#ubuntu-discuss 2012-10-15
<TheLordOfTime> IdleOne, (from scrollbacks) i'd say that'd be better
<TheLordOfTime> <IdleOne> [10/13/12 23:52:06] would you prefer if it said "that tries to make  (wireless) networking Just Work ?  <-- that
<TheLordOfTime> but athat's just my opinion
#ubuntu-discuss 2012-10-16
<TheLordOfTime> !network-manager is <reply>networkmanager is an application that tries to make (wireless) networking "just work".  See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WifiDocs/NetworkManager
<zykotick9> IdleOne: fyi, i've been pondering your ubuntu's-great-community statement from the other day.  it's very true, ubuntu has a very special community based around it (puts apple-fanboys to shame).  still pondering on issue, no conclusions yet ;)
#ubuntu-discuss 2012-10-17
<guntbert> any idea what happened to the doc team?
#ubuntu-discuss 2012-10-18
<RaringOne> So, what do you folks think of the name for 13.04 raring Ringtail http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/1195 ?
<Flannel> seriously?
<RaringOne> yes
<Flannel> I can't tell if we're going to get comments about being a proprietary compression standard, or if we're going to get comments about going the way of the dodo.
<jussi> Im disappointed.
<jussi> It was supposed to be Randall Ross
<JoseeAntonioR> I was hoping the same
<jussi> The ubuntu one free 6 months is a pretty big gamble from canonical, but rather cool at the same time
<RaringOne> UbuntuOne is free for 6 months?
<jussi> sort of
<jussi> https://one.ubuntu.com/services/music/?utm_source=ubuntu.com&utm_medium=takeover&utm_campaign=u1_takeover
<jussi> RaringOne: doispekdetruf?
<RaringOne> yudospekittru
<RaringOne> it makes me sad to see iphone clients on there
<jussi> RaringOne: why?
<RaringOne> because UbuntuOne users should be using Ubuntu
<jussi> Im happy to see that. Only way to be successful in this is to be truly cross platform
<jussi> RaringOne: thats a bunch of fail if you ask me
<RaringOne> providing apps for other OS'es doesn't make it cross platform, makes it a Storage service.
<jussi> Its a little more than a storage service do you not think?
<RaringOne> perhaps, but I thought the point was to encourage people to use the OS
<RaringOne> That is becoming clearly not the point anymore
<jussi> RaringOne: Im not sure you follow. I know many people who use ubuntu, but have an iphone - why should they miss out?
<RaringOne> you have a point
<RaringOne> A good point. I tend to forget that use those things.
<RaringOne> I don't own a mobile
<jussi> RaringOne: you luddite :P
<RaringOne> A happy one at that :P
<RaringOne> you what is funny?
<RaringOne> I know something that is making me giggle
 * TheDrums has one not, but does have a Google Number.
<RaringOne> are you curious?
<jussi> RaringOne: mildly, but also scared :P
<RaringOne> ok I will share with you
<RaringOne> put down your drink, don't want you to spill it :)
<RaringOne> ready?
<jussi> ahem...
<RaringOne> * jussi (quassel@ubuntu/member/beanpc.jussi01) has left #ubuntu-ops (requested by RaringOne (No, but you are!))
<RaringOne> LOL
<jussi> har... har... har... hardly qualifies as high quality ontopic discussion :P :P :P
<RaringOne> hey it is late and it is also release day'ish I think we can allow ourselves some latitude
<jussi> hehe
<zykotick9> OMG - donate to ubuntu (aka canonical) is wrong!  i really question legality of "donations" from canada, to a for-profit business... but more importantly IMO, this is morally wrong.  wow...  i'm almost speechless ;)
<zykotick9> hilarious - choose what area of ubuntu you want to donate too. including (paraphrazing): Desktop, Games, Hardware support, phone/tablet, community, upstream co-operation.
<zykotick9> (ironically) i personally think "free" software should cost MORE then propritary software (and that is legal/possible with free software)
<AlanBell> zykotick9: how do you think it should be done?
<zykotick9> AlanBell: well, not by "donation".  ubuntu for $ makes sense, but "donation" is reserved for not-for-profits IMO (and i believe, in some ways legally as well)
#ubuntu-discuss 2012-10-19
<AlanBell> zykotick9: they actually changed it from donation to contribution I believe
<k1l_> since mark called the new "closed community" tactics for some projects do you know some other linux projects that first develope in small groups before releasing it to the masses? on the other big distros for example?
<IdleOne> android
<IdleOne> google
<k1l_> yeah of course that. but doesnt redhat or suse develope stuff in small groups first too?
<IdleOne> I think it isn't a bad idea. A little surprise reveal on release day would be interesting and generate some buzz.
<IdleOne> k1l_: I really don't know, you could try asking them
<k1l_> i dont think that this a bad idea. especially when developing for the TV and Mobile sections.
<k1l_> but atm there is a "omg ubuntu is just wanting to take your money" wave, again. and some examples form similar distributions to prove them wrong would be nice
<IdleOne> I wouldn't know, my focus has been on Ubuntu for 5 years now. I haven't even tested any other distro.
<k1l_> for me too
<k1l_> maybe someone here knows a similar strategy in other distros
 * genii-around makes more coffee
<guntbert> genii-around: as long as you don't drink it -- making is ok :)
 * genii-around slides guntbert a fresh mug
 * guntbert cannot resist ... mhhh 
#ubuntu-discuss 2012-10-21
<zykotick9> /wc/
#ubuntu-discuss 2013-10-17
<RoyalDogBiscuits> hey
<RoyalDogBiscuits> low-jitter kernel needs YOU! http://ovekarlsen.com/Blog/turning-ubuntu-12-04-into-a-professional-low-jitter-os/
<jussi> RoyalDogBiscuits: how is that different from the RT or lowlatency kernels we have had in the past?
<RoyalDogBiscuits> jussi: From what I see, the config is very different. Low-latency is not neccesarily low-jitter graphics wise. For that you need to reduce all causes of jitter, such as interrupts, uneccesary code running etc. Try it!
<jussi> RoyalDogBiscuits: maybe at home, not here (work machine)
<jussi> RoyalDogBiscuits: I want to know more details about it though, and particularly differences from RT kernel
<RoyalDogBiscuits> The main difference is that it is very efficient.
<RoyalDogBiscuits> For instance Doom 3 which is a very jitter sensitive game, that Carmack not long ago stated was taxing even on modern computers, runs with accurate 72fps.
<RoyalDogBiscuits> Doom 3 does three OpenGL passes, pr frame.
<RoyalDogBiscuits> This also really on a core 2 duo, and a GTX 280.
<RoyalDogBiscuits> Many have reports glitches disappearing from their games.
<jussi> RoyalDogBiscuits: I suspect a much better forum for talking about this would be #ubuntu-kernel (if you havent already)
<RoyalDogBiscuits> I pasted a link there too.
#ubuntu-discuss 2013-10-18
<torkan2> hello?
<k1l> hi
<torkan2> i made the switch from windows 7 recently
#ubuntu-discuss 2013-10-19
<ShapeShifter499> linuxuz3r, hi there :)
<linuxuz3r> hi go to offtopic
#ubuntu-discuss 2013-10-20
<ShapeShifter499> hi
<ShapeShifter499> how do you guys feel about the deteriorating state of privacy in ubuntu with 13.10?
#ubuntu-discuss 2014-10-15
<angel__> hi there)
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-10-12
<Spiderixius> Hello
<lordievader> Good morning.
<Spiderixius> Morning Lordie
<lordievader> Hey Spiderixius
<Spiderixius>  I have to add, Fishshell is darn good!
<Spiderixius> has autocompletion based on your usage history of the terminal.
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<Spiderixius> Hello Kaj
<lotuspsychje> good evening to all
<lotuspsychje> erm afternoon i mean
<BluesKaj> 'morning  lotuspsychje :-)
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj :p
<lordievader> Jumping timezones, lotuspsychje?
<lotuspsychje> lol lordievader :p
<BluesKaj> think I'll have some breakfast
<lotuspsychje> bon apetit BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> lotuspsychje, thanks
<HackerII> doh
<lotuspsychje> add to favs :p
<HackerII> got it
<lotuspsychje> all ok mate?
<HackerII> my little red queen
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> not sure where she cam from
<HackerII> whos idea was that
<lotuspsychje> no idea
<lotuspsychje> just saw her yesterday
<HackerII> so, howya doin these days
<lotuspsychje> great
<HackerII> same here
<lotuspsychje> got my bq 4.5 ubuntu touch
<HackerII> work good ?
<lotuspsychje> and it rocknrolls :p
<lotuspsychje> yes
<HackerII> i want one, link me lemme see it
<lotuspsychje> HackerII: your usa?
<HackerII> is that the one that only goes 3g ?
<HackerII> in usa
<lotuspsychje> not sure bq works in usa
<HackerII> i think its only 3g
<HackerII> id still get one, how much you pay
<lotuspsychje> im europe here
<lotuspsychje> 173 euro with send costs
<HackerII> whats that in dollars
<lotuspsychje> HackerII: you can ask in #ubuntu-touch if bq works usa
<lotuspsychje> HackerII: about the same
<HackerII> under 200 dollars ?, tooo cheap
<lotuspsychje> loool
<lotuspsychje> its nice clean and small
<lotuspsychje> a guy cant wear big phones in his pocket right
<HackerII> is it fast enough, isnt that a 2g processor ?
<lotuspsychje> HackerII: http://www.bq.com/gb/aquaris-e4-5-ubuntu-edition
<HackerII> soon as it comes here ill get one 4 sure
<HackerII> looks
<lotuspsychje> there's the E5 also
<lotuspsychje> but i dont need hd
<HackerII> so, you have a full fledged ubuntu on that ?
<HackerII> tooo coool
<lotuspsychje> yes
<HackerII> Operating system Ubuntu
<lotuspsychje> i got tablet nexus7 with touch also
<lotuspsychje> yes
<lotuspsychje> free updates
<HackerII> im beta testing the new kodi today, gonna install it on a xtra space, i have the g-box which is nifty
<lotuspsychje> cool
<HackerII> man, i hevent got anything but a generic cell px, waiting for the ubuntu px here
<HackerII> i (will) spend the money
<lotuspsychje> :p
<HackerII> srsly, how do you like it
<HackerII> doesnt it have external graphics output ?
<lotuspsychje> very like ubuntu touch
<lotuspsychje> no
<HackerII> huh, i thought you could hook a monitor to it
<lotuspsychje> that convergence mode is something they still work on
<lotuspsychje> and not sure bq 4.5 will be able to
<lotuspsychje> ask in #ubuntu-touch for more details
<HackerII> ok
<lotuspsychje> think meizu will be able
<HackerII> most likely
<lotuspsychje> but as i dislike android so much
<HackerII> being able to hook a monitor and keyboard/mouse would make that thing flyoff the shelves
<lotuspsychje> im soo happy with touch phone :p
<HackerII> i dont trust any of those guys, only ubuntu
<HackerII> proven
<lotuspsychje> another wish on my list would be terminal apps install on the phone
<lotuspsychje> now its locked for safety
<HackerII> i wish they would hurry up
<HackerII> cant unlock it ?
<HackerII> is it rootable ?
<lotuspsychje> you can, but you cant receive updates then
<HackerII> ah
<HackerII> ic
<lotuspsychje> and i want the new updates :p
<HackerII> ya
<lotuspsychje> for the 170 euro im very satisfyed
<HackerII> id be too, not bad price at all
<lotuspsychje> i dont wanna pay 4g neither
<lotuspsychje> only wifi at places
<HackerII> i just hope the nsa dont demand back doors like thay did microshaft
<OerHeks> No java, great phone
<OerHeks> No Dalvik either, so no lawsuites :-D
<HackerII> lol
<lotuspsychje> :p
<OerHeks> meizu mx4 is sold out, maybe mx5 is comming ..
<HackerII> you kno it
<lotuspsychje> and other brands will join the circus too
<HackerII> yep
<OerHeks> One plus One is nearly usable.
<lotuspsychje> power to opensource!
<HackerII> ive been w ubuntu from the start, they have proven trust by me
<HackerII> got customers, back when done, good day folks
<lotuspsychje> kk
<lotuspsychje> laterz
<lotuspsychje> add to favs :p
<HackerII> done
<lotuspsychje> cfhowlett: good afternoon mate
<cfhowlett> heyheyhey lotuspsychje
<OerHeks> hi-di-hi cfhowlett
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> hi EriC^^
<EriC^^> hi lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/ubuntu-15-10-is-shipping-with-linux-kernel-4-2-494357.shtml
<HackerII> idk the validity to this.
<HackerII> http://lxer.com/module/newswire/ext_link.php?rid=220543
<daftykins> o/
<daftykins> it would appear i was banned again in my absence
<EriC^^> daftykins: o/
<daftykins> just got back from England :)
<EriC^^> cool, had fun?
<daftykins> yeah good stuff thanks :) saw my friends little 14 month old son - and fixed up all their computers :)
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<daftykins> heya \o
<EriC^^> cool
<EriC^^> hi pauljw
<pauljw> how's everyone today?
<daftykins> in good spirits here thanks :) yourself?
<pauljw> same  :)
<EriC^^> im good thanks
<pauljw> :)
<pauljw> that's a good trick to get banned while not even here daftykins
<EriC^^> maybe it was your cat O.o
<daftykins> :D
<EriC^^> like the guy who's cat kept deleting his home dir or something
<pauljw> heheh
<daftykins> well an op i know unbanned me on the day i left, then i think the one i offended must've put it back
<EriC^^> ( i watched my cat for a few days to see what buttons it was pressing ..) remember? :D >.<
<daftykins> EriC^^: haha i remember that guy :D
<lotuspsychje_> good evening pauljw and daftykins
<daftykins> hey hey!
<pauljw> oh the world and its sensitivities...
<daftykins> lotuspsychje_: you'd be proud, i had a friend buy a samsung 850 EVO whilst i was away ;)
<pauljw> hey lotuspsychje_
<lotuspsychje_> nice daftykins
<lotuspsychje_> daftykins: and he installed linux on it?
<daftykins> then i put the old 60GB OCZ he had into his wifes old 1.4GHz 1GB RAM Advent laptop - with xubuntu :)
<lotuspsychje_> cool
<lotuspsychje_> ssd always benfits :p
<daftykins> definitely
<lotuspsychje_> still got that old transcend 8gig slc
<daftykins> from a netbook or some such?
<lotuspsychje_> running trusty 64bit rocketfast
<lotuspsychje_> no got a desktop running on it
<lotuspsychje_> and 1TB data mechanical drives
<lotuspsychje_> daftykins: bought it spare, back in the ssd expensive days
<lotuspsychje_> payed like 100 euro for it
<daftykins> :)
<lotuspsychje_> !isitoutyet
<ubot5`> Not yet!
<OerHeks> Why, ubot5`, why?
<OerHeks> wily is slower than vivid, i like that.
<lotuspsychje_> lol
<lotuspsychje_> give us the rushhhh
<OerHeks> or phoronics should dust the fans
<lotuspsychje_> lol
<daftykins> is it really slower? or you just mean slower to be released? :)
<OerHeks> He did a benchmark, most points it is slower, but will we notice that?
<OerHeks> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-15-Benchmarks
<daftykins> that's a really strange specification system to test on
<daftykins> more of a workstation than a common desktop
<OerHeks> i think he is using a wireless mouse, that can slow down milliseconds too
<daftykins> XD
<OerHeks> *hips*
<lotuspsychje_> ah well, at least we will have 4.2 kernel and new scrollbars lol
<daftykins> and roll on January 31st to make 15.04 go EOL, so there're only 3 releases left standing :)
<daftykins> 12.04, 14.04 and 15.10 then right?
<lordievader> !precise
<ubot5`> Ubuntu 12.04 LTS (Precise Pangolin) is a currently-supported !LTS release of Ubuntu.  Download http://releases.ubuntu.com/12.04/ - Release Info: http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/1204
<lordievader> Hmpf, why don't you list the support period...
<daftykins> April 2017 i figure
<daftykins> 5 year LTS?
<lordievader> Makes sense ;)
<daftykins> now all i need do is get unbanned so i can actually help ;)
<daftykins> although i might actually get a new job so i can keep busier for the Christmas period
<lordievader> daftykins: You got banned from #ubuntu? What for?
<lordievader> Telling an idiot he is an idiot?
<daftykins> i was a bit rude to an op
<lotuspsychje_> wich1
<daftykins> after a long shift i didn't appreciate being told the rules :)
<daftykins> might be better for my case if i don't name, i'm afraid!
<lordievader> Agreed.
<lotuspsychje_> | grep logs :p
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> grep for me and f***
<lotuspsychje_> hahaha
<lotuspsychje_> at least all the friendly volunteers are here :p
<daftykins> ;_;
<daftykins> i'm friendly!
<lotuspsychje_> of course, thats why i invited you here
<daftykins> oh i get what you meant now, my mistake
<lotuspsychje_> :p
<lotuspsychje_> mocking is not my style dont worry
<daftykins> :D
<pauljw> :)
<lordievader> Ahh, too bad :(
<lordievader> :P
<lotuspsychje_> lol
<lotuspsychje_> !info macchanger | daftykins and come as d4ftykins :p
<ubot5`> daftykins and come as d4ftykins :p: macchanger (source: macchanger): utility for manipulating the MAC address of network interfaces. In component universe, is extra. Version 1.7.0-5.3 (vivid), package size 186 kB, installed size 677 kB (Only available for linux-any)
<lordievader> lotuspsychje_: Why would he change his mac?
<daftykins> haha, i think i'm only banned by my cloak
<lotuspsychje_> ip/nick ban?
<lotuspsychje_> ah ok
<daftykins> or at least i was before i left on my trip
<lordievader> Better to just ask the ops to unban you.
<lotuspsychje_> im out, movienight with the misses
<lotuspsychje_> see you next session guys
<lordievader> Have fun
<lotuspsychje_> tnx
<pauljw> later
<daftykins> take care o/
<daftykins> yeah i wouldn't do deception, not worth the hassle
<lordievader> You might just get a more severe ban.
<daftykins> indeed
<OerHeks> now you are welcome again, daftykins
<pauljw> :)
<OerHeks> F**** = Friend!
<daftykins> 8D
<pauljw> heheh
<daftykins> all thanks to a kind soul :)
<pauljw> you're a kind soul yourself and much more patient than I
<daftykins> i have my moments ;)
<OerHeks> If i could swim, i came over for meet & greet.
<pauljw> :)
<daftykins> that'd be neat actually, i do like to put faces to names with IRC folk
<daftykins> as it was the friends i was visiting, i discussed my helping out in #ubuntu whilst i was doing the xubuntu reinstall
<daftykins> they think it's really admirable work
<OerHeks> i am sure you have seen this one before https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6885560/DrabberEnIkOpPaard.JPG
<pauljw> it is admirable, i'm in awe of some of the knowledge shared here.  irc itself is something that i never knew existed till i discovered linux and was taken with it almost as much as the os itself
<daftykins> OerHeks: i don't think so! are you going to shock me and say you are the horse? ;)
<OerHeks> Yes.
<OerHeks> no, the girl ...
<OerHeks> ehhh that guy on top of it, ofcourse :-D
<daftykins> ^_^
<daftykins> that's a cool dog
<daftykins> kinda looks like a firefox (red panda) in the face :)
<OerHeks> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6885560/2015DrabberSStoer.JPG
<OerHeks> Chihuahua, long hair version
<daftykins> hehe, that is a proper Clint Eastwood pose :)
<daftykins> i'm sure everyones seen mine, but here was me on my riding trip to Wales - https://www.dropbox.com/s/ogkekwst4h8b4dw/IMG_20150906_171157.jpg?dl=0
<OerHeks> different bike .. or was that the rental ?
<daftykins> good memory! just a friends one beside me from that angle :)
<pauljw> brb...
<OerHeks> Got a free bike last week, simular to this, blue with white fenders, 12 speed http://www.galaxybikes.com/1970s-peugeot-57cm-road-city-bike/ (same year)
<wileee> nice, looks like a comfy ride
<OerHeks> no rust, allways been inside, so the tyres are dried out.
<pauljw> that's sweet
<OerHeks> yes, the steering is like a limousine, for long rides.
<wileee> that is worth a bit just as a historical bike.....somewhere
<OerHeks> Allways handy to have a 2nd one, for friends on visit, or when one is broken.
<OerHeks> I was actually looking for a lady bike, for a friend here in this appartmentblock.
<OerHeks> never say npo to a free bike :-D
<OerHeks> *no
<wileee> yeah, I have a street mountain combo great for the street
<OerHeks> *unless the lock is broken without key
<wileee> heh, would steal either, funny shows with people getting trapped doing it.
<wileee> would not*
<OerHeks> No need to steal, really, all i need will get on my path, but not all on my path is good for me.
<wileee> heh, you to
<daftykins> bike looks good :)
<daftykins> whilst away my friend told me his was stolen from a train station up there :(
<wileee> saw this lately, did not know and I live here, kinda funny, very portlandia, http://laughingsquid.com/the-pedal-powered-talk-show-a-portland-oregon-talk-show-recorded-from-a-desk-mounted-to-a-cargo-bike/
<OerHeks> awesome, wilee, i would like to do that too :-D
<daftykins> that looks like good fun!
<wileee> I've only seen bits of portlandia, I don't have cable, but saw them filming next to my daily starbucks hang, some other horror show is filmed here as well.
<daftykins> i keep hearing the line that "the 90s are alive in Portland" but don't know much else about it :)
<wileee> It is a funny place to be, no idea what it's like elsewhere, a good chuckle by the minute from the persona's worn and acted out by many.
<wileee> everybody has a funky dad's hat lol
<wileee> very popular donut place here, very close I don't go, I might not leave. http://voodoodoughnut.com/
<daftykins> i found it very odd at the weekend when i installed xubuntu on an empty drive, that it set the GRUB timeout to 10
<daftykins> well, perhaps it always is - but i was surprised it actually did make me wait
<wileee> first thing I change generally
<daftykins> i only expect to see it displayed on a failed boot
<wileee> heh, makes sense I have been multi booting for so long
<OerHeks> It is getting colder, people start using the pc again .. lots of EOL nerds
<wileee> and their mad now
<OerHeks> Some of them will return to Vista :-D
<OerHeks> oh, that is EOL too
<OerHeks> hi mcphail
<mcphail> Hi OerHeks
<mcphail> Does anyone think it would be reasonable to tweak the installer to support bcache?
<mcphail> If a bcache'd filesystem is detected, bcache tools shopuld be installed so the install will boot
<mcphail> Without bcache-tools, the filesystem isn't recognised at boot
<OerHeks> That would be nice, just read about bcache
<mcphail> OerHeks: it (seems_ to work well. But currently requires a chroot into the install to add the bcache-tools package before reboot. Messy
<mcphail> (and the cause for a bit of my hair loss last night)
<OerHeks> I think one needs live mode first, to prepare bcache
<OerHeks> not possible on a server install though
<mcphail> OerHeks: you can do a server install, but you'd need to use debootstrap. There's a neat Ubuntu server guide somewhere
<daftykins> OerHeks: ah that's a good point as to why we're seeing those utopic users, indeed
<mcphail> OerHeks: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/InstallOnBcache
<OerHeks> oh, i was looking @ https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Bcache
<OerHeks> nice
<mcphail> I suspect there must be a way for the installer to check for /dev/bcache* and add the tools. Alternatively, they could be added to the base install by default (as the package is only 18.6kb)
<OerHeks> cat /sys/block/bcache0/bcache/state  The output can be: no cache / clean / dirty / inconsistent
<OerHeks> * afer adding the tools, i presume
<mcphail> I think you need to have set up a bcache device (and add the tools) before that /sys tree is populated
<OerHeks> ehm .. good point
<OerHeks> is Bcache better than DM-cache?
<mcphail> It fits in my brain better :)
<mcphail> I think the intent is similar
<OerHeks> interesting, i like to try it myself. i have a spare 60 gb ssd and a 4 gb duocore.
<OerHeks> maybe 2 x320 gb sata2 too for raid
<mcphail> certainly worth a try on a spare machine. I'm using it for an experiment wily install. No problems yet, but have only been using it for 24h ;)
<OerHeks> both can handle udev?
<mcphail> in what way?
<mcphail> bcache-tools sets up the udev rules, if that's what you mean?
<mcphail> (That's why I'd propose adding it to the installer...)
<daftykins> wow even more utopic question askers
<daftykins> how do these people not notice they're running EOL 'til now? XD
<mcphail> Probably never press the "update" button during the supported period, anyway
<daftykins> could well be
<EriC^^> when i first wanted to download ubuntu i downloaded a non lts, if you dont know about package managers and linux and stuff long term support is like a chinese term or something
<daftykins> very true
<EriC^^> i remember thinking what's this sudo thing every where
<daftykins> though i think i was lucky and spotted both the terms on the download page that first time - and checked what it meant
<mcphail> Ha - I have a debian squeeze box which I have to hand-compile all security updates, so I can't criticise
<OerHeks> I joined the irc right away, when switching from Fedora to Ubuntu.
<OerHeks> But ubuntu-nl is pretty dead.
<mcphail> Is Seveas in ubuntu-nl? I think he taught me everything I now know when I joined the #ubuntu irc
<mcphail> I often wonder how #ubuntu can get that same atmosphere of help and support again. I suppose having 20 people each day asking the same questions about EOL ditros and over-full /boot partitions doesn't help
<OerHeks> Nope, he is doing nothing lately, according to his wikipage
<OerHeks> I miss ikonia, actionparsnip and such
<mcphail> The #ubuntu-touch community is very nice, and is like a (smaller) version of #ubuntu in its prime
<MonkeyDust> i'd like to see the installation of thermald (daemon) and indicator-cpufreq added to this page... where or how do I suggest it? ... https://help.ubuntu.com/lts/ubuntu-help/power-hotcomputer.html
<daftykins> hmm, if you're logged in with single sign on - do any controls become visible to edit it?
<daftykins> i'm not sure how the pages are handled tbh
<daftykins> TJ-: hi sir \o
<TJ-> Evening :)
<daftykins> back from invading England, but i've got to retire early for a change to keep my good schedule and also work! :D
<daftykins> nn all \o
<TJ-> Setting a good example! I need to do that too
<OerHeks> daftykins, i lost my yubikey, now i cannot login anymore, mail does not help :-(
<OerHeks> no more replies to askubuntu, only ubuntu-nl forum is available
<TJ-> OerHeks: you lost it?! no back-up?
<OerHeks> it is a hardwarekey
<TJ-> I mean back-up for the sites you use it on. If a site accepts Ubikey as a 2nd factor, they should always provide a method to disable the ubikey/2-factor in case it is broken/lost/stolen
<OerHeks> TJ-, nope, all i can do is joining an irc channel ( dead) or mail .. done twice, no reaction :-( dunno what to do now
<TJ-> OerHeks: I assume this is with one.ubuntu.com single-sign-on?
<OerHeks> Yes
<TJ-> Ahhh, and the policy there recommends using 2 or more 2FA device
<OerHeks> ohh.. i tried now, and i can..
<OerHeks> never got a reply they have resetted
<OerHeks> \o/
<OerHeks> mea culpa, for this non problem
<TJ-> :D
<TJ-> And set up a back-up device next time :)
<OerHeks> Sure do!
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-10-13
<JhonnyCOL> Testing Emacs ERC...
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Ya mind taking over for goddard ?
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: ill try mate
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Good deal .. cause I am done .. well past the shift change !
<lotuspsychje> good night mate
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Later .. yall all take care.
<lordievader> Good morning
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<OerHeks> :-)
<OerHeks> Yes ...no,wait
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-10-14
<Ben64> i love when people actively argue for something dumb
<Bashing-om> Pointless, and wasting our resources .
<OerHeks> I don get it, the problem is with 'expensive'serversoftware ?
<Ben64> i don't get it either
<Ben64> ssh is easier to set up, more secure, secure out of the box, and 'just works'
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lordievader> Good morning.
<spider_> Haha, cmatrix, such nostalgia
<daftykins> morning \o
<lotuspsychje> :p
<daftykins> ^_^
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/9vx752or7x52fpo/IMG_20151008_072255.jpg?dl=0
<lotuspsychje> lets c
<daftykins> nice sunrise last Thursday, when i left
<daftykins> you can see a large cruise ship in front of the island of Herm, over on the left
<lotuspsychje> nice1
 * daftykins groans
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/ubuntu-phones-will-run-any-linux-application-on-top-of-unity-8-494496.shtml
<lotuspsychje> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-16.04-Firefox-Q
<lotuspsychje> someone knows if webbrowser-app uses adobe flash
<daftykins> hrmm
<daftykins> i think flash functionality should be allowed to die
<lotuspsychje> youtube works on it just tested it
<lotuspsychje> but not sure how they support it
<daftykins> plus i think firefox 42 is going to bring the per-process tabs
<lotuspsychje> how to see dependecies with pat-cache again?
<lotuspsychje> apt
<daftykins> policy or showpkg
<daftykins> i always forget which is which so do both :D
<lotuspsychje> apt-cache showpkg did it :p
<daftykins> \o/
<lotuspsychje> alot of qt-plugins
<HackerII> mind your own business
<lotuspsychje> lol
<daftykins> no, follow the rules else depart, HackerII.
<HackerII> grow up
<daftykins> that's wise advice, i suggest you follow it.
<lotuspsychje> common guys lets keep it nice
<HackerII> im 60 , boy.
<HackerII> now follow suit, or get out of the way
 * cfhowlett adds another useful tool ... to /ignore
<daftykins> very good advice, cfhowlett - no point enabling these special cases
<HackerII> idk where kids these days get their intellect from.
<cfhowlett> one more reason to love hexchat: point and click ignore actually works.  always failed in hexchat for some reason ...
<lotuspsychje> webbrowser-app: http://paste.ubuntu.com/12779546/
<cfhowlett> xchat
<daftykins> have you guys seen the new Dell XPS 13?
<cfhowlett> too new to be in china, but I know they haven't (yet) released a Developer Edition
<daftykins> it's been refreshed with intel's 6th gen CPUs, (skylake) and so is claimed to do 18hrs battery now for the FHD model (1080p)
<lotuspsychje> nice
<cfhowlett> but if that battery is legit, I'd have to look hard at finding a way to get my hands on one
<daftykins> it also has a thunderbolt 3 port with a USB C form factor :) so single cable gigabit LAN, multiple display output and USB 3.1 gen 2 etc
<daftykins> it's an odd one really, the last model did 15hrs... and that was met fine by one site i read (anandtech.com) but a lot of other review sites do stupid things like play full HD video over wifi then claim that it didn't meet Dell's battery claims Â¬_Â¬
<lotuspsychje> bbl movie
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/ubuntu-15-10-might-ship-with-a-couple-of-annoying-trash-related-bugs-494518.shtml
<OerHeks> first one is annoying indeed, it should not open, or open the trash folder.
<OerHeks> 2nd one is nasty :-(
<lotuspsychje> :p
<cfhowlett> I don't think any recent bug was more harmful to ubuntu than the "dual boot?  delete ALL the windows!" on 14.04
<lotuspsychje> loool
<OerHeks> sounds like a GPT issue
<lotuspsychje> oh wily...
 * lotuspsychje will wait for dual X X
 * cfhowlett will wait for 16.04.1 ...
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> gizmoooo
<lotuspsychje> its very weird i never had 1 issue on trusty on all 50 boxes i installed it
<lotuspsychje> all cable+updates and running smooth after
<OerHeks> Me too, i envy those problem makers
<lotuspsychje> i dont get all those trusty malfunctionings
<OerHeks> only the trash bug happens here
<lotuspsychje> lool
<HackerII> el oh el
<lotuspsychje> lol@cosmic
<cfhowlett> hey it had to be said.
<lotuspsychje> its actually true
<lotuspsychje> so many distro's without actual support
<cfhowlett> but but but ... it's UBUNTU based, innit??
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> and ubuntu is debian
<lotuspsychje> and debian is... atari
<lotuspsychje> and ataris is..
<cfhowlett> unix?  bsd?
<lotuspsychje> lol
<cfhowlett> I SO want to make the obvious comparison: So if you'd go to your proctologist to get your teeth filled?  Because a dentist IS a doctor, right?
<lotuspsychje> lol
<cfhowlett> but .. that would be wrong
<lotuspsychje> buy a bread at the butcher because its a store
<cfhowlett> *though I HAVE mentioned Ms. Cleo a few times when people just magically expect someone to figure out their issue in the absence of meaningful detail
<lotuspsychje> i have a prob!!! help!!
<cfhowlett> leave your initials and Ms. Cleo will call you back with a solution!  Have your credit card ready!
<lotuspsychje> lol
<daftykins> Ms. Cleo earns a fine wage i'm sure
<daftykins> :)
<daftykins> i find that even funnier since it's the name of a friends cat
<cfhowlett> well she did.  till she got caught and ...
<cfhowlett> "She never saw it coming ..." [puts on the shades] YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH
<lotuspsychje> oO
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<lotuspsychje> hi pauljw
<pauljw> hey lotuspsychje :)
<daftykins> cor we lost a lot of folk there
<pauljw> brb
<wileee> OerHeks, Sorry that was bad phishing, I was trying to get enough info from them, the graphics was basically it, I was thinking.
<OerHeks> :-)
<OerHeks> i am not sure why he is asking drive manager .. am i so fuzzy or what?
<daftykins> don't hate me guys, but i have a mac in to fix tonight
<wileee> heh, get him
<OerHeks> daftykins, -10 points
<OerHeks> :-D
<daftykins> ;_;
<daftykins> oh my client didn't rejoin #ubuntu when kornbluth died
<daftykins> i thought we just had no questions!
<pauljw> bbl
<daftykins> well so far i'm not very impressed with installing the latest OS Apple have to offer :)
<daftykins> sat at a progress bar!
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-10-15
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> morning cfhowlett
<cfhowlett> hey hey hey lotuspsychje
<Ben64> that guy is really mad
<lotuspsychje> i saw him before here
<lotuspsychje> might be back after the splits
<Ben64> don't see him in my logs anywhere
<lotuspsychje> hmm
<Ben64> ip location is khazakstan
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> its borat
<daftykins> XD borat in #ubuntu
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<daftykins> o/
<OerHeks> âº
<daftykins> i see it is troll season
<OerHeks> i love a good troll for breakfast, with onions and fresh toe-cheese
<OerHeks> daftykins, >> http://news.softpedia.com/news/first-malicious-app-published-in-store-for-ubuntu-touch-494595.shtml
<daftykins> :O!
<EriC^^> evening everyone
<daftykins> hallo thar o/
<EriC^^> o/
<daftykins> mercy mercy me, troll season it be
<EriC^^> :D
<daftykins> even my cat is joining in!
<EriC^^> lol
<OerHeks> mauw
<daftykins> 1) Cat goes outside 2) Cat walks to my office window 3) Cat miaows at me as if she can't get in
<daftykins> :)
<EriC^^> lol
<EriC^^> wow the atmosphere in #ubuntu is taking a plunge
<OerHeks> Why aren't you an op, EriC^^ ?
<EriC^^> i was just thinking if i were op, i'd ....
<daftykins> ...nuke it from orbit?
<OerHeks> tony was there just a minute ago
<EriC^^> daftykins: lol
<daftykins> this yama guy needs a +q stat
<daftykins> anyone tried to report it in -ops yet?
<daftykins> i thought ikonia was an op
<OerHeks> 1 2 3 ...
<OerHeks> oh no not in discuss
<daftykins> nooooo
<OerHeks> no no, no no nooo no, there is no limit !
<OerHeks> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qM5W7Xn7FiA
<EriC^^> why hasn't there been like a new i7 and stuff?
<daftykins> there has! 6th generation skylake came out a bit ago
<daftykins> but to start with they were only the enthusiast parts, i think the majority of standard line parts for laptops etc are coming in the new year (in quantity)
<EriC^^> i see
<EriC^^> so the new one is i7-6xxx
<daftykins> yep
<daftykins> i'm really excited by the new model Dell XPS 13 (9350) - it's claiming 18hrs battery now O_O
<EriC^^> wow
<EriC^^> that's really cool
<daftykins> (1080p screen model)
<HackerII> it runs @ 14 mhz
<HackerII> el oh el
<daftykins> EriC^^: any clue as to how this user nuked this disk?
<EriC^^> nope
<daftykins> wow, flash player has an actively being used zero day that you have to uninstall, on every major OS.
<EriC^^> well at least it's consistent
<daftykins> :D
<EriC^^> it would be amazing if a 0-day didn't come out every week or so :D
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-10-16
<Bashing-om> daftykins: I joined the channel 15 minutes ago, 3 users ! I had to consider that the world was ending .
<wileee> heh, you get an iou in iowa for more than a 600$ lottery win till state budget talks finalize
<pauljw> that's priceless...
<wileee> circa NBC nightly news
<pauljw> later wileee
<wileee> later
<wileee> and late
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Quiet on the Western front, maybe too quiet .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: did you see that guy again with his prime issue?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: No, was curious how that went . Never like leaving some one hanging .
<lotuspsychje> yeah me neither, tryed to help the guy out, but he didnt reply anymore and i had to leave myself
<lotuspsychje> didnt see him since
<Bashing-om> getting CUDA working .. sometimes a challenge . Used to be a real bear back in 12.04 .
<lotuspsychje> cuda and prime are such a mess for most users
<lotuspsychje> !info nvidia-cuda
<ubot5`> Package nvidia-cuda does not exist in vivid
<lotuspsychje> !find cuda
<ubot5`> Found: boinc-nvidia-cuda, libcuda1-331, libcuda1-331-updates, libcudart6.5, nvidia-cuda-dev, nvidia-cuda-doc, nvidia-cuda-gdb, nvidia-cuda-toolkit, python-pycuda-doc, libcuda1-304 (and 5 others) http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=cuda&searchon=names&suite=vivid&section=all
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: is it that toolkit?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Not reasl sure anymore .. used to be nvidia-cuda-toolkit .
<lotuspsychje> yeah i think thats the one
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Think Nvidia has now gone in a different direction ; https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Cuda .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: yeah tnx
<Bashing-om> Leaveing it in better hands, will see yall on my flip.
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: nite nite mate
<Bashing-om> Later !
<OerHeks> âº
<lordievader> Good morning
<OerHeks> morning lordievader
<lordievader> Hey OerHeks, how are you doing?
<OerHeks> i am good, thank you for asking, how is wily going?
<lordievader> No idea...
<lordievader> Last time I ran it, it was okay.
<OerHeks> oh, i thought you were testing it.
<lordievader> Well, it is on a test box. But I don't really have a purpose for it. So really testing it becomes somewhat time consuming.
<BluesKaj> Hey all
<OerHeks> daftykins, sorry, i could not resist ..
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> i smiled :)
<daftykins> does X not start with no display attached o0
<OerHeks> daftykins, it is an strange story, as it has a beamer attached
<daftykins> i guess it just needs to sit there and record these projector streams and not be visible itself
<daftykins> but yeah you would think it could be plugged in and just not be used
<cfhowlett> you know, it's very confusing to enter these threads sometimes.  It's located in the little cabin above the beamer?  what the deuce!
<daftykins> :D
<OerHeks> friday issues .. like some dutch computer sites, friday articles are allways funny
<daftykins> my guess is in the university lecture hall there's a bracket with shelves that the projector lives on, suspended from the ceiling
<OerHeks> i want to know the exact height, dimension and colour too!
<OerHeks> *hips*
<daftykins> :)
<cfhowlett> beamer = BMW you know ...
<OerHeks> ... scotty!
<daftykins> cfhowlett: yeah i was thinking that too
<daftykins> a little PC recording lecturers attached to a BMW in a lecture hall
<daftykins> i imagined a very odd looking room :)
<DosTuMai> Woooo. Laptop is fixed. Finally. @_@
<DosTuMai> Linux dostumai-Aspire-5315 3.16.0-50-generic #67~14.04.1-Ubuntu SMP Fri Oct 2 22:08:53 UTC 2015 i686 i686 i686 GNU/Linux
<DosTuMai> No issues for me. The bugs been fixed for those with problems?
<daftykins> which problems? you're on an old HWE stack there
<daftykins> 3.16 is the utopic HWE for trusty, ancient++
<daftykins> you should either be on trusty's stock 3.13, vivid's 3.19, or soon enough i'm sure there'll be a wily 4.2
<DosTuMai> Yah, just noticed... thought I'd gone through all the upgrades. Gimme a few to meld the atoms in my head with the wall's, then upgrade distro...
<daftykins> oh you can skip that step #1 ;)
<DosTuMai> D'aww, but that's the most fun step!
<daftykins> yep, it's the weekend alright
<OerHeks> he he .. i am going into reserve mode, only the real problems.
<OerHeks> what linux are you using? i install gnome. (should i fish for more?)
<daftykins> i sense here be dragons, OerHeks ;)
<DosTuMai> Beat me to the #debian, OerHeks. xD
<OerHeks> someone make me coffee, or let my dog out!
<DosTuMai> sudo make coffee /usr/OerHeks
 * DosTuMai adds home made doughnuts to that.
<OerHeks> grep donuts | tee -a $ALL
<DosTuMai> =D
<daftykins> i'll take the dog for a walk if there's coffee and doughnuts when i return
<DosTuMai> Wont be any left if I'm involved...
<daftykins> i'll fight you for them!
<daftykins> except you're a lass, so i guess i'd lose by default
<daftykins> DAMN!
 * DosTuMai idly brandishes a large, black dildo in daftykins' general direction.
<daftykins> DosTuMai: i find you far too naughty to be a mild mannered Linux running lass
<daftykins> :P
<DosTuMai> I'm an ex-army Linux running mountainbiking lass. So 'mild mannered' comes out as an unknown grep error.
<OerHeks> nice, i a have no driving license, so bike a lot.
<DosTuMai> 2 wheels are better than 4.
<OerHeks> cheaper yeah
<DosTuMai> And more fun.
<Bashing-om> ^^ and the 2 wheels utilize a renewable resource . :)
<OerHeks> My dog loves to ride too
<OerHeks> a car goes too fast, and then he misses "ohhh see that cute dog!"
<DosTuMai> Calorie-propelled vehicles! =D
<OerHeks> no parking problems
<DosTuMai> Depends on the kind of bike, and the area you're parking in...
<DosTuMai> I miss my trail dog. She was awesome.
<DosTuMai> FYI: Debian doesn't like disabling search on Gnome. You need to make your own GUI for that.
<OerHeks> I got banned multiple times from debian.
<DosTuMai> Is there anywhere you don't get banned from? xD
<OerHeks> They hate my cloak, i guess.
<OerHeks> nope, not even christian channels.
<DosTuMai> D=
<DosTuMai> I get banned from christian channels regularly for being a satal worshipping, baby eating, murdering atheist lesbian...
<OerHeks> Heks = Witch ( dutch)
<OerHeks> So you like babies too ?
<DosTuMai> Ohyus, doesn't everyone like talking sausages? Or in some circles; the other _other_ white meat.
<daftykins> oh yeah we were talking about the bikes before i left, weren't we
<daftykins> my brain misfiled that entire convo.
<DosTuMai> We were, but now it's moved on to how tasty small children are in a mango sauce.
<daftykins> \o/
<daftykins> hmm i should do food about now as it goes
<DosTuMai> Already eaten, I had mac & cheese with loads of bacon.
<OerHeks> Rice and Beans tonight ..
<EriC^^> burger king here
<DosTuMai> Ick.
<EriC^^> yum
<EriC^^> :|-
<DosTuMai> Rice and beans as in West-Indian rice 'n' pea?
<EriC^^> ( homor simpson drool )
<OerHeks> Yes, and chicken, sate, and some weird stuff from a jar.
<DosTuMai> Wooo, Das Hoff on the radio! *Dances liek a True Survivor.*
<DosTuMai> Sounds soooo nice, OerHeks.
<OerHeks> But money?no, i got no money
<OerHeks> Ship with money should be comming in.
<DosTuMai> Don't need much of that stuff.
<OerHeks> As long as my dog got his food, i am oke.
<DosTuMai> ^_^
<EriC^^> happy dog, happy furniture
<OerHeks> He leaves my shoes and furniture alone. up to now.
<HackerII> http://lxer.com/module/newswire/ext_link.php?rid=220741
<DosTuMai> I've got a cat that's obsessed with sleeping on my shoes.
<HackerII> is his name boots ?
<DosTuMai> No, her name is Olivia.
<DosTuMai> Awesome link, HackerII. Reminds me not to move to US.
<HackerII> well, the nsa is world wide, dont kid urself
<HackerII> and at this point, the tech they have were not privy to is beyong conventional comprehension
<EriC^^> of course they have stuff nobody can even dream up yet
<EriC^^> in like 20 years it'll be common stuff and public, and they'll have stuff then that nobody can dream up either
<DosTuMai> I don't know whether to put that comment down to severe paranoia...
<EriC^^> lol
<HackerII> yep, ive been building and repairing electronics for 35 yrs, back in 99/2000, we were converting cable boxes, no one believed they had mics in them, till i broke them down and showed them.'
<EriC^^> put it down to an acid trip where we came up with the idea that a group of people are controlling the planet
<HackerII> truth is stranger than fiction
<EriC^^> the internet we're using right now came from the war right?
<EriC^^> and so did tv's and whatever, then later became commercial technologies, so it's pretty logical to assume they have stuff that isn't public right now, that will be in the future though
<HackerII> germany had tv first, they figured out the 60 cycle effect on the mind
<HackerII> aplha data beta waves
<EriC^^> anyways it doesn't affect us really if they can decrypt stuff so who cares
<DosTuMai> ^That.
<EriC^^> it's not surprising though
<DosTuMai> Cryptology has advanced exponentially in the last 10 years. That the NSA can crack things easily isn't really news. Most government agencies have experimental, and high-tech equipment.
<EriC^^> yeah, lots of money and tech
<DosTuMai> Also: Beta waves have no effect on the human brain.
<HackerII> http://mentalhealthdaily.com/2014/04/15/5-types-of-brain-waves-frequencies-gamma-beta-alpha-theta-delta/
<DosTuMai> [Citation needed]
<EriC^^> what is this freshman english? it's on the internet ffs, of course it's true :D
 * DosTuMai waddles off to PubMed.
<EriC^^> lol j/k
 * daftykins wonders if that's medicine delivered via a pub
<HackerII> rectally
<DosTuMai> It's for public access to peer-reviewed medical journals.
<HackerII> the same institutions that educate these people, are owned by the same money people who pring the money
<HackerII> get that straight
<EriC^^> your sentence makes me think of pringles for some reason
<EriC^^> i have no idea why
<HackerII> eat my son, eeeaaat
<EriC^^> lol
<HackerII> lol
<HackerII> cannonicle should make tater chips
<HackerII> canonacle in a can
<DosTuMai> You're typing to someone with Dr. in front of their name, so yah.
<HackerII> so, im an engineer whats your point, i have nothing to prove.
<EriC^^> what kind of doctor are you DosTuMai ?
<HackerII> spin
<DosTuMai> Physics. >_>
<EriC^^> PhD in physics?
<HackerII> sitting on irc ?, huh, im retired, i have an excuse
<DosTuMai> Well, it's 2100 where I am.
<daftykins> hey i thought you were in Canada o0
<DosTuMai> Born there, don't live there.
<DosTuMai> Pondering a move to Sweden at the moment.
<daftykins> o rly
<daftykins> i was all "but that's my timezone!"
<DosTuMai> I'm in England, kinda wanting to be out of here because it's falling down the pan.
<daftykins> oh no that was long ago :>
 * daftykins throws sticks from his island
<DosTuMai> Okidoki: falling farther in to the nether regions?
<daftykins> i was there just on Monday!
<daftykins> :)
 * DosTuMai NP: EVE-Radio - Lynyrd Skynyrd - Free Bird - (Rock Anthems [+Digital Booklet])
<EriC^^> been having a lot of kernel panics lately with firefox
<HackerII> iant had the first one, did u get todys update ?
<EriC^^> yeah i saw it haven't updated yet
<daftykins> that seems oddly serious for a browser to cause
<EriC^^> i used to get them a lot, especially in youtube
<EriC^^> they started again recently
<OerHeks> lots of hackers with malicious .flv ?
<EriC^^> *shrug*
<OerHeks> i love those pasting guys
<HackerII> does it happen w chrome ?
 * DosTuMai sings along to Head Like a Hole -- NIN.
<EriC^^> i dont use chrome that often
<OerHeks> chrome runs fine, i have no issues at all
<HackerII> what about reqonk
<EriC^^> i dunno what that is
<HackerII> sry rekonq
<EriC^^> it's a browser?
<HackerII> ya
<EriC^^> never used it
<EriC^^> !info reqonk
<ubot5`> Package reqonk does not exist in vivid
<HackerII> its for kde
<EriC^^> !info rekonq
<ubot5`> rekonq (source: rekonq): KDE web browser based on Webkit. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.4.2-0ubuntu2 (vivid), package size 5059 kB, installed size 9023 kB
<EriC^^> lightweight?
<EriC^^> 9mb
<HackerII> i like it
<EriC^^> that guy just reminded me of that movie where the 2 models are trying to get the files out of the pc
<EriC^^> what's it called? the one with ben stiller
<DosTuMai> They're _inside_ the computer! *Throws it off a balcony.*
<EriC^^> he's like leave, quit, exit
<OerHeks> zoolander?
<EriC^^> damn pc won't listen
<Ben64> yep
<OerHeks> :-D
<EriC^^> yeah OerHeks :D
<OerHeks> awesome movie indeed
 * DosTuMai does Magnum.
<OerHeks> Magnum a. the icecream b. the hawaiian detective or c. the gun ?
<OerHeks> or D. Champagne :-D
<daftykins> :>
<OerHeks> â
<DosTuMai> Magnum the pose that Derek Zoolander does.
<OerHeks> Oh, that 'Bowie-style'
<DosTuMai> Bowie. *Dribbles.*
<daftykins> seems i always get stuck down a rabbit hole when i try and deal with someone and xrandr Â¬_Â¬
<EriC^^> this is pretty odd
<EriC^^> perms are ok in the home dir, .profile and .bashrc are fine, won't login
<EriC^^> no .xsession-errors gdm logs dont say much
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: Maybe (a) proprietary driver did not build for graphics ? Xorg.0.log ?
<daftykins> hey guys i just stitched together a panoramic snap of my pics from the weekend
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/5oqutkua3569u8f/hill_pano.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> it's like 5MB though so be warned :)
<EriC^^> his other user works
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: Only 3 things I know of less corrrupted DE. Can we see any errors if he starts the desktop from terminal ?
<DosTuMai> Beautiful picture, daftykins. =D
<daftykins> ty!
<EriC^^> nice pic
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/fa4aotoq5h9fl3p/hilltop_pano.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> just made a second too
<daftykins> east sussex downs are pretty cool
<EriC^^> Bashing-om: yeah i just asked him to run startx
<OerHeks> nice
<EriC^^> http://termbin.com/1gft
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: We know what DE he is running .. maybe 'startx' is not a good thing ?
<OerHeks> i think that is the cause of his issue ..
<EriC^^> he's using gnome, startx is fine might say what's wrong since the logs show nothing, won't harm
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: K; as all else has failed, how bot deleteing the config files ? ~/.dmrc , ~/.config/dconf and ~/.config/compiz-1 ? See what happens on the re-boot ??
<EriC^^> i think it's a pam issue
<EriC^^> hmm thought he meant it asks twice then works fine, i dunno
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: I keep look'n over your shoulder. I am sure now of a learning experience.
<DosTuMai> Don't people ever think of using google before asking in IRC?
<EriC^^> Bashing-om: :)
<OerHeks> Bing gives nice results too.
<wileee> so boring here I'm upgrading from 15.04 to 15.10 to watch the cli like zippy the pinhead
<OerHeks> so against your own advice, you upgrade before release?
<OerHeks> :-D
<wileee> that was after
<OerHeks> my advise: download the iso and put it on usb, before upgrading.
<wileee> this time, heh, gotta go with the channel
<wileee> I usually fresh install, it's just faster with my older computer, download is fast.
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<EriC^^> hi pauljw
<EriC^^> how's it going?
<pauljw> good, you?
<EriC^^> good, thanks
<pauljw> :)
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-10-17
<DosTuMai> https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1XfDBb8toplTVlvZnhUVjZ5bFU/view
<wileee> just had a 1 hr or so upgrade to 15.10, used to be longer, must be the SSD, the processing was much faster
<DosTuMai> Nice.
<wileee> used to be 4 hrs, this sounds like a miracle now, not possible
<wileee> slightly faster download with infinity vs comcast however
<DosTuMai> Because comcast sucks.
<wileee> the gnome-shell 3.16 desktop has made the bottom panel a pop put from left, that is a  nice change
<wileee> out*
<wileee> yeah, you have to watch charges with services
<wileee> I meant centurylink, heh infinity is or was comcast
<wileee> both shady at best
<DosTuMai> http://i100.independent.co.uk/article/theres-a-petition-to-change-australias-currency-to-dollarydoos--bkWaR32hPl
<DosTuMai> If I was an Australian, I'd sign that in a heartbeat.
<wileee> isn't the media great; images for our stereotyping pleasure, can't stop even when I know I am
<pauljw> gnite all
<Bashing-om> Me too . gnite all
<OerHeks> Me wants coffee, Dog wants a walk, computer wants 8gb more.
<wileee> whoa, psychedelic man, vbox xp brainwave mind machine
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lordievader> Good morning.
<MonkeyDust> babysitter needs babysitter ... http://paste.ubuntu.com/12817415/
<MonkeyDust> i'm unable to completely remove vpn
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon to all
<MonkeyDust> lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey MonkeyDust all ok?
<MonkeyDust> babysitter needs babysitter... unable to completely remove vpn-server ... http://paste.ubuntu.com/12817415/
<MonkeyDust> "/var/lib/dpkg/info/vpnserver.postrm: 22: /var/lib/dpkg/info/vpnserver.postrm: systemctl: not found"
<lotuspsychje> !info vpnserver
<ubot5`> Package vpnserver does not exist in vivid
<lotuspsychje> MonkeyDust: wich ubuntu version?
<MonkeyDust> 14.04.3
<lotuspsychje> !info vpnserver trusty
<ubot5`> Package vpnserver does not exist in trusty
<MonkeyDust> don't know or remember when, how or why i installed it
<lotuspsychje> ppa?
<lotuspsychje> can you sudo apt-get autoremove?
<MonkeyDust> nope, i have a ppa for typhoon and google-earth, already checked
<MonkeyDust> autoremove is part of my update script
<MonkeyDust> custom*
<MonkeyDust> and for skype *blush*
<lotuspsychje> how about sudo dpkg --purge vpnserver
<MonkeyDust> if that simple commands helps, i'll eat my shorts
<MonkeyDust> nope
<lotuspsychje> just trying to help :p
<MonkeyDust> "subprocess installed post-removal script returned error exit status 127"
<lotuspsychje> how about dpkg --remove --force-all vpnserver
<lotuspsychje> MonkeyDust: this guy cleans up that /var/lib: http://blog.bodhizazen.net/linux/apt-get-how-to-fix-very-broken-packages/
<MonkeyDust> getting this error, but --purge didnt help: "dpkg: warning: ignoring request to remove vpnserver, only the config files of which are on the system; use --purge to remove them too"
<MonkeyDust> lotuspsychje  it's gone, i owe you a beer
<lotuspsychje> !yay
<ubot5`> Glad you made it! :-)
<MonkeyDust> !cookie | lotuspsychje
<ubot5`> lotuspsychje: Wow! You're such a great helper, you deserve a cookie!
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> i usually clean up things with bleachbit
<lotuspsychje> but not sure this case would have helped
<MonkeyDust> bleachbit removed too much, more than once, i no longer use it
<lotuspsychje> i kinda like it with specific scan, not all enabled
<lotuspsychje> few days left for wily :p
<lotuspsychje> !isitoutyet
<ubot5`> Not yet!
<MonkeyDust> i have wily in vmware
<MonkeyDust> let's see...
<lotuspsychje> MonkeyDust: how does it feel like
<MonkeyDust> MATE... works nice
<lotuspsychje> ubuntu mate wily?
<MonkeyDust> yes
<lotuspsychje> nice nice :p
<MonkeyDust> one minor glitch: vmware tools don't seem to work... they do for the vivid guest, however
<lotuspsychje> maybe theyl fix on official release
<MonkeyDust> guess so
<lotuspsychje> theyr pretty busy this week :p
<MonkeyDust> full-upgrading...
<lotuspsychje> nice :p
<lotuspsychje> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-15.10-Final-Freeze
 * DosTuMai NP: EVE Radio - Canadian Horse Pirates - BronyCAN [The Last Saskatchewan Pirate]
 * DosTuMai dances & sings along.
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon EriC^^
<EriC^^> afternoon lotuspsychje :)
<lotuspsychje> hiya OerHeks
<OerHeks> hi lotuspsychje
<OerHeks> and EriC^^
<EriC^^> hi OerHeks :)
<lotuspsychje> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=2560-linux-gpus&num=1
<lotuspsychje> good evening BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> hey lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> good evening Bashing-om
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Hiya mate, Yeah I be early .. but I miss anything exciting ?
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: support is pretty active today
<lotuspsychje> with calmness in between :p
<Bashing-om> great. I get caught up. The forum is slow on my support .
<lotuspsychje> wixh forum?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: That be ubuntuforums.org . I fairly active on that one.
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: are you trying to solve issues there?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: yeah, I generally have 3 thorny ones going and a bunch of quickies .
<lotuspsychje> nice!
<lotuspsychje> i love askbuntu little more as several answers come by
<Bashing-om> It is " what can 'I' learn today " ; blows me away sometimes what I pick up on .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: you browsing latest issues then?
<Bashing-om> Yeah, mostly .. with attention to old posts .
<lotuspsychje> nice nice
<lotuspsychje> anyone wanna win the E5?
<lotuspsychje> https://insights.ubuntu.com/2015/10/16/origami-wily-werewolf-competition/?utm_source=ubunteu&utm_medium=url_shortner&utm_term=IYmaNu&utm_campaign=shortner
<OerHeks> lotus: You enter by submitting your picture of a origami version of Wily Werewolf on Twitter .. do you have twitter?
 * OerHeks not
<lotuspsychje> neither :p
<lotuspsychje> i can vow a paper plane thats all!
<OerHeks> no twitter, no facebook .. no VMware ..
<OerHeks> :-D
 * lotuspsychje throws the paper plane to EriC^^ 
<lotuspsychje> lol OerHeks
<OerHeks> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=it-vXwAElUU
<EriC^^> lol lotuspsychje
 * OerHeks folds a paper-drone
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> bbl
<OerHeks> i think i'll submit my werewolfie https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6885560/Drabber-bot.JPG
<OerHeks> i am dreaming about installing windows 10 on my pc .. wake me up please!
 * iaMuTsoD slaps OerHeks around a bit with the Win ME bugs catalogue.
<EriC^^> weight lift much?
 * OerHeks wakes up and finds an early xmas present https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6885560/newlinux.JPG
<iaMuTsoD> No, I just paid someone to borrow a crane.
<EriC^^> haha
<iaMuTsoD> Nice, OerHeks. =D
<OerHeks> now i need to learn yum
<daftykins> hey folks :)
<daftykins> been for a walk today down the south-west coast
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/p5ibnpp8s9m20wb/IMG_20151017_174326.jpg?dl=0
<EriC^^> very nice
<TJ-> Shame you didn't catch our poachers!
<daftykins> TJ-: someone been sneaking onto your land!?
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Is that other islands in the background, across the water ?
<daftykins> nah all Guernsey and rocks there, westward has nothing before you reach Canada practically
<daftykins> i've got some of the neighbouring rocks eastwards, i live in town just beside them so see them everyday
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/2hrb4l739ttzr18/IMG_20150727_154936.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> there we are
<daftykins> that's an old one from July of a cruise ship moored between the islands
<TJ-> daftykins: Yeah, around 2100, had to chase them :)
<daftykins> :O
<daftykins> TJ-: do you have some livestock?
<TJ-> No, all arable. They may have been prowling around the buildings or equipment. Locked the gates so they were delated leaving and was able to follow and get the registration number. Got them on the CCTV too
<wileee> any free cream
<daftykins> \o/ anything you can pursue with the police?
<daftykins> jasondockers was an unhappy customer
<TJ-> yeah, reported it at the time. Will look around in daylight for any signs of damage/theft
<TJ-> multi-monitor is a pain at times; beggers belief that many of the developers working on that code don't use mulit-monitors, or even test the code !
<daftykins> :)
<daftykins> it's quite the shock
<wileee> ah, poachers, had some things stolen here lately, funniest was a laundry cart
<daftykins> lol
<TJ-> nicked your nickers?
<wileee> heh, yeah my bosses, did lose my soft seat cover on the bike though.
<wileee> loose*
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-10-18
<DosTuMai> Here's a pic of my pussy:
<DosTuMai> https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/11057217_829740863768380_3553304125574575714_n.jpg?oh=5ed843c79ecd732dbf0e19c4d7f20496&oe=56C387C9
<cfhowlett> DosTuMai, get out of here with your stupidty
<DosTuMai> It's the feline kind. O_o
<DosTuMai> And I clicked the wrong channel. But hey, take it serious. Sure.
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> !info firefox
<ubot5`> firefox (source: firefox): Safe and easy web browser from Mozilla. In component main, is optional. Version 41.0.2+build2-0ubuntu0.15.04.1 (vivid), package size 42407 kB, installed size 102426 kB
<lotuspsychje> morning wileee :p
<wileee> hello lotuspsychje weather nice there, late summer here
<lotuspsychje> nice mate! enjoy a sunny lazy sunday :p
<wileee> cool, just chillin watching an original star trek on digital broadcast\
<wileee> over the air
<lotuspsychje> wileee: your a star trek fan heh
<wileee> I have the originals, this is on once a week, but I've seen these more times than I can count. ;)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> its nice to see old stuff on led tv
<lotuspsychje> in hd
<wileee> I had a pseudo multicultural class that used an orig episode, yeah exactly, re digitized perfect resolution on the samsung 32 inch
<lotuspsychje> niceee
<wileee> little meds, cough and you know....nirvana
<lotuspsychje> hehe
<lotuspsychje> ive watched some nice older martial arts movies in hd
<lotuspsychje> sweet memorys :p
<wileee> I get the net on the tv, and have the canadian NFB films app, interesting stuff, from 1950's on indust, arts...etc socialist media
<lotuspsychje> cool
<wileee> https://www.nfb.ca/explore-all-films/
<wileee> Lots of stuff, great at 3 am
<lotuspsychje> nice tnx!
<wileee> np ;)
<lordievader> Good morning.
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<daftykins> hi all \o
<daftykins> a_ [~a@117.221.88.131] <-- one of our usual timewasters?
<pauljw> hey daftykins :)
<daftykins> how are we doing today?
<pauljw> doing well thanks, you?
<daftykins> yep all good here :) just got a nice hot sausage roll at a pasty company around the corner from my house
<daftykins> living 10m from the high street has its' benefits :D
<pauljw> heheh...
<daftykins> oh my my the weekend trolls are strong
<pauljw> oh yeah
<EriC^^> i think this guy borked his file system or something
<daftykins> this texnicer is a weird one, saying this disk is a Windows install but ubuntu won't read it at all - SMART output looks clean too - http://paste.ubuntu.com/12845963/
<daftykins> the guy hid the serial, haha
<EriC^^> lol
<daftykins> ah you give them advice and they say "that was my plan all along!"
<daftykins> Â¬_Â¬
<EriC^^> :D
<pauljw> bbl
<daftykins> tum te tum te tum, ah a lazy sunday night
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Uh huh .. watching the "helpers" not make a boo boo !
<daftykins> :)
<OerHeks> hmmm FUD or True ? https://www.gamingonlinux.com/articles/valve-looks-like-its-removed-the-steamos-icon-for-games-that-work-on-linux-but-not-perfectly-on-steamos.6085
<JanC> OerHeks: sounds like a sensible thing to do for Valve
<daftykins> TJ-: o/ hope yourself and the huskies are free from pilfering rustlers :)
<TJ-> Haha! Turned out it was someone we know, and has permission... but turned up with someone else in a different vehicle that we didn't recognise :)
<TJ-> Bad communication: missed calls, unread SMS, etc. :)
<daftykins> ah-ha! well that's a good turn out
<TJ-> Has anyone played about with using LXC unprivileged application-specific containers? I'm exploring the best way to write a tool to automate the creation of an LXC config file by analysing the strace of a candidate application. For things like sandboxing the user's web-browser and other common applications to prevent inadvertent/malicious data snooping
<daftykins> 'fraid not
<TJ-> Looks like a candidate for a few days tinkering and hacking :)
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-10-17
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Comming to you live in a SSD with 16.04 - but I have had my misadventures ! Ya said ya got some advise on maintaining this SSD ? -
<lotuspsychje> nice Bashing-om !
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: what issues did you come across?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Still not certain .. system freezing up - Possible that my partitoning scheme was a bad bad idea . reinstalled as full disk and full desktop install .. so far so good .
<lotuspsychje> ah great
<lotuspsychje> bios needs to be from IDE to AHCI also
<lotuspsychje> for ssd
<lotuspsychje> !info preload | Bashing-om first to install
<ubot5`> Bashing-om first to install: preload (source: preload): adaptive readahead daemon. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.6.4-2 (xenial), package size 34 kB, installed size 135 kB
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Yeah I did check that AHCI was enabled .. anything wrong with a standard mount in /etc/fstab " UUID=d9c2a8e6-d014-42a6-846f-7e7892f4aef5 /               ext4    errors=remount " ?
<lotuspsychje> no, thats good
<Bashing-om> preload install .. any configuration ?
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: no,that works automatic preloading apps, on next reboot
<lotuspsychje> !swappiness
<lotuspsychje> !swap
<ubot5`> swap is used to move unused programs and data out of main memory to make your system faster. It can also be used as extra memory if you don't have enough. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SwapFaq for more info
<Bashing-om> Then all that is left is set swappiness ??
<lotuspsychje> set swappiness on 10 instead of the 60
<Bashing-om> yeah .. on my to-do yet .
<lotuspsychje> you can also tweak fstab with stuff, but i hear ubuntu uses best already
<lotuspsychje> https://sites.google.com/site/easylinuxtipsproject/ssd
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Yeah .. that is what I gathered about tweaks .. I figger to leave well enough alone .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: setting browsers cache to 0 also helps alot on ssd
<Bashing-om> K .. will do that also .. thanks for the hints and help by the way .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: i also use 'relatime' in fstab
<lotuspsychje> and wiped discard
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Noted .. will see .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: that should do the tricks :p
<lotuspsychje> unity-tweak-tool to make your unity bit lighter/better
<lotuspsychje> and ccsm to tweak unity as your needs
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: I gonna stick with xfce :) .. I do have ubuntu full install on this box .. and have a great deal of appreciation for unity  .. but my work flow/thought-process is best in xfce .
<lotuspsychje> kk
<Bashing-om> I noticed in my prior install that the log files were not being written, Maybe the freezes were in that respect ( ??). This install looks good thus far .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: not sure what could freezed...
<lotuspsychje> can be comming from several points
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: My thoughts too .. could be a lot of things .. rather than trouble shoot, I got impatient in wanting to ger this install operational . - A new Nvisia card - GT 710 - and no open source support for it in 14.04 .
<lotuspsychje> i see
<BobbyJr> Ok sorry to jump in here, but Im looking for a cheap but well supported card to replace my current AMD 7770 (which suffers from oddly poor performance with the opensource drivers)
<BobbyJr> Is the nvidia FT 7-series worth looking at?
<BobbyJr> GT*
<lotuspsychje> BobbyJr: with wich ubuntu version?
<BobbyJr> lotuspsychje: 16.10 Gnome
<lotuspsychje> BobbyJr: you could ask in #ubuntu or #gamingonlinux where they know alof of latest cards/drivers
<lotuspsychje> BobbyJr: but i guess 16.04 would perform well on the most of cards
<Bashing-om> BobbyJr: I am verry inpressed wuth the nVidia gt 710 .. cheap at under $40 USD
<BobbyJr> Bashing-om: Thats the card Ive been looking at and tbh at that price, cant go wrong.
<Bashing-om> BobbyJr: What bkew me away .. after I found there was no open source driver ofr ot in 14,04 .. I finally got the vesa driver to load .,. and even with the vesa driver that card is sharp !
<BobbyJr> Bashing-om: Thats good news. Im assuming the support is there in 16.x. Though tbh Im in two minds whether Im sticking with Ubuntu anyway.
<lotuspsychje> bbl breakfast
<Bashing-om> BobbyJr: The support for proprietary is there in 14.04. --- 16.04 has the open source driver .
<Bashing-om> I run a minimal install .. and to install the proprietary driver is a bucket load of other stuff that I do not want .
<BobbyJr> Bashing-om: aha yeah that makes sense.
<ducasse> \o
<BluesKaj_> Hiyas all
<daftykins> \o
<ducasse> \o BluesKaj_, daftykins - how are you guys?
<daftykins> none too shabby here thanks, just trying to work out what to do with the day... and you?
<ducasse> stuck on building some stuff for yakkety, got to the i-could-do-this-but-it-will-likely-bork-my-system-stage...
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> time for a VM?
<ducasse> lxc, maybe, but i kinda really need this particular thingy on the host(s). googling for an alternative :)
<ducasse> a snap would actually be ideal here...
<BluesKaj_> Hi ducasse, daftykins ..doing fine altho Iá¸¿ seeing the dentist in 90 mins ..not looking forward to that
<daftykins> erk! fingers crossed for that going smoothly :)
<ducasse> BluesKaj_: you have my sympathy :)
<BluesKaj_> new partial in my future , altho I think thereÅ an extraction sooner ot later too
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<ducasse> hiya
<daftykins> o/
<daftykins> wb pauljw
 * daftykins is groaning looking at accomodation near London for a wedding of a friend next year
<daftykins> the weddings really need to stop :P
<pauljw> :D
<ducasse> which terminal emulator do you guys use? i need to switch, and there are just sooo many to wade through.
<daftykins> cmd.exe ?
 * daftykins ducks
<pauljw> lol
<ducasse> cmd.exe is not a terminal emulator :)
<pauljw> gnome terminal here
<ducasse> hmm.. how are the deps, i wonder? /me looks
<daftykins> i always thought it was a bit chubby, that one
<daftykins> don't folk speak of terminator and so on?
<ducasse> considering terminator, best i've found thus far.
<ducasse> i'm going to miss roxterm.
<BluesKaj_>  Hi pauljw
<pauljw> hey BluesKaj_
<daftykins> weird, my old das keyboard is working again
<daftykins> maybe it has some capacitors i can solder >:)
<ducasse> das keyboard <3
<daftykins> the cherry reds on that steelseries i bought have definitely been trashing my finger joints, so i think cherry blues are where it's at for my fingers
<pauljw> you know, solder isn't the answer for EVERYTHING... ;)
<daftykins> 8D
<ducasse> there's also duct tape :)
<daftykins> be nice if it was, Â£100 of keyboard right here :P
<pauljw> true, would be nice if you could fix it.
<ducasse> what's wrong with it?
<daftykins> well it was dropping keys up until i abandoned use of it for the new one, so for example vowels might take 5 strikes to register one press
 * daftykins opens her up
<daftykins> omw the reds on this one feel so different
<daftykins> so essentially i have one keyboard now that's nice in games and one that's nice to type on XD
<ducasse> oooh! looks like my new mikrotik will be here today! \o/
<daftykins> hrmm there are indeed some little tiny caps
<daftykins> 10uF 16V
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/o48brjqt27ppie7/IMG_20161017_133101.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> i think those are mostly USB port related though :(
<ducasse> daftykins: do they look intact?
<daftykins> they're solid so no sign of issue, yeah
<ducasse> should think there would be a very limited amount of things that can go wrong in a keyboard...
<daftykins> it's behaving when connected to these front USB ports, lets try some others
<daftykins> i have a USB Y cable to power it, since it annoyingly has the hub inside requiring more power
<daftykins> well damn, guess she's alive again... for now.
<daftykins> needs a good scrub of the keys though ;)
<ducasse> well-known issue :)
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/mj8vmv07psdwgyk/IMG_20161017_140452.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> eww
<ducasse> oh man, you're being thorough :)
<daftykins> yeah it's been dirty for a while, i'm cleaning every key with IPA right now :P
<OerHeks>  "Zesty Zapus"
<daftykins> yep, but if they do, zap 'em back
<OerHeks> jumping mouse
<ducasse> package! \o/
<ducasse> :)
<daftykins> :O
<daftykins> hey i've been typing on my das for a while now and it's back to working fine O_O
<daftykins> i wonder how long this will last...
<ducasse> hard to say, enjoy it while you can :)
<daftykins> ^_^
<daftykins> no more finger joint pain \o/
<ducasse> oh dear lord, i wonder if i should wait until the morning before i play with this...
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> yesss
<daftykins> otherwise it'll snowball ;)
<daftykins> "i'll just try one more thing..."
<ducasse> right now i'm in "wtf am i doing?"-mode :)
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> i'm seeing the dog in the safety specs
<daftykins> (meme image)
<ducasse> the docs are really good, there are just sooo much of them :)
<daftykins> hrmm can't be too ace if you can't just pick it up and go
<ducasse> you can - it is set up as a regular home router by default, and that is not what i want.
<ducasse> i want to use the provisioning and management features of the bigger mikrotik with this one, and that is a bit more complex...
<ducasse> daftykins: woohoo! got it! :)
<daftykins> \o/
<pauljw> :)
<ducasse> _now_ i'm going to delay the remaining config until tomorrow :)
<Bashing-om> System froze up again .. Ouch .. what is going on may take a bit to isolate !
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-10-18
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> hows your rocket going Bashing-om ? :p
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Well .. still having freezing episodes :( Not isolated yet to any common factor, no log entries ( as expected )) .
<lotuspsychje> hmmz
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: wich brand is your pc?
<lotuspsychje> !17.04
<ubot5`> Ubuntu 17.04 (Zesty Zapus) will be the 26th release of Ubuntu.  It is due to be released in April 2017. Discussion in #ubuntu+1
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Home build .. running a Abit main board .. and dual Athlon CPU .. Odd thing here is all installs on this SSD have freezing issues .. BUT (u)buntu 16.04 on a spinner has no issues ... hummm ???
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: im thinking...
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: can you describe at wich point freezes?
<Bashing-om> Box is running very cool !
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Nope .. not to this time .. at first I thought is was a gksu issue ,, in that when I attempted to mount internal drives from the GUI .. shortly there after a freeze would occur ( re-installed a full desktop at that point ).. but .. not messing about with the GUI and still happens . To this time I have not found a common factor .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: im guessing it could be bios/new hardware issue
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: tried setting your abit to low defaults? update bios flash?
<Bashing-om> Kinda think I am going to keep where I am .. and await sytem updates and next kernel . If I keep installing ( and fsck'n ) this SSD, will not do well for wear leveling !
<lotuspsychje> i dont think its ubuntu freezing it
<Bashing-om> Got the thought too that a updated bios chip might be a good idea ( my bios is on chip ! ).
<lotuspsychje> low defaults on abit can be also good idea to test
<lotuspsychje> abit is real stubborn, but stable board
<Bashing-om> Well. been through bios setting several times . I do not see anything I thought to change to make a difference .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: you should be able to change 'defaults' or improved settings
<Bashing-om> I have not "reset to optimized defaults " reckon a good idea to try ?
<lotuspsychje> i remember having afreezing acer laptop, with network boot enabled, i had to disable it for ssd/system freeze
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: i would first try reset to low defaults
<Bashing-om> Well .. will not hurt to try .. all that is lost in trying ia a bit of time .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: no ssd errors showing in syslog neither?
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: hmmm, i remember samsung ssd's could have a bug with some chips..VIA i presume
<Bashing-om> Been running ( light ) now for about 4 hours .. no problems - no freezes .
<Bashing-om> Nvidia chip sets .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: also check samsungs website for the latest firmware of your ssd type, you never know
<lotuspsychje> if it shows a new firmware, its highly recommended to flash it aswell
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: did you have 850 evo or 840 evo?
<Bashing-om> K .. that too is a thought .
<lotuspsychje> could also be a sata bottleneck
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Thought about the ports too .. and have changed the sata cables to different ports . with new locking cables .
<lotuspsychje> ok bad sata cables checked :p
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: another thought might be testing a lubuntu live, to make sure its not an xfce flaw?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Yeah .. done that too .. ( not for long term however ) . And As said .. my installs on the spinners have no issues .
<lotuspsychje> must be ssd/hardware level then
<lotuspsychje> something bottlenecking
<Bashing-om> Bios is old .. maybe time for that bios upgrade .... 2007 long before SSD speed was thoughgt of .
<lotuspsychje> mine is abit aswell kv8-max3 playing perfect with the ssd
<lotuspsychje> there must be something we overlook
<Bashing-om> I did see where Rod Smith cautioned that this Phoenox bios might not support GPT partitioning ( I did partition MBR ), and I can see where if GPT is a problem .. dealing with a SSD might also be a problem for this bios !
<lotuspsychje> hmm gpt partitioning?
<lotuspsychje> could try auto partition from ubuntu?
<Bashing-om> Could be - as you have said - a number of possibilities -- Graphics driver on this new card I have been running nouveau .. might see what resukts with the 367 version driver .
<lotuspsychje> ah yeah
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: time for deep investigation :p
<lotuspsychje> bbl
<Bashing-om> wont take bit a tik to install from the PPA . - as much as I do not want to go proprietary . Still a good thought to try .
<Bashing-om> bit/but*
<Bashing-om> I run me some glx-info test and compare !
<lotuspsychje> gl mate
<lotuspsychje> ttyl
<ducasse> morning all
<Bashing-om> ducasse: o/ .. A good day to ya ! As I get to me signing off place .
<ducasse> you do that. got any further diagnosing your system?
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Naw .. think I gonna next install the proprietary graphic's driver ..
<ducasse> Bashing-om: i would consider updating bios and ssd firmware, at least check if a newer bios is available.
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Yepper .. have also that thought .. my bios is on chip .. so not a great big deal to get an updatd chip . Lotus also suggested the firmware upgrade from Samsung - if there is one .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: which ssd model?
<Bashing-om> 850 pro .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: the pro models actually have a linux update tool, i think...
<ducasse> Bashing-om: anyway, best of luck! let us know if you want any help tracking this down! and sleep well :)
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Not done a lot of looking yet .. but I do understand is an .iso that you can burn as bootable !
<OerHeks> surprising top 3 .. http://i.imgur.com/OaEuuSy.png
<daftykins> hmm!
<OerHeks> not sure these numbers have a global meaning
<daftykins> could either be a sign that people with low spec systems are holding onto lubuntu to try and make them relevant still, or perhaps many see the light that 3D accelerated desktops are wasteful
<daftykins> however if the first, you don't need a new kernel on old kit :)
<nicomachus> any of you guys use screen or tmux often?
<nacc> i use screen pretty often
<nicomachus> any good tutorials out there? I've been told a few times it makes irssi over SSH a whole lot better, but reading the man page just doesn't really give me a good rundown of how to do that effectively.
<nacc> nicomachus: ssh into a server, `screen irssi`. When you want to disconnect, run ctrl+A then d, which will disconnect you from the session. When you want to reconnect, ssh back in and `screen -r`
<daftykins> yep screen here
<daftykins> screen -U irssi; for me :>
<nacc> daftykins: fair point :)
<daftykins> mind you i think i use a font without UTF characters here in KiTTY so it's all moot!
<daftykins> i still get those square boxes :>
<nacc> heh
<nicomachus> I think the detaching and reattaching is the part I'm not getting.
<nacc> nicomachus: so ctrl+a is the (iirc, default) screen metakey, 'd' tells it to detach
<nacc> now your irssi session is running in a detached screen
<nacc> it's still running, still connected to a terminal, etc.
<nicomachus> brb
<nacc> screen -r resumes that session (if there are mulitiple screens, screen will tell you their names and not resume any of them, iirc)
<daftykins> it's a pretty weird key press the first few times you use it
<nicomachus> ok, I think I get it. messing with attaching and reattaching while on some man pages
<daftykins> for some reason i always saw guides referring to using "screen -raAd" for resizing on reattach (a and A) as well as detaching an existing session (d) but i don't think they're necessary
<daftykins> you can do some pretty neat shared shell sessions with screen so someone remotely can SSH in and watch what you're doing :>
<nacc> i guess if you're connecting from multiple locations, but even then, you don't need to disconnect the other
<daftykins> yeah
<nicomachus> I've been using newsbeuter as an RSS reader lately. Have it configured on my home PC, and I've been accessing it both from my phone and laptop
<nicomachus> this could help, I suppose.
<nicomachus> newsbeuter is nice for a CLI RSS reader, btw
<daftykins> i use feedly on my phone
<nicomachus> I still need to do some more work on it to get it how I want.
<nicomachus> i thought feedly was abandonware at this point?
<daftykins> news to me if so
<nicomachus> maybe I'm thinking of something else.
<daftykins> could be, wasn't long ago i got my last update
<nicomachus> since newsbeuter is setup on my home pc though, it saves my read status no matter where I access it from. without being hosted on some cloud somewhere where you never know when it's gonna rain.
<daftykins> when at the PC/laptop i can use the chrome app too, as it's all synced online
<daftykins> yeah feedly is the same, i read something on the phone and it's instantly updated
<daftykins> free account too
<nicomachus> Chrome though.
<nicomachus> I'm done with them.
<daftykins> it's not my primary browser, and we're talking about a browser addon so i don't know if it's elsewhere
<daftykins> what's up your posterior about Google today? :)
<nicomachus> tired of relying on one company for everything.
<daftykins> hrmm
<daftykins> a client of mine wants an all in one PC, but my word they're all so rubbish
<daftykins> plus it's essentially buying a laptop and shoving it in a large screen on a desk
<nicomachus> aren't the all-in-one Mac's the same hardware as the macbooks?
<daftykins> all out of date, it's an iMac he has right now but he's finally seen the light that it's too much of a hassle to have Windows in the office, then when he wants to do something at home quickly he doesn't know how :D
<nicomachus> gonna try to put some stress on screen. brb
<daftykins> o0
<nicomachus> hey, it worked
 * nacc tries to imagine what stress is
<nicomachus> probably a bad word for it
<daftykins> nacc: being in #ubuntu
<daftykins> ;D
<nacc> lol
<nicomachus> I forced an SSH disconnect, which made my ssh sessions freeze up
<nacc> nicomachus: no it's the right word, i'm just trying to consider what that would be to screen
<nacc> ah
<nacc> that doesn't stress screen at all, fwiw :)
<nacc> screen is running purely on the remote server
<nicomachus> right. poor word choice. but it was just testing how to get back into the session after a disconnect, which is the issue I was having with irssi over SSH before using screen
<nacc> nicomachus: ah got it
<nicomachus> if I'm not paying attention and disconnect/connect a VPN or something, i would kill my SSH connections.
<daftykins> i've heard mosh is worth a play too, but it seems a bit of work
<nacc> yep, that's where screen et al can really help you out :)
<daftykins> mmm my irssi runs in a VM on my file server, i connect in from wherever i am to chat - even whilst i was in the US
<daftykins> which reminds me, got a port to close...
<nicomachus> what's the connect like across the pond to hit your file server?
<nicomachus> s/connect/connection/
<daftykins> you definitely get a bit of delay, but if the connection is good in 'murica then it's very reasonable, my islands peering is very good
<daftykins> so for example the shoddy internet connection in Estes Park was a bit bleh, but once we got down to Boulder there was a comcast business connection in the hotel there i think, it was ace
<EriC^^> hey guys
<EriC^^> daftykins o/
<daftykins> o hai
<OerHeks> :-)
<EriC^^> how's it going?
<daftykins> all good here thanks, and you?
<daftykins> any new toys recently? :D ooh how did the night time photo taking go?
<EriC^^> !ping
<ubot5`> pong!
<EriC^^> nice
<EriC^^> this samsung can really take a beating
<EriC^^> i'm good, no new toys
<EriC^^> haven't taken many pics really
<EriC^^> i think i discovered photography isn't really one of my passions, like just a once in a while hobbie thing
<EriC^^> :D
<nicomachus> samsung?
<EriC^^> ah the phone i got after my iphone started inflating
<daftykins> yeah i liked borrowing an SLR whilst hiking in Colorado, but i couldn't care to own one
<EriC^^> it's a $100 phone but i dropped it and it keeps working
<EriC^^> i literally just threw it across the room onto the bed and it bounced off the bed and landed facedown on the floor
<EriC^^> (had to take an important international call on the landline and didn't want the wifi to cut off in the room)
<daftykins> :>
<nacc> we should just pay someone to translate from what a user is asking in #ubuntu to what they should be asking
<OerHeks> nacc, i am cheap
<OerHeks> :-D
<nacc> heh
<OerHeks> he wants to boot a live iso, so switching bootdevice should be his answer.
<OerHeks> plop-i-plop
<daftykins> i always hated the ones that came in with a translator
<nicomachus> good lord this kid is insane.
<nicomachus> trying to help out this Bray guy with a missing driver, can't cut through the crap.
<nacc> couple of real hair-pullers in a ruow :)
<nacc> *row
<OerHeks> TheFatherMind is his little brother perhaps?
<Ben64> i picked the wrong time to come into #ubuntu :)
<OerHeks> Ben64, no! this session will make your chesthair grow
<OerHeks> âª winter in america is cold ..
<Ben64> productive
<OerHeks> same troll ..
<Ben64> aw, checked the logs
<Ben64> he's one of the trolls about jewish stuff
<nicomachus> oh great.
<Ben64> wait maybe he was just responding to one
<nacc> so that video he posted was just a short one that showed someone booting the plop ISO and then, I think, passing through a usb thumb drive to the vbox guest
 * nacc lets it go
<nicomachus> you actually watched it? lol
<nacc> i believe they thought they did something with 16.04 and weren't able to do it with 16.10. I'm not sure if they actually did it or not
<OerHeks> I 'd like to see the face of thefathermind when he starts his upgrade to 16.04 ..
<Ben64> it's probably possible to boot from usb in vbox
<Ben64> but... why
<Ben64> if you got the iso on a usb, you have the iso already
<OerHeks> much much faster too
<nacc> Ben64: yeah, i think that was the discussion that wasn't happening, but not sure
<OerHeks> err .. just reading "Canonical Now Offering Live Kernel Patching Services, Free for Up to Three PCs
<OerHeks> Read more: http://news.softpedia.com/news/canonical-now-offering-live-kernel-patching-services-free-for-up-to-three-pcs-509417.shtml
<nacc> not that it's super important, but only applies to 16.04 kernel stream
<nacc> probably will end up being a faq though as people on 16.10 wonder if they can use it or not
<OerHeks> goto https://ubuntu.com/livepatch, login, get token, sudo snap install canonical-livepatch and sudo canonical-livepatch enable <token>
<OerHeks> oh indeed, only supports 64-bit versions of the Ubuntu 16.04 LTS
<OerHeks> yay \0/
<Bashing-om> Hehe he ... Success on a SSD re-partition and not loose what I had !
<OerHeks> good job, Bashing-om
<Bashing-om> I was real unhappy having this one install take up the whole disk .. and recommendations were to leave a bumper zone at the end of the drive .
<OerHeks> Not sure about that beiing correct..
<OerHeks> "do not fill your ssd over 90%" also questionable
<daftykins> well if you have a drive that doesn't have any built-in spare area, you'll see speeds dramatically drop when they're full
<Bashing-om> Well .. was looking on Samsungs web site in repextto updates for the firmware .. and I see they ( at that time ) still advised a 25% bumper .. now how "needed" that is .. well beats me . I am all new to all this SSD stuff .
<Ben64> why does live patching require a subscription thing
<daftykins> Bashing-om: Often an SSD would present to an OS as say 240GB but the actual chips would be 256GB or more - the difference is called the 'spare area' and is used by the controller chips to speed up writes, rather than it having to flush old 'dirty' blocks each time. The thing with this is that it's different for every model of drive
<daftykins> i wouldn't bother going that far though (leaving unpartitioned space)
<dax> Ben64: Because the free tier only allows three systems
<dax> I assume that's how they count
<Ben64> right but i don't get it, why not just build it into the system, the kernel has allowed it for a while
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-10-19
<dax> because then they can't charge for it?
<Ben64> i guess
<Ben64> thanks OerHeks
<Ben64> could answer this dude's question in #ubuntu because of you
<nacc> Ben64: this isthe 'official line': http://blog.dustinkirkland.com/2016/10/canonical-livepatch.html#gpluscomments (FAQs re: livepatch)
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> got any wiser on the freeze Bashing-om ?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Not really .. Was of a mind was in regard to access to the spinners, I withheld access this day, and still had a freeze up . I have also shrunk the default install down to comply with the 25% bumper recommemdation . All I know to do at this point is use it and see what/when happens . Consider upgrading the bios chip !
<lotuspsychje> ouch
<lotuspsychje> weird you cant catch a syslog?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Nope, when it freeze .. it is froze ! Not even able to write to the logs . I have a few terminals open with some tests in them to see if anything gets caught . I have had this system turning and burning trying to make something happen . Can not reprodice ! .. This last freeze happened after exiting about 40 FF tabs, ITSSE going .. and data bases just open . Made another simple
<Bashing-om> edit to the data base file .. and froze up .. lost all my work up to that time ! Ouch !
<lotuspsychje> hmmz
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Just nothing to get our hands on .. As bad as I do not want to abuse that SSD .. all I know to do is use the system and make very frequent backups of my working files and data bases .
<Bashing-om> (and I really prefer xfce 4.10 over 4.12 and FireFox is not winning me back )
<lotuspsychje> you sure you got AHCI enabled in bios right
<lotuspsychje> (berfore you installed)
<lotuspsychje> as changing values, need a fresh reinstall
<Bashing-om> I have looked and looked .. There is no option to set AHCI .. think it is set as AHCI by default .. as all I have onboaord is SATA .
<lotuspsychje> hmm, must be somewhere
<lotuspsychje> ah you have no IDE,kk
<Bashing-om> When I built this box it was cutting edge and built for a file server . Even now it is still a great machine ( for what little I now do ) .
<lotuspsychje> if its latest mobo, then it surely must work with ssd right
<Bashing-om> well .. I got my doubts about the Bios .. will not hurt my feelings to upgrade . This ole motherboard is the Abit K9 SLI .
<lotuspsychje> that should work like a charm with ssd
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: I would think so .. 6 GB buss !
<lotuspsychje> did you check if there are firmwares?
<lotuspsychje> for ssd
<lotuspsychje> i had to firmware the 840 evo as it had performance bug
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: I did a cursory look .. and found nothing for the 850 EVO .. I do intend to get the maintenance .iso for linux .
<lotuspsychje> so weird
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: i bet the ##hardware guys could find something
<lotuspsychje> if spinners work allright, must be ssd related right
<lotuspsychje> not Os
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: I am think'n a jinx factor .. as I was congratulating myself on running so long with no freeze .. and no sooner the thought than the freeze occured .. and only froze up this one time today .. and been on now about 13 hours .
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Wel the spinner all have different falvors and older releases .. but YES, none of the installs on the spinners have any problems .
<lotuspsychje> some kind of random bottleneck
<Bashing-om> I do not know .. was wierd that under load did not freeze up .. and froze under a simple edit with little system load at that time .
<lotuspsychje> abit boards can be stubborn really
<lotuspsychje> but once it works, its for long time
<lotuspsychje> bios upgrade and low defaults yet to try
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Yepper ! .. My thoughts too .. upgrade the Bios .
<lotuspsychje> bbl breakfast :p
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: talk to ducasse, he also got the 850
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Yeah ducasse is very interested and helpful too .
<ducasse> morning all!
<Bashing-om> Giving it a rest, catch yall on the flip side . G nite .
<Ben64> wow, tonight is a great night for trolls
<daftykins> must be the trolls are coming in for the winter
<OerHeks> warm and cozy ... mu ha ha ha
<daftykins> :)
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<OerHeks> Haswell also leaking... good job intel :-D
<OerHeks> http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/10/flaw-in-intel-chips-could-make-malware-attacks-more-potent/
<OerHeks> intel suffers from open standards, i love the word joke
<OerHeks> ( for years now, back to 2002)
<daftykins> morning pauljw \o
<daftykins> 1171.5MB of Android 7.0 Nougat on the way down to my new phone o0
<pauljw> hi daftykins :)
<daftykins> Haswell is already 3 generations behind :>
<daftykins> 4 come the new year
<daftykins> er, no wait 2 and 3 i meant respectively
<pauljw> my laptop is using haswell, built in 2013.
<daftykins> neat generation that, not much has changed since
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<daftykins> hallo \o
<BluesKaj> hey
<pauljw> hi BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hi pauljw
<ducasse> \o
<lotuspsychje> good evening to all
<lotuspsychje> http://linux.softpedia.com/blog/ubuntu-16-10-now-offers-more-than-500-snaps-including-vlc-3-0-and-krita-3-0-509431.shtml
<lotuspsychje> wobbly windows still working like a charm on 16.04 just tested out :p
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> hey sir
<lotuspsychje> hey daftykins
<lotuspsychje> !info linux-image-generic
<ubot5`> linux-image-generic (source: linux-meta): Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version 4.4.0.43.45 (xenial), package size 2 kB, installed size 12 kB
<lotuspsychje> !info linux-image-generic yakkety
<ubot5`> linux-image-generic (source: linux-meta): Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version 4.8.0.22.31 (yakkety), package size 2 kB, installed size 12 kB
<OerHeks> that newer card 1070 wants kernel 4.8  and fresh nvidia drivers, iirc
<lotuspsychje> tnx OerHeks
<daftykins> that's my card 8D
<lotuspsychje> :p
<daftykins> and lovely it is too, now it's winter the fans don't even kick in under load!
<OerHeks> Lubuntu is the best
<OerHeks> http://imgur.com/a/uL17S
<OerHeks> yeh yeh na na na yeh yeh
<lotuspsychje> wowww
<lotuspsychje> seeding yakkety huh
<OerHeks> 200 gb+ now
<lotuspsychje> yayy
<lotuspsychje> i tested lubuntu xenial, and it rocknrolls
<lotuspsychje> best lubuntu ever
<nicomachus> !rocknroll
<nicomachus> hmmm
<lotuspsychje> lol
<nicomachus> !rock&roll
<nicomachus> ubot5 sucks. I want ubottu
<daftykins> i hope you won't try to enable people with netbooks into thinking they can keep using them, though ;)
<daftykins> not even lubuntu can save them!
<lotuspsychje> i have a netbook daftykins :p
<daftykins> lemme at it
<daftykins> i'll decommission it for you...
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> acer aspire rocketfast on ssd
<nicomachus> rm -rf /*?
<lotuspsychje> !danger
<ubot5`> DO NOT RUN THAT COMMAND! That particular command is DANGEROUS and shouldn't be uttered here. REST OF YOU: DANGER, WILL ROBINSON, DANGER! Do not use the command or utter it here thank you!
<lotuspsychje> :p
<nicomachus> oh blah blah
<lotuspsychje> haha
<nicomachus> that's why I didn't write it with sudo, duh
<daftykins> all the netbooks hardware are useless since so many GMA965 intel graphics regressions got into the kernel back in ~13.xx days
<daftykins> those things need firing out of cannons into the sun, only course of action ;)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: every box needs ubuntu, even netbooks :p
<lotuspsychje> shoot your rocket to me and ill sell them :p
<daftykins> deadly serious, it would be immoral to claim they're usable still
<lotuspsychje> so many ppl use old laptops in belgium, you have no idea
<daftykins> i figure performance and quality is just a relative thing, if it hasn't been experienced they don't know what they're missing
<lotuspsychje> my aunt has an old aspire that doesnt like lubuntu and xubuntu even, o,ly xp
<daftykins> oof
<lotuspsychje> thats the only box ever that i could not install linux on yet
<lotuspsychje> well, it installed alright, nut wasnt very useable
<daftykins> could well be the regressions i speak of!
<lotuspsychje> cant recall if it was integrated intel graphics
<lotuspsychje> aspire 1394 is think..
<daftykins> most of them were
<Bashing-om> Hello guys ; All fired up and ready to go .. Let's see what the session brings .
<lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj_
<BluesKaj_> hey lotuspsychje, Bashing-om
<Bashing-om> Hey lotuspsychje I did not expect you to still be here .. Good surprise .
<lotuspsychje> hehe
<lotuspsychje> evening chat for once :p
<Bashing-om> BluesKaj_: Good to read you also ! A good day in our neighborhood ?
<BluesKaj_> Bashing-om,well ok here except for some probs with my old pc , orherwise fine, how about you?
<lotuspsychje> what probs
<BluesKaj_> just a chain of events that seem like gremlins are anticipating my every move
<lotuspsychje> lol
<Bashing-om> My system, the jury is still out . Holding my breath for freezing incidents - so far so good .. maybe resolved . - Anything I can do for your system to make it feel better ?
<lotuspsychje> hey wafflejock
<wafflejock> hey how is going lotuspsychje
<wafflejock> is it*
<lotuspsychje> great on this side of the world :p
<BluesKaj_> 16.10 final release was a disaster for my pc, the cdrom  died , then my drive in the lapop is no longer recognized ...the list goes on
<lotuspsychje> wow
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: getting awfully late there, isn't it?
<wafflejock> bummer
<lotuspsychje> 21.46 here nicomachus :p
<wafflejock> I have some issue with HDMI out on 16.04 and 16.10 that doesn't happen on 14.04 no idea what it is though, screen looks horizontally interlaced
<lotuspsychje> wafflejock: perhaps drivers issue?
<wafflejock> probably gonna try the display port though.... want to help fix the issue but don't want to have to mess with it for dual monitors
<wafflejock> lotuspsychje, yeah obrien suggested installing intel stack from them I did that but no go
<nicomachus> wafflejock: haven't seen that myself. I use HDMI on my HTPC at home running 16.04
<wafflejock> nicomachus, picture of it here https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/photo/108173165070170894192/6329992220494460850?icm=false maybe something interesting taking a screenshot it doesn't show the problem at all
<lotuspsychje> wow
<wafflejock> yeah psychedelic but not the effect I was going for :)
<wafflejock> screen reports the same vertical and horizontal refresh rate as when it's working with 14.04 too I dunno
<lotuspsychje> xrandr --auto ?
<wafflejock> yah I tried xrandr all sorts of things nothing worked, some were a little less bad and others more bad but nothing working
<lotuspsychje> weird
<nicomachus> wafflejock: whoa. definitely seems like a driver issue, or even hardware.
<lotuspsychje> yeah driver issue is my guess too
<nicomachus> also: full screen window for hexchat? what a waste of real estate
<lotuspsychje> wich card is that wafflejock
<nicomachus> :P
<wafflejock> nicomachus, well know it's not hardware cause I made a bootable 14.04 and that worked out so guess is also something with the driver or X but not sure how to debug either really
<wafflejock> nicomachus, hehe
<wafflejock> nicomachus, this is why I need more monitors :)
<wafflejock> http://paste.ubuntu.com/23350330/ <-- lshw  and lspci -k --> http://paste.ubuntu.com/23350333/
<nicomachus> so no dedicated GPU? just intel?
<wafflejock> lotuspsychje, ^^ video driver info
<wafflejock> ya
<wafflejock> just my laptop
<nicomachus> same driver I'm using here... but I'm using VGA with my external monitor. and only 1 external.
<wafflejock> yah I have the 1 though VGA that's fine, but before had VGA and HDMI working okay so long as I turned off the laptop display
<nicomachus> yea intel would have trouble with 3
<wafflejock> with 3 on I would get some CRTC error but wouldn't do anything to crazy would only allow 2 displays active
<nicomachus> now that I think about it, I have had a monitor with VGA and a TV with HDMI plugged in, with the screen on.
<nicomachus> but the tearing on the TV was so awful I ended up unplugging the HDMI
<wafflejock> yeah I really didn't have many problems before, it was slightly noticeable that the VGA wasn't completely sharp compared to the HDMI but easily usable
<nicomachus> I wanna say I was on 15.10 still when I did it.
<wafflejock> I've got a display port on here though so thinking of just grabbing a display port to HDMI since my monitor has no display port and praying that works out
<lotuspsychje> some nice latest shots: http://www.deviantart.com/browse/all/customization/screenshots/nix/?order=5&offset=0
<wafflejock> I also have a way better desktop already hooked up to both monitors but don't think I've upgraded that one yet and like to have it as the gaming machine so I'm not working on the gaming machine, anyhow will figure something out let me know if you guys have other debug ideas
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: ooh. I like the GTK theme there.
<nicomachus> can I get a screenfetch?
<lotuspsychje> linux is very alive so it seems :p
<nicomachus> oh that's not you
<lotuspsychje> no :p
<lotuspsychje> but i have a few on first xenial installs
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: http://lotuspsychje.deviantart.com/gallery/
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: you need screenfetch. :)
<lotuspsychje> !info screenfetch
<ubot5`> screenfetch (source: screenfetch): Bash Screenshot Information Tool. In component universe, is optional. Version 3.7.0-1 (xenial), package size 39 kB, installed size 206 kB
<nicomachus> http://i.imgur.com/LCCLj3q.jpg
<daftykins> wafflejock: don't ever install anything intel from intel on *buntu :)
<lotuspsychje> cool!
<daftykins> all you do is break things even more :>
<wafflejock> daftykins, it was sort of a last ditch effort :)
<daftykins> yep last 'cause now you can't go back without effort ;)
<daftykins> wafflejock: need a /var/log/Xorg.0.log really to see what's going on there
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: https://paste.ubuntu.com/23350385/
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: there you go. :)
<nicomachus> it just gives all the info in one go.
<lotuspsychje> great hint tnx
<nicomachus> you can mess with colors on that *buntu logo, too
<nicomachus> you can even mess with people and change the logo to debian or arch or gentoo or manjaro etc etc
<gebruiker> guys I am looking for a countdown timer - anny recommendations?
<wafflejock> daftykins, should I try to clear the Xorg.0.log first and plug in the monitor to see if there's anything new or just hook it up and dump the log file?
<daftykins> wafflejock: is it the primary and only display?
<daftykins> fresh boot with it in ideally
<daftykins> assuming it's repeatable every time
<wafflejock> no it's a laptop, but just the HDMI out isn't working, happens consistently
<daftykins> and it's definitely not a hybrid graphics machine?
<wafflejock> okay will hook it up and reboot and drop the file
<wafflejock> yah intel only
<daftykins> might be interesting to see a real life pic of the effect, also
<daftykins> but this is why we don't upgrade meaninglessly people! "if it ain't broke..." ;D
<nicomachus> daftykins: he said it was broke in 16.04 too though
<daftykins> i read that it *worked* in 14.04
<wafflejock> daftykins, yeah works fine in 14.04 (tried with live environment after upgrading from there where it was working)
<wafflejock> 16.04 and 16.10 seems broken
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: looking good this http://www.deviantart.com/art/Ubuntu-16-04-631715365
<wafflejock> I upgraded from 14.04 to 16.04 and tried the 16.10 live
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: I like that one.
<lotuspsychje> wafflejock: tried a clean 16.04.1 also?
<nicomachus> not a huge fan of all the system stats on the left, especially with a notification pop-up covering a good portion. but oh well.
<wafflejock> lotuspsychje, well tried from a live 16.04 but not clean install
<nicomachus> s/left/right/
<wafflejock> lotuspsychje, I figure doing the live usb was good enough to avoid any old config problems or anything like that
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: yeah i like minimal myself
<wafflejock> daftykins, one sec will paste links from above with details I had already
<wafflejock> daftykins, https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/photo/108173165070170894192/6329992220494460850?icm=false <-- image of the problem
<wafflejock> daftykins, http://paste.ubuntu.com/23350330/ <-- lshw  and lspci -k --> http://paste.ubuntu.com/23350333/
<daftykins> wow is that meant to be the wallpaper? :D
<wafflejock> daftykins, I'll get it rebooted and hooked up to the HDMI in a few minutes and drop the Xorg
<OerHeks> http://imgur.com/a/JXHUk
<wafflejock> daftykins, heh yeah that's the problem looks like horizontal interlacing it's wacky
<lotuspsychje> nice one OerHeks like it!
<wafflejock> daftykins, I tried all sorts of xrandr mode setting and whatever but nothing working on that HDMI out all some sort of wrong scaling or something weird going on, but works on live usb with 14.04
<daftykins> mmm
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: whats the _ _ _ indicator?
<OerHeks> classicmenu indicator
<OerHeks> for the old gnome2 style app menu
<lotuspsychje> ah right, forgot that it changed icon
<lotuspsychje> was an ubuntu circle before right
<OerHeks> the ubuntu menu is not something helpfull.
<wafflejock> daftykins, actually gonna take the doge for a walk so he doesn't make a mess but brb
<lotuspsychje> OerHeks: agree, its too lagy and too...
<OerHeks> not tweakable :-D
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<lotuspsychje> where is the users choice when you need it..and on linux?
<gebruiker> what app would you recommend to configure mime-types in Unity?
<daftykins> gebruiker: this isn't a support channel, it says so in the topic - please join #ubuntu for that.
<lotuspsychje> gebruiker: questions like that you can safely ask in #ubuntu also
<OerHeks> besides the poor choise in systemsettings, there is no app afaik
<gebruiker> ah shit i thought i was in #ubuntu
<gebruiker> lol
<daftykins> also, language.
<gebruiker> seriously? "shit" is not allowed?
<gebruiker> is this because of religious based morals?
<OerHeks> keep it family friendly
<lotuspsychje> !language
<ubot5`> The main Ubuntu channels require that you speak in calm, polite English. For other languages, please visit https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/ChannelList
<daftykins> gebruiker: no, ones where you're a human to other humans you want help from :)
<OerHeks> grandma, what do you have such big frieten
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: took me a bit to get the screenshots done and uploaded, but here's my setup. Pretty minimal. https://imgur.com/a/JP0Y0
<gebruiker> Guys, did you know that there has been research done towards using words that are considered family unfriendly, results might supprise you. That is why I asked ..
<daftykins> gebruiker: serious suggestion here, if you want help from people, quit whilst you're behind
<daftykins> fighting it just shows how much you should be avoided.
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: wow nice mate
<nicomachus> newsbeuter needs work... just started using it a couple days ago. it's nice though
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: how do you get duckduckgo in black
<gebruiker> daftykins: just pointing out biased belief systems, meant more as education than attacking daftykins
<daftykins> i didn't take it as you attacking me, i just took it as you fighting rules that you should accept, or move on
<daftykins> bye now
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: is that a newsreader or downloader?
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: ah found themes :p
<nicomachus> lotuspsychje: for duckduckgo, it's in the settings. top right. and newsbeuter is an RSS reader
<gebruiker> alright, did not know the irrationality behind it. I will leave it then. No worries
<gebruiker> bye
<nicomachus> !guidelines > gebruiker
<ubot5`> gebruiker, please see my private message
<nicomachus> I'd like to figure out how to get newsbeuter to open links in Lynx though, without changing my default browser to Lynx. because it's running on my home PC and I just get it through SSH, so opening the links in a full browser can be slowwww
<lotuspsychje> gebruiker: we all believe here in the respect for each other way-support method no offense
<gebruiker> lotuspsychje: i am not trying to impose it, if these are the guidelines than so be it. I just belief in reason rather than engraved rules, that is how I grow. To each it own, I leave it as it is
<gebruiker> :)
<lotuspsychje> gebruiker: as we have large channels here, there must exist rules somehow to keep support in a behaved way
<lotuspsychje> gebruiker: doesnt mean ypu cant think free yourself
<gebruiker> lotuspsychje: i was not pointing to perspectives i was actually pointing out to scientific research regarding the underlying beliefs of these rules and how these family un-friendly words impact childeren
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: did you try links2 yet?
<nicomachus> no, never heard of it
<lotuspsychje> !info links2
<ubot5`> links2 (source: links2): Web browser running in both graphics and text mode. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.12-1 (xenial), package size 2796 kB, installed size 4356 kB
<lotuspsychje> i love it better then lynx
<lotuspsychje> but not sure howto open links from newsbeuter
<wafflejock> daftykins, http://paste.ubuntu.com/23350513/
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: http://synflood.at/newsbeuter/newsbeuter.html
<lotuspsychje> nicomachus: http://moparx.com/configs/newsbeuter/
<lotuspsychje> an example of config
<nicomachus> yea the manpages have some info about setting the browser I think
<lotuspsychje> would be nice if worked on links2
<lotuspsychje> ok dreamtime here
<lotuspsychje> have a nice evening guys
<wafflejock> night lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> nite nite
<daftykins> wafflejock: er is that really your 16.04 install?
<daftykins> you've got the wrong trousers on, gromit!
<daftykins> Kernel command line: BOOT_IMAGE=/boot/vmlinuz-3.13.0-85-lowlatency root=UUID=d53b1c8e-3946-41d8-adb4-0775c8ed46d6 ro acpi_os_name=Linux acpi_osi= quiet splash vt.handoff=7
<daftykins> that's both 14.04's kernel and outdated
<daftykins> also not fond of those additional parameters
<wafflejock> daftykins, yeah was from an upgrade from 14.04 but I had waited till 16.04.1 came out
<wafflejock> see I should have some 4.x kernel though eh
<wafflejock> had lowlatency installed for some MIDI Jack audio stuff I was messing around with but not really actively using it on here
<wafflejock> daftykins, same problem happens when I use a bootable live USB too though, what to do?
<daftykins> if i were you, grab a 16.04.1 ISO and boot that live, see if it misbehaves
<daftykins> well it might be best to grab a log from that live session, as right now the log is flawed given the disparate versions
<wafflejock> yah I've tried that already should I boot into live and get the Xorg from there?
<wafflejock> k
<daftykins> only if it's a 16.04.1 image
<wafflejock> yeah pretty sure I still have that download just grabbed them all in the last few weeks to see what was going on here, will come with a more sane Xorg :)
<daftykins> ^_^
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-10-20
<wafflejock> daftykins, hey so turns out that was the wrong Xorg file hence the wrong version of the kernel in there, found the right one, grepping it I see some new problems showing up so going to see if I can make heads from tails out of this but let me know if you can look again (also thanks for checking it out first time around)
<wafflejock> daftykins, http://paste.ubuntu.com/23351665/ found it in ~/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log, the one in /var/log/Xorg.0.log was from april apparently before I upgraded to 16.04
<wafflejock> ah also that one is without the problem monitor hooked up, gonna reboot now that I know where the log is and hook up the HDMI one too will dump it again here
<wafflejock> daftykins, http://paste.ubuntu.com/23351686/ <-- hooked up to HDMI and VGA with this one, VGA looks good HDMI still crazy as ever
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<ducasse> morning all
<OerHeks> hey hey :-)
<ducasse> \o OerHeks - how are you?
<OerHeks> Not sure ducasse, i think i am dead
<ducasse> ooof, that is not good. :-/
<OerHeks> :-D
<OerHeks> Drabber got his friend for a visit, Pip
<OerHeks> So the peace in house has gone, boys are running and "playing"
<ducasse> ah, fun for him :) are they keeping you busy? :)
<OerHeks> No, i have time for myself, they keep each other buzy
<ducasse> i'm swapping a disk today, just need to wake up a bit more first :) root filesystem, so i need to get it right...
<EriC^^> !ping
<ubot5`> pong!
<OerHeks> Â¡pung
<EriC^^> :D
<OerHeks> hi EriC^^
<EriC^^> hi OerHeks
<ducasse> \o EriC^^
<EriC^^> hi ducasse o/
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<OerHeks> hi di hi, BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hey OerHeks
<nicomachus> lion4407 should get ZERO attention from anyone
<nicomachus> Starting at 21:55 https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2016/10/18/%23ubuntu.txt
<nicomachus> well, 21:44 really
<OerHeks> i think he encountered the vbox issue that is suited for the 4.8 kernel
<OerHeks> http://news.softpedia.com/news/virtualbox-5-1-8-out-now-oracle-adds-linux-kernel-4-8-support-in-virtualbox-5-0-509433.shtml
<nicomachus> yea, I just don't want to give him anything after that tantrum.
<OerHeks> oh, wait ..
<OerHeks> he is going to tell something maybe.. i keep quiet
<ducasse> "[21:58] <lion4407> watch the youtube link bitch and shut the fuck up" -- and nobody +b'd him?
 * ducasse is surprised
<nicomachus> he left right after that
<nicomachus> also, no ops were around at the time to get him right away.
<nicomachus> I'm sure he'll run right into a +brick wall soon.
<OerHeks> phlop bootloader, i don't know why he wants that
<ducasse> right. it's no fun to be a volunteer when people have that attitude.
<EriC^^> in the morning/afternoon time we definitely need more ops
<nicomachus> they're around, they're just in -offtopic or somewhere else and not in main
<OerHeks> As ubuntu-member, i have ops in all channels *but #ubuntu
<nicomachus> someone give this man a promotion!
<EriC^^> that's 8GMT til around 12GMT i guess
<EriC^^> troll hour and i usually dont see any ops active
<OerHeks> dec 4th i go for my next term of 2 years. or maybe now is a good time to bring this up to ubuntu-ops.
<EriC^^> :D
 * OerHeks feels blue
<daftykins> wafflejock: ooh-err, so perhaps my 16.04 education starts with it being in a new path all the time now? bit worrying how many things change for no good reason... :)
<daftykins> does that sound right to everyone else, as i've not touched 16.04... Xorg.0.log isn't in /var/log anymore? D:
<pauljw> daftykins, it's still in var/log here.
<nacc> pauljw: it's still there, but is it being written to?
<nacc> daftykins: doesn't *sound* right, but i can confirm my xorg logs for my current boot are in my .local subdir
<daftykins> ah har, so what you have in /var/log might be pre-upgrade?
<daftykins> assuming you ran one
<nacc> it appears to be from march of this year, so probably pre 16.04
<daftykins> well damn, guess i'm learning a new path :|
<daftykins> so ~/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log eh?
<nacc> in my case, oddly, it's 1.log -- i have no idea why
<nacc> 0.log is older
<daftykins> funky!
<nacc> daftykins: yeah, dont' have time to debug right now, but also don't have any isuses with graphics :)
<nacc> daftykins: doing a quick lsof to see
<nacc> http://paste.ubuntu.com/23354893/
<nacc> i wonder if this was the switch of x sessions to user
<daftykins> makes you wonder which user gets the log on a multi user system
<nacc> as Xorg is running as my user now
<pauljw> well, properties says modified/accessed today w/19.6kB of info in it.  and it references my current kernel dated 10/19/16
<nacc> daftykins: ah there are two Xorgs on my system, one running as gdm, one as me :)
<nacc> daftykins: admitteldy, i'm on 16.10 not 16.04 :)
<daftykins> ah right, makes sense - so were you to ctrl+alt+function key swap you might find another X potentially
<nacc> intereesting, there seems to be a X running on vt1 that has no session attached
<nacc> i wonder why
<nacc> i'm on the vt2 session, which is presumably why 1.log is being used
<pauljw> this is also a vbox install, but i wouldn't think that would matter.
<nacc> yeah it shouldn't
 * daftykins boots 16.10 desktop in a VM
<daftykins> XD major showstopper crash on booting in vmware
<nacc> heh
<daftykins> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/402993 reply 10
<nacc> really c 17
<nacc> nice that vmware responded
<daftykins> i'd imagine a lot of their user base are virtualising Linux :)
<ducasse> hmm, x is running as root here on two 16.10 installs.
<daftykins> yeah there's some CPU feature that that change masks out, seems to be trashing things
<daftykins> apparently 16.10 can be a bit funky under vbox too right now
<nicomachus> OerHeks was saying that the new vbox update should address some of the issues
<daftykins> gotta love it when i google for issues with vmware workstation 12 on ubuntu 16.10, i get...
<daftykins> "How-to Install VMware Workstation Pro 12 on Ubuntu 16.10 Yakkety ..."
<daftykins> :>
<OerHeks> Buy it, use it, break it, fix it, Trash it, change it, mail - upgrade it, ... daft-punk-kins
<daftykins> >:D
<ducasse> tech-no-logic...
<OerHeks> i thought there was a ban on username AlvaraMolino ...
<daftykins> what's that name about, if so?
<OerHeks> it is a guy from wikipedia-se spamming all day
<daftykins> hrmm
<OerHeks> and that guy with install-login, is also trolling, if you ask me
<nacc> seems odd for sure
<OerHeks> but if he is right, i will apologize ofcourse
<ducasse> i actually think he's genuine, but really bad at recalling exactly what he did and what happened, due to frantically trying 100 different distros and several options on each...
<daftykins> XD
<nacc> ikonia: you have more patience than i... once someone says file/directory permissions are annoying, I feel like it's only an uphill battle
<daftykins> especially if they refer to having 777'd
<Ben64> hey i did 777 recursively to /
<Ben64> how do i fix
<Ben64> :P
<nacc> not that extreme (yet), but wanting uids to magically match across multiple systems
<nicomachus> Ben64: wat
<Ben64> get that occasionally in #ubuntu
<Ben64> because people don't like having to use sudo
<nicomachus> there really should be a failsafe on that like there is on rm -rf
<Ben64> something something idiot proof something something better idiot
<nacc> heh
<nicomachus> /Â¯\_(ã)_/Â¯
<Ben64> you might want to get your hand checked out
<nicomachus> idk why it does that extra slash. i can't fix it.
<nicomachus> every time I try, it just takes out another.
<Ben64> weird
<nacc> lol
<nicomachus> I have it as an irssi alias, though, because I got tired of googling, copying, and pasting
<nacc> nicomachus, just poppin' & lockin'
<nicomachus> now I'm gonna ask in #irssi because I remembered it again
<daftykins> careful, call someone an idiot and you'll get banned!
<daftykins> ;D
<nicomachus> lol
<nicomachus> speaking from experience?
 * daftykins nods
<nicomachus> someone keeping a running tally of the chans daftykins is banned from?
<daftykins> what do you mean? it's 1.
<nicomachus> #ubuntu....?
<daftykins> hi i'm daftykins, have we met? :)
<nicomachus> once or so
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-10-21
<FireStriker> hey
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<ducasse> hi all
<lotuspsychje> morning ducasse how r you?
<ducasse> good thanks, and you?
<lotuspsychje> all great here
<lotuspsychje> a day off
<ducasse> goodie :)
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: did you follow bashing-om's problem?
<lotuspsychje> a weird 850 evo freeze system at random
<ducasse> haven't talked to him, he was here when i came on yesterday but logged off right after. last night i didn't see him. spoke to him two days ago, however, weird problem.
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: i suggested he looked for a bios upgrade and flashed a new firmware on the ssd, only suggestions i had.
<lotuspsychje> yeah same here
<lotuspsychje> breakfast time guys
<lotuspsychje> ttyl
<daftykins> yay 14.04's 3.13 kernel hit -100 \o/
<daftykins> break out the soft drinks, folks ;)
* barjavel.freenode.net changed the topic of #ubuntu-discuss to: Welcome to #ubuntu-discuss. This is a channel for high quality on-topic non-support discussions about Ubuntu | Non Ubuntu stuff to #ubuntu-offtopic or the relevant other channel | We follow the CoC at all times here | No ranting here please | Ubuntu for Phones discussion has moved to #ubuntu-touch
<nicomachus> that was quite the split
<daftykins> mmm banana split
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-10-22
<ducasse> morning all
<Bashing-om> Top o' the morn'n ducasse . A good day also to ya .
<ducasse> hi Bashing-om - how are you? did you sort out the freeze problem?
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Well .. Indications are that it is indeed Bios .. My next step is to update bios .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: right. have you looked for updates on the gigabyte site?
<Bashing-om> No, I have looked around .. not at all sure now who I can trust for the 23 version update .
<ducasse> the maker of the motherboard usually has bios updates available for many, many years, so you should be able to find one.
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Abit went out several years ago .. I be slow about deciding what source to trust .
<ducasse> ah, i thought you had gigabyte. they didn't get bought up or anything, they just went bust?
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Be that they did get bought up, I do not recall the final disposition . be an Abit KN9 SLI board .. Think'n about finding a replacement bios chip .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: seems they got bought up and is now called "universal abit". don't know if that helps...
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Yeah ,, I refuse now to get in a hurry . Kinda backing down and regrouping after all the frustration of trying to make things work - in a unworkable situation . I get bios updated will be in a better position .
<ducasse> if you have another machine, you could also use the netconsole to see if there are messages on freeze... https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Netconsole
<Bashing-om> I am leaning toward replacing the chip and keeping the old one as a better option than flashing the present chip .
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Yeah .. thought that too about bringing another box on-line . I got another I was think'n about for a media center .
<ducasse> right, if you don't already have an extra box it's a bit of a hassle. media centers are nice :)
<Bashing-om> Well .. we spend most of our time here on these terminals . Presently no push for a media center . By the way .. I do appreciate all the great input to find a solution for my little problem .
<ducasse> no problem, we're here to help, after all :) i've been thinking of building a very slim x terminal for my living room, rather than always using a laptop with small screen and poor keyboard...
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Look how cheap a chip is ! http://www.biosflash.com/e/Bios-Chips-ABIT-KN9-SLI-55.htm ! Wow . // My comfort zone for what I do with my system is a desktop and a full size keyboard !
<ducasse> Bashing-om: that's not a bad price, seems like a good solution. i just bought a new mechanical keyboard, so i've got a spare one. just need the screen and a raspberry pi or something.
<Bashing-om> I have an old ps/2 mechanical keyboard . I guess it will be burried with me when we go . I kinda like it .. and stuck on it .
<ducasse> i've used mechanical keyboards on and off for many years, but first started buying and using them exclusively a few years back. not willing to let go of the one i've got now.
<Bashing-om> OK, My time at an end ... calling it a night .. G nite
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<ducasse> \o BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hi ducasse
<ducasse> BluesKaj: quiet today, typical weekend. how are you - any plans for the day?
<BluesKaj> no plans for today..up early due to insomnia, maybe a nap this afternoon ...just setting up kodi on my 14.04 partition
<BluesKaj> and you ?
<ducasse> not much, i'm going to play a bit with the new access point, then just kill time until it's time to go out and get a huge burger for dinner :)
 * BluesKaj nods  :-)
<BluesKaj> kodi is unstable on 16.04 and 16.10, or vice versa...not sure whether it's kodi or the OSs. We need a stable OS for the HTPC, hence 14.04
<ducasse> hmm, odd. i don't think i've tried it on either, the last ubuntu i ran kodi on was probably 15.10. does it crash?
<BluesKaj> no crahes, just takes forever to close, the it crashes X , so either reboot or startx is nrequired
<BluesKaj> the=then
<ducasse> nasty, is this with the kodi from the repos?
<BluesKaj> yes
<ducasse> if i were to guess i would say that sounds like a bad interaction with a video driver, you could file a bug. that takes time to get a fix, of course.
<BluesKaj> but I haven't  tried the ppa version, which I DL's for 14.04 since kodi isn't available there
<ducasse> right, that could be worth a shot, but for a htpc 14.04 is just fine anyway.
<BluesKaj> yeah, I'm going to use 14.04 for  watching movies and listening to music ...16.10 is for testing and 17.04 soon
<ducasse> still waiting a while before i upgrade to zesty, i'm not in a hurry :)
<BluesKaj> well, I
<BluesKaj> 'll probly try it soon , upgrade from 16.10 by changing the source.list with sed. It's on a separate partition, so if it breaks there's no harm done
<ducasse> right. both my desktop and laptop have / on btrfs now, so i use snapshots for that sort of thing.
<BluesKaj> dunno anything about btrfs , never bothered trying it
<BluesKaj> I'm adventurous to some degree , but a file system that's an unknown to me is a bit more risk than i'm willing to take
<ducasse> btrfs is nice, but i'm not sure i would trust it with anything important. for that i use zfs, which is rock solid. still, it's nice to be able to rollback the filesystem to an earlier state if something breaks horribly.
<BluesKaj> I see
<ducasse> it also has stuff like built-in raid etc, but i don't use that. it's mostly comparable to zfs feature-wise, but zfs is a lot older and more mature.
<ducasse> !info python3 trusty
<ubot5`> python3 (source: python3-defaults): interactive high-level object-oriented language (default python3 version). In component main, is important. Version 3.4.0-0ubuntu2 (trusty), package size 8 kB, installed size 100 kB
<EriC^^> OerHeks for op!
<EriC^^> 2017
<EriC^^> :D
<EriC^^> there's a guy in the channel flooding and nobody's doing anything!
<ducasse> the gimp troll squad are out in full force today..
<EriC^^> i recently learned mokutil --sb-state
<EriC^^> to see if secureboot is enabled, always wondered how boot-repair's reports had a line where it says if it's enabled or not
<ducasse> interesting, thanks for the tip. never messed much with mokutil, i just disable sb.
<OerHeks> wait, i mixed up virtual servers with fantasy servers
<OerHeks> nvm
<daftykins> o0
<daftykins> the latter sounds suspicious!
<OerHeks> all on one subnet.
<Bashing-om> Here I be once more - another fine day in our nieghborhood .
<daftykins> welcome back!
<Bashing-om> 'tis good that I can be here .. is better that daftykins is here .
<daftykins> on goes the mission!
<Bashing-om> We are on it ! We can do it ! 'buntu all things are possible . ( attitude check ?)
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> though a BIOS update is a tad OS agnostic!
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Took the easy way out on the Bios thing .. got the replacement chip on the way :)
<daftykins> ah neat \o/
<daftykins> i've not tried to whip one of those chips out, is it going to come with a tool?
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Patience is a virtue, needless to say I am anxious as to how this works out . - inquirung minds want to know - now !
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Well the tool is the better option, but one can remove the chip with a bent paper clip .
<daftykins> ah that's neat, vaguely remember reading that works too
<Bashing-om> well, I am a firm believer in the right tool for the right job - Murphy's Law - what can go wrong will go wrong .
<daftykins> there is that, annoying to get something with such a unique purpose though
<Bashing-om> Uh Huh ..only take it out as the need arises .. rarely . Now is the hassel and expense justified ?
<daftykins> mmm
<Bashing-om> In my case. was only a one click deal .. and about $4 USD .. I did opt in .
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> i keep wishing i had more reason to play with my soldering iron ;)
<pauljw> :)
<Bashing-om> LOL
<Bashing-om> any thoughts here - got me guessing " BOOT_IMAGE=(hd0,msdos1)/vmlinuz root=/dev/sda1 to " to - HUH ? in grub.cfg system is mounted 'ro' .
<daftykins> had it flagged errors on boot, or is it hardcoded to mount ro in /etc/fstab ?
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Nope mount directive in ftab looks good " UUID=3a47f1f1-ed1f-4134-b6aa-be101a7d97b4 /               ext4    errors=remount-ro 0       1 "; near as I can know .
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Mind ya on the system with the new Nvidia card that has no driver support in 14.04 ... I just never seen the mount option 'to' . Do not know where 'ro' gets reset to 'to' or what 'to' means .
<daftykins> oh yeah that's a new one on me too
<daftykins> what file was your quote from?
<Bashing-om> Well .. I am no longer in a bored state of mind .. Homework to do !
<daftykins> :>
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-10-23
<Bashing-om> And a-hunt'n I shall go - rebooting . my : https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2340885  . May be awhile .
<ducasse> morning all
<Bashing-om> \0 ducasse
<ducasse> hi Bashing-om - how are you today? getting ready for some sleep?
<Bashing-om> ducasse: ZDoing well . yeah most there for sleepy bye time . Got your coffee done ?
<ducasse> Bashing-om: just sat down with a big cup of tea, waiting for it to cool down enough to drink :)
<Bashing-om> tea is good :)
<ducasse> Bashing-om: ordered the bios chip?
<Bashing-om> Uh Huh ! .. it on the way . Now be a game of patience before we look at else .
<ducasse> hope it helps, i don't really have any other suggestions...
<Bashing-om> I am much glad I can still boot up 14.04 - else I would have to put that ATI card back in .
<ducasse> what kind of video card do you have now?
<Bashing-om> ducasse: I installed a nVidia GT 710 .. too new of a card, no support for it in 14,04 .. and my bios will not handle it in 16.04 .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: right. i don't know much about video cards tbh, just use the intel gpu in my desktop - it works well enough for me.
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Well ,, the old ATI card it's self worked well for my needs, but the cooling fan in it failed . Box overheats and shuts down . So In my antcipation i over extended .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: in that case it was probably just as cheap to get a new card as to replace the fan, yes. i'm glad to avoid the binary nvidia driver hassles, though.
<Bashing-om> ducasse: I be real happy just to get nouveau to run on it . I have no real need of better graphics .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: me neither. how's the weather where you're at? here it's creeping ever closer to zero, just a couple of degrees above today. it's also been raining for over a week, real autumn weather.
<Bashing-om> autumn here too . Fired up the gas stove yesterday .
<Bashing-om> Heber Springs, AR: Temp: 46 F (8 C) ~ Clear ~ Humidity: 93% ~ Observed: Sun 23, 01:35
<ducasse> Bashing-om: yep, winter is coming. not really looking forward to the constant dark we get here.
<Bashing-om> ducasse: You must be far North - Now that I no longer have to deal with the effects of cold - I do not seem to mind Winter as much .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: norway, so not that far from the arctic circle. i don't mind the cold much, but when it's dark so much of the day for several months it can get to you.
<Bashing-om> Yeah ,, spent a few years at sea . After a couple of months cooped up aboard ship it gets to you .
<ducasse> Bashing-om: i can imagine :-/ think about the poor people on the space station, that's not a good place to freak out and panic.
<Bashing-om> Yeah ! Now that does take an attitude adjustment !
<Bashing-om> Hey, my bed is calling ,, I am calling it ,, and will do this on my morrow . G nite .
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<pauljw> hey EriC^^ :)
<EriC^^> hi pauljw :)
<EriC^^> how's it going?
<pauljw> just fine, EriC^^ , thanks.
<pauljw> you?
<EriC^^> pauljw: good thanks :)
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-10-16
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Maybe take another cup of motivation .. getting nuts in main :)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: trolls or crowdy?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Naww just off the wall stuff non procedural responses .
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> lets c
<Ben64> bazhang has too much patience
<Ben64> i'd have ban hammered immediately lol
<Bashing-om> bazhang been around here a while .. seen most of all I guess .
<Ben64> <jas> since when do you run [junk] here
<Ben64> /mode +b jas Since about 2007
<Ben64> would have been my response
<Bashing-om> That one is scating on thin ice presently .
<Ben64> yeah who uses emoji in irc
<lotuspsychje> isnt that guy a regular volunteer? his nick sounds daily?
<lotuspsychje> oh its about jas nvm
<lotuspsychje> welcome
<lotuspsychje> lol oerheks
<oerheks> really, so obvious ..
<lordievader> Good morning
<ducasse> good morning all
<lordievader> Hey ducasse
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<ducasse> up and about, trying to plan out the day. sun is shining and it seems not-freezing :) how about you?
<lordievader> Doing good here
<lordievader> Trying to wake up with coffee
<ducasse> just keep chugging it down, it's bound to work soon :)
<lordievader> Hahaha
 * lordievader bounce bounce
<EriC^^> !ping
<ubot5> pong!
<BluesKaj> Howdy all
<BluesKaj> HI EriC^^
<EriC^^> hi BluesKaj
<oerheks> :-)
<BluesKaj> hey oerheks
<oerheks> hey guys, are you all on wifi ?
<oerheks> :-D
<BluesKaj> not atm, my laptop is in suspend
<oerheks> this wpa2 crack makes more waves than kim jung ill & trump tweets together
<EriC^^> what wpa2 crack
<EriC^^> wpa2 isn't secure anymore?
<ducasse>  https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2017/10/severe-flaw-in-wpa2-protocol-leaves-wi-fi-traffic-open-to-eavesdropping/
<oerheks> jups, and https://www.krackattacks.com/
<oerheks> German dude http://papers.mathyvanhoef.com/ccs2017.pdf
<oerheks> but the attacker must be in your neighbourhood, and you must click something to reuse the key
<EriC^^> wow
<BluesKaj> heh, some of my neighbours don't know enough to use wpa2,  one didn't even use a wifi pw
<daftykins> it's all about 64-bit WEP keys
<daftykins> ;D
<BluesKaj> turns out he was using ethenet and didn't know his laptop was broadcasting wide open
<BluesKaj> thought ethernet auto-killed laptop wifi, unless it was a misconfigged router
<daftykins> nah both carry on at once always
<BluesKaj> Hi daftykins, ok, makes sense then
<daftykins> surely it wasn't the laptop sharing out a network though, that'd be odd
<BluesKaj> guess I was mistaken, must have been the router
<BluesKaj> don't think anyone around here would have realized there was no pw needed except me when I logged on to their wifi, but i let them know so not much piggy backing went on.
<daftykins> :D
<BluesKaj> local cable guy set it up ...moron
<daftykins> hmm, usually they're not allowed to touch consumer gear
<BluesKaj> it was the cable comapny's router
<BluesKaj> cable tv/internet bundle
<daftykins> ah everything ISP supplied always has default keys ime
<lordievader> The lovely thing about those company routers is that they usually have a backdoor. That way they can see everything which goes on in your network.
<BluesKaj> he neglected to setup a pw...she told me the installer didn't show them how to set up the wifi pw etc
<ducasse> i always thought they handed out those routers to give to children to practice soldering on
<BluesKaj> i have my own router , a TP-Link-TL WDR3600 and a TP-Link modem as well, which was suggested by my ISP as a compatible brand
<lordievader> Those things can be evil on ipv6
<lordievader> IIRC spamming dhcpv6 request at a rate of 300Hz while the network uses SLAAC
<BluesKaj> lordievader, what things?
<lordievader> TP-links
<BluesKaj> my ISP is strictly IPv4 afaik
<nicomachus> so how is the KRACK vuln fixed? Can kernel upgrades do it, or is the protocol itself broken?
<ducasse> the protocol, aiui
<nicomachus> aiui?
<daftykins> as he understands it
<nicomachus> oh
<daftykins> yeah so firmware all over the show
<nicomachus> so we need a new protocol then.
<daftykins> most likely gonna mean a lot of devices turn into crap
<daftykins> nah it's fixable
<ducasse> for linux, a patch to wpa_supplicant, i think
 * nicomachus sets a check for updates every hour on the hour
<ducasse> supposed to be made available later today european time
<nicomachus> ah, well that's timely. Good to know.
<nicomachus> unrelated, but --progress really should be a default option on rsync
<daftykins> anytime i've tried to use rsync i've found it prohibitively slow :<
<nicomachus> what's the alternative?
<nicomachus> for transferring files over SSH, anyway
<daftykins> depends on the scenario really
<nicomachus> "Notably, our attack is exceptionally devastating against Android 6.0:
<nicomachus> it forces the client into using a predictable all-zero encryption key."
<nicomachus> that sounds like a serious problem for Android
<ducasse> tons of fun for the gazillion devices that get no more updates
<nicomachus> I wonder what the market share is for 6.0 nowadays
<nicomachus> I'm on 8, but last I heard 4.4 was still the most common
<daftykins> it's definitely a shit-show
<daftykins> did i tell you mine made me download and install 8.0 on top of itself? o0
<freakyy> does anyone find hosting rocket.chat myself would be worth it? ;D
<daftykins> what's that and how does it relate to ubuntu?
<nicomachus> daftykins: what do you mean?
<daftykins> nicomachus: i'd put on 8.0 myself manually, then it prompted me to update to 8.0 :D thing downloaded it quite rapidly, then installed rapidly as well
<nicomachus> I tried texting my dad a few questions about this whole deal because he's in netsec for some gov contractor and all he replied was "busy"
<daftykins> build didn't change or anything
<nicomachus> oh, yea, mine did that too but I assumed it was something slightly different. Didn't check the build number. I had the 8.0 beta installed and it made me download and install the first 8.0 release.
<nicomachus> Looks like patches may be public now: https://twitter.com/vanhoefm/status/919853110700531712
<nicomachus> hostapd and wpa_supplicant
<TJ-> The patches were released just after midnight
<TJ-> Ubuntu published updated packages about an hour ago, just waiting for the release team to push them to the archives
<nicomachus> debian fix: https://lists.debian.org/debian-security-announce/2017/msg00261.html
<TJ-> LineageOS (previously Cyanognemod) has the patches in review now, so should get merged later on
<nicomachus> Just got a wpasupplicant update on my Ubuntu 16.04 laptop
<daftykins> seen a few defections to Lineage for OnePlus owners annoyed with the privacy woes that was a story in the last week
<nicomachus> Looks like Android itself won't get an update until the November 6 normal security release
<daftykins> yeah
<TJ-> unless someone releases an active exploit then Google/device-makers may move faster
<TJ-> it's not a difficult set of patches to apply after all
<nicomachus> rpi got the wpasupplicant update too.
<nicomachus> and HTPC. So I'm all up to date except for my phone. :/
<nicomachus> TJ-: I was hoping for something sooner just because Google is my carrier, manufacturer, and OS maintainer. Lol
<TJ-> nicomachus: I know, I was suprised they said they're leaving it so long. I can only guess they weren't one of the manufacturers notified during the 5-month embargo window since the exploit was discovered
<daftykins> probably down to how faceless Google is so you can't find anyone to contact :<
<TJ-> otherwise I'd have expected them to have access to the wpa_supplicant patches early and apply them and get an update out. Same as Microsoft have done with Windows
<TJ-> Ubuntu security devs didn't know about it until I told them at midday UTC
<TJ-> so they've done fabulously to turn around the updates so quickly
<nicomachus> You would think the researchers would have notified Google since one of the strongest attack vectors was on Android 6.0....
<TJ-> Yes. As I said, it's my guess based on Google's reaction. I may be wrong.
<TJ-> You'd think with the way their Project Zero operates they'd have been ready and have a fix out before the embargo ended though
<TJ-> You know what's neat about this exploit though?
<nicomachus> They have a decent reporting department don't they? I thought they were one of the best for responding to bounties, etc
<nicomachus> TJ-: please do tell
<TJ-> The researcher -  Mathy Vanhoef - found this because he was reading the source-code of wpa_supplicant whilst avoiding finishing writing up another paper he was working on, and noticed a function call ic_set_key(), and wondered what would happen if it were called twice. Made a note, went back to it some time later and discovered this issue
<TJ-> So ... more eyeballs on code do sometimes make bugs shallow
<nicomachus> +1 for FOSS?
<TJ-> and as this is a protocol bug too, not implementation, that's even more impressive
<TJ-> I'd say so yes.
<TJ-> If he'd not been prevaricating from his other work he may not have discovered it.
<nicomachus> +1 for procrastination
<TJ-> There's some indication someone spotted this potential before him too, but no indication they ever followed up on their doubts on it
<nicomachus> but honestly, who procrastinates by reading the source code of wpa_supplicant?
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> true smarticles
<TJ-> so, this could be out in use as an exploit because I would assume anyone in places like GCHQ/NSA tasked with reviewing source code for vulnerabilities would easily come to the same conclusion
<TJ-> It's the kind of question I ask myself as I'm scanning source-code all the time. I think most hackers operate in that way too
<TJ-> hackers in the sense of code-hackers, not crackers
<nicomachus> In the words of Elon Musk: Nerd.
<TJ-> That was just the Whiskey talking  :)
<TJ-> daftykins: are you getting blown about by the storm?
<TJ-> oh, in case you need to pass it on to others asking, this is the USN https://usn.ubuntu.com/usn/usn-3455-1/
<daftykins> nah just saw the yellowy skies this morning and really low light
<nicomachus> daftykins: I figured out an alternative to rsync
<nicomachus> instead of transferring all the episodes of this series I wanted to watch from my HTPC to laptop, I just symlinked ~/Videos in /var/www/html/. :D
<daftykins> haha
<daftykins> in London at the weekend i was tethering to a spare phone to get online... mooched a small TV episode from home :>
<nicomachus> hmm... pihole is blocking my access to the page for some reason.
<nicomachus> and when I try to whitelist it says "not a valid domain". bugger.
<nicomachus> oh I see now. nvm.
<nacc> oerheks: maybe i missed it, did ricmm say why they wanted to know about vivid?
<oerheks> nope..
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-10-17
<oerheks> !isitoutyet
<ubot5> Nope, it's not out yet.  Check back on Thursday!
<oerheks> ..ohhhh
<oerheks> what is not out, ubot5 ?
<oerheks> .. clever marketing
<lordievader> Good afternoon
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<EriC^^> evening all
<nicomachus> good lord, what a day on #ubuntu...
<daftykins> mmm?
<daftykins> do tell :)
<nicomachus> 12:06 < lfowlr> do you even understand it's ouput?
<nicomachus> when nacc asked for a full dmesg
<nicomachus> 12:04 < ironhoof> I am ubuntu 14.04 and after using -reinstall in the package
<nicomachus>                   manager I now have 2 init, dbus daemons, and 2 upstarts is
<nicomachus>                   there a way to correct this?
<nicomachus> that's just.... what? how does that even happen?
<ducasse> that lfowlr character just lost any attention from me by calling someone 'idiot' for the 2nd time
<nicomachus> I just want to get my scrobbling from mpd set up. :(
<nicomachus> librefm works fine. Lastfm? Noooooooo
<ducasse> mpd <3
<nicomachus> that's normally my attitude but right now I'm just ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
<nicomachus> like, mpdscribble is trying to create 2 journals at /var/cache/mpdscribble/lastfm.journal and then a pid file at /var/run/mpdscribble.pid but it doesn't have permissions for /var/
<nicomachus> and then Last.fm is failing at a handshake somewhere. It almost looks like it's trying to POST to turtle.libre.fm but that's the URL for libre.fm. Last.fm should be post.audioscrobbler.com
<nicomachus> WAIT
<nicomachus> I GOT IT
<nicomachus> OMG
<TJ-> nicomachus: ironhoof could have been on a host that had LXD or Docker container(s) running in which case process list may well show multiple instances
<nicomachus> Â¯\_(ã)_/Â¯
<nicomachus> nacc has a patience I can't match
<nacc> nicomachus: ironic, because i'm really impatient these days
<nicomachus> what does that mean for me? lol
<nacc> heh
<nicomachus> i just...
<nicomachus> "it's an infamous ubuntu error"
<nicomachus> what
<tgm4883> nacc: I'm just going to start responding to incomplete thoughts with incomplete thoughts
<nicomachus> lol
<daftykins> :)
<TJ-> lfowlr is a write-only bot :)
<daftykins> :D
<TJ-> Typical young Indian call-centre persona though
<TJ-> Bangalore
<daftykins> oh? "answers now"?
<ducasse> he seems to think he knows a lot, but actually knows very little...
<tgm4883> TJ-: yep
<daftykins> ducasse: so he's ripping off my entire support style, drat!
<daftykins> ;D
<tgm4883> The type of person that sees a firetruck and thinks there can only be a fire
<nicomachus> 12:45 < lfowlr> nacc: i don't want your "help"
<nicomachus> well, that's the end of that, I suppose.
<daftykins> how dare you help someone in a support channel!
<tgm4883> good
<nacc> I guess I do wonder if someone was to have reasonably asked "apport reported an issue, how do I find the report it generated, or the bug it filed"?
<TJ-> Sounded to me like the system failed to shutdown cleanly, maybe neeed a hard power-off. That can cause the empty "Your system crashed" popups at first log-in
<nacc> is there a straightforward answer to that?
<tgm4883> I have zero sympathy for people that refuse to actually read what people are telling them
<nacc> TJ-: ah that's a good point
<tgm4883> nacc: if apport reports and issue, there's a button for "more info" or something like that I believe
<nicomachus> nacc: I don't know if there's a centralized log of those or not. somewhere between dmesg, syslog, and /var/log/*
<ducasse> isn't there a 'details' button in those popups?
<nacc> tgm4883: right, but presuming they did report and then closed the popup?
<TJ-> nacc: originally, apport would redirect to bugs.launchpad.net to show the report, but since that was changed to go to errors.ubuntu.com that is no longer done, because LP doesn't get the report
<nicomachus> I think that's the issue. How do you find it again after you close the popup?
 * nacc has noted most apport-filed bugs don't get responses when triaged
<nacc> (for server)
<tgm4883> nacc: well then they could do it next time it pops up
<nacc> tgm4883: true
<nicomachus> tgm4883: replication can't be the only solution
<nacc> tgm4883: but that might end up being a new report (in theory)
<tgm4883> nicomachus: why not?
<nacc> i'm not sure how smart apport is
<tgm4883> nacc: nope, apport is pretty smart
<nacc> TJ-: ah that makes sense (the bugs -> errors change)
<nacc> tgm4883: oh ok
<tgm4883> nacc: errors.ubuntu.com groups them all together
<nicomachus> tgm4883: because what if you don't know what caused it? there's no log somewhere that just tracks apport?
<TJ-> dupes are detected usually and grouped
<tgm4883> nicomachus: you mean like "apport.log"?
<nicomachus> oh, yea, that. :D
<TJ-> /var/log/apport.log should track
<tgm4883> I wonder where a log file called apport.log might be :)
<tgm4883> -rw-r----- 1 root adm 0 Oct 17 07:35 /var/log/apport.log
<tgm4883> Assuming if you have an error, that populates
<nicomachus> that's what I was looking for.
<TJ-> tgm4883: I wonder, is it always empty, empty only if reports aren't filed, or contains all crashes even if not reported
<tgm4883> TJ-: all of mine are empty
<tgm4883> Then again, I don't get those types of errors
<nicomachus> I have some from today
<nicomachus> http://paste.ubuntu.com/25760722/
<nicomachus> never saw a popup for those though.
<TJ-> nicomachus: are you on 17.10 ?
<nicomachus> TJ-: no. 16.04
<TJ-> nicomachus: right, so not due to the 'we don't report pre-release bugs' then
<nicomachus> I've been using my laptop for work too much lately to go onto a beta release.
<TJ-> looks like at some point you may have checked the Ignore button for those "this executable already crashed 2 times, ignoring"
<nicomachus> possible. I was crashing that program left and right all day yesterday.
<TJ-> Did foca disappear or has just gone very quiet?
<nicomachus> he's a bit slow to respond.
<TJ-> I thought my connection had died
<daftykins> hehe the most irritating thing about support
<TJ-> I may have to go, but I'm suspecting 1 of several possibilities. wifi driver issue (dropping frames - famous in iwlwifi - Intel wifi devices), conflicting entries for both /etc/network/interfaces and NetworkManager, or some other service relied upon has been systemctl disable-d by the user.
<daftykins> oh intel, how far you've fallen
<nicomachus> :/
<TJ-> if it's currently got NM running pastebin the entire /var/log/syslog or better still "journalctl -u NetworkManager.service"
<nicomachus> TJ-: looks like a realtek driver for the ethernet
<TJ-> or e1000 - don't know which he's using
<nicomachus> I've never even seen anything buy iwlwifi for intel
<nicomachus> what is e1000e
<nacc> nicomachus: that's the ethernet driver
<nacc> nicomachus: as opposed to wifi driver
<nicomachus> I guess I just don't see that many ethernet related issues these days. It's always the wifi driver
<daftykins> :>
<TJ-> iwlwifi is the common core for all Intel wifi devices
<TJ-> e1000e is the Intel wired gigabit ethernet driver
<nicomachus> that's what I have on my embedded wifi device here.
<TJ-> iwlmvm usually depends on iwlwifi for most modern chipsets
<nicomachus> TJ-: you caught that before my SSH connection caught up. :D
<oerheks> :-)
<TJ-> Oh no :( Just discovered yet another headache we're going to hit once 17.10 is released, with Wayland compositor as the default. It doesn't/can't support screenshots - not built into the protocol or server/
<daftykins> O_O
<daftykins> how on earth was that looked over?
<TJ-> well you know... gnome devs, wayland devs, systemd, mostly employed by Red Hat. monoculture, monolithic software. "I don't need it so you can't have it"
<nacc> TJ-: hrm, i'm running Xwayland and it just took a screenshot with printscreen or the screenshot app
<nacc> TJ-: is the compositor you mentioned a different component than Xwayland itself?
<TJ-> Xserver will, but pure Wayland doesn't support it
<TJ-> I just found out reading commentary by a developer that's created a really neat screenshot capture tool and has no way to support pure Wayland/Weston whatever the implementation is called
<TJ-> you've got the Xserver in the loop so it's the same as if Wayland compositor weren't there: see https://wayland.freedesktop.org/xserver.html
<nacc> TJ-: hrm, how does oen drop Wayland out of the loop? I am on relatively stock 17.10
<nacc> err, drop Xserver out of the loop
<TJ-> I've not investigated that :)
<nacc> oh
<nacc> so not really a problem in ubuntu then
<nacc> :)
<nacc> (at least for 17.10)?
<TJ-> From what I've read though, the default is either Wayland+WaylandX, or Wayland with Xserver as an alternative (rather like we had/have upstart or systemd)
<TJ-> I hope not, but I think it'll rear its head as we move on. I did some reading up on what the chances are and discussions by the devs. It seems the way-off future possibility is a newer compositor called way-cool, with 2 components, a root  with clients such as the composer, where a capture tool could plug itself into the pipeline
<TJ-> My terminology may be way off but basically the current all-in-one design didn't envisage any support for screen capturing
<nacc> interesting
<nacc> TJ-: but has an actual Ubuntu user hit that issue?
<nacc> TJ-: or is it purely an upstream wayland discussion?
<TJ-> No, I was pointing out we'll start to see that kind of issue in the future when users have the option to drop the Xserver part. So it's useful to have in-mind if a user complains they cannot screenshot this could be the reason (we sometimes ask for screeshots and the bot has a factoid on where to post them)
<nacc> TJ-: true
<TJ-> like we used to ask for pastebinit's and not realise the user was on an older release that didn't install it as part of ubuntu-minimal
<nacc> TJ-: I guess my perspective is for 17.10, that's ont going to be possible in "ubuntu"
<nacc> the user will have had to done something beyond what is shipped
<nacc> and maybe it will be solved by 18.04
<TJ-> Oh, and they do - you should know that by now :D
<nacc> TJ-: sure, but i'm happy to note it as unsupported :)
 * TJ- wipes brow... this is uphill work
<nacc> TJ-: i believe linuxlove is an old, now often ignored user
<nacc> i don't have the ip logs handy, but it seems familiar
<TJ-> it feels that way :)
<TJ-> oh gawd, ignoo spamming -devel +1 and . now
<daftykins> where are the ops when you need 'em?!
<oerheks> iron maiden, never bought a record of that music
<oerheks> oh, feel free to report in #ubuntu-ops
<daftykins> :)
<oerheks> .. wait
<oerheks> I love your wordgame, that you need an ops :-D
<oerheks> unban daftykins please
<daftykins> XD
 * TJ- is hiding from linuxlove!
<daftykins> Don't fear the Penguin, sir
<daftykins> oh that's a user? ;)
<Bashing-om> TJ-: deserves more than a cookie .. pass an apple pie :)
<TJ-> I've got a freezer still with 2 drawers full of apple pies made last autumn. Trying to eat them up before converting this year's apple crop into more pies
<daftykins> time to get brewing some cider :)
<TJ-> daftykins: yeah, been trying to help him decide how to dual-install Windows for what seems like 24 hours but is more like 4 hours.
<daftykins> sheesh :)
<TJ-> going round the houses and back to what I said originally, so I'm staying mum now
<Bashing-om> TJ-: Can the apples this year ! .. Can make up pies on-demand :)
<TJ-> It's easier to make 200 pies ina  single day and freeze them. Did that 2 days last year and had almost 400 in the freezer
<daftykins> O_O
<TJ-> yup, that's how my eyes and my tummy look after I've been at them :)
<Bashing-om> TJ-: Canning: Some one taught me the easy way .. in the cook stove oven !
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-10-18
<Bashing-om> rebooting to see what is in recovery for graphic's driver .
<Bashing-om> Mind more at ease now . Verified that 'recovery' also loads the nvidia driver :)
<lotuspsychje> !isitoutyet
<ubot5> Nope, it's not out yet.  Check back on Thursday!
<lotuspsychje> morning guys
<lotuspsychje> !party
<ubot5> Please remember that #ubuntu, #kubuntu, #xubuntu, #edubuntu, and #lubuntu are support channels. To countdown to !xenial release and then party once it happens, join #ubuntu-release-party - For in-person parties, see http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/global/3339/
<lotuspsychje> tnx for the edit dax
<lotuspsychje> http://news.softpedia.com/news/canonical-adds-last-minute-finishing-touches-to-ubuntu-17-10-artful-aardvark-518062.shtml
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: How is wayland going to work with the nvidia graphic's driver ?
<lotuspsychje_> Bashing-om: we will see tomorrow in main mate lol
<lotuspsychje_> Bashing-om: ive tested an nvidia laptop, but that was before wayland, aka xwayland
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje_: https://wayland.freedesktop.org/xserver.html . Think we are going to have issues !
<lotuspsychje_> im sure we will..
<EriC^^> morning all
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
<EriC^^> hey lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> all good there EriC^^ ?
<lotuspsychje> almost artful day :p
<lordievader> Good morning
<lotuspsychje> hey lordievader & ducasse
<lotuspsychje> all good there?
<lordievader> Hey lotuspsychje
<lordievader> Doing good here
<lordievader> How are you?
<lotuspsychje> great here, coffee
<lordievader> That doesn't sound like a bad idea.
<Bashing-om> ' Nuf - do this more later o/
<ducasse> morning everyone
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
<lordievader> Hey ducasse
<EriC^^> back
<EriC^^> how's it going lotuspsychje ?
<EriC^^> morning ducasse lordievader o/
<lordievader> Hey EEriC^^ , how are you doing?
<EriC^^> good thanks, yourself?
<ducasse> morning EriC^^
<lordievader> Doing good here :)
<EriC^^> :)
<lordievader> What is on the program for you guys today?
<ducasse> good question :)
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<pauljw> mornin' BluesKaj :)
<BluesKaj> 'Morning pauljw
<oerheks> cron.daily issues on a live iso, not sure it is trolling ..
<nicomachus> oerheks: I didn't even bother with that one
<oerheks> .. didn't update .. my faith in humanity climbed 3 points
<BluesKaj> Hey oerheks, nicomachus
<oerheks> hi BluesKaj :-D
<oerheks> welcome to the support jungle
<BluesKaj> ready for the big release tomorrow?
<BluesKaj> think I'm mostly up to date already
<oerheks> yes, backupped and backupped the backup
<oerheks> incl https://www.dropbox.com/s/0f25drf283kmjup/2017Pien%26Drabber.JPG?dl=0
<oerheks> Pien Hijacked the couch, Drabber is not amuzed
<BluesKaj> kitties !
<nipoc> Hey guys anyone know what time 17.10 is being released tomorrow, a quick google didn't help? thx
<TJ-> depends on when the images have all built and been put in place
<daftykins> nipoc: all the cool kids use LTS
<nipoc> TJ: thanks
<nipoc> daftykins: haha, I just want shiny new gnome
<TJ-> You're wanting to do a fresh install? Otherwise a do-releae-upgrade will do it
<nipoc> TJ: yea I was trying out elemental for a bit, but want to return to the fold
<daftykins> wise decision, no fakers!
<TJ-> well you can install from the daily/beta ISO too, then full-upgrade in case any packages have been upgraded since
<nipoc> TJ: that's the solution I was looking for, the froze most packages a couple of days ago anyway, right. I'll do that, thanks TJ
<TJ-> nipoc: yes, that's correct
<Bashing-om> Back on :) .. Bright eyed now and bushy tailed .. we do Wensday support .
<daftykins> welcome back!
 * daftykins hands Bashing-om his Ubuntu mug of tea/coffee
<Bashing-om> daftykins: :) That ^ is a good thing .. brain cell lubrication .
<daftykins> :D
<oerheks> * now with 1 free braincell every cup, collect them all!
<daftykins> :O!
<Bashing-om> Then - there are those times that even when all brain cells are corraled - still ain't got enough :(
<oerheks> Tomorrow release, friday payday, then weekend support ..
<Bashing-om> oerheks: wayland ! .. It will be a learning experience .
<oerheks> ai ai ai
<daftykins> weyhey the band is back together (:
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Feels Good ^ even EriC^^ and TJ- are in residence :)
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<daftykins> welcome back \o Ubuntu logo'd coffee/tea mugs are over by the door, help yourself!
<daftykins> :D
<leftyfb> oh right, 17.10 is finally doing wayland
<leftyfb> can't say I'm excited about that in the lease. No more X forwarding :(
<daftykins> it seems big changes in Linux-land are far too often about "what can you no longer do" until things catch back up again (if at all)
<leftyfb> it's because people rewrite solutions from scratch and then find out why the original solution became stagnant and bloated to begin with and don't want to put in the effort to get back to feature parity
<daftykins> heh yep that makes sense
<daftykins> probably bogged-down with bugs and edge cases in the meantime too
<TJ-> I was chatting to someone in ##linux yesterday who's running the 17.10 dailies and pointed out Wayland doesn't support screenshots. He was adamant it does and he'd done it. He then tried to prove it worked. Iasked to see the process list, and there was XWayland - Xorg running atop Wayland, so providing screenshoting. He then changed it to start with pure Wayland and lost screenshoting
<leftyfb> people who come up with new solutions have a great 10% POC and love saying "oh, adding in the other features will be easy and will come soon enough" ... then don't realize that most of the work in the solution was all those features working together. Not the 10% you already came up with.
<Bashing-om> leftyfb: How large has the kernel code base now become ?
<leftyfb> I hope we don't drop xorg before wayland is closer to feature complete
<leftyfb> Bashing-om: I think the kernel is a bit of a different beast. Mainly due to drivers who do in fact come and go (mostly come).
<TJ-> we're at something like 20 million lines of code
<daftykins> sheesh
<daftykins> and no screenshots ;D
<leftyfb> it's doing something right though if it's basically running the world at the moment
<TJ-> Indeed, a monolithic yet extremely modular kernel. It's why most microkernels haven't really taken off for mainstream use
<Bashing-om> When one sits down to read the kernel source, best have more than one cup of coffee handy :P
<TJ-> better a hose
<daftykins> XD
<TJ-> it's actually quite readable. The problem is understanding and sometimes finding all the inter-relationships since so much is done via deferred work queues and so on. You can necessarily follow a simple call stack to figure it out
<TJ-> s/can/cannot/
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-10-19
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> !isitoutyet
<ubot5> Nope, it's not out yet.  Check back on Thursday!
<EriC^^> morning lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey EriC^^
<lotuspsychje> artful day :p
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/10/ubuntu-17-10-whats-new-video
<lordievader> Good mornign
<lordievader> morning even
<lotuspsychje> morning lordievader
<lordievader> Hey lotuspsychje
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<lotuspsychje> fine here, artful day
<lordievader> Yeah, I saw that.
<lotuspsychje> krashekspress: welcome
<EriC^^> any idea on 17.10 eta?
<lordievader> The answer usually was, when it is ready.
<lordievader> I suppose [1] gives some kind of indication. [1] http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/383/builds
<lordievader> Lubuntu is marked ready.
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: The release channel says mid afternoon UTC .
<EriC^^> Bashing-om: ah thanks
<EriC^^> lordievader: cool site
<UB08-08> Hi
<EriC^^> so 17.10 will have 32bit support? i had read in a website that 32bit is being dropped in 17.10?
<EriC^^> hi UB08-08
<UB08-08> When is ubuntu release time? here in Spain it's 08:44AM now, 19/10/17
<lordievader> EriC^^: The 'Ubuntu' category on the QA page only lists 64bit. Other releases do list 32bit versions.
<EriC^^> lordievader: oh i see
<Bashing-om> UB08-08: The release channel says mid afternoon UTC .
<UB08-08> Ok, Thanks!
<Bashing-om> I leave it to uall to awaut 17.10's arrival - o/
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<nicomachus> trying to decide if I should do this upgrade.
<nicomachus> I wanna check out the newest version of Gnome but at the same time I've spent a good deal of time customizing my own Gnome env over here.
<TJ-> nicomachus: install into a container maybe?
<TJ-> or install into a separate LVM LV and then add a GRUB boot entry to it
<nicomachus> TJ-: you're getting outside my comfort zone. :P
<nicomachus> I've never done any of that. I've done VMs in Virtualbox and that's about it
<TJ-> nicomachus: for hardware testing LVM LVs is the way, and it's very easy to do.
<TJ-> and those same LVs can be built/installed via a VM first
<nicomachus> LV?
 * nicomachus is reminded of Elon Musk's ASS memo
<TJ-> In Logical Volume Management (LVM) we go RAW_BLOCK_DEVICE -> Physical Volume (PV) -> device for -> Volume Group (VG) -> parent of -> Logical Volumes (LV) -> File-System
<TJ-> nicomachus: in real terms: pvcreate /dev/sda9; vgcreate My_VG /dev/sda9; lvcreate -L 4G -n My_LV My_VG; mkfs.ext4 -L My_LV /dev/mapper/My_VG-My-LV;
<nicomachus> TJ-: do you not like piping or what? lol
<nicomachus> pastebinit <( rfkill list) instead of rfkill list | pastebinit
<nicomachus> I've noticed you do that a lot.
<TJ-> nicomachus: always. Having "pastebinit" first makes it clear thats the command to run. Also, I can do "pastebinit <( command 1) <(command 2) <(command 3) if I want to; can't do that with pipes
<nicomachus> I see. interesting.
<leftyfb> hm, interesting
<leftyfb> never knew you could do that
<leftyfb> hm
<leftyfb> you can't
<leftyfb> multiple <()'s will give you multiple pastebins
<leftyfb> not a single one
<nicomachus> I think multiple is the point
<leftyfb> I guess if that's what you're looking for that works
<TJ-> correct
<nicomachus> but it's all in one command
<leftyfb> still nifty
<TJ-> When I'm working with a SLOW responder I can batch up several commands and get logical pastebins all in one go
<TJ-> what should take 2 mins can otherwise take an hour
<TJ-> also why I surround all commands with " to make it clear what is my commentary, and what is a command
<TJ-> Can never have enough precision in this medium.
<leftyfb> what about that tool I can never remember the name of .... basically outputs a ton of hardware data and logs
<daftykins> if it's not installed in a base image it's often useless
<daftykins> trying to get a user to add something before giving you info, especially if that system is hosed, eek
<nicomachus> I go for ` to denote commands instead of ", just because ` is usually the formatting code in markdown languages.
<nicomachus> someone set ubottu to send PMs instead of channel messages on pipe?
<nicomachus> !info apt | nicomachus
<ubot5> nicomachus: apt (source: apt): commandline package manager. In component main, is important. Version 1.2.24 (xenial), package size 1037 kB, installed size 3315 kB
<nicomachus> !bootinfo | nicomachus
<ubot5> nicomachus, please see my private message
<nicomachus> interesting
<nicomachus> poor v3n0m just getting pounced on. lol
<daftykins> o0
<nicomachus> daftykins:
<nicomachus> 14:10 < v3n0m> sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get upgrade && sudo apt-get
<nicomachus>                dist-upgrade && sudo apt full-upgrade && sudo do-release-upgrade
<nicomachus>                -c
<daftykins> oh dear oh dear oh dear
<nicomachus> is how he just told someone to go 17.04 -> 17.10
<oerheks> v3nom surely acts like his name
<nicomachus> lol
<nicomachus> clogging up the channel with is endless 'enter's
<oerheks> heya lotus
<lotuspsychje> hey hey
<lotuspsychje> just upgraded to final
<oerheks> yay\0/
<oerheks>  i am still on 17.04
<lotuspsychje> you seeding oerheks ?
<oerheks> no, just recieved the upgrade button in updates
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> !isitoutyet
<ubot5> Yes!
<oerheks> i am a little musslepain, sniffy, cold .. going to bed again
<lotuspsychje> ohhh have a nice warm gingertea oerheks
<nicomachus> aaaaand there he goes
<lotuspsychje> not gonna stay long neither
<lotuspsychje> just in and out tonight
<lotuspsychje> still got that launch bug and windows buttons missing hmmm
<lotuspsychje> i blame wayland :p
<dax> there's an xorg session in the login manager, if you'd like to test that theory :3
<lotuspsychje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1718653
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1718653 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Windows buttons gone on specific programs" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<lotuspsychje> dax: tnx for the idea lemme try that
<nacc> i struggle sometimes with people like v3nom. They know enough, practically, to answer questions. But they don't seem to konw why they konw what they know. Or why what they are suggesting works.
<nacc> e.g., throwing every apt subcommand at a wall and a release upgrade check, just to see if you're current??
<nacc> yes, that will do ... something
<oerheks> there is no i in team..
<dax> it's the stackoverflow problem
<nacc> but it's not "right" or efficent
<nacc> dax: absolutely
<dax> people google their problem, find some command on SO, and throw it into their notes without any comprehension of what it's doing
<dax> much worse in actual programming
<nacc> yep
<nacc> because "it works"
<nacc> but that's so insufficient in the long-term
<nacc> it's crazy :)
<daftykins> it's pretty amazing they haven't even worked out the repetition in their own commands
<dax> until it doesn't, and then you're SOL because you don't know what it does
<nacc> dax: yep
<dax> at least this example is Mostly Harmless
<oerheks> re-install is so much fun :-D
<nacc> yep
<lotuspsychje> dax: yep, working again in xorg
<lotuspsychje> tnx for the headsup
<dax> *nod* points to wayland indeed, then
<dax> didrocks has a nice article on sessions in 17.10 and who gets what on upgrade/reinstall, btw: https://didrocks.fr/2017/10/18/ubuntu-gnome-shell-in-artful-day-16/
<lotuspsychje> lets c
<dax> somebody said their ubuntu gnome upgrade went a little screwy though, so maybe still some kinks to work out on the upgrade case
<lotuspsychje> interesting
<TJ-> I guess there's going to be a lot of difficult-to-diagnose GUI issues with the switch to the Gnome wayland compositor
<oerheks> interesting article, as extra to the releasenotes.. no screenshot utility available?
<oerheks> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArtfulAardvark/ReleaseNotes/#screenshot
<oerheks> this is nice one too: Graphical applications can't be run as root from terminal
<TJ-> going to be some howls from folks using VNC etc too
<daftykins> no more config breakage by amateurs!?
<lotuspsychje> yay
<daftykins> about time they dumped that plaintext fiend :)
<daftykins> lotus heya \o
<lotuspsychje> i wonder how many 'unsupported' hardware there will be on wayland
<oerheks> and: Ctrl+Alt+Shift+R keyboard shortcut to start video recording of the whole desktop, 30 second, placed in ~/Videos
<lotuspsychje> hey hey daftykins
<TJ-> I'm glad I work from terminal not GUI!
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> soo xorg aint dead yet
<TJ-> it's sad how much functionality is being torn out in the pursuit of 'progress'.
<lotuspsychje> think we gonna need it the comming days$
<lotuspsychje> bbl guys, tv time for now
<TJ-> I think 2104 was about the high point, since then I've lost track of the regressions across the entire stack
<lotuspsychje> have a nice1
<nicomachus> >press Ctrl-H
<nicomachus> 15:07 < piraye> press: command not found
 * nicomachus facepalms, parts channel, quits irssi, sudo poweroff's, and goes home
<TJ-> I'm leaving... new release == madhouse
<TJ-> snap
<TJ-> I'm going to just run the huskies to the north pole and back... I may be a while
<daftykins> TJ-: enjoy :)
<nicomachus> I should probably just throw in an rm -rf / while I'm at it
<daftykins> nicomachus: it'll never be enough
<nicomachus> I'm actually just gonna go back to trying to find a way to access the images assets of this icon pack
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Looking for that rabbit hole :P
<dax> nicomachus: nah, you need sudo rm -rf / && sudo rm -rf /* && sudo dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda1 && sudo dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda bs=1M && sync && sync && sync && sudo dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/sda
<nicomachus> lol
<nicomachus> maybe a && sudo apt clean on there for good measure
<nicomachus> just to be safe
<TJ-> I wish I had a Â£ for every fix I've done with acpi_osi!
<TJ-> i'd be able to afford pie&chips :D
<Bashing-om> TJ-: Not counting all the times I have directed per your instruction.
<TJ-> What's worse is we cannot blame Microsoft. This is all down to the firmware authors in the manufacturers, mostly Chinese/Asian teams that still seem to only know Windows
<daftykins> TJ-: hey i thought you were overstocked on pie ;D
<TJ-> only Apple
<TJ-> I and the Huskies could eat a pallet of steak pies
<TJ-> poor lordcirth :)
<Bashing-om> Hummm .. Beef Pot Pies ... Good things :D
<nicomachus> TJ-: found a minor drawback to your method of pastebinit. But maybe it's a bonus.
<nicomachus> It shows the output in terminal. Piping to pastebinit doesn't, just throws the link
<TJ-> nicomachus: what command did you test it with? that'd only happen if there was output to stderr
<nicomachus> tree
<nicomachus> tree >(pastebinit)
<nicomachus> err
<nicomachus> scratch that. reverse it.
<nicomachus> pastebinit >(tree)
<TJ-> wrong way, you're sending into the sub-process. it should be pastebinit <(tree)
<nicomachus> oh right. whooops.
<TJ-> LOL
<TJ-> it's shell redirection of a sub-process output
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-10-20
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> hows the artful night been?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: \o artful, so far smooth - no real new issues identified :)
<lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om nice2hear
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Been on pins, awaiting the hammer to fall . No impact to this time :)
<lotuspsychje> great
<lotuspsychje> my artful performs best on xorg
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Seen a few incidences where xorg reversion was recommended :(
<lotuspsychje> ok tnx
<lotuspsychje> welcome bordy
<lotuspsychje> oerheks: can you paste that link from dax again here
<lotuspsychje> from yesterday
<bordy> Evenin folks
<oerheks> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArtfulAardvark/ReleaseNotes/
<oerheks> err https://didrocks.fr/ ?
<lotuspsychje> didrocks yeah
<lotuspsychje> take a look at that Bashing-om
<lotuspsychje> the upgrade to artfull page
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: look'n .
<oerheks> and from the releasenotes, to https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_debug_Wayland_problems#Known_issues.2C_frequent_complaints.2C_fundamental_changes
<oerheks> gives valuable information too
<oerheks> s Ctrl+Alt+Shift+R keyboard shortcut to start video recording of the whole desktop , and lands in ~/Videos
<lotuspsychje> cool
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: oerheks : I say again ^^ We have a lot to learn :D
<lotuspsychje> yeah lil complicated on wayland..
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Developers are throwing a lot of changes at us - fast ! systemd, netwworking, wayland ( GUI graphics ), logging ......... ouch !
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<Guy1524> hey guys, theoretically, would it be possible to upgrade an Ubuntu 4.10 installation to 17.10, and if so, how would it differ from a fresh install
<lotuspsychje> !eolupgrade
<ubot5> End-Of-Life is the time when security updates and support for an Ubuntu release stop, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases for more information. Looking to upgrade from an EOL release? See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EOLUpgrades
<lotuspsychje> Guy1524: fresh install is very recommended
<Guy1524> I don't actually have 4.10 installed, I am just curious, because it would be interesting
<lotuspsychje> Guy1524: why is an eol version interesting?
<Guy1524> just to see how robust the upgrade system is in Ubuntu
<lotuspsychje> Guy1524: check the eolupgrade link
<Guy1524> k
<lordievader> Good morning
<lotuspsychje> hey lordievader
<lordievader> Hey lotuspsychje
<lordievader> How are you today?
<lotuspsychje> great here
<lotuspsychje> almost having breakfast
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/
<lotuspsychje> its artful news all over
<lordievader> I'm sure it is.
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: IRT Cosec__  ' sudo find / -name "NVIDIA-Linux-*" ' there is a uninstall script .
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> bbl
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<oerheks> Happy 13th Birthday, Ubuntu!
<oerheks> my lucky number
<pauljw> hi BluesKaj, everyone.
<oerheks> get 10% off XPS 13 developer edition w/the code "SAVE10XPS" til 7amCT 10/26
<pauljw> that's nice, but they're still too expensive for me.
<BluesKaj> Hi pauljw
<pauljw> :)
<BluesKaj> already have a decent laptop, and 13" screen for that kind of money is too expensive, despite the portability factor
<BluesKaj> and you're still paying for useless W10 on top
 * BluesKaj is in a crirtical mood this morning ...pissed off at a few things
<BluesKaj> BBl
<pauljw> :(
<daftykins> i love my XPS 13 (:
<nicomachus> too small for me.
<nicomachus> screens should be 15+
<nicomachus> no smaller
<daftykins> i prefer portability above all else
<daftykins> well, battery life is the true priority
<nicomachus> 15 inch screen is portable.
<daftykins> not to me as a cyclist
<oerheks> 4 inch and full hd  .. wait
<nicomachus> This guy basalt is having some issues with the ath10k driver if anyone wants to dive into kernel stuff.
<daftykins> ;D
<daftykins> 'get a new one'
<daftykins> (kernel)
<TJ-> We've got a major issue for Nvidia users coming up as soon as Ubuntu adopts v4.14 kernel. A key kernel symbol in the memory-manager has been made GPL-only, and it breaks the nvidia (and other out-of-tree non-GPL module) builds entirely
<nicomachus> oh great
<TJ-> In this current v4.14 development round AMD introduced Secure Memory Encryption facilities and enabled it by default to support their new CPU facilities. Because the memory-management functions are core to almost all drivers it's caused a new GPL-only symbol, sme_me_mask, to be imported into almost all modules. As a result, nvidia drivers fail to modpost when being linked
<TJ-> Got a response from the kernel's MM sub-system maintainer today after reporting this last weekend with the RC2 build. They won't change it (I don't blame them). However, unless the SME functions are disabled entirely - which means AMD devices with SME cannot make use of it - the generic Ubuntu kernels will fail with proprietary drivers
<nicomachus> So is this just an Ubuntu issue or going to be linux-wide?
<TJ-> Linux wide if kernels are built with SME enabled to support AMD devices. For people/distros that build CPU-specific kernels it won't be an issue, but for distros like Debian and Ubuntu RedHat etc., it'll be an issue because we build a single kernel that is capable of supporting all devices
<TJ-> The CONFIG enables it by default in mainline too, so anyone trying mainline kernels (as I do and discovered it) will hit this
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<nicomachus> o/
<daftykins> wb o/
<Bashing-om> pauljw: \o
<pauljw> :)
<nicomachus> !recs
<nacc> what in the actual f
<nacc> sorry for the language
<nacc> but serious, connorkmc must be trolling right?
<pauljw> seems like it to me, nacc
 * nacc should know better, but I get so much madder at people wasting my time on a Friday
<nacc> on a happier note, git-ubuntu 0.4 released, and a test snap branch created that has the ability to take an upstream fix, cherry-pick it and make a quilt patch out of it for testing (incl. building a .deb)
<pauljw> :)
<pauljw> that's pretty nice
<nacc> i'm sure it will break for some cases, but it should help a lot of people learn to contribute
<nacc> and eventually get us to a git-only workflow
<nacc> hopefully we'll start importing all packages in the next month or so
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-10-21
<Thunder_Tw> are the evenings usually this quiet here?
<dax> yep
<Bashing-om> sometimes even quieter :)
<dax> freenode has a very notable day/night cycle in user count. #ubuntu does too.
<daftykins> legends from years gone by speak of weekends making people go to some holy place known simply as... 'out'
<Thunder_Tw> sounds like stone age times xD
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> hey sirru5h
<sirru5h> Hey there lotuspsychje how are ya doing?
<lotuspsychje> welcome to hardcore volunteer channel
<lotuspsychje> great here tnx, and you?
<sirru5h> I'm alright hanging in there
<lotuspsychje> sirru5h: tested artful?
<sirru5h> ?
<sirru5h> oh aardvark
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<sirru5h> Nah not yet I'll wait until it is stable
<sirru5h> How about yourself?
<lotuspsychje> sirru5h: yeah im helping bug out with a box
<lotuspsychje> as its an important release
<lotuspsychje> normally im sticking to LTS
<sirru5h> Nice, yeah I got ubuntu 17.04 on both my machines now
<sirru5h> Windows 8.1 died pretty bad oh well
<lotuspsychje> lol
<sirru5h> I previously had ubuntu just on my netbook but now it is on my new to me machine
<sirru5h> It was just a bad day when windows went then I thought I had it and my dog she is very skittish and she jumped onto the coffee table spilling juice on my machine which I just kinda recovered
<lotuspsychje> ouch
<sirru5h> so well I use linux pretty much everyday anyways so installed ubuntu on here
<lotuspsychje> same here, daily driver
<lotuspsychje> on all boxes
<sirru5h> You know I remember back in what 2004 or so I had at that time used linux for 5 years mainly Slackware and RH
<lotuspsychje> i tested linux with RH on gnome aswell
<sirru5h> Anyhow yeah I was taking a linux+ course and used ubuntu like 4.05
<sirru5h> something odd balled
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> !4.05
<lotuspsychje> !5.04
<ubot5> Ubuntu 5.04 (Hoary Hedgehog) was the second release of Ubuntu.  End Of Life: October 31, 2006. See !eol for more details.
<lotuspsychje> this one?
<sirru5h> 4.10
<lotuspsychje> !4.10
<ubot5> Ubuntu 4.10 (Warty Warthog) was the first release of Ubuntu. End Of Life: April 30, 2006. See !eol for more details.
<sirru5h> I used hedgehog as well
<sirru5h> Yes I am an old linux user
<lotuspsychje> same here
<sirru5h> It's come a LONG way though
<lotuspsychje> ubuntu has transformed nicely surely
<sirru5h> It feels good to see that linux now is much more friendly and is down right easy to use
<sirru5h> Ubuntu actually I credit them with doing that
<sirru5h> You remember that if you had linux and a gui pretty much you were a noob/lame
<lotuspsychje> yeah the easyness shows the reward worldwide
<sirru5h> Yeah even up to 2004 linux sometimes was daunting
<lotuspsychje> lol i never felt lame, but yes i remember
<lotuspsychje> for me linux was also an eyecandy thing from the start
<lotuspsychje> looking up users screenshots
<sirru5h> lol yeah I didn't get it but back then a nix machine was just terminal and keyboard
<lotuspsychje> yeah
<lotuspsychje> sirru5h: whats your birth year?
<sirru5h> oh geez
 * sirru5h waves his cane 
<sirru5h> 1980
<lotuspsychje> dont worry it might lay not tto far from mine
<sirru5h> I ain't that old
<lotuspsychje> 77 here
<lotuspsychje> gonna bbl on breakfast mate, ttyl ok sirru5h
<lotuspsychje> set this chan to favs as you like
<sirru5h> Cool stuff I like to come by here and there
<lotuspsychje> youl meet some interesting ppl here
<ducasse> morning all
<ducasse> hi lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
<lotuspsychje> out for shopping bbl
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<Thunder_Tw> oi
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon to all
<immu> hello lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey immu
<immu> whats up
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: how was the shopping? :)
<lotuspsychje> good ducasse tnx
<lotuspsychje> hows your day ducasse
<ducasse> soon heading out to shop groceries, most of the other stuff i had to do is done now
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: how far is the shop from your house?
<ducasse> not sure, maybe 250m? not far, anyway, just a couple of minutes walk.
<lotuspsychje> oh cool
<oerheks> i would take the train
<oerheks> :-Dhey guys
<lotuspsychje> hey oerheks
<ducasse> \o oerheks
<ducasse> oerheks: you could start taxi'ing people to the shop on your bike, just put some pillows in the box
<lotuspsychje> lol
<oerheks> sure, payment in pizza
<oerheks> i thought you were living in the woods, with bears and kangaroos
<lotuspsychje> lol
<ducasse> just close to them, but there are two (for some reason) shops nearby. if i want anything other than groceries i need to go into the city centre, though.
<ducasse> and no bears, and the kangaroos are very shy.
<lotuspsychje> wait, kangoos in norway?
<ducasse> not really, no, i thought that was obvious :)
<lotuspsychje> Thunder_Tw: welcome
<Thunder_Tw> lotuspsychje: thanks
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: aren't desktop icons a no-no on gnome?
<Thunder_Tw> i have ubuntu-mate witch is issentialy gnome2 and i have desctop icons
<lotuspsychje> didnt test
<ducasse> i meant gnome3
<Thunder_Tw> sounds like more of the same thing
<lotuspsychje> its possible they created activities button to avoid the desktop mess
<ducasse> that's what i was thinking, desktop icons sounds like a typical things the devs would decide people don't want :)
<TJ-> I always thought having files/launchers on the desktop a silly way to do things - since you've got to minimze all windows to get to it
<TJ-> it was a metaphore that Windows popularised
<TJ-> Started with Windows 95 I think; before that there was just a File Manager
<Thunder_Tw> That's why I use it for the stuff i likely start on a fresh desktop
<lotuspsychje> i always liked a dock at bottom
<lotuspsychje> mac style
<TJ-> When you're on multi monitor setups it helps that you can position the menu/dock/tasbar whereever you want to, rather than having it prescribed, else it can be in-between 2 displays rather than above or below.
<TJ-> That was something I disliked immensely with Unity when it came out, and a major reason I stopped using it entirely
<lotuspsychje> yeah you always said the multiple monitors was one of your dislikes
<TJ-> Gnome's nearly as bad.
<Thunder_Tw> Mate ftw
<TJ-> when dev's prescribe rather than providing flexibility I know there's something to avoid
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: changes say its got 4k,multi monitor improvements?
<Thunder_Tw> i have a multimonitor setup and i can place my menu-panels annywhere i want
<TJ-> Gnome devs once told me - when I complained about multi-monitor support - "we don't test it on that config, it's not supported"
<TJ-> How can a GUI dev NOT have multi-monitor setup to work and test on!?
<ducasse> i3 has the best multi-monitor handling i've seen - jmo, of course
<TJ-> Thunder_Tw: I'm running 6 monitors so it gets a bit trying at times
<Thunder_Tw> cool
<Thunder_Tw> losing the mouse from time to time no?
<TJ-> No, don't have that problem :)
<Thunder_Tw> then we need more pixels!
<TJ-> I mostly work in terminals, and even then I use tmux and regularly have 10 windows per session going. Easy to get lost without needing a mouse
<lotuspsychje> how many terminals can fit on 6 screens lol
<lotuspsychje> bbl dinnertime :p
<brunch> dinner at such time!
<ducasse> ...and without inviting us!
<TJ-> My tummy is eating me from the inside, out
<ducasse> we should get free pizza ;)
<immu> some one is hungry now ducasse
 * oerheks opens the oven to get the smoke of the fried chicken out
<oerheks> ..now where is the butter
<TJ-> I think I'll be making pizza
<oerheks> yes TJ-, vegetables are good for you
<TJ-> I usually make 8 at a time, freeze 7
<oerheks> good, we will be there soon
<TJ-> LOL *hides* the dough
<TJ-> I freeze the bases; I make each pizza fresh
<oerheks> sometimes i grab a fresh kit, dough and the base paste
<oerheks> more expensive than ordering out, but i like the smell in my house
<TJ-> yeah, there's something about making them fresh that beats any shop-made
<ducasse> yuck, electron terminal. fantastic idea.
<oerheks> it is part of digestion, i guess, the smell prepares the stomach for food
<oerheks> grinn ducasse
<TJ-> yes, the smell is the thing. also, handling the ingredients
<oerheks> .. and the dishes afterwards, standing up after eating is good too
<oerheks> grandma told me
<ducasse> making food is therapeutic stuff, frozen food can't quite compete.
<TJ-> also making it myself I pile on lots of ingredients which shops don't do
<oerheks> i care for less salt
<TJ-> it's like with making fresh salads too. I managed 20 different ingredients on the plate over summer
<oerheks> My idea of support is pathetic. I confess ..
<oerheks> And i should change my job.
<Thunder_Tw> oerheks:  true, I would like to complain to your manager about you getting payed too much for the pathetic support :p j/k
 * ducasse puts up another gold star for oerheks on the board
<oerheks> my karma is still 0 on launchpad
<Bashing-om> Long dry spell breaking - We getting rain here - Welcome to Saturday support :)
<dax> new factoid, !krack
<EriC^^> !krack
<ubot5> KRACK is a group of attacks against the wireless WPA2 protocol and related software. Ubuntu clients are protected against it if they are updated; see https://usn.ubuntu.com/usn/usn-3455-1/ for details. Networking equipment needs updating if using 802.11r, repeater mode, or other AP-as-client configurations, which most are not. See https://www.krackattacks.com/ for technical details.
<dax> probably should have made it a week ago, but oh well
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-10-22
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> how was the night Bashing-om
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Started off frightful at the end of ducasse's shift - now quiet . just a couple of wayland issues outstanding .
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: tnx for the headsup, good we have the xorg session as backup
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Yes, But wayland should work , Xorg for the times that some apps are not ported to wayland .
<lotuspsychje> aha
<lotuspsychje> unless on nvidia?
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Have not seen nearly as many nvidia/wayland issues as I had anticipated :)
<lotuspsychje> good news then?
<Bashing-om> well,, I still think optimus will not work as is .
<lotuspsychje> ok
<Bashing-om> Seems likely " Nvidia doesn't support VDPAU on Wayland. If you need video acceleration -> Xorg  "
<lotuspsychje> ah so the basics work
<lotuspsychje> thats gonna b waiting for the vdpau support then
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: :) Got 9 months to work out the kinks .
<lotuspsychje> yess
<lotuspsychje> hey luxio
<luxio> hi
<lotuspsychje> so you tried artful?
<luxio> artful?
<lotuspsychje> 17.10
<lotuspsychje> luxio: can we know wich graphics card you have?
<luxio> lotuspsychje: NVIDIA GTX 750Ti
<luxio> yes I'm running 17.10
<lotuspsychje> wow
<lotuspsychje> luxio: did you test gaming on it?
<luxio> well I'm playing Minesweeper right now LOL
<luxio> nothing graphically intensive though
<lotuspsychje> right
<lotuspsychje> luxio: no graphic glitches on wayland?
<luxio> anything in specific I should try out?
<luxio> and no
<lotuspsychje> luxio: sure a more graphic game
<luxio> any game in specific? not sure what to try
<lotuspsychje> any shooter in software center
<lotuspsychje> luxio: can you try vdpauinfo dfrom a terminal also?
<luxio> lotuspsychje: https://i.imgur.com/am6uXA5.png
<lotuspsychje> luxio: ok tnx mate
<lotuspsychje> luxio: what does show behind driver= when you sudo lshw -C video?
<lotuspsychje> dont need the screenshot, just the driver= loaded
<luxio> There's no line that says driver=
<luxio> https://paste.ubuntu.com/25791115/
<luxio> oh, nouveau
<lotuspsychje> driver=nouveau
<lotuspsychje> yep
<lotuspsychje> tnx for feedback luxio
<luxio> np
<luxio> lotuspsychje: as for games, OpenArena crashes when I start a match
<lotuspsychje> aha
<lotuspsychje> luxio: perhaps try that from a terminal to catch errors?
<luxio> lotuspsychje: already done. https://paste.ubuntu.com/25791129/
<luxio> segfault
<luxio> full logs: https://paste.ubuntu.com/25791136/
<lotuspsychje> tnx
<lotuspsychje> luxio: might check another game as a test also
<luxio> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ioquake3/+filebug/b2b57b98-b6e3-11e7-8007-68b5996a96c8/+login?field.title=ioquake3+crashed+with+SIGSEGV
<luxio> ^ That link came up when it asked me to send a crash report
<lotuspsychje> luxio: paste the bug # number plz?
<luxio> not sure how to get it
<luxio> tried another game, here are logs: https://paste.ubuntu.com/25791156/
<lotuspsychje> luxio: after you get in that bug launchpad it will create a bug number in link
<luxio> I can't get the bug report to open again
<lotuspsychje> hmm weird
<lotuspsychje> cant find new bugs on ioquake3 neither
<lotuspsychje> luxio: how about you try some 1080p trailers or mkv samples, to see quality?
<luxio> Streamed, or downloaded M
<luxio> ?
<lotuspsychje> can choose
<lotuspsychje> just to see how it would perform on wayland & your card
<luxio> lotuspsychje: HD video playbacks works fine
<lotuspsychje> great!
<lotuspsychje> luxio: now another test, try that game from the xorg session?
<luxio> how do I go to an xorg session?
<lotuspsychje> luxio: logout, and click the gear icon to choose xorg
<lotuspsychje> set back to wayland if you wanna go back again
<luxio> lotuspsychje: Things are a lot faster in xorg
<luxio> lotuspsychje: It also crashes on xorg
<lotuspsychje> hmmm
<lotuspsychje> might be not wyland related then
<lotuspsychje> hi bordy
<bordy> evenin
<lotuspsychje> morning ducasse :p
<lotuspsychje> morning sirru5h
<sirru5h> Hey there lotuspsychje how are you doing
<sirru5h> It's 2333 here still night time
<lotuspsychje> ohh
<lotuspsychje> late night visit?
<sirru5h> Well I I work nights most of the time as not to interfere with a clients customers/employees
<sirru5h> So night time usually is a good time
<sirru5h> I'm guessing that you are from asia perhaps maybe Australia?
<sirru5h> ooks like ubuntu 17.10 has been released
<sirru5h> I may just upgrade right now how is it? stable?
<sirru5h> Tell ya what wish me luck I'm gonna upgrade brb
<lotuspsychje> :p
<sirru5h> Howdy everyone
<Thunder_Tw> Ahh! Gaming on Ubuntu and Linux in general is so much better than i could've hoped for 5 years ago <3
<BluesKaj> Howdy folks
<lotuspsychje> good evening to all
<lotuspsychje> luxio: did you get any wiser on your bug?
<luxio> Not yet, I pretty much went to sleep after that and just woke up
<lotuspsychje> oh cool, good morning :p
<ducasse> hi lotuspsychje \o
<lotuspsychje> luxio: at least your system works with nvidia & wayland
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse had a nice mate?
<lotuspsychje> hi immu
<immu> hi lotuspsychje
<immu> i think i am in
<lotuspsychje> immu: your on artful?
<lotuspsychje> evening TJ-
<immu> no Solus
<immu> why? what happ
<lotuspsychje> just curious
<immu> ok
<TJ-> G'evening
<immu> lotuspsychje, you?
<lotuspsychje> immu: xenial & artful
<immu> 17.04 & 17.10
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: luxio here tested artful on nvidia both xorg & wayland working on it
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: not for very much longer :) well, at least once we move to kernel v4.14 anyhow
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: what will happen then?
<TJ-> the proprietary driver will no longer build.
<lotuspsychje> ouch
<immu> who is TJ- did we meet earlier?
<lotuspsychje> tj is the legend
<immu> never met him or saw him here lotuspsychje tj
<TJ-> AMD introduced Secure Memory Encryption API in this 4.14 cycle, and it's enabled by default (to support AMD devices that use it). It adds a GPL-only kernel symbol sme_me_mask. This is part of the kernel's core memory-management sub-system. It caused a failure to build any non-GPL modules - e.g. nvidia. I reported it  at the rc2 stage. now at the rc5 stage and the kernel sub-system maintainer decided
<TJ-> the GPL symbol will remain.
<immu> 4.14 hmmm
<TJ-> That means, if we're using genericly built kernels that support both AMD and Intel CPUs this has to be enabled, which means non-GPL modules cannot be linked in. The memory-management sub-system is so core to everything I cannot see a way it can be worked around.
<immu> aah 4.14 :)
<TJ-> I doubt anything serious will be done about this (by nvidia) until after 4.14 is released and lots of users start to be affected
<immu> i was thinking on 4.4 line
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: so good we still have xorg as backup?
<TJ-> when this GPL-symbol issue has hit previously there's been some change and it's been fixable, but for this one I don't see how it'll be possible when SME is enabled
<TJ-> lotuspsychje: nothing to do with Xorg - this means the nvidia kernel driver cannot be built/linked in
<TJ-> nouveau will be fine obviously
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: kk
<lotuspsychje> its a kernel thing then
<immu> brb
<TJ-> I think some other out-of-tree non-GPL modules will be affected too. I can't think of any module that doesn't need to use the memory-management sub-system
<lotuspsychje> evening sirru5h
<sirru5h> lotuspsychje, I got 17.10 installed
<lotuspsychje> artful succes?
<sirru5h> Yeah I had an odd issue with trying to run a gui program from terminal
<lotuspsychje> didnt they block that by default?
<sirru5h> I would get Protocol not Specified
<lotuspsychje> think i saw oerheks mention that
<sirru5h> mm not sure I did a little work around
<lotuspsychje> sneaky lol
<ducasse> sirru5h: won't work under wayland
<lotuspsychje> sirru5h: wich graphics card your on, just for feedback?
<sirru5h> good question let me check
<lotuspsychje> lol
 * lotuspsychje crosses fingers its not atari
<lotuspsychje> evening kostkon
<kostkon> lotuspsychje, hey
<TJ-> Here's the mailing-list discussion about the GPL symbol: https://marc.info/?t=150681105200001&r=1&w=2
<lotuspsychje> lets c
<lotuspsychje> immu: https://www.deviantart.com/customization/screenshots/nix/newest/?q=solus not bad
<sirru5h> lotuspsychje,  product: Richland [Radeon HD 8550G]
<sirru5h> and ducasse my work around does work for wayland btw ;)
<lotuspsychje> sirru5h: no graphic glitches on wayland?
<lotuspsychje> im having issues on my older ati X800
<lotuspsychje> lagging overall launching apps, mouse lags
<sirru5h> mmm nothing too crazy but yes laggy very laggy
<lotuspsychje> xorg performing better for that machine
<lotuspsychje> hmmm
<lotuspsychje> sirru5h: what cpu/ram?
<ducasse> sirru5h: sorry, i misread what you wrote. just ignore me, i'm not really focusing :)
<lotuspsychje> dax: alive mate?
<sirru5h> it used to take about 6/7 seconds in unity on 17.04 now it's like 12 seconds from when I hit grub to login
<lotuspsychje> sirru5h: how about the gnome desktop itself lag?
<sirru5h> 8gb DDR3 product: AMD A8-5550M APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics
<lotuspsychje> wow
<sirru5h> mmm it really isn't too bad and it's not new or anything
<sirru5h> I got a bit nervous to be honest on that first boot when I saw that it was taking nearly 2x the normal amount on boot
<lotuspsychje> ouch
<sirru5h> I was just expecting kernel panic at any moment and perhaps my dog might nuke this machine as well
<sirru5h> lotuspsychje, on my netbook a 1.3 ghz celeron (no internal hd (external only)) it takes maybe 20 seconds
<lotuspsychje> dog lol
<lotuspsychje> !xubuntu
<ubot5> Xubuntu is Ubuntu with !Xfce as the desktop environment. More info at http://xubuntu.org/ - To install the Xubuntu environment from Ubuntu: Â« sudo apt-get install xubuntu-desktop^ Â» - Join #xubuntu for support - See also: !xubuntu-channels
<sirru5h> lotuspsychje, I had my dog who is a bit skittish jump onto the coffee table while I was trying to fix a VMware issue next thing I know coffee table to couch juice on the computer
<lotuspsychje> lol
<sirru5h> lotuspsychje, I actually am using mate on that netbook now
<immu> ubuntu mate is also good
<sirru5h> I actually had left ubuntu for a few years used zenwalk
<immu> i never resolved my self after unity was killed
<sirru5h> Well I used ubuntu back in like 2003/2004
<sirru5h> And I switched to zenwalk in about 2008/2009 and came back to ubuntu less than a year ago but I saw other distro's become much more easy and friendly for users to use and ubuntu did that
<lotuspsychje> oerheks: the flavors url's have http and redirect to https, think ops need to change that?
<lotuspsychje> !xubuntu
<ubot5> Xubuntu is Ubuntu with !Xfce as the desktop environment. More info at http://xubuntu.org/ - To install the Xubuntu environment from Ubuntu: Â« sudo apt-get install xubuntu-desktop^ Â» - Join #xubuntu for support - See also: !xubuntu-channels
<lotuspsychje> hi Bashing-om
<Bashing-om> o/ Ready to do this again :) Hey lotuspsychje - still same as I left it ?
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: was bit crowdy :p
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Well, then - I best get caught up and get with it --- Huh ?
<lotuspsychje> yeah jump in mate
<lotuspsychje> im off for movie :p
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: K, I do what I can :P
<TJ-> Bashing-om: I think we're going to have to let mist go, it sounds like the thing is hosed and he's not being particularly clear or helpful
<daftykins> user down!
<Bashing-om> TJ-: `mist Went above my skill set some time back . I be struggling now to understand .
