobbsee> Kmos: this is part of the "i dont touch a bug unless i know i should be" - and for sync requests that you didnt file, you dont need to touch them
<Kmos> Hobbsee: yeah
<Hobbsee> Kmos: trust me, i, or another member of MOTU who knows more will go and yell at them.  you dont need to
<Kmos> Hobbsee: that's one before we talk about that
<Hobbsee> Kmos: i realise that :)
<Hobbsee> Kmos: i note that another guy has also been doing that recently, so i'll have to speak to him too.
<Kmos> i found the mistake, but can't fix it, because can't unscribe U-U-S
<Hobbsee> yeah, i know what you mean.  that's fine
<Kmos> who ?
* Hobbsee has fixed it
<Hobbsee> jerome_ on irc, it seems
<Kmos> :)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: your uploads are fine, i take it?
<Hobbsee> oh, meh.  if you've made all the ubuntu changes to the package, then i trust that your sync request is fine.
<geser> Kmos: can you explain me why you subscribed my to bug #132408?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 132408 in elisa "upgrade elisa to 0.3.1" [Wishlist,Triaged]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132408
<Hobbsee> geser: english parser fell over.  please reword.
<Kmos> geser: because you have done the latest upload
<Kmos> maybe you want to know about that
<Kmos> that there is a new version after a lot of time
<Kmos> geser: also fixed bug 132341
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 132341 in xdialog "Please sync xdialog (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132341
<Hobbsee> Kmos: in general, subscribing other people to bugs is a bit of a privacy invasion.  it's also spam
<Hobbsee> Kmos: poke them on irc about the bug
<Hobbsee> Kmos: also, launchpad has a function where you can get sent bugs on packages that you're interested in
<Kmos> Hobbsee: ok
<Hobbsee> zul: why are you assigned to visualboyadvance?
<geser> Kmos: I acked the last sync request for elisa, therefore I'm listed as the last uploader
<Kmos> a months agoo, someone told me to subscribe people that maybe had interest in bug
* Hobbsee thought we decided not to sync that one
<Hobbsee> Kmos: hmm.  better to ask them on irc first
<zul> Hobbsee: umm...i dont know
<Hobbsee> zul: ah, because you've done half of it.  please finish it.  (unsub u-u-s, actually comment on the bug)  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/visualboyadvance/+bug/132194
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 132194 in visualboyadvance "Please sync visualboyadvance (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] 
<Hobbsee> debian bug #436022
<ubotu> Debian bug 436022 in tua "tua: crontest failure /usr/lib/uucp/tua_run: No such file or directory" [Normal,Fixed]  http://bugs.debian.org/436022
<mruiz> hi all. I'm waiting for a review (upgrade): https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/alleyoop/+bug/80885
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 80885 in alleyoop "Upgrade Alleyoop to 0.9.2" [Wishlist,In progress] 
* Hobbsee cheers over this launchpad email interface, for bugs.
<geser> Kmos: is there a good reason to sync xdialog besides the new upstream version? The interesting changes (gtk1 -> gtk2) are only in experimental.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: have you started using the email interface for bug filing, yet?
<Hobbsee> geser: the latter version is in unstable, i thought
<ScottK> For bug filing, no.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: you should, purely for sponsorship
<ScottK> When I have some time, I need to look into it.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: there's info
<Hobbsee> but mine is
<Hobbsee>  status triaged
<Hobbsee>  subscribe ubuntu-archive
<Hobbsee>  unsubscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<Hobbsee> Request approved.
<Hobbsee> (space important there)
<Hobbsee> and just bugnumber@bugs.launchpad.net
<ScottK> Thanks.
* ScottK makes a note.
<Hobbsee> apparently edit@b.l.n is supposed to work, but i didnt get success with it
<Hobbsee> of course, it's then helpful that you're working on the sync queue on yoru own, as it's a mass ack :P
<geser> Hobbsee: Kmos wanted first to sync xdialog (2.3.1.dfsg.1-1) experimental but changed then the sync request to xdialog (2.3.1-2) unstable
<Kmos> geser: maybe now there isn't
<Kmos> it closes 4 bugs in debian
<Hobbsee> geser: fair enough
<geser> Kmos: those 4 bugs are severity normal and one is a bug asking for the new version
<Hobbsee> right, done the rest of the syncs there.
<Hobbsee> this mail interface seriously rocks - to be able to do 10+ bugs at once
<geser> Hobbsee: what's your opinion on the xdialog sync request? sync or not sync?
<geser> Hi bddebian
<Kmos> geser: invalid it :)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bddebian> Hi geser
<Hobbsee> geser: oh, hmm.  our amarok script uses that, incidently.  that's...ah...not good
<Hobbsee> bddebian: please make sure you follow sync process
<bddebian> I think I looked at xdialog last night and I don't think it can be synced
<bddebian> Hobbsee: What sync process?
<Hobbsee> bddebian: it's in the second link
<bddebian> Second link of what?
<geser> bddebian: unsubscribe u-u-s once you're done
<Hobbsee> bddebian: the part about actually commenting on the bug (because some people set it to confirmed cos tehy can), and actually unsubscribing u-u-s afterwards
<Hobbsee> bddebian: oh, topic sorry
<Hobbsee> bddebian: this sync queue fried my brain
<bddebian> I didn't do the UUS crap
<Hobbsee> oh?
<Kmos> bddebian: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/skyeye/+bug/132280
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 132280 in skyeye "Please sync skyeye (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Triaged] 
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Meaning I didn't file them so maybe I'm not understanding what you men?
<bddebian> Err mean even
<Hobbsee> bddebian: no, not filing.  approving
<bddebian> Ah, remove UUS after approving?
<Hobbsee> bddebian: yeah, just to keep teh queue sizes down
<Hobbsee> bddebian: a while ago we went "right, hwo do we actually sanitize this thing?"
<bddebian> Well it doesn't help that someone is being a little "ambitous" with sync requests
<bddebian> Hobbsee: I didn't know we were supposed to unsubscribe, sorry
<Hobbsee> bddebian: no problem ;)
<Hobbsee> bddebian: i saw it and actioned it on the bugs that i saw
<Hobbsee> bddebian: indeed.  he's already been blasted a few times over that.
<Hobbsee> bddebian: including tonight
<AndyP> d'oh, just missed ScottK
<bddebian> Goddamn typo
* AndyP wonders if he needs to chase up an archive admin about bug #129856
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 129856 in Ubuntu "Please sync python-syck from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/129856
<AndyP> the syck sync has been done now so its deps are all present now
<Hobbsee> AndyP: it should just get done...
<Hobbsee> or usually would
<Hobbsee> no idea, with the writing
<AndyP> Hobbsee: ok, i'll keep my faith :)
<Kmos> http://kmos.homeip.net/~kmos/ddclient -> no revu, so here it is..
* Hobbsee so isnt reviewing *anything* else tonight
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: do we have MDT runnign anywhere now?  (query LongPointyStick with the answer, or mention my or it's nick with your answer, so i see it)
<geser> Hobbsee: http://people.debian.org/~lucas/ubuntu-versions/
* bddebian dances around the room
<Hobbsee> lucas: any chance of a section: kde added?  :)
* Hobbsee dances around the room with bddebian
<Hobbsee> why are you so happy, bddebian?
<bddebian> Who said anything about being happy? :-)
<bddebian> I get the feeling that I "fit in" even less than I used to :'-(
<Hobbsee> bddebian: unsure if anyone does.
<Hobbsee> bddebian: of course, helps if you're actually here and get involved :)
<Hobbsee> bddebian: you'll get back into it all, if you want to
<pygi> Hobbsee, what's up with this libmtp? You want it in?
<bddebian> Well I'm severely unimpressed with this whole bzr shit I have to say...
<Hobbsee> pygi: if amarok and such works with it, and it supports more devices, then yeah
<Hobbsee> bddebian: yeah - i think a lot of people are, which is why most things dont use it
<Hobbsee> ScottK: if you get a chance, can you check if there's anything in kde that we want synced across, before UVF?
<Hobbsee> ScottK: obviously, we can shove it thru post-UVF, but that is a slight pain
<ScottK> Right.
<ScottK> If I can.
<ScottK> I'm finishing the new Klamav right now.
* Hobbsee wonders about an exception for "anything that hobbsee and ScottK agree on, that starts with a k doesnt need to be documented well"
<Hobbsee> but i guess that's a little suss :P
<bddebian> hehe
<Hobbsee> bddebian: well, we're both on the uvf team, so...
<ScottK> Sounds like almost as much fun as archive admins doing backports unsupervised.
<Hobbsee> bddebian: i said i wanted kde representation :P
<Hobbsee> ScottK: heh. t hat may be fun too
<Hobbsee> bddebian: i suspect it may come under "abuse of power" though.
<bddebian> Naah :)
<Hobbsee> anyone want to do my computing homework?
<AndyP> sure if you want to finish coding this python binding for me :)
<Hobbsee> hah
<geser> Hobbsee: luckily the kernel package is now called linux-image :)
<Hobbsee> hm?
<geser> "anything that hobbsee and ScottK agree on, that starts with a k doesnt    dthacker
<geser>                            need to be documented well"
<geser> argh, broken C&P
<Hobbsee> geser: ahhh
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Yes.  The best I can say about archive admin backports is that at least one of them cleans up what they break.
<Hobbsee> true
<pygi> Hobbsee, ok, I'm after it then
<Hobbsee> pygi: cool :)
<Hobbsee> pygi: obviously, having as much stuff supported as possible is useful
<pygi> Hobbsee, yup
<pygi> Hobbsee, you gonna review and upload then?
<Hobbsee> not tonight, no
<pygi> Hobbsee,I'll just assign the core-dev-sponsors :)
<Hobbsee> yay, i'm not on them :P
<pygi> Hobbsee, fine, I'll bug someone to put you inside first then :p
<Hobbsee> hah
* Hobbsee can remove herself
<pygi> Hobbsee, you have no idea :)
* jussi01 hugs Hobbsee
* Hobbsee hugs jussi01.  hiya!
<jussi01> heya, hows things?
<Hobbsee> jussi01: i've done a large bunch on the u-u-s queue, and so now will ignore it for a few days, to do bits that i want to see before UVF
<jussi01> Hobbsee: sounds like you are busy... I just got an interview for monday...yay!!
<Hobbsee> jussi01: yay!  what for?
<jussi01> for a "work practice" position, part of my studies...
<jussi01> :)
<Hobbsee> nice :)
<jussi01> Ive been searching for a while now, its hard when you dont know much of the local lingo
<Hobbsee> yep
<jussi01> but hopefully i will get this, I should as its an upaid/paid f-all position... kinda like an intern...
<Hobbsee> :)
* jussi01 hates it when upstream put a /debian dir in....
<pygi> Hobbsee, packages as always ready, gotta test them
<boucaron> hi there, is there any problem on revu.tauware.de ?
<mruiz> boucaron: is still offline
<AndyP> jussi01: me too, i think there should be an awareness campaign to educate upstream maintainers of the advantages of distributing debian directories separately ;)
<boucaron> ok thankjs mruiz
<bddebian> wtf is going on..
<bddebian> StevenK: You aboot?
<Hobbsee> bddebian: he's asleep by now
<ScottK> bddebian: What particular thing has gotten you excited now?
<siretart> Mez: arond by chance?
<bddebian> nip2
<bddebian> Heya siretart
<siretart> hi bbd
<siretart> hi bddebian
<siretart> or jdong by chance?
<yigal> is there an easy way of deleting my identiy on launchpad ?
<yigal> or is there a way at all?
<ScottK> yigal: You have to ask someone to do it.
<ScottK> Try #launchpad.
<yigal> ScottK: good, thank you
<bddebian> Sheesh zeroc-ice is taking forever to build :-(
<Skiessi> is there any mmorpg worth trying in universe?
<Skiessi> *the universe?
<Skiessi> I knew it... ._.
<miles> is it possible for me to get an ubuntu mentor so i can join the development community?
<DktrKranz> miles, you can have a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Mentoring
<tgm4883> could I get someone to look over a package for me?  The package is located at http://linux.weilandhomes.com along with the output of lintian and linda
<superm1> although i'm not actually a MOTU yet, I helped tgm4883 on getting this package into good shape, and looked it over
<ajmitch> morning
<highvoltage> mornign ajmitch
<Mez> siretart, sup?
<ScottK> Which debian repository does a package need to be in before I can synch it (i,e, which one do the archive admins pull from)?
<norsetto> ScottK: hi scott
<ScottK> HI
<ScottK> I went ahead and uploaded it.  I imagine you noticed.
<norsetto> ScottK: yeah
<ScottK> With UVF upon us, I figured better to get it uploaded and adjust later.
<ScottK> I don't think that whatever problems there are, are new to the package.
<norsetto> ScottK: got in touch with the devel anyhow, we are ironing out the lintian/linda warnings but the real problem is the maintainer scripts
<ScottK> Right.
<ScottK> Sounds good.
<ScottK> When you have material for an ubuntu2 upload, let me know.
<ajmitch> hello ScottK
<norsetto> ScottK: sure
<ScottK> It looks to me like this package has needed attention for some time.
<geser> ScottK: LP can sync from every source with a Sources file
<ScottK> hello ajmitch.
<norsetto> ScottK: it does indeed ....
<ScottK> Geser, yes, but the package in question is gone from incoming and not yet at ftp.debian.org, so I didn't know if there was another one.
<geser> ScottK: then it's on it's way to the mirrors. It will appear on ftp.debian.org (or any other mirror) before sync request gets usually proceeded
<ScottK> OK.  I guess I'll go ahead then.
<geser> ScottK: I've filed several sync request from Debian unstable when the package was still in incoming.d.o
<ScottK> OK.  Well then the race is on.  We'll see who's faster....
<norsetto> do you guys actually scan the IRC logs regularly?
<geser> scan?
<norsetto> yes, like reading what happened
<norsetto> just wondering as I've made a request yesterday that went unanswered but I see that it was done
<norsetto> coincidence I guess
<geser> I read my backlog only around hilights and seldom skim through it
<ScottK> norsetto: What was the request?
<norsetto> ScottK: to move mozilla-mplayer to multiverse
<ScottK> Ah.
<ScottK> Wasn't me.
<ScottK> geser: Looks like you were right.  The package is on f.d.o now.
<norsetto> hmmm, let me try another one: any chance any u-u-s who is passing by would glance at bug 127380 or 125823; I would also be happy with a won't fix (wait for upstream) so that we get them out of the u-u-s queue
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 127380 in mail-notification "[gutsy]  FTBFS mail-notification 4.1.dfsg.1-1 synced from Debian" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127380
<norsetto> too bad there are not many u-u -s passing by :-)
<ScottK> bug 125823
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 125823 in camorama "Camorama reports wrong version" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/125823
<ScottK> Both look like reasonable things to fix to me.
<geser> norsetto: re 125823: are there many occurances of 0.17 in configure.in?
<norsetto> in configure.in no, just once
<geser> why not patch configure.in and configure directly and avoid calling autogen.sh?
<norsetto> geser: what do you mean by configure directly?
<norsetto> ogra: if you reply to my last email I will not kiss you ;-)
<geser> norsetto: patching the generated configure file. with such simple changes I prefer to patch the configure script instead of regenerating it (less delta to Debian)
<norsetto> geser: i see the point, the problem is that the configure script is pretty messy to patch
<norsetto> geser: I also afraid we might miss it since that string might be used in some other script
<geser> that's true in most cases
<geser> norsetto: but changes in configure.in should only affect configure
<btm> if there's code that's dual-licensed mpl/gpl, how would you signify that in 'copyright'?
<norsetto> geser: are u 100% sure? if you are ok (because I'm not)
<ScottK> btm: List them both
<btm> ScottK: and if some of is dual licensed and some isn't, should I just be descriptive about that and put both licenses in there?
<norsetto> geser: granted you a "grep 0.17 configure" list only 11 occurrences
<norsetto> geser: and two are comments anyhow
<ScottK> btm: Yes.  You need to be clear in your description what code is covered by what license(s).
<geser> norsetto: pretty sure: the string 0.17 appears only 74 times in the whole source tree
<norsetto> geser: ok, let me patch configure then and see if that works
<geser> if you ignore the autogen.sh generated files and config.log you nearly got only configure left
<norsetto> geser: its the nearly that scares me :-)
<geser> $ grep -c 0.17 configure gives 11
<geser> I've patched configure.in and configure successfully in other packages without regenerating configure
<norsetto> geser: actually its only the spec file which is left
<norsetto> geser: hmmm, but why both configure.in and configure? I mean, I can do of course, but for what purpose
<geser> configure would be enough for our purpose but patching also configure.in has the advantage that your change isn't lost when someone needs to regenerate configure in the future
<norsetto> geser: well, one could also suppose that upstream will update the version one day .....
<norsetto> geser: in the frame of this century hopefully ....
<geser> yes, but I think more in direction of further ubuntu changes for the same version
<btm> What if the code in the package does not contain copyright dates but does have names and emails, what would you put in copyright for the authors?
<norsetto> pbuilding right now ...
<voidlogic>  I'm having problems getting a tape drive detected. It works dual booting into windows so I don't think its a hardware issue. Its using the megaraid driver. It should be the 2nd device on channel 0, but I don't see anything but my cd-roms in /proc/scsi/scsi. If I do an lspci I see the controller card is indeed detected. The card+drive worked for one boot yesterday for but some reason it only worked that once. Any ideas?
<norsetto> geser: looks good, it build and camorama -V gives Camorama version 0.18 (can't test it more as I don have a webcam)
<norsetto> geser: should I upload new patch?
<geser> norsetto: yes, please
<geser> norsetto: what's the rationale for adding gnome-common to build-depends?
<norsetto> geser: gone, i changed all occurrences (also comments) to be consistent
<norsetto> geser: that was needed for autogen.sh, its removed in the present patch
<geser> ok
<btm> Is there a list of valid "Sections" (control file)? I can't seem to find one.
<geser> btm: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-archive.html#s-subsections
<bddebian> Later folks
<geser> norsetto: uploaded. thanks for the debdiff
<norsetto> geser: cool! thanks to you, really appreciated
<norsetto> geser: actually, re. Sections, I found out that there is a slight difference with Debian
<geser> what difference?
<norsetto> very minor: we don't have non-free of and they don't have translation and virtual packages
<geser> non-free is called multiverse in Ubuntu
<norsetto> and contrib of course; wonder if lintian covers these for us or if we get an error (like wrong section)
<norsetto> geser: yeah, but its not a section, right?
<geser> no, it's also not a section in Debian but a segment
<norsetto> well, apparently they can use non-free and contrib in Section (at least according to the policy)
<norsetto> but only in the form  segment/section
<DarkSun88> Hi
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-15
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
(bddebian/#ubuntu-motu) #$%^^ launchpad
<khermans_> what is the cutoff in the release cycle for adding a new package to universe/multiverse?
<ScottK> August 30th for new package
<Fujitsu> khermans_: See GutsyReleaseSchedule... the deadline in question is NewPackagesFreezeUniverse
<Fujitsu> Or what ScottK said.
<khermans_> Fujitsu, oh nice!
<khermans_> Fujitsu, ok so i hjave a question
<khermans_> metasploit 3 is under their own license
<Fujitsu> Fire away.
<khermans_> would this go into multiverse instead?
<khermans_> it is somewhat restrictive
<Fujitsu> It depends if the license is appropriately free.
<Fujitsu> Link?
<khermans_> sec
<khermans_> Fujitsu, http://www.metasploit.com/projects/Framework/msf3/download.html?Release=alpha-r3
<Fujitsu> Looking.
<Fujitsu> Urgh, 3a.
<ajmitch> "there are significant restrictions on commercial use and redistribution. "
<ajmitch> doesn't look promising from the start
<khermans_> ajmitch, well i have aconvo going with hdm
<khermans_> the lead dev
<Fujitsu> It basically seems to be "don't modify or we'll kill you"
<khermans_> i dont think he wants to prevent it being in ubuntu, just ensure that people dont modify and commercialize it
<ajmitch> looks like it may be a challenge to even get into multiverse
<khermans_> ajmitch, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/102212
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 102212 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  metasploit" [Wishlist,Confirmed] 
<khermans_> ajmitch, how did Sun's JDK get in?
* ajmitch isn't sure what level of redistribution is required 
<jmg> hmm
<Fujitsu> Commercial use is fine, but you can't sell it.
<ajmitch> khermans_: there was work done with sun & redistribution of it was allowed for that
<khermans_> it was in before going open source
<Fujitsu> It is redistributable, AFAICT.
<jmg> isnt there generally a moratorium on script kiddy tools going into debian
<Fujitsu> Just not very modifiable... I'd say multiverse would be OK.
<khermans_> ajmitch, right so if possible the msf devs gave us permission, would that make it uni or multi ocmpatible?
<ajmitch> khermans_: multiverse at best
<ajmitch> (from a very quick reading of the license)
<khermans_> i thought so
<jmg> i mean
<ajmitch> an archive admin would have a better opinion of it
<khermans_> ajmitch, can you refer me to someone?
<jmg> just because i release a rootkit under a compatible license
<jmg> doesnt mean it should go in the archive...
<khermans_> haha
<khermans_> jmg, well you could say the same about nmap
* Fujitsu looks at Germany.
<khermans_> or any other security tool
<khermans_> hehe
<jmg> khermans_: nmap cant root
<khermans_> jmg, of course not
<jmg> khermans_: metasploit can
<khermans_> jmg, so can a guy with nc
<khermans_> or telent
<khermans_> telnet -froot
<jmg> khermans_: a guy who knows what hes doing
<jmg> at least defang the plugins
* ScottK wonders if the indemnification clause might also be problematic.
<khermans_> anyways, whatever we can do to get it in if possible
* khermans_ looks
<jmg> shrug
<khermans_> ScottK, what does that really mean?
<ScottK> I'm not entirely sure.
<khermans_> lol
<Fujitsu> ScottK: Which bit do you think is questionable?
<ScottK> It might mean that if Ubuntu distributes it and it turns out it violates someone's patent, Ubuntu has agreed to defend the developer.
<ScottK> I'm not sure it means that, I'm just not sure it doesn't.
<jmg> http://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2006/07/msg00118.html
<ajmitch> ScottK: I suspect we already have some dodgy clauses like that in multiverse
<ScottK> Could be.  I've never uploaded anything to multiverse that wasn't there due to multiverse depends.
<Fujitsu> Hm, that `and defend' doesn't look nice, you're right.
<khermans_> Fujitsu, hrmmm
<khermans_> well i will keep in touch with the devs an see wha thappens
<khermans_> thx for the help
<jmg> the metasploit license is not approved by osi
* ScottK sure as heck wouldn't upload it with the "and defend" clause in there.
<Fujitsu> jmg: Your point? multiverse isn't all free.
<Fujitsu> ScottK: Me neither.
<jmg> Ah.
<khermans_> there are about ~600 packages in multiverse
<khermans_> interesting that linux-lowlatency is in multiverse
<khermans_> maybe the kernel patches are from some major vendors
<bddebian> Grr, what the hell is up with netatalk and netdude..
<virtuososteve> hey
<Hobbsee> khermans_: ubuntu-archive@lists.ubuntu.com is the contact address
<TheMuso> /c/
<TheMuso> ugh
<Hobbsee> you really should script that
<btm> So is having a 4-clause bsd license in ubuntu packages okay?
<khermans_> Hobbsee, ?
<Hobbsee> khermans_: ?
<Hobbsee> khermans_: you asked how to contact the archive admins
<khermans_> Hobbsee, well i asked who would want to talk about a license issue for getting somehting into multiverse
<pygi> Hobbsee, poke you. I've got the libmtp stuff, care to review?
<Hobbsee> khermans_: i believe you got the answer "the archive admins".  that is their contact address
<Hobbsee> pygi: not overly, on this connection.
<pygi> Hobbsee, ah, k
<pygi> Hobbsee, /me gonna bug pitti then ^_^
<Hobbsee> khermans_: pitti is around, but he'd prefer you contact that mailing list, as he's no licencing expert
<khermans_> Hobbsee, will do thx
<Hobbsee> no problem
<Hobbsee> Mithrandir: khermans_ ^
<khermans_> :-)
<Mithrandir> Hobbsee: given I just joined; please repeat. :-)
<Hobbsee> Mithrandir: i have no mouse, i'm inside irssi here :)
<Hobbsee> http://www.metasploit.com/projects/Framework/msf3/download.html?Release=alpha-r3
<khermans_> Hobbsee, how about gpm?
<Mithrandir> well, somebody else then. :-)
<Hobbsee> 13:34 < khermans_> metasploit 3 is under their own license
<khermans_> or you mean physically no mouse...heh
<Hobbsee> would this go into multiverse instead?
<Hobbsee> metasploit 3 is under their own license
<khermans_> right,,,
<Hobbsee> gah, that did paste twice
<Hobbsee> khermans_: gpm?
<khermans_> Hobbsee, the mouse module for the console
<Mithrandir> it's non-free, but you're allowed to redistribute the source, so multiverse.
<khermans_> Hobbsee, sudo modprobe gpm
<Mithrandir> gpm isn't a kernel driver, it's just a normal package
<Hobbsee> hmmm.  bugger.
<Hobbsee> this uni clearly doesnt sync things.
* Hobbsee scp's differently, then.
<khermans_> got disconnected, Xorg borked on me
<khermans_> the last thing i saw was hobess linking to the license
<Mithrandir> 07:47 < Mithrandir> it's non-free, but you're allowed to redistribute the source, so multiverse.
<khermans_> Mithrandir, no what about the clause about defending the develoeprs and their software?
<Mithrandir> khermans_: multiverse only requires us to be able to redistribute the software.
<khermans_> Mithrandir, well im just wondering about debian policy
<Mithrandir> it's fine for Debian's non-free too.
<khermans_> if the license says you must bend over and kiss your own ass, is that allowed in multiverse?
<Mithrandir> yes.
<khermans_> good to know!
<khermans_> Mithrandir, also why is linux-lowlatency in multiverse?
<Mithrandir> or "this licence is only valid for as long as you stand on one leg.  Once you put down your other foot, your rights to use this software is terminated." is fine.  Well, not fine, but it's allowed.
* Hobbsee heads home
<khermans_> i c
<khermans_> Hobbsee, thx dude
<btm> khermans_: did you see http://wiki.debian.org/DFSGLicenses ?
<Mithrandir> because it depends on linux-restricted-modules-lowlatency which is in multiverse
<khermans_> ahh
<StevenK> Ugh. Why is the thing I'm waiting to build 4th last on sparc's build queue?
<btm> khermans_: and you may enjoy: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=323420
<ubotu> Debian bug 323420 in wnpp "ITP: metasploit-framework -- advanced platform for developing, testing, and using exploit code" [Wishlist,Open] 
<khermans_> btm, but still fine for multiverse right?
<khermans_> i read this thread previously
<Mithrandir> StevenK: what are you waiting for?
<StevenK> Mithrandir: nip2
<Mithrandir> StevenK: should build next, then
<StevenK> Mithrandir: Heh, I see that. Thanks. :-)
<Mithrandir> StevenK: I'm generally happy to rescore builds for you guys if you have a valid reason ("I want my bling" is less of a valid reason than "I need this other thing so I can fix this bug and test it in a useful manner")
<StevenK> Mithrandir: Ah, the reason is "I want this to build so I can get two old binaries NBS'd out of the archive."
<Mithrandir> a perfectly fine reason to me
<btm> khermans_: I would suppose so, that's one gross license though.
<mrigns> hi, can I add repositories to pbuilders sources.list without opening the base.tgz?
<mrigns> Hobbsee, how can I add apt-lines to pbuilder? I tried this:  sudo pbuilder update --override-config --distribution feisty --othermirror deb http://ftp.stw-bonn.de/ubuntu/ feisty universe ./
<mrigns> which results in an error
<Hobbsee> "an error"?
<Hobbsee> follow !pbuilder
<mrigns> E: Malformed line 1 in source list /etc/apt/sources.list (type)
<RAOF> mrigns: You would need to put the deb line in quotes, at least.
<Hobbsee> mrigns: then you may want to actually check said /etc/apt/sources.list
<Hobbsee> line 1, in particular
<mrigns> Hobbsee, this is line 1: deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu feisty main
<mrigns> doesn't seem wrong imho
<Hobbsee> should be OK
<mrigns> Failed to fetch http://ftp.stw-bonn.de/ubuntu/dists/feisty/Release  Unable to find expected entry  .//binary-i386/Packages in Meta-index file (malformed Release file?)
<btm> what's with the "./" in your repository line?
<mrigns> btm, hmm it's used in the manpage
<Hobbsee> mrigns: try it without - that tends to mean "all options" instead of just feisty main
<Hobbsee> mrigns: but why are you wanting to build a feisty pbuilder anyway?
<btm> mrigns: drop the ./
<mrigns> dropped it
<mrigns> Hobbsee, just to fool a bit around, trying how to build packages
* \sh thinks that he has to start a GPbuilder project...from setting up an environment to building packages... 
<RAOF> devscripts?
<Hobbsee> \sh: how would that work?
<Hobbsee> \sh: it'd be nice if we could do a file that would "just work".
<Hobbsee> although that would require adding universe & multiverse by default, i expect
<\sh> Hobbsee, i have some shells which creates my directories, setup my pbuilderc for any release I need and which creates pbuilder-<distro>-<arch> scripts which are working nicely on x86/x86_64 archs ;)
<Hobbsee> \sh: nice :)
* RAOF almost has something similar.
<RAOF> And then I switched to sbuild.
<\sh> Hobbsee, this can be setup in a gui tool with gtk-python or python-qt
<btm> mrigns: it would be "deb url repos". most mirrors have multiple repos all under url (main, restricted, etc). if url pointed into one of those, you'd use ./ as the repo. It's just for being able to list multiple repos on one line without duplicating urls.
<mrigns> btm, thx for the info
<\sh> but thinking about a gui tool for packagers ... i would say "the apocalypse is near"
<ajmitch> \sh: wouldn't it just be wonderful & make ubuntu so much better?
* pygi thinks there already is such project (gui for packaging)
<\sh> ajmitch, no comment about this...it would be not CoC compatible ,-)
<ajmitch> hehe
<\sh> ajmitch, good think is: ubuntu reaches more people if we would do everything with UIs
<\sh> ajmitch, bad think would be: we lose brain
<Mithrandir> mm, brains.
<Hobbsee> Mithrandir: NOT YOURS.
* Mithrandir steals Hobbsee's brain.
<Mithrandir> mm, tasty!
* Hobbsee cries
<Hobbsee> there's no brain there
<Mithrandir> sure, I just had a small tasting.
<\sh> reading jordans blog article about opensuse...I wonder if anyone knows, that they are auto-building debian packages, which will be then .rpms for opensuse ,-)
<Mithrandir> I don't want to kill you.  Where would the fun in that be?
<\sh> and this works on OBS quite nicely
<Hobbsee> Mithrandir: dont know.  id' suggest you ask the people who want to kill me.
<Hobbsee> \sh: they're also doing stuff for ubuntu, iirc
<\sh> Hobbsee, they have ubuntu dapper/feisty build repositories..yeah..and it's possible to create debian packages and rpms from one tar.gz at the same time...very cool...and opensource..i have the buildservice running in our DC for building packages for all used distros we have :)
<Hobbsee> nice :)
<\sh> cool workflow btw...
<\sh> for debian packages you can just upload "orig.tar.gz, diff.gz, .dsc file" and it starts building for debian build repositories
<\sh> or you upload upstream.tar.gz, a spec file, and a debian.tar.gz with the debian dir inside..and it builds rpm and .deb files :)
<\sh> I told adrianS last year that they are crazy ... but seeing it now and how it's working...I'm really admiring the build-service team for creating this piece of software...really..it's great work
<tonyyarusso> \sh: where can I look into this software?
<\sh> tonyyarusso, http://en.opensuse.org/Build_Service
<\sh> tonyyarusso, you can read about it there...and for opensuse10.2 you have packages...ubuntu packages for feisty as well...but they are not supported...I'm working on a better solution for ubuntu packages for this...
<tonyyarusso> ah
<\sh> I'm integrating this buildservice tool into our fai installation...so we can use the repositories there for SLES/openSuSE and ubuntu repositories...
<\sh> it also creates apt-getable repositories for debian projects...very nice
<norsetto> morning all
* Hobbsee starts to wonder if there's anything important in these 27  unread emails from the MOTU list.
<Hobbsee> morning norsetto!
<norsetto> Hobbsee :-)
<\sh> Hobbsee, btw...I'm still working on amarok...my buildserver just died yesterday evening because of more important private issues :)
<Hobbsee> \sh: right.  tell Riddell that
<Hobbsee> \sh: oh, and preferably keep that to one, quieter channel too, maybe :)
<pygi> Hobbsee, you've got yourself more hardware support btw ;)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: so can i have a psychic pony?
<Hobbsee> pygi: hm?
<pygi> Hobbsee, the libmtp
<Hobbsee> oh, yay!
<Hobbsee> greetings jono
<jono> hey
<ajmitch> hello mr jono
<jono> hey ajmitch
* ajmitch really hopes this wine update doesn't break WoW
<\sh> oh wine...how silent my life is now without wine ,-)
* ajmitch really needs to purge tracker from this system
<Lutin> norsetto: did someone had a look at your mail-notificaion patch already ?
<norsetto> lutin: don't think so
<norsetto> lutin: can you have a look at it yourself? Would appreciate it much
<Lutin> norsetto: yep, will do it today
<norsetto> lutin: merc! :-)
<Lutin> norsetto: np ;)
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Your RC bugs thing is giving overly verbose MySQL errors.
<ajmitch> probably because I just restarted & mysql isn't running
<ajmitch> tracker was murdering disk performance
<Fujitsu> That's what tracker does, unfortunately :(
<\sh> I disabled tracker :)
<mok0> What is the easiest/best way to update the build dir when a new upstream version appears?
<Fujitsu> mok0: uupdate
<mok0> Fujitsu: thx I will check the manpage!
<broonie> Note that that won't work with some packaging styles (dbs is the main offender)
<\sh> ohoh...http://phanatic.hu/archives/2007/08/ubuntu-viral-marketing-in-hungary/ this will get very political ,-)
<norsetto> A20: what is your problem?
<RainCT> hi
<norsetto> hi
<apachelogger> \sh_away: I consider blogging... I like supporting good marketing campaigns :D
* apachelogger though prefers the more ...insane professonal way...
<Lutin> norsetto: mail-notification FTBFS even with your patch :/
<arthur-> hello Lutin
<Lutin> heya arthur- \o
<arthur-> Lutin: so, what's up? :-)
<Lutin> arthur-: trying to sort out the mail-notification thing ;) . you ?
<xxxxx1> mornin' people
<arthur-> Lutin: trying to build a shared lib from libgphobos (D language shared library) :-)
<Lutin> :)
<Lutin> 'morning xxxxx1
<arthur-> hello xxxxx1
<Lutin> norsetto: around ?
<xxxxx1> hey Lutin, arthur-
<norsetto> lutin: sorry, was haviung lunch
<Lutin> norsetto: no prob
<norsetto> lutin: you applied the patch to 4.1.dfsg.1-1?
<Lutin> norsetto: yep, with some adjustments
<norsetto> lutin: ok, it was building fine for me with a pbuilder gutsy
<norsetto> lutin: amd64 if it makes any difference
<Lutin> norsetto: eg, running llibtoolize & co won't ever work with the makebuilddir: target, because this is run before the patches are applied iirc
<norsetto> lutin: the first time yes, but it is rerun after the patch
<Lutin> hum ok
<Lutin> norsetto: fails with this here: mn-evolution-folder-tree-control.gob:129: error: too few arguments to function 'em_folder_tree_set_selected'
<Lutin> amd64 as well
<norsetto> lutin: never seen it before, if you tell me what you modified I can try on my machine too
<Lutin> norsetto: apart the makebuilddir: target, nothing
<norsetto> lutin: what target did you choose?
<Lutin> post-patches
<norsetto> lutin: ok, let me try with that
<zul> morning
<Lutin> morning zul
<Lutin> norsetto: same error if I apply your patch and compile right after
<norsetto> lutin: building now, I'm wondering about this error: mn-evolution-folder-tree-control.gob perhaps its an api change; but the lib was not changed recently
<norsetto> lutin: same error I guess?
<Lutin> yep
<A20> norsetto, Hi
<A20> norsetto, have you seen my privat messages?
<norsetto> A20:I saw you contacted me, if its about the reception, can you send me an email?
<A20> sure
<norsetto> A20: please add also details about you and what you did so far, ok? thanks
<mok0> When repackaging the orig.tar.gz, am I supposed to put a shell-script somewhere that says how I did it?
<ScottK> mok0: get-orig-source in debian/rules is what you are thinking of.
<ScottK> It's not absolutely required.  Alternatively you can describe how to do it manually in debian/copyright.
<ScottK> There's a description on one of the MOTU wiki pages on how to do get-orig-source.
<mok0> ScottK: I'll use copyright, then.
<ScottK> OK.  That's what I did when I had to do it.
<mok0> ScottK: Is revu still down?
<ScottK> Feel free to ping me when you have stuff that needs looking at since I've looked at your packages befre.
<ScottK> Yes
<ScottK> befre/before
<mok0> I'll email you the source package shortly, then
<ScottK> Or if you have web space you can use a link to a .dsc so I can dget it would work.  Up to you.
<ScottK> siretart: I approved the backport in Bug 120905 based on your say so that it worked.  I'd appreciate it if you would have a look at the latest comment on the bug.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 120905 in feisty-backports "Please backport emacs22 from gutsy to feisty-backports" [Wishlist,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/120905
<norsetto> lutin: ca c'est la bonne, ils aves deja pris mes modifications!?
<arthur-> Lutin: tu chired j'avais oubli de te dire
<Hobbsee> norsetto: are you busy at the moment?
<norsetto> Hobbsee: not anymore
<mok0> ScottK: Is README.Debian-source not used??
<Hobbsee> norsetto: can you do me (and white) a favour, and merge imlib please?  unsure if it's a sync or merge.
<Hobbsee> norsetto: it's a security fix
<ScottK> mok0: Not anymore.  It's a recent change.
<arthur-> hello man-di
<norsetto> Hobbsee: sure
<Hobbsee> norsetto: thanks :)
<mok0> ScottK: I just emailed you kssh
<ScottK> I'll have a look.
<mok0> Great! Ooops I have to go...
<mok0> need to pick up my daughter from school
<siretart> ScottK: looks like it has been build in the wrong chroots
<ScottK> siretart: OK.  Thanks for looking.  Suggestions on what to do?
<siretart> ScottK: verify that only the binary in my ppa is affected, and file a bugreport
<ScottK> OK.
<russ_> Thanks for the offer ScottK, My Question wa:  I want to install a Python library, I know how to do this in Windows (c:\Python25\lib\) do you know where to put it in Ubuntu?
<ScottK> russ_: What library?
<ScottK> First thing is to check if it's been packaged already.
<russ_> http://libgmail.sourceforge.net/
<POX_> russ_: aptitude install python-libgmail
<russ_> great thanks :)
<Skiessi> could you get cinelerra to the repository?
<Hobbsee> Skiessi: if someone puts it in there, sure
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Skiessi> Hobbsee: you can put it after someone else has put it there? gj
<geser> hi bddebian
<tgm4883> is anyone available to review a package for me?  The necessary files are located at http://linux.weilandhomes.com  I also included the output of lintian and linda which came back with no errors
<bddebian> Anyone have a minute to help me with a buildd failure?
<Hobbsee> Skiessi: if someone uploads a good version of it whcih follows the packaging guide, then sure, it'll go in
<bddebian> Heya geser
<Hobbsee> bddebian: i'll attempt to help with the build failure, if you help tgm4883.  howzat for blackmail?  :)
<bddebian> Oh man...
<tgm4883> lol
<bddebian> tgm4883: Whats the package?
<tgm4883> its mythstream plugin for mythtv
<bddebian> OK
<tgm4883> i had superm1 help me do it and he looked it over too
<bddebian> This is new to Ubuntu?
<tgm4883> yea, its an unofficial plugin.   only the official plugins are in ubuntu
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Both netdude and netatalk failed to build on the buildd but built fine in my pbuilder.  I've seen issues before with buildd but these look like missing libraries so I'm confused :-(
<ScottK> bddebian: But I know superm1 has been working with people to get their stuff up to snuff for inclusion.  Their goal is to be as "official" as possible.
<bddebian> ScottK: Sure
<Hobbsee> bddebian: got the buildlog URL's handy?
<bddebian> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8835482/buildlog_ubuntu-gutsy-i386.netatalk_2.0.3-6_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<bddebian> ScottK, tgm4883: The reason I ask is that if it's new to ubuntu, shouldn't the release be -0ubuntu1?
<ScottK> Ah
<ScottK> bddebian: I'm willing to blame apparmor for that one
<Hobbsee> bddebian: looks like a missing b-d on libgssapi-dev
<Hobbsee> bddebian: as for why it worked on your pbuilder, i've no idea.
<ScottK> Nevermind
<bddebian> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8835483/buildlog_ubuntu-gutsy-i386.netdude_0.3.3-4_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<geser> Hobbsee: the missing b-d is libkrb5-dev
<tgm4883> I found the package from a debian guy (andrew pollack).  It's not in the debian repos, but he debanized it so I thought it should be -1ubuntu1
<Hobbsee> geser: ah, so that was it
<tgm4883> sorry, andrew pollock
<Hobbsee> geser: i didnt know which group of dev packages it belonged to (krb, or gssapi)
<tgm4883> I found it here  http://www.andrew.net.au/~apollock/mythstream/
<geser> you can probably replace heimdal-dev with libkrb5-dev
<bddebian> So how the hell does it build locally?  I'm trying it again now just to be sure..
<Hobbsee> bddebian: no idea on that second one, apart from the obvious
* ScottK wonders where is superm1 and why isn't he helping ...
<bddebian> It just built again.. wtf
<ScottK> If the result after a build is "Failed to upload", does that need an archive admin to fix it and do I need to tell them or do they just get to it eventually?
<Hobbsee> ScottK: means soyuz fell over.  poke an archive admin or infinity
<ScottK> OK
<ScottK> Thanks.
<bddebian> tgm4883: Test building now
<tgm4883> ok, thanks
<tgm4883> am I okay with the verion # since I got it from andrew pollock?
<bddebian> No you should probably change that, but that's minor
<tgm4883> ok
<bddebian> geser: What about the netdude one?  Add a build-dep for libcap0.7-dev?
<bddebian> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8835483/buildlog_ubuntu-gutsy-i386.netdude_0.3.3-4_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<tgm4883> so just to be sure, it should be this right mythstream_0.17.2-2-0ubuntu1.dsc?
<bddebian> Yes it should
<tgm4883> ok
<bddebian> tgm4883: Oh, no.  0.17.2-0ubuntu1, sorry
<tgm4883> ok, was just about to ask that
<bddebian> And only 1 changelog entry would be needed
<tgm4883> only 1 changelog entry from me?  or are you saying to remove andrews entries?
<bddebian> You can probably get rid of all of them.  Just have 1 entry for -0ubuntu1 stating initial release for ubuntu and any specific changes you have make
<tgm4883> ok
<bddebian> s/make/made/
<tgm4883> am i correct in thinking that if it was in the debian repos that it would be -2ubuntu1?
<tgm4883> or am i thinking wrong altogether on that?
<bddebian> tgm4883: Yes if Debians release was -2 it would be -2ubuntu1
<tgm4883> ok thanks
<geser> bddebian: replace libpcap-dev with libpcap0.7-dev (it doesn't build with libpcap0.8-dev)
* bddebian is still confused why these built locally
<bddebian> thanks geser, you DA MAN!
<tgm4883> bddebian, should i also remove XSBC-Original-Maintainer:  Andrew Pollock <apollock@debian.org> from control?
<Hobbsee> bddebian: crack infected system.
<pygi> tgm4883, afaik that line should be there
<tgm4883> ok, just checking
<bddebian> tgm4883: Do you know if he intends to maintain it in Debian?
<tgm4883> no idea
<tgm4883> my plan was to send him the changes, then perhaps we could sync
<geser> bddebian: the last libpcap0.8 upload (17 hours ago) move libpcap-dev from libpcap (0.7) to libpcap0.8
<bddebian> tgm4883: Then I would leave it
<tgm4883> ok
<bddebian> @#$%$^
<bddebian> tgm4883: Looks like debian/copyright might be missing some copyright holders.  libs/qhttp* seem to be: Copyright (C) 1997-2005 Trolltech
<bddebian>  parsers/apple.pl:# * Copyright 2005 by Michael Knoll
<bddebian> parsers/bbc/bbc_l1.pl:### Copyright (c) 2005 Robin Gilks
<Hobbsee> norsetto: please see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/imlib/+bug/132724 :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 132724 in imlib "Please merge imlib (1.9.15-3) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Incomplete] 
<Hobbsee> (the last comment)
<bddebian> tgm4883: Other than the changelog and those 3 copyright holders, it looks very clean to me
<tgm4883> alright, i fixed the changelog
<Hobbsee> norsetto: apart from that, looks great :)
<tgm4883> i'll add those 3 copyright holders to the copyright section of copyright
* norsetto reads
<bddebian> tgm4883: Excellent thanks.  I didn't look at the licenses for the parser stuff but the Trolltech stuff uses the Q license so I think you need to put a copy of that in debian/copyright as well
* bddebian hates licensing stuff
<norsetto> Hobbsee: you are right, I think the clean target maybe do not revert patches correctly?
<Hobbsee> norsetto: it usually does, depending on the build system
<Hobbsee> norsetto: (you should just be able to remove the offending part out of the debdiff)
<norsetto> Hobbsee: sure, just wanted to understand how it ended up there
<Hobbsee> norsetto: yeah.  there's a section of debhelper that you can add to the rules file to add and remove patches.  http://kubuntu.org/~jriddell/patch-rules for eg
<Hobbsee> but it would usually remove them too, in the clean
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
(AndyP/#ubuntu-motu) was revu running breezy? :)
(\sh/#ubuntu-motu) nixternal, with drupal you can just inject malicious php code...yeah, but not updating from breezy to something else (dapper e.g.) it's also a fault...no security patches == more risk, less fun ;)
<nixternal> true
<\sh> AndrewB, revu never ran drupal
<\sh> aeh AndyP
<nixternal> but the attacks/exploits were "supposedly" traced back to the use of old versions of Drupal (cross-site) and ftp
<AndyP> \sh: i didn't say it did
<\sh> but I don't know...when we started, it was running breezy, sure, but after that, I wasn't admin anymore :)
<\sh> nixternal, ftp is more dangerous...the wrong ftp service running with a nice root exploit, and you can do everything
<nixternal> and that they did :)
<\sh> happy birthday my dear ;)
<\sh> ok...need to end this for today...my little sexy wife is just waiting for me with a nice ubuntu shirt on...
<\sh> good night ppls
<bddebian> Gnight \sh
<xxxxx1> ScottK, PM?
<ScottK> If it's quick
<xxxxx1> someone is available to sponsor my ecryptfs-utils update?
<bddebian> xxxxx1: Where is it?
<xxxxx1> is on bzr branch
<xxxxx1> https://code.launchpad.net/~xxxxx1/+junk/ecryptfs-utils
<bddebian> egads
<bddebian> why? :)
<xxxxx1> i manage my packages on bzr
<xxxxx1> :P
<bddebian> Just so wrong
<broonie> +junk, huh?
<xxxxx1> oh, +junk is used because it's not a ubuntu branch
<xxxxx1> it's used for personal branches
<MattJ> Does anyone know why the ecplipse-cdt pulls in so many dependencies?
<ScottK> MattJ: Generally it's because the packager thought they were necessary.
<MattJ> It doesn't seem right
<MattJ> Ok
<MattJ> But for example it depends on eclipse-pde
<MattJ> http://www.eclipse.org/downloads/moreinfo/compare.php
<MattJ> Which as shown there, is certainly not necessary
<ScottK> MattJ: I don't know anything about eclipse, so I'm not the one to argue with.
<ScottK> That was just a general rule.
<MattJ> Who can I argue with? >:-P
<ScottK> I'd suggest file a bug against the package.
<MattJ> ok
<ScottK> With whatever documentation you can muster.
<ScottK> There are mistakes in packages, but generally stuff is there for a reason.
<bddebian> Hmm, I have a patch that applies successfuly but isn't in the binary package..
<xxxxx1> jweyrich, what you want here?
<xxxxx1> hehe
<bddebian> Ack, what happened to all the comments on ajmitch's site??
<RainCT> if you place a .desktop file in the debian/ dir of a CDBS package, will it automatically be handled by it?
<bddebian> RainCT: Not that I know of
<RainCT> bddebian: how can I tell it then that there's a desktop file?
<jweyrich> xxxxx1 :)
<xxxxx1> microsoft developer here?
<xxxxx1> rsrs
<jweyrich> where? give me the gun, faster.
<jweyrich> ;p
<bddebian> RainCT: Is there a .install file?
<Kmos> bddebian: bug 132694 - yes!
<RainCT> bddebian: no
<xxxxx1> bddebian, we can't delete the bad upload and upload 0ubuntu1 again?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 132694 in ddclient "Please sync ddclient (3.7.3-2) from Debian unstable" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132694
<Kmos> xxxxx1: the next upload will kill the last one
<xxxxx1> bddebian, because your version brokes my on bzr
<bddebian> xxxxx1: Unfortunately no, not to the archive
<xxxxx1> bddebian, ah
<bddebian> xxxxx1: That's what you get for using bzr
<xxxxx1> bddebian, i'll update my bzr branch
<xxxxx1> :)
<ScottK> Kmos: Once again you are trying to answer questions you don't know the answer to and getting it wrong.  Please stop.
<xxxxx1> bddebian, version 2 only modifies changelog, right?
<Kmos> ScottK: isn't it correct?
<Kmos> [21:42]  <bddebian> xxxxx1: Unfortunately no, not to the archive
<ajmitch> hi
<ScottK> Hi ajmitch
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> xxxxx1: Yes and used the correct orig.tar.gz this time
<ScottK> Kmos: What bddebian said is correct.  What you said [16:41]  <Kmos> xxxxx1: the next upload will kill the last one is wrong.
<bddebian> ajmitch: What happened to the comments?
<xxxxx1> bddebian, just to be sure. I'm doing the change on bzr too ;) thanks.
<ajmitch> bddebian: the're sleeping
<bddebian> :-)
<ScottK> With the fishes ....
<Kmos> ScottK: I think it's the same thing. you can't delete things on the archive, just with a newer upload with modified version that will kill the last one.
<ScottK> No.  You can't re-upload the same revision more than once.
<ScottK> It'll get rejected.
<bddebian> xxxxx1: Why put it in bzr at all?  Can't you just overwrite on your next revision?
<ScottK> You have to bump the revision number and upload a new version.
<Kmos> ScottK: i forgot to say with "new version" :(
<ScottK> That's what made your answer wrong.
<Kmos> yeah
<bddebian> xxxxx1: Or better yet, stop using bzr ;-P
<xxxxx1> hehe
<xxxxx1> take it easy barry
<xxxxx1> :D
<norsetto> bzr foreever!
* bddebian vomits
<ScottK> That's how long it takes, yes.
* xxxxx1 waves norsetto 
<bddebian> ScottK: hehe
* norsetto cleans his shoes ....
<xxxxx1> heh
<ScottK> What's the only thing slower than launchpad, bzr + launchpad.
<jweyrich> tsc.
<ajmitch> + internet connectivity in NZ
<bddebian> heh
<jweyrich> a more accurate answer, dialup+bzr+launchpad
<xxxxx1> norsetto, you're maintain packages on bzr too?
<xxxxx1> oups
<ScottK> Hah.  Yeah. I'd guess that.
<ajmitch> dsl in NZ is mostly equivalent to dialup anyway
<xxxxx1> norsetto, you maintain packages on bzr too?
<norsetto> no, I just like to side with the minority ;-)
<jweyrich> hahah, ajmitch, sorry for my laughs, but brazil can be compared to dialup as well.
<bddebian> Who's the minority?  I think only ScottK and I are the bzr haters
* ScottK agrees.
<ScottK> We are the old and bitter ones.
<bddebian> heh
* pygi thinks bzr has it's shortcomings, but thinks bzr devs in time will create a beautiful product
<bddebian> OK I'm starting to get tired of syncs/merges..
<bddebian> pygi: I'm not faulting bzr per-se, I just think its stupid for packaging.  Upstream development "maybe" but for packaging, pfft
<ScottK> bddebian: Where a vcs works is where you have a team that agrees to use it for team maintenance and maintains all debian dirs in the vcs.  The Debaian Python Modules Team uses svn for this and it works really well.
<ScottK> Us non-DD's upload our stuff to the svn and ping a DD via IRC or e-mail, they look at it and upload it.
<ScottK> The Debian Perl team operates similarly.
<ScottK> I don't think there's any way it would scale to something like Universe though.
* pygi doesn't see reason  *not* to scale that much
<ScottK> pygi hasn't sat and waited for several minuts on my laptop waiting for svn up to even figure out it needs a password for the ~120 dirs I've got checked out of the DPMT svn.
<ScottK> minuts/minutes
<ajmitch> ssh-agent helps a lot there
<ScottK> True, but I do all the packaging work on my developmental laptop hard drive (i.e. the one currently running Gutsy) so in the interest of I'm more likely than usualy to get crashes, I don't store any passwords on that install.
<ScottK> What with automatic crash reporting and all...
<xxxxx1> bye ubunteros and ubunteras
<RainCT> bye xxxxx1
<hroo772> so i think i screwed up my pbuilder envoriment, i was hoping to start a fresh base.tar.gz, so all i did was sudo pbuilder create
<hroo772> but now when trying to compile wine i have this error
<hroo772> error: C compiler cannot create executables
<jweyrich> directory permissions?
<jweyrich> damn connection.
<jweyrich> hroo772 solved the gcc issue?
<ScottK> bddebian: Still around?
<bddebian> Sorta, what's up?
<ScottK> Trying to figure out why you requested Bug #132604
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 132604 in python-biopython "[Sync Request Universe]  python-biopython 1.43-2" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132604
<hroo772> jweyrich: well im figuring its not the permissions, its more an issue with how im trying to build the package
<bddebian> ScottK: Because it was on ajmitch's list
<ScottK> OK.  It's a rebuild for Python2.5 in Debian.
<jweyrich> hroo772, try to compile a simple C program, like a hello world, and use -v flag for gcc, gcc -v hello.c
<hroo772> jweyrich: well my test was between wine .42 and wine .43
<ScottK> It's not going to hurt to do it, but it won't change anything as we've already built it for Python 2.5
<hroo772> jweyrich: when i was compiling .42 i had it set with --enable-win64, which isn't really supported with wine so the compile fails part way through
<hroo772> jweyrich: when i took out that option for .43 it stopped with that gcc error, since now it should be trying to compile as 32bit, which im thinking it can't see the 32bit gcc properly
<jweyrich> hroo772 did you update the libc ?
<jweyrich> hm
<jweyrich> right, let me research a bit
<hroo772> jweyrich: or possibly the ia32 libs, but to help with that, i logged into my pbuilder and installed the ia32-libs and libc6-dev-i386
<jweyrich> is your computer/pc/whatever arch x86_64 ?
<bddebian> ScottK: Aye, just trying to clean up his list ;-)
<hroo772> jweyrich: yea its amd64
<jweyrich> hrii772: and which gcc version?
<hroo772> in pbuilder or just on my machine?
<hroo772> jweyrich: i mean based on my updating it to the latest i could, it whatever is newest on launchpad
<jweyrich> oh, okay
<bddebian> what the heck is this thing trying to do??
<bddebian>   $(INSTALL) -p -m755 debian/postinst debian/preinst \
<bddebian>       debian/prerm debian/postrm        debian/tmp/DEBIAN
<hroo772> jweyrich: im just thinking i havn't set something correct in the debian/rules, to tell it to compile for amd64 but compile against the ia32 libs since wine is only 32bit for now
<bddebian> Is that trying to put postinst, preinst, and postrm in debian/tmp/DEBIAN??
<ajmitch> bddebian: yes
<bddebian> WRONG... :-)
<jweyrich> hroo772 just a second.
<ajmitch> bddebian: I would presume that's the intent, at least
<jweyrich> hroo772: http://wiki.winehq.org/WineOn64bit#head-08d4087d863019523214064680fcf26721c9a1af
<jweyrich> have you read it?
<hroo772> jweyrich: i actually already had the page open, im waiting on the current test compile to see if adding the ldflags and confflags will let it compile
<hroo772> jweyrich: well it just errored the same, i could send you the rules file or whatever to look at since thats the only place that would need to change
<hroo772> jweyrich: i know it just has to do with whats in this section
<hroo772> ifeq ($(DEB_BUILD_ARCH), amd64)
<hroo772>         LDFLAGS="-L/lib32 -L/usr/lib32 -Wl,-rpath,/lib32 -Wl,-rpath,/usr/lib32"
<hroo772>         CONFFLAGS += ICU_LIB_DIR=/usr/lib32
<hroo772> endif
<hroo772> jweyrich: in this section before it only had CONFFLAGS += --enable-win64 which should not be there
<ajmitch> yay for sensational "reporting" on slashdot
<bddebian> Grrrrr
<bddebian> fakeroot chown -R root.root debian/tmp-src
<bddebian> fakeroot: FAKEROOTKEY set to 1910363207
<bddebian> fakeroot: nested operation not yet supported
<jweyrich> right hroo772, the ./configure shown some error?
<hroo772> jweyrich: well im building with pbuilder so i get the output like i should, but it says it saved a .log file, but im not sure how to get to that after a build fails in pbuilder
<bddebian> Oh, maybe it's this line that fails??   dpkg --build $(TMPSRC) ..
<hroo772> bddebian: were you talking about my build issue?
<bddebian> hroo772: No, I have my own, sorry :-)
<hroo772> its all good
<jweyrich> sorry, I was busy.
<mok0> ScottK: I soon have updates to kssh. I am sorry I missed the failed build, I was in a rush this afternoon :-(
<jweyrich> hroo772, I gotta go, needs to homologate an app in 30 mins. sorry for not helping too much, I'll be back later, then I can make a complete review with youy.
<jweyrich> you*
<hroo772> jweyrich: ill be leaving work also, ill be back on the channel around 7pm EST
<jweyrich> let me know if you solve the issue.
<jweyrich> 7pm here, probably I come back @ 11pm.
<jweyrich> if nothing goes wrong :) see you.
<jweyrich> bbl guys.
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-16
<ScottK> mok0: No problem.
<RainCT> good night
<jmg> so
<jmg> was revu hosted on zambesi?
<Zombie> Is there a Hugo Package in Ubuntu?
<Adri2000> hi Zombie
<Zombie> Hi.
<Zombie> I'm needing some Applications packaged for Fiesty.
<Adri2000> accoring to apt-cache search, there isn't any package called *hugo* or containing hugo in its description
<Adri2000> according*
<Zombie> freedroidrpg, hugo, sdlmame
<Zombie> Have any suggestions to rectify this?
<Adri2000> package it
<Zombie> I'm not familiar with your packaging arch.
<Zombie> I'm only familiar with RPM
<Adri2000> file a needs-packaging bug
<Adri2000> let me find the wiki page
<Adri2000> Zombie: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New
<mohammad> would someone please let me know where I can find a gnome applet developing howto?
<sooth> Anybody know how to get debarchiver working on Ubuntu?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<RAOF> Heya bddebian!
<bddebian> Hello RAOF
<RAOF> Hey, if I took Xgl and turned it into not-a-bzr branch for you, would you like to review it?
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> I'll pull from bzr if you want but last time I couldn't build it that way??
<RAOF> It's available, but it's got a 5mb diff, sadly.
<bddebian> Egads
<RAOF> (Yay for autotools)
<RAOF> 5mb worth of configure, Makefiles, et al.
<RAOF> 1K worth of changes you might actually want to review.
<RAOF> If I had been thinking right, I may have just b-d'd on autotools.
<bddebian> How do I force debian/rules to use bash?  Just !/bin/bash ??
<bddebian> RAOF: Where is it?
<RAOF> bddebian: cooperteam.net
<RAOF> I'll grab a dgettable link for you, if you like.
<RAOF> http://www.cooperteam.net/xserver-xgl_1.1.99.1~git20070727-0ubuntu1.dsc
<bddebian> Nah, that's Ok as long as .diff.gz, .dsc, and tarball are there?
<RAOF> Yes.
<bddebian> Oh how novel, downloaded already.. :-)
<bddebian> Brb, need a smoke
<bddebian> Hmm, did I grab the wrong one?  diff.gz is only 700Kb
<RAOF> The unpacked diff is 5 mb
<RAOF> Not the gzipped one.
<bddebian> Oh, yeah, duh.. sheesh
<bddebian> do be do be dooo
<RAOF> bddebian: You might want to check that I've got the right XS-vcs-bzr line in debian/control.  I think that what you've got should have it, but I only remembered to add it recently.
<bddebian> RAOF: Yeah I'll be sure to check that its in there.. ;-P
* bddebian wouldn't care less
<bddebian> RAOF: I don't think xgl has enough build-deps ;-P
<RAOF> bddebian: It's only a page long at 80x24 :P
<bddebian> Mez!!!!!!
<bddebian> :-)
<Mez> bddebian, !!!
<bddebian> How have you been?
<StevenK> RAOF: Ouch!
<RAOF> StevenK: What's that in reference to, the b-ds or the 5mb diff? :)
<Mez> bddebian - am good other than my install being forked to hell
<bddebian> :-(
<bddebian> StevenK: Gonna do gem next? :-)
<StevenK> RAOF: Both
<RAOF> Heh
<Mez> bddebian, cant boot unless i use the feisty kernel, and everything is evil when I dont use it
<Mez> time for a reinstall I think
<bddebian> Ugh
<Mez> and is evil when I use it (pidgin wont even run!)
<RAOF> Mez: Yeah, that's bitten me too.  Empathy works :)-
<bddebian> RAOF: How long does it usually take for you to build?
* RAOF checks his buildlogs
<RAOF> Last build took 7 minutes.
<gouki> Anyone working on a package for vodafone-mobile-connect-card-driver-for-linux? It would be great to have this on the repositories.
<bddebian> 7 minutes? Sheesh, what type of machine do you have?
<RAOF> Athlon 64 3500+, 1 Gb ram?
<RAOF> That was with all the b-d's cached locally.
<ajmitch> RAOF: and sbuild instead of pbuilder?
<RAOF> ajmitch: Totally
<ajmitch> I presume that pbuilder-satisfydepends would take about 7 minutes by itself
<Mez> RAOF... empathy?
<RAOF> ajmitch: If you weren't using -gdebi, yes.
<RAOF> Mez: Telepathy-based IM client.
<ajmitch> I've had problems with -gdebi in the past
<Mez> well RAOF, to be fair, the ernel isue is a PITa
<RAOF> Well, it doesn't check versioning, certainly.
<Mez> RAOF: any good?
<RAOF> Mez: Eh.  It works.  I don't really ask much of my IM clients, frankly.
<Mez> I wub pidgin tho
<Mez> RAOF: failed to launch
<bddebian> Me either since I don't use any :-)
* bddebian realizes that he is just a grumpy old bastard
<RAOF> Mez: Well, ...
* RAOF runs!
<Mez> http://rafb.net/p/pareg156.html
<RAOF> Mez: Go file a "empathy should depend on dbus-x11" bug :)
<Mez> ;)
<Mez> RAOF: cant be botehrd..
<Mez> lol
<Mez> I'm just downloading tribe 4
<bddebian> RAOF: I assume all the missing manpages are expected?
<bddebian> bbiam
<RAOF> bddebian: Yes :(
<RAOF> I'm working (slowly) on them.
<RAOF> But *nothing* in X has a manpage!
<StevenK> Yay. Success.
<StevenK> $WORK's new vmware server is up and racked.
* StevenK wonders if UVF has hit yet.
<bddebian> StevenK: Tomorrow for my time zone ;-P
<bddebian> RAOF: NP.  This is the only other linda warning I see: W: xserver-xgl; Long descriptions contains short description.
<Mez> RAOF, got empathy working but it wants a server name
<Mez> snd i wanna use Yahoo
<RAOF> bddebian: Oh.  I didn't change the descriptions, but I can change that if you like.
<bddebian> RAOF: Not a bigge.  I think there are some licenses on the planet that aren't include in debian/copyright ;-P
<RAOF> bddebian: Heh.
<bddebian> Do the .desktop files really belong in /usr/share/xsessions?
<StevenK> bddebian: I doubt it.
<RAOF> bddebian: That's where xsession files go, and xsession files are desktop files.
<bddebian> But you have seperate xsession files, no?
<RAOF> bddebian: You'll notice that /usr/share/xsessions contains gnome.desktop, the gnome session.
<bddebian> OK
<RAOF> bddebian: No.  I have separate *wrapper* scripts, because our xsession runner can't handle passing parameters.
<bddebian> Well it looks fine to me.  I don't know (hope to God) you don't need all the copyright holders for the xprint stuff :)
<bddebian> BTW, the XSBC-Vcs crap is NOT in debian/control
<RAOF> bddebian: Ah, curses.
<RAOF> It is in the bzr branch, I believe.
<bddebian> RAOF: Unfortunately I can't install to test it currently but the packaging/building is fine
<RAOF> bddebian: Ok.  Thanks.
<RAOF> Hm.  How is this going to work, re uploading?
<RAOF> I'll fix the description warning, and make sure the vcs-bzr line is in there before I worry too much more about that, I guess.
<bddebian> Holy crap 7009 New bugs :-(
<ScottK> It's OK.  Kmos filed probably 7003 of them of which 2 are valid.
<ScottK> </bitter>
<ajmitch> harsh :)
<ScottK> Hey, I gave him credit for sometimes getting stuff right.  I'm an optimist at heart.
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> I guess it's pointless to look at the "upgrade" bugs a day before UVF eh?
<RAOF> Not really.
<bddebian> Not really?
<RAOF> If there are some necessary ones in there, UVFe!
* ScottK get his "No" ready.
<RAOF> Heh.
<bddebian> ScottK: Thanks buddy
* ScottK just thinks we have UVF for a reason and so ought to stick with it unless stuff is broken.
<RAOF> Indeed.
* ScottK mumbles about democracy player or whatever it's called now and figures by that reasoning it can be uploaded until release day.
<bddebian> Why is gnunet marked as Fix Committed when it has not been uploaded
<ScottK> Probably by mistake.
<ScottK> Look in the activity log to see who marked it.
<RAOF> ScottK: You can still upload miro before UVF!
<ScottK> I don't even know what miro is.
<RAOF> ScottK: democracyplayer 0.9.8
<ScottK> Ah.
<RAOF> With a swanky new name :P
<ScottK> I heard it had a new name, but hadn't heard what it was.
<RAOF> Anyway, u-u-s is subscribed to a package for it.
* ScottK is busy trying to order groceries before the children go hungry.
<RAOF> Soft!
* RAOF suggests tin soaked in sulphuric acid.
<ScottK> If they get hungry they whine and cry all night long and I get no sleep.
<ajmitch> ScottK: I'll have about 20 or so UVF bugs to file for you
<ScottK> Any of them worth approving?
<ajmitch> they should all be of the sort "package is currently completely broken"
<ajmitch> or "here's a nice fat security bug"
<ScottK> Sounds reasonable.
<ajmitch> but I should upload f-spot now before the deadline
* ScottK looks around to see if we have a documented exception approval process and where it went....
<ScottK> Yes, please.
<ajmitch> yes we do have a documented approval process
<bddebian> Ho hum, what to do next..
<ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<ajmitch> MOTU/Processes/UVF redirects there
<ajmitch> we have been working on the 2 ACKs needed for UVFe
<ajmitch> oh, and you probably want to change that to subscribe the motu-uvf team rather than assign :)
<ajmitch> motu-uvf team member who gives the 2nd ACK should confirm the bug
* ScottK looks around for the other lucky winners...
<ScottK> Sounds reasonable.
* ajmitch is no longer a lucky winner
<ScottK> You gotta run to win.
* ScottK thinks ajmitch should've run.
<ajmitch> why?
<ScottK> You're quit capable and then maybe fewer people would've voted for me and I'd have lost.
<ajmitch> there were 5 candidates for 5 slots
<ajmitch> it would be very hard for you to lose
<ajmitch> I doubt that many would have voted for me :)
<ScottK> Right.  That's why I was hoping for more qualified people to run.
<ajmitch> you're qualified enough
<ScottK> I mostly jumped on to make sure we'd be able to fill all the slots.
* ajmitch isn't
<ScottK> Sure.
<ajmitch> because I think an important qualification should be "works on ubuntu"
* tonyyarusso points out that you're both more qualified than he, so why not?
<ajmitch> tonyyarusso: last I saw you weren't going for the motu-uvf team either
<ScottK> Well you've certainly been around less, but I'd like to see that change.
<ajmitch> ScottK: oh no, I've been around a lot
<ScottK> Don't worry though, I'm used to not getting what I want.
<ajmitch> just not doing anything :)
<ScottK> OK.
<tonyyarusso> ajmitch: nope
<ScottK> tonyyarusso: How goes son of the son of Nvu (whatever it is called)?
<StevenK> ScottK: You don't really trust yourself to be on -uvf?
<ScottK> Well I've been doing less lately too.
<ScottK> StevenK: I do, just management stuff like that isn't fun.
<ScottK> I'll do it well, I just won't particularly enjoy it.
<ajmitch> StevenK: he foolishly thinks I'd be a better choice
<StevenK> Heh
<ScottK> His primary qualification being "He's not me".
<StevenK> I don't mind doing it. Based on what I saw last year it isn't too much work.
<tonyyarusso> ScottK: Varied.  We have code for a new release, but are going through a few hurdles for packaging.  Additionally, it's still based off of the quite old Aviary mozilla branch, which asac isn't terribly happy about, but which might be too much work to fix for the time being.  I'm still holding onto hope for making the August 30th deadline, but we'll likely need a fair bit of help, since neither Kaze or I know as much as most folks.
<ajmitch> StevenK: it wasn't too bad, I managed to do it for a couple of releases
<ajmitch> after doing it for that long, why stick my hand up for another round?
<ScottK> tonyyarusso: Just get it released and uploadable.  Don't dawdle.  You can do bug fixing for a long time....
<ScottK> ajmitch: Which is an entirely reasonable reason not to do it.
<tonyyarusso> ScottK: Right
<StevenK> ajmitch: So you didn't stick your hand up because you were sick of it, or because you wanted a break from it?
<ScottK> tonyyarusso: People ask me what should I use instead of Nvu and I tend to say, "Uh ..."
* tonyyarusso should build up his gutsy pbuilder so it's ready to go tomorrow
<ScottK> That's the spirit
<tonyyarusso> ScottK: yeah, my mom is one of those people.
<tonyyarusso> !pbuilder
<ubotu> pbuilder is a system to easily build packages in a clean chroot environment. To get started with PBuilder, see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<ScottK> My usual answer is, "Well I use Kate, but for that you actually need to know some HTML."
<ajmitch> StevenK: because I was sick of ubuntu work at the time, also
<StevenK> How can you possibly get sick of Ubuntu work?
<ScottK> Well I've been working up to it recently.
<ajmitch> oh I don't know
<bddebian> *cough*
<tonyyarusso> oh, right - I'll have to update debootstrp
<tonyyarusso> *ap
<ScottK> Apparently it's totally OK in Ubuntu to go completely insane and cause lots of work for other people as long as you take a break and get sane every few days in between.
* tonyyarusso gets nervous about such things
<ScottK> </bitter> - No kidding this time.
<ajmitch> StevenK: besides, you were doing an admirable job doing everything
<bddebian> hehe
<StevenK> Ha!
<StevenK> You jest.
* bddebian does an admirable job of doing nothing! :-)
<tonyyarusso> Gutsy's debootstrap isn't likely to break anything atm is it?
<ScottK> tonyyarusso: If you use the one in feisty-backports it'll work fine in Feisty and do a Gutsy pbuilder no problem.
<ScottK> IIRC.
<tonyyarusso> aaaah
<tonyyarusso> ScottK: erm, minor problem
<tonyyarusso> -backports aren't created until after release.
<tonyyarusso> or wait, maybe not
<ScottK> That's why I said feisty-backports.
<ScottK> You are running Feisty, aren't you?
<tonyyarusso> never mind - packages.ubuntu.com has it listed, you just can't search feisty-backports.  Was able to browse to it fine after looking up the section.
<ajmitch> oh my, dpkg triggers landed
<jmg> wats a trigger
<jmg> what
<minghua> ajmitch: "oh my" indeed.  Though it's a bit funny to see such a change in a 1.14.5ubuntu3 -> 1.14.5ubuntu4 new version. :-)
<ScottK> Quote from #ubuntu-devel earlier today "[14:54]  <iwj> OMG it works and I'm going to upload it.  I wonder where all the bugs are ?"
<ScottK> Time is US Eastern.
<ajmitch> heh
<ScottK> Landed is probably the right word.
<ScottK> Any Sendmail users out there?
<jmg> Sic transit sendmail.
<ajmitch> no thanks, we're sane
<minghua> "I'm going to upload it to Ubuntu this evening - only to Ubuntu right now because I'm prioritising meeting the hard deadline of Ubuntu's feature freeze, tomorrow."
<minghua> That's from Ian, in http://lists.debian.org/debian-dpkg/2007/08/msg00009.html
<ScottK> Any recovering Sendmail users out there who remember enough to help me make the dkim-milter init work reasonably for both Postfix and Sendmail?
<jmg> Oh, i heart these triggers
<StevenK> Me too.
<bddebian> Oh joy octave2.9 is "maintained" in Debian svn
* tonyyarusso noticed the d-i upload to dapper-changes and was curious
<StevenK> scrollkeeper being run once during upgrade is nice. Also, I think it makes sense for updating the initramfs, too.
<ajmitch> I've had upgrades with update-initramfs being run about 7 or 8 times, which was slightly annoying
<StevenK> Agreed.
* StevenK files 3 syncs before UCF
<StevenK> Er, UVF
<bddebian> gem?
<StevenK> Okay, okay, I'll look at it now.
<bddebian> Heh, you don't have to
* StevenK is anyway
<bddebian> :'-(
* bddebian feels bad now
<StevenK> bddebian: Don't feel bad, I've just looked at 3 other packages anyway.
<jmg> where can i get the bzr branch url to use with bzr co?
<RAOF> jmg: From launchpad.
<RAOF> jmg: Each branch's page has a url to branch from it.
<RAOF> Unless you're after something in particular...
<jmg> https://launchpad.net/truecrypt-installer
<RAOF> Hit the "code" tab.
<RAOF> I presume you're after the debian branch; it has url https://code.launchpad.net/~jari-aalto/truecrypt-installer/debian
<jmg> That worked ,thanks.
<jmg> Wow, bazaar is mighty slow.
<bddebian> Nooo, don't do it.. :)
* RAOF tries to provide both fish and instruction in the use of tackle :)
<StevenK> Hah
<StevenK> RAOF: Just set him on fire, then jmg will be warm for the rest of his life.
* bddebian tries to provoke reason and logic
<jmg> StevenK: i am decarbonised
<ajmitch> StevenK: don't tempt him
<jmg> bzr: ERROR: Connection error: while sending GET /~jari-aalto/truecrypt-installer/debian/.bzr/branch-format: (110, 'Connection timed out')
<RAOF> Hm.
<ajmitch> https?
<StevenK> bddebian: gem sync filed
<ajmitch> I wonder when I'll get my next "you're expiring from a team" email from launchpad
<StevenK> ajmitch: Don't go. Stay good. :-)
<ajmitch> StevenK: I expire from core-dev in ~3 weeks, iirc
<bddebian> doh :-(
<bddebian> StevenK: Thanks!
<jmg> sniff
<jmg> yes
<bddebian> Ah yes add SSL encryption over bzr, that ought to speed it up...
* bddebian hides
<ScottK> It's unlikely to make it significantly slower.
<bddebian> True, it would be hard to get much slower
* ajmitch waits for the hating on bzr to finish
<bddebian> I'm done, sorry :-)
<RAOF> It'll get quite a lot faster with 0.20
<ScottK> ajmitch: I don't particularly hate it, I just dislike dealing with yet anothter vcs that is (for my purposes) unique to one project.
<ScottK> RAOF: Two times nothing is still ...
<RAOF> ...thrashing launchpad!
<bddebian> And it will still be overkill for what we do
<RAOF> Maybe.  As far as VCSs go, there's stuff about bzr that I miss in every other one.
<TheMuso> Well I intend to use bzr as my vcs of choice for some other projects that I will be starting in the near future.
<ScottK> RAOF yes, but hardly the point for me.  I have to deal with cvs, svn, and git elsewhere.  I don't want to learn one more just for Ubuntu.
<RAOF> ScottK: True.
<ScottK> Note that I'm not the one that gets to pick on those projects.
<StevenK> Meh, they mostly all fall to common principles.
<RAOF> Yeah.  In that respect, it's sub-optimal.
<RAOF> StevenK: Well, two broad camps.  Those that make branching hideously painful, and those that don't.
<StevenK> I don't mind using cvs, svn and bzr. Like I was saying to someone a few days ago "I also used tla." Their reply was "If you can do useful work with tla, you can use any VCS."
<StevenK> RAOF: Branching in SVN is simple. It's merging that's a *PAIN*.
<RAOF> StevenK: True.  Similar to falling, really. :P
<StevenK> Hah
* ScottK installs libgtk1.2
* StevenK is vaguely pondering switching from CVS to bzr here.
<bddebian> I'm not anti-vcs.  I use cvs often for Hurd stuff I do, I just think it makes absolutely no sense for Universe
<StevenK> Mainly because SVN can't seem to deal with a direcory that contains over 15,000 directories.
* mwolson was also a tla fan back in the day
<jmg> s/tla/nwa/
<jmg> s/tla/tna/
<StevenK> mwolson: I got sick of the community surrounding it, Tom Lord himself, and the fact that it would break regularly.
* ScottK gets sick of waiting for claws-mail to compile and goes to bed.
* StevenK tries to figure out why his sound doesn't work.
<StevenK> I don't even get an error message - just no sound, which is what's irritating.
<Hobbsee> wow, i'm actually putting something together which isnt a direct sponsorship and upload
<pygi> Hobbsee, :)
<Hobbsee> this feels really weird
<Hobbsee> it's still a request from someone else though
<pygi> :P
<Hobbsee> err....a build-depend on g++?
<Hobbsee> er, gcc, that is
* Hobbsee removes it
<pygi> :P
<Hobbsee> oh, twitch.
<Hobbsee> the last version b-d's on gcc too, which is currently in ubuntu
<pygi> :P
* RAOF grins, cheshire like.
* Hobbsee isnt sure this copyright is entirely correct either, but will ignore it on the basis that the archive admins let it into ubuntu before
* pygi thinks Hobbsee knows better then that
<Hobbsee> pygi: it's a "the author hasnt listed his email address" rather than a "there are files there that are under a different licence not listed in debian/copyright"
<pygi> oh well
* Hobbsee hmmms.
<Hobbsee> these scripts have moved, or something.....
<Hobbsee> oh, wait.
<Hobbsee> this is what happens when you rm -rf *
<pygi> Hobbsee, you think we should get "Cheese" in the repositories? :)
<Hobbsee> pygi: maybe :)
<pygi> Hobbsee, we have it already o.O
<pygi> seriously outdated tho :P
<pygi> Hobbsee, are we under UVF already, or not yet?
<Hobbsee> pygi: i dont think so
<Hobbsee> that's why i'm uploading this this afternoon
<pygi> Hobbsee, wohooo :) Then you can upload for me :)
<Hobbsee> hah.
* pygi gotta abuse Hobbsee a bit :p
<Hobbsee> i said i wasnt doing sponsoring stuff, i've been looking at that damned queue too much already.
<pygi> Hobbsee, I'm sure you'll help :)
<Hobbsee> right, that's uploaded.
* RAOF does a little dance
<Hobbsee> morning norsetto
<Hobbsee> oh wait, i was going to upload norsetto's patch too.
<Hobbsee> apart from that, i'm not doing any more sponsoring :P
<norsetto> morning :-)
<pygi> Hobbsee, but ofcourse you are !
<Hobbsee> norsetto: compiling
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Is miro on your queue at all? ;)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: definetly not.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: have you written that mail yet?
<Hobbsee> RAOF: although, if i ignore it, you'll just file a UVFe, and i'll have to look at the bugger anyway, wont i?
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Totally.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: you suck.
<Hobbsee> :P
<RAOF> Actually, it may not be UVFe worthy.
<RAOF> Really.
* RAOF thinks.
<Hobbsee> oh, excellent!
<RAOF> Actually, there are some annoying bugs fixed.
* Hobbsee can ignore it forever, then!
<Hobbsee> RAOF: how crackful is it?
<RAOF> Hobbsee: No more cracfull than the democracyplayer that's already in the archives.
<RAOF> Actually, a little less so.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: oh, i've just had an evil thought.
* Hobbsee has learnt well from mithrandir.
<RAOF> It's slowly moving away from reimplementing private DBUS methods.
<pygi> somebody crashed my panel again o.O
* RAOF awaits with dread.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: you never saw my core dev app, presumably?
<RAOF> True, I didn't.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: mithrandir volunteered me, as i refused to put myself forward.
<RAOF> Oh.
* RAOF sees where this is heading.
<Hobbsee> hehe :
<Hobbsee> * :)
<Hobbsee> Uploading to ubuntu (via ftp to upload.ubuntu.com):
<Hobbsee>   imlib_1.9.15-3ubuntu1.dsc: done.
<Hobbsee>   imlib_1.9.15.orig.tar.gz: done.
<Hobbsee>   imlib_1.9.15-3ubuntu1.diff.gz: done.
<Hobbsee>   imlib_1.9.15-3ubuntu1_source.changes: done.
<Hobbsee> Successfully uploaded packages.
<Hobbsee> hurrah, thanks norsetto!
<norsetto> cool!
<Hobbsee> RAOF: okay, where's this crack-infested thing?
<RAOF> Hobbsee: In the u-u-s queue, I believe.
<Hobbsee> then it was unhelpful to delete my u-u-s email, i take it
<Hobbsee> RAOF: can https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/democracyplayer be shrunk with the new version?
<Hobbsee> or you're utilising the closing by changelog function?
<RAOF> Hobbsee: I am closing with changelog.
<RAOF> But I don't think many of those bugs are actually valid.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: cool :)
<RAOF> Like specto, my packages don't have bugs :P
<RAOF> (This is a bare-faced lie)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> i saw the specto stuff
<Zombie> Any packagers I'd like to negotiate with?>
<RAOF> Specto doesn't have bugs, though.  At least after I patched some of the totally broken stuff :)
<Hobbsee> negotiate with?
<Hobbsee> RAOF: :)
* RAOF is available at the reasonable rate of $35/hr
<Zombie> I have some applications that I have in RPM format I'd like to see packaged as Debs for Fiesty in an expediant manner.
<Zombie> They are open source applications.
<RAOF> Not going into Feisty, at this point.  You *may* get them into gutsy, although you're cutting it fine.
<Hobbsee> they wouldnt go into the archives, if they were for feisty
<RAOF> If however you're just after packages you can poke people with, that should be ok.
<Zombie> In particular freedroidrpg, hugo, sdlmame (thats not the same as XMame) vavoom
<\sh> Zombie, are you hosting those rpms on opensuse build service eventually?
<Hobbsee> Zombie: are you interested in packaging them yourself, or finding others to do them?
<Zombie> Well, I already have packages as SRPMs.
<Zombie> Not Binary RPMs
<Zombie> I need someone to help me "convert" them.
<Zombie> Alien isn't suitible for this task.
<\sh> Zombie, put those packages into opensuse build service (http://en.opensuse.org/Build_Service and I will take a look if they are feasable to include them into Ubuntu
<\sh> moins jono
<Hobbsee> RAOF: how long does miro take to build?
<RAOF> Not very long.
<RAOF> Actually, that's a lie.
<RAOF> It's C++, built twice (once per pyversion)
<RAOF> I can check my buildlogs.
<jono> heya
<Hobbsee> yummy
<Hobbsee> it's ok
<Hobbsee> it'll finish at some point
<Zombie> sdlmame is in there but its older.
<norsetto> I've got a new package in REVU, sitting there since a month. Its pretty much ready for upload, but, will it make it for gutsy?
<\sh> Zombie, so talk to the maintainer of the project and ask them to help them to update...I can take a look at the updated source then
<RAOF> Apparently 1 minute 20, as far as sbuild is concerned.
<Hobbsee> norsetto: ENOREVU :)
* RAOF is sckeptical.
<Hobbsee> oh, here we go
<Zombie> Damn it.
<Zombie> I have enough problems with the Mandriva Cooker as it is.
<norsetto> yeah, exactly
<Zombie> How well will Fiesty run a Mandriva Build? Some of these are PLF applications./
<Zombie> I('m finding a few are deliberately not listed because they are PLF.
<\sh> Zombie, the build-deps and deps have to be changed for debian/ubuntu anyways...
<Zombie> This is pissing me off.
<Hobbsee> RAOF:
<Hobbsee> sarah@liquified:/var/cache/pbuilder/result$ linda miro_0.9.8.1-0ubuntu1_amd64.deb
<Hobbsee> E: miro; No manual page for binary miro.real.
<Hobbsee> W: miro; Binary /usr/lib/python-support/miro/python2.5/miro/MozillaBrowser.so compiled with an RPATH of /usr/lib/firefox.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: is the latter intentional?
<RAOF> Hobbsee: No, it isn't.
<pygi> Hobbsee, so want to review & upload? :)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: did you want to fix it?
* Hobbsee doesnt know much about RPATH's, except that they're bad.
<RAOF> Hobbsee: I did, but I couldn't actually see how to.
<TheMuso> There is a utility that can strip them.
<RAOF> Really?
<TheMuso> I can't remember what its called, but its a build-dep for speechd-up if you want to find out.
<RAOF> Awesome.
<TheMuso> chrpath
* RAOF is already apt-getting that package.
<TheMuso> is what its called
<TheMuso> RAOF: you can use apt-cache showsrc to check build-deps.
<TheMuso> chrpath will do what you want.
<RAOF> TheMuso: Merely by having it installyd?
<RAOF> Surely there's a need to call it?
<TheMuso> RAOF: Yes, in debian/rules.
<TheMuso> speechd-up's rules file uses it.
<RAOF> Hence the apt-get source :)
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> Here is some reading for those who want to know more. http://wiki.debian.org/RpathIssue
<LucidFox> UVF has occurred, hasn't it?
<pygi> LucidFox, no
<TheMuso> Not yet.
<TheMuso> Just under 12 hours.
* pygi bugs someone willing to do review & upload of cheese
<TheMuso> pygi: Bug #?
<LucidFox> gah, so only a few hours remain?
<norsetto> I'm really pissed off, that package has been sitting there for a month, ready to upload
<TheMuso> Is it in uus?
<TheMuso> pygi: oh just got the mail. I'm on it.
<pygi> TheMuso, bug 132881
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 132881 in cheese "[needs review]  Cheese 0.2.0 [needs upload] " [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132881
<pygi> TheMuso, thanks ;)
<TheMuso> norsetto: What bug/
<norsetto> TheMuso: bug 121301
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 121301 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  gnome-mplayer" [Wishlist,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/121301
<pygi> does anyone here use banshee? I'm considering updating it
<TheMuso> norsetto: It says fix committed. Whats the problem?
<norsetto> TheMuso: its commited because the package is ready for upload, but if nobody uploads it.....
<TheMuso> norsetto: Gotcha. Will have a look after cheese is done.
* Hobbsee wonders if we can actually *get* to the packages on REVU.
<norsetto> TheMuso: I don't know if you can with REVU down?
* Hobbsee was under the impression that we couldnt
<TheMuso> ah its on revu... right
<norsetto> TheMuso: I can just pack up .dsc .diff.gz and orig.tar.gz and upload it somewhere if it may help
<TheMuso> norsetto: Yes, it would, if they are the same as what was on revu.
<norsetto> TheMuso: they are, but have my word only for that
<TheMuso> Yeah true.
<norsetto> TheMuso: I think you actually reviewed it yourself (but might be worng), I remember Emmet and Daniel (Emmet was ready to upload but we wanted to have upstream correct a couple of things, which they did)
<TheMuso> Ah ok.
<TheMuso> Without revu its hard to know exactly where things stand.
<TheMuso> I don't think new package freeze is for a while yet anyway.
<norsetto> TheMuso: indeed
<TheMuso> But don't hold me to that.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: in that case, i'd just sanitycheck the package again, and upload it.
<TheMuso> Ok.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: because we know that norsetto's stuff is good anyway.  people can always audit again after it hits the repos, if the advocaters were incorrect
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Very true.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: this si where the "follow the idea of the law, not the letter of the law" comes in
* norsetto hugs Hobbsee and TheMuso
<TheMuso> yep
* Hobbsee hugs norsetto
<TheMuso> pygi: Just running cheese through a test build.
<norsetto> sorry to be pain, its just a waste to have it let go
<TheMuso> norsetto: Not at all.
<TheMuso> Since REVU has been down, new package work has kinda crumbled.
<TheMuso> And it will be nice to get a GNOME frontend for mplayer in.
<TheMuso> IMO
<norsetto> :-)
<norsetto> I shouldn't say it perhaps, but I think upstream did a nice job, and they responded very quickly too (which I can't say of some others....)
<norsetto> :-X
<TheMuso> norsetto: Great.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: it'd be worth at least discussing a delay in new package freeze, due to REVU down
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Yeah it would.
<RAOF> Hobbsee: A special "rpath must die" build of miro is now starting...
<TheMuso> RAOF: heh
<pygi> TheMuso, oki, did that, but I know you have to test :)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: \o/
<TheMuso> pygi: I am sure you did, but it doesn't hurt.
<pygi> TheMuso, yup, I know =)
<TheMuso> bah. Dep problems for my chroot.
* TheMuso updates.
<pygi> TheMuso, sorry ^_^
<TheMuso> pygi: Its not your fault.
<TheMuso> pygi: My chroot needs an update. Usually once a day is enough. :)
<pygi> TheMuso, yea, but you have to bug yourself with such stuff because of me :p
<RAOF> Fun fact of the day: miro pulls in libxcb as a build-dep.
<TheMuso> back later. Dinner.
<Hobbsee> yay, bug squished.
<jussi01> Hobbsee: YAY! which one?
<Hobbsee> jussi01: the one in my assignment
<RAOF> Hobbsee: New miro package on cooperteam.net.  Now with 100% less rpath.
<jussi01> grrr, I hate revu being down...
* TheMuso returns
<TheMuso> norsetto: I'll get to gnome-mplayer shortly. Was just at dinner.
<jussi01> wb TheMuso
<TheMuso> Still need to get cheese done.
<norsetto> TheMuso: take it easy Luke!
<TheMuso> heh
<StevenK> TheMuso: Cheese?
<TheMuso> StevenK: A package that pygi wanted uploaded.
<jussi01> can someone remind me where to find the "new" queue?
* norsetto was tempted to use the starwars phrase, but restrained.....
<StevenK> jussi01: launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+queue
<jussi01> thanks StevenK
<jussi01> hmm, is there a way to grab a package from the new queue?
<jussi01> gday jono
<jono> hey
<TheMuso> norsetto: Was it you who was enquiring about banshee? If so, it was jst synce.
<TheMuso> synced
<norsetto> banshee!? no
<TheMuso> Ah ok.
<TheMuso> Must have been pygi.
<TheMuso> norsetto: Ok looks like I can move onto gnome-mplayer for now, as I need to talk to pygi about something with his package. Have you got a URL to the upstream tarball, and a way to get the diff and the dsc to me?
<norsetto> I have the tarball here: http://www.webalice.it/norsetto but I have to activate the site .....
<TheMuso> ok
<norsetto> and of course the bloody thing refuses to like Konqueror....
<TheMuso> haha
<TheMuso> norsetto: Sorry, got to run for now but will be back very soon
<norsetto> TheMuso: do you know perhaps another web hosting site I can use?
<norsetto> TheMuso: ok, see you soon
<TheMuso> norsetto: Ok I'm back.
<norsetto> OK, I just put up a page in a hurry, now I have to make a correct link :-)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: cool
<Hobbsee> !
<Hobbsee> RAOF: cool!  but with 200% more crack?
<norsetto> TheMuso: it should be OK, can you try?
<TheMuso> norsetto: Ok. The above URL?
<norsetto> yes, or directly http://www.webalice.it/norsetto/gnome-mplayer.tar.gz
<TheMuso> norsetto: Got it.
<TheMuso> Downloaded and unpacking now.
<norsetto> really appreciate what you are doing Luke
<TheMuso> thanks
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Well, not terribly more crack. :)
* norsetto bearhugs TheMotu
<Hobbsee> RAOF: :)
<norsetto> TheMotu :-) haha
<TheMuso> heh
* norsetto should stop smoking that strange black herb .....
<TheMuso> ROFL
<Zombie> Well.
<Zombie> I'd still like to negotiate.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: ROFL!
<Hobbsee> # RPATH must die!
<Hobbsee> find debian/miro/usr/lib -iname '*.so*' -exec chrpath -d '{}' \;
<Hobbsee> that's almost as good as #LETS RUN AUTOHELL AGAIN
<RAOF> Ok, I could be a *tiny* bit more descriminate :)
<TheMuso> RAOF: Like ensuring that the files you are changing are shared objects, and are actually files.
<StevenK> Hobbsee: I've got a comment in code at work that reads # Eyes closed now  ; no strict 'subs' ; .... ; # Eyes open. If you can read this, you cheated.
<TheMuso> heh
<Hobbsee> RAOF: i like it :)
<Hobbsee> StevenK: hehe :)
<TheMuso> Oh lovely. Broken gnome deps, same issue as with pygi's package.
<ajmitch> hello
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch.  please work your magic on the queue
<TheMuso> Hey ajmitch.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: what magic?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: the "removing things from the default view of the queue"
<ajmitch> oh, you mean 'mark all as invalid'
<ajmitch> can do
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: or actually upload bits, too
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: the trouble is, if you mark them invalid, someone always goes and unmarks them.
<norsetto> TheMuso: Broken gnome deps? Its gnome-mplayer?
* ajmitch loves the detailed explanation in comments on bug 132694
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 132694 in ddclient "Please sync ddclient (3.7.3-2) from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132694
<TheMuso> norsetto: Somethign in the gnome stack is broken, package wise
<Kmos> ajmitch: it's mine :) lol
<ajmitch> Kmos: yes, and it's not particularly informative
<norsetto> TheMuso: OK, I just rebuild it before uploading, just to make sure, and didn see any problem
<TheMuso> hmmm ok
<Kmos> i'm member of ddclient project, i talked to debian maintainer to update things there, you can also check the changelog
<Kmos> what want more?
<Kmos> ajmitch: i don't understand what need more.. "Why?" is not so informative too
<Kmos> last ddclient packages for ubuntu are done by myself.
<ajmitch> Kmos: the 'why?' is 'why can each of the ubuntu changes be dropped?'
<ajmitch> stating that all changes are now included in debian is helpful
<Kmos> ajmitch: I know that..
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: i think we should have keybuk processing syncs again.  Kmos would get eaten.
<ajmitch> preferably listing the changes
<ajmitch> heh
<Hobbsee> RAOF:
<Hobbsee> W: miro: script-not-executable ./usr/share/python-support/miro/miro/feedparser.p                                                          y
<Hobbsee> W: miro: script-not-executable ./usr/share/python-support/miro/miro/coverage.py
<Hobbsee> W: miro: script-not-executable ./usr/share/python-support/miro/miro/timetemplate                                                          s.py
<Hobbsee> ew, that pasted badly
<Kmos> Hobbsee: i don't know keybuk
<ajmitch> be glad
<Hobbsee> yes, be glad.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: nah, I think iwj would have more fun
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: i've only ever had keybuk yelling at me about merges.
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Ok, lintian clean it is.  Right
<Hobbsee> sorry, sync requests
<Hobbsee> RAOF: sorry?
* RAOF rolls up his sleeves.
<TheMuso> If you are in keybuk's good books, he is an absolutely rockin guy. But get in his bad books, as already said........
<Hobbsee> RAOF: well, it sometimes can be useful :)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: (got that from running it on the binaries)
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: keybuk didnt have that much of a go at me.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I haven't experienced it myself, but seen one or two responses of his on bug reports.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: colin's are more fun.
<Kmos> i like more dr.house =)
<TheMuso> Yes, but Colin's seem to feel different to me. His reports feel more quietlyand sternly advising rather than yelling.
<TheMuso> I can't imagine Colin ever shouting.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: on some of them...i can :P
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> such interesting people
* Hobbsee also finds it hard to tell if he's teasing, or telling me off, in person
<Kmos> bug 132694
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 132694 in ddclient "Please sync ddclient (3.7.3-2) from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132694
<Kmos> more complete now ?
<TheMuso> Ah I see the problem.
<TheMuso> dbus is broken.
<Riddell> superm1: ping, mythbuntu-meta has a GPL 3 COPYING file but debian/copyright says GPL 2
<Riddell> superm1: I'd downgrade it to GPL 2+ so code can be shared with other -meta packages
<ajmitch> Kmos: looking at the ubuntu history of the package, I'm seeing previous changes that have been dropped
<Kmos> ajmitch: i only see one.. sample file for ubuntu
<Kmos> the others are to be fixed on ubuntu package, but are already on debian one
<ajmitch> Kmos: I'm referring to ones dropped in the current package by you, such as dh_installinit & ddclient.init changes
<Hobbsee> Kmos: listen to him.  he's a core dev.
<Kmos> Hobbsee: i'm listening..
<Hobbsee> Kmos: he knows what he's talking about
<Kmos> ajmitch: it's members.dyndns.org the correct one. only need to refer to dydns.com when it's about the main website/project.
<Kmos> so it had some problems with members.dyndns.com that's with my last package
<Kmos> and now fixed on debian
<ajmitch> ok, I see that your previous upload didn't drop them, you just didn't mention them in the changelog. This sync *would* drop those changes
<ajmitch> -       dh_installinit -u multiuser
<ajmitch> +       dh_installinit
<Kmos> ajmitch: yep..
<Kmos> and fix them
<ajmitch> why would you revert that change I just pasted?
<Kmos> that's on debian package?
<Kmos> i didn't touch that
<ajmitch> and you're saying that it can be dropped
<ajmitch> just because you didn't make that change recently doesn't mean that it wasn't made earlier on, and still worth keeping
<Kmos> so I need to do a merge
<Kmos> but today is UVF
<ajmitch> yep
<Kmos> so can't do it
<Kmos> ?
<ajmitch> why not?
* ajmitch isn't sure when things are meant to freeze
<ajmitch> or if they already have
<ajmitch> I'm no longer on the motu-uvf team :)
<StevenK> Denied. So nyah.
* StevenK chuckles
<ajmitch> haha
<Zombie> Does Ubuntu have a PLF Branch?
<Kmos> StevenK: ok :)
<Kmos> so I can set bug to Invalid ?
<StevenK> Kmos: I was joking - feel free to merge it and ask for sponsorship.
<Kmos> :)
* ajmitch should go to bed now
<Kmos> ajmitch: good night
<ajmitch> night
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: the freeze is just before the meeting, iirc
<jmg> nooo
<Hobbsee> jmg: run!
<jmg> i need to up elisa 0.3
<jmg> but revu is still down\
<Hobbsee> get going, then.
<Hobbsee> jmg: i'm planning to ask for a delay of new package freeze, due to REVU.
<jmg> they can freeze main
<Hobbsee> jmg: also, we'll take stuff that was filed before UVF, but wasnt processed before then, at our discression.
<Hobbsee> jmg: i dont think it "freezes" per se - as in, with the upload manager required approval
<Hobbsee> it's more of a trust thing
<Fujitsu> Yeah, we can still upload new UVs as normal, but we might get murdered for it.
<norsetto> neah, just tortured ....
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: attacked with the Long Pointy Stick of DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! , etc.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: in theory, i'd like for the restriction to go away for the current MOTUs.
<Fujitsu> That's the one.
<jmg> i waited in #elisa for the supposed umc meeting but it never came
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Why so?
<Fujitsu> Why? Because they're likely to be more sane?
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: exactly
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: part of being a MOTU is that you're sane about uploading things, and not breaking them.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: So am I getting this right? You are saying the UVF team should only be for non-motus?
<Hobbsee> and if some people cant be responsible with that, then lets throw them off the team until they can do this.
<TheMuso> Is that a bit unfair for them?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i'm getting to that.  the non-MOTU's need sponsorship anyway.  surely the MOTU's who are uploading can look at the proposed upload, and see if it's sane or not.  see the previous part.
<TheMuso> Fair enough.
<Hobbsee> of course, you then have to have a procedure for throwing said people out for a while, which is doable.
<TheMuso> Yes.
<Hobbsee> they can apply like anyone else - as one of the criteria is not uploading things when they shouldnt be
<Hobbsee> and this is testable by the stuff that they upload for sponsorship
<jmg> http://thoughtcrime.org.nz/~cartel/elisa/ source going up now (unsigned)
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: TheMuso in the longer term, we're going to have lots more sponsorees, and only a few MOTU's.  we need to spread our resources in the best way
<TheMuso> Yep fair enough.
<jmg> im working on a dvd plugin that doesnt depend on fluendo
<jmg> upload done
<jmg> has anyone seen uzuul
<norsetto> TheMuso: I'm going for lunch, is there anything I could/should do about gnome-mplayer?
<harrisony> !seen uzuul
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen uzuul - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<harrisony> hmm thought the bot had seen
<TheMuso> norsetto: No. Dbus is broken, and I just set up a pbuilder to build the package, which seems to avoid init scripts bein gstarted.
<TheMuso> so just test installing now.
<Hobbsee> harrisony: /msg seenserv seen
<norsetto> TheMuso: ok
<harrisony> Hobbsee, it was for jmg  :P
<Hobbsee> jmg: ^
<Hobbsee> harrisony: true.
<TheMuso> hmm. Ok gnome-mplayer looks good. I'll upload.
<harrisony> sbuild vs pbuilder
* norsetto dances and sings out loud
* norsetto tries to convince TheMuso to dance with him
* norsetto tells to TheMuso that he is not such a big dancer but loves him nonetheless
<TheMuso> heh
* harrisony dances with norsetto 
* norsetto thinks its a wild night :-)
<Kmos> harrisony: i like more pbuilder :)
* Hobbsee prefers pbuilder
* Hobbsee hides away from all the dancing
* Kmos can dance disco music? =)
* norsetto wonders why kmos and hobbsee are retiring in that dark corner ....
<Hobbsee> no, no, Kmos is in a different corner to me
* Hobbsee is in the card playing corner, playing Mao.
<Kmos> norsetto: she don't like me :-) what you've suggested
<Kmos> oh god
* TheMuso prefers sbuild, except when package init script fail to start properly.
<harrisony> quick little thing Kmos and Hobbsee why pbuilder and TheMuso why sbuild
<harrisony> wait errr not Kmos :P
<Hobbsee> sbuild likes falling over randomly.
<Fujitsu> sbuild doesn't fall over on me.
* harrisony is going to try this cowbuilder thing 
<RAOF> NOr me
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Does sbuild prevent package init script from starting? Or, is it supposed to?
<azeem> you could set policy-rc.d in the chroot I guess
<azeem> I don't think sbuild prevents init scripts from running
<Kmos> harrisony: i'm not black, you can ask me :) lol
<Kmos> but not now.. shower time!
<harrisony> Kmos, sbuild vs pbuilder vs other
<harrisony> hmm, im meeting up with the girl i like before school tomorrow so i better get to bed and sleep!!! night all
<TheMuso> haha
<TheMuso> harrisony: Good luck.
<Kmos> that's a better idea :) else she get bad like Hobbsee sometimes with me
<Kmos> :)
<harrisony> TheMuso, :P gotta prepare the icing on the cake then im gonna ask her out sometime next week or when i think the icing is done :)
<TheMuso> haha
<Hobbsee> :)
<Kmos> harrisony: take a compiler error with you.. else you can understand her
<Kmos> *can't
<Kmos> lolol
<harrisony> hah
<TheMuso> Ok. Time to process uus.
<harrisony> why is #ubuntu-love-advice empty! ok now im sleeping!!
<stiV> hi everyone i have my own debian mirror, (self signed etc...) and some own packages. the packages work fine, except one package has an initscript that starts/stops a daemon. (perl) the problem is when i upgrade the package and the daemon is already running when the script tries to start it or already stopped when it tries to stot it the last thing i see is "Hangup". and the package configure fails
<stiV> the "Hangup" does not come from the initscript - when i do this manually (stopping multiple times, starting multiple times) everything works ok --- if running, it tells me and if already stopped in tells me that too.
<stiV> exit status is always 0 (checked by echoing $? right after the commands)
<stiV> anyone have a suggestion how i can get my postinst script to ignore this and just go one (everything works if i remove that starting part, but i want it to do that...!)
<stiV> "go one" = "go on"
<stiV> ah and i tried to remove the "set -e" --> doesn't help
* RAOF puts down the crack pipe and realizes that miro doesn't *build* 2.4 packages!
<RAOF> So, we're down to "missing manpage for miro.real"
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Is ^^^ a blocker?
<ScottK> RAOF: Why doens't is build 2.4 packages?
<RAOF> ScottK: Because libboost-python doesn't build 2.4 packages.
<ScottK> Hmmm
<ScottK> That's OK I guess then.
<RAOF> ScottK: This is also the reason there is no Debian miro package yet.  Debian's libboost-python is *also* built against 2.5, but some of miro's other dependencies aren't built against 2.5 yet.
<ScottK> You ought to be able whip out a man page in about 5 minutes.  I'd say just get it done.
<RAOF> Upshot is: Democracy/miro is broken in debian, not Ubuntu.  Yay for not having to do the python 2.5 transition again!
<RAOF> Ok.  Man page before bed!
<ScottK> Yeah.  If it's only 2.5 it wouldn't work so well in Debian just now.
<miles_> hello all
<harrisony> !hi | miles_
<ubotu> miles_: Hi! Welcome to #ubuntu-motu!
<ScottK> stiV: Are you stopping the package in a pre-inst before you upgrade?
<Hobbsee> RAOF: well, it's gutsy, which we do with 2.5, so no
<miles_> do any of you guys want to be my mentor?
<stiV> the init script is being inserted via debhelpter - so yes it is being stopped (and even if not - i don't want the package to care about that). i found out what the problem is, but i don't know how to solve it: the debhelpter is starting the script using invoke-rc.d (which is ok, i know) - BUT invoke-rc.d returns an exit status of "129", while using /etc/init.d/bla always returns 0 (which i want it to do)
<RAOF> Actually, is there any particular reason not to link the miro & miro.real man pages?  How do you do that?
<Hobbsee> RAOF: i doubt it
<Hobbsee> RAOF: no idea how to, though
<ScottK> stiV: Since debhelper doesn't normally exit 129, my advice would be to figure out why it's doing that and not paper over the problem.
<stiV> the problem is i have no idea how to find out why it's doing that, the script works and does everything i need (starting, stopping, telling if it is already started or stopped, ...)
<stiV> i haven't used invoke-rc.d until now *g*
<ScottK> RAOF: The actual content of the man page doesn't need to be much more than something like miro.real is part of the miro package.  It does X.  For more details see Y.
<stiV> i ALWAYS get exit status 129 from invoke-rc.d, even if the daemon got started or stopped. the last output is always "Hangup", right after the line that tells me what happened (started, stopped, ...)
<stiV> and google isn't helping w. exit status 129 from invoke-rc.d
<stiV> it's no the fault of the debhelper script, invoke-rc.d exits with a bad exit status - i just don't know why. any idea how i could find out?? (as i said - everything WORKS, no errors from the daemon, just the "wrong" exit status)
<ScottK> stiV: The man page says, "invoke-rc.d always returns the status code returned by the init script."
<Hobbsee> norsetto: is it OK by you if i reject your REVU down mail?  it probably more belongs on MOTU ML, and you know the answer nwo anyway
<stiV> but if i start the initscript using /etc/init.d/blub start|stop i always get 0
<xxxxx1> mornin'
<ScottK> stiV: Is there anything in the init script that would cause exit 129?
<stiV> hm i have to look - its starting a perl Daemon::Generic
<stiV> but as i said - this should always return 0. crap
<ScottK> My advice is to look into that and understand it.
<ScottK> Should, but isn't.
<norsetto> Hobbsee: sorry, was having lunch.... what REVU down mail?
<Hobbsee> norsetto: the one you sent to ubuntu-devel@
<norsetto> I didn't sent any mail to ubuntu-devel!?
<RAOF> Hobbsee: New, 100% lintian & linda clean miro package.
<RAOF> Now with added manpage goodness.
<Hobbsee> woot!
<TheMuso> RAOF: You advertisement junky.
<norsetto> somebody has been sending email with my address????
<RAOF> Also, 50% less crappy testing framework files shipped.
<RAOF> And 20% more less!
<Hobbsee> norsetto: oh, bah.  same first name.
<norsetto> ha!
<norsetto> bloody italians ... all alike :-)
<Hobbsee> hehe :
<Hobbsee> * :)
<Hobbsee> Hi all there,
<Hobbsee> I should upload on Revu a new version of the sdlmame package, but I see the
<Hobbsee> usual site is down.
<Hobbsee> Does anyone know if it did move elsewhere or I should simply wait for it to
<Hobbsee> be back online?
<norsetto> sdlmame rings a bell; there was a guy whose name was Cesare Franco if I remember it correctly
* Hobbsee discards, and posts a link to the revu thread
<Hobbsee> yeah
<Hobbsee> http://tinyurl.com/27v8fn
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:Hobbsee] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | http://ubuntu.joejaxx.org/ - TOP 10 Uploaders/Packages | REVU likely down for the next few days - See http://tinyurl.com/27v8fn for details
<TheMuso> ScottK: UVF is not yet in effect.
<ScottK> OK.  What time is it then?  If someone is going to go to the trouble if filing UVFe requests, then the least I can do is complain about their inadequacy.
<POX_> RAOF: can I have a link to miro.*\.dsc file?
<TheMuso> ScottK: I believe it comes into effect a bit before the dev team meeting.
<ScottK> OK.
<RAOF> POX_: Certainly.
* RAOF hunts
<RAOF> POX_: http://cooperteam.net/miro_0.9.8.1-0ubuntu1.dsc
<POX_> thanks
<RAOF> POX_: Since I don't remember seeing you here before, I presume that's not for a review & sponsor :)
<POX_> I can upload to Debian :)
<RAOF> Ah.
<RAOF> That won't work on debian, you know.
<RAOF> python versions and all.
<POX_> it will
<RAOF> I wouldn't have packaged miro if it could be done in debian.
<RAOF> POX_: Allow me to be skeptical :)
<POX_> I already sponsored python2.5 & libboost-python pacakes
<RAOF> POX_: And all the other packages that miro depends on?
<POX_> s/pacakes/packages
<RAOF> POX_: You're not Uwe by any chance?
<POX_> dunno what miro depends on... yet
<POX_> no
<POX_> see /whois POX_
<ScottK> RAOF: POX is a DD.  If he says he can upload it to Debian, I'd believe him.
<RAOF> POX_: It depends on everything that democracyplayer depends on.
<RAOF> I'll dig up the BTS links for you, if you like.
<RAOF> Oh, I wasn't skeptical about his ability to upload to Debian, I've got no reason to be.
<RAOF> Just that it'll *work* :)
<RAOF> If so, awesome.
<POX_> I'm at work now, but I can send you few comments without building it, though
<ScottK> But it's a successor to Democracyplayer.  Is working even relevant?
<RAOF> POX_: I'm all ears.
<RAOF> (The bug I'm thinking of is http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=430659 by the way)
<ubotu> Debian bug 430659 in democracyplayer "ImportError: /usr/lib/libboost_python-gcc41-mt-1_34.so.1.34.0: undefined symbol: Py_InitModule4_64" [Grave,Open] 
<POX_> RAOF: debian/menu -> change section to "Applications/Network/Web News"
<RAOF> Done.
<norsetto> I just merged imlib yesterday, and now checking the package status I see bug 70367. I could have patched this yesterday ..... do you guys think this is worth updating that package?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 70367 in imlib "imlib1 does not correctly handle 32-bit visuals" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/70367
<POX_> debian/pyversions: change it to "2.5-" unless it will not work with python2.6 once it will be default in Uuntu
<POX_> Ubuntu
<RAOF> POX_: It won't work against anything but the version of python that libboost-python is built against.
<RAOF> POX_: And that's 2.5
<RAOF> At least at the moment.  Also, doesn't 2.5- mean "2.5 or less", rather than 2.5 or 2.6?
<ScottK> norsetto: I'd say yes.
<POX_> RAOF: no, it means 2.5 and all greater versions
<norsetto> ScottK: ok
<RAOF> Wow.  Unintuitive.
<RAOF> Also odd, since I've seen 2.5- build against 2.5 & 2.4.
<RAOF> Maybe I should have a closer look at them.
<RAOF> Maybe it's my crappy memory again :)
<zul> oh yeah its uvf time isnt it?
* RAOF finally groks it.
<Hobbsee> in some hours, yes
<ScottK> RAOF: python-support and python-central have different pyversions syntax.
<RAOF> Yeah, that's part of what confused me.
<ScottK> That may be what's confusing you.
<ScottK> ;-)
<POX_> RAOF: add "[i386 hurd-i386 netbsd-i386 kfreebsd-i386] " next to python-psyco in Suggests:
<RAOF> Also, it's my table-top wargaming geek coming out :)
<RAOF> Since it's only built there, check.
<RAOF> MOTUs: there's no problem with having the useless arch's in there, right?
<ScottK> No, there isn't
<RAOF> Good, didn't think so.
<ScottK> We get stuff with archs we don't have from Debian all the time.
<RAOF> POX_: Unless libboost-python is fixed to build against more than one python version at once, miro won't work on more than one python version at once.  So the 2.5 rather than 2.5- is justified?
<POX_> yes
* RAOF tests the "miro will work in sid" hypothesis.
<RAOF> Heh, not *my* packages, they won't :)
<POX_> RAOF: it will fail on firefox-dev build-dep
<RAOF> Yup.  And the python-dev, too.
<RAOF> Since that should only pull in 2.4, yes?
<POX_> yep, you can change it to python-all-dev or python2.5-dev since you have "2.5" in pyversions anyway
<RAOF> Yeah.
<RAOF> Hm, something's pulling in python2.4 dev.  I wonder what it is.
<RAOF> You know what would be awesome?  If firefox finally built against libxul, so we didn't need this crazy "firefox-dev" package. :)
<POX_> RAOF: will send you more comments later, need to go now
<RAOF> POX_: Thanks.
<RAOF> And I'll be off to bed.
<xxxxx1> who is on u-u-s today?
<TheMuso> xxxxx1: Got a bug you would particularly like attention given to?
<xxxxx1> bug 66940
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 66940 in psi "Psi version string presents as "Debian testing/unstable" on Dapper" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/66940
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Looks like you'll be getting a UVFe for miro, unless you want to sponsor the package now and upload a new package addressing the comments later :)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: no, that's OK.
<RAOF> Cool.
<RAOF> Good night all!
* TheMuso has a quick look.
<xxxxx1> TheMuso, cool
<Hobbsee> night RAOF
* Hobbsee is happy enough to accept bugs that have been filed before UVF, but not processed, at the UVF team's/uploader's discression.
<ScottK> RAOF: It's a new package, right?
<ScottK> We aren't at the new package freeze yet.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: er, it'll sit in binary NEW, i guess, yes.
<Hobbsee> and source new
<Hobbsee> ScottK: it's a package rename
<ScottK> Point.
<tsmithe> man-di, ping? sorry to bug you again, (and the dreaded but), but i'm wondering about wired :)
<zul> i guess the motu utf team should get together sometime
<ScottK> Agreed.
<norsetto> ScootK: I'm uploading a patch that fixes bug 70367. It is a patch against imlib_1.9.15-3ubuntu1 which is not yet in the archives (uploaded few hours ago). Is it ok or do you want me to do a patch against the version presently in the archives?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 70367 in imlib "imlib1 does not correctly handle 32-bit visuals" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/70367
<bddebian> Heya gang
<norsetto> hey bd
<bddebian> Hi norsetto
<norsetto> bddebian: you owe a new pair of shoes by the way .....
<bddebian> I owe a new pair of shoes?
<norsetto> bddebian: yeah, I don't know why but when somebody mentions the word bzr you puke
<bddebian> Haha
<norsetto> bddebian: now I know :-)
<norsetto> ScottK: I'm uploading a patch that fixes bug 70367. It is a patch against imlib_1.9.15-3ubuntu1 which is not yet in the archives (uploaded few hours ago). Is it ok or do you want me to do a patch against the version presently in the archives?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 70367 in imlib "imlib1 does not correctly handle 32-bit visuals" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/70367
<ScottK> norsetto: I'd wait until the new one is in just to be sure.  It's not a rush.
<norsetto> ScottK: ok, so I just upload this. thx
* TheMuso gets ready for bed while waiting for two packages to build.
<xxxxx1> hey bddebian :)
<bddebian> Heya xxxxx1
* norsetto steers away from bddebian and 5x1 ....
* AndyP investigates the disappearence of python-syck
* ScottK titivates (that is an actual word) the dkim-milter init scripts.
<AndyP> ScottK: nice word, i'll have to use it some time
<TheMuso> I'm outa here folks. Good luck with getting in new upstream stuff before the freeze.
<norsetto> TheMuso: by Luke, many thanks again!
<TheMuso> norsetto: Welcome.
<DarkSun88> TheMuso: Thanks a lot for you uploads :)
<TheMuso> DarkSun88: No problem.
* norsetto thinks it was a worthy day: two new words in his vocabulary :-)
<pygi> TheMuso, thanks for the upload, but why didn't you mark as fix released? :)
<ScottK> pygi: Did you have the bug listed in debian/changelog?
<pygi> ScottK, not really, why would I? I requested review & upload of package?
<ScottK> Ah.
<ScottK> If the bug number is in debian/changelog then it gets automatically fix released when it's published.
<ScottK> If you do it manually, most people wait until the package has built.
<pygi> right, it's built anyway ^_^
<ScottK> Then go ahead and mark it fix released.
* pygi should probably wait sparc build, but oh well
<pygi> ScottK, ok, thanks :)
<ScottK> No problem.
<asac> who cares for listen? was that pochu ?
<asac> pygi: can we make a bzr branch for swfdec ?
<bddebian> Noooo
<norsetto> there he goes again; thanks guys for pronouncing the b word....
* bddebian cleans off his shoes
<norsetto> LOL
<bddebian> Man I am having problems re-entering the fold.. Sheesh
<pef> hello
<bddebian> Heya pef
<LucidFox> qca2 is finally in, it seems
<LucidFox> how many hours remain until UVF?
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya geser
<joejaxx> hello bddebian geser
<bddebian> LucidFox: I have already requested a sync of psi if that is what you are thinking :-)
<joejaxx> :)
<bddebian> Heya joejaxx
<LucidFox> bddebian> yes, but the wrong version ^_^
<geser> Hi joejaxx
<LucidFox> Debian has 0.11~rc2-2 now
<LucidFox> (as opposed to 0.11~rc2-1)
<LucidFox> Dang
<LucidFox> As always, I write without reading first
<bddebian> LucidFox: I know but do you know that -2 builds and works.  There was an issue last time I looked at it
<LucidFox> Ah. So let -1 be synced then.
<LucidFox> By the way, how did you know I meant psi?
<mathiaz> hi. I'm working on bug 85194
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 85194 in samba "samba's package postinst script shouldn't return an error if samba daemon can't be started (e.g. if smb.conf file is incorrect or is removed)" [Medium,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85194
<mathiaz> What's the proper way to report an warning from the postinst script ?
<bddebian> LucidFox: I was finishing a build of psi and looking at your bug when you asked about qca2 :-)
<LucidFox> What happens to packages in NEW after UVF? Are they all discarded?
<Hobbsee> LucidFox: they should get processed as normal, if htey were uploaded before new package freeze
<LucidFox> ok
<cypherbios> the today's freeze is only for main or it is for universe too?
<Hobbsee> it's both
<xxxxx1> hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi xxxxx1
<bddebian> Gawd I hate building huge packages for small fixes
<geser> bddebian: are huge changes on huge packages better?
<bddebian> At least they seem more worthwhile :-)
* AndyP wonders what the biggest package in universe is
<Hobbsee> ia32libs, iirc
<norsetto> don't know about size, but the Haskell stuff was a pretty long build .....
<geser> Size: 227430088 (from nexuiz-data)
<bddebian> Eeks
<bddebian> Oh, thanks, that reminds me.. starsomething-data package..
<AndyP> wow, ia32-libs is ~375MB
<AndyP> (source)
<bddebian> eeks
<AndyP> builds to a 25MB deb though
<norsetto> vaporware .....
<Hobbsee> there's something...wrong...about that.
<geser> AFAIK it is build from i386 debs which means it also needs to include the source code for the debs in the source package
<AndyP> it does sound rather ugly
<pef> http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/autopkgtest-output/gutsy/screem/log
<pef> does someone has an idea what "expected specifier-qualifier-list before" gcc error means ?
<pef> it causes screem to FTBFS
<geser> pef: have you the source code and can look up the mentioned line?
<pef> geser, yes
<pef> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/33952/
<AndyP> it probably can't find the GtkTooltips symbol so it thinks it's meant to be a new symbol and wants a specifier-qualifier list before it... probably a missing include or an API change (?)
<pef> AndyP, I will look at the gtk api :)
<pef> afk
<geser> pef: drop the -DGTK_DISABLE_DEPRECATED from the gcc call
<geser> AndyP: gtk 2.11 marked some API parts as deprecated but can still be used if you don't disable deprecated functions
<bddebian> Ahh it feels so good to be useless again :-)
<AndyP> geser: thought it might be something like that
<AndyP> bddebian: more than usual? ;)
<bddebian> Exactly :-)
<geser> AndyP: I had already the same problem with building ardour, so I know the solution now :)
<RainCT> can somebody check this please? http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/33954/  (manpage for pbuilder-dist)
<AndyP> geser: so that's the secret of your genius :)
<norsetto> RainCT: open invaders ;-)
<geser> RainCT: line 21: there is a p missing before "builder-feisty"
<RainCT> norsetto: :)
<RainCT> geser: thanks, fixed that
<norsetto> RainCT: in withlog/nolog, I think by overriden you really mean overwritten
<RainCT> norsetto: true, thx.
<norsetto> RainCT: and "On August 2007 it was mainly rewritten" I guess is "On August 2007 it was mostly rewritten"?
<norsetto> RainCT: on the Synopsis [...]  means what? that you can repeat the operation option as many times as you want?
<RainCT> norsetto: no, that there can be more stuff. for example when the operation is build, a .dsc file needs to be specified
<norsetto> RainCT: right, so you should mention that too?
<RainCT> ok
<RainCT> is 'specify' correct or is it 'specificate'?
<norsetto> RainCT: NAME:  open-invaders - wrapper to use pbuilder with many different versions of Ubuntu / Debian; perhaps you could shorten it to NAME: pbuilder-dist - multi-distribution pbuilder wrapper (or similar)?
<norsetto> RainCT: I would say specify (but I'm not a native English speaker)
<pef> geser, are theses flags disabled by buildds ?
<pef> geser, you rocks, I've disable all DISABLED* flags, and it compiles fine :)
<cypherbios> What are the possible reasons for the Build-Depends in debian/control being ignored by debuild?
<pygi> asac, sure we can
<pygi> asac, you here?
<norsetto> RainCT: I like this "This  manual  page  was  written ...  for YOU" :-)
<asac> pygi: sorry ... lost context ... what did i ask? :-D
<pygi> asac, can we open a swfdec bzr branch. Personally I'd make ubuntu-flash team, and have all branches in there
<pygi> asac, but that would be tomorrow tasks because I'm *ultimately* tired now :(
<asac> pygi: k ... cu then
<norsetto> is bddebian gone!?
* bddebian is busy vomiting in the bathroom
<pygi> asac, we can maintain gnash branch there as well then :) CU :)
<norsetto> ah! was worrying ....
<zul> thanks thats probably too much information
<highvolt1ge> gnash ftw
<bddebian> zul: inside joke with norsetto
<norsetto> ROTFL
<RainCT> norsetto: do you know how I can escape the points? \. doesn't work
<norsetto> RainCT: it should, where is that?
<RainCT> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/33957/ line 51
<RainCT> @ norsetto
<norsetto> RainCT: why not just using \fB[...] \fP?
<RainCT> norsetto: it doesn't display it neither
<norsetto> RainCT: strange, it is displayed on my machine
<RainCT> norsetto: ah, right. with [ and ]  it does
<norsetto> RainCT: what is strange is that it is not aligned properly
<RainCT> norsetto: well.. a .br does it
<RainCT> norsetto: do the examples look ok for you?
<norsetto> RainCT: looks fine; but why do you say ", and cant be changed" for the default amd64?
<norsetto> gotta go, wife is calling!
<RainCT> norsetto: because on the bottom it says The default value of all optional parameters can be changed by editing the first lines of the
<RainCT> script.
<RainCT> norsetto: ok. thanks for your help :)
<RainCT> how can I tell CDBS where the manpages are?
<nixternal> if I use XS-Vcs-Svn, do I have to use the Browser as well?
<ScottK> RainCT: Look at the klamav source package for an example.
<ScottK> nixternal: No.
<nixternal> thanks
<RainCT> ScottK: thanks
<ScottK> No problem.
<nwidger> hi i was wondering how to log a syncing bug for mutt to be update to the latest debian version in gutsy
<RainCT> TheMuso: can you merge ~rainct/ubuntu-dev-tools/dev into ~ubuntu-dev/ubuntu-dev-tools/trunk please?
<RainCT> oh, he is sleeping. can someone else merge them please?
<Pici> nwidger: I was looking for this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<nwidger> Pici: thanks man :)
<xxxxx1> bye all
<kompozer> hello
<kompozer> I would like to know if it's still time to propose a package for Gutsy
<kompozer> s/propose/submit
<ScottK> If it's a new package, yes.
<ScottK> It's ~2 weeks to the new package freeze.
<kompozer> ok, good
<AndyGraybeal> aah.. mark of the unicorn, this is not.
<pygi> asac, you here?
<dharrigan> Well, I've used export LD_LIBRARY_PATH to get round it for the moment
<nixternal> anyone know of a cdbs doc mirror? duck whatever is down
<pygi> asac, do you want us to have ubuntu-flash team, and there maintain mainline branches (and our personal ones) for both gnash and swfdec and flashplugin-nonfree?
<azeem> nixternal: did you check whether his documentation is included in the package nowadays, maybe?
<nixternal> azeem: :D
<nixternal> shhh, don't let anyone know I forgot it was there
<superm1> nixternal, i'm assuming you were referring to the one at: https://perso.duckcorp.org/ ?
<nixternal> ya
<azeem> his hosting is down
<nixternal> it is installed in /usr/share/doc/cdbs
<nixternal> ;)
<superm1> yea that's the one i refer to usually too
<nixternal> just not as pretty, but it is there
<bddebian> No one is working on swfdec0.5 for Gutsy are they?
<pygi> bddebian, shhhhhhh =)
<mrigns> hmm seahorse or seahorse-agent seems to break my  my debsign...
<pygi> mrigns, they always do xD
<bddebian> pygi: I'm only asking because of bug: Bug #127794
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 127794 in swfdec0.4 "new upstream version available 0.5" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127794
<pygi> bddebian, I know :)
<mrigns> pygi, did not know that, well, it sucks... waaa ;P
<bddebian> pygi: You are running out of time.. ;-)
<pygi> bddebian, mememem, :)
* pygi does it now since so much folks are bugging xD
<bddebian> pygi: I don't care either way :-)
<\sh> bddebian, do the work, dude ;)
<pygi> bddebian, assign to me pls, thank you
<AndyGraybeal> you guys are evil, i thought MOTU was an ubuntu dev's and MOTU dev's working together to make the most brilliant Audio Linuxes Boxen ever!
<\sh> AndyGraybeal, pardon?
<AndyGraybeal> then i was gonna be like.. move over Pro Tools!
<AndyGraybeal> MOTU = Mark of the Unicorn, a pro audio company (somewhat pro)
<\sh> MOTU == Master of the Universe an old cartoon series
<\sh> from the 80ies
<\sh> most children from today don't know those goodies anymore ,-)
<bddebian> heh
<AndyGraybeal> i'm that old, i understand, but at first i thought it was Mark of the Unicorn
* DktrKranz was a big fan of it :)
<\sh> hehe...I had those action dolls from them ...
<AndyGraybeal> i about pooped my pants.. debian was after all the first platform to incorporate Audio with it's purpose... demudi back in the day
<\sh> ok as well the old marvel ones too
<pygi> bddebian, thanks
<mrigns> pygi, how about gpa, does it also break debsign?
<asac> pygi: we can do that ... though I would prefer to keep release-branches in the realms that are allowed to sponsor that package
<asac> so meaning ~core-dev for main packages ~ubuntu-dev for universe packages
<pygi> asac, fine, then open a mainline branch of swfdec and flashplugin-nonfree in appropriate team (MOTU)
<asac> however we can always setup *main* branches in ~ubuntu-flash
<pygi> asac, fine, then no need for team. We'll just hold personal branches under own names ;)
<asac> that is good as well
<pygi> asac, ok, open a team then ... I'm after swfdec now :)
<asac> pygi: however for swfdec you might want to take care that we have vcs import setup
<asac> i think git should be possible
<asac> ok meeting i guess
<pygi> asac, k :)
<ajmitch> morning
<sistpoty> hi folks
<sistpoty> hi ajmitch
<ajmitch> hey sistpoty, how's it going?
<DarkSun88> Hi.
<sistpoty> so far so good, still fighting mail backlog though ;)
<ajmitch> hehe, I know that feeling ;)
<sistpoty> ajmitch: and how are you?
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch, sistpoty
<sistpoty> hey bddebian
<ajmitch> sistpoty: good thanks :)
* ajmitch should run off to work though
<sistpoty> hehe, last week when I sneaked to IRC I was late for work at the next morning *g*
<ajmitch> heh
* ajmitch will catch up with MC mail at work
<sistpoty> great!
<sistpoty> ( /me doesn't do ubuntu stuff during work, otherwise I'd not manage my time well enough to get my own work done)
<sistpoty> btw.: any news about tiber?
<ajmitch> not that I've heard yet
<sistpoty> well, I guess I'll need to visit siretart for news tomorrow then ;)
<DarkSun88> bddebian: Thanks for upload. :)
<bddebian> DarkSun88: No, thank YOU for the patch :-)
<DarkSun88> ;)
<bddebian> Wow, have I got some whopping karma these days.. :-)
<AndyP> wow, almost as bad as mine :)
<pygi> bddebian, sure it can, it's important package ;)
<bddebian> pygi: ?
<pygi> bddebian, swfdec ;)
<bddebian> Oh, pfft :)
<bddebian> They're all important to someone.. ;-P
<pygi> bddebian, shhhh!
<ajmitch> bddebian: I'm glad you've got some karma
* ajmitch has ~0
<sistpoty> ajmitch: your karma is still way bigger than mine ;)
<bddebian> ajmitch: What, the number was so big it gets an integer overflow? :-)
<ScottK> If Karma is the goal, just right a script that requestsnycs the entire archive.  For Karma, quantity is all that counts.
<ajmitch> bddebian: no, more that I've done nothing
<ajmitch> ScottK: easier to just upload rebuild-only changes :)
<ajmitch> filing a bug for each
<sistpoty> oh, do uploads add to karma nowadays?
<ScottK> That's work too.
<ajmitch> sistpoty: no
<ScottK> No, you need to file the bug.
<ajmitch> ScottK: who said you needed to test the uploads?
<sistpoty> hah, than I can't blame my low karma on not uploading anything for ages *g*
<bddebian> heh
<ScottK> Well there are certainly some who don't think it's required.
<bddebian> Did all of those [can-not-install]  bugs get auto-filed by something?
* bddebian wonders if they are talking about him
<ScottK> Yes.
<ajmitch> bddebian: yes they were probably filed automagically
<bddebian> Gads
<ajmitch> at least my bug lists aren't fired like a shotgun at launchpad
<bddebian> Hehe
<ajmitch> too many false positives there
<bddebian> Well I asked for syncs that I probably didn't need to :-(
<ScottK> Well that bot is better than some people who file lots of bugs by hand (not thinking of bddebian - glad he's back).
<ajmitch> yep
<bddebian> Suuure ScottK :)
<DarkSun88> G'night.
<sistpoty> gn8 DarkSun88
<DarkSun88> G'night sistpoty
* ajmitch really needs to spellcheck email before sending it to the MC list
<ajmitch> it doesn't look good if I send an email starting off "I've veyr happy with"...
* ajmitch blames the lagged ssh connection :)
<ScottK> Depends on what your goal is.
<sistpoty> hehe, and I always thought I were the foreign speaker ;)
<sistpoty> I guess, I could set you on moderate, ajmitch :P
<ajmitch> yeah, and I can moderate my own emails :)
<sistpoty> *g*
<ajmitch> so that'd give me a chance
<ajmitch> don't worry, I corrected the email before signing & sending
<sistpoty> good. no fighting with mailman then *g*
<ajmitch> a fairly damning review of lib{nss,pam}-ldap for main inclusion
<jmg> ajmitch: what is?
<ajmitch> just what I said
<ajmitch> they were reviewed for inclusion in main
<mohammad> hello, Do you have any estimation when revu works again? and during this period is there any possiblity to upload any packages or updates for reviewing somewhere elese? I appreciate if someone answers please :)
<sistpoty> gotta go to bed now... gn8 everyone
<bddebian> Gnight sistpoty
<norsetto> mohammad: until REVU is up again the only possibility you have is to use an hosting service
<POX_> RAOF: about miro: I restored libxul-dev dependency (you have firefox-dev) and it builded fine in Sid, pythom2.5 extension for python-gnome2 is missing in Debian though, I requested for binNMU so it should be fixed soon
<Riddell> superm1: see my message from earlier?
<superm1> Riddell, don't believe so?
<Riddell> superm1: mythbuntu-meta has GPL 3 in COPYING but debian/copyright says GPL 2
<superm1> ah yes i just looked in my log and saw
<Riddell> I'd recommend changing COPYING to GPL 2 so code can be shared with other -meta packages
<superm1> sure i'll switch that over
<superm1> Riddell, its pushed up and seen in revno 10
<superm1> Riddell, once this meta is in, how does UVF policy apply to it?
<superm1> (since it's debian native)
<Riddell> it doesn't, it's not upstream
<superm1> good.  I have a few things that may be joining it as dependencies later in its life before gutsy release.
<Riddell> uploaded
<superm1> great :). Thanks a bunch
<bddebian> Heading home, later folks
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-17
<RainCT> good night
<TheMuso> pygi: You put an LP bug in the changelog. When the package gets through, it should be closed automatically.
<pygi> TheMuso, nod, will do ;)
<pygi> asac, you still here?
<asac> a bit
<pygi> asac, ok, should I just assign universe sponsors?
<RAOF> POX_: Excellent!  So python-gnome2 was the only remaining problem?  Great.  Thanks.
<pygi> asac, or do you have time to review? ^_^
<asac> assign universe-sponsors ... if noone uploads till monday ping me and i can do it
<asac> tomorrow i have to do some catching up of other things
<pygi> asac, it'll be uploaded today I believe :) Thanks, and no worries
<pygi> asac, if I can help with anything, poke
<asac> pygi: please ensure that you have npp-tags
<asac> pygi: and flashplugin-alternative
<pygi> asac, that's for swfdec-mozilla, I know :)
<asac> otherwise please don't upload
<asac> ok
<LaserJock> helllllloooo MOTU LAND!!!
<pygi> TheMuso, willing? ^_^
<pygi> hey LaserJock !
<LaserJock> has anybody heard of an ETA on REVU?
<pygi> no ETA yet
<LaserJock> k, I was going to offer some storage space for people, but wanted to make sure it wasn't going to be up today or something
<TheMuso> pygi: I don't have time now, but I'll see it on the queue later, and will have a look.
<pygi> TheMuso, oki, thanks :)
<pygi> LaserJock, nice :)
<LaserJock> k, gotta run, cya folks
<pygi> laters
<Kmos> in a merge from debian, we should include old changelog from ubuntu too?
<RAOF> Yes
<norsetto> yes
<Kmos> thx
* nixternal kicks the hell out of this package
<ajmitch> poor package, what'd it ever do to you?
<nixternal> permissions trying to create a directory with a dirty makefile
<Kmos> in a merge, after i've done the ubuntu package from debian
<Kmos> i can do a debdiff from debian (old) to ubuntu (new) ?
<RAOF> Kmos: Yes.  That's what you're meant to do.
<killown> how do I to set flags optimization gcc in apt-build sources packages? I want to build with it flags : -O3 -march=prescott -mmmx -msse -msse2 -msse3 -mfpmath=sse -fomit-frame-pointer -pipe debian/rules  file here >> http://rafb.net/p/hKbKd144.html
* StevenK blinks
* Fujitsu hides.
* StevenK whispers 'Gentoo'
<Fujitsu> killown: Sure you don't want #gentoo?
<Fujitsu> Damn.
<killown> :/
<Kmos> RAOF: thx
<RAOF> Alternatively, the "apt-build" package can give you that special "totally unsupportable" feeling with your very own apt-based distro!
<Fujitsu> Yeep.
<Kmos> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8875516/ddclient_3.7.3-2ubuntu1.debdiff
<white> !info lwat gutsy
<ubotu> lwat: LDAP Web-based Administration Tool. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.15-1 (gutsy), package size 68 kB, installed size 540 kB
<white> the 0.15-2 version from unstable should be synced
<superm1> white, at this point a UVFe will need to be filed for that
<superm1> since it's past the freeze time
<white> superm1: i am only forwarding security related stuff
<jmg> wow, a ricer
<keescook> superm1: 0.15-1 vs 0.15-2 I don't think counts since the orig.tar.gz is the same.  (i.e. it's a bug-fix update)
<superm1> keescook, didn't look closely at the versions
<superm1> your right
<StevenK> Yes. *Upstream* Version Freeze. :-)
<ajmitch> StevenK: you should just have a total freeze
<ajmitch> "you need 3 ACKs for every change made to a package in gutsy+1"
<bddebian> Heya gang
<soskel> hi
<soskel> I was told to come here
<bddebian> soskel: Hi.  For what?
<soskel> adding something to the repos
<Instabin> im compiling gpredict from cvs. everything compiles correctly but when i run it there are none of the pixmaps that were included in the source
<Instabin> Istead it shows an x where the pixmaps should be
<soskel> I don'
<bddebian> soskel: A new package?
<soskel> I don't understand how to add something to the repos if you don't have ubuntu
<soskel> yea, a new package
<soskel> imageprocessinglab.com
<bddebian> If you don't know how to package something yourself, your best bet is probably to file a bug on Launchpad, requesting that it be packaged
<bddebian> Instabin: Do you know where it expects the icons to be?
<soskel> and someone will package it for me?
<soskel> bddebian:
<Instabin> bddebian: I know where they are
<Frogzoo> soskel: someone might consider packaging it
<soskel> ahh
<bddebian> soskel: They might.  Unfortunately there are no gaurantees.  It is unlikely it would get in Gutsy as this point
<soskel> well, thanks
<bddebian> Instabin: That wasn't my question :-)
<Instabin> bddebian: What file would i look in to find that
<bddebian> Did they end up in /usr/local/<something> ?
<Instabin> bddebian: I had it make the install to /home/user/gpredictcvs
<Instabin> under there its in /share/pixmaps
<bddebian> How? did you do --prefix=... ?
<Instabin> ./configure --prefix=/home/user/gpredictcvs
<soskel> bddebian: https://launchpad.net/
<soskel> were do I go on the site>?
<bddebian> Instabin: Should work.  Just for kicks you could try copying one of the files to /usr/share/pixmaps
<Instabin> and under gpredictcvs I have bin and share
<Instabin> bddebian: they should allready be there i have the deb for gpredict installed
<bddebian> soskel: Click Ubuntu, then Report a Bug
<soskel> ah
<soskel> ok
<soskel> thanks
<bddebian> NP
<bddebian> Hrm, how are you starting your gpredict?
<Instabin> from terminal cd /home/user/gpredictcvs/bin
<Instabin> then ./gpredict
<bddebian> OK
<Instabin> The one in ubuntu right now is useless b/c none of the satellite data is current
<Frogzoo> how does ubuntu decide what kernel options get compiled?
<jmg> Frogzoo: they just say yes to everything and take out what breaks
<bddebian> heh
<jmg> *duck*
<bddebian> Instabin: Have you filed a bug to ask for an update to the package? :-)
<Instabin> yes
<bddebian> OK
<Frogzoo> hmmm... cos there's no CONFIG_VGACON_SOFT_SCROLLBACK and I think this is needed to enable scrollback on the ttys - I took a look at rebuilding the kernel, but it seems a bother
<Frogzoo> would be nice to have swatch sitting on a tty, but without a scrollback, it's pointless
<Instabin> bddebian: I also contacted writer of gpredict b/c i couldnt compile the 0.8.0 version on gutsy. so he update the cvs so that i could
<bddebian> Instabin: When you did "make install" did you give it a DESTDIR=".." ?
<Instabin> bddebian: yes /home/user/gpredictcvs
<bddebian> It "should" work
<Instabin> bddebian: this is what he had to do so i could compile it on gutsy......
<Instabin> Allow deprecated symbols otherwise gpredict will not compile with
<Instabin> 	Gtk+ 2.12 (GtkTooltips deprecated).
<Instabin> Woudl that effect the pixmaps?
<bddebian> I wouldn't think so
<bddebian> Do you get any errors on the console?
<Instabin> bddebian: no
<Instabin> ok bddebian now im getting an error when just trying to launch gpredict... I didnt recompile or do anything to it since the last time i launched it.
<Instabin> bddebian: (gpredict:9858): GLib-CRITICAL **: g_dir_close: assertion `dir != NULL' failed
<soskel> bddebian: Can't add program to respo
<soskel> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/133082
<soskel> You received this bug notification because you are a direct subscriber
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 133082 in Ubuntu "Can't add program to respo" [Undecided,New] 
<soskel> of the bug.
<bddebian> soskel: OK, thanks
<Instabin> bddebian: it will work if there is a pre existing .gpredict directory
<soskel> bddebian: what does it mean?
<Instabin> but still dosnt have the pixmaps
<bddebian> Instabin: I assume you didn't build with sudo?
<Instabin> no
<Instabin> didnt want to mess up
<Instabin> my system
<Instabin> That is why i did the prefix
<bddebian> I don't really know, sorry
<Instabin> I can send you the cvs
<bddebian> soskel: Launchpad is just letting you know you submitted a bug report :-)
<soskel> haha
<soskel> ok
<soskel> thanks
<bddebian> Instabin: I can't accept through my firewall.  And it's almost bedtime for me.
<Instabin> bddebian: awww
<Instabin> bddebian: I used to do file sharing through dcc
<bddebian> Instabin: I don't want to sound rude but since you are not using an official package, it's not really something we can support here.  Your best bet might be to ask in #ubuntu.
<Instabin> #but that channel does not support gutsy
<Instabin> lol
<bddebian> I think there is an #ubuntu+1 channel no?
<Instabin> yep
<Instabin> im in both of them
<Instabin> + nouveau
<Instabin> os[josh@amdnvidia, Linux 2.6.22-9-generic i686] 
<Instabin> sry
<Instabin> didnt try that
<bddebian> Ah well bedtime.  Gnight folks.  Good luck Instabin, sorry I couldn't be more help.
<Instabin> NerdList v 0.6 by Elena ``of Valhalla''
<Instabin> usage:
<Instabin> *** !nerd nick reason ***
<Instabin> add a reason why nick is a nerd
<Instabin> *** !nerdlist num
<Instabin> prints the top num nerds (default 5)
<Instabin> *** !nerdhelp
<Instabin> print this help
<Instabin> join #newinstabinfakechan
<jmg> !nerdlist
<Instabin> NerdList v 0.6 by Elena ``of Valhalla''
<Instabin> Top 1 List of Nerds for the channel #ubuntu-motu
<Instabin>  1                  (0)
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about nerdlist - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<Instabin> sry
<Instabin> !nerd jmg typed nerdlist
<Instabin> NerdList v 0.6 by Elena ``of Valhalla''
<Instabin> Top 1 List of Nerds for the channel #ubuntu-motu
<Instabin>  1                  (0)
<Instabin> dum thing how do get rid of plugin
<ajmitch> Instabin: please don't spam the channel with this crap
<Instabin> ajmitch: I got it now its gone
<lifeless> ajmitch: you were saying you had a local repo to provide build-deps for things you were building that needed as-yet-unpublished packages
<lifeless> ajmitch: how do you go about doing that with pbuilder - bind mount? local http server?
* RAOF uses a local http server
<lifeless> hmm, nearly three pm. Lunchtime.
<ajmitch> bind mount
<ajmitch> & a hook to run apt-get update before each build
<lifeless> ajmitch: can you document this somewhere if its not already?
<lifeless> RAOF: http servers are a nuisance :)
* RAOF has an http server running anyway, so...
<ajmitch> should be documented somewhere already, I think maybe in the example pbuilder hooks
<lifeless> not visibly in /usr/share/doc/pbuilder
<lifeless> grep -r update /usr/share/doc/pbuilder/examples/
<ajmitch> ok, it's as simple as having a D hook that (optionally) throws a line into /etc/apt/sources.list, and runs apt-get update
<ajmitch> the pbuilder config takes care of rebuilding the Packages.gz file outside of the chroot on each build, which is a little bit of an overkill
<nixternal> I use the hooks for KDE 4 packaging
<lifeless> I can put together the D hook. But I'm a little confused by the mention of Packages.gz being rebuilt; my pbuilder definately doesn't maintain Packages files for me
<nixternal> they are documented via google and debian somewhere...the script on the wiki for the multiple pbuilder setup has the hook in there as well
<nixternal> lifeless: you can add the rebuilding of the Packages.gz
<lifeless> ajmitch: so how do you get the bind mount; as each build has its own chroot dir?
<ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#head-5e51532fca6153405af36a03364e03803e99edcf
<nixternal> I just have pbuilder fire off 'dpkg-scanpackages . /dev/null |gzip -9c>Packages.gz' from /var/cache/pbuilder/*/results/
<ajmitch> let pbuilder handle the bind mounting
<lifeless> ajmitch: exactly my question.
<lifeless> ah, I see. thans
<nixternal> BINDMOUNTS="/var/cache/pbuilder/kde4/result"
<lifeless> *thanks*
<lifeless> yes, blindingly ovbious now I'mlooking at the right doco
<superm1> nixternal, you don't event need to have it pipe through gzip -9c
<nixternal> OTHERMIRROR="deb file:/var/cache/pbuilder/kde4/result/ ./"
<superm1> dpkg-scanpackages . /dev/null > Packages
<superm1> is all I do
<superm1> in my hook
<ajmitch> hence why I pasted the link, since there are a few lines you can stick in the pbuilder config
<nixternal> ya, mine is a little old, but still works like a charm
* ajmitch also uses it with ccache
<lifeless> ajmitch: thanks for the patience;
<nixternal> ajmitch: does ccache help that much?
<ajmitch> nixternal: it certainly can if you have to rebuild 10 times to get something right :)
<nixternal> hehe, that is why I start out in a chroot and just debuild -nc
<StevenK> ccache is one of those things I keep meaning to look at.
<superm1> there is also using pbuilder-gdebi for your dependency resolution on pbuilder.  it's supposed to speed things up as well
<RAOF> By a couple of orders of magnitude, yes.
<StevenK> RAOF: WoW 2.2.0 has hit pre-patch stage.
<RAOF> Yay VoIP!
<RAOF> That's going to be so good.
<TheMuso> Heya folks
<RAOF> Hey TheMuso
<superm1> hey TheMuso
<TheMuso> Hey RAOF, superm1.
<viviersf> ajmitch, ping
<lifeless> any opinion on this-?
<lifeless> I think its a bug that usr/share/pbuilder/pbuilderrc exports BINDMOUNTS=""
<lifeless> because this means that BINDMOUNTS=FOO pdebuild ... will ignore the variable
<superm1> hi Hobbsee
<lifeless> 17:15 < lifeless> any opinion on this-?
<lifeless> 17:15 < lifeless> I think its a bug that usr/share/pbuilder/pbuilderrc exports BINDMOUNTS=""
<lifeless> 17:15 < lifeless> because this means that BINDMOUNTS=FOO pdebuild ... will ignore the variable
<lifeless> Hobbsee: ^
<Hobbsee> hi superm1
<Hobbsee> lifeless: quite possible, but it's only a config file to be modified, i thought
<Hobbsee> otherwise people dont find out about the option at all
<lifeless> /usr/share/pbuilder/pbuilderrc is not a conf file
<superm1> Hobbsee, some time back i remember eaves dropping on a conversation in -devel that I believe you were saying that metapackages in universe and multiverse don't install Recommends by default.  This is no longer the case it would appear by /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/01ubuntu, correct?
<lifeless> /etc/pbuilderrc *also* trashes it, but at least that isn't replaced on upgrades
<lifeless> Hobbsee: as for finding out about it; surely
<lifeless> # BINDMOUNTS=""
<lifeless> will do the job :)
<Hobbsee> superm1: that's been fixed, yes, i'm unsure exactly how mvo fixed it.
<Hobbsee> lifeless: true.  oh, i thought you were talking about /etc/pbuilderrc
<Hobbsee> lifeless: indeed.  unsure why it doesnt
<lifeless> should I bugger a file ?
<StevenK> lifeless: You can pass pbuilder options to pdebuild
<superm1> Hobbsee, well the fix appears to have shown up in that file, but i'm having a heck of a time overriding that behavior now.  I liked it the old way better :)
<Hobbsee> lifeless: as in, write a patch?  that'd be nice
<StevenK> pdebuild -- --bindmounts /blah
<Hobbsee> superm1: why?
<lifeless> StevenK: I know, humour me :)
<Hobbsee> superm1: use suggests, then
<superm1> ah good point
<lifeless> StevenK: its a PITA to pass such options through 4 layers.
<superm1> that's probably an easier route
<StevenK> Why four layers?
<lifeless> shell wrapper, bzr builddeb, pdebuild-$distro-$arch, pdebuild itself
<StevenK> Ah ha
<StevenK> I've just decided I don't want to know. :-)
<lifeless> :)
<POX_> RAOF: no, LP: #132580 needs to be fixed in debian as well
<coNP> Morning
<Hobbsee> morning coNP
<pygi> Hobbsee, poke? Mind checking UVF exception request? :)
<Hobbsee> oh, meh.  those have already started.  i was intending to stick an email filter in for them
<pygi> Hobbsee, pretty please? ^^
<DarkSun88> Hi all
* Hobbsee filters the email, and sorts it out
<Hobbsee> oh, grr. people dont seem to get the concept of a freeze
<pygi> Hobbsee, like who? :)
<Hobbsee> laurent
<pygi> ok, as long as it's not me :)
<Hobbsee> i didnt look at yours
<Hobbsee> besides, yours was in before the freeze, wasnt it?
<pygi> Hobbsee, true, but it wasnt uploaded
<pygi> so I requested a check by motu-uvf
<pygi> anyway, over and out :)
<Hobbsee> pygi: then you dont need a UVFe for it, assuming it's sane.
<pygi> Hobbsee, you check :)
<pygi> Hobbsee, it *is* sane ofcourse ;0
<Hobbsee> pygi: (at the motu-uvf's and sponsorship teams discression, of course)
* Hobbsee ponders getting motu-uvf to point at a mailing list, and filtering that way
<RainCT> hi
<TheMuso> RainCT: Your branch has been merged.
<RainCT> TheMuso: I've seen it. Thanks :)
<TheMuso> RainCT: Welcome.
<RainCT> (btw, I'll be away next week)
<mok0> RMS is safe in Peru
<Kmos> bug 132694 - http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8875516/ddclient_3.7.3-2ubuntu1.debdiff
<Kmos> Hobbsee: hi :) good night there
<Hobbsee> hi Kmos
<Kmos> bug 132694
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 132694 in ddclient "Please merge ddclient (3.7.3-2) from Debian unstable" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132694
<Hobbsee> yes, and?
<Kmos> i've done a debdiff
<Kmos> want sponsorship
<Hobbsee> there's a sponsorship queue....
<Kmos> checked now it's already on U-U-S
<Kmos> thx
<Hobbsee> then wait.
<Hobbsee> oh, excellent.  gparted will grow and shrink ext3 partitions
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Er, of course. It'd be pretty useless otherwise.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: qtparted, at least in edgy, will let you delete and create, but nto resize.
<Fujitsu> Hm, I'm sure it did.
* Hobbsee just checked.
<Hobbsee> and gparted wouldnt let me grow a partition
<Fujitsu> Oh qtparted. I see.
<Fujitsu> It's telling you to use GNOME.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: She'd just beat it with the Long Pointy Stick Of Doom (tm).
<Hobbsee> gnome doesnt like me.
<Hobbsee> although, gparted looks quite qt-ish, in some ways
<Hobbsee> or at least, tries to use kde icons
<mok0> Has anyone here experience with running the openafs filesystem?
<Hobbsee> Kmos: the logic of the queue is this:  "the queue will be gone thru, and those who poke about non-urgent things will have their items sent to the bottom"
<Hobbsee> does that make sense?
<Kmos> Hobbsee: yeah, i think that's already resolved
<StevenK> The more you ask, the lower the priority is.
<Hobbsee> :)
<Kmos> StevenK yesterday told me to ask for sponsorship
<Kmos> =)
<Hobbsee> Kmos: sure, but not of me, right this particular minute.
<Hobbsee> :)
<Hobbsee> was that in before feature freeze, i wonder.  oh, yes it was.
<Hobbsee> the sync request was, and then it was found that it was wrong.
<Kmos> Hobbsee: the debdiff it's there =)
<Hobbsee> Kmos: we're in feature freeze and upstream version freeze now.  anything filed after that freeze needs an exception, if it's a new version
<Kmos> Hobbsee: i know what's UVF is :)
<Kmos> ddclient is an exception because it fix one important bug and another less important
<Kmos> just in LP
<white> unidentified version (of a) freak?
<Hobbsee> Kmos: you still have to follow the process for getting an exception, if it was filed after the freeze date.
<white> Fujitsu: resize is a new future (and finally there)
<Hobbsee> hiya white.  those packages got done
<Kmos> Hobbsee: it was filled before :)
<Hobbsee> Kmos: then you're in luck for that one.
<Kmos> 2007-08-15
<Hobbsee> yes, so you dont have to for that one.  just for anything else you file, that's a new upstream version
<Kmos> Hobbsee: yep
<Kmos> i just want this one =) after is to fix bugs..
<Kmos> and triage them
<Hobbsee> then go ahead and do that.  it'll stay on the quuee
<Kmos> the others in main sponsors are there for some days and anyone touch them
<Kmos> Hobbsee: yep
<Kmos> it have time =)
<Hobbsee> Kmos: most people here dont upload to main.
<Kmos> yeah, i know
<Kmos> just telling you about something that's happening
* Hobbsee already knows about it
<Kmos> so, sorry..
<Hobbsee> it's ok
<Hobbsee> as for whether most peopleeeeeeeeee would be able to do anything with it anyway...
<TheMuso> So where does the UVF stand WRT uus bugs that were filed prior to UVF?
<TheMuso> UVF team even
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: upload most of them, at our discression
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: ie, if they're going to break stuff, then no, we wont
<Hobbsee> but otherwise, if it was filed before, then we're happy enough to honour it
<Hobbsee> or at least, that's my view
<TheMuso> Right.
* TheMuso decides to wait on a concensus from the whole UVF team, and goes off to find bugs to fix.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: seriously, if it's sane, upload it.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: no need to get caught up in red tape
<TheMuso> Yeah true.
<Hobbsee> the archive admins were happy enough to do the above procedure for sync requests last time, iirc
<Hobbsee> as in, they hadnt gotten around to processing syncs before UVF
<TheMuso> right
<Hobbsee> and so there were a few left, and i wanted one.
<Hobbsee> after some arguing, they did it
<TheMuso> heh
<pygi> Hobbsee, right, but pretty please look at the bug, so if sane I could work on swfdec-mozilla? :)
<pygi> or I'll have to bug someone else =)
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> i will at some point, in the next week or so
<pygi> Hobbsee, ok, then I'll bug someone else :p
* pygi needs to work on other things next week :-/
<Hobbsee> pygi: it's in the queue, so it'll be done when someone processes it
<pygi> Hobbsee, oh well
<pygi> k
<xxxxx1> mornin' ubunteros
<coNP> morning xxxxx1
<xxxxx1> hey coNP
* ScottK agrees with Hobbsee that if it was filed before UVF and is sane, go ahead.  You break it, you fix it, I'd add.
<ScottK> Good $TIME_OF_DAY all.
<coNP> Hey ScottK
<ScottK> Hello coNP.
<TheMuso> Hey ScottK.
<ScottK> Hello TheMuso
<mok0> Any news on when REVU will be back online?
<ScottK> It's been "Real soon now" for quite some time.
<ScottK> If you have web space, just post your packages and give us a link to the .dsc.
<ScottK> If you don't, there were several volunteers on the mailing list yesterday to host them.
<ScottK> mok0: BTW, looking at kssh just now.
<mok0> ScottK: Great. I was wondering if I had to put license preambles for LGPL and GFDL in debian/copyright, but I couldn't find any
<xxxxx1> hey ScottK
<ScottK> mok0: I'll double check that.
<ScottK> xxxxx1: Hi.
<ScottK> mok0: Yes you do have to put the preambles in debian/copyright.
<mok0> ScottK: Where can I find the text?
<ScottK> In /usr/share/common-licenses.
<ScottK> Also, GFDL is in there too, so please refer to it there rather than the man page.
<mok0> Errr, not on feisty?!?
<mok0> Gutsy perhaps?
<ScottK> Ah
<ScottK> Yes.  I looked on Gutsy.
<ScottK> It's there in Gutsy so you can just refer to it there.
<ScottK> It's /usr/share/common-licenses/GFDL
<mok0> I am putting that in as we speak :-)
<ScottK> Great.
<mok0> ScottK: For GPL there is a short ~10 line version preamble that goes in copyright, but I can
<mok0> not find the FDL equivalent.
<ScottK> mok0: How about Everything up through the end of paragraph 0?
<mok0> ScottK: ??
<mok0> Ah
<mok0> OK
<ScottK> ?
<mok0> I know what you mean
<ScottK> Does that make sense?
<mok0> A few minutes I pastebin it
<ScottK> OK
<LucidFox> I am the upstream author of a Qt application that uses .ts/.qm files for translations. What should I do to make it compatible with Launchpad translations?
* ScottK hides.
<LucidFox> heh
<LucidFox> am I that annoying? ^_^
<ScottK> It's not personal.  It's the translation thing.
<mok0> ScottK: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/34050/
* ScottK looks
<ScottK> It looks good, except for you should change your wget GFDL to cp it like you did for LGPL.
<ScottK> Since that will work on the target system.
<Ng> LucidFox: #launchpad may be a good place to ask (in that the launchpad developers hang out there)
<Hobbsee> ScottK: who else is on the motu-uvf team?  you, me, StevenK, zul...who have i missed?
* ScottK looks
<Hobbsee> oh, soren
<ScottK> Yeah
<Hobbsee> ping:  ScottK StevenK soren zul
<ScottK> Pong
<Hobbsee> right, there's 1.
<mok0> ScottK: Correction posted at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/34053/
<white> !info denyhosts gutsy
<ubotu> denyhosts: an utility to help sys admins thwart ssh hackers. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.6-2 (gutsy), package size 61 kB, installed size 416 kB
<white> someone might want to upgrade denyhosts to 2.6-2.1
<ScottK> mok0: Looks good to me.
<ScottK> Any volunteers to file the sync?
<mok0> ScottK: Assuming you sponsor it, how do we find another one with REVU down?
<zul> Hobbsee: pongish
<mok0> I will post .dsc on my website as you advised
<zul> sorne is on vacation i think
<zul> soren even
<ScottK> mok0: We've been coordinating here, but since this has already been uploaded and is just being fixed for licensing stuff, one is all that's needed.
<Hobbsee> zul: ok, cool.
<ScottK> mok0: The .dsc on the web site would be good for your other packages.
<Hobbsee> so that's 1.3, then.
<mok0> ScottK: I am working on btk-core ATM
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> E-mail me the update for kssh when you have it ready.
<Hobbsee> hi spam
<ScottK> mok0: Any chance I could talk you into filing the sync for denyhosts?
<ScottK> It's be good practice.
<ScottK> It's/It'd
<mok0> ScottK: will do. one final question... I get: W: kssh: binary-or-shlib-defines-rpath ./usr/bin/kssh /usr/lib
<ScottK> Ah.
<ScottK> You need to fix that.  Did you get that before?
<mok0> It's built using cdbs
<ScottK> Let me find you a reference.
<mok0> Hmmm I don't think I got that before
<mok0> Probably something in the buildenv got updated
<ScottK> mok0: http://wiki.debian.org/?RpathIssue
<zul> Hobbsee + ScottK do you guys wanna sit down (i dunno with jono or ajmitch) this weekend and go through the process?
<ScottK> zul: What TZ are you in?
<zul> EST
<ScottK> OK.  You and me both then.
<Hobbsee> zul: yeah, sometime.
<ScottK> Since Hobbsee and ajmitch are on the opposite side of then planet, I'd suggest maybe via e-mail.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: person is likely doable, sometime.
<ScottK> Why jono?
<ScottK> OK.  I'll be around most of Saturday.  Sunday mostly not.
<zul> *shrug* a suggestion
<zul> isnt jono doing motu these days? i have lost track
<ScottK> No.  dholbach is the Canonical MOTU these days.
<ScottK> He's on vacation.
<Hobbsee> zul: he is doing MOTU as well, yes
<ScottK> ajmitch had some process suggestions on IRC that I thought were good.  Did you both see them?
<Hobbsee> i didnt
<ScottK> He is?
<Hobbsee> ScottK: yes
* Hobbsee has already spoken to him a couple of times on the phone about MOTU and related stuff.
<ScottK> OK.  I'll go dig them out of my logs and pastbin them here in a minute.
<Hobbsee> that'd be cool.  cc them to the mailing list, if you could
<ScottK> OK.  I believe you, I just haven't noticed.
<Hobbsee> unsure if he's really started much yet
* ScottK is in the midst of reconfiguring 3 Postfix servers right now and needs a few minutes to finish that.
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> ok
<ScottK> OK.  Done.  I had the test server done and wanted to get the other two fixed up before I forgot what I was doing.
<ScottK> Off to grovel through the logs.
<ScottK> Hobbsee and zul: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/34056/
<ScottK> Not a lot to it.
<Hobbsee> right, yeah
<zul> ScottK: okies
<white> !info gnatsweb gutsy
<ubotu> gnatsweb: Web interface to GNU GNATS. In component universe, is extra. Version 4.00-1 (gutsy), package size 54 kB, installed size 236 kB
<sistpoty> hi folks
<Hobbsee> hi sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi Hobbsee
<sistpoty> siretart: I can't sudo on sparky, need my pw for it which I don't know
<siretart> sistpoty: really?
<siretart> hmm
<siretart> sistpoty: are you at home or at work?
<siretart> sistpoty: please call 28030
<sistpoty> siretart: at home... I left early today ;)
<sistpoty> I'll call in a minute
<superm1> is that a long enough number to dial in some parts of the world?
<siretart> superm1: no. but he knows the prefix
<superm1> ah
* ScottK no longer has a running Gutsy installation.  Hard drive just died.  I guess that'll make it easier to get some real work done today.
<soskel> hi
<ScottK> Hello
<soskel> can I have my program featured as a stock application in gusty?
<ScottK> Possibly.
<ScottK> It would have to be properly packaged and approved for upload by 30 Aug.
<soskel> imageprocessinglab.com
<ScottK> Someone would have to volunteer to do that work (the packaging).
* ScottK is not volunteering today.
<soskel> I reported a bug for it
<soskel> yesterday
<ScottK> OK.  That's a good first step.
<ScottK> The odds of anyone volunteering to package it in time for the new package freeze are very low.
<mohammad> ScottK: hello, it seems that zekr failed to upload: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/zekr/0.5.1.dfsg-0ubuntu1/+build/376990 would you please kindly take a look?
<ScottK> mohammad: I've looked.
<ScottK> I'll give you details in a moment.
<soskel> well, thanks ScottK
<ScottK> soskel: If you want to package it, people here will help you, but we are virtually all volunteers.
<soskel> I don't have ubuntu
<Lamego> soskel, which software is it ?
<soskel> imageprocessinglab.com
<ScottK> mohammad: I have followed up on it and something went odd in the build system (Soyuz).  The person to talk to is currently out sick.  I've e-mailed them and will continue to follow up on the package.
<ScottK> AFAIK, it's nothing wrong with Zekr, but I don't know why it happened yet.
<Lamego> does it build with the current Feisty libs ?
<soskel> ??
<Lamego> I mean, can it be compiled on Ubuntu Feisty ?
<soskel> yea
<soskel> you can try if you want
<soskel> :)
* tsmithe doesn't see a Makefile in the source
<tsmithe> how does it build?
<soskel> em
<soskel> all I know is you can run it in ubuntu
<tsmithe> uhuh..
<tsmithe> if we can't build it, we can't package it
<tsmithe> how are mono applications usually built? i'm unsure
<soskel> I built it from the C#
<Lamego> they are usually built with makefiles
<bddebian> Heya gang
<tsmithe> hiya bddebian
<Lamego> in this case it seems to be a VS solution file :P
<bddebian> Heya tsmithe
<tsmithe> soskel, Lamego, also it depends on this "aforge" library, which doesn't seem to have a mono package available
<soskel> can you try building it? or even running it?
<tsmithe> bddebian, how's it going?
<ScottK> IIRC, RAOF is the one to ask about mono.
<bddebian> tsmithe: It's "going" thanks.  You?
<tsmithe> alright :)
<Lamego> soskel, that is what we are trying :)
<tsmithe> gotta get out more, though
<bddebian> I hear ya
<tsmithe> hehe
<siretart> sistpoty: I've changed the DNS to have tiber pointing to sparky
* siretart off home now
<sistpoty> siretart: great, thanks!
<sistpoty> siretart: one more question
<sistpoty> siretart: will the ML of tauware accept mails from sparky?
<tsmithe> soskel, where do you get the impression that we can run it in ubuntu?
<siretart> sistpoty: I think so
<sistpoty> (or could you make it so? *g*)
<siretart> sistpoty: if freiburg doesn't, I'll fix it
<mohammad> ScottK: thanks. Nicolas Spalinger owner of pkg-fonts team asked me to apply a few changes to http://packages.ubuntu.com/gutsy/x11/ttf-scheherazade, in particular he asked me to rename ttf-scheherazade to ttf-sil-scheherazade (to comply sil convention). I have prepared the new package. just don't know I should wait for revu to works or is there any other possiblity to upload it somewhere else?
<soskel> tsmithe: because it is program that can be run on wine
<soskel> for sure
<sistpoty> siretart: cool, thanks!
<tsmithe> soskel, uhuh... if it's c# we would most likely build it with Mono
<tsmithe> and we aren't going to ship and wine apps any time soon
<ScottK> mohammad: Any web space you can put the tarbarll, diff.gz, and .dsc is fine.  Just give us a link.
<tsmithe> soskel, see http://www.mono-project.com/Main_Page for our .net implementation
<mohammad> ScottK: thanks I will do it
<sistpoty> mohammad: give me one or two hours, maybe revu will then suddenly work again ;)
<ScottK> mohammad: You will also want to update zekr then to depend on the renamed font.
<soskel> thanjks
<soskel> I will look at it
<tsmithe> cool
<ScottK> mohammad: Actually, I'd make it depend on ttf-sil-scheherazade | ttf-scheherazade
<tsmithe> it most likely will build and run on ubuntu, i guess. although if it uses WinForms, i'm not sure of the state of that
<mohammad> ScottK: if ttf-sil-scheherazade is uploaded to gutsy then will you remove ttf-scheherazade from gutsy?
* tsmithe goes away again
<sistpoty> oh, stupid question, what is the most simple and secure ftp-server? vsftpd? or the netkit-one (ftpd)?
<tsmithe> good luck soskel
<soskel> thanks a ton
<tsmithe> time to devour some more trees, methinks...
<ScottK> mohammad: Don't make an entirely new package though, just rename the one you with a new version.
<ScottK> Yes, ttf-scheherazade would get removed.
<ScottK> And now that I think about it, zekr hasn't actually been published because of the Soyuz problem, so just do a zekr revision (...ubuntu2) with the new dependency.
<ScottK> No noeed to make it a "|" depends.
<siretart> sistpoty: personally, I liked pure-ftpd, but I haven't touched it a long time. we used vsftp on tiber, but I didn't really get it to have the permissions handled the way I wanted to
<sistpoty> siretart: ok, then I'll install pure-ftpd, as I don't have a preference (apart from that I dislike proftpd a little bit)
<xxxxx1> hey bddebian, siretart :)
<bddebian> Any of you in here know why /var/run/msysqld.lock pukes???
<bddebian> Heya xxxxx1
<ScottK> bddebian: Because it's broken.  That's why.
<ScottK> ;-)
<bddebian> Well I assume it's because /var/run isn't static anymore?
<ScottK> bddebian: That would be my guess
<mohammad> you might know Persian=Farsi so I am not sure in ttf-sil-scheherazede.defoma-hinst which one should be mentioned?    Location = English Farsi Arabic Kurdi Urdu OR   Location = English Persian Arabic Kurdi Urdu
<ScottK> Lots of packages have trouble with that.
<bddebian> Well it's breaking a lot of postinst scripts
<ScottK> mohammad: I would say Farsi as that is what the language is called.
<ScottK> mohammad: I'm sure anyone who can read Farsi (and would want the font) would know.
<ScottK> mohammad: I don't recall, do you support Punjabi?
<ScottK> I'd expect it would use the same font as Arabic if you do.
<mohammad> ScottK: I think it does not support Panjabi
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> Just trying to think through the different possibilities.
<ScottK> mohammad: Though for the font that may be used by other applications, I do think Panjabi should be mentioned as it is a language that uses Arabic script (at least western Panjabi does - it's different in India).
<mohammad> ScottK: about persian: Actually I am native Farsi speaker. the point is that when we reffer to our langauge in persian we call it Farsi but based on some conventions I think in English the official name is Persian
<ScottK> Ah.
<ScottK> mohammad: I have heard people refer to it as Persian, but people who know anything about Iran will know and refer to it as Farsi in English.
<ScottK> That's my experience anyway.
<ScottK> If someone said Persian, I would know they meant Farsi, but think they didn't know much about that part of the world.
<ScottK> Of course that describes a lot of English speakers very well.
<ScottK> mohammad: I'd suggest Farsi, but your call.
<mohammad> ScottK: http://www.wazu.jp/gallery/Fonts_Urdu.html in section related to Scheherazade there is a long list of Supported Script. Panjabi is not among them.
<mohammad> Support: Arabic script (Arabic, Ajami, Azeri, Balochi, Berber, Brahui, Kashmiri, Kazakh, Kirghiz Kurdish, Lahnda, Jawi, Parkari, Pashto, Persian, Shahmukhi, Sindhi, Uighur, Urdu, Uzbek; Also includes letters in the "Arabic Supplement" block), Latin
<ScottK> mohammad: I see where it says, "Punjabi Shahmukhi", that
<ScottK> is the one I meant.
* ScottK reads more
<ScottK> mohammad: Shahmukhi is western Punjabi.
* ScottK hadn't seen that term before, but I'm not an expert either.
<mohammad> I add Panjabi to the Location in defoma-hints
<ScottK> Cool.
<ScottK> That's a bit of an odd one anyway as I understand the before the partition, all Panjabi was Gurmukhi.
<mohammad> in debian/control shoul I mention ttf-scheherazade in both Replaces and Conflicts? or just Replaces?
<mohammad> ScottK ^
<ScottK> Hmmm
<sistpoty> imbrandon: around? I've made some modifications on sparky, and also ran an apt-get autoremove (which for example remove launchpad-interaction). can you check if everything is still working?
<ScottK> mohammad: I'd say both.
<ScottK> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html#s-conflicts
<bddebian> grr
<ScottK> Sorry.
<sistpoty> hooray, I'm halfway through setting up revu again :)
<bddebian> w00t
<ScottK> Easy half or the hard half?
<sistpoty> ScottK: for me the easy half (apache, mod_python, database)... the hard one will be keyring, ftp-server and processing incoming, as I never touched the scripts that do this *g*
<ScottK> Ah.
<mohammad> I uploaded it here: http://www.math.uwaterloo.ca/~mderakhs/transfer/ttf-sil-scheherazade/
<ScottK> Is the ftp-server needed for dput?
<ScottK> mohammad: I'll have a look
<mohammad> ScottK: thank you and bye
<sistpoty> ScottK: not quite sure, but it simplifies things. anyways, I'll want it to do *only* anonymous ftp (but I'll need to figure this yet)
<ScottK> mohammad: It's not resolving for me.
<ScottK> sistpoty: OK.  Given what's been published about the issues on the other box, the less ftp we have the better.
<mohammad> ScottK: Sorry I didn't get. what is the problem?
<sistpoty> ScottK: well, ftp for revu is not the problem. someone trying to log in with his credentials over ftp is. (and I guess we really should only allow key-based login to sparky to resolve this once and for all)
<ScottK> sistpoty: That or sftp (but doing that without giving out shell access is hard).
<ScottK> mohammad: The link you gave me gives no response.
<sistpoty> yep
<ScottK> mohammad: "The server at www.math.uwaterloo.ca is taking too long to respond."
<ScottK> mohammad: Why don't you just e-mail me the package?
<mohammad> ScottK: ok I will email it to you
<mohammad> ScottK: I sent it. if the package has any problem please send me an email and let me know. Thanks :)
<ScottK> I will.  If you want, send an update to zekr (ubuntu2) and I'll take care of it too.
<mohammad> ScottK: ok I will. Thanks again
<ScottK> No problem.  Maybe the soyuz issue was a one time problem and a new revision will fix that too.
<sistpoty> hm... if that's bold enough that the setup is not yet complete? http://revu.tauware.de
<ScottK> Cool.
<Kmos> it's back =)
<Kmos> not yet
<sistpoty> no, I'm still fighting with ftp and processing :(
<sistpoty> might take a while
<Kmos> :)
<sistpoty> hm... seems like I'm too dumb for pure-ftpd
<soothsayer> Anybody have advice on how to bump a patch to a newer version of
<soothsayer> 	     a package. That is, patch applies against 1.0, want to modify it
<soothsayer> 	     to apply against 1.1
<soothsayer> Argh. Sorry about that.
<soothsayer> Anybody have advice on how to bump a patch to a newer version of a package. That is, patch applies against 1.0, want to modify it to apply against 1.1
<ScottK> Does the patch apply against 1.1?
<soothsayer> It's a generic question, but I assume that it applies, at least with some fuzz
<ScottK> If it applies, then you don't need to do anything.
<ScottK> Generally when futzing with such things I use dpatch-edit-patch or cdbs-edit-patch depending on what patch system the package uses.
<soothsayer> ScottK: To edit the file names?
<sistpoty> (if it applies, you'll still need to check if it's still sane then)
<ScottK> Ah.
<sistpoty> (common error for people using patch systems, "it still applies, let's not look over it")
<ScottK> soothsayer: If it's just file names, any text editor will do.  I use Kate myself.
<ScottK> But what sistpoty says is also true.
<soothsayer> ScottK: It's not just file names. You use cdbs-edit-patch to edit, for example, chunk offsets?
<ScottK> Yes, but not simply.
* ScottK finds the bits that apply, pulls out the rejects and then does those by hand in cdbs-edit-patch.  I'm sure it's not the best way.
<soothsayer> I was kind of hoping for some tool that would automatically update hunk offfsets
<soothsayer> I guess I can write a script to apply the patch with fuzz and diff the files to create an updated patch
<ScottK> There may be such a thing.  I'm certainly not the world's patching expert.
<ScottK> The ways I do it work and are safe, but I'm certain not extremely efficient.
<soothsayer> Yeah, it seems tedious to me to update file names and hunk offsets manually.
<ScottK> If you figure a better way, I'd like to know.
<soothsayer> I'll let you know if I find anything. I'll look into some SCMs, maybe they have they kind of functionality.
<soothsayer> For now, I settle for manually.
<chx> hi. I think I will take the time and effort to package protoeditor -- if it has a chance to make it into Gutsy Universe. Or even better, Feisty Universe. http://protoeditor.sourceforge.net/
<chx> I have a launchpad acc, uploaded a key, signed the code of conduct and reading the packaging manual as I speak.
<ScottK> New package freeze for Gutsy is August 30
<ScottK> So there is a chance.
<chx> great!
<chx> oh, and in the ubuntuforum thread someone else asked for it.
<ScottK> I don't think people here get particularly excited about the forums.  Virtually everyone here is a volunteer and will help as their interest and time allows.
<chx> i am just saying that to further my request for the inclusion of it
<chx> in my eyes this program is the best thing since sliced bread :)
<ScottK> If it's legal to distribute and packaged correctly, it will get in.  If it's not, all the user howling in the world won't get it in.
<chx> ah I see. Well, it's GPL. And while I am not experienced in this, I am a fairly advanced Linux user and I can follow instructions pretty well :)
<ScottK> Great.
<ScottK> I'm tied up in $WORK at the moment and can't give detailed help now, but maybe someone else can...
<Lamego> chx, does it build with a regular configure/make ?
<chx> well, I think the guide will be enough.
<chx> Lamego: yes
<chx> Lamego: the only tricky is that you need a --prefix /usr
<Lamego> chx, I will create the package for it, but not to be integrated on the official repositories, that will be your part :)
<Lamego> let me just finish the current package in a few minutes
<chx> Lamego: oh! it's two in one. It's a standalone editor using katepart and a kate application plugin. for the latter, --enable-kate-plugin configure options is needed.
<Lamego> hum, I am not much experienced with KDE, katepart ?
<ScottK> maybe nixternal will help.
<nixternal> ey?
<ScottK> nixternal: Read the last ~ 20 minutes of scrollback.
<ScottK> It won't take long
<nixternal> ya, I just did..I am researching this protoeditor because I am not sure if I ever heard of it
<nixternal> ann, that is Thiago's app
<nixternal> err
<nixternal> ahh! :)
<chx> does that mean good... or bad :) ?
<norsetto> hello all
<ScottK> Hello
<Marco> hello
<Marco> libmtp6 should require removal of libmtp5, as they conflict over /etc/udev/rules.d/libmtp.rules and can't coexist
<sistpoty> omg, so many hard-coded pathes in revu, I'll never get this sorted out :(
<highvolt2ge> :(
<sistpoty> hooray, revu-key seems to be working again... a small step for revu, but a big step for me :)
<pygi> sistpoty, good work ;)
<sistpoty> pygi: still the setup is not complete (aka revu is not yet running again)
<pygi> sistpoty, true, but progress :)
<sistpoty> hehe
<ScottK> IIRC StevenK said something last week about REVU not being that hard to set up.  Maybe you should wake him up and make him finish it.
<sistpoty> ScottK: might be an idea... at least if he knows the parts about processing uploads ;)
<sistpoty> (which I didn't write any code for, so am a completely newcomer there)
<ScottK> I have no idea which bits he was talking about, but also I'm old and forgetful, so I may have imagined the entire discussion.
<sistpoty> ScottK: talking about laserjock's mail?
<sistpoty> ah, confusing irc and mail reading once again, sorry
* sistpoty is not made for multitasking *g*
* pygi makes sistpoty use gmainloop
<ScottK> No, it was on IRC.
<ajmitch> hi
<norsetto> hi
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> ajmitch: Got a second?
<sistpoty> hi
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Later folks
<LaserJock> hmm, where did Barry go? :/
<sistpoty> he came, he went ;)
<LaserJock> sistpoty: good to hear about the spam
<LaserJock> I had to eventually unsubscribe, it was just too much
<sistpoty> yeah, it was pretty evil, indeed
<LaserJock> it's really tough
<sistpoty> (also, we'll have enough bandwith for revu in the future, but that's imo not the main problem)
<LaserJock> well, I was thinking bandwidth for .debs
<sistpoty> hm... revu never produced .debs to download, only source packages
<LaserJock> IMO, we should be doing more .deb testing for package review
<LaserJock> sistpoty: exactly, that's my point
<calc> sistpoty: hello :)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: right, and I guess PPA will be a huge step forward for this
<sistpoty> hi calc
<LaserJock> sistpoty: yes, because then building and hosting .debs becomes Canonica'ls problem ;-)
<ajmitch> hi LaserJock
<sistpoty> yeah, especially building, which is a imo a security nightmare *g*
<ajmitch> but it won't be *our* nightmare :)
<sistpoty> :)
<LaserJock> right
<LaserJock> let elmo worry about it ;-)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: nonetheless, I believe that the features of LP and MOTU needs for reviewing packages won't be the same
<LaserJock> sistpoty: I think that's definitely a possibility
<sistpoty> just think of a common review system for debian *and* ubuntu, I doubt that would be a goal for LP
<LaserJock> as I said, I'm not convinced that using only LP is the way to go
<LaserJock> I just think we need to do this more systematically
<sistpoty> of course, revu(1) is outdated nowadays... and I'm guilty for that ;)
<ajmitch> ah, the eternal launchpad debate for reviewing
<sistpoty> however I'm currently thinking, that a new revu2 should make use of LP (e.g. building packages via PPA, or bzr branches of source-packages) where possible
<LaserJock> exactly
<ScottK> Everytime I touch something on LP, it just seem slow and overly complex.  Maybe I'm just used to it, but the REVU pages work pretty well for reviewing.
<ScottK> sistpoty: Please don't make me learn bzr.
<LaserJock> I think having a REVU that puts a nice frontend onto LP/bzr/malone
<ScottK> I'm good with that.
<ScottK> Do whatever magic you want on the back end.
<LaserJock> but, I'd also like to get some more info from the LP devs
<sistpoty> ScottK: unless debian accepts bzr, the canonical (no pun intended) source for a package will remain the source package
<LaserJock> yep
<ScottK> Agreed.
<LaserJock> I'd sure hate to see us move completely to bzr for package right now
<LaserJock> it'd confuse the heck out of me ;-)
<sistpoty> ScottK: however if  a package is stored in bzr (in some agreed on form), a new revu should be able to pick it up
<ScottK> We had a discussion about that on -devel recently and mvo removed his apt-get source vcs warning.
<LaserJock> *but*, it is useful to maintain /debian in a VCS
<LaserJock> especially when there is more than one person working on a package
<ScottK> sistpoty: As long as REVU gives me a link to a .dsc I can dget with, I don't care where it is.
<LaserJock> ScottK: I'm pretty sure that can be arranged ;-)
<ScottK> LaserJock: I agree, but we either have to all use it or not.
<sistpoty> LaserJock: ha, I don't want to start the discussion about keeping debian/ in VCS or the complete source package, but a VCS *is* definitely useful
<LaserJock> sistpoty: well, at a minimum the debian/
* ajmitch usually keeps it all in bzr
<LaserJock> when I think of the complete source in VCS I think of my 30GB debian-tex SVN checkout
<ajmitch> I don't quite have anything that large :)
<sistpoty> ScottK: exactly, as it is still the way to interchange debianized software between distributions based on debian
<ScottK> Yes, so people are welcome to use vcs as it helps, but it can't be required/authoritative.
<LaserJock> yeah
<ScottK> We use svn in Debian Python Modules Team very successfully.
<ScottK> Hi mok0.
<ScottK> kssh uploaded again.
<mok0> Hi!
<sistpoty> ScottK: right, exactly that's what I think of a "new revu", being able but not limited to pick up packages from bzr
<LaserJock> well, I had a good talk with LP people today
<ScottK> sistpoty: Sounds good to me then.
<mok0> ScottK: hopefully it is accepted this time :-)
<ScottK> LaserJock: Do tell...
<LaserJock> about MOTU needs, etc.
<sistpoty> (and maybe even svn or other things stored in x-vcs-*)
<ScottK> mok0: I think it will.
<ScottK> mok0 and ran across a problem today and I want to check to see if it's a bug.
<LaserJock> it seems that for 1.1.9 we should have most if not all of the "motu" tagged soyuz bugs fixed
<sistpoty> and maybe (since it's already the 17th, I guess i can announce this in a "half-public" way) I'll have more time to work on revu once my MC membership has been replaced :)
<LaserJock> and perhaps a first run at a "Developers User Guide" type doc
<ScottK> He had to repack the source for kssh to add some missing license text and as recommended changed the dir it unpacked to to packagname-version.orig.
<LaserJock> sistpoty: MC membership replaced?
<ScottK> When I unpacked his repacked tarball with dpkg-source, dpkg-source did me the "favor" of removing the .orig off the dir name.
<ScottK> That didn't seem right.
<ScottK> Comments?
<ajmitch> sistpoty: elections? :)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: right, I'm going to step back from MC once dholbach is back from holidays... I'm always late at work once I start to kill my email-backlog
<ajmitch> ScottK: it shouldn't matter
<sistpoty> ajmitch: damn *g*
<ajmitch> (afaik)
<ajmitch> sistpoty: hm?
<sistpoty> ajmitch: meaning that I've got to wait until elections have been finished ;)
<ScottK> ajmitch: It would all work fine, but the point of changing the dir name to .orig is to alert people that the tarball has been repacked.
<ajmitch> yeah, well maybe they'll just replace the whole lot of us :)
<ScottK> Stripping it seems to make no sense.
<sistpoty> ajmitch: so better get going with some questions to the applicants :P
<LaserJock> ScottK: ahh, that might be because it already uses .orig for something else
<LaserJock> i.e. making the diff.gz perhaps
<ajmitch> sistpoty: nah, if they replace me then I won't need to so anything, will I? :)
<ScottK> Dunno.
<sistpoty> ajmitch: cheater :P
<ScottK> mok0: I'd say file a bug.
<LaserJock> ScottK: look at the dir names for the diff on the .diff.gz
<ScottK> What elections?
<ScottK> LaserJock: Looking
<LaserJock> I believe it uses .orig to do the diff
<LaserJock> that said, I'm not sure that "fixes" your problem
<ajmitch> ScottK: sistpoty is leaving the motu council
<sistpoty> ScottK: MC members were elected
<LaserJock> sistpoty: they were?
<ScottK> Yes, they were.
<LaserJock> when did this happen?
<ajmitch> when it was setup
<ScottK> Maybe I misread, I got the idea you were saying an election was already in progress.
<sistpoty> yep, however the candidates were set up by TB? (or CC?)
<ScottK> Nevermind.
<LaserJock> ok, but how/when did we get new MC?
<ajmitch> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/+polls
<ajmitch> LaserJock: we haven't
<ajmitch> but we will get at least 1 new person
<sistpoty> ScottK: no, this is my "public coming out" ;)
<ScottK> OK.
<LaserJock> ohh
<ScottK> Just making sure I didn't miss something.
* LaserJock is confused
<ajmitch> sistpoty: haha
<LaserJock> I thought you were saying that a new MC had been elected
<LaserJock> and I was thinking "I didn't get any email about it"
* ScottK too.
<LaserJock> surely I'm not *that* out of touch ;-)
<sistpoty> no, I'm just planning to step back from MC if that wasn't clear enough
<LaserJock> I got that part
<LaserJock> just not who was replacing you
<sistpoty> motu-land is full of good candidates imho
<LaserJock> ok, so back to LP briefly, I think we need to write a spec-like wiki page
<LaserJock> that outlines what workflows MOTU has and requirements
<LaserJock> and specifically what we need from Launchpad
<sistpoty> LaserJock: yes, though I doubt that LP will always fulfill all motu requirements
<LaserJock> I agree, but I think it can be made significantly better
<sistpoty> so I think we should first figure what the optimal workflow would be for us (not tied to anything that LP can possible provide) and then see how LP can be integrated
<LaserJock> and the head honchos over there seem to be willing to do something
<ScottK> Start with make if faster.
<imbrandon> s/\)//
<imbrandon> err
<LaserJock> imbrandon: you're alive!!!!
<sistpoty> imbrandon: did I break sparky? *g*
<imbrandon> sistpoty: not that i'm aware
<sistpoty> :)
<LaserJock> ScottK: ok, so what actions are slow?
<imbrandon> LaserJock: hehe i'm always alive, i just straw away from irc last few months
<imbrandon> stray
<LaserJock> good man
<LaserJock> that's what I'm supposed to be doing right now
<ScottK> LaserJock: IMO all of them.  LP is by a significant margin the slowest web site I visit regularly.
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> and you're in the US right?
<ScottK> That's one of the reasons I really don't like focusing more of our work flow there.
<ScottK> I find it very painful.
<ScottK> Yes
<sistpoty> ScottK: the interim revu (once I've managed to set it up) will be *much slower* ;)
<imbrandon> better solution would be to find the poblem and fix it then avoid it, network latency app slowness etc et etc
<ScottK> Urhg.
<RainCT> good night, see you next week
<ScottK> Good night.
<sistpoty> ScottK: though a migration to faster HW is planned once siretart and /me have some time to assemble it
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> Sounds good.
<LaserJock> ScottK: I'm not sure why you'd be getting slowness, it'd be nice to get some rough numbers
<ScottK> One of LP's fundamental problems is that everything is https whether it needs to be or not.  So everything is slower than it has to be.
<LaserJock> I remember people from NZ and Australia having issues
<LaserJock> but it seemed like from the US it was usually fine
<imbrandon> the whole island runs on 56k though
<imbrandon> ;)
<sistpoty> haha
<LaserJock> a single 56K line
<imbrandon> yea kinda like .tw
<imbrandon> ;)
<LaserJock> shared by several million sheep
<imbrandon> roflmao
<imbrandon> just leak the LP source like facebook did ;)
<LaserJock> for me LP is speed-wise is on the lower half of sites I visit but not out of an "average" range
<LaserJock> it's like 2s for most pages
<imbrandon> must faster for me normaly, even when it draggs its 2 -3 s
<imbrandon> imho
<imbrandon> but i have fat pipes here
<LaserJock> pfft
<LaserJock> you can get like a whole .iso in 2-3s ;-)
<imbrandon> hahah more like 2 - 3 minutes
<imbrandon> ;)
<LaserJock> really? that's not *that* fast then
<imbrandon> i'm capped at 100MB/s on my workstation
<peanutb> dang. thats fast
<imbrandon> if i bonded nic's and used diffrent routerts etc
<imbrandon> i could up it but you know
<imbrandon> i'm lazy
<LaserJock> heh, <imbrandon>"damn you and your 100MB/s cap! I want fresh .isos and YouTube now!"</imbrandon>
<ScottK> For me it tends to be more like 3 - 6 seconds per page.
<imbrandon> ;)
<ScottK> I don't have imbrandon's bandwidth, but I do have 7mb down.
<LaserJock> ScottK: much better than waiting 2hrs for debbugs ;-)
<gouki> Does anyone know the name of python-notify (edgy) on dapper drake repositories?
<ScottK> LaserJock: I find the Debian web pages to be uneven.  Some days they are fast and a few slow.  On their normal, fast days, I find them much more responsive than LP>
<LaserJock> ScottK: the web pages yes
<LaserJock> but the email interface is ... difficult for me
<gouki> Edgy and Feisty, actually
<ScottK> Agreed that the e-mail interface is complex.
<LaserJock> I've had duplicate bugs filed before because it took so long to get a response (literally over 2 hrs) that I thought it didn't go through
<LaserJock> the key for me, unfortunately I suppose, is to do as few clicks in LP as possible
<LaserJock> I hardly ever click from one page to another
<LaserJock> 90% of the time I build the URL
<sistpoty> LaserJock: the DBTS email interface is imo a big plus of DBTS of LP, as I never managed to get used to the LP interface (probably because 1) the documentation is not easily accesable and 2) you need to learn DBTS for debian)
<sistpoty> also, I can access the lists of bugs simply with bugs.debian.org/<package>
<LaserJock> I've never once used the email interface for LP
<sistpoty> never have I, since I can do it the long but easier way, I guess ;)
<LaserJock> it's much shorter for me to us the webUI
<LaserJock> I think we could definately have bugs.ubuntu.com/<package>
<sistpoty> yes, that would be great!
<ajmitch> hey imbrandon
<imbrandon> heya ajmitch
<imbrandon> email is evil, rember not everyone ( more and more ) use webmail
<imbrandon> so its the same issues
<ScottK> Not sure what webmail has to do with it.
<ScottK> The major use I make of the LP email interface is to reply to bugmail with additional comments.
<imbrandon> in otherwords why would i trade one direct webui for another indirect webui to work with LP
<ScottK> Ah.
* ScottK doesn't use webmail much.
<LaserJock> we already have bugs.ubuntu.com, it should be possible to get the right redirect
<imbrandon> you are by far becoming a minority
* ScottK uses regular mail clients.
<LaserJock> I only use webmail now
<LaserJock> my uni mail is Horde and gmail for everything else
<blueyed> If I want to provide a debdiff for xubuntu-meta (2.39), which version should it take? "debch -i" gave me 2.39ubuntu1.
<sistpoty> imbrandon: because it's essential to have a good workflow for the people doing *reviews* (as that's our bottleneck), likewise for people producing fixes to bugs
<sistpoty> (or rather being people to upload fixes for bugs)
<sistpoty> blueyed: native package?
<blueyed> yes. meta package for xubuntu.
<blueyed> I've used 2.40 now..
<sistpoty> blueyed: 2.40 seems sane to me, since its a ubuntu native package
<Rinchen> ping LaserJock
<norsetto> night all
<LaserJock> hi Rinchen
<Rinchen> hey LaserJock, I wanted to tell you about a change to the bug page in next week's release
<Rinchen> give you advanced notice
<Rinchen> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/totem/+bug/38169
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 38169 in totem "totem firefox plugin doesn't plug in" [Medium,Fix released] 
<Rinchen> note how the drop downs in that bug have changed
<LaserJock> Rinchen: yeah?
<Rinchen> and also the action is different when you click on the package name
<Rinchen> oh
<Rinchen> that reminds me
<POX_> ScottK: I see you're promoting DPMT here, great, new members are welcome!
<LaserJock> yeah, so the package name now goes to the package, how smart :-)
<ScottK> sistpoty or ajmitch: If one of you are moderators for motu-council, I sent a message to the list from the wrong address.  I'd appreciate it if you would set if free.
<Rinchen> does MOTU have a place where I can send you advance warning of features to? like an email list
<sistpoty> ScottK: sure, we both are, give me a minute
<Rinchen> we sent advanced warning to a few places, like our distro team but we probably should send it to you guys too
<LaserJock> Rinchen: like ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com?
<ScottK> POX_: I also wrote https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributingToDebian/PythonModulesTeam
<ScottK> sistpoty: THanks.
<Rinchen> LaserJock, yeah, if that's a good place, I'll try to get all of the early warning LP changes your way
<LaserJock> Rinchen: excellent, thanks
<POX_> ScottK: yes, I saw that page few weeks ago
<ScottK> OK.
<sistpoty> ScottK: my I PM you?
<ScottK> Sure
<Rinchen> LaserJock, great. I'll make that change effective now...which means you'll get those for the next LP release (if we have any that need to go out)
<LaserJock> coolio
<Rinchen> LaserJock, and I'll also try to get MOTU some good dev docs in 1.1.9...at least get something going. I've already assigned it.  If you or the rest of the MOTU have ideas, please collect them on a wiki someplace and I'll have Matt R give you (laserjock) a shout.
<LaserJock> Rinchen: will do, I think that'd be a big improvement
<Rinchen> LaserJock, great. I think it'll take a few cycles to get the docs out but maybe we can do the ones you guys might need first. You're probably in LP more than most folks.
<Rinchen> LaserJock, did I tell you or did someone mention that we're going to be providing public APIs to LP?
<Rinchen> Something to think about with REVU
<LaserJock> Rinchen: not really, what's it going to have?
<Rinchen> access to all of LP's data
<ajmitch> that's useful
<LaserJock> sistpoty: have you heard about ^^?
<imbrandon> nice
<ajmitch> what sort of access is this?
<Rinchen> The devs are figuring out how to make that a reality in a few weeks and then we'll be working on it for a few months.
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-18
<imbrandon> eta?
<Rinchen> sabdfl announced it at Ubuntu Live but you may not have heard.
<ajmitch> most of us couldn't afford to be there :)
<sistpoty> Rinchen, LaserJock: nice, I'll happily look at that ;)
<Rinchen> imbrandon, no eta yet.  We've got the gang together to look at the approach on the 27th
<Rinchen> imbrandon, so I suspect it'll be some time yet but we're all excited.
<imbrandon> ;)
<Rinchen> The good news is once we put the plan together you can, like all things now, track it on LP via the release cycles
* ajmitch hopes that some of the spec wiki pages will be public as well
<LaserJock> Rinchen: yeah, we could use some sanatized spec pages :-)
<Rinchen> ajmitch, I'll look into that. I suspect the internals will be private for now but the API interface docs will be public and perhaps even have some sample code.
<LaserJock> not like the ones the government puts out that are all black ;-)
<ajmitch> Rinchen: that would help
<ajmitch> then we could give some feedback on the API & what we need
<Rinchen> hehe, as above I think for the API's, at this point in time, it'll be end user docs on how to use it. (There is the whole concept of how to secure the API's from abuse that needs to be investigated, etc.)
<Rinchen> anyway, wanted to give you guys a heads up.
<Rinchen> oh
<Rinchen> if you have any USE CASES or design ideas, please email them to me by next Friday
<Rinchen> joey@canonical.com
<Rinchen> I'll see they are added
<Rinchen> for consideration of course
<ajmitch> we can try
<Rinchen> The more use cases we have the better the system will be
<ScottK> Rinchen: I'd suggest looking at the code of some of the apps that scrape the LP web interface.
<Rinchen> anyway, LaserJock - I've asked the team to schedule your malone and soyuz MOTU bugs for 1.1.9 as well.
<LaserJock> Rinchen: thanks
<Rinchen> ScottK, if you have any, let me know. The only ones I have are the email processing kind.
<Rinchen> ScottK, like ubuntustats
<LaserJock> hehe, I've got one, but it's been kinda obsoleted
<ScottK> I don't recall.
<LaserJock> screen-scraper for +packagebugs
<Rinchen> LaserJock, is it still in use?
<LaserJock> kinda, I think it still runs
<LaserJock> but it was more of a workaround
<LaserJock> and the immediate issue got fixed
<LaserJock> although there's more to do
<Rinchen> well, running and being useful are two different things. :-)  If the data is used by someone, like motu for example, then I'll have it considered.
<LaserJock> well, sadly it's on the REVU server that went down
<Rinchen> REVU was on the externally hosted servers I take it
<LaserJock> yep
<ScottK> Yes.
<Rinchen> hmpf
* ScottK cannot help but note that REVU is also FOSS.
<LaserJock> sistpoty: are we going to get the data from tiber back?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: we could, if we wanted to. However after speaking with siretart today, I consider it a feature that the old packages are gon
<LaserJock> sistpoty: well, I was thinking more our ~/
<Rinchen> well, I'll leave you guys to it. I just wanted to drop in to let you know about what I'm doing LaserJock. Feel free to ping me on #launchpad or pm me.
<Rinchen> Have a good weekend.
<LaserJock> sistpoty: I've got some bzr branches on tiber
<sistpoty> LaserJock: nonetheless, you can ask Ng in #canonical-sysadmin (or elmo, he helped me tonight) if you're interested in a particular file/directory
<nixternal> 17:27:46              ScottK cannot help but note that REVU is also FOSS.
<nixternal> :D
<nixternal> I was wondering when someone was going to snapback with that
<ajmitch> someone? I knew it'd be ScottK
* LaserJock bites his tongue
<ScottK> I did my best to restrain myself.
<ScottK> When I said "cannot help", I meant it.
<nixternal> ajmitch: ya, I thought you maybe, and then I seen imbrandon give a winky smile, and even LaserJock
<nixternal> I figured it was coming, just didn't think it would take so long
* ScottK gets paid to do system requirements for proprietary systems.  It's not a hobby.
<nixternal> LaserJock: I am willing to bet the taste of blood in your mouth is horrible from biting your tongue :)
<nixternal> probably don't have a tongue anymore after biting it that hard :D
<LaserJock> heh
<ScottK> Fire away LaserJock.  I get offended when proprietary system developers ask me to do their work for them for free.
<LaserJock> well, I don't want it to be taken wrong so I don't think I should say anything
<nixternal> ya
<TheMuso> Hey folks.
<nixternal> is there an "Open source LP now" bug yet?
<ScottK> OK.  Probably just as well.  I'm certain I'm unduly hot under the collar right now.
<ScottK> Yes.
<nixternal> hehe
<ScottK> IIRC marked Medium/In Progress.
<nixternal> haha
<LaserJock> ScottK: well, my comments aren't for you, don't worry
<ScottK> OK
<LaserJock> I recognize the effort that's gone into REVU, I really do
<LaserJock> and I think it's served us well
<sistpoty> nixternal: ther e is, just look at sabdfl's most active bugs ;)
<LaserJock> but I don't think it's being FLOSS has really mattered one bit
<LaserJock> the code is freely available and hardly ever worked on
<LaserJock> I'd rather have code that gets worked on and is proprietary than FLOSS that just sits there
<ScottK> LaserJock: That's true, but a few people have submitted patches (the most recent being to keep uploaders from advocating their own packages).
<ScottK> REVU is largely satisfactory for what it does.
<LaserJock> I agree
<ScottK> If there were more problems with it, then more patches would happen.
<LaserJock> but my experience has been that it being FLOSS has helped us little
<ScottK> I prefer tools that the community has control over versus stuff that random strangers change on a whim.
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> I do too
<sistpoty> well, my opinion lately is pretty plain: if there's s.th. that works better, use that. However since there have been arguments for solutions that work worse in the past, I may have become a little bit stubborn
<ScottK> And that's pretty much how I view LP.
<LaserJock> I just want to get the job done
<sistpoty> hehe
<LaserJock> if there are two equal apps to do that and one is FLOSS and the other isn't, I'd like us to prefer the FLOSS solution
<ScottK> I will tell you where it really matters for me.
<LaserJock> but if one suits our needs better I'm not so concerned about it's freeness
<ScottK> If someone in the community asked me to invest my time in figuring out how to make revu or devscripts work better for us, I'd do it.
<LaserJock> REVU was working well for us long before LP was half-way usable
<ScottK> When an LP dev wants me to volunteer to design his system for him, I'm not going to.
<ScottK> He's paid to do that, and so he should.
<LaserJock> that makes sense to me
<sistpoty> ScottK: please find out how to make revu better :P
<LaserJock> although providing bug reports and feedback is always nice, regardless
<ScottK> sistpoty: I just don't feel there's really much wrong with it on the outside (I'm sure from your comments today it's much different on the inside).
<ScottK> LaserJock: Bug reports sure.  System design, no.
<ScottK> If LP is a service and I shouldn't worry, then it's up to the service provider to do the heavy lifting.
<LaserJock> I'd love to just stop taking NEW packages, that'd solve the problem ;-)
<sistpoty> ScottK: given that I still haven't managed to set it up there must be s.th. wrong (or I'm just not capable *g)
<ScottK> sistpoty: Yeah.  That's the ugly on the inside part.
<LaserJock> well, it doesn't build debs and provide a repo
<ScottK> That's true.
<LaserJock> I think that might become an important thing for us to do
<LaserJock> I hadn't thought about it that much
<LaserJock> but we really don't do much other than look at the source package
<ScottK> And I don't doubt that we can make PPAs part of a good backend for that.
<LaserJock> I also find the REVU frontpage kinda difficult unless I know what package I'm looking for
<ScottK> Personally, I also build them and unpack the .debs (ark is good for that) to make sure they aren't doing weird stuff.
<LaserJock> sure
<ScottK> Agreed, but I don't think LP is a model of unuitiveness and orderliness either.
<LaserJock> but I think we might want to get into a mode where we're asking a bit more if we *should* have the package in Universe not if we *can*
<ScottK> I guess the other thing is I think the LP U/I is getting worse not better.
<ScottK> Agreed, but that's different than the tools.
<LaserJock> we create and awful lot of work for ourselves if we pump Universe full of crappy apps
<LaserJock> ScottK: I'm not sure what's overly hard about treating a package review via a bug report
<LaserJock> we're already filing bugs to ask for packages to be done
* ScottK never looks at them.
<LaserJock> why not just complete the circle in one bug
<nixternal> heh, we could create a new repo called "crappy" :D
<ScottK> Well this just rehashes the "we are trying to do stuff in two places and that sucks" arguement.
<sistpoty> don't tell me that I'm fiddling with a revu setup for nothing :P
<ScottK> sistpoty: NO.  You aren't
<nixternal> deb http://.../ubuntu main restricted universe multiverse crappy
<nixternal> hehe
<LaserJock> nixternal: I was thinking of something like that today
<sistpoty> hehe, but I'm close to despair right now *g*
<nixternal> heh, I was sadly just joking...I think the PPAs could do this for us, no?
<ScottK> Which is why I think we should quit doing the LP bug thing.  If there happens to be a needs-packaging bug, fine, but not a requirement.
<LaserJock> well, I understand not wanting to lock into something
<sistpoty> imo limiting packages will be not the easiest thing. I guess starting out with some metrics of how packages in ubuntu have been cared for in the past, and optionally removing these might be suited beter
<sistpoty> s/beter/better/
<LaserJock> but it gets really really confusing for people when we don't have a canonical system
<ScottK> Right.  So we should stop trying to use LP for tracking packaging progress.
<LaserJock> why?
<ScottK> Why did we start?
<LaserJock> because wiki pages suck
<LaserJock> filing a bug is more intuitive
<LaserJock> like a feature request or a request ticket
<LaserJock> they don't want to edit a wiki page
<ScottK> Sure.  I think that's a fine way for a user to say "someone please do this".
<LaserJock> right
<sistpoty> LaserJock: do I get it right that you think it's bad (for the workflow) if not everthing is tied into LP?
<ScottK> That doesn't mean it needs to be tied into our "how we do this" process.
<LaserJock> so if we already have a list of packages that are requested, why not go all the way?
<LaserJock> sistpoty: I think where possible we should be consistent
<sistpoty> LaserJock: yes, I think that of course also would be optimal, but we just won't get there...
<LaserJock> well no
<LaserJock> but it seems logical to me to use a bug report
<sistpoty> just think of MoM, which is essential to ubuntu but by far no part of LP
<LaserJock> I'd hardly call it essential, but yeah
<ScottK> LaserJock: How many packages have you packaged because someone filed a needs-packaging bug?
<LaserJock> not a single one in Ubuntu :-)
* ScottK neither.
<LaserJock> is that they way it should be? I'm not so sure
<ScottK> Most packaging happens because the packager is interested in a package.
* TheMuso notes that he done more sponsoring than anything else lately
<LaserJock> but that's beside the point
<ScottK> No, it's not.
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> it is
<ScottK> The point is that the needs-packaging bugs are almost entirely unrelated to what gets packaged.
<sistpoty> well, if a bug report can provide the same (or better) features, it makes sense. However especially to give a possible reviewer an overview I find difficult
<LaserJock> I'm not saying that I want everybody to be forced to only do needs-packaging bugs
<LaserJock> what I'm saying is that is already a source of info for packaging NEW
<ScottK> LP is not currently the starting point for our process for getting something packaged in virtually all cases.
<LaserJock> I'm also saying that Debian uses bugs
<ScottK> Sure.
<LaserJock> many people are used to using bugs for these things
<jussi01> hello everyone
<ScottK> For "I want/am doing this package"
<ScottK> Not for here's what needs to be changed in the package.
<sistpoty> LaserJock: no, debian uses mentors for reviewing, but bugs for tracking wnpp ;)
<LaserJock> so I don't know why it's an illogical thing to do
<LaserJock> gosh that's my stinking point
<LaserJock> but if you look at wnpp bugs they often discuss the progress of the package
<jussi01> hmmm, can I jump in?
<ScottK> Because LP is slow, painful to navigate, and I'd really rather not get stuck dealing with it more than I have to.
<LaserJock> I would love to see LP+ubuntu-motu-mentors used
<ScottK> jussi01: Sure
<sistpoty> LaserJock: sure, but it's imo orthogonal (which may be a design flaw though *g*)
<LaserJock> I think tying it up a bit more
<jussi01> Just from what I see, needs packaging bugs ar extremely useful to people like myself, who need a something to do/ideas
<LaserJock> doing an ITP bug report (or taking over a needs-packging bugs) then following that report
<LaserJock> adding in PPA for the actual package handling and bzr when people want to us VCS
<LaserJock> it kinda seems like a logical thing
<LaserJock> the elements are pretty much there
<ScottK> If I could navigate it quickly, intuitively, and reliably, I'd agree.
<sistpoty> and having revu on top of this framework to allow easy reviewing :)
<LaserJock> what I *don't* see is a good way to have an overview of it
<ScottK> The pieces are there.
<LaserJock> ScottK: what is there to navigate?
<LaserJock> you could do the whole thing without the web UI
<ajmitch> sistpoty: sure, have REVU pull a list of needs-packaging bugs :)
<sistpoty> ajmitch: I'm fiddling with revu processing incoming packages atm. :P
<ScottK> LaserJock: On revu, if I want the history of a package, I go to one page and it's all right there with debdiffs of mulitple versions of the same revision.
<jussi01> it would be helpful if packagers actually updated the bugs though, so many I come across are being packaged but nothing is mentioned on the bug
* enyc was suprised to discover that Ubuntu Dapper6.06 has various previous mysql client lib (binary compatibilitiy etc.) versions in  universe, but debian Etch4.0  does not....
* Fujitsu joins the conversation after reading the log.
<LaserJock> ScottK: yes the debdiff thing is one of my "hmm, how do we do that" points
<Fujitsu> enyc: Etch was released almost a year later, so it's not surprising they're different...
<enyc> Whereas, ubuntu has many things only in universe, when Debian Etch4.0 suports them in main...
<ScottK> The one thing I miss out of the package page on revu is the ability to do a diff of the debian dir only.
<TheMuso> LaserJock: I'm g uessing PPAs wouldn't allow the same version to be uploaded multiple times like REVU does.
<Fujitsu> enyc: Erm, Etch doesn't have supported/unsupported as such.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: It doesn't, though removal should be coming soon.
<TheMuso> RIght.
<enyc> Fujitsu: yes... not same as Ubuntu
<enyc> Fujitsu: i know
<mok0> Couldn't uploaders just bump the -0ubuntuX number for each upload?
<Fujitsu> mok0: Eeeeeek, no.
<Fujitsu> ~ppaX, please.
<Fujitsu> And cleaning the changelog before -0ubuntu1 is uploaded would be sane.
<LaserJock> it would depend for me how many bumps it needed ;-)
<LaserJock> but ~ppaX is the sane way to go
<Fujitsu> For some it's... quite a lot.
<ScottK> mok0: No.  That'd end up with ubuntu42 being the first version in the archive.
<sistpoty> Fujitsu: why? it was released to the public via ppa with that distinct version, wasn't it?
<Fujitsu> sistpoty: Not entirely sure we want an enormous number of changelog entries in the initial package, really.
<mok0> ScottK: No, it would be -1ubuntu
<ScottK> Then it shouldn't have an Ubuntu revision at all.
<Fujitsu> Fixing trivial packaging mistakes and the like.
<sistpoty> (same as a DD left in my changelog entries because he adopted my ubuntu package)
<Fujitsu> mok0: No, -0ubuntu
<sistpoty> though that's really details :P
<mok0> Fujitsu: Isn't first proper release 1ubuntu ?
<ScottK> In fact, now that I think of it, I think it would be good if PPA didn't allow revisions with ubuntu in the revision number.
<Fujitsu> mok0: No...
<Fujitsu> Aha, Soyuz Karma is targeted for 1.1.9.. I wonder how they'll do that.
<sistpoty> damn, then I'll need to upload s.th. again, right?
<mok0> Then we could use something like -0ubuntu0.1 ... etc
<ScottK> mok0: And you did it right on kssh.  You had me scared for a minute that I missed that when I uploaded it.
<mok0> ScottK: :-)
<ScottK> No, I think ppa shouldn't have ubuntu at all since it's not an ubuntu package.
<sistpoty> -0ppa1 < -0ubuntu1.. I guess that'd work
<mok0> I was just today thinking why the notes and package revisions done during mentoring shouldn't appear in changelog
<TheMuso> mok0: I am not so sure I would like that.
<sistpoty> mok0: because most of these are useless (e.g. package FTBFS)
<mok0> It would leave a log for people to learn from
<ScottK> mok0: Those are available via the REVU comments if people want them.
<ajmitch> ScottK: then we should use -0revu1 for anything on REVU
<ScottK> ajmitch: Except we aren't distributing binaries.
<ajmitch> so?
<ajmitch> we have built binaries in the past on REVU
<LaserJock> I'd think -0ubuntu0ppa1 would work or something similar
<sistpoty> ajmitch: but these weren't world-readable
<TheMuso> LaserJock: that looks ugly
<ScottK> Also it's from a spot that's not part of the official infrastructure.
<ajmitch> sistpoty: they sometimes were :)
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: There isn't an `ooh, clicky clicky give me binaries' button on REVU (there will be on LP soon)
<sistpoty> but that was a bug :P
<LaserJock> as the packages are built for Ubuntu and will eventually become 0ubuntu1 it seems a shame to ditch it
* ScottK worries in general about PPAs and the hord of bugs that are coming written against the crack version someone got from a PPA.
<LaserJock> sistpoty: hehe, your "bug" is LPs feature ;-)
<TheMuso> The thing is, if we have crazy versions, the packager doesn't learn about official versioning, and is likely to confuse them more.
<TheMuso> s/is/its/
<TheMuso> And I think packagers get overwhelmed enough sometimes with what we ask of them.
<jussi01> I have to agree with TheMuso here...
<jussi01> btw, what is ppa?
<LaserJock> TheMuso: if things are properly documented it's not quite so bad
<TheMuso> Personal Package Archive.
<TheMuso> LaserJock: For those who read docs, yes.
<TheMuso> LaserJock: But I fear that many don't.
<LaserJock> then they've got bigger problems
<Fujitsu> Do we have some stats on how many new packages get touched after initially uploaded?
<TheMuso> I guess thats the big question isn't it.
<ScottK> Fujitsu: You mean NEW packages REVUed being touched/modified before going to the archive?
<TheMuso> ScottK: I think he means once they are in the archive.
<ScottK> Ah.
<sistpoty> that's s.th. I think is long overdue for motu-land.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Yes.
<TheMuso> sistpoty: s.th?
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: you mean packages that *aren't* just dumped into the archive?
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: That's probably a better question, yes.
<sistpoty> TheMuso: statistics of ubuntu uploaded packages that are not maintained (vs. packages being maintained properly)
<TheMuso> ah
<Fujitsu> I've just got the one new one, and that's now in Debian and properly maintained, but I'm quite sure that's the exception rather than the rule.
* TheMuso has put through three new packages, two of which are now in main, and are also in Debian, and one which is only in Ubuntu, but I maintain it, and its almost dead upstream anyway.
* ScottK tends all the packages he's uploaded.
* ScottK has to go for dinner.  See you later.
* ajmitch has put a couple of new packages into ubuntu
<sistpoty> Fujitsu: my assumption is that there is quite some crap (maybe even from apt-get.org imports), though I'd really see some hard figures to prove that
<ajmitch> but they mostly go into debian
<TheMuso> Actually, make that 4 through. The last one I also maintain.
<TheMuso> And is not yet in Debian, and likely never will be anyway, due to what it is for.
<Fujitsu> .... did we previously import from apt-get.org?
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: sadly yes
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: a mandate from on high
<Fujitsu> Ewwww, that's why theere's so much crap.
<sistpoty> not to sure if that's the only source... I guess some people loose interest likewise
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Agreed.
<Fujitsu> 615 source packages not in Debian is seriously uncool.
<ajmitch> when the idea of universe having *everything* was encouraged
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: where do you see that? lucas' mdt pages on people.debian.org?
<Fujitsu> http://people.ubuntu.org.au/~fujitsu/motuscience/versions/universe.html
<Fujitsu> That doesn't include main, AFAICR, so no language packs.
<ajmitch> http://people.debian.org/~lucas/ubuntu-versions/unimultiverse-all.html
<ajmitch> 750 on there
<Fujitsu> Mine might only be universe, I'll check.
<ajmitch> stuff there that has probably been removed from debian
<Fujitsu> Mine has some really nasty removals support, so that could be it.
<ajmitch> and it's missing stuff that's in debian experimental (like ironpython)
<ajmitch> so it's not as bad as 615, but still too many
<sistpoty> compared to our active motus, yes
<Fujitsu> I think we either need to keep syncing existing things from apt-get.org, or kill them off... having them lieing dormant is pretty stupid.
<ajmitch> heh
<TheMuso> I like option 2 best.
<LaserJock> I just dump crap into Universe and leave ;-p
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Yeep.
<TheMuso> IMO we only trust stuff from Debian, or that goes through us.
<LaserJock> well
<sistpoty> sheesh, revu won't accept my upload... if I ever find out who coded that ... *g*
<LaserJock> this comes back to the big big question
<LaserJock> What *is* Universe?
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Something that needs to have a `dangerouscrap' component split out of it.
<LaserJock> Mark and I think dholbach see it as more-or-less a large FLOSS playground
<LaserJock> hence the apt-get.org stuff
<LaserJock> and not really caring what goes in as long as it's packaging is ok
<sistpoty> well, a playground doesn't necessarily mean to exclude non-maintained crap from it, which noone uses
<Fujitsu> But apt-get.org's packaging isn't necessarily OK.
<TheMuso> I don't like the term playground.
<LaserJock> well, the point with the non-maintained stuff is that it *could* be maintained
<LaserJock> that we throw in as much FLOSS as we can in the hopes that somebody'll pick it up
<ajmitch> wondering why we get so many bugs
<LaserJock> it doesn't matter if *we* maintain it or if it really gets maintained at all
<LaserJock> that's sort of one view
<Fujitsu> I'd like to have stuff in universe be able to be a bit maintained.
<LaserJock> this is why I was thinking of nixternal's crappy repo
<LaserJock> ;-)
<TheMuso> LaserJock: I often wonder whether dholbach's view of universe is a little optimistic.
<LaserJock> I was using the term PPA in my mind today
<sistpoty> well, sorting out what is non-maintained might be a first step. that way we could at least make it clear that *you'll be on your own when installing this software*
<minghua> I'd like to see a three-tier archive too, maybe not the "dangerouscrap" component name though.
<Fujitsu> sistpoty: Right. The `crap' component.
<LaserJock> one of the things I was thinking
<LaserJock> was maybe PPA offers us this oppritunity
<LaserJock> so we can say "heah, go get it from a PPA, we don't want it in our repo"
<ajmitch> sistpoty: sure, we could probably fit a few hundred packages into universe then :)
<sistpoty> ajmitch: :P
<TheMuso> heh
<sistpoty> well, most of the packages are maintained by debian and are in a pretty good shape though :P
* TheMuso prepares to do a fresh install of gutsy onto his mac mini.
<LaserJock> we have roughly 4000 ubuntuX packages
<sistpoty> (or rather because of that)
<Fujitsu> Do we track origin for synced packages?
<LaserJock> no
<Fujitsu> Darn.
<Fujitsu> That would make sense.
<LaserJock> there's really know metadata or whatever you'd call it
<LaserJock> to know where a package comes from
<LaserJock> s/know/no/
<Fujitsu> I guess we could look at old -changes.
<LaserJock> that's what upset me with the Maintainer spec
<sistpoty> hm.. is there any place apart from debian to sync from?
<LaserJock> sure
<sistpoty> LaserJock: as in?
<Fujitsu> sistpoty: Yeah, marillat and apt-get.org have been done in the past.
<LaserJock> apt-get.org, upstreams
<sistpoty> wooo... scary
<LaserJock> it's not a sync like what we do for Debian
<TheMuso> yuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck
<LaserJock> but that's where we're getting the packages
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Yes it is, I believe.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: don't we have to upload them?
* sistpoty always though the syncs are just normal uploads
<sistpoty> the "syncs"
<ajmitch> nope
<ajmitch> they'll be able to sync from PPAs as well
<TheMuso> nooooooooooo please tell me thats not true
<ajmitch> TheMuso: yes it's true, and it's intended by design
<LaserJock> IMO that's a good thing
<sistpoty> LaserJock: yes
<TheMuso> hrmf
<LaserJock> I'd rather be able to look at something LP than sync from "wherever"
<LaserJock> part of the design of PPA would be for us to more easily assess packages, I think
<sistpoty> this means especially to be able to review changes between pockets and move from one pocket to another, preferred by a web-interface (e.g. -proposed to -updates=
<TheMuso> Yeah, and we'd catch all the bad sync requests for such stuff.
<TheMuso> from non-MOTUs.
<LaserJock> well, processes wouldn't change, that I know of
<sistpoty> right, but the "handle -proposed by motu-sru" would be affected, though there is only a legacy motu-sru left ;)
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> I'd eventually like it so if needed we can have MOTU admin Universe
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: That'd be nice... but I can't see us being allowed to NEW stuff.
<LaserJock> well, I want the technical barriers out of the way
<LaserJock> whether we're allowed (and eventually I don't see why not) is up to the TB
<Fujitsu> Yeah, not requiring pretty much root access on drescher would be neat.
<sistpoty> well, how about being able to comment on the new queue by e.g. motu's
<sistpoty> ? ?
<LaserJock> hmmmmm
<sistpoty> that way, e.g. TB could sort out easily who is doing good comments and then make her or him an admin for universe
<Fujitsu> That just duplicates rREV
<Fujitsu> Oops. REVU.
<sistpoty> Fujitsu: no, revu hasn't got the feature (yet) that non-motus can comment on packages *g*
<imbrandon> afaik it has, someone just needs to enable that on a per account basis
<sistpoty> yes, but then the commenter can also advocate...
<sistpoty> now if revu would only process my upload, I'd be almost happy *g*
<sistpoty> grrrr
<ajmitch> sistpoty: want  me to help? :)
* Fujitsu has only set REVU up the once, and it was aages ago.
<sistpoty> ajmitch: sure... you got root@sparky?
* sistpoty set it up a few times, but it got ever more complex *g*
<ajmitch> yep
<sistpoty> ajmitch: great...
<LaserJock> you're setting it up on sparky?
<ajmitch> where have you hidden things?
<sistpoty> ajmitch: -> query, ok?
<ajmitch> sure
<sistpoty> LaserJock: yes, as an interim solution
* TheMuso groans at the UbuntuStudio guys wanting to me put in hacks... i.e using dpkg-divert to divert files owned by another package, and manually adding to a pam config file... grrr
<sistpoty> LaserJock: we're getting a faster box for it though, but we still need to assemble it
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Bwahah.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: I don't want to do it, yet they want these particular features that the hacks enable..
<Fujitsu> How about they do them properly?
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: I've tried pushing that, but nothing has come of it.
<LaserJock> well, there's not much they can do, that I'm aware of
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: You would have seen the pam rtprio thread on -devel?
<LaserJock> the setting conflict with the stock Ubuntu ones
<TheMuso> Thats one of them.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: When? I don't recall it.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: A while back now.
<LaserJock> oh, heah, it looks like we have delayed postinst stuff now
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Oh, dpkg triggers?
<LaserJock> Setting up volumeid (113-0ubuntu7) ...
<LaserJock> update-initramfs: deferring update (trigger activated)
<Fujitsu> Finally :D
<LaserJock> Processing triggers for initramfs-tools ...
<LaserJock> update-initramfs: Generating /boot/initrd.img-2.6.22-9-generic
<Fujitsu> Nafallo: Go to sleep.
<LaserJock> man, triggers could be so nice for TeX
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: need to put a temp. backupserver online first.
<LaserJock> if they work right that is
<Fujitsu> Mhm. I wonder when they'll appear in Debian.
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: was in IPhouse trying to resurrect our old one all day.
<TheMuso> LaserJock: That is sweet sweet new.s
<Fujitsu> Nafallo: Ah, so that's why my Jabber server is complaining at me?
<ScottK> Fujitsu: IIRC the release for triggers was only done when it was to make Ubuntu feature freeze.
<micahcowan> LaserJock, why great for TeX?
<ScottK> I expect it'll be in Debian once we've debugged it.
<micahcowan> (dunno anything about triggers)
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: dunno, mine is online. forgot to config my firewall on the server.
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: s/on/off/
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: it has layer 2 and can ping the layer3 linknet thou :-)
<minghua> LaserJock: According to Debian TeX maintainers, dpkg trigger won't help TeX packages.
<LaserJock> oh yeah, I saw that email
<LaserJock> I didn't quite get it
* Fujitsu hasn't kept up to date with debian-tex.
<LaserJock> micahcowan: because TeX package run the same stuff over and over and over again and it takes forever
<LaserJock> that and the stupid emacs packages
<Fujitsu> Hahah.
<LaserJock> ;-)
<Fujitsu> Yay, emacs.
<LaserJock> mine, I just about burned up my laptop on TheCore's snapshot packages
<LaserJock> s/mine/man/
* Fujitsu won't go anywhere near emacs.
<LaserJock> it's great for the data processing I do
<LaserJock> I haven't figured out how to move around columns in vim
<micahcowan> I have yet to find a better program than emacs with psgml-mode for XML editing.
<micahcowan> LaserJock, how do you do that in Emacs?
<LaserJock> rectangular regions, the lifeblood of my group ;-)
<LaserJock> Ctrl-x r k to kill a region
<LaserJock> Ctrl-x r y to yank it back
<LaserJock> so it takes me ~10 seconds to process a largish data file, doing a s/,/ / and chopping of the right column
<LaserJock> *off
<minghua> LaserJock: in vi, Ctrl-v (going into visual mode), x, then p.
<minghua> s/vi/vim/, to be exact.
<minghua> Err... ctrl-v, move cursors to select the region you want to move, x, then p.
<LaserJock> how do you go to the end of a file in visual mode?
<micahcowan> LaserJock, same as in normal mode. Visual mode is mostly normal mode with an active selection.
<minghua> LaserJock: G
<LaserJock> oh, that is nice
<LaserJock> minghua: thanks
<mok0> I am working on a postinst script that downloads files using curl. How should the dependency be defined?
<micahcowan> There are three versions of visual mode, LaserJock; a rectangle-oriented one (minghua's Ctrl-v), a character-oriented one (v), and a line-oriented one (V).
<mok0> ... and how to check if the machine has network access at all?
<LaserJock> ah, so many modes so little time ;-)
<micahcowan> :)
* minghua is a new learner of visual mode, too.
<micahcowan> mok0, you might consider using wget or similar instead, since it's Priority: standard vs Priority: optional.
<micahcowan> (disclaimer: I'm the maintainer of wget).
<micahcowan> I actually think curl is superior for single-file fetching in several respects, but I think wget is a little more widely-used.
<mok0> micahcowan:  wget would work
<micahcowan> Might want to see how some packages, like the restricted flash stuff, downloads their stuff, and emulate that.
<mok0> micahcowan:  thanks, good idea, I will take a look at that
<LaserJock> well, now minghua has totally made emacs obsolete for me ;-)
* TheMuso is really in between a rock and a hard place.........
<LaserJock> my boss will not be pleased
<Fujitsu> Yay, the less emacs in the world the better.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Why?
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Those damn hacks.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: They want them in, badly.
<LaserJock> how many files do you need to divert?
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<minghua> \o/
<TheMuso> Two, but they are owned by another package
<LaserJock> two doesn't see that awfully bad
<TheMuso> And append a line to a pam config file.
<TheMuso> Its bad enough for me.
<minghua> I'd rather let no package touch my PAM config file.
<TheMuso> Especially since I wrote a a spec for sevilla to do it properly, yet the ubuntustudio guys that were there didn't push it
<LaserJock> why can't you do it properly?
<minghua> TheMuso: Then why are you in a difficult position?  Are you responsible for approving or rejecting it?
<LaserJock> and btw, I have 47 diverted files on my system, I doubt 2 more would kill me ;-)
<TheMuso> LaserJock: Because it erquires coordination with seb128/desktop team to do so, and there is a hairy situation with the file containing translations.
<TheMuso> LaserJock: Are they owned by another package?
<LaserJock> some of them surely
<TheMuso> hmmm
<LaserJock> that's kinda the point of dpkg-divert
<LaserJock> like kdesudo diverts /usr/bin/kdesu from kdebase-bin
<LaserJock> I mean, it's not ideal for sure
<TheMuso> right
<LaserJock> but perhaps it's good enough until the proper solution is ready?
<TheMuso> yeah
<LaserJock> it's just Universe ;-)
<TheMuso> true
* Fujitsu throws something at LaserJock.
<LaserJock> me adds the gutsy-crappy repo
<LaserJock> I guess it should be a component rather
<LaserJock> so http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ gutsy good bad ugly ;-)
<minghua> I like the "good bad ugly" name.
<minghua> Although in gstreamer's interpretation, main == good, universe == bad, restricted == ugly.
<LaserJock> yeah so we just need
<LaserJock> good bad ugly crappy
<LaserJock> and then when we get experimental
<LaserJock> we can call it crackful
<LaserJock> "heah man, if you really want bleeding edgy, grab the crappy crackful repo" ;-)
<LaserJock> dang it
<LaserJock> I can't even type edge properly anymore :(
* Fujitsu wonders why we have so many -0.0 versions... is that some particularly crackful apt-get.org versioning system?
<TheMuso> Gotta love bzr  for being able to bring files back from the dead.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: That feature is rather useful and a lifesaver at times, yes.
<TheMuso> Yup.
<Fujitsu> Hi bddebian.
<minghua> By "bring files back from the dead", you guys mean get deleted file back in work directory?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bddebian> Hi Fujitsu
<sistpoty> hm... where would I find /usr/bin/mail in?
<bddebian> No responses to my motu mail :-(
<Fujitsu> !find /usr/bin/mail
<sistpoty> bddebian: ?
<ubotu> File /usr/bin/mail found in mailutils, mailx
<Fujitsu> sistpoty: ^^
<sistpoty> Fujitsu: no, don't have it installed on my box, likewise on sparky :(
<bddebian> sistpoty: I sent an e-mail to ubuntu-motu ML
<Fujitsu> sistpoty: I asked ubotu where it was, and it replied.
<sistpoty> bddebian:either I haven't got it yet or I ignored it :P
<sistpoty> Fujitsu: ah... good ubotu :)
<bddebian> heh
<imbrandon> Unpacking libmtp6 (from .../libmtp6_0.2.1-0ubuntu2_i386.deb) ...
<imbrandon> dpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/libmtp6_0.2.1-0ubuntu2_i386.deb (--unpack): trying to overwrite `/etc/udev/rules.d/libmtp.rules', which is also in package libmtp5
<imbrandon> grr
<bddebian> Is the wiki down?
<Nafallo> imbrandon: yea, annoying.
<bddebian> nm
<soothsayer> ScottK: I think recountdiff from patchutils does what I want (Too tired to verify right now). See also rediff
<soothsayer> s/what I want/what I was looking for earlier
<Hobbsee> pygi: ping
<xhaker_> imbrandon, bug #133165
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 133165 in libmtp "Should conflict with libmtp5" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/133165
<xhaker_> check my two last comments
<xhaker_> i think that fixes it
<Hobbsee> oh meh, why have a libmtp-common?
<xhaker_> i need someone to review it
<Hobbsee> i dont think libmtp-common is the way to go there - they're not supposed to be coinstallable.
<xhaker_> Hobbsee, doko suggested it. It contains the udev rules and hotplug stuff
<Hobbsee> xhaker_: would be good if you can put the (LP: #foobar) in the changelog
<xhaker_> well, from what i understand doko suggested it for the future.. not this particular bug.. so when libmtp7 gets here it'd be easier
<Hobbsee> seeing as the packages have all been rebuilt anyway...and the new versions all depedn on the new library, i really cant see the point
<xhaker_> it happens to solve this bug because i've made libmtp-common conflict with the older version of the package libmtp6 and the others before
<xhaker_> i don't know.. i'm trying to do my best
<xhaker_> Hobbsee, how would you go to fix this one?'
<Hobbsee> xhaker_: i'd use the first debdiff
<xhaker_> and keep adding the older lib to conflicts whenever the soname changes?
<Hobbsee> xhaker_: you can drop libmtp2 off there as well - it wasnt in dapper, and we dont support edgy--> gutsy upgrades
<xhaker_> Hobbsee, please make your opinion noticed on the bug report
<xhaker_> if you want, that is
<Hobbsee> doko_: ping
<Hobbsee> xhaker_: uploaded.
<xhaker_> Hobbsee, I hope it works :) thanks for your time
<Hobbsee> no problem
<Hobbsee> it should work
<Hobbsee> xhaker_: i dropped the libmtp2 conflicts as well
* xhaker_ hugs Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> :)
<mok0> I used to be able to find the build queue on LP. Does anyone remember how to get there?
<Hobbsee> mok0: buildds, or the new queue?
<sistpoty> can anyone help me setup apache? http://pastebin.com/m25f4852b. I get an 404 for http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/min12xxw-0708180532/min12xxw_0.0.9-1build2.dsc
<mok0> New queue
<Hobbsee> pygi: what's the status of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnash/+bug/131864 ?  youv'e said it's fixed, yet not marked it fix released.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131864 in gnash "gnash crash! ...gnash 0.8.1~trunk.070802-0ubuntu3 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess post-installation script returned error exit status 2" [Undecided,Confirmed] 
<leonel> is there an estimated time for  ubuntu 6.06.2 ?
<leonel> found it : https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+milestone/ubuntu-6.06.2
<sistpoty> ok, revu is back up (at least, some kind of), so you might be able to upload to revu again
<TheMuso> sistpoty: Cool.
<sistpoty> please note, that currently the db doesn't know anything about reviewers, so no motu can comment to an upload. I'll try to fix this once I'm sober again ;)
<TheMuso> heh ok.
<nixternal> haha
<sistpoty> oh, and anything that goes wrong: ajmitch has root on sparky, so he can fix it :P
<nixternal> booyah!
<mok0> sistpoty: I can't reach revu, is it the same url?
* ajmitch hides
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch
* bddebian shines a flashlight on ajmitch
<ScottK> Hobbsee: But we do support Dapper to Gutsy+1 updates.
<ScottK> mok0: It's probably your DNS lagging.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: it wasnt in dapper
<Hobbsee> ScottK: dapper amarok had no libmtp at all
<ScottK> Ah.  OK.
<bddebian> ajmitch: Did you happen to see my e-mail to ubuntu-motu?
<bddebian> yeah sistpoty :)
<bddebian> sistpoty: Actually why not just leave it down until Gutsy+1 opens up? :-)
<sistpoty> mok0: maybe the dns isn't updated yet (try sparky.informatik.uni-erlangen.de in the meantime)
<sistpoty> bddebian: :P
<mok0> sistpoty: yes sparky works
<sistpoty> ok, I'm off to bed now, finally... good n8 everyone
<bddebian> Should we just blindly do things like: Bug #124295
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 124295 in audacious-plugins "The compiliation should have --enable-chardet" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/124295
<bddebian> gnight sistpoty
<StevenK> man-di: What's happening with sear? Now it needs a UVFe to hit Ubuntu.
<bddebian> Why did we get rid of the Needs Info status on LP?
<Hobbsee> bddebian: it's renamed to incomplete
<Fujitsu> bddebian: Renamed to Incomplete.
<minghua> Fujitsu: Adding the BSD readline (called libeditline) support in gnuplot is not as easy as I thought. :-(
<Hobbsee> superm1: ping
<Fujitsu> minghua: How hard is it?
<Hobbsee> keescook: ping
<minghua> Fujitsu: need some autoconf-fu (configure.in needs to be changed), then we can test if the needed functions are implemented in libeditline.
<bddebian> Thx Hobbsee, Fujitsu
<bddebian> gnuplot is fairly hideous iirc :-)
<bddebian> Anyone know audacious very well?
<Hobbsee> bddebian: i think everyone still calls it needs info though :P
<superm1> Hobbsee, i'm here for a few minutes
<superm1> did you need something?
<Hobbsee> superm1: just letting you know, we're in uvf
<superm1> Hobbsee, i know
<Hobbsee> superm1: was your upload request filed before uvf date?
<superm1> yesterday Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> "yesterday" was friday.
<Hobbsee> was it before or after the ubuntu dev meeting, which was when the freeze came in place?
<Fujitsu> superm1: `Yesterday' spans 48 hours.
<superm1> keescook had uploaded yesterday
<superm1> and then somethign went wrong
<superm1> and he redid the upload afaik
<Hobbsee> superm1: you must be in the US.
<superm1> yes
<superm1> so is keescook
<Hobbsee> superm1: seeing as you appear not to understand the concept that there are other people in the world, and the existance of timezones.
<superm1> he is a on the far west coast, and i'm in the midwest
<superm1> thought you knew i was in the US :)
<Hobbsee> "yesterday" is a relevant term, dependant on the timezone you're in
<Hobbsee> sure, but you should learn to give days and times in UTC, like the rest of the world.  you cant assume that everyone will bend to your timezone.
<Hobbsee> like i cant assume that you'll bend to mine.
<superm1> right
<Hobbsee> so, things like "yesterday", "at 9pm local", arent terribly helpful - we shouldnt have to convert out fo your timezone, and then back into ours.
<xhaker_> any java person here?
<Hobbsee> and no, i dont remember where everyone is - but anyone who tends to think that the world revolves around them, w.r.t time, tends to be in the US :)
<superm1> well i'm not sure what happened to the upload, i'm assuming keescook accidently pushed it to the wrong place, because there were no source changes when he reuploaded
<superm1> but you'll have to check with him
<ScottK> xhaker_: man-di is the person you want.
<superm1> he said that he got "Accepted" messages back when it was done
<Hobbsee> superm1: i plan to, yeah.
<Hobbsee> superm1: obviously, if we let some people do it, then everybody else (with more risky and big changes) will go "but you let them do it, why not me too?"
<superm1> and in -mythtv he said at 23:12 UTC, he said "<keescook> superm1: found my idiocy, got an exception, re-uploading myth{tv,plugins} now."
<Hobbsee> which is why it's an issue
<xhaker_> ScottK, thanks, already sent some his way :) it's just that i'd like to fix it now!! you know :D
<ScottK> Sure.  I don't know a bit about Java, so can't help you there.
<superm1> Hobbsee, if it comes down to it, i'll be glad to refile it as a UVFe considering the timing
* xhaker_ had a hard time figuring out how to copy some text from xterm
<Hobbsee> superm1: it's uploaded now.  the announcement has been CC'd now
<Hobbsee> i wonder who he got an exception off...
<Hobbsee> oh well
<xhaker_> ScottK, ../localfile.c:12:17: error: jni.h: No such file or directory -> not quite javaish but i can't figure it out myself
<ScottK> You want one of these packages for a build-dep or depends depending on where you got the error:
<ScottK> http://packages.ubuntu.com/cgi-bin/search_contents.pl?word=+jni.h&searchmode=searchfiles&case=insensitive&version=gutsy&arch=i386
<StevenK> Hobbsee, ScottK: There ought to be a bug where one (or more of us) says "Yes, I Rubber Stamp this upload."
<ScottK> Or something.
<ScottK> Agreed.
<xhaker_> Rubber Stamp is good?
<ScottK> UVFe isn't that hard to fill out.
<ScottK> People ought to just do it.
<ScottK> But I'm in a grumpy mood....
* bddebian is grumpy too
* xhaker_ rebuilding eclipse / fingers crossed
<ScottK> StevenK: What did you mean?  Just a standing UVFe rubber stamp bug that we can comment on?
<ajmitch> StevenK: sounds good, can I have one for anything I upload? :)
<StevenK> ScottK: If people want a UVFe, they need to file a bug, and then ask/poke us pointing us at it, and one (or more) of us comments saying "Fine, go ahead."
<ScottK> Agreed.  Just thought you might be suggesting something else.
<ScottK> The first one of us should comment on the bug and the 2nd ack should set it to confirmed.
<ScottK> Then whoever is going to upload can execute.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I would have thought that if you were involved with MOTU/Ubuntu development, you shoud be on devel-announce.
<ScottK> TheMuso: One would thing.
<ScottK> thing/think
<tonyyarusso> StevenK: Sounds a lot like what I was just pondering in the e-mail I wrote to -motu ML.
<tonyyarusso> (the rubber stamp thing - could be integrated everywhere)
<StevenK> tonyyarusso: Great minds, etc etc
<tonyyarusso> ya :)
<ScottK> StevenK: How to deal with people who upload without a UVFe past the freeze is another question.
<StevenK> ScottK: I'm not sure there is anything we can do aside from "please don't do that."
<ScottK> This gets back to Hobbsee's recurring point that there is no process to fire a MOTU.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: well, this is true, but some developers arent even on ubuntu-devel
<Hobbsee> er, soem MOTU's
<TheMuso> Seems crazy to me.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: this is true, but i'd hate to fire them due to an accidental crossing of red tape.  however, those who consistently break said red tape, and so therefore risk the archive, are a different story
<Hobbsee> think of this one - it's a mythbuntu upload, so it wont affect anything else in the archive
<StevenK> I'm not ...
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Agreed.
<ScottK> Agreed that I wouldn't fire anyone for this upload, but it's be a bad mark in that direction in my book.
<ScottK> it's/it'd
<Hobbsee> bah.  everyone probably missed that, with the split
* Hobbsee pastes
<Hobbsee> [14:11]  <Hobbsee> ScottK: this is true, but i'd hate to fire them due to an accidental crossing of red tape.  however, those who consistently break said red tape, and so therefore risk the archive, are a different story
<Hobbsee> [14:11]  <Hobbsee> think of this one - it's a mythbuntu upload, so it wont affect anything else in the archive
<Hobbsee> [14:12]  <Hobbsee> also, it's still early
<Hobbsee> [14:12]  <Hobbsee> however, if someone decides to upload something important...hmmmm....say, oh, whatever, a lib that a lot of things depend on, then, late in the cycle, then i will have their head.
<Hobbsee> [14:13]  <Hobbsee> because they're attemping to (or actually) break the archive by doing so.
<Hobbsee> [14:13]  <Hobbsee> i think it's those we really need to worry about, rather than the odd red-tape breaker of something low risk
<Hobbsee> [14:14]  <Hobbsee> as in, tell them off, sure, and make sure they know the purpose of the freeze, and that it is in place, (so that they dont do it again), but no need to throw them out of MOTU
<Hobbsee> [14:14]  <Hobbsee> of course, if htey keep doing it, then it comes under the category of "attempting to break the archive by ignoring, and not following the rules), then we look at getting them out of MOTU
<StevenK> [14:16]  < StevenK> The occasional, accidental, "Oh I'm so sorry! I forgot" is okay. The consistent forgetters are a different story.
<Hobbsee> yes, the "forgetters"
<xtknight> some news i missed? :O
<TheMuso> But how can you not forget. :)
<ScottK> xtknight: Just that we are past Upstream Version Freeze for Gutsy and someone uploaded a new upstream version.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: if you dont watch irc and the discussions there, easily.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i've only recently forwarded the freeze mail to the motu ML
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: That was what prompted me to say that anybody involved with development should be on devel-announce.
* ajmitch is interested to see discussion of "firing" people
<ajmitch> we always get the complaints of too much red tape, you don't trust MOTUs to make good judgements, etc
<ajmitch> the suggestion comes up every release that we shouldn't need a motu-uvf team
<TheMuso> I have seen the UVF team work in previous cycles.
<TheMuso> SO I think its a good thing.
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
<davromaniak> revu page is online, so we can hope have it working well this week ??
<Fujitsu> davromaniak: You should be able to upload to it.
<davromaniak> I cannot login in the main page
<Fujitsu> davromaniak: You'll probably need to upload something before it creates an account.
<davromaniak> ok
<Fujitsu> This is on a clean database.
<davromaniak> ok
<Zombie> What is the URL for new Submissions?
<davromaniak> the same as usual
<davromaniak> revu.tauware.de
<davromaniak> how do I have to create an account on revu
<davromaniak> because I can upload, but I can't login
<siretart> davromaniak: has your upload been accepted?
<davromaniak> yes
<Fujitsu> davromaniak: Have you tried to recover your password?
<Fujitsu> Hm, it's not generating new passwords properly, apparently.
<davromaniak> ok
<Lamego> what would be the best word to describe "Desktop Apps, Server Apps, Console Apps" ? class or type ?
<Frogzoo> platform's not right
* Frogzoo ponders
<Lamego> "Browsing software for Desktop, the following classes are also available."
<Frogzoo> Lamego: = use
<Lamego> use ?
<Frogzoo> use = desktop/server/console
<Lamego> it will not look good "Please select the following use types" :P
<Frogzoo> everyone's a critic :p
<Lamego> ;)
<Lamego> I think i will use "type"
<SimIJskes> i have patched libpoppler so that it delegates some font name translation to fontconfig, is there anybody else working on this subject?
<SimIJskes> i have patched libpoppler so that it delegates some font name translation to fontconfig, is there anybody willing to adopt the patch?
<geser> SimIJskes: try asking pitti (he's currently on vacation) or tkamppeter in #ubuntu-devel during the week
<SimIJskes> geser: thnks
<Hobbsee> Kmos: no, UVF does *not* start on the 30th, that's new package freeze.
<TheMuso> Evening folks.
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso
<Kmos> Hobbsee: ah ok =)
<Kmos> and when it ends again ?
<Hobbsee> Kmos: gutsy+1
<Hobbsee> Kmos: ie, it goes on forever, for gutsy.
<Kmos> :)
<Hobbsee> Kmos: think about the point of it, and you'll understand why
<Kmos> Hobbsee: yep
<Kmos> geser asked me if ddclient it's an UVF
<Hobbsee> i saw
<Kmos> but it was registered on LP at 15
<Kmos> and have some bugs that need to be fixed on gutsy because it's not working correctly
<Kmos> about the ip update
<Kmos> members.dyndns.com is not correct, it's members.dyndns.org
<Kmos> dyndns.com is only used to talk about the website
<Kmos> ddclient team have talked to dyndns.com about that
* Hobbsee loves it how people cant read.
<Hobbsee> launchpad users is still *not* for requesting cds.  it says that in big bold letters above the page
<Hobbsee> when registering
<Hobbsee> perhaps they're just giving their addresses so that they can have someone cart them off and teach them how to read.
<Kmos> Hobbsee: yeah, i've answered to that mail
<phoenix_> always wondered what moto mend
<phoenix_> erm motu
<phoenix_> anybody here ?
* Hobbsee waves
<phoenix_> hey Hobbsee
<phoenix_> i got a Q
* TheMuso is also here.
<phoenix_> thats kinda needing devs to it
<Hobbsee> shoot
<TheMuso> !ask | phoenix_
<ubotu> phoenix_: Don't ask to ask a question. Just ask your question :)
<phoenix_> u answered ;)
<phoenix_> bye
<Zombie> Does anyone know how to add support for different resolutions in Ubuntu?
<Hobbsee> Zombie: sounds like a #ubuntu type of question
<phoenix_> lol
<phoenix_> Hobbsee,  what motu kinda Q ?
<Hobbsee> Zombie: also, my psychic pony is on holidays, so i cant know what type of video card you have.  the answer depends on that.
<Zombie> Its an Intel 940
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: lol
<Hobbsee> Zombie: gutsy?
<Zombie> Fiesty.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: RAOF gets the credit
<Zombie> Gutsy isn't stable.
<TheMuso> hehe
<Hobbsee> Zombie: then this really isnt the place (most of us arent running feisty), but install 915resolution
<Zombie> When will Gutsy be blessed as Stable?
<Hobbsee> when it's released.
<phoenix_> after enough zombies ran it ;)
<phoenix_> i give up
<phoenix_> i cant install ubuntu
<phoenix_> and nobody knows something to help
<phoenix_> damn via chipset
<Hobbsee> elkbuntu: was running with a via chipset, iirc
<DarkMageZ> phoenix_, the digg.com user/zombies have been running it since alpha1. that doesn't make it stable.
<elkbuntu> eh?
<phoenix_> hey elkbuntu
<phoenix_> u run via chipset gutsy ?
<elkbuntu> yeah?
<phoenix_> i cant seem to manage the install
<phoenix_> care to help ?
<phoenix_> it doesnt detect my hdd at all
<phoenix_> via vt8251
<phoenix_> and i only found a dapper driver
<elkbuntu> what part of the system is the vt8251?
<phoenix_> the ide chipset
<phoenix_> erm sata
<elkbuntu> i dont have sata, so i am not a valid test case, sorry
<phoenix_> can u point, me wher to look for the feisty driver ?
<elkbuntu> phoenix_, if you're after support, join #ubuntu+1 where other gutsy users might be able to help you.
<phoenix_> thkx
<phoenix_> http://www.viaarena.com/default.aspx?PageID=420&OSID=45&CatID=3270&SubCatID=167
<phoenix_> thats only driver i found
<phoenix_> but it isnt similar to yours then :$
<phoenix_> k bye and thkx
<Hobbsee> greetings jono
<jono> hey Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> jono: what are you doing here?  it's a weekend
<jono> Hobbsee: just logged on to see whats going on
<jono> going to have an afternoon kip in a sec
<Hobbsee> jono: heh.  that would be working, right?
<Hobbsee> normal people arent supposed to do that on weekends.
<jono> Hobbsee: heh, this is not a normal job
<jono> :P
<jono> I seem to always work at weekends :P
<jono> might go and do some recording soon actually :)
<Hobbsee> awww.
<jono> its all good :)
<Hobbsee> i get so bored on weekends, if i dont have $workthatigetpaidfor to go to
<jono> cool
<jono> we actively encourage Hobbsee to not get $workthatshegetspaidfor so she spends more time on Ubuntu :)
<Hobbsee> jono: hah.
<Hobbsee> jono: well, i'd like the money
<jono> I am gonna piss around with packaging soon too
<jono> keen to experiment with MOTU
<Hobbsee> cool
<elkbuntu> try not to piss on anything edible :
* elkbuntu ducks and runs
<TheMuso> lol
* Hobbsee tries to block the mental images
<DarkSun88> Hill
<davromaniak> I can arrive to have my new password on revu, :(
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Bug #123411 seems reasonable to me.  Thoughts?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 123411 in pommed "[UVFe]  Please sync pommed (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/123411
<Hobbsee> ScottK: looks fine
<ScottK> OK.  I've acked it.  You want to be #2 then and ack it to the archive?
<Hobbsee> ok
<bluefoxicy> I love upgrades.
<bluefoxicy> just bam.
<bluefoxicy> I can't get back to X
<bluefoxicy> CAF1
<bluefoxicy> login.
<bluefoxicy> killall gnome-screensaver
<bluefoxicy> rofl
<bluefoxicy> everything's crashing
<mr_pouit> ScottK: Hobbsee: thanks :)
<Hobbsee> mr_pouit: no problem
<ScottK> No problem.
<bluefoxicy> was vmware server dropped from gutsy
<mok0> Is it safe to do a dist-upgrade feisty -> gutsy??
<geser> try and you will know :)
<geser> you could also try asking in #ubuntu+1 if somebody upgrade to gutsy recently
<mok0> geser: true :-)
<ScottK> mok0: I've done it and had no problems and while we are past Upstream Version Freeze, a lot of stuff is still changing rapidly.
<ScottK> mok0: I wouldn't do it on a system you actually need to have at any given moment.
<mok0> I did s/feisty/gutsy in sources.list, but do I need to keep feisty repos?
<ScottK> What I do is have a spare hard drive for my laptop.  One with Feisty and one with Gutsy.
<ScottK> No
<mok0> This is my box at home... I use it to play with...
<ScottK> Then have fun and go for it.  It'll be a good learning experience.
<mok0> Yeah, what the heck, I'll try
<Frogzoo> hey, if they ever get apt to run over bit torrent, can we get mp3 debs?
<ScottK> Back up your data first...
<geser> mok0: I don't know of any actual problems, but I upgraded weeks ago
<mok0> Too late :-)
<geser> mok0: please file any upgrade problem as a bug
<mok0> It's downloading 1245 packages
<mok0> 1.3 Gbyes
<mok0> Hi minghua, did you get a chance to look at btk-core?
<minghua> mok0: Hi.  I got your mail, but sorry, I haven't had time to look at the package yet.
<minghua> mok0: I suggest you send mail to ubuntu-motu list to try getting more attentions.
<mok0> I made some changes, f.ex. I left out the example programs
<minghua> mok0: Eventually I'll look at it, but I've been busy these days.
<mok0> minghua: OK, I can do that, I just thought you should have a first chance :-)
<minghua> mok0: Thanks for that, I am afraid I'll have to pass this first chance. :-)
<mok0> NP
<keescook> what kind of crack is apache2-mpm-itk !?
<geser> does it need a rebuild again?
<keescook> geser: well, I didn't know it existed, and the feisty apache security update broke it because it builds a hard version depend against apache.
<keescook> instead of using something saner.  Anyway, I'm rebuilding it for feisty now.
<geser> keescook: it's the same in gutsy, I already rebuild it twice for the last two apache2 uploads
* ScottK notes from the package description, "Please note that this MPM is highly experimental, and is not from the same tree as the other MPMs."
<minghua> IIRC, the story is that apache2-mpm-itk must be synced with apache itself, but apache maintainers don't want to include -mpm-itk in their package, so -mpm-itk becomes a separate source package, and needs a binNMU whenever apache is updated.
<ScottK> Appears it's crack by design then.
<mok0> Uh uh. Just got an error with dist-upgrade: E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)
<mok0> Will try rebooting, see you later...
<simu> hello, i just uploaded a package to revu and looking for reviews. it's called rotoscope, a nice gnome graphics app. I made a package for feisty is there a chance to uload it too the fiesty universe or is there only gusty packaging allowed?
<geser> simu: wrong version and distribution: should be 0.2-0ubuntu1 and gutsy
<geser> the new REVU needs some finetuning
<zul> afternoon
<ScottK> afternoon zul
<ScottK> Any thoughts on a UVFe that says we just rewrote the entire application?
<geser> zul: are you planning to update xen-meta soon? it has currently some unmet deps on amd64 (depends *-3.0 instead of *-3.1)
<simu> geser: is it possible to add new packages to feisty's universe?
<geser> simu: no
<zul> geser: yep probably today sometime
<geser> ok, then I won't touch it
<zul> if you want to go ahead
<joejaxx> anyone know what revu.t.d what running? distro wise?
<zul> ScottK: if mvo is ok with im ok with it
<zul> joejaxx: i heard freebsd ;)
<simu> geser: why debian1? there is no rotoscope package in debian
<simu> geser: sorry ubuntu1
<ScottK> I guess I wonder why if, as stated in the bug "This is all we (upstream developers) have been working for the last five months for inclusion on Ubuntu Gutsy" it's after the freeze and not before.
<ScottK> I guess I'll ask.
<zul> ScottK: they should still follow procedure though, but in theory im ok with it
<ScottK> Sure.
<zul> diffstat changelog debdiff, blah blah
<geser> simu: all package modified by Ubuntu get a -XubuntuY revision to not collide with Debian revisions. As there is no Debian package for it currently we use -0ubuntu1 as revision
<simu> geser: I see, I correct the version and build a gusty package and upload it again, thax for the feedback
<joejaxx> zul: oh ok
<zul> joejaxx: i was kidding
<joejaxx> oh
* joejaxx goes to install revu on deb4 :)
<sistpoty> hi folks
<joejaxx> hello sistpoty :D
<geser> Hi sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi joejaxx and geser
<ScottK> Hi sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi ScottK
<joejaxx> :)
<geser> who is responsible for REVU now?
<sistpoty> geser: what do you mean by responsible?
<sistpoty> geser: as in taking care for the box?
<sistpoty> geser: that would be siretart and me then
<zul>  geser: #133303 wouldnt it be easier just to grab the patch your self and just upload it yourself?
<geser> can you allow access to the extracted directory for the uploads again? e.g. http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/rotoscope-0708182100/rotoscope-0.2/
<joejaxx> so revu is back?
<sistpoty> geser: it's on my list... currently I'm trying to fix the lost pw thingy
<geser> ok, no hurry
<sistpoty> joejaxx: yes, but it's only an interim solution running on sparky, so it may be a little bit slow
<joejaxx> ah ok
<joejaxx> sparky?
<geser> I guess sparky.ubuntuwire.com, one of the community machines for ubuntu-dev
<sistpoty> joejaxx: the sparc box of ubuntu-wire (standing in erlangen)
<joejaxx> oh ok
<geser> zul: it would be faster than waiting for the sync but is it worth it to upload it as 2.6-2.1build1?
<ScottK> zul: I'd say it's better to sync it and stay in sync with Debian that do manual packaging work.
<zul> sure whatever
<zul> no skin off my nose :)
<zul> is anyone doing wine?
<geser> zul: can you look over the debdiff for xen-meta? http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/34194/
<geser> zul: are the xen-image-* for -server and -amd64 still the current ones? and is it ok for -desktop to depend on the linux-xen meta-package?
<zul> 2.6.19 is gone for gutsy so linux-xen should be fine
<sistpoty> geser: directories can be browsed again on revu :)
<zul> back later
<geser> zul: should ubuntu-xen-server also depend on linux-xen?
<geser> zul: there is no linux-xen on amd64. I can only find xen-image-2.6.19-4-generic-amd64
<ScottK> Would you believe one of our dogs stepped on the power switch?  Ugh.
<geser> secure it better
<ScottK> As a rule I do.  I had an UPS failure recently and things are a bit on a shoestring until the new one comes.
<nixternal> ScottK: hah, my dog unplugs the power to my computers
<nixternal> and he chews up my cat5 whenever he gets a chance
<ScottK> This was one aspect of two of them deciding to have a disagreement under my desk (and they aren't small dogs).
<nixternal> my pit bull is perfect, he doesn't mess with stuff, he is calm and laid back
<nixternal> the Yorki, my lord is a little terrorist
<ScottK> When my wife and I got married 6 years ago, she had two dogs and I had one.  They are still sorting out dominance issues.
<ScottK> Their latest thing is disagreeing over who gets to lay closest to me at my desk.
<nixternal> lol
<nixternal> my pitbull gets under the desk and sleeps with his head on my foot
<nixternal> the yorki wants to get on the desk
<nixternal> I am willing to bet that the dog whisperer would get owned by the yorki
<ScottK> It doesn't help matters that the male is currently stuck wearing an Elizabethan collar and has trouble getting some places.
<ScottK> He's grumpier than usual to start with and, I swear, the other two dogs tease him about it.
<nixternal> lol
<simu> hello, i just uploaded a package to revu and looking for reviews. it's called rotoscope, a nice gnome graphics app.
<simu> I corrected the version now
<jussi01> simu: revu is down afaik
<jussi01> read the topic ;)
<simu> update the topic
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:ScottK] : "Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | http://ubuntu.joejaxx.org/ - TOP 10 Uploaders/Packages | REVU is back up on an interim server"
* jussi01 hugs ScottK
<sistpoty> well, the account database of revu is still (almost) empty, I'll take for this later
<sistpoty> +care
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:ScottK] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | http://ubuntu.joejaxx.org/ - TOP 10 Uploaders/Packages | REVU is mostly back up on an interim server
<simu> the time on REVU is wrong
<ScottK> I'd file that under "mostly" and not worry about it too much for now.
<simu> bad-distribution-in-changes-file gutsy
<simu> what ist the dist target for gutsy? do I have to use "unstable"
<ScottK> Gutsy is correct.  You can ignore that.
<simu> good
<asac> siretart: you do bzr stuff for debian, right?
<asac> siretart: probably you know that in debian bzr and friends are uninstallable because python-debian was updated :)
<soothsayer> I want to enable a particular configure option. Where do I do that in the package? An older version of the package had an obvious configure rule in configure.status in debian/rules. The new version is pretty spartan (3 lines). Where do I specify the option?
<Seveas> soothsayer, I assume the debian/rules uses CDBS
<soothsayer> Seveas: I'm a bit of noobie when it comes to debian packaging, how can I tell? The first two lines are 'include' directives
<Seveas> do the iclude cdbs in the path?
<soothsayer> One of them being debhelper
<soothsayer> Seveas:  Ah yeah, CDBS
<soothsayer> include /usr/share/cdbs/...
<Seveas> soothsayer, firefox /usr/share/doc/cdbs/cdbs-doc.html
<Seveas> that's the cdbs manual :)
<soothsayer> Seveas: Alright thanks. I though CDBS was only patch management
<Seveas> iirc you need to set DEB_CONFIGURE_EXTRA_ARGS
<soothsayer> Seveas: Thanks
<Seveas> ah, it's DEB_CONFIGURE_EXTRA_FLAGS
<Seveas> see file:///usr/share/doc/cdbs/cdbs-doc.html#id2541616
<soothsayer> Yeah I'm looking at it
<soothsayer> Thanks
<soothsayer> Can someone confirm the following bug: libxmlrpc-c3/gutsy does not build from source
<TheMuso> soothsayer: Do you have a bug number?
<soothsayer> TheMuso: It's not an official bug
<TheMuso> soothsayer: Well perpaps it should be filed.
<TheMuso> but I'll have a look.
<soothsayer> TheMuso: There seems to be a hardcoded directory in 'clean'
<TheMuso> soothsayer: Well I'll have a look.
<soothsayer> TheMuso: Thanks
<TheMuso> soothsayer: According to the latest version report in gutsy, it built fine.
<TheMuso> from launchpad
<soothsayer> TheMuso:  Okay then. Though, can you explain the meaning of line 13 of http://www.pastebin.ca/662577
<TheMuso> ok one sec
<soothsayer> I should say I'm building on Feisty
<Skiessi> http://www.wings2.net/index.php?page=download can someone put these in multiverse?
<TheMuso> soothsayer: that explains it then.
<Skiessi> to packages like wings2-fe, wings2-fe-levels, wings2-fe-music
<Skiessi> http://www.wings2.net/index.php?page=about this could be the debian description
<TheMuso> Skiessi: Is a needs packaging bug filed?
<Skiessi> not yet but I can make one
<TheMuso> Skiessi: Please do.
<Lamego> Skiessi, have you checked it's license ?
<StevenK> Ugh.
<StevenK> And here I thought that 8am on a Sunday didn't exist.
<StevenK> Worse, now I have to drive to Canberra.
<AndyP> StevenK: i guess a "good morning" would be lost on you :)
<StevenK> AndyP: At this point, yes. :-)
<AndyP> StevenK: have a good journey though
<StevenK> Thank $DEITY I'm not the only one driving.
<AndyP> heh
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-19
* jono is learning to package
<jono> going through http://women.debian.org/wiki/English/PackagingTutorial
<superm1> jono out of curiosity, why following women.debian.org?
<jono> superm1: there is the packaging tutorial there
<jono> but dh_make seems to not generate a debian directory for me
<superm1> we have one at our wiki too
<superm1> !packagingguide
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
<tgm4883_laptop> jono was trying to pick up chicks
<jono> ok will start there
<tonyyarusso> jono: whatcha packaging?
<azeem> jono: does dh_make spew out an error, or just doesn't create debian/
<jono> tell you what, I will look at the packaging guide first
<jono> tonyyarusso: just want to learn how to package
<tonyyarusso> ah
* gouki is thinking about joining jono. But packaging can be tricky.
<Hobbsee> hmmm, no life
<Hobbsee> !uvf
<ubotu> uvf is Upstream Version Freeze.  For an exception, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess#head-9523bc4076ff011324d67cddc97969ec609618d6
<white> Hobbsee: bored? :)
<Hobbsee> white: not overly.  was going to see whether the world had blown up, etc
* Hobbsee --> finding lunch before work
<ScottK> gouki: Yes, but there are easier bits you can start with.  It doesn't have to be all tricky stuff.  Start with bugs tagged packaging bitesize.
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<simu> looking for reviews of my package on REU
<simu> *REVU*
<white> simu: i am not so sure about REVU procedures, but wouldn't it help the reviewers, when you give them your package name?
<geser> white: currently you have a 50% chance to review the right package :)
<geser> it's rotoscope
<simu> white: its calles rotoscope
<simu> called
<simu> geser: lol correct ;-
<simu> currently I'm the guy who builds half of the packages
<white> geser: out of curiousity, did the community decide, if they want to have the servers at canonical or not?
<geser> white: I don't know what's planned with REVU in the future. Currently it is on one of the community machines for ubuntu-devs.
<white> does every MOTU have an account on the normal devel machines?
<white> or is it restricted to the core devs?
<Fujitsu> white: Only Canonical employees have accounts on Canonical machines.
<white> Fujitsu: weren't the compromised machines community ran?
<Fujitsu> There are a few community systems around, with *.ubuntuwire.com accessible to all ubuntu-dev members.
<white> so *.ubuntu.com is canonical only?
<Fujitsu> white: They're not really Canonical machines, and they're more for LoCo teams.
<Fujitsu> Pretty much, yes.
<white> ah ok
<sistpoty> hi folks
<Fujitsu> Hi sistpoty.
<sistpoty> hi Fujitsu
<Lamego> anyone on gutsy right now ?
<ScottK> Lots of people.  Yes.
<Lamego> ok
<Lamego> could you test the unsermake package ?
<ScottK> Not me anymore unfortunately as my Gutsy hard drive died on Friday.
<Lamego> before I create a bug report, I would like to be sure it is not fixed on the gutsy version
<ScottK> Sorry.
<Lamego> ok :(
<Lamego> I am getting a "ImportError: No module named cPickle" on Feisty
<nixternal> I removed unsermake so I can't test it either
<Lamego> ok, found the issue, it depends on python-2.4, but it is not set as a depend
<nixternal> that error looks familiar
<geser> I tried importing the module in python2.5 and a python2.4 shell and it worked both times
<Lamego> well, i just tried running the "unsermake" command
<Lamego> without python2.4
<Lamego> it fails
<Lamego> brb
<geser> Lamego: can you try if importing cPickle in a python shell also fails?
<sistpoty> wohoo, I'm doing some huge data mining to rebuild revu's account database right now :)
<geser> Lamego: according to packages.u.c it should be included in the pyhton2.5 package
<Lamego> it does not fail, importing from the shell
<Lamego> checking /usr/bin/unsermake
<Lamego> exec python2.4 -c "import $mod; $mod.main()" --modules $mods "$@"
<geser> Lamego: running unsermake in a gutsy pbuilder gives only "no file Makefile present"
<Lamego> well, I am using a feisty dchroot
<Lamego> geser, can you check /usr/bin/unsermake ?
<Lamego> the feisty version script contains: mods=/usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/unsermake
<geser> still the same
<geser> it still references python2.4 in the script
<Lamego> ah found it, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unsermake/+bug/107822
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 107822 in unsermake "unsermake requires python2.4 which is not listed as dependency" [Medium,In progress] 
<zorglu_> q. im trying to build a .deb for vlc 0.9, and the .diff from 0.8.9 pacakge no more apply. any suggestion on how i can fix this ? the 3500 line .diff seems hard to edit :)
<CyberSDF> Hello all !
<CyberSDF> I'm a Geany user (http://geany.uvena.de/) and i would like if it possible for someone in MOTU to update the version of this packages from 0.10.2 (actually in universe) to 0.11 ?
<Lamego> Zombie, recreate it from scratch :) ?
<norsetto> CyberSDF: geany 0.11.2 will be available in gutsy
<tobiasschulz> Can someone check http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=13 ?
<tobiasschulz> And perhaps advocate?
<CyberSDF> norsetto, not in feisty? Some bugs in 0.10 are tedious
<ScottK> CyberSDF: Are any of these bugs ones that cause a crash or data loss?
<Lamego> CyberSDF, current versions updates policy is restricted to security or serious bug fixes
<CyberSDF> No bugs are not serious nothing impacting security or stability
<ScottK> CyberSDF: Then you can request a feisty-backport.
<ScottK> !backports
<Lamego> CyberSDF, you can find geanius 0.11 at non official sources, use are your own risk :P
<ubotu> If new updated Ubuntu packages are built for an application, then they go into Ubuntu Backports. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports - See also !packaging
<ScottK> Doing a backport of the Gutsy package is safer than trying to install the upstream stuff yourself.
<CyberSDF> ScottK, yes i'll do that
<ScottK> OK.
<CyberSDF> Thanks all :)
<ScottK> You're welcome.
<Lamego> CyberSDF, http://www.getdeb.net/app.php?name=Geany <- is is backported
<tobiasschulz> May a MOTU please check my package? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=13
<ScottK> Lamego: Please do NOT recommend people install stuff from random external sources.  That is NOT an Ubuntu backport.
<ScottK> CyberSDF: I recommend you ignore Lamego's last suggestion.
<CyberSDF> getdeb packages are not safe ?
<Lamego> ScottK, have you checked the build diff ?
<ScottK> Lamego: Just so you know, the person that runs getdeb was invited to work with us to get his packages into Ubuntu.
<Lamego> or are just picking the usual "we are the only best and secure" source of software ?
<ScottK> His response was that it was to much work to make his packages meet Ubuntu quality standards.
<ScottK> No.  I haven't checked this particular package, but it was the getdeb people that said they would not make their packages meet our quality standards.
<Lamego> ScottK, I am that person, I have created that package, and it has safe as compiling from the source, if you are not a developer and have no skills to check the source by yourself
<ScottK> We have a backports process and it's not that har.
<Lamego> but ok, this is motu, CyberSDF please ignore me
<ScottK> har/hard
* norsetto relaxes and watches the fireworks .....
<ScottK> Lamego: Then why don't you get your stuff into the Ubuntu repos rather than duplicate effort elsewhere?
<ScottK> Backports testing also requires no packaging skills and is a part of the Ubuntu process.
<Lamego> ScottK, I already reply that several times, I am sure you can answer that yourself from the recent mails on the MOTU ML :)
<Lamego> anyway, lets keep on,  I will not recall getdeb urls into -motu, again
<sistpoty> most revu accounts are back, passwords recreated. the login is whatevery your email address was in your last upload to gutsy
<ScottK> Lamego: I would really like to see you try and work with us to get your work into the Ubuntu repos.
* AndyP hugs sistpoty 
<sistpoty> please don't nuke packages yet, the script to do so most probably won't work ;)
<Lamego> ScottK, I am working for "current" users, not for "future" users, we have different goals, it is not duplicate work
<ScottK> Lamego: Gutsy + Backports = Current users.
<Lamego> there is a lot of users which can find getdeb, under stand it, but not backports
<Lamego> backports are still driven by "ubuntu+1" not "current" for apps versions
<ScottK> Well Ubuntu+1 strives to be current.  If you are packaging stuff that's not in Ubuntu yet, then you are doing work away from Ubuntu that would benifit the community more if it were done here.
<ScottK> You've made the choice not to do that.  It's your choice.
<Lamego> ScottK, Ubuntu is the community which I belong to, so, getdeb is ubuntu :)
<ScottK> Lamego: From your perspective I'm sure that's true.  From mine, it's not.
<ScottK> If your packages break systems (not saying they do), it's not an Ubuntu problem.  It's a getdeb problem.
<Lamego> ScottK, Your comments look a lot like those Debian fans during Ubuntu's birth :)
<zorglu_> q. im trying to build a .deb for vlc 0.9, and the .diff from 0.8.9 pacakge no more apply. any suggestion on how i can fix this ? it ends with "1 out of 1 hunk FAILED -- rejects in file modules/misc/freetype.c  Patch 020_dejavu_font.diff does not apply (enforce with -f))
<Lamego> ScottK, sure, that is why they are tagged "~getdeb~" so that they can be pointed and fixed by us
<ScottK> Lamego: That's a responsible approach.
<ScottK> zorglu_: You have to look at that patch and figure out why it didn't apply.
<zorglu_> ScottK: that patch is a 3500line diff...
<ScottK> Lamego: From Debian's perspective I would agree BTW.  If we break something in Ubuntu, it's not Debian's problem.
<Lamego> don't worry, the universe is big enough both for the masters and the apprentices ;)
<zorglu_> ScottK: is there any tool for that ? or you guy really handle 3500line diff ?
<ScottK> zorglu_: I certainly wouldn't.
<Lamego> Zombie, most of that diif may contain patches which were already applied upstream
<zorglu_> ScottK: good because im not enclined to either :)
<Lamego> ops, i meant zorglu_
<ScottK> zorglu_: There is something, I think called rediff.
<zorglu_> ok looking for rediff
<zorglu_> Lamego: ok.. not sure i understand what you mean tho. im not used to packaging, i got vlc svn compiled, just trying to get the .deb for feisty, based on the .deb from 0.8.9
<zorglu_> upgrade :)
<xhaker> Lamego, you should come by #ubuntu-pt and register on launchpad on the team
<ScottK> Lamego: Bug #124933 is an example of what I think should be avoided.  Have you tried to get this package into Ubuntu?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 124933 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  flock" [Wishlist,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/124933
<ScottK> Bug #94896 too.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 94896 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  BASIC-256" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/94896
<Lamego> ScottK, no, that was one of the few binary builds, and which may have legal issues, or not
<Lamego> but because I am not a lawyer and don't have the time or will to research on it it will be kept until someone complains about it :)
<ScottK> I have to run.  I do hope you will work to get more stuff into the Ubuntu repos.
<ScottK> Lamego: Which of those two bugs are you discussing, Flock?
<Lamego> yes, flock
<Lamego> which I believe contains some copyrighted art
<xhaker> How does one regenerate the control file with one control.in manually?
<Lamego> ScottK, we will continue this chat later :P
<Lamego> what happened to the servers ? how where they compromised ?
<sistpoty> Lamego: look at the mail sent to the loco teams, I don't know anything more than stated there
<Lamego> I am not on a loco team, do you have the link ?
<sistpoty> Lamego: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/loco-contacts/2007-August/001510.html
<Lamego> the last mail on REVU denotes user accounts concern, it seems to be related :P
<Lamego> no info
<xxxxx1> heya
<toutouff> Hi xxxxx1
<xxxxx1> hey toutouff
<highvoltage> hey xxxxx1 and toutouff
<xxxxx1> hey highvoltage
<ScottK> sistpoty: Is there a mailing list for REVU uploads/comments yet or is that still on the TODO?
<sistpoty> ScottK: it should use the motu-reviewers one, but s.th. (I guess with exim setup on sparky) is still wrong
<sistpoty> ScottK: but it's on my list, but I probably won't fix it today though ;)
<toutouff> I am a new contributor. About the bugs tagged as needs-packaging, if I want to package one, in debian/control, I set Maintainer with my name or with Ubuntu MOTU Developers ?( then it will go to REVU and maybe to universi if everithing's OK)
<ScottK> OK.  No problem.  I really do appreciate all the effort you put into getting revu back up.
<ScottK> toutouff: Maintainer is the Ubuntu MOTU Developers.  Set yourself as XSBC-Original-Maintainer.
<sistpoty> ScottK: if I didn't program it that crappy in the first place, It'd have been much easier *g*
<ScottK> Heh.
* sistpoty grabs a bite to eat now... bbl
<toutouff> ok, thank you ScottK
<siretart> Seveas: do you have a minute regarding django use in falcon?
<Seveas> siretart, yes
<siretart> Seveas: I don't find a settings.py nor a manage.py in falcon's branch.
<Seveas> siretart, that's because there isn't any :)
<siretart> Seveas: how do you specify the sql backend, create tables and such?
<Seveas> If you look at manage.py in a django project, you'll see it only has 3 lines. All functionality it uses can be used from code directly
<siretart> right
<siretart> still, I don't see a call to django.core.management.execute_manager() in falcon
<Seveas> and settings.py isn't the only way to configure django, you can call django.conf.settings.configure(), see lib/falcon/config.py.in
<Seveas> I don't use the functions of the manager with execute_manager -- the only functions I use is the database creation things, look for _get_sql_model_create in lib/falcon/__init__.py
<Seveas> django/core/management.py exposes some other nice things as well
<Seveas> you have to configure django (d.c.settings.configure() ) before being able to use the management functions this way
<siretart> ah, I see
<siretart> this requires quite intime knowledge of djangos internals, doesn't it?
<Seveas> not really, I just wanted to be able to automatically create the tables and I went looking through the code to see how django does that
<Seveas> django/core/management.py proved to be useful
<Seveas> I found all this out while writing falcon :)
<siretart> didn't you use the admin webapp from django for db administration/debugging tasks?
<Seveas> no
<Seveas> django offers the './manage.py shell' function. Falcon has a similar 'falcon shell' function, allowing you to easily play with its innards
<Seveas> manual db administration/debugging should not be necessary for end users. I used either the falcon shell or a simple sqlite shell for that
<siretart> for revu production, I'd prefer a postgres
<sistpoty> huhu siretart
<Seveas> then say so in django.conf.settings.configure() :)
<siretart> hm. phone brb
<siretart> hi sistpoty
<Seveas> siretart, but revu is a web app, it should not try to avoid manage.py/settings.py
<sistpoty> siretart: there are some weird exim errors in the log files on sparky, not quite sure what to make off these (didn't touch any exim stuff there)
<sistpoty> siretart: e.g.: ** motu-reviewers@tauware.de R=nonlocal: Mailing to remote domains not supported
* sistpoty is off again, pizza is ready
<siretart> sistpoty: I'll look at that later today
<sistpoty> siretart: cool, thanks!
<Lamego> how do we flag that a package should be on the amd64 repository because it does not run on 64 bits ?
<crimsun> err
<crimsun> do you mean that it should /not/ be available for amd64?
<Lamego> yes, if it does not work, why should it run ? Unless someone can provide a fix, which does not seem to be the case
<Lamego> i mean, why should it be there
<Lamego> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gambas/+bug/130137
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130137 in gambas "gambas doesn't open" [Undecided,New] 
<siretart> Lamego: I'd say do the same as we do with all buggy software: file a bug
<Lamego> it does not work on feisty, and it will not work on gutsy
<Lamego> siretart, it was filed already
<simu> still looking for motu that advocate my package rotoscope on revu
<Lamego> the first bug report on this was on Date: Wed May 2 12:41:39 2007
<Lamego> still the package keeps there, leading people to spend more time on bug reports
<siretart> sistpoty: should be working now
<sistpoty> siretart: excellent, thanks!
<siretart> sistpoty: sparky is now relaying mail via faui45, I need to ask michael gernoth tomorrow if he's okay with that, but I'm confident
<mok0> Do we have to register again with REVU? My account seems to have disappeared...
<sistpoty> siretart: great, thanks a lot... imo it would only bee needed to relay mails to the reviewers mailing list, maybe michael would like that, too ;)
<ScottK> mok0: Not all the accounts have been recreated.
<sistpoty> mok0: you're not a motu, are you?
<sistpoty> mok0: if so, you're account will automatically get recreated, once you'll upload a package
<mok0> sistpoty: No I'm not a MOTU
<sistpoty> mok0: I've only imported motu accounts, since setting an account to be able to review packages is (the only) manual step
<Lamego> does this new old REVU server has backups setup ?
<sistpoty> Lamego: it doesn't. but I'll do manual backups from time to time
<mok0> sistpoty: So I have to get my gpg public key uploaded again?
<sistpoty> mok0: unless you've changed your key on LP today, no. I imported the keyring from LP on friday night
<geser> mok0: no, upload to REVU again and your account will get recreated (with a new password)
<mok0> I'll try it tomorrow
<sistpoty> mok0: but please only upload, if you've got a package to review to keep revu clean ;)
<siretart> sistpoty: regarding the home directories of tiber, in fact, I've done some using boxbackup
<mok0> sistpoty: not to worry, I have several packages that have gone through several cycles of reviewing.
<siretart> sistpoty: I would 'just' need to restore them :)
<sistpoty> siretart: great... though I'd rather not run arbitrary cronjobs/web-pages from home directories on sparky ;)
<mok0> ScottK, geser: my feisty -> gutsy distupgrade crashed and burned
<sistpoty> siretart: I'll follow up on the mail regarding revu with that info
<siretart> sistpoty: wait with that
<sistpoty> siretart: ok
<siretart> sistpoty: I still need to find the encrpytion key
<sistpoty> hehe
<siretart> ok, found it. hmm. I wonder if I should restore the backup key to tiber and restore the old homes there.. hmmm
<siretart> oh, boxbackup not in feisty, need to backport that. grml
<ScottK> mok0: We need bug reports then.  If you want help sorting it out before filing bugs, feel free to mail me.
<mok0> ScottK: I am not sure what went wrong.
<ScottK> mok0: What happened?
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-11
<RAOF> Ok.  That should be easy, then; just a $PACKAGENAME.install file containing "foobar.script usr/share/mythtv/mythstream/parsers"
<tgm4883_laptop> great, got that
<tgm4883_laptop> the file installs just fine, it's just getting it packaged and past revu thats a pain ;)
<RAOF> Yes.
<tgm4883_laptop> but so far, i've complied with everything, it's just this diff problem
<RAOF> tgm4883_laptop: Sorry, gnome-terminal crashed.
<RAOF> tgm4883_laptop: What is the usr directory there for?
<RAOF> tgm4883_laptop: Oh, that's the problem.  You've added a usr directory to the source; that's not necessary.
<tgm4883_laptop> RAOF, I need to pull that and fix the install file don't I?
<RAOF> Right.
<tgm4883_laptop> ok
<RAOF> I'm not sure that the diversions are a great idea, though.
<tgm4883_laptop> and move the youtube dir back to the root dir?
<tgm4883_laptop> why not?
<tgm4883_laptop> I think I have to do them
<RAOF> You could modify the mythstream package to not install the youtube parser, but to depend/recommend it.
<tgm4883_laptop> heh, yea, working on that too
<tgm4883_laptop> but that i'm less familiar with, as the actual mythstream package installs that rather than something like the install file
<RAOF> That can be corrected in the mythstream packaging.
<tgm4883_laptop> how so?  I've been looking at it (admittedly I am not the best guy to look at that)
<RAOF> By deleting the youtube filter stuff after it gets installed :)
<tgm4883_laptop> heh, well at least i'm getting different results now when trying to build the package
<tgm4883_laptop> RAOF, now i'm getting this  tar: youtube/search.pl: Cannot open: File exists when trying to build the package
<tgm4883_laptop> and it doesn't build at atll
<tgm4883_laptop> This are the last two lines before it crashes   dpkg-source: failure: tar -xkf - gave error exit status 2
<tgm4883_laptop> dpkg-buildpackage: failure: dpkg-source -i.bzr -b mythstream-parser-youtube gave error exit status 29
<tgm4883_laptop> I really appreciate you help btw
<tgm4883_laptop> bah, that was a typo, nm
 * emgent need DD.
<tgm4883_laptop> Thanks again for the help RAOF, everything seems to be working now
<tgm4883_laptop> If any MOTU has some spare time, I'd appreciate another REVU of this package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube  I've made the requested changes.
<RAOF> Hm.  It seems the recent REVU work has broken some of the database.  In particular... http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gtk2-engines-aurora
<tgm4883_laptop> I'm sorry, when making the requested changes I introduced a bug.  Please disregard my request for a REVU on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube  My apologies
<nxvl> ok
<nxvl> http://paste.ubuntu.com/35777/
<nxvl> this is the error i'm getting
<nxvl> the odd thing
<nxvl> is that using a debian chroot env to build it works fine
<nxvl> it should be an issue with ubuntu specific autotools/libtool
<persia> nxvl: I've not seen that error before.  Which version of libtool is specified in ltmain.sh?
<nxvl> 1.5.24
<StevenK> libtool | 2.2.4-0ubuntu3 |      intrepid | source, amd64, i386
<nxvl> StevenK: yep
<nxvl> the most odd thing
<nxvl> is that on debian works fine
<persia>  libtool |   1.5.26-4 |      unstable | source, alpha, amd64, arm, armel, hppa, hurd-i386, i386, ia64, m68k, mips, mipsel, powerpc, s390, sparc
<StevenK> nxvl: Enable experimental in your debian chroot.
<nxvl> oh
<StevenK> nxvl: I bet it then blows up
 * nxvl creates experimental chroot
<persia> nxvl: Well, I'd recommend starting from http://people.debian.org/~keybuk/libtool-updating.html or http://people.dooz.org/~lool/debian/relibtoolize if you want to update it.  Both of those are a little out of date, but likely helpfull.
<nxvl> i've been following http://wiki.debian.org/LibtoolUpdate
<persia> nxvl: Updating my documentation redirects, but that doesn't look much fresher.
<tgm4883_laptop> Ok, i've fixed that bug I introduced, so if any MOTU has some spare time, I'd appreciate another REVU of this package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube  I've made the requested changes.
<nxvl> mm
<nxvl> i will check and write some documentation on the issue
<nxvl> there should be more packages that will have the same issue soon
<persia> nxvl: Thank you.
<nhandler> What directories are considered "standard", and don't need to be included in .dirs files when packaging an application?
<RAOF> nhandler: Everything.
<nhandler> What do you mean RAOF ?
<RAOF> nhandler: In most cases you don't need a *dirs at all.  It's only if you need some directories to exist that the build process doesn't create.
<nhandler> RAOF: So if you have a .install file that is moving some files into a directory, you don't need to include those directories in a .dirs file?
<StevenK> nhandler: If the build process creates those directories, no. If it doesn't, yes.
<RAOF> I think you will, unless your build system already creates those directories.
<emgent> python, sure. If you like we are in #rapache-devel
<emgent> wrong window -.-'
<nhandler> According to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Basic, it says "dh_install and .install files will automatically take care of creating directories. You only need to use dh_installdirs if your package needs to ship empty nonstandard directories". That is why I was asking.
<RAOF> nhandler: Why not try?  If the package builds and contains the files you expect, then it works :)
<RAOF> I suspect that it might, because I don't think that any of the packages I've touched has needed a .dirs file.
<nhandler> Ok, I guess I can do that. Thanks for your help RAOF
<emgent> moin people
<nxvl> :D
<tgm4883_laptop> Ok, i've fixed that bug I introduced, so if any MOTU has some spare time, I'd appreciate another REVU of this package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube  I've made the requested changes.
<dholbach> good morning
<jpds> morgen dholbach
<dholbach> hi jpds
<jpds> dholbach: I did some changes to hugdaylist and get-branches and uploaded to intrepid yesterday.
<dholbach> jpds: nice! :)
<jpds> :)
<slangasek> sistpoty: I never mind a query, but can't promise being around :)
<huats> morning everyone
<bigon> could some motu-sru member have a look at https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/pymsn/+bug/255307 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255307 in pymsn "Can't connect to msn accounts" [Medium,Confirmed]
<sylvaing> hi
<directhex> hm. how can i see the build log for a debian package?
<persia> directhex: packages.qa.debian.org has lots of useful links
<directhex> what kind of half-baked autoconf files use "no" as your compiler if the following happens: "checking for ./../mcs... no"
<persia> directhex: The very special ones :)
<directhex> bleh
<directhex> okay, let's see it build now
<RAOF> directhex: That's _awesome_.  Who's autoconf is that?
<directhex> RAOF, monodoc :)
<RAOF> !!!
<directhex> righty. i post the debdiff from the latest debian package to the new ubuntu package for a merge, yes?
<RAOF> Ya.
<persia> directhex: As long as the Debian orig.tar.gz represents either a new version or is bit-identical to the Ubuntu orig.tar.gz
 * RAOF watches #nouveau work out how to resume an nv3x card in a macbook
<persia> RAOF: That reminds me: how are the libdrm debates coming along?
<RAOF> persia: Dunno, really.  It seems that GEM is going to to go upstream sometime soon (2.6.28 is a number that springs to mind), but I don't think that TTM has died, either.
<persia> RAOF: So the prospect of nouveau in intrepid+1 still looks dim?
<RAOF> Intrepid+1?  I'd hope that'd fly.
<persia> Unless we lose step, 2.6.28 seems the right target.  If that's GEM, and there is an expectation that all the drivers will migrate, I'm hoping nouveau will be amoung the "all".
<persia> On the other hand, until TTM either wins or dies, I'm less sure.
<RAOF> I think that maybe we'll end up with two managers.
<persia> I thought the kernel folk felt that was a fundamentally stupid way to do it.
<RAOF> TTM doesn't seem like dying; people working on slightly more sophisticaed hardware than Intel cards seem skeptical that GEM can do everything they need.
<RAOF> On the other hand, nouveau doesn't actually have to care; it's not blocking on a GPU memory manager.  Just a libdrm release new enough.
<RAOF> IE: 2.4.x
<persia> Oh.  I thought it was blocking on both.
<RAOF> No.
<persia> Cool then!  I suppose the interim release (2.3.1?) wasn't sufficient?
<RAOF> I don't believe so.
<RAOF> libdrm was blocking on GEM/TTM; even if they do a GEM-only 2.4 release nouveau gains a new-enough drm to build.
<persia> Ah, I understand now.  Thanks.
<RAOF> At least for now; it's a bit of a maintenence problem, since they don't give any API guarantees.  That said, their drm API has changed only twice in the last 6 months or so from memory.  Possibly only once, actually.
<RainCT> ScottK: ping, do you have a moment to speak about julius?
<Lutin> bobbo: you commented 'waiting for -4 so we can sync' for the prayer merge, but I don't see any bug related to this on the BTS. private email ?
<RainCT> ScottK: I've answered to your comment on REVU.
<directhex> can i pray for syncs too?
 * RainCT looks at directhex with a ???? face :P
<directhex> LP:256641
<persia> syntax failure bug #256641
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 256641 in ubuntu "[sync request] webkit-sharp from Debian Unstable, version 0.2-1" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/256641
<RainCT> directhex: that's already ack'd
<persia> directhex: Even with the bug reference, it doesn't make any sense.  At first, I was ignoring what I thought was a reference to the merge of prayer, but now I'm also confused.  What do you mean?
<directhex> i mean i'm waiting on a sync. nothing more than that.
<RainCT> directhex: Ah, you just have to wait for an archive admin to look at it; that shouldn't take much.
<directhex> hm, maybe it's a good thing i forgot to add u-u-s to a merge bug. sounds like there'll be a new version in debian later today
<nxvl> moin
<Syntux> moinmoin
<slytherin> can anyone please ack bug 254919?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 254919 in libdvdnav "Please update to 4.1.2-3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/254919
 * RainCT looks
<slytherin> RainCT: are you a MOTU?
<RainCT> slytherin: yep
<slytherin> oh, I didn't know that. :-)
<persia> slytherin: You might want to look at the requestsync output for the common format for sync bugs.
<directhex> ooh, i didn't know about requestsync
<slytherin> persia: I didn't log that but, I was going to log one when I saw an existing bug. I just subscribed u-u-s and gave reason for sync.
<bigon> any motu-sru around?
<RainCT> slytherin: please correct the bug title & summary before subscribing u-u-s in the future
<persia> slytherin: Ah.  I usually edit the description when I do that, as many people who aren't regularly in this channel aren't familiar with the specific format that reduces work for the archive admins (so we can get more syncs).
<slytherin> RainCT: persia: Ok. Will keep in mind.
<RainCT> slytherin: Ack'd. I can give-back gst-plugins-bad0.1 if you ping me once the new version has been build
<slytherin> RainCT:. Ok. Will keep watch.
<ScottK> RainCT: I'm not so great on library stuff either.  I'd suggest ask sistpoty when he's around.
<RainCT> ScottK: Okay, thanks.
<persia> RainCT: which package?
<RainCT> persia: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=julius
<slytherin> does anyone if it it possible to provide more than one package names in apt:// style link?
<RainCT> slytherin: yep. iirc just do apt:package1,package2
<RainCT> or with ; perhaps, I'm not sure
<RainCT> slytherin: yes, apt:pidgin,pidgin-plugin-pack
<directhex> it'd be nice to specify repos with apturl
<RainCT> directhex: +1
<directhex> especially useful for PPAs
<joaopinto> apturl supports adding repositories, or at least it was on the specification
<directhex> that's one thing suse has right now - "1-click" lin ks which can define a repo as well as a package
<directhex> joaopinto, where's it documented?
<wgrant> I believe that was left unimplemented due to the stupidity of the idea.
<RainCT> directhex: I think the reason why this isn't enabled (the code is already there, or at least some of it) is that some people feared that it would be too easy to use evil repositories then. That doesn't make sense, IMHO, as if they want to break their system they will do anyway, and if they do it with apturl we have the chances to show a nice, big, warning
<slytherin> RainCT: it works with ',' but it shows one confirmation dialog per package.
<directhex> RainCT, have you heard sorry tales of malicious suse 1-click repos?
<RainCT> nope, but neither have I heard about SuSe having 1-click repos :P
<wgrant> And neither have I heard about anybody using SuSE.
<joaopinto> how would  it differ from the current gdebi  implementation ?
<RainCT> directhex: and you don't need to convince me (I like the idea), convince wgrant :P
<RainCT> joaopinto: that you don't have to download the files yourself
<wgrant> Particularly given that PPAs are unsigned, it is very bad to encourage their use.
<directhex> wgrant, so do it on a temporary basis. allow an apturl link to specify a repo which is only used for resolving the requested package list - but is not added permanently
<joaopinto> RainCT, uh ? I mean from a security perspective, you always have to request for the action, regardless if you are installing from APT or from a .deb
<directhex> so you get to show all the usual gpg moaning all you want. it just makes adding split packages from outside the main repo much easier
<RainCT> wgrant: Having apturl support them doesn't mean encourage their use. The point is that if they add them through apturl we have the chance to say "Hey, that's bad. Don't do it."; else they will just see "add ... to your sources.list"
<RainCT> joaopinto: in my view, it's the same
<persia> directhex: Why would you wish to do that?
<wgrant> directhex: How does that make it any better?
<wgrant> So now I both have a chance of getting a bogus repo, and not getting security updates.
<directhex> wgrant, it's still better than the current approach spread far & wide over the internet involving "sudo wget"
<wgrant> Perhaps not.
<directhex> copypaste this lengthy string to set up your system. don't worry abuot confirmation screens, our nice clever config lines take care of them for you
<joaopinto> wgrant, such risk exists if you add the repository manually, your concerns is not on how to setup the repositories, but on the repository contents itself
<wgrant> We don't want a facility for websites to be able to present links like that with the only confirmation being dialogs that users will just click throough.
<directhex> if someone clueless wants to add a potentially bad repository to their system, i really fail to see why a popup warning "this repo is unofficial and might screw you up" is worse than people just pasting things like "sudo wget http://somebadsite.com/sources.list.d/hardy.list -O /etc/apt/sources.list.d/badsite.list" into a terminal
<persia> On the other hand, it is nice to present links that let people install packages from the already configured repositories, for documentation, etc.
<wgrant> directhex: Users dislike click-through dialogs.
<wgrant> directhex: Users just click through them.
<directhex> and <3 terminals!
<wgrant> Terminals seem to generally do a good job of scaring new users off.
<joaopinto> wgrant, users dislike security concerns in general, so what's the point ?
<RainCT> wgrant: yes, but put a shiny warning icon there and if they don't see it it's their problem. with the current approach they will just copy-paste stuff without even knowing what it does
<wgrant> I don't see why we should make it easier for users to click-through potentially fatal warnings.
<joaopinto> wgrant, actually it usualy breaks their system frequently, because users without a security conscience are those which try anything on the terminal
<elkbuntu> wgrant, eep, who's suggesting that?
 * slytherin feels responsible for starting flame war on the channel. :-(
<directhex> slytherin, not at all, you reminded me of a pet peeve
<andrew_sayers> wgrant: surely you'd have to type your password though?  That's harder to sleepwalk through than clicking on stuff.
<wgrant> andrew_sayers: You'd be surprised what users will do.
<directhex> like run random things as root in terminals?
<wgrant> Lots of people complain about terminals.
<wgrant> So people obviously vastly prefer GUIs.
<Hobbsee> directhex: i see people run rm -rf /, when suggested.
<Hobbsee> why would they not click through warnings?
<Hobbsee> which are less scary than opening a terminal?
<directhex> Hobbsee, some warning or no warning. pick one.
<wgrant> Terminals are scary enough to send people back to Windows.
<joaopinto> this is a new security technique, security through scariness
<directhex> why doesn't ubuntu alias rm to "rm -i" like on redhat? people can't be trusted, evidently
<andrew_sayers> If you really wanted to be malicious, wouldn't you just create a shell script that called gksudo?
<wgrant> joaopinto: There is no other solution to stupid users.
<andrew_sayers> Then tell people to double-click on the script and click/type through.
<ion_> A dialog that forces you to type âI am possibly letting <blahblah> happenâ to continue? :-)
<directhex> ion_, remember glxgears -iacknowledgethstthistoolisnotabenchmark ?
<joaopinto> wgrant, that is why stupid users have problems into getting into Linux, some people instead of educating prefers to keep stupids away
<wgrant> "Yes, do as I say!"
<ion_> Like what apt does when youâre removing something essential
<wgrant> 'tis what I was quoting from.
<wgrant> I hope.
<Hobbsee> joaopinto: based on their frustration level at attempting to get anything done, si that such a bad thing?
<Hobbsee> clearly, you have to have some form of clue, and actually read things, to succeed.
<Hobbsee> the same thing happens in windows, or in anything else complex, that you haven't seen before.
<joaopinto> Hobbsee, no, but I believe that stupidity is not a non treatable disease, is something that your turn into knowledge, it is not not something that you just care about keeping away
<Hobbsee> case study:  bubblewrap.
<wgrant> Hobbsee: Indeed.
<Hobbsee> yeah....right....
<Hobbsee> wgrant: i take it you've seen enough of the saga to be well aware...
<wgrant> Hobbsee: I have.
<wgrant> joaopinto: One can't educate clueless users immediately. You have to scare them from some things first.
<directhex> joaopinto, ignorance is curable. stupidity isn't
<joaopinto> Hobbsee, why not adding a warning on the installer "Are you stupid Y/N?" ?
<Hobbsee> joaopinto: because i don't write the installer?
<joaopinto> directhex, users are ignorant, not stupid
<andrew_sayers> It seems like the argument against modifying apturl is that we're protecting the set of users that would click through absolutely anything in a window, but would never touch a console...
<directhex> joaopinto, you'd be surprised. there's a definite mix
<Hobbsee> joaopinto: i'd prefer to do it as "here's a block of text.  here's a multiple choice quiz, to check that you actually can read"
<Hobbsee> or something.  but that's idealism.
<andrew_sayers> ... from the set of bad guys that can do anything with a shell script, but can't call a GUI from it.
<directhex> how big is that demographic?
<andrew_sayers> Surely the intersection of those two sets is pretty small?
<joaopinto> Hobbsee, no, because your personal believe does get proper recognition, otherwise the installer developer would implement it, but I am sure it would not be on Ubuntu :)
 * wgrant -> bed
<Hobbsee> joaopinto: or because i'm not silly enough to ask for it.
<Hobbsee> while it would be nice, it's not feasible.
<ScottK> Adri2000 or Lutin: The main.php page on DaD is serving up the Universe list ...
<joaopinto> well, you could provide a terminal to them with "Please type at least 3 unix commands", that would scare them during the install phase
<Hobbsee> yes, but that would nto be my aim.
<persia> Umm.  Lots of discussion on this, which is good.  Tone is less ideal.
 * white waves
<directhex> here's the thing.
<Hobbsee> my aim would be to check fi they're actually capable of taking in information.
<directhex> gdebi makes it easy to download and run a .deb
<directhex> of unknown safety and origin
<persia> Given the number of bug reports we had from easyubuntu, automatix, etc., I think it's better to say that the desire it to make it difficult to install software not currently in the repositories.
<white> Hobbsee: so when are you in melb? no more excuses ;)
<andrew_sayers> How about taking such users out of sudoers and forcing them to do a root log-in to a session that can only do a limited set of jobs?
<directhex> however, we're saying a procedure to make installing two debs is ZOMGBADNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
<Hobbsee> because if they're not, then really, they should go back to windows, where they might have somehow understood it.
<andrew_sayers> (Install packages, edit a few things)
<Hobbsee> white: no idea........
<white> ;?
<white> ;/
<directhex> persia, so why is gdebi there?
<directhex> persia, if the policy is terminal-or-repo-only, gdebi violates that
<ScottK> andrew_sayers: Once you are root, then there is no such thing as a limited set of jobs.
<ScottK> directhex: I'd prefer it weren't.
<elkbuntu> persia, add ultabreaksit to that list
<andrew_sayers> ScottK: If you're smart, yes.  But we're talking here about people that will run "sudo rm -rf /" if a stranger tells them to.
<persia> directhex: It's not policy, it's guidelines to reduce invalid bug reports, and yes, gdebi does violate the guideline.
<Hobbsee> andrew_sayers: ultimately, they will still find ways around, to screw stuff up.
<ScottK> I'm fairly well convinced that being both easy and secure is a system administration design problem that is not yet solved.
<joaopinto> I thought the goal was to make  the users aware of the risks of installing software from untrusted sources, not to block them
<Hobbsee> andrew_sayers: OTOH, they might learn, after the first time.
<ScottK> I'm not convinced it's solvable.
<white> Hobbsee: what about mid-semester break or so?
<Hobbsee> white: perhaps.  i'll think on it :)
<white> :)
<Lutin> ScottK: still having the main/universe issue with DaD ? works just fine here
 * ScottK tries again.
<andrew_sayers> Hobbsee: then why bother putting such a small roadbump to stupidity as apturl when there are legitimate uses where it's quite handy?
<Lutin> ScottK: anyways given the number of broken merges for main, you might not want to use it
<ScottK> Lutin: Fine now.
<ScottK> Lutin: It's useful for knowing IF there's one I should look into.
<Hobbsee> andrew_sayers: because for the people who are ignorant, it's a good wake up call.  those are unlikely to screw up their system.
<Lutin> ScottK: true :)
<ScottK> Thanks for the warning though.
<Hobbsee> andrew_sayers: those that do not take in any information are doomed to fail, whatever is done.
<joaopinto> Ignorant users don't need applications features to turn their system insecure, they are insecure by nature
<Hobbsee> (which is a different category)
<andrew_sayers> Hobbsee: but forcing them to log in to an alien environment that they haven't seen for X months isn't a wake-up call?
<persia> andrew_sayers: What is the use case which this solves?
<joaopinto> Hobbsee, what is your definition for "taking any information?", how does an sources.list setup instructions improve the information quality to a dialog presenting the repository url and a warning about the risks of using it ?
<andrew_sayers> persia: The use case for apturl: I'm writing an application that I plan to put into a PPA some time soonish.  After that, I'd like to go to ubuntuforums.org and tell people "click here to try the app out, then tell me if it's any good".
<ScottK> andrew_sayers: Of course given the current DNS cache poisoning problems that's a fundamentally insecure approach since PPAs aren't even signed.
<directhex>  andrew_sayers you're dangerous then!
<andrew_sayers> What would be a more secure approach?
<directhex> the mythbuntu team will be handing out free mirror-and-sign scripts in the foyer during the interval
<ScottK> It doesn't matter how you install it or get it, there's no guarantee the user is getting the package you served.
<joaopinto> andrew_sayers, you can just ask "please ALT-F2: "wget && sudo " I am sure that will be clear for them :P
<Hobbsee> ScottK: nor that the package that was uploaded to the main archive is any good, or was for anything but testing purposes.
<ScottK> andrew_sayers: Build your own binaries, sign them and serve them.
<Hobbsee> ain't security great?
<ScottK> Hobbsee:
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Yes.
<directhex> and write a six step guide on accessing them
<directhex> bonus points for subtle differences from the last 3rd party repo instructions you read
<ScottK> Hobbsee: I think maybe we need a script like the contentless ping script that drops a warning about unsigned repositories into the channel every time someone says PPA.
<persia> andrew_sayers: I guess.  I'm not very comfortable with that being a means to get users, but that may be me.
<directhex> medibuntu earns double bonus points for use of "sudo sed"
<bddebian> Heya gang
<stefanlsd> If im looking at a merge and looking at a debdiff and i see       +-      printf(buf);                   (new line)     ++      printf("%s", buf);        (what is the +- and ++ showing as opposed to just + or -)...
<Hobbsee> joaopinto: i wasn't making a point about that at all.  My point was that we have users who are determined to do silly things, and that click through warnings probably aren't effective.  But then, consoles don't appera to scare them either.
<RainCT> stefanlsd: that there's a diff in the debdiff
<directhex> stefanlsd, it usually means changes are being made to a patch in debian/patches/
<Hobbsee> ScottK: well, they do plan to sign them eventually.  I personally think that's more dangerous.
<Lutin> directhex: thanks for the bonus points
<ScottK> Hobbsee: In a different way.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: well, people don't even think about it - all it says is "this comes from launchpad"
<Hobbsee> but i don't currently see a way around that.
<directhex> Lutin, and you increase the score further by having over 1000 words in the repo howto
<Lutin> directhex: woot
<Hobbsee> i wonder if the solution is to implement complete rollbacks.
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Yes.  I agree that's a problem.  Personally I think that PPA and such mark the eventual doom of the official repository.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: that, adn other reasons.
<directhex> Lutin, disappointing use of a keyring package instead of wget and apt-key though :(
<Hobbsee> but i think other reasons will be the predominant factors.
<andrew_sayers> Random idea - how about wrapping apturl in a questionnaire when it tries to install from random sources?
<andrew_sayers> "Why did you install this [for fun, to solve a problem, other]?  How much do you expect it to crash [1..5]?"
<andrew_sayers> Then a similar questionnaire on exit.
<joaopinto> lol
<andrew_sayers> That would give great feedback for the legitimate use case of developing packages, would scare users and be non-ignorable, and would make life harder for bad guys.
<stefanlsd> directhex, ScottK - thanks. I see that there is a patch in the debian/patches directory which i guess explains the ++ and +-.  Am I right in saying that debuild doesnt apply the patches...
<directhex> andrew_sayers, you could implement it by allowing your repo to define a script to run as root when the repo is added!
<directhex> andrew_sayers, your script could call a gui-drawing script tool, like lots i forgot the names of!
<Lutin> directhex: why disappointing ?
<Hobbsee> "pop all this bubblewrap, and think about what you're about to do.  it could break your system"
<Hobbsee> "you can't install this until you finish"
<directhex> Lutin, too user friendly
<Lutin> directhex: ahah. good one
<andrew_sayers> directhex: I know you're being silly, but you'd have a set of standard scary questions, and a text file defining optional extra useful questions.
<directhex> Lutin, ooh, how about making people do apt-key -add <EOF, then paste the key into the window! joy!
<andrew_sayers> standard == for all packages, hardcoded in apturl.
<Lutin> directhex: and btw, we (as in, the medibuntu team) didn't write that documentation. we're merely updating the URLs
<directhex> Lutin, i'm not trying to mock you guys, i'm just using it as an example. it's probabnly one of the most popular third party repos on the interwebs
<directhex> Lutin, how many hits do you get on packages.gz a month?
<Lutin> directhex: I don't even know. lots
<jpds> Laney: I've made some changes to pull-lp-source in ubuntu-dev-tools trunk.
<directhex> i wonder what discussions the suse people had over ymp.
<slytherin> anyone having powerpc machine access right now? I need confirmation on some observation related to java on intrepid.
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<Hobbsee> hey sistpoty|work
<sistpoty|work> hi Hobbsee
<ScottK> slytherin: I'd suggest asking TheMuso.
<\sh> directhex: they can use "signed rpm packages" so when I trust one dev who signed his/her packages, I can be sure that this package is no malware....
<slytherin> ScottK: I dropped a message on #ubuntu-powerpc but no one responded.
<\sh> directhex: but regarding the repos , they are lost, too
<\sh> directhex: hint on binary packages
<directhex> \sh, i just find it dumb that you can pick four popular third party repos, and find four different instructions for enablement
<slayton> Does anybody know if there are any plans make deb package for dbus-c++?
<persia> Could someone from the mentoring team please respond to https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2008-August/001369.html (in the appropriate forum)
<directhex> the irony being that the most "user-friendly" method is opening a terminal & blindly copypasting things into it, entering a sudo password when prompted
<persia> slayton: Is there a needs-packaging bug?  If not, you might search for a Debian ITP.  If neither exists, the chances are very low that someone is working on it.
<andrew_sayers> Is it worth sticking a few installation-related ideas up on brainstorm and seeing what the crowd makes of them?
 * soren would also be hesitant to consider the existence of an ITP much of a suggestion that someone is working on said package
<persia> andrew_sayers: It's certainly more likely to generate a useful discussion than an IRC log.
<persia> soren: An ITP is explicitly a statement that someone *is* working on a package.  This is how it differs from an RFP.
<andrew_sayers> persia: I'd dispute "discussion", but "evidence", certainly :)
<soren> persia: I've lost count of the times I've wanted a package of some software, found that it wasn't in Debian, and then went on to find a several year old ITP about it.
<azeem> persia: depends on how old the ITP is
<azeem> soren: however, they are getting expired semi-automatically these days
<soren> persia: It doesn' imply that someons is working on it. It implies that at some point, someone *intended* to work on it.
<azeem> but yeah, I'm sometimes annoyed by this
<persia> soren: The owner of the ITP should be pinged, and if not responsive, it ought be retitiled to an RFP.  Anyway, for many of those I've found an ignored package on mentors.debian.net to go with the old ITP.
<\sh> directhex: well, how could someone solve those issues, without distributing everything....people without a clue should not deal with those things...but this is a dream
<soren> In fact, I'll bet that in more than a few cases, those stale ITP's have caused people to NOT package stuff, because apparantly someone else is working on it (only they're not).
<soren> persia: That's a reasonable point.
<soren> persia: I've, in fact, myself had a package in that state.
<persia> soren: Well, sure, but that's because not enough people triage wnpp, rather than being part of the definition of an ITP.
<azeem> persia: this /is/ happening
<persia> azeem: Which is happening?
<azeem> retitling to RFP or closing of ITP bugs after a timeout
<persia> soren: I'd hope by now you had the appropriate levers to get out of that state.
<azeem> some people just reopen them, though
<soren> persia: If you look at it from the perspective of a new developer who comes along and thinks, "hmm, Debian doesn't have this package, apparantly. I'll be a good boy and package it.. <google around a bit>... Oh, someone is already working on it. I'll play some more WoW instead of working on Debian."
<persia> azeem: Yep.  There are many people with persistent intentions.  I will very likely someday be the maintainer of uqm.  This may not happen until after lenny+1 ships.
<directhex> soren, been there done that
<soren> persia: Exactly that happened to me.
<soren> persia: WEll, without the WoW stuff.
<soren> persia: I was more of a Tetris kind of kid.
<persia> soren: You didn't even bother to contact the person working on it?
<soren> persia: Nope.
<soren> persia: Who was I to question their work?
<soren> (or lack thereof)
<persia> soren: Hrm.  You've improved with time, but still, communication is good.
<soren> persia: This was many, many moons ago.
<directhex> \sh, as andrew_sayers pointed out, i think the number of people who will blindly click through things ignoring the consequences, but who won't open a terminal & paste things in ignoring the consequences, is small
 * persia had issues with Debian back in woody/sarge days that cause Ubuntu to be the primary focus of development, but doesn't understand not communicating if you want something done.
<soren> persia: /me guesses ~10 years.
<sistpoty|work> universal saying of the day: you just have to get the right blocks into the right slots :)
<soren> That's what she said.
<directhex> sistpoty|work, not if you have a hammer
<persia> sistpoty|work: Indeed.
<sistpoty|work> directhex: heh
<persia> soren: You were a Hamm user?
<soren> persia: Bo.
<\sh> directhex: well, people are more likely to click through a UI wizard, but regarding my experiences with "start term, copy&paste this" it works very well and easy even for non - knowledged people...
 * persia is impressed
<azeem> soren: I was just lucky that the only guy packaging stuff in my field (chemistry) soon left Debian after I got interested
<soren> persia: And unfortunately, I never made the step from user to developer and I largely blame stale ITP's. I think I must have gone through the "hmm.. I'll try packaging this.. Oh, someone's already doing it" cycle at least 10 times.
<soren> When i finally found something that noone had packaged, and I did it, I never was able to find a sponsor, but that's a different argument altogether.
<directhex> \sh, as soon as you give instructions to people involving a terminal, you've lost the "linux isn't hard & nerdy" argument. the sad thing is, for most people, it's simply incomprehensible voodoo - and either you end up scaring them away from gettring things done, or teach them pasting random lines from the internet is safe
<persia> soren: Ah.  I've never been a fan of new packaging.  My largest contribution to Debian pre-Ubuntu was trying to get packages that hadn't updated in testing since potato pushed back to sid for sarge (which is now fairly standard practice)
<ScottK> Which gets back to my point that both secure and easy is a sysadmin problem that is not solved.
<ScottK> directhex: ^^
<\sh> directhex: not if they have to just consume...really...people will eat, sorry to say, shit to get things done...
<directhex> \sh, if they're going to fuck up anyway, why not make it easier for the rest of us, then?
<soren> persia: Well, that I didn't do either, because each package had a maintainer, so they were probably already working on it.
<soren> persia: I know, I know, I was a silly little boy.
 * persia refrains from comment
<\sh> directhex: and they even eat the shell, if they don't have to think about it...and regarding ubuntu and it's sudo rule and its "one user per system", it makes things even easier for them, despite the fact, that people like me will need to deal with the consequences
<\sh> directhex: because it's not the right way, we need to prevent users from doing something stupid, we need to stop bad PR (technical and business talk)...the easiest thing: pay some dollars to be allowed to distribute mp3 player libs legally...pay some dollars for distributing the other codecs as well...but this we don't see in the near future
<directhex> \sh, bad PR with whom? i san see more than one scenario where "just click this to install on suse, or follow this six-step terminal-based guide on ubuntu" won't make ubuntu appear to be the better option for beginners, even if it is theoretically more secure in some capacity
<persia> directhex: Why shouldn't it be in the repositories then, if the software is useful and safe for users to install?
<directhex> persia, not everything makes it into -updates or -backports
<directhex> persia, and there's questions of scope and relevance. fr'example, it would be nice if a third-party company, e.g. a canonical partner like dell, can post a single link for "install special dell sauce"
<persia> directhex: For -backports, that's a soluable issue.  For -updates, it's limited for a reason.
<persia> And they can, as the special dell sauce is in the repositories.
<broonie> Nokia have a system for doing this on their internet tablets.
<broonie> Might be worth looking at what they do there.
<persia> More generally, the model is that any vendor that wants to ship software for Ubuntu does best to work with Ubuntu (which may or may not be Canonical) to get the software integrated.
<directhex> the perception that doing things the "right way" is hard is how things like automatix come into existence
<ScottK> Right and doing things the right way is the reason it no longer exists.
<directhex> yeah
<joaopinto> persia, is that model working with acceptable results ?
<directhex> have you met my friend ultamatix?
<joaopinto> ScottK, actually it does, ultamatix
<ScottK> No.  OK.  Nevermind then.
<directhex> ultamatix here wants to add 101 modificatiosn to your hardy system! and is based on the strong foundation of automatix! http://ultamatix.com/
<nxvl> hello!
<sistpoty|work> directhex: does it add the right blocks into the right slots? *g*
<directhex> sistpoty|work, [14:50] <directhex> sistpoty|work, not if you have a hammer
<sistpoty|work> heh
<persia> joaopinto: Depends on how you measure things.  I think the model is working reasonably well, considering the growth of Ubuntu.  I'd like to see more people pushing things in.
<slayton> How does one generate a .dsc and .changes file that will allow for the adding of the debian directory to a source tar ball with dpkg-source
<persia> (assuming said things are being maintained)
<persia> slayton: You've that a bit backwards: one unpacks the original source, adds the debian directory and calls dpkg-buildpackage or debuild to generate the .dsc and .changes file.
<ScottK> Right.  Same quality level Automatix was famous for.
<persia> directhex: The experience has been that most of the external add-ons get sufficiently involved in Ubutnu, and gain enough experience with bugs and related issues, that they begin to see the rationale behind the policies, and work to integrate.
<slayton> persia, right so thats the way I've usually done things... I was unsure if the .dsc and .changes files generated by dpkg-buildpackage were sufficient or if I had to do something special
 * ScottK just loves the .pyc files shipped in the .deb.
<persia> slayton: Those should be sufficient.  Mind you, debian/ should really be in the diff.gz, rather than in the original source.
<slayton> ohh.. right so I guess my question is how do I generate that .diff.giz
<directhex> ScottK, with quality like that, who can say no?
<directhex> slayton, have an orig.tar.gz which differs frmo your app-version folder, when you run debuild
<slayton> directhex, persia Thanks!
<ScottK> Three cheers for Launchpad performance (while we're on the topic of quality).  This is the main Ubuntu bugs page: <!-- at least 99 queries issued in 13.71 seconds -->
<persia> ScottK: Bug #1 is a good metric
<geser> LP stops counting at 99 queries?
<ScottK> No.  It'll count higher.
<ScottK> I've seen bug pages that took over 400
<ScottK> They make a database that take 400 queries to render one web page and I'm supposed to feel comfortable with them automating my workflow?
<ScottK> It always says 'at least'
<laga> i need some help with dpkg-divert and shared libraries. http://www.pastebin.ca/1166171 - is there any way i can "correct" the first symlink?
<laga> the libmyth-0.21-0 package also seems to ship these symlinks and i'm diverting the lib and the symlinks in my preinst
<laga> i guess i could put the diverted library in a different directory.
<geser> laga: may I ask why you need to divert a lib?
<directhex> for great justice!
<andrew_sayers> I've just written up a little shell script that an attacker could get users to run either by doing `wget .../evil.sh | sh`, or by downloading evil.tar.bz2, unpacking and running the program...
<andrew_sayers> It prompts for the root password using gksu, then does whatever it likes, and leaves no trace...
<tuxmaniac> Can some please review and sponsor for bug 255224? Thanks in advance
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255224 in gnusim8085 "New Upstream Release 1.3.4" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/255224
<andrew_sayers> That's a much more severe security hole than anything else we've discussed today - where do I post the bug report?
<directhex> andrew_sayers, the dreaded irish virus? http://www.voidspace.org.uk/gallery/silly/the_irish_virus.jpg
<andrew_sayers> directhex: :p
<laga> geser: we have a libmyth-0.21-0 package and libmyth-coreavc-0.21-0. the coreavc package contains just one lib which is supposed to replace libmythtv.so. the new lib adds support for coreavc which is a h.264 codec for windows. and we don't want that patch installed by default
<directhex> mmm symbols
<geser> sounds sane to use divert here
<laga> yeah, it just doesn't work yet ;)
<andrew_sayers> Seriously though, have a look at: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/36544/
<laga> how is that a security hole?
<andrew_sayers> laga: talking to me?
<laga> yes
<andrew_sayers> We've been arguing about whether to make it possible to have 1-click apturl for non-Ubuntu repos.
<andrew_sayers> The argument against is that bad guys could use it to install bad things.
<andrew_sayers> So far as I can see, arguing that would be a security hole implies that the script I just posted would be a security hole.
<geser> laga: doesn't the nvidia packages also divert a lib? Perhaps you could spy there how to do it.
<andrew_sayers> The script more so, because it's the attacker wouldn't be tied to Ubuntu.
<laga> geser: yes, i'll take a look there.. but it could also just be PEBKAC
<andrew_sayers> So logically, either you have to say that apturl is an acceptable risk, or tell me where to file the report for that script.
<\sh> andrew_sayers: regarding a single user system, this can be dangerous
<andrew_sayers> How so?
<\sh> andrew_sayers: but a user how enters his/her user pw/root pw to execute a script or something else, does know what he/she 's doing
<\sh> s/how/who/
<\sh> andrew_sayers: the same as with windows..just click on something and you have a trojan horse on your system working
<\sh> it depends on your viewpoint
<andrew_sayers> Just to be clear, you're saying that the script can be dangerous?
<\sh> andrew_sayers: well, drinking too much coffee could be dangerous too...but it's not in the first place...so yes, a 1-click deb install could be dangerous...
<persia> andrew_sayers: That script isn't dangerous because it's self contained, althoguh it may overwrite a local ~/evil2.sh (and ought be rejected anyway as it doens't make a useful improvement).  If you'd refreshed your definition of evil with wget or curl, it would be more evil, but would break the download-software-from-non-repo rule that we try to follow.
<\sh> andrew_sayers: but I'm one of the people who likes the "people learn through pain"
<andrew_sayers> I'm confused...
<directhex> \sh, "install package? dodge spinning razor blades to continue..."
<andrew_sayers> Are you saying that security issues don't count if they're not sanctioned by a package in Ubuntu?
<\sh> and TBH, i'm waiting for the day, where we have third party repositories with really dangerous packages inside, like hufflepuff-0.1.0-0ubuntu1_amd64.deb , click here to install...the contents: just a postrm with "rm -rf /"
<\sh> s/postrm/postinst/
<directhex> as opposed to just a link to hufflepuff-0.1.0-0ubuntu1_amd64.deb with the same thing?
<andrew_sayers> \sh or a package in main that allocates you a password out of a pre-defined set of 32768 passwords :p
<\sh> andrew_sayers: no..that was not with an intention... that was just a bad way of "the 4 eye principle"...I really mean "I want and will destroy peoples machines"
<persia> andrew_sayers: The difference is intent.  Known evil is excluded.  Unknown evil may be included, but we try to avoid it.
<\sh> andrew_sayers: let's say it like this: If someone of us (approved uploaders) is going to upload a package with the intention of destroying peoples systems, you can be sure, that someone will sue us
<andrew_sayers> I'm still confused :s
<directhex> isn't that how trust works though? would you trust a third party repo signed by someone in debian-keyring ?
<persia> Well, not everyone is somewhere easy to be sued, but if discovered to be intentional and malicious, there is a reasonable chance that the offender would lose upload rights.
<\sh> andrew_sayers: but people outside this project can do what they want...so if people think package "hufflepuff" from repository "harrypotter" is so awesome that they install it, and in this package they do something nasty...nobody can be sued
<directhex> how about signed by someone trusted by someone in debian-keyring?
<andrew_sayers> \sh: so your argument against 1-click install from apturl is that it makes it easier to sue?
<RainCT> directhex: why debian-?
<\sh> andrew_sayers: no it makes it easier to inject malicious software
<andrew_sayers> \sh: How?  What would an attacker gain by making hufflepuff.deb that they don't get from evil.sh?
<directhex> RainCT, because debian-keyring contains the keys of everyone. it's big. really big.
<\sh> andrew_sayers: schadenfreude
<RainCT> beside that people would get a warning dialog and some of them might be sane enough to not install hufflepuff.deb
<\sh> oh wow...schadenfreude is also an english word....how nice
<sistpoty|work> is hufflepuff good software? should I download and install it? does it make my ubuntu experience better? *g*
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: no, it's a pokemon :P
<directhex> \sh, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9B-ZoS0wvU
<sistpoty|work> heh
<directhex> RainCT, crap, i thought i'd completed my pokedex :(
<\sh> andrew_sayers: you make an announcement: "Hufflepuff is the way to go..install this software, and your computer runs 100x times faster then normal"...believe me, more then 1000 people are installing this package without having a look what's inside..and those 1000 people are left with a broken system...
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: well, not really :P
<directhex> \sh, but that wouldn't happen if they were linked to a .deb instead of to an apturl
<joaopinto> \sh, those same people will do the same thing with "To install this software: ALT-F2: wget && sudo supersoftware"
<\sh> directhex: well, that would happen with any unproved third party software
<\sh> doesn't matter if it's coming via a repo or just via gedebi
<RainCT> directhex: lapsus xD. but there is a purple pokemon called something like that, or? :P
<\sh> joaopinto: yes..but that's too difficult... a single click and synpatic + search for hufflepuff is easier, because it's colorful
<RainCT> \sh: click on synaptic?
<directhex> hm, importing debian-keyring takes a while
<sistpoty|work> synaptic installs pokemons?
<RainCT> LOL
<directhex> sistpoty|work, gotta Depends: 'em all
<joaopinto> \sh, copy&paste is rather easy for most users this days, because they can't find some click and information dialogs for some tasks...
<\sh> to sum up, because I have to go: you can't solve this problem, only distributing the whole software proved by the distributor...and this is not going to happen, because we have too many legal issues with this
<RainCT> \sh: there are no legal issues -.-
<\sh> joaopinto: I repeat my statement to directhex some time ago today: People eat shit so they do everything to taste it...
<\sh> RainCT: distributing some codecs in main would give us some ,-)
<andrew_sayers> \sh: so it is a legal rather than security issue?
<RainCT> \sh: I though we were still talking about allowing apturl to get packages from non-official repositories (showing a big warning message, of course)?
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: can you have a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=julius please (especially the comments)?
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: sorry cannot give an in depth review from work...
<\sh> andrew_sayers: e.g. what are people downloading on linux the very first time? w32codecs...it's not 100% legal to distribute those codecs in one package without having a windows license or a license of the software vendor, this is why we can't distribute this package in ubuntu in the first place, and this is the reason why we have repos like mediubuntu with this package in their repo ... so now I present to you a repo/package with this package, same
<\sh>  name, latest version etc. everything looks nice and proper ...I'm no. 1 on google, but instead of the normal contents what you expect, I just put "rm -rf /" in this package ... you install it, voila, so we have two things:
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: but I guess if the question is whether to ship a -dev package in the first place, I'd be a little bit in favour of dropping it altogether
<\sh> 1. it's dangerous to use third party repos/packages without any clue...2. if we want to stop this, we need to find a way of getting rid of those legal issues
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: okay, thanks
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: maybe put the header/static lib in julius itself?
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: well.. julius doesn't need them
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: however it's perfectly okay to just have a -dev package without corresponding shared lib
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: so of what use are these in the first place? *G*
<\sh> 3. it wouldn't stop the user to download other third party packages/repos where software is hiding which are not in our repos..
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: I don't know xD
<\sh> 4. therefore, I don't like the simple way of making peoples life easier, but as I#m not the godfather of simplicity, I think people need to learn through pain, and wait for their first windows experience on linux ,-)
 * sistpoty|work peeks at a header file
<andrew_sayers> \sh: I take your point that (2) is an issue that I can't argue as a mere techie - as to the others, they only makes brainstorm seem more like the place to gather evidence.
<sistpoty|work> hm... nice another library reinventing a boolean type. hello library, c99 defines bool. *g*
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: to me it looks a little bit like the whole julius speech recognition is realized in libjulius, so that other programs can make use of it as well.
<\sh> andrew_sayers: well, just use the class enemy no. 1 , I don't know you, but my neighbours and some of my beloved non-computer friends and even my girl are always coming to me and telling me: "[Honey (that's what my girl is calling me)|Stephan|Hr. Hermann] Could you please fix my windows, I just downloaded something and now it tells me all the time, I should buy some blue pills"...
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: so I guess your solution to ship it as a separate -dev package seems best to me
<\sh> andrew_sayers: regarding the user base we want to reach, this can happen much faster on ubuntu as we like
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: and no need for different -dev packages fwiw, since libjulius directly includes stuff from (lib)sent
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: so it is OK like it's now? :)
<\sh> andrew_sayers: but in this context, I hope we don't copy Windows ,-)
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: at least in regards to libjulius-dev ;)
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: Great. Thanks :)
<sistpoty|work> np
<andrew_sayers> \sh: the reason I'm suggesting to go to Brainstorm is that maybe there's only three people in the world that want apturl modified (in which case the security issue is definitely more important), or maybe Ubuntu users are sick and tired of going to the console every other day to install stuff (in which case, we need to find some sort of solution).
<andrew_sayers> We're talking here about balancing security with ease of use, so it's important to know how much each one weighs :)
<\sh> andrew_sayers: regarding my job as sysadmin: security, regarding my job as computer geek: security, regarding my life as computer user: easy to use, but secure (knowing the dark side of the force)
<\sh> andrew_sayers: and yes, that's difficult...that's why we do discuss this topic every now and then
<andrew_sayers> So to conclude, how would you feel about filing a bug against apturl in a week or two if Brainstorm says yes?
<andrew_sayers> (So we can continue to discuss once there's evidence)
<\sh> andrew_sayers: tbh, i don't care about "Brainstorm"...I know it sounds rude, but you know, when 1000 flys are eating crap....I do like a meal with no flys flying around ;) most of the people don't know the real world work fixing peoples computer because of some weired decisions
<\sh> but those decisions are somehow fixable...e.g. not using this or that software...and on servers I don't have the problem anyways
<\sh> anyhow.../me needs to rush home...
<andrew_sayers> Bye.
<tgm4883_laptop> If any MOTU has some spare time, I'd appreciate another REVU of this package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube  I've made the requested changes.
<proppy> oy
 * sistpoty|work heads home... cya
<schakrava> bobbo: hi
<bobbo> hey schakrava
<schakrava> what should i do to get started?
<bobbo> schakrava: have you ever fixed a packaging bug before?
<schakrava> nope
<bobbo> schakrava: cool, we want to get started on something properly simple then
<schakrava> bobbo: sure
<bobbo> we keep a list of "bitesize" (easy to fix) bugs for new contributors at https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=bitesize
<bobbo> schakrava: fixing a packages description or manpage is a good place to start
<schakrava> bobbo: so i pick a bug in "confirmed status"?
<bobbo> schakrava: yeah "Confirmed" or "Triaged"
<schakrava> bobbo: ok let me take look. if i have any questions i ask, is that how it works?
<bobbo> schakrava: yeah if you need any help ping me and i'll try to help :)
<schakrava> bobbo: sounds good. i will talk to you soon then. thanks for your help
<bobbo> schakrava: np
<bobbo> schakrava: just make sure to check noone has go to the bug before you (read the comments) as we dont need to duplicate work :)
<schakrava> bobbo: ok sure.
<bobbo> Lutin: ping
<tgm4883_laptop> If you are a MOTU and are bored right now have I got a deal for you.  To help ease your boredness, I'll let you REVU my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube I've made the requested changes from the last REVU and am ready for another.  This offer valid while supplies last.
<RainCT> lol
<ScottK> RainCT: You lol'ed you now you have to review it.
<AstralJava> Nice approach. :)
<tgm4883_laptop> thx ;)
<LaserJock> I need somebody to un-sub UUS from bug #178948
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 178948 in pyro "No init scripts for Pyro Event Server" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/178948
<RainCT> LaserJock: done
<LaserJock> RainCT: awesome thank you
<tuxmaniac> hello folks. can somplease please review diff.gz for bug 255224 and sponsor if found OK?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255224 in gnusim8085 "New Upstream Release 1.3.4" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/255224
<tuxmaniac> thanks in advance
<foxbuntu> any one willing to give my package a revu? I would greatly appriciate the help: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythbuntu-log-grabber
<slytherin> how can I delete a photo from gpg key?
<slytherin> I tried to replace photo with newer one but seahorse seems to have added the new photo
<jpds> slytherin: Have you uploaded the key with the photo to a keyserver?
<slytherin> jpds: not with newer photo.
<slytherin> anyway, I just deleted it with help of seahorse.
<jpds> slytherin: The photo will stay with the key forever on the keyserver.
<slytherin> jpds: I am uploading now the updated key
<geser> slytherin: you can only revoke it, but it will be there forever
<jpds> slytherin: When you download the key, the photo shall still be there.
<geser> keyservers are append-only
<slytherin> is there no replace? Like I replace my whole key with newer one?
<geser> no
<slytherin> :-(
<geser> keyservers don't have any authentication method
<Treenaks> slytherin: there is no remove, only add
<Treenaks> slytherin: you could revoke your old photo, add a new one
<Treenaks> slytherin: but it'd still be there
<Treenaks> (a photo is just another UID, afaik)
<bobbo> is there any documentation that will explain what a fakesync is?
<jpds> bobbo: Upload of Debian package into Ubuntu by an Ubuntu developer.
<bobbo> jpds: just like a normal sync?
<jpds> bobbo: Yeah, that's why it's fake.
<sebner> bobbo: ubuntu orig.tar.gz with debian diff.gz
<bobbo> ah ok
<geser> bobbo: usually a source package will get copied from Debian as is, but if the .orig.tar.gz differs, a developer needs to take the Ubuntu .orig.tar.gz and the Debian .diff.gz, build a new source package and upload it
<sebner> ha! as I said XD
<geser> sometimes it's needed due to bad versioning
<bobbo> I'm trying to work out what to do with Jokosher
<bobbo> dholbach packged it into Ubuntu, but someone else packaged it into Debian
<geser> bobbo: same upstream version?
<bobbo> geser: yes
<geser> but the .orig.tar.gz have a different md5sum?
<bobbo> nope, the orig's have the same sum, its the diff.gzs that are different
<slytherin> bobbo: For jokosher merge I suggest take Debian version and try to apply changes form Ubuntu that are relevant.
<geser> than it's just a simple sync or a merge
<bobbo> slytherin: ok, yeah makes sense
<slytherin> I feel that it will be a sync in the end.
<bobbo> maybe i should get it synced, then apply the changes in a different upload, to stop potential breakages when merging again
<bobbo> otherwise I will need to change things like debian/copyright and mess up debian/changelog
<sebner> huhi norsetto
<norsetto> hi sebner
<totopalma> norsetto, hi :)
<norsetto> hi totopalma
<norsetto> bobbo: hehe, you are a great commuter when it comes to community communication
<bobbo> norsetto: hehe :D
<fabrice_sp> Hi. I'm getting a  manpage-not-compressed-with-max-compression error in lintian when using the upstream manpage (in gz format). Should I recompress it?
<RainCT> fabrice_sp: how are you installing the manpage?
<fabrice_sp> RainCT: dh_installman in rules, with a manpages file in debian directory
<norsetto> yuppi, the opengl 3.0 spec is out!
<bobbo> norsetto: shame everyone is hammering it :(
<norsetto> bobbo: of course, I would be surprised of anything else
<bobbo> hehe, true, peopel always find something to fight about when something major is changed
<bobbo> s/peopel/people
<bobbo> SUggesting moving to Empathy instead of Pidgin has started an almighty holywar on the forums :/
<directhex> is it any good?
<RainCT> Description: This is the youtube parser for Mythstream, a plugin for MythTV.
 * RainCT runs away and cries :P
<laga> RainCT: ?
<RainCT> laga: that's supposed to be a short description
<sebner> RainCT: hf :P
<laga> heh
<RoAkSoAx> heya guys, i have an offtopic question!: how much does a junior sysadmin, and a junior developer earns in Europe?? (or someone who is just starting in the IT field)
<fabrice_sp> RainCT: any clue on the error Lintian is giving me?
<directhex> RoAkSoAx, depends on where in europe, experience level, and company
<RoAkSoAx> directhex: yeah but for someone who is just starting?? let's say in countries like Austria, Germany, Spain... ?
<directhex> no idea on those
<RoAkSoAx> directhex: in the uk?
<directhex> mmm, probably 18k outside london
<Kopfgeldjaeger> my bro has just started working for IBM in germany
<Kopfgeldjaeger> 18k â¬ / year
<directhex> Â£
<RoAkSoAx> Kopfgeldjaeger: so like 26k USD ?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> 28.8k $US
<directhex> $36.
<directhex> Â£18k is ~$36k
<Kopfgeldjaeger> yeah, about 26, 27k
<norsetto> you should specify that those sums are after taxes
<RoAkSoAx> and for someone who just left university, and maybe doing an internship or something like that?
<RainCT> fabrice_sp: no, sorry :(
<directhex> those sums are before taxes
<directhex> uk pay is quoted per anum before income taxes
<directhex> all taxes together make about 33% deduction
<norsetto> directhex: ah, then I don't envy you ...
<fabrice_sp> RainCT: thanks for looking. I'll ask upstream to deliver non compressed files.
<directhex> RoAkSoAx, i started on Â£18k academic salary when i graduated
<jpds> RoAkSoAx: http://www.itjobswatch.co.uk/
<directhex> jobcs.ac.uk ?
<directhex> bah
<directhex> jobs.ac.uk
<directhex> typing is HARD. let's go shopping!
<RoAkSoAx> what about if the company is hiring someone outside the country of where the company is?? no taxes right?
<RoAkSoAx> and work from home
<Kopfgeldjaeger> RoAkSoAx: my brother hasnt left univery yet
<directhex> working from home, as a beginner?
<directhex> ha
<directhex> good luck with that
<RoAkSoAx> directhex: yeah as a beginner working from home.. how much would you think could be a good salary?
<RoAkSoAx> or an average one
<directhex> i don't have the faintest idea, you'll only find nebulous web companies who'd even think of offering telecommuting to graduates
<directhex> and they'll pay abyting from 10k to 100k depending on how much venture capital they have lying around
<slytherin> any mediawiki formatting experts here?
<RoAkSoAx> directhex: i see.. it would probably be a sales representative/ sysadmin
<webframp> packages libghc6-xmonad-dev and libghc6-xmonad-contrib-dev depend on libghc6-x11-dev (= 1.4.1-1), but libghc6-x11-dev 1.4.2-1 is what gets installed in Intrepid
<azeem> haskell fun
<webframp> yea, where would I look to proceed from here?
<azeem> I guess those xmonad packages need a rebuild
<webframp> whats the best way to do that?
<webframp> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto ?
<azeem> webframp: are you asking as a user who wants to use them, or as a developer who wants to fix the archive?
<webframp> well i am a user who wants to use them (fix my broken haskell environment) and as a learning process towards fixing the archive
<ScottK> webframp: If sistpoty comes around, ask him.  IIRC he was working on Haskell stuff.
<webframp> ScottK: thanks, i'll watch
<sebner> webframp: though not likely today :)
<webframp> sebner: heh nice, well some other time maybe
<norsetto> anyone on intrepid care to test the installation of libgail18 ?
<geser> ScottK, webframp: I've just filed a sync request for xmonad
<sebner> norsetto: already in the archive?
<norsetto> sebner: yes
<sebner> norsetto: unmet dep
<norsetto> sebner: which one?
<Syntux> Good day, I'm packaging English-Arabic dictionary that works with Stardict, Arabeyes.org did the word list in dictd format and someone else converted what they did to Stardict, who's the author in this case? and should I mentioned both in copyright?
<webframp> norsetto: libgtk2.0-0: Conflicts: libgail18 but 1.22.1-1ubuntu1 is to be installed
<sebner> norsetto: http://paste.ubuntu.com/36626/
<webframp> geser: is there a launchpad page i can watch to track the status ?
<geser> webframp: bug #257085
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 257085 in xmonad "Please sync xmonad 0.7-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/257085
<norsetto> thanks sebner, webframp: this is an interesting one, libgail18 depends on libgtk2.0-0 which conflicts with libgail18 ...
<schakrava> can someone tell me what DebianMaintainerField specification.
<geser> webframp: and bug #257086
<schakrava> is?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 257086 in xmonad-contrib "Please sync xmonad-contrib 0.7-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/257086
<sebner> norsetto: you're welcome :)
<schakrava> bobbo: are you there?
<webframp> geser: thanks, subscribed
<RainCT> schakrava: if you have a packaging question, we don't bite :)
<RainCT> (well, at least most of us :P)
<ScottK> schakrava: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
<geser> RainCT: who bites? :)
<RainCT> schakrava: ah. hadn't seen your question :)
 * norsetto bites geser
<schakrava> :) trying to do my first packaging task. 235063
 * DktrKranz is hungry, he would bite everything
 * geser bites back :P
<RainCT> schakrava: you can use command update-maintainer to change the Maintainer according to the DebianMaintainerField spec
<schakrava> scottk: thanks. reading it
<RainCT> geser: see? :)
<schakrava> rainct: thanks
<DktrKranz> norsetto, do you want some photos of saturday's party? :)
<RainCT> yw
<norsetto> DktrKranz: the rave one? ;-)
<DktrKranz> yeah
 * norsetto pumps up the bass
<sebner> DktrKranz: \o/
<DktrKranz> sebner, you there too^
<DktrKranz> ?
<DktrKranz> there... here ;)
<sebner> DktrKranz: sure but just some minutes before I leave though
<fabrice_sp_> Hi. I have to add a menu file to the package I'm creating (for people noyt using desktop manager). Could someone point me to a sample?
<nxvl> jcastro: the video streaming is awesome, we should do that on UDS
<k0p> hi all.
<meta> re
<meta> now from the interpid
<DktrKranz> hi k0p ;)
<meta> There are a little problem about krusader:
<meta> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<meta>   krusader: Depends: libkonq4 (>= 4:3.5.8-1) but it is not installable
<meta> I hope that this is the right place to report this
<RainCT> ScottK: what do you mean about the binary?
<RainCT> ScottK: it's not a lib but a CLI application
<RainCT> (re julius)
<ScottK> RainCT: OK, then sispoty
<ScottK> sispoty's reference to libjulius confused me then
<ScottK> RainCT: libjulius-dev without a libjulius seems odd to me, but don't mind me.
<RainCT> ScottK: dunno, sistpoty said that that's allowed
<ScottK> And I believe him, it just seems odd.
<sebner> gn8 folks
<RainCT> sebner: gute nacht
<sebner> RainCT: =)
<norsetto> RainCT: stille nacht
<emgent> hello people
<norsetto> emgent: O/
<emgent> A voi!
<RainCT> hey emgent
<fabrice_sp_> norsetto: I corrected some of your comments on mountmanager (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mountmanager). Should I upload a new package or wait until everything got corrected?
<emgent> hello RainCT :)
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: lets wait, there is no rush
<fabrice_sp_> ok. Thanks
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: if qt4-dev-tools is explicitily required than we should explicitly add it as a (Build-)Depends; its better than to expect it to be dragged in by some other dependancy (which may always change)
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: re 2.1, we should get the "preferred form of modification" with the tarball then, otherwise we cannot distribute it
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: 7.1 to 7.3, yes, unless they are required for the program to run (in which case I would be tempted to say that the program should be patched)
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: 8.1: the problem is about the comment, not the name
<fabrice_sp_> norsetto: for qt4-dev-tools: you're right. The first comment from apachelogger let thought that qt4-dev was depending on qt4-dev.
<fabrice_sp_> I'll correct that
<fabrice_sp_> norsetto: and about 8.1. The link you put is only for name (except if I'm getting blind :-) )
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: Menu Item Tooltips
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: thats what the comment is used for
<fabrice_sp_> norsetto: ahhh. I didn't knew that. Thanks
<fabrice_sp_> norsetto: the only explicitly required qt4 package is libqt4-dev (i checked in configure file). qt4-dev-tools is not explicitly required (except in readme). So I will let dependencies the way they are now.
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: for the menu, check /usr/share/doc/menu/menu.txt.gz in the menu package; you will find plenty of examples in the repo (almost all debian packages have it)
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: yes, thats why I wanted you to check with upstream
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: this upstream seems to mix build-dependancies and dependancies too, but I find it strange that libqt4-dev-tools would be a dependancy
<fabrice_sp_> norsetto: this upstream is a bit lost with packaging :-) Anyway, I think he puts qt4-dev-tools as dependencies, because he needed them to develop, but for packaging and compiling, it's not needed
<huats> norsetto: hello
<huats> how are you ?
<norsetto> huats: huats? huats?? Do I know a huats???
<huats> ;)
<fabrice_sp_> norsetto: is this comment more compliant? Manage the mounting of storage devices,flash cards, removable disks in Linux
 * norsetto wears his "last of the mohicans" wig and says "are you talking to me?"
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: hmmmm, I would make it shorter ;-)
<fabrice_sp_> norsetto: like this? Manage the mounting of storage devices (it will be difficult to make it shorter :-) )
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: Manage storage devices mounting :-)
<fabrice_sp_> norsetto: ok. You win :-)
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: Mount your storage devices
<huats> fabrice_sp_: you'll notice that norsetto ALWAYS wins
<huats> :)
<norsetto> fabrice_sp_: Mount :-)
<norsetto> norsetto-huats: 1-0, so there!
<huats> oh
<huats> except against me :)
<huats> but it is the exception :)
 * norsetto crashesh with a SIGHUATS
<huats> :)
<norsetto> huats: how did the bug jam go?
<huats> norsetto: it went really well
<huats> (surprising well in fact)
<huats> I could even answer all questions :)
<norsetto> huats: you mean you were actually able to close a bug?
<huats> http://www.reponses.net/blog/
<huats> norsetto: no, but it was not the aim
<huats> I've been explaining the bugs handling
<huats> ...
<huats> so closing was not the point the other day
<norsetto> huats: I see, so we will be soon flooded by hordes of new eager bug triagers
<huats> :)
<huats> well it is a good start...
<norsetto> huats: the venue seems nice, what is it, a bar!?
<huats> it is
<norsetto> champagne pour tout le monde!
<huats> in fact a bar at 30 meters max from my appartement
<RainCT> jono: do you think the baconizer plugin would be a good addition to universe?
<jono> rainCT: hehe
<jono> sure :)
<huats> mister bacon hey
<huats> :)
<huats> how are you jono ?
<jono> hey huats
<jono> good thanks
<jono> hectic!
<huats> :)
<ajmitch> good morning
 * RainCT *headdesks*
<norsetto> morning ajmitch
<ajmitch> RainCT: I'm not that bad, surely
<RainCT> ajmitch: hah. hey ajmitch :)
<RainCT> don't worry, it's not because of you :P
<jpds> It's because of me.
<RainCT> jono: lol. no, it's because of what I've just told you ;)
<RainCT> err, jpds
 * norsetto goes to bed
<RainCT> gn8 norsetto
<bobbo> night norsetto
<norsetto> night all
 * bobbo is bored, someone give him something to do
<jpds> bobbo: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/ubuntu-dev-tools/trunk - get hacking.
<Laney> jpds: Good work!
<jpds> Laney: Thanks.
<bobbo> jpds: your Depends are wrong
<jpds> bobbo: Their RainCT's depends.
<bobbo> jpds: /ubuntu/ppaput needs python-apt and debian/control doesnt mention it
<jpds> bobbo: ppaput is not installed, it's just... there because.
<bobbo> jpds: fair enough then :P
<schakrava> bobbo: having hard time finding a bitesize packaging bug
<bobbo> schakrava: they all taken?
<schakrava> bobbo: all of them have debdiff attached
<bobbo> schakrava: :( That sucks
<schakrava> bobbo: yes :( so what happens after someone uploads the debdiff?
<bobbo> schakrava: the sponsors team (proper MOTUs) look at the debdiff and if it is good they upload it into the archives for you and if not, they tell you what to fix
<schakrava> bobbo: i c. do you have a task for me by chance?
<bobbo> schakrava: im having a look around
<schakrava> bobbo: i did the packaging (except the upload) anyway on 1 bug for practice
<bobbo> schakrava: ah cool, did you generate a debdiff?
<schakrava> yes
<schakrava> bobbo: practiced on the 2vcard bug, cant remember the number
<bobbo> schakrava: could you pastebin the debdiff (http://pastebin.ubuntu.com) so I could have a look at it?
<schakrava> bobbo: give me a few. i think i have deleted the tree
<bobbo> schakrava: ah ok :D
<RAOF> Man, gnome-main-menu could do with some Debian love.
<RainCT> good night
<RAOF> Good morning.
 * RAOF invites everyone to witness the changing of the guard.
<jpds> -ChanServ(ChanServ@services.)- #ubuntu-motu has the SECURE option enabled, and RAOF does not have appropriate access.
<jpds> Looks like chanserv does not like the new guard.
<RAOF> Does ChanServ pick up on /me invites ?
<jpds> Don't think so.
<schakrava> bobbo: debuild -S is exiting with errors. not sure where the problem is
<bobbo> schakrava: pastebin the error?
<schakrava> bobbo: yes. 1 sec
<schakrava> bobbo: pastebin'd the error
<bobbo> schakrava: link?
<schakrava> bobbo: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/36686/
<schakrava> bobbo: sorry for the delay, firefox froze on me
<bobbo> schakrava: no problem :)
<bobbo> schakrava: thats a problem with your GPG key
<bobbo> is the email in the changelog and the email registered with your GPG key the same?
 * Kopfgeldjaeger just realized that he did everything grab-merge.sh can do manually and even wrote a little script for some parts
<jpds> Kopfgeldjaeger: Is it less descructive than the real one?
<schakrava> yes its the same email
<jpds> Kopfgeldjaeger: If not, see bug #155098.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 155098 in ubuntu-dev-tools "add grab-merge.sh" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/155098
<bobbo> schakrava: hmm try passing the -k<your key id> option to debuild
<schakrava> bobbo: just reran the gpg --gen-key as well
<bobbo> schakrava: ok
 * jpds => bed. Night all.
<Kopfgeldjaeger> jpds: well, it does much less than grab-merge.sh
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-12
<schakrava> bobbo: giving the key explicitly worked
<bobbo> schakrava: good :)
<schakrava> bobbo: my computer is acting very strange. brb. reboot
<effie_jayx> ScottK, ping
<schakrava> bobbo: here is the pastebin: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/36691/
<schakrava> bobbo: i mean debdiff
<bobbo> schakrava: cool, I have to go to bed now, but it looks good (only a few little things would need changed)
<schakrava> bobbo: thanks. have a good night!
<bobbo> schakrava: I'll have a proper look tomorrow
<schakrava> bobbo: sure thing.
<effie_jayx> hello all I am trying to figure out how best to send a font change upstream
<persia> effie_jayx: Were you able to migrate the change from the .ttf itself to the source?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> good night
<jdong> *cry* I miss doing MOTU work.... internships suck....
<persia> jdong: MOTU work misses doing you as well.
<effie_jayx> persia,  I got soruce files to it but I am unable to build the package
<effie_jayx> persia,  I was directed to https://launchpad.net/ubuntutitle
<tgm4883_laptop> jdong, in order to ease your pain, i'd let you REVU http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube ;)
<persia> effie_jayx: What happens when you try to build the package?
<effie_jayx> to send "it" upstream... I am guessing I can send my sdiff (diff file between FontForge Source files )
<effie_jayx> persia,  fails to buid since it has a binary in it ... (the ttf file)
<persia> effie_jayx: The binary is modified by debian/rules clean?
<effie_jayx> persia,  nope
<persia> effie_jayx: RIght.  Apply the *source* changes to the package, and build that.  Send the source patch upstream.
<effie_jayx> persia,  the binary is there... and it complains stating ... "Irrepresentable changes in the ttf"
<persia> effie_jayx: RIght.  The ttf should only be changed at build time, not at packaging time.
<effie_jayx> ok
<effie_jayx> persia,  learning curve... you are mean
<persia> effie_jayx: Sorry.  Not my intention to be mean.  My intention is to help, but I've never edited a font, so what I can suggest is limited.
<effie_jayx> persia,  no worries... nice way to get back to MOTU work
<effie_jayx> persia,  funny thing is that the font source won't work... since I doubt it gets generated at build time
<persia> What is the license for the font?
<effie_jayx> persia,  SIL OPEN FONT LICENSE Version 1.1
 * persia goes to read that, not being familiar
<persia> effie_jayx: Seems sual-licensed under OFL and GPL.  If we select OFL, we can't patch it in Ubuntu (cannot distribute modified versions under the same name), so let's choose GPL.
<persia> If we choose GPL, we have to distribute source matching the binaries, and modify the source when we want to change it, so we'd need to build the binary from the source.
<persia> Looking at the packaging though, it doesn't seem like we build the binaries from the source.
<persia> I'd suggest complaining to upstream, and perhaps opening a bug to demote to multiverse.
<persia> Alternately, fix the build system so it does build the binary from the source.
<persia> (which may clobber the existing binary, but I've not much sympathy)
<effie_jayx> persia,  ok, Not an easy fix, But I am up for it
<effie_jayx> persia,  heck I already spent hours on the actual font, I might as well carry it on
<persia> effie_jayx: You always seem to get the ones that look easy, but aren't really.  You are to be commended on actually fixing most of them.
<effie_jayx> persia,  I made sure I closed all open bugs for missing glyphs...
<effie_jayx> so people will be happy that some glyphs will be available
<effie_jayx> persia,  how do I complain to upstream... the launchpad project does not have contact,
<persia> effie_jayx: It does have a list of "Most active people".  You might try chasing them.
<effie_jayx> persia,  right... cool thanks for your words.. I shall get working then
<effie_jayx> persia,  I am currently sending an email to the top contributors and also I am workin on a package with binaries on it... using uuencode and uudecode
<nxvl> effie_jayx: uuencode and uudecode fun! luck with ti!
<nxvl> it*
<effie_jayx> nxvl,  heh... I hope you are not being ironical ... :S
<effie_jayx> :P
<nxvl> effie_jayx: don't bet
<persia> effie_jayx: uuencode / uudecode doesn't allow distribution under either the OPL or the GPL though.
<persia> For OPL, either we need to not modify, or we need to change the name.  For GPL, we need to ship a working source.
<effie_jayx> persia,  hw do they get the ttf in the pacakge then
<nxvl> effie_jayx: if you want, you can check apache, i added some icons to it and decode them on debian/rules
<nxvl> effie_jayx: so you can use it as an example
<persia> effie_jayx: They are upstream: they don't have to comply with the license.
<nxvl> persia: i did it for some icons on apache
<persia> (Well, for a sufficiently large project, this ceases to be true, as coordination between contributors to not comply becomes more complicated than compliance)
<effie_jayx> persia,  What should I ask upstream then to change license and demote the package to multiverse?
<effie_jayx> or rather suggest
<persia> nxvl: Yes, but for icons it is arguable that GIF is one of the "preferred forms for modification", as there are plenty of GIF editors.  For this font, it's fairly clear that Ubuntu-Title.sfd is supposed to be the source.
<nxvl> oh
<nxvl> he's encoding a font
<nxvl> now i get it
<effie_jayx> persia,  what is the point in demoting the package to multiverse
<effie_jayx> ?
<effie_jayx> apart from letting us work with it
<persia> effie_jayx: Demoting to universe would let us use OPL, so while we couldn't patch, we could push binary patches through upstream.  Having it in universe means the font neds to be built at build time.
<persia> Err.  Demoting to *multiverse*
<effie_jayx> persia,  mind If I cc you on the email ?
<persia> effie_jayx: You could, but I doubt I have much to contribute.
<effie_jayx> persia,  your insights on packaging? since this package needs a bit of more neatness
<persia> effie_jayx: I guess: to me it seems to be more about licensing than packaging.  Anyway, send a copy my way, and I might comment on the response.
<effie_jayx> thanks persia
<effie_jayx> persia,  I have just generated a dsc without modifying the binary and be able to generate a pack
<effie_jayx> a patch between the new and the old.. that should commit a fix and push for action upstream
<effie_jayx> while the email sorts the package issue
<persia> effie_jayx: I don't understand exactly what you mean, but I doubt upstream can use a binary patch to the ttf either, as then they might have issues modifying it.
<effie_jayx> persia,  you can generate sfdiff out of the two files
<persia> effie_jayx: Hmm.  Maybe then.
<persia> I still think they have some source file from which they work.
<effie_jayx> persia,  you mean it is not Ubuntu-Title.sdf?
<effie_jayx> .sfd
<persia> effie_jayx: No idea.  Can you generate Ubuntu-Title.ttf from Ubuntu-Title.sfd?  If so, then just put that generation in debian/rules, and you're all set.
<effie_jayx> persia,  I'll find out
<rexbron> foxxtrot: if the setup.py file is using the standard setup-tools module, then --prefix should work
<foxxtrot> I'll run tests of both
<rexbron> have you uploaded the package to revu?
<foxxtrot> I've barely started the debhelper process.
<foxxtrot> I do have a different package to upload to revu though, I've only put it in my PPA so far (my wife and a co-worker of hers needed the package sooner)
<foxxtrot> Of course, the PPA stuff is targetting hardy, I should target intrepid with anything pointed at revu, yes?
<foxxtrot> And anything I upload to REVU should list it's Section as universe/sub-section right?
<persia> Target intrepid, yes.  Using universe/ as a prefix, no.
<foxxtrot> Thanks
<k0p> hi all.
<k0p> how much time needs to a package be compile in archive?
<persia> k0p: Between 1 minute and 60 hours, depending on the complexity of the package.  Note also that sometimes there is a queue, so the build may not start for a while.
<k0p> hmm sure.
<k0p> and how I can know about that?
<persia> k0p: e.g. https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+builds
 * persia notices that https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+builds?build_text=&build_state=pending is empty, and encourages lots of uploads.
<k0p> persia, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/umit/0.9.5-0ubuntu1/+build/687956
<k0p> should it be on archive ?
<foxxtrot> Does REVU use that build queue?
<persia> foxxtrot: Packages on REVU are not autobuilt.
<foxxtrot> ah
<foxxtrot> How long does it take a package uploaded to REVU using dput to show up on the REVU site?
<nhandler> I think the list is refreshed every 5 minutes foxxtrot
<persia> k0p: It waits on binary NEW : https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+queue
<k0p> ok
<JasonSpradlin82> I swear this packaging guide is going to drive me insane
<k0p> persia, thanks
<JasonSpradlin82> how much of the packaging guide do i need to fully understand before i can go and try to start getting mentored and start helping out?
<persia> JasonSpradlin82: None of it.
<JasonSpradlin82> persia: oh
<JasonSpradlin82> persia: i'm getting to understand more and more of it, but it takes a long time, because its not exactly intuitive to those unfamiliar with the basics
<persia> More specifically, you'll want to understand the basics of Debian format packaging, which may also be gleaned from examination of some sample packages.  You'll also need a willingness to learn, and to research anything on which you are unsure.  You may find that much of what you end up discovering that way is also in the Packaging Guide.
<JasonSpradlin82> yeah... i tend to learn better by DOING or by being taught in an environment wwhere I can ask questions... one cannot ask questions of the packaging guide
<persia> Yes, it's not very intuitive.  Personally, I found it easiest to work with small modifications to packages to build familiarity.  Closing small bugs is a good way to do this, and gives you exposure to a variety of packages.
<NCommander> I personally found following the New Maintainer guide's example and disassembling the hello package to help a lot
<foxxtrot> Damn, I may not be able to package this very easily.  Some of the code is in a 'questionable' licensing state
<foxxtrot> If it contains any code not licensed under an OSI-style license it has to go into the multiverse, right?
<persia> foxxtrot: It has often been said that debian/copyright is the hardest part of packaging
<foxxtrot> Well, all but this one .so are GPL
<foxxtrot> But the non-GPL code only has a copyright associated with it.  I'm going to need to email Swofford and figure out the licensing for this code.
<foxxtrot> Since the package seems to depend on this .so it builds
<tgm4883_laptop> jdong, in order to ease your pain, i'd let you REVU http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube ;)
<tgm4883_laptop> bah, sorry
<tgm4883_laptop> If you are a MOTU and are bored right now have I got a deal for you.  To help ease your boredness, I'll let you REVU my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube I've made the requested changes from the last REVU and am ready for another.  This offer valid while supplies last.
<NCommander> Holy
<NCommander> I just got a AM
<NCommander> *an
 * NCommander faints
<jdong> tgm4883_laptop: lol I had to review some heart attack-inducing code at work today, so I think I'll take a break before I burst a vessel somewhere :D
<jdong> tgm4883_laptop: though I'm CONFIDENT your code will be better than what I've seen today
<tgm4883_laptop> heh, take a break then.  I didn't mean to ping you about it twice ;)
<tgm4883_laptop> hope so, i've had 2 REVU's on it already and fixed many things ;)
<ScottK> effie_jayx: Pong
<effie_jayx> ScottK, I meant to ask you about ttf-Ubuntu-title, I have made some changes to fix some bugs but I can't seem to package them due to binary changes. I saw you were a past contributor- I thought you could help with some pointers
<ScottK> effie_jayx: No.  Sorry.   I think I helped a bit with some packaging questions, but don't recall much about the package.
<effie_jayx> ScottK, right... thanks
<effie_jayx> ScottK, the issue is that the ttf is a binary that does not get generated by the source in the pacakge.. due to licencing uuecode and uudecode cannot be used. and I am figuring out a way to build the ttf from source. I have contacted upstream about it and I am holding on to a reponse
<tgm4883_laptop> If you are a MOTU and are bored right now have I got a deal for you.  To help ease your boredness, I'll let you REVU my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube I've made the requested changes from the last REVU and am ready for another.  This offer valid while supplies last.
<tuxmaniac> :)
<tuxmaniac> can someone plese have a loof at the .dff.gz for bug 255224 and sponsor after review?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255224 in gnusim8085 "New Upstream Release 1.3.4" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/255224
<dholbach> good morning
<tgm4883_laptop> good evening ;)
<lunch> tac-plus is not in the repository, was in there back in the gusty days
<lunch> anyone able to fix this? or i need to compile my own?
<Hew> Hey guys. I nominated high priority bug 248055 for SRU a month ago and it's still sitting there for nomination. Have I followed the correct process so far? Is someone able to give the bug a bump? It's an easy fix (essentially a backport).
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 248055 in gtk-gnutella "gtk-gnutella cannot connect to newer network - ancient version detected" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/248055
<dholbach> does anybody know if Bhavi Shankar is on IRC every now and then?
<dholbach> hi Koon
<Koon> hello Daniel !
<james_w> dholbach: he is
<james_w> dholbach: he often turns up for MOTU school as well if I remember correctly.
<dholbach> I think he's "coolbhavi" here, right?
<Hobbsee> dholbach: he's coolbhavi, usually found in -in
<Hobbsee> what's he done now?
<dholbach> I was just looking for him
<persia> Hew: It looks good to me, but the solution is very much not clear.  Have you considered requesting a backport of the new version?
<Hobbsee> ahh.  try -in
 * Hobbsee goes back to trying to figure out this hell-spawned subject list.
<Hew> persia: I read somewhere that if a backport is to fix a bug, then it should be done as a SRU
<Hew> persia: I assume the fix is just a backport, but to *-updates
<persia> Hew: Yes, that is true, although in this case, I think both routes make sense.
<Hew> persia: What action should I take? Request a backport as well as the SRU?
<persia> I'm not sure I like the idea of an upstream-forced upgrade because of declared incompatibility.  Also, to move forward, your bug needs someone to look at preparing a patch that does the right thing (whatever the right thing might be).
<Hew> persia: It's broken _because_ it's the old version, that's the problem. I don't think it's something that a patch to the old version can fix
<persia> Hew: Yes, which makes it extra complicated.  bugfixes should go through SRU, but the new version surely has other changes.
<persia> I suspect the complication is part of the delay.
<Hew> indeed
<persia> Does anyone other than Hew use gtk-gnutella?
<Hew> persia: I'm on Intrepid myself now so it's not even a problem for me anymore, but the longer it goes on, the more people appear on that bug report.
<persia> Hew: Understood.  I'm just hoping someone else with experience with the software might have an opinion.
<Hew> When I was on Hardy though, I tested the Intrepid package and it was all fine.
<Hew> yep
<lifeless> persia: I think its a mistake to put more consideration into an SRU than the aggregate consideration done over a release cycle
 * RAOF wasn't aware that the gnutella network still _existed_.
<lifeless> persia: because it makes the SRU have a higher bar than the next release does, and thats silly.
<persia> lifeless: Do you want to upload the new version to hardy?
<lifeless> I have a critical data loss bug to fix first
<lifeless> just making an observation
<Hew> my opinion is that, by "backporting" as a SRU, there will be a far greater benefit (everyone has a working client) compared to the risk of regression.
<persia> Anyone from MOTU SRU about?  If Hew pushes the intrepid gtk-gnutella to hardy, woudl that be approved?
<RAOF> We should probably collect a list of these "only the latest version works" packages; I remember some discussion about Tor along similar lines.
<persia> Some of the games are that way too: openarena, tremulous, nexuiz (note that one *can* run the old server, but that it's hard to find them on the net)
<tgm4883_laptop> If you are a MOTU and are bored right now have I got a deal for you.  To help ease your boredness, I'll let you REVU my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube I've made the requested changes from the last REVU and am ready for another.  This offer valid while supplies last.
 * Hew just found two questions on answers.launchpad about the bug as well..
<tuxmaniac> anyone have information on Kickstart compatibility on Ubuntu here? the wiki page seems very very old and outdated. If someone could give me poitners to that will be very helpful.
<tuxmaniac> not sure whether this is right channel to ask.
<persia> tuxmaniac: Not really the right forum, but depending on your requirements, FAI and debian installer preseeding may also be interesting.
<lifeless> I thought kickstart was still supported
<lifeless> tuxmaniac: it probably hasn't been updated because it hasn't needed one
<tuxmaniac> ok thanks.
<tuxmaniac> debian preseeding page seems to be having quite a lot of info. thanks persia
<persia> tuxmaniac: Note that lifeless could well be perfectly correct: kickstart might just work as documented there.
<tuxmaniac> ok
<Iulian> Good morning.
<huats> morning everyone
<sylvaing> huats: hi
<huats> hey mister sylvaing
<huats> :)
<silwol> is there a display problem with the http://revu.ubuntuwire.com website?
<silwol> there are no packages in the "needs review" and many many in the "advocated packages" category
<persia> silwol: Indeed, and those in "Advocated" don't seem to have records of advocation.
<emgent> moin
<NCommander> Uh oh
<NCommander> damn it
<NCommander> RainCT broke it
<NCommander> I should be able to revert one revision
<NCommander> silwol, ignore it for now, it looks like we're experiencing some mild db corruption
<silwol> no problem for now, just wanted to make sure you know about the problem
<huats> TheMuso: are you around ?
<bigon> any motu-sru around?
<huats> bigon: +1 for me :)
<Syntux> When do we need to use provides/conflicts/replaces ?
<persia> Syntux: Provides when something meets a (possibly virtual) dependency.  Conflicts when there is a file name in common between two packages (note that policy mandates it work in essentially the same way: cf. /usr/lib/sendmail), replaces when one package should overwrite files from another package.
<persia> The most common case is when you have multiple binaries from a single source, and move some files between them.  The package getting new files then Conflicts with older version of the package that gave it the files, and also replaces it so as not to confuse dpkg.
<Syntux> persia, I'm using them with stardict english arabic dictionary because I'm going to package another english arabic dictionary for stardict provided from different source, would that make it correct us ?
<sylvaing> ping nijaba
<persia> Syntux: Is there a reason you can't install them in parallel, with slightly different file names?  Users might want to compare both results.
<Syntux> persia, different licenses
<Syntux> persia, we only have one GNU dictionary, two CC dictionaries but they are not general dictionaries but economic and politics i guess
<Syntux> and the last one is free from babylon but they didn't mention the license but it's freely available in babylon format easily converted to stardict format
<persia> Syntux: Sure, but is there a reason they should not all be installed, assuming the licensing is sorted?
<Syntux> persia, the two general didn't work together when installed
<persia> Syntux: Why not?
<Syntux> persia, no idea why
<persia> Syntux: That'd be the fist thing to investigate, before fussing with Conflicts/Replaces/Provides
<Syntux> persia, hmm but this isn't my game, I mean I don't know how to investigate why it's happening
<Syntux> persia, although they work just fine when both installed but one is disabled.
<persia> Syntux: You might check the error messages, etc.
<Syntux> ok
<Syntux> another question
 * persia is in a meeting, and hopes someone else can answer
<Syntux> babylon english-arabic dictionary is freely available http://www.babylon.com/define/98/English-Arabic-Dictionary.html but they didn't mention any license
<Syntux> argh freenode
<mok0> Syntux: it must have a license to be included in the distribution
<Syntux> mok0, and by putting them online for free download that doesn't mean it fits under any license ?
<mok0> no, just because you can freely download it, doesn't mean that you can also distribute it
<Syntux> mok0, what if we converted its format into something else? does that make it ours?
<mok0> Syntux: no
<mok0> Syntux: you need to get in contact with babylon
<mok0> Syntux: check what the DFSG says
<Syntux> mok0, what if someone else converted it and I just packaged what he converted? do I have to track the second level?
<mok0> Syntux: yes, you can't do that, it will violate the originators copyright
<Syntux> I studied law for two years and we do not track 2nd source in money laundry cases but we do in licenses, interesting :D
<Syntux> Okie, I will put contacting babylon on my todo and will only package the GNU dictionary for now
<mok0> Syntux: :-) hehe
<mok0> Syntux: the rule-of-thumb is that there _must_ be a license, and that license must conform to the DFSG
<mok0> Syntux: Several times, I
<mok0> I
<Syntux> mok0, yeah I understand but the thing is, babylong dictionary itself is free and its dictionaries are free too
<mok0> I've had to contact upstream to get them to clarify their license
<Syntux> although there is no license but we should make use of such enormous free efforts
<Syntux> mok0, great, can you give me an example of what should I ask them about ?
<mok0> Syntux: Unless there is an explicit license that allows us to distribute, it doesn't matter that it's free...
<mok0> Syntux: Ask them to include a license in a file with the dictionary source (which has to be editable, btw)
<Syntux> I still can't get it because naturally no one can own the words
<laga> why does the dictionary source have to be editable? if it's to live in multiverse it shouldn't matter.
<laga> although it'd be better if it was editable
<Syntux> it's like licensing the bible or holy quran
<mok0> laga: It has to be in "preferred modifiable form"
<mok0> Syntux: well, in contrast to the two works of art you refer to, these guidelines make sense
<mok0> ;-)
<broonie> Syntux: Actually, it is possible to copyright collections of things (ie, the result of putting a certain collection together is coptyrightable)
<Syntux> ok, I'm going to create a software and license both books and then the whole world should "Show me the money"
<Syntux> :d
<broonie> I'd also point out that in the UK there is crown copyright on the KJV bible.
<Syntux> humans!
 * mok0 wonders if God/Allah don't have copyright...
<jpds> Any Python folk know how I can urllib2.urlopen("https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev").read() - and check if the text: "You are not a member of this team" is in the page source?
<Syntux> not sure if God/Allah have a copyright but he have a database for sure :D
<mok0> Syntux: lol
<Syntux> and some secret agents spying on us
<mok0> jpds: Can't you just set up a regexp using the re module?
<RAOF> jpds: Sounds like you just want something along the lines of 'if "you are not a member of this team" in urllib.whatever' :)
<achadwick> "You are not a member of this team" in obj.read(), if you don't mind being inefficient
<Syntux> which is against our privacy!
<jpds> mok0: I tried that, I think my regex didn't work.
<mok0> jpds: so... make it work?
<jpds> mok0: I've tried, that's why I'm asking.
<mok0> jpds: show us the code (pastebin)
<Syntux> the new API doesnt have team membership status ?
<jpds> mok0: Seems I removed it experimenting..
<mok0> jpds: ah
<mok0> jpds: Syntux is right, you should check out the new LP API
<mok0> jpds: it may do what you want
<jpds> OK, I'll check it out.
<Syntux> or I'd awk it.
<Syntux> mok0, for gnu dictionary sections should be free/text ?
<jpds> Damn it, the reason the above failed was because the page had: "You must <a href="+login">log in</a> to join or leave this team".
<tuxmaniac> hi folks. can someone please look into bug 255224 and sponsor? thanks in advance
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255224 in gnusim8085 "New Upstream Release 1.3.4" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/255224
<mok0> Syntux: I don't know
<mok0> Syntux: I think they have to be free as in free speech
<Syntux> they are
<Syntux> with gnu license
<Syntux> editable format
<Syntux> what else do you want? haa?
<mok0> Syntux: sounds about right
<RAOF> Hah.  I win!  gnome-main-menu builds again.
<mok0> Syntux: check the writeup for the gnu dictionary app
<RAOF> Now I simply need to resist the urge to pull in more functionality from SVN while I'm pulling in patches to make it build.
<mok0> Syntux: they might actually not care about the dictionary
<Syntux> I'm trying to find list of section in ubuntu to see which fits most
<mok0> Syntux: but Debian/Ubuntu want the license to follow the DFSG
<Syntux> RAOF, if you torture the package it will build.
<Syntux> mok0, babylon case closed, I sent them an email and I wont bother packaging their dictionaries before hearing from them
<RAOF> Hm.  It seems build != work :)
<mok0> Syntux: great
<Syntux> mok0, now I'm talking about arabeyes gnu dictionary available in dictd format and someone converted it into stardict and I'm packaging it
<Syntux> there is no text section but translation but they mean something else by translation
<mok0> Syntux: OK, sounds good. I don't know the last thing about dictionary formats, though
<Syntux> it's free/text neyahahahaha
 * Syntux wonders when he'll have 10mbs 
<effie_jayx> persia, I got a reply from upstream. they are meging some changes and they will fix the font.
<persia> RAOF: What are you doing to the poor menus?
<persia> effie_jayx: Excellent news indeed.  Will they also fix the packaging, or do we need to move it to multiverse?
<persia> (or can we fix the packaging to be GPL?)
<effie_jayx> persia,  they are first fixing the font, aparently they have 7 different branches. they will not move the package to multiverse since it is of canonical maintenance. first they merge and they will build a better package for it...
<effie_jayx> basically they said... thanks kid, we got it covered
 * persia doesn't think Canonical gets a special pass for licensing, and hopes they fix it.
<effie_jayx> persia,  If they don't, in a years time I'll rant :D
<effie_jayx> persia,  how come the ubuntu-title isn't usable in many languanges... it is in the ubuntu promise...
<effie_jayx> heh
<effie_jayx> persia,  you are right ... some luck I have with bugs
<persia> effie_jayx: Just upstream didn't fix that.  Wasn't it in universe anyway?
<RainCT> jelmer: ping
<RainCT> jelmer: can bzr-upload on REVU be archived?
<effie_jayx> persia,  it is universe
<Kopfgeldjaeger> persia: Do you know what the direct config.sub changes in jabberd2 are for (you uploaded *ubuntu3 in january)?
<persia> Kopfgeldjaeger: Err, no.  Let me check to see if I have any of that information accessibly offline.
<stefanlsd> persia: what do u do for a living... out of interest
<persia> stefanlsd: I'm currently mostly a developer.  I've had lots of different jobs though, although mostly in technology.
<stefanlsd> persia: oh ok. employed or self employed?
<persia> stefanlsd: Employed.
<stefanlsd> persia: oh ok. cool. just you're so active and busy here, so i was just wondering
 * stefanlsd tells canonical to employ persia fulltime
<persia> I have unlimited access to IRC at work.
 * broonie is on IRC for work purposes :)
<persia> stefanlsd: Also, I'm in UTC+9, so you're usually about in my evenings, which likely impacts your perception.
<stefanlsd> oh ok. that would also explain it.
<elkbuntu> question: is there a netbook channel?
<dholbach> elkbuntu: you could try #ubuntu-mobile *shrug*
<persia> Kopfgeldjaeger: Sorry, I know nothing about that package: I only rebuilt it for NBS, but didn't look at it.
<Kopfgeldjaeger> ok
<elkbuntu> yeah... i was thinking something more aimed at eeepcs, not phones
<persia> Ubuntu Mobile isn't for phones.  Hardy only has MID support (very small laptops, small tablets, etc.).  Intrepid may have subnotebook support, if the right package set can be assembled.
<Treenaks> persia: subnotebook = eee-class?
<persia> Treenaks: Yep.  If you look at intrepid, you'll notice two meta packages: ubuntu-mid for the very small devices (4-6" screen, although there are some 3.5" devices it might work with), and ubuntu-mobile for the next larger (7-9" screens).  10"+ are likely candidates for ubuntu-desktop
<Hew> persia: Do we have the all clear to copy gtk-gnutella from Intrepid to hardy-proposed? bug 248055
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 248055 in gtk-gnutella "gtk-gnutella cannot connect to newer network - ancient version detected" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/248055
<Treenaks> persia: well, that assumes the hardware works
 * wgrant raises the alarm.
<persia> Hew: No idea.  Did you hear from anyone in motu-sru?
<Hew> persia: nope
<wgrant> Copying from Intrepid sounds bad.
<persia> Treenaks: How do you mean?  (and maybe #ubuntu-mobile is a better place)
<Hew> wgrant: Check out bug 248055, would be great to have extra eyes on it
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 248055 in gtk-gnutella "gtk-gnutella cannot connect to newer network - ancient version detected" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/248055
 * RainCT is thinking about if it would be good to have a 'ubuntu-packaging' metapackage which would pull in (as recommends) all the packages listed in the PackagingGuide
<persia> RainCT: why?
 * persia already has too many packages pulled by ubuntu-dev-tools
<jpds> persia: 'Tis my fault, I'm afraid: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/ubuntu-dev-tools/trunk/changes
<persia> jpds: I'd be very happy if you could add sbuild as an alternative to pbuilder, especially given the presence of the mk-sbuild-lv binary.
<jpds> persia: I shall look into it.
<Kopfgeldjaeger> It looks like $package ships with an old version of a file and I need to libtoolize --force --copy before it  builds successfully. Is this OK?
<RainCT> 6/14
<RainCT> (oops)
<emgent> http://apu.debconf.org:8000/Salon_del_mar.ogv.m3u
<jpds> Hobbsee: A "buildd" script is now in ubuntu-dev-tools trunk, and it does all the mozilla cookie extraction for you. FYI.
<Hobbsee> jpds: woot!
<jpds> :)
<RainCT> jpds: and you're missing a nose
<jpds> RainCT: :~>
<RainCT> strange nose :)
<directhex> :Õ(
<RainCT> directhex: is that a Debian nose?
<directhex> ooh, this one works well. :á)
<bddebian> Heya gang
 * jpds uploads new ubuntu-dev-tools package.
 * emgent clap clap clap
<RainCT> can some non-MOTU verify on REVU if he sees an Archive/Unarchive option on the details.py page for his packages but not on those from others?
<RainCT> (just look if it's there, no need to try it out as it doesn't do anything yet it you are not a MOTU)
<RainCT> jpds: you're spamming my mailbox :)
<Kopfgeldjaeger> I can see an Unarchive option
<jpds> RainCT: Use proper mail filters.
<RainCT> Kopfgeldjaeger: and is the package archived?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> for mine
 * slytherin wonders why we are still stuck at grub version 1 in Ubuntu. What happened to grub 2.
<Kopfgeldjaeger> yep
<persia> slytherin: Needs more testing.
<RainCT> jpds: what's the point of subscribing to diffs if I filter them out afterwards? xD
<RainCT> Kopfgeldjaeger: great, thanks for checking :)
<persia> RainCT: You can later review them to understand the changes.
<Kopfgeldjaeger> no problem ;)
<slytherin> persia: what kind of testing.
<RainCT> persia: well, but for that I can also do a  bzr diff -rXX..YY
<nhandler> RainCT: I am able to archive one of my own packages on REVU too
<RainCT> that with the mailbox spaming was a positive comment, btw
 * jpds hugs RainCT.
<persia> slytherin: http://www.gnu.org/software/grub/grub-2-faq.en.html #2
<RainCT> thanks, nhandler. no more testing needed for now
<slytherin> persia: It works well on i386 at least. But I will wait if people think it needs to stabilize.
<persia> slytherin: Considering that the vast majority of new 9386 compatible hardware is really amd64 or lpia, I'm not sure that's sufficient.  On the other hand, November is soon: might be worth proposing for intrepid+1
<slytherin> hmm
<geser> jpds: does requestsync also check if a MOTU requests a sync for a main package? as this also requires sponsorship
<jpds> geser: Err, I'll fix that with next upload.
<Jaded> don't suppose anyone from the ruby area is awake ?
<raphink> is it me only or the ubuntu wiki is down ?
<RainCT> raphink: here it works
<raphink> hmmmm
<RainCT> Jaded: just ask :)
<raphink> AttributeError
<raphink> 'module' object has no attribute 'getSysPage'
<raphink> If you want to report a bug, please save this page and attach it to your bug report.
<raphink>     * Show debugging information
<raphink>     * Report bug
<raphink>     * Visit MoinMoin wiki
<raphink> that's what I get
<raphink> :(
<RainCT> raphink: on what page?
<raphink>  on /
<raphink> or on any page actually
<raphink> I think it's an openID issue
<raphink> it happened after I logged in
<persia> raphink: Works for me o be authenticated.
<raphink> hmmm
<jpds> Works here.
<raphink> maybe it has to do with the theme then
<raphink> I'm using the kubuntu2 theme
<raphink> and I have no idea how to change it if I can't access the website ;)
<raphink> the debug infos seem to get down to kubuntu2.py
<Jaded> ok, was wondering if/when a package will be rolled covering the DNS spoofing vul in resolv.rb ? Ruby itself is patched up, but there doesn't seem to be a patched version in ubuntu packages
<raphink> is anyone else using the kubuntu2 theme on the wiki?
<joaopinto> Jaded, have you searched for the bug  on launchpad ?
<jpds> raphink: Try asking for a config change in #canonical-sysadmin
<raphink> jpds: ok thanks
<Koon> packaging question: a package builds binaries and associated libraries (that nobody else uses afaict). By default it puts the libs in /usr/lib. What is the best way[tm] : a single package with the default locations, multiple packages (one for the binaries + two for each lib, as if they were shared libs), or trying to have a single package that relocates the libs to /usr/lib/pkgname ?
<jpds> geser: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/ubuntu-dev-tools/trunk/revision/153
 * jpds makes changes to the above.
<jpds> There, that's better.
<Jaded> joaopinto: yeah, I'll just double check...
<bobbo> hey everyone, i just wrote a little python script that wraps around apt-cache rdepends and allows you to easily count the number of rdepends and it also support recursion (finding the rdepends of another packages rdepends and so on). Would people find this usefule in ubuntu-dev-tools?
<directhex> sounds useful for backporting
<dx9s_work> quicky question
<dx9s_work> where does one go to see recently released updates? (I think I remember a recent update for Evolution [gutsy] -- and now I can't connect to a global address book)
<slayton> is there a way to list all packages that a given package depends upon?
<bobbo> slayton: apt-cache showpkg or apt-cache showsrc should tell you
<slayton> bobbo, thanks!
<slayton> after I install a deb by hand it shows up in the list of packages under aptitude search... how can I get my manually installed packages to go away after I have removed them by hand?
<geser> slayton: what do you mean with "removed them by hand"?
<slytherin> slayton: go away from where?
<slayton> so I installed some packages with dpkg -i <debfile> then I have removed some with dpkg -r others with apt-get remove...
<dx9s_work> (2nd time) is there a place (web page?) to review recent updates (released/sorted by release date)... I seem to remember some updates for evolution over the past few days...
<slayton> when I type: aptitude search "query"  i see packages that I installed by hand in the list of available packages
<geser> slayton: does it have perhaps remaining config files still installed?
<slytherin> dx9s_work: for intrepid https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/intrepid-changes/
<dx9s_work> slytherin, ty (looking for https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/gutsy-changes/ ) heheh
<slayton> geser, i guess it could... not sure though
<slytherin> slayton: you could try apt-get --purge remove packagename. Not sure if theer is a purge option for dpkg
<slayton> ok I'll try that
<geser> dpkg -l the_package_name will tell you the status for it
<geser> slytherin: dpkg -P
<dx9s_work> slytherin, hmmm.. I see no recent updates .. (trying to rule out an update that has broken part of evolution-exchange / or not).. can connect to exchange (via OWA) but not the LDAP directory and get the "Global Address Book" ... no recent ldap updates either
<dx9s_work> slytherin, means a setting on the M$ side screwed things up
<geser> dx9s_work: you can also check /var/lib/dpkg.log for recent installed updates
<slytherin> dx9s_work: check changelog from synaptic to see when was package updated last time.
<dx9s_work> geser, thanks... (I see something 2008-07-31 2.12.1-0ubuntu1.3) .. and for me it is in /var/log/dpkg.log*
 * dx9s_work guesses he'll install the -dbg and see if there is anyway to figure out what-the-hell is going on
<james_w> hey, could someone please do a fakesync for bug 223596
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 223596 in mailping "Please sync mailping 0.0.4-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/223596
<RainCT> jpds: I have a new icon on LP :P
<dx9s_work> geser, thanks... but as I figured out.. it was not any updates.. it was the "admin" turning off the global catalog!
 * dx9s_work had to prove it wasn't Linux / Ubuntu / Evolution first tho!!!
<dx9s_work> (lame winholes idiots I work with)
<slayton> I'd like to package hdf5-1.8.1  to ship with some of the software i'm releasing.... how different  the debian dirs be from the 1.6.5 and 1.8.1? Is it as simple as copying the dir over and just changing the relevant version numbers?
<slayton> how different would the
<jpds> RainCT: hmm?
<RainCT> jpds: ubuntu-l10n-ca :)
<jpds> Aha.
<bdmurray> Should an Ubuntu bug be opened for debian bug 486408?
<ubottu> Debian bug 486408 in spamassassin "cron.daily: The update downloaded successfully," [Normal,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/486408
<RainCT> jpds: you can use os.path.expanduser() instead of os.environ
 * jpds reads help()
<tgm4883_laptop> Other packages take candy from babies.  Mythstream-parser-youtube gives candy to babies, stands up for what you believe in, and does the right thing.  If you are a MOTU, REVU mythstream-parser-youtube today.  Paid for by the maintainer to get mythstream-parser-youtube REVUed  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube
<jpds> RainCT: Ahh, ok.
<superm1> tgm4883_laptop, it looks like as they stand those perl scripts when installed aren't marked executable
<superm1> tgm4883_laptop, do they work?
<tgm4883_laptop> superm1, yes
<tgm4883_laptop> to clarify, yes they work
<superm1> so the plugin does actually call them with perl SCRIPT then
<tgm4883_laptop> i'd have to dig throught the mythstream code to verify, but it must because none of my installed parsers are marked +x
<medo_> if you attach a patch to bug report how do you get someone to check it and test it thoroughly??
<medo_> or it is some one will check it when he can?
<jpds> medo_: Which bug # is it?
<medo_> jpds: bug #159189
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 159189 in usbutils "lsusb : Fix or remove -t option" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/159189
<jpds> medo_: usbutils is in main, you should subcribe the "ubuntu-main-sponsors" team.
<medo_> jpds: thanks a lot
<jpds> medo_: https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-main-sponsors
<emgent> ScottK: around ?
<didrocks> Hi all :)
<didrocks> I try to build the azeurus intrepid source package azureus_2.5.0.4-1ubuntu4
<medo_> jpds: then do I need to send a message to them requesting a sponsor or it should appear to them?, sorry it is very naive as this is my first patch to do
<didrocks> got this FTBFS: ./org/gudy/azureus2/ui/console/multiuser/commands/UserCommand.java:31: package org.apache.commons.cli does not exist
<didrocks> (with sudo pbuilder build...)
<didrocks> I do not understand why it is not recorded in harvest as FTBFS and it seems a missing dependency, no?
<slytherin> didrocks: why are you trying to build azureus?
<didrocks> slytherin: there is a NBS for icedtea-java7-jre that I try to fix
<tuxmaniac> hi folks. Any idea when the next REVU day is?
<didrocks> 4 reverse dependies (azureus, freecol, project-x and sun-javadb)
<slytherin> didrocks: There is a large merge pending for azureus. The debian version is some 3.1.x if IIRC. Try to work on that merge if you can. :-)
<didrocks> for the 3 others, it was ok, just remove the dependencie
<didrocks> oh, ok, it will be my first merge so, is it ok even if it is a large one ? :)
<slytherin> didrocks: that is why said, if you can. :-)
<didrocks> slytherin: during this time, is it possible to subscribe u-u-s to remove the 3 fixed reverse depencies (to not having to regenerate the debdiff is someone else upload a new package during this time): https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/project-x/+bug/203636 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 203636 in sun-javadb "replace icedtea-java7 references with openjdk-6 references" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<slytherin> didrocks: let me check
<didrocks> slytherin: ok
<slytherin> didrocks: your debdiff for project-x is wrong. Also if you are removing icedtea from dependencies, make sure you also remove it from build dependencies.
<didrocks> slytherin: I removed it for the line Depends:${misc:Depends}, libcommons-net-java, openjdk-6-jre | sun-java6-jre | sun-java5-jre
<didrocks> is it not sufficient?
<slytherin> didrocks: why should it remain in Build-Depends?
<didrocks> I should have made a mistake, let me try again :/
<Yasumoto> Hey guys, if there's an issue with the postinst script, should I just generate a debdiff as normal? Or is there a special way to go about it?
<slytherin> Yasumoto: debdiff as normal.
<slytherin> Yasumoto: of course if the package does not have a ubuntu revision (ubuntux) then you might want to see if the problem has already been fixed in some Debian version.
<slytherin> didrocks: by the way, #ubuntu-java is an ideal channel for java packaging matters.
<Yasumoto> slytherin: mm, thanks
<didrocks> slytherin: to try to fix the FTBFS, I will use it, for sure ;)
<schakrava> bobbo: hi
<didrocks> slytherin: if I look at project-x_0.90.4dfsg-0ubuntu4.dsc (previous version), I have "Build-Depends: cdbs (>= 0.4.43), debhelper (>= 5.0.38), libcommons-net-java, liboro-java, openjdk-6-jdk"
<didrocks> but in debian/control, there is "Depends:${misc:Depends}, libcommons-net-java, openjdk-6-jre | icedtea-java7-jre | sun-java6-jre | sun-java5-jre"
<slytherin> didrocks: I think you got confused. My bad. There are two different problems. 1. The debdiff you uploaded for project-x is messed up. 2. In the debdiff for freecol, icedtea is still present in build depends.
<didrocks> oh, build-depends and not Depends
<didrocks> I'm sorry
<Yasumoto> slytherin: yep, no ubuntu version. good call :) I found the bug reported in the debian bug tracker as well :)
<zooko> You mean the egenix package of pyopenssl, right?
<zooko> Whoops, wrong channel.
<didrocks> slytherin: it must be ok now
<slytherin> didrocks: Haven't checked. Busy with something else.
<didrocks> slytherin: ok, just for the advice, do you think when my mentor will have checked that I should suscribe u-u-s juste for these 3 when I will work on the 4th?
<slytherin> didrocks: sure no problem.
<didrocks> thanks a lot slytherin, have a good work ;)
<Adri2000> does the SRU Verification Team checks universe bugs or only main ones?
<slytherin> Adri2000: there is a separate motu-sru team.
<Adri2000> motu-sru approves sru, but doesn't verify that the fixed packages work afaik, does it?
<slytherin> Adri2000: no, that has to be done by users when package is uploaded to -proposed. I am not sure if it also needs to be verified by some developer.
<Adri2000> ok
<Adri2000> and do you know how much time a package should stay in -proposed before moving to -updates?
<Adri2000> I'm pretty sure it's 7 days but can't find it on the wiki
<slytherin> Adri2000: it is not time. IIRC, at least 2 people need to verify that package from -proposed fixes the problem and does not introduce any regressions.
<Adri2000> oh :o
<Adri2000> anyone to confirm?
<slytherin> Adri2000: but I guess 7 days might be considered reasonable time so that people can report back.
<didrocks> Adri2000: I just know that is the way it works in debian :)
 * Adri2000 goes poking an archive admin in #-devel to move his sru to -updates
<fabrice_sp> Hi. I'm having a menu-icon-not-in-xpm-format error when validating my package with lintian. Is it possible to convert a png file to xpm? Thanks.
<slytherin> fabrice_sp: I that error is for Debian menu system. I don't think you should be concerned with that as we use freedesktop menu specification. Debian menu system is the old one which predates freedesktop specification. I am not sure if even Debian uses it.
<fabrice_sp> slytherin: I'm adding a menu file to the package I'm doing, after norsetto reviewing my package. One of his comment was adding a menu file
<fabrice_sp> (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mountmanager)
<slytherin> fabrice_sp: well then you should be able to use gimp to convert png to xpm. But keep png also as it should be installed /usr/share/icons/hicolor
<fabrice_sp> slytherin: as this xpm file is not in upstream, would I have problems with the diff file? (because of binary). Anyway, I will keep png file
<didrocks> fabrice_sp: convert $source debian/desktop/${dest}.xpm
<didrocks> for instance
<slytherin> fabrice_sp: you will have to keep the xpm file in debian directory. And I think you need to use uuencode and uudecode utilities for binary to ascii conversion. Not sure exactly how, as I have never done it myself.
<didrocks> I tried once a debdiff on it without any problem
<RainCT> for uuencode, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Howtos/BinaryFilesInDiff
<fabrice_sp> didrocks: where can I find convert?
<RainCT> fabrice_sp: imagemagick, I think
<slytherin> fabrice_sp: imagemagick
<didrocks> yes, imagemagick :)
<fabrice_sp> slytherin & RainCT: I'll have a look to uuencode. I is acceptable to have imagemagick as build dependency to a package?
<fabrice_sp> (and add convert during the build pahse)
<fabrice_sp> s/pahse/phase
<RainCT> fabrice_sp: For the XPM? You could do so, but I don't see any reason for it (you don't need to uuencode .xpm's).
<fabrice_sp> RainCT: xpm are ascii? So I just have to convert it once. Thanks! :-)
<fabrice_sp> one more question about this xpm stuff: How do I install it in a clean way? Calling install -d within rules files seems a bit odd...
<\sh> fabrice_sp: xpms are ascii yes...just like an old sprite definition
<Treenaks> \sh: aren't xpm's C-headers even?
<\sh> Treenaks: somehow yes...but the definition of the whole xpm looks like an old sprite layout definition... you know when you designed your sprites for the C64 ,->
<Treenaks> \sh: I'm one year too old for C64, and Hercules mono didn't have sprites
<\sh> Treenaks: can't be....I used hercules graphics after the c64 ,-)
<Treenaks> \sh: sorry, I was born one year too late
<Treenaks> making me one year too young
<Treenaks> brainfart
<\sh> Treenaks: btw...people are still finding those scary "Ubuntu fan Videos" ,-)
<Treenaks> \sh: _scary_? :)
<Treenaks> itym lovely!
<\sh> Treenaks: this morning a colleague from finance came to me and asked me "Stephan, is this you on the video?" and I was shocked...
<Treenaks> rofl :)
<Treenaks> That was in Montreal, wasn't it?
<\sh> Treenaks: right :)
<\sh> anyways ,  a good sign that windows people are showing interest in linux and especially ubuntu...one task on my list -> done
<laga> hum. kind of off-topic, but.. how can i revert changes in a git tree? do i need to commit them first?
<\sh> Treenaks: btw...are you planning to attend froscon this year in germany (st. augustin, near cologne + bonn?)
<Treenaks> \sh: when is it?
<\sh> Treenaks: 23rd and 24th of august ;) a weekend
<\sh> laga: is there no "git uncommit" like in bzr?
<laga> i think there is, but i haven't committed yet
<laga> i'm not very familiar with git :)
<Treenaks> undo?
<Treenaks> revert?
<\sh> revert i guess
<\sh> then
<laga> i'll ask google for a git tutorial :)
<\sh> laga: ask linus he should know ,-)
<laga> heh
<norsetto> gentlemen
<\sh> ola norsetto
<norsetto> \sh: ola ombre
<\sh> norsetto: how is life?
<norsetto> \sh: alive ;-) And you?
<laga> \sh: git-reset --hard does what i want
<\sh> up and down..the usual :)
 * norsetto hands over a beer to 
<norsetto> oh well
<\sh> norsetto: ah I just had one or five
<bobbo> hey schakrava
<Syntux> Salam
<bobbo> rm $(ls)
<bobbo> sorry!
<\sh> that's dangerous
<bobbo> \sh: how so?
<laga> it's dangerous because it won't work if a file name contains spaces
<\sh> executed in my home dir it would give me pain
<laga> indeed
<schakrava> bobbo: hi
<schakrava> bobbo: was the debdiff ok?
<bobbo> schakrava: there were a couple of little things that could be improved (though fairly minor)
<\sh> laga: real unix people not "space" using in filenames
<bobbo> schakrava: i'll msg you to avoid spamming this channel :)
 * warp10 moins bobbo
<bobbo> warp10: moins?
<schakrava> bobbo: ok
<didrocks> warp10: !!!
<warp10> didrocks: !!!
<jpds> bobbo: North German slang for morning.
<jpds> ...or something.
<bobbo> jpds: ah :)
<\sh> jpds: not correct... moin moin is north german slang for good morning...moins is just some other slang someone created ;)
<jpds> \sh: "...oder etwas."
<\sh> jpds: hehe
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-13
<nxvl> ScottK: i surrender trying to patch the libtool hell from courier
<nxvl> persia: around?
<nhandler> If there is a bug requesting a merge of a package, and that package really should be synced, should I simply add a comment stating why this is a sync instead of a merge, or should I modify the bug description/title as well to make it a sync request?
<Adri2000> modify description and title to add the required informations for a sync
<nhandler> Ok, because in the past, when this has happened to me, the bug was simply marked as incomplete and assigned to me. They then added a comment stating it should be a sync. It was then up to me to modify the report. I just wanted to see what the proper way to go about switching a merge request to a sync request was
<nxvl> nhandler: it's better to change the title and add a comment, but just adding the description of why is enought
<nxvl> enough*
<Adri2000> not only the rationale is needed, sync requests require changelog and other things
<nxvl> yep
<ScottK> Apparently Launchpad forgot that FOSS is actually supposed to have the source distributed too.
<ScottK> I went to look at ebox-mail in the ebox-unstable PPA and there's no orig.tar.gz, but the binaries are there.
<ajmitch> ScottK: you mean http://ppa.launchpad.net/ebox-unstable/ubuntu/pool/main/e/ebox-mail/ebox-mail_0.11.svn11184-0ubuntu1~ppa1~intrepid1.dsc ?
 * ajmitch saw the orig.tar.gz listed right below that
<ScottK> Wasn't there a minute ago.
<ScottK> ajmitch: Odd.  It's not listed on the web site and dget can't find it.
<ScottK> Thanke
<ScottK> Thanks
<ajmitch> strange, it appears in the Sources file
<ScottK> I can dget it from that link fine.
<ScottK> It's when I tried from the link to the .dsc on the web u/i.
<ScottK> Then if failed.
<ScottK> if/it
<ajmitch> bug time
<ScottK> Right.
<ScottK> Filing
<ajmitch> web UI does just have links to the librarian from what I can see
<ScottK> Yes, but usually you can dget those.
<ajmitch> really? I thought that it wasn't possible due to different directories
<ScottK> It's been possible for a while (I think someone made dget smarter.
<ScottK> At a guess someone change librarian and didn't tell either the PPA people or the dget maintainer.
<zver> i need rebuild nginx package with perl support. how i can simply do it. what command i need run? thanks for help.
<zver> 1. what command for get src package
<ScottK> apt-get source $SOURCEPACKAGE_NAME
<zver> don't work. http://pastebin.ca/1169164  wrong repos?
<zver> i'm fix it
<zver> :)
<zver> so, i get sources. how i may build it ? what command?
<dholbach> good morning
<RAOF> Good afternoon, dholbach :)
<dholbach> hi RAOF
<tuxmaniac> good morning everybody. Can someone please review bug 255224 .diff.gz and sponsor the upload to fix the same? thanks in advance
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: taking a look at it
<tuxmaniac> dholbach: thank you.
<tuxmaniac> can anyone let me know when is the next revu day?
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: which version of the package did you base yours own?
<tuxmaniac> 1.3.2
<dholbach> which ubuntu revision?
<tuxmaniac> 1.3.2-0ubuntu1
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: it seems you drop a bunch of debian/changelog entries and removed the package maintainer in debian/copyright?
<dholbach> there's 1.3.2-2ubuntu1 in intrepid
<dholbach> if you could update the diff.gz I'd appreciate it
<tuxmaniac> sure
<dholbach> ROCK ON
<tuxmaniac> but I didnt touch the copyright. I will ask slytherin when he is around. thanks for the update
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: maybe it was a change on the way to 1.3.2-2ubuntu1
<dholbach> and not your fault at all
<tuxmaniac> I will look at it.
<dholbach> I'm currently test-building it, so I can sponsor it once you updated the diff
<tuxmaniac> dholbach: thanks. I am doing it right away. will ping you once done
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: merci
<tuxmaniac> dholbach: bitteschoen
<tuxmaniac> dholbach: you are right. I am sorry I overlooked the versions. there are a few changes done by nhandler that got missed.
<dholbach> a mistake easy to make - don't worry
<tuxmaniac> dholbach: the version number is correct right. I think there need not be any changes wrt that. 1.3.4-0ubuntu1 ?
<dholbach> yes, the version number is fine
<zver> how i may see list files in deb file without unpack it ?
<dholbach> zver: less bla.deb
<tuxmaniac> dholbach: have updated. please check and let me know any issues
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: alright
<dholbach> hey jono
<jono> hey
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: uploaded - thanks :)
<tuxmaniac> dholbach: great! thank YOU
<dholbach> anytime :)
<huats> morning everyone
<dholbach> hi huats, hi thekorn
<huats> hey mister dholbach :)
<Iulian> G'morning
<dholbach> heya Iulian
<Iulian> Hey Daniel, huats.
<huats> hi Iulian
<Laney> Morning all
<Laney> Half day at work :D
<Iulian> Morning Laney.
<sylvaing> huats: ping
<Laney> dholbach: Morning, you subscribed the archive to bug #256355 but didn't ACK it. Was this an oversight?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 256355 in gutenbrowser "Please sync gutenbrowser 3:0.9.0-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/256355
<dholbach> Laney: yes, fixed
<Laney> 0:D
<Laney> -0
<Syntux> Good day
<\sh> oh lord...does anyone know how the support of broken packages is done for getdeb.net?
<RAOF> What's broken on there that's tickled your fancy?
<RAOF> I think they have a Launchpad project?
<\sh> RAOF: no..it's just announced on a news portal...and I want to avoid wrong pointers to people...
<RAOF> \sh: You mean: please don't file bugs on these packages with us, file them at $URL?
<\sh> ah there he is :)
<\sh> RAOF: yes
<\sh> joaopinto: I just talked about you and getdeb.net
<joaopinto> hello, good morning
<joaopinto> bad things :P ?
<\sh> joaopinto: could you give me a pointer where users should go and file support requests and bugs? it wasn't mentioned on the german news portal (http://www.linux-community.de/Neues/story?storyid=26323)
<joaopinto> https://bugs.launchpad.net/getdeb.net
<\sh> joaopinto: ah ok..via launchpad.net
<\sh> cool
<Syntux> mok0, 90% of Babylon Arabic dictionaries created by users, I'm contacting them one by one to explain what is GNU and to encourage them to GNU the dictionaries, Babylon itself has nothing to do with it
<slytherin> geser: there
<geser> slytherin: Hi
<slytherin> any thoughts on bug 257215 or bug 183139 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 257215 in fop "Please add dependency on ant-optional" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/257215
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 183139 in openjdk-6 "[wishlist] make gtk laf default for icedtea-java" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/183139
<slytherin> geser: by the way, your expertise could be useful in #ubuntu-java :-)
<geser> slytherin: re the first bug: how big would a fop-ant package be?
<slytherin> geser: A small jar containing few class files I. Should not be more than 100KB in any case. I prefer that solution because not everyone may want to use fop ant task. And I don't want to add dependency on ant-optional since fop can be used standalone.
<geser> slytherin: why not add ant-optional to recommends or suggests? because every new package makes the Packages file bigger
<geser> and one should try to avoid adding many small packages where possible
<slytherin> geser: yes, but not everyone wants to use ant with fop. Also there is chances that people will set 'Do not install recommends by default' and then complain that ant task of fop is not working.
<quadrispro> geser, slytherin: new debdiff uploaded (I prefer 1st solution, I'm not sure that a fop-ant bin-package could be really useful), feel free to do what you consider the best solution (I'm only a beginner in packaging) :)
<slytherin> quadrispro: I an not upload a debdiff. All I can give is my opinion. I will wait to Matvey to look into it.
<quadrispro> ok ok :)
<geser> slytherin: wouldn't the same people complain that fop is missing the files in fop-ant and want a dependency on fop-ant added to fop?
<slytherin> geser: I think not because then you cleary have a fop-ant package which says it contains ant task.
<slytherin> geser: anyway, this is my opinion. I can wait to hear more about it. I will bring it up in next meeting.
<geser> slytherin: re the second bug: is there also KDE laf?
<slytherin> geser: AFAIK, not part of JRE. But if someone has created a LNF package for KDE then I don't know.
<geser> do you know if the LNF can be configured on a per-user basis?
<slytherin> geser: yes, let me find documentation about that.
<Syntux> guys, I created a needs-packaging bug and packaged that 'wishlist' package, what should I do now?
<slomo> slytherin: hi, re gst-plugins-bad, imho just a missing dependency on libdvdread-dev in libdvdnav-dev, if you could care for that, that'd be nice :)
<Syntux> bug # 257239
<coolbhavi> emgent, hello
<slytherin> slomo: problem has been already fixed in Debian. A sync bug is filed and acked.
<slomo> slytherin: yes, or that :)
<slytherin> Syntux: Is the package available on revu?
<slytherin> slomo: if you could push some archive admin to do process the sunc. :-D
<slytherin> sync
<Syntux> slytherin, not yet, shall I proceed and add it there?
<slomo> slytherin: which bug number?
<slytherin> Syntux: Since it is a new package it has to be reviewed and REVU is best place.
<slytherin> slomo: 254919
<slytherin> geser: it is possible to specify LNF from command line. So an alias would work. Not sure if a user can have swing.properties in his home directory.
<slomo> slytherin: thanks
<stefanlsd> Is it possible to tell dpkg -i to install dependencies automatically?
<RAOF> I don't believe so, no.
<ion_> dpkg --unpack foo, apt-get -f install
<broonie> Or just dpkg -i it and then ask apt-get or aptitude to fix it up.
<ion_> --unpack
<sylvaing> zul: done for obm on revu ;-)
<slytherin> geser: do you think this look and feel is closer to how QT4 apps look - http://java.sun.com/developer/technicalArticles/javase/java6u10/#nimbus ?
<emgent> hello stefanlsd :)
<Laney> jpds: Hey, I've added some extra validation code to pull-lp-source. In ~laney/ubuntu-dev-tools/dev if you'd be so kind as to merge
<geser> slytherin: I don't know how QT4 apps look like. I prefer Gnome.
<slytherin> :-)
<geser> slytherin: the best solution would be a wrapper for the java bin, which allows specifing the LNF in a dot-file in the homedir (or a system default) and calls java with the correct LNF
<geser> so Ubuntu could sets gtk as default and Kubuntu metal or nimbus (depending what they prefer)
<slytherin> geser: right. We want java apps to look better integrated. So we should make Metal go away.
<directhex> death (to) Metal!
<slytherin> geser: but if we need to use different look and feel based on desktop then the swing.properties file will need to reside outside of  jre package.
<directhex> webkit takes a while to build.
<slytherin> directhex: I don't think any package matches OOo in build time.
<directhex> slytherin, probably not. and i dread to think about the space requirements too
<directhex> slytherin, but webkit's pretty damn slow for only a 12 meg package
<RAOF> I'd guess that Eclipse could give OOo a run for its money.
<slytherin> directhex: I heard it close to 10 G.
<slytherin> RAOF: you may be right. I neevr considered that possibility.
<directhex> tee hee, OOo build-depends on mono
<directhex> RAOF, compare the build-dep lists between OOo and eclipse
<RAOF> slytherin: It was particularly good when we were building Eclipse with gcj as well, I don't know if we still do.  That consumed a pretty 5 Gb of RAM.
<jpds> Laney: I'll take a look.
<geser> slytherin: I guess KDE people won't be happy if we force the GTK LNF to them, so better make it configurable from the start. This will probably also give you less resistence to move away from metal
<slytherin> geser: Yes. No second opinion about that. Only thing I wanted to know is how can we configure look and feel based on desktop. It is a simple properties file after all. How to you propose we make the property value conditional?
<geser> slytherin: if you also think about multi-user system where both Gnome and KDE are installed, it would be best if a wrapper around java could read the prefered LNF from the users homedir (and fall-back to a value stored in /etc/...) and call the java with the correct switch
<geser> I don't see currently any other option which would work for all
<slytherin> geser: hmm, need to think about it.
<slytherin> geser: of course this is if KDE guys insist on having their own look and feel.
<geser> yes, if you can persuade them to the GTK LNF even better (and simplier)
 * slytherin adds a reminder to send a mail to kubuntu-devel mailing list.
<Syntux> could someone review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=stardict-arabeyes-english-arabic
<slytherin> geser: on a side note, do you think if space permits, we could accommodate openjdk-6-jre on CD?
<devfil> Can a REVU admin resync keys?
<geser> devfil: not needed anymore
<devfil> geser: why?
<geser> devfil: REVU fetches your key on the first login
<devfil> geser: but I've changed my gpg key
<geser> devfil: ask RainCT or NCommander (when he's here again), I don't know how this should work in that case
<slytherin> devfil: when did you change the key? Whether it was before revu revamping?
<devfil> slytherin: yesterday
<geser> slytherin: how much space whould openjdk-6-jre need on the CD (incl all dependencies not already on the CD)?
<directhex> lots
<slytherin> geser: will need to calculate.
<directhex> can't openjdk be split? i know sun jdk can't due to licensing, but does openjdk have the same limitation?
<slytherin> directhex: what kind of split do you suggest?
<directhex> slytherin, look at mono as an example - 12 meg monolithic packages for the entire classlib were split into small few-hundred-k-at-most packages for each major classlib entry. helps make apps smaller, so you're not depending on some enormous irrelevant chunk of the classlib just to run an app barely more complex than hello world
<RainCT> devfil: your key is synced each time you log in
<directhex> slytherin, so tomboy & f-spot have 16.2 meg of package dependencies including the required runtime, whereas openjdk is twice that without any apps
<slytherin> directhex: The main reason jre is so big is I guess it also includes translations. As of now it is only split between -jre and -jre-headless, where headless does not contain any UI classes.
<directhex> slytherin, well, i don't think anyone's surprised that openjdk is big. so's mono. the difference is you don't pull in *all* of mono just to run one app. take a look at http://www.meebey.net/jaws/?gadget=Blog&action=SingleView&id=Hello_World_how_small_can_you_get for example
<directhex> slytherin, if you have a dapper VM or chroot handy, compare the dependency chain for a mono app on dapper & now (dapper had more monolithic mono than edgy+)
<slytherin> directhex: Yours is good point. We will surely discuss it in next meeting.
<directhex> slytherin, it's gonna be a big job, and i don't remember if the java classlib already ships distinct class files (or if they're packed into jars)
<directhex> slytherin, it's been a while since i did much java, to be honest. but it's worth wondering about, on a longer timescale than intrepid is offering
<jpds> Laney: Merged with trunk and pushed. Thanks.
<slytherin> directhex: yes, this seems to be more appropriate for intrepid +1. the rt.jar itself is 53M
<directhex> bugger. not a great start
<directhex> slytherin, i think you'll be lucky to get openjdk onto the intrepid ISO as it is - the squashfs image on hardy is already 680 M, i can't imagine shrinkage from intrepid
<directhex> slytherin, though if it makes you feel better, mono will shrink further in the lenny+1 timescale, which should free some space for intrepid+1
<slytherin> directhex: there is very low chance. May be I can ask about including -jre-headless on server image.
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<slytherin> directhex: server image is pretty small, around 580M.
<jpds> moin sistpoty|work
<sistpoty|work> hi jpds
<directhex> slytherin, sounds sensible for server, if paired with other related things like tomcat. is tomcat in main?
<slytherin> directhex: tomcat 5.5 is in main, tomcat 6 has entered archives recently.
<sistpoty|work> Laney: just saw that you want to join uncommon-prog-lang (which is quite a dead team right now)... any particular languages/packages you want to fiddle with?
<directhex> intercal!
<devfil> Can a REVU admin resync keys?
<sistpoty|work> devfil: keyring syncs aren't necessary any longer
<sistpoty|work> devfil: just sure you've logged in and merged accounts
<sistpoty|work> (and the queues are empty as well... not too much to do for a revu admin nowadays :))
<devfil> sistpoty|work: Merge REVU accounts?
<sistpoty|work> devfil: in case you had a local revu account, you'll need to merge this with the launchpad/openid account (but that's not necessary for uploading in the first place)
<devfil> sistpoty|work: ok, thanks
<sistpoty|work> np
<ScottK> dholbach: Are you around?
<luisbg> what port does apt use?
<slayton> I keep getting an error with my changelog.... http://pastebin.com/m3bc6780
<slayton> I have no clue what to do
<directhex> luisbg, um... http or ftp, so 80 or 21?
<luisbg> directhex: ok, thanks
<slayton> here is the changelog http://pastebin.com/m2f89d4d5
<geser> slayton: time missing in the first entry
<slayton> ahhh! ok thanks!
<luisbg> directhex: a question about the or... can I force apt to just use http?
<geser> slayton: how did you edit the changelog? dch is really helpful here
<directhex> luisbg, only having http lines in sources.list?
<geser> luisbg: depends on your sources.list
<luisbg> I see
<luisbg> :) very logical
<james_w> slayton: I think you are missing the timezone from that trailer line
<luisbg> have a user having problems with firewall
<luisbg> nothing big
<james_w> hey luis
<luisbg> hey james_w
<luisbg> james_w: how is life going?
<james_w> luisbg: good thanks, you?
<luisbg> james_w: doing very good... busy as hell but that is good
<luisbg> james_w: got any gigs recently?
<slayton> geser: thanks again for your help.... does this look better? http://pastebin.com/m534cd308
<james_w> luisbg: no, have you?
<geser> slayton: almost, I'm not sure if the two space between the date and the time are a problem (line 5) and I guess it should be "Tue" and not "Tues" in line 11
<devfil> Can someone take a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=ircp-tray ?
<slayton> geser. thanks!
<luisbg> james_w: I am resident of a club here in Dublin now
<luisbg> they cover the saturdays at a big venue here
<james_w> luisbg: ah cool, I forgot you were in Dublin now. Perhaps I'll find myself in Ireland one weekend looking for somewhere to go out :-)
<dholbach> ScottK: yes
<ScottK> dholbach: Yesterday I had an interesting experience I'd like to share with you.
<ScottK> I was at a customer facility for $WORK and got to chatting with a local sysadmin there.
<ScottK> He's currently using Debian Testing on his desktop at home and considering switching to Ubuntu.
<dholbach> nice :)
<ScottK> We got to talking about my involvement in Ubuntu development and I encouraged him that he could get involved.
<ScottK> He doubted he knew enough but I assured him he did.
<dholbach> What kind of stuff is he interested in?
<ScottK> Not sure exactly, at work he's tending a variety of ancient SunOS, Solaris, Red Hat, and Centos boxes and not enjoying the experience.
<ScottK> The thing I wanted to pass on, was that really seemed to seal the deal as far as his interest was that I gave him one of the Kubuntu CDs I got at UDS.
<luisbg> hey dholbach
<luisbg> james_w: if you are around dublin let me know
<ScottK> Given the cut backs in ShipIt, if I hadn't been at UDS, I wouldn't have had one to give.
<dholbach> hi luisbg
<james_w> luisbg: I sure will
<ScottK> dholbach: I'd like you to consider that if developers could get more CDs, we could do a lot better with getting technically ept people involved.
<dholbach> Did anybody else make a similar experience?
<jpds> ScottK: I chose "Custom order" in ShipIt, linked to my LP page and got some more CDs.
<ScottK> It'll send me 1.  Let me look again.
<Syntux> Do we have anything like legal department in Ubuntu ?
<dholbach> ScottK: that sounds great and I'll pass this on just as you told me
<coolbhavi> hello dholbach sir
 * RainCT tried requesting 5 from the custom order option and got that rejected (and afterwards the same with 3)
<dholbach> hi coolbhavi
<nhandler> Hey Daniel
<dholbach> nhandler: hey Nathan
 * coolbhavi hugs nhandler 
<jpds> ScottK: https://shipit.ubuntu.com/specialrequest
<ScottK> So far I've gotten one CD out of shipit this year.  All the rest were denied.
<broonie> ScottK: Wierd. I seem to get two of each release with no trouble.
<broonie> And one of us works rather more directly on Ubuntu than the other.
<ScottK> Maybe I'm just special.
<slytherin> slayton: you should be using the output provided by 'date -R' command for timestamp.
<ScottK> jpds: Thanks.  Submitted now.  We'll see.
<ScottK> dholbach: I sent a special request.  Maybe that will get me more than one per year.
<slytherin> Syntux: what is the query?
<Syntux> sylvaing, various questions
<sylvaing> yes
<Syntux> sorry sylvaing.
<Syntux> slytherin, various questions :-)
<sylvaing> lol
<sylvaing> ok
<slytherin> Syntux: I am not sure of #ubuntu-legal exists and you can check on lists.ubuntu.com if there is a mailing list for legal.
<jpds> ScottK: I remember that before there was an "Ubuntu Member" offer.
<dholbach> ScottK: I just looked at our conversation again and what I'm also interested in is the "He doubted he knew enough but I assured him he did." part - when I'm talking to people I hear that a lot
<dholbach> I think we're doing a lot to get the message out that you don't need to speak fluent C with your family to be able to help us out, but still lots of people have the wrong impression of what we do
<ScottK> Yes.  I told him that as an experienced sysadmin, as long as he knew a bit of shell, he could package.
<ScottK> Feel free to point me out as an example.  I got core-dev and I don't do C at all.
<slayton> in the various packaging guides out there I keep reading about upstream... what is upstream?
<dholbach> slayton: the authors of a piece of software
<ScottK> or Debian.
<ScottK> Places from which we get code.
<sistpoty|work> or more generic: someone you take software from (who might have modified it from somewhere else, who might it ...)
<coolbhavi> I am getting this error please help http://pastebin.com/d6f1d5a00
<slytherin> coolbhavi: you don't have ant installed
<coolbhavi> slytherin, Okay!
<slayton> I have a couple of packages that I'd like to submit to Universe I've been reading  the reqs on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/CodeReviews#NewPackage, I'm pretty sure my package isn't ready but I don't feel like I know enough to get it the last 10%....  how can I submit a package for review/feedback?
<sistpoty|work> !REVU | slayton
<ubottu> slayton: REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<slytherin> coolbhavi: are you working in a merge of libjidc-java?
<coolbhavi> huats, hello
<coolbhavi> slytherin, yes
<coolbhavi> oh power down
<huats> hello coolbhavi
<coolbhavi> brb
<slytherin> coolbhavi: make sure you talk with geser first, he is the last uploader.
<slytherin> ï»¿coolbhavi: are you working in a merge of libjidc-java?
<slytherin> coolbhavi: wrong copy paste. ï»¿Make sure you talk with geser first, he is the last uploader.
<slytherin> what is the easiest way to configure XF86Media keys?
<coolbhavi> slytherin, Ok will contact him
<ScottK> Adri2000 or Lutin: The problem I was having the other day getting to the Main merge page appears to be that the link to it from the Universe page is a relative link.  Konqueror wants it to take me to universe.php/main.php.
<geser> coolbhavi: you can merge libjdic-java if you want as I currently don't have time for it
<coolbhavi> geser, OK
<coolbhavi> thanks
<coolbhavi> geser, will do it in next 2 days thanks
<Adri2000> ScottK: the link points to ./main.php. I think this is a Konqueror bug
<ScottK> OK.  Thanks.
<stefanlsd> How does MoM find out about a merge... can we get it to check for a merge...?
<Adri2000> stefanlsd: afaik, MoM is not updating because the disk of the machine it's hosted on is full
<directhex> hah!
<stefanlsd> Adri2000: heh. funny. will attempt to do what MoM does manually :)
<Adri2000> stefanlsd: or you can try DaD
<stefanlsd> Adri2000: yeah. DaD doesnt have it either
<Adri2000> stefanlsd: what package?
<stefanlsd> Adri2000: curlftpfs
<slayton> mv: cannot move `../dbus-c++_1.0-1.dsc.asc' to `../dbus-c++_1.0-1.dsc': Operation not permitted   I'm trying to run: dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa -rfakeroot -k<GPGkeyID> and I got that error...
<Adri2000> stefanlsd: strange
<slayton> ?
<dholbach> not that it would fix your problems, but  debuild -S -sa  is probably a bit shorter
<dholbach> slayton: do you have the right permissions on the files? do you own them?
<slayton> dholbach,  ughh...  your right... that is the problem... ok sorry for the pedantic questions
<dholbach> don't worry - just ask
<dholbach> we're all happy if we can make the world a better place, even if it's little steps :-)
<slayton> dholbach, thanks again... this really is one of the most helpful and friendly channels i've encountered on IRC...
<Adri2000> stefanlsd: err... it's not strange at all
<Adri2000> stefanlsd: there are no ubuntu changes
 * Adri2000 stops investigating uselessly
<stefanlsd> Adri2000: thanks. that makes sense. Does this normally mean we just request a sync...?
<Adri2000> if you want the debian version, yes, request a sync
<jorgenpt> Hi. :)
<jorgenpt> Anyone have any tips on creating a package for a python script that has a couple of internal 'libraries' that it uses, without using an automated tool like stdeb?
<RainCT> jorgenpt: internal libraries = modules created exclusively for that application?
<jorgenpt> Yes
<jorgenpt> Non-binary
<RainCT> jorgenpt: you can place them into /usr/share/<packagename> then
<jorgenpt> I found something using python-support that said /usr/share/python-support/packagename
<jorgenpt> How does that sound?
<RainCT> jorgenpt: do you know if setup.py has some option for private modules?
 * RainCT would say that the files there are public modules, but I'm not sure
<jorgenpt> RainCT: I dunno, I just used --install-lib=$PREFIX..
<jorgenpt> I uploaded my package to ppa using dput, and it said 'Successfully uploaded packages.\nNot running dinstall.'
<jorgenpt> But nothing shows in my package repository, nor on my build status page.
<jorgenpt> Any tips?
<RainCT> jorgenpt: check your inbox for an accepted/rejected mail?
<jorgenpt> Aha.
<jorgenpt> Unable to find distroseries: unstable
<jorgenpt> Aha
<jorgenpt> How do I release a package to multiple distros?
<jorgenpt> Ah, space-separated.
<jorgenpt> Or not, lintian complains.
<james_w> jorgenpt: it's not actually a usual thing to do
<jorgenpt> Really? Why not?
<james_w> even though the format allows it I've never seen it
<jorgenpt> This is a python package that's fairly multi-release
<broonie> jorgenpt: This used to be used by Debian in the dim and distant past.
<broonie> (when we had a release freeze rather than testing)
<joaopinto> any idea how to set a package to be compressed using lzma with cdbs ?
<broonie> jorgenpt: it fell out of disuse in Debian due to testing (there is no call to upload to multiple targets these days).
<RainCT> jorgenpt: create a different version for each release (..~ppa1~gutsy1, ...~ppa1~hardy1, etc.)
<jorgenpt> I don't mask, so just ~gutsy1, ~hardy1, etc.
<jorgenpt> Do I use different changelogs for that?
<jorgenpt> Also, do I need to bump my version number even for a rejected ppa-upload?
<RainCT> jorgenpt: yes and no
<jorgenpt> RainCT: It told me 'Already uploaded to ppa.launchpad.nte'
<RainCT> jorgenpt: dput -f
<jorgenpt> Thanks
<RainCT> jorgenpt: or delete the .upload file
<jorgenpt> But how do you guys usually maintain different changelogs?
<broonie> jorgenpt: Usually the older distros are handled as though backports of the most recent one.
<jorgenpt> broonie: Yeah, but do you do a sed 's/hardy/gutsy/g' -i changelog, or what? :)
<broonie> jorgenpt: It normally shows up as a new changelog entry with text saying "Backport to X".
<jorgenpt> So you have a 'main' changelog, and one for each distribution, which just has <version> \n Backport to <old distro> \n <sign>
<jorgenpt> ?
<broonie> No, just add the backport entry to the top of the changelog in the backported version.
<jorgenpt> Aha, thanks. Does the main version usually have ~hardy1 or whatever you build it against?
<RainCT> jorgenpt: no
<broonie> I'd not expect so.
<RainCT> jorgenpt: that's not necessary as it's usually in the latest Ubuntu release, and the ~ means 'before' so users will get the version from there when they upgrade to it
<RainCT> btw, if someone looks for me, I'll be away from the 15th to the 25th
<jorgenpt> I uploaded a source package, will this be 'built' into a 'binary package' so users can do aptitude install <package>? (if they add my repo)
<jpds> RainCT: OMG.
<jorgenpt> This is a python script, so I don't get the distinction between source & binary, it has no extensions.
<RainCT> jpds: yeah :P
<broonie> jorgenpt: The binary package is the installable .deb.
<RainCT> jorgenpt: yes
<broonie> with everything in the appropriate places on the filesystem, the maintainer scripts and whatnot
<jorgenpt> dput uploaded the .dsc, the orig.tar.gz, the .diff.gz and the _source.changes.
<jorgenpt> Aha, ok.
<jorgenpt> So when my PPA page says 'built [X]' it means they've built it into a .deb?
<jorgenpt> Hey, PPA has a 'copy binaries' to copy to other series. Neat.
<jorgenpt> Packages: 1 source package (41.6 KiB) 1 binary package (24.6 KiB)
<jorgenpt> \o/
<Hew> Hey guys. I just want to bring attention to bug 248055 again, as it's high-priority and an easy fix. Users are getting more restless..
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 248055 in gtk-gnutella "gtk-gnutella cannot connect to newer network - ancient version detected" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/248055
 * jorgenpt has his first packages in PPA, woopwoop.
<jpds> Hew: Wait for the SRU folk to come along?
<Hew> jpds: Been waiting a month
<Hew> jpds: do you know who accepts the nominations for release?
<jpds> Hew: That team i thought.
<Hew> jpds: Yea, it's been a month, and really just requires a backport by the SRU guys.
<Hew> anyone from motu-sru around?
<joaopinto> Hew, actually a backport maybe complex for an SRU, SRU are usually smaller diffs
<Hew> joaopinto: Do you think I should request a backport as well, since it's important this fix is delivered asap?
<Hew> that may be able to be delivered faster than the SRU
<joaopinto> probably
<Hew> joaopinto: ok, will do
<bigon> any motu-sru around?
<james_w> didrocks: hey, thanks for your work on the multiuser stuff
<didrocks> james_w: you're welcome :)
<james_w> didrocks: one thing that I hadn't mentioned before is that the "multiuser" stuff required a versioned dependency on sysvinit, that can be dropped with these changes.
<didrocks> james_w: oh, so, let me check
<james_w> didrocks: also, you can use http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=494951 and just change the details to forward these bugs. I think that explains everything we should explain to the Debian maintainers.
<ubottu> Debian bug 494951 in smartmontools "smartmontools: Please remove stop links from rc0 and rc6" [Wishlist,Open]
<didrocks> james_w: yes, it will be a good template and it will be easier to fw to upstream with that link :)
<slytherin> RainCT: in case you are here, can you please give back gst-plugins-bad0.10?
<didrocks> so, regarding the dependency, I just have to remove  sysv-rc (>= 2.86.ds1-14.1ubuntu2) for sysv-rc , isn't?
<james_w> didrocks: I'd been asked to write a blog post to ask for people to help with this work, but if you keep storming through it like this you'll save me that job as well :-)
<james_w> didrocks: you should revert to whatever Debian has
<james_w> didrocks: patches.ubuntu.com or packages.debian.org are probably good places to look that up
<RainCT> slytherin: sure, one moment :)
<didrocks> james_w: I think I can do it in the next two days :)
<didrocks> ok, I will give a look
<didrocks> Indeed, it's the mail on server ML that awake me. I had planned to do this some time ago :)
<RainCT> slytherin: done
<RainCT> jpds: the buildd script works nice :)
<slytherin> RainCT: thanks
<didrocks> james_w: I revert also to previous lsb-base version (cf http://patches.ubuntu.com/a/acpid/acpid_1.0.6-9ubuntu2.patch)
<james_w> didrocks: no, that's for the status action in the init script, we still need that one
<didrocks> ok, so, just remove sysv-rc in this case
<james_w> yep, I think so
<didrocks> pbuilder will confirm that ^^
<james_w> well, it's a runtime dependency, so you'd have to install the package
<didrocks> yes, I will do in my intrepid VM
<didrocks> james_w: dictd seems to be cleared (no sysinit specific depends)
<didrocks> so, no change in this debdiff
<didrocks> I will reboot and try to install the new acpid package
<slytherin> when I use requestsync, where is the mail sent exactly?
<ScottK> slytherin: Launchpad via some mail server.
<slytherin> ScottK: and what is usually time for the mail to get converted to bug report?
<ScottK> 5 - 10 minutes.
<slytherin> ok
<nxvl> slytherin: slytherin     to = 'new@bugs.launchpad.net'
<nxvl> err
<nxvl> slytherin:     to = 'new@bugs.launchpad.net'
<nxvl> or it maybe uses lpbugs
<nxvl> so no mail envolved in the process
<ScottK> It can do either.
<slytherin> which mail servers does it use by the way? because I haven't setup any.
<ScottK> Mail is the default.
<ScottK> I don't recall.
<ScottK> Odds are, IIRC, it won't be working then.
<slytherin> a status message like this surely doesn't say that it is not working - Sync request mailed.
<slytherin> I will wait for 15 minutes to see if the bug turns up.
<nellery> why is it that apt-get source buxon retrieves an older version than it should?
<nellery> is there any work around for these things?
<RainCT> nellery: do you have intrepid in your sources.list?
<geser> slytherin: mailserver = 'fiordland.ubuntu.com'
<slytherin> geser: thanks for info
<slytherin> geser: and you were right about the gpg key. I think I should have revoked the email id and photo id instead of deleting it.
<nellery> RainCT, that could be it...
<nellery> RainCT, what would I add?
<RainCT> nellery: deb-src http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ intrepid main restricted universe multiverse
<nellery> RainCT, thanks
<nellery> awesome.. it worked :)
<sebner> RainCT: intrepid \o/
<RainCT> sebner: ??
<sebner> RainCT: intrepid is great ^^
<RainCT> I know
<RainCT> :)
<kostmo> Hey all, I am looking for MOTU advocates for my package "pyrocket": http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=3240
<kostmo> pyrocket is a driver and frontend for several of the USB rocket launchers that you might find on ThinkGeek or other novelty shops
<kostmo> it exposes a few features of the devices that aren't accessible from the Windows drivers, and allows more methods of control, like joystick, and potentially webcam/computer vision control
<Treenaks> \o/ mecha armies
<kostmo> :)
<kostmo> The needs-packaging bug is here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/242910
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 242910 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] pyrocket" [Wishlist,In progress]
<kostmo> anyway, I've got a lot of feedback from package reviewers, and I think it's in good shape -- now I just need a couple advocates
<slytherin> ScottK: geser: Either I did something wrong or there is problem with requestsync. I requested a sync more than 20 minutes ago and it is not on launchpad.
<geser> hmm
<nxvl> geser: my application is up to you, persia and/or nixternal
<nxvl> :D
<devfil_> Can a MOTU take a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=ircp-tray ?
<emgent> nxvl: can i call you Master? :-)
<nxvl> heh
<nxvl> not still
<nxvl> we still have 2 more votes to go
<emgent> ok Master nxvl
<james_w> didrocks: cool, dictd may not have had the dependency added by mistake
<jpds> RainCT: Wahey.
<didrocks> james_w: as the 15 is an off day here, I will try to fix all of them this dayâ¦
<nxvl> emgent: heh
<james_w> didrocks: that would rock
<jorgenpt> How do I build my source package after I've already uploaded one version?
<jorgenpt> debuild ...? (Is there another way that doesn't upload the orig.tar.gz?)
<jorgenpt> Also, how do you separate upstream fixes from your own in the changelog, usually? Do you specify your own like 'fixed foo' and have 'bump from upstream' or whatever for upstream updates?
<cr3> hi folks, I'm creating a transitional package because I'm in the process of renaming hwtest to checkbox. the reason is that the vocation of the project has changed from strictly hardware to include software as well.
<cr3> so, I created empty packages for the old hwtest with Depends: checkbox. then, in the checkbox package, I have Replaces/Provides/Conficts: hwtest.
<cr3> when I upgrade, hwtest gets marked as "rc" and the new checkbox package is installed as "ii". the reason seems to be that other packages depend on hwtest and I think I just put my finger on the problem!
<cr3> how can I determine which package depend on another package?
<mathiaz> cr3: try apt-cache rdepends hwtest
<jpds> cr3: apt-cache rdepends <package>
<cr3> mathiaz: ok, so that returns hwtest-cli and gtk packages which also have the equivalent transitional packages, why aren't those being upgraded?
<cr3> oh wait, this needs to apply recursively as well because ubuntu-desktop depends on hwtest-gtk! that seems to be the problem
<cr3> I wish there was an rrdepends, as in recursive reverse depends :)
<mathiaz> cr3: did you versionned your Conflicts and Replaces ?
<cr3> mathiaz: nope, I should specify the version for the last version of hwtest, ie pre transitional right?
<mathiaz> cr3: yes
<cr3> mathiaz: will that help for the fact ubuntu-desktop depends on hwtest-gtk?
<mathiaz> cr3: it should since you're Providing hwtest-gtk with checkbox
<cr3> mathiaz: right, thanks man!
<RainCT> jorgenpt: debuild -S  (if the version is different than -1 or -0ubuntu1 and you don't use -sa with debuild the .orig.tar.gz won't be included)
<mathiaz> siretart: RainCT: raphink: ajmitch: could you mark me as a reviewer on REVU ? Thanks :)
<RainCT> mathiaz: did you have an account before? if so, you can merge it
<mathiaz> RainCT: I don't think so
<RainCT> mathiaz: woo you're a core dev :)
<RainCT> mathiaz: ok one second
<RainCT> mathiaz: done
<kostmo> cody-somerville: you REVU'd my "pyrocket" package a while back - would you be willing to advocate it also?
<mathiaz> RainCT: great ! thanks
<kostmo> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=3240
<jorgenpt> RainCT: thanks
<didrocks> james_w: I took the test for acpid on my intrepid vm and it was successfull. New debdiff provided. I keep you in touch on friday about the others.
<james_w> great, thanks.
<jorgenpt> How do I make it so dh_installman finds my man-page?
<ion_> Please read dh_installman(1)
<jorgenpt> I tried, and it said it read the first binary package in control.
<jorgenpt> I named my man-page debian/first_package_name.1
<jorgenpt> Hm. Do I need to add 'first_package_name.1' to the parameter-list of dh_installman?
<SolarWar> what does this error mean? dpkg-shlibdeps: failure: no dependency information found for /usr/local/lib/libmtp.so.8 (used by debian/qlix/usr/bin/qlix).
<nxvl> jorgenpt: you need to copy it into debian/tmp before
<ion_> âFiles named debian/package.manpages can list other man pages to be installed.â
<jorgenpt> ion_: 'other', this is the man-page for the first binary package
<nxvl> jorgenpt: look for a package that has it's man page under debian/ and check it's debian/rules
<nxvl> jorgenpt: yes, but it's not on the source dir, so it is other
<jorgenpt> Aha.
<ion_> Other manpages than the ones listed in its command line parameters.
<nxvl> jorgenpt: the package what it does is install everythin on debian/tmp, and then install what it's in debian/tmp on the system (dh_installman work on the second part) so it need to be on debian/tmp/$man_path to be installed
<ion_> The path of the manpages should not matter.
<jorgenpt> Right. dh_install debian/my_first_package.1 seems to do what I want. :)
<jorgenpt> Also, my changes gives me this lintian:
<jorgenpt> bad-distribution-in-changes-file hardy
<Iulian> jorgenpt: Change with intrepid.
<jorgenpt> What? Intrepid isn't released yet, is it?
<jorgenpt> Also, I have a sample rc-file, where should this be installed?
<Iulian> jorgenpt: It's still in development.
<jorgenpt> Right. But you're saying I should use intrepid instead of hardy?
<Iulian> jorgenpt: Yes, you'd like to get that into intrepid, right?
<jorgenpt> Oh, you mean for a 'real' release?
<jorgenpt> Sure, I'm just using PPA for now, was thinking of submitting the package to the official repositories sometime. :)
<Iulian> Ah
<jorgenpt> Is /usr/share/doc/package-name/ a fine place for sample configs?
<jorgenpt> (example rc-file)
<ion_> jorgenpt: dh_installexamples(1)
<jorgenpt> Thanks :)
<doctormo> Remind me, how would I get a package from ppa into some other more useful repository?
<laga> thru REVU? if it's a new package
<jorgenpt> Bit unrelated, about man-pages. How do you usally document your config options? (Currently there're three of them)
<Iulian> !revu | doctormo
<ubottu> doctormo: REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<doctormo> Ah thanks
<jorgenpt> Ooh, that looks like what I want when this is in -3 or something. ;)
<RainCT> jorgenpt: it isn't necessary to install the manpage, just tell dh_installman where it is or create a file called debian/manpages (or debian/binary_package_name.manpages) and write it's name (debian/binary_package_name.1) there
<RainCT> jorgenpt: what do you mean by "config options"?
<jorgenpt> RainCT: stuff the user can put in ~/.foorc
 * jorgenpt is packaging someone elses software, but without a man-page
<ion_> jorgenpt: -3 wouldnât be accepted as a new package in Ubuntu. -1 would be accepted as a new package Debian and -0ubuntu1 in Ubuntu.
<jorgenpt> ion_: Well, in my ppa it's -3.
<RainCT> jorgenpt: create a manpage called foorc.5 for it, then
<ion_> jorgenpt: Better use version numbers in PPA that are lower than the first upload to Ubuntu.
<RainCT> jorgenpt: and list it in binary_package_name.1's "SEE ALSO" section
<ion_> For the same upstream release
<doctormo> Is it worth going to REVU  for https://launchpad.net/gnome-wallchanger , or should I just wait and see if it's taken up by more people first?
<jorgenpt> Hmm. But I've already uploaded -1~hardy1, ion_. :o
<RainCT> jorgenpt: -1~hardy1 is less than -1
<jorgenpt> Can I just delete it via the ppa and change the changelog?
<jorgenpt> Yeah, but ion said -0ubuntu1 for ubuntu?
<RainCT> jorgenpt: ah right. bad luck for the PPA users then :P
<jorgenpt> Doubt anyone except me and one other guy has installed the package. :)
<jorgenpt> (one other guy being the developer)
<jorgenpt> First release a few hours ago
<RainCT> jorgenpt: you can delete it from the PPA then
<jorgenpt> Read the page help to understand how removals work.
<jorgenpt> What page help? :(
<RainCT> jorgenpt: it doesn't say anything interesting anyway :)
<RainCT> jorgenpt: just that the actual files may remain on the server for some hours
<cr3> before submitting a main inclusion report, I need to get the package into universe, right? what if the package is just a rename of an existing package?
<jorgenpt> ok
<jorgenpt> Haha, I misunderstood dh_installman, I thought it meant debian/package.manpages _literally_ :p
<cr3> hm, what's the universe equivalent to the main inclusion report?
<geser> cr3: nothing
<cr3> geser: how would I go about submitting a new package into universe so that it eventually makes its way to main?
<calc> cr3: ideally upload it to debian
<mathiaz> cr3: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<geser> cr3: I've read it's a rename, does only the binary names change or also the source name?
<cr3> geser: both
<jorgenpt> Do you guys like version-control your debian meta-information anywhere when you package someone elses software?
<geser> cr3: then I guess you need to go through REVU
<cr3> geser: so I have a transitional package for the old source and a new package
 * calc had almost forgotten debian is around freeze currently, so uploading to it probably is not a good idea at the moment, heh
<mathiaz> cr3: is it just a package rename ? or has the code been updated ?
<jorgenpt> ion_: :(
<jorgenpt> dpkg-source: warning: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but Maintainer: does not have Ubuntu address
<mathiaz> cr3: IIUC you've just renamed hwtest to checkbox
<cr3> mathiaz: the code has been updated to reflect the new name, that's about it
<mathiaz> cr3: well - it's not a brand new package then
 * jorgenpt makes it -1~ppa
<mathiaz> cr3: I'd upload your packages somewhere (like a ppa or p.u.c) and ask a MOTU for sponsoring
<cr3> mathiaz: it's already in the following ppa, want to be my sponsor? https://edge.launchpad.net/~hardware-testing/+archive
<mathiaz> cr3: I'll have a look at it :)
<cr3> mathiaz: sure, would you like an email as a reminder in your inbox?
<cr3> mathiaz: you caught me at the right time, I was reporting a bug for the new package process already :)
<mathiaz> cr3: better file a bug in LP and subscribe me
<cr3> mathiaz: will do
<mathiaz> cr3: so that the review can done in LP rather than by email
<jorgenpt> How should you structure files that you add to a third-party package, like foo.desktop? Should it be in debian or in the package root?
<joaopinto> it should be on debian/* since you are not expected to change anything outside it :P
<jorgenpt> Oh, ok
<jpds> Does anyone have a package with FTBFS in the archives? I would like to test my rebuild script.
<RainCT> jpds: boson
<jorgenpt> Doesn't ubuntu use .desktop-files to generate the app menu?
<RainCT> jorgenpt: yes
<RainCT> jorgenpt: (and they have to be installed into /usr/share/applications)
<jorgenpt> Hm. It is.
<jorgenpt> But what are the .menu-files?
<jorgenpt> I.e. /usr/share/menu
<jpds> RainCT: ARGG; rock on! http://paste.ubuntu.com/37250/
<RainCT> jorgenpt: (you can check it running desktop-file-validate against it)
<RainCT> jorgenpt: for Debian's menu
<jorgenpt> So I should include both?
<jorgenpt> Where can I find syntax for .menu?
<jorgenpt> Thanks, seems there was a problem with it. Any way to get gnome-panel to reload without killing it? Does it respond well to e.g. HUP?
<jorgenpt> Hm, it seems to autoreload. Neat.
<jpds> RainCT: "Pushed up to revision 161."
<jpds> RainCT: This is so much fun! :D
<jorgenpt> So when do you need to upload .orig's?
<jorgenpt> Seemingly, when you delete your package from PPA, and when you upload a package for the first time.
<jorgenpt> When else?
<jorgenpt> Version-bump from upstream?
<RoAkSoAx> jorgenpt: yes
<jorgenpt> I have both foo-1.2.tar.gz and foo_1.2.orig.tar.gz
<jorgenpt> Can I delete the foo-1.2.tar.gz?
<jorgenpt> Also, my foo_1.2.orig.tar.gz unpacks to foo/ and not foo-1.2/, so I have to rename it. But I think this perhaps makes the diff contain the whole foo/?
<jorgenpt> whole foo/
<jorgenpt> whole foo-1.2, even
<RoAkSoAx> jorgenpt: updating a packege?
<RoAkSoAx> pagkage*
<RoAkSoAx> package*
<jorgenpt> No, writing my own from scratc
<jorgenpt> scratch
<RoAkSoAx> jorgenpt: take a look at: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/openweekhardy/PackagingA
<jorgenpt> Hm, okay. Can't see anything specific about my question.
<jorgenpt> Should I repack it?
<jorgenpt> like tar zxf foo-1.2.tar.gz; mv foo foo-1.2; tar czf foo_1.2.orig.tar.gz foo-1.2
<RainCT> jorgenpt: yep
<jorgenpt> Thanks
<Laney> DktrKranz: ping, did you ever manage to take a look at my package?
<jpds> Any Python people know what's wrong with this? http://paste.ubuntu.com/37257/
<jpds> It was working a few moments ago....
<james_w> jpds: you're missing a colon at the end of the "if" line
<james_w> or rather the continued if line
<jpds> james_w: Arg, bugger, thanks.
<tgm4883_laptop> If you're happy and you know it REVU Mythstream-parser-youtube http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube
<DktrKranz> Laney, on my TODO list, but not done yet, sorry :(
<Laney> DktrKranz: No worries, just hope to get it in before FF
<DktrKranz> gah, libtool strikes again :/
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-14
<_2> can someone point me at my problem here   http://ubuntu.pastebin.us/?show=d308f1395  ?
<tbielawa> hello everybody
<RAOF> _2: I'm not sure what you're actually asking.  What are you trying to do?
<_2> RAOF just get the package manager un hung
<_2> RAOF can't install xorg  because of that dependancy
<RAOF> _2: Oh, right.  Well, that's probably a question for #ubuntu (or a question on launchpad.net, or a bug), not here.  How did the libgl1-mesa package get installed?  Also, is your root partition writeable?
<_2> RAOF heh in #ubuntu i was sent here  :)
<RAOF> _2: #ubuntu was wrong, this is a development channel :)
<nxvl> RAOF: maybe it's a bug
<nxvl> let me chech
<nxvl> check
<RAOF> nxvl: Yeah, possibly.
<nxvl> wow
<nxvl> dapper
<RAOF> Indeed.  Oldschool.
<RAOF> If it's a bug, it's an infrequently triggered one :)
<nxvl> _2: can you please include your sources.list?
<_2> sure what it here ?  only three lines
<nxvl> nop
<nxvl> on pastebin please
<_2> well more than three anyway    http://ubuntu.pastebin.us/?show=d3a3294ee
<_2> i had forgotten adding src
<neurobuntu> condor? Look at my pm
<_2> oh crap  that shell is not chrooted in that system.   this is the sources list for that system   http://ubuntu.pastebin.us/?show=d28980f52
<_2> sorry nxvl my bad.
 * Hobbsee waves
<_2> Hobbsee :)
<RAOF> Yo!  Hobbsee!
 * Hobbsee apparently has a USB stick of doom.
<_2> you too ?
<_2> nxvl apt-cache policy on that package  http://ubuntu.pastebin.us/?show=d34abe004  if you want it too
<Hobbsee> yeah.  it keeps shutting down the machine whenever i plug it in, anywhere in the lab.
<Hobbsee> i'm not sure why.
<_2> oh my.   mines not that bad...  ;/
<nxvl> _2: i'm creating a dapper chroot to check :D
<Hobbsee> which is odd, as it doesn't shut down the machines in the first year labs.   yet it does the third.
<Hobbsee> go figure...
<_2> nxvl k.
<foxbuntu> I would appreciate it if someone could take a look at my package for revu: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythbuntu-log-grabber
<Hobbsee> HAH!
<tbielawa> !
<Hobbsee> the problem is SP3 of XP.
<tbielawa> is it wrong of me to have to: touch config.status; $(MAKE) clean; rm -f config.status;
<tbielawa> to have a dependable` fakeroot debian/rules clean` system?
<RAOF> Doesn't autotools-dev recommend that you copy their config.* on clean?
<tbielawa> RAOF: I've never heard of that before.
<tbielawa> RAOF: my rules file does do checking for config.sub and config.guess files.
<tbielawa> When lintian checking in the past I've gotten errors about there being a config.{status,cache} file in my source. So I've had to delete it... then trying to make clean freaks out because there is no config.status file
<tbielawa> Is there a proper procedure for this that you can point me at?
<RAOF> I think, by default, dh-make will produce something which copies the config.{sub,guess} from the autotools-dev package.
<RAOF> But I'm not aware of a canonical source for this info.
<tbielawa> RAOF: You are correct
<RAOF> Just do that :)
<tbielawa> RAOF: test ! -f config.status && touch config.status
<tbielawa> :)
<_2> ummm touch is safe without testing.  it only sets the timestamp
<nxvl> _2: i don't have any problems here, so it's not a bug
<tbielawa> _2: I've had good results so far. THe upstream makefile seems to just hate makeing clean without config.status existing
<_2> i mean it wont blank an existing file
<_2> nxvl hmmm ok.   thanks.   that means something other than that package is borked causing it...     ;/
<_2> nxvl i do apreicate that.   although it means more work for me... ;/       so thank you.
<nxvl> _2: try to reinstall the package which ships that library
<_2> nxvl that is the package.
<nxvl> _2: than why is it already in your system?
<nxvl> then*
<nxvl> (i'm talking about libGL.so.1.2)
<_2> and yes i know.        i copied the files out of the archive testing to see if there was a problem with the package in that respect.
<_2> the files copy ok  but the package when installing blanks one of them. and errors out.
<_2> http://ubuntu.pastebin.us/?show=d308f1395
<_2> see that pastebin was after i had already "given up" on being able to find it myself.    and yes i tried removinf the files contained in the package from the system and installing,  same results.
<_2> but if it installs cleanly for you.  then it's something on my system. and not the package.    which makes me pull hair and screem...   0.o
<_2> i.e. i can copy /usr out of the package just fine.   but dpkg can't
<tbielawa> :(
<NCommander> I've got a question
<NCommander> Upstream for a package is adding a linking exception to allow adeone and openssl to be linked
<NCommander> Is it sufficient to just having this in the COPYING/LICENSE file, or does something more need to be done?
<james_w> debian/copyright as well at the least I would say
<NCommander> Yeah
<NCommander> Upstream doesn't get the problem linking with OpenSSL -_-;
<RAOF> If they've got copyright headers on each file, I think they may want to add the exception to each header.
<NCommander> I've never seen linking exceptions in the headers
<RAOF> I certainly have, but I'm not sure whether they're necessary.
<RAOF> Yay licensing!
<NCommander> *rolls eyes*
<RAOF> debian-legal has _surely_ had to answer this at some point; maybe search the archives?
<NCommander> They just said add a linking exception
<NCommander> I can't find anything stating if it has to go in the headers
<NCommander> (and I've seen headers that just say "Licensed under the GPL", which flew with arch admins)
<RAOF> Wow.
<_2> nxvl are you done with me ?     or am i waiting on something,   cause i'll go if i'm just taking up space here...
<nxvl> sorry i get distracted
<_2> not a problem.   i just don't want to become a nusense in here.
<_2> and i type a lot...
<NCommander> persia, ping?
<nxvl> _2: sorry, i can't find where the problem is
<_2> nxvl ok.    again.  my "thank you!"    and i hate that i have spent both yours and my time in vain here.     peace man.
<_2> i'll work it out somehow. ...
<nxvl> _2: it's never a waste of time
<nxvl> :D
<StevenK> Argh, he was IRCing as root?
<tbielawa> !
<foxbuntu> Cartman: "I've got a a golden ticket..."
<ScottK> NCommander: As long as it's in the upstream license file, I think it's fine (per file would be better).  I've seen packages accepted that had no per file copyright statements at all as long as the verbatim copy of the license was in the tarball.
<tbielawa> 4 hugs to anyone who will give me a revu (and hopefully ACK) of lucidlife: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=3308
<foxxtrot> I have a package that I'm working on that contains a single perl script, but mostly C code compiled binary.  Should I have an 'indep' section in my control file for the Perl script?
<RAOF> Are you building an arch: all package as well as the arch: any from this source?
<foxxtrot> Wasn't planning on it.  The perl script probably wouldn't be that useful on it's own
<ScottK> How big is it?
<foxxtrot> 1.2k
<ScottK> I think I wouldn't bother.
<foxxtrot> Great.  Didn't seem worth while at this time
<ScottK> The only point in splitting it out would be to save archive space and if it's that small, I don't know that you'd actually save any.
<ScottK> Right, but we do lots of stuff that doesn't seem worth the trouble.
<foxxtrot> Which is why I asked
<foxxtrot> I'd rather do the right thing now than be asked to fix it later
<xgfhsdgfhsd> so I am trying to upload a translated .PO I made for xulrunner but there's no upload option; what do I do?
<xgfhsdgfhsd> (in Launchpad)
<tgm4883_laptop> Are you a MOTU that has no time to REVU http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-google ?  Take some Ambien and REVU it while you sleep ;)
<nxvl> tgm4883_laptop: commented
<tgm4883_laptop> thanks nxvl
<tgm4883_laptop> Fixed, thanks again nxvl
<dholbach> good morning
<tgm4883_laptop> good evening dholbach
<dholbach> hi tgm4883_laptop
<tgm4883_laptop> how are you?
<dholbach> good, just waking up - how are you?
<tgm4883_laptop> pretty good.  Tired (2138 here).  Have a bunch of packages i'm trying to get REVUed
<tgm4883_laptop> so if you are ever bored, let me know
<dholbach> tgm4883_laptop: I'm still a bit in catching up mode after nearly 3 weeks of holidays, so I'm likely not to be bored
<dholbach> tgm4883_laptop: which of the packages in the best shape you think?
<tgm4883_laptop> best shape?
<tgm4883_laptop> sec
<dholbach> give me the URL and I might check it out later
<tgm4883_laptop> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube
<tgm4883_laptop> this one is best shape
<tgm4883_laptop> all are pretty similar, but this one has been revued the most and has 1 ack
<dholbach> alrighty
<tgm4883_laptop> thanks
<tgm4883_laptop> I'm trying to come up with alternative ways of asking for a REVU
<nxvl> dholbach: good morning! you are early today!
<dholbach> hiya nxvl
<dholbach> nxvl: Mimi had to get up earlier today, so I decided to get up as well
<nxvl> oh ok
<nxvl> dholbach: btw, have already uploaded the pictures of india?
<dholbach> no, f-spot and friends have all been letting me down for flickr
<dholbach> so I uploaded just a few to picasa to try picasa out
<dholbach> but it sucks somewhat
<nxvl> yes it does
<dholbach> and I really want a tool that scales images for me, uploads them, etc
<nxvl> dholbach: have you tried with igal?
<dholbach> ah, no I didn't
<nxvl> igal scales all the images in a folder (with some options) and creates a plain html gallery
<nxvl> you can always drop the html
<dholbach> I'd need to select images before I do that
<dholbach> I did like 1100 pictures in India
<nxvl> igal can handle it
<nxvl> :D
<dholbach> maybe I don't want to upload them all ;-)
<nxvl> and IIRC it's python
 * dholbach hugs nxvl
<nxvl> heh
 * nxvl HUGS dholbach back
 * dholbach is a tricky customer today
<nxvl> ah no igal is perl
 * nxvl remembers his perl coder days
<nxvl> it's good that the nightmares are finished
<nxvl> :P
<StevenK> What's wrong with coding in Perl?
<nxvl> StevenK: the problem is not coding, is the code!
<StevenK> nxvl: Oh?
<nxvl> StevenK: try to remember 2 months later what the hell did you do on a script
<StevenK> nxvl: Meh. If I wrote the script, that usually isn't a problem.
 * StevenK tries to find some Perl he wrote
<nxvl> StevenK: actually it is some times
<StevenK> $self->{IP_MAPPING}{$self->{ID_MAPPING}{$_}} = [$name, $_];
<StevenK> See! Perfectly understandable.
 * nxvl runs
<nxvl> screeming!
<nxvl> dholbach: oh, btw, your fanclub is growing
<nxvl> dholbach: we have 9 members
<StevenK> ~we-love-dholbach ?
<nxvl> ~dholbach-huggers
<nxvl> https://edge.launchpad.net/~dholbach-huggers
<dholbach> yooohooo! :)
<nxvl> dholbach: can you please confirm if the versioning thing is right
<nxvl> dholbach: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-google
<nxvl> dholbach: i find it odd
<dholbach> nxvl: best to ask the archive admin
<superm1> nxvl, i believe sistpoty recommended that type of versioning
<superm1> nxvl, to point out the changed orig.tar.gz
<nxvl> superm1: yep, it's on the response, but i still find it odd
<nxvl> superm1: in that case why do we have the extra -0ubuntu1
<superm1> because the debian directory is'nt in the changed orig.tar.gz
<superm1> but yeah nxvl i agree it does seem a bit out of place
<nxvl> yeah
<nxvl> since it's 1ubuntu1-0ubuntu1
<nxvl> on the second part of it i see that it's not in debian but it is on ubuntu
<nxvl> but how did you read the first one?
<nxvl> it is in debian and it the 1st ubuntu revision?
<tuxmaniac> heya gang
<nxvl> dholbach: oh, btw some guy ping me some days ago, he posted the spanish video on his blog -> http://www.blogubuntu.com/379/video-como-ser-un-motu-de-ubuntu/
<nxvl> heh, my CPU is at 99% building in experimental and sid
<nxvl> :D
<nxvl> i love making my CPU work
<foxxtrot> What is a "watch file" in relation to packaging?
<RAOF> A file which describes how to get the upstream source and work out its version.
<nxvl> it helps you when you need to update your package (as in package the new upstream version) and knowing when you have to update it
<foxxtrot> I'm having trouble finding documentation which describes what this should look like
<RAOF> "man uscan" describes the format.
<nxvl> take a look at one package that ships with a watch file
<dholbach> nxvl: NICE :)
<nxvl> foxxtrot: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Recipes/DebianWatch
<nxvl> dholbach: we have almost 3K of pontential spanish contributor that saw the video
<dholbach> nxvl: I hope they'll all show up here! :)
<nxvl> me too
<dholbach> so we need 1) more videos and 2) more spanish videos, right? :)
<tuxmaniac> foxxtrot: http://cypherm0x.blogspot.com/2008/08/more-packaging-fun.html this might help too
<dholbach> please add videos (and suggestions too) to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Videos
<foxxtrot> nxvl, RAOF: thanks
<nxvl> and 3) TIME!
<foxxtrot> tuxmaniac: I'll bookmark that
<nxvl> time to sleep
<nxvl> have a nice day
<dholbach> sleep tight nxvl!
<nxvl> or sleep tight, or whatever applies to your timezone
<nxvl> :D
<nxvl> dholbach: thank you, have a nice day!
<dholbach> gracias...
<huats> morning
<tuxmaniac> dholbach: thanks a lot for the acks
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: np
<Iulian> Good morning.
<Devendra> good morning
<Flannel> What are "hardy", "hardy-updates", hardy-security, hardy-backports, and hardy-proposed called? not components (those are main, universe, etc, yes?)
<directhex> technically a distribution, afaik
<csrealized7> hi all
<Iulian> I'm not sure if they have a name.
<Iulian> Hello csrealized7.
<csrealized7> hi lulian
<csrealized7> i have gone thru the packaging guide for motu beginners
<csrealized7> and have achieved packaging for the software on my machine
<Iulian> That's great.
<csrealized7> I want to know how should i package the new software on launchpad bug list
<csrealized7> ?
<csrealized7> i have an acount with launch pad
<csrealized7> I want to have a start for contributing in ubuntu
<Iulian> csrealized7: Look for needs-packaging bugs - https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=needs-packaging
<Iulian> csrealized7: Those are programs requested by users to be packaged.
<csrealized7> thnks lulian...
<Iulian> csrealized7: You might want to have a look at https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=bitesize too. Those bugs must be easy to fix. If you encounter any issues, don't hesitate to ask here.
<joaopinto> good morning
<Iulian> Morning
<csrealized7> lulian : thanks a lot...
<Iulian> No problem.
<csrealized7> I have gone thru the documentation and will try my best..to package some software
<Iulian> csrealized7: Ok, it is your choice.
<joaopinto> csrealized7, I am  not sure packaging software is the best activity at this time, judging from the lack of activity on REVU
<csrealized7> actually, i want to have a hands on packaging ........
<joaopinto> and also if I am not mistaken the UVF is getting close
<RAOF> This time next week, I believe.
<csrealized7> so that i can fix the bugs for the packages
<joaopinto> csrealized7, sure, but I would not expect to get those packages still available on Intrepid :P
<joaopinto> fixing bugs and creating packages are different activities, to fix a bug you usually only need to provide the diff for the bug, you don't need to understand how to create  a package (except maybe for the build command)
<RAOF> Fixing bugs you'll learn most of the things you need to create a package from scratch, just not all at once.
<joaopinto> RAOF, I do not agree, you are not expect to understand what is a debian/copyright or a debian/rules or even debian/control for fixing a bug...
<RAOF> joaopinto: You should certainly start developing a working knowledge of some of them.
<directhex> joaopinto, you're not fixing the right bugs then!
<directhex> and debian/rules and debian/control are hotbeds for bugs
<RAOF> joaopinto: NOt debian/copyright, perhaps, but you'll need to be touching the other files!
<joaopinto> directhex, those are packaging related bugs, not application bugs :)
<csrealized7> thnks guys....i have learnt the packaging.....and i could understand most of it debian/...so would be very happy to have a hands on fixing bugs :)...
<directhex> joaopinto, and equally valuable to the project
<joaopinto> directhex, that was not the subject, he was mentioning that he wanted to learn package, and at the same time fix application bugs :P
<directhex> joaopinto, look at it this way, if he fixes an application bug, he needs to know about debian/patches and possibly hack debian/rules too
<joaopinto> directhex, assuming he will use debian/patches :P
<directhex> joaopinto, if not, it's slappin' time!
<slytherin> csrealized7: Reading the documentation is not exactly ... learning the packaging. There is lot more under the hood. :-)
<csrealized7> i believe it....
<csrealized7> so i tried to some practical also...but i trully believe commiting to ubuntu would tell me much more....
<csrealized7> just a small question....
<csrealized7> what is triaged status ????
<RAOF> Ready to go.
<RAOF> As in: all the needed information is there, the priority is set correctly, and all that remains is for a dev to swoop in and fix whatever the well-identified problem is.
<csrealized7> cool
<Iulian> csrealized7: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Status
<Iulian> csrealized7: And see /Importance too if you're interested.
<csrealized7> k
<RAOF> Well, that's convenient.  gnome-main-menu is libslab's only rdepend.
<RAOF> Can there be anything more fun than updating debian/copyright?
<\sh> RAOF: yes...changing licensing and then updating debian/copyright
<directhex> \sh, even better, DFSGing a package by deleting things. then updating debian/copyright to mention it
<RAOF> Translations should be mentioned in copyright, shouldn't they.  WOOOOOOOOO!
<slytherin> Does anyone have any idea if elisa 0.5.x is going to land in intrepid?
<RAOF> It'd probably be kinda cool, but elisa's in main, right?
<slytherin> RAOF: yes. Let me see if there is already a bug for update
<RAOF> Asking in #ubuntu-devel would be a better bet; but when is 0.5 out?
<slytherin> RAOF: It has been out for a while. Current version is 0.5.5
<RAOF> Oh.  Go package it up, then~!
<RAOF> :)
<slytherin> RAOF: Nah, no python expertise here.
<RAOF> Python's _easy_.  GO!
<directhex> ehm... why is elisa in main?
<RAOF> I have _no_ idea.
<RAOF> Because we want to support it with security fixes for 3 years?
 * wgrant likes it when insecure things enter main.
<directhex> i propose moving it to restricted, since it's utterly broken with Free 3d drivers ;)
<RAOF> directhex: Not so!  Nouveau runs it!
 * NCommander lurks in
<RainCT> morning
<NCommander> I'm bootstrapping kfreebsd-i386 for lenny
<NCommander> ....
<RAOF> Perhaps with an unusually generous definition of "run", however :)
<directhex> RAOF, okay. runs it without showing white rectangles or red dots instead of labels
<wgrant> Intel cards are too bad?
<RAOF> directhex: It does pass that definition of 'run', yes.
<RAOF> It might accidentally segfault in mesa when playing stuff, but the _interface_ certainly works :)
<jpds> morning RainCT, you have new commits \o/
<RainCT> jpds: don't flood my inbox too much while I'm away ;P
<directhex> RAOF, better than ati, intel, or via then!
<directhex> wgrant, intel cards are fine. elisa is not
<RAOF> directhex: Really?  Score one for gallium, then!
<jpds> RainCT: Why, I would never do such a thing!
<directhex> RAOF, cell-based driver? O_o
<k0p> hi all.
<k0p> why my package is yet in the queue? https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text= :(
<k0p> I'm concern with it.
<k0p> RainCT, do you know something about that?
<Hobbsee> k0p: because every package that is new to ubuntu goes in there?
<k0p> Hobbsee, yes. But is it a queue?
<Hobbsee> yes
<k0p> Yesterday I have 48 packages in the queue. Today I see 23.
<k0p> what's priority of this queue? do you know?
<Hobbsee> some of them come from different places, so get thru quicker.
<Hobbsee> ie, new stuff to ubuntu, from debian, is quicker, so might get done faster.
<Hobbsee> main stuff tends to get done faster, too
<k0p> Hobbsee, sure :)
<k0p> I don't know about this priority.
<k0p> Hobbsee, is it added manually?
<Hobbsee> define "it"?
<k0p> packages
<k0p> I only have a sources on the archive.
<k0p> soren, is the pacakges added manually to archive?
<k0p> s/soren/so
<Hobbsee> once the sources get built into binaries, they go into another queue, then get added
<k0p> Hobbsee, https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+builds?build_text=umit&build_state=all
<k0p> I think it is already built
<k0p> so now it's on the queue :)
<Hobbsee> probably :)
<jpds> http://tinyurl.com/5dan4f \o/
<RAOF> directhex: Cell-based driver?  Gallium isn't cell-specific, although there is a cell driver, I believe.
<RAOF> directhex: Gallium is the swanky new GPU abstraction layer in mesa; driven, as always, by Intel.
<directhex> can't they finish their hardware video decoding lib first? O_o
<RAOF> directhex: It's the same thing.
<RAOF> The deal is: you write the gallium driver, which is meant to map fairly cleanly to modern GPUs, and then there are a bunch of "state trackers" on top of it; OpenGL is one, there's a xvmc tracker being done as a part of GSoC, etc.
<RAOF> Intel have a DirectX state tracker, although I don't think it's open-source.
<directhex> hm, the description of gallium looks all 3d related. i'm unconvinced that it's related to vaapi
<RAOF> Possibly they have special video acceleration hardware, although the trend seems to be against such hardware.
<RAOF> directhex: But the problem with vaapi is that not only do you have to write the library, and implement it in the drivers, but you also need applications to _use_ it.
<directhex> well, yes
<RAOF> Although that's probably more likely than using xvmc, since it actually accelerates something people care about..
<directhex> if you build it, they will come
<directhex> anyway, i'd rather see a mature vaapi used by multiple vendors than rubbish like VeMP
<RAOF> directhex: They build xvmc.  Who came? :)
<directhex> RAOF, epia users, snice they still don't have enough mhz to play SD MPEG2 convincingly?
<directhex> really, that's the XvMC problem. it helps with mpeg2. whoop. a $50 cpu can eat HD mpeg2 for breakfast
<jorgenpt> vaapi? What's that?
<RAOF> You mean lpia?  Ok.  But no player that I use supports xvmc :)
<directhex> RAOF, mythtv! also things like mplayer
<directhex> jorgenpt, xvmc, but for all the "current gen" codecs instead of just mpeg2
<RAOF> Right.  No player I use :)
<jorgenpt> It relies on hwacc with a sw fallback?
<jorgenpt> Or is it a spec for a type of hwacc?
<directhex> RAOF, vaapi should be more embeddable into other things. gstreamer sinks, that'd be nice
<directhex> jorgenpt, i don't think it'll have software fallback, but it should allow any card with vaapi drivers (and appropriate back-end hardware) to accelerate playback in a way they aren't currently
<jorgenpt> Ah, okay. Anything support it yet?
<RAOF> No.
<jorgenpt> is it aimed at motherboards or at gpus?
<RAOF> GPUs.
<RAOF> Because motherboards generally don't have video decoding hardware on them ;)
<jorgenpt> The problem with hw accelleration is that "no-one" ever supports it. :|
<jorgenpt> My VIA Epia has, I think? (mpeg2)
<RAOF> Not totally true; Xv is well supported.
<RAOF> jorgenpt: But that's going to be on the GPU, the integrated video.
<directhex> xv takes care of one or two of the major steps in decoding video. colorspace conversion and scaling, iirc
<RAOF> Right?
<directhex> RAOF, right.
<RAOF> directhex: Correct, yes.
<jorgenpt> I mean, you need to first define a good API/library that people can use to get backend-ignorant decoding of formats, and then you need to find all the types of hardware that supports hw acc and use it to decode, and then you need to get hw producers to add hw acc, _and_ release specs so you can port your lib to support it.
<jorgenpt> Like, it's going to use the actual GPU to do the decoding, not specialized hardware?
<jorgenpt> (using shaders or whatnot)
<RAOF> jorgenpt: With the nice caveat that modern graphics cards _don't_ generally have hardware to accelerate specific codecs.  They have stomping great parallel cores.
<RAOF> Using shaders can be done already, at least experimentally, in GStreamer.  I believe there's a shader-implemented dirac decoder.
<directhex> realtime dirac playback?
<RAOF> Yeah.
<jorgenpt> You'd need to implement the "big" codecs like xvid and h264, though. Those that're used for high-res video and people can have problems decoding.
<jorgenpt> and that's _gotta_ be a lot of work to do efficiently.
<RAOF> I'm pretty sure a reasonably powerful CPU can decode 720p dirac at the moment, with the schrodinger elements.
<directhex> once again, we're gonna have cpus comfortably decoding these things before we get the drivers to do it in hardware
<RAOF> Not that I've tried it, myself.
<directhex> ffmpeg's frame-level parallelism should help enormously with h264
<jorgenpt> But what's vaapi about? Using GPUs with shading language?
<jorgenpt> Or using the display drivers to decode?
<directhex> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_Acceleration_API
<RAOF> jorgenpt: No.  It's basically extending xvmc to handle modern codecs.  How drivers implement it is up to them.
<jorgenpt> directhex: Is that already in place? (Frame-level parallelism?)
<directhex> jorgenpt, in trunk, in unfinished form, yes
<jorgenpt> Can't wait, that'll be pretty neat.
<RAOF> Man, it'd be awesome if the ffmpeg devs considered ffmpeg a library.
<jorgenpt> What do they consider it?
<jorgenpt> My media center has 2 cores on ubuntu, so frame-level parallelism would rock. :)
<RAOF> I'm not entirely sure.  :)
<directhex> RAOF, never heard of libavcodec?
<directhex> (and libavformat)
<RAOF> directhex: Care to point me to a release? :P
<directhex> apt-cache policy libavcodec1d?
<RAOF> So, not so much a release as Debian finally saying "no, all ffmpeg apps can _not_ have their own private copy of ffmpeg.  Link against this svn snapshot we've taken"
<jorgenpt> ffmpeg apps usually link statically against the ffmpeg source 'library'?
<directhex> erm, yeah. generally they still have their own private copy
<RAOF> jorgenpt: Right.  Because there's no guarantee that the next svn revision doesn't break your app.
<directhex> partly because the symbols change weekly
<directhex> perhaps daily
<jorgenpt> haha :p
<RAOF> Indeed.  They don't treat it like a _library_.
<jorgenpt> That's a strange dev model. Isn't ffmpeg a few years old?
<RAOF> If they thought of it as a library, they'd make it possible for other apps to use it.
<directhex> ffmpeg is a melting pot for development. making it useful for real use is other peoples' problems
<RAOF> jorgenpt: If you ask the ffmpeg devs, releases are an unnecessary waste of time, and are boring.  Plus, static linking is, like, 0.001% faster.  Also, a stable API would mean we'd need to design ahead of time.
<bhavi_> How to write a detailed changelog? its confusing me
<RAOF> Also, a stable API would mean we couldn't have different APIs for different codecs, and that would reduce efficiency! </rant>
<jorgenpt> So they mostly run gentoo?
<jorgenpt> ;)
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<RAOF> sistpoty|work: Howdie.
<bhavi_> hello sistpoty|work
<jorgenpt> API _additions_ aren't that much of a problem, are they, RAOF? And they could still maintain different APIs for different codecs? ;)
<sistpoty|work> hi RAOF and bhavi_
<bhavi_> sistpoty|work, Can you please guide me in writing a changelog?
<sistpoty|work> bhavi_: dch -i, write all stuff you changed there. enjoy :)
<sistpoty|work> or was that too short? *g*
<bhavi_> sistpoty|work, yes but most bugs are marked incomplete coz of the same reason
<sistpoty|work> hm?
<directhex> jorgenpt, they're always changign though. the ffmpeg command line is hell since it needs modifying for every new svn snapshot
<jorgenpt> Strange people. :p
<mok0> ScottK?
<jpds> mok0: You'll have to wait a while - he just left.
<mok0> Ah, thx
<slytherin> is there any shortcut available on wiki.ubuntu.com to specify a bug, something like bug #xxxxxx
<Kopfgeldjaeger> My first (new) package has no FTBFS \o/
<superm1> sistpoty|work, did you talk to nxvl and tgm4833 about that version naming scheme on that mythstream youtube package?
<superm1> sistpoty|work, pitti put some feedback in and doesn't like two ubuntu1's in the version
<sistpoty|work> superm1: nope
<bddebian> Heya gang
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<sistpoty|work> superm1: oh that, yes
<bddebian> Hi sistpoty|work
<superm1> sistpoty|work, i think you were the first one that recommended that name
<sebner> hiohoi sistpoty|work :)
<sistpoty|work> hi sebner
<sistpoty|work> superm1: well, I recommended to change the name of the upstream tarball, giving that as an example.
<superm1> sistpoty|work, ah
<sistpoty|work> superm1: pitti shouldn't be too picky about that :P
<superm1> well i gave a positive revu on it (everything else looked good, and it seemed that you came to an agreement on the versioning), but nxvl wasn't happy so he asked pitti
<huats> raphink: hey
<huats> are you around ?
<raphink> huats: yes I am
<raphink> what's up?
<asac> hi. do i need to be subscribe to motu-council list in order to send there?
<asac> sistpoty|work: ?
<soren> asac: Strictly speaking, yes, but we moderate things through *very* quickly.
<asac> soren: ok.
<asac> soren: is motu-council still the place to send motu applications to?
<soren> asac: I doubt anything ever sits in the queue for more than an hour. dholbach's a frickin' machine!
<soren> asac: Yes.
<soren> asac: You want to be a MOTU? :)
<asac> ok cool
<sebner> lol
<sebner> asac go go go go for MOTU \o/
<asac> lol
<dholbach> soren: I wish that was true for the sponsoring queue!
<asac> lets write a "auto-sponsor" bot ;)
<dholbach> asac: right - "grumpy groundhog"! :)
<dholbach> ./grumpy -q --ignore-all
<geser> dholbach: isn't -q --ignore-all the default?
<dholbach> geser: probably :)
<dholbach> I wanted to make sure we get our daily crack
<soren> --crack-level=\infty
 * sistpoty|work heads home... cya
<Hew> anyone here from motu-sru?
<cody-somerville> Hew, I am
<Hew> hey cody-somerville. Bug 248055 has been around for a while and users are getting pretty restless about a SRU, since gtk-gnutella is completely broken for all except Intrepid. I was wondering what motu-sru thought about the bug, and if the nominated releases were going to be accepted?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 248055 in gtk-gnutella "gtk-gnutella cannot connect to newer network - ancient version detected" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/248055
<cody-somerville> No. I won't approve the entire version to be uploaded to Hardy.
<cody-somerville> I will accept a minimally invasive patch.
<cody-somerville> You might want to affect that bug against the hardy backports project to get a backport for the entire version going
<cody-somerville> Oh, already is
<Hew> cody-somerville: yep
<cody-somerville> jdong, ping ^^
<Hew> cody-somerville: The problem is that the network requires the new version in order for it to function. I don't think there's anything that can be "patched", unless it's to lie about a version number somewhere, which would be a bad thing to do.
<cody-somerville> Hew, If the network won't allow that version to connect any longer than a backport might be the only recourse
<Hew> cody-somerville: I see. So even though everyone has completely broken clients, it's not possible to push the new version as a SRU? What regression could possibly occur?
<Hew> cody-somerville: I know it's not the normal SRU process, but this case seems to be an exception.
<cody-somerville> I'm not convinced the entire version needs to be backported to fix the issue
<cody-somerville> I suggest getting in contact with upstream to get their opinion.
<Hew> cody-somerville: ok then
<cody-somerville> Hew, I see someone commented on the bug about who is responsible for this bug, yada yada. You're now responsible :P
<Hew> Thanks for your help. Looks like the immediate fix is to get that backport :-)
<Hew> haha ok.. and I'm on Intrepid! :P
<cody-somerville> Hew, nothing stopping you from installing the hardy version to test :P
<sumanc> hi. trying to submit my first sync request. can someone help. requestsync command is failing. bug 235063
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 235063 in 2vcard "mistake in the package description" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/235063
<Hew> cody-somerville: I tested it already before I switched to Intrepid and it worked fine.
<cody-somerville> sumanc, just mark the bug as confirmed
<cody-somerville> sumanc, subscribe the ubuntu archive team
<Laney> cody-somerville: A MOTU needs to ACK the sync
<cody-somerville> Laney, I'll ack it
<Laney> Then you should be the one to confirm ;)
 * cody-somerville rolls eyes. :P
<cody-somerville> Okay okay.
<cody-somerville> :P
<cody-somerville> I guess I should actually make sure the sync is good too? :P
<Laney> Hah, now that would just be asking too much!
 * Laney gets on u-u-c app
<kirkland> mathiaz: could you have a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=update-motd ?
<mathiaz> kirkland: ok
<asac> soren: moderate ;)
<sumanc> cody-somerville: sorry dint see your update in time. also subscribed ubuntu-universe-sponsers
<sumanc> is that alright?
<cody-somerville> sumanc, I unsubscribed them
<cody-somerville> And subscribed archive team
<cody-somerville> and all that jazz
<sumanc> oh, sorry. so the sync request is all set then?
<Laney> sumanc: You should dupe it the other way round
<sumanc> you mean mark 257959 as duplicate of 235063?
<Laney> yes
<sumanc> just to clarify for future purposes: when i submit a sync request bug, i mark it as duplicate for the original bug leading to the sync request?
<emgent> hello people
<sebner> emgent: \o/
<jpds> sumanc: Using the "requestsync" script in ubuntu-dev-tools may help.
<jpds> sumanc: In Intrepid it checks for you if you need sponsorship.
<sumanc> jpds: i tried that first but the socket timed out. but thanks, i will try that first in future.
<sumanc> but i dont understand why the sync request bug should be marked as duplicate ?
<jpds> sumanc: Did it say where it timed out?
<Laney> sumanc: You didn't need to file a new bug at all for that one
<Laney> It's alright to retitle the existing bug and subscribe u-{u,m}-s
<sumanc> ok. got it. first sync request ;(
<jpds> sumanc: Please report all problems you find in any ubuntu-dev-tools you find - and I'll do my best to fix them.
<jpds> ..and maybe Laney too.
<sumanc> jpds: socket connection timed out, thats the error it gave.
<sumanc> it was after i entered my gpg passphrase and hit ENTER to submit
<sumanc> i mean the prompt after the gpg prompt, where it says ENTER to submit or something else to abort
<jpds> sumanc: Did it say: "Using cookie file at"...
<Laney> gpg prompt = submitting by mail, afaik
<Laney> Hmm, might be a good idea to have an option to submit to staging for debugging
<jpds> Laney: Yay, in that case I didn't break it.
<sumanc> i found the error txt :) http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/37502/
<sumanc> should have done this in the first place ;)
<Laney> Ah, you probably need a working local mail setup for that
<jpds> sumanc: Are you using a STMP server, other than the default?
 * Adri2000 suspects port 25 closed
<sumanc> i havent configured any mail. just default hardy. but i am behind a firewall, dont know what kind
 * Laney thinks we should make LP the default
<Adri2000> the default is fiordland.ubuntu.com
<jpds> sumanc: OK; it sounds like Adri2000 is right.
<Adri2000> sumanc: what does telnet fiordland.ubuntu.com 25 says?
<Adri2000> it should tell you something like "220 fiordland.canonical.com ESMTP Postfix (Ubuntu)"
<sumanc> nope. just says Trying 91.189.94.145...
<Adri2000> s/says/say/
<jpds> sumanc: Next time try running requestsync with the "--lp" flag.
<sumanc> that wont use mail?
<jpds> sumanc: No, it connects to Launchpad directly.
<jpds> ...with python-launchpad.bugs
<sumanc> cool. will use it in future.
<sumanc> should the program suggest that though, when it fails like it did for me?
<jpds> Well, "man requestsync" shows the available options.
<sumanc> agreed :)
<jpds> One can simply choose the one that tickles there fancy. :)
<sebner> norsetto: \o/
<cody-somerville> \o/
<norsetto> sebner: \o/
<jpds> sebner: \o/
<sebner> jpds: cody-somerville \o/
<sebner> xD
<norsetto> cody-somerville \o/
<jpds> All do the IRC wave!
<norsetto> norsetto \o/
<cody-somerville> omgz!! \o/
<DktrKranz> rest-of-thw-world, \o/
 * norsetto does the wave
<nxvl> \o/
<sebner> well, at least we 4
<sebner> nxvl: congratulations :D :D :D
<nxvl> sebner: thank you
<nxvl> :D
<DktrKranz> nxvl, now... pay us some good wine
<norsetto> master nxvl :-D
<nxvl> now i need to learn how to upload to the archive
<nxvl> :S
<geser> \o
<cody-somerville> nxvl, congratz :]
<geser> \o/
<jpds> nxvl: \o/ on your MOTUness.
<geser> o/
<geser> o
<nxvl> DktrKranz: i owe you one! i really do
<cody-somerville> We all rock! :D
<nxvl> thank you all!
<DktrKranz> nxvl, apt-get install checkinstall
<norsetto> DktrKranz: doh?
<nxvl> installing
<nxvl> installed
<RainCT> nxvl: congrats!
<bdrung_> where can i see which packages hanging in the new queue?
<nxvl> TheMuso: around?
<DktrKranz> ok, now upload your first piece of crack
<nxvl> RainCT: thank you!
<nxvl> yes i need to find where it is
<nxvl> :S
<DktrKranz> NEW queue should go
<jpds> geser: My goodness, your limbs have come off.
<bdrung_> link?
<sebner> !ohmy | DktrKranz
<ubottu> DktrKranz: Please watch your language and topic to help keep this channel family friendly.
<RainCT> nxvl: ah, regarding your question: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/New
<RainCT> :)
<sebner> DktrKranz: checkinstall!?!?!?! :P
<sebner> RainCT: put it as topic :P
<DktrKranz> sebner, I always used checkinstall, any problems? ;)
<sebner> hrhr
<Laney> bdrung_: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+queue
<sebner> Now I know why intrepid is so b0rken :P
<bdrung_> Laney: thx
<DktrKranz> sebner, not my fault, blame some other developers who prefers devscripts
<RainCT> sebner: btw, boson still needs to be fixed :P
 * sebner hides 
<sebner> RainCT: damn you :P
<sebner> DktrKranz: sure ^^
<sebner> RainCT: but, yes on my todo list :)
 * jpds watches RainCT do: "buildd boson intrepid status" for the rest of the evening.
<DktrKranz> sebner, is it a FTBFS?
<DktrKranz> (boson)
<jpds> All archs.
<sebner> DktrKranz: yep
<sebner> DktrKranz: because of kde4 black magic
<DktrKranz> I see
<DktrKranz> all yours
<nxvl> wooho
<emgent> nxvl: congrats! :(
<nxvl> i just did my first upload to the archive
<nxvl> :D
<emgent> s/:)/:)/
<nxvl> emgent: thank you!
<emgent> argh..
<nxvl> i'm so exited
<emgent> s/(/)/
<sebner> nxvl: Successfully built  (ACCEPTED)   <--- that's always good ^^
<norsetto> nxvl: oh oh, your upload was rejected ...
 * norsetto tries to revive nxvl
<sebner> bad norsetto :P
<jpds> Too much excitement, heart attack!
<norsetto> I think I need an hand sebner, can you please fetch some salts?
 * norsetto slaps nxvl
 * norsetto slaps nxvl hard
<nxvl> ouch
<sebner> lol
<sebner> not that fast reaction ^^
<nxvl> i was watching the DPL dance
<nxvl> :P
 * norsetto goes to find medications for his hand
<nxvl> it's always funny for a LatinAmerican to see a non-LatinAmerican dance LatinAmerican dances
<nxvl> :D
 * sebner gives norsetto a "first aid box"
 * warp10 runs towards norsetto with a giant syringe
 * norsetto screams, jumps and flees
<cody-somerville> Whats up with all the Norsetto love today?
<warp10> cody-somerville: norsetto is always looking for love
 * norsetto hugs cody-somerville :-)
<cody-somerville> :D
<sebner> cody-somerville: you just *can't* love norsetto :D
 * norsetto looks at sebner suspiciously
 * norsetto remarks that sebner has no beed glass on his hands
 * warp10 installs a gunsight on the giant syringe
 * norsetto concludes sebner has gulped it down already ...
<sebner> norsetto: straight :P
<norsetto> warp10: hmmmm, what is in the syringe?
<warp10> norsetto: mmm... well... just a gooood medicine for your hand 0:-)
<nxvl> warp10: you have already worked with revu-tools package, it's always so lintian unfriendly?
 * norsetto never trusted a doctor in his life, and is not going to start NOW
 * nxvl get's always the same greeting from the doctors: "What did you do NOW?"
<nxvl> :D
<warp10> nxvl: congrats, first of all! :) Regarding revu-tools: I just made an upload to fix an unmetdep, not actually worked on it a lot
<norsetto> is it only me that can't edit wiki pages anymore?
<warp10> norsetto: resistance is futile!
 * cody-somerville yawns.
<nxvl> warp10: thank you! But when you build it lintian show his unhappines?
<norsetto> warp10: what was it, all your syringes belongs to us?
<norsetto> \o/ mok0
<warp10> nxvl: it does, but nothing very hard to fix, IIRC
<warp10> norsetto: and we assimilate more and more every day!
<nxvl> warp10: it's complaining about the versioning
 * warp10 take a look
<porthose> nxvl:  Congrats :)
<nxvl> and that it was an empty directory
<nxvl> and that it has a non executable script
<nxvl> porthose: thank you
<nxvl> some has used revu-tools?
<warp10> nxvl: it complains indeed. Looks like lintian thinks it's a NMU
<emgent> heya norsetto
<norsetto> emgent: o/
<nxvl> raphink: around?
<nxvl> RainCT: did you use revu-tools?
<RainCT> nxvl: nope
<RainCT> right.. seems like revu-tools is using wrong versioning
<RainCT> if it's a native package it shouldn't have a - in the version
<nxvl> yep
<mouz> nxvl: i do not understand your question in the 4th comment in bug 246106
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 246106 in revu-tools "revu-tools always say lintian not happy" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/246106
<norsetto> mouz: I guess he means the version, he was talking about that before
<mouz> norsetto: current version in intrepid is 0.6.1-3. What would you suggest I make it?
<norsetto> mouz: they were discussing that its not appropriate since the package is a native one, so, it should just be 0.6.1 (or 0.6.1.3, depends from the tarball version)
<Laney> We just appended "ubuntuX" to the version of ubuntu-dev-tools, I believe this was to appease lintian with native packages - maybe revu-tools should do the same?
<Laney> jpds: Is that ^ right?
<jpds> Laney: Yeah, it was complaining about NMU. RainCT did the change.
<Laney> aha
<norsetto> mouz: ^^ ask RainCT to have a look at your debdiff for inclusion, since he is working on revu-tools right now apparently
<mouz> norsetto: ok thanks
<Laney> norsetto, mouz: No, I was just talking about u-d-t.
<RainCT> norsetto: Uhm no I aren't; I just did 'aptitude changelog' :).  I can have a look at the debdiff but that would be in 10 days as I'll leave tomorrow (and I'm about to poweroff now) :P
<norsetto> RainCT: don't come back sunburned ...
<jpds> RainCT: Good bye, have fun!
<sebner> RainCT: yeah, hf =)
<RainCT> thanks :)
<Laney> jpds, RainCT: Sent my app ;)
<norsetto> Laney: gracious? RainCT GRACIOUS?
<Laney> But of course!
<jpds> norsetto: We are loveable.
 * RainCT kicks norsetto 
<norsetto> RainCT: you see, and he is calling you GRACIOUS! OML!
<RainCT> lol
<jpds> norsetto: OML?
<norsetto> jpds: Oh My Lord ...
<RainCT> Well, answered to Laney's application, so.. see you in 10 days! :)
<Laney> \o/
<Laney> Don't miss us too much...
<jpds> Laney: Fear not, he'll have 10 billion commit emails from us poking u-d-t.
<RainCT> noooooooooo
<Laney> hahaha
<james_w> there's going to be a MOTU School session on merging in #ubuntu-classroom in a few minutes if anyone is interested
<Laney> james_w: At 2300 BST?
<james_w> Laney: that's the badger
<Laney> Excellent, time for a quick shower
 * Laney sprints
<jussi01> anyone know what Im missing?
<jussi01> checking for snd_pcm_open in -lasound... no
<jussi01> configure: error: Ogg support on Linux requires the alsa library
<Laney> jussi01: A build-dep
<jpds> jussi01: libasound2-dev
<Laney> That build-dep!
<jpds> !
 * jpds hugs Laney.
<jussi01> hehe
<jussi01> thanks
 * Laney high fives jpds 
<Laney> To the classroom!
<tbielawa> yay! #ubuntu-classroom merging from debian!
<tbielawa> I'm so glad we have these classrooms
<tbielawa> merging was something I was hoping there would be a session on :)
<Laney> Merging is good fun
<tbielawa> the cutoff date for intrepid is approaching, right?
<tbielawa> +new packages into intrepid
<Laney> tbielawa: Yes, Aug 28 :(
<tbielawa> oh noes
<tbielawa> can anyone check this revu out for me? Ive been working hard on it http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=lucidlife
<tbielawa> let me add 'please' to that request.
<tbielawa> hey there nxvl
<TheMuso> nxvl: I'm around now.
<nxvl> TheMuso: can you please add me to uus?
<TheMuso> nxvl: Whats your launchpad ID?
<nxvl> TheMuso: nvalcarcel
<TheMuso> Ok doing now.
<nxvl> thank you!
<james_w> congratulations nxvl
<nxvl> james_w: thank you!
<TheMuso> nxvl: done
<TheMuso> And congrats.
<nxvl> TheMuso: thank you (2 times)
<TheMuso> nxvl: No problem.
<bdrung_> vorian: did you sponsored some xmms2 related packages?
<kirkland> nxvl: my congrads to you as well ;-)
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-15
<nxvl> kirkland: thank you
<nxvl> sponsoring stuff is fun
<nxvl> :D
<directhex> so is guitar hero
<RAOF> Hm.  update-grub seems to have eaten my grub.cfg.  Yay.
<nxvl> to sponsor a sync
<nxvl> i need to ACK it and suscribe ~ubuntu-archive, don't i?
<RAOF> Yup.
<Laney> and set it to confirmed
<Laney> and unsubscribe u-u-s!
<nxvl> Laney: that's the first thing i did
<RAOF> Always with the unsubscribing, yes.
<nxvl> :D
<RAOF> !!!
<RAOF> Where did /boot go?
<directhex> sorry, i was hungry
<RAOF> This is probably why grub-probe is somewhat confused.
<RAOF> You know, I should probably merge grub-pc if I'm gonna use it; it seems debian's newer snapshot is full of "please don't die" bugfixes.
<RAOF> Oh.  I think I know what ate my /boot.  Stupid parallel fsck!
 * wgrant spits out /boot's bones.
<RAOF> Nothing says "I love you" more than having a mount point not exist every now and then.
<james_w> I have "intltool-update.in -> /usr/share/intltool/intltool-update.in" in a couple of packages, which fail to build in Intrepid as that file is not available, even in the intltool package, has anyone else seen this?
<james_w> anyone know where they went?
<RAOF> james_w: I believe that's a change in the new intltool.
<RAOF> james_w: I hit that packaging Do; I believe intltool would now like to be run as a part of ./configure
<directhex> how nice for it
<directhex> isn't it a little bit late in the day for intrepid for intltool to break everyones' packages?
<james_w> RAOF: thanks, do you know what I need to change?
<james_w> it's ./configure where it bombs out
<emgent> kirkland: your ecrypfs r0cks. i fixed my system problem
<emgent> now work very nice.
<kirkland> emgent: thanks, dude.  what was your problem?
<RAOF> james_w: From memory, with Do I acually added the intltools stuff to configure.ac and re-autogen'd
<emgent> kirkland: in the first step i dont put same password in login and ecryptfs, after that more problem (you know). i removed all an i start new clean setup. now work fine.
<kirkland> emgent: very good...  i wonder if i should improve the documentation/prompts somehow?
<kirkland> i wish there were an easy way for me to validate that password
<emgent> kirkland: documentation is very good, you wrote (add same login system password), It was my mistake
<kirkland> emgent: okay, thanks
<emgent> kirkland: no thanks to you! :)
<emgent> kirkland: do you have a launchpad branch for ecryptfs ?
<kirkland> emgent: no, it's managed in git.kernel.org
<emgent> i'm asking about tool
<emgent> ecryptfs-setup-private ecc..
<kirkland> emgent: i have passed ALL of the code I've written to the upstream ecryptfs-utils project
<emgent> okkay great! :)
<kirkland> emgent: http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/mhalcrow/ecryptfs-utils.git;a=summary
<kirkland> emgent: i send my patches to the mailing list, and Mike applies them
<emgent> http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/mhalcrow/ecryptfs-utils.git;a=blob;f=src/utils/ecryptfs-setup-private;h=1aa6bf56ca5f88a41be8bd68903166b87c63f337;hb=HEAD
<emgent> yeah nice work, thanks kirkland !
<kirkland> emgent: that's it :-)
<kirkland> emgent: i think i'm going to add a check, if you've previously run ecryptfs-setup-private, and if so, error out, and tell you that you have to use a "-f" option to force it
<emgent> nice i can remove flashusb for .ssh .gnupg .mozilla-thunderbird and .mozilla
<kirkland> emgent: I also want to add a "--undo" option too
<emgent> now i can use this stuff.
<kirkland> emgent: ;-)
<emgent> very good :)
<emgent> argh we are in -motu.. i think that we can switch to -server
<emgent> we are OT.
<emgent> moin
<dholbach> good morning
<stefanlsd> morning
<stefanlsd> nhandler: just worked thru your lesson. thanks. was great!   (you explained the .patch files well. was missing that...)
<emgent> moin
<bhavi_> emgent, howdy mate
<emgent> bhavi_: moin
<tuxmaniac> heya gang
<Hew> can someone from u-u-s look at the prboom sync request bug 231811
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 231811 in prboom "freedom is a dependancy for prboom... but shouldn't" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/231811
<Laney> Hew: You should retitle the bug
<Hew> Laney: Thanks, will do
<Laney> Please sync <package> <version> (<Ubuntu component>) from Debian <release> (<Debian component>)
<Hew> done
<Hew> I've gotta head off now so I'll check on it later. Thanks again.
* persia changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs?  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Intrepid open, go wild!  https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html | QA targets available from  http://qa.ubuntuwire.com | TODAY - Another day!! Keep working. | Next MOTU meeting:  Fr, August 22nd 12:00 UTC
<coolbhavi> hello I m getting this error please help http://pastebin.com/f25de910
<effie_jayx> coolbhavi, ./dhelp-0.6.12ubuntu1/debian/control at line 27: block lacks a package field <----
<effie_jayx> did you change debian/control and erased the package field?
<coolbhavi> effie_jayx, no
<effie_jayx> coolbhavi,  did you change anything in debian control?
<persia> Looks to me like the upstream makefile doesn't have a clean rule.
<ogra> that shouldnt really matter, can you pastebin your debian/control as well ?
<coolbhavi> effie_jayx, yes a min please I ll paste it
<coolbhavi> effie_jayx,  http://pastebin.com/d27eb5a04 <---- control file
<persia> coolbhavi: Remove the blank line 14.
 * persia thinks we'll see a different error now
<coolbhavi> a min please
<sebner> persia: he hasn't answered yet (almanah) but on debian mentors is a new revision with my manpage in it :\
<persia> sebner: Progress is being made.
<coolbhavi> persia, you are a magician it worked!
<sebner> persia: sure but this isn't the collaboration I want to see ;)
<persia> yeah :/
<sebner> persia: btw, nearly forgot to ask. any progress with qmasters?
<sebner> uqm ^^
<persia> sebner: Not at all.  Thanks for the poke.  I'll push the merge into Ubuntu, as Debian is frozen.
<sebner> persia: kk :)
<sebner> persia: wait, It needs an update to -8ubuntu1
<persia> sebner: Indeed it does.  Do you want to do that?
<sebner> persia: sure ;)
<sebner> persia: urgent?
<sebner> persia: updated :), I'm off for now. Bad thunderstorm /here
<persia> sebner: Thanks.  I've been organising my review queue today, and expect to push it.
<mok0> Shouldn't intrepid be available to hardy's debootstrap?
<mok0> ... at least in backports
<jpds> mok0: It is as of 1.0.9~hardy1.
<mok0> jpds: huh? I have 1.0.8
<mok0> jpds: ah, I thought I had backports enabled, bummer!
<jpds> mok0: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/debootstrap/1.0.9~hardy1
<mok0> thx
<ScottK> mok0: I saw you were trying to ping me yesterday.
<mok0> ScottK: yes, thanks for looking at gamgi
<mok0> ScottK: but please see my comment
<ScottK> mok0: Link please?
<mok0> ScottK: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gamgi
<ScottK> Looking
<elkbuntu> right. is there any known bug where booting into a red flashing screen will cause your grub to turn into pastebin.ca/1172892 ?
<elkbuntu> yes, it is the right pastebin
<ScottK> mok0: I still thing it needs a man page.  I think every executable in /usr/bin is supposed to have one.
<mok0> ScottK: But the user should not know about this
<ScottK> mok0: What does Debian Policy say?
<mok0> ScottK: the user will execute the program "gamgi"
<ScottK> Right.  Once you read policy, the answer will be a short man page that says don't excute this.
<ScottK> I could be wrong.
<mok0> ScottK: It says that when a program needs environmental variables, a wrapper script should set them up
<mok0> ScottK: So, for the convenience of the user, the wrapper script is called "gamgi" and the binary is called "gamgi.real"
<ScottK> Right, what about the Policy about man pages?
<mok0> ScottK: let me check that
<ScottK> Should be policy 12.1
<persia> mok0: Note that you can probably get away with a single manpage for both, with a symlink.
<mok0> I don't see anything concerning wrapper scritps
<mok0> The environment thing is in 9.9
<mok0> persia: allright, but I think it's silly
<persia> mok0: Well, some user might get clever :)
<mok0> persia: heh. Well I see that there are no man pages for "uncompress.real"  or "ldconfig.real"
<persia> mok0: Sure: not every package is policy compliant.
<mok0> persia: You are right
<mok0> ... and there _is_ a manpage for uncompress.real, so that settles it
<mok0> persia: otoh, using a link to the manpage is not good, because people should not run the ".real" program, so the manpage should say that
<persia> mok0: No reason the manpage for gamgi can't mention the existence of gamgi.real, and that one should use /usr/bin/gamgi
<persia> alternately, shove it in /usr/lib/gamgi/gamgi.real
<mok0> persia: yes... does that change the requirement for a manpage?
<persia> It does: policy requires a manpage for everything in /bin, /sbin, /usr/bin, /usr/sbin, and /usr/games
<mok0> persia, I don't see that. I only see "Each program, utility, and function should have an associated manual page included in the same package"
<persia> Hmm..  I guess it depends on one's interpretation of policy.  I always felt that everything in the path, and everything not in the path that users were expected to execute should have a manpage.  I may be mistaken.
<mok0> What do you think, ScottK?
<mok0> persia: I agree that putting the exe file in /usr/lib/... is better
<persia> I don't think it's better, it's just an option.
<ScottK> mok0: I believe that what persia is giving you is the traditional interpretation.  This policy requirement is mechanized in Lintian, so for a real anwer, I'd suggest consulting the Lintian source.
<mok0> ScottK: good idea
<mok0> persia: It is better, because it will prevent users from running the binary without environmental variables set up (unless they are clever)
<persia> mok0: I guess that makes some sense.
<mok0> ScottK, persia, thanks for the input! I will go ahead and fix the package
<emgent> nxvl: o/
<nxvl> emgent: hi!
<mok0> Hmm, just created a new sbuilder, but it is missing apt???
<mok0> intrepid sbuilder, that is
<emgent> argh another issue on drupal..
<mok0> emgent: what's up with drupal?
<emgent> more security issue
<mok0> uhuh
<emgent> committed intrepid now, i'm working to test backport fix for hardy.
<mok0> emgent, what version of drupal is this?
<emgent> 5.X and 6.X
<mok0> emgent: ah, finally, version 6! :-)
<emgent> 6.X it`snt in intrepid yet
<mok0> emgent: will be I hope
<emgent> i'm waiting for bump it in Ubuntu
<Hobbsee> emgent: thanks for the warning.  upgraded drupal, and actually subscribed to the rss feed now!
<emgent> mok0: dont know.. i will see first to 28 August
<emgent> Hobbsee: hehe np, the real problem is that all LoCo Team use it, but not with ubuntu repo..
<emgent> manual installation.. :-|
<Hobbsee> mine's manual too
<Hobbsee> it took about 2 minutes.
<emgent> and not all LoCo upgrade it..
<emgent> (of apply the fix)
<Hobbsee> true
<emgent> and box dont run mod_security for try to exclude this attack
<mok0> Ydrk, getting a compile error in intrepid (but not earlier):  'struct hostent' has no member named 'h_addr'
<mok0> Ydrk, it's now wrapped in ifdefs
<emgent> i think that we should write a census for CMS used by loco.. and try to send auto-notice when vuln is out.
<emgent> (with attached fix)
<emgent> anyway i will talk about it in the next security team meeting
<nxvl> with wich command is that i saw that packages depend on $package?
<mok0> apt-rdepends
<persia> I tend to use apt-cache rdepends, as apt-rdepends is a little funny (or at least I can't get it to use --follow right)
<nxvl> persia: yeah, i'm using rdepends, i have just tried the 2 of them and apt-cache is more what i was looking for
<nxvl> thank you!
 * nxvl HUGS mok0 and persia 
<mok0> persia: did you file a bug report? :-D
<emgent> heya persia :)
<persia> mok0: Not yet: I've yet to determine it's not me (I keep getting distracted by something else when using apt-rdepends)
<persia> That said, the manpage says it doesn't quite emulate apt-cache, so except where one needs recursion, I think apt-cache is a better tool.
<nxvl> bobbo: around?
<vorian> dholbach: ping :)
<vorian> nxvl: congrats man!
<bobbo> nxvl: hey
<nxvl> vorian: thank you
<nxvl> bobbo: nevermind i just uploaded it
<bobbo> nxvl: ok :)
<cherva> should I register a blueprint for Intrepid on launchpad if I'm not going to assign myself to it ? if they find it as a stupid idea they will remove it right ?
<persia> cherva: There's no good way to remove blueprints, and blueprints for intrepid were discussed in May, so the timing is a little awkward.
<persia> The next round of blueprinting will be for intrepid+1, for discussion in December at UDS.
<cherva> persia: so it is too late to proppose to make nautilus edit id3 tags of mp3 via properties->sound tab ?
<persia> cherva: There's only two weeks until FeatureFreeze, and nautius tends to follow upstream very closely.  You'd do best to either work to get that into GNOME or put it on brainstorm.
<cherva> persia: it is on brainstorm
<persia> cherva: OK.  From brainstorm, the next step is to organise the implementation, and get some PoC stuff together.  Often a wiki page is used for this, and written in Specification format.  Has that been done?
<cherva> persia: http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/3888/ there is no wiki, strage this idea is from  8 Mar '08 where can I see the discussed blueprints for the ibex?
<persia> cherva: I don't know that they are organised in their entirety anywhere.  Most of the teams have individual listings of blueprints interesting to them.
<cherva> persia: I guess I'll wait for the interpid+1 discussion :)
<superm1> persia, do you have a good methodology for how you are tracking down the extras that get added in in the studio stuff?  _MMA_ showed me some 300 megs that got added
<persia> superm1: Not really.  I've been fiddling with `apt-rdepends --show=Depends,Recommends`.  I've yet to figure out how --follow works.  Also: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-studio-devel/2008-August/000822.html
<persia> cherva: That or get inolved in implementing it yourself: generally those specs that are almost there are more likely to get included than those that are more a description of something someone else should do.
<superm1> persia, ah okay fairly similar to how i started to look at some of the mythbuntu stuff that is depending on too much.
<superm1> our live cd image is some 200 megs bigger (That includes compression.....)
<superm1> and from what i've seen so far, we dont want any of it
<cherva> persia: I don't think my code will be good for implementing it ANYWHERE :)
<persia> Well, there's some stuff we want: I just added libpam-ck-connector to -desktop today.  On the other hand, we were pulling all of KDE, which is a bit odd for a GNOME-based desktop.
<persia> cherva: Proof-of-concept.  Then present that to known nautilus hackers, and watch it change into real, useful, code.
<cherva> persia: I don't know gtk :) just a little qt4 I'll just leave it for now
<persia> cherva: OK.  If you really want it, maybe you can find someone else who both knows GTK and also wants it?
<cherva> no I just wanted to ask what will happen if i register a blueprint and I know now thanks :)
<goshawk> h
<goshawk> hi
<goshawk> if someone have free time please see :http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=dsss
<persia> goshawk: What is dsss?
<goshawk> persia: it's like python eggs
<goshawk> but for D programming language
<goshawk> dsss net install application
<goshawk> downloads compiles and installs the application
<persia> Ah.  Considering how much time we spend patching that out of python apps, I'm unsure how much we want it for other programming languages
<goshawk> you're right
<goshawk> but sometimes it could be good
<goshawk> expecially for not packaged application
<goshawk> and, now, in the D world
<persia> Well, I don't think it's good for not-packaged applications, as they ought be packaged.  It might make things more convenient for D developers though.
<goshawk> they are a lot (that are not packaged i mean)
<persia> (but not much more convenient for D developers who wanted to have their applications in Ubuntu)
<goshawk> persia: it's also the "make" equivalent for D applications
<persia> Oughtn't they be packaged then, if they are useful?
<persia> Oh.  If it's "make" equivalent, than we do need it.
<persia> I don't suppose you've packaged it in a way that tries to pull libraries from the repositories, rather than the net, have you?
<goshawk> persia: it's mainly a make equivalent
<goshawk> the "net" module get sources from net and compile it
<goshawk> for example
<goshawk> dsss build
<goshawk> in a D source tree
<goshawk> compiles and generate executables
<goshawk> persia: it's a coded from scratch application
<goshawk> it uses just C libs
<goshawk> and D ones
<goshawk> (using gdc the gnu d compiler that is in the ubuntu repo)
<goshawk> it does not use the net to build
<goshawk> itself
<goshawk> all the libraries are in the repo
<persia> Right.  I'm just considering the future popularity of this for D developers, and think that if you haven't, you might want to see if you can stub out the net module to pull libraries from the repositories, pehaps if a certain siwtch is provided.  That then makes it easy to package D code that build-depends on dsss
<goshawk> you can't use the net module while using dsss like "make"
<goshawk> except you do dirty things in makefiles
<persia> goshawk: OK.  Now I'm confused.
<goshawk> persia: i'll explain better
<goshawk> D applications have a makefile called dsss.conf
<goshawk> it's readed by dsss
<goshawk> to build sources
<goshawk> dsss has a net module too
<goshawk> to get and compile sources
<goshawk> but the net module is not accessible by dsss.conf
<goshawk> it has no sense for a dsss.conf to get
<goshawk> the net module
<goshawk> since
<goshawk> the net module just get sources from the net
<goshawk> and open them
<goshawk> then it goes in the source dir and do "dsss build"
<goshawk> and dsss install
<goshawk> is it now more easy to understand?
<persia> OK.  So there's no easy way for a developer to configure dsss to pull build-dependencies from the net as part of a call to dsss build ?
<goshawk> no, dsss does not solve dependencies, it's like make
<goshawk> dsss net module is able to
<goshawk> but you can't call it from dsss.conf
<persia> OK, so `dsss build` can't pull from the net?
<goshawk> yep right
<goshawk> dsss build just builds
<goshawk> according to specifications in dsss.conf
<persia> OK.  Added to my list of packages to review.
<goshawk> :) thanks
<sebner> persia: after uqm of course :P
<persia> sebner: Indeed.  It's a FIFO queue.
<goshawk> D:
<goshawk> :D
<sebner> persia: nice to hear =)
<devfil> Someone can take a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=ircp-tray ?
<emgent> evening
<ethana2> on ubuntu 8.10 alpha 4, the version of miro that ships is 1.2.3, current from miro apt is 1.2.6
 * ethana2 checks code freeze date
<ethana2> ok, we haven't even hit feature freeze
<ethana2> http://www.getmiro.com/download/
<devfil> ethana2: can you open a bug (if it doesn't exists yet)?
<ethana2> launchpad?
<devfil> ethana2: yes
<nellery> ethana2, this will help https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs
<ethana2> ok
<ethana2> well i report bugs all the time
<ethana2> a few others this week-- but how do you file a 'package needs to be updated' bug?
<nellery> Have a look at the many examples https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=upgrade
<nellery> ethana2, make sure you add the tag 'upgrade'
<ethana2> got it
<ethana2> ok, how to i add tags?
<ethana2> is that after submitting?
<ethana2> ok  yes
<ethana2> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/miro/+bug/258401
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 258401 in miro "old version of miro in intrepid repositories" [Undecided,New]
<ethana2> oh hey, while i'm here, i'd like to see this maybe get resolved in a timely manner
<ethana2> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/258058
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 258058 in libprinterconf "Brother DCP 7020 uses wrong drivers" [Undecided,New]
<cody-somerville> ...
<ethana2> particularly because not only is this bug extremely annoying to me, but the solution should be somewhat simple
<cody-somerville> ethana2, I look forward to receiving your patch then
<ethana2> i don't know if i have the ability to help fix this bug myself
<ethana2> ok, how do i do this?
<cody-somerville> Well, you fix it
<cody-somerville> then you compare the the old and the fixed version
<ethana2> right, i have the .deb files for all the right drivers
<ethana2> is there a driver index file somewhere i can insert this stuff in?
<ethana2> anyone familiar with the printing subsystem want to help me out?
<ethana2> i'm expecting the fix to involve maybe a few lines of text, but i don't know where the file is that the text needs to be added to
<ethana2> ok here, how do i found the launchpad maintainer of a given project?
<cody-somerville> Well, you could determine what binary is launched when you plug in your printer
<ethana2> once i know that i can just ask him
<cody-somerville> Then determine which package that belongs to
<ethana2> i've got that already
<ethana2> i think
<ethana2> alright, i should be absolutely sure i guess
<cody-somerville> "apt-get source <package name>" to get the source code
<ethana2> how do i see what's being launched as i plug stuff in?
<ethana2> ah yeah, when i apt-get source, does it just dump it wherever i'm at like svn, or does it put it in some source directory?
<cody-somerville> It will download three files to you current working directory
<cody-somerville> and extract the source into a sub directory
<ethana2> ah, ok
<ethana2> ok, got it, now to figure out where it stores the printer/driver index
 * ethana2 is asking on ##cups
<ethana2> Ok, this is confusing--what I may do is get a livecd of the latest suse and fedora and add those to the bug report on launchpad if they're affected
<ethana2> well, thanks for the help-- time to see how the intrepid radeon driver performs in tremulous
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-16
<__iron> hi
<__iron> folks i m interessed to develop
<tacone> hi __iron, I'd suggest you to ask specific questions.
<__iron> tacone: i know its a meta-question
<__iron> but i will work who i can useful
<__iron> -who +where
<tacone> I am still missing the point.
<tacone> are you asking what you can do ?
<__iron> the point i'm just a student with c and c++ experience who want help where he can help
<tacone> I am not a motu myself, anyway: here are some bugs that needs to be corrected http://daniel.holba.ch/harvest/ . if you don't know anything about packaging you may want to read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted to find your way out.
<__iron> k thx
<tacone> that's scaring at first, but when you are stuck you could just come back here to ask your questions.
<__iron> k ty
<tacone> np
<__iron> tacone: how can i get a mentor ?
<tacone> __iron: you should request it on the motu mailing list.
<tacone> __iron: beware there's quite a queue usually to get a mentor. so one has to wait for some time
<__iron> i ll try the mailing list
<__iron> ty
<__iron> now i'm a mailing list user
<__iron> *g*
<tacone> :-)
<emgent> __iron: please see https://edge.launchpad.net/~motu-mentoring-reception
<__iron> thx: emgent
<emgent> __iron: np, the best anyway is mail norsetto@ubuntu.com (for ask mentoring)
<__iron> emgent: what could be the best way ?
<emgent> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Mentoring
<__iron> k ty
<tbielawa> hello everybody
<JDCarroll> Anyone around?
<persia> JDCarroll: 184 of us.
<Toma-> is it possible to have a chroot of another distro on ubuntu? eg a chroot of fedora in hardy
<persia> Toma-: Sure, although you may not find many tools to automate setting it up.
<Toma-> hm ok
<persia> Toma-: You might do better with a virtual machine.
<Toma-> yeh i think i might be
<cody-somerville> :(
<persia> ?
<cody-somerville> persia, sistpoty and ajmitch expired from Ubuntu members today.
<persia> cody-somerville: Yes, but they continue to retain that membership indirectly.  It is just an accounting issue.
<cody-somerville> Ah, I hadn't looked
<cody-somerville> Good to hear :]
<NCommander> persia, I'm working what we talked about
<persia> :)
<NCommander> Sorry for the delay, I got caught at a nice big working house fire :-P
 * NCommander is smoldering
<persia> Ugh.  That's not ideal.
<NCommander> Part of the job of being a firefighter
<NCommander> I did get to throw a table through a window
<NCommander> :-)
<persia> Oh.  That's not so bad then :)  It was the "caught" and "smouldering" that didn't sound ideal, but tables make an effective means of arranging egress.
<NCommander> Mindless destruction: Good for the soul ;-)
<RAOF> With bonus fire.
<NCommander> had a couple WTFs with our water supply
<NCommander> And I got stuck on cat detial
<NCommander> Freaking owners had 10 cats
<NCommander> Four were deepfried, one went ballistic on my parnter and animal control caught the rest
<jscinoz> Deepfried... nice
<jscinoz> *creepy voice* now i'm hungry!
<NCommander> KFC - Kentucky Fried Cats
<nxvl> how can buildd not find procps
<persia> nxvl: Out of date apt-cache maybe?  Perhaps a result of a recent upload?
<nxvl> persia: but it's a required package
<persia> nxvl: Hrm.  Go ask a buildd admin then .
<nxvl> yep
<nxvl> also it's a problem just in i386
<nxvl> i will try i given-back tomorrow to check if it was a temporal issue
<slangasek> "required" != "essential", fwiw
<nxvl> and then ping a buildd admin
<nxvl> slangasek: right!
<slangasek> although the definition of "required" is supposed to be "things apt and dpkg depend on", it appears the package manager doesn't actually misses procps if you remove it? :)
<slangasek> s/misses/miss/
<NCommander> evening slangasek
<nxvl> slangasek: so you suggest i better make the package depend on procps?
<slangasek> nxvl: yes
<slangasek> NCommander: 'lo
<nxvl> ok then
<persia> Well, build-depend.
<nxvl> persia: yes, that's i meant, sorry
<NCommander> slangasek, thank you for responding to the dropping architectures post on d-devel, its appreciated someone said something about it
<slangasek> nxvl: btw, are you any relation to the "Balcarce" whose name is plastered all over Mar del Plata? :)
<nxvl> slangasek: kind of
<slangasek> NCommander: sure
<nxvl> slangasek: at some point of the history the family splited out into peru and argentina
<nxvl> slangasek: and the name changed a bit in some points
 * slangasek nods
<nxvl> slangasek: so i think that going back enought will bring us to a common point
<nxvl> slangasek: are you still at MdQ or already home?
<kirkland> nxvl: I had two Pisco Sour tonight, thought of you ;-)
<nxvl> :D
<nxvl> kirkland: where?
<nxvl> kirkland: you need to try Pisco Sour IN Peru, it's different
<nxvl> time to sleep
<nxvl> read you later
<mcasadevall_> persia, bah, my laptop hung
<persia> That explains the information-rich nick :)
<mcasadevall_> i dont think my work in progress saved
<mcasadevall_> I really hope the graphical issues this machine having is kernel related and not *sigh* hardware related
<RAOF> Pro tip to upstreams: when your project is gnome-main-menu, don't include a file licensed under "the same license as the subdomain_parser package", particularly when the subdomain_parser package appears to be a part of a combined GPL/non-free program who's website NO LONGER EXISTS.
<NCommander> Question
<NCommander> WHo does the actual appointment to the -sru/-release teams in Launchpad?
<NCommander> (like who throws the magic switch)
<RAOF> Any administrator of those teams, I believe.
<RAOF> AAARGH.
<NCommander> RAOF, ?
<RAOF> NCommander: gnome-main-menu contains an unlicensed file.
<RAOF> Or, rather, it contains a file who's license is explicitly "the same as the subdomain_parser package".
<NCommander> -_-;
<NCommander> ow
<RAOF> Which may or may not be GPL.  I don't know, because the company that produced that package appears to have died.
<RAOF> It's in a translation.  They're still copyrighted, though.
<tacone> RAOF: so, what to do in such cases ?
<RAOF> tacone: Well, my best guess as to the licence is that its proprietary.  I'm going to strip the translation from the tarball, and file a bug upstream.
<RAOF> "SubDomain is distributed under two licenses: the kernel patches and the kernel module are distributed under the GPL, and the user-level portions of SubDomain are proprietary to Immunix, Inc."
<tacone> RAOF: ok, thanks
<mcasadevall_> persia, I'm growing convienced its a hardware issue with my machine
<mcasadevall_> *sigh*
<mcasadevall_> I'm not happy
<NCommander> my laptop crawls with jus ta single memory stick
<tuxmaniac> if Ubuntu itrepid already has a latest upstream release packaged that isnt in Debian unstable, can I ask the debian maintainer to sync it from Ubuntu by rising a bug in debian BTS? Is it OK?
<persia> tuxmaniac: Well, Debian doesn't usually sync from Ubuntu (although there are exceptions).  Given that Lenny releases in 30 days, I doubt that the Debian Maintainer wants to upgrade now.
<tuxmaniac> persia:I didnt mean an automated sync. Just informing him that an upgraded package is present in Ubuntu? Yeah Lenny release is close.
<NCommander> persia, I'm not going to be able to finish working on the wik page tonight
<persia> I had a recent experience with that, and sent email to the development team list (team-maintained in Debian) reporting what work was required to get the new upstream to work with the Debian packaging: this was well received, but it was confirmed there were no plans to upgrade now.
<NCommander> I'm right now seeing if I can track down the hardware issue with my laptop
<wgrant> persia: 30 days. Hah.
<persia> NCommander: That's why tomorrow was invented.
<NCommander> DO you know a reliable way I can stress my video card out
<NCommander> I think VRAM is what's failing
<persia> wgrant: September 15th is the planned release day.
<wgrant> persia: Oh, they actually have a date now?
<NCommander> ooh, when did that happen
<wgrant> I thought it was still just September.
<wgrant> Like Etch was.
<NCommander> persia, can you repost the comments you gave me?
<NCommander> (I shut that machine down)
<tuxmaniac> persia: Why I am so careful is the last time I did that by packaging the new release myself and attaching the .diff it was nt well received and it was considered package hijack. But when I cleared it out saying I am the upstream author and as over excited, then the flames settled. So alsways kind of careful :-)
<tuxmaniac> s/as/was
<persia> tuxmaniac: Yes, being careful is best, and sending small patches and discussion is generally preferred to sending a diff.gz.
<persia> tuxmaniac: Also, if you are upstream, you want to develop fairly close communications with your Debian Maintainer, sharing information about bugs, fixes, etc.
<persia> http://asdfasdf.ethz.ch/~tar/bts/
<NCommander> persia, bah, I think compiz was causing the crash, graphical effects got turned on max, and this laptops intel video card isn't fully supported it
<wgrant> Has anybody seen strip segfault before?
<NCommander> And that proved it
<NCommander> Enabled compiz froze my system nice and hard
<NCommander> wgrant, I've seen it do that on hurd ...
<wgrant> NCommander: This is on boring amd64 Linux.
<NCommander> wgrant, I'm running AMD64, I can take a look
<NCommander> Strip usually only crashs if your working with a malformed binary
<wgrant> I just hadn't seen it happen before.
<wgrant> (something FTBFSed because of it)
<persia> wgrant: On the buildds?  strip acts special there.
<wgrant> persia: In the rebuild.
<persia> Ah, hrm.
<mcasadevall_> So the compiz switch is not stinky ...
<mcasadevall_> Cause it switched itself back to Extra after the last reboot
<mcasadevall_> causing yet another crash
<mcasadevall_> -_-;
<mcasadevall_> hold on
<NCommander> well, now it seems "stable"
<NCommander> If it keeps doing it, I'll have to enable my nvidia graphics card, and use that piece of evil
<tuxmaniac> wgrant: I think the package  qantenna is not under the mOTu science teams purview. It would be great if you could subscribe that to our team so that we can keep track of the bugs and releases. Thanks in advance
<wgrant> tuxmaniac: Sure, subscribing.
<tuxmaniac> wgrant: thanks
<mcasadevall_> persia, remember when I said I fixed my crashing issue?
<persia> heh
<tuxmaniac> Hi. I am looking at bug 207760. There is patch that fix a few issues submitted by the upsrteam author so that it is taken into the current versions in Ubuntu. Should I just apply the patch and generate a new .diff.gz to be taken for intrepid ? Ofcurse by applying the patch I meant debian/patches
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 207760 in geda-gnetlist "Broken VHDL and Verilog netlisting backends" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/207760
<tuxmaniac> wgrant: you were the last uploader for that package and I guess might be in a better position to help
<devfil> Someone can take a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=ircp-tray ?
<devfil> asac: can you take a look at https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xulrunner/+bug/254618 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 254618 in xulrunner "Please update xulrunner to 1.8.1.16 version." [Undecided,Confirmed]
<evalles_> can package upgrades be done still?
<sebner> evalles_: sure
<stefanlsd> geser: do u mind if i work on merging showimg?
<stefanlsd> Does anyone know what has replaced xutils - E: showimg source: build-depends-on-obsolete-package build-depends: xutils?
<slangasek> nxvl: already back home
<persia> stefanlsd: A whole heap of stuff, as part of the modularisation of X.  Which utilities do you need?
<persia> (and if you don't know, you might grab an old xutils from launchpad, and see what it provides)
<stefanlsd> persia: i am busy merging showimg from debian, and they have it there.  How would i work out which piece of xutils showimg actually wants?
<persia> stefanlsd: That's the hard part :)
<stefanlsd> persia: hehe.
<persia> +Looking quickly at sid, it appears xutils is a transition package, depending on x11-xfs-utils, x11-utils, x11-xserver-utils, x11-session-utils, xfonts-utils, xutils-dev
<persia> You'll need to look at those, and at what the package needs, and update it.
<salutis> hello all. I am not able to upload updated package to REVU since I changed my GPG key. can somebody help me?
<stefanlsd> persia: thanks. will remove xutils and try build then add those deps...
<ScottK-laptop> salutis: Did you update your GPG key in your Launchpad account?
<salutis> ScottK-laptop: yes, I have 2 keys in launchpad - old key (revoked) and new key. uploading worked with old key, but it's currently revoked and new key seems to not work (sorry for my english)
<persia> ScottK: I'm reminded: about the documentation on the decision making process...
<persia> salutis: What is your LP ID?
<salutis> persia: salutis
<ScottK-laptop> persia: Thanks.
<salutis> persia: C60968A5 is old revoked key and B0298FA8 is new one which is not working
<persia> Hmm.  The REVU keyring only has B0298FA8: C60968A5 doesn't appear.
<persia> I don't see anything in REJECTED.  Which package did you upload?  What error did you get?
<salutis> persia: I received e-mail today at "Sat, 16 Aug 2008 16:25:09 -0000 (18:25 CEST)" with this message: "Rejected: Signer has no upload rights at all to this distribution.". I am trying upload 'thinkingrock' package
<salutis> persia: dput finished with message - "Successfully uploaded packages."
<persia> salutis: I suspect you uploaded it somewhere other than REVU then, as REVU doesn't send such mail (or I don't think it does).
<persia> dput just sends stuff over ftp: that being successful has very little to do with whether you can upload.  You can probably dput to Debian, but the package will be rejected.
<salutis> persia: mail come from "Ubuntu Installer <archive@ubuntu.com>" and at the end of message is this text: "If you don't understand why your files were rejected, or if the
<salutis> override file requires editing, please go to: http://answers.launchpad.net/soyuz". maybe I am doing anything wrong
<persia> Right, that would indicate an upload to the primary ubuntu archives, rather than to REVU.  Please dput again, and be sure to specify REVU as the target.  You may want to delete your .upload file to make this easy.
<salutis> persia: upload with target 'revu' is in progress
<salutis> persia: it takes some minutes. I will inform you
<persia> salutis: OK.
<geser> stefanlsd: I don't mind, go on with merging it
<stefanlsd> geser: thanks :)  almost done i think.
<salutis> persia: upload finished successfully, but on 'revu.ubuntuwire.com' isn't appeard till now
<stefanlsd> What happened to libkonq4-dev? I see my intrepid only has libkonq5-dev...
<geser> stefanlsd: looks like the soversion of libkonq increased
<persia> salutis: It can take a few minutes for the package to get accepted or rejected.  That runs every 10 minutes.  I'll watch to see if it gets rejected.
<stefanlsd> geser: mm. looks like that prefers kdelibs5 also.  heh :)
<geser> looking more at it, libkonq4 was for kde 3.5 and libkonq5 is for kde 4. Does somebody know if KDE 3 is still in intrepid?
<salutis> persia: it's uploaded successfully. persia, thank you very much for help! thanks, man
<persia> salutis: Your upload was successful.
<salutis> persia: perfect! many thanks, persia
<stefanlsd> Anyone know anything about libkexif1-dev?  It has a depends on kdelibs4-dev (>= 4:3.4.3-2)  which prevents my update to showimg which wanted libkong4-dev (which no longer exists in intrepid - so moving to the kde4 stuff - libkonq5-dev) which means kdelibs5-dev...
<stefanlsd> I wonder if its easier to get libkonq4-dev back into intrepid...
<salutis> good evening :) I have a simple question - I have uploaded my package in MOTU. Should I ask someone for review, or ï»¿can I just wait for it and do nothing?
<jpds> salutis: A link to the REVU page would be a away to get reviewers... linked.
<salutis> jpds: sorry, I don't understand. can you explain it bit more?
<jpds> salutis: Have you uploaded the package to http://revu.ubuntuwire.com ?
<salutis> jpds: yes!
<jpds> salutis: What is the package name?
<salutis> jpds: thinkingrock
<jpds> salutis: Providing a link to this channel like: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=thinkingrock - would be a good idea.
<salutis> jpds: so, it's now provided :)
<salutis> jpds: and now I can only wait. right? (this is my first MOTU package, so I am new in this bussiness)
<Laney> salutis: Explaining what the package is sometimes gets people interested in reviewing
<IntuitiveNipple> Is there a quick way to update the po translations in a source package? The package has a template but the po files haven't been updated in several versions.
<salutis> so I fixed what I can at: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=thinkingrock. if there is something else for fix, leave a comment. thanks for reviews
<nhandler> I am trying to patch an application. The version in Debian is 0.9.4-1. Ubuntu has version 0.9.4-1build1. What version should I use for my edited version of 0.9.4-1buil1? 0.9.4-1buil2? 0.9.4-1ubuntu1?
<Laney> ubuntu1
<nhandler> I thought so, I just wanted to be sure since 'dch -i' sets the version to '0.9.4-1build2'
<directhex> iirc, "build1" is used to force a rebuild of a (unmodified) package; used in both debian & ubuntu
<directhex> so if there are now ubuntu changes, then it becomes a ubuntu1 package
<nhandler> Thanks directhex. The build1 version was an unmodified rebuild. I have used 0.9.4-1ubuntu1 as my version
<ScottK> That is the right way to do it.
<sebner> ScottK: Just some hours I wanted to start with courier and what did I see? BAMMMMMMM
<ScottK> sebner: You are quite welcome to it.
<sebner> ScottK: seems pretty finished to me :P Well, also other stuff todo ^^
<ScottK> sebner: Finished except for the actually working part.
<sebner> ScottK: working part?
<ScottK> We have a debdiff, but it doesn't build.
<sebner> ScottK: Didn't notice
<ScottK> If you could figure it out, that's be lovely.
<sebner> ScottK: I'll try but you know, I usually suck at making things build/fix stuff
<ScottK> You can't suck worse than me on this one so far.
<sebner> ScottK: well I'll try to apply the debdiff :P
<ScottK> Thanks.
<sebner> ScottK: but I feel bad. You know, before filing a sync bug we should check if we can fix anything but I discovered that I can't fix anything (several times). this made me depressed and led me mass-filing sync bugs(20 xD) :(
<sebner> ScottK: from the RC bug list though
<ScottK> Right.
<sebner> ScottK: debdiff applies without problems, btw
<ScottK> It'll build fine for a long time too and then get to maildrop and die.
<sebner> ScottK: I'll start a testbuild
<DnaX> hi at all
<DnaX> someone can review this package? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=ircp-tray
<jpds> good evening DnaX
<DnaX> jpds: in italy it's night ;)
<jpds> DnaX: Yep, and I'm about to head off to bed.
 * sebner too
<DnaX> understand....
<sebner> DnaX: Austria \o/
<DnaX> sebner: XD
<DnaX> so, for that package?
<sebner> DnaX: I'm no motu :P
<DnaX> uhm... someone else?
<sebner> ScottK: ping
<ScottK> Png
<ScottK> Pong even
<sebner> ScottK: there is a problem (or more) with maildrop but it dies later for me with:
<sebner> [ ! -f Makefile ] ||-/usr/bin/make clean
<sebner> /bin/sh: -/usr/bin/make: not found
<sebner> make: *** [clean] Error 127
<ScottK> It looks like it needs relibtoolizing.
<ScottK> jpds can tell you how much fun that is.
<jpds> ... pain...
<ion_> Perhaps the rule used to be â-$(MAKE) cleanâ (make clean, ignoring the return value) and someone added the [ ] test in front of it, mistakenly moving the dash along with the rest of the line.
<sebner> debian/rules says: [ ! -f Makefile ] ||-$(MAKE) clean
<ion_> Make it -[ -f Makefile ] && $(MAKE) clean
<ion_> I donât really see the value of the [ ] test in the first place, but whatever.
<ion_> Iâd just use -$(MAKE) clean
<sebner> well it should be
<sebner> [ ! -f Makefile ] || $(MAKE) distclean
<sebner> ScottK: can the "-" be the bad thing?
<jpds> sebner: "/usr/bin/make: not found" ?
<ion_> It is the bad thing, when it is in the wrong place. It should be the first character of the line.
<sebner> ion_: not necessarly. http://lintian.debian.org/tags/debian-rules-ignores-make-clean-error.html
<ion_> Hm, now that i think of it, that test actually has *some* value: in case Makefile exists and distclean fails, the clean rule fails.
<sebner> jpds: cool, hmm?
<ion_> Yeah, agreed.
 * sebner is testbuilding again
<sebner> \o/
<sebner> ScottK: well, now it dies at maildrop as you said ^^
<ScottK> That's where libtool comes in.
<sebner> right
<sebner> libtool can't find anything
<sebner>  command not found
<sebner>  , bla bla bla
<Kopfgeldjaeger> Are there some by-rule-of-thumb-guidelines when asking for becoming an Ubuntu member is not too awkward?
<sebner> ScottK: maybe we should ask the debian maintainer for help? :P :P :P
<emgent`> hello there
<sebner> emgent: \o/
<emgent`> heya sebner :)
<james_w> Kopfgeldjaeger, hi, I'm not sure what you mean, could you expand please?
<sebner> Kopfgeldjaeger: ubuntu universe contributor?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> james_w: Well. I think Ubuntu membership is really interesting, but I am not sure if I already really have made a "significant and sustained contribution to Ubuntu and the Ubuntu community"... sebner: Ubuntu Membership
<Kopfgeldjaeger> I guess rather not yet
<sebner> Kopfgeldjaeger: depending on what you've done so far
<james_w> Kopfgeldjaeger, you could read the logs of a membership meeting to see what other applicants have
<Kopfgeldjaeger> james_w: good idea
<Kopfgeldjaeger> sebner: Well, so far at least one new universe package, 1 main merge, 4 universe merges, i translated the rhythmbox doc (upstream) and am quite active in the german ubuntu community... But I hope I can make many more merges for ubuntu+2
<Kopfgeldjaeger> I guess that's not really much yet, so I asked what could be a good first aim
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-17
<sebner> Kopfgeldjaeger: maybe not that much, less. And cool, I know you from uu.de
<Kopfgeldjaeger> ;)
<DnaX> bye
 * DnaX go to bed
<sebner> DnaX: hf
<Kopfgeldjaeger> bye
<sebner> gn8 folks :)
<Kopfgeldjaeger> good neight
<bddebian> persia: You around by any chance?
<orly_owl> So MOTU is the people who maintain ubuntu universe and multiverse?
<Flannel> orly_owl: Yes
<persia> bddebian: WIth a bit of a delay: what's up?
<bddebian> persia: How much do you know about gettext/intltool?
<persia> bddebian: As little as possible.  What seems to be the issue?
<bddebian> persia: I'm trying to help upstream fix his build system to regenerate the .pot files and such and I've done what a lot of the docs say to do but it just doesn't seem like it's doing anything
<persia> bddebian: Hrm.  That one is beyond me.  I don't seem to have the answer in any of my standard reference spots either.  Does the package use autotools?  If so, acl seems to do it.
<bddebian> Yeah, it's autoconf.  acl the package?
<persia> acl the package.  Look in po/Makefile for the sorts of hints that are being passed.
<bddebian> OK, thanks man
<persia> bddebian: No problem.  Note that $(TOPDIR)/include/builddefs is a generated file, so you may need to run some of a build in order to have the right information available.
<bddebian> Well I added gettextize and intltoolize
<bddebian> to autoge.sh
<bddebian> +n jeez, I can't type
<persia> Does the build now call xgettext?
<bddebian> I don't think it calls shit.  He was calling intl-extract by hand to regenerage the files
<persia> Have you tried a run with the modified autogen.sh?
<bddebian> Oh yeah, I've hacked the crap out of it and the autotools files and it builds fine and runs fine, I just don't know if I'm actually getting the translations :-(
<persia> heh.  Now I understand.
<stefanlsd> the KDE stuff is a bit silly that ubuntu kde are following experimental by moving to KDE4 and sid is still got kde3.5 stuff
<persia> Are the .po and .pot files updated during the build (based on timestamp comparison)?
<persia> stefanlsd: Different release cycles: KDE4 wasn't ready early enough for Lenny, but is ready early enough for Intrepid.
<bddebian> persia: I'm checking that now
<stefanlsd> persia: yeah. just seems painful as we merge from sid against things that no longer exist in intrepid
<persia> stefanlsd: I know, but that's part of what happens when a Debian release is pending.  When Debian releases in late September, we'll see *lots* of package bumps in sid, but won't want to sync/merge because Intrepid will be mostly frozen.
<stefanlsd> persia: heh. fun :)
<bddebian> Hmm, well it seems to generate a new .pot file
<stefanlsd> persia: I was looking at merging showimg which is a kde package which seems dependant on libkonq4-dev which no longer exists in Intrepid (spoke with Riddell and its by design).  Any suggestions or options? It doesnt appear to compile under libkonq5-dev as once i move to kdelibs5-dev things break. I have emailed upstream author re KDE4 support.  I've tried to build it without libkonq and its also failing.
<persia> stefanlsd: That happens sometimes.  You'll need to check how the API changed, and prepare a port.
<stefanlsd> persia: port of what exactly?  the application in question?
<persia> Indeed.  showimg.
<stefanlsd> Wouldnt that be a function of the upstream app developer?  (No problem assisting, but he may not even want to continue the app...?)
<persia> Well, maybe.  This is part of the collaborative interface.  The only reason the app needs porting is because Ubuntu ships a different library, so from that perspective, it's entirely our job.  On the other hand, the upstream for the library is moving on, and so the upstream for the client will need to move at some point, or become obsolescent, so from that perspective, it's upstream work.
<persia> In cases like this, I think that the work ought be done by whoever can get it done first.
<stefanlsd> yeah. ok. Let me see what upstream says. the package in question may of been replaced similair functionality in other software or kde core functionality and if upstream has abandoned the project, no use in maintaining it if I have no other interest except for trying the merge.
<bddebian> Shite, it's not creating the .mo files though :-(
<persia> bddebian: That's an easier problem though :)
<bddebian> It is?
<persia> msgfmt -o target.mo source.po
<persia> %.mo : %.po
<persia> <tab> msgfmt -t -o $@ $<
<persia> Err, except without the -t :)
<bddebian> weird, that is all in po/Makefile
<persia> OK.  Does anything depend upon the .mo files so that they get built?
<bddebian> Hmm, no clue
<persia> pastebing po/Makefile
<pyc> howdy, is it OK to ask PPA failed build related questions here?
<persia> pyc: We much prefer questions about builds that fail in the primary repositories, but it depends on the nature of the problem: stuff that's too PPA specific usually gets ignored.
<bddebian> persia: http://paste.debian.net/14957/
<pyc> persia,  i see, so would be much better to ask SOYUZ?
 * persia wants a browser that cannot crash.
<persia> pyc: It depends on the nature of the problem.  Things that are too packaging-specific tend to get ignored there.  Better to just ask, and see what people say.
<pyc> ok
<pyc> was wondering what's wrong with this
<pyc> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/16877126/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-lpia.revel_1.1.0-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<pyc> so far i can only comprehend that the build failed because ..
<persia> pyc: It's an XviD issue.  Modify the build to echo config.log, and examine it.  Alternately, try building in a local lpia chroot.
<pyc> ok
<persia> bddebian: From the stamp-po rule it looks like you might want to fiddle with LINGUAS or POFILES, but I'm not sure (and I've run out of time for this session).
<bddebian> persia: NP, thanks man
<persia> To me it looks like it's configured to generate the files on request, rather than at build time.
<bddebian> Yeah, that was the issue
<persia> Fixing it is probably just a matter of adding some dependencies to the rules, so that when the .pot files are updated, it regenerates $(DOMAIN).pot, etc.
<bddebian> Uhm, yeah sure :)
<persia> (this is an expensive operation, but may be what you seek)
<persia> Also, right now all translations are copyright Yoyodyne, Inc. which may not be correct :)
<persia> "Uhm, yeah sure :)"?  Read the comment about $(DOMAIN).pot which describes it in some detail.
<bddebian> OK, will do, thanks
<persia> From line 410 or so.
<persia> Might just be resetting the definition of POFILES to not be empty.
<persia> Anyway, I'm off.
<bddebian> Laterz, thanks again
<superm1> hum what's the point of this motu membership renewal email if I'm just able to do it myself?  wouldn't it make more sense to default to yes, and have me opt out when I don't want in anymore?
<superm1> or to make me appear across some council that affirms my worthiness at least
<ScottK-laptop> superm1: No, just makes you need to at least care enough to answer a mail if you want to stay in.
<ScottK-laptop> Not everyone does.
<ScottK-laptop> superm1: IIRC you're maintaining DKMS now, right?
<superm1> ScottK-laptop, yup
<superm1> got some qualms?
<superm1> :)
<ScottK-laptop> Nope.  Need some help.
<superm1> sure what's up?
<ScottK-laptop> Klamav depends on the Dazuko modules for auto scanning.
<ScottK-laptop> AFAICT it's never worked in Debian/Ubuntu.
<ScottK-laptop> I'd like to make it work.
<superm1> dauko kernel modules i'm assuming?
<ScottK-laptop> Yes
<ScottK-laptop> http://dazuko.dnsalias.org/wiki/index.php/Main_Page
<ScottK-laptop> http://dazuko.dnsalias.org/files/patch-dazuko-linux-2.6.26.diff.gz is the patch.
<superm1> well the obvious first question will be is it possible to get these kernel modules upstream?
<superm1> as in mainline kernel
<ScottK-laptop> Not for Intrepid.  That's for sure.
<superm1> well at least in the ubuntu/ part of the tree?
<ScottK-laptop> Dunno.  I'm just sorting this out now and you suddenly appeared.
<superm1> IIRC server folk don't like compiling kernel modules on their systems
<superm1> and i would think that is a big target for this
<superm1> ah from what it appears this is nearly ready to drop into a 2.6.26 kernel tree like is present
<ScottK-laptop> That's what they claim, but I know zip about kernel modules.
<superm1> Kconfig and all
<superm1> well lets step into #ubuntu-kernel and I can try to get you started doing that first instead.  it's the better solution if possible
<ScottK-laptop> OK.  There.
<ScottK-laptop> LWN describes them as a "having relatively hostile attitude towards the suggested ways of moving their code into the treea"relatively hostile attitude towards the suggested ways of moving their code into the tree"
<pyc> a very stupid question , what is a local lpia?
<pyc> i know what a chroot is
<pyc> but local lpia ,  i really have no idea :))
<ScottK-laptop> The only LPIA I know is the Intel Low Power Architecture.  It's one of the archs that Ubuntu is built on.
<Hobbsee> lpia is an architecture used for -mobile
<pyc> how do i set that up? to debug a ppa?
<pyc> or is this a FAQ?
<Hobbsee> i assume you'd have to build a mobile thing - it might be in the #ubuntu-mobile FAQ
<superm1> you can build lpia chroot's though
<superm1> just need to point to the proper archive mirror on ports
<superm1> ubuntu-dev-tools in intrepid has support in mk-sbuild-lv to make one
<pyc> i'll have to wait for intrepid then? ;)
<superm1> pyc, well you can grab the ubuntu-dev-tools package from intrepid and run it on hardy
<superm1> its mostly a collection of scripts anyhow
<pyc> superm1,  i see :)
<superm1> but you should be able to build one yourself too if need be just with debootstrap
<superm1> just need to tweak the right arguments
<superm1> but if you've already got sbuild+LVM setup, the former that i suggested is much more preferable
<superm1> far easier
<pyc> superm1, do you have any idea why ppa would fail, even if its succeed on mine?
<superm1> pyc, depends on the build log on the PPA
<superm1> pyc, got a link?
<pyc> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/16877126/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-lpia.revel_1.1.0-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<pyc> persia already pointed out the xvid issue
<pyc> but why would it fail anyway, if the configure says xvid >= 1.x.x ?
<superm1> so is that xvid library not available on lpia then?
<pyc> in ppa?
<superm1> well did you add it to the dependencies in debian/control?
<superm1> that xvid library
<pyc> oops..
<superm1> and if you have, did you mistakingly indicate it for amd64, i386 only?
<pyc> no, i specify "any"
<pyc> that's most likely the problem not specifying xvid in control
<pyc> thanks ;)
<superm1> yup
<superm1> np
<nxvl> why i'm still a contributor for revu?
<nxvl> do i need to do something special?
<RAOF> Anyone feel like revuing a new mono package?
<RAOF> Failing that, anyone want to dispense copyright advice? :)
<RAOF> Hobbsee: I know you're here, so there's no use hiding.  Do you know of any tools for determining whether a library's ABI/API has changed?
<Hobbsee> RAOF: no.
<orly_owl> heh
<RAOF> Curses!
<Hobbsee> :)
<RAOF> I suppose I'll diff the headers, then :/
<RAOF> Well, that was painless :)
<RAOF> Here, shlibs file!  Come to me.
<ion_> raof: dpkg-gensymbols(1) might be useful.
<RAOF> Cool.
<rebel_kid> hey im a new programming, i know the basics of python and study more everyday, im looking to get involved in the devel of ubuntu and/or its applications
<RAOF> rebel_kid: You have a common misunderstanding of what we actually do as a part of Ubuntu; we generally don't actually _develop_ anything.
<RAOF> rebel_kid: That said, if you want to help, there's plenty to do :)
<RAOF> !contribute | rebel_kid
<ubottu> rebel_kid: To contribute and help out with Ubuntu, see http://www.ubuntu.com/community/participate
<rebel_kid> RAOF: thanks, the devel room topic said to go here, i would love to help in anyway, in development or here
<RAOF> rebel_kid: If you actually want to _program_, the way to help would generally be to find an upstream project and start helping there.
<rebel_kid> what do u mean upstream project?
<RAOF> I mean: none of the software in Ubuntu is actually _written_ by Ubuntu; we simple package up other people's work so that it's easy to use.
<rebel_kid> oh i understand that
<RAOF> So, if you want to do programming, you probably want to find a piece of software that you'd like improved, and improve it :)
<rebel_kid> speaking of which, want to package up one of my programs lol
<rebel_kid> jk, it doesnt even have a GUI yet
<RAOF> _Now_ we're cooking with #ubuntu-motu :)
<rebel_kid> if thats the kind of thing you guys do i would love to learn how
<rebel_kid> especially when i decide to distribute my program, i got couldnt find a good inventory program for ubuntu, so im writing it
<emgent`> moin
<gnomefreak> anyone have a clue why ubuntu-restricted-extras installs atles one .exe
<gnomefreak> ok scratch that most of the packages are .exe
<gnomefreak> here is a post of what it does http://pastebin.mozilla.org/517785
<geser> msttcorefonts
<gnomefreak> geser: i thought that was in archive
<ion_> The license forbids from even renaming them IIRC, so they arenât compatible for the archive.
<ion_> ...or putting into a package
<geser> but the "windows" fonts are only available as .exe from microsoft, so it downloads them and extracts the .ttf files
<gnomefreak> its in multiverse
<gnomefreak> geser: yeah i saw that
<foxbuntu> if anyone would be willing to take a peak at this for a revu for me, great appreciated: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythbuntu-log-grabber
<askand> Is there a reason msttcorefonts is not included in kubuntu-restricted-extras or can I go ahead and fix bug 231094 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 231094 in ubuntu-restricted-extras "Please add msttcorefonts to kubuntu-restricted-extras" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/231094
<jpds> askand: Since u-r-e has it, yes, please do.
<askand> Does this debdiff look ok http://pastebin.com/m57c51bcc
<jpds> askand: Could you possible attach it to Launchpad?
<jpds> possibly*
<geser> askand: the debdiff looks ok, so you can attach it to the bug for sponsorship (don't forget to subscribe the correct sponsor team)
<RAOF> Right.  One gnome-main-menu uploaded.  Yay.
<askand> jpds: it is attached now, wanted to know it was ok before attaching :P
<askand> geser: hm what would be the correct sponsor team for ubuntu-restricted-extras? Its in multiverse
<jpds> askand: ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<askand> jpds: tanks
<Hobbsee> askand: because i've long not seen teh point of installing non-free fonts, as u-r-e seems to be the more for enhancements of the non-free variety.
<Hobbsee> askand: i'd prefer to install ttf-liberation or something :)
<askand> Hobbsee: I guess it is for people who need to use msfonts, me for example have to use times new roman in the essays at my university
<Hobbsee> askand: ah yes, i guess there isn't a TNR font for htat.
<StevenK> But the liberation fonts are metrically equivalent.
<StevenK> That's the entire point of them
<askand> Isnt it better that liberation fonts are installed by default then and ms fonts is still in restricted package? Or is liberation fonts also restricted somehow?
<wgrant> Liberation was non-free a while ago, but IIRC that might have changed.
<ion_> Seems like Liberation is GPL-2 with an exception.
<stefanlsd> Has anyone got a suggestion as to why I am getting a build failure. http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/38217/   (i havent made any mods yet. just apt-get source, debuild -S -sa, and using pbuilder).
<gnomefreak> problem with zaptel package? as in there is a problem within that package
<stefanlsd> gnomefreak: that version is in intrepid. So i assume of would of built?
<stefanlsd> gnomefreak: or if its a sync, do we just use the deb as is from Debian?
<gnomefreak> 1.4.11~dfsg-1
<stefanlsd> yeah...
<gnomefreak> your using the right package
<gnomefreak> i thought it was a newline issue but its not, i dont think that warning means anything that would cause FTB
<gnomefreak> stefanlsd: does it build in chroot?
 * gnomefreak tries not to use pbuilder but its just me
<stefanlsd> gnomefreak: only tried my intrepid pbuilder...
<gnomefreak> it failed while trying to build zaptel
<stefanlsd> yeah
<gnomefreak> but the only thing that jumps out is the new line warning
<stefanlsd> gnomefreak: ok. thanks.  let me see if i can find out why thats happening
<gnomefreak> i would say try to build zaptel
<gnomefreak> ok im gone its weekend
<geser> stefanlsd: looks like the package FTBFS twice in a row
<geser> stefanlsd: pbuilder has a bug that it builts every package twice (pbuilder build --twice will build it once :)
<sebner> geser: still thinking about an ACK-script? ^^
<geser> sebner: yes, I just need a py-lp-bugs which works with current LP
<emgent> evening
<sebner> emgent: \o/
<emgent> heya sebner :)
<sebner> geser: ask \sh ^^
<stefanlsd> geser: aah yeah. that worked using --twice
<stefanlsd> here i am removing all these duplicate links and fixing all the errors :)
<emgent> stefanlsd: o/
<ScottK> mok0: I had done a detailed copyright review of gamgi that I thought I submitted to REVU, but either I didn't submit it or it was eaten.
<ScottK> mok0: Do grep -ir copyright * on the gamgi source and you'll find a number of additional licenses you duon't currently list.
<ScottK> mok0: You will also find one file that is not distributable and will have to be removed.
<ScottK-laptop> mok0: It's dat/cell/polymers/polyethylene_sulfide.cif that's not distributable.
<ScottK-laptop> OK, looks like the comment didn't get eaten, just I was dealing with a cached copy of the page.
<mok0> ScottK-laptop: I didn't see your message until now, thanks
<ScottK> Sorry to have bad news.
<mok0> ScottK: that's life :-)
<mok0> ScottK: I will contact upstream about the non-distributable file, it is probably a mistake
<ScottK> That would certainly be the best answer.
<mok0> ScottK: yeah, he updates his distro quite often, so he may do it quickly
<mok0> ScottK: Good you spotted that file. It is from the damned CCDC, it is outrageous that they impose this kind of copyright on public research data. Grrrrr
<ScottK> mok0: I highly recommend running grep -ir copyright * over any package you make.  It's often very instructive.
<mok0> ScottK: I thought I did, apparently not on the data files :-(
<ScottK> Well there are a number of other licenses that need to be added to debian/copyright too, so ...
<mok0> *blush*
<mok0> ScottK: the bitstream font files in the package are md5-identical to the ones in the package ttf-bitstream-vera
<mok0> ScottK: These font files are not installed by the gamgi package, however, instead there is a dependency on ttf-bitstream-vera
<ScottK> mok0: Then they should not be installed and you should use the packaged ones already.
<ScottK> Ah.
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> It still needs mentioning in debian/copyright (I think) since it's distributed in the source package.
<mok0> ScottK: I will look at the ttf-bitstream-vera package and see what they do about the license there.
<ScottK> OK.
<mok0> ScottK: yes I will mention it in copyright
<ScottK> Sounds good.
<mok0> ScottK: Have we started to use the Debian.source file now?
<mok0> It's been discussed on the dd list
<__iron> hi just a question, who can i get a listing about linux-interfaces
<laga> "redrum" like in "the shining"?
<Treenaks> also, why would you sponsor it
<therealnanotube> hey guys... so let's say i have a package, that depends on say, package A. but there are two actual packages that provide package A. how can i specify that my package "prefers" one of the two that provide package A?
<therealnanotube> is that even possible?
<laga> say A is provided by B and C
<therealnanotube> ok
<laga> then you can just say: depend on "B | A"
<laga> or "B | C | A"
<laga> not sure if that's a good idea, but it should work ;)
<therealnanotube> so then if i have "B | C | A", that means that it will try B, and will try for C only if B is not available?
<laga> i think so
<therealnanotube> what if B happens not to provide A in some cases - will it recognize that? or will it just go for B first no matter what?
<laga> that escapes my knowledge ;)
<therealnanotube> the actual situation is this: in gutsy 64bit, package linux32 is provided by unix-util, and by linux32. in all other versions of ubuntu, it is provided either by linux32 (feisty and earlier), or unix-util (hardy), but not both.
<therealnanotube> on gutsy, if i depend on linux32, it conflicts with unix-util, and removes a whole bunch of other stuff from unix-util as a result, which is undesirable.
<therealnanotube> so how do i make a package that says "depend on linux32, and take it from unix-util if it provides it, otherwise, take it from linux32" ?
<geser> therealnanotube: have you tried versioned dependencies?
<geser> Depends: util-linux (>= version_with_linux32) | linux32
<therealnanotube> geser: ah, interesting idea. that just might work! thanks :)
<therealnanotube> laga: thanks to you to, for trying :)
<therealnanotube> laga: *too
<CarlF1> i want to try building a .deb from http://debian.cs.binghamton.edu/debian/pool/main/c/couchdb/ - the .gz is sources that I need to apt-get suorce?
<tillux> heya. supposed I wanted to 'create' a gui for cloneZilla. what'd be the first step I'd have to make? or... what would you recommend me to read?
<andrew_sayers> I think I've found a bug in Vino with security implications - should it be filed in Ubuntu, and can someone confirm that I'm not being ridiculous?
<andrew_sayers> Basically, vino checks your password before asking the user whether to allow a connection, meaning that attackers can brute force passwords even if you specify to ask for a connection.
<andrew_sayers> Er, ask to confirm incoming connections.
<Laney> Probably best to talk to upstream first
<Laney> But LP has a facility for security bugs too, so you can put it there too
<andrew_sayers> Fair enough.  I'll go and create yet another account and password I'll never use again... :s
<CarlF1> what is the sources.list line?  this aint it: deb http://debian.cs.binghamton.edu debian main
<TomJaeger> Okay, I'm going to plead my case one last time.
<TomJaeger> The package that I'd like to advocate: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=easystroke
<TomJaeger> It's a gesture recognition application for X11 with a gtk interface.
<TomJaeger> It's not one of those programs that does the same thing as a million others before, there really isn't anything comparable in the archive.
<TomJaeger> The program closest to it is probably strokeit for windows, but I think easystroke is a lot more sophisticated by now.
<TomJaeger> It doesn't require editing config files and it can deal with arbitrary strokes, as it doesn't try to dissect them into line segments.
<TomJaeger> Reviewing the package should be very easy, I've looked over a lot of suggestions that were made for other packages and incorporated what was applicable to my package.
<TomJaeger> I've just released a new upstream version in which I got rid of all the code from other people, so the copyright file is really simple now.
<TomJaeger> There's a clear demand for the package to be intrepid: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=837032  (or you could google for strokit and linux)
<highvoltage> Goodnight.
<TomJaeger> Plus, I've put a lot of effort into this package (I even released a new (now obsolete) upstream version at one point because of licensing issues)
<TomJaeger> The package is also in my PPA if you want to check it out: https://launchpad.net/~thjaeger/+archive
<TomJaeger> So yeah, I'd really appreciate it if a MOTU would find the time to review the package and I won't bother you any longer. Thanks.
<CarlF1> http://packages.ubuntu.com is mia - should I tell anyone?
<CarlF1> im guessing there is a #u-admin or something
<cody-somerville> no, there isn't
<jpds> CarlF1: Close, #canonical-sysadmin, but I think they may be out for the weekened.
<CarlF1> thanks
<TomJaeger> Any tablet pc users in here at all?
<RAOF> CarlF1: That site is run by a volunteer, whose server is getting overwhelmed; he recently posted that he couldn't reasonably continue providing it.
<wgrant> RAOF: No it isn't.
<wgrant> It's now hosted by Canonical.
<RAOF> wgrant: Oh, cool.  That got resolved!
<wgrant> A while ago now, but yes.
<wgrant> So it's a bit more reliable now.
<jpds> It's been down for weeks.
<directhex> i use it all the time. it's most certainly NOT weeks
<SolarWar> once your package is uploaded from revu- what is the next step?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> Wait, and wait, and... or annoy some MOTUs so that they have a look at your package :)
<SolarWar> no, i mean, after it has been advocated by two MOTUs
<Kopfgeldjaeger> ah, ok
<SolarWar> :)
<Kopfgeldjaeger> A MOTU will archive it and then it comes into NEW. When the archive admins accept it, it will come into universe
<Kopfgeldjaeger> afaik
<SolarWar> is there a way to track its acceptance after its left the revu listing?
<Laney> SolarWar: You can look at the queues on LP
<Laney> Ubuntu -> Intrepid -> Show uploads  on the right, I think
<SolarWar> :)
<SolarWar> thanks
<TomJaeger> SolarWar, how /did/ you get two MOTUs to review your package?
<SolarWar> I filled a LP packaging bug, and then packaged it my self- the bug got assigned to someone and i had them look at my (got some comments) and then the bug got assigned to me
<SolarWar> and from there it was a bit of waiting and requesting people to review here
<SolarWar> i hear people have been really busy with the intrepids release and they haven't been having regular review days this cycle
<TomJaeger> Thanks
<SolarWar> np
<TomJaeger> trying to ask people here to review my package really hasn't worked out very well for me.
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-10
<artfwo>  hi! would anybody like to re-review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scantailor - an interactive post-processing tool for scanned books (c++/qt/cmake/cdbs) :)
<fabrice_sp> artfwo, you should ping nellery so that he checks the fix, and if he gives you the advocation, ping again vorian ;-)
<fabrice_sp> you already have one advocation ;-)
<artfwo> but it's gone, because I've reuploaded the package
<artfwo> nellery, could you please re-check the fix for scantailor?
<fabrice_sp> by the way, you alread had 2 advocations, and it got uploaded. What happened?
<fabrice_sp> Got rejected by archive admin?
<artfwo> well, it got rejected from the archive, because there was a CC-icon compiled into GPL binary
<fabrice_sp> ahh  ok
<artfwo> I have replaced it and the change was also accepted upstream
<artfwo> so there should be no licensing issues anymore (I hope)
<fabrice_sp> artfwo, as james_w` and nixternal_ already gave you an advocation, perhaps you could check with them if they are still willing to advocate the package
<artfwo> oh, I thought it's not okay to ping you guys individually in such a case
<fabrice_sp> well, if they already gave you an advocation, you can just ask them if they are  still willing to advocate it again. But as it was in march....
<artfwo> james_w`, nixternal_ would you like to advocate http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scantailor once again, hmm?
<nellery> artfwo: I'll take a look again
<artfwo> thanks!
<nellery> artfwo: ah, found another missing copyright
<artfwo> is there?
<nellery> artfwo: in imageproc/GaussBlur.cpp
<artfwo> oh
<artfwo> it uses code from the gimp
<AnAnt_> Hello, something wrong with packages.ubuntu.com ?
<AnAnt_> also rmadison doesn't seem to work
<mrooney> AnAnt_: I was just going to ask how to figure out which version of a package is in Karmic without it, it does seem to be down
<AnAnt_> mrooney: there's a tool called rmadison
<nellery> artfwo: and the google copyright is missing some years
<AnAnt_> mrooney: rmadison <package name>
<AnAnt_> mrooney: yet it doesn't seem to be working either
<artfwo> nellery, is it okay, to just extend the copyright line to "2006-2008"?
<nellery> mrooney: www.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/<packagename> should work
<nellery> artfwo: I don't see a 2007
<nellery> so I think 2006, 2008 would be better
<artfwo> okay
<AnAnt_> nellery: ah, thanks
<nellery> artfwo: crash_reporter/google-breakpad/processor/scoped_ptr.h has a few missing
<nellery> and that's all I found missing
<artfwo> do you think, anything else besides copyright requires fixing?
<nellery> artfwo: not that I can see
<nellery> still need to test it out a bit
<dholbach> good morning
<mrooney> nellery: thanks :)
<mrooney> dholbach: good morning!
<dholbach> ih mrooney
<nellery> hey dholbach!
<dholbach> hiya nellery
<fabrice_sp> Hey! Good morning dholbach :-)
<dholbach> hey fabrice_sp
<artfwo> nellery, do you mind re-reviewing scantailor? I have just reuploaded with an updated copyright
<nellery> artfwo: yup
<nellery> artfwo: looks good
<nellery> ack from me
<artfwo> thanks!
<ScottK> nellery: One ack for a re-upload is enough.
<nellery> ScottK: ok
<nellery> artfwo: I'll upload it then
<artfwo> can I track the status of the upload somehow?
<nellery> artfwo: once it's uploaded you'll see it at http://launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+queue
<artfwo> okay, will check it out then
<ScottK> StevenK: Any feelings on if a 26.5MB package that is just a packaged PDF doc that's built as an arch any package is worth a reject from Binary New with a note "Please may arch all"?
<lifeless> insanity is insane
<nellery> artfwo: it's at https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+queue now
<artfwo> wow, that was fast
<StevenK> ScottK: Err, yeah, that needs to be killed.
<ScottK> StevenK: It's  simplecommeubuntu.  Feel free to reject it or I will after I sleep.
<doctormo> ScottK: are you saying there is a pdf which is 25MB in a package? shouldn't the source be in there instead if it really must be a package?
<fabrice_sp> doctormo, ScottK is speaking about a binary package, not a source package
<doctormo> I see
<hyperair> who broke cups-pdf? it now prints blank pages!
<hyperair> hmm cups-pdf didn't change recently, so it must have been one of its dependencies..
<hyperair> or maybe it's cups itself.
<hyperair> hmm https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ghostscript/+bug/410556
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 410556 in ghostscript "Only blank pages print on Brother MFC-7420 (dup-of: 409962)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 409962 in poppler "poppler 0.11.2 produces blank pages with cups" [High,Confirmed]
<YokoZar> ScottK: mind if I poke you ~ the R packages a bit?
<YokoZar> I'm curious if there's still any left to sync from Debian
 * directhex recompiles YokoZar using ICC
<apw> anyone know when the next motu council meeting should be?  the documentation variously says every 2 weeks and also specifies the 2nd friday and 4th friday, yet there was one last week and that is still marked as the 'next' one ... confusing
<geser> apw: oh, good question, will ask the other MC members and update the page accordingly
<apw> geser, thanks
<ScottK> YokoZar: I think it's done. There were some in New it might be worth syncing if they get out in time.
<YokoZar> directhex: sorry I generate valgrind errors unless you're using gcc
<directhex> curses!
<directhex> i built mono with icc once. benchmarks were about 10% faster, except for one test which was 700% slower
<geser> apw: in theory the next MC meeting should be this Friday but if you planned to send an application you're late for this meeting. The meeting after that one is Thu, August 27th
<apw> geser, think there is any chance of sneaking onto the friday one, gonna be away for the next one
<apw> it would be hard for anyone to apply in time as the date wasn't clear till today
<apw> and indeed as was demonstrated by the last one, you can't use the algorithm to predict it :/
<geser> apw: the last one was made as the one before that did not happen
<geser> as we usually want at least one week to have time to review an application it will be unlikely in time for this week (and I don't know yet if this friday will happen, waiting on answers)
<apw> well the simple solution for me is to just list the dates i can do and they can tell me which works
<apw> life is too short to try and second guess
<apw> geser, do you know who moderates the email lists?
<apw> (motu ones)
<geser> the MC but only motu-council is moderated IIRC
<apw> hrm perhaps i am stupdi
<apw> geser, hrm, that is the one they ask you to email
<Laney> apw: your mail got through
<Laney> I don't think m-c is moderated
<Laney> at least i've never seen a moderation mail when posting there
<apw> it emailed me to say so :)
<apw> but if its through i can go back to sleep
<geser> Laney: it is: "Motu-council post from apw@canonical.com requires approval" but it also got moderated already
<Laney> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2009-August/002177.html
<Laney> you can check there
<apw> sorry for the noise ...
<Laney> maybe it's just unmoderated for subscribers
<geser> that might be
<Ng> --help
 * Laney eyes Ng 
<Ng> I failed at using irssi's help
 * slytherin wonders why netbeans would crash thunderbird
<ScottK> Apparently because it can.
<stochastic> does anyone have time to REVU any of these packages: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xwax       http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/a2jmidid      http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xjadeo        http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/slv2        and it's not mine but I'd really like to see it get included: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyphat
<doctormo> Where is the best place to talk about the deps when installing avahi?
<RoAkSoAx> cjwatson, grub-installer does not unhide the menu if other operating systems are installed
<cjwatson> RoAkSoAx: I thought I just fixed that today
<RoAkSoAx> cjwatson, I just upgraded grub and it does boot directly into Ubuntu and I have windows vista on one machine installed, and in other machine windows XP
<cjwatson> RoAkSoAx: if you upgraded grub, grub-installer is not involved
<RoAkSoAx> and in both, it boots directly into UBuntu without unhiding the menu
<cjwatson> RoAkSoAx: you need to do a bit of manual reconfiguration if you've been upgrading through karmic, I'm afraid. I'll post to ubuntu-devel-announce about it
<cjwatson> RoAkSoAx: basically edit /etc/default/grub, comment out GRUB_HIDDEN_TIMEOUT, and set GRUB_TIMEOUT=10 (or whatever), then sudo update-grub
<RoAkSoAx> cjwatson, ok will do. Though I just have to tell that before todays update it was working properly :)
<cjwatson> yes, I'm aware of that. I couldn't think of a particularly reasonable way to do the upgrade automatically.
<cjwatson> (why on earth are you reporting bugs on #ubuntu-motu, BTW?)
<RoAkSoAx> cjwatson, I just wanted let you know, since you did the last update :S
<RoAkSoAx> and thanks for the fix :)
<cjwatson> RoAkSoAx: right, better to use the bug tracking system in future though please - anyway, the jaunty->karmic case is what's important, which is bug 386789 and I'll edit the bug to make that explicit
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 386789 in grub2 "'grub2' does not carry over correct 'timeout' time from 'grub'" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/386789
<RoAkSoAx> cjwatson, btw I did not upgrade from jaunty, I just updated karmic. I've reported the bug here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/grub2/+bug/411584
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 411584 in grub2 "karmic: After update, grub2 does not unhide the menu when other operating systems are installed" [Undecided,New]
<cjwatson> RoAkSoAx: I understand that
<cjwatson> RoAkSoAx: my statement is that I care much more about jaunty->karmic upgrades than about karmic->karmic upgrades
<RoAkSoAx> cjwatson, oh I misunderstood then :)
<cjwatson> RoAkSoAx: and if making the former behave correctly involves sacrificing the latter for the moment, I'll do that
<RoAkSoAx> cjwatson, I understand. I just misunderstood :). Anyways, the bug is reported. Thanks again for the fix.
<mrooney> Is there a way to search installed packages by install date? Like packages I installed since Friday?
<ScottK> mrooney: For dates that recently /var/log/dpkg.log* should know.
<garyvdm> Hi - I did a uscan, and then deleted that file it download. Now I'm getting this error: http://paste.ubuntu.com/251009/ How do I resolve this?
<Ampelbein> garyvdm: remove the qbzr-1.13(.orig) directory
 * garyvdm tries
<garyvdm> Ampelbein: Thanks - that solve that problem. Now I'm getting another error, but let me try solve it my self first.
<garyvdm> Ok - I updated bzr-builddeb. Now I get this error: http://paste.ubuntu.com/251025/
<garyvdm> uscan in the parent dir works.
<Ampelbein> garyvdm: there is no 0.13 tarball at the specified location.
<Ampelbein> https://edge.launchpad.net/qbzr/+download has a 1.13 tarball though, is that it?
<garyvdm> yes - and uscan had all ready successfully downloaded it.
<Ampelbein> garyvdm: in your debian/changelog, the topmost entry must have the version 1.13 . can you confirm?
<garyvdm> Yes . Give me a sec, and I will paste it.
<Ampelbein> garyvdm: your uscan now looks for version 0.13 which doesn't exist.
<garyvdm> Top of changelog: http://paste.ubuntu.com/251029/
<garyvdm> Ampelbein: I ran uscan, and it downloaded 0.13
<Ampelbein> garyvdm: no it didn't, see your previous paste http://paste.ubuntu.com/251009/ (last line)
<Ampelbein> garyvdm: it tried downloading 1.13
<garyvdm> Thats what I can understand. I got that error when I ran bzr bd, but not when I ran uscan.
<garyvdm> *can't
<Ampelbein> garyvdm: uscan looks for the latest upstream version, which is 1.13
<Ampelbein> garyvdm: bzr bd looks at debian/changelog and looks for that version, in your case 0.13
<garyvdm> oops
<Ampelbein> garyvdm: and that version does not have a tarball for download
<garyvdm> Ampelbein: 1.13 should be 0.13 - Silly me
<Ampelbein> garyvdm: seems to be a release problem from the authors  of qbzr though. they claim it's 0.13 but the tarball is named 1.13
<garyvdm> That would be my mistake.
<garyvdm> Ampelbein: Thanks for the help. All working now :-)
<Ampelbein> garyvdm: you're welcome.
<jtimberman> Hello. How can I delete a package? I'd like a sync from Debian NEW rather than the package I uploaded to REVU? Package: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/merb
<jtimberman> sync request is : https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/411536
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 411536 in ubuntu "[Sync Request] Request sync of merb_1.0.12-1 from Debian NEW (main) for (universe)" [Undecided,New]
<jtimberman> yes that.
<RainCT> jtimberman: I've archived the package on REVU.
<RainCT> jtimberman: has the pacakge already gone through NEW though?
<hggdh> loic-m, things seem to have gone bad. I am sorry about that (got busy here), and I would like to keep on the discussion
<jtimberman> RainCT: Its in NEW, which is backlogged.
<jtimberman> so its not uploaded to any debian repos
<loic-m> hggdh: yes, my head is a bit hurting atm though ;)
<RainCT> jtimberman: I don't think we do syncs from the NEW queue
<hggdh> later, loic-m  ;-) now it is not the time (and I have to pack and get to my hotel
<loic-m> And my wife is looking at me reproachfully
<hggdh> LOL
<hggdh> we'll talk later
<jtimberman> RainCT: Ah, I misunderstood.
<loic-m> hggdh: I'll be AFK for 2 weeks, had to start today but will start 2morrow AFAIK if weather gets better ;)
<hggdh> brb
<loic-m> ping me in 2 weeks
<loic-m> nitey nite
<hggdh> loic-m, will do, thanks for the patience
<directhex> NEW is write-only
<loic-m> np
<jtimberman> So I understand, for packages that are in only Debian NEW and not in a Debian APT repo: Should I open launchpad tickets as [needs-packaging], and upload the packages I'm working with to REVU?
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-11
<directhex> jtimberman, how long's it been in NEW?
<jtimberman> Couple days, but they have an estimated 1 month backlog before it will be in Sid.
<jtimberman> Trying to get Chef and dependencies in Karmic. :/
<jtimberman> (And also in Debian while we're at it)
<jtimberman> so i unarchived the merb package, since its in NEW but not in an APT repo, and fixing the findings from REVU, but it still complains about the maintainer field. I used the value specified in the Ubuntu packaging policy manual.
<Laney> there's an update-maintainer script in ubuntu-dev-tools to do it for you
<jtimberman> oh
<jtimberman> It sets it to 'Ubuntu developers' not the MOTU team.
<jtimberman> Laney: i'm packaging for Universe, shouldn't it be set to the MOTU team, not Ubuntu Developers?
<Laney> it's in anticipation of archivereorg
<Laney> u-d-d is good
<Laney> goodnight
<Ampelbein> jtimberman: see https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2009-May/028213.html for the maintainerfield setting, along with https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArchiveReorganisation
<jtimberman> thanks Ampelbein
<jtimberman> i take it the policy will be updated to reflect that then? :)
<jtimberman> (at some point, not immediately)
<Ampelbein> jtimberman: i guess so, otherwise it would not make sense ;-)
<jtimberman> hehe :)
<jtimberman> no worries, thanks for the pointer.
<Hilikus> how do i add a PPA repo to the sources list inside my pbuilder?
<Hilikus> or it will use the same sources as the systemL?
<nellery> Hilikus: use sudo pbuilder login
<Hilikus> i was trying to avoid that
<nellery> then you can edit the sources.list from there
<Hilikus> is there no switch or somethnig?
<nellery> Hilikus: I think you can use --othermirror if my memory serves
<nellery> see the manpage
<Hilikus> i did, but the thing is, how do i add the public key?
<maxb> Either don't, and just ignore the warnings, or sudo pbuilder login --save-after-login and make changes inside the chroot same as you would on a real system
<jedc> Hi, i'm trying to learn how to package software and I am a little confused about the rules file. If the software I am packaging is already built what do i need to change in the rules file since I dont need to compile it?
<hggdh> jedc, you will need to rebuild it under the rules. No binary-only packages...
<jedc> ah i see, but it gets compiled when it get made into a package?
<hggdh> it will be built yes. You can use debuild -b, or a pbuilder
<porthose> jedc, I would suggest finding a package similar to the one you are trying to package and use it as an example :)
<jedc> hmm, good idea, i will see if i can find one that is similiar
<therm> Hello everybody out ther
<therm> e
<therm> I yesterday build my packages for karmic in my ppa and was wondering where they package eclipse-common-nls is for karmic?
<therm> it exists for jaunty
<therm> does somebody know about this?
<fabrice_sp> therm, it has been deleted from Ubutnu: "It's too old, upstream released 3.5 but eclipse package in Debian is not updated"
<fabrice_sp> well, really, it got deleted from Debian
<therm> fabrice_sp: lol, and now I will have to package it myself right?
<fabrice_sp> therm, you can upgrade the package, yes. I'm doing something similar for a package that didn't got updated since a long time in Debian, to have the latest version
<therm> fabrice_sp: thx for the information
<fabrice_sp> yw
<YokoZar> Hmm, I'm trying to update ia32-libs and it keeps bombing with "Unable to find a source package for qt4-x11" -- what's weird is that apt-get source qt4-x11 seems to work just fine
<therm> fabrice_sp: but how will I be able to get this to ubuntu or debian?
<fabrice_sp> therm, for Ubuntu, open a bug report, and attach the diff.gz file of your packaging
<therm> fabrice_sp: thx
<fabrice_sp> for debian, I don't know.
<therm> fabrice_sp: for me it is important that my packages run with ubuntu, but I would be nice to have to give it back to debian
<fabrice_sp> TheMuso, given the timeframe you have for Karmic, I would say make it for Ubuntu, and try Debian after
<fabrice_sp> TheMuso, sorry. Bad tab completion
<fabrice_sp> therm, ^
<YokoZar> ah hah, I see why... for some reason qtcore4 is version -0ubuntu2  while its source package is version -0ubuntu3
<YokoZar> Is that due to a build failure?
<fabrice_sp> YokoZar, yes
<therm> fabrice_sp: thanks a lot, I will try to do so
<fabrice_sp> YokoZar, in this case, the package has been uplaoded 3 hours ago, so it's not yet built
<fabrice_sp> therm, yw
<YokoZar> fabrice_sp: Oh, didn't realize the new source package would be moved into the archive before the binary was built
<fabrice_sp> YokoZar, the binary are built from the source, so first source, then, if the package builds fine, binary. :-)
<fabrice_sp> that's why it's better to look for source package is the package FTBFS :-)
<ScottK> YokoZar: I was curious if you are generally interested in R?
<YokoZar> ScottK: Yeah I'm big on that stuff I'm helping the RevoR guys get their stuff into Ubuntu
<ScottK> YokoZar: OK.  I know mok0 is interested in R also.
 * ScottK likes the idea of Ubuntu being a great R platform, but doesn't currenlty use it.
<YokoZar> ScottK: do you have an interest or were you just syncing packages then? ;)
<ScottK> Since Debian has such an active R effort from upstream, it seems a shame not to have it good in Ubuntu too.
<ScottK> If someone else will mind after it, I don't mind a bit.
<YokoZar> The debian maintainer for all these R stuff is more interested in them creeping into Ubuntu I believe
<ScottK> He is.
<ScottK> He was at the last UDS.  Did you see his plenary presentation?
<YokoZar> ScottK: Yeah, I was at his session as well (I think I was one of two Ubuntu devs there...I assume the other was mok0)
<ScottK> No, he didn't make it to UDS
<dholbach> good morning
<porthose> good morning dholbach :)
<dholbach> hi porthose
<wizztjh> hiii
<wizztjh> i need to find a mentor in UBUNTU!!!
<wizztjh> anyone can help me , haha
<wizztjh> i need to find a mentor in UBUNTU!!!
<dholbach> wizztjh: easy! repeating your request isn't going to make it any quicker
<RAOF> wizztjh: What specifically do you need?  Also, all-caps & repetition doesn't look very friendly.
<dholbach> wizztjh: did you check out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted and read the pages linked from it already?
<dholbach> wizztjh: I suggest you mail the motu mentoring reception and while you wait check out those links and start playing with the tools as explained in the packaging guide to get some more idea...........
<dholbach> oh well
<Laney> wow
<sebner> troll
<slytherin> what is with freenode these days? Or is the netsplit seen only on ubuntu channels?
<directhex> slytherin, freenode's been *good* lately!
<slytherin> Am I the only one who sees soo many quit messages then?
<artfwo> I see them as well, but that's been always happening in the east :)
<Daviey> If you fork the debian packaging for use in another similar, but different package.. what should you do about debian/copyright?
<Laney> keep the original debian/ copyright entries and add yourself after
<Daviey> Laney: so the "This package was created by.."  It won't cause problems if that person is unrelated to it?
<Laney> Daviey: If it's a new package I'd write a DEP5 copyright file anyway
<Daviey> well i guess i could do a DEP5 one, and mention in the abstract that it is based on the package XXX by YYY ?
<Laney> the important thing is just to keep the copyright and license of the original debian directory
<Daviey> it's not as if there is actualy much there.. but now i've seen it - even if i write the packaging from scratch, i'm still tainted :)
<Laney> I don't know that you need to mention that in copyright
<Laney> I'd be tempted to put it in the changelog entry though
<Laney> * Initial release, packaging modified from xxx source package
<Daviey> sounds sane
<Daviey> What Standards Version does DEP-5 become valid?
<Laney> it's still a proposal now
<james_w> if the packaging declares a license then you have to abide by it obviously
<james_w> e.g. if it is GPL then you have to make yours GPL
<Laney> indeed
<ximion> Has someone enough time to recheck the smile package at revu? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/smile
<ximion> I think it's ready now.
<j^_> hi, what would be a good way to get a package into universe, so far its only in a ppa
<artfwo> j^_, have you read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages ?
<krisives> I made a backport of a package from Karmic to Jaunty, what can I do to get that into the repo?
<krisives> It fixes a bug that many people are irritated with :D
<nhandler> krisives: Take a look at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports
<krisives> Thanks
<nhandler> You are welcome krisives
<krisives> Is there a way to get a list of backported packages?
<nhandler> krisives: What are you trying to do? Check if certain applications have already been backported? If so, I prefer to do 'rmadison PACKAGE', and check if it is in foo-backports
<krisives> I made a backport for nautilus-open-terminal, which had a very irritating bug with SFTP in Jaunty. This was fixed in Karmic, and I simply built the backport
<krisives> http://67.43.13.30/~kives/wp/2009/08/nautilus-open-terminal-backport-for-jaunty/
<krisives> Hehe, don't make fun of me :(
<krisives> I'm just trying to help
<garyvdm> Hi - Usan seems to be using a cached copy of the ?watch page". How can I get it to refresh
<garyvdm> *uscan
<hyperair> get rid of your caching proxy and retry
<hyperair> uscan does no caching
<slytherin> krisives: just search for package on packages.ubuntu.com
<krisives> slytherin: I've already seen that the package isn't backported yet
<slytherin> garyvdm: you can use uscan --verbose to get more details.
<Laney> and --debug for even more
<foolano> hi guys, it would be lovely if some of you could check the package I've uploaded to revu http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/libtext-dhcpleases-perl thanks ;)
<slytherin> directhex: what is the status of ikvm from the point of view of this bug - http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=269062
<ubottu> Debian bug 269062 in ikvm "ikvm: Provide java-virtual-machine" [Wishlist,Open]
<directhex> slytherin, it's still pretty useless for gui apps... and i don't know how compatible the command-line args are...
<directhex> i think it's an interesting idea which would frighten upstream! :)
<slytherin> directhex: if it is good for command line apps then it should have 'Provides: java2-runtime-headless'.
<directhex> i would hesitate to use the words "good for"
<directhex> it seems to work in my very basic checks, but i feel uneasy about anyone relying on it as "real" java
<slytherin> directhex: is it active upstream? I mean do developers expect bug report?
<directhex> yes, upstream is active
<slytherin> then I guess it is good to let users know that it can work as jre and they can file bugs against it. :-)
<directhex> what alternatives do i need to provide?
<directhex> and which command-line apps do you suggest testing?
<slytherin> directhex: java2-runtime-headless, java5-runtime-headless (if it is compatible), java6-runtime-headless (if it is compatible)
<slytherin> directhex: bsh is what comes to mind immediately.
<directhex> root@osc-bigmac:/usr/share/mkgmap# ikvm -jar mkgmap.jar --version
<directhex> svn
<directhex> well that one seems to work
<slytherin> bsh has at least started. :-)
<slytherin> And hello world has worked. :-P
<directhex> karmic?
<slytherin> jaunty
<directhex> it's much improved in karmic. feel like trying a backport for testing?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<iulian> Hi bddebian.
<slytherin> directhex: do you have backport ready?
<bddebian> Hi iulian
<directhex> slytherin, nope! ought to be simple to do though. i'll look at it later
<slytherin> directhex: wait, I can try in Debian (testing). I am leaving now for home. Will be back online in an hour.
<james_w> Jazzva: " The source is licensed under GPL v3, as pointed out by the upstream author
<james_w>  in the e-mail.
<james_w> "
<james_w> Jazzva: which email?
<Jazzva> james_w: was that related to some extension?
<james_w> yeah
<james_w> bugmail
<james_w> the one you uploaded the other day
<Jazzva> james_w: let me check. I think the new version has a license file. Did I miss to remove that comment from some file?
<james_w> err...debian/copyright
<Jazzva> james_w: yeah, found it :)
<james_w> Jazzva: accepting anyway, but there's no need to introduce doubt where there is none :-)
<Jazzva> james_w: Sorry about that, I forgot about that notice. I'll edit that and push to bzr.
<james_w> and if you need to reference an email in debian/copyright then include the email, don't just refer to the "the email" because we need the record
<james_w> thanks
<Jazzva> james_w: that's left from previous upstream version, when the license file was not present, and I completely forgot to remove it.
<Jazzva> james_w: thanks for accepting, and telling me how to do it right :)
<Jazzva> I'll fix debian/copyright now, so the notice will not be there in the next upload :)
<james_w> artfwo: nice job on debian/copyright for scantailor
<slytherin> james_w: what is specifically nice about it?
<james_w> it's complete
<james_w> :-)
<slytherin> :-)
<james_w> it was the first time in a while I didn't have to reject a package that had multiple licenses covering the included files
<james_w> normally people just include the main one, and don't check for others
<slytherin> Does anyone happen to have access to a sparc machine? I need to test a FTBFS fix. The fix will probably ready in an hour.
<artfwo> ah
<artfwo> it was complete back when you have first reviewed it james_w
<crimsun> slytherin: NCommander or TheMuso may
<artfwo> but the new upstream release included more works my other authors
<james_w> artfwo: still, good job
<artfwo> thanks, I hope it will make its way to the archive
<artfwo> huh
<artfwo> it has already?
<james_w> yep
<james_w> I just accepted it
<artfwo> great!
<artfwo> my first real ubuntu package ever!
<artfwo> and I hope not the last
<james_w> congratulations
<artfwo> and it already fails to build on armel:(
<fabrice_sp> Hi. I'm having some issue with mime types. if I manually run "update-desktop-database /usr/share/applications" and "update-mime-database /usr/share/mime", it works after installing my package, but in postinst, I only have the update-mime-database call. What am I missing in my rules files? and then
<chrisccoulson> fabrice_sp - that's unnecessary on karmic
<chrisccoulson> they should run automatically on package install via dpkg-triggers
<fabrice_sp> chrisccoulson, and in Jaunty?
<chrisccoulson> perhaps not in jaunty
<fabrice_sp> I'm testing the package in Jaunty
<chrisccoulson> in jaunty, i think you still need to call dh_desktop in debian/rules
<fabrice_sp> I'll check in a karmic VM, then
<chrisccoulson> but that is deprecated in karmic
<fabrice_sp> that makes sense: i saw a lot of 'dh_desktop is deprecated', but that's for karmic, you're right! I'll try with dh_desktop in Jaunty. Thanks!
<chrisccoulson> you're welcome:)
<stochastic> chrisccoulson, so if dh_desktop is depreciated in Karmic, what takes its place?
<chrisccoulson> stochastic - nothing
<chrisccoulson> all it did was add a postinst hook to call update-mime-database
<chrisccoulson> but that isn't needed anymore as update-mime-database happens via dpkg-triggers magic when you install any files in to /usr/share/applications
<j^> if i uploaded a package to revu and it does not show up, how can i find out why this is happening?
<j^> the package i uploaded is called oggvideotools
<geser> did you only upload the source (..._source.changes)?
<j^> yes only source, orig and diff, uploaded to a ppa before and that worked fine
<geser> and I don't know if it still the case, but you might need to login to revu once before you upload your first package so it can get your gpg key from LP
<j^> ah, that could be the issue
<j^> if that is the case, should i just upload it again?
<j^> am logged in non revu now
<geser> you can at least try it (else you need to wait for a REVU admin who can look into the logs)
<j^> after upload, does it take some time to show up?
<geser> the cron job who processes the uploads runs every 3 min
 * slytherin is glad that reportbug is finally working. :-)
<stochastic> I must say I'm starting to get dismayed about contributing to Ubuntu, it's just a little over two weeks from feature freeze but the bugfixes I've added to launchpad and the packages I've added to revu are all just sitting helplessly awaiting motu's action
<stochastic> I know you guys are busy, but isn't there a team that works through these contributions?  it seems like that's been absent this cycle.
<geser> there is
<geser> but like most other MOTUs they are doing it in there free time
<joaopinto> and the problem is not specific to this cycle, REVU is getting behind for some time
<stochastic> I understand that, after all, my contributions are done in my free time too
<geser> stochastic: I see that you are talking about new packages on REVU
<stochastic> it's not just REVU, the bugfixes that I've subscribed universe sponsors to have sat inactive for almost a month now
<geser> have you a bug number handy?
<stochastic> hold on, launchpad is being slow
<slytherin> stochastic: feature freeze just means no new versions of the packages. It does not mean bug fixes can not be done.
<stochastic> Bug #325004
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 325004 in denemo "Upgrade denemo package from 0.7.7 to 0.8.6" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/325004
<geser> REVU was always very slow on processing packages and I'm not doing seldom reviews as I prefer to get the packages we already have fixed instead of adding new one that nobody will look after later
<stochastic> Bug #148585
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 148585 in ardour "".ardour" project files are not recognized by GNOME (no file type association)" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/148585
<stochastic> geser, but major features of upstream software depend on new libraries like http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/slv2
<stochastic> Ubuntu is going to become an outdated operating system if the new libraries and formats don't get incorporated into the repositories
 * stochastic realizes he's ranting now
<geser> stochastic: the choice is sometimes not easy. I prefer no packages at all so users now that they need to compile it themselves or use some hopefully PPA (I know that opinion may sound hard) that to offer unmaintained and probably outdated packages from universe (where nobody will look at bugs)
<jtimberman> stochastic: Ah, but not everyone wants the most bleeding edge latest version of the software... I suppose thats what RHEL is for ;)
<jtimberman> But in 15 years of using Linux, Ubuntu is a far cry ahead of the curve when it comes to including the latest releases of software, generally speaking.
<slytherin> if you want more bleeding edge, try Debian experimental. :-)
<jtimberman> or gentoo ;)
<stochastic> Bug #325004 is a prime example that goes against both your arguments, that package has needed an update since hardy and the official website states "DON'T USE ANY VERSION OLDER THAN 0.8"
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 325004 in denemo "Upgrade denemo package from 0.7.7 to 0.8.6" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/325004
<norsetto> stochastic, feel free to work on it
<stochastic> norsetto, I've added my debdiff and it's awaiting upload, but it's sat inactive and I'm worried it won't make feature freeze
<stochastic> ^^ sorry, my diff.gz
<stochastic> Anyway, I didn't want to start a big confrontation, I'm simply expressing my slight dismay that all my attempted contributions to Karmic seem to be sitting stagnant in either launchpad or REVU
<mzz> jtimberman: gentoo stable isn't all that recent for most software, and for gentoo unstable it varies wildly
<jtimberman> mzz Indeed, my comment was intended t obe snarky ;)
<mzz> (please keep jokes about "gentoo" and "stable" being a contradiction to yourself :P)
<norsetto> stochastic, there are 160 packages in the sponsor's queue and I don't know how many in revu, and an handful of people looking at those
<stochastic> norsetto, so you're saying that the MOTU team is too small for the amount of contributions it's receiving?
<jtimberman> mzz: I rarely keep jokes about Gentoo to myself, but as that's well off topic, I'll refrain from further ;)
<norsetto> stochastic, your package is number 27 on the queue, so, just be patient and it will be processed
<james_w> hey norsetto!
<james_w> how are you?
<stochastic> norsetto, what about these packages awaiting REVU any likelyhood they'll make feature freeze: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xwax       http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/a2jmidid      http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xjadeo        http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/slv2        and it's not mine but I'd really like to see it get included: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyphat
<norsetto> james_w, hi there
<geser> stochastic: although there are around 100 MOTUs (incl. some core-dev) I don't know how many are currently really active and from those how many look at the sponsoring queue, probably too few :(
<norsetto> james_w, pretty fine, and you?
<james_w> good thanks
 * slytherin nukes one bug from queue, it is already fixed.
 * porthose waves at norsetto :) 
 * norsetto waves his queue at porthose
<hggdh> all, I was chatting with a Gnome bugmeister, and he told me gnome-volume-manager is completely orphaned upstream. Is it time to drop it from Universe?
<chrisccoulson> yes, gnome-volume-manager is not worth keeping around now
<chrisccoulson> james_w ^^^
 * ScottK waves to norsetto too.
<ScottK> Long time no chat.
<norsetto> hi ScottK, whats up?
<ScottK> Hey norsetto.  Keeping busy.  Trying to make a Kubuntu for netbooks this cycle.
<norsetto> ScottK, ha, that should keep you busy :-)
<ScottK> Yep.  Working pretty good right now.
<goatbar> Is this a good place for beginners trying to create new ubuntu source packages?
<crimsun> goatbar: sure, but some reading is expected
<goatbar> we are working on it.  I've been a fink developer (deb for Mac OSX) for many years, but that abstracts away a lot of directly dealing with creating debs and I haven't created a source deb before
<goatbar> the two of us have already submitted 2 bug reports for the documentation today
<crimsun> excellent
<goatbar> when building a source package as described in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/HandsOn, should the debian directory really be inside of the unpacked original source tree?
<jtimberman> goatbar: yes
<jtimberman> the debian directory stores all the packaging bits, and the source is untouched unless you create any patches (dpatch or quilt) for it.
<goatbar> Thanks.  We are trying to figure out how to source control the debian directory for our own work.  Is there a standard way of doing this?
<goatbar> if we have a bunch of packages that we are working with before they end up in ubuntu (assuming that they get approved down the road)
<jtimberman> a lot of the various packaging teams have different ways to do that, i don't think its really standardized. i have all my packaging bits on a repository on github, and i pull them down and toss into the package's debian directory.
<goatbar> that's basically what we thinking
<jtimberman> I'm sure someone more experienced than I can answer with a better recommendation, I just started working on packaging for Debian/Ubuntu a couple weeks ago.
<james_w> chrisccoulson: was that a request to remove it?
<chrisccoulson> james_w - yes, but don't worry about it yet - it still has some rdepends that i'm going to look at
<chrisccoulson> when I get a chance anyway ;)
<james_w> chrisccoulson: cool, thanks
<james_w> a bug report is better anyway, as it leaves a paper trail
<chrisccoulson> james_w - yeah, I think hggdh is looking at that. most of the rdepends seem quite trivial except one of them
<chrisccoulson> but it would definately be nice to remove it, as it really does more harm than good now
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-12
<ianm_> would anyone be interested in packaging this personal spanish tutor app?  http://linux.com/archive/feature/140574
<CarlFK> .py app uses some wx stuff.  what should the Depends be for "latest stable python-wxgtkX.Y that works with installed version of python" ?
<CarlFK> and how does this work: python-wxversion - wxWidgets Cross-platform C++ GUI toolkit (wxPython version selector)
<goatbar> with pbuilder on an up-to-date jaunty box, I'm getting complaints about being unable to get debhelper >= 7.  Is there an easy way to update the debhelper in base.tgz?
<goatbar> actual complaint is: pbuilder-satisfydepends-dummy: Depends: debhelper (>= 7) but it is not installable
<jedc> is it possible for a package to build-depends on itself?
<jedc> sorry if that got answered i missed it lost connection
<jedc> Does anyone know if you can create a package that depends on itself to build?
<jedc> say, once you had the first package in the repos?
<CarlFK1> that seems odd
<ScottK> jedc: It is possible, but extremely frowned on.
<CarlFK1> how would it ever get built the first time?
<ScottK> jedc: How do you boostrap the first one?
<ScottK> CarlFK1: Generally you get a Canonical sysadmin to hand build it (ain't going to happen for Universe) or your first upload includes prebuild binaries.
<CarlFK1> 'neat'
<ScottK> Painful.
<CarlFK1> I can imagine
<lifeless> ScottK: you can't upload binaries though, can you?
<lifeless> ScottK: or do you mean, in the source package?
<CarlFK1> I guess gcc is like that.
<ScottK> lifeless: I mean in the source packages.
<CarlFK1> I am having gentoo flashbacks
<ScottK> Pain all around.
<lifeless> CarlFK1: gcc can boostrap and cross compile with any C compiler
<ScottK> We really try to avoid this.
<CarlFK1> generally too much trouble
<ScottK> fpc is an example of a package that had to be bootstrapped manually.
<ScottK> It was broken for several releases before it got done.
<jedc> well, i am trying to package a scheme implementation written mostly in scheme, it can be build using mzscheme (for the first one), but is much easier to build using itself
<jedc> ok, so better idea is just do it using mzscheme?
<ScottK> That's doable
<ScottK> Do the first one with mzscheme
<ScottK> Painful, but not impossible.
<StevenK> Build-Depends: itself | mzscheme and a rules that can deal either way could work, too
<jedc> hmm, thanks guys for the info and advice
<dholbach> good morning
<fabrice_sp> good morning dholbach !
<dholbach> hiya fabrice_sp
<goatbar_> got a basic package going today in the style of Ubuntu... http://schwehr.org/blog/archives/2009-08.html#e2009-08-11T19_28_03.txt
<fabrice_sp> I have a lot packages that needs a sync from Debian, but build depends as a chain (package c depends on b to build and b depends on a to build, and a and b are not in Ubuntu, but are in Debian). Should I open 3 sync requests for each package? Or only one with the 3 packages?
<ScottK> 3 sync requests.
<fabrice_sp> ScottK, and I put a reference to each other, saying "you have to sync this bug first, then this, ..."?
<fabrice_sp> I'm trying to get built maven-plugin-tools, and apart from the self dependency, it miss at least 6 packages ...
<fabrice_sp> requestsync is broken in karmic?
<fabrice_sp> not anymore after an apt-get upgrade...
<ScottK> fabrice_sp: Yes.
<fabrice_sp> ok. Thanks ScottK
<ScottK> !backports
<ubottu> If new updated Ubuntu packages are built for an application, then they may go into Ubuntu Backports. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports - See also !packaging
<hyperair> cjwatson: ia32-libs is now effectively without the pulseaudio alsa plugins, and lib32asound2-plugins doesn't have them either.
<ivoks> what could be the reasons for dpkg-source to build native package?
<ivoks> package versioning is correct
<ivoks> dpkg-source: info: using source format `1.0'
<ivoks> format 1.0 is native, right?
<ivoks> nah, it can be both, silly me :)
<cjwatson> hyperair: right, it's on my list, after alpha 4 ...
<hyperair> okay
<hyperair> =)
 * ivoks <- idiot :)
<hyperair> ivoks: format 1.0 is the .dsc/.diff.gz/.orig.tar.gz or .dsc/.tar.gz format
<ivoks> hyperair: i know
<ivoks> hyperair: i've solved the issue
<hyperair> format 3.0 is the one which uses quilt
<ivoks> it was a typo :/
<hyperair> ah
<ivoks> - instead of _
<ivoks> :)
 * hyperair wonders what format 2.0 is
<ivoks> man dpkg-source
<hyperair> ah
<hyperair> right
 * hyperair hopes that dak would hurry up and get format 3.0 support
<siretart`> hyperair: soyuz love for format 3.0 would be even better :-)
<hyperair> siretart`: well it'll have to come before dak implements it or autosyncs will be painful.
<siretart`> indeed
<dholbach> nhandler: can you get http://ubuntupackaging.wordpress.com/2009/08/12/on-call-review/ on the fridge? :)
<highvoltage> I just discovered dpkg.org, it's quite cool: http://www.dpkg.org/dpkg/DPKG?action=fullsearch&context=180&value=dpkg&fullsearch=Text
<highvoltage> well some of the pages at least like http://www.dpkg.org/dpkg/ConffileHandling
<dholbach> persia`: did the packaging training session about upgrading packages happen?
<dholbach> there's no log at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Packaging/Training/Logs yet
<highvoltage> dholbach: how do you keep tabs on all these things? how do you keep yourself organised? you seem to be involved in so many things and yet you seem to be on top of everything so effortlessly
<mok0> highvoltage: he has superpowers :-)
<mok0> highvoltage: I struggle to keep on top of ONE thing :-)
<highvoltage> This dholbach has Super Cow Powers.
<highvoltage> mok0: heh, I can relate :)
<dholbach> highvoltage: I wrote a bit about it in http://daniel.holba.ch/blog/?p=455
<dholbach> (the last part)
<highvoltage> I guess I'll have to give GTG a shot myself then
<jpds> StevenK: Do you plan to update gnome-do-plugins too?
<StevenK> jpds: Yes
<jpds> Awesome.
<persia`> dholbach, There weren't enough attendees.  We talked a bit about other things, but didn't do a proper upgrade training.
<dholbach> persia`: ok
 * slytherin is glad to see persia` back in action. :-)
<sebner> huhu persia` \o/
<persia`> Um.  "in action" isn't the best way to describe it, but I am about.
<sebner> in action = online and writing in the channel ^^
<persia`> Ah :)
<slytherin> In action = sharing the wisdom with community. :-)
<sebner> uploading stuff and breaking the archive \o/
<persia`> RIght.  That's more how I usually think of "in action".
<dholbach> thanks nhandler
<nhandler> No problem dholbach
<bdrung_> dholbach: hi
<dholbach> hey bdrung_!
<dholbach> how are you doind?
<dholbach> doing
<bdrung_> dholbach: good. the exams are behind me. i have time for packaging. ;)
<dholbach> yeeeeehaw! :-)
<bdrung_> dholbach: when i manage to setup the network for kvm i will try out harvest
<dholbach> that sounds great
<dholbach> thanks a lot for jumping in to help out
<dholbach> james_w: ^ seems we found one Harvest Hero already!
<dholbach> :-)
<bdrung_> dholbach: ;)
<bdrung_> dholbach: seams that i am hacking on basic things. harvest, mozilla-devscripts, ...
<bdrung_> dholbach: i plan to apply for motu. what do you think?
<dholbach> bdrung_: I think that's a fantastic idea
<bdrung_> dholbach: ok, then i start writing it.
<dholbach> :-)
<slytherin> ttx: Do you plan to ask for sync of jetty from Debian unstable, since your packages only provide libraries and we have outdated jetty in karmic.
<pi-meson2> I'm trying to package up my python program, and have read the debian python policy, and I still don't quite understand the handling of "private modules" for my python package
<bdrung_> dholbach: do you come to the stammtisch today?
<dholbach> bdrung_: no, unfortunately not - we have Mimi's cousin visiting us tonight
<pi-meson2> Can anyone point me to an example of a python program that ships a private module, so I can see how it modifies the sys.path to enable the import?
<ttx> slytherin: not for karmic... jetty6 must reach main and at this point the jetty6 debian packages are not good enough. But for karmic+1, we'll definitely sync
<slytherin> ok.
<ttx> I'll spend a few cycles qa it in debian next month
<slytherin> I was just asking from point of view of solr merge.
<slytherin> we have a solr-jetty package which is not present in Debian because jetty was previously removed from Debian.
<POX> pi-meson2: see PAPT repository - you'll find losts of examples there (patching sys.path is avoided in most of them)
<POX> see also http://lists.debian.org/debian-python/2009/03/msg00091.html (search for "current")
<POX> PAPT repository = http://svn.debian.org/viewsvn/python-apps/packages/
<pi-meson2> POX: fantastic, thanks
<POX> "--install-lib=/usr/share/foo --install-scripts=/usr/share/foo" added to setup.py's arguments should be enough (if script name != module name)
<POX> (and then dh_link /usr/bin/bar /usr/share/foo/bar)
<pi-meson2> okay, so the crazy part here is that, at the moment, I'm not actually using setup.py, but rather cmake
<pi-meson2> I might have to change that
<POX> doesn't matter much
<POX> the idea is to have script and module in the same directory
<POX> /usr/share/foo/script and /usr/share/foo/module - this way you don't have to patch anything
<pi-meson2> and then /usr/bin just symlinks to the script?
<POX> yes
<pi-meson2> *whew* okay, that makes a ton of sense
<pi-meson2> and prevents a lot of nastyness, too
<pi-meson2> thanks!
<POX> join PAPT and you'll get more comments later :)
<slytherin> Does anyone exactly how the buil-depends-indep work from point of view of Debian buildd?
<geser> according to policy they are only needed to build arch:all packages. In Debian they're a build by the uploader, so not installed on the buildd at all while on a Ubuntu buildd only on i386 (as it builds arch:all)
<geser> practise may differ (as usual)
<slytherin> hmm, looks like this is the problem then. One of the package FTBFS on non-i386 Debian buildd because there is no JDK. The reason is default-jdk is in build-depends-indep.
<Laney> but it's really required to build a non-arch:all package?
<slytherin> Laney: Actually the build process is continuous. It builds arch:all as well as arch:any component in one go.
<Laney> is that policy compliant?
<slytherin> in what way is it non-compliant?
<Laney> any depending on all I thought was a problem
<slytherin> Laney: or the reverse?
<Laney> maybe
<slytherin> Consider this. There is a jar file which will go in arch:all package. And there is a .so file which will go in arch:any package. Both these files are built in a continuous process.
<slytherin> the arch:all package depends on arch:any in this case.
<directhex> slytherin, the problem with any depending on all is NMUable version numbers
<slytherin> right, but here all depends on any.
<directhex> slytherin, if a binNMU of javafoo-native is uploaded with version 1.0-1+b1, but javafoo-java 1.0-1 expects javafoo-native=1.0-1, then you have a problem
<directhex> so you can make that NMU-safe by breaking your build process to depend on >=1.0-1, << 1.0-2~
<slytherin> Hmm, will have to think about this. There are at least 2 other such packages.
<directhex> however, the NMU is the key problem here, and why breaking the build system to allow building the binary-only part should be allowed
<directhex> i.e. it's okay for the arch:all build to do the arch:any build first, but NOT okay for the arch:any build to also build the arch:all
<directhex> i don't know if it actually breaks policy, but it can be... ungood
<directhex> as an example, ikvm in Sid is on 9 arches, and only 3 in lenny - and the extra arches were enabled by splitting the arch:all build
<directhex> (it needs about a gig of ram to build, and crashed on most buildds mid compile) - but i386 buildd had the ram
<slytherin> directhex: But in case of Ubuntu non-i386 buildd actually build arch:all packages.
<directhex> mmm, nope
<slytherin> So should I then use some technic in rules file to specify which target to run for arch:all and which to run for arch:any?
<directhex> slytherin, yeah - the buildd will run "debian/rules build" then "debian/rules binary-arch" on non-i386 arches. so make sure your build rule doesn't do the indep stuff
<slytherin> I am using cdbs
<directhex> on i386 it does "debian/rules build" then "debian/rules binary"
<directhex> cdbs i can't help i'm afraid
<Laney> If we had cdbs 0.4.59 then you could set DEB_BUILD_DEPENDENCIES
<Laney> I even did the merge but there's a build failure I don't know how to fix :<
<slytherin> or there is easier option to change arch:all package to arch:any.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Laney> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hello Laney
<iulian> Hey bddebian.
<bddebian> Hi iulian
<nicolasvw> Hello, can a package in universe have a depends on a package in multiverse?
<james_w> nope
<dreamcat4> ping: nixternal
<nicolasvw> james_w, thanks
<Ryan52> how do I request NEW packages be synced from debian to ubuntu?
<slytherin> Ryan52: command 'requestsync'
<Ryan52> same way as normal? I'd assume that there's no package to assign the bug to, tho...
<Ryan52> slytherin: it doesn't work on my system because I don't want to install random .debs from ubuntu.
<Ryan52> I just need to know, if there's no package to assign the bug to, where do I assign it?
<directhex> Ryan52, NEW as in ftp-master.debian.org/new.html ?
<Ryan52> yes.
<Ryan52> well no.
<Ryan52> there's a package that just got ACCEPTED into Debian
<Ryan52> but it's not in Ubuntu
<Ryan52> I want it to be.
<Laney> just use requestsync
<Ryan52> Laney: 08:08 < Ryan52> slytherin: it doesn't work on my system because I don't want to install random .debs from ubuntu.
<Laney> oh ok
<Laney> then file a bug manually against Ubuntu
<slytherin> Ryan52: Ok. Then the package should be 'Ubuntu'.
<Ryan52> ok, thanks.
<Laney> but how are you testing that your sync works without an ubuntu environment?
<Ryan52> I'm not.
<Ryan52> :D
<Laney> Â¬_Â¬
<slytherin> Ryan52: make sure you subscribe the ubuntu-universe-sponsors team to the bug.
<Ryan52> nah, I just bother nhandler :)
<bdrung> dholbach: my application text is ready (hopefully).
<dholbach> bdrung: could you send me an email about it - I'm happy to comment on it tomorrow
<dholbach> I'm just about to head out
<bdrung> dholbach: i will.
<dholbach> thanks muchly!
<bdrung> dholbach: would the 27.8. to early?
<dholbach> bdrung: not at all - just ask a few folks to weigh in on the application and apply
<bdrung> dholbach: ok
<dholbach> ok... I need to head out now
<dholbach> see you around!
<bdrung> dholbach: cu
<dholbach> bye
<geser> stochastic: I tried your patch for ardour (bug #148585) but it FTBFS
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 148585 in ardour "".ardour" project files are not recognized by GNOME (no file type association)" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/148585
<stochastic> geser, what does FTBFS mean?
<geser> Fails To Build From Source
<stochastic> uh oh
 * stochastic runs off to check why
<geser> see my comment in the bug
<geser> it's probably because of the inclusion of gnome.mk
<geser> but I don't know if it's needed for sharedmimeinfo and if yes how to fix it
<stochastic> geser, from what I've read on cdbs that's the line to include for sharedmimeinfo
<geser> but apparently it doesn't work as intended for package without a configure script (ardour uses scons as far as I can tell)
<stochastic> geser: chrisccoulson was saying that running dh_desktop is depreciated in Karmic, therefore probably including gnome.mk isn't needed
<stochastic> ^^ the therefore is my interpretation, not what he was saying
<geser> try it out and check if the sharedmimeinfo is correctly included in the package
<alkisg> I'm thinking of starting a new pygtk-based project, which may be ready in 6 months or so. Should I use python 3 or python 2? I'm asking because I think that python 3 won't be shipped by default in even Ubuntu 10.04...
<jtimberman> Ohai, looks like there's a bug in the runit package on karmic. I added a patch to this bug: #406621, but not sure the process of getting the package updated.. should i repackage per the MOTU Contributing page?
<jtimberman> (i'm not the maintainer of runit, just a user)
<geser> alkisg: does pygtk work already with python3? if you don't plan to get your app into main, you can use python3 if you want as it's already in universe (but I don't know if the packaging tools do the right thing for python3)
<stochastic> geser, my pbuilder doesn't want to successfully build the original ardour-2.8-0ubuntu1 package, does yours?  I can't test the mime info otherwise
<alkisg> I guess I'd better stick with 2.x... :)
<geser> stochastic: I just checked if the same error happens in the 2.8-1ubuntu1 and aborted when configure got running (didn't let it build to the end)
<stochastic> geser, half way through it errors out on some invalid char conversion
<stochastic> is this a bug in the package that needs to be fixed before release?
<stochastic> or a bug in my pbuilder?
<geser> jtimberman: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
<jtimberman> geser: the runit package is already in universe.
<geser> stochastic: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=505960 perhaps?
<ubottu> Debian bug 505960 in ardour "FTBFS with GCC 4.4: missing #include; overloaded 'bitset(int)' is" [Unknown,Open]
<jtimberman> it doesn't need a sponsor for a bug fix does it??
<geser> jtimberman: sponsor == some dev who uploads a bug fix for you (after review)
<jtimberman> geser: okay, hopefully some attention will be given to this then? its a pretty serious bug for anyone using runit, as it won't start properly when the package is installed.
<stochastic> geser that debian bug doesn't have the same error that I'm getting.  I just uploaded to my PPA to see if the same thing happens there
<logari81> hi, I am looking for an example multi-binary source package which uses debhelper and builds both arch-dependent and arch-independent binary-packages
<geser> logari81: look for packages building a -doc package, it should be easy to find one using debhelper
<geser> logari81: e.g. mcpp (but I didn't check if it's a good example)
<logari81> geser: mcpp seems just fine..., it is also debian native
<fabrice_sp> Hi. Can some MOTU have a look at bug #412347 and Bug #412352? This are the first step for more than 7 sync/merge after. Thanks :-)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 412347 in ubuntu "Sync libstax-java 1.2.0-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/412347
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 412352 in ubuntu "Sync maven-repo-helper 0.7 (universe) from Debian unstable (main) (to sync after bug #412347)." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/412352
<geser> fabrice_sp: done
<fabrice_sp> geser, thanks :-)
<fabrice_sp> I'm trying to fix all the maven packages, and it's a real mess!
<geser> good luck with that
<jbernard__> if there's a needs-packaging request for a package that's currently in debian NEW, is it proper to wait for it to enter unstable and request a sync, or upload a candidate to REVU and allow the debian version to override it later?
<pochu> jbernard__: if it's not high in the queue, I'd upload it to Ubuntu now as FeatureFreeze will start soon and after that it's hard to get a new package in
<pochu> you can request a sync later when it's accepted into Debian
<jbernard__> it usually takes a week, which it's nearly at now, but I never know the current ftp-master load or how fast they'll get to it
<pochu> a week to be processed? I'd rather say a month :)
<jbernard__> well then i should definately get my package uploaded to REVU soon ;)
<jbernard__> thanks for the input, i appreciate it
<pochu> yw
<__theIdiotBox> hello everyone. i want to give back to the opensource community... and i think i can do that by contributing to the repo maintenace/building community...thats why i'm here to learn and get started...can someone help me get started.
<fabrice_sp_> !contributing
<ubottu> Sorry, I don't know anything about contributing
<fabrice_sp_> __theIdiotBox, look at the subject (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing )
<__theIdiotBox> fabrice_sp_, any useful link
<__theIdiotBox> thank you : fabrice_sp_
<fabrice_sp_> yw :-)
<therm> fabrice_sp_, hello again, you told me yesterday to repack eclipse-common-nls because it has been kicked out ouf debian
<therm> fabrice_sp_, now there is a problem, it seems to be no upstream source greater than this
<therm> fabrice_sp_, should I maybe build the old version for ubuntu? At least I need it
<ripps> Does anybody know how to use gpg-agent and pinentry over ssh. I'm trying to pull bzr packges, build, sign and upload them from a remote machine
<MementoMori> hi
<MementoMori> I've read http://davidsiegel.org/100papercuts-round6/ and I'd like to help. Anyway I don't know how to set up my local devel environment. Are there guidelines about it?
<Quintasan> hmm, debuild -S -s -k$GPGKEY starts with clean and it fails because I didn't build it yet, how do I ommit clean?
<MementoMori> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/PatchSystems seems a good source of info
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-13
<nhandler> Any ideas why padre is failing to build in my PPA (http://launchpadlibrarian.net/30258686/buildlog_ubuntu-karmic-i386.padre_0.42-1~ppa1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz). It says that libalien-wxwidgets-perl (>= 0.39) is not available, even though version 0.42+dfsg-1 is in karmic
<zul_> anyone seen ajmitch?
<goatbar_> Is there an official field that can be used in the control file that gives the source URLs for download?
<micahg> for uscan?
<micahg> goatbar_: ^^^
<goatbar_> micahg: not sure what uscan is, but we are trying to figure out a reasonable way to automate pulling the source so we don't have to checking the original tar with debian tree while we are working on these
<micahg> check out the debian/watch file
<goatbar_> ok... in the debian trees or ubuntu?
<micahg> in the source of the package for ubuntu, there is a debian folder which controls the package
<micahg> in that folder you can set a watch file and point it to download updated tarballs for you
<goatbar_> gotchya.  thanks
<micahg> is that what you're looking for?
<goatbar_> trying to remember how to get there
<goatbar_> what's the url?
<micahg> for what?
<goatbar_> I tried "apt-get source watch" and it didn't pull the deb info
<micahg> no
<micahg> for whatever package you have, you have a debian folder
<micahg> and you can add a watch file
<micahg> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Howtos/DebianWatch
<micahg> in the same directory as the control file
<goatbar_> okay?  I thought you were meaning that I should pul the source debian for the "watch" package
<micahg> no, sorry for the confusion
<micahg> is it clear now?
<goatbar_> ah... yes.  Thanks!
<micahg> great! :)
<goatbar_> the packaging for fink on mac uses debs, but does packaging very differently, so I'm working on trying not to think in the fink packaging style.  uscan looks like what I want
<fabrice_sp> Hi. Some archive admin here? I'd like to have packages in bugs #412352 and #412347 sync ASAP, as there is still something like 10 packages behind those 2 (a lot of java package in Debian are using maven-repo-helper now).
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 412352 in ubuntu "Sync maven-repo-helper 0.7 (universe) from Debian unstable (main) (to sync after bug #412347)." [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/412352
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 412347 in ubuntu "Sync libstax-java 1.2.0-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/412347
<TheMuso> /c/c
<dholbach> good morning
<fabrice_sp> good morning dholbach !
<dholbach> hey fabrice_sp
<dholbach> hi mok0
<Hobbsee> hi dholbach!
<dholbach> hi Hobbsee
<\sh> moins
<stochastic> does anyone know if sharedmimeinfo gets updated automatically in Karmic?  or what the proper way to get it refreshed in cdbs is if it doesn't?
<dholbach> persia`: are you going to re-run that session? ara just asked about the logs
<stochastic> does any motu with a spare minute and a kind heart want to REVU one of these: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xwax       http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/a2jmidid      http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xjadeo        http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/slv2        and it's not mine but I'd really like to see it get included: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyphat
<alkisg> Good morning. If a package "P" recommends package "R", is there any bug/way that a user may install "P" and not have "R" automatically installed? (assuming that R doesn't conflict with any other package in the system)
<ScottK> Yes
<alkisg> When does that happen?
<ScottK> You can turn installing recommends off is one way
<directhex> --without-recommends
<alkisg> Ah ok, but in a default installation (e.g. from within ubuiqity or d-i) that won't happen, right?
<directhex> but Recommends are for "you really probably want this but it isn't vital" situations. perhaps you should use a Suggests if the requirement isn't that strong?
<alkisg> No no it is that strong, we want package "R" to be installed but give the option to the user to remove it later on
<directhex> the default was switched a release or two ago to recommends-by-default. certainly d-i will do it
<Hobbsee> you can remove it later on, with no problem
<directhex> but if the recommends isn't available from the install media, it'll be skipped
<alkisg> Thanks a lot to all of you, that was what I was looking for :)
<artfwo> (
<artfwo> oops, sorry
<wsuthomas> I want to get involved
<slytherin> wsuthomas: read the topic of channel.
<slytherin> juli__: Uploaded cobertura, waiting in the NEW queue - https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+queue
<artfwo> by the way, what happens to the package after it's uploaded to the NEW queue? is it documented anywhere?
<slytherin> artfwo: Packages in new queue are reviewed by archive admins. When they are approved they are uploaded to build servers and get built.
<slytherin> This is about source packages.
<slytherin> Binary packages in new queue when approved by archive admins get copied to archive pool.
<artfwo> so it's a matter of 2 steps
<artfwo> every binary and source package is reviewed then including updates?
<juli__> slytherin, thank you! for uploading cobertura and  commenting in my application
<slytherin> welcome. :-)
<directhex> artfwo, every source package is reviewed at first upload, and again only when the binary package list changes
<slytherin> artfwo: every 'new' source and binary package.
<directhex> artfwo, intermediate uploads which don't change the binary manifest are not re-checked
<artfwo> understood it, thanks
<slytherin> TheMuso: any idea if powerpc buildd has different default compiler flags than others? I am wondering about this in gdb FTBFS - cc1: warnings being treated as errors
<j^> so how does the review process on revu work? uploaded a package and its just sitting there.
<j^> can i get anyone a beer to have a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/oggvideotools
<siretart`> j^: done. How to get my beer? ;-)
<POX> "standards version should be 3.7.2"?
<POX> 3.8.2?
<j^> siretart, in berlin at any point?
<james_w> except for the LGPL files
<POX> j^: s/Description: "Ogg Video Tools" is a /Description: /
<POX> s/jaunty/UNRELEASED/
<siretart`> POX: yes, indeed
<siretart`> j^: nope. i'm from Erlangen/Nuernberg :-)
<j^> UNRELEASED would be for the changelog?
<POX> yes
<siretart`> POX: why?
<Laney> i don't think that matters for revu
<Laney> j^: doesn't mention copyright of the packaging
<siretart`> for revu, please don't. the packages should be in a state that a reviewer can just debsign the source package and upload it
<POX> siretart`: because it provides a lot of confusion (when you f.e. want to Depend on it in other package)
<siretart`> POX: what confusion would that bring?
<POX> let me dig for a bug report...
<Laney> also please point to the versioned gpl in common-licenses
<siretart`> how about maintaining them in a PPA to get the dependencies sorted out and then copy it to revu in the right order
<POX> siretart`: http://bugs.debian.org/386354
<j^> siretart, not coming down there anytime soon, but if you ever come to berlin, let me know.
<siretart`> POX: TBH, I think having UNRELEASED changelog entries causes more confusion than it solves, but obviously YMMV
<slytherin> POX: changelog entry should be for current development release.
<POX> if package was uploaded to Debian/Ubuntu - distribution field should point to the distribution it was uploaded to ("distribution" as in unstable, jaunty, etc.), if it was never uploaded, it should be marked as UNRELEASED or removed from the changelog, IMHO
<POX> debian/changelog should help other maintainers as well, not only the package maintainer
<slytherin> POX: That is fine when you are maintaining the packaging bits in some VCS. revu is not VCS. And if package uploader puts 'unreleased' then he sponsorer will have to modify changelog entry before upload, which is not ideal.
<Laney> he's talking about previous changelog entries
<POX> Laney: thanks
<Laney> makes sense to me
<slytherin> Oh, sorry. I thought he was talking about latest one. Mu mistake. :-(
<j^> what if previous versions where in a ppa build for the version mentioned?
<slytherin> j^: ppa is not official repository
<j^> yes, but you have to use the version to get it build for that ubuntu release
<slytherin> how does that matter? If the package was only in PPA previously, you should not keep multiple changelog entries at all. COmbine then into one.
<j^> ok
<j^> i was using the same changelog for the ppa and now revu but can use a combined one for revu
<jcfp> j^: some more: incorrect version in changelog ...-ubuntu3 (probably want -0ubuntu1), homepage field missing from control, copyright for the your own work (the packaging) isn't specified, several files are not gpl2+ (lgpl, bsd-like) but missing from copyright, man pages for each executable?
<j^> man pages are worked on upstream, so next version will have them, copyright issues also discussed with author.
<jcfp> there's several files that are properly licensed but not mentioned in debian/copyright
<dholbach> Packaging Training Session "On-Call Review" with cjwatson, seb128, james_w and me in 12m in #ubuntu-classroom
<james_w> multi-ping!
<directhex> oh wow, that's an all-star team
<TheMuso> slytherin: not sure. Probably looking at the build logs of packages on different arches may help.
<dutchie> how long does it take an upload to show up on revu?
<Laney> not long
<dutchie> that's useful
<artfwo> I recall it's around 3 minutes
<dutchie> ok, it's been about 5.
<dutchie> I'll give it a bit longer
<nicolasvw> Hello, does a universe package versioned xxbuild1 get auto-synced from debian or does one have to file a sync request for it?
<Laney> either, depending on the release cycle
<directhex> nicolasvw, yes, it gets auto synced. when we're not past debian import freeze
<Laney> place in the^
<dutchie> could an admin have a look to see if my package has appeared on revu?
 * Laney giggles at the classroom session
<dutchie> it's not showing up on the web interface
<Laney> RainCT: ^ can you help?
<nicolasvw> directhex, thankx
<RainCT> Laney, dutchie: Sure, which package is it?
<dutchie> suvat
<dutchie> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/suvat
<dutchie> I just uploaded 0.2-0ubuntu1
<RainCT> 2009-08-13 14:03:02 - suvat_0.2-0ubuntu1_source.changes: Incorrect signature, moving to rejected.
<dutchie> how is it incorrect?
<RainCT> dutchie: Have you logged in on REVU before uploading the package?
<dutchie> no, should I have?
<RainCT> dutchie: Yes, you need to log in at least once so that REVU takes your GPG key from Launchpad
<dutchie> ah, ok
<dutchie> ok, it's uploaded
<dutchie> thanks for your help
<RainCT> no problem
<slytherin> RainCT: perhaps the package on wiki needs update to mention the new GPG import workflow.
<RainCT> slytherin: yeah, feel free to clean it up ;)
<mhall119|work> morning
<mhall119|work> what is the process for getting packages into Universe?
<siretart`> mhall119|work: first step is looking at the links in the topic :-)
<fosser_josh> can anybody help in developing deb packaging
<mhall119|work> siretart`: oh, sorry, the name list made it scroll up out of sight
<wildnfree_> Hello, I am new to this irc channel. I am looking for help in becoming a MOTU developer. I am one of the developers on the OpenShot Non-Linear Video Editor for Linux. I am developing the documentation package, including the Gnome Help files.
<wildnfree_> I am looking for a mentor to help me build up skills in producing the .deb packages fo OpenShot.
<bddebian> heya gang
<slytherin> RainCT: Done
<slytherin> wildnfree_: have you read the links referred in the topic.
<RainCT> slytherin: thanks :)
<wildnfree_> Hello Slytherin. Yes I've read the links. I am registered on Launchpad, and I have signed the Ubuntu Code of Conduct.
<slytherin> Did you look into the packaging guide?
<wildnfree_> I have also read lots of the pages on the Ubuntu community site, but the information in those just sends me round in circles.
<wildnfree_> I have been gradually learning the packaging guide, and have created one .deb package.
<slytherin> wildnfree_: So if you have questions then fire away.
<wildnfree_> How do I get a mentor to help me improve my packaging? And how do I actually apply for membership of MOTU?
<slytherin> wildnfree_: If you have already prepared a package, the first step would be to upload to revu so that it gets reviewed and improved.
<slytherin> wildnfree_: MOTU membership takes more time. As you have to work on more than one packages, get involved in community, help others etc.
<wildnfree_> The package at present is just a test package to learn to package the manual. What is <revu>?
<slytherin> wildnfree_: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU and http://revu.ubuntuwire.com
<wildnfree_> slytherin: I have been involved in the Linux community since 1996 when I started using Debian. I used to offer advice and support on the old LBC list in Britain.
<wildnfree_> I have been providing support to users on the OpenShot (alpha) project as well.
<slytherin> nice
<slytherin> is the movie editor Free?
<wildnfree_> Yes! Gnu Public Licence! And the films I am editing and compositing with OpenShot, are being published under a Creative Commons licence.
<slytherin> looks lot like pitivi to me. :-)
<slytherin> wildnfree_: if you want to get it included in next Ubuntu release you must hurry, the feature freeze is on 27th August.
<wildnfree_> slytherin: we won't have it ready for Karmic. OpenShot is alpha, and about to become beta. We need help in packaging first
<slytherin> wildnfree_: As I said, post your package on revu and get it reviewed.
<wildnfree_> slytherin: I am first looking for a mentor to get the packages into  suitable condition to submit to revu.
<slytherin> wildnfree_: you don't need to. revu is place for review. Just upload.
<slytherin> wildnfree_: or are you saying that your package is not in condition to upload to revu?
<wildnfree_> slytherin: Not in a condition yet to upload to revu
<slytherin> wildnfree_: Considering that feature freeze is close, it is hard to find a mentor for personal interaction. Still, may be others will be able to help you
<slytherin> Got to go now.
<pochu> does apport now also offer you to get a backtrace locally, instead of submitting the coredump to launchpad?
<pochu> looks like it still can't
<james_w> pochu: you can do it yourself with apport-retrace, but it's not part of usual apport flow
<pochu> james_w: not in the UI yet though, right? I recall there was a bug report about that, but I can't find it now...
<james_w> pochu: that's as I understand it
<hyperair> hmm for some reason, banshee's and liferea's notification area icons no longer have black backgrounds
<hyperair> O_o
<hyperair> i wonder what happned
<pochu> hyperair: for liferea it's fixed in 1.7
<pochu> but not on jaunty
<pochu> it only happens if you select 'display the number of unread items in the tray icon' in the preferences, maybe you unselected that?
<hyperair> pochu: i know. i'm still usnig liferea 1.6 and suddenly my black background disappeared
<hyperair> nono i didn't change anything
<hyperair> all of a sudden, i noticed banshee didn't have a black background anymore
<hyperair> so i restarted liferea
<hyperair> and voila, no more black background
<hyperair> O_o
<pochu> ok, lucky you ;)
<hyperair> yeah O_o
<hyperair> i wonder if it'll stick when i reboot
<chrisccoulson> is there any specific reason that meta-gnome2 is marked "no need to sync" on merges.ubuntu.com? Is it just that theres not much point in putting the effort in to do that, or is there another reason?
<apachelogger> RainCT: ping
<fabrice_sp> Wouah! Archive admins are subscribed to 160 bugs report! Is it a normal volume?
<geser> fabrice_sp: I assume because of the pending alpha release, sync requests aren't processed at the moment to not disturb it
<fabrice_sp> oh, makes sense
<nicolasvw> when setting Build-Deps to default-jdk instead of openjdk-6-jdk, what should the JAVA_HOME variable in rules be set to?
<logari81> please take a look at the following package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=6621
<logari81> it is pretty complicated for my experience level, hence any comments are welcome
<logari81> and some notices on the revu site itself:
<logari81> A. the link http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/getfem%2B%2B doesn't work.... I suppose the ++ signs in the package's name trigger the problem
<logari81> B. The Details and Description fields here http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=6621 correspond to the last binary package of the multi-binary source package (it'd be more intuitive to consider the first binary)
<fabrice_sp> logari81, in the copyright file, the url is not changed
<fabrice_sp> also, the version should be -0ubuntu1
<fabrice_sp> I think your libgmm-dev.install is not complete (no lib installed?)
<fabrice_sp> files in superlu are copyrighted to xerox (1994). Reflect that in your copyright file. And check all the source files to be sure that the copyright file reflect everything
 * fabrice_sp feels alone....
 * ScottK gives fabrice_sp a good hard slap in the head so he feels some companionship.
<ximion> Hello! Could someone please review my smile package? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/smile
<fabrice_sp> ScottK, this is not the kind of companionship I was expecting :-)
<ximion> And how do I remove the ubuntu-main-sponsors from the related bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/298706 ? I added them by accident.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 298706 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] smile" [Wishlist,Fix committed]
<ScottK> ;-)
<ScottK> ximion: You don't.  I'll do it
<ximion> ScottK: Sorry :-(
<ScottK> No problem
<ximion> ScottK: But companionship for me ;-)
<stochastic> can someone please look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xwax it's been sitting with one advocation for a month now and feature freeze is immanent
<fabrice_sp> ximion, building your package  right now
<ximion> fabrice_sp: Oh, Thank you!
<logari81> fabrice_sp: thank you for your time,
<logari81> A. version will be corrected,
<logari81> B. I think libgmm-dev has only headers so lib is not needed (the actually problem with libgmm is that it already exists in the repos as standalone)
<logari81> C. I ll try to figure out all the copyright parts (how did you find out so quickly about the xerox part?)
<fabrice_sp> logari81, I used the 'legal' link in revu
<fabrice_sp> you can also use checklicense (I think)
<fabrice_sp> ximion: seems good.
<logari81> ok, are there any remarks about the names of the binaries? I ve removed the "++" so that package names correspond to the library name.
<ScottK> fabrice_sp: licensecheck
<fabrice_sp> ScottK, you hit me too hard on the head. I became dyslexic ! :-)
<fabrice_sp> logari81, ^^
 * ScottK whacks fabrice_sp again to put it back the right way
 * fabrice_sp begins to write in French! 
<ximion> fabrice_sp: You'll find the GPLv2 at
<fabrice_sp> ximion, what do you mean?
 * fabrice_sp is building getfem++
<fabrice_sp> logari81, your pacakge FTBFS in karmic
<fabrice_sp> did you used pbuilder to build it?
<ximion> fabrice_sp: ScottK told you to make a license-check... Some others already complained there would be no license shipped with the source code. (But they did not look in the BIB_ManSlide/Help dir)
<ScottK> As long as the full license text is somewhere in the tarball it's OK.
<fabrice_sp> ohh: license-check was for logari81
<ScottK> If it's in an odd place, mentioning that in debian/copyright doesn't hurt
<ximion> ok
<ximion> ScottK: How do I get a sponsor for this? Simply wait if someone wants to sponsor this package?
<ScottK> Pretty much.  Mention it here now and then too
<logari81> fabrice_sp: I have built it in my ppa https://launchpad.net/~logari81/+archive/ppa
<fabrice_sp> What is the equivalent of xdg-icon-resourceÂ installÂ --novendorÂ --contextÂ mimetypesÂ --sizeÂ 192Â %{_datadir}/pixmaps/aqsis-doc.pngÂ application-x-slx in the debhelper world? I added dh_icons in my rules file, but nothing is generated in preinst
<fabrice_sp> logari81, for Jaunty, not for KArmic
<logari81> fabrice_sp: but for jaunty
<fabrice_sp> :-)
<logari81> yep ok I ll upload it for karmic too
<fabrice_sp> ok
<fabrice_sp> I'll explain it in another way: I have a package in Jaunty that install a mime file and some desktop file to associate that file type to programs and icons. The problem is that the icon mentioned in desktop file are not associated to the extension. Ddh_icons does not solve the problem. Any ideas?
<ximion> I developed a GNOME-AppInstall solution for KDE, which is completely based on PackageKit and Qt4. Now in Karmic+1 the new AppCenter should arrive. Where do I find information about this and how can I contact the AppCenter developers? (Because maybe I'll stop developing QAppInstall)
<ximion> fabrice_sp: To assign a mime-type, a mime info is also required.
<fabrice_sp> ximion, upstream install the mime file in the right place, and dh_desktop and dh_installmime is called
<ximion> fabrice_sp: Look in /usr/share/mime for all available mime types.
<fabrice_sp> do you ahve an example? It changed between jaunty and karmic, so it should be for jaunty
<ximion> To notify the system about that the app can handle a file type, just add the line MimeType=application/x-ipk; to the .desktop-file.
<ximion> (replace applications/x-ipk with the mime-definition)
<ximion> dh_desktop is outdated.
<fabrice_sp> hmm. I think the mime file if well installed, because if I double click on the file with the extension, the program is run
<ximion> it does nothing at time (or am I wrong?)
<fabrice_sp> it is outdatedi n Karmic, but still useful in Jaunty
<fabrice_sp> in Karmic, it does not do anything, you're right
<fabrice_sp> I'll check the desktop file, but upstream is telling me that it's working in Fedora
<fabrice_sp> the desktop file is ok: MimeType=model/x-rib;model/x-rib-gzip;
<fabrice_sp> ximion, thanks for trying :-)
<ximion> fabrice_sp: I tried it here (Karmic): Everything works! Do the mime models exist?
<ximion> You also may need to start a new desktop session to see the effect.
<fabrice_sp> as it's for Jaunty, I'll check some package that installs mime file
<RainCT> apachelogger: pong
<stochastic> what's the process for becoming a MOTU?
<directhex> make lots of contributions, write a personal statement, and add yourself to the CC agenda
<pochu> s/CC/MC/
<directhex> yeah, those guys
 * directhex is too busy eating an ice lolly to be accurate
<stochastic> how many contributions constitutes 'lots'  (roughly)
<pochu> stochastic: your fellow developers will tell you when you're ready
<stochastic> pochu, thanks
<pochu> or when somebody assumes you're one when you're not, you should probably apply :)
<stochastic> I don't suppose anyone might be willing to help me get 'lots' of contributions by revu-ing some of my packages?
<directhex> i'll take a look, then
<directhex> but i still need to finish tidying the house
<stochastic> thanks directhex, take your pic from http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xwax  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xjadeo  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/a2jmidi  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/slv2
 * stochastic ducks out to do some dishes
<apachelogger> RainCT: sent a memo :D
<RainCT> apachelogger: err what?
<apachelogger> RainCT: you didn't get a msg from memosrv?
<RainCT> ah yes
<apachelogger> :)
<RainCT> apachelogger: okay, sure
 * apachelogger buries RainCT in cookies \\o/
<RainCT> :D
<Jazzva> Is there any condensed way to add licenses to debian/copyright when a lot of files are licensed under MPL/GPL/LGPL and the only difference is in developers/contributors? Can I just mention them in section for upstream authors/contributors, and leave just one copy of license in the license section?
<Laney> if each file has different copyright then you can't get around listing that
<Jazzva> Tthanks for the answer
<Jazzva> s/Tt/T/
<stochastic> Jazzva, you might also be interested in this: http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep5/
<Jazzva> stochastic: thanks
<RainCT> apachelogger: done, but Launchpad doesn't feel like letting spooky pull the changes :(
<apachelogger> RainCT: spooky launchpad, no cookies for that beast :P
<jtimberman> anyone able to look at some packages I have in REVU? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/u/jtimberman
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-14
<RainCT> apachelogger: ok, REVU is updated
<apachelogger> RainCT: yay, finally revu looks good in konqueror, this is ubercool, thanks a lot *hug*
<RainCT> apachelogger: if just everything would be so easy! :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> hi motus. I have a quick question about mozilla apps in ubuntu - is here ok, or is thre a better channel?
<Kamping_Kaiser> (The question is about mozillas crash reporter, and if its shipped in Ubuntu)
<ScottK> Kamping_Kaiser: #ubuntu-mozillateam is likely better
<Kamping_Kaiser> ScottK: thanks, I'll give them a go.
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> geser, soren, nixternal, persia`, nhandler, jpds: around?
<persia`> Yes.
<soren> dholbach: Ja.
<dholbach> one MC member to go :)
 * dholbach keeps a couple of telephone numbers ready :)
<dholbach> can somebody please add me to  ~ubuntu-universe-sponsors ?
<dholbach> persia`: ^
<persia`> In a few minutes :)
 * geser yawns a good morning
<dholbach> ah nice... hey geser
 * dholbach was just about to text jpds and nixternal :-)
<dholbach> thanks persia`
<persia`> No problem.  You seem to get hit with expiry-while-away a lot (I remember you dropped from MOTU once for that).
<persia`> I suspect there's a potential bug against LP :)
<dholbach> if it's always as easy to get back as it was now, I can live with it :)
<juanje> dholbach: Hi :-)
<juanje> dholbach: I've been changed some stuff you told me yesterday about nautilus-md5sum package (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/nautilus-md5sum) . Could you review it, please? ;-)
<dholbach> juanje: in a meeting right now, but I can probably squeeze it in later
<juanje> dholbach: thanks :-)
<dholbach> juanje: done
<juanje> dholbach: :-)
<juanje> dholbach: thanks :-)
<geser> ember: as TIL for wordpress, to you intent to merge it? Debian has a new version with several CVE mentioned in the changelog
<ember> geser: i don't have the time right now
<geser> will do it then if that's ok
<ember> geser: great, thanks.
<logari81> hi, how can I prevent pbuilder from cleaning up after a build failure, so that I can extract some debug information about the failure?
<geser> there is an example hook which gives you a shell when a build failure occurs
<Laney> gosh, an exciting announcement?
<directhex> ?
<slytherin> logari81: From where do you plan to extract the debug information?
<slytherin> Laney: which announcement?
<Laney> " Daniel Holbach  is collecting the last bits to announce something really exciting... I'm so excited."
<logari81> slytherin: I just want to examine the configure script in debian/tmp/
<slytherin> logari81: but that configure script is from your upstream source. You can examine it even outside of pbuilder.
<geser> slytherin: I guess logari81 is interested in the configure log containing the error
<logari81> slytherin: not really it is being rebuilt during the build... the orig package provides only the autogen.sh
<slytherin> logari81: ahh
<geser> logari81: install a hook to give you a shell (see /usr/share/doc/pbuilder/examples/C10shell and copy it to /usr/lib/pbuilder/hooks or your local hook dir)
<logari81> geser: I had imagined that it would be possible over a hook but hoped for something simpler.... anyway I ll give it a try, ty
<slytherin> How do I login to people.ubuntu.com?
<geser> AFAIK you need to be employed by Canonical
<slytherin> No. I can't do ssh. I can only do sftp.
<slytherin> geser: people.ubuntu.com is accessible to all Ubuntu Members.
<geser> perhaps on purpose (scponly)
<slytherin> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PeopleUbuntuCom
<soren> when was this announced, by the way?
<geser> that's news to me. interesting
<soren> I knew it was that way now, but I haven't seen it announced. :)
<slytherin> I don't know. I just stumbled upon it.
<geser> I don't remember an announcement or I missed it
<slytherin> I was looking for some way to try building a package on a sparc machine. I thought people.ubuntu.com can help me.
<iulian> Hmm, that's interesting.  I didn't know either.
<ScottK> slytherin: For sparc, Ubuntuwire ought to be able to help.
<iulian> So yeah, that's a good question.  I wonder what services are available to us.
<slytherin> ScottK: how? Any link to some readme?
<ScottK> slytherin: ubuntuwire.com and #ubuntuwire
<ScottK> REVU runs on a sparc box.
<dez> Hi, I am interested in joining the ubuntu development community. anyone could help me?
<iulian> dez: Take a look at the /topic :)
<dez> iulian, jejjejejejeje
<dez> iulian: so there is no irc channel where I could as for help on this?
<iulian> dez: Sure, this is the right channel.  Everything is explained in those wiki pages.
<geser> sure, here if you have specific questions
<iulian> So, questions regarding development of Ubuntu are welcomed here.
<happyaron> Hi, I want to package a software and put it into Multimedia section, what should I put in 'Section' in 'control' file?
<dez> iulian: I have read the wiki and found out that to apply I have to implement an app and then create a wiki, etc...
<iulian> dez: What do you mean?
<iulian> Ah, do you want to apply for MOTU membership?
<dez> iulian: I will check the information at the MOTU contributing. as I am computer engineer I just want to get involved on ubuntu development, progressively I mean
<dez> iulian: I have been using ubuntu for years and now I want to contribute directly. I just want to know what should I do...
<slytherin> ScottK: I thought there was some general infrastructure for developers to gain access to the community supported architectures.
<iulian> dez: That's awesome.  If you have questions, don't hesitate to ask in this channel.
<ScottK> slytherin: Yes.  Ubuntuwire.  Canonical does not provide such a thing.
<slytherin> happyaron: Which Multimedia section are you talking about?
<happyaron> slytherin: it's an ogg video tool
<slytherin> happyaron: No. I mean where did you see Multimedia section? In Synaptic?
<happyaron> yes
<dez> iulian: I supposse the first step is starting with bugfixing, ryt?
<slytherin> ScottK: Thanks for info. I have asked the Debian developer for the package to check the fix on sparc. If he does not respond I will check ubuntuwire.
<happyaron> slytherin: but I cannot push it to my PPA when I set section to 'Multimedia'
<iulian> dez: Yea, look at bugs which have the bitesize tag set.
<slytherin> happyaron: just check the control file for one of the packages already present in that section.
<happyaron> okay
<dez> iulian: is MOTU the only way to develop at Ubuntu?
<iulian> dez: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment
<iulian> dez: And https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers.
<happyaron> slytherin: it seems to be graphics, thank you
<dez> iulian: thanks
<andol> I just got a debdiff from fetchmail bug #371072 sponsored. Now I recieve this mail http://paste.ubuntu.com/253150/ from LP regarding a fetchmail translation. Rather sure about not having any translated stuff in the debdiff. What's the deal?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 371072 in fetchmail "fetchmailconf does not start" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/371072
<andol> (No problem really, merely curious ^^)
<geser> andol: it has something to do with rosetta but I don't know the details
<andol> geser: Rosetta doing some magical stuff, which end up being tagged to the most recent update?
<dutchie> is there a way to see what stage of review a package is at?
<slytherin> dutchie: which package? where did you post it for review?
<dutchie> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/suvat
<slytherin> ttx: ping
<ttx> slytherin: what's up ?
<slytherin> I read your comment on maven2 spec. Considering that it is complete standalone stack and does not affect other packages, don't you think we should try to get it in karmic? We can keep aside the maven + debhelper integration for karmic +1.
<ttx> slytherin: yes, why not... I have 0 time for that though.
<slytherin> Ok. Just wanted clarification on your comment.
<ttx> slytherin: if it does not update/change anything outside the maven stack...
<slytherin> right. I will not touch other packages.
 * ttx is looking for some stability in the java infrastructure right now :)
<Laney> who thinks I can do some sponsoring from the train?
<dholbach> Laney: I BELIEVE IN YOU!
<Laney> this lag is pretty bad
<Laney> luckily I have my PC on at home
<Laney> byobu power!
<dutchie> how sponsored is http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/suvat ? I'd like to see it in Karmic, but am going away tomorrow, so any work done on it has to be done today if it's going to make the freeze
<happyaron> hi, I am packaging a ogg video tool and it says required theoraenc and theoradec, I added the build dependency of libtheora-dev, but 'configure' still says cannot found both of the two, any suggestions?
<artfwo> happyaron, try adding libtheora-bin instead
<happyaron> artfwo: okay
<artfwo> but if any of theora headers are required, make sure you keep libtheora-dev as well
<happyaron> artfwo: I've added both, but still cannot pass the check
<jpds> happyaron: can you look at the configure source to see exactly what it's looking for?
<happyaron> jpds: 'theoraenc' and 'theoradec'
<artfwo> hmm, command-not-found shows that these commands can be found in 'ogmrip' package
<happyaron> artfwo: that's a dvdripping tool
<slytherin> happyaron: I believe there was a bug in libtheora-dev which was fixed recently.
<happyaron> in its README it gave a link to the thoera homepage saying we can download from
<slytherin> happyaron: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/karmic-changes/2009-August/005893.html
<happyaron> slytherin: how to solve now?
<happyaron> slytherin: is that released on karmic?
<slytherin> happyaron: the bugs is fixed in karmic. Is your pbuilder updated?
<happyaron> slytherin: no, I will try it now
<artfwo> it was looking for theoraenc and theoradec pkgconfig libraries then!
<happyaron> artfwo: and what to do ?
<artfwo> install the updated library
<slytherin> happyaron: you don't need to do anything. Simply including libtheora-dev is sufficient.
<happyaron> okay, try now
<artfwo> by the way, is there a way to test armel builds on i386?
<slytherin> artfwo: test as in test after successful build?
<artfwo> no, I have a package that fails to build on armel and I'd like to try out the fix
<artfwo> in short, build a package in an ubuntu armel environment
<artfwo> perhaps some virtual machines support that?
<slytherin> artfwo: I believe qemu supports armel. so you can have a virtual armel PC.
<artfwo> okay, will try that, thanks!
<ximion> geser: Are you there? I have a question about your comment to my packaging of libqt4intf > http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/libqtintf4
<happyaron> how to ask "tor" to be added to karmic? it's there in debian unstable but not in ubuntu for several releases
<geser> ximion: yes, I'm here
<ximion> geser: shlib-without-versioned-soname usr/lib/libqt4intf.so.1.70 libqt4intf.so How can I fix this? Only the developer could do this, I think. Is it necessary to fix to get this package into universe?
<directhex> ximion, the tradition is that you only ship a soname'd library with a lib package
<directhex> ximion, i.e. usr/lib/libqt4intf.so.1.70 goes in the lib package,and  libqt4intf.so into the -dev package
<geser> ximion: yes, it's an upstream issue. It shouldn't block the inclusion into universe but it makes the maintainment of the package harder as you need control yourself if the ABI or API changed and coordinate that all packages get rebuild with the new version.
<geser> directhex: IIRC objdump returns only SONAME libqt4intf.so in this case
<directhex> oh
<directhex> useless C++ nonsense
<ximion> geser: non-dev-pkg-with-shlib-symlink => I've overwritten this error, because this is a really small pkg. A -dev package would only contain a symlink. Is this okay?
<ximion> And another thing: The buildscript creates a library named libqt4intf.so I created a script which installs the library as libqt4intf.so.version in /usr/lib and creates a symlink for that package. The script gets the current version as parameter from the debian/rules script. Is that a usual way or should I simply install the libqt4intf.so without symlink?
<kklimonda> hey, anyone could sponsor my sync of python-django package (bug 413658) - it enables a test suite which was requested by other developer in a MIR bug..
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 413658 in python-django "Sync python-django 1.1-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/413658
<iulian> kklimonda: I'll have a look at it.
<kklimonda> thanks
<geser> ximion: I guess yes (re override), but I'm no expert on library packaging. Do you know http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html ?
<ximion> geser: Yes, I read parts of it to create the package.
<ximion> geser: The buildscript creates a library named libqt4intf.so I created a script which installs the library as libqt4intf.so.version in /usr/lib and creates a symlink for that package. The script gets the current version as parameter from the debian/rules script. Is that a usual way or should I simply install the libqt4intf.so without symlink?
<ximion> geser: I wrote a mail to the developer's mailing list, describing the shlib-without-versioned-soname error. I hope they'll fix it!
<geser> ximion: I'm not expert in library packaging and this gets very specific, perhaps ask the Debian people for some input in this regard
<ximion> geser: Okay. If upstream fixes the issue there is no need for my script either, so I'll wait until I get response (or a new libqt4intf version)
<ximion> Thank you for your help!
<slytherin> happyaron: Looks like it was deleted by mistake from jaunty - https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tor/+publishinghistory the bug being referred is https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tor/+bug/328442 which was about removal of 0.1.x version
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 328442 in tor "Tor 0.1.2.x abandoned by upstream, update to 0.2.0.34" [Undecided,Fix released]
<slytherin> happyaron: bug pitti on #ubuntu-devel.
<geser> I remember a discussion on the ubuntu-devel or ubuntu-devel-discuss ML about tor
<slytherin> geser: the bug was for removing 0.1.x version. The version that was removed is 2.x
 * slytherin remembers how 'electric' was lost because the archive admins missed that it was updated in Ubuntu. :-(
<geser> I don't remember the details about it but it was something about missing SRU to tor to keep in usable or similar
<happyaron> slytherin: so, what to do?
<happyaron> tor might be useful for users in China
<slytherin> happyaron: first discuss with pitti on #ubuntu-devel, then file a sync request (or merge if ubuntu changes form last release are still relevant).
 * slytherin got to go
<geser> happyaron: have you reread the linked thread from that bug report?
 * dutchie wants http://revu.ubuntuwire.net/p/suvat reviewed and uploaded asap, anything needed on it?
<happyaron> geser: I am reading now but not finished
<iulian> kklimonda: Acked.
<happyaron> geser: read that, it said nobody to maintain it in ubuntu
<geser> happyaron: unless this changes it's pretty unlikely to get it included back
<happyaron> geser: but as a user, tor is necessary anyway
<geser> happyaron: for those tor upstream provides current debs also for Ubuntu releases
<happyaron> geser: using debian's repository might be a better choice instead
<geser> not necessarly as the are build for the dependencies in Debian (stable or unstable) and might not match the versions available in your used Ubuntu version
<happyaron> geser: users in some place cannot access torproject.org in fact
<happyaron> as far as I know
<happyaron> geser: they use tor to get rid of the limitation, but first step they cannot get tor, :(
<geser> I guess it's forbidden in those countries, and using an Ubuntu (or Debian) package doesn't make it legal either, does it?
<happyaron> geser: using the packages are legal, e.g. in China
<geser> but that's a different topic. As Ubuntu was asked to remove tor by upstream as it's unmaintained and causing problems for upstream, this won't change unless someone steps up to maintain it properly
<happyaron> geser: if an MOTU like to maintain it, can it be bring back?
<geser> happyaron: from the look of the discussion it should be possible to get it back if a MOTU (or even an contributor who needs sponsoring) is willing to maintain it in the development version and also provide updated packages for the released versions
<happyaron> geser: okay, I will try to do that or find somebody to do that, wish it back, really
<happyaron> geser: when is the deadline of karmic?
<geser> feature freeze is on August 27th, after that an exception will be needed
<happyaron> oh
<happyaron> thanks
<geser> but one can maintain it a PPA till it get proberly included
<happyaron> geser: yes, just what I am consider it now
<geser> it might have an advantage to be included in Ubuntu, as the PPA owner has to follow only his own policy which version (and updates) will be make available to released Ubuntu versions and is not bound by the SRU policy
<geser> ... not included in Ubuntu...
<happyaron> geser: are you a motu?
<geser> yes
<dutchie> can I get someone to review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/suvat ?
<happyaron> geser: I will try to upload it tomorrow, can you help review my package? I am a newbie on packaging
<dutchie> I need to do anything that needs doing today, as I am going away and won't be back before the feature freeze
<geser> happyaron: can try if my time permits. I hope you take e.g. the existing Debian packaging as a starting point and only change what's necessary, this will make it easier for you as you can work together with the Debian maintainer on the packages
<happyaron> geser: thanks for you advice
<geser> happyaron: if you are lucky then you don't need to modify it at all but just upload it your PPA and get it build for the Ubuntu versions you want to support and update them as necessary later
<happyaron> geser: oh
<geser> happyaron: the tor version that was once in Ubuntu was taken at some point from Debian unstable (like many other packages) but Ubuntu is missing manpower to look after the package (sync regularly with Debian) and provide updates for released Ubuntu versions therefore upstream asked us to remove it
<happyaron> geser: in that bug, upsteam asked to remove the 0.1.x package and referring to the new 0.2.x, but finally ubuntu deleted all packages
<happyaron> :(
<geser> yes, because there was no one to look after them and to not let it happen again (e.g. Ubuntu released with 0.2.x while upstream is at 0.2.y (y >> x) and it not willing to support 0.2.x anymore)
<dutchie> am I getting through or are people just ignoring me?
<happyaron> geser: but if someone can catch up with the update, it can be bring back
<geser> dutchie: I can read you :) but currently don't have time for a proper review (and others are either busy or already enjoying the weekend)
<happyaron> right?
<dutchie> geser: ah, ok.
<geser> happyaron: yes
<dutchie> I just want to make sure that it gets into karmic
<mainbrain_> hi there
<mainbrain> I made a package and want to know where to send it now
<mainbrain> can someone help me out?
<geser> !REVU
<ubottu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<mainbrain> that also applies to package updates right?
<geser> for existing packages? no, just file a bug in LP, attach the new .diff.gz and subscribe the sponsoring team
<geser> ubuntu-universe-sponsors for packages in universe/multiverse and ubuntu-main-sponsors for packages in main
<mainbrain> and why all the hassle with: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/HandsOn#Tutorial%202:%20Updating%20a%20Package
<mainbrain> ubuntu's doxygen is outdated, so I did an upgrade
<happyaron> geser: should I file a bug when uploaded the package to revu?
<geser> happyaron: a needs-packaging bug would be fine
<happyaron> thanks
<mainbrain> okay, so I file a bug in LP and attach doxygen_1.5.9-0ubuntu1.diff.gz right?
<geser> mainbrain: this shows how to update a package and in step 6 (debuild -S -sa) you build the new source package incl. the new .diff.gz you need to attach to the bug
<geser> mainbrain: yes
<mainbrain> thanks :)    ... now I just need to know what LP is ... google was no help
<geser> mainbrain: LP == launchpad -> http://www.launchpad.net/
 * norsetto guesses that automake1.10 has been obsoleted today
<geser> mainbrain: I see that doxygen 1.5.9 is already in karmic -> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/doxygen
<mainbrain> oh ... but why can't I see it in my synaptic?
<geser> mainbrain: do you use already karmic (Ubuntu 9.10) or the stable version (jaunty, Ubuntu 9.04)?
 * sebner waves at geser and norsetto :D
<mainbrain> i'm using jaunty
<norsetto> huhu sebner
 * geser waves a sebner
<geser> mainbrain: then you are asking for a backport?
<geser> !backport
<ubottu> If new updated Ubuntu packages are built for an application, then they may go into Ubuntu Backports. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports - See also !packaging
<mainbrain> !packaging
<ubottu> The packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports
<mainbrain> oh :(
<geser> sebner: are you today in sync or merge mode?
<sebner> geser: don't know yet (just came from church), do you need anything specific?
<geser> sebner: nothing special, just the usual ubuntu-universe-sponsors queue
<sebner> geser: I'll take a look later =)
<geser> perhaps also check any interesting open merges as FF is nearing irresistible
<sebner> geser: everything \o/
<happyaron> geser: your suggestion seems works, currently building on PPA virtual builder
<happyaron> :(, failed
<happyaron> pdfTex failure
<mainbrain> Whats the naming 0ubuntu1 good for? Whats the pattern?
<hyperair> for some reason, i received mail addressed to gpocentek. spam even.
<geser> hyperair: check the envelope from, not the From header
<geser> s/from/to/g
<hyperair> envelope from?
<hyperair> what header's that?
<directhex> mainbrain, the bit after the dash is the debian revision number. if there's ubuntu changes, then "ubuntuX" is added where X is the ubuntu revision
<geser> hyperair: see RFC 2822, MAIL FROM and RCPT TO
<directhex> mainbrain, if there's no debian version, then the debian version 0 is used, hence 0ubuntu1
<mainbrain> ahhh, thank you
<hyperair> geser: i don't think this is something i can see in the mail headers is it? (it appeared in my gmail inbox)
<geser> hyperair: not in most cases, but some mail servers log it in the Received headers (the RCPT TO value) and Return-Path for the MAIL FROM value
<hyperair> hmmm
<geser> hyperair: the correct RFC is 2821, not 2822 as I mentioned. The headers like you see them in your mail reader are already part of the mail data and can contain everything you want (even forged To: and From: headers)
<hyperair> geser: i'm viewing the message source in thunderbird.
<hyperair> so yes, i'm seeing them Received headers
<hyperair> none of them show my address though
<hyperair> except for Delivered-To
<hyperair> seems that's not the only spam message i've gotten with that To: address
<geser> yeah, some mail servers store it in Delivered-To, some as part of Received and others not at all
<hyperair> ah
<hyperair> well assuming there's no glitch anywhere, the RCPT TO had to be hyperair@gmail.com =\
<geser> yes
<jtimberman> I need motu advocate for some packages in REVU: chef, stompserver, merb, coderay and libsystemu-ruby, on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/u/jtimberman (libsyntax-ruby should be removed, but won't 'nuke' when i tell it to)
<geser> hyperair: it could also be your @ubuntu.com address in RCPT TO and forwarded later to your gmail address
<hyperair> ah yes. of course
<hyperair> in fact, that's probably it, since the mail has launchpad in its Received header
<hyperair> no wait, not launchpad. canonical
<mainbrain> bye :)  thanks for helping me out
<micahg> does anyone here use a GUI for browsing bzr branches locally?
<superm1> micahg, bzr-gtk ships an app called olive-gtk
<micahg> superm1: it crashes
<micahg> are there any other ones?
<superm1> micahg, try running it a second time.  i see dbus errors the first time i try to launch it upon reboot too alot
<micahg> indeed superm1
<micahg> thanks
<micahg> I'll have to update the bug report I filed on it a while back
<superm1> micahg, can you subscribe me to it too?  I've been meaning to file one for ages, but never got around to it
<micahg> I subscribed you
<micahg> I'll have to update it later though
<micahg> I'm at work now
<superm1> thanks
<micahg> superm1: do you know an easy way to import all the history from an svn repo
<superm1> micahg, no i don't sorry.  you might want to ask the guys in #bzr or #bazaar (whichever channel they own)
<micahg> thanks superm1
<jbernard__> after looking through the packaging guide, I have not been able to find information on "taking an existing debian package and making the necessary changes for its inclusion in ubuntu", does something like this exist somewhere?
<jbernard__> nevermind, im an idiot
<directhex> jbernard__, existing debian packagea are by definition ready for inclusion in ubuntu, with few exceptions
<Ampelbein> jbernard__: why do you say that? perhaps the guide is unclear on that specific issue and needs to be better phrased? can you tell us what exactly was it you wanted to know?
<jbernard__> well, i suppose if i just follow the guide it will have the necessary pieces, like: changing Section from 'interpreters' to 'universe/interpreters'
<jbernard__> and chaning the maintainer to motu
<jbernard__> so here's my issue specifically, I uploaded a new package to debian (lua-iconv) and it currently sitting in NEW, but id like to see the package make it into karmic before the freeze
<jbernard__> so i belive the next thing to do it to upload it to REVU
<jbernard__> (with the above mentioned changes included)
<jbernard__> am I on the right track here, or off in left field? :)
<Ampelbein> jbernard__: why would you want to change the section to 'universe/*'? the categorization in main/universe is done automatically, you don't need to change the section in debian/control.
<jbernard__> ahh
<jbernard__> so just the 'Maintainer:' field must change?
<jbernard__> or is that automatic as well
<Ampelbein> jbernard__: there is a script available in the package "ubuntu-dev-tools", called update-maintainer. you can either use that or change it by hand.
<jbernard__> perfect, are there any other required changes prior to a REVU upload?
<Ampelbein> jbernard__: none that I know of from the top of my head
<jbernard__> that's awesome, thanks for your help!
<jetsaredim> anyone know why usb-creator isn't in jaunty?
<geser> jbernard__: you want to get an existing package in Debian unstable get included in Ubuntu?
<jbernard__> geser: is "almost" existing, its in NEW at the moment, but im afraid it may not make it into unstable before the freeze
<geser> ah, then REVU is the right way
<stochastic> can someone take a look at one of these?   http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xwax  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xjadeo  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/a2jmidi  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/slv2
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-15
<bobbo> hey everyone!
<iulian> Hello bobbo.
<bobbo> hey iulian, how's it going?
<iulian> Pretty good, thanks.  What about you?
<bobbo> I'm great, finally able to get back to MOTU after multiple computer failures :)
<iulian> bobbo: Heh, awesome!
<bobbo> iulian: been a good three or four months since I last uploaded anything (Ever tried running pbuilder on 256mb of RAM?), but got a couple up the other day, felt great to be back :D
<iulian> bobbo: Hehe, I cannot remember if I tried to build something on a computer with only 256mb of ram.
<bobbo> iulian: you definitely do not want to ever try
<bobbo> iulian: took about an hour to build a tiny python based package once, I then gave up and waited until I have 4gb of RAM :D
<mardoct> Ever put Crysis on a Pentium 4? Just about as successful.
<iulian> bobbo: Yikes!
<mardoct> I did it for laughs, just to see how it was.
<mardoct> It barely was is the best description.
<bobbo> mardoct: I bet you got some epic framrates with that
<mardoct> It was a slideshow for a few seconds, I had my laughs and quickly removed it afterwards.
<bobbo> I can vaguely run Crysis at pretty high settings, but the lag in some places is unbearable
<mardoct> My main computer handles it pretty well at highish settings. I barely played it, I just use it as a sort of casual benchmarking tool.
<bobbo> mardoct: yeah, I suck pretty hard at gaming, though since I got a brand new graphics card, I thought I better give some newish games a go
<bobbo> most of my CPU cycles are given over to pbuilder right now :D
<mardoct> The only game I really love and don't toss away within in month is Deus Ex. It's about 9 years old.
<mardoct> I only have good hardware to be able to convert .avi to DVD in decent times.
<mardoct> ... And bragging rights; of course.
<bobbo> of course, bragging rights are the most important thing about computing ;)
<mardoct> Of course. Right now I'm bragging to some friends of my on Windows. I'm currently running Ubuntu twice with virtualbox yet only using as much RAM as Windows 7 at rest.
<mardoct> Hey everybody. Can anyone tell me what the problem is when dpkg-source gives the error exit status 1?
<jmarsden> I'm trying to submit a sync request, but I'm getting a Timeout Error (Error ID: OOPS-1323F679) from LP... is this a known issue, or is there some other way I should submit the request?
<ubottu> https://lp-oops.canonical.com/oops.py/?oopsid=1323F679
<therm> good morning
<happyaron> anyone knows about latex can help me solve a problem?
<happyaron> http://paste.ubuntu.org.cn/32603
<happyaron> geser: something wrong with texlive-latex-bin and the tor package cannot be compiled successfully on karmic
<happyaron> geser, freeflying: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/texlive-bin/+bug/413964
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 413964 in texlive-bin "got "invalid image dimensions" error" [Undecided,New]
<slytherin> asac: now that gnome-bluetooth is in main, it should drop build-dep on libgeoclue-dev right? Or is there a plan to move libgeoclue-dev to main?
 * hyperair lies in wait for mok0
<DerGraf> hi all
<DerGraf> I think I've fixed a bug in libgtkada2-bin... I've already uploaded it to lunchpad.. so what should I do then?
<logari81> does anyone know (or have an opinion about) why autoconf generates such an indentation and line breakage mess in the configure scripts it creates?
<iulian> DerGraf: Subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors.
<DerGraf> iulian: ok.. thanks.. I'll do that in a few hours.. got to do some garden-work ;)
<hyperair> logari81: the reason is the m4 macro expansion.
<hyperair> you're not meant to read configure, you're meant to read the m4 macros. so the m4 macros are indented/linewrapped properly within their own files.
<hyperair> reindenting the macros upon expansion is overengineering, and is bound to cause issues if/when the reindentation fails.
<logari81> hyperair: actually indentation is not my worst problem, line breakage is. With autoconf 2.64 I have an inline "fi" which breaks my configure target which worked with 2.63 (coincidentally I suppose)
<hyperair> logari81: how did that happen? shell doesn't usually bork on indentation issues.
<hyperair> and fi can be put anywhere from on the same line to a few blank lines down =\
<logari81> hyperair: the problematic line looks like
<logari81> " "$LINENO" 5		fi
<logari81> if I insert a line break before fi ... it works again
<hyperair> looks to be like quotatino issues =\
<hyperair> quotation
<hyperair> i see three quotes there
<hyperair> could you pastebin the snippet?
<logari81> hyperair: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/253632/
<hyperair> and what was it like inside the macro?
<happyaron> mdeslaur: could you pay some attention on this bug? https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/flashplugin-nonfree/+bug/398042
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 398042 in flashplugin-nonfree "package flashplugin-installer 10.0.22.87ubuntu2 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess new pre-removal script returned error exit status 1" [Undecided,New]
<hyperair> hmm i can fix that.
<logari81> hyperair: i am trying to find the corresponding macro... since I have very little experience with autotools it may take some time
<hyperair> logari81: where can i get access to the sources? i can help
<logari81> hyperair: https://launchpad.net/~logari81/+archive/ppa/+files/getfem++_4.0~svn3053.orig.tar.gz
<logari81> it fails to build in karmic because of this error
<hyperair> tch. why does the postrm of flashplugin-installer repeat so much code?!
<logari81> hyperair: here is the macro http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/253636/
<hyperair> hmm how strange, eh..
<hyperair> logari81: looks like autogen fails miserably
<hyperair> lots of strange unknown macros O-o
<hyperair> no wait.. AC_CACHE_VAL appears to be failing miserably or something
<mok0> hyperair: you're waiting for me?
<hyperair> mok0: !! how did you guess
<logari81> hyperair: what do you mean I see only warnings about suspicius cache-id
<hyperair> mok0: codelite has a new version =)
<mok0> hyperair:  ah
<mok0> hyperair: bug #?
<hyperair> bug #413992
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 413992 in codelite "[needs-upgrade] Codelite 1.0.2893" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/413992
<logari81> hyperair: you can compare with the following log http://launchpadlibrarian.net/30288280/buildlog_ubuntu-karmic-i386.getfem%2B%2B_4.0~svn3053-0ubuntu0ppak4_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<mok0> hyperair: I'll check it out right away... that is, after I make myself a cup of mocca...
<hyperair> mok0, mocca, they rhyme don't they? =D
<hyperair> logari81: yaeh i see it too. imo some quotation is missing?
<hyperair> anyway go complain upstraem
<hyperair> they've got a hideously convoluted configure.in
<logari81> ok, but I think that the line breakage issue could be a potential autotools bug, anyway for the moment I can workaround it by adding a blank line into the macro definition
<logari81> hyperair: thank you, you ve helped me a lot
<hyperair> i did nothing :(
<logari81> I wouldn't have figured out the trick to modify the macro definition :), just too little experience
<mok0> hyperair: I will close the LP bug in changelog for you
<hyperair> mok0: ah thanks
<happyaron> could somebody have a look at https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/flashplugin-nonfree/+bug/398042
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 398042 in flashplugin-nonfree "package flashplugin-installer 10.0.22.87ubuntu2 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess new pre-removal script returned error exit status 1" [Undecided,New]
<hyperair> happyaron: i'm looking at it so would you stop plugging it on this thread already?!
<happyaron> hyperair: okay
<hyperair> also, even if i didn't, it would be better to just be patient than plugging it a few times a night
 * hyperair sighs
<happyaron> yes
<mok0> hehe
<happyaron> :)
<mok0> Patience is a rare virtue
<mdeslaur> happyaron: the flashplugin-nonfree issue should already be fixed in the current karmic package
<happyaron> mdeslaur: thanks
<stochastic> can someone take a look at one of these?   http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xwax  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xjadeo  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/a2jmidi  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/slv2
<stochastic> I'd really like to see at least one make feature freeze.
<james_w> stochastic: slv2: what's debian/README for?
<james_w> debian/copyright is incomplete
<james_w> a2jmidi doesn't exist
<stochastic> james_w http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/a2jmidid
<james_w> xwax looks cool, I wish I had some timecoded vinyl to test with
<stochastic> james_w, yes it's a very fun program
<james_w> can mixxx do the same thing?
<stochastic> mixxx uses xwax's libraries internally
<james_w> ah
<james_w> embedded?
 * stochastic is packaging the latest version of mixxx right now
<james_w> it doesn't build a libarary package
<james_w> cool, thanks
<stochastic> yes, embeded
<james_w> could that be changed?
<stochastic> I don't know enough about it yet, I could ask on some mailing lists
<james_w> it's much better if the code can be shared rather than embedded
<stochastic> yes
<james_w> anyway, this package looks good, uploading
<stochastic> thanks
<james_w> could do with a manpage
<stochastic> the manpage would have the same contents as 'xwax --help' displays
<james_w> still :-)
<stochastic> I'll put the request in upstream for a xwax library for mixxx to use
<james_w> please subscribe to the bugs of the package at https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xwax
<stochastic> manpage will be added for next release
<james_w> it's now in the NEW queue and will be reviewed there in the next few days
<james_w> if it passes then it will be in the archive, if not then you will be asked to make some adjustments
<stochastic> okay, thank you very much
<james_w> stochastic: all reviewed. Nice work, just needs some tweaks to debian/copyright of the other packages
<stochastic> james_w, thank you very much
 * stochastic gets to work on those tweaks
<ximion> Hi! Could someone please review my projectM-Jack-Packaging? It is in revu since May and has no review yet: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/projectm-jack (To build it, projectm-qt is needed: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/libprojectm-qt )
<ximion> (projectM-Jack is a small package to enable projectM visualisations for the JackAudio server)
<james_w> ximion: libprojectm-qt1-dev shouldn't have the SONAME included in the name
<james_w> it should just be libprojectm-qt-dev
<james_w> COPYING as well ;-)
<ximion> james_w: Okay, I'll change this.
<james_w> and debian/copyright is incomplete
<ximion> \me Fixing issue in libprojectm-qt-dev
<james_w> what gets installed in usr/share/ in libprojectm-qt1?
<ximion> james_w: This does not apply to libprojectm-qt1 ?
<james_w> sorry?
<ximion> james_w: Should I rename libprojectm-qt1 -> libprojectm-qt
<james_w> no, that's correct
<james_w> it's just the -dev package that shouldn't be versioned by the SONAME
<ximion> james_w: A SVG icon gets installed to /usr/share/pixmaps
<james_w> that's bad
<james_w> library packages should only contain data that is tied to the SONAME
<james_w> if there is a SONAME bump then the two library packages won't be co-installable, which is a real pain
<james_w> for projectm-jack, my only complaints are licensing
<james_w> debian/copyright is incomplete
<james_w> the license seems to be LGPL, but COPYING is the GPL
<james_w> and was video_init.cpp written for this project?
<ximion> james_w: Should I delete the image? It's not needed by the library, but by the projectM-jack package.
<james_w> it should be shipped in that package then
<ximion> james_w: Changed. I don't know if video_init.cpp was written for this project, but I added Peter Sperl to the copiriight holders list.
<james_w> I see now he's a projectm developer, so that's ok
<ximion> The GPLv2 (look at the COPYING file) is shipped with this package
<ximion> james_w: Oh, one file is LGPL. Should I add  a short version of the LGPL to the copyright file too?
<james_w> but I can't find any GPL code in projectm-jack
<james_w> any code explicitly declared as GPL, sorry
<asomething> any REVU admins around?
<ximion> james_w: The copying-file says it's GPL...
<james_w> so it's ambiguous
<ximion> What should I do with the license?
<james_w> well, clarification would be good
<james_w> I can only find explicit declarations of LGPL and MIT/X11
<james_w> the whole thing could be GPL, but that's unusual
<james_w> clarification would be needed to get this in the archive
<asomething> gilir: Congrats on making MOTU!
<james_w> yeah, congratulations gilir
<james_w> about time too :-)
<asomething> the sponsorship queue will seem empty now ;-)
<ximion> james_w: I'll write a mail to the projectM developers, so they can update their upstream tarball.
<james_w> thanks
<gilir> thanks asomething, thanks james_w :)
<mardoct> When trying to build a package, I'm getting "dpkg-buildpackage: failure: dpkg-source -b gtk-gnutella-0.96.6 gave error exit status 1" Can anyone tell me what the problem is?
<Ampelbein> mardoct: we need to examine the complete buildlog. can you put it on pastebin?
<Ampelbein> mardoct: at least the last 20 lines before that error
<mardoct> Ampelbein: Where would it be by default?
<Ampelbein> mardoct: depends. if you used debuild it should be in the same folder where your .orig.tar.gz lies.
<mardoct> Ampelbein: Oh, it's the .build file?
<Ampelbein> mardoct: exactly.
<Ampelbein> sorry i did not tell you. ;-)
<mardoct> Ampelbein: That's Fine. Want me to just spam it all here? Nobody else is talking.
<Ampelbein> mardoct: please don't.
<Ampelbein> !pastebin | mardoct
<ubottu> mardoct: pastebin is a service to post multiple-lined texts so you don't flood the channel. Ubuntu pastebin is at  http://paste.ubuntu.com | To post !screenshots use http://tinyurl.com/imagebin | !pastebinit to paste directly from  command line | Make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic
<mardoct> Ampelbein: http://paste.ubuntu.com/253770/
<mardoct> Ampelbein: Why can't all file hosting be that easy?
<Ampelbein> mardoct: line22,  warning: source directory 'gtk-gnutella-0.96.6' is not <sourcepackage>-<upstreamversion> 'gtk-gnutella-0.96.5'
<ximion> james_w: Okay, I fixed all issues in the packages, except for the license problems
<Ampelbein> mardoct: did you unpack the new source?
<mardoct> Ampelbein: It did come in .tar.bz2 not, tar.gz if it matters, but I unpacked it.
<Ampelbein> mardoct: i see. line 25: dpkg-source: info: building gtk-gnutella using existing gtk-gnutella_0.96.5.orig.tar.gz
<mardoct> Ampelbein: ... So it's trying to use the old source instead of the new?
<Ampelbein> mardoct: you need to repack to .tar.gz
<Ampelbein> so bunzip2 foo.tar.bz2, gzip -9 foo.tar
<Ampelbein> mardoct: but please first check if there isn't a .tar.gz tarball for download.
<mardoct> Ampelbein: Only came in .bz2
<Ampelbein> mardoct: then you need to repack.
<mardoct> Ampelbein: I got it to .tar with that command. Should that resolve the error?
<Ampelbein> mardoct: just gzip -9 the tarfile to have a .tar.gz
<mardoct> Ampelbein: Got it. Should I try again?
<Ampelbein> mardoct: oh and it needs to be named <packagename>_<upstreamversion>.orig.tar.gz
<mardoct> Ampelbein: Already in that format.
<Ampelbein> Marce: then you can try again.
<mardoct> Ampelbein: More or less a carbon copy of the last attempt. Fails the same way on the same line.
<kklimonda> hmm.. I have a problem with test suite for django - it requires internet connection to run one of regression tests and as our buildd doesn't have one it fails.
<kklimonda> should I disable this regression test - it may introduce some regressions in the future though we won't be able to find :/
<mardoct> Ampelbein:  I just tried the example on the packaging guide, same results.
<Ampelbein> mardoct: can you paste the new result?
<Ampelbein> mardoct: and also, please paste the output of ls in the directory with orig.tar.gz
<mardoct> http://paste.ubuntu.com/253777/
<mardoct> http://paste.ubuntu.com/253779/
<Ampelbein> mardoct: dpkg-source: info: building gtk-gnutella using existing gtk-gnutella_0.96.5.orig.tar.gz
<Ampelbein> mardoct: could it be that you did not insert a new changelog entry to debian/changelog? you can use dch for that task.
<mardoct> Ampelbein:  I did everything as outlined at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#Updating%20an%20Ubuntu%20Package
<Ampelbein> mardoct: and what is the topmost entry in debian/changelog?
<mardoct> Ampelbein: It had the same results for the example given there as with the gtk-gnutella package.
<Ampelbein> mardoct: did you do the dch thingie? (step 5 of the guide). please pastebin your top debian/changelog entry
<mardoct> Ampelbein: I added a new entry. On closer inspection, I forgot to change the version in the header of the log entry, though. Does it parse that when it tries to build?
<Ampelbein> mardoct: yes, it does. that's why it still compares to 0.96.5.orig.tar.gz instead of the new one.
<mardoct> Ampelbein: I'll try again.
<mardoct> Ampelbein: Haha, success.
<mardoct> Ampelbein: Thank you very much.
<Ampelbein> mardoct: see. is easy. now go become a MOTU ;-)
<mardoct> Ampelbein: On that note, what is the standard procedure for putting the update into the repository?
<Ampelbein> mardoct: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
<mardoct> Ampelbein: Thank you again.
<Ampelbein> mardoct: you're welcome.
<mardoct> Is there an option with pbuilder to make a i386 package on an amd64 computer?
<Laney> yes
<mardoct> Laney do you know it off hand?
<Laney> not at all
<Laney> it's easy with pbuilder-dist though
<mardoct> Laney Just set the distro to 32 bit?
<Laney> pbuilder-dist karmic-i386 create
<mardoct> Laney Ok. Thanks.
<kklimonda> could any MOTU comment on a bug 414176 and maybe sponsor it if everything looks fine?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 414176 in python-django "some regression tests fail because buildd has no access to the internet" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/414176
<Ampelbein> kklimonda: sponsored
<Ampelbein> kklimonda: small change: don't mention maintainerfield change in changelog and I usually name the patch I introduce in changelog. I've made that changes.
<Ampelbein> Question about Fakesyncs: as far as i understand, the version number should become <debianrevision>build1 so that the next revision gets autosynced. but i see a problem. let's say we have foo-5.3-0ubuntu1, debian has foo-5.3-1 but with different orig.tar.gz md5. now we do a fakesync foo-5.3-1build1 - when debian releases a foo-5.3-2 it gets autosynced but still has different orig.tar.gz checksum. how is this prevented to happen?
<Laney> dont use buildN
<Laney> I imagine the autosync script deals with it, but you should use ubuntuN for human consumption imo
<Ampelbein> Laney: ok, that's what i was thinking. but the recent upload of waf (1.5.8+dfsg-2build1) reminded me to ask here.
<superm1> Ampelbein, ideally shouldn't the orig.tar.gz be the same even if we release it sooner?
<Ampelbein> superm1: generally speaking: yes. i don't know about waf, I did not upload the ubuntu or debian version.
<Ampelbein> superm1: but this could happen when repacking a tar.bz2 to tar.gz for example.
<superm1> Ampelbein, yeah i suppose.
<stochastic> I'm attempting to build a package but pbuilder is failing with this error that I'm not sure how to fix:  dpkg-shlibdeps: error: no dependency information found for /usr/share/qt4/lib/libQtXml.so.4 (used by debian/mixxx/usr/bin/mixxx).
<porthose_> would a kind MOTU please ACK bug #414200 :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 414200 in ubuntu "Please sync quickplay-1.5-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/414200
<Ampelbein> porthose_: http://packages.debian.org/sid/quickplay gives me a "no such package". and pull-debian-source fails probably due to master.debian.org outage.
<porthose_> hmm it's showing me a PTS page a QA Page and on package.debian.org :(  Ok I'll just ask a little later on thx :)
<sebner> porthose_: I'm a kind MOTU ;) I fetched it directly from the debian ftp server (it takes some time until it shows up on p.d.o), Reviewing and testbuilding now
<porthose_> sebner, Ohh cool thx alot :)
<sebner> porthose_: is it python2.6 compatible?
<porthose_> sebner, yes
<sebner> porthose_: makes things easier :)
<porthose_> :)
<sebner> porthose_: ACKed. if it breaks, you have to fix it :P
<porthose_> hahaha Ok :)
<porthose_> sebner, thx :)
<sebner> you're welcome
<sebner> gn8 folks
<porthose_> sebner, gnite
<stochastic> is this a bug against libqt4-dev:  dpkg-shlibdeps: error: no dependency information found for /usr/share/qt4/lib/libQtXml.so.4
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-16
<stochastic> james_w, if you have any more time, I've fixed the copyright file in http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/a2jmidid
<RainCT> directhex: Got some time to review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/mistelix? :)
<directhex> RainCT, seems sound
<RainCT> directhex: gonna give me an advocation today? :)
<directhex> don't think i have the button needed to do so
<RainCT> directhex: Which means you should use REVU more! :P
<RainCT> Now you have
<directhex> :o
<RainCT> mok0!! :P
<RainCT> directhex: thanks!
<happyaron> could someone have time have a review on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gmchess ?
<ripps_> happyaron: in my experience, it seems easier to get new packages into debian through debian mentors and then to make a sync request in ubuntu. Motu's only seem to check revu once in a blue moon
<happyaron> ripps_: oh, thanks
<hyperair> ripps: my experience is the reverse. i've gotten a few packages in through revu before, but none through debian mentors.
<hyperair> ripps: of course, it's better to use debian-mentors and get it synced over anyway, but that's a different matter.
<happyaron> hyperair: I volunteer to maintain that tor package in ubuntu, how can I do that?
<hyperair> happyaron: er what?
<happyaron> hyperair: I want maintain 'tor' in ubuntu, which deleted before
<hyperair> hmm i'm not sure why it was deleted in the first place
<happyaron> hyperair: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tor/+bug/328442
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 328442 in tor "Tor 0.1.2.x abandoned by upstream, update to 0.2.0.34" [Undecided,Fix released]
<hyperair> hmm fix released?
<hyperair> that means it's back in ubutnu?
<happyaron> hyperair: no ,the fix is abandoned in jaunty
<happyaron> hyperair: I want it back, and seems it needs somebody to maintain it for ubuntu as it was said in that bug
<hyperair> i see.
<hyperair> i'm not sure how to go about reintroducing packages
<hyperair> chances are you'll have to go through NEW again
<hyperair> basically package a new fix, stick it in revu, and such
<hyperair> or debian-mentors
<hyperair> was it removed from debian?
<happyaron> hyperair: no
<happyaron> hyperair: I requested the sync, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/413657
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 413657 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] Please sync tor 0.2.1.19-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New]
<hyperair> ah. subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<happyaron> but they told me we need somebody keep maintain it for ubuntu
<happyaron> hyperair: and send a mail there?
<hyperair> who is they?
<hyperair> and got a link to the post?
<hyperair> nono subscribe the launchpad team ubuntu-universe-sponsors to that bug
<happyaron> somebody in this channel
<happyaron> oh
<hyperair> is someone maintaining it in debian/
<hyperair> or has it been orphaned?
<hyperair> packages.qa.debian.org is hating me currently =\
<hyperair> huh bugs.debian.org as well
<happyaron> hyperair: there is somebody still maintains it
<happyaron> I cannot access packages.qa.debian.org either
<hyperair> in that case, it shouldn't be much of an issue and should get autosynced at the beginning of every release
<hyperair> any archive admins here?
<happyaron> hyperair: but it was deleted in jaunty because the 0.1.x is abandoned by upstream, but nobody maintains 0.2.x for ubuntu, as described in that bug
<happyaron> http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=tor&searchon=names&suite=all&section=all
<hyperair> that's not a bug address
<happyaron> that's a search result in packages.ubuntu.com
<happyaron> this is the previous bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tor/+bug/328442
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 328442 in tor "Tor 0.1.2.x abandoned by upstream, update to 0.2.0.34" [Undecided,Fix released]
<happyaron> and this is my sync request https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/413657
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 413657 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] Please sync tor 0.2.1.19-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New]
<hyperair> happyaron: yes yes can you stop reposting your links please.
<hyperair> now then.
<hyperair> i've read through the bug, and it seems that the person who was involved mainly was pitti
<hyperair> i say you sit around and wait for him here
<hyperair> or #ubuntu-desktop
<happyaron> oh
<hyperair> and ask him *nicely* not annoyingly repeating yourself multiple times here.
<hyperair> or email him
<happyaron> sorry, I just didn't understand what you said in 'that's not a bug address', so I repeated the links
<logari81> hi, I have a package which installs a python module using debhelper+pysupport
<logari81> in jaunty the module is installed in
<logari81> usr/share/python-support/packagename/pythonversion/.....
<logari81> in karmic it is being installed in
<logari81> usr/lib/pyshared/pythonversion/...
<logari81> instead. Why does this happen?
<maxb> logari81: Because python-support has been redesigned to act in that way.
<iulian> How much time does it take for a new package to show up in the pools?
<logari81> maxb: nice, it is normal then.... I don't have to worry
<therm> iulian: "it depends" ;-)
<therm> iulian: on you and your skills in packaging, on the calendar date (feature freeze), if you find someone who is reviewing your packages and so on..
<maxb> iulian: define "new"
<iulian> maxb: Synced from Debian.
<iulian> It seems that some buildds are busy.
<andv> iulian, as soon as it gets built it will be published in LP
<andv> don't worry
<andv> iulian, depends on buildd queue
<iulian> Yea.
<andv> but I guess in 3-4 hours will be done
<slytherin> iulian: is that a new source?
<iulian> That odd.  Then why liblocale-msgfmt-perl hasn't been published?  bug#412585
<iulian> s/that/that's/
<LLStarks> hi.
<LLStarks> can i get a sense of progress on this? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libass/+bug/410112
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 410112 in libass "libass 0.9.7 released" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<iulian> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/412585
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 412585 in ubuntu "please sync liblocale-msgfmt-perl from debian sid" [Wishlist,Fix released]
<LLStarks> i know it's been ppa'd already, but what's keeping it from the build farm?
<LLStarks> isn't 10 days enough for a fair evaluation?
<iulian> LLStarks: It hasn't been uplaoded yet.
<slytherin> LLStarks: evaluation where? Is it available in revu?
<LLStarks> not sure.
<slytherin> iulian: your package is here - https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=liblocale-msgfmt-perl
<iulian> Oh!
<iulian> That explains it.
<slytherin> LLStarks: As discussed on the Debian bug, has SONAME bump been taken care of? What about transition plat for packages that build-depend on it?
<LLStarks> i'm the wrong person to  ask.
<LLStarks> i'd like to think all outstanding issues are resolved.
<LLStarks> artur, the sponsor, has a ppa package that would suggest so.
<LLStarks> https://launchpad.net/%7Eari-tczew/+archive/ppa/+sourcepub/692957/+listing-archive-extra
 * LLStarks sighs
<LLStarks> i find the cynicism of the gstreamer and totem dev teams to be counterproductive to delivering a product that can outperform mplayer out of the box.
<rowinggolfer> can anyone tell me if this howto is still current? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Python
<rowinggolfer> it advocates the use of python-central
<rowinggolfer> pochu: I guess I am asking you ^^^
<rowinggolfer> pochu: great howto, but not working for my project. (openmolar on launchpad)
<maxb> rowinggolfer: My impression is that community consensus favours python-support these days
<rowinggolfer> maxb: that's the conclusion I am coming to also
<rowinggolfer> although I am struggling to find any documentation for it.
<rowinggolfer> maxb: my problem is exacerbated by the fact that *.egg files (ie. using setuptools not distutils)
<rowinggolfer> seems to be the flavour of the month
<rowinggolfer> and yet I would like my project debs to be build in launchpad.
<rowinggolfer> I am REALLY confused at the moment.
<rowinggolfer> and would much rather be adding new features to the app itself
<rowinggolfer> as opposed to trawling through contradictory howtos.
<maxb> rowinggolfer: Perhaps if you explain your current specific problem, or point to a failing buildlog or package that built wrongly, people here can help
<rowinggolfer> maxb: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/30377369/buildlog_ubuntu-intrepid-amd64.openmolar_0.1.2-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<c_korn> hello, I am trying to create a sync request for scilab using requestsync but I get this error: http://pastebin.com/ddcfaf51
<rowinggolfer> when I tried to build this
<rowinggolfer> https://launchpad.net/~rowinggolfer/+archive/ppa/+build/1166278
<maxb> dpkg-gencontrol: error: error occurred while parsing , , $(python:Depends}
<maxb> rowinggolfer: error is (somewhat) obvious :-)
<maxb> hint: look carefully at those brackets :-)
<slytherin> c_korn: read the last line in that error
<andv> c_korn, you should set up your user informations
<andv> c_korn, so that LP will recognize you when you submit the bug report
<c_korn> slytherin: I know. but the wiki says that I will be prompted for my GPG passphrase and not that I type my LP password in plain text somewhere: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<slytherin> c_korn: Before that the requestsync needs to setup a cookie. Did you check manpage of manage-credentials?
<c_korn> I did. and requestsync asked me to log in in LP using firefox so it can get the cookie. I did so but now it additionaly requires my password ?
<slytherin> c_korn: Which password is it asking you?
<c_korn> slytherin: ok, it also only wanted me to log in into LP. I think this step should be noted in the wiki. Am I allowed to add it ?
<slytherin> c_korn: sure, why not.
<rowinggolfer> maxb - whoops.
<rowinggolfer> thanks!
<c_korn> ok, thanks. I added it.
<c_korn> eh, why do I have to attach a build log ? is this always the case? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/scilab/+bug/414410/comments/1
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 414410 in scilab "Sync scilab 5.1.1-7 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,New]
<geser> c_korn: depends on your sponsor, Andrea wants to see a build log as a proof that you test-build the package before requesting the sync
<andv> c_korn, I'm not at home so I can't test-build it on my own
<andv> and anyway it's alwais important to test build packages before asking to sync them
<andv> (packages coming from unstable to karmic of course)
<andv> geser, ty for the response
 * Laney always builds before sponsoring anyway
<andv> Laney, if I'm not at home, I just ask to provide a build log
<c_korn> ok, I just followed the wiki. maybe I should also add this as a note. so dputting the debian unstable package into a PPA for karmic is enough ?
<andv> or ask my cousin's pc but he just left
<andv> c_korn, yes
<andv> c_korn, just add a note saying sometimes is preferred a build log
<andv> attached at the sync request
<andv> (if the sponsor requires it of course)
<andv> geser, the automated sync import is no more active?
<geser> no, the automated sync stops at DIF
<slytherin> andv: not since Debian Import Freeze
<andv> true, ty for the info
<pochu> rowinggolfer: I guess it could use some love, but shouldn't be too far from reality
<happyaron> geser: hi
<logari81> how should I handle some source files without any license and copyright notes? They are mostly small test files, not really important for the package. Could I just ignore them in debian/copyright ?
<andv> logari81, usually all source files should have their own license header
<slytherin> logari81: No. You can not ignore any files. Either contact upstream and ask them to assign a copyright/license or remove the files while creating .orig.tar.gz
<rowinggolfer> pochu: thanks. turns out the problem was me being as dense as concrete
<logari81> andv, slytherin: ok I ll try to contact the upstream
<andv> great
<geser> happyaron: Hi
<happyaron> geser: I have packed tor, but where to upload it? to revu?
<andv> happyaron, please ask your question to the whole channel
<andv> and not to a specific person
<andv> (of course if this specific person is not directly involved in what you ask)
<andv> happyaron, is that a NEW package?
<andv> happyaron, or a new upstream release? or what?
<happyaron> andv: no, 'tor'
<happyaron> andv: yes, but deleted in jaunty
<devfil> happyaron: what did happen to the sync request?
<andv> happyaron, deleted in jaunty??
<andv> happyaron, why?
<happyaron> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/413657
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 413657 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] Please sync tor 0.2.1.19-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New]
<andv> happyaron, if it has been deleted from jaunty there should be a valid motivation
<happyaron> the bug which have it deleted was bug #328442
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 328442 in tor "Tor 0.1.2.x abandoned by upstream, update to 0.2.0.34" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/328442
<devfil> happyaron: well, I think the sync request is enough, if you work on a new package or the package is taken from debian is the same thing (but it's better to have it due to a sync), pelase ask to pitti if we can upload that
<happyaron> though it shows fix released, the solution is delete tor in jaunty
<andv> happyaron, you should talk to an archive admin about whether we should accept it back or not, I guess
<happyaron> andv: archive admin, who are they?
<devfil> happyaron: please, ask to pitti
<happyaron> ok, still pitti
<andv> happyaron, pitti for istance, he replied on that bug report too
<happyaron> I know
<andv> so he will know what to do
<happyaron> okay, thanks
<andv> np
<geser> andv: from the old thread on ubuntu-devl I assume it will get accepted back iff there is a maintainer for it who also takes care about the versions in the released Ubuntu versions
<andv> geser, yeah, it seems happyaron wanna maintain it on Ubuntu
<andv> let's see what will happen after his talk with pitti then
<happyaron> andv, geser I've sent him a mail, what to do might be wait for him
<andv> yep
<hyperair> geser: what's the issue with just having it get autosynced from debian?
<hyperair> geser: there's a debian maintainer isn't there?
<geser> hyperair: missing SRUs
<hyperair> geser: i mean in karmic. it's gone from karmic as well
<geser> upstream contacted Ubuntu and asked us to remove tor from released versions as we were shipping versions abandoned upstream
<hyperair> yes, i noticed.
<hyperair> but karmic isn't released is it
<geser> hyperair: we could sync it to karmic but have to remove it before release, so why sync in the first place?
<hyperair> ..eh what?
<geser> (unless we find a maintainer)
<hyperair> no wait, aren't the debian packages maintained upstream?
<geser> I don't know the situation exactly. I know that upstream has a repo with debs for Debian and Ubuntu
<hyperair> the issue was with a certain version of tor, but it's been picked up by another upstream was it not?
<hyperair> yeah, i know that too
<hyperair> but taht's all i know
<geser> hyperair: and how do we prevent that it doesn't happen again?
<hyperair> upstream abandonment?
<hyperair> don't all projects undergo the same risk?
<hyperair> especially if it's maintained upstream by a person rather than a team?
<geser> say, we sync tor 2.1.19 (IIRC that's the current version) to karmic, release karmic with it, upstream releases 2.2.0 in a few months and doesn't support 2.1.x say 6 months later (or so) while karmic will still be in support
<hyperair> i see, so you basically want someone to actively backport it?
<geser> (don't know upstream release plans at all)
<geser> yes
<hyperair> sounds like a painful upstream.
<geser> someone who takes care that karmic will have a version of tor which is maintained upstream
<hyperair> i'm just speculating here, but aren't most projects obsoleting their old versions and telling you to upgrade to the latest, but incidentally the latest doesn't appear in stable versions of ubuntu because the archive's frozen?
<geser> I can understand upstream that they don't want to support Ubuntu users with a version which is too old (e.g. once synced before DIF of a LTS version)
<geser> hyperair: yes, other upstreams may have the same problem but they don't contact Ubuntu and simply ignore that problem
<hyperair> in other words, as long as the upstream says "we don't support an old version any more" we're going to purge it from the archive, including from an unstable archive?
<hyperair> that'll screw around with our entire release cycle won't it?
<hyperair> though i think the best person to talk about this issue with is pitti, since he's the on who made the decision then.
<geser> we aren't hostile towards upstream and try to find solutions which please all but if the only solution is that we remove it than it will be
<hyperair> perhaps there are additional reasons that aren't clear
<hyperair> i know we aren't hostile with upstream, in fact we should work well together with upstream if possible. but i think that purging a package from the archive just because it isn't supported is too harsh.
<geser> in the tor case someone stepped up to updated the tor packages once (for the released versions) but as we didn't find someone to look after them in the future is was the best to remove it
<hyperair> there are many users (like me) who want to use an old version of the package even if it isn't supported.
<hyperair> something like "i don't care if it's supported or not. it's worked for me in the past, and will continue to work for me so just let me use my old crippled version if you're not going to give me a new one"
<hyperair> if it's broken, i'd understand completely. purge it from the archive since it's not going to be much use in the archive anyway. but it wasn't broken beyond use (or at least not highlighted in the bug reports anyway)
<geser> hyperair: nothing forces you to remove installed packages if you don't want and removing packages from released versions is pretty hard (never heard that Ubuntu needed to do that)
<hyperair> geser: i'm talking about if i reinstalled ubuntu and want to get back my packages
<hyperair> geser: there are many users who reinstall every release instead of just do-release-upgrade-ing or using update-manager all the way
<geser> as removing from released versions it pretty hard, it won't probably happen for that reason, but it will be removed from the development versions (and therefore future release) if no solution can be found
<hyperair> geser: what about the just-let-it-autosync-from-debian solution?
<geser> hyperair: see the ion3 case in Debian. upstream was unhappy that Debian shipped old devel versions in stable so changed the license and force it to non-free (http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/non-free/i/ion3/ion3_20090110-2/ion3-dev.copyright)
<hyperair> ...that's ridiculous =.=
<geser> hyperair: that only works till DIF and after that nobody files sync requests and prepares SRU or backports -> upstream unhappy again
<hyperair> i pity whoever has to deal with ion3's upstream.
<hyperair> geser: are all packages maintained by at least somebody in ubuntu, or is there a significant number that aren't, but just in debian?
<andv> hyperair, the latest
<andv> i would say
<hyperair> andv: what latest?
<andv> hyperair, the latest phrase you said
<hyperair> latter you mean?
<andv> yeah :)
<andv> usually a lot of Debian maintainer works on ubuntu too
<geser> hyperair: depends how you define "maintain". there are certainly packages in universe which are just auto-synced from Debian where nobody ever looked at the bugs in LP
<andv> so there aren't any problems
<hyperair> okay, excluding those.
<hyperair> geser: that's precisely what i mean.
<hyperair> geser: if we go around deleting packages just because they're just auto-synced and nobody stares at it in LP, we're going to have a significantly decreased pool.
<andv> hyperair, the problem was not related to the fact they are auto-synced
<geser> hyperair: we do it only when upstream asks us to and nobody steps up to look after the package
<hyperair> andv: i meant just autosynced and not brought into ubuntu via any other method.
<hyperair> geser: well let's pray hard that we don't get any more fussy upstreams.
<andv> hyperair, usually auto-synced packages are maintained correctly in Debian
<hyperair> geser: if there are enough of these upstreams, we'll have a significantly reduced pool and people will start jumping ship.
<hyperair> andv: isn't tor maintained correctly in Debian?
<andv> hyperair, dunno
<andv> didnt follow that package for a while
<hyperair> the PTS seems to show that it's actively maintained.
<andv> but from what geser said upstream directly contacted ubuntu to have old versions removed
<hyperair> he filed a bug, yes.
<andv> that's the main problem not the fact it's auto-synced
<andv> let's hope the guy who wants to maintain it here will do a good work then
<hyperair> why couldn't we just file a sync request, and then let the next DI round bring the next version in again?
<andv> hyperair, I guess that's happyaron's idea
<andv> hyperair, he mailed pitti already who followed tor issue in the past
<geser> and who looks at tor once karmic is released? that's the main problem as there nobody is/was to do it
<andv> geser, I thought happyaron wanted
<geser> andv: yes, that's the plan
<andv> oh ok, that's it then
<hyperair> geser: my main concern here is that there are presumably many other packages in a similar situation, with the exception that they don't have fussy upstreams.
<andv> hyperair, yep
<geser> tor can be synced again if the archive admins are happy with happyaron maintained it
<hyperair> and i think it's important that we give more consideration to our users
<hyperair> this is a one-off case that is resolved by getting a maintainer.
<hyperair> i find it disturbing that something like this can happen.
<andv> hyperair, luckily seems this issue is a bit rare
<hyperair> yes, luckily, but i'd still like our users to be given greater priority.
<Laney> I think there was more to it than upstream support
<Laney> ie the packages didn't work or had security holes
<Laney> there's a thread about it
<hyperair> security holes i think.
<hyperair> but i think they did work.
<hyperair> at least in intrepid i used it
<Laney> "unmaintained" is a bad excuse
<Laney> as the vast vast majority of *verse packages aren't maintained by us
<andv> hyperair, Debian usually don't have this kind of problems cause its particular way of maintaining things (e.g there is a specific person who looks up a package)
<hyperair> andv: i agree. i'm concerned about *ubuntu* users.
<Laney> anyway
<hyperair> all we need is to have a set of fussy upstreams, and have a few more packages purged in a similar manner, and whee no more users.
<Laney> if upstream maintain a deb repository of their own, and we updated the SRU policy with a specific exception for tor
<Laney> ....you see where I'm going
<hyperair> update the policy how exactly?
<geser> hyperair: we don't help our users either when we provide them old packages who nobody cared to update for security holes
<Laney> there was an agreement to allow new upstream releases of tor
<hyperair> geser: you don't help users, but at least you don't go out of your way to inconvenience them.
<Laney> the problem was the nobody did it
<Laney> that*
<hyperair> Laney: so there was such a clause in the policy?
<geser> hyperair: true, but if we don't have ressources to do it properly then IMHO it's better to not provided a package instead of raising assumptions in the users that we can't hold (at least they know that they're on their own)
<Laney> http://www.mailinglistarchive.com/ubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com/msg24406.html
<Laney> I'm suggesting that if upstream maintain these debs anyway then they might as well maintain them in ubuntu
<hyperair> i'm thinking the same thing actually. happyaron: maybe you should go contact them, and establish some form of communica-oh hell he disappeared.
<geser> hyperair: this problem might only arise for a very active upstream (releases several times a year) and popular programmes as users will contact upstream for help. It probably won't occur for software which releases once 2 years with only a few users.
<hyperair> agreed. but i'd suggest that popcon should be consulted before purging a package like that with "unmaintained" as the excuse.
<geser> removing a package from the development version should only be a last resort and should not be dismissed as an non-option how unpleasant it is
<geser> of course we should try any other option before going this way
<hyperair> mmhmm
<hyperair> but in tor's case, it was a remove-or-update request wasn't it? if upstream cared enough to request this of ubuntu, why not expend the effort to file a sync request occasionally?
<Laney> it's stable updates that are the problem
<hyperair> imo it was remove-from-future-releases, wasn't it?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> but the reason was keeping it up to date in stable releases
<hyperair> i see.
<hyperair> imo upstream should have expended the effort of getting it backported =\
<hyperair> filing a backport request or something
<andv> hyperair, it got backported to hardy
<geser> I don't expect that upstream knows all the processes in all those distro out there (and they shouldn't care)
<andv> and then nothing more
<hyperair> i think if they care enough to request removal, they should care enough to go through all the procedures.
<hyperair> otherwise just not care about requesting removal
<geser> hyperair: do you expect that upstreams knows the backport process in Debian? or OpenSuse? or Fedora? I don't
<hyperair> i expect them to either not care about a distro enough to request removal, or to care about a distro enough to get it updated.
<geser> they care about their software and in there eyes getting it removed was the easiest way to resolve the problem
<hyperair> i can't bring myself to agree with their thinking, esp if it was released under GPL or some other DFSG-compatible permissive license. it's contradiction, nothing else.
<geser> they probably don't care about Ubuntu, they just want to stop the support requests from Ubuntu users using obsolete versions
<hyperair> they could ignore them =\
<hyperair> or redirect them
<Laney> they clearly do care if they maintain their own packages
<hyperair> mmhmm
<geser> this discussion leads nowhere as we don't know the reasons and thinking from upstream which lead to that mail
<hyperair> true
<geser> we got that request and had to deal with it somehow
<Laney> did we?
<geser> did we not? there was a thread on ubuntu-devel ML what to do
<Laney> Just saying that doing nothing was an option
<Laney> and the interests of the distro and the interest of upstream aren't always the same thing
<hyperair> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tor/+bug/147987 <-- another bug referring to the whole tor issue
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 147987 in tor "remove tor from gutsy" [Undecided,Invalid]
<hyperair> there's a link to a long ml thread there as well
<hyperair> and a post from their project leader: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2007-September/024479.html
<nhandler> It looks like the new lintian will be maintaining a list of certain meta packages in order to notify people when a package depends on a meta package. Would we be interested in modifying the list in Ubuntu so that it knows about some of our Ubuntu-specific meta packages?
<AnAnt> Hello, can someone help me with this build failure: dpkg-gencontrol: error: current host architecture 'amd64' does not appear in package's architecture list (i386)
<AnAnt> why does this cause an error ?
<slytherin> AnAnt: apparently you are trying to build a i386 only package on amd64 machine
<slytherin> AnAnt: check 'Architecture' in control file
<AnAnt> slytherin: well, it's a source package that got 2 binary packages, one of them is Arch: i386 only
<slytherin> AnAnt: right, that is the reason for failure
<AnAnt> well, that's wierd, I don't remember that this failed before
<slytherin> AnAnt: by the way, in case you haven't noticed already monajat source is in 'NEW' queue.
<AnAnt> slytherin: oh
<AnAnt> slytherin: there's a python re-write for it that's almost ready
<AnAnt> slytherin: I didn't notice indeed ! I didn't get any notification
<slytherin> LOL
<slytherin> I don't know who exactly is recipient of notification. The usual practice is to send mail to motu ML when sponsoring a package form REVU. And I forgot to do that. :-(
<AnAnt> thanks anyways
<slytherin> welcome
<AnAnt> so, back to the arch thing
<AnAnt> are you sure  that this is right ?
<AnAnt> I remember that I built sl-modem on launchpad before, and this problem didn't happen
<slytherin> have you checked previous build logs?
<AnAnt> checking now
<therm> good evening
<AnAnt> I just realized that this is the first time I build sl-modem for karmic
<AnAnt> it was for jaunty before !
<therm> someone an idea what I did wrong:
<therm> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<therm>   eclipse-rcp: Depends: libswt3.4-gtk-java (= 3.4.1-0ubuntu2) but it is not going to be installed  libswtcalendar-java: Depends: libswt-gtk-3.4-java but it is not going to be installed E: Broken packages
<therm> ?
<AnAnt> old build logs aren't available !
<slytherin> AnAnt: -daemon package is for both i386 and amd64, at least in jaunty.
<AnAnt> yes, it's -source that's for i386 only
<AnAnt> ah, I found an old build log
<slytherin> therm: there is a conflict between libswt3.4-gtk-java and libswt-gtk-3.4-java. The former package is built form eclipse source and later is from separate swt-gtk source.
<slytherin> therm: Unfortunately I haven't found time to make eclipse use the swt-gtk package.
<therm> slytherin: So there is no way to build it at the moment?
<slytherin> therm: build what?
<therm> slytherin: jameica, thats why I am packaging all the packages like swtcalendar ;-)
<therm> slytherin: and based on jameica -> hibiscus
<slytherin> therm: why do you need eclipse-rcp for that?
<therm> slytherin: Because of those jar-files:
<slytherin> what jar files can you please be clear?
<therm> /usr/lib/eclipse/plugins/org.eclipse.core.runtime_3.4.0.v20080512.jar /usr/lib/eclipse/plugins/org.eclipse.jface_3.4.1.M20080827-2000.jar /usr/lib/eclipse/plugins/org.eclipse.osgi_3.4.2.R34x_v20080826-1230.jar /usr/lib/eclipse/plugins/org.eclipse.ui.forms_3.3.101.v20080708_34x.jar
<therm> sorry it took a moment
<slytherin> sorry, can't help this time. time to hit bed. office tomorrow.
<slytherin> see you later.
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-16
<wgrant> yofel_: Soyuz doesn't do -dbgsyms itself yet -- it's handled by a non-Launchpad hack which I don't know the details of.
<wgrant> yofel_: However, Soyuz will start handling them soon, and it works for backports.
<AnAnt> Hello
<superm1> wgrant, does that mean they'll be published in the regular archive too, and hence increasing the size of the packages.gz that gets downloaded?
<wgrant> superm1: Only for PPAs.
<wgrant> We have a separate archive for ddebs.
<superm1> ah nice
<wgrant> Well, will have, once I finish writing it.
<superm1> that sounds good by me
<ebroder> Ooh - ddebs are going into PPAs? That's awesome
<wgrant> Yes.
<wgrant> The PPA work is done, but we can't really safely turn it on until it works for the primary archive too.
<ebroder> Rock on
<wgrant> I did most of it a couple of weeks ago, and I will hopefully have the last couple of fixes done this cycle.
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> Looking at that mail on -motu, does LyX still need the delta?
<Laney> Merge changelog says "+    - debian/control: do not build latex-xft-fonts, it has its own
<Laney> +      source package in main."
<Laney> but that package got demoted to universe in Lucid
<Laney> well I have to go away for the rest of the week now, but it would be nice if someone could look at this. I think that latex-xft-fonts can now be removed and then lyx synced. You could explain this to the guy on the mailing list and then ask him to file the sync FFe bug.
<Laney> bye all!
<bilalakhtar> I have a question. Package sbackup is maintained in Debian. But, a new version of the package is desperately needed. Is it OK to get the new upstream version directly into Ubuntu? (FFe needed) or should I get it into Debian (FFe should be needed for the merge)?
<bilalakhtar> Desperately needed because of bug #550261
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 550261 in One Hundred Paper Cuts "Backups cannot be started through the GUI" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/550261
<RAOF> bilalakhtar: By and large you should feel free to fix bugs in Ubuntu.
<bilalakhtar> RAOF: The new upstream version fixes the bug, in reality
<bilalakhtar> RAOF: An SRU is waiting in lucid-proposed as well.
<RAOF> So, update the package & send that packaging up to Debian.
<bilalakhtar> RAOF: update the package first in ubuntu?
<bilalakhtar> ok
<RAOF> Unless there's a particularly active Debian/Ubuntu collaboration team caring for sbackup (as the pkg-mono team cares for the -cil packages) there's no problem in uploading first for Ubuntu.
<AnAnt> dholbach: hello
<AnAnt> Laney: bye
<dholbach> hey AnAnt
<AnAnt> I don't understand that thing about latex-xft-fonts
<AnAnt> why did Ubuntu have its own latex-xft-fonts package ?
<AnAnt> ah, I got it
<AnAnt> ok, how do I file a removal request for latex-xft-fonts
<AnAnt> Laney: thanks for spotting it -> LP: #618547
 * Laney hugs AnAnt 
<Laney> â confirmed and subscribe the archive
<AnAnt> Laney: are you sure you confirmed & subscribed archive to LP 618547 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 618547 in latex-xft-fonts (Ubuntu) "Please remove latex-xft-fonts" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/618547
<Laney> no, I was saying that's what you need to do
<AnAnt> ah, ok
<AnAnt> what's archive ?
<Laney> ubuntu-archive
<AnAnt> ok
<AnAnt> done
<AnAnt> also sent an email about it
<Laney> \o/
<Adri2000> -:
<Adri2000> oops, sorry
<AnAnt> vish: Hello
<AnAnt> vish: how can LP #613304 be fixed ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 613304 in zekr (Ubuntu) "Zekr SC logo is very low resolution" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/613304
<AnAnt> vish: what icon does software center use ?
<vish> AnAnt: hey.. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter#Icon , looks to like the app does not have the icon in all sizes [i havent gone through the package though]
<AnAnt> is it the icon used by .desktop file?
<AnAnt> vish: what's the expected resolution ?
<vish> AnAnt: it seems to be using 48px icons
<AnAnt> ok, there are 48, 128 & 256 px
<vish> AnAnt: hmm , yeah , was just checking the branch , might be app-install-data problem?
<AnAnt> vish: yes, the .desktop file uses the 32px xpm icon, which is very ugly
<vish> AnAnt: ah , there you go :)
<AnAnt> ok, I will assign myself to it
<AnAnt> vish: thanks for the heads up
<vish> AnAnt: np , thanks for picking it up :)
<AnAnt> vish: how can I test the SC fix ?
<vish> AnAnt: not really sure , you could ask some of the SC hackers , they are hanging out in -desktop right now..
<kaushal> hi
<kaushal> can someone please guide me about https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-server/2010-August/004541.html ?
<tumbleweed> kaushal: looks like a bad postinst script
<tumbleweed> kaushal: it should allow invoke-rc.d to fail
<kaushal> tumbleweed, ok
<tumbleweed> kaushal: you intend to fix it?
<kaushal> so any suggestion ?
<kaushal> tumbleweed, not sure i understand about  you intend to fix it?
<tumbleweed> kaushal: I was asking why you were asking
<kaushal> tumbleweed, if you can give me some clue please ?
<Rhonda> kaushal: It is not clear what your question is. Do you want to fix the package, do you want to workaround so you can fix installation of the package for yourself, do you want to file a bugreport about it?
<AnAnt> bdrung: what's top-posting ?
<bdrung> AnAnt: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style
<AnAnt> ah, thanks
<kaushal> Rhonda, sorry was away
<kaushal> when i install collectd using apt-get install collectd i get that error
<kaushal> Starting statistics collection and monitoring daemon:
<kaushal> collectdinvoke-rc.d: initscript collectd, action "start" failed.
<bacon> hi, is it the good chanel to aska bout debian packaging?
<tumbleweed> bacon: #ubuntu-packaging
<bacon> tumbleweed: nobody's answering on this channel :/
<bacon> it is like dead
<bacon> tumbleweed: i tried before coming here
<tumbleweed> bacon: aah, I've only heard other people recommend it. /me pops in there to help bacon
<stalcup> bacon: yes, ask your question and someone will answer
<micahg> stalcup: the user is being helped in -packaging now
<bacon> stalcup: thanks anyway ;)
<stalcup> eh? there is a packaging now?
<micahg> stalcup: yeah, to consolidate PPA and non archive packaging help from #launchpad and this channel
<AnAnt> is Stefan Potyra here ?
<jpds> AnAnt: No.
<ari-tczew> where can I check current UTC time?
<jdong> http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=utc+time
<lfaraone> ari-tczew: http://everytimezone.com/
<jdong> err not sourceid=chrome </shame>
<micahg> ari-tczew: date -u
<lfaraone> damn, that doesn't list UTC *headdes*
<lfaraone> ari-tczew: what micahg said.
<jdong> TZ=UTC date
<jdong> that works too
<jdong> the inverse is date -d "17:00 UTC" which converts it to local time
<ari-tczew> jdong, lfaraone, micahg: thanks, I'm in UTC +0200
<ari-tczew> +2 hours
<lfaraone> micahg: did you see http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/debian-olpc-devel/2010-August/002900.html by any chance? looks like somebody on the debian side has pyxpcom packaged separately
<micahg> jdong: I wanted to ask you about the SRU process, I modified the procedure to say subscribe ubuntu-sru after upload, but that doesn't match your original email
<micahg> lfaraone: yeah, he has an ITP for pyxpcom
<jdong> micahg: well, feel free to subscribe SRU as soon as you have a patch ready, but don't wait on approval before uploading
<lfaraone> micahg: I tested out his package, it worked at the very least with Browse.activity
<micahg> jdong: but that was the understanding I got from the emails as a whole though
<jdong> micahg: I usually go look at the upload queue to see what SRUs are waiting for approval
<micahg> jdong: k, so maybe I should just revert my change to the procedure then
<lfaraone> micahg: would that package possibly be usable as-is in Ubuuntu?
<micahg> lfaraone: yes, I think so
<micahg> jdong: should I revert this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates?action=diff&rev2=151&rev1=150
<lfaraone> micahg: mk. I should ask if he needs a sponsor
<ari-tczew> I need a sponsor for SRU right now :P
<micahg> lfaraone: I don't think that's the issue, the package can't go in until squeeze is released
<lfaraone> micahg: lies!
<jdong> micahg: yeah, please revert that
<micahg> jdong: k, sorry
<jdong> micahg: if you want to clarify the procedure a bit, you can add that you don't need to wait for approval before uploading to -proposed
<lfaraone> micahg: that's why god gave us the wonder known as experimental. (aka the "rc buggy" release)
<jdong> micahg: no worries!
<micahg> lfaraone: well, idk, can one upload a package to experimental if it's not in unstable
<lfaraone> micahg: yep. sugar-0.90 is there right now.
 * micahg wishes there was a revert button
<jdong> haha we need more vandals to motivate that feature!
 * micahg goes to hide in his vandal cave
<micahg> jdong: better? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates?action=diff&rev2=152&rev1=150
<jdong> micahg: yep. Note that on step 5, that email is already linked. Maybe move that statement down to step 5 so we dont' link to the same thing under 2 different names?
<micahg> lfaraone: idk what he's waiting on then, maybe more feedback
<lfaraone> micahg: fair enough, I replied saying "works great, let me know if you want a hand getting it in"
<micahg> jdong: I don't see that
<jdong> micahg: nvm I was looking at the wrong revision before
<jdong> disregard that statement, what you've got looks good!
<jdong> *gets more coffee*
<micahg> lfaraone: I'd still like someone to make sure that it will be supported long term before we reinclude it
<micahg> jdong: awesome :)
<jdong> thank you
<lfaraone> micahg: what sort of maintinence needs to be done? I'd imagine only bugfixes. (unless the stable API that pyxpcom uses will change....)
<micahg> jdong: np
<micahg> lfaraone: well, the xul APIs will change and unless pyxpcom will track those, we can't throw it in the archive since security support will end for xul192 long before the series is EOL
<lfaraone> micahg: okay, so we  just update it to the next-upstream-version when needed, right?
<micahg> lfaraone: well, last pyxpcom update was Feb 2010 which isn't a good sign
<micahg> lfaraone: yeah, we'll probably throw the release after 4.0 into maverick
<lfaraone> micahg: that just feels wrong to me.
<lfaraone> (otoh, I'm not stepping up to support 3.6 either :)
<micahg> lfaraone: we already upgraded hardy/jaunty/karmic to 3.6
<kamal> bdrung: sorry for botching my FFe subscriber sequence there, and thanks for fixing it :-)
<bdrung> yw
<ScottK> crimsun_: Back in January you fixed Slicer so it would build.  Now it FTBFS with the current VTK in Maverick.  I was wondering if you might have a look at it.
<micahg> ooh someone removed sparc from FTBFS page
<ScottK> geser: ^^^
<micahg> TB meeting about it isn't for another week
<ScottK> The data isn't removed, just not displayed.
<micahg> ah
<ScottK> Worrying about sparc is pointless even if they don't kill it.  The port doesn't actually work.
 * micahg was just commenting
<geser> micahg: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/+builds?build_text=&build_state=failed&arch_tag=sparc if you're still interested in them
<micahg> geser: no, I have no test platform and am just waiting to see what the TB does, but thanks
 * micahg was just surprised to see it gone already
<geser> if ia64 gets dropped too the FTBFS page will get even shorter
<micahg> yeah, I hope powerpc sticks around though since there are a lot of old machines that can use it
<mdeslaur> tumbleweed: are you aware of bug #618787?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 618787 in ia32-libs (Ubuntu) "version 20090808ubuntu1 breaks flashplugin" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/618787
<tumbleweed> mdeslaur: yay :) no I wasn't
<mdeslaur> tumbleweed: mind if I assign the bug to you?
<tumbleweed> go for it
<mdeslaur> tumbleweed: cool, thanks
 * tumbleweed grumbles about the size of that package (it'll take me an hour to do the upload)
<mdeslaur> yeah, it's an awful awful package
<ajmitch> it's an ugly package that will hopefully be removed one day
<ajmitch> mdeslaur: I guess it causes all sorts of headacahes for the security team?
<mdeslaur> ajmitch: when it comes to that package, we usually just put our fingers in our ears and sing loudly
<ajmitch> oh dea r:)
<micahg> bigon: thanks for merging gnome-sheel
<micahg> *gnome-shell
<mdeslaur> ajmitch: in all seriousness, it is a concern of ours
<bigon> micahg: np
<AnAnt> bdrung: shouldn't latex-xft-fonts be removed first before uploading lyx ? LP #618547
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 618547 in latex-xft-fonts (Ubuntu) "Please remove latex-xft-fonts" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/618547
<micahg> AnAnt: already uploaded :)
<micahg> or ratehr sync'd
<bdrung> AnAnt: no. the binary latex-xft-fonts package from lyx replaces latex-xft-fonts provided from latex-xft-fonts
<bdrung> AnAnt: then the source package latex-xft-fonts will be found on NBS
<AnAnt> aha, ok, so should 618547 be considered fixed ?
<bdrung> bug #618547
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 618547 in latex-xft-fonts (Ubuntu) "Please remove latex-xft-fonts" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/618547
<bdrung> AnAnt: nope. the source package needs to be removed manually
<AnAnt> ok
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-17
<andol> Any chance one might get some attention to the SRU bug #562067? Should be fairly straightforward, as it is only about a rebuild?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 562067 in psimedia (Ubuntu) "voice call feature, cause psi to crash" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/562067
<micahg> andol: have you ready the SRU procedures?
<micahg> andol: you just need to subscribe -sponsors so it gets uploaded :)
<andol> micahg: Yes, I have read them, but obviously not closely enough :)
<micahg> andol: yeah, the -sru team prefers to review in upload queue now (I added a link for this today)
<bdrung> andol: is it fixed in maverick?
<andol> Ok, thanks
<bdrung> andol: is it fixed in maverick?
<andol> bdrung: I don't know, once I originally worked at that bug there really wasn't any Maverick, and now I don't have any  Maverick availible. Yet probably something I should look into.
<andol> (that is, any desktop maverick)
<bdrung> andol: first step is to fix the development release and then backport the fix
<andol> bdrung: Have you looked at the bug?
 * micahg forgot about that :-/
<bdrung> andol: quick look
<andol> bdrung: package copied directly from Debian, built against wrong qt library. The fix is merely a rebuild. Not entirely sure how a backport is applicable is such a situation?
 * bdrung notes down that  micahg doesn't know anythings about Ubuntu. *joking*
<micahg> bdrung: :)
<micahg> andol: BTW, maverick has newer versions of both libraries
<bdrung> andol: just make sure that it works in maverick
<bdrung> it's too late. i launched sponsor-patch in the interactive shell of sponsor-patch
<andol> bdrung: Yeah, now I should definetly do that. But what should I have been doing when I originally looked at the bug? Assuming a package completly unuable without a rebuild? Wait for there to be a Maverick availible I could work on?
<micahg> andol: I think you should reread the SRU docs, your test case needs to be in teh description as well
<andol> ok
<micahg> bdrung: most likely invalid against maverick
<bdrung> andol: in the time where the next devel release is not open for upload, just work on the stable one
<bdrung> micahg: assumes that too, but checking twice is better than being wrong
<micahg> bdrung: yep :)
<micahg> andol: right after the dev release opens, they'll pocket copy any fixes from -proposed/-updates to the devel release
<andol> ok
<bdrung> andol: uploaded
<andol> bdrung: Thanks
<andol> (But what about maverick first?)
<micahg> SpamapS: sorry, I haven't been able to solve the issue I've had with the build yet
<bdrung> andol: i assume that maverick is not affected and assume that you will test it. the ubuntu-sru team needs some time to approve the upload
<jdong> and oh boy, tonight I should process the queue
<jdong> been a hectic 2 weeks of preparing to move back to school
<andol> bdrung: Fair enough, t hanks
<andol> s/ //
<bdrung> andol: "Fairenough, t hanks"? ;)
<andol> bdrung: I am afraid I am to tired to come up with a witty response to that :) Hence I am off to bed.
<bdrung> andol: s/<sleep time>//
<andol> Ok, now I am just confused...
<SpamapS> micahg: weird
<micahg> SpamapS: are you in a rush to get this in?
<micahg> SpamapS: if not, I"ll try to find someone who knows scons to help me with it next wekeends
<lifeless> gl ;)
<micahg> lifeless: I didn't say where I'd look ;)
<bdrung> andol: just a joke: just drop your sleep time ;)
 * bdrung should go to bed.
<bdrung> 10 universe sponsor request remaining \o/
 * micahg has one of them but doesn't understand scons
<ScottK> micahg: You and pretty much everyone else.
<bdrung> ScottK: scons is better than waf ;)
<ScottK> Yes, but that's not saying much.
<ScottK> Although I understand the theory of waf isn't so bad as the developer's inability to grasp the concept of releases.
<ScottK> Of course scons is good in theory too (I even know of people that like it)
 * ajmitch has heard of projects actually using scons & not falling over in a screaming heap
<ajmitch> I'm not sure if the same can be said of autohell
 * ScottK looks at http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS/libstdc++6-4.1-dev and thinks of YokoZar....
<ajmitch> people still want wine1.0?
<ajmitch> ah, I see 1.2 on the top of the list
<lfaraone> dyfet: find the source of the ftbfs bug 617026?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 617026 in imageshack-uploader (Ubuntu) "ftbfs - incomplete syslog support" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/617026
<YokoZar> ScottK: I take it there's a transition I need to do there yes?
<dholbach> good morning
<ripps> Does anybody know why debhelper spits this out when ever I use bzr-buildpackage to make a source package? http://pastebin.com/VhDyTrMD
<ripps> It looks like dh_clean is trying to remove a file that doesn't exist and fails
<bilalakhtar> bdrung: present?
<bilalakhtar> leave it ^^
<bdrung> bilalakhtar: yes
<bilalakhtar> bdrung: the other day, in a talk with kenvandine, they said that moving to quilt is not necessary
<bilalakhtar> s/they/he/g
<bilalakhtar> bdrung: he and the desktop team is happy with cdbs+simple-patchsys
<bdrung> bilalakhtar: not necessary, but nice to have
<bilalakhtar> bdrung: just telling you, since you asked me to tell the conclusion of the discussion
<bdrung> bilalakhtar: ok, thanks
<Riddell> bdrung: on bug 462193 you say "uploaded chilicuil's debdiff" but I don't see anything by a "chilicuil"
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 462193 in debhelper "djvulibre-bin produces garbage in the root (/man1/*)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/462193
<Riddell> can you make clear which debdiff got uploaded?
<bdrung> Riddell: done
<bdrung> Riddell: he has changed his displayed name after giving my comment. :)
<Riddell> how confusing
<bdrung> Riddell: next time i will attach the uploaded patch if it's changed
<Riddell> bdrung: what about the other issues on that bug?
<bdrung> Riddell: testcase: install and "ls /"
<Riddell> no use on irc, needs to be on the bug :)
<bdrung> Riddell: the patch supplier should provide this information.
<bdrung> Riddell: some went wrong with bug #607788 - it's mobile-broadband-provider-info and not gcj-4.4
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 607788 in mobile-broadband-provider-info (Ubuntu Lucid) "Please SRU mobile-broadband-provider-info into lucid(SRU exception)" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/607788
<Riddell> whoops
<Rhonda> Riddell: \o/ :)
 * Riddell feels the love
<Riddell> geser: bug 524938 seems to have been randomly reopened by someone who isn't in any teams, I've no idea how they are able to do that, but maybe you could comment on it
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524938 in libopensync-plugin-syncml (Ubuntu) "Remove binary "opensync-plugin-syncml" from lucid" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524938
<kaushal> hi
<kaushal> is there a way to get apache 2.2.15 on lucid ?
<kaushal> i did rmadison apache2
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: FFe isn't needed ; no new feature is being added
<kaushal> i get apache2 | 2.2.16-1ubuntu1 |      maverick | source, amd64, i386
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: then you should say so in the bug
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: I copied the changelog
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: that should be enough, since that is what the others have done
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: if you add a sentance saying you know we are in FF, but you don't think this needs an exception because of $WHATEVER then it's clearer
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: I thought that would be obvious, since I am posting changelog.
<bilalakhtar> Whatever
<tumbleweed> otherwise it just looks like you are totally unaware
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: fine, will take care of that in later merges
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: thanks
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: BTW, how are the merges?
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: I didn't look
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: If you are free, could you please look?
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: not now, but yes. Please resubscribe sponsors if necessary
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: that is done
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: Thanks for the comment btw!
 * bilalakhtar brb
<ScottK> YokoZar: Yes.
<Omahn> I'm trying to fix a bug and I'm following the directions to create a branch for the change. All goes well until I try to build my package with bzr builddeb, that fails when it's unable to find one of my new files. But, debuild -i -I builds the package fine. What am I missing?..
<james_w> Omahn: did you "bzr add" the new file?
<Omahn> james_w: Ah, no. I just assumed the 'debcommit' would pull in all changes. I guess not? :)
<tumbleweed> debcommit wraps around "$vcs commit"
<Omahn> tumbleweed: That makes sense now. doh.
<nigelb> Not doing "bzr add" is a famous gotcha of vcs packaging.
<nigelb> I remember james_w asking me the same thing.
 * Omahn nods
<AnAnt> what's the tool to check validation of .desktop files ?
<Omahn> Thanks everyone, all worked perfectly this time and I've successfully pushed my first branch up to LP. Yippe. :-)
<AnAnt> ah, desktop-file-validate
<AnAnt> could someone comment on LP #619073 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 619073 in keurocalc (Ubuntu) "Please merge keurocalc 1.0.3-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/619073
<micahg> is it appropriate to tell people on the -motu list if they ask about a PPA to go talk to the PPA maintainer?
<jdong> that sounds correct to me
<micahg> jdong: k, thanks
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: ping
<ari-tczew> jdong: ping on bug 617614
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 617614 in gwget2 (Ubuntu Lucid) "epiphany-extension-gwget cannot be installed: requires 2.29 <= epiphany-browser < 2.30" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/617614
<micahg> ari-tczew: what's the issue?
<micahg> ari-tczew: it's already in -proposed and just needs to wait 7 days now
<ari-tczew> micahg: package tested - OK and it can go to release
<micahg> ari-tczew: no, there's a 7 day waiting period unless it's urgent
<ari-tczew> aha, heh ;]
<micahg> ari-tczew: also, archive admins are the ones who move things from -proposed to -updates
<andreserl> ScottK, ping
<ari-tczew> where is sistpoty? he always come back with Feature Freeze.
<micahg> ari-tczew: he's around, just subscribe ubuntu-release if you need something, he responds pretty quickly
<ari-tczew> micahg: I'll do, because I plan to prepate a one patch. and second case is more private :P
<Rhonda> I received a build error for openarena on powerpc - and am not too sure that it's openarena's fault.
<Rhonda> It doesn't seem to be able to install even the build-depends.
<Rhonda> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openarena/0.8.5-3 has the log linked (the buildlog link itself is way too long to paste :))
<iulian> ari-tczew: I have some spare time to look at some FFes.  Do you have something for me?  If not I'll just randomly pick some from the queue.
<ari-tczew> iulian: not now. feel free to use queue.
<ari-tczew> thanks for the offer
<iulian> Alrighty.
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-18
<alucardni> Hello, I'm in process of triaging LP 618562 but I'm not able to mark the bug as triage :-S
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 618562 in Ubuntu "new package cgit" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/618562
<micahg> alucardni: no, you can't, you should request that in #ubuntu-bugs if you think it has all the information
<alucardni> thanks micahg :)
<lfaraone> Hmm. Would bug 578608  qualify for a SRU? Upstream asked for the fix to be ported back to Lucid.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 578608 in autokey (Ubuntu) "Can't select "Automatically Start Autokey at Login"" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/578608
<micahg> wow, they're really bad at 1 fix per commit...
<micahg> lfaraone: you would need the code for that one fix
<micahg> ugh...http://code.google.com/p/autokey/source/detail?r=233
<lfaraone> micahg: hehe. upstream identified the change.
<micahg> lfaraone: out of that mess?
<lfaraone> micahg: http://code.google.com/p/autokey/source/diff?spec=svn233&r=233&format=side&path=/branches/autokey-combined/src/lib/gtkui/settingsdialog.py
<micahg> lfaraone: just that file?
<lfaraone> micahg: that's what I was told. http://code.google.com/p/autokey/issues/detail?id=44#c5
<lfaraone> micahg: the fix looks right, too.
<lfaraone> since we don't ship an autokey.desktop anymore.
<micahg> lfaraone: k, well, they review in upload queue now, so I'd say make the SRU and upload to -proposed, seems pretty safe
<lfaraone> micahg: okay, that version of the package has no patch system. I'm okay to just make the change directly to the source, then?
<lfaraone> (it has a debian/patches/ dir though :X )
<micahg> lfaraone: yes
<micahg> lfaraone: is it source format 3?
<lfaraone> micahg: nope.
<lfaraone> that's odd, that changeset was already in lucid.
<lfaraone> upstream must have found the wrong fix, then :)
<micahg> lfaraone: heh :)
<lfaraone> well then, makes my life easier. "incomplete, identify a fix and get back to me"
<ScottK> 10.04.1 is released, so -proposed is open for business again.
<cody-somerville> ScottK, has there been any changed to 10.04.1 in the last hour?
<cody-somerville> *changes
<ScottK> cody-somerville: It was released.
<cody-somerville> fabulous
<Rhonda> Now that the FeatureFreeze is in place, how would one request a sync? Does requestsync has a special option for that?
<Rhonda> Actually I missed the timeline for a sync request for wesnoth-1.8 which finally contains the unversioned meta package to ease upgrades.
<persia> It doesn't.  If the sync doesn't include new features, just follow the normal procedure.  If it does, file an exception request, and change to a sync when approved.
<persia> !ffe
<ubottu> Feature Freeze Exception. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess for the freeze exception process.
<Rhonda> And it would be a good idea to drop the wesnoth source package from maverick alltogether.
<Rhonda> persia: Well, it actually can be considered a new feature that it now builds the unversioned metapackage to ease upgrades. :)
<persia> File a bug with the rationale for removal, and subscribe the archive admins.  Most with good rationales are honored,.
<Rhonda> I'll try that.
<persia> heh.  Well, if you want, file an exception request :)  To me it sounds like you're just fixing an upgrade bug.
 * persia is *not* involved in approving freeze exceptions, so any guidelines expressed are entirely personal
<ajmitch> requestsync does actually have a feature for syncs after feature freeze
<ajmitch> it just subscribes the release team to the bug that gets filed
<Rhonda> argl, subscribed OEM Archive Admins by accident.  %-/
<nigelb> heh, don't think it matters
<Rhonda> How do I find the archive admins in the subscribe box? It only lists me the OEM ones and UK Mirror Service?
<nigelb> ubuntu-archive
<Rhonda> Alright, #619650 and #619652 :)
<ajmitch> this is why requestsync has the -e flag :)
<ajmitch> but I see one is a removal request
<Rhonda> Yes, and I can't use the requestsync tool from here. :)
<ajmitch> but why not? :)
<Rhonda> my notebook is not networked here
<ajmitch> ah
<ajmitch> irc by phone?
 * ajmitch saw something scary on debian-devel today - an ITP for an emacs twitter client
<nigelb> o.O
<Rhonda> No, but firewall and similar means. Won't even get an IP address. :)
<Rhonda> ajmitch: qataki is all the twitter client that I ever need.
<ajmitch> morning dholbach
<dholbach> good morning
 * nigelb waves to dholbach 
<ajmitch> nigelb: so when's the next behind the circle interview going up? :)
<dholbach> hey nigelb
<nigelb> ajmitch: as soon as LucidFox and I get organized.  We're getting there :0
<nigelb> ajmitch: I finally got the new list and processing it.
<nigelb> dholbach: http://blog.qa.ubuntu.com/node/101 \o/
<dholbach> nigelb, YES!
<nigelb> 409 is a good number, small but good :)
<ajmitch> great
<nigelb> We're moving slowly. (hint hint: Review one patch a day!)
 * ajmitch decides to be naughty & start up debian
<vish> nigelb: i think we need a reality check.. :) '409' i would consider that number very close to the normal patch/debdiff review which /had/ already been going on. the script tags debdiffs as patch as well, so debdiffs moving out of the sponsors queue is also included in 409. Plus if you see the desktop patches, patch submitters are immediately asked by the desktop team to forwarded them upstream,so bug gets tagged -forwarded which /was/ already a regula
<vish> r process,[a lot of the other teams do the same as well], which would eventually yield a much lower number of reviews actually being done. but yes, "We're moving on very slow and we need to Review one patch a day!"  we have to remember that this is the first cycle this has been started, so its not bad for a new start... :)
<vish> oh! typed too much ;p
 * nigelb blinks
<nigelb> I turn my eyes away and I have 2 paragraphs to read.
<vish> ;p
<nigelb> vish: If desktop patches come under our workflow that is indeed a good thing.
<nigelb> But that is still not cheating the numbers anyway.
<vish> nigelb: dint say it was cheating , but the number of patches being actually reviewed is lower than we can attribute,  while it only increases their work
<nigelb> vish: the 409 is the sum of all unique bugs with anything other than patch tags.
<nigelb> vish: how is it increasing their work?
<nigelb> Its just a workflow that we follow for bugs with patches.  they're happy to adopt the same as well.
<vish> nigelb: yeah , they now have to remember to tag a bug patch-whatever for something they have already been doing..
<nigelb> which is not a big deal if you ask me.
<nigelb> I know that seb has been reviewing a good number of patches :)
<vish> nigelb: nope not a big deal, but what i'm trying to mention is, that it doesnt/shouldnt really count as a patch reviewed by the "Operation cleansweep"
<nigelb> vish: why NOT!
<nigelb> Operating cleansweep is about reviewing all the patches.  It doesn't say that if desktop does something it shouldn't be counted.
<vish> nigelb: we've just increased a bit of their work and claiming it as part of the success for the project, which is supposed to clean up the old patch which were left unattended
<vish> nigelb: what i'm trying to say , is review process != Operation Cleansweep
<vish> nigelb: desktop following th process is good
<vish> the*
<vish> but claiming it as part of something different which we initially intended to do is just a bit of hogwash.. ;p
<Rhonda> Can someone help me understand the openarena build errors on amd64 and powerpc? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openarena/0.8.5-3
<Rhonda> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<Rhonda>  libsdl1.2-dev : Depends: libpulse-dev but it is not going to be installed
<Rhonda> â¦ in both build logs. It doesn't look like that would be something that has to get addressed in openarena, is it?
<nigelb> vish: Cleansweep was not perse about old patches.  It was about *all* the patches.
<nigelb> This discussion did come up at UDS.  Did we want to do only old or both old and new.
<nigelb> The choice was to do all and this was a known side effect.
<nigelb> s/was/is
<nigelb> lunch, afk
<geser> Rhonda: it looks like archive skew, a give-back of openarena should work
<vish> nigelb:  i dont see how that sounds really sensible, taking the work that has already been going on by the existing teams and tagging them as /our/ success is wrong..  :)
<Rhonda> geser: So clicking on the retry?
<geser> yes
<Rhonda> Thanks. Rather asking twice (and annoy through that) than annoy through clicks that weren't meant to follow. :)
<geser> I checked with "apt-get -s build-dep openarena" if this got fixed (pbuilder would also work)
<Rhonda> Don't have a powerpc or amd64 system on which I could try that at hands. :/
<geser> I've only amd64 and checked there
<vish> nigelb: in the sense, what has Operation Cleansweep actually improved, wrt patches? we brought in a workflow, but has it really improved the chances of a patch getting reviewed?
<nigelb> vish: It has.   To some extent.
<nigelb> The problem is the backlog.
<nigelb> If we are at zero, its easier to review the newer ones
<nigelb> if at some point we manage to clear the backlog (I hope by end of N cycle), then patches would be processed fast.
<bilalakhtar> hey
<vish> nigelb: yes it did, but we need to claim responsibility *only* for that, right now, its like just using a contributors patch and the uploader claiming it to be his just because he uploaded it..
<bilalakhtar> vish: IMHO it hasn't improved anything
<bilalakhtar> vish: we are still at 13% progress
<nigelb> bilalakhtar: isn't taht much better than zero.
<nigelb> It was bitrotting
<vish> bilalakhtar: yes, we have not improved a lot, but if you check the backlog that 13% is a bit cooked up too ;)
 * nigelb notes that its 19%
<nigelb> http://bobbo.me.uk/
<nigelb> vish: How /can/ you claim its cooked up
<nigelb> Operation cleansweep is about reviewing *all* the patches.  We are getting there.  Which is process.  *NOT* cooked up.
<vish> nigelb: yes, its not *actual* work what has been done..
<nigelb> ugh, you're rounding up to the same point again.
<bilalakhtar> nigelb: vish is right. its cooked up. people are just in a hurry and are reviewing patches in a very easy and quick way
<bilalakhtar> nigelb: There are many regression bugs coming up now
<nigelb> bilalakhtar: wait, are you confusing one with other?
<nigelb> patch review is about forwarding patches to relevant upstream
<vish> nigelb: it is just claiming a process that has been going on for years and saying "yay! we have done these many bugs" , when the actual bugs being reviewed are by the sponsors and the teams which have been doing this work for ages
<nigelb> Its not about getting them into Ubuntu immediately.
<bilalakhtar> nigelb: I understand, but both needs to be done, right?
<nigelb> bilalakhtar: can you read the wiki for reviewers team please? You're confusing sru process with this.  Its totatly different.
<bilalakhtar> nigelb: no I am not
<nigelb> vish: We started at 0.  Now we're at 400.  How does this be done by sponsors?
<bilalakhtar> nigelb: I completely understand OC is for development releases
<bilalakhtar> not *stable* releases
<vish> nigelb: why are debdiffs being tagged? and counted when they are done by the sponsors?
<nigelb> bilalakhtar: NO.  OC is not for development release either.
<nigelb> vish: debdiffs are not counted.
<bilalakhtar> nigelb: then what?
<vish> nigelb: they are, i have shown you this several times
<bilalakhtar> nigelb: lol, are all patches going into lucid then?
<nigelb> bilalakhtar: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OperationCleansweep
 * bilalakhtar has that page open
<nigelb> vish: YES, but that doesn't get into the count which I'm talking about
 * nigelb moves discussion to -reviews
<bilalakhtar> nigelb: 'The idea is to get the number of bugs with patches down to 0 by Maverick's release.'
<nigelb> bilalakhtar: Yes, but we will not incorporate them into maverick immediately.
<nigelb> The idea is to forward them upstream, and let them make a call
<bilalakhtar> nigelb: that's whta I meant
<Rhonda> geser: \o/ - the builds did now succeed. :)
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: DDs rule the world! Are you fre?
<bilalakhtar> *free
<bilalakhtar> I have an NMU awaiting sponsorship from a long time
<Rhonda> No, I'm commercial.
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: You could have said 'I am contrib'
<Rhonda> Hmm, that might fit pretty well actually. I only depend on non-free stuff to sustain my life, personally I could be considered free. Though, it might be that some special person in my life could disagree with that. :)
<bilalakhtar> well, it was http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?msg=10;filename=debdebdiff.debdiff;att=1;bug=589502 Rhonda
 * Rhonda wonders where the attached screenshot in that bugreport is :)
<Rhonda> Did you try contact the gnome team?
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: yup, from the last 2 days
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: sent a message to their list, but it is bouncing
<Rhonda> I might give it a shot tomorrow evening (european time), can you ping me again then?
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: Thanks a lot!
<azeem> well, once
<Rhonda> I don't have the ressources or environment right now to test it.
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: np at all
<raywang> anyone knows how to remove a deb package regardless the dependencies, i want to force to remove a package
<tumbleweed> raywang: I assume you have a good reason? dpkg has a --force option
<raywang> tumbleweed, well , it doesn't work
<bond_gone> raywang, but you should be beware of reverse dependencies as it might break working of a system
<tumbleweed> raywang: if I have to talk you through getting it to work, I'm worried that you aren't aware enough of how bad this is
<raywang> bond_gone, yeah, i know, but no problem with that, i just want an option like --nodeps in rpm
<raywang> tumbleweed, well, i know, i want to downgrade a package, but it doesn't allow me to do that with apt-get
<tumbleweed> apt-get does allow you to downgrade
<tumbleweed> as does dpkg
<bond_gone> raywang, even aptitude does
<raywang> so what i'm thinking is remove that package regardless the dependencies, and use apt-get to install right away
<azeem> raywang: that's the wrong solution
<azeem> just downgrade it
<raywang> well, how to use apt-get to downgrade a package, i still can get it from the manpage :(
<raywang> can't
<tumbleweed> raywang: apt-get install package=$VERSION
<raywang> ok
<tumbleweed> or package/$RELEASE
<azeem> raywang: then your question should've been that, not "how do I break my system"
<raywang> well, it remove some dependencies as well when I downgrade it...
<tumbleweed> raywang: was this a new version from a ppa?
<raywang> yep
<tumbleweed> look at ppa-purge
<bond_gone> raywang, aptitude resolves the dependencies on downgrade i think
<bond_gone> so that your system will not break stuff
<raywang> the original name is like x.x.x-lucid0~ppa15, but new version is like x.x.x.-lucid~ppa19
<azeem> ouch
<raywang> so apt-get can't install the newer one,
<AnAnt> Hello
<highvoltage> tumbleweed: ooh, happy belated birthday!
<tumbleweed> highvoltage: thanks :)
<nigelb> oh.
<nigelb> HAPPY BIRTHDAY tumbleweed !
<tumbleweed> nigelb: 'twas yesterday, thanks
<nigelb> ah.  Still.  Birthday is birthday :)
<yofel> who reviews merges against ubuntu packages again? it wasn't ubuntu-branches iirc
<AnAnt> ubuntu-sponsors ?
<yofel> hm, and how do you change that? As https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~chilicuil/ubuntu/maverick/dkms/fix-613407/+merge/32626 has ubuntu-branches as reviewer
<tumbleweed> yofel: it appears on the sponsor list just fine
<yofel> really? I guess I missed it then :(
<yofel> meh, right, should have just used ctrl+f to search for it -.-, sry
<bond_gone> tumbleweed, happy belated birthday
<nigelb> yofel: Its a mistake by the person requesting the merge
<nigelb> The reviewer should be set to ubuntu-sponsors.
<nigelb> (or so I think.  somone correct me if I'm wrong)
<tumbleweed> nigelb: practically speaking that probably doesn't matter (as ubuntu-sponsors doesn't receive mail). nigelb: thanks :)
<tumbleweed> bleh, bond_gone: thanks
<nigelb> tumbleweed: its not about mail
<nigelb> its about getting permission to merge it (I think. Again)
<nigelb> Its been a while since I packaged.
<tumbleweed> anyone can merge it
<tumbleweed> (with the right rights)
<tumbleweed> and anyone can review it
<nigelb> hm, then things have changed.
<nigelb> Earlier if you didn't set sponsors as reviewer, the sponsor couldn't review it.
<tumbleweed> nigelb: as far as I understand it, the request review function is just to generate mail (and to differentiate between requested reviews and "community" reviews)
<nigelb> tumbleweed: I'm talkinga bout setting Branch Reviewer
<nigelb> tumbleweed: I may be wrong though.
 * nigelb is a bit rusty.
<tumbleweed> I thikn the branch reviewer sets the default review request, and who has the permission to manipulate the review status, in which case ubuntu-dev seems to be right
<nigelb> tumbleweed: as far as I remember, the default reviewer would be ubuntu-branches which needs to be changed to ubuntu-sponsors.
<nigelb> (by the person requesting the merge)
<nigelb> should ask bdrung for more info though
<nigelb> He would know better :)
<MDC1> is it possible to create a ppa from a bzr repo on launchpad automatically now?
<shadeslayer> MDC1: erm you mean recipes ?
<shadeslayer> creating packages for daily builds
<MDC1> shadeslayer: maybe?
<MDC1> shadeslayer: would be good if it's not only daily builds but also from tags
<shadeslayer> cant do tags for now
<shadeslayer> but dailies are there
<MDC1> shadeslayer: and for different versions of ubuntu
<MDC1> dailies would be a good start :)
<shadeslayer> import project to bzr -> make packaging branch -> make recipe -> fire away
<shadeslayer> MDC1: yeah thats supported
<shadeslayer> goes ALL the way back
<shadeslayer> i think it goes back to hardy :PO
<MDC1> shadeslayer: hmm.. i was more thinking about clicking things in lp and not doing anything locally. just commit to bzr and lp automaticlly triggers a build + upload to ppa..
<MDC1> shadeslayer: i thought i read that a while back that it was in the pipe..
<MDC1> shadeslayer: might be wrong though
<shadeslayer> actually
<shadeslayer> it is all webbased
<shadeslayer> MDC1: you just push your packaging to one branch
<MDC1> shadeslayer: oh.. it is
<shadeslayer> and import your project in another
<shadeslayer> MDC1: https://help.launchpad.net/Packaging/SourceBuilds/Recipes
<MDC1> shadeslayer: hmm.. not really sure what you mean. thing is this is a new small application i'm writing and thinking if using lp + bzr + ppa would make my life happier ;
<MDC1> ;)
<shadeslayer> yeah, should not be a problem :)
<shadeslayer> MDC1: for eg. project neon : https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~neon : the packaging is in foo-ubuntu and code import in foo
<MDC1> shadeslayer: hmm.. lots of new magic to learn. i'll give it a try :) thanks a lot
<shadeslayer> no problemo
<AnAnt> Hello
 * jdong mumbles quietly about build-deps for clean target
 * geser mumbles "dpkg-source -b" might work depending on the changes
<lfaraone> Wrt Planet Ubuntu, is the list of corporate blogs up to date? I've seen Turnkey and Dell on the 'net, but they 're not isted on <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PlanetUbuntu#Corporate Blogs>
<bdrung> nigelb: i am back. something you want to ask?
<fta> siretart, hi, any idea what's causing subs to stay on screen in recent mplayer (in maverick)?
<angelabad> Hi cjwatson,
<Rhonda> Hmm, did daniel find someone for tomorrow's tech talk?
<dyfet> ping scottk
<Rhonda> ScottK?
<ScottK> On the phone.
<dyfet> ok :)
<ScottK> dyfet: I forgot to get back to you.  Sorry.
<ScottK> dyfet: I'll be sort of here/not for a bit so ping with what's up and I'll reply when I can.
<dyfet> scottk: ah, yes.  I had not been able to rebuild python-qt4 either currently on Maverick, so I had not been able to try some of my fixes for kdebindings :(
<ScottK> OK.  Still needs doing ....
<dyfet> python-qt4 dies trying to get qtdirs...seems like it may be very basic
<dyfet> but I never played with the qt config stuff
<geser> argh, /me just following the link from Martin Meredith blog post
<directhex> NARWHALS!
<dyfet> I guess naughty numbat is out then...
<directhex> i still want owls for 11.10
<micahg> do packaging cleanup changes need an FFe (I can never remember this)
<ScottK> micahg: Depends on if you're fixing stuff or changing the entire build system....
<micahg> ScottK: it's for a merge from Debian: http://changelog.debian.net/google-gadgets  <-- we have everything except the top changelog
<micahg> I would think that's all just cleanup except for source format 3
<jdong> hmm, grumble
<jdong> a lot of hash sum mismatches from debmirrored Packages.bz2
 * jdong wonders if it's time to look for a different mirroring solution
<jdong> but the hashes of the mirrored file and real file are the same...
<micahg> wgrant: I have a feeling ubuntuwire is still pulling from testing instead of unstable
<micahg> wgrant: nm
<wgrant> micahg: What was the problem?
<micahg> wgrant: idk some things just aren't updating like chmsee
<wgrant> Let's see.
<wgrant> Which page?
<micahg> http://qa.ubuntuwire.org/mdt/mozilla.html
<wgrant> OK, yeah, something is still broken.
<wgrant> It's still getting confused when there are multiple versions of a source in Sources :(
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-19
<ScottK> micahg: Package rename would definitely need FFe since it needs to go through New.
<micahg> ScottK: thanks, do you think it's worth it since it actually should've been done before?
<ajmitch> jcastro: nice dinosaur :)
<nigelb> heh :)
 * ajmitch awaits the dinosaur vs bird argument
<nigelb> evolution
<nigelb> It was a mix of dinosaur vs bird.
<nigelb> shoulda gotten a raptor though.
<nigelb> More fierceful :p
<ajmitch> maybe he'll get that on the other arm
<nigelb> hahah
<ajmitch> of course he had to be all metal & get the photos with the metallica shirt on :)
<jcastro> there is no dino/bird argument!
<ajmitch> and there he is!
<ajmitch> hey :)
<jcastro> hi aj
<ajmitch> jcastro: so what are you getting for the other arm? a raptor as nigelb suggests?
<jcastro> I have a snake there already
<nigelb> ajmitch: that is not about being metal.
<nigelb> ajmitch: its about keeping the job :p (you know, under jono)
<ajmitch> of course
<ajmitch> but jcastro was like that long before he became one of the horsemen :)
<jcastro> yeah!
<nigelb> (already courrupted :p)
 * ajmitch recalls the fun of uds in mt view
<nigelb> The one at google?
<ajmitch> yes
<nigelb> I've only seen pictures :(
<nigelb> jcastro: do you by chance have a python there? ;)
<ajmitch> of course the main reason I use ubuntu one is to have somewhere to buy the latest iron maiden album :)
<nigelb> hahaha
<jcastro> ajmitch: hah that's how I got it
<ajmitch> it worked well until it stalled on downloading the last track
 * nigelb wishes he could buy stuff from ubuntu one
<nigelb> The ones I like aren't available for my region.  Sigh.
<ajmitch> I do have to use some hacks to get rhythmbox to use an ssh tunnel as a SOCKS proxy in order to get music in the US region
<ajmitch> it's not nice
<nigelb> Oh. See.  Lots of sales lost :(
<ajmitch> yes, the regional restrictions on it are the single most annoying thing about the music store
<nigelb> Buts not Ubuntu One's blame per se.
<nigelb> Music Industry operational methods.
<ajmitch> no, but it's still annoying enough
<nigelb> Yeah :/
<ajmitch> it feels like it's about time to work through http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/maverick/
<ScottK> micahg: Might as well get it overwith.
<micahg> ScottK: thanks :)
<ScottK> ajmitch: Would you be up for making cyrus-sasl2-heimdal build?
<ajmitch> I can try, what's wrong with it?
<ScottK> sample-server.c:69: error: conflicting types for 'getsubopt'
<ScottK> /usr/include/stdlib.h:896: note: previous declaration of 'getsubopt' was here
<ScottK> It needs a rebuild for NBS and it won't ....
<ScottK> It would need a rebuild anyway to match the cyrus-sasl2 version.
<ScottK> It's the last package left for the Heimdal transition.
<ajmitch> fetching it now
<ScottK> Thanks.
<ajmitch> ScottK: it at least looks like cyrus-sasl2 had the exact same error fixed last month
<ScottK> ajmitch: Sounds both convenient and plausible.
<ajmitch> effectively the same source?
<ScottK> Yes, just built against Heimdal instead of Kerberos or something.
<ScottK> There's a Debian bug suggesting they can be merged now.
<ScottK> It wasn't clear on exactly how though, so I'm pretty sure we should wait on going that far.
 * ajmitch tracks down what the change was from bug 600180
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 600180 in cyrus-sasl2 (Ubuntu Maverick) "cyrus-sasl2 fails to build from source in maverick" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/600180
<ajmitch> someone needs to ship me a faster piece of string
<ScottK> You need to live somewhere with more bandwidth than a soda straw.
<ajmitch> but we have hobbits here!
<ajmitch> so much for trying to grab branches of cyrus-sasl2
<ajmitch> the idea of UDD is nice & all, but it's often just not there
<ScottK> Yep.
<ajmitch> ok, changes from cyrus-sasl2 applied fine, just waiting for pbuilder now
<ScottK> Cool.
 * ScottK didn't think to look there.
<ajmitch> here is where I need an SSD for compiling
<micahg> ScottK: I think you misread teh changelog as did I, there's no new package for google gadgets, just the .docs file was mislabeled
<ajmitch> ScottK: you wouldn't happen to know if this can be tested beyond installing it? :)
<LucidFox> I wonder...
<LucidFox> what is it about Java specifically that makes its frameworks so insanely prone to overengineering?
<frogzoo1> any ideas why OpenProj isn't in the repos?
<micahg> frogzoo1: no one's packaged it?
<frogzoo> there's a .deb on their site so yes/no
<micahg> frogzoo: debian 548399
<ubottu> Debian bug 548399 in wnpp "RFP: openproj -- Project management solution" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/548399
<micahg> frogzoo: well, there's a process to get things into Ubuntu (usually through Debian) and certain standards must be met
<frogzoo> thanks for that
<micahg> frogzoo: you can pick up the RFP in Debian if you want
<frogzoo> much as I'd like schedule doesn't permit - maybe in a few weeks
<micahg> frogzoo: oh, it was attempted, see debian 442032
<ubottu> Debian bug 442032 in wnpp "ITP: openproj -- A desktop replacement for Microsoft Project" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/442032
<frogzoo> does look pretty user friendly - much more so than TaskJuggler & lets nubs point/click their way to gantt charts - something that really needs to get into the repos, but as I say, I'm booked next 3 weeks
<micahg> frogzoo: I don't think anyone's rushing to do it, so don't worry
<frogzoo> what me worry ;)
<Rhonda> Ist Stefan Potyra doing irc?
<micahg> Rhonda: seems he was on 13:30 - 16:30 UTC today
<Rhonda> With what nick?
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> morning dholbach
<Rhonda> And today we didn't have 13:30 - 16:30 UTC yet. :P
<dholbach> hola ajmitch
<ajmitch> Rhonda: he's sistpoty
<Rhonda> Thanks. :)
<ajmitch> what's he in trouble about now? ;)
<Rhonda> Stalking my git commits of wesnoth :)
<ajmitch> haha
<micahg> Rhonda: sorry haven't gone to bed for the night yet
<Rhonda> timezones suck ;)
 * ajmitch agrees
 * nigelb too
<micahg> you're all ahead of me ;)
 * ajmitch is ahead of nearly everyone
<nigelb> haha
<ajmitch> UTC+12 isn't the most convenient timezone, it's often hard to catch people in europe
<Rhonda> Get up early, they won't be in bed by then usually. ;)
<Rhonda> Actually for +12 I wouldn't think you need to get up _that_ early anyway to catch us?
<ajmitch> no it usually means staying up later :)
<Rhonda> Hmm.
<Rhonda> ajmitch: Actually I might be able to hack my way into packages.ubuntu. But then, that would be abuse and definitely not be received well. :)
<ajmitch> haha
<ajmitch> that might get elmo knocking on your door in the middle of the night :)
<mok0> Hmm, what does the "." mean in this line:
<mok0> drwxr-xr-x. 7 mok  mok   4096 2007-12-21 15:55 src
<mok0> (the one after drwxr-xr-x)
<mok0> Ah, it indicates a file with an SELinux security context
<mok0> Thansk
<mok0> :-)
<and471> if there is a file in the debian dir that I need to edit, do I create a patch using the package's patch system, or just edit the file directly?
<Rhonda> You edit the file directly.
<Rhonda> patches are for changes to the upstream source.
<and471> Rhonda, thanks
<bilalakhtar> dholbach: disconnect, reconnect, disconnect, reconnect!
<bilalakhtar> dholbach: if you are free, could you please see bug #414107 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 414107 in gnome-disk-utility (Ubuntu) "Palimpsest GUI impossible to use on small screen" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/414107
<bilalakhtar> it requires an SRU as well, so would need an upload to lucid-proposed
<dholbach> bilalakhtar, it happened to me once
<dholbach> bilalakhtar, is that patch accepted upstream?
<dholbach> bilalakhtar, I'd prefer if a desktop person had a look at it
<bilalakhtar> dholbach: nope, but forwarded from a long time
<bilalakhtar> dholbach: BTW, meego accepted the patch
<bilalakhtar> dholbach: we took the patch from there
<dholbach> can you ping the folks on the upstream report again?
<bilalakhtar> dholbach: np
<dholbach> and ping seb128 or robert_ancell about it - they know who to get in touch with
<dholbach> they can probably can talk to somebody on irc on gimpnet
<bilalakhtar> dholbach: thanks!
<vish> bilalakhtar: it has already been uploaded to -proposed and it has been tested
<bilalakhtar> vish: I am not talking about the sbackup one
<bilalakhtar> vish: its bug #414107
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 414107 in gnome-disk-utility (Ubuntu) "Palimpsest GUI impossible to use on small screen" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/414107
<vish> bilalakhtar: doh!
<vish> bilalakhtar: nvm ;)
<and471> oops who broke the internets?
<AnAnt> Hello
<kirkland> there's an example package in the archive, maintained by joey hess, i think .... anyone know what it is off the top of their head?
<ajmitch> hello?
<ajmitch> or hello-debhelper
<azeem> those are maintained by sanvila IIRC
<ajmitch> right, what sort of example package are you looking for?
<ajmitch> http://qa.debian.org/developer.php?login=joeyh&comaint=yes doesn't list anything obvious as an example package
<kirkland> ajmitch: perfect! thanks
<ScottK> ajmitch: re testing: Not sure, but if you fixed it the same way cyrus-sasl was fixed, then I image it's reasonably safe.
<ajmitch> ScottK: it installed, so I uploaded it
<ScottK> ajmitch: Great.  Thanks.
<sebner> huhu RainCT :)
<RainCT> hey sebner
<AnAnt> Hello
<and471> if I am creating a branch that fixes a packaging bug, and then create a merge request, under which launchpad project should I create it?
<and471> should it just be in +junk ?
<geser> bzr push lp:~youraccount/ubuntu/maverick/$package/$branch-nick
<and471> geser, thanks
<canesin> Hi all.. I want to use an science package in an application I'm developing.. but the package in universe is years old... how can I take care if the package ?? Can I adopt it ??
<micahg> canesin: you can certainly work to keep it updated, we don't have "maintainers" per se
<micahg> canesin: I think there's a MOTU science team
<canesin> micahg: =) .. so how can I do that ?? I already have an launchpad account...
<micahg> canesin: https://edge.launchpad.net/~motuscience
<iulian> canesin: I suggest you to join the Debian science team and talk to them regarding that package.
<iulian> If the current maintainer is MIA and the package is really outdated, it would be great if you could adopt it.
<canesin> iulian Debian science ?? Go rigth upstream you say ??
<iulian> canesin: Upstream in this case is Debian.  Take a look at http://wiki.debian.org/DebianScience.
<canesin> iulian: Okey, but what I really would like it to have that package at ubuntu... I'm writing a new application that make use of it... and I believe most of the users will be ubuntu
<canesin> iulian: wow !! The dabian package is even more older !!! The software is "paraview", the most recent one is 3.8.1 .. in ubuntu it is 3.4.0 and in debian it is 3.2.2 ..
<iulian> canesin: I agree with you, but maybe the rest of them would be using Debian.
<iulian> canesin: I see that 3.8.1 has just been uploaded to Debian a couple of weeks ago.
<iulian> canesin: s/Debian/Debian unstable/
<iulian> And it's currently in Squeeze as well.
<canesin> yeah... I'm see it now
<canesin> I was in lenny branch
<iulian> canesin: Oh, we've got 3.4.0 in Maverick.
 * iulian adds it to my todo list.
<iulian> canesin: So yea, if you're interested in getting involved in maintaining paraview, please do consider joining the Debian Science team.  Help is always needed. :)
<canesin> iulian: Okey.. how do I do that ?? If I help update it in Debian it will make in Ubuntu universe ??
<canesin> I work at National Institute of Science and Technology in Thermophysics ...
<canesin> Here most of us use ubuntu...
<iulian> canesin: It seems that the Ubuntu package has local changes.  In this case the package needs to be merged with the one that Debian has.
<iulian> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<canesin> iulian: sorry.. wireless is droping
<iulian> canesin: No worries.
<iulian> Got my last message or should I resent it?
<iulian> t/resent/resend/
<canesin> resend
<iulian> canesin: It seems that the Ubuntu package has local changes.  In this case the package needs to be merged with the one that Debian has.
<iulian> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<lfaraone> dyfet: so I can close bug 617026, right?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 617026 in imageshack-uploader (Ubuntu) "ftbfs - incomplete syslog support" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/617026
<dyfet> yes I believe so
<lfaraone> dyfet: okay, I'll do that then
<canesin> Hi all, I have an updated .deb file of an package I want to update ( it is very old in ubuntu ) ...
<canesin> I have it from debian-unstable and build from source
<canesin> It is paraview ...
<canesin> How can I update the package present in launchpad ?
<canesin> Who should I email ?
<micahg> canesin: you need to merge it
<canesin> okey..
<canesin> how do I do that ?
<micahg> canesin: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<canesin> micahg: It will be up as soon I finish the merge ??
<micahg> canesin: no, you propose the merge and a sponsor will review and either sponsor if everything's good or give you feedback on what needs to be done
<RainCT> aren't we in FF already?
<micahg> RainCT: oh yeah...
<micahg> canesin: you need an FFe for the update :)
<micahg> !ffe | canesin
<ubottu> canesin: Feature Freeze Exception. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess for the freeze exception process.
<canesin> O.o
 * RainCT hopes canesin's head doesn't explode ;)
<micahg> lol
<canesin> I cannot update the package in lucid ?
<micahg> canesin: backports once it's in maverick
<micahg> !backports | canesin
<ubottu> canesin: If new updated Ubuntu packages are built for an application, then they may go into Ubuntu Backports. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports - See also !packaging
 * micahg will brb
<canesin> lol .. is more complicated than I have imagined
<RainCT> canesin: Well, all those different policies can be a bit overwhelming at first, but it's not that complicated once you know how it works.
<RainCT> canesin: Basically you need to get the package into the current development release (Maverick) first, and when it's there you can ask for a backport to Lucid (which means it'll get copied into the "proposed" archive, wait for some people to test it and then it can get into "lucid-backports").
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-20
<RainCT> canesin: What makes it a bit more complicated right now is that Maverick is in "Feature Freeze", which means no new stuff is allowed in. If there is a good reason to have this new paraview version, you can file a bug and explain why it'd be good to have and how risky it might break as opposed to the current version (this is called a Feature Freeze Exception request)
 * zooko reads about backports
<zooko> Neat.
<micahg> bdrung: did I read somewhere about a new vlc PPA?
<bdrung> micahg: not on my blog, but i have setup one
<micahg> bdrung: stable releases?
<bdrung> micahg: nope, bleeding edge (1.2.0~git)
<micahg> bdrung: :(, any chance of a stable PPA?
<micahg> or should I backport on my own?
<bdrung> micahg: https://edge.launchpad.net/~videolan/+archive/master-daily
<bdrung> micahg: you can ask me nicely when i am back from my vacation and i will setup one
<micahg> bdrung: I can help maintain if you want :)
<bdrung> micahg: if you want to build your own one locally, grab the maverick git branch and use this patch: http://pastebin.com/E4eb2CSE
<micahg> bdrung: is that for Lucid or maverick
<bdrung> micahg: that is for lucid
<micahg> bdrung: k, thanks
<bdrung> micahg: for maverick you can just use the maverick branch :)
<bdrung> micahg: but instead of a vlc ppa, we could backport vlc 1.1.3-1+exp1ubuntu1 with the posted patch
<micahg> bdrung: do you want to backport for every release?
<bdrung> micahg: no, for lucid
<micahg> bdrung: I meant for Lucid for every release :)
<bdrung> micahg: if it's not too much work.
<bdrung> micahg: at least one backport would be nice (look at the 1.1.0-1 changelog)
<micahg> bdrung: I'm not in a position to join backporters yet, but you could :)
<bdrung> micahg: i want to try to backport something. for self consumption i have a backports PPA: https://launchpad.net/~bdrung/+archive/backports
<micahg> bdrung: I have one as well :)
<micahg> bdrung: the only problem with sending vlc to backports is to keep it updated if there's a security vulnerability
<bdrung> micahg: if we backport the same version that will end up in maverick the workload will not be increased that much
<micahg> bdrung: well, I think with backports, tis better to update than patch, but I could be wrong
<micahg> can we even patch stuff in backports?
<bdrung> micahg: dunno. backporting the fixed version is probably the way to go
<micahg> bdrung: are you waiting to see if you can sync from expermental before uploading to maverick?
<micahg> bdrung: nm, I remember the issue now
<bdrung> micahg: i am waiting for siretart to upload the packages to sid and experimental
<micahg> bdrung: ah, ok
<bdrung> micahg: then i will upload the package to maverick
<bdrung> micahg: i will sync the experimental package once x264 is accepted in debian
<bdrung> micahg: if this needs as long as mplayer, it will be in one year ;)
<bdrung> micahg: time to say goodbye. i will be on vacation tomorrow
<micahg> bdrung: enjoy your vacation, anything I can keep an eye on for you while you're goine?
<bdrung> micahg: the sponsor queue :)
<micahg> bdrung: I can't do much with it, but I'll watch my stuff :)
<bdrung> micahg: everything that is listed on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BenjaminDrung
<micahg> bdrung: vlc's the only think I can do anything with
<micahg> oh, eclipse too
<bdrung> micahg: you could talk with nthykier on #debian-java - we need to sync -6 (once released). and there are new reports that it doesn't work
<micahg> bdrung: k, what tz is he in?
<bdrung> micahg: mine - utc + 0200
<micahg> bdrung: will try him in the morning then
<bdrung> micahg: he lives in Denmark
<micahg> bdrung: k, well, enjoy, I'll keep an eye on vlc and eclipse then, if siretart doesn't get to it until tomorrow, can I assume you're gone and do the merge?  Do we need an FFe?
<bdrung> micahg: i probably check my mails in between. otherwise i will have ~2000 mail when i come home
<micahg> nm, you did the merge, I mean upload :)
<micahg> bdrung: k, I won't worry about that one then
<micahg> but will try to get 3.5.2-6 for eclipse in
<bdrung> micahg: if i am gone, you can ask siretart to do the maverick upload (it's prepared in the maverick branch)
<bdrung> micahg: i talked with the release team. we don't need a FFe for vlc
<micahg> bdrung: k, you know I have upload rights for it, right?
<bdrung> micahg: have you access to the git repository?
<micahg> bdrung: pkg-multimedia?
<bdrung> micahg: yes
<micahg> bdrung: yes, I'm a junior dev
<bdrung> micahg: k, then you could do it, too
<micahg> bdrung: k, if I have any questions, I'll ask siretart
<bdrung> yes
<micahg> bdrung: I"ll be back in about an hour, you can always send email to my nick at ubuntu dot com if you need something
<micahg> bdrung: once again, enjoy your vacation :)
<lfaraone> How can I figure out why a package that was in Lucid and is in Sid is not in maverick? searching for "packagename remove from maverick" does not give me antyhing usesul.
<lfaraone> *anything useful
<bdrung> lfaraone: which package?
<lfaraone> bdrung: libunicode-map8-perl-dfsg was formally in main.
<lfaraone> bdrung: now it's not shipped. libunicode-map8-perl (which is in sid) was in dapper but no other release after that.
<bdrung> lfaraone: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libunicode-map8-perl-dfsg/+publishinghistory
<bdrung> (From Debian) [auto-cruft] obsolete source package
<lfaraone> makes sense, there's no libunicode-map8-perl-dfsg in debian, because it's libunicode-map8-perl. But libunicode-map8-perl isn't there either <_<;
<bdrung> lfaraone: then request a sync of libunicode-map8-perl and provide all information for a FFe
<lfaraone> bdrung: working on it.
<bdrung> good night
<lfaraone> bdrung: thanks
<bdrung> you're welcome
<LucidFox> I wonder if it's possible to have the same package version in Debian and Ubuntu while building with indicator libraries only on Ubuntu
<LucidFox> Something like, Build-Depends: libappindicator-dev | not-ubuntu
<micahg> LucidFox: worth a simple delta
<LucidFox> micahg> Even when I'm the maintainer in both? -_-
<micahg> LucidFox: yes :), unless there's already a convention for what you're proposing :)
<micahg> LucidFox: maybe ask in #debian-ubuntu
<wgrant> Or push indicators into Debian :)
<wgrant> Although I get the feeling that anybody trying that would not survive for long.
 * micahg thinks someone was working on that
<micahg> wgrant: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2010/06/msg00293.html
<nigelb> LucidFox: might want to talk to kartik and evgeni @ debian end of things
<Zhenech> lucidfox, huh? (I'm evgeni)
<lucidfox> Zhenech> Well, I just had an idea, to avoid introducing deltas, to have the same source package build with Ubuntu-specific libraries under Ubuntu and without them under Debian
<Zhenech> lucidfox, from what I've observed, the deltas are usually only the thing that ubuntu ships the packages as -0ubuntu1 earlier as we ship the -1
<lucidfox> Zhenech> Erm
<Zhenech> from the packaging point of view the deltas are zero
<micahg> Zhenech: depends on the package
<lucidfox> Thing is, suppose I'm the maintainer of a package in both Debian and Ubuntu, and I want -1 sync as is from Debian, but build with indicator libraries
<Zhenech> debian has indicator libraries
<Zhenech> so you could build on both systems with indicator?
<Zhenech> (or is it something that needs your patched gtk to work with?)
<lucidfox> libindicate, yes, libappindicator, no
<Zhenech> ah, gimme a sec
<Zhenech> do you mean https://launchpad.net/indicator-application ?
<lucidfox> yep
<lucidfox> Well, I suppose I could cheat and write something like libappindicator-dev | build-essential
<Zhenech> thats ugly :)
<lucidfox> to make it, essentially, a "soft build-dependency"
<Zhenech> mh, maybe we should just pull appindicator to debian :)
<micahg> Zhenech: there was a thread on debian devel a couple months ago about it
<Zhenech> i added it to our wiki page as to be worked on :)
<micahg> dholbach: good morning
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> hi micahg
<micahg> dholbach: is there anywhere to track the progress of the new harvest?
<dholbach> micahg, "bzr branch lp:harvest; less harvest/INSTALL" I'm afraid
<micahg> dholbach: oh, is there a working copy up somewhere?  can I set up my own copy somewhere?
<dholbach> we want to fix https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/harvest/+bugs?field.importance=Critical and then get it deployed
<micahg> dholbach: ooh, so soon?
<dholbach> the new harvest has been in the making for quite lon
<dholbach> g
<dholbach> we can always get up new improvements later on
<Zhenech> trying to build indicator-application
<Zhenech> Couldn't find include 'Gtk-2.0.gir' (search path: ['.', '/usr/share/gir-1.0', '/usr/share/gir-1.0', '/usr/share/gir-1.0'])
<Zhenech> meh
<Zhenech> gtk gir is in gir-repository-dev in debian
<Zhenech> ok it at least built
<and471> if I file a merge request for a package in ubuntu, do I subscribe ubuntu-sponsors to the bug report, or set ubuntu-sponsors as the reviewer of the merge request?
<geser> I'd do both (if a bug exists but don't file a new one)
<and471> ok
<and471> vish, looks like geser agrees with you :)
<vish> :)
<vish> and471: iirc, only the bugs show-up in the sponsors list..
<geser> vish: depends on which list you look: only the bug gets shown on LP but both get listed on http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/
<vish> geser: ah, neat..! that list is what is in the topic.. hence i had told him to do both :)
<vish> wasnt sure which they might look at..
<geser> probably depends on each sponsor
<AnAnt> Hello
<bilalakhtar> geser: but, for branch merges, I have always been told to set reviewer but never sponsor.
<bilalakhtar> sorry
<bilalakhtar> I have always been told to set reviewer but never subscribe to bugs
<bilalakhtar> in case of branch merges ^^
<geser> have you been told any reason?
<geser> perhaps it changed in the last couple of months, but when I did my last branch merging, I also subscribed the sponsors team to the bug because of the poor visibility of merge requests at that time
<vish> i dont see why doing both is gonna harm though..
<vish> if some one reviews the bug they'd also be checking the merge of the list
<vish> s/reviews/sponsors
<geser> I wouldn't file a new bug but if a bug already exists, I see no reason why not subscribe the sponsors
<vish> yeah , not a new bug
<coolbhavi> geser, another thing after a sync request some update will be there say a ftbfs fix and I test that bug and update saying that this is a ftbfs fix for the present version reported in the sync will a sync always be uploaded in the original reporters name?
<geser> I'm not sure
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: I forgot to ping you yesterday!
<Rhonda> Oh, right!
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: np, give me another time to ping!
<Rhonda> Will be offline the next week? :)
<AnAnt> Hello
<canesin> Hi all
<canesin> =) .. here I'm again..
<AnAnt> Hello
<canesin> I have run the: grab-merge command and get :
<canesin> *** WARNING ***
<canesin> It looks like this package is maintained in revision control:
<canesin> than i trow some git and svn adress
<canesin> You almost certainly don't want to continue without investigating.
<canesin> ???
<canesin> Can some one help to merge that package ?? it is paraview..
<tumbleweed> canesin: you *probably* don't need to worry about it. Many Debian Developers maintain their packages in version control systems, and ubuntu packages we've forked can be maintained in bzr branches on lp
<canesin> tumbleweed: okay.. so I want to merge that package .. what should I do now ??
<canesin> tumbleweed: I have run the grab-merge tool...
<tumbleweed> canesin: if the Vcs URLs mentioned are *.debian.org you can ignore it (esp if it's a universe package)
<canesin> tumbleweed: they are .debian.org
<canesin> tumbleweed: so what now ??
<tumbleweed> canesin: carry on with the merge
<tumbleweed> canesin: you are aware that we are in feature freeze? (and so you'll need a freeze exception for merges that aren't purely for bug fixes)
<canesin> tumbleweed: this is a major scientific application.. it is in 3.8.1 in Debian unstable.. and in years old 3.4.0 in Ubuntu
<canesin> tumbleweed: to be true.. I believe all changes in the ubuntu one do not apply anymore to the current version
<tumbleweed> you'll probably get your exception then, but you still need to file for it in your merge bug https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<tumbleweed> yes, your merge should be for maverick. If a newever version is necessary in lucid too, follow the backporting process (once it's in maverick)
<canesin> I have to wait for maverick launch ??
<tumbleweed> canesin: no, you have to merge the new version of whatever this is into maverick, then you can get it backported to lucid (if it's needed there too)
<AnAnt> Hello
 * fabrice_sp has just seen that p.u.c knows about maverick packages now! Hurrahhh
<ari-tczew> packages.ubuntu.com fixed \o/
<ChogyDan> ari-tczew: yay!
<ari-tczew> it's a pity, that scarcely now. I always use packages.ubuntu.com during stricte development cycle (till FeatureFreeze)
<micahg> siretart: since bdrung is afk, I was going to try to update vlc this weekend in maverick, he finished everything in the git repo, but I have to reversion it since you changed the upload to experimental to be -2, will you be around this weekend at all if I run into any issues?
<micahg> sistpoty: sorry thunderbird took so long, I was sick half the week
<sistpoty> micahg: no worries (I mainly wanted it to not being dragged after beta), and big thanks for working on it!
<micahg> sistpoty: np, do you need any help with release stuff for mozilla related apps this time around?
<sistpoty> micahg: looks like noone cared about delegates yet :/
<sistpoty> micahg: however if there's mozilla releated stuff to approve, I assume you'll offer to help, right?
<micahg> sistpoty: I still want to try to get a few packages updated before beta if I can
<micahg> sistpoty: sure, I'm a dev this time around as well :)
<sistpoty> micahg: great, thanks!
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-21
<nigelb> Rhonda: *hugs* for getting packages.ubuntu.com working again :)
<dupondje> and now merges.ubuntu.com :)
<Rhonda> nigelb: Well, thank elmo I would expect, or cjwatson who should at least know who did the final tweakings.
<nigelb> Rhonda: yes, but somone had to keep poking them :)
<Rhonda> I guess I have to continue with that to make the screenshots appear anyway, people seem to like the idea, strangely enough. ;)
<nigelb> heh
<Rhonda> busy at froscon btw. Anyone of the usual suspects here?
<Rhonda> There is some ubuntu and kubuntu booth at least.
<nigelb> Berlin? dholbach maybe.
<nigelb> Oh, Bonn
<vish> jcastro: maye we can mention stack exchange in the installer itself!
<vish> argH!
<vish> wrong channel!
<and471> can anyone point me to some documentation on how to go about removing a package from main
<and471> actually, removing from universe
<tumbleweed> and471: write a bug requesting it's removal, and showing it has no rdepends. Link to the appropriate debian bug if it was removed there too. Subscribe ubuntu-archive.
<and471> ok thanks
<bilalakhtar> hi tumbleweed, for that keurocalc merge the other day do you think it was good from my part (after ignoring the forwarding to debian problem) ?
<and471> tumbleweed, thanks for the merge yesterday :)
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: I remember no issues :) and471: np
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: ah, ok. I am extra-careful about such stuff nowadays, since every thing counts once you get closer towards MOTU :)
<vish> bilalakhtar: looks like the gps drive is looking for someone to maintain it.. what we have in archive is pretty old outdated package, interested?  ;)
<bilalakhtar> vish: is it orphaned? ME TO THE RESque!
<bilalakhtar> vish: I wanted to maintain it for a long time, but the maintainer didn't announce it to be orphaned
<vish> bilalakhtar: its in the comments in one of the reports you pointed out.
<vish> bilalakhtar: not orphaned, but seems maintainer is MIA.
<bilalakhtar> vish: MIA?
<and471> missing in action
<vish> which might be orphaned , but not official
<vish> bilalakhtar: ^
<bilalakhtar> ok
<bilalakhtar> vish: it isn't orphaned, but I will put up an RFA
 * bilalakhtar fires up reportbug
<bilalakhtar> it appears that I will need to contact the maintainer
 * bilalakhtar joins #debian-qa on irc.oftc.net
<and471> bilalakhtar, what are the advantages of being a contributing dev?
<bilalakhtar> and471: the only advantage is that you get ubuntu membership the easy way!
<and471> bilalakhtar, vish has just recommended that I become one, but since you have just become one I thought I'd ask you :)
<and471> hehe
<bilalakhtar> and471: How many packages have you uploaded?
 * and471 starts counting
<bilalakhtar> and471: did you ever work on merges/syncs?
<vish> and471: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BilalAkhtar/ContributingDeveloperApplication  this was app
<vish> i
<and471> bilalakhtar, no not really, mostly fixes for 100 papercuts
<vish> and471: what about Software center? ;)
<and471> vish, oh yeah and that :)
 * bilalakhtar looks at and471 's lp profile
<bilalakhtar> and471: what did you do about s-c ?
<vish> and471: this is the wiki : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers#Ubuntu%20Contributing%20Developers  just thought you might qualify.. [but i'm not dmb though] ;p
<and471> bilalakhtar, I have just been heavily involved in its development
<bilalakhtar> and471: ah, that would help
<and471> vish, no problem, I am glad you recommended it or I never even would have thought about it
<vish> np.. :)
<and471> vish, bilalakhtar, I think the problem is I haven't done any sync/merges
<and471> (to be honest I couldn't define either)
<and471> maybe if I can get a few of them under my belt, I could apply
<bilalakhtar_> yes I am here, and471 and vish
<and471> bilalakhtar_, clone...
<bilalakhtar_> actually I got disconnected, so had to reconnect
<bilalakhtar_> let bilalakhtar go down, then I will change nick
<bilalakhtar_> and471: I was going to tell you, merging/syncing from Debian is the most common task in development (ubuntu). It might be a bit difficult to become UUC without it, but I cannot say anything, for sure
<and471> no you are right, I did to do some of them
 * bilalakhtar has to switch WiFi networks now, will be back in a few seconds
<ari-tczew> and471: do you want to become as UUC?
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: yes
<and471> ari-tczew, that is a question I need to ask :)
<ari-tczew> and471: could I see your LP and wiki page?
<and471> ari-tczew, vish recommended it and I just wanted to first find a little bit more about it
<bilalakhtar> and471: BTW, I never uploaded a package outside Maverick
<and471> ari-tczew, sure launchpad.net/~and471
<bilalakhtar> and471: which means that I got involved in development too early
<bilalakhtar> and471: its your choice, but I would recommend you to apply once you have crossed 10 uploads
<and471> bilalakhtar, cool thanks for the advice :)
<vish> ari-tczew: and471 has been working on Software center for a very very long time, ever since it was released , and i have seen him do work on a few other packages too.. so i just suggested it might be something he could try for :)
<bilalakhtar> and471: BTW, do you remember me poking you up for porting Wasiliana to python?
<and471> vish, I was working on it before you were called vish...
<vish> and471: ;p
<bilalakhtar> hehe
<and471> bilalakhtar, nope, but I probably have a bad memory
 * bilalakhtar switches networks
<and471> bilalakhtar, wasiliana is not really being worked on at the moment, I am trying to get kazam ready for a release and that is being a bit slow as well
<ari-tczew> and471, vish, bilalakhtar: there is no stricte bareer like "minimum 10 packages uploaded", just minimum work for Ubuntu. I didn't remember your work (personally).
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: I just recommended it to him
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: I know that there is no strict barrier
<and471> ari-tczew, yeah, but I think I need to do some syncs/merges before I apply
<bilalakhtar> BTW, coolbhavi got rejected from MOTU even after uploading 900+ packages!
<ari-tczew> and471: you have to create a wiki page if you want apply as UUC
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: he is just thinking about applying
<ari-tczew> and471, bilalakhtar: even so, it's require to get some comments from sponsors
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: hey, how do you people get so many packages uploaded! (joking) Did you hack or something? You have so many uploads!
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BilalAkhtar/ContributingDeveloperApplication was my application
<ari-tczew> bilalakhtar: just working
 * persia notes that nobody is ever rejected from MOTU: applications are just deferred
<ari-tczew> and471: I propose to fix security issues or even testing proposed patches :)
<vish> persia: hey! :)
<and471> bilalakhtar, did you have to ask people to comment on it, or does it just happend?
<and471> ari-tczew, cool thanks
<bilalakhtar> persia: ah ok if I used the wrong word, but what happened with coolbhavi's application and the e-mail votes?
<bilalakhtar> and471: you need to manually poke the people to comment
<and471> ok
<bilalakhtar> and471: I had poked 6 people, but only 3 commented
<and471> vish, well hopefully with those two bugs I just managed, I can get two syncs
<persia> bilalakhtar, In process.  Results will be annonced later.
<and471> if debian are not slow about it again
<bilalakhtar> one thing I don't like about Debian is that NMUs get sponsored very slowly
<ari-tczew> bilalakhtar: bhavi's case is sad, but he could include people's changes to debian/changelog and everything will be allright
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: that was a very small error
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: well, that taught all of us a lesson
<bilalakhtar> always thank people for patches in debian/changelog
<ari-tczew> bilalakhtar: I don't think so, because there are people which were affected by his problem
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: will you attend th e
<and471> anyway thanks for all of your guys' advice/help/jokes :)
<bilalakhtar> (continuation) next meeting
<bilalakhtar> ?
<and471> I'm gonna go now
<and471> see ya
<bilalakhtar> bye and471
<ari-tczew> bilalakhtar: I don't understand
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: will you attend the next meeting?
<ari-tczew> bilalakhtar: as you can see on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperMembershipBoard/Agenda, yes
<ari-tczew> and there is a question of free time, because 17th Aug I've been working in hours UTC 8:00 - 16:00 +1 hours for come back to home, so I was too late on channel.
<cjwatson> Rhonda: I did tell you who it was - Brad Marshall
<Rhonda> Oh, then I missed that part, thanks.
<AnAnt> Hello
<ari-tczew> helo AnAnt
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: could you review again bug 583280 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 583280 in mtd-utils (Ubuntu Lucid) "nandwrite failing with IGEPv2 (OMAP 3430)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/583280
<ari-tczew> now sponsors step is first before SRU team review
<tumbleweed> ari-tczew: so, do you think that debdiff is ready for SRU? I see two small issues
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: so I have to look into debdiff :P
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: 1: run update-maintainer and 2: include lp: # in debian/changelog
<ari-tczew> no subscribed ubuntu-sponsors in bug :P
<tumbleweed> ari-tczew: yes to all of those. but two issues in this line: mtd-utils (20090606-1ubuntu1) lucid; urgency=low
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: s/lucid/lucid-proposed
<tumbleweed> yup
<ari-tczew> s/20090606-1ubuntu1/20090606-1ubuntu0.1
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: ^^
<tumbleweed> almost there
<tumbleweed> hint:
<tumbleweed>  mtd-utils | 20090606-1 | karmic/universe | source, amd64, i386
<tumbleweed>  mtd-utils | 20090606-1 | lucid/universe | source, amd64, i386
<tumbleweed> ari-tczew: point 4: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Procedure
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: and?
<tumbleweed> karmic and lucid have the same version number. 20090606-1ubuntu0.1 in lucid would not allow us to SRU karmic
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: why not?
<tumbleweed> well, what version number would we use to SRU to kramic?
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: 20090606-1ubuntu-9.10
<tumbleweed> we try to never have two hyphens in a version, it confuses some things
<tumbleweed> anyway, if you follow th elink from point 4, you'll get here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/UpdatePreparation#Update%20the%20packaging
<tumbleweed> which has this recommended scheme:
<tumbleweed> 2.0-2 in two releases         2.0-2ubuntu0.5.04.1 and 2.0-2ubuntu0.5.10.1
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: so he must repair his debdiff
<tumbleweed> you know everything that needs to be done now, feel free to propose a debdiff
<ari-tczew> I'll do that, but later
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: do you mean attach a fixed debdiff or suggest him to fix something?
<tumbleweed> ari-tczew: attach one
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: sign by me?
<tumbleweed> yes, nothing wrong with that if you are the one preparing it. It's normal to give credit to the patch author in the message.
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: I'll add in debian/changelog a line:  [ Daniel J Blueman ] and below the change
<tumbleweed> that works too
<ari-tczew> bilalakhtar: that just Bhavani has got the problem with including other people in debian/changelog ^^
<michas> Hi, not sure if I am absolutely on-topic, but do you know why the sun-java6-* packages where moved from multiverse to partner? Was there a large licence change or something?
<sebner> michas: I guess because in theory openjdk is now equivalent to sun-java
<sladen> michas: being superceded
<SpamapS> Anyone know how to get requestsync to see that this package was uploaded to unstable: http://packages.qa.debian.org/g/gearman-interface.html ?
<SpamapS> 0.13.2-1 is severely broken
<geser> SpamapS: once LP or rmadison list it
<geser> SpamapS: but you still have the option to file the sync request by hand, just copy the needed infomation into the bug
<SpamapS> geser: whats rmadison ?
<nigelb> SpamapS: its a tool (in devscripts)
<nigelb> !info rmadison
<ubottu> Package rmadison does not exist in lucid
<nigelb> that's strange
<nigelb> oh wait, it isn't a package
<geser> nigelb: like you said, a tool in devscripts
<geser> !info devscripts
<ubottu> devscripts (source: devscripts): scripts to make the life of a Debian Package maintainer easier. In component main, is optional. Version 2.10.61ubuntu5 (lucid), package size 578 kB, installed size 1724 kB
<geser> :)
<SpamapS> ah Ok
<SpamapS> so how does rmadison update itself?
<nigelb> SpamapS: It queries the servers.
<nigelb> geser: yeah, I was getting there :)
<SpamapS> ok, I see that.. and it still has 0.13.2-1 .. odd
<geser> it's only a frontend for a CGI page on the Debian servers which gets its information directly from a database
<SpamapS> yeah I see that
<SpamapS> weird that PTS has the new version, but madison does not
<SpamapS> I'm probably just being too eager. the upload was only 24 hours ago
<geser> which should usually be enough
<SpamapS> Projectb snapshot from Thu, 19 Aug 2010 15:18:06 +0000
<SpamapS> not quite. ;)
<SpamapS> Not sure how often that snapshot is updated.. but 2 days seems a long time. ;)
<geser> dinstall runs nowadays 4 times a day in Debian IIRC
<SpamapS> well I won't worry about it
<SpamapS> I should be outside in the sun anyway, not syncing packages
<simar> shadeslayer: heya !!! hows going on
<shadeslayer> oh hey
<shadeslayer> :D
<shadeslayer> simar: long time no see :D
<simar> shadeslayer: ya :D
<simar> shadeslayer: I'm happy that you remember me..
<shadeslayer> :)
<simar> shadeslayer: I want to ask something, why doesn't the moto mentoring program respond??
<shadeslayer> because its not active as of now?
<simar> shadeslayer: :-((
<simar> shadeslayer: oh, by the way hows you application for moto going on..
<shadeslayer> yeah i know
<shadeslayer> simar: ah.. right now im looking at some coding, not alot of packaging for universe
<shadeslayer> but im involved with neon.. which takes up most of my packaging time :P
<shadeslayer> one sec
<simar> simar:  neon??
<iulian> simar: The acronym is MOTU btw, not moto.
 * iulian goes back to his cave.
<simar> iulian: oh, my mistake.
<simar> iulian: , typo
<shadeslayer> simar: project neon
<shadeslayer> basically aimed at providing nightly KDE builds
<simar> shadeslayer: ok
<simar> shadeslayer: now i can package better and i'm still a beginner to packaging.
<shadeslayer> good to hear :D
<shadeslayer> so basically its bug fixing time in maverick, you might want to look at the topic ;)
<simar> shadeslayer: I hope you can guide me some better starting point (than FTBFS that i started at) for easy packaging..
<simar> shadeslayer: I'm interested in bug fixing... let me see
<shadeslayer> well.. your a bit late, else i could have told you how to do sync's and merge's as well
<simar> shadeslayer: :-((
<simar> shadeslayer: I can't see much interesting in topic.. what you were pointing at??
<shadeslayer> same FTBFS :P
<shadeslayer> and look at bugs.launchpad.net
<shadeslayer> do we have a tag for packaging bugs?
* sladen changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Archive: Open | Maverick Feature Freeze in effect - Fix bugs | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://is.gd/2y76G | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/ | latest rebuild failures: http://udd.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu_ftbfs.cgi
<simar> shadeslayer: ya FTBFS has taken a lot of my energy..
<shadeslayer> whee
<shadeslayer> archive open again
<simar> shadeslayer: see this I have submitted some patch work https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kball/+bug/611867
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 611867 in kball (Ubuntu) "FTBFS in maverick. Error: 'mkdir' was not declared in this scope" [Undecided,Fix released]
<simar> shadeslayer: I think i should start at 100 papercuts, may be..
<shadeslayer> simar: good start
<simar> shadeslayer: thanks for encouraging :-))
<simar> shadeslayer: what about 100 papercuts
<shadeslayer> simar: id say go for them ;)
<shadeslayer> also look at operation cleansweep
<simar> shadeslayer: ya I have heard both of them, I think i'll try to fit myself somewhere ..
<simar> shadeslayer: thanks for you advice
<simar> though
<simar> :))
<shadeslayer> simar: contact nigelb for operation cleansweep
 * shadeslayer points nigelb to new minion 
<simar> shadeslayer: ya i will, first i will read some wiki, though i have read some.. :))
<shadeslayer> yeah operation cleansweep has a pretty small wiki
<shadeslayer> just see if the patch is still applicable > use it with packaging > attach debdiff and ask a MOTU to review bug if its in universe
<simar> ya, if we skip knowledge base part of it. ..lol
<simar> shadeslayer: thanks for overview ..
<shadeslayer> :)
<simar> shadeslayer: ok, i think i should start right away .. once again thanks n good luck in coding .. :-))
<shadeslayer> hehe :D
<shadeslayer> my patch is almost 90 % ready
<simar> shadeslayer: good .. keep it going, c ya later
<shadeslayer> cya
<sistpoty> can anyone unsubscribe sponsors from bug #619709 please, as I seem to have lost the ability to do so during the merge of the sponsors teams.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 619709 in javacc (Ubuntu) "Please sync javacc 5.0-4 (main) from debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/619709
<tumbleweed> sistpoty: done
<sistpoty> thanks tumbleweed
<BlackZ> sistpoty: if you ACK a sync request, you should set the bug's status to "Confirmed"
<sistpoty> BlackZ: ah, thanks for the hint
 * RainCT wonders if anyone is familiar with libtextcat
<RainCT> particularly on why libtextcat-data-utf8 won't let met install libtextcat0
<sistpoty> RainCT: libtextcat0 depends on libtextcat-data, which conflicts with libtextcat-data-utf8
<RainCT> sistpoty: yup, so why would that be?
<sistpoty> RainCT: no idea... I'm not familiar with libtextcat :P
<RainCT> It looks like libtextcat-data-utf8 is there only for OpenOffice.org, which from what I've read ships a bundled copy of libtextcat0
<sistpoty> RainCT: my best guess is that both data files are meant to be interchangeable, just the mechanism was chosen wrongly
 * RainCT tries what happens adding a Provides: libtextcat-data to -utf8
<sistpoty> RainCT: I doubt it will work, since libtextcat-data is non-virtual... otoh, provides in conjunction with conflicts is so special, that I always forget the details. probably if you change the conflicts to libtextcat-data it might even work
<RainCT> "openoffice.org-common conflicts with libtextcat-data   libtextcat-data-utf8 provides libtextcat-data and is to be installed.  dpkg: error"
<RainCT> damn you dpkg :P
<sistpoty> haha
<sistpoty> RainCT: I think the self-conflicts of libtextcat-data-utf8 should be adjusted to libtextcat-data, maybe that makes dpkg happier :)
<RainCT> OK, got it installed, giving libtextcat0 an alternative dependency on -utf8, and removing "Breaks: libtextdata0" from -utf8. Let's see if it works
<sistpoty> RainCT: I think the traditional approach is to have both data packages provide one virtual package (both conflicting to it) and have the library depend on bestfitrealpackage | virtual-package (since that adds the least burden on apts dependency resolver)
<sistpoty> Lutin: python-evas ftbfs (0.3.1+svn20091203-1), however 0.5.0+r49677-1 builds fine. Should we go for a sync? (I'm totally unfamiliar with the zhone stack)
<RainCT> uhm, half of the sentences in langclass/ShortTexts/catalan.txt are in Spanish o.O
<sistpoty> saludos! :)
<RainCT> sistpoty: ok, the library works fine with the UTF-8 data, so I see no reasons why they should conflict
<sistpoty> RainCT: probably it was just a not working approach to state that either data or data-utf8 would be needed
<Lutin> sistpoty: oh yes, totally. that's my fault here - forgot that python-* was in ubuntu. you might want to sync python-ecore, -edje, -edbus and -elementary too
<sistpoty> Lutin: thanks!
<RainCT> oh, packages.ubuntu.com is being updated again?
<sistpoty> RainCT: hm? works for me (though I still don't get screenshots *g*)
<RainCT> last time I checked it didn't have maverick
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-22
<smallfoot-> plz package php-gtk
<smallfoot-> plz package php-gtk
<kklimonda> smallfoot-: the project is all but dead and with the upcoming gtk+3 release and all the gobject introspection work that goes along with it I fear that uploading the current version right now wouldn't make sense. Not to mention that there is no one who is interested in packaging it.
<smallfoot-> kklimonda, but i need php-gtk for running gui of phoronix-test-suite
<kklimonda> yes, and that is probably the only realworld application that uses php-gtk bindings. You will have to ask phoronix guys how to install php=gtk (or check its homepage). There may also be some 3rd party ppa with it - have you ckecked?
<smallfoot-> there is a ppa but only for karmic, not lucid, maverick
<smallfoot-> and i dont want use third-party ppa or install from source, i want it "just work"
<Muscovy> Hi, I'm the uploader of http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/day-of-ubuntu . Would anyone mind helping me solve the lintian error? I haven't been able to fix this one without creating more.
<kklimonda> Muscovy: what errors do you get when you remove NMU?
<Muscovy> It's been a while since I tried, so I'll test. I _think_ it mentions it needs NMU.
<ebroder> Muscovy: What version of Lintian are you using? It should know not to whine about NMUs if the maintainer is set to ubuntu-devel-discuss
<Muscovy> I think I had set it to the development team as the owner.
<Muscovy> Also, is there an easy way to download it all from revu? I can't seem to find my local copy anymore.
<ebroder> dget <.dsc file>
<Muscovy> Thanks, that's handy.
<ebroder> (It only works if all the files are in the same, err, URL directory, or whatever)
<ebroder> (But that's usually the case)
<Muscovy> So is it ubuntu-devel-discuss with no address?
<ebroder> Muscovy: Sorry, no - what you've got should be good. Just remove the NMU note from the changelog
<Muscovy> Ok.
<Muscovy> Ok, it's uploading. It'll take a few minutes.
<Muscovy> Here we are, ebroder: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/day-of-ubuntu-1008220757/lintian
 * ebroder squints
<Muscovy> Two complaints: 3.0 format and no README.
<ebroder> I have a theory
<ebroder> Muscovy: Are you doing development on a Lucid or Maverick machine/VM/chroot/whatever?
<Muscovy> Lucid machine.
<ebroder> And do you get those warnings when you run Lintian on your package?
<Muscovy> Nope.
<Muscovy> I get "W: day-of-ubuntu source: out-of-date-standards-version 3.8.3 (current is 3.8.4)".
<ebroder> Ok. In that case, I blame revu for being a really old machine
<ebroder> (You should bump the standards version, though)
<Muscovy> I tried that before, actually.
<Muscovy> Revu said 3.8.4 didn't exist.
<ebroder> Yeah. That's because Revu is running Hardy, and it didn't exist then :)
<Muscovy> Ah. Why isn't 3.8.4 a lucid update though?
<Muscovy> 3.8.3 is still the lucid default.
<ebroder> Packages update their standards version when they get around to it. Do you mean that 3.8.3 is what you get from dh_make or something?
<Muscovy> Yes.
<ebroder> Yeah. It probably just wasn't updated when Lucid was syncing from Debian
<kklimonda> the current policy is 3.9.1 so you should update your package to it
<kklimonda> (by update I mean actually checking if there were changes affecting your package - there is a nice upgrading-checklist.txt.gz in debian-policy package)
<ebroder> Speaking of which, it's *really* silly that REVU is still running on a Hardy sparc box. What are the current hardware requirements for the site (disk, etc)? Surely someone else has some - any - spare capacity...
<micahg> ebroder: can't upgrade w/sparc to lucid...
<ebroder> micahg: Right. The sparc bit is the bit that's silly
<Muscovy> There, it's up: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/day-of-ubuntu
<wgrant> ebroder: We can move it elswhere. But there's no really compelling reason to do so yet.
<wgrant> But it was discussed last week.
<ebroder> wgrant: "Having an ancient version of Lintian that misfires errors at you" doesn't count as a compelling reason? :)
<Muscovy> I agree with that.
<Muscovy> And it can't use debian 3.0 format.
<wgrant> Muscovy: That just requires backporting a new lintian, which we've historically done often.
<wgrant> Er, ebroder: ^^
<wgrant> Muscovy: And a dpkg backport was in progress last week.
<Muscovy> Ah, progress. :D
<ebroder> I guess that works then
<wgrant> It just requires somebody to care for REVU.
<wgrant> I can move it onto different hardware if required, but others need to maintain the service.
<Muscovy> Well, if I become a MOTU, I'll certain help if possible.
<Muscovy> Revu feels under-utilized.
<ebroder> wgrant: Hmm...if you're looking for MOTU volunteers, I might be interested, but I'll have to get back to you once I think about what I'm getting myself into
<wgrant> Well, there are others in control of the service.
<wgrant> I'm not looking for anyone.
<wgrant> I was mainly responding to the questioning of whether there was other hardware.
 * micahg prepares an upload to feed the hungry builders
<wgrant> ia64 and sparc are going to be eternally hungry soon :(
<micahg> wgrant: nah, we just have to start backporting and SRUing more :)
<wgrant> Heh.
<micahg> should .pc be in the VCS for soruce format 3?
<micahg> wgrant: ^^
<Zhenech> hyperair, ping
<tumbleweed> micahg: I wish it wasn't but the auto-imported packages tend to be stored patches-applied, yes
<micahg> tumbleweed: that's what I'm wondering, the Debian version has it, so I should include in Ubuntu version too?
<tumbleweed> "the debian version" ?
<micahg> lp:debian/sid/foo
<tumbleweed> aah
<maco> is there any reason why it would be a bad idea for /etc/bashrc to by default have "export QUILT_PATCHES='debian/patches'" to save *headdesks* later for us all on new installs?
<micahg> maco: because not all packages work like that
<maco> dang
<tumbleweed> maco: time to store your .quiltrc in $vcs and write a new install personal-customisation script?
<maco> i dont have a .quiltrc...i just put that in my .bashrc and then setup VMs and forget to do it there too and then get confused
<maco> i was asking seb128 the other day how he got gnome-control-center to compile when quilt push -a fails... and he reminded me
<bilalakhtar> maco: how was it?
<maco> bilalakhtar: i forgot to set QUILT_PATCHES
<bilalakhtar> ah ok
<AnAnt> Hello
<micahg> tumbleweed: when merging with VCS, does every merge change need to be a new commit w/source format 3 or all in one?
<tumbleweed> micahg: that's up to personal style, I tend to do them in one commit (or a few commits in a branch, merged into one commit in the UDD tree)
<tumbleweed> (if I'm understanding you correctly(
<micahg> tumbleweed: yeah, the changes should all be present though
<micahg> just patches if necessary aren't applied
<micahg> in ,oc
<micahg> or rather in the code..
<tumbleweed> people like patches-applied because you can see the final source in the tree, and $vcs blame it appropriately. I don't like it, because it makes reviewing harder and obfuscates things (often resulting in auto-generated anti-patches, when people are new to quilt)
<micahg> tumbleweed: also, should I put the Ubuntu VCS info or leave the Debian VCS info
<tumbleweed> only if we maintain our own packaging of this in a VCS somewhere
<micahg> tumbleweed: not UDD?
<tumbleweed> well, all packages have UDD branches
<micahg> tumbleweed: no, most packages have UDD branches
<tumbleweed> and few packages are actually maintained in them (you don't see new versions being prepared in them)
<tumbleweed> basically, I'd say leave the debian vcs info
<micahg> tumbleweed: k
<hyperair> Zhenech: pong
<Zhenech> hyperair, talked with enrico at froscon yesterday
<hyperair> oh cool
<Zhenech> hyperair, the safest way to get plugins 0.19 in is not to ship any of the new plugins :)
<hyperair> eh?
<hyperair> oh, into squeeze?
<Zhenech> yepp
<hyperair> okay.
<Zhenech> dunno how the release team thinks about new binaries
<Zhenech> will ask later today
<hyperair> okay, thanks.
<bilalakhtar> hi hyperair seeing you after so long
<Zhenech> have a patch on my hd to do this already :)
<hyperair> bilalakhtar: it's only been a week =)
<hyperair> Zhenech: a patch to drop the new binaries?
<Zhenech> yepp
<hyperair> i see.
<hyperair> that's nice
<hyperair> speaking of which i need to get round to adding --enable/disable flags for each plugin, instead of those with weird dependencies.
<Zhenech> yepp! :)
<hyperair> wait, you mean the patch does all that?
<Zhenech> no
<Zhenech> my patch just drops ctpl build dep
<Zhenech> and drops the packages from debian/control
<Zhenech> so they are built but never installed
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: As for bug #621065 , seb128 told me that we can go ahead without FFe since its a GNOME package
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 621065 in sound-juicer (Ubuntu) "Update to 2.31.6" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/621065
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: am I right ?
<tumbleweed> sounds fair enough
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: GNOME packages can be updated until version 2.32 rolls out
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: Its not fair to freeze on an unstable release like 2.31.* and not upgrade to the stable ones
<tumbleweed> yeah, sounds good
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: And, we are uploading this version even though the package is maintained in Debian, because of the fact that Debian will straightaway upload 2.32 while Ubuntu needs to go in a more progressive way (seb128)
<micahg> bilalakhtar: some of the debian maintainers will upload the 2.31.x releases to experimental
<hyperair> Zhenech: i see. that sounds feasible.
<hyperair> Zhenech: could you pastebin the patch somewhere so i can apply it? =)
<bilalakhtar> Thanks tumbleweed for the upload!
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: any time
<micahg> tumbleweed: with MoM down, UDD is a lifeaver
<micahg> *lifesaver
<tumbleweed> micahg: are you using my merge tool?
<micahg> tumbleweed: no
<tumbleweed> micahg: :)
<micahg> tumbleweed: sorry, this was same upstream revision so it was an easy merge :)
<Zhenech> hyperair, i also could just commit myself :)
<Zhenech> hyperair, but I mail debian-release first :)
<shadeslayer> hi, how do i request a sync from debian experimental?
<shadeslayer> i tried : requestsync foo -d experimental  -e
<shadeslayer> doesnt work :/
<geser> error?
<shadeslayer> E: 'kmymoney' doesn't appear to exist in Debian 'experimental'
<shadeslayer> http://packages.debian.org/experimental/kmymoney
<ajmitch> shadeslayer: possibly because it was uploaded in the last 24h?
<geser> it was uploaded today
<shadeslayer> oh
<shadeslayer> yes i know
<shadeslayer> so it doesnt pick it up
<shadeslayer> ddidnt know that ^ :P
<ajmitch> no, it grabs the info from a mirror that's regularly synced (daily iirc)
<shadeslayer> hmm
<geser> requestsync only knows what's in LP or reported by rmadison
<shadeslayer> rmadison ?
<shadeslayer> debian mirror ?
<geser> a script from devscripts
<shadeslayer> oic
<geser> http://qa.debian.org/madison.php?package=kmymoney
<geser> hmm, the snapshot seems a little bit out-of-date
<micahg> geser: yeah, I"m having that with phpmyadmin also
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: Hello! Would you recommend me to apply for MOTU now or wait?
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: drop me a mail with a list of spnsorships I've done for you, and I'll be able to give you an answer (we need a script for this, I tried writing one but can't get the data I need out of lp's API)
<persia> tumbleweed, You can parse the data out of the -changes mail
<tumbleweed> persia: yeah, I suppose that's the best way
<AnAnt> persia: hey, long time !
<Rhonda> Is the last change in bug #619650 someone just looking for easy karma? :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 619650 in wesnoth (Ubuntu) "Please remove wesnoth from maverick" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/619650
<nigelb> Rhonda: Possible. I don't see him/her in bug squad.
<nigelb> (the entire thing is not needed I think.  Generally bug squad is encouraged to stay away from workflow bugs)
<anoteng> which package am I missing when I get the following error during source package building?
<anoteng> dpkg-source: error: source package format `3.0' is not supported (Perl module Dpkg::Source::Package::V3 is required)
<Bachstelze> could an SRU person look at #622319 ?
<tumbleweed> Bachstelze: subscribe ubuntu-sponsors. It also needs a maverick fix before the SRU can be approved
<Flannel> anoteng: dpkg-dev
<Bachstelze> tumbleweed: ok, done
<tumbleweed> Bachstelze: you also want to Nominate for Lucid
<anoteng> Flannel:  I thought so too, but it's allready installed...
<Flannel> anoteng: What version of Ubuntu are you running?
<Bachstelze> tumbleweed: also Maverick?
<tumbleweed> Bachstelze: not necessary
<anoteng> 10.04
<geser> what the content of debian/source/format?
<ari-tczew> Rhonda: I think that it's pedantic.
<ari-tczew> nigelb: so upgrade dspam must be gigantic procedure
<nigelb> ari-tczew: I dunno.
<nigelb> I just looked at the debian ML
<ari-tczew> nigelb: IIRC they are upgrading 3 years this package
<nigelb> ari-tczew: well, it is in experimental
<nigelb> I think it broke some stuff
<ari-tczew> nigelb: some time ago I tried to do this, but it's true, it's very hard to do.
<nigelb> ari-tczew: In that case, we cannot blame them.  Everyone's a volunteer.
<nigelb> I myself was away from cleansweep for some time until I could finally schedule my work around it now.
<ari-tczew> yea
<funkeyDuder> I am having trouble building a package.  When I change the source I get an error about failing some test (using debuild).  Anyone have any thoughts as to what might be going on?
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: I mailed you the list of bugs
<andrew_708476> IS there anyone that doesn't mind lending a hand with Ubuntu
<ari-tczew> funkeyDuder: give a log - use pastebin
<ari-tczew> dupondje: ping
<dupondje> pong :)
<ari-tczew> dupondje: are you still interesed contribute to Ubuntu?
<dupondje> sure sure :) but bit less time atm :)
<ari-tczew> dupondje: we have to finish patching asterisk, do you remember?
<ari-tczew> it's still waiting on my hard disk :)
<dupondje> what was not correct with it again ? :)
<ari-tczew> dupondje: please tab me if you are writing to me.
<ari-tczew> it will easy for me
<ari-tczew> dupondje: you have to complete file CVE-2007-6170.dpatch
<ubottu> SQL injection vulnerability in the Call Detail Record Postgres logging engine (cdr_pgsql) in Asterisk 1.4.x before 1.4.15, 1.2.x before 1.2.25, B.x before B.2.3.4, and C.x before C.1.0-beta6 allows remote authenticated users to execute arbitrary SQL commands via (1) ANI and (2) DNIS arguments. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2007-6170)
<ari-tczew> there is no DEP3 tags
<ari-tczew> there are no *
<AnAnt> Hello
<ari-tczew> hello AnAnt
<micahg> is conflicts appropriate when if one package is installed, the other will not work?
<micahg> in that they provide similar functionality
<debfx> micahg: yes, if they really don't work when the other is installed
<micahg> debfx: k, filing the bug in Debian...
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-15
<dholbach> good morning
<philipballew> Good morning dholbach
<dholbach> hi philipballew
<philipballew> good day in your neck of the woods I hope
<dholbach> I'm sure it will be :)
<philipballew> Most excellent!
<pibara> I'm not quite sure what to do with respect to getting a library I wrote into universe. I've added a script for generating a proper deb package (for amd64) from the source tree, and probably could do the same for other architectures (to what I don't have access). Should I look for an existing universe maintainer willing to add my package to universe, or go trough the mentor thingy to become one myself? I would prefer the first, but not sure if this is possible,
<pibara> Anyone who could advice me on that? Do I look for a universe maintainer (if so where do I find one), or do I need to go trough the mentor mill to become one myself?
<pibara> For some more context, its a C++ JSON parsing library build on top of the GLIB JSON C library.
<micahg> pibara: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<pibara> micahg: tnx
<hakermania> tumbleweed: some time you suggested me to work on other projects too, while you'll be looking on mine, or something like that. Were you reffering to bug fixes?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: I mean if you are hanging around in #ubuntu-motu, you could help out with Ubuntu :) see the links in the topic
<hakermania> tumbleweed, would love to
<jtaylor> is this supposed to throw an exception in python2.7? import locale; locale.normalize(u"en_US")
<jtaylor> it works without unicode
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: works on debian
<Pici> jtaylor: works on Ubuntu (Natty) as well.
<jtaylor> o_O
<jtaylor> does not work in my unstable chroot
<tumbleweed> ah, this was on testing, you're right re unstable
<jtaylor> its a python 2.7.2 regression then
<jtaylor> introduced by this patch: http://bugs.python.org/issue1813
<tumbleweed> that looks about right
<tumbleweed> so, what does it break?
<jtaylor> playonlinux and aptdaemon
<jtaylor> the latter was fixed
<jtaylor> or worked around
<jtaylor> former patch submitted to debian
<jtaylor> but it will break a lot of wx code
<jtaylor> wx.Locale.GetCanonicalName returns unicode
<tumbleweed> :/
<jtaylor> reported upstream http://bugs.python.org/issue12752
<jtaylor> Should I report it against python package too?
<jtaylor> and put all bugs duplicate against it
<jtaylor> found 3 already
<systemclient> given that my package was accepted into debian unstable, what do I have to do to get it into ubuntu?
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: yes (against python2.7),  it sounds like we should do something in Debian/Ubuntu about it.
<tumbleweed> systemclient: we're in feature freeze, so file a sync request witha feature freeze exception
<systemclient> tumbleweed: or wait till 12.04?
<tumbleweed> systemclient: you can do that too. But, we are only a few days into feature freeze. if it's a leaf package you'd like to see in oneiric, you can file a request
<systemclient> tumbleweed: what is a leaf package? Nothing depends on it?
<tumbleweed> yes
<systemclient> that is the case â¦ I'll look into sync requests tonight then
<systemclient> thank you!
<jtaylor> can someone set it to triaged? maybe also set importance: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python2.7/+bug/824734
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 824734 in python2.7 (Ubuntu) "locale.normalize does not accept unicode: TypeError in normalize(): character mapping must return integer, None or unicode" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Laney> jtaylor: please get bug control ;-)
<Laney> what importance would you set?
<jtaylor> as it affects some core components (update-manage) I#d say high
<paultag> Yeah, I agree
<paultag> it breaks unrelated software. Setting now
<Laney> just testing
<paultag> jtaylor: all set. Thanks for picking that one out :)
<nigelb> jtaylor: I'd +1 Laney's suggestion. Please get bug control or alternatively MOTU :)
<Laney> bug control should be much quicker
<Laney> no reason to not get it based on some other pending application
<paultag> yar, -bugs is fairly active
<paultag> honestly I thought this was bugs until I checked
<nigelb> heh
<jtaylor> sent an application for bug control
<nigelb> stuck in moderation, should come in, in a few
<jtaylor> someone here a member of debian-gnome and can sponsor meld(exp)?
<jtaylor> it ould allow fixing a bunch of ugly meld bugs in natty
<Laney> have you pinged in there?
<jtaylor> the debian maintainer did a couple fo times already
<Laney> ok
<Laney> i'll do it later
<jtaylor> great thanks
<hggdh> jtaylor: OK. You got the first +1 on -control ;-)
<micahg> jtaylor: BTW, dev membership includes bug control :)
<tumbleweed> so apply already
<Laney> how can I tell svn-bp that I have an orig.tar.xz?
<jtaylor> by patching it
<jtaylor> meld was uploaded already
<jtaylor> it wasn't you?
<Laney> no
<Laney> someone did it?
<jtaylor> yes short while ago
<Laney> fair
<Laney> still, it needs patching to do that?
<Laney> what a hunk
<jtaylor> its easier to fix than pristine-tar needed for git-bp :/
<Laney> pristine-tar: committed meld_1.5.2.orig.tar.xz.delta to branch pristine-tar
<Laney> seems like the delta is the entire file
<Laney> works though
<tumbleweed> hrm, I notice ubuntu-sponsoring no longer things MOTUs can upload to universe
<tumbleweed> thinks
<tumbleweed> Laney: I wonder if that was due to going anonymous
<micahg> tumbleweed: what do you mean?
<tumbleweed> micahg: bold vs italic on the sponsorship overview
<micahg> ah, yes, I noticed that
<Laney> tumbleweed: why would it?
<Laney> sounds like an api bug if so
<Laney> can you run the method manually
<Laney> ?
 * Laney is cooking ATM, then DMB â sorry
<Laney> it was a fairly uninvolved change from my side :P
<geser> Laney: thanks for the reminder
<Laney> heh heh
 * Laney hopes maco and persia can make it too
<paultag> I thought maco steped down from the DMB
<paultag> thought I got an email about that
<geser> paultag: she is
<tumbleweed> Laney: yeah I should look at it properly too. I remember the api call being horrible (you determine True or false by whether you get an exception or not): P
<geser> paultag: we hope she will be available till the vote for her replacement
<paultag> geser: ah, right. CoC and all that
<Laney> tumbleweed: actually I remember somethign weird about that call
<Laney> perhaps it wasn't a function of the launchpad object?
<tumbleweed> actually maybe that was the call as me. after supper...
<geser> tumbleweed: it might be really that anon is not enough. If I did my quick api test correctly then distribution.main_archive.getPermissionsForPerson(person=person) returns an empty list which results in False for person_can_upload (assuming that the first part of function doesn't return anything)
<Laney> why would that be?
<geser> I didn't check each call of the function but IIRC the second part was needed too (I asked about it in the past when writing a similar function for requestsync)
<tumbleweed> geser: this sounds like a bug in launchpad
<tumbleweed> yeah I see the empty list vs populated list when logged in
<paultag> Hey MOTU
<paultag> does anyone remember what we did after warty warthog when the release name+1 was < then the stable release?
<paultag> was there a massive debian-local version bump and rebuild or what?
<paultag> e.g. package-1.0~warty1 > package-1.0~dapper1
 * tumbleweed wasn't an ubuntu-user in those days, but was it such a big issue? Was the release name in many package versions?
<Laney> I can only think of backports, and I'm not sure if that existed then
<tumbleweed> well, people could use a release name in SRU versions too
<ScottK> It was not part of the archive.  It was on sourceforge.
<paultag> right
<ScottK> (project is still there if you're interested in historical artifacts)
<paultag> ScottK: do you seem to remember what was done for when this happend, or what the plan is post Zadjective Zanimal ?
<ScottK> paultag: It was before my time (I started with Dapper).
<paultag> Ah, I need someone from badger-era :)
<paultag> humm. I'm betting good money Debian has to deal with this after wheezy
<paultag> they append the version ID to migrations, I think
<paultag> Oh wait, SRUs, right
<micahg> well, they use versions in backports usually, not codenames
<tumbleweed> paultag: even then it won't affect that many packages
<tumbleweed> micahg: +squeeze1 is common for SPU (SRU in debian)
<paultag> tumbleweed: well the changes would be pushed to unstable as well with a bump
<paultag> even if it's a NMU it should work OK
<micahg> tumbleweed: yes, but that packages is usually superceded in testing
<tumbleweed> micahg: yes, and it'll only be an issue if it isn't
<micahg> I would expect the stable release team in Debian to prevent such things from occuring :)
<tumbleweed> you'll never have copy-up from spu to testing or tpu to unstable. The only way it could happen is if something was tpu-ed and never migrated from unstable again until the next release. not going to happen :)
 * tumbleweed can't remember why I've got a netatalk beta in my ppa, but it seems to generate lots of e-mail from people to me, wanting new releases
<tumbleweed> clearly they can't read the "This PPA is my personal play-ground, and full of weeds. Don't expect anything to not break your system or to still be here tomorrow."
<ajmitch> it's not one of those things that you expect people to still be using these days
<Laney> google for "$software ppa", add first result, ???, profit
<Laney> second result in this instance (after the ubuntu +source page)
<tumbleweed> Laney: hrm, that's probably it
<tumbleweed> oh well I'll do a new upload then. /me pleases the anonymous masses
<Laney> yeah, having (some) PPAs not be indexed by search engines would be good
<ajmitch> I see that oneiric at least has a recent release of it
<tumbleweed> apparently there's a 2.2 final release out
<ajmitch> released only ~3 weeks ago, too
<ajmitch> I didn't know anyone still cared about AFP
<Laney> tumbleweed: there's a backport request for 2.2 final too
<Laney> fancy it? :-)
<broder> haha, i was just looking at that bug
<tumbleweed> Laney: we'd have to get it into oneiric first
<tumbleweed> broder: I was just about to ask you to review it :)
<tumbleweed> broder: (err ubuntu-be--tools if that's what you were asking about)
<Laney> yep
<Laney> and before that, sid â right? :P
<broder> tumbleweed: wait, huh? i was referring to the backport request
<tumbleweed> Laney: ok, I got it to build with the addition of a patch called "compile-dammit"
<tumbleweed> broder: I just fixed the backportpackage local dsc bug
<tumbleweed> well, discovered I'd fixed it during debconf
<broder> tumbleweed: +1
<broder> i'll take a look
<tumbleweed> Laney: so, sure, I'll give jonas my patches (which are all upstream bugs), and remind him that he has desparate users
<Laney> excellent
<broder> tumbleweed: where's the patch?
<broder> tumbleweed: nvm, found it
<tumbleweed> broder: ok, I'll merge it and upload to Debian
<tumbleweed> Laney: aha "I found a link to your ubuntu repository on the ubuntu forum about Time Machine Backup with lion." That kind of thing gives google hints :)
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-16
<dholbach> good morning
<philipballew> dholbach, good morning
<dholbach> hi philipballew
<philipballew> :) have a great day on the irc dude!
<dholbach> thanks :)
<dholbach> philipballew, good night!
 * philipballew hopes someday to go to bed before the sun rises over the horizon
<jussi> philipballew: come live here, sun doesnt really get over the horizon in winter :D
<philipballew> jussi, where is here
<jussi> philipballew: north of finland :)
<philipballew> im told i trase back to norway.
<philipballew> here in ca it hit 100f
<philipballew> 38 Celsius then
<philipballew> jussi, is that hot for you?
<jussi> ouch, very
<jussi> Mind, its normal where Im from (australia). I just live here :D
<philipballew> the weather there. whats it like?
<jussi> in australia or finland?
<akheron> -25Â°C and 2 meters of snow in the winter is quite normal
<philipballew> i snowed 3 times here
<jussi> yup
<philipballew> 3 inches each time
<akheron> 3 meters = 9 feet, right?
<philipballew> yeah
<akheron> erm 2 meters = 6 feet
<philipballew> 1 inch = 2.54 cm
<philipballew> jussi, do you like it there>
<philipballew> ?
<jussi> strangely enough, I do - love it here :)
<philipballew> It seems like a nice area. Im thinking of leaving california sometime
<jussi> something like this can happen if you leave your car for a cpouple of days... http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_0JPSNaR7sqA/TTDPCbXftGI/AAAAAAAAH2E/ytp7_Ud4UpU/s1600/window.jpg
<philipballew> how do you get it out?
<jussi> a spade and a brush :)
<jussi> doesnt take long, but a garage is a really good thing to have here ;)
<akheron> http://i.imgur.com/qlrHy.jpg  I like this pic
<akheron> it's been like that in southern finland for two consecutive winters now
<akheron> usually we have less snow here :)
<philipballew> I met a man who has never seen snow last year
<philipballew> also owns no pants. just shorts
<Laney> welcome back dholbach!
<dholbach> hey Laney - thanks :)
<Laney> :-)
<Laney> how was your trip?
<huats> morning !
<ajmitch> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hey ajmitch
<dholbach> Laney, it was great - a week in very relaxed North of Norway and a less relaxed week with travelling around Norway, Germany and Luxembourg where we visited loads of people - it was still lots of fun though :)
<Laney> awesome
<Laney> would love to visit norway some time . o O ( like this? http://www.northsea-cycle.com/ )
<dholbach> Laney, nice
<jtaylor> tumbleweed: can I directly subscribe archive for bug 826856 or should it first go through sponsoring again?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 826856 in meld (Ubuntu) "FFe: sync meld 1.5.2-1 from debian experimental" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/826856
<geser> jtaylor: I'm not sure about this myself, perhaps tumbleweed can answer this
<tumbleweed> in my experince it should be sponsored separately
<tumbleweed> (although release-team can self-approve, so I could have sponsored it too)
<jtaylor> I subscribed sponsors
<tumbleweed> there, ubuntu-dev-tools uploaded. I thought it would be a quick 5 minute thing, but turned into an hour of pain, thanks to mox :/
<tumbleweed> I'll request a sync later
<Laney> can/can't (there was a discussion in #-release about that the other day)
<tumbleweed> Laney: oh, right, I think I misread what ScottK said in that conversation :)
<Laney> it's ok for backports but not for release
<tumbleweed> yup
<dholbach> tumbleweed, after your last commit to the sponsoring page, a bunch of other code is unnecessary, I removed it in a merge proposal
<tumbleweed> dholbach: oh, thanks
<Laney> did that api bug get worked around?
<tumbleweed> dholbach: btw, we appear to have broken teh "can-upload" detection by dropping authentication
<Laney> ah
 * tumbleweed seems to remember proposing it in the past, and someone telling me this would happen
<dholbach> ok, I'll remove my MP - can you propose something that readds the auth code with a comment why we need it? :)
<dholbach> so we don't re-remove it again :)
<tumbleweed> indeed
<Laney> we should rather fix the bug
<Laney> or find out if it is one
<tumbleweed> yeah, I'd also prefer a better workaround
<dholbach> or note the LP bug number
<dholbach> I'm sure it's filed already
 * tumbleweed couldn't find one
<dholbach> oh
<Laney> ask #lp?
<tumbleweed> #lp-dev is usually better for this kind of thing
<Laney> yeah, except i'm not there :(
 * tumbleweed does a little more digging first
<tumbleweed> Laney: so, isSourceUploadAllowed works unauthenticated, which can give us PPU rights. All we need are per-component upload rights, which we can hardcode to motu / core-dev membership
 * tumbleweed doesn't hang out there either
<Laney> does isS... only work for PPU?
<tumbleweed> yes
<Laney> :(
<tumbleweed> well, packagesets too
<tumbleweed> actually I haven't tested non-packageset PPU. Any examples you can think of?
<tumbleweed> Laney: meh, it doesn't support PPU, just packageset
<Laney> weird
<Laney> did you ask in lp-dev?
<tumbleweed> yeah: 12:48 < lifeless> thats a good question
<tumbleweed> < lifeless> why shouldn't you be authenticated though ?
<Laney> why /should/ you? :-)
<tumbleweed> that was kind of my response. The # then got distracted
<tumbleweed> basically the problem is that the permission entries aren't visible to unauthenticated users. We don't know why
<Laney> tumbleweed: where is the bug? i'd like to subscribe
<tumbleweed> Laney: didn't file one. lifeless didn't seem very interested
<Laney> :(
<lifeless> well
<lifeless> I said I'm not convinced its a bug
<lifeless> and separately that knowing who is running cron jobs is very useful when they go rogue
<lifeless> we only really support anonymous API access for folk doing experimentation in browsers etc - thats the primary anonymous use case.
<tumbleweed> lifeless: I wish that were better documented. I use anonymous API access whenever I can
<randomaction> Hello guys. Are debcheck results for Oneiric available anywhere? This page seems out of date - http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/debcheck/
<RoAkSoAx> zul: ok so I almost have the stuff for the ARM pxe booting with cobbler
<zul> sweet
<jtaylor> ups I just removed half my system in an attempt to install a i386 multiarch pacakge :(
<jtaylor> I really ought to rad those apt reports better
<Laney> the boring half anyway
<jtaylor> so all installed again, I hope it does not explode on the next reboot :)
<geser> at least we know what happened to you when you disappear for a few days
<cody-somerville> Any awk experts in here? If so, I'd love if someone could show me an example of how to get the package names and versions listed in a Packages file. :-)
<jtaylor> grep -E "^Package|^Version" package-file?
<cody-somerville> jtaylor, Looking to have the package name and version on the same line (and just the values, not the field names too).
<Rhonda> cody-somerville: grep-dctrl | tbl-dctrl
<Rhonda> with appropriate options
<Rhonda> or tbl-dctrl right ahead, depending on whether you want to filter at all
<Rhonda> tbl-dctrl -d\  -cPackage -cVersion -H < yourPackagesFile
 * Rhonda . o O ( part of dctrl-tools )
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-17
<ripps> I've found a weird packaging bug. I run a daily ppa for gmpc/libmpd, and recently libtool started naming the libmpd.so wrong.
<ripps> In previous builds it has always named the file libmpd.so.1.2.0 -> libmpd.so.1 because LIBMPD_LIBTOOL_VERSION=3:0:2. Now, the last commit in git renamed it to LIBMPD_LIBTOOL_VERSION=3:0:3 and it's now naming the library libmpd.so.0.3.0 -> libmpd.so.0.
<ripps> As you can guess this is screwing up gmpc and it's plugins. I've read over the libmpd git diffs and that is the only difference I see made to any of the autotools stuff (not much has changed in months)
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> tumbleweed, happy birthday! :)
<tumbleweed> dholbach: thanks :)
<iulian> dholbach: Morning. How did you know that it was tumbleweed's birthday?
<iulian> Happy birthday tumbleweed.
<geser> iulian: dholbach knows everything :)
<iulian> It seems so...
<iulian> No idea who he does it.
<nigelb> iulian: facebook :P
<nigelb> (probably)
<nigelb> although I'll gladly believe that dholbach is all-knowing ;)
<nigelb> tumbleweed: Happy Birthday!
<dholbach> I'm not :)
<dholbach> facebook indeed :)
<DktrKranz> facebook is just a frontend, dholbach is the guy behind it
<iulian> Do people still use that nowadays?
<nigelb> haha, good one.
<nigelb> I only use it to track birthdays :P
<Rhonda> I use my own reminder file for that.
<DktrKranz> RTM is quite good
<Rhonda> But it's easy to remember, tumbleweed is a day late for Debian's birthday.
<jtaylor> hm are the german mirrors broken? didn't get any upgrades for two days, now changed to us mirror and 175 upgrades available
<Laney> lp/mirrors I believe
<Laney> ubuntu/+archivemirrors even
<jtaylor> indeed my mirror is 2 days behind, thx
<tumbleweed> iulian, nigelb, Rhonda, everyone: thanks :)
<hakermania> Hey, how do I upload files to launchpad? i mean i've created Wallch's page etc but shouldn't I include the DEB(s) and the souurce(s) as well?
<nigelb> well, why don't you use a PPA?
<nigelb> if your use-case is to provide debs that is.
<hakermania> nigelb, I have never made a ppa, any how-to?
<nigelb> I think this should be a good start https://help.launchpad.net/Packaging/PPA
<Laney> do you mean a launchpad project?
<Laney> I think you do (rather than a PPA), and questions for that are best asked in #launchpad
<hakermania> Thanks all
<hakermania> micahg, you're subscribed to wallch, so please get it reviewed asap :( We have only 8 days left and it's a pity, because featurefreeze exception was given...
<hakermania> Hey guys, is there any problem the needs-packaging bug to be against the upstream projecT?
<jtaylor> will bug 826856 actually be processed by sponsors as it is already confimed by -release?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 826856 in meld (Ubuntu) "FFe granted: sync meld 1.5.2-1 from debian experimental" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/826856
<jtaylor> or does triaged me sponsoring done?
<Laney> now needs sponsoring
<jtaylor> xes but will it be considered by sponsors?
<jtaylor> in the past sponsored sync requests of mine where set to confirmed
<tumbleweed> yes, that may confuse people
<freeflying> hi all, whom shall I ask for the upload permission for specific package?
<jtaylor> I'll set it back to new then?
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: wouldn't hurt, also wouldn't be too worried
<Laney> anyone got an i386 machine which is running an i386 kernel and oneiric?
<Laney> if so, i'd appreciate a test rebuild of mono from oneiric
<hakermania> Whola, wallch in omgubuntu :)
<hakermania> Well guys, I never thought that Wallch could ever go into omgubuntu, I mean, common! But I am really excited :D And I want to share this excitement. Also, please please do something with wallch, or at least, let me know that sb's working on it :/
<RoAkSoAx> zu/win 4
<hakermania> RoAkSoAx, huh?
<RoAkSoAx> hakermania: typo
<hakermania> RoAkSoAx, hard to believe you :P
<kklimonda> ma ktoÅ pomysÅ na krzesÅo do biurka za 700-900zÅ?
<kklimonda> ups wrong channel.. heh
<Quintasan> kklimonda: wrong channel :)
<kklimonda> indeed
<kklimonda> I've restarted weechat after few months, and it has reordered channels..
<hakermania> What do REVUs do nowadays? Bug fixing? http://tiny.cc/ne0fi
<hakermania> nowadays= these days
<Laney> you've been advised a few times to get your package into Debian first, and that remains your best chance of getting into Ubuntu (it will involve making the Ubuntu specific features optional, which is no bad thing as it allows your software to be more widely used)
<hakermania> Laney, no way. I know it seems like I impatient but I'm not! REVU is for uploading ubuntu specific packages and going through debian is not a solution, it will get me in worse trouble while i'm going for final exams!
<hakermania> Laney, the thing is, can REVU do what it was designed for?
<paultag> hakermania: policy is almost identical
<paultag> REVU is for ubuntu changes, mostly
<paultag> new packages should be in Debian
<hakermania> paultag, *mostly*
<paultag> hakermania: if your package is in good shape for Ubuntu, there's no reason you'd get kickback from Debian
<micahg> paultag: no, REVU is for new packages, Ubuntu changes just go inthe sponsorship queue
<paultag> hakermania: small things like shipping a changelog, but that's not your duty
<paultag> micahg: wait, seriously?
<paultag> micahg: why does REVU even exist anymore, then?
<micahg> yeah, we just send most of them to Debian anyways when they are ready
<Laney> REVU reviewer time is extremely limited
<hakermania> micahg, so even if time expires and sb reviewes the package, will it be sent to debian?
<micahg> hakermania: no, you would have to submit it to Debian (you're welcome to do that now if you like or after the review), is the needs-packaging bug in the sponsorship queue (ubuntu-sponsors subscribed)?
<hakermania> micahg, I have a question about the needs-packaging bug. Does it have to be against the ubuntu distro?
<hakermania> micahg, I just subscribed ubuntu-sponsors
<hakermania> But why so?
<hakermania> Also i'd like to send it to debian after the review, so as to ensure that everything package-related will be ok
<micahg> hakermania: yes, as it needs packaging in ubuntu
<micahg> hakermania: where's the bug?
<hakermania> micahg, which bug?
<micahg> hakermania: the needs-packaging one
<Laney> if it's not against ubuntu then the upload cannot close it
<hakermania> Laney, I have it against the project, is this a problem?
<Laney> why not just open an additional task?
<hakermania> Laney, do you mean I should make the bug against ubuntu?
<hakermania> And where does it specifies that it should be this way?
<micahg> hakermania: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<hakermania> micahg, so, i make the bug against ubuntu and then I update it also to the deb package? (changelog)
<hakermania> BTW 100 motus have seen the bug and nobody told me that it should be against ubuntu -_-
 * micahg doesn't recall seeing the bug
<hakermania> micahg, you were the 101th :P
 * micahg still doesn't know where th ebug is, # please?
<hakermania> wops, w8 a moment
<hakermania> http://bit.ly/nibINh
<hakermania> micahg, the above link shows the bug as to be an 'ubuntu' one (it says bugs in ubuntu), but the same bug is being seen in the project's bugs. What's going on?
<micahg> hakermania: bugs can have multiple tasks
<hakermania> micahg, can you please tell me what should I do?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: getting it into Debian would have been way faster, you could have got in ages ago. But I did promise you a re-review, and I'll look at it right now
<hakermania> tumbleweed, are you god?
<tumbleweed> no, but I'll review it :)
<jtaylor> we fixing flightgear is fun
<jtaylor> depends on a library with a billion sshared libraries, no upstream build system for them and no debian patchsystem ._.
<jtaylor> can one handle circular dependencies in shared libraries somehow?
<tumbleweed> err you really sohuldn't have that
<jtaylor> well I do
<jtaylor> but don't blame me, blame flightgear developers ^^
<jtaylor> or the debian maintainers even :O, upstream doesn't provide shared libraries at all it seems
<tumbleweed> that's not that uncommon
<tumbleweed> (upstream not providing shared libraries, but debian making them happen)
<jtaylor> yes but it fails when the static libraries where not designed to be shared and have these ugly dependencies
<jtaylor> hm seems easier to again just disable --as-needed
<tumbleweed> try to avoid that, if possible
<jtaylor> it can probably be done in a minimal way
<jtaylor> can one use the positional property of as-needed with automake?
<jtaylor> if you put it in LDADD it complains ...
<tumbleweed> if you want some fun FTBFSs, you are welcome to complete the vtk transition. I ran out of steam :)
<tumbleweed> it complains?
<jtaylor> yes "linker flag belongs in ldflags"
<tumbleweed> oh I see what you mean
<tumbleweed> no idea
<hakermania> Somebody was talking about bugs' tasks and that I should add one to mine so as to be a valid needs-packaging bug
<jtaylor> what kind of ftbs are the vtk ones?
<jtaylor> need adapting for new api?
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: mostly nasty as-needed & no-add-needed
<tumbleweed> and the all the reverse build deps fail to build on armel because of a missing dependency
<jtaylor> hurry flightgear builds with only one change
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/vtk.html
<jtaylor> I'll have a look when I'm bored (which is often ;) )
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: you sound like you need things to do. I wish I knew more people liek that :P
<hakermania> How much time does lp to post a new ppa?
<hakermania> false positive
<sum1nil> Hi, I have a question - I am attempting to learn packaging and am following https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Recipes/PackageUpdate
<sum1nil> but when i get to debuild -S -sa the end product fails
<jtaylor> sum1nil: what is the error message?
<sum1nil> it is on pastebin: http://pastebin.com/XPc71PB5 at the end of the output
<ajmitch> looks like the changelog is still referring to 0.5.2, so it's trying to diff against the orig.tar.gz for that release
<ajmitch> though you appear to be trying to update to 0.6.1
<sum1nil> I believe the main hitch is dpkg-source: info: use the '3.0 (quilt)' format to have separate and documented changes to upstream files, see dpkg-source(1)
<sum1nil> dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source
<jtaylor> yes your working copy tree should be identical to the original tarball + the debian dir
<jtaylor> you should also use 3.0 (quilt);  mkdir -p debian/source; echo "3.0 (quilt)" > debian/source/format
<ajmitch> fix the version in debian/changelog, make sure you have a brasero_0.6.1.orig.tar.gz
<jtaylor> its a package format where all patches against the upstream source are saved in debian/patches and applied with the program quilt
<sum1nil> thanks let me follow these suggestions and get back to you. thanks
<sum1nil> hi again, the suggestions worked great thanks
<sum1nil> on to the next exercise, cya later
<hakermania> tubmleweed, I'm going to bed LOL, anyway, thanks again...
 * tumbleweed wasn't suprised by the quality of wallch :/
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-18
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hi ajmitch
<ronin___> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hi ronin___
<iulian> Morning.
<ronin___> morning iulian
<hakermania> tumbleweed, thanks for the review. About the too many system calls, could we avoid it? I think that we only call it so as to set the desktop background, call the music players and to delete things
<hakermania> Maybe the last one could be "C++azed"
<hakermania> but the others seem fine, to me :/
<jtaylor> you should be able to control everything over dbus
<hakermania> jtalor, I think im  good sending dbus messages, xD. Any other info about this? Should I send messages to the system so as to tell it what to run?
<hakermania> jtaylor, .
<tumbleweed> hakermania: I was just suprised to find a C++  program that was half-shell
<tumbleweed> hakermania: they could all handle errors a bit better (use && instead of ; or use set -e)
<tumbleweed> hakermania: btw, the sounsd aren't included in the binary package
<hakermania> tumbleweed, thanks. I was surprised to find out that the build didn't work for you. Also I thought that the watch file was looking in a specific folder of sourceforge where i've placed the source. But it seems that it looks for the file that sourceforge considers as last
<hakermania> And I don't know how to change it to the real last source (V2.0 GNOME 3)
<tumbleweed> hakermania: the problem with the watch file is that you're matching .* as a version. maybe you should use [0-9.]+
<hakermania> tumbleweed, thanks. About the sound files, why aren't they included into the binary package? I mean they are into the DEB file and when zi did a complete unistallation of the program and re-installed through the DEB the sound files where there
<tumbleweed> hakermania: they aren't in the deb I built
<tumbleweed> "debc" will show you what's in the deb that just built
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I thought you said "Package doesnât build", how did you manage to build the DEB? Also in what environment are you building? This source doesn't build in Natty but in Oneiric it does
<tumbleweed> hakermania: by overriding dh_auto_install, as I mentioned in the comment
<tumbleweed> oneiric, of course, hang on, I'll give you a build log
<tumbleweed> http://paste.ubuntu.com/669042/
<jtaylor> :( pypy does not work in oneiric anymore :( needs libffi.so.5
<jtaylor> and my machine is not powerful enough to rebuild it
<tumbleweed> hakermania: your 'make install' calls 'make clean' That could be problematic :P
 * tumbleweed pokes a pypi developer
<tumbleweed> err pypy
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I am a bit confsed with the clean step. Should it done at the end or at the begginning? In my case it is done in the beginning...
<hakermania> Also, you said I should run 'make clean' before uploading or something, while the source seems clean (no .o files, no binary etc)
<hakermania> tumbleweed: Fetched 74.8 MB in 3s (21.3 MB/s) o.O?
<tumbleweed> local mirror
<jtaylor> apt-cacher-ng ftw :)
<tumbleweed> hakermania: the source package includes some foo~ files
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I hate gedit -_-
<tumbleweed> clean is what you do when you're done and want to build everything from scratch again. you probably don't want to do it inbetween building and installing
<hakermania> tumbleweed, Ok, I'll take care of it. But now im more confused :/ you said that dist-clean should remove debian/wallch* and debian/files etc plus wallch (the exectuable), so I assume you need a total clean, leaving the source as it was initially
<hakermania> So, why not having the 'make clean'?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: no I didn't say that
<tumbleweed> err
<tumbleweed> I said you don't need to remove those manually in debian/rules, distclean will take care of the upstream parts, and debhelper will take care of the debhelper parts
<tumbleweed> you don't need your clean rule in debian/rules at all
<hakermania> Yes, but apparently (at least in my case), distclean leaves the wallch untouchable and also the debian/wallch* and debian/files files are not removed. So, somebody's not doing its job well (i assume me xD)?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: no I don't mean *you* must run distclean
<tumbleweed> I mean running debian/rules clean (without your clean rule in it) should do the trick, because debhelper will clean up after itself and will run make distclean
<hakermania> tumbleweed, yes but it doesn't
<tumbleweed> it does for me
<tumbleweed> if you remove the clean rule from debian/rules
<hakermania> tumbleweed, oh you mean that it finds that a clean rule exists and so it doesn't run its clean rules?
<tumbleweed> yes, you are stopping "dh clean" from running
<hakermania> Ok thanks :)
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: actaully, debmirror. I can live with being a bit out of sync, although some people call that herecy :P
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I found out why the source didn't build for you. You need to run 'sudo debuild -S', because during installation I call update-desktop-database which needs root
<hakermania> I do that to associate the new mime type with the desktop file
<tumbleweed> hakermania: that would be wrong
<hakermania> tumbleweed, it's the only way I think
<tumbleweed> we don't need the buildd to have an up to date desktop file database
<hakermania> tumbleweed, without this rule the DEB file doesn't associate the desktop file with the mime type
<tumbleweed> hakermania: you're missing my point
<hakermania> Yes probabl
<hakermania> y
<tumbleweed> hakermania: update-desktop-database updates the database of the machine you run it on, not the machine you install the deb on
<hakermania> tumbleweed, can't we assume that it would be the same machine? If not, how would I make it work :( ?
<tumbleweed> it's pretty safe to assume it isn't the same machine. I don't think our build daemons have desktop backgrounds that need changing
<tumbleweed> hakermania: but guess what. dh_installmime detects that you are installing a mimetype, and adds "update-mime-database /usr/share/mime" to the postinst script that gets run when your deb installs
<hakermania> tumbleweed, i think that's not enough
<hakermania> that updates the system's mime lists but does not associate it with the desktop file
<tumbleweed> hakermania: then add *that* to the postinst
<hakermania> tumbleweed, should I edit a debian/^ file to do so?
<tumbleweed> yes
<hakermania> tumbleweed, in the current status, 'uscan --report' shouldn't output anything, right?
<tumbleweed> yes. With a --verbose it should tell you you have the latest version
<hakermania> -_- http://qa.debian.org/watch/sf.php/wall-changer/ failed: 500 Can't connect to qa.debian.org:80 (Bad hostname 'qa.debian.org')
<philipballew> QUESTION: there is software in the current ubuntu repos that has updated versions but the version in the ubuntu repos is from 08. can this be fixed?
 * philipballew is willing to fix it to
<tumbleweed> hakermania: that sounds like a problem on your end :)
<hakermania> tumbleweed, you mean its my ISP's fault? Also, when do I call libglib2.0-bin through system()?
<tumbleweed> philipballew: of course it can. The question is how important is it to update these packages (we are in feature freeze) and who maintains them (why hasn't it been updated yet)
<jtaylor> philipballew: which software?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: gsettings?
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I see. What about the 1st question? My browser connects to qa.debian.org normally
<tumbleweed> maybe it was a spurious error then
<tumbleweed> (your ISPs DNS resolvers just suck)
<hakermania> ok thanks :P
<philipballew> jtaylor, kismet
<jtaylor> philipballew: the package seems orphaned in debian: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=534884
<ubottu> Debian bug 534884 in kismet "new version and core of kismet" [Normal,Open]
<philipballew> jtaylor, i see. so basically noone is packaging it anymore?
<jtaylor> last upload of that maintainer was in 2008
<jtaylor> it probably needs a new maintainer
<philipballew> i see. well it appears jtaylor that the kismet team is making their own deb's for people and their own repo for people to add for their sources list
<philipballew> if a maintainer is needed I can be that, but i am really bad at packaging. could learn, but whatever
<hakermania> tumbleweed, as for the copyright, should I just change the 'Format' field to the latest? (http://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/dep/web/deps/dep5.mdwn?revision=174)
<hakermania> Because as I see there aren't any major format changes...
<tumbleweed> hakermania: fine, I was just pointing it out
<jtaylor> philipballew: if you want to do that you should ask in #debian-mentors on irc.debian.org for advice, maybe also ask fourmond@debian.org who did two non-maintainer uploads recently if he has plans with this package or contact to the original maintainer
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I just think that the url I provided above isn't the correct one. I mean it does point out to the latest format but the page doesn't look like this: http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/dep/web/deps/dep5.mdwn?op=file&rev=152
<hakermania> it is the previous format I used. And replacing 152 with 174 returns error
<tumbleweed> hakermania: we know about that, don't worry it was the correct one
<hakermania> Ok thanks
<hakermania> tumbleweed, what's the problem in installing to /usr/share?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: please elaborate?
<hakermania> tumbleweed: "The upstream makefile probably should be installing to /usr/local not /usr/share"
<jtaylor>  /usr/share is package manager land, trespassers will be shot
<tumbleweed> that's not an issue for this package, it's an issue for people who install it from source
<hakermania> tumbleweed, so, source should install to /usr/local/ and package to /usr/share/? How can I achieve this? For somebody who builds from source it's like doing the same thing with building the deb but actually installing it immediately to his system (copying files etc immediately)
<jtaylor> your makefile should support DESTDIR, default to /usr/local and the package overwrittes it to /usr
<tumbleweed> you can achive this by making your upstream makefile use /usr/local as PREFIX. dh_auto_configure will pass PREFIX=/usr to qmake
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: this is qmake, so it uses INSTALL_ROOT rather than DESTDIR. Also, aren't you mixing up DESTDIR and PREFIX?
<hakermania> Wait, and then through the code how would I call a sound file if I don't know where it is located?
<jtaylor> don't know qmake, but in normal Makefiles DESTDIR is the same as PREFIX
<jtaylor> http://www.gnu.org/prep/standards/standards.html#DESTDIR
<tumbleweed> hakermania: you know at build time, because you can use PREFIX
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: PREFIX is where it will be installed, DESTDIR diverts the installation (e.g. into debian/tmp)
<jtaylor> oh
<jtaylor> ok then I mixed them  up
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I think i'm missing something. Let's say that somewhere in the code it says 'system("canberra-gtk-play /usr/share/wallch/a.ogg");
<hakermania> How am I supposed to change it if user builds from source?
<hakermania> (and the it will be /usr/local not usr/share
<hakermania> )
<tumbleweed> you'd play PREFIX + "/share/wallch/a.ogg"
<hakermania> Where PREFIX would be /usr or /usr/local, got it
<hakermania> Does qmake knows which prefix to use each time :/ ?
 * hakermania feels a bit noob
<tumbleweed> export DH_VERBOSE=1 and you'll notice that qmake is called with PREFIX=/usr by dh
<tumbleweed> obviously users installing at home wouldn't do that, so it would use the default (which you should make /usr/local)
<hakermania> tumbleweed, so, to make it clear, the prefix that dh uses is '/usr' no matter the default (being '/usr/local'). Also, the default should be specified during the creation of makefile (qmake PREFIX=/usr) or inside the project file? I suspect the latter
<tumbleweed> inside the project file
<hakermania> tuumbleweed, it's the first time I use the PREFIX variable. Do I call it straightly in my program as you told previously (PREFIX+"/share/etc)? Also guys on #qt doesn't seem to know anything about PREFIX :P
<tumbleweed> hakermania: read the gnu coding standrds (that jtaylor linked to). You'll also need to modify your qmake project to make it pass -DPREFIX=$PREFIX to g++
 * hakermania is something like http://bit.ly/qYeDvs
<hakermania> tumbleweed, how does the dh overrides the default PREFIX?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: 12:36 < tumbleweed> export DH_VERBOSE=1 and you'll notice that qmake is called with PREFIX=/usr by dh
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I think I've found it!!!! It should look like this inside the makefile: http://paste.ubuntu.com/669150/ doesn't it????
<Laney> who has a lucid i386 installation on bare metal and wants brownie points?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: yes, you need to make qmake generate that
<tumbleweed> Laney: only have a lucid i386 kvm vm
<Laney> nah, not tricksy enough, cheers though
<tumbleweed> Laney: actually, I do have one of those
<Laney> yeah? fancy test building mono from oneiric? :-)
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I did it!!!!
<hakermania> Whola!
<tumbleweed> should it build with nothing special?
<Laney> an oneiric chroot should be fine
<Laney> don't know about the backport
<tumbleweed> aah
<Laney> nobody can reproduce this ftbfs, but i don't think any of us have a similar enough setup to the buildds
<Laney> vms are no good, oneiric kernel is no good
<Laney> i386-on-amd64 is no good
<tumbleweed> heh
<jtaylor> squeeze kernel is no good
<ajmitch> i386 kernel with i386 oneiric vm on amd64 host is no good
<ajmitch> we've been having a fun time building
<Laney> woe is the debian mono group
 * tumbleweed is debootstrapping...
<ajmitch> it's a sad day when we're disappointed that the build works fine
<Laney> so if you can reproduce, it's bisectin' time
 * tumbleweed should probably ionice this a bit, it *is* a production fileserver, but I don't think anyone will notice
<ajmitch> production? who cares about that, packages are on the line here!
<tumbleweed> it's for an unmaintained lab with 5 year old hardware, if they can log in, that's better than average
<Laney> there won't *be* a production if we don't fix this!
<nigelb> Laney: lucid i386?
<nigelb> I do
<hakermania> Should I have the Makefile in the orig.tar.gz?
<hakermania> NO!
<Laney> nigelb: you can also try rebuilding mono from oneiric if you want :-)
<nigelb> lp-pull-source and put it into a pbuilder?
<Laney> pull-lp, yeah
<nigelb> do I need to make any changes?
<ajmitch> nope
<nigelb> trying now
<nigelb> need to find if  still have a lucid pbuilder though
<Laney> if it's pbuilder-oneiric
<ajmitch> 2.10.4-2 is what failed on a couple of buildds
<Laney> we want oneiric guest, lucid host
<nigelb> my pbuilder is probably lucid pbuilder
<nigelb> oooh
<ajmitch> update it!
<nigelb> put it throgh an oneiric pbuilder?
<ajmitch> yes
<nigelb> also, source package name
<nigelb> mono?
<ajmitch> 'mono'
 * ajmitch hopes it's not stupidly hardware dependent somehow
<nigelb> getting source
<nigelb> anyone seen persia around lately?
<ajmitch> see you in a couple of hours
<Laney> no
<tumbleweed> nigelb: not since debconf
<nigelb> hmm
<nigelb> *facepalm* ssh'd into a machine and typed up arrow for byobu. The last command was reboot.
<nigelb> s/typed/pressed/
<ajmitch> well done :)
<tumbleweed> better than halt :)
<Laney> didn't it need a password?
<nigelb> no passwd
<nigelb> or whatever that settign is in /etc/sudoers
<Laney> ssh root@...
<tumbleweed> Laney: how long until expected build failure?
<Laney> depends how fast your hardware is
<Laney> it was about 40 minutes on the buildd
<tumbleweed> dual-xen 3Ghz, 2G RAM
<tumbleweed> xeon
<Laney> builds a load of native stuff, then mcs [basic] stuff, then [net_2_0], then [net_4_0], then mdoc which is where it fails
<tumbleweed> ok, it's building, I'm going to go out for a bit
<nigelb> dammit, I have so much source code lying around that I have no more space.
<ajmitch> mono will take a fair bit
<hakermania> Ok, about the code now, you told me that I could solve the system calls through sending dbus messages. How-to?
<ajmitch> about 1.1GB used on my clean VM's ~ so far
<nigelb> Firefox source + compiled code eats my space.
<sladen> nigelb: reboot & history -r
<nigelb> sladen: heh, I just typed it out manually instead of arrows
<nigelb> later, I'll find who did the exit instead of Ctrl + D :)
<nigelb> everytime, I see the gpg key password dialog box
<nigelb> I remember UDS lighting talks and james_w :)
<hakermania> tumbleweed, OK, now that I made qmake take PREFIX, how do I use it inside my code? What is it? char?
<hakermania> Should I define it?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: you are defining it with -D
<tumbleweed> so yes, it' sa string instrted by the preprocessor, you can do "foo " PREFIX "/share/bar"
<tumbleweed> Laney: my mono has got as far as running make check
<Laney> tumbleweed: alright, that's too far then
<Laney> you can't reproduce it either, thanks for trying :(
<Laney> directhex:
<directhex> sigh
<Laney> shall we ask that guy for a shell yet?
<hakermania> tumbleweed, what about the 'uninstall' scipt? Should it check if wallch is installed in /usr/share or /usr/local/ or automatically trying to remove from /usr/local/ ?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: it'll only be run by people who installed from source, so it sholud only remove from /usr/local
<hakermania> GOT IT
<hakermania> tumbleweed, as for the pictures, the monitor comes from a site with NO WARRANTY and we've send some emails to request for the other images (i assume we should have done so before using them :P)
<hakermania> tumbleweed, also: error: âPREFIXâ was not declared in this scope
<tumbleweed> hakermania: then you aren't declaring it with -DPREFIX=whatever
<tumbleweed> hakermania: "NO WARRANTY" does not equate to claming copyright for it and distributing to others under the GPL
<hakermania> tumbleweed, http://www.clker.com/disclaimer.html
<tumbleweed> hakermania: that does say that everyone uploading to the site certifies their artwork is in the public domain. You should probably state where you got it from in your licence information
<hakermania> No I don't think so
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I made PREFIX to work but it seems like a straight /usr/local inside the program... For example "a" + PREFIX + "b" returns: usr/local was not declared in this scope
<tumbleweed> hakermania: you don't think so?? you probably want to define it with quotes around the value.
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I already have (DEFINES +="PREFIX=\"/usr/local\"") and I get the same errors. And yes, I think that the site is quite clear that anybody can do anything with its pictures unless it has to do with porn or breaking a law
<tumbleweed> hakermania: and the way you avoid archive-admins / ftp-masters asking the same questions I did is by including the necessary informationn in debian/copyright.
<hakermania> Ok, so should I make debian copyright say Files: Pictures/monitor.png and then License? What?
<tumbleweed> DEP5 explains how you should handle public domain
<AnAnt> dholbach: Hello, thanks for the ACK.
<AnAnt> dholbach: you've been away for a while ?
<dholbach> AnAnt, yes, I was on holidays for 2 weeks :)
<AnAnt> dholbach: note, I will just fix the title of #819692, it is -11 to be sync'ed not -10
<dholbach> sounds good
<AnAnt> dholbach: do I really have to comment on 812120 ?
<AnAnt> dholbach: I mean , the changelog speaks for itself
<Laney> Why should we break the freeze for this version â i.e. does it fix any bugs that are present in Ubuntu currently?
<AnAnt> Laney: not that I know of
<dholbach> I talked to Colin about it and it was his suggestion - I can see why somebody would be a bit hesitant to update a package which virtually every other package build depends on :/
<AnAnt> yes
<AnAnt> well, I filed it before freeze actually, but since we are after freeze, the changes in changelog might be scary
<tumbleweed> cyphermox: I just got one of your usb-modeswitch segfaults
<cyphermox> tumbleweed: yeah
<tumbleweed> the bug's still marked as incomplete, need anything tested?
<cyphermox> tumbleweed: does the workaround at the end work for you? and can you reproduce and see where it crashed if you were to run this in ltrace or something?
<cyphermox> I'd really like to understand why it's crashing, which is what I don't have now, just a change in how the file handles are redirected, and I don't understand why it makes it work
<tumbleweed> cyphermox: the workaround seems crazy to me, esp as that code path isn't involved
<tumbleweed> cyphermox: it doesn't segfault under strace (loops through something big, forever), but it does under ltrace
<cyphermox> ah?
<cyphermox> as run manually or though the udev script?
<tumbleweed> run manually
<tumbleweed> damn, it just worked
<cyphermox> see, the problem is no matter how much I try it always works for me, except the first time I tried to reproduce it; at which point I obviously had nothing ready to catch where the bug was ;)
<cyphermox> if your system is looping through things for a long while, your 3g dongle likely needs scsi attributes; which is a little less well tested.
<cyphermox> but if you can give me some piece of info more than just the segfault message from syslog (I can't parse that, unfortunately), then it's going to be a win already :)
<tumbleweed> yeah, let me spenda little more time on it (and grab some debug symbols)
<cyphermox> even just a the usb_modeswitch.log from /var/log if you enable logging in /etc/usb_modeswitch.conf first, is good
<tumbleweed> can't trigger it if I enable logging :/
<cyphermox> tumbleweed: maybe that's why I can't reproduce it either
<cyphermox> do you have the ltrace output where it failed?
<tumbleweed> commented on the bug, but it's only ltrace, no output from usb_modeswitch_disptatcher
<tumbleweed> yeah if I try to catch stdout and stderr, it doesn't segfault
<cyphermox> so it's got to be something about file handles
<tumbleweed> cyphermox: got it in gdb, see bug
<cyphermox> amazing, you rock
<tumbleweed> righ,t now I can go to pub quiz and leav you to fix it :)
<cyphermox> yup
<cyphermox> found two issues with the data you gave there
<cyphermox> thanks!
<tumbleweed> np
<lfaraone> micahg: myself, I'd prefer to just  have the new upstream version packaged and SRUed, but I think that's about a snowball's chance in hell of happening.
<micahg> lfaraone: I think SRUing version 2 would be better, even though it has new features as the current version is totally broke, but IANA release team member
<micahg> lfaraone: no, if the current version worked it would be a problem, but it doesn't :)
<lfaraone> micahg: hm. I'll repeat my offer, want to maintain another package in Debian? :)
<micahg> lfaraone: I'm still working on the first :), I have no inherent interest in blogtk, there seems to be interest in UBuntu for it though as the original bug for deprecating python-gtkhtml keeps getting a ping on blogtk
<micahg> lfaraone: but if the package isn't too bad, maybe I can get the ball rolling on it
<lfaraone> micahg: I've seen more lintian warnings. https://launchpad.net/~jayreding/+archive/ppa/+files/blogtk_2.0%7Eppa6%7Elucid.dsc
<hakermania> tumbleweed, DEP5 says that "If a work has no copyright holder (i.e., it is in the public
<hakermania>      domain), that information should be recorded here."
<hakermania> And it refers to the Copyright, field
<hakermania> But how?
<hakermania> Should we include the site's name?
<hakermania> Along with our names?
<hakermania> Also what about the straight PREFIX?
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-19
<lfaraone> persia: ping
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Morning dholbach.
<dholbach> hey iulian
<Rhonda> duh
<Laney> bdrung: can the native sync branch be merged now?
<Laney> bdrung: also, please vote on the dmb applicants
<bdrung> Laney: i came back from vacation yesterday. i will have a look at both.
<Laney> ah ok, thought you were back for some days now since you've been commenting before
<bdrung> Laney: since monday i had internet access
<Laney> i see
<Laney> hope you had a nice time!
<bdrung> Laney: yes (but it was too short) :)
<hakermania> tumbleweed, wow! What is this MemoServ thing? Thanks for the link!!! How can you leave a message to someone who's logged off?
<StevenK> hakermania: Send it a privmsg of 'help'
<hakermania> StevenK, I see. Thanks
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I have a hard time explaining to ##c++ and #qt folks what's going on with PREFIX. Do you know any direct way to use it inside my program? cout << "PREFIX" outputs 'PREFIX' but cout << PREFIX gives: /usr/local: was not declared in this scope
<jtaylor> you could use a higher level buildsystem like autotools, cmake or scons, it does all for you
<hakermania> jtaylor, I don't know if you know what i'm talking about
<hakermania> :)
<jtaylor> I did not read your message properly :/
<jtaylor> the PREFIX macro should be a const string
<hakermania> jtaylor, compiler or something provides my code with the variable PREFIX. PREFIX will be /usr/local if the program is installed by source and /usr if installed by DEB.
<jtaylor> it seems it is unquoted
<hakermania> jtaylor, Yes, exactly!
<hakermania> But I have declared it as: DEFINES +="PREFIX=\"/usr/local\""
<hakermania> (quoted)
<hakermania> So I don't know what to do or what to say (LOL)
<jtaylor> in a makefile?
<hakermania> jtalor, in the project file I have the Definition
<hakermania> jtaylor, in the Makefile, after the definition, it looks like: DEFINES = -DPREFIX="/usr/local" -DQT_NO_DEBUG etc
<jtaylor> how is DEFINES used?
<hakermania> jtaylor, to define something :P I asked yesterday tumbleweed about the Makefile's condition (DEFINES = -DPREFIX="/usr/local"), i mean if it is what I should achieve, and he said that yes, it's ok
<hakermania> And yes, it seems that it is because inside my code I see that PREFIX contains /usr/local, despite the fact that I cannot use it
<jtaylor> you can indirect it thorough another macro to quote it, but thats more a workaround
<jtaylor> there must be a proper way to do it, but I don't know qmake
<jtaylor> maybe drop the quotes around the PREFIX
<hakermania> jtaylor, you mean DEFINES +=PREFIX=\"/usr/local\"  ?
<jtaylor> maybe
<hakermania> failure
<hakermania> I bet that tumbleweed knows but enjoys seeing me try :P
<jtaylor> in cmake its just -DMACRO="value"
<hakermania> jtaylor, and then it's just a const string?
<jtaylor> y
<geser> you might perhaps need -DPREFIX="\"/usr/local\"" if the inner quotes should stay
<hakermania> geser, I used DEFINES +="PREFIX=\"\"/usr/local\"\"" and the Makefile *successfully* gave -DPREFIX=""/usr/local"" but again the same error :(
<jtaylor> maybe DEFINES +="PREFIX=\"\\\"/usr/local\\\"\""
<hakermania> jtaylor, GODLIKE
<hakermania> how did you know?
<jtaylor> you need to escape quotes for gcc
<jtaylor> quite weird qmake does not handle if for you like cmake
<hakermania> jtaylor, tumbleweed does not seem to be around. In my project file I've tell the program to move the files manually to /usr/share, should I tell it to move them to $PREFIX/share?
<jtaylor> yes
<ahasenack> ng
<Ng> that is me
<nigelb> heh
<tumbleweed> hakermania: no, I don't know the details of how to actually achive most of this (but I could work it out if I needed to, I assume). I have no qmake experience.
<tumbleweed> and yes, you learn more when you have to work things out yourself :)
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I know that you learn more when you figure out things yourself. Something last about the PREFIX, I use it so as to actually move the files to /usr/(local/)share, so i assume that I should use the PREFIX so as to move the files to the correct directory.
<hakermania> I do this in my wallch.pro file while I could do this in the debian/install file. But I don't know how to use PREFIX there. PREFIX could be a variable inside the project file but this variable will be changed by dh!
<hakermania> will *not* be changed by dh
<hakermania> so it will always be /usr/local
<hakermania> Oh, found it I think!
<hakermania> tumbleweed, is this the correct way to do it: PREFIX = /usr/local
<hakermania> DEFINES += "PREFIX=\\\"$$PREFIX\\\""
<hakermania> err and sorry: http://paste.ubuntu.com/670065/
<hakermania> I mean by doing so inside the project file will dh be able to change it back to /usr/share?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: that sounds about right
<hakermania> tumbleweed, about=right?
<hakermania> about=semi?
<hakermania> about=not?
<Laney> try it?
<hakermania> Laney, :)
<hakermania> i will try it when i'm back cause i have a lesson ._.
<hakermania> B
<cjwatson> lfaraone: any chance of uploading http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=633904 ?  it would be good to just sync it from unstable rather than needing to do an Ubuntu-specific upload
<ubottu> Debian bug 633904 in imageshack-uploader "Please patch imageshack-uploader to build correctly with libav 0.7 (experimental)" [Wishlist,Open]
<cjwatson> ow, working on libav transitions is hard work
<Laney> are there large api changes?
<cjwatson> lots of small ones
<lfaraone> cjwatson: sure.
<lfaraone> wow, I must have a very expansive definition of "two days"
<tumbleweed> you wouldn't be the first person to do that :)
<Laney> you never said they were earth days ;-)
<manu-tm> Hello, I just uploaded package News-RSS-Ticker on revu and am waiting for someone up to review it: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/news. Thanks! ;)
<debfx> what's the best way to check if a package is installed in a shell script?
<jtaylor> dpkg -l package | grep -E "^ii.*package" maybe
<Laney> dpkg-query
<debfx> currently I have: dpkg-query -W -f='${Status}' $PKG | grep -q '^install'
<hakermania> tumbleweed, jtaylor, any possible reasons for this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/670346/ ? Also why does it sends them to /usr/local/share while I've run 'debuild' and there were supposed to go to /usr/share?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: those errors are because they are going to /usr/local. As to why, I'd need the source package
<hakermania> tumbleweed, would you like to send it to you?
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I am quite sure that this is happening because inside the project file, PREFIX is a set variable which apparently dh cannot change.
<tumbleweed> hakermania: there must be a way to do a variable with can be provided on the command ine
<hakermania> tumbleweed, can you tell me exactly what is my need so as to have the necessary information so as to search it on the web?
<hakermania> i.e. you need a variable editable by dh, or you need X or Y
<hakermania> Because, to be honest, I don't know what I'm trying to achive... A PREFIX variable accessible by the code [OK] editable by dh [(EPIC) FAIL]
<tumbleweed> hakermania: I don't know what you are asking, but I read a little qmake documentation and discovered isEmpty. try this: isEmpty(PREFIX) { PREFIX = /usr/local }
<jtaylor> isn't prefix built into qmake?
<jtaylor> I never used it, but it seems like a pretty standard thing that should just work out of the box on anything above plain makefiles
<tumbleweed> that's what I was expecting, but I can't see anything. Ask some qt people :)
<hakermania> jtaylor, tumbleweed, can you make me understand the nature of the problem? What's the problem here? As far as I have understood the problem is that dh cannot edit PREFIX variable so as to change it to /usr instead of the default /usr/local
<jtaylor> your file should allow PREFIX to be overriden by commandline
<jtaylor> search for other qmake projects and see how they do it
<hakermania> jtaylor, i'll have a look at clementine
<hakermania> unlucky, it uses cmake
<hakermania> jtaylor, how would I describe what I want to do? i want qmake set a commandline PREFIX as cmake does so annoyingly easily?
<hakermania> Good Night
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-20
<joru> howdy, I was planning on getting to know packaging so i thought i'd join the photo team. is anyone here part of that?
<jbicha> joru: I don't think that team is active, but you don't have to be on that team to help with photo app packaging
<joru> jbicha: ok, well i thought it would be a good place to find ppl with same interests
<joru> jbicha: and to start learning how to do it
<joru> also saw that the mentorship mailinglist seemed quite dead
<jbicha> well I recommend you look for a bitesize bug on harvest first and figure out how to fix it
<joru> jbicha: yepp so I've understand too from all the how-to's etc i've read
<tumbleweed> joru: you'll find people with the same interests over time, but the skills required are common across all packages, so it doesn't matter too much what you start with (although it helps motivation if fix something that bugs you)
<joru> tumbleweed: yes that is true. so say that i'd look into this one https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/772573  then i'd downlaod the unity source? what does is a11y stand for?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 772573 in unity (Ubuntu) "[a11y] Unity launcher buttons are not Actionable" [Medium,Triaged]
<tumbleweed> !a11y
<ubottu> Information about the Ubuntu Accessibility Team can be found on the wiki at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Accessibility or by joining #ubuntu-accessibility
<tumbleweed> joru: ^ accessibility
<joru> ah excellent
<joru> one step in some learning direction =)
<tumbleweed> ok, maybe I should say *some* of the skills are common everywhere. I don't do much GUI stuff and have never improved the accessibility of anything :)
<joru> tumbleweed: the general process and tools are similar
<joru> i get the point
<joru> =)
<joru> well i havent looked into accessibilty msyelf either before
<joru> but i might see what i can learn from this bitesize
<joru> the goal is just as much the learning process itself as it is the fix
<hakermania> tumbleweed, ok I have fixed all the issues except the system() ones, where I need more specification. I mean, i do error checking by checking the return code, also I'd like to ask you what could be done in C++ that I do via system().
<tumbleweed> hakermania: everything, but I'm not requiring you to do that, just noting that you probably should
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I think the code is OK! It works, if it could be better I don't know, probably yes, as in every code around, but I think the quality is OK
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I got this: http://lintian.debian.org/tags/maintainer-script-lacks-debhelper-token.html but if I add it to the top of the postinst script and below from it the update-desktop-database I get error: http://paste.ubuntu.com/671346/
<tumbleweed> hakermania: sounds like it didn't have a shebang (and that question didn't need to be directed to me)
<hakermania> tumbleweed, you suggested me using the postinst scirpt :O
<jtaylor> you don't need update-desktop-database in postscripts
 * tumbleweed told him that
<jtaylor> debehlper does that for you
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-21
<hakermania> jtaylor, no it doesn't
<hakermania> jtaylor, i've tested many times, what it does is updater-mime-database
<hakermania> But anyway, I made it work
<jtaylor> hakermania: that is enough, update-desktop-database is called by a trigger from desktop-file-utils
<jtaylor> http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/d/desktop-file-utils/current/changelog
<jtaylor> 0.15-2
<hakermania> jtaylor, I don't know why but it doesn't seem to recognize i am installing a mime type in my case and so it doesn't call it? Anyway the .wallch files have their icon but don't run with wallch, means that aren't associated with the desktop file, means that update-desktop-database was not called
<hakermania> anyway, it's 3.20 in the morning here, lol, good night
<micahg> is   ret = (Description *) bsearch (&d, descriptions, n_elems, sizeof (Description), compare_methods); considered an implicit conversion?
<broder> that seems fairly explicit
<micahg> that's what I thought :)
<broder> uh, though i bet &d is an implicit conversion to void *
<broder> err, const void *
<broder> and same for descriptions
<micahg> nah, found it: connection.c:542:9: warning: cast to pointer from integer of different size [-Wint-to-pointer-cast]
<micahg> Function `bsearch' implicitly converted to pointer at connection.c:542
<broder> huh
<micahg> umm, that's not it :(
<broder> you're getting both of those?
<micahg> the function returns a void
<broder> right, i have the manpage up
<micahg> yeah, both are in th echangelog : https://launchpadlibrarian.net/77704072/buildlog_ubuntu-oneiric-amd64.gnome-system-tools_2.32.0-0ubuntu7_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<broder> i think it's trying to convert the bsearch symbol to a pointer, which makes me suspect that the parsing went off somewhere earlier
<micahg> the functions isn't that big, and AFAICT all looks normal...
 * micahg totally doesn't understand this implicit conversion thing
<Bachstelze> connection.c:542:3: warning: nested extern declaration of 'bsearch' [-Wnested-externs]
<Bachstelze> definitely a typo somewhere
<Bachstelze> or actually..
<Bachstelze> bsearch is in stdlib.h, the file doesn't include it
 * micahg wonders if it's that simple
<micahg> Bachstelze: that seemed to solve it locally, although, it's still complaining about one of the arguments to bsearch, but I"ll look that up later, thanks
<jtaylor> tumbleweed: should I create ubuntu deltas for the as-needed bugs which weren't fixed in debian yet now?
<jtaylor> as we are getting closer to the next freeze
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: go for it
<jtaylor> urg the awn packages are awful ...
<jtaylor> include python code but don't use helpers
<cjwatson> micahg: yes, missing #include would mean that the implicit prototype mechanism (which is basically for ancient pre-C89 code) makes up 'int bsearch(void);' for you
<cjwatson> generally not what you want ...
<cjwatson> there's a fair bit of old code that sort of gets away with it as long as the function doesn't take varargs and as long as it either returns int or has its return value ignored
<joru> Howdy, i'm trying out some bitesize bugs. My question is where an applications category is defined so that it is properly displayed in correct category in UBC?
<joru> is it the .desktop file?
<tumbleweed> UBC?
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I lost the link about the public server and the copyright, may I have it again please?
<joru> tumbleweed: oh a typo, ubuntu software center
<joru> tumbleweed: i've found an <app>.desktop file in the app i'm looking at that holds the "Categories" metadata
<tumbleweed> hakermania: sorry, don't know what link you are looking for. If the source for your media said it was public domain, just say that in debian/copyright
<tumbleweed> joru: correct, I'm pretty sure that's where the categories for USC come from
<joru> tumbleweed: yes i am sure now, i've got it confirmed
<joru> tumbleweed: nice to learning-by-doing
<hakermania> Should I have the Files: * and then Files: Pictures/foo.jpg inside debian/copyright or vice versa?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: "Multiple Files paragraphs are allowed. The last paragraph that matches a particular file applies to it."
<hakermania> tumbleweed, if I provide the source will dropbox compile it for me for both 32 and 64 bit? Will it produce both 64 and 32 bit debs?
<hakermania> dropbox=launchpad soory
<hakermania> Using ppa I mean
<tumbleweed> hakermania: https://help.launchpad.net/Packaging/PPA
<hakermania> tumbleweed, thanks
<hakermania> tumbleweed, i made it work with the --parallel and I can see that dh@ runs with this options while debuilding, but what's the difference, really?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: debhelper's manpage will explain the details. Your build system supports building mutiple files in parallel, which can make the build a lot faster on a multi-core machine
<sum1nil> hello all, I am trying to set up a chroot environment described on te page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapChroot
<sum1nil> but at dpkg-reconfigure passwd I get locale errors - perl
<tumbleweed> sum1nil: those aren't errors, you can ignore them. It just means that you are trying to use a locale you haven't got installed. Install a langpack in the chroot
<sum1nil> ok will try thanks
<sum1nil> thank you tumbleweed that worked fine
<hakermania> Does lp builds only with the latest ones? I mean can't it build my source for GNOME 2 (that compiles OK in natty). I get the same error messages I got when I tried to compile the GNOME 2 source in GNOME 3. Is there any options somewhere I can specify to it?
<tumbleweed> hakermania: your build was on oneiric, so the current versions of everything in oneiric. You can restrict versions in Build-Depends, but if what you request isn't available in the target release it'll fail to build
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I see, there's no problem in adding ~GNOME3ppa eh?
<hakermania> so as to show which version it is
<tumbleweed> hakermania: if you are testing something you eventually want to build in normal ubuntu archives, youc an't be depending on another ppa
<hakermania> tumbleweed, OK, so, all of my ppas will have the ~ppaX tag
<tumbleweed> hakermania: it's just to allow you to upload multiple versions (and to ensure the official version has a higher number)
<micahg> cjwatson: thanks
<Phoenix87> hallo
<Phoenix87> how can i submit a new application for ubuntu for approval?
<micahg> Phoenix87: application for what?
<Phoenix87> a gnome front-end for gnuplot
<Phoenix87> it's in launchpad at the moment
<micahg> Phoenix87: it's a little late this cycle, if you get it into Debian now, it'll get into Ubuntu for P
<micahg> then you can backport it to oneiric
<Phoenix87> well i don't mind missing a cycle, i was just wondering about the possibility of having my app figuring in the main repositories ^^
<micahg> Phoenix87: if you get it into Debian it will automatically come in at the beginning of next cycle
<Phoenix87> how can i get it into Debian?
<micahg> Phoenix87: http://expo.debian.net/
<Phoenix87> micahg, thank you!
<micahg> Phoenix87: you're welcome, thank you for your interest in Ubuntu
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: I don't see a MOTU application yet :)
<jtaylor> yes I'll start it now
 * ajmitch looks for a wiki page to put a +1 on
<jtaylor> not yet done
<jtaylor> wiki hangs on login :(
<Timk> 11.04 UI Much different.  Everyone is a fan?
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-13
<ESphynx> Sundays *are* quiet in here =)
<LordOfTime> quietish everywhere :P
<ESphynx> Well I think I solved our GCC 4.7 issues =)
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Morning dholbach.
<dholbach> hi iulian
<raju> coolbhavi,  yeah now its cool
<coolbhavi> :)
<raju> coolbhavi,  how are you feeling ??
<coolbhavi> raju, pm please
<raju> coolbhavi,
<raju> cool
<ral> Hi
<ral> I'm trying to maintain a library symbols file.
<ral> But dpkg-gensymbols keeps adding the version from debian/changelog rather than allowing the upstream version, which I thought was the intent.
<xnox> ral: C++ or C?
<ral> C
<xnox> ral: dpkg-gensymbols generates with "current" debian/changelog version because it doesn't know upstream symbol vs symbol introduced in a debian patch
<ral> So "foo@VERS_1.0 1.0" changes to "foo@VERS_1.0 1.0-0~ppa1"
<Laney> that's quite normal, you need to manually apply the diff that gensymbols gives you and edit the symbols file to remove the debian part of the version
<ral> Laney: Ah, I've missed out a step.
<ral> I did that, but the actual problem is that I get lintian errors when the package is built.
<ral> Saying that the symbols have changed, you have 1.0, but should have 1.0-0~ppa1.
<xnox> you might not have added the symbols file correctly to the packaging
<xnox> or there are extra symbols on different architecture
<xnox> e.g. amd64 and x86 can have different symbols
<dupondje> anyone with experience with reprepro?
<ral> xnox: Possible, but I doubt it. I'm updating packaging that used to work rather than starting from scratch (although the SO version has bumped so they are new package names)
<xnox> and you renamed the pkg.symbols -> pkg-1.1.symbols?
<ral> And this is all just on my local machine so I've not even got to possible architecture errors yet :)
<xnox> and other similar files? =)))
<ral> pkg0.symbols -> pkg1.symbols
<ral> I think so, but it's worth checking.
<dobey> hey all. any chance to get a little traction on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1035392 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1035392 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] u1db" [Wishlist,In progress]
<ral> xnox: I can't find any trace of the old names.
<ESphynx2> hey guys :) so I solved our issues building Ecere with GCC 4.7 on Quantal =)
<ral> xnox / Laney: Seems to be a bug with dpkg-gensymbols - if change the changelog version number from 1.0-0~ppa1 to 1.0-0ubuntu1 it works. I suspect the ~ is causing problems.
<xnox> ral: no bug, expected behaviour.
<xnox> =)
<xnox> if the symbol is marked as present in 1.0
<micahg> dobey: if there's some urgency for u1db, you could ask a couple of desktopper core-dev/MOTUs to review for you
<xnox> ral: than 1.0-0~ppa1 is smaller and hence not "big" enough to include the 1.0 symbols.
<xnox> so it warns you that you "backported" symbols into the past =)
<xnox> ral: I suspect that 1.0-1~ppa1 might be "big" enough to have 1.0 symbols
<ral> xnox: Right
<ral> Counter intuitive, but dpkg agrees with you.
<ral> I didn't realise that ~ was that powerful.
<ESphynx2> jtaylor: around by any chance? ;)
<xnox> ral: well -0~
<xnox> ral: so you are saying that it's smaller than -0 debian release of upstream, hence it's "bigger" than 0.0~bla-0 but still smaller than 0.0
<ral> I would still expect 1.0(anything here) to be > 1.0
<ral> But that's beside the point.
<ral> It works with a "proper" version number for debian/ubuntu, and ppas don't care about lintian.
<ESphynx2> Anyone willing to review our cross-plaform SDK for wishful inclusion into Quantal? =)
<ral> Thanks for your help.
<tumbleweed> ral: dpkg --compare-versions '1.0-0~' lt '1.0' && echo yes
<tumbleweed> it's not beside the point at all :)
<xnox> ral: see debian policy with respect of meaning of ~ and +
<xnox> ral: we are bending the rules of mathematics by using limits and negative/positive zeros
<ral> tumbleweed: It's beside the point that I expected 1.0(anything) to be > 1.0. I'm not disagreeing that I'm wrong! :)
<xnox> ral: yet you do want to package alpha, beta, rc, snapshots, before 1.0 is actually tagged and released! =)
<ESphynx2> So guys, how would I go about finding a reviewer?
<xnox> ESphynx2: subscribe sponsors to the merge proposal or but report
<ESphynx2> sponsors being? a group id thing, or actual people?
<xnox> ESphynx2: ~ubuntu-sponsors
<ESphynx2> Ohh! awesome Mantis support on Launchpad!
<ESphynx2> xnox: Thanks... that's done :)
<ESphynx2> xnox: is there any faint hope of finding a sponsor before the feature freeze? ;)
<xnox> ESphynx2: depends what for. What's the package / bug?
<ESphynx2> xnox: Ecere is a cross platform SDK...  Light yet powerful/flexible, cross platform GUI toolkit, compiling tools for the eC language, network/system library, it's a full fledged media library comparable to SDL or SDFL, and an IDE for C/C++/eC ...
<ESphynx2> SFML*
<xnox> ESphynx2: i wanted URL, not package description =)
<ESphynx2> xnox: ahh...https://bugs.launchpad.net/ecere/+bug/394998
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 394998 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] ecere-sdk -- cross-platform developer toolkit" [Wishlist,In progress]
<ESphynx2> Reported by Ryan Prior on 2009-07-02 :|
<ESphynx2> I was hoping 2012.10 was the time :P with the end of the mayan calendar and all ;)
<xnox> Did you mean to add a URL to the .dsc and or attach a packaging branch to the bug report?
<xnox> cause without either of those, there is nothing to sponsor. So sponsors team will be unsubscribed with a comment
<ESphynx2> xnox: Hmm... well we've got a PPA...
<xnox> "this bug report has nothing to sponsor"
<ESphynx2> ugg
<xnox> it's just a packaging request
<ESphynx2> xnox: how am I meant to do this?
<xnox> ESphynx2: create a debian source package suitable for inclusion into debian/ubuntu
<ESphynx2> xnox: The PPA is @ https://code.launchpad.net/~jerstlouis/+recipe/ecere-daily-precise ... I just need to merge dev into master and rebuild
<xnox> and upload it into a ppa, or just any plain http:// ftp:// hosting
<xnox> ESphynx2: ergh.... a daily build is not good enough.
<ESphynx2> It is in a PPA... our PPA has been running since 2009...
<xnox> you need to use correct version string for the distribution and a released tarball.
<ESphynx2> xnox: ok... so it should be a specific version?
<ESphynx2> Should the version string have a particular format?
<xnox> ESphynx2: http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/
<ESphynx2> xnox: The daily builds already have all the .dsc and everything...
<ESphynx2> xnox: Can I build it using Launchpad packaging recipes?
<ESphynx2> Is it that the changelog should say something specific about Quantal? Or it's just the deb-version thing that must be set properly?
<dobey> ESphynx2: ideally, you'd attach the .dsc and stuff for a released version, to the bug report. not use recipes or daily builds
<dobey> ESphynx2: more like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1035392 for example
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1035392 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] u1db" [Wishlist,In progress]
<ESphynx2> dobey: But Launchpad recipes produce .dsc ...
<ESphynx2> Which I could then attach, right?
<dobey> launchpad recipes produce a changelog which says "automated build" which is not acceptable
<dobey> you need a proper changelog entry
<ESphynx2> isn't that the changelog in debian/ ?
<ESphynx2> Could someone with a bit more Ubuntu packaging familiarity be willing to assist me with this?
<dobey> yes
<dobey> (yse i mean the debian/changelog file)
<ESphynx2> I wrote a changelog entry in debian, under our ppa/precise branch
<ESphynx2> I thought that's what get used by the automated build
<ESphynx2> https://github.com/ecere/sdk/blob/ppa/precise/debian/changelog
<dobey> ESphynx2: lp recipes adds a new entry with the proper changes to the version and series info, for uploading to the ppa. and this new changelog entry simply says "* Automated build."
<ESphynx2> ok...
<dobey> or "* Auto build." rather
<ESphynx2> so I need to manually run debuild (is it?)
<dobey> yes
<ESphynx2> And what should changelog say, version wise , to be proper?
<ESphynx2> "correct version string for the distribution " ?
<ESphynx2> and what's this urgency about ? does it have to saw low?
<dobey> probably just "* Initial packaing of $package for Ubuntu." or something, if it's not already packaged in debian
<dobey> you should probably just always leave urgency=low there
<ESphynx2> ok... and at the top the version string
<ESphynx2> that'd be ok what I currently have ?
<dobey> no. it would need to be 0.44.01-0ubuntu1 for example
<dobey> unless you're building it as a native package, which isn't really advisable
<ESphynx2> $package -- did you mean that as is? or should I replace that?
<ESphynx2> what's a native package?
<ESphynx2> So... 0.44.01-0ubuntu1 quantal; urgency=low   ?
<ESphynx2> * Initial packing of Ecere SDK for Ubuntu.  (LP: #394998) -- should the bug ID be there?
<dobey> yes the bug id should be there
<ESphynx2> and I should replace $package by say, Ecere SDK ?
<dobey> a native package is where the releases are only done into the package, and you just have the version number without any build numbers
<dobey> and given the description of what ecere is, that doesn't seem to be anywhere near appropriate for you
<dobey> it also makes it a pain for people to contribute to the packaging
<dobey> yes, $package was a pseudocode-variable
<ESphynx2> ok... well i have the packaging on ppa/precise branch in github...
<ESphynx2> dobey: https://github.com/ecere/sdk/blob/ppa/precise/debian/changelog -- looking good?
<xnox> ESphynx2: i posted a quick review of the PPA source package
<xnox> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ecere/+bug/394998/comments/2
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 394998 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] ecere-sdk -- cross-platform developer toolkit" [Wishlist,In progress]
<xnox> there are at least 7 serious bugs with the source package
<ESphynx2> xnox: What did you try to build?
<xnox> ecere_201208122348-0~580~precise1.dsc
<ESphynx2> I just pushed the fix for it to build with GCC 4.7
<xnox> ESphynx2: it didn't even start clean the package
<ESphynx2> xnox: sorry, I was saying have to wait till the build bot builds it
<ESphynx2> xnox: that's the one that isn't building
<xnox> so way before gcc4.7 is ever envoked
<ESphynx2> hmm ?
<xnox> dh build
<xnox> dh: No packages to build.
<xnox> dpkg-buildpackage: error: dpkg-genchanges gave error exit status 2
<ESphynx2> xnox: How would the PPA bots build it then?
<xnox> they didn't
<xnox> build it on amd64 at all....
<ESphynx2> xnox: It only builds as 32 bit
<xnox> why?
<ESphynx2> you can run it as 32 bit on 64 bit machine
<ESphynx2> because we don't have 64 bit support yet
<xnox> so
<xnox> you should.
<ESphynx2> I should...?
<xnox> and even if you don't have 64 bit support, packages should not be all marked as i386, some of them should be marked as `all`
<xnox> ESphynx2: "the package should be patched/ported to support 64 bit"
<xnox> currently in Ubuntu we widely support 5 architectures: amel, armhf, i386, amd64 and powerpc
<ESphynx2> xnox: there is major work involved into supporting 64 bit
<xnox> in Debian we have 12 architectures
<ESphynx2> it is planned.
<xnox> armel and armhf are 32 bit
<ESphynx2> but right now it doesn't...
<xnox> yet you excluded them
<ESphynx2> well I've never tested on those yet :)
<ESphynx2> xnox: The library DOES link against system wide libpng, zlib, etc.; the sources of other libraries are included for the convenience for building on Windows.
<ESphynx2> well I updated the debian/copyright, 'cuz it was quite off...
<ESphynx2> https://github.com/ecere/sdk/commit/534ea0c1bcbec7b1ea7dbff32b575a34d7fc6c92 -- would that be ok xnox ?
<ESphynx2> sorry, https://raw.github.com/ecere/sdk/ppa/precise/debian/copyright
<ESphynx2> thanks for the review xnox  :)
<xnox> ESphynx2: debian archive auto-rejects source packages if it detects included copy of zlib
<ESphynx2> So what are the odds of the package being accepted before we have native 64 bit support?
<xnox> it still should build for: any !amd64 !powerpc64
<xnox> for example to include other 32 bit platforms
<xnox> the included libaries must be stripped from the tarball
<ESphynx2> how could I work around this? I want zlib to be included when downloading the tarball so it builds on Windows easily...
<ESphynx2> so the upstream tarball will automatically have it, which step could strip it down?
<xnox> as a debian maintainer, you should ask upstream to either publish a source only tarball
<micahg> hrm, I don't think we need a repack unless it's not DFSG
<xnox> or alternatively the debian maintainer repackages the tarball to make it DFSG
<ESphynx2> I'm the author btw...
<xnox> ESphynx2: i know, I am just being explicit =) you will have to "double up"
<ESphynx2> So when I build the .dsc I strip it down :)
<xnox> micahg: what about zlib auto-reject then?
<xnox> in Debian.
<ESphynx2> xnox: Should I put [amel] [armhf] [i386] ?
<ESphynx2> or is there a [!amd64] [!powerpc64] ?
<ESphynx2> I'm just worried about breaking all the other builds...
<xnox> ESphynx2: upstreams usually develop on a small amount of systems. Distributions often have wider access to differnt architectures.
<ESphynx2> right. e.g. I have no clue what amel or armhf are :P
<xnox> so we strike to build for all arches, if they fail to build from source, it's fine, since it will not be published for the users
<ESphynx2> armhf is that what the raspberry pi has/
<xnox> ESphynx2: armel is ARM v5 CPU, and armhf is newer ARM v7 CPU
<ESphynx2> ah ok... both arm platform
<xnox> ESphynx2: raspberry pi is armel, panda boards and android phones are ARM v7 / armhf
<ESphynx2> well it's been built before on ARM and PPC , with a certain level of success.
<ESphynx2> I've just been told before to put [i386] in there so that the PPA bots don't attempt to build for AMD64 and fail...
<micahg> xnox: raspberry pi is armv6...
<tumbleweed> and capable of HF
<micahg> xnox: and I'm not familiar with that auto reject (can't seem to find it listed)
<ESphynx2> oh, so no need to the github tarball can be used? =)
<ESphynx2> I mean no need to tweak it*
<xnox> micahg: non-fatal  -embedded-library
<xnox> http://ftp-master.debian.org/static/lintian.tags
<micahg> xnox: right, non-fatal :), if it's not used I thought it's file as long as it's DFSG distributable in source form
<micahg> s/file/fine/
<ESphynx2> micahg: ah great :)
<ESphynx2> So you guys have suggestions about what I should put to address the ARM platform issue xnox brought up?
<ESphynx2> I'd happily do I can to make it compliant but I would really appreciate a little hand-holding given the fact that I'm trying to be maintainer while being the upstream author, and otherwise fully busy with work and life :)
<micahg> ESphynx2: I'd do the ! as xnox suggested if it'll build on all 32 bit platforms
<ESphynx2> micahg: so that would be [!amd64] [!powerpc64] ? or [!amd64 | !powerpc64] or ...
<micahg> ESphynx2: just a straight list should be fine !amd64 !powerpc64 (and whatever archs in Debian if you upload there as well)
<ESphynx2> with [ ] around?
<ESphynx2> [!amd64] [!powerpc64] ?
<micahg> no
<micahg> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-controlfields.html#s-f-Architecture
<micahg> "In the main debian/control file in the source package, this field may contain the special value all, the special architecture wildcard any, or a list of specific and wildcard architectures separated by spaces. If all or any appears, that value must be the entire contents of the field. Most packages will use either all or any. "
<ESphynx2> ahhh sorry
<ESphynx2> I was confusing with the dependencies.
<ESphynx2> architecture specific dependencies...
<ESphynx2> samples, doc, extras... I used to have 'all' there for Natty,  but that would break things on Precise because the other packages didn't support amd64
<gld1982ltd1> hi all MOTU....does anyone have a sec to help me package an app?
<micahg> ESphynx2: no, you should use multiarch then to solve that problem
<gld1982ltd1> or more specifically, check to see if i am on the right track?
<gld1982ltd1> i have the branch on launchpad.
<ESphynx2> micahg: right with Precise now I'm using multiarch (that's why I only built for i386)
<micahg> ESphynx2: right, but arch:all should be fine where appropriate
<ESphynx2> so if I have !amd64 !powerpc64 with the binaries, all should be fine?
<micahg> ESphynx2: and use all where it's architecture independent
<ESphynx2> great. thanks. updating that... adding the thing for the  ${misc:Depends} as well...
<ral> gld1982ltd1: Best bet is to post the link to the branch.
<ESphynx2> native-package-with-dash-version -- This would go away once I build it myself instead of with the autobuild , right?
<micahg> ESphynx2: what's debian/source/format say?
<micahg> and do you have an .orig.tar.{gz,bz2,xz} that you're using
<ESphynx2> is that supposed to be a file?
<ESphynx2> micahg: xnox just used the automated .dsc file built by our PPA on launchpad for preliminary reviewing
<micahg> debian/source/format is supposed to be a file, yes
<ESphynx2> I do not have a debian/source/ folder ...
<ESphynx2> well unless that gets created by the debuilder ?
<gld1982ltd1> https://code.launchpad.net/~gld1982ltd/lxmed/testing
<micahg> ESphynx2: http://lintian.debian.org/tags/missing-debian-source-format.html
<xnox> micahg: it's a daily ppa build which merges branches, creates native tarball, and has a version number $date-0~$revno
<xnox> =/
<micahg> ah, ok
<micahg> is that because recipes are still broke with 3.0 (quilt)?
<ESphynx2> The new source package just built (before my packaging tweaks though... but that's the source that will build on Quantal (32 bit))...
<gld1982ltd1> ral: any suggestions or comments?
<ral> gld1982ltd1: I'm no motu, but the packaging part looks like a good start. Are you intending to package it for debian/ubuntu or a ppa?
<gld1982ltd1> for a ppa.
<gld1982ltd1> then for ubuntu
<gld1982ltd1> This is the only menu editor i have found tpo work for lxde that doesn't also waqnt to install another desktop environment with it.
<ral> gld1982ltd1: Your debian/copyright file should also list the copyrights for the source files, not just the packaged files.
<ral> Er, packaging files that is.
<gld1982ltd1> ok
<gld1982ltd1> man, i need someone who knows what they are doing to join the team on launchpad. how could i go about that?
<ral> gld1982ltd1: The Vcs-* files in control should point to repo where the debian/ files are stored, if you're going to include them.
<ral> And Homepage: needs filling in of course :)
<ral> gld1982ltd1: The version number in changelog is what it would be if packaged in debian.
<ral> If something is packaged in ubuntu and not in debian it would be something like 1.0-0ubuntu1
<gld1982ltd1> ah......ok.
<ral> The idea being that if was subsequently packaged in debian then the newly packaged version would supercede the ubuntu version.
<ral> You can compare package versions with "dpkg --compare-versions".
<ral> Something I was having problems with myself earlier :)
<gld1982ltd1> ral: did you look at the actual trunk this testing branch was taken from?
<gld1982ltd1> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~lxmed/lxmed/lxmed/files
<ral> I was looking here: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~gld1982ltd/lxmed/testing/view/head:/trunk/installation/debian/lxmed/debian/
<gld1982ltd1> right....the trunk is different. maybe i changed something i wasn't supposed to?
<ral> gld1982ltd1: You should also make sure the version number for your ppa would be superceded by any "properly" packaged package.
<gld1982ltd1> there is no properly packaged package. there is no package yet at all.
<ral> gld1982ltd1: Er, dunno.
<ral> gld1982ltd1: Yes, but if there is a properly packaged package it should take precedence over your ppa package.
<gld1982ltd1> oh, ok.
<gld1982ltd1> so i need to change the version to 1.0ubuntu0? would that work?
<ral> gld1982ltd1: 1.0-0ubuntu0 would work, but something like 1.0-0ppa1 might be more appropriate.
<gld1982ltd1> ah
<gld1982ltd1> i see
<ral> 1.0-AubuntuB means upstream version 1.0, debian revision A, ubuntu revision B.
<gld1982ltd1> aaaaahhhh
<ral> So the -0 part is important.
<gld1982ltd1> ok....i'm going to revert back to the original and start over. looking at the original source, should i follow this page? http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/packaging-new-software.html
<gld1982ltd1> that's what i have been trying to follow.
<ral> gld1982ltd1: I'm not familiar with that page, but given that it is talking about keeping the packaging files in a repo suggests it's reasonably up to date.
<ral> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete gives more details.
<ral> There's lots to learn, but it looks like you've started with a reasonably straightforward package.
<gld1982ltd1> cool.
<gld1982ltd1> ral: thanky ou very much for your help.
<gld1982ltd1> i got to go now.
<ESphynx2> thanks again for the help guys
<ESphynx2> micahg: still around? dpkg-source: error: `!amd64' is not a legal architecture string
<micahg> hrm, I guess that's only good for dependencies
<ESphynx2> yeah that's what it looks like... for [!amd64]
<ESphynx2> So what should I do here?
 * micahg guesses list them out then
<micahg> i386 armel armhf powerpc
<ESphynx2> fair enough
<ESphynx2> done... reimporting the branch and re-schedulring a build then :)
<ESphynx2> btw, if anyone is willing to try it out, the previous build did succeed on Quantal:  ecere - 201208132049-0~776~quantal1  @ https://code.launchpad.net/~ecere-team/+archive/ppa/+packages
<ESphynx2> (though that's before the packaging tweaks, since that build didn't go through :P)
<ESphynx2> well gg, bbl
<ESphynx2> thanks micahg
<Laney> someone want to do a round of haskell rebuilds?
<Laney> seeing a few weird failures on arm{el,hf} that i haven't investigated yet but are keeping some rows red
<ajmitch> sounds terribly exciting, where do I sign up?
<Laney> so try not to reupload those if you can, but it's not the end of the world if you do
<Laney> i already accidently did that once
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/ghc.html thar
<ajmitch> this is why I need to get real armhf hardware working properly at home
<micahg> Laney: any reason why haskell-platform wasn't uploaded?  someone just filed a bug
<Laney> i was waiting to finish everything else
<Laney> so that i don't have to think about whether other packages are making it red
<ajmitch> why does the transition tracker show it as red for all archs?
<Laney> same with dummy
<micahg> umm, because it's not installable?
<Laney>  haskell-platform : Depends: ghc (< 7.4.1+) but 7.4.2-2 is to be installed
<Laney>                     Depends: libghc-haskell-src-dev (>= 1.0.1.5) but it is not going to be installed
<Laney>                     Depends: libghc-haskell-src-dev (< 1.0.1.5+) but it is not going to be installed
<Laney> at least the ghc one will require sourceful uploadery
<Laney> and haskell-src is in level 35, so will be around soon
<micahg> hrmm, why does it show that package as level 1 then?
<Laney> no clue
<ajmitch> Laney: I take it there are still a few uploads/syncs to do?
<micahg> Laney: can you have a look at my tracker branch?
 * micahg would appreciate if someone with a proper setup could run it to see if it does what I think it does
<Laney> i'll look tomorrow
<Laney> sleep now
<micahg> ok
<Laney> ajmitch: not so many syncs
<Laney> that freeze thing
 * ajmitch has no proper quantal setup yet
<Laney> http://paste.debian.net/183446/
<ajmitch> Laney: that's a short list
<Laney> good eh
<Laney> rest will just be rebuilds
<Laney> nighty night
<ajmitch> night
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-14
<TheDrums> micahg: I had simply asked if it was going to be in backports, not pushing. :)   Reason I asked though, is because debian stable's one in backports supports additional ssh features such as keyfile and changing the port number which I can't find in the current Ubuntu one.  Found a devs PPA though.
<micahg> TheDrums: if you want it there, request it, backports is based on user request mostly
<micahg> TheDrums: it's easy enough to approve once the testing is done and I"m happy to prepare test packages if you like
<micahg> the person who did the first round of backports has been busy of late
<TheDrums> Well, I'm pretty new to the program, but I'd pretty much be up for it.
<micahg> TheDrums: test == install/run, just run the requestbackport script from ubuntu-dev-tools, it'll help you file a request and tell you what needs testing
<micahg> any questions along the way, I'm sure someone here can help
<micahg> the great thing with backports is the testing is something almost anyone can do, and by helping something get there, you're making it available to all Ubuntu users
<TheDrums> It's not a big deal to have for me, but I can do and I already have backports enabled. :)
<micahg> TheDrums: it's on automatically in oneiric and later
<micahg> you just have to select the new version the first time you want to jump to the backports version of something
<ESphynx> Hey guys, would anyone have a clue on how to build for PPC on a Launchpad PPA so I could test the other platforms?
<ESphynx> so the answer is I can't unless it's on an official Ubuntu archive :P
<ESphynx> So should the source packages be de-built on Quantal, or it doesn't really matter?
<ESphynx> downloading the image, though I guess I'll start by trying it out in Precise :P
<ESphynx> What's up with this error guys native-package-with-dash-version ?
<ESphynx> any ideas why debuild is giving me unmet dependencies , but the Launchpad PPA is working fine ? https://raw.github.com/ecere/sdk/ppa/precise/debian/control
<dupondje> How can I let pbuilder include the source file when it generates a .changes file? I did build the .dsc with debuild -S -sa, but still not included :(
<geser> dupondje: you mean a .changes file with the binary and the source "files"? (as needed for uploads to Debian)
<Laney> I suppose it's --debbuildopts -sa
<dupondje> geser: well i'm trying to make my own package, and upload it to my own repo with reprepro
<dupondje> but the .changes doesn't include the orig.tar.gz
<dupondje> so its not dputted
<dupondje> Laney: dpkg-genchanges: including full source code in upload
<dupondje> that worked :) thx
<ESphynx> hey guys... so I've updated https://bugs.launchpad.net/ecere/+bug/394998
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 394998 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] ecere-sdk -- cross-platform developer toolkit" [Wishlist,In progress]
<ESphynx> Do I need to re-subscribe sponsors? looks like it's not subscribed...
<dholbach> ubuntu-sponsors seems to be subscribed as far as I can see
<ESphynx> dholbach I just added it back ;P
<dholbach> ok
<tumbleweed> ESphynx: any reason that can't go through debian?
<ESphynx> tumbleweed: well, I was hoping to make it into the feature freeze for Quantal :P
<ESphynx> been trying to get this packaging settled for 3 years :|
<tumbleweed> there's no rush. it can land after feature freeze
<ESphynx> how so?
<tumbleweed> there's an exception process, and brinding a new package through debian is a valid exceptoin reason for me
<ESphynx> ah... well i'm tring to build on debian as well
<ESphynx> different package standards though make it all a pain
<landic> hi, is there someone around who can help me get this landed before feature freeze? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/transmission/+bug/1031035
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1031035 in transmission (Ubuntu) "Transmission daemon upstart support" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<tumbleweed> the standards are the same
<tumbleweed> (well, almost)
<tumbleweed> what differences are causing you trouble?
<tumbleweed> landic: can you prepare a patch against the package?
<ESphynx> dholbach: any chance you have the failed build log? :)
<dholbach> ESphynx, just a sec
<landic> tumbleweed: never done that, but it sounds like more work than just saving the file to the debian/ dir
<dholbach> ESphynx, http://people.canonical.com/~dholbach/last_operation.log
<tumbleweed> landic: that's what ubuntu developers expect, though
<ESphynx> thanks dholbach
<landic> tumbleweed: i'll see if I can find the time before my vacation
<ESphynx> dholbach: that's very strange, because it said: The Ecere SDK is fully built. and The Ecere SDK has been installed.
<landic> probably not though
<Laney> landic: tumbleweed: While a patch is the most easy way to apply a change, I don't think it's necessary
<Laney> as there is a proposed file there, I would expect most sponsors to be able to take it from here
<dholbach> ESphynx, line 685
<tumbleweed> Laney: no, it's not. But if there was a patch, the patch bot would have subscribed ubuntu-sponsors and that'd be all he had to do
<ESphynx> don't wanna bug you too much though... guess I'll have to try it in Quantal...
<Laney> landic: I'm saying that you can probably just subscribe ubuntu-sponsors now and someone could take a look
<landic> Laney: I'll do that then, thanks
<ESphynx> dholbach: I see the missing files, but I don't know who's saying that? https://code.launchpad.net/~ecere-team/+archive/ppa/+build/3722682/+files/ecere-sdk_201208132333-0~776~quantal1_i386.deb  --> the .so is in there, and if it said installed successfully, that's because install -D succeeded on that file....
<Laney> if you want to ensure you get credit from the change in Launchpad then you should give a patch though.
<dholbach> ESphynx, I built it in a i386 quantal pbuilder
<dholbach> ESphynx, how did you build it?
<landic> Laney: I don't really care about credit :)
<ESphynx> or rather ln -sf $(LP)EDA$(SOV) $(LIBDIR)/$(LP)EDA$(SO)
<Laney> fair enough
<ESphynx> dholbach: on Quantal, only on Launchpad PPA (i386) so far...
<landic> I just want to get this going so transmission will play nicer with ubuntu
<ESphynx> there's another build pending in 15 min...
<ESphynx> But last succeeded build was: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/112670033/buildlog_ubuntu-quantal-i386.ecere_201208132333-0~776~quantal1_BUILDING.txt.gz
<dholbach> ESphynx, I'm happy to retry it locally and see if that changes anything
<ESphynx> dholbach: well is there any way you could peek at the created files?
<ESphynx> i.e. after the make install is done?
<dholbach> ESphynx, I can try - give me a bit of time - I'm currently looking at something else as well
<ESphynx> thanks a lot dholbach
<dholbach> ESphynx, I'm in the i386 chroot now - which files do you want me to look at?
<ESphynx> dholbach: well it's saying that it's missing a libEDA.so* ?
<ESphynx> in /usr/lib/
<ESphynx> (of the DESTDIR...)
<dholbach> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1146636/
<dholbach> ah, it's a i386 chroot on amd64, if that matters O:-)
<ESphynx> and h_install: ecere-sdk missing files (usr/lib/libEDA.so*), aborting
<dholbach> did the ppa build suceed?
<ESphynx> dh_install*
<ESphynx> dholbach: The earlier one did for sure
<dholbach> let's wait for this one to run and see what it says
<dholbach> if it succeeds, i386 chroot on amd64 might be a problem :)
<ESphynx> it's currently building now...
<dholbach> ok
<ESphynx> https://code.launchpad.net/~jerstlouis/+recipe/ecere-daily-precise
<ESphynx> I'm pretty sure it's gonna be the same thouhg...
<ESphynx> it's the dh_install looking for it in /usr/lib/ while it's in /usr/lib32/ ...
<ESphynx> but isn't that a symlink?
<ESphynx> oh. but it's 'local' path
<ESphynx> I know dholbach
<ESphynx> what does DEB_HOST_ARCH say ?
<ESphynx> ifeq ($(DEB_HOST_ARCH),i386)
<ESphynx> 	cp debian/libecere.install.in32 debian/libecere.install
<ESphynx> 	cp debian/ecere-sdk.install.in32 debian/ecere-sdk.install
<ESphynx> endif
<ESphynx> shell dpkg-architecture -qDEB_HOST_ARCH
<ESphynx> I bet I could kill all this code on multiarch.
<dholbach> i386
<ESphynx> if it's i386, it tries to copy usr/lib/libEDA.so*
<ESphynx> ah
<ESphynx> HOSTTYPE := $(shell uname -m)
<ESphynx> taht one probably conflicts :P
<dholbach> uname -m is x86_64
<ESphynx> they don't agree :P
<dholbach> let me know how the PPA build goes :)
<ESphynx> dholbach oh i'm sure the PPA will work.
<ESphynx> it's really a cross-build issue
<dholbach> yeah, I think so too - if I had set up a VM I'm sure it'd work in there as well
<ESphynx> or rather, chroot issue...
<ESphynx> i.e. if you build with make
<dholbach> once the PPA build is done, I'll have a look at the resulting packages
<ESphynx> it installs as is...
<dholbach> let me know when it's done
<ESphynx> without need for a chroot
<ESphynx> I have it configured so one can just download the orig tarball and hit 'make' on a 64 bit system.
<ESphynx> great, thanks!
<dholbach> anytime
<ESphynx> dholbach: hmm the binaries build are scheduled for in one hours :( do you want me to attach the .deb that my .dsc etc produced?
<dholbach> ESphynx, maybe just link to the build page in the bug report
<dholbach> attaching should not be necessary
<ESphynx> dholbach: I was tols earlier that daily builds were not good enough :P
<ESphynx> tumbleweed: my main problem with getting it in debian is they want me to do it with pbuilder :P which is a serious pain.
<ESphynx> pbuilder for sid
<dholbach> ESphynx, I'm too lazy to set up a i386 VM right now, so for reviewing it and establishing that a 'regular' i386 build works a daily build is good enough
<dholbach> I assume that the daily build is pretty close to the source package you submitted in the bug report
<xnox> ESphynx: $ apt-get install ubuntu-dev-tools; pbuilder-dist create sid ; pbuilder-dist sid build *.dsc
<ESphynx> dholbach: it is.
 * xnox There is a deb for that! =)
<ESphynx> xnox: don't forget the i386 in there
<ESphynx> and hten I get amd64 errors
<xnox> ESphynx: pbuilder-dist crate sid i386
<ESphynx> which I think is why i had the [i386] where the way I had them before
<ESphynx> which you had me take out :P
<xnox> will give you a i386 pbuilder chroot on amd64 host
<ESphynx> I think they ahd to be like that to work on debian
<xnox> and then you want
<xnox> $ pbuilder-dist sid i386 build *.dsc
<ESphynx> xnox: yse I did that, and I did it a second or 3rd time, and now my VDI is out of space.
<ESphynx> let me try that
<xnox> ESphynx: to recover space, $ pbuilder-dist sid i386 clean
<ESphynx> E: amd64 not in arch list or does not match any arch wildcards: i386 armel armhf powerpc all
<ESphynx> xnox: how to recover the non-i386 one I built by mistake?
<xnox> ESphynx: can you pastebin the exact command you ran?
<ESphynx> the exact one you just pasted
 * xnox ESphynx note "sid i386" not just "sid"
<xnox> and you need to create it first (the i386 variant)
<ESphynx> xnox yes I copy pasted your command
<ESphynx> I created it too
<ESphynx> although i hope running the create command a 2nd time (did that by mistake) didn't delete the first one I had created
<xnox> ESphynx: you create a chroot once (one time setup), then you simply use build each time (it creates a snapshots, does the build, and deletes the snapshot)
<ESphynx> dholbach: if you have interest in reviewing the actual package capabilities, maybe you'd like to quickly look through http://ecere.com/SDKIntro.pdf which was published in the Software Developer's Journal :)
<ESphynx> xnox: right I knwo
<dholbach> ESphynx, I'm afraid I might be a bit too busy to do that right now :/
<ESphynx> I ran it a 2nd time by mistake (wrong command going up, cuz they both started by pbuilder-dist!)
<ESphynx> dholbach : hehe np
<ESphynx> dholbach: allright I updated the maintainer and copyright thing and pushed to the packaging branch...
<dholbach> ok
<ESphynx> so the next build after that will pick it up I guess ;)
<ESphynx> well all this sid creating and recreating is taking forever
<ESphynx> I badly need sleep
<ESphynx> thank you all, good day/night
<ESphynx> xnox: still there?
<ESphynx> xnox: same thing.
<ESphynx> I: Logging to /home/jerome/pbuilder/sid-i386_result/last_operation.log
<ESphynx> E: amd64 not in arch list or does not match any arch wildcards: i386 armel armhf powerpc all
<xnox> strange.
<StevenK> amd64 does not build all, and is not in i386 armel armhf powerpc
<StevenK> So, maybe you should use 'any' rather than enumerating them
<ESphynx> StevenK: exactly.
<ESphynx> I remember going through the exacts steps 6 months ago or so.
<ESphynx> someone had me change it back to all yesterday
<ESphynx> any will cause problem
<ESphynx> I had to list the same binary types
<ESphynx> if I put any i'll get some amd64 errors
<ESphynx> won't I?
<ESphynx> well putting 'any' seems to work
<ESphynx> guys in #debian-mentors says it might be fixed in pbuidler 0.202, which I don't have
<xnox> hmm... let me check pbuilder
<xnox> pbuilder 208 is in precise and quantal
<xnox> what distro are you using?
<ESphynx> well my pbuilder stuff was in oneiric
<ESphynx> so I was doing that there
<ESphynx> though i have a fresh quantal machine (That nicely froze on the reboot at the console!!!)
<ESphynx> and a precise 32 VM up as well
<ESphynx> dholbach: I hit that chroot bug with pbuilder... obviously
<tumbleweed> ESphynx: do I remember right that this package doesn't actually support amd64?
<ESphynx> tumbleweed: it will build if you just say 'make'
<ESphynx> as 32 bit (-m32)
<tumbleweed> right, so why bother?
<tumbleweed> why not just only build it on i386?
<ESphynx> tumbleweed: that is what I do.
<ESphynx> however here I was in a 64bit oneiric machine trying to pbuilder it for those Debian guys
<ESphynx> and I hit that chroot problem
<tumbleweed> should work just fine. You need an i386 pbuilder chroot
<ESphynx> tumbleweed oh I have one, but it hits a bug
<ESphynx> disagreement between dpkg-architecture -qDEB_HOST_ARCH and uname -m
<tumbleweed> right, don't trust uname
<ESphynx> which is there to make 'make' just work if you do it
<ESphynx> on the amd64...
<ESphynx> tumbleweed: what else should I trust?
<tumbleweed> ESphynx: I suppose you can trust uname -m. it should return i686 in a i386 chroot (thanks to linux32)
<ESphynx> tumbleweed: it returns x86_64
<ESphynx> [07:22] <dholbach> uname -m is x86_64
<tumbleweed> it returns i686 in my chroots
<ESphynx> weird.
<ESphynx> but anyways, I insatlled pbuilder on my 32bit machine to build for Debian...
<ESphynx> ok running it in a 32 bit now :P
<directhex> use dpkg-architecture, never uname
<directhex> uname returns x86_64 in an ARM chroot :)
<ESphynx>  Failed to create /var/cache/pbuilder/ccache/2/6: Permission denie -- awesome
<ESphynx> directhex: that is the command I use to build the source package... on any system, linux or not :)
<ESphynx> I want it to be possible to build from 'make'
<ESphynx> besides I hate chroot.
<xnox> echo "unset CCACHEDIR" | sudo tee -a /etc/pbuilderrc
<xnox> ESphynx: ^^^ should fix the ccache error
<ESphynx> k thanks
<xnox> or edit manually to add the unset into there....
<ESphynx> ok... crashing
<tumbleweed> directhex: works in mine
<directhex> hmph. how about /proc/cpuinfo ?
<tumbleweed> well, that always lies :)
<tumbleweed> (I mean don't trust that at all, setarch doesn't fake it)
<tumbleweed> directhex: back to the point,t hough. I think ESphynx is using uname in his upsrteam makefile. One can't depend on dpkg-architecture on non-debian
<tbf> ricotz: hi. just advertised your grilo-0.2 packages. do you also plan packaging grilo-plugins-0.2 ?
<green7> I keep getting this error after running debuild:
<green7> dpkg-buildpackage: error: debian/rules build gave error exit status 2
<green7> debuild: fatal error at line 1350:
<green7> dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -D -us -uc failed
<Lasall> green7: please nopaste your build log
<green7> all right
<green7> can you help me?
<Lasall> I don't know before viewing the log ;)
<green7> well?
<Lasall> green7: use pastebin.org or something similar
<jtaylor> or the pastebinit command line tool
<green7> here is the pastebin: http://pastebin.com/Jd966jPr
<jtaylor> green7: did you install all build dependencies?
<green7> yep
<jtaylor> either apt-get build-dep package or mk-build-depends -ir
<Lasall> green7: is libsigc++-2.0-dev installed?
<jtaylor> this type of message can pretty much only mean missing build dependency
<green7> Lasall: nope it's not :P
<green7> Installed libsigc++-2.0-dev
<green7> nothing!
<Lasall> nothing what? please nopaste your login again.
<Lasall> *log
<green7> SFML/Graphics.hpp is missing
<Lasall> install libsfml-dev
<Lasall> but you really should install build-deps with one of the commands from jtay_lor
<green7> Actually I'm packaging
<green7> how do I submit my patch without using bzr?
<micahg> green7: cross-posting in multiple channels is generally frowned upon, you should give people more than a few minutes to answer a question
<green7> sorry
<green7> can you help me out?
<jtaylor> update the changelog with dch -i, build the package and the do a debdiff old.dsc new.dsc
<hyperair> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1036725 is weird. is scintilla broken with regard to ubuntu mono's font hinting?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1036725 in geany (Ubuntu) "geany's default font is broken" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<ESphynx> good morning guys
<ESphynx> FYI I uploaded the Ecere package to mentors.debian.net as well: http://mentors.debian.net/package/ecere
<dupondje> Somebody with experience on mozilla packages?
<dupondje> would like to build new version of the lightning extension :)
<dupondje> Building fails with "configure:17825:27: fatal error: sys/int_types.h: No such file or directory"
<dupondje> but no idea where that file would be :)
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-15
<aabbcc> hy everyone! I have to rebuild a package using another name. what field have I to change? and in which file (control or changelog)? thx everyone
<arand> aabbcc: You'll have to change anumber of things, depending on how the package is structured, changelog, control, name.install files, rules, ...
<aabbcc> arand: i hope you can help me. i have to dispense a fixed version of scribus to a number of people who use several version of ubuntu. I can't tell them to change /etc/apt/preference, and the only method I find to avoid automatic upgrades (also from an Ubuntu release to another) is build a version of scribus with another name (like scribus-keep). the debian directoy is http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/s/scribus/scribus_
 * aabbcc now go away, in his bed... see you tomorrow.
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-16
<JainAmber> Err... where do I report this error to?
<JainAmber> I get "500 Internal Server Error" on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<JainAmber> Here's the screenshot of error: http://i.imgur.com/6e30D.png
<JainAmber> Laters. Thanks!
<ral> I've pushed a branch that updates a package to the new upstream version (which fixes some bugs that affect the current ubuntu version), could someone take a look at it please?
<ral> https://code.launchpad.net/~roger.light/ubuntu/quantal/mosquitto/upload-1.0.1
<tumbleweed> ral: if you want, you can upload it to Debian experimental, and then trivially sync it
<tumbleweed> ral: but to get someone to look at the update, propose a merge into lp:ubuntu/mosquitto
<ral> tumbleweed: Right, thanks. I wasn't aware that debian-experimental was a valid route during a freeze.
<ral> I think I'll propose a merge for the moment though, it always takes a while to get a new version uploaded in Debian and there are ubuntu customisations in the package anyway.
<tumbleweed> can those customisations be merged into the debian package?
<tumbleweed> it's nice to reduce ubuntu-delta
<tbf> is there any way to remove .orig tarballs in a ppa, or to replace them?
<tumbleweed> no
<tumbleweed> if you changed the .orig tarball, you should have changed the upstream version
<ral> tumbleweed: They add apparmor support and replace the startup script with an upstart script. They could be left out to keep parity with debian, but it's nice to have them.
<tumbleweed> one can also conditionally install them one building on Ubuntu
<ral> Any hints on how to approach that? At the moment the .init and .upstart files are installed automatically.
<ral> And the apparmor file is listed in the .install file.
<tumbleweed> ral: dpkg-vendor
<ral> tumbleweed: I'm not sure that helps. dh_installinit will always install package.upstart by preference if it exists. I suppose I could detect if it was being installed on debian and move the .upstart file out of the way temporarily, but that feels very hacky.
<tumbleweed> ral: yeah, we're all waiting for upstart to just be supported in Debian
<ral> It would make things easier.
<Logan_> What should I do if a package needs a no-change rebuild to fix a bug?
<micahg> Logan_: either attach a debdiff for the no change rebuild if you want credit, or just ask someone to do it for you here
<Logan_> I don't need credit. :P
<Logan_> It's to fix https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xmlcopyeditor/+bug/901547
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 901547 in xmlcopyeditor (Ubuntu) "xmlcopyeditor does not start" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Logan_> Can you please do a no-change rebuild for xmlcopyeditor? I confirmed that the startup bug no longer existed when I built it myself, and others confirmed the same.
<micahg> Logan_: which release?
<Logan_> For Quantal, and for Precise as well if that's possible
<micahg> Logan_: ok, 12.04 will need SRU paperwork, can you do that?  I'll give you a bug task
<Logan_> ok
<Logan_> micahg: updated the title/description
<Logan_> shall I subscribe ubuntu-sru now, or should I wait until it's in precise-proposed?
<micahg> Logan_: the uploader should subscribe ubuntu-sru
<Logan_> And you're the uploader, correct? :P
<micahg> Logan_: well, if no one else gets to it
<Logan_> So, should I request a sponsor?
<micahg> if there was a pilot in -devel, I'd suggest asking them
<Logan_> Doesn't look like it.
<micahg> Logan_: I don't think I can get to this today, if someone else around wants to do it, that's fine, otherwise I'll get to it when I have a  minute
<Logan_> Aight, thanks.
<gotwig> hey Masters..
<gotwig> Wanna ask if you also package KDE and QT packages
<gotwig> packages for qt quick are missing, mainly developer packages, it seems
* gotwig changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Quantal: Archive open | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://bit.ly/fz6AyQ | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs
<micahg> gotwig: well, MOTU looks after some of those, but most are probably handled by the Kubuntu devs
<ESphynx> So are there any masters here who are also DD? :)
<ESphynx> I've cleaned up my ecere-sdk package :)
<xnox> ESphynx: did you now =)
 * xnox is also a DD
<Rhonda> xnox is also xnox
<xnox> Rhonda is also not very funny
<xnox> =)
 * xnox Muahahah
<Rhonda> :(
<xnox> Rhonda also appears to be quite slow on the comebacks and responses ;-)
<jocarter> hie hie
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-17
<ESphynx> oh I missed xnox :(
<ESphynx> btw the package is at http://mentors.debian.net/package/ecere-sdk :P
<abin_> is there Chinese in motu, I a beginner, and want someone to help me do some work?
<codemaniac> where to start to become a motu ?
<UndiFineD> codemaniac, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/
<codemaniac> thanks UndiFineD
<UndiFineD> topic :)
<codemaniac> UndiFineD: can i do the dev activities on a headless ubuntuserver install
<codemaniac> i mean is there any GUI tools needed
<codemaniac> for a MOTU
<UndiFineD> read the docs, it is all there
<codemaniac> sure , but i was planning to set things up , thanks
<ScottK> codemaniac: Most of us use primarily command line tools even when we have a GUI available.  It's certainly not needed.
<codemaniac> ScottK: thanks , you turn my nitro booster on
<codemaniac> Do i need a development release of Ubuntu as a testbed ?
<geser> it helps if you can test your changes yourself (a VM is sufficient if you don't want to run the dev release)
<codemaniac> is there any way someone can review/test the changes for me ?
<codemaniac> i believe here comes the sponser
<Zhenech> Daviey, may I bother you with some canonical job-related questions?
<Daviey> Zhenech: I can try..
<directhex> "what's the secret handshake?"
<Daviey> directhex: I couldn't disclose anything like that!!
<Zhenech> Daviey, I sent an application for https://tbe.taleo.net/NA3/ats/careers/requisition.jsp?org=CANONICAL&cws=1&rid=493 about two weeks ago and was wondering about possible roundtrip times in canonical-core for that (background: other possible employees want to know when I can be sure about joining them)
<Lasall> micahg: i'd like to help the chromium people to get their ppa uptodate. is help welcome and if yes where can i start?
<dholbach> anyone up for taking the last 1h slot on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek/Timetable?
<micahg> Lasall: yes, help is welcome, I'm gathering a list right now
<Lasall> micahg: :) just ping me
<ESphynx> xnox: hi :)
<xnox> ESphynx: hola =)
<ESphynx> como esta
<ESphynx> See http://mentors.debian.net/package/ecere-sdk :P pretty clean now ;)
<xnox> ESphynx: I might have some time over the weekend to look at it again =)
<ESphynx> xnox: Ah great :) that would be nice.
<ESphynx> Would any of you here be able to assist me regarding integration problems with Unity?
<ESphynx> guys: http://ecere.com/tmp/unityBug.png
<ESphynx> is there some kind of weird override going on with maximized apps? > Unity realy doesnât play nice with my GUI toolkit :|  youâll see the menu bar display twice under itself when maximized... and sometimes the clicks are gonna be off as well... I really wish we could work to resolve this
<ESphynx>  My app is meant to come up maximized...But with Unity, sometimes it will come up maximized messed up, sometimes maximized OK , sometimes not maximized (fine)
<ScottK> ESphynx: If it's a development issue, #ubuntu-deskotp is a better channel.
<ESphynx> ScottK, thanks.
<ESphynx> See that double menu bar :P not supposed to happen :P (And I donât know how the heck it happens)
<siretart> jbicha: I notice that you have uploaded/synced the latest live-boot. I've had the chance to test it in quantal in an nfsroot environment
<siretart> jbicha: unfortunately, the version in quantal fails to optain an ip via dhcp. AFAIUI, this was fixed by this patch: http://live.debian.net/gitweb?p=live-boot.git;a=commit;h=990d419eacf614710c838ef743aa10ec0612ed7a
<siretart> jbicha: as a quick test, I've installed the debian package 3.0~b1-1 in the nfsroot and rebuilt the initramfs
<siretart> jbicha: while the system still fails to boot because of bug #1038075, at least dhcp worked
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1038075 in linux (Ubuntu) "[quantal] overlayfs over r/o NFS mount triggers OOPS" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1038075
<siretart> jbicha: any objections to sync that into quantal?
<jbicha> no, please go ahead :)
<siretart> jbicha: did you use/test live-boot for something in particular?
<siretart> hrmpf. not in testing yet, so https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/quantal/+localpackagediffs?field.name_filter=live-boot doesn't work
<codemaniac>  /whois siretart
<jbicha> siretart: you can use syncpackage from the ubuntu-dev-tools package
<ScottK> siretart: If it doesn't, that's a bug since we're syncing from Unstable this cycle.
<ScottK> But syncpackage is the way to go in any case.
<micahg> siretart: one is not supposed to use the web interface for syncing, syncpackage is the proper way to do it
<xnox> tumbleweed: can I haz an RSS for UDS Radiant Raccoon specs? =)
<tumbleweed> xnox: there, done :)
<xnox> tumbleweed: do I need to do anything? is it the same feed?
<tumbleweed> same feed
<xnox> cool =)
 * tumbleweed goes out
<zachtib> hey, I have a quick question about ubuntu/debian packaging, is this a proper place to ask?
<TheLordOfTime> zachtib:  this would be one place, #ubuntu-packaging might be a good place also.  if for Debian, you might be looking for the debian mentors on oftc.
<TheLordOfTime> :)
<zachtib> TheLordOfTime, well, I'm doing this on Ubuntu :P
<TheLordOfTime> but i get my in-depth packaging help here, or on debian-mentors when i'm packaging for Debian on Ubuntu :P
 * TheLordOfTime is not a MOTU, nor a packaging expert, btw.
<zachtib> so, I'm packaging a program for work, and it's build process is kind of cludgy, but it seems to compile ok...
<zachtib> the auto_install doesn't work, though, so I'd like to write my own inside of debian/rules. I've found override_dh_auto_install, but I can't seem to make use of env variables from inside debian/rules
<tumbleweed> zachtib: export them
<zachtib> tumbleweed, oh, ok
<tumbleweed> the override_dh_auto_install will run in a sub-make
<zachtib> let me see if that works...
<zachtib> tumbleweed, to clarify, I want to define this variable from within the override, and use it on subsequent lines in that override
<zachtib> or should I just do that at the top of the file?
<tumbleweed> zachtib: ah
<tumbleweed> so you can't really do that, because each line gets executed in a separate shell
<tumbleweed> if you want to have a multi-line chunk executed in the same shell, put ;\ at the end of each line
<zachtib> ah
<tumbleweed> (; for bash, \ to tell make that you're continuing the line)
<tumbleweed> and do start it with a set -e; or you'll not abort on errors
<tumbleweed> don't forget you also need to escape $ for shell variables. So you'll be saying $$foo
<zachtib> ok, that I did not know
<tumbleweed> $(make_variable) $$shell_variable
<zachtib> export DESTDIR=$(shell pwd)/debian/appname;\                                     mkdir -p $$(DESTDIR)/usr/bin
<zachtib> so, that didn't work =/
<tumbleweed> no need to export it there
<tumbleweed> btw, you can use $(CURDIR)/debian/appname
<zachtib> ok
<tumbleweed> or even simple, just put usr/bin in debian/appname.dirs
<tumbleweed> dh_installdirs reads that
<zachtib> well, the script continues, I do want that variable later
<zachtib> i'm still getting DESTDIR: not found
<tumbleweed> $$DISTDIR not $$(DESTDIR)
<zachtib> oh
<jtaylor> I'd define it globally as a make variable
 * tumbleweed wouldn't be suprised if dh_auto_install already defines it
<jtaylor> but I think you might be better of trying to coax dh_install to do the right thing
<tumbleweed> +1 on that
<zachtib> at some point, I need to just fix our build system
<jtaylor> that would be best of course :)
<zachtib> it's a cludgy cmake script that only handles building the application binary
<tumbleweed> if it's just copying things to the rigth places, dh_install makes that trivial
<zachtib> and doesn't install any of the related files
<tumbleweed> (but dh_install doesn't help with renaming)
<zachtib> I really need to better learn what it's capable of
<tumbleweed> see its manpage
<zachtib> but for a friday afternoon, I'll be content to just get this done >.<
<jtaylor> a lot since it can execute scripts :)
<zachtib> well, that takes care of my super-hacky approach... maybe next week I'll learn how to do it properly
<zachtib> I should probably just change the project to use autotools and then dh can do everything on its own
<jtaylor> it can do that for cmake too
<zachtib> I know
<zachtib> so, another question, is there a way to use dch inside of a script (so it won't open the editor after inc the  version number)?
<zachtib> nvm, found it
<ESphynx> tumbleweed: are you a DD too? :)
<tumbleweed> ESphynx: yes
<ESphynx> tumbleweed: oh :) did you notice I fixed the ecere package? :P
<ESphynx> Just in case you were interested :P Guess you guys are busy , but I would really like it it made it into QQ :P
 * tumbleweed hasn't been paying much attention to the world recently, I'm afraid :)
<ESphynx> tumbleweed: http://mentors.debian.net/package/ecere-sdk  ... also uploaded it with Ubuntu pacakging to the Launchpad bug
<tumbleweed> it's a complex package, non-trivial to review
<ESphynx> for sure.
 * tumbleweed leaves a tab open, maybe I can find some time
<ESphynx> Ah nice :)
<ESphynx> time is but a dimension of the world we live in :)
<ESphynx> it is not as it seems :P
<ESphynx> yet it does feel sparse :(
<ESphynx> specially when you want to do so much :)
 * micahg wonders if a GUI backport requesting tool would be good, based on how hard it was for the user in -packaging to get a backport request
 * micahg thinks he has himself a EOY vacation project :)
 * micahg guesses Qt wouldn't be allowed in ubuntu-dev-tools, a separate source maybe :)
 * micahg guesses it could be done in pygtk, maybe that's the way to go...
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-18
<ScottK> micahg: How about PyQt?
<ScottK> It could be a suggests.
<ESphynx> micahg: How about doing it with Ecere? ;)
<codemaniac> is there any community servers around i can use as test bed for Ubuntu packaging ?
<jtaylor> codemaniac: why can't you use your own machine?
<jtaylor> I think members get time limited free access to some HP cloud which you could use
<Kihokki> Hello! Does anybody know when Intel GMA3600 drivers are released for Ubuntu? I found this: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/cedarview-graphics-drivers/precise-proposed
<codemaniac> i actually dont have permanent access to Ubuntu system . :|
<codemaniac> jtaylor: can i get a limited access to start with packaging .
<jtaylor> I don't think so
<jtaylor> amazon offers a micro instance free for a year
<jtaylor> but its probably to slow for packaging
<codemaniac> jtaylor: do i always need a development release for packaging ?
<jtaylor> codemaniac: no, you don't even need to use ubuntu
<jtaylor> codemaniac: though a debian based distro helps
<codemaniac> thats great
<codemaniac> i have a debian server , but no root access , will that help
<jtaylor> codemaniac: no you do need root :/
<codemaniac> i can contact the admin s though if required
<jtaylor> codemaniac: can't you use a virtual machine on your local machine?
<codemaniac> ok
<codemaniac> jtaylor: i have managed a Ubuntu server with root access , will that help
<codemaniac> do we need GUI tools for packaging
<codemaniac> So far i have not read about any GUI tool son MOTU docs .
<jtaylor> there are guis, but they are generally not recommended
<jtaylor> if you want to package seriously you must learn the command line tools
<codemaniac> jtaylor: i am quite familiar with linux commandline and native unix tools
<codemaniac> jtaylor: do i need to upgrade the server version to 12.10
<codemaniac> precise has been installed over it right now
<jtaylor> codemaniac: no, you can use pbuilder-dist to create 12.10 working environment
<jtaylor> pbuilder-dist quantal amd64 create
<codemaniac> jtaylor: wow , sounds like all set up to go , thanks i will drop by hee sometimes
<codemaniac> s/hee/here
<codemaniac> i would also like to subscribe for the mailing-list
<Rhonda> If cousteau comes around again, I am not responsible for the uptime of the system, only for the codebase. :)
<Rhonda> Ah, xnox jumped in.
<xnox> Rhonda: I remember somebody came back from vacation and was replying to backlogs
<nigelb> Rhonda: Oh, you own that codebase now?
<xnox> "pers-1: oh this is a horrible bug", half an hour later "pers-2: oooh this might fix", 10 minutes later "pers-3: thanks for taking care of that"
<xnox> almost wants me to say read *all* the scrollback before replying =)
<Rhonda> nigelb: Who "owns" a git repository? :)
<nigelb> heh
<nigelb> whoever has a last commit? :D
<Rhonda> But I have access to deploy on the system, if that's what you mean.
<xnox> Rhonda: ooh it's back! =)
<Rhonda> That's neither my fault, xnox ;)
<cousteau> this is UNFAIR!
<cousteau> why was the package nvidia-173 fixed but not nvidia-96?
<cousteau> (and, could it be fixed in the same way the -173 was?)
<xnox> cousteau: what do you mean by "fixed"?
<xnox> cousteau: marked to be incompatible?
<cousteau> xnox, a broken dependency has been replaced by a working one
<cousteau> xorg-video-abi-10 by xorg-video-abi-11
<cousteau> (I think)
<cousteau> ps: I'm talking about precise
<cousteau> (not sure if this was fixed quite long ago)
<Rhonda> cousteau: Hey.  Btw., I can do nothing about server not reachable or down.  I am only behind the codebase tinkering. :)
<Rhonda> I'm not in the canonical sysadmin team (unfortunately)
<cousteau> ok, good to know...  thanks anyway  :)
 * ajmitch looks up & sees complaints about binary drivers
 * xnox .oO(the complaints look down on ajmitch)
<ajmitch> probably
<ajmitch> it's not like we can do a lot about old binary drivers :)
<astraljava> I was really surprised to see that nouveau works very well on that one 3D game that I occasionally play. I'm happy to see that moving away from proprietary (totally) is again a little closer. :)
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-19
<ESphynx> âsup guys )
<micahg> ESphynx: sorry, trying to stick to more mainstream languages ATM :)
<micahg> ScottK: maybe, I certainly prefer Qt to GTK as I prefer C++ to C
<ScottK> micahg: Not everything required to run every script in ubuntu-dev-tools is a dependency of the packages (devscripts is similar) so I wouldn't let dependency weight on ubuntu-dev-tools influence your decision.
<micahg> ScottK: I assume it should be python based though to be able to be in there
<ScottK> You're more likely to get more help with maintenance and taking advantage of common code in there should be easier.
<ScottK> So not required, but I think it makes sense.
 * micahg has been wanting to do a pure Qt app for a while, but in the spirit of not bikeshedding, I think I should do it in PySomething
<ScottK> It's your bike shed to paint, so pick your color.
<JontheEchidna> just be careful that the local home owners association approves of your color choices ;-P
<JontheEchidna> (to bring the analogy to its aggrivating extreme)
<codemaniac> hello world
<JontheEchidna> hello
<codemaniac> what is the amount of primary memory i wlll require to build up a system for packaging Ubuntu ?
<codemaniac> would 512 megs be sufficient for building any packages ?
<micahg> sure, just not stuff like openoffice/chromium in any reasonable amount of time
<micahg> s/openoffice/libreoffice/
<JontheEchidna> firefox too. Last I heard linking the executable takes gigs of RAM to do
<codemaniac> JontheEchidna: ScottK any advice
<micahg> ah, yeah, maybe now it does
<ScottK> codemaniac: More is always better, but that's enough to do most things.
<JontheEchidna> I did packaging work for 2 years on a computer with 700 MB of RAM
<JontheEchidna> some larger stuff like Qt took 2 or 3 hours, but it got done
<ScottK> We build Qt for arm on 512MB systems and that's up there when it comes to package size.
<codemaniac> ScottK: thanks
<codemaniac> JontheEchidna: that sounds inspiring and i feel the adrenaline spikes in my system
<ScottK> IIRC the laptop I used in 2007/08 had 512MB of RAM and I could build almost everything.
<JontheEchidna> I had the computer with 700-something MB of RAM in '08 and '09
<codemaniac> i will be running a ubuntu server , and no GUI
<JontheEchidna> mine was running a GUI, so I'd imagine it would be comparable to your setup
<codemaniac> ScottK: how can i test if my packages work or not ?
<ScottK> Try it and see.
<ScottK> We build some pretty huge packages for arm on 512MB ram, so it should be fine with a few possible exceptions.
<codemaniac> ScottK: so in a server with no GUI ,m cannot i build QT/GTK packages ?
<ScottK> No.  It doesn't mean that.
<ScottK> You can install the packages for build, but not run the UI.  Two separate things.
<codemaniac> i can build but cannot test right ?
<codemaniac> ScottK: thanks for all the help :)
<ScottK> Right.
<xnox> codemaniac: you might struggle with very heavy c++ with many, many, many templates cause that requires a lot of memory due to regressions in gcc.
<xnox> codemaniac: but most of stuff will be fine =)
<codemaniac> xnox: as i am just beginning ubuntu packaging i will start with lightweight packages :)
<codemaniac> then gradually go up for tougher nuts with help of you guys
<codemaniac> :)
<xnox> codemaniac: we have plenty of packages, such that you will be able to help with heavy weight stuff as well =)
<ESphynx> micahg: I was teasing tenatively :P
<ESphynx> micahg: although I hope eC becomes more mainsteam and itâs then a great choice due to its low dependency requirements and lightness =)
<ESphynx> and ease of building GUIs...
<ESphynx> tell you what, if you ever need to build a new GUI tool for the R. R. release, Iâd volunteer to do up a prototype GUI in eC just to show you guys how great it is :P
<codemaniac> is there any forum for ubuntu motu devs ?
<ScottK> No.
<ScottK> As a general rule developers are allergic to the forums.  Most interactions are on IRC and via mailing lists.
<codemaniac> anyidea where dh_make is located ?
<codemaniac> which package do i need to install ?
<Laney> codemaniac: http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?searchon=contents&keywords=dh_make&mode=exactfilename&suite=quantal&arch=any â the packages.ubuntu.com website can answer such questions
<tumbleweed> or you can just type dh_make, and command-not-fonud will point you in the right direction
<Laney> or you can use apt-file
<tumbleweed> or axi-cache
<codemaniac> i thought it should have been included under packaging-dev .
<tumbleweed> it's in packaging-dev's Suggests
<codemaniac> it would have been a good idea to bundle up all the packaging weapons under"packaging-dev"
<codemaniac> tumbleweed: i have already installed i believe on my Ubuntu server
<tumbleweed> Suggests aren't installed by default
<codemaniac> tumbleweed: packaging-dev is there on my system
<codemaniac> thanks for the replies folks
<Laney> I just have a browser shortcut for that link I pasted you earlier
<Laney> possibly not very cool :(
<codemaniac> Laney: thanks , but i wanted to know the exact toolset you use as a MOTU . :)
<Laney> I just did let you know
<Laney> I would have done "up dh_make"
<Laney> :(
<Laney> bah, no publisher and no builds being dispatched?
 * ajmitch shrugs
<ajmitch> wouldn't surprise me if bits & pieces are still down
<wgrant> Laney: Hm, the publisher should be working. What's not published?
<wgrant> And builds should be being dispatched to the few builders that are alive
<Laney> wgrant: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libpst/+publishinghistory
<wgrant> i386 and amd64 are built
<Laney> all the distro builders are idle despite there being a queue
<Laney> yeah, but still pending
<wgrant> Right, but it's reasonably plausible that the publisher that started 5min ago isn't there yet
<Laney> wait, there is no queue on the arches that have buildds
<Laney> i see
<wgrant> Right
<wgrant> Nothing appears obviously wrong here
<wgrant> Except for the fact that 80% of the builders are still missing
<wgrant> And the publisher is possibly being a little slow, but we'll see in 5 minutes
<ricotz> hello everyone
<ricotz> wgrant, hi
<wgrant> (we don't have logs or metrics of any kind from the cocoplum replacement yet... stuff I have to arrange on Monday)
<ricotz> wgrant, is there anything you can do about those "psi-plus" builds?
<wgrant> Oh, I missed those in the sea of red
 * wgrant kills them
<wgrant> Thanks for pointing them out
<ricotz> wgrant,
<ricotz> thanks
<ricotz> same for libreoffice which run out of space
<wgrant> Hm, they're refusing to die.
<wgrant> OK, got some of them killed, but now they're having NTP issues.
<wgrant> Yay
<smartboyhw> Er, how do I upload a debian package?
<tumbleweed> smartboyhw: you mean upload *to* debian?
<tumbleweed> or sync from debian
<jtaylor> I'm guessing arm and ppc builds are still affected by the downtime? jobs are in a weird "Start" state
<jtaylor> oh all builders are disabled, that probably explains it
<micahg> jtaylor: it would appear the builders haven't been brought back to life yet
<g4m30v3r> can someone help me with something
<micahg> !ask | g4m30v3r
<ubottu> g4m30v3r: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) See also !patience
<g4m30v3r> i need to learn how to install downloaded items and programs off the internet
<tumbleweed> g4m30v3r: this isn't a support channel
<micahg> g4m30v3r: you want #ubuntu then (I assume you're on a stable release)
<g4m30v3r> im on 12.04 and im new im sorry i dont know the channels
<micahg> tumbleweed: I'd like to say the same for -release FWIW
<tumbleweed> micahg: yeah, I'm about to have enough of that
 * tumbleweed gets on with being productive instead
<g4m30v3r> so i want to type in /join #ubuntu? then
<micahg> yeah
<g4m30v3r> ok ty
<micahg> xnox: heh, we collided on ztex-bmp, you won :)
<xnox> micahg: =))))
<xnox> micahg: well you stole fftw3 from me ;-)
<micahg> heh
<xnox> micahg: i asked Logan_ to apply for motu
<Logan_> oh hey
<xnox> micahg: http://ubuntu-dev.alioth.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu-sponsorships.cgi?render=html&sponsor=&sponsor_search=name&sponsoree=Logan+Rosen&sponsoree_search=name
<xnox> is pretty long
<micahg> xnox: he doesn't have the sustained commitment yet, we usually like to see people go through a whole release cycle first
<xnox> micahg: is that so =) ok.
<xnox> Logan_: are you planning to eventually become MOTU / core-dev though?
<Logan_> possibly, if I have the time commitment
<tumbleweed> we don't require any time commitment, just sustained contribution
 * tumbleweed has been fairly MIA for the last month. But busy working on that... :P
<xnox> Logan_: you can apply for contributing developer and get Ubuntu Membership and @ubuntu.com
<Logan_> I have been considering that, yes
<tumbleweed> xnox: sustained contribution is a requirement for membership
<Logan_> is there a way to get +localpackagediffs to show Sid versions instead of Wheezy versions?
<tumbleweed> Logan_: no
<xnox> Logan_: no. because quantal got initialised as derivative of wheezy.
<Logan_> are there any external tools that will compare Quantal versions with Sid versions?
<Logan_> besides the possible RC bugs thing on ubuntuwire, which only shows serious/grave fixes
<tumbleweed> multidistrotools on ubuntuwire?
<tumbleweed> also, of course, merges.ubuntu.com
<Logan_> mdt compares to Wheezy as well
<tumbleweed> ah, right
<tumbleweed> sid and wheezy should be fairly similar atm, though
<tumbleweed> people are encouraged not to upload new crack to sid during the freeze
<Logan_> true
<Logan_> also
<Logan_> what is the preferred way to request that packages be removed from the Ubuntu repositories?
<Logan_> do you subscribe the Ubuntu Package Archive team?
<xnox> Logan_: sponsors first, then we subscribe Archive team.
<micahg> Logan_: if you have upload rights for the package in question yes, otherwise ubuntu-sponsors
<Logan_> ok
<Logan_> another question - if I'm creating a Ubuntu delta, do I change Uploaders to XSBC-Original-Uploaders?
<tumbleweed> Logan_: run update-maintainer
<tumbleweed> when we change a package we only change the Maintainer field, not Uploaders
<Logan_> ok
<verwilst> hello
<verwilst> i have 2 build jobs in my ppa that have been waiting to be built since 9 hours ago, and still it's waiting
<verwilst> is there a problem with the build servers?
<micahg> verwilst: backlog due to the datacenter move
<verwilst> ok, makes sense, thanks micahg :)
<verwilst> micahg, it will start in 2 days so it seems.. :P
<micahg> well, the build farm isn't completely back yet
<ajmitch> at least there's more than 1 or 2 ppa buildds at the moment :)
#ubuntu-motu 2013-08-12
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Morning dholbach.
<Noskcaj> Afternoon dholbach
<Noskcaj> Does anyone know when we can expect automake1.14 in ubuntu?
<geser> Noskcaj: we could sync it once it's in Debian sid (it isn't there yet and assuming it's not too late to sync it)
 * Noskcaj wonders how hard it would be to package it. probably very
<dholbach> hi iulian, hey Noskcaj
 * Noskcaj rage quits packaging gthumb
<geser> a new version of gthumb?
<Noskcaj> geser, 3.2.3 instead of 3.0.*. I'm meant to be adopting it (in debian) but the package fefuses to play nice
<Noskcaj> *refuses
<geser> ah, :(
<geser> and you need a more recent automake for it? it doesn't work with automake 1.13?
<Noskcaj> geser, it does, i just kept getting a strange error saying it needed 1.14. That's fixed and it fails somewhere else
<geser> can you pastebin the error message you get?
<Noskcaj> yeah, sure. just let me undo all of my failed attempts at fixing it
<Noskcaj> One other question. What is the recommended way of merging stuff now? I've tried MoM, UDD, and manually packaging.
<geser> what works best for you and the package you are merging
<Noskcaj> ok
<Noskcaj> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5976391/ is the last 250 lines of the debuild output for gthumb
<geser> "Makefile:564: *** missing separator.  Stop." Can you pastebin the Makefile too?
<Noskcaj> Makefile, Makefile.am or makefile.in ?
<geser> The Makefile for now as I want to know what is around line 564 it complains about
<Noskcaj> geser, http://pastebin.com/ywcAXY9Z
<Noskcaj> 564 says "          empty_fix=; \" without the quotation marks
<geser> do you also have a help/Makefile?
<geser> as make was "Making all in help"
<Noskcaj> geser, http://pastebin.com/3yZQNLbc
<geser> "@YELP_HELP_RULES@" looks like the problem
<Noskcaj> ok
<Noskcaj> On another topic, the debian gzip bzr branch doesn't have 1.6 even though it's on unstable
<geser> Noskcaj: I guess you need "yelp-tools" to resolve that substitution
<Noskcaj> ok, i'll try that then see if it needs to be a dependency
<geser> the package importer failed for gzip: http://package-import.ubuntu.com/status/gzip.html
<Noskcaj> geser, debuild clean now works, but debuild still doesn't
<geser> same error or different?
<Noskcaj> different
<Noskcaj> i'll investigate myself for a while
<Noskcaj> I can't understand the new error either, it's at http://paste.ubuntu.com/5976481/
<geser> sorry, I'm not very familiar with automake/autoconfig
<Noskcaj> ok
<jtaylor> hm its trying to regenerate in make clean
<jtaylor> it normally does that if maintainer mode is enabled and the timestamps don't match
<jtaylor> don'T know how to prevent that
<Noskcaj> I've just merged gzip and added dholbach's autopkgtests, can someone take a look? https://code.launchpad.net/~noskcaj/ubuntu/saucy/gzip/1.6/+merge/179658
<Noskcaj> infinity, Do you mind if i try and merge dpkg?
<Noskcaj> infinity, never mind, there seems to be a small regression
<infinity> Noskcaj: Pretty please, don't merge it.  I'll get to it when we're ready.
#ubuntu-motu 2013-08-13
<Noskcaj> mfisch, Do you mind if i try and merge PopCon?
<dholbach> good morning
<Noskcaj> afternoon dholbach
<dholbach> hi Noskcaj
<Noskcaj> I've got 10 packages on debian mentors, most of which fix bugs in ubuntu but are currently syncs. What do you recommend i do? (none have conflicts or regressions
<Noskcaj> )
<Noskcaj> correction. 8 packages
<dholbach> if you feel they're important enough to get them in now rather than waiting, upload them as "-(n-1)ubuntu1" versions to Ubuntu (a opposed to -"n")
<dholbach> you can then still sync them later on
<Noskcaj> dholbach, i'll look into if any are worth that. thanks
<dholbach> cool
<Noskcaj> also, i got gzip to version 1.6
<Noskcaj> any idea when slangasek will be online so he can check it?
<Noskcaj> dholbach, Why, when you merge package updates, do you not mark the branch as merged? Not saying it's wrong, just asking why
<dholbach> Noskcaj, I usually mark them as merged as soon as it lands in saucy itself
<Noskcaj> ok
<slangasek> Noskcaj: hmm?  check what?
<Noskcaj> slangasek, i uploaded a branch with gzip 1.6 for saucy
<Noskcaj> I have to go now though, and won't be back till 2000UTC
<slangasek> Noskcaj: if you want me to review it, please raise an MP and set me as reviewer
 * mfisch wonders what Noskcaj's email is
 * mfisch emails him
<Noskcaj> slangasek, gzip is at https://code.launchpad.net/~noskcaj/ubuntu/saucy/gzip/1.6 if you want to have a look
<mapreri> Hi! quickly information: is "Closes LP: #1211069" in a changelog a valid way to automatically close a bug? (usually I put it in brackets, so I'm not sure)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1211069 in tuxpaint (Ubuntu) "Please merge tuxpaint (0.9.21-1.1) for Debian unstable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1211069
<Noskcaj> mapreri, It might work (i don't know), but the best way is to use --fixes=lp:123456
<Noskcaj> when you commit
<mapreri> Noskcaj: sorry, but I'm not deeply involved in the package part of Ubuntu. What do you mean with "when you commit"? I have to do a debdiff to attach to the bug, and a motu my frind will review and upload it, I don't make a branch
<Noskcaj> mapreri, ok. when you commit was with bzr. Attaching a debdiff to the relevant bug should bbe enough
<mapreri> Noskcaj: ok, thanks
<Unit193> mapreri: http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/fixing-a-bug-example.html#documenting-the-fix
<mapreri> Unit193: so, I have to put it in brackets?
<mapreri> have I*
<Unit193> mapreri: It would appear to be common syntax: "Fixed typo in inet(3) (closes: Bug#370277)"
<mapreri> Unit193: yes, but my changelog is http://paste.ubuntu.com/5982671/ and put the brackets is will look ugly
<Unit193> mapreri: I see, and personally agree, but I mainly follow the Debian guide.  My package that closed the ITP did not have them.
<mapreri> Unit193: FYI I've just recalled the fact that in the changes file there is a field "Launchpad-Bugs-Fixed:", I check and it's filled correctly
<mapreri> So, it's fine :)
#ubuntu-motu 2013-08-14
<dholbach> good morning
<Noskcaj> I just merged an RC bug fix, can someone review? https://code.launchpad.net/~noskcaj/ubuntu/saucy/i7z/i7z/+merge/180258
#ubuntu-motu 2013-08-15
<Rhonda> mapreri: Well, it's not clear from your changelog which of the changes arctually are the ones related to the closes line.  The closes line should be next to the specific changelog entry.
<Rhonda> mapreri: That's actually the main reason why the closes: is expected in brackets, because it's meant to be written next to the corresponding changelog entry. :)
<Unit193> http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/developers-reference/pkgs.html#upload-bugfix
<mfisch> Noskcaj: I commented on your i7z merge
<Noskcaj> mfisch, I've uploaded a fixed version. The RC bug is not reported in ubuntu, but is shown in the debian part of the changelog
<xequence> Hi. Could someone please help review this LP: #1209414
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1209414 in Ubuntu Studio saucy-13.10 "ubuntustudio-installer needs packaging" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1209414
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Morning dholbach.
<smartboyhw> iulian, any time to help us review Bug #1209414?
<ubottu> bug 1209414 in Ubuntu Studio saucy-13.10 "ubuntustudio-installer needs packaging" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1209414
<dholbach> hi iulian
<smartboyhw> Or maybe dholbach can do it:P
<mapreri> Rhonda: I hacked the changelog a bit before uploading, putting it in brackets: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tuxpaint/1:0.9.21-1.1ubuntu1 In this way is much clearer
<Rhonda> mapreri: So that makes it clear that the bug closes the merge request.  Thanks. :)
<mapreri> Rhonda: Now I would like update the debian package too, the pts is quite a shame.... :\ I'm wondering why the maintainer doesn't take care of such a simple thing
<Rhonda> There might be multiple reasons, you have no insight into private issues of people.
<Munksgaard> Hi, I'm trying to create a package for my ppa, but I'm unsure what I should put in the Section part of the control file. If I just leave it out, launchpad rejects my dput.
<geser> see the list at http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-archive.html#s-subsections for possible values and pick the one which matches the software you package
<Munksgaard> geser: So this is a compiler/interpreter, so I guess It'd just go in devel ?
<geser> yes, devel seems to be correct
<micahg> coolbhavi: you have time to look as a second reviewer on a package for upload to saucy quickly?   it's for Ubuntu Studio
<coolbhavi> yes micahg
<coolbhavi> link pls
<micahg> Bug #1209414
<ubottu> bug 1209414 in Ubuntu Studio saucy-13.10 "ubuntustudio-installer needs packaging" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1209414
<coolbhavi> sure thanks ll have a look
<micahg> thanks
<coolbhavi> nm
<coolbhavi> micahg, just had a look everything seems fine test build in progress
<micahg> coolbhavi: I noticed after  I gave it to you it seems to be missing a policy file
<coolbhavi> d/changelog needs target change to saucy
<coolbhavi> policy file?
<micahg> yeah, it uses pkexec, so it needs a policy file to decide when to allow that and how
<coolbhavi> ah I dint build it wait
<coolbhavi> yes
<mfisch> micahg: sorry I missed seeing that change upsteram
<micahg> mfisch: it happens :)
<micahg> coolbhavi: ok, just spoke with OvenWerks, policy file isn't an issue, how did the package work out for you?
<coolbhavi> micahg, package is fine except that
<ChogyDan> general question, is there a need for more packagers?
<Noskcaj> slangasek, I've just got autoconf merged from debian. do you have to to upload it to the archive?
<micahg> Noskcaj: are you asking the person who touched something last before merging things?
<Noskcaj> micahg, that's what i just did.
<micahg> Noskcaj: no, that's asking after you merge something
<Noskcaj> micahg, i meant i've done the work, i've not uploaded or anything
<micahg> Noskcaj: yes, I understand, you're supposed to ask before you do the work to prevent duplication of work and/or wastes of time
<Noskcaj> micahg, ok
<micahg> Noskcaj: don't worry, there's plenty of work to go around :)
<Noskcaj> :)
#ubuntu-motu 2013-08-16
<dholbach> good morning
<Noskcaj> slangasek, PING
<sil2100> Hello everyone!
<Noskcaj> hey sil2100
<sil2100> I am looking for someone who would help us getting a new package into universe
<sil2100> It's a package that will be required by a new unity scope and some touch apps as well
<sil2100> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1212993
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1212993 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] Mediascanner" [Undecided,New]
<sil2100> The packaging is prepared, reviewed
<sil2100> We will be daily-releasing it in our infrastructure in the nearest future, but we'd like to at least get the first version into Ubuntu the normal way
<sil2100> (since FF is getting near)
<Laney> sil2100: I suggest you subscribe ubuntu-sponsors and ping a patch pilot when they show up (if it's that urgent, otherwise wait for a sponsor to get to it normally)
<Noskcaj> sil2100, i don't have merge powers, but some tips. 1. Get the package completely liintian clean. 2. Get the copyright file in the official debian format. 3. Upload the package to debian and ubuntu, so that it can eventually be a merge. 4. Make sure the package builds in a clean environment
<sil2100> Noskcaj: well, this package will be Ubuntu-specific, so I don't suppose Debian would be interested in getting it in ;) It builds cleanly and follows our packaging guidelines pretty well
<sil2100> Laney: ok, will do that
<sil2100> freeflying: hi!
<sil2100> freeflying: ikepanhc told me you would be able to push our package into universe if anything
<sil2100> freeflying: here's the packaging bug with all the branches and PPA's:
<sil2100> freeflying: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1212993
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1212993 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] Mediascanner" [Undecided,New]
<sil2100> freeflying: I had to merge in one more commit so that the version number is more correct, that's why I'm pinging just now
<sil2100> dholbach: hi! Not sure how busy you are, but maybe you could upload my NEW package? ;)
<sil2100> dholbach: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1212993
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1212993 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] Mediascanner" [Undecided,New]
<sil2100> Looking for anyone who could help
<dholbach> sil2100I'll have a look in a bit
<sil2100> dholbach: thank you :)
<sil2100> dholbach: I also asked kenvandine, but he's also busy with some near-deadline stuff as well
#ubuntu-motu 2013-08-17
<Rhonda> Before anyone asks - yes, I have intentionally b0rked packages.ubuntu.com right now.
<iulian> Oh no!
<Rhonda> Don't act like you would have noticed it if I didn't state it. ;)
<iulian> Well, you got me here...
<Rhonda> Hah.  Someone noticed.  And actually is someone who is here at debconf  \o/
<Rhonda> (no, it's not Laney)
<Laney> how do you know? :P
<Rhonda> Are you a split personality to use different nicks on IRC at the same time? :)
<Rhonda> No juding involved, just curious.
<Laney> aha
<Laney> I guessed you were checking in logs
<Rhonda> Nope, someone sent me an irc query. :)
<Rhonda> Sometimes you must break stuff to know whether there is actually still people using it, don't you.
<Rhonda> huhm
<Rhonda> yay
<Rhonda> saucy packages!
<Rhonda> Gosh, answering mails from may seems strange â¦
<tumbleweed> if you like that kind of thing, I have a pile of e-mail from the last few years that I need to reply to :P
<iulian> tumbleweed: I think you can easily ignore those. :)
<tumbleweed> that's theplan
<Rhonda> tumbleweed: It's all Laney's fault, he didn't pester me enough about the issue. :)
<Noskcaj> Can someone please look at gnome-codec-install? i am not sure if it can be a merge now
#ubuntu-motu 2013-08-18
<slangasek> Noskcaj: hi, so is there a bug open in the Debian BTS for the remaining delta on autoconf?
<slangasek> Noskcaj: also, I've been at DebConf all week, no need to ping so loudly :)
<Noskcaj> slangasek, sorry, and i don't know
<slangasek> Noskcaj: well, can you please follow through on this as part of the merging, so that next time neither of us has to worry about the delta but can sync it instead? :)
<Noskcaj> The debian guy did say he'd finally have time to get time to update this week. And i'll do that now
<Noskcaj> slangasek, Do you have any idea why that patch still exists? I can't find a bug for it or a why we need it
#ubuntu-motu 2014-08-11
<[ESphynx]> hey guys, I'm hitting this extremely annoying hang which seems to be new...
<[ESphynx]> https://gist.github.com/anonymous/cbcac0e6413fc30d6a75  calling XCreateIC seems to jam
<dholbach> good morning
<picca> Hello, I am the DD of the tango package. the 14.04 version is affected by this debian bug #743508, which was fixed in the 8.1.2c+dfsg-5 version. I would like an update of this package in 14.04. Is is possible ?
<ubottu> Debian bug 743508 in libzmq3 "libzmq3: upgrading from 3.2.3 to 4.0.4 breaks python-pytango" [Normal,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/743508
<jtaylor> picca: sure if you have  patch
<picca> hello julian, which can of patch do you need, the version I would like uploaded to 14.04 is the current developpement version
<jtaylor> the whole version?
<jtaylor> that somewhat depends on the size of the diff
<picca> Yes, is adds two patches from the upstream, and also this fix  #657146
<jtaylor> the upgrade procedure is described here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<jtaylor> first we need the fixed version in utopic (dev release)
<picca> utopic already contain the right version
<jtaylor> oh tango, I looked at pytango
<picca> In fact the problem is in the tango library, not in the python binding
<picca> the real problem is with zeromq3 4.0.4., but tango upstream provided a patch which fix this bad interaction
<picca> 14.04 is affected because zeromq is the 4.0.4 version...
<jtaylor> file a bug with a minimal debdiff and I'll see to uploading it
<jtaylor> bug description should have a testcase as described in thewiki
<picca> I do not have an ubuntu machine, I can open a bug from the we interface ?
<picca> the wiki is StableReleaseUpdates previour link right ?
<jtaylor> yes
<jtaylor> there is a webinterface
<jtaylor> do you have a launchpad account?
<picca> yes
<picca> ok, I filled a bug but I do not have the debdiff now Bug #1355394 , I need more time to build the -3 -> -5 debdiff
<ubottu> bug 1355394 in tango (Ubuntu) "please upgrade 14.04 with the 8.1.2c+dfsg-5 version" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1355394
<jtaylor> picca: the backportpackage script from ubuntu-dev-tools should give you a start to work with
<jtaylor> should also work in debian
<picca> ok I will try, thanks
<picca> jtaylor: I attached something to the bug, can you check that it is ok
<jtaylor> not really, you would need to debdiff the trusty package against the backport
<jtaylor> and then the backport is not yet a proper backport though in this case probably just some minor adjustments are required
<jtaylor> oh some stuff is renamed in the package, that should not be part of the sru
<picca> so I miss used the backportpackahe script...
<jtaylor> no the debdiff
<jtaylor> actually I'd probably skip the unowned file backport
<jtaylor> doesn't seem important enough
<jtaylor> only the zmq fix should be fine
<jtaylor> picca: why was --disable-static added to rules?
<picca> to reduce the compilation time, I do not install the static library
<picca> so in fact the important point is just to add the two upstream pacthes and that's all
<jtaylor> yes
<jtaylor> I can do so, seems simple enough
<jtaylor> picca: your testcase does not run
<jtaylor> I need to do some setup first?
<picca> you need to install first a mysql-server
<picca> then the tango-db package, which should start a tango database usign the tango user
<picca> during the configuration it should ask for the TANGO_HOST
<picca> normally this should be ok if you use the default value
<picca> then you install python-pytango
<picca> and at last you should try the python snipset furnish by the bug reporter
<jtaylor> mh now how do I get a mysql server to start in a chroot
<picca> this is a problem indeed...
<picca> Is it possible to start the mysql-server outside the chroot and mont the mysql socket inside the chroot ?
<jtaylor> ok I think I got it to work
<jtaylor> its now hanging as expected
<jtaylor> lets see if my debdiff fixes it (still building)
<picca> thanks :)
<jtaylor> picca: are there upstream bug logs?
<jtaylor> not sure how p812_3 is related
<jtaylor> the sleep in the connect is also dodgy
<picca> http://sourceforge.net/p/tango-cs/bugs/662/
<picca> p 812_3 is not related, but it is better to provide all the upstream pacth available. upstream produce a few hotfix for a release, usually they are  important
<jtaylor> ok the patches fixed the hang but I get: 2014-08-11 20:19:37.923333 SYS/DATABASE/2 STATE CHANGE [API_AttributePollingNotStarted] The polling (necessary to send events) for the attribute state is not started
<picca> I will ask the main bug reporter what is the expected result of the method. I updatethe bug report with your informations
<jtaylor> is there a testsuite that can be run to check its working?
<picca> not yet, I asked the upstream for a test suite, but it is not yet part of tango source package. I filled a bug for this.
<picca> Now the problem is that they are using a dedicated mysql-server with pre-filled tables for the test
<picca> so I need a script which populate this database.
<picca> It would be a nice test case for debci :)
<picca> b
<picca> from what I know about tango it seems to me that the return values are ok, the state attribut is a special one and users need to configure specially the polling of this attribute, to obtain events
<picca> the -5 version is working on my machine, but indeed I would be nuch confident If I would have a test suite... maybe one day
<jtaylor> do you get the same message?
<picca> this is strange on my debian unstable it does not work ???
<picca> I do not have the output message
<picca> ouf I got it >>> id = dev.subscribe_event("state", PyTango.EventType.CHANGE_EVENT, cb, [], True)
<picca> >>> 2014-08-11 22:43:09.745188 SYS/DATABASE/2 STATE CHANGE [API_AttributePollingNotStarted] The polling (necessary to send events) for the attribute state is not started
<jtaylor> I also get it in stable without zmq
<jtaylor> so its probably fine
<picca> Yes in stable I never activated the event system... whcih require a non maintained library omninotify
<jtaylor> picca: I uploaded it to -proposed
<picca> thanks a lot for your efforts
<picca> also for ipython ;)
<jtaylor> should have probably looked at it better earlier
<jtaylor> I knew of the bug before trusty was released
<jtaylor> but for some reason I though trusty is not affected
<Logan_> Noskcaj: stealing my syncs, I see :P
<jtaylor> must have been before zeromq4 landed
<jtaylor> or me just being stupid :)
<Noskcaj> Logan_, Saves you work
<jtaylor> mh, right I still wanted to fix gccs sanatizers :/
<picca> To my opinion zeromq3 should be reverted to the lastest 3.2.4 version and a new zeromq4 should be introduce...
<jtaylor> probably
<jtaylor> but its too late now
<jtaylor> debian would probably prefer to only ship one zmq and thus remove 2 and 3
<picca> Indeed, it would be nice to have only once version of zeromq
<picca> but the zeromq maintainer does not seems to be very active.
<jtaylor> I'm still waiting for sodium to finally get uploaded so I can build pyzmq with encryption
<jtaylor> there seems to be some progress on that now
<picca> have a good night, and thanks again for your help
#ubuntu-motu 2014-08-12
<dholbach> good morning
<ginggs_> Hi all.  I subscribed ubuntu-sponsors to LP: #1311975 and LP: #1354704, but I'd really like someone to review these two debdiffs before I upload them, please.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1311975 in ocl-icd (Ubuntu Trusty) "ocl-icd-libopencl1 should conflicts,replaces nvidia-opencl-dev not nvidia-libopencl1-dev" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1311975
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1354704 in traceroute (Ubuntu Trusty) " traceroute --mtu doesn't work on recent kernels" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1354704
<rbasak> ginggs_: for bug 1354704, in general a backport of a newer upstream release is not acceptable, because they contain unrelated changes, carry more regression risk and are harder for the SRU team to review.
<ubottu> bug 1354704 in traceroute (Ubuntu Trusty) " traceroute --mtu doesn't work on recent kernels" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1354704
<rbasak> From https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Procedure: "...the patch in the bug report, a detailed and user-readable changelog, and no other unrelated changes."
<rbasak> Your debdiff has many unrelated changes.
<rbasak> I can't speak for the SRU team, but I think it's unlikely they'll accept your debdiff as-is.
<rbasak> If you want to fix --mtu only (as this is the bug), then best to cherry-pick that particular fix from upstream VCS.
<ginggs_> rbasak: thanks. yes, I understand that this is not usual, but there weren't many changes from 2.0.19 to 2.0.20, and no new features.
<rbasak> ginggs_: well, you can upload and see what the SRU team say. At a minimum I'd at least explain that you understand it's not unusually and provide your justification, though.
<ginggs_> rbasak: thanks, i'll explain in more detail.  if the upload is rejected, won't that prevent further uploads with a lower version number?
<rbasak> ginggs_: no - the upload doesn't "count" until it's accepted (in this case by the SRU team).
<ginggs_> rbasak: ok, that's good.  thanks again!
<Zhenech> 1/wi3
#ubuntu-motu 2014-08-13
<dholbach> good morning
<Rhonda> http://paste.debian.net/115314/ - sometimes I love comments in code.  Sometimes I don't.
<SirDMZ> greetings, i appear to have forgotten how edit-patch works. so i extracted the orig and the ubuntu diff. all in the right places, then went edit-patch 98-something. it spat out 2 normalizng lines and no patches applied... it then dumped me back to the regular shell notthe patching shell. any ideas?
#ubuntu-motu 2014-08-14
<dholbach> good morning
<Unit193> Howdy.
<Laney> "No module named backends.file"
<Laney> what happened to python-keyring?
<Laney> aha, â keyring.backends...
#ubuntu-motu 2014-08-15
<dholbach> good morning
<ESphynx> good morning dholbach ;) you're up early today :)
<dholbach> hi ESphynx
<ESphynx> dholbach: finally released this new version of the SDK!
<dholbach> eh?
<ESphynx> dholbach: ecere-sdk that is
<ESphynx> still in the mentors queue though, I assume xnox is busy :|
<dholbach> ahhh ok
<sao> hey can someone have a look at the merge request https://code.launchpad.net/~diodon-team/diodon/new-upstream-release-1.2.0/+merge/229496 ? Would be great if it could be merged before feature freeze.
#ubuntu-motu 2014-08-16
<a_cotrim> Greetings.
<sney> hi
<a_cotrim> I believe I may have uploaded a package to archive.ubuntu.com by mistake, due to a misconfiguration on my end. I am not officially the maintainer of said package. Do I need to make a request for the package to be removed from the archive?
<a_cotrim> If so, how do I do it, and to whom?
<a_cotrim> Any help is appreciated, and thanks in advance.
<Unit193> Are you an official Ubuntu dev or MOTU?  What package?
<a_cotrim> I am neither. Package is mednafen, version 0.9.36.3, arch amd64.
<Unit193> If you are neither, you likely got a rejection email from "Ubuntu installer".
<a_cotrim> Not yet, I believe. That may still happen though.
<a_cotrim> I have corrected my configuration, having pbuilder point to 127.0.0.1 instead. I am still learning how to build Debian packages and gaining understanding of what each tool involved in this process does.
<a_cotrim> For this one my objective was to compile a program from source once and have a package that I can install/uninstall cleanly to/from any system anytime.
<sney> #debian-mentors on irc.oftc.net might be a useful channel for you to idle in, contrary to the name it's an appropriate learning resource for anyone making debian packages, even for derivatives
<Unit193> Quite so, good place for packaging questions if you get stuck.
<a_cotrim> Thanks!
<Unit193> And as far as uploading to Ubuntu, if you haven't specifically been given permission, then it won't let you upload anyway.
<a_cotrim> I did this while following this tutorial: http://www.webupd8.org/2010/01/how-to-create-deb-package-ubuntu-debian.html. The part that suggests a "upload" comes from the output of the dpkg-buildpackage command.
<sney> normally it'd be debuild for an actual official upload. that's a pretty old howto, too
<sney> http://mentors.debian.net/intro-maintainers section 3 on this page has some good authoritative resources
<a_cotrim> I'll be sure to check it out. Not that I have anything to officially propose for integration into a distribution right now, but what brought me here (and what took me there) is that I want to learn how to do it the right way.
<a_cotrim> Once again, thanks!
<sney> np
#ubuntu-motu 2015-08-10
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2015-08-11
<dholbach> good morning
<bohrmeista> hello
<bohrmeista> I was wondering why SSLv3 is still used in the current OpenSMTPD package of Ubuntu 14.04
<bohrmeista> and figured it can only be changed at compile time
<jpds> I think most people use postfix
<bohrmeista> still, it might be worth changing for security purposes
<rbasak> bohrmeista: it's in universe so it's out of Canonical's security team's remit. But if somebody wants to submit a suitable update, they'll review and sponsor it. You can coordinate with them in #ubuntu-hardened to discuss proposed fixes, etc.
<rbasak> It might be worth looking at what the Debian maintainer of the package thinks is appropriate too.
<rbasak> Keep in mind that we don't want to regress users of the stable release either by recommending an update to them that will break things.
<rbasak> So it's a tough balance that needs to be struck.
<bohrmeista> I see, thanks for the answer
#ubuntu-motu 2015-08-12
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2015-08-13
<dholbach> good morning
<bluesabre> hello motus, would anybody be interested in reviewing/possibly approving https://bugs.launchpad.net/xfpanel-switch/+bug/1484478 for wily?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1484478 in Xfce Panel Switch "ITP: xfpanel-switch -- layout manager for the Xfce panel" [Wishlist,In progress]
<bluesabre> the xubuntu team is interested in shipping this package if possible
<bluesabre> I'll be out most of the day, but ochosi should be able to answer any questions in my stead
<ochosi> o/
<AndrewGee> Hi all, how do I work out why a package isn't being copied over from debian sid to wily?
#ubuntu-motu 2015-08-14
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2015-08-16
<Adri2000> hi
<Adri2000> quick question, REVU is dead right? not used anymore? I stumbled upon it in dput.cf...
<Unit193> Yes.
<Logan> hi Unit193
<Unit193> Hello, Logan.
#ubuntu-motu 2016-08-15
<alan_g> Hi, I'm looking for advice on getting lp:miral added to archive, have I come to the right place?
#ubuntu-motu 2016-08-18
<msbrogli> Hi! I found a bug in exim4 4.87-3ubuntu1, and I already have the patch to fix it. But Iâve read the Ubuntu Packaging Guide and I still cannot branch the source package. Would anyone help me? The URL of the package is: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/yakkety/+source/exim4
<msbrogli> Iâve tried `bzr lp:exim`, but it gets the wrong package. When I try `bzr lp:yakkety/exim`, it says invalid url supplied to transport.
<msbrogli> Anyone?
#ubuntu-motu 2017-08-15
<Unit193> willdeberry: You get LP figured out?
<willdeberry> Unit193: not yet :(
<willdeberry> i have an email going but no resolution yet
<willdeberry> they found that my account wasn't fully activated and fixed that, but still doesn't let me log in
<willdeberry> i told them to nuke the account so i could start over
<Unit193> I'm entirely unable to create build chroots for artful now. :/
<willdeberry> that's no good
<Unit193> No, it's not.  But at least no issues with unstable, so I guess between zesty and unstable chroots test builds will be "good enough"
#ubuntu-motu 2017-08-16
<willdeberry> Unit193: you use those chroots for building purposes i assume?
<Unit193> Yes sir, I use pbuilder for test builds (or builds to go to my own repo.)
<Unit193> ..Or to test new packages.
<willdeberry> makes sense
<willdeberry> i am used to git buildpackage being the wrapper for pbuilder and cowbuilder :)
<Unit193> I have a nice pbuilderrc that I use instead.
<willdeberry> not sure if you use anything like jenkins for CI, but this has come in handy for scripting package building https://github.com/mika/jenkins-debian-glue. also i am sure you being a real ubuntu dev, have better toolage for most things :)
<Unit193> I don't personally use jenkins, and I'm not sure I count as 'real ubuntu dev' but thanks. :)
<willdeberry> you are more real than me, so from my POV, you count lol
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: I've actually been looking for something like that :P  Thank you!
<willdeberry> :D
<willdeberry> it's proven well for my work at least. and i believe it can even be used outside of jenkins since it is a library of scripts
<willdeberry> Unit193: finally can access my lp account :)
<willdeberry> will hopefully be diving into some merges tonight
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: :D
<willdeberry> should be interesting dealing with merges though
<willdeberry> i have to fill out stuff on the snappy forum to deal with other issues. so already looking like an ubuntu type of night
#ubuntu-motu 2017-08-17
<willdeberry> tsimonq2: around by chance?
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Yep :)
<willdeberry> just wanted to run things by you if you don't mind. filed my first bug and added to comment on MoM: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/scim-chewing/+bug/1711263
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1711263 in scim-chewing (Ubuntu) "Please merge scim-chewing 0.5.1-2 from debian unstable" [Undecided,New]
<willdeberry> figured when the comment in MoM says, feel free to take, could be a good one to start at :P
<willdeberry> I resolved all the conflicts, updated the changelog. uploaded to ppa and tested installation and package management
<willdeberry> generated the diff and created ticket
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Uploading several things and my connection is garbage atm, talk in like 10 mins :)
<willdeberry> rgr
<willdeberry> i see a couple more adjustments i can make, so that's fine
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: "Closes:" should be "LP:" and I typically put that before the ":"
<willdeberry> rgr, will make the adjustment
<tsimonq2> (actually, I'd do "Merge from Debian unstable (LP: #1234567). Remaining changes:")
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1234567 in GNU Mailman "Czech catalog bug" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1234567
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Also, in my experience sponsors like looking at a diff from the Debian revision, not the last Ubuntu one. :)
<tsimonq2> i.e. what you have in debian-diff.patch
<willdeberry> docs said to include both if sponsorship was needed, but i can include just the one if you think it is better
<tsimonq2> Yeah
<tsimonq2> I just don't bother with the debdiff from the last Ubuntu revision
<tsimonq2> Like I said, sponsors are OK with the diff from Debian.
<willdeberry> sounds good to me
<willdeberry> less work ;)
<willdeberry> attachments have been updated and pruned
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Also, please carefully look at REPORT
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: debian/patches/series.UBUNTU shouldn't stay like that
<tsimonq2> It should just be debian/patches/series
<willdeberry> right. i must have missed it this time around. honestly nuked my dir like 3 times getting used to the workflow
<willdeberry> i clobbered the other one that was the same way :-/
<willdeberry> good eye though
<tsimonq2> Also, the diff in debian/rules can be cleaner. Instead of moving override_dh_auto_configure above override_dh_autoreconf, I'd just edit the stanza and not move it.
<willdeberry> this control file had duplicates. so i just nuked one of them
<willdeberry> probably why the diff is looking the way it is
<tsimonq2> An Ubuntu delta is just a modification of the Debian revision, that's why diffs from Debian really matter ;)
<tsimonq2> And that's why I'll always look at the diff before I give it to my sponsors because if the diff can be simpler, my sponsors will point it out, it saves time :P
<willdeberry> appreciate all the critiques for sure
<tsimonq2> You're welcome :)
<willdeberry> ill get used to the process and what people look for
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Also, since you can control it, if adding a completely new patch is part of the delta, please add DEP-3 headers: https://raphaelhertzog.com/2012/08/08/how-to-use-quilt-to-manage-patches-in-debian-packages/
<tsimonq2> Yeah it just takes time ;)
<tsimonq2> (btw that's my goto reference for updating patches, creating new patches, etc.  it's worth a read :) )
<willdeberry> thanks!
<tsimonq2> You're welcome :)
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: BTW here's an example of a bug report I file for this sort of thing: 1708392
<tsimonq2> bug 1708392 rather :P
<ubottu> bug 1708392 in sidplay-libs (Ubuntu) "Merge 2.1.1-15 from Debian Sid" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1708392
<tsimonq2> A couple things I'd like to note that over time I've found useful:
<tsimonq2>  1) Justify the delta, as the goal is to reduce deltas. If (and when) you submit deltas to Debian, link to the bug report to let your sponsors know you've submitted the changes.
<tsimonq2> (in that case, it's an Ubuntu delta that we need to keep and that can't be forwarded to Debian, but that's not always the case)
<tsimonq2>  2) Specify the Debian revision you are merging from, as Debian could upload a new revision *after* you submit the bug report and *before* you get it sponsored (happened to me once or twice).
<tsimonq2>  3) I'll typically add the artful tag and if it's a new upstream software release, the upgrade-software-version tag. Just helps with bug organization. :)
<tsimonq2>  4) In comment #1, I follow the same format for every merge comment I do with a debdiff. "Attached is a debdiff for RELEASE applicable to DEBIAN REVISION." Makes things much easier for your sponsors.
<tsimonq2> (also the filename, that's pretty self-explanatory)
<tsimonq2>  5) Lastly, subscribe ~ubuntu-sponsors
<willdeberry> well #5 is at least in the docs :P
<tsimonq2> hehehehehehe :)
<tsimonq2> Like I said, I've learned from my sponsors. ;)
<willdeberry> sounds good man. it's a hell of a knowledge dump but great to have
<tsimonq2> For sure :)
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Last nitpick, enable as many architectures in your PPA as possible because sometimes arm{hf,64} and ppc64el like to do "fun" things :P
<tsimonq2> And append ~ppa1 at the end, because you never know when someone might request changes or things go FTBFS, etc.
<tsimonq2> Learned that one the hard way.
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Oh, one more thing I see. When your changelog is done, run `dch -r` to update the date in the changelog, the date in your changelog entry is back from June...
<willdeberry> will do
<tsimonq2> Cool :)
<willdeberry> life is so much easier when you are the maintainer of the native package lol
<tsimonq2> In this case, I've been eyeing up that merge myself, but I always like to check the page for the package in tracker.debian.org to make sure it builds on all arches and is installable before merging to Ubuntu :)
<tsimonq2> Hehehehe, yeah :)
<tsimonq2> But yeah, otherwise it lgtm
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Once you get an updated debdiff attached, I can poke my usual sponsor for you ;) (as the sponsorship queues are getting pretty long)
<willdeberry> ill get onto making the adjustments :D
<tsimonq2> Ok :D
<tsimonq2> Also, like I said before, try to justify the delta *before* my usual sponsor inevitably asks :P
<tsimonq2> (or forward to Debian)
<willdeberry> makes sense
<tsimonq2> (when you forward to Debian, it's fine to just simply say "these are Ubuntu's changes" and attach the debdiff from the Debian revision)
<willdeberry> so in that aspect of things, i still create the lp ticket and then file a ticket with debian as well?
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: yep, sometimes you can even file a bug with Debian before merging and if they apply your changes, just force sync ;)
<tsimonq2> Also
<tsimonq2> This is wrong
<tsimonq2> +scim-chewing (0.5.1-2ubuntu1) artful; urgency=low
<tsimonq2> +
<tsimonq2> +  [ Ubuntu Merge-o-Matic ]
<tsimonq2> +  * Merge from Debian unstable. Remaining changes (LP: #1711263):
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1711263 in scim-chewing (Ubuntu) "Please merge scim-chewing 0.5.1-2 from debian unstable" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1711263
<tsimonq2> Just delete "[ Ubuntu Merge-o-Matic ]" and it'll be fine
<willdeberry> damn dch
<tsimonq2> ikr :P
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Ok, sent the bug report :D
<willdeberry> :D
<willdeberry> you have been a great help tonight
<willdeberry> on that good note, i am done for the night and will tread down this path again tomorrow :)
<tsimonq2> o/
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Here, uploaded :D https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/scim-chewing/0.5.1-2ubuntu1
#ubuntu-motu 2018-08-13
<dodobrain> hi all, i'm updating the ctrl file for a package
<dodobrain> how do specify A | B as in Build-Depends ?
<dodobrain> i.e. i need one of A or B installed to be able to build my package
<Unit193> Rhonda: It seems I now have PPU rights for Irssi in Ubuntu, fyi.
#ubuntu-motu 2018-08-14
<Rhonda> Unit193: oh, cheers.  I had the impression that you had that already. :)
<Unit193> Nope, I just either opened bugs or poked core devs.  I'm MOTU/PPU for Irssi as of this afternoon.
<Rhonda> Unit193: cheers for that :)
<Rhonda> Unit193, else: irssi upstream added the otr plugin to their source. great stuff :)  though, irssi is in main, while libotr is in universe. question now, how to deal with that? I guess either has to move around, or is it possible to create the otr plugin as separate package and put that in universe while irssi stays in main? I doubt that because it's a build depends issue still, right?
<Rhonda> ... not building it on Ubuntu would be the wrong message, and I assume the external plugin source will become stale
<Laney> Rhonda: Build-Depends can be in universe
<Rhonda> Laney: so keeping irssi in main and putting irssi-otr in a separate package built from the same source but have that sent to universe works?
<Laney> Rhonda: Should do, as long as main only Depends/Recommends main
<Laney> But we have proposed-migration keeping us honest anyway so it'll just get stuck :)
<Rhonda> gotcha. sweet, will give it a try then, and keep it separated (at least for Ubuntu, have to look how I can make it that it's a recommends in Debian and only suggests in Ubuntu)
<Unit193> Rhonda: Something along the lines of https://sources.debian.org/src/deluge/1.3.15-2/debian/rules/#L3 could be used.
#ubuntu-motu 2018-08-16
<cob> Hi, is it possible to make a package for a kernel module?
<karstensrage> where would be a good place to ask about calls into an NSS library
<karstensrage> im getting calls for to getgrpnam_r for admin but  i dont see where that group name exists
#ubuntu-motu 2018-08-17
<Rhonda> waaaaaaaah, rt@ubuntu, why the heck do you not take the name I'm sending my mails with but claim that they were sent using my deadname!!
<Laney> oh dear :(
<Unit193> Rhonda: Going to guess your name is right on LP too?
<Rhonda> Unit193: Oh, it's correct there.
<Laney> it's remembering the name the ticket was started with or something?
<Rhonda> Laney: It seems to create an entry for every single mail it receives and goes with the data of first encounter.
<Rhonda> So if I actually would like to play jokes with someone, using a faked from and wait until they are filing their first ticket for them to drive crazy.
<Unit193> I'm going to call someone 'Duckmania' and see if they get confused.
<Rhonda> So even if I log in with Ubuntu SSO and that specific mail address, it still shows me just as "rhonda" with no name set.
<Rhonda> â¦ but given that I can't seem to be able to update it myself.  Well, I guess I'm taking a few steps back from maintaining the packages.u.c website for now, it's not something I currently feel in the state to deal with. :/
<Laney> I guess it would be *another* RT to get it fixed by the sysadmins
 * Laney hugs Rhonda
<Rhonda> I've responded to that mail, asking to not be deadnamed â¦ which just triggered another mail to me that did deadname me.  >.>
<cob> Hi, are there any examples of how to make a debian package for a kernel module? maybe using dkms or something?
<chocorho> Hey
<chocorho> is anyone online?
<chocorho> Is this a dead channel
<teward> ask a real question
<teward> and maybe you'll get an answerl.
<chocorho> lol ok ok
<chocorho> actually nvm, I'm too scared to ask. The answer has got to be out there and I'm just missing it.
<teward> nah I just come off as harsh is all sorry about that
<teward> long week and what not :P
<teward> I will make a note that this channel is far less active than others though, and there may be a more appropriate channel you can get assistance in (and maybe I can help guide where you need to ask)
<chocorho> well... the thing is, I'm developing a somewhat elaborate game in C++, and (though it's barely in alpha) I've become curious about distribution methods.
<chocorho> One thing I'm considering is making a .deb file for it (since it's free software)
<chocorho> I probably just need to read more about making & maintaining packages, but
<chocorho> for the life of me I can't seem to figure out *where* the game's assets should be placed (I know usr/local/bin will have the game binary, but is there a specific place for a res/ folder?)
<chocorho> idk, probably a stupid question.
<teward> chocorho: if you're installing it as a .deb, it'd probably be /usr/lib/ rather than /usr/local/lib/.  But this information is up in the Debian Packaging Guide and the Filesystem Hierarchy definitions (which are more or less identical at Debian as they are for Ubuntu)
<teward> http://refspecs.linuxfoundation.org/FHS_3.0/fhs/index.html might be of usefulness, as would https://wiki.debian.org/FilesystemHierarchyStandard  (I know they're from Debian but they're still relevant)
<teward> that's usually pretty useful to help ID where *generally* something should be put upon install.
<teward> but in either case, if you're still looking for some help, I'd suggest waiting a while for the other more experienced individuals to assist :)  (Note that this channel is fairly dead around this hour unfortunately)
<chocorho> ohh ok, thanks
#ubuntu-motu 2020-08-11
<slyon> Hey MOTUs! Could somebody please review/sponsor my GCC-10 ftbfs fix for bug #1889138 into universe? This would be the first step of making sbuild/dpkg migrate from -proposed and is kind of blocking me right now..
<ubottu> bug 1889138 in procenv (Ubuntu Groovy) "procenv is FTBFS in Groovy" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1889138
<Unit193> Hi.
<Unit193> It fixes it. :o
