#ubuntu-sugarteam 2010-07-12
<timClicks> ./sugar-jhbuild is failing to build python-xklavier on lucid - any ideas
<manusheel> timClicks: Yes, this issue has been recently reported.
<manusheel> Let me get back to you on it.
<timClicks> ty
<manusheel> timclicks: Did you install the package from http://devel.randomink.org/projects/python-xklavier/files?
<manusheel> kandarpk: Tim wrote - ./sugar-jhbuild is failing to build python-xklavier on lucid - any ideas
<manusheel> kandarpk: What is the status of this package? I think this issue has been resolved.
<manusheel> Will be back in 20 minutes.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: yes sir, I downloaded the package from
<kandarpk> http://devel.randomink.org/projects/python-xklavier/files
<kandarpk> and it worked fine
<manusheel> kandarpk: This is infact a sugarjhbuild issue.
<manusheel> We should report this after reproducing on our machine.
<manusheel> ./sugar-jhbuild does not build this package correctly.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Can you please check this sometime today.
<manusheel> ?*
<manusheel> timclicks: We'll get back to you soon on it.
<manusheel> timclicks: Thank you for reporting it.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: I'll have time in the eening
<timClicks> manusheel, no problem
<kandarpk> *evening
<timClicks> thank you for your prompt response
<manusheel> kandarpk: Sure, Kandarp.
<manusheel> We'll check then.
<manusheel> timclicks: Very welcome.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: neeraj had used some other source, I guess
<dfarning> I am running a fresh jhbuild to see where it breaks.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Ok, let us check with him.
<kandarpk> dfarning: please mail me the steps to reproduce when you get time
<manusheel> dfarning, kandarpk: Will be back in an hour.
<dfarning> kandarpk, sure, it will probobly take 30 minutes to run the build.
<dfarning> manusheel, see you
<dfarning> kandarpk, what do you have planned for today?
<kandarpk> dfarning: will be working on API
<kandarpk> and studying PyGtk
<kandarpk> dfarning: is there any other important task ?
<manusheel> dfarning: Was just about to leave. Did you get a chance to create a backgrounder for network management tasks?
<dfarning> kandarpk, great.  I think that is as high as anything else on the list:)
<manusheel> kandarpk: Will like you to work on network management related tasks once we have them ready. Will be sending you the reference links for telepathy, presence service and other important areas.
<manusheel> dfarning : Indeed.
<manusheel> They are all important areas.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: ok
<dfarning> manusheel, I still need to figure it out myself.... I think I have a mental block when it comes to networking.... I'll keep working on it tonight.
<manusheel> dfarning: Can you send me the list of tasks that you had planned. Will come back in an hour, and will spend time on its roadmap an execution.
<manusheel> dfarning: Sure.
<manusheel> Please take your time.
<dfarning> manusheel, sure.
<manusheel> dfarning: Great. Talk to you soon.
<dfarning> manusheel, does that me I can't play with kandarpk tonight:)
<dfarning> s/me/mean/
<manusheel> dfarning: Kandarp and you can work on tasks together.
<manusheel> dfarning: Kandarp might not be able to do testing and packaging work right now. He spends morning and afternoon time on reading and understanding things.
<manusheel> dfarning: And, starts working on development related activities in evening.
<dfarning> manusheel, that is a long day.
<manusheel> dfarning: He can work on sunjammer.
<manusheel> dfarning: Kandarp can work on documentation related tasks.
<manusheel> He'll coordinate with you directly on the discussions and taks.
<manusheel> tasks*
<kandarpk> dfarning: how can we use http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Jhbuild
<kandarpk> like any othe rfile location ?
<kandarpk> *other file
<manusheel> dfarning: Talk to you soon.
<dfarning> manusheel, I was kidding:) yesterday I had a good hacking with him/
<dfarning> manusheel, bye
<manusheel> dfarning: Ok :-)
<manusheel> dfarning: bye.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: bye
<manusheel> kandarpk: bye. Will be back in an hour.
<dfarning> kandarpk, we need to run jhuild in your home dir.
<dfarning> dfarning, the directions following the heading Check out sugar-jhbuild should work.
<dfarning> kandarpk, ^^
<kandarpk> dfarning: oh, never went to that link
<kandarpk> dfarning: so, we are just creating a local repo and updating it for changes ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes we want to make a local instance of jhbuild.  The gives us three thing. 1) the install/... dir is a good place to pull the sorurces for generating the documentaion 2) In a single command we can go through all the git repo for daily update.  3) eypydocs alsl uses jhbuild/install/...
<dfarning> s/alsl/also/
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok.
<kandarpk> dfarning: 2) will be helpful in case sphinx-build issues error
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes
<dfarning> kandarpk, http://pastebin.org/389720 is the error I am getting for 'Error during phase build of python-xklavier'
<dfarning> kandarpk, I would suggest having some one ask alsroot on #sugar.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I think working on it will take some time
<kandarpk> have to leave in 5 min
<dfarning> It looks like a version mismatch error.
<kandarpk> dfarning: will get back in around 75 min
<dfarning> kandarpk,  see you
<kandarpk> dfarning: yes, that was my first response
<kandarpk> bye
<dipankar> dfarning, manusheel Sir good morning
<dfarning> dipankar, good morning
<dfarning> dipankar, how are you this morning.
<dipankar> dfarning, I have just woke up. :) Was awake will 2:30 am last night to catch the World Cup Final.
<dipankar> dfarning, Match was a complete idiotic one. :( I did not like it at all.
<dfarning> dipankar, I was just installing debian on my netbook to test the new debian packages and screwed up grub so the netbook will not boot:(
<dfarning> dipankar, I forgot about:(
<dipankar> dfarning, I have just the solution for that
<dfarning> dipankar, what is your solution
<dfarning> ?
<dipankar> * I once worked on this issue myself. Many people screw up grub while uninstalling/installing Linux.
<dipankar> Did you have windows loaded?
<dfarning> dipankar, no.
<dipankar> dfarning, actually my solution is to boot from Windows DVD and 'recover the start-up'
<dipankar> dfarning, no worries
<dipankar> dfarning, you can installing grub once again using a live DVD
<dipankar> *s/DVD/CD
<dipankar> dfarning, I forgot the exact process. Please give me a minute, to look for it
<dfarning> dipankar, I remebmer what you are talking about.  I'll try it in the morning.... I am getting to tired to trouble shoot.
<dfarning> very busy day:) now very tired:(
<dipankar> dfarning, yeah. I guess that will be good. Today was a Sunday. Why so busy?
<dfarning> I am leaving to go to paraguay next monday, kandarp and I had a good day hacking, and manusheel and I talked about expansion plans.
<dfarning> dipankar, what do you have planned for the day?
<dipankar> dfarning, thats nice :).
<dipankar> dfarning, Manu Sir wants me to check some packages for debian
<dfarning> dipankar, great.
<dipankar> dfarning, + he wants me to start with networking area
<dipankar> dfarning, * The solution which I mentioned: http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/ubuntu/reinstall-ubuntu-grub-bootloader-after-windows-wipes-it-out/
<dfarning> dipankar, did you get a debian test system set up?
<dipankar> dfarning, yeah, I think I have. When we all (seeta team) last met, we shared the ISOs.
<dipankar> dfarning, *ran on Virtual Box
<dfarning> dipankar, very nice.
<dipankar> dfarning, I guess I too have to use Debian for a while
<dfarning> dipankar, yes, i think so.
<dfarning> dipankar, the core of networking on linux is network manager.  http://projects.gnome.org/NetworkManager/
<dfarning> dipankar, well the core from a users point of view.
<dipankar> dfarning, thanks. BTW is there a package manager like synaptics in Debian
<dipankar> ?
<dfarning> I think you can install synaptic via apt-get
<dfarning> dipankar, the network manager ties it all together,  historically networking on Linux has been horrible.  many people complain about network manager but is it much better then before.
 * dipankar is away: I'm not here
<dipankar> dfarning,  I will join you in 15
<dfarning> ok
<dfarning> dipankar, manusheel I need to get to bed, I am exhausted after the past couple of days.
<manusheel> dfarning: Sure. Please take rest.
 * dipankar is back (gone 00:36:59)
<dipankar> dfarning, good night
<dipankar> manusheel, Sir, So I would be working on he link that David sent?
<dipankar> *s/he/the
<dipankar> manusheel, Sir this one: http://projects.gnome.org/NetworkManager/
<ankur> dfarning,  around?
<dfarning> ishan, good morning
<ishan> drarning,good morning
<dfarning> ishan, how are you?
<ishan> fine thank you
<ishan> dfarning, how are you
<dfarning> ishan, I was very tired last night, so I went to bed by 1030.  now it will be another interesting week.
<dfarning> ishan, what do your have planned for today?
<ishan> dfarning,studying python and links related to networking on sugar
<dfarning> ishan, great.  I would appreciate it if you focused on network manager and the various service that network manager uses.
<ishan> dfarning, okay.
<dfarning> ishan, I expect that 90% of the nework related bugs will be directly related to how network manager and sugar interact.
 * dipankar says hello to all
<dfarning> ishan, if you have questions, I can provide more information.
<dfarning> dipankar, manusheel good morning.
<manusheel> dfarning: That is an interesting observation.
<manusheel> dfarning: Good morning.
<dipankar> good morning dfarning
<manusheel> dipankar: Good morning.
<dipankar> manusheel, Sir Good morning. Finally you are in sync there :)
<manusheel> dipankar: Ishan and David had a brief word on network management. I would like you and Ishan to set up a workplan for 2 things in reference to network management -
<manusheel> dipankar: Yes :-)
<manusheel> dipankar - 1. Study the links that I had send and focus on the services that network manager uses.
<dfarning> manusheel, when sugar was designed no one envisioned it having to work with network manager.  Sugar was hardcoded to work with the XO.
<ishan> dfarning,surely,
<manusheel> 2. Focus on interaction between network manager and Sugar.
<dipankar> manusheel, Sir I think network manager uses D-Bus
<dfarning> dipankar, that is correct
<dfarning> dipankar, and udev
<dipankar> dfarning, ohk.. and D-Bus is under PyGTK stack
<dfarning> dipankar, dbus is a message passing service see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D-Bus and http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/dbus
<manusheel> dfarning: Your feedback on Sugar design is interesting. Interaction with network manager should have been envisioned.
<dfarning> dipankar, ishan this is getting alittle bit ahead.... but the primary issues is that the sugar presence-service has a way to gracefully degrade presence in that face of different network type availablity.... and network manager also tries to 'manage' the network connections.
<dfarning> two very good ideas.  :)They just need to learn to work together
<manusheel> dfarning: Can you elaborate on the first idea?
<dfarning> manusheel, network issues are the number one problem experienced with SoaS.
<dipankar> dfarning, So the point to consider is : Telepathy controls the networking in Sugar & NM in Ubuntu
<dfarning> dipankar, yes.
<dipankar> *if Sugar has to run on Ubuntu, we have to set come kind of channel so that both are in sync
<dfarning> manusheel, I will have to ask that dipankar and ishan ask tomeu. I don't understand it well enough to explain.
<dfarning> dipankar, yes that is correct.
<dfarning> manusheel, how would it be if dipankar worked with tomeu and I worked with ishan this morning.
<manusheel> dfarning: Is Tomeu around?
<dfarning> manusheel, he should be in #sugar
<dipankar> dfarning, manusheel : Shall I contact tomeu there? or we will have discussion here?
<dfarning> I keep forgetting how foreign sugar's coloration process is to people first learning sugar.
<dfarning> dipankar, I suggest you go to #sugar and ishan open the Channel also.
<ishan> dfarning,okay
<manusheel_> dfarning: Wish to recommend that both Dipankar and Ishan work with you this morning. Ishan will need to get into the context of our discussions. Dipankar has that experience and can guide him as you work with both of them.
<lfaraone> apologies, I'm running a little late today. I'll be available in 30 minutes or so, I left my laptop charger at another house and my battery is low.
<manusheel_> dfarning: Please let me know your thoughts and feedback on it.
<dipankar> hey lfaraone good morning :)
<lfaraone> hi dipankar. gotta run, but I'll brb.
<dfarning> manusheel_, ok.... looks like you are having network trouble this morning
<dfarning> morning lfaraone
<manusheel_> dfarning: Yes. Had network issues. Just going through the logs.
<dfarning> ishan, dipankar ok to fully understand the network stack we need to first look at the pedagogy behind sugar.
<dipankar> dfarning, oops. Sorry I pinged tomeu there.
<dfarning> one of the key premise is the students oftern learn well when working in groups.
<dfarning> thus every thing in sugar allows colloration.
<dipankar> dfarning, by collaboration , here I think its 'non-restricted sharing'
<dfarning> please see http://en.flossmanuals.net/Sugar/NeighbourhoodView , http://en.flossmanuals.net/Sugar/GroupView and , http://en.flossmanuals.net/Sugar/Collaborating
<dfarning> dipankar, yes.  In this case collobration is an education term used to describe a technical problem.
<dipankar> dfarning, *like you can connect to any XO from yours without any password/ security key
<dipankar> dfarning, ok
<dfarning> dipankar, and it goes one step further.
<dfarning> every activity is design so that users can invite others to work on the activity with them.
<dfarning> for example several people can work together on a document it write at the same time.
<ankurkhurana_> hello all :)
<dfarning> dipankar, ishan can you read the links I sent from floss manuals and then play with the features with sugar?
<dfarning> and let me know if you have questions.
<dfarning> ankur ankurkhurana_ good morning.
<ankurkhurana_> dfarning,  good morning to you too :)
<dipankar> dfarning, done
<dipankar> dfarning, are you on sugar right now?
<dfarning> ankurkhurana_, can you help ishan though them.... I don't expect that he has had much experience with sugar yet.
<ankurkhurana_> dfarning,  well i needed some help here. i packaged XO IRC as well , and i was going to file ITP for that and etoys as well.
<dfarning> ankurkhurana_, great luke will be back shortly
<dfarning> dipankar, yes I have a sugar emulator running.
<ankurkhurana_> in ITP for irc  and i was thinking that i should name mel chua as upstream author or not?
<dipankar> dfarning, what is your user name?
<dfarning> dipankar, David Farning
<dfarning> ishan, does this make sense so far?
<dipankar> dfarning, can you check up your server in settings once. I want to sync it to yours
<dfarning> dipankar, I am on the server at solutiongrove.com
<ishan> dfarning,yes and the links you gave I have read them once, no problem yet
<dfarning> ishan, if colloration was working we would be able to see each other in the group view.
<manusheel_> ishan : Have you gone through the guide - http://en.flossmanuals.net/sugar
<manusheel_> ?*
<ishan> not yet sir
<manusheel_> ishan: I would advice you to go through it in fine details.
<manusheel_> Important for you to understand it.
<ishan> manusheel.okay
<dfarning> dipankar, ishan ok so now we see that enabling students to collaborate is a key educational requirement in sugar.
<dipankar> dfarning, * just a doubt, I was able to see other users on jabber.sugarlabs.org
<dipankar> but couldn't find anyone @ solutiongrove.com
<dfarning> dipankar, let me try the jabber.sl.o server . ishan can you join us there.
<ishan> dfarning,okay let me try
<dfarning> dipankar, oops. I can't change servers.  That is a bug i notice last week.  I can not type anything in the text entery box.
<dipankar> dfarning, strange, I can change it tough
<dipankar> *s/tough/though
<ankurkhurana_> it's downpouring here , my connectivity is badly affected :(
<dfarning> dipankar, yep this is weird problem.  it is going to be tough to track down.
<dfarning> ishan, were you able to change servers
<ishan> my server is already set to jabber.sugarlabs.org
<ankur> dfarning,  i will wait for luke  to return , can you tell on what to proceed next?
<dfarning> cool, can you and dipankar see each other
<dfarning> ankur, I would suggest going through the reviews luke completed and fixing the problems.... even if they are other peoples packages:)  We have to learn to pick up where someone else left off.
<ishan> dfarning,we can see each other
<dipankar> dfarning, well, ishan can see me. but I an't see him
<ankur> dfarning,  well okay , doing that .one thing if you can help find me version of etoys as well.
<ankur> http://activities.sugarlabs.org/en-US/sugar/addon/4030
<dfarning> ishan, dipankar yes that are the sorts of things is need to debug.
<dipankar> it 113 ankur
<ankur> in change log they have represented version in different ways.Should i contact bert who is present in #etoys
<ankur> ?
<ankur> well , it would be good if you can confirm this dfarning
<ankur> dipankar,  well it has happened that the version shown on the link i gave is not the final one
<dipankar> ankur, better try the git.sugarlabs.org
<dfarning> ankur, I suggest contacting bert on #sugar he is the upstream etoys maintainer and can explain it best.
<ankur> well , i was referring to changelog in git only
<dipankar> ankur, they have main-line git there
<dipankar> dfarning, ishan : I can see alsroot !
<ankur> dfarning,  okay . And in XO IRC i am filing mel chua as upstream author . i suppose i am right
<alsroot> dipankar: hi
<dipankar> alsroot, hi, we are testing the neighbourhood view
<dfarning> dipankar, ankur etoy is an unusal activity. it is base on squeak.... which is a major project which came long before sugar.
<dipankar> alsroot, please join the activity in sugar
<ishan> alsroot, i cant see him
<bernie> dfarning: sure, go ahead (about the vhost change to /srv/www-sugarlabs/sphinx/docs)
<dipankar> ishan, can you see the activity I am sharing
<alsroot> dipankar: I don't see any shared activities
<bernie> dfarning: you do have root on sunjammer, don't you?
<ishan> dipankar,no i cant see any activity
<dfarning> bernie, Yes we are running sphinx in kandarpk's home dir and will move it to /srv/www-sugarlabs/ in a few days.
<dipankar> alsroot, thanks for looking. I guess there _is_ some problem in Sugar on emulatro
<dipankar> *emulator
<dfarning> dipankar, ishan shall we go on or do you want to experiment with this some more.
<dipankar> dfarning, its no use. there is some problem.
<dipankar> dfarning, I think we should continue
<dfarning> ishan, ?
<ishan> dfarning, we should continue
<dfarning> ok, I mentioned that sugar can degrade gracefully.
<dipankar> ok
<dfarning> 1. if two computers are on the same network that can directly communicate.  this is prefered.
 * lfaraone is back, sorry for beign late.
<dfarning> 2.  if the two computer are not on the same network but are registertered at the same jabber server they use the jabber protocall
<dfarning> 3.  if they can not find a common jabber server they try to connect using a mesh network.... this is often refered to as 'under a tree.'
<dipankar> ok
<ishan> ok
<dfarning> 75% of sugar network issues are cause by the corner cases that result from the 'under a tree' situation.
<ankur> dfarning,  left bert a message, hopefuly he will reply when he comes back :)
<dipankar> ok
<dfarning> I think our first challenge is figuring out how to make scenario 1. work reliably 100% of the time.  as it is the most common use case in classroom.
<dfarning> ankur, lfaraone is back so he can help get you started.
<ishan> okay
<dipankar> dfarning, I assume they are successfully working on XO
<ankur> dfarning, thanks
<dipankar> *the scenarios you have mentioned
<ankur> lfaraone,  hi :)
<lfaraone> ankur: hallo ankur.
<dfarning> this causes an interesting conflict in the sugar open source communty because most developer work from seperate locations so the jabber method is the prefered method of communication.
<dfarning> and volunteers work on what is important to them:)
<ankur> lfaraone,  i uploaded the slider activity.
<ankur> Can you look at that so that i can update all the other activities i uploaded and post them for review ?
<lfaraone> ankur: sure. I'll have plenty of time today so I should be able to go through all of them.
<ankur> lfaraone,  :)
<dfarning> dipankar, ishan with this in mind please spend a few hours going through the resources manu sent this morning I think they will make more sense now.
<ishan> dfarning,okay
<ankur> lfaraone,  there is one more thing about copyrights i wanted to ask
<dfarning> dipankar, I'll be here if you have and questions.
<dfarning> ishan, ^^
<ankur> when i build the package
<dipankar> dfarning, are the scenarios you mentioned, working perfectly on XO?
<lfaraone> ankur: go ahead.
<ankur> i get the copyright information for all the files while when i run licensecheck -r --copyright
<ankur> it gices different info
<dfarning> dipankar, no:(
<ankur> i incompelete
<ankur> *i mean
<dipankar> dfarning, thats a bummer. I guess only the jabber method is working so far
<dfarning> dipankar, the first two work pretty well, but when they do fail the teachers have no idea how to fix it.  so they get frustrated and put the xo back in a closet.
<lfaraone> ankur: when you build the package, you get the licencing information, you mean?
<ankur> yes
<ankur> it list all the files in proper manner with it's copyright information
<dfarning> dipankar, most sugar hackers can figure out the problems within a few minutes.  So to the technical people it does not seem like a big deal.  But it is a very troubleing issue to educators.
<lfaraone> ankur: as part of the build process CDBS runs the copyright checker. it's algorithmic, so it does not always work properly. sometimes it even finds "copyright"s in binary images :)
<lfaraone> ankur: the point of the check is not to create policy-compliant copyright files, but to alert you to potentially differently-copyrighted files that are in the package.
<dipankar> dfarning, what exactly is the cause of this problem?
<ankur> lfaraone,  got it :)
<lfaraone> ankur: yeah. It checks the package and puts the result in debian/copyright_newhints, then compares agaisnt the previously generated debian/copyright_hints. If it finds differences, it alerts you.
<dfarning> dipankar, that is _exactly_ one of our tasks for the next several months / years.  to make it work perfectly:)
<lfaraone> ankur: which activities do you have for me to review? (current queue: Connect (WiP), Memorize, Log)
<dipankar> dfarning, ohk. pin-point aim now :) makes studying the links easier.
<ankur> i have slider as of now and after that review i have jigsaw puzzle , XO IRC
<ankur> slider was modified according to the reviews you gave
<ankur> so i was kind of making sure that
<ankur> before you review all , same errors should not reoccur
<lfaraone> ankur: great, that'll make sure we can expidite the process int he future.
<ankur> lfaraone,  and etoys is in queue as well :) . i have some confusion over it's version no. so i have left Bert a message( maintainer of etoys on sugarlabs). will push it once i get confirmation
<ankur> lfaraone,  so for now can you give me reviews of slider?
<lfaraone> ankur: yes, once I get through connect, memorize, and log.
<lfaraone> ankur: please push up the activities for now, you can always make changes later.
<ankur> lfaraone,  sounds good .
<ankur> lfaraone,  okay
<ankur> lfaraone,  well i was not sure with watch
<ankur> what does watch exactly do?
<lfaraone> ankur: it's used by the "uscan" command to check a website to see if there are new releases of a software available.
<ankur> lfaraone,  then in case we dont have any tarball available and we are using git for the source code like in slider , i will leave it empty?
<lfaraone> ankur: yeah, just replace the file with a comment "# Upstream tarballs for this pacakge are not available."
<lfaraone> ankur: I talked with dfarning, and I'll look at sliderpuzzle first and get back to you shortly.
<ankur> lfaraone,  thanks :)
<ankur> lfaraone,  i will be back after having my dinner
<lfaraone> ankur: have a good one.
<ankur> lfaraone,  thanks :)
<lfaraone> ankur: in your most recent commit, 1da183a, you said you "added description to control file", but all I saw was a deletion of the original tarball. The deletion is not a bad thing, but did you mean to commit something else?
<dipankar> dfarning, what should we do after going through the links
<lfaraone> alsroot: by the way, could you publish tarballs of sliderpuzzle? it would make our work much easier.
<alsroot> lfaraone: will do
<lfaraone> alsroot: awesome.
<dfarning> dipankar, we will start debugging.
<dipankar> dfarning, ok. Just a few minutes more I guess..
<dipankar> dfarning, only reading stuffs is somewhat boring
<dipankar> :(
<dfarning> dipankar, yah
<dfarning> manusheel_, are you around?
<alsroot> lfaraone: http://download.sugarlabs.org/sources/honey/SliderPuzzle/
<ankur> lfaraone,  i am back
<ankur> well  i ran git status and it showed that one file has been removed
<ankur> so for the same purpose i committed . well was i not supposed to commit
<ankur> ?
<lfaraone> ankur: can you run "git push --all path/to/s-sliderpuzzle-a/git/repo" followed by "git push --mirror path/to/s-sliderpuzzle-a/git/repo"?
<ankur> yes , one min
<dfarning> dipankar, ishan are you guys ready to switch gears for a while?
<ishan> dfarning,I am still reading
<ishan> i think it would be over in about 15-20 mins
<dfarning> ishan, ok, I'll be back in 15 min with our first bug.
<ishan> okay
<dipankar> dfarning, lets shift, reading is boring
<ankur> lfaraone,  it is giving error
<ankur> one min more please
<lfaraone> ankur: okay.
<ankur> in path to repo
<ankur> i was supposed to give the path to git repo on collab-maint ?
<lfaraone> ankur: yeah.
<lfaraone> ankur: the "git+ssh" one.
<dfarning> dipankar, I am am going to take a break for 15 minutes and we will work on a bug.
<dfarning> dipankar, are you logged into the emulator on lucid?
<dipankar> dfarning, yup
<ankur> lfaraone, done
<dfarning> dipankar, try going to the neiborhood view and clicking on the icon for the network you are connected to.
<ankur> shall i post the log or it was done for altogether diff. purpose ?
<dfarning> dipankar, for me the network disconnects, and network manager tries to log onto a different network.
<lfaraone> ankur: I had you do it because not all the branches (upstream and pristine-tar) were available on the repo.
 * dipankar asks if everyone can see him?
<ankur> dipankar, yes
<dipankar> ankur, thanks
<ankur> lfaraone,  okay i will do that in future with other rep also
 * lfaraone can't see dipankar, but can read him.
<dfarning> dipankar, can you see if you and ishan can reproduce the issue, help ishan set up sugar to create the logs, and then paste the logs to pastebin so we can look at them?
<dipankar> dfarning, When I single clicked on the network, nothing happened. But when I double clicked it momentarily disconnected and again reconnected to same network
<dfarning> dipankar, hmm it might just be me.  lets see what happens for ishan
<ishan> dfarning , i am done with the reading part
<lfaraone> ankur: okay, great, I'll continue the review.
<lfaraone> ankur: by the way, do you mean to use "Ankur khurana" as your name, with your surname lowercase? I see you using it often, and wasn't sure if it was a typo or intentional.
<ankur> lfaraone,  well i used it initially to register my keys and sign ubuntu code of conduct . So i kind of used it from then. I am not sure if i can change it or not , well though i will like to.
<ankur> *initially it was a mistake
<lfaraone> ankur: okay. well, you can change the UID on your key if you like. See <http://www.garrels.be/Howto-add-delete-GPG-uid> and then sync the key to the keyserver as before.
<dipankar> dfarning, ishan uses ethernet to connect to net
<dipankar> dfarning, so he doesn't have any network icon on the neighbour hood view
<dfarning> dipankar, hmm looks like it is just me.  one minute. I'll post some logs
<ankurkhurana_> lfaraone,  thanks i will change it. and i was getting some problem uploading my new changes to repository.
<lfaraone> .alsroot: do you claim copyright on sliderpuzzle?
<lfaraone> * alsroot
<lfaraone> ankurkhurana_: okay, what were they?
<ankurkhurana_> i uploaded jigsaw puzzle before and it turned out that it didnt contain debian folder .but now after commiting again i tried to push it again
<ankurkhurana_> the error is:
<ankurkhurana_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/462581/
<dfarning> ishan, dipankar ok, I can't reproduce it every time.  I'll come back when I have some data.  In the meantime can you see if you can find other network related bugs?
<alsroot> lfaraone: what do you mean? it is GPLv2+, activity was orphaned and I just picked it up
<dipankar> dfarning, I have told ishan use of logs and how to activate them
<dfarning> dipankar, great
<dipankar> dfarning, I seem to find only one problem
<dfarning> dipankar, what is that?
<dipankar> sugar users are loaded very slow
<dipankar> * I guess that is bandwidth dependent
<lfaraone> alsroot: well, if you look at the project, you see lots of (C) World Wide Workshop and (C) OLPC, since although they've released the software under the GPL they still retain their copyrights.
<dipankar> dfarning, sugar users are loaded very slow * I guess that is bandwidth dependent
<dfarning> dipankar, yes, that is a known problem.  It is caused by problems with the jabber server being very slow today.
<alsroot> lfaraone: thats right, but whats the issue?
<lfaraone> alsroot: so, you can either (C) 2010 Aleksey Lim, or attribute your copyright to SL, so your chages are (C) 2010 Sugar Labs.
<dipankar> dfarning, what else can be problem?
<lfaraone> alsroot: there's no issue. I'm just asking how/wheter you want to be credited in the debian/copyright file :)
<dipankar> dfarning, lets try this: I can see ishan he can see me
<ishan> dipankar,i cant see you on neighbourhood view but i can see you on group view
<alsroot> lfaraone: I'm just one of last contributors, so just "(C) 2010 Aleksey Lim"
<ishan> i have added you as friend
<dipankar> dfarning, thats weird
<dfarning> dipankar, yep
<dipankar> dfarning, I am inviting ishan to turtle activity but he is unable to receive any invitation
<dipankar> dfarning, is that a bug?
<dfarning> dipankar, yes.
<lfaraone> ankur: you've got a loooong email coming up :)
<ankur> lfaraone,  well , waiting :)
<ankur> hope i havent goofed up too much
<ishan> dfarning,dipankar:seems i am facing another problem as well
<dfarning> ishan, yes?
<ishan> none of the applications are starting up
<lfaraone> ankur: nah, it's all good.
<dipankar> ishan, what problem?
<dipankar> ishan, means?
<ankur> lfaraone,  keeping my finger crossed :)
<ishan> some are working and some not
<ankur> dipankar,  well the activities were not starting before as well
<dfarning> ishan, dipankar ok I have a concret problem at http://pastebin.org/390195
<ankur> he might be refering to that
<ishan> it shows error failed to start
<lfaraone> ankur: sent. oh, and and you include a duplicate copy of COPYING in your package. dipankar had issues with that too, talk to him as to how he resolved it.
 * lfaraone is off to lunch, will be back in 30 or less. 
<ankur> lfaraone, checking it . and today i learned network split from irc
<ankur> lfaraone,  have a good one :O
<ankur> sorry
<ishan> dipankar, moon activity is running
<ankur> i meant :)
<dipankar> ishan, try chat activity
 * dipankar is off to dinner. :P
 * dipankar is away: I'm not here
<ankur> dipankar,  what was the command to merge changes from git that luke made
<ankur> oh , you are off to dinner
<ankur> see you after your lunch
<dfarning> ishan, looks like dipankar went to eat.  can you take a look at http://pastebin.org/390195
<ishan> * ishan is off to dinner
<ishan> dfarning,sorry would be back in 15 mins
<dfarning> ishan, ok
 * dipankar is back (gone 00:24:24)
<dipankar> ankur, you need not do anything to merge. it will automatically do when you commit the changes and push them to alioth
<lfaraone> dipankar: ankur left. he was saying to merge in *my* changes.
<lfaraone> dipankar: he'll just have to pull them in if he hasnt made any commits yet.
<dfarning> dipankar, ishan when you guys get back, can you talk to tomeu about http://pastebin.org/390195 . He is expecting you.
<dipankar> yup
<dipankar> dfarning, ok
<dfarning> dipankar, he started to explain to me....
<dfarning> dipankar, my turn to go to lunch:) back in 60 minutes.
<dipankar> dfarning, no problem
 * lfaraone is reviewing Connect for kandarpk.
<dipankar> lfaraone, just a small help. how do i open a .log file in sugar?
<lfaraone> dipankar: in sugar itself? no idea.
<dipankar> lfaraone, ok. very clumsy situation.
<dipankar> lfaraone, you mentioned that activities were  not installing in correct directory.
<lfaraone> dipankar: when did I say that?
<dipankar> what was the solution to that problem?
<dipankar> on the mailing list.
<lfaraone> dipankar: ah, https://launchpad.net/bugs/601219, right.
<lfaraone> dipankar: those packages weren't using CDBS, they manually installed files into folders. I just had them install into the right folders.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: thanks for your review
<kandarpk> just went through it
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I had removed redundant files, dont know why were they present
<kandarpk> *watch and docs I mean
<lfaraone> kandarpk: when you remove a file, you need to tell git about it. do "git rm path/to/file" if you've previously added the file you are going to deelte.
<dipankar> lfaraone, ok. :)
<lfaraone> kandarpk: more than happy to.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: ok, thanks.
<kandarpk> will update connect soon
<kandarpk> lfaraone: hopefully other packages that I pushed have lesser errors
<lfaraone> alsroot: can you also publish the tarball for memorize? http://download.sugarlabs.org/sources/honey/Memorize/ has 33 but git/ASLO has 34.
<alsroot> lfaraone: done, http://download.sugarlabs.org/sources/honey/Memorize/
<dipankar_> lfaraone, did i miss the answer?
<lfaraone> dipankar_: answer to what? last I saw, "13:27  dipankar$ lfaraone, ok. :)"
<dipankar_> <dipankar> lfaraone, also I somehow missed the snippet for the .git removal from original tar ball made.
<dipankar_> <dipankar> *using debian/rules
<dipankar_> <dipankar> lfaraone, could you tell that too please
<lfaraone> dipankar: http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/sugar-connect-activity.git;a=blob;f=debian/rules#l64
<dipankar> lfaraone, one more thing: I guess I need not change rules when I have the original tar ball available, or do I always need to change debian/rules?
<dipankar> dfarning, you returned?
<lfaraone> dipankar: you mean to change it to include that git removal snippet? you should do it anyway so that on future revisions it'll be removed.
<dipankar> lfaraone, I meant to make a new original tar ball.
<dipankar> lfaraone, if the original tar ball is present why make a new one?
<lfaraone> dipankar: two reasons: A) it documents how we generated the existing tarball, and B) it automates the generation of tarballs for future upstream versions if needed.
<dipankar> lfaraone, makes sense. Thanks for clearing the doubt.
<lfaraone> dipankar: any time.
<dipankar> lfaraone, this means I have to change the rules file for log activity.
<lfaraone> dipankar: you should, yes.
<dipankar> lfaraone, did you get a chance to look into the problem I mentioned.
<dipankar> ?
<lfaraone> dipankar: which problem?
<lfaraone> dipankar: you'll have to pardon me, my memory fades as I age. :P
<dipankar> lfaraone, age?! you saying that! very bad :P
<dipankar>  it would be great if you could try git-builpackage on the log activity, there is some error related to 'Log.activity folder not found'
<dipankar> lfaraone, ^^
<lfaraone> dipankar: okay. right now I'm looking at memorize.
<dipankar> lfaraone, the review pipeline :P
<dipankar> lfaraone, no worries. I was about to head to bed.
<dipankar> lfaraone, I will contact you in 9-12 evening EST
<lfaraone> dipankar: okay.
<dfarning> dipankar, just got back
<dipankar> dfarning, ishan left. he was tired
<dfarning> dipankar, understandable -- learning is hard work.  It looks like you are working with tomeu on sugar.
<dipankar> dfarning, I made a small mistake in interpreting his statement and lost 15 minutes
<dfarning> dipankar, that is part of learning:)  if this was easy someone would have done it already.
<kandarpk> dfarning: hi
<dfarning> kandarpk, good afternoon.
<kandarpk> dfarning: good afternoon
<kandarpk> sorry, couldn't join earlier
<dfarning> kandarpk, np, I did not realize all of the projecs manusheel_has you working on.
<dfarning> kandarpk, ankur had good progress working with lfaraone on packaging while dipankar and ishan started working on networking and colloration.
<kandarpk> dfarning: yeah, I went through the logs
<dipankar> dfarning, I am unable to get what tomeu actually means :(. could you help me a bit
<dfarning> dipankar, just a moment I catch up.
<kandarpk> dfarning: what do I need to work on ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, did manusheel_forward you the task list yet.
<dipankar> dfarning, ok. I am not getting this line : <tomeu> ok, and what you got in the terminal and what you got into the log file?
<kandarpk> dfarning: I received the links to network management
<dfarning> dipankar, there is a terminal activity inside of sugar.
<dfarning> kandarpk, will you also be working on networking.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I think so.
<dipankar> dfarning, I know that. :)  I ran the command too
<dipankar> dfarning, after that?
<dfarning> kandarpk,  tomeu is asking that you run the command on the terminal activity inside of sugar
<dfarning> ok
<dfarning> dipankar, ahh about 'less' ?
<dipankar> dfarning, kandarpk : People assigned for networking are: me, Ishan & kandarp
<dipankar> dfarning, ?
<dfarning> ok great
<dfarning> kandarpk, I would suggest reading http://people.collabora.co.uk/~danni/telepathy-book/ telepathy is the collorating stack in sugar.
<kandarpk> dipankar: how did you get started ?
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok.
<dipankar> dfarning, how about kandarpk follow the irclog
<kandarpk> dipankar: I went through it
<dfarning> dipankar, yes
<kandarpk> dipankar: was way too much to understand in one go
<dipankar> kandarpk, you got the scenarios I guess
<kandarpk> dipankar: sugar-emulator does not show anyone in my neighbouhood
<kandarpk> view
<dipankar> kandarpk, just hold on for sometime, it will show.
<dipankar> dfarning, about 'less'??
<kandarpk> dipankar: less is command line editor like vim
<satellit__> kandarpk: it is taking 2-5 minutes for jabber.sugarlabs.org to show others
<kandarpk> dipankar: I waited for about 4-5 min
<dfarning> dipankar, http://www.oreillynet.com/linux/cmd/cmd.csp?path=l/less
<dipankar> satellit__, whats your id on sugar?
<satellit__> use analyze activity to see if gabble or xmpp local
<dfarning> kandarpk, no one show up in the neiborhood view for me either, dipankar was working on tomeu to fix it.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok, I have someone.
<satellit__> I just logged off.....satellit....
<kandarpk> sharing same problem
<satellit__> daveb: on #sugar maintains jabber
<dipankar> dfarning, I tried running 'less telepathy-gabble.log'
<dipankar> no result
<dipankar> dfarning, "telepathy-gabble.log" may be a binary file.  See it anyway?
<dipankar> is what I got
<kandarpk> dfarning: setting server to jabber.sugarlabs.org, running chat, switching to neighborhood view
<dfarning> dipankar, what dir are you in?
<kandarpk> dfarning: is it all that is required to view other users ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, it should be:(
<dipankar> kandarpk, you need not turn on any activity
<kandarpk> ok.
<dipankar> kandarpk, you will see others in neighbourhood view directly :)
<satellit__> you may have to reboot after jabber change...not sure of this.
<dipankar> dfarning, I am in .sugar/default/logs/
<kandarpk> satellit__: I was using emulator
<dipankar> satellit__, reboot not required, I have tried it on my system
<dfarning> dipankar, type 'ls'
<kandarpk> still need to reboot ?
<satellit__> great I always do it but not based on fact...
<dipankar> dfarning, http://paste.ubuntu.com/462647/
<dfarning> dipankar, type 'ls -la'
<dipankar> dfarning, http://paste.ubuntu.com/462648/
<dfarning> dipankar, are you making a typo with less telepath-gabble.log ?
<dfarning> dipankar, just type 'less '
<dipankar> dfarning, I don't think so
<dipankar> dfarning, here is the o/p of less: Missing filename ("less --help" for help)
<dfarning> dipankar, when typing filenames do you use autocomplete?
<dipankar> dfarning, yes
<dfarning> dipankar, try using less to look at the shell log file
<dipankar> dfarning, its working with 'less shell.log'
<kandarpk> dfarning: will 'cat filename' help if less isn't working ?
<dfarning> dipankar,   try it
<dipankar> dfarning, kandarpk : it just ran through the whole file.
<kandarpk> dipankar: it will
<dfarning> dipankar, weird that it don't work with 'less'.
<dipankar> dfarning, what am I supposed to look at?
<dfarning> dipankar, I don't know:(
<dipankar> dfarning, why 'less'?
<dipankar> dfarning, I am feeling very sleepy.
<dfarning> dipankar, it presents the file one 'page' at a time so you can scan it quickly
<dipankar> dfarning, ohk.
<kandarpk> dipankar: please give some hints on getting started before going
<kandarpk> *Networking
<dfarning> dipankar, np you have been working on a new hard problem.  I suggest that you start fresh tomorrow by becoming familiar with all of the things on http://gd.tuwien.ac.at/linuxcommand.org/learning_the_shell.php
<dfarning> dipankar, once you have done that try asking tomeu again:)
<dipankar> kandarpk, we didn't go much far from what David explained.
<dipankar> in the starting
<dipankar> :)
 * dipankar says good night to all
<dipankar> bye guys. see you tomorrow
<kandarpk> dipankar: :(
<dipankar> kandarpk, why so sad?
<kandarpk> dipankar: coz I have no idea of networking yet
<dfarning> kandarpk, you are up late.
<kandarpk> dfarning: need to make up for the time I lost today
<dfarning> kandarpk, did you have something else going on?
<kandarpk> dfarning: can you provide some very basic guide to networking ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, sure.
<kandarpk> dfarning: yeah, just lost some time for unforeseen reasons
<dfarning> well you know the basics of the neighborhood and collaboration.
<kandarpk> dfarning: got some idea from chat logs
<kandarpk> dfarning: basic aim - to promote education
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes exactly colloboration is the key distinguisher between sugar and other desktop envirnoments.
<kandarpk> dfarning: yeah, I got that point
<dfarning> kandarpk, but it has a lot of very frustrating bugs.
<kandarpk> dfarning: so how have we planned to approach them ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, and you saw that within sugar the 'technique' for handling collaboration changes depending on the available network?
<kandarpk> dfarning: the mesh sort of thing you were talking about ?
<dfarning> the biggest challange is how network manager which tries to manage the connection and sugar which also tries to manage the connection.
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes,
<kandarpk> *I understood that, but can't put in exact words
<dfarning> kandarpk, so the plan is to start picking off the low hanging bugs and then focus exclusively on specif types of bugs.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok
<dfarning> most classroom have a wireless router so the students connect directly over their local network.  but most developers are remote... so connects via jabber server gets to most attention.
<dfarning> kandarpk, so we will start by focusing on colloboration over a local network.
<kandarpk> dfarning: how does jabber helps in connecting remote users ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extensible_Messaging_and_Presence_Protocol
<dfarning> kandarpk, collobaration via xmpp is basically a very advanced version of google chat.
<kandarpk> dfarning: it means it receives/transmitts messages to/from different users over different networks
<kandarpk> ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes.
<kandarpk> by collecting the messages to one place and sending them to desired locations ?
<kandarpk> one place being the server used
<dfarning> kandarpk, basically.  whenever sugar starts it registers with the xmpp server chosen under setting->nework
<dfarning> kandarpk, from then on all sugar sessions are aware of all of the other sugar sessions also connect to that jabber server.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok, the server serves as a node to which all other machines are connected
<dfarning> kandarpk, sugar itself passes various messages around and activites can be written to pass messages around.
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok
<dfarning> kandarpk, I think the current limit is about 200 students per jabber server.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok.
<dfarning> in theory a server can handle several orders of magnitude more.  but there is a bug:(
<dfarning> kandarpk, please read http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Presence_Service
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok, understood most part of the documentation
<kandarpk> dfarning: it doesn't tell about the bug ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, the bug dipankar was working on was http://pastebin.org/390195
<kandarpk> dfarning: I mean the bug you said which did not allow more than 200 students to cannect
<dfarning> kandarpk, that bug (I think) is related to how we do encryption.  sugar uses a modified version of jabber.
<dfarning> kandarpk, that bug (I think) is related to how we do encryption.  sugar uses a modified version of jabber.
<kandarpk> dfarning: how is presence service different from sugar.precence ?
<kandarpk> is presence service independent of OS ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes presence service is on top of the os.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok, just like hardware drivers ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, it might make more sense to think about telepathy (made by collobra) as a high level communications frame work.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok
<dfarning> kandarpk, and the sugar presence.service is 'service' to setup and manage connects via telepathy.
<kandarpk> dfarning: do we need to work on sugar.presence to fix the bugs present in Network Manager ?
<kandarpk> with rest of the layers remaining as it is
<lfaraone> hey jelkner.
<dfarning> kandarpk, +1 it is like the layers of the osi stack. the sugar presences service sits at the top.
<jelkner> lfaraone, hello mr farone
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok.
<dfarning> kandarpk, in theory it should not matter what connection manager the frame works uses.  but the the abstract barriers are not prefectly clear yet.
<dfarning> kandarpk, take a look at the dependancies that sugar-presence-service pulls in.
<kandarpk> dfarning: shlibs, python, cdbs
<kandarpk> dfarning: thats all I could find
<dfarning> kandarpk, it pulls in a bunch of telepathy-stuff to provide the framework.
<lfaraone> kandarpk: those are substituted out when the package is built. inspect the built .deb to see what deps it really has, or use "apt-cache show PACKAGE_NAME"
<kandarpk> lfaraone, dfarning : ok.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: thanks for reviewing memorize
<dfarning> kandarpk, do you want to look at you packages for a while:) and we can work on the network stack next time we are online.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I could not use speak/* for licence as tthere were some files not under copyright Â© 2008  Joshua Minor
<kandarpk> dfarning: no
<kandarpk> dfarning: I made thode mistakes because I didn't know about them
<kandarpk> *those
<lfaraone> kandarpk: happy to. okay, you could at least collapse those with identical copyrights into the same Files entry.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: sure
<dfarning> kandarpk, I need to go for about 30 -- when I come back we can continue on the netwrok.
<lfaraone> kandarpk: looking at the code, I think it's safe to say you can use speak/*, all of them without copyright statements seem to be from speak proper which has those copyrights.
<kandarpk> dfarning: that will be ok.
<lfaraone> kandarpk: scratch that...
<lfaraone> kandarpk: nah, nevermind. using the speak/* should be fine.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: ok.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I've pushed poll too, but dont review that right now
<kandarpk> that package too will have the quilt error
<lfaraone> kandarpk: when you want it reviewed mark it on the tasks page :)
<kandarpk> lfaraone: ok, and thanks for your support
<kandarpk> :)
<kandarpk> lfaraone: how do I regenerate copyright_hints ?
<kandarpk> and wht is it required ?
<kandarpk> *why
<lfaraone> kandarpk: DEB_MAINTAINER_MODE=1 fakeroot debian/rules pre-build; mv debian/copyright_newhints debian/copyright_hints"
<lfaraone> kandarpk: DEB_MAINTAINER_MODE=1 fakeroot debian/rules pre-build; mv debian/copyright_newhints debian/copyright_hints"
<lfaraone> * "DEB_MAINTAINER_MODE=1 fakeroot debian/rules pre-build; mv debian/copyright_newhints debian/copyright_hints"
<lfaraone> kandarpk: see http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/07/12/%23ubuntu-sugarteam.html#t15:29 when I talked with ankur about this earlier today.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: does that mean copyright_hint contains the copyright info. generated during build process by CDBS ?
<lfaraone> kandarpk: it is generated by CDBS, but not by default.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: ok
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I think I should leave now
<lfaraone> kandarpk: uh, okay.
<kandarpk> bye
<manusheel_> dfarning: Hi David.
<manusheel_> Around?
<dfarning> manusheel_, just got back.
<dfarning> manusheel_, how is the conference?
<manusheel_> dfarning: Conference has been very good. My apologies, I was not around when you messaged me. Just send you a couple of e-mails on the work done today, and tasks moving forward.
<ankur> dfarning,  can i ask one thing , i was confused on how to pull changes into my local rep which luke made in git
<dfarning> ankur, Iooking I always forget the syntax of git:('
<ankurkhurana_> dfarning, well it's little confusing ....
<ankurkhurana_> i used git fetch but it didnt seem to work out
<dfarning> ankurkhurana_,  please see git pull on http://www.kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/everyday.html
<ankur> dfarning:  my net connectivity is again jerky today due to rains . I suppose i will contact you in morning
<dfarning> ankur it looked a little weird for the last couple of minutes.... you kept changing names.
<dfarning> ankur ok thanks for all the good work today.
<ankur> dfarning:  all due to rains ..... :(
<dfarning> see you soon.
<ankur> dfarning:  sell see you soon too. i will make changes accroding to review in all the packages and complete them by tommorow .
<dfarning> ankur great.  Good night.
<ankur_> dfarning:  i forgot to ask one thing . i found this link as well
<ankur_> http://dev.laptop.org/git/projects/etoys/
<ankur_> so now i am confusedas to from where to fetch the source code and can you help me figure out the version?
<dfarning> I'll email bert so you can talk to him.
<ankur_> as i can fetch this from git.sugarlabs.org
<ankur_> dfarning:  i left him a message around 8 hrs ago on #etoys
<dfarning> ankur,  yes those can get lost:)
<dfarning> hey timClicks
<dfarning> ankur,  yes those can get lost:)
<ankur> dfarning:  name changing again is not my fault :) , hope you wont mind
<dfarning> ankur, np
<ankur> dfarning:  then i will wait till morning to get package activity.
<dfarning> ok that sounds good.
<ankur> dfarning:  also as i will be packaging those activities ,Is there any thing else that needs to be done side by side
<ankur> ?
<dfarning> ankur, I would suggest becomeing proficient with the commands on this page http://gd.tuwien.ac.at/linuxcommand.org/learning_the_shell.php
<ankur> dfarning: shell scripting :)
<dfarning> ankur, becoming handy at the command line will make everything much easier and faster:)
<dfarning> ankur, yes just being comfortable with shell commands is important.
<ankur> dfarning:  i have basic working knowledge of shell scripting . I will try my hands more at it
<ankur> just today i was trying to write a script to perform packaging by just giving command line arguements
<ankur> well seems like a good tut
<ankur> dfarning:  i should be going to sleep now , it's 4 am here .
<ankur> good night
<dfarning> ankur, this page is not really about scripting as much become familiar with the common commands.
<dfarning> ankur, good night.
<timClicks> morning dfarning
<dfarning> timClicks, ahh yes morning for you:)
<timClicks> heh, g'night
#ubuntu-sugarteam 2010-07-13
<lfaraone> dfarning: for ankur, you should say "use whcihever is the most recent"
 * lfaraone will be back in 1h30.
<lfaraone> Anybody around?
<dfarning> Ian_Daniher, how are you?
<dfarning> Ian_Daniher, anything interesting going on?
<lfaraone> dfarning: I saw your additions to the tasks page. Is there a reason you included activities already present in Debian in the table?
<lfaraone> dfarning: "Sugar Activities" is under "New packages", there's a section above (untabilized) named "Package updates" which might be more suitable, but I'm not sure what you're looking for.
<dfarning> lfaraone, yes -- this a meant as a semi-long term task tool.  So manu and I can keep track of who is doing what and how they are coming.
<lfaraone> dfarning: okay. that might belong under a separate table that is more suited to the task (no pun intended)
<dfarning> lfaraone, did you look at the table again recently?
<lfaraone> dfarning: I'm looking at it right now.
<lfaraone> dfarning: a table with things like "ITP number" and "Ubuntu Version" isn't really well-suited to what you're looking for, right?
<lfaraone> dfarning: I'm not saying that's not the right page, I'm just not sure it's the right table for that information.
<dfarning> lfaraone, we can just leave ITP and Ubuntu version blank where they don't apply
<dfarning> lfaraone, Yah I think I expanded the table beyond what you intended.
<dfarning> lfaraone, Is the a reason for keeping track of 'ubuntu version'?
<lfaraone> dfarning: well, it origianlly provided us with the information as to what we wer basing our work off of.
<dfarning> lfaraone, yes and now all of those packages have been started by someone.
<dfarning> dipankar, good morning:)
<dipankar> dfarning, good evening :).
<lfaraone> dfarning: right. what I saw the table as was a list of activities / software / packages we were trying to get into debian, get reviewed, etc.
<dipankar> lfaraone, hi.
<lfaraone> hey dipankar .
<dipankar> lfaraone, what is the use of debian/install then?
<dipankar> lfaraone, * just went through your review
<lfaraone> dipankar: if you didn't use CDBS, debian/install tells debhelper (a collection of scripts used by CDBS and by maintainers direcly) where to manually install files into a package direcotry
<dfarning> lfaraone, yes I think it still does that well....  I am going to add another colume with a link to the existing package if it all ready exists in debian.
<lfaraone> dfarning: maybe a modification of http://qa.ubuntuwire.org/multidistrotools/sugar.html would be more useful?
<dipankar> * sorry was going through mails and links
<dipankar> lfaraone, dfarning : we have not been assigned any activities on the Sugar/tasks page. Any reason?
<dfarning> dipankar, I just put it together about and hour ago -- manu will assign tasks -- but feel free to volunteer.
<dipankar> dfarning, okay. I was thinking of the taking up the browse-activity.
<dipankar> dfarning, also the sugar-presence-service; as I packaged it for ppa too :)
 * dipankar is away: I'm not here
<dfarning> dipankar, on second thought -- we better wait til we hear from manu.
<dfarning> kandarpk, good morning.
<kandarpk> dfarning: good morning
<dfarning> kandarpk, what do you have planned for today?
<kandarpk> dfarning: Manusheel sir had sent some links for studying Network management
<kandarpk> dfarning: will go through them right now, and will ask you my doubts next morning when you get back
<dfarning> kandarpk, sounds good.
<kandarpk> dfarning: hope it works out
 * lfaraone is out for the night. See you all in the morning.
 * dipankar is back (gone 00:32:39)
<dipankar> kandarpk, good morning
<kandarpk> dipankar: good morning
<dipankar> dfarning, ok. Lets wait for Manu Sir's e-mail. :)
<dipankar> dfarning, continuing work from last night, why tomeu suggested using 'less'? why can't /usr/lib/telepathy/telepathy-gabble' be opened through gedit?
<dfarning> dipankar,  real hackers use less, cat, vim, and sed.  People lie me use gedit:)
<dfarning> dipankar, people like me use gedit:)
<dipankar> dfarning, can't I use gedit too? :(
<dfarning> You are a much better hacker than I every will be.... So the use or hacking tools will help you become more effective.  gedit is fine for now, but with in a couple of months you will be using the experts tools.
<kandarpk> dfarning: what topic do I pick up first for studying networking ?
<kandarpk> the list has presence service, telepathy, network manager ....
<dipankar> kandarpk, just go in the order manu sir sent you the lins
<dipankar> *links
<kandarpk> ok.
<dfarning> kandarpk, I think I would start at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Telepathy that is the framework which sits below http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Presence_Service and above network manager.
<dipankar> kandarpk, that way you will find the topics related to each other. If taken at random, there will be a problem in relating.
<dfarning> dipankar, did you get a chance to read the logs of kandarpk and my conversation from last night?
<dipankar> dfarning, going through them.
<dfarning> dipankar, for me at least, it make a lot more sense to think of the presence-service, telepathy, connection managers, and network manager as part of a stack similar to the osi model.
<dipankar> dfarning, ohk.
<kandarpk> dfarning: we do not need to touch telepathy
<kandarpk> dfarning: so basically we need to study it to understand its functioning ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes, but one of the most important points is how telepathy can automatically switch back and forth between connection-managers.
<dfarning> kandarpk, see the part under connection managers on the telepathy page.
<kandarpk> dfarning: if telepathy is hidden from sugar due to the presence of Presence Service and sugar.presence( on which we need to work), how will the study of functioning of telepathy help ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, depending on the situation, telepathy choses between gabble and salut
<dfarning> kandarpk, It seems that a lot of the bug are related to gabble and salut.... or they at least show up in the stack trace.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I am a bit confused now.
<kandarpk> dfarning: if telepathy works ok in other environments, why is it failing in sugar ?
<kandarpk> we must be using the same module ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, I am not sure -- I think it was orginally created for sugar and is just now moving into gnome.
<kandarpk> dfarning: does that mean telepathy too needs some modification ?
<kandarpk> I mean which layer do we need to modify assumiong others are working fine ?
<kandarpk> sugar.presence -> Presence Service -> Telepathy
<dfarning> kandarpk, tomeu sent a link to a telepathy developers manual.... which I can't find right now.
<dfarning> kandarpk, We can not assume that any of them are working 100%
<kandarpk> dfarning: I mean, which layer needs to be fixed first ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, I think it will be an iterative process or gradually improving the entire stack.
<kandarpk> dfarning: that is what I thought after asking the question
<dfarning> kandarpk, on the plus side the telepathy is pretty sell supported by a strong community.
<dfarning> is pretty strong
<dipankar> dfarning, ok, last last's discussion was a bit confusing.
<dfarning> dipankar, ok which part?
<dipankar> dfarning, the part sugar.presence and presence service.
<dipankar> dfarning, btw are you looking for this link : http://people.collabora.co.uk/~danni/telepathy-book/
<dfarning> dipankar, yes thanks.
<dipankar> np
<dipankar> dfarning, just curious, is there any link b/w telepathy and empathy? they both have same icon.
<dfarning> dipankar, http://live.gnome.org/Empathy  .  It looks like empathy sits on top of telepathy
<kandarpk> dipankar: I think empathy uses telepathy just as sugar does
<dipankar> yup, it is XMPP alright
<dipankar> *is on
<dipankar> dfarning, what is the task for today? to through the guide, then?
<dfarning> dipankar, yes i would suggest taking another look at the http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Presence_Service and http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Telepathy pages and following the links.  with emphasis on http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Telepathy_Gabble and http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Telepathy_Salut
<kandarpk> dfarning: is D-BUS just another software which enables message passing between different applications ?
<kandarpk> by providing standard modules ?
<dfarning> kandarpk,  then when tomeu come on line explain what you have learned and ask for help again.  he will be impress by the preparation you have done before asking for help again:)
<kandarpk> dfarning
<kandarpk> sure
<dfarning> kandarpk, oops typo I didn't dipankar and tomeu work together yesterday.
<dfarning> but anyway working together with him will be good.
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes, dbus is just another IPC system.
<dfarning> kandarpk, but it came about as an effort to minimize the differences between gnome and kde.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok.
<kandarpk> dfarning: didn't know gnome and kde were so different.
<dfarning> kandarpk, historically they were pretty different.  http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/ was a joint project designed to bring them together around certain standards.
<dipankar> dfarning, I went through a page on D-BUS(can't remember exactly which one). It mentioned there that D-BUS can also be used for device detection sort. Like if a USB drive is inserted.
<dipankar> dfarning, so D-BUS is not limited to networking only, I guess
<dfarning> dipankar, http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/dbus dbus  ... does not 'detect' the device rather it passes message that 'something' detected new hardware.
<dipankar> dfarning, yup ^^ that is the site :)
<kandarpk> dfarning: Sugar provides a wrapper interface to the D-Bus API in the Python module sugar.presence.
<kandarpk> what does it mean ?
<kandarpk> I am not able to understand the use of sugar.presence
<dfarning> dipankar, any service can send a message using dbus.
<kandarpk> *functionality of sugar.presence
<dfarning> kandarpk, what was the context of your last question.
<dfarning> ?
<kandarpk> dfarning: http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Presence_Service
<kandarpk> dfarning: the Presence Service is responsible for detecting different users
<kandarpk> why can't applications directly interact with presence service
<kandarpk> and remove the sugar.presence module layer
<dipankar> kandarpk, Python activities (and Sugar) make use of the sugar.presence module to interact with Presence Service. sugar.presence provides an API for accessing Presence Service over the D-Bus session bus. <from the wiki.laptop.org>
<dipankar> kandarpk, oops I thought you didn't check the site
<dfarning> kandarpk, i believe they can interact directly.. but there are several commonly reoccurring 'things' that activities need to do such as invite, share ....
<dfarning> kandarpk, see http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Activity_sharing
<dfarning> kandarpk, check out http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Presence_Service_DBus_API for what api presense_service offers.
<dfarning> dipankar, kandarpk good night guys.  thanks for everything
<kandarpk> dfarning: good night.
<kandarpk> dfarning: pleasure working with you.
<dipankar> dfarning, good night. I will go through the links deeply this afternoon IST
<kandarpk> dfarning: hopefully I'll have some doubts.
 * dipankar is away: I'm not here
 * dipankar is away: I'm not here
<dipankar> dfarning, good morning
<dfarning> dipankar, good morning
<dipankar> dfarning, how are you doing this morning?
<dfarning> I am good and you.
<dfarning> dipankar, tomeu is waiting to go over yesterday bug with you again:)
<dipankar> I am also doing good :)
<dipankar> dfarning, I still couldn't use less to open up the file.
<dipankar> :(
<dfarning> dipankar, I would guess that is has something to do with fonts.
<dipankar> dfarning, I am going through the manual here since tomeu wasn't sure of my linux knowledge :( http://en.flossmanuals.net/CommandLineIntro/MovingAround
<dfarning> dipankar, but you know a lot more today than yesterday.
<dfarning> dipankar, good idea.
<dipankar> dfarning, I tried a lot to open up the file in 'less' whenever it opened, it shows only '@'s all around
<dipankar> dfarning, btw I still don't know what the bug is related to?
<dfarning> dipankar, yes that is a font thing.  just used gedit of vim for now:)
<ishan> dfarning , hi
<dipankar> dfarning, :) thanks.
<dfarning> ishan, good morning.
<dipankar> * thats was a comforting
<ishan> did i miss something
<kandarpk> dfarning: good morning
<dipankar> kandarpk, hi :)
<dfarning> kandarpk, good morning.
<kandarpk> dipankar: how is your progress regarding networking ?
<dipankar> dfarning, what is the bug you pasted last night (IST)? I am not clear with that.
<dipankar> kandarpk, so-so, Its pretty tough to understand thing in one go.
<dfarning> dipankar, it was the same one you were working on with tomeu.
<kandarpk> same here
<ishan> kandarp, hi
<kandarpk> ishan: hi
<kandarpk> ishan: how are you ?
<ishan> kandarp, fine
<ishan> trying to understand networking
<kandarpk> ishan: you can use tab to autocomplete the nickname
<ishan> kandarpk, okay
<dipankar> dfarning, I mean, what is the bug on Sugar? What does it affect? :)
<dfarning> dipankar, I think it prevents me from connecting to a jabber server on my computer:(
<dipankar> dfarning, ohk.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I found studying the manuals very hard
<dipankar> kandarpk, +1
<ishan> kandarpk,  +1
<kandarpk> dfarning: they have too much info.
<dfarning> Yes, I suggest a couple of hands on debugging sessions with tomeu:)
<kandarpk> dipankar: what do you say ?
<dipankar> kandarpk, dfarning I am up for it. But last night's interaction with tomeu really set me back a bit
<kandarpk> dipankar: can me and ankur join from where you left in debugging with tomeu ?
<dipankar> kandarpk, As far as I know ankur is assigned with networking
<kandarpk> dipankar: oh yes, not ankur but ishan
<dipankar> kandarpk, sure why not. There is nothing to ask in that
<kandarpk> dipankar: I mean did you make any progress that we might find hard to catch up ?
<dipankar> kandarpk, ishan : Till nothing much has been covered. I was advised by tomeu to go through 'Linux command line' tutorial first.
<dfarning> dipankar, don't worry about it.  It is an iterative learning process and we all understand that.  We are all just glad you guys are taking on these tasks.   One thing to remember.... on IRC we are often doing several things at once.  So frustration can easily be misdirected:(
<ishan> dipankar, any particular tutorial adviced by tomeu
<dipankar> dfarning, I was thinking of that only. I guess tomeu was involved deeply in some other thing :)
<dipankar> ishan, nope. But walterbender did suggest using flossmanuals.net
<dfarning> dipankar, +1
<dipankar> dfarning, hows is tomeu today? I hope he is _really_ free...
<ishan> dipankar, okay
<dfarning> dipankar, you will just have to ask:)
<dipankar> dfarning, aww. thats tough!
<kandarpk> dipankar: don't worry
<kandarpk> I know some command line
<kandarpk> you just ask
<dipankar> ok, here goes nothing.
<dipankar> dfarning, oh. I lost the link to the paste. Can you please provide it again?
<dfarning> dipankar, http://pastebin.org/390195
<dipankar> * guys please join in #sugar. I am feeling lonely
<dipankar> :P
<kandarpk> dfarning: what should we do now ?
<kandarpk> dfarning: studying tutorials and understanding them will take a lot of time
<dfarning> kandarpk, one moment
 * lfaraone waves.
<dipankar> hi lfaraone :)
<kandarpk> lfaraone: hi
<lfaraone> hey dipankar, kandarpk.
<dipankar> lfaraone, how are you this morning?
<lfaraone> dipankar: decent, you?
<dipankar> lfaraone, I think good :), its just we are having a tough time in networking.
<lfaraone> dipankar: okay. let me know if there is anything I can help with.
<dipankar> lfaraone, sure. I saw you are also busy on #sugar
 * ishan is away for dinner
<dfarning> dipankar, kandarpk, did you follow my conversation on #sugar?
<dipankar> dfarning, I am trying. its a bit tough
<dfarning> dipankar, me too:(
<dfarning> dipankar, I think the next step is to figure out what ---- this looks to me as a wart in dbus+dbus-python: PS wants to call gabble, dbus starts gabble, gabble dies shortly after, dbus-python tries to introspect, introspection fails, dbus-python tries anyway to call it, marshalling fails because it's guessing the signature wrongly, logs confusing error
 * ishan is back
<dfarning> means:)
<kandarpk> dfarning: Its very confusing
<dfarning> dipankar, kandarpk I am going to take a short break... be back in a few minutes.
<dipankar> dfarning, no problem
<dfarning> kandarpk, dipankar does everyone have plenty of tasks in the queue to stay productive....
<manusheel> dfarning: Yes. Luke has provided good code reviews.
<manusheel> dfarning: Improvements need to be made in packages accordingly.
<kandarpk> dfarning: and we can take up other activities when we finish the ones we are working on
<manusheel> kandarpk, dipankar: The networking related tasks will require regular effort from our side.
<manusheel> Let us take things step by step.
<dipankar_> dfarning, did I miss anything
<dipankar_> ?
<manusheel> In the beginning, things might look hard and difficult to gather.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: networking seems to wide to cover
<manusheel> No one is expecting a 100% understanding of the context. We'll take things step by step.
<dipankar_> <dipankar> dfarning, I was just viewing the shell.log while sending a friend request to ishan and got this:
<dipankar_> 1279031604.881226 DEBUG s-p-s.server_plugin: friends subscribed
<dipankar_> 1279031604.881913 DEBUG s-p-s.server_plugin: friends group synced
<dipankar_> 1279031618.053936 WARNING s-p-s.presenceservice: Error fetching aliases: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken.
<manusheel> kandarpk: It is actually not very wide to cover.
<dfarning> manusheel, kandarpk +1 networking/collaboration is the single most unique feature and benefit of Sugar.... OLPC and SL have been working on it for several years and not gotten it to work.
<dipankar_> manusheel, Sir the problem is with lack of hands on session
<manusheel> dipankar: Hands on session will come. We just need to be patient and work towards whatever we have. No one has developed hands on session in networking related development.
<manusheel> Perhaps, that is an opportunity too.
<manusheel> dipankar: It is very much like a research problem, where we have a set of resources available.
<dipankar> manusheel, ok..
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: I found it tough because
<kandarpk> we need to work on sugar.preservence, Preservence service, Telepathy, D-BUS
<manusheel> We need to develop an objective statement and an approach. We'll be able to do it once we try and analyze the different parameters involved in the context, their use-cases and importance. We'll define priorities accordingly.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: each one being big enough to study
<manusheel> kandarpk: It is way too early to say it is tough.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: you are right
<kandarpk> we haven't put in much yet
<dipankar> manusheel, Sir I would put it, its tough for first go.
<manusheel> kandarpk: You'll need to spend time. Take things as they come. Accept it, reject it or wait till you have a better answer. Get to the level of details step by step or adhoc depending upon the resources available.
<manusheel> And, then arrive at a defined approach and implementation steps.
<manusheel> dipankar: This is one step forward from packaging. Some challenges ought to be there. We should like challenges and develop an approach as we work.
<dipankar> manusheel, ok Sir.
<manusheel> dipankar: Some of the areas will remain open to analysis and debate. We'll need to focus on what we can gather and put it into perspective accordingly.
<dipankar> ok
<manusheel> dipankar, kandarpk: So, be patient. Networking is a core research area. You'll need to spend time and energy on this aspect along with your ongoing tasks.
<manusheel> I personally feel you'll enjoy this experience.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: actually, being completely new to networking, we found it a bit challenging
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: but I am sure we will learn a lot with time
<manusheel> kandarpk: You are not new to networking. You are new to this paradigm of networking in reference to Sugar.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Well, everyone is, in the beginning. No one comes with a whole set of tools available. Networking in reference to Sugar is an area of importance. I would like you to learn what you can, and try to put this into context through assignments, bug fixing and documentation.
<manusheel> We'll then move into feature enhancement requests.
<manusheel> You'll need to get comfortable with these things, before we start focusing on the design and feature enhancement requests.
<dipankar> makes sense Sir
<manusheel> dipankar, kandarpk: Great. Good luck.
<manusheel> dipankar: Also, discuss amongst yourselves as you learn things. Will help you build up that base, which is very much required.
<manusheel> kandarpk, dipankar: After all, we are working on collaborative models :-)
<dipankar> manusheel, thanks Sir. will try our best :)
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: :)
 * dipankar is off for dinner
 * dipankar is away: I'm not here
<dfarning> ankur ankur_ hello
<dfarning> how is your connection today
<ankur> dfarning,  hello . good morning :)
<ankur> well it seems good as far .i didn't got disconnected .
<ankur> how are you?
<dfarning> ankur after debugging with tomeu, I needed a nap:)
<dfarning> ankur the networking/collaboration stuff makes my head spin:(
<kandarpk> dfarning: you had proper rest ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes:)
<dfarning> kandarpk, I guess we will do a bit more reading and try again tomorrow.......
<dfarning> kandarpk, how is the packaging coming?
<kandarpk> dfarning: Networking kept me too busy
<ankur> dfarning,  i just came , and i will be working till late today , can you help me catch up on what we did today ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, Let's put networking on a lower priority for a day or so...... We will be working on the for the next 12 months and we have plenty of other pressing tasks.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok.
<dfarning> ankur tomeu helped us debug a problem.... but none of us understood enough to know what he was talking about:(
<ankur> well working on it help us get it in future i hope, i was not there so i cannot comment much :(
<dfarning> ankur so I was going to go over the logs this afternoon and try to understand it betters so we can return with smarted question in a couple of days.
<ankur> dfarning,  i too will go over the log and see what i can understand :)
<dfarning> kandarpk, does everyone have a good queue of packages?  Are there things I can do to help anyone who is stuck?
<kandarpk> dfarning: most of us have some practice of packaging now
<kandarpk> dfarning: I don't think packaging should be a problem now
<kandarpk> dfarning: let me correct the packages I've already pushed
<kandarpk> will seek your help if I get stuck somewhere
<dfarning> kandarpk, did you see I added some more packages to http://wiki.debian.org/Sugar/tasks#preview
<kandarpk> dfarning: yes, I saw them
<kandarpk> dfarning: that is why I think we have plenty of work at hand
<kandarpk> dfarning: you've added read-activity as well, which Jonas is maintaining
<dfarning> kandarpk, these activities are all ready packaged in debian. They will just need to be updated and added to collob-maint
<kandarpk> dfarning: we need to merge the activity present at collab-maint with the latest one ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, and some from seeta to 'maintain' or be responsible for them.
<dfarning> kandarpk, You will need to talk to lfaraone about the exact process.
<ankur> dfarning,  also chat activity was packaged by jonas (and it was latest version)
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok, but the activities( outdated ) are present at collab-maint ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, these are debain issues that we will have to work out with lfaraone.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: around ?
 * lfaraone will be back, lunch.
<dfarning> kandarpk, at this point the list represents the packages that I think we want to ship.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok, got your point
<kandarpk> dfarning: we need to have latest packages of these activities at collab-maint
<kandarpk> ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, they may be en various states of packaging by different people.  But, I would like to see if we can work with jonas and lfaraone to get them on collab-maint.
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes... i type too slow.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok.
<dfarning> kandarpk, by moving them all to collab-maint and packaging them all in a uniform manner we can reduce our future maintaince burden (cost).
<dfarning> kandarpk, can you assign and track work until we hear back from Manu?
<kandarpk> dfarning: I'll assign one activity each till Manu sir replies
<dfarning> kandarpk, Ok great, I am going to try to come up with a better plan for how to learn about collaboration.
<dfarning> kandarpk, I'll talk to you again in the morning.
<ankur> lfaraone,  are you around?
<lfaraone> ankur: for a little while, what?
<ankur> okay , i needed to ask some questions , some quickies
<ankur> when you mention "*" rule
<lfaraone> ankur: okay.
<ankur> you refer to the portion where we have written Files : *
<ankur> in copyright file ?
<lfaraone> ankur: yes.
<kandarpk> ankur, ankur_ : Neeraj has packaged write and record ?
<lfaraone> ankur: see http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep5/#index2h3
<ankur> and you mentioned to include years as well
<ankur> so in that case where i have not mentioned year or say i have not got year, i will take or assume it as 2010
<ankur> like in case of setup.py
<ankur> of in "*" case
<ankur> kandarpk,  i dont have any idea about that . i will see if i can find him online
<manusheel> kandarpk: around?
<kandarpk> lfaraone: after specifying 3.0 (quilt) source package format, do I need to build the package again ?
<lfaraone> kandarpk: well, you should do so if only to verify the package still builds, no?
<kandarpk> lfaraone: right.
<ankurkhurana_> lfaraone,  can you answer about year that when we are not provideed with years then i should take it as 2010?
<ankurkhurana_> i got disconnected :(
<ankurkhurana_> in case you answered
<lfaraone> ankurkhurana_: use "first release date of the package"/
<ankurkhurana_> okay. and i do not have a debian/source folder
<lfaraone> ankurkhurana_: you should create one.
<ankurkhurana_> lfaraone,  thanks :)
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: hello sir
<manusheel> kandarpk: Hi Kandarp.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: You were looking for me ?
<manusheel> kandarpk: I would like you to work on Read and Pippy package after you complete your current set of packages.
<manusheel> Please add your name.
<manusheel> ankur: Around?
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: Ok, I worked on read before as well, so no problems
<manusheel> kandarpk: Great.
<manusheel> ankurkhurana__ : Ankur, have you completed your set of packages?
<ankurkhurana__> manusheel sir after the review i am changing my packages accordingly , there were some mistakes . So rectifying them.
<manusheel> ankurkhurana__ : How long do you think it will take you to complete these tasks?
<manusheel> An estimation only.
<ankurkhurana__> I will be able to complete them today , in case some technical problem arise which i am not able to do by myself , by tommorow afternoon at max
<manusheel> Ok, great.
<manusheel> Let me assign you the next set of packages.
<manusheel> ankur: You'll be working on Write and Record activity.
<manusheel> i.e. packaging these activities.
<ankurkhurana__> manusheel,  it will be great :0 . packaging can get bit monotone :)
<ankurkhurana__> sir , i think neeraj have already packaged them as i talked to him last night
<ankurkhurana__> he hasn't pushed them yet
<ankurkhurana__> if not
<manusheel> ankurkhurana__: Ok.
<ankurkhurana__> i will push them up
<manusheel> Sure.
<manusheel> ankurkhurana__ : I would like you to get started on Sugar's human interface guidelines.
<manusheel> Let me send you the link - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Human_Interface_Guidelines
<ankurkhurana__> will be glad to do so , sir you said you will send a link of the guidelines .
<ankurkhurana__> okay , i am bit late :)
<manusheel> ankurkhurana__ : I would like you to study them in detail. Once you are ready, we'll touch base with Gary on UI paradigm of Sugar.
<manusheel> You'll be first solving UI bugs. Then working on feature enhancements.
<ankurkhurana__> manusheel right sir . I will start working on them once i upload these packages .
<manusheel> ankurkhurana__ : Sure. Please also confirm the current status of Read and Record activities.
<ankurkhurana__> neeraj is here :)
<manusheel> neeraj: Hi Neeraj.
<neeraj> hi manusheel sir
<neeraj> hi ankurkhurana__
<manusheel> neeraj: What is the status of packaging of Read and Record activities?
<manusheel> Have you submitted them for review?
<neeraj> Sir just doing that.. got struck while filling ITP that day..
<neeraj> ankur is helping me in that
<manusheel> ankurkhurana__ : The next activity that I would like you to package after completing this set of activities is Paint.
<manusheel> neeraj: Ok.
<ankurkhurana__> manusheel,  will do it :)
<manusheel> ankur: Thanks Ankur.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: around ?
<ankur> manusheel sir, for ?
<manusheel> ankur: For starting with paint activity package. I am sure it is going to be an interesting effort.
<manusheel> :-)
<ankur> manusheel sir , thank you sir :) . i will be glad to do so .
<kandarpk> lfaraone: getting error while pushing : http://pastebin.org/392283
<lfaraone> kandarpk: did you pull in my changes before you started working?
<kandarpk> lfaraone: yes
<lfaraone> kandarpk: the "non-fast-forward" bit says otherwise.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I used
<kandarpk> git pull git+ssh://git.debian.org/git/collab-maint/sugar-memorize-activity.git
<kandarpk> before working
<lfaraone> kandarpk: okay. run that command again now.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: it says already upto date
<kandarpk> From git+ssh://git.debian.org/git/collab-maint/sugar-memorize-activity
<kandarpk>  * branch            HEAD       -> FETCH_HEAD
<kandarpk> Already up-to-date.
<lfaraone> kandarpk: I'm looking at http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/sugar-memorize-activity.git;a=summary, ant it appears your commits are there.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: yes, commits are present
<kandarpk> lfaraone: what errors were reported then ?
<kandarpk> http://pastebin.org/392283
<lfaraone> kandarpk: in pristine-tar and upstream.
<lfaraone> kandarpk: "git pull git+ssh://git.debian.org/git/collab-maint/sugar-memorize-activity.git pristine-tar" then "git pull git+ssh://git.debian.org/git/collab-maint/sugar-memorize-activity.git  upstream"
<kandarpk> lfaraone: do I need to push again after running the above two commands ?
<lfaraone> kandarpk: you shouldn't since you didn't make changes.
<lfaraone> kandarpk: but see if you still get the error.
 * lfaraone will be back later.
<ankur> dfarning,  one problem is coming in packaging
<ankur> when i generate copyright_hints file
<ankur> using
<ankur> DEB_MAINTAINER_MODE=1 fakeroot debian/rules pre-build
<ankur> i am not able to open the copyright_hint file
<ankur> Gedit says format not recognised
<dfarning> ankur what is the result of ls -la
<ankur> dfarning, http://paste.ubuntu.com/463093/
<ankur> oops
<ankur> i done it in aactivit folder
<ankur> not in debian folder
<ankur> where was i supposed to give that command in debian folder?
<ankur> pasting that also
<ankur> dfarning,  http://paste.ubuntu.com/463094/
<ankur> this is in debian folder
<dfarning> ankur I don't  see a copyright_hint file
<ankur> dfarning,  one min , i will paste new one .
<ankur> i might have deleted it while checking
<ankur> dfarning,  i am not able to again create copyright_hints file
<ankur> if you excuse me for some time
<ankur> i will get back to you
<dfarning> ankur sure
<neeraj> dfarning, while submitting itp I made one mistake http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?msg=5;bug=588949
<neeraj> pls see ur inbox..
<dfarning> neeraj, what is wrong with it?
<neeraj> see the url part
<dfarning> neeraj, Don't worry about that.  An ITP is just a notice that you send to the list to let others know you will be working on a particular package.
<neeraj> dfarning, ok..
<kandarpk> ankur: around ?
<ankur> yes
<kandarpk> ankur: how do we generate copyright_hint ?
<dfarning> neeraj, and it is also a reminder.  If you let a ITP sit too long without completing the package, people will start to bug you:)
<ankur> kandarpk,  DEB_MAINTAINER_MODE = 1 fakeroot debian/rules pre-build
<ankur> then rename copyright_newhints file
<ankur> to copyright_hints
<ankur> kandarpk,  i learned this from reading the conversation between you and luke in logs :P
<kandarpk> ankur:do we need to add pre-build to debian/rules ?
<ankur> no
<kandarpk> ok
<ankur> everything is done autmatically
<kandarpk> ok.
<ankur> i want able to see where the arguement of pre-build go in rules file
<ankur> may i didnt inspected it fully
<ankur> kandarpk,  were you able to push your changes
<kandarpk> yes
<ankur> as i was getting same problem as you
<ankur> of fast forwareded packages
<ankur> that you just asked luke
<kandarpk> Ok, I didnt try the same package again
<ankur> did pulling from both and master and upstream worked
<ankur> ?
<ankur> okay
<ankur> when you try
<ankur> please do tell me
<ankur> as
<ankur> i pushed some package to git
<kandarpk> ankur: I didn't push the same package again
<ankur> kandarpk,  will ask you later then
<ankur> what are you working on as of now?
<kandarpk> ankur: correcting the packages I had pushed
<ankur> kandarpk,  ok
<kandarpk> poll, connect, memorize
<ankur> kandarpk,  did you fully understand the conceot of copyrights?
<ankur> i am confused int that
<ankur> may you can help me out if you asked luke some of the same questions i wonder
<kandarpk> ankur: I just list down all the files
<kandarpk> nothing else
<ankur> can you send me your copyright file after you work out your package
<ankur> how do you do that?
<ankur> any particular procedure
<ankur> do you check all files personally
<kandarpk> wait
<ankur> ?
<kandarpk> ankur
<kandarpk> http://paste.ubuntu.com/463097/
<ankur> kandarp try this
<ankur> in your activity folder
<ankur> licensecheck --r -copyright *
<ankur> and do these match with copyright_hints
<ankur> actually i was confused
<ankur> because they show somewhat different things
<ankur> and luke also said to make sure that we dont miss out on one
<neeraj> dfarning, in control.in depends field $(python-abiword:Depends) will be fine?
<ankur> file
<ankur> kandarpk,  around?
<kandarpk> ankur: yes
<dfarning> neeraj, I think that you just need to replace EXTRA_DEPENDANCIES with python-abiword
<neeraj> while building I used only python-abiword..
<dfarning> neeraj, did it give and error.
<neeraj> ok.. I was just trying to modify all file acco to lfaraone reviews to other packages
<kandarpk> neeraj: its correct
<dfarning> the ${...} is bash for a calling a variable.
<kandarpk> python-abiword
<kandarpk> just use this
<ankur> dfarning,  so we use   ", python-abiword"
<ankur> or " , ${python-abiword:Depends}"
<ankur> or even EXTRADEPENDENCIES
<dfarning> ankur, the firstone
<kandarpk> Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, ${python:Depends}, python-abiword, ${misc:Depends}
<neeraj> dfarning, kandarpk I was just trying to modify it acco to this comment of lfaraone http://paste.ubuntu.com/463108/
<neeraj> kandarpk, yes.. initially I used only this :)
<ankur> neeraj,  that means that you have to give ' '(space) after
<ankur> the ','
<kandarpk> neeraj: you might have put commas in wrong places
<ankur> dfarning,  copyright thing is still confusing . :(
<dfarning> ankur i agree.
<neeraj> kandarpk, I am not getting ny error.. I am just asking whether that method is correct or not..
<neeraj> anyways.. leave it as of now :)
<kandarpk> neeraj: put commas in correct places
<kandarpk> I think rest all is fine
<ankur> dfarning,  can you help me find the correct version of paint
<ankur> :)
<ankur> http://activities.sugarlabs.org/en-US/sugar/addon/4082
<ankur> here it says 27
<ankur> and i cannot find any other info abt version
<ankur> dfarning,  got it in activity.info
<ankur> it is 27
<ankur> i will be proced with it . It will be right ? , just confirming though
<dfarning> ankur I belive so.... just to be on the safe side please send an email to godiard@gmail.com and Ashita Dadlani <ashita@seeta.in> they are the current maintainers of paint.
<ankur> well that git is maintained by Manusheel sir, wont he know
<ankur> ?
<kandarpk> dfarning, ankur, neeraj : good night
<ankur> kandarpk, good night
<dfarning> ankur manusheel passed maintains off to the two people I just listed above:)  he has not had time to hack for a while
<dfarning> kandarpk, good night and thanks
<neeraj> kandarpk, good night
<ankur> dfarning,  i will send a mail to Ashita then.
<kandarpk> dfarning: dont say that, feels embarrassing
<neeraj> ankur, what change should I make in copyright file?
<ankur> neeraj , well what i do was to run thin sommand
<ankur> *command
<ankur> DEB_MAINTAINER_MODE=1 fakeroot debian/rules pre-build
<ankur> then it lists all the copyright holder name
<ankur> i copied them from terminal in proper forma
<ankur> t
<neeraj> ok
<ankur> thought i have to confirm about this from luke that if i follow this procedure i will follow in right side of rule
<ankur> i have sent Ashita a mail to confirm though
<ankur> i wil find if bert is available at this or not. :)
<ankur> dfarning,  he is not available as of now.Shall i send a mail to him as of now as i need to confirm about it's version as well
<dfarning> ankur yes, and just introduce yourself devs like to know the people who package their work.
<ankur> well what will be the proper way of introduction ? if you dont mind
<dfarning> ankur Hi, i am packaging paint for debain and ubuntu.  I just wanted to say hello:)
<ankur> dfarning,  i will compose a mail and send it to you and and again send it  to Bert after you nod on it. :)
<dfarning> ankur sure
<ankur> dfarning,  http://paste.ubuntu.com/463125/
<ankur> Does it require any changes ?
<dfarning> ankur looks good
<ankur> dfarning,  then i am sending it :)
<ankur> df
<ankur> dfarning,  http://paste.ubuntu.com/463129/
<ankur> again the copyright_hint file error
<ankur> i produced it by method luke told
<dfarning> ankur try 'less copyright_hint'
<ankur> it worked
<ankur> but is less an editor
<ankur> ?
<ankur> dfarning,  i will fix the copyright issue of all the packages later when luke returns tommorow
<ankur> as of now it is bit confusing
<dfarning> ankur rather then gedit I suggest that you get in the habit of using vim.
<dfarning> ankur it is a little confusing to learn.... but very fast to make quick edits.
<ankur> dfarning,  i know that vi is used by most of the core developers
<ankur> i tried to learn it but then gedit seemed mush easier
<ankur> dfarning,  i will learn
<dfarning> ankur great
<dfarning> ankur great
<ankur> will start working on vim :)
<ankur> dfarning,   i was little confused by packaging commands so i created some scripts to help me out :)
<ankur> it works wonder
<dfarning> ankur very nice.  a nice library of personal scripts is incredibably handy.
<ankur> dfarning,  i will be waiting for bert and ashita reply
<ankur> and put them in queue as well tommorow
<ankur> i have uploaded other activities as of now
<ankur> will learn more abt copyright tomorrow from luke
<ankur> good night
<lfaraone> dfarning: so, anything else on the docket for reviews? right now I have log and flipsticks (re-review) in the queue. aside from that, I'm working on python-elements so we can get physics in.
<neeraj> lfaraone, I will push write activity now..
<dfarning> neeraj, nice.
<neeraj> lfaraone, dfarning please see this http://paste.ubuntu.com/463146/
<dfarning> lfaraone, and several people have expressed confusion about copyrights....  Could you clarify that with neeraj?
<neeraj> If I have tried my best to make changes as per lfaraone reviews to packages push by other members
<neeraj> dfarning, did u tried the record activity on ur lucid?
<dfarning> neeraj, no not yet.  did you send it to me and I missed it?
<neeraj> yes i sent that on the same day when I packaged write
<neeraj> lemme send u again
<dfarning> neeraj, awesome both write and record worked on lucid.
<dfarning> neeraj, did lfaraone help you with http://paste.ubuntu.com/463146/
<neeraj> I think he is not around.. Now i m creating a repository for sugar-write-activity
<dfarning> neeraj, nice work.
<neeraj> he can review it and tell me the changes which are required
<neeraj> dfarning, approximately after how much time sugar-write-activity repository will be available on git?
<dfarning> Should be just a few minutes.
<dfarning> neeraj, ^^
<neeraj> dfarning, ok
#ubuntu-sugarteam 2010-07-14
<dfarning> manusheel, are you around?
<dfarning> welcome rgs_
<dfarning> every body is asleep right now it is 7:30 in the morning in Delhi.
<dfarning> rgs_, I'll introduce you as people come online.
<rgs_> dfarning: ok, great
<lfaraone> hey dfarning, it's been pretty quiet this evening.
<dfarning> hey lfaraone, yes, manusheel in traveling:)
<lfaraone> dfarning: ah, understood.
<dfarning> lfaraone, I would like to introduce you to rgs_ or raul
<lfaraone> hey rgs_.
<dfarning> rgs_, will be working with us for awhile
<lfaraone> cool.
<lfaraone> rgs_: let me know if there's anything I can help you with. my knowledge is mostly in Debian and Ubuntu packaging.
<dfarning> rgs_, lfaraone is a genius high school guy we hired for th summer to mentor on packaging for debian and ubuntu:)
<lfaraone> dfarning: I appreciate the praise, but reserve genius for the real ones like bernie :)
<dfarning> lfaraone, rgs_ was CTO of ParaguayEduca
<dfarning> rgs_, is working with lucian to port browse to webkit so we can dump xulrunner for good.
<lfaraone> dfarning: exciting. rgs_: I admit I'm not intimately familiar with the group, but from what I've heard you're doing very interesting work down there.
<lfaraone> dfarning: awesome.
<dfarning> lfaraone, I have ask him to hang out in this channel to mentor as needed.
<dfarning> lfaraone, how are the reviews coming?
<lfaraone> dfarning: I looked at the tasks page, and didn't see any new review requests.
<lfaraone> dfarning: I was talking to dipankar about log recently, wasn't sure he had resolved the outstandign issues I mentioned via IRC.
 * lfaraone checked, he hasn't.
<dfarning> hmmm what about write and record?
<lfaraone> dfarning: neither have owners, bugs, or git repos, nor review requests on the tasks page.
<dfarning> hmm I ampretty sure neeraj push them last night.
<lfaraone> let me look on g.d.o
<lfaraone> dfarning: http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/sugar-record-activity.git;a=summary and http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/sugar-write-activity.git;a=summary both report "no commits"
<dfarning> lfaraone, ok maybe something went wrong.  what do you have scheduled for tonight?
<lfaraone> dfarning: well, I finished* python-elements, and just have to write a description and do some testing, then move to physics.
<dfarning> lfaraone, nice another one done.
<lfaraone> dfarning: wrt reviews, I think it might be a good idea to re-review flipsticks since it looks like dip did fix some stuff.
<lfaraone> dfarning: yeah. only bad news is it's taking three packages to provide one activity. granted, it's a pretty cool one, but still...
<lfaraone> (s-physics-a, python-elements, python-box2d)
<dfarning> lfaraone, I have mixed feeling about physics.... but it is too cool:)
<lfaraone> dfarning: yeah, and it's in the SoaS set. which, incidentally, just got larger. did you see peter robinsons' mail to the list about adding new activities?
<dfarning> lfaraone, I have been avoiding it:)
<lfaraone> dfarning: thought you'd like it :P
<dfarning> lfaraone,  Lets' make some concrete progress on the current set before we move the goal posts.
<lfaraone> dfarning: seems sensible.
<dfarning> lfaraone,  8:30 am and nobody awake.... proper hacker hours:)
<lfaraone> lol. well, if it's not useful to have me around this period, I can juggle my schedule.
<lfaraone> granted, I usually don't wake up until 9am (on the days my curtains do their job properly)
<dfarning> I don't wake up willingly until well after the sun is up.
<dfarning> dipankar, good morning:)
<dipankar> dfarning, good evening. How was your day?
<dipankar> lfaraone, hi. how was your day?
<dfarning> It was good. and your night:)
<dipankar> dfarning, is weird that I am sleeping a bit more lately. :( May be due to weather here. Too humid and tiring through out the day
<dipankar> *it is weird
<dfarning> dipankar, I think is the the hacker hours:)
<dfarning> dipankar, no working on collaboration or networking today:)
<dipankar> dfarning, why? something happened?
<dfarning> dipankar, Instead I would like everyone just to watch and enjoy a talk by robert mcqueen.   http://mirror.linux.org.au/pub/linux.conf.au/2008/Thu/mel8-158.ogg
<dipankar> dfarning, hmm. I think something has happened while I was sleeping. Isn't it true?
<dipankar> dfarning, I will be back in 20.
 * dipankar is away: I'm not here
<dfarning> dipankar, we will start digging into collaboration deeply in a few days.  But it is such a critical part of sugar that it needs to be fun and fill with fascination:) and a not a chore:(
<dfarning> dipankar, welcome back.  Did I scare you away?
<dipankar> dfarning, you aoround?
<dfarning> dipankar, yes
<dfarning> dipankar, Did I scare you away?
<dipankar> dfarning, nope. not at all. As a matter of fact, I already have played with registry in Windows.
<dipankar> * my router is resetting itself after sometime of connection. :(
<dfarning> dipankar, weird.
<dipankar> dfarning, Guess have to complain to the ISP( as he provided the router)
 * dfarning wonders what a 'registry in Windows' is :)
<dipankar> ok!
<dipankar> Itself the system files that manages every single windows properties.
<dipankar> if I tweak anything in registry it will directly reflect on Windows.
<dfarning> dipankar, :)  I am a bit of a zelot.... I have not used windows since spring of 2000
<dipankar> dfarning, woha! thats a looong time.
<dipankar> dfarning, here is some info : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Registry
<dfarning> dipankar, got it. a big config file:)
<dfarning> dipankar, what do you have scheudaled for today?
<dipankar> dfarning, nothing as of now. I was waiting for manu Sir's email on the packages.
<dipankar> also your assignment.
<dfarning> dipankar, as far as networking lets just take a break and watch the video at http://mirror.linux.org.au/pub/linux.conf.au/2008/Thu/mel8-158.ogg
<dfarning>  we will start digging into collaboration deeply in a few days.  But it is such a critical part of sugar that it needs to be fun and fill with fascination:) and a not a chore:(
<dipankar> ok. got it.
<dfarning> dipankar, what were your questions about the scheudal?
<dipankar> real hacking :)
<dfarning> +1
<dipankar> dfarning, I was thinking of you could share our targets till 12th August, the once for Ubuntu 10.10 inclusion closing sort of thing
<dipankar> *s/once/one
<timClicks> any luck on sugar-jhbuild on ubuntu?
<timClicks> is there anything I can assist with (I don't know Makefile syntax unfortunately)
<dfarning> timClicks, not yet it is a dependancy problem.... a good thing for me to work on with dipankar:)
<timClicks> okay, no rush :)
<dipankar> dfarning, I am confused. Which problem?
<timClicks> one other idea I had today, what do people think about the idea of using virtualenv & pip for individual packages
<timClicks> dipankar, from memory python-[something]klavier is failing
<dfarning> timClicks, I think upstream sugar push ahead with a version and we have not caught up yet.
<timClicks> I see
<timClicks> perhaps I will move my Sugar dev work to a Fedora VM
<dfarning> timClicks, I have not heard of virtualenv and pip.
<timClicks> oh, they're very neat
<timClicks> super-simple tools to create an isolated python environment
<dfarning> timClicks, I have add them to my reading list for this evening:)
<timClicks> $ virtualenv --no-site-packages sugar
<timClicks> creates a fully isolated py env
 * dipankar will be back soon
 * dipankar is away: I'm not here
<timClicks> bbl
<dfarning> neeraj, good morning
<neeraj> dfarning, good evening :)
<dfarning> how are you?
<neeraj> dfarning, I am fine.. how was ur day
<dfarning> It was good.
<dfarning> neeraj, what do you have planned for today?
<neeraj> I just pushed the write activity..
<dfarning> neeraj, great lfaraone was asking about that:)
<neeraj> dfarning, i will make changes in record activity file and will push it into git/collab-maint
<dfarning> neeraj, cool
<neeraj> dfarning, after that on which activity I should work?
<lfaraone> neeraj: I'm about to go to sleep, but please make sure you update the table http://wiki.debian.org/Sugar/tasks and request review as indicated on that page
<dfarning> neeraj, can you update ...  iam too slow
<neeraj> lfaraone, ok I will
<dfarning> neeraj, just grab an unclaimed one that looks interesting:)  But skip browse for now it is going through a rewrite upstream
<dfarning> neeraj neeraj_ you have multiple personalities:)
<neeraj_> dfarning, did I missed something..? I closed the irc by mistake :(
<dfarning> neeraj, just grab an unclaimed one that looks interesting:)  But skip browse for now it is going through a rewrite upstream
<neeraj_> dfarning, ok
<dfarning> neeraj_ also you could go through and fix someones elses package base on lfaraone's review.
<dfarning> neeraj_ it seem weird, but in open source we often pick up and help out on other peoples task.
<dfarning> good morning kandarpk
<kandarpk> dfarning: good morning
<dfarning> kandarpk, good news, we are going to take a break from collobration for today.
<dfarning>  we will start digging into collaboration deeply in a few days.  But it is such a critical part of sugar that it needs to be fun and fill with fascination:) and a not a chore:(
<kandarpk> dfarning: I liked networking, but it was so vast, just couldn't handle it
<dfarning> kandarpk, so for today can you just watch the video at http://mirror.linux.org.au/pub/linux.conf.au/2008/Thu/mel8-158.ogg
<kandarpk> dfarning: what is it about ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes, we will try to tackle it in smaller pieces.  it is a 40 minute over view of telepathy by robert mcqueen the lead developer of telepathy.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok
<dfarning> kandarpk, I have ask robert if he has any good tutorial videos on telepathy.  some times it helped to learn using methods other then reading:)
<dfarning> kandarpk, other than that, the goal for today is working though some more packages.
<kandarpk> dfarning: yes, I had planned to package today
<dfarning> kandarpk,  great, I am going to go to bed.  It has been a long day.
<kandarpk> dfarning: hmmm, its quite late as well
<kandarpk> dfarning: good night
<dfarning> kandarpk, good night
<neeraj_> dfarning, good night
<manusheel> dipankar: Hi Dipankar.
<manusheel> Around?
<manusheel> neeraj: Hi Neeraj.
<manusheel> Around?
<neeraj> manusheel si,r hi
<neeraj> *sir, hi :)
<manusheel> neeraj: Hi Neeraj.
<manusheel> Did you get a chance to complete packaging of Record?
<neeraj> Sir not completely.. but just filling itp and pushing into collab maint is remaining..
<neeraj> Presently I am filling ITP for the same
<neeraj> I will update it on http://wiki.debian.org/Sugar/tasks as soon as it gets complete..
<manusheel> Sure.
<manusheel> neeraj: Will you be able to complete this by today noon, India time?
<manusheel> neeraj: Would like to assign you core Sugar packages today.
<neeraj> I hope so.. :) Ok, I will start with core-sugar
 * dipankar is back (gone 00:46:18)
<dipankar> manusheel, SIr hello. How was your day?
<manusheel> dipankar: Great. Presentation came along very well.
<manusheel> How about you?
<dipankar> I overslept I guess :P Very humid here.
<dipankar> thats nce
<dipankar> *s/nice
<manusheel> dipankar: Yes. Everyone is telling me that humidity is at an all time high in Delhi.
<manusheel> dipankar: I would like you to get started with packaging sugar-presence service today.
<dipankar> manusheel, ok Sir.
<manusheel> dipankar: For 0.84, 0.86 and 0.88. Please engage Ishan with you in this effort.
<manusheel> dipankar: I'll be sending an e-mail with the entire list on who'll be working on what package.
<dipankar> manusheel, I didn't get it Sir. for all : 0.84, 0.86, 0.88 ?
<manusheel> These are different branches of Sugar.
<manusheel> We need to maintain different versions of the same package.
<manusheel> dipankar: Please visit http://qa.debian.org/developer.php?login=debian-olpc-devel@lists.alioth.debian.org
<kandarpk> dipankar: around ?
<dipankar> kandarpk, yeah hi
<kandarpk> dipankar: can you help me find out the source of pippy activity ?
<dipankar> kandarpk, sure
<kandarpk> dipankar: the one at laptop.org is invalid
<dipankar> ok. let me search a bit
<dipankar> kandarpk, see here: http://git.sugarlabs.org/projects/pippy
<kandarpk> dipankar: thanks
<dipankar> kandarpk, if that is not what you are looking for, do tell me.
<kandarpk> dipankar: it is ok.
<kandarpk> http://pastebin.org/393979
<neeraj> ankur around?
<ankur> yes
 * falcon ankur also use falcom as other nick name, in some channels.so you might see this nick sometimes.
<falcon> neeraj, you wanted to ask
<falcon> ?
<neeraj> dipankar, around?
<dipankar> neeraj, yeah.
<neeraj> http://wiki.debian.org/Sugar/tasks#preview can u help in finding core sugar package
<neeraj> dipankar, I think core sugar is sugar only naa? See this http://git.sugarlabs.org/projects/sugar/repos/mainline
<dipankar> neeraj, I think 'core' refers to the packages under them. : sugar, artwork, and so on
<dipankar> neeraj, have you been assigned any specific package?
<neeraj> no.. manu sir wanted me to to package core sugar..
<neeraj> *core sugar package
<neeraj> I guess u are right.. R u working on any core package?
<dipankar> i don't think there is any package named core. let me cross check.
<dipankar> I am assigned with presence service
<neeraj> dipankar, ok
<neeraj> anyboy doing ny other package in that section(core)
<dipankar> i was right :) see the details here : http://qa.debian.org/developer.php?login=debian-olpc-devel@lists.alioth.debian.org
<neeraj> also please update on task list that u r doing that package.. :
<dipankar> neeraj, I think I saw that in the irc logs. Don't remember clearly. Please go through last night's (IST) log
<neeraj> the procedure for building these packages is same??
 * dipankar is updating wiki page : Sugar/tasks
<neeraj> Ok I will do that
<dipankar> neeraj, done.
<dipankar> neeraj, I don't really have any idea right now.
<dipankar> manu Sir told me to package for 0.84, 0.86, 0.88.
<dipankar> I am a bit confused myself.
<neeraj> dipankar, ok.. lets wait for dfarning then
<dipankar> neeraj, good idea. :)
<dipankar> neeraj, by then we can collect the source files
<dipankar> I have found the presence service here : https://dev.laptop.org/pub/sugar/sources/sugar-presence-service/
<neeraj> dipankar, I am confused which package I should choose..
<dipankar> may be you can try that site too
<neeraj> yes I saw source of artwork, toolkit and other packages are also available on that site
<dipankar> neeraj, you worked on artwork on PPA I guess
<neeraj> yes.. I uploaded that once afair
<dipankar> I see you uploaded datastore on PPA.
<dipankar> you can have that package.
<dipankar> sugar-datastore it is :)
<dipankar> neeraj, you ok with it right? I am changing it on Wiki
<neeraj> yes I am fine with it.. But i will start it in evening only..
<dipankar> no problem :)
<dipankar> I am off for a nap
<dipankar> :P
<dipankar> see you in the evening
 * dipankar is away: I'm not here
<dfarning> good morning all
<dfarning> good morning neeraj
<neeraj> dfarning, good morning.
<dfarning> neeraj, how are you?
<dfarning> is it still hot humid?
<neeraj> Just finished reading ur mail.. So I have to wait for sometime before starting with python-xklavier
<neeraj> dfarning, I m fine.. No humidity here.. :)
<dfarning> neeraj, hmm looks like we have to add python-xklavier to core.
<dfarning> neeraj, go ahead with that one.... It i all ready in debian so it might just need an update.
<neeraj> dfarning, yes it's in debian.. I was looking for a way to download it's debian folder..
<neeraj> dfarning, can u tell me whats the preferred way to update a package on git/collab-maint
<dfarning> neeraj, sorry that is a question for lfaraone
<neeraj> dfarning, np. I will wait for him
<neeraj> dfarning, also last night I could not push the package because even after waiting for like half an hour, the git/collab-maint/s-write-a was not ready..
<dfarning> neeraj, is it ready now?
<neeraj> dfarning, I have pushed both record and write package and update it on http://wiki.debian.org/Sugar/tasks
<dfarning> neeraj, very nice!
<dfarning> neeraj,  what do you have for planned for today
<kandarpk> dfarning: good morning.
<dfarning> kandarpk, good morning.
<neeraj> I was waiting for you so that I can start core sugar packaging..
<neeraj> Now after seeing Manu sir mail, I am little confused regarding the exact way to doing this. We have to maintain different versions
<kandarpk> neeraj: faced problem while committing ?
<dfarning> neeraj, let's wait for luke on that -- these packages get a bit more complicated.
<dfarning> neeraj, yes -- an I don't understand how that works.
<neeraj> *will be back in 15min
<dfarning> kandarpk, the primary goal for today will be finishing up the partially completed packages.  We want to start pushing to to jonas for super review and inclusion in debain unstable.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I've finished packaging
<kandarpk> tried my best.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I have packaged read-activity and pippy-activity
<neeraj> *back
<kandarpk> but did not push them as Jonas is maintaining these packages
<dfarning> kandarpk, great, go ahead and push them for review... we can work things out with jonas later.  some time it is easier to ask for forgiveness than permission.
<kandarpk> dfarning: as you say
<kandarpk> dfarning: I think I need to remove Jonas packages first
<dfarning> kandarpk, hmmm can you leave a note on the task page reminding Luke that you have a question about these packages?
<kandarpk> dfarning: sure
<dfarning> neeraj, kandarpk so you guys are as far as you can go without feedback?
<kandarpk> dfarning: yes
<kandarpk> dfarning: I had problem in building pippy, so waiting for Luke
<dfarning> kandarpk, do you know who was going to pick up etoys, paint , and speak?
<kandarpk> dfarning: no idea.
<neeraj> dfarning, yes
<neeraj> dfarning, etoys- ankur is waiting for clarification on version
<manusheel> dfarning:
<manusheel> Good morning.
<dfarning> neeraj, what about paint?  some one picked it up I think
<dfarning> manusheel, good morning.
<manusheel> dfarning: e-toys and paint have been picked up by Ankur.
<manusheel> dfarning: I am deciding on who should pick up speak.
<manusheel> The same developer will be picking up Listen and Spell moving forward.
<neeraj> dfarning, dfarning	ankur I belive so.... just to be on the safe side please send an email to godiard@gmail.com and Ashita Dadlani <ashita@seeta.in> they are the current maintainers of paint.
<neeraj> I guess ankur is also confused about the version number of paint..
<neeraj> You two were discussing it last night :)
<dfarning> manusheel, ok great, I updated the tasks table.
<dfarning> manusheel, it looks like neeraj and kandarpk are caught up... I would suggest that they:) 1. help other complete their pacakges when they come on and 2) start learning how to sync to ubuntu.
<manusheel> dfarning: Sure, absolutely.
<dfarning> kandarpk, neeraj are you up for those challanges?
<manusheel> dfarning: Do we have a tutorial for syncing up the packages with ubuntu?
<kandarpk> dfarning: yeah :)
<manusheel> dfarning: We are all ready to take up challenges :-)
<neeraj> dfarning, absolutely :)
<kandarpk> dfarning: tired of packaging
<dfarning> great.
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes, it is a lot of work at first.....
<kandarpk> dfarning: updated 5 packages today
<dfarning> manusheel, yes there are some tutorials.  I'll explain the context.
<manusheel> kandarpk: It is just the beginning. To give you a change, I would ask  you to go through the telepathy presentations :-) David, we have some good structured material on telepathy now.
<manusheel> dfarning: Great.
<manusheel> dfarning: Can you send me the links? Will go through them in the meantime.
<dfarning> manusheel, with regard to collaboration -- lets start with telepathy -- the best resources are the book at http://people.collabora.co.uk/~danni/telepathy-book/ and the wiki at http://telepathy.freedesktop.org/wiki/
<dfarning> manusheel, and the video introduction
<manusheel> dfarning: Sure. Absolutely.
<manusheel> These resources are pretty neat.
<dfarning> kandarpk, the reason we are focusing on packaging first is that it is better to debug properly installed packages.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I too think so.
<dfarning> with regard to syncing to ubuntu.  please read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<dfarning> kandarpk, neeraj what we are going to want to do is file sync requests every time a change we make in a package in debian is accepted to unstable.
<dfarning> this way 95% of our work between debain and ubuntu will overlap!
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok
<neeraj> dfarning, ok
<kandarpk> dfarning: what causes the 5% difference ?
<kandarpk> dfarning: maybe the dependencies not being there ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, occosionally ubuntu deviates from debain... often because of version differences with dependancies.
<dfarning> +1
<kandarpk> ok
<dfarning> Our goal will be for several members of the seeta team to become MOTU.  That way we can work directly with packages in Ubuntu with out having them reviewed.
<dfarning> there is a very general over view here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted
<manusheel> dfarning: That is great. Glad to hear.
<dfarning> we allready know quite a bit about packaging :) so please review the MOTU information with on eye on prosesses and becoming a MOTU.
<dfarning> lfaraone, is a MOTU so he can mentor as he is doing with debian.
<manusheel> dfarning: Sure, David. I'll ask everyone to study the processes in detail.
 * Dipankar says hello
<dfarning> everyonce is a while we will need to upload packages that are not in debian. so we will have to follow the process at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
<dfarning> Dipankar, good morning
<Dipankar> dfarning: good morning :)
<ishan> manusheel,dipankar,dfarning :hi
<Dipankar> hey ishan.
<manusheel> ishan: Hi Ishan.
<dfarning> manusheel, we focues on debian packaging first because it take much less time to have a package synced than sponsorehemd.   having a packaged sponsored is not hard.... the porblem is they can set in the queue for months before anyone notices t
<dfarning> ishan, good morning.
<manusheel> dfarning: Sure, David. Absolutely, we should follow this workflow.
<dfarning> ok that is the picture in broad strokes... any questions?
<kandarpk> dfarning: for compatible packages we only need to request for a sync ?
<manusheel> dfarning: One question. What are the key priorities that our team members should focus on for becoming a part of Ubuntu MOTU?
 * Dipankar is unable to catch up. A little synopsis will be great
<dfarning> kandarpk, +1 just a sync is all that is needed.  After we have a MOTU on the team we can do the syncs ourselves:)
<dfarning> manusheel, the two keys are:)   1. Familiarity with the packages. since we are the upsteam maintainers that should not be a problem:) and 2. a good reputation in the ubuntu community.
<manusheel> dipankar: 1. We are discussing about syncing Debian packages with Ubuntu.  2. Ubuntu MOTU.
<manusheel> dfarning: Absolutely.
<manusheel> Points noted.
<kandarpk> dfarning: but I had the understanding the packages present in Debian are automatically synced to Ubuntu on the release of Ubuntu
<dfarning> kandarpk, kind of -- once a sycn is set up.  Ubuntu can detect when a package has changed in debian and automatically sync.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok, we need to request for a sync first, it will be automatically updated after that ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, we also have to pay attention to the DebainImportFreeze date on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MaverickReleaseSchedule
<kandarpk> ok.
<Dipankar> dfarning: I asked you the question last night and it completely slipped out in discussion. 'What is the target for 12th August'?
<dfarning> Auto syncing only happens atomatically befor the debianimportfreeze date.  after that we have to trigger a sync.
<dfarning> Dipankar, 12 august is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeatureFreeze
 * lfaraone waves.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: hi
<dfarning> Dipankar, we need (to try) to have all of our major work done by the feature freeze.  after that only bug fixes are allowed -- we can ask for exceptation when necessary.
<kandarpk> *will be back in 30 min.
<Dipankar> lfaraone: hi
<dfarning> good morning luke,  How about and intense day of reviewing and fixing issues found in reviews?
<lfaraone> dfarning: sounds good.
<lfaraone> neeraj: what issue did you encounter while pushing?
<manusheel> dfarning: Absolutely.
<manusheel> Thank you for sharing the roadmap.
<dfarning> I will step aside and let you guys get busy on that:)
 * dipankar is booting into Ubuntu. will return in 5 minutes
<dfarning> manusheel, you are welcome... I am off to read about telepathy
<lfaraone> dfarning: a recent development that might make things easier: we can ask the Developer Membership Board to create a "package set" for Sugar, and then request that the SEETA folks get access to that set. This is much easier than full MOTU, since MOTUing requires broad experience and interest across the archive.
<neeraj> lfaraone, I have pushed the packages.. Could not push last night as even after waiting for half an hr , sugar-write.activity.git was not ready.
<dfarning> lfaraone, +1 can you send me links?  I'll get started on that.
<neeraj> lfaraone, it was around 2.30am when I got tired and slept :)
<lfaraone> neeraj: the repo is "sugar-write-activity.git", not "sugar-write.activity.git". Maybe that is the source of the problem?
<lfaraone> dfarning: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers#DelegateDev
<dfarning> lfaraone, that sounds inline with what we are doing thanks.
<neeraj> lfaraone, i used sugar-write-activity :).. also, I kept checking git.debian.org :)
<lfaraone> dfarning: we'd probably need to create a separate group, "~ubuntu-sugar-dev" or something to match the naming scheme.
<lfaraone> neeraj: it takes 12 hours to show up in git.d.o, but it's created immediately.
<dfarning> lfaraone, yes, I figure it out today and apply
<lfaraone> neeraj: please do "git push --all URL" then "git push --tags URL" so that other branches are pushed up (pristine-tar, upstream, and their relevant tags)
<neeraj> lfaraone, strange.. I then I might be making some stupid mistake..
<neeraj> lfaraone, ok
<lfaraone> dfarning: cool. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers/TeamDelegation has the exact steps. Ask me if you need help.
<dipankar> lfaraone, while moving core package, do I have to keep something in mind?
<lfaraone> dipankar: moving them? how?
<dipankar> lfaraone, * I am assigned presence service.
<lfaraone> dipankar: right. what do you mean by moving the package around?
<dipankar> lfaraone, I mean I found Jonas already made a git repo.
<dipankar> for the package.
<dipankar> what exactly do I have to do?
<lfaraone> dipankar: right, because he packaged it.
<lfaraone> dipankar: I don't know. dfarning ?
<dfarning> lfaraone, can you coordinate with jonas how to handle it?  Jonas is used to working alone .... but he is very willing share the load.
<lfaraone> dfarning: well, what exactly do you want the SEETA folks to do?
<neeraj> lfaraone, done..
<lfaraone> dfarning: ideally, *they*'d send mail to the list telling Jonas "Hi, I'd like to help with FOO. What can I do? Import new upstream versions? Sprinkle magic fariy dust on the packages?"
<dfarning> lfaraone, what ever is necessary to make Sugar on Debian the best educational platform available.  If that is the normal process let's follow it until we hear otherwise from jonas.
<lfaraone> dfarning: let's have one person ask and say "hi, I and a bunch of my co-workers would like to help out with FOO, BAR, BAZ. What can we do?"
<lfaraone> dfarning: so far I've been the only major poster to the ML, it might be good to get some more voices over there.
<dfarning> lfaraone, that would be a good task for dipankar:) he is a team leader and will benefit from the experience:)
<neeraj> ^^ +1
<dipankar> dfarning, lfaraone : So I should write an e-mail to Jonas for working with him?
<lfaraone> dipankar: sure. feel free to send it to us first if you want proofing first, then send it to the debian-olpc-devel mailing list.
<dfarning> dipankar, +1
<dipankar> dfarning, lfaraone : I still don't get it. What do we have to do? :(
<dipankar> I mean with the packages?
 * ishan is away for 30 mins
<dfarning> dipankar, one moment -- I'll explain so luke can focus on reviews:)
<dfarning> dipankar, I need another cup of coffee.
<dipankar> dfarning, ok.
<dipankar> lfaraone, sorry. I thought review process was over
<dipankar> :(
<lfaraone> dipankar: nah, see all the "r?"s at http://wiki.debian.org/Sugar/tasks
<dipankar> yah..
 * dipankar is updating the wiki page : Sugar/tasks
<kandarpk> lfaraone: when I tried to build pippy, it couldn't find libstdc++.so.6 and the build failed
<kandarpk> http://pastebin.org/393979
<lfaraone> kandarpk:  do you have build-essential installed?
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I think so, I'll just check
<dfarning> dipankar,  are you around?
<lfaraone> kandarpk: oh, this is interesting. pippy embeds box2d, which is a separate library. we'll need to make some changes to make this work properly.
<dipankar> dfarning, yeah
<kandarpk> lfaraone: ok.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: build-essentials is installed
<kandarpk> I searched for libstdc++6 and that too is installed
<dfarning> dipankar, our current process is---  Developers package. Luke reviews. when Luke is satisfied a packages is done correctly, he asks jonas for a 'super review'.  when jonas is happy he adds the package to unstable.
<dipankar> ok
<dfarning> over the coming weeks we need to earn jonas' trust so that he suggests that luke add packages with out jonas' approval.
<dipankar> okay.
<dfarning> to insure that we don't stall is luke is not arould we will need to add seeta team members to jonas' circle of trust.
<dipankar> okay.
<dfarning> dipankar, so what I am suggesting is that you step up and start gaining jonas's trust.
<dipankar> okay.
<lfaraone> +1
<lfaraone> kandarpk: I think it mgith be a good idea to hold off on packacing pippy for a little while, we can get back to it later.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: by the way, Jonas is already maintaining it
<lfaraone> kandarpk: yeah. so the way forward would be to clone his repo, import the new upstream version, and push up your changes.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: ok.
<lfaraone> dfarning: should I review the new activities first or the ones that have already been reviewed once?
<dfarning> lfaraone,  could you looks at the ones that have been reviewed once.  It would be great to get some of these packages accepted:)
<lfaraone> dfarning: sure thing, bossman,.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: after cloning Jonas' repo, will the steps remain same as we used after extracting the debian folder ?
<dipankar> lfaraone, dfarning: Jonas is maintaining the repo is perfect condition. I don't know whether he would like new people handling it.
<lfaraone> dfarning: aside, it might be a good idea to take some of the people you want to get package-set rights and have them request sponsorship for some fixes.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: any changes to be made in fakeroot debian/rules get-orig-source ?
<lfaraone> dipankar: one way to find out, ask.
<dipankar> lfaraone, sure :P
<lfaraone> kandarpk: read "debian/README.Debian" or "debian/README.source"
 * ishan is back
<dfarning> yes, I was going to introduce dipankar to the process.  We want to be careful that even though we are a team, we follow Debian protocol and individually earn rights and responsibility.
<dfarning> lfaraone, ^^
<dipankar> lfaraone, what was the step to rename a git repo? I am unable to find it somehow. it was something like 'mv ..'
<lfaraone> dipankar: well, you ssh into git.debian.org, go to /git/collab-maint, and just use mv like you normally would. why are you renaming a repo?
<lfaraone> kandarpk: in sugar-connect-activity, you probably should remove sugar-connect-activity_22.orig.tar.gz.id
<dfarning> dipankar, we do not want to more jonas's work.  instead we want to ask him permission to help maintain work he started.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: will replacing manually do or is it automatically generated ?
<lfaraone> kandarpk: it was automatically generated at one time. just "git rm" it and commit the removal.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: ok
<dipankar> dfarning, lfaraone : I am just renaming the logviewer activity to log activity
<dipankar> ^^ nothing related to Jonas
<dipankar> :P
<dfarning> dipankar, ahh sorry
<lfaraone> dipankar: okay. let me know if you have trouble with the instructions I provided above.
<dipankar> lfaraone, I am on it
<dipankar> lfaraone, done :)
<dipankar> http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/sugar-log-activity.git;a=summary
<dipankar> * Logviewer activity is changed to log activity on git.debain.org /collab-maint/
<dfarning> dipankar, please let me know when you are caught up and we can start looking at the new maintainer process.
<lfaraone> dfarning: btw "New Maintainer" != new person who is going to maintain a Debian package, it means person who is going to be a Debian Developer.
<lfaraone> dfarning: and person who is listed in uploaders or maintainer field != Debian Maintainer.
<lfaraone> dfarning: see http://wiki.debian.org/Maintainers
<dipankar> dfarning, I am ready to start. What should I start with?
<dipankar> lfaraone, powerful words!
<dfarning> lfaraone, yes.... but it a quick look at the new maintain stuff will provide a good over view to the philosopy, mindset, goals, and politics of Debain development:)
<dfarning> dipankar, can you start by looking at http://www.debian.org/devel/join/newmaint and http://wiki.debian.org/DebianMaintainer they will give you an idea of the rigure that debian developers go through to become fully approved.
 * dipankar dislikes reading stuffs :P
<manusheel_> dipankar: Reading ia a very important habit.
<manusheel_> Don't lose it.
<dipankar> manusheel_, I am going through them :)
<manusheel_> dipankar: Great.
<manusheel_> :-)
<kandarpk> lfaraone: to import new upstream version after cloning Jonas' repo, are these steps correct ?
<kandarpk> http://ubuntu.pastebin.org/395571
<lfaraone> kandarpk: I think so. Try it out.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: ok
<lfaraone> kandarpk: although I think it might be best if we wait before importing the new version of Pippy until box2d is uploaded.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I'll try it on read-activity
<lfaraone> dfarning: based on Jonas's comments a while ago, there's something I'd like all the maintainers of packaged activities to look at before we continue.
<dfarning> dipankar, can you send a post to the debian mailing list introducing the members of the seeta-sugar team and ask permission for kandarpk to work on pippy and read.  Also let him know that Luke will review all packages updates.
<dfarning> lfaraone, yes
<lfaraone> dfarning: basically, the template we provided assumes that these activities only work on sugar 0.88 and 0.86. If that is the case, we should change the names of the activities accordingly.
<lfaraone> dfarning: however, I suspect that these activities work on .84 as well. I think we should ask their maintainers to try out the activities and make sure they run on .84, .86, and .88.
<lfaraone> dfarning: seem sensible?
<dfarning> lfaraone, admittedly I have been sticking my head in the sand about backwards compatibility:(
<dipankar> dfarning, ok. I am on it
<lfaraone> dfarning: well, we support .84-.88 in Debian. If we don't support them, we should rename the pacakges .
<dfarning> lfaraone, because it add another layer of complexity....
<lfaraone> dfarning: right. but, as it is, our debian/rules file says "we only support 86 and 88" while our package name says "we support all".
<lfaraone> dfarning: one of those two should be changed.
<dfarning> lfaraone, I would suggest that we only support .88 -- at this time.  as we improve our understand on packaging and vesioning we can add backawards compatibility.
<dfarning> lfaraone, does that seem sane? what steps should we do to implement that?
<lfaraone> dfarning: okay, then we'll need to modify all the rules files to remove 0.86, rename the binary packages to "sugar-FOO-activity-0.88" in control.in, then regenerate debian/control from debian/control.in.
<dfarning> lfaraone, does this policy seem sane as a starting point?
<lfaraone> dfarning: well, I think Jonas would prefer "test with everything to determine what works", since from what I can tell he prefers to be throurough over quick. Not sure if you saw the xklavier and rainbow threads I had with him :)
<lfaraone> dfarning: we'll find out when we submit for "super-review" :)
<dfarning> lfaraone, yes... I agree with through over quick... my concern is not getting sucked down the rabbit hole of reverse compatibility before we have a good understanding packaging for one version.
<dipankar> dfarning, I don't think I have to introduce Manu Sir, He must already be know
<dipankar> *s/know/known
<dfarning> dipankar, please add him to the list just to be complete.
<dfarning> lfaraone, the single most common failure for software project is trying to do too much and ending up doing nothing well.
<dfarning> lfaraone, can you send an email to olpc-deb . describing the situation and asking jonas for guidance on how he wants to handle the situation.
<lfaraone> dfarning: sure.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: running debian/rules get-orig-source is looking for tarball instead of merging the repo.
<kandarpk> http://ubuntu.pastebin.org/395638
<lfaraone> kandarpk: right, because that get-orig-source looks for a tarball.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: yeah, thought about it after asking the question
<kandarpk> lfaraone: by the way, Jonas' rules file too has "DEB_SUGAR_BRANCHES = 0.86 0.88"
<lfaraone> kandarpk: probably because that activity only supports 0.88 and 0.86.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: but read has been renamed to read-0.86
<lfaraone> kandarpk: there's also a sugar-read-activity-0.84.
<lfaraone> kandarpk: the version usually means "this and above"
<kandarpk> lfaraone: ok.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I think the rules file has to be modified, and I do not have enough understanding to do so
<lfaraone> kandarpk: is the version of read you want to package available as a tarball?
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I don't think so
<kandarpk> esle it would have downloaded it
<kandarpk> let me check
<kandarpk> lfaraone: version 78 present here:
<kandarpk> http://download.sugarlabs.org/sources/sucrose/fructose/Read/
<kandarpk> latest is 87
<lfaraone> kandarpk: okay. please ask sayamindu in #sugar to make tarball releases. Since his activity is in fructose, it really should have tarball releases.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: ok.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: by the way, cant we merge the two repos ?
<lfaraone> kandarpk: which two?
<kandarpk> lfaraone: after cloning the one maintained by Jonas', merge the latest one into it
<lfaraone> kandarpk: well, if you follow the instructions for "packaging from an upstream git snapshot" and tag the upstream/* branch properly, you can do that. But we prefer tarballs, and there is no reason for one to not have them for a fructose activity.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: ok.
<lfaraone> kandarpk, dipankar, neeraj, ankur_, could you all please test your activities per http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/debian-olpc-devel/2010-July/002600.html and follow the instructions given to determine the verisons of sugar that your activity works wtih?
<lfaraone> kandarpk, dipankar, neeraj, ankur_, updating your activity's "works-with" entry in the table at http://wiki.debian.org/Sugar/tasks and marking your activity for review if it needs it when you're done.
<lfaraone> dfarning, manusheel, ^^ fyi.
<manusheel> lfaraone: Neat. Thank you for pointing this. Let me forward your message in an e-mail.
 * dipankar is away: Be Right Back
 * dipankar is back (gone 00:00:02)
<dipankar> * sorry if I missed anything. was off to Dinner.
<lfaraone> dipankar: nah, just dfarning and myself cooking up more tasks for you :)
<dipankar> lfaraone, did you go through the letter
<dipankar> ?
<lfaraone> dipankar: yeah. "grant permission" seems a bit formal, in the future it might be better to say "how can we help you with it?" you're already in the team, so you already have the permissions to do so from a technical standpoint.
<neeraj> * is away
 * lfaraone is off. See you in the evening.
<ankur> dfarning,  i changed the tasks page status of jigsawpuzzle to r+ but it seems that r+ is not there.Did i goofed up or Luke remove it before reviewing?
<dfarning> ankur you will want to mark your package 'r?'  which mean 'ready for review'.  Then the reviewer will respond with 'r+' or 'r-'
<dfarning> r+ = approved,  r- = needs work.
<kandarpk> dfarning: If the activity works in 0.84, do I need to test it in 0.86 as well ?
<dfarning> ankur how are your packages coming?
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes we better to be complete.
<kandarpk> hmmm
<dfarning> kandarpk, yah:( but potentially millions of kids will be using these packages. so we need to get if right:)
<dfarning> s/if/it/
<kandarpk> dfarning: I have no  problems with that
<dfarning> kandarpk, I tend to be lazy:)
<kandarpk> dfarning: connect is working in all 3
<kandarpk> :)
<dipankar> dfarning, I have to run the check procedure sometime later
<dipankar> is it ok?
<dfarning> dipankar, sure.  I need to eat and take a break.
<dfarning> good work again today.  I'll be off line for a couple of hours.
<dipankar> dfarning, :). Then I will contact you tomorrow morning morning IST.
<dipankar> dfarning, have a nice day :)
<dfarning> dipankar, great. you too.
<ankur> dipankar,  around?
<dipankar> ankur, yup
<ankur> sry urgent call , i had to go somewhere. now back to packaging :)
<ankur> what are you doing as of now?
<ankur> dipankar,  in watch file
<ankur> we give link to package page
<ankur> or download lijk of package?
<ankur> what is the format of link?
<dipankar> the source page.
<dipankar> just a sec ankur
<dipankar> ankur, here is an example of debian/watch
<dipankar> http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/sugar-log-activity.git;a=blob;f=debian/watch;h=8a7959c23c0bc34baa83782f38602e8062e26196;hb=HEAD
<ankur> power gone :(
<ankur> seeing it
<dipankar> neeraj_, around?
<neeraj_> dipankar, yes
<neeraj_> facing an issue in debian.. asking help on #debian .. ttyl
<kandarpk> lfaraone: pushing memorize activity gives error: ! [rejected]        pristine-tar -> pristine-tar (non-fast-forward)
<kandarpk> lfaraone: details here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/463619/
<kandarpk> lfaraone: pulling pristine-tar gives branch already upto date.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: memorize, poll, connect working in all three branches
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I've pushed changes, please review them when you get time.
#ubuntu-sugarteam 2010-07-15
 * lfaraone is currently looking at: Poll Activity (by kandarpk)
<dfarning> hey lfaraone good to see you.
<lfaraone> hey dfarning
<dfarning> lfaraone, today will be heavy on the packaging again.
<dfarning> lfaraone, with a brief into into telepathy.
<dfarning> lfaraone, as you go along can you introduce dipankar in to what needs to happen before he can be a maintainer for a package or group of packages?
<lfaraone> dfarning: well, all he needs for that is to have his name in the "Maintainer" field. In the case of debian-olpc, we have team maintinence, but list specific people as Uploaders (Jonas, and the SEETA guy responsible for the activity, for example)
<lfaraone> dfarning: if you mean to be able to upload packages where he's in said fields without a sponsor checking his work, in Debian he needs to be a Debian Maintainer (which means a DD has to endorse him and (possibly a differrrent) a DD has to sign his key), and have "DM-Upload-Allowed: yes" set in the debian/control file.
<dfarning> lfaraone, Yes the goal is to get to that point within a few months.
<lfaraone> dfarning: cool. they'll have to arrange the DD signature, but Jonas or (when I'm a DD) I can endorse the appl./
<dfarning> lfaraone, Can we start looking for people to sign their keys now?
<lfaraone> dfarning: sure.
<lfaraone> dfarning: http://wiki.debian.org/Keysigning/Offers#IN
<dfarning> lfaraone, ok that is the sort of thing manusheel is a wiz at doing.... he knows everybody:)
 * dipankar says hello to all :)
<dfarning> good morning dipankar
<dipankar> dfarning, hi
<dfarning> how is the reading coming:)
<dipankar> I have just woke up. :( Will continue reading in an hour
<dfarning> dipankar, what do you have planed for today?
<dipankar> dfarning, as Manu sir told last night, I have to draft a workflow for new seeta members, who will be working with Sugar Team
<dipankar> dfarning, I am dilemma here: whether to start with PPA or git with new Members... Right now situation demands git, but PPA is somewhat easier to try on before git.
<dipankar> * I am in dilemma
<dfarning> dipankar, +1, I would start with PPA.
<dfarning> dipankar, the git method is specialized and hides a bunnch of important stuff behind scripts.
<dipankar> yeah. if not gone through that, git will just become a bunch of commands for some work.
<lfaraone> dfarning: maybe it'd be good to have some folks backport https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/601219 by prepairing a debdiff for the earlier ubuntu versions...?
<lfaraone> dfarning: (10.04) as practice.
<dipankar> lfaraone, hi.
<lfaraone> dfarning: very very very straightforward, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/maverick/sugar-flipsticks-activity/maverick/revision/3/debian/install and a changelog entry.
<lfaraone> hey dipankar
<dipankar> lfaraone, the install directory problem?
<lfaraone> dipankar: yep. we just need to tell it to install in a different dir, as demonstrated in the link.
<lfaraone> dipankar: via a debdiff. tutorial: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Recipes/Debdiff
<lfaraone> dipankar: with the distro being "lucid-proposed" and the proceedure for submitting the patch being at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<dipankar> lfaraone, yup. Looks like an easy task. I feel it somewhat similar to git diff & git commit
<lfaraone> dipankar: what it does do is give people *real* Ubuntu packaging practice, and their changes actually get uploaded to the main Ubuntu archive.
<lfaraone> since I can sponsor them.
<dipankar> lfaraone, that would be nice. So who can work on this? Are you referring to new comers?
<dfarning> lfaraone, will you work with neeraj on this when he comes online?
<lfaraone> dfarning: sure.
<lfaraone> dipankar: anybody.
<dipankar> dfarning, I would also like to try this, :)
<dfarning> dipankar, you have your hand fulls working on becoming Debian Maintainer.
<dipankar> oops yeah!
<lfaraone> okay, connect installs and runs in squeeze. reviewed.
<dipankar> lfaraone, I seem to have some problem with my Debian on Virtual Box
<dipankar> lfaraone, I am unable to install any package :(
 * dipankar is away: Be Right Back
<lfaraone> dfarning: does it make sense to repeat myself when I'm reviewing three activities by the same person which have identical issues?
<lfaraone> kandarpk: hi, most of the points in the review I sent of connect apply to memorize as well. and why does memorize contain "sugar-memorize-activity_34+git20091021.837e6c6b.orig.tar.gz.id" in the root directory? :)
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I removed it from the folder, maybe forgot to remove from git repo.
<kandarpk> sorry
<kandarpk> will correct it
<dfarning> lfaraone, a trick I learned while TAing was to keep and editor open with common corrections. For now I suggest just cutting and pasting as necessary.
<lfaraone> kandarpk: not a big issue. if you could quickly fix the issues I mentioned in poll and memorize, I'll avoid wasting our time and space by repeating myself. (by holding off on the review until you've pushed up)
<lfaraone> *the issues I mentioned on my email of connect in poll and memorize
<lfaraone> dfarning: hehe, yeah, I've been copypasting from prior emails, but the glue was getting my workspace all sticky.
<dfarning> :)
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I am not using my PC right now :(
<lfaraone> kandarpk: understood.
<dfarning> dipankar, what are you writing and who is your audience?
<kandarpk> dfarning: hi
<dfarning> morning kandarpk
<kandarpk> dfarning: good morning
 * lfaraone will brb in 15
<kandarpk> dfarning, lfaraone: how different is packaging for core sugar from sugar-activities ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, basically it is the same.  Just a bit more complicated.
 * dipankar is back (gone 00:31:42)
<dipankar> kandarpk, Hi, I am having some trouble with Debian. I am unable to download and install any package by running 'apt-get' in root
<dfarning> kandarpk, do you have time stamps on your logs? About 1.5 hours ago lfaraone had a good idea for introducing the Ubuntu workflow by fixing some straight forward bugs.
<kandarpk> dipankar
<kandarpk> try synaptic
<kandarpk> if that works
<dipankar> I am not able to find synaptic too. :(
<lfaraone> dipankar: post the error message and I'll look at it when I get back in 10
<dipankar> lfaraone, ok. I am back in 5
<dfarning> dipankar, can you email with the requirements of document you are writing?
<dipankar> dfarning, ok.
<dfarning> dipankar, thanks I have to go for about an hour:(  But I'll get back to you as soon as possiable.
<dipankar> dfarning, no problem.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: pushing memorize activity gives error: ! [rejected]        pristine-tar -> pristine-tar (non-fast-forward)
<kandarpk> kandarpk lfaraone: details here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/463619/
<kandarpk> lfaraone: pulling pristine-tar gives branch already upto date.
<kandarpk> dipankarl: please mail me as well the documentation you prepare on working on PPA.
<lfaraone> kandarpk: not sure.
<lfaraone> dipankard: your nick is gaining appendages! :D
<dipankarl> kandarpk, thats for new comers :)
<lfaraone> dipankard: any luck apt-getting?
<kandarpk> dipankarl: I am sure it will have something I don't know yet
<dipankarl> kandarpk, nah! Just starters
<dipankard> lfaraone: Just about to start
<dipankard> * running debian 5.0 on virtual box
<kandarpk> dipankarl: you just copy me. I am not very confident working on PPA
<dipankarl> kandarpk, no problem. I will do that for sure :)
<kandarpk> dipankarl: thanks
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I didn't receive your mail regarding the review of poll-activity
<dipankard> lfaraone: at the end of my name : *d refers to desktop and and *l refers to laptop
<kandarpk> dipankard: multitasking!
<dipankard> * ok here is the problem: E: Couldn't find package vlc
<kandarpk> dipankard: you can try installing synaptic so that you know what all packages are there in the debian repo
<dipankard> I ran: root@debian:~#apt-get install vlc
<dipankard> kandarpk: There a high probability that vlc is in debian repo
 * dipankarl is away: Be Right Back
 * dipankard is on Desktop
<lfaraone> kandarpk: resent. if it doens't get in your inbox, check the mailing list archives.
 * lfaraone is off for the night.
<dipankar> goodnight lfaraone
<dipankar> kandarpk: can you please tell me how you installed the packages? Was there something in installation?
<kandarpk> dipankar: I installed synaptic. all packages were listed there
<dipankar> kandarpk: and the sugar packages that luke told to test? how are you installing them?
<kandarpk> dipankar: sugar-0.84, 0.86, 0.88 all were there in the list
<dipankar> kandarpk: I downloaded the .deb of synaptic and that also did not install.
<dipankar> :(
<kandarpk> sudo apt-get install synaptic
<dipankar> kandarpk: Not working. I am planning to install Debian once again. Can you guide me? It will take 15-20 minutes at max.
<kandarpk> dipankar: I dont think installing again will help
<kandarpk> dipankar: but if you wish you can try to
<dipankar> kandarpk: I remember screwing up something during installing. There is no loss in installing again :)
<kandarpk> dipankar: ok.
<dipankar> kandarpk: started installation: Automated install
<kandarpk> dipankar: ok
<kandarpk> dipankar: you will find an option to test cd for errors
<dipankar> kandarpk: you there?
<dipankar> kandarpk: its asking for a preconfiguration file
<kandarpk> dipankar: I didn't receive any notification like that
<dipankar> Let me start all over again
<kandarpk> dipankar: I've sent you the steps I followed
<dipankar> kandarpk: thanks :)
<kandarpk> dipankar: they should help.
<kandarpk> dipankar: anything not being there means I didn't had that issue
<dfarning> good morning neeraj
<dfarning> how are you?
<neeraj> dfarning: good morning..
<neeraj> dfarning: I am fine.. and u?
<dfarning> good thanks
<dfarning> neeraj, what are you plans?
<neeraj> dfarning: At present I am in my college for some work.. I will reach home in 3hr. after that I will test write and record on 0.84,0.86 and 0.88
<neeraj> dfarning: Did ny one from seeta started packaging  core packages
<neeraj> ?
<dfarning> neeraj, great let's wait on the core packages for a week or so.  nothing is pressing.
<neeraj> dfarning: Ok..
<dfarning> neeraj, But we would like you to take a look at some Ubuntu bugs.  They are easy to fix.
<neeraj> dfarning: sure..
<dfarning> neeraj, great thanks
<dfarning> lfaraone will also be a available in 1.5 to 2 hours to help.
<neeraj> dfarning: ok. I will wait for him..
<dfarning> neeraj, here is our discussion about the issue.
<dfarning>  dfarning: maybe it'd be good to have some folks backport https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/601219 by prepairing a debdiff for the earlier ubuntu versions...?
<dfarning>  dfarning: (10.04) as practice.
<dfarning> <dipankar> lfaraone, hi.
<dfarning> <lfaraone> dfarning: very very very straightforward, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/maverick/sugar-flipsticks-activity/maverick/revision/3/debian/install and a changelog entry.
<dfarning> <lfaraone> hey dipankar
<dfarning> <dipankar> lfaraone, the install directory problem?
<dfarning> <lfaraone> dipankar: yep. we just need to tell it to install in a different dir, as demonstrated in the link.
<dfarning>  dipankar: via a debdiff. tutorial: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Recipes/Debdiff
<dfarning>  dipankar: with the distro being "lucid-proposed" and the proceedure for submitting the patch being at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<dfarning> <dipankar> lfaraone, yup. Looks like an easy task. I feel it somewhat similar to git diff & git commit
<dfarning> <lfaraone> dipankar: what it does do is give people *real* Ubuntu packaging practice, and their changes actually get uploaded to the main Ubuntu archive.
<dfarning>  since I can sponsor them.
<dfarning> <dipankar> lfaraone, that would be nice. So who can work on this? Are you referring to new comers?
<dfarning> <dfarning> lfaraone, will you work with neeraj on this when he comes online?
<neeraj> dfarning: unable to open http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/maverick/sugar-flipsticks-activity/maverick/revision/3/debian/install
<neeraj> * will be back within an hour
<dfarning> Ian_Daniher, ping
<lfaraone> morning.
<lfaraone> dfarning: that link works for you, rigt?
<dfarning> lfaraone yes it did.
<dfarning> and good morning
<dfarning> neeraj, lfaraone is available:)
<neeraj> lfaraone: good morning
<lfaraone> morning neeraj.
<neeraj> * reading the links for applying patch.
<lfaraone> neeraj / neeraj_ let me know if you have trobule.
<neeraj_> lfaraone, yes facing trouble while running patch -pl command.. wait a min I am trying once again..
<lfaraone> neeraj_: that's "-p1"
<lfaraone> neeraj_: one, not ell.
<neeraj_> hmm.. I copied the command.. anyway.. trying one more time
<neeraj_> I have renamed the 3_2.diff file to sugar-flipsticks-activity_1-0ubuntu2.diff
<neeraj_> lfaraone, http://paste.ubuntu.com/464039/
<neeraj_> patching method for diff and debdiff is same or different?
<neeraj_> lfaraone, -pnumber.. number should be 1 or something else?
<lfaraone> neeraj_: "patch -p1"
<lfaraone> neeraj_: please read the manual page for patch. it's arguments go as follows: "patch [options] [originalfile [patchfile]]"
<lfaraone> neeraj_: so if you wanted to apply a patch to the present dirctory, you'd do "patch -p1 `pwd` path/to/file.patch"
<neeraj_> lfaraone, ok.. I used patch -p1 and nothing happening.. have u seen the paste link?
<lfaraone> neeraj_: yes.
<neeraj_> ok I was missing '<'
<lfaraone> neeraj_: yes, "patch -p1 < path/to/file.patch" would also work.
<neeraj_> lfaraone, http://paste.ubuntu.com/464053/
<dfarning> neeraj_,  the '<' symbol causes redirection please see http://www.linuxsa.org.au/tips/io-redirection.html
<lfaraone> neeraj_: please paste your patch, the contents of changelog, and the contents of install.
<neeraj_> lfaraone, first tell me do I have to make changes in diff file?
<lfaraone> neeraj_: I am not sure what you mean.
<lfaraone> neeraj_: wait. you're applying the existing diff file? it's already been applied...
<neeraj_> I mean the patch u created.. 3_2.diff file.. Do I need to remove ur name and add mine. I don't think so
<neeraj_> No.. I download it from http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/maverick/sugar-flipsticks-activity/maverick/revision/3/debian/changelog#debian/changelog
<lfaraone> neeraj_: you should make the change to the install file manually, add a new changelog entry (of the version scheme "1-0ubuntu1.UBUNTUVERSION.1", like "1-0ubuntu1.10.04.1"), do a source build of the package, then generate teh debdiff.
<neeraj_> lfaraone, ok.
<lfaraone> neeraj_: you're supposed to create a debdiff, not apply one :X
 * dipankar says Hello :)
<dipankar> dfarning, hi. Thanks for the modifications in the work flow.
<dfarning> dipankar, you are welcome:)  I'll try to add layers in bite sized pieces this time.
<dipankar> dfarning, that will be great.
<neeraj_> lfaraone, done
<lfaraone> neeraj_: cool. can you show me your debdiff?
<kandarpk> dfarning, lfaraone, dipankar, neeraj_ : Hi.
<lfaraone> hi kandarpk .
<dipankar> hey kandarpk , hi :)
<neeraj_> lfaraone, http://paste.ubuntu.com/464064/
<lfaraone> neeraj_: please fix the version number per https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/UpdatePreparation#Update%20the%20packaging
<lfaraone> neeraj_: (there is already a package with that version in Maverick)
<lfaraone> neeraj_: also, you're packaging the fix for Lucid, right? shoudln't the dist be "lucid-proposed" and not "maverick"?
<neeraj_> lfaraone, sorry missed that point which u mentioned earlier in the morning..
<lfaraone> neeraj_: no worries.
<neeraj_> lfaraone, If the lastest version is 1-0ubuntu2 then I should just change it to 1-0ubuntu2.1 ?
<neeraj_> Also as we are packaging for lucid then we need to check for latest version in lucid only or Maverick to(thought I guess latest version gets released for both at same time)
<lfaraone> neeraj_: the latest version in *maverick* is 1-0ubuntu2. The latest version in lucid, karmic, jaunty, intrepid is 1-0ubuntu1.
<lfaraone> neeraj_: the idea is when backporting or SRUing a fix the version number of the backported fix MUST be less than the version in later releases but greater than that of the current release.
<lfaraone> neeraj_: usually a good idea is to take the old version number and add ".UBUNTU_VERSION.1" to it. like 1-0ubuntu1.10.04.1, for example.
<neeraj_> lfaraone, ok. thats why in SRUing and backporting we just keep increasing version by adding .1 and so
<neeraj_> lfaraone, ok So I hope 1-0ubuntu2.10.04.1 will be fine?
<lfaraone> neeraj_: no, since that is GREATER than the version in maverick...
<neeraj_> or we have to update it acco to latest version of package in lucid that is ubuntu1
<lfaraone> neeraj_: so what should the number be?
<neeraj_> 1-0ubuntu1.10.04.1
<lfaraone> neeraj_: right.
<neeraj_> lfaraone, should I update control file acco to Maintainer: Ubuntu Developers <ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com>
<neeraj_> XSBC-Original-Maintainer: Ross Burton <ross@debian.org>
<neeraj_> though lintian didn't pointed out it when I build with out touching the control file
<neeraj_> I mean lintian used to gave a warning when we used to build packages for sugar-team ppa..
<lfaraone> neeraj_: "XSBC-Original-Maintainer: Ross Burton <ross@debian.org>" is just an example.
<neeraj_> I remember when I asked you said that it is not a problem at present but we will have to make changes in it if we want to send it into ubuntu
<kandarpk> lfaraone: how do I remove debian/stamps-configure/ ?
<lfaraone> neeraj_: it should probably be set to "ubuntu-sugarteam@lists.ubuntu.com"
<kandarpk> git rm debian/stamps-configure/ doesn't help
<neeraj_> lfaraone, yes I know.. I will replace it with current maintainer Jani Monoses <jani@ubuntu.com>
<lfaraone> neeraj_: with XMBC being set to Jani.
<lfaraone> kandarpk: what eerror did you get?
<kandarpk> lfaraone: fatal: pathspec 'debian/stamps-configure' did not match any files
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I had removed the folder from debian, but I need to delete it from git as well, right ?
<lfaraone> kandarpk: what does "git status" tell you?
<kandarpk> # On branch master
<kandarpk> # Your branch is ahead of 'origin/master' by 34 commits.
<kandarpk> #
<kandarpk> # Untracked files:
<kandarpk> #   (use "git add <file>..." to include in what will be committed)
<kandarpk> #
<kandarpk> #	.pc/
<kandarpk> nothing added to commit but untracked files present (use "git add" to track)
<lfaraone> kandarpk: okay, you're good then, I guess.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: ok, thanks. correcting the packages again :(
<kandarpk> lfaraone: one more thing,  * Switch to dpkg-source 3.0 (quilt) format was inserted automatically on build
<neeraj_> lfaraone, should I change standard version to latest 3.9.0 ? In maintainer I have added  Ubuntu SugarTeam <ubuntu-sugarteam@lists.ubuntu.com>
<kandarpk> lfaraone: so I thought it was necessary
<lfaraone> neeraj_: no, you don't need to .
<lfaraone> kandarpk: it was inserted automatically when you switched the format.
<lfaraone> kandarpk: it's useful to note if you had previously uploaded the package to Debian and wanted to let people know what chanegd, but we've never done such a thing, so the informatin isn't useful.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: ok, got it
<neeraj_> lfaraone, ok.. Here is the link of lintian output.. If I need to change something then please tell http://paste.ubuntu.com/464080/
<lfaraone> neeraj_: right. since we're SRUing, it's usually good to just make the smallest change possible. none of what you mentioned is really terrible, so it can be ignored for now. if this was a new package or being uploaded to Debian unstable, I'd have you go and fix them.
<neeraj_> lfaraone, debdiff http://paste.ubuntu.com/464081/
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I've pushed connect-activity, will push memorize and poll within an hour
<lfaraone> neeraj_: cool. do that for logviewer, memorize, pollbuilder, if you would, and attach your debdiffs for each of them to the LP bug at https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sugar-0.88/+bug/601219
<lfaraone> neeraj_: and edit the description adding to the top information that meets the criteria at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Procedure
<neeraj_> lfaraone, didn't got ur last point..
<lfaraone> neeraj_: the bug description. in order for a SRU to be approved, the bug description needs to be updated to include the information required per the SRU criteria.l
<neeraj_> lfaraone, ok
<lfaraone> kandarpk: awesome.
<neeraj_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/464094/
<neeraj_> poll builder http://paste.ubuntu.com/464100/ and memorize  http://paste.ubuntu.com/464101/
<neeraj_> * away (dinner)
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I've pushed connect, memorize, poll activities
<kandarpk> lfaraone: please review them when you get time.
<dfarning> lfaraone how is every thing going today?  it looks like good progress
<lfaraone> dfarning: decently.
<lfaraone> sorry, just came back from lunch.
<dfarning> lfaraone is it possiable to push other patches to lucid -proposed so we can start getting rid of the PPA?
<lfaraone> dfarning: very much so. I'd highly recommend it, since it both directly provides value (people using ubuntu sans PPA can work with Sugar) and gains us good experience.
<lfaraone> dfarning: I'm not too familiar with the patches you've had to apply, but open bugs for them , have the developers attach debdiffs or bzr branches, fill out the SRU criteria and subscribe me.
<dfarning> lfaraone  Ok, let's have neeraj work on that over the next couple of days. That way he will gain valuable experience.
<dfarning> lfaraone I'll try to isolate out some of the patches for him to get started.
<dfarning> lfaraone the reason that I orginally went with the PPA was so that we could start working on more recent version of Sugar.
<dfarning> the ppa has .88.1 while universe has .87.2
<dfarning> ankurkhurana__, hello
<ankurkhurana__> hello dfarning
<dfarning> ankurkhurana__, how are you?
<ankurkhurana__> dfarning,  i am good.And good morning :)
<ankurkhurana__>  I was going through the emails and i found that i did some mistakes with ITP
<ankurkhurana__> can i rectify it or do i have to file it again .
<ankurkhurana__> ?
<dfarning> ankurkhurana__, what were the mistakes?
<lfaraone> dfarning: well, for that we can backport, or, if there are no new features, SRU the important bits.
<dfarning> lfaraone the biggest difference I noticed was the different use of cdbs
<lfaraone> dfarning: oh?
<ankurkhurana__> dfarning,  i am in and out , just give i am checking my connection . I will be back
<ankurkhurana__> *ping
 * lfaraone is out.
<dfarning> lfaraone, I had to use a newer versions of cdbs
<kandarpk> dfarning: around ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes
<kandarpk> dfarning: how do I start with core packages ?
<kandarpk> start in the same manner and see if it works ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, pretty much:) they might be a bit more complicated.
<kandarpk> dfarning: in what sense ?
<dfarning> activities usualy have very few dependancies and are all installed in a single dir.
<dfarning> activities, for the most part depend on API, provided by core sugar.
<dfarning> while the core sugar packages need to interact with the os on a system level.
<dfarning> for example pushing the shut down menu must trigger the correct system level call to start the computer shut down process.
<neeraj__> dfarning, how can I un-install a particular activity from sugar?
<neeraj__> sudo apt-get remove is not showing activities..
<dfarning> neeraj__, how was it installed.
<dfarning> neeraj__, if it was install manually you can just delete the activitity bundle in ~/.sugar
<neeraj__> dfarning, flipsticks activity.. Inot manually
<neeraj__> *not
<dfarning> neeraj__, is sugar-activites installed?
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok.
<dfarning> neeraj__, that is a collection of activites that were all installed at once.
<neeraj__> ^^ yes
<dfarning> neeraj__, It is the thing we are trying to get rid of and replace with individually packaged activities.
<kandarpk> neeraj__: does flipsticks work when you run sugar ( is it really installed ) ?
<neeraj__> kandarpk, yes.. its working fine
<kandarpk> try sudo dpkg -r sugar-flipsticks-activity
<neeraj__> dfarning, I am trying to create bug report for SRUing
<kandarpk> neeraj__: you can hit tab to autocomplete package name
<neeraj__> no
<neeraj__> kandarp where can I find activities in ./sugar?
<neeraj__> any idea?
<kandarpk> neeraj: no.
<kandarpk> neeraj: what are you looking for ?
<kandarpk> trying to remove installed activities ?
<neeraj> not all.. but specific activities only..
<neeraj> May be bcz we installed all activities using the activity bundle, I am unable to un-install single activity
<neeraj> how can I un-install all activities?
<kandarpk> neeraj: I use synaptic
<neeraj> kandarpk, sugar tool is installed in ur system?
<kandarpk> neeraj: you mean sugar-emulator ?
<neeraj> kandarpk, please try to install sugar-flipsticks-activity on lucid
<kandarpk> neeraj: working on debian right now
<kandarpk> you can mail me, I'll try in about 30 min
<neeraj> kandarpk, ok.. is flipsticks working properly in debian?
<neeraj> I think it is..
<neeraj> ankur_, around?
<ankur_> neeraj: yes
<kandarpk> neeraj: I don't have its .deb
<neeraj> ankur_, u r on lucid or win?
<ankur_> lucid
<neeraj> ankur, is flipsticks installed in ur system?
<ankur_> kandarpk:  i had a question to ask as well
<ankur_> neeraj not yet as of now .
<ankur> kandarpk,  when i commit a change and push it to git
<kandarpk> ankur: yes ankur_
<neeraj> kandarpk, can u prep a doc for git.. I mean what all we have to do and avoid while pushing
<ankur> can i make another change after that
<neeraj> I guess now you are quite experienced in it :)
<ankur> or do i need to pull cahnges again
<kandarpk> ankur: that is what I do!
<ankur> you pull changes again?
<neeraj> ankur try to run sudo apt-get install sugar-flipsticks-activity
<kandarpk> ankur: you dont need to pull unless the git repo is changed
<ankur> neeraj trying it, but what happened
<ankur> okay
<ankur> but let me post it
<ankur> okay not post
<ankur> but let me first explain
<ankur> i deleted watch file , and now i want to commit that in change.
<ankur> is that not possible or something that git does not allow?
<neeraj> I need to check a bug related to its installation but the problem is that I have already installed it and unable to uninstall it now :|
<ankur> neeraj doing that
<ankur> can you copy me the bug
<kandarpk> ankur: git rm debian/watch
<ankur> kandarpk,  thanks :)
<kandarpk> neeraj: didn't dpkg work ?
<neeraj> kandarpk, no
<ankur> neeraj, installing it
<neeraj> kandarpk, for checking the compability u repeatedly installed all three version of emulator?
<kandarpk> neeraj: they were of 1 MB only :)
<neeraj> or just first checked on one version and then another..?
<neeraj> cool then
<neeraj> also u kept changing and committing on the same git repository which u pushed or copied it somewhere else?
<kandarpk> neeraj: copied means ?
<neeraj> I mean created a spereate git for testing
<neeraj> *separate
<kandarpk> neeraj: yup, copied the package, tested on all three, and made final changes to the original one
<neeraj> kandarpk, ok :)
<ankur> neeraj flipstick install kar liya now what?
<ankur> what is the bug?
<ankur> also
<neeraj> is it working?
<ankur> did you tried sudo apt-get remove sugar-flipsticks-activity ?
<neeraj> ankur, yes
<neeraj> ankur, is it working?
<ankur> one min
<neeraj> ankur, ok
<ankur> well it is not showing in index
<ankur> just a sec
<ankur> let me reinstall
<neeraj> ankur, thats the bug :)
<ankur> neeraj wait , is that activity uploaded to ppa in activity bundle or just otherwise?
<ankur> lemme check
<neeraj> ankur, I don't knw whether its in ppa activity bundle or not
<ankur> it is not in ppa it may be bundled then ;
<ankur> neeraj install log viewer
<ankur> i am too doing it
<ankur> let us see if we can find something there
<neeraj> kandarpk, If you get free time then please make a documentation summarizing all the reviews which lfaraone gave to your packages pushed in git/collab-maint and mentioning the bugs which u faced.
<neeraj> *mention
<ankur> and also the git document
<ankur> -ation
<kandarpk> neeraj, ankur : will try to mail it to you by tomorrow
<kandarpk> 4pm
<neeraj> kandarpk, thank you..please do it only when you have nothing much to do :)
<ankur> neeraj,  installed log?
<kandarpk> neeraj: it will help if you could mail me the steps you took today for Ubuntu packaging
<kandarpk> neeraj: you can leave the commands, that I can search, but just mention the overview, and what the steps were used for
<ankur> neeraj even log is not being shown in UI
<neeraj> kandarpk, ankur  the problem is that these packages get installed in usr/share/activities
<neeraj> ankur, please check usr/share/activities problem.
<ankur> neeraj will do it . Was modifying one package. So will need some time
<neeraj> kandarpk, ankur for fixing this only small change is required.. We have to just change the install directory to usr/share/sugar/activities
<kandarpk> neeraj: ok.
<kandarpk> neeraj: do you have some idea on it ?
<neeraj> kandarpk, for fixing this bug we just need to change the install directory in debian/install
<neeraj> I have done the required changes
<neeraj> Now I need to file a bug report so that I can forward it to ubuntu so that they will include it in Stable Update Release (SUR)
<neeraj> for the bug report I needed to reproduce it.. which I was unable to do as I told you that the flipsticks activity is not getting un-installed
<kandarpk> please mail me the .deb
<kandarpk> I'll try
<kandarpk> neeraj: ^^
<neeraj> kandarpk, ankur uninstall problem got solved :)
<kandarpk> neeraj: howz that ?
<ankur> how ?
<neeraj> I asked on sugar channel, I had to just to go the list view and right click/hover on the activity.. Then the package shows an option of erase :)
<kandarpk> neeraj: ok
<neeraj> kandarpk, ankur also just someone told me that I can go to my home directory/Activities folder and delete that a particular activity :)
<Ian_Daniher> ankur: yt?
<neeraj> Ian_Daniher, ankur will be back after 30 min or so..
<dfarning> ankur how are you?
<manusheel> dfarning: Hi David. Ankur will be back in half an hour.
<dfarning> manusheel, how was your talk?
<manusheel> dfarning: Very well.
<dfarning> manusheel, great what was it about?
<manusheel> dfarning: It was about Collaborative learning through SocialCalc spreadsheet.
<dfarning> manusheel, interesting.
<manusheel> I focused on both the paradigms of networking - mesh and cloud (public and private).
<manusheel> dfarning: I demonstrated the sharing of SocialCalc activity on Sugar using the mesh networking scheme too.
<manusheel> Came along well.
<dfarning> manusheel, very cool
<manusheel> dfarning: Thank you.
<Ian_Daniher> neeraj: thanks.
<Ian_Daniher> ankur: yt?
<ankur> Hello Ian_Daniher
<Ian_Daniher> ankur: Caroline mentioned you were working on ISO customization
<Ian_Daniher> ankur: what's up?
<Ian_Daniher> ankur: what are you trying to accomplish?
<ankur> well Regarding ISO customization ?
<ankur> Ian_Daniher, If you are talking in general , this might be the link that can provide more insight https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuSugarRemix
<ankur> well . to have a complete overview dfarning  and manusheel might be the right person to ask as i am guided by them :)
<ankur> Ian_Daniher, well i think that link might provide an overview but were you trying to point towards something else ?
<satellit__> iso customization works in fedora: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/How_to_create_and_use_a_Live_CD
<satellit__> FYI
 * ankur ankur is going to sleep ,good night 
<ankur> :)
#ubuntu-sugarteam 2010-07-16
 * lfaraone is looking at sugar-poll-activity
<lfaraone> hey dipankar .
<lfaraone> manusheel, kandarpk, are there any good Debian mirrors in India?
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I am using the main download location.
<dfarning> hey lfaraone just got your message.... I took my nephew to a baseball game because of a rain delay today was a double header.
<lfaraone> dfarning: ah, exciting
<lfaraone> dfarning: I replied to Jonas's message on the list about communication.
<dfarning> lfaraone, yes I saw that.  It looked like a fine response.
<lfaraone> dfarning: he felt that he was missing out on part of the conversation because it is all in IRC and very little of it is on-list. I'm not sure what conniving, scheming of plans he's talking aobut that occur in this channel, but if we do any such things in the future, it might be good idea for us to inform our victi-, er, teammates as to our plans.
<dfarning> It is nothing to worry about..... _All_ communication except tasking are happening on a public forum.  If that public forum does not happen to be the forum they prefer it is their problem.
<dfarning> On the other hand I agree all policy should and does happen on the list.
<dfarning> lfaraone, every thing we have done is in attempt to comply with pre existing sugar packaging standards.
<dipankar> hey dfarning, hello
<dfarning> hey dipankar
<dipankar> dfarning, nice day you had! great!
<dfarning> dipankar, yes pretty fun.... but now I need to get to bed 7 hours in the hot sun with a 1st grader is hard work!
<dfarning> good night all
<ankur> kandarpk, around?
<kandarpk> ankur: yes
<ankur> kandarpk,  well i am getting build error due to the addition of debian/source
<ankur> did you faced any kind of Problem like that?
<kandarpk> ankur: can you paste the error on pastebin ?
<ankur> just a second
<kandarpk> ankur: debian/source had the quilt info, right ?
<ankur> yes
<kandarpk> ok, I didn't face any errors in any of the three packages
<kandarpk> ankur: will try to see if the error report helps once you paste it
<ankur_> kandarpk:  i think i was disconnected
<kandarpk> ankur_: yup
<ankur_>  kandarpk,  i solved that problem
<ankur_> one thing more
<ankur_>  what did luke mentioned about in his review for the CDBS variable in debian/rules
<ankur_>  well did it apply to all of our packages or the one taken from tarbaal?
<ankur_> *tarball
<kandarpk> ankur_: that applies for all packages which we packaged using git
<ankur_> okay so in the intial_debianisation we remove the two lines for all of our packages?
<ankur_> kandarpk:  around?
<kandarpk> ankur_, ankur : yes
<ankur> kandarpk,  can you review this copyright file?
<ankur> http://paste.ubuntu.com/464387/
<ankur> i was confused and comma seperated listing of files
<ankur> which luke mentioned .
<kandarpk> ankur, ankur_ : you can also write as http://pastebin.org/398898
<kandarpk> Files:  Area.py, Desenho.py, OficinaActivity.py, fill/Makefile, fill/eggfill.c, fill/eggfill.h, fill/fillmodule.c, toolbox.py
<kandarpk> Copyright:Â©2007, NATE-LSI-EPUSP
<kandarpk> License: GPL
<kandarpk> ankur: I had not put commas here
<ankur> kandarp , saw your file but wasnot clear with oyur abouve statement
<ankur> *above
<ankur> kandarpk,  and we do not provide GPL version here?
<kandarpk> ankur: you need to
<kandarpk> ankur: that you can check in the files listed above
<dfarning> mukul, good morning and welcome to the IRC channel:)
<mukul> dfarning, thank you :)
<mukul> Its evening here though :P
<dfarning> mukul, is dipankar helping you get settled?
<mukul> dfarning, ya he is
<dfarning> good morning ishan
<ishan> dfarning , good morning
<dfarning> yes, we have interested work schedudals in because of the time differences?
<dfarning> mukul, ishan what will you work on today?
<ishan> dfarning, i am currently reading links related to packaging and networking
<mukul> I'm trying to get settled on ubuntu
<mukul> I'm using live usb now
<dfarning> ishan, nice,  mukul it take a little time to get use to:)
<dfarning> ishan, what part of networking/colloboration are you reading about?
<ishan> dfarning, i am going through the links send by manusheel sir on collobration
<dfarning> ishan, The topic is pretty big.  I suggest that you start by making sure that you have a very good understanding of the stuff in the email 'Background on collaboration'
<ishan> dfarning, okay
<dfarning> ishan, everything builds on top of the messaging passing system Dbus.
<ishan> okay
 * ishan is away
<dfarning> good morning neeraj. how are you?
<neeraj> dfarning, good morning,
<neeraj> dfarning, I am fine, thanks for asking
<neeraj> how about you?
<neeraj> dfarning,  I am writing BugReport acco to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Procedure  for bug#601219. You can view it at http://piratepad.net/WtNk4x8z32
<dfarning> neeraj, very tired.... My nephew, who is in 1st grade, is having a hard time understanding why I will be gone for a month...  We went to a baseball game yesterday so we spent many hours relaxing in the sun.  It is hard to get back to work this morning:)
<dfarning> neeraj, yes the bug report looks good.
<neeraj> dfarning, I am yet to finish it. I will ask luke to review it before submitting it on LP
<dfarning> neeraj, how did it go making patches for the installation bugs yesterday?
<neeraj> dfarning, fine.. after understanding the procedure it was only like 15mins task to create patches for other 3-4 activities
<neeraj> But I was facing a problem in reproducing the bug as I was unable to uninstall flipsticks activity.. but later it got solved and I have tested them on my system
<neeraj> dfarning, I will get back to you after finishing this report. It will not take much time :)
<dfarning> neeraj, +1 are working on the first of the bug reports for those packages?
<neeraj> dfarning, ?? If you are asking me that I am writing the report for first package(out of 4/5) then yes. But report for all other will be same except the package name and version..
<dfarning> neeraj, great.
<kandarpk> dfarning: Good morning.
<dfarning> kandarpk, good morning.
<kandarpk> dfarning: finally, Luke gave a thumbs up to poll-activity.
<dfarning> kandarpk, awesome!  There are a lot of details to get correct.
<dfarning> kandarpk, the first one is alway the hardest.
<kandarpk> dfarning: hmmm
<kandarpk> dfarning: I don't think Jonas wanted us to try out core sugar packages
<ankur> hello dfarning
<dfarning> ankur, good morning  -- I was going to say hello, but is looks like you have been using several different systems this evening.  Your log in keeps changing:
<kandarpk> dfarning: ankur isn't there
<ankur> sorry went without notive. Hello dfarning
<ankur> *noticcccccccccccccccce
<ankur> *notice
 * lfaraone waves.
<kandarpk> lfaraone: hi
<kandarpk> lfaraone: thanks for reviewing my packages again and again without losing hope :)
<lfaraone> kandarpk: always a pleasure
<neeraj> lfaraone, hi :)
<lfaraone> neeraj: you did patches for more than just flipsticks, right?
<neeraj> lfaraone, please look at http://piratepad.net/WtNk4x8z32 and tell me the changes I should make in the bug-report
<neeraj> lfaraone, yes..
<neeraj> I am ready with debdiff for all those activities which you told me to do
 * dipankar says hello to all
<dipankar> :)
<dipankar> hi dfarning
<dfarning> dipankar, hello
<dipankar> hey lfaraone :)
<lfaraone> neeraj: okay, then the SRU report should be generalized for "the activities" (plural) so we can handle all of them at the same time.
<lfaraone> neeraj: minus sliderpuzzle and jigsaw, which we're skipping because there are other issues with them.
<neeraj> lfaraone, Ok
<lfaraone> neeraj: for test, you say "Currently, X Y Z happens when you try to start the activity. The activity is located in FOO, which is an incorrect directory. After installing this  update, the activity will be in BAR and will show up in Sugar."
<dipankar> lfaraone, neeraj : Thanks for your help guys. now I am able to download and install packages on Debian :)
<lfaraone> dipankar: oh, glad you got that fixed.
<dipankar> hey mukul. Welcome to IRC. You will like this place for sure :)
 * ankur says hi to all
<kandarpk> mukul: hi
<lfaraone> neeraj: you did logviewer too, right?
<neeraj> yes
<ankur> lfaraone,  why are we skipping sliderpuzzle and jigsaw ? is it an issue from my end?
<lfaraone> ankur: ""We are not fixing the problem at this time in sliderpuzzle and jigsawpuzzle due to other issues preventing them from starting which are pending investigation.
<ankur> lfaraone,  okay
<ankur> well if you are free , i needed help regarding etoys
<lfaraone> ankur: one of them is probably related to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sugar-jigsawpuzzle-activity/+bug/284968
<lfaraone> ankur: okay.
<ankur> well , when i filed the ITP regarding etoys , i assumed that it was made in python and had GPL license , which was wrong on my end.
<ankur> Etoys was built using sh and had MIT license
<ankur> how can i rectify that in ITP ?
<lfaraone> ankur: etoys is written in smalltalk.
<ankur> and the debian folder remains same for the ETOYS pacakge?
<lfaraone> ankur: and it's already packaged separately as http://packages.debian.org/sid/etoys
<ankur> well lfaraone , one is etoys application and other one is activity
<ankur> let me check
<ankur> okay , lfaraone  does that mean we do not have to package it seperately>
<mukul> kandarpk, dipankar :hi
<lfaraone> ankur: well, we should package the activity and have the activity depend on etoys
<ankur> well i did the same
<ankur> i packaged the activity  and added etoys in Depends
<ankur> the package was running fine in my comp.
<ankur> i will post it for review after some changes
<ankur> and should i refile ITP now?
<lfaraone> ankur: you don'
<ankur> well , and any way to rectify it?
<ankur> is that needed?
<lfaraone> ankur: you don't need to refile, just reply to the existing one saying "Sorry, the activity is really SOME_LICENSE and is written in FOO and BAR languages."
<ankur> lfaraone,  okay
<lfaraone> ankur: you know each bug has an email, BUGNUMBER@bugs.debian.org
<lfaraone> ankur: just send a mail to that.
<ankur> One more thing , as we have approached Jonas for the packaging of activity , shall i send a mail on mailing list asking about to package chat activity ?
<ankur> Jonas maintains the rep.
<lfaraone> ankur: I'm not sure what you mean.
<ankur> well , i was supposed to package chat activity .
<ankur> which is already present in collab-maint and  is owned bu Jonas.
<ankur> *by
 * ishan is away
<lfaraone> ankur: give me a sec.
<ankur> and it is up to date as well
<ankur> lfaraone,  sure
<neeraj> lfaraone, where do I have to submit the bug description?  at LP https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sugar-0.88/+bug/601219 ?
<lfaraone> neeraj: you edit it. in LP, next to the words "Bug Description" there should be an edit icon.
<neeraj> Ok.. I should replace it with original ..
<neeraj> I mean replace the original description with this new bug description
<lfaraone> neeraj: no, put it at the top of the existing one.
<lfaraone> neeraj: then upload the patches for each activity as a patch / attachment in LP
<lfaraone> neeraj: there is a link on the bug page "See original description" which is a link :)
<neeraj> :)
<lfaraone> ankur: although it's written in shell, all Sugar activities currently use setup.py etc for installing, so we don't need to change rules.
<lfaraone> ankur: I think you should ask him on list, and give an example of some of the things you'd liek to do. (like updating the activity, for example)
<ankur> lfaraone, seems good :) otherwise i would have to package it again
<ankur> lfaraone,  well in case if it is already up to date ?
<lfaraone> ankur: then you don't have to do anything.
<ankur> lfaraone,  i wil check once again , last time i checked ,version in fructose and rep matched
<lfaraone> neeraj: let me know when you finish fixing the descr and post the patches to LP
<neeraj> lfaraone, ok
<ankur> lfaraone,  in jigsaw it is problem with pyabiword
<lfaraone> ankur: right. if you have an idea how to fix it, patches are more than welcome.
<ankur> can it not be solved after adding python-abiword in Depends
<ankur> lfaraone,  i think i might be able to fix it as when i packaged it , i faced the same problem
<ankur> also i updated the repository in collab maint of slider and jigsaw .
<ankur> i have checked there deb files which seems to be working now
<lfaraone> ankur: great.
<ankur> lfaraone,  neeraj is also working on patching activites in LP i suppose.
<ankur> does this patching work require simmilar procedure ?
<ankur> if yes then , i can ask him and save some of your time
<ankur> :)
<lfaraone> ankur: yeah. basically, file a bug against https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sugar-jigsawpuzzle-activity/+filebug and add sliderpuzzle to it (since it might have the same issue), have neeraj prepare a debdiff including the changes in install and deps, and post it according to the SRU proceedure.
<ankur> lfaraone,  sure , will check it out with neeraj :)
<ankur> lfaraone,  what more activities are in review queue if any?
<kandarpk> lfaraone: how do I package read and pippy ?
<neeraj> ankur, have u tested ur activities in 0.88,0.86,0.84
<ankur> neeraj , not yet
 * ishan is back
<kandarpk> lfaraone: tarball of read isn't available yet, and pippy required external library.
 * ankur i will be back after dinner .
<neeraj> lfaraone, also did you removed r? from comment sections from those activities which have not been tested on 0.88,0.86,0.84
<lfaraone> neeraj: yes.
<lfaraone> kandarpk: then you don't :)
<lfaraone> ankur: you put r? by paint and sliderpuzzle but A) there are no supported versions declared, and B) there is n o git repo linked. '
<lfaraone> ankur: you also put r? by jigsaw but there are no supported versions declared.
<lfaraone> kandarpk: by the way, when you "correct debian/rules", it would be more helpful for me if you'd explain in teh commit message *how* you corrected it. When I look at http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/sugar-connect-activity.git;a=summary , I still have no idea what you actually did without looking at the commtidiff.
<lfaraone> commitdiff
<kandarpk> lfaraone: I did mention in some cases that I removed redundant lines from rules after realising what you are saying
<kandarpk> lfaraone: http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/sugar-poll-activity.git;a=summary
<lfaraone> kandarpk: mk, just reminding you :)
<kandarpk> lfaraone: thanks. I do make some mistakes. :)
<neeraj> lfaraone, I have to attach only debdiff file naa? just confirming
<lfaraone> neeraj: attach a debdiff for each package you are fixing.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I've gone through most of the links you provided regarding collaboration
<kandarpk> dfarning: should I start reading about telepathy in detail now ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, did you understand dbus pretty well it is fundematal?
<neeraj> lfaraone, done.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I understand its working.
<dfarning> kandarpk, then did you get a general overview of telepathy?
<lfaraone> neeraj: cool. currently building/testing flipsticks
<kandarpk> dfarning: do I need to study about D-Bus in detail ?
<neeraj> lfaraone, thanks :)
<kandarpk> dfarning: how it assigns ID's to activities ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, you will need enough of an understanding to debug it:)
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok, I'll first completely understand D-Bus then
<kandarpk> instead of moving to telepathy
<dfarning> kandarpk, I think manu sent some new links introducing telepathy this morning?
<kandarpk> dfarning: yeah, I've basic understanding of telepathy after going through them
<dfarning> kandarpk, then I think the  next part of telepathy will be to understand the two connenction managers 'gabble' and 'salut' well enough to debug them.
<kandarpk> dfarning: you are confusing me.
<kandarpk> dfarning: telepathy or D-Bus, which one should I study in detail first ?
<kandarpk> dfarning: I've got basic understanding of both of them
<dfarning> kandarpk, dbus in detail first....
<kandarpk> dfarning: Ok, once I complete that, I'll ask for help, as always :)
<dfarning> kandarpk, I'll send an email about the connection managers in a few hours.
<kandarpk> dfarning: that will be great.
<dipankar> lfaraone, I am having some difficulties in running the check: here is my debian/rules :http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/sugar-log-activity.git;a=blob;f=debian/rules;h=9f42f9ce4ab5e160d6a3a6b086f9babf65d4cc8f;hb=2510d5a3f57f7262c3ec02516bb0299b5c42db99
<kandarpk> dfarning: I am reading about D-Bus from :
<kandarpk> http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/dbus
<dipankar> lfaraone, ^^ I am not getting all the stanzas that you mentioned to comment out
<dfarning> kandarpk, +1
<lfaraone> dipankar: lines 12 through 20.
<dipankar> lfaraone, ok. :)
<kandarpk> dipankar: you haven't yet placed the code for testing on all the emulators yet ?
<dipankar> kandarpk, nope I am working on it
<dipankar> lfaraone, before changing the debian/rules according to this: http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/debian-olpc-devel/2010-July/002600.html
<dipankar> my packages are building, but they are not working
<dipankar> on sugar
<dipankar> lfaraone, i ran the emulator and the activities are not starting.
<kandarpk> dipankar: ok, was just reminding.
<lfaraone> dipankar: were they starting before?
<lfaraone> dipankar: and which version are you trying?
<dipankar> 0.88
<lfaraone> dipankar: which activity?
<dipankar> sugar-log-activity and sugar-flipsticks-activity
<dipankar> I then installed the packages from ubuntu-main server
<dipankar> then they were running
<neeraj> *away  (dinner)
<dfarning> lfaraone, How are the various packaging tasks coming?
<lfaraone> dfarning: decently, I just sponsored and reviewed neeraj's changes. they're now waiting in the SRU queue.
<dfarning> lfaraone, great  will they get an additional review before being commited?
<dipankar> lfaraone, any clue?
<dipankar> ^^ about the problem?
<kandarpk> dfarning: I had some confusion understanding the jabber server
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes?
<kandarpk> dfarning: how is it different from usual servers ? how does it enable/help in networking ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, a jabber server is a particular type of network message passing server
<dfarning> kandarpk, jabber is more commonly called XMPP  see.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extensible_Messaging_and_Presence_Protocol
<kandarpk> dfarning: I did go through that
<kandarpk> but there isn't much documentation here on how it manages to pass messages
<lfaraone> dfarning: well, a member of ubuntu-sru sanity-checks them and then approves them.
<lfaraone> dfarning: mostly to make sure we followed proceedure etc.
<dfarning> kandarpk, the 'connection manager' gabble from telepathy uses the jabber server.
<lfaraone> dipankar: so in your Debian system you installed sugar-emulator-0.88 and your version of sugar-log-activity?
<dipankar> lfaraone, I was about to install sugar on debian, but a power cut took place. I am on Laptop battery right now
<lfaraone> dipankar: okay, we're testing the activities in Debian for this check.
<dipankar> lfaraone, I have sent the package to kandarpk for testing it.
<kandarpk> dipankar: log-activity installed and worked correctly :)
<kandarpk> I was able to see various log files
<dipankar> kandarpk, you mean its starting up on Debain!
<kandarpk> yes
<dipankar> thats great.
<kandarpk> :)
<dipankar> how come it is not working on Ubuntu :(
<dipankar> Thanks kandarpk. Thanks a lot
<lfaraone> dipankar: that's an interesting question, but not one we're trying to solve right now :)
<lfaraone> kandarpk: can you test log on the older versions of sugar as well?
<dfarning> lfaraone, how are the activites for debain coming? looks like good progress.
<dipankar> lfaraone, I am confused. We are not to test packages on Ubuntu right now?
<kandarpk> lfaraone: dipankar sent me the .deb
<kandarpk> lfaraone: will installing it on older version test it correctly ?
<dipankar> lfaraone, I will send him the .deb of all required version in about 15 minutes.
<dipankar> *him -> Kandarp
<kandarpk> dipankar: we have only 1 deb I think
<lfaraone> dipankar: well, for this test we're trying to see "does s-FOO-a work on sugar-0.88 on Debian? sugar-0.86? sugar-0.84?"
<kandarpk> dipankar: modify rules according to the steps mentioned by lfaraone and then build the package
<lfaraone> dipankar: you only build the package once for alll versions, then we determine which versions (if any) the activity does not work with.
<lfaraone> dipankar: if the activity doens't work in Ubuntu, that's interesting, but a separate issue :)
<dipankar> ohk. got it ^^
<lfaraone> dfarning: good. I think Jonas will have more time to review after his theatrical production gets out this Sunday.
<dipankar> lfaraone, phew, I thought I missed the debugging activity
<lfaraone> dfarning: most of my day today I've spent helping neeraj with preparing his first SRU.
<dfarning> lfaraone, yes.... very important step.
<dfarning> lfaraone, +1 since you are going to debconf if would be great if you had a nice queue of activites reviewed which you and jonas can go over together.
<lfaraone> dfarning: yep. hopefully I'll be able to get some time where we can review them f2f.
<dipankar> kandarpk, i have sent you the 0.86 and 0.84 versions of packages (.deb). Please try them out too. Thanks for helping me out
<lfaraone> dipankar: you only have to build the package once, by the way.
<lfaraone> dipankar: it's then installed and *tested* under different versions.
<dipankar> lfaraone, didn't get you.
<dfarning> lfaraone, and one more request:) Can you send a post to deb-olpc explaining the idea of you teaching and review first and then passing on to jonas until he feel comfortable with you doing super reviews with dipankar doing initial reviews.
<lfaraone> dipankar: you said "sent you the 0.86 and 0.84 versions of packages". We're only building "one version" of the package tha allows it to be installed under all Sugar versions.
<kandarpk> dipankar: only 1 .deb is to be tested on all versions
<lfaraone> dfarning: sure. by the way, I'm driving up to Rhode Island today so I'm not sure if I'll be here in the evening.
<dipankar> oh no !! What have I done!!
<lfaraone> dipankar: ?
 * dipankar needs a rest to set his mind back to work!
<dipankar> lfaraone, I didn't go through the instructions properly. Now I get it. The same package will be tested on different emulators
<neeraj> *back
<lfaraone> dipankar: right.
<dipankar> guys, i guess I have to shut down my laptop too. This power cut is a long one.
 * dipankar says bye to all and good night :)
<dfarning> lfaraone, I was going to suggest that we all take a break from hacking and read and talk about http://producingoss.com/ and how the situations are similar and diffent than the ones we are facing:)
<kandarpk> dipankar: good night
<lfaraone> dfarning: fair enough, I should reread it anwyay :)
 * ankur is back
<ankur> lfaraone,  i forgot to put the repo address there.Will do it just now.
<ankur> and i have not checked for the versions yet.
<ankur> i did not know that i have to post versions before posting for review
<ankur> will do it
<ankur> .
#ubuntu-sugarteam 2010-07-17
<dipankar> hi lfaraone, dfarning,
<dfarning> dipankar, hello
<dipankar> dfarning, how was your day?
<dfarning> It was good getting ready for my trip. how was yours?
<dipankar> mine was good too. except for the erratic power cuts. :(
<dipankar> you are going on a trip
<dipankar> ?
<dfarning> dipankar, I am leaving to spend a month in Paraguay on Monday.
<dipankar> dfarning, for some work?
<dfarning> dipankar, yes Actiivty Central also has several developers providing service and support for the OLPC deploment in Paraguay we are going to try to expand into Uruguay.
<dfarning> dipankar, did you get a chance to talk to kandarp about reading http://producingoss.com/ ?
<dipankar> dfarning, no. :( Last night there was a power cut. I was online on IRC till my laptop battery supported.
<dipankar> dfarning, it looks like one of those books on "ethics".
<dfarning> dipankar, You guys have been working hard hacking and reading dense technical material.  It is time to do something a little lighter:)
<dfarning> dipankar, it is less about ethics than open source culture and how to effectly work with open source projects.
<dipankar> dfarning, ok. I guess I again judged a book by it's title and Cover.
<dfarning> dipankar, I was suggesting now that you are working directly with opensource projects you should take the weekend and read the book.
<dipankar> dfarning, that very nice of you. I will definitely go through the book.
<dfarning> dipankar, there are some talks by the authors at http://producingoss.com/#presentations .  I you are not in the mood for reading:)  I suggest start with the videos they are pretty funny.
<kandarpk> dfarning: hi
<dfarning> kandarpk,
<kandarpk> dfarning: do you have an idea when will Luke be around ?
<kandarpk> Manu sir would like us to work on core packages now
<kandarpk> so, needed help on how to proceed
<dfarning> kandarpk, luke will be gone tonight traveling.... That is why I suggested that you read producing oss today.
<kandarpk> dfarning: that means he'll be there next morning your time ?
<dfarning> kandarpk,  Luke does not have scheduled hours on the weekend.  but if he around, he will help.
<kandarpk> dfarning: Ok.
<dfarning> kandarpk, ping
<kandarpk> dfarning: hi
<dfarning> I have most of the documentation buildsystem set up.
<kandarpk> dfarning: Ok, mail it to me.
<dfarning> kandarpk,   it is on sunjammer  in srv/www-sugar/apimaster  all I have left is setting up the permissions.
<dfarning> kandarpk, ok
<kandarpk> dfarning: I've some idea of packaging core activities.
<kandarpk> trying to see if that works.
<kandarpk> for sugar-0.89
<dfarning> kandarpk, very cool.  Hacking _is_ the best way to learn:)
<kandarpk> dfarning: the rules file maintained by Jonas for sugar has more than just sugar listed in it
<dfarning> kandarpk, can you point me to the git repo of jonas' package?
<kandarpk> http://paste.ubuntu.com/464813/
<kandarpk> dfarning: ^^ rules file
<kandarpk> dfarning: oops, not rules, it was control.in
<kandarpk> dfarning: git repo : http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/sugar.git;a=summary
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes this is a common situation.  this source package make several different binary packages.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I understand that slightly
<kandarpk> dfarning: but when I package, will I too need to make all the packages ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes when you run the build scripts it will make all to the binary packages for you.
<kandarpk> dfarning: Ok, it seems complicated ( as you said )
<dfarning> kandarpk, in this case, you would be updating the .88 package to .89 so 99% of the packaging would be the same.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I'll try hit and trial.
<dfarning> kandarpk, so it is mostly a case of pointing at the new upstream tar ball, changing version numbers,  modifing the patch series as necssart and testing.
<kandarpk> dfarning: +1
<kandarpk> dfarning: was just thinking of doing the same.
<dfarning> kandarpk, now that you know the fundemantals of packaging you should be able to figure out (or google for) any errors you get.  Hacking probobly the best approach to developering skill and proeciency.
<kandarpk> dfarning: with Luke not being around, I've enough time to hack and try make it work :)
<kandarpk> *I'll be back in 10min
<kandarpk> dfarning: around ?
<neeraj> lfaraone: ping
<neeraj> dfarning: Good Morning :)
<dfarning> neeraj, good morning how are you?
<neeraj> I have tested write and record on various version of sugar-emulator
<neeraj> dfarning: Good..
<dfarning> neeraj, what did you learn?
<neeraj> dfarning: how are you feeling this morning?
<neeraj> dfarning: I have not stated anything new.. I mean I have tested those packages.. write was not working on sugar-emulator-0.84
<neeraj> I have updated it on wiki and waiting for lfaraone to review it..
<dfarning> neeraj, I feel ready to work:)
<dfarning> neeraj, great
<neeraj> Also I went through the logs between 10-17 and I tried to note down all points related to packaging
<neeraj> I will share it will all members and ask them to add those points which I have forgotten and the problems which they faced while building packages using GIT
<dfarning> wow!
<neeraj> dfarning: I am not yet finished with it.. I will add points from lfaraone reviews to packages which he posted on olpc-list. I hope that will help new members :)
<dfarning> neeraj, I'm sure it will.
<dfarning> neeraj, it sounds like you have enough work to keep you busy for a while.
<neeraj> dfarning: actually i got a little bored with docu.. If you have some thing on which I can work or learn something then I am up for otherwise I will continue documentation task after half and hr :)
<neeraj> s/up for/up for it
<dfarning> I would suggest that you read http://producingoss.com/ . It is an interesting book about how to work effectivily with open source projects.
<neeraj> dfarning: ok..
<kandarpk> dfarning: good morning :)
<dfarning> good morning, how are you?
<kandarpk> dfarning: I am doing good
<dfarning> kandarpk,  I am finishing up the documentation build system.
<kandarpk> dfarning: Ok.
<dfarning> kandarpk, need to transfer conf.py and *.rst as part of the script.
<kandarpk> dfarning: hmmm.
<dfarning> kandarpk, did you modify anything on apimaster?  It worked for me last night, but not this morning:(
<kandarpk> dfarning: nope, I didn't even log in
<dfarning> kandarpk, ok, Bernie was working on some build machines....
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok.
<kandarpk> dfarning: the script is to automate the HTML generation ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes, it, runs sugar-jhbuild to update to the latest code, runs epydoc, and runs spyinx-build.
<kandarpk> dfarning: is it possible that new files get added to sugar ?
<kandarpk> dfarning: because their HTML wont get generated if they are not mentioned in .rst files
<dfarning> kandarpk,  yes, that is the part I am working on now. there is a dir in apimaster called sphinxstub where you can modify the .rst files.
<kandarpk> dfarning: modify manually ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok
<neeraj> kandarpk: around?
<kandarpk> op_amp, hi
<op_amp> kandarpk: hi are you doing anything related to packaging>
<kandarpk> op_amp: no, why ?
<op_amp> kandarpk: just asking if there is something on which I can work now..
<kandarpk> op_amp: what have you been involved in recently ?
<op_amp> kandarpk: as u knw last night I was finishing renaming task for ubuntu-bugs
<op_amp> today I just finished testing of write and record activity and prepared the git document which i shared with u.
<kandarpk> op_amp: involved in studying networking ?
<op_amp> kandarpk: ohh.. yeah manu sir did send us the link for studying that part..
<op_amp> kandarpk: are you also studying networking?
<kandarpk> op_amp: yeah.
<kandarpk> op_amp: actually I find it one of the most innovative parts of Sugar
<kandarpk> op_amp: but a bit tough to cover.
<kandarpk> op_amp: anyway, you can read about open source development at :
<kandarpk> http://producingoss.com/
<op_amp> kandarpk: i was reading it..
<kandarpk> op_amp: thats good to know :)
<op_amp> kandarpk: but didn't felt like reading full book. I will keep reading it in my free time.
<kandarpk> op_amp: same here
<op_amp> kandarpk: ok i will also start networking then..Can you give a tutorial for level 0 person in networking knowledge?
<kandarpk> op_amp: the links provided by Manu sir yesterday and a day before are quite good
<kandarpk> op_amp: very basic and covers quite a lot
<op_amp> kandarpk: ok then I will start from there :)
<kandarpk> op_amp: good night.
<op_amp> kandarpk: good night
#ubuntu-sugarteam 2010-07-18
<kandarpk> lfaraone: around ?
<dfarning> neeraj, good morning
<neeraj> dfarning: good morning :)\
<neeraj> dfarning: how are u ?
<dfarning> neeraj, nice job getting the SRU accepted
<neeraj> dfarning: all credit goes to lfaraone for being patient and explaining the things to me :)
<dfarning> neeraj,  I am good, needed to take a break last night.... I need to find a pace I can sustain for the next couple of years without burning out:)
<dfarning> neeraj, what is you plan for today?
<neeraj> dfarning: I was planning to start reading about reading about networking(Background On Collaboration)..
<dfarning> +1.
<neeraj> dfarning: also I was waiting for lfaraone so that we can finish SRU task. (I am not sure whether I need do anything after uploading the patches on LP)
<dfarning> neeraj, I am not sure either.
<kandarpk> dfarning: Good Morning :)
<dfarning> kandarpk, good morning, I was just emailing you:)
<dfarning> I finally got the documentation build script to work correctly.
<dfarning> kandarpk, how did you hacking go yesterday?
<kandarpk> dfarning: didn't succeed but learnt more than I did on following the steps Luke provided
<kandarpk> for packaging other activities
<dfarning> kandarpk, +1
<kandarpk> dfarning: I'll mail you, Manu sir the error reports and steps followed
<dfarning> great,
<dfarning> kandarpk, what do you have planned for today?
<kandarpk> dfarning: will try to work on sunjammer
<kandarpk> dfarning: is everything set up ?
<kandarpk> dfarning: and D-Bus
<dfarning> kandarpk,  I think so.
<kandarpk> dfarning: what do I need to do ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, It is now in production at /srv/www-sugarlabs/apimaster please delete the stuff in your home dir on Sunjammer.
<dfarning> kandarpk, build-docs.sh is the build script that you need to run to rebuild the documentation -- it take about 20 minutes.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I'll delete that.
<kandarpk> dfarning: can we see the result online ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, sphinxconf/ contains all of the .rst files and conf.py that you set up by hand.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok.
<dfarning> kandarpk, results are at http://api.sugarlabs.org/
<dfarning> kandarpk,  we need to ceate a nice index.html for that page.
<dfarning> kandarpk, I fix the README file to reflect that changes.
<kandarpk> dfarning: the sphinx documentation isn't there, its the epidocs one right now
<dfarning> kandarpk, hmmm I modified so you can chose either type of documentaion from there.
<kandarpk> dfarning: how can we do that ?
<kandarpk> dfarning: to see HTML  pages generated by sphinx
<dfarning> kandarpk, can you just click on the sphinx link?
<dfarning> it will take you to
<dfarning> http://api.sugarlabs.org/sphinx/
<kandarpk> dfarning: I could not find the link
<kandarpk> dfarning: anyways, what changes are required in index.html ?
<kandarpk> dfarning: how should it look like ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, I have not figure that out yet.... just a page to introduce and link to the two types of document.  The we can use the build script to put in in the correct place.
<kandarpk> dfarning: Ok.
<dfarning> kandarpk, are there things you want me to prepare or task to set up for the team?   I was going to create the next two colloboration lessons.... anything else right now?  I will probobly fall a 1.5 days behind while traveling so I need to get a bit ahead:)
<kandarpk> dfarning: please mail me the steps I'll need to follow to modify the documentation as well
<kandarpk> dfarning: I'll try to make some changes
<dfarning> kandarpk, changes to the docstrings will require modifying the code, submitting a patch to sugar-devel, and rebuilding the documentation after the code has been committed.
<dfarning> kandarpk, changes to the .rst stubs you make can be done directly in sphinxconf/
<kandarpk> dfarning: Ok, thats nice.
<kandarpk> dfarning: and where is the script that runs to build the pages ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, It is now in production at /srv/www-sugarlabs/apimaster/build-docs.sh
<kandarpk> dfarning: do I have the access to it ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, I think so.  Just log into sunjammer and cd to that dir.... you are a member of the group apimaster.  I something does not work please let me know so I can fix the permissions.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I am working on Debian right now.
<kandarpk> dfarning: shall I let you know after sometime, if you'll be around ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, ok, I'll try to be here for the next 5 hours.
<kandarpk> dfarning: Ok, thats great :)
<kandarpk> dfarning: I am following the steps to package sugar.
<kandarpk> dfarning: will mail you the error reports soon.
<dfarning> kandarpk, great. Do you use gmail?  I found it very handy when I started to switch between several OSs and computers!
<kandarpk> dfarning: I have a gmail account gmail ( kandarp89 )
<kandarpk> dfarning: how does it help in using different OSs ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, As long as a browser work in the OS, gmail will work.  Often if I do something in one version of Ubuntu and need the result in another version, I just email it to myself as a file attachement.
<kandarpk> dfarning: nice, that is what I do if I find some interesting links when working from some other machine.
<kandarpk> dfarning: http://paste.ubuntu.com/465448/
<kandarpk> dfarning: it has some steps I followed to package sugar
<kandarpk> *initial steps
<kandarpk> dfarning: now, running $ git merge upstream-release-tag gives:
<kandarpk> fatal: 'upstream-release-tag' does not point to a commit
<dfarning> kandarpk, I don't know... will have to ask luke or jonas
<kandarpk> dfarning: Ok.
<kandarpk> dfarning: why do we use -u here :
<kandarpk> git-import-orig --pristine-tar --keyid=4AE3FF0B -u ''0.89'' ../sugar_0.89.1.orig.tar.bz2
<kandarpk> upstream version ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, I don't know:(
<kandarpk> dfarning: np :)
<dfarning> kandarpk, do you have tasks for everyone to work on?
<kandarpk> dfarning: Manu sir is back, so we'll have no problems
<dfarning> kandarpk, ok
<kandarpk> *will be back after logging into USR.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I need to remove all folders from my home dir. at sunjammer ?
<dfarning> kandarpk,  I like to remove unused copies of stuff so I don't get confused.
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok, everything except public_html
<dfarning> kandarpk, +1
<kandarpk> dfarning: by the way, the public_html still cant be accessed online
<dfarning> kandarpk, bernie will be coming back from vacation today.... I'll ask him soon about that.
<kandarpk> dfarning: thanks
<kandarpk> rm: remove write-protected regular file `sphinx/sugar-jhbuild/.git/objects/pack/pack-34eb4c1e09a6167a3c8fbbf62264b7998494d0f0.pack'?
<kandarpk> dfarning: maybe you ran sphinx ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes, I ran jhbuild in your dir so you would not have to worrry about setting it up..... that is when I noticed that we would have to run in on a build machine.
<dfarning> kandarpk, one moment I'll fix it.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I'll delete it, just wanted to confirm
<dfarning> kandarpk, all the permission should be fine.
<kandarpk> dfarning: at what time will the automatic documentation generating script run ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, I have not set up the cron job yet.... I would like to run it manually the first couple of times to make sure it works as expected.  When you are satisified that it workes, we can create a cron job to run once a day.
<kandarpk> dfarning: running manually should be OK for now, as we haven't made the rst files yet
<kandarpk> *I'll be back in 20 min
<kandarpk> dfarning: may I run the script to see how it works ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, sure.  It will just look like it is sitting there for between 10 and 30 minutes.  Then the command prompt will return.
<kandarpk> dfarning: does it generates epydocs documentation too on changing .rst files ?
<dfarning> kandarpk,  I am not sure what you mean by .rst files.  As I understand it the .rst stubs point to modules in the .py code.  and the changes to the docstrings will happen in the .py files.
<kandarpk> dfarning: the format of .rst files/stubs present in sphinxconf directory decide the appearance/listing of various modules in the HTML pages
<kandarpk> dfarning: for eg if we want to change the heading on http://api.sugarlabs.org/sphinx/
<kandarpk> from sugar-activity to foo, we only need to change the index.rst
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes every time the script is run it will copy the contents of sphinxconf/ to the buildmachine and merge them into the source tree.
<kandarpk> dfarning: we can avoid generating epydoc documentation if only rst files are changed
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes, go into the file api-remote.sh and put a comment # infront of the epydoc stuff at line 27 to 41
<kandarpk> dfarning: Ok.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I do not have write permissions
<dfarning> kandarpk, :) one moment
<dfarning> kandarpk, I added you.... I think.  Can you test.
<kandarpk> dfarning: sure
<kandarpk> dfarning: Found a swap file by the name ".api-remote.sh.swp"
<dfarning> kandarpk, chose the option to delete it.
<kandarpk> ok
<kandarpk> dfarning: done
<dfarning> kandarpk, and another userful thing is to comment out the two jhbuild lines if you are just testing formating stuff.
<kandarpk> dfarning: hmmm, that is required to update the source
<kandarpk> dfarning: wont be needed here
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes that update the source but the .rst files are copied and merged in  a seperate step.
<kandarpk> dfarning: hmmm
<kandarpk> dfarning: you've already commented them ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, I must have done that while testing:)
<kandarpk> dfarning: permission denied due to rsync
<kandarpk> dfarning: http://paste.ubuntu.com/465500/
<dfarning> kandarpk, Ok I screwed something up.
<kandarpk> dfarning: wait
<kandarpk> dfarning: I have stopped jobs, what does that mean ?
<kandarpk> I had used Ctrl-Z to stop ./build-docs.sh
<kandarpk> dfarning: I can't logout now :(
<dfarning> kandarpk, you will need to type exit twice.
<dfarning> kandarpk, please see http://www.unixguide.net/linux/linuxshortcuts.shtml under process control
<dfarning> Ctrl-Z puts a job in the background and Ctrl-C stops it.  (usually)
<kandarpk> dfarning: ok, one of my friends didn't had this knowledge.
<kandarpk> dfarning: now I am sure I do not have the permissions
<dfarning> kandarpk, does ctrl-Z stop jobs in windows? I hit it instead of ctrl-C by mistake.
<kandarpk> dfarning: not sure.
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes, I have to figure out how to give you authorization to switch users to apimaster to run the script.  It depends on using apimasters ssh key to establish the connection to the remote build machine.
<kandarpk> dfarning: Ok.
<kandarpk> dfarning: by the way, Ctrl-Z on windows is EOF.
<kandarpk> dfarning: does that mean that only few users can execute the script ?
<kandarpk> dfarning: right now, it must be only you ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, yes, I had though that anyone in the apimaster group could execute the script... I made it group executable.... but I forgot about the ssh connection.
<dfarning> kandarpk, because it uses, ssh only the user 'apimaster' can run the script.  I need to figure that out.
<kandarpk> dfarning: why do we need a remote authentication using ssh ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, because the build process is complicated, CPU intensive, and error prone we don't want to run it on sunjammer the primary server.  Instead we pass the job a remote build machine.
<kandarpk> dfarning: and pass the identity of the primary server along ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, we pass the identity of the apimaster user because there is no way to machines in the Sugar Labs without ssh.  It is a system wide security measure.
<dfarning> ^^no way to log into machines
<kandarpk> dfarning: got it
<dfarning> kandarpk, I need to ask bernie how to set this up so that the documentation team can switch users to apimaster.
<kandarpk> dfarning: np
<dfarning> kandarpk, he is in the air so I won't be able to fix it for a couple of hours.  Usually, I just try things and see if they work, but when it come to security I try to ask an expert before I start changing random stuff:)
<kandarpk> dfarning: please let me know when I can start working on it.
<kandarpk> dfarning: I should be here for next 3 hrs.
<dfarning> kandarpk, ok.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: around ?
<kandarpk> dfarning: why do connection names in D-Bus and telepathy represent a path like /org/freedesktop/Telepathy/Connection/cm/proto/account
<bernie> dfarning: I'm around. what do you need?
<kandarpk> bernie: hi
<bernie> dfarning: (boarding on a plane to sao paolo soonish)
<bernie> in 1h
<bernie> kandarpk: oi!
<bernie> kandarpk: regarding your question... it's an odd naming convention established by the original dbus designers. quite ugly if you ask me.
<kandarpk> bernie: I thought it was something regarding file locations as we cannot pass pointers.
<kandarpk> my assumptions will ruin me!
<bernie> kandarpk: pointers as in C pointers to memory locations?
<bernie> kandarpk: it's generally not possible with any IPC mechanism
<bernie> kandarpk: because the virtual address space of one process is totally disjoint from those of other processes
<kandarpk> bernie: yes, I understand that pointers are not an option
<bernie> kandarpk: what do you need to pass? and for what purpose?
<kandarpk> bernie: how does this location-like connection name help in identifying the object ?
<kandarpk> bernie: I have the understanding that we pass these names along with the messages
<kandarpk> correct me if I am wrong
<bernie> kandarpk: it's a unique name.   it's usually a reverse internet domain name of whover designed the dbus client, followed by the name and other internal stuff
<bernie> kandarpk: dbus clients usually provide documentation about their internal structure: objects, methods, parameters, etc.
<bernie> kandarpk: yes, you use the dbus paths along with parameters. it looks like some kind of Remote Procedure Calll mechanism
<bernie> kandarpk: to experiment quickly, there's a dbus-send command line tool
<bernie> kandarpk: anything you could do from python, you can also do from the command line, faster.
<kandarpk> bernie: great.
<kandarpk> bernie: can you please provide links to some tutorials where D-Bus codes are used for explanation instead of theory about its working
<bernie> kandarpk: full documentation of dbus is here: http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/dbus
<bernie> kandarpk: I suggest skimming through the docs and then looking for the specific docs of the client you want to talk with
<bernie> kandarpk: whic is...?
<kandarpk> bernie: actually I've just started to study about D-Bus right now
<kandarpk> nothing specific
<kandarpk> bernie: and about the problem dfarning and I were having in running the script build-docs.sh at /srv/www-sugarlabs/apimaster on sunjammer
<kandarpk> bernie: ssh verification is done to run the script on a remote machine
<kandarpk> bernie: dfarning has made the script group executable but I still do not have permission to run it due to rsync
<dfarning> bernie, how do I set up sudoers so kandarpk can run a script as the user apimaster?
<dfarning> kandarpk,  I need to get lunch. will be back soon.
<kandarpk> dfarning: sure :)
<manusheel> kandarpk: Yes, I am around.
<bernie> dfarning: where's the script?
<bernie> dfarning: is kandarpk in group apimaster?
<bernie> dfarning: yes he is
<bernie> dfarning: I did not change anything, it works already: if I become kandarpk and type: "sudo -u apimaster ls" , the command gets executed as user apimaster
<bernie> dfarning: note: you can't use sudo over a non-interactive ssh session
<bernie> kandarpk: ^
<kandarpk> bernie: I do not have root privilages
<kandarpk> bernie: I think that is why I am not able to run the script
<kandarpk> bernie: the errors I am getting on running the script: http://paste.ubuntu.com/465500/
<bernie> kandarpk: you don't need root privileges for "suso -u apimaster" from your user
<kandarpk> bernie: sorry, my fault, read suso as sudo :(
<kandarpk> bernie: what command do I need to use to run /srv/www-sugarlabs/apimaster/build-docs.sh ?
<kandarpk> running suso -u apimaster gives
<kandarpk> -bash: suso: command not found
<bernie> kandarpk: sorry, my typo. it's "sudo", but you don't need to be root because there's a line in /etc/sudoers allowing members of group apimaster to become user apimaster
<bernie> kandarpk: try this: sudo -u apimaster /srv/www-sugarlabs/apimaster/build-docs.sh
<kandarpk> bernie: perfect :)
<kandarpk> bernie: thanks.
<kandarpk> dfarning: Do we know the relative location of python source files ( under sugar-jhbuild ) ?
<kandarpk> dfarning: *relative to index.rst
<kandarpk> it is required to show the source codes.
<kandarpk> dfarning: in case I am not online, path used in activity_src.rst.
<kandarpk> bernie: around ?
<dfarning> bernie, thanks
<dfarning> bernie, I arrive  tuesday afternoon.  I will send my itinerary to you and rgs_ tomorrow morning.  I bought the ticket through orbitz (my first time) and they have change the intinary twice:)
<dfarning> kandarpk, did the script work correctly?
<kandarpk> dfarning: yes
<kandarpk> :)
<kandarpk> dfarning: by the way, most part of the script is commented out right now
<dfarning> kandarpk, great now we need to figure out the relative paths.  do you have sugar-jhbuild installed on a local machine?
<dfarning> kandarpk, :) it must run pretty fast.
<kandarpk> dfarning: took like 2 min.
<kandarpk> dfarning: yes, I have jhbuild installed
<dfarning> kandarpk, I set it up so the .rst files are in sugar-jhbuild/install/lib/python2.6/site-packages/sugar
<kandarpk> dfarning: didn't get that
<kandarpk> dfarning: you have changed the location in activity_src.rst ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, see http://pastebin.org/402871
<dfarning> the contents of sphinxconf/ are copied to  sugar-jhbuild/install/lib/python2.6/site-packages/sugar
<kandarpk> dfarning: we don't need to do that
<dfarning> kandarpk, where do you want them?
<kandarpk> dfarning: open activity_src.rst
<kandarpk> dfarning: to show the source code in HTML pages, the path mentioned in it is to be changed
<dfarning> kandarpk, the way you had it set up we had to manually copy the modules each time we updated from git.
<kandarpk> dfarning: aren't the codes stored on the same machine ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, if you want you can move them? or else just remove the '../src' from the begining of each path.
<dfarning> kandarpk, line 25 of api-remote.sh copies the contents of the sphinxconf/ dir.
<dfarning> neeraj, how are you coming?
<neeraj> dfarning: I did went through the links
<neeraj> dfarning: But i will take some time in completely understanding all things
<kandarpk> dfarning: I am not sure how much I understood that
<dfarning> neeraj, for colloboration?
<neeraj> dfarning: I was reading about details of D-BUS
<dfarning> neeraj, we will start looking at code examples soon so it will make more sense.
<neeraj> I read the floss-manual which just give a overview of it.
<neeraj> dfarning: brb,, helping ankur with deb file testing on debian
<dfarning> kandarpk, activity_src.rst  it looks in the dir '../src/activity/activity.py' by copying the .rst files to the sugar/ dir all you need is 'activity/activity.py' in the path
<kandarpk> dfarning: will the script still work ?
<dfarning> kandarpk,  it should. As long as the the path in the .rst file points to the correct .py file it will work.
<kandarpk> wont it read rst files from sphinxconf ?
<dfarning> kandarpk, see line 44 of api-remote.  It is running sphinx directly from sugar-jhbuild/install/lib/python2.6/site-packages/sugar
<kandarpk> dfarning: have you changed the script or it was same before as well /
<kandarpk> ?
<dfarning> There was not a script before.... I based it on the instructions you sent.  I don't remember where the code was relative to the .rst files in you instructions.
<kandarpk> dfarning: let me check if it works
<kandarpk> dfarning: it works :)
<kandarpk> dfarning: good night
<manusheel> dfarning, kandarpk: Great.
<manusheel> Glad to hear.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: hi
<kandarpk> I was about to leave.
<manusheel> kandarpk: So, we are all set with the system, right?
<manusheel> <manusheel> kandarpk: So, we are all set with the system, right?
<manusheel> kandarpk: I wrote this at the same time when you left.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: yes sir
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: running the script does generate the desired output :)
<manusheel> kandarpk: That is simply wonderful. So, now our focus will be on doc strings, right? Will you like to try inserting a test doc string, and see if we get the output in the desired format.
<manusheel> ?*
<manusheel> kandarpk: Very neat.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: let me check if I can find where the source code is placed
<manusheel> kandarpk: So, now we can focus on core modules, sub-modules, their classes, variables, etc.
<manusheel> kandarpk: sure.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: Sir, I think the source is placed on some remote machine
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: but changing the rst files do changes the output HTML pages
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: dfarning should know more about it.
<manusheel> kandarpk: That is unfortunate.
<manusheel> So, changing the rst files is not changing the output of HTML pages?
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: it is changing the HTML
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: but I have access to rst files only, so cant change the docstrings
<manusheel> kandarpk: Ok, that means you cannot insert docstrings?
<manusheel> kandarpk: This access is important to us.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Without this, we'll not be able to add explanation for classes, variables and methods.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: hmmm.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Did you try inserting the test doc string, and it said permission denied?
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: sir, the script made by dfarning runs on a remote machine
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: and it seems the source is present on that system
<kandarpk> REMOTESRV="140.186.70.115"
<kandarpk> REMOTEACCT="dfarning"
<manusheel> kandarpk: Ok.
<manusheel> Thank you.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Will discuss this, and get back to you soon.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Should be easy to work upon. We just need access to source machine.
<manusheel> We can insert doc strings from there.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: yes sir.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Great.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Will get back to you soon on this.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Was Luke around today?
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: No sir, he couldn't come.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Ok, absolutely fine, Kandarp. We'll touch base with him tomorrow on sugar-base and sugar core packages.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: sure, my error report is ready
<manusheel> kandarpk: Ok, great. Are you comfortable going through it?
<manusheel> kandarpk: Send me the logs too.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Let me go through it, today night.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: I am not sure if the steps I followed were correct
<manusheel> kandarpk: Please write the steps in a txt document too.
<kandarpk> manusheel sir: it was all hit and trial.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Ok.
<kandarpk> mailing you.
<manusheel> kandarpk: Still, send me the steps, and I'll have a look.
<kandarpk> manusheel, manusheel_ sir: I should leave now.
<kandarpk> was waiting for dfarning to come.
<manusheel_> kandarpk: Sure.
<manusheel_> Take good night rest, and you can start working tomorrow.
<kandarpk> manusheel_ sir, neeraj : Good night.
<manusheel_> kandarpk: I think you forgot
<manusheel_> to attach the logs.
<manusheel_> kandarpk: Good night.
<neeraj> kandarpk sir, good night
<kandarpk> manusheel_ sir: the file has the commands run and the output generated
<kandarpk> manusheel_ sir: will that be ok ?
<manusheel_> kandarpk: Sure.
<kandarpk> Good night.
<manusheel_> I think that is perfectly alright, and easier to browse too.
<manusheel_> kandarpk: Good night.
<dfarning> manu ping
<lfaraone> dfarning: neeraj doesn't need to do anything.
<dfarning> lfaraone, :) what is on his task list?
<lfaraone> dfarning: not sure.
<lfaraone> dfarning: but the SRU has been fixed.
<lfaraone> dfarning: should I have him investigate the issues Edward Cherlin (sp?) reported with flipsticks, log, and sliderpuzzle in Lucid?
<dfarning> lfaraone, Ahh I misunderstood.
<lfaraone> dfarning: once he submitted the patches, I applied them to the package, uploaded to ubuntu's ftp archive, and am currently waiting for archive admin / ubuntu-sru approval.
<dfarning> lfaraone, how about having neeraj work on getting the process of syncing the Debian packages in to 10.10?  Then we will try to backport the from 10.10 to 10.04.
<lfaraone> dfarning: if you think that's useful, sure. He'll need to follow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess (using "requestsync"), and learn how to test packages in pbuilder.
<dfarning> lfaraone, do you think there is a better process?
<lfaraone> dfarning: nah. the alternative is to have me do it :)
<lfaraone> dfarning: I (or another MOTU) will still have to review his requests. The review will be very easy if he includes a build log (from using pbuilder to build the package), since then I won't have to try and build the package myself.
<lfaraone> dfarning: should I write an email explaining how to do so?
<dfarning> lfaraone, yep.  Let's have neeraj start on that.
<dfarning> lfaraone, yes please.
<dfarning> lfaraone, but be sure that you don't cross post it:)
<lfaraone> dfarning: yessir.
<dfarning> lfaraone, how the the reviews/ fixes coming?
<lfaraone> dfarning: I've been on vacation this weekend, so I haven't had a chance to do anything since Friday morning.
<dfarning> lfaraone, I think that you and jonas spending time together at debconf will be great.
<lfaraone> dfarning: and this afternoon we have a family cookout, so although I'll try to get some stuff done today the first time I'll really be "online" and focused will be tomorrow morning.
<lfaraone> dfarning: yeah. as soon as I get my schedule together,  I'll talk to him about some sit-down time.
<dfarning> lfaraone, What did you do fore vacation?
<lfaraone> dfarning: I'm in Rhode Island for the next two weeks. We spent today at the beach getting sunburned :)
<dfarning> lfaraone, I expect that he will want to spend much of the allocated hacking time with you.
<lfaraone> dfarning: yeah. if I had known we'd be able to get so much work done, I would have attended DebCamp as well. (the week before DebConf)
<dfarning> lfaraone, nice.  I have been finding it really enjoyable to work remotely while traveling.
<dfarning> lfaraone, is it too late for Debcamp?
<lfaraone> dfarning: well, yes. apart from the whole "you're on vacation!" aspect, I'd have to get to NYC and fund myself the entire time. The conference is funding my lodgings and food while at the Conf. proper.
<dfarning> lfaraone, I did realize it was so soon:)
<lfaraone> dfarning: heh. Camp is the last week of July, Conf the following. Feature Freeze is sometime early next month. Brace for a exception! :)
<dfarning> lfaraone, If we keep the same learning rate going for the next two weeks.  August should be very productive.
<lfaraone> well, duty calls. I'll send off a quick email then I'm off. See you tomorrow morning.
#ubuntu-sugarteam 2014-07-13
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