#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-09
<Pendulum> TheMuso: I notice it's not listed on the blueprint, but is 'making Unity 2D accessibile' something you expect to have brought up in the Unity 2D Oneiric Improvements session?
<TheMuso> Pendulum: Yes.
<kinouchou> hi Pendulum 
<Pendulum> TheMuso: great :)
<Cheri703> I think I may have missed one of the accessibility blueprints, I'm going to go make sure
 * Pendulum only has internet over 3G so won't really even be able to do remote participation until Thursday
<Pendulum> and I was just trying to sort out sessions where a11y should get mentioned ;-)
<kinouchou> Pendulum: you are at UDS?
<Pendulum> kinouchou: no :(
<kinouchou> :(
<Daniel0108> hi
<kinouchou> i want see you
<kinouchou> hi Daniel0108 
<Daniel0108> Who is at the UDS? :P
<kinouchou> me
<Pendulum> charlie-tca is, but I doubt he has a computer with him
<Daniel0108> hi hajour
<MrChrisDruif> Aloha hajour 
<Daniel0108> hajour: Which meeting are you going to attend ?
<TheMuso> Hi folks, I'm here at UDS also.
<Cheri703> I'm here
<Cheri703> *at uds
<MrChrisDruif> I'm here *at home, with no video or audio stream* :(
<Daniel0108> :(
<UndiFineD> :)
<Daniel0108> I'm at UDS too :P
<Cheri703> Daniel0108: are you in/behind the 3rd row (or anyone?)
<Daniel0108> I'm behind the 3rd row
<Cheri703> ok, right or left side?
<Daniel0108> I'm directly beside the 4th door, right side
<Cheri703> ok, I'm almost opposite corner :)
<Daniel0108> oh, lol
<Cheri703> I am hanging out with hypatia most of the time, she has bright pink hair :) she's my "how to find cheri" landmark :)
<Cheri703> where are you headed after this?
<TheMuso> I'm on the right side of the ballroom somewhere near the middle.
<MrChrisDruif> Yay!
<Daniel0108> Community Roundtable or Desktop Roundtable, Cheri703 
<Cheri703> I'm headed to community roundtable I think
<Daniel0108> Cheri703: okay
<TheMuso> Hrm I don't remember seeing the desktop round table...
<Cheri703> it's in jozsef
<Cheri703> room 12 on the name badge map :)
<TheMuso> Oh there it is.
<TheMuso> Yay, now the challenge of actually finding that room
<TheMuso> Sorry maps are no use to me.
<Cheri703> oh, sorry
<TheMuso> np
<Cheri703> if you go out of this room and turn left, it's down the hallway
<Cheri703> it's on the way to mine.
<TheMuso> Brilliant, thanks for that.
<Cheri703> on the left hand side of the hallway
<Cheri703> middle room
 * TheMuso hopes to get a drink on the way... Damn warm in here.
<Cheri703> yeah, I brought a water bottle :)
<kinouchou> +1 TheMuso 
<Daniel0108> +1 TheMuso
 * Cheri703 is also carrying a big honking bag, so...
<Cheri703> trade-offs
<Cheri703> TheMuso: where are you seated in here?
<hajour> what room TheMuso ?
<MrChrisDruif> Like Jono said "Drink responsibly"
<Daniel0108> hajour: Community Roundtable?
<Cheri703> hajour: do you know what session you are headed to?
<hajour> i am in the room where the readings are
<TheMuso> I am right hand side, somewhere in the middle, near the middle exit door I think.
<Cheri703> ok, cool. I'm near the front, opposite the doors
<kinouchou> if somebody needs help, i can help him
<TheMuso> A couple of rows in front of where the middle set of PA speakers are located.
<Cheri703> I can as well
<hajour> are you in the hall TheMuso ?
<Daniel0108> hajour: yes, I'm there too, but I mean, in which room are you going to be the next hour?
 * Cheri703 is more than happy to play guide dog as needed :D
<hajour> because i can go get you if you like TheMuso 
<TheMuso> MrChrisDruif: Jono was referring to alcohol. :)
<Daniel0108> hajour: I'm in the hall, I'm directly beside the 4th door
<TheMuso> I am going to the desktop round table room.
<TheMuso> I.e Joszef.
<TheMuso> This room is not big enough for all of us.
<TheMuso> Anyway, oging to pack up now.
<Cheri703> Anyone who needs a hand going point a to point b, let me know
<Daniel0108> Cheri703: Are you going to the Community Roundtable?
<Cheri703> yes
<Cheri703> the desktop one is on the way :)
<kinouchou> me too
<Cheri703> cool, I'll keep an eye out for you guys :)
<Daniel0108> me too
<hajour> TheMuso,  are you in c orinthia hotel?
<Cheri703> I'm the one with the orange lanyard ;)
<Cheri703> oh, random question I've always wondered: screen readers: how do they handle emoticons?
<Cheri703> and/or punctuation
<Daniel0108> Cheri703: I'm the one with the white T-Shirt with TouchLay on it :P
<Cheri703> I have this idea in my head that they do (or should) say "winky face" or "smiley face" or "angry face" etc
<hajour> TheMuso,  i go look or i can find you i go to the hall .
<Daniel0108> hajour: When are you going to the Community Roundtable?
<MrChrisDruif> Finally, stream is back
<Daniel0108> great
<hajour> TheMuso, i am in the hall
<Daniel0108> hajour: I'm there too
<Cheri703> am I the only one of us that is in the room?
<kinouchou> no I'm in the room
<Cheri703> kk
<Daniel0108> has the Roundtable already started?
<Cheri703> I doubt it?
<Cheri703> since this thing is still going
<Daniel0108> yeah, but it's already 10 AM
<Daniel0108> it's 10:10 AM
<Cheri703> yeah, this is running over, and at least most people are here, and they're not going to walk out of the keynote, so...I think they'd probably wait for people
<Daniel0108> yes
<Daniel0108> I'm still in the Grand Ballroom too
<Daniel0108> Cheri703: are you in the Kazincy room?
<Cheri703> I'm still in the ballroom
<Daniel0108> Cheri703: okay, me too
<Daniel0108> I need a power source :/ Battery's low
<Cheri703> a plug?
<Daniel0108> yes
<Cheri703> I have an adapter and power strip with me
<Cheri703> *euro adapter
<Daniel0108> me too
<Daniel0108> wb hajour
<hajour> its not a good connection here
<Cheri703> which network are you on?
<UndiFineD> for the audio streams I tink we have to wait for the keynote to end
<Daniel0108> hajour: Connect to Ubuntu
<Daniel0108> hajour: Royal is not good here
<hajour> i am going to the table from name tags Daniel0108 
<Daniel0108> hajour: now?
<Daniel0108> hajour: are you still in the hall?
<Daniel0108> hi ivanka 
<Daniel0108> hajour?
<hajour> Daniel0108,  i am close by the name tag table
<Daniel0108> okay
<Daniel0108> hajour: I'm coming
<hajour> i not no how you look Daniel0108 
<hajour> TheMuso, is the maker frokm orca if i am right Daniel
<hajour> from
<UndiFineD> hajour, lees je pm
<TheMuso> hajour: No.
<Daniel0108> I'm back, hajour
<kinouchou> no accessibility session today?
<TheMuso> No sessions specific to accessibility I believe, but the Unity 2D session will have accessibility discussion.
<kinouchou> and an informal meeting? 
<TheMuso> No meetings formal or informal that I know of.
<Pendulum> wow, really impressed with the number of people signed to go to the Invisible Exhibition
<Cheri703> Pendulum: do you have that link handy?
<Pendulum> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/team/949/detail/
<Cheri703> thanks
<AlanBell> TheMuso: is the blind chap from linaro on the list for the invisible exhibition yet?
<TheMuso> AlanBell: I don't know, I'd have to have a look.
<Cheri703> there is another blind gentleman here, works for canonical. I mentioned the exhibit to him, not sure if he is wanting to go
<Daniel0108> TheMuso: are you here?
<TheMuso> Daniel0108: Yes, I am currently in Dery in the Unity 2D session.
<Daniel0108> TheMuso: oh, okay, I'm going to be in the LoCo directory session at 12:00 AM
<Cheri703> Daniel0108: I am going to be there as well
<Daniel0108> Cheri703: oh okay, I missed the two first sessions :/
<Cheri703> :/
<Daniel0108> It's my first UDS, lol
<Cheri703> mine too!
<Daniel0108> and the long Keynode messed the schedule up :P
<Daniel0108> Cheri703: where are you?
<Cheri703> I'm in the session about maturity ratings, room arany, though I may duck out a few minutes early
<Cheri703> I'm in as Cheri703 and cheri703-mobile, I'll get pinged on both on my phone once my computer is back in its bag :)
 * TheMuso is heading to the image media space session, i.e the session at 12:00 in Elod.
 * TheMuso now needs to find elod...
 * Cheri703 isn't going to the plenary sessions
<hajour> wanted to let you know i talked with someone from canonical this afternoon and they want to use browserspeak for the buttons in above bar from the screen 
<hajour> pleia2, ^
<MrChrisDruif> In above bar from the screen?
<MrChrisDruif> You mean the top panel?
<MrChrisDruif> hajour; ^
<hajour> yes MrChrisDruif 
<hajour> just had have a talk from i think more then a half hour
<MrChrisDruif> Button....you mean the globalmenu?
<hajour> not remember anymore but they go come to here or to speechcontrol if they had more questions
<hajour> TheMuso,  see above lines about browserspeak
<hajour> i not yet have found you TheMuso 
<hajour> my laptop is still not full charged
<hajour> so i need to leave in the hotel room
<hajour> but the cleaning lady is here to clean up the room so i stay till see is finished
<hajour> mhall119,  have you read above lines?
<hajour> conninical part
<hajour> canonical i mean
<mhall119> hajour: just read it, but I'm not involved in desktop development, so I'm not sure how I caould be involved
<hajour> it was just sharing the good news mh:)
<hajour> mhall119, 
<hajour> i not need help with that now
<hajour> only i not know my way around here.
<hajour> feeling som lost here downstairs by the readingrooms
<hajour> i need to put out my laptop else it never go charge up
<mhall119> hajour: sorry, I'm on the 4th floor working with my team, not downstairs in the sessions
<hajour> well i go soon downstairs again. long i keep it up anyway.
<hajour> hi Pendulum  :) just have spoken to person from canonical.and they want to go use browserspeak for top panel and things like that
<AlanBell> how would that work?
<hajour> he said if you use the click the button then right away would speak out loud the function
<hajour> i have told if he got questions he can come here or in speechcontrol AlanBell 
<Pendulum> hajour: do you know who you talked to?
<AlanBell> ok, so looking at the code for browserspeak it is some javascript plugins for chrome/firefox with a dependency on openmary (hardcoded to one running on localhost)
<hajour> not remember my laptop battery was empty
<hajour> so i could not make a note
<AlanBell> the unity sidebar isn't rendered by a browser and openmary isn't in debian yet so I am not sure how browserspeak could be used in this context
<hajour> but he said we would talk later this week again
<hajour> i not know or he was from unity AlanBell  or is unity the same like canonical?
<hajour> AlanBell, ^
<AlanBell> Unity is the user interface to the Ubuntu desktop
<hajour> but its good right? or not?
<UndiFineD> wow hajour nice work
<hajour> now i go doubt if i it was good honest say
<hajour> :)
<AlanBell> not sure, I am still a bit confused, but if you send people here that would be great
<AlanBell> this is the code we are talking about right? http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~speechcontrol-devel/browserspeak/trunk/files
<hajour> also i have introduced daniel0108 by them because they already further with touchtables .its arranged someone who speaks german will learn daniel0108 more from it
<hajour> that person kis also from canonical
<UndiFineD> AlanBell, I think they want to use openmary to speak the buttons
<hajour> -k
<hajour> yes UndiFineD 
<hajour> that i mean
<AlanBell> that would be a bad idea if not going through speech dispatcher
<UndiFineD> of course the would be done via SD
<hajour> they go use speech dispather
<UndiFineD> but I think the person was convinced of the voice qualities
<hajour> i told about libopenmary and openmary and espeak orca ect.
<hajour> i am better with speaking then write AlanBell 
<hajour> at least its now more coming
<hajour> needed first to adjust more
<AlanBell> yup, hope you are enjoying it all
<AlanBell> do try and grab names of interesting people you talk to
<hajour> need my laptop if i want write names :(
<AlanBell> where is your laptop?
<hajour> everytime i think i talk to someone from ubuntu it later seams to be someone from canonical
<hajour> here in hotelroom it needed to charge ala
<Pendulum> hajour: well most Ubuntu people at UDS are also Canonical employees
<hajour> battery was very low
<hajour> then i was go downstairs without laptop and just run in to the person from canonical see above
<hajour> i talk more easy in some small groups then in big groups
<hajour> hee leoquant 
<TheMuso> hajour: Most of the discussion rooms have power strips that you can plug into.
<hajour> ok so i can take laptop with me TheMuso 
<TheMuso> Yes.
<hajour> also i not know what is standing on the doors :(
<hajour> TheMuso, ^
<TheMuso> I don't know what you mean either.
<hajour> on the doors are standing words but its hard to read
<hajour> anyway i go to downstairs now i not have come to here to stay on a hotelroom
<cprofitt> hello all
<AlanBell> hi cprofitt 
<Cheri703> hi cprofitt 
<cprofitt> good sessions today AlanBell -- miss being there
<cprofitt> for the most part the audio was good, but being there allows for discussions after the session
<AlanBell> I am not there either
<UndiFineD> eh 
<UndiFineD> how can we have 2 accessibility meeting at the same time tomorrow ?
<AlanBell> UndiFineD: they will move apart, don't worry
<maco> AlanBell: not without interference
<maco> the Qt one was manually put there because it used to be at 4-am-my-time and i'm the one going to be doing most of that
<AlanBell> yeah, they must both have been manually scheduled, I will arrange some interference
<AlanBell> anyone object to the community one moving?
<UndiFineD> better apart then together
<Pendulum> fine by me, although is there any way you can find out who manually scheduled it in the first place so that you can figure out what other conditions might need to be fulfilled?
<AlanBell> it would have been done by jcastro or jono
<maco> the Qt one was ScottK
<hajour> i lost connection but i go sleep now goodnight all
<phillw> ;terminal
<Cheri703> did anyone notice that 2 accessibility sessions are scheduled concurrently tomorrow?
<AlanBell> Cheri703: yes
<Cheri703> ok, is that ok? there are actually 3 sessions that hour that I want to go to :/
<AlanBell> not OK, if you see jcastro or jono can you point it out to them please
<AlanBell> the community one needs to move I think as the Kubuntu one is fixed for maco's availability
<Cheri703> ok, yeah, I want to go to the community one too
<maco> AlanBell: the kubuntu one can go an hour later as well
<AlanBell> ok, good to know
<Cheri703> so ideally all 3 would be on separate hours, yes?
<Cheri703> oh, you're talking about a different one, nvm
<AlanBell> jono should be able to sort it out, grab him before, during or after the community round table
<Cheri703> kk
<paul_h1> hi, anyone on here know anything about the kAccessibility screen reader?
<AlanBell> maco: would be the one to talk to about that
<maco> paul_h1: hello
<maco> #kde-accessibility is actually probably better
<maco> ive used kaccessible a little to test it out, but not much
<paul_h1> maco: any idea if I could install it on a system running gnome to read qt apps for me?
<maco> paul_h1: should work
<maco> you need to export QT_ACCESSIBILITY=1 before running the Qt apps
<maco> so you could do:    QT_ACCESSIBILITY=1 kmail
<maco> for example
<paul_h1> QT_ACCESSIBILITY=1 virtualbox-ose
<maco> i haven't tried it with vbox yet, so let me know how that goes
<maco> should also be a way to set the environment variable in gnome session startup, but i don't know it
<maco> maybe in ~/.gnomerc, but i don't know if that's still how it's done (im seeing it in c. 2004-2005 posts)
<paul_h1> maco: hmmm not getting anything. what speech synthesizer is it meant to use?
<maco> paul_h1: espeak i think. however it is possible that there is a tray icon that you can't see in the tray that if you open it will drop out a menu with a checkbox to turn on speech
<maco> note to self: sort out how to make kaccessible start turned *on*
<paul_h1> maco: oh right. yeah tray always been problematic 
<paul_h1> maco: guess I'll have to setup my vm's from the command line :)
#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-10
<AlanBell> the accessibility team community session has been relocated to Ond room at 17:05
<UndiFineD> ok
<charlie-tca> Accessibility session for the community is scheduled for 17:00 today in #ubuntu-uds-ond
<hajour> AlanBell, i have talked to some people also from canonical who are from touchscreen
<AlanBell> ok, great, who?
<hajour> and ask to let it be useble n smartboards
<AlanBell> utouch people?
<hajour> together with speechprogram
<hajour> yes
<hajour> so i have named edubuntu as possible program to be usble for AlanBell 
<hajour> they want to know or it is possible that edubuntu can support smartboards 
<AlanBell> hmm, more of a project than a program
<AlanBell> anyhow I have to go collect kids o/
<hajour> :)
<hajour> but i not know or i may ad onthe etherpad to ask
<hajour> or when i can ask/tell it
<Cheri703> hajour: copy this and paste it here in irc: /join #ubuntu-uds-kond
<Cheri703> that will let you join the chat room for this room we are in
<UndiFineD> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UndiFineD/UDS-O#preview
<hajour> thanks Cheri703 :)
<Cheri703> sure
<Cheri703> they said edubuntu can support smartboards
<UndiFineD> cool
<UndiFineD> coming up
<UndiFineD> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-o/meeting/desktop-dx-o-unity-a11y/
<UndiFineD> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-dx-o-unity-a11y
<UndiFineD> huba 15
<UndiFineD> http://icecast.ubuntu.com:8000/huba.ogg.xspf
<Cheri703> when is that one UndiFineD ?
<Cheri703> is that the desktop testing?
<UndiFineD> now
<Cheri703> bah, there are like 3 this session and 3 next session that I want to be in -_- I am in another because it is a continuation of one from yesterday
<Cheri703> take good notes :)
<Cheri703> there are so many conflicting sessions :(
<UndiFineD> hey what happened
<Cheri703> ?
<UndiFineD> they rescheduled
<Cheri703> oh, ok, cool
<Cheri703> the schedule is CONSTANTLY changing, it is frustrating. today there are several that conflict for me
<AlanBell> got an accessibility mention in the plan for unity testing http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-o/meeting/desktop-dx-o-unity-testing/
<Cheri703> AlanBell: we want you in #ubuntu-uds-tohotom
<Cheri703> :)
<TheMuso> Yeah scheduling is a bit rediculous.
<hajour> AlanBell, i got the name for you from the person from the touch program .his name is chase douglas
<AlanBell> great
<hajour> got a mailadress to AlanBell 
<hajour> but i not go put that in chat here
<hajour> if i am home i will let UndiFineD send it to you
<hajour> AlanBell, ^
<AlanBell> https://launchpad.net/~chasedouglas
<AlanBell> it is on his launchpad page anyway
<hajour> ok :)
<hajour> i never now i rather not put mail adresses in chat AlanBell 
<UndiFineD> :)
<hajour> so i hope to can do more this week
<hajour> i discovered why i cant read the name tags by the doors
<AlanBell> yeah, best not to post email addresses, but most people have them on their launchpad page anyway
<hajour> its because the color combination what is used
<hajour> because i can read the name on the name cards what is the white fonts on orange
<hajour> i hope i will be worth the sponsoring
<TheMuso> So who here is going to attend the kubuntu accessibility session this afternoon?
<Pendulum> I know maco is going to be there remotely
<Pendulum> I unfortunately am about to not have internet
<Pendulum> until sometime late tomorrow
<Pendulum> I think Cheri703 might be as well
<Cheri703> I'm going to be there (as far as I know)
<hajour> i will be there TheMuso 
<hajour> are you there to TheMuso ?
<UndiFineD> I am doubly booked at that time for the only session of interest for Ubuntu Adverts
<AlanBell> they have just cut all the track leads permissions to reschedule stuff :)
<Cheri703> Any suggestions of books/sites for accessibility in User experience design?
<Cheri703> I'm in the session about that, and mentioned it, so they're asking for resources
<hajour> do i go to there Cheri703 ?
<Cheri703> well, they've sort of moved on from it now :)
<hajour> i can come if it will be helpfull
<Cheri703> nah, we found some stuff, no worries :)
<hajour> they also may talk to me later if they want Cheri703 
<Cheri703> ok, I will let them know
<hajour> i am whole week here
<hajour> Cheri703, after the accessibility meeting this afternoon can you help with look what is useful from sessions to go to for me?
<Cheri703> the kde/qt accessibility is next hour in room 11 kazinczy, the other accessibility session is at 5 in room 19 Ond. I will look at the list for tomorrow and see if I have any thoughts
<AlanBell> hajour: in general the pink ones are good to go to
<hajour> ok Cheri703 thanks:)
<hajour> ok AlanBell  also thanks :)
<AlanBell> I will be in the community session later, I have to pop out and get a replacement goldfish!
<Cheri703> heh, have fun!
<AlanBell> great, got two replacement fish, and one died before it even got released out of the bag
<AlanBell> I am delighted at the list of people for the invisible exhibition
<AlanBell> pleia2: a photo of everyone outside it would be great (no photos inside obviously)
<pleia2> AlanBell: good idea :) Ill see what I can do
<AlanBell> thanks
<maco> http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/IMMD/~3/N8olF_UI5Ek/
<Daniel0108> hey
<maco> hello
<hajour> hi all
<hajour> they go look at the idea from audio mail but it maybe will become also video mail to
<AlanBell> gah, listening to the audio of the a11y session, I should have made the start of it!
<AlanBell> TheMuso: so the story with the keyboards is I made onboard look somewhat prettier with the goal of getting the design team excited about it (which kind of worked)
<MrChrisDruif> Aloha
<hajour> also i found someone who can solve the algoritme problem so that means it not will take 10 minutes anymore for openmary go read out loud 10 lines
<AlanBell> TheMuso: speaking to the gnome a11y people they initially told me we should be using the "official upstream keyboard" that is part of the gnome platform and is caribou
<AlanBell> TheMuso: however on further investigation we couldn't get the thing to compile
<MrChrisDruif> hajour; Audio mail?
<hajour> yes MrChrisDruif audiomail
<hajour> just a idea of me i just had get in accessibility meeting
<MrChrisDruif> Meaning? Mail software that reads the email to the user?
<AlanBell> TheMuso: I think onboard will be the keyboard in Oneiric, perhaps with other optionsin the repo, but for Oneiric+1 we might reconsider the default keyboard question. I want one that does everything, from scanning to multitouch to odd layouts like steno chording keyboards
<hajour> no you just speak your message in and the mail sends audiofile
<hajour> they go look to it all opensource mail will go look at it
<MrChrisDruif> Scanning?
<AlanBell> MrChrisDruif: scanning is where the user has very very limited control, like a switch they can press (Stephen Hawkin uses it)
<hajour> no just a button you click on it then you speak in and send it
<AlanBell> the keyboard flashes between rows, you press your switch when the row you want flashes, then it flashes the keys of that row and you press when the one you want is highlighted
<hajour> just try to think more simple MrChrisDruif :P
<MrChrisDruif> Sorry hajour, that scanning was for AlanBell.
<hajour> a ok sorry XD
<AlanBell> really slow way of entering data, but if all you have is a switch then that is how it works
<MrChrisDruif> hajour; But what are we doing with Speechcontrol then? :-/
 * MrChrisDruif is confused
<hajour> its needed for websites to read MrChrisDruif 
<AlanBell> hajour: orca does that
<AlanBell> I think TheMuso's suggestion of documenting the Ubuntu architecture for accessibility is a great one
<MrChrisDruif> I thought SpeechControl would do what it's name implies; Control (the computer) by Speech
<hajour> its not very difficult we are able to use natural voice i also found someone who maybe can solve orca s problem with the haspering
<hajour> AlanBell, ^
<AlanBell> I don't know what haspering means
<Daniel0108> hajour: we can just use our SpeechControl daemon as an orca speech-synthesizer 
<AlanBell> it doesn't seem to be a word in Dutch or English :)
<Daniel0108> *could
<AlanBell> Daniel0108: orca feeds what it reads into speech dispatcher
<hajour> stotter
<hajour> ^netherlands
<AlanBell> speech dispatcher is a common interface to multiple synthesis back ends
<AlanBell> espeak is a synth, it comes on the CD it is small and works well at high speed
<hajour> AlanBell,  do not so hard plz i not only have suggest espeak also orca
<hajour> they just can choose there self what works for them the best
<AlanBell> there are other synthesisers such as festival, openmary etc
<AlanBell> also hardware voice synthesiser devices
<hajour> AlanBell,  they go use openmary
<AlanBell> all can be fed stuff to say through speech dispatcher
<hajour> combined with a speechprogram
<hajour> by using libopenmary
<hajour> just let them help
<hajour> they are from canonical
<AlanBell> so yes, OpenMary is great, has lovely realistic voices, but it is a back end to speech dispatcher
<hajour> its not important what will be used its important the end goal that it works
<AlanBell> I thought libopenmary was supposed to be a speech dispatcher driver for the openmary back end
<hajour> yes
<AlanBell> it isn't
<hajour> and i found help to solve the algoritme problem AlanBell 
<hajour> it works by Daniel0108 
<hajour> i have heard it here by uds
<Daniel0108> yes
<Daniel0108> even emospeak works
<hajour> AlanBell,  just be happy we all together are busy to succeed
<MrChrisDruif> stammer
<AlanBell> I am happy :)
<hajour> you have done also important work AlanBell 
<AlanBell> what is emospeak Daniel0108?
<hajour> and also TheMuso 
<MrChrisDruif> Or in this case stammering
<MrChrisDruif> hajour; ^
<Daniel0108> AlanBell: Emotional Speech, for example: you set the voice excited and it talks excited
<Daniel0108> or bored
<AlanBell> oh yeah
<hajour> a ok i found someone who can help to solve the stammering problem
<hajour> he is from canonical
<AlanBell> is the stammering issue just with your laptop?
<hajour> i speek to him again later this week
<hajour> no by more people AlanBell 
<AlanBell> Daniel0108: http://cvs.freebsoft.org/doc/speechd/speech-dispatcher.html
<MrChrisDruif> hajour; by = with
<hajour> a ok thank you MrChrisDruif 
<Daniel0108> hajour: the only disadvantage of  openMary is that it's SLOW
<hajour> we making accessibility progress or am i not right?
<AlanBell> Daniel0108: yeah, it can be, but that is because I have used a generic driver
<AlanBell> Daniel0108: did you try the generic driver and my server?
<hajour> yes but i also was looking for help for orca not only for that Daniel0108 
<Daniel0108> hajour: okay
<Daniel0108> AlanBell: you have to ask hajour about her idea :) I'm just a programmer, I do what she wants me to do :P
<hajour> i try to do whatever i can for accessibility
<hajour> lol
<hajour> if AlanBell  have a good idea always listen to ideas
<hajour> after you always can decided or you go use it
<AlanBell> so doing the generic driver for openmary was just a proof of concept really
<AlanBell> so you can try using orca and openmary to read the screen, read websites, do everything you can already do with orca and espeak but with the openmary voices
<hajour> i am a little tired i not even have eaten i not have seen a cook and there was no food i could eat
<hajour> AlanBell,  we use espeak
<hajour> but its needed to can used also very good by orca
<hajour> like i said it need to be multifunctional
<AlanBell> go find some food hajour :)
<hajour> cant i got foodalergic
<hajour> i can eat out side the hotel
<Daniel0108> hajour: I think he means that HE is going to find some food :P
<hajour> and in hotel its very expensive
<Daniel0108> oh lol sorry
<Daniel0108> didn't read the lines before that :P
<hajour> ubuntu thing where was eaten is already over
<Daniel0108> hajour: soo.. I programmed the library, but not openMary. Who programmed openMary? o.O
<hajour> dont ask me to thibnk hard on this moment i not able to think hard anymore now
<hajour> think i mean
<AlanBell> Daniel0108: Das Deutsche Forschungszentrum fÃ¼r KÃ¼nstliche Intelligenz
<AlanBell> http://mary.dfki.de/
<hajour> 1 of the persons said to me it was good i had some health issues because else i would be to inteligent and they not would understand me anymore .ye right
<hajour> i know it was mend for a joke
<hajour> meant
<MrChrisDruif> :)
<hajour> but AlanBell  i hope i was usefull
<MrChrisDruif> hajour; are* ;) You are useful
<hajour> what is more needed to do AlanBell ?
<AlanBell> yeah, we need to think about things differently
<MrChrisDruif> Fix bug #1 while your at it hajour :)
<ubot2> MrChrisDruif: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1 (Not reporting large bug)
<AlanBell> hajour: go and get food, there is no food on IRC
<hajour> AlanBell,  there also is no food here for me
<hajour> if i order on a moment what is not in a event i need to pay self my diner
<AlanBell> get something on room service or go find a supermarket
<hajour> its to expensive here in the hotel
<AlanBell> no you don't
<AlanBell> just put it on the room
<hajour> yes i am marianne told me that very clear
<AlanBell> ok, fair enough
<Daniel0108> Bug #1 definitely HAS to be fixed!
<AlanBell> but there is a per diem you get to claim back
<hajour> but i cant eat food here out the supermarket i got food alergic AlanBell 
<hajour> busy with it Daniel0108 
 * AlanBell has no further suggestions
<hajour> i know AlanBell 
<Daniel0108> hajour: everyone is busy with bug #1 :)
<ubot2> Daniel0108: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1 (Not reporting large bug)
<MrChrisDruif> Daniel0108; It sounded you didn't know about bug #1?
<ubot2> MrChrisDruif: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1 (Not reporting large bug)
<hajour> it would be better if next time something like this would be kept in a cheaper hotel
<Daniel0108> MrChrisDruif: I knew about it :P
<Daniel0108> MrChrisDruif: I already posted it on twitter a few months ago :P
<hajour> btw i have told several people to go to accesibilty team
<hajour> 1 from kde really need help for to get the magnifier to get working AlanBell 
<AlanBell> ok, that is good, but I am not too focussed on kde
<hajour> tomorrow we go talk further what more he need help with for the accessibility part AlanBell 
<AlanBell> I do want to get the text following added to the compiz ezoom plugin
<hajour> we need to get accessibility on all programs AlanBell 
<hajour> so they ask help with that
<AlanBell> I know how the gnome magnifier linked to orca works, I read the source code for that
<hajour> it seams its accessibility team task to offer that help AlanBell 
<AlanBell> I can do the same for the ezoom plugin
<hajour> great
<hajour> i have said in accessibility team we have people with all kind of skills so big chance to solve problems with that in here
<hajour> problems like that
<hajour> i would like to see some from the city also
<hajour> but i cant go alone i go get lost because my memory problem
<MrChrisDruif> I'll see if I can make it next time, maybe we could go together then hajour 
<Daniel0108> bye now :)
<Daniel0108> see ya tomorrow :P
<Daniel0108> hajour: ^
<hajour> ok Daniel0108  see you tomor
<hajour> tomorrow and goodnight Daniel0108 
<Daniel0108> good night
<MrChrisDruif> Sleep well Daniel0108 
<hajour> they say i speak very good english now .the people here
<hajour> for the short time i do speak it
<hajour> was i understandably AlanBell  on the session?
<MrChrisDruif> For the short time you speak it, I have no doubt...
<MrChrisDruif> I didn't hear you....I thought once I heard you hajour :P
<hajour> jmarsden heard me he said in chat
<MrChrisDruif> Were you in the room where the next session was going about Lubuntu cleanup etc?
<hajour> only i often are sitting far from the mic
<MrChrisDruif> I heard gilir speak...classic example of a France accent :P
<hajour> i was by edubuntu and kde 
<hajour> i not new from lubuntu sorry
<hajour> i am all day be busy with talking to people
<MrChrisDruif> :)
<MrChrisDruif> Glad to hear your enjoying yourself hajour :)
<hajour> from 8:00 morning till 11:00
<hajour> so it was a long day
<MrChrisDruif> 3 hours?
<hajour> sorry i meant 23:00
<MrChrisDruif> :)
<hajour> make that 15
<MrChrisDruif> 8:00 AM to 11:00 PM would also work
<hajour> i always forget where am and pm are stand for
<hajour> i mix them up
<MrChrisDruif> I don't know what they start for, but I know when to use which :)
<MrChrisDruif> Before noon (midday) you use AM, after that use PM
<hajour> i try to remember it but till now i was not able to remember it
<MrChrisDruif> AM = latin for Ante Meridiem and PM = Post Meridiem. First means before noon, and second after noon
<hajour> i think UndiFineD  is sleeping now
<MrChrisDruif> Alright, he'll read it in the morning :)
<hajour> if we not talk to much he will he cant scroll back so far
<MrChrisDruif> Was there something he should have seen in this channel?
<AlanBell> someone in the session asked about names on the etherpad and the colours
<AlanBell> anyone remember who that was?
<Cheri703> I did
<Cheri703> I asked undifined if he was typing stuff
<hajour> i not remember honest say
<Cheri703> hajour: does UndiFineD not have logs?
<hajour> yes 
<AlanBell> male, southern US accent perhaps
<AlanBell> anyhow the point was that after everyone has logged out you can't see the names to tie to the colours
<Cheri703> (so we don't have to worry about how much we type for the scrollback, he can just check logs)
<hajour> but i know talk in my loco team :)
<AlanBell> however you can in the time slider (which is hard to get to right now)
<hajour> to inform them
<Cheri703> ah, that may have been charlie?
<Cheri703> ah, ok
<Cheri703> good to know
<AlanBell> http://pad.ubuntu.com/ep/pad/view/uds-o-community-o-accessibility-team/latest for example
<MrChrisDruif> A bit of a etherpad fail
<AlanBell> what is?
<AlanBell> it is only hard to get to because I hid it :)
<MrChrisDruif> AlanBell; That you can't see who edited what AFTER everyone left :)
<AlanBell> well you can, that is what the time slider does
 * AlanBell claps at TheMuso plan for getting to accessibility profiles from ubiquity
<MrChrisDruif> Accessibility profiles from ubiquity? :-/
<AlanBell> I am listening to the session
<AlanBell> 42 minutes in
<AlanBell> TheMuso: could the absence of a keyboard device pop up the onboard keyboard?
<hajour> sorry to tired to go to a session more today
<AlanBell> kind of like udev backwards!
<AlanBell> I am listening to the audio recording of the session this afternoon
<hajour> o ok sorry
<AlanBell> is it charlietca perhaps?
<hajour> was it by kde?
<hajour> because i talked also there
<AlanBell> TheMuso: I was talking to joanie about writing an intro to orca article
<AlanBell> TheMuso: she is rather focussed on people who already have screenreader skills so this would address those who don't
<AlanBell> TheMuso: such as sighted application developers
<hajour> goodnight all
<MrChrisDruif> I'm offline, see y'all tomorrow :) Aloha!
#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-11
<TheMuso> AlanBell: We could, but at won't be easy, given the various methods that a keyboard can be connected to a system.
<TheMuso> We'd also have to make sure we have a pointing device present.
<TheMuso> But its certainly a good idea.
<TheMuso> AlanBell: Re the article, that sounds like a great idea.
<AlanBell> morning
<MrChrisDruif> Aloha
<MrChrisDruif> And I'm off again. See y'all soon (about 30 mins or so). Aloha!
<TheMuso> AlanBell, Cheri703, I have added some discussion items to the ubiquity accessibility review whiteboard. If you guys have anything to add, please do so.
<Cheri703> looks good to me TheMuso. I will ponder the possibilities for notification of accessibility options on install
<Cheri703> can someone ping me if charlie-tca shows up?
<MrChrisDruif> Same here ;)
<MrChrisDruif> How's it going Cheri703 ?
<Cheri703> Pretty good, learning a TON at uds
<Cheri703> (also annoyed with the launcher in 11.04, installed it this morning)
<Daniel0108> indeed
<Daniel0108> Cheri703: I'm still using 10.10 ;)
<Daniel0108> but I have a natty sticker on my laptop, lol
<Cheri703> I generally use 10.10. I put 11.04 on the other partition (finally got rid of 10.04) and I decided to give it an actual test run
<Cheri703> not sure how long it'll last, so we'll see
<Daniel0108> oh okay
<Daniel0108> I was testing 11.04 when it was still beta
<Daniel0108> but I want unity to be as customizable as gnome
<Cheri703> I figured this is the place to mess with it, if I have issues, there will be LOTS of people who can help :D
<Cheri703> yeah, I'm fairly meh about unity
<Daniel0108> gnome3 is also not as customizable as gnome2, so I'm staying with gnome2 :P
<Cheri703> yeah, I was on 10.04 til march, just switched to 10.10 then
<MrChrisDruif> Cheri703; I'm using something based on 10.10: Elementary OS (Jupiter release)
<TheMuso> Well classic GNOME will still be available in universe for however long its maintained in Debian/Ubuntu/Upstream.
<Daniel0108> ok
<Daniel0108> I want a gUbuntu 11.04 :D
<MrChrisDruif> xD
<MrChrisDruif> Daniel0108; That won't happen
<Daniel0108> I know :(
<Cheri703> Daniel0108: that'd work for me
<Cheri703> I just want the dang launcher to minimize when I click on the icon again -_-
<UndiFineD> the audio stream in dery is horrible and unsuitable for remote participation
<MrChrisDruif> Still no sight of charlie?
<TheMuso> MrChrisDruif: What did you want to talk to him about? I will likely see him later today.
<MrChrisDruif> Apparently he is testing manager or something...I might consider doing the same for Lubuntu...so I wanted to get the load down from him what's it all about
<TheMuso> ah ok. he is not carrying a laptop around with him. I'll ask him for you and get him to ping you when he is next online.
<hajour> yesterday i talked about the mail idea .we figured out to let people choose or they want get audio mail or written or both's.also that a speechfunction will be in the mail.automatic
<hajour> for option if someone have choose for the accessibility version
<hajour> that last count for the speechpart part\
<maco> i'll be missing the unity one to make the drive into work. if DBO (Jason) is there, ask him about that SRU for me?
<Cheri703> sure
<Cheri703> (I don't know what sru is, but sure :) )
<AlanBell> stable release update 
<Cheri703> ah, ok :)
<AlanBell> it relates to allowing onboard to type into the unity stuff
<Cheri703> I gotcha
<AlanBell> he bet everyone in -offftopic that they couldn't find a unity bug he couldn't fix within 24 hours
<AlanBell> maco threw that gauntlet down
<Cheri703> heh
<UndiFineD> AlanBell, what about your onboard improvement
<UndiFineD> or the orange wiki links
<UndiFineD> yes
<UndiFineD> much better
<AlanBell> that too UndiFineD, but not in the unity session
<AlanBell> I will follow that up with sladen & ivanka after UDS
<UndiFineD> she knows :)
<AlanBell> is sladen at UDS?
<UndiFineD> I went to the color session
<AlanBell> ah great, I will listen to that later
<UndiFineD> raising awareness across teams is good too, and I pointed them to the checker so pages will improve hopefully
<hajour> btw they already go work it out the speechprogram by utouch
<hajour> i not know which one
<hajour> thats there choice
<Daniel0108> hi hajour
<hajour> if you like the idea i go ask them to make a screen keyboard in it to
<Daniel0108> hajour: where are you?
<hajour> i know now who i need to speak for to ask that
<Daniel0108> hajour: are you talking about uTouch?
<Daniel0108> because there's a uTouch session :)
<Daniel0108> today
<hajour> i am in  desktop-dx-o-unity-a11y | Audio: http://icecast.ubuntu.com:8000/huba.ogg.m3u
<hajour> i not know when that is and where
<hajour> Daniel0108, ^
<Daniel0108> hajour: 17:05 Krudy 06: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-o/2011-05-11/
<hajour> i don't can really understand all of where they speak about here
<hajour> :(
<hajour> i am not useble by huba i not understand what they saying
<hajour> so if i not understand them its just waste of time for me i go.next session is utouch i go try arrange unscreen keyboard by utouch
#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-12
<Pendulum> so did all of the documentation/outreach stuff just kinda get dropped from UDS?
<Pendulum> (sorry, vaguely online now, but not really here, just looking at the session notes from Tuesday finally)
<Cheri703> we did talk about outreach a bit...
<Cheri703> (also, glad you traveled safely :) )
<Pendulum> okay, just no notes on the etherpad...
<AlanBell> hi Pendulum 
 * Cheri703 was taking notes, did a crappy job, sorry
<AlanBell> Pendulum: there is audio too
<Pendulum> or very little
<AlanBell> http://mirrors.tumbleweed.org.za/uds-o/
<Pendulum> AlanBell: bad auditory processing so listening without the discussion won't help me :-/
<Pendulum> Cheri703: no worries!
<Cheri703> Pendulum: there weren't necessarily specifics about it, just "we should probably do more outreach" I think
<Pendulum> I guess the documentation/outreach stuff that was on the etherpad from our last meeting just never made it onto the UDS etherpad :-/
<Pendulum> (so didn't get discussed)
<Cheri703> well, I think some of the testing classes charlie-tca and I were talking about would be outreach at least to a degree
<Pendulum> yes
<Pendulum> true
<Pendulum> I was mostly thinking personas and that side of stuff
<Cheri703> yeah, we didn't talk much about that
<Pendulum> and the fact that we need to look at what documentation needs updating/overhauling/to be created
<Cheri703> we did talk about creating a document that would explain exactly what accessibility things exist and how they fit together (I think that was in the meeting you're talking about)
<UndiFineD> but there has been done a lot of outreach onto various sessions regarding a11y and docu
<Pendulum> cool :)
<UndiFineD> where appropiate I dropped achecker.ca
<UndiFineD> so they themselves can test for it
<UndiFineD> which is better then no attention to it at all
<fregl> feedback appreciated: https://live.gnome.org/Hackfests/ATK2011/Agenda/EnablingAccessibilityProposal
<fregl> maco: ^
<maco> fregl: i don't know anything about dbus, but in #kde-accessibility someone wondered whether the reason QT_ACCESSIBILITY had to be set first is that the widgets have to be created post-ATK-startup.. not the case?
<fregl> right, I can also post in kde-accessibility ... too many channels :p
<fregl> widgets created post atk startup?
<fregl> I don't understand
<maco> <tbsaunde> jpwhiting: dbus signal would work, but I wonder if the qt-bridge assumes its loaded at the start of execution
<maco> <jpwhiting> ah, as in it only creates accessible objects for widgets as they are created? maybe
<maco> <jpwhiting> but maybe not, it seems to work right on windows where a signal turns on accessibility (I think from fregl's email)
<maco> <tbsaunde> jpwhiting: yeah, its cetainly a possibility, I just mean that it might take some work on the bridge to make it work
<fregl> well, if I am going to implement this inside Qt, then it's going to work (I hope at least :p)
<fregl> no, I can create everything at any time, it just needs a bit of work. but that is required no matter what
<maco> cool
#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-13
<TheMuso> maco: I am happy to handle some of those work items for the kubuntu a11y spec, since some will be needed for Unity 2D.
<maco> TheMuso: which should I mark you down for?
<TheMuso> maco: Let me have another look.
<TheMuso> maco: I can work with fregl to get QT patches and the at-spi bridge into Ubuntu.
 * TheMuso goes and adjusts the whiteboard.
<maco> http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/IMMD/~3/TXH4KfEAKmE/  :)
<TheMuso> maco: Re the casper work item, I intend to refactor the casper scripts for the accessibility profile functionality in the first ubiquity screen, so if you could wait till I have refactored things, that would be much appreciated.
<maco> TheMuso: no problem. im going to be bugging you about "how does this bit work?" anyway :P
<TheMuso> Right, better to be doing so after the refactor.
<webczat> hey
<UndiFineD> UndiFineD_nl Keimpe de Jong 
<UndiFineD> @NeelieKroesEU #AskNeelie Will you hold governments and others responsible to make their websites accessible? It is easy: http://achecker.ca
<meetingology> UndiFineD: Error: "NeelieKroesEU" is not a valid command.
<UndiFineD> she asked fr it :P
#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-14
<jbicha> I tried caribou on Fedora 15
<AlanBell> jbicha: how was it?
<jbicha> it uses a popup keyboard next to the textfield which kinda works except that sometimes it's covering important parts of the app
<jbicha> so it doesn't work if you use Gnome Terminal fullscreen as it'd be in the way
<jbicha> but if you "window" the terminal, it can work
<jbicha> and it doesn't work in some apps like Firefox
<jbicha> the included keyboard doesn't have any F- keys or the Shift key, but I suppose if you're using a mouse
<jbicha> you could just browse to a menu and wouldn't be doing keyboard shortcuts like that
<jbicha> it didn't appear to be integrated into Fedora's gdm login screen but maybe I wasn't doing it right
<jbicha> *and the popup keyboard isn't movable, it just pops up where it wants to which I didn't like
<jbicha> caribou's pretty new, only 0.2 so maybe these things will be worked out
<AlanBell> yup
<AlanBell> if I can get it installed I would like to try and see if it has archtectural benefits over onboard
<AlanBell> not seeing it at the moment tbh
<jbicha> I wasn't able to get it built from jhbuild nor have I seen a .deb for it
<AlanBell> however the gnome a11y people seem to be betting on caribou as their official keyboard
<AlanBell> I couldn't build it either
<jbicha> maybe we could alien Fedora's rpm
<AlanBell> the main developer was working on .deb files for it
<AlanBell> Pendulum: I was thinking of doing a blog post about the four UDS sessions
<Pendulum> AlanBell: go for it
<AlanBell> Pendulum: ok, ready for you to check and publish
<AlanBell> actually, hang, on, will add a bit about the invisible exhibition
<Pendulum> k
<Pendulum> will wait then
<AlanBell> ok
<AlanBell> just added picture and link to pleia2's blog
<Pendulum> AlanBell: not sure if it's going to save because it says you're also editing, but the Invisible Exhibition trip was Wednesday, not Thursday
<Pendulum> otherwise looks good
<webczat> AlanBell: What about atk-wrapper?
<Pendulum> AlanBell: so I'll exit and if you change what day, then it's good to go from my POV
<cprofitt> Pendulum: you here?
<Pendulum> cprofitt: yes
<cprofitt> we are starting to gather our wiki pages for Summer of Documentation
<cprofitt> if Accessibility has pages they want worked on we can add them to the list and the Documentation team (of UBT) will hopefully get them done over June and July
<Pendulum> cprofitt: I'd suggest sending an e-mail to the accessibility list. I'm not 100% up to date to what got discussed at UDS (I wasn't there and by the time I got home from my holiday I was pretty ill so haven't had a chance to fully catch up)
 * cprofitt nods
<cprofitt> will do
<Pendulum> that way if people have an idea of what definitely needs to get done, they can respond
<cprofitt> sorry to hear you were ill
<UndiFineD> it was discussed to get at least a chapter into the ubuntu manual
<cprofitt> UndiFineD: did you get the quiche?
<UndiFineD> its in the oven now
<cprofitt> cool
<Pendulum> mmm... quiche
<UndiFineD> no not too cool,
<cprofitt> I like quiche
#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-15
<hajour> hi all wanted to tell i arrived at home
<hajour> i hope i was enough useful on UDS
<hajour> i go sleeping till tomorrow i am tired goodnight all
<Fudge> hi TheMuso 
<hajour1> i beginning to become very tired i go stop for today till tomorrow all and sleep well for later :)
#ubuntu-accessibility 2012-05-08
<Fudge> AlanBell  do you have the lightdm keypresses to enable unity 2d?
<AlanBell> hi Fudge 
<AlanBell> I will check
<AlanBell> tab space down down return tab
<AlanBell> then enter the password
<AlanBell> that sequence moves to the desktop selector button, selects the second option which is unity2d by default
<AlanBell> and goes back to the password box
<AlanBell> might be a bit different if you have gnome-shell or classic gnome-panel desktop installed
#ubuntu-accessibility 2012-05-09
<Fudge> thanks AlanBell 
<Fudge> i could not see gnome-shell in that screen when i tried it last week
<Fudge> and setting gnome in lightdm.conf didnt laod it either
<Fudge> load
<Fudge> I think because of my hardware unity-3d is default
#ubuntu-accessibility 2012-05-11
<AlanBell> hi
<AlanBell> https://launchpad.net/~andyrock/+archive/unity-a11y
<AlanBell> TheMuso: ^^
#ubuntu-accessibility 2012-05-12
<TheMuso> AlanBell: Thanks.,
#ubuntu-accessibility 2012-05-13
<Fudge> AlanBell  you have ears on?
<AlanBell> hi Fudge, I just got back from UDS
