#ubuntu-translators 2011-03-28
<dpm> morning all
<happyaron> morning
<dpm> heya happyaron, how are you doing?
<happyaron> dpm: fine, thanks, busy but happy, :)
<dpm> this is only work in progress... but look at the Galician, Bosnian, Slovenian and Asturian teams up there, impressive!
<dpm> http://people.canonical.com/~dpm/stats/ubuntu-11.04-translation-stats.html
<dpm> andrejz, good work!
<andrejz> thanks
<andrejz> and that's even before the translation maraton
<andrejz> i guess it will be around 103 % after it :P
<dpm> you'll run out of work!
<dpm> ;)
<andrejz> until ddtp packages exist i won't worry about it :)
<andrejz> also documentation still awaits us.. but it would be boring, if there were no challenges left
<happyaron> I think we can push some changes to ddtp project
<andrejz> in addition it needs to be kept in mind we were already at 99% for 10.10, so most of the work was done on other things not included in these statitics
<happyaron> the debian way is not so efficient, and the launchpad way will make people scared and tired...
<happyaron> and ddtp on launchpad are just suggestions to ddtp debian, that's a bad thing in some way...
<happyaron> software-center relies on ddtp heavily (IIRC), it'll be a great deal of things to be done.
<andrejz> back, empathy crashed on me (running 11.04)
<dpm> happyaron, have you got any plans for improvement in mind?
<andrejz> @happyaron: what do you mean by suggestions?
<andrejz> do ddtp translations get used in ubuntu or do only upstream translations get used?
<dpm> happyaron, nightmonkey can send ddtp translations to debian already, it's just that IIRC, the maintainer upstream was busy at the time to process them
<dpm> and what do you mean that the lp way will make people scared and tired?
<happyaron> for debian, I can read "DDTSS is down" on debian-i18n regularly... and DDTSS needs three people to review every submission (rosetta's translations just count to one). Using the email way is making more noises.
<happyaron> For launchpad, it's a huge project in a single template, which make people feel tired and don't like to continue
<happyaron> we may split the template into more detailed categories and make each template smaller
 * happyaron poor andrejz
<andrejz> i am a victim of empathy bug
<andrejz> excuse me for continious leaving/coming again
<andrejz> happyaron, you worte something ?
<happyaron> andrejz: will send to you via private msg, :)
<andrejz> anyway i was going to say i translated ddtp main and i believe it could easily be seperated in the strings that make sense and thnd the ones that dont
<andrejz> for exmaple
<dpm> happyaron, ok, gotcha
<andrejz> as i already mentioned to happyaron
<andrejz> my experience with ddtp is the following:
<andrejz> ddtp main has 17000 strings 12:43:47
<andrejz> 7000 are either python bindings, libaries for something and obscure x modules
<andrejz> additional 1500 are translations for gnome and kde packages (8 strings per language)
<andrejz> i was planning to do all the package but got frustrated (also by the length of the package - you work the whole day and make a lousy percent or so ?) and also by this advanced strings, like libbrasero, which are utterly useless in my opinion
<andrejz> no user is going to go and look libbrasero
<andrejz> User will go and install brasero and doesn't care for all the libaries it needs, system installs it for him
<andrejz> the same goes for ddtp main universe which i started a couple of days ago
<andrejz> so my suggestion is
<andrejz> at least get all the libaries and phython bindings into some sort of advanced package
<andrejz> I am translating ddtp solo, because i believe many newer membes will be intimidated by sometimes highly technical strigns they don't understand
<andrejz> any additional categories (besides libaries and phython bindings would be nice), but i think this is the absolute minimum
<andrejz> i think about 30-50 % are either a libary or phython binding
<andrejz> any opinions here?
<happyaron> +1 from me
<andrejz> again my technical knowledge is slightly above avereage and i have almost 0 programing / packaging knowledge, so i cannot estimate how difficult would be to implement this
<andrejz> it would be great if somebody from launchpad team could comment on this
<dpm> andrejz, these are all good points, but we need people to be aware of them to even consider working on them. What I would suggest to do is to get a discussion started by sending an e-mail to the launchpad-users list and cc mvo (at) ubuntu (dot) com
<dpm> happyaron, andrejz, in any case http://nightmonkey.ubuntu.hu/ does help
<andrejz> that link is rather usefull, thanks dpm
<dpm> hey translators, if you want to share your experiences, there is a session on how to run translations jams on #ubuntu-classroom in 10 min
<dpm> do come along!
<dpm> :-)
<Andre_Gondim> hi dpm can you help me to solve this bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/743153
<ubot4`> Launchpad bug 743153 in ubuntu-translations "Description of package 'apt-xapian-index' is badly translated to pt_BR (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
<TLE> Andre_Gondim: he's sort of busy right now ^^
<Andre_Gondim> hmmmmmmm, someone may tell me where may I fix it?
<TLE> askhl_: Hey, how is it, do you know where the package descriptions are stored?
<Andre_Gondim> hmmmmm, let me c if I found it
<dpm> Andre_Gondim, yeah, sorry, running an IRC session right now
<Andre_Gondim> yeah I see, dpm ;)
<Andre_Gondim> I find it at https://translations.launchpad.net/ddtp-ubuntu/maverick/+pots/ddtp-ubuntu-main/pt_BR/+translate
<askhl_> TLE: hi
<TLE> askhl_: ah, never mind ;)
<askhl_> TLE: so you don't refer to app-install-data then
<askhl_> which is another one
<askhl_> with package descriptions
<TLE> askhl_: I'm unsure, it was in relation to Andre_Gondim's question
<AJenbo_> dpm, sure
<dpm> hey :)
<dpm> so I'm mostly happy with the output of the stats now. My goal was to keep it simple, but useful. There is now only a bug I need to tackle:
<AJenbo_> Looks realy good, the one i have done just displays a list of packages and the number of missing lines in the terminal as the statistic are generated.
<AJenbo_> posibly "Need review" is more usefull then "Total"
<dpm> yeah, I should probably add it too, but I think at the point I'm generating the data files to be loaded on the page it's not easy to get the number of "Need Review" ones, so I left it for later
<dpm> in any case, if you've got a branch, I can add your feature to the trunk one too
<AJenbo_> dpm, i didn't have time to make my hack preatty and the out put from yours seams to be the same+
<dpm> anyway, what I meant with the bug was that due to the way the raw data is dumped from the LP database, the templates which have got no translation at all are not shown in the output
<dpm> but I think that's not critical for established teams
<dpm> it affects mostly new teams with not many translations
<AJenbo_> how is the dump generated?
<AJenbo_> is to done automatically periodically or manually by some one when the time feels right?
<dpm> it's done automatically with an SQL query against the staging database, which dumps the output in a couple of text files. This happens daily, but the caveat is that the staging database is not synced daily with the production database, so it happens quite often that staging is behind production, meaning that stats from the ul10n-stats tool are behind as well
<dpm> unfortunately there is no easy way to solve it
<AJenbo_> ok that explains it :)
<dpm> the proper solution is to finish the implementation of the lp translations reporting API, and getting rid of the raw data export altogether
<AJenbo_> Yeah, LP-trans could still improve a lot :/
<AJenbo_> There is a real gap betwean people obliviosly making sugestions and the translation team
<dpm> yeah I definitely agree, but I still think it's an awesome tool :-)
<AJenbo_> dpm, I might take a look at your code and see if i can get it to link to the actuall package on LP
<AJenbo_> Yeah we have started using it for smalle updates and package descriptions, in this area it definatly beats oure old methode.
<AJenbo_> Not to mention keeping track of what has changed and needs and update
<dpm> AJenbo_, adding the link to the actual package on the table was the next thing I was aiming to sort out, but I won't have time this week, so if you look at it, that'd be really awesome!
#ubuntu-translators 2011-03-29
<dpm> good morning all
#ubuntu-translators 2011-03-30
<dpm> good morning all
<andrejz> morning
#ubuntu-translators 2011-03-31
<dpm> good morning all
<andrejz> good morning dpm
<andrejz> just writing a blog post about slovenian translation marathon. It should appear on ubuntu planet soon ;)
<dpm> hey andrejz, cool, :-)
<head_victim> Question, if you're translating on launchpad itself, you have multiple people working on the same package or does that confuse launchpad? I want to attack a package (firefox) that has a large number of strings to be translated wiht a few people all at once but don't want to kill it
<dpm> head_victim, no, that doesn't confuse LP, but it might confuse humans :-) You might want to coordinate with the few people who are doing it
<andrejz> head_victim
<andrejz> just be sure you are not working on the same strings, that's it
<andrejz> someone can work on strings 0-100, other on 100-200 and so on
<head_victim> andrejz: so that's not automatically taken care of by launchpad when you pick "untranslated"?
<head_victim> dpm: part of a translation jam ;)
<andrejz> yes, but if too people work on the same strings at the same time they might overwrite other person's work
<head_victim> andrejz: ah ok I might just spread them out then to be safe
<andrejz> for example if i choose untrasnlated firefox strings
<head_victim> This one will be more about just showing people how easy it is to do so they can go off and do it themselves.
<andrejz> launchpad will show me fist 10 untranslated strings in firefox
<andrejz> if anyone else click's on the same link, they will see the same 10 strings
<head_victim> Ah I was hoping that those 10 strings would somehow have been "allocated" so that the next person would automatically get a new set of strings
<andrejz> no it doesn't work like that automatically AFAIK
<head_victim> No worries, glad I checked now :)
<andrejz> only after you click save and continue button strings will be marked as translated
<head_victim> That makes sense
<andrejz> there it is - http://ubuntu-slovenija.blogspot.com/2011/03/schedule-for-slovenian-translation.html
<dpm> andrejz, http://www.facebook.com/ubuntu.translators :-)
<dpm> andrejz, head_victim, you can work concurrently in Launchpad, the only thing is that you'll have to refresh the browser to see the other people's translations if they've done them after you've loaded a page
<artnay> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntuone-control-panel/+bug/746374 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntuone-control-panel/+bug/746370 can you find more? :-)
<ubot4`> Launchpad bug 746374 in ubuntuone-control-panel "Translation difficulties with %(service_name)s variable (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
<artnay> shoudn't rosetta refrain from overwriting translations done in launchpad when doing upstream importing?
<artnay> dpm:
<dpm> artnay, in general yes. If that's not the case, I'd suggest filing a bug or talking to henninge on the #launchpad channel
<artnay> dpm: are some tags used for natty translation(s) in bug reports?
<artnay> ie. natty-i18n
<artnay> not just natty but a release
<artnay> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-sso-client/+bug/746397
<ubot4`> Launchpad bug 746397 in ubuntu-sso-client "Missing translation when unknown user tries to do a review in software-center (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
<artnay> 3rd translation bug report from today...
<dpm> artnay, you don't need to add tags. Just add a bug task for the ubuntu-translations project (btw, good work testing translations and filing reports! :)
<artnay> I mean, if there was some tag which would be recommended for translators to use, it would be easier to track translation bugs
<dpm> artnay, yeah, that's what we do in the ubuntu-translations project in LP. If you add a bug task for it (use the "Also affects project" link on a bug report), we can keep track of them in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-translations/
<artnay> dpm: yeah, done it before
<artnay> my gripe is the UI
<dpm> what UI?
<artnay> try to add ubuntu-translations without knowing the exact wording
<artnay> eg. click the also affects... winnnnnnnno
<artnay> damn logitech...
<dpm> artnay, yeah, but you do know the exact wording now ;-)
<artnay> if I write "translation", "translators" or something, I'll get more than 11 pages of results and none of them is ubuntu-translations
<artnay> even though I search for "ubuntu-translations" :-)
<artnay> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1011999/err-where-is-it.png that's what I mean
<artnay> those are the actual results for "ubuntu-translations"
<artnay> "is there a bug for that?" :-)
<artnay> could +1 for it
<dpm> artnay, there might be, probably at https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad
<artnay> here you go https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/471328
<ubot4`> Launchpad bug 471328 in launchpad "Also affects search error - too many matches (affects: 8) (dups: 3) (heat: 7)" [High,Triaged]
<artnay> well, it's not 1:1 but related
<artnay> seems like all fixes in libwnck have been overwritten by upstream importing - fixes done in rosetta aren't even suggested
<dpm> artnay, please file a bug on https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+filebug and add a task for ubuntu-translations, that's the only way we cant track this
<artnay> dpm: sure, I actually was just looking for henninge first
<artnay> and crying out loud here just to inform other translators and maybe to receive "+1" :-)
<artnay> hi henninge, I was looking for you at #launchpad
<henninge> artnay: Hi!
<artnay> henninge: so, umh, many translations which were fixed in rosetta have been overwritten by upstream imports. the overwritten fixes aren't even suggested anymore.
<artnay> upstream is kind of picky when it comes to Launchpad translations... hence not all fixes have been taken into upstream
<henninge> artnay: which project is that?
<artnay> henninge: for example https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/libwnck/+pots/libwnck/fi/+translate?batch=10&show=all&search=ty%C3%B6tila
<artnay> Current workspace: "%s"
<artnay> it was just a few minutes ago wrongly translated (by upstream, Suggested by Pauli Virtanen on 2007-08-20)
<artnay> then I fixed it 8 minutes ago
<artnay> and it shows as Translated by Jiri GrÃ¶nroos on 2010-03-23
<artnay> and that wasn't even suggested 8 minutes ago
<artnay> so Launchpad somehow remembers I've fixed it, forgots it (and overwrites) during upstream importing
<artnay> now as I fixed it (once again) after upstream importing, I've "reviewed" the non-existent suggestion
<artnay> hopefully you understood a bit :-)
<henninge> artnay: yes, old strings are remembered and re-activated when they are entered again.
<artnay> henninge: shouldn't Launchpad refrain from overwriting?
<henninge> artnay: I am checking right now why it does that.
<artnay> henninge: great, thanks. I'm able to give you more examples as I find them
<artnay> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/gnome-panel/+pots/gnome-panel-2.0/fi/+translate?batch=10&show=all&search=napsauttamalla+t%C3%A4t%C3%A4 that's another example. #176 was changed during maverick cycle but it has been overwritten by upstream import. no suggestion(s) visible.
<henninge> artnay: can you re-enter your translation on that one, please? I just cleared the translation to try something.
<henninge> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/gnome-panel/+pots/gnome-panel-2.0/fi/176/+translate
<artnay> henninge: maybe I can't remember the exact wording since LP tells me "translated/reviewed 1 min ago"
<artnay> exact wording from maverick cycle, I mean
<artnay> henninge: so it has been changed now. can you somehow force/schedule upstream importing for Finnish gnome-panel-2.0 / libwnck so we'll see what happens
<artnay> I could file a bug about it and get back in touch after the next import (if the problem still persists)
<henninge> artnay: Are you sure taht the translation was overwritten *today* or did you only notice it today?
<artnay> henninge: never said anything about today. I guess it has been overwritten earlier, not today
<henninge> <artnay> it was just a few minutes ago wrongly translated (by upstream, Suggested by Pauli Virtanen on 2007-08-20)
<artnay> I'm on ati and need fglrx (powersaving), that's why I'm late testing natty.
<artnay> henninge: yes, I meant it was translated that way (from 2007) and only changed a few minutes ago by me
<henninge> ah, I see
<henninge> artnay: https://translations.qastaging.launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/libwnck/+pots/libwnck/fi/+translate?batch=10&show=all&search=ty%C3%B6tila
<henninge> artnay: Looks like it was overwritten in January.
<henninge> (qastaging has a slightly older database)
<henninge> artnay: we had a but that caused that in January.
<henninge> See dpm's mails to the translators list.
<artnay> henninge: ok, good catch. I guess the problem has been solved (for now). thank you for co-operation.
<artnay> didn't know about qastaging
#ubuntu-translators 2011-04-01
<dpm> morning all
<TLE_02> good morning
<dpm> hey TLE_02 :)
<Mirv> hmm, is there a bug report about cd boot menu having no translations at all?
<Mirv> well, I reported it anyway at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gfxboot-theme-ubuntu/+bug/747090 since at least under that package there wasn't
<ubot4`> Launchpad bug 747090 in gfxboot-theme-ubuntu (Ubuntu) "No translations in natty (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
<dpm> hey Mirv, not that I know of (it was working for me last time I tried it). You might want to ask at #ubuntu-installer
<Mirv> can someone else of you try the beta before I go there?
<Mirv> I have the amd64 beta running in qemu
<dpm> Mirv, could you add a task for the 'ubuntu-translations' project using the "Also affects project" link? This way we can track it as a translations problem
<Mirv> yep
<dpm> thanks :)
 * Mirv is waiting for the unity upload to offer Search/Shortcuts strings to be translated
<Mirv> apparently soon after beta if the fix that I saw fixes it
<Mirv> ...and "See %d more results"
<Mirv> same result btw with i386 image
<artnay> dpm: yesterday we thought with henningen that overwrites were due the January "but".
<artnay> dpm: just realized that the same has happened with chromium within last few weeks, see these pics from yesterday: http://i.imgur.com/w0LMD.png http://i.imgur.com/HcOCt.png
<artnay> so something has overwritten the changes made during the last 1,5 months
<artnay> dpm: just to let you know, I've informed henninge as well
<artnay> don't really know if tassini has made some oops or what
<artnay> hi henninge
<henninge> Hi artnay!
<henninge> HI dpm!
<dpm> hey henninge!
<henninge> Let me finish something else here first ...
<henninge> ok
<henninge> artnay: that is a product, the situation is different
<henninge> chromium, I mean
<artnay> henninge: true but I wasn't sure if it's about LP (affecting ubuntu, too) or if it's an oops made by fabio tassin
<artnay> let's try to get the name right... fabien tassin!
<artnay> I have a schedule, will be back in 5 hours. I'll talk to fta if he's around still then.
<henninge> artnay: ok
<henninge> I was trying to look up the bug about the projects
<henninge> bug 740225
<ubot4`> Launchpad bug 740225 in launchpad "The differences between New and Translated for upstreams was removed (affects: 1) (heat: 31)" [Undecided,Won't fix] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740225
<henninge> artnay: fta is subscribed to that bug
<henninge> (I think he "noticed" it)
<andres_kain> Hi, a bit new here... I'm registered to launchpad can I start to submit suggestions or do I have to go through registering my email?
<andres_kain> to the spanish email list I mean... and what is rosetta? apart from the stone...
<andres_kain> OK sorry found the answer.
<andres_kain> it was in the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuSpanishTranslators first two lines.
<andres_kain> yes I can.
<andres_kain> sorry!
#ubuntu-translators 2011-04-03
<Daniel0108> hi
#ubuntu-translators 2012-03-26
<yurchor> Hi! Does anybody know what is the status of Blender translation on LP (https://translations.launchpad.net/blender ). There are no LP marks in Blender 2.62 translations. Are the LP translations used by upstream?
<kelemengabor> dpm: hi, looks like ubuntu-desktop (and language-selector) now depends on im-switch, should I reopen bug #612499, or file a new one?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 612499 in im-switch (Ubuntu) "im-switch is not internationalised" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/612499
<twobottux> Launchpad bug 612499 in im-switch "im-switch is not internationalised" [Unknown,Fix released]
<twobottux> Launchpad bug 612499 in im-switch "im-switch is not internationalised" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/612499
<dpm> hi elky, would it be possible to remove twobottux from the channel? Thanks!
<dpm> hi kelemengabor, looking...
<dpm> kelemengabor, hm, that's a bit of a mess. The im-switch contacted me a while ago to migrate to im-config in Ubuntu. I got him in touch with pitti and pointed him to how to do the migration, but it seems he's not really pushed for it. Feel free to reopen the bug with a comment.
<elky> dpm, you can do the actions, i'm not on the access list for here. /msg chanserv op #ubuntu-translators dpm
<dpm> elky, how can I do it?
<elky> dpm, first: /msg chanserv op #ubuntu-translators dpm
<dpm> ok, I believe I've done that
<dpm> but didn't see any visible effect
<elky> hrm. I'll go find a freenode staffer
<elky> Myrtti, twobottux is no longer required. dpm's access list entry looks mangled
<dpm> thanks elky
<Myrtti> I see where the problem is
<elky> well, not only looks, he tried to op and cant
<elky> there's no * before "dpm" in the ident
<Myrtti> you've been granted access flags by hostmask, not nickserv account
<Myrtti> and it's been done when you've run your client on a system with identd
<elky> that too
<elky> Myrtti, for now the most important thing is to get twobottux out so it doesn't spam.
<elky> dpm, can you try the same command as before? it should work now
<dpm> it seems to be doing the same. All I got is the following line on my client:
<dpm> >chanserv< op #ubuntu-translators dpm
<dpm> (I'm using xchat-gnome)
<elky> Myrtti, :(
<elky> we just need someone to be op to do /mode +b twobottux!*@*
<Myrtti> elky: new staffdom poses some delay too :-| never done this kind of stuff before and freenode staff isn't on the access list so can't help there much either
<elky> yeah, after this i'll get the ircc to get themselves added to the list to make future requests more responsive
<elky> dpm hasn't exactly done much op stuff before, so it's all new to him, and i think most of the others on the access list have moved on
<dpm> yeah, I can confirm that. I can't remember who the previous op was, but he definitely moved on. At the time he chose not to give me op status, and I haven't need it until now, but anything that would make future changes more agile would be great. Thanks!
<elky> dpm, thanks for being patient with us. it's just one of those things where you don't know there's a hole until it rains ;)
<dpm> elky, no worries, I really appreciate your help :)
<sagaci> dpm, just a side question, do you use xchat-gnome since the translations are actually used?
<dpm> hi sagaci, I'm not sure I understand the question. I've used xchat-gnome for ages, and afaik, it's always been translated
<dpm> especially as I was the upstream translator :)
<sagaci> yeah, I just mean in contrast to the usual xchat, which doesn't display upstream translations
<dpm> sagaci, ah, I didn't know xchat didn't load translations. Is this a known bug?
<sagaci> I think I've reported it
<sagaci> I'll check
<dpm> ok
<dpm> in any case, now that I understand the question, the answer is because I find xchat-gnome to be nicer, to integrate better in the desktop, and while we don't include an irc client by default, it's the recommended one
<Myrtti> I don't know who recommends it - I'm pretty sure no hardcore IRC user does ;-P atleast that was the general consensus few years ago
<sagaci> yep, I prefer xchat but it's an annoying bug to not have it show translations
<sagaci> GUI IRC clients
<dpm> Myrtti, the idea was not to recommend it to hardcore users, who will probably use irssi or will be able to make their own choice. But rather to recommend it to regular users, to which xchat-gnome was more friendly in terms of usability. There was never an official recommendation, rather we tended to recommend it when running Ubuntu Open Week and such events, although nowadays we probably recommend webchat or Lernid (when it used to work :)
<AlanBell> hi dpm, I am on the IRC Council and Myrtti has asked me to help with sorting a few things here
<sagaci> dpm, I thought I filed it but not showing results
<sagaci> I'll file it
<kelemengabor> sagaci: xchat shows up translated for me, and it ever did
<sagaci> en_AU isn't
<kelemengabor> maybe your translation is not in the upstream release yet, but this is no surprise given that the upstream project is pretty much dead
<elky> AlanBell, it's likely that it's run off a machine that someone else connects from, the ban isn't necessary now that the bot won't join
<elky> at least it shouldn't re-join, a nick ban would be enough if it does
<elky> and thanks :)
<elky> dpm, all done :)
<sagaci> kelemengabor, so there's no real fix?
<kelemengabor> well... I can't think of one, sorry :\
<dpm> thanks elky, Myrtti and AlanBell :)
<elky> dpm, things should be easier for the next time now too. you're welcome :)
<Myrtti> that makes me happy
<dpm> cool :)
<Myrtti> seeing freenode staff mask on the access list is always a relief on sore eyes
<elky> hehe yeah, it helps lots
<Myrtti> since my work here is done, time to close some excess irssi windows
<elky> and with that, i bid you all goodnight
<Myrtti> until next time...
<Mirv> pretty happy with the results of my translation salvaging work
<artnay> Mirv: job well done
#ubuntu-translators 2012-03-27
<TLE> kelemengabor: hallo
<kelemengabor> hi TLE
<TLE> I was just looking at the testing page for the Natty lang packs, the testing is now done
<TLE> I think we agreed that the stuff that your bad review was not a regression and hence the pack could be tested, but could I persuade you to check whether any of the things mentioned in the german test report are also broken in yours
<TLE> because at least some of those things look like regressions
<kelemengabor> well... for Banshee, those strings IIRC come from the database itself which is populated at creation time - so if they were not translated then, these will remain the same
<kelemengabor> some time ago I met this same problem, and took a while to figure out the working of this :)
<kelemengabor> the partial help is the same thing I saw
<kelemengabor> the gwitchit thing... I think the untranslated window title is a bug, fixed since Natty but not backported
<TLE> about banshee permit me to say, aha, seems a wierd design though to put localized strings in a database, but ok
<TLE> ok, so likely no regressions in that report either
<kelemengabor> the missing help topic is not a translation problem, probably an upstream bug
<TLE> yes
<kelemengabor> no, not really. only things that were buggy before
<artnay> any idea if the KDE langpacks will be updated to 4.8(.1) before 12.04 release? bug 945560
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 945560 in Ubuntu Translations "Precise's KDE translation templates on Launchpad are not updated for KDE SC 4.8" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/945560
<dpm> artnay, I did ask the Kubuntu devs and they said they'd do it. Have they not yet?
<dpm> if not, I'd recommend asking on #kubuntu-devel
<artnay> dpm: roger
#ubuntu-translators 2012-03-28
<dpm> good morning all
<dpm> hi all, could someone tell me if going to http://91.189.93.101/ you see a localized help page?
<TLE> dpm: it triggers a download and it isn't localized
<dpm> TLE, hm, weird. What is it trying to download? Have you got language preferences set in your browser? And does http://91.189.93.101/index.html.da load for you?
<TLE> it is downloading a page that looks as if it is a html page with the desktop guide, non localized or styled
<TLE> that link does the same
<TLE> let me check on the language preferences
<dpm> which browser are you using?
<TLE> chrome
<TLE> I would assume that the language preferences are set, the gnome release notes loads the danish version
<dpm> hm, strange, the direct link works for me in Firefox and Chromium
<dpm> TLE, there is a <html lang=> attribute on the page it downloads. Is it at least set to "da"?
<TLE> let med check
<TLE> no wait sorry, the long link loads
<TLE> and it has lang set to da
<TLE> maybe we just don't have anything to localized
<TLE> if I switch to german it shows something in german
<TLE> so that seems to be tha case
<TLE> but the short link still downloads
<artnay> dpm: works for me
<dpm> thanks for testing TLE. I don't quite understand why the short link does not work... I'll have to investigate
<kelemengabor> dpm: works for me too
<dpm> artnay, kelemengabor, thanks. Does the short link work for you guys?
<artnay> dpm: just the ip? yes, it gives me the localized version
<kelemengabor> I tried the short link
<artnay> I'm using chrome as well
<kelemengabor> that works
<dpm> it might have to do with the .da extension
<dpm> I'm using the same method to load localized pages as the browser home page in Firefox
<artnay> dpm: do you plan to update the localizations before nonlangpack freeze?
<artnay> dpm: could be helpful for ubuntu-docs translators
<dpm> I remember the .pl and .tr versions had problems in the past, as the server was interpreting them as Perl files and something else
<dpm> artnay, that was the idea, but I'm not sure I'll have time. I want this to be fully automated, and I asked the docs team a few days ago on the mailing list to use automatic exports, so that translations are committed daily, but they haven't come back to me yet
<TLE> dpm, kelemengabor: Do you have a few secs to talk about the natty lang packs
<dpm> TLE, sure
<kelemengabor> sure
<TLE> 2 sec
<TLE> ahh actually 2 min, I just got an email on the matter
<TLE> I'll get back to you
<dpm> ok
<kelemengabor> dpm: what's up with those?
<dpm> kelemengabor, with those what?
<TLE> ok the problem is that the latest natty language packs are not very good, major problems with the docs
<kelemengabor> dpm: natty langpacks
<TLE> two languages have tested
<dpm> kelemengabor, I think you wanted to ping TLE, he's the one who wants to talk about them :)
<TLE> so the issue is whether these problems are regressions, which will determine if we release them
<kelemengabor> no much love for natty anymore
<dpm> TLE, what are the major problems with the docs?
<kelemengabor> dpm: argh, I'm a genius :\
<dpm> np :)
<TLE> from discussion with kelemengabor it seems that they are not regressions, but I'm currently in dialog with the german tester as well, will get back to you when I know what the verdict is there
<dpm> TLE, yeah, that sounds like a good plan. As the one who mentioned the problem, it makes sense that he checks if it's actually a regression. It could also well be that the docs upload previous to the langpack export was done without pulling the latest LP translations
<TLE> yeah, but he is actually not able to test for regressions him self, but he has asked for feedback from other translators
<dpm> ah cool
<kelemengabor> dpm: as I wrote on the QA page, the docs sucks because of bug #794426
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 794426 in Ubuntu Translations "Can't open help because of XML error in user-guide.xml" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/794426
<kelemengabor> and probably always did... so no regression here
<dpm> kelemengabor, so does the bug affect all languages with low coverage, or only Danish?
<kelemengabor> dpm: its not only about coverage (that too), but basically yes
<kelemengabor> the other problem is that there is a legal.xml which is included from a lot of pages, but not translated to any languages
<kelemengabor> so the wrong linking strikes even those who have high coverage
<kelemengabor> http://people.ubuntu.com/~kelemeng/pix/langpackup.png
<kelemengabor> like this
<dpm> bummer. I wonder why no one other than the Danish guys complained about this before. I would have thought the Spanish translators and others with complete translations would notice
<kelemengabor> as a result, even those languages with high coverage have pages that do not appear translated
<kelemengabor> and of course, fixing manually this broken link resulted in a perfectly translated help :\
<dpm> kelemengabor, so do you know if this still affects precise (i.e. are we still using cdbs + debhelper.mk to build the docs)?
<kelemengabor> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/oneiric/ubuntu-docs/oneiric/view/head:/debian/rules
<kelemengabor> this one does...
<kelemengabor> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/ubuntu-docs/precise/view/head:/debian/rules
<kelemengabor> this too
<kelemengabor> but... IIRC there is something else in the toolchain that makes this not appear anymore
<TLE> going to the lab now, get back to you later
<kelemengabor> dpm: ah got it, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/cdbs/precise/revision/111
<kelemengabor> the buggy code part was dropped after natty :)
<dpm> ah, pheeew! :)
<dpm> thanks for investigating
<kelemengabor> indeed :)
<kelemengabor> so, what do we say about #794426? I'm thinking about wontfix for g-u-d and fix released for u-t and cdbs...
<trijntje> Is there anything I can do to get some attention to bug 957746  ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 957746 in ubuntu-defaults-builder (Ubuntu) "ubuntu-defaults-builder: setting language does not take effect" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/957746
<dpm> kelemengabor, agreed. Pity that we haven't got a better way to mark that the bug is still present in an earlier version, but 'Won't fix' is the right status, +1
<dpm> trijntje, I'd suggest you talk to pitti on #ubuntu-desktop, as he's the maintainer
<kelemengabor> dpm: explaining in a comment can work though :)
<dpm> :)
<trijntje> dpm: thanks, I'll try that!
<dpm> trijntje, cool, let me know how it works out
<dpm> I've added a comment to the bug too
<artnay> are some titles hardcoded into ubuntu-docs? for example the title "Dash" at http://91.189.93.101/unity-introduction.html doesn't exist on ubuntu-docs template
<artnay> this is problematic since we've translated dash as "Unity menu", now we have both dash and "unity menu" in docs
<dpm> artnay, I'm not sure. I can see it translated on http://91.189.93.101/unity-introduction.html.es
<dpm> Or http://91.189.93.101/unity-introduction.html.sl
<dpm> is that what you mean?
<kelemengabor> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric/+source/ubuntu-docs/+pots/ubuntu-help/fi/2435/+translate
<kelemengabor> maybe this is it?
<artnay> dpm: yes
<artnay> kelemengabor: could be although the current page is missing "the", it's only "dash" (which is non-existent on template)
<kelemengabor> artnay: interesting, because it is translated for me like "The Dash"
<kelemengabor> it's time to ask dpm where did he got the original and the translations :)
<artnay> kelemengabor: http://i.imgur.com/LGiyW.png
<kelemengabor> artnay: the latest&greatest upstream has The Dash too: https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-docs/precise/+pots/ubuntu-help/fi/2555/+translate
<trijntje> dpm: I'll try building a package with 'nl complete', but as far as I know the example package uses 'de complete', and also has the same bug
<dpm> trijntje, ah, ok. Feel free to comment on the bug and mark it as 'New' again
<dpm> Gwaihir, were you guys hit by that bug when you created the Italian ISO? ^^
<artnay> kelemengabor: true, maybe http://91.189.93.101/unity-introduction.html uses natty translations for some parts
<dpm> artnay, kelemengabor, I've got a checkout of lp:ubuntu-docs/precise, that's where I'm generating the localized versions from
<dpm> I suspect that the docs team did not update the template in the Ubuntu source package in LP
<kelemengabor> dpm: I don't have permission to mark #794426 as wontfix in Ubuntu, could you help me out
<kelemengabor> ?
<dpm> bug 794426
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 794426 in gnome-user-docs (Ubuntu) "Localized help files not correctly loaded because of wrong symlinking" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/794426
<dpm> kelemengabor, I don't have the permissions, either. So I'd recommend asking on #ubuntu-bugs or leaving it as confirmed for the bugsquad or the desktop team to update its status
<dpm> ok, uploaded an updated template on https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/ubuntu-docs/+imports
<kelemengabor> okay, I'll leave it for now
<Gwaihir> dpm, which bug?
<dpm> Gwaihir, bug 957746
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 957746 in ubuntu-defaults-builder (Ubuntu) "ubuntu-defaults-builder: setting language does not take effect" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/957746
<Gwaihir> dpm, nope, I do not recall this problem
<Gwaihir> have to check with xdatap, but I didn't see that bug
<dpm> ok, thanks!
<kelemengabor> dpm: is it normal that the last data point is 03-20 here: http://91.189.93.77/stats/precise/hu
<kelemengabor> or 21
<dpm> kelemengabor, good catch, I've noticed it too just today. I had to re-deploy the whole webapp when the previous cloud instance died during maintenance, and when I set it up, I made a mistake when writing the cron job that updates stats. But no worries, all data is safe and I'll be updating it this evening :)
<kelemengabor> thanks :)
<trijntje> dpm: bug 957746 was caused by the use of unetbootin to put the image on a usb stick
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 957746 in ubuntu-defaults-builder (Ubuntu) "ubuntu-defaults-builder: setting language does not take effect" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/957746
<dpm> thanks for the update trijntje
<dpm> kelemengabor, ok added a todo item to recover the data on the stats server - https://trello.com/board/translations-team/4f621c87861db54230b9ca39
<dpm> will do it in a few hours
<kelemengabor> dpm: this reminded me that I wanted to do something this week - added it :)
<dpm> kelemengabor, ah, cool, thanks :)
<dpm> kelemengabor, ah, your action reminds me I wanted to show you something else, just a sec...
<dpm> kelemengabor, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/903993/
<kelemengabor> yay!
<dpm> I know you'd like it :-)
<dpm> *knew
<kelemengabor> added another task to myself
<dpm> :)
<kelemengabor> and now back to some release-notes... ;)
<dpm> :)
<artnay> is there a reason why translations from "Launchpad Translations Administrators" are preferred over translations that have been done (read: fixed) later by users? this happens in ubuntu-docs natty -> oneiric -> precise transition and the reason seems to be license compatibility... for example https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-docs/precise/+pots/ubuntu-help/fi/+translate?batch=10&show=all&search=Est%C3%A4%C3%A4+muita+henkil%C3%B6it%C3%A4+k%
<artnay> it's pretty frustrating to fix all those after they've already been fixed in natty/oneiric.
<artnay> and +details page doesn't offer any way to filter translations made by LTA: https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-docs/precise/+pots/ubuntu-help/fi/+details
<dpm> artnay, looking...
<artnay> dpm: thanks
<dpm> artnay, sorry, it might take me a while, but I'll look into it today
<artnay> dpm: no hurry, I just leave it like that for a while. will fix it later.
<dpm> artnay, I cannot see anything in the link you gave me. Is this the correct link? -> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-docs/precise/+pots/ubuntu-help/fi/+translate?batch=10&show=all&search=Est%C3%A4%C3%A4+muita+henkil%C3%B6it%C3%A4+k%
<artnay> dpm: try this https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-docs/precise/+pots/ubuntu-help/fi/+translate?batch=10&show=all&search=Prevent+other+people+from+using+your+desktop+when+you+go+away+from+your+computer.
<dpm> I think the reason why translations in LP are being overridden is because the docs team is importing PO files from the bzr branch, but does not export them often. So what I believe it happens is:
<dpm> - Someone fixes a translation in LP
<dpm> - An out of date translation is uploaded/committed in the docs package/upstream project
<dpm> - Source package uploads/commits have got preference over translations done in Launchpad
<dpm> - Translations in Launchpad are demoted to suggestions
<artnay> dpm: that would suggest that translation sharing isn't working, no? the upstream package should have the updated translation. if the docs team doesn't incorporate the fixed translations into source package before creating a new branch, this happens, right?
<dpm> translations sharing is working. The problem happens when there is an upload or commit of an outdated translation, which then takes precedence, as LP thinks the outdated one is the current
<artnay> dpm: right, I hope the -docs team will take a note
<ttoine> hi
<ttoine> is there someone from the french ubuntu translation team ?
<dpm> ttoine, if no one answers, you might also want to try on #ubuntu-locoteams
<ttoine> dpm, thanks
<dpm> artnay, kelemengabor, ok the ubuntu-docs template in Ubuntu is now in sync with the one upstream. Now "The Dash" translations appear on https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/ubuntu-docs/+pots/ubuntu-help/ca/2509/+translate and
<dpm> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/ubuntu-docs/+pots/ubuntu-help/ca/2511/+translate
<dpm> With the help from the docs team I can now set up http://91.189.93.101/ to be updated daily with new translations. If anyone needs a more frequent refresh, feel free to send me PO files and I can then refresh the HTML pages with the new translations
<artnay> dpm: will you do that tomorrow or /now/? :-)
<artnay> dpm: you can call it a day now, this is a great addition
<dpm> artnay, I'll set it up tomorrow, as today translations are already up to date :) Then next translations export happens some time tomorrow morning.
<dpm> but as I say, if anyone has got PO files that you'd like me to generate HTML for in between daily updates, feel free to send them my way
<roadmr> kelemengabor: hey, are you around? :)
<kelemengabor> roadmr: yes
<roadmr> kelemengabor: we got some trouble with setting up i18n support in checkbox-qt, follow-up from last week
<roadmr> kelemengabor: I'm calling bindtextdomain("checkbox","");
<roadmr> kelemengabor: we're just not too sure about leaving the localedir parameter blank, is this OK?
<kelemengabor> hm, good question
<kelemengabor> IIRc I never saw it empty
<roadmr> kelemengabor: hehe :) so on local tests (i.e. I put a test .mo file in /usr/share/locale-langpack/en_CA/LC_MESSAGES/checkbox.mo and run *from my branch*), then it picks up the translations OK
<roadmr> kelemengabor: if OTOH I build, then install a package, and put the test .mo in /usr/share/locale/en_CA/LC_MESSAGES/checkbox.mo, then it *doesn't* pick them up
<roadmr> kelemengabor: however, the Python portion of the code *does* pick up all the translations, so I'm thinking it has to do with our call to bindtextdomain
<roadmr> btw, ctf here is the one who found this problem; I was happy to see it work in the source branch, but he actually tested a package, smart thing to do since it fails :(
<kelemengabor> well, then don't do that
<kelemengabor> http://www.gnu.org/software/gettext/manual/gettext.html#Triggering says it has to be there, but does not speak about what happens otherwise
<roadmr> kelemengabor: hehe :) makes sense :)
<roadmr> kelemengabor: for instance, unity-2d points that to their INSTALL_DIR and some other stuff
<kelemengabor> usually, it is $datadir/locale
<roadmr> kelemengabor: I see the checkbox .mo files in /usr/share/locale, I could try arbitrarily pointing it there but I want to make sure I do the right thing
<kelemengabor> that's appreciated :)
<roadmr> kelemengabor: btw, thanks so much for all the pointers on getting intltool working with the .cpp files; with the Makevars magic and the POTFILES.in thing, it worked great :) (now the problem is in *my* code heh)
<kelemengabor> the problems is that I don't know much about Qt myself
<roadmr> yes, the build infrastructure is a bit crazy, so I don't have stuff like automake/autoconf and so on
<roadmr> basically I just qmake; make
<roadmr> prior to dh_build
<kelemengabor> roadmr: one more thing, I have checked out your branch, and noticed that there are some strings marked for translation with tr() in qt/frontend/qtfront.cpp, and you do not pass this function to the XGETTEXT_OPTIONS variable in Makevars
<roadmr> kelemengabor: oh! the branch we're testing replaces that with checkboxTr and catches a few more stray strings; we were just testing before merging to trunk
<kelemengabor> cool
<roadmr> kelemengabor: ok so if I arbitrarily set localedir to /usr/share/ it works, but I'm not too happy with it :/
<kelemengabor> don't worry, many packages do so... *usually* they do not break :)
<roadmr> kelemengabor: ok, so we'll try that as a workaround and try to figure out the right way (tm) later
<kelemengabor> also, why is it necessary to define custom translation functions and not to use stock ones?
<roadmr> kelemengabor: by default, Qt uses Qt::Translate (or somesuch), but that doesn't pick up gettext message catalogs; it uses Qt's own l18n mechanisms
<kelemengabor> oh
<roadmr> kelemengabor: they provide a mechanism to replace those calls with a custom function, it's the approach I've seen for Qt apps that need access to gettext catalogs (unity-2d and vlc; admittedly a pretty small sample)
<kelemengabor> then it makes sense, thanks
<roadmr> kelemengabor: further, the replacement function can't just be "gettext" (which would be easy) because the parameters qmake puts in place are different; so a wrapper is needed. But if you look at our wrapper, it's very thin, so no much complexity added
 * roadmr is no expert either; learned everything about i18n in the past few days :)
<roadmr> are .mo files cached somewhere? we tried removing our .mo file and we're still seeing the translated messages %)
<roadmr> never mind, we found the problem :) a stray .mo file was getting picked up.
#ubuntu-translators 2012-03-29
<dpm> hi kelemengabor1, are you around?
<kelemengabor1> dpm: yup
<kelemengabor1> good morning boss :)
<dpm> lol
<dpm> kelemengabor1, on the yelp-xsl template, its translations need to be put in the package rather than on language packs, right?
<kelemengabor1> absolutely
<kelemengabor1> its the translation of one xml file
<kelemengabor1> IIRC
<dpm> ok, I'll disable the langpack checkbox on https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/yelp-xsl/+pots/yelp-xsl/+edit
<kelemengabor1> (disable it, disable it!)
<dpm> done
<dpm> ok, and added it to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NonLanguagePackTranslationDeadline too
<artnay> dpm: hi, how is the syncing of ubuntu-docs translations to http://91.189.93.101/ progressing?
<dpm> artnay, we're not yet there, as it proved to be more difficult than expected. The pages are up to date, but translations still aren't
<artnay> dpm: that's ok since yelp's content in English doesn't seem to be up-to-date. at least your site will help a bit.
<dpm> artnay, ok, try now, Finnish should be up to date as of the Launchpad export this morning around 7:00 http://91.189.93.101/
<artnay> dpm: seems to work now, thanks!
<dpm> cool :)
<artnay> dpm: I don't know if it's the template or what but once again I've found lots of missing sentences/strings. for example http://91.189.93.101/unity-introduction.html - ... "and gives you quick access to the applications" ... - "Learn more about the launcher." - "Learn more about the dash." don't exist in template
<artnay> and thus they appear in English
<artnay> ouch, there are lots of those in different sections
<dpm> artnay, yeah, I noticed that too, and it's because the template was not up to date, so I updated the template myself and imported it into Launchpad. However, it will still take a while to get imported. You can track the status here:
<dpm> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/ubuntu-docs/+imports
<dpm> The English strings you see were changes made yesterday, as far as I can tell. Remember that the string freeze was delayed until today, so the template will not be stable/up to date until at some point today
<artnay> dpm: ah, I guess I missed the changed freeze date. at least someone else figured this out, great.
<dpm> artnay, ok, the template in Launchpad is now up to date, and it shows the strings you mentioned:
<dpm> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/ubuntu-docs/+pots/ubuntu-help/fi/+translate?batch=10&show=all&search=and+gives+you+quick+access+to+the+applications
<dpm> enjoy ;)
<artnay> if you go to system settings -> theme, are "Hight contrast" and "Hight contrast (reverse)" untranslated? nothing on LP or gnome bugzilla: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=high+contrast
<kelemengabor1> artnay: IIRC, a few days ago they were
<artnay> when one translates ubuntu-help, i18n/l10n bugs will be found :^
<artnay> kelemengabor1: in English?
<kelemengabor1> yes
<dpm> kelemengabor1, do you know where these strings are translatable, if they are at all?
<kelemengabor1> dpm: http://l10n.gnome.org/POT/gnome-themes-standard.gnome-3-4/gnome-themes-standard.gnome-3-4.hu.po
<kelemengabor1> in theory, they should be okay...
<dpm> hm...
<dpm> but not in langpacks?
<dpm> themes/Adwaita/index.theme.in
<dpm> do we support .theme files in langpacks?
<kelemengabor1> dpm: AFAIK not, because they are not .desktop files
<dpm> I can't see them translated in Catalan, though they are upstream. However, I don't know when we finished the translation, so it might be that the package is not up to date. Perhaps another package to add to the NonLanguagePackDeadline page?
<kelemengabor1> dpm: my po file has a po-revision-date from LAST march, not this one, so...
<artnay> yes, 2011 in Finnish as well
<dpm> So it seems translations are not loaded. artnay, would you mind filing a bug and adding a task for ubuntu-translations?
<artnay> dpm: I'll do it later today
<dpm> cool, thanks
<artnay> dpm: against g-c-c?
<dpm> and feel free to report anything else you see, as it's really useful
<dpm> artnay, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-themes-standard
<dpm> kelemengabor1, http://91.189.93.77/stats/precise/hu is now up to date and back to daily updates. I'll take care of adding the missing data in between later
<kelemengabor1> thanks!
<TLE> dpm: FYI, I may be a little late for the meeting
<TLE> have to go now
<andrejz> dpm, i am gonna be afk, can you ping me when the meeting starts
<dpm> andrejz, sure
<dpm> brb, rebooting...
<artnay> kelemengabor: in case you're interested - bug 968290
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 968290 in gnome-themes-standard (Ubuntu) "System settings -> Appearance -> Theme entries don't appear translated" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/968290
<twobottux> Launchpad bug 968290 in gnome-themes-standard "System settings -> Appearance -> Theme entries don't appear translated" [Undecided,New]
<twobottux> Launchpad bug 968290 in gnome-themes-standard "System settings -> Appearance -> Theme entries don't appear translated" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/968290
<artnay> dpm: as promised, bug 968290
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 968290 in gnome-themes-standard (Ubuntu) "System settings -> Appearance -> Theme entries don't appear translated" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/968290
<twobottux> Launchpad bug 968290 in gnome-themes-standard "System settings -> Appearance -> Theme entries don't appear translated" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/968290
<twobottux> Launchpad bug 968290 in gnome-themes-standard "System settings -> Appearance -> Theme entries don't appear translated" [Undecided,New]
<dpm> thanks artnay :)
<artnay> dpm: but "(default)" doesn't exist in gnome-themes-standard
<dpm> argh, twobottux is back :/
<dpm> elky, do you think you could help us kicking it out of the channel again?
<dpm> kelemengabor, andrejz, ok, hangout started
<dpm> kelemengabor, you might want to try to hang up and re-join
<kelemengabor> artnay: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/gnome-control-center/precise/view/head:/debian/patches/04_new_appearance_settings.patch#L1326
<artnay> kelemengabor: yeah, of course they've been hardcoded. also, "%s <small><i>(default)</i></small>"
<kelemengabor> artnay: that too. I have pointed that out too in the bug
<kelemengabor> let's hope there is not many more of these :)
<kelemengabor> (of course there is :P)
<artnay> kelemengabor: you were faster, I was just going to change the project
<artnay> that (default) made me actually ask if I should file it against g-c-c
<artnay> is baobab in English for you?
<trijntje> artnay: yes
<elky> amithkk, can you reconfigure the twobottux so it doesn't join here, we have ubottu here now. thanks for the loan of the bot.
#ubuntu-translators 2012-03-30
<andrejz> hello dpm!
<andrejz> do you have time for the bug report template?
<andrejz> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Universe_Translations_in_LP
<dpm> hi andrejz, good morning :)
<dpm> andrejz, probably not today, but might have some over the weekend
<andrejz> i just need a starting point and then maybe i will be able to continue myself. I am not sure about the technicalities
<andrejz> so i am not sure what to put in
<dpm> andrejz, ah, wait, I can probably send you an e-mail with some details, give me a minute
<andrejz> that would be great
<dpm> andrejz, ok, I found the instructions and saw that it wouldn't take me too long, so I've just added them on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Universe_Translations_in_LP - I've updated my action on Trello, so it's over to you now :)
<andrejz> ok, i guess i will manually copy and paste this text into a bug report for each package and then add those to the wiki
<dpm> andrejz, I've noticed gdm is on the list. I'm not sure I'd add it, as I'm not too sure how well maintained it is now that we use lightdm
<andrejz> also chromium is already translatable, isn't it?
<andrejz> seems to be
<andrejz> https://translations.launchpad.net/chromium-browser
<dpm> andrejz, yes, but that one definitely needs to be removed from the list, as it doesn't use gettext and we cannot ship its translations in language packs :(
<andrejz> currently launchpad package search are timing out on me but i will try to get it mostly done over the weekend and deal with additionally added packages early next week
<artnay> andrejz: chromium's translations aren't maintained (on LP) anymore. I don't know where the translations are being done, probably Google's translators take care of them. see http://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=55788
<artnay> https://launchpad.net/chromium-browser should mention that the translations from LP won't be used. or the translations should be disabled. I see tens of languages are still being translated... for no good reason.
<artnay> really waste of effort
<dpm> artnay, that bug date is previous to chromium being translatable in Launchpad. Translations in Launchpad were set up by a community member, but unfortunately he's moved on until then. They can be used in the Ubuntu Chromium package, so it makes sense to have them there, but there is no one that takes care to send them upstream, as it used to happen in the past
<artnay> dpm: but the latest reply from evan isn't.
<artnay> dpm: and I'm not even sure if the translations are being used in ubuntu's current chromium packages.
<dpm> artnay, the latest reply from evan does not offer any context at all
<dpm> I've just pinged the current chromium maintainer to make sure, let's see if we can find out more...
<artnay> dpm: and the dates at https://translations.launchpad.net/chromium-browser don't suggest the template is even maintained anymore.
<andrejz> i think in general it would be a good idea to announce this changes
<andrejz> there was a big announcement when chromium was available for translations in LP but now when it seems it's not being sent upstream anymore it wasn't really clear (or at least I didn't know it until artnay pointed it out a few minutes ago)
<artnay> andrejz: more importantly, the template isn't updated from upstream source
<dpm> andrejz, yes, I agree, but I can't have an eye on everything :) I also got notice quite a while after fta quit maintaining the chromium package, and would have appreciated a short heads up message to translators
<artnay> well the import/export system was done by fta, now it probably only needs a maintainer
<artnay> maybe that should be pointed out at the bug I linked above
<andrejz> sure dpm
<andrejz> i understand your point. But maybe in the future if someone steps up for mainting package like fta did we can ask them to let us know if/when the things change
<andrejz> noboby is able to keep an eye on everything so the developers themselves should let us know
<dpm> yeah, but that's what we generally expect from all contributors. Even if it's a volunteer contribution, it's ok to step down, but gracefully
<dpm> artnay, +1, as usual, it just needs someone who cares for the project to step up and take action
<dpm> I'm talking with micahg right now, and it seems we might be able to put the Chromium infrastructure back in place, although there is no ETA yet
<dpm> I've added an action on the Trello board for me to check
<dpm> andrejz, sent you and mvo an e-mail to start the ball rolling on universe translations for Synaptic
<andrejz> yeah i saw it
<andrejz> thanks
<andrejz> you think we should first mail the maintainers or start with bug reports?
<dpm> andrejz, I think I would talk to a few maintainers first, to get a feel for what they think. I remember a while ago we started filing bugs for all packages which needed to include translations before NonLanguagePackDeadline without having talked to maintainers first, and most of them got rejected, which was a bit of a wasted effort. I'd like to avoid repeating that again.
<andrejz> ok, makes sense
<dpm> Do you think you could find out the maintainers for the packages and update the list? Then we can perhaps contact 3 or 4 and decide on the next step
<andrejz> sure i can do that but currently Launchpad search is timeouting on me
<andrejz> when i try to perform a package search so i don't know when launchpad will allow me to do it
<dpm> ah, no worries. When LP is back for you, here's the URL where you can find out about the maintainers:
<dpm> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/<nameofthepackage>
<dpm> e.g.
<dpm> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/synaptic
<andrejz> cool, i will do it over the weekend
<dpm> If the maintainer is ubuntu-core-dev, you might have to dig out a bit deeper and look at the changelogs for the latest uploaders, e.g.
<dpm> (just click on the package link on that page ^)
<dpm> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/synaptic/0.75.7
<andrejz> hm
<andrejz> for some packages it's not very clear who is maintainer (for example xfce4-power-manager) - but in this case i guess i can contact people substribed to all it's bugs instead
<dpm> andrejz, you can look at the changelogs as pointed out above ^
<dpm> e.g. https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfce4-power-manager/1.0.10-5ubuntu2
<dpm> or look for the Xubuntu project lead
<andrejz> yeah i will do that
<dpm> cool
<andrejz> need to work real job thing a bit right now, but will do it over the weekend
<andrejz> dpm i also sent you a bit unrelated email and would appriciate it if you look at it when you have time
<dpm> thanks for your work on this. I think translators (and users!) will love to have those apps translatable
<andrejz> indeed
<andrejz> that's why we are doing it
<dpm> andrejz, ok cool, got your e-mail and will reply to it
<andrejz> thanks dpm, i know odds are against me but felt like i needed to ask
<dpm> no worries :), I've quickly replied to some of it in private
<dpm> andrejz, btw, good work on Slovenian translations. As you're at 100%, I usually use your stats to see if there has been any user interface freeze break :)
<dpm> http://91.189.93.77/stats/precise/sl
<TLE> dpm: how is it, are the items on the list on your translation stat web app sorted in the same way as in lp, i.e. in some sort of prioritized order?
<andrejz> TLE
<andrejz> no
<andrejz> it's in order of remaining strings i think
<andrejz> at least on the main one
<TLE> D'oh!
<TLE> ahh yes it would seems so, I've actually got en education with in the natural sciences, so don't tell anybody about this ;)
<andrejz> dpm, yes i commited translations from upstream gnome immediately after string freeze and it helped a lot
<andrejz> TLE your secret is safe with me;) (but not with IRC logs, sadly )
<dpm> TLE, as andrejz is saying, right now they are prioritized by untranslated. I'm planning to sort them on priority (it's relatively trivial), but I haven't found the time yet and there are other things I want to get addressed before that, so it's a bit on the bottom of my priorities list
<TLE> andrejz: do you know when we can expect them to trickle down there on their own, the translations from official gnome release I mean?
<andrejz> they won't
<TLE> they won't??????
<andrejz> according to the docs team
<dpm> I think you guys are talking about different things :)
<andrejz> a couple of days ago they said they don't have the infrstructure to commit translations
<TLE> yeah, I'm talking about just the GUI translations from gnome 3.4
<TLE> when they will have arrived inlp
<dpm> they should be there already or about to, I think
<dpm> packages were uploaded already iirc
<dpm> for 3.4.0
<TLE> greeeat stuf, has to do a motivational email to the translation team to keep pushing on ubuntu how that gnome is out the door
<andrejz> TLE those are in for a while now
<dpm> as per the ubuntu-docs, what andrejz means is that the ubuntu-docs team is not using the GNOME docs translations
<TLE> ah ok
<andrejz> they used them only the first
<andrejz> first time
<dpm> I'd like to help them, but I don't actually understand how they merge the content from gnome
<andrejz> but are now only updating .pot using strings from upstream
<andrejz> dpm it's trivial
<andrejz> at least manually
<andrejz> you take gnome .po file
<andrejz> add lanunchpad header stuff so launchpad will swallow it and upload
<dpm> yeah, what I mean is that I don't know which PO file or files to fetch. If it's just one PO file, the docs team should simply be able to fetch and commit them, but I suspect it's not that easy
<andrejz> it's just one po file
<dpm> do you know which one is it? (I haven't been translating gnome docs for quite a while)
<andrejz> http://l10n.gnome.org/module/gnome-user-docs/
<dpm> oh, so it just needs a script to:
<dpm> - Fetch translations
<dpm> Err, I should be more detailed:
<dpm> - Fetch upstream translations from the right branch on http://l10n.gnome.org/module/gnome-user-docs/
<dpm> - Merge them with those in the lp:ubuntu-docs branch
<andrejz> that would be greast
<andrejz> i mean i can commit them but i prefer if i don't have to do that. and some people don't know about this
<andrejz> i know a russian translator was frustrated about this for 11.10
<dpm> yeah, I remember, frustrated is to put it mildly, if I remember correctly the amount of swear words he used ;)
<dpm> it should be trivial to write such a script, but I most definitely won't have the time to help on this this cycle
<dpm> In case there are any takers I've put it as an idea on the Trello board
<dpm> https://trello.com/board/translations-team/4f621c87861db54230b9ca39
<andrejz> maybe we can post it on translators mailing list if there is any taker
<TLE> this is for the ubuntu help translation, right?
<dpm> yes
<TLE> but, ok, stupid question, is the Ubuntu Help based on the content of the gnome docs?
<TLE> gnome-user-doc I should say
<dpm> TLE, it's not a stupid question. It is based on gnome's docs, plus additional Ubuntu-specific content
<dpm> and some branding changes
<TLE> ok, because otherwise, just blindly importing string might not be a good idea
<dpm> TLE, I agree, that's why I mentioned the PO files should be merged ^
<dpm> A python script that accepts a parameter for the upstream branch to fetch, checks out the right lp:ubuntu-docs branch and that calls msgmerge properly should probably do
<andrejz> TLE
<andrejz> i am translating both
<andrejz> and they are essentially the same
<dpm> andrejz, actually, that's a good idea. Would you be up for sending that e-mail to the list?
<TLE> dpm: agreed
<andrejz> just activities overview is changed with the dash
<andrejz> and some other UI specific changes
<andrejz> i manually uploaded gnome help and number on unstranslated strings went from 840 to 250
<andrejz> so it's definetly worth it
<dpm> Oh, btw, I finally got round to create a proper project for the translations stats instead of the code living in a +junk branch. Feel free to submit bugs, code and (once I've enabled them) translations!
<dpm>     https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-translations-stats
<dpm> ok, going for a break, brb
<artnay> hmm, I wonder if bug 968290 was actually fixed (to use translated theme names)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 968290 in Ubuntu Translations "System settings -> Appearance -> Theme entries don't appear translated" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/968290
<TLE> dpm: when you return, what subset of the packages in precise in launchpad are in your list?
<dpm> TLE, it's explained on the link at the bottom of the stats page -> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Stats#UbuntuTranslationStatistics - in short, I'm filtering out anything that's not shipped by default on the ISO and anything below a certain priority threshold (I think it's 3499)
<dpm> artnay, I'm not sure. Seeing the changelog, it seems only the (default) string has been marked for translations. Please feel free to report your findings in the bug
<andrejz> dpm, sent emails to xubuntu and lubuntu developers
<dpm> cool, thanks andrejz!
<vibhavp> If I create a locaized CD image in a PPA, where will it be stored?
<dpm> hi vibhavp, every LoCo team should be responsible for storing it for now
<dpm> check out the FAQ on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricOcelot/LocalizedImagesRollout
<andrejz> dpm is it possible you update the contributors list before the release
<andrejz> we just got some new translators and i know they would feel very bad if they weren't on the list
<dpm> andrejz, definitely, that is the plan. The current list was only a proof-of-concept to see if everything worked, and it will be updated before release.
<andrejz> ok
<dpm> It's the final unchecked point of my TODO for that on the translations Trello board, so don't worry, it will be updated :)
<artnay> dpm: hey, could you import the latest Finnish ubuntu-docs translations to http://91.189.93.101/index.html ? thanks!
<artnay> dpm: can't see the latest revision here: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/gnome-control-center/precise/changes - I'll check it out later and reopen the bug if needed
<dpm> artnay, sure, can you send the latest PO to me?, or shall I just get it from bzr?
<artnay> dpm: I sent the link to your ubuntu.com address
<TLE> dpm: thanks
<dpm> artnay, cool, thanks. If it's just a url, feel free to paste it here too
<dpm> nevermind, got it now
<dpm> ok, building pages now, it will be online in ~5 min
<dpm> artnay, updated -> http://91.189.93.101/
<artnay> dpm: thanks
<vibhavp> dpm: I meant , if I build the CD Image using a PPA where will the image be stored
<vibhavp> I am building it currently, and will soon store it on my server
<dpm> vibhavp, ah, I don't know the exact location off the top of my head, but it will be a .iso file in one of the directories of the build
<vibhavp> ok
<vibhavp> Then Ill store it on my server
<dpm> vibhavp, cool, let me know how it goes. If you need more technical details, you can also talk to pitti on the #ubuntu-desktop IRC channel
<vibhavp> sure
<sagaci> yeah you just get an iso file in the directory you build it in
<kelemengabor> artnay: you are right about bug 968290, only the "default" string appeared on LP
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 968290 in Ubuntu Translations "System settings -> Appearance -> Theme entries don't appear translated" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/968290
#ubuntu-translators 2012-03-31
<Malizor> Hi everyone, here is a question about ubuntu-doc trasnlations:
<Malizor> *translations
<Malizor> Ubuntu-doc is a fork of gnome-user-manual but these projects still share thousand of strings.
<Malizor> Why relevant translations are not imported automatically from upstream, as with all other Ubuntu apps ?
<Malizor> Actually  I did a manual import for French yesterday (with some shell magic and a bit of manual editing)
<Malizor> It brought this translation from 7% to 75%...
<kelemengabor> Malizor: because it is a fork, and not just a packaged version of the original
<kelemengabor> there was some talk about this problem yesterday
<kelemengabor> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/03/30/%23ubuntu-translators.html#t11:05
<kelemengabor> I think we will figure out something... but no promises :\
<Malizor> kelemengabor: thanks
<Malizor> Another problem is that Gnome translators are not currently credited for their work
<Malizor> There is just Launchpad contricutors
<Malizor> *contributors
<Malizor> And, as you probably know, we can't modify the "	
<Malizor> translator-credits" string, so we can't add them.
<Malizor> Si this is not fair...
<Malizor> *So
#ubuntu-translators 2012-04-01
<vibhav> :(
#ubuntu-translators 2013-03-27
<dholbach> hey
<dholbach> dpm, I was wondering if a cheap solution to translating the CoC would be to just put it up on people.u.c and update it through a cron job? whenever a translation is complete we could then add a link to ubuntu.com or LP(?)
<dholbach> I'm not sure that altering LP to handle CoC translations (including signing) is a good use of time
<dpm> dholbach, yeah, I have to think about it in more detail, but I can get the cron job running on p.u.c for starters
<dholbach> I'm really not sure what the best way is to put it up in a semi-official place
<dpm> adding links to translated versions (but still requiring the English version to be the one to sign) either on https://launchpad.net/codeofconduct/2.0 or http://www.ubuntu.com/project/about-ubuntu/conduct might be a way.
<dholbach> yeah, probably - we'd just need an official looking URL that never changes
<dholbach> once the CoC is translated its translations probably won't need an update in a very long time :)
<dpm> yes :)
#ubuntu-translators 2013-03-28
<teolemon> hey dpm, a bit early, but I'm available
<dpm> hi teolemon
<teolemon> hi :-)
<teolemon> irc or hangout ?
<dpm> teolemon, would a hangout in ~20 minutes work for you?
<teolemon> yup :-)
<dpm> perfect, let's talk then
<dpm> teolemon, actually, this afternoon would work better for me, which would give me time to sort a few things on translations before the hangout. Would you still be available, say, at 14:30? Or does the morning work best for you?
<teolemon> nope, 14:30 is most probably ok
<teolemon> yes
<teolemon> i mean
<teolemon> it's ok for 14:30
<dpm> teolemon, perfect, thanks! I've sent a calendar invite with the link to the hangout. Let's talk later on, then.
<teolemon> accepted it
<teolemon> see you
<iceroot> hi
<iceroot> https://translations.launchpad.net/pdfchain  what is the way to translate here? is it a LP bug? or is it only done somewhere upstream?
<dpm> hi iceroot, the project has not been set up for translations in Launchpad, but in any case the upstream developers have not made it clear whether they are using LP for translations or something else. I'd suggest contacting them and asking
<iceroot> dpm: i will do so, thank you
<dpm> np
<teolemon> fwi, i'm having a hangout with David in 40 minutes
<teolemon> fyi
<teolemon> if anybody wants to join or ask some questions
<teolemon> I'll go through the issues we discussed last time, and various other things
#ubuntu-translators 2013-03-29
<henninge> exit
#ubuntu-translators 2014-03-30
 * geochr sfgf
#ubuntu-translators 2016-03-28
<justxux> Hi,anyone here?
#ubuntu-translators 2016-03-31
<rvr> Hi :)
<dpm> hey rvr :)
<dpm> hi Gwaihir, around?
<dpm> Gwaihir, whenever you're online, a quick question: we're trying to release OTA10 for the phone, which came with new strings that have some suggestions that need review in Italian. If you've got some time, do you think you could either have a look at them or point the Italian translators to them?
<dpm> They're: https://translations.launchpad.net/unity8/trunk/+pots/unity8/it/+translate?start=0&batch=10&show=untranslated&field.alternative_language=&field.alternative_language-empty-marker=1&old_show=translated
<dpm> And https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-rtm/15.04/+source/indicator-session/+pots/indicator-session/it/+translate?show=untranslated
<dpm> thanks!
<nerochiaro> dpm: hi
<rvr> nerochiaro: dpm asked Gwaihir to approve your translations as soon as he's available
<nerochiaro> and hopefully check them before
<rvr> Yeah
#ubuntu-translators 2016-04-03
<pavlushka> Hi everyone!!
<pavlushka> o/ all
<pavlushka> guys, now translating lubuntu-ubiquity-slideshow....
<pavlushka> !patience
<ubottu> Don't feel ignored and repeat your question quickly; if nobody knows your answer, nobody will answer you. While you wait, try searching https://help.ubuntu.com or http://ubuntuforums.org or http://askubuntu.com/
<pavlushka> in Bengali
<pavlushka> good night guys!!
#ubuntu-translators 2020-03-26
<lotuspsychje> GunnarHj: hello, im letting you know bug #1813262 seems to be fixed on my 20.04 daily now
<ubottu> bug 1813262 in language-pack-gnome-nl (Ubuntu) "livepatch strings not fully translated yet in bionic" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1813262
<lotuspsychje> https://imgur.com/a/uSDUPuY
<GunnarHj> lotuspsychje: Good, thanks for letting me know. Closing the bug then.
<lotuspsychje> thank you!
<lotuspsychje> GunnarHj: i filed it originaly on bionic, will that also be pushed?
<GunnarHj> lotuspsychje: Ah, my mistake. Bionic will be updated at next 18.04 translation update, provided that some member i the Dutch translators team tests and confirmed the updated language packs. You may want to subscribe to <https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators> to be notified about next call for testing.
<lotuspsychje> no worries, its good that 20.04 will include it now
#ubuntu-translators 2020-03-27
<jwtiyar> hey
<jwtiyar> how to translate ubuntu settings? its in which part in launchpad translation?
<lotuspsychje> hey GunnarHj
<GunnarHj> lotuspsychje: o/
<lotuspsychje> GunnarHj: i have a little question about bug #1869379
<ubottu> bug 1869379 in language-pack-gnome-nl (Ubuntu) "Apport strings not fully translated yet" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1869379
<lotuspsychje> i found another non-translated button, and im trying to add the dutch translation team, but all it find are the mailing lists
<GunnarHj> lotuspsychje: The name of the dutch team is ~ubuntu-l10n-nl. I just added it to the bug report.
<lotuspsychje> ah thank you, so the search keyword must be exact?
<GunnarHj> Not always, I think...
<lotuspsychje> ok thank you again!
<GunnarHj> yw
#ubuntu-translators 2020-03-29
<jwtiyar> hey
<jwtiyar> hey
<jwtiyar> how language pack will be updated in daily builds of ubuntu 20.04?
<jwtiyar> how language pack will be updated in daily builds of ubuntu 20.04?
