#ubuntu-au 2011-05-23
<gggs> do you guys keep your window buttons on the left or right? I'm playing with xfce and finding myself going to the wrong side
<head_victim> gggs: in what program?
<head_victim> Or the panel?
<gggs> head_victim: window title-bars, where they moved close/min/max to the left side
<head_victim> Oh, I don't have any versions of Ubuntu with that modification yet. My most up to day computer uses LXDE, the other computer sits on LTS releases
<gggs> Really? I'm running 10.04LTS
<head_victim> Yeah my window bars are on the right still
<head_victim> I don't recall changing that?
<head_victim> (although it's possible I have at some stage)
<gggs> afaik it annoyed a number of people, I'm surprised you haven't heard of it. I thought it was nice, I think it makes slightly more sense from UI philosophy standpoint
<head_victim> Oh I've heard of it
<head_victim> But I don't have any versions that do it. LXDE has never had it set up that way
<head_victim> Yeah the UI argument is actually quite solid.
<gggs> LXDE sounds nice, what's it like VS gnome/xfce?
<gggs> yea I figure the control buttons on the left mean they don't move when a window is resized, although with Apple's UI guidelines as they are I'd like to know their own reasons
<head_victim> It's very light on resources, I use it for all P4 and older computers.
<sagaci> head_victim: ping
<head_victim> sagaci: hey there you are
<sagaci> head_victim: just a pinch under 150,000 strings to go
<head_victim> I see you've been doing a fair few
<sagaci> nearly up to 10% of the whole lot
<head_victim> I created a monster!
<sagaci> and about 0.6% away from 60% complete
<head_victim> Evening bejames 
<head_victim> sagaci: nice work, I wish I'd done half as much
<gggs> what does everyone here do with old PC's? I have like, 3 or 4 lying around the house that are too slow &/ too noisy &/ inefficient to use
<head_victim> gggs: how old?
<head_victim> If they're P4 era I'd stick Lubuntu on them and find someone to donate them to.
<gggs> well, there's a P3 500, a p2 200 (!), and an XP2500+ based desktop not doing much
<head_victim> The P3 might still run Lubuntu ok
<sagaci> I have a p4 around, 2GiB ram
<head_victim> That's what I'm using now.
<gggs> head_victim: you're still using a p3?
<head_victim> P4 with 2GB ram
<gggs> a friend of mine is buying a new PC, he's giving me his old(er) quad-core 2.33GHz; I have more processing power than I know what to do with already
<head_victim> Nice friend.
<head_victim> My "main" pc is a quad core 2.4 with 10gb ram.
<gggs> yea, you should see what he's replacing it with though, phew
<head_victim> Hah yeah, I want to replace my old P4 with a low power consuming i3
<head_victim> The quad core still does everything I need it to and more
<head_victim> The worst part about my main pc is the 8800GT video card and it is still fine for my needs really.
<gggs> it just seems like a waste to throw away a perfectly good PC, I'd put a Linux/Windows on it & give-away-to-good-home, but that usually means providing long-term support
<head_victim> Nah just point them to Ubuntu-AU or donate it anonymously through a local charity.
<sagaci> PENTIUM 4
<sagaci> feel the power!
<sagaci> head_victim: are you building
<head_victim> sagaci: building what?
<sagaci> your i3 replacement
<gggs> most of my close friends are in IT & have no use for it either, can't see what a charity would use it for
<head_victim> Oh yeah, I haven't ever actually bought a prebuilt computer.
<head_victim> gggs: if Lubuntu or whatever runs ok on it just call a couple of locals see if they want it. If not try and find a computer recycling place
<head_victim> sagaci: looking at an i3 2100T cpu and just use the integrated video and whack in a fanless PSU
<head_victim> Still waiting on work to pay me my money they owe
<gggs> head_victim: thanks, I'll look into it
<head_victim> gggs: no worries, hope you find a good home
<gggs> yea either that or I'll find 3 or 4 novel fish tanks
<gggs> boat anchors, speed humps, makeshift snow-sleds
<head_victim> Put them on your front footpath, someone will take them
<sagaci> head_victim: at LCA, what were the main things people were asking about... obviously I couldn't be there but were there recurring questions throughout the day
<gggs> hey that gives me an idea, I wonder if I could fit them in my recycling wheelie bin
<head_victim> sagaci: "what are you going to see next"
<head_victim> gggs: dremel helps
<sagaci> head_victim: err, what do you mean?
<gggs> head_victim: perfect!
<head_victim> sagaci: That's the first question everyone asked. Sorry it was an attempt at humour
<gggs> head_victim: don't worry man, I thought it was funny
<head_victim> sagaci: so what context were you referring to Ubuntu-AU, linux in general ?
<sagaci> still don't get the joke... anyway, obviously most people would have known about ubuntu, so were they interested about the team itself?
<head_victim> Most people don't know the team exists
<head_victim> A lot of people using Ubuntu and a lot of people using Macs.
<sagaci> yeah, a bunch of people were wearing natty narwhal t-shirts, more than I envisioned
<head_victim> Yeah either they didn't know or weren't overly interested. That being said there were a bunch of us that caught up and it helped us get some HUMBUG contacts (the local linux user group in Brisbane)
<sagaci> head_victim: well, 21 million users to go, in Australia
<head_victim> Heh indeed
<head_victim> We'll get there ;)
<sagaci> so those posters at LCA in those photos you have on the wiki... you've told me before, but so you're saying you printed them off yourself?
<head_victim> Yep, can be used by the team as they're laminated. It's just the postage costs that's the killer.
<sagaci> postage for what
<head_victim> If others around the country want to reuse them
<sagaci> head_victim: how many did you get done
<head_victim> 2 of the ones like the business card, one huge one not quite as big, one other ubuntu logo one and another software freedom one.
<sagaci> so i'd be better off just getting them done myself, for personal use and if I ever hold an ubuntu hour
<head_victim> Yeah they're not too expensive if you shop around, I left it too late and just went to officeworks
<head_victim> The business card ones are on the wiki the rest I got off spreadubuntu.com
<sagaci> you take in a design and they have it in a jiffy?
<gorilla> sagaci: yes, pretty much.
<sagaci> $30-50 laminated, roughly?
<gorilla> sagaci: no idea.. I have had some instant business cards from officeworks.
<sagaci> I want to get something a bit bigger
<sagaci> at least a decent poster size
<sagaci> this cup of tea is awesome, btw
<head_victim> SOrry had a washing machine malfunction
<gorilla> head_victim: oh no!
<head_victim> sagaci: http://www.officeworks.com.au/retail/content/copying-and-printing;jsessionid=%28J2EE5996400%29ID1331206351DB01459218520694532575End;saplb_*=%28J2EE5996400%295996451?siteAware=true#largeformatfullprinting for prices
<head_victim> Oh wow, my apologies, that is a LONG link
<head_victim> Add about 50% for laminating
<sagaci> well what's polyester
<sagaci> ty for the link
<head_victim> Not sure TBH, I was in quite a rush I didn't look into it much
<head_victim> I have a much better quality contact for business cards though, I would not recommend officeworks for them.
<head_victim> Evening Octatron 
<head_victim> http://www.quickcolourprint.com.au/index.php they did the team business cards
<head_victim> They came out alright
<head_victim> Or if price is the only factor then there is always vistaprint.com.au but don't expect much from them except cheapness
<gorilla> head_victim: ditto.. but i was in a hurry and our usual supplier isn't set up for rush jobs.
<head_victim> I have some personal ones through vista print, they're useful instead of writing down numbers and emails but wouldn't use them in a business setting I don't think
<Octatron> Evening head_victim, whats new in the jungle?
<head_victim> Octatron: I just woke up half the neighbourhood with my washing machine
<Octatron> nice :P
<Octatron> I just finished birthday shopping for the other half, gets harder each year
<head_victim> Octatron: doesn't it?
<Octatron> yeah, sometimes you just think here, have some cash happy birthday 
<Octatron> At least I have converted her to Ubuntu good and proper :P
<head_victim> I'm still working on my wife, she distrusts anything that's "free"
<head_victim> Despite her not wanting to pay for Windows
<Octatron> What about all the other stuff you have to buy for Windows?
<sagaci> office
<Octatron> Antivirus
<sagaci> I can get by on libreoffice but I prefer office 2010
<sagaci> I use MSE on win 7
<sagaci> just use common sense
<Octatron> Then there's the fear issue of licensing and having more than one pc
<sagaci> yeahp, no decent cli environment, upgrading system/applications can be painful
<Octatron> I think it all comes down too lack of good computer training in schools and in workplaces
<Octatron> People say they are computer illiterate like it's a badge of honor or something..
<head_victim> It's more that windows is too ingrained so it's what they use at school. uni and work so why not at home to?
<Octatron> Yeah, alot of people aren't even aware that Apple Mac exists where I live let alone Linux..
<Octatron> I'm currently trying to write up a 3 page decision sheet listing the pro's and con's of each general platform.  So they can choose what's best for them.
<sagaci> Octatron: ... linux, that hacker program you install on windows that brings up a black box with a blinking cursor?
<Octatron> I get mixed responses to Ubuntu with customers, some I've vetted to check it meets their needs swear by it and tell their friends, others miss windows and hate change.  It's hard to work out what a person will do before you offer it too them.
<Octatron> head_victim: show your other half XBMC on ubuntu hooked up to the tv with an eeepc remote and wireless logitech keyboard, that's how I convinced my gal :P once they see their movies & tv shows come up so nice and ordered with a polished interface it's hard to go back.
<head_victim> Nah we don't watch lots of tv
<head_victim> The only thing she does outside of web browsing is play a game that has a native linux version - urban terror.
<head_victim> She does some very minor photo editing as well but nothing that couldn't be done in one of 100 programs.
<head_victim> Crop, rotate and you're done'
<Octatron> Have you tried UT2004? runs great on Ubuntu and pretty cheap at EB esp with low gravity mods switched on
<head_victim> Nah she's happy with urban terror.
<head_victim> It's free and has native linux, mac and windows clients.
<Octatron> must be interesting when you pair are on opposing teams
<head_victim> We're a little too competitive I think
<Octatron> Medal of Honor was fun in a multiplay, Id shoot a mate of mine and he'd hold onto a grenade.. then you see it .. ah shh..BOOM
<Octatron> then there's those moments you see each other at the same time, your on a balcony and he has a bazooka.. good times..
<head_victim> I like the fact that in urban terror it doesn't matter how long you've been playing you all have the same weapon set
<Octatron> Well that's good, no cheaters trying to ruin the game
<Octatron> One personal favorite of mine is using the helicopters on Battlefield Vietnam to swoop down and hit the enemy with the windscreen.. funny!
<Octatron> head_victim: I might hit the hay, btw I've got some content to make a page on how to add ical to calendars on different email accounts what do I have to do to make me own little area to test out a page?
<head_victim> Octatron: firstly make sure you can't just link to another page that exists online. If it's unique information maybe a sub-page of /Meetings ?
#ubuntu-au 2011-05-24
<firtvid20> Hello
<sagaci> hi
<firtvid20> Haven't been on IRC for a long time
<firtvid20> Anyway, what is it with this Unity on Ubuntu? I haven't upgraded to 11.01 yet
<sagaci> head_victim: any TODO for the wiki?
#ubuntu-au 2011-05-25
<somethinginteres> is anyone aware of how I could write a script or something to set up a situation whereby each time file.doc is edited a  backup copy of file.doc is made to a specific location (second hard drive)? 
<elky> somethinginteres, use cron to check an md5 checksum of the file and if it's changed, copy it across?
<elky> it won't be precisely at save time, but you can make cron run every few minutes
<somethinginteres> elky: OK, well that works fine. Cron jobs. OK I will have to google
<thegoodcushion> hello boys and girls
<thegoodcushion> Mind if I join?
<thegoodcushion> I'm an Aussie Ubuntu user
#ubuntu-au 2011-05-26
<sagaci> have an internode (huawei e1762), i'm currently on the command line, how to go about connecting? what command or protocol should I read up on?
<sagaci> so used to just using network-manager, want to know how to do it all over the cli
<head_victim> sagaci: never really looked into it, does it show up as an interface? (I've never used a usb wireless modem)
<sagaci> it does after I connect it via network manager over on a gnome environment... ppp0
<head_victim> sagaci: http://johnlewis.ie/mobile-broadband-from-the-command-line-in-ubuntu/
<head_victim> :D
<sagaci> well I'll try that soon
<sagaci> thanks
<sagaci> most of the top google searches relates to intrepid
<head_victim> Glad to help :)
<sagaci> if it works I'll be back here on irssi
<head_victim> sagaci: come back to the good gui side! :D
<sagaci> ok wish me luck
<sagaci> no joy
<head_victim> Bummer
<head_victim> I'd help more if I had any idea whatsoever
<sagaci> i'm using the gui network-manager applet now so I guess it's just finding out its backend
<head_victim> Yeah I've played with ethernet but no idea about modem stuff
<head_victim> I've always had standalone modems and stand alone routers
<sagaci> yeah, compizconfig-settings-manager is pretty comprehensive
<head_victim> I'm working on getting my lightscribe burner working
<head_victim> I got 4 perfect the next 2 have been coasters :/
<sagaci> lightscribe being?
<head_victim> Burns a label into cds/dvds
<sagaci> ah ok
<head_victim> I didn't think it was even possible under linux, found out it works, just not reliably it seems. Either that or my drive is failing
<head_victim> Hmm that one came out beautiful. Maybe it was a bad couple of disks or overheating or something
<sagaci> what do you use that for, ubuntu cds?
<head_victim> I'm actually doing up a slideshow for a funeral.
<head_victim> But you can do it for whatever
<head_victim> I wouldn't do it for throw away CDs though, it takes 20 minutes to do one
<head_victim> Hmm glad I have both DVDRWs as lightscribe drives, if I alternate between the two they work perfect. I think the coasters were overheating issues so giving it a break in between each seems to work ok
<sagaci> head_victim, when's the next ubuntu event that we can do something as a LoCo?
<head_victim> sagaci: nothing planned to my knowledge just yet, I've asked if anythings in the works though so will let you know if I hear anything.
<head_victim> The main page at http://loco.ubuntu.com/ has a section in the lower left where they pop up when decided upon
<head_victim> sagaci: http://www.jonobacon.org/2011/05/23/community-team-plans-for-oneiric/ is a bit of a rundown on what should happen at some stage, but I don't think they're set in stone as to when/what just yet
#ubuntu-au 2011-05-27
<Clown_Knife> hi all
#ubuntu-au 2011-05-28
<gggs> can anyone recommend a similar alternative to UltraEdit, Notepad++, or jEdit? UltraEdit is closed-src, Notepad++ is Windows, jEdit is Java (ugh), vim is useless on a Dvorak keyboard, emacs is ridiculous, gedit is a little too simple (no macros)
<gggs> I <3 JOE, but a GUI would be nice for large source files
<YankDownUnder> gggs, What about using like Bluefish as an editor...?
<gggs> isn't that a HTML editor?
<YankDownUnder> gggs, It can be used as whatever an editor you wish...great for HTML, but...however, it's an editor...quite a nice one IMHO
<gggs> does it do simple macros?
<YankDownUnder> Honestly never used a macro in it...could check...
<YankDownUnder> gggs, http://bluefish.openoffice.nl/index.html
<gggs> I just installed it, looking at it now
<sagaci> do you want an html editor?
<gggs> sagaci: no; plaintext, LaTeX, C, C++, Java
<gggs> Bluefish seems like a really nice HTML editor, nice menus and scripts, loads quickly too
<sagaci> codeblocks, gedit, vi, netbeans, geany
<gggs> I do exactly 0 HTML though, but if I do I'll remember Bluefish
<mrshr3d> gggs, good to see another Dvorak user, never EVER going back to qwerty.  Both my speed and acc are definitely better.
<gggs> mrshr3d: Awesome, I've been a Dvorak typist for at least 10 years, a friend & I learned it in high school, never met another Dvorak typist though
<mrshr3d> About 5 years for me.  Never met another either.  Makes us a very rare breed - Dvorak AND Ubuntu  :-)
<gggs> sagaci: thanks, I've used gedit & vi, but I not the others
<gggs> mrshr3d: for sure, I used to hate typing in QWERTY, but once I got proficient after a month or two in Dvorak, writing long emails/essays/IRC/* is a breeze
<gggs> esp when you start peaking at 90--100wpm
<thegoodcushion> I've been told it's easier
<thegoodcushion> the world typing speed champion has 20 wpm more on Dvorak than QWERTY
<gggs> thegoodcushion: qwerty used to piss me off, keys always seemed like they were in the wrong places, it's much easier once you get the hang of Dvorak
<thegoodcushion> I'm sure it is
<thegoodcushion> how easy is it to buy a Dvorak keyboard?
<mrshr3d> I still just use a regular qwerty just type Dvorak
<thegoodcushion> oh...
<thegoodcushion> that's weird
<gggs> thegoodcushion: I just re-arranged the keycaps on my IBM Model-M, else you print out A-Z on a labelmaker, or even just print out the Dvorak layout on a card and leave it beside your monitor
<thegoodcushion> yeah
<thegoodcushion> I still think it's nice to have the keys labelled correctly
<mrshr3d> I am weird  :-)
<gggs> the [] keys are the only ones I struggle with when typing in Dvorak & looking at a qwerty keyboard
<gggs> [] keys in Dvorak are the -= keys in qwerty
<mrshr3d> to learn it, I did relabel my keys...if you touch type it shouldn't matter what's on the keys anyway hehe
<thegoodcushion> I'd be happy to start learning to type in Dvorak but only on a keyboard that's labelled properly
<thegoodcushion> I'll see if I can find one
<gggs> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Model_M_keyboard
<thegoodcushion> have to find the thing on sale somewhere
<head_victim> http://www.deckkeyboards.com/product_info.php?products_id=95 is going to be my next keyboard I think
<head_victim> And I was toying with the idea of dvorak'ing the keys
<sagaci> head_victim, not in stock til July
<head_victim> sagaci: you have to buy from a reseller to get them in AU
<gggs> head_victim: do you need a glowing keyboard?
<sagaci> ah ok
<head_victim> gggs: makes it easier at night with no ambient light to only have 2 monitors and keyboard lighitng the room
<gggs> that's what those nodules on the "F" and "J" keys are for
<head_victim> gggs: I'm more talking about use of the shortcuts I use to change settings in the kvm (screens, lock screen, etc)
<head_victim> sagaci: damn even the resellers that were in stock a little while ago just sold out.
<head_victim> My only real requirements for my next keyboard are cherry keys and backlit.
<head_victim> I am thinking I prefer the quiet tactile (clear/brown) as opposed to the clicky (blue) ones.
<gggs> head_victim: perhaps you could stick one of those coin-cell LEDs to your monitor, like a DIY-ThinkLight
<head_victim> Nah I like the idea of a backlit keyboard, even if I put it down really low I think it would suit my needs well. I'd prefer a red backlit but can't get it in tactile from deck (red light is better on the eyes in a dark room)
<gggs> fair enough, good luck with your search
<gggs> night all
<head_victim> night gggs 
<head_victim> I'm off for some urban terror, bbl
<sagaci> hi
<dns53> hey
<head_victim> Nice, I just got my data raid back up and running after a format and reinstallation of the system drive.
<head_victim> Next test will be dd'ing an mbr of a single drive and seeing how it goes handling the failure
<sagaci> head_victim, any TODO?
<head_victim> Specifically for the team or generally?
<sagaci> bpth
<sagaci> both*
<head_victim> For the team there is mainly just researching whether or not to set up the social media accounts as groups or as individual accounts for fb and identica, apparently on twitter there is no option, it has to be a single account
<head_victim> There also needs to be some thought and planning to start looking at SFC in september if we need resources from canonical
<head_victim> SFD*
<head_victim> I've let the last couple of months of team reports slip :/ 
<sagaci> ah ok
<head_victim> And as for general stuff there are always bugs, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Tag/ and translation work ;)
<head_victim> If you get excited you could always look around your local area to see if there's any events coming up that might be good to promote Ubuntu at
<sagaci> the monthly markets would be easy/good
<head_victim> sagaci: especially if you can get a free stall seems how you're not selling anything ;)
<sagaci> yeah, would have to sus it out
<head_victim> More than happy to help you out with that, can even submit a request for some goodies if you can formalise it slightly
<head_victim> I can point you to all the posters we used at LCA
<head_victim> There's a couple of good short videos going around you can set up on displays as well
<sagaci> it'd be under an ubuntu hour, right?
<head_victim> Yeah or you can do it as just a one off presentation
<sagaci> yeah
<sagaci> i'd be happy to buy 50 or so official CD's to hand out
<head_victim> Or you can use that to get some people interested in a Ubuntu Hour in your area
<head_victim> Buying them might be quicker but if you do a couple of posts to the ML, a wiki page and a LD event up I would be willing to submit a request for a conference pack for you
<head_victim> Might not get a full one not specifically being a conference but it can't hurt to ask even if it's just some CDs and stickers. Save you forking out for them
<head_victim> And that sort of thing is about the only thing we're really lacking as a team that would help us become official again. If we have a few people running something like that every now and then I'm sure we'd be reapproved ina  second.
<sagaci> yeah, it's just choosing the right event, the markets seems a sane idea but I'll have a look around elsewhere too
<sagaci> I guess ideally it would be good to have a local lug set up or at least measuring the interest in making one
<sagaci> head_victim, i'm just waiting for oneiric to switch over to being the focus for translations, and hence on the new strings
<head_victim> sagaci: yeah the local lug idea is good, I'm slowly working on getting involved with mine, they seem very keen on working together as it would help us both to do so
<sagaci> humbug?
<head_victim> That's them
<sagaci> average meeting attendance?
<head_victim> Not sure seems to be 30 odd?
<head_victim> I've only been to a couple
<head_victim> It runs from midday until after midnight as well so i'm sure people come and go
<sagaci> oh ok
<head_victim> It's pretty casual actually, I don't think they do many "talks" as such it's just general mingling.
<head_victim> Sort of a hack and install fest
<sagaci> monthly?
<head_victim> FOrtnightly
<sagaci> my work are paying for me to do cert iv in vocational education. I wouldn't be able to go and teach IT or anything but I guess that have that qual would enable me a foot in the door to doing some kind of basic ubuntu desktop training, even for free
<head_victim> Would make it easier to do up training material that's for sure
<sagaci> yeah, i'll get some stuff off spreadubuntu or something or make up some slides
<sagaci> i've installed inkscape, gimp and openshot, i'll have a bit of a play around with them
#ubuntu-au 2011-05-29
<airtonix> sagaci: the most you'd be teaching with cert4 is jobseekers.
<airtonix> anything more serious than that and you won't get employed without a teachers degree
<airtonix> and THEN you'll be forced to teach things like : it's Microsoft Word, not a word processor
<airtonix> until you complete a PHD on how awesome the ribbon bar in ms office is
<airtonix> then you can become a program director
<airtonix> that's when you get to tell others what they'll be teaching
<airtonix> better off sneaking ubuntu in sideways from corporate training sessions
<gorilla> teaching as field is one to get out of... you are not going to make a difference to someone's life.
<airtonix> ^
<gorilla> training the trainer qualifiication is worth having though... handy for running short courses.
<airtonix> pays surprisingley well too
<airtonix> singley!!!
<gorilla> airtonix: yup... though the non-contact hours can be tough at first as you scronge the materials together.
<sagaci> airtonix, are you a teacher at a tafe?
<airtonix> sagaci: no but i had some good conversations with some teachers willing to talk to me about it, i was seriously thinking about going through teachers college
<sagaci> airtonix, i'm nearly finished my b. teach, thinking about doing my cert iv for tafe teaching at half year
<airtonix> well if you have the degree, then you're halfway there deciding what content is being taught
<airtonix> you just have to find a school where the program director wants your opinions
<airtonix> most of the time they don't. some of the time they do but can't take it because the government dictates the content.
<airtonix> so my advice is to not focus so much on the idea of windows or linux, but rather the concepts used on both systems that should be standardised but currently are not.
<airtonix> like, use python & qt instead of visualbasic
<airtonix> or  slip in sessions on understanding the importance on referencing and how it is related to intergrating the choice of OSS license in a software project
<gorilla> they are still teaching Visual basic?? ew-gawds.
<airtonix> yeah
<airtonix> quite a bit
<airtonix> because microsoft give windows for free to schools
<gorilla> Who uses that crap in industry?
<airtonix> enough people for it to be taught 
<gorilla> airtonix: Grrr... that makes me cross.
<airtonix> fortunately my last year at tafe i was able to persueade my GUI interface course teacher to let me do the stuff in vbGTK
<airtonix> so i didn't have to use visual studio
<airtonix> i also showed him how much faster it was to create the same gui example interface in pyQT4 than it was in VB
<airtonix> not to mention i could run it on a lot more systems
<airtonix> but yeah, huge lack of standards and quality processes being taught in schools today
<mrshr3d> how does pyQT4 compare to wxGlade/wxPython?  I've sort of started using the latter.
<airtonix> im not sure i've not used wx enough to care
<airtonix> qt4 has QSS which is CSS for your interface... i don't think wx has that
<gorilla> airtonix: quality??? you can't be serious. Are we talking secondary or tertiary education here?
<airtonix> tertiary
<airtonix> i mean even simple things like documenting your code as you create it
<gorilla> airtonix: In that case, quality has gone out the window as the uni and tafes receive more funding for each student that passes... So everyone gets a pass!
<gorilla> Tafe more so... I went through it over 10 plus years ago and saw a lecuturers assitant helping someone through the practial exam... And not someone who had a disability.
<airtonix> that still happens, but only if you demonstrate a genuine desire to understand the concepts
<airtonix> if you bludge, they document it and fail you. i think they still get paid too
<airtonix> but horrendous amount of paperwork to defend the action to the auditors
<airtonix> to be honest, i'm more impressed by tafe than first year university.
<gorilla> :-/ that's disgusting. I give up!
<airtonix> as far as i'm concerned i'd rather have people who understand the concepts but need to refer to manuals, than people who can recite the manual but not understand the concepts
<airtonix> I actually need an assistant django/python programmer at work, which will be hard to find in south australia
<airtonix> which reminds me i need to write up an interview process
<gorilla> airtonix: having someone that cannot go though basic program design or know where to start debugging becomes too hard on the job.
<airtonix> yeah i'm not there to teach them how to understand the concepts
<airtonix> about the partiucular project yeah sure. but not basic things like why we follow various PEP protocols
<airtonix> i i'm sure that there are plenty of people in south australia who i would love to have working with me. but they are already employed
<airtonix> or even worse... not in south australia
<gorilla> yeah. I think if I was interviewing someone, I'd have a non-bootable computer sitting on a table and ask them what's wrong with it... just to see if that are observant and the steps that they go through (5 minute exercise)
<elky> I'd probably respond with "did you put tape over the ram?"
<gorilla> elky: we use rubber bands instead.. no residue left behind when you remove them
<elky> gorilla, hah, good one
<gorilla> elky: I'd unplug the power to the hard drive.
<elky> also a good one, but not as good as the taped ram which wouldn't be visible without _close_ inspection
<gorilla> elky: do an obvious fault also :-)
<elky> gorilla, well if you're after an obvious fault and a non-obvious one, plug the hdd into the cd drive. people don't follow the cables.
<gorilla> yeah.. it also can show that people follow a checklist based on previous exerience rather than troubleshooting the actual problem in front of them.
<elky> doing a headcount before actually looking isn't so bad. it's when you stop at the headcount you fail.
<mrshr3d> I don't follow what you mean by taping ram, do you mean like putting sticky tape on the contacts of the stick of ram then reinserting?
<elky> yep
<mrshr3d> lol nice prank hehe
<gorilla> mrshr3d: No, not a prank. I would not be happy if I found that someone did that to my machine. removing the memory could be just as effective though.
<mrshr3d> same, but I imagine it as something that would be done as a prank.
<sagaci> head_victim, pingg
<head_victim> sagaci: pong
<sagaci> got a few moments?
<head_victim> Yeah here for a few minutes
<sagaci> what were the things I needed to apply for syndication to planet-au... I realise this is like the third time I've asked but it seems to go in one eye and out the other... or if you could pick out the day I asked last if your backlog is long enough 8)
<sagaci> and also, it's raining here
<head_victim> Your name, your blog home page, your blog feed and if you like a picture to associate with your blog :)
<sagaci> did you copy paste that
<sagaci> dejavu
<head_victim> Nope, just memory :)
<head_victim> If you just shoot it to me in an email I can then submit the request 
<head_victim> Brb in a few minutes.
<sagaci> ubuntu wiki is driving me up the wall, can't seem to get a username, exisiting or being able to register a new one
<head_victim> sagaci: you're not the only one :/
<head_victim> If it continues throughout tomorrow I'd log a bug on launchpad for it
#ubuntu-au 2012-05-21
<h_v> Alright, now that's sorted. Damn me registering like nicks.
<h_v> Anyone come across an issue where a user cannot log in? It's credentials are fine as I can su to it but it won't log in, just returns to the log in screen without error.
<ikt> hrmm
#ubuntu-au 2012-05-23
<hot_wheeelz> hi guys how are we?
<md_5> not bad
#ubuntu-au 2012-05-24
<sagaci> If jellyware is around sometime in -chat... i'll be down in Sydney on the 23-24th june weekend so hopefully will be able to get an ubuntu day or afternoon happening for that Saturday afternoon
<jaddi27> head_victim, Have you seen the mailing list tonight?
<head_victim> jaddi27: the one where gorilla apparently forgot to hit reply all and just hit reply instead?
<jaddi27> Yes, that one
<head_victim> I read it today on the phone
<jaddi27> Hopefully it doesn't get personal again like a few years ago
<head_victim> Only just got home so haven't gone through the inbox too well yet
<jaddi27> Right. Luckily nothing else has been said yet - lets hope it stays like that
<head_victim> I was hoping gorilla would be online tonight to chat
<jaddi27> Is he usually online during the week?
<jaddi27> Oh, there is a reply now
<jaddi27> He was good in his reply, so it should be fine
<head_victim> Yep, I met gorilla at the Brisbane LCA, didn't seem the type to make personal attacks.
<jaddi27> He doesn't sound like it in the meetings, so was a bit surprised by it all. Andre can get a bit fired up though at times
<head_victim> I play devils advocate at work every second of the day, everyone there always jumps to the worst possible conclusion without thinking things through. So I'm quite used to thinking about how others perceive stuff.
<jaddi27> Yeah, I have experienced a fair bit of that through school and uni
<head_victim> Ah well, started my uni application for real, it's getting scary now.
#ubuntu-au 2012-05-25
<antonio_acosta> homies, which one of you are proffs with RTMPDUMP ?
#ubuntu-au 2012-05-26
<head_victim> Hm, just set up an ipv6 tunnel. No idea why, but it's done.
<ikt> head_victim, any noticeable differences?
<head_victim> ikt: not really, by default it prioritises v4 anyway for web browsing
<ikt> same as my work
<ikt> winxp with ipv6 installed
<ikt> the internode website has a spinning logo
<ikt> but that's the only difference I noticed
<head_victim> There's a spinning logo?
<ikt> head_victim, only with ipv6
<head_victim> Any particular link or just the home page?
<ikt> should just be the homepage
<head_victim> Not doing anything for me, but it's also showing as v4 only.
<ikt> yeah has to be ipv6
<head_victim> Yeah, for me to see it I'd have to find a link to an ipv6 only address for it
<head_victim> If it has both it defaults to 4
<ikt> ah
<ikt> i have a draytek 2820 which doesn't support ipv6 at all
<ikt> and i'm watching my servers logs scroll by
<ikt> it's just a load of errors about unable to resolve ipv6 addresses
<ikt> should probably disable ipv6 but cbf
<head_victim> I'm still running a bunch of netgear stuff here.
<ikt> netgear modems I don't mind
<head_victim> The mikrotik stuff looks interesting though. 
<ikt> since they have managed to keep the same interface across like their entire model range
<ikt> and it's easy enough to support :P
<ikt> mikrotik?
<head_victim> I have a fvs336g, dual wan and gigabit lan
<ikt> nice!
<ikt> sounds perfect for nbn
<head_victim> The loudest thing in my study is the 24 port switch :/
<ikt> haha
<head_victim> Netgear gs724t 24 port gigabit "smart" switch
<ikt> many fans?
<head_victim> Just one I think
<head_victim> http://www.netgear.com/service-provider/products/switches/smart-switches/gs724t.aspx
<ikt> looks good
<head_victim> Yeah was mean to last me forever
<head_victim> I heard abotu ipv6 about 6 months after buying those 2 items
<ikt> running F@H on my comp atm, fan is making a racket but also heating room, so I just live with it
<ikt> ah
<ikt> they should do
<head_victim> Nah the router for sure doesn't yet to my knowledge
<ikt> dual wan would be good if you needed 2 isp's
<ikt> afaik NBN router has 2 wan's enabled by default
<head_victim> It does fallover, load balance and separation of services
<ikt> so you can have 2 seperate isp's
<head_victim> Million dollar question
<head_victim> There is only a single fan (I'll pulled the case apart) that's a blow through, it's not actually connected to anything but the case. Do I disconnect it or now :/
<head_victim> Better solution - http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=9_506&products_id=6016
#ubuntu-au 2013-05-21
<ikt> hey all
<Noskcaj> hello ikt 
<ikt> what's going on?
<Noskcaj> not much.
<Noskcaj> i have to go now, air force cadets
<jared> ikt: that bitly stuff is a bit unsettling
<jared> 2
#ubuntu-au 2013-05-23
<roshambo> hi all
<roshambo> is anyone having issues with aussie ubuntu mirrors today?
<roshambo> apt-get is saying connection refused for aarnet, iinet and internode mirrors, but i can wget the files just fine
<roshambo> logically this indicates a problem with apt-get but nothings changed since yesterday when it was working
<jea> have you tried the overseas mirrors, and do they work?
<jea> I just tried an apt-get update and upgrade, and both worked properly with local mirrors
<roshambo> ok
<roshambo> must be some weirdness here then
<roshambo> thanks!
#ubuntu-au 2013-05-24
<New2Ubuntu> Hello
<Noskcaj> hello New2Ubuntu 
<New2Ubuntu> Was starting to think its a bit quiet lol
<New2Ubuntu> Any chance I could ask a few questions ?
<Noskcaj> sure, if you need help #ubuntu will get you better answers though
<New2Ubuntu> Im there as well lol
<New2Ubuntu> Just thought I would check the aussie room out as well lol
<New2Ubuntu> Just started using 12.4 would this be a good version to start on ?
<Noskcaj> New2Ubuntu, yep, try and make sure it's the 12.04.2 version
<New2Ubuntu> Thats the one
<New2Ubuntu> Its quite a good layout
<New2Ubuntu> Coming from windows user perspective
<Noskcaj> good to hear
<New2Ubuntu> I notice you can do a lot from the terminal
<New2Ubuntu> Is there a user manual
<New2Ubuntu> silly question *go's to google*
<Noskcaj> New2Ubuntu, no real user manual, but most programs have a command list
<New2Ubuntu> so like windows you need anti virus or firewall software or can this all be set via terminal ?
<Noskcaj> New2Ubuntu, you don't need antivirus for linux, it's essentially virus proof
<New2Ubuntu> Ok what about unwanted access
<New2Ubuntu> Are there monitoring tools ?
<debenham> yes, ranging from simple scripts, to firewalls (such as ufw) to full on monitoring systems
<debenham> but by default most systems are only listening for ssh connections so the attack vector is much smaller than other OS's
<debenham> (some OS's)
<debenham> Easiest way if you are worried is to use a simple firewall such as https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UncomplicatedFirewall
<debenham> note: have a look around on that wiki - lots of good info there
<New2Ubuntu> Great thats for the info
<New2Ubuntu> ty bbl need a restart
#ubuntu-au 2013-05-25
<Noskcaj> is anyone else watching the Storm VS Roosters match?
<jea> jared: around?
<jared> jea: sort of, doing uni work as always :)
<jea> I got fed up, and sent a reply to a Michael thread
<jared> jea: yeah lots of noise on that list lately. Fortunately there has been some good stuff, pity about the rest.
<jea> Yep. He has just replied, and has not got the point of my message at all. I really hope he reads the Translations wiki as David suggested again
<jea> I am a developer, but all I have done within Ubuntu is translations - I just understand that you have to read documentation sometimes
<jared> You mean reading the documentation you translate is useful, no way!
<jea> Who would have thought
<jared> He wants to blank an entire locale?
<jea> yep
<jea> I don't think he gets it
<jea> Aparently one person did some bad translations, so Michael basically took him out of the team
<jea> and since then, he has wanted all translations in his locale to be blanked
<jared> WOuldn't it be easier to get a database dump of what that individual did?
<jea> That has been suggested
<jea> you can also see a list of what they have done through launchpad, i think
<jared> It would be funny it it wasn't so sad.
<jea> I am glad David pointed out the CoC. I was about to do it, but thought I would wait for the reply
<jared> I found translations quite easy to follow on the wiki. I don't know what this guy's problem is. "I didn't read the manual and now it's all gone crappy". Well, duh.
<jea> I must say that if he was on my translations team, I would have politely asked him to leave by now
<jared> Maybe he needs to sit in one of the online training sessions
<jea> is there one coming up soon?
<jared> Not sure, was just referring to the open weeks and developer weeks, etc
<jea> Yep. I should volunteer to run it...
<jared> I couldn't restrain :/
<jea> I think that should hopefully sum it up for him
<jea> Good to see that David is explaining it too him fairly clearly
#ubuntu-au 2014-05-20
<deserted> hey all, anyone here had much experience with custom upstart jobs?
<jea> I can't say I have done much of that myself
<deserted> hey bicranial you from Tassie to?
#ubuntu-au 2014-05-21
<bicranial> hey deserted, sure am
#ubuntu-au 2014-05-23
<owh> Man this place is going off!
#ubuntu-au 2015-05-21
<juzCnc_> Hi guys, is there a way to install a display port driver for unbuntu 10.04?
<juzCnc_> What should I be looking into to do backporting for graphic drivers?
#ubuntu-au 2016-05-24
<nich> hey, where do i report stuff like this? http://www.ubuntulovefoundation.org/
#ubuntu-au 2017-05-25
<lee234> lol
#ubuntu-au 2017-05-26
<guiverc_t> AU folks - just looked @ wiki - it links to non-existing site, non-existing planet. etc.   should i clean 404-sites from wiki??  (email sent to jared; head_victim)
#ubuntu-au 2018-05-27
<snafu_> <Karma157?
