#ubuntu-desktop 2009-02-09
<crevette> good morning
<didrocks> morning crevette o/
<crevette> salut didrocks
<crevette> salut seb128
<seb128> lut crevette
<didrocks> plop seb128 :)
<mvo> good morning seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> hey mvo
<mvo> hey crevette, didrocks
<crevette> hello mvo
<seb128> didrocks: had fun at fosdem this weekend?
<seb128> mvo: did you have a nice travelling back?
<didrocks> hi mvo
<didrocks> seb128: oh yeah, it was really fun :)
<crevette> who is managing the bluez package usually, because it uses bzr for the packaging and it wasn't updatd for a while? As I did few of the last upstream update I wanted to push the changes
<didrocks> seb128: I have a message for you from vuntz: "you are not kind at all for not coming" :)
<seb128> ah ah ah
<mvo> seb128: yes, slept half of it :) so it went by pretty fast
<didrocks> seb128: I met james_w, keybuck, and some other (but few) canonical boy.
<seb128> didrocks: lool was there too no?
<mvo> I do a clutter update in my ppa and will package metacity-clutter - or did anyone look at this already?
<didrocks> so, appart from sharing my room for 2 days with huats, everything were really enjoyable
<didrocks> (joking :))
<mvo> haha
<crevette> :)
<seb128> mvo: the mail from pitti suggested that the code is no ready to be shipped yet
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I just saw him, but not talk with him
<seb128> oh, huats was there too
<mvo> I would have loved to come, but it conflicts with the sprint for me
 * pitti hugs seb128, mvo, and didrocks, good morning
<seb128> I'm wondering if he will manage to get this gnome-keyring update done one day ;-)
<seb128> he's working on it for 3 weeks now
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<didrocks> Hi pitti :)
<mvo> seb128, pitti: the mail I have about metacity-clutter is that someone should have a look at it, no?
<didrocks> seb128: well. He fights with it :) Even he asks something about it to vuntz
<pitti> mvo: just whether someone has an opinion about its readiness
<didrocks> seb128: I know that his libgda update is ready, but he does not know how to test it
<pitti> mvo: if you want to play around with it, I won't stop you, of course :-P
<mvo> :)
<mvo> I will, should be quick (I hope)
 * crevette is working on libopenobex-1.4 and he has some pain :)
<seb128> mvo: there is an another thread going where you are not cc-ed, and pitti states that's mirco said it's not ready to be used yet
<mvo> aha
<seb128> didrocks: to be honest I don't care about libgda, gnome-desktop is stopping GNOME updates where libgda is not really used
<didrocks> seb128: appart for my python-gnome-extras update :)
<seb128> didrocks: btw were you supposed to work on the gnome-python update too?
<didrocks> seb128: yes, I will do it tonight, as well as on gtkmm
<seb128> ok
<didrocks> but I fell that gtkmm will be a pain as everything is patched inline...
<seb128> ?
<mvo> james_w: hi! I hope you had a good trip. did you seed apt-transport-https already? if not, I can do it here
<seb128> it's not
<didrocks> seb128: sure ? Let me look at the diff.gz
<seb128> didrocks: it's package in the pkg-gnome svn where only the debian directory is stored so if there is changes not in the diff.gz that's an error
<seb128> mvo, pitti: btw extra hand on desktop sponsoring are welcome if you have some time this week, I've been fighting the queue a bit during the sprint but there is still lot
<pitti> right, on my list
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<pitti> seb128: I'm currently fixing pkgstriptranslations to not break the publisher on parallel builds
 * crevette is feeding the sponsoring queue
<crevette> :)
<pitti> seb128: I think the buildds set DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=parallel or so
<seb128> pitti: oh, you found the bug?
<pitti> seb128: which makes glib2.0 create broken translations.tar.gz
<didrocks> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/115888/
<mvo> seb128: sure, is all on the sponsoring queue?
<seb128> mvo: yes
<pitti> seb128: looking at the build log and debian/rules, it's the only explanation I have (things do run in parallel there)
<didrocks> seb128: there is a lot of autotools changes but also other one (like gtkmm-1.2.10/src/gtk--/base.h
<seb128> mvo: just pick anything on dholbach's page if you want, I commented on totem-pl-parser but didn't start on it so you can do and totem or anything else there
<seb128> didrocks: it just seems that whoever did the previous update screwed his autoreconf patch build
<didrocks> seb128: can autoreconf changes .h files?
<seb128> didrocks: is it using a patch system or not?
<seb128> didrocks: why not, if there is a corresponding .in and a rule to update those or if those are automatically build by some tools
<didrocks> seb128: it's not using one apparently (I have to check further, btw)
<didrocks> seb128: as we are in sync with debian, setup one is not a great idea, is it?
<seb128> didrocks: the 2.14.1 copy on my disk uses simple-patchsys in its rules
<didrocks> seb128: ok, so, I will run it and make it clean
<seb128> didrocks: ok good
<lool> didrocks: You should have said hi!
<crevette> hello lool
<lool> Hey
<seb128> lut lool
<seb128> lool: how was fosdem this year?
<lool> It was packed with people, but I saw less familiar faces as usually
<lool> I was relatively unlucky in my talk attendance in that the interesting ones were happening together and the others I had seen a couple of times already
<lool> But it was great to see a bunch of people and some interesting presentations nevertheless!
<lool> Less so to get my luggage stolen afterwards though
<mvo> lool: oh? someone stole your stuff :( ?
<mvo> at fosdem?
<seb128> lut huats
<huats> hello seb128
<seb128> huats: how is gnome-keyring going?
<lool> mvo: No, in the train station  :-/
<huats> seb128: not much to say
<seb128> lool: oh :-(
<lool> With some dev hardware in it unfortunately (as I wasn't flying)
<huats> the upstream seems to be unable to fix the LDFLAGS stuffs
<mvo> lool: right, that sucks :(
<lool> In practice, I didn't lose any non-replaceable stuff or personal or company data, but I did lose some expensive devices sadly
 * seb128 hugs lool
<seb128> not lucky
 * seb128 notes to not let unattended luggage at train station either
<lool> It was on my side, like 2 cms away (really) but I was buying a book in a press shop and the guy just took it as if it was his
<lool> I noticed 30 seconds later, but outside everybody has a luggage
<didrocks> lool: I am so shy, you know :p But I will not miss next time, promess (I just saw you far far away on the opening conf)
<huats> lool: oh... that sucks !
<didrocks> lool: In Bruxelles train station?
<didrocks> lool: yeah, that really sucks :/
<lool> didrocks: Yes, in Bruxelles Midi
<crevette> salut huats
<seb128> pitti: btw http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/seahorse?view=revision&revision=2774
<seb128> crevette: you are working on the obex server update?
<crevette> obex-data-server ? done, and in lp
<huats> hello crevette
<seb128> crevette: ah cool, I though other libs updates were required
<crevette> it needs eventually libopenobex 1.4 which is not packaged yet, but it seems too hard for me, anyway I'm trying to package it
<pitti> seb128: rocking!
<crevette> seb128: but I didn't check symbols differences
<seb128> crevette: is the lib required or not?
<crevette> which one ?
<seb128> libopenobex
<crevette> it can be built against the libopenobex we have in ubuntu now
<seb128> crevette: oh, that's just a lib update?
<seb128> slomo: hey, gst-plugins-good0.10 should be synced?
<crevette> seb128: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/obex-data-server/+bug/327103
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 327103 in obex-data-server "Please sponsor new upstream version into jaunty (0.4.3)" [Undecided,New]
<mvo> seb128: I just checked the updated by chris and its a bit inconvienient to apply them to bzr, I think I wait for him to appear and ask if he can either do debdiffs or a bzr branch
<seb128> ok
<seb128> what is inconvienient?
<seb128> can't you diff the debian directory between version and commit that for the upgrade?
<mvo> seb128: sure, its still a bit inconvinient, a debdiff could be applied right into bzr
<seb128> right
<seb128> you don't want a debdiff though
<mvo> seb128: for the other, I first need to get the tarball, build the source deb, get the old deb, debdiff and then apply that into bzr
<seb128> but a debian directory debdfiff rather
<seb128> right, just try to point him to bzr so he knows for next update, he's quite active on desktop updates and bug triage but I think he's not used to use bzr yet
<mvo> seb128: sure, I added it into one of the bugreport, when he is online I will be happy to mentor him for the bzr stuff
<seb128> ok good
<mvo> I think he is US timezone based
<james_w> mvo: https://code.launchpad.net/~james-w/ubuntu-seeds/platform.jaunty.apt-transport-https
<seb128> not sure but he's usually on IRC in evening european hours
<james_w> mvo: I was going to ask Colin to review
<mvo> james_w: aha, thanks! I leave it to him then
<didrocks> hey james_w ;)
<james_w> hey didrocks, home safely?
<didrocks> james_w: yes, a little bit late, but no problem :) and you?
<james_w> fine thanks
<slomo> seb128: yes
<seb128> slomo: ok good ;-)
<crevette> hey seb128, thanks for the update
<seb128> crevette: you're welcome, thank you for the work ;-)
<crevette> seb128: bah it's a minor package
<seb128> crevette: should the gnome-user-share upload wait until the mdns things is updated?
<crevette> 0.4.4 was just released :)
<seb128> crevette: another update for you then ;-)
<crevette> seb128: yes, IIRC mdns 0.6 is required
<seb128> how did you build and test the update?
<crevette> seb128: yeah
<crevette> I talk with debian openobex developper
<crevette> the 1.5 was released yesterday, and he should buid it b y the middle of feb, is it okay for ubuntu ?
<crevette> seb128: not really
<crevette> let me try
<seb128> crevette: buid it?
<seb128> ah
<seb128> he will upload to debian you mean ?
<seb128> yes, that should be alright
<crevette> yeah I build it myself
<seb128> didrocks: there?
<seb128> didrocks: what update do you still have on your todolist?
<crevette> seb128: wonderful it works and fixes another issue
<crevette> :)
<crevette> now you'll see one feature I've worked on and people never seen
<didrocks> didrocks: I have gnome-python-extras which waits for libgda, gnome-python & gtkmm that I will handle tonight, and evince that is waiting for sponsoring
<seb128> didrocks: oh evince is waiting for review, good, let me do that now
<seb128> didrocks: is gnome-python-desktop also on your list?
<didrocks> seb128: you can see some additional information there: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DidierRoche/MOTU/bugsaction
<seb128> just cleaning tarballs which are not uptodate
<didrocks> (for evince)
<didrocks> and no, but I can take it
<seb128> ah right you told me about that the other day
<seb128> I was in berlin sprinting though and didn't look at it
<didrocks> seb128: no problem, you told me it wasn't possible for you to review it then :p
<seb128> didrocks: ok good, if you don't feel overworked already it's for you ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: I get used to gnome-python* ;)
<seb128> didrocks: sometimes I tell things which make sense ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: only sometimes? That's no usually the case? :D
<seb128> didrocks: this wikipage is amazing, how many centuries did you spend on writing it? ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: it was to "record" my sponsors :-)
<didrocks> seb128: as you can see, most of them aren't described
<didrocks> seb128: but it was really useful for my first package
<seb128> right, most people don't do a such detailled job, it's quite impressive ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: I think it was a real gain to avoid forgetting things
<seb128> didrocks: I don't understand your gconf note there
 * crevette is packaging ods .0.4.4
<didrocks> seb128: hum didn't updated it
<seb128> crevette: good ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: one sec, let me have a look at debian/rules first
<didrocks> (to avoid telling bad things ;))
<crevette> seb128: you seems to be interested by ods, why? just to fix bugs or you'" using bluetooh now ?
<crevette> :)
<seb128> crevette: not especially interested but we had a gvfs bug where obex was not working on a nokia phone which is fixed in the new version
<crevette> which bug ?
<seb128> bug #324246
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 324246 in obex-data-server "bluetooth phone: no files when browsing" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/324246
<seb128> I already closed it
<crevette> I admit I don't test all use caseq, like obex://
<didrocks> seb128: that's there. There is something I didn't understand in the package. Let me explain:
<didrocks> seb128: so, I changed the DESTDIR from debian/evince to debian/tmp
<seb128> crevette: don't worry it's still early in the cycle and the upstream diff looks alright
<didrocks> the gconf schemas were in debian/tmp/etc. In evince.install I added debian/tmp/etc/gconf
<seb128> didrocks: you can as well drop the line
<didrocks> seb128: ok, I will know that's a possibility :)
<seb128> it was there from the time where evince-gtk was built I think, the default is tmp when you have several binaries
<Laney> (btw, f-spot might ftbfs and if it does you probably need to add CSC=/usr/bin/csc to the configure arguments)
<didrocks> seb128: when building it, with dh_gconf I thing, the gconf schemas are in debian/evince/etc AND in debian/evince/usr/share...
<didrocks> but finally, in the package, it just remains in /usr/share...
<didrocks> (and there is no rm -rf debian/evince/etc...)
<didrocks> in debian/rules
<didrocks> so, this was a strange behavior I can't explain
<didrocks> seb128: I tried as well not putting in evince.install file this reference (debian/tmp/etc/gconf), but we don't get debian/evince/usr then...
<seb128> didrocks: listing the etc directory is correct
<seb128> dh_gconf does move those to usr
<didrocks> seb128: I use the pbuilder hook to log when the package is built
<didrocks> and I see as well debian/evince/etc/gconf and debian/evince/usr/share/gconf
<seb128> Laney: due to some new changes in the mono stack?
<didrocks> but only the latter is present in the package
<seb128> didrocks: see that where?
<crevette> seb128: I would like to push packaging of ods into VCS, who should I contact
<seb128> didrocks: those are installed in etc and then moved to use when dh_gconf is run
<seb128> crevette: it's already in a vcs apparently, see the control
<didrocks> seb128: where I build my packages...
<Laney> seb128: I'm not sure, but it got dropped in Debian from my Ubuntu patch.
<didrocks> let me check again, but I am almost sure of it
<seb128> Laney: I will sponsor the debdiff on launchpad and we will see what happens ;-)
<seb128> that's the lazy way
<seb128> I will let one of you guys fix it if that breaks
<Laney> heh
<Laney> give it a test build?
<seb128> or get the fix in debian and we can sync the new revision ;-)
<Laney> I asked meembey to upload, we'll see if he does it soon
<Laney> meebey*
<seb128> Laney: I can do that but I need to wait on the new binaries to be published then
<Laney> k
<Laney> I don't think that build-dep version is a problem btw, we have 2.0 in Jaunty anyway
<seb128> didrocks: not sure, I never really bothered about checking the build dir I just look at the debs
<seb128> didrocks: what I now is that upstream uses etc and dh_gconf move the schemas to usr
<seb128> you should have the etc directory in the tmp location
<crevette> seb128: yeah I know, but I wanted to have it merge rather
<seb128> but the evince dir should have only the etc one after the build
<seb128> crevette: well ask mvo for bzr questions ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: yes, but I have another one etc/gconf in debian/evince :)
<didrocks> so, I was surprised to not see it also in the resulting package
<seb128> didrocks: let me review and testbuild your upload so we can continue this discussion
<didrocks> let me check again, two minutes :)
<crevette> seb128: you 'll a lot of handful people to build packages now :)
<didrocks> yes
<didrocks> seb128: oki
<seb128> crevette: that's nice isn't it ;-)
<seb128> desktop team rocks!
<mvo> crevette: I'm around if you have a bzr question
<didrocks> seb128: yes it really rocks \o/
<crevette> a build-farm
<crevette> mvo: I seen that obex-data-server and bluez packaging we're not pushe recently
<seb128> that would be bad citizen work
<crevette> 1) if if want to push changes, should I do a commit per version to fill the gap, or should I just get the latest version and do that in one commit ?
<crevette> seb128: I'm guilty too
<mvo> crevette: just do it with one commit, that will make your work a lot easier I htink
<crevette> mvo: as usual I push it to my branch and you'll do the merge ?
<mvo> crevette: yes, that sounds fine
<seb128> didrocks: one build later
<seb128> $ find debian -name schemas
<seb128> debian/tmp/etc/gconf/schemas
<seb128> debian/evince/usr/share/gconf/schemas
<seb128> didrocks: not, it's not duplicated there
<seb128> didrocks: dunno how you do your builds ...
<didrocks> seb128: I am currently building it again, mayve my memory is very bad :)
<didrocks> maybe*
<didrocks> seb128: if so, that makes sense that dh_gconf do what it claims to do :)
<didrocks> does*
<seb128> didrocks: otherwise the binaries look mostly ok
<didrocks> # find debian -name schemas
<didrocks> debian/evince/etc/gconf/schemas
<didrocks> debian/evince/usr/share/gconf/schemas
<didrocks> debian/tmp/etc/gconf/schemas
<didrocks> in my pbuilder
<didrocks> I am not crazy \o/
<seb128> didrocks: you probably want to install the documentation in the corresponding binaries, ie /usr/share/gtk-doc/html/libevdocument in libevdocument-dev and not evince
<didrocks> (and I check again, the binary does only contains /usr/share..)
<seb128> didrocks: is the directory empty in etc?
<didrocks> seb128: no: http://paste.ubuntu.com/116065/
<seb128> didrocks: weird
<didrocks> seb128: really, isn't it?
<seb128> didrocks: did you run dh_install --list-missing there?
<didrocks> seb128: yes, it was listing .a and .la files
<seb128> didrocks: it would recreate it
<didrocks> but not listing this one
<seb128> ok, so that's due to it
<didrocks> ?
<seb128> the dh_install call redo the install
<seb128> but you don't run dh_gconf after that
<seb128> so you reinstall in etc but don't move those
<seb128> rm the etc dir
<didrocks> ok, that's understable :)
<seb128> run dh_install --list-missing
<seb128> and look it's back there
<seb128> dh_install do its job
<didrocks> let me try
<didrocks> (I was think dh_install --... would not launch dh_install only)
<seb128> dh_* tools don't call other dh_tools
<seb128> that's why you get everything listed in debhelper packages for example
<crevette> mvo: I don't understand, I can 't specify bluez and cannot specify bluez-4.x, what should I do ?
<didrocks> seb128: yes, you right :) that's just strange that dh_install --list-missing is not listing debian/tmp/etc (other it knows from dh_gconf that can be moved)
<didrocks> seb128: thanks a lot for the explanation! What about the documentation, you told me?
<seb128> didrocks: you're welcome
<crevette> mvo: sorry I forgot the pastebin link http://pastebin.com/m22823088
<seb128> didrocks: you should move the api documentation in the corresponding binaries, not in the evince binary
<didrocks> (seb128: I told you I like to understand weird stuff ;))
<seb128> didrocks: and your symlinking in the rules are weird
<seb128> don't do that
<didrocks> seb128: ok for the place (I thing this is an option for dh_installdoc)
<didrocks> seb128: for symlinks?
<seb128> why do you want to change the location?
<didrocks> It was what were used in evince-dbg
<seb128> right, not sure why it's there but that's wrong for libs
<seb128> especially that you install those html in the evince binary which can be not installed
<didrocks> seb128: you just told me to change the location for libevdocument, no?
<seb128> just installed /usr/share/gtk-doc/html/libevdocument in libevdocument-dev and not evince
<seb128> do the same for the other library
<seb128> and drop those weird rules call
<didrocks> even for -dbg one?
<seb128> no, let the dbg the way it is
<seb128> that's coming from debian
<seb128> and doesn't hurt
<seb128> the dbg depends on the binary anyway
<seb128> the libs don't depends on evince
<seb128> just drop your rules hack
<seb128> and update the 3 .install to list only the html api corresponding to each binary
<seb128> each libevince*-dev its documentation
<mvo> crevette: try bzr push --create-prefix lp:~bmillemathias/+junk/bluez-ubuntu for now, look like LP madness
<seb128> evince has /usr/share/gtk-doc/html/evince
<didrocks> seb128: and for libevince* (without -deb)?
<didrocks> -dev*
<seb128> didrocks: in evince
<seb128> or what do you mean?
<crevette> mvo: it's been like that for few days
<didrocks> hum, -dev has a dependency on libev..., that's why I thought a symlink was good
<seb128> but what do you try to get there?
<crevette> mvo: thanks you can get the branch for bluez
<seb128> didrocks: I don't understand what you try to solve
<didrocks> seb128: like for -dbg stuff, a symlink from the -dev documentation on the corresponding binary library doc
<seb128> didrocks: the documentation are installed in debian/tmp/usr/share/gtk-doc/html and used correctly there
<didrocks> right
<seb128> didrocks: install the documentation directly in the libevince*-dev that's how it's done usually
<seb128> no need of any symlink this way
<seb128> the -dbg hack is just to spare CD space I guess or similar
<seb128> since evince and evince-dbg are similar
<didrocks> seb128: and in the binary library (not -dev), just evince documentation?
<seb128> there is no specific documentation for the dbg
<seb128> didrocks: no, nothing in the libs, library should not conflict on soname changes
<seb128> didrocks: there is 3 html directory, one for evince binary and one for each library
<seb128> didrocks: in library you only put the library itself since you want no common files when the soname is changed
<didrocks> seb128: ok, so the documentation for each library must only be put in -dev
<seb128> right
<seb128> if you need to api documentation you probably have the dev installed anyway
<didrocks> seb128: ok, I will note it in my "logging wiki page" :) let me handle that and push a new version
<didrocks> seb128: it was not mentionned in the library classroom, that's the reason I made this way
<seb128> didrocks: oh btw please drop the hildon patch and the lpia build-depends while you are at it
<seb128> didrocks: I got the request from a mobile team guy during the sprint
<didrocks> it's not needed anymore?
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> I thought that the mobile team added extra patch in some way :)
<seb128> the patch was moved out of the patches directory and not used for a while
<didrocks> that's why I kept it :)
<didrocks> no problem*
<seb128> and they don't plan to rewrite it now
<didrocks> oki
<seb128> and the build-depends are outdated and they want to clean some of those packages now
<seb128> so just drop those and the patch in the update
<didrocks> seb128: I will do all that stuff just after a meeting :)
<seb128> didrocks: ok, otherwise pretty good work for a first library split!
<didrocks> seb128: thanks! ;)
<seb128> didrocks: update the descriptions too btw
<seb128> didrocks: "Document (postscript, pdf) viewer - debugging symbols" is the short description for the new libraries ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: ok, wrong copy-paste :-)
<seb128> didrocks: description are usually no fun to write but drop at least the debugging symbols there which is wrong ;-)
<didrocks> yeah, I'm sorry for this :)
<seb128> that's ok
<seb128> didrocks: you could also add libs and libdevel section to those binaries
<seb128> didrocks: and you can also probably remove the cleaning line in the rules for evince and update the .install no to list *.so in the nautilus directory for example but that's a detail
<seb128> didrocks: I think that's all for my comments ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: it was also not mentionned in the classroom too. I have to write a wiki page about it :)
<seb128> where is huats now, he needs to hand me work too ;-)
<didrocks> remove the claning lines in the rules? it will add a new change from debian
<didrocks> cleaning*
<seb128> didrocks: well, reading the comment it was meant to be there because there was no lib split
<seb128> you can let it too if you want that's a detail
<crevette> mvo: is there some kind of branch per ubuntu release ?
<didrocks> seb128: yes. I will try to push those diff to debian back
<seb128> didrocks: they will probably not start on 2.25 now
 * didrocks just finished a copy/paste to be sure to forget anything :)
<didrocks> seb128: but I can still push to aliot svn, right?
<seb128> not really
<didrocks> and once they will want to take it, after lenny release, they will, no?
<seb128> they split by distribution usually
<seb128> ie, if there is already an unstable and an experimental version and want to stay on 2.24 for experimental
<seb128> there is no really a stagging right now there
<seb128> you can try to squeeze that somewhere
<seb128> on send your work as a 2.26 update when 2.26 will be available
<didrocks> ok, and they will only update to 2.26, when unstable will be "Squeeze"?
<seb128> not especially, they could do 2.24 to 2.26 in experimental too
<didrocks> seb128: ok, but only stable GNOME release
<didrocks> so, we push back only stable version, right?
<didrocks> (for GNOME)
<didrocks> in unstable/experimental
<seb128> usually yes
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> a lot of things to note/triage/make clear on the wiki :)
<didrocks> seb128: I will keep you updated when all of this stuff is done
<seb128> ok
<seb128> thanks for the work
<seb128> let me know when the package is updated, I'm rather interested in that than in your wiki documentation ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: thanks to you :)
<didrocks> seb128: yes, I'm sure, you prefer binaries or source :p
<crevette> seb128: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/obex-data-server/+bug/327188 :)
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 327188 in obex-data-server "Sponsor new upstream version (0.4.4)" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> crevette: thanks
<fta2> seb128, evo crashes when i tag a message as junk. known?
<seb128> dunno, I don't use tagging or junk
<seb128> fta2: copy your stacktrace on /usr/share/gtk-doc/html/libevdocument in libevdocument-dev and not evince
<seb128> update
<seb128> fta2: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/dupfinder/simple-dup-finder.cgi
<fta2> gnome bug 569700
<ubottu> Gnome bug 569700 in BugBuddyBugs "crash when canceled during downloading of an image" [Critical,New] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=569700
<fta2> in my case, it's when i junk a message while it's not completely loaded (tons of images)
<seb128> fta2: that's a frequent crasher, I triggered it several times by deleting spams in inbox
<fta2> just started today for me
<crevette> seb128: before doing the sponsor hold a bit if you can I need to add a lp bug being fixed
<seb128> crevette: I was looking at it
<seb128> fta2: right, you probably just upgraded to 2.25.90 today
<seb128> crevette: which one do you want?
<crevette> seb128: 291043
<seb128> bug #291043
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 291043 in obex-data-server "No notification bubble on file reception" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/291043
<seb128> crevette: seems there is no patch to consider there
<crevette> seb128: no, but at least the bug is corrected in gnome-user-share
<crevette> hey cassidy
<seb128> crevette: well do you want to do changes to ods?
<crevette> which changes? to the changelog?
<seb128> crevette: dunno you asked me to wait before uploading, what do you want to change?
<crevette> I wanted to add that it fixes the bug I gave you
<seb128> crevette: but it doesn't
<seb128> crevette: at least 0.4.4 doesn't
<crevette> it did for me
<seb128> 0.4.3 to 0.4.4?
<seb128> ie 0.4.3 was not working?
<crevette> and on the upstream bug I had a confirmation it is fixed by another reporter
<seb128> that's weird
<seb128> there is almost no change there
<crevette> 0.4.3 is fixing the bug
<seb128> ok, that has already been uploaded
<seb128> just close the bug on launchpad
<crevette> yep but I didn't noticed that
<seb128> well listing it as a 0.4.4 fix would be wrong
<crevette> seb128: nothing to expect for intrepid ?
<seb128> just close the bug saying 0.4.3 fixed it
<seb128> no, that's too much of a detail, we got almost no user complain and intrepid is not a lts
<seb128> uploaded
<crevette> thanks a lot
<seb128> you're welcome
<crevette> seb128: sorry for being dumb but how can I close a bug telling it is fixed, perhaps I don't have enough power for that ?
<seb128> click on one of the small arrows in the corresponding line?
<seb128> it should give you an area to write comments and change settings, if some are locked you don't have the bugtriage rights
<crevette> I did set the status for each product in bug 291043, but is ther a way to close the bug globally ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 291043 in obex-data-server "No notification bubble on file reception" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/291043
<seb128> no, that's ok this way
<crevette> hello mclasen
<mclasen> morning
<crevette> seb128: does it exist a script for request sponsorship, because I'm tired to do it manually :)
<seb128> crevette: not that I know but maybe dholbach has one
<seb128> huats: !!!
<seb128> ;-)
<huats> seb128: !!!
<huats> seb128: I haven't forgotten you
<huats> :)
<seb128> good ;-)
<pitti> I'll upload totem{,-pl-parser}? from the sponsoring queue now
<Davedan> I accedently draged the toolbar to the right. how do I put it back in the top of the screen?
<didrocks> Davedan: you can drag and drop it to the top
<didrocks> (just clic in a empty space of the bar)
<Davedan> ok thanks
<didrocks> you're welcome :)
<crevette> hello gentlemen
<huats> hello crevette
<crevette> hey huats
<crevette> tx seb128
<pitti> seb128: just got to sponsoring totem and -plparser, sorry; will do more tomorrow morning
<pitti> tomorrow was too much other stuff going on
<seb128> pitti: thanks, don't worry there is nothing urgent ;-)
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<seb128> didrocks: was that you who I pinged about pidgin some days ago, I'm not sure now?
<seb128> chrisccoulson: good work on those deskop changes ;-)
<chrisccoulson> you're welcome:)
<seb128> chrisccoulson: you should talk to mvo about using bzr btw ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i'll put those changes in to bzr in a bit if they haven't been done already. i didn't realise they were maintained there :/
<seb128> chrisccoulson: since you seem to be looking at f-spot maybe you could have a look at trying to get the other patches which are waiting for sponsoring to debian?
<seb128> chrisccoulson: there is some listed on http://people.ubuntu.com/~dholbach/sponsoring/index.html
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'll take a look at those in a bit
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> apt-get source tell you when something is maintained in bzr
<seb128> easy to not notice if you are used to not read the log though ;-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, and i tend to just manually download the sources instead of using apt-get at the moment, as i still do most things on my intrepid machine, and i don't know if i can use apt-get to download the jaunty sources
<seb128> you can
<seb128> just add a jaunty deb-src source
<seb128> it will get the most recent source
<chrisccoulson> i never thought of that ;) i'll give that a try in a bit
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<seb128> you're welcome
<chrisccoulson> what i really need to do is upgrade this machine to jaunty though, without my partner noticing
<chrisccoulson> is anything happening with the fast-user-switch-applet this cycle?
<seb128> no
<seb128> no switch to the new gdm no change to the applet for jaunty
<seb128> the dxteam is busy working on other things and jaunty is planned to be mostly a bug fix cycle
<chrisccoulson> i was looking at a few bugs for the existing applet and was going to try and fix them, just as long as the applet wasn't going to change much over the next few weeks
<seb128> good idea
<seb128> but the applet will probably change a lot next cycle
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i can imagine. will a lot of our existing patch-set need porting across?
<seb128> if we switch to the new gdm, they rewrote it basically and have different dbus api, different codebase, etc
<seb128> that's to define, it seems people don't agree on the way to go right now
<seb128> the fedora guys are adding status api to gnome-session but there is already some software doing that job correctly
<seb128> so it's not clear what will be used
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it's a little messy at the moment. and the existing applet has some weaknesses (such as no policykit support. i actually work around this at home by patching the applet to just call the session dialog)
<seb128> you can talk to tedg about it, he's the one who worked on the ubuntu changes and is following the upstream discussions
<chrisccoulson> i've just noticed totem failed to build
<chrisccoulson> i missed a Makefile.in from the autotools patch
<seb128> did you test build it?
<seb128> is that one of those cases where autotools get ran when installed which make you not notice build issues? ;-)
<seb128> when using quilt you want to find . -name | xargs quilt add
<chrisccoulson> i built it, but then made a last minute (what i thought was a minor) change before i submitted it
<seb128> or use cdbs-edit-patch to update your changes
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I've to run now but I will have a look to it later if mvo is not quicker ;-)
<chrisccoulson> that's really odd
<chrisccoulson> its actually building at home
<seb128> what I said
<seb128> autotools get ran locally if installed
<seb128> look to your build log
<crevette> seb128: while you're still here, I have a question about nautilus-sendto for universe
<crevette> I didn't had time to look at it
<seb128> crevette: sure
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'll do that once it's finished. i'll prepare a fix for that though in the meantime
<crevette> how can I do to just have the two *.so of the plugins, should I run a rm on all files I don't want
<crevette> ?
<seb128> crevette: either that or install to tmp and use a .install to move what you want to the deb
<seb128> got to go
<seb128> bbl
<seb128> asac: you have some trivial sponsoring bugs waiting you should review those one day ;-)
<asac> seb128: heh
<asac> ;)
<asac> anything particular you have in mind/spotted?
<seb128> asac: I'm just looking through the sponsoring list
<seb128> bug #295788
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 295788 in network-manager-applet "Network Configuration menu item should also be displayed in Xfce" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/295788
<asac> yes. didnt i fix that long ago;)?
<seb128> it's a one liner in a .desktop waiting for a month
<seb128> dunno the bug is still listed
<asac>   * fix LP: #268803 - Ubuntu Intrepid: Both Knetworkmanager and Network
<asac>     Manager load on startup; fix xdg autostart .desktop file to
<asac>     "OnlyShowIn=GNOME;XFCE;"
<asac>     - add debian/patches/lp268803_xdg_autostart_gnome_xfce_only.patch
<asac>     - update debian/patches/series
<asac> thats from -- Alexander Sack <asac@ubuntu.com>  Mon, 01 Dec 2008 14:05:51 +0100
<asac> maybe they want SRU?
<seb128> asac: that's not the autostart there but the menu item for the configuration dialog
<asac> heh :)
<seb128> asac: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/21173925/network-manager-applet_lp_295788.patch
<seb128> asac: bug #283416 too
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 283416 in network-manager "one should have /etc/init.d/network-manager status option as well" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/283416
 * asac should probably not work now ;)
<seb128> asac: the debian maintainer says they have that option, either copy that or upload the patch or decide that still needs discussion and unsubscribe the sponsoring team there
<asac> seb128: hey, i know how to process that ;)
<seb128> asac: would be nice to clean the sponsoring list a bit so dholbach doesn't get depressed ;-)
<seb128> it's over a screen for main right now
<asac> true
<huats> seb128: hey
<seb128> lut huats
<huats> I am finishing my last build of gnome-keyring right now
<huats> ...
<seb128> huats: ohh ;-)
<huats> I have asked upstream for any opinion
<seb128> huats: the upstream change is working?
<huats> haven't tested yet
<huats> (sorry)
<huats> I will do another one after that one :)
<huats> seb128: I have found that mandriva has included the ui files
<huats> so I have added them too :)
<seb128> ;-)
<huats> (ok I know it is bad to look over his neighbour shoulder)
<seb128> huats: open source is about sharing experience ;-)
<cj> seb128: hey there
<cj> seb128: I'm jhbuilding up so I can build a patch to put gtkglarea in gtk-shallow/gtk/gtkglarea.[ch]
<cj> I'll go re-read your comments on the bug.  :)
<seb128> ?
<seb128> I don't think I know about any gtkglarea bug
<seb128> I do comments on hundred of bugs every week so some context is usually useful
<cj> bug 119189
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 119189 in linux-source-2.6.22 "[gusty] all the gusty's kernel are bugging with my DVDRom" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/119189
<cj> I thought for certain I saw your name on it somewhere...
<seb128> not likely
<seb128> that is a linux bug
<seb128> I'm working on desktop packages usually
<cj> no, sorry.  gnome bug 119189
<ubottu> Gnome bug 119189 in general "Add OpenGL support to GTK+" [Enhancement,Assigned] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=119189
<cj> looks like your name is not on it, though
<cj> ubottu: botsnack, but improve in the reading my mind area
<ubottu> Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<seb128> no, and as said I don't know about gtkglarea
<cj> well, then!  disregard :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> enough work for today see you tomorrow
<cj> sleep well!
<pochu> good night seb128
<seb128> huats: don't work too much I will not upload the update before tomorrow now ;-)
<huats> sure
<huats> I will finish it no
<huats> w
<seb128> huats: 'night
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-02-10
<huats> night seb128
<crevette> hello good morning
<seb128> mvo: hello
<mvo> hey seb128
<seb128> mvo: I assigned some trivial sponsoring bugs to you let me know if that's not ok and I will not do it again ;-)
<seb128> mvo: some trivial apt things waiting for weeks
<seb128> the list was several pages long and I decided to help a bit on it so dholbach doesn't have a nervous breakdown ;-)
<mvo> seb128: what wsa the bugnumber for the apt thing?
 * pitti hugs seb128
<crevette> hello seb128 and pitti
<seb128> mvo: bug #263089 bug #224460
<crevette> and mvo
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 263089 in apt "Please translate "dpkg was interrupted, you must manually run 'dpkg --configure -a'" message" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/263089
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 224460 in apt "apt-cache shows misleading dependency information" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/224460
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> lut crevette
<seb128> mvo: the translation one should be easy to review, not sure about the other one, you might want to unsubscribe sponsors if that requires extra thinking or discussions
<seb128> pitti: what do you think about bug #201495? I will try to ping davidz on IRC to get upstream review
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 201495 in policykit-gnome "Policy Kit auth dialogue lists me as "${My Name},,,,"" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/201495
<seb128> mvo: bug #274407 also is a one liner upstream change
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 274407 in compiz "focus does not follow mouse during drag-and-drop" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/274407
<seb128> mvo: and bug #298296 is a typo fix should be trivial
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 298296 in update-manager "Typo in Message window" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/298296
<pitti> seb128: generally looks good, but I haven't really scrutinized the patch; if David is happy with it, sure
<mvo> seb128: thanks, two of them are fix commited, the other needs some love
<seb128> pitti: ok, I will try to get davidz to review it
<pitti> thanks!
<seb128> mvo: can you unsubscribe the sponsor team on those which need work?
<seb128> or give me the number so I can do it for you
<seb128> mvo: not sure what you mean by fix commited btw, the update manager typo fix is fix commited since november, or you mean you commited the fix to your bzr now?
<mvo> seb128: the apt-cache one is probably for apt 0.8 (where some breakage of the output format is ok)
<mvo> seb128: the compiz one I need to talk about with upstream, I'm not sure about possible side effects
<mvo> seb128: the other ones look good and are merged :)
<seb128> mvo: there is a pointer to the upstream bug, they commited the change there with a comment explaining what it does
<seb128> mvo: ok thanks
<mvo> seb128: aha, excellent. it should be in the compiz 0.8 branch then :) I will upload that this week
<didrocks> hi seb128, mvo & pitti!
<didrocks> seb128: no, it was not me for pidgin update :)
<seb128> mvo: good
<seb128> didrocks: hello, ok
<didrocks> seb128: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~didrocks/evince/ubuntu should be ready now :)
<crevette>  I seen chriscoulson did the merge request throught launchpad yesterday
<seb128> didrocks: excellent
<seb128> crevette: right, and I wanted to ping mvo about that
<didrocks> seb128: once done, I will have just one question on gnome-python (but later, I do not have the time now)
<seb128> mvo: for this totem fix, you just bzr get lp-url and bzr merge directory?
<crevette> mvo: if you have time to merge lp:~bmillemathias/+junk/bluez-ubuntu to bluez and lp:~bmillemathias/+junk/ubuntu-obex-data-server-4.x in obex-data-server I'd be thanksfull
<seb128> didrocks: ask now while I'm not too busy ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: I have to check something before, you think it will be ok in less than 10 minutes ? ;)
 * crevette raise its hand for the next question
<crevette> raises
<seb128> didrocks: sure
<seb128> crevette: don't ask to ask just ask ;-)
<crevette> okay, I tried to package nautilus-sendto-universe, with the dh_install, si now I have my *so but also /tmp/buildd in my package so Iwonder if you had time to help me with this
<crevette> and my package is still a bit hackish
<crevette> http://pastebin.com/m2a4874d3 is the diff between nautilus-sendto and -universe
<seb128> crevette: just copy nautilus-sendto
<seb128> crevette: looking
<crevette> http://pastebin.com/m5f6bb8e8 is the content of the package now
<crevette> I'm a bit puzzled by the content of my nautilus-sendto-universe.install
<mvo> crevette: thanks, merging now
<seb128> crevette: right, your --prefix= is wrong
<seb128> use DEB_DESTDIR := debian/tmp rather
<mvo> seb128: yes, ideally a bzr branch, but a patch is fine. for the merge of chris I will probably just diff it myself (unless he is here today and I can ask him to publish his branch)
<seb128> the --prefix is where you will get things installed on your system
<seb128> mvo: pitti did sponsor the totem* updates yesterday
<mvo> seb128: did he merge them into bzr too?
<pitti> yes he did
<mvo> cool!
<seb128> mvo: and he was there yesterday and didn't notice those were using bzr, he said he would be doing updates using it now
<mvo> thanks pitti
<mvo> hm, so the warning in apt should be more prominent?
<seb128> right
<seb128> it seems people are used to not read things apt display
<seb128> I've to admit that after doing some thousand apt-get source I don't read the screen either
<seb128> just apt-get source, switch to something else, get back there after download and start on the update
<seb128> I do read it now because I know about some people using bzr
<seb128> but when you are not aware of that ...
<seb128> I'm not sure the way the message is displayed is the issue though
<seb128> it's just habits which need to be changed
<mvo> crevette: bluez bzr is merged, thanks again (I noticed it got uploaded already, right?)
<crevette> mvo: yep it is, thanks a lot
<crevette> mvo: if there is a better way to ping you on IRC tell me
<seb128> mvo: I did upload obex-data-server and bluez yesterday yes
<mvo> crevette: irc works fine for me
<mvo> crevette: obex-data-server merge too, thanks again!
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<crevette> thanks a lot
<didrocks> seb128: this issue already exists in previous gnome-python package. When executing dh_install --list-missing I have that:
<didrocks> /usr/lib/python-support/python-gnome2/python2.5/gtk-2.0/bonobo/
<didrocks> and yes, python-gnome2.install is : http://paste.ubuntu.com/116383/
<didrocks> oupss, wrong paste for first reference. dh_install give me: dh_install: python-gnome2 missing files (/usr/lib/python*/site-packages/gtk-2.0/bonobo/*.{py,so}), aborting
<didrocks> and the reason is that data are copied into /usr/lib/python-support/python-gnome2/python2.5/gtk-2.0/bonobo/
<didrocks> I think this is a dh_pysupport thing, which is not detected by dh_install --list-missing, right?
<seb128> didrocks: it's likely indeed
<didrocks> seb128: so, it will be hard to check for missing files :/
<seb128> right
<seb128> well the package doesn't change so much
<seb128> read the NEWS
<seb128> list new things otherwise assume it's correct
<didrocks> yes, but it was more for information indeed :)
<didrocks> so a bonus question is this case :)
<didrocks> in the package, there is a patch, that change some Makefile.am
<didrocks> as usually ^^
<crevette> seb128: it seems passing DEB_DESTDIR := debian/tmp fails the package to build --> "libtool: install: `debian/tmp/usr/lib/nautilus-sendto/plugins' must be an absolute directory name"
<didrocks> but the patch that apply it to configure is not used (commented in dpatch): http://paste.ubuntu.com/116386/
<didrocks> so, if this patch is no more necessary, we can bump it
<crevette> should I pass $(CURDIR) ?
<seb128> crevette: right
<crevette> thanks
<seb128> you're welcome
<seb128> didrocks: bump it?
<didrocks> seb128: remove it, sorry
<seb128> didrocks: we discussed this update and said to keep the patch but comment it since it's only useful when building for several python versions which is not the case at the moment but it will be useful again when python 2.6 is there?
<didrocks> seb128: ok, so, there is even no need that I refresh 99-runaclocal+autoconf+automake.dpatch
<didrocks> atm
<seb128> no
<didrocks> seb128: is there a documentation somewhere explaining exactly how this is handled when having serveral python versions? (I am a bit confused with this patch)
<didrocks> just we don't specify an explicit PYTHON_LIBS version...
<seb128> didrocks: "this" being?
<seb128> didrocks: I don't remember the details about this change, the idea was to not depends on a specific python version
<seb128> ie not having a hard depends on python2.4 when building for 2.4 and 2.5
<seb128> the change might not be correct
<seb128> but it was having the right effect
<seb128> there was no depends on a specific python version
<didrocks> seb128: ok, so, I will only keep the main idea for the moment and go further to understand this if the need is still present :)
<didrocks> seb128: thanks a lot. I think the update will be soon available
<seb128> thinking about it now it might be better to just add a line in debian rules to not calculate shlib:Depends for this .so
<didrocks> seb128: yes, it can be wiser, maybe
<seb128> but as said I don't really care right now, it's not required in the current version
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: ok, will see when needed ^^
<didrocks> you're welcome!
<crevette> ls
<crevette> oups :)
<seb128> hey MacSlow huats
<huats> hey seb128
<MacSlow> hey seb128
<seb128> huats: you worked late!
<huats> (and MacSlow too of course)
<didrocks> hey MacSlow & huats
<huats> seb128: I have put the right .diff.gz...
<huats> seb128: sorry...
<huats> I think my yes were not opened enough
<MacSlow> hey huats, didrocks
<seb128> huats: that's ok, seeing the time where you added the diff.gz you should have been to bed ;-)
<huats> seb128: thanks
<huats> have you seen my email ?
<huats> the patches for the libs are working (on my computer)
<seb128> huats: yes
<seb128> and you commented on the upstream bug which is good ;-)
<huats> :)
<seb128> hey tseliot
<tseliot> hey seb128
<tseliot> I'll get back to you with the patches soon. I was too tired to work on them yesterday
<seb128> ok
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hey seb
<rickspencer3> good morning
<seb128> how is the london sprint going ?
<rickspencer3> loooong
<rickspencer3> we're just starting day 4
<rickspencer3> :)
<seb128> ;-)
<rickspencer3> how was the sprint for you?
<seb128> excellent as usual ;-)
<seb128> we got a lot done and it was nice to see everybody
<rickspencer3> me too
<asac> rickspencer31: mpt: did you meet mconnor yet?
<mpt> asac, I did, yesterday afternoon
<seb128> slomo: do you know if gstreamer is still supposed to have issue on online stream song changes nowadays?
<seb128> slomo: ie bug #327475
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 327475 in gstreamer0.10 "Internal data flow error" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/327475
<slomo> seb128: should work nowadays if totem would use playbin2... and it will probably not be ported for 2.26 because it's too late now and everbody is busy
<slomo> seb128: so it's essentially a totem bug, gstreamer is fixed ;)
<seb128> slomo: ok what I though, thanks for confirming
<seb128> somebody should clean all those bugs
<seb128> there is probably a lot of those which will be fixed when totem uses the new playbin version
<slomo> seb128: oh and rhythmbox has the "same" bug of course... and banshee... and... ;)
<seb128> right
<slomo> hadess is aware of the issue though and i bet there's also a bug on totem already
<seb128> right
<seb128> gnome bug #542663
<ubottu> Gnome bug 542663 in GStreamer backend "Port to playbin2" [Normal,New] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=542663
<slomo> thanks
<didrocks> seb128: if you have nobody for pidgin, as other updates seems ok, I can handle it too
<seb128> didrocks: let me check
<seb128> I did ping somebody about that some days ago so I don't want to duplicate work
<seb128> there is other task if you are looking for work though ;-)
<didrocks> why not ^^
<seb128> didrocks: bug #316636, seems nobody is actively working on it
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 316636 in pidgin "Please upgrade to pidgin 2.5.4" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/316636
<didrocks> seb128: ok
<didrocks> I assigned it to myself
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> didrocks: I'm going to sponsor a new pidgin revision now so make sure you get this change when you do the update ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: ok, which revision, so that I can be sure?
<seb128> didrocks: 0ubuntu3
<didrocks> oh well, I will give a look at jaunty-changes
<didrocks> ok :)
<seb128> didrocks: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/22437717/pidgin_2.5.3-0ubuntu3.debdiff
<didrocks> "Windows Live" -> who cares ? :)
 * didrocks runs...
<seb128> ;-)
<crevette> seb128: the package nautilus-sendto-universe is done, however I think it needs some review, 1) on copyright because I don't know if I should let or remove the creator of the nautilus-sendto package; 2) on control.in for dependency, I set a dependency on nautilus-sendto on the same version than nautilus-sendto-universe
<crevette> I put the code on http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~bmillemathias/nautilus-sendto/ubuntu/revision/1
<seb128> crevette: let me look at it
<seb128> crevette: you should update the description
<seb128> crevette: would be nice to have "this package ships the extra feature which require universe dependencies" or something around those lines
<seb128> crevette: also why did you add yourself as upstream author in the copyright?
<seb128> crevette: what you put in the README would be nice in the description
<crevette> ah right I did the README.Debian but forgot that
<crevette> should I add myself to author ?
<crevette> I thought I should add myselft as I modified the package
<seb128> crevette: use rather source:Version that binary:Version for the depends I would say
<seb128> crevette: you added yourself in the upstream authors list ...
<seb128> crevette: upstream means GNOME, the people writting the code
<seb128> crevette: you can add a line after the first one to say that you added changed to it
<seb128> ie, this package was debianised by ... and modified for ubuntu by ...
<seb128> crevette: you can also clean the depends on bluez, thunderbird, etc since those are not required for the universe variant
<seb128> otherwise the update looks correct
<crevette> "otherwise" :)
<crevette> I wonder what is it remains :
<crevette> )
<didrocks> seb128: I wonder what's the difference between ${binary:Version} and ${source:Version}, as all packages must have the same Version?
<seb128> didrocks: what do you mean must have the same version?
<seb128> didrocks: crevette is adding a nautilus-sendto-universe source which builds a nautilus-sendto-universe binary which depends on nautilus-sendto
<seb128> didrocks: ie those are different source packages so they can be out of sync
<didrocks> seb128: oh ok, and ${binary:Version} will be replaced by nautilus-sendto version?
<seb128> no
<seb128> not sure to understand your question
<didrocks> by nautilus-sendto-universe version
<seb128> binary:Version is the version of the package itself not from an another one
<didrocks> hum, I do not how ${binary:Version} and ${source:Version} can be different
<didrocks> see*
<seb128> binNMUs
<didrocks> (you talk previously to replace binary by source)
<didrocks> right, in this case :)
<crevette> source can be 1.1.1 and binary 1.1.1-0ubuntu15 ?
<seb128> we don't have that in ubuntu right now though ;-)
<seb128> but still
<seb128> not a recent to not use the correct one
<seb128> reason
<didrocks> ok, didn't think about binNMU, but right ;)
<crevette> so nautilus-sendo-universe can still be installed if it source matches with the one from nautilus-sendto
<crevette> binNMU ?
<didrocks> (seb128: thanks)
<didrocks> crevette: binary-only non-maintainer upload
<seb128> crevette: debian can do rebuilds of the same source if required
<seb128> so the binaries version doesn't match the source one
<seb128> ie source can be 1-1 and binaries 1-1.1
<jpds> seb128: re: bug #319182 - I tried making a debdiff but it prints out all upstream changes too.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 319182 in python-gdata "Package Update Request: python-gdata" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/319182
<asac> lool: hmmm ... not on -mobile anymore?
<seb128> jpds: right, that's the idea, having an idea of what changed and if the upgrade is a good thing ;-)
<seb128> I'm away for half an hour or so, brb
<seb128> I will look at the evince and gnome-keyring sponsoring request then
<didrocks> seb128: ok, I will be around in case of questions :)
<seb128> cool
<seb128> brb
<asac> lool: are moblin mailing lists known to be down?
<asac> i sent patches, but they don't get through ;)
<lool> asac: ?
<lool> asac: You need to use lists.moblin.org
<lool> asac: The @moblin.org addresses will timeout
<lool> asac: (yay!)
<asac> lool: ah ok ;)
<pitti>  /quit
<Tm_T> pitti: and /exit went to a bar
<jpds> seb128: Stuff requested added to python-gdata bug.
<seb128> ok, I will have a look to that after lunch
<Davedan> how can I edit a file with a gui editor as root?
<Davedan> on the terminal I can just do: sudo nano filename, but I don't no how to do the same with a gui editor
<rickspencer3> Davedan: I'm not sure if this is your question, but most people invoke the graphical editor from the command line as root
<rickspencer3> There's also a channel called #ubuntu that may be better suited for a question like this (assuming i understand your question)
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> Tm_T: :)
<rickspencer3> hey pitti
<jpds> !gksudo > Davedan
<ubottu> Davedan, please see my private message
<Davedan> thanks. I'm reading it
<asac> mvo: apt-transport-https: Depends: libapt-pkg-libc6.9-6-4.7 ... broken!
<asac> transitional state?
<mvo> asac: transitional
<asac> mvo: one archive pulse or should i wait till tomorrow?
<mvo> asac: one more arcive pulse
<asac> cool. thx
<seb128> huats: gnome-keyring update uploaded ;-)
<seb128> huats: good work, that was really a non trivial one
<huats> seb128: cool
<huats> seb128: thanks :)
<huats> i though it was really easy, that is why i decided to put the gcalctool diff.gz :)
<huats> it was funnier ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<huats> seb128: if you have things to do, please let me know
<huats> otherwise I'll give a shot at finishing libgda
<seb128> there is gnome-doc-utils to update which should be easy if you want to do it
<huats> so that I can tackle teh anjuta after
<seb128> otherwise you can continue on libgda, anjuta, etc
<huats> of I'll take that one too...
<seb128> cool
<huats> (libgda is almost done...)
 * calc is at sun and got his internet working :)
<seb128> libgda is blocking didrocks too I think
<huats> seb128: it is
<huats> seb128: i was thinking of the pb gcalctool update
<huats> since we won't have the SRU
<seb128> what do you mean by pb there?
<huats> seb128: sorry
<huats> currently the intrepid version returns some wrong results
<huats> (in some specific cases)
<huats> (that was the reason why I asked for a SRU)
<huats> and i was wondering since the packing iis done, if it worth putting it on my ppa...
<seb128> that seems worth a sru
<seb128> wrong maths is not good
<huats> so that users can have it
<huats> I know...
<seb128> why has the sru idea being discarded?
<seb128> I though there was no bugs worth a sru in the update
<huats> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gcalctool/+bug/306702
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 306702 in gcalctool "gcalctool 5.24.1, won't switch to rad" [Undecided,In progress]
<rickspencer3> bryce: 327175
<rickspencer3> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-input-evdev/+bug/327175
 * didrocks nodes
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 327175 in xorg-server "sometimes loses input devices on suspend/resume" [Unknown,Confirmed]
<didrocks> (and this gcalctool issue seems important. No conversion from deg to rad is some kind of basic stuff :/)
<seb128> didrocks: depends of your users, not really in non scientific world
<seb128> I've to admit I've not used anything than degrees since school
<didrocks> seb128: sure, I used more my hp49 when having to make more complicated calculation
<didrocks> seb128: and also, I never used more complicated things than % from the day I finished my engineering studies. That's a shame :/
<seb128> welcome to the real world ;-)
<seb128> I doubt many people use the desktop calculator to do something else that simple maths
<seb128> the people who need to do maths in their work have probably better tools and the other ones just do basic maths usually
<seb128> Laney: hi, f-spot failted to build on the buildds
<seb128> Laney: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/22442383/buildlog_ubuntu-jaunty-i386.f-spot_0.5.0.3-1ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<seb128> Laney: do you have any idea about the issue? it built correctly locally
<didrocks> seb128: yes, RPN rocks on HP calculator \o/
<seb128> I own a texas calculator and I'm not using rpn ;-)
<didrocks> rpn is good, other things are just evil :-)
<didrocks> seb128: once you know that you have to use 2 [enter] 2 [+], everything's ok :)
<Laney> seb128: Uh
<Laney>    * C# compiler: /usr/bin/mcs
<Laney> this is what I told you yesterday
<seb128> it worked locally though
<Laney> How did you build?
<seb128> let's wait for the new revision to be uploaded to debian and sync that next then ;-)
<seb128> apt-get source, cd source, debuild
<Laney> jaunty?
<seb128> yes
<huats> seb128: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/22442821/buildlog_ubuntu-jaunty-hppa.gnome-keyring_2.25.90-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<seb128> but I might not be uptodate
<huats> :(
<huats> (failed on hppa and armel)
<Laney> I guess you have mcs.exe installed, it would have failed for you in pbuilder
<seb128> huats: kick upstream for using -Werror in tarballs
<seb128> Laney: indeed
<Laney> easy fix if you want to do it, otherwise you can wait for the sync
<huats> seb128: but it builds fine on my pbuilder which is supposed to work like the build system :(
<Laney> meebey has been unwell though, don't know when he'll sponsor it
<seb128> huats: some errors are arch specific
<huats> seb128: ok
<seb128> huats: 32 against 64 bits, etc
<huats> yeah
<seb128> toolchain difference
<asac> mvo: compiz complains about software rasterizer ... is that anything i can enable/disable in xorg?
 * asac would love to use compiz on his ati card
<seb128> huats: ok, so you can work on a gnome-keyring update to not use -Werror if you want now ;-)
<huats> According to the changelog, it is related to : "add -Werror back in when --enable-tests is configured."
<huats> and we do have the --enable-tests configured
<mvo> asac: what ati card do you have?
<seb128> huats: right, not sure why pochu did enable that in debian, let's not use this configure option
<huats> seb128: ok
<asac> mvo: VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc R580 [Radeon X1900]
<asac> mvo: i enabled compise in xorg.conf ... didnt stop X to work at least ;)
<asac> glxgears works too
<asac> s/compise/composite/
<mvo> asac: hm, interessting. but compiz does not work? because of the software raster issue
<mvo> hmmm
<mvo> there is a force option
<asac> mvo: what option should i try?
<asac> Checking for Software Rasterizer: present.
<asac> Software rasterizer detected, abortingaborting and using fallback: /usr/bin/metacity
<asac> mvo: maybe there is a xorg.conf option to enable hardware rasterizer
<asac> ?
<asac> also grep Composite /var/log/Xorg.0.log
<asac> [    0.265380] (**) Extension "Composite" is enabled
<mvo> asac: try "SKIP_CHECKS=yes compiz
 * asac feels brave ;)
<huats> seb128: have you touches anything on the update ? or can I start from the version I have put on LP  ?
<seb128> huats: you can use the lp version
<asac> mvo: without --replace?
<asac> hmm ... seems to not work. i get a white screen
<seb128> somebody told me during the sprint that it was always doing replace
<asac> ah ok. doesnt make a difference anyway
<mvo> asac: should work
<Amaranth> asac: perhaps you have a permissions problem on /dev/dri/card0
<Amaranth> that was causing the same kind of problem on intel for me at one point
 * asac looks
<Amaranth> it should be 666
<asac> Amaranth: there is no such /dev entry
<Amaranth> well then
<Amaranth> fglrx?
<Amaranth> if not, there is your problem :P
<asac> Amaranth: no ati
<asac> glxinfo  | grep direct
<asac> direct rendering: Yes
<Amaranth> yeah, exactly what mine would say
<asac> glxinfo  | grep Raster
<asac> OpenGL renderer string: Software Rasterizer
<Amaranth> pastebin your xorg.0.log and the full output of glxinfo
<asac> http://paste.ubuntu.com/116457/ (glxinfo)
<asac> http://paste.ubuntu.com/116460/ (xorg log)
<asac> Amaranth: ^
<seb128> didrocks: the update looks correct, the short description could be better though, and maybe change the hildon mention to say "by the mobile team request" rather than saying it's not needed, it's rather than it needs to be rewritten I think
<didrocks> seb128: ok. I change these
<mvo> asac: did SKIP_CHECKS=yes not help?
<mvo> asac: you should at least see a diffrent error message :)
<seb128> mvo: he got a white screen apparently
<mvo> aha
<asac> mvo: heh. well, i get a white screen :)
<asac> it continues and spits out a bunch of meta city warnings/errors
<asac> mvo: http://paste.ubuntu.com/116464/
<asac> hell whats going on
<asac> i have compiz now ... i think
<asac> what i did was run compiz -c -> then it locked up and i restarted gdm from console
<asac> mvo: ^^
<asac> let me try EXA now (currently have XAA enforced)
<mvo> asac: ha! that might be the issue
<asac> mvo: well ... so now compiz is on ... (it was before with XAA even)
<asac> but its snail slow
<mvo> asac: is it still using software for the rastering? I guess its simply that the hardware support is not yet there for your card
<asac> hmmm seems its just composite
<asac> desktop effects is off
<asac> let me try
 * asac gives up
<asac> back to Xaa without composite and metacity ;)
<pitti> ArneGoetje, bryce, Riddell: here?
<asac> 1500UTC?
<pitti> oh, we start at :30 nowadays, right
<asac> heh
<asac> i think before that it was 1600UTC
<pitti> right, it's actually 16:30
<Amaranth> oops, cable guy showed up
<didrocks> asac: pitti : you just have to make a bisection between your two thoughts :)
<Amaranth> asac: reading now
<Riddell> hi
<asac> so in 30 or 90 minutes ;)?`
 * asac confused ... logs into his calendar
<asac> ok meeting is in 90 minutes according to calendar ;)
<bluesmoke_> [    0.651249] (WW) RADEON(0): Direct rendering disabled
<bluesmoke_> [    0.651352] (II) RADEON(0): XAA Render acceleration unsupported on Radeon 9500/9700 and newer. Please use EXA instead.
<bluesmoke_> [    0.651372] (II) RADEON(0): Render acceleration disabled
<asac> Amaranth: i tried EXA ... didnt help.
<Amaranth> asac: So using XAA is actually the same as disabling all acceleration, apparently
<Amaranth> hmm
<asac> not sure if i get the same error though
<Amaranth> [    0.651228] (==) RADEON(0): Backing store disabled
<bryce> pitti: yep
<Amaranth> You got some funny thing in xorg.conf?
<seb128> asac: 85 minutes indeed
<asac> Ampelbein: Option          "AccelMethod"            "XAA"  Option "XAANoOffscreenPixmaps" "true"
<asac> those are the only options
<asac> let me check for the error output when running EXA
 * asac fiddles with xorg.conf
<pitti> bryce: sorry, mixed up time; still 1:30 hours to go
<bryce> pitti: yeah, seemed a bit early.  ;-)  If not for the jet lag I'd still be asleep. ;-)
<Amaranth> asac: you also apparently have some extra input options setup although that shouldn't matter to this
<Amaranth> asac: sudo mv /etc/X11/xorg.conf ~      then restart X :)
<Amaranth> That's what bryce always says, anyway
<asac> Amaranth: ... in the past i ended up in bad situations with no xorg.conf ... but i can try
<asac> let me first try SKIP_CHECKS with EXA again
<seb128> asac: try UXA ;-)
<Amaranth> don't use SKIP_CHECKS unless it's failing on a blacklist
<Amaranth> everything else being checked is "compiz doesn't work without this" stuff
<bryce> pitti: say, how can I get the source for usplash 0.5.27?
<pitti> bryce: debcheckout -a usplash
<pitti> bryce: and then branch off the 0.5.27 tag
<bryce> pitti: thanks
<pitti> bryce: or download it from https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/usplash
<asac> so without xorg.conf i end up with C64 screen resolution on my 24" monitor ;)
<asac> but lets check whether it helps for compiz
<Amaranth> haha
<asac> so software randerization is still on -> now trying SKIP_CHECK again
<bryce>  64 RAM SYSTEM  38911 BASIC BYTES FREE
<bryce> READY.
<Amaranth> asac: With software rendering you're either going to get a white screen or 1 frame every 5 seconds which will look like it froze
<pitti> bryce: C64 â¥
<asac> [    0.710959] (==) RADEON(0): Backing store disabled
<asac> [    0.710978] (WW) RADEON(0): Direct rendering disabled
<asac> but i get direct rendering: in glxinfo
<asac> [    0.711019] (II) RADEON(0): EXA Composite requires CP on R5xx/IGP
<asac> what does that mean?
<asac> CP?
<asac> i think UXA fell back to EXA
<bryce> asac, don't think UXA is available for -ati yet
<asac> argh ... gnome-terminal is soooo slow with EXA
 * asac goes back to XAA
<bryce> hmm, I'm running EXA on a R5xx here with no perf problems
<seb128> didrocks: evince uploaded now
<asac> bryce: really?
<asac> bryce: you must have magic hands ;)
<didrocks> seb128: thanks :-)
<bryce> (**) RADEON(0): Using EXA acceleration architecture
<bryce> 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller [0300]: ATI Technologies Inc RV535 [Radeon X1650 Series] [1002:71c7] (rev 9e)
<bryce> asac: I had problems getting it working on an R6xx card, but R5xx has been fine
<mvo> for my Radeon Mobility X1400 it works pretty well too
<bryce> small cursor corruption sometimes, but that's minor
<asac> R580 [Radeon X1900]
<asac> probably too gamerish ;)
<bryce> asac: if you have a bug open on it, I can forward it upstream for you at least.
<asac> bryce: cant you use the "EXA slow on ati by default" bug i opened?
<bryce> asac: yes I can.
<asac> let me find that
<asac> sigh ... bryce what is the source package for ati again?
<bryce> xserver-xorg-video-ati
<bryce> didn't see a bug by you there... looking through your reported bugs
<asac> hmm
<asac> where did it go :/
<asac> maybe reassigned?
<bryce> the launchpad ogre ate it?
<bryce> maybe, but no bugs mentioning "EXA" in your reported bugs list
<asac> against what?
<bryce> against anything
<asac> i didnt find any from me against -ati ;)
<asac> Bug 315889
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 315889 in hal "EXA has severe performance impact on ATI R580 (X1900) (dup-of: 306014)" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/315889
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 306014 in hal "HAL does not apply ACL on DRM device" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/306014
<asac> what happend to that :(
<asac> went to hal and duped ;)
<asac> is that the correct rational for that bug?
<bryce> ahh...  we did have some issues related to the /dev/dri/* permissions that ended up being a hal typo
<bryce> but that's fixed since a couple weeks or so
<asac> ok i undupe
<huats> how can I testrun gnome-doc-tool ? does anybody see a way ?
<asac> bryce: done.
<asac> bryce: hmm. i see that i have still fglrx module loaded. could that be the problem?
<bryce> yes
<bryce> purge that
<mvo> aha, right
<mvo> the fglxrx problem
<asac> heh
<asac> so its a known issue ;)?
 * asac feels like this could help
<bryce> asac: yeah many issues arise from having leftover bits of fglrx installed when using -ati
<bryce> probably #1 issue we have with ATI in general
<seb128> due to the libGL divert?
<seb128> I got bitten by that too
<asac> so fglrx-source should Break: -ati driver?
<bryce> libgl* conflicts are the most common
<asac> performance looks good on exa now
<asac> great
<bryce> sweet
<asac> now going for compiz ;)
<asac> too bad still software rasterizer
<Tm_T> asac: try Kwin instead (;)
<asac> but ok ... enough achieved for today ;) -> EXA
<bryce> asac, :-)
<bryce> some more info is available at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RadeonDriver
<bryce> asac, (and I'm curious whether this helps your sauerbraten issue at all)
<huats> seb128: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-keyring/+bug/327643
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 327643 in gnome-keyring "Please sponsor gnome-keyring 2.25.90-0ubuntu2 into jaunty" [Wishlist,Fix committed]
<asac> bryce: sauerbraten ;)?
<seb128> looks german
<seb128> huats: uploaded
<huats> seb128: ok
<huats> great !
<asac> bryce: ok so this didnt help for my ET QW game ;)
<asac> still performing slow
<asac> but well
<asac> back to work ;)
 * bryce returns to playing with usplash diffs
<bryce> ok, reverting kees' last change and building my own debs seems to work ok
<seb128> and do you get the issue using the current version and building your own debs?
<bryce> seb128: that's next
<seb128> ok
<Davedan> hi. when I'm trying to type a single quote ' in the command line I get ` only on the seccond press
<Davedan> how can I fix/change that?
<bryce> weird, I can't drag my panels around anymore after an xrandr clone event
<seb128> bryce: you have to use alt to dnd those in jaunty (just in case you didn't know that's required now)
<bryce> AHHH
<bryce> seb128: ok didn't know that
<seb128> it was too easy to dnd them by mistake and get confused users before
<bryce> seb128: well that should cut down on confused users
<seb128> right
<bryce> yeah, both my mother and wife have gotten things messed up due to it
<bryce> when I visit my mother I always have to straighten out her toolbars from whereever they got stuck ;-)
<bryce> er s/toolbars/panels/
<seb128> should not happen in jaunty then ;-)
<bryce> guess that's going to be a nice complement to ctrl-alt-backspace going away
<Davedan> anyone knows what can cause the single quote button not to work?
<bryce> Davedan: many things
<Davedan> I didn't change anything in the setup
<bryce> hal, xkeyboard-config, hardware problem, on and on
<bryce> Davedan: did you review /var/log/dpkg.log for recently changed packages?
<Davedan> bryce: no. what do I need to do?
<bryce> try downgrading things that look like viable candidates (debs may still be in your /var/cache/apt/)
<Davedan> this is a clean install
<Davedan> I didn't put anything that should mess with UI or keyboard
<bryce> what keyboard layout?  us?
<Davedan> only apache, mysql stuff
<Davedan> yes
<seb128> do you get the same issue in gtk applications?
<bryce> what kind of keyboard?  anything unusual?
<Davedan> Microsoft wireless
<bryce> mm.  usb?
<Davedan> yes
<bryce> got another keyboard you could test with?
<Davedan> yes
<bryce> that'll be the easiest thing to test first
<seb128> do you get the same issue in gtk applications?
<Davedan> let me check both things
<Davedan> yes I get the same issue with gedit
<Davedan> I'll check a different keyboard but it'll require a restart
<Davedan> thanks
<Davedan> maybe it'll be simpler. does double quotes and single quotes do the same in the command line?
<bryce> Davedan: often
<bryce> Davedan: another thing to try is to run 'xev' and see if it receives your ' key
<Davedan> what 'xev' does?
<bryce> Davedan: I assume ' and " are on the same key?  and the latter works but not the former?
<Davedan> yes
<bryce> Davedan: it prints the keycodes received by the system at the X layer
<mvo> ember: thanks a lot for the brasero update, doing it now
<Davedan>  bryce: I see that but don't understand what to do with it
<ember> cool, thanks.
<Davedan> sombody said something about composing
 * asac grabs some food
<seb128> asac: getting energy for the meeting? ;-)
 * bryce --> coffee
 * pitti -> sponsoring
<pitti> :)
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<pitti> I did mutt and lintian, doing monodoc and squid now
<crevette> hey
<Davedan> bryce: changing the layout from US internation to UK fix it. thanks!
<crevette> seb128: I've updated my branch for nautilus-sendto-universe with you comments, what should I do now? I guess I should open a bug to have this package included in universe now.
<Davedan> now I have to work :(
<seb128> crevette: right
<crevette> Okay I'll do that tonight
<seb128> crevette: open a bug on ubuntu and subscribe the universe sponsor team to the bug
<crevette> Need to go back home, my 2 days off are finished :/
<crevette> yep
<seb128> see you later!
<crevette> see you
<pitti> seb128: shall I do gnome-themes?
<calc> where should i tell this user to file the bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openoffice.org/+bug/267371/comments/40
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 267371 in gvfs "[gvfs] [smb] Damaged OpenOffice files from samba shares" [High,Confirmed]
<calc> that particular comment on the bug
<calc> seb128: i'm guessing it might be gvfs but not completely certain
<seb128> pitti: yes please, I've done enough sponsoring for today, I will sponsor gnome-desktop for tseliot when ready but everything else is free for upload
<pitti> seb128: ack
<seb128> danke
<seb128> calc: the comment is not especially clear on how exactly to trigger the bug, if there is exact steps on how to trigger the bug that would be nice, then open it on bugzilla.gnome.org
<calc> ok
<pitti> *DING* meeting time
<seb128> *DONG*
<asac> hi
<pitti> ArneGoetje, Riddell, tkamppeter: ping?
 * calc isn't sure if he'll be here the whole meeting but will be here at least part of it
<pitti> calc: that's ok, I already marked you as "excused" :)
<pitti> calc: how's the Sun?
<seb128> anybody on jaunty amd64 to run "chrpath -l /usr/lib/python-support/python-gconf/python2.5/gtk-2.0/gconf.so"?
<calc> pitti: pretty good :)
<asac> hope better than our Snow here ;)
<seb128> that's for bug #327671
<calc> snowed here this morning, heh
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 327671 in gnome-python "python-gconf: built with rpath" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/327671
<asac> calc: are you in hamburg ;)?
<tseliot> seb128: sorry but my bzr seems broken and I can't push my changes
<pitti> everyone made it back in one piece?
 * pitti enjoyed the sprint, and we got great work done
<seb128> tseliot: can you upload the debdiff on your webpage?
<Riddell> hi
<tseliot> seb128: sure
<calc> asac: yea
<pitti> Riddell: Hey Mr. KDEMaster!
<tkamppeter> hi
<pitti> ok, let's start
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-02-10
<pitti> has the current reports and agenda
<tseliot> seb128: is it ok if I use version 1:2.25.5-0ubuntu2
<tseliot> ?
<pitti> nobody sent in agenda items, not surprising at this time, though :)
<pitti> = Outstanding actions from last meeting =
<pitti> Riddell: are you still blocking on anything MIRish?
<Riddell> no I think I'm good now
<bryce> Davedan: ok cool good to hear
<pitti> cool
<pitti> for the graphical installer, I'll take the action point of getting this discussed
<asac> Riddell: note: ask you can see in my activity report i talked to upstream about jsapi policy ... seems that things are moving
<seb128> tseliot: yes
<Riddell> asac: oh nice
<pitti> ACTION: pitti to discuss graphical installer requirements with Steve George, Colin, and Rick
<asac> Riddell: with some luck we can get that for jaunty ... but dont want to promise too much yet
<Riddell> asac: right.  it's not a major issue if not
<pitti> asac: is that blocking something?
<pitti> ok, seems not
<asac> pitti: i think having google gadgets
<asac> on kde desktop
<asac> in main
<pitti> right, I remember the stable ABI discussion
<Riddell> yeah, fun but not a required feature
<asac> sure. thought it was shiny though
<asac> and shiny is good (havent tested myself)
<pitti> *bling* :)
<pitti> ok, === Sponsoring ===
<pitti> The queue was immense on the weekend, and thanks to the unstoppable Seb it's much less scary now
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> but still scary enough that we should put some extra effort into it
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * asac hugs seb128 
<asac> also for prodding me
 * seb128 hugs pitti asac
<pitti> it's really great to see so many contributors doing gnome updates, etc!
<seb128> indeed!
<mvo> yeah, cheers to them
<pitti> so, all hands appreciated there
<bryce> pitti: between the poor network, and the many questions on X stuff, I didn't get to sponsoring last week
<pitti> bryce: nobody did, that's ok (I didn't really expect anyone)
<bryce> ah, that would explain why we're behind then
<pitti> it's not a very efficient thing to do while we are all together :)
<pitti> bryce: exactly
<tseliot> seb128: http://albertomilone.com/ubuntu/gnome/jaunty/gnome-desktop_2.25.5-0ubuntu2.debdiff
<pitti> that wasn't meant as a blame, just as information that we should catch up this week
<pitti> === release status ===
<pitti> I updated https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus today
<pitti> kudos to everyone, we halved the bug list since last week
<pitti> there's one thing which is new, bug 309482
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 309482 in xserver-xorg-video-nv "jaunty: Kubuntu OEM enduser setup fails with black screen (nv driver fails)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/309482
<pitti> bryce: would you have some time to take a look at it and ask for the right debug info?
<pitti> it was originally filed against oem-setup, but apparently it's an -nv bug
<pitti> otherwise I'm quite happy about the current status; anything from you?
<bryce> pitti: ok
<pitti> bryce: thank  you
<bryce> pitti: there's several X problems I'm tracking (some of which are now fixed), but generally things are ok for this stage of the release
<asac> now that i found why my ati driver was slow with EXA i am happy for the moment
<pitti> right in time for getting back from the sprint, suspend and hibernate gives me some issues (crashes after some 10 minutes), but I'll handle that as a bug report
<pitti> Anything else we should talk about?
<asac> right. i didnt file a bug yet, but once i came back home my laptop now auto log-outs when i suspend
<bryce> pitti: yep I'm following up on a number of reports done during the sprint, we've gotten some patches from upstream, etc.
<pitti> asac: sure that this isn't X crashing?
<bryce> asac: check your /var/log/gdm/*.log files to see if X is crashing
<asac> pitti: could be ... i will check that now
<pitti> AOB, 2nd?
<seb128> thanks pitti ;-)
<bryce> pitti: your PowerManagement graphviz diagram looks nice (would be better in inkscape, but...) ;-)
<pitti> bryce: heh, but I wanted to learn dot :)
<bryce> pitti: how is hal ?
<pitti> bryce: and after nudging some of the edges a bit, it actually looks "good enough" imho
<asac> i wonder if the points on the WorksItems page should reflect the important things i plan to do for jaunty
<pitti> bryce: "how"?
<asac> or just what came out of specs
<bryce> pitti: any major issues?
<pitti> asac: they are meant to do both
<pitti> bryce: nothing now TTBOMK; it basically didn't change since hardy, except for a handful of bug fixes
<pitti> but I keep hammering on hal-info
<asac> ok i think there need to be a bunch more items on it then
<pitti> fixing bugs, quirks, and keymaps by the dozen :)
 * pitti pats his commit access, that's really helpful
<asac> i will try to give an additional list
<pitti> asac: I think it's actually both
<asac> i think i will check with rick ;)
<pitti> asac: i. e. a breakdown of separable issues from specs, as well as other things which need to be done
<pitti> asac: it's meant to project our progress on work we committed to, to see when/if we are falling behind
<asac> right. i think its only spec stuff so far for me
<pitti> asac: I suppose you have quite a bunch of non-spec things, too?
<asac> and my specs are rather lowish
<pitti> this is quite a new tool, so we need to improve it a bit (and of course also check out whether it suits us at all)
 * pitti waves at rickspencer31
 * calc has something to bring up
<pitti> so we need shiny graphs :)
<pitti> calc: go ahead, please
<calc> Riddell: do we want to disable KDE support, i mentioned this in my status report but i didn't know whether we actually want to go ahead with it or not
<calc> background on this for others is OOo has KDE integration but only for KDE 3 which requires the kdelibs4 be on the cd's
<Riddell> calc: I think not
<calc> Mandriva has already dropped KDE support in their release
<Riddell> we're not desperate for that extra space on the CD and not having nice widgets is really ugly
<calc> Riddell: ok that is fine with me :)
<pitti> is that actually widgets, or more like file selector and print dialog?
<Riddell> pitti: both
<calc> just wanted to know for certain since i will need to do an upload about as soon as i get home from hamburg
<pitti> (loosing the latter would really be sad, I think)
<calc> pitti: all of it
<calc> Riddell: if you can find someone knowledgable enough to do the porting work that would be very helpful :)
<calc> Kendy from Novell doesn't apparently have the time to do it anytime soon
<Riddell> it would indeed
<pitti> ok, so we can note down as a decision to leave everything in place for jaunty
<calc> yes that is fine :)
<pitti> Riddell: how's the Kubuntu CD space-wise, once all mysqlish stuff gets added?
<Riddell> pitti: still 30 to 40MB free
<pitti> wow, nice
<asac> sounds efficient
<pitti> well, I guess it doesn't have langpacks yet
<Riddell> right
<seb128> pitti: speaking about CD space did you look at how much the GNOME updates changed on the ubuntu CD thanks to your changes?
<pitti> seb128: not recently; once all are done, it should amount to some 10 MB on the desktop
<calc> room for java on the desktop now :)
<seb128> we rebuilt most of GNOME this week
<seb128> no, room for translations on the desktop rather
<calc> heh
<pitti> looking at /usr/share/gconf/schemas/, many packages are already converted, but some big ones are still missing
<pitti> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 1256414 2008-12-09 20:13 ekiga.schemas
<pitti> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 1248978 2009-01-13 12:13 metacity.schemas
<pitti> being the two biggest ones
<mclasen> may I ask where those gconf patches are ?
<seb128> mclasen: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=568845
<ubottu> Gnome bug 568845 in gconf "Please support calling gettext() at runtime instead of shipping static translations" [Enhancement,Unconfirmed]
<pitti> seb beat me to it
<pitti> I still need to find some time to apply some enhancement proposals I got from the feedback there
 * mclasen thinks it is funny how an intltool bug gets turned into a feature here...
<pitti> mclasen: intltool bug?
<dobey> eh?
<mclasen> pitti: that it leaves all those translations in the mo files
<pitti> mclasen: that was by design, not a bug
<mclasen> after mergeing them back into whereever they came from
<dobey> it's not a bug, and it's not intltool
<dobey> that's how gettext works
<pitti> anyway, that's post-meeting stuff
<pitti> seems we are done otherwise, though
<mclasen> dobey: intltool is what takes strings out of xml, puts them  in a po
<pitti> so, thanks everyone
<mclasen> and merges translations back into xml, no ?
<pitti> [end of meeting]
<seb128> thanks pitti
<asac> thanks!
<pitti> mclasen: no, out of a po, into an xml
<mclasen> and in the process it forgets to remove the translations from the mo file
<mclasen> I've filed a bug about it
<dobey> intltool doens't put anything in mo files
<pitti> mclasen: there's another step that xgettext's the template xml files into pots
<dobey> and it may or may not merge back into one or more xml files
<pitti> mclasen: but that's exactly the wrong way around...
<mclasen> whatever, the end result is: if your project is using intltool, your mo files are larger than they should be
<bryce> pitti: thanks
<mclasen> we can certainly discuss this away from being an intltool bug
<pitti> they shuold stay in the mo and stop being replicated all over the place (.desktop, .schema, .directory, .icon, and whatnot)
<pitti> putting bundled static translations into text files makes it so utterly hard to update them
 * rickspencer31 waves
<pitti> rickspencer31: right on time :)
<seb128> ;-)
<rickspencer3> :)
 * mclasen stops pointless intltool debate, best to avoid it
<pitti> mclasen: also, chances are that the same string is used in other places (such as teh code itself), so you can't just remove everything from the .mo files which gets merged into a .schema or .desktop
<pitti> mclasen: I wasn't saying that intltool would DTRT, it clearly doesn't
<mclasen> pitti: of course you cannot just remove all strings
<mclasen> in our rpms, I use msgmerge to filter out whats unneeded
<pitti> mclasen: ah, seems everyone has their own little build wrappers :)
<pitti> mclasen: but in the case of .schema files, how do you solve the duplication of translations in /usr/share/gconf/schemas/ and /var/lib/gconf/defaults/%gconf-tree-$LANGCODE.xml?
<pitti> (well, I guess they aren't in the same path in other distros, but they are certainly somewhere)
<mclasen> pitti: I am open to the idea that going via gettext() might be right for schemas
<mclasen> the really right solution for gconf would be to keep all translations client-side in gconf-editor, I guess
<pitti> mclasen: you mean in g-e's PO files?
<mclasen> no, I mean there should be no need for gconfd to open all the worlds .mo files
<mclasen> gconf-editor could do that,
<pitti> absolutely
<mclasen> in some future replacement of gconf
<pitti> it shuold happen in the client-side library only
<pitti> and in fact my patch does that (or at least means to)
<pitti> I haven't checked whether gconfd itself calls gconf_schema_get_{long,short}_desc(), though
<pitti> (if it would, then not doing so would certainly be a worthwhile optimization)
<seb128> pitti: do you use an amd64 jaunty right now?
<pitti> seb128: no, but I can rsync and boot a live CD if that helps you?
<seb128> don't bother
<pitti> just did a fresh install yesterday, but again i386
<pitti> but yay ext4 :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> that's for bug #327671
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 327671 in gnome-python "python-gconf: built with rpath" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/327671
<pitti> seb128: you just need to check whether it has an rpath, or test a fix?
<pitti> (the former should be independent of the host platform)
<seb128> test if there is a rpath
<seb128> are you sure? I though that was an amd64 issue
<seb128> I don't have an rpath on my i386 install
<pitti> seb128: I mean, download the deb, extract it, run chrpath on it
<seb128> good idea thanks
<davmor2> anyone else having issues with pure grey title bars?
<davmor2> http://www.davmor2.co.uk/greytitles.png shows terminal and FF
<Amaranth> davmor2: nvidia?
<davmor2> Amaranth: err yes
<Amaranth> I don't have a fix, I just know nvidia is your problem
<davmor2> Amaranth: Okay ta just wondered about it :)#
<Amaranth> davmor2: that's compiz, right?
<davmor2> Amaranth: Yes compiz is enabled
<Amaranth> davmor2: There is a bug report for that, although the latest 180 driver should have fixed it
<davmor2> Amaranth: that is the 180 driver.  I'm only smoke testing so I'll try again tomorrow and see if it is fixed then :)
<rickspencer3> asac: I saw the role up from the team meeting today
<rickspencer3> wrt work items
<asac> rickspencer3: yes, go ahead
<rickspencer3> asac: don't stress about it. Just update the items there and we can talk when I am back online next week
<asac> rickspencer3: ok.
<rickspencer3> It shouldn't cause any anxiety, it's just a way for me to judge (numericaly) how much progress we are making
<rickspencer3> we can talk about how to make it more accurate, but I don't want it to cause more than 5 minutes of extra work a week
<asac> rickspencer3: right, i will send you a list of items that should on there anyway i guess.
<rickspencer3> if you want
<rickspencer3> that would be great
<asac> not many. just a few additions ;)
<rickspencer3> you can just add them to the wiki if you want
<asac> ok cool. i think i can figure the syntax ;)
<rickspencer3> but email me if that's easier for you
<rickspencer3> lol
<asac> rickspencer3: one more thing. i subscribed you to two bugs as they are about things where we interface with/deliver to dx team. let me know if thats ok or if you want some other procedure for that
<rickspencer3> asac: actually, I thought that was a really good idea
<rickspencer3> feel free to do so for other bugs if that would help
<asac> right, thought was a good thing for you to be in the loop for inter-team stuff
<pitti> rickspencer31: right now the process of updating those seems quite unclear to me -- does that happen in reports, or we directly edit the wiki page, or the blueprint status?
<rickspencer31> pitti: i dunno
<rickspencer31> I just thought it would be easy this week for everyone to update the wiki for this week, and then I can run my script and generate that little table
<pitti> rickspencer31: ah, forgot that, sorry
<pitti> rickspencer3: I'll do it ASAP
<rickspencer3> NO RUSH
<rickspencer3> I really wanted this to be a low stress, 5 minute a week thing to help roughly track progress
<pitti> rickspencer3: so you aren't generating the wiki page automatically, it's the primary source?
 * pitti waves good night, 'nuff for today
<rickspencer3> pitti: correct. it is not auto generated
<seb128> 'night pitti
<rickspencer3> just my script to extract the statts
 * rickspencer3 'night
<Laney> seb128: Hi, do you want a debdiff to fix f-spot? Or an LP bug?
<Laney> or just wait for sync?
<seb128> Laney: I'm about to go for diner, can you attach the debdiff to the previous bug or open a new one as you want?
<seb128> do you know when it will be uploaded to debian?
<Laney> nope
<Laney> probably in the next days
<Laney> seb128: it's on bug #293305
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 293305 in f-spot "[patch] Inactive import folder in f-spot" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/293305
<seb128> Laney: thanks
<Laney> np
<dashua> Amaranth: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/327794
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 327794 in compiz "gwd is transparent with metacity update " [Undecided,New]
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-02-11
<didrocks> hi mvo :)
<mvo> hi didrocks
<crevette> hello
<didrocks> lut crevette
<crevette> salut didrocks
<didrocks> hi seb128 & huats
<huats> hey seb128
<didrocks> seb128: python-gnome and python-gnome-desktop are ready (bug #327938 and bug #327933)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 327938 in gnome-python-desktop "Please, sponsor gnome-python-desktop 2.25.90 to jaunty" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/327938
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 327933 in gnome-python "Please, sponsor gnome-python 2.25.90 to jaunty" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/327933
<seb128> lut didrocks huats
<seb128> didrocks: ok thanks
<didrocks> seb128: you're welcome :)
<geser> could someone please look (or even better sponsor) bug 317344 as this blocks the transition of tomboy and f-spot to the new gnome-sharp2 package names?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 317344 in gnome-desktop-sharp2 "Update to gnome-desktop-sharp2 2.24 for Tomboy" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/317344
<huats> pochu: do you remember why you enabled the test-suite on gnome-keyring in debian ?
<pochu> huats: because test suites are good
<huats> pochu: sure but any other reason ?
<seb128> you guys are speaking about gnome-keyring?
<huats> because in the latest release, it fails to build if you enable them (because it sets -Werrors)
<huats> seb128: yep
<pochu> huats: in what arches?
<seb128> well, that's building the test tools to neither install or run those
<huats> seb128: I was asking pochu if there was any reason why he enable the test-suite
<pochu> huats: and since what release?
<seb128> so what is the interest?
<seb128> you don't run those during the build
<pochu> seb128: isn't it a test suite?
<seb128> and you don't install those
<seb128> right, but you need to run make run if you want to run it
<seb128> and you don't do it
<pochu> oh
<seb128> and you don't ship the tools either
<seb128> so I fail to see the interest
<pochu> you're right then
<tjaalton> seb128: I've got a request for gnome-menus; what about moving <DefaultMergeDirs/> to the end of {applications,settings}.menu, so that people can override the values by adding files in *-merged/
<pochu> clearly what I wanted to do was to run the test suite... but I failed it seems ;)
<huats> pochu: it was added (the set -Werrors) between the  the 2.25.4.1 dans the 2.25.5 I think
<seb128> tjaalton: who made that request?
<tjaalton> seb128: me :)
<pochu> huats: ah ok
<seb128> tjaalton: I've an air of dejavu
<pochu> huats: so feel free to disable it... it seems my change was pointless :(
<huats> pochu: and it fails on the architectures that are not present on ppa :) (otherwise we could test them more easily)
<huats> pochu: already did :)
<seb128> tjaalton: let me find the bug for you
<tjaalton> seb128: ok, so for instance now I can't have a file in merged/ which would remove all KDE entries from the menus (we have to install both desktops)
<tjaalton> thanks
<seb128> tjaalton: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=557443
<ubottu> Gnome bug 557443 in layout "Move <DefaultMergeDirs/> to the bottom of the menu files" [Enhancement,Resolved: notabug]
<tjaalton> sigh
<pochu> huats: btw, do you have your check-symbols script handy? I'd like to have a look at it :)
<huats> sure :)
<huats> I will send it to you this afternoon ok ?
<seb128> tjaalton: edit the .menu or ship a custom one if you want to do that
<tjaalton> seb128: that's exactly what I'm trying to avoid :)
<seb128> tjaalton: read the bugs for details and talk to vuntz and try to convince him if you still disagree
<tjaalton> seb128: now I just include the file with the excludes, and it works just fine
<tjaalton> but I had to add the include to the file
<tjaalton> MergeFile that is
<tjaalton> anyway, will read
<pochu> huats: sure, thanks!
<tjaalton> seb128: so the spec sucks :)
<andreasn> mpt, ping
<asac> seb128: bug 272010 -> please look at totem debdiff and tell me if you want me to push that or do something else on that package for you ;)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 272010 in totem "Some plugins lack proper ubufox integration (Was: confusing plugin selection dialog)" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/272010
<asac> anyone here has sun java5/6 plugin installed and can give me a dpkg -L on that?
<gnomefreak> asac: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/621196
<gnomefreak> its -l not -L
<asac> gnomefreak: but i need -L ;)
<gnomefreak> but dpkg doesnt like -L
<syldeb35> asac: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/621198
<asac> syldeb35: hmm ... there is no .so ... where are the alternative links ending?
<asac> how is that file called?
<didrocks> I have to bind to evince in gnome-python-desktop update: http://paste.ubuntu.com/116783/ but there is no evince-dev or some similar package and it builds successfully without it. Does this mean I have only to add it as a dependency of the binary package?
<geser> didrocks: did you checked the build log if it detects evince or not? I guess it checks for evince but as it doesn't find the needed headers it skips it.
<didrocks> geser: let me check (and I don't find any package with header for evince, appart from the two libraries that I added libevdocument-dev and libevview-dev)
<syldeb35> asac : perhaps this one :dpkg -L sun-java6-bin -->http://pastebin.mozilla.org/621203
<syldeb35> the alternative links end to /usr/lib/jvm/java-6-sun/jre/plugin/i386/ns7/libjavaplugin_oji.so
<asac> yeah thanks
<asac> syldeb35: is that the same filename for sun-java5-bin?
<syldeb35> not sur because sun-java5-plugin not installed but I have /usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5.0-sun-1.5.0.17/jre/plugin/i386/ns7/libjavaplugin_oji.so
<seb128> didrocks: there is libevdocument and libevview which are evince libraries
<syldeb35> and /usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5.0-sun-1.5.0.17/jre/plugin/i386/ns7/libjavaplugin_oji.so
<didrocks> seb128: yes, (cf my last sentence :)). I will just try to check the build log first
<seb128> asac: the debdiff looks alright please upload
<seb128> didrocks: those are the libraries supposed to be used, they did make libraries for a reason
<didrocks> seb128: so, gnome-python-desktop will not really depends on evince, but only on those two libraries
<seb128> right
<asac> seb128: done. thanks
<seb128> they made those libs especially for that
<seb128> asac: did you push the changes to bzr?
<didrocks> seb128: oh right (do you follow a ML to keep up to date with those informations?)
<seb128> didrocks: not really, I do read the changes description on the ftp list
<asac> seb128: am i part of -desktop?
<seb128> ie the NEWS for new tarballs
<seb128> asac: dunno, if you are not we can fix that easily ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: it's just written "New Evince bindings", not that those 2 lib gives these bindings, but yeah, it's implicite :)
<asac> seb128: trying to push ;)
<asac> seb128: i think i have no permissions. can you add me?
<seb128> asac: sure, one sec
<seb128> didrocks: that might have been detailled on a planet.gnome.org blog
<seb128> didrocks: and the mention of the split was on the evince side, ie they wrote about new libs allowing embeders
<didrocks> seb128: ok. What's strange is that I have no "no evince binding found" in the build log when I don't add them.
<didrocks> too late ;)
<asac> now seb is gone :)
<didrocks> he will be back soon, as usually ^^
<asac> yeah. me feels itchy to push the branch and move on ;)
<didrocks> asac: :)
<didrocks> seb128: ok. What's strange is that I have no "no evince binding found" in the build log when I don't add them.
<seb128> asac: added
 * asac runs bzr push
<seb128> didrocks: maybe the configure is not verbose, are the binding built and in the deb?
<asac> ok Pushed up revision 9.
<seb128> asac: danke
<didrocks> seb128: let me add the b-d first to compare the build log :)
<seb128> asac: welcome to ubuntu-desktop too btw ;-)
<seb128> doing an another bootchart, brb
 * asac feels thrilled
<asac> and a warm feeling of new power ;)
<didrocks> seb128: yes, it works. It activate a whole bunch of bindings now
<seb128> see ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: let me push the new branch version
<didrocks> (and tag it again)
<seb128> you are using tagging now?
<didrocks> seb128: yes, since evince update :)
<didrocks> I dunno if it's useful, but well
<Tm_T> hi asac
<didrocks> seb128: it's ok now
<seb128> pitti: what command can be called to trigger suspend nowadays?
<soren> pm-suspend?
<soren> That's what I use.
<seb128> mvo_: how busy are you today? ;-)
<mvo_> seb128: medium, why? need some sponsoring love?
<seb128> mvo_: no, there is a new gnome-control-center version available, I'm looking at it but in case some your patches need to be updated ;-)
<mvo_> seb128: hm, I see. if there is trouble please ping me, I will have a look
<seb128> mvo_: ok thanks, the proxy thing doesn't apply I'm looking at it
<seb128> did I already say how much I dislike glade changes? ;-)
<mvo_> you did (and I agree)
<geser> mvo_: if you have some time for sponsoring, could you please look and sponsor bug 317344?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 317344 in gnome-desktop-sharp2 "Update to gnome-desktop-sharp2 2.24 for Tomboy" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/317344
<mvo_> geser: sure, let me have a look
<seb128> mvo_: ok that was an easy one you are off the hook for now ;-)
<mvo_> *puffff*
 * mvo_ makes a sign of relief :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> trying gsd update, brb
<crevette> wow my karma doubled in the last 2 weeks
<crevette> I started low :)
<mvo> geser: I have to admit that I don't know that much about c#, is ok that its still "libgnomedesktop2.20-cil" (even though this is now updated to 2.24?
<geser> mvo: me neither, I hope that the Debian maintainers know what they do (slomo did the upload to experimental)
<mvo> geser: aha, if he did it, then its probably allright :)
<crevette> should I ping someone to have universe packaged sponsored? I did 2 bug reports for new versions with universe sponsors subscribed, but I don't news about them
<seb128> tseliot: are you there?
<mvo> oho, someone else on the hook now ;)
<seb128> crevette: no, there is just a lot of items, look on http://daniel.holba.ch/sponsoring/
<tseliot> seb128: sure
<seb128> mvo: see it's not only you ;-)
<seb128> tseliot: you gave me patch updates for some of the g-c-c changes yesterday, did you actually change something to those?
<seb128> tseliot: ie 109_screen_resolution_extra.patch applies correctly to 2.25.90
<tseliot> seb128: yes, I did changes to them
<seb128> same for 110_screen_resolution_package.patch
<tseliot> seb128: I think I gave you the right patches, let me check them again
<seb128> tseliot: could you summarize the changes so I know why I should use your versions and what to write in the changelog ;-)
<seb128> http://albertomilone.com/ubuntu/gnome/jaunty/gcc-patches/110_screen_resolution_package.patch
<seb128> http://albertomilone.com/ubuntu/gnome/jaunty/gcc-patches/109_screen_resolution_extra.patch
<seb128> http://albertomilone.com/ubuntu/gnome/jaunty/gcc-patches/25_window_manager_settings.patch
<seb128> the previous version of those still apply correctly
<seb128> I'm not sure what you changed
<tseliot> seb128: there were only some small conflicts. The real changes took place in the patches for gnome-desktop
<tseliot> seb128: therefore if the old patches compile, simply leave them as they are
<seb128> ok
<seb128> right the 80_aspect_in_dropdown.patch needed to be updated
<seb128> thanks
<tseliot> that was relevant to what I do so I thought it would be useful to update it
<seb128> indeed that was useful thanks for that one ;-)
<tseliot> ;)
<lool> seb128: BTW I know now what really made me unhappy about bug-buddy and gnome-dbg
<lool> seb128: Something on my system pulled bug-buddy at some point
<lool> which pulled gnome-dbg
<lool> gnome-dbg and bug-buddy have some circular dependency (one recommends one depends) and wont ever get out of your system
<lool> Downgrading the recommends make this loop go away, which is good for my sanity
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> I use neither bug-buggy or gnome-dbg so I was not really bothered but I understand your issue ;-)
<lool> I guess I could as well drop the bug-buddy depends from gnome-dbg
<crevette> what is gnome-dbg ?
<lool> a meta package pulling all the *-dbg on Debian
<crevette> ah okay, I thought it was kind of debug wrapper scripts that could appears when a crash happens, and offer you to debug it, like in windows :)
<seb128> didrocks: is gnome-python-desktop ready to be reviewed?
<lool> crevette: Sure, and it would also hand you a patch?   :-)
<crevette> lool, we could propose to run nemiver instead of bug-buddy :)
<crevette> only for real mens
<crevette> lool, I hope you bought the wonderful GNOME tee-shirt at FOSDEM?
<maxb> I have Alt+F6 configured to "Run a terminal" as per default, and in compiz it works. In metacity, instead it causes a thick black border to highlight the active window - what is this hilight for, and why is it intercepting the configured keybinding?
<lool> crevette: I did
<crevette> lool, \./
<crevette> are they nice? I choose them, I ordered the print, but I don't know what they look like :)
<crevette> s/what/how/
<walters> maxb: see /apps/metacity/global_keybindings - by default that's switch_group which switches windows inside a "group" (application, sort of)
<maxb> hmm
<maxb> I guess I need to file a bug about the UI and actual behaviour disagreeing
<asac> seb128: what do you think about bug 217551 ... nm just opens gtk_menu_popup with activate_time
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 217551 in network-manager "Password prompt "freezes" system during presence of a drop-down menu [hardy]" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/217551
<lool> crevette: They are simple and nice
<lool> I like the color a lot better than last year's
<crevette> don't you like the green ?
<crevette> :)
<seb128> asac: needs debugging?
<crevette> the burgundy looked like cool on the paper
<crevette> so I chose that :)
<seb128> asac: any reason you don't try to authentificate while the menu is open?
<maxb> Where are the keybindings that gnome-keybinding-properties edits stored?
<asac> seb128: hmm ... dont think i understand what you mean. from what i understood the keyring dialog is triggered and then all input isnt processed anymore
<seb128> asac: to me it seems that the keyring callback get called while the menu is open which creates a keyboard grabbing issue
<seb128> asac: usually you open a menu, click on an item, that calls the keyring callback and the menu is closed before you get the dialog
<asac> seb128: how does keyring grab keyboard?
<asac> gdk_keyboard_grab ;)
<seb128> asac: yes
<seb128> asac: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=554782
<ubottu> Gnome bug 554782 in nm-applet "race condition or deadlock between nm-applet and gnome-keyring" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<seb128> asac: that bug suggests it has been fixed in nm-applet svn some months ago, do you still get the issue on jaunty?
<asac> seb128: keyring does no error handling for "grab_keyboard"
<seb128> asac: http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/network-manager-applet?view=revision&revision=1062 ?
<asac> seb128: Not fixed in intrepid, not fixed in jaunty. C'mon guys, this is REALLY irritating bug.
<asac> seb128: i think it fixed the issue partially
<asac> if you reopen the menu before keyring pops up it might reproduce still
<seb128> asac: I agree it's an irritating bug
<seb128> I'm not sure what the right fix is though
<seb128> keyboard grabbing should fail in this case no?
<seb128> brb
<seb128> trying compiz update
<asac> hmm
 * seb128 looks to mvo
<seb128> mvo: can I get a wm running? danke!
<seb128> /usr/bin/compiz.real (core) - Error: Plugin 'core' has ABI version '20090207', expected ABI version '20080828'.
<seb128> /usr/bin/compiz.real (ccp) - Error: InitObject failed
<seb128> /usr/bin/compiz.real (core) - Error: Couldn't activate plugin 'ccp'
<seb128> mvo: you broke my jaunty ;-)
<maxb> seb128: Have you got the recent compiz-fusion-plugins-{main,extra} updates? They seemed to take a while to reach the mirrors
<maxb> Though clearly there aren't strict enough dependencies
<mvo> seb128: did you upgrade everything? hrm hrm
<seb128> maxb: that's alright, I know what is broken and why, I'm just teasing mvo because he didn't use breaks correctly ;-)
<mvo> but yeah, some dependency strictness is missing
<seb128> mvo: no, I did upgrade compiz-gnome
 * mvo sighs
<mvo> seb128: ha! so you did it on purpose ;) ?
<seb128> which triggered compiz-core and compiz-plugins to be upgraded
<seb128> mvo: yes, just to show if you did use breaks correctly this time ;-)
<seb128> show -> see
 * mvo hides under a rock
<maxb> The new compiz has also broken a few keyboard shortcuts (bug 328111)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 328111 in compiz "New compiz appears to have broken Alt+F1, F2, F6 shortcuts" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/328111
<mvo> oh, thanks maxb
<mvo> maxb: could you please check if you have the "gnomecompat" plugin enable (it should be default)
<maxb> Sure!.. How? :-)
<seb128> mvo: bug #327793 has some users which have issues
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 327793 in compiz "Window decorations in title bar missing with compiz enabled" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/327793
<seb128> mvo: but that seems to be partial upgrades
<seb128> restarting session again
<mvo> seb128: the broken title bar should be fixed
<seb128> mvo: ok, I get 6 workspaces on one line rather than 8 on 2 lines now
<seb128> but compiz is running
<mvo> seb128: hrm, bad
<seb128> let me do an another session restart to make sure that's not transitionnal
<seb128> mvo: hum and the gnome-panel taskbar lists all the dialog open, not only the ones on the current workspace as it should
<davmor2> bryce: you around yet?
<didrocks> seb128: thanks for the sponsoring (when you have some time, there is still gnome-python one)
<seb128> didrocks: did you subscribe the sponsor team? it's not listed on
<seb128> http://people.ubuntu.com/~dholbach/sponsoring/index.html
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, apparently: bug #327933
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 327933 in gnome-python "Please, sponsor gnome-python 2.25.90 to jaunty" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/327933
<seb128> it's in the not correctly parsed list, weird
<didrocks> I will report a bug to dholbach :)
<mvo> seb128: oh, lets talk about it after my meeting
<seb128> mvo: it doesn't do it for everything, I'm trying to see what is going on exactly
<seb128> mvo: are you running you shiny new compiz version? ;-)
<mvo> seb128: no, don't tell me you run this unstable gnome ;) - kidding, yes I do on my workstation
<bryce> davmor2: yep
<mvo> maxb: please open "ccsm" (from e.g. a terminal) and check it should be in the top row
<seb128> mvo: can you try to open evolution on any workspace and see if it's listed on all workspaces?
<seb128> mvo: or gnome-screenshot
<seb128> mvo: listed in the gnome-panel tasks, not in alt-tab
<mvo> seb128: for me it seems to be only in the main one, maybe its viewport<->workspace ocnfusion again :( ?
<mvo> and I run a very fresh profile, reseted it the other day
<mvo> (the compiz profile)
<seb128> I run a recent profile too
<seb128> I selected normal in the capplet to restart compiz after the partial broken upgrade
<davmor2> bryce: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-nv/+bug/309482 I've added the nv stuff.  Is there an easy way to force vesa use though for the vesa info everytime it reboots it's using nv again
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 309482 in xserver-xorg-video-nv "jaunty: Kubuntu OEM enduser setup fails with black screen (nv driver fails)" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<mvo> seb128: lets debug after the meeting/tomorrow, I may need the dump of your profiel settings
<seb128> mvo: ok, let me know when you want to debug this
<asac> mvo: in the past i saw packages in /var/cache/apt/archives in apt-cache show PACKAGENAME ... thats not the case in jaunty anymore?
<asac> s/packages/package-versions/
<bryce> heya mvo
<bryce> mvo: btw we can drop the blacklisting of Intel Eaglelake from compiz now.
<bryce> mvo, (LP: #261080)
<bluesmoke> bug 261080
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 261080 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "Intrepid: compiz fails on Intel McCreary [8086:2e02]" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/261080
<mvo> bryce: done
<mvo> asac: hm, what execalty did you see in the past? I have not changed anything here
<mvo> asac: I will be away for some minutes, lets talk after
<asac> mvo: i think i saw all versions in the cache ... now i see: version in archive + version installed
<asac> but no version that is in cache but not installed nor in archive
<mvo> asac: I don't think this ever worked, might be conincidence (archive==version-in-cache)
<asac> mvo: well. i am quite sure it worked. i used it frequently
 * asac confused
<asac> of course i believe you ;)
<mvo> asac: hm, I can review the bzr logs, but I have currently no idea
<asac> you are the man (TM)
<mvo> asac: might be really strange side effect or something
 * mvo really runs now
<mvo> bbl
<bryce> mvo: excellent, thanks!
<highvoltage> anyone else have a problem in Jaunty where "Launching File Browser" just opens up in a loop in the window list and slows down the machine to a crawl?
<dobey> highvoltage: i've seen that happen in intrepid before. could be an extension you have installed, causing problems
<highvoltage> dobey: I think it started happening when I installed the netbook-launcher, but it happens even in a safe-mode gnome-session
<highvoltage> (when the netbook-launcher isn't started)
<dobey> highvoltage: when it happened to me, it was a python-based nautilus extension i was playing with, causing nautilus to "crash" and the session kept restarting it
<maxb> mvo: ccsm showed the gnomecompat plugin not selected. ticking it restored Alt+F1 and Alt+F2, but not Alt+F6. However, there's a further problem with handling these as a compiz plugin - it means the settings in gnome-keybinding-properties are not respected
 * maxb goes to say the same in the bug
<crevette> wow a lot of -dbg pulled in the lastest update
<maxb> Yeah, I think that isn't sane
<maxb> bug-buddy is the source of the Recommends that pulls it all, AFAIK
<pochu> well, you shouldn't need bug-buddy in Ubuntu ;)
<maxb> But I didn't install it manually
<maxb> It may be that update-manager needs to consider removing bug-buddy rather than pulling in all that lot
<benc> do I need to install or configure a firewall on ubuntu desktop?
<BugMaN> benc: read this -> https://help.ubuntu.com/8.10/keeping-safe/C/firewall.html
<benc> thanks. is it recommended or unnecesary?
<BugMaN> benc: not necessary like in a windows environment
<benc> BugMaN: I'm developing  web applications so I guess I should setup a firewall. thanks
<BugMaN> benc: ok in this case is better to install a firewall
<benc> thanks
<mvo> maxb: thanks for this update, I check it out (tomorrow)
<asac> since today my window decorations are white :/
<asac> maybe uxa
<asac> let me test
<asac> hmm ... that wasnt the problem
<bryce> asac: is this with the new 6.10.99 -ati?
<asac> bryce: no thats on my thinkpad with i965
<asac> i am currently upgrading in the hope that its gone :)
<bryce> ok
<bryce> duh right, uxa == intel
<asac> bryce: http://people.ubuntu.com/~asac/tmp/screen_white.png
<asac> but its not accellmethod
<bryce> weird.  compiz maybe?
<bryce> compiz (1:0.7.9+git20090211-0ubuntu1) was uploaded yesterday, that'd be my first guess
<bryce> if you still have earlier compiz debs in your /var/cache/apt/archives/ maybe try reverting?
<asac> bryce: ok. it was a temporary issue as it seems
<asac> last update made it go away \o/
<asac> how colorful a desktop can be ... impressive ;)
<asac> for a moment i thought it was an experient from dx team ;)
<asac> experiment
<bryce> hehe
<Amaranth> asac, bryce: Downgrade metacity, not compiz
<Amaranth> libmetacity-private changed
<Amaranth> The fix should be in compiz git at this point, gotta check on that
<Amaranth> Problem was we were creating an RGBA colormap the "old-fashioned" way since when that code was written the way libmetacity wants it done didn't exist
<asac> Amaranth: for me its fixed already
<Amaranth> ah, mvo is quick :)
<Amaranth> yay a git snapshot even
<Amaranth> that means wall viewport changing should look a lot cooler
<bryce> sweetness.  dual head at 3840 x 1200, and compiz is working (and nice performance).
<maxb> asac's grey titlebar issue should be fixed with latest compiz and metacity in the archive
<bryce> on RV535/X1650
<bryce> I'm stunned, I've not had both dual-head and compiz like this before.  very nice
 * bryce wobbles windows across two monitors
<dobey> bryce: i wonder how well it works at 4096x1152 :)
<bryce> hmm, only issue so far is when I first enabled compiz, it moved all my gnome-terminal windows to 0x0
<bryce> Amaranth: hey, have you played with the cube and dual-head displays?
<Amaranth> bryce: not in a _long_ time
<bryce> basically it seems to give me two cubes, one for each screen
<bryce> with each screen being an adjacent face on the cube
<bryce> which... works... but doesn't feel right
 * bryce shrugs
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-02-12
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> morning pitti
<crevette> hello
<didrocks> Hi seb128, crevette
<crevette> salut didrocks
<seb128> lut crevette didrocks
<didrocks> seb128: gtkmm2.4 is ready (https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtkmm2.4/+bug/328251)
<crevette> salut seb128 & andreasn
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 328251 in gtkmm2.4 "Please, sponsor gtkmm2.4 2.15.3 for jaunty" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<andreasn> hallo crevette
<seb128> didrocks: good thanks
<crevette> didrocks is already on the run
<didrocks> but has gnome-python, it doesn't show up in dholbach page
<seb128> ok
<crevette> seb128: you can "apt-get install nautilus-sendto-universe" now :) thanks for driving me
<didrocks> (indeed, it show in "The following bugs have not been parsed")
<seb128> I'm not sure we want to use bzr for this one
<didrocks> seb128: really?
<seb128> crevette: you're welcome
<seb128> didrocks: well, gtkmm2.4 is often in sync with debian so I'm not sure how to manage that and keep the bzr uptodate, that seems extra work rather than win
<didrocks> seb128: ok :)
<seb128> didrocks: let me talk to mvo when he will be around
<mvo> hm?
<didrocks> seb128: ok. So, I have only python-gnome-extras waiting for libgda
<seb128> crevette: was that bug #327747?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 327747 in nautilus-sendto "Please promote new package "nautilus-sendto-universe" to universe" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/327747
<didrocks> and nothing else to do o/
<crevette> seb128: yes
<seb128> mvo: didrocks is putting everything in bzr nowadays thanks to your guidance ;-)
<didrocks> (pidgin has been taken by alessio)
<mvo> heh :)
<seb128> didrocks: ok
<crevette> seb128: oups I didn't read that last comment
<mvo> I like that
<crevette> seb128: I hope this is a type
<crevette> typo
<seb128> mvo: but gtkmm2.4 is often in sync with debian, not sure how to keep bzr uptodate in such case, that seems rather extra work
<seb128> crevette: I think that's a bug triager closing the bug wrongly, let me reopen
<seb128> crevette: the bug should not be on nautilus-sendto but on ubuntu
<crevette> ah I didn't know
<mvo> seb128: hm, good point. when its in sync with debian it will not have a vcs-bzr header, and when we de-sync it, we can do that from the bzr tree. but its a bit ugly to keep the tree around when its not up-tp-date
<mvo> OTOH this way we will have full ubuntu changelogs
<mvo> (something I sometimes miss)
<seb128> what do you mean by full changelog?
<didrocks> that's right that the vcs-bzr header can be an issue :/
<seb128> there is no ubuntu change, we are just sometime faster to package unstable versions
<crevette> need to go
<crevette> bye
<mvo> seb128: hm, right
<seb128> didrocks: can you drop the vcs-bzr line in control? we will just upload, using bzr is just extra work there, we will likely be using the debian again in next versions
<didrocks> seb128: sure
<didrocks> seb128: do you I put a debdiff?
<didrocks> (so, I think I have to revert the debian/watch change)
<seb128> didrocks: you can use your bzr, I will use if for sponsoring but just not push that to the ubuntu-desktop codepage
<seb128> didrocks: the watch file is no issue
<seb128> just let's not bother with bzr there
<didrocks> ok, thanks, it will be easier for me with push/pull :)
<didrocks> ok
<seb128> vuntz: there?
<seb128> vuntz: are you running gtk 2.15.n?
<didrocks> seb128: done, rev 3 pushed
<asac> mvo: see msg
 * huats notices that seb128 is on "clear gnome-keyring bugs" mode 
<huats> :)
<seb128> huats: yeah, you are welcome to do that too if you want ;-)
<huats> :)
<seb128> not on gnome-keyring though since it's mostly cleaned now
<huats> I am a bit on a rush at the moment for my day work
<huats> but I wll try to help outÂµ...
<seb128> no hurry you already did a lot recently
<didrocks> seb128: if you have something that I can handle, it will be with pleasure :)
<seb128> didrocks: http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-icon-theme/2.25/gnome-icon-theme-2.25.90.tar.gz
<seb128> didrocks: http://download.gnome.org/sources/seahorse-plugins/2.25/seahorse-plugins-2.25.90.tar.gz
<didrocks> seb128: ok, I take them :)
<seb128> cool
<didrocks> seb128: I checked withc check-symbols the ABI differences in gtkmm2.4
<didrocks> seb128: there is only added symbols, so, it's ok, but I wonder why all libraries still have the same name *.1.0.30
<didrocks> and not bump a minor version like *.1.0.31
<seb128> because upstream didn't upgrade the number correctly
<didrocks> (without changing the SONAME as there is no ABI breakage)
<seb128> that should not make a real difference though
<didrocks> ok, but theorically, this change has to be done, right?
<didrocks> is it this? change the minor revision?
<seb128> right
<didrocks> it was just to confirm ^^ thanks
<mvo> seb128: hi, how is compiz behaving today?
<seb128> mvo: hello, not, I'm on my desktop right now which has a recent ati card and doesn't work on compiz
<seb128> mvo: I will try again the laptop later and let you know
<mvo> seb128: aha, no problem
<seb128> mvo: you don't get the issue by running gnome-screenshot?
<mvo> seb128: no :/
<seb128> you have a tasklist and use the option to list only things on the current workspace?
<seb128> it's weird it was doing it for evolution and gnome-screenshot for example
<seb128> but not for gedit, xchat-gnome, etc
<seb128> didrocks: ups, there was a bug in your gtkmm update
<seb128> didrocks: SHVER in rules should be updated to 2.15.3 since there is new functions in this version
<mvo> seb128: I tried it with evo and gnome-screenshot and the "workspace switcher" and the tasklist show them only on the current one
<seb128> the workspace switcher and alt tab are not issue
<seb128> that's the flat list of tasks which was
<seb128> anyway will try a bit later and let you know
<mvo> seb128: "window list" and "show windows from current workspaces=yes" - looks ok for me, when I switch its gone from the window list
<mvo> seb128: let me check if I have the latest gnome panel applets
<seb128> those didn't change recently
<asac> mvo: did you figure how to enable NM system connections in upgrade tester?
<asac> or do you need more info?
<mvo> asac: not yet, sorry. need to get back to this
<seb128> mvo: the synaptic quick search thing is not really smart
<mvo> asac: how can I detect if its restarted? do I need some sort of monitoring process?
<mvo> seb128: no?
<seb128> I guess that's a known issue?
<seb128> mvo: well it tends to list lot of things which don't match the filter, or it tries to be too smart and match in depends and descriptions too and score that quite high
<mvo> seb128: what search did you do that was not good?
<seb128> mvo: try typing gnome-applets in the entry
<seb128> gnome-applets-data is listed first
<seb128> gnome-applets is several screens after that
<seb128> it lists
<seb128> gnome-applets-data
<seb128> capplets-data
<seb128> bluez-gnome
<seb128> etc etc etc
<seb128> and then gnome-applets
<mvo> seb128: yeah, I see the same here, I have a look, its xapian smartness, the amount of influcence I have is not that great into the scoring
<seb128> mvo: usually have the exact name match first would be cool ;-)
<seb128> having
<seb128> or that's what I would expect when I type a binary name correctly
<seb128> do you want a bug about that?
<mvo> yep
<seb128> it's a detail probably not worth the trouble
<seb128> I was just pointing it in case you were interested ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: you're right. I didn't checked what it is used for. New version pushed
<seb128> didrocks: you need to update the changelog to 0ubuntu2 I did sponsor the previous revision a bit quickly, did test build, install, try gnome-system-monitor and upload
<didrocks> oh crap
<seb128> ie, you can't reupload using the same number
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> I didn't see you uploaded a new version
<didrocks> sorry for that
<didrocks> how did you see that, for information?
<seb128> didrocks: see what?
<seb128> didrocks: I didn't upload a new version, I just sponsored your update
<didrocks> that I forgot to change this value, afterwards
<seb128> I did bzr diff to see what you did exactly
<didrocks> because once sponsored, I think you don't look at the rules file :)
<seb128> as said I did sponsor too quickly, I just test built and uploaded
<seb128> then I went "ups, maybe I should review the changes too"
<didrocks> yes yes, but how did you see the mistake, once sponsored?
<didrocks> ok
<seb128> that's what you get after sponsoring some good work ;-)
<seb128> you just trust the updater ;-)
<didrocks> sorry for the mistake, I should have looked at the rules file :/
<didrocks> next time, I will grep for version, to be sure :)
<seb128> that's just a small mistake, but since you told me they added functions but didn't change the soname I decided to check that you updates the shver
<seb128> well, new function = shlibs update
<seb128> it can be a .shlibs or in the rules
<didrocks> ok, I just looked for .shlibs :/
<vuntz> seb128: gtk 2.15.n: yes, partly (didn't log out)
<didrocks> seb128: so, rev 5 is pushed
<asac> seb128: hmm yesterdays seahorse (ssh agent) has issues?
<asac> slogin senica -lalex
<asac> buffer_get_ret: trying to get more bytes 4 than in buffer 0
<asac> buffer_get_int: buffer error
<seb128> vuntz: that's ok, I don't need testing out of ubuntu after all I think ;-)
<seb128> asac: gnome bug #571060
<ubottu> Gnome bug 571060 in keyring files "gnome-keyring-daemon makes ssh fail with DSA keys" [Major,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=571060
<seb128> vuntz: btw since you are there, did you ever looked at vertical gnome-panel freeze when there is over 8 tasks in the list?
<seb128> vuntz: and to the gnome-panel not matching the screen after using xrandr?
<vuntz> seb128: hrm, no
<vuntz> didn't know about the second issue
<seb128> vuntz: try switching to a lower resolution using xrandr and back to your current one
<asac> seb128: thanks. CCed me
<seb128> vuntz: and let me know if it goes back to the correct value
<seb128> asac: you use a dsa key right?
<vuntz> seb128: why do you always ask me to test stuff that will break my config?
 * vuntz tries in xephyr
<seb128> vuntz: that will not break, just restart gnome-panel
<asac> seb128: i dont use it, but i have a key still yes.
<seb128> asac: try moving it somewhere else?
<seb128> didrocks: you did change the timestamp of the previous changelog entry, can you revert to the correct value? ;-)
<vuntz> seb128: definitely works in xephyr
<vuntz> seb128: can you try there?
<asac> seb128: i think i have to relogin ... let me check
<asac> (now getting wierd "cannot sign error")
<seb128> asac: otherwise you can workaround by using ssh agent
<didrocks> seb128: of course, I can do. For information, why is this really important for some automation tools)?
<didrocks> or just for consistency?
<seb128> just export SSH_AUTH_SOCK= to the ssh-agent socket and ssh-add
<seb128> didrocks: for consistency, no reason to change things in the previous revision
<asac> seb128: well so seems we have a dejavu ;)
<seb128> didrocks: you usually try to not change things which have already been uploaded
<asac> i removed my dsa stuff .... relogged in
<asac> now i get:
<asac> Agent admitted failure to sign using the key.
<asac> Permission denied (publickey).
<asac> thats the error i had in intrepid for quite a while ;)
<didrocks> seb128: some kind of "don't change the past", ok :)
<seb128> asac: well to gnome bug #571422
<ubottu> Gnome bug 571422 in keyring files "ssh agent stopped working after 2.25.90 upgrade" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=571422
<seb128> asac: btw I opened gnome bug #571423 too for you
<ubottu> Gnome bug 571423 in ask dialog "grabbing the keyboard while a menu is open can lock the session" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=571423
<seb128> didrocks: right
<asac> seb128: cool. could you reproduce outside of NM?
<seb128> asac: I could, that's not trivial though (need to write some code to trigger that I guess) and I'm working on other things right now, will try later
<seb128> vuntz: ups sorry, busy replying to other people, how do I use xephyr? I'm using this new gdm which has no gdmflexiserver --xnest on this box
<asac> seb128: sorry "could" wasnt clear. i asked whether you reproduced it already. dont need to try for now
<seb128> asac: no, I didn't try but I figured that letting upstream know about the issue can't hurt
<seb128> if they don't do anything about it that will make no change
<seb128> if they know what is wrong and fix it that's a win for everybody ;-)
<vuntz> seb128: launch Xephyr :1 -ac -br -screen 1024x768
<vuntz> seb128: and then DISPLAY=:1 gnome-session
<didrocks> seb128: hopefully, commit 6 will be the right one :)
<seb128> vuntz: no I don't get the issue in xephyr
<seb128> didrocks: uploaded
<vuntz> seb128: ah, interesting.
<vuntz> seb128: intel driver?
<seb128> vuntz: yes
<seb128> well I got the issue during the sprint on my laptop which is intel
<seb128> I'm on my desktop right now which is ati
<didrocks> seb128: thanks seb :)
<seb128> let me try in my session
<vuntz> seb128: can you reproduce with ati?
 * vuntz is pretty sure it's one intel driver bug
<seb128> I don't get it
<seb128> ok, why would the driver create the issue?
<seb128> some xevent not triggered?
<seb128> compiz gets confused too on that box, it consider the screen limits to be where they were before the xrandr switch
<seb128> bryce: ^ iz intel bog?
<vuntz> seb128: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=523408
<ubottu> Gnome bug 523408 in gdk "Xinerarama code needs to sanitize overlapping monitors" [Normal,New]
<vuntz> seb128: my guess
<seb128> vuntz: ok thanks
<vuntz> metacity works because we fixed it, iirc ;-)
<seb128> mvo: fix compiz!
<mvo> seb128: its not broken ;)
<seb128> vuntz: but that bug would also make gnome-panel being wrongly fit for the screen on normal session not only after xrandr changes no?
<seb128> vuntz: we had bugs were people have an output enable and it's broken all the time for them I think
<seb128> vuntz: where the xrand bug is only after switching modes, or that trigger the vga by some way but calling xrand doesn't list the vga as being enabled
<seb128> mvo: do you have intel video cards? ;-)
<mvo> seb128: I can get hold of a machine with hintel
<seb128> mvo: don't bother, I was just curious to know if you were getting the issue too there
<vuntz> seb128: I don't know what's wrong. I just know that it's likely not a panel bug ;-)
<seb128> vuntz: it seems weird to me that the bug is an xorg one since restarting gnome-panel makes it work correctly
<seb128> vuntz: why would it behave correctly after a restart if xorg was reporting wrong informations?
<seb128> that's not consistent, it seems that it rather doesn't detect that xrandr has been used and that it should refresh the screen infos or something
<seb128> vuntz: other small thing, do you get the clock tooltip displayed on the other side of the screen when clicking on the clock applet to display the calendar?
<vuntz> seb128: got a report of this. And then the guy told me it happened in evo too. So gtk+ bug :-)
<seb128> ok what I was assuming, gnome-panel didn't change a lot this cycle
<vuntz> seb128: if it doesn't work in compiz, is it really a panel bug? ;-)
<vuntz> oh, it did have some change
<vuntz> not for this kind of stuff
<seb128> vuntz: compiz can be buggy too ;-)
<seb128> vuntz: I'm just wondering what layer in xorg is wrong
<seb128> because as said restart gnome-panel works
<seb128> which means there is a way to get correct informations from xorg
<seb128> so I'm wondering if there is some sort of update signal that should be sent and is not
<seb128> or something around those lines
<seb128> if I can get details I can try to ping bryce about the issue
<vuntz> seb128: the panel gets a signal from gtk+, fwiw
<vuntz> so if there's someone to blame it's between xorg and gtk+
<seb128> ok
<seb128> so either it doesn't get the signal
<seb128> or the geometry query is not correct
<seb128> I tend to lean toward a driver bug too if that's intel specific
<seb128> vuntz: thanks for the informations there ;-)
<seb128> vuntz: other quick question, do you know if something started looking at why the gnome-session dialog are not themed in the current 2.25 version?
<seb128> vuntz: I might try to look at this afternoon if nobody else is on it yet
<vuntz> seb128: didn't look at it, but I was wondering if this was because of g-s-d is launched
<vuntz> "how g-s-d..."
<seb128> well xsettings should apply dynamically
<seb128> starting gnome-settings-daemon manually after the session doesn't workaround the issue
<seb128> the settings apply to normal gtk applications but not to gnome-session
<vuntz> seb128: right, but something changed
<vuntz> and I'm not sure what it could be :-)
 * seb128 grrrrs a no gnome-session-remove in the rewrite
<seb128> a-> at
<crevette> yeah I was unable to remove nautilus yesterday from the session to test something,
<vuntz> it's quite easy to remove apps
<vuntz> pkill $app; pkill $app; pkill $app; etc.
<mvo> while true; do pill $app; done ;) ?
<vuntz> mvo: that's advanced shell usage. I'm not that clever
<mvo> lol
<pochu> bash: pill: command not found
<pochu> :)
 * mvo can do shell, but he can not type!
<seb128> vuntz: gnome-session respawn those automatically though
<seb128> vuntz: ie nautilus
<seb128> brb
<dholbach> hello my desktop friends
 * pochu waves at dholbach :)
<dholbach> can somebody tell me how I can debug what's happening with my ssh connection
<dholbach> ?
<dholbach> I have a hunch that something's wrong with seahorse or something
<dholbach> ssh -v  gives me "Agent admitted failure to sign using the key"
<ember> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=571422
<ubottu> Gnome bug 571422 in keyring files "ssh agent stopped working after 2.25.90 upgrade" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<dholbach> thanks a bunch ember
<dholbach> strangely enough it still works on my i386
<dholbach> just not on my amd64
 * ember hugs dholbach
<rickspencer3> asac: ping
<asac> rickspencer3: pong
<rickspencer3> asac: msg?
<dholbach> ember: followed up on the bug
<dholbach> muchas gracias
<dholbach> when I log into my amd64 from the i386, I can still ssh without problems
<dholbach> makes using bzr a bit of a pain
 * dholbach hugs seb128
<seb128> dholbach: what?
 * seb128 hugs dholbach
<seb128> dholbach: use ssh-add
<dholbach> seb128: talking about gnome bug 571422
<ubottu> Gnome bug 571422 in keyring files "ssh agent stopped working after 2.25.90 upgrade" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=571422
<seb128> right
<dholbach> other than that... how's the desktop world ticking along? all good?
<seb128> set SSH_AUTH_SOCK= to the ssh-... directory
<seb128> and use ssh-add
<seb128> yes, we are mostly uptodate and not too buggy ;-)
<seb128> and how is the community world?
<dholbach> busy, busy as always
<seb128> the sponsoring queue seems reasonable again now
<dholbach> today's loco docs day
<dholbach> seb128: main yes, universe not yet :)
<dholbach> but a lot of people put some more effort into it, which is nice
<seb128> I was pondering doing some work there or letting motu clean it
<dholbach> if you see something interesting and have a little bit of time, consider doing it :)
<dholbach> it makes me a happy man :)
<dholbach> not only you, but everybody else too
 * huats hugs seb128 and dholbach (advantage of having long arm)
<dholbach> hiya huats
<dholbach> haha
<dholbach> a lot of people put good efforts into merging important fixes from debian which is fantastic
 * dholbach is happy with the new people in MOTU land
<seb128> dholbach: let's wait for tomorrow
<seb128> then huats and didrocks can clean the universe sponsoring list ;-)
 * dholbach goes back to 5aday-automation :)
<dholbach> haha
<dholbach> exactly
<huats> ;)
<dholbach> the French mafia
<huats> well
<didrocks> seb128: :p
<huats> i am sure didrocks and I will be happy to help
<huats> :)
<didrocks> for sure
<huats> (but before there is the MC :))
<didrocks> (and to have to wake up early, hey huats ;))
<dholbach> yes, and as it's going to be 7:00 UTC and everybody will be grumpy, we'll grill you properly
<huats> btw dholbach in the new process, do we need to prepare anything ?
<seb128> ;-)
<huats> I am sure you will dholbach
<didrocks> great \o/
<seb128> dholbach: do I need to be there?
<didrocks> I love to be grilled ;)
<dholbach> no, you guys sent in good applications, you're fine
<dholbach> seb128: no
<seb128> cool
<huats> usually I am the cooker :)
<seb128> it's way too early ;-)
<huats> seb128:  lucky you :)
<didrocks> seb128: lucky man, you can sleep during this time :)
<huats> seb128: if you want we can give you wake up call ;)
<dholbach> seb128: so you prefer writing a bit more text on the application to getting up early for a meeting? :)))
<seb128> vuntz: I found the commit which broke the gnome-session theming
<dholbach> hiya vuntz!
 * seb128 hugs dholbach
<huats> pochu: I sent you the check-symbol stuff
<dholbach> I see... lots of stuff going on in Desktop land
<dholbach> rickspencer3: you have a great community in here! :-)
<didrocks> huats: you have to explain me again what you added, because I used the old one yesterday ;)
<huats> didrocks: the idea, with my stuff
<rickspencer3> dholbach: there is a great community here, yes
<huats> is that you can run it on your intrepid, even to test a jaunty stuff
<dholbach> rock on my desktop friends and thanks again for the pointer for the broken seahorse
<rickspencer3> but I think I don't think it's mine :) I think I joined a great community ;)
<didrocks> huats: using pbuilder login (I was thinking about using this trick)
<vuntz> seb128: oh, cool. Which one?
<didrocks> dholbach: see you tomorrow :)
<dholbach> didrocks: yeah :)
<seb128> vuntz: 5192 and 5193, ie the one which added the presence api
<pochu> huats: thanks! I'll look at it later :)
<huats> didrocks: it is a possibility also
<seb128> vuntz: not a small commit, trying to figure what is creating the issue there
<ember> is anybody working on tracker? mvo or pochu perhaps?
<mvo> not me
<pochu> ember: not me either, feel free to do the merge ;)
<ember> hmm ok i will have a look
<ember> btw mvo thanks for gtsharp2 it was blocking tomboy
<mvo> ember: thank you work doing the update
<huats> seb128: I am testing the gnome-doc-utils update... the documentation created by it, is the one used by yelp right ?
<seb128> huats: correct
<seb128> hey hggdh
<huats> seb128: ok great
<huats> :)
<seb128> hggdh: there?
<hggdh> seb128, yes
<hggdh> hi
<seb128> hggdh: so if you run seahorse, go to the password tab it's empty?
<seb128> you don't have default or login lines?
<hggdh> seb128, no, no keyring lines at all
<seb128> and nothing typed in the filter there?
<hggdh> nope
<seb128> weird
<seb128> so your bug is basically similar to bug #327481?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 327481 in seahorse "seahorse does not display passwords from login.keyring" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/327481
<hggdh> looking it up
<hggdh> seb128, indeed. File/New/Password Keyring does not do anything
<hggdh> so mine can be set as a dup of this one
<seb128> ok, doing that
<seb128> the new doing nothing is yet another issue
<seb128> seahorse lists my keyrings and password correctly but new doesn't do anything there
<hggdh> ah
<seb128> perhaps you could open the bug on bugzilla since you get the issue?
<hggdh> yes, will do
<seb128> it's working for me so I can't reply to the upstream questions if there is any there
<seb128> thanks
<hggdh> seb128, welcome
<mclasen> file/new/ssh is bizarre
<hggdh> ?
<mclasen> that help button is really misplaced
<hggdh> oh
<hggdh> perhaps a new bug on it would be good
<bryce> seb128: re the panel bug, it'd be helpful to have a simple test case to demonstrate the issue.  Offhand it's not obvious to me at what level the breakage could be happening.
<seb128> bryce: if you read the discussion it's not obvious to me either ;-)
<seb128> bryce: but I don't get the issue in xephyr or using an ati driver
<bryce> seb128: the patch by federico sounds like it is against Xinerama rather than Xrandr, and in reading it I'm not sure it would solve the problem.  Good to have for reference just in case though.
<seb128> right I don't think that's the exact same issue
<seb128> but gtk and gnome-panel don't change between those installations and the issue seems to be intel specific
<seb128> so xorg behaves differently on intel in some way
<bryce> mm
<seb128> compiz is buggy on intel too btw
<vuntz> bryce: I think you should blame seb128. It's the easy way, really
<bryce> intel is buggy too all by itself ;-)
<bryce> anyway, if we have steps to reproduce, I can push it upstream as an -intel bug and see what happens
<bryce> they're pretty responsive, including if it's an xserver bug rather than -intel
<bryce> my worry is that it's going to be more of an xrandr protocol level issue... like some functionality not yet provided for setting/getting the primary display
<bryce> which would be tough to get a fix for
<bryce> but if it is confirmed to work on -ati, then that suggests it's not a protocol issue
<seb128> well at least we would know what the issue is
<bryce> right
<seb128> well, it works fine on ati and xephyr for me
<seb128> and vuntz suggested from start that would be an intel bug
<bryce> did you also reproduce without xephyr?
<seb128> no, only on intel
<seb128> ati and xephyr work fine
<bryce> is there a bug id#?  And steps to reproduce written down?
<seb128> let me look, I did got a lot of comment about that during the sprint
<seb128> bug #325800 that you open is around those lines but slightly different
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 325800 in gnome-panel "On EeePC panel will not resize correctly after external monitor disconnected" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/325800
<bryce> yeah might be related but not the exact issue
<bryce> fwiw that is davidm's eeepc that he has promised to help do testing with
<seb128> bryce: ok, no bug that I can found describing the issue, I will try to debug a bit and open one later
<rickspencer3> bryce: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/xorg-server/+bug/327175
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 327175 in xorg-server "Sometimes loses input devices on suspend/resume: Device has changed - disabling." [Unknown,Confirmed]
<bryce> excellent; subscribe me to it once it's open
<seb128> ok
<seb128> brb doing a new bootchart
<andreasn> mpt, ping
<seb128> vuntz: btw, http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=570765
<ubottu> Gnome bug 570765 in Calendar "gnome panel hangs after clicked on the clock applet" [Critical,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> vuntz: you were asking for a stacktrace of clock applet hanging gnome-panel in 2.25
<vuntz> seb128: added a comment
<seb128> vuntz: thanks ;-)
<seb128> vuntz: it does happen with 2.25.90
<vuntz> ah. Well. No luck. I blame eds
<seb128> well, e-d-s is likely crashing
<seb128> still the clock should not hang
<crevette> I did had this bug yesterday evening I guess
<mvo> seb128: let me know when you are close to your laptop again (no rush), I have a theory about the compiz bugs you mentioned the other day
<seb128> mvo: ok, that will probably be in 15 minutes but I'll not be around it for long tonight since I go to sport soon after that, other that's for tomorrow
<seb128> mvo: do you want me to try something?
<seb128> ups
<mvo> seb128: just a gconf dump of your plugin settings
<seb128> ok
<mvo>  /apps/compiz/general/allscreens/options/active_plugins
<mvo> that is all I need
<seb128> that's probably the default set
<seb128> or rather select normal in the appareance capplet
<mvo> I think that the crucial bit, it seems like there is some reordering going on and that makde the default not the gconf default
<seb128> I did that after the abi breakage issue
<mvo> and to confirm I want to see yours :)
<seb128> ok
<vuntz> seb128: hope your question in the bug is not for me ;-)
<seb128> vuntz: you or mbarnes whoever want to reply
<seb128> time for sport and dinner bbl
<mvo> maxb: you had the compiz issues with gnomecompat too, right? is your system still in this state? if so, I would like to ask for debugging help :)
<maxb> mvo: Hi, just saw bugmail. Is your info request still useful after I've manually ticked the gnomecompat plugin on?
<mvo> maxb: I guess, please put it into the report that you did that :)
<mvo> maxb: a vanialla one would be better, but I'm sure I find someone with one (or I can try to reproduce it with some livecd magic)
<mvo> maxb: I have a theory about the problem at least
<maxb> Hmm.. I'm reading the debdiff now.... won't that solution fail if the user has played around in ccsm at all?
<maxb> w.r.t. the addition of "gnome-terminal" as the terminal command line (in the debdiff) - somehow it was figuring that out anyway - my problem turned out to be that the gnomecompat plugin defaults the "terminal" keybinding to disabled
<maxb> Hmm... So gnome-keybinding-properties syncs the settings it makes into compiz's gconf area?
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-02-13
<crevette> hello
<crevette> salut huats
<huats> hello crevette
<seb128> good morning there
<mvo> hey seb128!
<seb128> hello mvo
<seb128> mvo: I'm on my laptop now ;-)
<mvo> did you had a chance to look at the gconf output?
<mvo> great :)
<seb128> can you give me the gconf key again?
<seb128> or rather gconf directory
<mvo> gconftool --get /apps/compiz/general/allscreens/options/active_plugins
<seb128> $  gconftool --get /apps/compiz/general/allscreens/options/active_plugins
<seb128> [core,ccp,dbus,place,mousepoll,gnomecompat,move,resize,decoration,png,svg,imgjpeg,text,neg,video,wall,snap,animation,scale,scaleaddon,expo,staticswitcher,regex,resizeinfo,workarounds,ezoom,vpswitch,extrawm,fade,session]
<mvo> but with this config its now working, right?
<seb128> no
<mvo> does that include the latest uploads I did from yesterday?
<mvo> oh
<seb128> I did upgrade to the version you uploaded yesterday and use the capplet to reset normal effects
<mvo> but you still get the windows on multiple workspaces?
<seb128> yes
 * mvo scratches his head
<seb128> mvo: if you open the applications menu, accessories and select screenshot there it's only listed on one workspace?
<mvo> seb128: yes, but with the live-cd from yesterday I saw the same effect as you, just not on my normal system. I will try harder to reproduce
<seb128> just select the normal effects in the appareance capplet?
<seb128> mvo: that's weird, if I run 'gnome-screenshot --interactive' which is the desktop command I don't get the bug
<seb128> using the run application dialog or a command line
<seb128> but when starting it from the gnome-panel menu I get the issue
<mvo> and its evo and gnome-screenshot? or everything you start from the panekl?
<seb128> same for evolution
<seb128> starting it on a command line = no bug
<seb128> using the launcher installed by default = bug
<seb128> everything I start using a launcher
<seb128> or menu entry
<seb128> I get it with gedit too now
<seb128> mvo: get the bug too now?
<mvo> not ready yet, give me a minute :)
<seb128> that sounds like a "let me get some tea first then I can have a look" ;-)
<mvo> heh .) no, tea is already ready
<mvo> *yum*
<seb128> ;-)
<mvo> but the compiz test machine was not booted yet
<seb128> ah ok
<mvo> seb128: do you compiz 1:0.7.9+git20090211-0ubuntu3 ( ?
<seb128> "compiz test machine", I see
<mvo> :)
<seb128> you don't run this compiz crap on your normal boxes right? ;-)
<mvo> the laptop can't run compiz, it freeze after 5min (ati driver issue)
<mvo> and everything else runs compiz (i.e. my regular workstation)
<seb128> let me restart my session to be sure
<seb128> $ dpkg -l | grep compiz
<seb128> ii  compiz                                     1:0.7.9+git20090211-0ubuntu3      OpenGL window and compositing manager
<seb128> still getting the issue after a session restart
<seb128> mvo: so you still don't get the bug?
<mvo> woah, that is very strange, *now* I get it too, but I did not restart or anything, just clicked on the menu
<mvo> that is puzzeling
<seb128> mvo: you didn't even try before did you?
<mvo> seb128: you click on the workspace switcher applet? or use the key (ctrl-alt-left) ro swithc?
 * seb128 can see mvo saying "compiz bug, yeah, yeah, another of those gtk bugs rather"
<mvo> seb128: *plong*
<seb128> mvo: doesn't make a difference but neither of those, I've switch to workspace-n set for the workspaces I use often
<seb128> but using ctrl-alt-arrows or mouse doesn't make a difference
<mvo> I think I can reproduce it now too
<seb128> what did you change in your workflow to get it?
<mvo> starting it via the gnome-panel seems to be the key
<seb128> right
<mvo> hm
<mvo> _NET_WM_DESKTOP = 4294967295 does not look quite right :)
<mvo> (especiall when a manually started xterm has "0")
<mvo> metacity gets that right, I think here is the problem
 * mvo digs into the changes
<mvo> thanks a lot seb128!
<seb128> mvo: thanks to you ;-)
<mvo> I bet its a off-by-one error, 4294967295 is FFFFFFFF
<pitti> didrocks: congratulations to your MOTU badge!
<seb128> pitti: where has that been announced? did huat get accepted too?
<pochu> seb128: yeah :) check the motu ml
<pochu> seb128: or ubuntu-devel@
<pitti> seb128: yes, huats too
<pitti> seb128: u-d or u-d-d
<seb128> got the emails now
<seb128> you guys are too quick at reading those ;-)
 * pochu was at the end of the meeting ;)
<seb128> I tend to not poll on my emails every minutes or I spend half of the day doing that ;-)
<pitti> seb128: just by accident, I figure
 * pitti usually processes mails three or four times a day
<seb128> btw other topic
<seb128> but do you guys have an opinion on all those netbook patches which randomly add scrollbars?
<seb128> that seems rather an ugly workaround to me and I don't like those very much though there is no strong technical reason for that
<pitti> scrollbars??
<seb128> I'm wondering if we should just apply those or should discuss other ways too?
<pitti> eww
<pitti> I thought they'd rearrange the dialogs to fit into small screens?
<seb128> pitti: no, they do add scrollviews for when < 600
<seb128> pitti: bug #324464 is one example
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 324464 in gnome-control-center "gnome-mouse-properties does not fit in 1024x600 screen" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/324464
<seb128> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/22549603/90_1024x600_gnome-mouse-properties.c.patch
<pitti> seb128: well, *shrug* if it doesn't alter the default look if you have more than 600 pixels, it's certainly bearable for jaunty, but IMHO the dialogs should just be rearranged upstream
<seb128> right, my opinion too
<didrocks> pitti: thanks a lot ;)
<seb128> several of those changes patch glade files though
<seb128> didrocks: congrats
<seb128> and patching glade = no fun to do updates
<didrocks> hi seb128 and thanks too :)
<pitti> seb128: for jaunty they won't change that much any more, and the original authors should push to get them upstream; otherwise we'll just drop them again in the next release and ask them to re-do the patch
<seb128> pitti: ok, I dislike the changes but I guess we can do that for jaunty
<pitti> seb128: btw, does the evo integration in the clock applet work for you?
<pitti> seb128: I never get any appointments/TODOs there any more
<pitti> and with google cals in evo enabled, it even hangs the panel
<seb128> I don't want to click on the applet now, I got too many hangs recently and ctrl-alt-backspace not working ;-)
<pitti> heh
<pitti> killall gnome-panel helps
<seb128> right when you think about opening a command line before having the issue ;-)
<pitti> ctlr+alt+f1 :)
<seb128> pitti: ok, can't use clock applet, hangs every time
<seb128> pitti: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=570765
<ubottu> Gnome bug 570765 in Calendar "gnome panel hangs after clicked on the clock applet" [Critical,Unconfirmed]
 * seb128 grrrrrs at vuntz
<seb128> re
<seb128> pitti: the clock applet seems to list events correctly when not freezing after starting evolution
<seb128> ie I restart, open the calendar, nothing listed, start evo, open the calendar, then they are listed there
<mvo> seb128: I think I nailed it down, sn_startup_sequence_get_workspace() return 0xffffffff when opened by the gnome-panel. I'm not sure if this is (also) a bug in the panel, but I added a workaround into compiz and sent a patch upstream
<seb128> mvo: ok thanks, that worked fine with compiz before the recent updates so compiz did change in some way
<mvo> seb128: yeah, I suspect its really compiz that is faulty, let me know if the new version (-ubuntu4) fixes it for you too, thanks again for the good description of the problem :)
 * mvo off for lunch
<seb128> mvo: you're welcome, thanks for the quick fixing ;-)
<huats> hey seb128 :)
<huats> we missed you this morning ;)
<seb128> lut huats, congrats
<huats> thanks seb128
<seb128> huats: too early for me ;-)
<huats> you deserve a great share for that...
<seb128> huats: now we can count on your for universe desktopish updates ;-)
<huats> yep !
<seb128> pedro_: hello, g_slice crashes require a valgrind log
<seb128> huats: how was the meeting then? did you get many questions?
<huats> seb128: not a lot
<pedro_> seb128: i know, I'm getting one since same crash is happening here
<huats> mainly about my opinion on how to improve the desktop work
<seb128> pedro_: ok
 * asac hugs huats for reaching MOTU decoration ;)
<huats> thanks asac !
<rickspencer31> pitti: ping
<Laney> seb128: What's the deal with bug #327747?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 327747 in ubuntu "Please promote new package "nautilus-sendto-universe" to universe" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/327747
<seb128> Laney: what do you mean exactly?
<seb128> Laney: that's a new package that needs review and sponsoring?
<Laney> Yeah, is there a reason why it's not on REVU?
<Laney> and why it's native?
<seb128> Laney: there is a diff.gz on the bug, how native?
<Laney> I see no orig
<seb128> Laney: is using REVU a rule? I for one don't have an account on REVU and don't use it
<seb128> Laney: the orig is the nautilus-sendto one
<Laney> ah
<Laney> REVU isn't technically required, but I doubt that any MOTU will review and upload straight from launchpad
<Laney> unless the package is special for some reason
<seb128> I will if they don't
<seb128> MOTU sucks sometimes
<seb128> I don't get why using REVU should be a requirement
<seb128> that's a normal sponsoring request
<seb128> need to talk to dholbach about it
<Laney> maybe its fine, I just didn't get what it was about
<seb128> Laney: it's about building code which requires universe build-depends
<seb128> Laney: the choice are to either promote those build-depends or have an universe package which does the build
<Laney> oh right, I get it
<Laney> it wasn't very clear, sorry for the confusion
<seb128> that's alright
<seb128> just curious but was not clear?
<seb128> the description and package name should give good clue
<Laney> I understood the purpose, but not the implementation
<seb128> what do you consider as suboptimal?
<seb128> or what is weird for you?
<Laney> It wasn't clear that this was a fork of an already-existing package, and that it uses the same orig
<Laney> maybe it's just the way I read it though
<seb128> well, it doesn't use the same orig exactly
<seb128> or rather than a cp nautilus-sendto.orig.tar.gz nautilus-sendto-universe.orig.tar.gz
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> md5sum-identical
<seb128> the idea is to have the same source but ship the things which have universe depends only
<Laney> anyway I will review it later
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> I was going to do that but if you do it that's better so I can NEW it
<seb128> I prefer to not have the same person doing the review and NEWing
<seb128> for what is worth I did look at the debdiff and it's trivial
<seb128> it's basically extra build-deps over the main package and a .install to install the things which are not in nautilus-sendto
<seb128> Laney: welcome on your new MOTU membership btw ;-)
<Laney> thanks
<seb128> welcome -> congrats
<seb128> rather ;-)
<ember> congrats huats didrocks and Laney :p
<huats> thanks ember
<bluesmoke> mvo: Please do a snapshot of plugins-main, wall is so awesome now :)
<mvo> bluesmoke: you should still have commit access to the team ;)
<mvo> bluesmoke: but yeah, sounds great. I need some "commitment" from danny that there will be a stable releas at some point
<mvo> otherwise I get into trouble :)
<bluesmoke> Supposedly 0.8 was supposed to be out now
<mvo> but just compiz, no? the plugins-{main,extra} are not branched
<mvo> or is trunk just what will be 0.8?
<mvo> (for the plugins)
<bluesmoke> They planned on doing it all together
<mvo> cool
<mvo> I missed that
<mvo> Amaranth: I make a update into the compiz ppa now, sounds like we should be prepared
<Amaranth> mvo: They want 0.8 to be the first release that drops the fusion name, from what I can understand of it
<Amaranth> Which I think is too much, they should just do the release and worry about that stuff for 0.9
<mvo> I agree, its just a name afterall
<pitti> rickspencer31: pong
<seb128> huats: do you have universe upload rights already?
<seb128> didrocks: or you?
<seb128> bug #329020 seems a good first desktop sponsoring ;-)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 329020 in ghex "fix "deprecation warning printed on startup" and "incorrect selection length in statusbar"" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/329020
<huats> seb128: I don't know :)
<seb128> huats: good opportunity to try if you want ;-)
<huats> seb128: I am a bit on a rush now :(
<seb128> huats: ok no hurry, maybe something to try this weekend if you want
<huats> yep
<huats> I am taking care of it , but this WE or monday :)
<seb128> ok
<huats> (of course I'll look if nobody deal with it ))
<ember> mvo or seb128 care to accept the gnome-desktop-sharp2 binaries? tomboy requires libgnomepanel2.24-cil
<mvo> Amaranth: plugins are now in the compiz-ppa
<Amaranth> mvo: woohoo
<mvo> ember: seb128 will have to do that, I can not do NEW
<Amaranth> mvo: have you seen the feature I'm talking about in wall?
<mvo> Amaranth: :) I like the "keep dock windows in place" when doing the place
<mvo> eh, switch
<mvo> is that what you mean?
<Amaranth> yep
<Amaranth> It's like the static plugin but it works for the desktop too
<mvo> Amaranth: yeah, its very cool
<mvo> a small thing, but looks much nicer
<Amaranth> I was asked to ensure this gets into jaunty :)
<mvo> haha
<mvo> Amaranth: by danny? or some users :) ?
<Amaranth> users
<Amaranth> gnome-do developers, actually
<mvo> nice
<mvo> I guess it should be safe to upload it into jaunty proper
<Amaranth> until 0.9 compiz is still "the latest git snapshot is better then the last release"
<Amaranth> 0.9.x is going to be hard to deal with
<mvo> did you actually start to package the compiz++ branch?
<asac> Riddell: i tried kubuntu-desktop yesterday on my ati system and after login it ends up with a white screen similar to what happens if i force compiz under gnome.
<Amaranth> mvo: Nope, not really worth it yet
<Amaranth> mvo: everything is going to be moving around
<asac> mpt_: see msg
 * mvo nods
<Riddell> asac: if you're in a testing mood, see if this helps  echo -e "[Compositing]\nEnabled=false" > ~/.kde/share/config/kwinrc
<asac> Riddell: ok so you dont run similar blacklisting as we do for compiz
<asac> =
<asac> Riddell: Riddell you ment ">>" not ">" right=
<asac> damn keyboard
<Riddell> asac: it should use the blacklist from compiz
<Riddell> asac: depends if you care about about kwin settings :)
<asac> i appended that now to my config. next time i log in i will check
<asac> Riddell: probably not ... i never used kde in the last years or so
<asac> oh i started it in intrepid for networkmanager i think
<asac> Riddell: the only thing that makes compiz fallback on my card is "Software Rasterizing" ... you probably want to check for that too
<asac> Riddell: anyway ... will let you know if that helped at all
<seb128> re
<seb128> mvo: so how many compiz updates can you screw in a week? ;-)
<mvo> *pff*
<seb128> mvo: just jocking, your new version fix my issue ;-)
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<crevette> hey gentlemen
<crevette> I plan to do the update of the lastest bluez version
 * mvo hugs seb128
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128 - just looking at bug 314263 again - the uploaded patch is not correct, which is part of the reason it doesn't work anymore
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 314263 in glib2.0 "regression - URIs opened with firefox %u load as local files (file:///...)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/314263
<seb128> chrisccoulson: feel free to submit a debdiff to fix it
<chrisccoulson> i will do, but i just tested it with the patch applied correctly, and it still doesn't work correctly. it doesn't pass any uri to the application now
<seb128> chrisccoulson: what is wrong in the patch?
<chrisccoulson> the patch does what was intended, but i'm wondering whether something changed between 2.19.5 and 2.19.6. i'm going to apply it to 2.19.5 in a minute and make sure it still works
<chrisccoulson> i'm doing a build with some g_debug's in at the moment so i can try and work out what is going on
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'll provide a corrected debdiff for that. it seems to be working now after logging out and back in again
<seb128> chrisccoulson: what did you change now?
<chrisccoulson> i havent changed anything, other than correcting the patch so that it applies properly
<seb128> chrisccoulson: you don't want to tell me what was wrong or not correctly applied then?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, the patch actually patched itself (if that makes sense), because of a copy/paste error from the debdiff i provided
<seb128> ah ok
<seb128> I did screw the 2.15.6 update because my local copy was not uptodate
<seb128> and your debdiff added another revision rather than fixing that
<seb128> so I did tweak it
<seb128> but I did it quickly and probably did something wrongly there
<seb128> next time I will ask for an updated debdiff rather ;-)
<chrisccoulson> that's ok ;)
<chrisccoulson> just in case it didn't make sense, i copied the extracted patch to http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/117746/ so you can see
<chrisccoulson> it's a direct copy and paste from the debdiff i think and as a consequence it actually patches itself;)
<asac> bryce: http://www.tuxradar.com/content/browser-benchmarks-2-even-wine-beats-linux-firefox ... hmm
<asac> thats partly firefox fault. most time probably goes lost on cairo/X11/driver level
<asac> just FYI
<bryce> asac: bummer
<bryce> asac: hmm, I wonder exactly what differences in the stack exist between wine and non-wine
<bryce> asac: I'd think they're using the same X11/driver bits underneath but who knows
<bryce> could easily just be some difference in cairo backends
<asac> bryce: its gtk + cairo + xrender vs. windows.dll toolkit that probably doesnt use cairo and maybe not xrender underneath
<asac> bryce: i am quite sure its cairo (if not gtk), but not sure if its really cairos folk or just its heavy use of xrender or other X11 features
<asac> i know that cairo has a few cases where it has bugs ... like rendering of box borders
<asac> not sure if those can explain all
<bryce> mm
<bryce> well I'm good friends with cworth (he lives the next town over) so if there's specific work or questions you need, I'd be happy to get his help
<bryce> asac, hmm in fact i'll send him this article now and get  his feedback
<bryce> asac: btw have you run that benchmark to confirm the findings on ubuntu?
<asomething> seb128: not to distract from your discussion in devel, but I was wondering if there are any 2.25.90 updates that still need some one to handle them.
<seb128> asomething: I don't think so but 2.25.91 coming soon ;-)
<seb128> asomething: you can work on split evolution documentation by locale if you want
<seb128> that would be nice to win cd space
<asomething> seb128: interesting, I'll look into that. that would be something new for me
<seb128> basically list evolution-documentation-nn where nn is a locale for each locale in the control file and move things in the rules or something I would expect
<seb128> you can try looking at how gimp does that
<asomething> i'll give it a shot
<asac> bryce: no, but a commentor did: 161 (wine) vs 130 (native)
<bryce> mm ok
<bryce> I'll cc you
<crevette> seb128: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/327747/comments/6
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 327747 in ubuntu "Please promote new package "nautilus-sendto-universe" to universe" [Wishlist,Incomplete]
<crevette> hey Laney
<crevette> you're here
<Laney> yessir
<crevette> about https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/327747/comments/6
<seb128> Laney: control.in, that's a copy of nautilus-sendto mostly so better to keep changes low to make easier to do updates and keeping those in sync
<crevette> if you I replace Universe by Supplementrary in short description, wiil it make you happy?
<seb128> Laney: ie, cleaning that would only means extra diff over nautilus-sendto and work to do merges for no real win
<Laney> seb128: Well I was imaginging that merges would be done manually anyway so it wouldn't matter
<Laney> but I dont' feel strongly about it, it was more stylistic
<seb128> right, I've no strong opinion either
<crevette> as you want
<Laney> crevette: I was thinking more along the lines of the nautilus-sendto one
<Laney> integrates xxx and yyy into nautilus or something
<Laney> also, there were some indentation inconsistencies in control, but now I'm really nitpicking :)
<crevette> so should I drop control.in ?
<Laney> I will upload either way, so pick what will make you more happy as maintainer
<crevette> Laney: I'm not technically speaking a maintainer, and I don't consider myself as a maitainer
<crevette> I'm just some guy helping ubuntu  :)
<crevette> I appreciate any good advice
<crevette> :)
<Laney> well IMO it isn't necessary, especially as the changelog history will differ, and this is the main point of uploaders.mk
<Laney> why did you add DEB_DESTDIR btw?
<crevette> Laney: to be able to only provide the two *.so files
<crevette> I've been advised to do so
<crevette> :)
<Laney> oh, was the whole directory installed by default in nautilus-sendto?
<crevette> Laney: yes
<Laney> i.e. not adding it would install all of the plugins again
<Laney> OK, got it
<Laney> (might be nice to say this in the changelog)
<crevette> Laney: we rebuild whole nautilus-sendto why that, and we only pick up the so we want to have
<Laney> yeah, I understand
<crevette> Laney: http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/m4b7895d5
<crevette> is it better for you?
<Laney> crevette: How about "integrates Empathy and UPnP into the Nautilus file manager"?
<Laney> following nautilus-sendto
<seb128_> Laney: are you a native english speaker?
<Laney> yes
<seb128_> just wondering ;-)
<seb128_> Laney: ok, so you pick the description, will probably be better than what french guys (ie crevette or me for example) can do ;-)
<Laney> heh, I was just going for consistency
<Laney> but it sounds better to me too
<seb128_> Laney: yeah, I think your suggestion makes sense
<pochu> seb128: I didn't know the notification bugs where actually valid upstream bugs
<pochu> seb128: that makes things quite different
<pochu> I've already forwarded one upstream and I'm going to prepare a patch for another one
<Laney> they are?
<pochu> Laney: yes
<Laney> interesting
<Laney> I was under the impression that Ubuntu was being quite heavy-handed here
<pochu> Actions may or may not supported by the daemon, so they should check that it's supported before using it
<Laney> in what sense are they valid?
<Laney> oh, that is cool
<pochu> see "Actions" in table 1 in http://www.galago-project.org/specs/notification/0.9/x81.html
<seb128> pochu: right, they are but they have no strong reason to go this way, they are just wishlists
<pochu> "This functionality may not be implemented by the notification server, conforming clients should check if it is available before using it"
<pochu> seb128: who are "they"?
<seb128> Laney: well, the idea is to stop using notification in bubbles
<Laney> Yeah, I know the idea
<Laney> I just thought that it was an Ubuntu quirk
<seb128> pochu: upstream, GNOME, the daemon they use support actions so they might not see the issue
<seb128> where the new daemon will not
<pochu> seb128: right, but they are ignoring the spec, which makes those valid bugs
<pochu> even if they are low prio
<seb128> right, bugs are valid
<seb128> I just say it's not really a priority for them
<pochu> yeah
<seb128> but no doubt opening bugs makes sense
<pochu> bug my two affected upstreams are not GNOME ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<pochu> and actually I'm now upstream for Liferea itself
<pochu> although if you tell me Liferea consumes 100% cpu, I'll blame Xulrunner :)
<seb128> pochu: congrats
<pochu> thanks :)
<crevette> pochu: time to switch to webkit :)
<pochu> crevette: oh yeah :)
<pochu> crevette: trunk is webkit only
<seb128> pochu: btw where are you running for motu membership then?
<crevette> really ?
<pochu> no Xulrunner, no GtkHtml anymore ;)
<pochu> crevette: yeah
<seb128> where -> when
<pochu> and 1.6 will be released soon
<pochu> seb128: I'm MOTU for more than a year ;)
<seb128> hum, I was not sure, should have checked
<seb128> pochu: you should do universe sponsoring ;-)
<pochu> yeah...
<seb128> good to see new people helping there with Laney, huats and didrocks who joined today
<seb128> anyway dinner time
<seb128> bbl
<pochu> enjoy
 * crevette stays UNMOTU
<crevette> :)
<pochu> crevette: not for long!
<crevette> pochu: you're tracking applications using action in notifications ?
<pochu> crevette: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=dxteam
<crevette> pochu: gnome-user-share uses actions (I coded notification for it)
<crevette> but I don't see the gain removing actions, but it is true I didn't read docs related to the changes you're doing
<pochu> crevette: I'm not tracking them... maybe the Dx team missed that
<pochu> crevette: or maybe they didn't report it yet ;)
<crevette> what is dxteam ?
<pochu> crevette: well, the point is that according to the notification-daemon spec, the daemon may not have actions support
<pochu> crevette: so you should check if it has, and if it doesn't, don't use them
<crevette> okay
<pochu> crevette: Desktop Experience team
<pochu> (new Canonical team)
<crevette> okay
<pochu> crevette: so the bugs are for applications that don't check whether the daemon has actions support before using them
<pochu> those that do are fine
<mclasen_> pochu: yet the bugs all read '...shouldn't use notifications with actions'
<pochu> mclasen_: yeah, I guess the title is incorrect
<pochu> mclasen_: the body says "they should check if the daemon supports Actions"
<mclasen_> fair enough
<pochu> or actually
<pochu> "Instead, the buttons should be made conditional on whether the notification server supports actions."
<pochu> which is the direction that patches have
<pochu> e.g. http://launchpadlibrarian.net/22449526/goobox-notify.diff
<asac> pochu: where did you read that?
<asac> 20:09 < pochu> "Instead, the buttons should be made conditional on whether the notification server supports  actions."
<pochu> asac: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/liferea/+bug/328606
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 328606 in liferea "liferea shouldn't use notifications with actions" [Undecided,New]
<pochu> asac: see comment #3 in bug 328609
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 328609 in decibel-audio-player "decibel-audio-player shouldn't use notifications with actions" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/328609
 * asac looks
<asac> pochu: (on liferea) but the presence of the option makes it difficult to remove ... what does that mean
<pochu> asac: I think they mean the presence of the option in liferea's preferences, but I'll have to check it
<pochu> I don't have libnotify enabled so I'm not sure
<pochu> will try to have a look tomorrow
<asac> which option?
<asac> "presence of the option" - what option? what do you control with that? enable/disable notifications?
<pochu> the preference option->yes
<pochu> and the notifications have actions in it
<pochu> like "mark those new items as read" and things like that
<asac> i understand that part.
<asac> for me "option" was not defined at all in the bug ... could be any option
<asac> so lets assume its "enable/disable" notification optoin
<asac> let me reread
<pochu> Liferea has a âShow a popup window with new headlines.â option that is on by default
<asac> pochu: heh
<asac> true
<pochu> it's cleary the preference option in the GUI tab, isn't it?
 * asac rereads ;)
<pochu> :)
<pochu> s/cleary/clearly/
<asac> pochu: so this bug is about removing action buttons
<asac> why all the rest of this info?
<asac> i mean its fine, but it isnt related to the bug ;)
<asac> or am i missing the connection?
<asac> so notifications are "These are annoying and unusable" ... because you get flooded ... now we remove actions which doesnt fix the flood ;)
<asac> pochu: so are those libnotify notifications?
<pochu> asac: yes
<pochu> "Instead, the buttons should be made conditional on whether the notification server supports actions."
<pochu> that's the key
<pochu> the notification-daemon specification doesn't guarantee the daemon will support Actions
<pochu> so the application (liferea) should check that the daemon does, and if so it can use Actions
<pochu> there's an API to check that
<pochu> but liferea currently doesn't check it, it just uses Actions unconditionally
<pochu> the Dx team plans to change notification-daemon to not provide Actions support, so those apps that don't check if there's support for them will be buggy
<pochu> those are bugs in the apps because of the spec says they need to check that
<pochu> so that's what we need to fix :)
 * pochu -> bed, g'night!
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-02-14
<asac> pochu: ok. thats what i understood. i aksed for API details on the bug.
<nickckck> good morning! buongiorno
<nickckck> anyone can tell me how to install ubuntu on my raid disks with dual boot with xp?
<pochu> asac: james_w pointed me to http://launchpadlibrarian.net/22449526/goobox-notify.diff that has a C example
<pochu> asac: basically you have to check if the GList returned by notify_get_server_caps() has a "actions" item, if so you can use actions
<pochu> asac: but I agree pointers in the bug report would have been useful :)
<Tm_T> nickckck: see topic
<nickckck> I saw topic... are about 2 months that i 'm triyng to install ubuntu, but .. nothing
<Tm_T> nickckck: I cannot help, as I do not hold the knowledge on this, so I'd say you may get help easier in #ubuntu
<Tm_T> (it's mentioned in topic too)
<nickckck> i'm already there, but they does't help me....thanks anyway :(
<asac> pochu: thanks. what i tried was that david includes that info in his bug reports ;)
<asac> pochu: can you add that link there?
<asac> or will you implement that even?
<pochu> asac: yeah I'll look at fixing it in Liferea
<asac> cool
<jbarnes> bryce: ping on bug #19304, dunno if you have an easy way to spin a new xf86-video-intel package with a patch, but if so some users there might like it :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 19304 in libxklavier "Error activating XKB configuration (breezy) (dup-of: 25797)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/19304
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 25797 in libxklavier "xkb error on gnome login in latest dapper" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/25797
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-02-15
<metoshade> hi everyone
<metoshade> i have a rather strange and bizar problem
<metoshade> hmmm
<metoshade> for support please join #ubuntu....
<metoshade> ok
<chrisccoulson> 1
<mountainma1> Hi all.  I need some help getting into ubuntu GUI desktop.  Did some updates and got rid of programs that weren't being used, now GUI will not load.  Upon advise of some posting threads, i uninstalled ubuntu-desktop through terminal, with intentions of reinstalling immediatly.  Now it's not working to reinstall--with the message "unable to fetch some archives, try running apt-get update" which produces another message "failure to fetch  ........" wi
<mountainma1> anyone here?
<Nafallo> mountainma1: you want #ubuntu
<mountainma1> can't find any help there either
<mountainma1> seems this is a bug from ubuntu-desktop....
<hicham> hi there
<hicham> hi there
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-02-15
<chrisccoulson> james_w - i've pushed a change to bzr for the gnome-desktop issue now, incorporating your change too
<chrisccoulson> i made a small change though. i removed this bit:
<chrisccoulson> +            *error = NULL;
<chrisccoulson> as that leaks the GError if it was set
<chrisccoulson> because the error is just discarded here, I don't pass it to the previous function at all anymore
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, you there?
<desrt> i miss seb :(
<robert_ancell> desrt, :)
<robert_ancell> desrt, I am your Canonical appointed Seb-substitute.  How can I help ;)
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, can you release lp:~ubuntu-desktop/xdg-utils/ubuntu?  Needs main privileges
<desrt> robert_ancell: a hug?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: What does releasing involve?
<TheMuso> oh upload it?
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, er, uploading. Sponsoring.  Whatever the jargon is :)
<robert_ancell> fixes attachments and thunderbird
<robert_ancell> (patches taken from upstream
<robert_ancell> )
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Righto will get to it in a sec
<robert_ancell> no rush
 * robert_ancell hugs desrt
<desrt> robert_ancell: that was most excellent.  thank you.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, oh, also any feedback about simple-scan and a11y would be appreciated.  I'm thinking OCR support could be very useful.
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Ok haven't looked at it yet, but I'll give it a try when I next need to scan something.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, are there any tools that scan and read out the contents?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: mago/ldtp, accerciser to name a couple.
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: that is if you mean a11y testing
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, I mean read out the contents of the scanned page
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: oh right, none that I know of that do that.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, I do use those tools but it's often hard to tell if ticking all those boxes really makes it accessible
 * robert_ancell files a new bug
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: ok looking at xdg-utils now.
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: uploaded
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, thanks
<TheMuso> np
<robert_ancell> RAOF, hey, thanks for the launchpad-integration work
<^arky^> hi
<^arky^> Wonder what happened to shutdown menu under system its an important a11y bug 510775
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 510775 in indicator-applet "indicator applet removes shutdown menu option" [Low,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/510775
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> asac: langpack machine name> macquarie
<pitti> kklimonda: they are hacked somewhat, like dropping the rsyslog dd process; but not too much
<baptistemm> good morning
<pitti> bonjour baptistemm
<baptistemm> hi pitti
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> hey pitti, did you have a good week-end?
<pitti> oh yes, I did; it was great for relaxing
<pitti> how about you?
<didrocks> pitti: I connected to IRC and got a lot of questions and feedbacks (more details on that later), so not really resting finally :)
<pitti> ah, error
<pitti> after not having had a weekend last week, I really needed this one
<baptistemm> didrocks, sorry :)
<baptistemm> hello :)
<didrocks> baptistemm: not particularly your fault ;) I had some ping on quickly, anjuta, and une too ;)
<baptistemm> salut seb128
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> hey didrocks baptistemm pitti
<seb128> didrocks, never IRC during the weekend ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: right, I guess I have to change my habits :)
<baptistemm> or change your nick during the weekend
<baptistemm> :)
<didrocks> hehe /nick didrocks_hidden
<baptistemm> pitti, what is the difference between devicekit-disk and udisk ?
<pitti> baptistemm: it was by and large a rename, but udisks also grew some more features
<baptistemm> okay
<baptistemm> the api has changed ?
<pitti> just uploaded usb-creator
<pitti> I'll port dell-recovery now, then I can remove devicekit-disks from the archive
<pitti> baptistemm: yes, due to the renaming; but not a lot besides that
<pitti> i. e. o.fd.DeviceKit.Disks -> o.fd.UDisks
<pitti> likewise with d-bus object paths, and so on
<Keybuk> usb-creator will need porting too I guess?
<pitti> 09:43:36         pitti | just uploaded usb-creator
<Keybuk> oh
<Keybuk> sorry
<Keybuk> haven't had enough coffee yet
<pitti> np :)
<pitti> Keybuk: good morning
<pitti> Keybuk: how was your weekend?
<Keybuk> relaxing thanks, yours?
<pitti> for me, too; went for some skiing, visiting family, grandparents in hospital, and got some housecleaning done
<pitti> oh, and some episodes of Al Bundy :)
<Keybuk> heh, nice
<Keybuk> most of mine was spent with friends
<didrocks> restarting session to test something, brb
<didrocks> baptistemm: bg change commited
<baptistemm> youpi
<baptistemm> Ihaz sharp Eyze
<didrocks> baptistemm: you have to say "chouette" here, it's rick's rule :) ("swcheet" is also accepted ;))
<baptistemm> Chouette !!!
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> baptistemm: heh, you will tell me once sponsored and installed
<baptistemm> so what did you do?
<baptistemm> didrocks, so not before tonight
<didrocks> baptistemm: put the quality to 100% for jpeg, the image have approximately the same size
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: work late again? (see a commit at 00:10 on libgnome-desktop) :)
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks
<chrisccoulson> that's not late for me ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: sure, relatively speakingâ¦ ;)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks: did you have a good weekend?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: a lot of IRC ping as you saw on Saturday for instance (but the same on Sunday). So, not really resting as I'm bugged myself during whole the week-end about the session issue :)
<didrocks> but it was still a week-end :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: and you?
<chrisccoulson> i had quite a relaxing weekend. i had plans to do lots of work, but we had family round in the end, and I didn't really start anything until yesterday evening
<baptistemm> didrocks, format name is always "jpeg"?, it couldn't be jpg for instance ?
<didrocks> baptistemm: looking at the format doc, it seems not
<baptistemm> okay, sorry for asking
<chrisccoulson> heh, i see pitti is busy this morning moving dk-disks bug tasks over to udisks ;)
<pitti> yeah, good oppportunity to review dk-disks bugs and catch up on triaging
<pitti> good morning
<didrocks> baptistemm: no pb. If we see some special case, we will be able to change that easily :)
<chrisccoulson> good morning pitti :)
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'm great, thanks; had a nice and relaxing weekend. how are yuo?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, quite relaxing too. we left our daughter with her grandparents on saturday evening, and went out for a meal
<chrisccoulson> which was a nice break!
<baptistemm> bad parents !!!!
<baptistemm> :)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> we only left her for an hour or so
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i just saw you left a comment on the g-d-u bug that superm sent upstream at the weekend
<pitti> *nod*
<chrisccoulson> i thought we'd fixed this issue
<chrisccoulson> but the new fix is definately wrong
<pitti> I faintly remembered that we discussed that before, indeed
<pitti> but I wasn't sure whether it was the same problem
<chrisccoulson> pitti - the issue we identified was related to the timeout of the dbus calls being shorter than expected
<chrisccoulson> the issue that superm has reported is fundamentally the same issue
<chrisccoulson> (the first dbus call fails when activating the daemon)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm wondering if there isn't another race here with activated services. udisks claims the org.freedesktop.udisks service name (or whatever it is called now) when it loads, but it does this before registering the object we're trying to communicate with
<chrisccoulson> i wonder if that can make the first call fail sometimes
<pitti> oh, is it even possible to do that the other way round? (register, then claim)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i can't see why not. you'd still have a connection to the bus (but it would be a number)
<chrisccoulson> then you just change the name when you're ready
<chrisccoulson> perhaps james_w has some insight here
<chrisccoulson> james_w - FYI - bug 521481 (this issue keeps cropping up again)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 521481 in gnome-disk-utility "gvfs-gdu-volume-monitor crashed with SIGSEGV in gdu_pool_get_presentables()" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/521481
<chrisccoulson> pitti - do you want me to reopen this bug?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, I think we should
<chrisccoulson> pitti - done
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - you bumped the gnome-desktop version number in bzr to 2.29.90-0ubuntu4
<baptistemm> For thoses interested, I packaged devhelp 2.29.90, I just need sponsoring
<chrisccoulson> there's no need to do that is there?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: grrr, I used dch -a, sorry, let me fix that
<chrisccoulson> (as 2.29.90-0ubuntu3 hasn't been released yet)
<baptistemm> ah daniel did it
<chrisccoulson> heh ;)
<chrisccoulson> thanks:)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: sorry, twice in a week ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: fixed
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<seb128> pitti, bug #453605
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 453605 in nautilus "Make default mount umasks configurable" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/453605
<seb128> pitti, this sort of option used to be in gnome-mount
<pitti> right, g-m had a nautilus extension
<seb128> pitti, I don't nautilus is the right component for such policy, should that be somewhere in the udisk stack?
<seb128> or g-d-u
<pitti> no, it needs to be in GNOME, and nautilus does the automounting
<pitti> (which I'm not happy about, but that's the way things are ATM)
<seb128> well nautilus doesn't specify mount options does it
<pitti> right, that's the wishlist :)
<seb128> I don't think nautilus should
<seb128> udisk should have some config file it reads
<seb128> the way gnome-mount was reading gconf keys
<seb128> no?
<seb128> it would seem logic to not have those options restricted to the caller
<pitti> udisks doesn't have policy, or can have per-user config
<pitti> we could have nautilus or gdu read gconf values
<seb128> well, what does call mount in the stack
<seb128> and why could that read a config?
<seb128> I'm sure there is non nautilus users who want to tweak mount options too
<pitti> well, you can with udisks and gdu
<pitti> gdu_device_op_filesystem_mount() takes options, and so does udisks --mount
<pitti> in theory we could add gconf reading to gdu
<pitti> that would make it a bit more awkward to XFCE and friends (due to the new dependency), but I don't care that much about this
<seb128> let's say it's a wishlist for next cycle
<seb128> by which time we will have gsettings in glib
<seb128> and we can use that rather than gconf
<seb128> pitti, thanks!
<pitti> right, just a wishlist bug; can be entirely ignored
<seb128> yeah, will do that
<seb128> I was just curious about the design
<pitti> ah, then we could add configurability to gdu indeed
<seb128> seems gnome-mount flexibility was better ;-)
<pitti> since it'll need glib either way
<pitti> yeah, it was indeed
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> how are you today?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good! you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i'm ok thanks. i'm getting a bit tired now though, as I've ran out of coffee at work
<seb128> no coffee on monday morning is not a nice week start ;-)
<chrisccoulson> it's not ;)
<chrisccoulson> i have to wait until lunchtime before i can get some more
<baptistemm> chrisccoulson, you're a coffeelcoholic ?
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm: yeah, i am
<chrisccoulson> it will probably do me good to have a morning without though
<baptistemm> For those working on Moblin, http://meego.com/ --> Â« Moblin and Maemo are merging Â»
<baptistemm> you can say bye bye to GTK+ development on mobile platform ...
<baptistemm> cassidy, do you look at empathy bug in launchpad ?
<cassidy> baptistemm, rarely. I already receive too much upstream bugs :\
<baptistemm> okay
<baptistemm> So I need to forward my crasher
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm: if it's not due to one of our patches ;)
<baptistemm> we'll see :-/
<cassidy> baptistemm, how does it crash?
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm: is bug 520603 the one?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 520603 in empathy "Empathy crashed after trying to send a file to a contact from nautilus" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/520603
<chrisccoulson> cassidy: ^^
 * chrisccoulson wishes it was lunchtime already
<cassidy> chrisccoulson, this one should have been fixed this week-end
<cassidy> chrisccoulson, you can close it as a dup of https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=609843
<ubottu> Gnome bug 609843 in Chat "Crashed when I closed one tab and hence switched to another tab for a disconnected account" [Major,Resolved: fixed]
<chrisccoulson> cassidy - thanks
<didrocks> pitti: can I get some feedback on that before implementing it: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Lucid/DesktopUNESession#gnome-panel ?
<didrocks> seb128: same punition (as you were disconnected). When you have some time, can I get some feedback on that before implementing it: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Lucid/DesktopUNESession#gnome-panel please?
<seb128> same punition than who, where?
<didrocks> punishment even :)
<didrocks> seb128: I asked pitti the same thing
<didrocks> :)
<seb128> looking
<didrocks> thanks
<seb128> I like none of those
<seb128> did you ask vuntz for his opinion?
<baptistemm> chrisccoulson, yeah thank, I've already create one bug upstream, I'll close it
<didrocks> vuntz told me to do the #3 when we discussed that, but I'm afraid it can break a lot of things (but I didn't show him this)
<didrocks> vuntz: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Lucid/DesktopUNESession#gnome-panel, any idea on how to fix this?
<didrocks> vuntz: because even, if we got fixed by #3, the user won't be able to add a new panel still as it would be mandatory and not depends on session (or if we make it default, if the user is adding/changing anything, he will get the same panels in UNE as well)
<pitti> didrocks: will look after lunch
<didrocks> pitti: thanks, enjoy :)
<baptistemm> asac, I sent a mail to linux-bluetooth mailing list about the API break, Waiting for an answer now
<asac> thx
<baptistemm> I don't know would what be the better fix, bump soname or restore API
<baptistemm> I don't know what use the api which was removed
<asac> restore API i would hope
<asac> just wait for upstream ,)
<asac> their call imo
<baptistemm> fedora pushed the package anyway
<asac> they dont have symbol tracking, do they?
<asac> they probably didnt notice
<baptistemm> I wonder
<baptistemm> hey Bastien told me he didn't noticed
<asac> right
<asac> thats what i suspected :-Ã
<asac> :-P
<baptistemm> or rather he didn't told me he noticed :)
<didrocks> pitti: after having a look of g-s-d code about triggering the wallpaper recache on update for the WI "write a small helper program to refresh bg and trigger caching, and add it to gnome-desktop postinst", I noted that it's watching the wallpaper file. If you change it, you trigger g-s-d to redraw to background, and so, get the new wallpaper cached.
<didrocks> pitti: consequently, I wonder if it's useful for people not having the background in a package. Do we still want to cache their wallpaper on update, or just wait for next reboot to do it for us?
<seb128> didrocks, next reboot is fine
<seb128> didrocks, the profiling etc will only update on first boot after upgrade
<seb128> didrocks, I was away for lunch looking at your une question again, but I think we should do what vuntz suggests
<seb128> didrocks, the spec is not really clear about what you aim to fix though
<didrocks> seb128: the issue is even if we fix that, we prevent people from adding another panel (as toplevel_id_list will be mandatory), right?
<pitti> didrocks: hi
<chrisccoulson> good afternoon everyone
<pitti> didrocks: yes, I think we want to cache it either way
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good afternoon to you too
<pitti> didrocks: but touching it during dist-upgrade doesn't work, since at that time the old g-s-d is still running
<didrocks> good afternoon chrisccoulson
<didrocks> pitti: oh right, forgot about that
<seb128> didrocks, it doesn't make clean either what was the drawbacks from the IRC discussion nor the bug reports
<pitti> didrocks: and doing it on first boot will just miss the chance of being covered by ureadahead
<pitti> didrocks: (same problem why we need an ubiquity hook)
<didrocks> seb128: "not editing the panel?"
<didrocks> seb128: I can point the IRC discussion though
<seb128> didrocks, is that something you want?
<didrocks> let me find it
<seb128> being able to edit the panel or not
<seb128> didrocks, I'm not really interested to read IRC backlogs if you could summarize the concern rather...
<didrocks> seb128: just that we already have bug report about that and bad feedbacks before alpha3 about preventing that
<didrocks> seb128: in a nutshell, the feedback was "UNE sucks if I can't edit the panel"
<didrocks> and other constructive terms like that :)
<seb128> you can't edit the panel at all with mandatory keys?
<didrocks> (took one hour of discussion on a Saturday, not always pleasant)
<didrocks> seb128: right, you can't
<seb128> or just not move the mandatory components?
<didrocks> you can't add/remove/move
<didrocks> (and can't add any other panel too)
<didrocks> pitti: ok, so, make sense for the caching thing. Not as easy as I guessed at first glance
<seb128> didrocks, do you have a statement of what the une session is meant to be?
<seb128> I'm being confuse about the purpose
<seb128> is that something to make easy to try une
<seb128> is that something which should allow full experience on both sessions
<seb128> or rather something to have a feel of what une is?
<didrocks> seb128: that's what I mostly answered on the bug reports "if you want to edit panels, use GNOME session now available"
<seb128> ie should config changes goes over to gnome session and back
<seb128> you might want to provide a script to turn the GNOME session in une
<didrocks> seb128: hence my first sentence. Do we want to state "the default panel is the UNE experience and we don't want user to change it"
<seb128> so users who want to use une can run that and will get the gnome-panel configured etc
<seb128> and keep using their normal session
<seb128> which will be an une one
<seb128> the script would set gnome-panel user config to une layout
<seb128> and change some autostart .config desktop files etc
<seb128> and say that the une session is a locked une demo
<seb128> those who really want to use une daily can turn their default session to an une ...
<didrocks> seb128: hum, difficult as UNE as dedicated applets (home-swichter, window-picker-applets) that you don't want in your normal GNOME session. Also, how determine that the user just wants one panel, and so onâ¦
<seb128> ?
<seb128> there is no GNOME session in what I suggest
<seb128> the script would configure your GNOME as an UNE session
<seb128> you wouldn't have a GNOME session
<seb128> that's for those who want to use UNE and not GNOME stock
<didrocks> oh ok
<seb128> you would have the UNE locked session for testing
<didrocks> some kind of "revert to previous state", only having one session
<seb128> and the option to run this convert script
<seb128> to make your GNOME session match UNE
<seb128> in which you would have no mandatory etc
<didrocks> the issue is that we would write/cp some files outside of any packaging management
<seb128> well that's user config
<seb128> it's not an issue to provide configuration tools
<seb128> I see 2 options
<didrocks> I'm thinking about the gconf keys in /usr/share/gconf/
<seb128> either do what I just described
<seb128> or do 2 independant sessions using option3
<seb128> in which case they would be really independant
<seb128> ie not share clock locations etc
<seb128> that would be by design
<seb128> since they are independant
<didrocks> hum, right, but that can be quite short to achieve before FF (as I guess they asked that from gconf and there is no "other user session" gconf). You lost all your apps config and such
<didrocks> as it's asking gconf for the right value
<seb128> what is "that"?
<seb128> in "they asked that"
<didrocks> seb128: configuring the panel
<seb128> didrocks, I'm not sure I follow you there
<seb128> I would say check with rick and,or pitti what you want the experience to be first, then decide on what to do...
<seb128> ie do you want the session to be locked or not
<seb128> do you want it to be a demo or something users can run daily and customize
<seb128> should the config changes go to the GNOME session too or not, and the other way around too
<didrocks> seb128: that's why I wrote this on the spec, to share with you, pitti (and rick when he will be there)
<seb128> I don't feel I know enough about the goal of this work to have an opinion
<seb128> I can give technical opinion on how to achieve one of the goals
<seb128> but I've not clue about what the purpose of this session should be
<didrocks> seb128: the thing is that the session is not only a "UNE demo", it's UNE (there is no difference with UNE stock install)
<pitti> seb128: the fourth solution would seem to be the best experience-wise, but if as you say that's hard to implement, nevermind
<pitti> sorry, didrocks ^
<pitti> please don't set up a parallel gconf tree or something like that
<seb128> didrocks, UNE stock install use mandatory settigns too?
<seb128> pitti, why not?
<seb128> pitti, it would not be a dup gconf config but just gnome-panel and gnome-panel-une
<seb128> pitti, ie namespace some keys and patch gnome-panel to read the namespaced version
<pitti> seb128: right, a new gconf dir /apps/gnome-panel-une/ is fine for me
<pitti> but not a ~/.gconf-une/
<didrocks> pitti: the 4th solution will only force to have one panel and what applets you have in your session (as the mandatory key are still needed for /apps/panel/general/{applet_id_list,object_id_list,toplevel_id_list}
<pitti> seb128: I agree
<pitti> didrocks: fundamentally I'd consider the UNE panel and GNOME panel as two separate entities wrt. experience and configuration
<didrocks> pitti: this is the second solution in fact (something like /apps/gnome-panel-session), more generic
<pitti> and not try to "merge" their configuration space
<didrocks> if it's ok for you and seb128, I can do that (instead on working on keys, just /apps/panel-{session}
<pitti> didrocks: /apps/panel/general/toplevel_id_list/toplevel_id-une is a bit too interleaved for my taste, but I could live with it
<didrocks> pitti: right, I like more your idea, more generic :)
<pitti> I'd actually prefer /apps/panel-${session}/general/...
<didrocks> seb128: ? ^
<seb128> I'm not really sure
<seb128> I think the namespace one is the best way to achieve what you want
<seb128> but that will only unsync the gnome-panel config changes
<seb128> not sure if others should be considered
<seb128> I've the feeling this is turning to something not easy to get working and bug prone too
<seb128> which I would like to avoid for the lts
<seb128> my favorite option right now would be what I described before
<seb128> declared UNE a demo locked session
<seb128> and let people who want to use a customize UNE to turn their GNOME into one
<seb128> I think the UNE session is not worth destabilizing the default desktop for a lts
<didrocks> seb128: but there is no "demo" and the default UNE will be the same (there is no difference in installing ubuntu-desktop and then UNE or UNE and then ubuntu-desktop)
<didrocks> just to ensure you know that, it seems you think that's a seperate functionnality :)
<pitti> didrocks: I just don't understand how this is suddenly a new problem? previous UNE releases certainly didn't behave any different?
<seb128> didrocks, I don't see why you couldn't dump the gnome-panel une profile on UNE install
<didrocks> pitti: in fact, previous version were using the gnome session, so you weren't able to have both sessions
<seb128> didrocks, well right not you could have UNE without mandatory use by writting the correct gnome-panel profile
<didrocks> seb128: installing gnome session on une was also on the spec. If we copy that, we can't have the gnome session back
<pitti> didrocks: oh, it's because in normal ubuntu you can now install ubuntu-netbook to get the netbook-launcher session in gdm as well, and that would lock your main GNOME panel?
<seb128> not -> now
<didrocks> pitti: right, all the tree is copied on install
<didrocks> seb128: on karmic? this is because you can't run ubuntu-desktop as well
<seb128> didrocks, no, I'm not speaking about karmic
<seb128> but I think what I'm suggesting is to get on lucid what we had on karmic
<seb128> + current hack which give you a locked UNE session
<seb128> or mandatory gnome-panel UNE config
<seb128> or whatever you want to call it
<didrocks> seb128: the first solution remove a part of the spec "having UNE and install ubuntu-desktop session on it"
<didrocks> (if we do that by default on une installation)
<didrocks> but well, keeping it mandatory can be a good thing, it was really difficult to add new applets to previous UNR panel
<pitti> didrocks: how can you keep the UNE panel mandatory while still leaving the GNOME one alone?
<pitti> didrocks: we have some magic to include (or not) /usr/share/gconf/une.mandatory.path on a per-session basis?
<didrocks> pitti: you add to gconf a path depending on gdm session which is /var/lib/gconf/<session>.{mandatory,default}
<pitti> ah, I see
<pitti> didrocks: so, if locking the GNOME panel when ubuntu-netbook is installed isn't an issue, just lock it and say "that's the UNE panel, dammit"
<seb128> pitti, user gnome-panel is not locked right, it's only the UNE one which use mandatory settings
<seb128> and yeah, +1 from me to say that
<didrocks> pitti: that's what we have from the start
<didrocks> and how I imagined the thing
<seb128> + maybe provide a small wrapper which dump UNE config on your user
<seb128> to turn your GNOME session in une
<didrocks> well, I just had a lot of complaints, even in a alpha :)
<seb128> you always have people to complain
<didrocks> seb128: right, for those user, we can do that
<pitti> "wontfix" then
<didrocks> ok, and about sharing the same time applet? do we keep two seperate?
<seb128> whatever is easier
<seb128> I want to avoid hacks, especially those who could create bugs in the GNOME session
<didrocks> ok, I'll speak about that with rick just to confirm that's the way we go and if we say "this is the une panel", nothing to touch so :)
<seb128> good
<seb128> and tell users who really use UNE to turn their default session to an UNE one
<seb128> there they can edit they gnome-panel etc
<seb128> I mean if they complain about the lack of edit option
<didrocks> seb128: so, I still have to provide this script
<seb128> not especially
<seb128> you can reply for now that they can configure their GNOME to be similar to UNE
<didrocks> to turn their default session to an UNE one?
<didrocks> ok
<seb128> well it takes some 5 minutes
<seb128> move some applets around
<seb128> drop those you don't want
<seb128> change theme
<didrocks> and start netbook-launcher
<seb128> add some autostart to the session
<didrocks> right
<seb128> you can document that on a wikipage if you want
<seb128> or let users do that for you
<didrocks> should be easy to document, I will do that after alpha3
<didrocks> thanks for the feedbacks seb128 and pitti :)
<seb128> np
<pitti> didrocks: thanks to you
<seb128> oh nice, bug #594831 commited to git
<ubottu> Error: Launchpad bug 594831 could not be found
<seb128> gnome bug #594831
<ubottu> Gnome bug 594831 in plugins "Fn-F8 should disable/enable touch points" [Normal,Resolved: fixed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=594831
<seb128> tseliot, ^
<seb128> g-s-d has code to disable touchapd now + a gconf key
 * tseliot has a look
<tseliot> ah, nice
<seb128> tseliot, not sure if we still want a capplet UI for it or not
<seb128> but that should make it trivial to do
<tseliot> yes, if the code is already in place then the UI will require minimal effort
<tseliot> not that the whole task requires a lot of work anyway ;)
<seb128> right
<fagan> is the sound indicator in lucid not working for everyone?
<fagan> Its not changing the sound level
<davmor2> fagan: check it's using the right hardware
<fagan> davmor2: it seems to be
<seb128> fagan, there is a known bugs with some audiosink configs
<seb128> works for me and other people who tried there
<fagan> it worked before with the notification area indicator
<fagan> its ever since it moved to the new spec
<fagan> hmmmm
<seb128> well as said there is a known bug
<seb128> maybe your config in this case
<seb128> wait for the fix to be uploaded
<fagan> sure
<fagan> seb128: does using the mouse wheel work on the new sound indicator?
<chrisccoulson> fagan - in the menu, yes
<fagan> nice
<seb128> fagan, https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/indicator-sound/+bugs
<seb128> fagan, you might want to check launchpad before asking on IRC
<seb128> it takes around as much time and you can probably do that without getting help from other people there ;-)
<seb128> which would allow other people to be distracted less in their work too
<fagan> noted
<seb128> thanks
<chrisccoulson> is anyone else seeing random FS corruption in lucid?
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine mentioned it last week
<chrisccoulson> and i had issues several times over the weekend too
<james_w> ext4?
<fagan> I havent seen it
<chrisccoulson> james_w: yeah
<chrisccoulson> it just randomly messes up and remounts RO
<chrisccoulson> then i have to fsck from a live CD to recover it
<chrisccoulson> it did it twice yesterday
<fagan> chrisccoulson: did you pull out a usb device without safely removing it
<fagan> thats the only way I got that before
<chrisccoulson> fagan: this is my internal hard drive
<fagan> But pulling out my ipod currupted my hd a few times
<fagan> orphaned innodes
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure why that would happen, but it seems unrelated to my problem (i'm not connecting any external media)
<james_w> chrisccoulson: any kernel oopses or anything?
<chrisccoulson> james_w - not that i've noticed. i do have a few ext4 errors in dmesg, but they aren't saved to disk
<chrisccoulson> in fact, the errors i get are very similar to comment 5 in bug 438379
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 438379 in linux "ext4 journal error, remounted read-only after resume" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/438379
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm not but I didn't still use the 3 there
<desrt> good morning, all
<seb128> hey desrt
<seb128> desrt, thanks for the eog change
<desrt> yup.  no problems.
<desrt> i built a package in my PPA if you want to test it out
 * seb128 hugs desrt
<seb128> desrt, I tested it out locally
<desrt> applies almost cleanly against karmic.. just a one-liner configure.ac that fails
<desrt> cool
<desrt> we're not string frozen upstream yet, so it's possible we could have it this cycle if we push hard
<seb128> desrt, but thanks
<seb128> yeah
<desrt> seb128: ran into a bit of an issue when doing the patch...
<desrt> fspot doesn't actually.. uh.. have an editor
<seb128> right, it has in the library but not the view mode
<seb128> which was another work item
<seb128> kenvandine has that almost done apparently
<seb128> should land in lucid this week
<desrt> sweet.  good timing.
<seb128> wth
<seb128> laptop just suspendend on vt switch
<seb128> suspended
<desrt> gnome-p-m is a win :)
<chrisccoulson> it seems like we need someone to volunteer to fix g-p-m bugs ;)
<seb128> hum
<seb128> we need somebody new to join the team
<seb128> and taking on new challenges
<desrt> i vote hughsie :)
 * seb128 wonders who could that be
<chrisccoulson> heh, yeah, i wonder who that could be ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> would that be the same person to maintain compiz?
 * pitti eyes RAOF
<seb128> chrisccoulson, that was my though too!
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> pitti, oh, that's another option, I was thinking to somebody would work on some web browser too
<seb128> pitti, and would need to do something else for a change sometime ;-)
<pitti> seb128: yeah, I know; good idea!
<seb128> otherwise we can still play the newest employee card on didrocks
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> hu, what? /me runs :-)
<seb128> didrocks, you like gpm don't you? ;-)
 * didrocks thinks he should think widely before answering ;-)
<didrocks> I'm fighting with gdk_screen_get_default() and gdk_display_get_default() returning both NULLâ¦ weird
<seb128> brb
<desrt> didrocks: did you gtk_init?
<didrocks> desrt: I'm just adding it in fact :)
<desrt> i'm sure you'll find that fixes your problems :)
<didrocks> desrt: way way better indeed (I use gdk_init now as not gtk need) :) ok, I can remove my g_type_init too
<desrt> didrocks: what the heck are you doing?
<didrocks> desrt: triggering a redrawing of the wallpaper during update so that we can cache it (I added caching to new libgnome-destkop)
<mclasen> libgnome-desktop already had caching, no ?
 * mclasen wonders
<didrocks> mclasen: there is no cache on disk (once resize and transformation applied)
<mclasen> point me to the bug for it ?
<didrocks> mclasen: we saw that resizing the wallpaper with the right transformation had a noticeable CPU cost during startup
<didrocks> sure, one sec
<didrocks> mclasen: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=608419
<ubottu> Gnome bug 608419 in libgnome-desktop "Caching wallpaper resize to avoid some CPU cycle at startup" [Enhancement,Unconfirmed]
<didrocks> mclasen: I should refresh the patch with last changes, not had the time yet
<desrt> didrocks: fascinating
<desrt> mclasen: odd to see you here :)
<mclasen> desrt: why ?
<desrt> well, i suppose i'm not on the ubuntu desktop team either...
<desrt> so maybe not that odd :)
<mclasen> well, this is the open side of ubuntu development, so I may as well lurk...
<didrocks> do you really think the 105 people around are in the ubuntu desktop team? ;)
<desrt> no.  but i expect that they run ubuntu, at least :)
<didrocks> right, that should be the case for most of them :)
<didrocks> mclasen: if you are interested, I have refreshed the patch with the last changes. attached to the bug
<djsiegel1> seb128: hey
<seb128> djsiegel1, hello
<djsiegel1> seb128: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/392589 <-- why do you say "this is an upstream issue"?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 392589 in hundredpapercuts "Default setting for remembering password should be remember until logout" [Low,Triaged]
<djsiegel1> Why can't it be an Ubuntu issue?
<djsiegel1> We shouldn't have to get upstream to agree to defaults/settings, should we?
<seb128> djsiegel1, "Why can't it be an Ubuntu issue?", because we don't have a distro change to change the behaviour
<djsiegel1> Why not?
<seb128> because we don't?
<djsiegel1> I think we shouldn't say "this is an upstream issue" for changes to settings
<seb128> I'm not sure to understand your question
<seb128> why shouldn't we include upstream in such discussions?
<seb128> ie why shouldn't we try to tell them what we think that is better and why
<djsiegel1> They can be included, but we shouldn't rely on them at all.
<seb128> we don't
<djsiegel1> I mean, we should try to convince them and all.
<djsiegel1> Ok, I was just unsure of what "this is an upstream issue" meant
<seb128> it means 'it's not ubuntu specific'
<seb128> or "it's not coming from an ubuntu change"
<djsiegel1> hmm, I guess I don't understand that
<djsiegel1> I just think if, for example, we want to change a setting for something in Ubuntu, say, Nautilus
<seb128> it means the default is set by people writting the code in their source
<seb128> not in the ubuntu package
<seb128> it doesn't mean we can't overwrite or distro change it
<djsiegel1> ok, I think people think it means that
<seb128> but when we think what upstream does in its code is wrong we ask people to start a conversation there
<djsiegel1> that we are passing the buck
<djsiegel1> we should (1) Fix it in ubuntu, and (2) tell upstream what we changed, why, and give them our change
<seb128> no
<djsiegel1> why not?
<seb128> we should make sure somebody open the dialog upstream first
<seb128> and do it in ubuntu when that is done
<djsiegel1> So, here's an example
<djsiegel1> say Nautilus defaults to List view in browser windows
<seb128> because otherwise people don't care once it's uploaded and nobody do the effort to discuss upstream
<djsiegel1> and we want to default to icon view
<djsiegel1> Why don't we just switch to icon view, and tell Nautilus that we think icon view is a better default for users?
<seb128> because if I do the change nobody will bother thinking about sending that upstream
<djsiegel1> Saying "it's an upstream" seems counterproductive when upstream simply wants a different configuration than we do
<seb128> they might or not
<djsiegel1> I just like the way we did the compiz settings paper cuts
<seb128> I'm asking for somebody to open that discussion before we upload
<djsiegel1> ok
<seb128> I don't think it's too much to ask
<seb128> otherwise we get lot of drawback to not send our work upstream
<djsiegel1> Can you make it clear that we are opening a conversation with upstream /in addition to/ the ubuntu conversation?
<seb128> or to not discuss with them of changes which make sense
<seb128> I'm using a stock bug triage reply
<seb128> you are welcome to improve those
<djsiegel1> When I read "it's an upstream issue" I feel like it says "it's an upstream issue and therefore not an ubuntu issue"
<seb128> or talk to the qa team about improve those
<djsiegel1> ok
<djsiegel1> I will, who should I ping?
<seb128> try bdmurray I would say
<djsiegel1> ok, thanks
<seb128> djsiegel1, the reply is intended as "the issue is not ubuntu specific and somebody should let upstream know too"
<seb128> it doesn't mean we block on upstream to do the work
<seb128> but it means somebody needs to get the issue raised there
<seb128> often it's also because we don't have the manpower to work on those bugs
<djsiegel1> ok
<seb128> and rather than letting them stay in our bug tracker we can raise the issue to the software writters
<seb128> so at least they know about it
<seb128> and the issue get a better chance to have somebody looking at it
<sabdfl> is bluez covered here, or in -devel?
<geser> did recently the placement of full-screen applications on dual-screen setups changed in metacity? as I see the application start full-screen start on my "main" screen (where the cursor currently is) but then jump to the other screen (happens only for apps started in full-screen)
<baptistemm> sabdfl, What would be the question about bluez?
<sabdfl> baptistemm: wanted to know why we're on 4.60 not 4.61 which was recently released
<baptistemm> sabdfl, api break on 4.61
<sabdfl> nice
<baptistemm> I sent a mail to linux-bluetooth but get no reply
<baptistemm> sabdfl, he took me one month to have 4.60 sponsored, don't count to have 4.61 before one month :)
<sabdfl> baptistemm: have you done a lot of uploads for those packages? if so, why not apply for per-package upload perms?
<baptistemm> sabdfl, no no I'm helping of few package not that much
<baptistemm> +s
<sabdfl> baptistemm: if you mostly do work on a few specific packages, and you are good with those, then you can get permission to upload those packages directly
<baptistemm> usually I do the upload when it's easy, for harder I let superm do them
<baptistemm> sabdfl, you're interested to have the latest bluez for a particular feature?
<sabdfl> no, just bug fixes, i happened to browse the site and notice the difference with the new packages that arrived yesterday and today (thanks for those :-))
<baptistemm> the latest one seems to had a lot of testing, so I'm interested to have it too
<chrisccoulson> still no response about bumping the soname?
<baptistemm> no :-/
<baptistemm> I would prefer to have the API restore, less much work
<chrisccoulson> it wouldn't be nice to maintain that though
<baptistemm> it would require to have all applications rebuilt with new bluez, even if they don't use the API which was dropped
<baptistemm> ?
<james_w> yes
<didrocks> pitti: seb128: in which package do you think it makes sense to have the "refresh the cache" trigger? libgnome-desktop-2-17 itself are add a new bin package?
<seb128> didrocks, do you need a trigger for that?
<didrocks> seb128: if you want to have it before rebooting on update right
<seb128> didrocks, why does it need to be a trigger? trigger would monitor any image in the dir not only the default one
<didrocks> seb128: sorry, wrong term, I mean "to trigger" -> "to force caching"
<didrocks> (it's just a simple executable, and I wonder in which package to put it)
<seb128> didrocks, can you do a summary of the changes?
<seb128> I've not followed enough that part and I'm confused now
<seb128> libgnome-desktop does cache the image by user
<seb128> then...?
<james_w> didrocks: executable in lib package == bad idea. lib packages should be co-installable and putting a binary in there defeats that unless it has the soname in the binary name
<didrocks> right, and then, to force caching when people will do there dist-upgrade from karmic to lucid, so that we have the cached wallpaper taken into account in first ureadahead, run a script in a postinst that force the cachin go the wallpaper
<didrocks> james_w: ok, and so, just an new bin package for an executable in that case
<seb128> didrocks, how do you force the cache?
<didrocks> seb128: calling draw_image_bg () from the libgnome-desktop lib
<seb128> on what image?
<mvo> didrocks: think of ... *multi-arch* ;)
<seb128> is that a by user thing?
 * mvo heard rumors that its just around the corner
<didrocks> seb128: no, only the current user, but it's just for ureadahead which is already the current one
<didrocks> mvo: hum?
<seb128> didrocks, I don't get how that works
<seb128> didrocks, how the postinst known what user refresh?
<seb128> and where will the cached image be written?
<mvo> didrocks: re lib packages and binaries in them
<didrocks> mvo: oh ok :)
<mvo> executables I mean
<mvo> multi-arch multi-arch multi-arch
<seb128> mvo, another pet project of yours? ;-)
<mvo> weekend fun
<didrocks> seb128: don't get that tried yet, but I was thinking of relying on $USER or other stuff like that
<mvo> just kidding, but I got a great guy who is really working on it now
<mvo> so it may become reality
<seb128> didrocks, that starts to seem hackish again
<seb128> mvo, you? ;-)
<mvo> my split personality ;)
<didrocks> seb128: see the mail you received the 02/09
<didrocks> (martin, rick and I)
<seb128> didrocks, I deleted part of my inbox by error
<seb128> I don't have this one
<didrocks> oh, that's why you didn't follow it :)
<seb128> no, it's rather than I'm crazy busy
<seb128> and you tend to ping a lot recently so I've difficulties to follow on everything ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: I try to only ping you just to agree on technical stuff before doing things you don't like :-)
<seb128> lol
<pitti_> didrocks: refresh the cache package> hm, putting the script into libgnome-desktop-2-17 would cause problems on a soname bump; gnome-settings-daemon would work for me
<pitti_> sorry, got disconnected (server down)
<pitti_> didrocks: oh, I don't think we need a trigger; just do it on "configure"
<didrocks> pitti_: no pb, I still have to get the current running user too in postinst
<pitti_> didrocks: iterate over pidof gnome-settings-daemon
<didrocks> pitti_: yeah, I used "to trigger" instead of "to execute"
<seb128> pitti_, would work only for connected users then
<pitti_> *shrug* "good enough"?
<pitti_> I wouldn't try to extend it too much; /home might be on a remote drive, etc.
<pitti_> if a user has a local running session, we can reasonably assume that his home dir is working and in use
<pitti_> but others might have encrypted home, mount-on-pam, and what not
<pitti_> you open a can of worms with that MIHO
<pitti_> IMHO, even
<seb128> I wouldn't bother at all about first reboot but *shrug*
<seb128> and we should really get some update-manager infrastructure for user config changes on upgrade
<pitti_> same problem: first reboot -> ureadahead -> you're going to miss the caching forever
<seb128> where "config" is not configuration file but tweaking we do a lot
<mvo> seb128: yes
<mvo> seb128: what is it this time?
<seb128> pitti_, "forever"? can't we trigger 2 profiling in a row?
<seb128> mvo, caching the user background on upgrade
<pitti_> seb128: not as user, in the caching code
<seb128> pitti_, do we profile user dir at all?
<pitti_> yes, we do
<pitti_> anythign which gets started in the first 45 s
<seb128> still thinking about it
<seb128> I really think such hooks should go to update-manager
<seb128> not random packages like gnome-settings-daemon
<pitti_> no objection
<rickspencer3> hi all
<rickspencer3> pitti_, seb128, didrocks, kenvandine, Riddell, ccheney, etc...
<pitti_> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> sorry to interrupt, but wanted to remind all ...
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> last week for blueprint work this week!
<rickspencer3> then it's:
<didrocks> hey rickspencer3
<seb128> wououh
<rickspencer3> 1. find and fix the worst bugs
<rickspencer3> 2. ensure a smooth upgrade experience
<rickspencer3> 3. integrate the latest and greatest
 * rickspencer3 starts chanting
<rickspencer3> :)
<rickspencer3> pitti_, what would you think about getting a list of bugs and running a burndown chart for them
<rickspencer3> (not to fill the capacity of the team, but just to make sure we are focused on some of the most widespread issues)
<rickspencer3> ?
<rickspencer3> just a thought
<pitti_> rickspencer3: can we link them on a "desktop-lucid-bug-fixing" blueprint? then it's easy
<pitti_> (and target that to final)
<rickspencer3> kewl
<rickspencer3> what about the whole notion of burning down bugs, like making a list and burning it down?
<rickspencer3> would it be useful to rally the troops, or just extra bookkeeping
<rickspencer3> ?
<pitti_> rickspencer3: to be honest, I think +assignedbugs and targetting them to lucid should do
<baptistemm> hello again
<pitti_> ooh, my server's back!
<pitti_> bbl
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> thanks pitti-
<rickspencer3> ttyt
 * rickspencer3 goes back to holiday
<mvo> seb128: agreed, not for lucid though :(
<didrocks> just to finish on the caching thing, so, do you want both the bin and the call in in update-manager, or just the executable in update-manger and the call in postinst of ubuntu-wallpapers for instance?
<baptistemm> didrocks, did you push your fix wallpaper?
<didrocks> baptistemm: pushed, but not sponsored yet, not had the time to ask
<baptistemm> ah you need sponsoring?
<didrocks> baptistemm: for gnome-desktop, yes
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - when are you going for core-dev?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: not that week as the schedule is already busy, so, first session in March
<chrisccoulson> cool:)
<chrisccoulson> just so i know when to start pinging you for sponsoring work for me ;)
<didrocks> heh
<seb128> didrocks, seems mvo says for next cycle, please ignore my comment and go with what pitti suggested
<pitti> seb128: nice, we'll get something like that?
<seb128> pitti, let's see, I want to discuss it at uds at least
<seb128> but time for sport for now
<seb128> that will be for later
<seb128> see you later everybody!
<didrocks> seb128: enjoy
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> bbl
<didrocks> pitti: so, I'm adding both things to g-s-d (the postinst call too)
<baptistemm> ah new gnome-bluetooth, I take it
<asac> pitti: remember that tbird locales had a depends: thunderbird | language-support-translations-de ... language-support is gone, does it mean we dont do alternative depends at all? (e.g. because its now recommended by language-pack-* ?)
<asac> hmmm ... seems its not referred to by language-pack*
<pitti> asac: yes, the alternative deps are not necessary any more
<pitti> it's now installed by language-selector
<asac> ok thanks for the confirm
<asac> ah cool. so it explicitly installs them
<asac> nice
<pitti> good night everyone
<mvo> didrocks: weehh, sorry, I just wanted to say "no generic framework this cycle"
<asac> bratsche: animated pixbuf gtkcellrenderer is evil? is there an easy way/code snippet?
<mvo> didrocks: if there is a propersal that fits into u-m can we can do that
<mvo> asac: software-center has one
<mvo> asac: AnimatedImage in softwarecenter/view/widgets IIRC
<asac> so custom?
<mvo> yes
<mvo> what do you need it for (just curious)
<asac> how do you trigger invalidation of the right pieces?
<asac> mvo: for a cool tree view ;)
<mvo> what does the cool treeview do?
<asac> err for an iconurl image that loads ;)
<asac> from the web
<mvo> asac: it does a qeue_draw_area in a gtimeout
<mvo> asac: check s-c, it has a full widget for this (CellRendererAnimateImage
<asac> yeah ;)
<asac> i will check that
<mvo> ok
<asac> find | grep Animat
<bratsche> asac: I don't know, I've never tried that.  I can try to find time to test it out later if you need.
<asac> nuothing ;)
<asac> bratsche: no its fine. i just wondered if i could put a value in there and the list store would recognize a notify or something and then emit row-changed or something ... but i will check what mvo did ;)
<bratsche> Cool.
<asac> mvo: there is no Animated
<asac> in the full tree
<asac> ;)
<asac> oh its lowercase
<asac> nevermind
<bratsche> I really would like to look into improving animation support in gtk+ during the next couple cycles though.
<bratsche> I have some ideas, and I think owen has some as well so I should talk to him about it more.
<asac> mvo: ok so you redraw all rows
<asac> i would have hoped the store would just trigger the right row somehow
<asac> is it true that row-changed is the best we have? rather than just "cell changed"?
<mclasen> there's no cells in models...
<asac> now that i think about it i see that ;)
<mvo> asac: it should just redraw the area
<bratsche> Hi mclasen, how's it going?
 * asac looks in treestore code
<asac> mvo: http://paste.ubuntu.com/377049/ you do that
<mclasen> bratsche: could be better
<mvo> asac: if you need something that updates, check the software-center/view/app.py stuff
<mvo> asac: right, it redraws the cell area with the animated image - is that not what you want?
<bratsche> mclasen: Bummer. :(
<mvo> asac: I need to do some $stuff, if you need anything beside the examples, please talk to me tomorrow (sorry)
<asac> mvo: all fine i think
<asac> mvo: i need something slightly different imo ... but i have to think a bit about it ;) enjoy!
<didrocks> mvo: what do you think? it's just a bin that should be run in a postinst. If you don't want to add overengeneering and we should execute it in a postinst, I'm fine with that.
<baptistemm> dpkg-gensymbols list public symbols only ?
<baptistemm> someone can help me for http://launchpadlibrarian.net/39239732/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-amd64.gnome-bluetooth_2.29.91-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz, bling_spinner_get_type disappeared but the maintainer told me it was not a public symbols ...
<baptistemm> so I bump anyway soname?
<chrisccoulson> milanbv - you release too frequently :P
<chrisccoulson> i only just uploaded 2.29.90 ;)
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm, dpkg-gensymbols will generate a list of symbols exported by the shared libraries
<chrisccoulson> your build log has gone already?
<seb128> pochu, hi
<seb128> pochu, do you think you could upload gir-repository without webkit binary to debian?
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm, it seems like bling_spinner_get_type was only exported by accident, and isn't part of the public API
<seb128> pochu, right now the binaries between it and webkit conflict, not sure how that works in debian but that breaks binary uploads in ubuntu
<chrisccoulson> that's not in any public header anywhere
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, better
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I had a not so great day, lot of emails, IRC pings, etc, I didn't manage to get things I want to do done
<seb128> but just back from sport, the break was welcome ;-)
<seb128> I will get dinner and a shower now and then try to catch up with some of the things I didn't do
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i've not got very much done today ;)
<seb128> while still going to bed not too late
<chrisccoulson> you've not had dinner yet?
<seb128> no, I just came back from sport
<seb128> I don't eat before because sport on a full stomach doesn't work for me
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i can imagine it would be difficult eating before ;)
<seb128> just some fruits or cake or something small usually
<seb128> hum
<seb128> bug #522291
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 522291 in gtk+2.0 "package libgtk2.0-common 2.19.5-1ubuntu2 failed to install/upgrade: error writing to '<standard output>': No such file or directory" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/522291
<seb128> weird bug
 * seb128 dups and reassign to update-manager
<mvo> *pfff*
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<seb128> mvo, sorry I didn't know you were still there ;-)
<seb128> "error writing to '<standard output>': Success"
<seb128> mvo, ^ I like that error :-p
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> that's a good error
<seb128> mvo, I reassign to update-manager because the user says the gui closed during upgrade btw, not because of the package installation issue
<seb128> which are probably "not a bug", just side effect of the gui closing
<milanbv> chrisccoulson: yeah, I know ;-)
<didrocks> well, let's go to bed. Have a good evening everyone o/
<chrisccoulson> 'night didrocks
<didrocks> thanks chrisccoulson, you too
<milanbv> since I'm going to be way for 3 weeks, I had to release 2.29.90 now
<chrisccoulson> milanbv - i'll update it in a few days ;)
<milanbv> but it leaves you 3 weeks before 2.29.92 :-p
<pochu> seb128: I think so, let me see
<milanbv> I didn't think you would package 2.29.3 just today
<milanbv> I should have told you
<seb128> 'night didrocks
<seb128> pochu, thanks
<milanbv> s/2.29.3/2.29.90/ && s/2.29.90/2.29.91/ <- I have to go to sleep
<milanbv> (I can't keep up either)
<chrisccoulson> bah, i can't install anjuta on my machine
<chrisccoulson> oh, thats because it FTBFS on amd64
<pochu> seb128: uploading ;)
<bratsche> Anyone here very familiar with the Nautilus codebase by any chance?
<pochu> bratsche: dunno, but there's #nautilus on gimpnet
<seiflotfy> seb128, is rickspencer around?
<seb128> seiflotfy, today is a national holiday in for him so he's not there
<seiflotfy> seb128, ok :)
<robert_ancell> seb128, which holiday is it?
<seb128> robert_ancell, don't ask me I've no clue ;-)
<robert_ancell> hey seiflotfy
<seiflotfy> hi robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> pitti, is there a udev tool you can run to see the udev events?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: udevmonitor I think it is.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, do you know what package that is in?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: sorry udevadm is the command with a monitor argument
<TheMuso> man udevadm
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-02-16
<nekohayo> ping jono?
<jono> nekohayo, hey
<nekohayo> hey there, I was curious about something regarding the pitivi MIR... I never really got an answer whether it was possible or not for pitivi to go past the 18th's feature freeze deadline or not
<nekohayo> (maybe I didn't ask the proper people or clearly enough)
<nekohayo> I'd just like to know if this is an option available
<nekohayo> or if it really really has to be done within the next 2 days
<nekohayo> so wondering if you have any idea regarding that
<dobey> isn't pitivi in main already?
<dobey> it appears it is
<nekohayo> dobey, yes, but it's an old version
<dobey> at least, apt thinks it is, and it was installed when i upgraded to lucid
<nekohayo> (that's the problem)
<nekohayo> many bugs are fixed in the dev version, and we'd like to at least have basic crossfade transitions in
 * dobey thinks it was a noble goal, but perhaps poor timing, to include pitivi by default
<nekohayo> perhaps
<nekohayo> if it can't be done it could be postponed to lucid+1, but if it can be squeezed with crossfade transitions, that could do it
<nekohayo> emdash is working on easy crossfading transitions, but I'm hesitant to say it would be completed in the next 48 hours
<nekohayo> maybe rickspencer3 would know :)
<rickspencer3> maybe
<rickspencer3> what's up?
 * rickspencer3 has no scrollback
<nekohayo> rickspencer3, http://pastebin.com/d133bc4c
 * rickspencer3 braces for rickroll
<nekohayo> :)
<rickspencer3> nekohayo, what do you mean about going past feature freeze?
<rickspencer3> we typically do lots of bug fixing and tweaking past feature freeze, but stop adding features
<nekohayo> a freeze exception
<nekohayo> hm
<rickspencer3> (but there are exceptions)
<rickspencer3> what are you wanting to do?
<rickspencer3> crossfades and transitions?
<nekohayo> we'll I'm just evaluating the options, 'cause 0.13.3 is old now, but 0.13.4 is not yet out the door
<rickspencer3> ah
<rickspencer3> these are indeed tough calls to make
<nekohayo> there are many users struggling with weird bugs that are absent from the git version
<rickspencer3> when is 13.4 currently scheduled to be ready?
<rickspencer3> we often update to a later version after freeze
<nekohayo> that's the thing, I'm not sure; https://bugzilla.gnome.org/buglist.cgi?product=pitivi&target_milestone=0.13.4
<nekohayo>  <-- could help seeing the bugs remaining
<rickspencer3> but if there are risky new features in the newest release, we sometimes dig up
<rickspencer3> patches from upstream to fix bugs in what we've got
<rickspencer3> so, I guess "it depends"
<nekohayo> well the git version is more stable/dependable than the 0.13.3 release, from my experience
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> well, we certainly can evaluate which is the right version to go with
<rickspencer3> if there is a high probability that 13.4 will be ready well before we release Lucid, it may be a good idea
<rickspencer3> to just update to it now
 * rickspencer3 adds to list of topics for desktop team meeting tomorrow
<nekohayo> limited to this feature set it would be possible IMHO (but no fancy poney-shaped wipe transitions)
<rickspencer3> yeah
<nekohayo> so yeah bring it up to the meeting and do tell me what happens
<rickspencer3> tbh, I'm more interested in the bug fixes, but some basic transitions would be good as well ;)
<nekohayo> methinks that https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=579230 could be implemented in time for lucid since emdash is currently working on it
<ubottu> Gnome bug 579230 in transitions "easy crossfading transition of overlapping clips" [Enhancement,Assigned]
<rickspencer3> ok
<nekohayo> and it's the absolute priority feature for the next release (I "settled" for it :)
<nekohayo> just not user that it would be done in 2 days
<dobey> Hrmm. the 'anonymous' access to the LP API is annoyingly annoying
<nekohayo> s/user/sure/
<rickspencer3> nekohayo, what's you gut tell you about readiness for Lucid?
<rickspencer3> (regarding pitivi of course ;) )
<dobey> hrmm
<nekohayo> what date must it be ready for, before april first I assume huh
 * rickspencer3 checks release schedule\
<nekohayo> my understanding of the situation is that once we get those easy crossfades implemented, and maybe that I kick the devs' butts so that they merged 2-3 patches on those bug reports, the release could be done
<dobey> rickspencer3: my gut feeling is that something like pitivi is a pretty big change to be bringing into an LTS, without it having been part of the default install prior to LTS. but maybe the code in git is stable-ish now.
<rickspencer3> basically, all the features need to be in by next Tuesday, though officially this Thur is the cut off
<nekohayo> dobey, you're not entirely wrong on this, I'd say. On the other hand, I've been worrying a bit about the LTS Thing
<nekohayo> otoh, maybe the visibility will make pitivi contributors appear in droves :)
<rickspencer3> Then it's fixing bugs up until we ship
<dobey> 3 years is a long time to be supporting unstable software :)
<nekohayo> hm hm
<dobey> nekohayo: is there a PPA with the git pitivi in it?
<nekohayo> dobey, there is, since a few days
 * TheMuso can't believe rickspencer3 is in here on his day/evening off. :p
 * nekohayo searches for it
<rickspencer3> Lets make it stable if we can
<nekohayo> http://rowinggolfer.blogspot.com/2010/02/pitivi.html
<rickspencer3> it's a good product that users like
<dobey> TheMuso: freezes can be at rather inopportune times :)
<TheMuso> dobey: yeah I am aware of that, but a day off is a day off. :)
<rickspencer3> I'll be off in a few
<dobey> nekohayo: get kenvandine to use that version for a bit then. I *know* he was having issues with pitivi :)
<rickspencer3> I was just online wokring on some of my side projects
<rickspencer3> dobey, it wasn't pitivi that was the problem
<rickspencer3> his problem was that the gtk-recordmydesktop was not encoding files correctly
<dobey> rickspencer3: ah
<dobey> rickspencer3: ok. i didn't know if he got it resolved or not :)
<rickspencer3> he didn't, but the bug is not in pitivi
<dobey> well, garbage files are garbage files. probably can't really fix the files i guess. but good to know where the problem is
<dobey> TheMuso: eh, I worked today too. trying to get all the ubuntu one client stuff 'done' for feature freeze
<nekohayo> kenvandine, get your crack right there.
<nekohayo> https://launchpad.net/~rowinggolfer/+archive/pitivi-unstable
<nekohayo> depends on the gstreamer-developers PPA
<nekohayo> aah, that good old recordmydesktop
<nekohayo> I'll feel the pain again when I'll have to make a pitivi 0.13.4 screencast.
<rickspencer3> nekohayo, just fyi, we are scheduled to make the pitivi go/no go descion for beta 2, I think
<rickspencer3> oops, beta 1, I mean
<TheMuso> dobey: fair enough
<nekohayo> dobey, /me has more hopes in gnome-shell becoming the new decent screencasting tool than recormydesktop ever being fixed :|
<dobey> Eh. I wish I could get interest and help on my project. I don't really have time to work on it though.
<nekohayo> recordmydesktop is yours?
<dobey> no
<dobey> deskscribe is
 * nekohayo searches
<dobey> it doesn't do video recording yet, but i want it to
<dobey> launchpad.net/deskscribe :)
<nekohayo> oh I see
<Amaranth> I've been tempted to resurrect the compiz video recording plugin just to get good screencasts
<Amaranth> seems using recordmydesktop with compiz requires something better than 2Ghz C2D and intel X3100 graphics
 * nekohayo just found out https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=525155 
<nekohayo> this may explain my recent troubles with r-m-d in karmic
<ubottu> bugzilla.redhat.com bug 525155 in recordmydesktop "Theora is broken in Rawhide" [Medium,Closed: errata]
<nekohayo> but it doesn't explain the "broken" theora frames (https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=2827013&group_id=172357&atid=861428)
<nekohayo> bleh
<ubottu> Error: Sourceforge bug 2827013 not found
<nekohayo> with istanbul and recordmydesktop being abandonned, my only hope is gnome shell
<pitti> Good morning
<baptistemm> hllo
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> hey pitti
<mvo> asac: did someone mention the GtkCellRendererSpinner to you yesterday btw?
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, good morning
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> I'm great, thanks! how about you?
 * pitti is packaging upower
<chrisccoulson> i'm quite tired this morning. my girlfriend is not very well, so i had quite a restless night
<chrisccoulson> are we migrating to upower this cycle?
<pitti> uh, I hope she'll get well soon
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, I'd like to (same as udisks)
<pitti> will make backporting patches much easier
<chrisccoulson> cool!
<pitti> or running backports
<chrisccoulson> i subscribed to the bugs in udisks already
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson pitti
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<pitti> and I already did some bug fixes in upstream trunk which the OEM team is waiting on :)
<chrisccoulson> HR have arranged a leaving interview here with me on friday morning
<chrisccoulson> right at the same time my breakfast arrives!
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson, seb128
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> chrisccoulson, way to finish a week!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hope your gf get better too btw
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
<seb128> hello didrocks, pitti
<baptistemm> hey chrisccoulson, I saw your message or yesterday this mornig, what so I do so? comment the missing symbols ?
<chrisccoulson> hey baptistemm - the missing symbol was never part of the public API, so it's not an issue that it is no longer exported in the new version
<baptistemm> so I just need to remove it from the .symbols file before the building and that's it
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm: yeah, that will work
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm: the removed symbol was never included in any public headers
<chrisccoulson> so i assume that they exported it by accident
<pitti> seb128: do you have a minute to source NEW upower? (it's just a package rename)
<seb128> pitti, sure
<pitti> seb128: merci!
<seb128> de rien!
<baptistemm> chrisccoulson, by accident means a bug in dpkg-gensymbols (osrry I have now knowledge about symbol export)
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm: the exported symbols is controlled by upstream
<chrisccoulson> i think they ship a symbols file to control that
<baptistemm> what does dpkg-gensymbols to knwo public symbols, does it scan *.h files?
<baptistemm> *scans*
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm: dpkg-gensymbols scans for symbols exported by a library (using nm, I think)
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm: http://people.redhat.com/drepper/dsohowto.pdf
<baptistemm> thanks
<chrisccoulson> that has a good section of how to control symbols exported by shared libraries
<chrisccoulson> section 2.2 "Export Control"
<seb128> pitti, do you need shlibs when you use .symbols?
<pitti> seb128: no, you don't
<seb128> pitti, ok, because upower has one in the rules?
<pitti> DEB_DH_MAKESHLIBS_ARGS_libdevkit-power-gobject1 = -- -v1:$(DEB_VERSION)
<pitti> you mean this?
<seb128> yes
<pitti> seb128: without that, dpkg-makeshlibs drops the epoch from debian/libdevkit-power-gobject1.symbols and complains about the file having totally changed
<pitti> it gets confused because it gets the package version from debian/changelog usually
<seb128> ah I see
<pitti> but debian/rules adds an epoch to the devkit-power-* stuff
<pitti> (which we need, because 0.9 < 011
<pitti> we can drop the libdevkit-power-gobject* bits at some point when everything got ported to libupower-glib
<seb128> pitti, ok makes sense, looks good, newed
<pitti> seb128: merci
<seb128> de rien
<seb128> what is working on nm-applet there?
<seb128> what -> who
<seb128> I got the lazy icon loading change done yesterday evening and waiting for upstream review
<seb128> I would appreciate review and sponsoring from somebody working on nm-applet if we want that in lucid for alpha3 now
<seb128> seems the packaging is using source in git and I'm not sure how to deal with it too
<seb128> asac, ^?
<pitti> Vcs-Bzr: https://code.launchpad.net/~network-manager/network-manager-applet/ubuntu.head
<pitti> oh, it's not that one?
<pitti> seb128: I'm happy to help out with git stuff, by now I got fairly familiar with it (*sigh*)
<seb128> pitti, let me look again
<seb128> I though that was in git I'm not sure why now
<seb128> pitti, ok, I think I got confused, I will work on the update now
<seb128> still a review from somebody else would be welcome once that is done ;-)
<pitti> o/
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<asac> seb128: our packaging doesnt use git
<asac> its the branch pitti pointed to
<seb128> asac, yeah I got confused apparently
<asac> seb128: get me the patch you want reviewed
<asac> seb128: already submitted upstream?
<seb128> asac, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=609134
<ubottu> Gnome bug 609134 in nm-applet "should do lazy loading for icons" [Normal,New]
<seb128> asac, the current change on this bug
<asac> startup time?
<seb128> asac, yes...
<seb128> lazy icon loading
<seb128> ie not loading 35 icons for animation when not needed
<seb128> + the vpn ones when not using a vpn
<seb128> etc
<kklimonda> btw - do you have any idea why are fields in debian/control called Vcs-Bzr: Vcs-Git: instead of (for example) Vcs-Ubuntu: Vcs-Debian?
<asac> seb128: ok. doesnt look bad on first glance. i assume you want that to be prepatched in our packaging?
<seb128> asac, I've no strong opinion, I'm fine waiting a few days for dan to comment upstream
<seb128> pitti, ^ how much do we want that one in for alpha3?
<asac> ok. if you say its ok to wait, i can poke him to give his review too
<asac> seb128: there are some indentation style changes
<asac> like here:
<asac> +nma_icon_check_and_load (const char *name, GdkPixbuf **icon, NMApplet *applet,
<asac> +gboolean fallback)
<seb128> right
<seb128> asac, do you want a lp bug for that?
<asac> not needed if you dont need it ;)
<seb128> ok good
<seb128> less work ;-)
<asac> tell me if you want that up today for a3
<pitti> seb128: I don't consider it a blocker for alpha-3, it doesn't have any functional change
<pitti> seb128: so if it's easier to get in after alpha-3, fine
<asac> k
<asac> i will let cyphermox commit this to our branch ... so it gets in daily
<seb128> asac, wait
<seb128> there is another change required
<seb128> I'm on it
<asac> seb128: ok. let me know.
<didrocks> note to myself: never work directly in quilt with bzr bd-doâ¦ to much chance to exit 0 before quilt refreshâ¦
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - oops ;)
<chrisccoulson> did you lose much work?
<seb128> asac, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/nm-applet.debdiff
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: yesterday's evening work on force refreshing cache
<seb128> asac, one distro patch needed to be updated for the change
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: but that's ok, 30 min to redo it when you know what to do :)
<seb128> asac, that one should be good to use
<seb128> asac, also can we get it to use automake1.10 instead of .9? ;-)
<pitti> didrocks: hang on
<pitti> didrocks: if you exit bd-do, it doesn't wipe anything
<pitti> didrocks: it's still in ../build-tree/gnome-desktop-<version>/
<pitti> just go back there and diff/hack/copy
<didrocks> pitti: yes, but this morning, I've redone a bzr-do
<didrocks> bd-do*
<pitti> or presumably quilt diff/quilt refresh
<pitti> ah, you lose then :(
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> it's ok, I've rewrite it now
<didrocks> I launched nm on the old bin to see I didn't forget anything
<pitti> didrocks: using the image_serialize bits?
<didrocks> pitti: to force the caching? no, I use some part of the libgnome-desktop API
<pitti> didrocks: no, to write the cache
<pitti> didrocks: right now you are storing a .jpg?
<didrocks> pitti: I didn't changed that yet
<pitti> ah, ok
<seb128> why does that need to be changed?
<didrocks> pitti: I'm storing in the same format than the original file, why?
<pitti> didrocks: mclasen suggested using this serializing API, which is even faster (avoids decoding the jpg, etc.)
<pitti> might be worth a try
<didrocks> pitti: right, I just want to finish my WI before alpha3, we can change that later, right?
<seb128> brb, trying gnome-keyring update
<pitti> didrocks: sure
<didrocks> pitti: I still have this 2D/3D thing that was added last week on netbook-launcher
<didrocks> pitti: so, finishing the command line, postinst is ready and then, go to the other task
<baptistemm> asac, bluez will have a fixed release about API breakage
<didrocks> ok, work lost againâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, how did you do that?
<didrocks> seb128: this time I really don't know. I quilt add Makefile.am to include the file in the build
<didrocks> refresh thenâ¦
<didrocks> quilt pop -a
<didrocks> exit 0
<didrocks> and then, I only see the Makefile.am in the patch, no more source file
 * didrocks get stressed
<pitti> didrocks: why would you expect anything else than Makefile.am if you didn't add anything else?
<didrocks> pitti: I added before the other file
<didrocks> pitti: refresh, exit 0, and so on
<didrocks> I obviously did something wrong, but can't find what now
<didrocks> so, I will rewrote for the third time the file, out of quilt + bzr, and then, copy to it
<pitti> didrocks: don't rewrite the file, it should still be in ../build-area/dir/
<pitti> DON'T do bzr bd-do now!
<didrocks> pitti: I saw that the file wasn't there when I did bzr bd which failed logically as no source file there
<didrocks> so, too late
<pitti> urgh
<didrocks> well, first time, 1h, second time 30m, third time 15min?
<pitti> perhaps copy the file to your home dir right before doing the patch building
<didrocks> pitti: I will work in my home dir this time :)
 * didrocks start timer
<pitti> I seldomly do patches in bzr bd-do and quilt these days
<pitti> but still, it shouldn't be that hard :)
<didrocks> I don't understand what was wrong this time. I know for yesterday's mistake and it's all my fault. But todayâ¦
<didrocks> well, let's go back to it
<asac> baptistemm: great. so when thats out we can update ;)
<asac> baptistemm: how happy were they about this incident?
<baptistemm> asac, Apparently holtman already fixed on saturday night that on git after I had a look there.
<baptistemm> but he didn't send an ack on IRC for that
<asac> yeah.
<baptistemm> so it didn't really care my mail :)
<baptistemm> s/it/he/
<baptistemm> asac, should I wait next really or push bluez with the fix
<asac> baptistemm: i dont see a reason to make an early push
<asac> bluez releases often enough
<baptistemm> hey, they wasn't any really for a month :)
<baptistemm> s/really/release/ doo
<asac> right. if they dont release in one or two weeks, lets request a release to unbreak api
<baptistemm> holtman said a release will be pushed soon
<kwwii> seb128: hey, I have an update for the humanity-icon-theme package (lp:~ubuntu-art-pkg/humanity/release) can you upload it when you get a chance?
<didrocks> ok, redone. /me triple backups it
<seb128> kwwii, ok
<didrocks> ah found it, I quilt add after adding the file the tree
<seb128> well that should make it ignore your change
<seb128> but not drop other changes
<seb128> like that doesn't explain the "editing makefile.am dropped source changes"
<didrocks> well, right, I don't know what I did wrong. This time, I have it, let's build the package. Too much thing for a tiny script a little postinst call :/
<seb128> kwwii, impressive list of bugs closed by this update mr wimer ;-)
<kwwii> seb128: hehe, thanks go to vish (I only made on of those icons!)
<kwwii> vish: ^ (well done!)
<seb128> vish, good work!
<seb128> kwwii, there is no upstream tarball right?
<seb128> kwwii, ie usually it's just built from bzr
<kwwii> seb128: yepp
<seb128> ok, good
<seb128> kwwii, ok, I'm uploading that, can you change the bzr to have "0.5.1" as version?
<seb128> kwwii, since you don't have a diff.gz you don't need an ubuntu revision
<seb128> kwwii, just delete the "-0ubuntu1" in the changelog
<kklimonda> it seems that bug 434316 is back (at least for me, not every time bug if I use system for a while it shows up eventually) - have it been reported already?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 434316 in empathy "Useless black bar in notification area visible" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/434316
<kklimonda> s/bug/but
<seb128> kklimonda, are you sure it's due to empathy?
<kklimonda> seb128, if I kill empathy line goes away
<seb128> ok, so I don't know
<seb128> djsiegel, so the hundredpapercut you pointed yesterday is not really one
<seb128> djsiegel, you don't usually need password storage since once a share is mounted it will stay mounted for the session
<seb128> djsiegel, and on the smb case it's done this way because sometime you need different credentials to have write access to some shares
<seb128> djsiegel, and if you were automatically using the default password you would break those usecases
<seb128> djsiegel, let me know if you disagree there or need extra details
<seb128> (that's from a discussion with upstream today)
<kwwii> seb128: yes, will do
<vish> kwwii: seb128: thanks :)
<didrocks> I need to know as well what display the user is on too (so that gdk_init succeed). /proc/{pid}/environ or is there a nicer way?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - consolekit?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: in a postinst script? is it easy to call?
<pitti> didrocks: eww
<chrisccoulson> hmmmm, i'm not too sure
<chrisccoulson> what are you trying to do?
<pitti> didrocks: aren't you looking for running gnome-settings-daemon processes anyway?
<pitti> didrocks: you could just fish it out of /proc/pid/env
<didrocks> pitti: right, hence my proposal. I was asking if there was a nicer way
<pitti> $ xargs -0n1 < /proc/$$/environ |grep ^DISPLAY
<pitti> DISPLAY=:0.0
<pitti> didrocks: not to my knowledge
<didrocks> ok, will use that so. Thanks :)
<pitti> gosh, how hackish; well, sabdfl always wins :)
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, was not that easyâ¦ a lot of time for tiny resultâ¦
 * hyperair wonders if it's okay to be running some graphical program from within a postinst
<hyperair> surely all kinds of strange things can happen during installation, like X crashing or something that will cause the postinst to fail spectacularly?
<didrocks> hyperair: it's not running a graphical soft, just need X for gdk getting things
<hyperair> didrocks: what if the upgrade was done without X running?
<didrocks> hyperair: g-s-d will not run so
<pitti> seb128: ah, with yesterday's update teh sound indicator started working \o/ so it wasn't due to a bad PPA
<hyperair> ah
<pitti> kenvandine: does the power indicator still have a chance to land this week? or should we postpone to beta-1?
<pitti> kenvandine: (I'm a bit nervous about that TBH; unlike gnome-volume-control-applet, gnome-power-manager is a huge piece of code to replace..)
<hyperair> eh? gnome-power-manager's getting replaced?
<seb128> pitti, there is a gpm port to the indicator system waiting in launchpad
<pitti> ah, it's a patch, not a rewrite
<seb128> it's gpm patch for now apparently yes
<pitti> tseliot, bryceh: given that the "Fix logic in patches 104 and 105 to correctly select -nvidia when appropriate" work item was postponed, would it be correct to postpone "Auto-config nvidia: Identify logic in jockey which inserts configuration into xorg.conf and create analogous logic in xserver" as well?
<pitti> ISTR that you didn't want to do that kind of magic in lucid?
<tseliot> pitti: yes, I think we should definitely postpone it. I don't think I will have the time to implement it any time soon
<tseliot> not in time for Lucid
<pitti> tseliot: ack, will do
<tseliot> ok
<pitti> tseliot: what about bug 258038?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 258038 in fglrx-installer "Look into feasibility of using an alternatives system rather than diversions" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/258038
<pitti> I haven't followed using the alternatives system for fglrx
<pitti> is that even necessary?
<pitti> i. e. does fglrx also divert libGL and the like?
<pitti> it seemed much less intrusive to me
<didrocks> pitti: g-s-d pushed, postinst and bin on it
<tseliot> pitti: that's fixed. I have already worked on that together with superm1, we pushed the changes to the upstream git. I will pull them when AMD releases an fglrx driver which works with Lucid's xserver
<didrocks> pitti: as gnome-desktop hasn't been sponsored yet with fixed quality cache. I will try to do the change about serializing now
<tseliot> pitti: currently the package is not installable and doesn't contain our changes.
<pitti> didrocks: \o/
<seb128> didrocks, do you need gnome-desktop sponsoring?
<didrocks> seb128: hum, there is one version waiting, but as I'll erase the changes and saving with serializing the pixbuf, this will go away, so no need now, thanks :)
<seb128> ok
<didrocks> just hackish g-s-d needs :)
<seb128> didrocks, oh please don't do that for g-s-d
<seb128> don't patch makefile.am with a new source
<seb128> you should rather put your .c in the debian dir
<seb128> and call gcc in the changelog to build it
<didrocks> oh really? I saw that for gdmsetup and other packages
<seb128> gdmsetup is code we try to get upstream
<pitti> didrocks: it's fine to do that in your upstream patch, of course
<seb128> your change has nothing to do with g-s-d code
<seb128> and it forces us to keep running autoreconf
<didrocks> there was already one autoreconf file, but yes, I put the .c in the debian dir, and call gcc in control
<seb128> (we need it for other changes right now but still we try to get away from those not to add new ones)
<didrocks> rules*
<didrocks> ok
<seb128> well my opinion
<seb128> didrocks, maybe do that for now and revisit after ff
<seb128> what you did work but will be extra work over time I feel
<seb128> we can clean that later though
<seb128> didrocks, "that" being what you commited now
<didrocks> ok, I'll prefer if we can change that after FF :)
<djsiegel1> seb128: I see
<pitti> tseliot: so is that blocked on getting a new upstream release which works with our X.org?
<tseliot> pitti: yep
<pitti> tseliot: thanks
<pitti> tseliot: but still planned for lucid?
<tseliot> see my PM
<seb128> didrocks, did you try how gdk_init behaves if you run your code on vt?
<didrocks> seb128: I didn't try without X running, but I tried with two connected users (so, one, not being the one connected to current gnome-terminal)
<seb128> didrocks, well not running X is not the issue, just run the binary on a real vt
<seb128> didrocks, not under an xorg session
<didrocks> seb128: the binary will fail, but the postinst should export the right DISPLAY before, let me check to reinstall it
<seb128> didrocks, does it?
<didrocks> seb128: right
<seb128> oh, ok
<didrocks> seb128: let me check install previous version to try an "upgrade" again on a vt to ensure it works
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - does your binary not cause an extra dbus-daemon and gconfd process to run?
<chrisccoulson> and do you need to clean those up afterwards?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: no, it's connect to current gconf
<didrocks> connected*
<seb128> didrocks, also calling sudo in the postinst might lead to pam password prompts
<chrisccoulson> didrocks: how does it do that? it needs the session bus address to do that
<seb128> we ran into lot of weird bugs when we did that for gdm gconftool calls
<seb128> we moved to ship the .xml rather
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it can get messy doing things like that from a postinst
<pitti> kenvandine: sound menu> "integrate with the backend components (PA): INPROGRESS" -> what's that about?
<didrocks> seb128: sudo was to get the user's environnement to get it runned. I don't know how to do in an other way
 * didrocks doesn't like that change
<didrocks> too much time
<didrocks> under fire by everybody
<seb128> didrocks, we failed for gdm
<seb128> didrocks, well I highly dislike the hack too, but it's not your fault you are just the messenger there...
<seb128> didrocks, well I highly dislike the hack too, but it's not your fault you are just the messenger there...
<seb128> ups
<seb128> didrocks, I'm just pointing that we fought with bugs about sudo use in postinst for gdm before karmic
<seb128> and did decide to roll back to not use sudo there
<seb128> it's a can of worms for issues
<didrocks> seb128: right, I agree that running sudo is not goodâ¦
<seb128> I'm trying to think to a better way
<didrocks> so, I need to connect to user's gconfd
<seb128> do you really need gconf there?
<seb128> that's to get the background image in use?
<didrocks> seb128: right
<didrocks> seb128: I didn't find any other way in the API
<seb128> dealing with gconf in a postinst is going to be an issue
<seb128> we really need a proper system to do such things
<didrocks> I agree
<seb128> and stop doing things likely to break in maintainer scripts
<seb128> ask mvo
<pitti> ok, this now sounds too messy to get working, I think
<seb128> we get so many things going wrong
<pitti> perhaps we can cowboy it into update-manager for lucid
<pitti> if we're going to have a better solution for manic monkey anyway
<pitti> update-manager at least has X, gconf, and all taht
<didrocks> pitti: it doesn't have X for other users, so it will still be hackish
<pitti> didrocks: nevermind other users
<seb128> mvo, ^ how easy would it be to run a small piece of C or python code in update-manager after install?
<Nafai> Good morning
<pitti> didrocks: the primary user is "good enough" here
<mvo> sorry, I did not follow the discussion
<seb128> mvo, just for the current user
<seb128> mvo, we are still try to get the background image cached after upgrade
<mvo> seb128: without asking? or with a prompt?
<seb128> mvo, it's basically calling gnome_bg_draw()
<pitti> mvo: noninteractive
<seb128> which will trigger the caching if new gnome-desktop is installed
<seb128> mvo, without asking
<mvo> ok, you want to run that on first login for every user, right?
<seb128> mvo, it's just a "trigger background caching by doing a libgnome-desktop call after install"
<pitti> mvo: no, problem is we need to run it after the upgrade, but before reboot
<seb128> mvo, no, it's too late, we want to do it before reboot
<seb128> mvo, otherwise we miss the profiling which happens on reboot
<mvo> ohh, but what about users that exist and are not logged in?
<seb128> Nafai, hey
<mvo> how would it work for them?
<pitti> I suppose it doesn't have to be C/Python, we could also call didrocks's small binary
<seb128> mvo, they lose
<seb128> mvo, we do profile for one user only anyway
<mvo> ok
<mvo> we can add it to u-m, its going to be a bit of a hack because the release-upgrade part runs as root - so we need to so something like sudo -u $SUDO_USER
<mvo> *ugly*
<pitti> mvo: the UI runs as root as well?
<mvo> yes
<pitti> so that doesn't have the user's d-bus connection, etc?
<vish> seb128: yeah , that icon was a place holder for someone to file a bug :)
 * vish currently working on a better icon
<vish> seb128: also , we have a ppa for humanity , wouldnt we need the "-0ubuntu1" ?
<seb128> vish, not really no
<seb128> vish, you can use 0.5.1+r<nn<
<vish> ah , cool
<seb128> <nn>
<seb128> vish, you can use 0.5.1+r<nn>
<seb128> I meant
<vish> k..
<seb128> if you build from commits
<seb128> chrisccoulson, btw do you know what is happening with the gpm libindicator change?
<pitti> tedg: good morning
<kenvandine> pitti, i'll talk to ronoc about it, but i imagine it is still open because it isn't working yet for a lot of people
<pitti> kenvandine: since yesterday's update the slider and mute seem to work
<kenvandine> pitti, not for me
<kenvandine> well, i haven't updated yet :)
<pitti> kenvandine: well, it's not working very well; it feels too much logarithmic
<pitti> but it does work
<kenvandine> progress :)
<pitti> kenvandine: so the "PA integration" means "volume slider/mute button"?
<seb128> pitti, right, ronoc found the issue some users were having which was a default audiosink selection one apparently
<kenvandine> i think so
<seb128> pitti, nice to get confirmation it's working ;-)
<tedg> Good morning pitti
<seb128> hey tedg
<huats> seb128, for the record I am updating deskbar-applet
<pitti> tedg: I wondered, was there a particular reason for indicator-session to talk to devicekit-power over d-bus directly?
<seb128> huats, ok thanks
<huats> (and I have noted that in the page)
<seb128> huats, how are you?
<tedg> Morning seb128
<huats> seb128, very very good :)
<pitti> tedg: I ported it to libupower-glib today (merge proposal sent), but I wondered why you didn't use libdevkit-power-gobject; to avoid the dependency?
<seb128> huats, good to hear ;-)
<huats> with a cute little by standing next to me :)
<tedg> pitti: Yes, it needs to find out whether we can suspend and/or hibernate
<huats> seb128, you ?
<pitti> tedg: right, for that reason I used the client side lib
<seb128> huats, quite good actually though a bit tired
<pitti> tedg: the server side can't check policykit privs (i. e. it might be disallowed only for some users)
<huats> seb128, yeah I can imagine that during the FF week
<tedg> pitti: There was an issue with this lib at some point, I don't remember what.  But it should probably be changed.
<kenvandine> good morning rickspencer3
<tedg> pitti: I think that it was mostly a port from using the GPM DBus interface, so it was easier to just change the interface rather than port to a lib.
<rickspencer3> good morning kenvandine
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<baptistemm> seb128, for https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bugs/456200 the user is user karmic, would you like to have a gnome-bluetooth update?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 456200 in gnome-bluetooth "bluetooth-sendto crashed with SIGSEGV in strcmp()" [Medium,Fix released]
<seb128> baptistemm, not a version upgrade no but feel free to backport the fix if you want
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<mvo> pitti: sorry, phonecall. no, no dbus connection. there is update-notifier, but that gets deactived during a upgrade
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<chrisccoulson> sorry, i was away from my desk there
<chrisccoulson> i thought kenvandine said he was reviewing the gpm appindicator change
<chrisccoulson> i can progress that though if it needs someone else to review it
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda: do you know when we're likely to see a 1.90 release of transmission?
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, i did last week
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson, charles was planning on releasing it this week
<kenvandine> gave him my feedback and hadn't see anything else
<vish> seb128: upstream has accepted the commit in Bug #513864 , [you had asked a question]
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 513864 in f-spot "Resizing to pixels should have a reasonable default value" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/513864
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson, but that depends on whenever he has managed to fix two bugs that result in some private trackers banning transmission
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson, also the only new feature is application-indicator so I think we should be safe in case 1.90 miss FeatureFreeze
<seb128> vish, I just pinged them on IRC
<vish> seb128: hasnt been committed yet , but accepted.. [rubens seems to have lost his SSH key]
<seb128> vish, so thanks but I know they are reviewing it ;-)
<vish> seb128: cool thanks :)
<seb128> vish, he hasn't lost his key he just doesn't have it on the computer he's using
<seb128> he might be at work or something
<vish> ah.. k..
<seb128> vish, thanks for following up though ;-)
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson, there is also some bug in libappindicator that have to be fixed for Transmission to display menu correctly.. but I can't find the bug number now
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda: oh, ok. thanks
<seb128> kklimonda, what does the bug do?
<chrisccoulson> i'm thinking about just uploading the appindicator change for transmission
<chrisccoulson> it would be nice to start getting user feedback
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson, charles is saying that he's probably going to roll a tarball today to get it into Fedora before freeze
<chrisccoulson> but if we get 1.90 this week, then there maybe isn't much point
<chrisccoulson> cool, i can wait for that then
<seb128> chrisccoulson, doit!
<chrisccoulson> heh, i can do that this evening :)
<kklimonda> seb128, it's easier to show than to explain - basically all menu entries use stock icons and stock names
<seb128> tedg, ^
<seb128> tedg, do you know if that's fixed or scheduled for this week?
<chrisccoulson> is that a known issue then?
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson, I believe qense has reported it
<qense> yes
<qense> The fix for that bug should be in 0.0.14.
<chrisccoulson> awesome, thanks :)
<jcastro> chrisccoulson, you're handling the g-p-m upload with the app indicators iirc?
<qense> kklimonda: bug 520048
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 520048 in indicator-application "Custom labels in GtkActionEntries aren't resepected by Application Indicators C-bindings" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/520048
<seb128> jcastro, no he isn't
<tedg> seb128: Yes, it's in trunk as qense said.
<seb128> <chrisccoulson> sorry, i was away from my desk there
<seb128>  i thought kenvandine said he was reviewing the gpm appindicator change
<seb128> <kenvandine> gave him my feedback and hadn't see anything else
<seb128> jcastro, ^
<jcastro> kenvandine, I just found a crasher bug in the xchat message indicator thing
<seb128> tedg, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~qense/indicator-application/fix-520048/revision/81
<seb128> tedg, that one?
<qense> seb128: that should be the fix, yes
<seb128> ok
 * seb128 backports to lucid now
<seb128> let's get that indicator work moving
<seb128> qense, tedg: thanks
<pitti> tedg: do you think you'll have time this week to review the merge proposal for indicator-session? it's keeping us from removing devicekit-power (and thus boot time/cd space/etc.)
<tedg> pitti: Review should be in your mailbox :)
<qense> btw, what's holding Anjuta up? For more than a day I've only got a new version for anjuta-common, anjuta itself isn't there yet. FTBS?
<tseliot> pitti: would it be possible to collect the output of "ldconfig -p | grep GL" and of "update-alternatives --display gl_conf" in apport for nvidia, fglrx and X bugs in general?
<pitti> tedg: ah, thanks; will followup there
<seb128> qense, am64?
<jcastro> seb128, yeah Nafai will probably finishing up a bunch of indicator work before FF so it's going to start piling up
 * kenvandine waits for evolution to filter the past 3 days worth of email...
<qense> seb128: yes
<pitti> tseliot: sure; sounds like it could be added to the "catch all" xorg hook (/usr/share/apport/package-hooks/source_xorg.py)
<seb128> qense, ftbfs yes
<qense> ok
<qense> I'll wait patiently then
<kenvandine> it might finish by feature freeze :)
<tseliot> pitti: sounds good to me. It would be a real time saver
<geser> qense: anjuta got hit too by the libmysqlclient16 breakage
<qense> damn libmysqlclient16! ;)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i build anjuta successfully last night on amd64. i thought it FTBFS due to version skew in some build-depends, so i retried the build after i managed to build it at home
<chrisccoulson> it still fails?
<tseliot> pitti: also, any ideas about this? http://launchpadlibrarian.net/39068474/Traceback.txt
<geser> chrisccoulson: "libsvn-dev: Depends: libaprutil1-dev but it is not going to be installed
<pitti> tseliot: yes
<geser> " from the build from today morning
<tseliot> ah
<pitti> tseliot: d-bus spawned programs have no $PATH
<pitti> tseliot: you need to call /sbin/ldconfig
<chrisccoulson> geser - yeah. that was the same issue as yesterday, but i managed to install that package in my pbuilder and successfully build anjuta
<pitti> tseliot: but probably, since this bit us more than once already, the backend should just check $PATH, and if it's empty, set a reasonable default one
<chrisccoulson> so i retried the build, and it still gets the same issue
<tseliot> pitti: oh, I think I remember that bug from a previous release cycle
<kenvandine> wow... the new icons in empathy are awesome!
<Nafai> seb128: I need version 82 to lucid as well for indicator-application
<Zdra> kenvandine, ubuntu changed empathy icons?
<qense> yes, they look really neat
<kenvandine> not sure where they came from
<qense> the humanity theme update
<kenvandine> i just noticed new presence icons
<geser> chrisccoulson: I still get this error message on amd64
<seb128> Nafai, does it fix an open launchpad bug?
<tseliot> pitti: so would it work if I checked os.environ["PATH"]?
<pitti> tseliot: I'd use "if not os.environ.get('PATH')
<pitti> tseliot: I'm not sure whether it's empty, or not present at all
<seb128> Zdra, depends what you call empathy icons, humanity icon theme got updated
<Nafai> seb128: Let me check, part of it fixes something I just told bratsche, but there might be a bug for part of it
<pitti> tseliot: so let's rather account for both
<tseliot> pitti: ah, ok
<seb128> Zdra, so some status icons are nicer in the humanity theme now
<vish> Zdra: yeah ,i added those icons in humanity.. as emapthy-*    is that not allowed ?
<Nafai> nope, I didn't file a bug for this one, just told bratsche about it
<qense> vish: I think the bug report that was fixed said they should have been called user-*
<Nafai> seb128: Should probably get in the habit for filing bugs for everything
<tseliot> pitti: I would do that from my own library though. Is it ok?
<vish> qense: works both ways :)
<vish> qense: there are those too
<seb128> Nafai, ok, what is the effect of the bug?
<pitti> tseliot: sure
<tseliot> ok
<tseliot> pitti: thanks for your help
<pitti> tseliot: you're welcome!
<Nafai> seb128: Changes made to menus after it has been set on the indicator were not being reflected
<Zdra> vish, sure it's allowed, we (empathy upstream) asked MANY times to have fd.o icon naming spec include IM related icons so we can drop that "empathy-" prefix
<vish> Zdra: yeah , the emapthy bug upstream seemed to have stalled , so i just added it for now :)
<seb128> Nafai, bug #521181?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 521181 in indicator-application "Menuitem visibility changing isn't handled" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/521181
<Nafai> oh yeah :)
 * vish just realized that it was kenvandine who pinged Zdra with an "empathy" highlight .. got confused earlier :)
<Nafai> I didn't file it
<kenvandine> vish, the icons look awesome :)
<kenvandine> hey rodrigo_
<vish> kenvandine: thanks :)
<rodrigo_> hi kenvandine
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, i see a tarball
<Zdra> vish, yep I have an highlight on "empathy", to spy what people do with it :D
<seb128> Nafai, ok, backporting that too
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, yes, 0.2.1, ready to be packaged
<kenvandine> great
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, i can do that today :)
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, cool!
<Nafai> kenvandine: Looks like seb128 is taking care of packaging the latest changes for app indicator  that I need.  So you can ignore the email jcastro sent
<kenvandine> Nafai,  cool
 * kenvandine still can't get into email... i really think evo has gotten slower at filtering mail
<Nafai> evo has always been slow whenever I've tried it
<chrisccoulson> congrats hyperair \o/
<kenvandine> it's always been slow at filtering for sure... but this is nuts
<hyperair> \o/
<kenvandine> i started it an hour ago and it is 23% done  with filtering new mail
<chrisccoulson> hyperair for MOTU :)
<kenvandine> it is only 3 days worth!
<seb128> Nafai, qense: kenvandine: both changes uploaded to lucid
<seb128> enjoy
<kenvandine> unless seb128 had a really busy day :)
<seb128> jcastro, ^
<qense> seb128: that's great, thank you!
<jcastro> \o/ seb128
<kenvandine> thx se
<kenvandine> thx seb128
<seb128> np
<jcastro> wow, lots of great stuff fixed today!
<qense> I suspect that some of my issues with Banshee will also be fixed by this new upload of Indicator Application.
<Nafai> seb128, Yay!  thanks
<pitti> tedg: replied and updated, thanks for review
<tedg> pitti: Cool, I'll look when LP catches up :)
<tgpraveen12> vish: with the humanity theme update with new status icons of empathy in the panel with me menu the status icons have colour
<tgpraveen12> no longer mono chrome
<vish> tgpraveen12: thats not humanity bug ;)  .. the memenu needs to be fixed to use the monochrome icons
<vish> tgpraveen12: the icons are in humanity now with the -panel names...
 * vish looks at tedg  ;)
<tgpraveen12> ok and the green border drawn on the message indicator envelope is intentional?
<tgpraveen12> it also breaks mono chrome scheme
<desrt> tgpraveen12: it's debugging
<tedg> vish: Ah, I didn't think of doing that in -me as well.  I'll put that on my TODO list.
<desrt> wait.  disregard.
<tedg> vish: AppIndicators should look for -panel now.
<seb128> tedg, Nafai: r82 seems to make rhythmbox crash on closing
<vish> tgpraveen12: it was a placeholder icon , since i didnt have time to do it for today's upload
<tgpraveen12> also sound pref icon has changed. and sound indicator icon looks bad in dark theme (though this was the case earlier also). i should probably hope over to #ubuntu-artwork now
<seb128> vish, next time let we know before upload so we wait for upload
<seb128> vish, it's sort of weird to have a placeholder icon for alpha3
<vish> seb128:  shall i push the fix for the mail icon?
<vish> i have done it now..
<LaserJock> is there a better place to talk about the indicator applet than here?
<seb128> vish, would be nice
<seb128> LaserJock, #ayatana
<tgpraveen12> LaserJock: ayatana
<vish> seb128: cool , i'm uploading the change
<seb128> vish, thanks
<seb128> tedg, could you try if rhythmbox crashes on closing for you?
<tedg> seb128: No, I don't think so.  Let me try again.
<pitti> rickspencer3: ah, you are currently editing https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-02-16 ?
 * pitti was just about to add his report
<rickspencer3> yeah
<rickspencer3> pitti, I cancelled
<rickspencer3> but bryceh started it without the template :,(
<pitti> oh, why that?
<rickspencer3> pitti, on call now, will ping back soon
<pitti> rickspencer3: page templateified, added my report
<seb128> tedg,
<seb128> #0  0x021da1dc in setup_dbusmenu (self=0x8388190)
<pitti> tseltiot, ArneGoetje, ccheney, didrocks, Riddell, kenvandine, seb128: can you please add your report to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-02-16 ? TIA
<seb128>     at libappindicator/app-indicator.c:1255
<seb128> #1  0x021da271 in client_menu_changed (widget=0x8982050, child=0x8979f10,
<seb128>     indicator=0x8388190) at libappindicator/app-indicator.c:1276
<seb128> pitti, ok
<pitti> seb128: sorry for breaking your stacktrace
<seb128> tedg, it crashes with that since I backported r82
<tedg> bratsche: ^
<seb128> pitti, np, you didn't break it, or at least not seen from there ;-)
<seb128> tedg, you don't get the issue are you sure?
<seb128> bratsche, hey ;-)
<tedg> seb128: Let me start from teh command line incase I accidentally turned of apport.
<vish> seb128: uploaded the icon  change to branch.. lp:humanity
<vish> is that good or how would you wish for me to do it?
<seb128> vish, that's good thanks, I will check with kwwii for the package update
<vish> hehe , he'll probably ask me to propose a merge anyway...
 * vish gets started on that ;p
<bratsche> seb128: Hey.
<seb128> bratsche, hello, how are you?
<bratsche> seb128: I'm okay.  I see a stack trace above that has my name on it though. :)
<seb128> bratsche, yeah, seems ted is blame you for this one...
<seb128> bratsche, rhythmbox crashes this way every time I close it since I backport r81 and 82
<seb128> backported
<seb128> speaking about indicator-application
<seb128> bratsche, do you think you would have time to look at the issue? or at least try if you get it too ;-)
<bratsche> seb128: Okay I just pushed r83 that checks priv->menu for non-NULL first.
<bratsche> seb128: I think this will fix it, but if not then ping me again. :)
<seb128> ok thanks
<seb128> will try in a bit
<bratsche> tedg: I just committed r83 without review, hope that's cool.  It's just checking something for non-NULL.
<tedg> bratsche: Cool with me.  Thanks for fixing it!
<rickspencer3> team meeting in 5 minutes
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-02-16
<seb128> is there anybody who would like to write a mir for mako there? ;-)
<vish> tedg: the rhythmbox app indicator icon is mixed up.. the icon now uses the playing icon when the app starts. [app is actually not-playing ] before with notification area , it used to use the not-playing icon
<tedg> bratsche: ^  (/me is having fun pinging bratsche for things ;) )
<bratsche> Yeah, this is why I said I'm going to work from a coffee shop with no Internet today.  Yesterday I managed to hardly work on my own stuff. :)
<rickspencer3> meeting time!
<ccheney> here
<didrocks> tseliot: still editing?
<seb128> bratsche, just close IRC ;-)
<tseliot> didrocks: yes, I was about to save
<rickspencer3> bryceh, ccheney, didrocks, kenvandine, pitti, Riddell, seb128, tseliot
<rickspencer3> who am I missing?
<kenvandine> hey hey hey!
<pitti> o/
<Riddell> hi hi
<seb128> hello
 * rickspencer3 taps gavel
<didrocks> o/
<tseliot> didrocks: just a sec
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-02-16
<rickspencer3> oops
<rickspencer3> I forgot "previous actions"
<rickspencer3> an oversite which will save us some time
<rickspencer3> ;)
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, partner update?>
<pitti> rickspencer3: they are on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-02-09
<tseliot> didrocks: done, you can edit the wiki now
<tkamppeter> hi
<bryceh> morning
<kenvandine> sure
<didrocks> tseliot: thanks :)
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> previous actions seem done
<rickspencer3> # Bryce to BP/WIify new work assigned on the sprint
<rickspencer3> #
<rickspencer3> Alberto to add missing alpha-3 WIs to foundations-lucid-boot-experience
<kenvandine> i am still waiting on dbarth to update the weekly releases page
<kenvandine> so that should happent oday
<kenvandine> today
<bryceh> rickspencer3, done
<rickspencer3> bryceh, tseliot did you guys get those?
<tseliot> rickspencer3: yep
<pitti> rickspencer3: I think I'm done with the alpha-3 BP mangling
<rickspencer3> (sorry kenvandine)
<pitti> rickspencer3: except for one which I'd like to discuss in the meeting
<rickspencer3> ok, so now ...
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, partner update?
<kenvandine> OLS is rocking the desktop, libubuntuone and rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store just had releases
<kenvandine> i will get the packages ready for review later today for lucid
<pitti> we need to rush them through NEW, etc.
<pitti> FF in two days
<kenvandine> the service isn't quite there, but damn close
<kenvandine> pitti, yeah.. hopefully today :)
<kenvandine> i have been maintaining the packages locally :)
<rickspencer3> pitti, does someone need to be ready to do the NEW rush?
<kenvandine> so shouldn't take me long
<pitti> rickspencer3: a prod to whoever's archive day is is prudent, I think
<pitti> (I'll be away later tonight, sorry; but I can have a look tomorrow morning)
<rickspencer3> pitti, ok
<Riddell> that'll be me today
<kenvandine> pitti, it will be ready for you in the AM :)
<kenvandine> or Riddell later today :)
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, all done partner update?
<kenvandine> the new U1 client is still coming this week, i will harass dobey asap for real code :)
<kenvandine> yup
<seb128> kenvandine, ping me if you want review and sponsoring
<kenvandine> seb128, will do :)
<seb128> I can probably do a first check and uploads
<pitti> kenvandine: do you know when we'll drop the U1 applet?
<seb128> then Riddell and pitti can NEW
<dobey> pitti: it's already dropped in trunk
<pitti> dobey: \o/
<kenvandine> dobey, release eta?
<dobey> kenvandine: this evening or tomorrow. i'll be poking statik to upload when ready
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> only new dep is libu1?
<dobey> no, libu1 isn't a dep for ubuntuone-client any more
<kenvandine> oh... ok
<dobey> webkit will be though
<kenvandine> ok
<dobey> python-webkit i guess. whatever the package for the py bindings is
<kenvandine> moving along
<pitti> kenvandine: pywebkit is already on the CD, no prob there
<kenvandine> yeah
<dobey> yay
<kenvandine> yay for gwibber too :)
<dobey> and music store :)
 * dobey goes off to lunch
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, all done?
<kenvandine> yup
<rickspencer3> thanks kenvandine
<rickspencer3> Riddell, Kubuntu status?
<Riddell> * 4.4 final is in
<Riddell> * daily images are looking good for i386/amd64 except for blocking on mysql fixed, amd64 should fit in CD size tomorrow
<Riddell> * kdebindings not compiling on ARM (the important bits do compile so we can just work around the unimportant bits)
<Riddell> * Qt 4.6.2 due today, and then we're in a good position for feature freeze
<rickspencer3> hmm
<rickspencer3> thanks Riddell
<rickspencer3> ccheney, mozilla update?
<ccheney> rickspencer3: i got everything that i think belongs into soup done, there are about 4 symbols left that it uses that i understand probably belong in glib/gnutls directly and that is what i am working on next
<rickspencer3> ccheney, how long until you complete it?
<ccheney> rickspencer3: i was off thu - mon, so haven't progressed since my last update with you
<ccheney> rickspencer3: hopefully not more than a day or two for that part, will need to discuss with asac how to make sure i don't break anything in the process since i will be modifying glib directly it is the most dangerous part of the change
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> moving on
<pitti> as long as we just add new code/symbols, it should be okay
<asac> the glib changes really looked confined well
<pitti> and glib has a large test sutie
<asac> but yes, lets look together
<ccheney> asac: ok
<rickspencer3> ok
<asac> (just convenience funcs for thread-local stuff)
<rickspencer3> so next team meeting we should hear that libsoup is complete
<asac> \o/
<rickspencer3> and work has started on the next item
<ccheney> wrt OOo 3.2.0 is now out upstream but hasn't been updated by ooo-build and debian yet, hoping to get the final uploaded to ubuntu in the next week
 * rickspencer3 crosses fingers
<ccheney> yes soup should be done by next week
<asac> yes. webkit and ephy is next
<asac> webkit -> easy (just the rename is painful); ephy require a few symbols (not that many from what i saw)
<rickspencer3> ccheney, thanks for the update on OOo, too bad it won't be ready for A3, but not a real problem
<ccheney> yea, hopefully no more cascading effects like with soup/glib, heh :)
<rickspencer3> ok, thanks ccheney and asac
<rickspencer3> moving on ...
<ccheney> rickspencer3: yea i doubt the ooo-build/debian stuff will be done by thu
<asac> rickspencer3: next week upload would hit a3, wouldnt it?
<asac> but please dont upload ooo in a3 week ;)
<rickspencer3> Transitioning from A3
 * asac with armel hat on
<ccheney> asac: yea i won't be uploading it unless it is done by friday
<asac> good
<asac> thx
<rickspencer3> ok, Transitioning from A3
<rickspencer3> ;)
<rickspencer3> so, this is pretty much the last week for blueprint work
<rickspencer3> so anything that you don't think will be done by Thursday, consider it more or less postponed to Lucid + 1
<rickspencer3> if you have any concerns about specific work items, please discuss with pitti, and if he is not available, you can ask me as well
<rickspencer3> after this week, we have three areas of focus
<rickspencer3>  1. Find and fix the worst bugs (how to find and track?)
<rickspencer3>  1. Ensure a smooth upgrade experience (how to test?)
<rickspencer3>  1. Integrate the latest and greatest
<rickspencer3> in terms of the first two items, I feel there is some ambiguity
<rickspencer3> hmm, pedro is not around :/
<desrt> rickspencer3: all tied for first place priority? :)
<rickspencer3> ?
<pitti> on a tangent, http://people.ubuntu.com/~mvo/automatic-upgrade-testing/
<rickspencer3> desrt, yes, of course, I am an manager
<rickspencer3> note that the list is subject to change :/
<pitti> http://people.ubuntu.com/~mvo/automatic-upgrade-testing/2010-02-16-12:16:25/
<rickspencer3> just kidding, that's just Moin formatting
<pitti> in short, defualt install upgrades are all working now
<rickspencer3> thanks pitti
<rickspencer3> I would like to discuss with QA team how we can better organize upgrade testing with the community
<rickspencer3> this is ofter a sore point, and since we have created a good amount of time to focus on quality, I am hoping we can do a good job there
<mvo> I'm working on a stepmaker based upgrade test (in addition to the one that pitti showed)
<rickspencer3> mvo, are you working with marjo on this?
<rickspencer3> or ara or pedro?
<rickspencer3> also, we probably need to define some upgrade behaviors and make sure they work well
<mvo> rickspencer3: no, I discussed it with soren at the sprint and created a profile. but I will and hope they can take it over
<rickspencer3> like, different cases if the user removed or moved an indicator, etc...
<rickspencer3> mvo ok
<rickspencer3> anyone particularly passionate about upgrade experience who would like to work on planning for this aspect?
<pitti> the trouble with us developers is that we don't have good real-life test cases for upgrades
 * rickspencer3 listens to crickets chirping
<pitti> we upgrade every day
<pitti> so we do them in small steps
<rickspencer3> yeah, I think we need to organize some test cases and some community efforts around this
<rickspencer3> ACTION: rickspencer3 to engage QA wrt upgrade testings
<pitti> we need to receive lots of feedback at beta-1, when all Canonical folks upgrade
<rickspencer3> ^sound okay?
<pitti> likewise with community feedback, of course (around beta-1)
<rickspencer3> pitti, right, but I would like to see some more organized, rigorous testing, since we have created a long period of time to focus on quality
<pitti> well, synthetic upgrades are already tested automatically
<rickspencer3> ok, I have an action item
<rickspencer3> tseliot, bryceh have you anything set up to test upgrades wrt the new alternatives system?
<pitti> what they miss is customizations in /etc/, wild package combinations, nvidia drivers, broadcom wifi, all the stuff that makes real boxes explode
<tseliot> rickspencer3: yes, today I've put my new nvidia card in my testing box so now I should have all the hardware I need
<rickspencer3> tseliot, so you are doing all the testing yourself?
<rickspencer3> (until the community starts upgrading)?
<pitti> I seriously think that we'll get lots of bug reports after beta-1
<rickspencer3> pitti, I know
<bryceh> rickspencer3, I have hardware set up for it as well, but time is the main limiting factor
<rickspencer3> I would like to get some of those earlier if we can
<tseliot> rickspencer3: yes but we also have a mailing list for that
<seb128> pitti, upgrade bugs or just bugs?
<pitti> so far our problem has always been to fix everything, not really not getting enough feedback
<pitti> seb128: upgrade problems
<pitti> seb128: well, "bugs" as well, of course
<rickspencer3> ok
<tseliot> bryceh: +1 on lacking the time
<rickspencer3> I will talk to marjo and see if we can organize something a tad more methodical than "everyone update for beta-1 and tell us what is broken"
<rickspencer3> so, that brings us back to
<rickspencer3> find and fix the worst bugs
<rickspencer3> I think that with the new gravity system, we might be a tad more effective at picking out actionable and important bugs
<rickspencer3> thoughts on how we could do better finding the worst bugs?
<rickspencer3> oookay
<rickspencer3> moving on
<pitti> rickspencer3: btw, ISTR that ara wanted to organize that as well
<bryceh> rickspencer3, hehe
<bryceh> rickspencer3, I think that same question gets asked every release ;-)
<pitti> rickspencer3: "that" > driver upgrade testing, etc.
<rickspencer3> bryceh, yes
<rickspencer3> and we have taken some action wrt the problem
<bryceh> rickspencer3, in fact I was asking myself the same question in the shower this morning
<rickspencer3> gravity + JSON searches
<rickspencer3> okay
<rickspencer3> by next week I will have the perfect bug finding workflow figured out
<bryceh> awesome
<rickspencer3> ;)
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> speaking of which
<rickspencer3> pitivi
<rickspencer3> so, we are to decide by beta 1 if pitivi is in or out
<rickspencer3> but we didn't really discuss the criteria for that
<bryceh> whats the word on the street?
<pitti> ideally we'd have a set of use cases that it needs to fulfill
<pitti> IOW, a "test plan"
<pitti> and then check the bug situation (incoming bugs vs. activity on them)
<seb128> I still failed to do anything useful with pitivi
<seb128> but maybe that's only me
<pitti> I just don't see anyone who currently maintains it on the Ubuntu side
<rickspencer3> bryceh, works on the street that the next version will be ready almost on time, fixes a lot of bugs, and has simple fade transitions
<rickspencer3> pitti, right
<rickspencer3> does someone want to step up and be ubuntu pitivi maintainer?
 * seb128 hides
<rickspencer3> also, of course, the pitivi team has a big say in this, especially if they don't feel it is ready
<seb128> I'm fine doing updates
<seb128> but I don't want to do extra work on it
<pitti> seb128: would not make much sense anyway if you aren't even using it
<rickspencer3> there may be some codecy stuff that needs to be tweaked
<rickspencer3> yeah
<seb128> pitti, well I'm doing updates for lot of GNOME things I don't use
<rickspencer3> seb128, right, I think he was referring to the "extra work" part
<pitti> seb128: is that an argument that you want pitivi maintenance pushed to you? :-)
<seb128> noooo ;-)
<rickspencer3> ok, let's carry this over to next week
<rickspencer3> see how everyone feels after ff ;)
<rickspencer3> perhaps I will have talked someone into it by then
<rickspencer3> pitti, did you have an "other business" item?
<pitti> anyone at least got a video cam?
<seb128> hehehe
<pitti> rickspencer3: some stragglers
<rickspencer3> ok
 * rickspencer3 hands mic to pitti
<pitti> kenvandine: I saw that power-indicator just got dropped, so that settles question 1
<kenvandine> :)
<pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/canonical-desktop-team-lucid-alpha-3.html
<pitti> I cleaned up a little today (some people got nagging questions from me, sorry)
<pitti> so we are by and large back on track
<pitti> I went through the remaining WIs, and they seem sensible and current to me
<pitti> if you sort this list by number of "todo", you'll see that 9 specs are just having 1 WI left
<seb128> there is probably some that can be moved there
<seb128> like speeding xrandr
<pitti> also, things like "write test plan", etc.
<pitti> which can be done after FF, and in freezes
<pitti> startup-speed is obviously the biggest one left
<pitti> we still have some stuff in the pipe
<pitti> oh, btw
<pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~scott/ratchet-netbook-lucid-20100216-23.png
<pitti> 10.8 s!
<pitti> that's with some tweaks of Keybuk which will get uploaded soon
<rickspencer3> oh man
<rickspencer3> go go go
<didrocks> :)
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> all other bits are in the budget, just desktop is at 4.8
<pitti> but this is awesome
<rickspencer3> so where do we get the .8 seconds?
<pitti> kenvandine: sfts -> remaining ones is integration (MIR and the like)? or still coding work to do?
<pitti> it gets tight for this
<pitti> rickspencer3: we still have some stuff in the pipe, like seb128's current work on nm-applet
<rickspencer3> great
<pitti> (which doesn't influence this particular chart, though)
<seb128> I'm done with it
<kenvandine> pitti, just one coding item
<seb128> it has been handed to upstream and nm-applet packaging team now
<kenvandine> and a few docs
<kenvandine> pitti, i still hope to be done
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: bug 522726 - builds fine, haven't found any problems
<pitti> seb128: rock, thanks a lot
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 522726 in transmission "Update to 1.90" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/522726
<seb128> pitti, you're welcome
<rickspencer3> pitti, any other wi business to discuss?
<pitti> the other bigger bit is the remaining mobile-lucid-une-2d-launcher
<didrocks> pitti: so, you think that the 2D/3D detection added last week is still relevant? (this will slow down the boot, without speaking I wasn't able to work on that today)
<pitti> didrocks: you had some concern there which is worth discussing?
<pitti> didrocks: heh, snap :)
<rickspencer3> asac has stepped out
<didrocks> well, with the bg cache WI always changing, I don't know if I will have the time to do this (the 3 WI related)
<rickspencer3> but I wanted to discuss with him today
<pitti> didrocks: I saw another WI in a different spec which just said "if mutter fails to load, present a dialog and explain how to switch" or so?
<didrocks> pitti: right, hence the "3" :)
<rickspencer3> what is the consequence of not getting those items done?
<pitti> didrocks: we certainly shouldn't reintroduce something like the compiz wrapper
<kwwii> seb128: lp:~ubuntu-art-pkg/humanity/release is updated with the new message menu icon
<didrocks> pitti: that was the plan: a wrapper to choose right "netbook-launcher{,-efl}
<seb128> kwwii, danke
<didrocks> but well, as it has been added at some kind of last minute effect, I don't know if it is really important
<pitti> didrocks: can't we put that as code into n-l itself, with a very cheap test?
<pitti> didrocks: anyway, I don't think it's an alpha-3 blocker
<pitti> if we need it, it can land by beta-1
<rickspencer3> ok, I'll talk to asac about just removing it from Lucid altogether
<pitti> if we determine that the current behaviour breaks too much on boxes without 3D support
<didrocks> pitti: so, asking for a FFe?
<rickspencer3> pitti, but if we keep working on it, that's less bandwidth for:
<rickspencer3> 1. find and fix teh worst bugs
<rickspencer3> 2. ensure a smooth upgrade experience
<pitti> didrocks: well, a fallback to the 2D launcher is a bug fix if starting thhe 3D launcher totally breaks the box
<didrocks> pitti: heh, right
<pitti> right, it's not even an upgrade problem, is it"
<pitti> ?
<jpds> 12
<pitti> karmic's netbook-laucher totally screws up in kvm
<pitti> i. e. on non-3D machines
<didrocks> no, nothing was done previously
 * Amaranth sees compiz mentioned
<pitti> didrocks: so if at all, I'd like to see the live system installer make the change (with an alternative perhaps)
<pitti> depending on whether the live system detects 3D caps or not
<didrocks> pitti: only on the live system so, what if you have a nvidia card and install 3D acceleration?
<pitti> didrocks: then you have a postinst to change the alternative
<pitti> but still, it seems quite complex to me
<pitti> so my question would rather be, how much are we required to get this in the first place?
<pitti> didrocks: if we can do something cheap and easy, like a 0.01 s runtime test in n-l which, when fails, executes n-l-2d, that's fine
<didrocks> that's not on my call, asac or rickspencer3, maybe :) for me, at least, it's not a regression, just a better experience thing
<pitti> didrocks: right, it's a question for asac
<didrocks> pitti: right, not sure about the test to do yet TBH
<rickspencer3_> my tubes!
<pitti> rickspencer3_: wb
<rickspencer3_> heh
<pitti> seb128 fell off the planet as well
<rickspencer3_> my network connection went down, am on 3g now :/
<rickspencer3_> anywho,
<pitti> didrocks: ok, too complex for meeting topic; let's discuss tomorrow morning with asac, shall we?
<seb128> sorry about that
<seb128> I'm back
<rickspencer3_> pitti, all done?
<didrocks> pitti: sure
<pitti> rickspencer3_: yes, from my side
<rickspencer3_> any other business?
<kenvandine> not from me
<seb128> no
 * rickspencer3_ taps gavel
<rickspencer3_> thanks all!
<pitti> thanks everyone
<ccheney> thanks
<pitti> dinner o'clock
<didrocks> thanks
<seb128> thanks
 * didrocks returns fighthing the deserialize stuff
<bryceh> thanks
<LaserJock> didrocks: so I got around the UNE panel immutability thing by creating my own ubuntu-netbook-default-settings for the short term
<seb128> LaserJock, why don't you just change your session to be similar to une in that regard?
<seb128> ie one bar with the applets you ned
<seb128> need
<didrocks> right, after discussion, UNE panel will keep the mandatory layout as the "UNE experience". if people wants to configure their panel, they can change the default GNOME session to fit their need (if you want to write a doc on that, I can help you)
<ccheney> pitti: are the changes to reach 10.8s going to make alpha 3?
<james_w> ah!
<james_w> my gpg agent grabbed all keyboard input to the system
<james_w> then displayed the results in the box
<james_w> without masking any of it
<james_w> has anyone else seen that?
<didrocks> james_w: what version of seahorse-plugin do you have?
<didrocks> seahorse-plugins* even
<james_w> 2.29.90-0ubuntu3
<james_w> that's not necessarily what is running in my session though, if this was recently fixed
<didrocks> hum, not me this time ;) let me have a test, I have to build something
<james_w> yeah
<james_w> seb has already fixed it
 * james_w hugs him
<LaserJock> didrocks: I guess I didn't know it would be easy to convert a normal GNOME panel into a netbook one, what about things like the launcher?
<kklimonda> james_w: I have a problem with merging transmission using bzr full source branches - sid packages is using new source format, it have patches from debian/patches/ applied but no .pc directory so when I try to generate source package I get errors. known problem or am I doing something wrong way?
<didrocks> LaserJock: just add a symlink from /etc/xdg/autostart/netbook-launcher.desktop pointing to /etc/xdg/xdg-une/netbook-launcher.desktop (same for maximus)
 * seb128 hugs james_w
<didrocks> LaserJock: if you want to write a doc for others people wanting customization and who don't care having both session, that whould rock :)
<LaserJock> didrocks: yeah, I think I'd be up for that
<seb128> or if that's for your user only add those to your session
<didrocks> LaserJock: if you want me to have a look once done, do not hesitate
<LaserJock> didrocks: that seems like a decent compromise for "power" users
<didrocks> seb128: right, maybe easier this way
<LaserJock> didrocks: is there an existing "space" for UNE docs?
<james_w> kklimonda: I haven't come across that
<didrocks> LaserJock: I agree. And as seb128's suggested, we can do one part "for all users" and one part "for your user only"
<james_w> kklimonda: I know there have been a couple of dpkg bugs in this area, perhaps it is related to those
<didrocks> LaserJock: TBH, I don't know :)
<james_w> kklimonda: I don't think it's specific to the merge is it? You can't build the sid branch?
<LaserJock> didrocks: in the past the Netbook wiki pages have often been pretty outdated and less-than-helpful just due to the in-development nature of things
<didrocks> LaserJock: true, maybe lucid is time to write something small and up to date
<pitti> ccheney: I think so
<kklimonda> james_w: I can and that's why I'm wondering if I do something wrong - do you have any documentation I could read? Things I've found were.. incomplete :)
<ccheney> pitti: cool :)
<kklimonda> james_w: right now I branch lucid branch, merge debian branch, fix all conflicts (and I get a few outside of the debian/ directory), then commit and use bzr bd to create package - at this point I get "dpkg-source: warning: patches have not been applied, applying them now"
<james_w> kklimonda: looking
<pitti> didrocks: actually, perhaps we could just install n-l on i386/amd64, and n-l-efl on armel by default
<didrocks> pitti: yes, this is the default fallback. It would just be a little better if we can be more fine-grained
<didrocks> pitti: the issue is not technical issue, just time issue
<pitti> if that's good enough for asac, let's keep it that way
<didrocks> pitti: the background cache is just failing on deserialization now btw
<didrocks> ok
<pitti> :(
 * pitti hugs didrocks
<didrocks> I'm stuck with it for 30 min now :/
 * didrocks hugs pitti back
<pitti> didrocks: like, the deserialization doesn't work?
<asac> didrocks: whats up?
<didrocks> pitti: right
<asac> too hard to implement the fallback?
<asac> (or too time consuming?)
<didrocks> asac: just no time. I haven't been able to even give it a look
<didrocks> I was thinking working on that yesterday and today
<asac> didrocks: ok. no problem.
<asac> just dont seed the 3d launcher on armel ;)
<pitti> asac: are there actually any arm devices which can (and should) run n-l instead of n-l-efl?
<asac> yes
<asac> in theory most ... its just a driver issue
<chrisccoulson> good evening everyone
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128. have you had a good day?
<didrocks> as pitti said, we can still consider that as a bug and so, target it just after FF
<didrocks> asac: ^
<asac> didrocks: works for me
<pitti> the other major question is how much effort (boot speed wise) it is to figure out 3D support
<seb128> chrisccoulson, okish, I managed to get some work today but I think I got a cold too
<didrocks> (in exchange, I hope to have a FFe for Quickly too ;))
<asac> i thought you planned to do that anyway?
<pitti> asac: we certainly don't want another compiz wrapper thing, taking more than a second
<didrocks> pitti: right
<seb128> I've a start of running nose
<pitti> seb128: urgh, cold?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thats not good. i hope the cold doesn't develop in to something too bad
<pitti> seb128: hot tub, book, bed?
<seb128> pitti, yeah, something like that I guess ;-)
<didrocks> pitti: I'll try to have a look on netbook-launcher, see where it fails and so, respawn netbook-launcher-efl in that case
<seb128> still half an hour finishing things and I'm off for diner and relaxing
<pitti> didrocks: if it properly fails, launching -efl in a kind of "exception" handler is best; saves the startup cost up-front
<didrocks> pitti: right, seems to be a good things. We should just check if it properly fails in those case
<didrocks> asac: do you have some arm where you can try netbook-launcher and see if it fails or just hang on?
<didrocks> (clutk_init or clutter_init should fail, I guess)
<didrocks> s/arm/arm hw/
<asac> i will ask someone to try that ;)
<didrocks> thanks asac :)
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, thanks for doing transmission
<chrisccoulson> i'll sponsor that now
<LaserJock> didrocks: is there a mailing list for UNE where there could be a doc discussion?
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, i can't merge your transmission branch
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: problem with rich support or something else?
<chrisccoulson> bzr: ERROR: KnitPackRepository('file:///home/chr1s/src/transmission/ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu/.bzr/repository/') is not compatible with CHKInventoryRepository('file:///home/chr1s/src/transmission/kklimonda/lp.522726/.bzr/repository/')
<didrocks> LaserJock: not from what I know of, there are some bug triagers mostly but not a proper doc handling (as there it's diveded more on multiple components).
<didrocks> LaserJock: if you find one, ping me, I'll subscribe :)
<chrisccoulson> ooh, nice icons:)
<LaserJock> didrocks: help.ubuntu.com/community has a number of wiki pages but only on specific netbook hardware (eeepc, aspire one, etc.)
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: maybe I have a newer version of bzr?
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, what version do you have?
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: when I branch lp:~ubuntu-desktop/transmission/ubuntu I get "Doing on-the-fly conversion from <RemoteRepositoryFormat> to <RepositoryFormat2a>."
<seb128> chrisccoulson, bzr upgrade I would say
<didrocks> LaserJock: maybe time to gather everything if you are interested in it. that would rock :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks, that fixed it :)
<LaserJock> didrocks: yeah, looks like a landing page would be good, then clean up of the outdated stuff
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: no - it wasn't that but seb128 has helped as always :)
<LaserJock> didrocks: then adding of LTS documentation for things like this panel issue
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you might also want to bzr upgrade lp:~ubuntu-desktop/etc
<seb128> chrisccoulson, or you will not be able to push I think
<didrocks> LaserJock: so, should I understand that you volonteer? ;)
<seb128> sort of stupid but I got stucked due to that several times
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks, i will do that before i push then
<LaserJock> didrocks: to some extent, yes
<LaserJock> didrocks: I'll start working on it and see how far I get
<didrocks> LaserJock: sweet! thanks a lot. Ping me if you need help (after FF) :)
<LaserJock> didrocks: my full-time "production" machine is an Aspire One, it benefits me to have good docs ;-)
<didrocks> LaserJock: sure ;-)
<LaserJock> I also have a horrible memory, that's the other reason
<didrocks> heh
<seb128> hum
<pitti> good night everyone
<didrocks> good night pitti
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: I got a black vertical line from empathy again - any idea how to debug it? ;)
<kklimonda> seb128 has just went to sleep :/
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, i'm not sure. i've noticed that too
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine - have you noticed that too?
<seb128> I'm uploading gnome-keyring 2.29 to the ubuntu-desktop ppa for those who want to try it
<seb128> out of mission-control which fails after autologin (but works after being restarted) it seems to work fine there
<qense> fta: the version number used in the Gwibber PPA makes it older than the release included in the Lucid repositories. Is this desired?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, I am loving the multi stream view in Gwibber
<qense> so am I
<james_w> kklimonda: I've managed to reproduce now
<rickspencer3> seems some folks are having good success with pitivi: http://www.0xdeadbeef.com/weblog/2010/02/sunrise-over-sweden/
<LaserJock> didrocks: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuNetbookEdition is an intitial stab at rounding up pages
<james_w> kklimonda: it's not the .pc dir
<james_w> it's that the top patch has to fuzz to apply now
<didrocks> LaserJock: awesome, will be a good base for gathering everything :)
<chrisccoulson> yay, transmission with app-indicator support uploaded \o/
<kklimonda> and I've heard people at #ayatana talking about making a new icon for transmission :)
<qense> kklimonda: It would be nice if Humanity would include a monochrome tray icon for transmission.
<LaserJock> didrocks: I'm not sure what to do with all the stuff for like pre-karmic releases, I guess maybe first thing should be to get more Lucid docs and then archive the rest?
<fta> qense, no, but as kenvandine (upstream) uploads to lucid as soon as there's an upstream commit, there's nothing i can do ;)
<chrisccoulson> qense - vish might be the person to ping about that
<chrisccoulson> but yeah, it would be nice :)
<didrocks> LaserJock: I'm in favor on that, "UNE" is only lucid (and karmic) interface
<qense> chrisccoulson: I think jorge was going to talk with some people about the icon.
<didrocks> grrr, g_file_get_contents () doesn't give me the right length, this is from where come the error
<qense> fta: well, then I'll just wait until a new version lands in Lucid. ;)
<vish> qense: transmission icon? for now i havent icon any new monochrome icons.. the ones in the recent update were rather old ones which only got pushed recently   ;)   [/me still waiting for info from UX team]
<vish> havent done*
<qense> vish: jorge was going to hand the transmission icon names to the design team, so I'm not sure if you'll be asked to do it
<jcastro> I told kwwii about it, I'll bug him about it tomorrow
 * vish uses vuze
<vish> qense: i have a neat vuze icon though ;)
<kklimonda> james_w: any guidelines how to fix it or should I just sit tight and wait? :)
<qense> vish: Well, someone better give Vuze Indicator Application support then!
<james_w> kklimonda: quilt push; quilt refresh; quilt pop; would be a good start
<Nafai> Is there a way to print the XML from a GtkBuilder?
<fta> qense, the daily starts at 4am UTC (or when someone asks me to boost it manually)
<qense> fta: but the version of Gwibber in Lucid really is older than the one in the PPA. I think it's because of the ~ that 2.29.1 is regarded as newer than a later commit.
<didrocks> spotted the bug, I think \o/
<mvo> james_w: or edit-patch ;)
<james_w> mvo: \o/
<fta> qense, well, it's not my choice, the packaging should either use "+" instead of "~" in g-o-s, or upstream should bump the version just after release
<fta> kenvandine, ^^, could you please do one of those?
<qense> fta: but in lucid we've got gwibber 2.29.1-0ubuntu1 whereas the PPA as got 2.29.1~bzr597-0ubuntu2~daily1
<qense> 2.29.1 is older than revision 597
<fta> qense, i know
<qense> ok
<fta> 2.29.1~bzr597-0u1 < 2.29.1-0u1 < 2.29.1+bzr597-0u1 < 2.29.2~bzr597-0u1
<chrisccoulson> vish - why use vuze?
<chrisccoulson> transmission rocks ;)
<chrisccoulson> we should be ditching the icons in the transmission menu though shouldn't we?
<chrisccoulson> all of the items there are actions rather than objects
<kenvandine> fta, i'll bump it
<vish> chrisccoulson: havent used transmission recently, but earlier[1-2yrs ago] it seemed to lack a lot of features.. been using vuze since a long time
<vish> chrisccoulson: the first thing after an install i do is remove transmission ;p
<chrisccoulson> vish - which features in particular? the newer transmission releases are pretty sweet :)
<chrisccoulson> although, i don't use that many features
<Nafai> vish: Yeah, vuze has been my usual choice, that's mainly out of habit though
<chrisccoulson> i tend to stick with all the applications on the stock install
<chrisccoulson> it's difficult for me to test apps that i don't use daily
<vish> chrisccoulson: i think it was per torrent speed control.. but not sure ,  that might be it... i should try transmission.. vuze  just hogs memory :(
<qense> vish: Transmission really improved over the last few releases
<fta> kenvandine, thanks
 * vish takes transmission for a spin
<vish> ooh.. transmission has indeed improved , neeeat :D
<chrisccoulson> brb, session restart
<chrisccoulson> does gnome-screensaver fade out work for anybody running proprietary nvidia drivers in lucid?
<rodrigo_> hey kenvandine, how's the libu1 work going? do you need anything from me?
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, nope
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, ok, cool!
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, :)
<rodrigo_> :)
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, congrats on the 3G modem
 * kenvandine wants one
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, yeah, works great indeed, just had to tweak a wvdial.conf file
<kenvandine> :)
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, I got it for free from my DSL company
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, maybe you can get one from yours?
<kenvandine> i wish
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, I won't use it much, but it's great to be able to do some work while travelling :-)
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, mind running gnome-screensaver --debug for your fade issue?
<chrisccoulson> i suspect the issue is the proprietary driver
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: sure...
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, it seems g-s uses the XRANDR extension now for doing the fade, and the proprietary nvidia driver might not support that
<didrocks> pitti: I honestly wonder if the serialization thing is good: On my laptop (1920x1200) original file: 175058, serialized_file: 3183453 (18x bigger!). If you want to give a benchmark test tomorrow morning, here you will find the i386 debs: http://people.canonical.com/~didrocks/
<vish> chrisccoulson: qense: thanks for reminding me of transmission :D   , it does indeed look nicer now.. only problem i loose all my ratio in vuze :(
<vish> ;)
<qense> vish: well, write a convertor for it!
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: I attached the debug log to the bug
<vish> qense: meh.. too much work just for bragging.. i lost similarly when i converted from windows ;)
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, thanks
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: curiously, it used to work with 2.29.1, and I don't see any changes related to that in git
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: unless the stoopid nvidia driver changed
<vish> maybe i'm like Nafai still liking the trusty old vuze  :)
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, oh, that's strange if it worked in 2.29.1
<chrisccoulson> that version uses the new fade
<asac>  /win7
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: let me downgrade for a sec...my memory is usually unreliable :)
<vish> qense: does the memory usage stay low?  what i see now is 1/10th of vuze 0.o   unbelievable
<kenvandine> asac, is win7 better than vista ?
 * kenvandine ducks
<chrisccoulson> [gs_fade_init] gs-fade.c:889 (14:58:13):	 Fade type: 3
<chrisccoulson> which is FADE_TYPE_XRANDR
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: you're right, it stopped fading with 2.29.1
<qense> vish: I never tested it, but I also never noticed it using a lot of memory.
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, i suspect then that this is not supported in the nvidia driver
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: yeah
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, would you mind running gnome-screensaver through xtrace, so i can see the X protocol calls?
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: sure, hold on a sec
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<kklimonda> vish: it does
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: I've attached an xtrace
<asac> kenvandine: lol
<vish> neat...  now i have to wean from vuze slowly ;)
<kklimonda> vish: transmission's developer have made a benchmark some time ago: http://pastehtml.com/view/091108Kw3uDGmn.html
<kklimonda> vish: you can't really even compare T with Vuze in terms of memory usage - it isn't fair fight
<vish> yeah , vuze consistently stays over 120MB :(
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, so, it seems like it's not supported by the nvidia drivers
<chrisccoulson> g-s thinks it is, because:
<chrisccoulson> 000:>:002c:32: Reply to QueryVersion: major-version=1 minor-version=3
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: great...it says it supports RANDR, but it doesn't really :)
<chrisccoulson> the server says it supports version 1.3 of the RANDR extension, which is a lie
<chrisccoulson> yeah
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: typical proprietary crap :)
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: thanks for taking a look, I'll close the bug
<chrisccoulson> i'll try and think of a way to work around that in g-s, that still makes it possible for us to have the nice fade :)
<chrisccoulson> you can keep ths bug open for now, as we will probably have to work around it anyway
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: by "us", you mean the smart devs who bought an intel chipset, right? :)
<chrisccoulson> the proprietary drivers won't be going away unfortunately
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, yeah, the people with an intel chipset ;)
<mdeslaur> hehe
<chrisccoulson> although, my desktop upstairs has a nvidia card too, but it still runs karmic
<Nafai> Are they intel chips that go up to 1920x1200?
<chrisccoulson> so, it would be nice if i could fix it
<Nafai> s/they/there/
<Nafai> That's one of the reason I like the nvidia card in my Thinkpad
<Nafai> This looks like an interesting program: http://kaizer.se/wiki/kupfer/
 * mvo hugs james_w for bzr-builddeb
<superm1> hi.  can someone desktopy take a look at gnome-panel-data's postinst and see if there is any logical reason why we're still calling (casper|dpkg)-reconfigure as the live cd boots?  I don't see any particular reason that code snippet needs to stick in there and reconfigure the package
<bryceh> erf, this shifting from X blueprint work to bugs again is rough.  There are **so** many bug reports 8-|
<bigon> sorry to ask again but could somebody make that merge ? https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/papyon/+bug/520699
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 520699 in papyon "Please merge papyon (0.4.4-1) from debian testing" [Wishlist,New]
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, i'm trying to figure out how to work around this nvidia issue. i don't know if you have time for doing any debugging, but i'm interested in whether xrandr_fade_setup returns FALSE when attempting to do the fade (because gnome_rr_crtc_get_gamma returns FALSE)
<chrisccoulson> and if that's the case, i'm trying to figure out what triggers the blanking of the screen eventually
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: sure, I've got time
<chrisccoulson> from comparing xtrace with and without nvidia, i think we can work around the issue and fall back to the non-randr gamma fade on nvidia
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: let me install the debugging symbols and figure out how to check with gdb
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, thanks :)
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: it's returning TRUE
<chrisccoulson> oh, that's unexpected ;)
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, does xrandr_crtc_whack_gamma get called when the fade is meant to happen?
<chrisccoulson> and does "if (gamma_info->size == 0)" evaluate to TRUE in xrandr_crtc_whack_gamma ?
<chrisccoulson> i suspect that is probably what happens
<chrisccoulson> it certainly doesn't get as far as setting the gamma, as i don't see any calls in xtrace
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: yes, xrandr_crtc_whack_gamma gets called a bunch of times, and always return with that condition being true
<chrisccoulson> cool, thanks. that's probably all i need to know for now then
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: cool, let me know if you need anything else
<Ian_Corne> Hello :)
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, robert_ancell hi
<seb128> re
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, hi
<seb128> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey
<seb128> kenvandine, still needing sponsoring?
<seb128> robert_ancell, how are you?
<robert_ancell> seb128, good, just woke up :)
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: yo
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, robert_ancell I'm putting the irc log on the meeting agenda right now
<TheMuso> ok
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, robert_ancell Eastern Edition?
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-02-16
<TheMuso> Sure
<rickspencer3> let me know when you've read it through
<kenvandine> seb128, yup
 * kenvandine looks for branches
<kenvandine> lp:~ken-vandine/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store/ubuntu
<kenvandine> lp:~ken-vandine/libubuntuone/ubuntu
<kenvandine> seb128,
<kenvandine> temp branches, then need to go to lp:ubuntu/NAME
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, I'll put my hand up for pitivi but not until I return to Desktop
<robert_ancell> (full time)
<kenvandine> then i will delete them
 * TheMuso has read
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, thank you
<rickspencer3> maybe we can find someone to fill in until then
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> let me run through the high points as I see them
<rickspencer3> 1. lots of U1 stuff is going to land this week
<rickspencer3> 1.1 I mean *lots*
<rickspencer3> 1.2 seriously
<rickspencer3> 2. Kubuntu seems in quite good shape, Riddell seems to have it in hand (no surprise there I suppose)
<rickspencer3> 3. Libsoup porting is almost done and should be done this week (I report for about the 5th week running)
<rickspencer3> 4. Post A3
<rickspencer3> this part I am not sure impacts TheMuso and robert_ancell so much, but it bears repeated
<rickspencer3> blueprint work should finish off this week
<rickspencer3> A3 will be substantially what the desktop team will deliver for final
<robert_ancell> blueprint work = blueprints for Lucid?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, yes
<rickspencer3> so the rest of the cycle is:
<rickspencer3> 1. find and fix the worst bugs
<rickspencer3> 2. ensure a smooth upgrade experience
<rickspencer3> 3. integrate teh latest and greates (as appropriate)
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, are there work items for lucid that you are concerned about?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, no, I think mine are all postponed/been claimed by seb128 :)
<rickspencer3> thank you robert_ancell
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, audio update?
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Nothing significant this week other than the fix for the ideapad machines being committted upstrea and available in crack of the day now.
<rickspencer3> oh, great
<TheMuso> upstream even, and I wasn't the one who wrote the patch, someone else did for another ideapad variant which uses the same chip.
<rickspencer3> that's great news
<rickspencer3> ok, so in terms of #1 above, no one had any great ideas about how to improve our ability to find the right bugs to fix
<rickspencer3> I am intending to work on this a bit with marjo, I am hoping that bdmurray's new tools help (especially gravity)
<TheMuso> Not really, other than scane packages one works on to find the bugs./
<seb128> robert_ancell, oh please feel free to still do you gdmsetup hacks if you get to that first though ;-)
<rickspencer3> *cough*
<rickspencer3> too late
<rickspencer3> *couch*
<rickspencer3> ;)
<seb128> lol
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, :P
<seb128> I will bug fix gdm otherwise to turn login sound off by default
<rickspencer3> for #2, I would like to see some more planning and rigor in finding upgrade bugs a bit earlier
<robert_ancell> seb128, did you find a good method to do that?
<seb128> which is a "ups, default value changed I don't know why"
<rickspencer3> but again, no one had any good ideas, so I will approach marjo abotu that as well
<seb128> robert_ancell, we have a custom gconf config which sets the theme etc
<seb128> robert_ancell, I can add the key there
<seb128> (sorry to disturbe the meeting)
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, talk about it later
<rickspencer3> for Easter Edition, any other business?
<TheMuso> seb128: please no
<TheMuso> a11y people will go skitso over that
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, he's teasing me, don't worry, seb128 wouldn't really do something like that :P
<seb128> TheMuso, let's discuss it after meeting but 99% of users don't need sound and get embarassed in public places due to that
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, what about the new configurator that you blogged about
<rickspencer3> can we get that into universe?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, yes, talking with the developers about it
<TheMuso> seb128: Ok, I can turn it on for a11y profiles during the install.
 * TheMuso sighs.
<rickspencer3> so I think that is just grand
<seb128> robert_ancell, I'm not sure I'm happy about you promoting hacking things having pygtk running under sudo and gconftool calls btw ;-)
<rickspencer3> seb128, not turning the sound off "by accident"
<robert_ancell> seb128, a hack is good enough for most people :)
<rickspencer3> seb128, are you concerned about the implementation of the new gdm configurator?
<seb128> rickspencer3, yes, cf my reply on the list
<seb128> it's a very hackish way to do things
<rickspencer3> list?
<seb128> ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
<TheMuso> An alternative is to allow people to mute the sound from within gdm. The volume will be saved for the gdm user, and no harm will be done once users do that.
<seb128> sorry I though you were reading this one
<rickspencer3> man, I have no recollection of that thread :/
<robert_ancell> (which was my earlier question, seb128 have you worked out a safe way of settings gdms gconf?  or are you moving to a global gconf setting only used by gdm)
 * rickspencer3 has tooooo much email
<seb128> I know the feeling ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, not really no, but changing from the greater would be easier since it runs as gdm user no?
<rickspencer3> seb128, I assume you mean "hackish" in a "can lead to bad results" way, and not in a "clever problem solving" way
<robert_ancell> seb128, oh, I see
<seb128> rickspencer3, no, I mean "running gui under gksudo when we try to move away from this model" and "doing things like system("gconftool...")"
<seb128> or rather sudo -u user gconftool --set...
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> seems fine for a universe app, and a good contribution for users who want it
<seb128> agreed
<seb128> I would like to see useful options available in the default install though
<seb128> but not really a meeting topic ;-)
<rickspencer3> seb128, right, maybe Lucid + 1
<rickspencer3> I think the meeting is over, actually
<rickspencer3> there was no other business
<seb128> I think that ought to be in lucid
<rickspencer3> seb128, well, feature freeze is in 2 days
<seb128> I will spend weekend time on it I guess if nobody gets to it first
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<seb128> it really sucks to have your computer being loud at boot in library or plane
<robert_ancell> seb128, this is an idea - we make a new gconf key "/desktop/gnome/login_mute" that is only read by gdm and set the default from gdmsetup
<seb128> it gives me a feeling of job not well done
<rickspencer3> seb128, I suppose, I don't think it's that big of a deal
<seb128> ie that was the sort of things I mentionned when we talked some days ago that I was envisioning getting fixed in a lts
<rickspencer3> well, I suppose we can treat that as a bug
<rickspencer3> no, I think the sound should be on by default
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, a _lot_ of people complain about it.  And the worst thing is PA takes so long to register the mute button that you hear it for a few seconds (in a crowded room)
<TheMuso> you only need to turn off /desktop/gnome/sound/event_sounds and the libcanberra desktop ready autostart event will not be run.
<seb128> TheMuso, right, which as you pointed is an a11y issue
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, yes, but we need to set that in gdm's gconf from another user
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: right
<seb128> TheMuso, I mean if we do it by default
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, we can't just change the whole start up experience as a bug fix to a problem that annoys us
<robert_ancell> which is easy if you are root
<TheMuso> seb128: Right, if we really want it off by default as I said, I can turn it on for a11y profile users.
<seb128> otherwise we need a gui way to set gconf keys for an another user
<rickspencer3> there must be myriad ways to turn off the start up sound
<seb128> rickspencer3, I would argue that having no sound by default and sound only in a11y profile is a better default then
<seb128> which I can get in by ff
<TheMuso> There are, but turning off /desktop/gnome/sound/event_sounds is probably the best.
<rickspencer3> seb128, no
<rickspencer3> like I said, we can't just change the startup experience like that
<rickspencer3> there are too many stake holders
<seb128> ok
<seb128> rock, hard place, us?
<rickspencer3> nice Friends reference, seb128
<seb128> it's really a show stopper for many users
<seb128> rickspencer3, ;-)
<rickspencer3> well, now they have a sweet tool that they can use to make GDM do whatever they want
<rickspencer3> and it's community contributed software, too
<seb128> if they go to universe is fetch it
<seb128> anyway I think we agree
<rickspencer3> I think we should rather focus on code defects and such
<seb128> I just with we could have fixed that by now
<seb128> but that's life
<robert_ancell> seb128, there'll be enough forum posts pointing out how to do it
<seb128> we can't get everything done
<rickspencer3> we would have if we hadn't lost robert_ancell
<rickspencer3> see robert_ancell we really miss you!
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, blame OEM, blame O-E-M!
 * seb128 hugs robert_ancell
<seb128> come back!
<seb128> we will be nice to you
<robert_ancell> seb128, that will make a change :P
<seb128> ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, if I get around to it i'll make that second gconf key patch and it will automagically work :)
<seb128> waouh
<seb128> $beers++ for you at next uds ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, did you consider those review ready for upload?
<seb128> kenvandine, or do you just want a first quick review?
<kenvandine> seb128, i wonder what that means :)
<kenvandine> bad errors?
<seb128> honest question
<kenvandine> oh... yeah... they should be ready
<seb128> libubuntuone has no COPYING
<seb128> or any license
<kenvandine> oh!
<ebartilson> hello, I have a quick problem, I have a server computer at work, when I go to install ubuntu ( any iteration)  when i click install only a dialog box appears
<kenvandine> oh... damn
<rickspencer3> ebartilson, hi
<ebartilson> i think its not allowing the CD to load into ram
<seb128> kenvandine, so I was wondering if that was just a "review the packaging they will sort licenses"
<ebartilson> How're y'all doin?!
<seb128> kenvandine, or it's that a "ups"
<kenvandine> it's in trunk
<rickspencer3> ebartilson, this channel is typically for developers working on the distro
<kenvandine> but not be in dist
<kenvandine> seb128, let me look again
<seb128> ebartilson, hi, you might want to ask on #ubuntu rather
<rickspencer3> support questions typically get answered better in #ubuntu
<kenvandine> i reviewed it before doing a source package branch import thingy
<seb128> kenvandine, ok ;-)
<kenvandine> which sucks in the tarball
<ebartilson> I'm sorry, I've tried boot and server
<rickspencer3> ebartilson, but you are sure welcome to hang out!
<ebartilson> thanks tho!
<ebartilson> ill leave the channel open thank you
<ebartilson> I haven't used an IRC client in ages!, I'm using a web based one and it sucks
<ebartilson> I feel like im not synced with any servers
<seb128> kenvandine, also
<seb128> $ grep "version 2 of the GNU Lesser" libubuntuone/* -r
<seb128> libubuntuone/syncdaemon.c: * modify it under the terms of version 2 of the GNU Lesser General Public
<seb128> libubuntuone/syncdaemon.h: * modify it under the terms of version 2 of the GNU Lesser General Public
<seb128> libubuntuone/u1-music-store.c: * modify it under the terms of version 2 of the GNU Lesser General Public
<seb128> libubuntuone/u1-music-store.h: * modify it under the terms of version 2 of the GNU Lesser General Public
<seb128> kenvandine, those are under the LGPL2
<seb128> kenvandine, which is neither in the debian copyright on in the missing COPYING
<seb128> ups
<kenvandine> it is in the copyright file
<seb128> libubuntuone/xmalloc.c: GPL (with incorrect FSF address)
<seb128> it's the other way around
<seb128> kenvandine, ^
<seb128> kenvandine, sorry, that one is under GPL and not LGPL
<kenvandine> ah... i can fix that :)
<seb128> good ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, configure.ac looks for gconf-2.0
<seb128> kenvandine, but you don't build-depends on libgconf2-dev
<seb128> dbus-glib-1 and libxml-2.0
<seb128> too
<kenvandine> i bet those aren't needed
 * kenvandine checks
<seb128> well they are using in configure
<seb128> so configure will fail if they are not there
 * TheMuso assumes the meeting is done...
<seb128> so you need to fix either configure or build-depends
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, sorry
<rickspencer3> yeah, like 20 minutes ago :/
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: np
<seb128> TheMuso, <rickspencer3> I think the meeting is over, actually about 21 minutes ago there
<seb128> ups
<seb128> I added what is after the ","
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, thanks!
<seb128> ir rather the "about 21..."
<seb128> kenvandine, right, gconf doesn't seem to be used
<seb128> libubuntuone/u1-music-store.c:#include <libxml/HTMLparser.h>
<seb128> libubuntuone/syncdaemon.c:#include <dbus/dbus-glib.h>
<seb128> kenvandine, ^ those are though
<kenvandine> this has been building in my ppa... so i would be confused if it actually fails to build
<seb128> well transitional depends
<seb128> like webkit probably triggers some
<seb128> it doesn't mean you package should rely on those
<seb128> webkit might stop doing that one day
<seb128> you should trigger what you actually need
<seb128> or pull what you need rather
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> we had quite some of those bugs when things stopped using deprecated gnome libs
<seb128> other things started failing to build because they were relying on depends to be installed by other packages which stopped doing that
<kenvandine> yeah, good practice to include what you check for :)
<seb128> kenvandine, out of the xmalloc.c GPL issues and the missing explicit build-depends it seems good ;-)
<seb128> and the lack of COPYING
<seb128> hum
<seb128> kenvandine, debian/tmp/usr/share/libubuntuone/javascript/*
<seb128> in libubuntuone-1.0-1.install
<seb128> that's also problematic
<kenvandine> ?
<seb128> library packages usually have only the library
<kenvandine> well, but those are used by the library
<seb128> you need to be able to install several soname versions together
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> damn...
<seb128> the binaries would conflict there
<kenvandine> i guess a new package it is :)
<seb128> can't you version the dir too?
<seb128> like having it follow the soname
<seb128> debian/tmp/usr/share/libubuntuone-1.0
<seb128> so if the abi change the dir change
<kenvandine> ok, that will require rodrigo to make code changes and a new release :)
<seb128> and you avoid the conflict
<kenvandine> but that is the right thing
<seb128> otherwise you need a new binary package
<kenvandine> the lib might need a specific version of the js
<seb128> right
<kenvandine> can we ship this version like this and advise him to fix it?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> just fix the license issue
<seb128> other ones can be fixed after alpha3
<seb128> the build-depends are easy to fix too while you are at it
<seb128> the versionning can wait
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> it needs to be fixed before lucid though
<kenvandine> done... just verifying all is sane in pbuilder
<seb128> good ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, also the find and delete .a and .la in rules can be dropped
<seb128> those are not installed by the .install
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> brb, session restart and I will review the other source ;-)
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, if you're still around, would you mind testing this patch: http://paste.ubuntu.com/377969/
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: sure, give me a few minutes
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<kenvandine> seb128: libubuntuone should be good
<kenvandine> seb128: libubuntuone should be good
<seb128> kenvandine, looking
<seb128> kenvandine, you need a COPYING.GPL too
<seb128> kenvandine, since you have a GPL source
<kenvandine> oh crap... yeah :)
<kenvandine> one sec
<seb128> sorry to be picky there
<kenvandine> no prob
<seb128> but if I'm not pitti will not accept those tomorrow ;-)
<kenvandine> glad upstream will be happy to accept my merge proposal :)
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> the other bzr doesn't work
<seb128> lp:~ken-vandine/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store/ubuntu
<kenvandine> oh... i blame aquarius
<seb128> is it private?
<kenvandine> aquarius, i bet cause it is stacked on your branch that had been private!
<aquarius> damn.
 * kenvandine grumbles
<aquarius> mbarnett unprivated my branch and the default setting for the project, but probably didn't do the other branches in the project. Sorry.
<aquarius> it is my fault, although in my defence the fact that you have to get a losa to fix it for you is *not* my fault :)
<kenvandine> seb128, aquarius has been battling that for a bit today :)
<seb128> so still an extra bit to go ;-)
<aquarius> my bit of advice for today: do not get a launchpad project made private. Doing so will make your life a misery later on when you change your mind.
<kenvandine> seb128, libubuntuone pushed
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: works great!
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, excellent!
<chrisccoulson> i'll get that uploaded in a few minutes
<seb128> kenvandine, sorry still one issue, debian copyright says LGPL2+ when license is LGPL2
<seb128> is the any later version should not be there
<kenvandine> all the source files say or any later version
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: sweet :)
<seb128> " * This library is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
<seb128>  * modify it under the terms of version 2 of the GNU Lesser General Public
<seb128>  * License as published by the Free Software Foundation.
<seb128> "
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: and thanks!
<kenvandine> or not
<seb128> kenvandine, libubuntuone/syncdaemon.c
<chrisccoulson> you're welcome:)
<seb128> kenvandine, ;-)
<kenvandine> ok, that is easier to fix :)
 * kenvandine has read lots of license files today :)
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> that's something that upstream tends to always get wrong for some reason
<seb128> like most of us wouldn't care about those details for some reasons ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, so the COPYING file's example text includes the "or (at your option) any later version."
<kenvandine> but since the headers don't have that, i should just make the copyright file match what's in the headers?
<rickspencer3> seb128, kenvandine is the latest pitivi in the default install atm?
<seb128> hum?
<seb128> rickspencer3, yes
<rickspencer3> thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, I fail to parse that I think
<kenvandine> seb128, the example block in that COPYING file is exactly how it is in the copyright file
<kenvandine> but the source headers don't include the "or later version" bit
<seb128> kenvandine, just delete what is after the "," in the debian copyright
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> so make it match the source headers :)
<seb128> the COPYING section you mention is " How to Apply These Terms to Your New Libraries"
<seb128> ie it's an howto about how you can do it
<seb128> if the source text dropped the "or..." do the same in the copyright
<kenvandine> seb128, pushed
 * kenvandine needs to head afk for a bit, kids are begging me for dinner :)
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, seems good now, I will get that one in by time you get up tomorrow
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> lets look at rb tomorrow :)
<seb128> kenvandine, drop me an email if you get the other one public or do a source upload somewhere
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> well, if i recreate the branch
<seb128> I will review that by time you get up
<kenvandine> it will be public
<seb128> and upload if it's good
<kenvandine> so i can do that tonight
<seb128> ok good
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> enjoy your evening
<seb128> see you tomorrow!
<rickspencer3> by seb128
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-02-17
<bryceh> rickspencer3, did you have your meeting with yingying?
<rickspencer3> bryceh, it's in 15 minutes
<rickspencer3> 'sup?
<bryceh> ah great, let me know if you need anything more
<rickspencer3> will do
<rickspencer3> I sent your bug list
<rickspencer3> otherwise, I guess we need to triage the 400+ bugs and see what's in there
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, hey
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: yo
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, so kernel freeze is approaching
<rickspencer3> is pulse and the kernel in sync atm?
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: right
<TheMuso> yes
<TheMuso> alsa userspace and kernelspace actually
<TheMuso> as in sync as they can be
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, fair enough
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> didrocks: indeed, I'll run a test with that
<RAOF> Good afternoon :)
<pitti> hey RAOF, how are you?
<RAOF> Pretty good.  Had a fun time in Tasmania over the weekend; we've put in an offer for a very nice house in West Hobart that we inspected.
<RAOF> Now I'm seeing if I can get a package for Docky build & reviewed before FF :)
<RAOF> Looking forward to talking with didrocks and seb.
<baptistemm> hello, good morning
<pitti> RAOF: oh, you'll move soon?
<RAOF> pitti: Such is the hope.  And, well, âsoonâ in real estate is about 2 months :)
<pitti> didrocks: ok, so you broke cheese?
<pitti> didrocks: hm, I actually can't replicate the problem in a chroot; no idea what the live system builders are complaining about :(
<pitti> and why it only affects the netbook CDs, not the ubuntu CDs
<pitti> oh, cheese isn't on the ubuntu CDs? why not..
<didrocks> pitti: cheese is broken? I didn't receive a FTBFS IIRC
<didrocks> morning
<pitti> didrocks: bonjour
<pitti> didrocks: I actually don't know why the livefs build fell over twice in a row :(
<pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/livefs-build-logs/lucid/ubuntu-netbook/latest/livecd-20100217-i386.out
<pitti> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<pitti>   cheese: Depends: cheese-common but it is not installable
<pitti>   libcheese-gtk17: Depends: cheese-common but it is not installable
<didrocks> hum, strange
<pitti> but it does work in an i386 lucid chroot with only main
<didrocks> right, I split the package
<pitti> ah, -common is new?
<didrocks> yes, libcheese-gtk17 too
<didrocks> rmadison tells me they are in main both
<pitti> ah, perhaps they were stuck in NEW until tonight
<didrocks> pitti: is there another way than ramdison?
<didrocks> rmadison*
<pitti> that's fine
<pitti> I'll just trigger a rebuild then
<didrocks> pitti: ok, you think cheese-common wasn't newed when the cd was building?
<seb128> hey didrocks pitti
<pitti> perhaps
<pitti> I can't think of another explanatino
<didrocks> salut seb128
<pitti> didrocks: however, no
<pitti> didrocks: then cheese wouldn't have been on that new version either
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<didrocks> hum
<pitti> meh
<pitti> g-p-m crashes on startup
<pitti> indicator patch?
<seb128> pitti, that didn't get uploaded?
<pitti> it did
<pitti> 2.29.2-0ubuntu4
<pitti> meh
<pitti> it crashes, and if you start it manually, it complains about a nonexisting property which looks like garbage
 * pitti files crash report
<pitti> ok, already filed, bug 523041
<ubottu> Bug 523041 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/523041 is private
<kklimonda> good morning
<RAOF> seb128, didrocks: Thanks for the talk.
<didrocks> RAOF: thanks to you :)
<seb128> RAOF, thank you ;-)
 * RAOF goes to wrap some chicken breast in pancetta and call it dinner.
 * seb128 goes to get some coffee
<seb128> didrocks, pitti: not sure if you have seen yesterday but gnome-keyring 2.29 is in the ubuntu-desktop ppa now...
 * didrocks goes to get some coffee too
<seb128> out of mission control not working after autologin (which might be fixed with a bugzilla change) it seems to work fine there
<didrocks> seb128: I'll give it a try
<seb128> you need to restart your session after upgrade though
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> pitti: ping me when you will be able to try a bootchart with the new "cached and serialized wallpaper". I'll work on ubiquity hook now. Also, we need to take a decision for the upgrade thing :)
<pitti> didrocks: just finished seed mangling for getting the CDs back in size
<pitti> I'll do the bootcharting now
<didrocks> pitti: shall we discuss that next week so that I can deal with all the CD bits? Just need a proper and quick introduction as each time we tried to discuss about it, we weren't able to finish :)
<pitti> didrocks: oh, it was the ubuntu CDs being overflown
<pitti> and I really have no idea about the cheese thing
<didrocks> oh ok, you are in charge of alpha3 ?
<pitti> I'll just try another build and hope
<pitti> didrocks: not primarily, but I still like our desktop CDs to work :)
<didrocks> (yes, crossing finger is always the highly and best scientific way to get things work ;))
<pitti> then again, with the current g-p-m breakage and the devkit-power/upower duplicating a new image won't be much better anyway
<pitti> and speech-dispatcher breaks CD images as well (new package is stuck in the build queue)
<pitti> seb128: I just had a look at the g-p-m indicator patch; it's veeeery brittle (not having _any_ checks for NULL/failure, or fallbacks to upstream behaviour)
<pitti> seb128: I'm that --><-- close to backing it out to restore g-p-m..
<seb128> pitti, we should land changes if we don't feel they are quality ready
<seb128> +not
<seb128> pitti, so +1 from me to backing it out
<pitti> I commented on the LP and upstream bugs where the patch was submitted
<pitti> seb128: done
<seb128> pitti, danke
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<chrisccoulson> i see gpm is broken this morning
<pitti> chrisccoulson: right, bug 523041; just reverted the patch
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523041 in udev "gnome-power-manager crashed with signal 5 in dbus_g_connection_register_g_object()" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523041
<pitti> (or, rather, disabled the configure option)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks
<chrisccoulson> i wish i'd reviewed this now
<seb128> chrisccoulson, got a cold but good otherwise, you?
<pitti> oops, /me assigns back to g-p-m
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'm not too bad. i have a bit of a headache this morning though
<chrisccoulson> i hope your cold doesn't get too bad
<seb128> get some coffee?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, the glib warning from gpm is bogus
<seb128> it's ok for now, just nose blocked on one side
<chrisccoulson> it would suggest an issue with my notify patch, but i already know that works ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you have a good night? is your gf better now?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, she's much better now thanks
<seb128> good ;-)
 * seb128 starts to think we need extra reviews for indicator changes
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i think so too
<pitti> didrocks: ok, so I downgraded gpm on my mini to get a crash-free startup (apport really spoils bootcharts)
<pitti> didrocks: I'll now do three charts with the current cache, and three charts with your new packages, and compare
<didrocks> pitti: sweet, thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you still want to sign on for reviewing this gpm change when you have a free slot?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, if so please do that ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i can take a look through that
<pitti> chrisccoulson: nevermind reviewing the current patch (I followed up upstream), it needs lots of change/love first
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: can you update liboobs to 2.29.91? there is a fix for bug 522612
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 522612 in liboobs "users-admin crashed with SIGSEGV in oobs_users_config_add_user()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/522612
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda: yeah, but it will have to wait until this evening
<chrisccoulson> please assign the bug to me
<kklimonda> ok
<kklimonda> hmm... what is the official status of users with dot in their name? I can't create one using users-admin
<tseliot> seb128: any ideas on bug #522969 ? Shall I assign it to gnome menu?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 522969 in jockey "Jockey doesn't add nvidia-xconfig (Nvidia X Server Settings) to menu after installing nvidia driver until you re-login" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/522969
<pitti> didrocks: measuring and evaluation complete, I followed up on https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=608419
<ubottu> Gnome bug 608419 in libgnome-desktop "Caching wallpaper resize to avoid some CPU cycle at startup" [Enhancement,Unconfirmed]
<didrocks> pitti: right, that was my fear
<pitti> sorry :/
<didrocks> not your fault :)
<didrocks> at least, I know know how to deserialize an image and save it to the disk ;)
<pitti> didrocks: so I think the patch should at least handle the case of an absent cache image more explicitly (the same confusion that I had also occurred with mclasen apparenlty)
<didrocks> so, I guess, I'll revert the patch, just do a little cleanage (factor the function) and release the new version with optimized quality for jpeg?
<pitti> didrocks: the multi-monitor case seemed worth discussing still
<didrocks> pitti: the first version had that and vuntz changed it, but I can came it back
<didrocks> pitti: well, it needs *tests* to know what happened exactly on those
<pitti> didrocks: so it sohuld perhaps allow more than one cache file, for different resolutions
<pitti> it will always be the same image file name, but with potentially different resolutiosn, right?
<didrocks> pitti: one for each (resolution x transformation type)?
<didrocks> that can be easy
<pitti> ah, right
<pitti> didrocks: I guess the function is just called several times for multi-monitor?
<pitti> didrocks: so I guess it just shouldn't throw away all other cached images, just the ones with differnet file names?
<didrocks> that's my guess too. But as for thumbnail there is nothing in the api that enables us to know what monitors is targeted. So, yes, saving one image for each resolution x transformation type seems to be in the spirit
<pitti> didrocks: so perhaps the ones which do not fnmatch("*_*_*_" + filename + ".cache")?
<didrocks> pitti: hum, I would rather erase all others file with the same resolution x transformation
<pitti> didrocks: right, I think it makes sense to keep the 300x300 size limit; in fact, I think with .jpg caches it makes sense to ignore all images which are below the screen size resolution
<didrocks> "if" one day, more than one image is allowed, we won't have to change this
<pitti> didrocks: that should work as well indeed
<didrocks> pitti: if we rename all fnmatch("*_*_*_" + filename + ".cache"), it won't (more than one filename)
<didrocks> if we just remove the same (*_*_*_) (resolution and transformation), we save this case
<pitti> didrocks: but then you would potentially kill caches which you need again in the next call (for a monitor with a differnet resolution)
<pitti> ah, nevermind
<pitti> I was confused
<didrocks> we will just keep it, even if it's not used
<pitti> didrocks: so, on a cache hit you just use that and do no further changes (to avoid always stat()ing the cache dir)
<didrocks> pitti: right
<pitti> and on a cache miss you do the cleanup and remove all stretch_x_y_* where * is not the current filename
<pitti> ?
<pitti> didrocks: upgrade> so, we ruled out postinst and we ruled out update-manager; let's ignore the upgrade caching for now
<didrocks> that will work with current implementation, but if one day there is the support for more than one wallpaper filename on each monitor:
<pitti> didrocks: ^ then we have to update the patch indeed
<didrocks> on cache miss, we can clean all corresponding (stretch_x_y)
<didrocks> where stretch_x_y is your current stretch and resolution
<pitti> oh, right the "where * is not the current filename" is irrelevant; we already established a cache miss
<pitti> so your's is simpler and correct
<didrocks> and will support having multiple wallpaper if done one day :)
<didrocks> we will just keep on resolution/monitor size change uneeded cache, but wellâ¦
<didrocks> I don't think we will have billions of them
<pitti> I don't understand?
<didrocks> let's say you have zoom_1024x768_foo.ppng as a cache
<didrocks> you change your monitor resolution to 1280x1024
<didrocks> the cache will create a new zoom_1280_1024_foo.png and will keep the old one
<didrocks> even if zoom_1024x768_foo.png won't be used
<pitti> ah, right
<pitti> shouldn't hurt that much
<didrocks> so, we will get some cache ununsed cache file, but as we will just have one for each (transformation x resolution), we won't have a lot of them
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> ok, I'll work on the install part too on ubiquity, shouldn't be complicated (just copy the cache file from the live user wallpaper cache directory if there weren't an existing $HOME)
<didrocks> seb128: I've tested upgrading gnome-keyring. So, I can ssh to a box and I get the prompt. I'm surprised however that I can still login into empathy and mission-control is running as you told it was broken. Can I test any other thing covered by gnome-keyring?
<seb128> didrocks, it's broken after autologin there, did you use the gdm greeter?
<didrocks> oh autologin, no, didn't try that
<seb128> didrocks, you can test seahorse (the graphical ui)
<tseliot> seb128: any ideas on bug #522969 ? Shall I assign it to gnome menu?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 522969 in jockey "Jockey doesn't add nvidia-xconfig (Nvidia X Server Settings) to menu after installing nvidia driver until you re-login" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/522969
<seb128> tseliot, oh sorry I forgot to reply to that
<seb128> tseliot, I would be surprised if there is not already some opens on gnome-panel or gnome-menus
<cassidy> hi seb128! It would be good to push latest papyon to Lucid ( https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/papyon/+bug/520699 ) it fixes some issues including this very popular crash in butterfly: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pymsn/+bug/401028
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 520699 in papyon "Please merge papyon (0.4.4-1) from debian testing" [Wishlist,New]
<tseliot> np, I thought you missed it because of some irc weirdness ;)
<seb128> tseliot, I start thinking it's a pitti's bug
<seb128> cassidy, yeah, it's on my todolist already, thanks for pointing it though ;-)
<cassidy> good good :)
<tseliot> seb128: but Jockey just installs those packages
<seb128> tseliot, I think it's due to the gnome-menus cache changes pitti did this cycle
<seb128> tseliot, reassign to gnome-menus for now
<tseliot> oh
<tseliot> ok, thanks
<seb128> np
<didrocks> seb128: ok, seahorse is working, I can see my keyring. I can't try autologin on that box as I have an encrypted home. I'll try on my crash box later if you need confirmation that it's failing :)
<seb128> didrocks, not that's ok, having confirmation it doesn't break anything you do daily on your box is good enough
<cassidy> seb128, except that most of the components are up to date : http://people.collabora.co.uk/~cassidy/tp-versions.html
<seb128> cassidy, excellent!
<seb128> cassidy, should we still stay on gabble 0.8 btw?
<cassidy> seb128, that's the safer bet for now. We are very keen on polishing it as that's the version used on the N900
<cassidy> and 0.9.x still have few regressions
<seb128> works for me
<seb128> thanks
<cassidy> I think there is a plan to branch to 0.10 soon
<cassidy> (stable branch)
<seb128> well let's revisit that when 0.10 is there
<cassidy> agreed
<pitti> seb128, tseliot: hm?
 * pitti looks at #522969
<seb128> pitti, we get an higher number of "menus don't get updated when a .desktop is installed" than usual this cycle
<seb128> pitti, gnome-menus didn't change much out of your chaching change so my first bet would be to start looking there for a potential breakage
<pitti> seb128: right, that's very proable
 * pitti keeps the tab to look into this later on
<seb128> pitti, I just sponsored libubuntuone now, can you NEW review when you have some time?
<seb128> pitti, some known issue: COPYING and COPYING.GPL in the diff.gz, we will get that fixed with next tarball but since we are in a hury for ff now...
<seb128> pitti, also there is a non versioned file installed in the library binary, that will be fixed too but likely after ff now
<seb128> I also need to talk to kenvandine about translations they are not installed now
<chrisccoulson> ooh, i should have a new desk arrive at home today
<chrisccoulson> so i can finally try my new monitor and docking station :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, getting ready to be in a comfortable work environment there? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i've got a little bit of rearranging to do
<seb128> you don't have a desk for the computer right now?
<seb128> or you just get a better one?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i've got a desk already, but it has my desktop on
<chrisccoulson> so i got another one to put the laptop on
<seb128> ah ok
<chrisccoulson> hopefully there will still be space for my coffee machine ;)
 * didrocks thinks chrisccoulson is a good candidate for testing wallpaper caching on multiple monitors :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, i can do that
<chrisccoulson> when i finally get everything set up ;)
<chrisccoulson> do you not have multiple screens?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: not, my main laptop is 17', so, it's ok to work with that
<seb128> didrocks, you don't have any computer screen?
<seb128> no desktop box?
<chrisccoulson> ah, yeah that's quite a good size
<seb128> 17" is small for daily work
<chrisccoulson> my laptop has a 15" screen, which is a bit too small for daily use
<didrocks> seb128: I have one, but no screen anymore. It was a 19' monitor, not LCD. To much space taken
 * seb128 wouldn't work on <22" anymore
<didrocks> too*
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i've got a 22" screen for my desktop, but the extra monitor for my laptop is 20"
<seb128> you need to be nice to your eyes if you spend 10 hours in front of the computer
<chrisccoulson> i hope that's not too small ;)
<chrisccoulson> my 20" monitor has the same resolution as the 22"
<seb128> and watching a laptop 15" or 17" screen is not good enough for me ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah, I guess 20" is ok too ;-)
<seb128> I just got used to work on a nice screen
<didrocks> seb128: my plan is 1. change my flat, 2. buy an LCD screen
<seb128> I would like to work on the laptop screen directly again
<seb128> +noy
<didrocks> but 2. can't be achieved with current flat :)
<seb128> +not
<seb128> can't type!
<seb128> didrocks, hehe
 * seb128 happy to not live in Paris
<seb128> here you can get space for decent price
 * didrocks really wants to come back to Lyon
<chrisccoulson> one of my former colleagues just moved to Lyon
<didrocks> good choice :-)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - do you have a lack of space in your flat then?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: right, 34m2 for 2 people is quite small. It was good when I didn't work at home, but not now :) Just waiting for few months before moving
<chrisccoulson> yeah, we're starting to run out of space now we have a baby
<chrisccoulson> and people keep buying her things too
<baptistemm> :)
<chrisccoulson> which makes it worse ;)
<RAOF> Eeep, that is small.  I'm looking forward to 120m2 of house in Hobart.
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: kind people buying stuff for the baby, what a shame ;-)
<RAOF> didrocks: And so unexpected, too! :)
<didrocks> RAOF: oh right, not the same size :)
<didrocks> heh
 * baptistemm was afraid to receive a 2 meter high Teddy bear when his child is born
<chrisccoulson> it's nice that people buy gifts for the baby, but it's not so nice trying to find space to store them all ;)
 * RAOF would imagine that would scare the child, too!
<baptistemm> RAOF, I guess it depends on the country where you live, and the place
<baptistemm> chrisccoulson, or receive gifts which plays loud music or makes lot of noise :)
<RAOF> baptistemm: Whether people give gifts for babies, or the relative size of houses, or both? :)
<baptistemm> s/receive/receiving/
<baptistemm> RAOF, I was responding about the 120mÂ² house
<baptistemm> I wont imagine how much it would cost here
<RAOF> Yeah.  That would cost like $1,000,000 in a nice suburb in Sydney.  Much, much cheaper in Hobart.
<RAOF> (Also, Hobart's nicer than Sydney)
<seb128> channel is quiet
<seb128> is anybody still there? ;-)
<didrocks> hey o/
<didrocks> I was thinking the same thing :)
<seb128> hey didrocks
<seb128> we lost pitti in a server split apparently
<seb128> I was wondering if I was on the buggy side, since apparently he can see me on the channel and replied to what I said an hour ago there but I didn't receive the reply
<didrocks> I didn't receive the reply either
<didrocks> and I don't see netsplit as I ignored the join/quit :)
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> s
<seb128> so the channel is really quiet for you ;-)
<didrocks> right :-)
<didrocks> that's why maybe I don't receive any answer on my ubiquity question on #ubuntu-devel
<seb128> that one could be because cjwatson is not working this week
<didrocks> oh, I didn't check if he was on vacation, right. I have to find it on my own so )
<didrocks> :)
<chrisccoulson> i'm still here!
<chrisccoulson> it is quiet though ;)
 * chrisccoulson waves
 * seb128 waves back
<Keybuk> seb128: I assumed the silence was the OMG IT'S FEATURE FREEZE panic
<seb128> there might be that too ;-)
<seb128> hey pitti
<pitti> o/
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> wb
<didrocks> pitti is back \o/
<seb128> wb pitti
<pitti> you are back \o/
<seb128> hehe
<pitti> didrocks: is there any method to find out whether it's slow?
<seb128> context: une
<pitti> didrocks: I'd guess glxinfo would show software rendering on those boxes?
<seb128> (for other people)
<seb128> or rather 3d une to know if 2d launcher should be used
<didrocks> pitti: right, but glxinfo is slowing the netbook-launcher start so
<pitti> didrocks: right, I'm not suggesting to actually call/grep it
<pitti> didrocks: just whether that's the class of machines that you mean
<didrocks> right, that's what I got from my test
<didrocks> so, we have either: crash or slow netbook-launcher depending on driver I guess
<pitti> didrocks: well, the "crash" case can be handled, by running -efl in the except handler?
<didrocks> pitti: the crash can happened different places depending on the driver (that's the fun part), so a wrapper would be needed in that case
<pitti> didrocks: I take it that we want to ship -efl by default on the netbook images?
<didrocks> pitti: still not decided. taking the decision to only seed -efl on arm is an option asac pointed. It was just to enable a better experience for user who don't have compositing today
<pitti> *nod*
<pitti> didrocks: n-l might to the GL call that glxinfo is doing to find out whether it's SW rendering?
<pitti> (instead of execing glxinfo | grep)
<pitti> if it uses GL, then it certainly already links to libGL anyway
<didrocks> pitti: I can ask upstream which call is needed. I'm not sure we will handle all cases, but most of them should be covered then
<pitti> const char *glRenderer = (const char *) glGetString(GL_RENDERER);
<pitti> now, that doesn't look too complex
<pitti> didrocks: ^ that's from glxinfo.c
<pitti> didrocks: seems it's right there in /usr/include/GL/gl.h
<seb128> pitti, I would  be careful before claiming that ;-)
<seb128> there is a reason why ie compiz does a zillion things to check if the config can work or not
<pitti> seb128: hence my question about whether "software renderer" accurately describes the cases where we want to run -efl
<pitti> seb128: because checking for _that_ seems easy
<seb128> right
<pitti> of course compositing != GL
<pitti> I don't know what n-l uses
<seb128> me neither
<seb128> btw other topic when you are done with this one
<pitti> but if that covers the majority of cases, it seems worthwhile checking?
<seb128> installing gnome-user-share by default ;-)
<seb128> pitti, right, agreed
<pitti> seb128: won't that pull in apache?
<didrocks> pitti: thanks, I'm checking with upstream too
<seb128> pitti, just apache-bin ;-)
 * pitti eyes the overflown CDs
<seb128> pitti, joke aside it works fine without apache, we want it for bluetooth sharing
<pitti> seb128: 3.4 MB, that's the French language pack :)
<seb128> ie being able to push files to the computer
<pitti> oh, that doesn't work through obex?
<seb128> well you need some UI to get that working no?
<chrisccoulson> we're going to patch gnome-user-share to make the webdav stuff optional
<chrisccoulson> and drop apache-bin to suggests
<seb128> pitti, run bluetooth-properties and see the receive files button
<seb128> that calls the gnome-user-share gui
<chrisccoulson> nobody got round to that yet
<pitti> seb128: I moved stuff between my old mobile and computer through the nautilus/bluetooth applet stuff; I thought that was how it's supposed to work?
<seb128> pitti, that works because your phone support browsing
<seb128> but seems quite some devices don't
<pitti> ah
<seb128> in which case you need to be able to push from the phone
<seb128> and you need something on the receiver end
<seb128> what chrisccoulson said
<seb128> I'm fine doing the change to disable the webdav share box if apache is not installed
<seb128> and moving apache to a suggests
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it seems a sane thing to do
<pitti> seb128: do you have hw to test this?
<seb128> I will let somebody else collect bonus point to do the "do you want to install apache" when checking the box
<chrisccoulson> i bet 99% of users won't really care about webdav, but want the obex push functionality
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I had expected it the other way round actually
<chrisccoulson> really? i think most people expect obex push to work, seeing as most bluetooth enabled handsets support it
<baptistemm> seb128, for gnome-user-share I did the packaging modification, but not the UI patch
<pitti> not that I'd have any kind of hard facts :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - me neither
<baptistemm> (the most of the job is to do)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: why would you push files from/to a headset?
<chrisccoulson> but having webdav optional saves around 2MB of depends
<chrisccoulson> pitti - handset (as in, cell phone) ;)
<chrisccoulson> i don't think i said headset ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, ok; I never saw that kind of device, so I'm afraid I have no real opinion about how useful it is
<seb128> pitti, I'm checking if I've some
<pitti> the last three or four mobile phones that I paired with my computer just worked with browsing
<seb128> bug we got request for it
<chrisccoulson> pitti - most cell phones i've owned support obex push (although, my G1 doesn't support it)
<pitti> so I never thought about a different method
<seb128> it seems it's common for modern phones to not be browsable
<chrisccoulson> my gf has a nokia 5800, and it supports both obex FTP and push
<pitti> . o O { modern phones just allow you to install an sftp client }
<pitti> *cough*
<chrisccoulson> pitti - on the G1?
<seb128> depends on how expensive your phone is I guess ;-)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: sure :)
<chrisccoulson> i'm running out of space on my G1 :(
<chrisccoulson> after installing sat-nav software on it
<pitti> seb128: btw, how attached are you to the "No sound is being played" part of source_totem.py apport hook?
<chrisccoulson> is there a standard way with software-center / aptdaemon etc for installing extra pacakges to provide missing functionality in a particular application?
<pitti> seb128: I thought about replacing it with something like "run apport-bug audio", so that we run the audio symptom properly and get standard bug titles, pulseaudio/codec debugging, etc.
<chrisccoulson> ie, a "Install software for WebDAV support" button
<seb128> pitti, I've no special interest in the totem apport hook, feel free to drop or replace it and change it as you want
<pitti> seb128: ok; that's my last WI for alpha-3, I'm going to do that now then :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> mvo, ^
<seb128> mvo, chrisccoulson's question about package install
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: you should get root access to your g1 and install app2sd - that's the only way to make it usable imo
<seb128> mvo, could you have a look to this one?
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda: thanks, i might try something like that
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - did you want gnome-user-share installed by default then? (for the obex support)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yes, what do you think about it?
<chrisccoulson> i think it's a good idea
<seb128> pitti, ^ any reason to not to if we drop the apache depends to suggests?
<baptistemm> how much cost the webdav dependencies on a bare ubuntu installation?
<seb128> baptistemm, some 3meg
<baptistemm> seb128, that's too much for the CD size ?
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm: there's not much space on the CD
<pitti> seb128: only thing that comes to my mind is CD space
<seb128> it's a trade off as pitti pointing, it's as much as translations for a popular locale
<seb128> ie french
<pitti> seb128: but if we don't install apache by default, it should be smaller?
<pitti> apt-get install gnome-user-share -> need to fetch 3.4 MB
<pitti> apache2.2-bin is 2.7 MB
<chrisccoulson> pitti - how much space is left? i think the only exrra thing that gnome-user-share will pull in is obex-data-server
<baptistemm> you need mod-ddnsd
<pitti> chrisccoulson: on today's image? between -4 and -7 MB
<seb128> baptistemm, not for bluetooth?
<pitti> I dropped a couple of langpacks today to get them back into size limit
<baptistemm> ah no sorry I though normal g-u-s
<pitti> (langpacks are currently unnecessarily big; we'll get a -base refresh this weekend)
<chrisccoulson> so, i don't think size is a particular issue then if we make webdav optional, and not installed by default
<pitti> so it should end up as 0.6 MB roughly?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, obexd-client you mean?
<pitti> yeah, we can fit it
<pitti> seb128: is it a daemon which starts by default?
<chrisccoulson> pitti, yeah, i think so. i can look at patching g-u-s to add a button for installing the extra packages needed for webdav
<seb128> pitti, 0.6 are mainly user documentation and translations
<baptistemm> pitti, yeap
<seb128> pitti, you will probably go lower once those packed
<chrisccoulson> it's not started if sharing is not enabled though is it?
<baptistemm> it adds a daemon on the Autostart list
<chrisccoulson> (which is the default anyway)
<pitti> couldn't that be started only once you pair with a device?
<chrisccoulson> we can make it conditionally autostart quite easily
<pitti> why run it all the time?
<baptistemm> chrisccoulson, I wonder what happen if you enableonce and disalbe afterward
<baptistemm> I guess the daemon will start, check gconf and shutdown
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm: we can do that in gnome-session
<chrisccoulson> no need to even start the daemon
<pitti> baptistemm: AutostartCondition in the .desktop file wouldn't need that
<baptistemm> sorry, I have to go, too bad I can't discuss that with you
<chrisccoulson> but i like pitti's idea of not autostarting until a device is paired
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you said "the only exrra thing that gnome-user-share will pull in is obex-data-server", but it uses obexd-client which gnome-bluetooth pull in already right?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - gnome-user-share starts obex-data-server, which is what listens to the connections
<seb128> oh
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well that is already in thanks to gvfs-backends
<seb128> so it's not something extra to install
<chrisccoulson> oh, even better then
<seb128> chrisccoulson, can I note you down for the "install apache when checking the box if required" and "start only if device is paired"?
<chrisccoulson> seb128- yeah, can do
<seb128> excellent, thanks
<seb128> pitti, do you want g-u-s to be pulled in before ff and those changes to come in the next days?
<seb128> pitti, or do you prefer to wait on those and grant ffe
<seb128> ?
<pitti> seb128: in the interest of not making the CDs explode I'd rather wait until the apache dependency is gone
<pitti> they should just barely fit now
<seb128> pitti, oh, that I would take of
<pitti> I can drop more langpacks if necessary
<seb128> +care
<pitti> seb128: as for the "install apache through GUI", no need to block on that from my POV
<seb128> I was speaking about the "install apache when activating webdav" and "start only when required"
<seb128> ok
<pitti> seb128: with AutostartCondition it should be good enough for now
<pitti> so that it doesn't punish people who aren't using it at all
<pitti> on-demand and apache-through-UI are nice polish
<seb128> ok, I will drop the apache depends, change the default to not activate sharing and use the desktop autostart condition
<pitti> seb128: does that sound reasonable to you?
<seb128> pitti, looks great to me thanks
<seb128> I will also make gnome-bluetooth recommends it once it's done
<seb128> no need to change seeds
<pitti> hmm
<pitti> not sure about recommends vs. seed, but I leave that call to you
<seb128> well +mir before
<seb128> pitti, well gnome-bluetooth has a broken button now
<pitti> ah, ok
<seb128> the preference "receive files" call g-u-s
<seb128> which fails on "no such binary"
<chrisccoulson> we'll need to at least hide/desensitize the apache related UI elements when apache is not installed, even if we don't provide an install button
<seb128> that's worth a recommends ;-)
<chrisccoulson> but an install button would be more useful :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I was thinking just unchecking the box
<seb128> and displaying a dialog when you try to check it
<seb128> "install apache"
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i don't mind. i can look at that anyway
<seb128> bonus point if that dialog let you do it
<vish> seb128: any chance of getting an update for Bug 523048 before a3 freeze?  /me knows chrisccoulson would like that ;)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523048 in humanity-icon-theme "transmission needs a monochrome icon" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523048
<vish> i also noticed that the ibus icon isnt being used , turns out app indicators use the name "ibus-keyboard" we could fix that too ?
<chrisccoulson> as long as it ends up in the ubuntu-desktop package set ;)
<seb128> kwwii, ^ vish's question
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I will do the first wave of changes to get it installed by default before ff
<seb128> chrisccoulson, and then let you clean the mess ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks. i'll work on the extra changes later on then :)
 * seb128 likes to break things and let other people fix :-p
 * pitti hugs chrisccoulson and seb128
<chrisccoulson> vish - what do you need from me for the transmission icon?
 * seb128 hugs pitti chrisccoulson
 * chrisccoulson hugs pitti and seb128
<pitti> seb128: way too often it is the other way around :/
<vish> chrisccoulson: nah , i mentioned you would like that bug fixed :)
<chrisccoulson> vish - oh, yes please :)
<pitti> yay, there goes my last a3 work item
<seb128> pitti, yeah...
<seb128> wouh
<seb128> \o/
<seb128> pitti, you rock ;-)
<pitti> and you!
<seb128> pitti, I've the bootspeed spec still on my TODO list, what should we do with it?
<pitti> seb128: this is pretty pointless, since we have an entire spec for it
<seb128> well I think the work item is coming from the blueprint milestone no?
<pitti> seb128: let me at least reassing it to the entire team, so that it's not on your personal list
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> seb128: reassigned
<pitti> seb128: I guess we can close this once we hit 4 s :)
<seb128> hehe
<pitti> or, rather, once we fix the remaining work items on desktop-lucid-startup-speed
<seb128> I guess you can postpone the xrandr one assigned to chrisccoulson too
<seb128> we have higher priority things to do
<seb128> it's a "nice to get" but not something which shows on the mini
<pitti> seb128: now you are down to one (the nm-applet one, which is "in progress")
<seb128> pitti, well it's done from my pov too
<pitti> seb128: not sure; did we ever measure its impact?
<chrisccoulson> i shall be looking at the xrandr / gnome-desktop stuff when i start looking at this gsd crash issue again
<seb128> chrisccoulson, too many things to do for you there now ;-)
<chrisccoulson> which i'm hoping i'll be able to recreate once i've got my external monitor connected up
<chrisccoulson> heh, yeah ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: now that I ran out of WIs, I'm happy to take a look at xrandr, if you want (not sure how much "attached" you got to this by now)
<seb128> pitti, I don't think we did on the mini, I get a 2 seconds "wait" on my d630 though
<chrisccoulson> pitti - feel free to. i think the delay there is probing the hardware, when gsd initially calls gnome_rr_screen_new
<chrisccoulson> i'm sure the delay is XRRGetScreenResources
<seb128> pitti, nm-applet what do you recommend to do? I'm done with the change, we can get it uploaded or wait for upstream comments, it's in bugzilla and in the daily n-m ppa I think
<seb128> pitti, or asac said he would ping somebody to get it in the daily builds
<seb128> so the wi can be closed or move to beta-1 and closed when we upload
<seb128> imho
<pitti> seb128: if you are happy with it, feel free to upload; it doesn't change anything on the user's home or so, so we can always replace it with something better if upstream has comments
<pitti> (or coordinate upload with asac)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> asac, ^ can you get nm-applet uploaded if you review the change and are happy with it? or should I be doing that?
<asac> seb128: i can add it
<asac> seb128: are you happy with it now?
<asac> (you said you wanted to change a few things still)
<pitti> oh, I'll also have a look at the nautilus-share plugin
<pitti> it still takes .53 s to initialize
<pitti> but before that, I'll take a break
<seb128> asac, I pinged you 15 minutes after than with the debdiff on my people webpage
<seb128> asac, there is just a distro patch which needed to be updated too
<asac> hmm ... seems that ping slipped
<asac> ok got it
<kenvandine> pitti, thx for reverting the g-p-m patch, i'll talk to those guys to get it cleaned up
<kenvandine> seb128, don't we want rhythmbox-plugins installed by default?
<asac> seb128: it still has different indentation style
<seb128> kenvandine, rhythmbox recommends those
<kenvandine> i didn't get it in my upgrade
<asac> +-      ICON_LOAD(applet->wwan_icon, "nm-device-wwan");
<asac> +-      ICON_LOAD(applet->vpn_lock_icon, "nm-vpn-active-lock");
<asac> ++    g_return_val_if_fail (name != NULL, FALSE);
<kenvandine> i didn't dist-upgrade i guess
<seb128> asac, oh, I forgot to fix that, let me 2 minutes I will do it now
<asac> thanks
<asac> just give me the patch
<kenvandine> seb128, so i need to make the u1music store plugin depend on that instead :)
<asac> i have to fiddle with changelog anyway as we are already ahead
<asac> will use your comments and give credits to you ;)
<seb128> asac, ok
<seb128> kenvandine, libubuntuone is blocked on discussion with pitti btw
<kenvandine> oh, what's up with it?
<seb128> kenvandine, he would prefer to get the library having conflict files and licenses not in upstream tarball fixed before upload
<seb128> kenvandine, also you don't install the .defs not sure if it's required not the translations
<kenvandine> seb128, ok... i'll try to track down rodrigo asap
<seb128> not->nor
<seb128> usually you need a -common for translations
<seb128> but with ubuntu language pack you can probably spare this one
<seb128> you might want to do one anyway
<seb128> and move the non versions js dir there
<kenvandine> seb128, i'll talk to rodrigo, but i think versioning the js files is a good thing
<seb128> right
<kenvandine> i can imagine if you have multiple versions of the lib installed, they will depend on features in the javascript
<kenvandine> aquarius emailed rodrigo about it
<aquarius> *nod* I'm not sure where rodrigo is today :(
<kenvandine> yeah... i've been looking for him :)
<aquarius> ah, he's got a swap day today, according to the holiday calendar. that's inconvenient.
 * kenvandine is going to have a long day... i can feel it
<kwwii> seb128, vish: sorry, I was out to lunch
<kenvandine> kwwii, so the empathy theme, i should do that in a new package and make the ubuntu-art package depend on it right?
<kwwii> vish: send me an email with the issues and I can see that things get fixed
<vish> kwwii: sure.
<kenvandine> kwwii, should it have a separate project?  i am mostly wondering where to keep the source :)
<hyperair> hmm what's up with nautilus-share?
<kenvandine> aquarius, does the u1music rb plugin add that "musicstore" entry in the treeview?
<aquarius> kenvandine, yes
<kenvandine> aquarius, shouldn't that be more "U1" specific?
<kenvandine> it is kind of vague... no caps and one word
<kenvandine> just to be a critic :)
<aquarius> kenvandine, the entry should say "Ubuntu One". which treeview do you mean? the rb sidebar?
<kwwii> kenvandine: it would be best to have it in it's own package, ideally, because it is not part of the empathy source (I assume)
<kenvandine> under library
<seb128> asac, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/nm-applet.patch
<kwwii> kenvandine: and you can put it in the ~ubuntu-art-pkg team
<kenvandine> kwwii, yeah... but can the source live under ubuntu-art somewhere?
<kwwii> kenvandine: or you can send it to me and I can take care of that
<aquarius> kenvandine, ah, yeah
<kenvandine> or is it best to create a full LP project for it
<kenvandine> aquarius, so that is your fault?
<kwwii> kenvandine: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-art-pkg/ is fine
<aquarius> kenvandine, I'm not sure that that's fixable (it's the folder name of the library), but I'll look into it
<seb128> kwwii, nothing to be sorry about ;-)
<kwwii> ;)
<kenvandine> aquarius, really?
<seb128> kwwii, can you merge the fix vish mentionned so I can sponsor that to lucid
<kwwii> seb128: yes, I'll get the details from him and take care of it
 * vish doing it^ as we speak
<aquarius> kenvandine, I can always rename the folder, perhaps
<seb128> kwwii, thanks
<kwwii> vish: thanks, hit me up when you'redone
<kenvandine> kwwii, that is more ownership though... what LP project should it be associated with?
<kenvandine> aquarius, so right now "Music" expands to have 2 sub items in the tree, "Music" and "musicstore"
<kenvandine> seems those should have proper labels and translatable
<kenvandine> note i have not looked at the rb source for that :)
<kwwii> kenvandine: something like ubuntu-empathy-theme or such
<kenvandine> kwwii, ok
<aquarius> kenvandine, I add a second library (the music store folder); under Music, it then names the two folders that are libraries
<kenvandine> ok... so it is purely a folder name... no way to label them?
<kenvandine> oh well
<kenvandine> perhaps something more u1 specific then :)
<aquarius> kenvandine, that's what I think
<aquarius> I can rename the folder though
<kenvandine> aquarius, i think it should be something more like Purchased
<kenvandine> or U1 Purchased, etc
<aquarius> kenvandine, agreed
<kenvandine> aquarius, thx :)
<kenvandine> aquarius, not that i don't LOVE the u1music store :)
<seb128> asac, updated version should fix all the tab against space and trailling space issues
<desrt> seb128: looks like a decent chance that the patch will go upstream
<seb128> desrt, the nm-applet one?
<desrt> no.  eog one
<desrt> for this cycle
<seb128> ah, sorry I was on wrong context
<seb128> you rock, thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, how is f-spot editing going?
<desrt> well, it raise a question, though:
<desrt> are you happy with the current "distributor" interface?
<seb128> kenvandine, desrt got the eog "add edit button" part done
<desrt> ie: patch here and here
<seb128> desrt, well I'm not so sure why you don't want an edit by default upstream? is that because GNOME has no image editor?
<desrt> seb128: yes.  exactly.
<seb128> desrt, but yeah, the change is trivial to be a non issue
<kenvandine> desrt, adding editing to eog?
<kenvandine> seb128, i have the patch backported to our version
<kenvandine> but it is crashy
<kenvandine> and i ended up getting no work done on it yesterday
<desrt> kenvandine: no.  remember from dallas we decided that we'd add a "edit image" button to eog that opened the f-spot editor?
<kenvandine> hoping to do more today
<kenvandine> oh... just launching :)
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> seb128, but it is no more crashy than what sde did in his branch of master
<seb128> when does it crash?
<kenvandine> it crashes on the actions that does live updates of the preview
<kenvandine> so crop, red-eye, etc works
<seb128> ok, so sort of common actions
<seb128> not really a corner case situation
<kenvandine> yeah
<desrt> that's really a better thing
<kenvandine> the hack would be to disable the other actions when in view mode :)
<kenvandine> but upstream would never accept that
<kenvandine> the fix is to figure out why it is blowing up :)
<desrt> if you can't fix it, release it with the crashes into alpha 3
<desrt> someone else will fix it.  guaranteed. :)
<kenvandine> seb128, i can make it work in either browse or view mode, not both :)
<kenvandine> i need to talk to sde, but he wasn't around when i was working on it
<kenvandine> seb128, there is also an issue with saving files and no undo
<seb128> kenvandine, rubenv said he started a job 2 weeks ago or so
<kenvandine> f-spot does commits as you do things
<seb128> he = sde
<kenvandine> without a separate save call
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> hey tedg
<kenvandine> so as soon as you do something, it is saved
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> and there is no concept of undo, f-spot depends on you having an original version in the library
<seb128> seems we have a packaged agenda for the week
<seb128> let's keep moving and get things in order
<kenvandine> maybe i'll just talk to rubenv
<seb128> can you dump your f-spot work in a bug or in bzr so other people can review it?
<seb128> and move back to libubuntuone for now
<kenvandine> sure, it is in bzr already
<seb128> let's get that done
<seb128> then we can come back to f-spot
<kenvandine> yeah, that is higher in my queue :)
<seb128> seems you will have a busier end of week than me
<seb128> I can cover for dxteam updates tomorrow if required
<kenvandine> which is why i didn't touch it yesterday... i also have a couple sfts things to finish
<kenvandine> seb128, if you could... that would rock...
<seb128> ok, done
<kenvandine> excellent
<kenvandine> seb128 is my hero
 * seb128 hugs kenvandine
<seb128> that's team work ;-)
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> seb128, know anything about generating API docs for dbus interfaces?
<seb128> no
<seb128> but I'm sure Keybuk or tedg or pitti do ;-)
<kenvandine> google isn't very helpful
<tedg> kenvandine: We're using doxygen for dbusmenu.
<tedg> kenvandine: He's not in this channel, but that was all agateau's work.
 * kenvandine wants to use epydoc if possible
<kenvandine> since that is what i am using for the python docs
 * tedg assumes that epydoc is some way to generate docs but not know if they're actually generated correctly until users take multiple choice tests to see if they understood them.
<pitti> re
<seb128> wb pitti
<kenvandine> hey pitti!
<pitti> hey kenvandine
<seb128> pitti, so what did you consider things that should be fixed before upload for libubuntuone
<seb128> ?
<seb128> let's make sure we agree on what needs to be done
<seb128> so we keep moving there
<pitti> seb128: just talking to Ken about that
<seb128> ok
<pitti> the orig tarball needs a license (that should be simple?)
<pitti> and the library mustn't ship a non-library file, at least not in a non-versioned dir
<seb128> I'm never sure how flexible we can be about that
<seb128> ie if that's fine to have in the diff.gz until a new tarball upload
<pitti> well, it'll bite us once we have a version bump, won't it?
<seb128> I was speaking about the license
<pitti> seb128: for stuff where we are upstream we could be more liberal about it, of course
<seb128> the non versioned dir right
<pitti> at the same time it's rather easy to fix; we can just repack the orig.tar.gz
<seb128> I just think it's going to be fixed in a few days timeframe since we are upstream for it
<seb128> and we will not likely see a soname change so soon
<seb128> or abi version change
<seb128> but right, if we have an ffe we can as well get those sorted before upload
<pitti> so is it hard to ship it in /usr/lib/ubuntuone/1/ or so?
<kenvandine> well it might require code changes in how it loads the javascript
<kenvandine> i wanted to talk to rodrigo about it
<kenvandine> but he is out
<seb128> I would expect it's a one liner change in the code
<seb128> no?
<kenvandine> probably... but i haven't looked and figure as long as we make sure it gets fixed soon it shouldn't block getting the initial version out
<seb128> right, that's what I said before, it should not be an issue we will get that fixed soon and before any abi change for sure
<pitti> it's uploading things which will explode in our face when we forget about them
<pitti> that's why I didn't new it yet
<kenvandine> it is an easy fix... perhaps a distro patch?
<kenvandine> hang on... let me talk to statik :)
<pitti> for now we could just patch the path in the source (append an /1 dir) and ship the file there?
<pitti> or 0 if the soname is 0
<kenvandine> maybe i can get it into the tarball
<vish> kwwii: merge awaiting approval :)
<pitti> similar to /usr/lib/evince/2 or /usr/lib/indicators/3
<kenvandine> right
<kenvandine> but should it be in libdir or datadir?
<pitti> kenvandine: depends whether the file is arch dependent or not
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> datadir
<pitti> (I don't know at all what the file is about)
<kenvandine> it's just javascript
<seb128> pitti, some .js
<seb128> ie text files
<pitti> ah, /usr/share/ is fine then (datadir)
<kwwii> vish: cool, I'll take care of it in a bit
<seb128> where they are is fine, just version the dir
<kenvandine> pitti, seb128: ok i proposed a branch to statik that installs the js in a versioned dir
<kenvandine> he should get that into the release he is doning
<kenvandine> doing
<seb128> good
<kwwii> seb128: I pushed my changes to lp:~ubuntu-art-pkg/humanity/release
<seb128> kwwii, ok, looking
<mvo> chrisccoulson: there is a interface for this with aptdaemon, here is a example: http://paste.ubuntu.com/378395/
<seb128> chrisccoulson, pitti: I've uploaded gnome-user-share, just moved things to suggests
<chrisccoulson> mvo - thanks. i'll take a look at that later
<pitti> \o/
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - cool, thanks :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, pitti: the sharing is off by default and the binary just exit when that's the case so I didn't do the autostart condition
<pitti> that still requires loading, linking, and running the binary then?
<seb128> yes
<chrisccoulson> that's ok. i will convert it to an autostart condition soon
<seb128> not trivial
<seb128> some people might have webdav sharing one but not bluetooth
<seb128> some bluetooth and not webdav
<seb128> I would rather suggest add a delay key if the binary loading is an issue
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's true. i can merge both of those options in to a single gconf key though, which gnome-session can use to trigger the autostart
<seb128> sharing can start 15 seconds in the session
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that should be ok
<rickspencer3> woah, trend line is looking ok!
<rickspencer3> http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/canonical-dx-team-lucid-alpha-3.html
<rickspencer3> pitti, nice ^
<pitti> :)
<rickspencer3> pitti, didrocks I thought we were going to move the 2d/3d detection stuff into bugs
<pitti> we can push those WIs out to beta-1 for my sake
<didrocks> ok, I have an app which just print a string (n-l or n-l-efl) depending on you driver. I'm not sure about the licensing as most piece come from glxinfo. Can I just pastebin somewhere to ensure you have the right choice?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: right, I just begin them
<pitti> didrocks: please don't
<didrocks> and need to test the caching copy on ubiquity
<didrocks> pitti: ?
<pitti> didrocks: I mean, don't make a separate app; just add it as a patch to n-l itself
<didrocks> pitti: and so, n-l will launch n-l-efl?
<pitti> it's 10.000 times more expensive to run another program than to just run a libGL function
<pitti> didrocks: I thought that was the idea?
<didrocks> pitti: ok, it's just that it's not just one line function, there is something like 100 lines for init before I can make the call
<pitti> didrocks: ah, so what things do you have to test for?
<didrocks> pitti: we have to get a screen, init some GL stuff on it, get some GL stuff like having the right Visual mode
<pitti> didrocks: as for your original question, if its' copy&paste from glxinfo code, keep its license and copyright
<didrocks> pitti: that's why it took me one hour for that :)
<didrocks> I just try to clean as much as possible to only have the needed initilisation
<pitti> didrocks: it doesn't give you the renderer without initializing a GL screen? d'oh
<didrocks> pitti: right
<didrocks> :/
<didrocks> it segfaults nicely
<pitti> didrocks: so, just add the glxinfo copyright to n-l's copyright then?
<pitti> depending on whether it was a copy&paste, or basically new code since you threw it around so much
<didrocks> pitti: from 1000+ lines, we got down to ~80
<didrocks> (from glxinfo)
<seb128> pitti, how busy are you still today?
<pitti> seb128: currently catching up on SRU (ETA ~ 1 hour), phone call with Rick
<seb128> pitti, ideally we would need gnome-user-share mir review and mako (rhythmbox uses python-mako for it's contextpane option)
<pitti> seb128: but if there's something urgent I can drop SRUs
<seb128> I will write the mirs
<pitti> seb128: can do
<seb128> not sure if we want those promoted by ff
<pitti> seb128: well, there's not much to write, just a lot to check :)
<seb128> pitti, right
<pitti> seb128: mako is a nuisance
<seb128> pitti, python-mako Recommends python-beaker too which is in universe too
<pitti> mako depends beaker depends sqlalchemy
<seb128> but I think that would be turned to a suggest
<seb128> would -> could
<pitti> seb128: at least the beaker -> sqlalchemy dep should be dropped
<seb128> pitti, it seems beaker is used for caching
<seb128> but I doubt rhythmbox requires that
<seb128> oh
<seb128> pitti, python-mako is a gwibber depends too
<seb128> we will need it promoted anyway
<pitti> right, those names rang a bell
<vuntz> chrisccoulson: did you have time to update the gnome-session autostart-delay patch?
 * vuntz wonders if it might still be possible to push it in
<chrisccoulson> vuntz - i've not had any time to do any more work on it for the last week or so. i still intend to finish it, but i'm struggling to find time at the moment
<kenvandine> seb128, libu1 updating coming in a few :)
<kenvandine> s/updating/update
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> seb128, ok, lp:~ken-vandine/libubuntuone/packaging
<kenvandine> whoops
<kenvandine> wait
<kenvandine> seb128,  lp:~ken-vandine/libubuntuone/ubuntu
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> seb128, and you should have access to lp:~ken-vandine/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store/ubuntu now
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, trying in a minute
<seb128> kenvandine, do you know how those .js are used btw?
<kenvandine> the library uses them in the webkit webview
<kenvandine> i don't think things outside libubuntuone should load them
<seb128> ok, so webkit
<kenvandine> yup
<seb128> no need to have a js engine installed like gjs or libmozjs
<kenvandine> i assume
<seb128> kenvandine, you still don't have the .defs and translations installed
<seb128> I guess the .defs should go to the python binary
<seb128> and you can install the translations in the library
<seb128> they will be langpacked anyway
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> seb128, fixing
<kenvandine> anything else?
<seb128> no
<kenvandine> great :)
<kenvandine> +debian/tmp/usr/share/locale/*
<seb128> pitti, any opinion on where translations should go? in the library based on the fact that it will be stripped for langpacks?
<kenvandine> is that good for the translations?
<seb128> I don't fancy adding a -common which will be empty when those are moved to langpacks
<pitti> seb128: ok for me, if it gets rebuilt after promotion, or NEWed straight to main
<pitti> (the latter is probably okay)
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, go for it
<kenvandine> ok, one sec
<kenvandine> seb128, pushed
<seb128> kenvandine, ok
<seb128> kenvandine, uploaded
<kenvandine> excellent, thx seb128!
<seb128> pitti, libubuntuone updated sent your wait for NEW review if you still want to review it
<seb128> kenvandine, np, store next ;-)
<kenvandine> hehe :)
<seb128> kenvandine, I can confirm access issue has been fixed now
<kenvandine> cool
<seb128> kenvandine,
<seb128> "Depends: ${misc:Depends},
<seb128>  ${python:Depends}${misc:Depends},
<seb128>  ${python:Depends},
<seb128> "
<seb128> kenvandine, spot the error ;-)
<kenvandine> crap... why doesn't that blow up?
<seb128> kenvandine, do you need other rhythmbox plugins for the store to work?
<kenvandine> the python one
<kenvandine> pushed
<seb128> kenvandine, that one is easier to review ;-)
<seb128> "binary-predeb/rhythmbox-ubuntu-music-store::
<seb128>         rm -rf debian/$(cdbs_curpkg)/usr/share/pyshared*"
<seb128> why that?
<seb128> that seems hackish
<kenvandine> well, i couldn't find a better way not to include useless files
<seb128> kenvandine, upstream issue but the rb-plugin should have a .in
<kenvandine> this isn't a python library
<seb128> so it can get translated
<kenvandine> good point... aquarius ^^
<seb128> the .in usually have _Name
<aquarius> happy to do that if you can explain what it means. :)
<seb128> _Name=...
<seb128> _Description=...
<seb128> and lists that in the POTFILES.in usually
<seb128> look at how rhythmbox is doing it maybe
<kenvandine> aquarius, it parses the .in and generates the .plugin file
<seb128> right now the name can't be translated
<seb128> anyway not an issue for the upload
<seb128> kenvandine, that one seems good to me, I test build and will upload
<kenvandine> seb128, thx :)
<seb128> kenvandine, do you have an @ubuntu.com email?
<kenvandine> i do
<seb128> can you use that for the maintainer?
<kenvandine> sure
<seb128> in the control
 * kenvandine changes
<seb128> it will avoid build breaking due to the lack of XSBC-Original-Maintainer:
<seb128> tools don't like ubuntu revision without XSBC-Original-Maintainer
<kenvandine> seb128, pushed
<didrocks> \o/ the 2D/3D netbook-launcher selection works (at least, with my hardware with and without rendering)
<didrocks> my last WI about ubiquity copy wallpaper cache is written, just testing it right now :)
<seb128> kenvandine, should the store be on by default?
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> it's not there
<kenvandine> that will require a patch to rb
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> should in that sense then ;-)
<kenvandine> yup :)
<kenvandine> needed to get this uploaded first :)
<seb128> can't you just ship a gconf key with the store package?
<kenvandine> aquarius, ^^
<aquarius> seb128, I'm going to, but not yet
<kenvandine> seb128, i think it is a single key with a list of enabled plugins
<kenvandine> or something
<kenvandine> aquarius, oh? ok... i thought you had said you couldn't do that
<seb128> usually it's /apps/rhythmbox/plugins/<naming>/active
<aquarius> kenvandine, I...believe it's doable, based on research, but I haven't actually tried it yet
<kenvandine> aquarius, now would be a good time to figure that out :)
 * kenvandine looks at clock
<aquarius> I don't have to do that before feature freeze, do I?
<aquarius> if I do, then everyone running lucid will get the store enabled, and when they click on it it'll say "The music store isn't available yet".
<kenvandine> aquarius, so?
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> $ gconftool --set /apps/rhythmbox/plugins/umusicstore/active  --type bool true
<aquarius> I planned to enable it for everyone automatically once we've got some beta testing done
<seb128> kenvandine, ship a .gconf-defaults in the debian dir with that line
<seb128>  /apps/rhythmbox/plugins/umusicstore/active true
<kenvandine> seb128, ok
<seb128> that should work
<kenvandine> aquarius, i would say that is a feature ...
<aquarius> ok...
 * kenvandine tests
<kenvandine> seb128, i guess i need to add a gconf dep too?
<kenvandine> or is that implied ?
<aquarius> surely rhythmbox already depends on gconf?
<kenvandine> yes
<seb128> oh good point
<kenvandine> just making sure i don't need to do it as well in the package :)
<seb128> we might want to do it in rhythmbox
<aquarius> seb128, you'd rather that everyone got a music store which says "The music store is under development, please be patient", rather than didn't get it at all?
<seb128> aquarius, no, I just realized it was doing that now
<seb128> I'm doing review and first run now
<seb128> I never tried befor
<aquarius> I'm trying to minimise the amount of disappointed looks I'll get from people who say "wahey! music store!" and then don't get it :)
<seb128> I was expecting to have a working store by now ;-)
<seb128> right
<kenvandine> haha... by alpha3 :)
<seb128> just happened there :p
<kenvandine> aquarius promised :)
<seb128> well I've seen things during the sprint which looked nice
<seb128> not a one line label ;-)
<aquarius> seb128, it is working, if you've got all the pieces in place, but I'm terrified that there might be bugs I haven't yet come across which will cause people to buy music but then not get it. Which would be a crushingly bad first impression.
<seb128> yeah, fair enough
<seb128> I'm not judging
<aquarius> which is why I want to get my betatest group to try it first before I open it to the world of twitter feedback :P
<seb128> better to take your time until you feel good about it
<seb128> in any case the package seems good for lucid upload
<seb128> it's just sort of useless :p
<kenvandine> ok, so i will hold off on the gconf setting :)
<kenvandine> i added it to the package... but won't upload :)
<kenvandine> ken
<kenvandine> mko09i8u
<kenvandine> ls
<kenvandine> df -h .
<kenvandine> ps
<kenvandine> top
<kenvandine> Mqps auxww|grep guest
<kenvandine> Mqps auxww|grep gdm
<didrocks> asac: JamieBennett: now that I have an embryonary working 2D/3D selector in netbook-launcher, can you please remove the uneeded C/R against netbook-launcher? (no file in common from what I saw)
<didrocks> (in n-l-efl)
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine: focus issue there?
<seb128> kenvandine, did you just copy a password there?
<seb128> james_w, hey
<seb128> james_w, can you move lp:~ubuntu-desktop/libubuntuone/ubuntu to lp:ubuntu/libubuntuone?
<james_w> seb128: done if you want to confirm
<seb128> james_w, confirm how?
<seb128> just there?
<seb128> yes I confirm ;-)
<seb128> thanks
<Sarvatt> chrisccoulson: weren't you hitting this bug? are you able to see if the patch works for you? http://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=14997
<ubottu> bugzilla.kernel.org bug 14997 in Video(DRI - Intel) "Closing and re-opening the lid does not reactivate the backlight" [Normal,New]
<seb128> james_w, lp:~ubuntu-desktop/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store/ubuntu too if you can ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, ^ sponsored too now
<james_w> is that the package name too?
<seb128> james_w, yes
<seb128> james_w, thanks!
<james_w> it apparently needs to at least hit NEW or something
<chrisccoulson> Sarvatt: yeah, i get that bug too
<james_w> there we go
<james_w> we're too efficient ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i won't be able to check if the patch works for me this evening though. i've already got quite a bit to do
<seb128> james_w, hehe ;-)
<Sarvatt> no worries, as soon as I see it go upstream I'll let ya know incase you want to try a mainline kernel out to see if it fixes it and bug the kernel people about backporting it if so :)
<Sarvatt> i cant reproduce it but i've seen you mention having the problem before
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i can reproduce it every time i close the lid
<chrisccoulson> i have to make sure i don't do it by accident ;)
<chrisccoulson> right, home time
<chrisccoulson> bbiab
<pitti> seb128: looking (libu1)
<seb128> pitti, danke
<kenvandine> seb128, thx
<kenvandine> seb128, i did just notice in the rb plugin, that rm -rf debian/$(cdbs_curpkg)/usr/share/pyshared isn't getting run
<kenvandine> s/rhythmbox-ubuntu-music-store/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store fixes it
<kenvandine> suffered from a package rename :)
<kenvandine> not a big deal, the files are harmless
<kenvandine> but noise
<kenvandine> i'll have the fix in the next upload :)
<seb128> pitti, bug #523310 btw for the record
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523310 in gnome-user-share "[MIR] gnome-user-share" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523310
<baptistemm> \./
<pitti> seb128, kenvandine: libubuntuone NEWed; do you want to upload a new version of rb-u1-music-store?
<baptistemm> seb128, I saw you did the Suggest change, thanks
<kenvandine> pitti, nah... it is fine
<pitti> in other words, should I reject the current upload, or look at it?
<seb128> baptistemm, np
<pitti> seb128: will look at the MIR after NEWing
<seb128> pitti, look at it, it's a detail
<kenvandine> i just was removing some junk but it is harmless...
<seb128> urg
<seb128> 45 mirs waiting
<kenvandine> urg
<baptistemm> huuu
<kenvandine> :)
<baptistemm> go go go
<seb128> and there is no gwibber etc there yet
<kenvandine> ?
<seb128> kenvandine, didrocks: who is supposed to do that one?
<kenvandine> didrocks was working it
<pitti> kenvandine: btw, we shuold use python-support these days
<kenvandine> i thought he finished it yesterday
<seb128> kenvandine, gwibber needs a mir no?
<pitti> seems that Debian converges on that one
 * didrocks is overloaded :)
<pitti> the MIR WI is assigned to kenvandine  ATM
<seb128> didrocks, welcome to the club
<kenvandine> pitti, yeah... didrocks had started it and volunteered to finish it off :)
<seb128> didrocks, kenvandine is overloaded too ;-)
<didrocks> I guess it just needs to update the dep with last gwibber (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MainInclusionReportGwibber)
<pitti> ok, feel free to reassign it to didrocks then
<seb128> didrocks, we moved away from using wiki paperwork for mir btw
<kenvandine> didrocks, yeah... and subscriber the mir team
<seb128> didrocks, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MainInclusionProcess
<kenvandine> seb128, oh?
<seb128> kenvandine, ^
<seb128> it was discussed on u-d list
<seb128> and announced on the announce list
<seb128> you just need to open a bug and list point you checked which were problematic
<seb128> not to write all the "checked that <...> is done correctly"
<pitti> well, it's of course still _allowed_ to write a wiki page
<seb128> point -> the points
<asac> didrocks: sure
<didrocks> seb128: oh, from last note, I didn't see there was an agreement on that
<pitti> if you prefer the template as a checklist
<seb128> asac, got nm-applet uploaded yet? ;-)
<kenvandine> good :)
<seb128> didrocks, kenvandine: one of you is going to do the mako mir I guess?
<asac> seb128: thought it wasnt urgent
<didrocks> pitti: the checklist is almost done
<didrocks> pitti: just need to update with last kenvandine's changes
<pitti> team spirit! :-)
<seb128> asac, not really urgent no, it's my remaining alpha3 item ;-)
<seb128> asac, I just though you said you were about to do it
<seb128> asac, no hurry ;-)
<asac> when i said that i was waiting for the second revision ;)
<asac> anyway let me pull it
<asac> odd ... didnt you also have a debdiff?
<asac> i wanted to take the comment from that ;)
<seb128> asac, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/nm-applet.debdiff
<seb128> asac, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/nm-applet.patch
<seb128> the patch is lazily_load_icons.patch updated to fix spacing issues
<seb128> I forgot to rename it before scping
<asac> yes
<asac> no its great ;)
<pitti> seb128: would you mind seeding rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store into desktop?
<seb128> pitti, I was going to make rhythmbox recommends it rather
<seb128> pitti, but as you prefer
<pitti> but that wouldn't be true
<pitti> RB works perfectly without it
<pitti> I think that's the kind of top-level desktop feature that should be seeded
<seb128> good point
<seb128> is it ready for that?
<seb128> right now it only displays a one line label
<pitti> seb128: oh, if it's still broken, nevermind
<seb128> well not broken
<seb128> just "not activated"
 * pitti leaves in universe then
<seb128> they fear bugs which lead to have people paying and not getting what they paid for ;-)
<seb128> so it's not on by default yet
<pitti> ok, so let's have it mature a bit in universe for now
<pitti> seb128: libubuntuone is in main now (with my MIR hat on); trivial MIR case, anyway
<pitti> and we need it to get the translations right
<kenvandine> pitti, aquarius, seb128: but the plan is on the CD for alpha3 :)
<seb128> kenvandine, no point of putting it on the CD if it displays that one line label imho
<aquarius> seb128, it won't display that by alpha 3. By alpha 3 it'll work. Perfectly. For everybody.
<kenvandine> it's a feature deliverable for alpha3
<aquarius> :-)
<kenvandine> both ends... so aquarius: get to testing :)
<seb128> will it need code changes? or server changes?
<kenvandine> just the gconf key
<kenvandine> rest is all server side
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> which is why i think we should just enable it now
<seb128> ok, let's get it to main then
<aquarius> assuming that there are no bugs in it at all, it will need a couple of code changes to turn off the no-music-store-for-you page and let everyone get at it, and the gconf key. The rest is all server.
<seb128> pitti, I will look into that in a bit, I didn't touch seeds since they have been reorganized, ie for cycles
<aquarius> Assuming that there are no bugs is pretty ambitious of me, mind :-)
<seb128> pitti, so I need to check how that's working now, but after finishing my other ff tasks
<seb128> kenvandine, ^ see the "couple of code changes to"? ;-)
<asac> ok committed it (appended)
<pitti> seb128: no different than ages ago; just add it to "desktop" in () parentheses (for "recommend") in lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu.lucid
<seb128> pitti, ok thanks
<kenvandine> aquarius, ?  i thought that was automatic... /me grumbles :)
<aquarius> kenvandine, at the moment, you have to specify a magic environment variable to get past the "no music store for you" page; that page is served locally, not from the server.
<aquarius> so we'll take out the line that checks for the magic envar
<kenvandine> yeah... i know... but i thought if you didn't specify it you got that from the server
<kenvandine> we could leave that line... but let it work if you don't specify it and it is live
<kenvandine> so without that check, it doesn't even try to talk to the server?
<kenvandine> or rather, with that check but the magic env not set?
<seb128> pitti, desktop seeds recommends rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store now
<pitti> ah, good
<pitti> merci
<seb128> de rien
<kenvandine> aquarius, can we get the code changes in so it is more dynamic when the store is available?
<seb128> pitti, sorry for all the pings today, ff is a crazy time ;-)
<pitti> seb128: no worries, I understand; it's just FF time :)
<kenvandine> hehe... yeah it is :)
<aquarius> kenvandine, um...you mean you want me to block stuff on the server? the problem with that is that it's quite easy to override the "no music store for you" page on the client: just set an envar. It's quite hard on the server, because I'd have to have the beta-test group go to different URLs (which were available to betatesters), and then I won't be testing what will actually be live, if you see what I mean
<kenvandine> but the beta testing is on edge, right?
<aquarius> yes...?
<kenvandine> so with the env set, it talks to edge properly... yada yada
<kenvandine> with the env, the prod server could do a proxy or redir or something to a "not avail" page
<kenvandine> i guess it is late to be designing that ;)
<kenvandine> and aren't those checks actually in libu1?
<aquarius> the checks are in libu1, yeah
<seb128> aquarius, kenvandine: no need to argue now, get the thing working and let's do the code changes on monday next week
<kenvandine> yeah, so that means another release of libu1 and rb plugin
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> so you still have some testing time
<seb128> kenvandine, distro patches will do
<kenvandine> seb128, just making sure we have a good plan
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> yeah, I'm not woried about those
<seb128> the changes seems to be easy
<kenvandine> they are
<kenvandine> just don't want to miss anything
<pitti> seb128: hm, the g-u-s changelog says "Don't move autostart file from /etc/xdg/autostart to /usr/share/gnome/autostart. Upstream use the former."
<pitti> seb128: but preinst cleans the autostart file in /etc/ on upgrade
<seb128> urg
<pitti> although that's admittedly for a veeery old version
<seb128> that's not from my upload but good catch
<pitti> I don't htink that this code actually runs
<pitti> seb128: no, not from your upload, just from previous merge
<pitti> seb128: I think it's inert, but I wondered what the intent is
<seb128> I will clean in the next upload
<pitti> ok, it just caught my eye
<seb128> pitti, Josselin considers autostart as not conffiles
<seb128> so he decided using etc is wrong
<seb128> and changes debian packages to use usr
<seb128> so he moves those there and clean etc files on upgrade
<pitti> +gnome-user-share (0.3-1) hoary; urgency=low
<pitti> + -- Jeff Waugh <jdub@perkypants.org>  Tue, 01 Jun 2004 16:14:59 +1000
<pitti> those were the days...
<seb128> hehe ;-)
<pitti> note the time zone
<kenvandine> long time ago :)
<pitti> must have been a sprint or so
<seb128> pitti, +1000 seems correct for .au?
<kenvandine> the archive freezes for alpha3 tuesday right?
<pitti> oh, it's getting late
<pitti> seb128: misread it as 0100..
<pitti> kenvandine: right
<seb128> heh
 * kenvandine is just making sure to put just the right amount of pressure on aquarius :)
<pitti> seb128: we need to rebuild g-u-s after the main promotion, for langpack stripping
<pitti> (promoted now)
<didrocks> lp:~didrocks/casper/copy_wallpaper_cache needs sponsoring :)
<pitti> didrocks: hm, that's a project branch?
<pitti> didrocks: did you derive from lp:ubuntu/casper?
<didrocks> pitti: right, just when I pushed it I didn't check the format
<pitti> ok, np
<seb128> pitti, ok, will take care of that
 * pitti hugs seb128
<pitti> I'll sponsor casper
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> pitti, is gnome-desktop still on your sponsoring list too or should I look at that one?
<pitti> didrocks: that looks nice, good job!
<didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
<pitti> seb128: oops, that must have fallen through the IRC cracks; will look at this after casper
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> didrocks: merged, uploading now; please flip the WI to "done"
<didrocks> pitti: thanks a lot!
<chrisccoulson> oops, the g-u-s conffile cleaning is probably from my merge ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I will probably wait for your other changes for the upload if you think you will have those done this week
<chrisccoulson> i will start working on those tonight
<seb128> ok
<seb128> no hurry to get the rebuild anyway, we will reupload on monday if there is no upload before
<pitti> gnome-desktop sponsored
<pitti> it's coming together
 * didrocks hugs pitti
<seb128> waouh
<didrocks> I just have to remove the desktop startup file in n-l-efl and I can upload n-l-efl and n-l to close my 3 "detect 2D/3D" WI :)
<pitti> didrocks: oh, you have the fallback working now?
<seb128> didrocks, good job!
<didrocks> pitti: right :) it's working at least on my box
<didrocks> seb128: thanks
 * pitti hugs didrocks
 * didrocks hugs pitti back
 * seb128 hugs didrocks too
 * pitti looks for more tasks to hand to didrocks
<pitti> j/k
 * didrocks hugs seb128 too ;)
<didrocks> pitti: noooooooooooooo
<didrocks> :-)
<seb128> pitti, let him finish the gwibber mir ;-)
<chrisccoulson> ooh, hugfest
 * pitti hugs chrisccoulson
 * seb128 tries to avoid dealing with the mako one
<pitti> seb128: righto
 * chrisccoulson hugs pitti
 * seb128 hugs chrisccoulson too
<didrocks> well, the hardest part now is to find how to remove the desktop file from n-l-efl as it's using dh 7 ;)
 * didrocks hugs chrisccoulson
 * chrisccoulson hugs seb128 and didrocks
<pitti> haha
<pitti> didrocks: drop it from the debian/pacakge.install?
<didrocks> pitti: failed, there is just one bin package :)
<pitti> happy overriding then
<didrocks> if I add one, it will create a debian/tmp and then match those? (I tried to create one debian/install and it still install in the debian/<package_name>
<pitti> 11.24 s, BTW
<didrocks> right, I look for the doc :)
<pitti> didrocks: I'm actually unsure whether it's that magic
<Amaranth> pitti: is that the netbook remix or desktop
<pitti> didrocks: but there must be something like a post-install hook?
<didrocks> pitti: I think I've read that one day. I'm just searching where from the Internet
<pitti> Amaranth: netbook; GNOME is still waaay to slow for that :(
<pitti> Amaranth: FYI, http://people.canonical.com/~scott/daily-bootcharts/20100217-max.png is current desktop
<pitti> Amaranth: (note the process which takes by far the biggest CPU chunk :-P)
<Amaranth> yeah, still can't figure that one out
<Amaranth> seb128: did you ever get a chance to test booting with no compiz plugins enabled?
<seb128> Amaranth, not yet, my mini broke and I'm waiting on Dell to repair and send it back which should be soon apparently
<C10uD> hi
<C10uD> i wanted to add appindicator support to my app, i've seen the examples and it's real easy, thanks for the flawless job
<C10uD> however i have two issues i currently can't sort out:
<C10uD> i don't know how to/if i can set "my" icons (as gtk pixbufs or paths)
<C10uD> i don't know how to/if i can "hotplug" items in my indicator's gtk menu
<C10uD> thanks in advance
<rickspencer3> Nafai, ^
<rickspencer3> any tips?
<rickspencer3> C10uD, #ayatana would probably be an ideal place to ask, now that I think of it
<Nafai> Yeah, lets take it over there, and I can help answer questions there
<C10uD> ok, thanks
<didrocks> pitti: what status should I give to "write a small helper program to refresh bg and trigger caching, and add it to gnome-desktop postinst": "done but too hackish to integrate it and no other solution"? :-)
<baptistemm_> yeah, g-u-s in main
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm_ - lets hope i can still upload it ;)
<baptistemm_> chrisccoulson, I asked hadess few days ago to release a tarball for g-u-s as he didn't ship one for 2.29.x
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, hey, did you ever get to look at bindwood?
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, i didn't get a chance to look at it (my weekend got taken up by family)
<chrisccoulson> does it still need doing?
<urbanape> chrisccoulson, ping
<chrisccoulson> hi urbanape
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, yes...
<urbanape> howdy. kenvandine got you to shepherd the Bindwood 1.0.0 release into lucid on Friday. Can I ask how that is going/went?
<kenvandine> that is why urbanape  showed up :)
<chrisccoulson> ah, i was just wondering about that ;)
<kenvandine> watch out for that urbanape fellow, he is sketchy
<chrisccoulson> urbanape, i can take a look at that later. i didn't get any time after friday to look at it
<urbanape> I appreciate that. We'd like to have it in alpha3.
<qense> kenvandine: gwibber failed to build on lucid, Launchpad says it's a chroot issue
<kenvandine> qense, i am getting those all over the place
<kenvandine> for ppas too
<qense> Also "E: Could not perform immediate configuration on 'udev'.Please see man 5 apt.conf under APT::Immediate-Configure for details. (2)"?
<seb128> urbanape, kenvandine, chrisccoulson: whatever bindwood is that's probably not an alpha3 priority for us
<seb128> chrisccoulson, please focus on things you had on your todolist affecting default installation before ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, it's the ubuntuone bookmarks plugin
<kenvandine> yeah, not default install... but a work item for lucid none the less :)
<seb128> kenvandine, the issue is that chrisccoulson has still a real work job and is doing things on his after work hours and is already overloaded wtih tasks
<kenvandine> understand
<baptistemm_> you have to pay for having chrisccoulson :)
 * kenvandine hugs chrisccoulson
 * chrisccoulson hugs kenvandine
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm_ - ;)
 * urbanape didn't mean to step on anyone's toes.
<seb128> chrisccoulson, don't feel you have to do everything you got asked to look at yet, just deal with things as you feel doing it
<seb128> those are nice to have things but we will manage in any case
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - no worries. i'm planning to do some work on g-u-s before i finish for the evening
<seb128> alpha3 is not lucid yet
<seb128> we still have plenty of time to get things done
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, thanks ;-)
<baptistemm_> chrisccoulson, can I help you on g-u-s ?
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm_ - if you want :)
<baptistemm_> it depends on what it is
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm_ - we're going to add an autostart delay to the desktop file, and also make sure it copes with apache not being installed, and modify the UI to allow you to install the extra components
<baptistemm_> ouch ...
<chrisccoulson> heh ;)
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm_ - initially, I might just desensitize the webdav parts of the UI, so that it is not possible to enable webdav sharing if the right components are not installed
<chrisccoulson> but an extra button would be nice too
<baptistemm_> ah okay, I'll started to look at that last week, but my coding is so lame, I didn't achieve ...
<baptistemm_> s/'ll/'ve/
<kenvandine> seb128, you were talking about python-mako and python-beaker earlier... did you see any problems with dropping python-beaker to a suggests?
<seb128> kenvandine, I've not enough clue about those to say, I was just reading the changelog and it suggested it's used for caching
<seb128> not sure if that's something that work transparently or not or would benefit gwibber or rhythmbox
<kenvandine> yeah, but looks more like wsgi related stuff... so not really used by desktop apps
<kenvandine> rb depends on mako?
<seb128> kenvandine, recommends it right now since it's used by the context pane code which is optional
<kenvandine> humm... doesn't that mean it would get pulled into main?
<seb128> kenvandine, yes it should, that's why I was pinging you guys about the gwibber mir and make mir too
<seb128> if you do it for gwibber I don't need to do it for rhythmbox ;-)
<kenvandine> ok, so that is new?
<kenvandine> i am doing it :)
<kenvandine> trying to avoid beaker :-D
<seb128> it's new since lucid yes
<seb128> and until now we didn't have the recommends
<seb128> and people complaining the option was not working
<seb128> until you install python-mako manually that is
<kenvandine> ok, the context panel right?
<kenvandine> that works for me with python-mako installed and no python-beaker
<seb128> kenvandine, yes
<seb128> as I said I don't think it's required for rhythmbox
<seb128> thanks for confirming ;-)
<kenvandine> seems sane to drop that to a suggests then
<kenvandine> nor for gwibber
<kenvandine> no idea about bauble, python-pylons and deluge-web
 * kenvandine looks
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, you'll probably notice from lucid-changes that i've just uploaded a new upstream version of gnome-screensaver, that has another CVE fix
<chrisccoulson> the fix is here: http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-screensaver/commit/?id=d4dcbd65a2df3c093c4e3a74bbbc75383eb9eadb
<chrisccoulson> although, i don't know the full impact of it
<chrisccoulson> oh, ok. it's about sometimes not getting the keyboard grab
<kenvandine> pylons has an actual depends for beaker, so that is good :)
 * didrocks caught a cold. I'm sure that's because of seb128's conference call we had :)
<kenvandine> seb128, ok... great... bauble and deluge-web only use it for templates
<seb128> didrocks, :-(
<kenvandine> just like gwibber and rb
<seb128> kenvandine, ok good, suggests that is ;-)
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> seb128, you mind doing that while i finish this MIR?
 * chrisccoulson hugs didrocks
<chrisccoulson> it seems everyone is getting a cold ;)
 * didrocks hugs chrisccoulson
<didrocks> too many hugs, that's the cause :)
<seb128> kenvandine, the recommends to suggests change? can do
<kenvandine> didrocks, get some rest
<kenvandine> seb128, yes please
<seb128> ok, doing now
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: yeah, thanks for that
<kenvandine> seb128, mako MIR filed
<kenvandine> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mako/+bug/523430
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 523430 in mako "[MIR] mako" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> kenvandine, change uploaded
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, who broke the build daemons ;)
<rickspencer3> tseliot, are you still around at all?
<tseliot> rickspencer3: yep
<rickspencer3> tseliot, so you are primarily working on the Plymouth theme from here on out?
<tseliot> rickspencer3: yes and there's a lot to do
<rickspencer3> ok
<tseliot> rickspencer3: plymouth theme and plymouth in general
<rickspencer3> ah
<rickspencer3> thanks tseliot
<tseliot> rickspencer3: np
<rickspencer3> tseliot, how is the them going?
<rickspencer3> still lots of days of work left?
 * rickspencer3 notes that building the theme seems time consuming
<tseliot> rickspencer3: yes, it's a program, so it's supposed to be time consuming, especially when I have to reimplement things
<rickspencer3> yeah, I understand
<rickspencer3> tseliot, not trying to pressure you here, just to understand
<rickspencer3> like 5 days of work left on the theme? 15? 100?
<tseliot> rickspencer3: I hope 5 days will be enough. Then I'll work on adding the support for vga16fb to plymouth
 * rickspencer3 nods
<rickspencer3> sounds like another 5 days or so
<rickspencer3> thanks tsimpson
<tseliot> rickspencer3: I think it will take more (for vga16fb) but hopefully I'm wrong
<rickspencer3> oh
<rickspencer3> tseliot, fair enough, like 10 days?
<rickspencer3> 100?
<tseliot> rickspencer3: I can't give you an exact estimate. I'll do my best. I still hope to do that in time for alpha 3
<tseliot> i.e. something acceptable, that is
<rickspencer3> tseliot, uh
<rickspencer3> I think we may have our dates mixed up
<rickspencer3> if it's more than 5 days for the fb work, that alone will push us past a3
<tseliot> so that plymouth can work with non-kms drivers
<rickspencer3> maybe I should have been more specific ...
<rickspencer3> ho many *more* days? like how many days remaining :/
<tseliot> rickspencer3: I haven't started working on that yet. I would like to finish the theme first
<rickspencer3> tseliot, ok, I'm confused, sorry
<rickspencer3> a3 work is basically finishing up tomorrow
<tseliot> rickspencer3: the theme is a separate thing from support for vga16fb
<rickspencer3> tseliot, ok
<rickspencer3> so are you saying you are almost done the theme
<rickspencer3> ?
<tseliot> rickspencer3: tomorrow we have feature freeze
<rickspencer3> tseliot, correct
<tseliot> alpha 3 is on the 25th
<rickspencer3> tseliot, right
<rickspencer3> we *ship* alpha 3 on the 25th
<tseliot> right
<rickspencer3> so we stop uploading to it before then
<rickspencer3> however, no worries
<rickspencer3> we can get exceptions for these things
<tseliot> rickspencer3: so, I'll make sure that theme gets in
<tseliot> I can't say the same for vga16fb support
<tseliot> as I want to be sure before I say anything about it
<chrisccoulson> seb128 / pitti - the conffile cleanup in g-u-s is actually valid
<chrisccoulson> the desktop file was renamed ages ago
<chrisccoulson> so the preinst hook removes the desktop file with the old name
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok
<tseliot> rickspencer3: I'll let you know as soon as I have news
<chrisccoulson> i removed the extra hook to remove the current desktop file when i did the last merge
<chrisccoulson> do that's ok ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you rock as usual ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey
<robert_ancell> seb128, evening
<bigon> seb128: thx for papyon merge
<bigon> is there any reason we drop the py-farsight deps?
<didrocks> time to stop, have a good night everyone!
<seb128> bigon, you're welcome, not sure about that but it's in universe and things seem to be working without it
<seb128> bigon, I've just reapplied changes which were already there
<bigon> cassidy: ^
<bigon> it was not releated to the fact we didn't want msn audio/video chat in karmic?
<seb128> could be
<chrisccoulson> hmmmm, there are only python bindings for aptdaemon, and no C library?
<rickspencer3> heh
<mvo> chrisccoulson: dbus is the alternative
<chrisccoulson> mvo - yeah, i think i'll have to do raw dbus
<chrisccoulson> i'm sure that won't be too hard though ;)
<mvo> *cough* FLW
<chrisccoulson> heh ;)
<ccheney> whee looks like we dropped from 10.8 to 10.4 today, 'just' another 0.4 until its ready :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-02-18
<dobey> any uploaders around?
<TheMuso`> dobey: What needs uploading?
<maxb> Is this the right channel for totem/gstreamer in Ubuntu?
<maxb> I'm wondering if anyone working in those areas tests DVD playback
<TheMuso`> maxb: I think those who maintain such packages are not around currently.
<TheMuso`> dobey: To be more clear, I can upload whatever you need uploading.
<maxb> Am I at least in the right channel that suitable people might be around at the right time of day? :-)
<james_w> maxb: yup
<TheMuso`> /c/c
<chrisccoulson> bah, i can't upload gnome-user-share any more
<kenvandine> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi kenvandine
<rickspencer3> woah ff is well and truly broken for me
<TheMuso`> FF as in firefox?
<nekohayo> feature notabug?
<nekohayo> ;)
<rickspencer3> TheMuso`, yeah
<rickspencer3> asac, is just made of awesome
<rickspencer3> he's already uploaded what he thinks will fix it
<asac> well. awesomely failed ;)
<asac> so now fixing the dirt ;)
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, you about?
<rickspencer3> asac, thanks for the fix!
<rickspencer3> I hope you get some sleep now!
<rickspencer3> ttyt
<asac> sure  about to do that ;)
<asac> can sleep much better that way
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, hey
<rickspencer3> how's it going robert_ancell?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, good
<rickspencer3> someone in #ubuntu-app-devel was asking about how to lay out files for a game
<rickspencer3> seemed like you would be up, and would have an opinion
<rickspencer3> it was gingerheadman
<robert_ancell> when? not seeing it in the log
<rickspencer3> this is "app-devel", not "devel"
<robert_ancell> oh
<robert_ancell> didn't know about that one!
<rickspencer3> it's new
<rickspencer3> if you wouldn't mind, and you have like 3 minutes
<rickspencer3> maybe you could help him out
<robert_ancell> np
<rickspencer3> thanks robert_ancell
 * robert_ancell reading log..
<dobey> TheMuso`: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/lucid/ubuntuone-storage-protocol/trunk/+merge/19552 and https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/lucid/ubuntuone-client/trunk/+merge/19557
<TheMuso`> dobey: I'll take a look.
<TheMuso`> dobey: Do they need uploading in a particular order?
<TheMuso`> dobey: also the package gives a Vcs-Bzr pointer to https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntuone-control-tower/ubuntu/lucid/ubuntuone-client/trunk. Should I be using that branch in any way shape or form?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, the Gwibber posting UI just rocks!
<rickspencer3> oops, I guess I meant that for kenvandine ;)
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, jono wants to marry simple scan
<kenvandine> haha
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, what is the process required to make an application "featured"?
<TheMuso`> I don't feel comfortable uploading/merging these unless there is a documented procedure for these ubuntuone packages somewhere. Merging from a personal branch seems weird considering the packaging points to the ubuntuone-control-tower branch.
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I dunno yet
<dobey> TheMuso`: ubuntuone-storage-protocol needs to be uploaded first
<rickspencer3> you tell me and I tell mvo ;)
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, in all seriousness, how do you suggest we pick those apps?
<dobey> TheMuso`: no, i forgot to change the Vcs-Bzr there to point to lp:ubuntu/ubuntuone-blah
<TheMuso`> dobey: Ok just its just a merge review, and upload
<dobey> working merge proposals for package branches is still a new thing to me :)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, I think we should decide how many to have and then propose new ones at desktop meeting.  Once we have the max number you have to nominate one to replace
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I shall steel that idea
<rickspencer3> the other option was for me to pick ;)
<rickspencer3> Rick's Picks
<dobey> anyway, I need to get some sleep
<TheMuso`> dobey: ok am on it.
<kenvandine> dobey, gettting an upload!
<kenvandine> dobey, that whole process is "so documented"
<robert_ancell>  rickspencer3, inkscape! cheese! blender! frozen-bubble!
<rickspencer3> yes
<kenvandine> dobey, best docs i found is "bzr help dh_make"
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, quickly! photobomb!
<rickspencer3> j/k
<kenvandine> dobey,  not for merge proposals... but for the process of sucking in packages
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, you know a small part of you isn't j/k :)
<rickspencer3> riiight
<rickspencer3> well, quickly is cool
<rickspencer3> but we should probably stick with apps in Main for them to be "featured"
<kenvandine> :)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, and gui based
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, yeah, and not for programmers :/
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, it would be kind of nice to have a programmers featured section, i.e. an ide, glade, ... but I guess programmers can easily look on the web
<robert_ancell> *sigh* software-center does not close with Ctrl+Q.  I think I might try and tackle the Ctrl+Q/Ctrl+W message for Lucid+1
<robert_ancell> s/message/mess
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I suppose that is a bug
<rickspencer3> unless mpt has decided that we should do it differently now
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, it's a very contentious that everyone likes to argue about and not fix
<robert_ancell> contentious point
<rickspencer3> anyway, for this case, "Q" seems logical, as it is quiting an app, not closing a window
<robert_ancell> what I do is, Ctrl+Q for quit application (all applications implement this), Ctrl+W for close document (if appropriate for application).  If a single document app use Ctrl+W for quit as well
<rickspencer3> I'll see if I can fix it right now
<rickspencer3> right
<rickspencer3> what does the HIG say?
<rickspencer3> in any case "W" seems wrong, as there is no document
<robert_ancell> hmm, my ff is broken now.  Did that upload come asac?
<TheMuso`> ubuntuone-storage-protocol uploaded, waiting for a test build of ubuntuone-client.
<TheMuso`> robert_ancell: It was uploaded, but likely not published yet.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso`, ah, should have waiting to do my update :)
<robert_ancell> waited
<robert_ancell> man, I'm on a roll today
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, the quit command is a stock menu item in Glade
<rickspencer3> would be more work for him to do a merge than to just do it
<TheMuso`> robert_ancell: its built on amd64 but yet to be published, building on i386.
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, change w to q in SoftwareCenter.ui line 60
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, uh
<rickspencer3> I edited the glade file and changed it to quit from close
<rickspencer3> if it uses a stock item, best to just use that, right?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, I don't think the stock buttons carry shortcuts anymore
<rickspencer3> really?
<rickspencer3> oh snap
<rickspencer3> that sux
<kenvandine> that sounds like a bug!
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, I don't know why it was changed but it seems to have happened some time ago
<robert_ancell> with the menus changing etc I just assume these things are being done on purpose :)
<kenvandine> seems silly
<kenvandine> this doesn't encourage consistency
<rickspencer3> whatever
<robert_ancell> which is why we have _no_ consistency :)
 * kenvandine wouldn't be surprised if it was on purpose :/
<kenvandine> but i still think that is silly
<mclasen> robert_ancell: must be an Ubuntu improvement... stock items haven't changed upstream
<rickspencer3> I should be refactoring these quidget.prompts.filedialogs, but the tedium is driving me crazy
<robert_ancell> I love Python apps, sudoedit the installed file and it works until next upgrade
<TheMuso`> dobey: ubuntuone stuff you requested is now uploaded.
<robert_ancell> mclasen, right
<kenvandine> TheMuso`, thx!
<TheMuso`> kenvandine: np
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, kenvandine looks like some have 'em and some don
<rickspencer3> t
<robert_ancell> mclasen, hey, which app did you put the gdm gconf stuff in?
<robert_ancell> damn, just missed him!
<rickspencer3> no, wrong
<robert_ancell> There also doesn't seem to be a Help>Contents menu anymore which should be consistent (and F1 shortcut)
<rickspencer3> in glade you have to set an accelerator in addition to choosing the stock item
<rickspencer3> seems rather odd
<rickspencer3> but happy I figured that out
 * rickspencer3 pushes code and turns out lights
<rickspencer3> g'night all
<robert_ancell> night
<Amaranth> Well, compiz is using almost no CPU now according to bootchart
<Amaranth> of course I've only got 5 plugins installed and loaded...
<Amaranth> also seems to have cut 1.5 seconds off my boot
<Amaranth> now to figure out which plugins are the problem...
<^arky^> Question about unclutter: setting START_UNCLUTTER doesn't seems to have effect in lucid?
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> didrocks: upgrade> set it to "dropped" and add a comment at the bottom about the details
<^arky^> pitti: Good morning
<Amaranth> good morning pitti
<pitti> didrocks: in KVM it seems that n-l-efl wants to start up, and on the mini I get n-l, so this part works, congrats! too bad that n-l-efl crashes immediately :/
 * Amaranth is off to make more bootcharts
<Bacta> Hai all!
<Bacta> XD
<didrocks> good morning
<didrocks> pitti: oh, n-l-efl crash?
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<pitti> didrocks: yes, just try to boot today's netbook daily
<pitti> didrocks: ^ that built again, BTW \o/
<pitti> didrocks: (boot it on a machine without 3D, such as KVM)
<pitti> didrocks: but that probably belongs into asac's domain rather
<didrocks> hey pitti :)
<didrocks> pitti: right
<didrocks> pitti: I'll help asac as well on setting up a dedicated n-l-efl session
<didrocks> (the work as already began, just need some cleaning)
<didrocks> I tried as well on Xephyr and on my laptop with and without the nvidia driver
<pitti> didrocks: we wanted to bring back OO.o to netbook, right? would you mind updating the WIs on https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-une-applications ?
<didrocks> pitti: ok, we will do the same for Tomboy
<didrocks> doing it now
<pitti> oh, that too?
<pitti> didrocks: then netbook is basically ubuntu + extra packages
<pitti> IOW, they'll overflow
<didrocks> pitti: hum, we can do in two steps maybe? first add OOo and then, see the remaining space?
<pitti> didrocks: *nod*
<didrocks> pitti: also, removing gnumeric and abiword
<pitti> right
<didrocks> and redemote them :)
<didrocks> pitti: do you want me to change the seed and your pull my branch or do you want to do it directly?
<pitti> didrocks: as you prefer; you can also tell me what to change
<didrocks> pitti: I'll try to edit the seed and push the branch somewhere
<pitti> didrocks: as a matter of exercise, feel free to patch it yourself and either mail me a bzr bundle or push a branch
<didrocks> right :)
<didrocks> (hum, wiki.ubuntu.com isn't reachable)
<pitti> Riddell: Kubuntu exclusively uses https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kubuntu/Todo/Lucid, right? currently that's only represented on http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/canonical-desktop-team.html, mashed with a lot of other specs, which makes it much less useful for both canonical desktop team and Kubuntu; do you want me to set up a separate report for Kubuntu?
<Riddell> pitti: yes that's right.  and yes that would make it much easier to read
<Riddell> asac: finally got approval for KDE patches to firefox, care to review? https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~jr/firefox/firefox-3.6.head/+merge/19580
<didrocks> pitti: ~didrocks/+junk/netbook.lucid
<pitti> $ bzr merge lp:~didrocks/+junk/netbook.lucid
<pitti> Nothing to do.
<pitti> did you push?
<Amaranth> hmm, nothing obvious seems to cause compiz cpu usage
<didrocks> pitti: right, I just pushed, let me check
<Amaranth> when I cut it down to literally the bare essentials the cpu usage went away
<pitti> Amaranth: so it's mostly spent on xml parsing, plugin loading, etc?
<didrocks> pitti: I guess LP hasn't scanned it yet: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~didrocks/+junk/netbook.lucid
<Amaranth> but when I cut out animation, regex, scaleaddon, dbus, etc it only puts a dent in the CPU usage, it does not get rid of it
<didrocks> pitti: because I bet you don't have my last commit :)
<Amaranth> I thought for sure it was going to be animation or regex
<Amaranth> pitti: it may be ccp itself now that I think about it
<Amaranth> none of the other plugins I have loaded seem like they would do all that much
<Amaranth> except perhaps workarounds and session
<Amaranth> I'll have to look more tomorrow
 * Amaranth goes to bed
<pitti> Amaranth: good night!
<Amaranth> one fun thing I realized: we have no reason to use the animation plugin anymore
 * Amaranth goes to bed for real
<Amaranth> hehe, guess not
<Amaranth> http://i.imgur.com/tgbPF.png <--no CPU usage!
<Amaranth> well, a little sliver
<Amaranth> (that's my super hacked setup)
<mvo> Amaranth: have you seen the profiling patch in debian/patches (in the ubuntu compiz branch?)
<Amaranth> yeah, it didn't seem to point to anything
<Amaranth> keybuk also gave me some tool to use to track function call usage and time but I forgot it
<Amaranth> I think next will be to replace compiz with a shell script that calls compiz for real with that tool so I can profile a boot
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, good morning seb128
<seb128> hey pitti
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I will tell you in a bit ;-)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i can't upload gnome-user-share any more :(
<seb128> chrisccoulson, blocked nose and no coffee yet, let's see how it is in half an hour ;-)
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson and seb128 :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you need some sponsoring?
<seb128> lut pitti didrocks
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - you definately need some coffee then ;)
<didrocks> seb128: welcome to the blocked nose family :-)
<seb128> indeed!
<pitti> argh, plague is spreading in France?
<seb128> didrocks, how do you feel today? got a cold too then?
<didrocks> seb128: right, and some headaches in the morning, but it's better now
<didrocks> pitti: heh, it seems that, yeah ;)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i put gnome-user-share in bzr, with some preliminary changes (I've added the autostart delay, and made it not possible to enable the webdav sharing checkbox when apache is not installed)
<didrocks> there is "freeze" in feature freeze :)
<chrisccoulson> i also changed a default gconf key to enable notifications when bluetooth push is enabled and you receive a file
<seb128> chrisccoulson, sounds a good start, I can upload that so we get the rebuild for langpacks too
<chrisccoulson> cool, thanks
<pitti> didrocks: great job on your WIs! so your only outstanding one is the upgrade, which (as discussed earlier) is sort of dropped, right?
<didrocks> pitti: exactly, I just changed the status and add a comment
<didrocks> pitti: and thanks ;)
<seb128> pitti, oh, you decided to drop the upgrade one?
<pitti> seb128: well, s/decided/didn't find a way to make it work/
<pitti> ideas appreciated
<seb128> out of doing something hacking to update-* I've no good idea sorry
<pitti> right
<pitti> it would be a ton of work for only very little benefit
<chrisccoulson> do we actually know what the benefit would be? (ie, i assume BG caching still works, but it does not get profiled by ureadahead)
<pitti> right
<pitti> ureadahead would read the large image in vain, and g-s-d needs to re-read the cache
<pitti> didrocks: please only seed writer and calc; the rest pulls in too much java
<pitti> didrocks: oh, impress doesn't pull in java as well?
<pitti> didrocks: ok, let's try this then
<pitti> didrocks: committed
<didrocks> pitti: impress is still needed and pulls java right. Let's see with that size and I'll have a look tomorrow at the CD size
<didrocks> pitti: thanks
<pitti> tseliot: your two plymouth WIs on https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-lucid-boot-experience: do they look realistic to land this week still? or should we move them to beta-1?
<seb128> pitti, so I guess we need to decide now on gnome-keyring
<seb128> who has been testing the ppa update?
<chrisccoulson> i've not had a chance to try it yet
<chrisccoulson> have you had any issues with it?
<pitti> argh, need to do that still
<seb128> just mission control failing on first run
<seb128> but there is a patch in bugzilla for that I need to apply
<seb128> otherwise seahorse, empathy, ssh, etc works fine
 * pitti upgrades to PPA
<om26er> kenvandine, can I have a minute please, gwibber 2.29.90 is showing 2.29.1 in about window. I was told to ping you instead of opening a bug report.
<seb128> om26er, he's probably sleeping by now
<om26er> seb128, ah. ok thanks
<baptistemm> hello
<pitti> seb128: just testing g-k, which seems to work with evo, empathy, and ssh
<pitti> just now X keeps freezing
<seb128> uninstall plymouth?
<pitti> I already disabled that
<seb128> I would be susprised if it was due to g-k
<pitti> right
<pitti> see #u-devel
<seb128> how did you disable plymouth?
<pitti> boot without "splash"
<pitti> well, disable the graphic bits
<pitti> that helps for me to get X up properly
<tseliot> pitti: this week?
<pitti> tseliot: well, "alpha-3" is basically "this week", yes
<pitti> Monday still, too
<tseliot> pitti: "support for 16 colours" won't make it in time for sure
<pitti> tseliot: is that important?
<tseliot> pitti: only if you want a bootsplash with non-kms drivers
<tseliot> other than the text plugin
<pitti> ah, for that
<tseliot> yep
<pitti> tseliot: "new plymouht boot theme", is that artwork, or code changes?
<tseliot> pitti: the design team gave me the artwork but I'm changing code as the theme is a program
<pitti> tseliot: right, but behaviourally it's still "artwork"
<pitti> tseliot: I'm interested in how regression prone it will be
<pitti> if it's just different "putPixel()" calls (on a very abstract level), that should be fine for beta-1
<tseliot> pitti: it should be much simpler than it used to be
<pitti> if it's "change the boot order, introduce a menu", etc., that's intrusive
<tseliot> pitti: with the scripting language that I'm using I'm operating on a very abstract level, as you said
<tseliot> i.e. no memory leaks, etc.
<tseliot> I'm almost done and I'll try to complete it by Monday
<pitti> tseliot: ok, thanks
<tseliot> np
<pitti> tseliot: so I'll keep the artwork for a3, and move the 16 colors to beta-1?
<pitti> then we can still drop it altogether if it's considered too much work/intrusive
<tseliot> pitti: yes, that would be wise. But there's no need to drop it completely
<tseliot> beta-1 should be fine
<pitti> thanks, done
<tseliot> thanks
<seb128> re
<seb128> got disconnected
<seb128> pitti, did you get what I was writting about uninstalling plymouth rather than changing splash option?
<pitti> seb128: no, I didn't
<pitti> seb128: slangasek just pointed out bug 518352
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 518352 in plymouth "[lucid] if booting without 'splash', gdm starts X on wrong vt" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/518352
<seb128> <seb128> pitti, that didn't fix the plymouth crashes for people there
<pitti> so "nosplash" apparnetly doesn't work very well
<seb128>  pitti, you have to apt-get remove plymouth
<seb128>  don't ask why I don't know
<seb128>  pitti, I think without splash you still get plymouth used
<seb128>  but in text mode or something
<pitti> right
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: curious; I just tried disabling nautilus in UNE (just to see whether it's worth changing some initialization to lazy/deferred), and it seems to have no impact at all
<didrocks> pitti: you mean, disabling at startup time?
<pitti> right
<didrocks> pitti: btw, from looking at the bg code and adding some debug, I noted that the "draw bg" function was called twice during the initialization
<pitti> within g-s-d? or once from g-s-d and once from e. g. launcher or nautilus?
<pitti> brb
<didrocks> pitti: not, within libgnomedesktop. I assume there is one call from g-s-d and one from nautilus, but unsure (there is always a compiz output between the two calls)
<asac> didrocks: already added ooo and tombox? please keep them !armel ;)
<asac> (as they were before)
<asac> tomboy
<asac> thanks
<didrocks> asac: I added OOo but didn't add it for armel
<asac> great
<didrocks> asac: we'll see tomorrow CD size to see if we can add tomoby on !armel :)
<didrocks> rebooting server, brb
<seb128> pitti, so what do you think for g-k?
<pitti> seb128: (1) seems to work, (2) medium risk, low benefit
<pitti> but on the plus side, consistency with the rest of gnome
<seb128> consistency + maintained for something which is somewhat a security component
<pitti> right
<seb128> + uptodate platform
<seb128> which is nice on a lts
<pitti> I'm leaning towards taking it
<pitti> but we need to watch out for regressions
<pitti> seb128: what's your feeling?
<seb128> - is that upstream will be busy soon apparently, waiting a children
<seb128> but current version seems to work fine
<seb128> pitti, I still lend toward doing it
<pitti> bah, each time I want to generate a clean bootchart, plymouth is acting up
<seb128> hum
<seb128> could somebody who upgraded today look to the Version in /usr/lib/pkgconfig/libpulse-mainloop-glib.pc?
<seb128> hum, bug #523716
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523716 in pulseaudio "pulseaudio version defined as UNKNOWN" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523716
<seb128> TheMuso`, ^
<fagan> mvo: http://twitpic.com/13xftx if you have installed a repo other than a ppa it doesnt have an icon in the software center
<mvo> fagan: thanks, we need nice icons :)
<fagan> mvo: True but I meant that the google repo doesnt have an icon
<mvo> fagan: right, I wanted to say "sort-of known issues, we do not have a icon yet for "other" repositories"
<fagan> Ah ok I just thought it was a small corner case that needed addressing
<mvo> fagan: yeah, we need a icon for "other", than we will add it
<fagan> mvo: good
<kenvandine> pitti, rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store is still in NEW, can you help move it through?
<kenvandine> good morning all :)
<pitti> seb128, all: I just filed bug 523788 FYI; do you have the exact same symptoms? Want to confirm it?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523788 in plymouth "Only see X mouse cursor on VT during boot" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523788
<pitti> hey kenvandine
<pitti> kenvandine: can do
<kenvandine> thx
<pitti> oh, source new? didn't I accept it yesterday?
<seb128> pitti, I think you didn't no
<seb128> pitti, bug confirmed
<pitti> so it's not just me then?
<seb128> the plymouth issue?
<pitti> right
<pitti> I get it 1/10 cases with standard lucid
<seb128> I've not tried this week but that's exactly what I described to slangasek and Keybuk one week ago
<pitti> and 100% with not starting cups
<seb128> I get it 75% of the time on my d630
<pitti> kenvandine: done
<pitti> seb128: same here
<kenvandine> thx!
<seb128> brb trying gtk update
<seb128> re
<seb128> kenvandine, csd in lucid now btw
<seb128> or building rather
<kenvandine> woot
 * kenvandine hopes it doesn't explode :)
<seb128> good that I tested
<seb128> it made gnome-panel not start with french locale
<kenvandine> i saw that
<seb128> the same issue I had when I tried some months ago
<seb128> you guys lack non english testers ;-)
<kenvandine> bratsche was loving the french last night :)
<kenvandine> seb128, we have you!
 * kenvandine waits for the bug reports :)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> I've already one
<kenvandine> i think there are still bugs
<kenvandine> there are always bugs
<seb128> nautilus icons are grey squares in dnd
<kenvandine> i noticed last night f-spot rendering weirdness
<tgpraveen12> there is an the option of sending annonymous usage statistics.
<tgpraveen12> where are these stats available? i want to see em
<pitti> tgpraveen12: do you mean http://popcon.ubuntu.com/ ?
<kenvandine> pitti, rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store is binary NEW, mind poking it again?
<kenvandine> pitti, sorry to nag... they are trying to get it to a point they can get some people testing it :)
<tgpraveen12> pitti: what about the information from system->admin->system testing
<kenvandine> seb128, wow cody was up late fixing the fr_FR problem in csd
<seb128> kenvandine, yeah, we crossed this morning my time and I overslept
<kenvandine> haha
<pitti> kenvandine: sure
<kenvandine> thx pitti
<pitti> I just fixed the bug in cups which caused udev-configure-printer to be needlessly spawned 10 times
<pitti> another 2 s I/O block gone from bootcharts
<seb128> waouh
<seb128> 8 seconds now? ;-)
<pitti> nah, no measurable difference for total time
<seb128> btw dell rocks
<seb128> got my mini back today
<pitti> the good thing is now that the big solid CPU block now consistently ends at 10.0 s
<pitti> seb128: oooh
<pitti> and afterwards there are just a few spikes
<mvo> !
 * pitti sees seb128 crave "myyyyyy precccciousssss!"
<seb128> hehe
<pitti> seb128: did they repair it, or sent a replacement?
<seb128> repair apparently
<seb128> it had not distinctive mark so I can't say for sure but it's not a new one
<tgpraveen12> hmm found it at http://hwdb.ubuntu.com . unfortunately it is of no use
<seb128> and they put a paper saying they changed the mb and the ram
<asac> Riddell: where did you get permission?
<asac> i didnt get a CC
<didrocks> sweet, seb128's bootcharts will be back :)
<tgpraveen12> and none of the links on the page work :-(
<pitti> chrisccoulson: did you ever happen to have a look why gnome-session needs .5 seconds (without 100% cpu) to start the autostart files?
<pitti> oh, at least half of it is gconf apparently
<pitti> gosh, I really want to use this 1 s CPU time
<Riddell> asac: rick talked to mconnor
<asac> ok i will check with rick
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti - yes, about 200ms is reading autostart files on the mini
<pitti> chrisccoulson: and the rest is gconf startup?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - there's a breakdown on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Lucid/StartupSpeed , although that's slightly out of date now
<chrisccoulson> it's actually 50ms for the autostart files on the mini
<chrisccoulson> it was 200ms on my rotary disk
<chrisccoulson> the 150ms delay for starting upower is not there now either
<chrisccoulson> bbiab, another meeting to go too now
<pitti> seb128: oh, cups fix seems to win .1 s
<pitti> argh, I hit the "warp 10 barrier" again
<pitti> removing xdg-user-dirs autostart breaks plymouth again
<kenvandine> seb128, pitti: did either of you add the music store rb plugin to the seed?
<pitti> seb128 did
 * kenvandine doesn't know how to check that himself
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> shouldn't that be in the ubuntu-meta package?
<pitti> kenvandine: it won't appear there until the package is in main
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> I did the vcs change
<seb128> I didn't refresh and upload the package though
<pitti> seb128: that wouldn't be of use, since it won't catch universe packages
<pitti> kenvandine: yesterday you told me to hold back, because it's not working yet
<seb128> right
<pitti> so I sent it to universe
<kenvandine> oh... i didn't mean that...
<kenvandine> but ok :)
<kenvandine> as long as we get it in by alpha-3
<kenvandine> it doesn't break, just displays you a under construction page
<kenvandine> unless you know the magic ENV variables
<kenvandine> pitti, how about gwibber, can we get that added to the seed?
<pitti> kenvandine: did you see my responses to the MIR?
<kenvandine> oh... no
<pitti> that was a bit .. scary
<kenvandine> pitti, did you look at the autostart file?
<kenvandine> it is disabled
<pitti> kenvandine: ah, ok; ignore that bit then
<kenvandine> :)
<pitti> however, why ship a disabled autostart file?
<kenvandine> it is there so you can just check the box :)
<kenvandine> it shows in the list, just unchecked
<pitti> ah, gconf option "start with session"?
<kenvandine> makes it easier
<pitti> I see; sounds fine
<kenvandine> ok, i have no strong opinions on it... but it shouldn't hurt startup time :)
 * kenvandine comments on the bug
<pitti> right, that bit is fine then
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> i changed it to new again :)
<kenvandine> thx
<pitti> kenvandine: that was just one third of the problem, though; responded again
<kenvandine> oh
 * kenvandine read it all this time
<kenvandine> well indicator-me really needs to depend on it... or get an overhaul
<kenvandine> and
<kenvandine> most of those bugs should get closed, they are very old
<seb128> what should the indicator depends on?
<kenvandine> and gwibber has effectively be re-written twice since many of them were filed
<kenvandine> indicator-me should depend on gwibber
<kenvandine> since it relies on gwibber for posting
<seb128> I though we didn't want gwibber in the default installation for lucid?
<kenvandine> unless they finish the features needed to make it more dynamic
<kenvandine> which they say they will
<kenvandine> we did
<pitti> kenvandine: shouldn't it rather hide the input box if gwibber is not installed?
<kenvandine> it was a pretty important deliverable for lucid
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> that is the plan
<seb128> I had the impression at the sprint that it was on by default for une
<pitti> ok
<kenvandine> i hope that is in today's upload
<seb128> and not for lucid desktop
<pitti> a dependency from the indicator sounds wrong
<seb128> yes it does
<seb128> there is many people not using microbloging
<kenvandine> well, it should be a recommends
<pitti> seb128: it's seeded on netbook only ATM
<kenvandine> but it was an important goal for lucid
<kenvandine> to include it
<pitti> kenvandine: well, if if gets included, it should be seeded
<seb128> right, I just though it good cut as many others
<pitti> not made a recommends of a random package
<seb128> ie too much to do
<kenvandine> nobody mentioned cutting it to me :)
<seb128> ok, I got the wrong impression
<kenvandine> i was told it was my top priority :)
<pitti> kenvandine: so, that was sort of my question
<seb128> I don't follow that up closely ;-)
<pitti> kenvandine: if it's a high lucid goal, then we can seed it, but someone needs to look at it in LTS
<pitti> if we don't have that resource, then we can't have it in main
<seb128> do we have space for it right now?
<kenvandine> yeah, we will need to make sure we follow the bugs
<kenvandine> i assume that will be my responsiblity :)
<pitti> seb128: its heavy dependencies are another problem (also mentioned in the MIR), but separate from the bug situation
<rickspencer3> ccheney, hi
<jcastro> kklimonda, great job on getting transmission 1.90 in!
<pitti> hi rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi pitti
<kklimonda> jcastro: thanks. chrisccoulson has helped too :)
<jcastro> woo team!
<pitti> kenvandine: well, yes, but this looks like it'd take half of your time?
<kenvandine> pitti, i am going to look at splitting those docs out
<kenvandine> pitti, we need to go through and expire or just close most of those bugs
<kenvandine> and we need to get more folks involved in triaging them
<pitti> kenvandine: we also have all these new indicators to care for, they are still buggy and need fixing/triaging
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> i know
<pitti> and csd, and all that new stuff
<pitti> I'm just afraid that we are overloading ourselves
<kenvandine> yeah... for an LTS
<seb128> +1
<pitti> and at the current pace the current gwibber code will be horribly outdated in a year or so
<seb128> reviewing and maintaining all the appindicator changes will be a time sink
<pitti> yes, I don't think upstream will take them anytime soon
<kenvandine> jcastro will have fun with that :)
<seb128> well jcastro does what he can
<kenvandine> it's a hard job
<seb128> but the actual work fixing and updating those will be ours
<seb128> right
<seb128> that's why I expect many upstream will not take those this cycle
<seb128> which means we will have to jungle with that extra workload for a while
<jcastro> well, there's no time crunch for fixing them to get accepted upstream since 2.30 is basically finished
<seb128> jcastro, well, we want them in lucid
<jcastro> right, of course
<seb128> which means all the workload is down on the desktop team for lucid
<rickspencer3> well, considering that Gwibber is required by the Me Menu, what do you suggest seb128?
<seb128> ie we will have to review those, distro patch them, fix them and update them
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, hopefully DX will have that stuff so it is "optional"
<seb128> rickspencer3, I was under the impression that having the entry displayed when gwibber is not installed is a bug and would be fixed for lucid
<rickspencer3> seb128, but Gwibber *should* be installed
<pitti> rickspencer3: it really shouldn't be required
<seb128> or when gwibber is installed but you don't have microblogging accounts
<rickspencer3> I suppose someone could remove it
<seb128> well I have it
<seb128> I read facebook
<pitti> rickspencer3: it must be possible to remove gwibber without breaking the me-menu
<didrocks> seb128: +1 :)
<seb128> but I never used microblogging
<seb128> why should I have this entry which is of no use for me?
<rickspencer3> pitti, it hardly breaks it
<pitti> rickspencer3: i. e. it should be explicitly seeded as a top-level feature, not be a dependency
<seb128> it will confuse users rather being useful
<pitti> rickspencer3: exactly; that's why it's not a dependency
<rickspencer3> but I do think it would be better if the Me Menu had some way to show that it wasn't configured to work
<pitti> but anyway, seed vs. dependency is a tiny technical detail
<kenvandine> seb128, right... tedg is that magic infrastructure for handling that stuff in today's upload?
<pitti> rickspencer3: right, it should hide the entry field
<rickspencer3> but that seems like a minor bug level task
<pitti> yes
<seb128> yes
<seb128> what was the discussion about again?
<seb128> I think I lost track there
<rickspencer3> ok, I was commenting more on the concerns about maintaining Gwibber
<pitti> rickspencer3: the main problem that I see here is that supporting gwibber is a huge task, which we don't have manpower for
<tgpraveen12> kenvandine: is the me menu also supposed to set the chat status text in empathy ?
<pitti> well, we could seed it and then just let it bitrot in LTS
<pitti> but then it can just as well stay in universe
<kenvandine> tgpraveen12, no
<asac> bitrot in LTS sounds bad without knowing the details ;)
<rickspencer3> no
<kenvandine> tgpraveen12, and i think the design team will have a few UI enhancements to make it more obvious
<rickspencer3> Gwibber is an important contribution, we will have to maintain it
<asac> ack
<tgpraveen12> any specific reason why? it sure would be helpful as the status can already be set from there (busy,available etc)
<rickspencer3> however, the bugs that it will accrue will not be of the nature of eating your data
<rickspencer3> crashing your hardrive, etc...
<pitti> rickspencer3: but we can't sell it as a new feature with 50 open crasher bugs
<rickspencer3> so I don't expect we will get critical bugs
<pitti> (yes, I just got told that many of them are probably outdated)
<rickspencer3> it has 50 open crashers atm
<kenvandine> tgpraveen12, i think there are some plans for that in lucid+1
<rickspencer3> right, so those need to be fixed
<rickspencer3> the only way through is forward at this point
<seb128> which bring us back to the issue that we have too much to fix for our manpower right now
<kenvandine> tgpraveen12, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeMenu
<rickspencer3> seb128, but we can't say that our position is that we won't create any innovative features, and in any case, it's too late for that discussion
<kenvandine> seb128, we need to go through and mark all the old bugs as incomplete, or invalid
<pitti> gwibber needs fixing, indicators need fixing, csd will probably need more love as well, we still need to get faster by .8 s, and we are also supposed to fix many bugs in existing stuff
<kenvandine> since most of them are so old they aren't really valid anymore
<rickspencer3> the question is not "should we support Gwibber", it's "How will we support Gwibber"
<asac> what is coming for gwibber? i tried it yesterday and it felt quite incomplete feature wise
<pitti> rickspencer3: ok, that at least settles the MIR question then
<seb128> well we are not speaking about removing gwibber
<rickspencer3> look
<seb128> just about installing it by default or not
<rickspencer3> we have bugs
<kenvandine> asac, incomplete?
<rickspencer3> we have time
<rickspencer3> no reason to panic
<asac> kenvandine: lots of features gone from what we had in karmic. yes.
<kenvandine> what kind of features?
<rickspencer3> we just prioritize the bug and fix them in priority order until we ship as per usual
<seb128> we have too many bugs seeing the timeframe for lucid and our team ressources
<seb128> that's not going to work well
<rickspencer3> seb128, I understand your viewpoint on that
<seb128> that's the first cycle since warty I've the feeling we are not on position to get the quality we want
<rickspencer3> my point is that we have some time, and we have a system
<kenvandine> asac, services supported?
<asac> kenvandine: like clicking on !tags for identica ... and a bunch of others that came in my way (just reading part ... havent tried sending)
<seb128> we have too much on our plates there
<rickspencer3> first, everyone stop creating new features, it's feature freeze
<asac> kenvandine: also Home + Messages are really redundant (the same) for me now
<rickspencer3> now we fix bugs from here on out
<kenvandine> asac, oh groups in identi.ca? that might be a bug
<seb128> well it's better to be realistic on what we can do and organize work according to that
<asac> kenvandine: sure its a missing feature (maybe just UI)
<seb128> rather than opt for a non realistic strategy to admit in one month that it will not work because we don't have the manpower to do it
<pitti> kenvandine, rickspencer3: ok, updated the MIR, just leaves the heavy dependency problem now (but that should be easy to fix)
<asac> kenvandine: also twitter doesnt work at all for me ;) (but thats obviously not a feature missing i hope
<kenvandine> asac, that could be a ca-certificates bug
<asac> kenvandine: i will run it today again and write down what i find missing
<seb128> rickspencer3, ok, so we fix bug, what do we do about the stack of applications which are going to be ported to appindicators
<rickspencer3> rather than list the bugs here in a haphazzard manner, I suggest that kenvandine gives the bug list a good going over
<kenvandine> asac, thx
<asac> just took a brief look yesterday
<seb128> rickspencer3, we will need to review those changes, get them in shape, ship those and maintain them for there
<rickspencer3> (for Gwibber)
<rickspencer3> seb128, right
<rickspencer3> three things:
<rickspencer3> 1. find and fix the most important bugs
<rickspencer3> 2. ensure a smooth update experience
<rickspencer3> 3. integrate the latest and greatest from Dx and OLS
<rickspencer3>  
<rickspencer3> we've done this before
<pitti> rickspencer3: where in your list is "keep adding more bugs"? (SCNR)
<rickspencer3> there is no reason to panic, the distro is in good shape, and we are more than 2 months from shipping
<seb128> hum, I disagree but *shrug*
<rickspencer3> pitti, this is why I keep saying "stop doing blueprint work!"
 * pitti apologizes for being in a sarcastic mood
<seb128> no need to panic
<seb128> but it doesn't seem realistic
<rickspencer3> seb128, we go through this every release
<seb128> the indicators alone will takes weeks of work to get in
<pitti> we didn't add a million new features in hardy
<seb128> rickspencer3, well, usually I'm confident with the goals and the capacity we have to deal with those
<seb128> I'm not there
<pitti> well, we'll get some new employees soon, so that should help quite a bit
<seb128> and I think it's probably the first time I feel we are so crushed since warty
<rickspencer3> seb128, ok, noted
<seb128> sorry to bring that
<seb128> I'm back to doing things that need to be done in order
<seb128> let's see how it goes ;-)
<seb128> but I predict we will have difficult time to squeeze all we want in in that timeframe
<rickspencer3> what time frame?
<seb128> lucid
<rickspencer3> between now and release?
<pitti> well, we can squeeze it in, it just takes away time for bug fixing
<seb128> yes
<seb128> pitti, getting those +35 appindicator patches in will takes week alone
<rickspencer3> what's left except bug fixing, integrating app indicators, Dx, and OLS stuff
<seb128> without having those tested or debugged
<asac> just my 2c: the current lucid desktop i have feels quite good ... not sure what is planned to land late, but for an outsider it feels not that bad
<pitti> seb128: I don't think we'll take them all
<pitti> seb128: we should get the existing ones working well
<seb128> pitti, we have like 5 of those
<rickspencer3> and lots of them are just universe apps
<jcastro> we're going to have about 4 more
<pitti> hang on
<jcastro> there's no one barely working on the universe ones
<pitti> are we actually committing to applying them _all_??
<seb128> pitti, the lucid list has 19 + universe extra ones
<pitti> no way
<seb128> pitti, I think the spec has 19 for lucid
<seb128> + extra ones are bonus
<pitti> well, it's FF now
<pitti> so what isn't in now needs serious justification anyway
<seb128> isn't that
<seb128>  3. integrate the latest and greatest from Dx and OLS
<seb128> ?
<pitti> there's certainly enough time to fix the g-p-m one
<jcastro> we just really need brasero, gnome-bt, vino, gdu, and gpm fixed
<seb128> I though it was one of the lucid goal to have default install ported to those
<seb128> jcastro, + g-s-d I guess?
<rickspencer3> any app indicator that isn't ready to ship simply won't ship
<jcastro> those are the major ones, the others are in main but not on the disc and I don't think we should worry about them
<jcastro> seb128, oh right, and that one
<pitti> seb128: well, perhaps, but I'm not ready to willfully break working software; these need to be properly tested and be ready
<baptistemm> to whom can I ask more permission to modify bug in lauchpad ?
<pitti> i. e. exactly what the gpm patch was *not*
<pitti> rickspencer3: right, that was how I believed how it should work
<seb128> pitti, rickspencer3: so maybe part of my "we have too much to do" is that I though we commited to get those 19 apps ported in lucid
 * pitti sees a big *phew* from seb128
<rickspencer3> seb128, well, we want them ported, for sure, but we will ship the ones that are ship shape
<seb128> pitti, ;-)
<rickspencer3> hehe
<rickspencer3> ok
<seb128> rickspencer3, well I though have not ship shape was not an option
<rickspencer3> personally, I am a bit more worried about OLS stuff landing
<rickspencer3> U1 and music store being solid
<pitti> let's get 5 in top shape, not 20 barely working
<rickspencer3> sleep up this weekend kenvandine!
<rickspencer3> pitti, ack
<kenvandine> i plan too
<kenvandine> :)
<rickspencer3> we'll take the other 15 into Lucid + 1
<jcastro> pitti, I think we can do that now that ted is unblocked and can fix the indicator bugs blocking brasero, gnome-bt, and vino
<seb128> rickspencer3, pitti: pfiou, I feel better already ;-)
<rickspencer3> seb128, maybe you need a day off tomorrow?
<pitti> and before we take more we also ought to get an agreement with GNOME to bless the principle
<rickspencer3> oh wait ;)
<pitti> we can't sit on those forever
<tgpraveen12> asac: will nm 0.8.1 be in lucid?
<jcastro> after that it's just fixing gpm and doing gdu and gsd
 * rickspencer3 visits canonicaladmin
 * seb128 hugs rickspencer3
<kenvandine> :)
<asac> tgpraveen12: there isnt even a 0.8 final yet ;) (we are at rc4)
<seb128> rickspencer3, hehe, right, I just need to convince my boss to accept it ;-)
<rickspencer3> good news on the #1 front
 * pitti -> back to (*#$(#*$# boot time
<rickspencer3> I talked to marjo last night
<rickspencer3> he said the that QA team will put effort into really scrubbing for the most important bugs
<kenvandine> excellent
<rickspencer3> so that you all have more time to fix bugs rather than triage them, etc...
<seb128> rickspencer3, that's good news ;-)
<pitti> \o/
<rickspencer3> speaking of which, we have some "critical" bugs now
<rickspencer3> is ccheney around? they seem to be assigned to him and on OOo
<pitti> looking at qa.u.c.
<pitti> A total of 5619 bug tasks were fixed during Karmic!
<pitti> A total of 2085 bug tasks were fixed during Lucid!
<pitti> so, some way to go for lucid still :)
<pitti> but we are just after FF, so we didn't really _try_ yet
<asac> we are not even at a3 ;)
<kenvandine> yeah... and haven't even entered bug fix mode :)
<pitti> seb128: hey, you are #1
 * pitti pulls the gauntlet
<seb128> pitti, hehe
<seb128> pitti, stop slacking and try to catch with me :-p
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<pitti> You bet!
<rickspencer3> next release we will not leave bug fixing mode, I think
<rickspencer3> fewer work items in Lucid + 1 if I can talk you guys into it
<pitti> rickspencer3: hm, 10.10 is a crack cycle, isn't it?
<kenvandine> pitti, in theory it should be
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> but i wonder what other crack we can introduce that we didn't add to lucid
 * kenvandine ducks 
<kenvandine> :-D
<rickspencer3> pitti, the "crack"/"stable" cycle doesn't make sense to me
<pitti> rickspencer3: well, it would if we'd stick to it :)
<rickspencer3> I would rather we figure out how to make strong steady progress with innovation while keeping the quality high
<pitti> it was an idea that came up some 1.5 years ago
<rickspencer3> over a year, it's the same rate of change either way
<rickspencer3> yeah, but I don't feel that it is working well
<rickspencer3> seems to cause too much stress for us and our users
<pitti> rickspencer3: e. g. in karmic we got a lot of new infrastructure: upstart, devicekit-*, halsectomy, etc.
<rickspencer3> but now we have a rough estimate of work items per engineer that we can pull off
<pitti> rickspencer3: and in lucid we stabilized that
<pitti> or KMS
<seb128> pitti, did we? (SCNR)
<rickspencer3> so we can just meter that so we can have ample time for quality too
<chrisccoulson> urgh, i'm only 14th on qa.u.c this cycle
<pitti> seb128: well, at least KMS/udev/udisks/etc. are much better now, IMHO
<chrisccoulson> look like i've got some catching up to do ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I assume you will start catching up in 2 weeks ;-)
<pitti> of course we couldn't resist and again added lots of new crack to lucid, but landing the major changes of karmic in an LTS would have been plain mad
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i need to go on a bug-fixing frenzy
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: is anjuta horribly broken atm? I can't get it to save any of my settings
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: strange, I'm the global page, not on the canonical desktop team one :)
<pitti> rickspencer3: btw, I did some cleanup this morning, this is the current plan for beta-1: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/canonical-desktop-team-ubuntu-10.04-beta-1.html
<Riddell> asac: so do I get to upload firefox?
<pitti> rickspencer3: the big one is obvioulsy DX/OLS integration, then some stragglers
<pitti> rickspencer3: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-gdmsetup is the big ? here
<pitti> rickspencer3: it's a target of opportunity, and I just noticed that it has grossly overcounted WI
 * pitti fixes
<rickspencer3> pitti, why do we have *any* work items?
<pitti> rickspencer3: desktop-lucid-dx-integration has 18
<rickspencer3> even targets of opportunity seem like churn that make stabelization more difficult
<rickspencer3> oh
<jcastro> seb128, ok I just scrubbed through the list of app indicators, here's their status http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/379144/
<rickspencer3> well, fair enough ;)
<pitti> rickspencer3: the rest are things spilled over from a3, like finishing touches of a3 specs
<jcastro> I think we can do those 8, and the rest are either done or won't make it.
<rickspencer3> oh fudge
<rickspencer3> pitti, is adding non-import editing to f-spot on that list?
<pitti> rickspencer3: yes
<rickspencer3> where?
<rickspencer3> I see adding "edit in f-spot" to eog
<rickspencer3> and a design review
<pitti> rickspencer3: desktop-lucid-default-apps
<seb128> jcastro, thanks
<seb128> jcastro, what is gnome-cc? gnome-control-center?
<pitti> rickspencer3: hm, where is that; I know that I saw it, hang on
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - did you get a chance to look at g-u-s at all? I'm not sure if we need a FFe for the work on that now
<pitti> rickspencer3: ah, it's still on the a3 chart
<jcastro> seb128, the ones blocking on DX are mostly finished, they just need to fix the crasher and then test.
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> I don't see that happening
<rickspencer3> we need to get that done asap
<seb128> chrisccoulson, don't worry about ffe for that, and not yet thanks for the reminder
<rickspencer3> right after a3
<seb128> rickspencer3, we got gtk csd in lucid today btw
<rickspencer3> seb128, nice
<rickspencer3> I don't expect *any* bug reports from that :/
<chrisccoulson> pitti - do you know if there is any reason we can't have g-u-s in the ubuntu-desktop package set?
<chrisccoulson> (so i can upload it again)
<seb128> rickspencer3, too late, it breaks nautilus dnd icons already ;-)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I don't know; used/seeded by xubuntu, etc.?
<seb128> rickspencer3, that was sarcastic right?
<asac> Riddell: i will review and integrate
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i don't think it is. it's only pulled in currently via gnome-bt, which is already in ubuntu-desktop
<chrisccoulson> i don't think it's seeded by anyone else
<pitti> chrisccoulson: that needs cjwatson to fix then, I'm afraid
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks
<rickspencer3> seb128, well, I would say "ironic", "sarcastic" is a bit more extreme
<asac> Riddell: the patches dont have bugzilla bugs
<asac> i need the exact reference where they were taking from
<asac> bugzilla id + attachment id
<Riddell> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=528510
<ubottu> Mozilla bug 528510 in General "[Tracking] Port OpenSUSE KDE Integration for Firefox" [Normal,New]
<seb128> rickspencer3, yeah sorry I picked the wrong word ;-)
<rickspencer3> seb128, s;okay, I was just kidding, really
<seb128> hehe
<asac> Riddell: that doesnt help. there is no attachment there
<asac> great. there is not even a single patch attached to all those bugs
<asac> which bug gets addressed by firefox-kde.patch?
<asac> or is that a multi-bug patch?
<Riddell> asac: here's debfx, he's done the packaging of this
<asac> debfx: where did you take the patches from?
<asac> debfx: can we get doc on that?
<debfx> asac: the patches are from http://gitorious.org/firefox-kde-opensuse/firefox-kde-opensuse/blobs/master/mozilla.patch
<asac> debfx: thats our mozilla-kde.patch?
<debfx> asac: though that patch is based on a patched firefox 3.5 source
<asac> or all combined?
<asac> sure
<debfx> both combined
<asac> debfx: what is this cp $(DEB_SRCDIR)/toolkit/content/widgets/dialog.xml $(DEB_SRCDIR)/toolkit/content/widgets/dialog-kde.xml ?
<debfx> asac: dialog-kde.xml is copied so it can get patched
<asac> kk
<asac> debfx: was the rebase easy for 1.9.2?
<debfx> asac: not too complicated
<ccheney> rickspencer3: just saw you tried to call but call dropped when i tried to answer
<asac> debfx: do you have the originals still? so we can produce a diff?
<asac> would like to check if there is anything obvious
<asac> debfx: if not, its ok. i can review the diff on its own i think
<debfx> asac: which originals?
<debfx> asac: my patches are still based on the one from firefox-kde gitorious
<debfx> since firefox doesn't use system xulrunner anymore, we could cat both patches
<pitti> seb128: during boot we are running both xdg-user-dirs-update and xdg-user-dirs-gtk-update; do we need both?
<seb128> pitti, yes, it's -gtk running the other one
<pitti> seb128: no, I mean we launch -gtk-update from /etc/xdg/autostart/user-dirs-update-gtk.desktop
<pitti> and -update from /etc/X11/Xsession.d/60xdg-user-dirs-update
<seb128> right, we launch one
<seb128> hum
<seb128> that seems wrong
<pitti> and the Xsession.d is synchronously
<seb128> that one can probably be dropped
<pitti> user-dirs-update-gtk.desktop only runs on GNOME?
<pitti> OnlyShowIn=GNOME;
<didrocks> the one in Xsession.d is the one which handling the session
<didrocks> handles*
<seb128> didrocks, what session?
<seb128> didrocks, it's gnome-session which handles the session ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: add /etc/xdg/xdg-$GDMSESSION
<seb128> ?
<didrocks> seb128: I mean, the xdg path depending on chosen gdm session :)
<seb128> ~$ cat /etc/X11/Xsession.d/60xdg-user-dirs-update
<seb128> if [ -x /usr/bin/xdg-user-dirs-update ]; then
<seb128> 	/usr/bin/xdg-user-dirs-update
<seb128> fi
<pitti> didrocks: I don't mean 60xdg_path-on-session
<seb128> didrocks, ^ I'm confused
<pitti> didrocks: I mean 60xdg-user-dirs-update
<seb128> didrocks, what that has to do with gdm?
<didrocks> oh sorry, I was thinking about 60xdg_path-on-session, indeed
<pitti> 60xdg_path-on-session needs to stay of course
<didrocks> seb128: sorry, pitti found the misunderstanding point :)
<asac> debfx: you rebased ... rebasing can have bugs7forgotten hunks etc. anyway, nevermind for now
<pitti> rickspencer3, seb128: I need to leave for today, we have a concert
<rickspencer3> bye bye pitti
<rickspencer3> break a leg
<rickspencer3> (or maybe he's just attending the concert, not performing)
<didrocks> enjoy pitti
<seb128> pitti, enjoy
<pitti> seb128: if you are bored, feel free to eliminate the extra xdg-update call :)
<seb128> pitti, I doubt I will be bored
<seb128> pitti, any opinion about gnome-keyring btw?
<seb128> should I just upload?
<seb128> let's discuss about it tomorrow
<pitti> seb128: I'm fine with going ahead
<seb128> I'm officially not working but will be one hour around in the morning
<seb128> ok
<seb128> let's see how tonight goes
<seb128> pitti, enjoy your evening!
<baptistemm> both xdg-user-dirs-update and xdg-user-dirs-gtk-update are necessary
<baptistemm> yes I'm late
<pitti> baptistemm: I thought -gtk-update would call -update?
<baptistemm> hmmm ..
<seb128> it does
<baptistemm> I remember I did the initial packaging and both  were necessry
<pitti> so maybe we can drop the extra call from -gtk-update
<pitti> anyway, need to go
<pitti> o/
<kenvandine> later pitti
<didrocks> baptistemm: well, you need it to build xdg-user-dirs-gtk, I'll have a look if it fetches it then in -gtk-update
<tommy^m> hi guys, any chance we're going to see kernel-2.6.33 on karmic?
<baptistemm> Alex is answering me of the necessity of run both or not
<didrocks> baptistemm: thanks ;)
<baptistemm> <alex> baptistemm: xdg-user-dirs-update always run very early in the login
<baptistemm> <alex> xdg-user-dirs-gtk-update runs in gnome sessions at a later time
<baptistemm>  xdg-user-dirs-update is generally run by the x startup scripts rather than the session
<didrocks> right, but the question is: does xdg-user-dirs-gtk-update make an additional uneeded call to xdg-user-dirs-update?
<Amaranth> hehe, seems we're booting too fast now :)
<LaserJock> didrocks: around?
<didrocks> LaserJock: yes :)
<Amaranth> pitti, seb128: bug 523788 happens to me without plymouth, I think
<LaserJock> didrocks: did you upload the latest netbook-launcher?
<Amaranth> but as my boot is 20+ seconds it is very rare
<didrocks> LaserJock: right, yesterday night
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523788 in plymouth "Only see X mouse cursor on VT during boot" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523788
<LaserJock> didrocks: I noticed that -efl is now Recommends, which means I get a bunch of new stuff to install :(
<Amaranth> but I don't have plymouth installed anymore (thought it was the problem) and I'm pretty sure I got the problem at least once more while doing bootcharts last night
<didrocks> LaserJock: yes, the idea is for people not having a 3D driver to get a fallback
<LaserJock> didrocks: I kind of thought it would go the other way around
<didrocks> LaserJock: but as it's just a Recommends and not a depends, you can still remove it
<seb128> re
<seb128> did somebody ping me?
<seb128> xchat-gnome crashed
<didrocks> seb128: no, nothing
<seb128> ok weird
<seb128> the message indicator has a line for this channel
<seb128> and when I clicked on it xchat-gnome crashed
<LaserJock> didrocks: so -efl is for people without 3D drivers?
<Amaranth> seb128: yes
<didrocks> it reminds me a bug I had two weeks ago in accepting people in empathy
<didrocks> seb128: oopps
<didrocks> seb128: there is Amaranth
<didrocks> 17:50:34      Amaranth | pitti, seb128: bug 523788 happens to me without plymouth, I think                                                                                                                                 â halfline
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523788 in plymouth "Only see X mouse cursor on VT during boot" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523788
<Nafai> seb128, I reported this a bit ago: bug #520568
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 520568 in xchat-gnome "xchat-gnome crashed when selecting an xchat item from the messaging indicator" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/520568
<Amaranth> seb128: I was saying bug 523788 happens to me without plymouth, I think
<Amaranth> eep
<didrocks> LaserJock: exactly
<seb128> Nafai, thanks
<Nafai> np
<seb128> Amaranth, are you sure?
<seb128> Amaranth, what do you call without plymouth?
<Amaranth> seb128: no
<Amaranth> seb128: completely uninstalled because it added like 8 seconds to my boot :)
<LaserJock> didrocks: I see, kinda sucks to have 20 additional packages because of it but it makes sense, perhaps that would be something for documentation?
<qense> I'm using Gwibber 2.29.90 on Ubuntu and Twitter doesn't show up in my feed. Is that worth a bug report, or is the configuration at my computer wrong?
<didrocks> LaserJock: right, that if people have 3D driver, they can after remove the netbook-launcher-efl. That's why it's only a recommends. We just want to make it work for most of people :)
<rickspencer3> qense, it's worth a bug report
<qense> rickspencer3: OK, I'll report
<chrisccoulson> yay, it's snowing outside, just in time for me to drive home
<Amaranth> seb128: also, booting compiz with bare minimum plugins (move, resize, place, decoration) removes almost all CPU usage from compiz in bootchart and seems to cut 1.5 seconds
<Amaranth> that's without ccp, too
<Amaranth> but when I trim it down to what I would consider the bare minimum to make it worth enabling compiz (no animation plugin even) it doesn't seem to make any dent
<Amaranth> I guess I need to go through the remaining plugins and hope one of them causes most of the CPU usage but I have a feeling it's death by a thousand cuts
<LaserJock> didrocks: does Canonical do hardware certification for netbooks?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: ^ ?
<LaserJock> I'm wondering if there will be a known "UNE *will* work OOTB for these models" list
<rickspencer3> LaserJock, I think they did for Karmic, but I don't know for Lucid
<didrocks> LaserJock: I think the community page at least for that is good. I've chosen my netbook from it :)
<LaserJock> didrocks: do know what the URL for that is? I'll add it to the landing page
<seb128> Amaranth, did you remove those from the config or from the disk?
<didrocks> LaserJock: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupport/Machines/Netbooks
<LaserJock> awesome, thanks
<didrocks> LaserJock: some are tested on UNR other on ubuntu-desktop, so, be careful ;)
<Amaranth> seb128: both
<didrocks> LaserJock: but the page is pretty useful, right :)
<Amaranth> seb128: dunno if removing from disk made any difference though
<LaserJock> didrocks: it's odd that it's on wiki.ubuntu.com, I would have expected it to be on help.ubuntu.com
<kklimonda> seb128: new gtk+ update has made rhythmbox a real cpu hog when playing music :/
<seb128> just when playing?
<LaserJock> didrocks: I'll dig around wiki.u.c and see if there is other netbook help-type docs that maybe should get move over or linked to at least
<kklimonda> seb128: yes
<kklimonda> seb128: the moment I start playing rhythmbox starts burning ~25% of cpu and makes X work hard too
<didrocks> LaserJock: apart from that one, I don't know any other, but that worthes a look. You can maybe paste it on help.ubuntu.com and make a link from wiki.u.c to help.u.c.
<didrocks> LaserJock: thanks for your excellent work on that ;)
<kklimonda> seb128: when I close window it's back to normal
<bratsche> Hey.
<seb128> hey bratsche
<qense> rickspencer3: My problem was already reported in bug 521569
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 521569 in gwibber "Gwibber not pulling feeds from all accounts" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/521569
<seb128> kklimonda, bratsche is the one who worked on those changes
<seb128> bratsche, where would be the right place to open a bug? rhythmbox or gtk?
<kklimonda> bratsche: hey - my rhythmbox doesn't like your gtk+ :)
<bratsche> kklimonda: I'm putting some music into Rhythmbox now so I can try to test.  Sorry. :)
<bratsche> Damn, I should have just imported one album.  I imported everything from Banshee and it's taking forever.
<LaserJock> didrocks: np, it's nice to be able to do something useful for a change ;-)
<seb128> bratsche, you can close rhythmbox ;-)
<seb128> bratsche, close and reopen, that's usually efficient :p
<baptistemm> didrocks, from alex "they do completely different things, xdg-user-dirs-gtk-update tracks language changes and offers to migrate to new folder names"
<didrocks> baptistemm: ok, thanks, we'll rediscuss that tomorrow once pitti is back
<baptistemm> I did packaged it but I totally forgot its purpose
<LaserJock> didrocks: is there a URL for UNE specs/task list?
<seb128> kklimonda, can you open a gtk+2.0 bug on launchpad?
<kklimonda> seb128: sure
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> LaserJock: the current UNE specs from last UDS as just been completed as FF was yesterday. I'll give you the links for lucid +1 when next UDS will be prepared
<bratsche> kklimonda: I'll get it fixed up asap.  Thanks!
<LaserJock> didrocks: so all the specs from Lucid UDS got finished? or did some get deferred?
<didrocks> LaserJock: all for UNE in any case are finished :)
<didrocks> LaserJock: now, it's time for bug fixing
<LaserJock> didrocks: wow, awesome.
<didrocks> LaserJock: if you want to give an hand, I have a list of bugs that I want to be fixed for lucid. I'll try to setup an order and difficultie level :)
<kklimonda> bratsche: bug 523949 for reference and closing when fixed :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523949 in gtk+2.0 "after upgrade to 2.19.5-1ubuntu3 rhythmbox hogs the cpu while playing" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523949
<bratsche> kklimonda: Thanks!
<LaserJock> didrocks: sure, I'd have a look. I don't know that I have time to contribute much but I could have a go at it anyway.
<LaserJock> didrocks: is https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-unr-qa/+packagebugs a good list?
<didrocks> LaserJock: no, I'll setup it tomorrow and paste it somewhere in the wiki
<didrocks> LaserJock: I'll ping you in any case :)
<LaserJock> didrocks: ok, cool
<didrocks> LaserJock: thank you for your work there!
<seb128> bratsche, g-t keeps flashing too, I've not found what triggers it but that happens quite often, not sure if that could be a vte thing
<bratsche> seb128: Yeah I think I know how to fix that.  I'll do that after I figure out the RB issue.
<seb128> bratsche, do you get it too?
<bratsche> seb128: It happens when the title changes.
<seb128> bratsche, ok
<seb128> bratsche, I think evolution has a similar issue
<seb128> it's so sluggish today so I can't almost use it
<kenvandine> seb128, i just shaved 976K off the size of the gwibber deps :)
<seb128> nice
<kenvandine> seb128, can you review a debdiff?
<kenvandine> when you have time?
<seb128> sure
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> this package did some things i havent' seen before ;)
<kklimonda> kenvandine: is there any eta for music store launch you can give?
<didrocks> james_w: I can confirm that the first time I convert to the new workflow merge-upstream, the debian/ directory is removed. I'll try to give you a simple testcase
<didrocks> james_w: and the debian/ directory was never created/deleted in the upstream branch
<james_w> didrocks: cool, a test case would be great
<kenvandine> kklimonda, http://isthemusicstorereadyyet.com/
<kenvandine> kklimonda, alpha3 :)
<kenvandine> aquarius, i love that page :)
<dobey> haha
<kklimonda> kenvandine: nice :D
<aquarius> :)
<didrocks> asac: you didn't remove n-l-efl autostart file (it's a conffile), consequently, for people having it before, it wasn't moved :)
<asac> hmm true
 * asac remembers his dislike about /etc for system defaults ;)
<asac> didrocks: i am on a marathon call and wont be able to fix today. if you have a diff i can sponsor
<asac> didrocks: otherwise ill do first thing in morning
<didrocks> asac: I'll do that tomorrow morning, not so important right now and I'll propose you a diff
<didrocks> (and right, that's misleading)
<mdeslaur> bratsche: the new gtk+2.0 is causing my xchat and xorg to use all available CPU. I've added a comment to bug #523949.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523949 in gtk+2.0 "after upgrade to 2.19.5-1ubuntu3 rhythmbox hogs the cpu while playing" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523949
<bratsche> mdeslaur: Thanks.  Sorry about that, I'm working on it.
<mdeslaur> bratsche: cool, thanks
<bratsche> Although I need to get some lunch and run an errand now.
<bratsche> I'll be back soon and try to get it fixed asap.
<chrisccoulson> bratsche, have you noticed that the GDM greeter window is decorated now?
<chrisccoulson> i'm just wondering if that's due to the gtk update
<chrisccoulson> tedg - where is the me menu meant to get the face icon from? (i assume that the new version is meant to display that)
<chrisccoulson> i just get the stock placeholder icon
<tedg> chrisccoulson: I'm not sure actually davidbarth did that work.
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok. thanks
<chrisccoulson> i'll see if i can figure it out after dinner ;)
<chrisccoulson> the new menu looks pretty sweet btw
<bratsche> chrisccoulson: Yeah, that's due to the gtk update.  Will fix. :)
<chrisccoulson> bratsche, thanks!
<kenvandine> hey seb128, wb!
<seb128> kenvandine, hello
<seb128> how are things going there?
<kenvandine> seb128, if you have time.. i would appreciate a review/sponsor of bug 523969
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523969 in egenix-mx-base "Split docs out into separate packages" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523969
<kenvandine> good, i got the last two DX uploads
<seb128> ok, will do that in a bit
<kenvandine> thx seb128
<seb128> np
<baptistemm_> hello
<TheMuso`> seb128: thanks will take a look.
<seb128> TheMuso`, hey
<seb128> TheMuso`, it has been fixed since but thanks ;-)
<TheMuso`> Right
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<seb128> hello chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> still having this cold but it's ok
<seb128> you?
<seb128> kenvandine, the doc packages should probably be arch all
<seb128> or do they have anything arch specific?
<kenvandine> oh, ok
<seb128> I would also uses Replaces: rather than Conflicts: there
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i'm ok thanks. had quite a long journey back this evening though
<seb128> but maybe check with mvo I'm never sure about that and if both should be used
<seb128> chrisccoulson, snowing again?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, it's snowing again. but there's not very much snow
<chrisccoulson> the roads just seem to stop when a few flakes fall ;)
<kenvandine> mvo, if i am splitting out docs into separate -docs package (which of course has path conflicts), should that be a Conflicts, Replaces, or both?
<kenvandine> seb128, changed it to arch all
<mvo> kenvandine: replaces (<< ) should be enough
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> so what is Conflicts for?
<mvo> np
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> seb128, ok, fixed that too
<mvo> replaces just means "this package will replace/overwrite/take over some of your files"
<mvo> conflicts: the two packages can not be unapcked on the system at the same time
<mvo> (which is a much stronger statement)
<seb128> kenvandine, Conflicts is for things conflicting
<seb128> like things which can"t be installed together because one breaks the other one
<mvo> so for a conflicts apt will remove the old first before installing the new, but that causes more trouble for the ordering and more fs churn. that is not needed in a situation like this were just some files get replaced
<seb128> random example would be login managers if you couldn't select which one to run
<mvo> or two httpd
<kenvandine> ah, ok
<mvo> yeah, its confusing :)
<pitti> re
<pitti> ah, that was nice
<pitti> didrocks: "without plymouth" -> nosplash, or purged package?
<pitti> baptistemm_: thanks; I know that they do different things, but I thought that -gtk-update would call -update; anyway, I'll check that
<chrisccoulson> my laptop is not in a happy place right now
<kenvandine> pitti, i shaved the 2 egenie-mx packages down by 965K :)
<pitti> kenvandine: yay
<kenvandine> so i think they are no 70K and like 81K
<pitti> kenvandine: so all the docs/examples are in a -doc package now?
<kenvandine> seb128 is reviewing it
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> the docs are all pdf files, gzipped
<kenvandine> so huge
<kenvandine> but actually quite nice, i had never looked at them :)
<pitti> kenvandine: tomorrow's CDs should build again (unless someone else breaks them all over again tonight :) ), then we'll see how much we have left
<kenvandine> yay for documented APIs
<pitti> I think I fixed the overflow yesterday with chopping langpacks
<kenvandine> cool
<baptistemm_> pitti, alex larsson (the guy who wrote the two tools) told me their jobs was different. I guess -gtk-update can be deferred to the end on the session beginning without any problem
<pitti> baptistemm_: right, my concern was just that we call -update twice (once from Xsession.d/, once from -gtk-update)
<pitti> baptistemm_: thanks for the investigations!
<baptistemm_> you're welcome
<chrisccoulson_> the latest indicator-messages makes every messaging app crash at launch now
<pitti> baptistemm_: ok, strace says that it's not
<baptistemm_> you're doing the same job than me :)
<baptistemm_> I was stracing too :)
<LaserJock> chrisccoulson_: that's uncool
<chrisccoulson_> yeah
<pitti> baptistemm_: however, the code does have several spawns for -update
<seb128> re
<seb128> gna
<seb128> tedg, !!!
<seb128> everything using the message indicator crashes on start there
<seb128> ie xchat-gnome, empathy
<tedg> seb128: We're talking about it in #ayatana
<seb128> tedg, ok
 * RAOF passes on the morning upgrade, then.
<LaserJock> I'm going for the "don't log out or reboot whatever you do" route
<seb128> workaround is to remove the indicator message applet and stop the corresponding service
<dobey> yay. I don't have an indicator applet, so no worries here :)
<dobey> except I guess at some point soon the nm-applet icon is going to disappear from my notification area :-/
<seb128> no it's not
<seb128> the indicators fallback to notification icons
<dobey> oh
<dobey> so i am supposed to still have the pulseaudio thing in the notification area?
<dobey> because i don't :(
<seb128> no, that one is a system indicator
<seb128> it's just because we disabled the autostart for gnome-volume-control-applet
<seb128> you can reable it in your session
<dobey> oh
<dobey> hrmm
<dobey> i don't see it in the gnome-session-properties list
<seb128> I've dropped GNOME; from the ShowIn in the desktop
<seb128> so maybe that filter it out of the capplet too
<chrisccoulson_> its because it has NoDisplay=true
<seb128> it has?
<chrisccoulson_> and our patch to the capplet filters it out
<chrisccoulson_> maybe we should drop that from the desktop file then
<seb128> oh right
<dobey> mosquito.kill(weapon=sledgehammer)
<baptistemm_> who should I contact to have some permission to in the bug part of launchpad?
<dobey> permissions for what?
<seb128> baptistemm_, try talking to pedro when he's around
<baptistemm_> +modify bugs report
<baptistemm_> okay, I'll ask tomorrow, I wont be long to go to sleep, tx
<baptistemm_> pitti, could a power daemon or any power related software could affect the bug https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bluez/+bug/381913 ?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 381913 in bluez "InitiallyPowered and RememberPowered options from main.conf file are not honored" [Undecided,New]
<nekohayo> ping seb128?
<seb128> hi?
<nekohayo> I'm the main pitivi tester/ui nazi/etc., and I have noticed that *many* files are not properly detected by the gstreamer codec installer thingy
<nekohayo> I have put together this bunch of samples, ordered:
<nekohayo> ...urgh wait a sec my server is down :(
<nekohayo> anyway I have gathered lots of sample video files
<nekohayo> that I *know* work with gstreamer, but are not properly detected for the missing codecs dialog
<nekohayo> so I'm wondering who I should bug about this
<nekohayo> rickspencer3 suggested I ask you
<bryceh> nekohayo, cool that you have a good test suite built up, I don't know if seb128 has already put you in touch with the qa team, but it would be awesome to see that included with the general ubuntu tests
<nekohayo> seb128, http://jeff.ecchi.ca/public/gstreamer-codec-autodetection/
<bryceh> nekohayo, pedro or ara would probably be good people to speak with
<bryceh> think they're on #ubuntu-qa
<nekohayo> bryceh, well it's a "bunch of random video samples" for testing, it's not a test suite that I have programmed or something like that
<nekohayo> brb
<seb128> nekohayo, do you know if the issue is specific to ubuntu?
<bryceh> nekohayo, the qa team might be able to help massage those into something more structured
<nekohayo> seb128, not sure
<seb128> are you doing testing for upstream?
<seb128> did you raise the issue on #pitivi before?
<seb128> grrr
<seb128> I don't get this debian format3 system
<robert_ancell> seb128, do you know what Debian package provides the GNOME_COMPILE_WARNINGS autoconf macro?
<nekohayo> seb128, I filed a bug on pitivi but not yet on gstreamer, and I poked Tim on #gstreamer about it vaguely
<nekohayo> seb128, pitivi bug is https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=610325
<ubottu> Gnome bug 610325 in source list "codec autodetection does not always work" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> robert_ancell, gnome-common: /usr/share/aclocal/gnome-compiler-flags.m4
<seb128> robert_ancell, I think
<robert_ancell> seb128, thanks, that was it
<seb128> nekohayo, seems to be an upstream pitivi issue I think you opened the bug at the right place
<nekohayo> sure
<nekohayo> seb128, but the thing is
<nekohayo> it's not just pitivi.
<nekohayo> totem, too.
<nekohayo> as you can see in that folder
<nekohayo> so at least part of it might be gstreamer's fault
<seb128> on the bug you say some work in totem and not in pitivi
<seb128> some in neither
<seb128> you should open different bugs for those different scenarios
<seb128> and give a specific example for each
<nekohayo> specific examples: well just look at http://jeff.ecchi.ca/public/gstreamer-codec-autodetection/ and you'll see :)
<seb128> sorry I can't really look to it right now, lucid feature freeze was yesterday and I'm still trying to get some late changes
<nekohayo> ok sure
<seb128> maybe come back next week
<nekohayo> should I file a bug on a) totem b) gstreamer general c) both?
<seb128> or drop an email about that on the ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com list
<nekohayo> d) ubuntu ?
<seb128> well, whatever has the issue
<nekohayo> seems like all of them
<seb128> you can try gstreamer with gst-launch playbin2 uri=...
<seb128> if that fails to play a video and you have the codecs open on gstreamer
<seb128> if that's a codec installation issue and you know there is a codec to play the format open a bug on totem
<seb128> or pitivi if the issue is only with pitivi
<seb128> better to open on launchpad and bugzilla
<seb128> and give urls to the other bugs in the comments
<robert_ancell> seb128, hmm, do you think simple-scan is "gnome-like-enough" to be included in the feature freeze exception?
<seb128> robert_ancell, no
<seb128> robert_ancell, the GNOME ffe exception is made because they have known schedule and freezes for translations, etc
<robert_ancell> seb128, :P But I'm following that schedule...
<seb128> robert_ancell, but it should be pretty easy to get ffe exception for it by just pinging pitti for example
<robert_ancell> seb128, np, I expect the next release will be 1.0 anyway
<seb128> usually for such updates it's just ask, get a quick reply to upload and do it
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, I have a merge with Debian update, ok to release that?
<seb128> yes
<robert_ancell> seb128, also, I'm planning to propose it for GNOME 3.0, do you happen to know where the list of current GNOME modules/dependencies is stored?
<seb128> have you seen the email on desktop-devel-list today about that topic?
<robert_ancell> seb128, the request for proposals? yup
<robert_ancell> oh duh
<robert_ancell> tl;dr :)
<robert_ancell> getting the amount of email these days makes me skim read too much :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, I deleted the email now but there was no url or instructions there?
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, there was a url :)
<robert_ancell> Interesting - gnome-scan/sane are not part of GNOME
<seb128> ok good ;-)
<robert_ancell> pitti, who produces libgudev?
<seb128> robert_ancell, look to the debian copyright in the source?
<robert_ancell> seb128, thanks, was looking at packages.debian.org.  I hate how low-level projects often don't bother with a website.
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-02-19
<bryceh> how do you get apport to force filing a bug report even if you don't have all the latest bits installed?
<bryceh> nm, found it (rtfm bryce)
<bryceh> hm, don't work
<bryceh> pitti, APPORT_IGNORE_OBSOLETE_PACKAGES=true apport-cli -c /tmp/xserver-xorg-video-intel.2010-02-17_22\:31\:42.401787.crash does not let me file the bug
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, isn't simple-scan already in Lucid? why would you need a ffe?
<bryceh> hi rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hiya bryceh
<rickspencer3> bryceh, seems like a plan is coming together for xorg + kernel bits?
<bryceh> yeah, we still need to get apw's view on it, but I think we got a solid plan finally
<seb128> bryceh, I think that's because you already got the crash report ready for upload
<seb128> bryceh, the variable works if you didn't do the "report the bug" yet
<rickspencer3> anywho ...
<bryceh> seb128, basically I have the .crash file and want to post it to launchpad so I can see what info it's including
<seb128> ie if the crash file doesn't have the stacktrace processed etc yet
<bryceh> oh
<seb128> ie before the bouncing bar work
<seb128> so basically get your crash and run that command without using the ui auto opened
<seb128> rickspencer3, new versions of softwares which are not purely bug fix updates need exceptions
<bryceh> seb128, I'm trying to do this remotely because the machine's keyboard isn't working
<Nafai> Is there a way to find out where in my source these warnings are coming from? http://paste.ubuntu.com/379439/
<seb128> bryceh, well, if you get the crash report and run the command directly without doing anything else with it before that should work
<bryceh> eh, I'll just upgrade the box to latest and reproduce the report
<bryceh> heh
<bryceh> bryce@blumonc:~$ ls /var/crash
<bryceh> _usr_share_apport_apport.0.crash                           xserver-xorg-video-intel.2010-02-17_22:37:01.055233.crash
<seb128> you crashed apport? ;-)
<bryceh> guess so!
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, ffe requires "a new upstream version of a package" to get an exception.  I guess it depends how much you class Simple Scan as upstream
<seb128> robert_ancell, non-bug-fix-only-version
<seb128> robert_ancell, bug fix updates are fine
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> robbiew_: libgudev is built by udev source
<pitti> bryceh: hm, perhaps it's not an obsolete package, but a non-native one?
<kenvandine> hey pitti, good morning
<pitti> hey kenvandine
<kenvandine> i shaved more off of gwibber :)
<kenvandine> 200K
<pitti> yay diets
<kenvandine> removed icons we don't use
<kenvandine> and split out the extra themes to a different package
<kenvandine> no need to ship 9 themes :)
<pitti> kenvandine: nobody uploaded your egenix splits yet?
<kenvandine> nope
<kenvandine> seb128 reviewed it
<kenvandine> but i guess not uploaded
<kenvandine> bug 523969 if you want to look at it :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523969 in egenix-mx-base "Split docs out into separate packages" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523969
<pitti> kenvandine: opening a tab, will do in a bit
<kenvandine> thx!
<pitti> kenvandine: can you forward the debdiff to Debian in the meantime, please?
<kenvandine> sure
<pitti> kenvandine: oh, both mtools and datetime are the same source? convenient
<kenvandine> yup
<pitti> urgh, yay for not using standard debhelper
<pitti> kenvandine: thanks
<kenvandine> pitti, yeah... it was an interesting package to mess with :)
<kenvandine> but i just followed what they already did
<kenvandine> movefiles.sh is an interesting approach
<kenvandine> :)
<pitti> kenvandine: right, that "urgh" wasn't directed at you
<kenvandine> understand
<kenvandine> i had a similar reaction when i first downloaded it :)
<kklimonda> good morning
<pitti> baptistemm: hm, I'm not sure what you mean -- why would any other process influence how bluez evaluates its options?
<baptistemm> pitti, I don't know, The reporter sent a mail to the bluez mailing list and the developper said it was working for him, and asked if any component in ubuntu would influence the power preferences
<pitti> didrocks: what I feared: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-netbook/daily-live/current/
<pitti> didrocks: I think we need to cut some OO.o parts
<didrocks> Guten Tag pitti, wie geht's?
<pitti> hey didrocks, bonjour!
<pitti> I'm a bit tired, but great
<pitti> I got up at 6, the thought of my xorg blunder wouldn't let me sleep any longer :)
<pitti> (all fixed now)
<pitti> Xsession.d/* is now really streamlined
<didrocks> ohoh, you didn't dream about it at least? :)
<pitti> (and it only took 4 package uploads..)
<pitti> didrocks: no, only took me an hour to get to sleep :)
<didrocks> rahâ¦
<pitti> but that's fine, TGIF :)
<didrocks> how was your concert?
<pitti> oh, it was actually an iceskating performance
<pitti> "Holiday on Ice"
<pitti> artistic ice skating
<didrocks> sweet, I know it even if I never attended to their show
<pitti> great show, great costumes, nice music, and gorgeous light effects
<pitti> didrocks: how are you? survived the release day yesterday?
<didrocks> I can imagine. Glad you like it :)
<didrocks> well, they release late.
<didrocks> and as I'm still ill, it was not a very good experience :)
<didrocks> but well, new release ready
<pitti> urgh, so you are in the middle of the cold?
<pitti> didrocks: take it light then
<didrocks> exactly. I'll try to not make something too brain-damaged today :)
<didrocks> so, first fix this CD size
<didrocks> pitti: the OVERSIZE file is always empty? It's just an indicator that the CD is oversized?
<pitti> didrocks: exactly
<didrocks> ok, so, in that can, most of the time you look at the seed and look at what can be moved away, right?
<pitti> right
<didrocks> (I see OOo draw is a good candidate)
<pitti> didrocks: it's also helpful to have a rather clean chroot/pbuilder login
<pitti> and compare "apt-get install" download sizes
<pitti> to see how much dropping a particular thing will buy
 * pitti goes back to *nnnng* speed ups
<didrocks> pitti: hum, is it possible to install from the seed all softwares and try autoremove in the pbuilder ,
<didrocks> or you just try some kind of heuristic to see what overlap or not?
<pitti> didrocks: no, just compare "install oo.o-writer oo.o-calc oo.o-draw" against "install oo.o-writer oo.o-calc"
<didrocks> ok, trying that :)
<didrocks> thanks
<pitti> (no need to actually install, of course)
<didrocks> right, just have the space took on disk :)
<pitti> didrocks: no, not on disk
<pitti> didrocks: look at the download size (.deb size)
<pitti> didrocks: squashfs is compressed
<pitti> which is pretty similar to the .deb size
<pitti> didrocks: for "normal" .debs it's almost identical
<didrocks> pitti: oh ok, I didn't know it was corresponding approx to an ar archive
<pitti> for OO.o the .deb size is a little smaller, since OO.o uses lzma
<didrocks> noted
<seb128> hey there
<didrocks> hey seb128
<didrocks> seb128: how is your cold?
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> still there but it's not a really annoying one this time
<seb128> no blocked nose or anything
<seb128> you?
<didrocks> ok, a light one so :) You'll be able to enjoy your day off
<seb128> yeah
<didrocks> hum, not very good I'm afraid. I think the week-end will be a slackering week-end in my bed :)
<seb128> still working a bit this morning
<seb128> then I will be off for lunch and enjoy my afternoon
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
 * didrocks hugs seb128
<didrocks> urgh, we still install firefox-3.5 in addition to firefox-3.6 on netbook (it's only 0.1MB of additional download, but still). I have to fix also webfav to work with 3.6
<pitti> didrocks: shouldn't we just seed "firefox"?
<pitti> hey seb128, good morning
<pitti> seb128: wern't you supposed to have a holiday today?
<didrocks> pitti: for me, right, I just want to see why there is this "germinate workaround" before removing it
<pitti> argh, I have gconf-sanity-check back; I thought we disabled that?
<seb128> pitti, as said before I'm around a bit in the morning then away for lunch and afternoon
<seb128> will likely going to a spa or something this afternoon
<seb128> I still want to deal with some aftermatch of yesterday's update today
<seb128> after the "all indicator message app are crashing" from yesterday
<seb128> and gtk csd makes apps slugish and use cpu
<seb128> pitti, btw I uploaded libgnome-keyring to NEW if you can have a look
<seb128> pitti, I added the COPYING.GPL and upstream fixed that to git yesterday
<pitti> ah, thanks
<seb128> I guess it's ok until next upload?
<seb128> the code is basically a split of what was in gnome-keyring before I don't think it needs mir review
<pitti> right, no MIR necessary, just a new upstream version
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, good morning
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> how are you?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: btw, I'm taking another look at your 56gconfd-helper and "26_preload_sources.patch gconf"
<didrocks> pitti: after having look at the entire thing, I'm a bit concerning for the nebook image. I can only see this candicate: firefox 3.5 (wanting for lool to answer an only 0.1MB) and openoffice.org-help-en-us, and maybe computer-janitor-gtk?). openoffice.org-help-en-us seems to take approx 5MB, so that could work and enable us to add the music store plugin
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<pitti> chrisccoulson: seems it might get late honours :) and we might use  it after all
<pitti> chrisccoulson: after the latest optimizations, it now nicely squeezes into the free CPU slot before mutter starts
<chrisccoulson> that sounds good then!
<chrisccoulson> that's not a good start to the day - i'm out of coffee again!
<seb128> oh?
<lool> didrocks: sorry, what's with firefox 3.5?
<chrisccoulson> i should have got some on the way to work ;)
<lool> didrocks: Oh the seed thing, just saw it
<lool> This was a subtle one, let me recall
<pitti> chrisccoulson: none in the office any more?
<didrocks> lool: right :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - there is some other coffee in the office, but everybody else drinks instant coffee
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you don't have a starbucks nearby? ;-)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/daniel-lucid-20100219-1.png is normal lucid
<pitti> chrisccoulson: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/daniel-lucid-20100219-1-earlygconf.png is with your two gconf changes
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i suppose i could drive in to redditch and get a starbucks ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: look how the CPU usage nicely increases right after the last red bar (desktop startup)
<seb128> pitti, early gconf uses cpu for some 0.5s extra though
<pitti> seb128: right, but nothing else is in that slot
<pitti> so we might just as well start it when we have a bottleneck (gnome-session and nothing else) anyway
<pitti> instead of starting it later where we already have enough waiting processes?
<pitti> seb128: or do you mean it uses 0.5 s _more_ when you start it early?
<lool> didrocks: Right, so in theory this could be considered a germinate bug, but abrowser gets considered despite firefox being listed earlier (which will eventually pull firefox-3.5 in karmic); it was enough to list firefox-3.5 anywhere in the seed to get this fixed, so that's what I did
<lool> didrocks: Sadly, we need to bump this workaround with each firefox update
<seb128> pitti, the earlygconf is 11.5s the other one 11s
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i just noticed that. how accurate are those markers?
<pitti> seb128, chrisccoulson: anyway, I'm currently experimenting with something else still; I'm not firm yet that the gconf change is optimal
<lool> didrocks: I'm not sure whether cjwatson had particular plans to address this, perhaps we will just have to live with the bug
<didrocks> lool: ok, so I'll just list firefox here
<pitti> chrisccoulson: not very
<pitti> the end marker varies some plusminus a second
<lool> didrocks: blacklists would make it easier to manage, but are usually a last resort kind of thing, and not meant for this
<seb128> pitti, is that still worth spending efforts on boot speed now?
<lool> didrocks: You should list firefox-3.6
<pitti> depending on where it decides that the CPU is "empty" enough
<pitti> seb128: we are still > 10 s..
<lool> didrocks: firefox is already listed earlier in the netbook-remix karmic seed
<seb128> pitti, we are down to 10.nn seconds and the remaining part to optimize doesn't seem really GNOME now
<didrocks> lool: understood, updating now. Thanks :)
<seb128> pitti, did we say 10.00s?
<lool> (I checked karmic; let me check the lucid UNE see)
<seb128> pitti, or 10s?
<pitti> well, desktop is 5 s still
<seb128> because 10.8s is 10s to me
<didrocks> lool: it's the same, we still have the firefox-3.5. I just have to replace by firefox as it's firefox 3.6
<lool> Oh right we don't have a firefox-3.6
<lool> didrocks: firefox should be already listed
<seb128> pitti, is notify-osd dbus spawned when something open a notify bubble?
<pitti> seb128: yes (dbus activation)
<lool> didrocks: it's already there on line 94
<didrocks> lool: right, it's already listed, but abrowser depends: firefox
<seb128> pitti, I'm wondering what sends a bubble during that boot
<seb128> pitti, and if that could be fixed to not
<pitti> seb128: hm, good point; nothing is
<lool> didrocks: Hmm so?
<pitti> seb128: perhaps something querying for capabilities
<seb128> pitti, well nm does the "you can connect by clocking on the notifyicon"
<seb128> clicking
<seb128> or do you autoconnect to something?
<didrocks> lool: no more need for the workaround, right? as abrowser will be considered and pull firefox, no?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 / pitti - nm-applet
<lool> didrocks: firefox is explicitly seeded
<pitti> seb128: nm-applet starts later than notify-osd
<chrisccoulson> that shows a notification when it connects to wireless
<pitti> so that's not it
<chrisccoulson> hmmm
<lool> didrocks: We want to list firefox in the seed because we want to ship firefox, not abrowser
<lool> didrocks: the goal of seeding firefox-3.5 was for the webfav deps to be already satisfied by the seed when considered
<pitti> the things before are: gconfd, mutter, g-s-d
<lool> didrocks: But that's not needed anymore since we seed "firefox" and that satisfies the webfav deps
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i suspect that maybe my osd patch to g-s-d queries the capabilities
<seb128> g-s-d maybe does query for notify capability?
<chrisccoulson> i can look at that this afternoon and fix it if it's dong that
<pitti> chrisccoulson: it might defer that until it has a notification to show?
<didrocks> lool: hence my "no more workaround needed" as webfav deps are already satisfied
<lool> didrocks: it used to be too indirect that we had to have a workaround (we wanted to avoid mentionning the firefox version in the seeded packages), so we added the workaround; it's not indirect anymore, we don't need the workaround
<seb128> pitti, can you try a boot without g-s-d to see if notify-osd is still there?
<pitti> seb128: good catch!
<seb128> pitti, ;-)
<lool> didrocks: Exactly, but do keep firefox itself seeded on line 94
<pitti> seb128: sure
<lool> Just drop the Germinate workarounds sections with 3.5
<lool> *section
<didrocks> lool: oh sure, I didn't mean that :) I have also to bump webfav dep
<lool> didrocks: Hmm the webfav deps are broken
<didrocks> lool: webfav doesn't currently work with firefox 3.6, but I'll fix that
<lool> didrocks: These might just need a rebuild IIRC
<lool> Ok
<pitti> seb128: oops, I think it didn't like that; it's spinning on a black bg forever now
<seb128> weird
<didrocks> lool: thanks :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: is that patch in a plugin? or in g-s-d itself?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it's in the media-keys plugin
<seb128> pitti, did you move the autostart away or did you do your chmod trick?
<chrisccoulson> bbiab, i have my exit interview with HR now
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good luck!
<pitti> seb128: chmod
<pitti> disabled the plugin now
<seb128> chrisccoulson, does g-u-s need sponsoring btw?
<seb128> pitti, that might not work, gnome-session might be waiting on g-s-d to be done with registration to go to next steps
<seb128> pitti, I usually move the autostart away which makes it not try at all
<seb128> anyway turning off media-key seems better
<pitti> nope, still starts up
<pitti> I'll track that down
<seb128> pitti, can you look at libgnome-keyring now?
<seb128> pitti, I would like to upload the gnome-keyring updates which block on the lib to be accepted first before going for the afternoon
<pitti> oops, sorry; doing
<seb128> pitti, danke
<didrocks> so, no objection about removing openoffice.org-help-en-us from the netbook seed? I don't see any other opportunity of removal apart from computer-janitor-gtk
<pitti> uh
<pitti> didrocks: dropping presentation and draw is not enough?
<pitti> and -base?
<pitti> seb128: looks fine, accepted; thanks
<didrocks> pitti: presentation can be dropped. draw isn't listed, so it should be mixed with something else
<seb128> pitti, danke
<seb128> pitti, to main?
<pitti> yes
<seb128> excellent
<didrocks> pitti: but one of the point of providing OOo again was presentationâ¦
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<pitti> didrocks: hm, ok; perhaps we could drop calc then
<pitti> didrocks: (fair point, yes)
<didrocks> pitti: let me check
<pitti> didrocks: and we don't even have mono back yet, do we?
<pitti> seb128: so I dropped all the g-s-d plugins which link against libnotify, and now it's started later
<didrocks> pitti: 5 MB for calc apparently
<didrocks> pitti: no, no mono
<didrocks> pitti: and I think we'll be asked to bring the music store plugin
<pitti> seb128: I'll just start a dbus-monitor and see what else is talking to it
<didrocks> (just hope it's few KB)
<seb128> pitti, I guess every program using libnotify queries for capabilities at init
<lool> RAOF: Heya, you seem to be taking care of libdrm these days, any plans for merging .18 from Debian?  it fixes a nasty random crash
<pitti> seb128: right, it's in notify_init()
<RAOF> lool: I believe tjaalton is on it.
<didrocks> pitti: when you have some time: lp:~didrocks/+junk/netbook.lucid. simple-scan can be the next opportunity if we really want gwibber in :/
<pitti> didrocks: well, if OO.o is too big, we have to go with abiword and gnumeric, and then have space for gwibber, tomboy, mono
<pitti> didrocks: dropping simple-scan is fair enough (although it is quite small); it's not a netbook-y app
<didrocks> pitti: right, I'm still looking for an presentation software which can open odp as this is typically a netbook usage (making a conference)
<lool> RAOF: thanks
<tjaalton> RAOF: sure, I'll add patches to revert the two changes you mentioned
<RAOF> tjaalton: Thanks.  You weren't already on it?  I'll prepare a nouveau DDX upload that'll build againt it.
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128 - you can sponsor g-u-s if you like. it's in a workable state at the moment anyway
<chrisccoulson> i'll do some more work on that over the weekend
<tjaalton> RAOF: I was about to ask you where we stand :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how went your hr interview?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, it was ok. but i just wanted to finish and have my breakfast ;)
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> they didn't offer you some coffee? ;-)
<kklimonda> hmm.. looks like firefox is yet another victim of the gtk-csd
<kklimonda> same problem as with nautilus - when I rearrange tabs or drag selected text I see gray rectangle..
<seb128> issues were expected
<seb128> opens bug if there is none and let us know
<seb128> I will tag and assign them correctly
<seb128> it's still before alpha3
<seb128> we have time for bugfixing before betas and lucid
<kklimonda> yeah, opening it right now - LP was misbehaving once again :)
<vish> seb128: i was about to say "i didnt understand" what you meant in Bug #524301 , only now i noticed rhythmbox cpu usage :D.. duping my bug.. thanks :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524301 in evolution "Evolution slow when switching mails [delayed formatting]" [Low,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524301
<seb128> vish, sorry about the dup undup got some launchpad issues
<seb128> vish, but yeah, I think all the "$software uses cpu" are the same gtk issue
<vish> np.. thanks :)
<kklimonda> seb128: bug 524329 - should I tag next bugs I find as gtk-csd or just paste them here leave triaging for you guys?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524329 in gtk+2.0 "gtk csd change breaks firefox dnd text and tabs" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524329
<seb128> kklimonda, feel free to tag those gtk-csd
<pitti> argh, I still had nautilus disabled on the mini
 * pitti does a reinstall with today's image to get a clean slate again
<pitti> didrocks: any chance to get the ubiquity icon into the favourites for alpha-3?
<didrocks> pitti: oh sure, I was thinking of making iso testing next week, but I still can have a look now
<pitti> didrocks: no need to let everything drop, just asking whether that's on your radar
<pitti> didrocks: we can certainly survive another alpha if it's hard for some reason
<didrocks> pitti: I hope it'll not be so complicated. I have a little idea why we don't have it anymore, but I need to check that
<didrocks> pitti: today, I'm triaging and ordering bugs which should be fixed and those two (with webfav not compatible with FF 3.6) are on my first priorities
<pitti> didrocks: sounds fine
<didrocks> (the third being "no clock applet by defaut)
<didrocks> default*
<vish> seb128: another Bug #524304 probably gtk-csd related ?  you want all to be duped to the meta bug or want to track the different issues?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524304 in gtk+2.0 "High CPU usage with murrine progressbars" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524304
<seb128> reassign to gtk for now and keep those separated
<vish>  ok.. thanks..
<seb128> those might be apps issues too or theme issues
<seb128> brb
<seb128> pitti, did you measure what impact gnome-user-share has?
<seb128> on boot speed
<pitti> seb128: I didn't; I thought it was disabled by default?
<pitti> just reinstalling
<seb128> pitti, well it exit immediatly since no option is activated by default
<seb128> but you were concerned by the loading cost
<pitti> I thought it had an AutostartCondition?
<seb128> chrisccoulson's update add a delay to the autostart but I'm wondering if that's really required
<seb128> pitti, no, as said the other day I didn't do that because the server check for what is enable and exit immediatly
<seb128> pitti, autostart can check one key not combinaison, and since you can use it for webdav and,or bluetooth
<pitti> that still requires it to link, start up, and connect to gconf in vain?
<seb128> well that's what you said the other day
<pitti> but I thought the final plan was to run it on demand
<seb128> that's why I'm asking ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 / pitti - if we want to use an autostartcondition, i could add a new merged gconf key to trigger the autostart
<chrisccoulson> i plan to do some work on this over the weekend anyway
<pitti> wah, fresh install, and it fails immediately
 * pitti purges plymouth again and sighs
<seb128> well I'm wondering if that makes sense, I would expect loading cost to be marginal
<seb128> but since we are after 0.1 seconds
<chrisccoulson> pitti - is it worth me reporting plymouth bugs, or is it known to be broken?
<chrisccoulson> plymouth gets worse every time i try and install it...
<seb128> pitti, anyway it has a delay=15s with the upload I just sponsored from chrisccoulson
<seb128> pitti, so it's not a boot speed concern
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks for sponsoring :)
<pitti> seb128: I just spent two hours to eliminate 4 greps and two "which"es from Xsession.d .. :)
<pitti> seb128: ok, that should be fine
<seb128> pitti, it just seems ridiculous to delay things this way to win 0.1s out of benchmark effect
<seb128> but yeah, we are fighting benchmarks at this point
<pitti> well, shouldn't it start on demand?
<seb128> not working on improving any user perspective
<pitti> well, needlessly starting a program is not just benchmark fighting
<seb128> pitti, well, if you can detect that something try to push things over bluetooth that would be nice
<seb128> I'm not sure that's the sort of things you get events for though
<seb128> I would expect you need the service to listen for those
<pitti> doesn't bluez daemon already listen to those?
<pitti> we have a bluetooth applet and a system bluez daemon
<pitti> adding a third one for functionality that isn't necessary for most people seems to be a waste to me
<seb128> I don't have any bluez daemon running there
<seb128> and the gnome-bluetooth applet is not a server
<pitti> seb128: e. g. the bluetooth applet already notices new devices like phones
<seb128> it's an ui to configure bluetooth
<pitti> it could start g-u-s once it pairs with a pone
<pitti> phone
<seb128> right
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i could look at doing that. it would need to handle the case though where a user allows non-paired phones to send files though
<seb128> well right now as said the daemon start, check if anything needs it and exit
<chrisccoulson> which is possible in the UI
<seb128> which I don't think it's anything real world users would notice
<pitti> seb128: right, but what's the point in that? it's overhead for zero benefit
<pitti> if it's not running, then it won't be there when actually needed either
<seb128> well it doesn't exit if you need it
<seb128> like you do webdav sharing
<seb128> or bluetooth sharing
<pitti> we don't want to say "you must have your phone turned on and paired when starting your session"
<pitti> right for webdav
<seb128> well g-u-s shares things over bluetooth too
<seb128> you can browse your computer from an another computer too
<seb128> using nautilus
<pitti> that again requires pairing first
<seb128> depends of what option you selected
<seb128> as chrisccoulson's said there is a "share without pairing" option
<pitti> that would be a good autostart condition then :)
<pitti> and the rest on demand, triggered on pairing
<seb128> well we just start having or conditions
<seb128> right
<seb128> we have zillions of things which would be nice to have but limited manpower though ;-)
<pitti> seb128: how come you don't have bluetoothd running, BTW? did you disable it for testing?
<seb128> anyway delay=15s, load a binary which check keys and exit should not be end of the world
<pitti> seb128: right, but then we also have the option of not installing it in the first place
<chrisccoulson> pitti - for now, do you want me to add an autostart condition so that it only starts when sharing is enabled (it is disabled by default anyway)
<chrisccoulson> then we can maybe look at other alternatives afterwards
<seb128> pitti, that would break obex push for users though
<pitti> chrisccoulson: that would be nice (i. e. move the check from the binary into the .desktop?)
<seb128> pitti, I've bluetoothd indeed I was looking for bluez* before
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah. i don't like the current architecture anyway (ie, the daemon starts and then exits if sharing is disabled, and then the preferences UI spawns it again if you enable sharing)
<seb128> pitti, I think I agree with you because we need to reach that benchmark target but I don't think having autostart condition or the binary checking condition and exiting itself makes a fondamental difference
<chrisccoulson> which just seems weird anyway
<seb128> pitti, out of the loading things cost with is like 0.1s and would not be noticed by any users out of benchmark in practice
<pitti> seb128: not a fundamental one, of course; just wakeups, I/O, and some power loss, but nothing dramatic indeed
<pitti> seb128: but even with ignoring that the architecture doesn't seem very clever to me
<seb128> well I would expect that loading a binary and looking for some keys is not any costy on a modern hardware
<pitti> seb128: in terms of usability
<seb128> right
<seb128> it's just that we have enough to do without redesigning g-u-s now
<seb128> I would just say keep the delay key and live with the marginal loading cost happening 15 seconds in the session
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you are welcome do you the changes you suggested if you want though ;-)
<pitti> brb, I need my eth cable for the mini, to get wl through jockey
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'll have a look over the weekend
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks
<pitti> seb128: hm, current dist-upgrade wants to remove dozens of packages, and upgrade holds back libnome-keyring
<pitti> is there a breaks or so to earlier versions?
<pitti> or is it just missing newer gnome-keyring now?
<seb128> pitti, yes, libgnome-keyring and gnome-keyring need to go together
<pitti> ah, good
<seb128> pitti, I've uploaded it but they are one publisher run away
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> so with new indicator, gtk csd and new gnome-keyring we finally having lucid looking like an unstable version :p
<pitti> lol
<davmor2> Guys is it me or is synaptic a bit broken?
<seb128> define broken
<pitti> seb128: although with plymouth it has felt like that for weeks now :)
<seb128> pitti, you can get the gnome-keyring binaries on launchpad if you want to bootchart the update
<pitti> seb128: not _that_ urgent, don't worry
<seb128> pitti, ah right, I just uninstalled this one and forgot about it ;-)
<pitti> seb128: they are a tad slower (I measured them before), by .1 s or so
<davmor2> seb128: it's been open for 3 minutes and it's still reading the package list only the bar bottom right doesn't seem to be moving
<davmor2> seb128: meh just tried it in vm on normal desktop it's fine but on une it's broken
<davmor2> seb128: I'll try a vm version of une and see if it is broken there too
<chrisccoulson> excellent, my new desk has finally arrived :)
<chrisccoulson> 2 days late
<baptistemm> Â« Better later than never Â»
<chrisccoulson> heh
<baptistemm> :)
<pitti> bah, stopwatching the boot is surprisingly difficult
<chrisccoulson> is it too quick?
<pitti> no, but it all pops up at once
<pitti> you don't have any progress to guide you when to press the button
<pitti> so you have to stare like an eagle and train a little :)
<chrisccoulson> and not blink:)
<pitti> I want to measure the impact of bootchart itself
<djsiegel1> Amaranth: hello
<pitti> that collector process uses a fair bit of CPU as well
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, it would be good if bootchart is adding 1 second to the boot ;)
<pitti> 'xactly
<pitti> it'd be like Heisenberg
<soren> Do we know how much it adds? It must add /something/.
<pitti> soren: that's what I'm just trying to find out :)
<pitti> soren: given how much we fight for every bit of blue on those charts, the permanent blue "collector" process certainly has some
<soren> pitti: If I were you, I'd insmod something right after bootchart runs (or doesn't run), and look at kernel timestamps in dmesg.
<pitti> sometimes it's nice to actually have a hardware clock :)
<soren> pitti: ..especially since we're (hopefully) talking about sub-second delays.
<pitti> but those matter hugely these days
<pitti> with bootchart: 11.58 11.67 11.9
<pitti> without bootchart: 10.63 10.52 11.28
<pitti> (three identical setups/measurements in a row)
<soren> pitti: How are you timing this?
<pitti> so sounds like 10% overhead
<pitti> grub "press enter" until desktop appears:
<soren> Using a stopwatch?
<pitti> yes
<pitti> I think my human error margin is some .2 s
<soren> Well, if you want it, I have a module that just says "Hi, pitti!". The kernel's timestamps should be accurate enough for a comparison.
<pitti> soren: what could be a trigger then?
<soren> pitti: Add a Xsession thing to insmod it?
<soren> At a relevant time.
<pitti> that'd be start of session, not "session is done"
<pitti> but I guess it doesn't matter
<pitti> to merely figure out the overhead
<soren> Well, how does bootchart get called?
<soren> Put it whereever that is.
<pitti> soren: it collects for 45s and then walks back the CPU chart until the CPU dropped
<soren> Oh.
<soren> Oh, ok.
<pitti> so, my average times are 11.7 vs. 10.8 s
<pitti> so an 8% overhead is fair to say, I think
 * pitti lunches
<soren> pitti: lp:~soren/+junk/pittimod if you want it. It expects you to have your kernel headers installed.
<pitti> soren: oh, thanks!
<soren> pitti: Just "make" should do it.
<djsiegel1> pressing the power button on  my laptop shuts the thing off, where do I report this bug?
<pitti> djsiegel1: do you have gnome-power-manager running?
<djsiegel1> pitti: I can't figure out how to type | on this netbook!
<djsiegel1> so I can't grep
<djsiegel1> one sec
<pitti> lol
<pitti> ps ux > /tmp/ps
<pitti> grep power /tmp/ps
<didrocks> djsiegel1: or ps -C gnome-power-manager
<djsiegel1> no, no gnome-power-manager
<djsiegel1> oo ps -C
<didrocks> grep is expensive :)
<djsiegel1> didrocks: yeah in 1990
<djsiegel1> pitti: this is fresh lucid daily, running with no gnome-power-manager
<pitti> djsiegel1: hm, do you have a crash report for it?
<djsiegel1> pitti no
<djsiegel1> pitti mabe
<djsiegel1> maybe
<pitti> djsiegel1: if you start it from a terminal with --verbose, does it fail?
<djsiegel1> no, that works
<djsiegel1> power button now works as expected
<djsiegel1> djsiegel1-afk
<asac> hmm gnome-keyring is installed but not started correclty i am told by gajim
<seb128> asac, did you upgrade to 2.29?
<seb128> asac, did you restart the session since?
<asac> seb128: i dist-upgraded
<asac> rebooted
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> dpkg -l | grep gnome-keyring
<asac> gnome-keyring                        2.29.90git20100218-0ubuntu1
<asac> no process running
<seb128> no gnome-keyring-daemon running?
<asac> i can start it manually
<asac> no its not running
<asac> let me re-login
<seb128> do you use GNOME?
<asac> yes
<seb128> weird
<asac> hmm do i?
<asac> let me check ;)
<asac> DESKTOP_SESSION=gnome
<asac> GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION_ID=this-is-deprecated
<asac> yes
<asac> can re-login in 3 minutes ... have to wait for aarm board upgrade in ssh session to finish
<pitti> asac, ccheney: "identify reverse dependencies in stable releases that get exposed to insecure content" -> is there a list now?
<asac> seb128: its now running
<seb128> asac, ok, weird, I will keep an eye on bugs about that
<asac> yeah ... i think its a one time thing
<kenvandine> hey pitti, forwarding that to debian is at the top of my list today
<pitti> hey kenvandine
<pitti> kenvandine: so, I'm a bit undecided whether to sponsor it now (if Debian uses something different, we'll have a big naming transition game)
<pitti> kenvandine: OTOH, we'll probably survive that
<pitti> but we'd have to keep the changes for 4 releases
<kenvandine> pitti, i would hate for all those docs to go into one package
<kenvandine> it would be a huge package
<pitti> yeah, probably
<kenvandine> and usually you only need a piece of it
<kenvandine> i think all the docs are about 9M
<asac> pitti: blam, epiphany, liferea, bfilter, edbrowse, gluezilla, gnome-python-extras, chmsee, conkeror, fennec, galeon, gears, gnome-web-photo, google-gadgets, kazehakase, listen, miro, midbrowser, prism, tuxguitar,
<pitti> asac: ah, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Lucid/FirefoxNewSupportModel/xulrunner-list ?
<pitti> asac: so that WI is done, thanks
<asac> devhelp and yelp are questionable
<asac> i would hope we can say no
<asac> for those
<asac> yes
<asac> let me add that at the bottom explicitly
<asac> pitti: will you set that WI to done? otherwise i can do that
<asac> we are working on the backporting in a ppa
<asac> err upporting
<asac> while doing this we will decide what apps are causing issues and need to be removed
<pitti> re (sorry, phone call)
<asac> no need to be sorry ;)
<pitti> asac: devhelp/yelp> I agree, that's not exposed to insecure contents
<pitti> [arnegoetje] roll new langpacks to lucid with localized yahoo plugins that have a search code: INPROGRESS
<asac> thats partly done
<pitti> asac: ^ hm, that doesn't seem to be related to the support model?
<asac> pitti: rick added it there because we had no spec for the associated project ;)
<asac> you know ... this yahoo project ;)
<pitti> ah
<asac> i think the idea is that i add the search codes for the currently shipped localized yahoo things and then we roll a new set for a3
<pitti> asac: thanks for the heads-up; I set the WI to done and fixed the link to the wiki page
<asac> and after a3 we add the zillion others
<asac> locales we have to support
<asac> i guess that needs to happen today?
<asac> (e.g. if we want a new langpack set for a3?)
<asac> i can also update the few we have manually ... but thats painful ;)
<pitti> asac: AFAIUI, we're going to have a full export/-base rebuilds over the weekend
<pitti> those will be the a3 langpacks
<asac> pitti: do you know when the build gets kicked off?
<asac> e.g. what time?
<pitti> asac: not exactly
<pitti> asac: but if it's a lot of manual work, I don't think it'd be a catastrophe to update it post-a3
<pitti> by the time we'll release a3, we're going to have 100 uploads waiting anyway
<asac> pitti: there are forces that want the searchcodes for locales to be proper by a3 ;)
<pitti> ah
<asac> i will update the plugins by EOD
<pitti> asac: ok, then "today"
<asac> if thats too late then thats bad luck ;)
<asac> and has to wait till after a3
<pitti> no, should be fine
<pitti> asac: this just affects your xpi scripts, not the actual LP import/export, right?
<asac> it only affects the po2xpi data even (not the scripts)
<asac> the scripts are ready for what we want in a3
<asac> so yes, not import/export related
<pitti> kenvandine: great job on egenix!
<pitti> (uploaded now)
<pitti> it's too good to hold back :)
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> great
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> i'll get it forwarded this morning
<Riddell> pitti: is this the chart you were making for kubuntu? http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/kubuntu-dev.html  it seems to include any item for everyone in ~kubuntu-dev, I'm not sure that's useful especially with ncommander in that team now
<pitti> Riddell: right, that was the first shot at it; do we have a team which more accurately represents the people who are working on Kubuntu?
<pitti> kubuntu-members is certainly way too large
<Riddell> pitti: I'd rather it was organised by the tasks in Kubuntu/Todo than by people
<pitti> Riddell: I could make a report just for ~jr :)
<pitti> and attach the wiki page
<chrisccoulson> pitti - is apport meant to catch Xorg crashes?
<pitti> Riddell: do you want to update Kubuntu status on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus ?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, that shuold work again these days, we fixed it at the sprint
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, i don't seem to be getting any crash reports
<chrisccoulson> when my laptop freezes at bootup, there is a trace in /var/log/Xorg.0.log.old, suggesting X crashed
<chrisccoulson> in fact
<pitti> this should generate an apport report
<chrisccoulson> bug 491672 is the one i'm getting
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 491672 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[i945GM] X server crash (SIGSEGV) in lucid when cycling video outputs" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/491672
<pitti> chrisccoulson: anythign in /var/log/apport.log?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - there's nothing there
<pitti> chrisccoulson: do you have it enabled in /etc/default/apport ?
<chrisccoulson> Xorg appears to use 100% CPU after supposedly crashing - i wonder if it gets stuck in a loop somewhere in its signal handler
<chrisccoulson> apport is enabled here too
<LaserJock> didrocks: around?
<didrocks> LaserJock: yeah, there
<LaserJock> didrocks: so I was going to start taking a crack on documenting making the GNOME session into a UNE-like one
<LaserJock> didrocks: I wondered if it would be good to just basically give gconftool lines to do equivalent
<didrocks> LaserJock: no, symlink are better if we change the settings
<didrocks> so that the new settings are taken into account
<LaserJock> hmm, so symlink to /usr/share/gconf/une/*?
<didrocks> LaserJock: oh it depends, I'm thinking about doing it on system or per user
<LaserJock> I just don't know enough of how gconf config dirs work
<didrocks> on system yes, that's it with also symlinking /etc/xdg/xdg-une/* to /etc/xdg/ (symlink file by file)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: perhaps; it worked fine when I tested it last
<didrocks> LaserJock: let's tackle the system one at first
<pitti> chrisccoulson: could you kill -SEGV xorg at some point and see whehter that works?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: (I suppose it does)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah
<chrisccoulson> i can do that now ;)
<chrisccoulson> brb
<didrocks> LaserJock: so, right, symlinking the mandatory and default file (symlink each file, not the directory) to /usr/share/gconf/default/
<LaserJock> didrocks: makes sense
<didrocks> LaserJock: and then, run update-gconf-defaults
<didrocks> LaserJock: (in the GNOME session)
<LaserJock> ok, that makes a lot of sense
<didrocks> LaserJock: ping me for a review, we will tackle per-user settings in a second round :)
<slomo> seb128: you might want to sync all the new gstreamer pre-releases before everything is frozen too much ;)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - that doesn't work either
<chrisccoulson> Xorg just gets stuck in a loop
<pitti> ok, seems it broke yet again then
<chrisccoulson> that's not an apport issue though is it?
<chrisccoulson> i might debug it later
<chrisccoulson> in the meantime, i've got some desk-building to do
<pitti> chrisccoulson: no, it seems the Xorg signal handler is broken again
<chrisccoulson> pitti - can you recreate that?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: can try later; I'm in the middle of something, I need X
<chrisccoulson> pitti - no worries. i might do some X debugging later and see if i can figure it out ;)
<rickspencer3> pitti, bryceh, didrocks, kenvandine, seb128, Riddell good morning/afternoon/evening
<pitti> hi rickspencer3
<didrocks> good morning rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> oh good, seb128 is out on his break
<rickspencer3> folks ... it's been a long few weeks I know, lots of hard work ...
<rickspencer3> so I want to encourage folks, don't fall into the trap of working this weekend!!
<rickspencer3> I beg you, take the weekend off
<rickspencer3> this is a marathon, not a sprint
<rickspencer3> there is still 2+ months until we ship ... so take care of yourselves ... the desktop will ship as schedule on the 29th
<rickspencer3> if you are thinking about working this weekend because something seems too important, ask yourself ...
<Riddell> hi
<rickspencer3> "what would happen if I got hit by a bus"?
<rickspencer3> chances are, when you think about it, you will see that Ubuntu will ship and all will be well
<Riddell> uh oh, I said I would go to (another) KDE 4.4 release party tomorrow, does that count? :)
<rickspencer3> Riddell, parties do not count ;)
<rickspencer3> Riddell, where is my invitation? 'pose it was lost in the mail
<Riddell> oh phew
<Riddell> you missed a fun one in DC last week
<ccheney> http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/daniel-lucid-20100218-1-hacked.png <- Yipee! :)
<ccheney> 9.98s
<kenvandine> ccheney, wow...
<ccheney> looks like without the 'hacked' we are still about .5 - 1.0 second off from that
<LaserJock> didrocks: so, I tried it out and it works well. The only thing is the netbook-launcher favorites seem duplicated (2 of each)
<LaserJock> I'm not sure if that's something I did on my system or not
<pitti> ccheney: :)
<pitti> ccheney: but that was (1) exceptionally lucky, and (2) a bit stripped down
<pitti> ccheney: in the meantime I uploaded the Xsession.d/ cleanup
<pitti> but I didn't upload the "early mutter startup" one yet
<pitti> I'm not so sure about this
<didrocks> LaserJock: hum, I think it should be on your user level, I don't have other explanation currently, but that has to be tried on a vm
<TeTeT> asac: do you think that upstream will accept my blacklisting patch for modem manager, see https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=608022
<ubottu> Gnome bug 608022 in ModemManager "Autoprobing makes serial non-modem devices unusable" [Normal,Needinfo]
<asac> TeTeT: will poke dan when i see him
<TeTeT> asac: thanks
<LaserJock> didrocks: yeah, and not a big deal either. I suppose I should also have the -efl equivalent too. One sec and I'll have it up in a wiki page
<didrocks> LaserJock: sweet!
<asac> TeTeT: in top comment he said we want to blacklist by vid/pid ... is tat what thi spatch does
<asac> ?
<asac> TeTeT: maybe attach an example blacklist
<TeTeT> asac: nope, it blacklists by device file name
<TeTeT> asac: I don't know enough about the probing unfortunately
<asac> TeTeT: thats like ttyS0?
<TeTeT> asac: exactly
<asac> TeTeT: yeah. he will reject it then.
<asac> the blacklist needs to be by pid/vid
<TeTeT> asac: ok, good to know
<asac> actually i think the right way is to add a udev LABEL
<asac> so you can deploy that in udev/rules.d
<asac> like MM_MODEM_PROBE_BLACKLIST
<asac> TeTeT: check /lib/udev/rules.d/77-mm-ericsson-mbm.rules
<asac> there they add ID_MM_ERICSSON_MBM label
<asac> we could use the same for blacklisting and then make the  patch to just ignore devices with such a label
<TeTeT> asac: great idea, but I fear my coding knowledge is not good enough for such a patch
<TeTeT> asac: I wouldn't know where to look for the label in the datastructure
<asac> TeTeT: it should be much simpler
<asac> rather than the whole code you just use one gudev call to get check whether such a property exists
<asac> i think its g_udev_device_get_property
<ccheney> pitti: good luck :)
<asac> or g_udev_device_get_property_as_boolean
<asac> pitti: is ^^ the func to get such a ENV{...} ?
<pitti> asac: correct
<asac> TeTeT: maybe even just g_udev_device_get_property_keys
<TeTeT> asac: looks like a possibility
<asac> TeTeT: so yeah. just replace the "is_blacklisted" call with that and then you are done
<asac> and you can blacklist modems like in the mbm rules (just with the right label)
<TeTeT> asac: mbm rules?
<asac> /lib/udev/rules.d/77-mm-ericsson-mbm.rules
<TeTeT> ok
<asac> ATTRS{idVendor}=="0bdb", ATTRS{idProduct}=="190a", ENV{ID_MM_BLACKLISTED}="1"
<asac> pitti: what is ID_ used for? is there a rule?
<asac> guess ID_ is wrong for this ;)
<TeTeT> ?
<pitti> asac: I don't know about ID_MM_BLACKLISTED
<asac> pitti: no ... what i mean: is ID_ a standing prefix used in udev world for some kind of stuff
<asac> ?
<asac> or is that just MM invention?
<pitti> asac: no, it's pure convention
<pitti> it's not magic in any way
<asac> TeTeT: try http://pastebin.com/d700ac834
<asac> pitti: right. just wanted to know what kind of convention that is
<asac> if its usually used for X ... i dont want to use it for Y ... but nevermind
<asac> dan can just fix the variable as he wishes
<asac> TeTeT: oh that has syntax probs ... one second
<pitti> asac: it's usually used for any kind of "ID"entification from the device itself
<pitti> asac: things like vendor names, partition types, drive labels, serial numbers
<pitti> asac: or driver names
<TeTeT> asac: why not has_property_as_boolean?
<asac> TeTeT: cat attachment.cgi\?id\=154040  | pastebinit
<pitti> but there's no strong policy on that
<asac> http://pastebin.com/d49062b2b
<pitti> the properties should be self-descriptive
<asac> TeTeT: i would say whenever that property is used we blacklist
<TeTeT> asac: ok
<TeTeT> well, it was nice to learn how to read a config file in gnome anyway ;)
<asac> lol
<asac> TeTeT: true.
<asac> TeTeT: i attached that patch to the bug
<asac> will talk to dcbw and commit it if he is ok with that
<asac> TeTeT: maybe confirm that it works as expected for you
<TeTeT> asac: I can't test right now, as I don't have the needed hardware, will query the customer
<TeTeT> asac: thanks a lot for your help!
<asac> TeTeT: yeah. try to build at least ;) ... no problem
<TeTeT> how to do something like bzr revert in git?
<TeTeT> nevermind
<asac> git reset HEAD^; git checkout -f (thats uncommit + revert)
<LaserJock> didrocks: does UNE-efl use maximus?
<didrocks> LaserJock: it will in the UNE session, I don't think it's compulsory, but it's better for the user experience
<pitti> DARN
<pitti> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/
<pitti> still oversized
<didrocks> LaserJock: it's just an independant piece of software which maximise every window
<didrocks> pitti: and no gwibber yet
<LaserJock> didrocks: yeah, I was just looking at /etc/xdg/xdg-une-efl
<didrocks> I'm afraid it will be really hard this time (and I don't want to imagine how it will be for the french remixâ¦)
<didrocks> LaserJock: right, but that will probably change soon
<LaserJock> didrocks: what will change about it?
<didrocks> LaserJock: having maybe maximus desktop file in it (still need to be discussed, but don't have the time today, I hope next week)
<LaserJock> ok
<LaserJock> didrocks: are there any public UNE meetings at all?
<LaserJock> I noticed that almost everything to do with UNE is pretty tightly Canonical
<didrocks> LaserJock: the meeting is here, in the traditional desktop team meeting
<didrocks> LaserJock: and specs were discussed at UDS, which is public
<LaserJock> k
<qense> kenvandine: I've found the Twitter issue for Gwibber: "error: (60, 'server certificate verification failed. CAfile: /etc/ssl/certs/ca-certificates.crt CRLfile: none')" Changing  'https' to 'http' in the URL_PREFIX in microblog/twitter.py solves the issue, but that's probably not the best solution.
<kenvandine> qense, ah... yeah
<kenvandine> jcastro knows the work around to that
<kenvandine> it is a bug in ca-certificates
<qense> ah
<jcastro> qense: I'll dig it up
<kenvandine> http://www.mail-archive.com/debian-bugs-dist@lists.debian.org/msg731602.html
<LaserJock> didrocks: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuNetbookEdition/ConvertGnomeSession
<qense> thanks!
<qense> kenvandine: I also see in my log that facebook:images and flickr:images don't work. Both keyerrors.
<kenvandine> qense, thank you!
<kenvandine> oh?
<kenvandine> file a bug on those
<qense> ok
<kenvandine> thx
<qense> thank you too
<TeTeT> asac: builds fine, I will install it now and see
<jcastro> qense: hey post your question on answers for gwibber so I can document it for everyone pls.
<qense> jcastro: I'll do it
<didrocks> LaserJock: rock! I read it and it seems correct. Just corrected a few typos
<LaserJock> didrocks: ok, well, we can tweak it as the release gets closer if needed
<qense> jcastro: https://answers.launchpad.net/gwibber/+question/101673
<LaserJock> didrocks: I tried to chase down some people who said they were working on some system docs for UNR last year at some point to see if they're still interested
<didrocks> LaserJock: right, there still have time. You should maybe link the page from https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuNetbookEdition*
<LaserJock> didrocks: yep
<didrocks> LaserJock: yeah, I saw you replied on the bug report ;)
<didrocks> LaserJock: if you can gather some community support for that, it will be really great. Also, there are a lot of new things to describe on the 2D launcher (beginning by "how can I swith my sessions") :)
<jcastro> qense: answered.
<qense> good
<jcastro> I wonder if that's something that would fall under the upgrade experience?
<LaserJock> didrocks: ok yeah. if you can give me a list of things you think should be documented I can start working on those
<jcastro> mdeslaur: what do you think? (he had the same ca-certs problem with gwibber)
<didrocks> LaserJock: just now, it's "switching sessions", describing the difference in the 3 ones. Also adding/removing a favorite in the launcher can be good. Maybe a FAQ with "why my window are all maximised"?
<didrocks> LaserJock: if I have further ideas, I will write them somewhere and ping you
<mdeslaur> jcastro: yeah, looks like the same issue
<LaserJock> didrocks: ok, great
<didrocks> LaserJock: thanks again for your work, that's really good and will help a bunch of people :)
<jcastro> mdeslaur: ok what radar do I need to put this on? I suspect with us shipping social-by-default that this will become a problem for people
<mdeslaur> jcastro: hmm...it should only affect people who were running alpha/betas of karmic and who upgraded from there
<mdeslaur> jcastro: I'm not sure where it could be visible...maybe it should get added to the gwibber website somewhere in a faq?
<mdeslaur> jcastro: the same problem probably exists for debian users
<jcastro> mdeslaur: release notes perhaps?
<mdeslaur> jcastro: also, it may happen for people who explicitly disabled that CA because of security concerns a while ago
<mdeslaur> jcastro: maybe release notes, although it's probably a corner case
<mdeslaur> it would hit developers, but probably not users
<jcastro> ok I will ask upstream to put it on the homepage, and then I guess we'll see if we get flooded with it. we can always add it if we need to.
<mdeslaur> what's odd is he says "...don't show up in Gwibber anymore"
<mdeslaur> like, how come all of a sudden
<jcastro> I don't think it showed up untill new-gwibber landed
<qense> At first I thought it was a bug in Gwibber.
<qense> did Gwibber switch from http to https between those releases?
<mdeslaur> qense: so this just happened suddenly?
<qense> mdeslaur: it happened after I upgraded to the new 2.29 release of Gwibber. With the previous release still included in Karmic it did work.
<mdeslaur> ah, maybe it switched to https
 * mdeslaur has no clue
<kenvandine> i think it was https before, but switched from urllib2 to pycurl
<kenvandine> so maybe that tickles something differently
<mdeslaur> maybe urllib2 wasn't validating the ssl cert
<qense> kenvandine: btw, is Gwibber going to switch to the https://api.twitter.com/1 URL?
<TeTeT> asac: your patch works, just blacklisted my 3G USB key. The specific module still detects it, but the generic one keeps the fingers off
<kenvandine> qense, no idea, that is a question for segphault :)
<kenvandine> is that the oauth new world order?
<qense> OAuth/RESTful, yes
<qense> more REST than OAuth, though
<kenvandine> ah... probably for next cycle
<kenvandine> definately not now
<asac> TeTeT: cool. maybe comment on bug
<asac> and post your example .rules
<qense> they say they're planning on releasing https://api.twitter.com/2 soon.
<kenvandine> ryan has looked at it
<mdeslaur> yep, looks like urllib2 doesn't validate server certs...a lot of good that does
<pitti> meh, seems that ICQ is thoroughly broken in empathy these days
<pitti> I only ever get "network errors"
<pitti> but it works just fine for my wife all the time (with pidgin)
<rickspencer3> pitti, that's bad news indeed
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, pitti, here's the scoopage on pitivi ...
 * kenvandine listens
<rickspencer3> pitivi teams thinks we should go with 0.13.4
<TeTeT> asac: done
<rickspencer3> this is a bug fix release
<rickspencer3> and will be out in about 2 weeks
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, i did notice trunk was more stable than 0.13.3
<rickspencer3> they think it will be ready for lucid
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, bilboed was pretty specific that we *should not* release 0.13.3
<rickspencer3> if we can't update to 0.13.4 for some reason
<kenvandine> ok, i would agree
<kenvandine> that was no fun at all :)
<rickspencer3> they are very focused on quality now
<rickspencer3> so I think we may end up in good shape
<kenvandine> i would say we should try to grab a snapshot then and upload before a3
<kenvandine> what do you guys think?
<rickspencer3> but no transitions or titles
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, I know you are busy as all get out, but could you check with bilboed before you do that?
<rickspencer3> or at least let him know
<kenvandine> give us a little more testing of something closer to what we are shipping
<rickspencer3> ?
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, definately
<rickspencer3> thanks kenvandine
<rickspencer3> is pedro on vacation or something?
 * rickspencer3 missed pedro
<kenvandine> dunno
<jcastro> yeah he's on holiday this week
<pitti> we can upload new upstream bug fix releases for another 6 weeks, so I don't see a problem here
<rickspencer3> pitti, ack
<jcastro> should I have him arrange some pitivi bug love days? I need to get gwibber hug days planned anyway
<rickspencer3> jcastro, take a look: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pitivi
<jcastro> rickspencer3: so are you saying we need more bugs reported or more bugs triaged?
<jcastro> because gwibber has like 145
<rickspencer3> jcastro, for pitivi, the bug list looks rather clean, or am I missing something?
<jcastro> I am willing to bet money it's clean because people aren't using it yet
<rickspencer3> jcastro, actually, I think community folks + pedro went through and cleaned it up
<pitti> you could check the "fix released"/"invalid" ones
<qense> there has been a bug day with pitivi as goal, eys
<rickspencer3> the last time I looked they were all "New"
<qense> yes*
<didrocks> kenvandine: btw, I tried gwibber and subscribed to identica lately. I used openid in identica to register, so, no password. I don't know which password to use for gwibber, especially that I don't get any error message even with "aaaaa" as a password :)
<jcastro> didrocks: you can't do that, to use the identi.ca api thing with a client you need to assign a password to your account there.
<jcastro> the openid thing won't work
<kenvandine> didrocks, oh interesting...
<didrocks> jcastro: hum, identica doesn't let me now set a password neither remove the openid setting
<kenvandine> didrocks, can you sponsor gwibber?
<kenvandine> it is now like 200K smaller deb size :)
 * kenvandine put gwibber on a diet last night
<rickspencer3> jcastro, it looks like on Feb 11 pedro and others triaged all the pitivi bugs
<didrocks> kenvandine: depending on how you can fix my issue with it :p
<didrocks> kenvandine: kidding, give me your branch ;)
<LaserJock> didrocks: is the 3D UNE session always the default? How will a person know to get the 2D version?
<kenvandine> haha... not sure i can do anything there
<kenvandine> didrocks, ~ubuntu-desktop/gwibber/ubuntu
<kenvandine> didrocks, should make the CD much happier
<jcastro> rickspencer3: ok well if ken ends up with a snapshot that will test upstream pitivi I'd be glad to take on an action to get people testing it furiously.
<rickspencer3> thanks jcastro
<kenvandine> that and trimming down the deps by 1M
<didrocks> kenvandine: it's not in the CD yet until it's in main, and the CD is already not happy :)
<kenvandine> i know
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> working towards that...
<pitti> btw, I got CDs to build again
<pitti> (ubuntu desktop)
<kenvandine> woot
<didrocks> LaserJock: for the moment, the 3D UNE session is the default (and the launcher fallback to the 2D one if it fails to init 3D)
<pitti> still 5 MB oversized with chopped langpacks :(
<kenvandine> :/
<LaserJock> didrocks: so if you want to go directly to the 2D session you can but otherwise it will essentially send you there as a fallback?
<kenvandine> and i want to add 1.2M :/
<pitti> something really grew in the last week
<pitti> well, FF brought a lot of new depends
<didrocks> LaserJock: right, (it doesn't switching your session, but just launch the 2D launcher)
<LaserJock> didrocks: do you think in the future there might be other 2D stuff that will further differentiate the two sessions? or will it hopefully go away at some point?
<bratsche> kenvandine, seb128: Just sent you guys an updated gtk+ patch which I think fixes that performance issue.
<bratsche> It's not fixing Rhythmbox for me, but I think my Rhythmbox performance problem may be different from what the original poster said.  Mine is somehow stuck trying to index my entire home directory and I don't know how to tell it to stop. :)
<bratsche> But it seems to be improving Evolution for me, and xchat seems fine.
<didrocks> kenvandine: missing Replaces: in your gwibber theme package
<kenvandine> ?
<kenvandine> oh
 * kenvandine fixes
<didrocks> :)
 * didrocks setup a password into identica
<cassidy> seb128, would be good to sync https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/telepathy-gabble/+bug/524417
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 524417 in telepathy-gabble "Sync telepathy-gabble 0.8.11-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New]
<didrocks> I'm sure that's the worst decision I took in my life :)
<cassidy> seb128, also, tp-sofiasip 0.6.0 (stable branch) and tp-idle 0.1.6 that I released this morning
<didrocks> cassidy: seb128 isn't there this afternoon, he will be back later or try on Monday :)
<cassidy> ok; that's not urgent anyway; thanks!
<pitti> kenvandine: so, you still need gwibber sponsored? is there a bug or branch for it?
<kenvandine> pitti, didrocks is working on it
<kenvandine> oh... i need to push
<pitti> ok, great
<LaserJock> didrocks: so have you seen this thing with the clock applet not always showing up in UNE?
<didrocks> LaserJock: right, I know the cause, it'll be fixed for alpha3
<didrocks> no more shared clock applet between UNE and desktop session.
 * didrocks hides from rickspencer3
<didrocks> pitti: pushed?
<kenvandine> didrocks, pushed
<didrocks> oupss kenvandine ^
<didrocks> thanks :)
 * pitti pushes his desk, but it won't move
<didrocks> heh
<kenvandine> sorry, people were asking me to upload crack in other channels (tedg) :)
<kenvandine> haha
<didrocks> kenvandine: don't trust those guys :p
<kenvandine> yup :)
<kenvandine> pitti, i uploaded a patch for indicator-application that fixes the crasher g-p-m was getting
<kenvandine> but fallbacks seem a bit broken still
<kenvandine> i won't upload that to g-p-m yet :)
 * didrocks wants upnp to get working again on rhythmbox (broken since csd update) :/
<kenvandine> :/
<didrocks> jcastro: still no upnp support in banshee btw? I tried to have a look and the mono upnp stack seems to be ackward
<pitti> kenvandine: btw, are you aware of broken icons in appindicator? Jockey's suddenly stopped working
<pitti> kenvandine: I'm fine to investigate and file a bug if not
<kenvandine> oh?
<kenvandine> not aware
<pitti> ok, seems not :) will send a bug then
<pitti> thanks
<kenvandine> maybe adding icon support broke something
<kenvandine> tedg ^^
<pitti> it removed icons apparently :)
<kenvandine> that should require any app changes?
<kenvandine> pitti, oh... is the problem that you see an empty icon?
<jcastro> didrocks: I've not heard an update on the upnp bits in a while, next time I talk to one of them I'll ask
<didrocks> jcastro: sweet, thanks :)
<LaserJock> didrocks: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuNetbookEdition/Sessions
<pitti> kenvandine: no, it's like a screen with a stop sign in it
<kenvandine> yeah, that is the broken image icon
<kenvandine> i think
<tedg> pitti: Do you use custom icons?  (like own theme type)
<pitti> tedg:         try:
<pitti>             indicator = appindicator.Indicator('jockey', 'jockey',
<pitti>                     appindicator.CATEGORY_HARDWARE)
<pitti> is one of that the icon name?
<pitti> ("jockey" would be correct for /usr/share/icons/hicolor/scalable/apps/jockey.svg
<pitti> or /usr/share/icons/hicolor/16x16/apps/jockey.png
<tedg> pitti: Hmm, yes, it should be.
<pitti> tedg: (sorry for dumb answer, I didn't write that)
<pitti> but I'm sure that it worked when I merged ronoc's tree
 * pitti is only here with half brain, release team meeting going on
<tedg> pitti: Can I just run "jockey"?  That doesn't seem to do anything.
<pitti> tedg: remove /var/cache/jockey/check and run jockey --check
<pitti> sorry, jockey-gtk --check
<kenvandine> crap... pitti can you sponsor this for me?
<kenvandine> lp:~ubuntu-desktop/indicator-application/ubuntu
<pitti> kenvandine: sure
<kenvandine> some of these DX packages keep getting the acl messed up
<kenvandine> thx
<pitti> kenvandine: it's not in desktop bit?
<kenvandine> not today :)
<kenvandine> it goes back and forth
<pitti> *chuckle*
<kenvandine> cjwatson knows
<pitti> you can only upload in even hours, you know
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> his script or whatever that goes through and applies the logic for the ACL makes weird decisions sometimes
<pitti> kenvandine: do I need to test anything or can I just blindly upload?
<kenvandine> thinks the indicator stuff is foundation
<kenvandine> i tested it
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> just upload
 * pitti debcommit -r
<kenvandine> it is fine
<kenvandine> :)
<tedg> Hmm, it must be related to jockey setting to "NeedsAttention" but not having an AttentionIconName set.
<tedg> I'll look into it.
<tedg> Definitely an indicator-application bug.
<didrocks> kenvandine: sweet, I've sent my first message in identica. sponsored :)
<kenvandine> woot
<kenvandine> thx!
<didrocks> kenvandine: but no feedback when the password isn't the good one. That needs fixing I think :)
<kenvandine> now to just find a way to bribe pitti into getting it on the oversized CD :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, i know... we are working on it
<kenvandine> it will likely require a FFE though
<pitti> kenvandine: uploaded
<kenvandine> thx
<didrocks> kenvandine: FFe, why?
<kenvandine> ryan is reworking some of the operations queue stuff
<didrocks> kenvandine: oh, I have the same issue in the UNE one :)
<kenvandine> in order to handle that
<didrocks> kenvandine: 5 MB oversized, removed OOo calc this morning, but still, we will need something for gwibber
<kenvandine> problem is the current operation handler can't distinguish when one service fails... etc
<kenvandine> so we can't handle the exception
<kenvandine> a bit of a design flaw :)
<kenvandine> we just can't fix it without a little bit more of a change than i would feel comfortable without a FFE
<kenvandine> i think
<kenvandine> we'll see what it looks like when ryan actually pushes the code
<kenvandine> maybe it will be no big deal
<didrocks> LaserJock: I've added some precision on the GNOME session, but otherwise, perfect ;)
<didrocks> kenvandine: ok, thanks for the clarification
<kenvandine> he should be done with it today actually, but we won't merge it until it gets some good review
<didrocks> pitti: btw, you used the commandline before to change the default session, but I added the functionality to gdmsetup too
<pitti> didrocks: oh, indeed
<kenvandine> pitti, btw i submitted that patch to debian
<pitti> kenvandine: ah, thanks
<tedg> pitti: Did you file the jockey thing as a bug?  I've got a merge proposal fixing it :)
<pitti> tedg: no, I just noticed it this afternoon when I reinstalled the mini
<pitti> tedg: sweet! I can merge it right away
<pitti> tedg: oh, against jockey or libindicate?
<kenvandine> indicator-application i am sure :)
<tedg> pitti: indicator-application :)
 * kenvandine is learning the indicat* stuff'
<kenvandine> only took a year :-D
 * tedg is so proud of kenvandine ;)
<pitti> I just say .*indicat.* and I'm sure that tedg KWIM :)
<kenvandine> hehe :)
<pitti> tedg: so you fixed it faster than I could ask "should anything be changed in jockey then?" :) thanks
<kenvandine> tedg, got a distro patch?
<pitti> tedg: isn't that called "bzr merge trunk" these days?
<tedg> kenvandine: give LP an hour or so to process it ;)
<kenvandine> haha
<pitti> i. e. why bother having debian/patches/ for trunk cherrypicks?
<kenvandine> but trunk might include more crack :)
<tedg> pitti: I don't think that we are doing, but they're getting merge into the ~ubuntu-desktop packaging branch.
<tedg> kenvandine: Not too much more :)
<kenvandine> tedg, sure......
<pitti> kenvandine: well, you could check that; or just cherrypick with bzr merge -c
<tedg> kenvandine: Give me time.
<kenvandine> pitti, then we have a mix of debian/patches and inline source diff
<kenvandine> pitti, perhaps after we clean the patches
<kenvandine> next time :)
<pitti> kenvandine: oh, we already have distro specific patches in indicator-applcation?
<tedg> kenvandine: Here you go, the patch is HUGE! https://code.launchpad.net/~ted/indicator-application/attention-icon/+merge/19728
<kenvandine> bug fix
<kenvandine> just one
<pitti> kenvandine: that's not merged upstream yet?
<kenvandine> it is, i think
<kenvandine> right tedg?
<LaserJock> didrocks: one more: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuNetbookEdition/BasicUsage
<pitti> kenvandine: so, your call obviously, but if we have everything in branches already, then personally I just find it a nuisance to deal with debian/patches/
 * tedg believes those Ubuntu people never send their patches upstream, that's what I hear atleast.
<pitti> no, they suck
<kenvandine> pitti, i agree completely.. i've been trying to conform to the ubuntu/debian way :)
<kenvandine> pitti,  i'll cherrypick them and ask you to sponsor :)
<pitti> kenvandine: oh, indeed, I just uploaded the same package :)
<kenvandine> yup :)
<kenvandine> this fix isn't in trunk yet
<kenvandine> waiting for review
<didrocks> LaserJock: sweet, you are really fast. Everything's ok, nothing to change :) I think those pages really ought to be linked from https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuNetbookEdition. Also maybe we can mention that UNE was called UNR before. Very good job!
<pitti> kenvandine: I think it would still work with bzr that way
<kenvandine> ok
<pitti> kenvandine: i. e. merge from that branch, and once that branch is merged upstream, bzr will know
<pitti> once you merge back from upstream to packagign
<LaserJock> didrocks: I have added the links on the main page under "Using UNE"
<LaserJock> didrocks: ah yeah, I'll add a note on the name change
<didrocks> LaserJock: oh right, should buy glasses :)
<LaserJock> didrocks: at some point some screenshots would help too, but probably after all the artwork is settled down
<didrocks> LaserJock: right, I don't know if we will use the traditional ubuntu theme or again the dust one by default. Let's wait later to see how this goes and which theme is going well we the netbook-launcher by default
<LaserJock> didrocks: hmm, is Lucid the first release as UNE or was Karmic also?
<didrocks> LaserJock: karmic was still called "UNR", so lucid is the first "UNE" one, yes
<kenvandine> pitti, can you look at lp:~ubuntu-desktop/indicator-application/ubuntu
<kenvandine> i removed the previous patch and cherrypicked it
<kenvandine> and cherry picked this fix too
<kenvandine> pitti, and it would be easier for you to test the fix in jockey... i don't remember how to trigger it :)
<pitti> kenvandine: my pleasure
<kenvandine> thx!
<LaserJock> didrocks: check out the 2nd paragraph of https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuNetbookEdition
<LaserJock> didrocks: not sure if that's the best place, but it's there anyway
<didrocks> LaserJock: seems good to me. The most important piece is that page to get found if someone look for "UNR" and not "UNE"
<LaserJock> yep
<LaserJock> didrocks: ok, enough docs for me for the moment. Got any bugs/triage/packaging that I could take a crack at?
<didrocks> LaserJock: some kind of week-end work? ;) Sure, I've triaged the bug I think that should be fixed on lucid: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UNE/lucid-bugs
<didrocks> LaserJock: I've already began those which needs to be fixed for alpha3, so, you can take others
<didrocks> LaserJock: I've tried to make categories by difficultie, but again, that's an heuristic :)
<LaserJock> didrocks: I've been home sick the last couple days == time to play on the computer
<pitti> sorry, got an X freeze
<didrocks> LaserJock: oh right, get some rest too
<pitti> kenvandine: ok, back to your sponsoring
<didrocks> LaserJock: if you are taken some, just assign them to you in LP so that we don't work on the same
<pitti> didrocks: I forgot, do you have a new seed branch?
<LaserJock> didrocks: ok, np, that's a quite a list, I'll have a look
<didrocks> pitti: lp:~didrocks/+junk/netbook.lucid
<didrocks> LaserJock: it's the "bugs which need to be fixed for lucid" from my point of view from triaging the 300 ones. No hurry, we still have something like 2 monthes to fix all of them :)
<LaserJock> didrocks: heh, "just" 2 months
<didrocks> LaserJock: for instance (5) is pretty easy, it's just asking to people in the bug report if they can try in lucid and see if the n-l-efl fallback works :)
<pitti> didrocks: I just saw that there's just one langpack on netbook right now :(
<didrocks> pitti: oh, how do you see that, on the MANIFEST file?
<pitti> didrocks: in the seeds
<didrocks> well, UNE is a really really big image so :/
<didrocks> let me look, to understand where the langpack are declared
<pitti> didrocks: rickspencer3 and I just wondered why
<pitti> didrocks: desktop has mono and tomboy  (which is 30 MB alone), and more langpacks
 * rickspencer3 pokes pudgy UNE
<didrocks> pitti: efl stuff + cheese ?
<pitti> didrocks: efl is 3 MB
<pitti> cheese sounds trivial
<didrocks> hum, weird
<pitti> I'll walk through manifest with a fine comb later on
<pitti> desktop first
<pitti> une is not really important to fit on 700 MB for alpha
<didrocks> pitti: I tried to compared the UNE seed and the desktop one
<didrocks> and I saw more apps (apart the one previously described) on desktop than UNE
<rickspencer3> pitti, didrocks don't forget to STOP WORKING this evening ;)
 * pitti is currently a bit lost; I think I need 20 minutes to catch up with all the sponsoring, bzr merging, and gwibber NEWing/promoting
<pitti> I'll be back in IRC in a bit
<rickspencer3> pitti, didrocks lets worry about UNE size next week
<rickspencer3> pitti, good idea
<pitti> right, but desktop size maatters
<rickspencer3> tty next week!
<rickspencer3> (yeah, desktop size needs to fit on a CD for A3)
<pitti> kenvandine: gwibber NEWed, FYI
<didrocks> pitti: I'll look at the UNE MANIFEST file next week. I only thought about the seed, but maybe there is something else
<pitti> kenvandine: once it's through the publisher I can promote it
<kenvandine> thx
<didrocks> oh langpack are on the ship file
<didrocks> pitti: if we can have a talk next week about the seeds again and description. The wiki page is not clear at all to me
<pitti> didrocks: ship> irrelevant for desktop CDs
<pitti> didrocks: "live" matters here
 * didrocks needs a map for all those files ;)
<didrocks> ok, so en and es for netbook
 * didrocks silently replaces es by fr :)
<kenvandine> :)
<LaserJock> didrocks: I could maybe have a look at the seeds this weekend if you like
<didrocks> LaserJock: no, don't bother about that, it will be boring I think (I've already went to the netbook seed today) and comparing the MANIFEST file seems to be a good Monday morning task :)
<didrocks> LaserJock: you still can have a look in case I missed something, but I think this is nothing really obviously wrong in it
<LaserJock> didrocks: fine, I had to do a fair amount of figuring out weird seed stuff when I did Edubuntu
<didrocks> LaserJock: right, fighting for CD space. Every 6 month I have to do that also for the french remix we ship in ubuntu-fr
<LaserJock> didrocks: yeah, I kinda fixed that with Edubuntu by going to a DVD ;-)
<LaserJock> but then it got to 3.5 GB real quick
<didrocks> heh, easy fix, but dangerous one :)
<LaserJock> but UNE doesn't ship gimp or OO.o right?
<LaserJock> I'd think it'd be decently smaller than Ubuntu
<didrocks> LaserJock: it ships OOo again due to community feedback
<didrocks> I removed calc this morning because we are already oversized
<LaserJock> ahh, dar
<LaserJock> *darn
<LaserJock> I love abiword and gnumeric
<didrocks> we'll see, that's still not the final decision, we depend on a lot of parameters, CD size being the main one :)
<LaserJock> yeah
<didrocks> the main issue is the lack of presentation software (odp reader)
<didrocks> because that's a typical netbook usage: go over a conference and make a talk
<LaserJock> didrocks: the latest daily has both OO.o and abiword/gnumeric
<didrocks> LaserJock: right, I changed that this morning, we'll see tomorrow
<Sarvatt> anyone still getting the sigquit and gdm restart when pressing enter after first boot issue? go figure after I build a kernel module to track where the quit signal is getting sent from I stop getting the problem
<didrocks> Sarvatt: uninstall plymouth
<Sarvatt> yeah I know that fixes it but I want to track down why :) its not happening with plymouth installed anymore here though
<didrocks> Sarvatt: for me installing/uninstalling plymouth was the way to trigger/removed the issue
<didrocks> oh really?
<didrocks> I had that issue in that box, I can maybe reinstall plymouth and give it a try
<didrocks> but lately some people still got the issue today (didn't know if they were up to date)
<pitti> rickspencer3, didrocks: ooh
<Sarvatt> http://sarvatt.com/downloads/trace-signal.c -- kernel module that will give more info on whats sending the quit signal to X's controlling tty when it happens
<Sarvatt> build instructions at the top of the source
<pitti> rickspencer3, didrocks: so the netbook CD has *both* OO.o and abiword/gnumeric
<rickspencer3> oops
<didrocks> pitti: why? it's not in the seed
<pitti> didrocks: apparently something pulls it in
<didrocks> (I rechecked)
<pitti> I rebuilt netbook-meta now, about to upload
<rickspencer3> thanks pitti
<didrocks> and it's still there?
<didrocks> so, ok, let me see the build log
<pitti> didrocks: it officially added OO.o back, but that is already in http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-netbook/daily-live/20100219/lucid-netbook-i386.manifest
<didrocks> (good debug seed experience ;))
<pitti> dropping abiword/gnumeric should free space
<didrocks> pitti: I guess I have to look at the metapackage build log, right?
<pitti> didrocks: just the changelog
<pitti> the build log of *-meta is very dull
<pitti> didrocks: rather, it'd be interesting to know what pulled in openoffice.org on the current netbook CD
<pitti> didrocks: i. e. by booting it and checking apt-cache rdepends
<pitti> didrocks: or, checking http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/netbook.lucid/rdepends/openoffice.org/
<didrocks> pitti: we added back OOo yesterday
<desrt> hello desktop people
<pitti> didrocks: yes, but only to the seed, netbook-meta wasn't rebuilt yet
<pitti> hey desrt
<rickspencer3> hello desrt
<didrocks> hey desrt
<desrt> any cool new tricks for alpha 3?
 * rickspencer3 needs to blog about that
<didrocks> pitti: oh, the CD is not from yesterday's seed?
<desrt> rickspencer3: :)
<pitti> didrocks: no, live fs is built from netbook-meta, plus live seed
<pitti> didrocks: anyway, might be a seeding problem. openoffice.org-help-en-us Depends: openoffice.org-writer | language-support-translations-en
<rickspencer3> desrt, I started a list
<pitti> didrocks: but the latter doesn't exist any more
<rickspencer3>  Desktop start time,  Social from the Start ,  Compiz effects
<pitti> ccheney, didrocks: so we'd need to fix the dependencies in OO.o to account for the fact that language-support-* is gone
<desrt> rickspencer3: i heard ken is working hard on the fspot editing thing
<rickspencer3> those are the "featurey ones"
<rickspencer3> desrt, yes!
<rickspencer3> desrt, I still think the plan we came up with at UDS was a good one
<didrocks> pitti: hum, how can it be an issue for the seed? we just ask for something that doesn't exist, so it's not pulled in, right?
<pitti> ccheney, didrocks: IOW, -help and friends shouldn't depend on oo.o any more, if we want to stop shipping oo.o at some point on netbook
<desrt> rickspencer3: ya.  me too.  i've run it by a few people and it's a hit.
<pitti> didrocks: right, I was wrong, it's not a seed bug (I thought so at first)
<rickspencer3> well, there is the ant-mono crowd that has some complaints :/
<desrt> rickspencer3: when we were thinking up the plan i was thinking "ok.  this will be nice but i'll never use it...."
<desrt> rickspencer3: but i'm running the patched eog now and it's actually *really freakin useful*
<rickspencer3> really?
<desrt> ya
<desrt> i got it wired into GIMP
<rickspencer3> desrt, that's really cool
<rickspencer3> nice
<desrt> i often find that i take a picture of something that i want to upload somewhere
<rickspencer3> desrt, that is really cool
<rickspencer3> *nod*
 * pitti is sorry that he has to drop German langpack from amd64 and French langpack from i386
<desrt> so i'll take a few shots... load 'em up on the computer to see what's best
<ccheney> pitti: ok i am needing to do a new OOo upload today anyway, so what should i change for it, just remove all the language-support-* alternates?
<desrt> *flip through with eog*
<LaserJock> I sure wish there was a good alternative to F-spot for photo management for netbooks
<desrt> "ok.  this one"  *open with gimp*
<desrt> that just got lots easier :)
<pitti> ccheney: yes, since they are gone they can just disappear
<desrt> *edit edit edit*  *upload*
<rickspencer3> desrt, would you do "open with f-spot?" as it has uploading to certain service built in
<rickspencer3> or will you stick with gimp?
<ccheney> pitti: and you said something about OOo-help needing to drop dependency on OOo itself, or did i read that wrong?
<desrt> rickspencer3: the patch is written so that it takes a .desktop file name from gconf and opens with that
<pitti> ccheney: once ArneGoetje is back I need to discuss the fate of language-support-en with him; that one still exists apparently
<rickspencer3> hmm
<desrt> rickspencer3: (including getting the toolbar icon from the desktop entry)
<rickspencer3> nice!!
<pitti> ccheney: we'd need that if we ever want to ship OO.o help, but not OO.o
<desrt> it's in my PPA if you want to try it
<pitti> ccheney: but on second thought this would be weird
<pitti> ccheney: so don't bother about this for now
<pitti> ccheney: I'll discuss it with Arne next week
<rickspencer3> desrt, I just looked, it is hot!
<pitti> ccheney: now that OO.o is back on netbook it's not urgent
<ccheney> pitti: ok so its fine just to drop the language-support-* bits then for now?
 * rickspencer3 adds open with -> photobomb
<rickspencer3> j/k
<didrocks> pitti: I'm trying to rebuild the metapackage to have a look about what's triggering OOo
<pitti> ccheney: please keep the -en ones (since that package still exists), the rest can go
<didrocks> pitti: with abiword and gnumeric
<ccheney> pitti: ok will do
<desrt> rickspencer3: some sort of 'upload this one' functionality might be cool
<pitti> ccheney: thanks
<rickspencer3> ooh
<ccheney> pitti: the various dictionaries, etc that do that also can be fixed or go back to sync with debian now too :)
<pitti> ccheney: anyway, I think that should help to drop the delta of quite some spell/thesaurus/etc. package, right?
<rickspencer3> like you could make a really simple app that takes a picture and uploads it, make the .desktop file, done!
<ccheney> pitti: yea
<desrt> rickspencer3: ya.  sure.
<ccheney> pitti: should remove the need for delta at all in many cases from what i remember
<pitti> ccheney: syncing is fine; nevermind explicitly uploading them, the extra deps don't actually hurt
<desrt> rickspencer3: i think that at that point we'd want to move toward better integration though
<ccheney> pitti: ok
<desrt> rickspencer3: it's one thing for us to say "ok.  fspot is how you edit apps on ubuntu, and if you don't like that, edit gconf"
<desrt> quite another for us to say "flickr is the photo service you use with ubuntu"
<didrocks> pitti: if I rebuild the netbook metapackage, I got: removed abiword and gnumeric, so everything's should be fine on next CD rebuild when you promote the new metapackage, right?
<rickspencer3> desrt, open with -> has a list for me
<pitti> didrocks: already uploaded netbook-meta
<pitti> didrocks: yes, once that's published, we'll rebuild CDs, and they should be fine
<desrt> rickspencer3: i mean for default actions
<rickspencer3> ah
<desrt> "preferred photo upload site" sort of like how we have preferred apps for email, browser, etc
<rickspencer3> right
<didrocks> pitti: sweet, we'll see the cd size then
<desrt> *shrug*
<rickspencer3> desrt, well, if would could just add cropping to eog, then it would get a lot simpler
<desrt> rickspencer3: and maybe redeye and brightness/contrast
<rickspencer3> yeah
<desrt> it already has rotate there... so obviously the infra exists for editing pictures and saving the changes
<rickspencer3> but cropping (imh and probably wrong o) is sort of the minimum to not need another editor "most of the time"
<desrt> maybe we could use GEGL or something?
<desrt> yes.  cropping is certainly the thing i find myself most usually doing
<desrt> oh.  and scaling.
<rickspencer3> I looked at writing a plugin, but the plugin arch. seemed all about editing meta data
<desrt> don't want to upload massive 290842megapixel pictures
<rickspencer3> true
<desrt> ya.  i tried the plugin route too, but it's a little too constrained.
<pitti> ok, I think I got all sponsoring/NEWing/seed shuffling done
<desrt> rickspencer3: you guys should consider getting someone on it for next cycle
<pitti> kenvandine, didrocks, rickspencer3: do you still have anything for me?
<rickspencer3> desrt, maybe
<desrt> "add crop and scale to eog"
<kenvandine> pitti, nope
<didrocks> pitti: for me, all is fine, you can enjoy your week-end :)
<rickspencer3> we're a community distro, so if someone wants to contribute that, we'd certainly be all over it
<kenvandine> :)
<rickspencer3> maybe someone on the team will be inspired to as well
<pitti> sweet, have a nice weekend then!
<rickspencer3> pitti, yes
<didrocks> have a nice week-end pitti
 * rickspencer3 things of silly long taking task to assign to pitti
<desrt> rickspencer3: i really hate hearing the words "community distro" out of you guys :p
<kenvandine> have a great weekend pitti!
<rickspencer3> desrt, oh?
<desrt> pitti: ciao :)
<pitti> rickspencer3: sorry, the timeout just elapsed :)
<rickspencer3> pitti, bye bye
<rickspencer3> ttynw
<desrt> rickspencer3: ubuntu desktop == canonical (within 90% certainty)
<rickspencer3> huh
<desrt> even if it's not true (and i really think it is), it's at least the perception
<rickspencer3> could be
<desrt> and canonical is a big company with lots of staff
<rickspencer3> I know we work with lots of differnet communities and work our asses off integrating contributions from all over
<desrt> yes.  in a sense, the pure essense of being a distribution is integration
<rickspencer3> and I spend hours every week talking to all different project leaders and community folks
<desrt> practically by definition, in fact
<rickspencer3> right, that's what we do ... deliver the latest and greatest to users in a form that works
<desrt> it's true.  i use it because it's the best thing going.
<rickspencer3> heh
<desrt> people always expect more, of course
<rickspencer3> I think there is room for lots of different kinds of distros
<rickspencer3> like some distros are really sort of upstreams for products or services they sell into companies and such
<rickspencer3> so they get their requirements from organizations that they sell into
<rickspencer3> that's cool too, because it's good to do things that work for people deploying desktops and servers
<rickspencer3> </soapbox>
<ccheney> pitti: so language-support-* is going to be removed as NBS at some time in the future i guess? I still see them all in the archive at present
<didrocks> time to rest a little
<didrocks> have a good week-end everyone :)
<james_w> you too didrocks
<rickspencer3> bryceh, wow, congrats on the -nv -nouveau transition
<Nafai> what's this?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, feels really good to have it finally crossed off the list
<bryceh> rickspencer3, we still got some work around drm to do post-a3 but I suspect that'll be pretty straightforward
<rickspencer3> Nafai, well, basically, Ubuntu starting tomorrow I guess, will have a different open source driver installed by default
<Nafai> of cool
<jcastro> one that's maintained!
<rickspencer3> so that you get a nice boot experience even if you have nvidia hardware
<Nafai> s/of/oh/
<Nafai> What's the advantage of using the proprietary drivers?  (I've always just used them)
<Nafai> Can I still get compiz with nouveau?
<rickspencer3> Nafai properietary drivers are 1. 3d, 2. faster, 3. support new hardware faster, etc...
 * Nafai nods
<rickspencer3> Nafai so, no compiz
<rickspencer3> but maybe someday
<Nafai> Sticking with the proprietary ones for now then :)
<rickspencer3> right, but of course we can't ship those by default
<rickspencer3> and some folks don't want to use proprietary goo
<rickspencer3> sadly, I always buy Dell because I can use the sweet Intel Open Source goodness for graphics, but my mini came with broadcom wireless :/
<rickspencer3> but who uses wireless, really?
<rickspencer3> corner case
<bryceh> hehe
<rickspencer3> anyway congrats bryceh, and please TAKE THE WEEKEND OFF!
<rickspencer3> there's been too much stress around here, we need to recharge batteries
<rickspencer3> it's a marathon, not a sprint
<rickspencer3> (and other manager platitudes)
<rickspencer3> work smarter, not harder?
<bryceh> I hope to do so...  I did promise apw to do some testing of some of his new drm stuff.
<rickspencer3> can you do it now, and then know off a bit early?
<rickspencer3> know off ?
<rickspencer3> read knock off
<bryceh> I'm going to try, although I already have a full slate of tasks scheduled for today.  I may be able to squeeze it in
<bryceh> or maybe sarvatt or someone can give it some testing over the weekend
 * kenvandine heads out... have a great weekend everyone!
<rickspencer3> bye bye kenvandine
<rickspencer3> have a great weekend yourself
<rickspencer3> great job this week!
 * rickspencer3 goes back to documenting quickly.prompts
<rickspencer3> *yawn*
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-02-20
<Ubuntunewb> I has an ubuntu
<Ubuntunewb> its blue.
<Ubuntunewb> So, does Canonical incorporate any desktop only kernel modifications in its releases? Or is the kernel less specific than that...I mean, is there a bunch of enterpise specific code in the Ubuntu distro?
<Ubuntunewb> not everyone talk at once now.
<vish> Ubuntunewb: its a weekend and the desktop team doesnt work on weekends.. try during weekdays
<vish> Ubuntunewb: preferably during UTC
<Ubuntunewb> ah k
<baptistemm> hello there
<tgpraveen12> so anybody knows what the new lucid theme that mark talked about is?
<kklimonda> tgpraveen12: He hasn't spoken about new theme and this isn't really channel for this discussion - go to #ubuntu-offtopic
<rickspencer3> tgpraveen12, stay tuned!
<vish> kwwii: ^ ;p
<kwwii> what you talking 'bout Willis?
<rickspencer3> kwwii, Mark mentioned new themes in an interview that hit reddit this morning
<rickspencer3> I wouldn't make light of the the situation, though
<rickspencer3> ;)
<kwwii> rickspencer3: yeah, I just watched the video
<kwwii> rickspencer3: lovely non-announcement to some extent ;)
<rickspencer3> hehe
<rickspencer3> let's just wait and see if there are some fun surprises in store
<kwwii> indeed :)
<rickspencer3> :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-02-21
<davmor2> pitti: might of found a flaw in jockey,  I needed to get the sta driver on my laptop, so I enabled the cdrom to get it on via that, jockey crashed everytime without fail, even after pluging in the ethernet.  Once I disabled the cdrom it worked fine.
<kklimonda> are we going to update evolution-data-server to 2.29/2.30 or is that also too invasive release for LTS?
<james_w> kklimonda: I believe that one is being held back
<kklimonda> james_w: yes - and it doesn't matter anyway as anjel depends on both evolution and eds in 2.29.x versions
<kklimonda> and now it's waiting for them to build :/
<kklimonda> anjal*
<kklimonda> james_w: looks like something went wrong on sync request bug 512199 - you were syncing 0.0.1 and 0.3.1 got synced instead
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 512199 in anjal "Sync anjal 0.1-1 (universe) from Debian experimental (main)" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/512199
<james_w> yep
<arand> I had a little inquiry about patching of poppler to fix selection issues, and if it could make it into Lucid, I'm not completely sure where to take the question, it is here: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2010-February/010694.html . Bug #33288 is the more relevant bug though. It was also suggested that this might be a place to bring it up, is it?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 33288 in poppler "Evince doesn't handle columns properly" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/33288
<kklimonda> james_w: should I report it somewhere?
<james_w> probably
<cafeteriaboy> Is anyone available to help with some 9.10 boot issues?
<c_korn> cafeteriaboy: this is probably the wrong channel. please join #ubuntu
<ripps> I wasn't sure where to ask this, as there was barely anybody in #murrine, but does anybody know how to make Murrine look like Nodoka Modern? I have a theme based on it, and I like how Nodoka Modern looks, but I don't like that Nodoka is poorly maintained and barely sees any use and development outside of Fedora
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-02-14
<micahg> hi robert_ancell, do you still think we'll be able to get a release version of webkit before beta?
<robert_ancell> micahg, afaik
<micahg> robert_ancell: cool :)
<TheMuso> With the new ubuntuone control panel, how is one supposed to sync contacts from Ubuntu one?
<TheMuso> Or have I msised something...
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> pitti: Do you happen to use ubuntuone for contacts syncing? if so, are things broken for you in natty atm?
<pitti> TheMuso: admittedly I've never tried it; I just have one computer, and my mobile syncs over google
<TheMuso> ok fair enough.
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> vish: I guess we should start naming our wallpaper packages after releases, so that the previous one remains installed on upgrades?
<fta2> $ dconf-editor
<fta2> dconf-editor: error while loading shared libraries: libgtk-3.0.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
<fta2> dpm, hi, fyi: http://ftagada.wordpress.com/2011/02/12/chromium-browser-survey/
<dpm> morning fta2
<dpm> fta2, it seems there are quite a lot of English-speaking participants in the survey :)
<Sweetshark> moring
<pitti> hey Sweetshark
<didrocks> morning Sweetshark
<Sweetshark> doh, let me come in again: Good morning (now with two n at the right places)!
<pitti> lol
<pitti> 'n's are so overrated
<chrisccoulson> good morning didrocks, pitti, Sweetshark, dpm and fta2
<chrisccoulson> and everyone else too ;)
<dpm> heya chrisccoulson
<didrocks> good morning chrisccoulson, how was your week-end?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, good thanks. We just went to visit some family on saturday. how was yours?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson:  excellent! my week-end was buying-more-furnitures-and-drill-the-wall and setup my server @home
<chrisccoulson> nice!
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<seb128> hey didrocks chrisccoulson
<didrocks> hey seb128
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i haven't had an invisible window all weekend btw ;)
 * chrisccoulson is happy :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: excellent!
<didrocks> so, seems the latest patch works then :)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, seems too. before the latest update, it took me 3-4 goes just to open firefox
<chrisccoulson> (the profile selector seemed to be a pretty reliable trigger)
<didrocks> do you think people are using profiles really or it's more a testing thing?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i don't think anybody really uses it, but i use it because i have a profile with development tools installed
<chrisccoulson> i don't want those in my main profile, and i also want a profile i can break ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: heh, right, like developer <-> user mode :)
<vish> pitti: ubuntu-wallpaper-$RELEASE sounds neat!   should we change the ubuntu-desktop depends soonish(we could just duplicate the previous release wallpapers at the beginning of each cycle) or wait for the wallpapers to be ready?
<fta2> dpm, if you want to spread it to get a more representative panel, feel free :)
<fta2> chrisccoulson, hi
<vish> pitti: it also solves the issue of folks requesting that the previous release wallpapers be uploaded to the repo..
<fta2> didrocks, seb128: shouldn't d-conf be rebuilt or something?
<pitti> vish: I think we can rename the binary once we actually replace wallpapers; it's an easy operation without risk
<vish> k.. cool! :)
<vish> iirc, kenvandine usually does the wallpaper uploads each cycle, maybe we can assign the bug to him?
<pitti> sounds goood
<didrocks> update-manager will propose to remove it at the end of the upgrade, maybe we can special-case this?
<vish> didrocks: so we need an update-manager task too?
<pitti> should be easy to do
<didrocks> vish: well, just a though, but it can be a nice thing to add (not to clean this kind of package), mvo? what do you think?
<didrocks> yeah, can a nice papercut :)
<mvo> sure, trivial to add cleanup for this
<mvo> or avoid it
<didrocks> yeah, avoid it rather :p
<didrocks> vish: so, please, add a u-m task too ;)
<didrocks> hey mvo btw!
<seb128> fta2, rebuilt for what?
<mvo> good morning didrocks
<vish> cool! ..
<mvo> and vish and seb128 and pitti :)
<seb128> hey mvo!
<seb128> how are you?
<pitti> hey seb128
<mvo> and fta2!
<vish> mvo: hi.. :)
<vish> btw, its Bug #625357 :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 625357 in ubuntu-wallpapers "Previous custom ubuntu-wallpaper disappears after an Ubuntu upgrade" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/625357
<fta2> seb128, dconf-editor: error while loading shared libraries: libgtk-3.0.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
<fta2> seb128, libgtk-3.0.so.0 vs libgtk-3.so.0
<didrocks> vish: excellent, thanks!
<mvo> seb128: I'm good, thanks! how are you?
<seb128> fta2, oh, likely yes then
<seb128> mvo, I'm fine thanks
<mvo> just a bit sleepy, but its monday morning ;)
<seb128> pitti, you would add years of wallpapers if you upgrade every cycle though
<seb128> pitti, just reading your comment on that bug
<seb128> g-c-c in GNOME3 will copy the image if it's not in the user dir
<chrisccoulson> has anybody here ever used chromebug before?
<seb128> which solves that issue in a better way that trying to keep all the old packages installed
<pitti> seb128: ah, nice; so we would only need to do that for natty then?
<seb128> pitti, natty, maverick, lucid
<pitti> seb128: we won't retroactively change it in maverick/lucid
<pitti> and natty+1 will hopefully get gnome3
<seb128> pitti, well I wouldn't not bother, it's nothing of a new issue, it's there for years
<seb128> having 2 sets of wallpaper also sort of clutter the dialog
<seb128> where the goal is to have a nice selected set
<pitti> seb128: I guess if someone really wants to see that, we would gladly accept a backport of the gcc 3 patch :)
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> note that with the gnome-desktop background caching it might even work if the file is cleaned
<seb128> the cache should stay in the user dir if you don't select a new background
<didrocks> yeah, it's been done like that for that purpose :)
<kklimonda> seb128: hey
<seb128> kklimonda, hello
<kklimonda> seb128: I did prepare gtkmm (and pangomm) updates but, as I just remembered, I've forgotten to subscribe ubuntu-sponsors :)
<seb128> kklimonda, ok great, I will sponsor it today
<rodrigo_> morning
<kklimonda> hey
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<fta2> compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in Launcher::EventLogic(): http://paste.ubuntu.com/566902/  known?
<duanedesign> hello rodrigo_
<duanedesign> .17
<duanedesign> ugh
<kklimonda> o/ duanedesign
<duanedesign> hey kklimonda
<duanedesign> :) good to read you
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm pretty concerned about swt-gtk now. i tried porting it to xulrunner-2.0 on friday, but it's going to take quite a substantial amount of work
<chrisccoulson> which i don't think is worth it ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, did Daviey mention anything about dropping it?
<chrisccoulson> but, that means we end up with both versions in main :(
<Daviey> o/
<chrisccoulson> pitti - no, he didn't mention anything about dropping it
<pitti> chrisccoulson: indeed, it'd be a shame to waste so much work on it
<pitti> hey Daviey, how are you?
<Daviey> I need to speak to upstream Eucalyptus, but they won't be avaliable until later today.
<Daviey> curses weekends.
<chrisccoulson> Daviey, cool, thanks :)
<pitti> weekends are good!
<Daviey> pitti, It's Monday... :)  Hope you are well.
<pitti> Daviey: I'm great, thanks! how are you?
<Daviey> pitti, good, or nearly there.. :)
<seb128> fta2, not sure, it seems not
<seb128> fta2, send it if you can, the retracer will mark it duplicate if it finds a matching one
<fta2> seb128, sure, i will (i asked because it's 180MB)
<fta2> 190MB
<seb128> k
<fta2> bug 718648
<ubot2> fta2: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: list index out of range (https://launchpad.net/bugs/718648)
<fta2> doh!
<seb128> fta2, you need to wait for retracing to have it accessible to others
<fta2> i meant, doh for the bot, it should say "private", not clash
<seb128> right
<seb128> didrocks, bug #660984
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 660984 in gnome-utils "Disk Usage Analyzer missing from applications place" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/660984
<seb128> didrocks, why did you reopen the gnome-utils part of the bug?
<didrocks> Changed in gnome-utils (Ubuntu):
<didrocks> importance: Low â Medium
<didrocks> status: Invalid â Confirmed
<didrocks> by Omer Akram
<seb128> ups
<seb128> closing it again then
<seb128> didrocks, should if be assigned to unity-places-files?
<didrocks> seb128: unity-place-applications rather
<seb128> ups, right
<seb128> didrocks, btw you have a "debian-changes-0.5.36-0ubuntu3" in unity-place-files
<seb128> not sure that's wanted
<seb128> debian-changes-0.2.32-0ubuntu1 in unity-place-applications
<seb128> it just has the pot file
<seb128> well the applications one has, the files one has some diff in the makefiles as well
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, there is a binary for now IIRC
<didrocks> (cherry-picked from trunk)
<didrocks> will be removed with next release
<didrocks> in any case, I'll deal with that in next release, thanks :)
<seb128> didrocks, yw
<seb128> I tend to assume that things which are not renamed to have a proper name are autogenerated patch errors ;-)
<didrocks> well, source3 and bzr merge-upstream fun :-)
<dpm> pitti, it seems that in the lucid-proposed langpacks not only the ca translations were not included in Firefox, but neither zh_CN and zh_TW were. Is there any log where we could find out what happened?
<pitti> hey dpm; looking
<pitti> dpm: http://paste.ubuntu.com/566918/
<pitti> dpm: I bet it's because it doesn't know about the zh-hans/zh-hant split
<pitti> dpm: hm, but I don't see any zh special case in the old po2xpi either; did the previous langpacks have firefox translations?
<dpm> pitti, weird, the split happened quite a while ago. Yeah, they had
<dpm> strange that the 'ca' translations are not on that list with errors as well
<pitti> Installing XPI tarball ca.tar.gz into ../lucid-proposed//sources-base/language-pack-ca-base/data/mozilla.tar.gz
<pitti> Installing XPI tarball ca@valencia.tar.gz into ../lucid-proposed//sources-base/language-pack-ca-base/data/mozil
<pitti> la.tar.gz
<pitti> dpm: did it have no translations at all, or just the @valencia variant?
<dpm> there were no translations at all IIRC, but let me check on my lucid system to be sure...
<pitti> didrocks: is it known that latest compiz or unity steal ctrl/alt key bindings?
<pitti> smspillaz: ^
<pitti> for example, in gtimelog or in mumble (push to talk is broken now)
<didrocks> pitti: oh no, didn't know about that one
<didrocks> pitti: can you reproduce in the classic session?
<pitti> ok, filing then
<pitti> didrocks: lemme check
<dpm> pitti, it seems it did not have any translations -> http://paste.ubuntu.com/566923
<pitti> didrocks: gnome+compiz seems to work fine; so it's unity?
<pitti> dpm: ah, so it did have a tarball, but it was empty
<didrocks> pitti: seems so thenâ¦
<seb128> pitti, ctrl-alt-L works fine here
<pitti> dpm: yay po2xpi
<pitti> seb128: yes, they do work in most GNOME programs, like germinal or gedit
<pitti> but not in mumble or gtimelog
<seb128> weird
<seb128> why would unity or compiz lead to a behaviour different between applications though?
<pitti> I don't know
<didrocks> apart from the alt -> showing the appmenu bar, I don't know
<didrocks> if it was qt app, we could have told that the qt part was turned on
<didrocks> but there is gtimelogâ¦
<dpm> pitti, perhaps po2xpi got confused with the @valencia variant and gave up?
<seb128> didrocks, well classic session uses appmenu as well
<didrocks> seb128: only if you add the indicator, which isn't added on upgrade, isn't it?
<seb128> correct
<seb128> pitti, does it work with appmenu in the classic session?
<pitti> didrocks: it also affects ctrl+ stuff; I'll file
<pitti> seb128: trying
<pitti> (just had to reboot, second session killed my first)
<seb128> pitti, is there a way to trigger the bug on a normal install?
<didrocks> if it affects ctrl + something elseâ¦ maybe not appmenu related
<seb128> I could install gtimelog but later on when my pending updates are installed
<pitti> argh, and now my test user starts unity for "classic desktop"
<didrocks> pitti: did you change anything in ccsm?
<didrocks> env | grep COMPIZ
<pitti> seb128: confirmed
<pitti> seb128: i. e. classic session with global menu breaks them
<didrocks> ok, appmenu then
<pitti> didrocks: filing against indicator-appmenu then?
<seb128> talk to mterry when he's online later on
<seb128> pitti, could be a duplicate, check open bugs first but yes
<seb128> there is several bugs about appmenu breaking modifier keys
<seb128> but they are not new so it's a bit weird you run into that now
<pitti> bug 663030 is old and was unreproducible
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 663030 in indicator-appmenu "indicator-appmenu breaks Alt accelerator keys" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/663030
<pitti> mine is definitively new; I use those keys every day in gtimelog
<pitti> and I had it on Friday the first time
<seb128> what did you upgrade on friday?
<pitti> http://paste.ubuntu.com/566927/ -- a lot :/
<seb128> when did it start?
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<seb128> pitti, nothing with "indic" in the name though
<seb128> like you didn't get the indicator-appmenu update which was after the european work hours
<seb128> guess libdbusmenu is a candidate there though, you can try downgrading it
<seb128> though the changelog doesn't seem to be doing anything close the those
<pitti> could also have been on Saturday
<pitti> I think I did an hour or two of work on Sat
<seb128> that would include the appmenu update
<seb128> but you said you had the issue on friday?
<pitti> 2011-02-12 15:25:00 configure indicator-application 0.2.93-0ubuntu2 0.2.93-0ubuntu2
<pitti> 2011-02-12 15:25:00 configure indicator-appmenu 0.1.94-0ubuntu1 0.1.94-0ubuntu1
<seb128> there was no recent work on modifier code though
<seb128> they mainly fixed refresh and parsing issues
<pitti> filed as bug 718676 now
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 718676 in indicator-appmenu "Breaks Alt and Control keybindings in some programs" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/718676
<Amaranth> didrocks: oh, alt-f and such are supposed to work to access app menus?
<seb128> check with mterry when he's online
 * Amaranth should file a bug about that then
<pitti> seb128: ok, will do; thanks
<seb128> np
<seb128> hum, time to get something to eat
<seb128> bbl
<didrocks> Amaranth: it should, and there are some work on getting pressing alt showing the menu as well
<tkamppeter> pitti, I want to merge ghostscript 9.01 from Debian experimental.
<Amaranth> didrocks: yeah, those don't work for me :)
<tkamppeter> pitti, only problem is that they have removed the gs-esp transitional package. Do we still need it?
<didrocks> Amaranth: I think you can open bugs on that then ;)
<pitti> tkamppeter: hey
<pitti> tkamppeter: nope, it's obsolete; no reverse dependencies to it at all
<Amaranth> arg, apport flooding me with crash reports
<Amaranth> looks like a dozen GPU lockups and a compiz crash or two :P
<rodrigo_> yay, unity works again
<tkamppeter> pitti, then I will MIR gs-cjk-resource, as this package ships the CMaps from real upstream (Adobe) and not wahst GS devs have taken from Adobe.
<tkamppeter> pitti, should not be a problem as this package is data-only, no security bugs possible.
<pitti> tkamppeter: will that remove the equivalent 1.5 MB from the ghostscript package?
<pitti> tkamppeter: yeah, MIR-wise this looks easy
<tkamppeter> Yes, the Debian package does not install the files of Resource/CMap.
<pitti> tkamppeter: is gs-cjk-resource a recommends (should be) or a depends?
<pitti> tkamppeter: if it's a depends, then you need to wait with the upload until the MIR is approved
<pitti> tkamppeter: if it's a recommends, you can upload right away, as this won't break installability for CD builds then
<tkamppeter> pitti, the MIR is bug 718692
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 718692 in gs-cjk-resource "[MIR] gs-cjk-resource" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/718692
<bcurtiswx> good morn'
<mvo> pitti: I merged your software-properties pygi branch, many thanks. I will upload it now (unless there is something else pending from you)
<pitti> oooh!
<pitti> mvo: danke
<pitti> mvo: not from my side
<pitti> pygi FTW!
<dpm> pitti, here's the last part of the langpacks schedule discussion we had at UDS: langpack update requests. Do these steps sound sensible from your pov? -> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/LanguagePackUpdateRequest
<seb128> could someone try to open nautilus in their user dir and select a file and open the file menu in unity?
<seb128> does the list of applications flickers for you?
<bcurtiswx> seb128, idk if you got my last response since i lost internet. but it all looks OK here
<seb128> bcurtiswx,  no I didn't
<seb128> ok, thanks
<seb128> it's weird there it flickers like if it was rebuilding the applications list
<seb128> but only when the file is in the user dir itself, not when it's on the desktop or somewhere else
<bcurtiswx> seb128, i've tried Desktop, ~, Documents all don't cause a flicker in unity panel
<bcurtiswx> well, the applications list
<seb128> it's not in the unity panel, it's in the file menu when it's open
<bcurtiswx> yup, no flickers anywhere.  I have been having issue with the unity panel tho.  I have to reset it to see any of kens or my additions (putting numbers on app icons)
<bcurtiswx> is there a . folder in ~ that controls anything with the application menu in unity ?
<seb128> you mean?
<bcurtiswx> like if i delete .gnome2 my panel settings get defaulted
<seb128> what do you call "application menu" in unity?
<seb128> there is no menu in unity...
<bcurtiswx> seb128, yes im not up to date on the right unity terminology, so to correct myself.. the app menu is the file-->help menu on the top..
<bcurtiswx> i mean the icons to the left
<bcurtiswx> when i said applications menu before
<bcurtiswx> what is the correct terminology for the icons on the left?
<bcurtiswx> unity launcher?
<seb128> bcurtiswx, I don't understand what you describe
<seb128> the ubuntu logo on the left?
<fta2> how can i stop that? http://paste.ubuntu.com/566986/
<vish> bcurtiswx: yea, launcher or unity launcher
<bcurtiswx> seb128, the icons below the ubuntu logo on the left
<bcurtiswx> vish, thx
<vish> bcurtiswx: if you want to get a few folks angry you can call it "dock" ;p
<seb128> bcurtiswx, that's the launcher
<pitti> dpm: that looks fine to me; thanks!
<seb128> fta2, uninstall indicator-datetime on chmod 0 the .so
<bcurtiswx> seb128, and to the right of the ubuntu logo is the application menu ?
<fta2> seb128, is it a known issue?
<seb128> fta2, don't forgot to report bugs and maybe ping kenvandine about those
<seb128> fta2, hard to say without a stacktrace
<seb128> kenvandine, ^
<seb128> tedg, ^
 * kenvandine reads back
<didrocks> vish: the new terminology is springboard btw :)
<fta2> sure, but it's re-spawning too fast
<seb128> well that's the indicator, it keeps reloading things
<fta2> quad-core rulez
<seb128> it should probably have a counter and try only a few times
<vish> didrocks: oh! thats a mouthful, can use just call it springy ;)
<bcurtiswx> didrocks, springboard seems appropriate only if you have a ton of launchers there.. which i can't accomplish yet
<vish> s/can use/can we
<bcurtiswx> im totally calling it springy from now on
<vish> bcurtiswx: we *can* add icons there
<tedg> fta2, Are you up-to-date with indicator-datetime?
<bcurtiswx> s/launcher/springy/g
<tedg> fta2, I thought we'd fixed that :-/
<kenvandine> fta2, wow... that is  a lot of spew
<dpm> thanks pitti!
<kenvandine> tedg, that is where it can't get a client right?
<vish> bcurtiswx: if some app is running, just check the "keep in launcher"
<bcurtiswx> yeah, i do that with empathy but it still spawns a new launcher entry, so i end up having two :-\
<fta2> tedg, upgraded this morning (and my uptime is ~6h)
<bcurtiswx> vish, ^^
<vish> bcurtiswx: haha! i guess you got your wish â¦ ;p " only if you have a ton of launchers there.. which i can't accomplish yet"
<vish> just add one and you get 2 ;)
<bcurtiswx> if only i could do that in my bank account :-x
<tedg> kenvandine, Yeah, usually.
<tedg> fta2, Is apport picking up any of the crashes?
<fta2> tedg, kenvandine: do you need a stacktrace for that?
<tedg> fta2, please!
<kenvandine> tedg, tell him the secret sauce for getting it to not respawn so he can run the service manually
<tedg> kenvandine, Can't he just grab one of the apport crash files?
<kenvandine> if there is one
 * tedg is confused, why wouldn't there be one?
<kenvandine> dunno, he said it wasn't firing apport
<fta2> there was one this morning, i dropped it as i had too many old ones, now, it's no longer producing any
<fta2> oh, it stopped respawning after a service apport restart, weird :P
<seb128> it might be that apport is blocking it a bit while getting the crash infos
<fta2> i still don't have the calendar in indicator
<fta2> +the
 * seb128 kicks the retracers
<seb128> pitti, I've fixed the retracers, amd64 crashed on python launchpadlib import error again
<pitti> argh; merci
<seb128> didrocks, pitti, Riddell: could one of your source new review vala-0.10 for me? It's basically "vala" from debian renamed without the valac binary reuploaded to natty
<seb128> not sure it really needs checking or not, we had it before natty and it's coming from debian
<vish> kenvandine: hi, do you plan on backporting the g-c-c (gnome3) patch for the wallpapers bug ? ;)
<kenvandine> which bug?
<vish> the previous wallpapers getting erased one..
<kenvandine> oh, no
<vish> yea.. dint expect.. ;)  so unassigning..
<kenvandine> thx
<mvo> mpt: did you had a chance to look at lp:~mmcg069/software-center/lobby-tweaks ? I would like to merge it to trunk as its IMO a improvement over the current lobby (afaict matthew adressed most of your points?)
<mpt> mvo, I just replied to him about it this morning.
<mpt> I haven't seen the branch itself, just the screenshot from a week ago.
<seb128> kklimonda, could you make sure you subscribe ubuntu-sponsors to your sponsoring requests?
<mvo> mpt: hm, I wonder if we shouldn't start using the mailinglist for this now so that I'm in the loop
<seb128> vish, doesn't seem worth spending time to backport
<mpt> mvo, I agree, I replied privately only because he mailed privately, sorry I didn't CC you this time
<mvo> mpt: what is the executive-summary? [ ] merge [ ] needs-fixing ?
<mpt> mvo, needs fixing
<mpt> I'll forward the message
<mvo> mpt: thanks
<kklimonda> seb128: ah, sure - sorry about that, I thought that just adding desktop-upgrade tag is enough to get it on your radar :)
<seb128> kklimonda, it makes the bug number shows on the version column, but it doesn't put it on any sponsoring list
<seb128> kklimonda, i.e it shows someone works on it, not that it's ready for review
<kklimonda> done
<seb128> thanks
<mvo> mpt: I get a branch from aaronp that replaces the yes/no links with thumbs-up/down - I guess that is problematic because its not generally understood (in all cultures?)
<kklimonda> seb128: so we use desktop/versions.html only to track who's working on what, and to get it uploaded I should follow the normal workflow? Noted :)
<seb128> kenvandine, why did you drop the libdbusmenu static build?
<kklimonda> seb128: would that be possible to add hamster-applet to this page? ;)
<seb128> kklimonda, not really, version will list first things that wait for sponsoring
<seb128> kklimonda, so we still use version
<seb128> it's just that "desktop-upgrade" will not raise it as needed action
<seb128> so it will stay in the middle of the list
<mpt> mvo, I just specified the text for each case: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter/RatingsAndReviews#feedback
<kklimonda> ok
<mvo> mpt: yeah, I saw that
<kenvandine> seb128, we didn't need it
<kenvandine> seb128, or did we?
<seb128> kklimonda, it's already on the list, you just need to click on the small plus sign next to the package column
<kklimonda> I think I get it now :)
<seb128> that displays the sources which are not on the CD
<seb128> kenvandine, well usually libraries all ship a static version for those who want to do a static build
<kklimonda> seb128: ah, I was thinking what is + hiding
<kklimonda> I didn't think to check if it hides hamster :)
<seb128> ;-)
<kenvandine> we don't for the other indicator ones
<kenvandine> so was just cleaning up :)
<seb128> kenvandine, indicator
<seb128> $ dpkg -L libindicator3-dev | grep [.]a
<seb128> /usr/lib/libindicator3.a
<seb128> kenvandine, ?
<kenvandine> oh... i thought we had removed those ages ago
<seb128> well, we don't do it for the indicators .so because those are not libraries you can build against
<kenvandine> of course
<seb128> kenvandine, we removed the .la, you are being confused there ;-)
<kenvandine> oh right
<kenvandine> i guess people might want to build static against dbusmenu
<seb128> they might ;-)
<seb128> there is little point to drop them anyway
<kenvandine> ok, i'll revert
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> go mterry go!
<seb128> mterry, nice to see you got 2 of 3 bugs fixed on the keyboard layout issues ;-)
<mterry> seb128, :)  still not sure about the crasher.  I'm having a hard time reproducing crasher now, so maybe I did fix it with the previous patch.  If you see the crasher again, let me know
<seb128> yeah don't bother for now
<seb128> mterry, I will try again with your fixes to see if it still happens here, but I think that might have been a side effect of the second bug you fixed
<mterry> seb128, yeah
<seb128> like it was crashing after being in its confused state
<seb128> mterry, do you still have bugs on your list or do you need new ones? ;-)
<seb128> mterry, I'm asking but I'm running out of issues I know about without needing to check bugs reports I think ;-)
<mterry> seb128, I'm going to catch up on a couple TODO things, but I'll come back for more bugs shortly
<seb128> out of the icons ones
<fta> tseliot, http://paste.ubuntu.com/567030/  whole desktop freeze when using either WebGl (chromium) or GL (googleearth) for more than a few minutes. known?
<tseliot> fta: what driver/system are you using?
<fta> tseliot, nvidia-current, natty, x64
<seb128> bah
<seb128> pitti, help
<tseliot> fta: are you using the driver with the IgnoreABI option?
<seb128> pitti, http://paste.ubuntu.com/567034/
<seb128> have you seen crashes similar to that before?
<seb128> pitti, the crash digger crashes this way
<fta> tseliot, hm, yes (since last Sept), but still with X 7.5 (not 7.6, still waiting for a compatible n-current)
<tseliot> fta: ah. Can you file a bug report about it then, please? I'll forward it to nvidia
<fta> tseliot, sure, but i don't have much to provide, it's full freeze, so i can only use the magic sysreq keys to s+u+boot
<tseliot> fta: if you provide an easy way to reproduce the issue, together with your nvidia-bug-report.log , that would be enough
<tseliot> *provided
<fta> tseliot, how do i generate that log?
<tseliot> fta: with nvidia-bug-report.sh, which is installed by nvidia-current
<tseliot> fta: the log is generated in your home dir after you run the script
<pitti> seb128: uargh -- no, that's new
<ari-tczew> tseliot: have you got any informations when nvidia is planning release driver with support latest xserver?
<fta> grrr, the log i'm referring to is not included
<pitti> seb128: might be due to the new rollout on Friday? I'll keep it in a tab, will have a closer look (but it seems launchpadlib or LP related)
<tseliot> ari-tczew: that's a good question but I'm afraid I'm not allowed to answer it
<seb128> pitti, cf #ubuntu-devel
<pitti> ah, great
<ari-tczew> tseliot: though soon or later?
<tseliot> ari-tczew: hopefully soon ;)
<pitti> mvo: sorry about bug 718811, I'll fix it ASAP
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 718811 in software-properties "[Natty] New software-properties breaks the application" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/718811
<ari-tczew> tseliot: I have noticed strange bug - on nvidia drivers my TV couldn't play sound. now on vesa (I guess?) sound works fine. what do you think?
<tseliot> ari-tczew: it sounds like an hdmi issue but I really don't know much about audio
<and471> vish, hey! no long no speak :)
<ari-tczew> tseliot: yes it can be hdmi issue, can I report it somewhere to nvidia?
<vish> and471: hey!  was just wondering about you today.. ;)  did you see someone mentioned about Kazam on the ayatana list?
<fta> tseliot, filed bug 718858
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 718858 in nvidia-graphics-drivers "System freeze using GL" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/718858
<and471> vish, oh really? hehe I don't subscribe to it but thanks for letting me know :)
<and471> vish, I have just fixed a papercut, which is assigned to the ninjas, what is the process I should go through?
<and471> (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/synaptic/+bug/704414)
<tseliot> ari-tczew: if you file a bug report on launchpad, I can forward it to nvidia
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 704414 in synaptic "In status bar, Resize grip overlaps synaptic's progress bar" [Low,Triaged]
<vish> and471: yea, someone was mentioning it as a replacement for gnome-screenshot+screencast replacement â¦
<tseliot> fta: thanks
<and471> ah cool, I will check it out
<vish> and471: just assign it to yourself
<and471> ok
<vish> and471: the assign to the ninja team is just for mail notifications
<and471> ok
<ari-tczew> tseliot: ok 'll do it, just give me fixed drivers :-)
<and471> vish, and then if I have linked a branch with a merge request, do I set to In Progress or Fix Comitted (I have got this wrong before :-] )
<tseliot> :)
<vish> and471: in-progress, and once it is merged it can be set to fix committed
<seb128> tedg, kenvandine, mterry: bug #718676
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 718676 in indicator-appmenu "Breaks Alt and Control keybindings in some programs" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/718676
<seb128> do you have any clue about that? pitti reported it today as a new issue
<and471> vish, ok thanks, it has been a while since I did this :p
<seb128> is there any recent change that could explain that?
<vish> and471: np.. :)
<kenvandine> tedg, maybe moving the menu parsing code to dbusmenu?
<mvo> pitti: oh, I overlooked this one. htanks for looking at it! I should have tested that
<pitti> mvo: same here -- I didn't expect it to be any different when launched from synaptics
 * pitti waves good night -- Valentine's dinner and Taekwondo
<tedg> kenvandine, It's odd.  Other people have reported that as well.  It seems to be intermittent.
<tedg> kenvandine, It's been around since the appmenu-gtk days.
<pitti> tedg: I get it all the time, with new accounts, with perfect reliability
<mterry> seb128, not sure...  I don't remember keybinding changes
<seb128> 'night pitti
<tedg> pitti, Hmm, I wonder why that is...
<tedg> pitti, That's good though as it could be debugged :)
<tedg> I hear about it most in gnome-terminal.
<tedg> (and it has happened there for me as well)
<fta> tseliot, is the modaliases line expected to be that long?? http://paste.ubuntu.com/567045/ (that's apt-cache show nvidia-current)
<seb128> mvo, are the rebuilds you are doing for the issue we discussed with soren earlier? or a different thing?
<tseliot> fta: yes, it's a feature
<fta> ok
<mpt> mvo, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thumbs_up#The_gesture_internationally
<seb128> bah
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128 ;)
<seb128> didrocks, did you say you wanted to work on the nautilus default menus?
<seb128> didrocks, the tweaks for the indicator-appmenu
<seb128> kenvandine, mterry: so it seems the issue is not due to the new compiz, not sure what is causing it
<didrocks> seb128: I was stuck in appmenu which didn't take my updated version. So no, if you want to play with it, please, do it :)
<seb128> didrocks, do you get a nautilus menu under the unity-panel?
<seb128> I can see if where switching desktop here
<seb128> well switching vertically
<didrocks> seb128: well, I restarted unity a lot, so I don't get any menu right now
<seb128> or you can notice a one pixel bar under the unity-panel
<seb128> didrocks, that's bug #717358
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 717358 in indicator-appmenu "nautilus puts a menu bar at the top of the desktop" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/717358
<didrocks> I think it's when you restart unity, isn't it?
<didrocks> like appmenu don't answer, so the application is showing the menu?
<seb128> didrocks, no, it happens in a classic session as well
<didrocks> oh ok :/
<didrocks> let me look at latest nautilus upload
<seb128> didrocks, well something like that, but it's showing the nautilus menu on the desktop
<didrocks> because I've done that on testing purpose before
<seb128> didrocks, nautilus didn't change for a month
<didrocks> ok, so I didn't uploaded that version :)
<seb128> didrocks, I'm wondering if that's the patch to export the default nautilus menu
<seb128> but I'm not why it didn't show up before then ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: not likely in its initial state
<seb128> not sure
<mvo> seb128: a different one, I have not looked into how to detect the one you saw, but I don't think its hard, could you nag^Wremind me tomrrow? tonight is my hockey night
<seb128> ok, I've assigned it to ted
<mvo> mpt: thanks!
<seb128> mvo, ok sure
<seb128> mvo, enjoy
<didrocks> confirmed, my local testing in "showing the menu" is stillâ¦ local :)
<seb128> didrocks, what issue did you run into?
<didrocks> seb128: updating the menu didn't update appmenu whereas it was updating the embeeded one
<seb128> could you try if that's still an issue?
<didrocks> I just spent one hour on this
<seb128> there was quite some bug fixing on appmenu refresh issues since
<seb128> if you still have your local build...
<didrocks> seb128: I'm working on other unity patchesâ¦ if nobody else can, I can tackle that next wekk
<didrocks> no, I don't have it anymore, I'm afraid :/
<seb128> didrocks, don't bother
<didrocks> it was just testing "hiding an entry"
<seb128> I will assign to mterry next time he's asking for a bug to tackle ;-)
<didrocks> heh :)
<bcurtiswx> indicator-datetime the date and time are hard to read as dark text and a slightly less dark background
<fta> kenvandine, i have two apport files for my respawns of indicator-datetime-service & geoclue-master
<fta> not sure how to append the 2nd one to the 1st bug
<kenvandine> fta, perhaps you have to just attach it via the web UI
<fta> won't be retraced then
<fta> maybe a 2nd bug
<kenvandine> yeah, we'll it's a different package though right?
<kenvandine> it is two bugs i think
<kenvandine> i think geoclue is crashing
<kenvandine> and indicator-datetime is crashing because of the geoclue crash
<fta> yep
<kenvandine> which ted thought he had prevented that
<kenvandine> well, in a fix from last week, preventing crash on geoclue failing
<kenvandine> he handles the case where geoclue fails to give him a client
<kenvandine> i bet in this case he gets a valid geoclue client, then geoclue crashes
<kenvandine> he probably didn't really protect against that
<fta> bug 718911 & bug 718908
<ubot2> fta: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: list index out of range (https://launchpad.net/bugs/718911)
<ubot2> fta: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: list index out of range (https://launchpad.net/bugs/718908)
<fta> they look like bug 714763 715086
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 714763 in indicator-datetime "indicator-datetime-service crashed with SIGSEGV in geoclue_master_client_set_requirements_async()" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/714763
<fta> bug 715086
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 715086 in geoclue "geoclue-master crashed with SIGSEGV in g_type_create_instance()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/715086
<kenvandine> fta, thx
<fta> is there a way to have more than 4 workspaces in unity? i'd like 6x1 instead of 2x2
<kklimonda> fta: you can change it in ccsm->general settings->desktop
<fta> oh
<fta> :)
<kklimonda> desktop size*
<kklimonda> what's the stance on "emergency library bundling" i.e. bundling it in source, and linking statically?
<kklimonda> after last weekend, and finding one more package that builds but fails its tests I don't see us upgrading libevent to 2.0.10 in natty
<kklimonda> I can't port Transmission 2.21 to libevent 1.4.x
<micahg> kklimonda: did you see SpamapS's reply to the thread?, doesn't seem to be happening for natty
<kklimonda> micahg: hence my question - I did reach the same conclusion yesterday after I got another ftbfs when someone has updated package.
<kklimonda> Transmission did bundle libevent in the past, exactly for this reason - they tend to use the newest, and shiniest version as doing that gives them a lot.
<micahg> kklimonda: I would think we should stick with Transmission 2.1x then, IMHO, unless there's a compelling reason to upgrade
<kklimonda> micahg: well - no reason other than it fixes bugs, and adds features. :)
<kklimonda> it's supposed to fix (or limit) one bug that hits users of Transmission with encrypted home directories.
<kklimonda> that would be worth updating it, so we can see if it helps.
<kklimonda> right now, some people report Transmission going into zombie state when the download files on either NTFS or ecrypts partition.
<micahg> kklimonda: can that be backported?
<chrisccoulson> w00t, more bugs fixed in the firefox menu \o/
<chrisccoulson> it seems that me and m_conley are the only people noticing bugs
<kklimonda> micahg: probably, but it wasn't a single commit and rather a list of changes. I'd have to discuss it with upstream.
<micahg> kklimonda: :(
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, is it only universe packages that don't work with the new libevent?
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: well, universe packages don't build
<chrisccoulson> but there are some in main that are problematic too?
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: it's just impossible to tell if they actually work without testing them
<chrisccoulson> i was going to suggest updating libevent to 2.0.10, and then uploading a libevent1 source to universe, and have the problematic universe packages stick with the old version ;)
<chrisccoulson> it would be a shame to block the transmission update on packages in universe
<micahg> chrisccoulson: server team doesn't want the transition
<chrisccoulson> hmmm :/
<chrisccoulson> that sucks
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: jordan is willing to rebundle libevent2
<chrisccoulson> well, that might be the best option ;)
<chrisccoulson> how often does libevent get security updates?
<chrisccoulson> it seems the answer is "never" ;)
<kklimonda> never
<kklimonda> indeed
<kklimonda> it's a solid piece of code :)
<chrisccoulson> IMO, I don't think that bundling it in transmission is any worse than having a separate libevent 2 source package that only transmission is using
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, is the current version of transmission we have in natty maintained anymore?
<chrisccoulson> (ie, is it likely to get security fixes?)
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: yes, it would get security fixes if we stayed with it - upstream is really helpful. But it's not maintained in a sense that someone tests it.
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, have you spoken to anyone on the security team? i think that would be my next step, and get their thoughts about bundling it until the security team want the transition
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: good idea, off I go to speak with them :)
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: any idea who can I poke about it?
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, you could try jdstrand
<SpamapS> [ 89939.568] (II) pointer_property
<SpamapS> These flood my Xorg.0.log constantly..
<SpamapS> anybody have an idea? I have a macbook pro 5,1
<bcurtiswx> is banshee 1.9.3 on anyone's todo ?
<Laney> yes
<bigon> mmm last gtk3 has been uploaded without changin the pkg name has been uploaded without
<bigon> "mmm last gtk3 (3.0) has been uploaded in ubuntu without changing the pkg name"
<micahg> bigon: hi, I wasn't sure if we finished our conversation about gjs before
<dobey> is anyone looking at updating webkitgtk/libsoup?
<micahg> dobey: I thought robert_ancell was
<dobey> ok, guess i'll wait until he shows up and poke him about it
<bigon> micahg: well not really, my point is that gjs is supported upstream, in debian and that firefox API breaks are not to expect before natty release
<micahg> bigon: right, but we do stable release updates of xulrunner, so they are likely to break and since there are no rdepends, there's no reason to have the support burden of porting to a new upstream xul version
<bigon> mmmh
<micahg> bigon: we'll provide it in the GNOME3 PPA with gnome-shell for anyone who wants to build them from source or use them
<bigon> the main argument on the RM request was "nobody use it" and this looks thin (without counting that it looks like sabotage and not only in my mind)
<micahg> bigon: no, it was that nothing in the archive uses it
<RAOF> gjs *has* been a pain in the past, and is likely to be in the future; if there are no rdepends then it makes sense to remove it.
<micahg> RAOF: it was removed and reuploaded :)
<RAOF> On the basis that a non-existent gjs package is better than a *broken* gjs package.
<RAOF> micahg: Yeah, I know.  I'm just providing supporting justification for you :)
<micahg> RAOF: thanks :)
<chrisccoulson> what is shutter using gnome-web-photo for?
<chrisccoulson> it's dead upstream, and requires a fairly substantial refactoring to work with with xulrunner 2.0
<chrisccoulson> not sure if anyone in here uses shutter ;)
<micahg> chrisccoulson: I was going to try to get that in Debian, hmm, should we just drop it from the archive then?
<chrisccoulson> not sure.
<chrisccoulson> it hasn't had a single commit upstream in 5 months, and that was only a translation change
<micahg> right, last "release" was a year and a half ago
<micahg> chrisccoulson: I don't see a project page or an ML for it
<micahg> chrisccoulson: here's the answer to your question: http://www.linoob.com/2010/09/shutter-feature-rich-screenshot-app-for-ubuntu/ item 1) 4.
<micahg> I think there might be a webkit app that does the same thing
<bigon> micahg: /wi15
<bigon> oups
<bigon> micahg: well if you want to RM the pkg again go ahead
<bigon> but I still think that it will made some ppl being not happy
<micahg> bigon: people are already not going to be happy about gnome-shell, I don't think they'll care about gjs per se
<micahg> but it'll be staged with the GNOME3 stack for those who want it in natty
<bigon> micahg: maybe see with didrock, he's the one who reupload the pkg
<micahg> bigon: I'll check with him in the morning
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-02-15
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Morning pitti.
<pitti> chrisccoulson: good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<Sweetshark> Morning all!
<pitti> hey Sweetshark
<rodrigo_> morning
<pitti> hey rodrigo_
<rodrigo_> hi pitti how are you?
<pitti> I'm great, thank you!
<pitti> rodrigo_: how about yourself?
<rodrigo_> great also :)
<seb128> hey rodrigo_ pitti
<rodrigo_> morning seb128
<seb128> how are you?
<didrocks> salut seb128, hey rodrigo_!
<rodrigo_> salut didrocks
<ara> hey rodrigo_, seb128, pitti, didrocks
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<pitti> hey ara
<rodrigo_> seb128, I'm fine thanks, you?
<ara> pitti, seb128: cr3 accepted my changes to checkbox (the migration to gtkbuilder) and it is now in the sponsorship queue: https://code.launchpad.net/~cr3/ubuntu/natty/checkbox/0.11/+merge/49736
<rodrigo_> hi ara
<pitti> ara: yay
<pitti> first step towards pygi
<didrocks> good morning ara
<ara> by the way, I am slowly preparing my MOTU application: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AraPulido/MOTUApplication
<ara> I would appreciate your comments :)
<ara> It is not like I will apply in the next weeks, but, you know, slowly :)
<seb128> hey ara didrocks
<seb128> rodrigo_, I'm fine thanks
<seb128> ara, \o/
<seb128> ara: I will sponsor it for you
<ara> seb128, thanks :)
<seb128> ara, thanks for working on that, it's one of the 2 remaining python-glade2 users on the CD
<pitti> the other is pitivi?
<seb128> pitti, correct
<geser> seb128: is there a bug about this menubar issue in natty? (I know only of bug 717332)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 717332 in gnome-terminal "gnome-terminal is confused about its menubar status" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/717332
<seb128> bug #717358
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 717358 in indicator-appmenu "nautilus puts a menu bar at the top of the desktop" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/717358
 * pitti reminds seb128 to remind him about the meeting reminder
<seb128> pitti, hey pitti, you should send the meeting reminder maybe today? ;-)!
<pitti> seb128: great idea, thanks!
<pitti> *woosh* done
<seb128> ;-)
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<rodrigo_> are current debian packages available in some svn/bzr branch?
<geser> rodrigo_: yes if the udd import of them worked
<rodrigo_> geser, I mean upstream debian branches
<seb128> ups
<seb128> rodrigo_, you might want to use http://packages.qa.debian.org/%s
<seb128> where %s is the source package
<geser> rodrigo_: the package importer also import Debian packages into UDD, not only the Ubuntu ones (if I understand you correctly)
<seb128> rodrigo_, it gives you details on the debian vcs, their bug tracker, etc
<didrocks> mvo: ahah, trying the ubuntudevbar? ;)
<seb128> didrocks, what is that?
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, that's what I wanted
<seb128> rodrigo_, http://pkg-gnome.alioth.debian.org/svn.html as well
<didrocks> seb128: an experimental plugin I've made for Quickly a year ago or so
<didrocks> I was thinking I never shipped it
<didrocks> maybe mterry shipped it thinking I was maintaining it
<mvo> didrocks: heh :) not as such, I run a automatic python import checker as part the upgrade tester
<didrocks> mvo: ok, I need to avoid shipping it then ;)
<didrocks> (as the second comments seemed "human", I was thinking about a manual test :))
<mvo> I have no idea about python-nautilus, is it actually useful if you can't do "import nautilus" when its installed?
<mvo> or does it serve a different purpose?
<seb128> mvo, I guess bug #719170 is a bug for you
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 719170 in gconf "Segmentation fault during processing triggers for gconf2 when installing some packages on LiveCD" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/719170
<seb128> mvo, see http://launchpadlibrarian.net/64376916/valgrind.log
<didrocks> mvo: it should work like this, right, but all gnome is migration to a different API for plugins in any case, that's why I don't maintain this prototype that much
<mvo> didrocks: if python-nautilus is no longer useful (sounds like it) shouldn#t we remove it then?
<seb128> mvo, it still has some rdepends
<seb128> mvo, it's as useful as it was
<seb128> which is not very but still
<didrocks> mvo: I think that some plugins still uses it, not sure how if the import is failing for you :)
<mvo> seb128: aha, ok. so "import nautilus" is just not supposed to work?
<seb128> mvo, let me check how it's supposed to work, I never used it
<seb128> mvo, but "import nautilus" should work
<didrocks> IIRC, it only works in the nautilus process
<didrocks> confirmed
<seb128> right
<seb128> mvo, ^
<seb128> see the package README for how to test
<seb128> it ships some examples as well
<mvo> aha, cool
<mvo> thanks!
<seb128> mvo, yw
<chrisccoulson> pitti - for bug 655707, i added a link to the testcase which contained the broken font that crashed the previous version of firefox
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 655707 in pango1.0 "Firefox crashes opening pages that use webfonts " [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/655707
<seb128> Riddell, bug #713880, could you reassign to whatever is the right kde source?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 713880 in gnome-control-center "System settings doesn't retain touchpad disablement" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/713880
<huats> morning
<Riddell> seb128: done
<seb128> Riddell, thanks
<seb128> rodrigo_, hey
<seb128> rodrigo_, I've added bug #718098 to your buglist, seems to be a common nautilus crash in natty, not sure if it's due to gtk or something else though since that seemed to have started recently and nautilus didn't change in a while
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 718098 in nautilus "nautilus crashed with SIGSEGV in g_str_hash()" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/718098
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, jibel get the crash easily if you need details
<rodrigo_> ah ok, cool
<seb128> rodrigo_, he also says that g-s-d is running but changing icon theme doesn't them to work, like the icons displayed are not updated
<rodrigo_> seb128, with 2.32 I guess?
<jibel> rodrigo_, yes
<jibel> rodrigo_, fresh install of natty
<rodrigo_> jibel, none of the icon themes work?
<jibel> rodrigo_, none
 * jibel doing screenshots
<rodrigo_> jibel, my first thought is some missing package, but I guess they wouldn't show up at all in the appearance capplet
<rodrigo_> jibel, you don't have g-s-d from the gnome3 ppa, right?
<jibel> rodrigo_, don't be so impatient, let me take the screenshots, I have only 1 brain and 2 hands
<seb128> rodrigo_, no, it's stock natty
<rodrigo_> ok, ok :)
<mpt> mvo, hey, I'm looking at bug 668382
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 668382 in software-center "No warning before removing important packages!!" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/668382
<mpt> and wondering, how can we tell that removing libcamel1.2-14 (for example) is dangerous in a way that removing evolution (for example) is not
<jibel> rodrigo_, I've attached 2 png to 718098
<rodrigo_> ricotz, any news on the gnome-shell package for the gnome3 ppa?
<ricotz> rodrigo_, sorry no, wanted to wait for the gtk+3.0 final
<ricotz> rodrigo_, before that every package in the ppa needs to be rebuild against the new gtk libs
<rodrigo_> right, is anyone working on the 3.0 packaging?
<ricotz> rodrigo_, they are already in natty
<rodrigo_> ah
<ricotz> rodrigo_, the soname changed, so everything using gtk3 should be broken currently
<ricotz> rodrigo_, but before that we should sync with debian, since the changed the package names according to the soname change
<ricotz> rodrigo_, robert should be on it
<Sweetshark> so oehm, how do I compile the dkms for virtualbox ose on natty?
<jibel> rodrigo_, 718098 reproduced on another system running classic desktop without effects
<jibel> rodrigo_, to reproduce, install a fresh natty, login,  launch "nautilus /usr/share/applications" and close the window => crash
<rodrigo_> jibel, add that to the bug, please
<Riddell> seb128: why is vala-0.10 needed if vala 0.11 is the default?
<Riddell> seb128: also main or universe?
<seb128> Riddell, because there is still a stack of rdepends we didn't port yet
<seb128> Riddell, to main for now please, binaries are still used in the default install
<seb128> they are staying on nbs for a while
<seb128> we discussed it during the last meeting there
<seb128> we just pull 0.10 back while we port those
<seb128> Riddell, i.e that will be be cleaned for natty
<Riddell> accepted
<seb128> Riddell, thanks
<bratsche> didrocks: btw, I posted two merge requests if you have a few minutes anytime today to look at them.   https://code.launchpad.net/~bratsche/libgrip/packaging-dep5-copyright/+merge/49639   and   https://code.launchpad.net/~bratsche/libgrip/packaging-remove-gtkdoc-dependency/+merge/49644
<didrocks> bratsche: looking at them right now :)
<bratsche> Awesome, thanks!
<didrocks> bratsche: approved! (for both)
<bratsche> woot
<bratsche> Thanks!
<didrocks> bratsche: think to migrate to ~utouch-packaging as well
<didrocks> bratsche: yw ;)
<bratsche> Okay
<bratsche> didrocks: Do I do anything other than push to a new location there?
<didrocks> bratsche: you need to update the Vcs-Bzr tag in debian/control
<didrocks> bratsche: look at the other utouch- packages, like utouch-frame, they should be fine
<bratsche> didrocks: Looks like I don't currently have Vcs-Bzr set.  I guess I should set that.
<didrocks> bratsche: right, that will be nice (it enables us to just debcheckout <package_name>)
<didrocks> bratsche: it will bzr branch or apt-get source depending on what is given in debian/control
<bratsche> didrocks: Okay added that and pushed now to lp:~utouch-packaging/libgrip/ubuntu
<didrocks> bratsche: excellent, all points are addressed then?
<bratsche> I'll double check.  Just a minute.
<bratsche> didrocks: Yeah, I think everything is addressed now.
<didrocks> bratsche: excellent, will give another look today and then upload it :)
<bratsche> didrocks: Awesome, thank you very much!
<didrocks> bratsche: you're really welcome!
<Sarvatt> new natty nvidia drivers in ppa:ubuntu-x-swat/x-updates
<tedg> Sarvatt, For xserver 10 ?
<Sarvatt> yep
<tedg> woot!
<seb128> njpatel, ^
<seb128> gord, ^
 * didrocks begins to break his machine
<Sarvatt> they haven't built yet
<seb128> MacSlow, ^
<didrocks> seb128: just miss dbo when you will be there :)
<gord> \o/
<seb128> didrocks, ;-)
<njpatel> seb128, hey
<seb128> njpatel, howdy
 * tedg thinks Sarvatt has started a DDoS on LP by telling people before they built as they'll all be refreshing the page
<njpatel> Sarvatt, WOOHOO
<didrocks> loi
<didrocks> urgh
<MrChrisDruif> :O
<MrChrisDruif> :P
 * tedg got them, amd64 FTW!
<didrocks> tedg: i386 is ready as well :)
<chrisccoulson> i feel like i'm missing out here with my intel chipset
<seb128> lol
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah, you just missed 2 weeks of frustration, what a shame ;-)
 * bcurtiswx agrees with chrisccoulson 
<bcurtiswx> okok, i have AMD64 :P
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i'm pretty fortunate about that :)
<bcurtiswx> but i don't have nvidia drivers
<MrChrisDruif> My next "might" be intel or nvidia....currently ati
<tedg> chrisccoulson, You miss out every time you want to see graphics run quickly ;)
 * bcurtiswx hits the boxing bell "Round 1"
 * tedg is rebooting
<tedg> Nope, segfault in X :(
<seb128> tedg, you were that close and yet... ;-)
<Sarvatt> tedg: accepted but its not staring
<Sarvatt> can ya pastebin it?
<tedg> Sarvatt, http://paste.ubuntu.com/567340/
<tedg> Cool, pastebinit finally works with paste.ubuntu.com!
<Sarvatt> tedg: thats 270.18
<Sarvatt> 270.26 is the newest one
<tedg> Sarvatt, Hmm... okay.
<Sarvatt> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-x-swat/+archive/x-updates/+sourcepub/1512937/+listing-archive-extra
<tedg> Sarvatt, Let me try again and make sure I get the right now.
<tedg> one
<Sarvatt> tedg: did ya just add the PPA and update? amd64 hasn't been published yet if so
<tedg> Sarvatt, Yeah.  Hmm, must have gotten it from somewhere else.  I'll look through my sources
<seb128> tedg, use apt-cache policy <binary>
<seb128> tedg, it will tell you where it's coming from
<Sarvatt> 270.18 is the current one offered in there for amd64, 270.26 still hasn't been published yet https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-x-swat/+archive/x-updates/+sourcepub/1512937/+listing-archive-extra
<tedg> Sarvatt, Ah, okay.
<Sarvatt> it'll be awhile until I can test it
<Sarvatt> 557 upgraded, 14 newly installed, 0 to remove and 2 not upgraded.
<Sarvatt> Need to get 530 MB of archives.
<didrocks> tedg: i386 FTW then :p
<didrocks> X restart brb
<didrocks> Sarvatt: seems that the packaging let me upgrading with a wrong version of nvidia, I have the ABI mismatch
<Sarvatt> Section "ServerFlags"
<Sarvatt>         Option  "IgnoreABI"     "True"
<Sarvatt> EndSection
<Sarvatt> didrocks: do you have that in your xorg.conf?
<didrocks> Sarvatt: I don't, should I?
 * Sarvatt nods
<didrocks> ok, let's try to ignore the check then :)
<didrocks> brb
<Sarvatt> didrocks: no luck?
<didrocks> Sarvatt: no :( didn't work very well, (my Xorg.0.log): http://paste.ubuntu.com/567359/
<Sarvatt> didrocks: kernel module failed to build?
<Sarvatt> didrocks: can I see your dmesg?
<didrocks> Sarvatt: I have a lot of NVRM: API mismatch, but nothing else relevant
<didrocks> Sarvatt: for instance: http://paste.ubuntu.com/567361/
<didrocks> Sarvatt: I've just upgraded my kernel but didn't restart. That shouldn't impact isn't it? as DKMS should build with every known kernelâ¦
<Sarvatt> yeah it affects it
<Sarvatt> you still have the old one loaded
<didrocks> Sarvatt: right, but dmks build for every kernels, isn't it?
<didrocks> it tries to only load the latest one?
<Sarvatt> dkms only builds against the current and the newest kernels I believe
<Sarvatt> dkms status
<Sarvatt> will tell ya
<didrocks> nvidia-current, 270.26, 2.6.38-3-generic, i686: installed
<didrocks> nvidia-current, 270.26, 2.6.38-1-generic, i686: installed
<didrocks> and I'm on 2.6.38-1-generic
<didrocks> I still can try to reboot anyway
<didrocks> but it doesn't seem to be that, isn't it? :/
<didrocks> trying
<didrocks> Sarvatt: segfault with the new kernel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/567369/
<didrocks> seb128: btw, I tried to reset the panel, and I don't get the messaging menu neither the indicatorme/session
<seb128> didrocks, how did you reset it? I noticed that as well in a guest session but it was working and gnome-panel didn't get updated
<seb128> didrocks, I got some applet crashes again since the recent compiz updates though so I was wondering if that was due to it
<didrocks> seb128: gconftools --recursive-unset /apps/panel
<didrocks> seb128: I'm on metacity
<MacSlow> seb128, thanks
<seb128> if not could be something in the indicator start
<seb128> stack
<seb128> didrocks, ok, so that needs debugging
 * Sarvatt disappears to test this nvidia junk :)
<didrocks> seb128: ok, at least, you reproduced in the guest session
<seb128> didrocks, yes
<rodrigo_> when pushing new branches for gnome3-team, it takes ages, taking /~vcs-imports/gnome-menus/main as default stacking branch, any idea what might be wrong?
<rodrigo_> it used to just work
<rodrigo_> work = push took a couple minutes, not 4/5 hours
<seb128> rodrigo_, did you use to push debian only directories or source history?
<rodrigo_> seb128, I usually branch locally from the ubuntu-desktop branch (debian only) and then just push that to ~gnome3-team
<rodrigo_> so yes, pushing a debian only branch
<seb128> rodrigo_, those imports are not debian only though
<seb128> which might be the difference
<tedg> Uhg, segfault the same with 26 :(
<seb128> tedg, it doesn't work for didrocks either
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, but why is it using that as stacking branch?
<rodrigo_> if I use --stacked-on=lp:~ubuntu-desktop..., the same, it takes ages
<seb128> not sure what you mean?
<seb128> how did you work on it?
<seb128> usually I do bzr get lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-menus/ubuntu
<seb128> hack on it
<seb128> bzr commit
<seb128> bzr push lp:~gnome3...
<seb128> which works fine
<rodrigo_> seb128, that's what I did
<seb128> rodrigo_, check on #launchpad then maybe
<rodrigo_> ok
<lamalex> bryceh, so i just updated from x-swat but nvidia isn't loading
<jasoncwarner> morning everyone...
 * kenvandine waves
<kenvandine> hey jasoncwarner
<pitti> hey jasoncwarner
<pitti> oh, meeting time
<dobey> rodrigo_: is it a particular branch, or all of them?
<seb128> hey jasoncwarner, pitti, kenvandine
<seb128> seems meeting time ;-)
<jasoncwarner> :)
<didrocks> hey hey
<jasoncwarner> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-02-15
<rodrigo_> dobey, last week it was gnome-icon-theme and this week gnome-menus, so the last 2 I've tried
 * Sweetshark waves.
<tremolux> hey folks
<rodrigo_> dobey, I've been able to push using --stacked-on, but see https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/gnome-menus/ubuntu
<Riddell> oh aye, meeting
<jasoncwarner> Alright...here we go for a quick meeting. Don't forget to update the wiki above and ....here we go!
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] Partner Update
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> DX, this week we'll have ABI changes for libindicator
<kenvandine> so we'll need to rebuild all the indicators
<kenvandine> shouldn't be a big deal, but beware of bumps in the road
<kenvandine> UbuntuOne:
<kenvandine> they have dropped the work planned for shotwell
<kenvandine> instead they will focus on API work to make it easier for someone to do it later
<kenvandine> the U1 API work done so far will land next week
<mterry> hi
<kenvandine> and the U1 integration in the launcher is blocked on bug # 709240
<kenvandine> libunity via python
<kenvandine> GIR problems
<kenvandine> anyone have questions?
<pitti> do they need help with that bug?
<pitti> I could help out with that
<kenvandine> pitti, probably
<kenvandine> kamstrup is out sick
<kenvandine> he was working on it
<chrisccoulson> oh, meeting time
<kenvandine> pitti, so please do :)
<chrisccoulson> i nearly missed that ;)
<seb128> yeah, jasoncwarner doesn't ping people just to make sure we pay attention :p
<pitti> kenvandine: ok, will coordinate with kamstrup
<kenvandine> great
<kenvandine> hehe
<didrocks> pitti: you should talk to kamstrup, right, he already advanced a little on the subject
<jasoncwarner> thanks, kenvandine. Any other questions?
<kenvandine> pitti, i think he has documented what he has done there
<jasoncwarner> next topic would be [TOPIC] UNITY
<didrocks> if you refresh the wiki page, you should have the report :)
<rodrigo_> :)
<didrocks> do you have any question?
<jasoncwarner> thanks didrocks, so the invisible window is gone except for gvim?
<seb128> I got some todays with gtk-demo
<seb128> so it's not only gvim
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: well, only on few apps, still need investigation
<didrocks> but I didn't get it for days now
<mterry> didrocks, is it when there's "nux input window" in the panel?
<seb128> mterry, no, that's another bug
<mterry> I saw that today
<mterry> oh, ok
<seb128> mterry, #693777
<didrocks> mterry: yeah, the nux input window is when the launcher is focused
<didrocks> like, you triggered alt + F1
<mterry> sure, blame it on me  ;)
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> mterry: with the greatest pleasure :)
<jasoncwarner> thanks didrocks..I'm looking forward to this update this week even...from the looks of https://launchpad.net/unity/+milestone/3.4.4 there are some real stability things coming this week.
<seb128> without wanting to disappoint anyone the bug I pointed was open before the alt-f1 work ;-)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: yeah, the list isn't finished yet, so, keep an eye on it :)
<jasoncwarner> cool..thanks
<didrocks> seb128: right, hence the "like, youâ¦" not the only case you can have it :)
<bcurtiswx> hmm, ubuntu-one-sync always causes my fan to turn on at startup
<jasoncwarner> Ok...next topic
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] Software Center
<tremolux> heyo
<bcurtiswx> oh meeting, apologies
<tremolux> report is on the wiki, but I can paste a summary
<tremolux>  Unity launcher integration: Software Center side is complete, Unity side in-progress
<tremolux>   Ratings and Reviews: New "Was this review useful" feature (awaits server-side rollout to activate), offline cache support for reviews
<tremolux>   Coming soon: Lobby improvements, deauthorize your computer feature
<jasoncwarner> tremolux: the unity integration, you feel pretty good about that landing this week?
<kenvandine> tremolux, is that using libunity?
<tremolux> jasoncwarner: I am not sure actually, I need to ping DBO for an update
<tremolux> kenvandine: currently the plan is dbus, but DBO may change that
<kenvandine> ok, because libunity from python is a problem right now
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: not sure for that week
<tremolux> kenvandine: yep
 * Sweetshark just has a Xorg freeze right now. Luckily the irc client is in tmux. However, the system has huge latency => I will need a reboot soon.
<jasoncwarner> ok, thanks tremolux. can't wait to see the software center / unity interactions :)
<jasoncwarner> any other questions?
<tremolux> jasoncwarner: yes, thanks!  me too
<jasoncwarner> next [TOPIC] Kubuntu
<Riddell> moi?
<Riddell>  * Lucid .2 testing under way
<Riddell>  * owncloud packaging in progress
<Riddell>  * samba sharing is working, finally! thanks to rbelem
<Riddell>  * Ubiquity keyboard selection now working, hugs to cjwatson
<Riddell>  * mobile seed split into new collection, launchpad update due to be merged, then kubuntu-mobile images will be working again
<Riddell>  * 10 bugs milestoned for alpha 3 http://goo.gl/yGhJd
<Riddell>  * In a decent position with https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Todo for feature freeze, mostly green where it needs to be
<jasoncwarner> very cool...is that samba sharing in the default install?
<MrChrisDruif> Woops....missing the meeting :P
<Riddell> jasoncwarner: yes (or will be on tomorrow's CDs)
<jasoncwarner> awesome, very cool.
<jasoncwarner> thanks
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] Xorg is for eastern edition
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] Tools and processes...if anything?
<jasoncwarner> and I don't think we have anything here except for WIs, WIs, WIs! :)
<mterry_> :)
<pitti> we are falling behind quite badly indeed
<didrocks> speaking of WIs, I wanted to discuss oneconf
<didrocks> so, I ported oneconf (with pain) on the new software-center API
<didrocks> still need to do the same for ubuntu sso API
<pitti> shoudl we start dropping the low BPs like https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/appdevs-desktop-n-opportunistic-developer-manual or https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-oneconf ?
<didrocks> so, with that, we will have the same oneconf as in maverick (just spent hours to port to changed APIâ¦)
<didrocks> then, seeing new issues with desktopcouch, the point of order is to drop it in the futur
<didrocks> and rely on the software-center infrastructure
<didrocks> we won't have upgrade path from desktop-couch -> s-c infrastructure easily
<didrocks> so, as we can't set it by default now, my proposal is to drop the ubiquity and oneconf by default for next release
<didrocks> once ported out desktopcouch
<didrocks> (so, I'll just have a "port to new sso API" WI)
<didrocks> thoughts?
<pitti> given that you are #2 on number of WIs, anything which relieves you will be quite welcome
<didrocks> (realistically, I won't have the time to port to the USC infrastructure this cycle before FF and I prefer to help unity righ tnow)
<pitti> didrocks: seems fine to me; is that packageselection-desktop-n-oneconf?
<pitti> shoudl we move the entire thing to the o cycle, or just POSTPONE some WIs there?
<didrocks> right
<MrChrisDruif> unity should be rock solid in natty....usc...it works as is...
<didrocks> pitti: the usc porting is almost done
<didrocks> I need to do the u1 sso port still
<didrocks> shouldn't be hard
<MrChrisDruif> unity is in your face all the time...
<didrocks> all the rest should be postponed to O
<pitti> didrocks: so perhaps you should update the spec yourself accordingly?
<didrocks> pitti: I'll
<pitti> didrocks: merci
<didrocks> pitti: de rien ;)
<pitti> related to that, I was wondering why our WI fixing pace has decreased recently
<pitti> is it because people work a lot more on bug fixes now? (that's certainly true for me)
<mterry_> that's where I've been
<pitti> or because the remaining WIs are the hard ones which were just pushed out to later?
<seb128> pitti, well to start most of our items are dx ones
<seb128> pitti, that and lot of unity, dx helping work and bug fixing which was not speced
<pitti> a large portion is also xulrunner 2.0 ports
<pitti> which should make progress once micahg starts
<seb128> pitti, well, same difference
<seb128> it's mostly items from other teams
<pitti> right, that's what I'd actually like to see :) (all hands to unity bug fix battle stations)
 * micahg has started :)
<seb128> we don't have some many desktopish items by themself there
<pitti> but even our own team still has ~ 70 items left for natty
<pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~platform/workitems/natty/canonical-desktop-team.html
<seb128> pitti, right, which seems an ok count
<chrisccoulson> if we could get xulrunner out of main, we could drop some of those WI's :)
<chrisccoulson> i'm spending way more time than I would like to on this stuff
<seb128> especially if you count off chrisccoulson's and didrocks's pet work items on those ;-)
<pitti> heh, yes
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yeah, I guess we should try harder eliminating swt-gtk from euca; it shouldn't have anything GTKish anyway
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that would be nice
<micahg> pitti: maybe I should move the universe packages off the WI list?
<chrisccoulson> did Daviey get back to you?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: not with details
<pitti> micahg: if you are going to port them, I think they should stay
<pitti> micahg: but perhaps we can be more aggressive with package removal?
<micahg> pitti: perhaps
<chrisccoulson> micahg - the issue is that because xulrunner is in main, i sort of feel like we're obliged to fix everything we break ;)
<chrisccoulson> (even the things in universe)
<seb128> do a call for help saying we will drop what is not fixed by the end of the cycle
<seb128> what the meeting over, is anybody still there?
<jasoncwarner> no
 * kenvandine is here
<jasoncwarner> :)
<seb128> ok, I was wondering ;-)
<jasoncwarner> almost though!
 * Sweetshark hides in the shadows
<didrocks> I'm still there and waiting the meeting to finish to restart on a working X, hopefully :)
<jasoncwarner> we only have one topic left if the previous discussion is done?
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] AOB, which I think we covered ;)
<jasoncwarner> maybe I should change it to [TOPIC] restart so you can get working desktop
<jasoncwarner> ;)
<didrocks> (or notâ¦) ;)
<chrisccoulson> is everyone using my globalmenu-extension in firefox btw?
<MrChrisDruif> chrisccoulson: I'm using Chromium <_<"
<seb128> no, I use what comes with natty
<MrChrisDruif> AOB?
<seb128> when it that one going to land? ;-)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: has worked like a charm for several days now
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'm hoping sometime this week, but people should be using it so i can fix all the remaining bugs before it lands ;)
<pitti> seb128: it's blocked by mozilla allowing us to ship ti
<pitti> it
<seb128> k, will install it
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<seb128> don't thank me, you might receive extra bugs :p
<Sweetshark> hmmm, the natty installer dies a flaming death in Virtualbox ... Is that a known issue?
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - so far, all of the bugs have been reported by myself and mike conley
<seb128> Sweetshark, not sure, check with ev or cjwatson, does it display any error?
<chrisccoulson> (ie, the 2 people working on it) ;)
<chrisccoulson> nobody else reported any bugs so far
<chrisccoulson> perhaps that is a good thing ;)
<seb128> you clearly don't have enough users running it ;-)
<chrisccoulson> there are some users running it, because i had a look on crash-stats and saw that some crashes were being caused by it ;)
<chrisccoulson> but those dropped to zero after i landed some fixes for them
<chrisccoulson> perhaps everyone stopped using it ;)
<seb128> ok, let's open a contest of who can find a bug first then:
<jasoncwarner> chrisccoulson: still thinking this week for mozilla getting back to us?
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner, i hope so
<jasoncwarner> chrisccoulson: ok..thanks.
<jasoncwarner> alright, anything else for today's meeting?
<seb128> not from me
<kenvandine> not from me
<pitti> chrisccoulson: no, perhaps because it just works now :)
<Sweetshark> not from me
<seb128> thanks jasoncwarner
<didrocks> nothing for me
<pitti> chrisccoulson: well, I still can't remove/edit bookmarks in the global menu
<didrocks> thanks!
<pitti> thanks everyone!
 * didrocks reboots and cross fingers
 * pitti reboots with new udev, brb
<jasoncwarner> [END MEETING] thanks!
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, that's not my fault though ;)
<Sweetshark> seb128: Well, I tried too different nightly, and both of them die after entering the default user and password with a dialog "blabla unrecoverable error, I will drop you on a desktop session". The only thing i did "different" from last time was Virtualbox and enabling "log me in automatically".
<MrChrisDruif> Alright, now that the meeting is over :P
<chrisccoulson> pitti / seb128 - the only bugs we're finding so far are minor things like bug 718374
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 718374 in globalmenu-extension "Empty bookmark menupopups in Firefox are not populated with the "(Empty)" placeholder menuitem when they are opened" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/718374
<MrChrisDruif> I've got a small question about keyboard lay-out in Maverick :P
<chrisccoulson> so i'm hoping that those are the sort of bugs that i[m going to get ;)
<chrisccoulson> MrChrisDruif, i don't think anyone in here uses maverick ;)
<MrChrisDruif> Still....it was there in lucid as well I think O:-)
<MrChrisDruif> It's a bug I think :P
<seb128> you should just ask your question
<MrChrisDruif> When ever you switch out keyboard lay-outs, and remove the old one....it's all fine and dandy....that is: until a reboot...
<MrChrisDruif> Then the old lay-out MYSTERIOUSLY reappears :P
<pitti> MrChrisDruif: you need to set your default layout in gdm
<MrChrisDruif> I've applied the lay-out system wide <_<"
<pitti> this will overwrite the default and add a new one
<pitti> still, your per-user gdm configuration (~/.dmrc) still has the old one
<MrChrisDruif> But if I'd select the new one, remove the old one and apply system wide.....shouldn't it be removed?
<kamusin> folks, is there any problems with gtk or something in Ubuntu Natty? just can't load any *.svg images :(
<didrocks> bratsche: added some info on the bug pulling from the latest
<Sweetshark> pitti: ping?
<pitti> hi Sweetshark
<Sweetshark> I have a nice little libreoffice-3.3.1~rc1-3ubuntu1 finished here, unfortunately lintian is not too happy with it.
<pitti> Sweetshark: I guess the previous version wasn't either, though? anything new?
<Sweetshark> pitti: Im not sure. But lintian errors (as opposed to warnings) are evil arent they?
<pitti> Sweetshark: in general they should at least be considered, yes; can you pastebin them?
<Sweetshark> https://pastebin.canonical.com/43355/
<Sweetshark> the armhf stuff is in 3.3.0 already fwiw if i read that correct: see http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=blob;f=control;h=66977e67ed09e9d770d6ff329ec8fbfd1cb36139;hb=ubuntu-natty-3.3.0#l18 for example
<pitti> Sweetshark: looks like a lot of them are in the previous version, too
<pitti> debhelper-but-no-misc-depends on openoffice.org* are harmless as these are only transitional
<pitti> (no harm in adding it, though)
<pitti> armhf might be a new one in Debian
<pitti> all the image-file-in-usr-lib are unfortunate (they should be in /usr/share/libreoffice/ ideally), but certainly not new either
<pitti> Sweetshark: I see nothing that stands out; it certainly would benefit from some cleanup (at least lintian overrides for image-file-in-usr-lib if it isn't going to be fixed upstream)
<pitti> Sweetshark: but nothing that would block an upload
<pitti> Sweetshark: do you plan to upload to a PPA for broader testing?
<Sweetshark> pitti: I would like a ppa. But first I would like to do some basic tests with it in a VBox (which just finished the install) and wait for rene to release 3.3.1~rc1-3 at debian. ;)
<Sweetshark> I would then merge the remaining changesets and go for it.
<pitti> \o/
<pitti> Sweetshark: congrats
<pitti> seems you got into the packaging bits really fast!
<Sweetshark> If rene is waiting with the release, I could release as 3.3.1~rc1-2ubuntu1 too.
 * pitti waves good night
<Sweetshark> pitti: rene moved the packaging repo from bzr to git which is of course evil, but it helped me a bit as i do not need to learn the details of two new dscms at once (I still keep writing hg^W^Wgit^W^Wbzr ...)
<Sweetshark> pitti: n8 ;)
<ricotz> MacSlow, hi, is there going to be a notify-osd update (with fix_dropshadow) soon?
<MacSlow> ricotz, yes in the next few days.
<ricotz> MacSlow, ok, i was hoping to propose a pixman update which is likely triggering this problem
<MacSlow> ricotz, this fix will be part of the release too
<ricotz> MacSlow, alright
 * kenvandine_ waves, gotta head out
<RAOF> Man, x-ray lasers.  How cool is that!
<jasoncwarner> RAOF: whaaaaaaaat?
<RAOF> Imaging viruses with x-ray lasers.
<jasoncwarner> one sec...meeting is on hold...RAOF needs to explain himself ;)
<RAOF> Or, rather, imaging *a* virus with an x-ray laser.  It's like x-ray crystalography, but without the making-a-macroscopic-crystal bit.
<TheMuso> I'll take you at your wodr. :)
<TheMuso> word
<jasoncwarner> ok...here we go... RAOF TheMuso bryceh robert_ancell
<jasoncwarner> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-02-15
<jasoncwarner> ready for meeting?
<robert_ancell> yup
<TheMuso> Sure.
<RAOF> Totally.
<jasoncwarner> ok....western edition log is on the wiki as always...
<jasoncwarner> kicking it off [TOPIC] X.org Update
<jasoncwarner> bryceh or RAOF
<RAOF> Xserver:
<RAOF> If the schedule is to be believed, Xserver 1.10 should be released on Friday.
<RAOF> I don't believe it :)
<bryceh> heya
<TheMuso> heh
<RAOF> However, we need to get utouch's Xi 2.1 multitouch work in, and there are some interesting packaging changes to merge from Debian.
<bryceh> RAOF, now, viruses weilding x-ray lasers... that'd be kinda scary actually
<RAOF> So there'll be another git snapshot Xserver upload towards the end of the week.  This won't change the ABI (in a backwards incompatible way), so it should be painless.
<RAOF> Mesa: We'll pull in a new snapshot from the 7.10 release branch soon, and add a tiny backported patch that makes unity work on nv5x+ hardware.  Yay!
<RAOF> That means that, as far as I'm aware, Unity will run on all the big three open-source drivers without complaint :)
<jasoncwarner> RAOF: I really, really want that
<jasoncwarner> when do you think that is going to happen?
<bryceh> I'll believe it when I see it
<TheMuso> RAOF: What about mipmapping stuff on radeon, I think I still get crashes when switching between windows in unity on radeon.
<TheMuso> I turned it off before, but haven't got round to doing that again.
<RAOF> TheMuso: Hm.  *My* radeon system doesn't suffer from that; I checked that I had mipmapping enabled.  It's possible I've done something strange, though, like enabled the gallium driver.
<RAOF> That's something I need to check while testing the mesa upload.
<TheMuso> Ok, this is a fresh install from a week or so back, card is V770.
<TheMuso> RV770 even
<RAOF> Which should be ready today, and *will* run unity on all the hardware I have access to :)
<RAOF> Ok.
<TheMuso> Yes t runs, but I get crashes when switcing windows. I'll check again in a while when I need to do some more unity testing.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, I can test the radeon bug too, I still get that sometimes
<bryceh> TheMuso, I'm using an RV770 myself.  Are there steps to repro the bug somewhere?
<TheMuso> bryceh: Not that I've looked for, I haven't dug into it much, but will try and reproduce when it happens again, and make a note of the steps.
<robert_ancell> alt-tab 20 times in a row tends to do it for me
 * RAOF fires up his radeon box.
<bryceh> ok, probably better rather than discuss unreported bugs here in the meeting, to go file reports on them.  ;-) ;-)
<jasoncwarner> Ok, RAOF and bryceh, anything else? otherwise we can talk about [TOPIC] AOB
<bryceh> I have been tending to incoming natty xorg bug reports pretty well this release, we're doing ok at tracking issues down
<RAOF> I believe the relevant upstream bug is https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=32246
<ubot2> Freedesktop bug 32246 in Drivers/DRI/R600 "Compiz 0.9 switcher segfaults in mipmap generation code" [Normal,New]
<TheMuso> thanks
<bryceh> jasoncwarner, new -nvidia was released today, however still hasn't been updated for new xserver
<jasoncwarner> bryceh: aight...just ping me when that happens and i'll update ASAP ;)
<TheMuso> bryceh: Thats just great. :)
<jasoncwarner> Alright, anything else ?
<bryceh> jasoncwarner, I've been focusing most of the past week on Intel gpu lockup bugs.  While they're kernel bugs more than X, I've been analyzing them and helping get upstream attention, and have pulled in some patches to fix things.
<bryceh> it seems each time the kernel updates we get slightly different new forms of gpu lockups, so it's a bit of an ordeal
<bryceh> however, been improving the apport hooks as well as I go
<RAOF> And generally rockin' the Launchpad!
<bryceh> trying to, but it's a hard fight to stay on top of the bugs.  http://www.bryceharrington.org/X/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/totals-natty-workqueue.svg
<bryceh> despite all the -nouveau/-nvidia complaints, it's clearly -intel where people are reporting bugs the most
<bryceh> RAOF, aside from tracking the upcoming releases (thanks), anything in particular you've been working on?
<RAOF> I've done some reviewing for someone who'se picked up my DRI2 changes and extended them.
<jasoncwarner> Ok, sounds like we are about done. If anyone has anything to add, now would be the time :)
<RAOF> Also, working out whether & how to do the gallium fallback differently.
<RAOF> (I notice no one has responded to my RFC on ubuntu-x âº)
<jasoncwarner> Ok....[END MEETING] ;) thanks everyone
<TheMuso> Thanks.
<RAOF> Oh!  And the mesa dricore patch actually landed upstream.  Hooray!
<RAOF> Thanks.
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner, should we be booking travel for UDS?
<TheMuso> bryceh, RAOF, where do things stand WRT notebooks with 2 GPUs, i.e an I7 wth integrated intel GPU + an NVIDA GPU?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Usually an email is sent out from admin as to when its ok to book.
<TheMuso> Thats usually what I go on.
<jasoncwarner> robert_ancell: I'll check and get back to you...
<robert_ancell> ok, thanks
<bryceh> jasoncwarner, I'd like to know as well
<bryceh> TheMuso, last I'd heard it wasn't working any better than last release, however there has been discussion upstream and it's a known issue.
<RAOF> TheMuso: Generally it should be possible to use the intel chip.  For some systems, it is be possible to switch off the intel chip and use the nvidia chip (with an X restart).
<TheMuso> Ok.
<RAOF> Last I heard, the binary drivers âhave no plans to supportâ dynamic switching.
<broder> i definitely saw that for nvidia
<bryceh> nvidia never seems to have plans ;-)
<TheMuso> As long as nouveau as power management coming, thats good enough for me, I'd be happy to live on nouveau.
 * TheMuso recently picked up a new Lenovo notebook which has an intel GPU and an NVIDIA GPU.
<jasoncwarner> TheMuso: which one?
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner: The T510, there was an Australia Day sale here in Australia, on, you guessed it, Australia day.
<jasoncwarner> TheMuso: very nice
<bryceh> TheMuso, what's the GPU?  NV50?
<TheMuso> bryceh: All I know is that its an NVIDIA optimus, I'll know the exact specs once it gets here, which should be in the next day or so.
<RAOF> bryceh: It'll either be nv5x-class or fermi, although it won't be nv50
<RAOF> AFAICT everythings been pretty similar nv50 onwards, and the nvc0 is the first crazy new thing.
<bryceh> TheMuso, well, anyway, according to the nouveau feature list, there is some "WIP-ish" support for power management for up through the nv50 family, but none for nvc0
<bryceh> IOW, I wouldn't count on it
<TheMuso> Ok.
<TheMuso> If I can disable the nvidia GPU, the intel GPU will be fine for the vast majority of things I need to do.
 * bryceh nods
<bryceh> looks like suspend and even modesetting is still tbd on NVc0
<TheMuso> Ok.
<RAOF> nvc0, with some binary firmware-y stuff you need to extract from a mmiotrace (IIUC), has 2D & 3D accel with git snaphshots, but none with what we've got in Natty.
<TheMuso> Right, I don't need a powerhouse GPU for Linux work anyway.
<RAOF> I think that if you don't have the firmware-y stuff that it won't even modeset, which is a little awkward.
<RAOF> Ok.  Looks like the reason I don't see the radeon mipmapping crash is that somewhere along the line I've overwritten the classic r600 driver with the gallium driver.
<broder> TheMuso: i think my friend has one of the thinkpads with optimus, and i think he mentioned an issue where turning off optimus to force the intel chip didn't stick across reboots, so keep an eye out for that
<TheMuso> broder: Thanks, may be addressed in a BIOS update though.
<broder> ah, good
<TheMuso> I don't know, just speculating.
<Amaranth> RAOF: If you didn't notice that's a strong plus toward turning it on by default :)
<RAOF> Amaranth: r600g?  Yeah.
<fieldymac> Current chat topic is âGNOME Seahorseâ, set by sadam. fieldymac: Hi, a quick shout out to find out if anyone knows if I can export the seahorse contents via the command line or a bash script. I need to backup the contents of the seahorse folder as part of a backup script I'm writing.
<TheMuso> Ok with the rv770 mipmapping alt-tab issue I have, it only occurs when compiz goes to display the window switcher. If I alt-tab before the switcher window appears, everything is fine. If I hold alt after pressing tab, and the window switcher window tries toa ppear, compiz crashes.
<bryceh> TheMuso, RAOF, any chance it is this issue?  http://cgit.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/commit/?h=7.10&id=995edd4c0a05412bb9c0f733546082cad707ecca
<RAOF> TheMuso: Right.  Thanks.
<RAOF> If we switched to the gallium driver this would magically disappear...
<bryceh> my patch probably fixed an earlier incarnation of the alt-tab crash, but it may still fail at a different point in the code
<RAOF> bryceh: Your patch is for r300g, rv770 is using r600c.
<TheMuso> Yeah was about to say that.
<bryceh> RAOF, ahh
<bryceh> lemme pop into unity and give it a try
<TheMuso> Heh I'm not the only one still using classic GNOME. :)
<bryceh> erf... remembering why I went back to classic now ;-)
<bryceh> unity + dualhead = nosogood
<TheMuso> ah
<RAOF> Particularly: don't try dynamically enabling a display.  Unity's not a fan.
<chrisccoulson> i can't even use my second monitor, with or without unity :(
<chrisccoulson> it sucks being stuck with 1 screen
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: That's terrible!  What's your bug?
<chrisccoulson> RAOF - bug 710625
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 710625 in linux "Oops in intel_tv_detect when docking laptop, or starting X with it already docked" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/710625
<bryceh> well, the good news is I can totally repro TheMuso's bug
<TheMuso> ...the worst part about the crash, is that if I have a terminal open, I can't give it focus and type commands... I have to switch to a VT to run metacity et all with the DISPLAY env set to clean things up. :)
<bryceh> yep
<RAOF> TheMuso: The trick is to have byobu set up, and a terminal always open :)
<RAOF> Then when you log in via the VT you've got all the environment set up for you :)
<TheMuso> Yeah but I do testing that infrequently that switching to a VT is not a problem, and I use a secondary test user to do unity testing atm.
<bryceh> unfortunately gdb can't grok symbols for the fault
<TheMuso> Oh lovely.
<bryceh> I installed dbg symbols for the usual suspects but still no go
<bryceh> dmesg just shows this:
<bryceh> [ 2158.039672] radeon 0000:01:00.0: r600_cs_track_check:361 mask 0x0000000F | 0x0000000F no cb for 0
<bryceh> [ 2158.039677] radeon 0000:01:00.0: r600_packet3_check:1330 invalid cmd stream 486
<bryceh> [ 2158.039679] [drm:radeon_cs_ioctl] *ERROR* Invalid command stream !
<RAOF> bryceh: it's highly likely to be fdo 32246
<bryceh> dunno if it's related
<RAOF> Hm.  New and different!
<RAOF> I don't think I was getting that.
<TheMuso> bryceh: Let me check my dmesg.
<TheMuso> bryceh: Get the same thing in my demsg.
<TheMuso> gah typing sucks this morning.
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: That sucks.  But at least it looks like that should be a fairly easy to fix bug with a clear lead.
<TheMuso> bryceh: Did you get a crash report from it?
 * TheMuso goes to reproduce again after clearing his crash directory.
<bryceh> -rw------- 1 bryce bryce   424092 Feb 15 15:41 _usr_lib_policykit-1-gnome_polkit-gnome-authentication-agent-1.1000.crash
<bryceh> that's the only one I got in /var/crash, but it hasn't popped up in apport (yet)
<TheMuso> hrm ok
<TheMuso> I got one, let me file a bug with it.
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-02-16
<bryceh> hmm, mipmap.c is rather dense
<RAOF> Yes, it is.
<bryceh> aha
<bryceh>         rowA = 0x0
<RAOF> I went hunting through there earlier.  Although the crash is triggered in the mipmap generation code I think the bug is earlier.
<bryceh> that's probably true
<RAOF> Ok, so it looks like it still is fdo #32246 :)
<bryceh> no, this is me looking at your crash report ;-)
<RAOF> Oh :)
<bryceh> RAOF, try DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=noopt to build packages without optimizing out variables, that may help you trace down where the null pointer is coming in
<bryceh> RAOF, did you mention you'd tried the newer upstream mesa code?  if not, think it's worth thumbing through recent commits?
<RAOF> I'd tried master at the time of filing that bug; it may have been fixed since, I guess.
<bryceh> well, to start with it looks like do_row() ought to have an ASSERT(srcRowA);
<bryceh> although that won't fix the crash
<bryceh> maybe it should just return srcRowB in that case?
<RAOF> From memory the underlying problem is that the texture that it's trying to mipmap isn't quite properly set up.
 * RAOF hugs sbuild passing through DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS
<bryceh> yeah in this case looks like srcB would be invalid anyway (it's just srcA + an offset)
<bryceh> ok, mipmap.c:1817 is as far as I can trace the null pointer by eye
<bryceh> looks like it verifies the format is not compressed and then gets the null pointer from srcImage->Data
<RAOF> Yeah.
<bryceh> somehow no asserts for those pointers along this path
<bryceh> intriguing
<RAOF> I hadn't got as far as working out where srcImage->Data was expected to be set, and why it wasn't.
 * RAOF watches as a mesa build races against a dist-upgrade on a 3-drive btfrs system.
<TheMuso> lol
<bryceh> boy, yeah srcImage->Data gets lost quick in the tangle of calls
<TheMuso> bug 719710 likely a dup of others there, but may have a usable backtrace.
<ubot2> TheMuso: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: list index out of range (https://launchpad.net/bugs/719710)
<bryceh> maybe add some debug code to _mesa_GenerateMipmapEXT to display contents of texObj
<bryceh> that's the highest point in mesa; above that it's compiz code
<RAOF> My thinking was that the problem was actually *before* generateMipmapEXT; that the texture being passed in there hadn't been properly initialised.
<RAOF> But I couldn't manage to get a test-case smaller than compiz to exhibit the problem.
<bryceh> yeah I think that's the case too
<RAOF> I tried to coerce some of the mipmapping piglit tests into crashing in the same way, but couldn't.
<TheMuso> Seems apport failed to retrace as well, re my bug mentioned above.
<RAOF> It's easily reproducible here, and still occurs with 7.10.1~git
<RAOF> So, to master!
<TheMuso> Sorry if I have derailed your day of other things...
<RAOF> There are few things more important than making sure Unity works on the free drivers ;){
<TheMuso> Fair enough.
<RAOF> And I've already got it working for nv5x, so radeon's the last holdout :)
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> RAOF: Thanks, let me know if I can test anything.
<RAOF> Yup, still applies to master.
<TheMuso> damn
 * TheMuso -> lunch.
<bryceh> alrighty
<bryceh> RAOF, http://paste.ubuntu.com/567529/
<bryceh> haven't tested it, but that should force mesa to kick out early instead of crashing
<RAOF> Fair call.
<bryceh> justify fixing it here in that due to fdo #32096 this situation has come up  beyond just compiz
<bryceh> RAOF, also I found something which is mighty interesting...
<bryceh> http://www.opengl.org/wiki/Common_Mistakes
<bryceh> scroll down to 'Automatic mipmap generation' and check the Warning
<TheMuso> Wow, a can of worms is being opened...
<bryceh> I know next to nothing about GL programming, but that sounds awfully similar to what compiz is doing leading up to this crash
<bryceh> Warning: It has been reported that on some ATI drivers, glGenerateMipmap(GL_TEXTURE_2D) has no effect unless you precede it with a call to glEnable(GL_TEXTURE_2D) in this particular case. Once again, to be clear, bind the texture, glEnable, then glGenerateMipmap. This is a bug and has been in the ATI drivers for a while. Perhaps by the time you read this, it will have been corrected.
<bryceh> it looks like the code is calling glEnable, then binding the texture (I guess?), and then doing the equivalent of glGenerateMipmap
<bryceh> I don't know if the order matters though
<bryceh> so it looks to my untrained eyes like compiz is doing the right thing, but it seems suspicious.  Someone more knowledgeable in compiz could take a gander
<RAOF> I remember having a look; I don't think it calls glGenerateMipmap, because that's a GL 3 call.
<TheMuso> I just discovered that nautilus creates an indicator when you copy files, allowing you to close the file copy window and bring it back with the indicator if you want. :)
<TheMuso> Cool feature.
<RAOF> I obviously do more file copying than you; that's been there pretty much since the advent of indicators ;)
<TheMuso> Right./
<TheMuso> Or probably because I didn't notice it, I just left the copy windows open int he background.
<TheMuso> I only noticed it now because I am going through libappindicator's rdepends.
<RAOF> My you can get a lot of debug spew with RADEON_DEBUG=tex :)
<RAOF> Hm.  Ok, so the other option would be to ship r600g by default, as Debian and fedora do.
<RAOF> #dri-devel is very much of the âwhy are you trying to fix r600câ frame of mindâ¦
<TheMuso> heh so why don't we?
<RAOF> Indeed.
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> Sweetshark: ah, do you have a shared repo now with an ubuntu branch
<pitti> ?
 * pitti -> off to an appointment, bbl
<didrocks> good morning
<mvo> good morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey mvo :)
<Sweetshark> pitti: yes
<Sweetshark> Morning, btw
<Sweetshark> I tried to create an export to launchpad, but bzr fast-import fails on it.
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark
 * Sweetshark waves back at didrocks.
<Sweetshark> Another build finished tonight, but failed in the smoketest. The funny thing is: The test itself completes successfully, but JVM dies a horrible dead after that. I am still wondering if it would be better with the Sun JVM instead of OpenJDK ...
<Sweetshark> s/dead/death/
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm fine thanks, you?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, not too bad thanks.
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson didrocks
<didrocks> hey seb128!
<seb128> lut didrocks ;-)
<huats> morning
<huats> hello seb128 and didrocks
<didrocks> bonjour huats
<seb128> salut huats
<pitti> Sweetshark: don't worry about git->bzr; I think it'll cause more trouble than it's worth
<pitti> Sweetshark: and you'd break the ability to cherrypick back into debian
<lool> Oy
<lool> Last time I came to visit here, I reported all the stuff which was broken on the desktop for me  :-)   today, I'd like to note that things have greatly improved in the last weeks, almost all my issues are gone
<lool> I also very much like the wiki applet integration, it's looking great
<seb128> hey lool \o/
<seb128> glad that things work better for you ;-)
<seb128> lool, what wiki applet?
<lool> err wifi
<Sweetshark> pitti: do we have some way to host git too? I have a copy of the repo on UbuntuOne, but still something directly hosted on Ubuntu would ease my mind ...
<pitti> Sweetshark: as kernel.ubuntu.com does it, we can do it somehow, but I don't know the details
<pitti> Sweetshark: but I thought you'd just commit to the debian repo into the ubuntu branch?
<Sweetshark> pitti: I do.
<seb128> lool, oh ok
<seb128> lool, running unity or classic GNOME btw?
<lool> I need to try unity again; last time I tried it was too broken for me
<pitti> Sweetshark: you mean backup if alioth goes down?
<Sweetshark> pitti: sortof ...
<pitti> Sweetshark: I guess alioth + your local copy + ubuntuone should be reliable enough..
<Sweetshark> k
<pitti> Sweetshark: and then you can of course always put it on people.canonical.com
<pitti> Sweetshark: we just don't have gitweb installed there (or maybe we do, and I don't know about it), but that doesn't stop you from pushing a repo there
<Sweetshark> ah ok, cool
<pitti> Sweetshark: ah, http://packages.qa.debian.org/libr/libreoffice.html still points to bzr
<Sweetshark> pitti: not on my local copy ;)
<pitti> http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/ubuntu-natty-3.3.1
<pitti> ah, nice
<lool> seb128: Just switched to unity, works fine!
<seb128> ;-)
<lool> Is there a "launch command" shortcut?  alt-f2 doesn't appear to work
<seb128> no...
<seb128> in fact I run a classic GNOME session with a gnome-panel in autohiden at the bottem and unity enabled in ccsm there
<lool> The number of workspaces is reset to a different value for some reason; perhaps some session switching magic
<seb128> so I've unity and working alt-f2
<lool> seb128: Eh good trick
<seb128> lool, how did you start it? if you run "unity" or the unity session it uses a different compiz profile where unity is enabled by default
<lool> I have a xorg bug, but that's unrelated to unity
<seb128> but it means you have a stock compiz config
<lool> seb128: I'm selecting unity from gdm
<seb128> ok
<Sweetshark> pitti: 3.3.1~rc2 has been tagged upstream, but I will finish this one as 3.3.1~rc1-2ubuntu1. rc2 will follow later ...
<seb128> lool, it might be easier to keep using GNOME but enable unity in cssm
<seb128> you would keep your compiz config and have a gnome-panel
<seb128> that's what I'm doing ;-)
<lool> Is there a way to display other workspaces in unity?
<lool> I mean, workspace switcher applet
<seb128> no
 * lool tries unity 2d to see the difference
<seb128> there is the workspace button on the launcher
<seb128> which triggers the compiz workspace expose
<lool> unity 2d is working quite well too now
<lool> seb128: Thanks for the tricks
<seb128> lool, you're welcome
<didrocks> lool: the default in unity is a 2x2 layout. there is no more "binding magic" with the metacity one and the compiz profiles are separated beetween the unity and the classic session.
<didrocks> though, IIRC, I set the metacity to be 2x2 as well by default
<didrocks> lool: if you want to change the number of ws in unity, you can use ccsm for that
<Sweetshark> pitti: sooo ... should I dput libreoffice_3.3.1~rc1-2ubuntu1 to the libreoffice ppa?
<pitti> Sweetshark: you figured out the smoketest failure? if so, go! go! go! :-)
 * Sweetshark has been way too long in OOo to not know how to trick the smoketest.
<Sweetshark> pitti: when there is a unrelease debian upstream version 3.3.1~rc1-3 and I am basing on it should I can mine 3.3.1~rc1-3unbuntu1 or 3.3.1~rc1-2unbuntu1 (which was released)
<pitti> Sweetshark: not "unbuntu" please :) Personally I'd use -3~ubuntu1
<pitti> (if -3 is about to be uploaded)
<pitti> or if it's still going to get a lot of changes before upload, use -2ubuntu1
<Sweetshark> -3 wont be uploaded as debian went on directly to rc2
<pitti> Sweetshark: which one doesn't matter much; just don't call it -3ubuntu1 before -3 actually hits debian
<pitti> Sweetshark: ah; use -2ubuntu1 then
<Sweetshark> k
<pitti> and just in case it fails to build in the PPA, -2ubuntu1~ppa1 :)
<pitti> then you can do some followup fixes until it builds in the PPA, and upload the final thing as -2ubuntu1
<pitti> Sweetshark: do you know ~ ?
<Sweetshark> no
<pitti> Sweetshark: X~Y is smaller than X
<pitti> so ~ is appropriate for backports,
<pitti> e. g. if you have 1-2ubuntu3 in natty, the maverick backport would be 1-2ubuntu3~maverick1
<Sweetshark> distro is still UNRELEASED until is will hit the natty repos, right?
<pitti> so that if you upgrade from maverick plus that backport to natty, the version number will be higher
<pitti> Sweetshark: in the changelog? yes, that's a good and common practice to have; you commit stuff with UNRELEASED
<pitti> and once you are ready to upload, you do "dch -r" and then "debcommit -r"
<Sweetshark> so, I have breoffice (1:3.3.1~rc1-2ubuntu1~ppa1) UNRELEASED; urgency=low
<pitti> Sweetshark: so ~ is usually used for kinds of "prereleases"
<pitti> Sweetshark: another common use case is 1.0~beta1
<pitti> 0.9 < 1.0~beta < 1.0
<Sweetshark> pitti: well, debian makes a _lot_ more sense than gentoo there ...
<seb128> (gdb) p priv->appinfo
<seb128> $2 = (GAppInfo *) 0x92705e8
<seb128> (gdb) p *(priv->appinfo)
<seb128> $3 = <incomplete type>
<seb128> (gdb) p *(GAppInfo*)(priv->appinfo)
<seb128> $1 = <incomplete type>
<seb128> hates gdb!!!
<seb128> does anybody know why it refuses to print it? I've the glib dbg symbols installed
<pitti> seb128: I don't know why, I'm afraid; you might be able to use call() with some accessor methods, perhaps?
<seb128> pitti, let me try
<pitti> seb128: does this work? call g_app_info_get_commandline(priv->appinfo)
<pitti> seb128: I guess the reason is that it's a private struct that is only defined within the .c file?
<Sweetshark> seb128: does "p *$2" work maybe?
<seb128> Sweetshark, no, it's equivalent to " p *(priv->appinfo)" I think
<seb128> it gives a " <incomplete type>" as well
<seb128> pitti, not really, GAppInfo is a gio structure
<seb128> pitti, using the g_app_info_get_... work yes
<pitti> cool
<seb128> still I would like to figure why I can't print the structure ;-)
 * Sweetshark had gdb sometimes be more generous when using the shortcut ...
<Sweetshark> apropos crashes: it there a oracle JVM available around natty somewhere?
 * Sweetshark wants to test his smoketest with that, suspecting OpenJDK ...
<pitti> Sweetshark: you can install it from lucid or maverick partner repository
<pitti> (sun-java6)
<Sweetshark> pitti: k
<didrocks> tseliot: about bug #710762, we have the "open a new instance" feature relying on middle clickâ¦
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 710762 in xserver-xorg-input-evdev "Middle mouse button no longer works" [Undecided,Won't fix] https://launchpad.net/bugs/710762
 * tseliot has a look at the bug report
<tseliot> didrocks: what do you mean by "we"? Unity?
<didrocks> tseliot: right
<didrocks> tseliot: it's a backup key as we won't have time to distro-patch every .desktop file to add the "Add a new instance" entry
<tseliot> didrocks: ok, so you need to have middle button emulation back on by default, right? I guess it would take just a simple configuration file to do it
<tseliot> I need to talk to the rest of the X team about it first though
<didrocks> tseliot: right, just to hilight that case ;) thanks for discussing it at least :)
<tseliot> didrocks: so, can you explain a little bit how this works (as I can't use Unity with the radeon driver), please?
<didrocks> tseliot: so, by default, when you click on a launcher icon, you open an application
<tseliot> right
<didrocks> tseliot: it you reclick on it then and that the application is already opened, it focuses it
<didrocks> so you can't open multiple instance
<didrocks> instances
<tseliot> oh, I see the problem now
<didrocks> for that, there is two ways:
<didrocks> - distro-patching the .desktop for applications we know multiple-instances are working
<didrocks> this is the right way to do it, it will be shown by a right click on the launcher icon
<didrocks> but obviously, we won't be able to patch every .desktop file we have in the repo where it's needed
<tseliot> right
<didrocks> so, the backup plan is the second solution:
<didrocks> - middle click on the launcher icon
<didrocks> that "tries" to open a new instance in every case
<didrocks> (with some weird behavior on application focusing as they don't support multiple instances)
<didrocks> the fallback with the keyboard is alt + F1 and then space (from next release though)
<tseliot> ok
<tseliot> didrocks: ok, so I'll send them an email and subscribe you to the discussion
<didrocks> tseliot: thanks :)
<mterry_> pitti, are you fixing PyGI to work with gtk+2.0 or are we backing out the ports we did already?
<pitti> mterry_: uh, what's broken?
<pitti> it is supposed to work, I'm not planning to back out the ports
<mterry_> pitti, nothing.  I just remember the conversation about PyGI and 2.0 not getting along
<pitti> mterry_: I'm happy to backport annotation fixes to gtk2
<seb128> works fine here for apport, jockey, etc
<mterry_> seb128, oh.  I remember a desktop meeting where we agreed to back out the ports because we didn't want to ship 3.0 and pygi and 2.0 didn't play nice
<mterry_> maybe I misremembered that
<pitti> mterry_: 3.0 has pretty much perfect annotations now; 2.0 ones are still a bit buggy, but I fixed them up to the point where they work with the stuff that we ported
<mterry_> pitti, i see.  so 2.0 mostly works
<pitti> mterry_: yeah, it took me some effort to get 2.0 working :)
<mterry_> pitti, awesome  :)
<seb128> mterry_, right, but since pitti decided to fix gi on gtk2
<pitti> mterry_: if you stumble over something that doesn't, I'm happy to fix it up further
<pitti> it's usually easy
<mterry_> pitti, nope, not yet.  Just got confused
<pitti> seb128: (actually it was the other way round -- fix gtk2 for gi :) )
<seb128> mterry_, current natty should work fine, he backported the annotations fixes needed for the ports he did
<mterry_> cool
<pitti> seb128: btw, I'll take off tomorrow and Friday; would you be able to sit in the release meeting?
<seb128> mterry_, btw while you are here, please don't use obsolete libs to set the tz
<seb128> mterry_, dpkg -L gnome-settings-daemon | grep date
<seb128> mterry_, the polkit helper there is what gnome-panel, GNOME3 are using and what the indicator should do
<mterry_> seb128, you mean liboobs, yeah, the indicator is using that
<seb128> mterry_, well please don't ;-)
<mterry_> seb128, or is liboobs considered obsolete?  really?  oh  :(
<seb128> mterry_, it's the gnome-system-tools lib
<mterry_> right
<mterry_> ok, didn't know that was going away
<seb128> mterry_, using the gnome-settings-daemon polkit helper should be easy and better
<seb128> mterry_, yeah, I assumed so, that's why I'm pointing it now ;-)
<mterry_> cool, I think the plan from mpt is to not have the indicator set the timezone directly, but I'll pass along to klattimer too
<seb128> mterry_, what would set the tz?
<mterry_> seb128, the preference dialog that you can launch from the indicator
<mterry_> seb128, which we should make sure does the new thing if we end up writing bunches of it
<seb128> hum, seems part of the blame belongs to kenvandine and tedg there
<kenvandine> ?
 * kenvandine reads back
<kenvandine> liboobs is obsolete?
<kenvandine> ugh
<seb128> right, it's ted who added the depends on the lib
<seb128> kenvandine, you will get some slapping for not describing your depends changes in the changelog
<seb128> or in the control
<seb128> it's mentioned nowehre you started using that lib
<seb128> or I would have told you when it was added
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> kenvandine, well in any case yes, please use the gnome-settings-daemon polkit helper
<kenvandine> tedg, ^^
<seb128> that's what GNOME is doing nowadays
<kenvandine> that should make the opensuse guys happier too
<tedg> Ah, fun.  Hopefully not too big a deal.
<kenvandine> they don
<seb128> tedg, you can copy set-timezone.c from gcc3
<kenvandine> 't have liboobs
<seb128> gint     can_set_system_timezone (void);
<seb128> void     set_system_time_async   (gint64         time,
<seb128> void     set_system_timezone_async   (const gchar    *filename,
<seb128> that's basically what is in set-timezone from gcc
<seb128> with a get_ as well
<tedg> seb128, gcc?  glib?
<seb128> tedg, gnome-control-center
<tedg> Ah, okay.
 * tedg was trying to figure out why the compiler had timezone support
<seb128> tedg, take the current git code it's in panels datetime
<jibel> seb128, I confirm that the workaround fixes bug 719861 and that it also fix the nautilus crash.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 719861 in gdk-pixbuf "After installation icon theme default to gnome-icon-theme and cannot be changed" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/719861
<seb128> jibel, right, I figured so for the nautilus crash
<seb128> jibel, thanks
<seb128> session restart brb
<bigon> will you compile empathy with geoclue support now that geoclue is in main?
<fta> kenvandine, any update on the fast-respawn dance of indicator-datetime & geoclue-master?
<kenvandine> fta, not that i know of, fta is it still happening to you?
<bcurtiswx> after installing indicator-weather shouldn't I see it on my top panel?
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, you need to run it
<Sweetshark> pitti: Ok, libreoffice_3.3.1~rc1-2ubuntu1~ppa1.dsc finished to build without a smoketest failure this time. I am just unsure, if that is plain luck ... and making ten tries to find out would take some time ...
<kenvandine> bigon, not sure, we are easing into geoclue
<fta> kenvandine, yep. on my x64 desktop at work. but not at home
<kenvandine> interesting
<kenvandine> tedg, did you look at that at all yet?
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, "Another instance of this program is already running".  I don't see the numbers on the launcher, which makes me think there's some config file on my comp keeping unity from truly resetting after a computer reboot
<bcurtiswx> because I _should_ see indicator-weather
<kenvandine> no config file
<kenvandine> unless indicator-weather does something like that itself
<kenvandine> which i doubt
<bcurtiswx> what could possibly cause me not to see the launcher numbers after a reboot ?
<kenvandine> well, is it running after a reboot?
<bigon> kenvandine: ok
<kenvandine> it would have to start itself with the session
<tedg> kenvandine, No I haven't.
<bcurtiswx> i just rebooted and indicator-weather in terminal says it's already running.. and on reboot the numbers for the launcher (after starting empathy) don't show :-\
<fta> tedg, kenvandine: it's bug 718911
<ubot2> fta: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: list index out of range (https://launchpad.net/bugs/718911)
<fta> grrr
<fta> oh, i don't use the network-manager on that desktop, that may be the reason
<kenvandine> fta,  i was just noticing that
<kenvandine> sucky way to fail though
 * kenvandine is looking at it
<fta> kenvandine, thanks
<aquarius> having a weird dconf experience. dconf-editor says "dconf-editor: error while loading shared libraries: libgtk-3.0.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory", but dconf-tools depends on libgtk3.0-0. Not sure what might have gone wrong so I can file a bug...
<fta> is there a way to tell compiz that i don't want windows overlapping two workspaces?
<fta> aquarius, bug 719528
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 719528 in d-conf "rebuild against sonamed gtk3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/719528
<aquarius> fta, cor, that was quick. Thanks :)
<dobey> ah, so you are
<seb128> aquarius, gtk soname changed
<seb128> aquarius, we will do rebuilds but the gtk3 binaries will change so I'm waiting for that to not have to rebuild things twice
<seb128> aquarius, you can use "gsettings" on a command line instead as a workaround
<aquarius> seb128, yeah, it's not a big problem :)
<aquarius> bah, I was looking for a "don't use autohide" key for the unity launcher and there isn't one :)
<seb128> aquarius, try ccsm, it's in compiz
<aquarius> aha, it is, cheers seb128! although it doesn't do what I want anyway, so never mind :)
<seb128> aquarius, what do you want?
<aquarius> seb128, I want maximised windows to maximise to the space *other* than the launcher, like they do with the top panel. I'm sure it's being worked on, it just doesn't work yet :)
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, just a suggestion for a future gwibber.  Make it so I can see notifications for all messages for a specific protocol instead of right now where I'll have to see all facebook/twitter/identi.ca messages and I on'y want to see twitter/identi.ca
<seb128> ups
<seb128> not sure the launcher does that indeed, didrocks knows better about it though
<didrocks> hum? backloogging
<didrocks> aquarius: you mean, you want the launcher not in autohide mode though?
<seb128> didrocks, aquarius's question
<didrocks> like, launcher always visible?
<didrocks> (in that case, it's Hide launcher -> never)
<aquarius> didrocks, yep. Now that I can see progress and alerts for things *on* the launcher (xchat-indicator, U1, that sort of thing) I'm more inclined to look at the launcher itself. I can currently have the launcher show always, but maximised windows appear behind it if I do that, so it's not useful right now.
<didrocks> aquarius: hum, maximized or fullscreen?
<didrocks> aquarius: for maximize window, if you set the launcher to never hide, it sets the STRUT that the window manager respects
<aquarius> didrocks, maximized. The window manager doesn't seem to respect it for me; if I never-hide the launcher, maximized windows appear behind the launcher (both windows that were maximized before I set never-hide, and windows that i maximize after I set never-hide). I have multi-monitor, though, which might be confusing it.
<pitti> mterry_: what is https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/appdevs-desktop-n-quickly blocking on right now?
<didrocks> aquarius: for those before you set never-hide, that's normal,
<didrocks> aquarius: but maybe the mutlimonitor is confusing it, right
<aquarius> didrocks, grr! it's working now! how very annoying. So, ignore me for now and I'll try and reproduce it :)
<mterry_> pitti, LP API additions
<didrocks> aquarius: sure, do not hesitate to open a bug if you can get a reproducible test case
<pitti> mterry_: ah, thanks
<kenvandine> fta, geoclue upstream has fixed that bug in git as well as made tons of changes in regard to network manager
<kenvandine> now to decide on taking a snapshot, convincing upstream to do a release, or fixing this specific crasher without all the other NM enhancements
<mterry_> pitti, not clear it will happen in time for me to also add support to quickly.  So high chance of being postponed
<mterry_> especially with FF so close
<kenvandine> fta, fix uploaded :)
<fta> kenvandine, excellent \o/ thanks
<kenvandine> anytime!
<kklimonda> mvo: are reviews from software-center going to be marked as "outdated" after some time, when the new version of reviewed application has been made available?
<mvo> kklimonda: yeah it already adds a little line about this
<jmscone> Is anyone around that's using Natty?
<jmscone> I have a semi-major bug I need to see if anyone else is experiencing
<devin> hello
<devin> i need to talk to a dev
<devin> hello?
<kenvandine> devin, best to just ask
<devin> Could I please talk to a dev? Is anyone available?
<devin> I have a gnome/ubuntu bug to report
<kenvandine> pretty much everyone in this channel are devs
<devin> can I talk to you?
<kenvandine> sure
<devin> I'd like to report a gnome bug involving the menus
<devin> I have a laptop with sound and other action buttons on the front, as well as button with extra functions
<devin> such as Fn+F2 turns off the wifi
<jmscone> Is anyone else experiencing an issue wherein "linux-generic" is not installed? I am in this installation from A2 and thus my computer isn't updating to the latest kernel
<devin> the bug I have noticed is if I'm using currently in ANY menu in ubuntu, and hit any of these function buttons, they do not work
<kenvandine> jmscone, i haven't seen a problem with that
<devin> if I open the application menu and hit, the increas eor decrease audio button, nothing happens
<jmscone> kenvandine, Should I not report it then? Or see if I can get someone else to repro it?
<chrisccoulson> devin - that's a well known long standing issue
<devin> ok
<devin> atleast I'm not crazy and thinking that shouldn't be the behavior
<chrisccoulson> the menus have an active grab on the keyboard when they are open
<kenvandine> jmscone, prehaps you had a dist-upgrade at a weird time?
<chrisccoulson> devin - there's a bug open on launchpad somewhere from years ago
<jmscone> I did a fresh install on a separate partition with the A2 ISO
<devin> can you put a link? I'm not "savy" on how to find and report bugs
<kenvandine> jmscone, not sure then...
<jmscone> Alright, I'll check to see if it can be reproduced and then go from there, thanks for the help kenvandine
<kenvandine> jmscone, sorry i wasn't more help :)
<jmscone> It's okay, any idea of where I should go for an Ubuntu One dashboard issue?
<devin> chrisccoulson, could you submit a fresh hit on the bug report for me?   I'm a user, not a dev, got no idea how to go bug reports
<chrisccoulson> devin - sorry, i don't really have time to search for bug reports right now
<chrisccoulson> devin, https://launchpad.net/
<pitti> good bye everyone! I'll be on a long weekend, back on Monday
<jmscone> Or about the fact that Banshee looses it's menu if you close it to the sound menu and then re-open it....
<chrisccoulson> jmscone, it's best just to report issues you're having to launchpad
<jmscone> Alright, I will the appmenu since I can do it consistently.
<jmscone> Thank-you
<chrisccoulson> jmscone, i'd imagine that's already been reported tbh
<chrisccoulson> it's the same with empathy too
<jmscone> OK, nevermind, down to just U1 and the kernel thing. Thanks again
<chrisccoulson> jmscone, bug
<chrisccoulson> 718926
<chrisccoulson> bug 718926
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 718926 in appmenu-gtk "Some apps don't integrate to appmenu after having their windows closed" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/718926
<chrisccoulson> oops ;)
<jmscone> :P
<jmscone> What should I file that kernel issue against?
<pitti> tedg, kenvandine: FYI, I'm currently fixing the GI annotations for dbusmenu
<pitti> (kamstrup mentioned that in bug 709240)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 709240 in libunity "libunity support gobject-introspected languages" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/709240
<kenvandine> pitti, missing annotations?
<pitti> kenvandine: that, misformatted annotations, and bug in build system
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> thx
<tedg> pitti, Cool, thanks!
<didrocks> pitti: nice! kamstrup will do the release tomorrow and I'll upload it then :)
<pitti> didrocks: I guess I won't be done by then
<pitti> didrocks: I'll take off tomorrow and Friday, and won't have much time any more today
<pitti> but I'll get it ready by next Monday
<didrocks> pitti: oh ok, sure then, that can wait and being distro-patch if needed :)
<dobey> can i get some sponsor love? https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/natty/libubuntuone/release-0_3_11/+merge/50019
<micahg> didrocks: hi, got a minute?
<htorque> hello everyone! which component is responsible for the window decoration in a classic session with compiz?
<seb128> pitti, still there?
<didrocks> micahg: sure
<seb128> htorque, yes
<micahg> didrocks: so, I was wondering about gjs in natty, if we don't have gnome-shell, is there any reason to keep it?  (it's staged in the GNOME3 PPA with the rest of the stack)
<htorque> seb128, yes what? ;-)
<seb128> htorque, it's compiz
<seb128> htorque, sorry I misread your question
<seb128> it's compiz
<didrocks> micahg: because GNOME people asked for it, to be able to develop against ubuntu without adding a ppa. There was no real reason on the removal as well (just "not needed")
<htorque> seb128, ah! :) so a bugs go to compiz then, thanks!
<seb128> htorque, you're welcome
<seb128> micahg, the-board is using it as well for example
<micahg> didrocks: ah, it's for the GNOME devs, ok
<micahg> seb128: is the board going in natty?
<seb128> micahg, it's a way to use gi in javascript which people start doing
<seb128> micahg, not sure
<seb128> micahg, but still it seems we want the framework to be available because people start shipping code using it
<seb128> micahg, it's likely users will want to play with gtk or gnome libs in javascripts, even if they don't use g-s
<seb128> micahg, or the-board
<micahg> seb128: ok, but it's hard to support security wise, let
<seb128> micahg, do we care if it's in universe and not used by anything which users can run in the archive?
<micahg> seb128: well, -security updates ideally shouldn't break things in universe
<seb128> seems it's something our upstream and users really want and where maintainance should be easy enough
<micahg> and either way, if we update xulrunner or switch back to mozjs and update that, if Mozilla breaks the compatibility with the update, that needs porting
<seb128> since g-s is going to depends on it it's likely that upstream code and debian will be updated on xulrunner updates
<chrisccoulson> tbh, it's quite likely we're going to get a separate libmozjs source package soon which won't be coupled to firefox releases
<chrisccoulson> the current situation is too much of a pain ;)
<micahg> chrisccoulson: we still need security support for those :)
<micahg> and decoupling may or may not make it harder
<seb128> micahg, well if we break gjs for a few when xulrunner get security updates it's not end of the world if nothing use it
<chrisccoulson> well, the gnome guys are arguing that the only content gjs is exposed to is secure
<chrisccoulson> so, it doesn't need the same level of maintenance security-wise
<micahg> chrisccoulson: if that's the case, then we can just lock it into the release version of xulrunner
<chrisccoulson> if we don't have a separate libmozjs source package that is decoupled from firefox releases, then we should just drop all of these things from the archive (as being unsupportable) IMO ;)
<chrisccoulson> permanently :)
<chrisccoulson> the JS engine is something that's likely to keep breaking frequently over the next few releases
<micahg> chrisccoulson: even with mozjs, unless upstream makes separate releases, it seems fragile and prone to error
<chrisccoulson> i've seen the sort of things they're discussing for ff5.0 already, and that's going to happen next cycle according to the schedule ;)
<chrisccoulson> micahg - the idea is that we can pick a JS version, and stick with it for a while until we're ready to do a transition
<chrisccoulson> rather than having to do a majot transition every 3-6 months
<chrisccoulson> **major
<micahg> chrisccoulson: we still needs security updates for it though, if they abandon the branch, it's still an issue as most of the CVEs are JS vulns
<micahg> s/most/a lot/
<chrisccoulson> right, but that defeats the purpose of having a separate source package
<chrisccoulson> like i said, if we can't do that, then i think we should just drop all of this stuff from the archive ;)
<micahg> chrisccoulson: which is why I'm torn on the subject :)
 * micahg wishes seed could do the same stuff gjs does
 * dobey wishes people weren't trying to write local applications in javascript
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> and talking of javascript, i'm still trying to get google-gadgets working with the latest mozjs
<chrisccoulson> it's taken a 70kB patch just to make it build
<chrisccoulson> and it still doesn't work
<chrisccoulson> grrrr
<chrisccoulson> this is why these things are unsupportable ;)
<seb128> kenvandine, do you think you could try to figure why gdk-pixbuf doesn't build?
<seb128> it's something gir-ish
<seb128> I've to run in 15 minutes, my upload just failed but I don't think I will have time to debug it before dinner
<rodrigo_> hello?
<dobey> hi
<rodrigo_> ok, it works now!
<rodrigo_> hi dobey
<dobey> your opensuse hostmask? :P
<rodrigo_> dobey, no, my router
<rodrigo_> it broke last night, and I've been the whole day waiting for a new one
<dobey> ah
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<seb128> rodrigo_, I sorted the g-s-d issue jibel was having today
<rodrigo_> seb128, oh, cool, what was it?
<seb128> rodrigo_, the nautilus crash is a side effect of it
<rodrigo_> oh, cool :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdk-pixbuf/+bug/719861 for details
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 719861 in gdk-pixbuf "After installation icon theme default to gnome-icon-theme and cannot be changed" [High,Fix released]
<seb128> rodrigo_, basically the librsvg gdk-pixbuf loader was not registered because at the registration time libgl1 is not in the ldconfig path which breaks it
<seb128> rodrigo_, so they don't have svg support, which means svg themes seem to not apply
<seb128> rodrigo_, the nautilus crash is due to it as well, it shouldn't crash though so might still be something to work on but lower importance
<rodrigo_> seb128, crashing because of the missing lib?
<seb128> rodrigo_, no, it probably fails to do something
<Sarvatt> didrocks: here's a very basic list of what needs to be done to downgrade X and not screw up the package manager royally on i386 at least http://sarvatt.com/downloads/downgrade.txt
<Sarvatt> (for proprietary blob users)
<rodrigo_> ok, will look at it, on a virtual machine, since my current desktop is mostly gtk3-based stuff
<seb128> rodrigo_, well, remove the svg loader and try to run nautilus
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, or just edit the cache in /usr/lib/gdk-pixbuf-2.0/2.10.0/loaders to remove the svg loader
<seb128> rodrigo_, you will get a crash with a stacktrace similar to the launchpad one
<didrocks> Sarvatt: oh nice, I'll redirect people to that one. I've done it by hand yesterday, just took 1h30 but worked well
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, added your comments to the nautilus bug, so that I don't forget (getting up-to-date with everything now that I have inet back)
<Sarvatt> didrocks: sorry again for the trouble yesterday, even nvidia thought that blob was *supposed* to work on natty :D
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok
<dobey> seb128: can you sponsor https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/natty/libubuntuone/release-0_3_11/+merge/50019 pleae?
<seb128> dobey, ok
<didrocks> Sarvatt: no worry, as long as I have been able to downgradeâ¦ ;-)
<rodrigo_> dobey, I have ppu permissions for that package, if in the future you don't find seb128 (he's still better than me sponsoring things anyway :)
<Sarvatt> I'm just hoping that doesn't mean another 1 month wait just so they can recompile it against the correct version, haven't heard anything back yet
<seb128> rodrigo_, do you think your push to launchpad issues were due to the broken router?
<rodrigo_> seb128, no, I don't think so
<dobey> rodrigo_: yeah, i just need to get around to applying for motu and more ppu :)
<rodrigo_> dobey, yeah, better
<rodrigo_> seb128, the router just stopped working at all last night, but before that, everything else was working great, except the push
<seb128> rodrigo_, weird
<rodrigo_> seb128, yeah, next time I need to push some stuff (probably tomorrow, as I have some 2.91 packages in progress), I'll try doing some debugging
<didrocks> good evening
<lamlex> bryceh: is it possible to run a user run a specific apport hook and have it automatically attach to a bug report? like apport-collect but for a specific hook
<bryceh> lamlex, hmm, seems like that should be possible, although I don't know the syntax
<bryceh> lamlex, I know the hooks can be run independently (which I do frequently for testing), but they generate new bug reports
<bryceh> lamlex, apport-cli has a --update-report <num> option
<bryceh> lamlex, and it has a --package <pkg> option
<bryceh> presumably using both those together should trigger (only) the respective hook, and attach to the given bug
<lamlex> bryceh: rad thanks
<lamlex> i will poke around
<lamlex> i figured you might know before i spend a bunch of time trying to figure it out
<bryceh> cool, yeah lemme know what you find, I'm curious now myself :-)
<Sweetshark> https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ppa/+buildjob/2266942 <- and there was much rejoicing!
<pitti> Sweetshark: congrats!
<seb128> pitti, unping btw
<seb128> pitti, it was to know if you still have your gdk-pixbuf merge in a vcs ready to push locally but I merged, added my patch and uploaded since
<pitti> seb128: apparently I don't
<pitti> sorry if I forgot to push
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> but now I need someone with gir clue to figure why it fails to build
<pitti> output?
<seb128> the source didn't change so it's like due to the gir stack updates
<seb128> pitti, http://launchpadlibrarian.net/64467165/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-i386.gdk-pixbuf_2.23.0-1ubuntu2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<pitti> /usr/bin/ld: /build/buildd/gdk-pixbuf-2.23.0/gdk-pixbuf/tmp-introspectzTObRP/GdkPixbuf-2.0.o: undefined reference to symbol 'g_input_stream_get_type'
<pitti> /usr/bin/ld: note: 'g_input_stream_get_type' is defined in DSO /usr/lib/libgio-2.0.so.0 so try adding it to the linker command line
<pitti> seb128: it's not GIR, it's the linking; probably looks a bit weird due to parallel build
<pitti> oh, sorry, gir scanner link
<seb128> no, I think it's due to the warning before it
<pitti> why is gdk-pixbuf looking for gdk-pixbuf.pc?
<seb128> dunno
<seb128> it built before that's weird, I just changed a script, nothing to the code
<cyphermox> huh, is there a way to get left+right click to emulate middle-click again?
 * pitti waves good night for real
<bryceh> cyphermox, yes
<bryceh> /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/ :
<bryceh> Section "InputClass"
<bryceh>     Identifier "middle button emulation"
<bryceh>     MatchIsPointer "on"
<bryceh>     Option "Emulate3Buttons" "on"
<bryceh> EndSection
<bryceh> add that to your xorg.conf
<cyphermox> ah, thanks bryceh
<cyphermox> so this was turned off on purpose or something?
<kklimonda> yes
<bryceh> cyphermox, it's an upstream change - https://launchpad.net/bugs/710762
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 710762 in xserver-xorg-input-evdev "Middle mouse button no longer works" [Undecided,Won't fix]
<cyphermox> ah, cool
<kklimonda> it's unfortunate, as unity relies on the middle-click
<mvo> it seem s to be no longer work after resume, that used to be the case
<bryceh> yeah
<bryceh> we're mulling over the pros and cons
<cyphermox> it's not so bad once I stopped being an idiot and used the scrolling wheel to click... but I order the ubuntu travel mouse and its wheel doesn't click ;)
<bryceh> "ubuntu travel mouse"?  what is that?
<cyphermox> a tiny usb mouse: http://shop.canonical.com/product_info.php?products_id=643
<bryceh> mm, thanks for the link
<kklimonda> wow. it's tiny :)
<mvo> Sweetshark: hello, just a quick ping if you are aware of bug #715075
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 715075 in openoffice.org "file overwrite error maverick->natty" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/715075
<Sweetshark> mvo: have not been yet aware of it. is reaasigned to me.
<Sweetshark> mvo: there is a libreoffice-3.3.1~rc1-2ubuntu1~ppa1 building in the libreoffice ppa btw (amd64 is done, i386 is still building)
<mvo> Sweetshark: nice
<mvo> Sweetshark: thanks, its not a huge deal, by default we run the upgrade with --force-overwrite, but still worth fixing
<Sweetshark> ivanka: hi!
<ivanka> Sweetshark: hi!
<Sweetshark> ivanka-train: Do you have a minute for talking about the human iconset for Libreoffice?
<ivanka-train> Sweetshark: I am on the train so could cut out but apart from that, sure
<ivanka-train> Sweetshark: what about it?
<Sweetshark> I enabled the code upstream to handle the additional iconset. So all that need to be done to get the itemset on the system is dropping a images_human.zip at the right location in the filesystem.
<Sweetshark> packing that zip is contains no further magic, so I would propose to make a simple package with just creates the zip from a set of icons. I would setup a bzr branch for it on launchpad and populate it with the (default) tango iconset. Icons could then simply be replaced/updated on that branch.
<Sweetshark> This would allow us to make modifications to the icon set without the need to juggle around with the huge and complex Libreoffice package, also it would allow fixes independant of Libreoffice builds.
<Sweetshark> I have no idea where the human icons themselves are stored currently, somebody who does will have to put them in the bzr repository then. Does that sound ok for you?
<Sweetshark> ivanka-train: Still there?
<ivanka-train> Sweetshark: yup, everything just coming through. I suggest you find DanRabbit on irc tomorrow - he knows much more about the ins and outs than I do. In principle your suggestion sounds grand!
<Sweetshark> ivanka-train: great, will do!
<Sweetshark> ivanka-train: which timezone is DanRabbit in?
<ivanka-train> Sweetshark: london this week but normally california
<Sweetshark> ivanka-train: great, I am in Hamburg, Germany, so that will work out.
<ivanka-train> Sweetshark: splendid!
<ricotz> Sweetshark, i think vish is maintaining the human icons
<ricotz> Sweetshark, look in #elementary
<vish> Sweetshark: the human icons for OOo are in a separate package  "openoffice.org-style-human"
<DanRabbit> Sweetshark: hey I'm here but I'll be right back :p
<Sweetshark> heh
<Sweetshark> vish: So is there any version control for the human icons?
<vish> Sweetshark: nope.. they are not updated from anywhere.. initially when Ubuntu used Human the packaged was named -human , then when we switched to humanity , someone from the community updated the human icons to humanity .
<vish> there was a bug somewhere for that
<vish> s/packaged/package
<Sweetshark> k
<Sweetshark> I would like to setup a bzr branch on launchpad for it.
<Sweetshark> for example here: https://code.launchpad.net/~libreoffice
<Sweetshark> it would make it much easier to track changes
<vish> https://code.launchpad.net/~10068660/openoffice.org-human-icons/tango+human
<vish> thats the branch^
<Sweetshark> ah, cool
<Sweetshark> so, is that human atop of tango?
<vish> actually "humanity", the 'human' icons were replaced, but no one renamed the branch :)
<Sweetshark> aka tango icons as a base and some modified humanity icons ontop of it?
<Sweetshark> k
<vish> yup..
<Sweetshark> Is that stuff complete? Tango itself fallbacks on Galaxy(?) IIRC. Upstream icons are packed completely now (copying missing icon in from the fallback).
<Sweetshark> If not we would need to "fill up" the missing ones from a (newly generated) tango.
<Sweetshark> (which itself now might include some galaxy)
<vish> not really sure.. but i tried to do that update (human -> humanity) but my brain turned to goo.. ;p  too many icons needed to be updated and the names were all messy
<vish> Sweetshark: but as you mention, not all the icons replace Galaxy
<vish> last time i checked, the copyright is also a bit mixed there.. each groups of icons get their own copyright holder
<Sweetshark> vish: so it would probably make sense to take a new tango set (which includes Galaxy fallbacks) and then copy the current repostate over it and see what changes remain.
<patrickmw> Anyone here running Natty that uses Evolution for email?  Curious if anyone has had issues sending messages.  Either getting error referencing a lock in Outbox or referencing "Appending to local 'Sent' folder instead"
<vish> Sweetshark: hmm, actually the current one should be a complete set of icons.. just not complete set of similar style
<vish> so if you use a new tango set and replace , you'd basically replace everything..
<vish> Sweetshark:  why not just clone the branch and use for LibO ?
<vish> (not sure why you think that wont work..)
<vish> this is the main branch : https://code.launchpad.net/~openoffice.org-human-icons/openoffice.org-human-icons/tango+human
<vish> Sweetshark: basically why the "openoffice.org-style-human" package exists is to rebrand OOo to fit the Ubuntu theming
<vish> so that the folders/arrows/etc all look the same as other windows
<Sweetshark> vish: what do you mean with "use for LibO"?
<vish> Sweetshark: well, if the icon names have not changed that package should work for LibreOffice(LibO)
<Sweetshark> vish: you mean putting the icons upsteam to the libreoffice repos?
<vish> Sweetshark: either that, or use it the sameway OOo was using the -human package
<Sweetshark> vish: That would mean to do a "clean" update of the icons one would have to do a full LO rebuild => Bad
<vish> Sweetshark: oh! right.. i just read the whole backlog.. so you want to package these icons as "humanity.zip" and use it that way?
<Sweetshark> vish: yes
<Sweetshark> and we could make icon updates idependant of LO builds.
<vish> Sweetshark: well, there is no easy way to do this; one has to manually check the icons and replace them :)
<vish>  there are like literally 1000+ icons there.. ;p
<Sweetshark> vish: why? because they are in a different sorting in the zip as opposed from the current repo structure?
 * Sweetshark is amazed that the libreoffice_3.3.1~rc1-2ubuntu1~ppa1 package actually seems to work ....
<vish> Sweetshark: yea, not sure what the new sorting order in the .zip is now.. so I'm not sure if it would work if icons are in different folders.. and there was no sane naming of the icons, it is literally not an easy task to check those icons
<vish> Sweetshark: ^thats from what i noticed with the OOo icons.. i havent tried to look at the LibO package ;)
<Sweetshark> vish: then I would do _one_ build with the humanity icon from the repo and get a totally zip file that is ordered (or mixed) totally different. Then you unpack that, put it that order in a repo (a new one would make sense, I guess) and continue to work directly on that.
<Sweetshark> argh - remove the first "totally" in that sentence
<vish> Sweetshark: no one is working on those icons.. :)  (or going to afaik) ,mainly cause there is no need there..  so if you package it once it should be good for a while..
<Sweetshark> well, with no fallback in LO (thus requiring each iconset to be complete), there might be some work needed on them between releases. One could check that by comparing the unpacked images_tango.zip between releases though and do similiar changes for humanity.
<Sweetshark> DanRabbit: Any comments from your side?
<Sweetshark> Does not seem so. ;)
<Sweetshark> DanRabbit, vish: Thanks a lot, you helped me along quite a bit!
<vish> np.. :)
<DanRabbit> Sweetshark: don't thank me I didn't do anything :p
<DanRabbit> sorry I went to have a shower, I thought vish had it sorted pretty well haha
<vish> DanRabbit: pff, shower!  you always hated OOo and preferred Gnome Office ;p
<DanRabbit> vish: yea that too
<dobey> gnome office?
<DanRabbit> dobey: I think it's an unofficial title, but Abiword + Gnumeric + Ease
<dobey> what is ease?
<dobey> oh
<dobey> looks complicated
<rickspencer3> crikey
<rickspencer3> I accidentally the whole side pane in LO, and I cannot figure out how to get it to redock :(
<broder> the current state of sandybridge is that maverick supports the cpu and natty's kernel+X stack support the integrated gpu, right?
<RAOF> broder: Maverick supports 2D on the GPU, Natty supports 3D.
<broder> ah, cool
<broder> and it is both kernel and X changes?
<Sweetshark> re after the usual nouveau reboot :(
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-02-17
<TheMuso> RAOF: So the notebook arrived yesterday, and now that I have the product recovery data backed up, I've looked at the NVIDIA GPU in Device manager. Its an NVS3100M.
<TheMuso> And the nice thing is in the BIOS, I can choose which GPU I want to use, either Intel, NVIDIA, or both.
<TheMuso> So I dare say nouveau support is still lacking for that chip.
<TheMuso> bryceh: ^^
<RAOF> Have you tried it?
<RAOF> Yay for bios writers being useful.
<bryceh> TheMuso, congratz on new laptop
<RAOF> Yeah, that too :)
<TheMuso> RAOF: Will try Linux with the nvidia gpu on it in a while.
<micahg> robert_ancell: is there a desktop branch for gjs?
<robert_ancell> I just used the lp:ubuntu/gjs branch
<micahg> robert_ancell: ok, I wanted to update it to use dh_xulrunner instead of adding it manually in debian/control, so I'll just upload then
<robert_ancell> cool
<micahg> then i'll fwd it over to Debian so we can sync again :)
<TheMuso> bryceh, RAOF, ok 2D nouveau works fine, let me get natty installed and I'll see if the experimental dri package does anything for 3D.
<TheMuso> Interesting... Nouveau reckons its an NV50 generation card.
<RAOF> I think nouveau knows of nv0x, nv2x, nv3x, nv4x and nv5x as card generations.  From what I can gather, everything after >nv50 and <nvc0 is sufficiently similar to consider one generation.
<TheMuso> ah ok
<TheMuso> lspci mentions G218
<RAOF> Since your card has 2D, I'd expect it to also manage 3D with -experimental (but won't do Unity until this mesa is finished building, tested, and uploaded).
<TheMuso> ah ok.
<RAOF> Your Stability May Vary :)
 * TheMuso nods. I can switch to intel if I need stability.
<TheMuso> ...or can I... :)
<RAOF> :)
<bryceh> the infamous Intel stability
<TheMuso> I see myself only using NVIDIA if I need GPU grunt for something, which is rather rare for me.
<RAOF> Quick quiz: does it use an eDP connection?  Stability/usability depends on the answer being ânoâ :)
<TheMuso> ...and testing.
<TheMuso> How do you find that out?
<RAOF> xrandr probably tells you.  Or you could switch to intel and see if the laptop panel turns on :)
<RAOF> (If it does, you probably don't have an eDP panel âº)
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, are the libindicate GIR bindings supposed to work?
<TheMuso> Oh the laptop panel is working with nouveau.
<TheMuso> Its not connected to a monitor.
<RAOF> It's intel that has problems with eDP; nouveau, as far as I'm aware, handles it.
<TheMuso> Oh right, well under intel the panel does turn on.
<TheMuso> And unity does load.
<RAOF> Hurray!
<cyphermox> hey TheMuso
<cyphermox> saw your bug about a11y for nm-applet indicator, did you file the same for indicator-network? I looked but couldn't find it, I was certain I had seen an email about that before
<TheMuso> cyphermox: No, I 've already done the work for indicator-network, and kvalo has seen and signed off on it.
<cyphermox> ah, so that's why
<TheMuso> Because indicator-network is a system indicator, whereas network-manager is still an application indicator, so there are still changes that need to be merged into libappindicator for that to happen.
<cyphermox> that's already working for libindicator then, just missing the API for libappindicator?
<cyphermox> hehe ok :)
<TheMuso> The work is done for libappindicator, and its in the merge queue, but its blocking on some KDE related stuff.
<TheMuso> Ted knows more about that.
<cyphermox> right
<cyphermox> I subscribed to your branch so in theory I should get an email as soon as it's merged
<TheMuso> Ok cool.
<didrocks> good morning
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<Sweetshark> morning
<chrisccoulson> hi Sweetshark, how are you?
<Sweetshark> I am fine, thank you. And you?
<rodrigo_> morning
<seb128> hey rodrigo_, how are you?
<huats> moning
<huats> hello seb128 !
<seb128> lut huats
<huats> how are you seb128 ?
<rodrigo_> salut seb128
<seb128> huats, I'm fine thanks, what about you?
<huats> fine too ! working too hard, but I think I get used to that :)
<huats> thanks
 * didrocks is eager to see "building from branch" to land. That will totally justify our dx workflow
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, how are you?
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, I'm fine thanks, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i'm not too bad thanks
<chrisccoulson> my daughter is not very well this morning though. she's been sick 3 times already :(
<ara_> seb128, morning
<seb128> hey ara
<ara_> seb128, is it only time what it is preventing you from sponsoring checkbox? or do you need any other information?
<seb128> ara_, the diff of the merge request was a bit weird so I delayed that until later, like it cleans files and things without having that documented
<seb128> ara_, i.e it's was not trivial and I had other things to do so I delayed until I would have time for proper review, I will try to do it today
<ara_> seb128, OK, thanks
<ara_> seb128, actually, the things removed are from the build folder, that I don't know why it is there in the first place. It may have been added by mistake in a previous upload
<seb128> right, I will check on that
 * ara_ checks at what point the build folder was uploaded
<ara_> seb128, it was in revision 20. I will create a new branch based on cr3's but removing the build folder and I will propose a new merge superseeding this one
<fta2> Title: indicator-application-service crashed with SIGABRT in reply_cb()
<fta2> UnreportableReason: The program crashed on an assertion failure, but the message could not be retrieved. Apport does not support reporting these crashes.
<seb128> ara_, seems great, thanks ;-)
<seb128> fta2: open a bug manually and add the stacktrace I guess
<seb128> I need to talk to pitti about those...
<ara_> seb128, not needed, I have seen that cr3 already deleted all the build files. I have put a comment to the merge request stating that
<ara_> seb128, is that enough?
<seb128> ara_, should be yes, thank you!
<ara_> seb128, thanks to you!
<kklimonda> seb128: when we package unstable version of some library (in this case pangomm) how should we bump shver in d/rules?
<seb128> kklimonda, if there is some api addition yes
<kklimonda> seb128: for stable libraries, we just bump to the $maj.$min.0, should we do the same for unstable ones?
<seb128> not sure to understand the question
<kklimonda> seb128: it's a good enough answer :)
<seb128> the number represent the version which has the current api defined
<seb128> so update the number every time they add a function
<seb128> or rather that they add a function to the public api
<kklimonda> right, so for unstable releases we may have to bump it more often?
<seb128> usually for each version yet
<seb128> it's cheap, it's just a number
<seb128> it's the depends packages building against the lib will get
<soren> The purpose of this tracking is to know that if the last time a new function as was added to libfoo was in x.y.z, but you built against x.y.w, you can still get away with a Depends: library (>= x.y.z).
<soren> We used to always have to specify Depends: library (>= <the version we built against>).
<seb128> better to use .symbols nowadays though
<soren> Very true.
<seb128> which does the right thing and check what symbols you use and when they were added
<soren> Yeah.
<kklimonda> seb128: btw, would you be willing to add some comment to my motu application? I'm not really sure how many should I get, but some people have 7+ so I feel weird ;)
<chrisccoulson> my laptop battery is now at 60% capacity. that's depressing. time for a new one soon i think
<didrocks> rodrigo_: do you know why evolution-couchdb isn't working for me?
<didrocks> when clicking on the ubuntu one list contact, I get a message telling me it can't get the contact list
<didrocks> (my android phone and the web interface are working though)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, kill evo and the e-addressbook-factory process, and start /usr/lib/evolution/e-addressbook-factory on a terminal, and then try to open the addressbook in evo again
<rodrigo_> didrocks, and pastebin the output on the terminal
<didrocks> rodrigo_: trying
<didrocks> grrr, double monitor and global menu :/
<didrocks> dual*
<didrocks> rodrigo_: hum, it exited
<didrocks> rodrigo_: I just get in the GUI: http://paste.ubuntu.com/568155/
<rodrigo_> didrocks, did you kill the previous e-addressbook-factory process?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: yeah, it was up and running
<didrocks> so, trying again
<didrocks> starting it
<rodrigo_> ok
<didrocks> now starting evo
<didrocks> ah, core dump this time :)
<didrocks> I prefer that to exiting without showing anything
<didrocks> rodrigo_: reporting the stacktrace
<didrocks> argh, obsolete because of the X stack :/
<didrocks> rodrigo_: when I'll have some time over the week-end, can I report it and bug you?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, yes, of course :-)
<didrocks> thanks :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, just try to get the output from e-a-f, that should be enough
 * didrocks is spammed with 1 000 contact adress since he synced android with his gmail account, time to clean that up
<didrocks> rodrigo_: ok :)
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, great work with the progress bar in empathy :)
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, thx
<seb128> kenvandine, is xchat-gnome supposed to show counts in the launcher or something?
<kenvandine> seb128, if you have xchat-gnome-indicator installed
<kenvandine> and
<kenvandine> you have the plugin enabled
<seb128> kenvandine, can you talk to me again there?
<om26er> icons in the live cd are set to gnome icon theme and cannot be changed it seems .svg files cannot be opened at all
<seb128> reinstall librsvg2-common as a workaround
<seb128> the svg loader is not registered
<seb128> didrocks, hey
<seb128> didrocks, unping
<kenvandine> seb128, did you get the count?
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, I think it's activated since the messaging menu list pending events
<seb128> kenvandine, but the launcher does nothing
<seb128> well it turns the arrow blue
<seb128> but no count
<kenvandine> humm
<didrocks> seb128: we should add that to our IRC client, unping support :)
<kenvandine> seb128, still no count?
<seb128> kenvandine, no
<kenvandine> :/
<kenvandine> if it is in the indicator, it should be in the launcher...
<kenvandine> although, this makes no sense, but bcurtiswx found he had to restart unity sometimes to get things to show up in the launcher
<bcurtiswx> thats correct, although this startup everything works OK
<bcurtiswx> my laptop is really an alien that looks like a laptop
<davmor2> kenvandine: you know what would make that xchat plugin perfect if when you clicked on it, it went to the window with the most pings :)
<kenvandine> davmor2, that is a good idea
<kenvandine> well, actually people might get annoyed that it changes on them without expecting it
<bcurtiswx> i think launchers should completely replace the indicator-applet
<bcurtiswx> they can perform the same functions, maybe that should be a blueprint for Natty +1
<bcurtiswx> left clicking on a launcher with pending messages could give you the same list that the indicator-applet does
<bcurtiswx> if the launcher panel is hidden make the ubuntu logo turn green ;)
<seb128> left click is to focus
<seb128> right click will give you the list
<seb128> it's how it's designed and work in natty
<seb128> the unity rendering side is already done, it just doesn't get the list because it lacks some glue
<seb128> it will not replace the applet though, for one thing the applet load other indicators which don't make sense in the launcher
<seb128> like the session one etc
<bcurtiswx> well the one with the mail and empathy and gwibber tho?
<seb128> it lists things which are not running
<seb128> which the launcher doesn't do if you don't pin those
<seb128> not sure it would be nice to clutter the launcher with things which are not running
<seb128> it doesn't hurt to have the envelop icon in there and the launcher integration
<seb128> it let the choice to use what you prefer
<bcurtiswx> yup, can't disagree.  I like that eventually a right click will bring a list of unread messages from the launcher icons
<bcurtiswx> just to get more opinion tho, not trying to start a full blown debate, but the launcher can perform the exact same tasks as the envelope icon besides having an easy accessible list of commonly used apps.  But these apps can show up upon clicking the ubuntu icon, and then the launcher would provide the rest of the actions the green envelope does
<seb128> well you can open a bug about that, I like the envelop though
<seb128> it's always on screen even when the launcher is hidden and it collect infos from all the messaging applications where the launcher you will have to right click on each one
<seb128> so when you come back to your computer you can see what happened in one click
<seb128> rather than doing a bunch of right clicking in the launcher
<bcurtiswx> seeing the amount of pending messages requires no clicking even when the launcher is hidden, then the user can decide which they prefer to check on
<seb128> right, but you don't have the details of names, etc
<seb128> the indicator is also useful in classic GNOME where is no launcher
<seb128> not sure why you want to spare those 20 pixels, just to get extra free space on the unity-panel where you can't add applets anyway?
<bcurtiswx> yup, that is correct.  If consistency between the two is what we're going for then I can't really say my ideas would be better
<bcurtiswx> seb128, a disclaimer for me would be Im not fully aware of the general idea the desktop team strives for, so I'm just throwing out a few ideas :)
<seb128> well unity design is rather ayatana design driven
<bcurtiswx> the envelope is ayatana as well?
<seb128> so you should better suggest your ideas on bug reports or on their list ;-)
<seb128> yes
<seb128> unity and the indicators are ayatana projects
<bcurtiswx> yeah I figured I'd try to come up with a mockup and bring it to the ayatana team
<bcurtiswx> see how my image editing skillz are
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> rodrigo_, do you have any clue about how to debug bug #639913?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 639913 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon random crash at session start (xorg badmatch error)" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/639913
<rodrigo_> seb128, looking..
<seb128> rodrigo_, we regularly get bugs about that so it's an annoying issue for our users, not sure how to debug it though
<rodrigo_> hmm, I was going to suggest to kill g-s-d and run it on gdb, but if it's random :(
<rodrigo_> seb128, but the error message has some info:
<rodrigo_> To debug your program, run it with the --sync command line
<rodrigo_>    option to change this behavior. You can then get a meaningful
<rodrigo_>    backtrace from your debugger if you break on the gdk_x_error()
<seb128> rodrigo_, right, the issue is that it seems to happen only at session start
<rodrigo_> those are indeed strange errors, I have seen that, for other apps, for years, once in a while
<seb128> not easy to ask users to run under gdb at login
<rodrigo_> right
<rodrigo_> the full .xsession-errors might help
<seb128> tedg, mterry, kenvandine: bug #708188 should really be fixed for natty
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 708188 in indicator-application "softwares using libappindicator crash with SIGSEGV in theme_changed_cb()" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/708188
<seb128> if someone wants to claim it
<mterry> seb128, seems bad, agreed.  I'm heads down right now on datetime dialog stuff, but if it's still unclaimed, can grab it
<seb128> mterry, I will try to get a valgrind log since polkit-gnome-daemon crashes often when using update-manager
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<seb128> no hurry to fix it this week it's nothing new
<tedg> seb128, Agreed.  It seems people like to change themes ;)
<seb128> tedg, it has nothing to do with theme changes
<seb128> tedg, I get it every 5 update-manager use here
<tedg> Yes, I understand, I was more joking :)
<seb128> ok ;-)
<seb128> rodrigo_, btw did you talk to gdm upstream about the g-s-d races between login and session?
<kenvandine> seb128, i think tedg is going to keep me pretty busy today
<seb128> kenvandine, oh, it's not a today thing, it's a natty cycle thing, I was just pointing it for the record
<Laney> I just upgraded to natty and it seems my /desktop/gnome/session/required_components/windowmanager setting is no longer respected
<htorque> seb128, hello! https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/705498 - i never know which status to set in such situations? fix released/invalid?
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 705498 in compiz "Notifications should not show up on the unlock screen" [Low,New]
<Laney> where did it move to?
<seb128> htorque, there is no strong rules, if you know what fixed it fix released with a comment about it, otherwise invalid
<seb128> Laney, it's using /usr/share/gnome-session/sessions
<htorque> seb128, don't know what exactly fixed it, so setting it to invalid - thanks! :-)
<Laney> seb128: how do I select which one to use? from gdm?
<seb128> htorque, you're welcome
<seb128> Laney, correct
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, but no answer, trying again
<seb128> Laney, well gdm uses /usr/share/xsessions
<seb128> Laney, which call gnome-session --session=<...>
<seb128> Laney, where the ... is in the /usr/share/gnome-session/sessions
<Laney> ah OK
<Laney> looks like I can just copy 2d-gnome and change Required-windowmanager
<Laney> is this an Ubuntu change or can I ask Debian to provide the file?
<rodrigo_> seb128, just reassigned the upstream bug to gdm, forgot to that last time
<seb128> rodrigo_, thanks
<seb128> Laney, it's a GNOME3 thing upstream that didrocks backported to our current GNOME
<seb128> Laney, so wait for debian to get GNOME3
<Laney> sure
<seb128> tedg, is the stacktrace on bug #720337 enough to work on the issue?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 720337 in indicator-appmenu "indicator-applet-appmenu crashed with SIGSEGV in dbusmenu_client_send_about_to_show()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/720337
<tedg> seb128, Not really, it seems to be a memory corruption error :(  Probably need valgrind
<didrocks> seb128: DSO linking issue with gtk-doc, does it ring a bell?
<seb128> didrocks, not really out of the fact that pitti mentioned some before
<didrocks> before, like recently?
<seb128> didrocks, like end of january but I don't think that was the same issue
<didrocks> humâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, what source is that?
<didrocks> seb128: libunity-misc, trying to make dist with --enable-documentation
<seb128> didrocks, http://launchpadlibrarian.net/62449433/libunity-misc_0.1.1-0ubuntu3_0.1.1-0ubuntu4.diff.gz
<seb128> didrocks, did you get doko's patch?
<seb128> didrocks, he fixed it in natty
<didrocks> I don't think so
<seb128> ok, so grab the patch from his upload I guess
<didrocks> seb128: this one has been fixed by njpatel in trunk
<didrocks> already
<didrocks> x11
<seb128> didrocks, ok, so maybe something similar
<didrocks> but yeah, not the GTKDOC one
<didrocks> seb128: ok, that should do it, thanks for pointing there :)
<didrocks> a shame that it wasn't notified upstream (just checked the bug) though
<seb128> didrocks, you're welcome, you got lucky I though that doko fixed some similar issues and ran into the libunity-misc example while trying to find one
<seb128> didrocks, which made me think "could be what didrocks is on" ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: hehe, yeah, I would have spent time in this Makefile.am :)
<didrocks> seb128: btw, so today, I learnt that documentation Makefile is manual
<didrocks> I was thinking that gtk-doc was handling everything as m4 macro
<didrocks> seb128: works wayyyy better, thanks again :)
<seb128> didrocks, yw
 * didrocks reopens his book on libtool library versionning when ABI and API break
<Sweetshark> 4
<highvoltage> 5
<chrisccoulson> 6
<chrisccoulson> can anyone join in?
<chrisccoulson> :)
<Sweetshark> auuw, people already made fun of me on #libreoffice for failure to use irssi
<Sweetshark> (... correctly)
<chrisccoulson> heh :
<chrisccoulson> )
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, my zero key is failing
<chrisccoulson> or it's got food stuck under it
<chrisccoulson> most likely to be the latter
<Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: ibm model m ftw!
<chrisccoulson> w00t - http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/rev/ed3437b7c12b
<chrisccoulson> that's going to rock on ambiance
<robert_ancell> Does anyone happen to know what package provides the broadcast icon in the messaging indicator?
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, should we update to the latest espeak?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: its on my to do list for this next few days.
<TheMuso> I have a git branch for ubuntu in the debian pkg-a11y repo, so will do the work there.
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-02-18
<TheMuso> Yay, new laptop doesn't even want to suspend using the NVIDIA gpu with nouveau, and suspends, but doesn't resume with the Intel gpu.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, ok, thanks
<RAOF> TheMuso: :(
<TheMuso> RAOF: Yeah, I expected as much with nouveau, but didn't with intel. Time to find out what I need to give the kernel guys to get things fixed.
<TheMuso> Actually, I'll wait to try out the new kernel first, once it filters down to the mirror I'm using, (working away from home today.)
<TheMuso> RAOF: Yay, I await that mesa upload with anticipation. :) Want to try unity on nouveau+experimental dri.
<didrocks> good morning
<Sweetshark> Good morning!
<sabdfl> morning all
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark, morning sabdfl
<sabdfl> didrocks! thanks for diving deep into unity :-)
<sabdfl> i filed a quickie today, would you mark it bitesize and see if someone is interested to take it on?
<sabdfl> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/721121
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 721121 in nautilus "Icon in Launcher should be home folder icon" [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> sabdfl: you're welcome :-)
<didrocks> sabdfl: sure, looking
<didrocks> oh right, that can be an easy bitesize one, adding to the list :)
<didrocks> Sweetshark: not sure if you noticed, I've opened bug #720716
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 720716 in libreoffice "Please add unity Quicklist support" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/720716
<Sweetshark> didrocks: taken
<didrocks> Sweetshark: I tried to be explicit on the wiki page, do not hesitate if you need any help :)
<didrocks> Sweetshark: you can look at gnome-utils (gnome-screenhost) as an example
<Sweetshark> didrocks: Im currently still on bug #696527, bug #712725, bug #696524 and a few minor ones, but I will have a look
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 696527 in libreoffice "LibreOffice - Human icons theme disabled, patch needs an update" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/696527
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 712725 in libreoffice "NLPSolver extension not available" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/712725
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 696524 in libreoffice "LibreOffice - launchpad-integration disabled, patch needs update" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/696524
<didrocks> Sweetshark: sure, no hurry :)
<huats> morning
<didrocks> salut huats
<rodrigo_> morning
<didrocks> good morning rodrigo_
<slomo> seb128: hi, is anybody working on getting gst-plugins-bad and gst-plugins-ugly updated in natty? people are complaining already ;)
<seb128> slomo, hey, dunno
<didrocks> good morning seb128
<seb128> you can try asking #ubuntu-motu
<slomo> seb128: will do... and otherwise i'll update them myself
<seb128> slomo, thanks
<Sweetshark> sooo ... if i want an unmodified debian package in a ppa, cant i just dput it there?
<bryceh> Sweetshark, pretty much
<Sweetshark> k
<bryceh> Sweetshark, I think it may need to be targeted to e.g. 'natty' rather than 'experimental' or 'unstable' or whatever
<Sweetshark> bryceh: ah, true.
<bryceh> Sweetshark, so do a 'dch -rebuild "Rebuild for PPA" --distribution natty'
<bryceh> I think that'd do it
<bryceh> or just 'dch -i' and fix up a rebuild by hand
 * Sweetshark wonders why he cant find the package on packages.debian.org. http://ftp-master.debian.org/new/nlpsolver_0.9~beta1-4.html says it is uploaded for unstable.
<seb128> Sweetshark, because the NEW queue is not public
<seb128> Sweetshark, things in there have not been reviewed and couldn't respect some licenses or not be distributable
<seb128> so they are not available to download to the public, only the people reviewing NEW have access to it
<Sweetshark> seb128: yep, i walked right into the dragons dungeon (#debian) to find out. I was not even flamed and received a friendly answer.
 * Sweetshark has to update his stereotypes.
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128!
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, I'm fine thanks
<seb128> how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i'm good thanks
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - bug 721113 btw - we get quite a lot of these types of reports against firefox. they always turn out to be that the user installed some proprietary application that comes with a bundled version of nspr that ends up in the ld search path
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 721113 in nss "evolution: symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/libnssutil3.so: undefined symbol: PL_ClearArenaPool" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/721113
<chrisccoulson> i just close them now ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, I was not sure, usually I suspect local installations but the library path was the standard one and I'm not sure what library provides the undefined symbol
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, the symbol is actually provided by nspr rather than nss
<chrisccoulson> it's in libplds4.so
<seb128> ok, if I'm not lazy I usually ask for a ldd log ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> i could do, but i know what it will look like already ;
<seb128> I've been lazy there and just bounced to the next component ;-)
<seb128> hehe
<chrisccoulson> i think some users installing adobe air end up with this problem
<seb128> chrisccoulson, we need a way to auto detect those ;-)
<seb128> rodrigo_, hey
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, that would be good
<chrisccoulson> perhaps apport can catch these ;)
<rodrigo_> hey seb128 :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, how are you?
<rodrigo_> seb128, fine thanks, and you?
<seb128> I'm fine thanks
<seb128> rodrigo_, do you have any clue what could cause bug #719739?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 719739 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon: error while loading shared libraries: libgtk-3.0.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/719739
<seb128> rodrigo_, the user says he's not using the ppa but natty...
<seb128> not sure what could try to bring gtk3 in
<rodrigo_> hmm, seems that's the one from the ppa, which indeed seems to need a rebuild
<seb128> rodrigo_, well he's convinced he's not using the ppa though
<rodrigo_> hmm, maybe a gsd plugin that links to gtk3?
<rodrigo_> although that doesn't make sense, we don't have any, right?
<seb128> do you know of any?
<rodrigo_> no
<seb128> ok, I just wanted to check in case
<seb128> rodrigo_, thanks
<rodrigo_> he swears he's not using the ppa, but it looks to me that he is
<seb128> would be nice if g-s-d would go down as soon as one of the .so it loads crashes
<seb128> wouldn't
<seb128> rodrigo_, yeah, I will ask for some details
<rodrigo_> seb128, just asked him to run apt-cache policy g-s-d
<seb128> great, thanks
<rodrigo_> is there any way to ask for a rebuild for all packages in the ppa?
<seb128> no, you need new uploads
<rodrigo_> ok
<seb128> soyuz doesn't handle binary rebuilds
<seb128> that sucks a bit for transitions
<rodrigo_> yes
<chrisccoulson> nice, firefox has a new theme for beta 12, to fit better with our dark theme: http://people.canonical.com/~chrisccoulson/theme.png
<chrisccoulson> not so sure about the dark tabs though
<Laney> you could vote for 245594 if you want launchpad to support binary rebuilds :-)
<RAOF> I'm surprised that bug has such a high number!
<njpatel> RAOF, Ping, had a few questions re: natty + Ati
<njpatel> RAOF, in natty, are there both free and non-free Ati drivers available, or just free?
<RAOF> In natty, as of now, just free.
<njpatel> is the ETA for non-free the same as nvidia? i.e. a few weeks away?
<RAOF> Pretty much.  The dates are NDA'd, of course.
<njpatel> well, weeks/months whatever
<njpatel> "who know's" I guess
<njpatel> okay, so we just need to wait
<njpatel> RAOF, so for A3, the only thing we can really do is make fixes for intel and radeon I guess (unity)
<RAOF> Yeah.
 * njpatel re-milestones bugs to reflect that
<njpatel> RAOF, thanks dude
<RAOF> And nouveau if you feel particularly frisky, but we're not officially supporting that.
<Sweetshark> anyone interested in a reliable way to crash banfdaemon?
<didrocks> Sweetshark: can you send if via apport?
<mterry> seb128, the other day, you were talking about liboobs being deprecated and that I should use the new method that GNOME 3.0 uses?  But it appears that such support is provided by gnome-settings-daemon 3.0, which we don't have
<seb128> mterry, ?
<mterry> seb128, I thought.  I looked briefly at the new 3.0 panel code, and it appeared they were using dbus calls to settings-daemon
<seb128> mterry, right, the polkit interface is there in 2.32
<seb128> mterry, that's what gnome-panel clock applet is using
<mterry> seb128, really?  oh, I missed that...  will look again.
<seb128> mterry, dpkg -L gnome-settings-daemon | grep date
<mterry> seb128, oh right, we went over this.  :)
<seb128> mterry, ;-)
<mterry> seb128, do you know of a good replacement to liboobs for configuring ntp?  seems like that service doesn't provide that functionality
<seb128> no
<seb128> but seems like something we should add to this service if it's needed
<rodrigo_> the one in g-s-d 3.0
<seb128> or talk to upstream about adding
<seb128> rodrigo_, oh, they did in the new gsd?
<Sweetshark> didrocks: no -- "an error during error reporting"
<mterry> rodrigo_, you're saying the 3.0 version does ntp?
<rodrigo_> seb128, afair yes, it has the ntp bits
<seb128> let's do some backporting then ;-)
<rodrigo_> let me re-check
<Sweetshark> didrocks: It happens when I smoketest LO :(
<didrocks> seb128: what's the error apport is giving to you?
<seb128> didrocks, ?
<rodrigo_> mterry, seb128: yes, it does ntp
<didrocks> grrr, autocompletionfail
<didrocks> Sweetshark: ^^
<seb128> mterry, rodrigo_: org.gnome.settingsdaemon.datetimemechanism.policy.in:  <action id="org.gnome.settingsdaemon.datetimemechanism.configurentp">
<seb128>                 if (!g_spawn_command_line_sync ("/sbin/service ntpd status",
<mterry> seb128, delightful, will backport
<seb128> seems they hardcoded the rh path though
<seb128> but should be easy to backport and get working
<seb128> mterry, thanks!
<Sweetshark> didrocks: hang, Im just doing a fresh build ...
<Sweetshark> didrocks: ("just" measured in terms of Libreoffice builds)
<didrocks> heh
<Sweetshark> didrocks: is there anything in bamf related to java? Because I also get a JVM crash at the same time.
<didrocks> Sweetshark: nothing javaish, no
<Sweetshark> Evil LO lets everyone else crash but happily churns on itself ...
<seb128_> mvo, do you have any opinion on https://code.launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/language-selector/lp-533159/+merge/50265 ?
<rodrigo_> hmm, getting again a failure when configuring python2.7-minimal, I recall having fixed that, but don't remember how I did, any idea?
<rodrigo_> E: pycompile:240: Requested versions are not installed
<rodrigo_> hmm, found this -> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=600536
<ubot2> Debian bug 600536 in python-minimal "python2.7-minimal: fails to configure: E: pycompile:240: Requested versions are not installed" [Normal,Fixed]
<rodrigo_> so, how can I manually add 2.7 to the list of installed python versions?
<rodrigo_> right, that's the problem indeed, pycompile -V 2.7 complains with the same error
<rodrigo_> ok, found it -> /usr/share/python/debpython/version.py
<cyphermox> bbl, going to the office...
<czajkowski> folks may be interested http://j.mp/eOHQhR
<boulabiar> hi !
<seb128> ok
<seb128> mvo, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/689034 has a trivial merge request for you
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 689034 in update-manager "Missing space in line 40 & 70" [Undecided,In progress]
<seb128> mvo, it's just 2 typo fixes in strings
<seb128> would be one less item on the sponsoring queue ;-)
<mvo> will do
<seb128> mvo, thanks
<mvo> done
 * seb128 hugs mvo
 * mvo hugs seb128
<seb128> mvo, do you have any clue about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/711896
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 711896 in update-manager "Upgrade to Natty fails to install xserver-xorg-core" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey
<seb128> Sweetshark, bug #696527, do you have any idea when that will land in natty?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 696527 in libreoffice "LibreOffice - Human icons theme disabled, patch needs an update" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/696527
<mvo> seb128: on a bug rampage, eh?
<seb128> mvo, weekly release team meeting, I'm covering for pitti and patch piloting as well
<mvo> seb128: that bug (the xorg one) is a bit of a puzzle as apt runs dpkg with the option to automatically deconfigure on break
<seb128> mvo, it has no duplicate as well, I'm wondering if that's really worth tracking as a natty issue
<mvo> is it possible to see who nomiated it ?
 * mvo hopes its not him
<seb128> mvo, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/711896/+activity
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 711896 in update-manager "Upgrade to Natty fails to install xserver-xorg-core" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<seb128> mvo, skaet
<mvo> hmmmm
<mvo> ok
<Sarvatt> mvo: possibly because x-x-v-v4l wasn't rebuilt against the new abi at the point of time he tried to update
<Sarvatt> keeping the old xserver around because upgrading it would break the new one since abi 8 was still around
<mvo> Sarvatt: that sounds plausible
<seb128> vish, there?
<Sweetshark> seb128: Im on it. Unfortunatly the current human icons are a mess (~7000 icons, and no difference between modified and "original" items). So "different" icons could be an upstream update or a real costumization. And we really do not want to add a theme, which reintroduced OpenOffice.org branding to Libreoffice. That would embarass us, Libreoffice and Oracle all in one turn ....
<vish> seb128: hey..
<seb128> Sweetshark, ok
<seb128> vish, hey, are you arguing on this bug that the nautilus desktop icon should be user directory one?
<Sweetshark> seb128: but I am currently working exactly on that.
<seb128> Sweetshark, great, no hurry I was just doing a status update for the weekly release team meeting (covering for pitti since he's not there)
<vish> seb128: the home icon that mark wants already exists,
<vish> seb128: if we change the system-file-manager icon to a home icon it would be shown wrong elsewhere too
<seb128> vish, should the other be a symlink to it then?
<seb128> vish, where is elsewhere?
<Sweetshark> (source code modification is done and works -- see the ppa version -- all you have to do is drop a images_human.zip at the right location). Its the content of that zip, that is problematic ...
<vish> seb128: off the top of my head, on the panel > the fileprogress icon and in the dialogue window which shows the file progress.. not sure where else it gets displayed, i'd have to think :)
<seb128> vish, well I'm trying to figure if he wants the icon to be changed only the in the launcher, or in any nautilus launcher including the classic GNOME menus or if that includes the nautilus icon in switcher as well
<seb128> Sweetshark, ok, gotcha, thanks for the update!
<vish> seb128: he mentions only the launcher icon, and that the icon needs to open home directory.. so its just similar to the user home icon in the panel's places menu
<seb128> ok, not sure how to do that
<seb128> the launcher matches to a .desktop, we can't modify it only for the launcher
<vish>  didrocks mentions that it could be changed there..
<seb128> guess we could add another nautilus-unity.desktop for it
<vish> yea, probably
<seb128> vish, well, we could update the .desktop yet, but the .desktop is used in the standard GNOME menus, in the places list, etc
<seb128> "yes" not "yet"
<didrocks> clicking on nautilus.desktop will open the home folder
<vish> right, so best would the nautilus-unity.desktop
<vish> s/the/be
<vish> seb128: so what do we do for that bug? switch to unity (again)? :)
<vish> didrocks: ^
<didrocks> vish: no, the theme sounds the right one to me
<vish> didrocks: that would change the icon in the file progress window. :s
<didrocks> vish: the file progress window have an arrow on it?
<vish> yup..
<vish> it been that way since a long time :)
<didrocks> humâ¦
<didrocks> I'm puzzled
<didrocks> vish: can we discuss that on Monday? I need to discuss a regression for on #ubuntu-devel :p
<vish> ok,sure.. :)
<bcurtiswx> i have chrome set as my default browser, but links i click in empathy/gwibber etc.. all keep bringing up firefox
<seb128> speaking of which
<seb128> chrisccoulson, on first start firefox complains it's not the default browser on natty, known issue?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i need to apply my gnome 3.0 patches
 * micahg thought that was part of how the new gnome-c-c handles defaults
<seb128> well, firefox is the default in the defaults.list
<chrisccoulson> micahg - firefox is still using the old gconf settings for the default browser check
<chrisccoulson> ^^seb128 too :)
<micahg> chrisccoulson: ah, ok
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - mozilla bug 611953
<bcurtiswx> well Chromium as my default browser
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 611953 in Shell Integration "GNOME 3.0 readiness" [Normal,Assigned] http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=611953
<chrisccoulson> basically, that's not going to make it for firefox 4, but we will backport those patches
<vish> bcurtiswx: there is a bug in LP about the chrome not opening links
<vish> bcurtiswx: iirc, the xdg browser (or something) needs to be updated
<bcurtiswx> vish, OK, great.
<maxb> (maverick) palimpsest and nautilus seem to be hallucinating a 4.1GB ext4 filesystem on /dev/loop1 that doesn't exist as far as mount and losetup are concerned, and I have no idea what it could be. Any suggestions for discovering where this phantom volume came from?
<lamalex> Hey, I see that libgl1-mesa-dri-expermental was updated recently. Any way to tell if it will still segfault on a nvidia 320m?
<seb128> don't upgrade natty on amd64 today
<seb128> eglibc seems to have an issue
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks, i was just about to upgrade ;)
<seb128> heh
<seb128> you probably can't, the binaries got blocked on the server
<Amaranth> Yeah, I was just upgrading and saw the 404
<Amaranth> phew
<fta> "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in IconTexture::~IconTexture()".. reporting
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-02-19
<raluxgaza> Hey guys what's your favourite music player, I am looking for something like winamp on windws with excellent sound quality
<ari-tczew> raluxgaza: clementine
<raluxgaza> ari-tczew, sweet, just rocking it now and it's better than audacious
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-02-20
<fongweekim> Hi I need help with Xen on Ubuntu 10.10 desktop
<fongweekim> I tried to read the Xen documentation page
<fongweekim> I can't get make world to run
<fongweekim> any ideas
<RAOF> Uuuh, is anyone else finding random garbage in files?
<kklimonda> not reall
<RAOF> I've just worked out why smuxi wasn't working; the libindicate .dll.config file was the right size, but contained 96 bytes of garbage from some other file.
<kklimonda> huh
<kklimonda> what filesystem do you use?
<RAOF> ext4
<RAOF> What's that deb md5 sum tool?
<RAOF> Heh.  debsums
<TheMuso> RAOF: Is your memory ok
<TheMuso> i.e does a memory test pass?
<RAOF> TheMuso: I guess that's the next thing to check.
<RAOF> debsums didn't pick up any other corruption, at least.
<RAOF> ls
<RAOF> GAH
<RAOF> I hate you milkman dan.
<kklimonda> ah, I really shouldn't update X after all :/
<RAOF> Oh, really?
<RAOF> What's wrong?
<kklimonda> it's just that nouveau is so slow - I've never noticed till now
<kklimonda> I've just tried to launch atom zombie smasher to play for few minutes and it's unusable ;)
<RAOF> Hm, really?  Slow on 3D, I presume.
<kklimonda> yeah
<RAOF> You've actually got the 3D drivers installed, I guess?
<kklimonda> I do
 * RAOF doesn't find it slow, but then he doesn't use it to play games, either.
<kklimonda> I don't really think it: http://blendogames.com/atomzombiesmasher/images/screenshot2.jpg qualifies as a 3D intensive game ;)
<kklimonda> also, nouveau seems to be running a little bit hotter than nvidia
<kklimonda> but that doesn't really matter as I'm still running a normal 2D gnome session
<RAOF> That would because it may not be actually doing power management ;)
<kklimonda> with metacity, and no composite manager - so temperature is still below 60
<kklimonda> yeah, that's quite possible - I was under the impression that it had some basic power managment
<RAOF> I've never quite got around to checking whether that's made it into 2.6.38
<RAOF> Certainly upstream has PM support.
<kklimonda> there is /sys/class/drm/card0/device and performance_level_* but performance_level always indicates that it's running on the 2nd level
<kklimonda> I never really see it scale either down or up
<broder> is the best way to get 12b0f7df cherry-picked into the xserver a bug + debdiff? or is there another process that's easier for the developers?
<RAOF> broder: I see that's in 1.10RC2, which means you'll get it once we've done that update.  Which will be early this week (I'm doing it now).
<broder> ah, ok. sweet :)
<RAOF> Bah.  memtest86 doesn't seem to work!
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-02-13
<desrt> ugh.  libneon is messed up.
<lifeless> desrt: again ? :0
<desrt> lifeless: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/neon27/+bug/845901
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 845901 in neon27 "libneon can't find SSLv2_server_method" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<desrt> it's pretty seriously messed up.  i'm surprised it builds at all.
<desrt> it's using a function that completely does not exist in any library
<desrt> presumably it existed in libssl at some point but was removed
<micahg> that should've been fixed many releases ago
<broder> IIRC we killed off SSLv2 in oneiric
<desrt> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=622140 btw
<ubot2`> Debian bug 622140 in neon27 "neon27: symbol SSLv2_server_method used" [Serious,Open]
<broder> because i think i ran into a boost incompatibility issue
<broder> upgrading some of my software to oneiric
 * micahg thought it was killed long before that
<RAOF> lifeless: Why would squid be dying with a SIGABRT when I try to start it?  squid3 -k parse -f /etc/squid-deb-proxy/squid-deb-proxy.conf lists a couple of warnings, complains about not being able to write to /var/log/squid-deb-proxy, but otherwise completes successfully.
<lifeless> RAOF: so if its calling abort() it should log something first
<RAOF> FATAL: xcalloc: Unable to allocate 4154659762 blocks of 1 bytes!
<RAOF> Ah.
<RAOF> Hm.  It's trying to allocate and zero 4GB of memory?
<RAOF> lifeless: http://paste.ubuntu.com/840056/
<BigWhale> Morning.
<GunnarHj> pitti: Good morning, Martin! Just replied on bug 930785.
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 930785 in language-selector "gnome-language-selector crashed with DBusException in call_blocking(): org.freedesktop.Accounts.Error.Failed: 'bg_BG.UTF-8' is not a valid locale name" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/930785
<pitti> hey GunnarHj
<pitti> GunnarHj: right, but I wonder if there is a cleaner solution
<GunnarHj> pitti: Guess we can wait a while. It's not very urgent, I suppose.
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> hey didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> pitti: I'm fine, thanks. And you, how was your week-end?
<pitti> didrocks: quite fine, thanks! we visited our grandma, and had a nice birthday party
<didrocks> ah nice :)
<pitti> GunnarHj: followed up to 930785
<lifeless> RAOF: fun
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok, then I'll write a patch with the 'locale -a' approach.
<lifeless> RAOF: a 27PB cache ?!
<lifeless> RAOF: that 4G alloc is probably happening for the hash table
<lifeless> RAOF: e.g. your config is insane
<seb128> hey
<czajkowski> seb128: morning
<seb128> hi czajkowski
<pitti> bonjour seb128, ca va?
<seb128> hey, pitti, ca va bien! et toi ?
<pitti> seb128: je suis bien, merci!
<pitti> seb128: did anything come up at the release team meeting?
<seb128> pitti, no
<pitti> I saw the fun with webkit, thanks for sorting this out
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey chrhi
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti. i'm good thanks, how are you?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: quite fine, thanks! had a nice long weekend
<chrisccoulson> excellent :)
<chrisccoulson> i had quite a busy weekend moving my desk and having everything set up and ready by this morning
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, you have a new "office" room now?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm downstairs now. we've freed up the old room for my daughter
<chrisccoulson> moving my desk downstairs was not much fun
<pitti> seb128: hm, I'm trying to build glom, but libgdamm4.0-dev doesn't exist; wasn't there some effort to pacakge it?
<seb128> pitti, dholbach has it in a ppa he asked for review on #ubuntu-devel last week I think
<seb128> goocanvasmm as well
<seb128> Laney said he would have a look iirc
<seb128> better to check with them
<pitti> ok, thanks; ignoring for now
<seb128> pitti, there?
<pitti> seb128: yes, I just spoke 2 mins ago :) )
<seb128> pitti, I want to chat about gnome-settings-daemon if you have a minute
<pitti> seb128: what's up?
<seb128> pitti, so, I've been looking at 3.4 compared to 3.2, I will do a second round today but with order of magnitude numbers are
<pitti> hm, LP just went down?
<seb128> - 350 commits, I would say: 150 are on wacom (new code, side feature), 100 on translations, 25 on xrandr (better support for docking station)
<seb128> some 50 are bug fixes
<pitti> right, I had to pull libwacom from jhbuild to build it
<seb128> and there are like 15 less easy commits like keybindings to gsettings and dropping gconf plugin
<seb128> I'm pondering going for 3.4, reverting the keybinding and gconf stuff
<seb128> how crazy do you think that is?
<pitti> is the latter a problem because unity or others still expect keybindings in gconf?
<seb128> the other option is to backport some 25 (at least) commits
<seb128> pitti, yes, compiz still use gconf
<pitti> I just had assumed that it would require control-center 3.4, too
<RAOF> lifeless: How has that config gone crazy?  It's unmodified from squid-deb-proxy defaults.
<seb128> in fact the keybinding stuff is one commit
<seb128> I think it should be easy enough to make it select gconf or gsettings at run time, which would maybe let update gnome-shell, I know they really would like the new version
<seb128> pitti, c-c, I didn't see a reason why it would
<seb128> they didn't change configuration keys or format
<seb128> it's mostly bug fixing, wacom, keybinding on gsettings (to revert), xrandr better dock support
<pitti> the other stuff sounds fine indeed
<seb128> pitti, if you think that's not too crazy I will go ahead with a second round and do a detailled summary with diffstat, diff, etc in a bug report
<seb128> and land it in a ppa for testing today if I can
<pitti> seb128: I'd like to get cnd's review on the new package, how the new wacom stuff holds up with our multitouch patches
<pitti> seb128: that sounds great
<pitti> happy to test from u-desktop PPA
<seb128> pitti, wacom is a separate dir, we can't just not build it if we don't want to
<seb128> can't->can
<seb128> like everything in gsd it's its own .so
<seb128> we can easily drop it
<pitti> ah, I see
<pitti> I guess we have to for the first round
<pitti> it's in universe, and too old
<pitti> seb128: is it an optional build dep, or do we need to hack the makefiles?
<pitti> seb128: if you want, I can update it to 0.2.1, if that helps
<pitti> or tjaalton might want to
<seb128> pitti, we need to hack the makefiles I think
<seb128> GNOME don't want to make stuff customizable or optional nowadays, they want GNOME to be it's designed ;-)
<tjaalton> pitti: libwacom?
<pitti> tjaalton: yes
<pitti> seb128: oh, it seems remmina-plugins is obsolete now, binaries are now built by remmina itself
 * pitti cleans up
<pitti> seb128: so, let's give that a try, if it's not too hard to do; I'm happy to test with my dock, too
<tjaalton> pitti: I'll update it, 0.3 is ok?
<seb128> pitti, ok, I will work on that today, still wanting to summarize where we go in details before update
<seb128> tjaalton, that would be great, thanks
<pitti> tjaalton: sure; but as I said, we can't use it in g-c-c right now (without a MIR at least)
<pitti> if someone could actually test this with an actual wacom device, we could do a MIR
<tjaalton> pitti: np, it'll be available at least
<tjaalton> oh the wacom capplet?
<tjaalton> I have an intuos4L
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<seb128> pitti, jbicha dropped me an email where he mentioned he's wanting to file the mir for libwacom, he really wants the new g-s-d in ;-)
<seb128> pitti, well the mir is not a blocker for ppa builds
<pitti> hey tkamppeter
<pitti> seb128: right
<seb128> pitti, so I don't know need to bother for the testing round
<pitti> seb128: you still need >= 0.2.1, though
<seb128> pitti, right, tjaalton is fixing that for me apparently though :p
<seb128> pitti, btw remmina 1.0, well done
<seb128> we got it in time for ff ;-)
<tjaalton> seb128: yeah I'd like to have the wacom gui as well :)
<pitti> seb128: I'll seed it today once jdstrand gives the final ok for freerdp 1.0.1
<pitti> actually, I'll update the seeds right now
<seb128> pitti, can you drop gnome-searchtools if we didn't yet?
<seb128> pitti, gnome-search-tool
<pitti> what's the replacement?
<seb128> pitti, nothing, design said nautilus search and dash are enough searches
<pitti>  * gnome-screenshot
<pitti>  * gnome-search-tool
<pitti>  * gnome-system-log
<pitti>  * gnome-font-viewer
<pitti> seb128: ah, right, nautilus search
<pitti> ^ those are our gnome-utils right now
<pitti> dropping search
<seb128> pitti, gnome-screenshot is its own source in fact
<seb128> but yeah
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> - * (vinagre)
<seb128> pitti, they made standalone components for gnome-utils this cycle, I only bothered packaging gnome-screenshot though since the other ones didn't get any activity worth getting the new version
<pitti> + * (remmina)
<seb128> \o/
<pitti> remmina recommends: remmina-plugin-rdp, remmina-plugin-vnc
<pitti> so that should suffice
<pitti> seb128: right, I meant "what used to be -utils"
<tkamppeter> pitti, can you upload cups-filters into Debian and Ubuntu? Thanks.
<seb128> pitti, right ;-)
<pitti> tkamppeter: any chance to get a simple texttops back for the release critical bug?
<tkamppeter> pitti, will do so and release as 1.0.1 upstream.
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i definitely need to get a lock for this door
<pitti> tkamppeter: should I wait for this to avoid two debian uploads in a row?
<tkamppeter> pitti, OK, wait for that.
<ricotz> seb128, while looking at g-c-c and g-s-d could you drop Makefile.in from patches?
<seb128> ricotz, is that creating issues?
<ricotz> seb128, this cleans the patch a bit and an autoreconf it done anyway
<seb128> ricotz, ok
<ricotz> thanks
<seb128> yw
<ricotz> seb128, do you know if joss has a running gdm 3.2.1.1 in debian since it is in the svn
<seb128> ricotz, not sure, ask him on #debian-gnome I guess
<ricotz> ah, didnt recall the nickname ;)
<pitti> Sweetshark: hey Bjoern, wie gehts?
<pitti> Sweetshark: the "libreoffice" metapackage depends: libreoffice-report-builder-bin, but report-builder was dropped, so these pacakges don't exist any more; can you please drop the dep?
<seb128> hum, could people stop spamming the desktop list with weird discussions? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i was thinking the same thing too
<chrisccoulson> you know when somebody references a scene from borat the discussion has lost all hope of ever being useful
<seb128> lol
<pitti> rickspencer3: finally! http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/testing/precise_probs.html
<pitti> Sweetshark: did you get my ping from earlier about the binfilter depends?
<Sweetshark> pitti: yes, I try to reenable building report-builder, just to see if it works.
<Sweetshark> pitti: I guess that would require a FFE even if it would build *confused* (the FFE definitions dont map well to the libreoffice a-whole-distro-in-one-source-package world)
<pitti> Sweetshark: hm, we had it before, though
<pitti> seb128: do you happen to know about packaging lightdm-gtk-greeter?
<seb128> pitti, being done by Debian, I will sync once it's uploaded
<seb128> pitti, I can have a look to not wait on Debian this week if you want to but not today
<seb128> pitti, it's mostly ready in the pkg-xfce vcs in Debian
<seb128> pitti, http://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/pkg-xfce/goodies/trunk/lightdm-gtk-greeter/debian/
<pitti> seb128: ah, thanks
<seb128> pitti, ideally somebody from xubuntu or lubuntu who step up to maintain that greeter
<seb128> since they use it and we don't...
<pitti> right
<Sweetshark> pitti: seems like some on the needed deps for report-builder got demoted to universe :(
<pitti> Sweetshark: don't worry, we'll re-promote it once it needs it again
<Sweetshark> bug 919659 <- oh, great. lets just kill 3.4 and backport 3.5 ...
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 919659 in libreoffice "[Downstream] Can't open/save spreadsheet with password" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/919659
<Sweetshark> </sarc>
<jbicha> good morning
<pitti> hey jbicha, how are you?
<jbicha> I'm doing good, how was your weekend?
<pitti> jbicha: it was really nice
<jbicha> remmina forgot to install its desktop file, it's fixed in trunk now though
<seb128> jbicha, hey
<seb128> jbicha, your g-s-d work, did you start on changes for the new version there or only merging on Debian?
<jbicha> seb128: I did both
<seb128> jbicha, hum, ok :-(
<seb128> jbicha, I don't want to increase diff by mixing a debian merge with the update, I will pick bits out of your work and rebase manually then
<kenvandine> wow the archive is slow today... been downloading updates for 30m this morning
<kenvandine> you'd think it was release day :)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, my neck really isn't used to looking to the left
<chrisccoulson> perhaps i shouldn't have rearranged my desk ;)
<kenvandine> haha
<pitti> chrisccoulson: noone's neck is -- the monitor should be right in front of you
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, my primary screen is. but the laptop screen + dock are on the left
<chrisccoulson> they used to be on the right, but that's where i also have my mouse
<chrisccoulson> so i thought i'd try moving the dock so that i have more room
<chrisccoulson> it feels a bit weird though
<didrocks> m4n1sh: hey, how are you?
<mterry> seb128, pitti: Why did we re-enable indicators for the fallback session?  That will challenge some assumptions elsewhere about whether Unity==indicators (e.g. the way we swap in our date/time panel for upstream's)
<seb128> mterry,
<seb128> gnome-panel (1:3.3.5-0ubuntu2) precise; urgency=low
<seb128>   * debian/patches/41_classic_layout.patch:
<seb128>     - Change the defaults to be more "classic Ubuntu": Show indicators
<seb128>       & show desktop, drop GNOME clock & notification area (LP: #846378)
<seb128> mterry, jbicha did it
<seb128> mterry, I've no strong opinion either way
<seb128> mterry, hey btw, had a good w.e? ;-)
<mterry> I also thought we were trying to not modify the upstream experience
<pitti> mterry: err, we did?
<mterry> seb128, yeah, it was good  :)
<pitti> mterry: I think we should not have any indicators in gnome-shell or gnome-panel
<mterry> pitti, I tend to agree
<seb128> pitti, cf the changelog I just copied
<pitti> right, I think we should revert that
<seb128> I've no strong opinion, jbicha and ricotz are in charge of GNOME upstream experience ;-)
<pitti> jbicha: ^ opinion?
<seb128> pitti, well he's the one who did the change so I guess he's in favor of it
<pitti> jbicha: I'd rather ship a real upstream experience now
<mterry> seb128, yar but he may not be aware of the consequences
<seb128> I'm unsure, people updating for lucid would probably like to still get their gnome-panel session similar to what they are used to
<pitti> jbicha: we don't really test indicators and other ubuntu-isms in gnome upstream, so we better not modify it too much?
<mterry> jbicha, just FYI, other parts of the desktop now detect whether they are in Unity or not to expose indicator preferences
<seb128> mterry, well what you say that is that we shouldn't have added indicator-applet back
<pitti> correct
<seb128> in the archive
<pitti> we even removed it, didn't we?
<mterry> Oh, I guess
<seb128> pitti, because it was not ported to GNOME3
<mterry> That's my biggest concern, yeah
<pitti> no, because we (well, seems "only some of us") didn't really want it back
<seb128> well, on the other side quite some people like gnome-panel with indicators
<mterry> seb128, have them email GNOME to add it.  ;)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> well we have indicator-applet and it's working
<mterry> Ah, but it's not quite.  Users have no way to modify some of the settings
<pitti> and now we don't have a real gnome any more
<seb128> it's about time we really fork gnome-control-center
<seb128> we stack hacks on hacks between sessions
<seb128> we should have an ubuntu-control-center and a gnome-control-center
<seb128> but that's a discussion for next cycle ;-)
<seb128> pitti, well gnome-shell is real GNOME
<mterry> seb128, perhaps.  But then to fix this, we'd be talking about swapping out the control center for the fallback session.  Which gets us further from the GNOME experience.
<seb128> ok, I'm out of this discussion
<mterry> :)
<seb128> I don't think gnome-panel is worth the time we are loosing discussing it
<mterry> seb128, care to talk about keyboard indicators instead?
<seb128> mterry, I'm happy to talk keyboard ;-)
<mterry> I don't get the no-keyboard-indicator bug you see.  So I'm not sure if I'm doing the same thing as you
<seb128> mterry, sorry for the list spam, I should draft emails rather than just commit after each step of testing :p
<mterry> heh
<seb128> mterry, the user switching one? or the "in session indicator"?
<mterry> The in-session indicator one
<seb128> mterry, my switch to workspace <n> keybindings are broken as well with your update
<seb128> so something is broken with g-s-d
<seb128> I tried to --debug run it but I didn't see anything obvious
<mterry> seb128, ??
<mterry> seb128, hmm.  sounds like maybe it's blocking on something?  Never gets to the point where it can show keyboard indicator or handle events
<seb128> mterry, well I've alt-1 for switch to ws1 for example, with the g-s-d from the ppa that stopped working
<mterry> seb128, like if it couldn't get a response from accountsservice when it tried to tell it about your layouts?
<seb128> so I'm wondering if there is an issue leading to some plugins not loading
<seb128> hum
<seb128> mterry, could be yes
<mterry> My patch is real small.  It's just calling accountsservice calls (but doing so synchronously)
<mterry> seb128, can you double-confirm you have the accountsservice from the PPA?
<seb128> mterry, do you use the gir?
<seb128> ii  accountsservice                           0.6.15-2ubuntu4+keyboard1                    query and manipulate user account information
<seb128> ii  gir1.2-accountsservice-1.0                0.6.15-2ubuntu4                              GObject introspection data for AccountService
<seb128> ii  libaccountsservice0                       0.6.15-2ubuntu4+keyboard1                    query and manipulate user account information - shared libraries
<seb128>  
<seb128> seems I didn't update the gir
<seb128> could it break stuff?
<mterry> No, shouldn't...  it doesn't use the gir
 * kenvandine wishes robert_ancell was online for a hug, he cleaned up all the compiler warnings in gwibber :)
<seb128> hehe
<kenvandine> and he started a branch with bake :)
<seb128> mterry, gdb on it seems to indicate it's not blocked
<seb128> #1  0x00b05020 in __GI___poll (fds=0x9c5f590, nfds=10, timeout=3999)
<seb128>     at ../sysdeps/unix/sysv/linux/poll.c:87
<seb128> #2  0x007d280b in g_poll (fds=0x9c5f590, nfds=10, timeout=3999)
<seb128>     at /build/buildd/glib2.0-2.31.16/./glib/gpoll.c:132
<seb128> #3  0x007c4dde in g_main_context_poll (n_fds=10, fds=0x9c5f590,
<seb128>  
<mterry> seb128, curious...  my patch seems so harmless besides the possibility of blocking: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/92613030/gnome-settings-daemon_3.2.2-0ubuntu15_3.2.2-0ubuntu15%2Bkeyboard1.diff.gz
<mterry> And it's not just crashing for you it sounds like
<seb128> mterry, ok, scrap the "keybindings are not working"
<seb128> mterry, they seem to work, maybe I had the wrong layout and didn't notice since the indicator is not showing
<mterry> ah, heh
<seb128> mterry, but you got the indicator to show?
<mterry> seb128, yeah.  I have 4 layouts configured, and I see the indicator
<seb128> hum
<seb128> d-feet returns what seems the right keymaps list
 * mterry wonders how widespread this is; needs another tester
<mterry> didrocks, heyo!
<jbicha> have y'all tried default gnome-panel without the indicators? it's pretty horrible, the battery icon does nothing, it doesn't scroll well, and so on
 * mterry waves to jbicha
<jbicha> mterry: hi!
<kenvandine> jbicha, nope, only with the indicators :)
<seb128> mterry,
<seb128> $ gsettings get org.gnome.libgnomekbd.keyboard layouts
<seb128> ['de', 'fr\toss']
<seb128> mterry, so that seems correct...
<mterry> jbicha, I just wanted to make sure that it was understood  that the preferences for the indicators don't show outside of Unity
<jbicha> mterry: :( well at least it looks prettier
<mterry> seb128, and you proved that g-s-d is not blocked with gdb... If you add a layout, does accountsservice reflect that over DBus?
<didrocks> hey mterry :)
<mterry> seb128, (the XKeyboardLayouts attribute)
<jbicha> I think we really need a separate OnlyShowIn: value for GNOME Classic than for Shell
<seb128> mterry, it does
<mterry> seb128, so that means my patch in g-s-d is doing its job.  Just somewhere along the line the indicator got lost
<mterry> didrocks, can you do me a favor and try the keyboard packages from the desktop PPA?
<seb128> mterry, I can easily trigger the issue if you need help debugging, like I "sudo apt-get install gnome-settings-daemon=3.2.2-0ubuntu15" and restart g-s-d and I get an indicator
<mterry> didrocks, I want to see if this is a French thing or not  :)
<seb128> I use the ppa and restart g-s-d and I get none
<didrocks> mterry: sure, you meant, the g-s-d here?
<mterry> didrocks, there are four packages, accountsservice, g-s-d, lightdm, unity-greeter
<mterry> didrocks, and then you have to log out and back in twice.  :)
<mterry> didrocks, might just be easier to dist-upgrade rather than pick them out
<didrocks> mterry: ok, that can wait for ~ half an hour?
<mterry> didrocks, sure
<mterry> didrocks, no rush, thanks!
<didrocks> will do :)
<mterry> tedg, did you get a chance to look at my indicator-power patch?  I wanted to distro-patch it in for FF, but would feel better if I could say "backported from trunk" in the changelog  :)
<seb128> mterry, I'm pretty puzzled at why your diff would break anything...
<tedg> mterry, Yeah, I saw it, I'm not sure if it conflicts with charles' patch though.
<tedg> mterry, I haven't looked at the two together yet.
<mterry> seb128, me too  :-/
<mterry> charles' patch, eh?  /me looks
<seb128> mterry, can you confirm one of the other issues I reported at least? ;-)
<mterry> seb128, heh, sure.  let me try the switch user one
<mterry> seb128, also, I tried switching layouts in the greeter and I wasn't able to log in anymore.  So for me, it seems layout switching is working
<mterry> seb128, wish there was a place to type that let you see what you were typing
<seb128> mterry, hum ok, anyway none of those seem blocker for an upload so maybe get that in precise and let's see what bugs come
<mterry> seb128, the indicator one is kinda bad
<seb128> mterry, can't you enable back the "other" in some config way?
<seb128> for nfs,ldap logins
<mterry> seb128, other?
<seb128> mterry, the entry that let you type an username
<seb128> mterry, isn't that required for i.e ldap logins?
<mterry> seb128, oh right.  no?  not sure what happened to that, but haven't seen it in a while.  let me check cde
<mterry> code
<seb128> I used to type in that field to see what I typed
<seb128> mterry, it was disabled by default, but I'm pretty sure that respect a config, like show user list
<seb128> mterry, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-greeter-team/unity-greeter/trunk/revision/236
<seb128> mterry, the check is easy to ack away at least for testing
<seb128> -if (greeter.hide_users_hint)
<seb128> +if(1)
<seb128> I guess
<mterry> seb128, or greeter-hide-users=true in /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf
<seb128> mterry, well then I guess you loose your users to test what config reading
<seb128> it would only list the username,password prompt in that case?
<mterry> seb128, I think so?  Let me try.  Not sure I have the absolute correct syntax yet
<seb128> mterry, well that's what I would think the option do, hide your users
<seb128> that might not be good for testing
<seb128> I guess easier is to do a local build and show the chars in the password entry
<ronoc> mvo, ping
<mterry> seb128, hrm.  I also don't get the switch-user behavior you describe.  When you switch users, does the user list have to scroll to get to your name?
<mterry> seb128, why not good for testing?
<seb128> mterry, no, I think the greeter is spawned with that user selected
<mterry> seb128, yar, but for me, it animates scrolling to the user.  Does it do that for you?
<seb128> mterry, vt switching sucks too much there, by the time I see the greeter it's already rendered, if it had to do an animation I don't see it
<mterry> k
<seb128> mterry, what user is selected by default?
<seb128> mterry, the user I tested happens to be the first in the list
<seb128> if that makes a difference
<seb128> so no scrolling needed
<seb128> mterry, that's maybe a corner case if the user selected for switching is the default one
<ronoc> mvo, the dependency problem with apt-get install libpackagekit-glib2-dev
<mterry> seb128, yup, if it scrolls, no bug.  But I do get it for first user
<seb128> mterry, I'm building a g-s-d locally with your patch and some printfs, let's see how that goes
<mterry> seb128, it's not the default one, but the first alphabetically
<ronoc> mvo, is preventing it from being released into precise
<seb128> mterry, right
<seb128> mterry, ok, good, so you can at least confirm this one ;-)
<mterry> now let me try disabling chars
<mterry> seb128, oh, I bet it looks horrible too for you!  I didn't put the light-themes changes in the PPA
<seb128> mterry, it looks weird but I didn't stop at cosmetic issues, it's not uif yet ;-)
<mterry> still, gotta have all the bling one can get
<seb128> mterry, hum, in fact I had only one glitch
<mvo> ronoc: the dependency problem that it pulls in packagekit itself?
<seb128> mterry, we got a light-themes snapshot recently, I think it includes the theming work Cimi did
<seb128> mterry, or was there extra tweaks since?
<ronoc> mvo, that's the one
<mterry> seb128, no, don't think that includes his lightdm tweaks
<mterry> oh it does, just in a different place...
<seb128> mterry, wtf
<mterry> so now i have to wonder how to get it to apply...
<seb128> mterry, so your ppa package rebuild locally works...is there any chance the i386 ppa build built with the old accountsservice and that's creating issues or something
<mterry> seb128, I can't see how...  doesn't need its headers or dbus api or anything beforehand
<mvo> ronoc: if the python-packagekit recommends get lowered to suggests, that should be all that is needed to fix it
<mterry> seb128, does it also fix the switching layouts issue?  :)  /me hopes
<seb128> mterry, on the greeter? I can't tell, I don't want to reboot now
<ronoc> mvo, ok  probably doesn't make a difference but  for the record I'm not using python
<didrocks> seiflotfy: do you kow if m4n1sh will get around soon? I think we need an activity-log-manager release with the COPYING issue fixed if we want to push it to main (and preferably the gtk warning/treeview issues fixed as well)
<seb128> mterry, I lost your lightdm changes when I fixed lightdm yesterday and didn't restart since I got the new update from the ppa so I'm running the archive version
<ronoc> mvo, it would be nice to get this today, any chance you could fix that and kenvandine can try the release again
<mterry> seb128, no problem.  all that's needed is liblightdm-gobject, so just having unity-greeter restart is enough
<seb128> mterry, ok, that I can try
<m4n1sh> didrocks: back. so it is not pushed in main yet?
<m4n1sh> didrocks: since it is uploaded to repos, so is FF applicable?
<seb128> mterry, yeah, that fixed it
<m4n1sh> since this release is bug fix
<seb128> mterry, so dunno wth with the ppa build
<didrocks> m4n1sh: no, but putting in main requires to meet the FF
<m4n1sh> oh noes
<didrocks> m4n1sh: and there is no official release with the fixed copyright file, so I can't ask for a MIR
<didrocks> m4n1sh: as you have that in trunk, can you cut a release with it?
<m4n1sh> I fixed COPYING, the binary name issue
<m4n1sh> yes
<didrocks> m4n1sh: I'll push and harass mterry so that he can review the MIR
<m4n1sh> but there are two open bugs
<didrocks> great :)
<didrocks> hum, which ones?
<didrocks> (the desktop files are fixed)
<didrocks> ?
<m4n1sh> yes
<m4n1sh> i checked it in a VM
<m4n1sh> works
<m4n1sh> two bug fixes are about application tab
<m4n1sh> i can fix it now
<m4n1sh> which leads to crash
<m4n1sh> and other in history tab, which is mostly about wrong error messages
<didrocks> m4n1sh: ok, tell me when you will have processed the release then :)
<m4n1sh> trying in 2 hrs
<didrocks> thanks :)
<mterry> seb128, OK, with your manual build then, the only bug is the user-switching one?  That's not bad
<seb128> mterry, yes
<m4n1sh> parallel clothes washing and bug fixing.. oh boy
<seb128> mterry, I feel uneasy about the ppa build stuff though
<seb128> mterry, did you try g-s-d from the ppa or your local build?
<mterry> seb128, I'm currently on the PPA
<mterry> seb128, no break that I can see
<seb128> mterry, though I don't understand how the ppa could make any difference
<mvo> ronoc: let me talk to ximion (in #Packagekit) about the best course of action then I can do  aupload
<ronoc> mvo, thanks
<seb128> mterry, there are some warnings like /build/buildd/gnome-settings-daemon-3.2.2/plugins/keyboard/gsd-keyboard-manager.c:130: warning: undefined reference to `XkbKeysymToModifiers'
<mterry> seb128, oh wait!  I just killed gnome-settings-daemon and got your bug
<seb128> but that's nothing that could create that...
<mterry> seb128, so maybe I was on a local build after all and just now switched to the PPA one
<seb128> mterry, ok, so ppa is b0rked, next question: "why"?
<mvo> ronoc: did you see the reply from glatzor? that sounded encouraging, didn't it?
<mterry> seb128, I will start a rebuild and at least see if it's a Heisenberg
<ronoc> mvo, yep just responding now. I have already done everything he suggested, will do the renaming/refactoring object name after FF
<mterry> brb
<mvo> ronoc: cool - so that leaves some bugs, right? i.e. you don't always see signals?
<ronoc> mvo, no I think it's fine
<ronoc> mvo, afaict from my testing last week it seemed good to go
<ronoc> mvo, it's the packaging
<ronoc> *just
<ronoc> deps
<seb128> mterry, ok, got it
<ronoc> mvo, mpt agreed to drop the requirement to represent 'updates installing'
<ronoc> that made my life a hell of alot easier
<ronoc> i.e. didn't have to bother with transactions
<seb128> mterry, easy one ;-)
<mterry> seb128, oh good!
<seb128> mterry, the ppa build has "	App indicator support:    no"
<mterry> heh!
<seb128> mterry, I think something with the recent transitions
<mterry> why....  h,
<mterry> OK, so on that theory, the rebuild will be better
<seb128> mterry, I wonder if it works locally because I still have an old lib or something
<mterry> Oh, you think it needs a configure.ac change
<seb128> yes
<mvo> ronoc: ok, new PK is uploaded
<pitti> didrocks: impressive compiz changelog!
<mvo> ronoc: aha, nice to hear :)
<didrocks> pitti: 4 months of upstream work :)
<mterry> seb128, part of the configure script is checking for the gtk2 version, part is checking for the gtk3 one
<ronoc> mvo, sweet thanks a mill :)
<ronoc> kenvandine, ^^
<ronoc> session restart brb
<kenvandine> mvo, ronoc: thx
<mvo> ta
<mvo> eh
<mvo> yw
<mvo> you know what I mean :)
<seb128> mterry, I don't get why it worked before
<mterry> seb128, OK, I have a keyboard3 packaging building in PPA that I will ping you to try later.  Should fix the indicator thing
<seb128> mterry, in auto case it checks for the gtk2 version
<mterry> seb128, a dep probably pulled in libappindicator-dev
<seb128> mterry, yeah, must be
<seb128> mterry, thanks!
<seb128> mterry, I'm glad we sorted it ;-)
<mterry> me too
 * mterry now looks at theming problem
 * mterry wishes things would stay fixed
<seb128> mterry, oh, I know what changed
<seb128> mterry, the gtk3 indicator-dev used to depends on the gtk2 one since they had the .h common for both version
<mterry> ah...
<seb128> mterry, that got fixed last week, they each have their .h now
<seb128> ok, great, mystery solved ;-)
<mterry> That doesn't seem right (sharing a .h).  But I probably did that patch originally...  My bad  :)
 * seb128 back to updating g-s-d to 3.3
<seb128> stupid question
<pitti> mvo: hm, I don't understand your packagekit change -- shouldn't packages which need the API depend on PK | aptdaemon-pkcompat?
<seb128> but how do I bzr bd-do to refresh my patches nowadays?
<pitti> seb128: you mean in an UDD branch?
<seb128> it refuses to log me into the shell because one patch fails to apply ... which is exactly why I want to log in, to refresh it
<seb128> pitti, no, ubuntu-desktop debian only types
<seb128> bzr bd-do fails because one of the patches doesn't apply
<pitti> eww
<seb128> how do I refresh patches then?
<seb128> I guess that's rather an #ubuntu-devel question
<pitti> hm, I don't see a --dont-apply-patches-dammit option
<pitti> seb128: you could manually unpack the tarballs with tar xf ../foo.tar.bz --str=1
<pitti> refresh the patches, and then "bzr clean-tree --ignored --unknown" again
<pitti> but again, eww
<seb128> pitti, well I'm rm debian/patches/series; bzr bd-do; bzr revert debian/patches/series
<seb128> but that sucks
<pitti> yes
<seb128> well rather comment the patches from the serie and uncomment
<seb128> but that's ridiculously stupid to do ;-)
<pitti> mvo: oh, it's for the library, I see
<mterry> tedg, ah, I see his branch.  I think I like mine slightly better, but I'm probably just being biased.  I don't care which gets implemented, but that decision should probably happen soon, because I don't want to distro-patch the wrong one and end up with a dead-end gsettings value
 * tedg sets up the octagon ... mterry, charles_, fight!
<tedg> Of course I mean the octagon of love.  This is a family IRC channel.
<mterry> tedg, yeah, I would think instead of an octagon, we hug it out in the circle of friends
<didrocks> seb128: you can bzr bd-do
<didrocks> wait it to fail
<didrocks> cd ../build-area/<your_project>
<didrocks> quilt push/pop whatever you need
<didrocks> and cp the patchâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, I like my edit series still better :p
<didrocks> :p
<seb128> at least it copies all the diff over for me
<didrocks> yeah
<seb128> but thanks ;-)
<didrocks> yw ;)
<didrocks> mterry: ok, ready now, too longer than expected
<didrocks> mterry: so, you want me to dist-upgrade from the ubuntu-desktop and try lightdm/keybindings?
<tedg> jono, I think mterry has found a new UDS activity... we set up a circle of friends, get those blow up sumo suits, and we use it to decide "hard conversations"
<mterry> didrocks, hold off on that for a sec
<mterry> didrocks, new package building
<mterry> tedg, heh
<didrocks> |o|
<mterry> didrocks, what's that mean?  :)
<jono> tedg, lol
<mterry> Is amd64 in bad shape in the archive?  getting various unmet dependencies
<didrocks> mterry: I hold up my arms, don't touch the keyboard anymore :)
<seb128> didrocks, we figured the issue so there is less need for another tester
<didrocks> ah great :)
<tedg> mterry, Woodpecker has put a whole in his tree, away from keyboard to get shotgun.
<mvo> pitti: yeah, just the libs to avoid that they pull in pk
<mterry> tedg, heh
<tedg> hole
<mterry> seb128, you on i386?  that build succeeded
<seb128> mterry, yes
<mterry> try keyboard3
<seb128> mterry, but I'm pretty sure that was the indicator stuff being disabled
<seb128> mterry, you would feel better if I try the update from the ppa still? ;-)
<charles> mterry, tedg: I don't mind which branch gets used, I kind of like my branch o/c :)
<mterry> seb128, yeah  :)  This one says "App indicator support:    yes" so just want to confirm it works
<charles> I thought I marked the ticket as "in progress" though -- I'm not sure why the duplication of effort happened?
<seb128> mterry, ok, I will test it, but only because it's you! ;-)
<mterry> charles, this is why we need sumo suits!  Yeah, sorry, I had the work item from UDS, but I never saw the bug
<charles> is there something else I needed to do to flag the ticket to avoid duplication? :)
<charles> mterry: ah, ok
<mterry> charles, just that the bug and blueprint never got connected
<mterry> tedg, check his branch first, since I'm pretty sure this was my mistake and it looks like his branch fixes some other stuff too?  :)
<seb128> mterry, hum, I wonder why the amd64 builders are unhappy
<pitti> seb128: failing on build depends?
<pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/testing/precise_probs.html
<pitti> might be the fontconfig upload
<charles> I think I like my branch a little better since it binds directly to the gsettings. mterry's is a smaller patch though, and should work, so they're both good
<pitti> fontconfig is built on all arches, so I hope it'll clear up in some 20 mins
<pitti> if it's not that, I need to dig deeper
<seb128> pitti, seems to be
<seb128> pitti, danke
<seb128> mterry, I'm an happy man again, thanks ;-)
<seb128> (the ppa build works fine)
<mterry> seb128, yay!
<mterry> so I'll push once I figure the theme.  Can fix the scrolling thing later, I think I know what that is anyway
<Sweetshark> pitti: how come that even though: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libxml-openoffice.org there is no libxml-java-openoffice.org to be found in my pbuilder?
<Sweetshark> (and yes, I added a universe line the sources.list)
<pitti> seb128: precise_probs back to normal, now mostly compiz-y stuff
<seb128> pitti, great, thanks
<pitti> Sweetshark: it existed until oneiric, not in precise any more
<Sweetshark> pitti: ugh, doh!
<Sweetshark> pitti: I keep mixing up release names again and again.
<pitti> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libxml-openoffice.org/+changelog
<pitti> Sweetshark: ^ It was removed from Debian and we followed suit
<pitti> it had no reverse dependencies any more
<pitti> Sweetshark: if we need it back, we can reintroduce it
<pitti> but it does smell pretty stale
<Sweetshark> no, actually we need the "libxml-java" source package from debian ...
<pitti> compiz failing on many arches doesn't help installability, of course
<pitti> Sweetshark: ah, fun; that was also removed a while ago, so it's back now?
<pitti> Sweetshark: syncing
<Sweetshark> pitti: yes, that and a bunchload of other java-related stuff
<ricotz> Sweetshark, hey, this doesnt sound like fun having it backported to lucid :\
<pitti> Sweetshark: ah, needed unblacklisting (done now), that needs some time to propagate
<pitti> Sweetshark: I'll sync it tomorrow
<Sweetshark> ricotz: disable reportbuilder then?
<Sweetshark> pitti: same for the flute source package, I guess?
<pitti> Sweetshark: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/flute/+changelog
<pitti> that should be published
<pitti> Sweetshark: but it's in universe
<pitti> Sweetshark: it's new, so needs an MIR if you need it
<Sweetshark> pitti: ah, right. then there is is source pentaho-reporting-flow-engine, which seems to be missing from precise
<pitti> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pentaho-reporting-flow-engine/+changelog
<pitti> Deleted in karmic-release (Reason: renamed to pentaho-reporting-flow-engine-openoffice.org)
<pitti> Sweetshark: unblacklisted, added to sync TODO list
<Sweetshark> pitti: and source liblayout also missing from precise
<ricotz> Sweetshark, i noticed this conversation, so havent actually looked at it yet
<ronoc> mterry, hey
<ronoc> just trying to apply a patch to lightdm at the mo
<pitti> Sweetshark: added to TODO
<mterry> ronoc, ok
<ronoc> mterry, I get this http://paste.ubuntu.com/840568/
<ronoc> from unity-greeter trunk
<pitti> Sweetshark: similar ones are jcommon-serializer, flute-1.3-jfree, librepository, libformula, libfonts-java
<ronoc> mterry, I have installed lightdm from the desktop ppa
<Sweetshark> pitti: I need librepository, libformula and libfonts too.
<ronoc> mterry, should i branch from your branch to apply the patch there
<pitti> Sweetshark: libformula sounds like a similar case
<ronoc> it's a small patch
<ronoc> mterry, will not conflict with your work
<mterry> ronoc, I fixed that already...
<pitti> Sweetshark: libfonts-java is not in Debian again
<ronoc> hence why i would like to do from trunk
<mterry> should be in unity-greeter trunk
<ronoc> hmmm
<ronoc> ok ill pull again
<mterry> ronoc, let me doulbe-confirm
<pitti> Sweetshark: sorry, mis-looked
<mterry> ronoc, sorry, I think I forgot to push  :(  Will do so now
<ronoc> mterry, sound
<Sweetshark> pitti: and MIR for libbase
<pitti> Sweetshark: so, flute-1.3-jfree again?
<mterry> ronoc, done
<ronoc> mterry, thanks
<mterry> (r285)
<ronoc> mterry, compiling now fine, thanks
<Sweetshark> pitti: http://packages.debian.org/source/sid/flute
<pitti> Sweetshark: ack
<pitti> good night everyone!
<Sweetshark> pitti: hey there! dont leave, without a big "thank you!"
<Sweetshark> pitti: ;)
<Sweetshark> pitti: four more: pentaho-reporting-flow-engine needs a sync and sacjava, libserializer and libbase a MIR
<desrt> DBO: hey.  how persistent are bamfwindow structs?
<desrt> do they drop when i unref them or do they drop when the window stops existing?
<lifeless> RAOF: pastebin the confi, let me see.
<didrocks> have a good evening everyone
<m4n1sh> seb128: there?
<seb128> m4n1sh, yes
<m4n1sh> I am getting this issue at console
<m4n1sh> Gtk-WARNING **: Failed to set text from markup due to error parsing markup: Error on line 1: Entity did not end with a semicolon; most likely you used an ampersand character without intending to start an entity - escape ampersand as &amp;
<m4n1sh> I see a lot of bugs with this warning
<m4n1sh> is it some issue with Gtk or the code?
<seb128> m4n1sh, the code
<seb128> you don't properly escape strings you use in a markup function
<m4n1sh> you mean set_markup ?
<seb128> it's like if you had invalid html syntax in an html document
<seb128> m4n1sh, well any label which is in markup format yes
<m4n1sh> checking
<seb128> m4n1sh, gtk_set_label_markup for example
<seb128> mterry, wb!
<mterry> seb128, heh, went for lunch and forgot to re-launch IRC
<mterry> seb128, did I miss anything?
<m4n1sh> seb128: yes. Looking at any such
<seb128> mterry, you missed me looking for you ;-)
<mterry> seb128, what's up?
<seb128> mterry, so...
<seb128> mterry, when do you plan to update those ppa versions of yours? at least accountsservice and g-s-d
<mterry> seb128, you mean upload?
<mterry> seb128, I just uploaded accountsservice and lightdm
<seb128> mterry, I've a g-s-d 3.3.5 test package I want to push to the ppa which needs to go with an unity-greeter upload
<seb128> mterry, but I'm trying to avoid too much different testing versions around so I would like yours to be mainlined first
<mterry> seb128, fixed the switch-user thing btw
<seb128> great
<mterry> seb128, right.   I'm mainlining them now.  I can push g-s-d and will roll a release of unity-greeter 0.2.1 and push it in
<seb128> great, thanks
<mterry> seb128, will ping you when done
<seb128> mterry, I'm pondering trying to get you to rush a small fix in 0.2.1 ;-)
<mterry> seb128, OK, shoot
<seb128> mterry, so, small issue which becomes a problem thanks to desrt
<seb128> g-s-d 3.3 renamed org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.wacom to org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.gsdwacom
<mterry> seb128, ah, easy fix.  sure
<seb128> which of course leads unity-greeter to abort
<seb128> mterry, well, easy "fix", I plan to do an upload with the rename in the ppa
<mterry> seb128, man, why would they make that change...
<seb128> mterry, the real fix would be make settings-daemon.vala check if schemas exist before trying to use them
<seb128> to avoid any exit on broken schemas
<seb128> mterry, yeah, that's a stupid thing to do to start with, thanks bastien...
<seb128> mterry, don't bother for that version, I will use a breaks and do an unity-greeter matching upload
<mterry> seb128, but if I'm going to mainline 0.2.1... why bother fixing it in PPA?
<seb128> mterry, because g-s-d 3.3 is a to test, we stayed on 3.2 until now
<seb128> and you will hit the opposite problem if you upload the rename with g-s-d 3.2
<seb128> the name will mismatch the other way around
<seb128> the real fix would be to skip invalid schemas
<mterry> seb128, right.  So what's the fix you want in 0.2.1?  the skip invalid?
<seb128> if possible
<mterry> seb128, so I can certainly do that, but there will still need to be some coordination for the release, else gsdwacom will suddenly be enabled in unity-greeter.  But regardless of that, I suppose it makes sense to avoid an abort
<seb128> mterry, well you could list both if we don't abort on missing schemas ;-)
<mterry> seb128, oh yeah.  :)
<mterry> That's TWO changes seb128
<seb128> lol
<seb128> indeed!
<seb128> mterry, you know how to do the "handle missing schemas"?
<mterry> I believe so
<seb128> basically it should be check if the schemas is in  g_settings_list_schemas ();
<seb128> if not skip it
<seb128> mterry, ok, since that's 2 changes you win 2 beers if you get that in your upload ;-)
<mterry> I have to list all?  Is this some plot of desrt's to discourage people from doing this crap?
<seb128> mterry, yeah, I believe so :-(
<cyphermox> seb128: re webkit, did you test the linker flags that are supposed to help? fwiw I tried --no-keep-memory and bluez builds locally, with a ulimit -Hv 3700000
<mterry> seb128, he should have made it harder to rename schemas then
<cyphermox> seb128: seems to peek at around 2.7 G memory or so when linking libwebkitgtk
<seb128> cyphermox, bluez?
<cyphermox> seb128: ignore me, I just noticed I did something incredibly stupid in testing this
<cyphermox> seb128: what about bluez?
<seb128> cyphermox, no I didn't yet, I delayed that to after ff
<seb128> cyphermox, you wrote "--no-keep-memory and bluez builds locally"
<mterry> seb128, there's also g_settings_schema_source_lookup
<cyphermox> seb128: thinko. :)
<seb128> mterry, it's not on http://developer.gnome.org/gio/unstable/GSettings.html ?
<seb128> cyphermox, I didn't try yet in any case, it picks a bit over 3g without it, but your testing is appreciated
<mterry> seb128, http://developer.gnome.org/gio/unstable/gio-GSettingsSchema-GSettingsSchemaSource.html
<seb128> cyphermox, you say the testing is not correct? let me know if you try again
<cyphermox> seb128: I will in a minute
<seb128> mterry, oh ok, thanks
<cyphermox> seb128: let me know if I can spare cycles again to help with this
<seb128> cyphermox, well if you want to help you are most than welcome
<cyphermox> the issue is that I was building on amd64 instead of i386
<seb128> ok
<seb128> you should still see if the option helps there I guess
<seb128> jbicha, ricotz: ok, I've a working g-s-d 3.3.5 with a fixed unity-greeter, I will upload to ppa, do a bug with details for review, email etc later
<seb128> jbicha, ricotz: I'm waiting first for mterry to clear up the ppa and upload his g-s-d and unity-greeter to precise
<mterry> seb128, you need the new unity-greeter specifically?  I can update g-s-d now, but will have to squeeze in some changes for unity-greeter (am going to try to fix the drag-window-by-menubar too
<sil2100> Hi
<sil2100> I would like to test out https://bugs.launchpad.net/compiz-core/+bug/864478
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 864478 in unity "Window shading is broken" [High,Fix released]
<seb128> mterry, not if you are fine with me upload unity-greeter in the ppa with wacom->gsdwacom stuff to get with my gsd
<sil2100> The description there says to modify '/apps/compiz-1/gwd/titlebar_action', but I don't see that in gconf settings
<seb128> mterry, just be careful to not sneak the rename in the archive later on
<seb128> sil2100, try #ubuntu-unity
<seb128> sil2100, didrocks called it a day and nobody else has been looking at those issues, you have a better chance with the unity,compiz guys on #ubuntu-unity
<seb128> sil2100, #ubuntu-unity is the right channel for unity question anyway since that's where you will find the people working on the code
<sil2100> Understood
<mterry> seb128, that's fine.  I don't need further testing for unity-greeter in the PPA
<seb128> mterry, ok, thanks
<mterry> seb128, so I'll update g-s-d now then in archive
<seb128> mterry, I'm out for dinner, if you upload your g-s-d version to precise I will upload mine later
<seb128> mterry, excellent, thanks!
<mterry> cool
<mterry> have a good dinner
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, alright, looking forward to it
<ricotz> mterry, ^ :)
<mterry> :)
<DBO> desrt, bamf owns the ref
<desrt> to me that says "this lives forever"
<ricotz> DBO, hey
<DBO> hey ricotz
<ricotz> DBO, are there plans to enable the introspection build for bamf again?
<DBO> desrt, it lives until bamf decides it shouldn't live
<DBO> ricotz, uhhhh I think so
<desrt> DBO: so i should take a ref on it is what you're saying :)
<ricotz> DBO, i was hoping to get some official vala bindings instead of handwriting them ;)
<ricotz> desrt, hey, are you playing with bamf in vala?
<DBO> desrt, yes
<desrt> ricotz: i wish :)
<DBO> ricotz, I'll ask thomi about it today
<ricotz> hmm, i am avoiding taking refs on views :\
<broder> who should i bother about looking at bug #682338? it's been sitting in the sponsor queue for over a month
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 682338 in libcairo "GTK programs in Ubuntu 10.10 are sluggish over NX" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/682338
<ricotz> desrt, DBO, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~docky-core/plank/trunk/view/head:/vapi/bamf.vapi
<broder> my original thought was to figure out how to detect NX in particular, but i can't find any way to distinguish it from the X server it was forked from
<DBO> ricotz, you dont *have* to take a ref
<DBO> but if you dont it will die on its own when you get a closed signal
<ricotz> DBO, yeah, i guess i am hitting this problem
<seb128> broder, you can upload if you feel like taking responsability for the change ;-)
<broder> seb128: well, i think the implications of the change are fairly well documented: if someone were to happen to use the patched cairo with a *really* old X server, it might crash
<seb128> broder, the issue is, what happens if you i.e ssh -X from a debian stable system?
<broder> debian oldstable isn't old enough to trigger this bug, IIRC
<mterry> stgraber, heyo.  Is edubuntu ready for a gsettings unity-greeter?
<seb128> broder, ok, I can upload that
<seb128> broder, I will do it today
<stgraber> mterry: no, but upload anyway, I'll take care of it this afternoon so it's fixed for our next daily
<broder> seb128: instead of the patch that's there, i might change src/cairo-xlib-display.c instead to not set ->buggy_repeat = TRUE in the first place
<mterry> stgraber, cool
<seb128> broder, if you want to add a new patch to the bug please do
<broder> seb128: i can make that adjustment and do the upload; i just wasn't comfortable with making the judgement call on whether the patch was conceptually acceptable
<seb128> broder, or feel free to upload, I think the fix is fine
<broder> ok. i'll double-check that debian oldstable isn't old enough to be problematic
<seb128> broder, I think we should be fine and we are early enough in the cycle to change that if there are issues
<broder> seb128: awesome, thanks. i'll take care of it later this evening then
<seb128> broder, debian oldstable has xorg 7.3 it seems and the fdo bug mention 6.9
<seb128> broder, thanks
<desrt> DBO: please fix your bamf docs...
<desrt> RAOF: more input issues :/
<desrt> RAOF: the mouse cursor is often 'getting stuck'
<desrt> usually (but not always) near the boundaries of displays
<desrt> happens maybe 50% of the time
<desrt> pulling the mouse back and 'trying again' is often enough to unstick it
<mterry> seb128, ronoc, stgraber: released and uploaded unity-greeter 0.2.1
<stgraber> mterry: thanks, will update edubuntu-artwork and upload
<ronoc> mterry, good stuff
<Beret> qq so I don't file bugs for no reason - is the current build of unity in precise known to be broken?
<seb128> Beret, how broken?
<Beret> seb128, keyboard shortcuts for changing desktops ignored
<Beret> I file #931698
<seb128> ok
<RAOF> desrt: Can you be more specific?  Unity's use of barriers on the screen edges could do something like that.
<desrt> RAOF: since you mention it, i did switch to unity at the same time i did dist-upgrade
<desrt> but it's not consistent
<desrt> sometimes it happens, sometimes not
<desrt> and it happens going both ways... not just when there's a panel there
<RAOF> Dependent on how fast you're moving your pointer? :)
<RAOF> Yeah, both ways is a bug.
<RAOF> Allow me to propose a merge to fix that.
<RAOF> lifeless: http://paste.ubuntu.com/840954/ is the config; throwing away /var/cache/squid-deb-proxy allows it to start annd work.  Presumably that's a result of a corrupt cache going weird?  I've got the original (broken) cache available.
<desrt> RAOF: it seems to semi-depend on speed?
<desrt> it happens a bit less often if i go really fast
<desrt> is this seriously a feature?
<RAOF> It was more of a feature when the launcher wasn't always visible.
<desrt> maybe they should drop it now?
<RAOF> Or at least turn off the barriers when it's not autohiding.
<desrt> indeed
<desrt> gnome-shell fixed that issue back in the late days of 3.0 by turning off autohide for multiple monitors
<RAOF> It's useful when the launcher *is* being autohidden.
<desrt> ya.  i can imagine
<desrt> hitting the 1 pixel required to show it would be pretty tricky otherwise
<dobey> is there any way to turn off the launcher/panel on my second monitor, completely?
<dobey> desrt: does gnome-shell put the dock on all screens too?
<desrt> no
<desrt> it doesn't even put one on the main screen except when in overview
<desrt> it takes the minimalist approach to chrome
<dobey> so the mouse thing was only an issue in gnome-shell if you had a screen to the left of the main screen i guess?
<lifeless> RAOF: yes, thats weird - file a squid bug upstream :)
<Laney> kenvandine: yo, just finishing (imho) libproxy
<Laney> will push after testing if you want to give it a whirl, and then i'll propose it to pkg-gnome
<desrt> dobey: right, actually
<TheMuso> /c/c
<desrt> dobey: the dash never auto-hid
<desrt> dobey: but the workspaces switcher did
<desrt> and it's actually clever enough to only disable autohide if there is a monitor to the right of the main screen
<desrt> (ie: only disabled if having it enabled would cause a problem)
<dobey> ah
<dobey> i really just want to get rid of all the shell bits on the non-primary screens. though i suppose with the way unity works, it's a bit hard for it to do that. however, having the launcher right in the middle is really annoying
<desrt> ya.... particularly with those barriers
<dobey> indeed. though the barrier tends to only be annoying for me, while dragging a window across screens
<dobey> and the unlock screen popping up on whichever screen has the mouse on it when i move it, seems a bit weird as well. but eh
<kenvandine> Laney, awesome
<kenvandine> i can try to test it tomorrow
<Laney> rock
 * RAOF returns from some impromptu fglrx wrangling.
<RAOF> desrt, dobey: We really want the barriers when dragging windows - again, snap-to-maximise(/half-maximise) is much easier with such a target :)
<RAOF> gnome-shell probably wants it as well :)
<RAOF> (Also for the lower-right message tray, for vertical multi-head)
<desrt> RAOF: we actually have the barrier in the message tray and top panel
<desrt> so you aim for those targets if you want a half-maximised window
<RAOF> Oh, ow.
<RAOF> You've got an impenetrable barrier in the lower left?
<RAOF> I mean, lower right.
<desrt> not impenetrable
<desrt> but pretty hard
<RAOF> How does it get dropped?
<RAOF> What's the behaviour for pushing through?
<RAOF> Also, wouldn't it be nicer to just hit the side of the screen rather than opposite corners?
<dobey> RAOF: but that is something i *never* want. and afaik, there's no way to turn it off
<dobey> RAOF: all i want to do is turn it off. :)
<RAOF> dobey: There's no way to turn it off, no.
<RAOF> I'm working out if we can get better threshold information in the server, so it's easier to both deliberately go through and hit.
<dobey> i am more interested in just not having all the visual noise on my second screen though. the barrier i can deal with (at least i can as it is running right now, i guess i need to update and reboot again)
<Laney> kenvandine: ok, pushed: git://git.debian.org/git/users/laney/libproxy.git - you'll need to git-dch --auto
<Laney> I attempted to multiarch it too, perhaps you could review that
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-02-14
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<BigWhale> pitti, good morning.
<BigWhale> didrocks, you too :)
<pitti> hey didrocks, bonjour BigWhale
<kenvandine_> good morning guys
<pitti> hey kenvandine_
<kenvandine_> BigWhale, did you see my comment on your merge proposal?
<didrocks> hey BigWhale, guten morgen pitti, hi kenvandine_
<kenvandine_> hey pitti
<kenvandine_> pitti, we've gotten dobey's branch of gwibber working with webkit-gtk3 and gnomekeyring gir :)
<pitti> !
<kenvandine_> it needs a little minor cleanup, then we can drop the webkit gtk2 depends :)
<pitti> so that's only ubuntu-sso-client left then
<pitti> and I figure they'll working on that
 * pitti smells some hope for the grossly oversized images
<kenvandine_> yeah, they are very motivated
<kenvandine_> :)
<BigWhale> kenvandine, not yet
<pitti> kenvandine_: my fear is just that they'll push hard to get pyqt on
<kenvandine_> it was way more work than it should have been
<pitti> kenvandine_: but that's twice as big as the old webkit
<kenvandine_> pitti, well that is their motiviation
<kenvandine_> ugh
<pitti> so it can't happen right now
<kenvandine_> i thought they had worked out the size and webkit would make enough room
<BigWhale> kenvandine, I am still waiting for my sensors to calibrate ... :>
<pitti> no, webkit saves about 7 MB, pyqt4 is about 13
<kenvandine_> BigWhale, :)
<kenvandine_> ugh
<BigWhale> conflicts? really. weird.
<kenvandine_> BigWhale, merge conflicts in the proposal
<pitti> and regardless of how big pyqt4 is, it's not a zero-sum game; we are 17 MB oversized right now
<kenvandine_> WOW
<pitti> the biggest offenders are firefox and tbird, which grew another 2.5 MB each
<pitti> about 10 MB is just noise from the delta langpacks, these will disappear
<kenvandine_> BigWhale, i would like to merge your branch tonight, if you can fix that up
<BigWhale> yeah ...
<BigWhale> I'm looking at it right now
<BigWhale> kenvandine, did you change anything in stream-view-tile.vala and the conflicts are actual conflicts or it's just bazar being silly?
<kenvandine_> i merged robert_ancell's branch last night
<kenvandine_> which changed parts of that
<kenvandine_> he fixes all the compiler warnings :)
 * kenvandine_ hugs robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> kenvandine_, well, not all of them :)
<kenvandine_> most :)
<kenvandine_> all the vala ones i think
<robert_ancell> kenvandine_, I was playing around with lp:~robert-ancell/gwibber/bake...
<kenvandine_> i saw :)
 * kenvandine_ also has a branch that removes all the hacks for finding service icons
 * kenvandine_ is happy with that
<BigWhale> kenvandine, will it be too late if I fix this in half an hour? I have to take the kids to school. :>
<kenvandine_> BigWhale, i should still be up :)
<kenvandine_> BigWhale, no worries
<BigWhale> ok cool
<BigWhale> later
<achiang> hello, did the default gtk theme change in precise? my gtk menus now seem to have a light background, and not a dark one
<achiang> my theme is sent to ambience (and not radiance)
<kenvandine_> achiang, some of them do
<kenvandine_> the appmenu menus and the indicators shouldn't
<kenvandine_> but context menus are light now
<achiang> kenvandine_: isn't it 2am where you are? :)
<kenvandine_> achiang, indeed
<achiang> yikes
<kenvandine_> :)
<achiang> kenvandine_: yeah, the context menus are light
<kenvandine_> i think that is intentional
<achiang> kenvandine_: e.g., in empathy, when you right click on a contact and select "information" the text is hard to read
<kenvandine_> yeah
<kenvandine_> there is a bug filed on that
<kenvandine_> against light-themes
<achiang> kenvandine_: ah, ok
<achiang> cool
<achiang> are all these changes announced on u-desktop list?
<achiang> or do i just have to wait for omg! to tell me what's up? :)
<achiang> precise has been a lot of, "is that a bug or intentional"
<achiang> kenvandine_: correction, right click on a contact => information is fine; but hover over a contact produces an unreadable window
<kenvandine_> yeah, that is what i meant
<kenvandine_> achiang, that is the norm :)
<achiang> heh ok
<achiang> thanks
<kenvandine_> i know because i maintain some of the packages
<achiang> that's one way to stay abreast of the situation. :)
<achiang> ok, i am going to try to sleep now, (a mere 23:00), like a normal person
<achiang> cheers
<kenvandine_> :)
<pitti> didrocks: any possibility to have a quickfix for compiz on armel?
<didrocks> pitti: I pinged sam about it, didn't get any feedback yet
<pitti> error: cast from 'QList<QVariant>::Node*' to 'QVariant*' increases required alignment of target type [-Werror=cast-align]
<pitti> that looks a little weird to me
<pitti> why do different pointer types need different alignment?
<pitti> oh, I guess the thing they point to do
<didrocks> yeah, seems that a bad thing is done with the Qt bindings, I think instead of a QVariant*, the QList should be used
<didrocks> (QList of QVariant)
<pitti> didrocks: ok, thanks
<tkamppeter> pitti, thanks for uploading c-f.
<pitti> tkamppeter: no worries, thanks for the fixes!
<didrocks> RAOF: hey :)
<RAOF> didrocks: Yo
<didrocks> RAOF: on https://code.launchpad.net/~raof/unity/unidirectional-barrier/+merge/92889, the barrier on the other direction is on purpose
<RAOF> Oh, really?
<RAOF> Why?
<didrocks> RAOF: apparently, design tested on multimonitor, and if you for instance, try to grab the the scrollbar on the left monitor and accidently go to the right one
<didrocks> then, try to take it back again, you have to reveal the launcher and so onâ¦
<didrocks> (as you have to go from right to left)
<RAOF> Fair enough.
<didrocks> but
<didrocks> IMHO, those barriers should be removed if we are in "launcher always shown" mode?
<RAOF> Right, yes.
<RAOF> That was what I was about to say :)
<RAOF> Incidentally, I've got a test for your crazy xt2 touchpad.
<didrocks> we agree, I didn't talk to design about it yet :)
<didrocks> oh great!
<didrocks> seems the dell mini 10v is one of the offender as well btw
<RAOF> The server + libs in ppa:raof/help-jason send some extra information on the events; I'll send you some code to dump that information and see if we can get more consistent numbers out.
<didrocks> RAOF: excellent! I'll try to focus to get an unity ready for testing today, but I can have some free time tomorrow for it!
<RAOF> And the server will be built by then :)
<didrocks> which is the right timing I guess! :)
<didrocks> smspillaz: hey dude!
<didrocks> smspillaz: thanks for the fix on the "all windows minimized"
<didrocks> smspillaz: ping back on a less funny stuff: bug #931500
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 931500 in kdebase-workspace "post 0.9.7 snapshot: FTBFS on armel" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931500
<didrocks> should we harrass Riddel?
<smspillaz> didrocks: doesn't riddel not work on kubuntu anymore ?
<didrocks> smspillaz: he's still
<smspillaz> didrocks: I think probably we should just disable the kde build :p
<didrocks> smspillaz: hum, demoting right now those packages are still a little bit of work
<didrocks> smspillaz: btw, will be fun next cycle with kubuntu in universe
<didrocks> we will have to remove all the kde stuff
<didrocks> it still builds on other archs though
<didrocks> so I would like to see first with Riddell about it and then, we can take a decision
<smspillaz> didrocks: O.o yikes
<smspillaz> didrocks: in /universe/ ?
<didrocks> smspillaz: kde, yeah
<smspillaz> I didn't think it was becoming ... that unmaintained
<didrocks> it's community maintained
<didrocks> smspillaz: the issue is in /usr/include/kpluginfactory.h, isn't it?
<smspillaz> oh so everything in main is canonical maintained then ?
<smspillaz> yeah something like that
<smspillaz> although, I'm not sure. .. I'm tempted to drop the kde decorator entirely although
<smspillaz> I'm not sure what the reprocussions of that will be ?
<smspillaz> maybe we should move it into a separate package
<didrocks> well, the definition is quite complicated and not everyone has the same (we made this game with lool a couple of cycle ago about the main definition for everyone) :)
<smspillaz> and repo or something
<didrocks> smspillaz: you mean upstream, yeah, kind of a little bit late for now though
<micahg> smspillaz: Canonical supported would be more accurate
<smspillaz> that makes sense
<didrocks> smspillaz: but it's building on i386/amd64, so maybe the alignement fix can be easier
<smspillaz> its going to be a bit awkward when kubuntu distupgrades
<smspillaz> and they get like
<smspillaz> "600 packages are no longer maintained"
<didrocks> pitti: I assigned Riddell for the kdelibs issue (re: compiz FTBFS on armel)
<didrocks> smspillaz: thanks for your input!
<pitti> didrocks: thanks
<Riddell> didrocks: uh oh, what's this?
<smspillaz> didrocks: np
<didrocks> Riddell: hey :) see bug #931500
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 931500 in kdelibs "post 0.9.7 snapshot: FTBFS on armel" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931500
<Riddell> oh gcc being fussy is it?
<smspillaz> :p
<didrocks> Riddell: well, it doesn't like this kind of casting, right :)
<pitti> does sound like an actual crasher, though
<Riddell> there's probably a simple fix, I'll try and work it out
<didrocks> thanks Riddell
<smspillaz> :)
<didrocks> pitti: why a crasher? if the pointer is well used, it shouldn't really make a difference with the QList from a
<didrocks> â¦ from a pointer, isn't it?
<pitti> I guess it depends what you want to access, but yes, I think I was confused
<pitti> if the original object works, then the alignment should be ok
<didrocks> yeah, it's just to prevent from making bad things with it I reckon in the way you are accessing other elements
<didrocks> smspillaz: on bug #871801 can you please link both new branches (the unity one and the compiz one) to it, please?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 871801 in unity "window management, alt-tab - After using 'show desktop' to minimise all windows, opening any new window also incorrectly restores all the minimised windows " [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/871801
<smspillaz> ok
<didrocks> well, only the compiz one is not attached :)
<smspillaz> I only just uploaded it :p
<didrocks> smspillaz: you should use --fixes lp:bugnumber
<didrocks> smspillaz: when you commit
<didrocks> then, it's automagically done
<didrocks> (also open a compiz downstream task please ;))
<didrocks> pitti: I'm afraid we will have again feature freeze exception to request for unity
<pitti> didrocks: unsurprisingly :)
<pitti> didrocks: but with the rather strict AC this should be a lot less of a problem
<pitti> didrocks: HUD is rather intrusive, though
<didrocks> pitti: yeah :/ I'm trying to get those for another release next week
<didrocks> pitti: the HUD will land thursday
<didrocks> no worry about that one, phew ;)
<didrocks> ibus support, maybe integrated menu, and also the coverflow (and so, the video lens) will go for next week.
<pitti> meh, digikam FTBFS
<Riddell> uh oh
<Riddell> oh on arm
<pitti> it's due to the new opencv, I'll have a poke on it
<pitti> no, on all arches
<pitti> cmake just makes it really hard to see the actual error
<Riddell> oh ok, there's a new digikam to be packaged before thursday so it might not be worth fixing incase it fixes itself
<pitti> ah, good; I'll postpone that then, thanks for the heads-up
<Riddell> /build/buildd/digikam-2.4.1/core/libs/widgets/graphicsview/regionframeitem.cpp:640:66: error: no matching function for call to 'qBound(double, qreal, qreal)'
<Riddell> should be a simple case of adding a qreal()
<pitti> I have a missing library here
<pitti> opencv 2.3 seems to have shuffled them a bit
<Riddell> I'll pass it onto our potential digikam packager
<micahg> pitti: yeah, they were broken out into multiple libraries, adri2000 did a test rebuild
<seb128> hey
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey pitti, wie gehts?
<pitti> seb128: gut, danke!
<pitti> happy Valentine's day everyone!
<seb128> thanks, you as well ;-)
 * pitti happily munches some chocolate muffins that Netti baked for me
<seb128> pitti, ;-)
<didrocks> we were on a more pragmatical way: just a dinner on saturday :)
<pitti> ... and nobody reminded me of the reminder this morning *sob*
 * didrocks will make an indicator for pitti :)
<pitti> I'd just need to add this to my calendar :)
<pitti> but I feel loved so much more if you guys remind me :)
<seb128> pitti, it's meeting reminder day!
<didrocks> ahah, ok, gotcha, will not miss it! :)
 * pitti hugs seb128
<seb128> ;-)
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> pitti, sorry I was looking at the g-s-d update bug to see if there were any comment during the night
<seb128> seems not
<pitti> "sorry"?
<pitti> didn't try it yet, will do in a sec
<seb128> pitti, lol, no worry I don't plan to upload today anyway, rather tomorrow
<seb128> pitti, it was just a subtle way to let people know that the new g-s-d is in the desktop ppa if anyone feels like installing it
<seb128> pitti, I will put a note on the meeting page as well
<pitti> yes, absolutely
<pitti> seb128: does this already use the new wacom?
<seb128> pitti, yes
<pitti> seb128: tried it in a guest session (can't restart until this huge package build is done)
<pitti> seb128: only thing I noticed is that clicking on "wacom settings" in g-c-c crashes g-c-c
<pitti> I guess that'll need a corresponding g-c-c update
<pitti> otherwise I played around with monitor config
<pitti> once I can restart, I'll check keyboard settings
<seb128> pitti, yeah likely for the wacom icon
<seb128> ok
<seb128> xrandr is a bit better I think here
<seb128> I used to see my wallpaper in "grid" at login (the login screen is in mirror so has a lower resolution than my external screen)
<seb128> i.e the login screen resolution with mosaic rendering of it again on side and bottom
<seb128> that seems to not happen with the new one
<pitti> one thing that still happens is that I still see two trash can icons even after disabling the internal monitor
<pitti> but this sounds like a unity bug rather
<pitti> it doesn't happen in my session (with an existing monitors.xml)
<pitti> just in guest (which starts up in clone mode)
<rickspencer3> hey all ...
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> I just had a full on graphics freeze
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> I seem to recall tehre was some great wiki documention about how to helpd ebug that
<rickspencer3> does someone have a link handy?
<vuntz> err, I'm looking at the gtk+ 3 patches in ubuntu, and, hrm, I don't understand 015_default-fallback-icon-theme.patch
<rickspencer3> (since I've gone multi-monitor, I notice xorg and unity are a bit less happy)
<vuntz> why do you patch this instead of using /etc/gtk-3.0/settings.ini ?
<rickspencer3> hi pitti and seb128 and vuntz :)
<vuntz> yo rickspencer3
<pitti> rickspencer3:  perhps https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Troubleshooting/Freeze ?
<rickspencer3> pitti, looks exactly right!
<seb128> vuntz, lut, ca va bien ?
<seb128> vuntz, what is /etc/gtk-3.0/settings.ini? no such file or directory here
<seb128> vuntz, is there a similar file for gtk2?
<vuntz> seb128: just create the file :-)
<seb128> vuntz, what is the syntax? is it documented somewhere?
<vuntz> seb128: it's like /etc/gtk-2.0/gtkrc
 * vuntz finds the link
<vuntz> seb128: http://developer.gnome.org/gtk3/stable/GtkSettings.html
<seb128> vuntz, thanks
<vuntz> seb128: let me show what we use in openSUSE
<seb128> vuntz, speaking of opensuse I'm sure you told me that in the past but where I can look at your patches or packaging? ;-)
<vuntz> seb128: http://paste.opensuse.org/view/raw/25892884
<seb128> vuntz, 'ci
<vuntz> seb128: it's all documented at http://distributions.freedesktop.org/wiki/DistributionLocations :-)
<vuntz> https://build.opensuse.org/project/show?project=openSUSE%3AFactory is what you want
<seb128> vuntz, oh, distributions.freedesktop.org, is that new? ;-)
<vuntz> seems to be down right now, obviously
<vuntz> nah, it's not new
<seb128> yeah, doesn't reply
<seb128> vuntz, thanks, useful pointer ... does your settings.ini means that without gsd your get adwaita anyway?
<vuntz> it should, at least
<vuntz> I think I tried that a while ago
<seb128> vuntz, I wonder if fedora does the same and that's why people don't see nautilus loosing its theme when gsd segfault
<seb128> I'm still puzzled because it seems to happen only to us
<seb128> well segfault or is stopped
<seb128> vuntz, thanks for the tips!
<slomo> tjaalton: hi :) are the latest pre-releases of gstreamer core/base/good/bad/ugly in ubuntu now?
<tjaalton> slomo: the ones from last week,yes
<slomo> tjaalton: great, thanks :)
<slomo> tjaalton: if you're interested we could maintain them on git.debian.org in separate ubuntu branches... might make merging in the future easier
<tjaalton> slomo: yeah I have them locally
<tjaalton> on a branch
<slomo> tjaalton: if you sign up on alioth.debian.org i can add you to pkg-gstreamer and we could have it all in one place
<tjaalton> slomo: I'm there already, tjaalton-guest
<tjaalton> hopefully soon s/-guest// :)
<slomo> tjaalton: ok, added you :) please name the ubuntu specific branch "ubuntu" and base it on the current "experimental" branch
<chrisccoulson> is there any way for an application to tell if the video driver is using exa?
<tjaalton> slomo: ok I'll push them at some point
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: No, I don't believe so.
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, ah, never mind
<chrisccoulson> we want to test for a very specific condition in firefox (see https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=716036#c20)
<ubot2`> Mozilla bug 716036 in Layout "css z-ordering renders invisible text on google search page" [Normal,New: ]
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: Mmm, bugs in the 16BPP EXA implementation?  No wonder no-one's hit it :)
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, i'm wondering if the bug is actually specific to the imx driver, but i'm not sure how to prove that
<ricotz> seb128, hi
<seb128> hey ricotz, how are you?
<ricotz> i merged your g-s-d
<ricotz> thanks, i am quite fine
<ricotz> how are you
<ricotz> ?
<ricotz> and there could be removed at lot of Makefile.in stuff, like 1500 lines
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<seb128> ricotz, oh right, I forgot to clean those, will do before upload
<seb128> ricotz, does it work correctly for you otherwise?
<ricotz> and a small issue with gnome-settings-daemon.install
<seb128> ricotz, not listing a .sh?
<ricotz> seb128, i am running it currently, but only with the datetime revert patch enabled
<seb128> the input.sh stuff? I'm not sure we wanted,need that
<seb128> ricotz, ok
<ricotz> yeah this example script
<ricotz> otherwise it runs fine
<ricotz> the libcolor problem is gone
<seb128> ricotz, do you need the example script for something? or it's just because it's showing in list-missing?
<seb128> ricotz, the hang issue?
<ricotz> i havent spotted a great difference though
<ricotz> maybe it was related to another lib/app
<ricotz> yes, the freeze
<seb128> ricotz, right, I workaround it by dropping -Wl,-Bsymbolic-functions from the LDFLAGS
<seb128> ricotz, same issue than gnome-bluetooth and other GNOME stuff
<ricotz> oh, interesting
<seb128> they don't know how to handle their symbols correctly
<seb128> like the symbols get defined in different binaries and -Bsymbolic-functions don't like it
<seb128> it's a bug on their side still, we just workaround it
<ricotz> i see
<ricotz> i am wondering if i ran into the same issue with gdm 3.2
<ricotz> since there were similar symptoms
<seb128> ricotz, could be try the same ld trick in the rules
<ricotz> ok besides the Makefile.in and script thing, i only added  --disable-systemd
<seb128> good idea, will do it as well
<seb128> thanks for the feedback
<seb128> not a lot of visible changes... yes but some bug fixes and some nice improvements in theory
<seb128> what I wanted especially was the xrandr dock station work
<didrocks> pitti: small question about apport for non genuine ubuntu package. (from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Apport/DeveloperHowTo)
<ricotz> seb128, no problem
<seb128> the keybindings xinput2 handle is nice as well, it should fix some old bug and handle better special cases like use of usb or bluetooth devices
<didrocks> pitti: I just need to add the code snippet to my already existing def add_info(report, ui):
<ricotz> seb128, yeah, good to have it updated
<didrocks> isn't it?
<pitti> didrocks: what are you trying to do?
<ricotz> seb128, on the other hand the changes in g-c-c are getting kind of ugly :\
<ronoc> seb128, hey
<didrocks> pitti: basically for the unity-team/ppa packages, to enable peope to report bugs with ubuntu-bug unity
<didrocks> pitti: and get those tagged
<seb128> ricotz, like? it's next to review on my list
<seb128> ronoc, hello
<ricotz> seb128, i merge these change, but i am tempted to disable them for my ppa
<ronoc> seb128, diwic and I as you well know are trying to find out how to play the startup sound in the most convenient way
<seb128> ricotz, you mean the ubuntu changes or upstream 3.4?
<ricotz> seb128, the overview changes, bigger icons and separators
<ricotz> the ubuntu changes
<ronoc> seb128, i have a branch here which has the necessary code in place
<seb128> ricotz, oh, right, design...
<ronoc> ~cjcurran/unity-greeter/play-synchronised-start-up-sound/
<ricotz> seb128, this isnt look good
<ronoc> seb128, we are having problems though with canberra not able to recognize the ubuntu theme
<seb128> ronoc, cool, can you merge propose it?
<seb128> ricotz, well visual look is a matter of taste, some users commented on the bug to say they love how it looks now
<ronoc> seb128, i can but i would like to prove that canberra can find the ubuntu sounds before merging
<ronoc> or do you want me to merge it in
<seb128> ricotz, ideally we would tweak the look only under unity
<ricotz> seb128, also the gnome-icon-theme doesnt contain the icons for the "separators"
<ronoc> and then we can figure that out afterwards
<diwic> canberra-gtk-play requires gtk-sound-theme-name=ubuntu
<pitti> didrocks: you can use what /usr/share/apport/package-hooks/source_ubuntuone-client.py does
<pitti> didrocks: drop the "ThirdParty" bit, that's obsolete
<seb128> ricotz, shouldn't it fallback by dropping the -<name>
<seb128> ?
<pitti> didrocks: but you can set/append report['Tags'] if you wish
<ricotz> seb128, it shows some default "terminal-window" icon
<didrocks> pitti: ah nice, let me try it! :)
<didrocks> pitti: ok, without the ThirdParty then
<seb128> ricotz, seems a bug, it should fallback
<pitti> didrocks: the package needs to ship a crash db conf file like /etc/apport/crashdb.conf.d/ubuntuone-client-crashdb.conf, though (bug 551330 is about making this easier)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 551330 in apport "allow defining crashdb inline within the report" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/551330
<seb128> channel is crazy now :p
<seb128> ronoc, diwic: is that a libcanberra bug?
<ronoc> :)
<didrocks> pitti: it's not really a "crash" db, isn't it? as it won't have symbols to retrace?
<ronoc> seb128, we think so
<seb128> ronoc, don't "merge" anything, just merge propose for review
<ronoc> ok will do that now
<diwic> seb128, I'm trying to figure out the best way to tell libcanberra that
<pitti> didrocks: read it as "place to send problem reports to"
<didrocks> pitti: but ok, it's basically the documentation minus the ThirdParty part then :)
<didrocks> pitti: ok, excellent! Thanks a lot :)
<diwic> seb128, I found that you could ship a /etc/gtk-3.0/settings.ini file, are you familiar with that?
<ronoc> this worked for diwic but not for me
<seb128> diwic, yes, vuntz mentioned earlier for the icon theme
<ronoc> seb128, if this proved to be a viable solution would you be happy with this sort of fix
<seb128> ronoc, yes
<ronoc> cool
<seb128> ronoc, I'm trying to understand the issue though
<ronoc> basically canberra will not identify ubuntu as a valid theme
<seb128> ronoc, why not?
<seb128> ronoc, there is a /usr/share/sounds/ubuntu/index.theme
<ricotz> seb128, jfyi http://i.imgur.com/yt1M9.jpg
<ronoc> that's what we are trying to figure out
<seb128> ronoc, shouldn't it consider all the /usr/share/sounds themes?
<ronoc> you would think so
<seb128> ricotz, yeah, buggy, the scrollbars shouldn't show as well
<diwic> ronoc, if you are in a session, logged in as a normal user, and execute the canberra-gtk-play command as written, will it work?
<diwic> as written in the patch
<ronoc> no, it can't find the sound
<ronoc> for me that is
<diwic> ronoc, hmm, that has been working for me since the start
<ronoc> oh
<Sweetshark> cjwatson: I just received a note from _rene_ that he would be happy about lintian fixes and would even make sure they land in debian 3.5.0-1 if they would arrive today.
<diwic> oh wait, not on this one
<ricotz> seb128, this is g-c-c 3.4 not sure if there were layout changes since 3.2 in this view which would cause this
<cjwatson> Sweetshark: synchronicity, I just filed it
<seb128> ricotz, oh, you merged 3.4? great, might spare me some work if I look at it
<ronoc> seb128, diwic -> /usr/bin/canberra-gtk-play --id=\"system-ready\" --description=\"Ubuntu System Ready\"
<ronoc> Failed to play sound: File or data not found
<Sweetshark> cjwatson: excellent!
<cjwatson> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=659867
<ubot2`> Debian bug 659867 in libreoffice-common "libreoffice-common: use Pre-Depends rather than 'dpkg-maintscript-helper supports' guards" [Wishlist,Open]
<seb128> ronoc, same here
 * ronoc checks canberra docs
 * diwic goes to try to understand why that works here
<seb128> ronoc, interesting
<seb128> ronoc, $ strace -f /usr/bin/canberra-gtk-play --id=\"system-ready\" --description=\"Ubuntu System Ready\" 2>&1 | grep sounds
<ronoc> diwic, the ini file ?
<seb128> [pid 29462] stat64("/usr/share/ubuntu/sounds", 0xbfeb0a8c) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
<seb128> ronoc, seems like it looks in the wrong dir
<seb128> i.e <theme>/sound
<seb128> and we have sounds/<themes>
<seb128> I guess ubuntu-sounds package should be fixed
<diwic> seb128, very interesting, let me look in libcanberra
<diwic> seb128, although libcanberra has caches and stuff so the stat might not be really reliable
<seb128> ok
<ronoc> seb128, hmmm
<ronoc> surely that would break for the other themes on ubuntu
<seb128> ronoc, diwic: need to go for lunch but I can have a look in half an hour
<seb128> will read the scrollback
<seb128> bbiab
<ronoc> seb128, cool
<ricotz> seb128, i think the pulseaudio dependency for g-c-c should be bumped to 1.1
<ricotz> the sound-nua applet uses some newer things of it
<ronoc> ricotz, thanks, well spotted
<ricotz> ronoc, i more likely ran into it on oneiric ;)
<ronoc> ricotz, aye that would flag the api delta alright
<ricotz> seb128, btw is gnome-session 3.4 on the way too now?
<seb128> ricotz, not from me, jbicha or you are free to work on it, I didn't spot anything interesting which wanted to make me want to do the work
<seb128> ricotz, thanks for the pulseaudio version notice
<seb128> ricotz, diwic: did you figure something?
<Sweetshark> jasoncwarner_: http://www.libreoffice.org/download/3-5-new-features-and-fixes/ yay!
<diwic> seb128, well, it has started to work on all my machines now, so difficult for me to troubleshoot :-(
<ricotz> seb128, gnome-session in my staging ppa too
<seb128> diwic, ok, I will have a look
<seb128> ricotz, then feel free to submit a merge request for it ;-)
<seb128> ricotz, I'm not interested enough that I will bother grabbing it from there but if there is a proper merge request I will review it
<ricotz> seb128, i see ;)
<seb128> ricotz, other try to talk to jbicha about it
<ricotz> seb128, also is there some interest to get GJS into main
<seb128> oh, for what?
<ricotz> seb128, it would be a benefit for e.g libpeas
<seb128> I'm sure chrisccoulson will like that :p
<diwic> seb128, I've just noticed that conor's machine might look for sound theme "__custom"  instead of "ubuntu", but not sure
<seb128> diwic, where did you notice that?
<seb128> (to see if mine is the same)
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, go for it :)
<diwic> seb128, try hexdump -C ~/.cache/event-sound...long-file-name
<diwic> seb128, do you know where we set gtk-sound-theme-name=ubuntu in the normal session?
<seb128> diwic, we don't
<diwic> ehh
<seb128> diwic, we hate sound effects and basically made sure we wouldn't have any sound by default
<seb128> (half joking)
<seb128> diwic, ok, I'm lying, http://launchpadlibrarian.net/79299184/libcanberra_0.28-0ubuntu7_0.28-0ubuntu8.diff.gz
<seb128> we set org.gnome.desktop.sound theme-name to "ubuntu" in gsettings
<seb128> which should be picked and applied by gnome-settings-daemon
<seb128> diwic, we used to do that
<seb128>  we set org.gnome.desktop.sound theme-name to "ubuntu" in gsettings
<seb128> ups
<seb128> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/65537498/libcanberra_0.28-0ubuntu1_0.28-0ubuntu2.diff.gz
<diwic> seb128, can that be read out of gconftool-2 or is that something completely different?
<seb128> diwic, gsettings get org.gnome.desktop.sound theme-name
<seb128> it's a different db
<seb128> superseeding gconf
<seb128> gsettings is the command line to interact with it
<BigWhale> my launcher randomly started adding new icons of currently running programs
<BigWhale> perhaps I should restart unity after I upgraded
<diwic> seb128, ok, thanks. ronoc, does " gsettings get org.gnome.desktop.sound theme-name" give 'ubuntu' on your system as well?
<seb128> diwic, $ gsettings get org.gnome.desktop.sound theme-name
<seb128> 'freedesktop'
<seb128> on mine
<diwic> hum
<seb128> $ gsettings set org.gnome.desktop.sound theme-name 'ubuntu'
<seb128> $
<seb128> diwic, then it works
 * ronoc tries
<seb128> though I had to go through some oops
<ronoc> okay i get '__custom'
<seb128> the canberra command would show as muted in level in the applications tab of the sound capplet
<seb128> ronoc, try the set command
<ronoc> ok now all good
<ronoc> now to try to the greeter
<ronoc> diwic, seb128 bingo
<ronoc> working
<seb128> weird
<seb128> why would the greeter follow some setting from your user?
<diwic> ronoc, goodie goodie, the question is who goes around and changes the gsettings database
<seb128> or do you --test-mode with your user?
<ronoc> seb128, yes
<ronoc> i can try from the proper greeter
<ronoc> but I have tried this already and it won't work
<ronoc> so i suppose at least we have identified the issue
<diwic> seb128, can we query the gsettings database as the lightdm user somehow?
<seb128> diwic, dunno for ronoc, but for me it's gnome-control-center
<ronoc> seb128, ?
<seb128> diwic, run the sound capplet and change the "sound effect" value and you get the key set to "freedesktop"
<seb128> dunno how ronoc got __custom though
<seb128> I though g-c-c does it
<seb128> though->doubt
<seb128> ronoc, ^
<diwic> maybe conor tested around with a custom theme? :-)
<ronoc> diwic, nope never did seriously
<ronoc> i don't know how that happened
<seb128> diwic, ronoc: for lightdm? I guess sudo -u lightdm -c 'gsettings...'?
<seb128> or similar
<ronoc> aha
<czajkowski> c
<ronoc> yes
<ronoc> ok restart to test
<diwic> seb128, thanks, well mine returns 'ubuntu' in that case as well
<seb128> diwic, ok, I will try to debug it this afternoon, I changed the value from "default" to "glass" and back to "default"
<seb128> diwic, did you try to change and set back "default"? maybe they hardcode default to be freedesktop?
<seb128> looking...
<diwic> seb128, bingo
<diwic> now mine's 'freedesktop' also
<seb128> ah ah
<seb128> sound-theme-file-utils.c
<seb128> #define CUSTOM_THEME_NAME       "__custom"
<seb128> so I guess that explains ronoc's one
<diwic> seb128, so the gsettings db is user-wide rather than system-wide, correct?
<seb128> diwic, yes
<diwic> so even if I change mine that would not affect lightdm IMO
<seb128> correct
<diwic> but the lightdm does not have a settings manager so it needs /etc/gtk-3.0/settings.ini anyway.
<seb128> it has the settings manager, well unity-greeter has
<seb128> lightdm-gtk-greeter doesn't
<seb128> diwic, ok, gvc-sound-theme-chooser.c in gnome-control-center has
<seb128> #define DEFAULT_THEME           "freedesktop"
<seb128> diwic, do you know if canberra or something has an api to give the name of the default theme?
<diwic> maybe we should patch it to let people choose between ubuntu and freedesktop
<seb128> the easiest solution is to patch it to be ubuntu under ubuntu
<diwic> seb128, no I don't think it has
<seb128> second option is to make it read the gsettings key
<seb128> third option is to teach canberra about it
<Sweetshark> pitti: would you give me a ping when the syncs and MIRs for reportbuilder are done?
<seb128> ronoc, wb
<seb128>  sound-theme-file-utils.c
<seb128>  #define CUSTOM_THEME_NAME       "__custom"
<seb128>  so I guess that explains ronoc's one
<seb128> ronoc, ^
<seb128> ronoc, also
<seb128>  diwic, ok, gvc-sound-theme-chooser.c in gnome-control-center has
<seb128>  #define DEFAULT_THEME           "freedesktop"
<ronoc> aah
<ronoc> sorry i was testing the startup
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> ronoc, you know that you don't need to log out right? just switch user that will start a new greeter (if you didn't make the sound to play only on first start)
<ronoc> seb128, yeah it works from the test mode
<seb128> ronoc, well anyway I will change the default to "ubuntu", you might want to do the same in your capplet codebase
<ronoc> seb128, i just want to test synchronized behaviour
<seb128> ronoc, i.e gvc-sound-theme-chooser.c #define DEFAULT_THEME
<ronoc> i.e. does pulse start up in time
<ronoc> seb128, will do
<ronoc> ok need lunch, biab
<seb128> ronoc, enjoy
<pitti> Sweetshark: I synced the missing packages, need to build/binNEW (handling)
<pitti> libxml-java pentaho-reporting-flow-engine liblayout librepository libformula libfonts-java
<pitti> Sweetshark: flute can go in main, it was there before
<pitti> Sweetshark: if there are other packages that you need, can you please open bug reports for them? "[MIR] packagename", and subscribe ubuntu-mir
<Sweetshark> pitti: k, willdo. Thanks for the syncs!
<Sweetshark> pitti: Ok, I will file MIRs for libbase-java and libsac-java, they seem to be missing from the list still ...
<m4n1sh> didrocks: uploaded. Thanks
<didrocks> m4n1sh: yw, thanks to you :)
<m4n1sh> is it in main?
<didrocks> m4n1sh: waiting for mterry so that we can MIR it
<didrocks> then, if he acks the MIR, I'll promote to main
<m4n1sh> so can you upload one more on 16th?
<didrocks> m4n1sh: with the unity release, it will be short, but yeah, any new features need to be uploaded before the 16th
<m4n1sh> some small changes left
<didrocks> m4n1sh: then, it's all bug fixes
<m4n1sh> before or on 16th?
<m4n1sh> 16th inclusive? or exclusive?
<m4n1sh> before 16th there are features
<didrocks> m4n1sh: before 16th, the upload need to be done on the 16th, not sure about the freeze so better to plan on 15th
<Laney> 21:00 UTC
<didrocks> ah thanks Laney :)
<m4n1sh> one is the diagnostics tab
<Laney> :-)
<m4n1sh> for enabling disabling apport reporting
<didrocks> m4n1sh: I'll have the unity release, so will be busy for sure, better to plan on 15th
<m4n1sh> okay
<m4n1sh> means tomorrow. tight schedule
<Sweetshark> pitti: bug 932061 and bug 932063
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932061 in sacjava "[MIR] sacjava" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/932061
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932063 in libbase "[MIR] libbase" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/932063
<didrocks> m4n1sh: indeed
<kenvandine_> BigWhale, thx for fixing that branch, i fell asleep before you pushed it :)
<dobey> pitti: the plan also includes splitting pyqt package up into multiple binaries, so we don't  have to install all of it, but only the bits we need
<pitti> dobey: *nod*
<kenvandine_> dobey, do you guys know how small you can make it?
<chrisccoulson> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=694594 is depressing :(
<ubot2`> Mozilla bug 694594 in JavaScript Engine "Crashes with gcc 4.4.3" [Critical,New: ]
<dobey> kenvandine_: well, with what i *thought* we needed, it would have made the qt bits we needed to add to the CD about 6MB
<pitti> seb128: finally rebooted to new g-s-d; my key to push a window to the background doesn't work any more
<pitti> seb128: otherwise it seems to work well
<seb128> pitti, did you reboot with the new compiz from yesterday before?
<seb128> pitti, the new compiz has known issue with keybindings
<seb128> pitti, I'm unsure it g-s-d to blame
<seb128> pitti, great, thanks
<BigWhale> kenvandine, as long you didn't wake up with a serious case of Qwertytis. :>
<kenvandine> haha
<jbicha> hi
<jbicha> the unity-greeter wallpaper is just showing the Ubuntu default and isn't matching the user wallpaper any more
<jbicha> I'm using seb128's g-s-d
<seb128> jbicha, hey
<seb128> jbicha, do you use an user background?
<seb128> jbicha, or one from the default set?
<jbicha> seb128: I just picked the blue striped thing GNOME uses as default since http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1925194 indicated something might not be working right
<seb128> jbicha, wfm
<seb128> jbicha, can you run d-feet go to org.freedesktop.Accounts
<ronoc> seb128, i still can't get any audio of lightdm when i test it in 'real life'
<ronoc> seb128, i copied the binary to /usr/sbin
<ronoc> according to 'which' that is where the system one is located
<seb128> jbicha, can you get your user id, .User and BackgroundFile?
<seb128> jbicha, what path does it has?
<seb128> ronoc, dunno, check the logs in /var/log/lightdm?
<ronoc> seb128, good idea
<jbicha> seb128: I connected to the session bus and I don't see org.freedesktop.Account
<jbicha> org.freedesktop.Accounts
<seb128> jbicha, it's the system bus
<seb128> jbicha, that's a system service, it lists all users
<jbicha> BackgroundFile=/usr/share/backgrounds/contest/background-1.xml
<jbicha> that's the train station one now
<seb128> jbicha, oh, it doesn't handle slideshows
<seb128> jbicha, .xml seems a slideshow, not an image
<seb128> jbicha, if you pick an image it should be working
<seb128> known bug
<BigWhale> Hmm, what or who is preventing more Unity customization settings to be added in the System Settings | Appearance | Behavior? Launcher hiding was a step in the right direction, but I think there are more things that could go in there.
<seb128> BigWhale, design approving those as beeing options we want to support and that useful enough to be in the ui
<jbicha> seb128: ok, that's it, the GNOME default background is a slideshow too
<seb128> BigWhale, we don't want the control center to turn into a ccsm for example
<BigWhale> ye gots... no
<BigWhale> bods
<BigWhale> gods ...
<BigWhale> If more than one monitor is present, I'd love to see the settings for edge stopping of the mouse.
<BigWhale> and couple of sliders for launcher/panel transparency.
<seb128> I don't think you will those in the normal ui
<seb128> most users don't want to change those stuff if they are set correctly
<seb128> jbicha, do you plan to do the mir for libwacom?
<seb128> jbicha, is g-s-d working fine for you otherwise?
<BigWhale> seb128, then who do I talk to, to tell them they are not set correctly? The edge thing, I don't care about the transparency really.
<seb128> BigWhale, open a bug on unity
<seb128> if there is not already one
<BigWhale> hehe ok :)
<seb128> but I know tweaks about those values and behaviour are still being discussed
<seb128> they are known to not be perfect yet
<jbicha> seb128: I don't have access to a wacom tablet, maybe tjaalton could do the mir?
<seb128> jbicha, well you don't need to test it to write a mir
<jbicha> lol
<seb128> it's likely the mir team doesn't have access to hardware either
<seb128> it's just about stating the need for it and getting a code review
<seb128> we can get others to test the g-s-d and g-c-c changes
<seb128> I would do it but I'm busy until ff and I would appreciate help on the paperwork if somebody wants to write the mir
<jbicha> yeah, busy week! I can do the mir today
<seb128> jbicha, thanks
<jbicha> speaking of mirs, I'm interested in bug 914631
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 914631 in mesa-demos "[mir] mesa-demos" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/914631
<seb128> jbicha, we discussed that at the platform rally with RAOF, basically he would prefer to not see those promoted, he said that source will probably ship other utilities and testing stuff that it's better to not officially support
<seb128> jbicha, would be better to teach g-c-c to do a direct call to the function that returns those infos itself, should be a small patch
<seb128> I will put that on the list for after ff
<jbicha> ok, thanks
<pitti> good night everyone!
<seb128> 'night pitti
<seb128> pitti, should I cover for the meeting if you have one?
<seb128> pitti, btw you didn't comment on the g-s-d update bug, do you want me to block on you to review that or just go ahead and decide either way?
<dobey> hrmm; i wonder if it's gtk, or the theme that is broken for me.
<kenvandine> dobey, how so?
<didrocks> mterry: good morning, can you handle the activity-log-manager MIR? shouldn't be too long to review :)
<dobey> kenvandine: bottom of text getting cut off for the title/artist/album label in rbox, text entries being tiny, and icons flaoting outside the box
<mterry> didrocks, sure!
<didrocks> mterry: thanks a lot!
<mterry> didrocks, this isn't marked for translation...
<didrocks> mterry: yeah, m4n1sh is already aware about it
<didrocks> mterry: will be fixed in the next release
<mterry> didrocks, hrm, that's a blocker for MIR
<mterry> didrocks, how soon?
<mterry> seb128, is g-c-c 3.3.5 working fine for you?
<seb128> mterry, g-s-d or g-c-c ?
<mterry> seb128, oh right
<mterry> seb128, nm, then  :)
<seb128> mterry, ?
<mterry> didrocks, is a-l-m working fine for you?  I run g-c-c, click on one of the (two!) Privacy icons and then g-c-c starts wigging out, constantly raising itself, launching jockey
<mterry> seb128, ^ I had the above problem, thought it might be your new g-c-c, but you were mucking with g-s-d instead
<seb128> ok, rright
<didrocks> mterry: for the UIF apparently
<didrocks> (sorry, on mumble)
<mterry> didrocks, np
<didrocks> mterry: oh raising itsel?
<mterry> didrocks, UIF?
<didrocks> UI Freeze
<mterry> ah
<didrocks> (meaning: next week)
<didrocks> mterry: you have two privacy icons?
<didrocks> mterry: what did you install?
<mterry> didrocks, yar.  -common and -control-center
<didrocks> that's what I have hereâ¦
<mterry> neither works
<didrocks> seb128: can you confirm?
<seb128> didrocks, what?
<didrocks> mterry: ensure you have activity-log-manager -common and -control-center
<didrocks> oupss seb128 ^
<seb128> ok
<didrocks> that install in g-c-c
<didrocks> grr, launch g-c- I meant
<didrocks> mterry: I'm really just getting on working entry here
<didrocks> (a lot of g_object_unref issue/warning, but that's knownÃ 
<didrocks> mterry: let's wait on seb128's feebdack, can you try to dpkg -L?
<seb128> didrocks, ok, installed, sorry got sidetracked talking
<seb128> didrocks, mterry: work fine here
<seb128> mterry, you debugged a first version from before the renaming locally to help m4n1sh iirc, any chance you let a .desktop or .so somewhere?
<didrocks> ahah
<m4n1sh> didrocks: back
<m4n1sh> so what is the issue
<m4n1sh> it isnt marked for translation now as there was hardly time for that
<didrocks> m4n1sh: yeah, it's kind of blocking the main inclusion as mterry told apart if you give a timeline for getting this fixed
<m4n1sh> mterry: I have one more release
<m4n1sh> which will include diagnostic tab from whoopsie (done by Evan)
<m4n1sh> plus translation
<m4n1sh> and a few UI fixes
<didrocks> m4n1sh: I added the "fix gtk warning" for seiflotfy as well
<m4n1sh> none of us have much idea why it is happening
<m4n1sh> probably need to take help from someone
<m4n1sh> I mean "neither" - me nor seif
<m4n1sh> didrocks: mterry is feb 19th or before fine for next release with translations, diagnostics and minor UI tweaks?
<didrocks> m4n1sh: didn't we discuss earlier about the feature freeze date ?
<m4n1sh> yes
<didrocks> so, this is after
<m4n1sh> didrocks: so translation is blocking?
<didrocks> let's see how mterry is confortable with it
<m4n1sh> for MIR
<m4n1sh> yes. I can do the translation thing. Let's see what is mterry reply
<didrocks> m4n1sh: can you please answer on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/activity-log-manager/+bug/928766 ?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 928766 in activity-log-manager "[MIR] activity-log-manager-control-center" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<m4n1sh> on it
<didrocks> m4n1sh: I think the crash was on 0.8, with 0.9 beeing a rewriteâ¦
<m4n1sh> yes
<didrocks> just answer that :)
<m4n1sh> done
<rickspencer3> Sweetshark, hey, libre office won't start with me
<rickspencer3> for* me
<rickspencer3> Sweetshark, any suggestions for how to debug this?
<mterry> sorry, was afk for a bit
<mterry> m4n1sh, didrocks: if there's a release later that's adding a new diagnostics tab, sounds like that would need an FFe anyway?  So why bother squeezing in before FF now?
<m4n1sh> mterry: because that diag thing is going to be included in main today
<m4n1sh> as it is just a matter of moving that UI from one app to another
<mterry> m4n1sh, whoopsie you mean?
<m4n1sh> yes
<m4n1sh> checked with cjwatson
<m4n1sh> he told it is not a FF blocker
<didrocks> m4n1sh: can you just do a release tomorrow with the translation fixes?
<didrocks> it seems easier than discussing for ever
<mterry> OK, so I'll try and get rid of any cruft I have on my side from testing m4n1sh's previous version, and test again.  As for translations, I can provisionally approve the MIR with the understanding that it will need to be demoted if we can't get it translatable by UIF
<mterry> didrocks, ^
<didrocks> then, tomorrow we push it to main
<didrocks> mterry: agreed
 * mterry goes and finds old files
<didrocks> mterry: yeah, I'm more worried about this personnaly, that you really have an issue that is not a local installation related :)
<mterry> didrocks, I'm sure it's local.  I did do a non-package install from before
<didrocks> *phew* :)
<m4n1sh> mterry: agree. If I cant get translations by UIF, it can be demoted
 * mterry has to log out to stop g-c-c from spawning over and over
<seb128> mterry, lucky you, I had to reboot yesterday because of lightdm :p
<seb128> mterry, interestingly if the greeter exits it's respawned endless, and the respawning trigger a vt switch, no way to go to a vt or anything
<m4n1sh> mterry: the issue you were facing was an old one. I fixed it
<m4n1sh> checking again in a VM
<mterry> aha, one "Privacy"
<m4n1sh> not the lock one
<m4n1sh> the right one, the one with yellow circle
<mterry> right
<m4n1sh> mterry: cant reproduce
<mterry> m4n1sh, I think it was just old alm.so being there
<m4n1sh> yes
<m4n1sh> even I did a make uninstall
<m4n1sh> to get rid of everything old
<mterry> m4n1sh, didrocks: approved
<m4n1sh> yaya
<m4n1sh> pizza on the way :)
<didrocks> m4n1sh: thanks, promoting :)
<didrocks> mterry: ^^
<didrocks> mterry: you take only pizza? how cheap you are :)
<m4n1sh> lol
<mterry> didrocks, with all the toppings though!
<didrocks> mterry: ah, that's totally different then :)
<cjwatson> I'd like to upload a gnome-screensaver fix for upgrades, but Robert seemed uncertain in bug 878836 about whether this could be uploaded yet.  Does anyone have current state on this?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 878836 in lightdm "Unity Greeter - Use Unity Greeter to fulfil lock screen as well as login functions" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/878836
<cjwatson> Should I back out Robert's change for the sake of an upload, and then put it back in bzr?
<mterry> cjwatson, I don't know the current status of his support for that
<cjwatson> It seems odd to have things in the branch listed in Vcs-Bzr that aren't uploadable
<seb128> cjwatson, well, it's easier to stack stuff there for an update coming soon that to create another vcs
<cjwatson> Sure, just awkward for those of us doing broad work across the archive
<seb128> cjwatson, do you need your fix in today? just commit to the vcs otherwise I will make sure it's uploaded before ff
<seb128> i.e tomorrow
<cjwatson> I already committed it a day or two ago; it's not a rush, I'm just trying to reduce the amount I need to keep track of
<seb128> cjwatson, ok, you can drop it from your list, we will do a gnome-screensaver upload this week anyway
<cjwatson> I can't delete it from the list I'm tracking because I don't have write access to lintian.ubuntuwire.org ;-)
<cjwatson> but OK, thanks
<Sweetshark> rickspencer3: Do you have a soffice.bin process running? Does running /usr/lib/libreoffice/program/soffice.bin give you an instance?
<seb128> cjwatson, yw, sorry for the issue with the vcs
<desrt> seb128: good g-s-d news today?
<seb128> desrt, it's in the ubuntu-desktop ppa for testing since yesterday, seems to work ok
<seb128> desrt, feel free to try it
<seb128> desrt, I will upload tomorrow if everything is still ok
<desrt> did you simply backport the keybinding stuff or did you add the patch?
<desrt> i had a thought about that....
<seb128> desrt, I reverted the commit for now
<desrt> it seems that you should not make it conditional based on the desktop environment
<desrt> rather, you should write to both all the time
<seb128> desrt, ff is this week I've no time for that, if others want to step in good, otherwise I will have a look next week
<mterry> charles, I'm trying your icon-policy branch and the 'charge' value doesn't seem to work?
<seb128> desrt, yeah, I didn't give it much thinking but that was an option as well
<desrt> of course, the question comes for where to read from to populate the initial values...
<seb128> desrt, I was just unsure if you wanted your unity keybindings to be the same as your GNOME ones
<desrt> seb128: i guess that's an interesting question
<desrt> seb128: but i bet 90% of people don't change their keybindings
<desrt> and another 90% of people don't run two desktops
<seb128> desrt, I think for next cycle we should drop the glue and have our own unity keybinding capplet
<desrt> so now we're only down to 1% of people who would notice the difference
<seb128> desrt, trying to sync cross wm doesn't seem needed nowadays
<desrt> yes.  maybe.
<seb128> desrt, but yeah, it's a corner case issue
<desrt> except now, strictly speaking, you're no longer syncing across WM
<seb128> desrt, I will give it some thinking but I'm not in an hurry for that ;-)
<desrt> the gsettings keys are from gsettings-desktop-schemas
<desrt> no more of this "steal stuff from metacity" approach
<seb128> right
<desrt> seb128: why does gnome-settings-daemon get held back by default?
<desrt> some new apt "don't upgrade from ppa by default" logic?
<pitti> seb128: g-s-d> I'd like a few more people to test it and give their thumbs up
<pitti> seb128: I have no objection against it, just afraid of regressions
 * didrocks waves good evening
<seb128> mdeslaur, you might be interested in bug #878836, I basically just broke screen locking on user switching using the indicator in precise, just letting you know
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 878836 in lightdm "Unity Greeter - Use Unity Greeter to fulfil lock screen as well as login functions" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/878836
<seb128> mdeslaur, robert_ancell and dx guys seems to agree that it shouldn't indicator-session calling gnome-screensaver, not sure what the right place is though
<mdeslaur> seb128: oh, wow, I though that was going to wait until P...so now I get to file a zillion bugs about screen locking misbehaving? :)
<mdeslaur> s/P/Q/
<seb128> mdeslaur, robert_ancell wanted to give it a shot see how it goes and it might be good to have it optional even if we roll back
<mdeslaur> seb128: ok, sounds good
<seb128> mdeslaur, it should be easy enough to go back to gnome-screensaver
<mterry> seb128, what does "nua" mean in sound-nua?
<seb128> kenvandine, ^
<seb128> mterry, dunno ;-)
<seb128> new something I guess :p
<greyback> mterry: "nua" from gaelic?
<mterry> greyback, does that mean new?
<greyback> mterry: yes
<greyback> pronounced "noo ah" where noo thymes with do
<greyback> *rhymes
<ronoc> mterry, hey did you see my merge proposal
<mterry> ronoc, for which?  maybe not
<kenvandine> seb128, ronoc named it... :)
<seb128> mterry, https://code.launchpad.net/~cjcurran/unity-greeter/play-synchronised-start-up-sound/+merge/93022
<ronoc> seb128, beat me to it
<mterry> ronoc, what does nua mean then?
<ronoc> mterry, Irish for 'new'
<mterry> ah, ok
<ronoc> it always goes after the noun
<mterry> ronoc, pulseaudio too!  unity-greeter grows up so fast
<seb128> kenvandine, ronoc: new indicator-session and sound uploaded
<ronoc> thanks seb128
<seb128> mterry, not pulse due, canberra! I'm sure it's to please the australian maintainer :p
<mterry> seb128, ooh, is there going to be a new -power?  I was about to distro-patch the 'icon-policy' patch, but don't want to duplicate effort
<ronoc> mterry, i know, it's the food it eats
<mterry> seb128, the patch also launches pa
<seb128> mterry, don't bother distro patching, ted said they would roll a bunch of tarballs tomorrow
<seb128> mterry, oh right, I didn't scroll down ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, new patch for g-c-c is coming
<seb128> kenvandine, graet
<seb128> great
<ronoc> kenvandine, cool
<kenvandine> ronoc, did you make changes to the old sound panel too?
<mterry> seb128, ok.  tedg: I'm testing the new icon-policy patch, and the label/icon in the panel don't seem to be updating as charge changes?  FYI
<ronoc> kenvandine, no shouldn't have
 * kenvandine is trying to weed out the quilt noise
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> didn't think so :)
<ronoc> i hope not at least
 * mterry is starting to agree that forking g-c-c is making some sense
<ronoc> +1
<chrisccoulson> g'ah, don't you just hate it when you start a build, go out to get some beer and then come back to find it failed
<seb128> mterry, not sure if I should ;-) or :-( on that
<seb128> chrisccoulson, give you a reason to go out for another beer? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<mterry> seb128, try :-S
<mterry> difficult maneuver in meat space though
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> just tried, I'm glad nobody is watching me
<kenvandine> seb128, g-c-c pushed, completely untested :)
<mterry> ronoc, why the read_cb bit?  you're spawning async anyway right?
<mterry> ready_cb I mean
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, will test after dinner
<mterry> ronoc, and why not spawn both apps at the same spot?
<broder> cyphermox: hey, congrats on core-dev. do you still need sponsorship for bug #528087?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 528087 in wpasupplicant "merge patch for segfault when using smartcards with NetworkManager" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/528087
<seb128> mterry, ronoc: btw I commented on the mr just giving my opinion
<cyphermox> broder: no, I wouldn't. you opened or where interested in that bug no?
<cyphermox> broder: I'd like a second opinion on it anyway, if you also feel it's safe, let's upload it
<ronoc> mterry, do we need want to leave a little bit of time to make sure pulse is ready
<broder> cyphermox: nope, not my bug. i can try to review it, though it looks subtle
<cyphermox> broder: ah, no I see
<mterry> ronoc, seems racy.  seb128's idea to use the API might make that logic more sane?
<broder> cyphermox: i can confirm that it matches an upstream commit :)
<cyphermox> right
<cyphermox> so not worried, I'll just go ahead and push it
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i definitely feel like drinking a lot of beer tonight ;)
<seb128> cyphermox, ok, got coredev, congrats!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you're next right? ;-)
<mterry> cyphermox, nice  :)
<cyphermox> thanks
<seb128> ok, that said dinner time
<seb128> bbiab
<mterry> Happy Valentine's Day all, btw.  I'm assuming that's US only, but still
<seb128> mterry, happy valentine's day
<chrisccoulson> mterry, i'm more looking forward to march 14th
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<seb128> mterry, I don't think it is us specific, France and Germany as well at least
<cyphermox> march 14th?
<seb128> us->US
<chrisccoulson> cyphermox, http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=March%2014th
<mterry> seb128, ah cool.  seems like such a fake holiday, I assumed it was regional  :)
<cyphermox> awesome!
<ronoc> mterry, I suppose it was easiest to spawn as opposed to test the vapis of canberra
<ronoc> mterry, although they look to be stable
<mterry> ronoc, :)  the raciness is worrisome though.  it'd be nice if canberra spawned pa as needed...
<mterry> ronoc, I'd see how reasonable the API is yeah
<ronoc> mterry, ok ill have a look in a bit
<ronoc> mterry, i need this in for FF though
<dobey> anyone on 32bit can test a branch of gwibber for me?
<dobey> actually, 3 on 32bit and 3 on 64bit would be perfect
<kenvandine> dobey, no crashes for me on 64b
<dobey> right
<kenvandine> dobey, i spin up a i386 VM pretty quickly
<dobey> kenvandine: can you try in it please?
<kenvandine> will do
<dobey> want to see a few results on each arch. seems like it might be an issue in python-gi or gtk perhaps :(
<tedg> mterry, can you mention that to charles :-)
<mterry> charles, I'm testing the new icon-policy patch, and the label/icon in the panel don't seem to be updating as charge changes?  FYI
<mterry> tedg, will that get to him?
<charles> mterry: that will get to me :)
<mterry> charles, yay!  :)
<charles> :)
<tedg> IRC, it's like the future.
<tedg> :-)
<mterry> tedg, charles: Someone's cutting a release of indicator-power tomorrow?
<charles> thanks very much for the report, I'll look at that now
 * mterry has a patch to toggle icon-policy ready to go once it's available in the archive
<tedg> mterry, Yes, today or tomorrow.  But since I seem to be unable to get the gtk2 version of libindicator to build I'm delayed :-/
<charles> tedg: like the future, but easier on bandwidth
<tedg> charles, <message><start>Remember</start> the <time>future</time> has <amount>infinite</amount> <value>bandwidth</value></message>
<seb128> mterry, you said holiday? it's a special day here but not an holiday ;-)
<seb128> mterry, i.e rather a commercial day
<kenvandine> haha
<desrt> http://people.freedesktop.org/~kay/f17.svg
<kenvandine> indeed... for us it is a hallmark holiday :)
<desrt> time to catch up, boys :)
<mterry> seb128, ah yeah.  Holiday in the US sense of special day.  Not a day off  ;)
<mterry> desrt, :)
<kenvandine> desrt, nice
 * desrt loves seeing stuff like this
<desrt> ubuntu pwns fedora at boot time
<desrt> fedora pwns back
<desrt> who will be the next contender?!
<BigWhale> this fails miserably ... run-parts: executing /etc/kernel/postinst.d/zz-update-grub 3.2.0-16-generic /boot/vmlinuz-3.2.0-16-generic
<BigWhale> :'(
<kenvandine> desrt, that isn't to a running desktop though is it?
<BigWhale> not fails it gets stuck
<desrt> no.  fully working multiuser text userspace, it seems
<rye> hm, gnome-character-map also has dark background
<kenvandine> desrt, ok, i'd like to see it to a full desktop :)
<kenvandine> my laptop was 9s last i looked
<kenvandine> damn compiz
<desrt> ubu or fedora?
<desrt> heh
<kenvandine> ubuntu
<desrt> 9s is pretty good for compiz
<desrt> ssd?
<kenvandine> indeed
<BigWhale> I used to have a Fedora ... then I figured, I don't really like to wear hats or caps or anything ... :>
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> BigWhale, ugh... you don't like to wear anything?
 * kenvandine hides
<BigWhale> hm
<Sarvatt> desrt: shouldn't you have linked http://people.freedesktop.org/~kay/bootchart-20120201-1621.svg which actually shows some userspace coming up?
 * BigWhale starts thinking how to get out of this mess :>
<kenvandine> oh, 30s now
<desrt> BigWhale: that looks like it was before the recent improvemnts
<kenvandine> the damn lazy loading of lenses regression
<desrt> erm.  Sarvatt , i mean
<seb128> desrt, that chart is only plumbing, that's not the slow part of boot ;-)
<kenvandine> i am still getting to lightdm in 3.5s
<dobey> kenvandine: compiz itself is really slow to start up for me
<seb128> dobey, is it? how slow?
<seb128> it takes 3 seconds on an atom cpu
<kenvandine> the lenses start, which fires gwibber-service and slows everything down here
<seb128> kenvandine, yes, "everything" is the word, included sh, gcc and ld!
<seb128> (still didn't look at why)
<kenvandine> after feature freeze :)
<dobey> seb128: i'm not sure how to get an accurate measurement of it. but logging into "classic gnome" was really slow with compiz and "classic gnome (no effects)" was pretty much instant log-in
<seb128> well, I guess a few seconds can feel really slow compared to no delay
 * desrt notes that all this wankery over 7s vs 10s boot time is pretty pointless when the damn BIOS screen still shows for 30s
<dobey> seb128: it might be faster now (or slower, now that i added a second monitor). not sure, and have enough other problems with multihead at the moment :(
<hallyn> oh no - why is my screen getting all messed up when i try to login now (new as of this morning's update)
<desrt> seb128: unity is having a better day today
<seb128> desrt, good ;-)
<seb128> desrt, I upgraded yesterday evening a bit before stopping the computer and never got your issues
<desrt> seb128: i still think it's ugly ;)
<seb128> desrt, geeks have no taste, that's fine ;-)
 * desrt considers taking it to the next level but backs off instead
<seb128> desrt, ;-)
<desrt> seb128: your mother is a lovely individual and she raised a fine young man
<seb128> lol
<seb128> desrt, don't worry, I'm sure I will pay for that another day ;-)
<seb128> or that you will make it even one way or the other ;-)
<desrt> seb128: i'm getting gnome-shell 3.4 in precise.  you get to be on my good list today :)
<seb128> hehe
<desrt> probably ricotz's too, for that matter
<seb128> don't forget jbicha as well
<ricotz> seb128, could you look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/clutter-1.0/+bug/932311
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932311 in clutter-1.0 "Sync clutter-1.0 1.8.4-1 (main) from Debian testing (main)" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> ricotz, synced
<ricotz> seb128, thanks!
<seb128> ricotz, thank you ;-)
<seb128> mterry, can I get you to look at bug #932307?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932307 in libwacom "[mir] libwacom" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/932307
<seb128> jbicha, thanks for writting it ;-)
<mterry> seb128, looking
<seb128> mterry, it's a requirement for my bug #931656
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 931656 in gnome-settings-daemon "let's try to update gsd to the current unstable version" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931656
<seb128> mterry, which ideally I would like to upload tomorrow if nobody finds any blocker issue or reason to not do it
<mterry> seb128, you mean promote tomorrow?
<seb128> mterry, I would like to upload g-s-d which build-depends on libwacom
<mterry> seb128, ah right, of cours
<kenvandine> seb128, do you know if anyone has been getting crashes in i386 that seem to be related to theme or drawing?
<kenvandine> i386 only?
<kenvandine> perhaps it is only happening in python-gi
<kenvandine> seb128, the gtk3 gwibber-accounts is very crashy on i386
<kenvandine> *** glibc detected *** /usr/bin/python: corrupted double-linked list: 0x08b25568 ***
<kenvandine> but we can't get it to crash on amd64
<kenvandine> dobey is running it in valgrind now
<dobey> trying to
<seb128> kenvandine, nothing that I know about
<dobey> man, this valgrind log is crazy :(
<kklimonda> hey, I have a small problem - transmission in 10.04 can't update its blocklist because project no longer hosts the level1 file used for that. I could switch to another level1 file, but it may as well get deleted at some point. Should I just go for it, or ask some ubuntu admins to provide me with a place I can put it in?
<seb128> kklimonda, try asking on #ubuntu-devel but you should probably do both
<seb128> kklimonda, get a fix with the change and try to get the admins to provide one
<seb128> kklimonda, it's likely that the admin stuff might take a while so you shouldn't block on it
<kklimonda> right
<kklimonda> seb128: maybe I could use http://people.ubuntu.com/~kklimonda for now (or even until lucid reaches EOL, it's not that long)
<seb128> seems like not a good idea to me
<seb128> try asking on #ubuntu-devel
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso` RAOF bryceh meeting reminder. please make sure the wiki is updated and if you have agenda items, they are listed there... https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-02-14
<kklimonda> ah, it seems I can't really point transmission to just any url anyway as all blocklists are gzipped, and 10.04 version doesn't know how to unpack them.
<hallyn> keyboard settings -> shortcuts still shows my shortcuts (ctrl-alt-q through r for switch to desktops 5-8), but they're not working :(
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, can give you status on the multimonitor spec now if interested?
<robert_ancell> mterry, still here?
<mterry> robert_ancell, about to head ot
<mterry> robert_ancell, something quick?
<robert_ancell> mterry, sure, just saying yes please to doing the messaging indicator stuff.  I'll confirm in the email
<mterry> robert_ancell, ok, can push that in tomorrow.  I'll add a XHasMessages property on accountsservice, k?
<robert_ancell> ok
<mterry> (just so I don't block you on the name)
<robert_ancell> I'll do the lightdm changes assuming that and make a release today
<mterry> cool
<seb128> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> seb128, hello
<TheMuso`> Grrr the new numpad stuff for compiz conflicts with Orca's flat review commands. :S
<robert_ancell> RAOF, do you know much about g-s-d and xrandr?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Yeah, a bit.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, so, I've enabled the xrandr plugin in the greeter, and I get the following behaviour:
<robert_ancell> If the external monitor is already plugged in, then the screens get mirrored
<robert_ancell> If I plug in the monitor after starting, then the second screen is placed, but the monitor screen has the original common resolution that was used for the mirroring
<robert_ancell> afaict I'm using the default g-s-d settings, is there anything I need to enable to make it do the "place them in the best locations"?
<RAOF> No, I don't believe so.
<robert_ancell> (and is there another g-s-d plugin that needs to be enabled?)
<RAOF> Again, I don't think so.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, could I get you to confirm the behaviour?
<broder> robert_ancell: that's consistent with my understanding of how the xrandr plugin behaves
<RAOF> Yeah, certainly.
<robert_ancell> broder, the observed behaviour?
<broder> yes
<robert_ancell> broder, how does the desktop make the better decisions?
<broder> robert_ancell: i'm not convinced it does, in general
<RAOF> I thought it probed on startup
<robert_ancell> broder, when I'm logged into Unity/GNOME Shell I have both monitors placed correctly, but perhaps I've set that in the settings at some point>?
<robert_ancell> I'll try a guest account
<broder> robert_ancell: let me go re-skim the source
<RAOF> Ah, right, it does probe on startup, but it only changes things if it sees an existing configuration.
<RAOF> (ie: you've had this monitor plugged in and spanned before)
<broder> uh, looks like there's a gsettings flag to change what it does at startup with multiple monitors
<bryceh> robert_ancell, with a default install, g-s-d will give you mirrored by default
<broder> ...and your choices are accept the layout X handed you, clone, or a spanning layout with just the non-builtin displays
<broder> quality
<robert_ancell> broder, damn, you're completely right.  guest session does exactly the same thing
<broder> seems like a vendor patch to plugins/xrandr/gsd-xrandr-manager.c:apply_default_boot_configuration to add a GSD_XRANDR_BOOT_BEHAVIOR_DO_EXTEND would be straightforward
<broder> robert_ancell: (i assume that extended layout is your goal?)
<robert_ancell> broder, well, I was just checking that I'd implemented it right in the greeter, but to match the multi monitor spec we should be doing extended layout by default (both in the greeter and the session) as long as it's not a projector
<bryceh> robert_ancell, there used to be a button on the config tool "set for all users" which would store monitors.xml in a system location.  If we still had that, then lightdm could simply use that as its settings file
<broder> bryceh: but there's no way to write a generic monitors.xml, just one for specific vendor/device ids
<robert_ancell> bryceh, does that still work today?  Because if we deliver 12.04 with just the old behaviour we need to let people know how to set the greeter setup to something normal
<robert_ancell> (there is no greeter display settings UI)
<bryceh> broder, yep that's right
<bryceh> robert_ancell, it doesn't still work today.  I don't know when/why that was removed.
<broder> the code for it is still in g-s-d, but there's nothing that writes out the global config file
<RAOF> That's odd :)
<bryceh> /etc/gnome-settings-daemon/xrandr/monitors.xml
<bryceh> that's where it used to live I think
<robert_ancell> does anyone know what the plan is for 12.04 for default monitor layout?
<broder> robert_ancell: i don't think you can build the spec without some significant rearchitecture of the xrandr plugin. i'm strongly of the opinion that the plugin *needs* that significant rearchitecture
<robert_ancell> I'll deliver the greeter changes, but they wont be visible if the default is to mirror.  I think "match the desktop" is the correct behaviour
<bryceh> robert_ancell, yes it's in the multi monitor spec
<broder> unfortunately, i've been stuck spouting opinions for the last year and a half without having time to implement them :-/
<robert_ancell> bryceh, I mean "is that getting delivered for 12.04"
<robert_ancell> broder, :(
<bryceh> robert_ancell, ah, right not sure there
<bryceh> robert_ancell, X sets mirrored as the default, and afaik we're staying with that
<RAOF> I think Design thinks that some of it is landing for 12.04
<bryceh> but the spec calls for extended, but it has to be done at the dm layer
<robert_ancell> dm?
<bryceh> display manager or session
<robert_ancell> session I'm hoping...  Not sure what the dm could do here to help
<RAOF> DM could default to extended.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, we can do that via a flag?
<robert_ancell> and g-s-d honors the default?
<RAOF> I'm not sure.  You could certainly set it manually.
<seb128> robert_ancell, g-s-d has a gsettings key for the default
<seb128> we set it to "follow xorg"
<seb128>     <key name="default-monitors-setup" enum="org.gnome.settings-daemon.GsdXrandrBootBehaviour">
<seb128>       <default>'do-nothing'</default>
<seb128>       <_summary>Whether to turn off specific monitors after boot</_summary>
<seb128>       <_description>'clone' will display the same thing on all monitors, 'dock' will switch off the internal monitor, 'do-nothing' will use the default Xorg behaviour (extend the desktop in recent versions)</_description>
<seb128> robert_ancell, that's org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.xrandr default-monitors-setup
<RAOF> Sadly, that's lying about Xorg's default behaviour.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, nice :)
<RAOF> Although I think that *is* the default behaviour in fedora
<robert_ancell> so, do we think we can switch to extend in Ubuntu by 12.04?  Are there any risks to doing that?
<seb128> RAOF, I think pitti wrote the patch when they started enforcing setting something by default (it was taking boot time)
<broder> you could easily do something like http://paste.ubuntu.com/842345/ and then create an "extend" option for that gsettings key
<seb128> RAOF, I'm pretty sure it's meant to not be applying any change when set this way, so default to what xorg is doing
<RAOF> seb128: Yeah, that matches with my memory.
<seb128> RAOF, that seems confirmed by the fact that current lightdm doesn't use xrandr and use mirror
<robert_ancell> broder, it's that easy?
<broder> robert_ancell: well, seb128's boot concerns are probably legitimate
<RAOF> Yeah, that'd be about right.
<broder> if there is a boot time concern, and we want extend-by-default, could we make X do it instead?
<broder> steal whatever fedora is doing to make that happen?
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, any opinions on this ^^^  i.e. how important is extend behaviour?  More important than boot time?
<broder> RAOF: how *is* fedora doing extend-by-default? is it a config flag? patch?
<RAOF> broder: Patch, IIRC.
 * RAOF is checking fedora git now.
<RAOF> Man, everything would be so much simpler if we could break Xserver ABI at will ;)
<RAOF> Hm.  Ok, so fedora's patch is http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/gitweb/?p=xorg-x11-server.git;a=blob;f=xserver-1.6.99-right-of.patch;h=a0c9e7f64b98a091f64faaf5a8a432e2122e25f9;hb=HEAD which has the *tiny* downside that it seems to break ABI.
<bryceh> heh
<broder> we could force it on drivers instead of giving them a choice :)
<RAOF> Hm.  And it *is* applied to their server.  You can run the nvidia binary drivers on Fedora, right?
<seb128> RAOF, how does it break abi? they reduced the padding by one and added one member?
<RAOF> Where do they reduce the padding?  Oh, there.
<RAOF> Yeah, that'd work.
<seb128> ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, so it reads what was a padding octet?  Hope everyone zeroed those out...
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, do i start looking at assembler tonight, or wait until tomorrow morning?
<RAOF> They're documented as being reserved for minor ABI bumps, but that's not exactly enforcable :)
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF what is your estimate on impact in boottime for extend?
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF:  and how long to implement? do you think we could test it out and see impact rather quickly?
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell and I are talkign and we agree, this is really nice for users, though need to know tradeoffs
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: I'm not sure what the boot-time impact would be; worst case, I think it'd on the order of 5 seconds.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, will you hit that post login screen anyway?
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: and we would likely pay that price elsewhere anyway, right?
<robert_ancell> (assuming you've manually configured the screens to extend)
<RAOF> That's likely, yes.
<broder> theoretically, this could improve boot time, right? if we were lucky, it might eliminate a plymouth -> lightdm flicker if you have multiple displays plugged in
<RAOF> Right.
<broder> (if we do it in the x server and not g-s-d)
<RAOF> If we do it in the X server we might just want to give the KMS drivers the option of not having X touch the modes they've already set.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF robert_ancell sounds to me like we should probably give this a go. would you guys agree? at least to see what boot speed regression would be in practice...the benefits of doing it seem high from a user perspective
<RAOF> Hm.  We'd probably need to do that in addition to the default-to-spanned, so we also catch nvidia and fglrx.
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: It seems like a good idea to me.  We can always do some testing.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: cool, thanks...let's make some users happy!
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh and RAOF fyi on that mouse scrolling thing I mentioned. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg/+bug/932439
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932439 in xorg "Horizontal scrolling feels backwards" [Undecided,New]
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, got it, will review and follow up shortly
<jasoncwarner_> thanks, dude :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-02-15
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: Did you do the evtest run I suggested?
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: oops...I didn't...doing it now
<RAOF> Make sure you note which horizontal direction corresponds to which button-press in evtest (ie: do something like move all left, then all right, and say that on the bug âº)
<Sweetshark> jasoncwarner_: ping?
<charles> Transmission 2.50 has been released... it's not on the website yet because we're still waiting on localizations on the Mac side, but I wanted to make sure the tarball was out before Precise's feature freeze
<charles> so: http://download-origin.transmissionbt.com/files/transmission-2.50.tar.xz
<TheMuso`> Oh wow, now unity-greeter deals with the lock screen. Now it just needs to respect my monitor config, which is what was being talked about earlier today I guess.
<jbicha> charles: thank you
<RAOF> TheMuso`: Yeah, just noticed that :)
<jbicha> RAOF: is it possible to sync from Debian's new queue?
<RAOF> jbicha: No.  IIRC, it's not possible to pull packages *out* of the new queue unless you're an ftp-master, as packages in NEW are not yet confirmed to be redistributable.
<jbicha> ok, I guess I'll wait a bit longer...
<jbicha> hmm, I wasn't expecting this: http://iloveubuntu.net/redesigned-nautilus-34-probably-land-precise-pangolin-next-weeks
<jbicha> I wonder what the source is for that, since I don't see those changes in git
<kenvandine> jbicha, they also wrote that google+ plugin for gwibber was likely to land in time for 12.04
<kenvandine> all i did was push a branch that handles authorization
<jbicha> haha
<kenvandine> stalkers :)
<kenvandine> no where near capable of doing anything useful, google doesn't even provide a useful API yet :)
<broder> that post reads like rampant speculation and wishful thinking
<kenvandine> indeed
<kenvandine> they are trying to get the scoop on everyone else
<kenvandine> by guessing
<jbicha> oh good, GNOME UI Freeze is next week
<DBO> kenvandine, uhhh has the lock screen changed dramatically recently?
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> unity-greeter
<DBO> kenvandine, it totally fucks with nvidia drivers
<kenvandine> oh?
<kenvandine> that isn't cool
<DBO> yeah like it now takes it 30+ seconds to come out of the lock screen
 * kenvandine hugs intel :)
<DBO> is it possible for me to get the old lock screen back
<DBO> or disable it
<kenvandine> DBO, no idea really, last i heard that feature might not make it
<kenvandine> and today i noticed i had it
<kenvandine> that is all i know
<DBO> can I disable teh lock screen all together?
<DBO> so I dont walk away for 5 minutes and then come back and have to wait
<kenvandine> yeah
<RAOF> Yeah, turn off the screen lock :)
<kenvandine> hey RAOF
<DBO> ah found it
<DBO> RAOF, you experiencing what I just described at all?
<DBO> RAOF, do you know anything about how its implemented or why its so different?
<RAOF> DBO: It's doing a VT switch
<DBO> it feels like the GPU is doing a full out memory swap
<RAOF> DBO: So nvidia, being the mad bastard that it is, hates you.
<kenvandine> vt switch should be fast as hell
<DBO> its not
<RAOF> Not on nvidia
 * kenvandine is glad he doesn't understand X
<kenvandine> :)
<RAOF> kenvandine: If what I'm hacking on right now works out, vt switches (on intel, radeon, nouveau) should be entirely instantaneous.
<DBO> why are we doing a VT switches at all?
<RAOF> Because we're switching back to the greeter.
<DBO> why?
<DBO> that *really* limits what we can do with it
<kenvandine> that is handling the lock
<kenvandine> that has been the plan since we decided to use lightdm
<RAOF> A number of reasons - (a) the login process is then the same, (b) it's trivial to switch to a different user, (c) it's more secure.
<DBO> (d) it means we will never be able to transition between the log in screen and the desktop
<DBO> further
<DBO> it will always be slow as hell on nvidia
<DBO> we need a way to use the old lock screen for nivdia users
<robert_ancell> d) we need wayland...
<RAOF> Which also doesn't have a way for nvidia to play, but whatever :)
<DBO> right no, fucking over nvidia is not acceptable
<robert_ancell> RAOF, was nvidia screwed even if the displays were set to the same modes?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Dunno
<RAOF> I don't think we're going to be able to enforce that constraint anyway.
<robert_ancell> k
<RAOF> X sets a mode during startup, and we can't change nvidia to read out the mode that was previously set.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, so does starting two nvidia X servers cause a mode switch or do they recognise they've already set the video mode
<DBO> robert_ancell, mode switch
<DBO> I can see it doing it
<robert_ancell> DBO, so you started an empty X server, then from that started a second one?
<DBO> what?
<DBO> no when I log in
<DBO> I can see it mode switch
<DBO> my monitor pops information about what mode its in
<RAOF> Do you have more than one display?
<DBO> yes
<robert_ancell> DBO, yes, but that could be because the greeter isn't running the same mode as the session
<RAOF> I think what robert is asking about is - if you have your session, and a guest session with the same monitor configuration, does switching between them imply a modeset.
<DBO> robert_ancell, I have saved my xconfig to the xorg.conf if that helps
<robert_ancell> that would do it
<robert_ancell> only works if you haven't configured your user from the system defaults
<DBO> ?
<DBO> well let me put it this way:
<DBO> its not wholly correct to say VT switch is the whole problem
<DBO> if I switch from X to VT1
<DBO> it takes about 3 seconds
<DBO> and is relatively painless
<DBO> switching back also takes about 3 seconds
<DBO> lightdm switching however
<DBO> that takes 30+ seconds
<DBO> and often causes compiz to crash inside the nvidia driver
<DBO> robert_ancell, ^^
<robert_ancell> yup
<DBO> its very similar to the delay nvidia incurs when switching resolutions
<DBO> I would guess its probably the same
<RAOF> And given that it *is* switching resolutions...
<RAOF> Oh, it's not; you've encoded that stuff in xorg.conf.
<DBO> yeah
<DBO> whatever is going on though
<DBO> is BAD juju
<DBO> it breaks the experience
<DBO> there should be testing around this :/
<DBO> RAOF, you here?
<RAOF> Yup.
<DBO> I want to fix this nivida thing once and for all
<DBO> I dont understand why we get stuck in ioctl
<RAOF> Oh, the slowness on modechange.
<DBO> I dont understand why it only happens the first time
<DBO> (except lightdm, that does it every time)
<DBO> I have 1.5GB of vram
<DBO> so even if that was *full*
<DBO> it wouldn't take 30 seconds to completely swap that out
<RAOF> Sorry about that; I accidentally unplugged my router.
<RAOF> DBO: Yeah, 30 seconds seems like a long time.  Unless it's paging to disc :)
<DBO> not likely
<DBO> I have 16GB of ram
<RAOF> :)
 * RAOF shall make a coffee, upgrade an nvidia netbook, and ponder.
<DBO> I have a test program that is relatively minimal
<DBO> it makes it happen on nvidia
<DBO> even with metacity
<DBO> it just creates 40 800x800 textures with 20 FBOs
<DBO> and binds them all and paints them
<DBO> *eventually* the damn thing recovers
<DBO> but it takes it about a minute
<pitti> Good morning
<robert_ancell> pitti, are you a dbus master?
<pitti> robert_ancell: I'm using the API and the CLI tool; I guess "apprentice" might be right? :-)
<robert_ancell> pitti, I'm trying to get the uid of a dbus caller.  It seems a lot harder than it should be
<pitti> hmm, how do I get the window menu these days?
<pitti> robert_ancell: hang on, I'll look for example code; some projects I work on use this
<robert_ancell> pitti, oh good.  The internet seems to have nothing.  I'm looking to policykit to work it out
<pitti> yes, that project would certainly need  to do that
<RAOF> robert_ancell: There's a libdbus call - uid_for_caller, right?
<robert_ancell> I'm calling org.freedesktop.DBus.GetConnectionUnixUser  - RAOF, I guess that is the same thing, and it's just not exposed in gdbus?
<robert_ancell> there's lots of decoy methods in gbus that sound like the right sort of thing but they don't seem to be any help
<pitti> yes, that sounds right
<pitti> robert_ancell: that's what PK does, anyway
<pitti> robert_ancell: you can call this through gdbus just fine?
<DBO> RAOF, do you want the test program?
<robert_ancell> pitt, yes, It's just finding any information that that is the correct method
<pitti> robert_ancell: http://paste.ubuntu.com/842637/
<RAOF> http://dbus.freedesktop.org/doc/api/html/group__DBusBus.html#ga24d782c710f3d82caf1b1ed582dcf474
<RAOF> robert_ancell: ^^^
<robert_ancell> RAOF, ta
<RAOF> DBO: Yes, please
<robert_ancell> pitti, ta also
<DBO> RAOF, http://paste.ubuntu.com/842639/
<RAOF> DBO: And that takes ages the first time after a modechange?
<DBO> RAOF, AGES
<DBO> RAOF, it screws up the GPU so bad metacity stops painting
<DBO> and so does everything else
<RAOF> Whee!
<DBO> you just get a bunch of white for a long time
<robert_ancell> pitti, and the trick is to use g_dbus_method_invocation_get_sender () I think
<RAOF> DBO: And I can build that with g++ $(pkg-config --libs nux), right?
<DBO> RAOF, I think so yeah
<DBO> RAOF, honestly there is a framebufferobject.cpp in the nux gputests/
<DBO> I just modified it a bit
<DBO> to you know
<DBO> make it evil
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> Well, intel doesn't like it very much, but is perfectly happy to draw it.
<DBO> I imagine its eating all of your vram
<RAOF> I have 16GB of vram!
<DBO> no
<DBO> you have 16GB of system ram
<DBO> that your driver can map
<RAOF> Minus what the system is using, of course :)
<DBO> but its freaking slow
<RAOF> Right.
<DBO> how unhappy is it?
<RAOF> It slows down unity a bit.
<DBO> yeah
<DBO> there is no rate limiter on this
<RAOF> Alt tab isn't quite so responsive.
<DBO> its just rendering as fast as it freaking can
<DBO> which is rebinding 40 textures each frame
<DBO> it eats all your GPU
<RAOF> The window doesn't much like being dragged, either.
<DBO> when you do that it resets the textures
<RAOF> But it handles it at > 1/sec
<DBO> I meant to disable that
<DBO> what?
<RAOF> -
<RAOF> Dragging it is really slow.
<RAOF> *really* slow; unity draw the move at ~1fps
<DBO> here
<RAOF> But just having it up and visible is actually barely noticable
<DBO> http://paste.ubuntu.com/842647/
<DBO> that fixes the dragging slowness
<RAOF> Oh, maybe the alt-tab switcher is 15fps when rendered over the top of it.
<DBO> thats probably due to the damage events
<RAOF> Sandybridge doesn't fall over on your fbo test.
<DBO> nope
<DBO> nvidia only
<pitti> robert_ancell: ah, so you landed the lock screen stuff after all .. did you figure out how to tell lightdm to not change XRandR?
<robert_ancell> pitti, no, I think RAOF says it might not be possible
<DBO> pitti, it broke everyone using nvidia blob :/
<pitti> eek
<pitti> can we please revert this then?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Oh, no.  It's entirely possible to tell lightdm not to change XRandR.
<RAOF> It's just not possible to tell *nvidia* not to modeset.
<RAOF> That was all I was promising from the beginning - not modesetting on kms drivers.
<pitti> changing VTs is bad enough and already breaks nvidia, but changing xrandr modes will make it suck for all other drivers using more than one screen
<pitti> so far people on these drivers just learned the hard way to not do user switching
<RAOF> Yeah, we can make it work for !nvidia, !fglrx.
<pitti> but now this forces it upon them
<DBO> pitti, this is about more than just user switching
<robert_ancell> pitti, I have to run out for about 1-1.5 hours, but will be back after that
<DBO> my lock screen now takes 30+ seconds to get out of
<pitti> DBO: yes, I know; that's the xrandr part
<DBO> no
<DBO> I have my xorg.conf hardcoded
<pitti> I'm afraid we simply don't yet have the technology to do this
<pitti> (for locking screen, I mean)
<pitti> robert_ancell: ok, thanks
<RAOF> pitti: nvidia does something weird on VT switch, like dropping all GL state or something.
<RAOF> pitti: You also see this after modesetting; unity takes a long time to draw anything after modesetting; sometimes so long that you can't press the âdo you want to keep this modeâ before it times out.
<pitti> RAOF: no need to convince me :) I know how broken it is on multiple levels
<RAOF> (Which is clearly hilarious)
<DBO> RAOF, technical question for you
<pitti> RAOF: my monitor takes some 5 seconds to get back to its senses after modeswitch; my wife's display takes 30 (!)
<DBO> texture A == made by generating a texture and then loading a png into it
<DBO> texture B == made by generating a texture, binding it into an FBO, and painting A into it
<DBO> then unbinding it
<DBO> what makes these textures different?
<RAOF> No idea.
<RAOF> Sorry :)
<RAOF> pitti: Is it your wife's monitor, or the nvidia GPU being crazy after modeset? :)
<pitti> RAOF: the monitor is excessively slow
<pitti> RAOF: it's using the ati driver (the free one)
<pitti> I don't have nvidia hardware in the house
<pitti> hm, just dist-upgraded and rebooted to test this
<pitti> tons of flickering, resetting xrandr to X.org's defaults, turns the LVDS back on, and lots of flickering when switching back
<pitti> this is not a nice experience :/
<RAOF> I can make it better.
<pitti> robert_ancell: the indicator-session change also introduces a regression, I followed up to bug 878836
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 878836 in lightdm "Unity Greeter - Use Unity Greeter to fulfil lock screen as well as login functions" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/878836
<DBO> RAOF, have you tried out the test app on nvidia?
<DBO> RAOF, on my system the nvidia driver takes a full minute to change resolution and begin drawing the app again
<RAOF> My test system is upgrading; the last attempt to get into X failed :(
<DBO> I've been trying a lot of things to hack around the slowness
<DBO> unbinding the textures/using a single fbo instead of many...
<DBO> nothing works
<RAOF> Worst case, we can throw that at nvidia via tselliot as a test case.
<DBO> RAOF, you think they will take this as a test case?
<DBO> RAOF, do you think its possible the driver is converting the texture formats?
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti
<RAOF> DBO: Yes; the driver's allowed to do all sorts of things.
<RAOF> Oh, huh.
<RAOF> DBO: Does it still happen if you don't use RGBA?
<DBO> RAOF, I was just testing that
<DBO> RAOF, and yes
<DBO> it does still do it
<DBO> I also tested BGRA
<GunnarHj> pitti: Good morning, Martin. Do you have time to take a look at the MP linked to bug 928400? (It was preceded by an anything but constructive discussion on the bug report with ScottK.) :(
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 928400 in language-selector "systemsettings crashed with AttributeError in onSystemLanguageApply(): 'QtLanguageSelector' object has no attribute 'writeSysLangSetting'" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/928400
<DBO> RAOF, the recovery time does scale perfectly with the number of textures we bind into the FBO
<pitti> GunnarHj: You know, I'd be more than happy to drop language-selector-qt
<GunnarHj> pitti: But don't write that on the bug. ;-)
<pitti> GunnarHj: I just did :) I think I was reasonably diplomatic
<pitti> self.writeSysLanguageSetting(code)
<pitti> 22- self.writeSysLangSetting(code)
<pitti> GunnarHj: ah, so the first one is enough now?
<pitti> GunnarHj: I guess originally the first wrote $LANGUAGE, the second $LANG
<DBO> RAOF, any other ideas before I give up and go postal?
<pitti> GunnarHj: but now the ls-dbus-backend does both?
<RAOF> DBO: I don't at the moment, no.  I suggest sleeping instead of going postal; I'll keep poking.
<pitti> GunnarHj: sorry that you got in between this
<pitti> GunnarHj: right, just saw the code; thanks!
<GunnarHj> pitti: Sorry, went to get coffee. Is there still any clarification you need?
<pitti> GunnarHj: nope, I'm good; I merged with dropping the "needs clarification" bit from the changleog
<pitti> GunnarHj: thanks muchly!
<pitti> uploaded
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok, thanks!
<DBO> RAOF, http://www.nvidia.com/object/linux-display-ia32-260.19.29-driver.html
<DBO> check THAT out
<RAOF> DBO: Ah.
<DBO> RAOF, do you think they regressed?
<DBO> RAOF, is it possible for you to test that driver?
<RAOF> Yes, I can test that driver.
 * DBO waits with baited breath
<DBO> RAOF, it turns out my google-fu is strong today
<RAOF> I suggest sleeping first.  It'll take a little while for me to actually install those drivers.
<RAOF> Or is it the morning for you?  âº
<RAOF> Either way, sleeping first.  It's never wrong to sleep!
<RAOF> Faster, laptops!  FASTER!
<DBO> RAOF, I'd not be able to sleep knowing that this bug might finally have a solid lead
<GunnarHj> pitti: Saw your bug comments. Please keep in mind that there are other derivatives (Lubuntu, Xubuntu) that use the gtk part of l-s, and want do keep doing so (at least for a while) when we switch to g-c-c.
<pitti> GunnarHj: right, but same comment -- I won't be interested in maintaining the GUI any more
<pitti> just the language_support_pkgs.py module
<pitti> which we might very well split out into its own source then
<pitti> then the rest can go to universe
<GunnarHj> pitti: Guess it will be up to the developers of those derivatives what to do, then.
<pitti> right
<pitti> well, it's not like we leave it behind completely broken
<pitti> this cycle it got a lot of cleanup, which should make it a little less ugly to maintain
<GunnarHj> pitti: True.
<micahg> pitti: next cycle I'd like to chat with you about alternatives to language-selector :)
<GunnarHj> pitti: I wrote a reply on the im-config/im-switch topic, with a suggestion on how to deal with it. https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2012-February/013316.html
<pitti> GunnarHj: I saw, thanks! so this does change behaviour and current configuration after all?
<GunnarHj> pitti: Yes.
<pitti> GunnarHj: it sounded like it would configure input support more automatically
<pitti> which would be a nice simplification of the GUI as well
<pitti> also wrt. control-center and other potential replacements
<pitti> this is pretty much the only reason why we still use l-s
<GunnarHj> pitti: If we leave the code aside, unlike im-switch it does not care about the current locale. Good or bad? I'm not sure.
<pitti> GunnarHj: oh? that sounds "bad" to my untrained ear
<pitti> I thought the point was to automatically select an appropriate IM for the current locale
<pitti> (LC_CTYPE presumably)
<GunnarHj> pitti: That's the point with im-switch.
<pitti> that's how I understood it anyway
<pitti> i. e. it has a locale -> IM method map
<pitti> and starts ibus, and the preferred method in those locales
<pitti> and with the indicator the user can then switch between methods
<GunnarHj> pitti: Yep.
<pitti> l-s just allows users to fine-tune this, but it shouldn't be necessary for most use cases
<pitti> GunnarHj: ok, so at least the two of us have the same mental model here?
<GunnarHj> pitti: So it seems.
<GunnarHj> pitti: I don't know the rationale behind ignoring the language/locale in im-config, but I know that some CJK users want to be able to use ibus even if they have e.g. English as the display language. After all, display language and input method are two different things.
<pitti> right
<pitti> GunnarHj: should they have LC_CTYPE=zh_CN.UTF-8 and LC_MESSAGES=en_US.UTF-8 ?
<pitti> I think in the new world we don't set these any more, they are derived from $LANG
<GunnarHj> pitti: No, no, currently it works just fine with im-switch. AFAICT there is no urgent need to change anything.
<GunnarHj> pitti: I suggested that we wait with converting to im-config because we don't know yet how GNOME will handle it in g-c-c, so by waiting we would avoid to expose the users twice to changes in the input method handling.
<GunnarHj> pitti: As regards which variables im-switch use, it's LC_CTYPE and if it isn't set LANG.
<GunnarHj> micahg: Out of curiosity, do have anything else bug the region module in g-c-c in mind as a replacement for language-selector?
<robert_ancell> pitti, so regarding the lock screen change - if I understand it correctly DBO says there is an instability problem with the switching as well as a performance one
<robert_ancell> (on nvidia)
<robert_ancell> You have nvidia right, are you seeing both problems?
<pitti> robert_ancell: I don't have any nvidia in the house; my two laptops are intel, my wife's is using the free ati driver
<pitti> robert_ancell: I'm mostly seeing the xrandr side, i. e. lots of flickering and long delays due to the monitor having to catch up
<DBO> robert_ancell, yeah I get crashes inside the nvidia driver if the switch takes too long
<robert_ancell> DBO, yeah, that's the really concerning part
<DBO> robert_ancell, at least they happen in libgl and not the x driver
<DBO> so x stays up just the window manager dies
<robert_ancell> DBO, so it looks like a gl bug or a compiz bug?
<DBO> nvidia gl bug
<robert_ancell> which we can't do anything with
<DBO> yeah we have to work around those
<didrocks> pitti: small question, if I need to promote some binary packages (but not all), I guess I should put the source to main as well, isn't it?
<pitti> didrocks: yes
<pitti> robert_ancell: I left my blurb about both changes (indicator-session lock regression and the gnome-screensaver ones) in the bug
<didrocks> pitti: I was puzzled by the fact change-override didn't do it :)
<didrocks> pitti: thanks for confirming :)
<pitti> didrocks: if you only change binary packages, it won't auto-change the source
<robert_ancell> pitti, ah, reading it now
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I have a hybrid graphic laptop, I was planning to spend some time figuring out how to use the nvidia chip today ... so let me know if you want me to do some testing
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, pitti has used his veto powers :)
<rickspencer3> oh
<rickspencer3> nm
<pitti> the xrandr part is certainly fixable on our part, as RAOF says too
<pitti> but I really don't see a good way around the proprietary drivers
<pitti> the crash and them not being able to handle more than one X.org at a time are both solvable in principle (but not by us)
<robert_ancell> pitti, there is blacklisting, but I'm not sure if we can reliably detect the driver from within the session
<pitti> but them not using KMS, and thus having a really poor performance and flickering during VT switch is a principal problem
<pitti> robert_ancell: yeah, if we can fix the randr part and blacklist non-KMS drivers, it'd be better
<robert_ancell> pitti, and the latter should hopefully solve that by matching resolutions by default
<didrocks> pitti: I don't see the quickly spec anymore on my status page: http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-precise/u/didrocks.html, any idea? (because targeted later?)
<pitti> robert_ancell: KMS == grep -q -E '(nouveau|drm)fb' /proc/fb
<robert_ancell> pitti, ok, gtg again, be back in an hour or so
<pitti> that's what pm-utils uses
<pitti> robert_ancell: not sure whether having /dev/dri/card0 is a good indication <- RAOF?
<pitti> i. e. does nvidia have that?
<pitti> (it's different from KMS, so I think checking /proc/fb is saver)
<pitti> "safer"
<DBO> pitti, nvidia does not make /dev/dri/card0
<robert_ancell> pitti, do you think it's worth trying with that?  Or would you prefer to revert the whole thing.  Note also that all the changes are in lightdm for this to work, so it can be enabled on OEM system should they wish to patch indicator-session
<robert_ancell> I mean gnome-screensaver
<pitti> DBO: ok, I remembered that much; but DRI != KMS, so it'd be only an approximation; checking /proc/fb is just as easy
<pitti> robert_ancell: it still leaves the xrandr change; are you confident that this can be fixed?
<pitti> robert_ancell: well, we can still revert it later, too
<pitti> robert_ancell: I don't understand the indicator-session chagne, which caused the locking regression
<pitti> robert_ancell: why was this necessary in the first place?
<robert_ancell> pitti, it depends on how bad you consider it - note that it is only when locking which is not normally a time critical thing
<DBO> pitti, is the plan to fall back to the old lockscreen on nvidia?
<pitti> DBO: yes
<DBO> +1 to that good buddy
<pitti> I don't think there's any other sensible option at that point on proprietary drivers
<robert_ancell> pitti, that was required because if do the lock and that asks lightdm to go to the lock screen, then do a user switch then you get two requests to the dm that spawns two VTs
<pitti> didrocks: hm, curious -- https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-quickly is still targetted to precise
<robert_ancell> the next version of lightdm does the locking for you so you don't have to worry about it
<DBO> pitti, if we figure out the slowness issue, it might fix this for nvidia at least
<DBO> RAOF, any news on that driver? :)
<pitti> didrocks: ooh -- the milestone was set to "later", which doesn't really exist, I guess?
<pitti> didrocks: should this be targetted to P (and mielstone -> beta-1), or moved to Q?
<robert_ancell> bbl
<pitti> robert_ancell: and gdm?
<didrocks> pitti: ok, not sure who changed it, will fix it :)
<RAOF> DBO: Almost there!
<DBO> RAOF, sexy
<RAOF> (Yes, that's slow.  Sorry)
<rickspencer3> pitti, robert_ancell, RAOF a dist-upgrade this morning rather significantly horked my netbook
<pitti> how in particular?
<rickspencer3> it starts in low graphics moods, then runs GMD, then won't start a session
<rickspencer3> low graphics mode
<pitti> intel?
<rickspencer3> moods too, I guess, but my netbook doesn't like it when I personify it
<rickspencer3> pitti, yeah, Intel
<rickspencer3> pitti, suggestions?
<pitti> rickspencer3: can you paste /var/log/Xorg.0.log and dmesg?
<rickspencer3> pitti, well, I can't log into a session, so not easily
<pitti> rickspencer3: I also dist-upgraded about two hours ago and rebooted, worked hehre
<pitti> so I don't have a general idea what could be wrong
<pitti> robert_ancell: you can log into VT1
<rickspencer3> pitti, yeah, I can get a VT
<rickspencer3> why would GDM run?
<pitti> gdm?
<rickspencer3> pitti, yeah, GDM instead of lightdm
<pitti> rickspencer3: do you have both lightdm and gdm installed?
<pitti> it should work with gdm as well, of course
<rickspencer3> pitti, yes
<pitti> rickspencer3: so, I think we'll need to see what dmesg/Xorg.0.log complain about
<rickspencer3> I thought gdm got removed on a previous update, I guess not, though
<rickspencer3> pitti, is this worth your time?
<pitti> rickspencer3: as a first step, can you please check if "sudo apt-get -f install" complains aobut anythign?
<pitti> interrupted dist-upgrade or so?
<pitti> we got a new kernel and such
<rickspencer3> pitti, -f install just said there was no work to do
<pitti> rickspencer3: making our manager be able to work again is worth our time, yes :)
<pitti> rickspencer3: ok, so it's not that at least
<rickspencer3> pitti, well, I have a laptop too
<pitti> rickspencer3: if you want to try, you could reboot, press shift to get into grub, and try with the previous kernel (-15)
<rickspencer3> if I am experiencing somehting idiosyncratic, I would want to put it off
<rickspencer3> but I am worried that it's a general issue
<pitti> and see whether that makes a difference
<rickspencer3> pitti, should I try dpkg --configure maybe?
<pitti> rickspencer3: no, if apt-get -f install is satisfied, packages are okay
<rickspencer3> ok
 * rickspencer3 ponders
<pitti> rickspencer3: so I'd first try kernel -15 again
<pitti> if it works -> kernel issue, need to bug them
<pitti> if it fails -> need dmesg/X.org log, some other package broke it
<rickspencer3> I wonder if I could be out of room on my hard drive
<pitti> df -h
<rickspencer3> well, I'm rebooting now
<pitti> that's possible; but it at least ought to mount a /tmp tmpfs in that case
<rickspencer3> oops, the -15 kernel isn't installed!
<rickspencer3> or at least not in grub
<pitti> oh, you already cleaned it up?
<rickspencer3> pitti, I didn't manually
<pitti> rickspencer3: it's now behind "older OS versions.." or so
<pitti> not the huge long list by default any more
<rickspencer3> pitti, under Previous Linux versions I have 2 memory test options
<rickspencer3> I've been upgrading this netbook for 2 years, now
<pitti> weird
<pitti> rickspencer3: does uname -r say 3.2.0-16-generic ?
<rickspencer3> I have to wonder if I once configured apt to delete old kernels at some point
<pitti> rickspencer3: I don't think you can
<pitti> well, I don't know how, anyway
<pitti> computer-janitor cleans them up nicely
<rickspencer3> pitti, so,  /dev/sda1 is at 100%
<rickspencer3> let me remove some stuff and try again
<pitti> aah
<pitti> rickspencer3: sudo apt-get clean
<pitti> that woudl make a nice test case
<rickspencer3> sudo rm -r *.wmv
<pitti> defualt install, fill up / to 100%, reboot and verify that a session starts
<pitti> it ought to survive that
<rickspencer3> I'm assuming I'm not going to watch all these old episodes of Futurama and southpark again
<pitti> that's why we mount a tmpfs on /tmp
<pitti> at least we used to, this might be broken now
<rickspencer3> pitti, I agree that my netbook should be able to survive all these old episodes
<micahg>  /run is a /tmpfs now
<rickspencer3> but, it seems like this is a bit of a corner case
<pitti> micahg: not by default
<pitti> micahg: sorry, yes; /run is
<pitti> I meant /tmp
 * DBO gives RAOF the big puppy dog eyes
<pitti> if it can't create X or D-BUS sockets, your system won't be very happy
<rickspencer3> pitti, making room fixed it
<rickspencer3> sorry to take up so much of your time
<rickspencer3> also ..
<pitti> rickspencer3: np
<rickspencer3> phew
<rickspencer3> I was having flashbacks to the bad old days
<Sweetshark> moin!
<pitti> hey Sweetshark, good morning
<Sweetshark> rickspencer3: are you still having trouble with LO?
<rickspencer3> good morning Sweetshark
<rickspencer3> I assume so, I haven't tried today
<rickspencer3> hold on
<rickspencer3> Sweetshark, so, yes, I am still having trouble
<rickspencer3> when I run it, the splash screen appears, and then when it disappears, nothing
<rickspencer3> when I run libreoffice from a terminal, there is no output
<rickspencer3> just the splashscreen coming and going
<DBO> rickspencer3, does the process terminate?
<rickspencer3> DBO yes
<Sweetshark> what does "strace /usr/lib/libreoffice/program/soffice.bin" do?
<rickspencer3> Sweetshark, it segfaults
<robert_ancell> pitti, this behaviour only occurs under lightdm
<pitti> robert_ancell: ah, I see
<Sweetshark> rickspencer3: strace itself? or the soffice.bin?
<rickspencer3> Sweetshark, not sure
<rickspencer3> the error dialog says strace
<Sweetshark> rickspencer3: interesting, I like it if debugging tools break themselves ...
<robert_ancell> pitti, actually it appears that indicator-session only switches under lightdm now
<Sweetshark> rickspencer3: was there any output before the segfault? if so, could you pastebin the last dying breath of it?
<rickspencer3> Sweetshark, yes, hold on
<rickspencer3> Sweetshark, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/842759/
<Sweetshark> rickspencer3: seems like it cant find libicui18n.so.48, hmmm
<rickspencer3> Sweetshark, ok
<rickspencer3> so, how can I help?
<pitti> siimilar to bug 917153 ?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 917153 in libreoffice "failed to upgrade from oneiric to precise: /usr/lib/libreoffice/program/unopkg.bin: error while loading shared libraries: libicule.so.48: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/917153
<kenvandine> woot, no more webkit-gtk2 dependency for gwibber!
<kenvandine> finally all merged
<Sweetshark> pitti: yes, I find that suspicious too. But I thought that to be an issue only with update order, after completing the install all libs should be there anyway ....
<Sweetshark> rickspencer3: does 'sudo apt-get install --reinstall libreoffice-core' and then 'sudo apt-get install --reinstall libreoffice-common' help?
<Sweetshark> rickspencer3: and do you know when the problem first appeared? There was no recent LO update in the last days.
<rickspencer3> Sweetshark, it started yesterday
<rickspencer3> and it worked on Monday
<rickspencer3> so, something when I updated yesterday morning, I guess
<infinity> And this wasn't an oneiric->precise upgrade between Monday and yesterday, I assume?
<infinity> rickspencer3: libicu48 is installed and configured?
<infinity> (dpkg -l libicu48)
<rickspencer3> infinity, it was a dist-upgrade, but precise to precise
<infinity> Hrm.
<infinity> At first glance, it sure looks like the bug that pitti brought up, but I don't see how that could happen on a recent precise->precise upgrade.
<rickspencer3> meh
<rickspencer3> pitti, should I log a bug from my "can't start when the disk is full" thing from this morning?
<infinity> Given that the last time I synced ICU was 3 weeks ago.
<pitti> again wrong unpack order?
<pitti> I thought that was the problem during dist-upgrade, although it should not really hit that hard on precise->precise
<infinity> pitti: Sure, unpack order issues are a sound theory, but the problem on dist-upgrade was the icu44->icu48 SOVER bump.
<pitti> rickspencer3: you migth as well; I'm sure that there are a thousand (unindentifyalbe) dupes around, but a clean one might be better
<infinity> pitti: rick would have already had icu48 installd, so...
<rickspencer3> pitti, which package should I log it against?
<pitti> rickspencer3: hm, I'm not sure about the root cause yet, so perhaps start with an "ubuntu" only task
<pitti> rickspencer3: it's probably in more than one
<rickspencer3> Sweetshark, hey, so, those reinstalls didn't work
<pitti> rickspencer3: what was the exact problem, X.org failed to start?
<pitti> rickspencer3: I think we lost the automatic tmpfs /tmp creation
<rye> erm, what does Super+R sho
<pitti> rickspencer3: so please start with "mountall"
<rickspencer3> pitti, ack
<rye> ... what should Super+R do? it does something weird now for me
<rye> something like panning virtual desktop with zoom
<pitti> eek
<rye> and I can't disable this mode, mouse pointer is also not displayed
<pitti> how do I get out of that again?
<pitti> TheMuso: ^ do you know?
<infinity> rickspencer3: Regarding your libreoffice troubles, does dpkg list "libicu48" as installed?
<rye> pitti, phew
<rickspencer3> ah
<rye> pitti, press super and scroll down on mouse/trackpad
<rickspencer3> everything is so big
<rickspencer3> help
<pitti> rye: thanks
<rickspencer3> phew
<rickspencer3> ok, so that's pretty cool
<pitti> so super+r is indeed confusing
<rye> quite unexpected, sorry about panicking
<rickspencer3> pitti, I got an apport error!
 * rickspencer3 resists the yak shaving excursion
<pitti> rickspencer3: which?
<rickspencer3> infinity, according to apt-cache, it is installed
<seb128> hey
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
<infinity> rickspencer3: Hrm.  Then it's vaguely curious that libreoffice can't find it. :/
<pitti> seb128: not too bad; desperately trying to keep teh archive in one piece :)
<pitti> seb128: and arguing about the gnome-screensaver changes
<seb128> pitti, oh, sorry you were not around when I uploaded so not kept in the loop, it's rather a "let's see how it goes and get some feedback", I don't think we will stick to it for this cycle
<pitti> seb128: I left my ramblings in the bug, and discussed possible options with robert_ancell
<seb128> ok
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<seb128> mdeslaur had good feedback yesterday
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<pitti> seb128: in other news, g-s-d works like a charm here
<seb128> I didn't think much about the issue due to the fact that your switch away from your user seat so i.e disable sound
<pitti> chrisccoulson: quite fine, thanks!
<seb128> or don't respect the user settings
<pitti> seb128: ah, haven't even considered those
<seb128> pitti, great, I will upload that to precise in a bit, jbicha filled the libwacom mir and mterry acked it
<pitti> seb128: it totally breaks nvidia users, and it's a really bad experience with multiple monitors
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> pitti, multimonitor? because vt switch sucks?
<seb128> didrocks, lut
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
<rickspencer3> pitti, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mountall/+bug/932598
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932598 in mountall "Full hard drive causes xorg and desktop to fail to load" [Undecided,New]
<rickspencer3> like I dope, I logged it from a different computer :/
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, not too bad thanks. stressing about mozilla bug 694594 though ;)
<pitti> rickspencer3: thanks, I'll queue that
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<ubot2`> Mozilla bug 694594 in JavaScript Engine "Crashes with gcc 4.4.3" [Critical,New: ] http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=694594
<seb128> rickspencer3, pitti: isn't that issue years old?
<pitti> seb128: it got much better when we had the fallback in sysvinit
<pitti> seb128: it used to mount a tmpfs on /tmp if you had < 1 MB free on /
<pitti> but I think we'd be better off with always having that
<seb128> pitti, rickspencer3: bug #35217
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 35217 in gdm "Unable to login when disk space is exhausted" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/35217
<seb128> it's a 5 digits bug!
<chrisccoulson> lol
<pitti> seb128: so there's two parts
<seb128> pitti, I'm pretty sure it was discussed on another bug recently but I think I cleared the emails
<chrisccoulson> and we're nearly at 7 digits!
<pitti> seb128: if you have /home on a full partition, the session fails to start
<pitti> but if /tmp is full, then not even lightdm/X.org start up
<pitti> as D-BUS etc. can't even create their sockets there, etc.
<seb128> pitti, oh, right
<pitti> but still, we can join the bugs indeed
<seb128> pitti, I don't think we ever really solved the xorg,session part
<pitti> thanks for the pointer
<pitti> right
<kenvandine> good morning seb128
<kenvandine> i know it must be time for bed if seb128 is here :)
<seb128> kenvandine, hey, what are you doing still there? ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, indeed :p
<kenvandine> merging branches :)
<pitti> jibel: how much effort would it be to add a test case which fills up the disk with a dummy file, then reboots, and checks that X and lightdm come up properly?
<RAOF> DBO: Why is the nvidia installer give such totally useless error messages?!
<pitti> jibel: this case kept breaking several times in the past
<seb128> pitti, rickspencer3: ah, found it
<seb128> bug #873368
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 873368 in gnome-session "Session fails to start when root system full" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/873368
<seb128> pitti, ^ that's the one I read comment on recently
<pitti> seb128: that sounds like a proper dupe of 35217 indeed
<seb128> it got assigned to our team
<chrisccoulson> is anyone else using the new unity from the PPA?
<didrocks> yeah
<jibel> pitti, doing a fresh desktop install, reboot, check that essential services are running, fill the disk, reboot, check again. That's it ?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, do you notice an annoying flicker when switching workspaces now?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: in the preview, you mean?
<chrisccoulson> perhaps that's a compiz thing actually. did compiz change recently as well?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, no, this is when using the keyboard shortcuts
<didrocks> you don't read the team report? :p
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> i do, honest ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: one sec, I have a video
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: bug #930122
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 930122 in compiz "some window preview glitches on workspace switcher and expo" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/930122
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, that looks the same as what i'm seeing :)
<chrisccoulson> thanks!
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: can you confirm as well?
<jibel> pitti, I think we can create a test case for this in the current iso testing framework. not very difficult but need to find the time to do it.
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: it's compiz
<jibel> pitti, is there any level of emergency ?
<didrocks> (spotted before the upload, but didn't worth blocking on it)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i can confirm that
<Sweetshark> meh. still cant reproduce the icu bug.
<pitti> jibel: no, it's not really something new; it just came up in the discussion again
<pitti> jibel: it doesn't need to be an entirely new install; a post-instal test of an existing one is sufficient
<desrt> pitti: good morning
<pitti> jibel: so that this takes a minute, not 20
<pitti> hey desrt
<desrt> pitti: i think introspection in libxklavier is broken
<pitti> desrt: how so?
<desrt>   GISCAN Xkl-1.0.gir
<desrt> gives
<desrt>  /home/desrt/jhbuild/checkout/libxklavier-5.2/libxklavier/xkl_config_registry.h:24:36: fatal error: libxklavier/xkl_engine.h: No such file or directory
<desrt> the reason seems to be because Xkl_1_0_gir_CFLAGS = $(INCLUDES) $(X_CFLAGS) $(XML_CFLAGS) $(GLIB_CFLAGS) $(XINPUT_CFLAGS)
<pitti> my checkout is still from January 16
<pitti> let me check
<desrt> but meanwhile the real AM_CFLAGS contain -I. -I$(top_srcdir)
<desrt> oh.  i'm looking at the 5.2 release, btw
<desrt> it may well have been fixed since then.  silly me.
<pitti> my checkout is before 5.2 even
<pitti> I'll compare my checkout with current master
<pitti> ok, still works in my checkout (c8addc9)
<desrt> oh.  indeed
<desrt> http://cgit.freedesktop.org/libxklavier/commit/?id=57785c952444e4cb9d13e43d4f9cc9713d66958b
<desrt> made after the 5.2 release
<pitti> hmm; master also works
<desrt> yes.  you're right.
<pitti> aah
<pitti> right, I noticed that on the next day
<desrt> i don't suppose you're interested in doing a point release :)
<pitti> but in the meantime 5.2 was already released
<pitti> so I cherry-picked this into our packages
<desrt> (i guess i ask svu for that)
<pitti> desrt: yes, I pointed that out to him
<desrt> okay.  sorry for the noise.
<desrt> jhbuilding is a lot like packaging ;)
<pitti> no problem at all
<pitti> desrt: let's say, if it's done well in jhbuild, packaging becomes much easier :)
<pitti> but I should update our packages to 5.2
<pitti> not many changes, but it's cleaner
<desrt> pitti: i like to think i've been actively making seb's life easier lately by catching ubuntu issues in gnome before he tries to package them :p
<seb128> desrt, hey ;-)
<desrt> seb128: good morning :)
<seb128> desrt, how are you? are you in europe yet or just on european tz adjustment? ;-)
<desrt> working on the adjustment :)
<robert_ancell> seb128, there's a new lightdm/u-g about to be uploaded - did you want to do any smoke-testing?
 * desrt will be in europe tomorrow
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey, I can do if you want
<seb128> robert_ancell, everything is in the packaging vcs?
<robert_ancell> seb128, yup
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, I'm on it
<desrt> robert_ancell: latest u-g theme changes look really nice, btw
<desrt> the seethrough dropdown is a nice touch
<robert_ancell> desrt, that's all mterry and cimi's work
<robert_ancell> seb128, if you've got multi-monitor then the greeter may look a bit weird - it does multi-monitor now, but the default is to mirror and on my laptop it trims the sides
<desrt> robert_ancell: hah!
<robert_ancell> (default being the g-s-d default)
<desrt> i was just typing a question to ask you how to change that :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, I'm using a laptop docked but with lid closed, i.e just the external monitor
<seb128> robert_ancell, that usually doesn't stop the closed screen for some reason and put me in minor
<desrt> because it looks quite bad
<seb128> which is annoying because I get the laptop resolution on the external screen
<desrt> the resolution ends up being sort of the worst-choice of all connected monitors
<desrt> seb128: it's not even the laptop's resolution
<desrt> it's the highest resolution supported by both devices
<desrt> which for me is something extremely obnoxious like 1024x768
<seb128> desrt, I think it is, at least it's in mirror mode, both screen should have the same resolution, I figured it would pick the lower one of the two
<robert_ancell> seb128, right, so if I start with my monitor plugged in I get that, but if you disconnect and reconnect the monitor it has the correct resolution
<desrt> seb128: not all monitors support all lower resolutions
<seb128> desrt, right, I see what you mean
<desrt> so if your laptop has an odd panel size, chances are the external monitor does not directly support it
<robert_ancell> seb128, so not sure what we're going to do here, the changes are nice but if we can't get g-s-d/x to play nice they might have to be reverted
<desrt> i think this is what the "Note: may limit resolution options" string in gnome-control-center is hinting at (which at first i thought only meant what you thought it meant and i was like "well... duh... obviously")
<seb128> robert_ancell, I'm pleased to see that you used merge-upstream this time :p
<robert_ancell> seb128, I remembered :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, I was not even sure you read my email
<desrt> robert_ancell: do you have an idea of what you'd ideally like to happen?
<robert_ancell> desrt, side by side - always
<desrt> seems right
<desrt> how do you select the default though?
<robert_ancell> desrt, heuristics I guess
 * desrt suggests a good one: largest panel
<desrt> you will not plug in an external monitor and ignore your laptop screen if the laptop screen is larger...
<robert_ancell> desrt, or the one closest to the hardware, i.e. laptop display overrides external monitor
<desrt> robert_ancell: i don't like that option because the lid may be closed
<robert_ancell> desrt, then you only have one screen
<desrt> is that how it works these days?
<seb128> robert_ancell, should I test lightdm first and then the greeter or both together?
<desrt> lid closed -> xrandr 'disappears' the monitor for you?
<robert_ancell> seb128, might as well both
<robert_ancell> desrt, it should
<desrt> that's pretty clever logic
<robert_ancell> (no idea if it does)
<desrt> well, i've seen behaviour that suggest that there is at least some hinting going on in this direction
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, installed, brb
<desrt> maybe g-s-d is doing something clever there
<robert_ancell> desrt, oh, I noticed that u-g is using the slow method of doing images (like we had in g-g)
<robert_ancell> is there an easy way to confirm the current method is the slow one?
<desrt> burn it!
<robert_ancell> desrt, the main part is being done in a thread and it didn't like me doing a trivial replacement
<desrt> for gnome-games i put a for loop for 1000 iterations around the 'draw' function
<desrt> that was enough to show a rather visible difference between the code as it was and my improvements
<robert_ancell> desrt, also, is there a reason why there isn't a Gdk.cairo_make_native_surface (w, h)?
<desrt> robert_ancell: oh.  yes.  don't do that.
<desrt> robert_ancell: you'd also need a GdkDisplay there (or maybe even a Gdk.Screen)
<robert_ancell> or just grab the default
<desrt> gdk tries not to introduce APIs that assume the default gdkdisplay these days
<desrt> in order to be safe for multiple GdkDisplay in one process
<desrt> (which i think is pretty bogus, but whatever)
<desrt> actually, i guess with our new support for multiple display backends this makes more sense than it used to
<desrt> but i still don't know of anyone who is actually using this support for anything
<desrt> robert_ancell: anyway.. it makes a lot of sense
<desrt> cairo is threadsafe itself
<seb128> robert_ancell, is buggy
<desrt> and an image surface is fully detached from the X server -- it's just in local process memory
<desrt> X on the other hand is _not_ threadsafe
<desrt> and the cairo 'similar' surface for an X window is going to be doing drawing via X
<robert_ancell> seb128, in what way?
<desrt> so you can't write to the similar surface in a thread at the same time that you do other things to X in the main thread
<seb128> robert_ancell, I can't start a guest session, it just switches me to the greeter
<seb128> robert_ancell, (it always did that when a greeter is running)
<seb128> did you make it so there is always a greeter running?
<robert_ancell> desrt, yeah, I was moving all that stuff outside of the thread and just doing the GdkPixbuf scaling in the thread
<desrt> robert_ancell: use cairo to do the scaling on the GPU
<seb128> robert_ancell, usually the greeter would close when I logged in or typed my password on the greeter to log back in, and then I could start a guest session from indicator-session
<desrt> robert_ancell: at the very worst you will get a fallback that's no worse than GdkPixbuf
<seb128> robert_ancell, now picking guest in the session menu (from my session) send me to the greeter
<desrt> robert_ancell: and maybe you get something a lot better...
<robert_ancell> seb128, confirmed
<seb128> robert_ancell, otherwise login on ecryptfs and normal, switch user, keyboard layout, etc work fine
<desrt> (although you may lose the concurrency benefits, of course)
<seb128> robert_ancell, small 'glitch' in lightdm as a greeter, if I log with 2 users and switch between those from the session indicator it sends me to the other session and I get gnome-screensaver, not the lightdm greeter
<pitti> always having a greeter running will again break on nvidia & friends
<pitti> (if that's intended)
<desrt> pitti: it is intended to break nvidia & friends? ;)
<seb128> pitti, I think you made that point yes ;-)
<desrt> does unity have an overview like 'spread' view?
<pitti> seb128: different context here, though; it's independent from the gnome-screensaver changes
<seb128> robert_ancell, otherwise multimonitor -> it doesn't behave differently from before, I get my external monitor in 1440 and not 1920, I guess it goes to mirror still by default for me
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, you'll need to unplug/replug it
<pitti> desrt: hm, we used to with super+w
<seb128> desrt, super-w
<seb128> desrt, sit on super for a second
<pitti> desrt: but now that only shows the apps on the current ws
<seb128> desrt, you will get a keys overview
<desrt> super+w works, thanks
<pitti> seb128: super+w is not documented there
<seb128> pitti, it is for me
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, I don't have the energy to chase down the problem tonight, I'll look into it tomorrow.  Can you revert the gnome-screensaver patch / indicator-session change?  I don't think I'm going to have the time to get it all working
<desrt> seb128: interesting
<pitti> seb128: odd -- translation issue?
<seb128> pitti, first in the bottom right section
<pitti> oh, there, right
<desrt> seb128: same here
<desrt> hum.  vi is calling unity a liar
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok
<desrt> it's telling me that it's quite sure i have this file open in another terminal
 * desrt thinks it's wrong, after all
<seb128> robert_ancell, do you want to upload the new lightdm,unity-greeter anyway?
<seb128> robert_ancell, I would say the guest session stuff is minitor
<seb128> minor
<seb128> robert_ancell, you can start it from the greeter
<pitti> robert_ancell: I have locally reverted the screensaver one; can upload that if you want to
<seb128> though if the greeter keeps running that's an issue for nvidia as pitti pointed
<desrt> hmm
<desrt> desrt    12637  0.0  0.0  53908  5076 pts/2    S+   04:19   0:00 vi gnome-suites-core-deps-3.4.modules
<seb128> pitti, please do
<robert_ancell> pitti, I know your just waiting to do it - go for it!
<desrt> does super+W also show minimised windows?
<pitti> robert_ancell: heh
<robert_ancell> seb128, nah, it's not pressing - just let mterry know the new ones are available if he wants to do any testing
<pitti> robert_ancell: good night, sleep well!
<pitti> robert_ancell: thanks for staying up late to discuss this
<seb128> pitti, can you revert the indicator-session patch as well if you think it's wrong? be aware that upstream acked it and merged it to their trunk so we will need to discuss it there if we want to revert that
<pitti> seb128: I was told it's incomplete
<seb128> pitti, dx is keen to not enforce screensaver from the session menu
<pitti> seb128: the next lightdm will do the locking
<pitti> so I'm fine with keeping this for now
<seb128> pitti, well as you pointed on the bug that's an issue for other dms
<seb128> ok
<pitti> seb128: robert told me that scrensaver will only do that if lightdm is running
<seb128> robert_ancell, 'night
<seb128> pitti, ok, good
<pitti> seb128: I guess he meant "indicator"
<robert_ancell> seb128, though I just grepped the indicator code and it appears they only support lightdm (i.e. no reference to gdmflexiserver)
<seb128> pitti, so let's wait for that, you upload gnome-screensaver?
<pitti> or that
<pitti> seb128: yes, will do
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> I'm fine wiht keeping indicator-session for now
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, we can sort the indicator stuff later
<robert_ancell> ok, bye all
<desrt> how does one regain access to windows that they have minimised?
<seb128> desrt, they click on them in the launcher
<desrt> that seems to be lauching new windows for me
<seb128> it shouldn't
<desrt> ohhhh
<seb128> it means you have a bamf bug and it doesn't see the current instance
<desrt> fascinating
<desrt> super+w -is- showing my minimised windows
<seb128> left click is focus the current one
<desrt> they're just invisible
<seb128> middle click is start a new one
<desrt> like, it does the spread, and leaves a space where the window should be and clicking into the space brings it back
<desrt> found it :)
<seb128> desrt, works for me, but I've seen issues with that in compiz before
<desrt> seb128: it was also not possible to get to it using alt+tab :/
<seb128> desrt, that seems a bamf bug
<seb128> desrt, did you restart it or did it segfault during your session?
<desrt> i don't recall either of those things happening, no
<seb128> desrt, unity has some issues when bamf restart, it doesn't restore its state always correctly
<seb128> that's a known bug
<seb128> it will be looked at after ff
<desrt> cool
<desrt> i kill bamf a lot while working but i did a cold boot when i got home and haven't done any work on it since then
<desrt> so something to keep in mind in any case if i see this bug pop up later while working
<desrt> thanks :)
<seb128> right
<seb128> yw
<pitti> seb128: done, and bug 878836 updated accordingly
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 878836 in lightdm "Unity Greeter - Use Unity Greeter to fulfil lock screen as well as login functions" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/878836
<seb128> pitti, danke!
<pitti> seb128: any new package versions etc. which we need to get in today/by FF?
<pitti> I'm doing some stable+1 stuff to hold the archive in one piece, but I have some time in between to help out if necessary
<seb128> pitti, there is some red on versions but I don't think any is ffish
<seb128> like they are point releases, i.e bug fix updates
<rickspencer3> Sweetshark, so, thoughts on getting LibreOffice working again?
 * rickspencer3 reinstalls everything, restarts session
<Sweetshark> rickspencer3: Im a bit out of ideas for now. I just updated my precise VM from ~Desktop-Sprint and had no issues.
<seb128> pitti, were the retracers broken and catching up or did precise just turned to have segfault issues yesterday?
<pitti> seb128: the former, I restarted it some hours ago
<seb128> ok, good, I was starting being a bit concerned, I've no time before ff to go through the bug emails but I can see those pilling up there ;-)
<mhr3> pitti, is it possible to add xsession-errors to apport bugs reported for the lenses?
<pitti> mhr3: it should be attached by default
<pitti> mhr3: well, right now we do that for programs which link with either libgtk or libX11
<pitti> mhr3: if lenses don't do that, we could either add a new 'trigger' library to apport
<mhr3> pitti, yea, lenses don't do that
<seb128> pitti, mhr3: we don't add .xsession-errors, we do a grep on known warning markers
<pitti> or you manually call apport.hookutils.xsession_errors(pattern) to the hook
<pitti> well, yes
<pitti> pattern = re.compile('^(\(.*:\d+\): \w+-(WARNING|CRITICAL|ERROR))|(Error: .*No Symbols named)')
<pitti> that's our current filter
<seb128> pitti, mhr3: that's on my list of things to "get fix"
<pitti> to avoid exposing arbitrary data there
<seb128> "get fixed"
<seb128> pitti, I think we should not worry about arbitrary datas
<seb128> we loose lot of useful informations with the current way
<seb128> in practice you don't have often real datas in there
<seb128> what bug-buddy was doing is attaching like the n most recent lines to GNOME bugs, I don't think it has been an issue
<pitti> well, we introduced this check because we had bugs with that
<pitti> any package hook can fish out other things it's interested in, of course
<mhr3> well for one unity is using custom log handlers, so it should include that as well
<mhr3> like using just "WARN"
<seb128> pitti, ok, I will open a bug about including Xerrors in some way there
<seb128> pitti, we miss the actual infos for half the g-s-d issues which are in BadMath xerrors
<seb128> but that errors is not collected
<seb128> so we don't get the numbers associated with those
<pitti> if we can grep X errors, that sounds fine
<Laney> dear all, libproxy is ready for reviewing if you have time git://git.debian.org/git/users/laney/libproxy.git
<Laney> i still do not know what to do about the modules
<seb128> pitti, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apport/+bug/932660
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932660 in apport "XsessionErrors should include X errors" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> Laney, hey, how are you?
<Laney> yeah, good thanks :-)
<Laney> you?
<seb128> pitti, ^ libproxy seems something we want in for ff if you still have some spare cycle
<seb128> Laney, I'm great thanks, a bit in a rush for ff
<Laney> heh
<seb128> pitti, our version doesn't support GNOME3 so we need that update
<pitti> Laney: you want me to do a Debian upload, or merge with Ubuntu, or both?
<Laney> pitti: I think there's a bit of a Joss situation with this package atm, so â¦
<pitti> I mean, I'm fine with committing changes to the Debian svn
<seb128> well Joss hates it but he agreed the update was needed since the current version is broken
<Laney> I'll try and negotiate with pkg-gnome; seeking reviews and probably an Ubuntu upload atm
<pitti> just not sure what this git branch is
<pitti> seb128: oh, why doesn't he like it?
<Laney> there's some stuff I am not entirely confident about, like the multiarching or the naming of the module packages
<Laney> or how users are supposed to get the modules
<seb128> pitti, dunno, he justs hate the design or the code or something
<Laney> thinks it should be better done in glib-networking
<seb128> pitti, he's wanting to replace it with something else or write something new instead, he considers it just broken by design and something we should get ride of if we can
<pitti> seb128: ah, ok; so nothing in particular about the new version
<seb128> I didn't bother trying to figure why exactly he hates it, I just know he does ;-)
<seb128> pitti, no, he said he agrees we need the update since the current one is broken with GNOME3
<seb128> but he would prefer to just get ride of it if we could :p
<Laney> actually probably the modules don't need to depend on the shared lib
<GunnarHj> pitti: A transition issue: As long as bug 926207 is not resolved, some of the people who install Ubuntu will have LC_MESSAGES, LC_CTYPE and LC_COLLATE set in /etc/default/locale. Therefore I think we should comment the 'dpkg --compare-versions' condition in http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/accountsservice/precise/view/head:/debian/accountsservice.postinst for now. It can be uncommented later on, b
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 926207 in ubiquity "Set formats related LC_* variables when applicable instead of LC_MESSAGES, LC_CTYPE and LC_COLLATE" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/926207
<GunnarHj> ut with a later accountsservice version than 0.6.15-2ubuntu3. Any thoughts?
<pitti> GunnarHj: that doesn't help much, though
<pitti> as it's unlikely that there is a package update after a precise installation
<GunnarHj> pitti: Why not?
<pitti> accountsservice is not the kind of package that gets many post-release updates
<GunnarHj> pitti: Then what would you suggest?
<pgraner> didrocks, not sure if you've seen this one https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/932520
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932520 in unity "Maximzed windows on start up don't show full window" [Undecided,New]
<pitti> GunnarHj: well, thaht bug needs to get fixed :)
<didrocks> pgraner: this is with latest unity trunk?
<didrocks> pgraner: or new to the compiz update yesterday?
<pgraner> didrocks, no yesterday's archive
<GunnarHj> pitti: Yes. Of course, my assumption was that it has to be done before the 12.04 release.
<didrocks> pgraner: ok, seems a compiz regression then, adding to the list, thanks
<pgraner> didrocks, started on after monday's updates and I've been able to repro tho it does take some time
<pitti> GunnarHj: after that we can do another accountsservice upload and bump the comparison, to fix it for people who installed alpha-2 etc.
<didrocks> pgraner: are you sure they are maximized not just "big enough"?
<GunnarHj> pitti: Yes, that's exactly what I meant.
<didrocks> (it's hard to tell from the screenshot)
<didrocks> but yeyah, seems anyway that something is cut
<pgraner> didrocks, yea look at the screen shot, the buttons are showing the right state and when you click the max/min button it goes to a window
<pitti> GunnarHj: ah, ok; misunderstood you then
<pgraner> didrocks, to note once you min then max the window all is working well
<didrocks> pitti: ok, I'll add about the button showing in the right state and add to the regression ist
<didrocks> list*
<didrocks> oupss, I meant pgraner ^
<pgraner> didrocks, ack, let me know if I can do anything else, I won't update that box for awhile yet
<didrocks> pgraner: smspillaz FYI, adding that to the list to look after ^
<seb128> pitti, good job on the apport-request-retrace stuff, we got to try it on one of the dx bugs yesterday and it worked great
<pitti> ah, nice!
<smspillaz> this list is growing larger and larger :(
<seb128> pitti, it's the first time I saw it in action, works as it should, kudos for that ;-)
<smspillaz> (this one is probably another silly race condition that I don't have time for again :( )
<didrocks> Ran 47 tests in 453.606s
<didrocks> ok, time to make an additional one that won't pass :)
<ronoc> mterry, hey , I resubmitted that branch for merging using canberra exclusively
<pitti> Laney: looking at your git now
<Laney> brill
<Laney> don't forget to git-dch
<pitti> Laney: but this confuses me -- it has 0.3.1-3
<Laney> ^
<Laney> :-)
<pitti> but Deiban already has 0.3.1-4
<Laney> I haven't imported -4 yet
<Laney> but it's not massively important (I have reworked the packaging anyway)
<pitti> Laney: so, what shoudl I do with this git branch?
<Laney> make sure to branch upstream and pristine-tar
<mterry> ronoc, ok, will look
<Laney> git-dch --auto, git commit debian/changelog -m snapshot
<Laney> git-buildpackage
<mterry> seb128, morning.  who changed the power dialog to add a dropdown for the battery indicator?  I had a branch ready to go for that
<ronoc> TA
<seb128> mterry, hey
<ronoc> oh ta
<pitti> Laney: oh, this way around (I'm using to committing the debian/changelog together with the changes, and debcommit)
<Laney> check the multiarching is OK; see if you agree with me that the plugins shouldn't depend on the shlib; see if you have an idea about how users should get the plugins
<ronoc> caps lock ...
<seb128> mterry, wasn't that part of charles's work? i.e the stuff you both worked on?
<pitti> Laney: plugins?
<Laney> ah, yeah, that's another workflow, but I don't do it that way because it makes cherry-pickink and other vcs manipulations easier
<pitti> Laney: (NB that I have NFC about what this pacakge does)
<Laney> pitti: yeah, like the gsettings plugin or the kconfig one
<Laney> it lets apps query the system for the proxy to use
<mterry> seb128, I didn't know he had a g-c-c side branch too; just knew about the indicator side
<Laney> and has plugins for various data sources
<seb128> mterry, sorry about that :-(
<Laney> so e.g. it won't query gsettings if you don't have libproxy1-plugin-gsettings installed
<seb128> mterry, the patch I applied was from charles, I though you both sorted that out the other day
<seb128> mterry, I hope you didn't spend too much time on it
<Laney> and I don't really know what the best way for users to have that installed is
<Laney> have g-c-c or something recommend it?
<mterry> seb128, no, just the indicator side.  Seeing a screenshot of the panel now, I'm inclined to still use my patch, as mine also makes the panel look more like the google doc design in other ways besides just the dropdown
<seb128> mterry, yes please do, I just tried to clean the queue yesterday and get stuff landing before ff
<seb128> mterry, I don't like much how his version looks like, alignment is weird, but I didn't have time to argue over it
<mterry> seb128, yar, of course.  This was just a miscommunication
<pitti> Laney: how did you test this?
<seb128> mterry, and it would be fair that you each land one of your commits ;-)
<mterry> heh
<Laney> install the tools package and run 'proxy http://some.url'
<pitti> Laney: the only rdepends are glib-networking and glib-networking-services
<Laney> apt-cache rdepends libproxy0
<pitti> Laney: ah, and if I set a proxy in control-center, it should pick that up?
<Laney> if you have the gsettings plugin installed, yeah
<Laney> http_proxy=http://foo proxy http://www.ubuntu.com is a simple test that it's working at all
<pitti> Laney: I meant for testing that plugins still work with the multi-archification; I guess $http_proxy is built in
<Laney> ah, yeah
<pitti> Laney: but I guess you already did that
<Laney> set _MM_DEBUG=1 _PX_DEBUG=1
<Laney> and you'll get debugging output
<pitti> Laney: so I'll take git diff debian/0.3.1-3 .. -- debian, review that, and put it into svn
<Laney> If you like... I was going to tread a more careful political course ;-)
<pitti> Laney: why did you drop debian/control.in?
<Laney> part of switching to dh
<Laney> possibly I shouldn't have done that
<pitti> Laney: so you intended this to be an Ubuntu-only update?
<pitti> (for the time being)
<pitti> (wrt. "political course..')
<Laney> For now I think that would be easier; I am planning on speaking to pochu as maintainer about what to do
<pitti> Laney: multi-archification was already done in -4ubuntu3, and it looks like -4ubuntu2 and -4ubuntu1 are obsolete
<pitti> right?
 * Laney looks
<pitti> 4ubuntu1 because  there are now separate plugisn
<Laney> yeah, that looks accurate
<Laney> sorry I haven't been on top of merging in changes since I forked it
<Laney> possibly in Debian it would be easier to target exp at first
<pitti> and for debian we'll probably need to revert o cdbs
<Laney> likely unless I take it over
<pitti> I don't want to commit this to svn as it is, as it woudl be the only pkg-gnome package which doesn't use control.in and cdbs
<pitti> yes
<pitti> I mean at least not without an ack from mbiebl, pochu, or joss
<Laney> I don't think the changes would be too difficult to make that so
<Laney> it was mainly the cli/python2 sequences that made me do it this way
<pitti> anyway, the diff looks ok to me (for Ubuntu), now I just need to create a real changelog
<Laney> cool
<Laney> I'd just remove all except the most important entries
<pitti> Laney: http://paste.ubuntu.com/843046/
<pitti> how does that sound?
<Laney> the shlibs:Recommends thing was only transient
<pitti> actually, the diff doesn't have any rpath
 * pitti drops that as well
<Laney> and that
<Laney> and I'd like Ken's change to be credited if you can
<pitti> http://paste.ubuntu.com/843049/
<Laney> wfm
<pitti> ok, I'll do a test build and upload then
<pitti> Laney: thanks!
<Laney> we can think about adding recommends or whatever later I guess
<Laney> thanks for your review!
<pitti> Laney: I think it's right for plugins to be in multi-arch dirs
<pitti> they can't be M-A: foreign
<Laney> yeah
<pitti> $ http_proxy=http://127.0.0.1 proxy http://piware.de
<pitti> direct://
<pitti> hmmm
<pitti> Laney: ^ that doesn't look right?
<Laney> hmmm
<Laney> set _MM_DEBUG=1 _PX_DEBUG=1
<pitti> also tried with other hosts
<Laney> maybe it prefers gsettings?
<Laney> laney@raleigh> http_proxy=http://127.0.0.1 proxy http://piware.de                 ~/dev/debian/packaging/pkg-gnome/libproxy
<Laney> http://127.0.0.1
<pitti> preload : /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libproxy/0.4.7/modules/config_gnome3.so
<pitti> Using config: 22gnome_config_extension
<pitti> Using ignore: localhost,127.0.0.0/8
<pitti> Config is: direct://
<pitti> direct://
<pitti> ah, perhaps with that plugin it _only_ considers the gsettings bits
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> not sure if that is desirable
<pitti> right, that's it
<pitti> gnome-control-center network crashes, can't test this ATM
<pitti> seb128: ^ for you as well?
<pitti> (as soon as I click on "proxy")
<pitti> might be fallout from g--s-d
 * Laney needs to thesis for a bit, ttyl
<pitti> gsettings set org.gnome.system.proxy mode auto
<pitti> Laney: now it queries WPAD
<pitti> seems to work fine
<Laney> :-)
<pitti> with "manual", too
<seb128> pitti, wfm
<seb128> pitti, stacktrace?
<pitti> Laney: uploaded, thanks!
<Laney> sweet, cheers again for your help
<pitti> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/843063/
<seb128> pitti, hum, you have a11y on?
<pitti> by accident perhaps
<seb128> pitti, I will need to check on that, it's off there, but it's not a gsd side effect, it's an a11y issue
<pitti> migth have enabled it in the past to test something
<pitti> org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.a11y-keyboard active true
<pitti> seb128: ^ this one?
<pitti> org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.a11y-settings active true
<seb128> pitti, if that is active a11y will be one yes
 * pitti resets the whole two a11y trees
<pitti> restarting session
<seb128> pitti, the gst plugin one is fine
<seb128> pitti, check on org.gnome.desktop.a11y.keyboard enable
<agateau> desrt: ping
<pitti> seb128: hm, still crashes with everything reset
<pitti> anyway, meeting, will check again later
<pitti> seb128: also crashes in a guest session
<seb128> pitti, hum, wtf, will debug tomorrow after ff rush if that works for you
<seb128> pitti, but it works here so it's not an everybody having it issue
<pitti> Laney, kenvandine: ah, bummer -- libmozjs185-dev is in universe, so libproxy is depwait
<Laney> argh
<kenvandine> :(
<Laney> was it intended to go to main?
<pitti> I guess not
<pitti> we might need to disable that plugin from libproxy
<pitti> kenvandine: pinged you because you apparently contributed the patch to build against it
<kenvandine> just a rename
<kenvandine> it had depended on the unverioned one
<kenvandine> unversioned
<Laney> just means that people have to use libjscore to interpret PAC files
<pitti> kenvandine: I see libmozjs-dev was in main in hardy, but I don't konw whether chrisccoulson is happy about it being in main
<seb128> Laney, pitti: until now we built with webkit and not gjs in ubunt
 * kenvandine would rather not use libmozjs
<desrt> agateau: hey
 * desrt wonders: is it common practice to have patches directly in the .diff.gz anymore?
<desrt> is this a result of packaging out of git or something?
<hallyn> does anyone here make any changes to the expo compiz plugin?  should the active desktop be getting colored or highlighted somehow?
 * desrt is used to seeing debian/patches/
<hallyn> (bc it isn't)
<agateau> desrt: some time ago you mentionned a linked attribute for GtkButtonBox or something similar, which would be useful to implement the gnome-control-center breadcrumbs
<dobey> desrt: in the .diff.gz?
<agateau> desrt: I can't find it :/
<dobey> desrt: usually in the dpkg source files, the patches end up in the .diff.gz or the debian.tar.gz, depending on which source format is used
<desrt> agateau: let me bang you up some demo code
<agateau> desrt: thanks!
<desrt> agateau: http://fpaste.org/c4GB/
<seb128> desrt, well, depends, typically you will get patches in the diff.gz for dx packages
<desrt> seb128: i see it here for libxml2
<seb128> desrt, because we bzr merge -c <rev> in the packaging vcs to backport upstream fixes
<seb128> desrt, which is handled by the vcs without needing a patch system
<jbicha> so I'd like to get gnome-boxes into Precise, don't know if it'll happen by feature freeze though, prerequisites are bug 931783 & bug 931803
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 931783 in ubuntu "Please package libosinfo 0.1.0" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931783
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 931803 in spice-gtk "[needs-packaging] Please package spice-gtk 0.9" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931803
<seb128> desrt, I think libxml is "old school debian"
<desrt> seb128: seems to be
<desrt> debian packaging is so broken :)
<seb128> jbicha, I think we should delay that to next week and ffe
<seb128> jbicha, it's universe should be easier to get, we still rush for stuff in main this week
<desrt> (or at least, debian packaging as it was apparently originally intended to be used)
<agateau> desrt: I assume this needs style support to work? I don't see any difference with Ambiance
 * agateau tries Adwaita
<desrt> agateau: yes.  probably.
<jbicha> seb128: yeah by next week, spice-gtk should just be a sync from Debian, maybe libosinfo too
<desrt> if ambiance doesn't support it it should start supporting it soon
<desrt> because gnome is starting to use it
<seb128> jbicha, did spice-gtk made it to debian already?
<jbicha> seb128: the new version is waiting in the new quee
<jbicha> *queue
<seb128> jbicha, ok, we can sync when it goes through, debian new is not slow nowadays
<agateau> desrt: nicer with Adwaita, it turns into segmented buttons
<desrt> agateau: yup
<agateau> desrt: I like your solution, but I would need to create my own "class" and thus it won't work well with any theme which does not explicitly support this
<agateau> mmm
<desrt> agateau: themes will need to support this
<desrt> agateau: i think the correct course of action here is to poke cimi for getting support in ambiance
<desrt> and then proceed as if you know you have it
<agateau> desrt: ok, assuming this is not a problem, is it possible for the theme to make the buttons overlap?
<desrt> no.  probably not.
<desrt> gtk won't let the theme get involved in size allocation to that extent
<desrt> and in general it's not possible to have overlapping widgets in gtk
 * agateau is messing with GtkFixed right now, don't tell desrt
<desrt> you want some array effect like [ / > home > agateau ] ?
<desrt> *arrow
<agateau> yes
<desrt> ya.  that will be quite difficult.
<agateau> or rather design team wants
<desrt> well
<desrt> depending on what is supposed to happen when you hover/click
<desrt> you could very obviously (and easily) "cheat"
<desrt> but that probably would only work for when you're not interacting with it
<desrt> is there a video somewhere of the intended behaviour?
<agateau> you mean put the whole arrow as part of one of the button?
<desrt> i was thinking half-and-half
<desrt> but ya... that's the basic idea
<agateau> iirc software-center widget used to just put the whole arrow in the button on the left
<desrt> it would be extremely easy for you to do that, obviously
<desrt> and honestly, i'd leave it to the theme to implement it
<agateau> and this way it can be done on the theme side
<desrt> like put "linked" and "breadcrumb" attributes on it
<desrt> and then let the theme do what it pleases
<desrt> the css-based styling gives enough power to do this, i'm pretty sure
<desrt> if it doesn't understand "breadcrumb" then at least it will be linked
<agateau> that sounds easier to do than what I was about to try
<agateau> I am going to check with Cimi then
<agateau> thanks!
<desrt> the power of css!
<desrt> ;)
<agateau> :)
<desrt> on the actual 'code' size, you will end up with an extreme trivial GtkButtonBox subclass, i guess
<desrt> *extremely
<agateau> yes, I already have that
<agateau> so if Cimi agrees, I am basically done :)
<desrt> you should join #gtk+ on gimpnet
<desrt> i'd be happier if you talked to Company or cosimoc about this
<desrt> they probably have some thoughts on the topic and they both know the area better than i do
<agateau> I would rather not get people yell at me for butchering upstream (cf. comments didrock got on his blog post about display settings)
<desrt> i think the yelling only comes when there is no attempt to collaborate
<desrt> asking for opinions first is a good way to avoid the yelling
<desrt> maybe they already have some (better?) plans here and you are just duplicating efforts
<seb128> mterry, hey, can you do me another favor? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-printers/+bug/932759
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932759 in indicator-printers "[MIR] indicator-printers" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> mterry, it's a new indicator should be easy to review
<mterry> seb128, nothing like FF to bring MIRs out the of the woodwork  :)
<agateau> desrt: that is true
<seb128> mterry, ;-)
<agateau> desrt: I assume you are on this chan, in case things get nasty?
<seb128> mterry, well that one is a combo, it was upload, get it NEWed (thanks didrocks), now need a mir and promotion
<desrt> agateau: yes.  of course.
<didrocks> mterry: just my conditional note on the build: the priority needs to be extra and the description be fixed
<agateau> desrt: ok, let's go
 * desrt goes to have a shower
<desrt> =)
<desrt> (you asked if i was on the channel... not if i would be active) ;)
<desrt> agateau: http://diylol.com/meme-generator/socially-awkward-penguin/memes/says-hi-in-gtk-gets-kickbanned
<agateau> desrt: so much for trying to be polite
<pitti> Laney, kenvandine: so, want me to try and build without mozjs, or are you on it already?
<pitti> kenvandine: or could we build against firefox-dev somehow?
<kenvandine> pitti, i don't think so, but haven't looked at it in quite a while
<Amoz> hi guys, I've got a small enhancement for the nautilus-terminal project, remapping the F4 toggle button to F7, thus not toggling the terminal when closing overlaying apps with alt+f4
<Amoz> maybe someone here has upload rights to the nautilus-terminal project? :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - build what against firefox-dev? i bet you don't really want to do that ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'm just disabling the mozjs plugin from libproxy for now
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, you couldn't build that against firefox-dev anyway
<chrisccoulson> well, you might be able to do it by linking against a 31MB libxul.so, but there isn't a separate libmozjs in firefox
<chrisccoulson> it's all statically linked ;)
<desrt> agateau: was that as bad as you thought? :p
<agateau> desrt: nope :)
<agateau> desrt: I expect some snarky comments when I pasted the mockup url, but that didn't come
<desrt> agateau: i can give them to you now, if you like :)
<desrt> "ew.  dark theme?  you weirdo."
<agateau> desrt: ah thanks, that feels better
<jibel> todays' updates broke my custom navigation shortcuts. I filed bug 932807
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932807 in unity "applications grab custom navigation shortcuts" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/932807
<jibel> and also now g-c-c is crashing
<jibel> :( bad day for an update
<desrt> jibel: be thankful you didn't update yesterday :)
<seb128> bah
<seb128> mterry, I'm hiding in shame, the german and french let go through without noticing the missing translations and you the american spoted it
<seb128> ;-)
 * kenvandine rofl
<seb128> kenvandine, there is nothing fun there, NOTHING :p
<kenvandine> i am used to being the one missing that stuff :)
<seb128> mterry, thanks for the review and nice catch ;-)
<mandel> has anyone experienced the following: http://paste.ubuntu.com/843187/ with gnome-control-center, to be precise when trying to access the network settings
<didrocks> sil2100: I saw that you removed some of the _descritpion in the test, which makes the result difficulty readable. Not your fault, I should have done the review better, but just a warning of being careful :)
<seb128> mandel, can you get a backtrace using gdb?
<mandel> seb128, sure, let me take a look
<mterry> seb128, :)
<didrocks> sil2100: is there any progress on the compiz side btw?
<mandel> seb128, should I bee looking for something?
<seb128> mandel, no, just pastebin the backtrace
<mandel> ack
<sil2100> didrocks: wait, what description ;)?
<sil2100> Ah, from checkbox?
<didrocks> sil2100: yeah
<didrocks> sil2100: it screwed the result collecter though, I just pushed a fixed version. The issue is that checkbox is not forgiving on the format :/
<pitti> good night everyone!
<seb128> 'night pitti
<sil2100> didrocks: oh my, sorry about that!
<sil2100> hmm
<didrocks> have a good night pitti
<sil2100> pitti: goodnight
<didrocks> sil2100: no worry, just to tell you we have to be really careful with it :)
<sil2100> Ouch! Now I see what you mean
<sil2100> How is it possible? I didn't even remember removing those ;)
<sil2100> Those probably got cut out by my misuse of vim and 'd'
<mandel> seb128, I hope this is all the info you need from gdb: http://paste.ubuntu.com/843221/
<seb128> mandel, report a bug using ubuntu-bug if it's detecting the segfault, the stacktrace is not that useful it needs debug symbols or retracing
<mandel> seb128, ubuntu-bug does not detect it, do you know how can get the debug symbols?
<seb128> mandel, are you sure it doesn't?
<seb128> mandel, ls /var/crash
<seb128> mandel, check /var/log/apport.log
<seb128> you might want to rm stuff in that dir and try again
 * mandel looks
<mandel> seb128, apport complains with the following 'Could not determine the package or source package name.'
<mandel> seb128, let me see the report of the crash
<seb128> mandel, do you have an apt source containing the binary which is hitting the bug?
<seb128> what is the command in the report?
<seb128> what dpkg -S on it says?
<mandel> seb128, the command in the report is: ProcCmdline: gnome-control-center
<seb128> mandel, ok, dunno, to debug with pitti tomorrow
<mandel> seb128, and dpkg -S gives the following: http://paste.ubuntu.com/843228/
<sil2100> didrocks: about that compiz keybinding bug - I'm in the middle of investigating right now
<didrocks> sil2100: ok, thanks :)
<seb128> mandel, sorry I've no time for that today, ff tonight, come back tomorrow
<sil2100> Sam told me to check the most recent source version of compiz-core, and it's still there
<didrocks> sil2100: the hot list for compiz is https://bugs.launchpad.net/compiz-core/+bugs?field.tag=compiz-ff-precise
<mandel> seb128, ok, I'll ping him about it tom, he is in germany atm, right?
<mandel> seb128, no problem :)
<seb128> mandel, yes
<sil2100> So I'm looking into it, and it seems that once a keybinding is modified, it stops working
<didrocks> weird that sam asked you that, we are already on tip of compiz-core :/
<seb128> mandel, but pitti hit a bug in the panel earlier so I suspect there is an issue and we will get reports about it
<mandel> seb128, I'll just change the proxy settings via  gconf-editor
<sil2100> But when it's not touched, it works, so hm, will keep you informed
<didrocks> sil2100: ok, thanks :)
<sil2100> didrocks: thanks for the list ;)
<seb128> mandel, oh, it's the proxy, yes, pitti reported the issue earlier
<desrt> didrocks: hey
<mandel> seb128, do you know the bug number so that i can listen to it?
<desrt> didrocks: did you know about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bamf/+bug/924471 ?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 924471 in bamf "Developer doc is empty in devhelp" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> mandel, it's probably bug #932644
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932644 in gnome-control-center "gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in g_type_check_instance_cast()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/932644
<seb128> mandel, pitti's stacktrace was similar
<mandel> seb128, superb, thx for the help!
<seb128> mandel, yw
<didrocks> desrt: oh interesting
<didrocks> desrt: trevino assigned it to himself, I think that the doc generation is maybe broken, I'll have a look
<desrt> awesome.  thanks :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: hey, around?
<mdeslaur> pitti: remmina got promoted to main, but there is a security issue in it: LP: #760381
<mdeslaur> pitti: oh, wait a sec, it may be fixed already
 * mdeslaur got confused by date of bug
<kenvandine> hey didrocks
<didrocks> kenvandine: small question on the video lens
<mdeslaur> pitti: yeah, false alert, please ignore me
<didrocks> kenvandine: you have two sources, is that on purpose? can't that be merged in one? (maybe easier for the maintainance)
<kenvandine> davidcalle, ^^^
<kenvandine> didrocks, i didn't really question that
<didrocks> kenvandine: also, no COPYING file in unity-lens-video :/
<kenvandine> i think the remote scope might get updated more often
<kenvandine> there should be...
<kenvandine> he merged my branch adding it :)
<kenvandine> maybe it didn't make it into the tarball
<didrocks> kenvandine: I just apt-get source the one you sponsored :p
<davidcalle> kenvandine, the COPYING was in only one of the sources
<davidcalle> :)
<kenvandine> not in the manifest
<kenvandine> whoops :)
<kenvandine> davidcalle, can you add that to MANIFEST.in ?
<davidcalle> kenvandine, done ;)
<didrocks> debian/source/format should be (quilt) or version 1.0
<didrocks> not native
<kenvandine> oh... i didn't bzr add it either :)
<didrocks> it's not a native package :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, i removed that... grr
<kenvandine> maybe i uploaded the wrong source :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: no worry :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, reject it and i'll re-upload :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, is that in both of them?
<didrocks> yeah, I'm finishing looking at it!
<didrocks> kenvandine: just in one for now
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<didrocks> davidcalle: kenvandine: it's weird that po/en_US.po isn't turned in a mo file with a local build
<kenvandine> oh
<didrocks> davidcalle: kenvandine: not import for ubuntu with the langpack but something should be broken in setup.py
<kenvandine> the problem is the debian dir is in the orig tarball!
<didrocks> ah, also
<didrocks> the lens refers to /usr/share/unity/5/lens-nav-video.svg
<didrocks> which isn't installed by the package
<didrocks> that should be it for the first one, rejecting
<kenvandine> davidcalle, can you create tarballs without the debian directory in them?
<davidcalle> kenvandine, sure.
<didrocks> so same thing on scope-video-remote
<didrocks> no COPYING
<didrocks> same debhelper hint, davidcalle, should be 8
<didrocks> same remark on the (native) for source format
<didrocks> also, just to be nitpicky: ${shlibs:Depends}, is not necessary :)
<m4n1sh> didrocks: can you check this #930091 - is this blocked by FF?
<m4n1sh> https://bugs.launchpad.net/activity-log-manager/+bug/930091
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 930091 in activity-log-manager "offer deletion of existing events for newly-added blacklists" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<tkamppeter> anyone here who can help me on a sync problem?
<didrocks> m4n1sh: sorry, missing context, can you illustrate with an example?
<didrocks> kenvandine: davidcalle: reject the scope as well
<davidcalle> didrocks, no shlibs for both?
<didrocks> davidcalle: yep
<davidcalle> Ok and debhelper (>= 8)
<didrocks> do not forget debian/compat to bump to 8
<m4n1sh> didrocks: example. you blacklisted gedit. so a dialog box will come up and ask "do you want to delete all the previously logged events for this application?"
<davidcalle> Yep
<tkamppeter> I want to sync the "pnm2ppa" package with Debian, once Debian's package needs all our needs, and second, to get rid of a broken upstream source tarball.
<didrocks> m4n1sh: it will need a FFe, yeah
<m4n1sh> probably then I will avoid it.
<m4n1sh> didrocks: any build system changes are not part? right? like the --with-ccpanel
<m4n1sh> and it doesnt probe itself and has to be passed explicitly
<didrocks> m4n1sh: nothing too fanzy, but avoid changing build system
<m4n1sh> okay
<charles> seb128: fwiw, I'm glad for mterry's g-c-c patch to go in instead of mine, it's all good
<mhr3> kenvandine, i have a little patch here in works for gwibber lens :)
<seb128> charles, great, sorry that you guys ended duplicating work
<charles> he didn't see the ticket so we didn't know each other was working on it. life goes on
<seb128> charles, we need to be a bit better in track cross team specs next cycle
<charles> well, it /was/ tracked ;)
<seb128> yeah, too much tracking :p
<seb128> doubled ;-)
<charles> anyway I agree with you wrt the alignment in my patch & am glad you can swap another one in before freeze
<sil2100> hm, when exactly is the freeze?
<charles> I needed to talk to mterry about something else, do you know what tz he's in?
<seb128> sil2100, in 5 hours
<seb128> charles, thanks
<kklimonda> seb128: wrt to blocklist hosting - what about putting it somewhere under *.debian.net (with a redirect to debian mainainer's server)? They have the same issue with squeeze version of transmission so we could maybe use the same place - and it's going to be much easier to get a hosting there ;)
<seb128> charles, east coast u.s
<sil2100> Holy shit!
<seb128> charles, he should be around
<seb128> kklimonda, would work for me ;-)
<charles> but of course the most urgent question is, Is Transmission 2.50 uploaded ;)
<seb128> charles, yes, jbicha did it before I woke up today
<seb128> ;-)
<charles> yay!
<kklimonda> \o/
<kenvandine> mhr3, patches welcome, what does it do?
<mhr3> kenvandine, fixes the search for multiple words etc
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I got gnome-control-center 3.3.5 working with all our patches I think
<seb128> I will upload to the ppa in a bit
<jbicha> seb128: awesome!
<seb128> hey jbicha
<seb128> jbicha, I had to revert some your changes, we can't drop the library that would break stuff that we integrate there
<jbicha> dropping the library is an upstream change, the headers still work
<jbicha> I still have the privacy, additional drivers panels etc in my System Settings 3.3.5 for instance
<seb128> jbicha, that doesn't make sense
<seb128> jbicha, you probably didn't uninstall libgnome-control-center1 3.3.2
<seb128> jbicha, i.e probably still have the old binary on disk
<jbicha> seb128: no, it doesn't need it, the library is part of the main binary now
 * didrocks waves good evening
<seb128> jbicha, I'm pretty surprised, i.e deja-dup depends on libgnome-control-center1
<seb128> jbicha, can you rm /usr/lib/libgnome-control-center.so.1.0.0 and confirm it still works?
<seb128> well it might resolve the symbols in the shell binary but that seems something I'm not sure I want to rely on
<jbicha> seb128: yes it still works after deleting that file
<seb128> jbicha, well anyway I restored the lib for that version, I will play with dropping if after ff when I've time to look at details
<seb128> jbicha, and you can rebuild the rdepends without the lib?
<seb128> jbicha, I'm surprised, only have the .h shouldn't be enough, you need the lib to resolve the symbols are build time
<seb128> jbicha, I doubt stuff will link against the g-c-c binary
<seb128> it's not a lib
<jbicha> seb128: yes, I tested rebuilding indicator-datetime for instance a month ago
<seb128> jbicha, with /usr/lib/libgnome-control-center.so.1.0.0 deleted?
<seb128> jbicha, upstream would have dropped the lib earlier if it was not needed, they kept it to be able to build gnome-bluetooth
<seb128> jbicha, well anyway, I'm just really suprised if the lib was not needed at all, I will check, thanks for the infos, it's interesting ;-)
<jbicha> seb128: I built with my sbuild so it was a clean environment, and it doesn't need the library to run
<seb128> jbicha, ok, I don't understand why ;-)
<seb128> jbicha, it should need to resolve the symbols at build time and they are in a binary in /usr/bin, that's not somewhere the linker look for symbols
<seb128> jbicha, ok, I don't understand why ;-)
<seb128> jbicha, it should need to resolve the symbols at build time and they are in a binary in /usr/bin, that's not somewhere the linker look for symbols
<seb128> jbicha, I'm interested to understand why it works but I will look after ff ;-)
<seb128> jbicha, I'm also curious why bastien didn't drop the lib earlier if it was not needed
<dobey> is sshd not working for anyone else on precise?
<seb128> dobey, works for me
<dobey> seb128: hrmm, it seems to be working now, after i restarted it a few times :-/
<achiang> desrt: ping
<desrt> hi
<seb128> TheMuso, I reverted your gtk uploaded, it turned g-c-c to segfault land and several people need to land and test g-c-c changes and I've no time to debug gtk
<desrt> seb128: new upstream release causing problems?
<seb128> TheMuso, please talk to me and get review before doing another gtk upload, we can't create too much installability issues around freeze time, and I would prefer getting a new tarball that playing backporting 15 commits
<seb128> desrt, no, backporting of a stack of git commits
<desrt> ah. ya.
<seb128> desrt, https://i92984147.restricted.launchpadlibrarian.net/92984147/Stacktrace.txt?token=e21bc64c12937ea01a6eddd00ee120c1
<seb128> is the stacktrace
<seb128> desrt, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/92923817/gtk%2B3.0_3.3.14-0ubuntu1_3.3.14-0ubuntu2.diff.gz is the upload
<desrt> achiang: how can i help?
<seb128> it seems broken as well, not sure what TheMuso did
<seb128> + get_effective_focus_column@Base 3.3.14-0ubuntu2
<seb128> that doesn't seem an upstream symbol, or that's really buggy
<seb128> in fact it's a commit from Company
<seb128> not sure where the commit stack is commit from though
<seb128> pitti, ^ your g-c-c segfaulting when trying to set a proxy was due to that
<seb128> we got like a dozen bugs similar today
<desrt> seb128: something to do with a11y.  looks to be a bug upstream as well, actually
<seb128> desrt, right, I just don't have time to debug it before ff and it's create lot of issues, I reverted for today, I guess TheMuso will follow up upstream
<seb128> TheMuso, ^ can you do that, the bugs it created are listed in the changelog
<desrt> seb128: it'll get fixed next time someone types 'make check' :)
<seb128> desrt, ;-)
<desrt> typical symbol leak mistake
<seb128> desrt, btw g-c-c 3.3.5 is in the ubuntu-desktop ppa, I got it before ff! (not built yet though)
<desrt> seb128: you're a brave man :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> that being done -> dinner
<seb128> bbiab
<desrt> hum
<desrt> i forgot to eat today, it seems
 * desrt should have some lunch :)
<ockham> hi, i've posted a bug report requesting a merge for scribus (from sid), and i've also attached a debdiff to take care  of the merge to it. could someone upload it?
<ockham> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/scribus/+bug/932962
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932962 in scribus "Please merge scribus 1.4.0.dfsg+r17300-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New]
<jbicha> ockham: did you see bug 930639 ?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 930639 in scribus "Please merge scribus 1.4.0.dfsg+r17287-1 (main) from Debian sid (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/930639
<ockham> jbicha: no, unfortunately :-(
<ockham> jbicha: but that debian version is also a bit outdated since they're now at r17300
<ockham> so, anyone?
<mterry> tedg, charles: Anyone want to review an indicator-messages branch for me?  Doesn't need a release, I can distro patch, but I'd like another set of eyeballs before releasing unto the world.
<mterry> https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/indicator-messages/tell-accounts-services/+merge/93290
<charles> mterry: larsu would be an excellent choice for that, he just got done doing patches for indicator-messages
<charles> I saw him in #systems just a minute ago but don't see him in here
<seb128> charles, to be fair it's 9pm in europe
<seb128> charles, so it seems it would be better to have u.s guys to look at it rather than asking lars to keep working
<charles> hm, you're right
<charles> ok then, I'll grab it
<mterry> Do we have tomorrow to push things in too?  Or just tonight?  I can never remember
<charles> this is my first time through, so I don't know :)
<seb128> mterry, nobody can, I asked earlier, you have still 23h57 min
<seb128> mterry, they keep changing  it :p
<mterry> nice
<seb128> mterry, it's 21utc tomorrow
<mterry> Don't think I need it, but still good for disasters
<seb128> mterry, do you want me to find a reason for you to need it? ;-)
<mterry> seb128, I need a head start for UI Freeze!
<seb128> hum
<seb128> mterry, ok, if that's for bringing the bling I'm happy with that ;-)
<micahg> actually, 24hr and 55 min
<charles> mterry: one superficial but useful trick I learned recently, you can replace all those "if (foo != NULL) { g_object_unref(foo); foo = NULL; }" blocks with "g_clear_object(&foo)" which is a little like g_clear_error() but for GObjects
<mterry> charles, ooh, fancy
 * mterry hates writing async gobject code in C
<Sweetshark> hmm, why do we have a poppler-0.18.3-0 source package, when sid is still at 0.16.7-3 but it is producing a libpopper-private-dev package for later migration, that we do not yet create. should I file a bug?
<seb128> Sweetshark, no
<seb128> dunno what debian is doing but that's broken
<charles> mterry: in "g_variant_get(foo, "(&o)", &bar)", the '&' before 'o' tells gvariant to return its own internal pointer so that we can skip an unncessary g_strdup()/g_free() sequence, is that right?
<seb128> we updated and ported all the rdepends
<Sweetshark> seb128: "dd a libpoppler-private-dev package: it will contain the private poppler core headers, but at the moment it is empty to allow sources to migrate their (build-)dependencies from libpoppler-dev to it.
<Sweetshark> from the sid poppler changelog at http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/p/poppler/poppler_0.16.7-3/changelog
<seb128> Sweetshark, seems like the debian poppler maintainer is on crack
<desrt> chrisccoulson: around?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, if you are *hide*
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> desrt, sort of ;)
<Sweetshark> seb128: please communicate that verbatim to _rene_
 * Sweetshark doesnt dare to.
<seb128> lol
<seb128> let's look at that tomorrow
<mterry> charles, yah
<mterry> charles, pointer lasts until the variant dies, obvi
<charles> *nod*
<seb128> chrisccoulson, kenvandine, mterry, cyphermox, jbicha: the new gnome-control-center should be in the ppa, if you could test it that would be welcome, I want to upload a bit later if it's working ok
<seb128> just make sure you got the new gtk or yesterday's one, the update today broke stuff
<seb128> i.e don't blame g-c-c for the buggy gtk update :p
<kenvandine> okie dokie
 * dobey wonders who to beg to get twisted 12.0 into debian/ubuntu before tomorrow
<seb128> you can still try with the buggy gtk but if like proxy segfault that's not my fault
<seb128> dobey, good luck with that
<kenvandine> dobey, i should have gwibber uploaded without the webkit-gtk2 depends today :)
<kenvandine> if that helps at all... i suspect not
<dobey> kenvandine: yay
<dobey> well, it doesn't help with twisted :)
<cyphermox> seb128: will test in a second. what's the good gtk version?
<dobey> guess i can just propose a twisted package that patches in the bits we need/want, for now
<seb128> cyphermox, 3.3.14-0ubuntu2 is the bad one
<cyphermox> gotcha
<seb128> cyphermox, so either 0ubuntu1 or 0ubuntu3 is good
<cyphermox> seb128: any noteworthy changes?
<cyphermox> nevermind me, I should just read changelog
<seb128> cyphermox, the changelog is not very informative (yet), just see if stuff work fine for you
<cyphermox> ok
<seb128> cyphermox, you can easily see that you got the new version by looking at the top left icon grid which replaced the "all settings" label
<seb128> cyphermox, wacom is the biggest change if you have one of those devices I think (I don't have one to test)
<seb128> cyphermox, otherwise that's mostly lot of small visual improvements and bug fixes at different places, hard to summarize or give a big change
<seb128> if things seem to work fine that's good enough info for me ;-)
<cyphermox> I assume the accesibility graphical tab has larger labels on purpose?
<seb128> yes
<cyphermox> seems to work just fine to me
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks for testing!
<cyphermox> I wish it didn't shift so much as modules are opened
<seb128> yeah, that's a bit disturbing
<seb128> but I guess normal users don't change panels so much
<cyphermox> oh well, in general it works, the rest is cosmetics
<cyphermox> right
<seb128> they most open the shell and click on one or directly access it by the dash or indicator
<cyphermox> sure
<cyphermox> now that reminds me I should fix the bluetooth pin dialog if possible
<cyphermox> it shows up under most windows :(
<seb128> mterry, do you still have your gimp update locally and forgot to push or did you overlook the vcs?
<seb128> mterry, don't bother if that's the second, I can commit it
<seb128> mterry, just noticed that the version I was about to upload is already in the archive, the vcs just didn't get it
<TheMuso> seb128: Sure, apologies that it caused issues... I wouldn't have backported if orca upstream didn't explicitly ask me to backport them so that they wouldn't have been hounded by users on precise running orca, but I guess in the long term they can just suffer hangs as it is still a devel release after all.
<seb128> TheMuso, sorry for getting angry before, today has been busy with ff rush and that fall as an issue in the middle blocking testing etc
<TheMuso> seb128: I understand, I'll get upstream to talk to you first if such a situation comes up again.
<seb128> TheMuso, well, gtk upstream roll a tarball every 2.5 weeks or so atm so I think we can wait a few extra days and get something tested
<TheMuso> seb128: and you had every right to be annoyed.
<seb128> TheMuso, I was mostly surprised at the stack of commits you backported, usually we backport some small fixes or wait for the next version
<seb128> TheMuso, anyway I didn't have time to investigate but could you check if trunk has the same issue as your backports?
<TheMuso> Yep.
<kenvandine> seb128, dobey gwibber uploaded, no more depends on webkit-gtk2 :)
<TheMuso> seb128: Once i've read up on it a bit more, I will do so yes.
<seb128> TheMuso, basically pitti said that opening the network capplet and selecting proxy was enough to segfault it for him
<seb128> kenvandine, \o/
<TheMuso> Ok.
<seb128> TheMuso, do you get that issue on your version? I didn't update today so I didn't have a chance to try if that was doing the same here
<TheMuso> seb128: Yup, crash, will test with git master.
<seb128> TheMuso, ok, good, that gives you start point ;-)
<seb128> TheMuso, thanks for looking to it
<TheMuso> No problem, and apologies. I feel terrible.
<TheMuso> But you live and learn.
<seb128> TheMuso, if you get another version you want to upload please bunch stuff in one patch and put it in the vcs, I will review,test it tomorrow
<dobey> kenvandine: yay
<seb128> TheMuso, no need to feel terrible, it can happen to anyone, it's not like session was not starting so it was easy to overlook even with testing
<TheMuso> Yep.
<seb128> TheMuso, I just found it because it traced back what changed which could explain lot of segfaults in gtk coming from retracers today
<TheMuso> Yep.
<jbicha> seb128: your new System Settings works here
<seb128> jbicha, thanks for testing!
<robert_ancell> mterry, hey
<TheMuso> seb128: So upstrea forgot to tell me that they had to rebuild gcc for things to work properly again, same with nautilus, so I dare say when we get the new tarball we will have to do the same thing. I'll check locally to be 100% sure.
<seb128> oh, a robert_ancell
<seb128> TheMuso, that seems like an abi incompatible change
<seb128> desrt, ^ is that "normal" that a gtk upload requires rebuild of gtk users to not segfault?
<TheMuso> seb128: Agreed. WIll check with git master anyway.
 * robert_ancell hides
<desrt> seb128: no.
<desrt> seb128: but certainly not 'unacceptable' during an unstable series
<desrt> that said, i don't know of anything right now that would require that
<seb128> desrt, ok, let's see what that is about if,when it's confirmed
<seb128> that seems weird to be
<robert_ancell> seb128, we are picking up the latest shotwell right?  I'm packaging gexiv2 atm
<seb128> robert_ancell, yes
<seb128> robert_ancell, thanks for doing that update
<seb128> robert_ancell, btw I'm updating g-c-c to 3.3 as we speak
<seb128> robert_ancell, well rather I did the update today, I'm uploading
<robert_ancell> seb128, btw I'm going to try and do a mad crazy sprint today and get gnome-screensaver to look like u-g so we have a solution for 12.04...
<seb128> robert_ancell, \o/
<robert_ancell> it's not going to be pretty code wise though :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, technically it's uif work, i.e you still have a week
<seb128> robert_ancell, but better to land something and improve then ;-)
<robert_ancell> really?  ok then
<seb128> robert_ancell, no, forget that
<robert_ancell> I have it on public record :P
<seb128> robert_ancell, (never remove the motivation to get stuff done :p)
<seb128> damn
<kenvandine> seems strange to have a week between FF and UIF, isn't that usually longer?
<seb128> kenvandine, it was 2 weeks last cycle
<kenvandine> i added something that was very ugly in gwibber specifically to motivate njpatel to make it prettier :)
<kenvandine> i hope he does it :)
<seb128> one month in natty
<seb128> so yeah
<seb128> it's shrinking :p
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> seb128, i poked around in g-c-c
<seb128> g-c-c 3.3.5 upload to precise, fear ;-)
<kenvandine> seems ok
<seb128> good
<seb128> kenvandine, I would have sweared if you just told me a minute after upload that it was broken :p
<kenvandine> hehe
<seb128> if it's broken I blame it on robert_ancell
<seb128> he did all those gdbus ports!
<robert_ancell> seb128, what's broken?
<kenvandine> i need to get away from the computer for a couple hours, 19 hours yesterday has wiped me out
<kenvandine> davidcalle, i'll re-upload the lens and scope when i come back, just get me new tarballs
<seb128> robert_ancell, nothing, I just updated g-c-c to the new serie, the ratio bug fixes,crazy changes was way in favor of the bug fixes
<seb128> robert_ancell, I'm covering in case the update has issues ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, but it seems to work fine so far
<davidcalle> kenvandine, ok :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, I reverted some stuff like the keybindings switch to gsettings though, but it seems it should be easy to get that done dynamically at runtime, if jbicha or ricotz look at doing that we might get the new gnome-shell after all for this cycle
<robert_ancell> seb128, sorry I missed that - are we going with g-c-c 3.4?
<seb128> robert_ancell, yes
<seb128> robert_ancell, that's what I was saying, I just uploaded 3.3.5
<robert_ancell> seb128, what drugs did desrt give you?
<seb128> lol
<robert_ancell> but yay \o/
<jasoncwarner_> hey robert_ancell and RAOF see this bug.... do you think it is in greeter/lightdm or x? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server/+bug/932611 I originally thought compiz, but seems not so much
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932611 in xorg-server "visual corruption on startup (before desktop)" [High,Confirmed]
<seb128> robert_ancell, I spent a week looking what fixes I wanted to backport, and I was like over 35 commits and I figured it would be easier to update and back out stuff I don't want
<seb128> robert_ancell, well "spent a week", look to it a bit and spent some time thinking about it, it didn't take me a week ;-)
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, since after the multi-monitor u-g upload?
<robert_ancell> seb128, yaeh
<jasoncwarner_> jasoncwarner_: yeah, I think so...I saw it first time 2 days ago
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell, rather ^^
<seb128> hey jasoncwarner_
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: and I thought it was compiz
<seb128> the multimonitor is not 2 days old I think
<jasoncwarner_> seb128: ! you should be sleeping, I'm pretty sure
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: That's basically the long standing âthere's nothing drawn on the screen between unity-greeter and g-s-d setting the wallpaperâ bug, isn't it?+
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: not sure, but I do know that I had not had the issue before, it just started
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, hang on, I haven't uploaded the latest u-g.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: makes book look pretty, uh, bad ;) lots of visual corruptions etc
<robert_ancell> RAOF, what happens if the resolution changes between u-g and the desktop?  I'm leaving the root window there so if it stays the same it should be seamless (it was for me)
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, RAOF, robert_ancell: just as a piece of info, when I updated to the new g-s-d (which was in the ppa for 2 days), my external monitor changed from showing the lightdm wallpaper tiled (login is 1440 because mirror, desktop 1920) to see nothing
<robert_ancell> but if it changes, no idea what the driver could do
<seb128> during login
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Right.  There's no sensible thing to do; except maybe blank.
<seb128> like before I could see the lightdm wallpaper in 1440 and tiled around
<robert_ancell> seb128, does that happen with the u-g you tried last night?
<seb128> since the g-s-d update I see a blank screen
<seb128> robert_ancell, yeah, I go from login to nothing to desktop
<seb128> which I find better than the tiled background
<RAOF> Well, that's an improvement.
<seb128> none is perfect though
<jasoncwarner_> I think blanking is better than the visual corruptions or tiling for sure
<jasoncwarner_> antyhing that makes the user think something borked their desktop == bad ;)
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, want to get your hands dirty and compile the new u-g and try it?
<RAOF> Well, what we really *should* be doing is fading to black, doing the modeset ensuring we end up at black, and then fading in to the desktop.
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, if you want to give it a try, wget https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/3.2.2-0ubuntu17/+build/3210683/+files/gnome-settings-daemon_3.2.2-0ubuntu17_amd64.deb and dpkg -i it
<robert_ancell> RAOF, or being optimistic and having the resolutions line up to be seamless
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: sure, can do...but probably not for a couple hours. otp with tim about compiz, unity and hud and then I have to do some x and gnome recruiting
<RAOF> I do not volunteer to make that happen this cycle :)
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, just to see if that's gsd which changed behaviour for you
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, (the deb assuming you are on amd64)
<jasoncwarner_> seb128: that will work for me
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, sleeping> I would if we wouldn't have ff tomorrow :p
<jasoncwarner_> seb128: coffee? ;)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> maybe not, I might not be in bed yet but I do plan to go soon ;-)
<seb128> I just learnt earlier that ff was tomorrow 21utc
<seb128> I though it was 0utc
<seb128> that gives me an extra day
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, RAOF, robert_ancell: see lp bug #850885
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 850885 in gnome-control-center "(oneiric) greeter screen displayed incorrectly with external monitor during login" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/850885
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: thanks...
<robert_ancell> RAOF, do you know of anyone doing nested X servers?  I was just thinking we could get the multi-session composition benefits of Wayland using a nested X servers and I can't think of any technical reason why it wouldn't work (suspect based on Xephyr that there isn't the support for this being fully functional though)
<RAOF> I don't know of anyone doing nested X servers; the problem would be forwarding on all the protocol stuff to the base server.  Currently you can bring up a nested server, as long as you don't want acceleration, 3D, randr, etc.
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: mine is slightly different, no tiling...mine is all jumbled and broken (I'll use my phone to take a pic)
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: What driver?
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: nvidia
<RAOF> GHreau
<RAOF> AONEuaohenudaoenstuha
<RAOF> !
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: no, not that one
<jasoncwarner_> ;)
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: was that the cat?
<RAOF> This is driver dependent; what you're getting is a framebuffer consisting of unitinialised memory.  Which just happens to contain a bunch of stuff from previous sessions.
<RAOF> No, that was me being annoyed with the nvidia driver.
<RAOF> Also the tiny, tiny netbook keyboard that I'm using to try and verify that an older nvidia driver is less sucky at FBOs for DBO.
<robert_ancell> seb128, have you seen the crazy strobe effect when importing in shotwell?
<seb128> robert_ancell, I didn't try to import recently
<DBO> RAOF!!!
<DBO> hows it going babe?
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, if you know which day the change occurred, your /var/log/dpkg.log can be used to narrow down what package(s) might be suspect
<seb128> robert_ancell, could be https://bugs.launchpad.net/light-themes/+bug/931630
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 931630 in light-themes "don't set GtkDrawingArea to have transparent background" [Undecided,Triaged]
<robert_ancell> seb128, I just did an import of ~/Desktop on a blank database and it seems to flash the default gray background between each photo being imported
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, then you'd downgrade each package one by one until the problem resolves, and then we know what to blame
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: ok...I'll take a look
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, there's a lot of rendering stuff going crazy from light themes it seems
<seb128> robert_ancell, if you read the emails from adam he mentioned that is causing some rendering issues, Cimi will look at it after ff he said
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, you may still have the older debs for things in your apt cache (/var/cache/apt), or can download them off launchpad if not
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: that sounds exactly like what I'm getting, btw...what you described above
<jbicha> seb128: oh that was fast, I was going to copy g-c-c to the gnome3 ppa but I guess I don't need to now :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, just drop the http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-art-pkg/light-themes/trunk/revision/184#Ambiance/gtk-3.0/gtk-widgets.css GtkDrawingArea 3 lines and see if that solves it?
<seb128> jbicha, yeah, ff is on us soon ;-)
<seb128> jbicha, it seemed to work fine so I went for it
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, try gsd first in case
<jbicha> yeah, it works
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, I'm sure it changed the lightdm to desktop background transition for me
<robert_ancell> seb128, that fixes it
<seb128> robert_ancell, cool
<seb128> robert_ancell, I will make sure Cimi look at it
<seb128> kenvandine, bug #931630, can you maybe revert the GtkDrawingArea change when you get a free slot?
<robert_ancell> seb128, is there a bug for it?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 931630 in light-themes "don't set GtkDrawingArea to have transparent background" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931630
<seb128> robert_ancell, ^
<seb128> robert_ancell, or feel free to do it if you want
<robert_ancell> seb128, I'll link it to shotwell so no-one goes looking for the problem
<seb128> we can sort if with Cimi later
<seb128> robert_ancell, thanks
<chrisccoulson> is Cimi breaking more stuff? ;)
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: I'm not sure what we can do about this for nvidia, except perhaps raise a bug with them.  Possibly there's something we can do in X.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: my question would be why I'm getting it now, but never got it before?
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: I still have to try the g-s-d that seb128 mentioned, but, yeah, why now?
<mterry> robert_ancell, pong
<robert_ancell> mterry, oh hey, I was just going to say there's a small bug in switching to greeter that is stopping the lightdm release, but otherwise is good to go
<mterry> robert_ancell, sure, k
<jasoncwarner_> seb128 RAOF just tried the latest g-s-d and still have it, fyi.
<bkerensa> jasoncwarner_: Does the engineer role you posted require any fluency in a specific language?
<bkerensa> I didn't notice a mention of any
<bryceh> bkerensa, the X position?
<bkerensa> bryceh: I would have to look
<bryceh> bkerensa, the X position would require fluency in C, and python/bash skills would be desirable
<bkerensa> it was the other one :P
<bkerensa> not the X
<bkerensa> The GNOME engineer
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-02-16
<cyphermox> hey jasoncwarner_
<cyphermox> I've been testing the hidden network case -- here it works fine; I can stop and restart network-manager after disconnecting everything, and since the hidden network is the last activated one, it gets re-activated automatically
<TheMuso> GRRRR! Something has broken Orca's shortcut key functionality. :S
<desrt> TheMuso: good money is on <Primary>
<TheMuso> desrt: Ok, what may have changed things then?
<desrt> TheMuso: does your orca shortcut involve the control key, by chance?
<TheMuso> Hrm and it seems numlock is perminantly on, at least according to orca.
<TheMuso> desrt: No
<TheMuso> desrt: Insert is used as the primary modifier when used on a desktop keyboard.
<desrt> oh.  this probably isn't what i'm thinking of, then
<TheMuso> Ok.
<TheMuso> Hrm. I wonder if its settings-daemon...
<TheMuso> Oh wow, Even broken copy/paste shortcuts are broken.
<TheMuso> gah
<TheMuso> Correctino, they are not
<TheMuso> Ok, its gnome-settings-daemon...
<TheMuso> Just downgraded and after turning numlock off, things work.
<TheMuso> it seems that something is holding numlock on.
<mterry> robert_ancell, do you know how to prevent the cog background from being black?
<robert_ancell> mterry, I assumed that was a GTK problem
<robert_ancell> it never used to be
<mterry> robert_ancell, it is... but not sure if it is now our problem.  I've been playing with it a bit just now
<mterry> robert_ancell, if I just add a basic GtkDrawingArea or whatever, I get a black box
<mterry> robert_ancell, like our widget backgrounds aren't being initialized
<jasoncwarner_> cyphermox: thanks, I'll do a another set of tests here....
<cyphermox> jasoncwarner_: please do
<cyphermox> jasoncwarner_: according to dcbw the case you saw working on gnome-shell could have been an shell bug, where connections got randomly autostarted in some cases -- but I really know nothing of it
<robert_ancell> mterry, it's probably bug 931630
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 931630 in shotwell "don't set GtkDrawingArea to have transparent background" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931630
<ritz> hmm, interesting http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/devel/2012-January/161306.html
<ritz> Changes coming for CUPS 1.6
<micahg> yep, I think we're sticking with 1.5 for precise though
<micahg> we've already got cups-filters in precise though
<cyphermox> robert_ancell: I noticed you started fixing up gnome-nettool, I was going to do it now :)
<ritz> cool
<robert_ancell> cyphermox, beat you to it :P
<cyphermox> robert_ancell: it was pretty cool to see a changelog with a date in the future (for me)
<ritz>  but would we not need avahi to be updated , assuming non-hetrogenous env ?
<micahg> right, one reason not to do it for precise :)
<ritz> fair enough. given the LTS stance
<micahg> right, we'll probably get it early next cycle to get maximum testing
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> tkamppeter_: I see you already uploaded pnm2ppa; do you still want to sync it? (You can do that yourself, BTW)
<kenvandine_> good morning pitti
<pitti> hey kenvandine_
<pitti> kenvandine_: nice gwibber work!
<kenvandine_> shaping up :)
<kenvandine_> i still have quite a bit i want to land before FF :)
<jasoncwarner_> kenvandine_: before FF? cutting it close, aren't you? ;)
<kenvandine_> yup!
<kenvandine_> it is mostly the error handling stuff
<kenvandine_> now that the service can handle it
<kenvandine_> i want to get the backend work in place so we can catch failures nicely... then maybe beg for a freeze exception to add the UI to handle them :)
<kenvandine_> and i want to add an API in libgwibber, that would be used if we manage to get the UI bits in later
<micahg> kenvandine: should gwibber be a dependency of Ubuntu desktop?  I'd like to fix bug 846031, I was wondering if you made it a dependency vs recommends for a reason?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 846031 in ubuntu-meta "ubuntu-desktop shouldn't depends from gwibber" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/846031
<kenvandine_> i thought it was a recommends
<kenvandine_> it used to be because indicator-me depended on gwibber
<kenvandine_> but that is gone
<micahg> right, then you added it to the seed as a depends
<micahg> desktop: * gwibber
<kenvandine_> humm
<micahg> easy enough to fix, was just wondering if there's a reason
<kenvandine_> nope, just needs to be on the CD
<micahg> ok
<micahg> pitti: are you planning a new meta upload for the change you made for the renames prinerdriver?
<pitti> micahg: yes, will do; I collected a few renames yesterday as well
<pitti> micahg: it's not that urgent, though, these packages have transitional names
<micahg> pitti: can you close bug 846031 after I push up this branch?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 846031 in ubuntu-meta "ubuntu-desktop shouldn't depends from gwibber" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/846031
<micahg> I mean close in the meta upload
<pitti> micahg: sure; i. e. you want to move it from depends to recommends, or want me to?
<micahg> I just did it :)
<pitti> nice
<pitti> micahg: need to wait a bit still for the pnm2ppa binaries to publish, will rebuild then
<micahg> sure, no rush, just requesting the bug be closed on upload :)
<kenvandine_> pitti, the latest gwibber version did shave 75K from the deb size :)
<pitti> *applauds* :)
<kenvandine_> i can probably trim it down a little more too
<kenvandine_> i removed some unused icon sizes
<kenvandine_> if i look closely there might be more
<pitti> kenvandine_: FYI, CC'ed you on a mail about gwibber exposing passwords in its apport hook
<kenvandine_> UGH
<kenvandine_> how could it do that...
<kenvandine_> the secret token should never go in the log
<kenvandine_> oh... the sina plugin
<kenvandine_> that is a separate source, maybe they log info they shouldn't
<sm|break> desrt: oh I asume you must know whats up with this <primary> thing then
<BigWhale> Good Morning.
<kenvandine_> hey BigWhale
<kenvandine_> BigWhale, would you have a little time to do a couple reviews for me?
<BigWhale> sure
<kenvandine_> cool
<BigWhale> and it seems that I fixed the utf issue
<kenvandine_> indeed
<kenvandine_> i distro patched that :)
<kenvandine_> thx!
<tjaalton> niice, the new wacom goodness on g-c-c works
<BigWhale> kenvandine, status bar looks ok to me... perhaps we just make it the same color as the toolbar
<kenvandine_> BigWhale, that is kind of what i am hoping njpatel will do
<BigWhale> whoops I just removed empathy
<BigWhale> kenvandine, is gwibber trunk now up to date?
<BigWhale> oh crap I removed a bazillion packages....
<kenvandine_> BigWhale, mostly, i have two more branches i want to get in
<kenvandine_> BigWhale, this is the easier of the two https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/gwibber/status_bar/+merge/93336
<kenvandine_> :)
<BigWhale> is there a way to quickly install all the missing packages that are installed by default?
<RAOF> smspillaz: You need to know about <Primary>?
<smspillaz> yeah
<smspillaz> whats up with that
<RAOF> GTK decided that <Ctrl> wasn't cool enough.
<smspillaz> in ccsm whenever I do <control> something it shows up as <primary>
<RAOF> Right.
<smspillaz> oh nice
<smspillaz> does it actually ... affect anything ?
<RAOF> Or, rather, what was <Ctrl> is now platform-dependent; it's something different on Macs.
<smspillaz> um
<smspillaz> don't macs have a control key too?
<RAOF> Yes.
<RAOF> But that's not the <Primary> key.
<RAOF> I believe that <Option> is <Primary> on Macs.
<RAOF> It does change things, in that I'm not sure you can actually *bind* <Primary>.  Maybe you can.  It was breaking Do, though.
<smspillaz> *facepalm* ?
<RAOF> Yeah, I'm not entirely sure why a fairly significant behaviour change was made to GTK2.
<didrocks> good morning
<RAOF> Heya didrocks!
<BigWhale> kenvandine, merge away :)
<didrocks> hey RAOF!
<RAOF> Have you had time to play with barrier-test?
<kenvandine_> grrr... my vala unit test won't pass, but the python-gi one passes
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
 * didrocks hopes he can see the nvidia issue on my system after the unity release
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti
<didrocks> RAOF: unfortunately not, had to fight with dx stuff all the day :/
<RAOF> didrocks: No problem.
<RAOF> It's not going to get stale :)
<didrocks> :)
<RAOF> (Well, it might if someone uploads a new xserver)
<didrocks> RAOF: I'm still worrying about the nvidia blob driver that I can't install, I should see with tseliot, isn't it?
<didrocks> RAOF: I had to rebuild the previous version to get my machine working with latest xserver
<RAOF> Why can't you install it?  It seems to be working heer.
<RAOF> Or even here :)
<didrocks> RAOF: if I install it, I don't get anything starting, weird artefacts on lightdm, no accelerationâ¦ (remember? I pinged you some weeks ago about it)
<RAOF> I thought that turned out to be the libc thingy.  Clearly I misremember.
<bkerensa> didrocks: How have you like this week?
<bkerensa> :D
<didrocks> bkerensa: as usual, sometimes it's 4PM and I just realized that I'm on my chair since 7am and didn't move, even for a glass of water :p
<didrocks> RAOF: no no, it was way before
<didrocks> hum, adding a compiz ABI break + unity release, today will beâ¦ interesting :)
<kenvandine_> didrocks, good times!
<didrocks> kenvandine_: indeed
<kenvandine_> didrocks, i just uploaded the videos lens/scope again
<kenvandine_> whenever you have time
<didrocks> kenvandine_: will tryâ¦
<kenvandine_> i need to get some sleep, i'll be back in a few hours
<tkamppeter> pitti, I have synced a lot of packages by myself now, but I did not succeed to sync pnm2ppa in the first place because its Ubuntu source tarball was this crazy DBS tarball-in-tarball whereas the equally-named source tarball of the Debian package was a straight tarball as every other package has. So even --fakesync did not work. See also the debian/changelog entry and my discussion with cjwatson on #ubuntu-devel.
<pitti> tkamppeter: right, thanks
<tjaalton> didrocks: hey, do you know if the new unity/nux(?) updates will fix bug 926859?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 926859 in nux "llvmpipe software rendering needs blacklisting in unity-support-test" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/926859
<didrocks> tjaalton: no, it won't from what I saw
<pitti> tkamppeter: will upload cups in a bit, but I need to add the dpkg-maintscript-helper bits to remove the conffile on upgrades (unless you beat me to it)
<pitti> tkamppeter: if the .deb merely stops shipping it, upgraders will still keep it, as it's a conffile
<tjaalton> didrocks: aww, ok
<tkamppeter> pitti, OK, which conffile will get removed?
<pitti> tkamppeter: /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist-cups-usblp.conf
<tkamppeter> pitti, I understand. Thanks.
<bkerensa> pitti: How would you describe this week?
<bkerensa> :D
<mvo> compiz ate my keybindgs (maxizme, move)
<mvo> :/
<micahg> hi mvo :)
<mvo> hey micahg
<didrocks> mvo: known issue, will hopefully get fixed today if we succeed in releasing :)
<pitti> bkerensa: describe how?
<pitti> hey mvo
<pitti> mvo: mine s well; I get crazy without my "put window to background" key
<pitti> didrocks: nice!
<mvo> pitti: yes, me too, move, maximze, I feel like one arm is twisted behind my back currently
<didrocks> pitti: did you see my "if" :)
<mvo> didrocks: anything I can build locally to fix it?
<didrocks> mvo: no, it's still under review and discussion
<didrocks> mvo: and it will break ABI
<didrocks> (also API)
<mvo> ok
<didrocks> not sure you want to rebuild libcompizconfig, compiz-plugins-main (+ fix), compiz-plugins-extra, unity :p
<jibel> mvo, bug 931927
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 931927 in compiz-core "[regression] Customized shortcuts don't work in compiz 1:0.9.7.0~bzr2995-0ubuntu1" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931927
<pitti> bonjour jibel, ca va?
<jibel> I keep closing windows instead of switching desktop. It's driving me crazy.
<jibel> pitti, good morning. Ã§a va
<seb128> hey
<pitti> jibel: je suis bien, merci!
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<pitti> seb128: so, g-c-c 3.4 after all :)
<seb128> hey pitti, wie gehts? ;-)
<mvo> ta jibel!
<pitti> seb128: OOI, what else is missing for a complete 3.4 then?
<seb128> pitti, yeah, new GNOME mostly after all ;-)
<pitti> ah, g-bluetooth, g-session
<seb128> pitti, gnome-keyring gnome-menus gnome-session and the gnome-shell stack
<pitti> seb128: ok, we talked about keyring; we have too many changes in -session, I guess too risky to update
<pitti> seb128: is shell because it needs a newer keyring/session?
<seb128> g-b as well, it's optional in g-c-c, I might have a look to see if there is any compelent reason to take it but I think I pushed my luck enough :p
<pitti> g-b?
<seb128> bluetooth
<seb128> pitti, gnome-shell needed a new g-s-d g-c-c
<pitti> *nod*
<seb128> pitti, though I reverted the keybinding port to gsettings in those upload since compiz is still using gconf
 * pitti runs through versions.html and gives back the failed builds due to gtk armel desync
<pitti> I did a few this morning already, but not from versions.html
<seb128> I don't plan to spend time on that, but the patches are easy enough that if jbicha or ricotz wanted to do it a runtime choice to be able to update shell they could
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, tired ;)
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good, a bit tired though
<seb128> chrisccoulson, late hacking again? did you finally start on your asm debugging yesterday? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i did
<chrisccoulson> i hate toolchain issues
<seb128> did you manage to figure the issue?
<chrisccoulson> not yet
<chrisccoulson> i will do though ;)
<seb128> is that doko's fault again? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> yes ;)
<pitti> mvo, Sweetshark: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=lfcGEQRyaqI -- koestlich!
<mvo> pitti: alter! *fremdschÃ¤men*
<ricotz> pitti, LOL
<pitti> one could see how that woman's brain tried to work out how to stop him
<pitti> I wish I could talk like that when getting an advertisement phone call :)
<ritz> sweet, ubuntu.desktop++ for thick borders
<BigWhale> So, I have this dbus service signal which is emitted once ... and then I have this certain vala client that receives this signal 13 times ...
<chrisccoulson> gah, things have stopped appearing in my alt-tab list, and clicking on icons just launches new instances of applications, rather than switching to them
<BigWhale> is there a command line utility where I could check who's doing it wrong? :>
<chrisccoulson> this is the second time since yesterday that it's happened :(
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, have you seen that?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: are you using precise unity?
<didrocks> or unity from the ppa?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, the one from the PPA
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, known issue, we are working on it
<chrisccoulson> cool, thanks
<didrocks> it's the release blocker right now
<seb128> chrisccoulson, pitti: do you have a working guest session? could you try something for me?
<seb128> if you run the guest session, you should get a "enter a keyring password" dialog
<seb128> if you click on "ok", it displays a "you are going to create an unsecure keyring, are you sure"
<seb128> can you click on the confirmation button of this dialog?
<pitti> seb128: what do I need to do to request the keyring?
<pitti> ah, I guess I could try connecting to an ssh server
<seb128> pitti, it does autoopen for me in every guest session
<seb128> I though maybe nm-applet or u1
<seb128> I guess run evo or empathy otherwise
<pitti> seb128: right, it hangs
<pitti> seb128: not for me; I use system-wide wifi connection
<seb128> pitti, you can close by the decorator right?
<seb128> but not click on the buttons
<pitti> seb128: confirmed
<seb128> pitti, can you add a comment on bug #931958 saying you get it as well?
<ubot2`> seb128: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: HTTP Error 503: Service Unavailable (https://launchpad.net/bugs/931958)
<seb128> bug #931958
<ubot2`> seb128: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: HTTP Error 503: Service Unavailable (https://launchpad.net/bugs/931958)
<pitti> Uh oh!
<pitti> Something has gone wrong. We're sorry!
 * seb128 kicks launchpad
<seb128> bug #931958
<ubot2`> seb128: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: HTTP Error 503: Service Unavailable (https://launchpad.net/bugs/931958)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> let's wait a bit
<seb128> it seemed to work again for me
<pitti> seb128: confirmed on the bug
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> tkamppeter: ok, testing cups now (I added the conffile handling bits)
<czajkowski> morning
<tkamppeter> pitti, great.
<pitti> hey czajkowski
<czajkowski> pitti: hiya
<czajkowski> latestest updates have borked my machine :( no sw cneter any more applications uninstalled, battery not showing when it's charging or running out of juice. but am enjoying my 1st week at canonical :)
<pitti> Sweetshark: ah, 3.5.0 final released? I guess we'll see another upload soon?
<pitti> Sweetshark: did you figure out the unopkg.bin bug with the cyclic dependency, or do we need to discuss this more?
<pitti> czajkowski: does apt-get -f install clean up?
<seb128> czajkowski, can you go in the control center and check in the power capplet the "when to display the indicator" combo option?
<czajkowski> pitti: let me try that
<czajkowski> seb128: aye did tat last night and changed the settings and restared and nothing happens
<seb128> weird
<seb128> maybe what pitti said
<Sweetshark> pitti: 1) yes 2) yes 3) i have a workaround for it, but I am not to happy with it (testing the postinsts by installing right now)
<czajkowski> seb128: I thought buying a new laptop would remove my weird funky bugs. :)
<czajkowski> pitti: no help, which is just odd
<czajkowski> and I keep getting this on update http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/844158/
<pitti> czajkowski: extras doesn't exist yet for precise
<pitti> the GB mirror failures do look worrying, though
<czajkowski> ah ok so no need to worry about the error
<pitti> not if it's transient
<czajkowski> missin skype and center is kinda annoying but not the end of the world
<pitti> if it's happening for longer than a day, asking IS might be good
<czajkowski> but the battery not showing it's losing power or showing its plugged in is kinda annoying, just wondered if anyone else had seen similar ?
<czajkowski> pitti: will do
<czajkowski> thanks
<pitti> czajkowski: skype is known; I suppose your recent dist-upgrade removed it because gcc-4.6 is built on amd64, but not i386 yet
<pitti> czajkowski: sudo apt-get install ubuntu-desktop ?
<pitti> it might have been lost during a dist-upgrade
<pitti> (always read what it wants to remove)
<czajkowski> pitti: aye ran the command,  but no effect, will wait and try again tonight and see if things fix :)
<czajkowski> thanks for your hel folks
<czajkowski> *help
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i wish the HUD would stop activating on workspace switches
<pitti> tkamppeter: cups uploaded
 * mvo weeps every time he write "hb.pack_start(widget, False, False, 0)"
<seb128> chrisccoulson, there is a fix pending commit
<chrisccoulson> cool :)
<tkamppeter> pitti, thanks.
<Sweetshark> pitti: fyi, this is the current workaround http://paste.ubuntu.com/844188/, but what I really need is a trigger that fires, if a) -core and -common are install b) one of them got updated
<pitti> Sweetshark: I guess I don't understand enough of this to be able to say whether it's correct
<pitti> Sweetshark: dpkg does have triggers, though
<tkamppeter> pitti, I need your help with Jockey.
<pitti> tkamppeter: sure, what's up? (I'm at lunch ATM, bbl)
<tkamppeter> It is about Epson's printer driver http://www.openprinting.org/driver/epson-201101w/
<tkamppeter> They are moving their drivers from Avasys' servers to Epson's servers.
<pitti> url 1
<pitti> (whoops)
<tkamppeter> Here is what the web query interface tells when one has detected an Epson NX130: http://www.openprinting.org/query.php?type=drivers&printer=Epson-NX130_Series&moreinfo=1
<tkamppeter> or in XML: http://www.openprinting.org/query.php?type=drivers&printer=Epson-NX130_Series&moreinfo=1&format=XML
<tkamppeter> Now if I do
<tkamppeter> cd /usr/share/system-config-printer/
<tkamppeter> python newprinter.py --setup-printer='file:/tmp/printout' --devid='MFG:Epson;MDL:NX130 Series;'
<tkamppeter> the driver does not get found, but manually loading the driver packages and signatures from http://www.openprinting.org/driver/epson-201101w/ works.
<tkamppeter> pitti: ^^ Is it possible that the signature https://intouch.ebz.epson.net/key/fingerprint is not corresponding with the package's signature?
<tkamppeter> pitti, how do I debug this?
<pitti> tkamppeter: it should appear in /var/log/jockey.log
<pitti> need to run out for 20 mins, bbl
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, brain ache
<chrisccoulson> i should get some more caffeine
<mvo> seb128: any ideas about bug #921477 - the code in question has not changed and its fine in oneiric, so something else changed in gtk that broke it and I have a hard time figuring out what it might be
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 921477 in software-center "drop down menus from app toolbar have black background" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/921477
<seb128> mvo, talk to Cimi, he changed menus theming
<seb128> mvo, I bet it's either a gtk change (they did a lot of stuff this cycle on the css support) which requires a theme fix or a theme change
<mvo> seb128: what channel is the best one?
<mvo> seb128: its not easy to reproduce unfortunately :/ I have not figured it out yet
<seb128> mvo, oh, it's not happening all the time, weird, dunno then
<seb128> mvo, try asking Cimi when he's around
<mvo> its happening all the time in s-c, but when I try to build a isolated testcase I get stuck
<mvo> so some side effect
<mvo> thanks seb128
<seb128> mvo, maybe the theme has special theming for s-c in its css?
<mvo> seb128: oh, could be - especially since adwaita look fine
<mvo> seb128: I will try to find out after lunch
<seb128> mvo, but I know cimi changed the theming of menubars and menus recently
<mvo> ta
<tkamppeter> pitti, back?
<tkamppeter> pitti, http://paste.ubuntu.com/844226/
<tkamppeter> pitti, it can be caused by an encoding problem, weird characters in the license text. See http://www.openprinting.org/query.php?type=drivers&printer=Epson-NX130_Series&moreinfo=1&format=XML, section "4. LGPL".
<tkamppeter> pitti, can you make Jockey robust against this?
<pitti> tkamppeter: back now
<pitti> tkamppeter: I can reproduce this
<pitti> tkamppeter: jockey itself doesn't do the XML parsing, that's cupshelpers; I'll reduce the test case and have a look there
<tkamppeter> pitti, great, patches welcome. Manufacturers do weird thigs and we need to make our software robust against that.
<pitti> tkamppeter: FYI, reproducer: http://paste.ubuntu.com/844292/
<pitti> tkamppeter: slighth correction: http://paste.ubuntu.com/844295/
<pitti> tkamppeter: it crashes with the current Ubuntu package, but not if I run it in s-c-p trunk with PYTHONPATH=.
<pitti> tkamppeter: so it seems fixed upstream already
<pitti> tkamppeter: http://paste.ubuntu.com/844298/ <- prints traceback
<pitti> tkamppeter: curious, though; diffing /usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/cupshelpers/openprinting.py against trunk's only shows that we added the "fingerprint" option
<pitti> ooh, and self.onlyfree = 0
<pitti> that might be it
<pitti> ok, with an extra op.onlyfree = 0 it crashes in trunk, too
<pitti> (Ã¢<80>&amp;#65533; LGPLÃ¢<80>&amp;#65533;).  Notwithstanding any provision of this Agreement, you may ^M
<pitti> tkamppeter: ^ that's the offending line
<pitti> tkamppeter: that's the final reduction:
<pitti> python -c 'from xml.etree.ElementTree import XML; XML("<x>\x80</x>")'
<pitti> so we need to filter out non-UTF8 stuff
<pitti> tkamppeter: there: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/tmp/0001-cupshelpers-Fix-XML-parsing-crash-on-invalid-UTF-8.patch
<pitti> tkamppeter: if you want to  "git am 0001-cupshelpers-Fix-XML-parsing-crash-on-invalid-UTF-8.patch" upstream and push it? then we can backport it to our packages, or wait for a new release
<tkamppeter> pitti, testing your patch by patching directly into the system and it works!
<tkamppeter> pitti, I do not have direct write access upstream, but I will pass on the patch to Tim Waugh.
<pitti> tkamppeter: oh, I thought you had
<tkamppeter> pitti, one or two years ago, Tim Waugh changed the proceeding, not giving out direct write access any more.
<tkamppeter> pitti, I will simply add it as distro patch for now and send a mail to Tim for getting it upstream (as I usually do).
<pitti> tkamppeter: cheers
<tkamppeter> pitti, and thanks for the quick fix.
<pitti> didrocks, seb128: the "privacy" capplet, is that zeitgeist?
<seb128> pitti, yes
<didrocks> indeed, there will add some apport crash stuff from ev IIRC
<seb128> pitti, it's what allow you to do a demo and showing your unity dash without exposing history of stuff you browsed for example
<didrocks> but it's mainly zg
<seb128> mdeslaur, hey
<mdeslaur> hi seb128
<seb128> mdeslaur, do you have any idea (before I start looking at it) at what made numlock to be always on?
<didrocks> seb128: btw, confirmed by multiple people on the french forum
<seb128> didrocks, did they found what update caused it?
<mdeslaur> seb128: certain bioses report it as always being on
<seb128> didrocks, or when did it start?
<didrocks> seb128: not, seems to have started yesterday
<mdeslaur> seb128: or is this a new problem?
<seb128> hum, I wonder if that's my gsd update
<seb128> mdeslaur, it's a new problem started recently
<seb128> mdeslaur, i.e bug #933405
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 933405 in gnome-settings-daemon "[Precise i386] Numlock cant be set "off"" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/933405
<seb128> ok, that bug states its "remember-numlock-state" in gsd
<didrocks> seb128: on the zg stuff, not sure there is this "conference mode" you describe apart from deleting your history. It was planned though. -> m4n1sh?
<seb128> didrocks, oh, ups :p
<mdeslaur> seb128: bug says downgrading g-s-d makes it go away
<seb128> mdeslaur, yeah, I found the bug after pinging you ;-)
<seb128> mdeslaur, I'm investigating, unping, sorry for the noise
<seb128> mdeslaur, I though first it maybe had to do with your changes
<mdeslaur> seb128: ok, cool. let me know if there's anything I can do.
<seb128> mdeslaur, I guess it's http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-settings-daemon/commit/?id=ebca1ce1287679c5cb470804abfcc8de3c2d740c
<seb128> mdeslaur, well that's the fix
<seb128> will try to backport that
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<didrocks> seb128: ah great! I can ask for confirmation on the forum once uploaded
<mdeslaur> seb128: looks like it
<ockham> hi, i've recently filed a merge request for scribus-1.4.0.dfsg+r17300-1, that has been applied a couple of hours ago. now that scribus-ng has recently been updated to a transitional package depending on that scribus version, i'd like to file a sync request for scribus-ng (which is currently lagging behind scribus!).
<ockham> unfortunately, requestsync fails, complaining about a 404 error on packages.debian.org
<ockham> this could be due to that upload of scribus-ng being rather recent...
<ockham> so, what's the best way to get that sync in before FF? file a request sync manually?
<jbicha> ockham: personally I'd just wait a few hours until requestsync works; if it's after Feature Freeze, it's easy enough to convert the bug into a FFe
<pitti> vuntz: bonjour
<ockham> jbicha: ok
<Laney> ockham: I can sync it for you. What's your LP ID?
<jbicha> or ask Laney ^ :)
<ockham> Laney: oh, cool! i'm ockham-razor on LP.
<Laney> ha
<Laney> I see what you did there
<vuntz> pitti: hola
<pitti> vuntz: just replied to your pygobject bug report, perhaps you can have a look
<Laney> ockham: there we go
<ockham> Laney: great, thx!
<Laney> np
<pitti> vuntz: the thing I'm not sure aobut is: if you do g_ptr_array_add(), does the added object become owned by the ptrarray if you use g_ptr_array_new_with_free_func() ?
<pitti> vuntz: my understanding is that it does get owned
<pitti> vuntz: and PK seems to understand that as well, as it calls g_object_ref() when _array_add()ing
<vuntz> pitti: well, it's not calling g_ptr_array_add() that gives the ref, but if the caller does g_object_ref(), then yeah, the ptrarray owns it
<vuntz> pitti: and really, if the free_func is g_object_unref, transfer full sounds right
<pitti> vuntz: right, that's how I understood it, too
<pitti> so (container) is a nice local workaround if you want to continue developing your script
<pitti> but it wouldn't be appropriate to apply in PK, AFAIUI
<vuntz> yeah
<pitti> and ISTR that even (container) crashed my test script back then
<vuntz> there aren't too many changes in pygobject between 3.0.3 and 3.1.0, so I'll bisect
<pitti> vuntz: probably c329bf2aee8d75
<pitti> vuntz: however, I'm 80% sure that this happened with 3.0.3, too
<vuntz> yeah, that commit is the first one I'm investigating
<vuntz> (rebuilding for python3 didn't help me, though ;-))
<pitti> vuntz: c329bf2aee8d75 seems to be it indeed
<vuntz> pitti: ah, should be "g_ptr_array_free (ptr_array_, FALSE);" I guess; since there's a cleanup function called on all items before
<pitti> vuntz: I'm currently working on a test case
<pitti> vuntz: thanks for the report!
<vuntz> pitti: it's likely that g_array_free() is wrong too, for the same reason
<pitti> vuntz: hm, I just discovered another bug, I think (in the test suite)
<pitti> vuntz:  array = g_ptr_array_new_with_free_func (g_free);
<pitti>   g_ptr_array_add (array, g_strdup ("regress"));
<pitti> return array
<pitti> vuntz: ^ would you say that this is (full) or (container)?
<vuntz> that's full
<pitti> exactly
<vuntz> well
<pitti> as the test suite calls this regress_test_garray_container_return, and (transfer container)
<vuntz> "return array" is a bit weird
<pitti> but _with_free_func would make this full, AFAIUI
<pitti> vuntz: it's just a test function
<pitti> I was about to add a regress_test_garray_full_return when I noticed this
 * vuntz goes back to read the doc
 * pitti wonders whether Xavier Classens is on IRC
<vuntz> pitti: actually
<vuntz> pitti: if the GPtrArray owns the ref of its elements, then maybe it's container
<pitti> I don't see how that would work
<vuntz> since the caller doesn't need to unref the elements
<pitti> oh
<pitti> i. e full -> python itself (i. e. pygobject) has to free the elements first and then the container
<pitti> so that would be an g_ptr_array_new(), without a free func
<pitti> right, so we got it the wrong way around
<vuntz> pitti: indeed :-)
<pitti> with g_ptr_array_new_with_free_func(), the ptrarray owns the elements, not the caller
<vuntz> sorry, my fault for adding confusion :-)
<pitti> and with g_ptr_array_new(), the caller owns them and has to clean them up
<pitti> vuntz: no worries -- I fell into the exact same trap :)
<pitti> but I'll still add a test case for (full) to ensure that this works
 * vuntz double-checks all PK annotations
<pitti> vuntz: fun, all other pk_results_* seem to get it right
<pitti> pk_desktop_get_files_for_package() looks wrong, too
<didrocks> new compiz on the way, fixing keybindings and some other stuff :)
 * pitti hugs didrocks
<didrocks> pitti: I think we won't have unity though
<didrocks> (just an unity rebuild for this compiz fix)
<pitti> will at least unbreak ARM, mvo, and me, so happy enough :)
<didrocks> :-)
<didrocks> yeah, not building kde support in compiz anymore
<didrocks> it's the "easy way", but well
<pitti> vuntz: http://paste.ubuntu.com/844438/ fixes it, I think I caught them all
<pitti> vuntz: did you find more?
<vuntz> pitti: I found one other which is wrong
<vuntz> pitti: http://paste.ubuntu.com/844438/
<pitti> vuntz: err, that was mine
<vuntz> http://paste.opensuse.org/view/raw/83277984
<vuntz> grr :-)
<m4n1sh> didrocks: ping
<pitti> vuntz: ah, thanks
<pitti> vuntz: ok with you if I push mine with the detailled changelog, and then push the fourth in your name?
<pitti> (that one is not a crash, but a leak, and a different data type)
<m4n1sh> seb128: didrocks which conference mode? am i missing context?
<seb128> m4n1sh, a way to say "don't publish my history"
<seb128> m4n1sh, like if you want to use unity in front of people but doesn't show them your personally pictures in the dash
<vuntz> pitti: sure
<didrocks> m4n1sh: normally, we plan with design a mode where you can say "I don't wait zeitgeist to give any data right now"
<m4n1sh> incognito mode?
<m4n1sh> the bottom right GtkSwitch?
<m4n1sh> that just  disabled logging at that moment
<didrocks> yeah, there were 2 options
<m4n1sh> does not  delete history
<didrocks> one for incognito (don't log) and another for don't take from the history
<m4n1sh> means stop engine from serving events too?
<didrocks> yeah
<m4n1sh> that should be implemented in unity
<m4n1sh> right now there is no API for zg which prevents from fetching events
<m4n1sh> only logging blacklist is implemented
<m4n1sh> seb128: didrocks cant it be done in unity?
<pitti> vuntz: hm, why is that (full)? pk_package_sack_finalize() calls g_ptr_array_unref (priv->array);
<pitti> vuntz: i. e. it again owns the items in the PackageSack
<didrocks> m4n1sh: not sure, I think you should discuss it in #ubuntu-unity with the unity guys
<seb128> m4n1sh, dunno, and probably a topic for today, I just though it would be part of privacy
<m4n1sh> sadly it wasnt never a part of API
<seb128> m4n1sh, that's the most frequent usecase I can see, don't show to everybody the personnal stuff I've been opening
<m4n1sh> blacklist is implemented as an extension
<m4n1sh> how do you know something is personal stuff
<dobey> pitti: want to sponsor an update to twisted for me? :)
<m4n1sh> difficult to filter
<vuntz> pitti: it's a GObject, isn't it?
<seb128> m4n1sh, well just a "don't publish anything, or stop zg"
<didrocks> hum, it was on design's scope, if not, that means that despite summurazing this 5 time with them, it got lost :/
<seb128> m4n1sh, like "I'm in public, I don't want my files to show, stop zg"
<pitti> vuntz: maybe, but any items you put into it are freed by the PackageSack itself
<pitti> vuntz: which again would be "container"?
<m4n1sh> seb128: didrocks I don't remember anything like that. Not on blueprint not on System Settings design doc
<vuntz> pitti: I don't think a GObject is a container type
<vuntz> pitti: "container is usually a pointer to a list or hash table, eg GList, GSList, GHashTable etc."
<didrocks> it was discussed at the session, the blueprint is not detailed, it's juste "implement the privacy" I have logs though when I discussed with design about this 5 times
<m4n1sh> :(
<m4n1sh> I was not at UDS
<pitti> vuntz: (meeting now, bbl)
<m4n1sh> nor was seiflotfy
<didrocks> m4n1sh: not blaming you at all :)
<didrocks> m4n1sh: can you talk with nutthinking?
<seb128> m4n1sh, no worry, not your fault
<seb128> m4n1sh, it's just an usecase we don't cover (yet)
<m4n1sh> I was just clarifying how it got lost :)
<seiflotfy> didrocks: u guys really want a last minute redesign now
<seb128> we will get there one day ;-)
<m4n1sh> seiflotfy: relax
<seb128> seiflotfy, no, we don't want anything
<m4n1sh> seiflotfy: even with that feature it is not possible
<seiflotfy> m4n1sh: i have a soltuion for that
<m4n1sh> engine API needs to be updated
<seiflotfy> but its an engine hack
<m4n1sh> yes
<seb128> seiflotfy, I just misdescribed what privacy was doing because I though that's what it would do
<seiflotfy> and i dont think every1 wil lagree
<m4n1sh> please dont mess with engine now
<seiflotfy> its basically moving the DB to a temp directory
<m4n1sh> put all our energy on fts
<seb128> seiflotfy, m4n1sh: yeah, just ignore that discussion, focus on what was planned
<seiflotfy> and telling the engine to not reply to any requests
<seb128> that was side chatting
<seb128> no blaming or anything
<m4n1sh> yeah :)
<m4n1sh> never mind, for P+1
<pitti> vuntz: oh! nevermind me, should pay more attention (meeting still going on..)
<seb128> pitti, dude, you spend your life in meetings nowadays it seems ;-)
<pitti> 10.04.4 meetings every day :/
<pitti> but release is today *phew*
<pitti> and it's looking good
<m4n1sh> seb128: seiflotfy didrocks, next cycle I will try doing things earlier rather than last moment. P+1 can have lot more done lot before FF
<seb128> pitti, oh, "are we there yet?" "are we there yet?" "are we there yet?" meetings? ;-)
<m4n1sh> just provide prototypes after UDS
<didrocks> m4n1sh: sweet, that will be awesome! :)
<m4n1sh> didrocks: I am not applying for UDS this time, so just keep the logs and update me in case something is missing in blueprint
<didrocks> m4n1sh: sure, there is the audio available
<didrocks> m4n1sh: so, just ping me, I'll point you to it
<m4n1sh> too much broken
<m4n1sh> last time
<didrocks> ah? :/
<m4n1sh> default apps session was somewhat inaudible
<dobey> eh, i think that's a social problem, not a technical one
<pitti> vuntz: pushed your's as well, thanks! https://gitorious.org/packagekit/packagekit/commit/d1783721dc079e8cca8feb7192b904e2434fe308
<dobey> some people are pretty loud, and others are pretty quiet
<pitti> dobey: hand me the diff/branch/etc?
<dobey> pitti: https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/precise/twisted/backport-gireactor/+merge/93329
<mterry> So...  my numlock got stuck on ON for my user yesterday.  does anyone else see similar behavior?
<pitti> mterry: not here
<dobey> mterry: turns off for me if i push the button
<dobey> i just want a keyboard without a numpad though
<seb128> mterry, I just uploaded a fixed g-s-d with the fix as you asked
<seb128> mterry, hey btw, happe ff day ;-)
<seb128> happy
<mterry> seb128, :)  which fix?
<seb128> mterry, the fix for the numlock issue
<seb128> mterry, it was a gsd bug
<mterry> seb128, oh neat!
<pitti> $ bzr merge lp:~dobey/ubuntu/precise/twisted/backport-gireactor
<mterry> so my keyboard isn't dying after all  :)
<pitti> Unapplying quilt patches to prevent spurious conflicts
<pitti> bzr: ERROR: exceptions.AttributeError: 'DirStateRevisionTree' object has no attribute 'last_revision'
<pitti> dobey: ^ yay
<seb128> mterry, no it's not ;-)
<dobey> pitti: wtf?
<pitti> dobey: doing manually, don't worry
<dobey> pitti: bzr broke i guess?
<pitti> dobey: uploaded, thanks!
<dobey> pitti: great! thank you!
<seb128> pitti, so with gwibber and ubuntu-sso-client on gtk3, do we still have a webkit-gtk2 rdepends?
<pitti> seb128: ubuntu-sso-client is still gtk2
<seb128> nessita, hey, well done landing sso gtk3 on time!
<seb128> pitti, ?
<pitti> ooh, is it? nice!!!
<nessita> seb128: :-D
 * pitti hugs nessita
<seb128> pitti, nessita uploaded a gtk3 version ;-)
<nessita> seb128: thanks!
<nessita> and it works too! :-)
<seb128> \o/
<pitti> so this should drop CDs to 712 MB, nice!
<pitti> and 11 MB are due to langpack updates, so we are effectively at 701 MB
<pitti> which is within the new limit
 * ogra_ thinks pitti should really shove off another 1.1M just because it looks better
<dobey> ugh, i can't resize the apport "send report" dialog any more :(
<pitti> seb128: the only packages on my system which need it are gimp (not on CDs) and ubuntu-sso-client, so I think we're good
<seb128> excellent!
<seb128> dobey, yeah, I was going to look at that and I noticed that the dialog was about to be replaced so I figured I wouldn't bother
<dobey> seb128, pitti: this means we can drop webkit gtk2 now
<seb128> ev has been working on a new version for db work he's doing
<seb128> dobey, right, that still doesn't mean we have CD space though :-(
<seb128> dobey, it just brings us on target
<pitti> dobey: yes, the next images should not have it any more
<pitti> we carried the two stacks long enough, *phew*
<pitti> dobey, nessita, kenvandine: ^ nice work!
<pitti> (also to the shotwell folks)
<seb128> pitti, well done before the lts, that's what matters ;-)
<nessita> pitti: we need room in the CD for python-qt4! :-D
<dobey> seb128: indeed. i hope to finish up some more work on that today
<seb128> nessita, go away, we like gtk :p
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> seb128, do we really?
<kenvandine> :)
 * kenvandine hides
<seb128> ohhh
<dobey> buuuuuuurn
<pitti> $ LANG= sudo dpkg -P libgtk2.0-0 2>&1 | grep 'depends on' | wc -l
<pitti> 55
<pitti> seb128: ^ still a bit to go :)
<seb128> yeah...
<seb128> well at least we dropped gnome-vfs from the CD this cycle!
<dobey> now we just need to drop firefox and thunderbird ;)
<dobey> should free up about 100M :P
<pitti> firefox and tbird both grew by ~ 3 MB since oneiric
<pitti> so they do have their share in size increase indeed
<chrisccoulson> pitti - and we'll get basically all of that back once i've figured out how to fix bug 894166
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 894166 in firefox "Make hyphenation work with system hyphenation patterns" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/894166
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, did we move to builtin hyphenation since oneiric, or does it make up for growth that happened elsewhere?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - no, hyphenation support for non-english locales was only added to Firefox recently, and it ships its own patterns by default
<chrisccoulson> but they don't map properly to the patterns that we ship
<kenvandine> ronoc, indicator-session says i have updates available!
<kenvandine> ;-)
<ronoc> kenvandine, sweet - hopefully it's correct
<kenvandine> seems to be
<chrisccoulson> bah, X has completely locked up twice today when hitting this barrier in between my 2 screens
<ronoc> good stuff
<kenvandine> grrr... focus stealing prevention.... clicking updates available in the indicator doesn't bring update-manager to the front
<kenvandine> i am so sick of evolution, i really wish we had a calendar alternative
<skaet> pitti,  didrocks,  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/FeatureLanding - when is the next compiz upload expected?  (should it switch from today to monday?)
<pitti> skaet: about an hour ago :)
<didrocks> skaet: the new compiz is building
<didrocks> with all the stack waiting for it to be published
<didrocks> libcompizconfig/compiz-plugins-main/compiz-plugins-extra/unity
<didrocks> skaet: we are almost done for the unity release
<didrocks> but
<didrocks> I will suggest to only upload it tomorrow morning
<didrocks> so that we have enough testing with the latest fixes
<Beret> didrocks, did you see compiz-dev is stuck?
<Beret> n/m
<didrocks> Beret: is it?
<Beret> you win, it's building now :)
<didrocks> it's not :p
<didrocks> it was dep wait
<Beret> yeah
<didrocks> same for the coming build-dep once libcompizconfig is built
<nessita> seb128: question: I split the ussoc source package in several binaries, so now we have the ubuntu-sso-client package that is just the dbus service, and we also have the ubuntu-sso-client-gtk that provides the Gtk UI. I guess we need to have the ubuntu-desktop depending on ubuntu-sso-client-gtk now, so we can fetch in the -gtk UI. What should I do to make that happen? :-)
<seb128> nessita, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SeedManagement
<seb128> nessita, get the seed updated
 * nessita reads
<skaet> didrocks,   moving the upload to tomorrow makes sense.  +1
<didrocks> skaet: ok, we agree, thanks :)
<skaet> :)
<seb128> didrocks, can you add an unity recommends on indicator-printers ?
<seb128> didrocks, I think it's unity which pulls the indicators on the default install?
<seb128> pitti, ^
<didrocks> seb128: sure, doing right now
<didrocks> seb128: indeed
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yw :)
<desrt> hello europeans
<pitti> seb128: hm, how does i-printers conflict with system-config-printer? is that applet going away?
<seb128> pitti, the applet got dropped yesterday in precise by lars and till
<seb128> pitti, I suggested to lars to bring it back and just not start it in Unity
<seb128> i.e add a NotShowIn=Unity
<seb128> to the autostart desktop
<pitti> don't get me wrong, I'm all for dropping a gtk2 python process ;)
<seb128> but we can fix that after ff
<pitti> so the intention is that i-printer replaces applet.py?
<seb128> pitti, yes
<seb128> pitti, cf https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Printing if you are interested in details
<pitti> niiiiiice
<seb128> pitti, indicator-printers is in precise and mir approved if you want to try it
<seb128> we got it in yesterday
<seb128> though I think lars was still looking at a cups issue making it not work
<pitti> vuntz: FYI, I added a test case for a (transfer full) GPtrArray
<pitti> vuntz: it's unfortunately hard to impossible to determine the internal refcount of the array items from python, but at least that will make sure that they don't crash
<mterry> Riddell, ping.  i'm going to hit the MIRs you filed, but wanted to make sure you were around for a quick feedback loop if possible
<pitti> mterry: thanks for the recent MIR reviews!
<pitti> mterry: any chance you could do bug 931458 as well? should be very similar and fast
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 931458 in libcss-minifier-xs-perl "[MIR] libcss-minifier-xs-perl" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931458
<mterry> pitti, oh yeah sure
<pitti> that would complete the new MIRs for eximdoc4 which we earned through the autosyncs
 * mterry restarts to fix numlock (hopefully)
<pitti> mterry: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.svg -> I assume we won't promote lyx?
<pitti> oh, gone
<mterry> seb128, yay, fixed!  i can type again
 * mterry does a dance
<pitti> mterry: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.svg -> I assume we won't promote lyx?
<tkamppeter> pitti, how can I make an applet only auto-start if the desktop is not Unity?
<seb128> mterry ;-)
 * mterry sees what lyx is
<pitti> tkamppeter: well, I guess you also don't want to autostart in GNOME, as gnome-shell uses the upstream printing stuff?
<seb128> tkamppeter, the .desktop has OnlyShowIn
<seb128> tkamppeter, pitti: /etc/xdg/autostart/print-applet.desktop
<tkamppeter> pitti, my current test is with the file /etc/xdg/autostart/print-applet.desktop
<seb128> -NotShowIn=KDE;LXDE;
<pitti> tkamppeter: rather, NotShowIn=KDE
<tkamppeter> and it has
<seb128> +NotShowIn=KDE;LXDE;Unity
<pitti> seb128: should it really be used in GNOME?
<Riddell> mterry: hi yes
<tkamppeter> NoDisplay=true
<mterry> pitti, oh goodness, I hope not.  Especially just for a Recommends
<seb128> pitti, in gnome-fallback I guess?
<tkamppeter> pitti, this does not prevent an auto-start at all.
<seb128> pitti, I've no clue what is the equivalent for gnome-panel sessions
<mterry> Riddell, cool, now that half my keyboard isn't a numpad, I can start reviewing in earnest  :)
<seb128> tkamppeter, read what I wrote
<Riddell> thanks mterry
<pitti> tkamppeter: so anyway, adding "Unity" to NotShowIn will do the trick for now
<seb128> tkamppeter, change NotShowIn=KDE;LXDE;Unity;GNOME
<seb128> you can add GNOME to the list
<pitti> *nod*
<seb128> do we know if i.e xfce uses it?
<pitti> yes, I think so
<seb128> ok, so yeah, just add Unity and GNOME to the list
<pitti> seb128, tkamppeter: do we still need to seed system-config-printer-gnome then? i. e. do we use the GUI from control-center, or is that replaced with the indicator and upstream capplet?
<seb128> pitti, the upstream capplet use the s-c-p backend
<seb128> pitti, the ui not sure
<pitti> seb128: that would be s-c-p-common, and should be a dependency
<seb128> right
<tkamppeter> pitti, larsu (in #systems) tells that the switchover will not happen in Precise, so that s-c-p-gnome package is still needed.
<pitti> ack
<seb128> pitti, well anyway we will still use scp for precise
<tkamppeter> pitti, seb128, testing NotShowIn=KDE;LXDE;Unity;GNOME
<seb128> lars didn't feel like we were on time to switch to the upstream ui
<seb128> it's a bit rushed
<seb128> so better after the lts
<pitti> ack
<pitti> just confirming
<seb128> pitti, btw https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-control-center-cleanup
<seb128> [rodrigo-moya] Implement installation of languages in g-c-c: TODO
<seb128> pitti, ^ should that be DROPPED?
<pitti> POSTPONED rather, I guess
<pitti> at this point we'll keep l-s
<seb128> ok
<pitti> I think I cleaned it up sufficiently now
<tkamppeter> pitti, seb128, that works, will apply it.
<seb128> pitti, done
<seb128> tkamppeter, you need a trailing ";" to be correct I think
<seb128> tkamppeter, validation tools will raise a warning otherwise
<seb128> tkamppeter, i.e "GNOME;"
<seb128> (it's a detail but we can as well do it right)
<tkamppeter> seb128, OK.
<seb128> thanks
<SpamapS> Anybody know how to maximize windows w/ the keyboard in the latest unity-2d?
<desrt> SpamapS: alt+space / x?
<SpamapS> desrt: great joke ;)
<SpamapS> the bug that removed alt-f10 suggested alt-f5 would be co-opted .. but alt-f5 seems to do nothing
<desrt> SpamapS: what joke?
<SpamapS> desrt: thats not funny.. alt space, then x.. seriously?
<pitti> SpamapS: alt+space invokes the window menu
<pitti> which is in fact the only way known to me to get it these days :/
<desrt> SpamapS: clearly you've never used emacs!
<SpamapS> alt-f10 has always maximized windows in gnome and xfce.. for years and years.. don't make me train a 2 part shortcut now...
<desrt> ^ (see.  now that's a joke.)
<pitti> SpamapS: that's just a bug
<pitti> I don't think it's intended to drop them
<pitti> last compiz broke quite a few keybindings
<pitti> oh, -2d
<mterry> Riddell, what's the deal with several of these packages having libraries that have "internal" or "private" in their name, but are installed in public locations?  The intention is that no one outside the ktp stack should link to them?
<Riddell> mterry: yes I expect so
<Riddell> mterry: it's a fairly common practice within KDE /usr/lib/*priva*
<Riddell> I have 5 installed
<nessita> ping
<nessita> oops
<nessita> sorry!
<nessita> (bad window)
<mterry> Riddell, weird.  like they only want "friends of the package" to link, but not random people.
<dobey> irc fail is contagious it seems :P
<dobey> mterry: usually i just make libraries GPL if i want that
<mterry> Or perhaps just reducing complaints when something breaks ABI
<Riddell> mterry: yes, it's a quick and not elegant but better than nothing way to allow for unstable ABIs
<mterry> dobey, ouch :)
<dobey> hehe :)
<Riddell> mterry: they should still do all the right versioning practices
<tkamppeter> pitti, seb128, s-c-p uploaded. Autostart now suppressed under Unity and GNOME and robustness against broken encoding of description or license of OpenPrinting-downloadable manufacturer drivers.
<seb128> tkamppeter, good work, thanks
<davidcalle> Riddell, ping
<Riddell> hi davidcalle
<Riddell> oh, new queue?
<Riddell> sorry
<davidcalle> Riddell, no problem. If you don't have the time, I guess it can wait, it will be a FFE anyway.
<Riddell> davidcalle: I'm onto it
<Riddell> davidcalle: this was a personal project not part of any employment right?
<davidcalle> Riddell, thanks. Part of a contract.
<Riddell> davidcalle: ok but not employment, that means you are indeed the copyright holder
<Riddell> didrocks: why did you reject it?  (you should post to ubuntu-archive list when you reject something)
<davidcalle> Riddell, ok
<mterry> Riddell, do you know why the tests for telepathy-qt4 aren't run during build?  If it's possible, can you enable them?
<didrocks> Riddell: you didn't know about posting, I just handled that directly on IRC with davidcalle on IRC
<tkamppeter> pitti, I did a printer driver auto-install test with your s-c-p fix on Precise now and itr works great.
<pitti> \o/
<Riddell> mterry: no I don't, maybe they require X or some other reason or maybe that's a packaging failure
<mterry> Riddell, can you check?  If it's possible to enable them, it's a MIR blocker.  But if there's a good reason not to, it's OK
<mterry> Riddell, at least one of the tests doesn't seem to require X (test-ptr).  Maybe a subset can be run
<Riddell> mterry: let me look
<Riddell> didrocks: so can you remember?
<didrocks> Riddell: let me show you the discussion yesterday
<didrocks> Riddell: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2012/02/15/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t16:44 and below
<pitti> good night everyone!
<seb128> 'night pitti
<didrocks> good night pitti
<mterry> pitti, bye
<seb128> mterry, did you see my gimp ping yesterday?
<mterry> seb128, no, what's up?
<seb128> mterry, you forgot to push your recent revision
<mterry> seb128, guh
<Riddell> davidcalle: any reason not to use source format 3.0? (not a rejectable offence)
<seb128> mterry, do you still have it and can push or should I just commit from the src package in the vcs?
<mterry> seb128, looks like I just worked from the src package
<seb128> mterry, don't bother if you didn't do it in the vcs, I just wanted to know if that was a push away or not
<seb128> mterry, ok, fine, don't bother then, thanks ;-)
<mterry> seb128, sorry!  :-/
<seb128> mterry, no worry
<davidcalle> Riddell, it's a change from kenvandine.
<seb128> mterry, btw stop undoing my changes the day after I do this :p
<Riddell> kenvandine: any reason not to use source format 3.0? (not a rejectable offence)
<seb128> this->one
<Riddell> davidcalle: what happened to "the lens refers to /usr/share/unity/5/lens-nav-video.svg" ?
<Riddell> "which isn't installed by the package"
<mterry> seb128, when did I do that?
<seb128> mterry, I switched indicator-messages to source v1 tuesday and you switched back to v3 yesterday ;-)
<davidcalle> Riddell, the file is already provided by Unity. Didrocks wasn't aware of it.
<mterry> seb128, hah
<mterry> seb128, I wanted to patch!  Why did you use v1?
<kenvandine> Riddell, so we can merge changes from other branches inline
<seb128> mterry, because v3 sucks with full source bzr
<seb128> mterry, the way I patch indicators is bzr merge lp:~mterry ... or bzr merge lp:indicator -c rev
<mterry> seb128, whatever happened to "3.0 (bzr)"?
<kenvandine> Riddell, basically the same thing seb128 is complaining about right now :)
<seb128> mterry, so next merge upstream just do the right thing and see the commit was there and skip it
<mterry> seb128, guh, in-source changes  :-/  I love me some patches
<seb128> mterry, so no need to add a patch, update series and undo in the next update
<seb128> mterry, well it's in the vcs and a proper upstream commit backport
<Riddell> davidcalle: accepted!
<seb128> but yeah it's less nice to apt-get source
<mterry> seb128, I still don't think in bzr.  My internal voice is quilt
<davidcalle> Riddell, thanks! First packages in the archive for me :)
<seb128> mterry, well quilt is work :p you need to get the patch and update the serie and drop the patch and update the serie
<seb128> mterry, bzr merge is easier :p
<seb128> mterry, but yeah, we only do that for dx packages (and lightdm) basically
<mterry> places where upstream is bzr  :)
<seb128> it's only worth when you backport your fixes from a compatible vcs and can merge them with bzr
<seb128> mterry, upstream is bzr and downstream is full source bzr
<davidcalle> Riddell, who should I talk to for a MIR?
<didrocks> mterry: ^
<mterry> davidcalle, more MIRs!?  man...  :)
<mterry> davidcalle, give me a bug #
<Riddell> davidcalle: file one as a bug following the wiki page then talk nicely to mterry
<davidcalle> mterry, Riddell, ok
<Riddell> mterry: oh they require dbus, that might explain why it's fiddly
<Riddell> and selinux
<mterry> dbus-test-runner is in main...  selinux is a harder sell  :)
<Riddell> mterry: ok I can manually patch those out and get it working in my chroot, of course that's no guarantee it'll work in soyuz's chroots
<mterry> Riddell, worth a shot?  PPA would be a good test
 * mterry gets warm fuzzies when tests run
<nessita> seb128: so, I read the wiki page you pointed me at and branched lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu.precise. ubuntu-sso-client is not listed in any seed (I would have expect it to be in desktop). Shall I add an entry there, or shall I ask software-center (which seems the one pulling in ussoc) to depend on ubuntu-sso-client-gtk instead?
<seb128> nessita, how does it work? do clients use a frontend in some way? or do they just use the service which is in -common and that triggers an ui?
<seb128> nessita, i.e who is calling the ui, and how do you decide which one to use if both are installed?
<nessita> seb128: clients accesses the dbus service, which spawns the UI. The ui by default is the -gtk one, but can be changed passing a specific parameter
<nessita> seb128: ubuntu-sso-client recommends the ubuntu-sso-client-gui virtual package
<seb128> nessita, well I guess that s-c etc should depends on the binary which has the service then
<nessita> which is provided by both ubuntu-sso-client-gtk and ubuntu-sso-client-qt
<nessita> seb128: but then who will pull the UI package in?
<seb128> nessita, you shouldn't recommends only a virtual package
<nessita> seb128: no?
<seb128> nessita, Recommends:  ubuntu-sso-client-gtk | ubuntu-sso-client-gui
<seb128> nessita, you always recommends "preferred option | virtual"
<seb128> well, always -> usually
<nessita> sehum... ok, did not know that. Shall I upload an ubuntu2 version of the package then?
<seb128> nessita, that should be enough to pull it in
<seb128> nessita, wait
 * nessita was waiting already :-)
<seb128> nessita, yeah, you can do that
<seb128> though I'm not sure how well that will play for i.e kubuntu
<nessita> hum
<seb128> nessita, you should probably do that and get ubuntu-desktop to recommends ubuntu-sso-client-gtk
<seb128> nessita, then kubuntu-desktop can recommends the -kde version
<nessita> seb128: so, do both? why not just making ubuntu-sso-client recommends the -gui package only, and having ubuntu-desktop recommends ubuntu-sso-client-gtk?
<seb128> nessita, because you don't want to recommends a virtual only, it makes the install not predictable
<nessita> right, I saw that in my vm
<seb128> nessita, how does it determine which of the guy you want when you install it?
<seb128> you prefered | virtual
<seb128> so people get the prefered if they install it "by hand"
<seb128> then you get the seeds to put their preferred one
<nessita> seb128: ack. And then, the kubuntu-desktop recommends will win over the ubuntu-sso-client recommends?
<seb128> nessita, yes
<nessita> ok then. Any wiki page to have the ubuntu-desktop recommending ubuntu-sso-client-gtk?
<seb128> nessita, the gtk | virtual will be true already if kde is installed
<seb128> nessita, you want to add a (ubuntu-sso-client-gtk) to the desktop seed
<seb128> nessita, i.e what I pointed you before
<nessita> yes
<nessita> seb128: ok, will do that. Thanks!
<seb128> kenvandine, ^ can you do that for nessita?
<seb128> kenvandine, nessita: I will have a look later otherwise but I want to finish something first
<nessita> seb128, kenvandine: FYI, ubuntu-sso-client-gtk is still in the NEW queue since is a new binary package
<seb128> nessita,  let me review it for you
<nessita> seb128: no rush!
<nessita> finish your thing first
<seb128> well it will take me a bit so I will review the binaries first then go back to what I'm working on
<seb128> no worry ;-)
<davidcalle> mterry, #933609 and #933610
<kenvandine> seb128, nessita: what should i do?
<nessita> kenvandine: hola!
<seb128> kenvandine, get ubuntu-sso-client-gtk added as a recommends to the desktop seed
<kenvandine> ah
<seb128> kenvandine, I didn't do seed changes for ages, I will look at it later otherwise
<kenvandine> i have only done it once :)
<nessita> kenvandine: I split the ubuntu-sso-client in several binary packages, so we now need the -gtk package there
<seb128> ok, I though you had better experience than me with that :p
<seb128> kenvandine, don't bother if you are busy, we will sort it tomorrow otherwise
<kenvandine> seb128, haha... i think i asked you about it when i did it :)
<seb128> nessita, so I installed the new sso, ubuntuone-control-panel is unhappy, it tells me in red that there is a problem while trying to fetch the authentification informations
<mterry> Riddell, kde-telepathy-approver needs fixing, see bug
<seb128> nessita, that's login in my test user session and click on either "I've an account" or "create an account" in the ubuntuone-control-panel-gtk from precise
<mterry> davidcalle, ACK
<nessita> seb128: hum... I tested in a clean VM. Let me re-check that.
<davidcalle> mterry, many thanks
<seb128> nessita, do I need to reboot?
<nessita> seb128: theoretically, the ussoc service automatically stops after each use. DO you have a ubuntu-sso-login process running?
<mterry> jdstrand, you around?
<mterry> jdstrand, I'd like a security review for a MIR if you have time
<seb128> nessita, it's spawned when I run ubuntuone-control-panel-gtk
<nessita> seb128: yes, but it disappears  after a couple of seconds, right? if you don't do anything else in the controlpanel
<seb128> nessita, correct
<nessita> seb128: what new packages did you install?
<nessita> (for SSO)
<seb128> nessita, the binaries from sso, all but qt
<seb128> well I dpkg -i *.deb but the qt one I'm missing some python-qt4 so I removed it
<nessita> that should work just fine, I'm using in it in a VM. WOUld you please paste the output of the log file located at:
<seb128> nessita,
<seb128> ii  python-ubuntu-sso-client                  2.99.4-0ubuntu1                                 Ubuntu Single Sign-On client - Python library
<nessita> ~/.cache/sso/sso-client.log
<seb128> ii  python-ubuntu-sso-client.tests            2.99.4-0ubuntu1                                 Ubuntu Single Sign-On client - Test suite
<seb128> ii  ubuntu-sso-client                         2.99.4-0ubuntu1                                 Ubuntu Single Sign-On client
<jdstrand> mterry: feel free to add it to my quite long list
<seb128> ii  ubuntu-sso-client-gtk                     2.99.4-0ubuntu1                                 Ubuntu Single Sign-On client - GTK+ frontend
<mterry> jdstrand, :)  just assigned to you
<jdstrand> mterry: I don't have time before ff though
<jdstrand> ok
<mterry> jdstrand, bummer, but understandable
<Riddell> mterry: fixed
<mterry> Riddell, ^ we may not be able to approve whole stack in time
<mterry> Riddell, awesome!
<seb128> nessita, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/844697/
<nessita> seb128: looking
<seb128> nessita,
<seb128> Traceback (most recent call last):
<seb128>   File "/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/ubuntu-sso-client/ubuntu_sso/credentials.py", line 85, in inner
<seb128>     result = yield f(self, *a, **kw)
<seb128> UnicodeEncodeError: 'ascii' codec can't encode character u'\xe9' in position 71: ordinal not in range(128)
<seb128>  
<seb128> not happy I guess
<nessita> seb128: I know what it is...
<nessita> seb128: why would you use .fr locale?
<nessita> :-P
<mterry> Riddell, I'll do rest that I can.  Is the auth-handler something that can be dropped for now and added as a FFe?
<seb128> nessita, it doesn't like my french utf8 ;-)
<nessita> seb128: nopes, it does not. We need to have gettext returning unicode translation
<nessita> seb128: let me build a branch for our trunk, and will make that a patch for the package
<nessita> seb128: would you please file a bug?
<nessita> I will setup my VM with a non-english locale now
<seb128> nessita, ok
<seb128> nessita, I'm disappointed your vm is not in french by default :p
<seb128> nessita, do you want me to hold the binaries until the bug is fixed?
<Riddell> mterry: um, I guess so, why?
<nessita> seb128: I guess is for the best, I don't wanna break every non-english locale :-/
<seb128> nessita, ok
<mterry> Riddell, needs a security review, and jdstrand is overloaded with those
<nessita> seb128: I will try to get a patch today, so I can also add the preferred | virtual tweak to the package
<seb128> nessita, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-sso-client/+bug/933632
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 933632 in ubuntu-sso-client "new sso client has issues on utf8 chars" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> nessita, thanks!
<nessita> seb128: thanks you!
<mterry> Riddell, same empty thing with contact-applet
<dobey> hrmm; apt-cache show not printing Source: for a binary package that has the same name as the source, is annoying
<Riddell> mterry: new telepathy-qt4 uploaded with tests
<Riddell> mterry: new ktp-contact-applet uploaded
<mterry> Riddell, I'm going to stop mentioning bug subscribers in my comments, we'll take that as read
<mterry> :)
<Riddell> mterry: yes kubuntu-bugs will be subscribed
<m4n1sh> mterry: have a min
<mterry> m4n1sh, sure?
<m4n1sh> in com.canonical.unity-greeter
<m4n1sh> which is the key for disabling the dots?
<m4n1sh> draw-grid or xft-antialias?
<m4n1sh> mterry: and what are the possible values of xft-hintstyle
<m4n1sh> IIRC you were managing the greeter
<mterry> m4n1sh, draw-grid
<mterry> m4n1sh, yeah, me and robert-ancell, but he's in Australia
<mterry> m4n1sh, don't like the dots?  :)
<mterry> m4n1sh, you should be able to see the possible values in dconf-editor
<mterry> m4n1sh, in the dropdown for the field
<m4n1sh> mterry: making a UI for configuring it
<mterry> (or in the schema file
<m4n1sh> the work on alm is nearly done
<m4n1sh> ev has to refactor the whoopsie thing before I integrate
<m4n1sh> mterry: I like it, just was looking at the config options.. not to tell I love the greeter <3
<mterry> :)
<mterry> m4n1sh, note that it reads the lightdm's users dconf values, not yours
<m4n1sh> mterry: so lightdm works as a seperate user?
<m4n1sh> means runs as a seperate user?
<mterry> m4n1sh, yup
<m4n1sh> so any hints how to read it? some *kit?
<mterry> m4n1sh, uh, I think you can if you sudo as the lightdm user?
<mterry> m4n1sh, not sure actually.  dconf would need dbus?   so maybe you need to sudo a dbus-launch command line?
<mterry> Riddell, ktp-common-internals needs some symbol tightening, FYI.  Commented in the bug
<m4n1sh> mterry: sudo a gui? doesn't sound good
<mterry> m4n1sh, you can sudo the gsettings command line
<m4n1sh> isnt that a ugly hack? if gsettings can be accessed via gi
<mterry> Riddell, and a minor bug with ktp-presence-applet, comment in bug
<mterry> m4n1sh, hm?
<m4n1sh> mterry: isnt there a way to program-matically read the gsettings value?
<m4n1sh> instead of invoking the gsettings command line which spawns a child process
<mterry> m4n1sh, oh sure.  I see.  You're asking from the POV of how to write a gui.
<m4n1sh> yes
<m4n1sh> exactly
<m4n1sh> accessing the greeter's dconf values
<mterry> m4n1sh, I bet there is a policykit permission you could ask for?  So the user would still need to authenticate to be able to read/write the values (as makes sense, lightdm is a system user), but it wouldn't be full root privileges
<mterry> If that's not possible, invoking a child process is probably safest way to minimize security concern
<m4n1sh> yup, but that's a hack
<m4n1sh> mterry: but even if I get the policykit permission, then a SessionBus needs to be started?
<mterry> m4n1sh, eh... doesn't strike me as bad.  You could write a tiny helper app to reduce the security concerns that used gi to write to gsettings, but that's no different than calling gsettings executable yourself
<mterry> m4n1sh, yar, policykit talks on dbus
<m4n1sh> mterry: bus name?
<mterry> Riddell, ktp-text-ui ships a library in it.  Do you know why?  Does anyone else use it?
<m4n1sh> GSettingsDaemon?
<mterry> m4n1sh, I'm not sure off hand.  policykit has a nice gobject library
<m4n1sh> planning to use it
<m4n1sh> even if it is not running
<m4n1sh> for unity-greeter user
<m4n1sh> than should start by dbus-activation
 * didrocks waves good evening
<didrocks> will probably restart some build later
<didrocks> see you
<Riddell> mterry: upstream says..
<Riddell> 18:35 < d_ed> no-one else does
<Riddell> 18:36 < d_ed> it was discussed patching to not ship it
<Riddell> mterry: so that's in progress
<mterry> Riddell, lintian really hates it.  :)  messages like "postinst-must-call-ldconfig usr/lib/libktpchat.so" but I see that it's rather common in Debian to override that error in KDE packages
<Riddell> mterry: well I guess this is why they weren't enabled https://launchpadlibrarian.net/93089493/buildlog_ubuntu-precise-amd64.telepathy-qt4_0.9.0%2Brepack-0ubuntu2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<mterry> Riddell, ah, that just needs an LD_LIBRARY_PATH being set
<mterry> Riddell, OK!  Just two incompletes and then the security review needed.  The two incompletes should be easy to fix.  Let me know when you upload new ones and I can approve.  Then you might want to drop the auth-handler for now so we can promote the stack without it and file a FFe later for it
 * mterry turns to davidcalle's packages
<kenvandine> uploading my last tp-indicator feature for precise :)
<chrisccoulson> lol @ http://i.imgur.com/2Kq6Y.jpg
<kenvandine> yeah :)
<dobey> i guess PNG is HTML then
 * nessita installs french langpack in honor to seb
<dobey> oh look, weather indicator missing again when i want to look at it; it's so playful with the hide-and-go-seek
<kenvandine> hahaha
<mterry> whoops, was off-irc accidentally.  was wondering why it was so quite  :)
<mterry> quiet
<mterry> I'm getting 'ghost' outlines of closed windows/popups in latest compiz.  Is that known?
<nessita> anyone knows why I can not choose a language different from english in a updated precise install, even if it's installed? see http://ubuntuone.com/1cpYDpn1ZCMtEv3NNASbvu
<nessita> francais is greyed out...
<federico1> ubuntu patches gnome-control-center to allow external modules - does anyone know which such modules get installed?  I'm looking for how distros extend the control center in general
<nessita> seb128: I tried to have it in frensh ;-) ^
<seb128> nessita, that ui sucks
<seb128> nessita, just click on french and dnd it to the top
<nessita> seb128: where what? :-)
<seb128> nessita, the grey ones are the lower rank, they become active if you dnd it at the top
<seb128> nessita, you can reorder lines
<seb128> it's not obvious...
<nessita> ooohhhh
<nessita> let's try
<seb128> nessita, you should be able to dnd french first
<nessita> seb128: what do you mean with dnd?
<seb128> nessita, drag and drop
<seb128> nessita, click on french, hold the click, move up
<nessita> yeah
<nessita> there is *no way* to guess that
<nessita> but I did it
<seb128> right
<seb128> that ui sucks
<seb128> it was planned to be replaced this cycle
<nessita> oh, and now a crash on unity-applications-daemon
<seb128> rodrigo was supposed to work on the control center equivalent
<nessita> :-/
<seb128> but he left canonical
<seb128> so next cycle
<seb128> nessita, well anyway, did it work?
<seb128> you need to log out and in again
<seb128> locale changes are not dynamic
<nessita> seb128: right, will do that, in the mean time I wanted to ask: given that the ff is very close, I can upload the new package the same? I will be doing that tomorrow... or do I need a ffe for the whole changeset I uploaded but is in the NEW queue?
<seb128> nessita, what count is the upload date, not when it's accepted
<seb128> nessita, so you are good
<seb128> nessita, you can upload tomorrow
<nessita> seb128: ack, will do. The lang change seems to be working, I get "mot de passe" now ;-)
<seb128> nessita, excellent ;-)
 * federico1 makes pretty eyes at seb128
<seb128> nessita, see, bugs are nice, they force you to practice french ;-)
<nessita> :-D
<seb128> federico1, hey?
<seb128> federico1, hey
<federico1> seb128: got my question above?
<seb128> federico1, I got "* federico1 makes pretty eyes at seb128"
<federico1> oh
<seb128> federico1, oh, reading scrollback
<federico1> seb128: ubuntu patches gnome-control-center to allow external modules - does anyone know which such modules get installed?  I'm looking for how distros extend the control center in general
<seb128> sorry I'm just back from dinner, I missed what you said earlier
<federico1> np
<seb128> federico1, we have actitivity-log-manager there (zg privacy preferences, since we use zg in the unity dash), deja-dup (backup), indicator-datetime (different implementation datetime from upstream)
<seb128> federico1, jockey (binary drivers), though that's not a proper panel (yet)
<seb128> federico1, and ubuntuone
<federico1> seb128: perfect - I'm going to add those to https://live.gnome.org/Design/SystemSettings/Brainstorm
<federico1> seb128: btw, if you have ideas for that page, they are much appreciated
<seb128> federico1, thanks
<seb128> ok, I will think about it
<seb128> federico1, while you are here, I upgraded to the new g-s-d (was eager to test your dock station work)
<seb128> federico1, my dock dell latitude laptop with lid close still default to "mirror"
<seb128> federico1, do you know if that's a bug, or an hardware limitation, or if I lack updates in the kernel space or something?
<seb128> federico1, that's intel i5 video with external hdmi monitor and lid closed for the docked laptop
<federico1> huh
<dobey> hrmm, splitting up pyqt4 packaging is a lot of tedium
<federico1> seb128: does up_client_lid_is_closed() return the right thing?
<federico1> seb128: try building g-s-d with debug info and setting a breakpoint in the callback we install for UpClient - that one monitors whether the lid is closed
<federico1> seb128: if it doesn't get called when you closed the lid, you have a problem lower down in the stack
<mterry> Riddell, ping?  If you're not up and about, Imma fix those incompletes in the kde telepathy stack
<Riddell> mterry: about but busy
<Riddell> mterry: are you offering to do them for me?
<mterry> Riddell, that's fine.  I can do them for ya.  They are simple
<seb128> federico1, ok thanks, I will have a look
<Riddell> mterry: that would be much appreciated
<seb128> federico1, I wanted to ask if that was a known issue before spending time on it
<mterry> Riddell, if I just remove the auth-handler from the meta package, is that sufficient?
<seb128> federico1, was your work depending on upower or kernel fixes?
<mterry> Riddell, or is there tighter integration in the stack?
<federico1> seb128: no special fixes that I know of
<federico1> seb128: though upower has to work as advertised; there are no fallbacks for anything :)
<federico1> seb128: hmm, I forget the /sys stuff you can check to see if the lid state is accurate...
<Riddell> mterry: I don't know
<mterry> Riddell, ok
<mterry> davidcalle, ping, do you need to make dependency changes elsewhere to have the lens/scope pulled in by default?
<kenvandine> mterry, didrocks said he was going to add a recommends
<mterry> kenvandine, cool
<mterry> kenvandine, before FF?
 * mterry looks at time
<kenvandine> i suspect with tomorrow's unity upload
<seb128> kenvandine, mterry, davidcalle: didrocks got a delay to tomorrow for the unity upload
<mterry> seb128, cool
 * mterry is just making sure his MIR reviews don't go to waste
<kenvandine> seb128, do you think adding error handling counts as a feature? :)
<seb128> kenvandine, no, bug fix :p
<kenvandine> woot!
<kenvandine> now that gwibber-service can give catch the errors
<kenvandine> it would be a shame to not do something with those in an LTS :)
<kenvandine> s/give//
<kenvandine> BigWhale, ^^
 * mterry was hoping I could rent/buy shows & movies in this new video lens like the Ubuntu TV mockups have
<seb128> mterry, don't tell me you can't do that!
<seb128> would be disappointing :-(
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, thank god it's nearly friday :)
<dobey> hrmm
<dobey> there is no way this pyqt build is going to finish in my pbuilder before the FF hour
<dobey> :-/
<davidcalle> mterry, seb128, regarding external sources, for now it uses standard Amazon, Youtube, BBC, etc but it's not Ubuntu TV yet.
<davidcalle> And it might have TED too
<seb128> davidcalle, cool! ;-)
<seb128> davidcalle, I'm eager to try it, I will in a bit when the ff rush is over ;-)
<davidcalle> seb128, all the sources are handled on an external server and are reloaded when the lens starts, so don't take the ones you see in there for release ready choices.
<kenvandine> i assume this window shadows left around with the latest compiz is a known bug?
<dobey> seb128: i guess we'll have to do a ffe to get pyqt changes in and on cd, and the qt sso and ubuntuone-control-panel packages?
<kenvandine> i guess it isn't window shadows, but shadows of indicator menus
<seb128> dobey, yes
<seb128> dobey, you will need to find CD space to start
<seb128> kenvandine, not sure, check that you got today compiz's update
<dobey> seb128: well, to start, i am splitting up pyqt, so we don't need as much space :)
<kenvandine> seb128, i just updated 10m ago
<broder> dobey: you should chat with ScottK about that - i remember seeing a debian bug suggesting that they were about to do that split
<broder> of course, it was from a couple of years ago, so something clearly went wrong
<broder> might be good to figure out if it was anything you should know about
<broder> (but in general, +1 for actually doing it)
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, so dunno if it's known
<seb128> dobey, how much space will you need?
<dobey> seb128: i think around 6MB.
<seb128> dobey, lol, good luck
<seb128> sorry
<dobey> heh
<seb128> but yeah, it's going to be challenging
<dobey> yeah i know
<seb128> we are still like 10mb over size, we should get back on size with the langpacks refreshes
<seb128> but still 6mb is a lot
<dobey> yeah, but gtk2 webkit was more than 6MB
<seb128> right
<seb128> and we were like 10mb over limit before dropping it
<seb128> pitti said we will be at 710mb without it
<kenvandine> http://ubuntuone.com/0KQqzXgaJdD6HXU2n2Cf83
<seb128> which is still like 10mb over limit
<kenvandine> seb128, ^^
<dobey> remove libreoffice ;)
<seb128> kenvandine, did that just start with the recent update?
<kenvandine> seb128, yes
<seb128> ok, tedg was just mentioning something similar I think
<kenvandine> seb128, it is much worse now
<seb128> :-(
<kenvandine> i have lines all over my screen now
<seb128> so regression in the compiz update?
<kenvandine> hard to read text
<seb128> didrocks and dx will love it...
<dobey> i wonder what all we can drop
<kenvandine> it seems to be any menu
<kenvandine> and using the gimp to crop that caused it to look much worse
<tedg> kenvandine, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/933615
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 933615 in compiz "menu shadows not clearing when menus close" [Critical,Incomplete]
<tedg> kenvandine, Apparently try the new version :-)
<tedg> Haven't done that yet.
<kenvandine> woot
<dobey> seb128: hrmm, what lang packs are supposed to be on the CD?
<kenvandine> only french :)
<dobey> lol
<kenvandine> the official language of ubuntu :-D
<dobey> french doesn't seem to be on there :)
<tedg> Woot!  We've won!
<tedg> :-)
<seb128> dobey, as many as we can
<seb128> dobey, there is no strict rules, out of the fact that we don't drop one without a good reason and we fill the space when we get some
<BigWhale> what what? what did I miss?
<BigWhale> :)
<seb128> dobey, oh, and no, we want to change toolkit is not a valid reason ;-)
<kenvandine> woot
<kenvandine> shadows are gone :)
 * dobey doesn't want to change the toolkit
<seb128> kenvandine, you were not uptodate after all?
<kenvandine> i was
<seb128> dobey, well that's what you ask for though
<kenvandine> just had to grab the debs :)
<kenvandine> the fixed version isn't published yet
<seb128> kenvandine, oh ok, there was newer than new?
<seb128> ok ;-)
<kenvandine> indeed :)
<kenvandine> that was aweful!
<dobey> seb128: i'm just trying to help keep all of ubuntuone in the default install :)
<seb128> weird
<kenvandine> tedg, there is hope :)
<seb128> dobey, we have all of ubuntuone, we are happy with the gtk control panel thanks ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, weird, there was only one upload today...
<seb128> kenvandine, do you use the daily ppa builds?
<kenvandine> i use staging
<kenvandine> 1:0.9.7.0~bzr2995-0ubuntu3
<kenvandine> has the fix
<kenvandine> 1:0.9.7.0~bzr2995-0ubuntu2 was broken
<kenvandine> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/1:0.9.7.0~bzr2995-0ubuntu3
<seb128> kenvandine, ok
<seb128> kenvandine, I see, thanks to Didier who came back to upload after having it called a day
<dobey> seb128: how is it decided which languages end up on the CD when space is available, though, and how much of those languages get supported in the default install?
<kenvandine> didrocks rocks :)
<seb128> dobey, the langpacks are filed by number of people in the world speaking the languages, they have a list from wikipedia or something which has the most spoken langages ranking
<seb128> dobey, we support as many as we can, i.e file the CD until we can't put an extra one
<seb128> dobey, as said before if you want a language dropped you can try to argue but I doubt that "we want to switch from gtk to qt" is a good enough reason to drop a language spoken by an hundred million users
<seb128> which is where the current languages we ship rank
<dobey> seb128: i'm just trying to understand the relationship
<seb128> between what and what?
<dobey> for languages being on the cd
<mhr3> kenvandine, thx for merging my branch, but weren't you too quick? as the description said it's not yet fully working with latest dee :)
<dobey> seb128: hrmm, does being in alternate recommends/depends cause something to stay on the CD?
<kenvandine> mhr3, but it works at least as good as before :)
<dobey> seb128: like Recommends: foo | bar, would keep bar on the CD along with foo?
<seb128> dobey, no
<seb128> dobey, if the first alternative is available it will not look for the or
<mhr3> kenvandine, well the dee issues cause the search to maybe return wrong results plus duplication of some items
<kenvandine> hummm, ok
<dobey> kenvandine: what version of gwibber is the gir version?
<kenvandine> my testing it seemed fine
<kenvandine> dobey, what do you mean? what version included your branch?
<dobey> kenvandine: yeah; what version in ubuntu? 3.3.5?
<kenvandine> dobey, yup
<dobey> kenvandine: can you change the gwibber-service depends from python-notify to gir1.2-notify-0.7 then please? :)
<kenvandine> oh!
<dobey> of course, system-config-printer-gnome still depends on python-notify :-/
<dobey> but it's tiny anyway
<kenvandine> dobey, good catch
<kenvandine> thx
<dobey> sure
<dobey> there's a lot of python packages on the CD, so trying to see which ones we can drop :)
<mhr3> kenvandine, yea, my testing tried to be more thorough as gwibber is now first to use DeeTreeIndex outside of our test cases :)
<kenvandine> mhr3, ok, well it is good enough for now :)
<mhr3> kenvandine, ok, the fixes will be merged when kamstrup gets back so it'll get only better :)
<kenvandine> dobey, i had also forgotten to remove the depends for python-gtk2
<kenvandine> not that we can get that off the CD :)
<dobey> kenvandine: naughty nellie!
<dobey> yeah, unfortnately
<dobey> and unfortunately a lot of the python-foo packages are just a few K, so not enough to make us any room
<dobey> kenvandine: why does gwibber depends on python-wnck? :P
<kenvandine> another that can be dropped
<dobey> kenvandine: oh i guess that's the gtk2 deps you meant
<dobey> kenvandine: yay! that gets us 28K :P
<kenvandine> haha
<dobey> now i just need to find 1000 more like that
<kenvandine> shouldn't take long :)
<dobey> where is system-config-printer-gnome upstream?
<dobey> is it a rh thing?
<kenvandine> it used to be
<kenvandine> so probably still is
<kenvandine> seb128, hey... what about that g-c-c change?
<dobey> why isn't ubiquity ported to python-gi? :(
 * seb128 kicks kenvandine
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> kenvandine, I'm working on g-c-c as we speak :p
<kenvandine> woot
<stgraber> dobey: ? ubiquity is using gi
<kenvandine> it is pretty easy to forget to remove old depends
<dobey> stgraber: oh sorry; was looking at rdepends for python-libxml2 which it still uses, and had a brain fail for a second :)
<dobey> wonder why it's not using elementtree though
<dobey> whee, and python-indicate is 14K. only about 7000K left to go
<dobey> wtf; python-dbus depends on python-dbus-dev?
<dobey> later. maybe i'll find a few more K tomorrow :P
<jasoncwarner_> hey RAOF I saw your name aside the corruption at boot bug I reported (reminder: nvidia, which I believe you responded with a 'kjsakjjfeijajklaejakdjfalenvnavlieer nvidia' or something like that)....so, what do you think? anyway we can clear the buffer at boot to at least ensure a blank screen?
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: I've not yet investigated it thoroughly.  We *can't* reasonably clear the VRAM, but it might be possible to get the X server to draw a full black display after each modeset.  I'm not sure what side-effects that would have.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: ok..thanks. let me know what you find when you have a chance to dig in a tad
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-02-17
<RAOF> Argh!  Why is compiz claiming <Alt>+<right>? for alt-tab?
<RAOF> *Sometimes* ?
<TheMuso> RAOF: I am having other funky keybinding issues in conjunction with Orca.
<TheMuso> So I think there may be keybinding issues with recent compizz.
<RAOF> I think this might have to do with the recent keybindings rework. :)
<TheMuso> RAOF: Indeed.
<TheMuso> I've just filed a bug for my issue.
<RAOF> Huh.  It seems that the *second* keypress works - <Alt><left> is swallowed, but <Alt><left>, <Alt><left> goes back a page in Chromium.
<RAOF> Heh.  And if you <Alt><left>, <Alt><right> Tomboy actually gets the <Alt><right>!  Workaround!
 * RAOF kills compiz again to get his keyboard back.
<RAOF> â¦and again.
<RAOF> @pilot out
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> dobey: we don't have many languages any more; English, Simplified Chinese (for China), Spanish, Portugese
<pitti> all others already became a victim of adding the 25th runtime/language on the CD
<DBO> RAOF, sorry, had to reject your branch
<RAOF> DBO: The pointer-barrier thing?  Yeah, after using it for a while it turns out that having the barrier both ways *is* better ;)
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: are you running unity-team ppa for compiz?
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: Yes, I think so.
<RAOF> Oh, actually no.
<DBO> jasoncwarner_, I am
<DBO> if you are referencing evil things from the super key-presses, we know
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: thumper just told me that the compiz there has some serious key grabbing issues...so if you are, that could be a problem
<jasoncwarner_> DBO: yeah, thumper just walked me through it...
<RAOF> I *am* running unity-team PPA for unity, though.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: I think you would have the compiz as well then, no?
<jasoncwarner_> DBO: thanks, yo...sounds like that one is going to be a fun one to look into ;)
<RAOF> 1:0.9.7.0~bzr2995-0ubuntu3 is the version of compiz I have; it's from the main archive.
<RAOF> I also have fun keygrabbing issues; is it possible that the compiz with that issue is in the main archive, rather than the PPA?
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: yeah, me too Installed: 1:0.9.7.0~bzr2995-0ubuntu3
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: I'm pretty sure that is unity-team ppa (didrocks can confirm, though)
<DBO> RAOF, what keygrabbing issues are you seeing?
<RAOF> DBO: <Alt><right> brings up alt-tab switcher, <Alt><left> doesn't work, but <Alt><left><left> does.
<RAOF> Similarly, <Super><space> doesn't summon Do; <Super><space><space> does.
<RAOF> <Alt><left><right> works for <Alt><right>
<DBO> alt right?
<RAOF> Basically, it seems that unity is eating the first keypress of any modifier-using chord.
<DBO> RAOF, how could we be doing that?
<RAOF> DBO: For getting dot points in Tomboy, for example, or for forward in Chromium.
<DBO> super space isn't even us
<pitti> dobey: oh, there's one other thing: if we can drop python3 from the default install again, we'd reclaim some 5 MB :)
<RAOF> DBO: No, but you *could* be eating everything with a <Super> attached, again.  You've got a passive grab on both <Super> and <Alt> now, right?
<DBO> RAOF, also we got unity running in LLVM pipe
<RAOF> Except now you're only eating the first keypress rather than all of them :)
<DBO> RAOF, nothing in archive should have changed that
<DBO> RAOF, LLVMpipe unity is quite fast
<RAOF> There is no newer compiz in the unity-team PPA, at least as far as I can see.
<RAOF> DBO: Yeah, LLVMpipe is pretty good.  I'd be interested to see how it fares on less-than-awesome CPUs; ARM would be a nice test :)
<DBO> RAOF, works fine on a mini-9
<RAOF> That's pretty impressive.
<DBO> yeah
<DBO> its not *as* fast
<DBO> but its livable
<RAOF> Slowish when trying to render a blurred alt-tab over video, I'd wager, but otherwise fine?
<DBO> yes
<DBO> llvm-pipe should disable blurs
<DBO> otherwise it is plenty fast
<RAOF> It just required you to swapbuffers on each damage event?
<DBO> yes
<RAOF> slash frame?
<DBO> yes
<DBO> which we cna do from the unity plugin itself
<DBO> so, as far as Unity is concerned
<DBO> we run on everything now
<RAOF> Props.
<RAOF> Now to get didrocks to try that barrier stuff :)
<RAOF> Hey!  Why don't I have software-center installed?
<RAOF> DBO: The patch for https://bugs.launchpad.net/compiz-core/+bug/925293 was in 1:0.9.7.0~bzr2995-0ubuntu2, which is in the archive.  Is that the thing causing modifiers to go mad?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 925293 in compiz-core "Plugins can't tell the difference between a modifier key-tap, and a modifier key-release (after being used to modify other keys)" [High,Fix committed]
<didrocks> good morning
<RAOF> Yo didrocks!
<didrocks> hey RAOF
<DBO> RAOF, yeah thats the one
<DBO> okay
<didrocks> modifier going mad?
<pitti> hey didrocks
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti
<RAOF> didrocks: Press <Alt><Right> :)
<pitti> RAOF, DBO: oh, are you talking about the problem that I can't type "B" any more?
<didrocks> RAOF: works here, weechat changes my channel
<RAOF> Alternatively, try to go back a page in firefox by pressing <alt><left>
<pitti> (I have a Ctrl+B keybinding assigned which is broken now, and then couldn't type B without modifier)
<didrocks> works too
<RAOF> didrocks: What's your compiz?
<didrocks> RAOF: well, the latest I pushed to the archive
<didrocks> ubuntu3
<RAOF> Hm, odd.
<didrocks> RAOF: pitti: do you have other examples of broken keys?
 * didrocks already reverted one patch yesterday from -0ubuntu2, so I can revert another one :(
<RAOF> didrocks: Anything using <Alt> or <Super>.  The first keypress is ignored  (or does something weird), the second and subsequent has the normal effect.
<RAOF> So I *can* go back a page in Chromium by hitting <Alt><left><left>, but <Alt><left> does nothing.
<DBO> pitti, yeah
<DBO> pitti, seems to be the patch to compiz that got backported into distro
<RAOF> Also, <Super><space> no longer summons Do; <Super><space><space> does.
<didrocks> grrr, I don't understand, it works hereâ¦
<RAOF> The bane of the developer!
<didrocks> ok, anyway, if there is a patch causing that, it can only be this one from the current set
<didrocks> hum
<didrocks> no, there is maybe the keybinding one as well
<pitti> anyway, that patch doesn't seem to have helped here to repair broken key bindings, only made it worse :/
<didrocks> pitti: it's not that one
<pitti> or putting windows into the background is generally broken now
<didrocks> pitti: it's another one which repairs the keybinding
<didrocks> pitti: so, open ccsm
<didrocks> pitti: viewport
<didrocks> switch to viewport
<didrocks> then assign a keybinding
<didrocks> -> this should work
<pitti> hm, my broken key is with window management
<pitti> (which are in control-center)
<pitti> I don't see a key for "put into background" in ccsm, but I'll keep lokoing
<didrocks> pitti: hum, I'm really not sure about this one though
<didrocks> is the viewport keybinding working?
<pitti> that is, switch between virtual desktops?
<pitti> yes, that never broke
<didrocks> (people were complaining about this one for keybindings
<didrocks> it was broken
<pitti> in fact, all of the Alt+F5, Alt+F10, Strg+Alt+Cursor etc. kept working all the time for me
<pitti> except my Ctrl+B to put window into the background
<didrocks> pitti: directly switching to a viewport
<pitti> but I guess I ought to file a bug about it
<pitti> didrocks: ah, let me try
<didrocks> viewport switcher -> go to specific viewport
<didrocks> people were complaining about those
<didrocks> and this is what was fixed by the patch
<pitti> doesn't work when I set it in control-center
<didrocks> alt + r just for testing and it works
<pitti> hm, how do I specify in ccsm?
<pitti> <Ctrl><Alt>1 ? or a different syntax?
<pitti> oh, nevermind; it's a confusing UI, found it
<didrocks> pitti: you can ask for capturing your key combination
<pitti> doesn't work there either
<didrocks> ?
 * didrocks doesn't understand
<pitti> it says <Primary><Alt>1  (and 2)
<didrocks> doesn't undertand at all
<pitti> but it doesn't actually act
<didrocks> pitti: try anything without ctrll
<didrocks> ctrl is written as "primary", that doesn't seem right
<pitti> tried <alt>1 / 2, works
<didrocks> ah
<didrocks> can you try the same for switching windows in the backcgorund?
<pitti> this also works in control-center
<didrocks> not using ctrl
<didrocks> yeah, I ensured the g-c-c integration worked
<pitti> ooh
<pitti> that works
<pitti> nice, I have that key back!
<pitti> so it's "just" control which is broken?
<didrocks> ok, so it's another issue
<didrocks> yeah, control seems to be mapped as "primary"
<didrocks> and no more "ctrl"
 * pitti goes back to configuring his screen layout the normal way, having good IRC again
<pitti> *happy*
<didrocks> I'm puzzled, nothing changed in ccsm, and no big changes in ibcompizconfig
<pitti> new GTK?
<didrocks> yeah, possibly :/
<didrocks> so, there is this bug
<didrocks> now, on the key tap not working
<DBO> didrocks, gtk changed control to primary...
<didrocks> I would really like to reproduce them
<didrocks> DBO: oh?
<didrocks> so yeah, there is a mismatch somewhere now
<didrocks> ok, keybinding works - this primary that we should track
<didrocks> on the tapping now, you all have it?
 * didrocks ties alt + left in weechat, chromium, always work, even the first time
<didrocks> RAOF: as you have the issue, can you do a build for me?
<RAOF> didrocks: Certainly.
<RAOF> Hah.  *Yet another* person confused by <Primary>
<didrocks> RAOF: lp:compiz, comment fix_925293.patch in debian/patches/series
<RAOF> pitti, didrocks: GTK (both 3 *and* 2) now map <Ctrl> to <Primary>.  For some reason that I've not bothered to explore fully, except to bitch about.
<didrocks> RAOF: interesting, so compiz is still waiting for Ctrl, but ccsm, because of gtk is setting it to <Primary> fo you :/
<RAOF> didrocks: Yeah.  Compiz (like apparently everything else which deals with keybindings) needs to deal with that.  http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-control-center/commit/?id=7f5733b454e26c882d4e707b57cd03b104f57dd2 is how g-c-c handled it.
<didrocks> RAOF: oh, thanks for the pointer!
<RAOF> Or possibly ccsm.
<didrocks> yeah
<RAOF> Also, don't write a check like that :)
<didrocks> hum, there seem that there is a key control check
<didrocks> It doesn't like me to edit directly in ccsm
 * didrocks tries in gconf
<didrocks> pitti: ok, Martin
<didrocks> pitti: in gconf-editor
<didrocks> pitti: you can edit your keybindings
<didrocks> for intance
<didrocks> <Control><Alt>1
<didrocks> that works
<didrocks> /apps/compiz-1/plugins/<pluging_name>/screen0/options
<didrocks> it's clearly due to ccsm + new gtk
<didrocks> phew, so the keybinding fix works, just need a little bit help of ccsm side
 * didrocks started to think he will at the end revert all the patches we had
<pitti> didrocks: hm, is that really a ccsm problem? I only touched that in g-c-c
<pitti> didrocks: anyway, I'll keep Alt+B for now
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, I'm looking about this, it's weird
<pitti> didrocks: in fact, that's what I had for a very long time until the menus grabbed them
<pitti> but now the window handling keybinding seems to trump a menu with 'B', so that's fine for me ;)
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> so g-c-c
<didrocks> still uses the keybinding integration
<didrocks> but store <Primary>
<didrocks> in gconf
<didrocks> and show Control in the ui
<didrocks> at least, it all make sense
<didrocks> I think the easier way is in compiz making Primary == Control, otherwise, it's patching g-c-c, ccsmâ¦
<pitti> I still wonder if that is a Gtk bug
<pitti> that seems like a rather pointless change
<didrocks> yeah, maybe better to wait for desrt on that one
<didrocks> RAOF: still building? :)
<RAOF> Yes
 * RAOF heads out to the movies; I'll test once I get back.
<didrocks> ok, thanks RAOF :)
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<pitti> hey tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> pitti, perhaps you know that Dwe have agreed on a printer driver packaging policy with Debian, where one part is to name the packages printer-driver-...
<pitti> tkamppeter: yes
<pitti> tkamppeter: and it seems we have most of that already
<pitti> I updated the seeds along
<tkamppeter> pitti, due to this, all the printer driver packages are renamed now and the ubuntu-meta seeds are pulling the transitional packages.
<tkamppeter> pitti, there are two possibilities to correct this:
<pitti> tkamppeter: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-meta/+changelog :)
<pitti> tkamppeter: I might have missed some, but most are updated
<pitti> c2esp already got renamed easlier
<pitti> in 1.258
<tkamppeter> pitti, fine, but perhaps we can go a more Debian-conforming way to include Debian's meta package printing-metas (source)/printer--drivers-all(binary). This is a meta package not installing any files, so no problem to introduce after FF.
<pitti> tkamppeter: as long as it doesn't pull in a ton of extra packages, or universe ones, sure
<tkamppeter> pitti, it pulls printer-driver-escpr and c2050 from Universe.
<tkamppeter> pitti, we could MIR the two, use printing-metas with these two patched out, or not use printing-metas, WDYT?
<pitti> tkamppeter: they are both tiny, so if they work and are well maintained, a MIR seems fine
<tkamppeter> pitti, is m2300w -> printer-driver-m2300w covered? I do not see this one.
<pitti> we don't currently install this at all by default
<tkamppeter> pitti, printer-driver-escpr is well maintained and probably already widely used under Ubuntu because it is also available as OpenPrinting auto download.
<pitti> supported-misc-servers: * m2300w  # Driver for the Minolta magicolor 2300W/24000W color laser printers
<pitti> I'll update that
<pitti> done
<tkamppeter> pitti, does m2300w get installed with the standard installation, as all the others?
<pitti> no
<tkamppeter> pitti, can we install it? The printers covered by m2300w should get equally treated as printers supported by other drivers.
<pitti> it's quite big (0.5 MB)
<pitti> so, as long as our CDs are horribly oversized, I'd veto any new major additions
<pitti> tkamppeter: I wish we could install printer drivers on demand instead of having to ship them all by default
<pitti> sounds like a nice UDS topic
<pitti> we have a nice system using a PackageKit API for this now
<pitti> so we could introduce this in an upstream friendly way
<pitti> (i. e. not a pure jockey solution)
<tkamppeter> pitti, printing-metas would pull this one, too.
<tkamppeter> pitti, c2050 is for one very old Lexmark inkjet, discontinued ~10 years ago, driver for only 300 dpi color, probably made by a student to get his printer working and that's it. package continued to be maintained by Debian (only packaging and perhaps bug fixes) and auto-synced into Ubuntu ...
<pitti> so that one doesn't seem very urgent then
<tkamppeter> pitti, I would only promote this to main to be able to sync printing-metas from Debian. I by myself even did not work on this package because the expected user community is extremely small.
<pitti> Sweetshark: nice @ bug 900636; do you know whether the patches will be in the pending upload?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 900636 in libreoffice "libreoffice ftbfs on armhf" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/900636
<tkamppeter> pitti, so how should we treat the printer driver seeding then? Simply as before, via ubuntu-meta?
<pitti> tkamppeter: for now this works, so there's no urgency here
<tkamppeter> pitti, OK, and the next one will perhaps download all drivers ...
<tkamppeter> pitti, do you have any idea about bug 933973? Especially it seems to work under Debian but not under Ubuntu, though CUPS packages are identical under Debian and Ubuntu.
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 933973 in cups "Cups and related packages will not install without error in chroot" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/933973
<seb128> hey
<BigW> Greetings
<BigW> Is there a way to reinstall all the ubuntu-desktop packages?
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson,  hey, did you see that t-bird is busted today?
<BigW> I broke something
<BigW> :>
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<pitti> tkamppeter: the main difference is init.d vs. upstart
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
<seb128> rickspencer3, seems it's not? or only if you activate non standard extensions?
<pitti> seb128: quite fine indeed; was quite happy to see this morning that precise_probs.html was beer-y and everything seems to be in good shape :)
<rickspencer3> seb128, well, I don't have non-standard extensions
<davidcalle> Hi seb128
<rickspencer3> it opens for me, but doesn't load any mailboxes or anything
<seb128> rickspencer3, ok, dunno then, works for me ;-) dholbach and micahg just discussed known problem on #ubuntu-devel but that's due to extensions
<seb128> hey davidcalle
<seb128> pitti, great!
<pitti> tkamppeter: there are no logs there, but I suppose it falls over when upstart is not running in the chroot; not sure whether jhunt knows a general solution to this
<rickspencer3> seb128, chrisccoulson I can still watch Taylor Swift videos, so we'll be okay for now
<seb128> rickspencer3, it's only 9pm in the uk, wait for chrisccoulson to get coffee ;-)
<chrisccoulson> hi!
<tkamppeter> pitti, can you assign the bug to the right upstart-in-chroot expert? Thanks.
<rickspencer3> lol
<rickspencer3> hey chrisccoulson, I'm logging a bug now
<chrisccoulson> the bug is a missing file in the package. it would have been trivial for somebody to fix before i signed on this morning, rather than spending efforts discussing workarounds :)
<davidcalle> seb128, I would need a very tiny amount of cd space, for the video lens + scope.
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, oh, someone discussed workaround?
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, what should I do?
<rickspencer3> just wait?
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, you can start it in safe mode (thunderbird -safe-mode)
 * rickspencer3 cancels bug report
<pitti> tkamppeter: it could also be that it fails in post-start, and it needs to be more resilient to cupsd not running
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, thanks
<rickspencer3> as always, you demonstrated awesomeness all around
<rickspencer3> :)
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<pitti> chrisccoulson: quite fine, thanks!
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<seb128> pitti, btw the compiz merge request you reopen, the update is sitting in the oneiric sru queue for a week so technically it's merged ;-)
<seb128> (I was just waiting on the autoimporter, I didn't bother actually using the vcs)
<seb128> pitti, I'm closing it again
<pitti> seb128: oh, I see; sorry
<pitti> need to find some time to process SRUs
<seb128> pitti, no worry
<chrisccoulson> pitti - hmmm, any chance you could kill the thunderbird builds?
<chrisccoulson> it's not actually enough to automatically recover from the problem that people are seeing
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I can't
<pitti> chrisccoulson: best to ask in teh IS channel
<pitti> there is no interface for that aside from ssh'ing in as root and rm -r'ing the build tree, then let it die
<rye> hi chrisccoulson, is thunderbird issue you are discussing related to all panels turning blank with no content?
<rye> as in this - http://ubuntuone.com/2InpyFE2dUNV11zWijd7Ie ?
<micahg> rye: bug 933951
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 933951 in thunderbird "Messaging menu extension interacts badly with lightning in precise making thunderbird unusable" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/933951
<micahg> not fixed, but workaround in there
<chrisccoulson> it's trivially fixable. it would have been better to fix it earlier rather than talk about workarounds and assign it to me when i'm still asleep ;)
<rye> micahg, thank you! could not find the bug in lp, sorry
<micahg> chrisccoulson: I had no idea what was causing it, if I did, I would've :)
<seb128> pitti, thanks for the sru round!
<pitti> you're welcome
<BigW> I figured how to reinstall ubuntu desktop
<seb128> grrrrr
<seb128> launchpad!
<seb128> oops an error, wasted my bug description!
<BigW> seb128, CTRL-A, CTRL-C before clicking submit ... I have this as a conditional reflex. :)
<seb128> yeah
<pitti> seb128: go back
<pitti> in most of the cases going back a page keeps the contents
<pitti> firefox is pretty good at that
<seb128> pitti, not with launchpad ajax stuff
<seb128> I got my title back
<pitti> oh
<seb128> but not the description :-(
<pitti> I was quite surprised that when appending a bug comment, the pending input text is still there even after closing and reopening firefox
<Sweetshark> pitti: bug 900636 patches will be in the next upload (although I think I will do a ppa upload without them first)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 900636 in libreoffice "libreoffice ftbfs on armhf" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/900636
<pitti> Sweetshark: cool, thanks
<pitti> Sweetshark: when do you plan to do this, BTW? we need to coordinate a bit with beta-1
<pitti> and armel takes very long these days
<pitti> although it should be faster now, the babbages are gone
<Sweetshark> ppa upload today
<Sweetshark> main upload, hmm, I would have prefered to put it on a clean debian version, but we could drop that and just go with the ppa-version plus armhf fix
<pitti> PPA version is building out of the packaging git?
<pitti> Sweetshark: I'm asking because this currently fails all the automatic upgrade tests, so it hides the other upgrade issues we need to fix
<Sweetshark> where does it fail the automatic update tests? is that the unopkg issue again?
<pitti> right
<pitti> also, it's one of the major blockers for moving armhf to our default arm flavour and dropping armel
<pitti> Sweetshark: sorry that you have the most important package in the archive :)
<Sweetshark> pitti: stop flattering me ;)
 * pitti sends a big â¥ to Sweetshark
 * Sweetshark hugs pitti
<pitti> Sweetshark: did you see http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=lfcGEQRyaqI ?
<pitti> (wrt. Valentine's day)
<Sweetshark> pitti: How about you becoming the german president? the position is vacant again since 25 minutes ...
<pitti> !
<pitti> http://www.zeit.de/politik/deutschland/2012-02/bundespraesident-wulff-ruecktritt
<pitti> indeed
<Sweetshark> pitti: yeah that guy is great.
<Sweetshark> pitti: http://blog.fefe.de/?ts=b1c35008
<pitti> Gauck FTW
<pitti> We still need Schaeuble, and the others just won't be good
<Sweetshark> CDU -- achivement unlocked: two failed presidents in a row.
<chrisccoulson> oh, i thought you were joking when you said "the position is vacant again since 25 minutes", and then i just checked BBC News ;)
<pitti> he had that coming
<pitti> he didn't really do anything serious, it was just the sum of lots of small blunders
<pitti> and it seems the media just wanted to see him go
<pitti> not that I had ever liked him, but killing him like this was not really appropriate
<pitti> it's just what you get when you make a politician president
<Sweetshark> pitti: although the timing is suspicous -- forcing him to retreat when the rhineland is drunk for a week ...
<RAOF> didrocks: Confirmed; dropping fix_925293.patch makes keybindings work as expected.
<pitti> RAOF: enjoyed the movies?
<RAOF> Yeah.
<RAOF> Saw _The Artist_
<didrocks> RAOF: yeah, someone pointed me to another reproducer which indeed worked here, so I already dropped and upoaded a little bit ealier, thanks for confirming! :)
<RAOF> It's surprising how understandable a silent movie can be, even with so little text.
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i'm pretty stuck with https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=694594 now. anyone got any bright ideas? :-)
<ubot2`> Mozilla bug 694594 in JavaScript Engine "Crashes with gcc 4.4.3" [Critical,New: ]
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: FYI, I'll be on vacation next Monday
<seb128> pitti, ok
<seb128> pitti, have fun! ;-)
<pitti> going to enjoy Berlin for a few days
<seb128> nice
<pitti> will hit the train in two hours, and work offline over the afternoon
<didrocks> pitti: oh enjoy :)
<pitti> I'll have some time to continue on that power debugging script
<pitti> seb128: I should be able to make the release meeting today
<seb128> pitti, ok, great, I'm not sure I will be around to replace you today, I might call it a day earlier this afternoon
<seb128> lol https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=670268
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 670268 in shell "The "all settings" view should have a calculated geometry" [Enhancement,Resolved: duplicate]
<pitti> ^ argh
<seb128> go bastien go ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i was just reading the comments on the duplicate bug too
<chrisccoulson> this is funny: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=657560#c4 ;)
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 657560 in shell "Overview visual improvements" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> lol, yeah
<seb128> comment #19...
<chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, i was just looking at comment #14 too
<seb128> pitti, should report['Title'] be availabe in an apport hook?
<seb128> it gives me a key not found, not sure why
<pitti> seb128: depends; for a crash it should, for a bug report not
<pitti> as bug reports can't have default titles
<seb128> pitti, it's a segfault
<seb128> I run ubuntu-bug on the .crash
<pitti> ah, sorry, no
<pitti> hooks can set it
<pitti> and if they don't, launchpad.py calls report.standard_title()
<pitti> seb128: so if you want to know the default title, just call taht
<seb128> pitti, can I call that myself? or hook after the call?
<seb128> ok, thanks
<seb128> pitti, I want to add [name_of_panel]: at the start of gnome-control-center bugs
<seb128> like [dislay]: segfault in function()
<pitti> seb128: so for future compatibility, probably best if you get it like
<pitti> title = report.get('Title', report.standard_title())
<pitti> title = [... mangle ...]
<pitti> report['Title'] = title
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<jibel> seb128, do you know where unity-greeter read the names of  keyboard layouts to list in the indicator  ?
<seb128> jibel, run d-feet in your user session
<jibel> on the broken system the layout is "fr          oss" and on systems that work it is "fr oss"
<seb128> jibel, connect to the system bus
<seb128> go to org.freedesktop.Accounts
<seb128> select your user on the right, unfold the first categories (.User) and find XKeyboardLayouts and double click on it
<seb128> jibel, but I think it's basically "gsettings get org.gnome.libgnomekbd.keyboard layouts" as well
<seb128> which gives me "['fr\toss']" here
<seb128> pitti, I guess the apport summary dialog is being redesign with ev work? i.e I shouldn't bother sending a fix for the widget being like 15 pixel high?
<seb128> pitti, thanks for the hint, my hook seems to work fine now!
<pitti> seb128: nice!
<Sweetshark> wooohoo! 3.5.0-1ubuntu1~ppa1 seems to run and look good.
 * Sweetshark prepares for upload.
<pitti> \o/
<pitti> bye everyone, have a nice weekend! will get online later again for release meeting, but otherwise mostly work offline
<chrisccoulson> bug 934085 is a really useful and well written bug report
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 934085 in firefox "can't see video" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/934085
<dixoncx> hey, i need help for empthy.. Is there any way for "google group chat" in empathy ? From where i will get "server" address for "google group chat" ?
<dixoncx> hey...
<dixoncx> anyone, pls help...
<dobey> pitti: i was wondering about python3. it looks like lsb-release, lsb-languages, and lsb-core all depend on it though
<dobey> i guess lsb-release is the problematic one there
<seb128> dobey, it was a decision to get pythion3 installed by default I think
<seb128> python3
<seb128> dobey, it just happens that lsb uses it, but it's not there only because of it
<dobey> seb128: perhaps, but if lsb-release requires it, then dropping is a bit more difficult than just discussing whether or not to have it installed by default
<seb128> dobey, well, porting lsb back to python2 is probably trivial
<seb128> dobey, but again "we want to change toolkit for our ui which is working" is hardly a reason to drop python3
<seb128> we will like better to keep the gtk ui of control panel and python3
<seb128> rather than drop python3 so we can switch the control panel to a toolkit which is different from everything else we use
<dobey> regardless of whether we find space on the CD or not, i don't think "keep the gtk control panel" is going to happen
<dobey> and it's not up to me, so i do not want to argue on that point
<nessita> seb128: I know your feelings (and dobey's), but I think that an important reason is that we're no longer supporting the Gtk controlpanel, and perhaps that can be a reason to start a discussion (whatever that can be)
<nessita> seb128: right, the decision of dropping support for the Gtk panel is not ours (devs), so there isn't much we can do. If we don't fit in the CD with Qt, we'll remove the controlpanel altogether leaving the installer only :-/ (which is another thing to maintain for us)
<seb128> dobey, nessita: the gkt control panel is on the CD if nothing happen it will stay here for the lts, so I'm not sure about  the "not going to happen"
<seb128> dobey, nessita: you are an upstream like another, we can decide to stay on the non maintain gtk panel as we decide to stay on GNOME 3.2 for some GNOME components
<jbicha> oh yay, the ubuntu one installer conversation again...
<seb128> jbicha, hey ;-)
<jbicha> seb128: hi
<dobey> seb128: the current gtk+ control panel is broken, and not getting fixed.
<dobey> nessita: were you planning to drop the gtk package on the next release? or when?
<nessita> seb128: sure, I know that. But I also know that part of the Ubuntu One branding is removing the Gtk contropanel and going with the Qt one, so I guess some more conversation will have to happen
<nessita> dobey: I was waiting to see if the issue of room in the CD was resolved...
<dobey> nessita: i think it's resolved to "there is none"
<seb128> nessita, dobey: well we told you at UDS that the toolkit change was going to be an issue, you choosed to ignore that... there we are
<dobey> seb128: i didn't ignore it. i knew it was going to be an issue. but it's not my call unfortunately :)
<nessita> seb128: hey, we did not ignore. We added that info to the decision making layers, and they used it.
<nessita> seb128: and they decided to go this route the same... there isn't much we /couldcan do
<seb128> nessita, well your decision making layers knew there was a chance it would be an issue and decided to take it, there they are
<seb128> nessita, dobey: it's nothing against you guys
<seb128> we just knew there was a chance it would be problematic
<nessita> seb128: right, I know
<dobey> seb128: yes. i knew it was going to be problematic. though, with dropping mono as well, i wasn't expecting it to be *this* problematic :-/
<nessita> dobey: regarding your question, since apparently we now have a definitive answer on the CD room, I guess we'll have to make that happen next release-week, no?
<dobey> seb128: anyway, now we are simply looking for possible solutions to it.
<seb128> dobey, nessita: I guess the best you have to do now is to open a bug explaining why we can't keep the gtk one and need to go with the qt one
<seb128> then we need to figure what we want to do
<seb128> I would argue than we can fix the gtk one if it has issues
<seb128> it seems to work fine for me btw, not sure how it's broken for you
<dobey> seb128: well one problem is that it suggests installing things we no longer supportâ¦
<nessita> seb128: among other things, is broken because it does not present the info as how out latest branding guidelines require
<dobey> seb128: and there are some bugs open that almost certainly won't be getting fixed
<seb128> well, open a bug and state all the reasons we should change for
<nessita> ack
<seb128> I still think it's stupid to switch from our default toolkit to a different one, it's going to be the only application looking different for no reason and it's making CD space issues
<dobey> we have 3 default toolkits
<seb128> like I would like better to have tomboy on the CD than qt only to be able to switch toolkit in the u1 panel
<dobey> actually, no; more than 3, but 3 major ones :)
<dobey> qt is already on the CD. we just need some of the python bindings
<seb128> dobey, we have no application using qt on the unity session so far
<dobey> seb128: unity-2d is qt.
<seb128> no even if it's technically on the CD we don't have any look mismatch
<seb128> dobey, it's not unity and it's not an application
<seb128> dobey, i.e it doesn't show as an look mismatch under unity 3d
<chrisccoulson> right, i've got to pop out for a bit
<chrisccoulson> going for our second scan :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good luck!
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<didrocks> see you chrisccoulson
<dobey> seb128: yes, well, technically our gtk control panel doesn't have a look consistent with the rest of the system, either.
<seb128> dobey, let's stop that discussion, it's not very useful, as said I think the decision made there is stupid but it was neither yours or nessita's and not revelant to solving that issue
<seb128> dobey, I just hate when obviously problematic decision are taken
<seb128> and when it leads to the issue we said it would lead to
<seb128> but shrug, it's the way it is
<seb128> dobey, nessita: open a bug and dump into it all the reason why we need to switch
<seb128> with an indication of the CD space you need
<seb128> then we can work from there
<seb128> we will have to make choices
<seb128> we might need to drop something else if we feel the qt panel is more important
<nessita> seb128: makes sense, thanks
<nessita> I'll talk to the bosses so they can fill in all the reasoning
<dobey> i guess we'll probably ned about 8M :-/
<pitti> dobey: yes, but lsb-release can be reverted in a matter of seconds; it was only switched to python3 to get py3 into the default install, hoping that more projects would pick it up
<pitti> but yes, it's trading one more runtime against another
<pitti> seb128: well, I'd not keep the gtk control panel in our LTS against the U1 team's will
<pitti> it's one of the components which almost certainly needs updating throughout precise's lifetime, so we need upstream support
<seb128> pitti, right, well pyqt is 8mb it seems
<pitti> I do share your avesion against introducing the n+1st toolkit, of course
<pitti> if anythin we need to drop more
<pitti> seb128: right now it's 13
<seb128> pitti, I was rather complaining about the decision to change toolkit to bring yet another set of binding where the toolkit used was working fine
<seb128> but *shrug*
<pitti> it can certainly be split, though, I think dobey mentioned that someone's working on that?
<pitti> seb128: yes, +1
<seb128> pitti, well seems he said it was going to be about 8mb
<seb128> which is better than 13mb
<seb128> but still not small
<pitti> right, and again just for one program
<pitti> so, the installer option would make more sense than in oneiric
<pitti> there it was working well, gtk was supported, and the gtk one was trivial in size
<dobey> well it's 8MB between pyqt itself, the couple of other libqt4-foo packages, and sso and control-panel qt packages
<pitti> is the installer written in Qt? or python/gtk?
<pitti> if it's pyqt, it would be no better, of course
 * pitti offline again until release meeting
<dobey> pitti: installer is already on the CD. it's pygi for now and always has been :)
<seb128> ok, I'm away for some hours, will be back later for a bit
<seb128> have a good w.e if I don't see you
<didrocks> see you seb128
<Daviey> infinity: You asked for a ping today, right? :)
<pitti> didrocks: FYI, retrying unity armel build, previously failed due to libnux arch desync
<asac> gnome-session conflicts unity-2d and vice-versa
<asac> in precise
<asac> guess thats because of a recent upload?
<asac> http://paste.ubuntu.com/846031/
<asac> didrocks: ?
<asac> whats more important of those two?
<asac> when will we get ubuntu-session :)?
<asac> or unity-session
<kenvandine> asac, looks like unity-2d FTBFS
<asac> kk
<asac> kenvandine: who is on it? would like to complete my precise upgrade before rebooting :)
<kenvandine> not sure, i just noticed when you pointed it out :)
<kenvandine> looks like maybe nux wasn't published yet, /me looks closer
<asac> cool.
<asac> guess having hte idea to upgrade during feature freeze rush wasnt the smartest :)
<kenvandine> asac, ok, i restarted the builds
<kenvandine> looks like it just got caught in the middle of publishing
<kenvandine> asac, the builds are succeeding now, but they are going to NEW
<kenvandine> so will be a bit
<asac> kenvandine: rock on... is it unity-2d?
<asac> or nbux?
<kenvandine> unity-2d
<Riddell> pitti: what is the language pack refresh and why does it make things smaller?
<pitti> Riddell: so, there is language-pack-XX-base with the full set
<pitti> Riddell: and language-pack-XX with updates since the last -base refresh
<pitti> so these update packages keep growing until we refresh them
<pitti> and during these times (new gnome/kde upstream releases etc.) they grow quickly
<Riddell> oh that'll be nice to have
<Riddell> kubuntu gained loads of space by splitting out amarok help docs in other languages so there's probably other cases where that can be done for us
<kenvandine> is unity-greeter working for anyone with multiple monitors?
<dobey> kenvandine: i've seen at least one report of it crashing today
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> it is crashing for me too
<dobey> pitti: looks like the old ubuntu-sso-client is still on CD, probably because the new binaries got held back yesterday, due to an issue seb found
<kenvandine> i think it was r294 from robert_ancell
<pitti> dobey: ah, I remember
<kenvandine> but it is  a big change, specifically for handling multiple monitors
<dobey> nessita: did you get seb's issue fixed/uploaded btw?
<pitti> dobey: I binNEWed them this morning, probably after today's CD image cronjob
<dobey> pitti: ah, ok
<pitti> dobey: so they should just fall off tomorrow
<nessita> dobey: nopes, I'm finishing the tests
<kenvandine> it would be nice if lightdm would fallback to another greeter if unity-greeter crashes
<nessita> dobey: shall I hurry that?
<dobey> nessita: please
<nessita> dobey: shall I upload the patch without the tests? I have it working and IRL tested on a french VM
<dobey> nessita: does it affect the tests that we install now?
<nessita> dobey: it modifies it, yes, but does not change the class that is being used from the controlpanel test suite
<dobey> nessita: i think it's probably safe to omit the test changes in the patch then, so we get it uploaded and it's not breaking for everyone.
<nessita> ok, will do that
<dobey> thanks
<dobey> especially important since pitti did the binNEW this morning :)
<nessita> oh uh
<pitti> was I not supposed to?
<nessita> no problem
<nessita> will that asap
<pitti> there was a ton of stuff caught there, I wanted to catch up a little
<nessita> pitti: well, seb found a problem with unicode that we had for ages but was masqueraded
<nessita> pitti: I have the fix, will upload ASAP
<dobey> pitti: it's ok. nessita will upload a fix shortly
<kenvandine> bug 934040
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 934040 in unity-greeter "unity-greeter crashed with SIGSEGV in background_loader_load()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/934040
<pitti> thanks
<kenvandine> i wonder where mterry is
<pitti> at least that one won't be caught then
<dobey> pitti: seb was holding them because of the unicode issue :)
<kenvandine> it is crashing loading the background on multiple monitors
<didrocks> pitti: thanks (sorry was on a call). I'm looking at them
<didrocks> asac: yeah, but once unity-2d will be published, it will be fine
<didrocks> asac: needing a newing on unity-2d indeed
<didrocks> pitti: ^
<didrocks> if around
<didrocks> sorry was on a meeting :)
<pitti> didrocks: meeting> me too, and then off
<pitti> didrocks: no worries, it was just a FYI that you can ignore the armel unity-2d failure (at least the first mail you get)
<didrocks> yeah, I have the tab opened as I'm used to the arch mismatched :p
<didrocks> pitti: if you can just binNEW unity-2d, that would help everyone upgrading https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+queue
<didrocks> just a transition from (unity-2d-launcher, unity-2d-places) -> unity-2d-shell
 * pitti patiently waits for the LP page to load through his shoelace/yoghurt can 2G connection
<didrocks> pitti: urgh, you are on a 2G connexion?
<didrocks> pitti: sorry didn't want to bother you
<didrocks> pitti: I can annoy someone else, don't bother ;)
<pitti> didrocks: done
<pitti> didrocks: no worries
<didrocks> pitti: thanks a lot, sorry again, didn't realize :)
<pitti> didrocks: yes, on a train en route to Berlin
<pitti> release meeting happening now
<pitti> didrocks: de rien :) not your fault
<didrocks> pitti: I think you arrived at your destination already! still a long time remaining?
<didrocks> thought*
<pitti> didrocks: it's a 5:40 hour ride, ETA 1.5 hours
<pitti> meeting finisheed, good night & happy weekend everyone!
<didrocks> see you pitti! enjoy your week-end :)
 * pitti hugs everyone
 * didrocks hugs pitti back
<pitti> didrocks: great work this week!
<didrocks> merci pour le NEWing :)
<didrocks> danke ;)
<didrocks> asac: so, now that unity-2d is available, you should have a matching gnome-session and unity-2d :)
<didrocks> asac: the double Breaks: was needed to ensure people won't land in an empty session
<chrisccoulson> so, we're having another girl by the look of things
<chrisccoulson> i'm going to be seriously outnumbered in this house!
<kenvandine> haha
<czajkowski> chrisccoulson: congrats
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
 * czajkowski has no desktop or login on precise upgrades
<czajkowski> I had no issues till two days ago on preicise :(
<kenvandine> czajkowski, ufh
<kenvandine> czajkowski, mulitple monitors?
<czajkowski> have managed to tether phone and get to tty to ssh in so I can see if I can get this fixed
<czajkowski> no go to login and it keeps saying I've no unity 2d see twitter.com/czajkowski for screen image
<chrisccoulson> now time for me to get some last minute compiler debugging in before the weekend
<chrisccoulson> fun times :)
<kenvandine> on, you got a partial upgrade
<kenvandine> czajkowski, any other sessions you could use?
<czajkowski> kenvandine: would seem that way but every time I try and fix it it keeps giving me an unity 2d erorr saying broken packages
<kenvandine> czajkowski, yeah not all the packages are published
<czajkowski> going to keep trying over the weeknd to pull updates and see if something makes a difference
<czajkowski> if not wiping and installing oneiric on sunday :(
<kenvandine> nah
<kenvandine> you'll be fine :)
<kenvandine> unity-2d should be published soon
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: fight back, fight back! We trust you :)
<czajkowski> lol
<czajkowski> kenvandine: hope so, it's been really good as I say till just this week and things just keep going a bit crazy,
<czajkowski> :)
<kenvandine> dist-upgrade can cause problems :)
<didrocks> well, basically, you can be blind on upgrade, and then take care on dist-upgrade :)
 * didrocks cracked the whip so many times on the french forum than now they don't do any more partial upgrades \o/
<czajkowski> yeah but I do try to run  non released releases to report bugs, the power indicator one got fixed this morning
<czajkowski> just habing no login working is a royal pita
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> czajkowski, need to look really close at what is going to happen on a dist-upgrade before confirming it
<czajkowski> kenvandine: indeed clearled missed the goning_to_remove_login :)
<czajkowski> meh I've a terminal can at least be occupied on the train
<czajkowski> not the end of the world either
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hum, it's your fault my upgrade it taking forever! thunderbird-dbg :p
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: btw, we need to discuss on Monday, I still have the long long "a script is runningâ¦" at startup
<didrocks> and have to press continue to get an ui
<didrocks> (thunderbird takes 1 min to start here)
<kenvandine> czajkowski, unity-2d-shell is now published
<didrocks> kenvandine: can you tell me that everything is fine on upgrade ?
<didrocks> kenvandine: just the unity-2d package transition (I tested on a machine from the ppa, seems ine)
<kenvandine> maybe
<didrocks> as it's was quite epic ;)
<didrocks> it*
<kenvandine> i'd have to also downgrade unity-greeter manually :/
<didrocks> oh?
<didrocks> kenvandine: dpkg-hold FTW
<kenvandine> crashes on multi-monitor
<kenvandine> oh
<czajkowski> kenvandine: can I just install that
<kenvandine> didn't know about that one :)
<czajkowski> or should I wait for it to come down in the archive ?
<kenvandine> czajkowski, dist-upgrade should get it
<didrocks> kenvandine: I learnt about it because of an issue with the nvidia driver for me :)
<kenvandine> i am on nvidia too
<didrocks> yeah, my nvidia card seems to not be supported anymore :/
<czajkowski> kenvandine: cheers will give it a bit
<kenvandine> bummer
<czajkowski> thanks
<didrocks> kenvandine: so, you should be able to dpkg-hold
<kenvandine> didrocks, it crashes trying to resize the wallpaper :/
<czajkowski> kenvandine: oh got a new laptop too no more old tosh with odd errors any more
<didrocks> then, apt-get upgrade
<didrocks> kenvandine: I didn't get any issue on unity-greeter, but I guesss I didn't login with the new version
<kenvandine> bug 934040
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 934040 in unity-greeter "unity-greeter crashed with SIGSEGV in background_loader_load()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/934040
<kenvandine> incase you reboot and hit it
 * didrocks looks
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> dist-upgrade still wants to remove unity-2d
<didrocks> kenvandine: apt-cache policy unity-2d ?
<kenvandine> apt-cache doesn't see it yet
<kenvandine> rmadison does though
<didrocks> oh?
<kenvandine> so almost published :)
<didrocks> not on the main archive?
<didrocks> normally rmadison is _after_
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> main archive
<didrocks> but I won't get against apt-cache policy :)
<kenvandine> i'm not feeling well, taking a bit of a break
<kenvandine> bbiab
<didrocks> kenvandine: :( hope you will feel better soon!
<asac> didrocks: kk. will check out
<asac> seems i can get ^ubuntu-desktop again. great
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, we should do a swap. i'll fix your thunderbird bug if you fix https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=694594 :-)
<ubot2`> Mozilla bug 694594 in JavaScript Engine "Crashes with gcc 4.4.3" [Critical,New: ]
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ahah :)
<didrocks> asac: so, it updated gnome-session and unity-2d?
<chrisccoulson> i think this is a really excellent idea :)
<asac> didrocks: well. one of them was removed i think
<asac> including unity full
<asac> did a dist-upgrade today and forced to continue
<didrocks> ah you forced :)
<asac> but ubuntu-desktop task installed properly now
<asac> doing autoremove --purge now and then rebootin
<asac> ok done
<asac> rebooting ... see you later
<asac> didrocks: seems i am back alive :) ... unity-2d works. and unity works too
<asac> didrocks: i noticed that the lightdm settings icon (the wheel) has a black background
<asac> so its a black box on the purple background with the silver setting wheel inside
<didrocks> asac: yeah, noticed that as well this morning. we pinged robert about it
<asac> didrocks: cool. so the sidebar is not hiding anymore when i full screen it
<asac> guess that definitelyu fixes the issues with that bar staying hidden :)
<didrocks> asac: indeed :p
<didrocks> asac: more seriously, design decision
<asac> wonder if the old behaviour is still wanted
<asac> sure
<asac> i felt it should have been there from the beginning
<didrocks> we miss you! :)
<asac> i basically had this layout on windows 10 years ago :) ... good that folks settled here
<didrocks> heh
<didrocks> asac: it was there
<didrocks> asac: but in ccsm :)
<asac> my innovations finally diffused into the brain of others
<asac> great
<asac> didrocks: guess this cannot be turned off again?
<nessita> pitti, dobey: new ubuntu-sso-client_2.99.4-0ubuntu2 uploaded
<asac> oh... alt-f10 is not avialable anymore to maximize :/
<didrocks> asac: heh on the "innovations" ;)
<didrocks> asac: it can be turned on
<didrocks> but it's "autohide"
<didrocks> not anymore intellihide
<asac> oh :)
<didrocks> in gnome-control-center -> background
<asac> that would be cool
<asac> well. let me use this not-hiding experience again
<asac> since i wanted this in te beginning i guess i will get used to it
<didrocks> asac: it's new, it's fresh, buy it! :)
<czajkowski> kenvandine: oh it did arrive and yes I can now login and not get an error, but it still doesnt bring me to the desktop it seems to just go black and have a muse pointer.
<didrocks> asac: indeed, and don't tell now that you preferred intellihide after all :p
<asac> didrocks: i think... i think the bar could zoom out and become smaller and then when mousing over zoom in :)_
<asac> but not disappear completely
<asac> hehe
<asac> didrocks: do we have four finger swipe to go to other desktops yet?
<didrocks> asac: do you want some woobling effect? :)
<didrocks> hum, not sure about one TBH, kind of too busy to test utouch :)
<asac> kk
<asac> didrocks: would multi-touch work on a thinkpad touchpad?
<asac> x220?
<asac> i have turned it off ... but would love to try
<didrocks> I think I saw people using it
<didrocks> so I assumeâ¦
<asac> really ... hmm.
<asac> ok i will enable it in bios and see whats hot in precise
<didrocks> (latest rally)
<asac> cu later :)
<asac> didrocks: ok... didnt spot a multitouch feature yet... maybe that is not installed by default with ubuntu-desktop?
<asac> ok i could install utouch it seems... if thats what i wnat
<asac> is it?
 * asac just goes for it
<didrocks> asac: calm down, it's Friday evening! :)
<asac> hehe
<didrocks> asac: seems you are excited by precise so far ;)
<asac> thats why i am on fire
<asac> :)
<asac> friday fire
<didrocks> heh
<asac> so utouch-compiz doesnt install
<asac>  utouch-compiz : Depends: compiz-core-abiversion-20110703 but it is not installable
<asac> guess thats old stuff
<didrocks> oh
<didrocks> not sure who is taking care about utouch-compiz
<asac> do i need that?
<asac> its in universe
<asac> so i hope not
<didrocks> asac: no, it's an empty placeholder IIRC
<asac> good
<didrocks> so shouldn't be what you want
<asac> ok relogging and hoping
<mterry> phew, I'm late, but I'm here!
<asac> ok at least the "disable touchpad while typing" setting now seems to do the right thing... so i can keep it enabled for now ... but cant disover multitouch... wonder if there is a test app that shows me my touchpoints to see if it recognizes anything at all
<asac> food etc.
<asac> anyway... break
<asac> but happy with precise so far...
<pgraner> didrocks, I found what causes https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/932520 to happen
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 932520 in unity-distro-priority "Maximzed windows on start up don't show full window" [High,Fix committed]
<didrocks> pgraner: oh really?
<didrocks> what about it?
<pgraner> didrocks, if my launcher is set to "Smart" mode it happens
<pgraner> didrocks, any other mode it works normally
<pgraner> s/Smart/Hidden/
<pgraner> sorry
<didrocks> pgraner: interesting artefacts, can you comment on the bug? I'll reping the dx team about it
<didrocks> so based on the STRUT you get itâ¦
<pgraner> didrocks, already did, let me know if you need anything else
<didrocks> pgraner: will reping dx on monday on it, thanks for the notice :)
<pgraner> didrocks, ack
<czajkowski> kenvandine: whoo it's back to nomrla now
<asac> didrocks: last support request for this weekend: can I change size of the displayed icons in the launcher bar? would really like to use "half of the size"
<asac> on my 12"
<asac> if its a secret you can /msg that me :)
<didrocks> asac: yes you can!
<didrocks> asac: even on the default install, without ccsm :p
<didrocks> and with an ui
<didrocks> lucky you :)
<asac> awesome
<asac> where?
<didrocks> gnome-control-center background
<asac> is there a "yes, i have good eyes" feature?
<asac> nice
<didrocks> heh
<didrocks> see the beautiful scrollbar I made for you :p
<asac> background is not really where i would put it though
<didrocks> talk to design, it was called "user interface" in the ui :)
<asac> didrocks: its actually called look i think
<asac> err appearance
<asac> and then look
<didrocks> asac: appearance
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> it's a distro patch :)
<asac> ah ... wow
<asac> :)
<asac> really odd :)
<asac> you mean ux team did that? or gnome?
<asac> maybe we just reuse the gnome background settings dialog for this?
<didrocks> asac: it's called background in gnome
<asac> yeah
<didrocks> right
<asac> then it makes sense
<asac> so we did the right thing (once)
<didrocks> design asked us to add those options
<asac> i love the 36 icons :
<asac> )\
<didrocks> hehe, we are "butchering" the ui as upstream says :)
<asac> err 32px
<asac> would prefer 24 though i guess
<asac> but *shrug* its good as it is now
<asac> let me check something
<didrocks> asac: yeah, unity doesn't support less right now
<asac> ok
<asac> our dash can become better
<didrocks> http://blog.didrocks.fr/post/Some-unity-configuration-in-gnome-control-center.#c212
<asac> searching for "launcher icon" doesnt bring hte appearence thing
<didrocks> asac: ^ upstream comment :)
<didrocks> yeah, we need to add keywords
<asac> i would really love to add more keywords to various things
<asac> i happened to use win 7
<didrocks> we need someone to track those
<asac> and even though the UI is completely incomprehensive, searching for the natural language terms made me find stuff
<didrocks> (with translation and such)
<pgraner> look like Nvidia broke after updating
<asac> like "how the hell can I change the launcher icon size" ... would work there
<didrocks> agreed
<asac> here just "launcher" would be good :)
<asac> cool. everybody agrees :) ... now lets find a victim to do it
<asac> lol
<asac> enjoy your weekend
<pgraner> bryceh, are you seeing nvidia breakage today?
<didrocks> asac: thanks, you too :)
 * didrocks waves good evening
<bryceh> pgraner, SIGSEGV in WriteToClient() ?
<pgraner> bryceh, no looks like: "This server has an unsupported input driver ABI version (have 16.0, need < 14.0). The driver will load but may behave strangely.
<bryceh> input ABI, huh
<pgraner> bryceh, yea, I can't get X to run, it loops until it finally gives up and I'm at a console prompt
<bryceh> pgraner, mind pastebinning your /var/log/dpkg.log?
<pgraner> nope
<bryceh> pastebinit /var/log/dpkg.log
<pgraner> bryceh, http://paste.ubuntu.com/846249/
<bryceh> thx
<pgraner> bryceh, http://paste.ubuntu.com/846254/    Xorg.0.log
<Sarvatt> pgraner: multi monitor?
<Sarvatt> there's some unity-greeter breakage
<pgraner> Sarvatt, yep two heads
<bryceh> arrandale iirc
<bryceh> upgrade  unity-greeter                  2012-02-17   13:45:02     0.2.1-0ubuntu1                 0.2.3-0ubuntu3
<bryceh> upgrade  nvidia-common                  2012-02-15   21:17:28     1:0.2.37                       1:0.2.38
<Sarvatt> pgraner: downgrading to https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-greeter/0.2.1-0ubuntu1/+build/3209641/+files/unity-greeter_0.2.1-0ubuntu1_amd64.deb sshould fix it for now
<Sarvatt> pgraner: https://launchpad.net/bugs/934040
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 934040 in unity-greeter "unity-greeter crashed with SIGSEGV in background_loader_load()" [High,Confirmed]
<bryceh> pgraner, the input ABI warning is innocuous.  We'll be updating to nvidia 295.20 soonish, and it may go away at that point.
<bryceh> pgraner, and you're a brave man upgrading the day after feature freeze ;-)
<pgraner> bryceh, yea, I went to nvidia right away when I saw that in the log
<pgraner> Sarvatt, that fixed it
<bryceh> pgraner, yeah, our 1.11 xserver has the input stack from xserver 1.12, but NVIDIA really shouldn't care much about the input side of things.  It's been a few weeks since we upped the X stack with that change.
<pgraner> Ok now gnome-settings-daemon keeps dieing
<pgraner> bryceh, http://paste.ubuntu.com/846267/
<bryceh> ok now that looks like us :-)
<bryceh> actually maybe not, that could just be g-s-d confusion
<pgraner> bryceh, if I unplug my wacom tablet g-s-d works
<bryceh> yeah, interesting, it's not recognizing your tablet as a tablet
<pgraner> bryceh, tell me I can blame cnd :)
<bryceh> pgraner, hmm, nothing changed on the X side that'd possibly lead to that.  I think cnd's innocent (unless something changed in the kernel).  Likely is this:
<bryceh> upgrade  gnome-settings-daemon          2012-02-15   09:48:23     3.2.2-0ubuntu17                3.3.5-0ubuntu1
<bryceh>  upgrade  gnome-settings-daemon          2012-02-17   13:41:50     3.3.5-0ubuntu1                 3.3.5-0ubuntu3
<pgraner> bryceh, damn! lol
<bryceh> pgraner, lemme poke around a bit
<pgraner> bryceh, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/934445
<ubot2`> pgraner: Error: <Bugtracker.plugin.Launchpad instance at 0xa5ae8cc> bug 934445 not found
<bryceh> pgraner, mind testing if downgrading to the earlier g-s-d makes it work?  https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/3.2.2-0ubuntu17
<bryceh> yeah looks like this new version has some significant changes with wacom
<bryceh> install  libwacom                       2012-02-15   09:48:22     <none>                         0.3-0ubuntu3
<pgraner> bryceh, that one works just fine.... so I can blame cnd?
<bryceh> seb128, ^^ you will want to look into this; the new wacom code in g-s-d apparently carries some risks
<bryceh> pgraner, nope, this one's for seb128 - see lp #931656
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 931656 in gnome-settings-daemon "let's try to update gsd to the current unstable version" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931656
<pgraner> bryceh, damn, I'm really wanting to blame cnd...
 * pgraner stomps feet
<bryceh> pgraner, basically the new g-s-d has some new wacom support, which evidently could use some additional polish.
<pgraner> bryceh, eh, nice way to put it... polish
<bryceh> pgraner, think you need a clickpad to be able to blame anything on cnd currently ;-)
<pgraner> bryceh, I have one on my lenovo but turn it off, I like the red stick pointer better
<seb128> bryceh, pgraner: hey, what's the issue? wacom shouldn't be used at all if you don't have a wacom device
<pgraner> seb128, I do have one
<seb128> pgraner, what's the issue with it?
<pgraner> seb128, if its plugged in gnome-settings-daemon crashes
<pgraner> seb128, with it unplugged it works fine
<seb128> pgraner, can you report an apport bug?
<bryceh> seb128, see 934445
<pgraner> seb128, I did
<seb128> pgraner, I will have a look but not today
<seb128> it's friday 9pm and it has been a look week ;-)
<bryceh> seb128, thanks; I've assigned it to you and am adding notes from our debugging
<seb128> bryceh, thanks
<pgraner> seb128, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/934445
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 934445 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon 3.3.5 crashed with SIGABRT in g_assertion_message() when my Wacom Bamboo 2FG 4x5 is plugged in" [High,Triaged]
<seb128> bryceh, pgraner: can that wait next week (I guess it can)? ;-)
<seb128> seems the workaround is easy and not so many people have a wacom device
<seb128> bryceh, pgraner: you can disable the wacom plugin in gsettings if needed, or just unplug the device
<pgraner> seb128, yea I downgraded so I'm good for now
<bryceh> seb128, yeah I think it's not critical; not many people have wacoms, and if they do and they MUST use precise, they can downgrade g-s-d
<seb128> ok, good, next week topic then ;-)
<kenvandine> mterry, did you see bug 934040 yet?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 934040 in unity-greeter "unity-greeter crashed with SIGSEGV in background_loader_load()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/934040
<kenvandine> not sure how many people are hitting it, but i know i can reproduce it
<kenvandine> seems to be multi-monitor related
<bryceh> kenvandine, yeah pgraner hit it earlier (see scrollback)
<bryceh> kenvandine, downgrade unity-greeter for the time being
<kenvandine> that is what i did this morning
<bryceh> kenvandine, which video driver?
<kenvandine> i just wanted to make sure mterry saw it
<kenvandine> nvidia
 * bryceh nods
<kenvandine> it has something to do with loading the background image, when it falls back to the default
<bryceh> kenvandine, robert ancell added multi-monitor support yesterday.  the Design team wants the login screen to be shown as extended rather than mirrored as the default, so he's investigating how to get that working.  Perhaps the bug should go his way?
<dobey> hrmm
<dobey> anyone knows what happens if two separate packages have gsettings overrides for the same key?
<kenvandine> bryceh, probably, but i figured mterry was more likely to be around sooner :)
<kenvandine> bryceh, looks like r294 was the commit, but it isn't simple to back out
<kenvandine> dobey, no idea
<BigWhale> did someone recently upgrade python logger in Precise?
<BigWhale> it seems that basicConfig stopped working
<kenvandine> hey BigWhale
<BigWhale> hey ken
<kenvandine> isn't logger builtin to python?
<BigWhale> I think so
<BigWhale> but suddenly I don't get any debug info in Precise
<BigWhale> which is weird
<BigWhale> anyway, I'll bbl ... have to unpack... came from the office half an hour ago :/
<kenvandine> python=2.7.2-13ubuntu5 was uploaded yesterday
<BigWhale> ok, thanks for the info.
<BigWhale> I'll look into it a bit later.
<dobey> kenvandine: i guess it's probably a race, and whichever gets installed last, wins; if not installed at the same time. and if they are installed at the same time, then i am not sure. i guess whichever comes later in the dir() listing
<mterry> kenvandine, back, and ACK
<kenvandine> mterry, i re-assigned it to robert_ancell
<kenvandine> but if you can fix it, i am sure folks would appreciate it :)
<kenvandine> it is a little painful to work around right now
<mterry> kenvandine, so how do you reproduce?
<kenvandine> my nvidia desktop with two displays
<kenvandine> crashes everytime
<kenvandine> i am not sure if it is nvidia specific or not
<kenvandine> could be that both of my displays are 1080p
<kenvandine> so it is scaling the image pretty big
<Sarvatt> kenvandine: do you use twinview too?
<mterry> kenvandine, seems to be because part of the code thinks there are *no* monitors...
<kenvandine> yes
<Sarvatt> everyone i've talked to hitting it has been using twinview
<mterry> kenvandine, can you pastebin me the output of "unity-greeter --test-mode" run in your user session?
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> mterry, http://paste.ubuntu.com/846474/
<mterry> thanks
<kenvandine> i hope it helps :)
<mterry> kenvandine, oh duh.  sorry I need a real log.  /var/log/lightdm/x-0-greeter.log maybe?
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> http://paste.ubuntu.com/846478/
<mterry> kenvandine, thanks!
<kenvandine> that is from 0.2.1, not the crashing version
<mterry> oh
<kenvandine> lightdm doesn't keep logs from previous sessions
<ricotz> cyphermox, ping
<kenvandine> i had to downgrade in order to login
<mterry> kenvandine, right; that makes sense, though doesn't have the debug output I wanted.  /me looks elsewhere
<kenvandine> sorry
<ricotz> cyphermox, hi, libnm-utils-dev is missing to install nm-utils-enum-types.h
<mterry> kenvandine, can you run this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/846487/  (with valac --pkg=gtk+-3.0 monitors.vala; ./monitors)
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> Screen is 3840x1080 pixels
<kenvandine> Monitor 0 is 1920x1080 pixels at 0,0
<kenvandine> Monitor 1 is 1920x1080 pixels at 1920,0
 * mterry is confused then and digs deeper.  kenvandine: thanks again!
<bryceh> mterry, what's the confusion?
<mterry> bryceh, the code at first blush seems to do the right thing as long as it thinks there are monitors.  And the above indicates it's getting the right info about monitors.  I'm just missing something stupid the code must be doing
<kenvandine> mterry, but the crash is in loading the background
<kenvandine> looks to me like it is really when it is trying to resize the background
<mterry> kenvandine, yeah, in loading a background at the various sizes needed, we try to print which sizes we just loaded, and we do that per-monitor size.  So we end up trying to pull a value from a null monitor array
<kenvandine> oh
<ricotz> hello, could someone sponsor this? http://people.ubuntu.com/~ricotz/nm/network-manager_0.9.2.0+git201202161854.8572ecf-0ubuntu3.debdiff
<ricotz> cyphermox, ^
<kenvandine> in the trace on the bug report i saw something that listed 3840x1080
<mterry> I think I see it...
<cyphermox> ricotz: I'll look soon
<cyphermox> already working on it
<ricotz> cyphermox, i already test-built it
<cyphermox> still
<kenvandine> mterry, i'd be happy to test a patch
<ricotz> cyphermox, ok, thanks
<cyphermox> ricotz: what do you need this for?
<cyphermox> just curious, it's obviously needed
<ricotz> g-c-c
<ricotz> but it also breaks the internal header deps
<ricotz> (meaning everything which is using nm-types.h breaks)
<mterry> kenvandine, I was able to reproduce on my own actually, after adjusting test-mode to use two monitors of the same size.  That was the trigger.  So I'm confident I got it.  I'll distro-patch it
<kenvandine> woot
<cyphermox> ricotz: yeah, I ran into that issue with nm-applet too
<kenvandine> mterry, it would be good to add a multi-monitor option to test mode to test these things
<cyphermox> ricotz: so I'll take my changelog and my changes, but I'll frankenstein in your name so you get the credits, since you were already done
<cyphermox> brb; gotta run some errands
<mterry> kenvandine, it has a multi-monitor option in trunk.  but the fake monitors are different sizes... so didn't catch this.  :)
<kenvandine> ah
<mterry> kenvandine, thanks a bunch for your help!  confirming your monitor list was accurate was helpful
<kenvandine> mterry, any time
<ricotz> cyphermox, thanks!
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-02-18
<cyphermox> ricotz: uploaded
<ricotz> cyphermox, thanks :)
<invisigothik> greetings!
<BigWhale> Good Morning.
<m4n1sh> BigWhale: isnt it too early for you?
<BigWhale> well, I did get up at 6am
<m4n1sh> on a sat
<BigWhale> now it's 0930 :)
<BigWhale> m4n1sh, yeah... I'm nuts.
<m4n1sh> too early for a sat
<m4n1sh> On a sat, I usually get up when the clock shows PM
<BigWhale> I think I don't have the sleeping gene or something. 5 hours is enough for me and 6 hours of sleep usually means auto-wake.
<m4n1sh> good for you. Here warm and sometimes hot weather makes me dull
<BigWhale> Come here, we don't know where to put all the snow ... :>
<m4n1sh> lol, you in Europe and can't get that done?
<m4n1sh> what expectation you have from other countries and continents?
<BigWhale> m4n1sh, those that get lots of snow are used to it and have infrastructure to handle it. :))
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-02-19
<hyperair> does evince use utouch by any chance?
<hyperair> for some reason, when i use two-finger scrollign on my laptop, evince lags for a bit after the initial touch before scrolling, whereas scrolling via circular scrolling, trackpoint, or external mouse works without lag
 * hyperair gasps. wow, the two finger pinch zoom actually works!
<ari-tczew> hello
<ari-tczew>  is there any documentation anywhere that tells me what I need to do to make clementine show up in that default apps list in Unity?
<dobey> ari-tczew: you mean on the launcher? or in the dash?
<jbicha> ari-tczew: it needs to have audio/x-vorbis+ogg listed as a mimetime in its .desktop file
<jbicha> http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-control-center/tree/panels/info/cc-info-panel.c#n954
<jbicha> *mimetype
<ari-tczew> dobey: I mean when you right-click on mp3 file, use 'Open as...' and you see a list with software which you can use. Sorry I'm not now on Unity.
<ari-tczew> sorry Open with
<ari-tczew> then you can make any software - make as default
<dobey> ari-tczew: for the list of apps when right-clicking on a file in nautilus, the application's .desktop file must list the file's mime type. although i think there is a way to specify "other" in the UI
<ari-tczew> dobey: this is what jbicha gave up? ^
<dobey> oh i guess there's not
<dobey> ari-tczew: that is something else. that is the default applciations list in the control center
<dobey> which isn't "default application to use for files of type X" so much
<ari-tczew> aha ok
<ari-tczew> dobey, jbicha: file .desktop looks: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/clementine/precise/view/head:/dist/clementine.desktop
<ari-tczew> what is wrong? vorbis exist already
<dobey> ari-tczew: what type of file are you trying to choose it as the handler for in nautilus?
<ari-tczew> dobey: mp3
<ari-tczew> in general, it's a bug 899285
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 899285 in clementine "Nautilus can't make clementine default mp3 player" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/899285
<dobey> ari-tczew: then it should be available in the list
<ari-tczew> dobey: are you running Unity right now?
<dobey> yes
<ari-tczew> dobey: could you try to install clementine and check it?
<dobey> but it has nothing to do with unity
<dobey> ari-tczew: clementine shows up in nautilus for me
<dobey> i didn't even have to restart nautilus
<ari-tczew> what's your ubuntu version?
<dobey> precise
<ari-tczew> hmmm
<ari-tczew> dobey: so, I guess bug 899285 is fixed in precise but oneiric needs SRU. what's your view?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 899285 in clementine "Nautilus can't make clementine default mp3 player" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/899285
<dobey> i have no idea
<dobey> but i doubt it
<dobey> it seems to have the audio/mpeg and audio/x-mp3 mime types in the .desktop file there
<ari-tczew> dobey: so what's the problem of people in above bug? they have even opened issues on ubuntuforums and askubuntu
<dobey> ari-tczew: i have no idea. someone needs to debug it
<ari-tczew> ok
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-02-11
<xnox> popey: there is no migration assistant in precise and up....
<xnox> popey: well we removed migration assistant in 12.04.1 and up.
<xnox> desrt: specifically which ones are affecting you?
<xnox> (ubiquity fixes)
<BigWhale> Morning all ...
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> didrocks: very well, thanks! I had a fine weekend
<pitti> didrocks: how about you?
<didrocks> pitti: very nice as well, a lot of snow, so most of the time was video gaming (mario galaxy II, continuing to get my backlog in shape!), but relaxing :)
 * Sweetshark reports back from skiing. No major injuries, now completed 10 of 16 red tracks done for that area with no intentions for the rest as they are too far off.
<Sweetshark> Also: Inbox 4300 -- if you have anything urgent I need to look at, give me a hint here on IRC.
<didrocks> Sweetshark: welcome back! :)
<Sweetshark> didrocks: thanks, southern france was an excellent host! (Which also means that despite only one day without skiing, I didnt loose any weight: magret de canard sauce framboise et the gourmand were just too tempting.)
<Sweetshark> Its all muscles and heavy bones by now of course!
<didrocks> Sweetshark: ahah, yeah, that's the trap. For me, it was more fondue savoyarde, racletteâ¦ :-)
<didrocks> Sweetshark: how was the weather? It wasn't splendid for me though
<jibel> good morning
<Sweetshark> didrocks: First week was very nice, only one day with rain and fog and wind (all the higher lifts were closed, I did a training session in lower altitudes (1700-1400m) that day. Second week had more new snow and less sun, so I didnt get the traditional drive drown the Massif Lauziere (was closed: they are more careful with that track because of multiples avalanches in the recent years) ... "I love the sound of anti-avalanche detonations in 
<Sweetshark> didrocks: I can evade raclette et fondue, they are part of the organized progam: If you want to join the ride down the tracks at night with a torch, you have to take part ;)
<didrocks> salut jibel :)
<didrocks> Sweetshark: ahah ;)
<jibel> Salut didrocks
<Sweetshark> jibel: morning!
<jibel> good morning Sweetshark !
<BigWhale> pitti, I owe you a beer or two ... :)
<pitti> hey BigWhale
<pitti> BigWhale: for what? :)
<BigWhale> pitti, for the pygobjecy/pycairo stuff/
<pitti> BigWhale: ah, I got it to build now, will update the upstream patch in a bit
<BigWhale> pitti, I'll go and bug them to make a new pycairo release.
<BigWhale> It was last released in 2011 ...
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> good morning chrisccoulson :)
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm good, thanks! yourself?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i'm not too bad thanks
<Laney> helloooo
<pitti> hey Laney
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hi Laney
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'm great, thanks!
<pitti> how about you guys?
<chrisccoulson> pitti, yeah, not too bad thanks. ruby had her first sleep over at her grandparents house at the weekend
<chrisccoulson> we spent the night in a hotel a few miles away
<chrisccoulson> just in case we were needed ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hah, as a trial run? how did it go?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, she was fine with it
<Laney> the main highlight of my weekend was finding a beer shop had opened in the city and going to visit it :-)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: sweet! so, you've got the prospect of a quiet night every now and then now :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti, sort of. we've still got maisie as well ;)
<pitti> Laney: ah, I saw your G+ post; already tried some?
<chrisccoulson> Laney, oh, what sort of beer? :)
<Laney> nope, didn't have a chance yet
<Laney> chrisccoulson: http://twitpic.com/c27ejy !
<chrisccoulson> oh, nice :)
<Laney> http://www.flippinggoodbeershop.co.uk/
<seb128> hey pitti, chrisccoulson, Laney
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<pitti> bonjour seb128, Ã§a va?
<seb128> pitti, oui, trÃ¨s bien, et toi ?
<pitti> seb128: je vais bien aussi, merci! j'ai eu une bonne we, avec Taekwondo, thÃ©Ã¢tre, et soleil :)
<seb128> pitti, j'ai vu ton post sur le taekwondo sur g+
<seb128> brrr, it's freezing (and snowing) here
<pitti> ici aussi
<pitti> -10
<seb128> I've enough of winter, please bring warmer weather
<Laney> indeed
<chrisccoulson> i like winter
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<ogra_> seb128, ++
<seb128> I like winter, but only so long ...
<czajkowski> morning folks, did an upgrade to raring last night and this was the first message I saw, http://ubuntuone.com/5VKWYSD1q9TfkPfkqTcv56
<Laney> true
<BigWhale> czajkowski, you got auto trolled by your desktop background ... :)
<czajkowski> well it;s not the most helpful of messages :/
<seb128> pitti, looking to that udisks/eject/power off bug, do you plan to get udisks 2.1 in raring?
<pitti> seb128: now that we have gvfs 1.15.x, I actually do
<seb128> pitti, excellent ;-)
<ogra_> czajkowski, yeah, there are so much more baeutiful 404s like http://kvartirakrasivo.ru/404/index.php
<Laney> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/raring/main/dist-upgrader-all/current/
<Laney> how are those made?
<pitti> seb128: I didn't upload it yet as David still did quite some architectural changes and I wanted to let it settle for a bit
<pitti> seb128: but I'll get it in before FF
<seb128> pitti, ok, makes sense, I was wondering if we should look at backporting the patches needed for the gvfs poweroff stuf or not ... I will just wait for the update, danke ;-)
<czajkowski> ogra_: yer a bit evil :)
<ogra_> haha
<czajkowski> hmm I also have two U1 clouds now also :/ feck
 * ogra_ wishes he had one that worked 
<ogra_> how do you guys use U1 with 2fa ?
<Laney> .
<Laney> ogra_: what problems do you have? I don't remember anything untoward in that regard
<Laney> also there is #ubuntuone ;-)
<ogra_> Laney, U1 uses my SSO account .... which is tied to 2Fa
<ogra_> if i want to be able to use U1 on a non registered device i always have to have my ubikey or a phone with the google tool with me
<ogra_> that kind of defeats the purpose
<Laney> oh to register new devices
<ogra_> to quickly push or pull something from my GFs or MOMs computers
<Laney> I never considered that as a problem really
<ogra_> i have a ton of machines i definitely dont want to have registered with LP but from which i would like to use shared files
<ogra_> so i never use U1 after all
<xnox> ogra_: use online/web interface instead on non-registered devices.
<xnox> ogra_: you can login donwload/upload stuff.
<ogra_> log in without 2Fa ?
 * ogra_ never used the web interface, i thought it uses the same account
<xnox> no, it still has 2Fa
<ogra_> right
<ogra_> i guess to effectively get around that i can only create an extra account (which i dont really want)
<Laney> can't you just log out when you're finished?
<ogra_> and that helps how ?
<ogra_> sure i can log out, but that only means i need to log in again
<Laney> Then I don't really understand what your problem is.
<ogra_> with another annoying 2Fa run
<Laney> just that it's annoying?
<ogra_> Laney, i would like to use U1 without having to have my 2Fa key with me all the time
<ogra_> or registering devices etc ...
<ogra_> U1 is way more complex to use than it would need to be which makes me simply not use it
<pitti> hm, I have my mobile pretty much everywhere; that works fine for 2fa?
<ogra_> i just changed to a new mobile that i hadnt registered yet ... if you then are somewhere else than home and want to access your files you are screwed
<Laney> it's even worse for me - I need a password manager to know my SSO password ;-)
<ogra_> thats beyond any kind of usability imho
<ogra_> (well, the whole 2Fa concept is imho)
<pitti> I thought you only needed 2fa for the U1 web uI?
<ogra_> you need your SSO account for U1
<pitti> I'm using U1 to sync my music, and the desktop never asked me for 2fa AFAIR
<ogra_> even in the native UI
<pitti> ah, perhaps when I signed up first
<ogra_> right
<pitti> but not in day-to-day operation
<ogra_> which means you effectively register the device for your account
<ogra_> i cant just sit on my moms PC, quickly push and pull some files without jumping through a lot of hoops
<pitti> right
<ogra_> so in the end i use sshfs with my webserver because its so much less effort
<ogra_> which kind of defeats the purpose of U1
<pitti> yeah, for that use case a network storage is much better than syncing files locally
<ogra_> well, but thats not how i understand personal cloud :)
<ogra_> it should make me want to use it over old methods ;)
<pitti> a gvfs backend for U1 would be quite nice indeed :)
<pitti> to directly access files in the cloud instead of having to download everything
<pitti> and/or a fuse module
<ogra_> yeah
<pitti> robru: did you ever make "valadoc" work for libfriends?
 * pitti found bug 1097111 in his quest to use valadoc for umockdev
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1097111 in libfriends "Fix valadoc ;-)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1097111
<pitti> hm, it fails the same way for libgee, so I guess our version just doesn't get along with vala 0.18
<pitti> indeed, it looks in /usr/share/vala-0.14/, so it needs an explicit --vapidir
<jibel> pitti, would 4h be a reasonable default for timeout of automated runs of jhbuild? the longest build is webkit it takes 2h or so
<jibel> pitti, I nearly finished implementing the feature and will submit the patch upstream
<pitti> jibel: did we ever actually see a build hang? I think we mostly need a timeout for "make check"?
<pitti> jibel: \o/
<pitti> jibel: 4 h sounds good to me, but we might want to start with 2.5 then?
<jibel> pitti, I meant 'make check' but the timeout will apply to every phase and is configurable
<jibel> the way jhbuild is structured make it difficult to implement a 'per phase' timeout
<pitti> *nod*
 * Laney eyes webkit with suspicion
<Laney> y u drop symbols
<czajkowski> Laney: swap you sympbols for odd lookin icons
<czajkowski> not sure if this is what it's meant to be
<czajkowski> or just odd
<Laney> I mean library symbols :P
<czajkowski> I'm still willing to swap :)
<Laney> el bug report
<Laney> bah, too much churn http://paste.ubuntu.com/1636182/
<glatzor> hello mpt
<cyphermox> good morning!
<marga> desrt, hey there!
<marga> desrt, it's me with dconf bugs again :)
<marga> desrt, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glib2.0/+bug/1122028
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1122028 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu) "gsettings does not respect dconf locks" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<marga> I'm trying to figure out what's going on.  Sometimes, gsettings values don't match dconf values.
 * xnox ponders if connection information should show hostname or not
<desrt> marga: hi
<psivaa> hello, bug 1122072 is affecting precise installations on VirtualBox.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1122072 in xorg (Ubuntu) "[Precise amd64 on VirtualBox] "Fatal server error: no screen found" in Xorg.0.log" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1122072
<desrt> marga: see https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=693149
<ubot2> Gnome bug 693149 in daemon "idle-delay value ignored when locked" [Normal,Resolved: notabug]
<marga> uhm.
<marga> really?
<marga> uint32 10 ?
<desrt> yup
<jibel> psivaa, what's the kernel on the installation media?
<psivaa> jibel: 3.5.0-23-generic
<psivaa> jibel: 'init: lightdm main process (2405) terminated with status 1' in dmesg
<marga> desrt, :-/  I don't think this is right.  Why does dconf think it's a signed number?  Shouldn't it default to unsigned unless there's a sign there?
<desrt> marga: no.  just as in C, the default is to assume signed
<marga> Except this is a config file
<marga> Not a C program.
<desrt> marga: it's using the GVariant parser
<desrt> which is the same everywhere...
<desrt> when you run 'dconf update' it doesn't have access to the schemas
<desrt> so it doesn't know about what type is expected
<marga> desrt, is there no way that dconf could find out about the non-matching types?
<desrt> no.  dconf is schemaless
<marga> how does dconf communicate with gsettings?
<desrt> gsettings has a pluggable backend mechanism based on the GSettingsBackend interface
<desrt> dconf implements that
<desrt> (it's not a capital-I Interface-- just abstract base class.... same idea, tho)
<marga> Ok.  I understand, but I still think this is something that needs to be fixed
<marga> I'm not sure if it needs to be fixed on the dconf side, or the gsettings side.
<desrt> it's an easy fix: you just need to write the correct type in the file
<marga> But it really makes little sense to cast a value in a config file.
<marga> Yes, yes, but that's to fix our current setup
<desrt> it's not a cast -- it's a type annotation
<marga> I want to fix it so that other people are not biten by the same thing.
<desrt> one thing that could be done is to emit a g_warning() when an incorrectly typed value is found
<desrt> but i'm not sure how much good that would do
<desrt> since it would just go to the .xsession-errors where you may or may not see it (and probably not)
<marga> Right, there are waay to many warnings being emitted
<marga> So, it's difficult to find a really important one
<desrt> meanwhile i can't change the gvariant parser -- it's far too widely used in places where it is assumed that it will remain compatible
<desrt> and i can't change the dconf db file format for the same reason
<desrt> i also can't really introduce a hard dependency on schemas being present during 'dconf update' both because it would again break compatibility and would be a weird layering violation
<marga> this incorrectly typed value... Who would find it? dconf or gsettings?
<desrt> and i don't want an optional dependency (ie: providing 'hints' if the schema is found) because the output of 'dconf update' would change depending on if or if not these files in another directory happened to be installed
<desrt> gsettings is finding it, in context of the program doing the read
<desrt> http://git.gnome.org/browse/glib/tree/gio/gsettingsbackend.c#n725
<desrt>   if G_UNLIKELY (value && !g_variant_is_of_type (value, expected_type))
<desrt>     ....
<marga> what's G_UNLIKELY? :)
<desrt> it'a a static branch prediction hint
<marga> ah, heh
<desrt> we have a bit of a convention of decorating our unexpected error cases with it
<desrt> such that the primary purpose is probably not even related to the performance improvements but improving readability
<marga> would it be too messy to check for casting possibilities in that if?
<desrt> ya... i definitely don't want to do that
<desrt> because then you have a problem but you never find out about it
<marga> So... We are left with adding a warning?
<marga> :-/
<desrt> i'm not even really crazy about a warning
<marga> Well, I've been having this problem for 2 months or so
<marga> And I couldn't fix it until I contacted you
<desrt> you usually don't expect stderr output from properly-behaving GUI applications because (for example) a config file has a bad format
<desrt> hmm
<desrt> you should really ping sooner :)
<desrt> but ya... i understand your frustration
<marga> heh, we didn't know whose fault it was.  We thought it was gnome-screensaver or something, until Jake found the gsettings discrepancy
<marga> I don't even know how he thought of checking that.
<desrt> so one thing that could possibly be kinda OK is for 'dconf update' to open the gsettings schemas only for the purpose of issuing warnings in the case of a type mismatch
<desrt> ie: no impact on the output... just an additional diagnostic printed
<desrt> you're much more likely to see stderr output from 'dconf update' than some GUI program
<desrt> (particularly something like the screensaver, running as part of the session)
<desrt> anyway.... adding this check would be non-trivial and annoying
<desrt> but if someone wanted to do the work, i think it would be helpful to prevent these types of situations
<happyaron> seb128: I guess it's not quite possible to have ibus 1.5 for Raring.
<marga> desrt, alright.
<desrt> in short: if you look at how 'gsettings list-recursively' works, we could take each schema object visited by that command and check its path against the value that you're trying to set in 'dconf update'
<happyaron> seb128: we've encoutered some difficult problems because of the gconf -> dconf move, which is... actually in a mess and need to be sorted out.
<desrt> and do a typecheck
<seb128> happyaron, you know better about IMs than me, what do you think? It's going to be difficult to update the gnome-settings-daemon/gnome-control-center keyboard layout handling code because it would mean having to rewrite our indicator
<marga> although "non-trivial and annoying"\ doesn't sound too tempting :)
<seb128> happyaron, oh, that was a question or a statement? ;-)
<happyaron> seb128: I guess statement... though we're trying to fix every bit, but new problems come out from time to time. Use a newer but not tested version isn't a good idea.
<desrt> marga: the big take away, though, is don't spend 2 months stuck on _anything_ without starting to ping people
<seb128> happyaron, right
<desrt> marga: even if just randomly for them to say "this is not my problem"
<seb128> happyaron, who is "we" there (just curious) ... do you have details on the issues (bug reports, list discussions?)
<marga> desrt, sure, it's just that it's not always easy to know who to ping.
<marga> like... I have this very weird bug that I've been chasing for months... Let me look it up...
<happyaron> seb128: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=700076
<ubot2> Debian bug 700076 in ibus "ibus: non-functional, setup breaks" [Grave,Open]
<marga> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-power-manager/+bug/998735
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 998735 in gnome-power-manager (Ubuntu) "Light blue screen on primary monitor when waking up from inactivity" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<happyaron> seb128: I'm working with another people in ~pkg-ime, and I guess you know him, Yunqiang Su.
<seb128> happyaron, right
<seb128> happyaron, thanks for the update, we are still on ibus 1.4 but I would like to go for the new version and gtk3/gsettings at some point
<seb128> we just need to figure how to get there
<seb128> but probably not this cycle right
<marga> This bug affects cinnamon and gnome, but not unity (in precise).  The bug is caused when using 2 monitors, regardless of the graphics card, regardless of the screensaver.  When the screen is blocked and the user receives a notification, the left screen becomes blue.
<desrt> marga: for issues like that i'd bug RAOF or bryce
<marga> RAOF is a nickname?
<desrt> yes
<desrt> he's on aussietime, though
<marga> oh... :-/
<marga> Ok.
<desrt> but next week he'll be on brittime, i think
<happyaron> seb128: I know the point, but I think let's wait for a bit more time. During my research of recent days I find that upstream is confused by the difference of gobject versions, which leads to quite a lot of problems.
<marga> ok, then.
<marga> tnx
<seb128> happyaron, ok, do you plan to open bugs against ibus upstream about the issues you find? please give me the numbers if you do, I'm interested to follow the progresses on those
<desrt> marga: about the other issue, i'd hate to say 'patches accepted' but i probably won't have time to implement it myself soon
<desrt> (and i still don't _totally_ love the idea)
<happyaron> seb128: I'm still in the progress of tracking issues that are already reported/fixed in RH bugzilla, that takes time...
<seb128> ok
<marga> desrt, well, who knows.  Maybe we'll come up with something better
<xnox> Laney: so I set all the keys for g-s-d to draw background and it doesn't.... I ssh in, fetch the DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS, rerun gsettings set org.gnome.desktop.background draw-background true and boom it draws it.
 * xnox gtk why u no draw early
<jbicha_> seb128: what do you think of https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-terminal/ubuntu/view/head:/debian/patches/02_add_transparency_properties.patch
<larsu> seb128: I'm running attente's ppa, and it works well.  What's your plan on when to get it into the desktop ppa (or even raring)?
<larsu> (I mean the unity-gtk-module thing)
<jbicha_> gnome-terminal 3.7 dropped support for translucent backgrounds and since that patch was disabled for so long, I'm wondering whether it would be better to turn it off again
<seb128> jbicha_, no opinion, feel free to drop it if the feature is gone
<Laney> xnox: is this for the installer? ship a gsettings override?
<larsu> people still want to use transparent terminals? What is this, the 90s?
<seb128> larsu, hey, I was planning to see with him in London next week, maybe having it in the desktop ppa this week and land to archive next week would be good
<ogra_> xnox, did you compile the scheme etc ?
<ogra_> xnox, also in the scheme file the right quoting counts :)
<ogra_> iirc
<larsu> seb128: sounds awesome!
 * didrocks waves good evening
<xnox> Laney: in the installer, and it kind of executes `gsettings set schema key val` with python subprocess
 * xnox ponders if i can ship overrides and load them upon launching gnome-settings-daemon
<smspillaz> bug 1111111
<ogra_> ubiquity should just ship them
<smspillaz> (cmon)
<ogra_> so they get removed with the package again
<Laney> indeed
<ogra_> there is a lot of stuff in casper that should just be in an override file from ubiquity actually
<ogra_> we should consolidate that at some point and clean it up
<ogra_> (casper really only needs to set settings that arent ubiquity related imho)
<xnox> Laney: which override "wins" for the same key? first one or last one?
<Laney> xnox: higher number I believe
<Laney> call it 99_ubiquity-hacks.gstreamer.override or so
<Laney> err not gstreamer, YKWIM
<Laney> too much sessioninstaller on the brain
<xnox> hehe ok.
<robru> pitti, kenvandine was looking into that and I think he got it working for him, but I was never able to build it for unknown reasons.
<xnox> Laney: right, so i think I'm getting to the bottom of this. g-s-d background plugin expects SessionManager on the dbus and listens to SessionRunning signal, but ubiquity runs without a session manager hence that is never fired and the background is not drawn.
<xnox> option one is to use dbusmock to fake session manager =) (pitti will love this)
<xnox> or i'm just gonna take g-s-d background plugin and refactor it into the ubiquity/wallpaper app.
<xnox> (g-s-d implementation looks cleaner and supports screen size changes \o/ )
<jbicha_> how much benefit is disabling the background plugin giving us?
<ogra_> disabling ?
<ogra_> xnox tries to enable it
<jbicha_> ogra_: we disable the plugin by default which by default breaks setups where nautilus doesn't draw the desktop
<notgary_> Question for the room at large: Regarding the closure of bug reports as invalid, what's the etiquette for using the 'No longer affects project' button?
<ogra_> oh. that, that needs reviewing anyway
<jbicha_> I'm curious if it saves 1 second on startup or saves 20k of RAMâ¦
<notgary_> I'm thinking about this for the paper cuts project
<ogra_> jbicha_, there is a WI to make nautilus only start if there are actual icons on the desktop
<notgary_> Since taking our task off the report won't affect the Ubuntu or upstream task
<ogra_> jbicha_, that wouldnt work without the plugin enabled
<ogra_> (unless we can just switch it on on the fly, but i guess that adds startup time)
<seb128> jbicha_, it doesn't save a lot but small wins add, and users who go to gsettings to turn nautilus desktop drawing off can as well turn something else on
<jbicha_> seb128: ok but Ubuntu GNOME ships with desktop-icons-off by default
<seb128> well maybe it should override the g-s-d plugin back to on then?
<jbicha_> so should ubuntu-gnome-default-settings explicitly override ubuntu-settings then?
<seb128> you already do if you turn nautilus off...
<jbicha_> seb128: not currently, we just hope people haven't installed ubuntu-settings :|
<seb128> well, broken one way or the another ;-)
<seb128> I'm fine saying that people who install the gnome settings want the gnome settings
<seb128> so overriding the ubuntu ones
<jbicha_> ok I'll try that then
<jbicha_> I wish Tweak Tool didn't use an autogenerated UI as I don't know how to patch it to explicitly turn on the background plugin if desktop-icons are turned off
<desrt> erm
<desrt> we should never use the background plugin
<desrt> either we should have nautilus drawing the background or compiz
<desrt> never gnome-settings-daemon
<desrt> background plugin just doesn't make sense when you have a compositor
<xnox> desrt: can compiz draw background for me?
<desrt> i don't know
<desrt> but it ought to be able to and it certainly _should_
<desrt> i mean.... one way or another compiz _is_ drawing your background for you as the first thing that it does when compositing your screen
<xnox> desrt: the manpage '--bg-image IMAGE' is a lie. All other references to bg image in compiz refer to integration with nautilus/kwin (pre gtk3 world) to change bg_images based on which virtual desktop is active
<desrt> things are more efficient if it just draws your wallpaper directly rather than some other process drawing it and compiz picking it up and copying it
<xnox> desrt: well, it's just black if I don't have wallpaper app running in ubiquity - gsd manages to draw a background. I didn't manage compiz to trick into drawing a background.
<desrt> isn't there some compiz plugin for this?
<xnox> my next step is to fix up wallpaper app - currently it draws noise.
 * desrt has a hard time believing that for all the plugins compiz has it would lack such a simple thing
<xnox> desrt: well, I've search and the only bit I found was that integrates into nautilus. Didn't find a basic - slap this image on the screen background plugin.
<desrt> :(
<desrt> this is definitely the proper solution -- even if it doesn't exist, i'd suggest writing it :)
<xnox> maybe I'm not up-to-date with how to enable / configure such a plugin from command-line (as ubiquity spawns it's own compiz with only basic plugins enabled to create a bare minimum / lightweight environment for ubiquity window to run in)
<desrt> smspillaz or duflu or even racarr ought to know more about this...
<xnox> well currently we have a botched up single C file wallpaper app which stopped playing nice with rarings gtk/gdk stack =)
<seb128> I would just use the g-s-d plugin in the installer
<seb128> not worth the work to write a compiz plugin
<seb128> (if there is none for that)
<desrt> seb128: do you really think that compiz would be missing a plugin for _anything_? :)
<xnox> seb128: turns out background plugin in g-s-d wants session manager which we are not running. So my current plan is to refactor g-s-d background plugin back into wallpaper app.
<seb128> desrt, well from a quick glance in ccsm I don't find one for that
<xnox> seb128: plus it doesn't help with Xubuntu/Mythbuntu/Studio as they don't have g-s-d nor compiz.
<seb128> hum, k
<desrt> http://wiki.compiz.org/Plugins/Wallpaper <- what is this?
<desrt> according to the docs on that page, the proper way to get it to work is to kill off the wallpaper drawer of your desktop environment
<desrt> https://launchpad.net/compiz-wallpaper-plugin
<desrt> you should definitely talk to smspillaz about this
<xnox> hmm... do we ship that?
<seb128> seems not
<seb128> but that wouldn't help much, as you said most images don't use compiz
<seb128> so for the installer it makes sense to simply draw the background
<jbicha_> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=686549
<seb128> without having to bother about configuration, scalling, etc
<ubot2> Gnome bug 686549 in background "background: remove code that deals with nautilus drawing the desktop" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<xnox> seb128: yeah.... =(
<desrt> what is the goal here?  what installer?
<seb128> desrt, ubiquity in install only mode
<seb128> desrt, that's used by xubuntu, lubuntu, etc as wel
<seb128> l
 * desrt would guess that the non-unity/gnome desktops have their own ...
<desrt> oh
<desrt> xubuntu is not installed by a livecd running a xubuntu desktop
<seb128> same as ubuntu
<xnox> kubuntu using python-qt/X api to draw a picture in the background fullscreen =)
<seb128> you have both items
<desrt> interesting
<seb128> "try desktop" and install from there
<seb128> or install only
<desrt> if this is just for the installer then ya... stop wasting time
<seb128> which just runs ubiquity
<desrt> but for the desktop we're gonna need to kick our g-s-d background dep. for the case that nautilus desktop drawing is disabled
<xnox> desrt: install-only is like an upstart jobs which spawns an X server, paints background creates a fake panel with faked network-manager and opens ubiquity window. The "best" entertainment one gets is the slideshow =) it is meant to be low-RAM friendly yet prettier than alternate cd
<desrt> neat.  got a11y?
<xnox> desrt: yeah we spawn that as well based on kernel / boot params or if Ctrl+L gets clicked.
<xnox> we have magnifier/alternative input/screenreader/low-contrast.
<xnox> it's like a mininiature desktop environment with smoke and mirrors =)
<xnox> supporting kwin, lxde, xcfe, compiz, metacity, etc.....
<desrt> seb128: btw: i was wondering what you will do about the keyboard stuff this cycle.  did you plan to try to stay on old ibus and the 3.2/3.4 era panel?
 * desrt tried out F18 over the weekend... wow...
<seb128> desrt, yes
<seb128> desrt, it might not be the nicest ui but it's allowing people in china to use their computer... ;-)
 * desrt wanted to stab someone when trying to ues it
<desrt> turns out that all the features that i thought they removed were just recategorised.... arguably in better places
 * desrt still has an uneasy feeling
<desrt> when/if we migrate we're gonna have to deal better with it than did upstream
<desrt> like 3rd level switcher and compose keys are no longer accessible via xkb options panel... but they added items to the 'shortcut keys'
<desrt> which kinda makes sense, but only if you've never used it before
<desrt> for existing users it's like *argghgh*
<desrt> they also removed esperanto support from the primary UI and stuck it in tweak tool.  a huge setback to the international agenda, imho :(
<bryce> desrt, "they" being xkb, or gnome?
<desrt> gnome
<bryce> desrt, ah.
<desrt> you know that big ugly xkb options panel that you can get to now by clicking on 'options'?
<bryce> desrt, yeah
<desrt> that's completely gone as of gnome 3.6
<bryce> :-(
<desrt> a select few things are lifted out of it into a nicer UI (like compose, 3rd level chooser, etc)
<desrt> the rest are dumped into the tweaktool
<bryce> desrt, I know there's some options from that which many people switch on (e.g. compose key, 3rd level, etc.)  I've been wondering if we ought to consider making some of those on by default.  Like R-Alt is compose by default, or whatever.
<desrt> i use r-alt for 3rd level fwiw
<desrt> which i guess is a pretty common thing to do
<desrt> some keycaps even have 'AltGr' written on that key
<desrt> but i guess at the same time some users would be quite surprised to find that alt+f (chorded using the right alt key) is no longer doing what it used to
<bryce> desrt, well, this is why I think this.  _Because_ they're so widely used, and because they're not on by default, and because we expose so many options, there's huge diversity in what people have gotten used to using.
<desrt> you're starting to sound like a gnome designer :)
<bryce> desrt, maybe the inverse :-)
<jasoncwarner_> chrisccoulson hey dude...rickspencer3 just mentioned that he sometimes has the goog hangout plugin freeze and completely take down firefox
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner_, srsly? :(
<bryce> desrt, I'd rather see better defaults with a detailed config tool, than no defaults and a braindead config tool
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner_, any steps to reproduce?
<desrt> bryce: ya.. so you're probably kinda on-page with the new gnome 3.6 approach already, then
<desrt> meanwhile, tweak-tool allows access to the 'other' options
<desrt> (although it does it with an interface that's even worse than the old xkb options interface from the control centre)
<jasoncwarner_> chrisccoulson not sure on steps, he just said it crashes, then firefox becomes unresponsive and he has to killall it
<bryce> desrt, worse?
<desrt> ya.. seriously
<bryce> (how??)
<desrt> ll
<bryce> anyway, ok...
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner_, it might be helpful if rickspencer3 could attach gdb to it once it's hung :)
<desrt> can't find a screenshot and don't want to boot fedora to get you one
<desrt> but rest assured, it's substantially worse
<bryce> desrt, don't worry about it, I prefer to live life in denial
<desrt> basically it's a list of drop-downs with labels to the left
<desrt> the label on the left is the xkb option name (as you would write it in the XKBOPTIONS string)
<desrt> the pulldown has the strings that would appear on the right side in the XKBOPTIONS string
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, ack, I'll see if I can get a stacktrace next time
<desrt> so like lv3     [ ralt_switch ]
<bryce> desrt, bet it was easy to implement!
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, cool, thanks :)
<desrt> bryce: i imagine so :)
<bryce> desrt, thankfully our users *love* it when we change the config tools
<desrt> ya.... i really can't recall the last time i heard a complaint in response to something like that
<thumper> morning
<jbicha_> desrt: have you tried gnome-control-center 3.7.5 yet? I think they moved several of the layout options back
<desrt> no
<desrt> just F18
<seb128> it's funny to see how GNOME is adding back stuff we distro patched by then when we updated to GNOME3, after they wontfixed those for over a year
<seb128> like they are adding a "never" option back to to "screen off after" list
<seb128> it's not the first one to happen this cycle ;-)
<seb128> they also decided to keep nautilus rendering of the desktop for their new "fallback"
 * desrt disappears to the dentist for an hour or so
<dobey> ugh nautilus; is the requirement to have nautilus running for drawing the background in raring now, a bug in gnome or compiz?
<dobey> (or unity)
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, should 09_lp577919-fix-chromium-launch.patch from lightdm be upstream?
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: hey, which upstream?
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, i.e. lightdm trunk
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: lightdm upstream already has the guest session apparmor in trunk?
<jdstrand> apparmor profile*
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, yes (we're upstream)
<robert_ancell> bug 577919
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 577919 in Light Display Manager "chromium-browser fails to start (guest account, OpenVZ): "Failed to move to new PID namespace: Operation not permitted"" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/577919
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: yes (I know we/you are upstream :)
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, the plan is to split the guest session out so then the apparmour will be separate but for now it's in trunk
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: what I was getting at is that you could collapse all the apparmor patches into one if you don't have them upstream. otherwise, I think including upstream is best
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, I hadn't noticed they were there. Is there any reason not to just merge them into trunk?
<jdstrand> not that I can think of
<jdstrand> anyone else who wants lightdm and uses apparmor would benefit
<robert_ancell> ok, done
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: thanks
<jbicha> dobey: I believe it's a compiz bug since GNOME Shell doesn't need the g-s-d bg plugin & GNOME plans to get rid of the plugin
<dobey> jbicha: is the plug-in already gone?
<dobey> i guess gnome-shell does it in the WM, which is just silly
<jbicha> dobey: no and we won't be taking g-s-d 3.8 for raring anyway
<dobey> jbicha: then shouldn't it still work with show-desktop-icons = false?
<Laney> if you re-enable the plugin
<jbicha> hmm, actually I guess it doesn't work correctly with raring's gnome-shell
<dobey> Laney: so the correct answer to "was it removed" is "basically, yes; it's still there but not enabled by default" ?
<Laney> it's disabled because, by default, it's not useful as nautilus handles it
<Laney> the show-desktop-icons thing is an annoying gotcha, i'll grant you
<stgraber> Laney: don't we have some clever gsettings migration scripts for that? surely we can explicitly turn on the plugin if we detect show-desktop-icons is false on upgrade
<stgraber> (won't work for anyone changing this after the upgrade script has run, but that should fix the obvious upgrade case at least)
<Laney> we do have the session-migration stuff, yeah
<BigWhale> The fact, that windows can't be placed over Panel and Launcher with Gtk.window.move() is seriously disturbing.
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-02-12
<smspillaz> xnox: you want wallpapes ?
<smspillaz> *wallpapers ?
<xnox> smspillaz: yes and no =) are you an X/gdk and,or compiz expert? =)
<RAOF> BigWhale: Whyso? Why would you expect to be able to move windows there?
<xnox> smspillaz: currently the installer doesn't show the wallpaper correctly (in the ubiquity-dm aka 'installer only' mode). Either the gdk mini wallpaper app in ubiquity needs fixing, or it would be awesome to ask compiz or g-s-d to draw the wallpaper for us.
<smspillaz> xnox: does it work if you use metacity?
<xnox> smspillaz: the wallpaper app? nope, it shows same corruption effects.
<xnox> (g-s-d works in both but wants session manager which we currently don't run)
<xnox> (compiz doesn't seem to have a way to draw a basic image / wallpaper in the background)
<xnox> but i've tested metacity with the installer long time ago, as we moved to compiz a while ago.
<smspillaz> xnox: hmm okay
<smspillaz> xnox: well, we do have a wallpaper plugin
<smspillaz> (I was just checking to see if compiz' ability to display the root window image broke again somehow)
<smspillaz> xnox: you can just enable that and give it an image
<xnox> smspillaz: ok, i will try it out as an alternative. I can see it's shipped in the compiz-plugins package which is not on the cd.
<smspillaz> yeah
<xnox> but i'll test it out to see how much it suits ubiquity use case =)
<smspillaz> otherwise you could just use XSetWindowBackground on the root window directly
<xnox> smspillaz: it would be nice for compiz to draw the background by default on the desktop as well.
<smspillaz> xnox: it does draw the background by default
<smspillaz> xnox: but it only does that if there are no desktop windows
<xnox> hmmm...
<smspillaz> and only if the background was set correctly
<xnox> and if compiz is started with wallpaper plugin loaded?
<xnox> recent discussions with laney and seb128 got me thinking that currently we have nautilus and g-s-d drawing the wallpaper apart from that we one or the other to do that & not both.
<xnox> currently we opted to disable g-s-d background plugin (which kind of breaks for people who have disabled desktop icons, since nautilus is not running/drawing background then)
<xnox> in the future nautilus will drop background drawing code.
<TheMuso> I've always thought that it didn't make sense for the file manager to draw the background...
<smspillaz> TheMuso: it made sense back in the days when you didn't have rgba windows
<smspillaz> way back when (like, back in 2007) I remember racarr wrote a patch for nautilus which made it an rgba window and made it only draw icons if wallpaper was enabled
<smspillaz> it allowed you to have per-workspace wallpapers
<smspillaz> it was pretty cool
<pitti> robru: I got valadoc to work now, one just needs to add the correct --vapidir for 0.18
<pitti> xnox: FYI, we recently disabled the g-s-d background plugin
<didrocks> re
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, comment vas-tu?
<didrocks> pitti: bonjour! mieux que mon wifi, j'ai dÃ» redÃ©marrer sur un ancien kernel :)
<didrocks> et toi?
<pitti> didrocks: je vais bien!
<pitti> just announced https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Raring/view/JHBuild%20Gnome/ to upstream, looking forward to people who want to fix their tests :)
<pitti> didrocks: when did wifi break for you?
<didrocks> pitti: on GNOME - jhbuild: excellent!
<didrocks> pitti: not sure, I dist-upgraded on 3.8.0-5 yesterday evening, and rebooted this morning
<didrocks> network connection worked for 30s
<didrocks> just the time to connect to IRC
<didrocks> rebooted on 3.8.0-4 and I see there is 3.8.0-6
<pitti> I'm running -6 now
<pitti> so -4 works?
<didrocks> yeah, it does for me
<pitti> the -5 changelog has nothing networkish in it, hmm
<pitti> -6 is a new upstream version
<didrocks> indeed
<didrocks> I was looking at that, weird
<duflu> didrocks: By network you mean intel wifi?
<didrocks> duflu: yeah
<duflu> didrocks: Yeah I noticed raring regressed badly on that last week
<duflu> Seems better now. Not sure
<didrocks> duflu: yeah, better for me as well, apart -5 this morning (but didn't try to reboot with the same kernel)
<duflu> didrocks: I had wifi errors in the kernel log when it happened. If it starts again I'll log a bug and CC you
<didrocks> duflu: depends on people, it seems that there are multiple causes, we do have multiple bugs (tjaalton opened one for instance)
<didrocks> hey robru, still around? :)
<robru> didrocks, you're in luck!
<didrocks> robru: ahah, always getting to bed late ;)
<didrocks> robru: just a head's up on https://code.launchpad.net/~abreu-alexandre/libunity-webapps/bump-2.4.4-fix-distcheck/+merge/147424/comments/320994
<didrocks> robru: please do think about that when you are reviewing upstream merge proposals
<tjaalton> didrocks: actually I didn't, since the offending commit was identified already
<tjaalton> before I got that far
<didrocks> tjaalton: ah nice, that's why previous kernels like -4 are getting better
<tjaalton> not sure it's in any deb yet
<tjaalton> but the one Sarvatt built was fine here
<tjaalton> so I think seth took it from there
<robru> didrocks, so this is a case of Canonical "upstreams" changing the version string in autoconf, but not in debian changelog, leading to an inconsistent state in the upstream trunk?
<didrocks> tjaalton: sweet, at least, great that the regressions are round :)
<didrocks> robru: exactly!
<robru> didrocks, I wonder if there's a way to hack autoconf to pull the version string from the debian changelog, so that way the information isn't duplicated ;-)
<didrocks> robru: well, there are different way of versionning in autoconf, then you have cmakeâ¦ and all that fun :)
<didrocks> robru: I think you saw, I've made a very simple FAQ for upstream and point to it at least :)
<didrocks> robru: do you mind ensuring that they are fixing it?
<didrocks> robru: it's an easy MP, but them doing it will ensure they will think about it in the future ;)
<robru> didrocks, but in this specific case it just looks like autoconf just has a simple m4 macro where they define the version string. you know, m4 is a turing complete programming language (despite being aimed at just doing macros) so maybe it should be possible to write an autoconf m4 macro that scans debian/changelog for what version string to use ;-)
<robru> didrocks, yes, I've already seen some cases where upstreams are trying to do releases but they haven't yet learned that they need to control debian/changelog now, so the changelog gets to an inconsistent state. Usually I am scrambling to fix it for them ;-)
<didrocks> robru: hum, we still need to add a new changelog and to commit that in same way, doable, not sure if it worths it for now (and I've already touched perl this week, so no m4 the same week) :p
<robru> hahaha
<didrocks> robru: try to get them fixing it and helping them, it's the only way they will learn/think about it IMHO :)
<didrocks> robru: so, counting on you to get it fixed (probably your tomorrow, no hurry anyway ;))
<robru> didrocks, oh, ok. well you already made the comment on the merge. do you want me to pester them even more?
<didrocks> robru: in case they don't see/read it, just track it and ping them on IRC if you see no action
<robru> ok
<didrocks> thanks robru :-)
<didrocks> robru: how is it going otherwise? what time is it for you?
<robru> didrocks, only 11:30PM for me, not too late just yet
<didrocks> yeah, still bearable :)
<robru> didrocks, going fairly well. today ken pushed a really big update to gwibber-qml, which is the phone frontend to friends. it's pretty slick!
<didrocks> robru: sweet! :-)
<robru> didrocks, I am so excited about this qml stuff that I want to start using it as my regular desktop app. it's not quite feature complete yet, but the features it does have are beautiful!
<didrocks> robru: indeed, I'm still wondering what will happen when people will need to touch the C++ to be able to expose more things, but it seems to be the right way to go :)
<robru> didrocks, do you know what kinds of things need C++? it seems to me like javascript is quite a nice language for general purpose hacking. I know in gjs you get the whole gobject stack within javascript, do you know if it's possible to import gobjects into qml?
<duflu> Run away...
<BigWhale> RAOF: When I'm recording a preselected area on the screen, this can overlap Launcher and Panel and while recording I'd like to draw an outline around that area.
<didrocks> robru: well, with the mainloops, I think it's possible but would be hackish, not sure we are going that way
<BigWhale> Good Morning all.
<didrocks> robru: there are still some stuff that are not exposed, like having a database not being the default one, writing to network disk, loading some icons from a theme
<didrocks> hey BigWhale
<didrocks> robru: not sure if we can't get the networking state still
<RAOF> BigWhale: My instinct would be: create a fullscreen, alpha=0 window, and then draw on it.
<robru> didrocks, well I'm sure it'll be handled in time.
<robru> BigWhale, good morning
<didrocks> robru: yeah, let's hope so :)
<BigWhale> Good Morning didrocks, RAOF, robru. :)
<BigWhale> RAOF, I am doing that when I'm selecting the area, that's ok.
<BigWhale> RAOF, The problem with this solution is that Panel and Launcher disappear when window is fullscreened. :)
<BigWhale> (and sometimes there will be a shadow of the Panel left on the screen)
<jibel> good morning
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<chrisccoulson> hi jibel
<jibel> hey chrisccoulson
<didrocks> salut jibel! hey chrisccoulson ;)
<jibel> chrisccoulson, I didn't forget you, but collecting junit files from the sandbox is actually less trivial than expected. The sandbox is deleted after the tests and before I can copy the results. furthermore the test is not supposed to know anything about the outside environment.
<jibel> so I need to think a bit harder
<chrisccoulson> jibel, heh, that's ok. thanks :)
<robru> pitti, I don't suppose you (or anybody...) knows where I can find a list of all known vala exceptions? eg, a list of the known/common subclasses of GLib.Error
<pitti> robru: valadoc.org, searching for "Error" might be a good first start?
<robru> pitti, yeah, I tried that, it seems to be mostly errors defined by random gobject libraries. is there no collection of the more "core" gerrors?
<Laney> good morning!
<pitti> robru: you mean those from glib/gio itself?
<pitti> robru: perhaps grep member.*ERROR /usr/share/gir-1.0/{GLib,GObject,Gio}-2.0.gir ?
<pitti> (or search for _ERROR_ in devhelp)
<robru> pitti, ahhhhhh, that's getting much closer to what I want. thanks!
<seb128> hey desktopers
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> pitti, thanks for the gvfs update, when we enable the goa monitor we should split it in its own binary probably (I had that on my todolist)
<seb128> pitti, salut, ca va bien ?
<pitti> seb128: that needs a gnome-online-accounts update first, and I guess we won't get that in this cycle?
<pitti> seb128: oui, Ã§a va bien, merci
<seb128> I've no plan for that
<seb128> but goa is not used by Unity
<seb128> so it's a call for the GNOME remix guys
<pitti> oh, that's stuff like google drive only? I thought it also does the "chat accounts" etc. stuff
<pitti> or shotwell picasa
<seb128> we use ubuntu online account for empathy
<seb128> and shotwell
<pitti> I see
<seb128> if we had feature parity we could probably just drop goa
<seb128> but we don't have uoa integration (yet) in eds
<seb128> and it's not supporting skydrive
<seb128> it's another of that hairy situations were ideally GNOME remix would like the upstream variant but would need e.g a second shotwell in the archive built with different flags
<Laney> StÃ©phane raised the idea last night of using session-migration to enable the background plugin again if you've turned desktop icons off
<Laney> is that a good fit for it / sensible thing to do?
<seb128> no
<seb128> GNOME is dropping that code from g-s-d
<Laney> you think it just kicks the pain down the road a bit
<seb128> so before the LTS we will have to deal with it not being available and not being possible to turn back on this way
<marga> RAOF, any chance you are still around?
<ogra_> seb128, hmm, so does gnome then always use nautilus or do they have some new way of drawing backgrounds ?
<seb128> ogra_, gnome-shell is rendering it
<seb128> which makes sense, it's the compositor and the best place to do that
<ogra_> (i still have a WI to start nautilus dynamically, not sure what to do with it in that light)
<seb128> dynamically?
<ogra_> onlys if there is something in ~?Desktop
<ogra_> onlys if there is something in ~/Desktop
<seb128> why?
<ogra_> dunno, it was a WI that came out of our UDS discussion ...
<seb128> on what spec is that?
 * ogra_ will happily drop it, but i thought there was some reason (save resources) for it
<Laney> that'll break background completely as it stands ;-)
<seb128> oh
<seb128> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-r-arm-boot-resume-speedup
<ogra_> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-r-arm-boot-resume-speedup
<ogra_> sorry, took a second
<ogra_> if we have no alternative we should drop it
<seb128> ogra_, yes, please drop it, it's not only that
<ogra_> if we will get one, it should stay but be POSTPONED i guess
<seb128> ogra_, I was not at the session but the idea is buggy
<ogra_> hmm, i thought the idea came from eitrher you or didier
<seb128> ogra_, nautilus also provide the ability to right click on the background to create a folder/document/change your wallpaper
<seb128> which lot of users want
<ogra_> yep, doesnt help much on a touchscreen unless you emulate right clicks
<seb128> right
<ogra_> that spec was in full focus of the tablet setup
<seb128> but our image is not touch specific
<ogra_> yeah
<seb128> I would drop it
<ogra_> ok, i will
<seb128> we need something to render the background
<seb128> ideally that will be unity
<seb128> but we are not there yet
<seb128> ogra_, danke
<seb128> urg, impressive
<seb128> click on the "test" play sound of a bluetooth device sent me to a vt with a kernel backtrace from the bluetooth stack
<seb128> I though it had taken my machine down at first :p
<seb128> but going back to the xorg vt worked, seems like I just have no sound/bt after that
<seb128> "fun"
<janimo> didrocks, hi, do you know what protobufs are used for in compiz?
<janimo> didrocks, nvm found an old mail with the rationale
<didrocks> janimo: it's used in libcompizconfig FYI (in addition to the rationale) ;)
<janimo> I was just surprised to see that lib in a default install :)
<janimo> it's probably worth it is they found it improved startup time but it's just weird to have compiz stand out in the way it handles various metadata
<janimo> maybe the rest of the desktop apps could benefit from pb based storage then :)
<didrocks> janimo: yeah, agreed, it's a runtime option though, but not sure if it worths
<didrocks> removing it
<janimo> didrocks, I just noticed it being there with ~600Kb of Pss used by a single process
<janimo> so was curious to see what's it about
<cyphermox> good morning!
<Laney> bonjour cyphermox!
<Laney> wie gehts?
<cyphermox> sehr gut
<cyphermox> et toi?
<Laney> Estoy bien, gracias. Luchando con sessioninstaller, pero ganar.
<Laney> Sain uutta musiikkia, joten se ei ole lainkaan huono.
<seb128> did one of you try english? ;-)
<cyphermox> seb128: come on, all of that was understandable ;)
<Laney> me no speaky good
<Laney> probably better than google translate does to Spanish and Finnish though :P
<cyphermox> hahah
<Laney> lunch (pancakes) time :D
<popey> ooh
 * popey squeezes a lemon
<dobey> xnox: i have this one http://ark.intel.com/products/59044/Intel-Desktop-Board-DQ77MK
<xnox> dobey: nice =)
<dobey> xnox: only problem is this one: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1021924
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1021924 in linux (Ubuntu Raring) "Multiple Displays not working on Core i7 3770S + Intel DQ77MK motherboard" [Medium,Confirmed]
<dobey> xnox: kernel bug; so any ivybridge board you get might have the issue :-/
<xnox> *sigh*
 * xnox has sandy bridge laptop with nice dual-screens and it works just fine.
<ogra_> i doubt the ccurrent boards differ massively ...
<ogra_> for my new desktop i built last year i actually looked that it fits the case and can take as much ram and peripherials as possible
<xnox> ogra_: well my laptop didn't get neither secure boot nor matrix storage.
<ogra_> well, i havent used intel laptops in the last 3 years :)
<ogra_> cant say much about them
<ogra_> i personally dont see any advantage in having secure boot
<ogra_> (apart from giving colin a had in testing)
<ogra_> *hand
<didrocks> Sweetshark, qengho, chrisccoulson, Laney, jasoncwarner, kenvandine, mlankhorst, cyphermox, mterry, robru, tkamppeter, attente: team meeting in 5 minutes!
<cyphermox> o/
<Laney> didrocks the meeting maestro again?
<didrocks> yeah :-)
<didrocks> Laney: I even didn't forget you!
<didrocks> feeling lucky? ;)
<seb128> Laney, (yeah, I found a way to slack more ;-)
<kenvandine> damn, how did meeting time sneak up so fast!
<Sweetshark> \o
<Sweetshark> oh, wait: that should have been o/
<didrocks> Sweetshark, qengho, chrisccoulson, Laney, jasoncwarner, kenvandine, mlankhorst, cyphermox, mterry, robru, tkamppeter, attente: meeting time!
<didrocks> hey guys, how is it going?
<mterry> w00
<didrocks> what enthousiasm! I guess you are all working hard on the nexus 7 optimizations ;-)
<qengho> YAY!
<didrocks> let's do a quick round of updates
 * mlankhorst throws a kernel at didrocks 
<didrocks> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-12-11
<didrocks> mlankhorst: ouch!
<didrocks> Sweetshark: welcome back! had nice vacations?
<mlankhorst> it's just bits!
 * Sweetshark still kills a 4300 msg inbox backlog and tries to complete the 3.5.7 LTS and 4.0 uploads.
<Sweetshark> didrocks: yeah. no broken bones.
<mlankhorst> I mean it's only 5 floppies at most
<didrocks> Sweetshark: achievement! and good luck with the new libroffice uploads :)
<didrocks> qengho: hey!
<Sweetshark> didrocks: not much else to report therefore unfortunately.
<qengho> yo.
<qengho> [desktop-r-chromiumbrowser-improvements]
<qengho> - Getting beta PPA building with automatic updates from #webapps' branch.
<qengho> - Getting ARM machine building armhf packages. Bisecting SEGV problem and stealing Debian packaging ideas.
<qengho> Happily up to date with important stable releases.
<qengho> EOF
<didrocks> qengho: did you see my email webapps and chromium?
<qengho> didrocks: about the extension?
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> qengho: do you mind answering to Will about it, if feasable?
<qengho> didrocks: I will.  I thought I already made it Recommends in R.  I'll verify.
<didrocks> qengho: thanks! please just answer as such if done already :-)
<didrocks> thanks qengho
<hggdh> do we have a target for steam bugs? For example, bug 1111668 (it is not failing within Ubuntu code, but in Steam's version of libc/pthread)
<didrocks> hggdh: sorry, team meeting, we can have a round of question in the end
<didrocks> hey Laney
<Laney> you skipped chrisccoulson ;-)
<Laney> however:
<Laney> - Uploaded language-selector and all fonts for 'correct' (hopefully) CJK defaults wrt. fontconfig
<Laney> - Updated glib to 2.35.7
<Laney> - Dropped gnome-media from the default install (boo hoo)
<Laney> - Improved the maliit packaging based on feedback from upstream (is Qt5 all in now so that we can enable the Nemo keyboard?)
<Laney> - Looked at (packaged) webkkit 1.11 series & stopped looking at it due to many confusingly dropped symbols that I don't want to investigate right now
<didrocks> Laney: he took his afternoon off, so it was intended :)
<Laney> - Ported sessioninstaller to gst 1.0 (waiting review) + Only gst 1.0 thing (besides bluez-gstreamer) on the CD now is pidgin (libpurple0 for tp-haze)
<Laney> oho
<didrocks> Qt5 is not yet all in
<didrocks> working hard on that with Mirv :)
<Laney> good stuff
<Laney> it seems to be many many source packages ;-)
<didrocks> nice work Laney
<didrocks> yeah, a little bit more to come :-)
<didrocks> with license-party :p
<didrocks> ok, now your turn kenvandine
<kenvandine> * Worked on the signon-ui Qt5 port
<kenvandine> * Landed the new friends-service written in vala to replace the long running python process
<kenvandine> * Found the dee memory leak which mhr3 fixed
<kenvandine> * Fixed variant handing in account-console
<kenvandine>  /EOF
<didrocks> nice work on friends and memory consumption reduction!
<kenvandine> we'll be landing that in raring this week for sure :)
<didrocks> sweet :-)
<kenvandine> it's ready now :)
<didrocks> daily release then? ;)
<kenvandine> yup!
<didrocks> \o/
<didrocks> do not hesitate if you need any help
<didrocks> to setup that
<kenvandine> certainly
<didrocks> thanks kenvandine
<didrocks> mlankhorst: so stop throwing kernels at me and file your report! :-)
<mlankhorst> but what if I'm the one baking those kernels
<didrocks> ;)
<didrocks> mlankhorst: anything else worthy to note this week? ;)
<mlankhorst> mesa 9.1 packaging
<mlankhorst> mesa 9.0.2 sru
<mlankhorst> and debugging xorg-server for lts
<mlankhorst> and some upstream work
<didrocks> great!
<didrocks> thanks mlankhorst
<mlankhorst> np
<didrocks> hey cyphermox, long time no see!
<cyphermox> hey!
<cyphermox> yeah, I can't wait to see your face.
<cyphermox> - Hacking at dbus-test-runner to try and make it behave in buildds.
<cyphermox> - PPPoE/dnsmasq work
<cyphermox> - Looking at NetworkManager memory usage to see if we can reduce that to some degree with some simple changes.
<cyphermox> - Baby-sitting indicators, as usual.
<cyphermox> \x00
<didrocks> \o/ for your dbus-test-runner patch
<didrocks> you will make infinity happy ;)
<cyphermox> well, hopefully it will work
<didrocks> cyphermox: you don't only babysit indicators, but as well oif and all the misc tests packages, that's a lot! :)
<didrocks> thanks cyphermox
<didrocks> mterry: hey! how is it going?
<mterry> - MIR reviews
<mterry> - Added a Qt5 version of liblightdm-qt
<mterry> - Various bug/autolanding work
<mterry> - Survived Nemo
<mterry> EOF
<mterry> good!  in answer to your actual question  :)
<didrocks> (less than one second to paste, we can see mterry is in the starting block) ;)
<cyphermox> hehe
<didrocks> thanks mterry
<didrocks> hey robru
<didrocks> awaken? :)
<kenvandine> mterry, glad you survived!
<kenvandine> :-D
<mterry> :)
<didrocks> I think robru is may be still sleeping, he finished up late as I was discussing with him in my morning, let's skip him
<didrocks> tkamppeter: hey
<didrocks> ok, so I guess it's your turn attente :)
<attente> awesome :)
<jbicha> (I'm totally not used to winter storms having names, I thought mterry was referring to the movie or the file browser)
<attente> patched chromium to get the menu bar working
<attente> fixed the module to correct shotwell's menu bar
<attente> looked at eclipse's menu bar, blacklisting it appears unavoidable
<attente> also currently looking into F10 bug (same as lp:689178)
<attente> EOF
<didrocks> jbicha: I took me one minute as well :)
<didrocks> jbicha: mterry is more robust than the power supply in our QA datacenter it seems :)
<mterry> jbicha, :)  Weather Channel got excited about naming things
<didrocks> attente: \o/ for menubar in chromium :)
<didrocks> oh, the F10 bug! awesome :)
<didrocks> long standing bug, a lot of people will like to get a fix
<didrocks> thanks attente
<attente> :)
<didrocks> ok, I think I'm the one keeping the meeting going, so my report:
<didrocks> Still more and more issues with UTAH failing daily builds. Working with QA and gema to get those addressed timely. Thanks to jibel, we may *just* found why today 100% of the runs are unfortunately failing (cobbler reprovisionning)
<didrocks> Hope then to do the HUD, then libcolumbus transitions with cyphermox.
<didrocks> Finally, Qt5 dance as already explained to get everything in the archive. A lot of reviewing
<didrocks> ..
<cyphermox> oh, speaking of libcolumbus
<didrocks> Any standing questions?
<didrocks> yeah cyphermox? ;)
<cyphermox> mterry: did you review both MIRs?
<cyphermox> we still need to land libcolumbus but then we should be okay I guess
<mterry> cyphermox, libcolumbus yeah.  I believe I commented, but it hadn't landed yet
<mterry> And I updated the python packaging name to match policy
 * didrocks refreshes the qtchooser MIR page
<mterry> didrocks, that too  :)
<didrocks> waow, after a refreshed, it's passing from New to Fix Released
<didrocks> impressive :)
<didrocks> thanks mterry!
<didrocks> mterry: to answer your question: yeah, we worked with debian on that
<didrocks> and thanks for the additional fix :)
<Laney> is all of the ubuntu components and sdk stack landing with this?
<Laney> everything from the mobile tutorial thingy
<didrocks> Laney: once Qt5 is in, yeah
<didrocks> but let's get the remaining Qt5 components first
<Laney> nice
<didrocks> taking a little bit more work than expected :)
<Laney> :P
<didrocks> ok, any other questions?
<Laney> if you need some packaging help or whatever i can spare some cycles
<didrocks> Laney: it's more reviewing/fixing, but yeah, I could definitively have some help there ;)
<didrocks> will keep that in mind and will bother you tomorrow!
<tkamppeter> didrocks, hi
<Laney> yeah question - has anyone looked at jibel's matrix thingy? http://people.canonical.com/~j-lallement/N7/memusage/pagemap/
<didrocks> hey tkamppeter, just in time :)
<tkamppeter> - Made printer driver auto-download out of the GNOME printer setup tool actually working, fixing a problem that nowadays full 40-character key fingerprints are needed to identify signature keys and not any more the 8-character key IDs (bug 1116503).
<tkamppeter> - Worked on automatic setup of IPP (Everywhere) printers via cups-browsed.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1116503 in aptdaemon (Ubuntu) "Problems installing package signature from Python script" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1116503
<didrocks> Laney: yeah, it's awesome, seb128 and jibel discussed about it, I think it will be useful for our sprint
<Laney> wondering for some hints on how to interpret it ;-)
<didrocks> thanks tkamppeter
<Laney> maybe do that next week instead
<didrocks> Laney: right, I'll give you work with Qt5, don't worry being workless ;)
<Laney> hrhr
<didrocks> ok, time to wrap the meeting, thanks a lot everyone :)
 * hggdh still has a question...
<hggdh> do we have a target for steam bugs? For example, bug 1111668 (it is not failing within Ubuntu code, but in Steam's version of libc/pthread)
<didrocks> hggdh: I think this kind of question is more for #ubuntu-devel, not really desktopish as a crash
<didrocks> hggdh: but bryce is following the Steam upstream AFAIK
<didrocks> hggdh: so maybe ask to him when he's around?
<Laney> or email
<Laney> also you might want to unprivate it if you're going to bring it up in public ;-)
<hggdh> didrocks: OK, will do, thanks (and yes, I considered steam as desktop... ;-)
<ogra_> there is also #ubuntu-steam
<didrocks> ogra_: how waow, yet-another-channel?
<ogra_> not sure if there are many devs in there though ... or any valve people
<didrocks> nice hint, thanks ogra_!
<ogra_> didrocks, dont look at me :) i'm only guest there
<didrocks> heh
<ogra_> dunno who owns it, probably bryce
<hggdh> ogra_: thanks, will go there
<dobey> xnox: well, if you build a similar machine, maybe we can get that bug fixed :)
<xnox> heh
<dobey> ok, need lunch badly
<Laney> glatzor: many thanks for the sessioninstaller merge!
<Laney> very fast
 * didrocks waves good evening
<glatzor> Laney, thanks for the patch
<Laney> is there a packaging branch?
<Laney> nm, lp:~aptdaemon-developers/sessioninstaller/ubuntu-quantal
<bryce> ogra_, yeah I registered it
<ogra_> bryce, can you help hggdh ?
<bryce> hggdh, we've been directing people to file bugs about steam or steam products on valve's github account (see faq in our wiki for info to include in reports)
<bryce> hggdh, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Valve#Problems.3F
<attente> qengho: hey
<qengho> attente: hi hi.
<attente> qengho: do you have any time to look at this MP?
<attente> https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/chromium-browser/chromium-browser/+merge/147395
<qengho> attente: Already did, but haven't given it enough thought.
<qengho> attente: I don't really understand what's wrong that it fixes, yet.
<attente> qengho: true, it isn't broken as is, but it's the only way to export its menus properly when the unity-gtk-module is installed, short of a proper GMenuModel implementation
<qengho> attente: so this is for Q+?
<qengho> attente: Is the Right Way dependent on anything other than time?
<attente> qengho: the Right Way just needs someone (presumably me) to fix the hack upstream
<attente> qengho: this shouldn't need backporting unless we end up using the unity-gtk-module on Q-
<qengho> attente: so it's R and later only?
<attente> qengho: it should be
<qengho> attente: that feels better.  I'll apply it soon.
<attente> qengho: thanks
<hggdh_> bryce: thank you, will redirect them
<bryce> hggdh_, thanks
<RAOF> marga: I am now.
<TheMuso> Yay for timezones.
<RAOF> Indeedy
<marga> RAOF: hey there
<marga> desrt told me to ping you about a very difficult bug to trace
<marga> one mom, I'll give you bug number and also a summarized desc
<marga> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-power-manager/+bug/998735
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 998735 in gnome-power-manager (Ubuntu) "Light blue screen on primary monitor when waking up from inactivity" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<marga> Also reported to linux mint: https://bugs.launchpad.net/linuxmint/+bug/1005545
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1005545 in Linux Mint "cinnamon unlock problem when screen power off" [Undecided,New]
<marga> This bug appears in both gnome and cinnamon, when using 2 screens.
<marga> It doesn't need to be two monitors, it can be monitor and laptop.  It happens regardless of the card (nvidia, intel, different models)
<marga> It also happens regardless of the screensaver (gnome-screensaver, xscreensaver)
<TheMuso> /c~/c
<marga> The summarized description is: when using two monitors and the screen is locked, any pop-up will cause the left screen to go blue.
<marga> I'm pretty sure that this is because something is not applying the correct offset, since when the screens don't have the same sizes, the blue square appears of the size of the right screen.
<marga> As I said, this happens with Gnome and Cinnamon, but not with Unity, although I'm almost certain that it did happen with Unity in the past.
<marga> Also, it's not unity as a whole, but compiz.  Replacing the cinnamon wm by compiz causes the issue to go away (although you end up with a messy desktop)
<marga> I've been investigating this for months, and got to this long diagnostics, but I still don't know which source code I need to look at in order to fix this.
<marga> RAOF: well, I guess you went away :-/
<marga> RAOF: I need to go to sleep now, but if you have any tips that you could give me, please let me know.
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-02-13
<pitti> Good morning
<Mirv> morning
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> hey didrocks
<didrocks> good morning pitti, how are you?
<pitti> didrocks: splendid, thanks! yourself?
<didrocks> pitti: I'm ok. Hoping that one day UTAH can successfully provides an image. 100% of failure since last Thursday (not counting Monday due to the snow storm and datacenter down)
<didrocks> so blocking all daily releasesâ¦
<pitti> :(
<kenvandine> good morning didrocks
<didrocks> kenvandine: goodâ¦ evening? still awaken, what are you doing dude? :-)
<robru> didrocks, I think ken is channelling my insomnia tonight ;-)
<didrocks> robru: I think we shouldn't pair both of you thinking about it ;-)
<kenvandine> couldn't sleep until i knew the friends tests passed on armhf again
<didrocks> kenvandine: ahah, and it's ok now? :)
<kenvandine> all good now... i should sleep :)
<robru> kenvandine, but those were fixed two hours ago ;-)
<kenvandine> yeah yeah...
<didrocks> kenvandine: hope you didn't add all your sleep() in the tests and none is left for you!
<kenvandine> hehe
<robru> didrocks, lol
<didrocks> guys, it's 8am here now, I've already starting working one hour ago, I expect normally just to see a pitti around :-)
<robru> didrocks, but if I signed off at a normal time, I would never get to talk to you!
<didrocks> robru: heh, indeed :-) btw, what time the team meeting is for you? We can maybe move it so that you can attend
<robru> didrocks, it is at 8:30 AM for me usually... it is quite early for me, I normally wake up at 11AM ;-)
<kenvandine> well i am going to stop hacking and get some sleep... i'll be back in a few hours :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: enjoy!
<robru> kenvandine, gnight
<didrocks> robru: well, basically, it's a cause-consequence of signing off late :-)
<robru> didrocks, yeah, it's true... but I do my best work from 6PM to 2AM ;-)
<didrocks> robru: coders being active at night, rings a bell to me :-)
<didrocks> only doing that on my pet projects on week-end though ;)
<dpm> good morning desktop people
<didrocks> hey dpm, how are you?
<pitti> hey dpm, how are you?
<dpm> hey didrocks, pitti, very well, slowly waking up, and how are you guys?
<pitti> dpm: very well, thanks
<didrocks> dpm: I'm ok, thanks :)
<dpm> super :)
<didrocks> dpm: FYI, we have already a lot of Qt5 components in raring, Mirv is finishing up qtwebkit and then will go on qtcreator. This will enable us to have the sdk then in the distro :)
<pitti> dpm: do you know when we'll get raring langpack exports?
<dpm> didrocks, yeah, that's pretty awesome
<dpm> pitti, unfortunately I haven't had time to look into that, I've spent nearly no time on translations this cycle :/. I need to set the export times and request the cron job to be changed in Launchpad. But it's been too long without langpacks, I'll do it this evening.
<pitti> dpm: ah, cheers
<marga> RAOF, ping?
<RAOF> marga: Yo!
<chrisccoulson> good morning
<RAOF> marga: So, I've read your bug. I'd guess it's an interaction between gdm & mutter; lock screen & screensaver responsibilities have been getting rejigged.
<seb128> hey desktopers
<RAOF> marga: Another option might be to apitrace mutter; that should at least tell you what mutter *thinks* it's drawing.
<marga> all my tests were with lightdm
<marga> I didn't even think of testing with gdm...
<RAOF> That's probably your problem; gnome-shell no longer handles the screen lock, IIRC.
<RAOF> Or something like that.
 * RAOF â dinner
<marga> ok, then I can test this with gdm
<seb128> marga, hey, what's the issue?
<marga> Assuming it doesn't fail with gdm and fails with lightdm, how should I proceed?
<marga> seb128, blue screen on the left screen when using two screens, and a pop up happens during a screen lock
<seb128> under gnome-shell? is the right screen locked correctly?
<seb128> what ubuntu serie? precise?
<marga> reproducible in gnome and cinnamon, but not unity, regardless of the screensaver (gnome and x)
<marga> precise, yes
<seb128> gdm doesn't do screen locking yet in that serie
<BigWhale> Good morning everyone.
<seb128> seems like a gnome-shell/mutter issue to me
<seb128> marga, similar to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1061787 (https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-slOE3M9ABEA/UGyt0TmoHlI/AAAAAAAADwU/QaqxfZjplzM/s800/photo.JPG)?
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1061787 in Ubuntu "Dual Monitor Lock Screen Dialog Hidden" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<marga> OH, I had pasted some bugs
<marga> but yes, it's that bug
<marga> also, graphics card doesn't matter, intel, nvidia, different models, reproducible any time you have 2 screens.
<marga> I'm guessing this is probably reported like 10 times on different packages, because nobody knows which is the right package.
<marga> Now, I will test this with gdm, I'll be away a few minutes
<seb128> marga, ok
<seb128> marga, could be the same as https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=662757
<ubot2> Gnome bug 662757 in general "Gnome-Shell lock screen does not always display password prompt" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<marga> Ok, I've tested it with gdm, and the issue is still there.  Even worse, the parent window of the popup appears on top of the blue
<marga> seb128, I think it's something related to mutter/clutter, but that's something that's quite different between gnome and cinnamon.  I wasn't able to find the common factor.
<seb128> marga, yeah, the gdm angle would make sense for >= quantal where the screen locking is done by gdm but you are on precise, I'm not surprised that didn't make a difference
<seb128> marga, cinnamon is quite different but it's a fork of gnome-shell and most of the underlining rendering techs are the same, I doubt they changed rendering in there, they are more interested by UI/worflow changes
<seb128> marga, did you try asking about the issue on #gnome-hackers (mention that you use g-s 3.4.1 if you ask there)
<Laney> hey
<seb128> Laney, hey, how are you?
<Laney> good, had a lot of pancakes last night ;-)
<Laney> you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks ;-)
<marga> seb128, I haven't.  I have been trying to first find which program is the failing one, before asking.
<marga> is that here, or in gnome's irc?
<seb128> marga, it seems pretty likely that the issue is with clutter/mutter/gnome-shell at this point
<seb128> marga, on irc.gnome.org
<marga> ok, will ask there
<seb128> Laney, it seems the uk are pretty big on pancake for that day ... is it call pancake day?
<Laney> yeah, but the formal name is shrove tuesday
<seb128> ok
<seb128> we usually makes fritters here (at least in my corner of France, could be a German thing)
<Laney> it is a tradition i fully support :P
<seb128> didrocks will probably tell us that real France does it differently :p
<Laney> ah, for the same reason though?
<seb128> yes
<Laney> eating rich foods before lent
<seb128> it's just fritters instead of pancakes
 * didrocks backlogs in a sec, after some busy chats :p
<seb128> pancakes are not really a french thing afaik
<seb128> Laney, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shrove_Tuesday
<Laney> yeah you have crepes ;-)
<seb128> they mention it's fat tuesday for us :p
<didrocks> we have also la "chandeleur" for crepes
<seb128> didrocks, do you eat beignets for mardi gras?
<didrocks> seb128: I never eat beignets, waffles/crÃªpes :)
<didrocks> well, not this year, I finished late workingâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, well, is beignets the traditional mardi gras food in paris/lyon?
<didrocks> but normally, it's more those 2 in real part of France :)
<seb128> I'm just wondering if that's a german thing
<didrocks> so waffles/crÃªpes
<seb128> right, what I though
<didrocks> I would say german thing :)
<seb128> \o/
<seb128> marga, not so much luck on #gnome-hackers, it might be a bit early still for europeans and very early or very late for the U.S... let's see maybe somebody will reply in a while
<seb128> marga, I will pick it up and try to get infos if that happens after you left
<marga> Yes, I have no problem waiting.
 * mlankhorst is awake! Oui!
<seb128> mlankhorst, good morning ;-)
<marga> I don't have an irc proxy for gnome, though, so I'll have to disconnect when I leave the office.
<mlankhorst> morning
<marga> I hope I get some reply before that.
<mlankhorst> but seriously if I'm awake for about an hour or 2 now it can't be early for europeans
<mlankhorst> :P
<seb128> marga, where are you based?
<marga> As I said, I've been chasing this for months, so it's not terrible to wait for other people to come online
<marga> seb128, Munich
<seb128> marga, seems already tz wise to still be around for some time ;-)
<seb128> already->alright
 * seb128 needs coffee
<jibel> seb128, the leak in g-s-d, bug 1123930
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1123930 in gnome-settings-daemon (Ubuntu) "memleak in plugins/orientation/gsd-orientation-manager.c" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1123930
<seb128> jibel, thanks a lot for tracking it down
<seb128> why am I not surprised, yet another bug coming from a distro patch
<marga> :-/
<seb128> Sweetshark, well done on getting libreoffice4 uploaded
<seb128> Sweetshark, seems to depwait on libmspub-dev ... did you open a MIR for that lib, I didn't find one
<seb128> Sweetshark, same for libcdr and libvisio
<seb128> Laney, sessioninstaller on new techs \o/
<Laney> \o/ indeed
<Laney> it's still python 2 though
<seb128> is there any port blocker? or just nobody got to it yet?
<Laney> xapian i think
<seb128> of course, xapian, what else...
<Laney> barry was looking into it I believe but came up against that
<Laney> don't hold your breath
<seb128> dpm, hey, can you approve https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/raring/+source/gnome-control-center-unity/+imports ?
<dpm> hey seb128, done
<seb128> dpm, thanks ;-)
<seb128> Laney, cool, the guy already replied with a postive comment on the gst SRU
<seb128> Laney, I guess you can tag it and upload yours ;-)
<Laney> good stuff
<Sweetshark> seb128: bug 1124074, bug 1124082 and bug 1124092. dammit, I thought I did that along with the sync requests.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1124074 in libcdr (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libcdr" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1124074
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1124082 in libmspub (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libmspub" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1124082
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1124092 in libvisio (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libvisio" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1124092
<rvgate> How come my unity-2d session still has animations when switching windows and workspaces? :/ i thought that wasnt available on unity-2d
<seb128> dpm, do you have any magic to wave https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/raring/+source/gnome-control-center-unity/+imports those in?
<seb128> dpm, I reuploade the g-c-c .po files updated to restore existing translations under the new domain by uploading a tarball with the .pot and the .po set
<seb128> dpm, but stupid launchpad decided to put them on hold for review
<seb128> dpm, I can't be bothered to go through 120 pages to just pick a domain and click approve though ;-)
<seb128> well, and to be fair it's all mterry's fault, he's clearly a non-american-speakers hater
 * mterry clearly signed on too early
<mterry> seb128, is this the dh-translations fix?  thanks for that
<seb128> mterry, hey! ;-)
 * ogra_ notes down "mterry ar fault"
<seb128> mterry, part of, I imported the g-c-c .po stack in rosetta after a make update-po in g-c-c-unity to recover translations
<ogra_> *at
<seb128> mterry, but stupid launchpad wants those to be manually valided before being important, I was checking with dpm if he has magic for that
<seb128> mterry, I don't want to click-click-click through 100 import pages
<mterry> seb128, how come part of the translations were coming through?
<seb128> mterry, oh, thanks for pointing it out
<seb128> mterry, I guess there is a code bug and it's loading those from the g-c-c domain
<seb128> mterry, we need to fix the code to use g-c-c-unity
<mterry> seb128, heyo, when you make changes to an autolanding trunk, you don't need to modify debian/changelog.
<mterry> seb128, do you mind dropping that bit, and I can approve?
<seb128> mterry, I was not sure if it was autolanding, changelog version is not having a daily*
<mterry> seb128, it should be...  didrocks, g-c-c-unity is autolanding now right?
<GunnarHj> pitti: ping?
<seb128> mterry, he said it is, I pinged after sending the mr though
<pitti> hey GunnarHj, how are you?
<GunnarHj> pitti: I'm fine, thanks. Hope you are as well.
<seb128> mterry, you want me to drop the changelog part then?
<GunnarHj> pitti: Is the fix of bug 37707 safe enough for a Precise SRU?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 37707 in language-selector (Ubuntu) "language-selector should not uninstall packages without a warning (allow opt-out)" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/37707
<seb128> mterry, I will fix the gettext domain stuff as well ... want it in the same MR?
<mterry> seb128, please drop the changelog part, yeah.  Sure, throw it in there
<seb128> in fact ignore that
<seb128> I don't see what's wrong
<pitti> GunnarHj: yes, I think it is; adding a precise task
<seb128> I though it was because your trunk was missing a config.h to define PACKAGE
<seb128> since configure.ac:GETTEXT_PACKAGE="$PACKAGE"
<seb128> but from a build tree that's ok
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok, thanks, then I'll add it to an already existing Precise branch.
<dpm> hey seb128, let me have a look
<seb128> dpm, thanks
<seb128> mterry, ok, pushed without the changelog diff
<mterry> seb128, just approved!
<seb128> mterry, thanks ;-)
<seb128> mterry, strace shows it's trying to open the gnome-control-center-unity.mo, I'm not sure why it's working, it seems to try both domains ... I will try again once I've a .mo for the new domain
<mterry> seb128, wait...  new domain?  gnome-control-center-unity isn't the right one?
<seb128> mterry, but afaik translations should be ok with the next langpack update
<dpm> seb128, mterry, only the .pot file needs to be approved, and once that happens then the PO files get auto-imported. I see that the .pot file I approved earlier on has already been imported, so the .po files should shortly follow
<seb128> mterry, it is, but the .pot was blocked in import queue so we don't have a g-c-c-unity in the langpacks atm
<mterry> k
<dpm> is this a package coming from the upstream g-c-c?
<mterry> dpm, no, this is from Canonical PS
<seb128> dpm, the .po from where?
<seb128> dpm, mterry: I hacked around ..
<seb128> dpm, short summary is
<seb128> - we move code from g-c-c (upstream) to g-c-c-unity
<seb128> I did
<seb128> - cp g-c-c/po/*.po g-c-c-unity/po
<seb128> cd g-c-c-unity/po
<seb128> intltool-update --pot
<seb128> make update-po
<seb128> for i in *.po; do msgattrib --no-obsolete $i -o $i; done
<seb128> tar czf that up
<tjaalton> there's something that blocks lightdm-greeter from appearing for ~25s here, anyone having the same?
<tjaalton> on current raring
<seb128> uploaded to https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/raring/+source/gnome-control-center-unity/+pots/gnome-control-center-unity/+upload
<seb128> dpm, ^
<seb128> dpm, the goal was to restore the translations from the g-c-c domain
<dpm> seb128, ok, so the translations are a mixture from upstream and Ubuntu-specific strings. Then for the other question: did you add the .pot file in that tarball you updated?
<seb128> dpm, I did
<dpm> ok, in that case those PO files should get imported automatically
<seb128> they don't
<seb128> I have to go through and pick the domain in the combo and do ack
<seb128> I did for some 15 translations
<seb128> see https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/raring/+source/gnome-control-center-unity/+pots/gnome-control-center-unity/
<dpm> seb128, it usually takes a while for them to get imported automatically after the template has been approved, especially if the imports queue is full. Your manually-approved translations are probably marked as Approved but not Imported. Let me double-check
<seb128> dpm, they are imported, see the page I pointed
<seb128> dpm, anyway if that sorts out over time great
<dpm> seb128, yeah, let's check in a couple of hours to see if they eventually got imported, and if not, let me think how we can get them imported without breaking our fingers clicking on the web UI
<Laney> you can likely use the API to do that
<seb128> dpm, well, middle click/import on ~90 url is like 10 min work, so not worth too much thinking
<seb128> 10min at max
<seb128> likely 5
<Laney> transition_import_queue_entry.setStatus
<seb128> e.g less time than writing a script
<marga> but really annoying
<marga> Should I insist on gnome-hackers?
<tjaalton> hm, authenticating the lightdm session is what takes ~25s
<ogra_> tjaalton, surely because of the complex finnish usernames :)
<chrisccoulson> i wonder where this build of glib comes from? https://crash-stats.mozilla.com/report/index/712274b4-f009-4ae7-9a9c-4c7fc2130212
<tjaalton> ogra_: it's the 'lightdm' uid :)
<tjaalton> once it's authenticated, greeter starts
<ogra_> wow
<ogra_> thats ecil
<ogra_> *evil
<tjaalton> yeah, my laptop isn't affected
<didrocks> mterry: seb128: it's as you wish, you can keep the changelog or just attach a bug to the MP
<Laney> or set the commit message on it
<Laney> IIUC
<didrocks> mterry: seb128: if the bug # was referenced with your name somewhere in the changelog, this bug won't be duplicated in it
<didrocks> mterry: seb128: the only thing to ensure is that you leave it UNRELEASED ;)
 * mterry likes consistency of auto-changelogging
<didrocks> sure, just explaining that it's smart and that I have an automated test for that :p
<qengho> /usr/bin/ld.gold.real: fatal error: out/Release/chrome: mmap: failed to allocate 1596311736 bytes for output file: Cannot allocate memory
 * qengho hugs this project.
<ogra_> 1596311736 bytes ?
<ogra_> they should have printed it in bits  :P
<qengho> Scientific notation.  1.5e9 or something.
<didrocks> qengho: hey!
<didrocks> qengho: it seems you didn't answer to Will yet (and I checked chromium, there is not plugin recommends ;))
<didrocks> just a kind reminder ;)
<qengho> didrocks: will do.
<didrocks> thanks
<seb128> mterry, not sure if you saw but Sweetshark filed some MIRs for libreoffice4 ... review this week, if you can, would be really nice ;-)
<seb128> mterry, I'm sure you efforts will be welcomed with some free beers next week ;-)
<mterry> seb128, in the middle of 'em now
<ogra_> oh, WOW !
<ogra_> i left my nexus7 idling over the last two days
<ogra_> seems gnome-settings-daemon accumulated 146M RES
<ogra_> jani should better upload that fix soon :)
<didrocks> qengho: thanks!
<mterry> Sweetshark, was libmspub in libreoffice source before, or is that actually new functionality?
<mterry> seems to be new
<Sweetshark> mterry: mspub is a feature of LO4. libcdr and libvisio are old.
<mterry> Sweetshark, cool.  I guessed as much.  I commented on all 3 MIRs
<Sweetshark> mterry: thanks for the comments. I will try to dig out what is going on with the fortify stuff there.
<mterry> Sweetshark, it's possible it's just false positives.  http://lintian.debian.org/tags/hardening-no-fortify-functions.html  gives several reasons for the tag
<Sweetshark> mterry: do you know the gcc flag that needs to be passed on by chance?
<seb128> Sweetshark, -fstack-protector I think
<seb128> Sweetshark, -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE as well
<seb128> Sweetshark, see /usr/share/doc/hardening-wrapper/README.Debian
<mterry> Yeah, what seb128 said
<Laney> if you use compat 9 with dh you get them set automatically
<Sweetshark> mterry: btw I like the moral hazard you create for me to break debian policies and ship with an internal version once, so that I can skip the security review. :->
<Sweetshark> .oO( OTOH I wonder when the initial security review to have LibreOffice in main was dont and how much it is stuff relevant for the current codebase ... )
<Sweetshark> s/stuff/still/
<mterry> Sweetshark, :)
<mterry> Sweetshark, I know.  The whole MIR thing as a one-time check is a tad fragile.
<mterry> Sweetshark, one could push a new trivial one-line script into main, then blow it up to an office suite with little oversight
<Sweetshark> mterry: well, I guess it works decently for a for most other stuff, but the libreoffice source package is essentially a distro on its own (on other platforms it certainly is).
 * didrocks waves good evening
<seb128> Sweetshark, trying to work around the MIR/security guys? ;-)
<jdstrand> you guys realize we are listening, right?
<jdstrand> :P
<seb128> lol
<seb128> Sweetshark, see, you better hide now :p
<sarnold> (I just hope the outcome isn't 'sarnold go audit main/* every six months...)
<ogra_> did you just volunteer ?
<sarnold> nopes.
<ogra_> but it totally sounded like
<sarnold> (I wonder how ogra_ can read my thoughts ...)
<seb128> sarnold, I think you did
<seb128> I'm with ogra there
<ogra_> :)
<seb128> I can sense you wanted to step up, no need to be shy ;-)
<Sweetshark> sarnold, jdstrand: one of you reviews libreoffice, the other one the rest of main. I wonder who gets the better deal out of that.
<sarnold> Sweetshark: lol
<ogra_> jdstrand, that guy deserves a good bonus this year, so much passion for his job !
<jdstrand> haha
 * xnox thought security team's weekly reading is taking all uploaded debdiffs and splitting them up evenly by total lines of code 
<mdeslaur> xnox: we only look at yours
<xnox> (or better pipe it to audio book converter and listen to it as background music)
<xnox> mdeslaur: =)))))
<mdeslaur> :)
 * xnox totally gets that
<mdeslaur> hehe
<TheMuso> mterry: I'd argue that a sufficient number of people watch changes that blowing a script up to an office suite could possibly be caught by someone, even if it was hidden in the changelog.
<mterry> TheMuso, yeah possibly that extreme example.  :)  But in general, incremental changes to software once it's in main do not get security reviewed or sanity reviewed
<TheMuso> Yeah agreed.
<squ1d> Anyone know why using pptp vpn on Ubuntu 12.04 will hang while under higher traffic loads with "pppd[17745]: Protocol-Reject for unsupported protocol...
<squ1d> really really annoying
<squ1d> on Ubuntu 11.04 it stays connected for days
<squ1d> on 12.04 i have to reconnect the vpn every few minutes while using too much internet
<czajkowski> squ1d: #ubuntu will be better to get support
<squ1d> no reponse there yet
<squ1d> thanks
<xnox> did something recently got uploaded that talks to consolekit unconditionaly?
<xnox> e.g. something like g-s-d or dconf?
<xnox> or compiz / metacity?
<xnox> bug 123798
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 123798 in pidgin (Ubuntu) "pidgin crashed with SIGSEGV" [Low,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/123798
<xnox> bug 1123798
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1123798 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "ubiquity-dm crashed with dbus.exceptions.DBusException in call_blocking(): org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.TimedOut: Activation of org.freedesktop.ConsoleKit timed out" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1123798
<xnox> better.
<xnox> cause consolekit was not previously required to start ubiquity-dm mini-session.
<xnox> Laney: ^ ? any ideas?
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-02-14
<robru> Twitter's OAuth implementation is a nightmare
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<didrocks> and again a new UTAH failure of the day :/
<jibel> good morning
<dpm> morning jibel
<jibel> Hey dpm
<didrocks> salut jibel, dpm!
<jibel> salut didrocks
<dpm> morning didrocks
<seb128> hey desktopers
<dpm> morning seb128
<seb128> dpm, hey, how are you?
<dpm> seb128, very well, thanks. And you? I haven't been on the channel for a while, but I guess things are as busy as always ;)
<seb128> dpm, I'm good thanks ... and yeah, always crazy busy ;-)
<dpm> good to hear some things don't change :)
<seb128> indeed ;-)
<Laney> morning
<pitti> bonjour seb128, hello Laney
<seb128> hey Laney, pitti, wie gets?
<pitti> seb128: gut, danke! chasing gnome jhbuild..
<Laney> ein bisschen mÃ¼de, aber gut, danke!
<Laney> es ist sonnig! ;-)
<seb128> Laney, you need coffee ;-)
<seb128> or tea, being british
<Laney> pfft, yeah - tea ;-)
<Laney> I have some here of course
<seb128> Laney, you know a bit of german, or google translator for the win? :p
<Laney> I did german in school
<Laney> but it's very very rusty
<Laney> for some reason I remember the word "abholzung"
<pitti> hah
<Laney> are .typelib files in multiarch paths supposed to work?
<didrocks> Laney: no, see bug #1124941
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1124941 in libappindicator (Ubuntu) "[raring] Python appindicators broken by the latest libappindicator update (12.10.1daily13.02.13-0ubuntu1) with "ERROR:root:Could not find any typelib for AppIndicator3"" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1124941
<Laney> yeah, that ;-)
<didrocks> Laney: do you have time to fix + process the dummy test I described? :)
<didrocks> so that we don't regress ever ever again on that? :p
<seb128> Laney, I might be overlooking something but it seems like it would be an easy g-i patch to look to both the multiarch dir and the normal one
<seb128> even if it's not proper multiarch in the sense of making other arch usable
<seb128> but that would stop those mistakes because packages got multiarched and libdir/libexecdir changes and the typelib end up in there
<seb128> pitti, ^ was that discussed before?
<pitti> seb128: no, not that I can remember
<didrocks> seb128: I would still have my test! :-)
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, sure, tests are good ;-) it's just an annoyance, it complexify the packaging in quite some places since we have to special case the gir- and move stuff back to /usr/lib manually
<didrocks> seb128: agreed :)
<Laney> autopkgtests are better for such package local things?
<didrocks> Laney: right, but autopkgtests are not blocking yet the migration from proposed to the main archive AFAIK
<didrocks> Laney: so, I would first put that as an autopilot test
<didrocks> Laney: I think, as part of the long term goal is to:
<Laney> oh you don't check it in the daily landing stuff
<didrocks> - have autopilot tests modular (not all in the unity package)
<didrocks> - have autopkgtests run as part of the daily landing stuff, and put stuff we can put there (unfortunately, very few for now) into that
<didrocks> Laney: jibel told me it's difficult to run them in that step right now, without the -proposed infra ^
<seb128> Laney, judging by the number of emails in my launchpad bugs inbox, the retracers have been working through the backlog
<Laney> yeah I saw some, good news
<didrocks> Laney: hum, I didn't see an answer, do you think you have the time today to look at this libappindicator, or should we let that to cyphermox?
<Laney> oh whoops, I was fixing it ;-)
<Laney> I don't know about doing autopilot tests but I did the packaging fix
<didrocks> Laney: for autopilot, lp:unity
<didrocks> Laney: tests/autopilot/
<didrocks> Laney: I would add just a file like tests/autopilot/unity/tests/test_indicators.py
<didrocks> doing this test
<didrocks> Laney: sil2100 can make a review if needed
<Laney> ok i'll give it a go
<Laney> thanks
<didrocks> thanks to you Laney :)
<Laney> I'm getting the feeling I shouldn't have run these tests on my machine :P
<didrocks> Laney: well, you can in a guest session, but yeah, otherwise, you bye bye your current session :p
 * Laney is watching it go crazy
<didrocks> Laney: recovering from your session? :)
<Laney> didrocks: heh, managed to get that back
<Laney> figuring out how to run a single test now
<didrocks> Laney: ahah, would be better, isn't it? :)
<Laney> aha
<Laney> didrocks: so something like http://paste.ubuntu.com/1649392/ ?
<didrocks> Laney: sounds perfect to me :)
<didrocks> Laney: bonus point if you do the same for indicate, Dbusmenu-0.4, DbusmenuGtk*
<didrocks> Laney: for those we install by default, at least :)
<Laney> good idea - i'll generalise it a little bit and submit that then
<Laney> Mirv: Hm, you here? I gots two problems with qt; wondering if you're aware â http://paste.ubuntu.com/1650651/
<ricotz> Laney, hi :)
<Laney> o hai
<ricotz> Laney, just a minor question, is the raring package of webkit 1.10.2 likely to build on precise without changes?
<Mirv> Laney: the first one is since qt5-default only suggests installing qt5-qmake and other tools handled by qtchooser. the latter is an upstream user unfriendliness bug, it should display help similar to man qtchooser
<Laney> ricotz: I've built 1.10.0 there before so a good chance
<Mirv> the latter is fixed in upstream git by having a help text, I'm not sure if the error text in the former case is now more user friendly
<ricotz> Laney, ok, thak
<ricotz> Laney, thanks
<Laney> Mirv: so what do I have to build-depend on for qt5-qmake? I thought qt5-default was supposed to be enough
<Mirv> Laney: qtbase5-dev brings with it a good collection of packages
<Mirv> qt5-default is only the default configuration for qtchooser, but does not by itself mandate the installation of development tools in case the user only wants to use eg. qmlscene which is standalone
<Laney> alright, thanks
<ricotz> Laney, here are just some things i noticed http://paste.debian.net/plain/234144
<Laney> probably won't upload for that, but feel free to do an MP against the packaging branch ;-)
<ricotz> Laney, no upload needed, just keep it in mind for the next one
<Laney> I usually look at the diff of configure.ac so don't notice such historical catching-ups - so thanks for that
<ricotz> Laney, yeah, unfortunately they matter much in regards of precise
<ricotz> (especially libsoup2.4 :\ which requires glib 2.34)
<Laney> ah yes, I remember now
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/~laney/+archive/webkit-backports
<ricotz> haha, i knew it
<Laney> so I /did/ know about it
<ricotz> doesnt explain the build failure yet ;)
<Laney> in that PPA?
<ricotz> so there is still something missing in the ppa
<ricotz> yes
<Laney> no, that was deliberate
<Laney> it was testing for a make-dfsg SRU
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/~laney/+archive/webkit-backports-2/+packages
<Laney> it's the previous PPA + -proposed (at the time)
<Laney> if I give that build back now it'll work
<ricotz> alright, i see
<Laney> so just make your PPA depend on webkit-backports if you like :P
<Laney> or copy those pkgs
 * Laney goes to lunchville
<Laney> aka the city centre to buy a valentines card
<ricotz> have fun :)
<didrocks> Laney: I didn't check, but you only added to the import installed by default, right? (as we only roll for now the default image)
<didrocks> Laney: if not, you'll need a followup to just skip the involved tests and  put a comment. I'll try to think how we can run those tests in the future
<Laney> didrocks: I didn't check that explicitly
<didrocks> Laney: do you mind please? :)
 * didrocks is still reviewing qtcreator
<Laney> ok
 * Laney kicked some qt5 builds earlier
<Laney> looks like powerpc is a bit sad
<didrocks> right, Mirv is aware/pinged about it :)
<Laney> i'm sure
<Laney> just wanted to get qt quick, quick!
<Laney> (and now it is done)
<Laney> didrocks: yeah they're all fine
<didrocks> Laney: excellent, thanks :)
<Laney> ah maybe not
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/ubuntu.raring/desktop
<Laney> was looking at /all
<Laney> better remove indicate
<dobey> xnox: hey. did you get a chance to upload the new pyflakes btw?
<xnox> dobey: yes, let me check if it's ready to sync.
<xnox> dobey: syncing
<dobey> xnox: thanks again!
<popey> seb128: i have a friend on 12.10 reporting that when he switches to another user (to do online purchasing / banking I think), when he logs out, there are still some processes left running.. I am not able to reproduce on raring or a 12.10 VM.. have you seen reports of this or what might cause it? GSD perhaps? http://paste.ubuntu.com/1651942/ <- what's left behind.
<Laney> didrocks: can you make the extra revision get merged?
<didrocks> Laney: I don't see a MP, it's better to resubmit a MP I guess ;)
<Laney> if I set it back to needs review?
<Laney> oh ok
<didrocks> Laney: I'm not sure, my old system supported that, not sure the new one does and I don't know the code :)
<Laney> ;-)
<didrocks> thanks Laney!
<seb128> popey, in the current world nothing close everything running in the session, most things just go away because xorg and the dbus session bus go away
<seb128> popey, i
<seb128> popey, it's not a new issue, gvfs, e-d-s etc have had issues with that for years
<didrocks> hey xnox
<didrocks> xnox: do you mind explaining to me this diff on your oneconf MP:
<didrocks> 24-PYTHON3=$(shell py3versions -vr)
<didrocks> 25+PYTHON3=3 $(shell py3versions -vr)
<didrocks> you do add 2 targets for PYTHON3?
<mitya57_> didrocks: probably because scripts need to have python3 shebangs (not python3.x)?
<mitya57_> (pybuild does that magic automatically)
<didrocks> mitya57_: but /usr/bin/env python3.3 work, though, isn't it?
<mitya57_> the goal is to not rebuild tons of python packages when migrating to new interpreter version
<didrocks> mitya57_: ok, got it then ;)
<seb128> mterry, are you familiar with the software-properties testsuit?
<mterry> seb128, no
<seb128> mterry, good answer
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> mterry, in any case I figured it out so it's all good, thanks ;-)
 * mpt crashes update-manager with gay abandon
<mpt> Oh, hi mterry :-)
<mterry> seb128, :)
<mterry> mpt, hi!  I see you posted some sorting changes to the SoftwareUpdates spec?
<mpt> mterry, a design for adding sorting as a feature. No biggie.
<mpt> An ideal task for dylanmccall, I think :-)
<seb128> mterry, btw I need to talk to you about update-manager next week
<seb128> mterry, the ui is buggy
<mterry> seb128, :(
<seb128> mterry, I tend to right click, deselect all, and pick an update when I want to do a specific binary update
<seb128> mterry, but most of the entries in the main list are non clickable
<mterry> seb128, Hmm.  OK, I can look at that
<seb128> it's also weird to have lot of stuff listed in the main list and then another bunch under the ubuntu logo at the bottom
<seb128> what's the difference between both?
<mterry> seb128, Ubuntu core is everything that the seeds depend on (i.e. what's on the CD)
<mterry> seb128, except for apps (things with .desktop files) which show at the top
<mpt> seb128, the detailed definition is at <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareUpdates#expanded> -- "The base package is..."
<mterry> er, what's on the DVD I guess :)
<seb128> mpt, thanks
<mpt> Any recursive dependency of ubuntu-desktop (or equivalent), ubuntu-standard, or ubuntu-minimal
<mpt> dependency/recommendation
<seb128> mpt, mterry: http://ubuntuone.com/1VNdHCnGPqxj3AfhcXx1qy
<seb128> mterry, mpt: it's weird to have "Tools for debuging application menus" in the main list
<mterry> seb128, you installed it manually (directly or indirectly) right?
<seb128> I guess so
<mterry> seb128, the thought is that you care about it then
<seb128> it's a debug tool
<seb128> I can about it less than the core OS
<mterry> seb128, :)
<seb128> and the core OS seems like second class citizen in the list compared to it
<mterry> seb128, I'm not wedded to the current layout.  But this is mpt territory
<seb128> mterry, mpt: thanks, at least I understand the logic, still seems weird that this debug package I don't care much about (it just happens to be installed) is listed before the default Ubuntu components
<seb128> and on a more "main" level
<seb128> I guess non-dev users have less of those dev packages and just core OS and apps
<mpt> We could have a branch for development packages, I guess.
<mpt> So that they're grouped together in the same way as base packages.
<seb128> mpt, yeah, that could be nice
 * didrocks waves good evening
<mpt> seb128, reported bug 1125443
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1125443 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "Development packages are ordered above "Ubuntu base" packages" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1125443
<seb128> mpt, thanks
<seb128> Laney, when you sponsor a SRU please set the bugs as fix commited and subscribe ubuntu-sru, thanks ;-)
<seb128> Sweetshark, not sure how you keep up with bug emails for bugs assigned to you but https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/628105 has debdiff that might be worth including in the next libreoffice SRUs you do
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 628105 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "[Upstream] Text not black in LibreOffice" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> tjaalton, is there any chance you SRU the fix for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libxrandr/+bug/985202 as well (since you did the raring upload ;-)
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 985202 in libxrandr (Ubuntu Precise) "libx11 causes kwin to crash on login (over NX protocol)" [High,Triaged]
<tjaalton> seb128: yeah, forgot the sru part
<Sweetshark> seb128: patch is in upstream 4.0 so will be in raring anyway. I didnt consider it for a SRU as it doesnt fix a security issue or crasher or something similar severe. If I would, there would be literally thousands of patches to consider.
<Sweetshark> seb128: I dont magically make something more important because it has a patch on lp instead of on freedesktop (would be a moral hazard anyway). And if that should land in quantal, it should done so by a backporting the patch to upstream stable 3.6, not by a vendor patch as that give us a sane review process (with knowledgable patch reviewers) for free and -- by MRE -- spares us the redtape of an SRU.
<Sweetshark> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/628105/comments/39 as for precise, remember the >20 backported patches I SRUed for 3.5.7 which all fixed bad crashers or prevented release regressions? If we open up for this class of bugs, we would end up with 200 patches every 2 month easily. 3.5.7 was the last 3.5 release. This release https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Releases/3.6.5/RC1 of the later 3.6 series was done
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 628105 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "[Upstream] Text not black in LibreOffice" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<mdeslaur> seb128: what component actually draws the indicator menu at the top of the screen?
<mdeslaur> indicator-appmenu?
<Sweetshark> seb128: ... and that assumes that finding out if a bug is 3.6-only or also applies to 3.5 is no work and that backporting from 3.6 to 3.5 is trivial, which it just isnt when people are doing stuff like ripping out obsolete, but widely used stringclasses of a 5 million LOC codebase.
<Sweetshark> seb128: the first bug on that list https://bugzilla.novell.com/show_bug.cgi?id=758138 is comparable to lp#628105 in scope and severity. Why should I take care of the lp# bug but not of the fdo# one? (Unless there is a UA ticket for the lp# one.)
<ubot2> bugzilla.novell.com bug 758138 in Impress "Slide Show Settings - Presentation Display: All Displays only uses primary" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<mdeslaur> seb128: nm, found it
<seb128> mdeslaur, hey
<seb128> mdeslaur, I can reply since you figured it you and I've nothing to do ;-)
<mdeslaur> hehhe
<seb128> mdeslaur, (was at dinner, seems like I was away at the right time)
<mdeslaur> yeah yeah, excuses excuses
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> mdeslaur, the rendering is done by unity-panel-service, e.g unity afaik, does that match what you found?
<mdeslaur> i believe so, yes
<mdeslaur> thanks
<seb128> yw!
<seb128> mdeslaur, what's your issue?
<mdeslaur> seb128: I was looking for the setting to disable menu fade, to add to the stuff I disable in VMs
<seb128> seems like a compiz animation's plugin thing
<seb128> unity does the functional hide/show
<mdeslaur> yes
<seb128> but the animations is compiz'
<dobey> xnox: if you're still around, any idea why the new pyflakes didn't go to release yet? it's still sat in proposed it seems
<seb128> dobey, http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_output.txt
<seb128>     * i386: lintian4python
<seb128> dobey, lintian4python depends on pyflakes (<< 0.5.0+)
<dobey> seb128: huh. but the previous version of pyflakes was 0.5.0 :)
<seb128> dobey, right, the depends seems to ensure it's 0.5, it has a > 0.5, <= 0.5+
<seb128> dobey, so that needs to be updated to the current version
<dobey> huh
<dobey> well that's annoying
<seb128> dobey, well, not sure why it's there but it's probably easy enough to bump the versions
<dobey> well, that seems to be a debian native package
<dobey> but aside from that, yeah, easy enough. i just don't have the privs and no idea how to propose changes to such a package :)
<seb128> dobey, just put a debdiff only
 * xnox will ask lintian4py developer.
<xnox> I was sure enough to check that it doesn't directly import pyflakes, but I guess it uses it in an another weird way.
<mterry> Sweetshark, in these libreoffice MIRs, you mention an email exchange with Rene.  Is that a public one?
<dobey> whee, lp:ubuntu/lintian4python is out of date :-/
<dobey> xnox: thanks (just saw the scrollback). no idea why it depends on a specific version that way. it's quite odd
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-02-15
<didrocks> good morning!
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> hey pitti
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel!
<jibel> bonjour didrocks !
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<Laney> morrrrrrrrrrrning
<Sweetshark> seb128: btw https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/1037111/comments/38, I hope this is not blocking on anything anymore.
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1037111 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "[SRU] LibreOffice 3.5.7 for precise" [High,Confirmed]
<Laney> seb128: SRUs> Fix Committed is for "this package is in -proposed", and I don't believe that subscribing ubuntu-sru is necessary
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Procedure
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Reviewing_procedure_and_tools says that the accepting tools will do that
<Sweetshark> bonjour, goooOOOOood morning, moin a tous!
<seb128> hey desktopers
<Laney> morning ;-)
<seb128> Sweetshark, re 3.5.7, nothing needed/blocking, 12.04.2 was released yesterday but I expect they will resume copies to -updates soon (maybe not today because it's friday though)
<seb128> Laney, oh ok, I'm old school again, I should re-read those documents every 6 months to pick the changes to the processes :p
 * Laney got re-educated by someone a few months ago
<Sweetshark> seb128: k, thanks
<didrocks> salut seb128, Laney, Sweetshark :)
<didrocks> and chrisccoulson ;)
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, seb128, Laney, Sweetshark
<seb128> hey didrocks, chrisccoulson
<seb128> how is everyone doing today?
<seb128> happy friday!
<seb128> it has been snowing again here, there is like 15 cm of snow on the ground
<didrocks> still UTAH not behaving as excepted, so, same sort of thing throughout the week
<seb128> didrocks, :-(
 * Sweetshark loves his radio paradise playing "while my guitar gently weeps" ...
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> didrocks: if the autolanding is borked, can/shall I upload libappindicator manually?
<didrocks> Laney: no, I'm forcing an update now
<Laney> ok, that's a useful capability
<didrocks> Laney: yeah :) I wish I wouldn't have to use it though :p
 * xnox bzr commit --unchanged ;-)
<didrocks> xnox: hey, did you see my comment on the MP btw?
<didrocks> for oneconf
<didrocks> xnox: seems barry rebased it now, so you only need to refresh your debian/changelog
<didrocks> xnox: also, when ubiquity is copying the logs to the home directory, does it wait for the late_command to finish?
<didrocks> xnox: we have a case where in the ~, we don't have those copied
<didrocks> xnox: where /var/log/syslog contains everything :)
<xnox> logs to the home directory - sounds odd, we copy logs to /var/log/installer/*
<xnox> we copy logs to /target/var/log/installer/*
<xnox> that is.
 * xnox checks the code
<didrocks> xnox: ah, so something else is doing the copy to the home dir?
<didrocks> like ~/installer_syslog
<xnox> sounds like utah thing =)
<didrocks> possibly :)
<didrocks> thought you had a dark and hidden feature for oem/preseeded mode :p
<xnox> didrocks: also. in ubiquity we don't have late_command (that's a d-i thing) we have ubiquity/success_command
<didrocks> xnox: sorry, I meant success_command
<didrocks> late_command is then used, for other things ;)
<xnox> looks like we copy_logs before running late_command, but not sure.
<xnox> s/late/success/ ;-)
<didrocks> xnox: "we" being ubiquity or utah ;)
 * xnox uses ubiquity as principal hat
<didrocks> ok :)
<didrocks> xnox: can you please keep me posted?
<xnox> also about oneconf: i saw email about missing commits, didn't notice the update branch yet.
<jibel> xnox, actually there is a success_command that copies /var/log/syslog and after installation when you compare this copy with /var/log/installer/syslog, /var/log/installer/syslog is shorter
<chrisccoulson> woohoo, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-trunk.head/revision/1540
<seb128> chrisccoulson, nice! but still using dbusmenu :p
<chrisccoulson> seb128, well, it needs to work on 12.04 (and GMenuModel still can't do icons) ;)
<seb128> right
<seb128> Sweetshark, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/libreoffice/1:3.5.7-0ubuntu4
<seb128>  1:3.5.7-0ubuntu4
<seb128> PUBLISHED: Precise pocket Updates in component main and section editors
<seb128> Sweetshark, well done! ;-)
<Sweetshark> seb128: \o\ /o/
<Sweetshark> timing is perfect: now if there is any issue with it, Ill get physical abuse for it next week in london. ;)
<seb128> you know your team! :p
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> pitti, salut, ca va ?
<pitti> est-ce que tu sais -- oÃ¹ est mon indicateur de bluetooth?
<pitti> seb128: je vais bien, merci! mais ma femme est malade :(
<seb128> pitti, dpkg -l indicator-bluetooth ?
<pitti> martin    2542  0.0  0.1 515584  5672 ?        Sl   08:00   0:00 /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/indicator-bluetooth/indicator-bluetooth-service
<pitti> seb128: oh, it's running, I just don't see it
<pitti> started yesterday
<pitti> I mean the bug started yesterday, I did see the indicator until yesterday
<seb128> pitti, do you have bluetooth hardware?
<pitti> seb128: I don't have my headphones nor my mobile's BT on right now, but even if I do it doesn't appear
<seb128> pitti, ta femme est malade ? qu'est-ce qu'elle a ?
<pitti> bluetoothd is running, too
<seb128> pitti, gsettings get com.canonical.indicator.bluetooth visible
<pitti> seb128: she's had a cold on and off in the past three weeks, and it got much worse yesterday
<seb128> :-(
<pitti> seb128: true
<pitti> seb128: so it seems you don't know that it's an intended change or so; I'll try with a new user / debug in more detail
<pitti> hm, my permanent test user doesn't even have a message indicator
 * pitti creates a fresh one
<seb128> pitti, no, it's not an intended change
<Sweetshark> pitti: bon retablissement a ta femme
<seb128> pitti, we recently added support for that gsettings key to hide it, but that's true for you
<pitti> Sweetshark: merci!
<pitti> no, same with a fresh user -- bt and msg indicators are missing
<seb128> oh, msg as well
<seb128> starts sounding like an unity/indicator stack issue
<pitti> hm, wait
<seb128> what updates did you get in the last round?
<pitti> $ sudo hcitool  dev
<pitti> Devices:
<pitti> $
<pitti> that's not good
<seb128> pitti, https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/indicator-bluetooth/only-show-when-adapter-present/+merge/147248
<pitti> [   12.844516] Bluetooth: hci0 command 0x0c56 tx timeout
<seb128> pitti, that landed recently; it hides the indicator if no hardware is available
<pitti> seb128: ok, so that confirms that this part is working then, and it's a kernel prob
<seb128> pitti, so that's likely what's happening for you
<pitti> new kernel?
<pitti> I got a new one this morning, rebooting
 * Sweetshark is slightly worried about the airport personal strikes and what it means for getting to london on sunday.
<pitti> seb128: ooh, je le sais!
<seb128> pitti, c'est de ta faute ?
<pitti> seb128: so, you know that you can disable BT in the indicator, right? that enables the "soft" kill switch
<pitti> seb128: once you do that, the indicator goes away
<seb128> oh
<seb128> and you can't get it back
<pitti> since raring, the soft kill switch isn't very permanent any more
<pitti> sometimes after reboot it remembers, but often it doesn't and switches back to "on"
<seb128> I guess it should consider no hardware and disabled differently
<pitti> so after this reboot it was a case where it was back to on
<pitti> but now I don't have an indicator to re-enable it
<seb128> I see
<seb128> you can probably do it from g-c-c ?
<pitti> $ cat /sys/class/rfkill/rfkill0/{type,state}
<pitti> bluetooth
<pitti> 0
<pitti> $ cat /sys/class/rfkill/rfkill0/soft
<pitti> 1
<pitti> it should probably look at that
<seb128> pitti, it's weird, if I disable bluetooth from the indicator the indicator stays but as greyed here
<pitti> yes, when I re-enable BT from g-c-c, the indicator comes back
 * pitti files bug report
<pitti> so regression from bug 1116289
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1116289 in indicator-bluetooth (Ubuntu) "Bluetooth menu appears when there are no Bluetooth adapters" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1116289
<seb128> pitti, I'm still unsure why it behaves different for you
<pitti> seb128: filed bug 1126108, sub'ed robert-ancell
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1126108 in indicator-bluetooth (Ubuntu) "0.0.6 regression: disappears entirely when disabling BT" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1126108
<seb128> pitti, I can't confirm that, it's just greyed for me
<seb128> when I disable bluetooth from g-c-c or the indicator
<seb128> but it's not hidden
<pitti> seb128: not sure what it's looking at
<pitti> rfkill or bluetoothd's dbus objects, or sysfs
<seb128> pitti, I was trying to understand https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/indicator-bluetooth/only-show-when-adapter-present/+merge/147248
<seb128> bluetooth_service._visible = client.adapter_model.iter_n_children (null) > 0;
<pitti> /sys/class/bluetooth/ is empty for me when I soft-rfkill
<pitti> that's from bluetooth-client.h
<pitti> seb128: if you disable it, do you still see something in "sudo hcitool dev" and/or /sys/class/bluetooth/ ?
<seb128> $ sudo hcitool dev
<seb128> Devices:
<seb128> $
<seb128> $ ls /sys/class/bluetooth/
<seb128> hci0
<seb128> $
<pitti> right, I don't have that when it's killed
<seb128> well, it any case it seems like the code to detect if hardware is present or not is not clever enough
<seb128> I wonder if that's possible to make the difference from the client side though
<pitti> right, it needs to look at rfkill in addition
<pitti> seb128: I updated the bug, thanks for checking
<seb128> pitti, danke!
<Sweetshark> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/628105/comments/40 btw
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 628105 in libreoffice (Ubuntu Quantal) "[Upstream] Text not black in LibreOffice" [Undecided,In progress]
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks!
<GunnarHj> seb128: Hi Sebastien! Can you please take a look at bug 1126149.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1126149 in ibus-chewing (Ubuntu) "Version in raring-proposed dependent on ibus 1.5" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1126149
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey, see happyaron's comment (he just added it)Ã 
<GunnarHj> seb128: Wow, he was fast! :)
<seb128> happyaron, hey, why do you need a rebuild because of sid? we don't do binary updates in Ubuntu, just source ones
<happyaron> :)
<seb128> so what is in sid shouldn't impact us
<happyaron> seb128: at that time ibus 1.5 was uploaded to Sid, then ibus-chewing, so it picks up ibus >= 1.5 in generated dependencies
<happyaron> ibus-chewing should work with ibus 1.4.2, which we want to keep in Raring, and a rebuild is needed to get everything correct (symbols, depends)
<seb128> happyaron, how are the depends generated? if it's at build time it should have picked 1.4 since that's what raring has and what it built with in Ubuntu
<happyaron> seb128: ibus 1.5 was auto synced to raring-proposed, I'm not sure whether ibus-chewing will build agaist which version of ibus (release or proposed). Also I need double check if it's hard coded in d/control...
<seb128> happyaron, no, it was not, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ibus
<happyaron> ok, hard coded one.
<seb128> happyaron, the only things autosynced are the ones without Debian diff
<seb128> Ubuntu diff rather
<happyaron> I see.
<happyaron> http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-ime/ibus-chewing.git;a=blob;f=debian/control;h=100461e697f582fed346477d0b7940ee5c3ef1cd;hb=HEAD
<seb128> if we have changes somebody needs to merge manually
<seb128> happyaron, can you just do an upload to Ubuntu with the fix?
 * Sweetshark loves building libreoffice in a 32GB tmpfs with ccache ....
<happyaron> seb128: sure, but I need test if ibus-chewing really works in VM. recently ibus-table's changes make me a little nervous.
 * seb128 things that "love" "libreoffice" and "build" don't go in a same sentence
<seb128> happyaron, ok, otherwise I guess we can upload a new.is.old tweaked version
<happyaron> ok
<happyaron> seb128: if it doesn't work, can we just drop it from proposed? (from the archive side)
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Any news about bug 1101836?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1101836 in im-switch (Ubuntu) "Needs to keep hands off when removed but not purged" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1101836
<GunnarHj> happyaron: If there is an issue we should deal with it fast, since it could affect quite a few im users.
<happyaron> GunnarHj: the file is modified by the user.
<seb128> happyaron, we can yes but I think in this case the next upload will need an higher version that the one dropped
<happyaron> seb128: thanks
<Laney> I don't think higher but just that that specific version can't be used
<Laney> AFAIK
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Ok, that's what I suspected.
<happyaron> GunnarHj: I don't know the impact of such problem, i.e. how many users may have edited it.
<Laney> GunnarHj: I need you!
<GunnarHj> happyaron: No, it's not easy to estimate...
<GunnarHj> Laney: How? Why?
<Laney> GunnarHj: Do you know how to register new IMs with im-config? In this case maliit
<happyaron> GunnarHj: there is no migration, and if the file isn't known then the input methods are left in a broken state.
<happyaron> Laney: patch im-config
<Laney> urg, really?
<happyaron> yes
<happyaron> there is no registration stuff in im-config anymore, those information is maintained by im-config itself.
<GunnarHj> Laney: I think that the im-config docs include some guidance.
<Laney> I found loads of huge shell scripts that I didn't really understand
<happyaron> :)
<happyaron> upstream prefers that way, once I offered to rewrite some of them in C/python, but get gentlely refused.
<Laney> bah
<happyaron> Laney: I wonder what's the plan for maliit? for phones?
<ogra_> happyaron, forst for the nexus7 image we ship since a while
<ogra_> *first
<seb128> happyaron, we are evaluating options, onboard is nice but it's also python and that's not really mobile friendly
<happyaron> ogra_ seb128 thanks
<Laney> right, currently just trying to make sure it's integrated properly
 * ogra_ hasnt gotten around to it yeat, but also wanted to take a look at florence
<Laney> anyway I didn't get IM activation working yet
<seb128> ogra_, have enough of the german winter you want to try italy? ;-)
<Laney> even with im-switch, so ho hum
<ogra_> haha
<ogra_> yeah, i woudl love to  :)
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Back to im-switch ... How about dropping the md5sum check in im-config? Or would the policy guards scream then?
<happyaron> GunnarHj: they sure will scream at Debian, but I doubt that in Ubuntu, ;-)
<Laney> some people would
<Laney> are you saying it mangles config files of another package?
<happyaron> yup
<GunnarHj> happyaron: I think there are good arguments in this case. 80im-switch isn't really a config file.
<happyaron> GunnarHj: I understand and totally agree.
<Laney> why don't you fix im-switch to just do nothing if it's not installed?
<Laney> those Xsession things are just shell scripts aren't they ?
<GunnarHj> Laney: Too late.
<happyaron> Laney: what if someone didn't update im-switch and just upgrade to Raring...
<Laney> partial upgrades aren't really something we can support anyway
<happyaron> the problem is that 80im-switch will have the effect even the package is removed (not purged)
<Laney> add a line to the top of it to exit if im-switch is in that situation
<Laney> exit 0
<ogra_> err
<ogra_> dont add exit statements to Xsession scripts, they are not executed but sourced
<Laney> ah
<GunnarHj> happyaron, Laney, ogra_: So do we just wait and see what happens then?
<happyaron> Laney: we need to make sure the file is gone when im-config is configured, either purging im-switch, or removing the file in im-config. Or input method related variables will be in sorry state.
<happyaron> GunnarHj: and we know how many people manually edited that file...
<ogra_> oh, that will mean a lot of fun with ucf for you then, if people changed it you will get prompts on upgrades
<ogra_> since its a conffile
<Laney> I'm saying that you can make it do nothing if im-switch is removed
<Laney> it being sourced makes that more grim though - I can't think of an elegant way to bail out of that
<Laney> does return work?
<happyaron> what about release note?
<GunnarHj> Laney: The smartest way would be to let im-config do it without bothering about whether the file was modified.
<ogra_> you cant, its a conffile
<didrocks> ogra_: is the nexus7 image broken? I tried to reinstall the image from the 14th, after the ubuntu plymouth logo, nothingâ¦
<GunnarHj> ogra_: Not really.
<ogra_> didrocks, yes, trying to find out whats going on there since yesterday already
<ogra_> GunnarHj, not really what ?
<didrocks> ogra_: ah ok, not on my end then, thanks :-)
<Laney> ah, it seems you can 'return' out of a sourced script
<ogra_> GunnarHj, dpkg considers every file under /etc a conffile
<Laney> not exactly
<Laney> but indeed this one is
<GunnarHj> ogra_: It's in /etc, but it's executed. And after a transition to im-config noone will care about 80im-switch.
<ogra_> it isnt executed
<Laney> if it's sourced you can 'return' out of it
<Laney> so check if im-switch is removed but not purged and reutrn if so
<ogra_> (and it is actually supposed to say so at the top)
<happyaron> Laney: but who to update that file?
<Laney> one of you two?
<Laney> oh, you mean because the package is removed?
<Laney> you can SRU it
<ogra_> http://wiki.debian.org/DpkgConffileHandling
<Laney> also I just noticed that this is the reason I couldn't test maliit with im-switch
<GunnarHj> Are we talking about SRUs in quantal, precice, oneiric... then
<ogra_> the runes you will need in your maintainer scripts for removing it
<Laney> because you trash the config file in im-config my im-switch configuratino wasn't being applied
<happyaron> SRU could be to late...
<Laney> you can't reinstall im-switch and have it work ...
<GunnarHj> Laney: Why?
<Laney> dpkg thinks that I deleted it intentionally
<Laney> so doesn't install it again
<GunnarHj> Laney: If you purge first, you should be able to install it.
<Laney> indeed
<happyaron> just tell users sudo dpkg -P im-switch, done. No more im-switch and let's use im-config...
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Maybe SRU of some exit code is an option, after all, if just we could have somebody sponsor it rapidly.
<happyaron> agreed
<Laney> I can add im-switch to your packageset if you want
<GunnarHj> We need somebody with full privileges to proposed and updates, then.
<happyaron> Laney: not sure if that sufficent for SRU..
<Laney> it can be
<Laney> we'll have to get someone to copy the packageset back to the stable releases you want to upload to, but that's easy
<GunnarHj> Sounds promising.
<Laney> if you mail devel-permissions asking for this to be added I will do the needful with the DMB
<happyaron> I don't think there will be SRU for other packages, so if someone (say, Laney?) can sponsor im-switch then no need to be this complex.
<Laney> if you like
<Laney> point me to the bug when you have it filled out with patches and the SRU information then
<happyaron> ok
<happyaron> thank you.
<GunnarHj> happyaron: We are talking about something like:
<GunnarHj> test -x /usr/bin/im-switch || exit 0
<GunnarHj> right?
<happyaron> not "exit 0", but almost, yes.
<GunnarHj> Why not "exit 0"?
<ogra_> because Xsession.d files arent executed
<happyaron> it will stop Xsession startup.
<GunnarHj> Aha.
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Are you going to do it?
<happyaron> GunnarHj: I'm okay, but need next Monday. I've finished my holidays and preparing to travel back to Beijing.
<happyaron> (Chinese lunar new year)
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Won't be a problem, if you just get the necessary backup from Laney etc.
<happyaron> ok
<GunnarHj> New year? :)
<didrocks> ogra_: FYI, the image from the 13th as well, but I guess you know it :)
<ogra_> err, its not
<didrocks> ogra_: do you know which latest image is fine?
<didrocks> ah
 * didrocks checks
<ogra_> all current images are unusable
<ogra_> the last working one was from the 11th
<happyaron> yup, lunar new year, today is the last day of this official holiday, :)
<didrocks> ogra_: do you have a link to it?
<ogra_> and i'm still hunting for the change that caused it
<ogra_> didrocks, we only keep 3 dailies
<didrocks> ogra_: at least, no unity upload due to UTAH mostly (and now tests), so not me \o/
<ogra_> (since we dont do milesstones anymore, the last working ones are now gone)
<didrocks> not fun :/
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Thanks for that cultural lesson. :)
<ogra_> didrocks, no, its the installer or something related to starting ubiquity-dm
<happyaron> GunnarHj: :)
<ogra_> didrocks, yes, we need a solution for the future for this
<ogra_> didrocks, i think cjwatson brought up to keep one image per month that has been tested or so ...
<didrocks> ogra_: yeah, or something running basic tests and the image candidates for being "latest good" if those tests pass
<ogra_> hard to do on a device like the nexus7
<didrocks> I guess, autoinstalling is hard :/
<ogra_> (you cant really check if the display works for example ... or the touchscreen)
<ogra_> you can indeed do preseeded installs
<didrocks> indeed, but at least, a basic test sshing and running some stuff
<ogra_> but they wont tell you if user interaction is possible
<didrocks> (like autopilot)
<didrocks> will help for a first pass
<ogra_> i think thats something plars works on atm
<didrocks> ok
<ogra_> but for a monthly "milestone" we need at least one manual test on such devices
<didrocks> yeah
 * ogra_ would like to know why his evo on raring is crashing all day today ... it worked flawless the last weeks
<jibel> seb128, do you know if anyone's working on gnome-settings-daemon 3.6.4-0ubuntu6 build failure on armhf?
<seb128> jibel, no, I didn't notice it failed, I just retried it
<jibel> seb128, thanks
<seb128> jibel, it hit a gcc error, with some luck that was transient
<seb128> jibel, thanks for pointing it
<ogra_> seb128, hmm, ubiquity-dm seems to have started failing to start on the 12th ... i wonder if https://launchpadlibrarian.net/131004748/gnome-settings-daemon_3.6.4-0ubuntu4_3.6.4-0ubuntu5.diff.gz could have something to do with it
<seb128> ogra_, g-s-d is not even used for the installer mode iirc
<ogra_> i.e. if we dont enable xrandr in the dm session
<ogra_> how do we get gtk themeing then ?
<ogra_> i thought g-s-d handles that in the installaer too
<seb128> custom ubiquity hacks
<ogra_> ok
<seb128> no, xnox was looking at displayed the wallpaper the other day I think
<seb128> xnox, ^ confirm or not?
<seb128> displaying*
<ogra_> yeah, thats not in the code yet
<seb128> he said he could use the g-s-d plugin since ubiquity doesn't use gsd
<seb128> couldn't*
<seb128> doh, it's friday, I'm tired :p
<ogra_> yeah, i'm voting for using the compiz plugin anyway
<seb128> ogra_, you are trying to figure out what update broke the installer? can you change vt to look at what is running?
<xnox> seb128: g-s-d is started by ubiquity.
<seb128> xnox, oh, I though you said you couldn't use it to display the background because you don't depends on g-s-d
<xnox> seb128: we depend on it conditionally - e.g. xubuntu/lubuntu doesn't but it's lower priority at this point.
<seb128> ok
<ogra_> seb128, no VTs once the driver detected that X attempted to start
<seb128> ogra_, so I was wrong
<ogra_> ok
 * xnox was not entirely clear last time we chatted seb128 
<seb128> xnox, thanks
<xnox> so my fault really.
<ogra_> so if we wouldnt have the xrandr plugin enabled ... i wonder if that would make it fall over with this patch
<seb128> xnox, is there any way to disable a gsd plugin/change a gsetting key before ubiquity starts?
<seb128> xnox, from a current image I mean, without rebuilding one
<xnox> yes, we have hooks directory, but it probably will be a bit late.
<xnox> let me check.
<xnox> drop executable into: /usr/lib/ubiquity/dm-scripts/install or /usr/lib/ubiquity/dm-scripts/oem
<xnox> (oem for nexus7 and the like)
<xnox> filename cannot have '.' in it.
<xnox> so one can change gsettings there as gsd is not started yet.
<seb128> ogra_, ^
<seb128> xnox, thanks
<desrt> morning, peeps
<seb128> desrt, hey, how are you?
<desrt> xnox: did you fix that raring image tar problem?
<desrt> seb128: okay
<desrt> yourself?
<seb128> jibel, the g-s-d retry on armhf worked
<seb128> desrt, I'm good thanks ;-)
<xnox> desrt: nexus7 raring image tar - we revert it all, but it may or may not fixed the underlying problem. ogra_ ?!
 * desrt wants to get his nexus reinstalled before next week...
<ogra_> xnox, it unpacks fine thats not the issue
<ogra_> there is a) a /tmp/.X0-lock file that seems to already be in the tarball (or i'm to slow to recognize a failed X startup) and b) there are g-s-d changes that i suspect to play bad
<Sweetshark> Bill was really bitten by the George H bug today. While my guitar gently weeps in the original and the ukulele version and now here comes the sun in the live version all in a few hours.
<desrt> ogra_: i guess this issue i have is not a g-s-d one since X is not even starting
<mterry> Sweetshark, what conversation did I log into here?
<mterry> Sweetshark, oh, btw.  In those libreoffice MIRs, you mention an email thread with Rene.  Is that public?
<ogra_> desrt, thats the point :)
<Sweetshark> mterry: woops. wrong channel. Anyway: you should all listen to radioparadise.com or dubstep.fm. back to the usual progam.
<mterry> :)
<mterry> Sweetshark, I do like radioparadise
<Sweetshark> mterry: saw your ping, but you were offline. Nope, its private. I will follow up on those, but need to recheck.
<ogra_> desrt, g-s-d uses consolekit and dbus ... and with the recent rotation patches it  is suppsed to wait until the xrandr plugin writes something to the bus ... my suspicion is that this holds up X startup
<ogra_> and makes it fail at some point
<mterry> Sweetshark, I just wanted to see his explanation that the hardening-no-fortify warnings were ignorable.  If you can tell me what he said, that's fine
<desrt> ogra_: i'm confused -- you're saying g-s-d starts before X?
<ogra_> desrt, g-s-d is started by ubiquity-dm
<desrt> ogra_: unless you disabled a bunch of plugins, that's not gonna work...
<ogra_> i think we do
 * ogra_ grumbles about evo ... 
<ogra_> so running it from a terminal to see if it prints anything when crashing it indeed stops to crash
<xnox> mterry: hardening-no-fortify lintian warnings have a lot of false positives =/
 * xnox usually does a full debug build and inspects the build-log
<mterry> xnox, yar, even the lintian tag page for it says so
<mterry> xnox, but in which case, ideally there's an override  :)
<xnox> ogra_: ubiquity-dm start X if fails we try "safe" X config -> we initiate consolekit session (wait) -> run hooks -> start session dbus -> start dconf, gconf, wallpaper app -> start window manager (compiz) -> launch g-s-d -> launch fake-panel app
<xnox> desrt: seb128 ^
<xnox> then start loads of other applets (e.g. nm, bluetooth etc)
<ogra_> hmm
<ogra_> does safe xconfig mean we execute xdiagnose to find that config ? there were changes too
<ogra_> ah, no]
<desrt> why would you start dconf?
<ogra_> was uploaded yesterday, cant be at fault
<ogra_> desrt, isnt teher a daemon ?
<ogra_> i know gconf had one
<desrt> yes.  but it should not be running
<desrt> and i doubt you need to start gconf either
<desrt> these things get activated by dbus
<xnox> desrt: we check if it's available on the path and start. It's very cargo-culted.
<ogra_> well, i think there is a lot of old and rather obsolete code in ubiquity
<xnox> desrt: are you sure all those things get dbus actived in Xubuntu/Lubuntu/Mythbuntu/etc. ?
<desrt> the normal state for the dconf service is that it is _not_ running
<desrt> xnox: yes... if something is bus activated or not does not depend on desktop environment
<desrt> it depends only on the dbus-daemon running
<ogra_> i know in pre-dbus times we had to fire up gconfd
<xnox> ok.
 * xnox takes a note to rip that code out and see if stuff still works.
<ogra_> and i think even that code is still there (unused though)
<ogra_> but back to my question ...
<ogra_> if https://launchpadlibrarian.net/131004748/gnome-settings-daemon_3.6.4-0ubuntu4_3.6.4-0ubuntu5.diff.gz is applied (which it is)
<ogra_> and xrandr plugin is disabled or nonexistent ... could g-s-d hang in a wait state ?
<ogra_> (and thus hold the whole startup process)
 * xnox learns about xsetbd
 * xnox learns about xsetbg
<ogra_> heh
<ogra_> oldschool
<xnox> well why do we have three re-writes of wallpaper app in ubiquity (wallpaper, python-qt one and the old-one) when there is xsetbg?
<ogra_> xnox, qiv is the new variant of it
<ogra_> qiv -x /path/to/wallpaper.png
<ogra_> xnox, xloadimage would have to move to main for xsetbg
<ogra_> xnox, and i think xserbg is pretty limited in formats it can use ... i would go for qiv if you really want to move to a new tool
<xnox> ogra_: and handwritten implemented thing is somehow "more" supportable right?!
<ogra_> not saying that
<ogra_> but if we go with a new external tool i'd not go with xsetbg
<ogra_> oh, but wait ... xloadimage is maintained by elmo
<ogra_> that makes it worth including it
<ogra_> :)
 * xnox likes the idea of putting elmo on the critical path in the installer
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> xloadimage also has fewer build deps
<ogra_> (less formats though. but jpeg and png are there)
<Laney> looks orphaned to me
<ogra_> npot sure how good the zoom is though
<xnox> ogra_: qiv is gtk2 which is too heavy for kubuntu and gtk2-less future
<ogra_> Laney, well, we have it in the archive still
<ogra_> xnox, right, just noticed that when reviewing the deps
<ogra_> and even gtk2
<ogra_> which we dont want
<Laney> i'm sure we do, but "maintained by elmo" doesn't seem correct
<Laney> looks like he did do in the past though
<ogra_> well, it is what the original maintainer field says
 * xnox will just do a bit of qa uploads =)
<ogra_> oh
<Laney> is dead upstream, orphaned
<ogra_> i should have checked on raring :P
<Laney> fun mir ;-)
<ogra_> Original-Maintainer: Debian QA Group <packages@qa.debian.org>
<ogra_> not elmo anymore
<ogra_> (i looked on precise)
 * Laney always checks the PTS for such things
<Laney> pretty sure that is my most visited website after launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/<stuff>
<ogra_> heh
 * ogra_ uses apt 
 * xnox gives ogra_ a web-browser
<ogra_> heh
<xnox> between qiv and xloadimage: xloadimage doesn't scale the default wallpaper correctlya and there are white borders on my dual screen rig.
<xnox> qiv on the otherhand gets everything right.
<Sweetshark> woha thanks raring for gracing the screen of my vm with colorful ASCII art after update/reboot.
<happyaron> unity just hang after installing vbox guest addtions... yeah vm again...
<ogra_> Sweetshark, thats an early easteregg ;)
<xnox> dobey: new pyflakes in raring-release pocket should be on the mirrors near you in less than half an hour
<dobey> xnox: thanks!
<GunnarHj> happyaron: still there?
<happyaron> GunnarHj: yes
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Considering that we actually changed 80im-switch not long ago, are there reasons to fear that many users have editied the file _after that_?
<xnox> qiv is damn good
<happyaron> GunnarHj: To be honest, I don't think people will normally edit that file, since there aren't any tweakable items in.
<GunnarHj> happyaron: So, would the SRU thing be do overdo it?
<happyaron> GunnarHj: but there are people who have touched it, I'm just wondering what to do for them. Just leave themselves deal with the situation or we can do anything for them.
<happyaron> GunnarHj: a bit, and may not be that effective.
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Dropping md5sum would be 100% effective.
<GunnarHj> happyaron: But maybe that fight wouldn't be worth it.
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Or would it?
<happyaron> there's doubt for policy guards
<happyaron> actually it's the only thing I'm in doubt.
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Can we drop the md5sum check in Ubuntu only?
<GunnarHj> happyaron: After all it's in Ubuntu im-switch/im-config is provided by default.
<happyaron> GunnarHj: if it's okay for us to take the risk of someone screaming about policy then, yes.
<Laney> why are you so averse to conffile prompts?
<GunnarHj> Laney: Not what you mean now.
<happyaron> Laney: it's not prompts, but silently set several variables for you then make input method does not work.
<GunnarHj> sure
<Laney> but you know how to stop it doing that
<GunnarHj> Laney: The way we discussed earlier isn't 100% safe.
<Laney> it's pretty bad that im-config doesn't even back up the file it removes btw
<GunnarHj> Laney: We can't be sure that people update before dist-upgrade.
<GunnarHj> Laney: As long as it hasn't been modified, why is that an issue?
<happyaron> But if it's modified... then it's our question now.
<Laney> it's an issue if it makes dpkg not put it back if I decide I want im-switch again (and if you do remove that md5sum check)
<GunnarHj> Laney: Aha, it's going back to im-switch that worryies you. Then don't. ;-)
<GunnarHj> happyaron, Laney: Then: drop the md5sum check in Ubuntu and backup the file if present?
<Laney> anyway if you /really/ want (I'm not sure I'd worry about it) you could have im-config insert the guard
<Laney> I'd say that is preferable to removing the file
<happyaron> Laney: you mean insert to 80im-switch?
<Laney> right
<Laney> it's probably still policy violating but still less objectionable imho
<happyaron> perhaps a better idea. if [ -x /usr/bin/im-config ]; then...
<GunnarHj> Sounds like a very nice idea.
<Laney> I'm only so keen on this because the current implementation made me waste time by breaking im-switch
<happyaron> Laney: forget about im-switch, it makes all dbus based IMF not starting reliably.
<Laney> if it's that bad you should have it removed
<happyaron> I know little about maliit/onboard, but im-switch is definately a worthy target for dropping from the archive. We are planning to do that in Debian after Wheezy...
<GunnarHj> happyaron, Laney: dropping md5sum check, _edit_ 80im-switch if present - can we sell that to Debian, or should we do that in Ubuntu only?
<Laney> if you have a robust patch then probably
<Laney> im-switch should be fixed too of course (while it still exists)
<happyaron> I can talk with Osamu about it.
<Laney> happyaron: Kubuntu still appears to use im-switch btw
<happyaron> Laney: thanks for the info, don't they use language-selector?
<Laney> they got rid of it
<happyaron> I see.
<Laney> not sure what they use instead
<Laney> probably some KDE thing
<happyaron> ok
<GunnarHj> Laney: I changed the seed for everyone _but_ kde when preparing the transition. We should probably give them a hint.
<Laney> yep, feel free
<GunnarHj> Laney: Will do.
<seb128> xnox, you really though that "eog can't open the default wallpaper" was not filled before? ;-)
 * seb128 dups from bug #172416
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 172416 in eog (Ubuntu) "eog determines image type from filename" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/172416
<xnox> seb128: who knew =) failing to draw the default wallpaper started only in raring
<seb128> hehe
<chrisccoulson> seb128, what time are you arriving on sunday?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I will be at the hotel around 7:30-8pm
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i'm getting the train in the afternoon, so i think i'll be there around 3:30ish
<chrisccoulson> i hope we can get nice beer not too far from the hotel
<chrisccoulson> i'm tempted to bring some of my own ;)
<Sweetshark> bdrung: woha! that was quick. ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm sure London has some decent pubs ;-)
<Laney> xnox will show us the local sights ;-)
<jcastro> post work Steam testing fellas: http://www.gametracker.com/server_info/54.243.8.249:27015/
<jcastro> it'll run all weekend.
<seb128> jcastro, nice!
<xnox> chrisccoulson: yes.
<xnox> Laney: yes.
<xnox> Laney: are you in next week?
<Laney> yep
 * xnox notes down to work from the office next week
<Laney> i mean no
 * Laney runs
<Laney> :P
<seb128> xnox, desktop team is having a sprint at the office next week
<chrisccoulson> all the awesome people will be there
<Sweetshark> bdrung: how/why does setting --libdir= evade the lintian warning?
 * didrocks waves good evening, week-end and see you on Sunday evening for most of you! :)
<Laney> bye!
<mpt> Hey glatzor!
<glatzor> hey mpt !
<mpt> How's things?
<glatzor> mpt, how are you?
<mpt> I am hungry.
<glatzor> mpt, fine. I am getting back to normal life.
<mpt> Is that a good thing, or a letdown?
<glatzor> mpt, I am in the lucky position to see a lasagne in front of me backing in the stove :)
<glatzor> mpt, to a normal geek life :)
<mpt> glatzor, yum. So I suppose now would be completely the wrong time to bother you about a bug? ;-)
<glatzor> mpt, it will still take 10 minutes :)
<mpt> I'll take that as a "go ahead"
<glatzor> mpt, it would be nice if we could talk about the future of s-c and aptdaemon.
<mpt> sure
<mpt> glatzor, so, USC is not the only graphical UI for installing software -- the Dash is doing it now too
<glatzor> mpt, that was my assumption too
<mpt> Which means, it would be more economical and consistent, if edge-case stuff like handling conflicts and errors was in aptdaemon widgets rather than USC.
<glatzor> mpt, it would be nice if we could make use of the packagekit session api. so we could do all the stuff in session-installer
<mpt> So that USC, the Dash, and Software Updater all benefit.
<mpt> sure
<mpt> I don't really understand where aptdaemon stops and sessioninstaller begins
<glatzor> mpt, unity/dash should monitor the system packagekit/aptdaemon interface generally.
<glatzor> mpt, the problem with dash is that I would like to avoid having a new API
<mpt> okay
<mpt> I have no idea what, if any, API the Dash uses
<glatzor> a new API to install software :) since we already have got aptdaemon API, the system and session API of packagekit
<glatzor> mpt, AFAIK mvo wrote a small helper script.
<mpt> ok
<mpt> didrocks should be able to point you at the right person, at least
<mpt> Meanwhile, at the UI design level, I have been moving stuff from <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter#installing> etc to <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwarePackageOperations>
<glatzor> mpt, It would be nice if unity could listen to package management tasks by default and always represent it. so if unity sees a package installation happening on the system it would show a progress bar in the sidebar
<mpt> glatzor, that would be nifty indeed.
<glatzor> mpt, so it would be nice if the graphically representation of package operation would not depend on the client which triggered the operation
<mpt> Currently we have the exact opposite -- USC shows tasks that are being done by other programs, which isn't really what we want.
<mpt> (in the "Progress" screen)
<glatzor> mpt, uhhh sorry. the lasagne is ready!
<mpt> glatzor, I was going to say, the ten minutes is nearly up :-)
<glatzor> mpt, I will be hanging around here later too
<glatzor> I will write an email to you and didi
<glatzor> see you
<mpt> glatzor, I'm going home shortly, so I'll just quickly remind you of two bugs: bug 441686 and bug 796193.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 441686 in aptdaemon (Ubuntu) ""Task cannot be monitored or controlled" alert is unhelpful and scary" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/441686
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 796193 in sessioninstaller (Ubuntu) "Lack of explicity between singular and plural string" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/796193
<mpt> Both of them have questions for you waiting. :-)
<mpt> ttyl
<m4n1sh> desrt: ping
<desrt> m4n1sh: hi
<m4n1sh> desrt: I need some help. Do you have 10-15 mins to spare?
<desrt> maybe.  what's up?
<m4n1sh> remember sometime back you gave me an example of baobab and showed how vala apps should be initialized
<m4n1sh> well, I did it
<m4n1sh> except that the app doesn't start up
<m4n1sh> I can trace the flow of control using stdout.printf but the UI isnt showing up
<desrt> paste me your app?
<m4n1sh> it is here https://code.launchpad.net/~activity-log-manager/activity-log-manager/redesign
<m4n1sh> bzr branch lp:~activity-log-manager/activity-log-manager/redesign
<desrt> what is the main file?
<desrt> alm.vala?
<m4n1sh> the relevant files are src/alm.vala and src/activity-log-manager.vala
<m4n1sh> yes
<m4n1sh> alm.vala is main file
<desrt> public AlmWindow() should take a Gtk.Application argument
<m4n1sh> after make, I do a ./src/activity-log-manager, it exits peacefully. Looks like I am not starting the main loop of something
<desrt> and do Object(application: app); first thing
<desrt> that should fix it
<m4n1sh> oh, that is the problem? that's it?
<desrt> yup
<desrt> you don't associate the new window with the application
<desrt> so the application doesn't know any windows are open
<desrt> so it has no reason to stay alive and quits
<desrt> then change your new AlmWindow() to new AlmWindow(this);
<m4n1sh> yeah, done that
<m4n1sh> i was going crazy over it for days
<m4n1sh> :(
<desrt> is it working now?
<m4n1sh> I saw the passing of Application instance, but just ignored it thinking that it is baobab specific thing
<desrt> nope.  that's important :)
<m4n1sh> yup, building it
<m4n1sh> desrt: yeah. It worked. yay!!!!
<desrt> :)
<desrt> ping sooner next time
<m4n1sh> desrt: is there a way I can buy you a beer :)
<desrt> i won't object next time we meet :)
<m4n1sh> exactly. hopefully anytime next uds if possible
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-02-16
<m4n1sh> mpt: ping
<m4n1sh> mpt: WRT to Privacy in Ubuntu, jbicha had told me that GNOME 3.8 is coming with it's own privacy panel. Do you have any upcoming plans how to change the current design?
<m4n1sh> mpt: he gave me more details from gnome side here https://plus.google.com/u/0/104684638694714940046/posts/2qHErPyMgRD
<xnox> shouldn't compiz reposition my window centered on the screen upon rotating nexus7 ?
<xnox> or should my app listen to gtk signal on screen size change?
<bdrung> Sweetsha1k: these package are way smaller than libreoffice. :)
<bdrung> Sweetsha1k: using debhelper 9 instead of 7 fixes the lintian warning. setting --libdir= is for disabling multi-arch.
<Sweetsha1k> bdrung: ah, heh, thanks for the info ;). I just had a quick glance at the package and wonder how the heck --libdir= fixes the lintian warning.
<Sweetsha1k> bdrung: btw support for rebooting the packaging is rising: https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/#/c/2169/ https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/#/c/2144/ https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=60924  https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=60949 etc.
<ubot2> Freedesktop bug 60924 in Libreoffice "move libraries to autoinstallation in scp2" [Normal,New]
<ubot2> Freedesktop bug 60949 in Libreoffice "move libraries from UNOLIBS_OOO to OOOLIBS in build system" [Normal,New]
<bdrung>  Sweetsha1k: nice to see the patches. i talked to rene and he haven't complained about the packaging reboot idea. so i think we should just start rebooting the package and he will jump aboard once it's usable.
<bdrung> Sweetsha1k: will you prepare the final 4.0 for raring?
<Sweetsha1k> bdrung: Ill be in London next week, I dont know extactly what to expect.
<Sweetsha1k> bdrung: but yes, now that 3.5.7 SRU for precise is out the door, its full force again on 4.0/raring
<bdrung> Sweetsha1k: okay. do you know when 4.0.1 is scheduled?
<bdrung> we have nearly 3 weeks til feature freeze
<Sweetsha1k> bdrung: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleaseNotes/4.0
<Sweetsha1k> eh
<Sweetsha1k> https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleasePlan/4.0 <- thats what I meant
<bdrung> Sweetsha1k: thanks. i think we should target at least 4.0.1 for 13.04
<Sweetsha1k> bdrung: yeah, makes sense.
<bdrung> Sweetsha1k: let me know when you have something to review.
<robru> Snow.
<desrt> robru: in TO?
<robru> desrt, sure am!
<desrt> are you on the 8pm flight or no?
<robru> desrt, yeah, same one as attente.
<desrt> cool.  same as me too.
<robru> great
<desrt> hanging out at YYZ?
<robru> I'm just at that restaurant with all the ipads, yeah
<desrt> land or airside?
 * desrt will be up there in an hour or two...
<robru> inside security
<robru> my ears still haven't popped from the first flight
<desrt> ow
<desrt> so in the E70s, i guess?
<robru> yeah, E69 I think it was
<xnox> What is /usr/share/gnome/wm-properties/compiz.desktop and how do I override it with slightly different settings?
<xnox> (on per session basis)
<doomlord> can you get multitouch input in linux desktop environments
<xnox> yes, with utouch
<doomlord> next question, what programming frameworks/libaries can you get these from
<doomlord> e.g. does one get x-server events from them (?)
<xnox> no idea. look up utouch documentation.
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-02-17
<czajkowski> anyone around that knows much about sound
<czajkowski> playing it via rhythmbox gives me sound, but playing any other application gives me no sound.
<mlankhorst> ok I arrived
<mlankhorst> czajkowski: what does lsof /dev/snd/* say ?
<czajkowski> mlankhorst: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1671637/
<czajkowski> mlankhorst: have switched into guest user asthere I have sound :/
<mlankhorst> what if you just killall pulseaudio and see if sound comes back online?
<czajkowski> let me boot back into my ac
<czajkowski> two ticks
 * mlankhorst needs to establish a vpn to home :s
<czajkowski> mlankhorst: that gives me back sound
<mlankhorst> yeah was suspicious that pulseaudio had control open but not the pcm thing
<czajkowski> cant change volume except from the application itself
<czajkowski> but it's better than where I was a few hours ago
<czajkowski> thanks mlankhorst
<mlankhorst> np
<czajkowski> mlankhorst: no idea why it happened just done a bunch of updates and then no sound. most anoying
<czajkowski> but thanks for the help
<mlankhorst> you're welcome :)
<czajkowski> mlankhorst: you on 13.04 by any chance?
<mlankhorst> czajkowski: depends on which laptop
<mlankhorst> i think i upgraded my eee, not 100% sure
<czajkowski> mlankhorst: trying to see if it;s my machine being special or a bug, but when I go to shut down from the main login screen it hangs and will not shut down and is stuck at the text box screen
<mlankhorst> seems to work for me
<czajkowski> bugger
<czajkowski> cheers
<Laney> meow
<ogra_> woof
<Laney> mlankhorst: you here?
<mlankhorst> Laney: yes
<Laney> nice
<Laney> how about that mood pad
<mlankhorst> ..?
<Laney> that's what they call the tablet in the room
<mlankhorst> oh I put it on its face since turning off just makes it turn itself back on and i hated the light
<mlankhorst> do you have a creepy doll in your room too with your name on it?
<ogra_> are you guys sure you are in the right hote ?
<Laney> doesn't have my name but it is rather creepy
<ogra_> *hotel
<ogra_> dolls in rooms etc ...
<mlankhorst> ogra_: what is your room #? I'll show it
<ogra_> mlankhorst, i'm not -desktop so i wasnt invited
<ogra_> :/
<Laney> :(
<czajkowski> mlankhorst: what made you think to know to killall pulseaudio btw ?
<mlankhorst> czajkowski: normally it should show pcm* is open
<mlankhorst> by pulseaudio, sometimes if it crashes some other app steals it and you don't get sound from normal applications, but I toy with pulseaudio too much and sometimes mess up the installation so that happens :S
<czajkowski> mlankhorst: done it again now 2-3 times since
<czajkowski> :/
<czajkowski> no idea why but now I know at least how to get sound back
<mlankhorst> oh then something is more seriously wrong
<mlankhorst> Laney: you're a debian developer right?
<Laney> correct
<mlankhorst> want to sign my canonical gpg key?
<Laney> you have multiple?
<Laney> yeah sure, i'll do it tomorrow
<Laney> get seb to as well (and RAOF)
<mlankhorst> yeah lost passphrase to my gmail key, never make 2 passphrases that have the same theme
<Laney> + keep a revcert
<Laney> ttyl!
<mlankhorst> yeah I have one now for the other one
<mlankhorst> still from time to time I try to crack my initial one
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-02-10
<hyperair> could someone please help me upload https://launchpad.net/~hyperair/+archive/staging/+files/libgpod_0.8.3-4ubuntu3.dsc to ubuntu while i apply for my PPU access to libgpod?
<TheMuso> hyperair: Sure, I'll take a look.
<hyperair> thanks
<zgsppdale> Hi
<TheMuso> hyperair: Uplaoded.
<hyperair> TheMuso: thanks
<TheMuso> hyperair: np
<pitti> Good morning
<larsu> good morning!
<ritz> hi, is indicators-printer maintained ?
<larsu> ritz: not really...
<larsu> what's the issue?
<ritz> thought so
<ritz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/959451
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 959451 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "Credentials from gnome-keyring is not used while printing" [Low,In progress]
<ritz> are we deprecating this in favour of system-config-printer ?
<ritz> or will we implement a different solution ( for ubuntu-unified-touch-phone-laptop-... image ) ?
<dholbach> hey hey
<dholbach> setting date and time in trusty does not work - it just opens up the general system settings
<dholbach> is there a workaround?
<dholbach> larsu, ^ do you know?
<larsu> ritz: indicator-printer replaced system-config-printer's applet. We still use s-c-p for other stuff
<larsu> ritz: I don't know about any plans for the phone yet
<larsu> dholbach: let me check...
<larsu> dholbach: do you have unity-control-center installed?
<dholbach> larsu, yep
<ali1234> you need unity-control-center-datetime
<ali1234> it's a new package
<larsu> but it's not pulled in by u-c-c or indicator-datetime?
<ali1234> it ispulled in by ubuntu-desktop^
<ali1234> but not if you're just upgrading
<larsu> dholbach: alternatively you can still start the g-c-c with gnome-control-center.real
<ali1234> don't ask me why, i'm looking for the bug report (popey?)
<larsu> ali1234: not for me after a dist-upgrade
<popey> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-control-center/+bug/1278063
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1278063 in unity-control-center (Ubuntu) "date and time settings missing unity-control-center-datetime not installed" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<ali1234> cheers
<popey> np
<dholbach> ali1234, great, thanks - that made it work
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<JackYu> morning:)
<popey> Morning
 * popey wonders why his keyboard layout keeps (twice in two days) changing on trusty from UK to US 
<seb128> do you have both configured?
<popey> no, only one
<seb128> weird
<seb128> what's the key combinaison to cycle layouts for you?
<seb128> (settings -> text input has it)
<popey> super+space, super+shift+space
<popey> which if i press, just echos a space
<seb128> do you hit those by error maybe?
<seb128> hum, k
<seb128> dunno then
<popey> seemed to happen when i got the new unity settings thing
<seb128> what new unity settings?
<popey> unity-control-center
<popey> may be coincidence, but the layout was fine all last week, only flipped over the weekend. (when ironically I went from the US to UK)
<popey> ok, added US to list of layouts, switched to it and switched back and now my kb layout is correct.
<popey> odd.
<seb128> unity-control-center is like gnome-control-center
<seb128> it's only a configuration UI, it has no service/daemon side
<seb128> it's not running if you don't and click it
<seb128> so not likely it changing your keymaps
<popey> hm. No idea then â»
<seb128> me neither...
<jibel> I had the same issue with FR->US. I applied latest updates and rebooted, now it's back to french
<seb128> jibel, popey: it changed after some upgrades during a session and get back to normal after reboot then?
<seb128> do you know what got updated when it happeneD?
<jibel> seb128, after an upgrade and a cold boot. I think it was fr in lightdm because I could enter my password but the layout was wrong once logged in. Packages updated during previous upgrade http://paste.ubuntu.com/6908067/
<seb128> jibel, thanks (I don't see any obvious candidate for the issue in that list)
<mlankhorst> oh btw, hello world :P
<lschuetze> Hi, is there a way to get an Indicator without icon with AppIndicator3? I am using python with PyGI currently.
<ali1234> no
<ritz> larsu, hi, again, wrt https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/959451 . running system-config-printer-applet resolves the issue.  indicator-printer seems to be a wrapper around system-config-print for queue management and printer management
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 959451 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "Credentials from gnome-keyring is not used while printing" [Low,In progress]
<ritz> is there a reason why we do not deprecated this in place of s-c-p
<czajkowski> loving Trusty folks thank you :) \o/
<lschuetze> Hi, is there a way to get an Indicator without icon with AppIndicator3? I am using python with PyGI currently.
<larsu> ritz: s-c-p uses a systray applet and I wrote indicator-printer to be a proper indicator
<larsu> ritz: but it's been changed by design to not be an indicator at all anymore
<larsu> I just didn't have the time to update it yet
<seb128> larsu, the issue (if I read the description correctly) is that there is some acl management the indicator doesn't do
<larsu> seb128: according to my last comment on the bug, it seems to be an issue with the print dialog. (I'm not sure right now though, I can't remember the details)
<larsu> but yeah, it passes along empty credentials
<seb128> what is s-c-p-a doing? can we easily do the same thing as a workaround?
<seb128> I don't really understand the issue but it seems like something that would be nice to fix for the lts
<larsu> right. I'll look into it later
<seb128> larsu, thanks
<seb128> larsu, btw, did you see the new comments in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evince/+bug/1277370 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1277370 in evince (Ubuntu) "Now used Aiatana design blocks Evince accessibility usage if the current session is not Unity" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> larsu, I'm not sure if I screwed the merge, but that's the same thing I was seeing on friday, some keybindings don't work under !Unity
<larsu> right
<larsu> looks like at least the first comment is about that
<larsu> the second one isn't a regression, but we can talk about it
<larsu> (changing Ctrl+Left to be used for jumping word when caret navigation is turned on)
<larsu> seb128: is ubuntu5 the one from last FridaY?
<seb128> (seems reasonable to me)
<larsu> ah, seems like it
<seb128> yes, ubuntu5 is the one with your fixes
<seb128> but I'm not ruling out that I screwed something when I reconsiliated the revisions I forgot to push and your merge request
<seb128> can you check that what you get from lp:~ubuntu-desktop/evince/ubuntu bzr bd-do correctly includes the fix your had?
<seb128> you
<larsu> hm, ubuntu5 crashes on Ctrl+S for me due to a double-free
<seb128> urg
<larsu> yeah let me check
<seb128> same here for ctrl-s
<larsu> the caret-navigation thing works fine here
<larsu> Ctrl+S is broken in my build as well
<seb128> I didn't try the caret navigation, but I had the keybindings not working under g-s on friday
<larsu> right, I'll test that after fixing the crash
<larsu> I already know the issue, doesn't seem very related to my patches
<seb128> the keybindings or the ctrl-S?
<larsu> the ctrl+s
<larsu> oh, it is :(
 * larsu hides in shame
<larsu> seb128: gotta go to the doctor and lunch first, though
<seb128> larsu, ok, no problem, good luck with the doctor and enjoy lunch!
<ritz> larsu, so, updating s-c-p to support indicator features would help ?
<desrt> hello europeans and just-returned americans
<seb128> desrt, hey, how are you? had a good trip back?
<desrt> yup
<desrt> very nice
<desrt> had a nice ubuntu-using seatmate :)
<desrt> it's kinda neat how this sort of thing happens more and more often
<seb128> nice
<desrt> the usual response these days is at least "oh ya.. i've heard of that" instead of "huh?"
<desrt> and every now and then you get someone who has actually tried it :)
<mdeslaur> desrt: cool. were they using unity?
<desrt> mdeslaur: they didn't have it on their laptop
<mdeslaur> oh, I see
<desrt> although i ran into another guy once on a bus on the way to the airport who asked for directions... and for some random reason started talking to the guy.... and came to the topic of the fact that i was travelling for free software.... and he said "oh.  i use suse... a friend of mine set it up..."
<desrt> i asked him "ah... are you using kde or gnome?"... "uh.... i don't know.... kde, i think?"
<mdeslaur> hehe
<desrt> when he took it out at the airport, gnome
<desrt> tells you all you need to know about the desktop holy wars :)
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> "uh... i don't know.... firefox?"
<mdeslaur> yes, I have to constantly remind myself that reddit isn't our target market :)
<desrt> that guy was cool... environmental engineer from france who was working at a freshwaters facility on lake ontario
<desrt> as part of a canada<->france governmental exchange program
<desrt> i really like it when non-computer-people are using our stuff
<mlankhorst> I like not thinking about the defaults ;)
<GunnarHj> seb128: ping?
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey
<GunnarHj> seb128: Hi Seb!
<GunnarHj> seb128: Question about ubuntu-docs?
<seb128> sorry, ctrl-W on the wrong screen
<GunnarHj> seb128: Question about ubuntu-docs?
<seb128> GunnarHj, sure (I'm probably not the best placed to reply about those but I can try)
<GunnarHj> seb128: We try to document the "release process" wrt ubuntu-docs. In my world it ought to be easiest to create a source package from lp:ubuntu-docs and upload that, and let lp:ubuntu/ubuntu-docs be automatically updated. Is there anything that speaks against that?
<seb128> that sounds good/logical
<GunnarHj> seb128: I know that you normally are expected to both commit to the ubuntu branch and upload. That's why I asked.
<seb128> well, if the upstream branch is the main location for the package as well that works fine
<seb128> that's what we do for most projects nowadays
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, thanks, that's what I wanted to hear. :)
<Sweetshark> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libetonyek/+bug/1277152/comments/5 <- FYI, Ill stay with internal libetonyek.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1277152 in libetonyek (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libetoneyek needed as b-d for libreoffice" [Low,Won't fix]
<seb128> Sweetshark, ok
<seb128> larsu, getting anywhere with those evince issues? do you need debug infos from me?
<larsu> seb128: nope, preparing a patch for the Ctrl+S issue right now
<seb128> larsu, great, thanks
<larsu> I haven't been able to reproduce the other issues he mentioned
<larsu> do you still have them?
<larsu> !Unity not working, I mean
<seb128> yes
<ubot2> larsu: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<seb128> let me retry to be sure
<larsu> ubot2: sorry, my bad.
<ubot2> Factoid 'sorry, my bad.' not found
<larsu> :)
<seb128> back
<seb128> larsu, sorry, something made user switching really unhappy on my box
<seb128> when I log out from sessions I get no X working
<seb128> need to test if that's the intel driver updates or lightdm
<seb128> larsu, anyway, still the same issue, under gnome-shell e.g f9 doesn't work
<larsu> seb128: ah I still had a locally-built version on my machine. I can reproduce with ubuntu5
<larsu> now I wonder what the differences were...
<seb128> larsu, as said, I don't rule out me screwing up the merge
<larsu> it looks fine so far. I'm rebuilding it right now
<seb128> there was a conflict in one of the debian/patches and diff on diff can be tricky
<larsu> ya :)
<sil2100> seb128: ping!
<seb128> sil2100, hey
<sil2100> seb128: hi! Can I borrow you for some preNEWing? ;)
<sil2100> seb128: when do you EOD today?
<seb128> sil2100, I'm going for sport in some 10 minutes, but feel free to give me the names and I can review them tomorrow morning when I start
<asac> sil2100: noone else we can try?
<asac> seb128: https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/landing-003/+packages
<asac> unity-scopes-scopes
<asac> :)
<asac> err unity-scope-scopes
<seb128> asac, sil2100: +1 for that source, I just reviewed it, it's a trivial one
<sil2100> \o/
<popey> grr, seb128 my laptop has just randomly flipped to US layout again!
<sil2100> seb128: can you check if the whitelist is updated?
<sil2100> (I guess we still need that to be done?)
<popey> indicator still shows UK
<sil2100> No, wait... hmm
 * sil2100 is confused
<sil2100> We didn't use CITrain yet for new packages, so I don't even know where from does it take the whitelist
<seb128> popey, :/
<popey> no idea what's causing it... very odd
<kenvandine> popey, you spent a week in the US... we figure you are ready for a change :)
<popey> hah
<popey> hey, I'm all for eating meat and dancing on tables!
<popey> Keyboard layouts however, no.
<kenvandine> haha... shhhhhhh
<kenvandine> :-D
<kenvandine> seb128, remember the greek place we went to a couple years ago?  we went back :)
<seb128> kenvandine, did you dance on the table? :p
<kenvandine> of course!
<seb128> ;-)
<larsu> seb128: building evince for hopefully the last time :-/
 * larsu really hates accels in 3.10
<seb128> :-(
<larsu> seems to work now though
<seb128> larsu, what was the issue?
<larsu> with a small workaround - desrt redid accel handling in 3.12 so I didn't bother to fix it in 3.10
<larsu> seb128: the accels from the menu xml don't get picked up by the window
<larsu> calling gtk_application_set_accelerator() in addition makes it work
<seb128> k
<larsu> the Ctrl+S issue was my mistake
<larsu> I'll mr both in the same branch
<seb128> hopefully we are gold this time ;-)
<larsu> ya....
<seb128> feel free to just commit to your git and point me to the commits
<seb128> e.g don't bother with quilt if you don't want to
<seb128> I can easily cherrypick diffs
<larsu> I already imported it into the package because I wanted to makes sure it works this time
<seb128> k
<larsu> by building the package itself
<larsu> (hence the wait...)
<seb128> larsu, take your time, I've to go for sport so that's going to be for tomorrow for me anywa
<seb128> have a nice evening everyone
<seb128> see you tomorrow
<larsu> seb128: enojoy!
<larsu> *enjoy
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, is it possible for you to try running the key grabber AP tests again with this branch? it just adds some extra debug output: https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/compiz/debug-gnome-key-grabber
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Yeah, I'll do that now.
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: I have some results from the debugging you asked me to do.
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, hey, thanks
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: So I ended up just using printf's instead because I couldn't get Compiz debug output to work on my setup.
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: But this is what was ouputted when I ran the failing test:
<ChrisTownsend> grad 38 0xd
<ChrisTownsend> ungrab 38 0xd
<ChrisTownsend> Err, grab
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, is there any more than that?
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Not when the test is ran.
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: There is more when Compiz starts.  Do you need that?
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, did you replace all of the compLogMessage's? i'm hoping you didn't happen to miss some of them
<attente_> (btw i was adding the --verbose flag to unity to get them to appear)
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: This is only for the test_grab_accelerator test that is failing.
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Yes, all of the one's you added.
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Oh, --verbose?  I was using --debug.  Let me switch it back and try that, but I think it will be the same.
<attente_> oh ok
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, do global shortcuts work at all for you?
<attente_> i mean the ones that g-s-d normally provides
<attente_> like the volume up/down buttons
<attente_> or the next/previous input source ones
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Doesn't appear they are.
<attente_> so bizarre... :S
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: So the same thing with --verbose.
<attente_> ok
<attente_> can you try again: dbus-send --session --dest=org.gnome.Shell --print-reply /org/gnome/Shell org.gnome.Shell.GrabAccelerator string:'<Shift><Control><Alt>a' uint32:0
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Ok
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Then dbus-monitor?
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, what is the reply for that send?
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, it seems so strange that the tests fail and none of the g-s-d keybindings work
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: method return sender=:1.875 -> dest=:1.887 reply_serial=2
<ChrisTownsend>     uint32 2
<attente_> but your alt+f is still opening in the panel
<attente_> correct?
<ChrisTownsend> Yes, alt+f opens the menu in the Panel.
<attente_> that suggests to me that the key grabber dbus server is down
<attente_> ok, now 'dbus-monitor member=AcceleratorActivated'
<attente_> and ctrl+shift+alt+a again
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Nothing is outputted.
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, dbus-send --session --dest=org.gnome.Shell --print-reply /org/gnome/Shell org.gnome.Shell.UngrabAccelerator uint32:2
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Ok
<attente_> any reply?
<ChrisTownsend> method return sender=:1.875 -> dest=:1.890 reply_serial=2
<ChrisTownsend>      boolean true
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, do you have any special compiz plugins installed?
<attente_> hmm.. no that can't be it...
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, can you killall gnome-settings-daemon?
<attente_> then try again dbus-send --session --dest=org.gnome.Shell --print-reply /org/gnome/Shell org.gnome.Shell.GrabAccelerator string:'<Shift><Control><Alt>a' uint32:0
<attente_> i'm wondering why g-s-d doesn't seem to be registering its accelerators
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Umm, this may be telling.  There is no gnome-settings-daemon process running.
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: I'm going to reboot and see if it comes back.
<attente_> wow, that's really strange
<attente_> ok
<ChrisTownsend> It is strange.
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Still no g-s-d.  What is up with my system?????
<attente_> :(
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: I can start it manually, right?
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, 'start gnome-settings-daemon'
<attente_> i hope so...
<attente_> but it's weird that it's in such a state as to not start with the session
<ChrisTownsend> Yeah, very strange.  It's running now.  I'll try the test and see what happens.
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, i guess the tests will still fail
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, but i'm wondering if your g-s-d keybindings work again
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Yes, g-s-d keybindings work now
<attente_> ok, can you do 'dbus-monitor member=AcceleratorActivated' again and try using some of those keybindings?
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: I get no output from those keybindings.
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, but the keybindings still have an effect?
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Yes
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, apt-cache policy gnome-settings-daemon
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Uh, I didn't notice, but I guess an update overwrote your g-s-d package I installed.  3.8.6.1-0ubuntu8
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, ah, ok
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: I only installed your package not using your PPA.
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, i guess this is still only half the problem though
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Right
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, can you downgrade g-s-d, restart it, and then dbus-monitor member=AcceleratorActivated again?
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Yeah, I'll try that.
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Bah, it won't let me because the gnome-settings-daemon-schemas cannot be downgraded.
<attente_> ooph.
<attente_> ok, let me upload a new one
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Ok
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, ok, i think i see what happened. it must be the g-s-d fork
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: I think this new package is also when my g-s-d started to fail starting.
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, ok, i'll have to apply the changes to unity-settings-daemon instead
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, thanks for your help, i'll let you know when it's ready
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Ok, np
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, do you actually have unity-settings-daemon installed?
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: I didn't, but now I do.
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, i can't seem to replicate the problem where your g-s-d isn't running, mine still runs and i don't have u-s-d installed
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: I honestly have no idea why it would not start.  u-s-d starts up on session start though.
 * ChrisTownsend Shrugs
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, you manually installed u-s-d?
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Yes
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, ok, i'm not sure what the right course of action is here
<attente_> robert_ancell, hey
<robert_ancell> attente_, hello
<attente_> robert_ancell, is there an issue where g-s-d wouldn't start up in the unity session because of the fork?
<robert_ancell> attente_, did you manually install u-s-d?
<attente_> robert_ancell, i didn't, but ChrisTownsend seemed to encounter that problem earlier
<robert_ancell> attente_, it was working for me, but it should be opt-in. xnox was playing around with the upstart config though
<Laney> buh
<Laney> the upstart changes went in
<ChrisTownsend> Right, I had latest g-s-d installed with no u-s-d installed and g-s-d would not start on session start up.  I manually installed u-s-d and not u-s-d starts fine.
<Laney> -start on started dbus and starting gnome-session
<ChrisTownsend> s/not/now
<xnox> attente_: please do $ apt-cache policy libunity-core-6.0-8 gnome-settings-daemon unity-settings-daemon
<Laney> +start on started dbus and starting gnome-session INSTANCE!=ubuntu
<Laney> that is bad if we don't pull in u-s-d in some way
<xnox> Laney: there is an override in libunity-core-6.0-8 to start gnome-settings-daemon, if there is no unity-settings-daemon, until unity-settings-daemon is pulled in by default.
<xnox> attente_: and paste the output somewhere =)
<attente_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6911569/
<attente_> xnox, ^
<attente_> xnox, but this isn't my issue i guess, somehow ChrisTownsend got into that state
<ChrisTownsend> Ah, libunity-core-6.0-8 was uninstalled due to me installing libunity-core-6.0-9 from the Unity daily-build PPA.
<xnox> ChrisTownsend: yeap, that would make things bad...
<attente_> bah. ok. my fault, sorry ChrisTownsend!
<xnox> robert_ancell: how far up the stack are we to make unity-settings-daemon the default?
<Laney> man, that is weird
<Laney> I'd have just waited before uploading it and done all the changes at once
<ChrisTownsend> Sorry guys for my Frankenstein system!
<xnox> ChrisTownsend: attente_: sorry about that, I should make merge proposal into unity.
<robert_ancell> xnox, "far up the stack"?
<xnox> Laney: that's what I wanted, that's why i had it blocked in -proposed.
<xnox> Laney: but somehow we ended up thinking on friday that gnome-settings-daemon is good to be unblocked into release pocket....
<xnox> robert_ancell: there was a tracking bug to switch dependencies, wasn't there?
<robert_ancell> xnox, bug 1277487
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1277487 in unity-greeter (Ubuntu) "Create Unity Settings Daemon so can remain on old GNOME Settings Daemon version" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1277487
<xnox> right that.
<xnox> robert_ancell: i guess we can seed unity-settings-daemon & gnome-settings-daemon.
<xnox> actually seed unity-settings-deamon only and drop gnome-settings-daemon.
<xnox> unity-s-d will pull in g-s-d-schemas and those remaining applications that depend on gnome-settings-daemon will pull it in, until we do all the uploads for s/gnome-settings-daemon/gnome-settings-daemon-schemas/
<kgunn> robert_ancell: yo!
<robert_ancell> kgunn, how's is going?
<robert_ancell> sure
<xnox> tedg: how do i land https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/indicator-session/unity-settings-daemon/+merge/205421 ? it's all good to go.
<tedg> xnox, thostr is the landing engineer for that project, so you'll have to ask him.
<tedg> xnox, He'll have to get it into the silo request spreadsheet, and then... there's process.
<xnox> tedg: what does a landing engineer means? why can't i be the lander of this branch? Surely anyone who can dput should be able to be the "landing" engineer.
<tedg> xnox, One would think.
<xnox> thostr, if you are in current working timezone and not on vacation and not otherwise swamped with high priority work, what needs to happen to land above branch into the archive?
<xnox> tedg: i have this wonderful command called "dput" and it's a pretty good landing robot =)
<tedg> xnox, It would be against the release process for me to recommend distro patching it and saving yourself a day's work.
<ali1234> hi tedg, how is the indicator stuff going?
<Laney> xnox: I'm not sure I knew that the upstart stuff was in there
<Laney> thought it was just the split
<Laney> oh well
<xnox> Laney: well, it was all of our changes as well -> that is: g-s-d start on !=ubuntu and u-s-d start on =ubuntu
<xnox> trickery that we designed.
<Laney> yeah I guess I got the wrong end of the stick
<Laney> thought they would just be put into bzr
<xnox> to be fair, if i didn't upload, i would have lost context about the "solution" by today =)
<xnox> Laney: they were committed into version control, -proposed branch... using dput. =)))))))) that's my preferred version control system these days.
<Laney> heh
<tedg> ali1234, Eh, okay.  Getting bogged down in non-code stuff, but I very much have fixing that on the TODO list.
<ali1234> tedg: we really need the fix for xubuntu, because we want to land gtk3 indicators this cycle, and currently our testers cannot test it
<ochosi> +1
<xnox> ali1234: is there something you need sponsoring?
<xnox> ali1234: i am also indicator developer.
<tedg> ali1234, I understand, sorry to take this long on it.
<ali1234> xnox: i have a MR that goes on top of the existing upstart indicator work
<xnox> ali1234: link?
<ali1234> https://code.launchpad.net/~a-j-buxton/libindicator/remove-timeout/+merge/198070
<tedg> xnox, It's basically finishing the session service transition for indicators.
<tedg> We can't land that until I get all the indicators cleaned up.
<ochosi> tedg: how many are missing atm?
<tedg> ochosi, messaging is the big one, but I think some of the others aren't right.  They're not using the Upstart XDG dirs, so they're kinda flaky.
<xnox> tedg: chicken and egg, eh? can't have both no-trigger-activation and auto-shutdown.
<ali1234> xnox: exactly, it causes a race condition
<tedg> It's really more about ditching all the process management code in libindicator, it fights with whoever *should* be managing the process.
<xnox> tedg: or do we have a lifecycle manager to start us up?
<xnox> (on the phone that is)
<tedg> On the phone Upstart does the session management.
<tedg> Or, management of the session.
<tedg> Technically "session management" is done by unity-mir.
<tedg> Wow, I'm not really sure I cleared anything up there.
<ochosi> tedg: hm, is there an ETA/deadline for the indicator work to be finished?
<Laney> feature freeze is in 10 days :-)
<tedg> ochosi, I think the... yes, what Laney said :-)
<ali1234> yeah but since you already cunningly half-pushed the changes, technically FF does not apply :)
<ochosi> well, does it apply to xubuntu then if we push the gtk3-indicator-related stuff after FF?
<ali1234> yes
<ali1234> this is the exact same situation that caused them not to get landed last cycle
<Laney> sure it does, the rest of the changes are still features
<Laney> it'd be polite to give flavours time to get their ducks in a row before feature freeze too ...
<ali1234> +1
 * ochosi admits he was asking rhetorically, trying to make a point
<Laney> to the bed-mobile!
<ochosi> well i guess we should half-cunningly push our changes then
<ali1234> yeah
<ali1234> well it would help if upstream would do a release too
<ochosi> yeah, i sent an email about that a few days ago (still waiting for a reply)
<ochosi> don't think we have any more time to wait
<ali1234> ochosi: worst case we can always stuff the workaround variable somewhere in the xfce environment
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-02-11
<MavKen> my neighbor is on my wifi... is there anything I can do to scare him?
<sarnold> best would be to fix your wiki.
<sarnold> manipulating his traffic while it goes through your network may introduce legal liabilities. best to just shut it down and be done with it.
<MavKen> ok
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<Laney> morning!
<larsu> morning!
<Laney> hey larsu, wie gehts?
<seb128> hey Laney, larsu, how are you?
<Laney> happy that I work from home ;-)
<Laney> weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet
<seb128> haha
<Laney> otherwise good! you?
<larsu> Laney: good thanks!
<seb128> I'm ok, I got a cold a friday which is slightly annoying, but I'm slowly getting over it, it seems
<Laney> oh I wanted to show you something ...
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ofono/+bug/1276699/comments/2
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1276699 in ofono (Ubuntu) "scan-for-operator script fails: org.ofono.Error.Failed: Operation failed" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<Laney> " we currently only support automatic network registration, and thus scanning is forbidden."
<seb128> shrug, kenvandine said it used to work!
<Laney> it did
<seb128> ok, so the title is misleading ;-)
<Laney> so do we need to take that feature out ...
<seb128> but "good", it's not our fault
<seb128> yeah, I'm going to talk to them though
<seb128> that one seems like a basic feature, it sucks to take it out
<Laney> I'm pretty sure it did work before
<Laney> so maybe he is mistaken
<seb128> though I've to admit in practice autoconnect is probably good enough for most users
<seb128> yeah
<Laney> I had to use it in the usa last time because roaming didn't work
<seb128> let's talk to awe or rsalveti when they are online
<Laney> k, /me patch pilots
<seb128> Laney, enjoy!
<seb128> larsu, don't bother arguing with that guy on the evince bug, I guess he's going to be happy enough once the keybindings issue is resolved
<Laney> after the Ã¼ber dist-upgrade of doom
<seb128> I saw all indicators landed, I wonder if that comes with any new bug
 * seb128 starts update-manager
<larsu> seb128: I'm not arguing, but trying to explain. I wonder why F10 doesn't open the menu on unity anymore...
<seb128> larsu, because there is no cog menu on unity?
<larsu> F10 used to open the global menu
<larsu> I'll ask attente later today
<seb128> that's an attente issue
<seb128> I think he's working on it
<larsu> ya, it's either an issue in the menus or the global keyboard shortcuts
<larsu> both attente issues :)
<larsu> man, he sure picked the easy problems on our desktop...
<seb128> lol
<seb128> you have to give him credits for picking those issues and sticking to them until they are fixed!
<darkxst> hi seb128
<seb128> darkxst, hey, how are you?
<darkxst> good, bit cooler now ;)
<seb128> come to Europe if you like cold
<seb128> or not, go to Canada I guess
<seb128> darkxst, what's the plan for external panels in g-c-c-vanilla? which ones do you want to keep?
<Laney> we can do wet https://witness.theguardian.com/assignment/52f0dd85e4b08e6aaede60d3
<seb128> hehe
<darkxst> seb128, mainly dejadup, UOA (not installed by default but we have users using it)
<seb128> darkxst, UOA is going to be problematic I think, would a standalone GUI work for it?
<darkxst> seb128, yes
<seb128> I'm saying that because robert_ancell had a look at dual building it for u-c-c and g-c-c and mostly gave up
<seb128> so I think they want to do what deja-dup is doing, having a standlone interface for non Unity
<darkxst> gufw, but that might just be a desktop link
<seb128> k
<darkxst> likewise with ubuntuone
<Laney> darkxst: what's the parent branch of this one you gave me?
<seb128> the changelog of that branch is weird
<darkxst> Laney, robert_ancells
<Laney> I'm kind of confused
<Laney> why didn't he branch off of the current g-c-c one?
<seb128> I would expect a "drop <list of Ubuntu patches>" on top of the current version
<darkxst> he dropped everything...
<darkxst> and I added back in the bits that are required
<seb128> that seems the wrong strategy
<darkxst> seb128, it wasn't my strategy!
<seb128> imho you should take the current "trunk" from trusty and drop things you do'nt want
<seb128> yeah
<Laney> indeed
<seb128> what's I'm saying is "feel free to discard what robert_ancell did"
<Laney> I'd rebase on the ubuntu-desktop branch
<Laney> if I were you
<seb128> I doubt he has much interest in it, he just tried to get things moving
<darkxst> right, I don't either if we can still sneak in that gnome-desktop transition (that makes seb128 so nervous)
<darkxst> seb128, fwiw config migration is not an issue, since it still uses the same file, but more of a backup for persistant storage
<seb128> good
<seb128> well, I'm too busy to help driving that transition through, and it makes me nervous
<seb128> I'm not going to block it if you find somebody wanting to take responsibility for it/do the uploads though
<seb128> you can try with Laney or other
<seb128> robert_ancell seems to share my opinion that we should better delay that one after the LTS, for the record (we discussed it last week)
<Laney> I didn't follow the issues really
<darkxst> Laney, all the XRANDR code move from gnome-deskop into a mutter
<seb128> basically gnome-desktop replaced their gnome_rr xrandr api to call a new dbus servic
<darkxst> so I ripped that code and made a standalone daemon which seems to work well
<darkxst> g-s-d obviously needs a bunch of git patches to adapt, g-c-c is much more trivial
<seb128> gnome-screensaver and others also use that API and are going to do patching if we do that
<seb128> but the bit that makes me most nervous is changing a xrandr library but a new, virtually untested for us, dbus service
<darkxst> seb128, its largely the same code
<lifeless> I sometimes thing Gnome has gone crazy w.r.t. DBUS
<lifeless> whats wrong with using component specific APIs like XRANDR
<Laney> do a PPA with all of the packages and a call for testing on -devel?
<Laney> anwyay, regarding g-c-c - can you put the changes back on top of the current branch?
<darkxst> lifeless, the whole point was to abstract away the display server from gnome-desktop
<darkxst> Laney, yes will rebase, but won't be tonight
<Laney> okay, no problem
<Laney> cyphermox_: do you have commit to network-manager?
<Laney> upstream
<seb128> Laney, if he doesn't he most likely know upstream enough to get stuff commited
<seb128> either way you can bounce patches his way I think ;-)
<Laney> that was my backup hope
<Laney> cyphermox_: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=663774
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 663774 in nm-applet "Country selection dialogue does not react on Enter key" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<lifeless> darkxst: uhm, ok. And DBus is the right answer for that? I would have thought an abstraction library, but thats just me.
<seb128> larsu, https://code.launchpad.net/~samvasko/libappindicator/libappindicator/+merge/204202 ... looks fine to you? (I just crossed it while looking at pending merge requests)
<larsu> seb128: yep, looks fine to me. Shall I approve?
<seb128> larsu, +1 from me, thanks
<seb128> Laney, do you know what desktops use g-s-d/u-s-d?
<seb128> out of Unity/gnome-shell of course
<Laney> fallback too
<Laney> and there are sessions that are fallback but with different window managers
<seb128> Laney, what is fallback likely to use? g-s-d or u-s-d?
<Laney> but you can think of those as mostly the same
<seb128> asked differently, do we need to keep the legacy key grabber in u-s-d
<Laney> g?
<darkxst> seb128, yes, I see all the fallback desktops using u- variants
<seb128> darkxst, for the control-center yes, I was wondering for the settings daemon
<darkxst> seb128, same
<seb128> I wonder if we need a rotw-s-d
<seb128> rest-of-the-world-settings-daemon :p
<darkxst> right now, u-s-d should fit the rest of the world
<seb128> darkxst, that's convenient for you, means we get to keep the legacy code there
<seb128> I'm not really wanting to do that though
<Laney> doesn't compiz need the keygrabber?
<seb128> I wanted to take the opportunity to clean stuff we don't use/need
<seb128> no
<seb128> attente is moving that to compiz, same way GNOME moved it to gnome-shell
<seb128> that's the only reliable way to do grabbing
<Laney> right now it does though
<darkxst> seb128, in that case the fallbacks can you that in compiz?
<seb128> e.g to key modifier only keys to work
<seb128> some fallbacks session don't use compiz
<darkxst> although I suppose some insist on using oldschool metacity
<seb128> so we can fix things for those in compÃ®z
<seb128> well
<seb128> or some are Laney and use custom wms
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> (can't even remember the name of that wm now)
<Laney> it's still panel + gsd
<seb128> xmodmap?
<Laney> monad
<seb128> close :p
<seb128> Laney, context is https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/gnome-settings-daemon/gnome-key-grabber/+merge/202758
<seb128> well I guess it's not the end of the world to keep the legacy grabber in there
<seb128> it's just more code to maintain
<Laney> I see
<Laney> that stuff seems pretty stable in practice though
<seb128> right, as said it's just cruft/old code to keep around
<seb128> the reason I want to clean it out is the same that made GNOME drop their fallback code
<seb128> less code makes the job easier for us
<seb128> but as said, no big deal for that one, we can keep it at least for the LTS
<Laney> as it is the fallback sessions will get gsd btw
<seb128> darkxst just said he expect those to use usd
<darkxst> seb128, I have no intentions of maintaining legacy desktops, surely that should fall onto the teams that still want to use them?
<Laney> yep
<Laney> but somebody has to fix it to do that
<seb128> darkxst, I can copy/paste what you just wrote
<seb128> darkxst, gnome-classic is not more an Unity session than it is a GNOME one, it's rather closer from a  GNOME one in fact
<darkxst> seb128, gnome classic *IS* gnome-shell
<seb128> gnome-panel-session
<seb128> whatever that's called
<darkxst> no it is gnome-shell
<darkxst> with some extensions
<seb128> well, what Laney is using
<seb128> and that's not gnome-shell
<Laney> fallback
<seb128> we have users who still run gnome-panel with the wm of their choice
<darkxst> there are some issues with UI expectations, but gnome classic is technology wise identical
<Laney> or whatever it's really called
<darkxst> gnome-panel aka fallback, would be much better using Unity stuff
<darkxst> they use the same indicators etc
<darkxst> edubuntu are going to switch over to Unity for XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP
<seb128> right, for UI bits it makes sense
<darkxst> (for gnome-flashback)
<seb128> g-s-d I'm unsure about
<Laney> Sweetshark: have you seen bug #1200277 is still alive?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1200277 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "[LibreOffice] - libreoffice-writer.desktop when drag/drop to desktop, 100% broken. " [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1200277
<darkxst> seb128, the biggest problem here is there is no distinction between UI bit and backend bits
<darkxst> backend wise, gnome-panel etc is very similar to Unity (apart from the few extra integrations you have)
<seb128> it's not that far from GNOME either
<Laney> haha
<seb128> you just don't want to have to keep maintaining the legacy code needed for those session (which I understand, but I don't want either ;-)
<darkxst> seb128, do you have any idea how much legacy code is hanging around to support Unity/panel sessions?
<seb128> I think we are eventually going to need to say "if you use a non gnome-shell/compiz wm, you are on your own"
<seb128> but that would be unkind to do that before the LTS
<seb128> darkxst, I've been putting those patches in for the most part, so yes
<darkxst> right, and apart from the possible move of keygrabber into compiz, everything is needed by unity also
<seb128> right, which is why we are making u-c-c/u-s-d
<seb128> not sure what we are discussing at this point
<seb128> out of
<seb128> Laney, nobody wants to maintain legacy code for you it seems...
<darkxst> no one wants the legacy code!
<seb128> right
<seb128> well, I guess we are going to keep it in u-s-d until it's creating enough issues that we decide that those sessions to find a solution that doesn't put the burden on us
<Laney> I think highvoltage does some upstream flashback maintenance :-)
<seb128> need to find*
<darkxst> mitya as wall
<darkxst> well even
<darkxst> perhaps all the legacy fanatics can move to MATE
<seb128> Laney, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/1274740/comments/21 btw
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1274740 in nautilus (Ubuntu) "Re-enable traditional titlebar on 'gnome-but-not-shell' sessions too" [Low,Confirmed]
<seb128> Laney, we were discussing that last week
<darkxst> altough I have no idea where that is at
<seb128> yeah, me neither*
<Laney> seb128: nice, I can't remember the details from before
<seb128> Laney, it's early enough in the cycle than we can deal with issues
<Laney> I made some patches over the weekend to set that for the indicators ;-)
<seb128> and I trust Dmitry to know what he is doing
<seb128> nice ;-)
<darkxst> Laney, Jeremy switched over flashback to Unity in past, then straight away reverted it since it was buggy
<seb128> do you remember what was buggy?
<darkxst> no, but I checked recently, as far as I can tell that was only due to the OnlyShowIn fields in the various desktop files
<darkxst> gnome-panel, nautilus-classic and indicator*
<seb128> ok, that's what we were discussing, Laney remembered that it was tried but not the reasons it didn't work/what was to be resolved
<darkxst> indicator ones will need a autostart condition I suppose
<darkxst> GNOME3 unless-session Unity
<seb128> we use upstart for those in Unity
<darkxst> oh, then it should be fine
<seb128> so they can do what they need with the desktop
<darkxst> which is just add Unity to them
<darkxst> offtopic, we have been hitting a weird bug where gdm restarts on upgrade, could that be some upstart thing?
<seb128> wasn't that https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm/3.10.0.1-0ubuntu2 ?
<darkxst> apparently not, that did work at the time when I tested it, but its still happening now
<seb128> but I doubt it's an upstart thing
<seb128> is gdm upstart managed nowadays?
<seb128> if it is the job didn't change in ages and usually they don't do restart, just start/stop and the stop for a dm is on init level change
<darkxst> I wouldnt have thought so
<darkxst> however, when I built and test the 3.10 package it was fine
<darkxst> (i.e Dec sometime)
<seb128> can you reproduce the issue?
<darkxst> sure, just reinstall gdm while gdm is running, and it brings down the entire session
<seb128> what does "sudo status gdm" says?
<seb128> does it restart when that happens or just goes down?
<darkxst> seb128, it restarts, but takes some time
<seb128> hum, k
<seb128> I can try having a look at it in a vm today
<darkxst> I can't even switch to a vm once it goes down
<seb128> that seems like a kernel/xorg issue to me
<darkxst> but ssh says: gdm start/running, process 4064
<darkxst> and apparently this time it is coming back up
<seb128> no segfault/sigabrt in the Xorg.*
<seb128> no apport repport?
<seb128> did the pid change?
<darkxst> no crash logs
<darkxst> X still seems happy enough
<darkxst> no idea if the PID changed
<seb128> you can maybe try to sudo gdb -p $(pidof gdm)
<seb128> (gdb) c
<seb128> then reinstall
<seb128> and see what happens in the gdb
<seb128> do that from a ssh
<darkxst> seb128, x tried to restart and failed
<seb128> why did it try to restart?
<seb128> debian
<darkxst> I don't get any logs of that
<darkxst> gdm tries to fire up on a new dispaly (:1) and fails
<seb128> when did that issue start?
<darkxst> but on my real machine, upgrade will result in gdm restarting
<darkxst> late Jan
<seb128> k, so not the new xorg
<seb128> I've problem with user switching for some days, I blame new xorg/intel
<seb128> but that's probably different
<darkxst> seb128, sometime before 22nd Jan
<seb128> hum, k
<darkxst> and my gdm changelog is dated way back in Nov
<darkxst> but it was certainly tested through dec
<seb128> what do you mean? you don't have the recent fix from trusty?
<darkxst> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm/3.10.0.1-0ubuntu1
<darkxst> Of I have the recent fix
<darkxst> ^of course
<seb128> k
<seb128> I can try having a look later, need to set up a vm or try on my real box (but testing needs closing/restarting sessions)
<darkxst> seb128, it will happen in a vm too
<seb128> good, makes debugging easier ;-)
<darkxst> just gdm fails to actually restart in my vmware VM's, whereas it does on real hardware
 * darkxst could not live without VM's although I am running out of diskspace
<seb128> darkxst, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm/+bug/1266496 seems still valid (look through recent reports)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1266496 in gdm (Ubuntu) "extra "fi" in file" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> ooh, just started snowing
<seb128> Laney, that's another kind of weet ;-)
<Laney> an exciting one
<seb128> yeah
<Laney> but it won't settle because of the previous wetness
<darkxst> Laney, can you bring some snow ;)
<Laney> sure, I'll pack it inside a thermos and send it over
<darkxst> Laney, a 40ft container would be better ;)
<darkxst> seb128, right, though I can't see how that would cause this issue
<darkxst> but will fix
<seb128> yeah, it's not likely it, I just crossed the bug while looking at reports
<seb128> thanks
<darkxst> seb128, I havent seen a single report of this, since people only submit bugs when prompted right? and gdm doesnt update that often...
<seb128> right
<Laney> woah, what happened
<Laney> 11/02 11:20:15 <Laney> seb128: can you push e-d-s please?
<seb128> Laney, did your box reboot by itself again?
<Laney> did that send?
<Laney> freenode lagged out
<seb128> Laney, "push"? there is a vcs?
<Laney> this is on a different server :-)
<Laney> ~ubuntu-desktop/e-d-s/ubuntu
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> sure, sorry about that
<Laney> cheers, np
<seb128> Laney, ok, vcs updated
<Laney> merci!
<seb128> de rien
<Laney> mlankhorst: was that ld crashing bug only on i386?
<Laney> i.e. not amd64?
<mlankhorst> yeah
<Laney> mmk
<xnox> MUAHAHA =) http://people.canonical.com/~xnox/gtk3-qmlscene.png
<xnox> this is qmlscene, loading Desktop Components gallery.... using gtk3 instead of gtk2 =) here be dragons.
<ogra_> xnox, dude !
<xnox> and it's only a 260 lines patch so far. https://codereview.qt-project.org/#change,77853
<seb128> xnox, I'm not sure to grasp what that is doing
<seb128> xnox, you are making qt use gtk widgets? ;-)
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> evil ...
<ogra_> that will get you all sorts of political issues :)
<xnox> seb128: more specifically, it already knows how to use gtk _2_ widgets, i'm making it use gtk _3_ widgets/themes instead =)
<seb128> that seems a weird concept
<xnox> ogra_: my evil plan is to rewrite ubiquity using qt/qml and nobody to notice the difference.
<ogra_> haha
<xnox> seb128: well, do you find mumble & skype out of place in terms of theming on ubuntu?
<seb128> xnox, they do, but I would think the fix there is to make a Qt theme matching our desktop one
<xnox> (e.g. the buttons are fully pale orange, instead of having gtk3 orange aura)
<xnox> seb128: Making qt themes is a pain, and at the moment, it simply dlopens gtk2 renders widgets and copies the pixmap back into QImage and slaps it onto QWindow.
<xnox> seb128: and that ends up looking far more native, then trying to maintain a parallel theme.
<xnox> sans gtk3 and gtk2 theme missmatches.
<seb128> k
<xnox> firefox is moving to gtk3 finally (patches posted), so it's time for qt as well ;-)
<xnox> then we will be left with google chom[e|ium] and libreoffice.
<xnox> eclipse / swt did move to gtk3, so i'm not sure what's holding libreoffice back.
<mdeslaur> hrm, won't switching firefox to gtk3 break flash?
<mdeslaur> or is that handled by the firefox sandbox now?
<xnox> mdeslaur: no idea, but as far as i remember firefox is sandoxing flash.
<xnox> mdeslaur: but i also thought flash stopped publishing napi plugin, and it's pepper only as part of google chrome....
<mdeslaur> chromium is dropping gtk and moving to their own widget set in the latest dev version I believe
<mdeslaur> xnox: well, the old flash is still supported for another 3 years or so
<xnox> excellent =) or i guess i'll make my mind up once it lands in stable channel.
<mdeslaur> it looks like ass at the moment :P
<mdeslaur> well, like windows ass :)
<xnox> mdeslaur: based on my timelines we will be all using silverlight by then.... oh wait maybe not =) and it will be more like XP never-ending EOL.
<mdeslaur> (by ass, I mean out of place)
<mdeslaur> xnox: lol :)
<xnox> mdeslaur: http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/borowitzreport/2014/02/gates-spends-entire-first-day-back-in-office-trying-to-install-windows-81.html
<mdeslaur> hehe, yes, saw that...funny :)
<xnox> it took me 2 days to figure out how to upgrade stock OEM 8 to 8.1
<mdeslaur> I booted windows 8 on my new laptop just out of curiosity before I blew it away. I had to google search how to turn it off.
<mdeslaur> seriously.
<xnox> turns out pre-loaded crapware, well McAffe antivirus, blogs connections to the 8.1 update servers and thus download just stalls at 0% and no indication how to fix it.
<xnox> lol =) i push power buttons to turn it off =)
<mdeslaur> heh
<seb128> xnox, so, doing an apt-get install --reinstall gdm leads to a console output
<seb128> Preparing to unpack ...deb
<seb128> gdm stop/waiting
<seb128> Unpacking gdm
<seb128> Setting up gdm
<seb128> gdm start/running
<seb128> xnox, do you know what could make gdm change to stop before the unpacking?
<seb128> the upstart script has
<seb128> stop on runlevel [016]
<seb128> that doesn't make sense to me
<xnox> seb128: dh_installinit by default stops in prerm and start in postinst
<xnox> seb128: one should pass --no-scripts or something like that, to make sure restart is not performed.
<xnox> seb128: it's not events that trigger restart, it's update-rc.d in maintainer scripts that explicetely stops and starts it, just like any other daemon.
<mdeslaur> mpt: heh, have you seen this? http://www.therestartpage.com/
<seb128> xnox, thanks
<mpt> Ahaha
<mpt> mdeslaur, thatâs brilliant
<xnox> it's even animated!
<mdeslaur> love the bios screens
<mdeslaur> got surprised by the mac startup sound :)
<mlankhorst> 2gs is quiet. :P
<mpt> mdeslaur, reminds me of http://www.clivejames.com/poetry/james/windows
<mdeslaur> lol
<mdeslaur> mpt: kind of like this: http://slowcoustic.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/The-Birds-is-coming.jpg
<mdeslaur> hehe
<mlankhorst> did I miss the os/2 one?
<mlankhorst> ah nm found it
<rsalveti> seb128: I know scanning was working fine with ofono in the past, as I implemented that feature
<rsalveti> not sure if it was disabled later on by awe
<rsalveti> will check once he's back
<seb128> rsalveti, ok, no hurry ... is he away this week? when is he back?
<seb128> Laney, ^
<rsalveti> seb128: he was sick yesterday
<seb128> k
<Laney> rsalveti: thought as much!
<Laney> rsalveti: can you confirm if scan-for-operators / manual mode in system-settings works for you?
<rsalveti> and it's useful, I use it all the time when traveling
<rsalveti> sure
<qengho> xnox, mdeslaur, right, two major-versions of chrom.. (about April!) from now will not support any NPAPI.
<qengho> mdeslaur: right, gtk2 dies in Cr. Aura should replace it.
<mdeslaur> qengho: right, so at least chromium can use the pepper flash in an likely illegal way...but firefox still needs gtk2 flash unfortunately
<mdeslaur> qengho: so, is the pepper flash using aura?
<qengho> mdeslaur: I have no idea what Flash is using. I doubt Adobe is that sophisticated, considering the youth of Aura.
<mdeslaur> I thought the whole point of pepper flash was that the chrome devs took over its development
 * mdeslaur shrugs
<qengho> mdeslaur: nope. The security and process model is the goal of PPAPI Everything. Adobe still owns.
<mdeslaur> I see
<qengho> May I have an upload for Trusty?  My usual contact seems busy.  https://launchpad.net/~canonical-chromium-builds/+archive/stage/+packages
<seb128> qengho, is usual contact chrisccoulson?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, stop being jetlagged :p
<seb128> qengho, I can sponsor that for you, sure
<qengho> seb128: merci.
<seb128> de rien
<kgunn> mlankhorst: just a heads up...we're going for another mir promotion...which will necessitate another xserver build
<kgunn> just a heads up so we don't collide again :)
<kgunn> i'll ping you as soon as i'm aware its happening, but you can always check with sil or did
<mlankhorst> hey
<mlankhorst> kgunn: no it's fine, nothing major planned, maybe mesa though :P
 * kgunn thinks mlankhorst is crazy "nothing major"=mesa :)
<mlankhorst> not immediately planned though
<seb128> oh, it's meeting time
<seb128> qengho, Sweetshark, mlankhorst, Laney, tkamppeter, desrt, attente_, larsu: hey, I hope you all made it back without issues
<desrt> holy crap.  it's a meeting.
<larsu> now?
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> larsu, why not?
<seb128> larsu, are you still on London time? (or did I screw the time?)
<larsu> seb128: I just didn't keep track of time is all.
 * larsu feels like it's noon
<seb128> same here
<seb128> ok, let's get started
<seb128> qengho, hey
<qengho> - Testing chromium binary-package rename.
<qengho> - To-do: treat meeting flu.
<qengho> - To-do: Chromium high-dpi first, then multitouch.
<qengho> EOF
<seb128> got the ubuflu as well?
 * seb128 got a cold starting on friday
<seb128> qengho, thanks
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey
<qengho> I washed my hands 1000 times.  :(
 * desrt flexes his immune system
<Sweetshark> seb128: aye
<mlankhorst> ohai
<Sweetshark> - fixed l10n issue
<Sweetshark> - bumped tarballs to 4.2.0 final, reviewed removed some superficial tarballs from -src
<Sweetshark> - using system mdds and orcus
<seb128> Sweetshark, DONE?
<Sweetshark> - tried for system libetonyek, but wont do it (not MIRing)
<Sweetshark> - bumped LibreOffice 4.1.5 to the PPA
<Sweetshark> EOF
<seb128> Sweetshark, you said some sponsoring request was coming soon, is that still happening? ;-)
<Sweetshark> seb128: its already at http://people.canonical.com/~bjoern/trusty/libreoffice_4.2.0-0ubuntu1_source.changes -- I just need to smoketest it.
<seb128> Sweetshark, ok, let me know when it's ready for upload
<Sweetshark> seb128: addendum: removed system-xmlsec its gone, add suggest to -sifr, did some major cleanup on ./debian/rules (ongoing)
<Sweetshark> and upstream some of that to debian and LibreOffice.
<seb128> let's cross fingers than the cleanup doesn't hit new bugs
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
<Sweetshark> s/upstream/upstreamed/
<Sweetshark> seb128: new bugs risk is actually rather low if one can compare the generated BUILD_DEPS and configure-flags to be staying the same. But this could also be punted for after the LTS.
<seb128> right
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
<seb128> mlankhorst, hey
<mlankhorst> transition to xorg 1.15, fixing bug related to GL_NV_vdpau_interop, fixing trusty xorg-server bug #1277014 . transition from precise to trusty https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg/+bug/1278737
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1278737 in xorg (Ubuntu Trusty) "Upgrade to trusty fails from precise backported enablement stacks" [High,In progress]
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1277014 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "Xorg assert failure: X: ../../dix/dispatch.c:3920: DetachUnboundGPU: Assertion `slave->isGPU' failed." [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1277014
<mlankhorst> and preparing mesa 10.1 for debian-experimental
<seb128> mlankhorst, how is the feedback on xorg 1.15 so far? good?
<mlankhorst> no feedback is good feedback :-)
<seb128> I had some intel issues on the way but seems they got resolved with the newest version
<mlankhorst> intel gave more problems recently, should be fixed with 910
<seb128> right
<seb128> seems to work fine for me
<seb128> no corruption today, and user switching seems stable
<seb128> mlankhorst, thanks
<mlankhorst> yeah npp
<seb128> Laney, hey
<Laney> hi
<Laney> â¢ Short-ish week; swap day
<Laney> â¢ Some gnome updates: glib, pango, cogl
<Laney> â¢ u-s-s reviews, brightness panel work (fixing things including animation-after-opening), investigation of slow-loading panel animation (ongoing), poke at 'manual' network selection not working â rsalveti taking a look.
<Laney> â¢ u-s-d/u-c-c discussions, work on the upstart conditions for u-s-d.Turns out you can parameterise 'start on starting' conditions for instance jobs! Implement hax to get the correct (Unity) settings panels from the indicators - will hopefully not be needed if we can manage to have XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP=Unity for fallback sessions too.
<Laney> â¢ Patch pilot
<Laney> â¢ DMB meeting/election wrangling
<Laney> â
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<tkamppeter> - cups/cups-filters: Worked out concept for on-demand starting of daemons
<tkamppeter> - cups: Patch for starting CUPS daemon socket-triggered via Upstart
<tkamppeter> - Talked with xnox about socket-triggered daemon starting with Upstart, found Upstart bug which prevents it, xnox reported the bug.
<tkamppeter> - Talked with mpt about print dialog for Ubuntu Touch, mpt posted first design thoughts on Ubuntu Wiki.
<tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2014: Posted project ideas for OpenPrinting, mentoring organization application for the Linux Foundation.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<seb128> desrt, hey
<desrt> seb128: hey.  working on a secret project right now.  i don't want to talk about it because of something larsu told me about motivation.
<desrt> but i can tell you that it's useful
<larsu> wait. what?
<seb128> lol
<larsu> oh, I remember!
<desrt> larsu: you said that if you tell people what you're working on you lose the motivation to keep working on it
<larsu> in some bus/tram in brussels
<desrt> so i'm giving that a try :)
<larsu> s/lose/can lose/
<Laney> parlez-vous franÃ§ais?
<larsu> croissant!
<seb128> it has been a long week already it seems :p
<larsu> feels like Friday
<seb128> desrt, nothing you want to share since friday then? ;-)
<desrt> nope.
<Laney> ohne Schokolade
<larsu> Laney: MIT!
<seb128> k, fair enough, enjoy the secret hacking ;-)
<seb128> attente_, hey
<desrt> mit ohne alles?
<desrt> this is a strange meeting
<larsu> desrt: you made it strange
<desrt> having a meeting to cover one work day since we last saw each other makes it strange :)
<attente_> more key grabber bug fixes, AP tests for key grabber
<attente_> trying to debug why they don't work on ChrisTownsend's machine...
 * attente_ also caught ubuflu last night
<attente_> EOF
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> attente_, get better!
<larsu> attente_: get well soon!
<Laney> I didn't understand that it was just supposed to be this week's stuff :P
<attente_> seb128, larsu, thanks :)
<seb128> I've ubuflu since friday, it's starting to be better
 * Laney nods towards attente_ 
<seb128> desrt, well, in fact almost everybody has been doing a summary of what they did last week (mine is going to have that as well)
<tkamppeter> I have no ubuflu at all.
<seb128> tkamppeter, lucky you!
<Laney> me neither
<seb128> attente_, congrats on getting your compiz changes merged in btw!
<Laney> I rode a Boris bike all around London on Saturday
<Laney> the fear probably scared the ubuflu away
<attente_> seb128, thanks!
<seb128> Laney, lol
<seb128> larsu, your turn ;-)
<larsu> sure
<larsu> - finally got the evince menu work in. Fixed a couple of issues we found while testing it (mainly related to accels)
<larsu> - gave file-roller a better menu bar on !GNOME desktops (thanks to mpt for design input)
<larsu> - started working fixing the amplified volume UI mess. On hold because of gtkscale issues
<larsu> - some theming and layout (unity-control-center) tweaks
<larsu> EOW
<Laney> yay menus
<seb128> larsu, is the file-roller one pushed somewhere? I lost track on friday afternoon
<larsu> Laynes: somehow I can't share your enthusiasm about menus anymore
<larsu> woah. Laney of course
<larsu> seb128: ya, it's in master
<Laney> it's a weird afternoon for my nickname
<larsu> let me find the bug
<Laney> hey man, you're getting upstreams to care about other environments
<Laney> that is GREAT!
<larsu> seb128: https://git.gnome.org/browse/file-roller/commit/?id=cefd32cb41abe0231b06e0fe2f43091e55a944ba
<seb128> larsu, danke
<desrt> Laney: most upstreams want to care
<Laney> or at least to not block other people who care :P
<Laney> yeah
<seb128> but yeah
<Laney> it's good! makes you enthusiastic!
<seb128> \o/
<desrt> Laney: one of the goals of this entire gmenumodel thing from the start was to make it easier for them to care
<Laney> I was trying to give larsu back some enthusiasm :-)
<desrt> don't worry -- they love larsu :)
<seb128> ;-)
<larsu> Laney: it's working... I think
<desrt> gedit guys are currently standing in the love-larsu queue, in fact...
<larsu> :)
<seb128> larsu is made of awesome, why would anyone not love him ;-)
<desrt> *nudge*
 * larsu didn't know there was a queue
 * Laney coughs
<seb128> ok, on that note
<seb128> larsu, thanks ;-)
<seb128> my turn
<seb128>  * Desktop Debian syncs and updates (harfbuzz, telepathy-mission-control, geary, evolution-data-server, pidgin, gstreamer/base1.0)
<seb128>  * unity-control-center/unity-settings-daemon testing, fixed some bugs (keybindings integration for compiz/unity)
<seb128>  * synced new libcmis for Sweetshark, had to deal with build issues then
<seb128>  * some desktop bugs fixes (gedit, nautilus, software-properties)
<seb128>  * reworked evolution-data-server online accounts packaging split to merge goa/uoa and move common bits back in e-d-s
<seb128>  * reviewed changes from other (u-s-s changes from Laney and click guys, gnome-settings-daemon audio detection from diwic, evince work from larsu)
<seb128> </week>
<larsu> seb128: thanks for the reviews and testing btw!
<seb128> larsu, thanks for iterations and bugfixes, good work ;-)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> comments/questions?
<seb128> if done, we are just done on the half an hour mark ;-)
 * desrt refrains
<Laney> skill
<seb128> lol
<seb128> thanks everyone!
<desrt> we did it!!
<seb128> desrt, you didn't share what you work on, you don't get to ask questions :p
<desrt> i was going to share
<desrt> but since we finished on time, i didn't want to ruin it
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> (at least was going to share the last-week stuff)
<seb128> double round next week!
 * Laney cries
<seb128> Laney, ?
<seb128> qengho, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/trusty/+source/chromium-browser/32.0.1700.107-0ubuntu1~20140204.977.1
<ritz> larsu,  hi, are you working on indicator-printer replacement ?
<Laney> I just looked at why the kylin images don't build
<ritz> or are we focusing on s-c-p ?
<Laney> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/trusty/ubuntukylin-default-settings/trusty/view/head:/hooks/chroot#L12
<Laney> at least most of it is commented out now
<larsu> ritz: no. I'm afraid nobody's focusing on anything printing right now...
<seb128> Laney, I did hurt my eyes by reading that file once as well :/
<ritz> larsu, hmm, thanks. so the best option would be to "ubuntuize" s-c-p ?
<Laney> one of the packages doesn't exist
<Laney> I'll just upload to remove that
<Laney> get in and get out, surgical extraction
<larsu> ritz: what needs ubuntuizing? Are you talking about the auth/keyring issue?
<ritz> yes
<ritz> s-c-p does not have an indicator icon
<ritz> akin to indicator-printer
<ritz> which presents us with a nice queue option
<larsu> indicator-printer is the replacement of s-c-p's tray icon
<larsu> but according to design, we don't want that at all anymore
<larsu> but show the queue list in the launcher instead
<larsu> indicator-printer has a queue option, no?
<seb128> larsu, have you seen https://git.gnome.org/browse/file-roller/commit/?id=74eae54feab2fdb54b5230c1cb48238585147d71 ?
<seb128> larsu, Archive Manager _Help -> Contents is going to make mpt cry :-(
<ritz> nope, it use s-c-p
<ritz> k, so not to show the queue
<larsu> seb128: ya :( I've been meaning to talk to paolo about it but forgot
<ritz> if I understand this correctly, indicator-printer can be killed by design
<seb128> larsu, anyway, no hurry, I'm backporting your patch and not that extra one, we have time before updating to 3.12
<larsu> seb128: :)
<larsu> ritz: right, but something still needs to listen to cups' notifications and show/hide the queue window accordingly
<larsu> and that still wouldn't fix the auth issue
<larsu> I think just keeping the indicator the way it is this late in the cycle is the safest option
<ritz> larsu, why would this not fix ? s-c-p does listen and responds to auth request
<ritz> aah
<ritz> fair point, pretty late in cycle
<mpt> ritz, indicator-printer was perhaps my most elaborate design mistake. Its replacement is specced at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Printing#Printing-1
<larsu> ritz: ya, and not all issues would be fixed. The print dialogs of various apps still show an auth dialog in some cases
<larsu> because CUPS inserts AuthRequired into printers.conf when it can't reach the printer
<ritz> hmm, will test this out
<ritz> thanks a ton for the insight
<larsu> I haven't had the time to investigate this deeply, but I think this needs a more elaborate fix
<seb128> larsu, there is an issue with your file-roller work (or with my backport)
<larsu> seb128: impossible!
<seb128> larsu, ;-) the "open" menu item is unactive for me
<larsu> uh oh
<seb128> hum, as are all the other items from files except "new archive"
<seb128> same for the edit menu
<seb128> larsu, does it happen for you as well?
<larsu> no, it works for me
<seb128> larsu, ok, don't bother, probably an issue with my backport then
 * seb128 does a git build
<seb128> that one is actually easy to git build ;-)
<larsu> let me try applying it to 3.10
<larsu> seb128: oh, conflicts
<seb128> larsu, https://git.gnome.org/browse/file-roller/log/src/ui/app-menubar.ui?id=cefd32cb41abe0231b06e0fe2f43091e55a944ba
<seb128> I backported those 4 commits
<seb128> (well not limited at this file)
<larsu> seb128: I have the same problem
<larsu> after applying those four commits
<larsu> it's only the open command though
<larsu> everything else works as soon as I open an archive
<seb128> not for me
<seb128> I tried to open a tar.xz from nautilus
<larsu> right
<larsu> some of them don't work for me either
<larsu> like anything in file
<larsu> stuff in view and help works
<seb128> there are not so many commits between 3.10 and master
 * seb128 looks at the log
<larsu> seems like the actions were renamed at some point
<larsu> seb128: even worse. Seems like the window actions weren't gactions at that point
<larsu> seb128: even worser, these were added in the same commit as the header bar
<seb128> https://git.gnome.org/browse/file-roller/commit/src/fr-window.c?id=66d798e79c079af6fd9203f659ea6e158580c772
<larsu> https://git.gnome.org/browse/file-roller/commit/src/ui/app-menubar.ui?id=66d798e7
<larsu> lol
<seb128> "fun"
<larsu> not my idea of fun
<larsu> whatever happened to independent small commits?
<larsu> sigh
<seb128> yeah, mine neither
<seb128> which is why the ""
<larsu> it's actually not thast big of a commit
<larsu> let me try separating it
<seb128> right, one hundred lines
 * larsu wonders if that's all though
<seb128> it should be easy enough to drop the headerbar part
<seb128> larsu, don't bother, I'm going to deal with that
<larsu> we should just switch to 3.12!
 * larsu hides
<seb128> lol
 * seb128 looks for a spare battery
<larsu> seb128: good, then I can go on the run wanted to go on :)
 * larsu needs air
<seb128> larsu, enjoy! (and sorry for delaying you with that)
<larsu> let me know if you need help
<larsu> no worries :)
<larsu> thanks
<seb128> should be fine, but thanks!
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Hey
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, hey
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: I made a comment in the MP, but I seem to be the only one hitting that AP failure, so I'm pretty convinced it's something with my machine.
<robert_ancell> seb128, yo
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: So when you merge in trunk again, we'll globally approve.
<robert_ancell> seb128, I wasn't sure about the dummy package - can we just stop providing a binary package? Will that correctly uninstall the old binaries?
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, ok, thanks!
<seb128> robert_ancell, just going for dinner but I'm back in half an our and can chat/read scrollback then
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, cool
<seb128> robert_ancell, you can stop yes, uninstall ... if not, add a Conflicts on it
<seb128> bbiab
<robert_ancell> k
<asac> seb128: which source carries gdk nowadays
<seb128> asac, gtk as always
<asac> seb128: whats the source package :/
<asac> ?
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, ok, resolved
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Cool, thanks
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, thanks :)
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: No problem, and thank *you*!
<seb128> asac, sorry was at dinner, depends of the gtk version, gtk+3.0 for gtk3
<robert_ancell> seb128, so what do we do about gnome-control-center-datetime? Nothing provides/conflicts etc with it
<robert_ancell> seb128, Do we just make gnome-control-center do that?
<seb128> robert_ancell, sorry, was catching up with pings
<robert_ancell> no rush
<seb128> robert_ancell, to get it uninstalled?
<robert_ancell> seb128, I guess? Because we don't want to leave it lying around around right?
<seb128> well, would it still work in g-c-c?
<seb128> I still have the u1 integration with nautilus installed, even after dobey dropped it from the archive, and I'm glad about that since it still works and prove to be useful
<robert_ancell> seb128, it would, but since it wont be rebuilt ever it might hold back its dependencies
<seb128> well, that's something for the apt resolver to resolve imho
<seb128> I would just let it like that and change things if we get reports of upgrade issues
<robert_ancell> seb128, it depends "indicator-datetime (= 13.10.0+14.04.20140124-0ubuntu1)"
<dobey> i'm not glad that i have 2 of every control-center module listed in the dash
<seb128> dobey, yeah, transitions suck
<robert_ancell> So it would stop the indicator upgrading right?
<seb128> robert_ancell, depends of which one has more "weight" in the apt resolver
<robert_ancell> dobey, yeah, that was the least painful transition we could do
<robert_ancell> seb128, so at some point it will just be uninstalled
<seb128> right
<robert_ancell> fine by me to keep it = less work for me :)
<seb128> ;-)
<dobey> and i had to run gnome-control-center.real to get online accounts to work
<seb128> well, just don't do anything
<seb128> if upgrades are blocked on buggy due to it we can tweak
<seb128> dobey, blame the CI daily landing stuff
<seb128> the fix was commited but stuff don't land as they should
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center-signon/0.1.7~+14.04.20140211.2-0ubuntu1 should fix it
<seb128> got uploaded today
<dobey> ok
<seb128> robert_ancell, on a similar "annoying transition issue", g-s-d-fallback-mount and u-s-d-fallback-mount grrrr
<robert_ancell> seb128, got any better ideas?
<seb128> robert_ancell, I get a mount and a "conflict mount prompt" every time I plug a device
<seb128> no
<seb128> I would have fixed it otherwise :p
<seb128> just get the damn transition done? :)
<robert_ancell> in flight...
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> btw did fginther got the autolanding work for u-c-c?
<robert_ancell> seb128, no
<seb128> robert_ancell, oh, and did you get an ok flight back? ;-)
<seb128> :-(
<robert_ancell> long and tedious but yes
<seb128> what's the issue with the CI ?
<seb128> k
<robert_ancell> seb128, still don't know
<seb128> fginther, hey!
<fginther> seb128, yes?
<robert_ancell> Can you approve https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/unity-control-center/datetime-panel/+merge/205665 and https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/indicator-datetime/no-panel/+merge/205664 if good now?
<robert_ancell> fginther, u-c-c still doesn't build (i.e. https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/unity-control-center-trusty-i386-ci/8/console)
<robert_ancell> Anything I'm doing wrong?
<robert_ancell> "dpkg-buildpackage: warning: build dependencies/conflicts unsatisfied; aborting"
<robert_ancell> it's like it can't find any dependencies
<fginther> robert_ancell, looking
<dobey> seb128: when will the duplicate entries disappear from the dash? or am i going to have to remove things manually?
<seb128> dobey, with the next g-c-c upload, which I hope is for this week
<seb128> dobey, you can also uninstall gnome-control-center
<dobey> ok
<seb128> it should be needed (once the -signon version from proposed lands)
<seb128> it shouldn't*
<dobey> i'll wait to make sure stuff goes away with the new upload :)
<robert_ancell> seb128, dpkg question... Since I've removed those old packages indicator-datetime doesn't build because the .install file now doesnt pick up the files in debian/tmp
<seb128> robert_ancell, can you pastebin the error?
<robert_ancell> is the "correct" way to fix this to update debian/rules or the .install
<robert_ancell> "dh_install: indicator-datetime missing files (usr/share/glib-2.0/schemas/*), aborting"
<dobey> robert_ancell: you've only got one binary package coming from the source now?
<robert_ancell> dobey, yep
<robert_ancell> whenever i hit this i dont know what to do
<dobey> robert_ancell: i'd just delete the install file unless you need to install extra stuff with it to debian/tmp (like man pages or whatever)
<dobey> robert_ancell: if it's just to pull files into the package and you've only got one binary, i'd just delete it
<robert_ancell> I'll check it doesn't filter anything out
<dobey> if you need to filter stuff out, i'd rm -f it in debian/rules explicitly, with a comment why
<seb128> robert_ancell, one binary -> destdir = debian/binary (instead of debian/tmp + .install moves)
<seb128> but yeah, you just need to rm the unwanted files, if any, in debian/rules
<robert_ancell> yeah, whoever came up with that inconsistency...
<seb128> I like it
<seb128> default case = no work
<seb128> if you need split, you define the details
<seb128> ok, enough for today
<seb128> robert_ancell, I approved the u-c-c mp (let's see if fginther finds the issue with the lander) and +1ed the indicator one for charles_ letting charles to approve since he's the maintainer for that one
<robert_ancell> seb128, yep, saw that. Thanmks
<seb128> yw!
<fginther> robert_ancell, seb128, I found a missing dependency on the build hosts gnome-pkg-tools. should have everything updated soon.
<robert_ancell> fginther, awesome, thanks!
<seb128> robert_ancell, btw, you should put your gnome-screensaver changes up for review as well ;-)
<seb128> fginther, thanks
<robert_ancell> seb128, review while broken?
<charles_> seb128: thanks for the update, I was waiting on your needs-info :)
<TheMuso> Which gcc/ucc branch should I be using to work on? Got some a11y fixes for the behavior tab in the look preferences panel.
<seb128> robert_ancell, well, with a "need to be fixed" note, maybe somebody has an idea about the focus thing or indicators
<robert_ancell> sure
<seb128> TheMuso, u-c-c for Unity, g-c-c for GNOME, both if you care about both
<seb128> g-c-c doesn't have "appareance"
<seb128> they are going to have their own "background" soon which is a new design
<seb128> charles, yw ;-)
<TheMuso> Ok, I just remember seeing discussion last night about the incorrect branch being used or some such... I was using lp:unity-control-center as a base, but should I be using another u-c-c branch?
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, that's correct
<seb128> night
<TheMuso> Ok good.
<fginther> robert_ancell, the builders should all be updated now
<robert_ancell> fginther, thanks again
<fginther> robert_ancell, I've triggered a rebuild for https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/unity-control-center/datetime-panel/+merge/205665
<robert_ancell> charles, Is Jenkins confused on https://code.launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/indicator-session/unity-settings-daemon/+merge/205421? Should that be merged?
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-02-12
<pitti> Good morning
<darkxst> hey pitti
<Laney> morning!
<Laney> xnox: You didn't reply to me, but there's a new gstreamer release to merge so I'm going to do that and look at doing a split at the same time.
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> Laney, hey, how are you?
<Laney> hey seb128, I'm good thanks!
<Laney> you?
<seb128> I'm good, my cold is getting better, didn't wake up this night
<Laney> the road to recovery!
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> larsu, that Attila guy is really interested in evince working correctly, not sure if you saw but he updated the bug with some new issues after the update from yesterday
<larsu> seb128: I just saw it and he seems to be right
<larsu> I'm fairly sure this was an issue before as well, though
<seb128> k, don't feel like you have to be the ones working on those if they are not regressions
<seb128> xnox, https://code.launchpad.net/~xnox/unity-greeter/off-the-grid/+merge/205896 ... do you build the image on the fly to add the version then?
<seb128> xnox, it seems weird to have a gsettings key rather than using the os-release version
<seb128> pitti, guten tag, wie gehts?
<pitti> bonjour seb128, je vais bien, merci ! et toi ?
<seb128> pitti, I'm good thanks, getting over the ubucold I brought back from London
<pitti> ouch
<pitti> I hope I'll survive the sprint next week without ubuflu :)
<seb128> pitti, just as a fyi, the polkit update I did yesterday should fix the most reported udisks2 issues (segfaults in auth_sync callbacks)
<pitti> !
<darkxst> hey laney, seb128
<seb128> darkxst, hey, how are you?
<darkxst> good, and you?
<seb128> good as well, thanks
<pitti> seb128: many thanks! that one was driving me mad, I could never understand or reproduce it
<darkxst> rebased g-c-c branch is at lp:~darkxst/gnome-control-center/vanilla3.8
 * pitti hugs seb128
<seb128> pitti, I got lucky, googled for the function it segfaulted in and went through all the results and found https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=966079
<ubot2`> bugzilla.redhat.com bug 966079 in udisks2 "[abrt] udisks2-2.1.0-2.fc19: udisks_daemon_util_check_authorization_sync: Process /usr/lib/udisks2/udisksd was killed by signal 11 (SIGSEGV)" [Unspecified,Closed: duplicate]
 * seb128 hugs pitti back
<seb128> pitti, one of the RH guys was able to reproduce and help debugging, but yeah, I would have never found the issue otherwise
<seb128> darkxst, nice, I'm going to have a look (if Laney doesn't beat me to it)
<darkxst> seb128, bug 1278929 maybe related to the gdm death
<ubot2`> darkxst: Error: Could not gather data from Launchpad for bug #1278929 (https://launchpad.net/bugs/1278929). The error has been logged
<seb128> darkxst, oh, I figured out the gdm restart issue
<darkxst> seb128, really?
<seb128> darkxst, yes, the gdm.postinst has
<seb128> rather the prerm
<seb128> # Automatically added by dh_installinit
<seb128> if [ -x "/etc/init.d/gdm" ] || [ -e "/etc/init/gdm.conf" ]; then
<seb128> 	invoke-rc.d gdm stop || exit $?
<seb128> darkxst, you want dh_installinit --no-restart-on-upgrade
<seb128> or rather --no-start
<seb128> (that seems to be what the lightdm packing uses)
<darkxst> seb128, thanks will try that
<seb128> chrisccoulson, shrug, new firefox still not build on arm64/ppc/ppc64 :-(
<seb128> chrisccoulson, can we just drop those archs from the supported list?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, with pleasure ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, see #ubuntu-devel
<seb128> (grrrr doko)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, so I want to hear back from slangasek before we do the change, but if nobody object strongly let's do that?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's fine
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how was Florida btw? happy to be back in rain land? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, it's miserable here. it's basically been raining non stop
 * pitti sends some sun to chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<seb128> London was like that last week
<seb128> we had a bit of blue sky on monday
<seb128> then it was pouring down for the rest of the week
<chrisccoulson> i read this morning that the thames barrier has been raised 150 times since 1983, and 28 of those since dec 6th
<seb128> shrug
<chrisccoulson> fortunately, we're not near any rivers
<pitti> seb128: ok to update gnome-menus to 3.10.1 (bug 1278900)? I'll build/test it first, but are there general reasons to not do that?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1278900 in gnome-menus (Ubuntu) "New Upstream Release -- Gnome Menu 3.10.1 --" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1278900
<pitti> (it's a fairly harmless package anyway)
<chrisccoulson> i wish we could cross compile distro packages: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/165664981/buildlog_ubuntu-trusty-armhf.oxide-qt_1.0.0~bzr358-0ubuntu1~ppa1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<seb128> we can no?
<seb128> well, at least some
<chrisccoulson> seb128, for local builds, yes
<pitti> hm, gnome-menu's vcs-bzr: is severely out of date
<chrisccoulson> and i cross-compile this locally (it takes 1 hour versus 12 hours on a builder)
<seb128> pitti, looking
<seb128> pitti, works for me, there is a limited number of commits between those versions and nothing that seems crazy
<Laney> hey happyaron, I uploaded ubuntukylin-default-settings yesterday to resolve the image build failure - could you please push that into bzr?
<Laney> I'm not in the right team for some reason
<pitti> seb128: *nod*, thanks
<pesari> hey, I see that Ctrl+Alt+Delete opens up a system monitor window instead of the logout prompt. Ise there a default keyboard shortcut for logout in Saucy?
<happyaron> Laney: sure
<pitti> seb128: I brought the vcs-bzr up to date
<Laney> happyaron: è°¢è°¢
<seb128> pesari, you can press the power button
<pesari> hmm, nice, unfortunately it doesn't seem to provide a logout option =)
<happyaron> Laney: haha
<seb128> shrug, of course pressing power did shutdown my laptop without asking (and I was wondering if I should try)
<pesari> haha :)
<Laney> hahaha
<Laney> pesari: ctrl-alt-del lets me log out
<ogra_> seb128, file a bug !
<Laney> it's a configurable shortcut in System Settings -> Keyboard -> Shortcuts -> System here
<seb128> ogra_, there is one! but people couldn't reproduce iirc (I think pitti looked at it for saucy)
<ogra_> heh
<seb128> Laney, the default is system-monitor though
<Laney> I doubt I ever changed that
<Laney> Log out -> ctrl-alt-del
<Laney> or the default changed in trusty
<pitti> really? I don't think I ever changed it either; it brought up the "do you want to log out/shutdown/reboot/etc" dialoge as long as I can think of
<seb128> Laney, you don't use unity, we changed it in unity
<seb128> pitti, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/1:0.9.10+13.10.20130828.2-0ubuntu1
<Laney> I do
<seb128> " Ctrl-Alt-Del should open the gnome-system-monitor at the processes
<seb128>     tab. This fix uses the commands plugin to override the default
<seb128>     action. This includes: - Install the commands plugin by default. -"
<Laney> looking on my desktop
<seb128> I guess it's an user config thing
<seb128> try in a guest session?
<Laney> ya it's system-monitor there
<pitti> ah, nevermind; I do get the system-monitor
<Laney> config migration then
<pitti> I was probably thinking of pressing the power button
<ogra_> like seb
<ogra_> :)
<ogra_> again
<seb128> oh, come on!
<seb128> shrugh, user switching become unstable for me recently in trusty
<Laney> I couldn't get back to my session from lightdm
<Laney> had to switch vt manually
<seb128> even few times it's nuking my session
<Laney> ROBERTTTTTTTTTTTT
<seb128> lucky you
<seb128> mine is putting a console over vt7
<seb128> I don't see my xorg again
<Laney> :(
<Laney> yesterday I had the bug where alt+arrows switches vt again
<seb128> never saw that one
<Laney> if you use terminator you can imagine how terrible that is
<seb128> anywwwwaaaay
<Laney> ;-)
<seb128> Laney, pitti: seems you are right, ctrl-alt-del opens the logout dialog in a guest session here
<chrisccoulson> i should probably upgrade to trusty at some point ;)
<seb128> I wonder why it behaves differently for my users
<Laney> haha wait
<Laney> 12/02 10:17:58 <Laney> ya it's system-monitor there
<Laney> there = guest session
<pitti> logout dialog is certainly a more sensible default
<pitti> so that's config migratin?
<Laney> I think I understand why they made that change
<seb128> pitti, mpt disagrees with you on this one
<seb128> well, for one thing, win defaults to system monitor
<Laney> it's what windows users press to get a task list to kill things
<mpt> On the other hand, I am a member of the Pitti Fan Club, soâ¦
<pitti> I don't have a strong opinion about it
<pitti> but in win you also press ctrl+alt+del to log in, no?
<seb128> pitti, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/890747/comments/7
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 890747 in compiz (Ubuntu) "Keyboard shortcut - Ctrl Alt Del doesn't do what most people typing it would expect" [High,In progress]
<mpt> pitti, that was the case in Windows NT 4 â¦ Donât know about more recent versions :)
<Laney> uh oh
<Laney> the dreaded "most people"
<seb128> lol
<pitti> mpt: I've still seen it on my mother's work laptop, that was something newer
<pitti> but anyway, mpt's opinion > mine in such design questions :)
<mpt> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Control-Alt-Delete#Windows says that in Windows XP it opens the Task Manager, but itâs not detailed about versions after that
<mpt> http://www.howtogeek.com/149280/how-can-i-make-ctrlaltdel-go-right-to-the-task-manager-in-windows-7/ suggests that in Windows 7 it opens something called the âWelcome screenâ
<mpt> by default, at least
<mpt> ah, thatâs the list-of-users variation of the logon screen
<mpt> So, it could go either way â¦ I donât have a strong opinion about it either
<mpt> It is a flaw in Ubuntu that after ten years we still donât have a reliable dialog for shutting down a runaway program, but that canât be fixed merely by reassigning keyboard combos.
<seb128> what do you mean? gnome-system-monitor let you do that no?
<mpt> seb128, no, gnome-system-monitor can be hidden behind other windows, or behind a hung full-screen game, and doesnât take priority over another app that is swamping CPU or I/O.
<xnox> seb128: os-release doesn't declare "LTS" or does it?
<Laney> ubuntu-distro-info -r --devel does print "14.04 LTS"
<seb128> xnox, I don't think it does, but still a gsetting key seems wrong
<seb128> xnox, I would rather see the logo being generated at build time with a configure option
<xnox> Laney: excellent, now all i need is a --current -> to get value for my current release.
<xnox> seb128: right i was debating between a compile-time #configure vs a runtime thing.
<xnox> seb128: with a runtime thing i now have an easter egg =) i've manually overriden the key and now i have "ubuntu (Cof) 4.10 Warty Warthog" =))))))))
<happyaron> seb128: I just requested membership for ~desktop-bugs, please approve, :)
<seb128> happyaron, done
<seb128> xnox, yeah, we also have the cost of generating an image at every boot, with the potential of bugs it represents...
<xnox> seb128: actually, we generate the image on boot anyway, and the logo location image is read from a gsettings key.
<xnox> seb128: but with cairo it should be easy enough to generate the image at build time.
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> if design validate the results I'm all for it
<Laney> I'd do it at build time
<seb128> we have been pinging Rosie to get updated logos every cycle
<happyaron> seb128: thx
<seb128> which is annoying
<Laney> the dynamic distro-info thing is an enhacement
<xnox> Laney: seb128: Rosie has _a lot_ of work to do. the amount of graphics she pumps out is a lot.
<Laney> taking this one away would be good
<xnox> Laney: seb128: and i can validate the design with her, next time i'm in the office.
<xnox> Laney: ditto "settings info/about panel" ?
<xnox> (it also appears to be using a static logo)
<seb128> xnox, good, thanks
<seb128> xnox, yes, those are the 2 we get from Rosie usually
<Laney> as in control-center?
<Sweetshark> heya all
<Sweetshark> seb128: got my mail?
<GunnarHj> Laney: Appreciate your mail. We'll still ask for an upload, but it makes sense to not make that a condition for approving.
<Laney> as you wish
<GunnarHj> dpm: ping?
<Laney> GunnarHj: maybe you can get someone else to write a testimonial though, more is always better
<GunnarHj> Laney: There is no obvious candidate. Will think about it.
<Laney> okay, it's not essential
<ochosi> bregma: hey, we're planning to do a light-locker stable release around the weekend (1.2, adds the feature of time-based locking, which would be used e.g. in Xubuntu), do you think you could package that in time before FF?
<bregma> ochosi, I'll try to slip it in
<popey> grrr, twice today my keyboard layout has flipped to US again
<dpm> hi GunnarHj
<GunnarHj> dpm: Hello David!
<GunnarHj> dpm: The doc team is about to request an upload of ubuntu-docs as a test to prepare ourselves for the coming LTS release by making sure that things work as expected.
<GunnarHj> Question: Do you think we should update the PO files when doing so?
<dpm> GunnarHj, yeah, I think so. The most important one is to update the POT file when doing the upload, but exporting PO files from LP and uploading them in the package should be useful for translators to see their progress
<GunnarHj> dpm: The reason I ask is the usual dilemma: If we update them now, there is a risk that some strings will need to be retranslated in a few weeks. OTOH, if we wait until doc freeze, there is only two weeks available.
<Sweetshark> I love you launchpad, but why are you always evading me? :_(
<GunnarHj> dpm: Should I take it that you think giving the translators more time for the current contents is worth the risk of a need to translate some strings twice?
<dpm> GunnarHj, yes, I'd say that.
<dpm> GunnarHj, it might be worth sending an e-mail to the translators list to explain that we're doing the update, but that there might be a risk of changing strings until the freeze. Then the translators can decide for themselves whether to wait for the freeze or start straight away
<GunnarHj> dpm: That sounds reasonable. Should we do it or will you?
<dpm> GunnarHj, would you mind doing it?
<GunnarHj> dpm: Not at all.
<dpm> excellent, thanks GunnarHj
<ochosi> bregma: great, thanks a lot!
<GunnarHj> dpm: As regards exporting from LP and updating the package will reasonably have to wait until some translation work has been done. Or am I missing something?
<dpm> GunnarHj, I'm sure people have already been doing translations for the existing strings, so there should be translations already
<GunnarHj> dpm: Aha, so that's what you meant. Ok, then we'll export as well.
<dpm> cool, thanks GunnarHj
<denisw> what's up with the unity webapp integration in trusty? is this a misconfiguration on my part, or is it intentional that webapp shortcuts start the touch webbrowser app now?
<larsu> seb128: you said the notify-osd positioning bug happened after a change to multi-head handling? Do you have a commit?
<larsu> or a bug #?
<seb128> larsu, we changed the default gsettings key value, the bug is not new
<seb128> larsu, https://code.launchpad.net/~sam92/notify-osd/focusfollowdefault/+merge/198541
<larsu> seb128: ah, that's what did it. Thanks!
<seb128> larsu, yw!
<seb128> larsu, are you looking at fixing the issue?
<seb128> larsu, MacSlow did https://code.launchpad.net/~macslow/notify-osd/notify-osd.fix-1092905/+merge/203047 but that creates regressions on multi screens with different geometry and he didn't follow up since to address those
<larsu> seb128: I'll have a look. I won't be able to test it though for lack of a second monitor
<ochosi> seb128: quick question, you patched out the headerbars in most gnome3 apps, any reason why gthumb slipped? (or was it simply not on your radar)
<seb128> larsu, thanks, let me know if you need help testing
<seb128> ochosi, "in most", that's like 1 of those (we didn't take new versions)?
<seb128> ochosi, but reason is "we focus on our default desktop/those design changes are upstream decisions"
<seb128> if gthumb users realize those don't work for them and report the issues to upstream it might make them realize they need to do a better job supporting !gnome-shell
<seb128> we can't patch the universe
<ogra_> thats only like 15000 packages ...
<ochosi> seb128: sure, i understand. i mostly wanted to know what your policy was. is it easy to patch out the headerbar?
<seb128> no it's not easy
<seb128> well, it's not difficult either
<seb128> but imho first step is to take a screenshot of how the app look to you and report it upstream
 * seb128 is going to do that for file-roller today
<ochosi> seb128: trying not to drift into trolling or a rant, but it puzzles me why !gnome-shell DEs are ignored like that...
<seb128> Laney, autopilot landed, we should have happy u-s-s again
<ochosi> anyhow, thanks for the info
<ochosi> and looking forward to file-roller's normal menu again ;)
<seb128> ochosi, mostly appwriters don't realize the issues on !gnome-shell because they use GNOME and follow the cool stuff there
<seb128> they are usually annoyed when they realize the impact on the changes on their users on other environments
<seb128> that's why you should open a bug, just to let the gthumb guys know
<seb128> they might want to fix it/add a codepath for other desktops
<Laney> seb128: woot!
<ochosi> seb128: ok, will do!
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> ochosi, thanks
<ochosi> seb128: well, thank
<ochosi> seb128: well, thank *you* for fixing all the others (like evince)
<seb128> ochosi, yw, thanks to larsu in fact who did all the work there ;-)
<mitya57> seb128: while you are talking about headerbars: what should I do to get my 2-lines ubuntu-themes fix merged?
<seb128> larsu, you reviewed that one and were happy with it for this cycle right?
<larsu> remind me again which one that was?
<seb128> https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/ubuntu-themes/headerbar-fixes/+merge/200477
<larsu> ya that looks great
<larsu> thanks :)
<seb128> mitya57, ok, approved
<seb128> mitya57, larsu: thanks
<seb128> larsu, I'm happy with the bgcolor one as well, should we just push that one through?
<seb128> I can do a land ask for those changes
<larsu> yes please
<seb128> larsu, I'm going to land https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/ubuntu-themes/fix-ambiance-separators/+merge/204443 as well, I don't know why both themes diverge, but it does the job so I don't care much about details
<larsu> same
<larsu> we might want to fix that one day :)
<mitya57> seb128, ochosi: At some point I was also going to backport a Gtk patch that adds appmenu as a button in headerbar on non-shell/non-unity sessions (like Xfce)...
<mitya57> ... so that appmenu button does not take the whole toolbar...
<ochosi> mitya57: that sounds like an improvement, the empty menubar looks awful...
<seb128> mitya57, how many headerbar app do we have in trusty?
<ochosi> in fact i hope we can get support for headerbars in xfwm4 merged in trusty (possibly after FF)
<seb128> ochosi, what do you mean "support for headerbars"?
<mitya57> seb128: I think all new gnome apps (like weather, photos, documents, etc) use it
<ochosi> seb128: https://plus.google.com/+AlistairBuxton/posts/4FU9vBAu1ty
<seb128> mitya57, oh, right, those new apps are new, I didn't really use them ;-)
<mitya57> seb128: Also, our patches don't work on Flashback session
<chrisccoulson> bah, again, https://launchpad.net/~phablet-team/+archive/ppa/+build/5580248
 * chrisccoulson bangs head against wall
<mitya57> seb128, ochosi: here is the patch, let me know what you think about it: https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/gtk/gtkheaderbar.c?id=2863bb287cdd654c2d7f3e2f64
<seb128> chrisccoulson, :--
<mitya57> The problem is that Gtk has rewritten the code in 3.12, so that code exists in neither 3.10 nor 3.12
<mitya57> And backporting the "new" code will be a much bigger patch
<seb128> right, I'm not wanting to take that much bigger patch
<mitya57> my link is the "old" patch
<ochosi> so that means that xfce will still need to basically support the headerbars, right?
 * ochosi thought that fallback app-menus would be shown in the headerbar in !gnome-shell by default
<seb128> mitya57, right, I'm just saying "don't start wasting time trying to backport the 3.12 features set"
<seb128> ochosi, mitya57: I'm not sure what you call "support of headerbars"
<seb128> is that "don't display the wm decorations"?
<mitya57> ochosi: my patch reduces the height by -1 toolbar, xfwm patch is another -1
<mitya57> seb128: yes
<ochosi> seb128: yeah, basically
<seb128> that's not very useful
<seb128> you still get different look
<seb128> can't resize those dialogs easily
<ochosi> not really
<ochosi> xfwm4 does draw a decoration
<seb128> you have the decorations looking different and on the wrong side/order
<ochosi> a special one
<seb128> for the resizing?
<ochosi> well the sides and bottom are the same as with any other window
<ochosi> and the top has new pixmaps, that have to be added in xfwm4 themes
<ochosi> (or by default flips the bottom pixmaps and uses them for the top-border)
<ochosi> so your 2px border will remain a 2px border
<ochosi> and iirc button-order can be controlled via the gtk-theme
<ochosi> so i can set that up at least to match our default setup (can't stop people from shuffling that around obviously)
<seb128> ochosi, GTK 3.10 doesn't have support for other buttons that close I think
<seb128> than*
<ochosi> yeah, how "nice" :]
<seb128> Laney, did you open a bug about "unity8 should set powerd screen settings on start" (or do you know if there is one)?
<seb128> ochosi, right, which is why I doubt you can "support headerbar properly" in trusty
<seb128> which is also why we decided to delay the use of those to apps until after the LTS
<Laney> pretty sure I did, sec
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity8/+bug/1273174
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1273174 in Unity 8 "Manage auto brightness synchronisation" [Medium,Triaged]
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<ochosi> seb128: hmyeah, i'm not sure it'll change much after LTS, the visual gap will be difficult to close
<ochosi> the visual consistency in linux was nice while it lasted...
<seb128> ochosi, right
<seb128> well, at least with the new GTK things like the wm buttons to list and their order should match
<seb128> then you are still going to have differences in look in behaviour
<seb128> but it's as much you can do with different implementations
<ochosi> yup
<ochosi> well there's still hope that there'll be fallback modes for !gnome-shell
<seb128> imho app writers should have fallback modes if they care about their users on other desktops
<ochosi> agreed
<seb128> the issue is that apps coming from GNOME have their authors living in GNOME world and most of them totally overlooked the consequences of the switch
<didrocks> Trevinho_: hey! do you mind registering on the fosdem website?
<didrocks> Trevinho_: so that our talk can be attributed toâ¦ us
<asac> big bustage with latest updates for chromium?
<asac> anyone complained yet?
<asac> for me nothing works anymore :/
<asac> webpages dont open etc.
<seb128> asac, what sort of bustage? nobody complained and wfm
<seb128> qengho, ^ did you hear of any issue?
<qengho> asac: really?
<qengho> Nope
<qengho> asac: if you run from command line, any interesting output
<qengho> ?
<asac> accessign any google service doesnt work
<asac> just stalls and asks me to kill page at some point
<asac> wait i will restart
<asac> seems its all bad
<asac> asac@thinki:~$ killall -KILL chromium-browser
<asac> asac@thinki:~$ killall -KILL chromium-browser
<asac> asac@thinki:~$ killall -KILL chromium-browser
<asac> :)
<asac> let me reboot
<qengho> asac, wait, let's see what the problem is.
<qengho> asac: are you still here? See direct messages.
<larsu> MacSlow: regarding the notify-osd bubble placement bug. Why isn't it always using the work area? Are there desktop environments that we support but that don't set it?
<larsu> seb128: I can't reproduce the problem in Laney's comment with gnome flashback :-(
<seb128> larsu, what problem? the out of screen one?
<larsu> seb128: no, the overlapping bubble when using gnome-panel
 * Laney tries again
<seb128> larsu, happens under unity for me
<seb128> larsu, what value do you have for the gsettings key?
<MacSlow> larsu, not sure about that... I've no gnome setup to try it out atm
<larsu> seb128: after applying MacSlow's fix of course
<qengho> seb128: I think that updating chromium package while browsers are still running can make the old processes go crazy. I think I need to ask the user to kill processes in postrm.
<larsu> MacSlow: I don't think we need to support GNOME (unless you mean fallback)
<larsu> *flashback
<attente_> seb128, are you seeing two menu bars?
<larsu> lol
<larsu> morning attente_
<seb128> larsu, oh, right
<larsu> attente_: what's up with the underscore?
<MacSlow> larsu, I don't have the issue anymore with my fix... otherwise I would not have put up a MR for it :)
<seb128> qengho, could you display a restart banner in the browser like firefox?
<seb128> MacSlow, did you see the comments on the mp?
<seb128> attente_, two menubars? where? no
<attente_> i'm seeing the one in the panel and the one in the window..
<Laney> ya, still overlaps
<larsu> MacSlow: some people seem to, which is why I'm investigating. It works for me as well though
<qengho> seb128: "in the browser" assumes the processes are in control. I don't think that would work.
<larsu> Laney: with MacSlow's fix on gnome flashback?
<attente_> Trevinho_, hey, are you seeing two menu bars? one in the panel and one in window?
<Laney> I just built that branch and installed it, so yes
<seb128> attente_, for all apps?
<MacSlow> seb128, larsu: still in a meeting... will look closer afterwards
<attente_> seb128, yeah...
<larsu> Laney: I wonder why it works for me :(
<seb128> attente_, are you trying local integrated menu from Trevinho? ;-)
<attente_> seb128, d'oh. must be it
<seb128> lol
<larsu> sigh, not that again
<seb128> attente_, btw did you see the bugs I assigned you some days ago about recently used callbacks being wrong?
<seb128> larsu, lim? ignore it...
<attente_> seb128, i did, but i'm not sure what changed to break that again
<larsu> Laney: is this with awesomewm or compiz/metacity?
<seb128> larsu, I can try under gnome-panel if you want, I didn't test that
<Laney> larsu: xmonad :-)
<Laney> I added a g_debug, sec
<seb128> larsu, I confirmed that bubbles are out of screen on smaller resolutions screens though
<larsu> oh, excuse me :P
<larsu> seb128: right. I can't test that for lack of a different monitor
<seb128> attente_, ok, no hurry, seems like a good one to fix for the LTS, we have time for that though
<larsu> seb128: I can come up with a patch that _might_ work
<seb128> mlankhorst, tjaalton: is there a way to "simulate" a second screen
<larsu> but I don't like programming blind
<seb128> ?
<Laney> ** (notify-osd:13562): DEBUG: selecting monitor 0 at (0,0) - 1280x800
<Laney> ** (notify-osd:13562): DEBUG: desktop-top: 0
<mlankhorst> seb128: not really, why?
<larsu> mlankhorst: lack of screens
<larsu> (physical ones)
<seb128> mlankhorst, larsu is trying to debug a notify-osd happening on configs with 2 screens with different geometry but only has 1 screen
<Sweetshark> seb128: reping: did you see the LO sponsoring req.?
<seb128> I was wondering if there was a way to make a fake one through xrandr or Xorg.conf
<mlankhorst> not that I'm aware of
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey, yes I did, I just forgot because I received the email while I was still on IRC/doing other stuff and didn't keep it unread, doing that now
<Laney> I think my overlapping thing might be an xmonad bug
<larsu> Laney: okay so your wm doesn't seem to set the work area
<Laney> not supporting _NET_WORKAREA
<mlankhorst> can't plug in a digital tv?
<Laney> wouldn't worry about that one
<Sweetshark> seb128: not terribly urgent, just wanted to check back ;)
<seb128> Sweetshark, good you did, thanks ;-)
<Laney> MAN, maybe I get to write some haskell to set it!
<seb128> lol
<seb128> so it's true, some people do write haskell?
<Laney> quite a few
<larsu> seb128: I'm not sure the plural form is warrented here
<Laney> like at least double figures!
<seb128> lol
<larsu> Laney: notify-osd does look for a panel though (I have no clue why), so it *should* work for you, too
<larsu> of course, that MR overrides that
<larsu> I'm thinking we should just not support envs that don't set workarea thoguh
<seb128> +1
<Laney> yeah I wouldn't worry about that
<Laney> I never even cared about or noticed this problem
<larsu> ah, all users of xmonad seem happy!
<seb128> ;-)
<Laney> http://qa.debian.org/popcon.php?package=xmonad
<Laney> you guys!
<mdeslaur> qengho: you can't really ask the user in a postinst...security updates get installed in the background for a lot of people. doesn't chromium have a built-in way to deal with updates somehow?
<qengho> mdeslaur: Thanks. In some environments, Cr updates itself and does okay. Something
<qengho> 's screwy here.
<mdeslaur> qengho: when it updates itself, it knows about it...perhaps it needs to be signaled somehow that it's about to get updated or something
<qengho> mdeslaur: I suspect the sandbox is to blame.
<MacSlow> seb128, Laney, larsu: we should just not allow a multi-monitor-setting where the screens aren't arranged to top-edge align ;)
<larsu> heh
<Laney> MacSlow: no, no, you say "users don't really do that" and then push your fix anyway
<Laney> we're power users ;-)
<MacSlow> seb128, Laney, larsu: I bet that easier to "fix" than to make notify-osd support every possible multi-screen setup ;)
<larsu> I think the best approach is to believe the window manager's work area hint
<larsu> that's exactly what it is for...
 * larsu goes and deletes some code
<seb128> yeah
<MacSlow> larsu, you mean ewmh's _NET_WORKAREA ?!
<larsu> ya
<MacSlow> larsu, well defaults_refresh_screen_dimension_properties() does grab that iirc
<larsu> MacSlow: ya, I'm working on that right now if you don't mind. I'd appreciate a review later ;)
<MacSlow> larsu, sure
<Laney> getting close with this Loader stuff!
<seb128> oh!
<Laney> http://ubuntuone.com/3bqY8Q2TKqJ1VWFlAyzBIF
<Laney> y ubuntuone so slow
<seb128> Sweetshark, shrugh, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/165741666/buildlog_ubuntu-trusty-amd64.libreoffice_1%3A4.2.0-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gzhttps://launchpadlibrarian.net/165741666/buildlog_ubuntu-trusty-amd64.libreoffice_1%3A4.2.0-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<seb128>  /bin/bash: /build/buildd/libreoffice-4.2.0/workdir/CustomTarget/postprocess/registry/Langpack-en-US.list: No such file or directory
<Sweetshark> seb128: can you just retry that build? it seems to be a missing dependency in the upstream build system. Never saw that on a PPA builder (to few parallel jobs), but sometimes locally. I will see to find an fix that soonish ...
<seb128> Sweetshark, done
<Sweetshark> seb128: ... or we can build libreoffice with "make -j1" just for fun ...
<seb128> we have enough fun with libreoffice, let's not try adding extra one
<Sweetshark> ;)
<seb128> Trevinho_, hey
<seb128> Trevinho_, do you know what that happens on a dual screen unity trusty config?
<seb128> >>> Gdk.Screen.get_default().get_monitor_workarea(0).y
<seb128> 0
<seb128> >>> Gdk.Screen.get_default().get_monitor_workarea(1).y
<seb128> 24
<seb128> there is a panel on top of each screen
<seb128> shouldn't both return 24?
<Trevinho_> seb128: mh, yes it should...
<seb128> Trevinho_, do you have a dual screen config? can you test if you get the same result? ;-)
<Trevinho_> seb128: yes, sure
<seb128> Trevinho_, "python -c 'from gi.repository import Gdk; print(Gdk.Screen.get_default().get_monitor_workarea(0).y)'
<Trevinho_> seb128: let me try
<seb128> -"
<seb128> Trevinho_, same for 1
<Trevinho_> seb128: yeah, I'm getting the same result
<Trevinho_> but the things are set otherwise if you've a long menu menu it should sow over the panel
<Trevinho_> let me check
<seb128> sorry, ctrl-W on wrong screen
<davmor2> kenvandine: just opened empathy on Trusty DESKTOP click on account settings nothing happens.  I open system-settings no online accounts so how do I add an account now?
<seb128> davmor2, that's fixed with https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center-signon/0.1.7~+14.04.20140211.2-0ubuntu1
<seb128> kenvandine, ^
<attente_> darkxst, hey, for the fix_screenshots_on_unity.patch in g-s-d, do we want to be using gnome-screenshot under unity regardless of having the legacy key grabber?
<kenvandine> ah.. yeah figured that was lost in the transition
<davmor2> seb128: ah thanks
<Trevinho_> seb128: mh, so let me check as the extents should be set
<Trevinho_> seb128: so in both the monitors I have
<Trevinho_> _NET_WM_STRUT_PARTIAL(CARDINAL) = 0, 0, 24, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1919, 0, 0
<Trevinho_> _NET_WM_STRUT_PARTIAL(CARDINAL) = 0, 0, 24, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 1920, 3285, 0, 0
<Trevinho_> on panel
<kgunn> mlankhorst: just fyi...we're building mir & xserver today...like right now...just a heads up
<seb128> Trevinho_, how do you get those?
<seb128> xprop?
<Trevinho_> So... it seems it's actually setting the right values
<Trevinho_> seb128: yes
<Trevinho_> over the panels
<Trevinho_> seb128: so, might that be a gdk bug?
<seb128> Trevinho_, get seems to use _NET_WORKAREA
<Trevinho_> ah
<seb128> _NET_WORKAREA(CARDINAL) = 65, 24, 3775, 1056
<seb128> well
<seb128> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?id=c6df2828b7ca6b65b7ab3c328ebb96bd78c087ee
<kenvandine> seb128, thx
<Trevinho_> xprop -root _NET_WORKAREA
<Trevinho_> is still valid here
<seb128> that's not by screen though
<seb128> Trevinho_, seems like the issue is on the GTK side rather than Unity?
<Trevinho_> seb128: it might be as compiz seem to work as it should here; but also gtk seem to consider it as menus are moved down to the panel...
<Trevinho_> seb128: I should check this better on the commit you've pasted though
<Trevinho_> but I'm about to leave now (but back later)
<seb128> Trevinho_, no worry, thanks for responding/have a look ;-)
<seb128> Trevinho_, have a nice evening!
<Trevinho_> seb128: thanks, you too
<seb128> thanks
<attente_> seb128, apparently that recent chooser menu is fixed already, we just need to release a new unity-gtk-module
<seb128> attente_, oh, I new it was ringing a bell, I didn't release we didn't release for a while
<seb128> attente_, I'm filling a landing request
<seb128> attente_, thanks
<attente_> seb128, thanks
<darkxst> attente_, yes, unless Unity is planning to grow a built-in screencapture utility like gnome-shell has
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-02-13
<pitti> Good morning
<Laney> morning!
<hyperair> evening!
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<seb128> "On a positive note, the autopilot fix is in now, and ubuntu-system-settings was able to run all the tests"
<seb128> \o/
<Laney> nice!
<Laney> hey seb128
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<seb128> can you take the wet weather back? that rain is boring :/
<Laney> quite nice here today ^_^
 * larsu looks out the window
<larsu> sunshine \o/
<seb128> bah :p
<Laney> BAH!
<Laney> Feb 13 CD Image        ( 48K) LiveFS ubuntu/trusty/i386 failed to build on 20140213
<Laney> unity-control-center-signon got NEWed to universe
<seb128> Laney, there is no NEWing with the CI stuff
<seb128> but yeah, it landed to universe, thanks for pointing it out
 * seb128 fixes
<TheMuso`> larsu: Is ido managed by CI? I see changes in teh branch that haven't been uploaded to the archive. In particular, I am awaiting the fix for bug #1242550.
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1242550 in ido (Ubuntu) "indicator-sound keyboard controls with left/right ARROW keys broken" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1242550
<Laney> I'll still call it NEWing :-)
<Laney> also, do you want to get these emails?
<seb128> TheMuso`, it's under autolanding, I'm going to do a landing request for it
<seb128> larsu, ^^
<seb128> Laney, more email? no, thanks
<Laney> the image failure ones are good usually
<seb128> where do I subscribe/unsubscribe?
<TheMuso`> seb128: Ok no worries. Just wasn't sure if it fell off the radar or not.
<Laney> it's in some file
<Laney> on the CD build server
<larsu> wow, that hasn't landed in a while
<seb128> indeed
<larsu> are we getting autolanding for it now?
 * seb128 misses the good old days where landing happened without you having to think
<larsu> me too
<seb128> larsu, "auto" in the sense of somebody needs to put a line on a gdoc
<larsu> which is kind of what I still do tbj
<larsu> *tbh
<larsu> seb128: :-/
<seb128> yeah, let's not argue over that
<seb128> we just need to be careful and ask for landings
 * seb128 adds one
<larsu> thanks
<seb128> I put one for the theme as well
<seb128> Laney, done
<Laney> ty
<Sweetshark> seb128: hmmm, I just had a weird experience. With enabled trusty-proposed, I didnt get libreoffice (the meta pkg) with an 'apt-get update' causing all kinds of confusion as I then had 4.2.0-0ubuntu1 and 4.2.0~rc4-0ubuntu1 packages mixed. Manually downloading the *.deb as build in proposed worked fine though.
<Sweetshark> I wonder what is happening there.
<Sweetshark> all the other packages just came in with the update.
<didrocks> mlankhorst: hey, from colin:
<didrocks> 12:43:56 cjwatson | wonder why xorg-server/ppc64el just started failing to build with an array-bounds error
<didrocks> 12:44:58 cjwatson | I've overridden the never-passed autopkgtest failure there, but ppc64el will need to be sorted out
<popey> seb128: any suggestion where I should file this "my keyboard keeps switching to US" bug?
<desrt> hi hi hackers
<hikiko> hello could someone help me a little with a branch? I am doing something with GVariants and I get a strange seg fault in a place I shouldnt...
<seb128> hikiko, hey, can you pastebin your code and the bt
<seb128> desrt, good morning!
<hikiko> sure thank you seb128
<seb128> popey, uninstall ibus (I guess you don't use it) and see if it keeps happening?
<seb128> popey, the indicator/GNOME stack didn't change recently, I doubt it's the xorg update so I would blame ibus
<seb128> popey, did you notice a pattern on when it changes?
<mlankhorst> didrocks: I have no idea, nothing in xorg-server changed afaics
<didrocks> mlankhorst: colin is telling it never passed
<seb128> Sweetshark, did the apt-get update work?
<mlankhorst> oh that's fine then
<popey> seb128: no, it appears randomly
<hikiko> seb128, http://paste.ubuntu.com/6925189/
<hikiko> I was trying to get the size of an array that contained 1 dictionary entry I should get 1
<hikiko> the array seems correct it should have a dict entry with a string (LVDS1) as a key and an int value (9)
<hikiko> seb128, if you need to run the code you need to install these gsettings too: bzr branch lp:~hikiko/gsettings-ubuntu-touch-schemas/new-schema-for-unity7-8
<didrocks> mlankhorst: I don't think it's really fine, colin has to override everytime
<Laney> umm
<Laney> xorg has no autopkgtest, he's talking about the firefox one
<seb128> hikiko, shouldn't you use "a{si}" for the signature?
<Laney> don't ride mlankhorst for that
<hikiko> in which place seb128 ?
<seb128> hikiko, wait
<seb128> larsu, desrt: can you help hikiko?
<desrt> hikiko: this is your own code or code in someone else's program/library?
<seb128> desrt, it's her code, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~hikiko/unity-control-center/unity-control-center.per-monitor-fonts-scale-factor-slider/view/head:/panels/display/cc-display-panel.c#L647
<seb128>   g_settings_get (self->priv->desktop_settings, "scale-factor", "a", &dict);
<seb128> the corresponding schemas is
<seb128> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~hikiko/gsettings-ubuntu-touch-schemas/new-schema-for-unity7-8/revision/7
<seb128>         <key name="scale-factor" type="a{si}">
<seb128>  
<seb128> desrt, she's hitting http://paste.ubuntu.com/6925189/
<seb128> I guess the gvariant use is incorrect
<hikiko> I am not sure let me try :)
<larsu> hi
<larsu> hikiko: do you have a full stacktrace?
<Sweetshark> seb128: I did it again with a fresh VM -- everything went fine there.
<seb128> Sweetshark, good
<desrt> seb128: i saw that.... i'm wondering what the code looks like :)
<desrt> thanks for the link
<seb128> desrt, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~hikiko/unity-control-center/unity-control-center.per-monitor-fonts-scale-factor-slider/view/head:/panels/display/cc-display-panel.c#L647
<larsu> hikiko: nevermind, I read the scrollback
<seb128> yw
<desrt> hikiko: &a is for GVariantIter
<hikiko> seb128, sec I think that was it just a sec to verify it
<desrt> er.  'a' rather
<desrt>   g_settings_get (self->priv->desktop_settings, "scale-factor", "a", &dict);
<desrt> in this case you should have 'GVariantIter *dict'
<larsu> desrt: morning :)
<desrt> larsu: hi :D
<hikiko> desrt, larsu and seb128 it was the a{si}
<hikiko> I have other bugs too
<hikiko> but I can solve them
<hikiko> I think :)
<seb128> hikiko, btw, looking at https://code.launchpad.net/~hikiko/unity-control-center/unity-control-center.per-monitor-fonts-scale-factor-slider/+merge/205227 ... the config parser thing is scary
<hikiko> seb128, I ll remove this
<seb128> good!
<hikiko> I use the gvariant instead
<desrt> hikiko: no... seriously... it's the g_settings_get() line that is the problem
<desrt> "a" _does not_ work with GVariant*
<desrt> and in fact, "a" is not a valid format string in any case
<seb128> desrt, she said that she changed the "a" but "a(si)" there I think
<hikiko> yes desrt I just found out that I should use a{si} like seb128 said
<desrt> that won't fix it either, unfortunately
<desrt> "a{si}" will still want to use a GVariantIter
<desrt> if you want to use a GVariant* then try "@a{sv}"
<desrt> or even better: dict = g_settings_get_value (...);
<desrt> no need to guess in that case
<hikiko> @a{sv} is not for string-string key-value pair?
<meetingology> hikiko: Error: "a{sv}" is not a valid command.
<desrt> sorry.. @a{si} :)
 * desrt has intense muscle memory for typing a{sv}
<hikiko> oh so @ is like reference-dereference?
<desrt> @ means "give me this as a GVariant* instead of the usual type"
<meetingology> desrt: Error: "means" is not a valid command.
<desrt> and for "a" the "usual type" is GVariantIter/GVariantBuilder
<desrt> take a look at https://developer.gnome.org/glib/stable/gvariant-format-strings.html
<desrt> it documents what each character means
<desrt> https://developer.gnome.org/glib/stable/gvariant-format-strings.html#gvariant-format-strings-arrays is 'a'
<desrt> https://developer.gnome.org/glib/stable/gvariant-format-strings.html#gvariant-format-strings-gvariant is '@'
<hikiko> I see :)
<hikiko> I thought I should use a to deconstruct the array and get the gvariant dict-entries thanks a lot :)
<hikiko> ok I am going to fix my other bugs now :) thanks a lot everybody!!
<desrt> hikiko: it's worth noting that the newest glib version (which will be in trusty) also has a new type: GVariantDict
<desrt> which would make your usecase quite a lot easier -- it supports adding one entry to a dict, for example
<desrt> actually -- i take that back.  this type only works with a{sv} dicts :(
<desrt> (sorry -- these types of dicts are really the absolute most common)
 * desrt considers supporting others....
<marga> Hi all! I'm having trouble with an issue running trusty, which I can't figure out.  The problem is that when I just boot, I can't switch VTs.  If I restart lightdm, though, I can.  I've found that seat0 is set to "CanGraphical=no", whereas in a non-customized installation it's set to "CanGraphical=yes".
<marga> I'm assuming some config file of mine is causing this, but I already tried moving some away to no avail.  Any suggestions?
<seb128> marga, hey, no idea, maybe mterry knows better about those details but he's not online yet
<marga> ok, tnx
<seb128> larsu, huummm
<larsu> seb128: did you see a croissant au chocolat?
<seb128> lol
<seb128> larsu, I had one this morning!
<larsu> \o/
 * larsu should get one and instagram it to didrocks 
<larsu> if that is something you do with instagram...
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> tsss :p
 * ogra_ heard FAXing is the new instagram
<seb128> larsu, I was debugging why evince stopped autoreloading documents when they change on disk
<seb128> larsu, turns out it's your patch
<seb128> larsu, ev_window->priv->settings is NULL, and 0001-Port-to-GMenuModel-and-add-menu-bar.patch drops ev_window_ensure_settings()
<seb128> larsu, do you remember why you did that?
<seb128> that function seems to be useful and not related to menus
<didrocks> because of too many croissants au chocolat
<didrocks> this thing *that doesn't exist* is just making you take bad decisions
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, so as so good that you forget what you were doing before bitting in them
<mdeslaur> lol
<larsu> seb128: I don't remember, but I wrote it down: https://git.gnome.org/browse/evince/commit/?h=wip/gmenu&id=c100e1fd670e4cdca935c867b652bcda82360fde
<didrocks> seb128: rohhhh
<larsu> haha
<seb128> larsu, ok, so that's buggy somehow
<seb128> larsu, in shell/ev-window.c
<seb128> ev_window_document_changed (EvWindow *ev_window,
<seb128> 			    gpointer  user_data)
<seb128> {
<seb128> 	if (ev_window->priv->settings &&
<seb128> 	    g_settings_get_boolean (ev_window->priv->settings, GS_AUTO_RELOAD))
<seb128>  
<seb128> settings is NULL there
<seb128> which makes it bail out from reloading
<larsu> right ... that looks like an oversight
<larsu> I've replaced the other ones with ev_application_get_settings()
<seb128> larsu, can you take it from there and fix it?
<seb128> you probably know that code better than me
<larsu> seb128: of course. I'm already on it :)
<seb128> larsu, danke!
<seb128> larsu, I'm buying you a croissant au chocolat next time we meet
<seb128> shame for didrocks that he's trolling me
<seb128> he's going to regreat not having one
<seb128> :-p
<didrocks> I can't have one, that doesn't exist again :)
<larsu> I will eat it in front of him and he'll implode because of a lack of logic
<didrocks> so I can't eat something that doesn't exist
<didrocks> </sheldon>
<seb128> larsu, seems you are right, it's starting
<seb128> ;-)
<larsu> gotta be careful
<larsu> we don't actually want to lose didrocks :)
<didrocks> you and all your illogicness! ;)
 * didrocks hugs larsu
 * didrocks hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs didrocks and larsu ;-)
 * larsu joins the hugfest
<seb128> larsu, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evince/+bug/1279755 assigned to you
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1279755 in evince (Ubuntu) "Evince no longer automatically reloads PDF on change" [High,Triaged]
<Sweetshark> grouphug!
<larsu> seb128: thanks :)
<seb128> larsu, thank *you* for fixing it ;-)
<seb128> Sweetshark, you can join, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/1:4.2.0-0ubuntu1 moved to release pocket!
<seb128> well done
<MacSlow> seb128, larsu: the workarea branch is good go to
<seb128> \o/
<seb128> MacSlow, thanks for the review!
<larsu> thanks man
<MacSlow> larsu, such "mostly red"-diffs are my favourite :)
<larsu> MacSlow: same :)
<larsu> the biggest one is that we have gdk_screen_get_monitor_workarea() now
<MacSlow> larsu, yeah I think I didn't have that initially and had to use plain X11 to get that
<larsu> right
<Mirv> didrocks: I wonder where the metacity upload went since I don't see it?
<MacSlow> but it's so long ago, I don't remember what call was added with which gtk+ version
<didrocks> Mirv: hum metacity_2.34.13-0ubuntu4_source.ubuntu.upload
<didrocks> Mirv: I didn't get any rejection email
<didrocks> Mirv: just redputed -f
<seb128> didrocks, Mirv: right serie in the changelog?
<didrocks> trusty when I checked
<seb128> k, dunno then
<didrocks> Distribution: trusty
<didrocks> second dput workedâ¦
<didrocks> I even didn't resign
<didrocks> just dput -f (as the first one had a .upload file already)
<seb128> weird indeed
<Sweetshark> seb128: \o/
<Mirv> didrocks: weird
<Mirv> now there anyway
<marga> Hey mterry, seb128 said that you might be able to shade some insight into a problem I'm having... I'll repeat what I said earlier.
<marga> mterry, I'm having trouble with an issue running trusty, which I can't figure out.  The problem is that when I just boot, I can't switch VTs.  If I restart lightdm, though, I can.  I've found that seat0 is set to "CanGraphical=no", whereas in a non-customized installation it's set to "CanGraphical=yes".
<marga> mterry, I'm assuming some config file of mine is causing this, but I already tried moving some away to no avail.  Any suggestions?
<seb128> sil2100, there?
<marga> uhm, also, the vanilla installation I'm coparing to is a VM, whereas the one that doesn't work is a real machine with an NVIDIA card... It might be related to that last fact, maybe.
<seb128> Laney, attente_, mpt, (tedg, kenvandine if you want to join): settings meeting in ~10min
<seb128> mterry, hey
<mterry> seb128, hello
<seb128> mterry, did you see marga's question a bit earlier? (asking but you might have IRC timeouted and missed it)
<mterry> seb128, missed it
<marga> I have just found that it's totally NVIDIA's fault.
<seb128> marga, you should ask again ;-)
<seb128> oh ok, "good" I guess
<marga> If I use nvidia-331 it works fine, but with nvidia-current it doesn't.
<asac> mlankhorst: when will the xorg-server build bustage be fixed?
<seb128> mterry, seems missing it spared you work, good move ;-)
<marga> What's the deal with that? Why is "current" still pointing to 304?
<seb128> asac, it's fixed, cf #ubuntu-devel
<mterry> seb128, :)
<seb128> asac, but builds failed because the CI copy copied the new binaries to universe
<mlankhorst> asac: /me shakes magic 8ball
<mlankhorst> outlook not so good :-(
<seb128> asac, I just promoted those, need to wait another publisher run now to retry
<seb128> marga, tseliot is maintaining those, you can ask him I guess, I don't follow the versioning much
<asac> seb128: ok, so we rebuild xorg and with some luck stuff will build?
<asac> and then kgunn can continue?
<seb128> asac, retrying the builds once the publisher has moved the binaries to main should let us finish that transition yes
<mlankhorst> the mir architectures still fail :P
<seb128> mlankhorst, did you retry?
<seb128> mlankhorst, or do they fail because of a code bug/issue in the upload?
<Laney> no
<mlankhorst> because ne w mir is not published y et
<Laney> he retried too early
<seb128> shrug
<Laney> use rmadison to check
<seb128> mlankhorst, I told you to use rmadison
<Laney> seb already said that
<tseliot> marga: we migrated nvidia-current to 334 because nvidia-current used to contain a driver that supported legacy cards, and nvidia-304 happens to be a legacy driver.
<seb128> mlankhorst, you are wasting buildds resources by retrying like that
<seb128> Laney, get your tablet, settings meeting about to start ;-)
<Laney> phone!
<seb128> that works too!
<marga> tseliot, ok, so there are no plans of making nvidia-current point to anything more current?
<tseliot> marga: not really. We only still keep it around to help with dist-upgrades.
<marga> tseliot, ok.  No other meta package to help with staying current either?
<seb128> mpt, kenvandine, ted, attente_, Wellark: who is coming for the settings meeting?
<mlankhorst> asac kgunn didrocks: why not spend the time waiting on testing mesa 10.1.0-rc1 :D
<mlankhorst> https://launchpad.net/~canonical-x/+archive/x-staging/+packages
<tseliot> marga: are you asking because your packages need to depend on nvidia or only because you want to always get the latest driver?
<marga> tseliot, I'd like to always get the latest driver, yes.
<mlankhorst> seb128: you too btw^ :D
<seb128> mlankhorst, k
<tseliot> marga: ok, then either nvidia-331 or nvidia-331-updates. When we move to whatever LTS version NVIDIA comes up with, these two packages will become transitional and you'll be migrated to the correct driver.
<marga> tseliot, ok, I understand.  But just to be sure, is there a reason why you don't want a meta package that is always the same?
<kenvandine> seb128, lonely ?
<attente_> mpt, hey, since we probably can't change the system display language on the fly, how should we prompt the user to reboot the phone when the language is changed?
<mlankhorst> marga: that's a bad idea, nvidia has dropped support for cards previously
<tseliot> marga: the rationale for this kind of behaviour is that if NVIDIA decides to drop support for a number of cards in their newer driver, we can decide to migrate users to the legacy driver, thus preventing problems on upgrades.
<seb128> kenvandine, were, but it's fine now, we are 4
<marga> mlankhorst, tseliot: ok, everything clear.  Thanks.
<tseliot> np
<seb128> kenvandine, we miss you though!
 * kenvandine hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs kenvandine back
<Laney> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ofono/+bug/1276699/comments/5 is the comment I was mentioning
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1276699 in ofono (Ubuntu) "scan-for-operator script fails: org.ofono.Error.Failed: Operation failed" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<Laney> I bet the D-Bus API changed
<seb128> seems possible yeah
<seb128> blame rsalveti!
<sil2100> seb128: what's up?
<sil2100> Been deep in code ;)
<seb128> sil2100, what do you code on?
<sil2100> seb128: OSK bug-hunting
<seb128> oh
<seb128> did you track it down? ;-)
<rsalveti> seb128: haha
<rsalveti> I did the original implementation, that worked fine :P
<seb128> rsalveti, then you handed over and it well downhill!
<seb128> went even
<sil2100> seb128: not entirely, but I think I'm close!
<seb128> sil2100, do you have some free slots to deal with landing requests for desktop stuff? (they should be safe since they don't impact touch)
<sil2100> seb128: I see most of them are assigned already, and I think that's a good thing to release those
<seb128> sil2100, the CI train ones or the old landing pipeline ones?
<seb128> sil2100, I put 3 on the old landing ask for things that are not under CI train yet
<sil2100> Aaaaaaa
<sil2100> seb128: ok, I'll try to look at those, not sure if didrocks didn't want all projects to use the CI train already - but for small projects like that I guess we could still release in the old way
<seb128> sil2100, thanks
<seb128> larsu, evince fixed verified&uploaded
<larsu> seb128: thanks :)
<seb128> thank you!
<seb128> bregma, Trevinho, the new unity has some issues :/
<bregma> seb128, hardly surprising since landing has been blocked for 4 months
<seb128> for specifics
<seb128> - in expose mode, there is some flickering between the windows and the decoration
<seb128> (e.g open 2 nautilus win, click on the launcher icon)
<seb128> likely something for Trevinho with the new decorations
<seb128> - the first time the dash is open (or resized) the background is solid black
<Trevinho> seb128: mh let me check
<seb128> that's really visible and not nice
<seb128> that's on a intel i5 hardware
<Trevinho> ah, seb128 yes... Well I've two ways to fix it...
<Trevinho> one is caching the texture before painting it, the other is trying the new cairo....
<Trevinho> as it seems that this paint using a scaled texture causes some slowdown, and I'd like to see if the new cairo with device scaling might help
<seb128> Trevinho, new cairo?
<Trevinho> so I left that as it is but it's a minor known thing :)
<seb128> Trevinho, I'm running the git snapshot from the desktop ppa here
<Trevinho> seb128: cairo with device scaling...
<seb128> Trevinho, I'm running that version
<Trevinho> seb128: yes, but I'm not using its features in uinity yet
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> well, in any case it's quite unpleasant looking
<seb128> we can't land that to trusty like that :/
<Trevinho> seb128: mh it's quite stuble here... but I guess it depends on hw... so I can fix it by caching the value
<seb128> it's quite visible on my i5 laptop and that's not a slow box
<seb128> it's sure not a very recent one, but it's not a notebook either
<Trevinho> seb128: that's not due to new decorations though... at least that's due to the gtk theming that we're using for decorations... Before we were painting things guessing the theme, now we're using the real one and this might be more expensive
<seb128> Trevinho, you are speaking about the flickering or the dash background?
<Trevinho> flickering
<seb128> Trevinho, oh, sorry, that's minor in my opinion
<Trevinho> as for the dash bg... mh, never got it :o
<seb128> the annoying one is the dash background being solid
<Trevinho> solid or black?
<Trevinho> do you have a screenshot?
<didrocks> sil2100: seb128: we'll need someone at some point for those though
<Trevinho> as there have been a lot of changes, and not having daily-landing and the human-quality checking every few days possibly made us to lose something....
<didrocks> (those projects)
<didrocks> Trevinho: registered on the FOSDEM side (see my request yesterday) btw?
<seb128> didrocks, right, I just don't want to block e.g themes fixes on finding somebody
<didrocks> sure
<Trevinho> btw the dash might be draw less (better thing), and this might lead to problems
<Trevinho> didrocks: mh, what you mean sorry, probably I missed something :P
<didrocks> Trevinho: so that our talk is published on the FOSDEM website, you had to register on it
<didrocks> so that you are linked as a speaker
<Trevinho> didrocks: ah ok :)
<didrocks> Trevinho: just tell me once done, I'll then email
<Trevinho> didrocks: is there a form? as I can't find anything on the site...
<didrocks> Trevinho: https://penta.fosdem.org
<Trevinho> didrocks: oh, thanks but it asks me for a password
<didrocks> Trevinho: click on FOSDEM 2014
<didrocks> and there is a sign in
<didrocks> ah
<didrocks> Trevinho: https://penta.fosdem.org/submission
<didrocks> that link should work and you have create account
<seb128> Trevinho, bregma: http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/unity.ogv
<seb128> Trevinho, bregma: that's what opening the dash first time after unity start or restart is with the new unity for me
<Trevinho> seb128: mhhm
<seb128> Trevinho, you see what I mean by "not nice looking" ;-)
<Trevinho> ok it might be due to the fact compiz doesn't send the texture to compiz quick enough...
<Trevinho> seb128: I'm a bit busy now but I could check how we could avoid that later... but I'd probably need you to test the code :)
<Trevinho> seb128: are you using multi-monitor?
<seb128> Trevinho, yes, dual screen
<Trevinho> seb128: can you try to remove one?
<seb128> Trevinho, no such issues then
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, it's something I experienced some time ago, but I've not found that anymore... it looks that compiz is laggy in sending the proper framebuffer texture to secondary monitors in some cases... but really I've not had this anymore since long time... :/
<seb128> Trevinho, bregma: I opened https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1279886 about that
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1279886 in unity (Ubuntu) "[new-trusty-unity, multimonitor] Dash background displayed as solid on first opening" [High,New]
<Trevinho> seb128: thanks
<seb128> yw
<Trevinho> seb128: tell me, does it happen in both monitors for you?
<seb128> Trevinho, shrug, it doesn't happen anymore now that I played with xrandr to turn one screen on/off
<seb128> now I've the same issue on the launcher and only on one screen it seems
<seb128> the launcher icons also have "flicker" when you move them
<Trevinho> seb128: it's basically a race...
<seb128> like you can first see a white rectangle behind
<Trevinho> seb128: that's an old thing
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I pay more attention than usual because I'm doing testing :p
<Trevinho> seb128: and that's because the texture doesn't get alpha background for some reasons at the beginning
<Trevinho> I've tried to fix... ity but with no jou
<Trevinho> joy
<seb128> k
<Trevinho> or... maybe I've an idea now... let me try
<Sweetshark> ricotz: btw, I created https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/libreoffice-4-2 -- Im not populating it for trusty now as the main archive is up-to-date, but feel free to dump saucy/raring/precise stuff there.
<ricotz> Sweetshark, ok, but raring is EOL ;), will some "final" 4.2 builds in the main ppa first though
<ricotz> Sweetshark, did you got my concerns?
<ricotz> <ricotz> hi, jfyi, libo_CHECK_SYSTEM_MODULE([mdds], [MDDS], [mdds >= 0.10.1])
<ricotz> <ricotz> not 0.9.1 like the packaging currently refers to
<ricotz> <ricotz> also please pick up http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=commitdiff;h=3ff0aa58c9aa10a1e173aaef294b8be1c3958d0f;hp=619a5d1159e28c0010a49649feb43c64a3a68f3b
<ricotz> Sweetshark, please push the packaging branches too
<Sweetshark> ricotz: yeah, noted.
<Sweetshark> ricotz: ah, will do.
<ricotz> Sweetshark, thx
<Trevinho> didrocks: finally done... account name: 3v1n0
<Trevinho> seb128: so, it seems that my idea about the launcher icon was right... can you confirm it: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6926582/ ?
<didrocks> Trevinho: great, thanks
<Trevinho> didrocks: thank you!
<seb128> Trevinho, not now but, I don't have an unity build tree locally, going to take a bit
<seb128> Trevinho, I'm going to try later and let you know
<Trevinho> seb128: thanks
<seb128> sil2100, nice that you debug, but can't drop everything else on the floor for most of a day, need to context switch sometimes... what's the status of the landings we discussed earlier?
<Laney> we should get some desktop landers ...
<Laney> ;-)
<seb128> Trevinho, your new decorations don't have a context menu, is that wanted?
<Trevinho> seb128: otp
<seb128> k
<Trevinho> seb128: so... no, it's something I've still to do... And at this point I want to make it for both the panel (for maximized windows) and the  normal decorations, but that's a minor thing I left for next weeks
<Trevinho> before UIF
<seb128> ok, as long as it's coming before the LTS
<seb128> that seems like a regression and a blocker to land new decorations though
<Trevinho> seb128: sure, the same is for the "this window is freezed" dialog..
<Trevinho> seb128: it's a regression indeed, but I'm not sure design ever wanted them in theory... it was just a legacy functionality left out from the gtk-window-decorator
<Trevinho> ah, if you upgraded please make sure if the decor plugin and the gtk.-window-decorator are not loaded anymore there (I've added migration scripts, bu who knows...)
<seb128> Trevinho, dropping those features is what angry our users and we agreed we don't want to angry more of them before the LTS
<Trevinho> seb128: I know, and that's why they'll be back
<Trevinho> it's something I already stated on the MR of the new decorations...
<seb128> Trevinho, they are not, I downgraded back to the trusty version to compare thing and I had no decoration :p
<Trevinho> seb128: nice :)
<seb128> Trevinho, well, we are not supposed to land things with regression, they should not be merged if they are not feature complete
<seb128> Trevinho, and yeah, menus are not great, but designers didn't provide us any other way to e.g pin a video player on top for example
<seb128> which is an useful feature if you want to watch something in a corner while keeping doing other stuff
<Trevinho> seb128: things are depening on it and we can't block trun because of this... you understand, that it would make merging impossible otherwise
<Trevinho> trunk^
<seb128> the decorator work shouldn't have landed in trunk while it was incomplete
<Trevinho> seb128: indeed. I use that, and ti's planned to get them back
<seb128> Trevinho, I understand you, but it was decided we would stop landing stuff with regression because then priorities changes and work is dropped and we release with regressions
<seb128> the only way to stop that is to not land stuff until they are complete
<seb128> Trevinho, that's nothing against you btw, but we have rules and they should be followed
<seb128> bregma, ^
<Trevinho> seb128: I know... Np I'll work on them asap, but really.. that was a very minor thing compared the all work needed to get all the decorations in
<Trevinho> seb128: have you noticed that last nautilus + light-themes (the ones from the build ppa, so trunk) has "rounded" corners under the decorations? http://i.imgur.com/YKsXdGR.png
<Trevinho> seb128: basically it was because it used to use an header-bar
<Trevinho> but it's quite ugly
<seb128> hum
<seb128> what nautilus version do you use?
<Trevinho> seb128: also the "home" button is cut on the left side
<seb128> that was supposed to be fixed by the version uploaded
<Trevinho> seb128: 1:3.10.1-0ubuntu4
<seb128> hum
<seb128> Trevinho, I had the pixel issue, I pointed it on https://code.launchpad.net/~darkxst/ubuntu/trusty/nautilus/310/+merge/200275
<seb128> but the version update he did fixed it
<seb128> I need to check again
<seb128> yeah, doesn't happen for me
<seb128> with the old decorator
<seb128> but I doubt that has to do with the decorator
<Trevinho> seb128: no, it's unrelated... it seems an app issue
<Trevinho> as the decorator draws outside the window shape
<Trevinho> I might have some outdated packages though
<Trevinho> but surely not nautilus or light-themes
<seb128> Trevinho, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~darkxst/ubuntu/trusty/nautilus/310/revision/406 was supposed to fix that
<seb128> and the fix works for me
<seb128> what is your XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP?
<Trevinho> seb128: unity of course..
<seb128> Trevinho, you never know with env, they can get screwed
<seb128> I was speaking about the env variable
<Trevinho> yes, yes.. but I've cheked :)
<seb128> not the desktop you run ;-)
<seb128> k
<seb128> well, I can't confirm, but I'm going to keep an eye on it
<Trevinho> ah. wait... the fix was after 1:3.8.2-0ubuntu4
<Trevinho> according the changelog
<Trevinho> oh, no .... I confused the main version...
<Trevinho> yeah the revision I have should work
<popey> seb128: found it! control+space!
<Trevinho> seb128: but for your information, I'm getting htat also with metacity...
<Trevinho> so it's not really an unity issue
<seb128> popey, yeah, that's the keybinding to switch layout...
<seb128> popey, how do you press that by error/without noticing?!
<popey> http://imgur.com/nQMk94C
<seb128> Trevinho, yeah, I didn't expect it, the headerbar gives round corners but that codepath should be disabled under !GNOME
<seb128> popey, right, that's normal
<seb128> popey, ctrl-space is the ibus keybinding to cycle layouts
<popey> i have _never_ seen that dialog before today â»
<seb128> popey, it was not working before
<seb128> seems they fixed it with the recent ibus update
<popey> i forsee an apt-get remove of ibus in my future
<seb128> big hammer
<seb128> you can run ibus-setup and disable the keybinding
<popey> i only have uk layout
<seb128> but how do you manage to do ctrl-space by error?
<popey> so why would it flip to us when i only have one?
<seb128> because us is always added as a fallback
<popey> and in "Text entry" it says "Super+Space" not Ctrl+Space
<seb128> that's needed so e.g ctrl-C works in russian layouts
<seb128> right
<seb128> text entry is our layout stuff
<seb128> ibus-setup is ibus
<seb128> we should probably disable the ibus one by default
<seb128> I'm still interested on how you press those 2 keys by error
<seb128> I wonder if that's a common issue
<seb128> they are not near of each others on my keyboard
<popey> V is near space
<popey> CTRL+V is something I press often
<popey> but I dont think I mis-hit
<popey> I think I have CTRL held down too long then move on to pressing space after pasting something
<popey> so press and hold ctrl, tap v, press space, lift ctrl
<popey> thanks for the info, happy now â»
<seb128> popey, yw, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ibus/+bug/1278511 btw
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1278511 in ibus (Ubuntu) "CTRL-Space no longer works under Unity" [High,Confirmed]
<bschaefer> seb128, that should be because it was changed to Super+Space right?
<bschaefer> in ibus 1.5.3?
 * bschaefer thinks that bug is invalid...
<attente_> i have an old ibus branch that disables the trigger under unity if that's what we want to do
<robert_ancell> cyphermox_, has network manager gone unstable recently? I'm getting issues connecting to a WiFi repeater and I had issues connecting to an airport lounge network (my Android phone connects fine to both)
<robert_ancell> I'm thinking the lounge might be a similar case of a repeater. When I disable the repeater it works fine
<cyphermox_> robert_ancell: no
<robert_ancell> cyphermox_, the good thing is I can easily reproduce by switching the repeater on and off - what logs can I give?
<cyphermox_> I'm getting issues with my own wifi device too, I think there has been changes in the kernel
<cyphermox_> robert_ancell: usually syslog has what we need
<robert_ancell> ok, I'll be back in a sec
<robert_ancell> cyphermox_, does http://paste.ubuntu.com/6927515/ give any hints?
<bschaefer> seb128, hey, do you know if libcairo 2.0 is landing for 14.04?
<cyphermox_> robert_ancell: 80:3F:5D:98:16:55 is the repeater?
<seb128> bschaefer, is there a such thing?
<bschaefer> err
<bschaefer> seb128, i though Trevinho talked to you about it?
<robert_ancell> cyphermox_, yes. Used to work fine
<seb128> bschaefer, attente_: no opinion on the ibus keybinding, if you stuff superseed it we should disable the ibus keys
<cyphermox_> there's this weird "wrong mac address" wl_cfg80211_get_station error too
<seb128> bschaefer, oh, you mean hidpi support? that's not 2.0
<bschaefer> seb128, o thought it was 2.0, my bad
<bschaefer> seb128, but yes!
 * bschaefer has the ppa but didn't check the version
<seb128> bschaefer, no worry, and yes I want to land that, but upstream isn't rolling tarball and I don't like uploading random git snapshots
<seb128> bschaefer, it's 1.3
<cyphermox_> robert_ancell: there is no error aside fro that "wrong mac address" message and the information that you're roaming to a different device
<bschaefer> seb128, alright, we can plan accordingly :), thanks!
<cyphermox_> robert_ancell: could you be on a system with the iwldvm driver?
<bschaefer> seb128, for now ill just assume it wont land so we don't get stuck depending on it
<attente_> i want to disable it, but maybe clearing the default is enough?
<bschaefer> attente_, disabling umm ctrl+space? Or super?
<robert_ancell> "12:00.0 Network controller: Broadcom Corporation BCM4313 802.11bgn Wireless Network Adapter (rev 01)"
<cyphermox_> nope. :/
<attente_> bschaefer, ctrl+space, the ibus trigger
<robert_ancell> Don't know what kernel driver that uses these days
<seb128> attente_, clear/disable, what's the difference?
<bschaefer> attente_, i think im a bit out of context :)
<attente_> when switching using ctrl+space, i-keyboard doesn't see it happen, so it doesn't reflect the current im properly
<cyphermox_> robert_ancell: sudo /usr/lib/NetworkManager/debug-helper.py --wpa debug
<bschaefer> attente_, right it doesn't only super+space
<robert_ancell> cyphermox_, after the problem or now?
<cyphermox_> robert_ancell:  run that and reproduce the issue please
<attente_> seb128, i mean disable as in it won't work even if the user sets it through ibus-setup
<robert_ancell> ok
<bschaefer> attente_, could you add ctrl+space to the keyboard indicator?
<cyphermox_> well, running it for a while helps
<attente_> clear as in, just change the default to be no keybinding
<bschaefer> attente_, i can imagine that making some users confused
<attente_> the user could still set it
<robert_ancell> cyphermox_, and get syslog?
<cyphermox_> we'll get to know more about what wpa thinks of all this
<cyphermox_> yup
<cyphermox_> it's all going to end up in syslog
<Trevinho> seb128: let's continue evaluating it, but the fact is that if we want hidpi support in 14.04 (for gtk apps) there's not much choice
<attente_> bschaefer, the thing is it's basically two different key bindings
<Trevinho> seb128: or just backporting the relative patch
<seb128> bschaefer, Trevinho: you can count on it landing
<bschaefer> seb128, cool, that works as well, thanks again!
<seb128> bschaefer, Trevinho: I uploaded it in the ppa a week ago, I plan to move that forward, I just got busy
<seb128> bschaefer, Trevinho: it's going to be in trusty next week one way or another
<Trevinho> seb128: nice
<bschaefer> seb128, yup, i've been using that ppa for a bit now and no problems
<bschaefer> attente_, hmm correct they are, you should be able to read all the ibus hotkeys
<bschaefer> through gconf or w/e they use now a days
<bschaefer> attente_, im not sure how hard it is for the keyboard indicator to use more then 1 hotkey for this
<attente_> bschaefer, but if the user uses the ibus hotkey, they'll only be switching among the ibus input methods
<attente_> if the user uses the g-s-d key, they'll be switching among those + keyboard layouts
<bschaefer> attente_, right, but if you hook up keyboard indicator to read the ibus hotkeys, cant you just set those hotkeys?
<bschaefer> for g-s-d to act on?
<attente_> bschaefer, oh. i see what you mean
<bschaefer> attente_, again, i think im missing something but that sounds like the most dynamic method
<attente_> for i-keyboard to intercept the ibus one?
<bschaefer> attente_, right, as i-keyboard already depends on ibus right?
 * bschaefer hasn't checked in a while...
<robert_ancell> cyphermox_, I should email you that log right? Looks like it has keys in it
<robert_ancell> cyphermox_, also, how to disable debugging
<bschaefer> attente_, its a bit close to FF but there use to be a way to read the hot keys from ibus...i think i have it down in an AP test
 * bschaefer goes to check
<attente_> bschaefer, if we do this, i'm afraid of the situation where both keybindings are equal to each other
<bschaefer> attente_, isn't that how it is by default? Super+Space?
<attente_> bschaefer, it comes from /desktop/ibus/general/hotkey triggers i believe
<bschaefer> right
<bschaefer>         variant = config.get_value('general/hotkey', 'triggers')
<bschaefer> is how im getting it in python AP test
<attente_> bschaefer, ibus default seems to have changed to control+space recently
<bschaefer> attente_, ooo yeah thats interesting...it use to be super+space for most of this dev cycle :)
<bschaefer> attente_, hmm it use to work when both were the same though? How would that cause issues now?
<attente_> bschaefer, ironically i think it wasn't a problem before because they were fighting over the same key grab...
<bschaefer> attente_, haha, i see. Those are always fun bugs :)
<attente_> but if we were to get i-keyboard intercepting it, i'd try to use the key grabber for that...
<bschaefer> so now the problem is... if you set the hotkeys dynamically, if ibus gets it first, i-keyboard wont get it
<bschaefer> attente_, it might not be a bad idea to, by default remove the hotkey from ibus, and add super+space / ctrl+space under i-keyboard
<bschaefer> to change langauge?
<bschaefer> language*
<bschaefer> which is what you were suggesting a bit ago (i think)
<attente_> well, i was only proposing the first half of what you're proposing now
<attente_> disabling the ibus trigger completely under unity
<bschaefer> that would work for most use cases, another problem is umm anthy or hangul users usually use Alt_L + <something>
<bschaefer> theres always to many things to remember for input methods
<bschaefer> attente_, that doesn't sound like a bad idea vs what we have now
<attente_> bschaefer, the actual keybinding doesn't matter so much
<attente_> bschaefer, they can still set it to Alt_L + <something> under the text entry settings
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner, damn, that was some fast shipping!
<bschaefer> attente_, i wonder if we could just let users set what they want in ibus, and i-keyboard reads it
<bschaefer> attente_, but have ibus patched such that it doesnt actually try to grab those keys?
<bschaefer> that way theres no fighting...
<bschaefer> attente_, that also sounds like a crazy-ish idea...and yours sounds a bit safer
<attente_> bschaefer, so you want both the g-s-d switcher and ibus switcher to work?
<sil2100> seb128: hi! Those old landings from the old spreadsheet - you guys tested those on the desktop right?
<seb128> sil2100, good morning! yes
<attente_> bschaefer, i mean work exactly the same way
<sil2100> seb128: let me land some of them then
<bschaefer> attente_, well yes above the hood
<seb128> sil2100, thanks
<bschaefer> attente_, we could force users to only use g-s-d though to change the hotkey
<robert_ancell> cyphermox_, there?
<cyphermox_> robert_ancell: yeah, email. to disable you can either reboot or use --wpa info
<bschaefer> attente_, but im not sure how easy it'll be for them to find it if they are use to ibus-setup
<bschaefer> attente_, just trying to avoid the confusion of not being able to find where to change the hotkeys when they fail or something
<bschaefer> attente_, but really, what is the easiest + best way for you to solve this atm?
<attente_> bschaefer, i'd say disabling the input trigger under unity is easiest
<bschaefer> attente_, that sounds good to me :)
<attente_> bschaefer, it avoids a lot of side effects of trying to support two different keyboard layout/IM switchers...
<bschaefer> right
<attente_> and i'm thinking of the case of the bug seb128 posted earlier
<bschaefer> attente_, it would get very chaotic, and simple is usually best
<attente_> if your ctrl+space is broken in emacs
<attente_> and it's not obvious why ctrl+space is grabbed by ibus
<bschaefer> very true, and finding out why is no easier...
<attente_> then your first instinct would be to check the text entry panel i would think...
<attente_> but then you don't see it there, it's set in ibus-setup
<robert_ancell> cyphermox_, emailed
<bschaefer> yeah, i would assume users who dont use ibus wont have a clue
<attente_> which most people aren't using...
<bschaefer> attente_, though really if they dont use ibus it should be started :)
<attente_> bschaefer, agreed
<bschaefer> shouldnt*
<bschaefer> which is how i imagined things use to work
<attente_> bschaefer, aha.. we've come full circle again..
<bschaefer> :)
<robert_ancell> Is this why ctrl+space doesn't work anymore...
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, i would imagine, if you check if ibus-daemon is running, i would assume its stealing your hotkey
<robert_ancell> sneaky ibus
<robert_ancell> yep, it's running
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, to fix that for right now, you should be able to do ibus-setup
<bschaefer> and remove the hotkey
<attente_> robert_ancell, you're using emacs? or this is something else?
<bschaefer> or kill the daemon
<robert_ancell> emacs
<bschaefer> but the daemon autostarts :(
<bschaefer> attente_, isn't input fun to get right? haha...
<seb128> robert_ancell, ibus-setup to disable it
<attente_> bschaefer, it's a joy :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey btw ;-)
<robert_ancell> fixed:)
<bschaefer> attente_, :), hmm sooo ibus does need to start up for i-keyboard...?
<bschaefer> attente_, which is fine, lets disable the hotkey under unity, make it super+space, if the ibus users want ctrl+space they can set it and be happy
<bschaefer> while we dont trample on emacs users, or any users who don't use ibus
<attente_> bschaefer, i-k only needs it for getting the IM name and icon, which is only necessary if the user has one in his lsit
<attente_> *list
<attente_> bschaefer, disable it? or set the default to super+space?
<bschaefer> attente_, sorry, set default to super+space
<bschaefer> some users will complain though...
<bschaefer> as ctrl+space has been the default for ibus for a long time
<bschaefer> well for IMs for a while...
<attente_> i thought super+space was default in 13.10
<bschaefer> attente_, hmm it could have been? Im sort of lost on the time atm :)
<bschaefer> attente_, where was ibus 1.5.3 pushed to main?
<bschaefer> when*
<bschaefer> last release?
<attente_> bschaefer, not sure, changelog says last september
<bschaefer> the last entry in ibus is:  -- Osamu Aoki <osamu@debian.org>  Sat, 24 Aug 2013 01:25:05 +0900 ... which yeah
<attente_> whoops, right
<bschaefer> attente_, hmm which should have been in for 13.10
<bschaefer> and i haven't heard of to many complaints...but the fact that ibus changed back to ctrl+space sounds like there was enough to change it back
<bschaefer> attente_, so i suppose back to why i-k needs ibus, which is only for the IM name and icon if the user has one in its list?
<bschaefer> the list of IMs? like pinyin?
<bschaefer> (which is installed by default IIRC)
<attente_> there's one other case where i-k needs ibus
<bschaefer> it was that crash right?
 * bschaefer forgot that bug...
<attente_> um.. just when migrating the user's old settings to the g-s-d input source settings
<bschaefer> attente_, wasn't there this crash, if ibus wasn't started but then the user selected like pinyin or something...
<bschaefer> in the i-k, ... i can't remember much more from it
<bschaefer> attente_, well so if we need ibus started, then im fine for just moving the default to super+space
<bschaefer> if the users want ctrl+space, they'll have to do that them selfs, but thats fine
<attente_> yeah
<attente_> i'm seeing the changelog again, it does seem like it was super+space at one point:
<attente_>   * This initiates ibus 1.4 to 1.5 transition.  This changes IM
<attente_>     switching key to SUPER-space and integrates xkb.
<attente_>     Closes: #690605, #699368
<bschaefer> right the 1.5 transition is when it happened
<bschaefer> and i've not heard any complaints about that in 13.10...
<cyphermox_> robert_ancell: I don't see anything weird
<cyphermox_> I'm guessing the repeater consistently has higher signal level than the other station so you'd always roam to it if it's available
<attente_> bschaefer, if there weren't any complaints before, maybe nobody will complain if we disable it :P
<bschaefer> attente_, but then the issue you were talking about before...if the user changes to ctrl+space...
<bschaefer> then i-k doesn't read it :(
<bschaefer> attente_, thats the hope :), though there will be a but more users on an LTS
<bschaefer> be a bit*
<cyphermox_> robert_ancell: you disconnected rather than waiting for it to roam didn't you?
<robert_ancell> cyphermox_, I "reconnected", i.e. clicked on the network name again
<cyphermox_> right
<robert_ancell> It doesn't seem to roam automatically for me
<robert_ancell> I can move to the lounge where the reception to  the repeater is awful. I'm sitting right beside the primary AP and it doesn't roam
<cyphermox_> ah? that's what seemed to happen from the first syslog
<attente_> bschaefer, if the user sets the key binding in ibus-setup, should ibus be able to switch the IM under g-s-d's nose?
<cyphermox_> I thought 80:... was the repeater
<bschaefer> attente_, hmm right, g-s-d shouldnt be responsible for changes in ibus, the user SHOULD really change the hotkey in g-s-d
<bschaefer> attente_, soo really, we just need to be sure to announce, if you want ctrl+space as your hotkey change it in g-s-d
<bschaefer> not ibus-setup
<bschaefer> attente_, it just seems unfair for g-s-d to be reasonable for two different hotkey settings...
<sil2100> seb128: ok, I published the 2 smaller ones, but I think didrocks will want unity-gtk-module to be released as part of CITrain
<seb128> sil2100, why? it's desktop only, and even so, we can figure that later rather than blocking fixes no?
<attente_> bschaefer, to put it simply, if the user sets the input trigger in ibus-setup, should that allow ibus to switch layouts?
<attente_> *input methods
<bschaefer> attente_, right, thats the question here hmm
<bschaefer> attente_, it seems like at this point, what is *wanted* by default right?
<attente_> because with g-s-d and g-c-c and i-k, i don't know if it makes sense for ibus to be managing that at all any more
<bschaefer> attente_, it would be really really really nice if ibus no longer controlled the hot keys if g-s-d is doing it
<bschaefer> that way the only way to change the hotkey was is in g-s-d/i-k?
<bschaefer> attente_, im not sure how to disable 'hotkeys for ibus only if g-s-d' is manging it though...
<bschaefer> attente_, i also have a very small perspective coming from the unity/ubuntu point of view
<bschaefer> attente_, to keep things simple, while keeping things sane, if the user changes the hotkey in ibus, i don't think g-s-d should be responsible for keeping up with that...
<bschaefer> it will make i-k useless though if that happens...
<robert_ancell> I feel bad that Ubuntu has rough edges and then I try Windows 8 and feel a lot better :)
<sil2100> seb128: I can publish, but if Didier or Alexander will be angry, I'll just send them to you ;)!
<seb128> sil2100, don't worry, I can handle them ;-)
<attente_> bschaefer, even if we change ibus' default back to super+space, we still have the problem of ibus changing input method under g-s-d's and i-k's nose
<seb128> robert_ancell, yeah, I tried to press the power button to reboot 3 times today, I missed the bios boot option and want to get back there ... press power, see the machine suspends, press again, wait to resume, grrr
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, :), i've yet to try windows 8 out ... it might be a refreshing thing to try
<attente_> as well as the apparent lack of consistency between ibus' list of IMs and g-s-d's list of input sources
<bschaefer> attente_, i know :(. We really should/must have only 1 place to change these hotkeys
<bschaefer> having more is over complicated things
<robert_ancell> bschaefer, it's got some nice ideas, but it's still got lots of rough edges
<robert_ancell> bschaefer, I definitely think it's a better bet than the traditional desktop for them
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, thats refreshing to hear
<attente_> bschaefer, maybe setting the ibus default to no hotkey is reasonable
<seb128> robert_ancell, they have the same issue we have, they are sitting between old school stuff and their new stuff, and you get a mixed bag
<bschaefer> attente_, it'll take some changing, but there must be only 1 place to change settings like this
<attente_> bschaefer, then if the user wants to explicitly do the switching by ibus, they can
<bschaefer> and i vote g-s-d, if its the only doing it by default
<attente_> bschaefer, and if the user never sets it, ibus never grabs something unintentionally important
<bschaefer> attente_, i agree...if the user wants to change the default go ahead
<bschaefer> but if it breaks things, all we can suggest is change it in g-s-d
<bschaefer> and things will work
<attente_> i don't know what effect this will have under other desktops though
<bschaefer> attente_, thats one thing im also worried about, but if g-s-d doesn't exist on other desktops
<bschaefer> then ibus will rule there
<bschaefer> hotkey changing wise
<attente_> bschaefer, in that case i guess the user manually sets it in ibus-setup
<bschaefer> we aren't disabling ibus it self from changing the hotkey, we'll just have g-s-d do it by default here...if they change that order
<bschaefer> then thats their issue, and will cause issues...
<bschaefer> but we can't control every possible situation
<bschaefer> attente_, if we make g-s-d control the hotkey, then thats what we support (imo)
<attente_> bschaefer, sorry.. i think you confused me a bit :S
<bschaefer> at lease when it comes to unity/ubuntu (again thats my area of perspective)
<bschaefer> attente_, i might be a bit confused :)
<Sweetshark> Hmmm, is reducing the LibreOffice noop incremental build time to two thirds good enough?
<bschaefer> attente_, so the issue we are talking about now, is if the users changes the hotkey in ibus-setup right?
<Sweetshark> whops, wrong window.
<robert_ancell> Sweetshark, we wont tell if you wont
<Sweetshark> robert_ancell: alright then ;)
<attente_> bschaefer, i guess it's several issues
<sil2100> seb128: hey, do you want to do a packaging ACK of the unity-gtk-modules package ? ;)
<attente_> bschaefer, g-s-d maintains a list of input sources, and switches between them using its own key bindings
<seb128> sil2100, yes, I approved the mr, +1
<sil2100> seb128: https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/cu2d/view/Head/view/Indicators/job/cu2d-indicators-head-3.0publish/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/packaging_changes_unity-gtk-module_0.0.0+14.04.20140213.2-0ubuntu1.diff <- it seems attente_ only moved packages around and added multi-arch
<seb128> sil2100, thanks!
<sil2100> \o/
<attente_> bschaefer, ibus maintains a list of input methods, and switches between them using its own key bindings
<bschaefer> attente_, correct, and by default g-s-d updates ibus to match its own right?
<bschaefer> users super+space? or do they both grab that key and update?
<bschaefer> using*
<attente_> bschaefer, g-s-d doesn't touch ibus's list of engines
<bschaefer> attente_, then how is ibus being updated along with g-s-ds' list?
 * bschaefer thought that is how things were happing...
<bschaefer> attente_, or was that the side effect you mentioned?
<attente_> g-s-d explicitly sets ibus' IM every time the user changes to an ibus input source
<bschaefer> i see... soo for example, if we press super+space a couple times and land on pinyin
<bschaefer> g-s-d sets ibus im to pinyin?
<attente_> bschaefer, right
<attente_> the little bit of code that does that is here: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-settings-daemon-team/unity-settings-daemon/trunk/view/head:/plugins/keyboard/gsd-keyboard-manager.c#L1160
<attente_> bschaefer, so g-s-d has its list and keybindings, ibus has its list and keybindings
<attente_> the problem is now we have the two trying to do the same thing
<attente_> no problem if g-s-d changes input sources, because all it does is explicitly set the IM if it's an ibus source
<bschaefer> attente_, we should, drop ibus hotkeys, and let g-s-d do this
<bschaefer> iff g-s-d is the one by default is doing this
<attente_> bschaefer, yeah. i'm just a bit concerned that someone will be like: oooh. ibus-setup, let's change the key trigger. hey it doesn't work...
<bschaefer> attente_, the fact we allow ibus to try to grab at the key as well sounds like a race condition/bug waiting to happen
<bschaefer> attente_, right, and if that happens, we don't support that if we are allowing g-s-d to do this
<bschaefer> well we can say we dont support doing that...
<bschaefer> any hotkey changes dealing with IM/ibus should happen through g-s-d
<attente_> bschaefer, works for me
<bschaefer> attente_, this is if and only if g-s-d is doing the hotkey stuff for IMs, that way ibus will normally work outside of g-s-d
<bschaefer> attente_, i don't think we can control that perfectly, and if the user does that
<attente_> bschaefer, ok, so we'll disable it and remove it from ibus-setup as well, just so there isn't any confusion i guess?
<bschaefer> attente_, sounds good
<bschaefer> attente_, as really, if the user does indeed set the hotkey in ibus-setup the language switcher will work for ibus
<attente_> bschaefer, and this is only under unity
<bschaefer> and g-s-d will no longer work
<bschaefer> attente_, yes!
<bschaefer> attente_, it would be good to somehow announce/have a bug that says, if you change the hotkey in ibus-setup it'll cause g-s-d to no longer to anything
<bschaefer> to no longer do*
<bschaefer> attente_, but i can only imagine this being an edge case where ibus users want ctrl+space...
<attente_> bschaefer, we won't need it if we remove the ability to set the key binding in ibus-setup
<bschaefer> attente_, if we can do that for unity/ubuntu that would be perfect!
<bschaefer> attente_, we should still have a nice place to let the users know where to change it now though hmm...
<attente_> bschaefer, i thought we agreed on disabling it entirely though
<bschaefer> attente_, even in g-s-d?
<attente_> no, i mean disabling ibus' keybindings only
<bschaefer> attente_, right, i agree with that, but if the users now want to change the hotkey and they only know about ibus-setup
<bschaefer> they will make a bug about ibus-setup not changing the hotkey
<bschaefer> attente_, but really, we can wait for the bugs to role in before doing anything
<bschaefer> roll*
<bschaefer> geez...
<bschaefer> attente_, anyway, i agree with that solution :)
<attente_> bschaefer, ok, will do
<bschaefer> attente_, cool, and thanks again for getting that compiz/unity key grabber landed!
<attente_> bschaefer, i think i owe the unity team a few beers for that one...
<bschaefer> attente_, :), i think at this point everyone owes everyone beers haha
<attente_> bschaefer, hehe :)
<ochosi> robert_ancell: just a very quick question on greeter+indicators: this is how you properly shut down the indicators (= kill them)? http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-greeter-team/unity-greeter/trunk/view/head:/src/unity-greeter.vala#L589
<robert_ancell> ochosi, yeah, we're pretty blunt in the greeter. We should use upstart
<ochosi> ok, just good to know
<robert_ancell> oh wait, we are now
<ochosi> since we support the indicators in gtk-greeter as well, we have to shut them down too ::)
<robert_ancell> indicator_pid is actually the upstrat pid
<robert_ancell> ochosi, but yeah, they should shutdown cleanly with SIGTERM
<ochosi> robert_ancell: ok, good to know. well we'll stick to what you're doing for now i guess
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-02-14
<robert_ancell> TheMuso`, you're working on bug 1266312?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1266312 in unity-control-center (Ubuntu) "Mute button is not labelled and Test sound button does not activate with Orca" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1266312
<robert_ancell> TheMuso`, if so, do you also want bug 1266291?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1266291 in gnome-control-center-unity (Ubuntu) "Workspace switcher toggle in Appearance Behaviour tab not available to Orca" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1266291
<TheMuso`> robert_ancell: Yeah I am actually working on both, just haven't assigned myself to the latter. I'll do that now.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, awesome, thanks
<robert_ancell> bschaefer, attente_, I assume bug 1270555 is related to what you were talking about before - is that a dup, can someone be assigned to that?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1270555 in unity-control-center (Ubuntu) "The Text Entry dialog shows invalid keyboard shortcuts to change layout" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1270555
 * bschaefer looks
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, ill save that for attente_ to take a look. Looks like it could be a different one possibly...
<robert_ancell> bschaefer, he might be offline, so I'll assign it to him :)
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, sounds good :)
<pitti> Good morning
<diwic> hi, I'm trying to test some changes in unity-settings-daemon, what's the recommended procedure? Uninstall gnome-session ?
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<seb128> happy friday
<diwic> seb128, good morning to you too!
<seb128> diwic, why? you should be able to just install it?
<seb128> diwic, hey ;-)
<Laney> morning
<Laney> happy friday indeed
<seb128> Laney, hey, how are you?
<diwic> seb128, so your workflow would be bzr branch lp:unity-settings-daemon, hack, and then...?
<seb128> diwic, bzr bd; sudo dpkg -i ../build-area/*.deb
<seb128> unity-settings-daemon --replace --debug
<seb128> or just copy the plugin .so over the system one
<diwic> seb128, but unity-settings-daemon conflicts with gnome-session ?
<seb128> diwic, it shouldn't
<Laney> it sure doesn't
<diwic> let me double check
<Laney> seb128: I'm good thanks, you?
<diwic> aha, maybe I'm just missing a dist-upgrade
<seb128> Laney, I'm good thanks
<seb128> diwic, robert_ancell did an upload this night to make gnome-session depends on g-s-d-schemas instead of g-s-d
<seb128> but g-s-d and u-s-d should be co-installable
<seb128> those changes are only if you want to remove g-s-d
<seb128> that you don't need to do
<diwic> seb128, I saw the breaks: gnome-session was versioned, and I seem not to have dist-upgraded in a while, so probably it's just that
<seb128> k
<seb128> diwic, is there any way to simulate an unknown audio device plugin to test your feature?
<diwic> seb128, in the next merge I'll add that TESTDIALOG define
<darkxst> heyo desktopers
<seb128> darkxst, hey
<seb128> diwic, ok
<darkxst> hey seb128
<diwic> seb128, hopefully today, I just got busy with a hwe bug that needs to take priority first
<seb128> no worry
<darkxst> seb128, so I was going to say I had a ppa for you to test, however I am hitting weird build failures
<seb128> darkxst, is that about gnome-desktop?
<darkxst> seb128, yes of course
<seb128> not giving up are you ;-)
<seb128> well, as said I doubt I've slot for it
<darkxst> nope!
<seb128> I've a list worth a month of work to check/land before ff next week
<seb128> things are getting slightly out of control there
<darkxst> right I will find another slot to land it
<seb128> well, don't block on me
<seb128> but I'm still of the opinion that it wouldn't be reasonable to land that before the LTS
<darkxst> just saying, something broke....
<seb128> what's the issue/error?
<darkxst> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/166020771/buildlog_ubuntu-trusty-amd64.gnome-settings-daemon_3.8.6.1-0ubuntu9~trusty1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<darkxst> looks like api changes but this built fine a couple of weeks ago :(
<darkxst> and gsd-cursor-manager is completely unrelated to the display config stuff
<darkxst> idle-monitor is included in the new packages btw
<seb128> don't upgrade people
<seb128> (guess it's late for most morning upgraders)
<larsu> seb128: uh oh. What broke?
<seb128> <zyga> hey, daily update left my system with this:
<seb128>  apt-get: error while loading shared libraries: libgcc_s.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
<seb128>  
<seb128> being discussed on #ubuntu-devel atm
<seb128> I'm going to keep you guys updated
<larsu> thanks :)
<seb128> larsu, is apt-get complaining about that for you?
<Laney> hum
<seb128> in fact that version got promoted 41 minutes ago
<seb128> so maybe most europeans updated before it hit the archive
<seb128> if some downloaded it, you can try to wget https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gcc-4.8/4.8.2-15ubuntu3/+build/5578881/+files/libgcc1_4.8.2-15ubuntu3_amd64.deb and install it
<larsu> seb128: no, I didn't get that
<larsu> I updated earlier though
<seb128> k
<seb128> stay away from the update trigger ;-)
 * larsu stays away
<Sweetshark> Moin all, btw!
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey
<Laney> postinsts R US
 * Laney offers a sacrifice to the gods of debian policy
<seb128> speaking of those
<seb128> mvo, hey, how are you?
<seb128> mvo, do you think you could have a look to the aptdaemon tests failing/ftbfs in trusty?
 * seb128 looks at pitti
<pitti> bonjour seb128, hey mvo
<seb128> pitti, salut, Ã§a va ?
<pitti> seb128: err, it's green? http://d-jenkins.ubuntu-ci:8080/view/Trusty/view/AutoPkgTest/job/trusty-adt-aptdaemon/27/
<seb128> pitti, seems like bug #1051951 regressed again (I didn't try for a while, but just plugged my ipod to test something and I get an usb stick icon)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1051951 in gvfs "music players are shown as usb drive not devices" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1051951
<pitti> seb128: Ã§a va bien, merci ! trÃ¨s mieux que trusty aujourd'hui âº
<seb128> trusty :/
<seb128> bah, launchpad timeout
<pitti> seb128: queueing for investigation
<seb128> pitti, it's not the autopkgtest that fails, it's the tests run during the build
<seb128> pitti, ID_MEDIA_PLAYER is set for the device
<pitti> seb128: ah, it's the same test, but hte last time aptdaemon was run was on Dec 13
<pitti> so it probably fails now due to some change
<pitti> seb128: oh, you mean the FTBFS of https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/aptdaemon/1.1.1-1ubuntu2
<seb128> pitti, yes
<pitti> mvo, seb128: hm, on trunk I only get a PEP-8 failure
 * pitti goes to fix them while wrestling with upgrade failures
<seb128> pitti, ok, maybe some fix to cherrypick there then
<seb128> pitti, btw I was looking at you for the gvfs issue, but thanks for picking up the aptdaemon one ;-)
<pitti> seb128: ah, that was mostly a quick drive-by thing, still deep in wrestling with upgrade issues; I'll keep gvfs on the radar, though
<seb128> pitti, I tried to debug a bit, I can continue doing it if you want
<seb128> well, rather I check basic stuff like that the old patch didn't get dropped
<seb128> and that the ID_MEDIA_PLAYER property is defined in udev output
<seb128> mpt, hey, what do you think about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/deja-dup/+bug/1280274? does the label suggestion makes sense there?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1280274 in deja-dup (Ubuntu) "The control panel includes a switch without description" [Undecided,New]
<tjaalton> is something broken with the keyboard layout? the switcher shows correct layout but I need to click it to take it in use, otherwise it's using us layout after login
<seb128> tjaalton, not a known issue, you are the first one to describe that
<seb128> wfm
<tjaalton> yeah it happens at least on one laptop
<tjaalton> but only on my session
<tjaalton> huh, now it works for me too..
<denisw> keyboard switching also changed for me too a few days ago (trusty) - since then, it is suddenly triggered with Ctrl-Space instead of Super-Space, which is really annoying with Emacs
<denisw> i don't know if this was a side effect of installing & trying out gnome-shell last week
<Trevinho> seb128: decorations menus are back, fyi.
<seb128> Trevinho, I saw the mp, great, thanks!
<Trevinho> even on panel now... is that enough for landing?
<seb128> Trevinho, wfm
<seb128> what's the status of the current CI train landing ask?
<seb128> do you guys plan to land the current version and do another landing soon
<seb128> or to update to include some extra fixes?
<Trevinho> seb128: I think we'd like to land asap... THe last AP tests given 7 failures (well, hundreds on intel, but I guess there's something broken with the test machine there)... So, we should be ok
<seb128> nice
<seb128> works fine on my machine (out of the dash bg thing)
<Laney> is it in a CI silo?
<Laney> I'll try it
<seb128> Laney, the new unity? it's in https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/landing-003/ but that doesn't include the decorator menu Trevinho was just mentioning
<seb128> testing would be welcome still
<Laney> ah
<seb128> since that's candidate for landing ;-)
<Laney> if it exists it can be included in this landing
<Trevinho> Laney: we need also bamf
<Laney> & that ;-)
<seb128> Trevinho, you can keep appending vcs-es to the landing ask and ask them to reconfigure the silo
<seb128> Laney, seems like they want to do a landing with what they have an another one with other nicety next week
<Trevinho> seb128: ehm I probably didn't understand :)
<seb128> going the ball rolling again, we didn't have unity landing for ages and the changeset is non trivial
<Trevinho> not at all
<Laney> thought you were talking about "no regressions" the other day
<seb128> yeah, that would be my stance
<seb128> but I'm not the one deciding, I just gave my opinion
<Trevinho> we "no regress"... mostly. :)
<seb128> Trevinho, the CI train table lists the branches to land
<seb128> if you are not happy with the current set you can work on a fix and add an extra branch to the request
<seb128> the ppa gets it and you can retest
<seb128> iterate until happy
<seb128> then you can land
<Laney> yep
<Laney> if bamf is needed it should be added in any case
<Trevinho> indeed
<seb128> it's already in the slot
<seb128> that's a compiz/unity/nux/bamf set
<seb128> so you can add branches for bamf as well
<Laney> ya, needs to be listed
<Laney> hum, maybe 4.4 fixes that scan-for-operators script
 * Laney reboots to see if it works after that
 * Laney : master of randomly changing the subject
<seb128> pitti, time for another beer, http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/1316? ;-)
<pitti> seb128: heh; well, if anything that just means more work for us in the long run, but we had that coming :)
<mdeslaur> seb128: a small taste of what to look forward to: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1043212
<mdeslaur> :)
<ubot2`> bugzilla.redhat.com bug 1043212 in systemd "something creating /var/run/nologin" [High,New]
<popey> "and be as pleasant to work with"
<seb128> pitti, yeh
<Laney> bugs are fun
<Laney> upstart was rebooting my computer on dist-upgrades recently; nobody is innocent :-)
<mdeslaur> bugs are normal, the more code churn, the less tests, the more bugs
<seb128> did you found the issue/what was happening?
<Laney> yeah, it's fixed now
<seb128> what was it?
<Laney> umm, can't remember exactly
<Laney> something was doing 'telinit u', which was crashing init I think
<seb128> k, don't worry, I was just curious
<Laney> u â please re-exec yourself
<Laney> like if it was mid-upgrade or something
<jodh> seb128, Laney: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/upstart/+bug/1269731 - invalid jobs were causing the failure. Amazing how many eyes looked at the code and missed that one :)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1269731 in upstart (Ubuntu) "init crashed with SIGSEGV" [Critical,Fix released]
<Laney> jodh: ya
<Laney> anyway I only brought it up as an example of bugs being everywhere
<Laney> and pointing at particular examples not being too helpful
<seb128> jodh, thanks
<seb128> Laney, right, I'm still happy that you figured it out, it was disturbing to have a bug reboot systems out there
<Laney> seb128: no credit for me, jodh got it
<seb128> tedg, hey, still working on inkscape? can you get https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/inkscape/+bug/1248174 https://launchpadlibrarian.net/165669413/1248174-Ubuntu-colour-palette-different-from-design_ubuntu_com.patch upstream?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1248174 in inkscape (Ubuntu) "The Ubuntu colour palette in Inkscape is different from the one in design.ubuntu.com" [Low,In progress]
<tedg> Sure
<seb128> tedg, thanks
<dobey> did anyone else notice that the new theme package breaks the theme? the mail view in evolution has a black background now and i can't read any mail
<seb128> dobey, that's one app
<seb128> but that might be due to https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/ubuntu-themes/dont-set-all-bgs/+merge/197234
<larsu> very likely it is...
<ochosi> just saying, but evolution has visual bugs with every theme
<Laney> it does some weird stuff
<ochosi> users reported that against the main xubuntu theme (greybird) as well, we also had testers with adwaita who could reproduce the issue
<ochosi> luckily, in xubuntu i can say "i don't care (enough)"
<dobey> ochosi: it worked fine yesterday. today it is broken.
<seb128> dobey, you might want to try unloading overlay-scrollbar in cases it helps, but I doubt it, it would have been buggy before
<seb128> dobey, right, it's likely the mp I pointed, that just landed, evo probably has some custom widget that needs special theming rules
<dobey> seb128: afaik it's just webkit, but the layout of mail messages in it might break something
<dobey> or well, might expose some behavior that other apps don't tend to hit
<seb128> it's probably a widget that should set a bg color and doesn't
<seb128> the theme was setting it for all widgets before
<seb128> it stopped doing that
<dobey> hah
<dobey> it's just webkit
<dobey> if you open online accounts and add an oauth account, the area where the webkit is is all black until the page loads
<ochosi> larsu: just wondering, you guys decided to revert the greeter_mode in indicator-sound? (it's not there anymore, this is when it was added, which was already a while back: https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/indicator-sound/add-greeter-mode/+merge/70339)
<dobey> seb128: so if you just fix it to set the bg for webkit, it should fix the issue
<ochosi> larsu: background: currently you can launch media-players in greeters that support indicators and don't explicitely blacklist -sound
<dobey> larsu: ^^
<seb128> ochosi, what do you mean?
<larsu> ochosi: i-sound still has a greeter mode, but it doesn't show any players
<larsu> should it?
<larsu> dobey: thanks
<ochosi> no, it definitely shows players in lightdm-gtk-greeter
<ochosi> the other indicators are fine though (e.g. datetime or power)
<ochosi> so setting the env_var works, i'd say
<seb128> ochosi, I guess the gtk greeter is not setting the indicator mode?
<seb128> oh
<larsu> no, it doesn't look at the env var anymore
<Laney> the plot thickens!
<ochosi> :}
<Laney> the panel gets the object paths back
<dobey> larsu: if you do that, would an update make it out today?
<larsu> do what?
<seb128> dobey, we can ask for one, then it's up to sil2100&co to see if we get a landing slot
<seb128> larsu, he wants you to look at the webkitgtk bg color issue I think :p
<larsu> ah, sorry I confused it with the i-sound debate
<larsu> I don't think it's that easy, but I'll have a look
<seb128> larsu, dobey: if I were you I would ask on #evolution on the GNOME irc if they know about a such issue, the evo guys are usually nice
<seb128> that might be a "oh, yes, check that"
<dobey> seb128: i just duplicated the exact same problem outside of evolution
<seb128> dobey, right, you said, but those guys might know about webkitgtk issues
<dobey> right, but i don't see how that will help exactly :)
<seb128> having somebody telling you where to find a fix rather than having to debug it yourself?
<seb128> that usually avoid wasting time
<seb128> that's like the XError software-center was hitting, I did some round of upstream pinging with question and they helped
<seb128> if I had tried to debug webkitgtk by myself, not knowing the code, I would probably still be debugging it
<dobey> well, the "fix" would be a patch to webkitgtk itself i guess, so that it always draws the default bg
<larsu> no
<larsu> it gets the color from css
<larsu> right now, we don't set one
<dobey> workarounds would be patches to any apps that embed webkit to set the bg on it by default. or to have the theme to set it
<dobey> larsu: well plain text e-mails don't have css
<larsu> dobey: gtk theming css
<dobey> larsu: then it sounds like my suggested fix is the right fix :)
<hikiko> hello :)
<larsu> dobey, seb128: hm, I was hoping this would fix it, but it doesn't: https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-themes-standard/commit/?id=7e381493870177818d990e3a4e6e63f4f7b09915
<larsu> and I don't have much more time to investigate this today unfortunately
<seb128> Laney, can you get me off the CD image builds emails? ;-)
<attente_> ChrisTownsend, for some reason the sticky edges setting is on even if i try to turn it off in g-c-c
<ChrisTownsend> attente_: Strange, works here.
<Laney> seb128: hahaha
<Laney> that lasted long
<seb128> Laney, I though I would receive emails only on build failures, not daily :p
<Laney> oh, /those/ ones
<Laney> you could filter them away?
<seb128> yeah...
<Laney> the failure ones are usually generally interesting
<Laney> s/generally/genuinely/
<seb128> right, that's why I said yes
<seb128> but I don't want to get a daily email on days where there are no issue
<Laney> ya
<Laney> not willing to have your client delete them?
<seb128> I guess I could put filtering
<Laney> up to you
<seb128> I need to get an actual failure to see what change/on what to filter
<seb128> Laney, let's give it a try
<Laney> I'd do "Daily CD health checks" â delete
<seb128> so the failures ahve different titles?
<Laney> there are two basic types
<Laney> LiveFS ubuntu/trusty/i386 failed to build on 20140213
<Laney> CD image lubuntu/trusty/daily-preinstalled failed to build on 20140212
<seb128> k
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> couldn't find an Ubuntu example of the second type
<Laney> it's more rare
<seb128> I'm just going to filter the daily check to null then
<Laney> nod
<Laney> wtf
<Laney> system-settings is
<Laney> OMG
<Laney> IS IT THAT SAME BUG
<Laney> the Column ListItem one
<seb128> ?
<Laney> seriously ...
<Laney> I added some printing and it gets the list of networks
<Laney> if it's an SDK problem...
<seb128> lol
<seb128> I was thinking about that yesterday and then forgot to mention
<Laney> I actually read the code of ofono
<seb128> :-(
<Laney> oh well
<seb128> easy to test if it's the sdk
<seb128> set an height for the column
<seb128> random one, try 300
<Laney> oh that fixes it too?
<seb128> yes
<Laney> was going to delete the column
<Laney> there's inconsistent indentation on the Column too
 * Laney twitches
<Laney> yep, that was it
<Laney> fail
<seb128> :/
<seb128> Laney, so it's working, just the toolkit screwed us?
<Laney> yes
<seb128> :/
<seb128> kenvandine, rsalveti: jfyi
<seb128> ^
<Laney> well, I can't verify selection is working
<kenvandine> ?
 * kenvandine reads back
<Laney> because I'm not allowed on any other network
<seb128> kenvandine, the empty carriers list is an uitk bug
<seb128> kenvandine, same as https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1275861
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1275861 in Ubuntu UI Toolkit "ItemSelector in Column not rendered" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<kenvandine> ah!
<Laney> kenvandine: why do we show 'forbidden' networks there?
<Laney> we know that we're not allowed on them
<seb128> kenvandine, the one I asked you to find somebody to assign while you were in Orlando
<kenvandine> seb128, yeah, we got that assigned
<kenvandine> Laney, i didn't know about forbidden :)
<kenvandine> i don't recall seeing anything about forbidden, but i guess i wasn't really looking for it either
<Laney> https://git.kernel.org/cgit/network/ofono/ofono.git/tree/doc/network-api.txt#n181
<Laney> probably only show available and current?
<Laney> rsalveti: does that sound right?
<Laney> well, I guess unknown too
<Laney> ok, hide forbidden :P
<kenvandine> makes sense to me
 * rsalveti reads backlog
<seb128> rsalveti, the ofono issue is not an ofono issue, it's an ui toolkit regression
<rsalveti> argh
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ofono/+bug/1276699 was related though
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1276699 in ofono (Ubuntu) "scan-for-operator script fails: org.ofono.Error.Failed: Operation failed" [Undecided,Triaged]
<Laney> rsalveti: still the question about if there's any point in displaying status: forbidden networks
<rsalveti> Laney: I never saw such thing anywhere, but I saw empty lists
<rsalveti> I'm able to reproduce that empty list behavior with another htc phone I have, but with android
<Laney> rsalveti: what thing?
<ogra_> seb128, a new UITK just landed in the archive
<seb128> ogra_, yeah, I saw, it doesn't fix that bug though
<ogra_> sad
<seb128> indeed
<Laney> it should be being prioritised imho
<seb128> well, I pinged kenvandine for that and he got it assigned
<seb128> the uitk team is busy with qt 5.2 coming and other stuffs I guess
<kenvandine> yeah, bzoltan had me assign it right away... but looks like nobody looked at it past that :/
<seb128> I'm going to ping them on monday
<Laney> anyway, we can fix those two things
<kenvandine> seb128, i just bumped the priority of the bug
<kenvandine> it's affecting more and more things
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<kenvandine> and hopefully the bug mail will remind them :)
<Laney> I already commented with the other bug link
<Laney> but thanks
<kenvandine> they were pretty overloaded all week last week with design
<kenvandine> the sprint was a bit overwhelming i think
<Laney> poor SDKers
<seb128> Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~hikiko/gsettings-ubuntu-touch-schemas/scale-factor-for-unity7-unity8/+merge/206240 looks fine to you?
<kgunn> mlankhorst: ping
<kgunn> mlankhorst: hey...we've got this new feature in mir to capture screen-cast...but it uncovered a bug in mesa
<kgunn> https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_activity.cgi?id=74563
<Laney> seb128: dunno, why do we need to store it separately?
<Laney> doesn't gtk have a setting for this?
<kgunn> just wondering...what's the best way to get some love on that mesa bug since its blocking us
<seb128> Laney, org.gnome.desktop.interface scaling-factor you mean?
<seb128> Laney, that's not by screen
<Laney> okay, and what does shell use?
<seb128> no idea
<seb128> do they do scalling by monitor?
<seb128> or just follow that scalling key from gsd?
<GunnarHj> seb128: Hi Sebastien!
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey
<GunnarHj> seb128: Do you have time to assist with an upload of ubuntu-docs?
<jasoncwarner> hey seb128 seeing a weird thing on a test machine this morning. I'm stuck at lightdm login screen for my user, but my guest session can get to a desktop.
<seb128> GunnarHj, yes
<GunnarHj> seb128: Everything is prepared in https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-doc/ubuntu-docs/trusty
<seb128> jasoncwarner, "stucked"? like it bounces you back after you auth to log in?
<seb128> GunnarHj, ok, just standard bzr bd to build?
<GunnarHj> seb128: We just need someone who 'push the button'.
<GunnarHj> seb128: Yes, standard 'bzr bd'.
<seb128> k
<jasoncwarner> seb128: exactly that.
<seb128> jasoncwarner, seems like your session fails to start, can you share ~/.cache/upstart/gnome-session.log ?
<seb128> GunnarHj, doing that in a bit
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, thanks!
<mlankhorst> kgunn: remind me monday please
<kgunn> mlankhorst: ta...have a nice weekend
<seb128> dobey, is your issue https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=699576 ?
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 699576 in general "Mail reader frame is black (in the mail view)" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<Laney> seb128: it's different to that
<Laney> well, I think it is --- the body background is black too
<Laney> for plaintext emails
<dobey> seb128: sort of yes. for html mails it looks something like that screenshot. for plain text mails, the whole background of the view is black
<Laney> it can't be the /same/ as that, as the revert I did is still in
<dobey> and it's all webkitgtk views, not just evo
<Laney> ya
<Laney> evo could have been working around it though
<dobey> well i see there's a patch in that bug that has status "committed"
<dobey> but i don't know if it's in the version of evo that's in trusty
<Laney> no, see the last comment
<Laney> i'd just wait for lars to take a look
<seb128> not going to happen before monday
<Laney> yup
<Laney> i think it can probably wait until then
<hikiko> Laney, gnome has the text-scaling-factor
<hikiko> which is not per monitor
<seb128> hikiko, they also have org.gnome.desktop.interface scaling-factor, which is what GTK uses for the widgets scaling
<hikiko> is it per monitor?
<hikiko> I think this is for the whole desktop
<seb128> no it's not
<hikiko> our scale factor is a dictionary of "monitor name", value
<hikiko> key=monitor name, value = an integer
<seb128> that seems fine to me
<seb128> Laney wanted to make sure we don't add a key where we could share one though
<Laney> correct
<hikiko> I see :)
<Laney> When GNOME does this I'll be in favour of migrating to share the key then
<desrt> hikiko: you're storing this dictionary in gsettings, right?
<Laney> I'm assuming they wouldn't take a patch to the schemas now to add it there :-)
<desrt> hikiko: when/how does this dictionary get updated?
<hikiko> desrt, in the unity-control-center, it's not ready yet, I will submit an MP on monday or later
<desrt> hikiko: so only the control center will ever change this value?
<hikiko> yes
<desrt> good :)
<seb128> GunnarHj, uploaded
<Trevinho> seb128: about that gdk issue with struts...
<seb128> Trevinho, we got it resolved, not an unity issue
<Trevinho> ah, ok...
<seb128> Trevinho, sorry, I should have kept you updated
<Trevinho> seb128: as I one weird thing I get here is that window action menus (right-click on decorations)... is showing over the panel on one screen and not in the other
<seb128> right, same problem
<seb128> it's a gtk bug
<Trevinho> seb128: not a problem at all... I just was noticing that today with some menus only
<seb128> Trevinho, https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/tree/gdk/x11/gdkscreen-x11.c#n390
<seb128> Trevinho, read that comment, that explains it ;-)
<Trevinho> seb128:  good catch
<seb128> Trevinho, you get the same issue if you open the display panel in the control center, the screen name tooltip overlap the panel on one of the panels
<mvo> seb128: hi, sorry, did not see this earlier (re aptdaemon)
<mvo> pitti: is adt using port 8080?
<seb128> mvo, hey, how are you? no worry
<mvo> pitti: just checking https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Trusty/view/AutoPkgTest/job/trusty-adt-apt/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/lastBuild/console and it looks like on one of the tests with the buildin webserver stuff fails and I wonder if it might be the adt environment
<mvo> seb128: good, thanks. should I still look at this?
<mvo> seb128: trying to make adt & apt happy currently
<seb128> mvo, if you want to, that would be welcome, it would be handy to have aptdaemon building in trusty ;-)
<mvo> ok
<ochosi> bregma: light-locker 1.2 is released, would be great if you could package/upload it! thanks in advance!
<bregma> ochosi, OK, thanks for the head-up
<xclaesse> Hmm, firefox takes ~60% CPU when the facebook tab has focus
<xclaesse> and goes down to 1% if I just switch tab
<xclaesse> am I the only one to experience that?
<xclaesse> seb128, since recent update in ubuntu 14.04, email are all black background in evolution
<ochosi> yeah, that's been mentioned before tonight
<ochosi> quick question, in Xubuntu i get "Gtk-Message: Failed to load module "unity-gtk-module", what's that about?
<seb128> xclaesse, seems some widget doesn't set its bg color correctly
<seb128> xclaesse, install https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-unity/+archive/daily-build/+build/5561124/+files/light-themes_13.04%2B14.04.20140206.1-0ubuntu1_all.deb back as a workaround if needed
<seb128> on that note, have a good w.e everyone
<Laney> ochosi: dpkg -l unity-gtk*-module*?
<GunnarHj> Laney: Still there?
<Laney> GunnarHj: a little bit
<GunnarHj> Laney: shaunm_ indicates that yelp 3.12 may not fit Unity very well, and suggests that we'd proably better skip it and wait for 3.14 (we are on 3.10 now. How do we pass that kind of info to people who might sync it later on?
<Laney> GunnarHj: I don't think anyone will do that without testing
<Laney> they'd get a beating if so
<GunnarHj> Laney: That's right, of course. If the problem is obvious, the tests will show. But otherwise?
<Laney> GunnarHj: umm, maybe mail ubuntu-desktop
<Laney> I'd say file a bug from the link on http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html but it's tracking 3.10 so yelp is up to date as far as it's concerned
<GunnarHj> Laney: Do you really think that anyone would remember such a warning?  ;-)
<Laney> I don't know of any strong mechanism
<Laney> either people read lists and remember what they see, check things like versions, or they don't
<GunnarHj> Laney: The doc team members will keep our eyes open. :)
<Laney> either they test or they don't
<Laney> but most people know that we're not taking 3.12 stuff so I doubt it'll be an issue
<GunnarHj> Laney: Ok. Guess that's safe enough.
<Laney> GunnarHj: thanks for the warning though!
<ochosi> Laney: thanks for the hint
<Laney> ochosi: did you have -common and neither of the -gtk2/3 ones?
<ochosi> Laney: i'm checking now where that came from, yeah, i guess i have some leftovers from testing the appmenu indicator in xfce
<Laney> interesting
<Laney> It's probably a bug that it asks for the module to be loaded even if it's not installed
<ochosi> hm, i have unity-gtk-module-common and unity-gtk3-module
<ochosi> so gtk2 is missing
<Laney> k
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-02-09
<akiva-thinkpad> Hey check this out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zt_hkSKQp6k pretty interesting first time use of 14.10 by a illiterate user
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> Laney: hm, it's running here, so bug report appreciated; stgraber or hallyn are certainly interested
<didrocks> good morning
<akiva-thinkpad> didrocks, morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks !
<pitti> didrocks: as-tu eu un bon voyage ?
<didrocks> pitti: bof, le train est parti avec 15 minutes d'avance sur l'heure prÃ©vue
<didrocks> pitti: donc obligÃ© de prendre un thalys pour Paris, changer de gare du Nord -> gare de Lyon Ã  Paris avec le RER
<didrocks> pitti: puis TGV Paris -> Lyon
<didrocks> arrivÃ© avec ~2h de retard par rapport Ã  l'heure prÃ©vue initiallement
<pitti> didrocks: uh, trop de neige ?
<didrocks> pitti: non, juste qu'ils ont changÃ© l'horaire du premier train sans prÃ©venir personne
<pitti> nous avons eu quelque rÃ©tard hier Ã  cause de la neige
<didrocks> pitti: lÃ , c'Ã©tait parti en avance, (de 15 minutes), pas en retard :)
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey didrocks pitti
<pitti> bonjour seb128, Ã§a va ? bon voyage chez toi ?
<didrocks> re seb128!
<seb128> pitti, salut, oui, trÃ¨s bien, le train c'est facile :-)
<seb128> pitti, et toi, bon w.e ?
<pitti> seb128: oui ! nous sommes allÃ¨s Ã  Zurich, pour visiter un ami
<pitti> seb128: he had a new theater play (he has done amateur acting for quite some years now)
<seb128> oh, nice
<seb128> did you have fun there?
<pitti> seb128: yes, we did indeed! he had 6 guests altogether, so nice theater play and some Zurich sightseeing plus some nice drinking and fun in the evenings
<seb128> sounds fun indeed
<didrocks> great!
<mlankhorst> Ggood morning, desktop!
<akiva-thinkpad> o/
<darkxst> hey seb128 didrocks
<darkxst> seb128, did you have a try of my totem build with menus?
<willcooke> Morning desktoppers
<didrocks> hey darkxst, mlankhorst, willcooke
<mlankhorst> everyone made it back home safely?
<seb128> darkxst, hey, not yet. Where is it again? And what's the status with the new depends, grilo, etc?
<seb128> mlankhorst, hey, yes! how is your fosdemflu, feeling better?
<darkxst> seb128, gnome3 ppa
<mlankhorst> just a cough remaining
<darkxst> grilo-plugins MIR is approved pending split
<darkxst> I patched totem to make the tracker plugin optional
<darkxst> seb128, bug 1394731
<ubot5> bug 1394731 in grilo-plugins (Ubuntu) "[MIR] grilo-plugins" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1394731
<seb128> darkxst, so without those it just behaves as a "normal" player?
<darkxst> seb128, no without those the recents/channels view is completely broken
<darkxst> you would only be able to play things by passing the video file as an argument
<seb128> hum
<seb128> is that something we consider acceptable?
<darkxst> seb128, no, its needs grilo-plugins
<darkxst> but we will split them so there is not a whole lot of random/useless plugins in main
<darkxst> seb128, but consider the tracker plugin a soft-dep
<seb128> k
<seb128> well, ideally I would like to try with the minimal set to see what's working and not and how much it pulls in
<darkxst> seb128, I summarised required plugind in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/grilo-plugins/+bug/1394731/comments/2
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1394731 in grilo-plugins (Ubuntu) "[MIR] grilo-plugins" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<seb128> I guess e.g youtube doesn't add much extra depends?
<seb128> in which case we should probably seed it as well
<seb128> the feature is useful
<darkxst> seb128, not sure they even pull in any extra deps
<darkxst> the only thing in universe is dleyna-server and that is suggests
<seb128> k
<darkxst> (alot of the earlier discussions were based around tracker but that is in main anyway now, and its only one small lib for non-GNOME environments, that is already there)
<seb128> yeah, as long as it doesn't force us to run the disk indexer...
<darkxst> seb128, only if you have tracker-fied your system
<Laney> HEY!
<didrocks> it's a Laney!
<seb128> hey Laney, how is u.k today? had a good w.e?
<darkxst> hey Laney
<larsu> morning Laney!
<darkxst> Laney, re Gtk+ looks like we need a full core update for GNOME
<darkxst> and wouldnt even consider that really until after .90 or .91 but thats well FFe territory
<Laney> there's somethign terrible going on with my interwebs, one second
<Laney> buh
<Laney> had to restart n-m
<seb128> just curious, why a gtk update enforces a GNOME update?
<Laney> darkxst: do you know what the problem is there?
<darkxst> seb128, gtk window decorations
<seb128> GTK is supposed to be abi/api compatible, what did they change? is that theming?
<Laney> it'd probably be enough to make us not do it I guess, don't want to ruin your stuff
<seb128> not going to make larsu happy :-(
<darkxst> seb128, GTK is now drawing window decorations for GNOME theme
<Laney> and hello, yes I had a good weekend!
<larsu> darkxst: what's your problem with that? You need to update your theme?
<Laney> we did some DIY in preparation for a bike shed ;-)
<larsu> what color does it have?
<darkxst> larsu, no mutter 3.14 don't support that
<seb128> darkxst, how does that work? if you don't update g-s, etc, can't you just get decoration drawed the way they currently are?
<darkxst> seb128, gnome theme is packaged in gtk+ now
<seb128> can't we undo that easily?
<darkxst> we could backport the old theme, and loose any fixes made
<seb128> e.g keep using adwaita
<larsu> or just update mutter?
<seb128> larsu, well, that's what he meant by update GNOME
<larsu> update mutter != update gnome
<seb128> larsu, they don't want an out of sync versions between g-s etc
<larsu> but meh
<darkxst> larsu, there has been another major reworking of input device handling
<seb128> but you know how things up when you try to mismatch components
<seb128> +turn
<darkxst> I don't feel comfortable splitting on mutter and g-s-d with that
<Laney> lolz, bugzilla seems busted
<larsu> seb128: fair enough
<darkxst> Laney, Maintenance
<Laney> ah some kind of upgrade
<larsu> Laney: scheduled updatd
<larsu> status.gnome.org
<Laney> darkxst: is this a problem because adwaita is in gtk now?
<desrt> Laney: old problem
<desrt> darkxst: i don't get why old mutter couldn't go on drawing the decorations.  is it because they'd mismatch the theme?
<darkxst> Laney, well partly, but the main reason we use Adwaita is because upstream keep it in sync
<desrt> that's sort of a problem we already had for server-decorated windows
<darkxst> desrt, they scrapped the metacity window themes, and switched to gtk/css
<desrt> darkxst: ya.. .i get that
<darkxst> mutter- 3.14 knows nothing of that
<desrt> but you seem to want to keep the old matter
<desrt> *mutter
<darkxst> desrt, I am all for updating to 3.16
<darkxst> but not now
<desrt> so it will still have the code for drawing old themes....
<desrt> i just don't understand why it would possibly cause a problem to upgrade gtk now
<darkxst> desrt, theme issues I guess
<desrt> they didn't remove the mutter theme drawing code from gtk... they removed it from mutter
<desrt> darkxst: ya... so the theme will be slightly out of sync... but nothing more than it was before
<darkxst> desrt, they changed the adwaita theme to accomadate the new decorations that is the problem
<darkxst> desrt, its pretty broken black titlebars etc
<desrt> darkxst: if you're planning to upgrade mutter later in the cycle anyway, then is a slight theme mismatch during development really a huge issue?
<desrt> ... something else sounds wrong
<desrt> because if mutter is drawing server-side decorations then it should still be using the old theme (ie: nothing gtk does could affect it)
<darkxst> desrt, there is no metacity theme anymore
<darkxst> adwaita is packaged in gtk+
<desrt> only the gtk css
<larsu> add it back?! Doesn't sound that hard
<desrt> the metacity theme is in gnome-themes-standard-data
<desrt> as an xml file in /usr/share/themes/Adwaita/metacity-1
<darkxst> desrt, maybe as an intermin solution
<desrt> well -- yes.... the longterm solution would be to upgrade to the new mutter
<desrt> and until then there is no sense in blocking a gtk upgrade because of one little xml file
<desrt> (okay... it's not particularly little, admittedly....)
<darkxst> and it may not be that simple either
<darkxst> though I havent tried
<willcooke> ARGH!  I cant live like this any more....
<larsu> darkxst: only non-focused titlebars are black for me
<willcooke> I'm going to have to
<larsu> darkxst: same for you?
<willcooke> tidy my desk
<larsu> willcooke: happy monday!?
<willcooke> \o/
<darkxst> larsu, yes
<xnox> I love Mondays, they are so good and lovely. Not tired at all, happy to wake up early!
<didrocks> Monday decisions!
<willcooke> larsu, my "office"  looks like a bomb went off in a rubbish dump and then a pig went to live there
<larsu> xnox: you're not welcome here.
<larsu> xnox: not with this attidude
<larsu> *attitude
<desrt> who is this xnox guy?
<desrt> >:|
<larsu> darkxst: I wonder how this can happen with a gtk update - gtk is not involved in drawing those at all, is it?
<larsu> (before mutter 3.16, I mean)
 * pitti ^5s xnox
<xnox> desrt: yo, how do send you glib patches?
<desrt> xnox: bugzilla.gnome.org
<xnox> desrt: connection is not private
<xnox> This server could not prove that it is bugzilla-test.gnome.org; its security certificate is from nagios.gnome.org. This may be caused by a misconfiguration or an attacker intercepting your connection.
<desrt> uh oh
<xnox> desrt: looks like it has hick-ups
<desrt> sounds like some upgrade troubles
<larsu> no
<larsu> scheduled update
<larsu> http://status.gnome.org
<desrt> so wait
<desrt> bugzilla.gnome.org is maintained as a launchpad.net project?
<desrt> this is delicious
<larsu> err, what?
<desrt> https://launchpad.net/bugzilla.gnome.org
<larsu> lol, last commit message: "I think I am merging here, but I don't really know"
<desrt> ya..... apparently they ended up using git to coordinate the merge due to some bzr fail
<desrt> not sure what their plan will be going forward
<desrt> i wonder what this is going to do to my bug downloader
<desrt> probably ruin everything :)
<darkxst> larsu, I suspect it the theme updates that are the problem
<larsu> darkxst: which ones?
<darkxst> larsu, adwaita is packaged with gtk+ these days
<larsu> darkxst: even the metacity parts?
<didrocks1> larsu: I assigned to you the u-c-c task as we discussed on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-v-bluez5
<didrocks1> larsu: seems that robert-ancell still have the indicator-bluetooth task, but I guess he stopped working on it?
<didrocks1> seb128: did you chat recently with him on this? ^
<larsu> didrocks: I guess he did. I'm fine working on both
<didrocks> larsu: doing the paperwork then, thanks man :)
<didrocks> sane behavior on pip at last, checking other package managers \o/
<didrocks> aquarius would be happy
<larsu> maybe he is?
<didrocks> larsu: seems not from the email I forwarded to you from a month and half, but he started working on it, I guess he just didn't both with changing the blueprint status
<willcooke> Erk.  Click new email in GMail and Google suggest perhaps I'd like to send money to someone with my debit card.
<willcooke> How about Noooo
<didrocks> thanks willcooke, donations really appreciated :)
 * willcooke sends didrocks 1 pence
<didrocks> willcooke: that's how all rich long path started I guess \o/
<willcooke> :)
<Laney> eaten up in currency conversion fees, sorry, better luck next time
<willcooke> Just followed up with bjkeyser re: new theme.  It's officially on the list now for 15.10
<willcooke> I will follow up again in a couple of months to make sure it's on track
<larsu> nice!
<Laney> sweet!
<Laney> willcooke: did they schedule working on the wallpaper for 15.04 too?
<willcooke> Laney, emailed JohnLea_ - I will follow up again once he's back from his sprint
<Laney> righto
 * Sweet5hark still accepts donations for his director-helicopter.
<jpds> Only helicopter I've donated to is: https://londonsairambulance.co.uk/2nd-helicopter
<Sweet5hark> jpds: admittedly, thats a much better use of a helicopter.
<jpds> Sweet5hark: Did you always have the 5?
<Sweet5hark> jpds: nope
<Sweet5hark> jpds: sad story actually. Me irrsi was running on a pandaboard and it failed boot through one day. So as a temporary solution I used pidgin from my notebook.
<jpds> Sweet5hark: What you need is a raspberry pi 2.
<mlankhorst> ah, I use a cloud for that ;-)
<Sweet5hark> There is nothing as permanent as a temporary solution.
<mlankhorst> though for a while I used pandaboard as my bedtime computer
<ogra_> jpds, where is the irissi snap package for that RPi2 ?
<ogra_> :)
<ogra_> mlankhorst, to cuddle with it before sleeping ?
<mlankhorst> no because it drew so little power I could just keep it on, only had to move the mouse to get it to respond
<mlankhorst> I only stopped using it because I no longer sleep in that bed :P
<seb128> didrocks, no, didn't talk to robert_ancell recently
<willcooke> seb128, didrocks  - I'm going to talk to him tonight if you have anything you want me to ask
<seb128> willcooke, ask what he's working on/if he still plans to help on the transition to bluez5 (and please mention that larsu is about to pick that up because it has been stucked for a while, to make sure they don't dup work)
<willcooke> ack
<didrocks> thanks willcooke :)
<larsu> willcooke: I'm planning to pick it up when I get back to Berlin (so starting on Wed)
<seb128> willcooke, please tell Robert to hand over to larsu if he can/if there is anything to handover
<seb128> like status update email, making sure to push what he had
<seb128> thanks!
<willcooke> kk
<didrocks> seb128: I already forwarded some weeks ago to larsu robert's latest branches (which didn't change since)
<seb128> didrocks, did you ask robert if he had offline work he didn't push?
<seb128> just in case
<seb128> doesn't hurt to ask, we never know
<didrocks> seb128: asked a week ago, nothing more, but I may have missed his answer
<seb128> didrocks, email?
<seb128> well, anyway, if willcooke gets a reply that should do
<didrocks> seb128: IRC
<seb128> we have little overlap with robert
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> seb128: last email was quite clear that he would stop working on this, I was just surprised to see the WI status didn't change though
<seb128> didrocks, k, all good then
<seb128> didrocks, thanks for tracking it!
<didrocks> yw! :)
<ichilton> I apt-get install'd ubuntu-gnome-desktop on a standard ubuntu-14.10 install (thinking I could switch between standard ubuntu desktop and gnome) and it's messed up ubuntu desktop - it's now half unity (panel, background, title bars etc) and half gnome (the system panel/tray, the system theme terminal is using etc).
<ichilton> How do I fix unity, and can I have both unity and gnome co-exist independantly so I can switch at login?
<seb128> ichilton, hey, try #ubuntu for user questions
<ichilton> thanks
<xclaesse> seb128, does ubuntu's theme on vivid has support for GtkHeaderBar ?
<seb128> xclaesse, what do you mean by "support"?
<xclaesse> make it look like ubuntu
<seb128> not really
<seb128> also unity doesn't handle csd well
<seb128> so you get no border on the windows using gtkheaderbar as decorations
<seb128> they are difficult to resize as well
<xclaesse> ok, was trying gedit master in jhbuild on ubuntu 14.04, csd is indeed not well supported
<xclaesse> was wondering if on vivid I would get nicer result
<xclaesse> http://people.collabora.com/~xclaesse/tmp/gedit.png
<larsu> xclaesse: did you try with the Ambiance theme, like I suggested in #gtk?
<xclaesse> larsu, that's why I asked here, they don't theme GtkHeaderBar, so that won't gain much
<xclaesse> well, on the tabs it will probably
<larsu> xclaesse: "they"? I added support for those a while ago. Not sure if it landed in utopic, though
<xclaesse> larsu, GTK_THEME=Ambiance doesn't change anything, but I think I have to install the theme in jhbuild, no?
<xclaesse> maybe some symlinking could do the trick
<larsu> xclaesse: no, just include /usr/share in gedit's XDG_DATA_DIRS
<larsu> or run it with GTK_DATA_PREFIX=/usr GTK_THEME=Ambiance
<larsu> (iirc)
<xclaesse> ah... bah just did ln -s /usr/share/themes/Ambiance/ /opt/gnome/share/themes/
<xclaesse> ok indeed that's way smaller now
<Laney> hey larsu, do you know anything about GdkVisual? https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?id=4cf6edda55edb57228e9a1b545dd72c90c3d22af breaks opacity on the 'flash' thing that gnome-screenshot has
<Laney> it sets one here https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-screenshot/tree/src/cheese-flash.c#n98 and that makes _set_opacity not get called after that gtk+ commit
<kenvandine> seb128, don't forget about silo 7, whenever you have time
<larsu> Laney: not sure why they'd explicitely set the default visual - it should always be that
<larsu> Laney: what happens if you take the set_visual() line out?
<Laney> works but sometimes there's another white flash when the fade is finished
<larsu> eek
<Laney> the comment says something about shadows, could be that
 * larsu wonders why setting a visual will cause it not to render shadows
<larsu> I think GTK_WINDOW_POPUP should do that
<larsu> hm, they set a notification type hint as well
<larsu> Laney: seems to work for me?!
<larsu> Laney: are you testing on a composited wm?
<Laney> i'm using compiz
<Laney> are you on a new enough gtk?
<seb128> kenvandine, oh, right, thanks for the reminder
<kenvandine> seb128, thank you!
<larsu> Laney: what's new enough?
<larsu> I'm on the one in the ppa
<Laney> 3.15.something
<Laney> ya, that is
<larsu> I see the same problem as you, but commenting the set_visual() line seems to make it work
<larsu> ugh, the fallback code is wrong :/
<larsu> puts events on the main loop and then unrefs the object
 * larsu found out while trying to debug with a longer flahs
<larsu> Laney: about to head out now (there's still sun!), but I'll take a look at it
<larsu> Laney: is it urgent?
 * larsu might sit down in a cafe for a while
<Laney> not hugely
<Laney> something which breaks with 3.15
<seb128> kenvandine, is that rtm7 or vivid7?
<Laney> I noticed that the callback is called forever too
<Laney> because of some double comparison lolz
<larsu> Laney: ok. I'll try to get something until tomorrow when I step out of the plane (afternoon) at the latest
<Laney> that's the reason it's displayed forever
<Laney> the visual thing just causes it not to fade in
<Laney> out*
<Laney> in and out?
<xclaesse> seb128, was trying gtk master, the file chooser does recursive search on type ahead. Ubuntu thanksfully reverted that in nautilus. Will you consider reverting that in gtk as well please? :D
<larsu> Laney: ya, it's all kinds of messed up :/
<larsu> Laney: I guess just nobody tested the fallback
<seb128> xclaesse, not typeahead anymore?!
<larsu> since it's all gnome-shell now
<kenvandine> seb128, vivid
<seb128> larsu, Laney, ^ btw, might be another issue with new gtk
<Laney> I guess so
<seb128> kenvandine, anything specific you want me to try?
<kenvandine> the bluetooth fixes at least
<kenvandine> you know how to test those, i think
<seb128> k
<seb128> yeah
<kenvandine> if you can test the translation fix too :)
<seb128> sure
<kenvandine> which i think is basically all the fixes :)
<xclaesse> seb128, didn't try vivid, but with gtk master in jhbuild when I type ahead in the file chooser it lookup in all sub-dirs
<xclaesse> seb128, so I get thousands of matches
<xclaesse> seb128, and I cannot simply naviguat my folder hierarchy
<larsu> I'll look into it
<seb128> xclaesse, do you know if that's a setting we can turn off?
<xclaesse> seb128, didn't investigate anything, was about to open an upstream bug to tell it's unusable, but bugzilla is down :p
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> please do what's it back up
<larsu> scheduled maintenance
<xclaesse> seb128, but given that's the default on nautilus as well upstrema, I guess it makes sense... in a way...
<seb128> yeah
<larsu> doesn't seem to be a setting
<seb128> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?id=de4427304c680c4d111ba92477a30f70befa2d06
<seb128> not sure what that setting ^ does but looks like it could be it
<seb128> setting in browse rather than search?
<xclaesse> seb128, note that ctr+f does bring the old type ahead
<larsu> seb128: looks like it, thanks. Maybe we'll need a small patch to make the old behaviour the default
<seb128> right
<xclaesse> seb128, but IMO the default should be the old way, then ctr+f for a recursive search
<seb128> +1
<xclaesse> that's how it's made in nautilus on ubuntu
<xclaesse> and IMO it makes much more sense
<seb128> xclaesse, thanks for pointing it out
<xclaesse> you're welcome :)
<seb128> kenvandine, bah, sorry, I screwed the translation one, they changed the order of context/text, pushed a fix for that to https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/security-use-ctr/+merge/248771
<seb128> kenvandine, I tested with that fix, should be fix, bluetooth, etc work as expected
<kenvandine> ok, i'll rebuild
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks, and sorry about that
<kenvandine> np
<seb128> kenvandine, https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/categories-no-effect/+merge/248272 should also be trivial if you want one more
<kenvandine> i'll do that one separately... already got 5 branches in this silo
<seb128> but if not that can be in the next round
<kenvandine> and i already clicked build :)
<seb128> k
<seb128> wfm
<Laney> test failed email â click link â "oh look, transient failure, let's retry" â connect to vpn â click private link â "Started by user Martin Pitt"
<Laney> this guy is too fast :-)
<Laney> "Started 1.8 sec ago", ha!
<didrocks> he is! :)
<seb128> cyphermox, hey
<cyphermox> seb128: hey
<seb128> cyphermox, have some minutes to talk settings/bt?
<cyphermox> sure
<seb128> cyphermox, remember https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/ubuntu-system-settings/unbreak-hid/+merge/243592 ?
<seb128> cyphermox, I'm pondering adding that function back, wanted your opinion first
<cyphermox> hum, what for?
<seb128> cyphermox, currently it lists all device, but if you try to pair with i.e a laptop, it's going to hit the
<seb128>     default:
<seb128>         qWarning() << "Nothing to connect: Unsupported device type.";
<seb128>         return;
<seb128> case
<seb128> which means you click on "connect" in the ui and it brings you back to the device list
<seb128> without any feedback on what happened and why
<cyphermox> hum, there is that
<seb128> that's not good user experience :-)
<cyphermox> but perhaps a better idea would be to grey the connect button in that case
<cyphermox> rather than not showing the devices at all
<seb128> well, that's what that the code you dropped was doing
<seb128> oh
<seb128> it was showing the device by disabled
<seb128> sure, we could move to disable the connect instead
<cyphermox> right
<seb128> I should maybe first try what happens if I add the computer type to the case
<seb128> maybe pairing a computer works
<cyphermox> hmm, not sure
<seb128> even if we can't do much once it's paired
<cyphermox> even if it did pair
<cyphermox> yeah ;)
<seb128> e.g no file transfert or anything
<seb128> hum
<cyphermox> there's no one good answer for this, there's a couple of ways we can handle these devices we "don't support yet"
<seb128> if I pair my laptop to my android phone I can use it to play music
<cyphermox> yeah
<seb128> cyphermox, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1419866
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1419866 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "[bluetooth] Computer pairing is unimplemeted but the UI still let you try it" [High,New]
<seb128> cyphermox, opened that and assigned to mpt
<seb128> just as a fyi
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks for the feedback :-)
<cyphermox> argh
<cyphermox> so yeah, we really do need mpt or someone from design to make a decision :)
<seb128> cyphermox, indeed
<seb128> cyphermox, also my krillin advertize itself as a computer on bt, is that right?
<seb128> cyphermox, my android phone advertize itself as a phone
<cyphermox> yeah
<cyphermox> we need to fix up bluez to split out the config in two separate packages, make one for a "I'm a phone" and another one for "I'm a computer.
<seb128> k
<cyphermox> otoh, much of that will be done automatically once we're on bluez 5
<cyphermox> by way of systemd and some updated system code
<seb128> cyphermox, oh, also it seems that the device is always discoverable, where the spec states it should only be when you are on the bluetooth screen
<seb128> is that known?
<cyphermox> it shouldn't be always discoverable no
<seb128> and where should it be reported?
<cyphermox> that was working fine
<cyphermox> mark it against u-s-s, bluez by itself doesn't usually put devices discoverable
<cyphermox> but I wonder if that might be different based on the bluetooth driver
<seb128> cyphermox, not a settings issues, I just rebooted my device
<seb128> it's discoverable as soon as it boot
<seb128> I didn't use/unlock it yet
<cyphermox> yuck
<seb128> can't be setting since that never ran
<cyphermox> heh, bluez then
<seb128> thanks
<cyphermox> but I'm pretty sure we had tried this and it was working properly
<seb128> that one might be an important issue
<cyphermox> that's why it seems like it's possibly a driver issue
<seb128> isn't that sort of a security problem?
<seb128> also use power?
<cyphermox> well, yes
<cyphermox> it's bad
<cyphermox> someone will need to figure out why that is
<cyphermox> were you testing this on mako?
<seb128> cyphermox, no, bq
<seb128> cyphermox, who do you recommend pinging about the issue?
<cyphermox> hum, you already pinged them I guess
<seb128> cyphermox, if them is you :-)
<cyphermox> yeah
<seb128> I didn't mention it out of here, well out of the bug
<cyphermox> maybe let ChickenCutlass know too. I see he doesn't seem to be here
<cyphermox> I'll see if I get the same thing on my mako, at least so I know whether bluez is really busted of if it's a driver thing like I really hope it is
<cyphermox> boo, it seems good here on mako :/
<cyphermox> at least, according to bluez-test-adapter
<seb128> what is that command supposed to say?
<seb128> $ bluez-test-adapter discovering
<seb128> 0
<seb128> on the bq
<cyphermox> hum
<seb128> that seems to always return 0, on desktop as well
<cyphermox> yes the device still shows up elsewhere?
<seb128> visibility turned off or on
<seb128> yes
<seb128> my laptop lists it
<cyphermox> well, it behaves correctly on my mako
<cyphermox> 1 when u-s-s bt page is open, 0 otherwise
<seb128> well, 0 here
<seb128> but the device is listed by other computers
<cyphermox> right
<seb128> so that flag is not respected
<seb128> driver issue I guess?
<cyphermox> possibly, but I'm not done testing :)
<cyphermox> gah
<cyphermox> still getting the right behavior on mako :/
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks for testing
<cyphermox> this is not good, I don't like driver issues like this
<cyphermox> the android drivers are already busted enough as it is that we don't need to find more issues ;)
<seb128> cyphermox, is "bluez-test-adapter discovering" supposing to return 1 when visibility = true?
<seb128> cyphermox, because on my vivid desktop it always returns 0, even when I toggle the visible switch in the indicator or gnome ui
<cyphermox> no
<cyphermox> bluez-test-adapter discoverable
<seb128> oh
<seb128> cyphermox, that returns 1 on krillin
<seb128> without using settings
<cyphermox> discovering is for whether you're currently running a scan, but that part is more less simple
<cyphermox> yeah, I believe you
<pmcgowan> seb128, I get 0 on krillin right now
<seb128> cyphermox, "disoverable off" works
<seb128> pmcgowan, what happens if you open the settings bluetooth page and close settings?
<cyphermox> seb128: ok
<pmcgowan> seb128, seems to work right, 1 when on page and 0 otherwise
<seb128> pmcgowan, hum, k, I wonder what is wrong on my krillin
<pmcgowan> oh let me do what you said
<seb128> pmcgowan, do you run rtm or vivid?
<pmcgowan> seb128, aha if you close settings while on the page it stays on
<seb128> k
<kenvandine> seb128, silo 7 is rebuilt, can you mark it as tested on the spreadsheet?
<seb128> cyphermox, is something storing the state accross reboots?
<cyphermox> seb128: it's not supposed to be saved
<seb128> seems to be
<cyphermox> hum, I was on vivid though
<seb128> pmcgowan, ^ I guess that's the issue maybe?
<seb128> pmcgowan, like if you do that it stays to 1
<seb128> and that persists over reboot for me
<pmcgowan> seb128, let me reboot and see what it is
<cyphermox> seb128: you are right, it's saved in /var/lib/bluetooth/<address>/config
<seb128> pmcgowan, ^
<pmcgowan> seb128, confirmed both, stays set over reboot and in the config file
<seb128> cyphermox, pmcgowan, commented on the bug
<cyphermox> seb128: I wonder if you had a bad crash while the bt window was open?
<seb128> cyphermox, no, I just worked on that panel and it's easier to swipe settings out and restart
<seb128> rather than exit the panel and close it
<seb128> e.g I use the switched and close it from there
<seb128> switcher
<cyphermox> hum
<seb128> kenvandine, done
<kenvandine> seb128, thx
<seb128> need to drop offline for a bit, back in less than half an hour
<didrocks> and with all those tests passing, have a good evening everyone!
<willcooke> ahahah!  I have learned another new C thing.  "a++" increments after the action, where as ++a does it first.  So my strings were getting null terminated 1 character too long
<JanC> that's very basic C knowledge  :)
<willcooke> I am very basic
<ogra_> goto 10
<willcooke> Now your talking my language
<ogra_> :)
<willcooke> except it should all be in caps
<mlankhorst> Can we have COBOL now? :P
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> morning robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> willcooke, hi
<seb128> hey robert_ancell, how are you?
<robert_ancell> seb128, hi good. otp at the moment
<seb128> robert_ancell, just saying hello, I didn't see you for a while! we missed you in Brussels
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, me too
<willcooke> g'night
 * willcooke -> EOD
<robert_ancell> seb128, looked like you guys had fun!
<robert_ancell> seb128, and you've grown quite a beard there :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, indeed! got the beard a bit shorter after coming back from Brussels though, it was starting getting a bit too much :-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, are you going for the hobo look with the beard?
 * seb128 slaps chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> :)
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, hobo-chic
<chrisccoulson> heh
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-02-10
<furkan> does anybody know why installing the xserver-xorg-lts-utopic package in 14.04 removes the ubuntu-desktop package? is it no longer needed?
<sarnold> furkan: no idea, but ubuntu-desktop is (mostly? entirely?) a metapackage; once you've got the other packages installed, it should be fine to remove it
<sarnold> furkan: maybe when you upgrade to a newer release it'll be awkward or won't compute as convenient an upgrade if it is missing.. if a future upgrade path looks silly, recall this conversation :)
<furkan> sarnold: haha thanks, based on historical data, i will probably go through an inevitable period of frustration, followed by an "ah" moment when i do recall this conversation :)
<sarnold> furkan: that's the one! :)
<tjaalton> furkan: probably some deps are still in transition and you're not supposed to try that yet
<furkan> tjaalton: yeah i think that's what it is - some packages (like the 32-bit libraries) are missing
<furkan> seems like the xserver-xorg-lts-utopic just appeared today
<darkxst> larsu, seems things like gtk:bg[NORMAL] don't work anymore in metacity themes
<darkxst> maybe affect ubuntu themes also, but they use lots of hardcoded values so probably not immediately obvious (but I do get black window borders for eg on Ambiance)
<pitti> Good morning
<happyaron> seb128 morning!
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey happyaron
<happyaron> :)
<didrocks> hey seb128, happyaron!
<seb128> re didrocks
<happyaron> seb128: need your help on two things
<happyaron> 1) binNEW fcitx-qt5
<happyaron> 2) subscribe desktop-bugs to packages in bug 1356222
<ubot5> bug 1356222 in tinyxml (Ubuntu) "[MIR] fcitx and related packages" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1356222
<seb128> happyaron, I can look at 1
<seb128> happyaron, for 2, don't you have an im team/group you can subscribe?
<happyaron> yes I do have, but I realized didrocks asked for desktop-bugs... not sure if that's a requirement
<happyaron> didrocks: ^^^^^^
<didrocks> happyaron: as long as there is at least one team subscribed to all packages, that's fine
<seb128> no
<happyaron> ok
<happyaron> then no need
<seb128> the requirement is that somebody subscribes/look after the bugs
<didrocks> a team your are in, of course :)
<happyaron> :)
<pitti> bonjour seb128 et didrocks, comment allez-vous ?
<pitti> hey happyaron
<happyaron> hey pitti
<happyaron> :)
<didrocks> pitti: Ã§a va, dealing with politics, et toi ? :)
<pitti> didrocks: dealing with jenkins :)
<seb128> hey pitti, wie gehts?
<pitti> seb128: gut, danke!
<seb128> didrocks, are you getting elected? ;-)
 * pitti holds his "didrocks for president" cardboard sign
<didrocks> let me answer and post the reference :)
<pitti> err -- "Notre prÃ©sident: didrocks !"
<didrocks> seb128: pitti: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-pip/+bug/1419695
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1419695 in pip "Should default to --user to not fail default pip install usage" [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> seb128: pitti: context is "pip install by default try to install in /usr/local", and of course, shows a traceback because it's not protected.
<didrocks> nice that it opened the discussion back after stalling for month upstream :)
<seb128> I see
<seb128> good luck with that!
<didrocks> seb128: well, it's simple, it's patched
<didrocks> so either they come with an upstream solution by then
<didrocks> and I change for that
<didrocks> either it stands :p
<didrocks> seems it's the only way to get them moving on that topic
<darkxst> hey seb128, didrocks
<didrocks> evening darkxst
<darkxst> didrocks, been a hot day here;( but cooling now
<darkxst> didrocks, can you look over bug 1416617?
<ubot5> bug 1416617 in appstream-glib (Ubuntu) "[MIR] appstream-glib" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1416617
<didrocks> darkxst: just curious, when did you subscribe the Mir team to it? (mterry is looking at the incoming queue regularly)
<didrocks> darkxst: I'll have a look anyway today, I have some spare cycles
<darkxst> didrocks, I would think jackson did that when he filed it so 31/1
<didrocks> interestingâ¦ Anyway, will have a look!
<darkxst> didrocks, or not, seems he did it today
<seb128> hey darkxst
<didrocks> darkxst: ah, that would explain :)
<darkxst> seb128, metacity themes just seem broken now, looks to be affecting your themes and mitya's also
<didrocks> seb128: are we going to ship the new totem this cycle, do you know?
<seb128> darkxst, now being with the new gtk?
<didrocks> (regarding this appstream-glib bug)
<didrocks> to know who should take maintainer ownership
<darkxst> yes with 3.15.4,  the things like 'gtk:bg[NORMAL] ' don't seemed to get substitued
<seb128> didrocks, not decided yet afaik, Laney and larsu were discussing it
<seb128> new totem is quite a different application
<seb128> it's also more integrated with grilo, tracker, etc
<seb128> not a simple player anymore
<didrocks> well, seeing that it requires appstream-glib, I would have bet so!
<darkxst> seb128, its a lot more subtle with ubuntu themes since many of the colours are hardcoded there
<darkxst> didrocks, appsteam-glib is nothing to do with the UI
<didrocks> darkxst: well, it's the "store" integration I guess
<didrocks> darkxst: so codecs and so on
<darkxst> didrocks, yes its related to the  metadata
<didrocks> darkxst: I just mean, if the ubuntu desktop team isn't going to take the new totam and depends on appstream-glib, I will ask your team to take maintainer ownership until then
<darkxst> didrocks, all GNOME apps will likely need appstream-glib next cycle
<didrocks> darkxst: yeah, but we are talking about this cycle though :)
<didrocks> those things can evolve over time
<darkxst> seb128, why do you keep on about grilo and tracker? they are non issues
<seb128> darkxst, they are new depends and extra bloating to our installion
<mlankhorst> morning
<seb128> hey mlankhorst
<seb128> darkxst, they also mean more code to have in main/support
<larsu> seb128: discussing?
<larsu> morning!
<seb128> hey larsu
<didrocks> morning larsu, mlankhorst!
<darkxst> seb128, its just a half dozen little plugins once we split grilo-plugins
<darkxst> and tracker libs are already there, but wont run on !GNOME
<seb128> darkxst, "just half a dozen"
<didrocks> override_dh_auto_test:
<didrocks>     # Don't run tests, they are always failing at time (20140924)
<didrocks> nice!
<seb128> larsu, I didn't follow, Laney mentioned that new totem was quite different and needed consideration/looking at the user experience
<darkxst> didrocks, most people don't know how to run tests (plus often upstreams do crappy stuff), though I haven't looked at these
<seb128> larsu, I though you were talking with him about it, sorry for misremembering
<larsu> seb128: ah right - we never quite finished that discussion
<larsu> seb128: maybe we should :)
<seb128> yeah
 * larsu is about to go to the airport though
<didrocks> seb128: btw, funny to see appstream-glib depending on libqt4-dev :)
<seb128> larsu, safe flight!
<darkxst> larsu, seb128 all this is news to me, I originally suggested forking the source for totem3 we could use
<seb128> didrocks, what for?
<didrocks> seb128: dunno, looking at debian/control :)
<didrocks>                libglib2.0-dev (>= 2.40),
<didrocks>                libgtk-3-dev,
<didrocks>                libqt4-dev,
 * didrocks will look at the code later
<darkxst> but instead wrote patches to bring back menus, fix grilo, and titlebars for you guys
<larsu> seb128: thanks!
<larsu> darkxst: news
<larsu> darkxst: news? nothing has been decided yet
<larsu> darkxst: forking seems like a lot of work
<darkxst> larsu, seb128  said he was happy enough with the UI at the time I guess
<didrocks> seb128: seems to be just some packaging cruft, doesn't seem like a hard depend
 * didrocks is going to ask on the MIR bug
<darkxst> didrocks, appsteam-glib is meant to be distro/DE agnostic
<didrocks> darkxst: right, but I mean, nothing I can see in the code is using qt4
<darkxst> didrocks, oh I see
<seb128> darkxst, well, ignore what I said, Laney is the one deciding for that update and I didn't pay much attention to it, so maybe I understood wrongly what he plans to do
<seb128> darkxst, the UI looks fine to me, what you said yesterday (that you might be able to play video only by passing them as argument) seems like more worrying
<seb128> but again I didn't try it
<seb128> so let's wait for testing to see how it works exactly
<seb128> happyaron, NEWed
<happyaron> thanks
<darkxst> seb128, that is only without grilo-plugins
<darkxst> and we already have agreed to split those up into the essential ones only, and DM seems ok with that also
<seb128> darkxst, k, well as said, I need to test the experience, I'm just waiting for the plugins to be split so I can test what we want to ship (and not the experience when installing things we are going to split out)
<darkxst> seb128, you could test it now, most of the stuff that will be split out is remote plugins
<darkxst> except I guess youtube
<darkxst> The recent tab doesn't use any remote plugins unless you select one and search
<darkxst> the channels tab is obiously populated mostly by the remote plugins
<willcooke> morning
<seb128> hey willcooke
<willcooke> larsu, didrocks seb128 -> Spoke to robert_ancell, he's happy to hand over bluez5.  He was only working on a small part of it, rather than bringing the whole thing in
<seb128> willcooke, k, was he still working on it?
<didrocks> thanks for clearing that up
<didrocks> darkxst: MIR commented: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/appstream-glib/+bug/1416617
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1416617 in appstream-glib (Ubuntu) "[MIR] appstream-glib" [Undecided,New]
<willcooke> seb128, nope - he'd pretty much stopped
<darkxst> didrocks, thanks I'll follow up on tests, and get Noskcaj to look into copyright/qt4 deps
<seb128> willcooke, good, the handover makes sense then :-)
<willcooke> :)
<didrocks> darkxst: yw!
<willcooke> Laney, the plan for Gtk 3.16 in 15.04.  Is the idea that those issues you mentioned, plus the others raised would be fixed before release, or that we'd live with them?
<willcooke> larsu, Gtk overlay scroll bars - can they be themed as well?
<darkxst>  didrocks looks like --as-needed is causing the test failures (so not actual test failures), I will get it sorted upstream
<darkxst> (^ appstream-glib tests)
<didrocks> thanks darkxst :)
<Laney> yo
<darkxst> willcooke, I'm going to propose blocking on my multiple monitor issues
<darkxst> willcooke, theme issues should be fixable
<Laney> willcooke: fix most of them, but there are more issues so maybe we shouldn't do it, let's talk in the meeting
<darkxst> Laney, has more than one monitor right?
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<willcooke> kk, thanks darkxst Laney.  From my position of little knowledge, it doesn't seem like the best plan right now :)
<darkxst> can you boot gdm with gtk 3.15?
<Laney> darkxst: ya
<Laney> umm, dunno, lemme see
 * Laney haz ubuntu-gnome plymouth theme
<darkxst> Laney, isnt it nice ;)
<Laney> it is
<Laney> who made it?
<darkxst> Laney, me, though the artwork guy did the logos
<darkxst> I just wrote a bit of code to fit his design
<Laney> gdm worked for me
<seb128> hum, GNOME bugzilla lost its identity
<seb128> looks like the fdo one now
<seb128> that sucks
<darkxst> Laney, maybe a NVIDIA blob issue then, but 3.14 doesnt hava a problem with same drivers
 * Laney forgot how it looked before clearly
<ogra_> are you sure its not your firefox ?
<Laney> because I didn't notice :P
<darkxst> Laney, antique like
<darkxst> (bugzilla)
<Laney> darkxst: maybe, I think I'm using nouveau
<Laney> try that?
<darkxst> Laney, I have a maxwell GPU ;(
<Laney> dunno what that means LA LA LA
<darkxst> a little too new for nouveau support
<seb128> darkxst, you find the new look better?
<seb128> it lost useful things though
<seb128> like canveat replies
<darkxst> seb128, have not really played much with it, since it came back up
<Laney> so where's the latest totem test package?
<Laney> let's have a look at it
<darkxst> Laney, gnome3 ppa
<Laney> ok
<Laney> I think my system is trackered
<darkxst> you can just pull binaries down from there, no transitions or what to bother with
 * Laney should kill that first
<darkxst> Laney, if you intsalled ubuntu-gnome-desktop then yeh it is
<Laney> rm -r .cache/tracker?
<darkxst> Laney, it will only rebuild that on next reboot, you probably want to remove traacker binaries/desktop files
<Laney> the packages are gone
<Laney> the processes are killed
<Laney> and that directory is now HISTORY
<darkxst> Laney, that should be enough, but if not there is a script in git to clean out everything
<Laney> totem-mozilla RIP :'(
<darkxst> Laney, https://git.gnome.org/browse/tracker/tree/utils/clean-prefix
<Laney> ok, running it
<Laney> fullscreen videos have a headerbar that doesn't go away, and when I move the mouse another one appears
<darkxst> Laney, Headerbar or titlebar?
<Laney> every time I relaunch the saved videos are duplicated
<Laney> looks like a headerbar to me
<Laney> inspector's pick a widget thing won't get it
<Laney> ah there we go, TotemMainToolbar
<Laney> there's something called toolbar-revealer too, probably just a simple de-headerbar thing I'd guess
<darkxst> Laney, if it only happens in fullscreen, yes would be simple fix
<Laney> prefs dialog has a headerbar
<Laney> I could fix that one, done a ton of that kind of work
<darkxst> Laney, ok, I don't think I have fixed dialog headers
<Laney> there's a property dialogs-use-headerbar or something that you have to fiddle with
<Laney> on GtkDialog
<darkxst> but the fullscreen issue sholuld be an easy fix
<Laney> some of the channels are a bit busted
<darkxst> which ones?
<darkxst> they all come through plugins but seem to work here
<Laney> guardian seems to require authentication (forbidden on console), euronews doesn't play
<darkxst> Laney, I doubt they will be in the package that get MIR'd
<darkxst> so wouldn't show up
<Laney> fair
<Laney> still it sounds like a good feature so worth a bug at least
<darkxst> Laney, euronews was working
<darkxst> not sure about guardian
<darkxst> I can't even launch totem currently (probaby the same gtk bug that breaks gdm)
<darkxst> my laptop needs a sledge hammer or a new screen ;(
<Laney> I get "The movie could not be read"
<Laney> wonder what the video duplication thing is about
<darkxst> and alot of the remote content comes through lua factory or whatever its called, so maybe just bad links/lack of codecs
<darkxst> Laney, in recents?
<Laney> the first screen
<darkxst> yeh
<larsu> willcooke: thanks. Yes, they can
<Laney> hmm, I deleted them and then restarted
<Laney> back from the dead!
<larsu> hi Laney :)
<willcooke> larsu, nice - could you (at some point this week) send me a quick screenshot of what a styled Gtk scrollbar might look like)?
<darkxst> back in grilo-bookmarks matbe?
<Laney> hey larsu
<Laney> darkxst: can I view it outside of totem?
<seb128> wth libtool
<seb128> /bin/bash ../../libtool   --mode=install /usr/bin/install -c   libgbtgeoclue.la '/tmp/install/usr/lib/gnome-bluetooth/plugins/'
<seb128> libtool: install: error: cannot install `libgbtgeoclue.la' to a directory not ending in /usr/lib/gnome-bluetooth/plugins/
<seb128>  
<seb128> '/tmp/install/usr/lib/gnome-bluetooth/plugins/' does end with /usr/lib/gnome-bluetooth/plugins/ no?!
<larsu> willcooke: sure
<darkxst> laney, bpp
<larsu> willcooke: depens a bit on how design wants them, of course :)  We can't have them like we did before (with a separate thumb thingy), but style wise we can go crazy on those two bars (the trough and the slider)
<darkxst> bookmarks shoujld inly pick up things explicitely added via the + menu
<Laney> darkxst: ah it's just sqlite
<Laney> I see 16 copies of the same video in there
<willcooke> larsu, understood - I think for now, if we can just match the colours that will be fine
<darkxst> filesystem scans your drive, but thats not configured currently I believe
<willcooke> fine enough for me to run past Mark & John anyway
<larsu> ok
<larsu> fun
<seb128> hate libtool
<larsu> seb128: welcome to the club. Everyone is in it.
 * darkxst needs dinner back in a bit
<seb128> larsu, :-)
<seb128> srly
<larsu> Laney: figured out the gnome-screenshot problem: it exits before the flash finishes
<larsu> also, it does everything synchronously
<larsu> so if you have a slow drive, you'll see longer white screen in the beginning
 * larsu is looking into a fix
<Laney> really?
<Laney> I thought it was flash then show the UI
<Laney> at least if you just run gnome-screenshot
<larsu> depends on the mode
<larsu> I was running it like it's run when you hit prtnscrn
<larsu> gah, the print screen button
<Laney> I did this http://paste.ubuntu.com/10156184/
<larsu> yes, this solves the "stays opaque all the time" bug
<larsu> I fixed this too, but a bit differently
<Laney> ya
<larsu> Laney: should we fix the other bug at all, then? Or are we ok with short flashes when hitting print screen?
<Laney> it's meant to flash
<Laney> but the opacity doesn't work
<Laney> that's the visual thing
<Laney> we should fix it
<larsu> right, remove the set_visual() call
<larsu> that fixes it for m
 * larsu is talking about yet another bug, but Laney doesn't seem to have noticed it
<Laney> don't think so
<Laney> cheese's flash seems to still work btw
<larsu> cheese needs a cluttervideosink for me
<Laney> probably got blacklisted at some point
<Laney> rm ~/.cache/gstreamer-1.0/registry*
<larsu> indeed, thanks
<larsu> lol
<larsu> flash works, but "there was an error playing video from the webcam" right after it took the pic
<larsu> and it didn't actually take it
<Laney> amigadaveeeeeeeee
<larsu> :)
<Laney> anwyay I guess from gnome-screenshot's filename that it stole this code from cheese at some point, could presumably do so again
 * larsu is on it
<darkxst> gnome-screenshot would be pretty dead upstream, unless the flashback guys have resurrected it
<Laney> cool
<Laney> darkxst: AFAIK it is used but the actual screenshotting is done by gnome-shell
<Laney> like the ui to select an area and save the picture and stuff is still in it
<larsu> ya, the ui was updated as well
<darkxst> Laney, gnome-shell has no external UI for screenshots
<Laney> so gnome-screenshot still is alive
<Laney> it got ported to this new itnerface
 * larsu read it-nerdface
<Laney> me typey good
<darkxst> Laney, still not convinced that gnome-shell uses it at all
<Laney> maybe not if you press print screen but you can still use the application
<robertoper> Hi! I would like to try Ubuntu Next (Unity8) on my desktop. And It worked one time in the past, but now It doesn't log in. It shows the LightDM but when I click on the login button it only shows the lightdm again with blank login window. Any idea?
<darkxst> not in gnome-shell
<Laney> btw I just ran the appstream-glib tests and they worked
<darkxst> that gives you a flash and then nothing
<darkxst> Laney, I was running upstream 3.15.x tests so maybe the issue is there
<robertoper> I found the bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity8-desktop-session/+bug/1320356
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1320356 in unity8-desktop-session (Ubuntu) "mir-session doesn't loads" [Critical,Confirmed]
<robertoper> Any idea or a workaround?
<seb128> robertoper, try maybe #ubuntu-unity
<robertoper> seb128: thanks, I'll give it a try
 * xnox is giggling at http://youtu.be/4KNRzdeUaC4
<xnox> i don't think i want to use desktop next as my main DE yet
<xnox> popup "sign into U1 to get update" -> presenter "is u1 even a thing still?....."
<seb128> xnox, sure is
<seb128> xnox, it's what handle the log-in to ubuntu services (websites, click store on touch, etc)
<didrocks> yeah, the sso part is
<xnox> i know, he doesn't =)
<didrocks> yeah
<xnox> the video is funny. wifi connection didn't work for some reason, thus scopes & updates didn't work and then the presenter says "i guess that's what the future looks like for canonical...."
<xnox> a bit of a fail video to be honest.
<didrocks> seb128: we should probably hack system-settings to disable system update proposals until we have the image based layout
<didrocks> xnox: argh :/
<xnox> pretty much every other screen says it's a phone
<xnox> (at least in that video)
<xnox> as in "connect this phone to computer to transfer videos on it"
<seb128> didrocks, where does it propose system updates?
<didrocks> seb128: it doesn't propose, it's just spinning forever (but I'm unsure if it's because it doesn't have the layout it expects or that udm isn't aware of the "no network" thing)
<seb128> didrocks, the updates panel works on desktop for me, I can update clicks from it
<seb128> didrocks, the keep checking is probably a connectivity issue
<xnox> i want to pilot plasma5 and possibly switch to that....
<seb128> with u-d-m
<seb128> xnox, "pilot"?
<xnox> as in try-out, like tv-series have pilots
<seb128> ah
<seb128> hum
<seb128> Laney,
<seb128> "  * Fallback icon themes are deprecated & ignored upstream, drop the patch and
<seb128>     the setting in debian/settings.ini."
<seb128> isn't that a problem?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I guess connecitivity as a "not on network, but it thinks it is"
<Laney> it happened ages ago
<Laney> so clearly not
<seb128> ages being 3.12 or before?
<didrocks> dart support added to ubuntu make in less time than the unity8 video trial :)
<seb128> didrocks, lol
<Laney> 3.10
<seb128> hum, k
<seb128> I wonder if that means we regressed on some icons without noticing
<seb128> k, can't find the original bug on why we added that change
<seb128> I'm pretty sure that's going to create some bugs in some cases
<seb128> but could be in cases where a settings daemon is not running
<seb128> oh, well, I gave up trying to not have regressions for non standard uses anyway
 * seb128 goes back to bluetooth hacking
<Laney> Then you get the gtk-icon-theme-name theme being used no?
<seb128> Laney, well, I don't remember why it was useful, but in fact it's ok, upstream sort of took the patch
<seb128> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?id=a093cd2a22173369424878eb6d8c38124e7aa1f9
<seb128> and I think the issue was when using an icon theme that doesn't inherit "gnome"
<tjaalton> colord seems outdated and still getting crash reports
<seb128> like that comment says, under KDE
<seb128> that would result in buggy icons in GTK apps, since often they rely on icons from the gnome theme
<Laney> ya, they just removed the configuration
<seb128> that comment didn't state that they add "gnome" to the standard fallback :-)
<seb128> but all is fine, good
<Laney> tjaalton: RAOF has been maintaining that
<seb128> tjaalton, is the second statement having to do with the first one?
<seb128> but other what Laney says
<tjaalton> seb128: assuming 1.2.1...1.2.8 would fix something
<tjaalton> Laney: yeah noticed raof is the maintainer
<Laney> If you're interested in helping with it, mail him and see if you can be an Uploader? :-)
<tjaalton> I'll do that
<Laney> \o/
<pitti> seb128: I finally got around to sending an MP for bug 1411972 FTR
<ubot5> bug 1411972 in powerd (Ubuntu) "systemd service blocks upgrade on desktop" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1411972
<seb128> pitti, danke
<pitti> Laney, seb128: are you still interested in testing gtk 3.15.4 from the PPA, or does the ML discussion (and some IRC discussions) made that first version obsolet?
<Laney> pitti: will follow up after the meeting later
<pitti> *nod*
<seb128> pitti, what Laney said I guess :-)
<pitti> I mean, pretty much the only thing that has to work for me is terminal :) (firefox is still GTK 2)
<Laney> you're so demanding!
<pitti> oh, and gtimelog of course!
<Sweet5hark> http://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=libreoffice%2C%20openoffice&date=today%203-m&cmpt=q&tz= <- so in cause anyone is wondering: it takes about 4,5 years to move a brand.
<seb128> Sweet5hark, doesn't seem to be much change over the years, that's weird?
<Sweet5hark> seb128: AOO did approx. nothing for 5 years, we did a lot, and still it took 5 years to even get parity. is that weird? well, to someone with a clue on the topic it should appear so ...
<seb128> Sweet5hark, well, I'm unsure how you read this graph, but it doesn't seem you reached parity to me
<seb128> or closed the gap
<Sweet5hark> seb128: I assumed some of that, but the extend of that was a lesson learned for me: in the end inertia is huge with brands. You have to be very actively evil to destroy them. technology isnt that relevant there.
<seb128> right
<seb128> http://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=libreoffice%2C%20openoffice&cmpt=q&tz= gives a better view
<seb128> so you are closing the gap indeed :-)
<Sweet5hark> seb128: well, we broke above "openoffice" for the first time this month. so we will finally get to the point were people are not saying "openoffice" even when they mean "libreoffice" ;)
<seb128> Sweet5hark, yeah
<Sweet5hark> seb128: If you look at news search, you will find "libreoffice" wiped the floor with the other brand year after year .... but: inertia.
<seb128> right
<seb128> most people I know still use openoffice
<seb128> as a name
<Sweet5hark> seb128: yep, see also below at related searches/top: "openoffice libreoffice", "openoffice", "libre office" are the top 3 ... for libreoffice
 * mlankhorst revives willcooke 
 * mlankhorst searches for libreoffice.org
<mlankhorst> excuse me, apache libreoffice.org :P
<xnox> desrt: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=744273 please pull =)
<ubot5> Gnome bug 744273 in build "tests failure, xdg runtime dir not created" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<desrt> :(
<desrt> why don't you have a runtime dir?
<desrt> the fallback to ~/.cache/ is really just meant to be a fallback
<xnox> desrt: and as per spec, things that use that should create it if it doesn't exist.... no?
<desrt> well, i wrote that spec
<xnox> desrt: maybe you can consult with xdg spec author..... as in yourself =)
<desrt> so it only follows that..... uh... i don't remember :)
 * desrt checks
<xnox> desrt: i don't have ~/.cache, cause it's a headless buildd without a systemd logind session....
<desrt> anyway... spec says no such thing
<desrt> it specifically says that the system needs to create/delete the dir
<desrt> but for the fallback case it doesn't say anything at all
<xnox> desrt: so.... the test-suite polutes the user's ~/.cache, instead of making it's own?
<desrt> maybe?
<xnox> how do you know current run succeeds, vs left-overs magically pass the tests?
<desrt> note that ~/.cache/ is not hardcoded here
<desrt> we will obey the xdg spec again for the definition of XDG_CACHE_HOME
<desrt> not saying that we actually bother to set that one, mind you ;)
<xnox> desrt: also "If, when attempting to write a file, the destination directory is non-existant an attempt should be made to create it with permission 0700."
<xnox> desrt: from the xdg spec.
<xnox> Under referencing this specification.
<desrt> under the section about XDG_CONFIG_HOME
<desrt> anyway... i don't want to argue about this more because i think you're probably mostly right
<desrt> despite what the spec says
<desrt> i just have to figure out a nice way to deal with this
<xnox> it's for all of them..... My solicitor will be in touch with your lawyer to discuss the details of the argument.
<desrt> man
<xnox> =) but yeah, ideally one way or the other test-suite should do something sensible.
<desrt> sure glad lawyers don't write our specs :)
<xnox> that patch is just a hack =)
<xnox> but it works, so it must be beautiful and upstream worthy
<desrt> so i'm thinking that i want g_get_user_runtime_dir() to make the directory
<desrt> but then i could extend the same logic to all of the xdg basedir APIs
<xnox> desrt: i also have the ugly patch to plug things when xdg-mime, update-desktop-*, user session dbus is missing -> http://paste.ubuntu.com/10158946/
<desrt> which is a bit lame, considering that most of the time those dirs are used for read-only
<xnox> but that one sprinkles g_test_skip all of the place with no real checks =)
<desrt> really, we need a better test framework
<desrt> but that's a yak that i'm not going to be the one to shave :p
<desrt> (with XDG_CONFIG_HOME, XDG_CACHE_HOME, etc. all setup properly)
<xnox> desrt: well, the spec is about attempts to write.... so i guess something does later on tries to write into it and fails =(
<xnox> g_write_user_cache_file_with_create() ? =)
<desrt> ya.... this is what i want to avoid, precisely :)
<xnox> i don't even know what all the mime databases crap is, and whether i want that on the server or not.
<DS-McGuire> larsu, I was referred from Ubuntu-design to ask you about some Ubuntu gtk work that needs to be done, I am good with CSS and I thought I could help, any idea as to what I can help with?
<Sweet5hark> *grumble* --- my libreoffice-dbg install seems to take ages for the download.
<seb128> not sure I'm going to be used to the new GNOME bugzilla, seems a step backward
<xclaesse> seb128, didn't notice any difference, tbh
<seb128> it looks like the fdo one
<seb128> standard replies have been dropped it seems
<seb128> so I guess they dropped the GNOME niceties to go standard bugzilla instead
<willcooke> DS-McGuire, larsu is travelling, he'll might be back on later, or more likely tomorrow
<xclaesse> seb128, FYI, I reported https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=744205 and https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=744204 for the new file chooser
<ubot5> Gnome bug 744205 in Widget: GtkFileChooser "Recursive search is unusable" [Normal,New]
<ubot5> Gnome bug 744204 in Widget: GtkFileChooser "File chooser in gedit try to open directory instead of navigating into it" [Normal,New]
<seb128> xclaesse, thanks
<DS-McGuire> willcooke, Thank you for the update. Do you know of anyone I can talk to in the meantime?
<willcooke> DS-McGuire, larsu will be the best person for sure
<DS-McGuire> willcooke, Okay, thanks :)
<willcooke> DS-McGuire, sorry to put you on hold, but it'll be best to wait
<DS-McGuire> willcooke, It's not a problem at all :)
<willcooke> cool, thx DS-McGuire
<DS-McGuire> :)
<willcooke> seb128, team, going to do the school run - should be back by half past the hour, if not please stand by for a couple of mins :)
<seb128> willcooke, k
<larsu> DS-McGuire: hi! )
<DS-McGuire> larsu, Hello! I wasn't expecting to hear from you today now haha!
<larsu> DS-McGuire: I don't have that much time indeed :)
<larsu> DS-McGuire: ubuntu's desktop theme could use a refresh
<larsu> DS-McGuire: don't worry too much about the css yet, it's quite specific to gtk
<DS-McGuire> larsu, Very much.
<larsu> but having new visuals would be nice
<larsu> haha, yeah
<DS-McGuire> larsu, Where do you think I should start?
<larsu> DS-McGuire: a small refresh for next cycle would be awesome .Just make it look a bit more modern
<larsu> DS-McGuire: do you want to hack on the theme directly?
<DS-McGuire> larsu, I would think that would be the best bet. Shall I grab an 15.04 ISO and hack that directly?
<larsu> DS-McGuire: otherwise I'm fine implementing it (it's normal css, but requires some knowledge about the internals of gtk)
<larsu> DS-McGuire: and our theme is all over the place right now. I've cleaned it up a bit, but didn't get nearly far enough
<DS-McGuire> larsu, I am sure I can pick up and learn the GTK as I go along, I am a software engineering student so that should play into what I do/.
<DS-McGuire> larsu, What files do you look at mostly? Say in the file system?
<larsu> DS-McGuire: ok cool. It's a bit much to get you started on the spot (I'm in a bit of a hurry, too). Can we talk again tomorrow in the morning (ECT) or so?
<larsu> DS-McGuire: 15.04 contains an outdated version, I've done quite some fixes for V
<DS-McGuire> larsu, Not a problem. IRC?
<seb128> larsu, V === 15.04
<DS-McGuire> seb128, I assume he means 15.04 still has the old code
<seb128> could be yeah
<larsu> seb128: thanks for watching. /me just stepped out of a plane
<seb128> larsu, had a uneventful flight?
<larsu> anyhow, it's better if I get DS-McGuire properly started :)
<seb128> yeah
<larsu> seb128: ya, but being sick didn't help
<seb128> :(
<larsu> seb128: everything's fine though
<seb128> good
<Laney> darkxst: I think the duplicate entries are a bug in the grilo plugin
<Laney> FYI
<DS-McGuire> larsu, Wow, dude. I don't want to make you worse, rest if you need, I/this can wait :)
<Laney> It's got some facility to make thumbnails but this seems to always create a new entry
<Laney> Probably fixed upstream but there's no new release yet and it depends on some library called gom
<larsu> DS-McGuire: thanks it's not that bad :) Sitting in a cafe drinking a mint tea already ;)
<larsu> DS-McGuire: let's have a chat tomorrow. Where are you located?
<larsu> Laney: that library is a sqlite wrapper by hergertme and hadess
<larsu> Laney: let me know if you have any questions about it
<DS-McGuire> larsu, Awesome :) Geographically? Wales in the UK.
<Laney> larsu: not atm, just seeing that they ported some parts of grilo to it
<Laney> but there's no release using it yet
<Laney> would be nice if there was because of ^^^ issue at least
<larsu> DS-McGuire: just figuring out if your morning is the same as mine :)
<willcooke> back
<larsu> Laney: there's a totem/grilo that depends on it but no release yet?
<Laney> no
<DS-McGuire> larsu,  I will be here most of the day
<Laney> I mean if they released what is in git it would probably have some bugs fixed
<Laney> due to porting to use gom
<larsu> poke hadess :)
<Laney> SCARY
<larsu> ?
<seb128> larsu, did you try to communicate with the guy? ;-)
<seb128> </troll>
<Laney> now we both pinged him
<larsu> seb128: look at the date!
<Laney> shit's going to go down
<larsu> DOWN
<seb128> lol
<seb128> larsu, not friday?
<larsu> nope
<larsu> doesn't even feel like it
 * seb128 hugs larsu
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Feb 10 15:32:54 2015 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic:
 * larsu hugs back
<willcooke> Roll call: mlankhorst, attente_, desrt, dgadomski, didrocks, FJKong_, happyaron, Laney, larsu, qengho, seb128, Sweet5hark, tkamppeter
<seb128> _o/
<mlankhorst> o/
<dgadomski> o/
<willcooke> hrm - that list doesnt look long enough - if I missed you, shout
 * desrt drops a pencil on the floor, bends over to pick it up
<desrt> oh hai!
<didrocks> hey
<Sweet5hark> ohai
<FJKong_> hi
 * FJKong_ feel sleepy
<willcooke> So slight change of order today, mlankhorst up first
<happyaron> hi
<willcooke> #topic mlankhorst
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: mlankhorst
<larsu> willcooke: I'll be off in a bit. Status: hackfests.
<mlankhorst> preparing mesa 10.5~git snapshot, making mouse events work in XMir under unity8, reworking mouse support in xmir, and a bit sick last week :(
<willcooke> fosflu
<mlankhorst> in next upload rotation/2x mode should work correctly with mouse events
<mlankhorst> indeed!
<willcooke> thanks mlankhorst.
<willcooke> larsu, you want to go next or are you done?
<willcooke> #topic larsu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: larsu
<larsu> oh sure
 * larsu is caught on the spot
<larsu> lots of discussion at the hackfest
<larsu> still didn't get a gedit headerbars conclusion
<larsu> might get a theme refresh soon
<desrt> larsu: see rule #1
<larsu> what's that?
<desrt> "make seb happy"
<desrt> we have to add a toolbar :p
<seb128> :-)
<desrt> see?
<desrt> he's happy already
<larsu> or keep the old version...
<willcooke> (Oh, before you go mlankhorst, larsu - Reviews.  Check your email and backlog at the end of this meeting for (slightly) more info.)
<seb128> let's discuss that later
<mlankhorst> oke :-)
<larsu> I also hacked a bit on gnome-terminal, making it's --app-id support more sane (thanks Laney for providing a transition script)
<desrt> larsu: what's the deal on that?  do you need me to look at those patches soon or is it back to a 'nice to have at some point in the future' type bug now?
<larsu> pondered using gtk 3.16 for V - looking pretty good safe for some smaller issues
<desrt> looks like chpe wanted another approach
<larsu> desrt: soon. The way they do things now is stupid
<larsu> desrt: this way the stupidity is in gtk at least - which we might fix with a private gdk api
<larsu> but please review
 * desrt appears supicious
<desrt> talk to me more about this later
<larsu> why?
<larsu> ok
<desrt> i think i've lost scope of what exactly you're trying to do :)
<larsu> did some bug fixes as well
<larsu> I probably forgot stuff again: but </lars>
<Laney> pink killers
<desrt> you guys missed a sweet last night
<willcooke> #topic attente_
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: attente_
<desrt> they serve pink killers in pint glasses, you know
<willcooke> oops - thanks larsu
<attente_> helped debug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntukylin/+bug/1408212
<attente_> wip/mir2 merged into master upstream
<attente_> not sure what to do about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/maliit-framework/+bug/1245925, prevents ibus and fcitx from working while maliit-framework is installed, and it's pulled in by ubuntu-desktop-next
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1408212 in Unity "Turn on/off the Large Text in Universal Access, it doesn't work immediately" [High,In progress]
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1245925 in maliit-framework (Ubuntu) "Troublesome export in /etc/profile.d/maliit-framework.sh" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<attente_> investigation about getting fcitx working under Mir. kind of works with the gtk backend in the mir demo shell with exception of the candidate window
<willcooke> attente_, any ideas who can assist with 1245925?  Do you want me to try and find someone?
<seb128> willcooke, attente_, I can help getting that moving
<Laney> it should at least check for maliit-keyboard being installed before setting the thing
<seb128> right
<attente_> i'm not sure, the problem seems to be that you can't really have both maliit and ibus/fcitx running simultaneously
<seb128> ideally it should set the env from an upstart job or something
<attente_> at least for qt apps
<seb128> or im-config need to learn to unset it
<seb128> ?
<attente_> maybe the right thing to do is to treat maliit on the same level as ibus/fcitx
<seb128> I think so
<happyaron> forcing maliit will get in the way of 3rd party keyboards as well, on iOS/Android people write their own
<happyaron> yep
<seb128> attente_, don't forget in your week summary that you bisected kernels to find a mir/intel regression
<happyaron> IIRC there was even ibus backend for maliit
<Laney> he bisected gtk too
<attente_> but it gets weird when you start switching between u7 and u8
<Laney> king of bisects
<seb128> Laney, that was his "helped debug ...." line
<Laney> by BISECTING
<seb128> rrrright
<seb128> got you ;-)
<willcooke> oki, sounds like between us we can work something out then
<willcooke> thanks attente_
<seb128> attente_, well, even on unity8, you might want to switch between osk and ibus/fcitx
<seb128> even in the same session
<seb128> like one screen being your docked phone and one being your docking stating external monitor
<attente_> seb128: yeah, this is bad for us
<seb128> so we need something more dynamic that the env at some point
<attente_> happyaron: we can kind of resolve it for not-qt apps by making im-config override empty GTK_IM_MODULE for example, but i'm not sure what else can be done for qt apps
<attente_> right
<seb128> let's discuss that after meeting
<happyaron> ok
<seb128> maybe the devel list would be better for that
<seb128> more people/potential ideas
<willcooke> great, thanks chaps
<willcooke> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: desrt
<desrt> hi!
<desrt> was in hackfest mode last week as well
<desrt> got a lot of useful engineering work done on stuff like mir, content hub, etc.
<Laney> - git wwpd
<desrt> wrote a neat thing called git wwpd :)
<desrt> people seem to like that...
<desrt> uh... mostly recovering from sickness and had a swap day yesterday so not a lot to report since the sprint
<Sweet5hark> .oO(what would the pope do?)
<desrt> Sweet5hark: what would 'push' do
<willcooke> thanks desrt
<desrt> displays a list of commits that would be sent to the server as a result of a particular 'git push' command
<willcooke> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: dgadomski
<Laney> next step is to wrap git push and add a confirmation step
<dgadomski> hello everyone
<dgadomski> - got a fix for bug #1337873, will ask for more feedback after initial tests show no regression (it used to happen every 1-2k reboots, testing takes a while)
<ubot5> bug 1337873 in ifupdown (Ubuntu) "Precise, Trusty, Utopic - ifupdown initialization problems caused by race condition" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1337873
<dgadomski> - back to analyzing bug #1104230 fix regression since kernel ~3.16.0-27
<ubot5> bug 1104230 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) "DisplayPort 1.2 MST support is missing in the Intel driver" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1104230
<dgadomski> - analyzing a Network Manager issue - will prepare a lp bug for that, does anyone specialize in the network manager area to check if this is a known problem?
<Laney> c_yphermox does
<seb128> dgadomski, you can describe the bug on the channel after the meeting
<seb128> or check launchpad/bugzilla
<dgadomski> I will surely search first, just need to understand what is going on there exactly
<dgadomski> thanks
<dgadomski> EOF from me
<willcooke> thanks dgadomski
<willcooke> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: didrocks
<didrocks> hey
<didrocks> Developer desktop:
<didrocks> - Added android NDK support to ubuntu make (not released yet). mhall119 should be happy about it.
<didrocks> - Workaround the "add a new unity launcher item  bug". Users should be happy this.
<didrocks> - patched pip install to do the right thing by default (not trying to install system-wide and get a traceback on pip install). aquarius should be happy about that.
<didrocks> - checked that others developer packaging systems are doing sane local install by default (rubygem, npm, bowerâ¦).
<didrocks> - Note that this put pressure on upstream to get this issue finally fixed (the topic was stalled for quite a while), and I proposed our help and backport an upstream fix this cycle (mostly same behavior). Barry should be happy with the final solution.
<didrocks> systemd:
<didrocks> - wrote and rewrote fsck<->plymouth integration patch first using epoll and then using systemd mainloop. Proposed upstream and waiting for a review now. pitti should be happy once it's merged.
<didrocks> - dropped libplymouth dependency, investigate and talk directly the raw protocol. Lennart should be happy with the replacement.
<didrocks> misc:
<didrocks> - MIR and AA duties. No-one can ever be happy about doing those.
<didrocks> - planned ahead to get sick a week before the sprint to NOT get fosflu. Success so farâ¦ I'm happy \o/
<didrocks> this whole week was about to make people happy :)
<didrocks> EOW
<willcooke> thanks didrocks
<pitti> haha
<pitti> hahahappy!
<didrocks> :p
<Laney> you should have seen him writing the plymouth code
<Laney> not happy!
<desrt> ya... particularly the 3rd time he was doing it
<willcooke> :D
<pitti> {blood,sweat,tears}Â²
 * pitti hugs didrocks
 * Laney hugs didrocks 
<didrocks> Laney: yeah, other were happy, not I! :)
 * desrt hugs didrocks 
 * didrocks hugs you back
<willcooke> #topic FJKong_
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: FJKong_
<FJKong_> * do some research on gif skin display for sogou IM, not easy to load gif skin from memory, needs more time fix it
<FJKong_> * bug 1413865 No default setting for "When power is critically low" in Power settings, still in progress
<ubot5> bug 1413865 in Ubuntu Kylin "No default setting for "When power is critically low" in Power settings" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1413865
<FJKong_> * upload pinyin search code to github
<FJKong_> * take two day off
<FJKong_> not much to update
<willcooke> FJKong_, you are off next week right?
<FJKong_> willcooke: not all
<FJKong_> willcooke: next next maybe
<willcooke> kk, well if we don't speak before Thursday, have a great new year :)
<FJKong_> willcooke: thanks all
<willcooke> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: happyaron
<happyaron> 1. Update most of the packages related to fcitx, prepare for the MIR again (sorryâ¦)
<happyaron> 2. Fix symbols craziness of libgooglepinyin and fcitx-qt5
<willcooke> And a happy new year for next week happyaron as well :)
<happyaron> 3. Fix 6 bugs assigned from Ubuntu Kylin
<happyaron> thanks
<happyaron> over
<willcooke> thanks for the update happyaron
<willcooke> bed time now :)
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: Laney
<Laney> â¢ Sprinting last week, working on a few things such as
<Laney> â A wrapper script for gnome-terminal to provide compatibility with old launchers
<Laney> â Packaging snapshot of gtk, glib, overlay-scrollbars with GTK3 stuff disabled for evaluation of a possible switch in 15.04
<Laney> â Fix some FTBFS in vivid test rebuild
<seb128> happyaron, FJKong_: happy new year :-)
<Laney> â¢ Upload gtk 3.14 latest release with patches to fix setting the text scaling factor
<Laney> â¢ Cherry pick the upstream patch to fix nautilus' glib signal connection order for background switching
<Laney> â¢ Look at totem 3.14, should be fine after another round of bug fixes, working with darkxst on this
<Laney> â¢ Poke a bit at gnome-screenshot 'flash' breaking on new gtk (involved bisecting gtk!), think larsu is looking at this now
<Laney> â
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<desrt> best part of the meeting is looking forward to Laney's choice of unicode
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: qengho
<willcooke> qengho is off today, but:
<willcooke>  Released Chromium 40.0.2214.94. Prepared 40.0.2214.111, which should be out today. I'm back at work Thursday.
<willcooke> New Chromium \o/  thanks qengho
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> indeed \o/
<seb128> â¢ looked at the vivid archive test rebuild, fixed some build issues
<seb128> â¢ investigate libpwquality not being translated
<seb128> â¢ fixed incorrect label wrapping in u-s-d free disk space dialog
<seb128> â¢ backported g-c-c change to fix u-c-c build with new n-m, cleaned out some deprecation warnings as well
<seb128> â¢ helped testing fixes for bluetooth/n-m segfaults
<seb128> â¢ some sponsoring (new chromium)
<seb128> â¢ looked at undefined symbol issue in gnome-bluetooth, hit libtool issues trying to fix the issue, opted rather to disable the plugin which is not useful/buggy (upstream dropped it in 3.10 as well)
<seb128> â¢ ubuntu-system-settings
<seb128> â implemented bluetooth ssp profile pairing
<seb128> â disabled bluetooth pairing action for unsupported device types
<seb128> â¢ usual share of desktop related bugs triages and discussions
<seb128> </week>
<willcooke> thanks a lot seb128
<willcooke> seb128, new kdb should be on its way to you
<FJKong_> seb128: thanks new year holiday start at 18th Feb to 24th :)
<seb128> willcooke, great
<seb128> FJKong_, noted!
<willcooke> FJKong_, happyaron - Beijing office is closed next week, so I expect most folk will be afk
<willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: Sweet5hark
<Sweet5hark> - FOSDEM
<Sweet5hark> - TDF Board of Directors meeting
<Sweet5hark> - some employee meeting and Hackfest (but already on the way to sickness then :/)
<Sweet5hark> - flight home and three days (plus weekend) under fosdem flu: sneeze, sob, sneeze
<Sweet5hark> - prepared 4.4.0.3 for vivid
<Sweet5hark> - checked for horror regressions by mergedlibs, didnt find any so far
<Sweet5hark> - bug 1419836 seems interesting: doesnt happen upstream, but isnt mergedlibs related (checked rc2 vs. rc3)
<Sweet5hark> - bug 1419521 same, could use help from tkamppeter to figure out whats going on ...
<Sweet5hark> - /me heard about perf reviews, distributes free virtual lollypops
<FJKong_> willcooke: yes most of them will travel back to home ahead of days
<Sweet5hark> EOF
<ubot5> bug 1419836 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "LibreOffice 4.4 (PPA): Extension can't be installed: Message: com.sun.star.uno.RuntimeException) "unknown error!"" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1419836
<ubot5> bug 1419521 in LibreOffice Productivity Suite "LibreOffice 4.4.0.3 broke printing" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1419521
<willcooke> thanks Sweet5hark
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> - system-config-printer: Trusty SRU completed
<tkamppeter> - CUPS: Update to CUPS 2.0.2 in Ubuntu (Debian is in freeze, therefor they are currently not working on updates like this.
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Working on a PPD generator for auto-discovered network printers
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<willcooke> thanks tkamppeter
<willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<willcooke> Worked on:
<willcooke> - TPM support - can finally log into my test machine using a binary
<willcooke> passphrase stored in TPM
<willcooke> - Fix seahorse FTBFS
<willcooke> Currently working on:
<willcooke> - TPM support (tidy up tools and start work on installer support)
<willcooke> - Updating Indic font packages (blocked on archive admin team removing
<willcooke> package block)
<willcooke> #topic willcooke
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: willcooke
<willcooke> So, yeah, you know how I said we had ages to do the reviews? Well, I was lying.
<willcooke> Due Friday people
<willcooke> sorry
<willcooke> If you have have your personal review done by then, and have emailed me your 360 people, that'll be grand
<willcooke> The other thing I wanted to follow up on was https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/1418295
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1418295 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) "Black screen after resuming from suspend" [Critical,Confirmed]
<willcooke> Just because it's a critical one
<willcooke> From the comments I think it's now almost agreed that it's a U7 issue
<willcooke> so I will follow up with those guys.
<willcooke> I'm going to London tomorrow - so if anyone needs anything from there let me know
<willcooke> the office I mean,
<seb128> willcooke, is that new that we need to go through you to ask for peer reviews?
<willcooke> not the ships
<willcooke> shops
<seb128> usually we could ask those directly
<willcooke> seb128, wellll. the docs say you email me and then I add it to the HR system.  I don't know if that's new or not, so let's just say it is
<seb128> k
<willcooke> That is
<willcooke> I just add that person as a reviewer
<Laney> we got this new system since then
<seb128> yeah, we didn't use the new website for that yet
<willcooke> and then the system emails them
<seb128> seems a step backward compared to the old system
<willcooke> right kk
<seb128> but let's see
<willcooke> yes
<Laney> so you're saying this part is not optional?
<willcooke> that's my (new) understanding yes
<willcooke> msg me if you want to talk about it
<Laney> interesting, ok
<willcooke> #topic any other business
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: any other business
<willcooke> going once
<Laney> stoppppppp
<didrocks> :p
<seb128> thanks :-)
<willcooke> Yes - the gentleman in the top hat
<Laney> GTK 3.15
<seb128> oh, that!
<Laney> I think there a few more issues than I expected
<Laney> so I'm becoming a bit more wary
<Laney> what do others think?
<seb128> it makes me a bit nervous, especially because of the new toolbars that we didn't really test yet (nor try to make look like we want)
<seb128> but we still have some time in the cycle
<willcooke> I'm a bit wary also, seems late in the cycle and a few too many unknowns and bugs for my liking.
<willcooke> seb128, do we have time?  Is this not a feature?
<didrocks> there is going to be a period when landing it will break thingsâ¦ depends if we agree about regressing our desktop or not
<seb128> didrocks, what sort of regressions are we talking about?
<Laney> and gnome's
<didrocks> seb128: the new toolbars "unknowness" for instance?
<seb128> willcooke, we, it's a feature to land it, it's not a feature to tweak more i.e the look of the scrollbars after ff
<willcooke> seb128, ack
<seb128> didrocks, well, that's something we need to resolve before landing
<Laney> not all applications will use the new scrollbars currently either
<Laney> e.g. webkitwebviews or vte widgets
<seb128> what would happen to e.g software-center then?
<Laney> normal scrollbar
<seb128> what was the reason we wanted to update gtk this cycle again?
<Laney> scrollbars :)
<seb128> I see
<Laney> there's still some black background cases
<seb128> g-s-m being the only known one we had to disable scrollbars for, right?
<Laney> ya
<seb128> I fear a bit that the new scrollbars are going to feel like a regression
<Laney> I think so
 * FJKong_ say --. -.
<seb128> but we need to deal with that at some point, not sure if delaying but a cycle buy us much
<seb128> at the same time there is no strong need to update
<seb128> so we could play safe
<Laney> and there's other issues like black notifications on the greeter and whatever else I mentioned
<seb128> especially that we still have the systemd and bluez transitions to come this cycle
<Laney> 6 (8) months to work on it instead of 2
<Laney> people can work on it out of the ppa so it's better at the start of next cycle, if they have time
<Laney> the time-based release thing
<seb128> +1 for delaying
<willcooke> +1
<seb128> it feels like we are going to get some unexpected side effect
<seb128> and history tells it's better to do that when cycle open than at ff
<Laney> larsu was for it though, will be sorry to disappoint him
<willcooke> we can land it nice and early next release, plus there might be a theme change needed too - so we could combine that in?
<willcooke> you snooze you lose
<willcooke> ;p
 * seb128 hugs larsu
<seb128> well, we can decide on that
<seb128> larsu can still try to convince us in the next days, nothing blocks us to revisit next week
<seb128> in case there is a status quo change
<willcooke> good point
<Laney> well
<Laney> it means that the gnome guys have to do some different work
<seb128> well, status is that we stay on what we have
<seb128> we can still see if people can sync on something else in the next week
<seb128> even if that's not likely
<Laney> works for me
<Laney> I think it was good to try
<seb128> I would like to at least let a chance to larsu to convince us when he's back, if he really thinks we should go with the new version
<Laney> because now we know issues to work on in an idle handler
<seb128> right
<Laney> style scrollbars, fix notifications, get them working on more apps, find out the nvidia problem, ...
<seb128> right
<Laney> cool
<Laney> moving on then
<seb128> + the gnome decoration issues
<seb128> + probably some extra bugs
<seb128> thanks Laney
<seb128> willcooke, seems like that's a wrap then :-)
<Laney> i'm assuming that one is fixed in 3.16 of mutter & gsd, but yes
<Laney> s/gsd/gs/
<willcooke> oki
<willcooke> One last thing then.. willcooke and Mrs willcooke are expecting the delivery of twin boys in May.  \o/
<willcooke> Hence no China trip for me
<Laney> yay!
<willcooke> #topic endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v | Desktop Weekly Meeting 2015-02-10 | Current topic: endmeeting
<Laney> congrats :-)
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<seb128> willcooke, congrats!
<desrt> willcooke: congrats :)
<attente_> +1
<attente_> or +2
<willcooke> :D thanks chaps
<Laney> oh that reminds me that I got some new pics of you-know-who ;-)
 * desrt readys telegram
<desrt> piano lessons already!
<Laney> better than me tbh
<willcooke> :D
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> I'm getting notifications with actions from nm-applet
<seb128> Laney, so fallback dialogs?
<Laney> yes
<seb128> seems like a bug worth pointing to cyphermox
<Laney> could be me somehow
<seb128> when doing what/when?
<cyphermox> uh oh
<Laney> well for one I'm on xmonad ;-)
<Laney> but there's notify-osd and no notification-daemon
<Laney> yeah I restarted nm-applet and it's okay now
<Laney> cyphermox: stand down
<Laney> :)
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> ;)
<cyphermox> glad I can still focus on plymouth, I think I'm getting somewhere finally
<Laney> you and didrocks can have a mutual counselling session
<Laney> apparently the codebase is fun to work with
<cyphermox> hahaha
<mhall119> didrocks: \o/
<Sweet5hark> seb128: suggesting for upload: http://people.canonical.com/~bjoern/vivid/4.4.0/libreoffice_4.4.0-1ubuntu1_source.changes and http://people.canonical.com/~bjoern/vivid/4.4.0/libreoffice-l10n_4.4.0-1ubuntu1_source.changes
<seb128> Sweet5hark, need sponsoring or just review?
<Sweet5hark> seb128: sponsoring. is: upstream rc2->rc3, completes mwaw MIR, reenables mergelibs
<happyaron> didrocks: mind have a look at fcitx MIR again? everything in your last message have been dealt with
<willcooke> seb128, can you try something on your U8 machine - from lightdm enter the wrong password - do you get the password box increasing in size?
<willcooke> and do you get the session icon just turning black?
<seb128> willcooke, neither of those, didn't update since friday though
<willcooke> seb128, mine is even older I think
 * willcooke upgrades
<Laney> what's GDK_KEY_OpenURL?
<didrocks> happyaron: I'll have a round tomorrow or thursday
<didrocks> happyaron: but please first change the component status for everything you fixed (as told last time)
<didrocks> happyaron: that's easier for us to track then :)
<didrocks> Laney: I see now why when walking to the doctor I receive some unexpected telegram photos :)
<didrocks> willcooke: congrats!
<Laney> \o/
<willcooke> thx didrocks
<willcooke> seb128, update has fixed most things, but I might have found a bug...  could you try this tomorrow:
<willcooke> 1.  Log in to U8.  2.  With the mouse/touchpad click on the wifi indicator some times (I did it three or four I think). Dont drag down, just click so that it expands a little way, then release.   3.  Without moving the pointer touch the wifi indicator.  4.  CPU @ 100% U8 unresponsive.  5.  sad face.
<seb128> willcooke, sure can try
<seb128> willcooke, but for me trying to open the power indicator is enough to screw things
<willcooke> heheh
<willcooke> let me try that
<willcooke> yup
<willcooke> my elaborate dance was for nought
<seb128> hehehe
 * didrocks waves good evening and good night
<willcooke> cya
<desrt> didrocks: ciao
<desrt> good evening
<didrocks> see you guys :)
<willcooke> oh, 360 reviews are super simple and quick
 * willcooke -> dinner
 * Laney the de-dialog-headerbarerer
<Laney> goodnight!
<larsu> night Laney
<robert_ancell> larsu, do you want bug 1396700 assigned to you?
<ubot5> bug 1396700 in indicator-bluetooth (Ubuntu) "Needs to be updated to bluez5" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1396700
<larsu> robert_ancell: sure :)
<larsu> also, hi! How are you?
<robert_ancell> larsu, good, yourself?
<robert_ancell> mterry, any idea why my (Nexus 4) phone greeter always shows "No data sources available"?
<larsu> robert_ancell: good good, thanks. Just came back home after conferences and sprints
<robert_ancell> larsu, yeah, sounded like fun!
<mterry> robert_ancell, no :-/
<mterry> robert_ancell, sounds like a bug with libusermetrics?
<larsu> robert_ancell: it was! And exhausting. Caught Fosdemflu
<robert_ancell> mterry, is there a greeter log or anything I can check?
<robert_ancell> larsu, :(
<robert_ancell> mterry, or does the greeter just use a widget
<mterry> robert_ancell, we have our own widget
<mterry> robert_ancell, so it *could* be that failing
<mterry> robert_ancell, you could check ~/.cache/upstart/unity8.log to see if there's anything that looks like an infographics error
<mterry> robert_ancell, there will be lots of noise though
<mterry> robert_ancell, I'm not sure where libusermetrics outputs to
<mterry> robert_ancell, poke pete-woods for help with that
<mterry> robert_ancell, actually, looking at my own daily driver phone, I'm seeing that too
<mterry> robert_ancell, I think I forgot that was a feature
<mterry> robert_ancell, let's move to #ubuntu-touch and pull pete-woods in
<robert_ancell> mterry, yeah, it's always been broken on my Nexus 4. I wondered if it was just a feature for production phones
<attente_> bschaefer: hey, you were right, i managed to get fcitx input working under the demo server
<bschaefer> attente_, woooooooots!
<bschaefer> attente_, what was the issue?
<attente_> it's just missing the candidate window popup
<bschaefer> yeah that expected
<willcooke> nice attente_
<bschaefer> attente_, does it pop up behind the main window?
<willcooke> morning robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> willcooke, hello
<bschaefer> attente_, as.... IIRC its pretty much just a menu?
<attente_> bschaefer: it doesn't pop up at all, because that's being done in a separate process
<bschaefer> ooo yeah, thats done after the dbus call to the actual server
<attente_> but the committing of the test actually works
<bschaefer> sweet!
<attente_> if you need to get it working, you just need to update the local version of immodules.cache that it's looking up
<bschaefer> i guess the fun part now is ... how to get an out of process window to render on an app? (I dont think mir wants that?)
<bschaefer> attente_, naw, knowing it works was the main test :)
<attente_> and add a reference to the system location of the im-fcitx.so
<attente_> :)
<bschaefer> cool, ill have to give that a test at some point
<bschaefer> attente_, soo that means, gtk and qt
<attente_> yeah, the next part is to figure out how to get fcitx-qimpanel working under the demo server environment
<bschaefer> should have IM support already.... the only other issue do we want mir to support IMs if a toolkit talks directly to mir
<bschaefer> ie. SDL2/SDL1.2
<attente_> yeah... i guess we need that still
<bschaefer> though i know SDL2 has ibus support meaning it will do the talking to ibus
<bschaefer> attente_, the only issue with that is... mir would have to expose some fun parts ... i would think?
<bschaefer> then we would then have to write backends in ibus/fcitx ... a lot of work for little gain
<bschaefer> kgunn, ^
<bschaefer> attente_, but i suppose thats something we can discuss later haha, the main part is to get it working for 80-90% of the cases :)
<willcooke> sounds like a very sensible plan to me :)
<attente_> i'd be happy if we could just get the candidate window working :)
<bschaefer> very! though thats going to be interesting...now that we know its an out of process window
<bschaefer> attente_, im not sure how mir will want to handle that... as i think that would mean we need some sort of trusted session?
<bschaefer> attente_, do you know of any other programs that use out of process windowing like input methods?
<attente_> i guess osk? but it seems like it gets treated the same
<bschaefer> soo then how does an osk work ... like mallite? (i cant spell it)
<attente_> maybe there's some a11y stuff that we don't know about
<bschaefer> i know its through some trusted session though im not sure how that would work
<bschaefer> attente_, yup, possibly questions in #ubuntu-mir
<attente_> maliit works as a qt im-module afaict
<bschaefer> im not sure what that is :) ... but it seems to get a window rendering on top of the running process
<bschaefer> that then accepts input
<bschaefer> sooo thats pretty much what we would need for the input method preedit window
<attente_> i think the window has little to do with the actual input because fcitx still can detect the keystrokes despite not having a surface in the demo server
<bschaefer> attente_, yeah fcitx will get the events through filter key press
<bschaefer> soo it doesn't *need* input it self it just needs to render above everything at the correct location
<bschaefer> its quite nice actually (the way it takes events) but pretty much the preedit window is only good for rendering
<bschaefer> i dont think... it normally takes events?
<attente_> makes sense. i guess that window still needs to respond to pointer events though
<bschaefer> yeah it seems to respond on X11 to a pointer
<bschaefer> hmm i wonder why the window doesn't pop up somewhere... even if its out of process....maybe mir rejects it?
<bschaefer> you would think, even if something out of process requests a window... the window would still appear?
<attente_> it's probably popping up on vt 7
<bschaefer> o interesting, yeah...i wonder if you get something working on a unity8 desktop?
<bschaefer> if it would pop up somewhere...
<bschaefer> though i could be behind the surface (though i think it would just be rejected)
<bschaefer> attente_, also, how did you figure out the issue? (Some what curious haha)
<bschaefer> as what does immoudules do?
<attente_> bschaefer: yep. it's popping up on vt 7
<bschaefer> nice, soo now ... why does it think vt7 should own it?
<bschaefer> possibly it just assumes DISPLAY=:0?
<bschaefer> attente_, where did you run the server on? the umm fcitx server?
<bschaefer> ie. what happens if you run the fcitx server from tty1 or tty2 and aim it at gtk for mir?
<attente_> the fcitx-qimpanel process is just started from my X session
<attente_> when the session started
<attente_> which i guess explains why it's on vt 7
<bschaefer> i see, what happens if you attempt to run that on the demo?
<bschaefer> yeah
 * bschaefer assumes its something like python/gtk or something?
<attente_> fcitx-qimpanel expects an X server it seems
<attente_> fcitx-qimpanel: cannot connect to X server
<bschaefer> sweet, now we know what to hack to get to work now :)
<bschaefer> though ... i wonder why it expects x11...
<bschaefer> where does qimpanel even come from?
<bschaefer> fcitx-ui-qimpanel
<bschaefer> haha nm...
<attente_> yep :)
<bschaefer> weird i didn't even have that installed?
<bschaefer> is that the only way to render the panel?
<bschaefer> fcitx-module-kimpanel
<attente_> fcitx comes with its own, but not many seem to be using it
<bschaefer> that makes sense
<bschaefer> attente_, for all we know it could just hard code a check for the DISPLAY
 * bschaefer hopes its not a hard depends
<attente_> bschaefer: i'll have to look into it more, but i guess it depends on qt, and is using an x11 backend
<bschaefer> attente_, that makes sense, i wonder if you can force the mir backend?
 * bschaefer doesn't know much about the qt port it self
<bschaefer> attente_, but awesome :)
<bschaefer> at lease you've something to track down haha
<attente_> yeah. i've never tried running a qt app under the demo server :)
<bschaefer> once that works...i hope the window renders over the mir app :)
<bschaefer> attente_, good luck!
<attente_> bschaefer: thanks :)
<bschaefer> also feel free to poke me if you need something tested or anything!
<attente_> will do
 * willcooke -> EOD
<willcooke> g'night
<koding123> so what is the point of using Ubuntu Make( https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-make ) instead of a package specific PPA?
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-02-11
<koding123> so what is the point of using Ubuntu Make( https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-make ) instead of a package specific PPA?
<pitti> Good morning
 * Mirv would like to file a bug "Abiword started launching on each login in vivid"...
<darkxst> hey pitti
<darkxst> did you get a chance to look at my systemd mount bug?
<pitti> darkxst: not yet, sorry; but still high on my list (probably today)
<darkxst> pitti, no problem, its just annoying me while constantly rebooting trying to fix gdm XRandr errors ;(
<didrocks> morning
<pitti> darkxst: you could try adding "mount -a" to /etc/rc.local
<pitti> darkxst: as a workaround
<pitti> hey didrocks, Ã§a va ?
<didrocks> pitti: Ã§a va, et toi ?
<pitti> didrocks: je vais bien aussi; trop de systemd bugs :)
<didrocks> argh :) j'ai lu hier le problÃ¨me avec les symlinks
<didrocks> pitti: I guess I'm going to upload the protocol support in plymouth for fsckd, it does only add a new stenza for fsckd: and keys:
<didrocks> doesn't impact existing behavior
<didrocks> for the rest, we'll see once Lennart would review the patches
<pitti> didrocks: sure, that sounds fine
<darkxst> pitti, ok will try that
<pitti> didrocks: it seems Lennart is back from Brno and catching up with the ML, I hope we can get this in soon; otherwise I'll pull them into the ubuntu packages if you want
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, let's give another couple of days
<didrocks> pitti: I'm catching up on developer stuff before feature freeze during this systemd-less time :)
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey didrocks pitti
<didrocks> salut seb128
<pitti> bonjour seb128, Ã§a va ?
<seb128> pitti, oui, et toi ?
<darkxst> hey seb128 didrocks
<seb128> hey darkxst
<darkxst> speaking of FF, anything blocking baobab, gnome-contacts etc other than titlebar patches?
<pitti> seb128: Ã§a va bien aussi
<seb128> darkxst, didn't look at those, but probably not
<darkxst> and gedit, but I have no plans to implement the OSX ui, just de-headerbar ot?
<darkxst> ok
<darkxst> vino I suppose is blocked on bug 1271358
<ubot5> bug 1271358 in vino (Ubuntu) "Update to 3.12" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1271358
<seb128> yes
<seb128> gedit, larsu and Laney were looking at it
<seb128> larsu added back the traditionnal menubar and decoration
<seb128> but it looks weird without a toolbar
<seb128> it also means the standard actions are not easily available
<seb128> (save, open, print, etc)
<seb128> so it's under discussion
<seb128> we might want to not update or to add a toolbar back
<darkxst> seb128, well the toolbar is there in the code, kinda
<seb128> didrocks, pitti, seems like http://launchpadlibrarian.net/196013611/casper_1.349_1.350.diff.gz is not working, do you have any idea why that could be the case?
<pitti> seb128: s/./:/ ?
 * didrocks looks
<seb128> pitti, shrug, could be indeed ... do we have logs somewhere that could should the error?
<didrocks> yeah, should be $USER:$GROUP
<pitti> hm no, . works as well
<didrocks> oh, really?
<seb128> didrocks, ^
 * didrocks learnt something today
<pitti> it's not documented, but I just tried it here
<seb128> I think I copied the line from somewhere else in casper
<pitti> didrocks: better don't :)
<didrocks> seb128: logs, you can see it at boot normally, but that's it
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, agreed, I lived quite happily without it :p
<didrocks> no obvious typo at leastâ¦
<seb128> ubiquity-hooks/30accessibility:		chroot /target chown -R $TARGET_USERNAME.$TARGET_USERNAME /home/$TARGET_USERNAME/.local
<didrocks> seb128: first boot, non persistent system I guess?
<seb128> didrocks, are those run at boot?
 * seb128 tries
<seb128> do you know that log to look at?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, really early at boot, and rerun at every boot
<didrocks> seb128: you won't find logs I guess, it's written on the console before the kernel loads AFAIK, but if you remove "quiet", you should see them
<didrocks> seb128: you can launch them by hand though
<pitti> seb128: you could boot with break=casper-bottom, there you might see some error messages and can also run stuff manually
<pitti> no, kernel loads before, that's the initramfs
<pitti> yeah, I see some "failed to change ... 1000 .. blabla" error messgae
<pitti> (without quiet)
<pitti> but why 1000, I thought it was 999
<pitti> ah no, that was another error message, I still see it on vt1 now
<larsu> good morning!
<seb128> hey larsu
<pitti> chown: unknown user/group ubuntu:ubuntu
<pitti> seb128: ^
<seb128> pitti, danke
<pitti> seb128: boot without quiet and check VT1
<didrocks> did you run that before the user is created?
<seb128> didrocks, I guess so? where is the user added?
<pitti> ./scripts/casper-bottom/25adduser
<seb128> so 51... should be after?
<pitti> seb128: no, the problem is that teh initramfs doesn't know this user
<pitti> try this: chroot /root "chown -R $USERNAME.$USERNAME /home/$USERNAME/.config"
<seb128> pitti, danke
<pitti> seb128: the user is only created in the /root file system
<seb128> right
<didrocks> making sense
<pitti> seb128: actually, I think without the quotes
<seb128> what's the easiest way to try those changes?
<pitti> seb128: the initramfs has vi, so break=casper-bottom, vi the file, and continue to boot (just ctrl+d or exit theh initramfs shell)
<seb128> pitti, danku
<pitti> seb128: F6 other options -> press esc twice to close the pop up menu, then you can edit the boot command line
<pitti> (I didn't know before that our live initramfs has vi, but I guess we weren't the first ones to hack casper fixes on the live system :)
<didrocks> it didn't 5 years ago
<didrocks> I'm jaleous now :p
 * didrocks had to cat, awk and redirect :/
<pitti> sed FTW :)
<FJKong_> seb128: didrocks about this bug : https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntukylin/+bug/1413865
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1413865 in Ubuntu Kylin "No default setting for "When power is critically low" in Power settings" [Medium,Confirmed]
<FJKong_> seb128: didrocks the right way is patch unity-control-center and add option 'suspend' ?
<seb128> FJKong_, does it make sense to suspend on those case? knowing that suspend uses power and your laptop is going to run flat anyway
<FJKong_> seb128: so maybe just shutdown ?
<seb128> yes, likely better
<didrocks> firefox developer edition support in ubuntu make done -> writing tests now :)
<FJKong_> seb128: so just patch ubuntu-settings and change default value to shutdown
<seb128> FJKong_, I guess so, though I wonder if we should rather patch the code to default to hibernate and fallback to shutdown if hibernate is disabled
<seb128> though since we disable hibernate by default we could decide it's up to the user to change the config if they enable it
<seb128> didrocks, pitti, thanks for the help, I tested it and confirmed it works this time :-)
<didrocks> nice!
<FJKong_> seb128: I think hibernate will be better
 * pitti ^5s seb128
<Laney> yo
<didrocks> FJKong_: hibernate isn't supported on all machines though
<seb128> FJKong_, we don't enable hibernate by default though
<pitti> hey Laney
<seb128> hey Laney, wie gehts?
<didrocks> hey Laney
<larsu> morning Laney!
<FJKong_> oh
<FJKong_> I see
<FJKong_> it seems we have no other choice then
<seb128> FJKong_, well, as said we could still default to hibernate and fallback in the code to shutdown if hibernate is not available
<seb128> but I'm unsure it's worth the effort
<seb128> if users enable hibernate they can go and change the config
<FJKong_> seb128: how to enable hibernate then
<Laney> hey pitti seb128 didrocks larsu!
<seb128> FJKong_, http://askubuntu.com/questions/94754/how-to-enable-hibernation
<didrocks> and done, large and medium tests \o/
<didrocks> (with fake mozilla certificates and fake server for medium ones)
<seb128> dpm, pitti, so ubunut-system-settings has langpack support enabled, but we should strip the .desktop (since some code on touch isn't smart enough to use gettext and try to read the Name .ini style), what's the easiest way to do that? use --exclude on the file in dh_translations?
<dpm> morning seb128, I think I'll have to defer that one to pitti
<pitti> seb128: you mean should *not* strip the desktop?
<Laney> which code is that?
<Laney> wouldn't you want to do this for every application then?
<pitti> seb128: dh_translations does look at -X, so that ought to work
<pitti> seb128: that will still add X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain:, but keep the inline translations
<seb128> pitti, yeah, sorry :-/ *shouldn't*
<FJKong_> seb128: well, if we have a quick fix this version and put more time on it later, it that okay? I don't think most of user will enable hibernate after installing
<pitti> seb128: ah no, it will *not* add the domain
<pitti> seb128: so yes, -X
<seb128> pitti, no domain is fine, it means thing just use the inline translations
<seb128> FJKong_, yeah
<seb128> Laney, wdym for every application?
<seb128> Laney, most applications on touch are click and that doesn't use langpack
<seb128> other debs seem to not strip their .desktop already
<FJKong_> seb128: cool
<Laney> maybe now they are, haven't looked at that
<Laney> but one day you will be able to install deb packages
<seb128> Laney, the code is notifications/notification_manager.cpp
<seb128> Laney, that code is not ready to support debs, it's calling "click list" to get the entries
<Laney> then what are you fixing in a deb package?
<seb128> I probably don't understand the code
<seb128> let me look at it more
<seb128> but settings is listed unstranslated in that panel
<seb128> and added a Name[fr]= to the .desktop fixes it
<seb128> adding
<willcooke> trains.  :(
<willcooke> morning all
<didrocks> argh, another gnome-terminal segfault while doing a sbuild :/
<didrocks> let's see once whoopsie would retrace it for me
<larsu> willcooke: in brussels again?
 * didrocks restarts the build and ubuntu make tests meanwhileâ¦
<didrocks> larsu: seeing "trainsâ¦", definitively brussels and not London for sure :)
<willcooke> larsu, I think it would have been quicker to go to Brussels
<willcooke> They said the trains were delayed by 16 mins.
<willcooke> lies
<willcooke> damn lies
<didrocks> ahah, it's starting to be a trend it seems (train starting earlier than what they announce)
<mlankhorst> in holland I don't have to worry about that :P
<ogra_> because you can walk across the country in 1h :)
<mlankhorst> hah you wish
<mlankhorst> we do have a database of all windmills though :P
<ogra_> lol
<willcooke> And when global warming kicks off in a big way Holland will be nice and cool, because of all the windmills
<larsu> will also be under water...
<willcooke> (favourite Futurama spot ever)
<willcooke> http://www.quickmeme.com/img/e8/e8612be4060eee520cad620292dfc484f2a2f64568a3942ec0bcddb767023e9d.jpg
<mlankhorst> it will be nice and cool because the gulf stream will have collapsed and we will get the climate of new york :p
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, re your gnome-terminal crash - don't you use tmux so that you don't have to restart the build?
<mlankhorst> I've rebased Xmir on top of xorg-server 1.17.1
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: yeah, I'll soon start doing this I guess :)
<mlankhorst> and I've uploaded to my ppa the qtmir version that broke autorepeat but fixed mouse events in unity8
<willcooke> I assume phablet-shell is part of the sdk ppa
<popey> willcooke: phablet-tools package
<willcooke> hrm
<willcooke> I have that install but no phablet-shell
<popey> apt-cache policy phablet-tools
<popey>   Installed: 1.1+15.04.20141107.1-0ubuntu1
<popey> ?
<popey> I am on vivid
<popey> you may need one of the sdk PPAs
<willcooke> ack, thanks popey
<pitti> seb128: btw, you have the shutdown hang, don't you?
<pitti> seb128: I noticed that unattended-upgrades delays shutdown a lot
<pitti> seb128: that might be another candidate for you?
<willcooke> ahh, I remember - I had to purge it to get Snappy to play nice
<pitti> didrocks: ^ you also reported some shutdown hangs; so modemmanager and unattended-upgrades might be things to try and disable
<didrocks> pitti: nice hint, will give it a try later
<willcooke> team - remember to get your self assessment done by Friday EOD
<willcooke> and let me know your 360 peers asap
<willcooke> this message will repeat
<darkxst> willcooke, has turned into a bot ?
<Laney> darkxst: think I've fixed those totem problems ("fixed" in one case :|)
<Laney> did you fwd your headerbar patch?
<willcooke> darkxst, I was always pretty close tbh :)
<darkxst> Laney, bookmarks problem?
<Laney> ya
<Laney> bug in the grilo plugin itself I think
<darkxst> Laney, not forwarded upstream yet, but will once I fix full screen issue
<Laney> did that
<darkxst> Laney, yeh I saw that commit after you mentioned it (way after I was sleep last night)
<Laney> http://paste.ubuntu.com/10172243/
<darkxst> Laney, Ack
<darkxst> and I really need to go to sleep
<darkxst> can you upload fix to gnome3 ppa or somewhere
<Laney> ya
<Laney> I'm going to fwd the dialogs-use-header stuff
<darkxst> Laney, we will eventually get packaging branches setup on alioth, but that hasnt quite happend just yet
<Laney> for what?
<darkxst> Laney, stuff in the gnome3 ppa's
<Laney> oh right
<darkxst> and perhaps some of the main branches in ubuntu GNOME packageset
<Laney> thought you'd branch off the ubuntu-desktop packages
<darkxst> Laney, we do where applicable
<darkxst> but i still don't like bzr
<darkxst> and pkg-gnome may one day move to git
<Laney> just you wait for git in launchpad
 * larsu waits
<Laney> i'll figure out a cool merged-with-upstreams-history workflow
<darkxst> but in the meantime we are ok to host UG git repos on alioth
<Laney> doesn't really matter where they are i suppose
<darkxst> Laney, nope, majority of ubuntu sponsors would probably have commit access there I suppose
<Laney> there's an 'ubuntu-dev' group there already
<Laney> manually managed tho
 * darkxst sleeps now
<Laney> night!
<darkxst> night
<didrocks> seb128: FYI, g-c-c for bluez5 now built in ppa. That should unblock you if you want to update (didn't retest yet with latest g-c-c)
<didrocks> larsu: that can interest you as well ^
<darkxst> didrocks, gnome-shell also has patches that need to be dropped for bluez5
<darkxst> (reverts)
<darkxst> but I am really sleep now
<nessita> hello! quick question, I updated my vivid install yesterday to latest, and since then some fonts are not properly rendered (yesterday Firefox was having the issue, today is evince), and I no longer can open a terminal with ctrl + alt + t. Any idea how to fix or where to ask?
<larsu> didrocks: which ppa?
<larsu> didrocks: and thanks :)
<didrocks> darkxst: if the gnome ubuntu team can provide a debdiff, we can send that to the same ppa and do the same copy on the D day (you have time still)
<didrocks> larsu: the transition one (see email): https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ubuntu/transitions
<larsu> didrocks: cool,thanks
<didrocks> yw!
 * larsu wanted to start hacking on that today, but too much to do
<darkxst> didrocks, ok, tomorrow then
<larsu> DS-McGuire: got some time to talk in ~15 mins?
<DS-McGuire> larsu, I do :)
<didrocks> darkxst: core-devs have access to dput directly to the ppa FYI
<darkxst> didrocks, me no core-dev
<didrocks> just propose a debdiff when you have time (the best would be this week)
<darkxst> didrocks, ok, will take a look tomorrow
<darkxst> probably gnome-shell, g-s-d and g-c-c all have reverts currently to work with bluez4
 * darkxst really sleeps now!
<willcooke> mlankhorst, should Xmir work with the devel channel?
<didrocks> darkxst: g-c-c is done, g-s-d has nothing to be done, g-s left to you, good night man :)
<darkxst> didrocks, ok, night
<mlankhorst> willcooke: ought to :P
<mlankhorst> I've just uploaded a rebuild against 1.17.1, haven't tested it yet
<willcooke> thanks mlankhorst
<willcooke> Just reflashing
<mlankhorst> oke
<nessita> willcooke, hi! which one would be the best channel to ask about issues with a vivid installation in a laptop?
<willcooke> nessita, #ubuntu will sort you out
<nessita> I see broken fotns such as https://drive.google.com/a/canonical.com/file/d/0B-cmfDncRJmYRnJ0SUhWWGsyVjQ/view?usp=sharing
<nessita> willcooke, thanks, going there
<willcooke> nessita, ahhh
<willcooke> seb128, didn't you see that as well (see link ^^)
<nessita> willcooke, ctrl + alt + t will not open a terminal either, since yesterday's updates
<mlankhorst> hm /me upgrades his phone too
<willcooke> Hrm.  Video drivers, or perhaps Gtk
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<seb128> nessita, willcooke, yeah, I see similar fonts corruption sometime, I blame xorg but I'm unsure
<nessita> hola seb128 !
<seb128> mlankhorst, any idea what could lead to corruption like the one nessita has in the url she just shared
<seb128> nessita, yeah, nice to see you still around! how are you?
<nessita> seb128, super good. How about you?
<nessita> seb128, mlankhorst font corruption was isolated to firefox yesterday, today seems to happen with evince. I installed all vivid updates yesterday
<seb128> pitti, unattended-upgrade is enabled & inactive, I can try to disable it
<seb128> nessita, does it persist after xorg restart?
<mlankhorst> no idea..
<seb128> nessita, I'm great, thanks :-)
<mlankhorst> never seen that tbh
<nessita> seb128, it persistes yesterday for FF after computer restart, haven't tried today, let me do that
<seb128> nessita, k, the issue I sometime have doesn't persist after xorg restart
<seb128> so likely different
<nessita> seb128, restarted, pdf still looks corrupted
<nessita> trying another pdf
<seb128> nessita, yeah, could be that it's picking a wrong font as well
<seb128> nessita, did you install new fonts recently?
<nessita> seb128, seems the case (not picking the right font). No, I don't recall ever installing new fonts explicitely.
<seb128> nessita, can you grep for font in /var/log/dpkg.log ?
<nessita> yes
<nessita> seb128, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10172824/
<nessita> more results than I expected!
<seb128> nessita, hum, I'm unsure
<seb128> in evince, can you go to files->properties-> fonts tab
<seb128> what fonts does it list there?
<seb128> then maybe email me a pdf which shows the issue so we can compare what is used?
<nessita> ack, on it
<nessita> seb128, sent
<seb128> nessita, that pdf renders buggy for me as well, it's specific to this file right?
<nessita> yeah
<nessita> so the pdf itself is not important
<nessita> but yesterday firefox (and the terminal for a bit) we broken as well
<nessita> we can leave this as is, and I can let you guys know if something else breaks font-wise
<seb128> nessita, do you still have the other issues after a restart?
<nessita> seb128, nopes
<seb128> nessita, btw firefox has the same problem rendering that pdf, wonder if the file is buggy
<nessita> can be, is an old pdf
<seb128> nessita, k, so the firefox&co issue was probably the corruption I see sometime
<seb128> the pdf issue is different
<nessita> makes sense
<seb128> nessita, I tried different viewers on my android phone, they have the same issue on the pdf, so I think we can say it's an issue with the file in that case
<nessita> seb128, sounds good!
<nessita> the pdf is not important
<willcooke> willcooke, test
<willcooke> wifi. sigh
<seb128> willcooke, you are at the office?
<willcooke> yeah
<seb128> nessita, your issue could be https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/1330385 ... you can maybe look in your log if there are such GPU error mentioned
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1330385 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) "Intel GPU crash corrupts fonts" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<nessita> seb128, checking!
<nessita> I certainly have an intel video card
<willcooke> attente_, can you remind me who you are syncing with on input methods from the Mir team?
<nessita> seb128, I can find the crash in my syslogs, but I will be paying more attention for future freezes/font corruptions
<attente_> willcooke: no one on the mir team
<willcooke> attente_, U8?
<seb128> nessita, can or can't?
<seb128> nessita, ok
<nessita> seb128, sorry, can't :-D
<seb128> nessita, k
<nessita> still morning to me!
<attente_> willcooke: just bschaefer so far
<willcooke> attente_, thanks!
<willcooke> attente_, good morning btw :)
<attente_> thanks!
<FJKong_> attente_: morning Hua
<attente_> FJKong_: good evening :)
 * mlankhorst reflashes phone
<larsu> attente_, desrt: does gtk-mir ever draw decorations on behalf of the app?
<larsu> greyback is seeing that apparently
<desrt> yes.  it does.
<greyback> desrt: any easy way I could disable that temporarily?
<desrt> GTK_CSD=0 or something?
 * larsu was totally unawware
<larsu> greyback: sorry :/
<greyback> larsu: no worries
<desrt> actually, i think that won't help
<greyback> no good
<desrt> GTK_CSD=1 is only useful for forcing it to be enabled
<desrt> GTK_CSD=0 is equivalent to being unset
<greyback> eee, 0 != undefined
<desrt> greyback: for mir it's hardwired to on
<larsu> what is this, javascript?!
<desrt>   if (GDK_IS_MIR_DISPLAY (gtk_widget_get_display (GTK_WIDGET (window))))
<desrt>     return TRUE;
<desrt> #endif
<desrt> gtk_window_should_use_csd (GtkWindow *window)
<greyback> desrt: thanks, gives me place to hack at
<desrt> i'm disconnecting from IRC for now.  too many pings and i need to sort through a bunch of reviews and other stuff.  bbl.
<willcooke_> desrt, ping
<willcooke_> I crack myself up - I really do.
<willcooke_> and it's not even Friday
<mlankhorst> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfVsfOSbJY0
<Laney> bah
<Laney> suspend failure, burny laptop
 * Laney stares at systemd
<Laney> how can I view the journal from the previous boot?
<Laney> --list-boots only shows this one
<seb128> Laney, see the README.Debian, you need to create the dir to enable persistent
<seb128> not sure why that's not done by default
<seb128> but maybe pitti or didrocks know
<Laney> hmm
<pitti> seb128: because we install rsyslog by default, and I don't think we want to write everything to disk twice
<Laney> oh so it's in the syslog maybe
<seb128> pitti, ok, makes sense
<Laney> Feb 11 12:46:43 iota systemd-sleep[31629]: System resumed.
<Laney> looks like it does some suspend things then does some resume things straight away
<pitti> Laney: is that with upstart or systemd? with upstart you might have a /var/log/pm-suspend.log
<Laney> pitti: systemd, I did the perma-switch last week
<pitti> hm, any kernel error message to go with that?
<Laney> sec, let me just pastebin the whole area
<sneezewort> Hello all. I left my system locked last night. When I came in this morning my system appeared as if it had rebooted, but when I run "who -b" it says last boot time was several days ago.
<sneezewort> How do I troubleshoot my lost session?
<sneezewort> In other words how can I figure out what happened, and how to keep it from happening again.
<Laney> pitti: http://paste.ubuntu.com/10174186/
<Laney> I wonder what the 2 minute gap is
<Laney> ah hang on, I did resume it
<pitti> Laney: I don't see a gap there
<pitti> just that there is pretty much zero time after suspend before resume
<pitti> Laney: is that reproducible, or only happened once?
<pitti> I don't think there's an inhibitor, otherwise you wouldn't have gotten that ar
<Laney> I did suspend, resume, <read a couple of emails>, suspend
<pitti> far
<Laney> yesterday I had to reboot because of a resume failure but it could have been the same thing
<Laney> lemme just try suspend/resuming a few times now
<pitti> oh, there I see the gap, sorry
<pitti> I figure you cut away the resume part from that?
<mzanetti> seb128: hey, did you push the workaround for bluez4 somewhere?
<seb128> mzanetti, hey, no, but you can edit /usr/share/ubuntu/settings/system/qml-plugins/bluetooth/DisplayPasskeyDialog.qml l39
<seb128> mzanetti, remove the .slice(entered)
<mzanetti> seb128: ack
<seb128> mzanetti, I can push that somewhere if you want, didn't do the fix I mentioned the other day yet but I can try to do that today or tomorrow
<seb128> (the "if "entered" > 6, then ignore it)
<mlankhorst> meh no luck now..
<mlankhorst> [   17.215852] init: apport-noui (/var/crash/_usr_bin_unity-system-compositor-spinner.0.crash) main process (2001) terminated with status 1
<willcooke_> sneezewort, you'll likely have better luck in the #ubuntu channel
<mzanetti> seb128: no worries, I'm just currently checking status on silo0 to see what's missing, and that one popped up.
<sneezewort> willcooke_, OK thanks.
<Laney> took 6 or 7 goes but I got a failure
<pitti> Laney: i. e. it immediately resumed again? either way, that sounds like a "fun" kernel bug to track down :(
<pitti> Laney: if you never had this before, I suggest trying some earlier kernels, perhaps utopic's?
<Laney> pitti: you get a black screen
<Laney> yeah, good plan
<pitti> Laney: another thing to try would be to run pm-suspend and see if you can reproduce it with that
<pitti> Laney: on any graphics card that supports KMS and reasonably modern nvidia cards (with the proprietary driver) the pm-utils quirks shouldn't be necessary any more, but maybe some are still applied on your system which help
<Laney> pitti: I'll try tomorrow, need to patch pilot now
<pitti> Laney: ah, safe flying!
<pitti> Laney: ack, we can then check which quirks pm-utils actually applies, etc.
<Laney> bah
<Laney> some network related lock up too
<Laney> bad day for laney
<Laney> mlankhorst: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mesa/+bug/1420294 for you
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1420294 in mesa (Ubuntu) "Update Mesa Mir EGL platform for Mir 0.11" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> cyphermox, hey, do you where in the code you toggle on/off discoverability of bt?
<cyphermox> yes, that's in plugins/bluetooth/devicemodel.cpp
<didrocks> happyaron: fcitx MIR approved now, thanks!
<cyphermox> in the init functions as soon as you know there is an adapter to do this on
<didrocks> happyaron: see my comment on how we are going to promote things in main, are you going to seed it directly or having a dep/recommends?
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks
<willcooke_> didrocks, happyaron - great work guys, thanks
<didrocks> seems that vivid will get fcitx in main :)
<attente_> willcooke_, didrocks: should i start merging those old branches for u-c-c, u-s-d, indicator-keyboard for fcitx support?
<didrocks> attente_: did you try against latest fctix (it doesn't seem to have changed much)? is the support complete? Meaning we have the ibus vs fcitx switch? (I didn't follow the end of that discussion, probably seb128 is more up to date on this)
<attente_> didrocks: i'll try it again, but last i remember they were just waiting on the MIR
<didrocks> better to triple check, but if so, all good, then we can push them and promote things as needed :)
<attente_> ok, thanks, really hope they're still ok...
<willcooke_> does anyone else find setting the input focus in gnome-calculator to be a bit tricky?
<willcooke_> I get the caret when I move the mouse over the numbers field
<willcooke_> but when I click it doesnt get the focus unless the mouse is, seemingly above half way
<willcooke_> I think that line underneath where you put the numbers, where it might say, for example, "Division by zero is undefined"
<willcooke_> is what I'm actually clicking on
<willcooke_> but it might be nice if clicking there focused the numbers input area instead?
<willcooke_> or not show the caret until I'm over the numbers
<larsu> willcooke_: how do you get that field to lose focus?
<larsu> seems to always have focus for me
<didrocks> larsu: I'm desperatly trying to have it losing focus as well :)
<willcooke_> larsu, I can use the drop downs for converting between things
<larsu> ah
<larsu> yeah this is weird
<willcooke_> in advanced mode that is
<larsu> it's because you can select the "error" text
<willcooke_> I can see that selecting the text in there might be useful
<willcooke_> but not very often
<larsu> hence you also get a caret cursor
<willcooke_> yeah, makes sense
<willcooke_> it just rubs me up the wrong way for some reason
<willcooke_> :)
<larsu> mpt is a big proponent of that, because you want to allow users to copy/paste error messages for questions
<willcooke_> sure
<larsu> it looks like the same widget though
<larsu> maybe we can trick it to focus the right thing on click
<larsu> but keep the same behavior when selecting...
 * didrocks can't use gnome-calculator anyway, it's not a RPN calc and so, breaks my mindâ¦ :)
<larsu> oh really?
<larsu> kewl
 * larsu uses python3
<didrocks> larsu: years of using HP48, there is no going back in your mental model :)
<larsu> never did use that
<willcooke_> I would argue that when it loses focus and regains it the input field should be selected by default
<larsu> but I can imagine
<didrocks> willcooke_: agreed, maybe something to discuss with robert as he's upstream?
<willcooke_> sure, just venting my very minor annoyances
<willcooke_> :)
<willcooke_> I feel better now
<didrocks> ahah
<willcooke_> ah
<willcooke_> in basic mode
<didrocks> larsu: it was always fun to lend the calc to someone else and see them being very puzzled :)
 * didrocks waves good evening and good night
<Noskcaj> Laney, Is there anything i can do to speed up the gtk3.16 work? I noticed the PPA versions are lightly behind gnome upstream
<Noskcaj> Also, should we try and fit clutter-gst-3.0 in before FF?
<mterry> seb128, hello!  Is there a wiki page about running the u8 preview image?
<mterry> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity8Desktop
<mlankhorst> Laney: already done :P
<mlankhorst> Laney: but it FTBFS
<mlankhorst> forgot to re-upload the build fix with -v, so it didn't close the bugs
<robert_ancell> infinity, I'm trying to remove an archive block (bug 958345) by following the procedure suggested when I try to upload. Is that on the radar for ~ubuntu-archive?
<ubot5> bug 958345 in ttf-indic-fonts (Ubuntu) "ttf-indic-fonts packages are outdated" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/958345
<desrt> reminder: new launch attempt in ~40 mins
<robert_ancell> desrt, watcha launching?
<larsu> robert_ancell: a rocket
<robert_ancell> larsu, at new zealand?
 * robert_ancell ducks
<ochosi> larsu: oh wow, you're around at this hour...
<desrt> robert_ancell: http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/
<desrt> an interesting launch for two reasons
<desrt> one: it's the first time we send something to orbit L1
<desrt> two: it's another attempt for space X to play xlander
<robert_ancell> oh, fun
<sarnold> I thought I heard they cancelled the landing due to weather concerns
<desrt> that was yesterday
<desrt> today is their retry
<desrt> and the winds are nice and calm....
<sarnold> I think it's the ten-meter waves at the landing location that caused them to scrub the landing
<desrt> i understood it was the 100km/h+ winds in the upper atmosphere
<sarnold> https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/565636516551352321
<desrt> oh!
<desrt> :(
<desrt> no xlander today, i guess
<desrt> i thought you were talking about yesterday's scrub
<desrt> which was also due to weather...
<robert_ancell> flash crashed one second before launch
<desrt> perfect
<desrt> fortunately the rocket did not do the same
<larsu> ochosi: hacker schedule
<ochosi> :)
<larsu> robert_ancell: hopefully not :D
<ochosi> larsu: hmm, so what are your thoughts on a possible gtk3.16 transition? i thought you just finished fixing up gtk3.14..?
<larsu> ochosi: I was in the room when we had the idea...
<larsu> 3.16 was pretty calm
<ochosi> what, no theme breakage?
<desrt> stage1 just got cut loose
<larsu> only notify-osd so far
 * ochosi is semi-disappointed
<larsu> and a few other issues (resizing problems in terminal for example)
<ochosi> but the 3.16 cycle is not done yet
 * larsu has been running it for a week and it works great
<larsu> better inspector, too
<ochosi> hmm
<larsu> ochosi: I know, but I also know that probably not many more changes are coming
<ochosi> i guess i need to look into it
<larsu> it's in the desktop team ppa
<ochosi> well, i'm always a bit hesitative about gtk3 upgrades tbh :)
<larsu> <gnome-hat>we're getting better!</gnome-hat>
<ochosi> hehe
<ochosi> well, that is good to hear
<ochosi> both, that you're getting better and that you're wearing a gnome hat now
<larsu> usually I don't wear it in this channel
<ochosi> well, good though if there are upstream connections
<ochosi> less surprises
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-02-12
<infinity> robert_ancell: Have you sorted a sane way forward for the indic font mess?  If so, enlighten me and then, sure, we can remove the sync block if that's the right thing to do.
<darkxst> robert_ancell, can you copy https://launchpad.net/~darkxst/+archive/ubuntu/bluez5/+packages to the bluez transition ppa?
<robert_ancell> infinity, I haven't been able to work out why the block is there. So my current assumption is "we should just match Debian".
<robert_ancell> infinity, any more background info very welcome
<infinity> # cjwatson, 2012-06-01
<infinity> # Temporary blacklist entries for quantal, requiring manual resolution due
<infinity> # to conflicts with existing Ubuntu-versioned binaries.
<infinity> robert_ancell: ^-- So, this is probably no longer true, or likely not, but I can't investigate right this instant either.
<robert_ancell> infinity, that's fine. I just wanted to check that you guys are aware of the bug and/or find alternative means to find the right person to lift it
<robert_ancell> darkxst, I'm trying to find the PPA link - do you have it?
<darkxst> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ubuntu/transitions
<robert_ancell> darkxst, ta
<robert_ancell> darkxst, do they need rebuilding?
<darkxst> robert_ancell, no, binary copy should be fine
<robert_ancell> darkxst, done
<darkxst> thanks
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey pitti
<pitti> bonjour seb128 !
<pitti> I'm finally making some progress on finding out why people's fstab mounts get unmounted during boot
<happyaron> pitti, seb128, morning, :)
<seb128> hey happyaron
<pitti> hey happyaron, good day!
<seb128> pitti, oh, why is that?
<pitti> seb128: do you get that as well?
<pitti> bug 1419623
<seb128> no
<ubot5> bug 1419623 in systemd (Ubuntu) "systemd unmounts partitions from fstab" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1419623
<seb128> but I don't have partitions mounted at boot
<seb128> only a /
<pitti> ah, I have /home and /srv in fstab
<pitti> and /boot/efi/
<pitti> seb128: it could still be a red herring, but so far my theory is that cgmanager does some mounts/unmounts/remounts which cause that; it remounts MS_SLAVE, not MS_RSLAVE
<pitti> (testing that now)
<pitti> but that doesn't yet explain the full story
<darkxst> pitti, still planing on switching to systemd init this cycle?
<pitti> darkxst: I was quite hopeful, but NFS, maas, and juju drag on.. :/
<darkxst> why is nfs a problem? surely upstream have that also?
<pitti> darkxst: upstream does have systemd units, yes; but our package only has an upstart job, so it doesn't work under systemd
<pitti> darkxst: slangasek wanted to look into that this week though
<darkxst> pitti, ok, I was thinking of switch Ubuntu GNOME, but then two critical bugs in a week ;(
<pitti> darkxst: oh, what's the other one?
<darkxst> pitti, ifup service hang,
<darkxst> guess that is fixed now?
<pitti> darkxst: ah, yes
<pitti> darkxst: see bug 1417010, both sysvinit and systemd are in vivid
<ubot5> bug 1417010 in sysvinit (Debian) "Reloading services can result in a deadlock under systemd" [Unknown,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1417010
<darkxst> pitti, I have missed that janitor comments, but certainly saw the fix-commited's
<seb128> hum
<seb128> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-desktop/2015-February/004636.html
<seb128> why is the sync bug #1420948 reaching the list?
<ubot5> bug 1420948 in appstream-glib (Ubuntu) "Sync appstream-glib 0.3.4-1 (universe) from Debian experimental (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1420948
<seb128> "You received this bug notification because you are a member of GNOME3
<seb128> Team, which is subscribed to appstream-glib in Ubuntu."
<seb128> darkxst: did you guys add the desktop list as contact info for your team or what?
<darkxst> seb128, we use gnome3-team for that
<seb128> or is that because there is no list associated to the team?
<seb128> darkxst, https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+mailinglist
<seb128> hum, I don't understand
<darkxst> seb128, I don't know why that would go to desktop list
<seb128> let me ask on #launchpad
<darkxst> seb128, I also don't know why Noskcaj even filed that bug ;(
<darkxst> it needs fixes for MIR, that should be forwarded to debian before sync
<Noskcaj> darkxst, But it helps to get the newer version, doesn't it?
<didrocks> morning
<larsu> hi didrocks!
 * didrocks spent 20 minutes in rebooting and being puzzled
<didrocks> hey larsu!
<darkxst> Noskcaj, it doesnt help the MIR
<darkxst> Noskcaj, fix those, forward to debian and propose an ubuntu package in the mean time?
<Noskcaj> no, of course not. ximion hasn't been online in the last 2 days, but he's normally pretty active
<darkxst> Noskcaj, I really don't see any reason they wouldnt take the changes
<darkxst> debian is normally more pedantic about copyright than us
<darkxst> useless build-deps and disabled but working tests seem to be a no brainer
<darkxst> Noskcaj, that said, may need https://github.com/hughsie/appstream-glib/commit/8fea9d934fbfffbead04a1a6ec9e4344725af188
<darkxst> for tests
<seb128> darkxst, Noskcaj, can you put the gnome3 list as contact address on https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+contactaddress ?
<seb128> without that each member get emailed on any bug subscription
<seb128> which includes the desktop list through ubuntu-desktop being a member
<darkxst> seb128, sure no problem
<seb128> thanks
<darkxst> never even realised it worked (or didn't) like that
<happyaron> didrocks: I'm preparing patch for seeding fcitx, but in doubt whether I should remove ibus at the same time
<happyaron> some follow up patches are needed to switch the default
<didrocks> happyaron: I didn't follow the discussions about what would be done in the end (switch or supporting both), I suggest you discuss it with attente_ and seb128?
<happyaron> sure
<didrocks> pitti: seems Lennart stopped just before my fsck patch if my email history is right :p
<darkxst> Noskcaj, seems you have to subscribe yourself for new gnome3-team ML
<Noskcaj> ok, will do
<darkxst> thanks
<pitti> didrocks: heh, yes; talked to him yesterday, and at the moment patches come in faster than he can keep up with; I'll ping him today to ask who would be appropriate to review/commit them (given that it already went through several rounds)
<pitti> didrocks: now that I found out what breaks our mounts at boot (see #u-devel), I can think about other problems again :)
<didrocks> pitti: sounds good, thanks!
<didrocks> pitti: oh, nice! backloging :)
 * didrocks answers to slangasek on CI Train and rewrite some wiki pages meanwhile
<didrocks> digging into my old code :p
<willcooke> morning
<willcooke> hrm - no clock
 * willcooke restarts panel service
<willcooke> haz clock
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<willcooke> morning didrocks
<willcooke> ohhh
<seb128> good morning willcooke
<willcooke> hi seb128
<Laney> hey
<Laney> had to restart network-manager to get my network to work just now
<Laney> :(
<Laney> could be ofono still I guess, didn't kill that
<seb128> hey Laney
<seb128> what was it doing?
<seb128> connected by no data going through?
<Laney> 16 packets transmitted, 0 received, 100% packet loss, time 15000ms
<Laney> I ctrl-ced it after exactly 15000ms, how cool is that
<Noskcaj> darkxst, Excluding copyright fixes, lp:~noskcaj/ubuntu/vivid/appstream-glib/mir-fixes should be ready
<Noskcaj> I'm signing off for the night, if it's all good, please propose the merge
<darkxst> Noskcaj, needs copyrights also
<Laney> you should get ximion to fix this
<Laney> or upload your fixes then sync :)
<Laney> also something in main could require it, I reverted back to appdata-tools for ... cheese I think
 * xnox Yaaaawh
<seb128> Laney, attente_, don't look at it, but https://appstore.bhdouglass.com/app/uu.mzanetti :-)
<darkxst> Laney, been through that entire conversation with Jackson already
<seb128> the "don't look at it" is for productivity reasons of course ;-)
<Laney> haha
<Laney> I thought someone would do this when they started talking about how easy it would be when we were playing it
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> it's working quite nice, need a few tweaks to be great
<Laney> someone just needs to do space team
<seb128> lol
<seb128> I've the feeling that one wouldn't be as trivial
 * Laney updates to the latest image
<Laney> got to test ... something ...
<seb128> lol
<mzanetti> :D
<Laney> darkxst: do you have a branch for your totem pkg?
<darkxst> Laney, no just whats on gnome3 ppa
<darkxst> but you can upload there right?
<Laney> sure
<Laney> but good history is better if it exists
<darkxst> given ubuntu-desktop is a member of that team
<darkxst> Laney, they guy who was setiing up out packaging branches resigned ;(
<Laney> bzr branch lp:~ubuntu-desktop/totem/ubuntu; hack hack hack; bzr commit; bzr push lp:~gnome3-team/totem/gnome3-staging
<Laney> sorry you lost a volunteer :(
<darkxst> Laney, or just stage it in ubuntu-desktop if you want
<Laney> might do
<Laney> any news on the grilo-plugins split?
<Laney> + mir + whatever
<larsu> Laney: morning. re gnome-screenshot... we can't use libcheese's cheese-flash, because that requires a parent window now (which gnome-screenshot doesn't have in non-interactive mode) and it doesn't support flashing individual windows
<Laney> ah ok
<larsu> however, the only noteworthy changes are getting rid of the set_visual() call
<larsu> and fixing the opacity mess
<darkxst> Laney, didrock was happy with the MIR pending split, seb128 may not be so happy ?
<larsu> by having a priv opacity var and not reading back the opacity from the widget
<larsu> kind of like I did
<larsu> only thing that remains is that weird double flash, which I only see on compiz :/
<darkxst> but I am proposing first group in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/grilo-plugins/+bug/1394731/comments/2
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1394731 in grilo-plugins (Ubuntu) "[MIR] grilo-plugins" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<darkxst> and probably youtube
<seb128> darkxst, I'm fine with whatever others decide, I just would like to have a summary of what it's going to bring on the CD and the installed size impact
<larsu> Laney: and I can't seem to get rid of it unless I don't destroy the flash window, which of course makes it leak
 * larsu is unsure what to do
<darkxst> I think Noskcaj will do the actual packaging
<Laney> darkxst: ok then
<Laney> are the build deps all okay?
<darkxst> Laney, everything is in main except dleyna-server which is a suggests in ubuntu packaging
<Laney> larsu: I think we're probably sticking with 3.14 anyway (per the meeting), so not super important to fix right now
<Laney> but will be needed next cycle
<Laney> darkxst: cool
<darkxst> Laney, 3.14 gtk?
<Laney> ya
<Laney> I'm going to mail the list in a minute
<Laney> after making a totem package ;-)
<larsu> Laney: ok, I'll file an upstream bug for the opacity part and start pestering Trevinho about compiz
<darkxst> Laney, ok
<darkxst> probably easier than fixing all the issues
<Laney> at least we know about them *now* instead of in 2 months
<darkxst> Laney, very much so, I Would be happy with gtk update landing early next cycle
<darkxst> aka faster than this cycle
<Laney> nod
<Laney> how do you unstage something in bzr?
<darkxst> Laney, idk, but suspect you can't once you have push to a public branch
<darkxst> uncommit does work before that though
<Laney> haven't push
<Laney> I just want to undo a bzr add
<darkxst> uncommit then
<Laney> not committed
<darkxst> Laney, I'm no bzr expert, do most things in git
<Laney> bzr rm --keep looks likely
<Laney> (Y)
<happyaron> attente_, seb128: wonders how do we proceed with the input methods..?
<seb128> happyaron, wdym?
<happyaron> seb128: I'm making a mp to seed fcitx, shall I remove ibus at the same time, or have both of them?
<happyaron> ...and, what's your opinion about switch or not (and what time)?
<seb128> happyaron, don't see fcitx
<seb128> seed
<seb128> we don't want to install it by default
<happyaron> why?
<seb128> because we need the support for fcitx to be merged in the indicator and unity-control-center first
<seb128> which didn't happen yet because we needed to build-depends on fcitx to build those
<seb128> which required fcitx MIR to be acked first
<seb128> so next step is to merge those in
<happyaron> ic
<seb128> the new build-depends can be added and are going to led to promotion
<seb128> then we can give a round of testing and see how things work
<seb128> then decide to make fcitx default or not
<seb128> but we probably want it default only for chinese in a first time
<happyaron> ok, great
<happyaron> that would make both ibus and fcitx included in the image
<happyaron> now the only input method in image is ibus-pinyin, which is for Chinese, to replace it we'll pull in fcitx
<darkxst> night all
<seb128> night darkxst
<seb128> ok, I give up on debugging that issue for now
<seb128> Laney, so, the u-s-s notifications, I was wrong, that code uses the gappinfo api to get the name
<Laney> I thought so
<seb128> Laney, that works and displays translated under unity7 and not unity8, on the same machine
<Laney> that works with langpacks already
<Laney> O_O
<seb128> I did go trough /proc/pid/environ
<seb128> no difference I can see
<seb128> I set the same LANG LANGUAGE LC_*
<Laney> do we call setlocale(LC_ALL, "") in u-s-s?
<Laney> surely so because other translations work
<seb128> no, but I tried to add that
<seb128> no difference
<seb128> and the code works under unity7
<Laney> ...
<seb128> why would it be required only under it?
<seb128> in src/i18n.cpp
<seb128> void initTr(const char *domain, const char *localeDir)
<seb128> {
<seb128>     setlocale (LC_ALL, "");
<seb128>     bindtextdomain(domain, localeDir);
<seb128>     textdomain(domain);
<seb128> I added the setlocale line
<seb128> but that doesn't fix it
<seb128> I'm puzzled
<Laney> one second
<seb128> my current guess is that something in e.g qt5's x11 backend does system or locale init in a different way than the mir backend
<seb128> but that's random guess
<Laney> I guess you can gdb and break inside glib to see if these functions are being called
<seb128> yeah, that's what I was planning to do next
<seb128> "these" being?
<Laney> in GKeyFile I think (or GDesktopAppInfo) there's some fallback to use gettext
<seb128> I was going to try to stop on g_app_info_get_display_name() and see what is the locale/domain/etc
<Laney> g_key_file_get_locale_string
<seb128> ok, called on my desktop
<seb128> let's see on unity8
<ochosi> Laney: i just read in the log that there seems to be a tendency against gtk3.16, i presume this is not definitive yet? also, a bit surprised, since the call for testing only went out yesterday
<Laney> ochosi: I sent it last Friday no?
<ochosi> oh
<Laney> The call for testing was just that though
<Laney> it showed more issues up ...
<ochosi> tbh it only reached me indirectly, guess there are more MLs i have to subscribe to
<Laney> so it did its job as far as I'm concerned
<ochosi> ok
<Laney> ah yes, this kind of stuff I usually send to ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com
<ochosi> yeah, i was away over the weekend until yesterday, so i only heard about it yesterday
<ochosi> that might explain the lag
<ochosi> will the definitive decision be announced on that ML too?
<Laney> yeah I'll follow up soon
<ochosi> ok, ty!
 * larsu hopes for the best
<ochosi> same here
<willcooke> bah.  Upgraded phone to latest devel - wont boot.
<Laney> woah
<Laney> started sbuild, lightdm died
<Laney> what is going on :(
<Laney> "Waiting for network configuration..."
<Laney> kernel
<Laney> didrocks: was using -13 (moving from other channel)
<Laney> is there a 14 now?
<didrocks> Laney: ok, so -12 was working for me, I didn't try yet -14 (upgraded today, but didn't reboot)
<Laney> 12 is okay, that's what I went back to
 * Laney tries dist-upgrade
<Laney> didrocks: ah, -13.14 seems to work
<didrocks> Laney: nice, I'll reboot later today and confirm
<nessita> seb128, hello! me again. Would you know why meld (http://meldmerge.org/), since the upgrade to vivid, shows its background in black instead of white? see https://drive.google.com/a/canonical.com/file/d/0B-cmfDncRJmYRFZSdDJuMjRoZVE/view?usp=sharing
<nessita> shall I file a bug?
<Laney> nessita: yes, (meld + ubuntu-themes)
<Laney> larsu usually fixes those, I guess he's subscribed to ubuntu-themes so will see it
<nessita> on it
<larsu> nessita: I might not be, please add me as subscriber
<nessita> larsu, kk, thanks
<Laney> nessita: I can't reproduce it myself though so please include steps
<nessita> Laney, tricky, I just opened meld and the background was black. I have a vivid system upgraded from utopic.
<Laney> me too
<Laney> but it looks normal here
<didrocks> willcooke: told you aquarius would be happy: https://plus.google.com/+StuartLangridge/posts/9fe7W2ijNhJ
<larsu> Laney, nessita: overlay-scrollbars?
<nessita> Laney, is ubuntu-themes a package I should have installed?
<larsu> yes
<Laney> light-themes
<larsu> oops, I always confuse the package and launchpad name
<nessita> light-themes: Installed: 14.04+15.04.20150128-0ubuntu2
<Laney> ya, I have o-s
<nessita> ok, filling the bug
<nessita> Laney, what is o-s?
<Laney> overlay-scrollbar-gtk3
<Laney> i.e. if you do GTK_MODULES= meld ... is it right?
<nessita> let me check
<nessita> Laney, GTK_MODULES= meld still shows a black background
<Laney> hmm
<nessita> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/meld/+bug/1421180
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1421180 in meld (Ubuntu) "Meld shows background in black instead of white" [Undecided,New]
<nessita> Laney, shall I mark it as also affecting ubuntu-themes then?
<Laney> yes please
<nessita> done
 * larsu is having trouble reproducing
<willcooke> didrocks,  yay!
<Laney> ah
<Laney> we need to theme the "osd" class for totem's new controls
<Laney> looks nice under adwaita, ambiance not so atm ...
<larsu> we're not doing that yet?
 * larsu thought he saw some .osd in there
<Laney> I don't think so, certainly doesn't look like it
<Laney> (transparent)
<Laney> larsu: seb128: darkxst: others: I uploaded a totem 3.14 to ppa:ubuntu-desktop/ppa, please try when it's built
<Laney> (should be able to see the osd issue then)
<larsu> will do, thanks
<nessita> larsu, so about the black meld issue, I tried purging it from the system and re-installing, and I still get the same issue. Is there other package that I should have installed that could help workarounding/fixing the issue?
<larsu> nessita: I don't think so. Does it happen with other themes as well?
<seb128> Laney, k
<nessita> larsu, let me check if I have other themes
<nessita> larsu, tried radiance and high contrast, same issue in bpth
<nessita> both*
<nessita> also, I may add to the bug, every time I hit "alt + tab" there is a glitch in the meld window because the files being merged are somehow set (super quickly) to None and then to the original file again. May record a video to be more explicit
<larsu> nessita: I've noticed this. probably a bug in meld
<larsu> nessita: and you're still seeing this even with overlay-scrollbars off?
<seb128> nessita, I can't confirm that one either
<seb128> seems a duplicate of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/meld/+bug/1404720
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1404720 in meld (Ubuntu) "comparison view has unreadably dark background" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> yeah he doesn't have o-s in that screenshot
<nessita> larsu, how can I set overlay-scrollbars off?
<larsu> nessita: start meld with `GTK_MODULES= meld`
<nessita> ah, yeah, I tried that, same black background
<seb128> nessita, what desktop env do you use?
<nessita> seb128, unity
<seb128> nessita, dpkg -l | grep libgtk-3-0
<nessita> all default settings except the task switcher, which I use the one that does not group windows
<nessita> ii  libgtk-3-0:amd64                                     3.14.8-0ubuntu1                            amd64        GTK+ graphical user interface library
<seb128> hum, k
<nessita> happy to keep debugging, jut throw commands at me :-D
<nessita> I use meld a lot, so this is important to me
<nessita> (and the black background makes it very hard to read)
<larsu> nessita: ok, let's get out the good stuff. Install libgtk-3-dev, restart meld, put the cursor over one of the panes and hit Ctrl+Shift+I
<larsu> gtk inspector should pop up
<nessita> larsu, on it
<larsu> and on the left side, a "MeldSourceView" should be selected
<seb128> nessita, when did the issue start?
<seb128> nessita, can you try to apply https://git.gnome.org/browse/meld/commit/?h=meld-3-12&id=281583a05117b9d05acb010c98adfebfeb27f70c
<nessita> seb128, I know I said I use meld a lot, and I do, but because some specific work assignment I did not work on code for several days, and I just restarted (fun) work today, so I noticed it today
<seb128> you use(d) KDE so could be ^
<nessita> seb128, but I haven't opened meld since I moved to vivid, so any time after that
<seb128> larsu, ^
<larsu> seb128: I'm using it constantly as well, never saw this issue
<seb128> larsu, KDE?
<larsu> meld :)
<nessita> larsu, so on the left side, in the Objects tab, I see GtkSettings, meld+meldapp+MeldApp, GtkAboutDialog, GtkApplicationWIndows, and 3 GtkFileChooserDialog
<nessita> larsu, not sure where to fing MeldSourceView
<tjaalton> ooh, that meld bug.. yes it's black for me too
<larsu> nessita: you need to select the MeldSourceView, either by drilling down or by clicking on the selector button in the toolbar
<larsu> nessita: and then clicking on the widget
<seb128> nessita, can you share your .config/gtk-3.0/Settings.ini if you have one?
<seb128> tjaalton, ^
<tjaalton> not found
<nessita> nessita@miro:~$ cat .config/gtk-3.0/Settings.ini
<nessita> cat: .config/gtk-3.0/Settings.ini: No such file or directory
<nessita> seb128, I only have .config/gtk-3.0/bookmarks
<nessita> larsu, entering a call, will be back with this as soon as I finish
<seb128> nessita, tjaalton, any chance you can try https://git.gnome.org/browse/meld/commit/?h=meld-3-12&id=281583a05117b9d05acb010c98adfebfeb27f70c
<seb128> you can probably edit the system files, python, it's easy
<Laney> mitya57 spoilered my email!
<Laney> while I was in the middle of writing it too
<nessita> seb128, will try, sure
<larsu> wubbly!
<seb128> whinoceros!
<larsu> :)
<Laney> yeah I spoilered the release name too
<Laney> annoying that emoji don't work in g-t for me >:(
<tjaalton> seb128: yep, fixed
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> larsu, ^
<seb128> tjaalton, thanks for testing, I'm going to update meld to the current stable version which includes that fix
<seb128> nessita, ^
<tjaalton> cool
<nessita> larsu, so sorry if I'm not seeing something obvious, but I can not find MeldSourceView in
<nessita> https://drive.google.com/a/canonical.com/file/d/0B-cmfDncRJmYMEVkMDBkVkdNblU/view?usp=sharing
<nessita> seb128, ack, trying now (was tryingt to get larsu 's info)
<larsu> nessita: not necessary anymore. The problem seems to be that meld changes css and doesn't repaint
<nessita> seb128, YES
<nessita> larsu, ack. So, what seb128 pointed out worked
<tjaalton> now I still have this weird problem since utopic where some fonts don't display.. guest account is broken as well, so apparently some packages don't mix too well
<nessita> seb128, larsu thanks a lot for your help! will comment on the bug
<tjaalton> hm, my font issue seems to be mostly/only with firefox/tb
<seb128> tjaalton, when it happens here xchat-gnome is impacted as well
<tjaalton> so gtk2 related?
<tjaalton> hmm no
<seb128> I was about to say that, but xchat-gnome is gkt3 since vivid
<tjaalton> right
<seb128> but I'm unsure I saw the issue recently, so maybe it was still old gtk by then
<seb128> but I doubt firefox uses gtk for font rendering
<tjaalton> a vanilla installation works just fine
<seb128> you mean? there issue is happening all the time on your installation?
<tjaalton> yes
<tjaalton> one way to reproduce is to read phoronix (yuck) forums
<tjaalton> the commented posts are blank
<tjaalton> also the page numbers
<ogra_> seb128, tjaalton i see that too from time to time in FF
<ogra_> (missing fonts or CSS)
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> looks like gtalk xmpp is going away on monday
<tjaalton> ogra_: oh, so I'm not seeing things
<Laney> guess we need to do some updates
<tjaalton> err, imagining things..
<larsu> Laney: does that mean it's not usable from telepathy anymore?
<Laney> i guess
<seb128> xmpp used to be a thing
<desrt> :(
<seb128> now no msn, no gtalk
<seb128> that's a shame :/
<desrt> seb128: it's okay.  we'll always have telegram
<desrt> seb128: can't really blame them, though, to be honest
<desrt> look at us and freedesktop.org
<desrt> we can either go through the specs process, or we can JFDI
<desrt> interop definitely slows you down
<seb128> right :-/
<desrt> i think that's what makes telegram so good
<desrt> they were super-pragmatic
<desrt> they have the same 'nice to have' list as everybody
<desrt> but at the top they put 'it has to work well, today'
<didrocks> focusing on one experience and getting it supported is clearly the key
<desrt> so the other 'nice things' have to be pushed aside
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, hey!  Getting "terminate called after throwing an instance of 'com::sun::star::uno::DeploymentException" when trying to run LO under Xmir - any suggestions?
<willcooke> this is on U8 / Mir / Xmir btw
 * desrt is vaguely entertained by the string 'sun::star'
<Sweet5hark> willcooke: yeah, something is wrong with extension deployment on 4.4.x. Do you have any python extensions somewhere?
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, erm, I didnt change anything in the extensions, so probably not
<willcooke> erm
<willcooke> unless I pulled in some strange python version
<Sweet5hark> willcooke:  sounds very much related to bug 1419836, which I am currently looking into ...
<ubot5> bug 1419836 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "LibreOffice 4.4 (PPA): Extension can't be installed: Message: com.sun.star.uno.RuntimeException) "unknown error!"" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1419836
<Sweet5hark> willcooke: this is with LibreOffice 4.4.0 on vivid?
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, yeah
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, sounds like very thing is in hand though - thanks :)
<willcooke> oh, it';s 1:1 time anyway
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, give me 2 mins to get tea?
<Sweet5hark> willcooke: sure, sure
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, thx
<willcooke> hey larsu - I think pretty much everybody has requested a 360 from you
<seb128> willcooke, did they?
<larsu> uh oh
 * larsu should get busy?!
<seb128> larsu, I'm changing my request to Laney instead, don't worry ;-)
<desrt> ya.  me too.
<willcooke> too late desrt
<desrt> oh wait.  already picked laney :/
<larsu> ts, would have loved to review you guys
<seb128> larsu, sorry, next time :-)
<larsu> seb128: I'll put you down anyway :P
<seb128> larsu, yeah, please do, I'm happy to review you, and I didn't have so many people asking me
<larsu> :)
<seb128> willcooke, Sweet5hark, libreoffice doesn't start anymore for me either today on vivid
<willcooke> seb128, all under control :)
<Sweet5hark> seb128: as a hotfix: do a "mv ~/.config/libreoffice ~/.config/libreoffice_".
<Sweet5hark> seb128: Havent had that "cant start at all" here yet, so would be interested if the above does help as a workaround ...
<Sweet5hark> seb128: (and yes, I am working on figuring out what is going wrong there properly)
<seb128> Sweet5hark, willcooke, ok, mine works again without that
<seb128> Sweet5hark, willcooke, update-manager updated only part of the packages, a set was blocked on libmwaw-0.3-3 to be installed
<seb128> seems like the depends don't enforce the update to not be partial
<seb128> but it doesn't handle the out of sync between binaries
<seb128> works again after upgrading the remaining ones
 * willcooke backlogging
 * willcooke tries an update again
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, oh, I tried deleting all of ~/.config/libreoffice before, didnt help me - but might be unrelated
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, I see another LO update when dist-upgrading
<jcastro> didrocks, http://askubuntu.com/a/584704/235
<jcastro> how would an upgrade look like?
<Saviq> willcooke, FYI: window geometry memory just landed in archive
<willcooke> Saviq, woo!  Thanks!
<willcooke> This is awesome news.  Now when you switch between windowed and staged mode the windows will remember where they were.
<willcooke> seb128, ^^
<willcooke> Saviq, presumably that's held in memory rather than, say a config file?
<Saviq> willcooke, sql db
<willcooke> ooooh
<willcooke> nice
<willcooke> sqlite?
<Saviq> yup
<willcooke> cool
<willcooke> is that part of the u1db stuff?
<Saviq> willcooke, no actually, you need a postgres install ;P
<willcooke> hah
<Saviq> willcooke, not right now
 * willcooke has evil thoughts about syncing window positions across devices
<Saviq> willcooke, it's not the target architecture for this most probably
<Saviq> willcooke, yeah, no
<seb128> Saviq, great, saw the changelog ... what's the id? like does it work between mode, or also between sessions?
<willcooke> :D
<Saviq> seb128, both
<seb128> excellent!
<willcooke> would this work for qt and gtk native apps as well?
<seb128> Saviq, how does it reconize the surface?
<willcooke> Laney, noticed any oddities with the UK archive servers today?
<willcooke> my updates keep crapping out
<Saviq> seb128, by app id right now, IIUC
<Saviq> mzanetti has details
<seb128> k
<seb128> which is fine as long as apps have one surface I guess :-)
 * mzanetti reads scrollback
<mzanetti> yes, appId so far.
<mzanetti> we need to change that to windowId once we have such a thing
<mzanetti> but it'll do for MWC
<seb128> right
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, re-upgraded and everything is back to normal
<willcooke> seb128, mlankhorst - Typing in to a LO doc under Xmir \o/
<mlankhorst> goodie
<seb128> great
<willcooke> AND pointing at things :D
<willcooke> and clicking
<mlankhorst> haha good
<willcooke> when this broken track pad allows me
<willcooke> power menu still crashes things
<willcooke> bah
<willcooke> My life is not perfect.
<willcooke> ;)
<Laney> willcooke: with what message?
<willcooke> erm
<willcooke> I turned it off
<willcooke> I'll try again
<Laney> if it's something aboutu a mismatch on Translations-en then yes
<willcooke> Laney, the logs would be in cachce upstart right?
<Laney> I don't think that update-manager logs
<willcooke> ohh
<willcooke> sorry - I'm talking cross purposes
<willcooke> erm, so the upgrade works now
<willcooke> meh
<Laney> ya, that happens
<Laney> you hit some inconsistency and then it gets fixed
<didrocks> jcastro: we let the upstream upgrade mechanism instead of messing with it
<jcastro> ack
<larsu> Trevinho: why did you change blacklisting in that indicator-appmenu branch as well?
<larsu> and again, I'm not really happy with exporting all menus at all times
<larsu> listening I mean
<larsu> it seems to work though
<Trevinho> larsu: well, it was just wrong to look only to these hardcoded paths
<Trevinho> larsu: as for exporting all the menus, I agree, but there's just not another way to do this
<Trevinho> without rewriting everything
 * larsu hates unrelated changes in the same branch
<Trevinho> :P
<larsu> Trevinho: yes there is. Get rid of this LIM madness
<larsu> (sorry)
<Trevinho> larsu: that's not the designed stuff
<Trevinho> solution
<larsu> Trevinho: I know :)  Anyhow, sorry for taking so long to take your branch for a spin. It seems good, approving
<larsu> Trevinho: I hope our deal's still on? :P
<Trevinho> larsu: anyway, considering that the indicator was generating all the menu data always and in any case, this won't change much things... a part from the fact that there will be more exported labels on dbus... but they will be updated less frrequently
<larsu> Trevinho: did the indicator cache data for all menus?
<Trevinho> larsu: yes, my hands are just bloody as they're inside the compiz core...
<larsu> hahaha
<Trevinho> larsu: it was and it will
<larsu> ok
<Trevinho> it was just loading them as soon as they were needed, so... once you focused a window. compared to now, where we do that always
<larsu> so the change is really just making the indicator exporting all the things to unity
<Trevinho> larsu: yes, and adding the relative parent xid
<Trevinho> so that we can then filter them out
<Trevinho> larsu: unity side of things was https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/lim-everywhere
<Trevinho> err is at
<seb128> Laney, ok, getting closer from the settings/translations/unity8 issue
<Laney> oh really!
<Laney> uitk/uss?
<seb128> Laney, I still don't know, but g_dgettext() fails to return a translation under unity8
<seb128> dgettext() works
<seb128> I'm reading glib source ;-)
<seb128> " For this
<seb128>  * feature to work, the call to textdomain() and setlocale() should
<seb128>  * precede any g_dgettext() invocations.  For GTK+, it means calling
<seb128>  * textdomain() before gtk_init or its variants."
<seb128> i18n.cpp does call     textdomain(domain); though
<seb128> and I've added a setlocale() call to it as well
<seb128> doesn't make sense :-/
<Laney> does g_dgettext do anything?
<seb128> I wonder if qt's x11 backend does some locales init that the mir backend doesn't
<seb128> anything?
<seb128> well, it returns me the english string instead of the french one under unity8
<Laney> other than just call dgettext ...
<seb128> Laney, it calls that http://paste.ubuntu.com/10191432/
<seb128> and use dgettext() if that is true
<seb128> so that must be false
<seb128> our domain is not the default one but it has translations
<seb128> k, so something under unity8 must call that function before us and have it return false
<seb128> right?
<Laney> I guess
<Laney> can you break there?
<seb128> no
<Laney> get a bt
<seb128> but I can rebuid glib and do that
<seb128> I don't think you can "b" on a static symbol
<Laney> g_gettext?
<seb128> but I can remove the static and rebuild and do it
<Laney> d
<seb128> then step from it?
<Laney> should be enough to just see where this is called
<seb128> I guess yeah
<Laney> it's going to call the other one
<Laney> and you know it returns false anyway
<seb128> shrug, hate that
<seb128> using gdb on the phone to start the app doesn't work
<seb128> it hits sigbus errors for some reasons
<Laney> :/
 * willcooke -> EOD
 * willcooke -> EOD
<willcooke> hrm
<seb128> Oh yeah
<seb128> got ja
<Laney> O_O
<seb128> http://paste.ubuntu.com/10191675/
<seb128> hum, guess not
<seb128> grrr
<Laney> i'm off too
<Laney> swapping tomorrow but may be on a bit in the morning
<Laney> can help look at this bug on monday if you want
<seb128> Laney, I'm going to have it resolved by then I hope ;-)
<seb128> Laney, enjoy the swap day!
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, what device are you running cut the rope on?
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, krillin
<kenvandine> and mako too
<kenvandine> but only briefly on the mako
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, it's really low frame rate for me on mako
<robert_ancell> just wondering if that's the same on krillin / expected
<kenvandine> it's perfectly smooth on my krillin
<kenvandine> i played 2 levels on the mako
<kenvandine> and it was smooth
<robert_ancell> weird
<kenvandine> i've been playing the free version for a while on krillin
<kenvandine> it's always been slick and smooth on that
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, Elleo said it was choppy on his mako too
<kenvandine> bregma, you have the yoga 2 pro right?
<bregma> THE Yoga 2 Pro, yeah
<kenvandine> and love it?
<bregma> hate the keyboard, love the screen
<kenvandine> i'm thinking about buying one
<bregma> the case also feels very nice
<bregma> all sexy-like
<kenvandine> hard to find something with a display like that :)
<kenvandine> touch screen works fine?
<bregma> the touch screen works great
<kenvandine> i'm thinking it'll be a good candidate to play with convergence features :)
<bregma> it also has a gyro, accel, and magnetometer, if I could figure out how to use them
<kenvandine> does the accel work in ubuntu too?
<kenvandine> i assume we don't actually handle the rotation
<kenvandine> yet
<bregma> sensor support in general in Linux is in its early days
<bregma> these sensors are IIO, I have others that are I2C, and there's no goof userspace support for any of these
<bregma> it's like PC ausio was in the 1990s
<bregma> *audio
<kenvandine> :)
 * kenvandine hasn't heard of IIO  :)
<bregma> or even video -- Hercules or Trident?
<bregma> I just want to be able to turn a tablet upside down and shake it to clear the screen, why does it have to be so hard?
<kenvandine> haha
<bregma> the feature for the Yoga 2 Pro I need to to detect when the keyboard is folded underneath (tablet mode) and disable the keyboard
<kenvandine> and enable the osk
<kenvandine> i'm kind of interested in the yoga 3 11"
<bregma> there's a hack out there to do that using the position sensor, I tested it but not installed it
<kenvandine> fanless :)
<kenvandine> but not the qhd display
<kenvandine> and not sure what to think of the processor
<bregma> there is a fan, but it rarely comes on and it's whisper quiet
<kenvandine> the yoga 3 is fanless
<kenvandine> has the intel M processor
<kenvandine> 800Mhz
<kenvandine> up to 1.7G i think
<bregma> it's good enough for what I do (building software, etc)
<kenvandine> i think the yoga 2 pro is a safer bet
<kenvandine> faster processor, and qhd screen :)
<robert_ancell> bregma, does the yoga have a sensor for that? I have a new Toshiba that does the screen flip but it doesn't seem to have a sensor
<bregma> robert_ancell, yes, it has a "position sensor" to indicate various keyboard positions (it does effectively 360 rotation of the keyboard)
<robert_ancell> bregma, how do you access that?
<bregma> through the /sys/bus/IIO interface
<bregma> it's pretty wretched
<robert_ancell> any tools to make that more accessible?
<bregma> there was a kernel patch floating around to redirect IIO through evdev, but it seems to be stillborn
<robert_ancell> hmm, I have a bunch of devices in there. I guess one of them might be related to screen position
<bregma> poke around, they give up their names and a description of their data if you squeeze hard enough
<robert_ancell> I've got the names but not sure what is what
<robert_ancell> accel_3d, gyro_3d, magn_3d, incli_3d, dev_rotation, als
<bregma> incli_3d is a 3D inclinometer
<bregma> als is ambient lighting
<bregma> https://github.com/pfps/yoga-laptop.git has some tools you might be able to take advantage of
 * robert_ancell just tried to bring up the ubuntu switcher on his Android phone
<bregma> is that the new Unity 8 switcher?
<robert_ancell> yeah, the Ubuntu phone one
<bregma> there's a bug asking for it to be ported to Android
<bregma> I think it was triages as 'wishlist'
<robert_ancell> haha
<darkxst>  Laney http://pastebin.com/scrYiXvE
<ochosi> larsu: i presume you know about this already, but progressbars are quite tiny in some apps with gtk3.14 (e.g. software center or update-manager)
<larsu> ochosi: ah right, I remember. Thanks
<ochosi> i guess that's a toolkit/app issue, not theming related
<larsu> not sure - it worked before, no?
<ochosi> before what?
<larsu> 3.14
<ochosi> larsu: yeah, i'm pretty sure they weren't *that* tiny
<Laney> darkxst: ok, I have a ppa1 anyway but I think I forgot to upload it
<darkxst> Laney, ok, gave it a quick test under GNOME seems fine
<Laney> neat
<Laney> just need the split then, hopefully before FF
<darkxst> we are still trying to confirm package naming with the DM
<Laney> ack
<Laney> berto's usually quite responsive, sure you'll be fine
<darkxst> ok
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-02-13
<tmpRAOF> Dear libtool: WTF.
<pitti> Good morning
<darkxst> hey pitti
<darkxst> storms are hitting! http://www.bom.gov.au/products/IDR021.loop.shtml
<TheMuso> darkxst: Where are you?
<darkxst> TheMuso, A little north of Melbourne
<TheMuso> darkxst: Ah yeah, nasty.
<TheMuso> darkxst: We are supposed to get storms here in Sydney too I think at some point.
<TheMuso> And hey there pitti.
<darkxst> TheMuso, we haven't had any rain at all in about a month, its probably useful!
<pitti> hey TheMuso, how are you?
<pitti> morning darkxst
<TheMuso> Oh yeah, as long as its not too heavy.
<TheMuso> pitti: Well thanks, yourself?
<pitti> TheMuso: quite well, thanks
<TheMuso> pitti: I've actually got something interesting to discuss re systemd, and its pkg-config file. For various reasons, I've been working to build pulseaudio with different prefixes/install locations, which gave me errors. This lead me to trying distcheck with puseaudio. I found that systemd's pkg-config file has the prefix hard-coded in the various service/unit directory variables. I see no bugs upstream/anywhere about this. Is this known?
<TheMuso> pitti: i.e systemduserunitdir=/usr/lib/systemd/user -- I would expect that variable to use ${prefix} rather than hard-code /usr...
<TheMuso> pitti: I was actually trying to come up with a patch to fix it, but my autofoo is lacking it seems...
<darkxst> TheMuso, maybe Lennarty did it on purpuse so you don't change the prefix ;)
<TheMuso> darkxst: But that makes no sense. If you look at other .pc files, when referring to the include dir etc, they all refer to prefix with a variable.
<TheMuso> darkxst: And it is likely to break the distcheck of packages that use systemd in some way, i.e pulseaudio.
<TheMuso> darkxst: Actually, it does break distcheck.
<TheMuso> There is no unlikelyness about it. :)
<darkxst> TheMuso, I wasn't actually being serious there!
<TheMuso> darkxst: Yeah saw the smily, but words on teh screen alone are not enough to convey such things, so yeah makes sense in context. :)
<darkxst> TheMuso, hardcoded paths are in the pc.in file?
<TheMuso> darkxst: No, it uses substitution to fill them in.
<TheMuso> But that has me wondering actually...
 * TheMuso checks something.
<TheMuso> Hrm ok, as I expected. Never mind, thought the prefix variable was part of the .pc.in files I checked that look sane.
<darkxst> TheMuso, why are you building pulseaudio with different prefixes? if you just want to isolate from your system? jhbuild can do that
<TheMuso> darkxst: Reasons, I cannot really say.
<TheMuso> darkxst: But even so, distcheck is designed to make sure a package is buildable with custom prefixes as well as using a different DESTDIR.
<darkxst> just saying, jhbuild has quite some hacks, to make things work with messed up mixed prefixes ;)
<TheMuso> darkxst: Nice to know, but jhbuild is overcomplicated for what I am doing.
<darkxst> TheMuso, some things take vars from the actual installed .pc files
<TheMuso> darkxst: I'm sure jhbuild is wonderful and all, but more than what I need, and, still we come back to pulseaudio distcheck failing.
<darkxst> TheMuso, maybe a bug in pulseaudo configure.ac
<TheMuso> darkxst: It could certainly be worked around in pusleaudio's configure.ac, but IMO that is rather hacky, and not the correct solution.
<didrocks> good morning
<TheMuso> Morning didrocks.
<didrocks> hey TheMuso
<darkxst> TheMuso, this is a fruitless conversation since you can't say what you are doing ;) sure you can work it out!
<darkxst> hey didrocks
<didrocks> good evening darkxst ;)
<darkxst> didrocks, stormy evening! first rain in over a month!
<didrocks> darkxst: waow, is it planned to stay over the week-end or just doing the night?
<didrocks> during*
<TheMuso> darkxst: Sure I can, but I am still of the thought that working things out *properly* means fixing systemd's pkg-config.
<TheMuso> Anyway, EOD for me.
<darkxst> Tonight and sat
<darkxst> TheMuso, pkg-config does what it is told
<TheMuso> We had a lovely late storm that roled into my area of Sydney last night, just as I went to sleep, was lovely.
<TheMuso> darkxst: Yeah I know that. Anyway, I can work around it for now.
<darkxst> didrocks, https://code.launchpad.net/~noskcaj/ubuntu/vivid/appstream-glib/mir-fixes/+merge/249562 should clean up the appstream-glib MIR
<didrocks> darkxst: oh DSO link errorsâ¦ insane we still have this nowdays, put my mind back more than 5 years ago :)
<darkxst> didrocks, I don't think Fedora builds with as-needed
<darkxst> even still
<darkxst> s/builds/links/
<darkxst> I hit them all the time in jhbuild
<didrocks> darkxst: oh really? I thought they turned on the gold linkerâ¦ but probably not when seeing that :)
<didrocks> darkxst: need sponsoring?
<didrocks> looking good to me
<darkxst> didrocks, yes, I don't have powers for appstream-glib
<didrocks> darkxst: running a sbuild pass first to ensure the tests are working and then, sponsoring
<Noskcaj> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> yw Noskcaj :)
<didrocks> Noskcaj: darkxst: built successfully, sponsored and MIR approved
 * didrocks closes tabs
<Noskcaj> didrocks, Since you approved the MIR, would you have time to s/appdata-tools/appstream-util in all the r-deps? The same binary is in both
<Noskcaj> It seems to be too trivial of a patch for it to be worth my time as someone without upload rights
<didrocks> Noskcaj: quite busy today, (and off Monday). If it can wait Tuesday (and you remind me about it), sure can do
<Noskcaj> cool
<darkxst_> Noskcaj, some naughty people can do copies from ppa's into archive
<didrocks> yeah, that works as well :)
 * didrocks likes darkxst_'s idea
<Noskcaj> ok, i'll look at making a ppa tomorrow if no one steps up to do the work
<didrocks> Noskcaj: keep me posted on Tuesday, I'll do the package copy if nobody did it before then
<Noskcaj> ty
<didrocks> yw
<willcooke> morning
<seb128> hey willcooke
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<popey> anyone else having multi-monitor pain on vivid on Intel today? http://imgur.com/80LcmgV
<willcooke> popey, on you x220?  So Intel gfx?
<didrocks> popey: urgh no :/ x220, intel gfx here
<didrocks> popey: -14 kernel?
<didrocks> 3.18.0-13.14 here
<popey> yes
<popey> bug 1421575
<ubot5> bug 1421575 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) "Desktop corruption when changing monitor config" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1421575
<popey> oh hang on, I'm on some dodgy 3.19 kernel
 * popey reboots to sanity
<didrocks> popey: what are you installing on your poor system? :)
<popey> installed 3.19 upstream to diagnose some other issue (gpu lockup)
<popey> but this is way worse
<didrocks> willcooke: postponed the arduino stuff
<didrocks> as discussed yesterday
<willcooke> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> yw
<willcooke> I didnt get time to explore Eclipse yesterday
<willcooke> maybe over the weekend
<didrocks> willcooke: no worry, we'll backport that to the ppa at worst :)
<didrocks> popey: trying to compete with attente_ on kernel bisecting?
<popey> bah, still busted on 3.18
<popey> but busted differently
<didrocks> popey: -13.14? -13.13 did have some issuesâ¦
<popey> dunno, i can't ssh into it now, disk light solid, it's not happy
<didrocks> waow
<didrocks> just dist-upgraded (quite a lot since yesterday)
<didrocks> rebooting
<didrocks> and see if I blame you *personally*
<willcooke> *brrring* *brrrring*   Hello, IT
<popey> networking is also busted
<popey> seems to want to have wifi and wired on at once and is getting upset with this situation
<willcooke> I had that yesterday on my U8 box, I think it's a different NetMan issue
<didrocks> popey: sorry, everything's working well here
<popey> 3.18.0-13-generic is what I am on
<seb128> Laney, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1420404/comments/3 btw, summary of the u-s-s translations issue
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1420404 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "Name entry in desktop file not localized" [High,In progress]
<willcooke> seb128, Laney is on swap today
<seb128> willcooke, I know, but he reads backlog when back usually, that can be monday
<willcooke> kk
<willcooke> just making sure
<seb128> willcooke, it's just a fyi on a bug I spent my day on yesterday
<willcooke> Hello Laney from the past
<seb128> he helped me a bit
<seb128> :-)
<popey> didrocks: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3ZQ9xW0PhQ :(
<didrocks> popey: private video
<popey> fixed, ta
<didrocks> popey: waow, if we wanted to do it on purpose, we wouldn't be able I guess :)
<didrocks> I guess it's a question for mlankhorst
<darkxst> didrocks, just like I hit 5 screws today screwing down architraves ;( certainly can't do that if you try!
<ogra_> just put some duct tape over it
<darkxst> ogra_, duct tape will fix it ;)
<didrocks> darkxst: it's really "Friday 13th" it seems for some of you :)
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> popey, mlankhorst is off today.
<darkxst> didrocks, doubt that is related to my achitrave problems!
<popey> balls, it is fine in a guest session
<popey> so something is knackered in my session
<popey> do we have a "reset compiz back to defaults" button anymore?
<didrocks> popey: you think it's compiz? do you have gnome-shell or any other DE?
<popey> no
<popey> I'm pure as the driven snow.
<didrocks> :)
<ogra_> popey, try removing the monitors.xml file
<popey> done that
<ogra_> ah
 * popey copies monitors.xml from a good guest session in 
<popey> \o/
<ogra_> heh
<darkxst> popey, just delete it, u-s-d will recreate a good one then
<popey> Not touching that again today.
<popey> nope, it didn
<popey> it created a _worse_ one
<didrocks> that's weirdâ¦ maybe it's the gsd config
<didrocks> let me find it
<popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/10201762/ is my good one
<didrocks> popey: do yo uhave the "bad" one?
<popey> no, but I can probably make a bad one by breathing near the display applet
<popey> lemme try
<didrocks> yeah, would be interesting
<darkxst> popey, if its creating broken configs, probably xrandr bug
<popey> k
<didrocks> darkxst: well, it does create a "good one" in his guest session
<didrocks> so puzzlingâ¦
<popey> didrocks: http://paste.ubuntu.com/10201816/ is the bad one
<popey> identical!
<didrocks> of course
<popey> but as my user if I touch the monitor config, even if I let it revert back, it still makes the display all messed up and flickery
<didrocks> popey: yeah, let's see with mlankhorst I guess, he will probably ask you to dump your xrandr configs
<popey> kk
<darkxst> popey, that looks like a driver bug
<popey> it must be something in my session
<darkxst> (unless xrandr is stuffing up the timings on your modes)
<willcooke> seb128, do you think I should be able to use gsettings set com.canonical.Unity8 usage-mode Staged to get U8 desktop in to tablet mode?
<seb128> willcooke, that should work yes
<willcooke> in which case....
<willcooke> sad face
<willcooke> should I be able to do it from an SSH session?
<willcooke> like,
<willcooke> do I need to be in the same session or something?
<didrocks> willcooke: did you get any error? (I think you are not in the same session bus)
<willcooke> no errir
<willcooke> when I tried from ssh
<willcooke> when I try from U8 terminal
<willcooke> I get a seg fault
<mlankhorst> ?
<didrocks> willcooke: if you then gsettings get com.canonical.Unity8 usage-mode, did you get the same value in return?
<willcooke> $ echo $?
<willcooke> 0
<didrocks> willcooke: it should print the value of usage-mode key (so "Staged")
<willcooke> nada
<willcooke> hey mlankhorst
<willcooke> mlankhorst, I know its your day off and all, but there's some weirdness for you to take a look at on Monday from popey up there ^^
<mlankhorst> define weirdness :P
<willcooke> mlankhorst, http://imgur.com/80LcmgV
<willcooke> mlankhorst, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3ZQ9xW0PhQ
<willcooke> (not Rick Astley)3
<mlankhorst> looks more like a compiz bug :P
<mlankhorst> seen the same before
<popey> yeah, that was my feeling too
<seb128> willcooke, ssh, you might need to define the dbus env
<willcooke> seb128, if I get env from U8 terminal, grep for bus, and then copy that in to my SSH session, that might work?
<didrocks> willcooke: you need DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS at least :)
<seb128> willcooke, just look to /proc/`pidof unity8`/environ
<seb128> easier to cat that, so you can select/paste
<seb128> rather than having to type it over
<willcooke> seb128, coolio, thanks
<seb128> yw
<willcooke> seb128, worked \o/
<seb128> willcooke, great!
<didrocks> weird that it wasn't working in your session though
<didrocks> (from the U8 terminal)
<Laney> seb128: nice fix!
<seb128> Laney, hey, thanks! it was "interesting" to debug
<seb128> Laney, btw did you go anywhere with the about panel/storage/qt5.4? Mirv wants to land qt5.4 early next week, we need to fix the panel to at least load, even if the disk computation is a bit off in a first time
<Laney> seb128: no sorry not yet, but could make it just use '/' or something
<seb128> Laney, right
<seb128> Laney, well, Mirv said he would have a look today, since they want to land qt and you are off work, just wanted to make sure he doesn't dup work
<Laney> oh well let me push the small bit I did
<Laney> Mirv: lp:~laney/ubuntu-system-settings/storageinfo-5.4
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> Laney, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1420404 btw for easy review karma if you want to ack it ;-)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1420404 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu RTM) "Name entry in desktop file not localized" [High,In progress]
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> why is CI grumpy on settings?
<seb128> seems like it fails to start or something
<didrocks> seb128: there are been a new CI Train rollout, maybe linked?
<seb128> didrocks, not sure
<Laney> seb128: I wonder if the uitk shouldn't have a fix here too
<seb128> Laney, yeah, I plan to open at least 2 bugs
<seb128> Laney, one to have the documentation mention that it sets the textdomain to that value
<seb128> Laney, and maybe one to say that is should set the domain only if it hasn't been set manually before
<seb128> (thanks didrocks for suggesting that one)
<seb128> Laney, is that what you were thinking about?
<Laney> indeed
<didrocks> yeah, you will clearly not be the only ones to be trapped by this, even if documentedâ¦
<seb128> well, to  be fair it's rather a special case
<seb128> but yeah, likely going to bite others
<seb128> you can do i18n.domain = ... from your qml
<seb128> and it's fine for the UI
<didrocks> I'm unsure that enthousiast would be happy to spend a day on something similar :)
<seb128> the fact that g_dgettext() decide on its strategy on the first call and that this calls happen between the init and the domain change is a bit special
<seb128> but yeah, we are probably not going to be the only one to use glib
<didrocks> yeah ;)
<willcooke> any quick workarounds for these wierd network manager issues?  I've already stopped ofono
<didrocks> willcooke: I didn't get it again since Brussels here btwâ¦
<willcooke> ohh
<didrocks> last time I did restart the network manager service
<Laney> ah crap, I had a nm bug just now
<Laney> C+Ped some nmcli output to file one but I forgot and lost it :(
<willcooke> I have wired networking and wifi - and I can't get to the internet most of the time
<Laney> vivid?
<willcooke> if I unplug the ethernet it works again#
<willcooke> yeah, on my u8 vivid machine
<didrocks> ah, not the same, only wifi here
<Laney> ya, try sudo restart network-manager
<willcooke> tried that, no different
<willcooke> I'm running a ping to 8.8.8.8
<willcooke> and it'll suddenly just work for about 10 seconds, and then stops again
<willcooke> disabled wifi - looks better now
<willcooke> could be some loop on my internal network
<willcooke> but I doubt it, since everything else works
<Mirv> Laney: seb128: ah, excellent! I did http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10202733/ as the bandaid solution to the rest of the about page if there wouldn't be a real fix
<Mirv> (in the ppa)
<Mirv> so if that branch helps it a bit further of not disabling the storage portion (even if wrong numbers), that would be better
<willcooke> mlankhorst, could we, if we wanted, interpret touch events as left-clicks in Xmir?
<willcooke> seb128, Trying to pair that kbd... "Please enter the following pin...." but no pin is shown
<seb128> willcooke, what device?
<willcooke> seb128, N7 running devel prop
<seb128> willcooke, yeah, bluez is buggy on that device
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bluez/+bug/1421598
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1421598 in bluez (Ubuntu) "DisplayPasskey() "entered" number wrong on some devices" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> willcooke, https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/bluetooth-key-hint-workaround/+merge/249622 as a workaround
<willcooke> seb128, nice one!
<willcooke> seb128, will that land in devel proposed at some point, or do I need to *shudder* compile code
<willcooke> oh
<seb128> Mirv, k, would be better to not disable storage indeed, are you looking at a better fix?
<willcooke> it's qml
<willcooke> I can just copy it?
<seb128> right
<seb128> it's one line to change
<seb128> so yeah, you can even vi edit it
<seb128> need to set your device to rw first though
<Mirv> seb128: I'm EOD after this hangout, but maybe Laney knows what's the next step that should be done to his MP now that the button + free space reporting is possible to get back. I guess implementing/copying QML class that used to be StorageInfo? FYI, here's the current diff I have http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10204250/
<seb128> Mirv, thanks, I guess we can look at doing better on monday
<willcooke> seb128, can you give me the path to DisplayPasskeyDialog.qml?
<willcooke> seb128, ignore
<seb128> willcooke, dpkg -S DisplayPasskeyDialog.qml
<willcooke> oh, neat trick, thanks
<seb128> yw!
<willcooke> yay! works
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<seb128> willcooke, great ;-)
<Mirv> seb128: yes, this solution at least fulfills the minimum level, and the main problem is probably thinking what's wise to do, the missing functionality itself is probably easy enough to replicate
<seb128> Mirv, right
<flexiondotorg_> I'd like some advice please.
<flexiondotorg_> I'm the Ubuntu MATE lead.
<flexiondotorg_> I've got a couple of files ubuntu-mate-settings that get installed to /etc/skel, just as other flavours have done. Such as Xubuntu.
<flexiondotorg_> Just want to get some feedback on that practice?
<desrt> flexiondotorg_: skel is evil.  stop doing that :)
<flexiondotorg_> Because I'm being asked by my sponsor to check with the desktop team.
<flexiondotorg_> desrt, Well, for I am using it for there is not other option.
<desrt> flexiondotorg_: is there not a way that you could make changes to the affected software to have the correct settings by default?
<desrt> flexiondotorg_: what are you doing with it?
<flexiondotorg_> desrt, Provide a default configuration for Tilda and qt4-config.
<flexiondotorg_> Much as Xubuntu currently do.
<desrt> because, almost certainly, it's not impacting all of the people that it ought to be, and is improperly impacting some of the people who it shouldn't be
<flexiondotorg_> Well, it is only relevant for system installs or new user additions.
<desrt> what can't qt by configured via more normal means?
<flexiondotorg_> Normal means?
<desrt> like xsettings, or so?
<desrt> ie: why are the needs of mate different here than the needs of gnome or unity?
<flexiondotorg_> Well, I guess my needs are the same as Xubuntu.
<desrt> sure... but that's not the question... in what way are they different than gnome/unity?
<flexiondotorg_> The default Qt4 look and feel doesn't fit and therefore requires a little tweak.
<desrt> it could be that xubuntu is also doing it wrong
<flexiondotorg_> desrt, Possibly. But I have tried to use the existing flavours as a guide.
<desrt> what's the tweak?  is it a new theme, basically?
<flexiondotorg_> desrt, Basicaly use GTk+ theme and Ubuntu font.
<desrt> and this isn't already the default under unity or gnome?
<desrt> maybe the fix to your problem is to get the defaults properly changed...
<desrt> anything else that you do really needs to be determined at runtime
<desrt> or at the absolute worst permissible case, via something like update-alternatives
<flexiondotorg_> So, how does Ubuntu (or rather Unity) set the Qt4 look?
<desrt> determined-by-packages-that-happened-to-be-installed-when-the-user's-homedir-was-created is just bonkers
<desrt> flexiondotorg_: i'd guess xsettings
<flexiondotorg_> desrt, Which package?
<desrt> {gnome,unity}-settings-daemon
<flexiondotorg_> If I have a reference I can follow.
<desrt> so probably mate-settings-daemon to you?
<flexiondotorg_> I'll take a peek.
<flexiondotorg_> desrt, Indeed.
<desrt> i'm not sure if this is true or not...
<desrt> i'm wildly guessing at this point
 * desrt is not a qt guy
<desrt> i just know that it's surely possible to do a better approach than your skel thing, and the person who flagged it as suspicious was absolutely right to have done so
<desrt> even a dpkg-diversion on the relevant system config file would be a better option... (but still a bad one)
<flexiondotorg_> desrt, There is not system level configuration AKAIK.
<desrt> there always is :)
<desrt> sometimes they just put it inside the .c files....
<flexiondotorg_> desrt, Which I can't influence.
<desrt> but i'd be surprised to hear about something that could be changed via a dotfile and not by a similar file in /etc
<desrt> flexiondotorg_: why not?
<desrt> this is #ubuntu-desktop
<desrt> this is where changes like this happen all the time...
<flexiondotorg_> I'm trying to see if Ubuntu have already changed the Qt4 config.
<flexiondotorg_> desrt, While I continue looking for if/how Qt4 is being tweak by Unity/Gnome could you take a peek at the following please?
<flexiondotorg_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mate-control-center/+bug/1351890
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1351890 in mate-control-center (Ubuntu) "Changing external screen resolution with dual monitors" [Medium,Confirmed]
<flexiondotorg_> See the patch we've prepare in #9
<flexiondotorg_> How can we get this merged and released?
<desrt> flexiondotorg_: you're talking to the wrong guy, unfortunately
<flexiondotorg_> desrt, Do you know who I should approach?
<desrt> oh.  this is a gtk patch?
<desrt> i'd talk to Laney about that
<seb128> desrt, gtk patch yes, from 2010, which apparently didn't get applied to gtk2
<seb128> desrt, would be nice to have applied upstream as well?
 * desrt thought it was a mate issue
<desrt> seb128: i doubt anyone would get very much objection from the gtk maintainers about that
<seb128> desrt, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=635380 to apply to gtk2 apparently
<ubot5> Gnome bug 635380 in Backend: X11 "gdk_event_apply_filters is unsafe against changes in filter list" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<seb128> flexiondotorg_, I guess you can ask on the upstream bug if they can apply to gtk2, or maybe open a new bug about it on  bugzilla
<desrt> er... https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk%2B/commit/?id=323df2b2800383832ed3c2e43626f2c6821c33ec ?
<desrt> oh.  you mean it didn't get backported
<flexiondotorg_> desrt, Correct.
<desrt> non-trivial backport there...
<flexiondotorg_> The patch is the TK2 backport.
<desrt> considering it modifies a file that doesn't even exist in gtk2
<desrt> you want to ping in #gtk+ on irc.gnome.org
<desrt> they'll almost certainly be very happy to accept that patch
<desrt> not really sure who monsta-mint is ... :)
<flexiondotorg_> desrt, monsta is a MATE dev.
<flexiondotorg_> desrt, Like myself.
<mlankhorst> willcooke: maybe
<mlankhorst> why? :P
<pitti> didrocks: lovely!
<pitti> didrocks: I get nice fsck progress (with the dummy) now *hug*
<pitti> didrocks: but neither in qemu nor on my real laptop Control-C works -- does that part need a plymouth fix?
<pitti> well, something for the next upload
<seb128> didrocks, congrats on getting some of that landing ;-)
<willcooke> mlankhorst, just playing with it on my touch screen laptop - I think it'd be a nice tweak if it's something that's easy to do
<didrocks> pitti: excellent! Control-C on the real laptop should work, the thing is that you have to press for ~1s
<didrocks> pitti: that was less noticeable with raw C
<didrocks> seb128: *finally*, phew! :)
<pitti> didrocks: ah! I suppose I didn't do that
<seb128> didrocks, :-)
 * didrocks back from cycling
<seb128> didrocks, ready for the tour de france? ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: ahah, seeing how many cramps I have the day after cycling for 30kmsâ¦ I would sayâ¦ no :p
<didrocks> and 15kms/h is like 4 times less than tour de france ;)
<seb128> didrocks, Laney, btw I opened https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1421672 and https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1421661
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1421672 in ubuntu-ui-toolkit (Ubuntu) "Overwrite the gettext to MainView.applicationName if already set" [Undecided,New]
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1421661 in ubuntu-ui-toolkit (Ubuntu) "The applicationName documentation doesn't state that it define the gettext domain" [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> seb128: excellent! let's see how it goes (keep us posted, I'm interested ;))
<seb128> just as a fyi
<seb128> didrocks, sure
<koko_> beurk beurk
<attente_> switching VTs seems to kill the audio for me
<ogra_> attente_, i thought thats expected since you lose your polkit seat
<attente_> ogra_: has it always been like that? i seem to remember it being able to recover as soon as i log into the vt
<ogra_> i was complainin aboout it years ago ... that was pitti's explanation i got :)
<ogra_> not sure if that behavior had changed later and is now broken again
<ogra_> it could well be
<willcooke> attente_, desrt trying to run gedit on a device:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/10206929/
<willcooke> it seems to just crashg
<willcooke> anything I can do, is it that just how it is atm
<attente_> willcooke: checking
<seb128> willcooke, what is the issue exactly? gedit is sort of a special case, it doesn't run on my inspiron, it tries to open another surface and mir allows one surface by app only at the moment
<seb128> could be the same issue
<seb128> you can try eog instead, that should work
<willcooke> seb128, heh - works fine on my Inspiron :)  This is on N7
<attente_> i'm not sure. it's running on my thinkpad, but i don't have a device to test it on
<pitti> ogra_, attente_: as soon as you log into the VT, you should get your audio back, no?
<attente_> pitti: that's what i thought, but it doesn't seem to do that for me now
<attente_> seb128: the log output seems to only create one window
<seb128> k
<attente_> "Could not load Gedit repository ...", i don't have this line in my output
<willcooke> eog seems same
<willcooke> http://paste.ubuntu.com/10207102/
<willcooke> meh - dont worry about it for now
<seb128> ok, need to go, going to a spectacle tonight, have a nice w.e everyone
<willcooke> cya seb128
 * didrocks goes as well, see you guys!
<didrocks> have a nice week-end :)
<attente_> willcooke: is it possibly because it's loading both the android and mesa drivers?
<willcooke> attente_, ah, ok - I'll pick this up with mlankhorst on Monday and see where we get
<willcooke> thanks attente_
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> wait
<willcooke> no, it's not an Xmir thing - duur
<attente_> willcooke: can you try removing the mir-client-platform-mesa package and see what happens?
<willcooke> attente_, sure - trying now
<willcooke> attente_, sabdfl
<willcooke> oops sorry sabdfl - ignore
<willcooke> attente_, same - you want a pastebin of the log?
<attente_> willcooke: it's ok, should be the same without that line i think
<sabdfl> willcooke, ack :)
 * willcooke -> EOW
<Noskcaj> Is anyone working on the evolution 1.12.11 update?
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-02-14
<Noskcaj> Does anyone have time to review/sponsor a merge of gnome-menus?
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-02-15
<hikiko> Hi
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: your pastebin timed out
<didrocks> good morning pitti, how was your week-end?
<pitti> bonjour didrocks ! Ä'Ã©tait bien, nous Ã©taions Ã  Dresden pour le 30eme anniversaire d'une amie
<didrocks> pitti: ah super ! pas trop fatiguÃ© ? :)
<pitti> didrocks: une grande fÃªte
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<pitti> didrocks: on n'a dormi pas beaucoup en fait :) (il n'y a que beaucoup d'alcool âº )
<seb128> hey didrocks pitti
<pitti> bonjour seb128, Ã§a va ?
<seb128> pitti, oui, et toi ?
<pitti> didrocks: mais je vais bien aussi, la derniÃ©re nuit Ã©tait assez longue
<seb128> beaucoup d'alcool ? t'as pas la gueule de bois ? ;-)
<didrocks> re seb128 :)
 * seb128 uses the opportunity to hand pitti some french expressions
<pitti> seb128: nous Ã©taions Ã  Dresden pour le 30eme anniversaire d'une amie, une grande fÃªte
<didrocks> pitti: heureusement qu'il y a la semaine de travail pour se reposer, hein ! :)
<pitti> seb128: hah, je ne connais pas cette phrase :)
<pitti> seb128: mais non, je ne suis pas mal aux cheveux
<seb128> "je n'ai"
<didrocks> (je n'ai pas mal aux cheveux)
<pitti> (oÃ¹ "je n'ai pas mal"?)
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> ah :)
<pitti> avoir, avoir, faire, faire, passer, passer
<pitti> tout les verbes en franÃ§ais !
<seb128> see, french is easy :p
 * seb128 ducks
<seb128> session restart, brb
<Laney> hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIiiiiiIIIiiiIIIiiiIIIiii
<willcooke> morning all
<seb128> hey willcooke Laney
<pitti> hey Laney, how are you? you have quite some echo there!
<seb128> how are things on the big island today? ;-)
<willcooke> Sunny and cold.  Looks like it snowed over night, but only about 2 mm
<Laney> hey seb128 pitti and willcooke!
<Laney> nice and chilly
<didrocks> hey Laney, willcooke
<Laney> and didrocks!
<Laney> how is it going?
<didrocks> good, thanks! yourself?
<Laney> awesome
<Laney> we went wild camping at the weekend
<Laney> well, bivvying
<seb128> had fun?
<seb128> did you get managed to avoid the bears? ;-)
<Laney> mostly scared of dog walkers in the morning
<Laney> (and badgers!)
<seb128> willcooke, Laney, do we IRC or hangout?
<willcooke> seb128, I'm easy.  I think HO might be faster though?
<seb128> k, let me find a quiet room then
<willcooke> seb128, if it's easier for you to IRC, we can do that
<seb128> no, hangout is fine
<seb128> I just need to move next room with the laptop, it's easy enough ;-)
<Laney> where are you?!?!?!
<seb128> on my way
<Laney> no I meant what kind of noisy place are you in :P
<seb128> oh, not noisy, just co-working with somebody else
<seb128> so I don't want to be speaking/disturbing
<Laney> interesting
<Laney> you go to a coworking place?
 * Laney joins the hangout instead..
<seb128> no, just meet with friends sometimes at ourplaces
<Sweet5hark1> moin
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: yeah, I found that only fail on that machine (running in a VM) -- I got an image created on another machine. Dunno, if its being in a VM, network settings or something else that caused trouble there ...
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: ah, nested qemu? what was the error you got?
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: timeout when setting up the image -- it was looping in some apt install runs claiming "the following packages will be REMOVED by this: <...>" with <...> being a single or a handful different packages each time
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: ah, that sounds like the kind of fun you get with nested QEMU indeed; what's your host release?
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: I found that xenial-on-xenial with "-cpu host" works reasonably well
<pitti> but nested qemu in trusty's qemu less so
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: maybe it was in some kind of dependency hell.
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, hey! had a good w.e?
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: that was a adt-run trying to get a xenial image on xenial. The outer xenial is a VirtualBox VM running on a non Ubuntu-system as a host (that _should_ be isolated though shouldnt it).
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: yes, weekend was pretty nice. Was window shopping for an ebike ;)
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: ah, so you don't even have kvm in the inner QEMU -- that's going to be glacially slow..
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, nice!
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, getting anywhere with the autopkgtest issues?
<seb128> if you are confident it's an issue with the setup and not libreoffice we might override while you continue debugging?
<seb128> not point blocking 5.1 while you debug infra issues
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: its some kind of infrastructure issue (if you include e.g. 'autopkgtests are missing deps' in that). I ran the tests outside adt-run and they completed fine.
<seb128> Laney, pitti, ^ wdyt about unblocking libreoffice?
<pitti> can do -- I'd force-badtest it, as it blocks a lot of other packages too
<pitti> but like that you won't notice if some other package update breaks LibO, so better fix them again :)
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: I can give you access to an affected instance if you need to (but should be fairly easy to reproduce locally)
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: yeah, Im running adt-run on native hardware now -- lets see how that goes ... so: no, not wanting access to that box (yet).
<Sweet5hark1> pitti, seb128: as the error message is pretty much a top level "cant find hsqldb1.8.0", the fun part will be tracking that though 20 abstraction layers in libreoffice to the original root cause ...
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: hmm, running libreoffice tests on either wily or xenial break with "no space left on device" locally. Is there a convenient way to resize the image?
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: ah, yes, sorry -- add "-s 50" to the adt-buildvm-ubuntu-cloud invocation
<pitti> that'll increase it by 50 GB
<pitti> and it's qcow2, so it should only grow to what it actually uses
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: ah, thanks.
 * Sweet5hark1 rebuilds images
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: I'll check here what actual difference that makes, I could just bump the default
<seb128> Laney, want to take on 1545308?
<seb128> bug #1545308
<ubot5`> bug 1545308 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu) "Backport upstream fix for memleak" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1545308
<pitti> qemu-img: The new size must be a multiple of 512
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: ^ sorry, -s 50 doesn't seem to work, hang on
<pitti> (it used to in the past, meh)
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: k, thanks for the heads-up
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: argh, of course -- "-s 50G", not "-s 50"
<pitti> 50 bytes won't help much
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: either way, I'll make that the new default
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: hah, I even wrote that intuitively and then "corrected" it to "-s 50" ;)
<pitti> --help even shows "default: 4G"
<Laney> seb128: could do
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> not so many fixes in that branch for a bugfix release
<Laney> anyone running wily ?
<Laney> verify the gstreamer srus please :)
<seb128> I don't have wily installs here, but if we don't find anyone I'm going to give a round of VM testing (but likely after feature freeze)
<seb128> pitti, we got a bug about the evolution translations missing, I reassigned to langpack-o-matic so I'm unsure if that's correct? bug #1545212
<ubot5`> bug 1545212 in langpack-o-matic "Evolution 3.18.4 package does not include translations" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1545212
<desrt> greetings desktop peeps
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: mirrors not playing nicely with U+1/proposed and autopkgtests? http://pastebin.com/9Z4bq4sd
<seb128> hey desrt!
<seb128> desrt, had a good w.e?
<seb128> desrt, in what tz are you this week?
<desrt> still having it, in fact ;)
<seb128> oh, right
<desrt> back in America/Toronto :)
<seb128> today is an holiday for you
 * Sweet5hark1 giigles
<desrt> but trying to hold on to the favourable jetlag
<seb128> desrt, early to wake up on a VAC day ;-)
<seb128> right
 * Sweet5hark1 wonders if one can engineer an all-holiday workyear by jetsetting.
<Sweet5hark1> would be exhausting though, I assume.
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: rather looks like networking is broken in your VM somehow?
 * desrt prepares the syringe^Wfrench press
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: thats running on native hardware and e.g. wily images seem to be happy ...
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: hmmm, "adt-run --shell libreoffice -- --apt-pocket=proposed --- qemu adt-xenial-amd64-cloud.img" aborts before I get a shell and leaving out "libreoffice" does make adt-run unhappy.
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: oh, you need to add -U too, and no --
<pitti> adt-run --apt-pocket=proposed -U --shell libreoffice --- qemu adt-xenial-amd64-cloud.img
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: still throws me out before I have a shell. (pinging archive.ubuntu.com works just fine from the wily host system btw_
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: can you run: qemu-system-x86_64 -enable-kvm -m 2048 adt-xenial-amd64-cloud.img -snapshot
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: then log in (ubuntu/ubuntu) and look what's wrong with the network config?
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: sorry, I've never heard about that kind of problem before, so I don't have some helpful hint right now
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: note that "ping" doesn't work in qemu, so use "wget -O- http://archive.ubuntu.com" or so
<pitti> or just apt-get pudate
<ogra_> the pu date !
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: hmmm, /etc/resolv.conf is empty (except for comments). I assume it shouldnt?
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: right, it shouldn't be; is it a link to /run/resolvconf ?
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: what does 'ip a' say, do you even have an interface that's up?
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: to ../run/resolvconf/resolv.conf and yeah, ifconfig shows I only have a lo ethernet interface ...
<Sweet5hark1> (very secure system, that.)
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: you mean you have *no* ethernet interface at all? not even a "down" one?
<pitti> you should have an "ens3"
<pitti> or perhaps eth0 (depending on the qemu version/config) -- do you have any kind of custom qemu configuration somewhere?
<Sweet5hark1> oh, "ip a" shows I have a ens3, which is down
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: do you have /etc/network/interfaces.d/ens3.cfg ? or any file in that dir?
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: it sounds like the setup-testbed script failed early on, before it got to setting up that stuff
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: does this mean it has the physical eth0 from the host (which is unplugged, as I use wifi for connectivity?)
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: can you add -v to the adt-buildvm-ubuntu-cloud command line, and copy&paste the output? I figure there's an error message somewhere
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: no, qemu emulates network interfaces for the guest
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: btw, to speed this up: please do this:
<pitti> cd /tmp/
<pitti> wget http://cloud-images.ubuntu.com/xenial/current/xenial-server-cloudimg-amd64-disk1.img
<pitti> ln -s . current
<pitti> ln -s . xenial
<pitti> adt-buildvm-ubuntu-cloud -o /tmp -v --cloud-image-url=file:///tmp/
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: ^ this will download  the image only once, adn adt-buildvm-ubuntu-cloud will then take it from /tmp/
<pitti> much faster for several iterations
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: /etc/networ/interfaces.d has no ens3.cfg ... but it has a eth0.cfg (and dmesg ens3.cfg was renamed from eth0)
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: what's the version of your autopkgtest package?
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: on the host or in the image?
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: it doesn't exist on the image; on the host (where you run adt-buildvm-ubuntu-cloud)
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: host: 3.17.4 on wily
<pitti> aah
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: please upgrade to the xenial one
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: cloud images and cloud-init changed the network config like three times, the wily version was before that
<pitti> autopkgtest | 3.19.2~ubuntu15.10.1 | wily-backports   | source, all
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: ^ this should be fine
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: k, will do
<pitti> ok, next time I'll ask for the version first :)
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: ;) -- do I need to recreate the images now?
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: yes, as they are broken
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: k, willdo
<pitti> Sweet5hark1: well, you could manually fix them, by changing eth0 to ens3 in the ifupdown config, if you prefer
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: when debugging a "works fine on the desktop, doesnt work in the test-env" issue, whatever I find in a "testenv that I turned the bowels upsidedown" will likely not help me much (might even be misleading)
 * Sweet5hark1 recreates images.
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: thanks for the hints
<flocculant> anyone of you wonderful desktop peeps listening to music while you work in xenial? do you have issues with cd's from rhythmbox ? real outlier - anyone use clementine? if so is it working for you :)
<flocculant> I obviously assume that you all whistle while you work ;)
<seb128> flocculant, you mean "CD" like the physical media rotating in the drive and making your laptop vibrate and make noise?
<seb128> or do you mean listing the digital format albums in rb?
<seb128> oh, and does your question is what is suggest, that you use clementine and have issue and are asking if we get the same ones in rb? if so did you try rb yourself?
<ngaio> can someone please help me assign bug #1545450 to the correct package? It's a serious or even critical bug in 16.04.
<ubot5`> bug 1545450 in unity (Ubuntu) "Severe Qt visual corruption with default Qt theme under Unity" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1545450
<willcooke> Trevinho, seb128 - any ideas?  ^
<Sweet5hark1> pitti: \o/ can reproduce the error in adt-run.
<seb128> ngaio, willcooke, yeah, seems like an old bug
<seb128> ngaio, willcooke, it doesn't do it if OVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=0 is set
<ngaio> seb128, where / how do I set OVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=0 ?
<seb128> ngaio, "OVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=0 vlc
<seb128> sorry
<seb128> LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=0
<ngaio> that fixes it for me too
<flocculant> seb128: I don't have anything as archaic as a cd player - but bug 1539700 appears that others are seeing what I am seeing with clementine bug 1537184
<ubot5`> bug 1539700 in rhythmbox (Ubuntu) "Audio cd's play with background buzzing" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1539700
<ubot5`> bug 1537184 in clementine (Ubuntu) "'Buzzing' during playback" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1537184
<flocculant> hard to be precise but iirc - the clementine issue appeared shortly after a gstreamer update in January - I tend to leave things with clementine for a while as I use the dev version of it
<flocculant> if I use alsa instead of pulse - works fine
<seb128> flocculant, I don't get the issue here, but it looks like it's something worth keeping an eye on
<willcooke> trying to find an audio cd....
<flocculant> seb128: thanks for looking :)
<willcooke> seb128, flocculant - yeah, same issue here
<flocculant> willcooke: thank the lord ... thought I was going nuttier :)
<willcooke> sounds like a sample rate thinh
<willcooke> thing
<seb128> do you get this on any file?
<flocculant> willcooke: in clementine I fiddled with sample rates - no change
<seb128> willcooke, using rb?
<flocculant> installed gstreamer.blah-alsa and use that and all is back to normal
<flocculant> seb128: any sound file that I have - ranging from mp3 to flac
<seb128> k, I don't get it here
<seb128> flocculant, how do you "use that"?
<willcooke> seb128, this is on my Inspirion with an external dvd/cd writer
<willcooke> with an install from daily on Friday
<seb128> willcooke, I don't think there is a need for medias, mp3 on disk should do it
<seb128> the use of "cd" was confusing in the question
<willcooke> ahh
<flocculant> seb128: not sure what you mean by "how do you "use that"?"
<willcooke> TheMuso uploaded a new Pulse the other day I think
<seb128> flocculant, <flocculant> installed gstreamer.blah-alsa and use that and all is back to normal
<seb128> flocculant, how do you tell it to use alsa?
<flocculant> oic - choose alsa playback in clementine preferences
<seb128> willcooke, yeah, the new pulse is from feb 11 but those reports are from january
<seb128> flocculant, I see
<flocculant> seb128: I also tried changing sample rate there alone and in conjunction - just appears to be pulse playback
<flocculant> seb128 willcooke - what I did find that it's only file playback in clementine which fails - any other player and it's ok - main reason I flagged it recently here is rhythmbox cd playback also falls over
<seb128> flocculant, willcooke, does "gst-launch-1.0 audiotestsrc ! audioconvert ! audioresample ! pulsesink" have buzzing issues for you?
<seb128> flocculant, what do you call "cd playback"?
<seb128> flocculant, you mean it doesn't happen on single song playback?
<flocculant> no buzzing with that
<flocculant> seb128: playing an audio cd - but I'm just repeating other people's issues there - don't have one available personally
<flocculant> which is the 1539700 bug ^^
<seb128> flocculant, it's still confusing to me, do you get the issue at all or are you repeating reports from others?
<flocculant> seb128: I get the issue with clementine
<seb128> flocculant, but not with rhythmbox?
<flocculant> nope
<seb128> flocculant, willcooke, does "gst-launch-1.0 playbin uri=file:///tmp/song.mp3" buzz for you?
<seb128> where /tmp/song.mp3 is a song you copied
<flocculant> seb128: nor amarok/audacious/exaile/banshee
<flocculant> seb128: that plays fine
<flocculant> seb128: I'm just talking about the rhythmbox audio cd issue because it "appears" to be the same issue
<seb128> ah
<seb128> flocculant, it happens if you have crossfade enabled in rb -> preferences -> playback
<seb128> not without it
<seb128> that wouldn't be the first time crossfading creates issues
<flocculant> :)
<seb128> can you confirm?
<flocculant> trying to
<flocculant> had to install it first :D
<flocculant> yup
<flocculant> had to restart rhythmbox
<pitti> didrocks: FYI: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ProposedMigration/AutopkgtestInfrastructure?action=diff&rev2=55&rev1=54 (in case you need this for u-make)
<didrocks> pitti: thx! (but no, I don't really need it as I have some options already to take from the ppa/archive, I don't want to build it locally first)
<pitti> didrocks: ack; I need it for doing tests for upstream systemd PPAs, so I just added that
<pitti> err, s/PPAs/PRs/
<xnox> doko, libgfortran3 : Depends: gcc-5-base (= 5.3.1-5ubuntu3) but 5.3.1-7ubuntu1 is to be installed => looks odd in many ways.
<xnox> i'll wait/try to find -8ubuntu3 stuff.
<didrocks> pitti: making sense!
<xnox> doko, wait, i think i have missmatched mirrors.
<flocculant> seb128 willcooke - so I removed gstreamer1.0-plugin-base from a vm - installed the wily version and clementine worked as expected, upgraded to the current xenial version and it did the 'buzzy' thing
<seb128> flocculant, willcooke, yeah, I just hit the same conclusion
<flocculant> seb128: you want me to comment on bug? I see you duped my clementine on to the newer rhythmbox one just now
<seb128> flocculant, if you want sure
<seb128> flocculant, willcooke, that reproduces btw
<seb128> gst-launch-1.0 -v audiotestsrc wave=silence ! queue ! adder name=a ! audio/x-raw,format=S16LE,rate=44100,channels=2 ! audioconvert ! autoaudiosink   uridecodebin uri=file:///tmp/song.mp3 ! audioconvert ! queue ! a.
<rickspencer3> hey all, I have new laptop running Xenial, and I am getting 5-10 freezes per day
<rickspencer3> it has IntelÂ® Bay Trail graphics
<rickspencer3> thoughts wrt debugging?
<seb128> rickspencer3, do you have any bt or gpu hand report in xorg.0.log/syslog?
<seb128> tjaalton, ^
<rickspencer3> seb128, something like>
<rickspencer3> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/15075038/
<rickspencer3> ?
<rickspencer3> there are a few of them lying around
<tjaalton> that looks normal
<seb128> rickspencer3, that log has no backtrace/error that I can tell
<tjaalton> but if it's a system freeze then there probably aren't any logs from it
<rickspencer3> let me look at some others
<rickspencer3> the .old one looks the same
<rickspencer3> I put it here just in case: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/15075065/
<seb128> rickspencer3, no :-/
<tjaalton> to rule out if the intel x driver is to blame, you might move it aside so it'll pick up the fallback driver instead ("modesetting")
<seb128> is the system freezing?
<seb128> e.g can you ctrl-alt-f1 to a vt?
<flocculant> willcooke: ftr it took a restart of rhythmbox for crossfading to cause me problem
<tjaalton> so, move /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers/intel_drv.so somewhere
<seb128> tjaalton, is that going to mean software rendering and slow/more cpu usage?
<tjaalton> no, it'll still use the actual dri driver for opengl
<seb128> k
<rickspencer3> tjaalton, so I did thisL
<rickspencer3> udo mv  /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers/intel_drv.so  /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers/intel_drv.so.backup
<rickspencer3> now I just reboot and use the computer until it freezes again, or doesn't?
<tjaalton> right
<rickspencer3> for anyone monitoring my network activity, I am watching netflix purely as a test, it's work ;)
<seb128> lol
<willcooke> seb128, bug #1545764
<ubot5`> bug 1545764 in gstreamer1.0 (Ubuntu) "Playing a CD in Rhythmbox with cross fading on crashes rb" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1545764
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<didrocks> (and using that to catchup on series you were lagging on :p)
<willcooke> nw
<seb128> no backtrace there though :-/
<willcooke> urgh, one sec...
<seb128> willcooke, I can confirm, don't bother with getting the bt I can do it
<willcooke> seb128, oh, cool, thank yoiu
<flocculant> seb128 willcooke - thanks for the help and time here :)
<willcooke> flocculant, thanks for the report :)
<flocculant> willcooke: yw :)
<flocculant> willcooke: probably would have left it longer to see if it hadn't been an LTS looming tbh - glad I didn't now :)
<willcooke> :) me too
<flocculant> hah
<rickspencer3> tjaalton, fwiw, hasn't frozen yet
<rickspencer3__> tjaalton, so, it froze exactly one minute later
<rickspencer3__> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/15075734/
<robert_ancell> willcooke, around?
<willcooke> robert_ancell, hey
<robert_ancell> can you help get https://bugs.launchpad.net/rnr-server/+bug/1540635 solved?
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1540635 in Ratings and Reviews server " The 2 hour limit for review editing should be removed (for .deb apps)" [Undecided,Won't fix]
<seb128> hey robert_ancell!
<robert_ancell> seb128, hi
<seb128> Laney, if you update eog for ubuntu as well can you include https://git.gnome.org/browse/eog/commit/?id=fbc11280 ?
<seb128> it's lp #1247800
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1247800 in eog (Ubuntu) "Picture displayed with noise in EOG" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1247800
<Laney> why isn't it on the stable branch
<seb128> (sorry, just saw the #debian-gnome backlog)
<seb128> that's a good question
<seb128> though there is a recent comment about performances
<seb128> so maybe not such a good idea to backport
<seb128> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QddT0tQsXRQ&feature=youtu.be
<Laney> looks like this makes performance bad
<Laney> :)
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> that comment was not there this morning when I read the bug (was in my backlog from the w.e)
<seb128> let's wait for them to sort it out then
<seb128> sorry for the noise ;-)
<Laney> heh
<doko> Laney, seb128, willcooke: please could you write a MIR (and subscribe to) nuget, new b-d of nunit?
<seb128> doko, can you take bug #1538173 in exchange? ;-)
<ubot5`> bug 1538173 in fonttools (Ubuntu) "[MIR] fonttools" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1538173
<doko> seb128, why? it's b-d of a desktop package
<seb128> doko, we don't own the fonts rendering stack afaik
<doko> seb128, b-d of graphite2, owned by the desktop team. and I still remember various fontconfig uploads by the desktop team during freeze times ...
<Laney> if you want to play this game
<doko> so, you are wrong
<Laney> nuget <- nunit <- nant <- antlr
<Laney> so bye
<seb128> right, I was going to say
<Laney> that's going to be a fun MIR
<doko> Laney, using this schema you can push everything to foundations
<seb128> doko, the main reason I've been uploading fontconfig is because it was not being updated otherwise, e.g trying to help
<seb128> but it was maintained by slangasek and stgraber before
<seb128> anyway, no point debating those details
<seb128> can we just split those and share the load?
<seb128> otherwise I guess it's something for willcooke & slangasek to discuss once Steve is back
<Laney> nuget is an upstream package manager thing
<Laney> don't know what the way out of that is
<Laney> apart from the xnox proposal
<doko> which will come a bit late
<willcooke> which is now+4 weeks away, so I think let's be pragmatic and share the love
<xnox> hm?
<seb128> willcooke, right, my though as well
<Laney> it's like miring npm or pip
<doko> yep, and we tend to have these in main too
<doko> willcooke, was this volunteering to do +1 maintenance for the next four weeks? ;)
<xnox> seb128, you can always pull in ogasawara as a slangasek substitute for the time being.
<xnox> MIRs are interesting.
<xnox> i believe a own a few "pre-promoted" or missmatched MIRs.
 * xnox looks at nuget
 * xnox sees description of apt
 * xnox is confused
<Laney> this is how software works these days
<xnox> yeap. it looks like a c# / .net maven equivalent.
 * xnox *sigh*
<seb128> (on +1 we are doing our share, some of us keep an eye on the proposed migration and transitions and help on regular basis)
<Laney> anyway it's a build system tool, so xnox's proposal is approvedâ¢ and we can just promote it, right? :)
<doko> Laney, did you check that it won't end up as a runtime dependency?
<xnox> Laney, well xnox proposal is blocked on solving doko's nacks, e.g. having check-mir in excuses.
<k1l_> seb128: hi. i filed bug #1545556 with windowbutton placement on gedit on 16.04
<ubot5`> bug 1545556 in gedit (Ubuntu) "ubuntu 16.04: window buttons of gedit are placed on the right side" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1545556
<willcooke> rickspencer3, are your freeze's just when using Chrome, or all the time?  And do you have to power off and back on to recover?  Not seeing anything suspect in that log
<rickspencer3> willcooke, all the time
<rickspencer3> really random
<doko> xnox, such discussions should happen in -devel, not in some secluded channel
<rickspencer3> willcooke, yes, I have to do a hard reboot
<rickspencer3> willcooke, sometimes it happens after 5 minutes of use, sometimes closer to an hour
<xnox> doko, i'm yet to form a response to the generated feedback on -devel. first day back, so catching up.
<Laney> well
<Laney> it's a waste of time to have arguments about promoting this build tool
<Laney> if we are going to allow it eventually anyway
<xnox> Laney, fyi, things in my proposal are the b-d's are not promoted, but stay in universe.
<Laney> like under the current MIR policy the s-ecurity team will definitely have issues with it
<k1l_> seb128: i have my system running in german, so i am not sure about the correct namings, but its this setting: "show the menus for a window" http://sourcedigit.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Appearance-Appearance.jpg
<xnox> it's just they are allowed, and e.g. would be demoted back to universe, if it doesn't generate runtime deps.
<Laney> xnox: not implemented though
<xnox> right.
<willcooke> rickspencer3, humm, could you send me a kern.log?
<rickspencer3> willcooke, yeah, hold on
 * rickspencer3 switches computers
<tjaalton> rickspencer3: do you have to reboot when it happens? dmesg might have something if not. but it's a kernel bug if the system dies
<rickspencer3> tjaalton, willcooke I am getting the kernel.log now
<rickspencer3> all I can say is that the system totally freezes and I have to do a hard reboot
<rickspencer3> I can't get to VT1 or anything
<rickspencer3> I suppose I could install ssh and try to ssh into it the next time it happens
<willcooke> rickspencer3, you could just try pinging it first, but I expect it's dead dead.
<rickspencer3> sure
<rickspencer3> here is my kernel.log
<seb128> k1l_, does unity-settings-daemon hit an error when you enable that option?
<seb128> k1l_, it looks like it does, your menu is not where it should it's not in the titlebar
<rickspencer3> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/15077887/
<rickspencer3> I think the last lock up was at 10:51
<rickspencer3> \00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00
<rickspencer3> \00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00
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<rickspencer3> \00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00
<rickspencer3> \00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00
<rickspencer3> \00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00
<rickspencer3> \00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00
<rickspencer3> \00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00\00Feb 15 10:53:02 rick-Satellite-L15W-B kernel: [    0.000000] Initializing cgroup subsys cpuset
<ogra_> ascii-art !
<rickspencer3> oh, so sorry
<rickspencer3> did not mean to paste that
<rickspencer3> according to jockey, my device is "Using Processor microcode firmware for Intel CPUs from intel-microcode (proprietary)
<rickspencer3> fwiw
<k1l_> seb128: i dont get an error. and another user made a fresh install, switched that setting and then the windowbuttons went to the right side too.
<tjaalton> rickspencer3: it manages to write a bit of garbage before dying. needs kernel bisect to find out the culprit...
<seb128> k1l_, weird, well there is something wrong with unity-settings-daemon for you and that another user, can you add the ~/.cache/upstart/unity-settings-daemon.log to the bug?
<willcooke> rickspencer3, would you mind opening a bug and we can see if the kernel team are able to advise further?
<rickspencer3> willcooke, np
<rickspencer3> tjaalton, just tell me how I can help, otherwise, I'll sit tight and expect that it will get fixed in the fullness of time
<k1l_> seb128: it includes only entries for cups stuff for 2 apps: (unity-settings-daemon:2402): color-plugin-WARNING **: failed to connect to device: Failed to connect to missing device /org/freedesktop/ColorManager/devices/cups_Roger_Router_Fax      and the cups_hp_laserjet
<seb128> k1l_, what's the status of unity-settings-daemon? "ps axu | grep unity-settings-daemon"?
<k1l_> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/15078361/
<seb128> k1l_, k, weird
<seb128> I don't know what's going on, it's like you were loosing the xsettings integration
<tjaalton> rickspencer3: you could try a newer mainline build to see if it's fixed in 4.5rc or drm-intel-next branch. google for mainline ppa
<tjaalton> and file a bug to track it. is there a reliable way to repro or is just idling enough?
<k1l_> seb128: yeah. to me it looks like that menu switch triggers something which breaks the buttons placement. but i dont know anything about gtk or such :/
<seb128> k1l_, well, unity-settings-daemon is the piece which watch the config and do the actual changes, and it looks like it stop doing its job for you when you trigger that option
<seb128> k1l_, can you do "stop unity-settings-daemon" then start it manually with "/usr/lib/unity-settings-daemon/unity-settings-daemon" and see if there is an error displayed?
<k1l_> stop works. i have old themes and icons
<ogra_> welcome to 1995
<k1l_> seb128: no error
<seb128> but the decorations are on the wrong side?
<k1l_> on gedit, yes
<seb128> and do you still get the menu under the decoration like on your screenshot?
<seb128> for e.g unity-control-center
<rickspencer3> tjaalton, I have not found a way to repro it
<rickspencer3> just using it for long enough :/
<k1l_> seb128: that image was just an image from google to show the english namings.
<k1l_> sorry if that was missleading :/
<seb128> k1l_, yes, it was
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> k1l_, can you make a screenshot with the settings panel and gedit open?
<k1l_> seb128:  http://i.imgur.com/OLsYois.jpg
<seb128> k1l_, there is no gedit/decoration on the right there?
<k1l_> seb128: did a "start unity-settings-daemon" and now changing themes doenst change the black titelbars.
<k1l_> seb128: sorry, didnt open gedit ...
<seb128> yeah, that's a known bug, that's fixed with a session restart
<k1l_> wait, now they are on the left again on gedit
<k1l_> seb128: http://i.imgur.com/cSTg6xN.jpg
<seb128> k1l_, no bug there ;-)
<ogra_> you were just holding it wrong ;)
<seb128> ngaio, willcooke, k, I found the issue with vlc/o-s, Mirv removed the patch to disable those thinking o-s are deprecated, but they are still there for gtk2 and it creates the issue, the patch needs to be restored in qtbase-opensource-src
<k1l_> ok. switching that menu doesnt make them go right again. i wonder what happens after a relogin
<seb128> ngaio, willcooke, Mirv, bug #1531516 updated
<ubot5`> bug 1531516 in qtbase-opensource-src (Ubuntu) "qt5/gtk integration needs to disable overlay-scrollbars since they create issues" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1531516
<willcooke> thank you seb128
<seb128> yw
<k1l_> seb128: ok. after a reboot and setting other icons the windowbuttons keep on the left side. even when i switch that menu again.
<Laney> see you!
<willcooke> cya Laney
<seb128> have a good evening
<willcooke> g'night all
<Mirv> updated the bug too, feel free to upload qtbase ubuntu3 if you're in such a timezone you have time to look at it
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-02-16
<didrocks> good morning
<hikiko> hi
<duflu> hihi
<duflu> kiko
<doko> didrocks, Laney: there's a bunch of desktopish packages which want to move to universe? Is this all intended? http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.txt
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> doko: I don't think they are, better to check with the desktop guys. I'll just promote session-shorcuts though as now unity migrated to main
<didrocks> good morning pitti
<pitti> oh, consolekit wants to go out of main -- can we remove that at last?
 * pitti goes through the rdepends
<pitti> ah no, still some open tasks on bug 1502045
<ubot5`> bug 1502045 in tcosmonitor (Ubuntu) "Move from consolekit to logind" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1502045
<alexarnaud> hoy hoy hoy everybody !
<willcooke> morning alexarnaud
<didrocks> hey willcooke, alexarnaud!
<willcooke> hi didrocks
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<Laney> morning
<seb128> hey alexarnaud willcooke Laney
<seb128> re didrocks ;-)
<Laney> what's up!
<didrocks> re seb128
<didrocks> morning Laney!
<seb128> Laney, tuesday starting with sun & blue sky, nice!
<seb128> also weather was perfect for tennis yesterday (dry with no wind)
<seb128> which was good for the match I had to play, I really enjoyed it (had a few frustating ones on previous weeks when it was very windy)
<seb128> Laney, how about you?
<Laney> yeah nice and clear here
<Laney> looks a bit frosty outside :-o
<Laney> my bike got a puncture last night so I had to leave it in the city centre :(
<Laney> going to need to go retrieve/fix that later
<seb128> urg
<seb128> I hope nobody stole a part of the bike meanwhile ;-)
<pitti> bonjour seb128, hey Laney!
<seb128> salut pitti ! Ã§a va bien ?
<pitti> seb128: oui, et toi ?
<seb128> trÃ¨s bien merci !
<doko> seb128, Laney: there's a bunch of desktopish packages which want to move to universe? Is this all intended? http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.txt
<pitti> seb128: are you aware of http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html#gnome-icon-theme ? it doesn't promote due to some uninstallability
<seb128> pitti, let me look, probably my fault
<seb128> I undid the split/-full since it's universe now and not on the CD
<seb128> I bet there is something needing -full, let me fix it
<Laney> good morning doko
<seb128> hey doko
<seb128> that list looks mostly fine yes
<seb128> feels weird to see the telepathy stack going to universe
<pitti> did LibO lose a lot of its java libs?
<seb128> but good, a bunch less things we actively maintain
<pitti> but a lot of it, like bacula/eclipse looks like server seed cleanup too
<seb128> pitti, Bjoern doesn't seem to be on IRC yet, that's a question for him
<willcooke> seb128, pitti - he's at the dentist this morning
<seb128> k
<seb128> doko, webkit2gtk should stay in main though
<seb128> Laney, is going to start that transition
<doko> still?
<seb128> still?
<doko> Laney, gm.
<doko> I thought there are two webkits in main?
<doko> and then there is texlive-extra, exchanging a set of font packages
<seb128> doko, right, we are moving from webkitgtk to webkit2gtk, we prepromoted it with ack from the security team, it needed to build in main to drop some universe depends it had, next we are going to switch desktop components from the old version to this one and then demote the old one
<Laney> I'll upload something in a bit to get it off your list :-)
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> pitti, do you know why we didn't get a xenial langpack update yesterday?
<pitti> seb128: because I'm building a fresh -base one right now
<seb128> hum, k
<pitti> I'll re-enable the cronjob after that, of course
<seb128> so we don't know if that bug dropping some .mo files was a one off or still an issue
<seb128> did we loose the debugging context meanwhile?
<seb128> or do we still have logs we can use to see what's going on?
<pitti> seb128: I looked at the logs, and they weren't helpful
<pitti> seb128: I kept the previous langpacks though, in case they are needed for examining this
<seb128> k, thanks
<pitti> but the -base refresh is overdue anyway
<seb128> that bug is not new, some domains were dropped before holidays
<seb128> and they came back
<seb128> so it's on and off for some reasons
<seb128> @base, ack!
<meetingology> seb128: Error: "base," is not a valid command.
<pitti> @ohshutupwillya
<meetingology> pitti: Error: "ohshutupwillya" is not a valid command.
<pitti> are we still in a meeting? :-)
<pitti> #endmeeting
<pitti> (ah, can't, only the person who started it can)
<seb128> are we?
<seb128> #endmeeting
<seb128> willcooke, did you forget to stop our weekly meeting previous week? ;-)
<seb128> or is meetingology just being noisy?
<seb128> there is no topic from the bot so I would say we are not in meeting mode
<willcooke> #endmeeting
<seb128> the bot is just being dumb
<seb128> so, feature freeze coming
<seb128> willcooke, Laney, other: opinions on gnome-logs vs gnome-system-log?
<seb128> others
<seb128> that's one topic
<seb128> the other one is "do we want to keep gnome-contacts installed by default"
<seb128> it was until previous cycle but empathy was bringing it in and we demoted that one
<willcooke> Gnome contacts, I don't think adds a lot of value any more without a mail client to use it
<seb128> having a contacts/addressbook application seems nice on principle but maybe it's only me who think that
<seb128> well, it lists your google contacts
<seb128> so it might be handy if you want to look for somebody's address or phone number
<seb128> but yeah, maybe people do that online
<willcooke> I expect most people to use a browser
<seb128> k, wfm
<didrocks> (I'm a people, and yeah, they do :p)
<willcooke> heh
<seb128> lol
<seb128> people are weird
<didrocks> heh
<seb128> on their phone they use the app
<seb128> why do they behave differently on 2 devices which are not that different? ;-)
<didrocks> I guess it's because the webapps are not (yet?) up to par for most of them
<didrocks> in term of perfs, system integration and such
<seb128> right, same on the desktop, the app is more integrated and easier to start
<Laney> gnome-contacts doesn't integrate with things anywhere near as well as the phone contact things do
<seb128> I guess that statement is true now without empathy
<seb128> I would have argued otherwise if we still had it
<seb128> you could message or video call directly
<seb128> same as on a phone
<seb128> but yeah, we lack apps that plug into it now
<Laney> yes if we were in a world where IM existed
<seb128> k, so I guess it's a consensus to stop using it
<Laney> on a phone you are in a world where the integrations are useful
<Laney> imho anyway
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> I would still find it useful if you could e.g start an hangout directly from it
<seb128> but I don't think you can
<seb128> k, so that's decided
<seb128> what about the logs?
<willcooke> yeah.  I think people like Facebook, Google etc have worked to try and keep your contacts in "their" system separate so you choose one platform (Facebook, Google, whatever) and stick with it
<seb128> I find the gnome-logs interfacing making it more difficult to see the logs content, the content is too small, you only see partial lines, easier to have a glance to the log in gnome-log-viewer imho
<willcooke> lemme look at the differences re: logs
<seb128> but maybe we could do some easy tweaks to make it better
<seb128> or maybe it's only me ;-)
<seb128> willcooke, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/log.png
<seb128> that's gnome-logs on the left and gnome-system-log on the right
<seb128> also I resized gnome-log because it opens smaller which makes for even less content (but that would be easy to change)
<willcooke> thx seb128
<willcooke> looking
<seb128> in fact I think the gnome-logs way doesn't work well for how I read log, it split every line in a list item which you can click to get that line detailed view, but I don't find the detailed view to bring more, it just seem less efficient to have things splitted like that
<willcooke> does syslog have the tabs as well, or is it just syslog?
<seb128> "tabs"?
<willcooke> on the left hand window, you have a pane with important, system, security etc
<seb128> ah
<seb128> gnome-logs has those categories and it uses the systemd journal
<seb128> gnome-system-logs lists different known log files
<willcooke> ah, I see
<seb128> like xorg.0.log
<seb128> syslog
<willcooke> well, I'm probably living in the past here, but I prefer seeing syslog, xorg, etc as separate logs
<seb128> same here
<seb128> willcooke, any opinion on the readability of both?
<willcooke> I prefer the one on the right
<willcooke> more compact
<seb128> k
<willcooke> what about you?
<seb128> same
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> you have content on screen and can read through the log
<willcooke> yeah, easier to scan
<seb128> on the left one I've the feeling I only have portion of the info
<seb128> which is less easy to read
<seb128> k, I guess gnome-logs might be nice once we have proper journal use
<seb128> but it's not the case atm, we still have other logs around, the logs are not classified/tagged as well they could, etc
<seb128> so let's keep the old one for this cycle (the one on the right on the screenshot)?
<willcooke> agreed
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<pitti> seb128: what was an example of a missing domain?
<pitti> (langpacks)
<seb128> pitti, eog evolution-3.18 evolution-data-server-3.18
<pitti> seb128: thanks
<seb128> yw
 * pitti uploads the new packs then
<seb128> \o/
<desrt> hello peeps
<willcooke> morning desrt
<willcooke> just going for an early lunch, getting a hair cut
<Laney> grade 0 all over
<Laney> hi desrt!
<desrt> morning laney :)
<Laney> what is new
<desrt> willcooke: pics!
 * desrt is poking the glib release
<hikiko|ln> Hi desrt + bbiab
<desrt> hikiko|ln: g'morn
<Laney> release day is my favourite day
<desrt> yesterday was release day, in fact
<desrt> but it was also a holiday
<Laney> time for tea then some webkit2 uploads
<Laney> eXcItInG
<Saviq> seb128, hey, I noticed you guys reverted nautilus a few days ago, now my icons are small at Ctrl+0, when I Ctrl+=, they get bigger (as I'm used to them), but spacing gets huge, that expected? https://imgur.com/a/yU4vu
<Sweet5hark> moin
<desrt> Sweet5hark: hello.
<alexarnaud> didrocks, willcooke, seb128 : how are you ?
<alexarnaud> Sorry for the late, I'm not able to work on task and read IRC ^^
<Mirv> seb128: can you verify the fix for the overlay scrollbar issue easily, before I copy the built packages to xenial-proposed?
<Mirv> PPA at https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-031
<doko> Sweet5hark, do we need that for xenial? if yes, please write a short MIR
<doko> o fonts-stix: fonts-stix
<doko>    [Reverse-Recommends: libreoffice-common (MAIN)]
 * Sweet5hark checks
<Sweet5hark> doko: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/1487148 <- can we just reuse this one for the MIR
<Sweet5hark> ?
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1487148 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "Please replace xfonts-mathml with fonts-stix in recommends" [High,Fix released]
<doko> sure, just open a new task
<seb128> Mirv, hey, sure, thanks for working on that
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark desrt Saviq
<seb128> Saviq, @spacing, yes, it's how it was before ... I've to say I sort of got used to the new layout and it felt weird going back to the old one with that much spacing
<seb128> same for you it seems ;-)
<seb128> Saviq, the small icons ... I think the new version wrote the change you made as default, you need to go in preferences and set that back to 100%
<willcooke> yeah, spacing looks like that on 14.04 too.  In fact, I just measured it with a ruler, and it is the same
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> :-)
<Saviq> willcooke, seb128, ok... I would've sworn I had one more column, but hey... seb128 changing the default helped, thanks!
<seb128> yw!
<seb128> Saviq, random internet screenshot from an old serie, http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-Ptcrk3Lk4cQ/UAbJ4F7F2bI/AAAAAAAAJVI/iIMGfqpvK_8/s1600/nautilus-3.5.4-ubuntu12.10.png
<seb128> Saviq, seems similar
<seb128> but yeah, the tighter spacing was nice
<seb128> just didn't play well with zoom level so they locked down to less values
<Saviq> seb128, ah, so you mean that new nautilus had it tighter? that might be
<seb128> Saviq, yes
<seb128> it makes a big difference
<seb128> Saviq, https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Hym4q2km_Zo/VmAHNvy2Q2I/AAAAAAAAINU/8Hzsp_9kIPQ/w1680-h1050/wolo.png
<seb128> Saviq, or better, http://i1-news.softpedia-static.com/images/news2/ubuntu-16-04-lts-to-ship-with-older-nautilus-due-to-bugs-and-menubar-499962-2.jpg
<Saviq> seb128, that's probably just it, then - I got used to the new spacing within the few days I had it :)
<seb128> so yeah, old nautilus looks like lot of uneeded spaces
<seb128> right
<seb128> same here
<seb128> it is better, I would have applied that change to the old version, if it was playing nicely with the zoom levels
<seb128> which it's not, the text overlap icons and don't wrap as it should
<seb128> which is why they limited to big icons
<seb128> Mirv, confirmed it fixes it, thanks!
<Mirv> seb128: thanks for testing!
<seb128> yw!
<seb128> willcooke, ^ btw, fix on its way for the qt/o-s issue discussed yesterday
<willcooke> Saw that, thanks a lot seb128 & Mirv
<seb128> yw!
<seb128> pitti, did you say you would override the libreoffice autopkg to let it in?
<seb128> (seems to still be blocked)
<seb128> Sweet5hark, did you get anywhere debugging the issue, I think you said you could reproduce yesterday?
<Sweet5hark> seb128: yeah, got adt-run to fail, Im in a shell in that machine right now. not more yet unfortunately ...
<seb128> k, no worry
<hikiko> I forgot to change my status after lunch \m/ :p
<seb128> hey hikiko!
<hikiko> hi seb128 :)
<Sweet5hark> that I need to tmux inside a qemu instance to debug a test just feels so wrong ...
<Sweet5hark> 1 tmux window for running libreoffice under gdb and 1 tmux window to start the out-of-process java test connecting to it ...
<rickspencer3> willcooke, I tired to use $ubuntu-bug linux to open my bug report, but the web browser never opened into the bug report page :/
<rickspencer3> what's a good way for me to open the bug report?
<willcooke> rickspencer3, what's your default browser?  Chromium?  There's a bug there atm
<rickspencer3> willcooke, Chromium, yes
<rickspencer3> willcooke, so, temporarily change my browser to FF and try again?
<willcooke> ^H^H^H yes please
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> will do later, after my calls
<willcooke> thanks rickspencer3
<seb128> willcooke, do we have a bug report about that?
<rickspencer3> you know you are a systematic team when your bug reporting tool has bug reports
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> seb128, pretty sure we do, looking now...
<rickspencer3> willcooke, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1546092
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1546092 in linux (Ubuntu) "computer freezes frequently" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<willcooke> thanks rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> let me know if there is anything I can add
<willcooke> will do, I will ask the kernel team to look first since I think that's where the problem lies
<Sweet5hark> seb128: the root cause of the fail is simple enough: a package missing from the test env
<seb128> Sweet5hark, which one? that should have been easy to reproduce in a pbuilder/minimal chroot env?
<pitti> seb128: I didn't see a final yay or nay on that, but can do
<willcooke> rickspencer3, I've added your kernel.log file and a comment to the bug report
<seb128> pitti, oh sorry, Sweet5hark said "yes please" and I +1ed it ... so yes, please override those, it's not an actual code bug just an env problem (which it seems Sweet5hark just figured out)
<rickspencer3> willcooke, ok, I can pull another one whenever
<rickspencer3> I just have to keep using the computer
<pitti> seb128: okay, done
<willcooke> rickspencer3, if you have time, it would be interesting to see if a live 14.04 session from a USB stick has issues as well.  That could (in theory) immediately point to a hardware issue, bad RAM perhaps.  But this is a guess on my part.
<Sweet5hark> seb128: libreoffice-sdbc-hsqldb was missing. I still have look why. Here is what I assume: rene split that out of some other package or renamed and as the dependencies of the autopackage test are manually maintained, they didnt include it ...
<seb128> pitti, danke
<rickspencer3> bad RAM seems like an unlikely scenario
<rickspencer3> willcooke, ok, I'll see if I can make such a USB stick and try it if the kernel team doesn't see anything obvious
<willcooke> rickspencer3, ack, thx
<seb128> kernel team is likely going to first ask to try with some newer kernel from a ppa or such
<Sweet5hark> seb128: still weird that libreoffice-base is even installable without libreoffice-sdbc-hsqldb. OTOH, strictly speaking you can use base without hsqldb (when you only use it as a frontend to e.g. postgres). I will recheck those deps though.
<seb128> Sweet5hark, k, good that you figured it out in any case!
<willcooke> seb128, humm.  I can't find a bug re: xdg-open.  But it's working for me on this fresh 16.04 machine.  I've mailed Chad to see what he says
<seb128> k
<seb128> willcooke, there is bug #1517956 assigned to Chad but I don't know if that would lead to that issue since there is no description or the user experience issue created
<ubot5`> bug 1517956 in Xdg-utils "xdg-settings (used to) assume desktop files have exactly one Exec line" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1517956
<willcooke> seb128, hrm... well I just tried ubuntu-bug (against unity, sorry Trevinho ;) ) and it worked as expected
<willcooke> and got an email from chad saying it was fixed a few weeks ago
<willcooke> so....
<willcooke> ?
<Trevinho> :)
<seb128> willcooke, weird
<seb128> Trevinho, hey
<seb128> Trevinho, how are you?
<Trevinho> seb128: hey
<Trevinho> seb128: ok, not too bad :)
<Trevinho> seb128: you?
<seb128> I'm good, thanks!
<Trevinho> Laney: hey, got any chence to check that zeitgeist patch I did (upstart side, as seb128 was saying)?
<Laney> Trevinho: I forgot, let me look again later or tomorrow
<Trevinho> Laney: np, thanks
<seb128> Trevinho, hum, my unity doesn't match nautilus (like I've a window open and it's not in alt-tab/matching the launcher icon) ... what sort of debug info would be useful? I didn't have such issues for ages, I wonder if that's a bug with the new nautilus integration code
<Trevinho> seb128: indeed it is related to that....
<seb128> you noticed the issue as well/got other reports?
<Trevinho> Mh, actually I forgot to add some debuggin statements around -_-
<Trevinho> seb128: I had once, but I thought I had fixed...
<Trevinho> seb128: do you have some external devices / partitions there?
<Trevinho> seb128: also the nautilus window was opened on ~/ ?
<seb128> Trevinho, I don't have external device/partitions atm
<seb128> I had my phone connected earlier though
<seb128> when I click the launcher icon it opens on ~ by default
<seb128> but I can browse any subdir it makes no difference
<seb128> nautilus is always missing from alt-tab/not matched in the launcher
<Trevinho> seb128: weeeird... Can you do a test build with some debugging code in FileManagerLauncherIcon::IsLocationManaged ?
<seb128> well in that session, I didn't try restarting unity/bamf but I guess that's going to fix it
<seb128> Trevinho, yeah, if I'm ever able to reproduce
<seb128> it's a one time thing atm
<Trevinho> ouch
<seb128> ?
<Trevinho> seb128: well, restarting bamf shouldn't fix it
<Trevinho> seb128: the content of the dbus-property of nautilus XUbuntuOpenLocationsXids is right?
<seb128> Trevinho, I didn't try restarting bamf or anything
<seb128> I didn't want to screw debug state
<Trevinho> yeah, that was a good move...
<Trevinho> If only I included the debugging bits in there!!!! :-@
<seb128> haha, do it now for next time somebody hits the bug
<seb128> Trevinho, where is XUbuntuOpenLocationsXids?
<Trevinho> seb128: on nautilus filemanager dbus api
<seb128>  /org/freedesktop/FileManager1 has an OpenLocations
<seb128> but that's it
<seb128> no XUbuntuOpenLocationsXids
<willcooke> oh, it's time already
<seb128> yeah
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Feb 16 15:31:17 2016 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic:
<Trevinho> seb128: later, but it's a property...
<Trevinho> seb128: also you've libxpathselect1.4 installed?
<willcooke> Roll call: andyrock (hols), attente, desrt,  dgadomski, fjkong (out), happyaron (out), hikiko, laney, qengho, seb128, sweet5hark, themuso (out), tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<Sweet5hark> heya
<dgadomski> o/
<hikiko> hu
<hikiko> hi
<happyaron> hey
<desrt> word up
<desrt> attente is here, but he is working very hard
<seb128> hey
<desrt> he's also using some weird irc client
<attente> i get notifications on the desktop now \o/
<willcooke> lets roll
<willcooke> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: attente
<attente> gnome-software ubuntu-one authentication
<attente> gtk menus.....
<attente> (eof)
<willcooke> thanks very much for all your help last week attente
<willcooke> much appreciated, and very good job
<attente> np!
<willcooke> attente, just sent an update email from a meeting I just had.  Might be some new stuff to work with pete-woods on, but we will see what RObert reports back
<attente> willcooke: sure, thanks
<willcooke> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: desrt
<desrt> hey.  had a pretty short week.
<desrt> did a glib release this morning
<desrt> and digging at bugs
<desrt> working on the --app-id thing for gapplication again, since it is coming up in context of xdg-app
<desrt> eof
<attente> helping me with threading issues
<willcooke> :)
<desrt> lol
<desrt> threading^Wrefcounting
<willcooke> thanks desrt, hope your travels were refreshing
<willcooke> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: dgadomski
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> * backported a fix to bug #1545750, it has been released today
<ubot5`> bug 1545750 in samba (Debian) "Access denied if the share path is "/"" [Unknown,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1545750
<dgadomski> * got some time to return to fixing bug #1125442, no results to share yet, however
<ubot5`> bug 1125442 in Compiz 0.9.11 "Always Visible and On Top Windows Steal Focus on Workspace Switch" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1125442
<dgadomski> * investigating bug #1545302, can't reproduce it on Xenial, trying to reproduce on Wily to make sure Xenial already has the fix
<ubot5`> bug 1545302 in wpa (Ubuntu) "wpa-roam broken by fix for ifupdown #1337873" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1545302
<dgadomski> (eof)
<willcooke> thanks a lot dgadomski
<dgadomski> thanks
<willcooke> let me know if you need help testing etc
<willcooke> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: happyaron
<willcooke> Happy new year happyaron!
<happyaron> hey ty!
<happyaron> * Was on holidays most of the time
<willcooke> :)
<happyaron> * Fixing the crashed canonistack vm (crap died again
<happyaron> * Ubuntu Kylin updates/seeds
<happyaron> * Random package updates at Debian (ocserv, radcli, etc)
<happyaron> EOF
<willcooke> thanks happyaron
<willcooke> #topic hikiko
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: hikiko
<hikiko> ezoom: I did some work and fixes on nux (the compiz part is ready). The main issue I have is related to the order of nux transformations. There are transformations like translations and others that take place in several places and make the scaled components appear misplaced if the scaling is performed before they are applied so I have to store the scaled modelview matrices and make sure that they are used at the right time (and there I have
<hikiko> some issues with the matrix stack that are under investigation :p). Apart from this, I took some time to look at the black-dots bug and I tested 2 ideas, but none of the two fixed the bug, so I gave up for the moment.. eof
<willcooke> thanks hikiko
<willcooke> We should get to the csm work this week so might need some support on the shadows.  <-- Trevinho
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: Laney
<hikiko> sure willcooke
<willcooke> *csd
<Laney> â¢ Some testing and bug fixes to appstream/appstream-glib/gnome-software/appstream-dep11 - need to send out "please improve metadata" announcement (tomorrow)
<Laney> â¢ Help vila with bzr and plugins patching/sponsorship
<Laney> â¢ webkit2 transition - prepare final packages, upload these, in progress now
<Laney> â¢ gnome updates: eog (now in sync!) gvfs libproxy (wk2)
<Laney> â¢ apply gnome-calendar/uoa fixes in Debian, that autosynced
<Laney> â¢ some usual wrangling of autopkgtests
<Laney> â¨
<willcooke> thanks a lot Laney
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: qengho
<willcooke> w/b qengho
<qengho> Hey!
<qengho> Not much to report yet. Some zfs stuff this morning, and some more zdg-utils bug.
<qengho> Then, chromium snap and regular packaging. New release yesterday
<qengho> EOF
<willcooke> thanks qengho, sorry for the goose chase this morning.  I've done more testing and xdg open seems to be working fine.
<qengho> xdg, Yes. that.
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> hey
<qengho> willcooke: Well, something is wrong. It's not an obvious one.
<seb128> â¢ some desktop updates (e-d-s, evo)
<seb128> â¢ helped a bit with packages blocked in xenial-proposed (libsunpinyin soname change, hsqldb1.8.0 ftfbs, ...)
<seb128> â¢ added an apport hook to fontconfig
<seb128> â¢ sponsoring (libreoffice)
<seb128> â¢ tested webkitgtk and gnome-software transitions
<seb128> â¢ debugged vlc/overlay-scrollbar xenial regression (turned out the qt patch to disable those was removed and should not)
<seb128> â¢ debugged/upstreamed some rhythmbox/gstreamer noise&segfault issues, then hit some other ones with daap and debugged a bit that as well
<seb128> â¢ working on software-properties "ask confirmation to enable proposed" changes
<seb128> </week>
<seb128> oh, also gnome-software's MIR has been approved
<willcooke> \o/
<willcooke> thanks seb128 #
<seb128> so we could start including it instead of software-center
<seb128> (I guess once Laney's appstream fixes land)
<Laney> already did
<Laney> there's a new version from upstream to test/include
<Laney> but this one is already ok
<seb128> k, I didn't see an upload on -changes
<seb128> weird
<seb128> but thanks for fixing it ;-)
<Laney> appstream-glib
<seb128> Laney, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/appstream-glib/+changelog ... is that the wrong component?
<Laney> assuming I uploaded it
<seb128> let's sort that out after the meeting
<seb128> no need to discuss that here
<willcooke> thanks chaps
<seb128> yw!
<willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: Sweet5hark
<Sweet5hark> - trusty and precise patch backports (sigh)
<Sweet5hark> - some new insights into snapcraft build/toolchain weirdness and failure, still need more nailing down though
<Sweet5hark> - ran circles to fix the autopkgtest fail, was a missing dependency in the test package
<Sweet5hark> -- (I wasted way too much time on getting the test setup for the above unfortunately, will promise to not be this clumsy next time)
<Sweet5hark> - upstream release and fix coordination (firefighting mode)
<Sweet5hark> EOF
<willcooke> thanks Sweet5hark
<willcooke> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: TheMuso
<willcooke> * Prepared changes to ubiquity and casper for new a11y profile work, still waiting for a11y-profile-manager to get into the archive so I can start landing other pieces and file an MIR... May have to file an FFE since we are getting close. All the coding is done, it just has to all be landed.
<willcooke> * Still got to get Orca patched to work with gsettings out of the box, should be able to get that done in plenty of time.
<willcooke> looks like we lost Till
<willcooke> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: Trevinho
<Trevinho> Â· prepared branches and landing for indicator-sound unity-lens-applications unity-lens-video unity-scope-Â· home doko patches for libgee-0.8
<Trevinho> Â· Some random fixes and improvements to unity theming
<Trevinho> Â· Looking at improving the matching of steam games in BAMF (valve seems interested in that)
<Trevinho> Â· Working on getting hikiko patch working with gtk apps.
<Trevinho>  /EOF
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho,
<willcooke> are we on track to land csd fixes this week?
<Trevinho> trying to
<willcooke> thanks!
<willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<willcooke> - GNOME Software work
<willcooke> - simple-scan 3.19.90 release
<willcooke> - At snappy sprint
<willcooke> #topic willcooke
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: willcooke
<willcooke> Reviews!
<willcooke> I'm going through my ones now.  Hoping to have them all done by EOW
<willcooke> g-s herding
<willcooke> I'm out at MWC next week
<willcooke> all week
<willcooke> Seb can be mother
<willcooke> and then I'll get back on to theme fixes
<Trevinho> :-)
<willcooke> in other news, I spilled Coke on my U key
<willcooke> #topic any other business
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-02-16 | Current topic: any other business
<Sweet5hark> seb128: mother? are we there yet?
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, don't start, or he'll turn this channel around and we'll all go back home
<seb128> lol
<attente> wondering if we can upload maliit-inputcontext-gtk before FF?
<seb128> attente, it's your lucky day, Laney is having his sponsoring shift today ;-)
<Laney> no
<attente> :D
<attente> D:
<seb128> unlucky!
<desrt> random AOB aside:
<seb128> do you have a bug in the sponsoring queue?
<desrt> does anyone know a good way to bribe laney?
<Laney> https://calendar.google.com/calendar/embed?src=6k1e5rq45m1bdqq0n1ge3oqaok@group.calendar.google.com&gsessionid=OK
<Laney> tomorrow
<attente> no, should i file one?
<Laney> but seriously if it's a new package
 * seb128 shakes the fist at eds
<Laney> that is not a simple sponsoring item
<seb128> attente, that would be better
<attente> ok
<seb128> desrt, no, Laney is not to be bribed, he fights for what he thinks is right
<Laney> what's right are fat wads of cash
<seb128> :-)
<Laney> I want a canal boat
 * desrt thought so ;)
<Laney> that is right too
<seb128> you can try to send some cats his way as well
<Laney> oh yeah, a trip to the cat boat in amsterdam
<Sweet5hark> Laney: you get your canal boat right after my helicopter and when we all speak french to make seb happy
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> willcooke, I think it's a wrap? ;-)
<willcooke> thanks all
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Feb 16 15:58:44 2016 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2016/ubuntu-desktop.2016-02-16-15.31.moin.txt
<seb128> thanks!
<Laney> oh yeah I'm uploading as-glib with the upstream patch nwo
<Laney> ;-)
<seb128> haha
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<seb128> Laney, willcooke, do we feel ready to do the seed change or should we get a call for testing or another round of "try on a daily image" before?
 * Laney would prefer to defer to robert_ancell
<seb128> it's going to have some rough edges still but we better switch now that wait for it to be perfect
<Laney> good to get it in before FF imho though
<seb128> +1
<willcooke> yeah, before FF for sure, but I think let's see if Robert is happy (I think he will be)
<Laney> I'm off out for a bit, got to go rescue my bike and do some errands and also eat my face off since I skipped lunch
<willcooke> bon chance Laney
 * Laney is going to take a track pump on the bus
<Laney> probably get me beaten up for being a weirdo
<Laney> so it's been nice knowing you all
<seb128> Laney, have fun!
<qengho> cking: Hi hi. What do you think of the patch here for zfs-linux? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/zfs-linux/+bug/1527727
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1527727 in grub2 (Ubuntu) "grub-probe for zfs assumes all devices prefix with /dev, ignoring /dev/disk/..." [Medium,In progress]
<cking> qengho, i've not had time to get around to that, it's on my todo list
<qengho> cking: I got feedback from pxtti. I'm trying a new approach this morning. This is uploaded 2 minuts ago: "Fix" zfs zpool, and make grub do less guessing.
<cking> qengho, indeed, that's why I've not got around to it yet, I will eyeball it, but I'm knee deep in other fs issues at the mo
<qengho> cking: right. later.
<qengho> cking, pitti: updated grub and zfs-linux debdiffs suggested in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/zfs-linux/+bug/1527727
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1527727 in grub2 (Ubuntu) "grub-probe for zfs assumes all devices prefix with /dev, ignoring /dev/disk/..." [Medium,In progress]
 * qengho food, brb
<seb128> willcooke, want to "wget http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/SoftwarePropertiesGtk.py; sudo cp SoftwarePropertiesGtk.py /usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/softwareproperties/gtk/" and try to enable proposed from software-properties-gtk and tell me what you think?
<willcooke> seb128, sure thing.  In a meeting, gimme an hour or so
<seb128> no hurry, tomorrow works as well
<willcooke> I'l have forgotten by then
<willcooke> meh, "wlp3s0" is much less friendly than wlan0
<willcooke> grumble
<willcooke> seb128, both buttons seem to cancel
<willcooke> i.e. "Enable" ==
<willcooke> sys:1: PyGIWarning: Gtk was imported without specifying a version first. Use gi.require_version('Gtk', '3.0') before import to ensure that the right version gets loaded.
<willcooke> ERROR:root:Authentication canceled, changes have not been saved
<willcooke> ERROR:root:Authentication canceled, changes have not been saved
<willcooke> ERROR:root:Authentication canceled, changes have not been saved
<Sweet5hark> pitti: thx!
<pitti> Sweet5hark: ah, did it land now?
<pitti> so it did
<Sweet5hark> pitti: yep, and it did and surprise me when I updated in one of my VMs ;)
<seb128> willcooke, hum, weird ... that error/callback is when the polkit auth fail, not to do with my change afaik
<willcooke> seb128, ahhhh
<willcooke> you know what
<willcooke> I'm running it over SSH and DISPLAY=:0
<willcooke> lemme run it locally
<willcooke> sorry
<pitti> Sweet5hark: did it? it only published 14 minutes ago, i. e. it's probably not even on the mirrors yet
<willcooke> seb128, works!
<willcooke> seb128, ship it
<Sweet5hark> pitti: hmm, maybe you're right, but it makes a better story ;) (I started libreoffice, was confused about a feature, looked up the version 5.1 and went to launchpad to look if it had landed).
<seb128> willcooke, :-)
<seb128> willcooke, k ;-) I'm merge proposed it as https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/software-properties/dialog-enable-proposed/+merge/286213 and asked for review from Laney (I don't think mvo does much review on that project nowadays)
<seb128> willcooke, feel free to +1 if you are fine with it
<willcooke> thanks seb128, I'll drop ara a quick note too
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<willcooke> seb128, just pondering some text along the lines of
<willcooke> "Enabling this repository may introduce instability"
<willcooke> seb128, let me run it past John Lea
<seb128> willcooke, feel free to suggest strings, I just copied the text from the wiki
<seb128> oh, a robert_ancell ;-)
<willcooke> hrm
<willcooke> looks like someone is trying to hack in to my IRC account
<willcooke> lots of failed logins
<willcooke> popey, around?
<qengho> willcooke: where do you see log-in count?
<popey> willcooke: for you, always
<willcooke> xx
<willcooke> I see this:
<willcooke> -NickServ- YOUHAVEGOODPW!~YOUHAVEGO@2001:67c:1350:104::20 failed to login to willcooke.  There have been 7 failed login
<willcooke> should I report it or something?
<popey> maybe ask in #freenode
<willcooke> thanks popey
<popey> oh
<popey> i see others talking about it in there right now
<popey> that channel is a right cesspit
<willcooke> yeah, was gonna say
<willcooke> I might as well have written my question on a Frisbee and flung it over a rainbow
<qengho> willcooke: That low is probably someone with a few passwords in search of accounts that use them. You should be safe if you have something hard to guess. If You are YOU.
<willcooke> muha ha ha
<willcooke> good call qengho, thx
<willcooke> the old qengho hit and run ;)
<qengho> willcooke: almost certainly a troll, right?
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> have a good evening!
<willcooke> see ya se
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> it's the thought that counts
<Sweet5hark> soo were is the launchpad project/DSCM etc. for http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/seeds/ubuntu.xenial/desktop ?
<willcooke> dinner time, g'night all
<Sweet5hark> (found it)
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-02-17
<hikiko> Hi
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<willcooke> morning seb128
<pitti> bonjour seb128 !
<pitti> hey willcooke
<willcooke> g'morn pitti
<seb128> hey willcooke pitti
<Laney> yo
<Sweet5hark1> moin!
<Sweet5hark1> Happy Birthday, the Document Foundation! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVkkZ64hJJA
<seb128> hey Laney Sweet5hark1
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, ;-)
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, so, I updated libreoffice in xenial and now my menus are not integrated in unity anymore ... known issue?
<ksamak> hey all
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: yes, because we install libreoffice-gtk3 in the default. That sneaked in as a dependency from Debian. Already fixed locally.
<alexarnaud> hoy all!
<alexarnaud> seb128, didrocks: is xorg-gtest specific to Ubuntu ? I cannot find anything about it in Debian repo
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: The fix is to not continue to build libreoffice-gtk3, but not install it by default. This is what we did before.
<seb128> hey alexarnaud
<seb128> Laney, did you get your bike back?
<Laney> NO
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, oh ok ... why is gtk3 not having integrated menus? ;-)
<Laney> WAH
<willcooke> ??!?!?!
<seb128> Laney, oh? :-(
<Laney> I broke the new inner tube
<Laney> *or* it was already broken
<Laney> but more likely that I did it
<willcooke> but the bike was there?
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: There will be some fallout from people running prerelease xenial, who will have libreoffice-gtk3 installed now. But people installing fresh from media or update postrelease should be unaffected, once the fixed package is there.
<Laney> aye
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, k
<Laney> fixed the puncture this morning
<Laney> so another trip out to the station tonight ...
<seb128> "fun"
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: (that "fallout" is actually not too bad: We also need _some_ people to test libreoffice-gtk3)
<seb128> right
<seb128> so you didn't reply at the "why is gtk3 not having integrated menus"
<seb128> I though you got that working at the london sprint?
<alexarnaud> seb128: I've find more things on freedesktop, it seems I need to investigate
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: as for the gtk3 doesnt have unity menu: yes, that was fixed in london. And apparently regressed upstream -- havent looked into that yet.
<seb128> alexarnaud, it seems like that simply nobody packaged it for Debian
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, ok
<alexarnaud> seb128: OK, I see
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, also, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/libreoffice.png ... is the text on the left pane supposed to be that big?
<alexarnaud> seb128: Did you know the link with Compiz ? I see it in Compiz dep.
<seb128> alexarnaud, it's used for tests
<alexarnaud> seb128: Ok, I'll learn more about it. Thanks a lot for your time
<seb128> yw
<seb128> alexarnaud, just curious, but what are you working on?
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: FWIW, I also have a MIR we should punch through: ucpp. In total, we have: 1/ fix autopkgtests 2/ build libreoffice-style-elementary too from new upstream 3/ continue building libreoffice-gtk3, build dont deploy in default 4/ MIR ucpp instead of using bundled
<alexarnaud> I'm working on porting Compiz from Ubuntu to Debian
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, k, seems like a good todo ;-)
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: So far libreoffice-gtk3 is worked on by some core hacker, I dont think he cares too much about finer UX/design things there (yet)
<seb128> alexarnaud, are you just interested by having compiz in Debian as an user? or do you plan to build something on it? wouldn't be easier to build whatever you are doing on Ubuntu?
<alexarnaud> seb128: It seems that everything work good but I've dropped gtest but I need to check if it essentiels or not to keep it in the final package
<seb128> yeah, it's not a runtine thing
<seb128> doesn't impact on how compiz works
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, I uninstalled gtk3, see the menus are not there :p
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, it's a screenshot of the gtk2 version, the sidebar text feels big
<alexarnaud> seb128: I work at hypra.fr team and we use Debian as work base
<alexarnaud> We provide repository with old Compiz version and we would to be more in contact with community, that's why we would like to make Compiz directly in Debian
<seb128> I see
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: argh. but yeah, looks the same on libreoffice 5.0.5 -- so is intentional.
<alexarnaud> seb128: My coleegue ksamak work on connecting Compiz with AT-SPI2 to manage a11y event
<seb128> alexarnaud, good luck, it still feels like things would be easier for you if you were based on Ubuntu ;-)
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, so it's not only my machine ... ok, if that's the way it supposed to be :-)
<alexarnaud> seb128: maybe yes but some of us are in Debian community and our mentor are an active Debian contributor
<seb128> k
<alexarnaud> :)
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: the todo list is already commited, I just need to cut through the redtape for the MIRs. Is MIRing ucpp a "feature"? (as there is ff tomorrow)
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, I don't think it is
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: good, thanks.
<seb128> switching from a bundle to a system shared lib feels like a bugfix to me
<ksamak> seb128: and we like debian cause it's free /troll
<seb128> ksamak, :-)
<seb128> ksamak, sorry I didn't want to troll,  it just feels like that this "packaging compiz" is taking you guys quite some work, it was an honest suggestion
<seb128> but yeah, if you have the free slots to get that done it's nice for everybody
<seb128> would be good to have compiz uptodate in Debian ;-)
 * Laney is being spammed with apparmor notifications
<seb128> what is getting denied?
<Laney> ntp
<Laney> just got updated
<pitti> hm, I'm just getting hundreds of "powercap intel-rapl:0: package locked by BIOS, monitoring only", that sounds differently
<willcooke> seb128, have updated https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/software-properties/dialog-enable-proposed/+merge/286213 with the final text from design
<seb128> willcooke, is "title" the window title or the bold part of the text? do we really need the "warning:" if it's the bol text?
<willcooke> seb128,  dialog = Gtk.MessageDialog(self.window_main, 0, Gtk.MessageType.QUESTION, Gtk.ButtonsType.NONE, _("Are you sure you want to enable updates from proposed?"))
<willcooke> that one ^
<seb128> k
<seb128> so that's the bold text
<seb128> having "Warning:" in there seems like poor form to me
<seb128> that dialog is a warning one, icon and bold text convey that
<willcooke> seb128, yeah, fair enough.  Drop the "warning"
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<seb128> willcooke, also any though about Brian's comment?
<seb128> the fact that "proposed" has different use on devel and stable series
<seb128> do we want different messages/behaviours?
<willcooke> I think it's a fair point, but this warning is for "normal" users running a released version.  I expect people running a pre-release will have more of a clue about proposed
<willcooke> so I think we just stick with a single implementation
<willcooke> keeps it simple for us too
<willcooke> i.e. no, we dont want different messages / behaviours
<seb128> k, wfm
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> I was pondering not showing the proposed box on devel
<seb128> since that shouldn't be used and people who need it usually know how to deal with the command line
<seb128> but that can be a later change
<willcooke> agreed
<seb128> gstreamer FAIL
 * seb128 looks at https://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/gstreamer-announce/2015-October/000359.html and is annoyed
<seb128> they were supposed to have 3 pre/rc between decembre and feb and have 1.8 out by now
<seb128> none of that happened
<willcooke> :((
<seb128> just wrote a comment on that gst/rb/crossfading/noise issue
<seb128> which is fixed in git
<seb128> asking what's going on with that schedule
<seb128> willcooke, I pushed an update to the software-properties/proposed dialog, but I've a feeling mpt wouldn't approve of the wording. I think it's unusual to have a confirmation dialog providing choices without having it's text stating what is asking about ... like it doesn't say "you are about to enable proposed, are you sure?" it just say "bla is dangerous", which the user could take as "wth is it telling me about bla"
<seb128> like nautilus doesn't say "deleting by passing the trash can lead to data loss", it tells you "are you sure you want to delete those? you are not going to be able to get those data back later"
<willcooke> mpt, care to comment?  https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/software-properties/dialog-enable-proposed/+merge/286213
<mpt> seb128, willcooke: Something thatâs specifically for testers and Ubuntu developers shouldnât sit like a mine in the middle of a UI that isnât. Thatâs why I specced that tab shouldnât offer -proposed at all. <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareUpdates#settings>
<mpt> Putting up a sign âWARNING: Mines can blow your leg offâ is not really a solution to the problem of the mine being there.
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: so, is bug 1546421 relevant for ff? Its already fixed in LibreOffice (which defaults to breeze on unity if available), but the one line change to ubuntu-meta to install -style-breeze instead of -style-human isnt in yet ...
<ubot5> bug 1546421 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "package libreoffice-gnome 1:4.2.8-0ubuntu3 failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/lib/libreoffice', which is also in package libreoffice-common 1:4.2.8-0ubuntu3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1546421
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, seems like more an uif item
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: hmm?
<seb128> mpt, willcooke, we don't have the contributor console though and our documentation/SRU process relies on testers being able to enable proposed to test candidate SRUs
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: argh, wrong bug id
<mpt> willcooke, and I already linked to that spec from the bug report that seb128 is working on, but ara changed the summary to assume the warning is a good solution. I disagree with that assumption.
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, installing another style by default seems like more "ui freeze" material to me
<ara> mpt, I changed the summary after talking to willcooke
<seb128> mpt, sort of false, there isn't a simple command to do that, but you could do a "echo "deb ... proposed" > /etc/apt/sources.lists && sudo apt-get update" with maybe some more scripting around to only add if if it's not enabled yet
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, right, that mostly impacts the look so I would consider it ui freeze not feature one
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: alright, thx.
<willcooke> well, we're not going to do significant work on the software sources or contributor console in 16.04, or in fact ever, because U8.  So we either remove proposed from there altogether or we go with a warning.  Both are sub-optimal.  Which is least bad?  Given that all our docs talk about enabling proposed through that UI, I think the warning is better than nothing.
<mpt> Those arenât the only two options. For example, we could move that checkbox to its own tab labelled âDeveloperâ or something like that. That way you could have warning text below it without needing a dialog.
<mpt> Does âbecause U8â mean âWeâre not going to let you install .debs any moreâ?
<willcooke> mpt, @ U8 - rather that U8 will have a new UI and so development will happen in there not in U7
<willcooke> i.e software sources will be re-implemented in U8
<willcooke> debs will still exist, so they'll need to implement an equivalent, which can be done correctly
<willcooke> I'm not sure about adding a new tab.  It won't be a huge amount of work, but it will render all the docs wrong
<willcooke> that said, it's probably not beyond the wit of a developer to work out what to do
<willcooke> seb128, thoughts on adding a new tab?  How much work>
<willcooke> ?
 * Sweet5hark1 filed two MIRs today already. Working hard for peace in the world!
<willcooke> 'bout time
<willcooke> ;p
<seb128> willcooke, it's probably not a lot, like half a day work
<dpm> pitti, seb128, IIRC langpack-o-matic is also creating the touch language packs right? Someone is asking me about bug 1491381 as it seems the Breton translation should have reached the threshold for which language packs are created
<ubot5> bug 1491381 in ubuntu-keyboard "Breton language Ubuntu touch" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1491381
<andyrock> morning
<seb128> hey andyrock, dpm
<seb128> dpm, no idea about that sorry
<dpm> seb128, np, we'll see what Martin has to say
<willcooke> dpm, btw - I think I know why you couldn't launch apps in u8 session
<willcooke> dpm, try installing  libpam-cgm
<dpm> willcooke, tried that already, but thanks :)
<willcooke> dpm, bah.
<dpm> there's a bug about that
<dpm> and I had some help from hallyn trying to debug it last week, but I had to give up at some point
<dpm> I'm planning to resume my tests some time this week
<dpm> willcooke, bug 1535058
<ubot5> bug 1535058 in ubuntu-app-launch (Ubuntu) "applications close instantly when launched from the launcher or dash" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1535058
<willcooke> dpm, so all I can offer is on a fresh 16.04 install, installing u8 session and that pam package allowed it to work for me
<dpm> I'll try it again in a bit, perhaps a week of updates fixed it for me
<desrt> good morning, attente
<attente> good morning
<seb128> hey desrt attente
<desrt> good afternoon seb
<attente> hi seb128!
 * desrt would like to point out that she was up at 6 but just forgot to say hello
<seb128> I guess you had coffee by now then ;-)
 * desrt hears the dish washer cleaning the french press already
 * xnox tries to upload all the things for the feature freeze
<xnox> i am not posh enough to operate a french press (well, not smart enough actually) hence i have dolce gusto pod coffee thing.
<seb128> xnox, all the things include that aptdaemon pkgkit1 port, right? ;-)
 * desrt gets annoyed at cgroups
<xnox> seb128, haha
<seb128> xnox, great, I knew we could count on you, thanks! ;-)
<didrocks> first time I learnt this was a "french press" was abroad TBH
<didrocks> so, not really popular here ;)
<desrt> too bad.  it's wonderful.
<desrt> i think it makes my favourite kind of coffee
<desrt> aka "very strong" :)
<qengho> I love french-press coffee too. I grind my beans a little finer than suggested to get it a little muddy, too. More coffee is better.
<seb128> is freedesktop.org down for others as well?
<Laney> ye
<seb128> k, thanks
<Sweet5hark> mterry: wrt bug 1487148, libreoffice was already depending on fonts-stix before the bug was filed. So should the state be: "libreoffice - fix released" as it has the dep and "font-stix -- fix commited" as it is still in components-mismatch?
<ubot5> bug 1487148 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "[MIR] fonts-stix -- to replace xfonts-mathml" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1487148
<seb128> mdeslaur, do you plan to merge/update freetype for xenial? it looks like the new version would be nice to have for the lts
<Trevinho> seb128: for some reason I get that this page is immutable (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/Theming), I did change it few days ago... Do you know how is this possible?
<mterry> Sweet5hark, oh ok sure.  I just saw the comment that went with the fix released was an auto-close due to a "no change rebuild" so it looked like some fluke.  Can set back to Fix Released
<seb128> Trevinho, the wiki has been locked to deal with some spam issue
<mdeslaur> seb128: I don't plan on it, no
<seb128> Trevinho, from what I read
<Trevinho> seb128: mh, who can I ping for getting access?
<Trevinho> As I'm able to edit other pages...
<seb128> Trevinho, try #canonical-sysadmin but they have it in their topic
<seb128> unsure why you can edit other pages
<seb128> maybe they lock concerns only some sections/pages
<seb128> " Known issues: wiki read-only for spam cleanup"
<Trevinho> ah, thanks...
<seb128> Trevinho, btw the nautilus not matching issue is still there today after a session restart :-/
<seb128> what info can I provide?
<seb128> brb, retrying with a fresh session
<Trevinho> seb128: so, could you recompile unity?
<seb128> Trevinho, yeah, same on a fresh session :-/
<Trevinho> seb128: if you can recompile you should add some output in FileManagerLauncherIcon::IsLocationManaged
<seb128> Trevinho, yeah, I can recompile, do you have a patch/some hints on what info you want printed?
<seb128> mdeslaur, would you consider it if asked nicely? ;-)
<seb128> mdeslaur, there is a bug asking for the update stating that it would make security fixes/updates easier for the LTS
<seb128> not sure if that's a true claim though
<seb128> it has improved thread-safety at least from https://sourceforge.net/projects/freetype/files/freetype2/2.6/
<mdeslaur> seb128: hrm, maybe. will that unblock your graphite2 issue?
<Trevinho> seb128: something like this should be fine http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/15100404/
<seb128> mdeslaur, I don't think it's needed for graphite2, that's blocked on MIR and mterry wanting a team subscribed but us and foundation not agreeing on who should maintain fonts :p
<mdeslaur> seb128: hehe
<mterry> seb128, you should both agree on a third team to maintain it  :)
<seb128> mterry, can I just subscribe you? ;-)
 * Laney applies for font team engineering manager
<mterry> seb128, I'm not a team!  :)
<seb128> can I create a "mterry is the best" team and subscribe it? ;-)
<mdeslaur> a team of one is still a team
<mterry> seb128, ....  I'll allow it
<seb128> Trevinho, ok, starting a build, it's going to take a while (i5 and no ccache/pre-build) ... btw unity depends on libgee-dev, can we get that changed to -0.8 or removed (Gee is used in a logger .vala source only but not mentioned in any build file so I wonder if it's even used)
<seb128> mterry, I'm not enough in troll mode today to do that, I subscribed desktop-bugs, not that those subscriptions make much of a difference anyway... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fonttools/+bug/1538173 should be good to be re-reviewed when you have some slot
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1538173 in fonttools (Ubuntu) "[MIR] fonttools" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> mterry, I keep the team idea in mind for another time though ;-)
<mterry> seb128, awesome, approved
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<Trevinho> seb128: about the gee thing, I think we can remove it...
<seb128> Trevinho, good :-)
<Trevinho> seb128: also still about that, the migration I've ready doesn't get approved by britney...
<Trevinho> seb128: https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/static/britney/xenial/landing-040/excuses.html
<Trevinho> or maybe Laney ^ ?
<Trevinho> The thing is unity doesn't build in that arch, so I don't know how I can ignore it
<seb128> I guess you can since it's not a regression
<Trevinho> I was suggested to set unity as build-depend on s390x  for unity-lens-applications, thus the error
<Trevinho> In fact, but... Without britney approval, the train doesn't allow to get things published
<seb128> what do you mean "set unity as build-depend on s390x  for unity-lens-applications"?
<Trevinho> So... I'm like blocked
<Laney> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/240168318/unity-lens-applications_7.1.0+16.04.20160212.1-0ubuntu1_7.1.0+16.04.20160217-0ubuntu1.diff.gz
<Laney> what is this diff?
<seb128> what he just described
<Laney> ...
<seb128> is that to trigger a dep-wait rather than a build fail?
<seb128> in any case it looks wrong
<Trevinho> exactly...
<Trevinho> Which I didn't want't to do...
<seb128> who suggested that?
<Laney> "what he just described" is not a helpful response
<seb128> seems like a crazy workaround from ci-lander
<Trevinho> But I was said it was a way to do this..
<Laney> it looks weird
<Trevinho> ci train guys
<seb128> tell them to force publish
<seb128> and revert that hack
<seb128> I can't believe they can't force publish over britney
<Trevinho> I hope so
<seb128> but please revert that s390x hack
<seb128> who exactly told you to do that?
<Trevinho> indeed, I hated myself in doing it..
<Laney> the old package built on s390x
<Trevinho> log from ci-eng http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/15100523/
<Trevinho> Laney: yes, it builds... But then there's a missing dependency
<Laney> what was the actual problem initially?
<pitti> Laney: njargh Prodstack access to squid.internal, I just bumped into this *again*
<Trevinho> Laney: unity-lens-applications has a dependency on unity because of the icons it uses..
<Trevinho> So not really a dependency, but...
<Trevinho> Laney: so, once it built on that arch there was the problem that one of its dependency was not available there
<Laney> Trevinho: but this part isn't new?
<Laney> pitti: oh dear :(
<Trevinho> no
<Laney> Trevinho: so why did it become a problem?
<Trevinho> Laney: the build-deps is new (now reverted), but the depends was there
<Laney> If it wasn't a problem last time this got uploaded I don't see why it would be now
<Laney> missing something here :)
<Trevinho> Laney: I think the same, but... For some reason britney doesn't think that this is an old problem
<seb128> Trevinho, what was the britney output before your hack?
<Trevinho> Laney: I'm rebuilding btw, so soon we'll get back to the initial issue
<Laney> it's right in what it is saying now
<Laney> because the build is indeed missing, that's what you forced to happen
<Trevinho> eh, we lost it.. But something like: unity dependency missing on that arch
<seb128> well it's true
<pitti> Laney: oh, there's quite some progress on your ticket
<seb128> but not a regression afaik
<Laney> pitti: sort of - they decided mimetype whitelisting was okay, then realised that you can't do this for https
<pitti> Laney: so you have to mark your r00tkit image/jpeg, and all will be good? *smirk*
<Laney> don't really understand what proxying is for https to be honest, apart from a passthrough
<Laney> pitti: indeed
<pitti> I can also base64 encode it and copy&paste it in
<pitti> this is a poor argument
 * Laney just wants it to work at this point
<seb128> what I don't get is how unity-lens-applications migrated to xenial if it has missing depends
<Trevinho> seb128: no, not a regression... But britney didn't think that (like it does for unity not having libnux working in the same arch)
<Laney> seb128: the s390x build happened in the release pocket
<seb128> oh
<Laney> because the arch got added later
<seb128> we should maybe just delete that binary then
<seb128> ?
<Laney> could do
<Laney> or make it a recommends
<seb128> Trevinho, ^
<Laney> or split the icons in unity
<Laney> pitti: what do you want it for this time?
<pitti> Laney: api.github.com
<Trevinho> Laney: I'd prefer not to touch the unity packaging...
<Trevinho> as already I'm changing something in that front
<pitti> Laney: github now makes test requests for systemd upstream PRs, but I can't tell it about their status
<Trevinho> Laney: as for reccomends, I think it's better
<Trevinho> Laney: so... if you remove the binary let me know... otherwise I'll go for reccommends
<seb128> +1 for the recommends
<seb128> you need to upload it anyway
<Trevinho> Ok, rebuild in progress... Let's see..
<Laney> cool
<Trevinho> willcooke, qengho: about video acceleration.... While reading the firefox bug related to that (it seems there's no hope in that front), someone mentioned that it's supported by Chromium... It seems that it needs to be patched with something like (https://github.com/fqj1994/chromium-vaapi, old but...). So, wondering what can be done on that side...
<willcooke> Trevinho, qengho - seems like a very early PoC more than a feature at this point.
<willcooke> Intel have u/s a load of VP9 patches for Cr. I think, so we might get that for free first
<Trevinho> willcooke: well it's shipped on chrome-os
<Trevinho> Uff, you're not supposed to be so slow, you arm64!
<Trevinho> I've to drive back to Florence, it will take ~1.5 hr
<jdstrand> Laney: you mention apparmor in your logs. is there a bug for it?
<Laney> jdstrand: yeah, and nice hilight :-)
<jdstrand> thanks :)
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ntp/+bug/1546455
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1546455 in ntp (Ubuntu) "Many instances of 'apparmor="DENIED" operation="create" profile="/usr/sbin/ntpd" pid=15139 comm="ntpd" family="unspec" sock_type="dgram" protocol=0' in syslog" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<jdstrand> Laney: did you talk to kickinz1?
<Laney> jdstrand: nah, I just hoped assigning would generate mail
<mdeslaur> seb128: freetype merged
<Laney> and then he would be like aaaahhh jdstrand please help me
<Laney> or something :)
<seb128> mdeslaur, you are a hero ;-)
<mdeslaur> seb128: you owe me INTMAX beers
<seb128> indeed!
<jdstrand> Laney: heh
<seb128> Trevinho, shrug, my nautilus matching issue was my fault :/
<seb128> Trevinho, I had a nautilus build without XUbuntuOpenLocationsXids (I commented out the patch while you were refreshing it and I used a version number higher than the one uploaded so was still on that) ... which is why I couldn't find it in d-feet
<seb128> Trevinho, works fine with the archive version
<Laney> :D
<robert_ancell> larsu, hi!
<robert_ancell> larsu, I was wondering if you have time for one last request - you might have some ideas on bug 1546276
<ubot5> bug 1546276 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Install button doesn't show loading bar in Ambience/Radiance" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1546276
<robert_ancell> mpt, hi, have you been following the GNOME Software work?
<mpt> robert_ancell, no, not at all
<robert_ancell> mpt, are you interested or would know someone on design who would be?
<mpt> robert_ancell, bjkeyser is the right person to ask
<robert_ancell> mpt, thanks
<Laney> hi robert_ancell
<Laney> how's the sprint?
<robert_ancell> Laney, hi. Going pretty good.
<Laney> sweet
 * Laney is sending a "fix your appstream plz" email
<Laney> right... about...
<robert_ancell> Laney, to... everyone?
<Laney> *gets gpg passphrase right the first time*
<Laney> NOW
<Laney> yeah
<robert_ancell> Laney, is the appstream stuff mostly working now?
<robert_ancell> Laney, and should I do anything to remove the stuff your shell script installed?
<Laney> it should be working
<Laney> actually I don't know which location is preferred
<Laney> I would just delete the stuff that it downloaded
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey
<seb128> robert_ancell, gnome-software's MIR got acked (and gcab one as well conditional on a fix), do you think it's ready to switch the seed? if so can you do it today or tomorrow (before ff)?
<robert_ancell> Laney, so I'm going to delete /var/cache/app-info/icons/, /var/cache/app-info/xapian/, /var/cache/app-info/yaml/ - that makes sense to you?
<robert_ancell> They don't seem to be owned by any packages and haven't been updated recently
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, I was going to ask your opinion. I think it's ready in the sense it works, but has bugs. But I think that makes sense for FF right?
<seb128> yes
<robert_ancell> And users can keep using USC so it's only new users that will get switched
<seb128> right
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, I'll do that today
<seb128> thanks
<robert_ancell> seb128, thank you
<seb128> don't forget to unseed oneconf as well
<robert_ancell> yep
<seb128> good work btw!
<seb128> I played a bit with it, feels nice
<Laney> robert_ancell: I think so, the system one is /var/lib/app-info/
<robert_ancell> I updated it yesterday to read the dpkg/apt files directly. It's ridiculously fast now
<robert_ancell> I haven't tried it with a rotary drive though, but I hope it should still read pretty fast
<robert_ancell> seb128, who's the best for GTK+ themeing issues?
 * willcooke sits a little lower in his chair 
<willcooke> robert_ancell, I can add it to my themes todo
<robert_ancell> willcooke, heh, I was thinking you'd inherited that title...
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> If it's a fairly easy css issue, I can probably fix it
<willcooke> at least, I can have a crack at it
<robert_ancell> Bug 1546276 is my issue - it's CSS that doesn't work with our themes
<ubot5> bug 1546276 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Install button doesn't show loading bar in Ambience/Radiance" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1546276
<robert_ancell> The CSS in gnome-software just adds a bar to the bottom of the button.
<robert_ancell> It might be our theme renders over it, or ignores such changes
<willcooke> oki, I can check it out
<willcooke> I've assigned it to me
<robert_ancell> willcooke, ta
<willcooke> nw
<seb128> thanks willcooke ;-)
<Laney> oh noes I forgot to block software-center
<Laney> better unblock all the other stuff
<Trevinho> seb128: ah, I knew there was something weird ð
<willcooke> robert_ancell, I've insalled g-s from the archive on a fresh 16.04 with no PPAs etc.
<willcooke> is that the right thing to do?
<willcooke> do I still need to run laney's script?
<Laney> it should work after an apt update
<Laney> from the archive
 * Laney is off, goodnight!
<alkisg> Hi guys, wrt the recent mail about gnome-software and appdata, two questions,...
<alkisg> one, when will gnome-software actually replace software center?
<alkisg> and two, I'm upstream + debian maintainer for 2 packages, can I sync them with ubuntu (with the appdata changes) even after the debian import freeze tomorrow?
<Laney> within days and yes
<Laney> really goodnight!
<alkisg> Thank you Laney, bb! :)
<willcooke> cheers Laney
<willcooke> robert_ancell, Laney - it works!  \m/
<willcooke> right, it's fts o'clock.
<willcooke> night all
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, aroud?
<robert_ancell> around
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: aye
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, in you lo snap, you have all the dependant libraries inside the snap right?
<robert_ancell> So it just depends on Ubuntu core
<Sweet5hark> yes.
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, and snappy handles all the linking stuff for that? Or did you need to modify LO?
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: I got it to finish building a libreoffice, by disabling tests. The result does print a help message, when you call it with ./soffice.bin --help ... as root ... with a LD_LIBRARY_PATH. It does nothing more.
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, root?
<Sweet5hark> Beyond that it fails in ways that suggest subtle and mean toolchain errors.
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, where does it write the configuration? In the snappy directories or ~?
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: hmmm, Im not sure if it even gets to that point ...
<robert_ancell> ok :)
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, but you would expect it to still go to ~ unless you patched it right?
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: yes.
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, are there any files in ~ that it might access outside of its configuration? Even indirectly through a library.
<robert_ancell> I guess the GTK+ theming configuration
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: hmm, never thought much about that. would need to strace it ...
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: also how do you define "its configuration"? because "its configuration" might include executable code (e.g. extensions stored in ~) and such fun ...
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, sorry, was called into a conversation
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, yeah, I'm trying to think along the lines of "what would happen if you couldn't access ~" or "You can only access ~/Downloads, ~/Pictures, ~/.config" etc
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: from what I see now it seems worse than that. namely, that some symbol export foo breaks C++ stdlibs in a subtle way inside snapcraft/snappy.
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, the C++ libs from ubuntu-core?
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: hang on a sec, I will try to find the conversation on that and include it in the mail.
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: you got mail.
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, it's all spam
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: you still got nothing?
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, I got it. It's a Futurama reference :)
<robert_ancell> Though googling I think the correct line is actually "It's not spam"
<robert_ancell> Which makese more sense
<Sweet5hark> heh
 * Sweet5hark is too much of an old fart for futurama
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, are there any services that LO relies on (e.g. D-Bus) that would stop it working if they were removed? Because you can get all the libs in the snap but not the services.
<robert_ancell> I mean e.g. a D-Bus service, not D-Bus itself.
<robert_ancell> Though perhaps that is a candidate...
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: well, we are certainly using various services, but we usually fall back soft when missing almost everything ...
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, yeah, I was thinking that apps like LO are a bit of a special case in that most things are optional. Other desktop apps rely on package dependencies to ensure their services are there.
<robert_ancell> So those sort of apps would need their services to be in snaps
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: if what remains is still a full office suite platform might be debatable. I assume there will be people having very strong opinions on that.
<robert_ancell> I have raised that point
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, is that because it would take much work to get them all working or is there anything fundamental that would be lost converting to a snap?
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: there is so much stuff that might break in containers, I just dont know how bad it might be and what would be the most painful things ...
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: for an extreme, take e.g. extensions and scripting via UNO: they are supposed to be able to do anything and everything to integrate with $whatever and run in the same process as LibreOffice. Thats not a good fit to containerization.
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: For the rest, TBH I wouldnt know. I have no idea if LibreOffice base is able to interact with any database source (mysql, postgres) anymore etc. -- and unittests dont help a thing, as they will be inside the container.
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: (also one person can do manual testing on a LibreOffice release for a year and not cover all corners) To have any idea of realworld impact: publish PoC, buckle up seatbelts, ask for feedback, brace for impact
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, ack
<Sweet5hark> (and better do it with volunteer early adopters enjoying the pain)
<Saviq> gaah what happened to my mono font :P
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-02-18
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: here is a recent output of libreoffice ./configure --help. I assume every second or third --with-foo or --enable-foo option might break: http://pastebin.com/NpkmD4BR
<sarnold>   --disable-coinmp        Disable compilation of the CoinMP solver
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: oh, yes: we will also bundle dictionaries for all languages with the snap, I assume?
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, Can they download on demand?
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: so far we provided them as proper packages installed along with lang support. But yes, if they find an language dict on extensions.libreoffice.org they might install it (to ~) just like windoze users would. Except that many dictionaries arent published on that page, but spread all over the internets, so many will do some easter egg hunt for their dicts ...
<Sweet5hark> ... and then end up installing something malicious from an untrusted source.
<robert_ancell> yep
<happyaron> Laney: can you refresh the upload rights for ubuntukylin packageset?
<tjaalton> does lightdm auto-adjust the scaling factor now?
<tjaalton> scaling in unity doesn't seem to work at all (xenial)
<hikiko> Hi
<alkisg> Hi, so, to check how our packages appstream data shows up, we're supposed to install gnome-software, right?
<alkisg> It's so bare... it always lists apps as "coming from a 3rd party", it doesn't list the version or license or source or size of the programs etc
<alkisg> It's not even in the gnome menu, I have to launch it from the command line
<alkisg> Am I testing it wrong?
<alkisg> I search for "gedit" and it shows "seahorse", it doesn't have an index of available programs... is it supposed to be so broken or am I looking at the wrong application?
 * alkisg just ran `apt-get install gnome-software`, hope I'm not missing any suggested packages that make it less functional...
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> hey pitti!
<seb128> wie gehts?
<cyphermox> morning amigos
<cyphermox> it's not my morning, I was just checking back on IRC before passing out.
<flocculant> ha ha
<seb128> hey cyphermox
<pitti> hey seb128 ! terribly tired, I hardly slept at all for some  reason
<seb128> lol I was going to ask
<seb128> cyphermox, have a good night ;-)
<seb128> pitti, oh :-(
<seb128> pitti, strong tea time!
<cyphermox> good day ;)
<pitti> seb128: dentist time too!
<seb128> good luck
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks ;-)
<Sweet5hark1> moin!
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark1!
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: heya
<seb128> going to grab a coffee and something to eat, bbiab
<andyrock> morning
<alkisg> Hi guys, let me ask again, gnome-software currently is quite empty (no index in the inital page, no categories, no working search etc), is that to be expected or is it an issue with my local installation?
<alkisg> (I'm asking here because a mail instructed us to use it to check the appstream data in our packages, and to direct questions to #ubuntu-desktop)
<willcooke> morning all.  Still no SSL on Freenode for me :(
<seb128> hey andyrock willcooke Laney
<Laney> hello!
<seb128> alkisg, did you apt-get update since you installed it? do you have the current appstream version?
<seb128> Laney, doing good today?
<alkisg> seb128: I've apt-get updated, `apt-cache search appstream` shows nothing, is that a package?
<seb128> alkisg, dpkg -l | grep appstream-util
<alkisg> Whoops sorry I ran the previous one in a 12.04 chroot. So, I have "appstream     0.9.1-1ubuntu" but not appstream-util.
<alkisg> Installing...
<seb128> you might not need util
<seb128> and what is after that 1"ubuntu"
<alkisg> It didn't make any changes
<seb128> you cut the part which is interesting
<alkisg> 0.9.1-1ubuntu1, sorry small term
<seb128> that's old
<seb128> we are at 1ubuntu6
<seb128> urg
<seb128> no, sorry
<seb128> what about libappstream-glib8?
 * alkisg apt-get updated a few minutes ago...
<seb128> alkisg, do you get any result if you "appstreamcli search ."?
<alkisg> Yup, I get a lot of results there
<seb128> dpkg -l | grep gnome-software?
<alkisg> libappstream-glib8:i386 0.5.8-1ubuntu6
<seb128> what version do you have for that one?
<alkisg> gnome-software 3.19.5+git20160212.a64f331-0ubuntu1
<seb128> I'm out of ideas sorry
<seb128> maybe Laney has a clue
<seb128> seems to be an issue on the gnome-software side
<alkisg> Do you guys see the software in categories?
<seb128> can you run it with --debug and share the log?
<alkisg> E.g. I have a freshly installed xenial vm, if I just run `apt-get install gnome-software; apt-get update` then I'm supposed to see the software categories etc?
<alkisg> Ah, much better
<alkisg> gnome-software was running as a pid even without a window
<alkisg> So all my tries were relaunching the already running, hidden version of it
 * alkisg sees categories etc now...
<alkisg> (after pkilling it )
<seb128> good
<alkisg> Thank you seb128
<seb128> yw
<Laney> hey, sorry, had a few emails to read ;-)
<Laney> don't like that you have to update another time after installing appstream
<seb128> hey Laney ;-)
<pitti> hey Laney
<seb128> right
 * Laney wonders how to fix that
<seb128> can we make that update a trigger
<Laney> not really
<seb128> or in the postinst or something
<Laney> it's a config file to apt
<alkisg> Apart from that, there was also the problem of gnome-software not really closing when its window is closed
<Laney> to download some more files from the mirror
<Laney> yeah that's a gnome thing, apps do that now
<seb128> alkisg, right, that's worth a bug report
<seb128> I wonder if that's a new gnome thing
<seb128> got similar problems with calendar
<seb128> Laney, do you know why?
<seb128> it means things keep using resources even after being closed
<seb128> that has to be a bug
<seb128> or are we going phone mode and never closing anything and hopping the oom does the job?
<Laney> I don't really know much about it
<alkisg> If ran from the command line, when I close the window, I don't get a prompt, and when I press ctrl+c, the "background process" closes normally, so I'm guessing it's a gtk quit handling issue...
<seb128> or a "feature"
<seb128> but please report a bug about it
<Laney> but it's about single instance
<Laney> hey pitti!
<darkxst> hey desktopers
<seb128> Laney, is gnome-software supposed to use the same screenshots data than software-center?
<willcooke> hey darkxst, how goes?
<seb128> Laney, e.g https://screenshots.debian.net
<seb128> ?
<seb128> hey darkxst
<Laney> I think it can fall back to that but upstream are supposed to supply them but also ximion mentioned that he needs to fix something to do with screenshots
<darkxst> hey willcooke, Im good again now!
<willcooke> darkxst, glad to hear it :)
<darkxst> Laney, what are the icon requirements for appstream? must have 64x or anything higher?
<Laney> higher is ok
<darkxst> Laney, gnome-weather has 256x but is still failing
<darkxst> willcooke, the side effects from the miracle drugs are crap!
<Laney> darkxst: lemme see
<darkxst> Laney, thanks
<willcooke> seb128, Laney - I've noticed some lag in the loading of the icons in categories.  Is that normal?  Oh, actually - no, today its fine.  Ignore
<seb128> willcooke, I didn't notice it
<willcooke> seb128, seems ok today.  Might be a first run thing I guess.  I'll see if I can reproduce it, but I don't think its a big issue
<seb128> the UI feels responsive and looks ok
<seb128> I miss being able to sort categories by rating though
<willcooke> I *really* like it so far
<seb128> I wonder if that should be the default?
<willcooke> I think alphabetical should be the default
<willcooke> but a rating sort order would be really handy
<seb128> hum
<seb128> for me it doesn't get added to the unity dash "most recently used"
<seb128> even after killing the service
<seb128> I wonder if that has to do with the service mode
<willcooke> same here
<willcooke> oh
 * Sweet5hark1 is feeling so snappy today. dunno why.
<Laney> schnappi
 * Sweet5hark1 thows some red meat in the air for Laney to fetch ...
<seb128> lol
<willcooke> Sweet5hark1, breakfast wine is the answer
<seb128> is that a thing?
<willcooke> it is in my house today
 * seb128 would rather go for the whisky in the coffee
<willcooke> :D
<seb128> :-)
<Sweet5hark1> wine? Ok, Im going with a Tullibardine 228 Burgundy Finish. There is burgundy in it, so it qualifies as wine on my book.
<willcooke> it's all just fruit juice
 * willcooke goes for a top up
<Laney> darkxst: haha
<Laney> "            # FIXME: Do we support icon names which contain a dot?
<Laney> "
<darkxst> Laney, oh right, wtf!
<Laney> "ummmmmmmmmmmm, yes please"
<darkxst> Laney, I'll send them a whipping, though tomorrow, sleep now
<Laney> darkxst: looking at the code
<Laney> oh
<Laney> ximion is here!
<Laney> ximion: looking at https://appstream.debian.org/html/sid/main/issues/gnome-weather.html and http://appstream.ubuntu.com/xenial/universe/issues/gnome-weather.html - seems you have a fail-fast path if the icon filename contains a '.'
<seb128> Laney, so screenshots, I guess it has some support because it displays the widget just says the image is invalid when there is/should be one
<Laney> which breaks this case
<Laney> it does
<seb128> where for some others it doesn't display the widget
<Laney> just needs some kind of fixing
<seb128> yeah
<Laney> no worries
<seb128> also it seems there is still the bug about it considering packages third party non free
<seb128> robert had an upload to fix that I think, I guess it doesn't work/needs more fixing
<ximion> Laney: heh, I even knew about that when writing the code, but assumed there were no apps having dots in their icon filename... So, again, more complexity is needed in the icon handler
<ximion> I'll fix that in a few minutes
<Laney> ximion: can you make the check smarter or just delete it?
<Laney> ximion: also another check needed for ubuntu contents files, pr coming up :)
<Laney> and hey, :)
<Laney> how's deutschland today?
<ximion> Laney: I need to make that check smarter, removing it will break a lot more other apps
<ximion> the icon stuff is really dumb ^^
<ximion> great and sunny :) - I'm not at the lab today, which is why you find me online :D
<ximion> (at this time)
<Laney> \o\
<ximion> Laney: what would be more important for Ubuntu in terms of metadata: having font components in the AppStream metadata, or having information about which software is localized in which language to what percent?
<Laney> ximion: what does gnome-software know how to deal with?
<ximion> the latter is so complex on Debian based systems, I am not sure if the additional processing effort would be worth the potential gain - on Fedora, this is a bit easier to implement, since they don't split the software into so many binary packages
<ximion> (unless it's LaTeX, there they seem to go nuts)
<Laney> you would parse the .mo files or something?
<ximion> Laney: yes and possibly other formats - problem is, I need to find them too, which means another call to the Contents list and extracting even more packages, and the package extraction is the really expensive thing
<ximion> I am actually thinking about rewriting some of those performance-critical things in C and have Python call that code... Not 100% sure about that yet, though, since python-apt also hooks into what is mostly C++ code
<ximion> GS can handle both
<ximion> but only uses the l10n data for sorting, and I think it also sometimes displays an "available in your language" badge
<Laney> I guess you would want to factor out the contents handling
<Laney> there is scope for modularisation here
<ximion> problem is, that if a binary uses 10% of it's srings from its own gettext domain, but the other 90% come from shared libraries, it's impossible to give an accurate measurement of localization
<tjaalton> willcooke, seb128: there is one blocker with nvidia still holding back the new xserver, so maybe I need to file a FFE bug?
<ximion> Laney: reading any .deb file data is by far the most expensive task, followed by reading the Contents.gz files, followed by reading other Packages.gz and supplimentary data - that are the big cost items, at least, there are a few smaller ones which sum up since they're called often
<ximion> but not as much as .deb file reading, which is both expensive and called always
<Laney> that's unavoidably expensive
<ximion> Laney: btw, when you boostrap a new architecture or suite using the generator, you can now use the prepopulate-cache action, which will at least set the packages which definitely have no interesting data to ignore
<ximion> that speeds up the initial processing run massively
<Laney> nice
<ximion> but requires that your contents file is up2date, otherwise you will loose information
<ximion> exists for a while now, but I didn't document it yet, to search for issues
<Laney> I reckon we could make use of a copy-suite action too
<Laney> since our new releases start out as copies
 * desrt yawns
<ximion> Laney: that should work out of the box, since the database doesn't know about suites at all
<ximion> only about package versions, so when a new suite is added, it will only process the package versions it doesn't know yet and skip the rest
<ximion> (= take the very same data)
<Laney> why do you need the prepopulate thing then?
<ximion> only when you deleted the cache or when you add a new architecture, which brings in tons of new package/version/arch combinations
<ximion> (when I want to reprocess everything, it's really useful)
<ximion> a delete-by-tag command will also be nice in future
<Laney> I wrote a script to do that
 * Laney is cool
 * Laney PRs
<willcooke> tjaalton, seb128 - ack
<pitti> Laney: do you still remember the bugzillla # about "double-click in terminal doesn't select URLs any more"?
<pitti> AFAIR upstream considered that a feature, not a bug
<Laney> pitti: my awesome bar seems to have forgotten about it
<pitti> mine too :/
<Laney> I use right click -> copy url
<pitti> Laney: I found https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=640727, but that's older and the inverse problem
<ubot5> Gnome bug 640727 in general "Links having a colon in the middle are not selected completely" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<seb128> tjaalton, wfm, should be easy to get
<pitti> Laney: oh, bug 1501250 and that links to the upstream bug
<ubot5> bug 1501250 in Gnome Virtual Terminal Emulator "double clicking on a URL drops the protocol from the URL" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1501250
<Laney> ah
<Laney> I was searching for 'select'
<tjaalton> willcooke, seb128: another update I'd like to get in is mesa 11.2, which will release -rc1 tomorrow and final around Mar 11th. then it would still get first or maybe even second bugfix pointrelease before final freeze
<tjaalton> i'll push rc1 in the staging ppa
<ximion> Laney: I dropped the dot-check afterall, there is no way to implement this safely if we assume that dots in icon filenames are common
<ximion> btw, the Contents.gz of unstable should be included on Ubuntu even when main is processed, AFAIK
<Laney> ximion: that's what I thought, either that or do a check for the filename + extensions which would be expensive and this is supposed to be a fail fast case - thanks!
<Laney> ximion: universe?
<Laney> it is - but we can't read it because of that bug
<ximion> ah, then it's good that this is fixed now, thanks!
<willcooke> tjaalton, thanks
<ximion> well, if we check against a list of filenames, we still get and error, because ".Application" isn't recognized as allowed icon filetype
<willcooke> interesting:  https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=815006
<ubot5> Debian bug 815006 in iceweasel "Renaming Iceweasel to Firefox" [Normal,Open]
<desrt> good morning everyone
<desrt> willcooke: looks mostly like compromise from the debian side to me
<Laney> hey hey desrt
<willcooke> hi desrt, still suffering with jetlag?
<desrt> suffering?
<desrt> THIS IS AWESOME
<willcooke> hehe!
<desrt> if i knew what waking up at 6am was like i would have been doing it all along!
<desrt> (...until next week when i finally give out)
<Laney> haha
<Laney> if only waking up at 6am was like that normally
<desrt> the key to waking up at 6 is going to bed at 10
<desrt> which, so far, has not been too big of a problem
<desrt> once that starts slipping, i'm doomed
<desrt> " In case of derivatives of Debian, Firefox branding can be used as long as the patches applied are in the same category as described above. "
<desrt> that's a pretty weak statement from mozilla, and it's surprising to see debian change their position based on that
<desrt> considering "in the same category" in this case means "architecture-specific portability patches"
<desrt> good to see debian back off a bit on this issue, in any case... some moderation here is probably not a bad thing
<Laney> what's the argument
<Laney> it's okay because if we needed to rename we could do it?
<desrt> the argument is (seemingly) that mozilla released a friendly (albeit weak and vague) statement toward debian so we should all feel nice
<desrt> indeed it would have been nice if they had included something along the lines of "we guarantee that we will never ask you to change the branding of firefox in a stable release or after feature freeze" or something like that
<desrt> but they didn't do that
<desrt> but this was never the original argument (at least as far as i understood it)... it was about the fact that even if mozilla was happy about debian's usage, it's clear that they may have become unhappy about derivative usage if that usage made more substantive changes to firefox... which was a restriction that debian saw as out of step with the DFSG
<desrt> this remains completely unaddressed except by that one sentence about "derivatives can do the same stuff that you've been doing"... which is not much...
<desrt> of course mozilla is no bully here... they need to protect their mark, and there are real cases of people abusing firefox's reputation to harm users in the real world... it's always been about how "morally flexible" debian is willing to be with the letter of the law in order to do something that is clearly moral in spirit
<desrt> and that, more than anything else, seems to be what is changing here.  an interesting development.
<Laney> there was a specific problem originally about some patches Debian made - Mozilla themselves explicitly revoked trademark permission
<Laney> 10 years ago-ish
<desrt> outright, or as an ultimatum?
<Laney> it was a bug report like "hi, I'm from mozilla, please rename your package"
<desrt> it was thunderbird, fwiw
<desrt> and it was mike connor.  nice.
<Laney> Don't see why this couldn't happen all over again
<Laney> I can see the arguments that it is in line with the DFSG
<Laney> but seems annoying nonetheless
<desrt> mozilla has said almost nothing that changes the situation
<Laney> presumably a part of this is that the maintainer works for mozilla now
<desrt> perfect.  put a mozilla employee in charge of packaging and move it to non-free.  problem solved :D
 * Sweet5hark1 spills some oil into the discussion with: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/TDF/Policies/Trademark_Policy#Use for comparision.
 * ogra_ checks if he accidentially ended up in #ubuntu-legal
<Laney> we're about as well informed as debian-legal :P
<Sweet5hark1> lets retroactively establish IANAL as an acronym for "I am not a layman" and sue everyone based in common law countries over legal advise!
<Laney> seb128: looks like we managed the webkit switch in one image
<Laney> want to do some hardcore demoting?
 * desrt renames her fork to Liberated OpenLibreOffice
<seb128> Laney, great, well done! sure I can do that ;-)
<Laney> woot
<Laney> now something weird has happened in this glib release
<Laney> /usr/bin/install -c ./libglib-gdb.py /<<PKGBUILDDIR>>/debian/install/deb/usr/share/gdb/auto-load/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libglib-2.0.so.0.4706.0-gdb.py
<Laney> nice path
<Laney> but looks like it is actually right!
<Laney> !!!
 * willcooke late lunches
<seb128> Laney, sphinx didn't migrate yet so not much demotion
<seb128> mitya57, ^ are you looking at that one?
<mitya57> seb128, not yet, will look now
<seb128> mitya57, thanks
<seb128> happyaron, hey, do we need fcitx to recommends fcitx-frontend-all? could we limit the recommends to (gtk2)gtk3&qt5?
<mitya57> seb128, Laney: uploaded pyresample with fixed tests which should unblock sphinx
<seb128> Mirv, mitya57, Laney, willcooke, what do you think about making indicator-appmenu stop recommending appmenu-qt and unseeding sni-qt but make those rather a recommends from some qt4 binary? it looks like we could get qt4 out of the iso/default installation
<seb128> mitya57, great, thanks!
<mitya57> seb128, +1 to this idea
<mitya57> Though, from Qt we can recommend sni-qt but it would be a bit ugly to recommend appmenu-qt (which is the server side of SNI spec)
 * willcooke checks rdepends on qt4
<seb128> willcooke, on the iso it's only fcitx/appmenu/sni
<willcooke> oh, cool
<seb128> which are integration with qt4 softwares, so not needed if there is no qt4 applications
<willcooke> sorry, I got distracted and forgot I was supposed to be looking at that
<seb128> yeah, I sort of forgot too
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> then +1
<willcooke> thx
<seb128> but we got a part of the qt4 stack uninstalled today with the software-center drop since that took off the ubuntuone package that was still using qt
<seb128> which made me look at the remaining items
<seb128> mitya57, yeah, I don't have a good idea, we don't have a way to state "install that if unity is installed"
<seb128> we could let to users to install those but most wouldn't and wouldn't have correct integration
<seb128> (have to go pick up somebody, bbiab)
<mitya57> OK, I guess it's not a problem to add a recommends on appmenu-qt, at least for LTS
<mitya57> If it's recommends, it's easy for users to avoid installing it if they don't want to.
<seb128> right
<andyrock> anyone managed to install gnome-software from sources?
<andyrock> i used to be able before
<andyrock> but now i cant' install apps with my own g-s
<andyrock> i get "installation failed" even if the app has been installed
<Mirv> seb128: getting qt4 out would be very nice, I agree
<pitti> wow, so software-center fell off the image? nice, congrats!
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> good work team!
<Laney> it was more pushed
<Laney> (seed change
<Laney> )
<andyrock> seb128: g-s is going to use aptd to install/remove/etc things right?
<willcooke> seb128, should g-s be added to the launcher by default?  (I dont think it is atm)
<willcooke> Laney, do you know how the "editor picks" work?
<Laney> I think they are hardcoded
<willcooke> so they'll always be the same?
<willcooke> I wonder if we can mix that up, or indeed become "the editor" ourselves on a rotational basis :)
<Laney> I would imagine that you would want to make it possible to change it externally
<willcooke> I'll open a bug with some thoughts
<Laney> Looks like plugins can influence this list
<willcooke> ah nice
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1547095
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1547095 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Featured and Editors Picks are hard-coded" [Undecided,New]
<robert_ancell> Sweet5hark, is bug 958345 resolved for LO?
<ubot5> bug 958345 in ttf-indic-fonts (Ubuntu) "ttf-indic-fonts packages are outdated" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/958345
<robert_ancell> I *think* it is
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: sorry, will look at in 60 minutes -- in a call now
<seb128> andyrock, yeah, it's using aptd, but better to ask robert_ancell about details
<seb128> willcooke, yeah, good point for the launcher
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey, g-s still seems to think that all softwares are third-party/non-free, did your fix still work for you? also is that normal/known that none of the "translated/documented/integrated with the system" seem ever acked?
<willcooke> seb128, I'll open a bug
<seb128> robert_ancell, also the "updated" and "license" are unknown
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, the third party thing is known - we need to mark things that come from main/universe. I have a couple of solutions, not sure how reliable they are. The non-free is because we don't know the licenses. That could come from appstream or we could just mark main/universe as "Open Source". The translated/documented/integrated come from appstream.
<robert_ancell> They're all fixable I think, though the solution might just be to hide them.
<robert_ancell> Please file bugs if not there already.
<seb128> k
<willcooke> robert_ancell, do you know if there is anywhere in g-s to show prices?
<willcooke> I assume not since most things will be assumed to be free
<robert_ancell> willcooke, G-S has no concept of prices.
<seb128> robert_ancell, willcooke, is that only me who find the "was this review useful" and "report abuse" buttons to be given too much importance?
<robert_ancell> seb128, Yeah, I see that too - ask aday
<seb128> like they are quite noticable but I would assume they are not the most used thing in comments
<robert_ancell> They were designed / added by GNOME
<seb128> k
<seb128> would you usually ask on IRC or file a bug?
<robert_ancell> seb128, bug then IRC/email
<seb128> k
<seb128> thanks
<robert_ancell> aday seems very busy, so I never see him online
<seb128> robert_ancell, oh, also do you know if it's normal that gnome-software doesn't exit on close?
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, it seems to run some sort of service for noticing upgrades. We should probably disable that (there's a bug on LP relating to that dialog)
<seb128> k
<seb128> it's especially annoying because it makes the unity dash not list it
<seb128> well I assume it's due to that, at least if it's running the dash stop listing it
<seb128> but it's not in the most recently used even after closing so there might be something else
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, I thinking these feature can all be fixed between FF and UI Freeze
<seb128> right
<seb128> even after uif
<seb128> those are mostly bugfixes
<robert_ancell> seb128, did you have any info on the desirability of the offline updates?
<seb128> robert_ancell, I think it would be considered a good improvement
<seb128> how easy would it be to enable?
<robert_ancell> seb128, do you know if it works on Ubuntu
<robert_ancell> seb128, it's there, but I don't know if it works
<seb128> willcooke might know better about partner/design opinion on the topic
<seb128> I've no idea
<seb128> I can try to play with that tomorrow though
<robert_ancell> I figure we either fix/support it or disable the button
<seb128> maybe Laney knows
<robert_ancell> It does somewhat overlap with update-manager
<seb128> it's quite a big change
<seb128> unsure it's safe to include now for the LTS
<seb128> but it could be nice to have it working on possible to turn on
<seb128> maybe some oem images would do that
<willcooke> sorry, what is offline updates?
<seb128> willcooke, windows style, apply them on shutdown/reboot
<Laney> it uses some systemd thing
<Laney> don't know if that is set up for us
<seb128> pitti, ^ do you know if that should work on deb/ubuntu?
<Laney> but the idea is a sound one imo
<seb128> willcooke, https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/OfflineSystemUpdates
<seb128> willcooke, that basically solve all the issue of doing in session updates/replaces things being in use under their feet
<willcooke> just reading it now
<willcooke> so the issue is that the UI which handles this is not Ubu-themed?
<seb128> I guess that's one
<seb128> I would be more concerned about the fact that it's quite a workflow change and a new untested stack handling your updates
<seb128> thinking about it, that feels risky to do by default
<robert_ancell> willcooke, the issue is A: there is a button in GNOME Software, but not in update manager (Do we add one). And B: Don't know if there's work required to make it work
<seb128> you don't want to have LTS updates handled by some new untested stack
<willcooke> ohhhh
<willcooke> sure why not
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, that was my feeling, unless someone has more experience to tell us otherwise
<willcooke> JOKE!!!
<willcooke> I crack myself up.
<seb128> lol
<seb128> robert_ancell, I would say to not bother for ff and not do it by default
<robert_ancell> willcooke, I heard your stress levels were too low, opt in for some more features!
<willcooke> Sounds like something for 16.10 to me
<willcooke> robert_ancell, :D:D:D
<seb128> but getting it to work for those who want to opt in would be nice
<willcooke> see the conversation about breakfast wine from earlier on
<seb128> willcooke, robert_ancell, I can see that as a nice thing oems install might want to opt in
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah
<robert_ancell> Perhaps a gsettings key will be enough
<seb128> well maybe it get enough testing and it's something we feel safe tell them they can use by LTS .3 or something
<seb128> like get opt in from tech users
<seb128> see how it goes
<willcooke> right, is it something which we could sru?  sounds like yes
<seb128> and it if it goes well we can decide to enable later
<willcooke> sounds wise to me
<mdeslaur> ugh, offline updates mean users don't get timely security updates
<Laney> as opposed to thinking they have them because they've installed by not restarted
<Laney> offline updates mean you know you have all updates applied
<mdeslaur> and waiting for your laptop to shutdown like windows is a pretty awful user experience
<mdeslaur> Laney: pff
 * Laney just yesterday did a stupid update and restart services dance for glibc
<willcooke> ohhhhhh
<willcooke> thats what I was supposed to do this morning
<mdeslaur> now that every other platform has live app updates, let's try and not regress to 1999 with an update on shutdown scenario :P
<Laney> it's for system components, which other platforms do offline
<seb128> so it only suggest it when you have a need-reboot package?
<Laney> and it's restart & update, not update & shutdown
<mdeslaur> ugh, even worse
<Laney> whatever
<Laney> bye
<mdeslaur> hehe
<seb128> I hate it on windows as well
<seb128> last time I want to play a game I ended up having to wait for windows to finish applying updates
<seb128> and 1h30 later it was too late to play
<seb128> FAIL
<Laney> have you tried this implementation?
<Laney> either of you
<seb128> no, that was the start of the question, asking if it's supposed to work/if we can try it
<mdeslaur> isn't it what fedora does?
<mdeslaur> or is it different?
<seb128> also I was commenting on the concept of blocking the computer to do updates
<seb128> I don't need to try it to know that it's time I can't use the machine :p
<seb128> but yeah, maybe it takes less than 15s and it's fine
<seb128> need to play with it to see ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, Laney, willcooke, reading the fedora wiki, there is at least a part which is implemented in packagekit so unsure it's going to work with aptdaemon
<Laney> I bet it requires pk 1.0
<Laney> it's like -> tell systemd to boot into some target
<seb128> wiki says 0.8.1
<Laney> -> in that target do the update
<Laney> -> restart
<Laney> nice
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> thing is we can't co-install packagekit and aptdaemon
<seb128> and I guess aptdaemon doesn't implement those functions
<seb128> so not going to work
<Laney> it's probably just a dist-upgrade in that target
<Laney> guessing
<Laney> ...pkcompat must do that...
<seb128> I'm going to give it a try after ff ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, I think we *can* install aptdaemon and PackageKit 1.0, as long as we remove the PackageKit compatibility layer from aptdaemon
<Laney> rrrrrrrright, laters
<seb128> Laney, bye
<robert_ancell> Laney, cya
<robert_ancell> Laney, nice work on the appstream stuff btw!
<seb128> robert_ancell, right, which start sounding like too risky/much work for this cycle
<robert_ancell> seb128, exactly
<seb128> so yeah
<seb128> 16.10 thing then
<robert_ancell> yes
<robert_ancell> Unless fairies and unicorns solve the issues
<robert_ancell> (I'm out of those at the moment)
<Sweet5hark> re
<seb128> wb
<Sweet5hark> robert_ancell: thx wrt bug 958345 -- resolved now.
<ubot5> bug 958345 in ttf-indic-fonts (Ubuntu) "ttf-indic-fonts packages are outdated" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/958345
<Sweet5hark> (for libreoffice)
<robert_ancell> seb128, can you remove from the archive?
<robert_ancell> Could you look at ^^ and remove those old font packages
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok
<robert_ancell> willcooke, if you ever find yourself writing "should" in a bug title I'd say you need to reword it :)
<seb128> that's what mpt said iirc
<seb128> not sure I agree with that :p
<robert_ancell> seb128, it makes the description unnecessarily longer (harder to parse) and it implies you have already decided the solution rather  than stating the problem
<seb128> well, sort of
<seb128> the first part is right
<seb128> but like "shouldn't segfault on invalid password" is not really something you decided the solution on
<willcooke> robert_ancell, ack :)
<seb128> sure it could be worded "segfaults on invalid password"
<robert_ancell> In that case the solution is (probably) obvious, but the later description is better
<robert_ancell> The "should" discourages thinking about alternative solutions
<seb128> I tend to word things with "should" because I find it more "polite" I think
<seb128> but that's probably a personal/non native speaker issue :p
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, I was thinking it might be that. To me "should" can be taken aggressively / be seen as arrogant
<robert_ancell> For example "GNOME Software should support the display of prices for purchasing software" says we have to modify GNOME Software in a specific way. The issue is "Support purchasing software" which could potentially be solved in other ways / codebases.
<seb128> to me should says "it would be nice"
<seb128> where the direct form is more an order
<seb128> like "do that"
<robert_ancell> seb128, that's the literal translation, but if I said to you "You should leave the room" it's quite an assertive statement.
<seb128> right
<robert_ancell> I'm not really giving you a choice.
<seb128> but people don't use should that way in bug titles
<seb128> or that's not the most common case
<seb128> they tend use it for e.g "should give better feedback about foo"
<seb128> to say "having better feedback would be nice"
<robert_ancell> My interpretation is the more agressive one. Of course that will vary. But also Engineers aren't known for having the best communication skills.
<seb128> but yeah, I see your point
<seb128> right
<seb128> point taken, you are probably right ;-)
<seb128> language is hard! :p
<robert_ancell> Yes.
<robert_ancell> It's not as tightly defined as code.
<tjaalton> robert_ancell: hi, does lightdm do some autoscaling in xenial, or is it unity-greeter?
<robert_ancell> tjaalton, that would be unity-greeter
<tjaalton> alright, thx
<seb128> tjaalton, you are going to say that the transition to the desktop doesn't look right? ;-)
<tjaalton> seb128: that too, everything looks tiny
<tjaalton> and scaling in the session doesn't work
<seb128> how doesn't work?
<tjaalton> moving the slider does nothing
<seb128> wth?
<seb128> wfm
<tjaalton> is it logged somewhere?
<seb128> what logged? unity?
<seb128> .cache/upstart
<tjaalton> yeah
<tjaalton> of course..
<seb128> hum, I tried  rhythmbox-plugin-alternative-toolbar  to reproduce a rb segfault (just uploaded a fix for that)
<seb128> their toolbar layout is actually nice
 * willcooke installs
<seb128> willcooke, you can enable it in the tools->plugins
<seb128> but there are segfault when you try to play (fixed with the libdmapsharing upload I just did)
<willcooke> changes the plugins window too
<seb128> yeah
<willcooke> no seg fault here on play
<seb128> but it's more the top bar which I like
<willcooke> yeah
<seb128> oh, you probably need daap enable for that to matter
<willcooke> ah
<seb128> that's where the segfault is
<seb128> anyway the default toolbar feels clumsy
<seb128> like different height for the widgets
<seb128> that one looks nice, though the artwork is a big small
<willcooke> yeah
<willcooke> although I just hit a situation where I couldnt open the plugins window without a restart
<seb128> right, if you enable/disable it seems to go wrong
<seb128> like probably something unrefed uncorrectly on unload
<willcooke> just added the vol slider in options too
<willcooke> nice
<seb128> I wonder if we should do that by default
<seb128> feels much nicer to me
<willcooke> and disable "enhanced plug ins dialogue"
<willcooke> not so keen on the "modern" option
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> what I like is just to have everything in the toolbar at the same height
<willcooke> yeah
<willcooke> me too
<willcooke> ship it
<seb128> feels much better
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> going to have a look to that before uif
<willcooke> :) thx
<tjaalton> seb128: looks like display scaling not working might be an xserver 1.18 thing, need to double check that :/
<seb128> tjaalton, urg, good that you catched it then!
<seb128> caught even
<tjaalton> that might actually also be why nvidia prime fails
<tjaalton> if something broke in randr
<tjaalton> does gnome have a similar scaling thingy?
<tjaalton> gsettings should work
<tjaalton> I'll test that too..
<seb128> you can also GDK_SCALE=2 gedit
<tjaalton> haha, ouch
<tjaalton> good to know :)
<tjaalton> that seems to work with 1.18
<seb128> the unity scaling is not relying on gtk
<seb128> well at least the unity custom elements
<seb128> like panel, indicator, etc have some gtk
<seb128> Trevinho might know better if you need specific/that's something you try to debug
<tjaalton> ok I'll ask tomorrow
<willcooke> seb128, @ alternative tool bar - looks a bit odd when playing a track with a long title: http://i.imgur.com/iW9jKc4.png
<seb128> Sweet5hark, libreoffice bug #958345 is not fixed, http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/ubuntu.xenial/rdepends/ttf-indic-fonts/ttf-indic-fonts-core
<ubot5> bug 958345 in ttf-indic-fonts (Ubuntu) "ttf-indic-fonts packages are outdated should be removed" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/958345
<seb128> Sweet5hark, e.G libreoffice-l10n-bn recommends ttf-bengali-fonts which is a binary from ttf-indic-fonts
<seb128> willcooke, right, should probably ellipsize
<willcooke> seb128, also, I miss the "View All" button from the normal toolbar
<willcooke> so if I drill down in to an artist, then I have to scroll back to the top click click on all again
<seb128> willcooke, ctrl-t?
<willcooke> BOOM!
<willcooke> ta
<seb128> yw!
<willcooke> if we do change, I'd vote for that to be on by default (if poss)
<seb128> it's not?
<seb128> I need to try on a fresh install
<seb128> anyway, that's for another day
<seb128> going to have a look in the fridge and think about dinner ;-)
<willcooke> cheers seb128
<Sweet5hark> seb128: k, will fix that tomorrow.
<Sweet5hark> eod
<willcooke> urgh bluetooth device window is uuuuugly
<cyphermox> willcooke: on the phone?
<willcooke> cyphermox, nah, u7 desktop
<willcooke> when you add a device
<cyphermox> ah, yeah, I suppose
<willcooke> no padding around anything by the looks of things
<cyphermox> willcooke: as in the wizard?
<cyphermox> we get all that straight from gnome, in any case.
<willcooke> Bluetooth settings -> Click the + bottom left -> my eyes my eyes
<willcooke> In other news: John McAfee looks like he sleeps in his car.  http://www.businessinsider.com/john-mcafee-ill-decrypt-san-bernardino-phone-for-free-2016-2?IR=T
<willcooke> via Trevinho
<cyphermox> willcooke: oh, the wizard steps are messed up
<cyphermox> willcooke: that applies to the wizard for mobile data connections in nm-connection-editor too
<cyphermox> this is fun, is that theming or straight gtk?
<willcooke> oh yeah
<willcooke> dunno, could just be themeing
<willcooke> I'll ask Seb tomorrow
<davmor2> willcooke: hmmm so the new bar for gnome is the thing that causes the ugly corners right?  I see them on the calendar app :(
<willcooke> davmor2, ugly corners are client side decorations issues.  We have a fix in progress right now
<davmor2> \o/
<willcooke> oh, well, actually, looking at my test machine, it might be fixed
<davmor2> willcooke: I just full-upgraded it isn't here on gedit/calendar but I still need to reboot for the new kernel so I assume I'm still running on old stuff
<willcooke> davmor2, ah yeah, you're right
<willcooke> I'm looking at older apps
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-02-19
<hikiko> Hi
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> Laney: offline updates> is that about installing at shutdown? that's a really bad idea IMHO
<happyaron> morning hikiko, pitti
<hikiko> hi happyaron pitti happy new chinese ywar
<hikiko> year*
<happyaron> ty, :P
<pitti> hey happyaron, hello hikiko!
<happyaron> seb128: hey seb
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey happyaron
<happyaron> fcitx's gtk3 support requires gtk2 one to be present, but qt4 and qt5 are seperate
<happyaron> so you want to drop qt4 from image?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> why does gtk3 requires gtk2 (just curious, we are not going to drop gtk2 this cycle since firefox/libreoffice still use it)
<happyaron> because gtk2/gtk3 share the same environment variable, when the variable is set but gtk2 support isn't present, the user has no way to input anything
<happyaron> I'll propose an MP for dropping qt4 then
<pitti> didrocks: bonjour ! Ã§a va ?
<pitti> didrocks: just FYI: we can now run autopkgtests triggered by github PRs (https://plus.google.com/u/0/+MartinPitti/posts/fjGYfENHo15)
<didrocks> hey pitti, Ã§a va
<didrocks> pitti: oh nice!
<pitti> didrocks: in case this is useful for u-make
<didrocks> pitti: the results point to the artefacts directly?
 * didrocks looks at the post
<pitti> didrocks: took me some time to implement the plumbing etc., but now it should be simple to enable it for more projects
<didrocks> yeah, sounds good! :)
<pitti> didrocks: I send the link to log.gz for now, statuses_url only accepts one result URL
<didrocks> pitti: we should do that on Ubuntu Make after mwc
<pitti> didrocks: yeah, I'll watch systemd PRs for the time beingn, and there's still some small cleanup to be done
<didrocks> great! thanks for the head's up?
<didrocks> s/\?/!/
<Laney> word up ma gangstaz
<happyaron> hey Laney
<willcooke> morning all
<willcooke> tgi Friday
<happyaron> hey willcooke, :)
<seb128> hey Laney willcooke
<seb128> how is u.k today? still holding to the UE?
<Laney> pitti: https://wiki.freedesktop.org/www/Software/systemd/SystemUpdates/
<Laney> hey seb128
 * happyaron supper time
<Laney> oh yeah the news was all about this
<Laney> hey happyaron!
<Laney> the next fun part is that the conservatives get to shit themselves over it for a few months
<willcooke> spent a few hours just playing with 16.04 on my Inspiron last night.  I know it's a fresh vanilla install, but man it felt fast.
<willcooke> Found some bugs too
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> reported them?
<seb128> oh, and which ones? ;-)
<willcooke> not yet, want to check them with you first
<willcooke> it's only a few
<willcooke> and on of them is certainly opinion
<willcooke> *one
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> The first one is the Bluetooth "add a device" windows and the "Set up a mobile broadband connection"
<willcooke> there is no padding it seems.
<willcooke> Is that "just" styling?
<seb128> unsure, needs investigation
<seb128> but it's a gtk thing
<seb128> it does the same in gtk3-demo -> assistant
<willcooke> ah, oki
<willcooke> I'll log it then
<willcooke> which project is best?
<seb128> gtk+3.0
<willcooke> thx
<willcooke> next:
<seb128> yw
<willcooke> In my opinion, when you use the mouse wheel over the playback position indicator in Rb, it goes the wrong way
<willcooke> mouse wheel down goes back, up goes forward
<willcooke> it seems the opposite in 14.04
<seb128> up for forward seems to make sense to me?
<willcooke> I think of it as a long document.  Up to get to the top.
<willcooke> ain't no thing
<willcooke> just opinion
<willcooke> Next:
<willcooke> LibreOffice menus.  The ugly
<willcooke> I'll speak to Bjoern about that when he's on
<seb128> what's wrong with those?
<willcooke> MASSIVE right arrows (to indicate sub menus) , white border around the menu
<seb128> are you menu integrated to unity?
<willcooke> ah, no, that's a good point
<seb128> you likely have libreoffice-gtk3 installed
<seb128> try without it
<seb128> we discussed it the other day, it got pulled in by error, going to be remove in the next upload
<willcooke> yeah, I remember now
<willcooke> thanks
<seb128> yw
<willcooke> and finally :) ...
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, can we drop the default U1 bookmark from Firefox?
<seb128> haha
<willcooke> Ubuntu and Free Software -> Ubuntu One - The personal cloud that brings your digital lif..............  dead
<seb128> willcooke, I think the gtk/padding issue is due to https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk%2B/commit/?id=cfd85de
<seb128> mclasen wrote on https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=750631
<seb128> "Unfortunately, I'm not convinced this is compatible enough - it will visually break quite a few assistants out that that assume the padding."
<ubot5> Gnome bug 750631 in Widget: Other "GtkAssistant: Allow to set a page with no padding" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<seb128> I wonder why he commited anyway
<seb128> sometimes their logic fails me :-/
<pitti> Laney: ah, that's applying them on boot, not on shutdown; that's better IMHO
<seb128> pitti, -1
<pitti> Laney: btw, I didn't yet find out what's up with teh trusty/ppc64el tests (the "libc6 not found blabla")
<seb128> pitti, I like better my laptop to be stucked in the evening when I stop working that having it to block me in the morning when I want to start working
<pitti> on shutdown is just about the worst possible time
<pitti> consider: when do people shut down their computer?
<seb128> like I can walk away and let it shut down 10 minutes later
<pitti> either not at all (suspend) -> then you don't get updates
<seb128> me? every evening after work
<pitti> or, when they actaully want to *leave*
<pitti> the last thing you want to do then is to twiddle your thumbs for 15 minutes
<pitti> yes, me too
<pitti> and when I have to leave, I want to leave *now*, not wait for an indefinite time
<seb128> well, I'm fine walking away knowing the computer is going to turn down after 10 minutes
<pitti> and if your computer is stuck, people will just switch it off
<seb128> there is a chance that you are not taking the computer with you
<seb128> especially on a desktop
<seb128> but when you turn on the computer there is all chances that it's because you want to use it
<seb128> and not sit watching updates being applied
<tjaalton> Trevinho: ping
<pitti> seb128: well, that's cf "no good time"
<seb128> right
<pitti> TBH, I still prefer the in-place updates most
<seb128> in session updates ftw :p
<pitti> it hardly ever breaks even for the devel series
<pitti> and a lot of things change there
<seb128> right
<pitti> for a stable release we don't reorganize files or drop packages or what not
<Laney> you update system libraries and want them to be used
<Laney> that's exactly where the benefit of offline updates lies
<pitti> so holding up the rather theoretic case of "in-place might disrupt your session" against "annoy everyone who wants to leave when they shut down", is a bad trade IMHO
<seb128> seems people are working the reverse way now though
<seb128> they are teaching the kernel to reload bits without reboot
<pitti> Laney: different use case
<Laney> what?
<pitti> Laney: servers and even many laptops are rarely booted
<seb128> ideally you want to never have to reboot
<pitti> so for those, applying them on boot or shutdown doesn't work anyway
<Laney> the option in gnome-software is "restart and upgrade"
<pitti> Laney: that actually sounds like a good solution for interactive upgrades
<pitti> i. e. if you trigger them through a knob, if ubuntu then tells you "you need to reboot to apply this security update", then the user has control over that
<pitti> works less well on servers, of course -- there, doing it in-line is still the least bad way IMHO
<Laney> no
<pitti> (inline and cron'ed)
<Laney> I just got an email fro IS telling me to restart to upgrade glibc
<pitti> yeah, me too (for prodstack)
<Laney> it's the safest way to upgrade libraries
<Laney> doesn't particularly matter at which exact point they are installed
<Laney> the restart is the important bit
<Laney> I should go do that actually O:)
<Laney> good to see that landscape is working
<seb128> :-)
<willcooke> seb128, should I still open a LP bug?
<seb128> willcooke, about libreoffice no, it's being handled, the gtk issue yes please, the rb one ... as you wish but I'm unsure it's a bug, would need to see what other platforms are doing
<willcooke> @ padding ^
<meetingology> willcooke: Error: "padding" is not a valid command.
<seb128> yes
<willcooke> grrrr
<willcooke> lp timeouts
<Laney> hmm, that didn't quite come back up cleanly
<seb128> :-/
<seb128> willcooke, same here
<Laney> missing a line to mount the ceph volume
<seb128> pitti, sorry I probably asked that in the past, but are autopkgtests supposed to autoretrigger on new versions uploads?
<seb128> pitti, like sphinx has failed pyresample and a new pyresample version has been uploaded
<seb128> is it going to retry by itself with the new pyresample?
<pitti> seb128: we want them to, yes, but it's not currently working (there's a bug)
<seb128> or does it need to be manually nudged?
<seb128> k
<seb128> so let me manually retry it then
<seb128> danke
<Laney> https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+git/appstream-cloud/commit/?id=055ab0887fedd8bbfef82751d6c75f106700b964 fix0r3d
<tjaalton> seb128: turns out it's the same commit that broke display scaling,  and lightdm starting with nvidia prime
<seb128> tjaalton, ah, good
<tjaalton> dunno what unity-greeter et al do, but it doesn't bend to randr-1.5
<hikiko> hi
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1547423
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1547423 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) ""Assistant" type window UI components lack padding" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<seb128> hikiko, hey, happy friday!
<willcooke> hikiko, did you fix your computer?
<hikiko> yes willcooke :) in case you have rge same problrm the solution is: boot from somewhere else, run update-gtub and reboot (or copy the conf files and reboot if you boot from flash/live cd)
<hikiko> the*
<hikiko> (becayse it happened after dist-upgrade)
<willcooke> aiieee
<seb128> willcooke, want to try http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/software-properties-gtk_0.96.17_all.deb ?
<willcooke> seb128, sure.  Did you just patch in the padding again?
<seb128> willcooke, no, that's the proposed source thing
<seb128> software-properties
<willcooke> ohhhh
<willcooke> sorry, didnt read that
<seb128> sorry, I didn't give you context ;-)
<willcooke> I should have read it
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> seb128, perfect :)
<tjaalton> is Trevinho out today?
<willcooke> tjaalton, no, just starting later
<tjaalton> ok
<Laney> he'll be working alllllllll night long (all night)
<willcooke> \o\ /o/
<Laney> (supergreen)
<willcooke> TIL: Emeinmen sampled a 70s track for "My name is"
<Laney> MULTIPASS
<willcooke> https://youtu.be/xKISdd2mKzU?t=124
<willcooke> So Ubuntu Firefox bookmarks are done in a patch.  Should I make a patch for that patch, or just a whole new patch file?
<Laney> I would branch the bzr repository and make the fix in there, then merge propose that
<willcooke> Laney, ack, thanks
<Laney> which seems to be lp:~mozillateam/firefox/firefox.xenial
<willcooke> yay!
<willcooke> I got the right one
<Laney> looks like Vcs-Bzr in debian/control.in debian/control says wily though, you could fix that while you're there
<Laney> ;-)
<willcooke> Laney, just a simple substitution for xenial?
<Laney> ya
<Laney> it makes apt-cache showsrc firefox show the wrong thing
<willcooke> done
<seb128> willcooke, https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/software-properties/newtab-enable-proposed/+merge/286626
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<seb128> yw
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, check it!  https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/firefox/bookmark-and-control-changes/+merge/286627
<willcooke> http://cdn.meme.am/instances/500x/62614952.jpg
<willcooke> ohhh
<willcooke> I think I proposed it in the wrong place
<willcooke> undo undo
<chrisccoulson> willcooke, you proposed it in the right place, but from the wrong branch :)
<willcooke> ohhh
<willcooke> so I need to take the main firefox branch?
<willcooke> not the xenial one
<chrisccoulson> willcooke, yeah, that's the one that we build nightlies from and where I pick changes to other branches from
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, https://code.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-trunk.head ?
<chrisccoulson> well, when we're actually able to build nightlies
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's the one
<willcooke> thx
<Laney> you should put something in README.source
<Laney> or fix Vcs-Bzr
<willcooke> you = me ?
<Laney> the maintainer :)
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, fixed: https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/firefox/bookmarks-update/+merge/286633
<seb128> willcooke, I reported the gtkassistant padding issue as https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=762315
<ubot5> Gnome bug 762315 in Widget: Other "Assistant pages have no padding which looks weird" [Normal,New]
<seb128> I've the feeling they are going to say that all the gtkassistant consumer needs to be "fixed"
<seb128> well they at least need to fix gtk-demo in this case
<seb128> but another annoying case of slight behaviour change which breaks existing softwares
<willcooke> yeah
<willcooke> Should I start adding the padding back in now?
<willcooke> ignore, I read the bug
<Trevinho> tjaalton: hey
<tjaalton> Trevinho: display scaling is broken with xserver 1.18 and I bisected the commit to https://cgit.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/commit/?id=7e1f86d42b54fb7f6492875e47a718eaeca3069b
<tjaalton> Trevinho: so I guess unity needs some fixing?
<tjaalton> the same commit also broke nvidia prime (greeter crashes)
<tjaalton> or is it u-s-d
<tjaalton> that needs something
<Trevinho> tjaalton: mh. Well unity handles the scaling by its own, so... What you mean by "broken"?
<Trevinho> There's no automatic recognition?
<Sweet5hark> seb128: in case you didnt notice the MIR/team-subscriptions thing on bug 1487148 started a nice bikeshed ... justsaying ...
<ubot5> bug 1487148 in fonts-stix (Ubuntu) "[MIR] fonts-stix -- to replace xfonts-mathml" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1487148
<tjaalton> Trevinho: using the slider does nothing
<Trevinho> Well, that's pretty weird since that has nothing to do with X....
<Trevinho> It's just a GSetting we listen and then we resize the UI based on that
<Trevinho> what could be... Is the name of the montitors that have changed
<tjaalton> right
<Trevinho> what's the output for gsettings get com.ubuntu.user-interface scale-factor ?
<Trevinho> once you changed the scaling?
<Trevinho> So maybe there's a mismatch between them... I really wanted to change this thing anyway (so using the edid, instead of plug names). So... Maybe it's the right moment
<tjaalton> I think the names lost the dash
<Trevinho> So the problem might be caused by a mismatch of what GdkScreen returns and the gnome_rr code which we use to set these at U-C-C level
<desrt> moin
<tjaalton> Trevinho: {'HDMI2': 8, 'eDP-1': 12, 'eDP1': 10, 'eDP-0': 11}
<andyrock> morning
<willcooke> morning desrt andyrock
<desrt> greetings willcooke, andyrock
<desrt> happy friday :)
<tjaalton> Trevinho: reset to defaults, then munged it a bit and now it's "{'eDP-0': 18}"
<Trevinho> mh, ok, so let me see something else
<Trevinho> tjaalton: what you get instead with python -c 'from gi.repository import Gdk; print(Gdk.Screen.get_default().get_monitor_plug_name(0))' ?
<Trevinho> or change the plug name based on what you're using
<tjaalton> "None"
<Trevinho> Mh, nice
<Trevinho> maybe gdk has to be fixed then?
<Trevinho> tjaalton I guess print(Gdk.Screen.get_default().get_n_monitors())' gives you the right output, isn't it?
<tjaalton> "1"
<Trevinho> yeah, and so python -c 'from gi.repository import Gdk; print(Gdk.Screen.get_default().get_monitor_geometry(0).width)' I guess
<Trevinho> I think gdk has some troubles with that then
<tjaalton> "3200" so yes :)
<tjaalton> where's gdk these days?
<tjaalton> ah, gtk
<Trevinho> https://github.com/GNOME/gtk/blob/master/gdk/gdkscreen.c
<Trevinho> well, actually.. https://github.com/GNOME/gtk/blob/master/gdk/x11/gdkscreen-x11.c
<Trevinho> (or in gnome git)
<tjaalton> yep
<tjaalton> no updates upstream
<Trevinho> tjaalton: I think init_randr15 has to be fixed to set plug_name
<Trevinho> output_name actually
<Trevinho> This is what is set for randr 1.3 http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/15130288/ and this is for randr15... http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/15130291/ Something is missing
<tjaalton> hmm I was looking at the wrong file from git..
<tjaalton> but all commits from master seem to be there
<Trevinho> tjaalton: what you mean?
<tjaalton> nevermind, our gtk is patched with the top commit from master to that file
<Trevinho> tjaalton: when is new server supposed to land?
<tjaalton> Trevinho: when this is fixed :)
<tjaalton> it's in ppa:canonical-x/x-staging
<Trevinho> tjaalton: so... fixing gdk would be nice...
<Trevinho> tjaalton: is there a ppa or something I can use?
<Trevinho> without rebuilding x
<tjaalton> 13:56 < tjaalton> it's in ppa:canonical-x/x-staging
<tjaalton> I need to head off soon
<tjaalton> Trevinho: should I file a bug upstream?
<tjaalton> I don't mind if you have time to look at it :)
<Trevinho> tjaalton: well, I can look at it, but not sure I can today...
<willcooke> http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/2016-02/19/virgin-galactic-spaceshiptwo-space-unveiling
<seb128> Sweet5hark, we subscribed desktop-bugs so it should be good anyway, right?
<andyrock> seb128: where should i propose a debian patch for gnome-software?
<seb128> andyrock, Debian or Ubuntu? what does it do
<seb128> Debian BTS & launchpad is probably best
<andyrock> Ubuntu
<andyrock> integration with unity-launcher on the apt plugin
<andyrock> *in the
<tjaalton> Trevinho: ok, I'll file it upstream
<andyrock> i cannot find the branch in launchpad
<Sweet5hark> seb128: yeah
<Trevinho> tjaalton: ok, post it here as well the
<Trevinho> then*
<tjaalton> sure
<seb128> andyrock, launchpad then
<Laney> robert_ancell has a branch on gnome git
<seb128> andyrock, ^
<Laney> so probably supply a format-patch on top of that
<andyrock> oki
<andyrock> thanks
<Laney> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-software/log/?h=wip/rancell/apt
<Laney> or I guess just push your own branch if you have commit there and ask him to merge it
<seb128> woot, new gstreamer tarballs!
<seb128> and slomo already uploaded to Debian :-)
<Laney> pitti: is there something wrong with the apt update?
<Laney> you're trying to get 6.6 but 6.7 is latest
<Laney> and the update only shows proposed being fetched
<tjaalton> Trevinho: is this accurate :P https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=762319
<ubot5> Gnome bug 762319 in Backend: X11 "issues with randr 1.5" [Normal,New]
<Sweet5hark> seb128: FWIW, pushed some minor fixes to the libreoffice .deb to a ppa, which should go to xenial (but not on a friday)
<seb128> Sweet5hark, ok
<Sweet5hark> seb128: arrgh, still need to do the indic-fonts-foo
<seb128> Sweet5hark, right
<seb128> Sweet5hark, also you can upload on friday so it builds over the w.e, just tag a bug to block in proposed?
<flexiondotorg_> Trevinho, I've updated a merge proposal as you requested - https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mate-dev/compiz/marco-gsettings/+merge/282882
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg_: thanks
<flexiondotorg_> Trevinho, I aslo have another small one for MATE - https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mate-dev/compiz/fix-1067951/+merge/283039
<willcooke> Trevinho, andyrock hikiko, seb128 - just updated the meeting with a hangout
<Trevinho> willcooke: ah i  was about to ask that
<seb128> willcooke, k
<Sweet5hark> .oO(There is a special place in hell for people who xkcd927 "abbreviations" for l10n .... "nono, in addition to the full name and a two letter l10n code, we need to have a 4 letter abbreviation. this is important.")
<flexiondotorg_> Trevinho, Thanks for the Approvals.
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg_: yw
<ricotz> hello desktopers
<ricotz> is this a known gtk3 bug in trusty? -- a GtkStack loosing its background -- https://launchpadlibrarian.net/240539411/g.png
<seb128> ricotz, hey
<seb128> did GTK has GtkStacj in trusty?
<seb128> it might be due to the theme or the overlay-scrollbars
<seb128> try to LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=0
<seb128> and see if that fixes it
<ricotz> yeah, it is a GtkStack (since 3.10)
<ricotz> I didnt see it myself here, I assume it is compiz related
<seb128> I doubt it is
<ricotz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1478175
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1478175 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "Gtk.AboutDialog credits background becomes trasparent" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> right, that bug is known
<ricotz> this one claims similar is fine on trusty but happens with 3.14.x
<seb128> right
<seb128> which matches what I remember
<seb128> we had those issues after trusty
<ricotz> I see
<seb128> maybe your user/report has a new gtk from a ppa or such?
<ricotz> could be a usual it lacks information
<ricotz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/plank/+bug/1547473
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1547473 in Plank "When changing back from Docklets Tab background gets transparent" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> yeah :-/
<ricotz> alright :\ , thanks :)
<seb128> yw!
<xnox> Laney, pitti, desrt - i can't remember who else was with us at systemd sprint, but we fixed highdpi unity at that point and login screen. However my lock screen is now partially correct - indicators and logo on the bottom left are good, but the password input is 1x dpi.
<xnox> is lock screen hiding somewhere separate? different user and/or codepath? to fix that too?
<seb128> xnox, it's part of unity
<xnox> unity7 i take it, ok. will poke some time.
<seb128> and should scale
<xnox> i think it's just a one off miss-calculation, or a missed place.
<xnox> or some such.
<Trevinho> xnox: lockscreen or unity-greeter?
<xnox> Trevinho, lockscreen.
<xnox> Greeter is good.
<Trevinho> Weird...
<Trevinho> the lockscreen scaling is there since forever...
<Trevinho> except that...
<xnox> and it does indicators and background right, not the input field.
<seb128> xnox, you changed the scaling factor from the control center?
<xnox> seb128, yes.
<xnox> (and manually hackery to twiddle greeter scaling factor)
<seb128> that shouldn't be needed in xenial
<xnox> by the way, it takes too long for scaling factor to kick on the greeter. it loads, small and then resizes.
<seb128> :-(
<xnox> seb128, autodetection was totally disabled in greeter at fosdem time.
<seb128> I guess it takes too long for xorg to provide the infos about your screens and their resolution
<seb128> yes, I re-enabled it since
<seb128> we fixed the gtk menu positionning issue that made us disable it
<Trevinho> seb128: I think it might be the u-s-d that takes longer to load..
<Trevinho> seb128: like it gets loaded later than the greeter, might be the case?
<Trevinho> (while it should be other way around)
<seb128> it could be
<Trevinho> xnox: can you check that^?
<seb128> it shouldn't take more than 1s to load on xnox's modern laptop though
<Trevinho> Yeah... In fact no. But then readapting the UI, rescaling... Might be visible
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> I don't have a good solution to that
<seb128> out of having a file on disk with a static config that could be read
<seb128> doing the dynamic computation is always going to be slower
<xnox> i used to have a scale x2 theme in plymouht, but latest merges from some sales guy broke it unnoticed. I guess sales people don't have high dpi.
<xnox> and to be honest i'm now thinking a kernel command-line parameter something like
<xnox> dpi.scale=2x or dpi=<integer> -> such that everything keys on to that: plymouth, greeter, lockscreen, user desktops.
<xnox> and we calculate that at install time, and record it in /etc/defaults/grub, or in one of the generators.
<xnox> this stuff should work by default.
<ricotz> Laney, hi, could you adjust the desktop-file patch while processing the current update of evolution? X-Ayanta-* should really be replaced with FDOs DesktopActions
<seb128> xnox, yeah, it's a bit more complex than that though, unity has scaling by monitor and it's sort of an user preference as well, some people like tiny UI elements some don't (depend of how good your eyes as well I guess)
<xnox> and how high the dpi is.
<xnox> cause e.g. on 1.2x screens -> 2x is too big, and 1x can be too small. =(
<xnox> per monitor you say, on jodh's laptop with external screen it was not per screen.
<xnox> oooh, i can test that!
 * xnox totally forgot that i have hdmi output on this brand new laptop, instead of mini display port.
<seb128> well, I said "unity"
<xnox> seb128, right, i see what you mean now.
<seb128> that applies to the Unity shell
<seb128> GTK does int scaling and for all monitors
<xnox> yeah.... cause e.g. my cursor is either "normal" or "XXL Pimp My Ride" size
<xnox> indicators look good -> but then you open the menu it's "Pimp my Ride size sub-boofers pull out"
<xnox> seb128, why does GTK not have float scaling or per screen scaling?
<xnox> did they really think, people will plugin "high-dpi" projects for many years to come?
<seb128> I think the int scale is because using non int value looks less good with pixmaps&co
 * bregma questions the sanity of the GTK designers on that point
<seb128> the per screen might be resolved under wayland
<seb128> I didn't look at it for a while
<seb128> I don't remember the reason (if they had one)
<Laney> ricotz: got patch?
<ricotz> Laney, it should look like https://paste.debian.net/plain/399409
<ricotz> those need similar treatment /usr/share/applications/inkscape.desktop /usr/share/applications/unity-activity-log-manager-panel.desktop
<Laney> ricotz: and this could go upstream now too ;-)
 * Laney wonders why no accept mail for eds
<seb128> Laney, forgot to include the orig (-sa)?
 * seb128 takes a guess
<Laney> nein
<Laney> just dak being shit I guess
<seb128> weeeird
<seb128> I just uploaded thing
<seb128> oh, you mean to Debian?
<Laney> not to the same place I did :-)
<seb128> right
<Laney> launchpad is a beautiful place
<seb128> :-)
<xnox> Laney, seb128 - so if software-centre is gone, does that mean that qt4 sso authenticator is no longer pulled in on the desktop, and it means we can try to kill qt4 from ubuntu-desktop?
<xnox> along with gtk2?
<xnox> (ISO and the default install)
<seb128> xnox, yes, see #ubuntu-desktop backlog from yesterday
<seb128> xnox, and no for gtk2, libreoffice&firefox still use it
<xnox> ah, darn.
<Laney> please reply to my previous ping
<xnox> i thought there is firefox with gtk3?
<xnox> Laney, hm, where/what?
<Laney> xnox: could you send a second cfn for the dmb please?
<xnox> Laney, ack.
<Laney> thx
<xnox> why is libreoffice still in the dark ages? =)
<seb128> xnox, there are firefox&libreoffice ongoing gtk3 ports, they are just no LTS quality/stability yet
<xnox> seb128, ok.
<Laney> is qt4 just for fcitx?
<seb128> no, cf log from yesterday :p
<xnox> looks like fcitx-frontend-qt4 holding it up.
<Laney> I thought you might like to tell us
<Laney> but I'll go look up the look
<seb128> we have fcitx/sni-qt/appmenu-qt
<seb128> sorry was typing
<xnox> imho, we should make qt4 core library depenend on those?
<seb128> and looking for the seed mp from happyaron to drop fcitx
<seb128> right
<seb128> that's what we discussed with mitya57 yesterday
<xnox> that way, if something needs qt4, qt4 fonts/menu/et.al get pulled in.
<Laney> not going to get fcitx off the iso
<seb128> Laney, -qt4
<Laney> it is installed on demand from there, that's some work we did last cycle
<seb128> we currently seed allfrontends
<xnox> seb128, i wish there was "WantedBy" equivalent for package dependencies =)
<seb128> which depends on gtk2/3 & qt4/5
<seb128> Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~happyaron/ubuntu-seeds/drop-fcitx-frontend-qt4/+merge/286613
<seb128> xnox, ^
<Laney> ok
<seb128> xnox, Laney, it's a bit annoying for sni-qt/appmenu-qt
<seb128> we don't have conditional recommends
<seb128> so either we recommend them and have other flavor to pull those in
<seb128> or we suggests and users are going to miss them and have their qt4 apps not integrated
<xnox> but like mumble is qt4, no? and so is like skype.
<Laney> does it have loads of deps or something?
<xnox> seb128, i thought appmenu-qt is an "inert" package, if one doesn't have appmenus in the right desktop it does nothing.
<Laney> seems like fcitx is going to be more annoying to handle
<xnox> no idea what sni-qt or fcitx is like.
<seb128> Laney, what's the issue with fcitx?
<Laney> how do you give people the qt4 thing?
<seb128> ah, that's what you mean
<seb128> I though you meant dropping the dep from fcitx
<seb128> yes indeed :-/
<Laney> it's nice now
<Laney> that it is only installed if you pick chinese
<xnox> i have an idea.
<xnox> we have this ubuntu-drivers-common thing, that can totally checkout which packages one has, and pull those qt4 things if a certain set of stuff is installed.
 * xnox hides
<Laney> you can do this kind of thing with language-selector
<xnox> that too.
<Laney> I'm not exactly sure when that gets triggered though
<Laney> every login?
<xnox> some say qt4 is a language, and others say his name is stig.
<Laney> # Column 3: dependency package(s). Only install the package in column 4 when this dependency package is already installed.
<Laney> GunnarHj is never around when you need him :P
<seb128> I don't think it's a service starting at logging
<seb128> at least I hope not
<seb128> it's python and slow :p
<Laney> what triggers it?
<seb128> you manually starting language-selector
<seb128> I wonder if we have a one time thing autostarted on first logging as well though
<seb128> no autostart in the deb
<seb128> hum, I would need to test again
<xnox> i thought it was an upstart session thing, no?
<seb128> not afaik
<xnox> hm, don't see it either.
<Laney> well that would be good
<seb128> what would that do?
<seb128> check if you have libqt4-something
<Laney> Maybe something like an apt/dpkg post hook thingy to run check-language-support
<seb128> and suggest that you install sni-qt/appmenu-qt/fcitx-qt4 (if fcitx is installed) if you do
<seb128> ?
<Laney> then show the incomplete dialog if needed
<seb128> well, check-language-support doesn't have a doesn't ask again I think
<seb128> it would need to win that
<Laney> a what sorry?
<seb128> a way to tell him to shut up :p
<seb128> like I don't install the full packs on purpose for some of the locales
<seb128> and I don't want to be prompted after every package install or loging
<Laney> fine
<Laney> but it seems like a feasible problem to solve
<seb128> yeah
 * Laney wonders if a language guy wants to work on that ;-)
 * Laney just ate a fork full of hot sauce
 * Laney dies
<seb128> I wonder if making some qt4 lib recommends appmenu/sni-qt and having the chinese install pull in fcitx-qt4 would be good enough for this cycle
 * seb128 hands some bread to Laney
<Laney> depends how much you want qt4 off the iso
<Laney> or if just out of the default install is ok
<seb128> out of the iso is nice
<xnox> seb128, yeah i don't think people will complain about a stray fcitx-qt4 / sni-qt / appmenu-qt too much.
<seb128> but we don't need it there to have ubiquity to download it if you are online
<xnox> Laney, the size decrease will be lovely, plus less obsolete / CVE buggy packages on the iso.
<Laney> meh, undoing our cool work
 * xnox wants libqt4core or what not, just recommend those three packages.
<Laney> xnox: what's the difference?
<Laney> in 'live' on the iso or installed on demand by language-selector
<Laney> slash recommended by qt4
<Laney> they should be as supported as each other
<xnox> Laney, either langauge-selector or depends route, will get the qt4 stack off the ubuntu-desktop iso. And both routes will make sure the three extra packages are there, if and when any qt4 app is installed (e.g. skype).
<xnox> however language-selector is quite obscure, and i don't think it will run e.g. straight after "apt install skype"
<xnox> in that sense recommends is the most reliable thing to do.
<Laney> we were just talking about fixing that
<xnox> or we can continue ship it on the CD, and thus force install qt4 by default, when no apps use it anymore by default. and only obscure ones remaining.
<Laney> I buy CD size arguments but not support arguments if we have it pulled in by some other mechanism
<xnox> even if langauge-selector is fixed, it is still kind of an abuse to install appmenu-qt via language selector =)
<Laney> fcitx-qt4
<Laney> appmenu-qt and sni-qt would be recommended
<xnox> i'd be ok with that.
<robert_ancell> seb128, should bug 1547608 say "without actions" ?
<ubot5> bug 1547608 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "use notifications with actions" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1547608
<robert_ancell> or "uses notifications with actions"
<Laney> probably "uses"
<seb128> robert_ancell, uses
<seb128> robert_ancell, I knew I should have titled it "shouldn't use actions in notifications"
<seb128> would have been easier to read :p
<robert_ancell> seb128, watch my renaming skillz :)
<seb128> lol
<robert_ancell> seb128, is the issue the buttons don't work in notify-osd or they're not appropriate?
<seb128> robert_ancell, they look like that http://i.stack.imgur.com/FQjdC.png
<seb128> it's just not a nice experience
<seb128> also "launch" didn't work in this case
<seb128> but maybe that's specific to vim and it tried to start the command line utility or something
<Laney> you get a cool persistent notification in gnome shell :)
<seb128> one with buttons
<Laney> no
<seb128> no "launch" button?
 * Laney screams at the huge Shutdown icon in the dash now
<seb128> I wonder why notify-osd acted like that then...
 * Laney is getting a screenshot
<Laney> if it's still there
<seb128> now we know that Laney uses gnome-shell :p
<Laney> virt-manager baby
<Laney> that's why I saw that grim icon
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/NICE.png
<seb128> ah, cool
<seb128> ohoh, g-s segfault!
<seb128> it doesn't like to be denied polkit auth, every few tries it goes down
<seb128> I guess I'm going to report some other bugs next week
<seb128> robert_ancell, btw I reported https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=762314 upstream
<ubot5> Gnome bug 762314 in General "The review buttons (was useful yes/no/report abuse) have too much importance" [Normal,Assigned]
<robert_ancell> seb128, nice
<seb128> hum I've aptdaemon warning in my unity log that could be due to gnome-software as well
<seb128>   File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/aptdaemon/client.py", line 623, in _on_property_changed
<seb128>     self.emit("progress-details-changed", *value)
<seb128> TypeError: could not convert type dbus.Double to (null) required for parameter 4
<seb128> going to play more with that next week
<seb128> but enough for this week
<seb128> have a good w.e everyone!
<willcooke> cheers seb128
<willcooke> off myself now.  I'll y'all a post card
<willcooke> toodles
<Laney> have fun!
<Trevinho> tjaalton: I've the fix for gdk... Did you open the bug then?
<Trevinho> oh, sorry... Missed the link
<Laney> happy weekend!
<Trevinho> seb128: get ready to backport https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=762319 this next week ð
<ubot5> Gnome bug 762319 in Backend: X11 "issues with randr 1.5" [Normal,Assigned]
<Trevinho> Happy we anyone
<tjaalton> Trevinho: whee, great!
<robert_ancell> seb128, Is there an appropriate method to check the notification system? GNotification doesn't seem to have any API for that
<robert_ancell> andyrock, is there a LP bug for the GNOME Software Launcher integration?
<robert_ancell> And is that patch all that is required for G-S or will there be more patches
<robert_ancell> I'm writing the debian/changelog for it, looking to attach the change to a bug number
<Sweet5hark> re
<robert_ancell> andyrock, I opened bug 1547676
<ubot5> bug 1547676 in unity (Ubuntu) "GNOME Software Unity launcher integration" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1547676
<robert_ancell> seb128, when do you think we should demote u-s-c in universe? Should we do it now and MIR it back in a disaster situation?
<robert_ancell> oh, it is done I see
<seb128> robert_ancell, libnotify has an api to query the server capabilities, dunno about gnotification
<robert_ancell> Moving your trello card...
<seb128> robert_ancell, right, things get semi-auto demoted when nothing keep them in main
<robert_ancell> huh, I did not know that.
<robert_ancell> Useful
<seb128> robert_ancell, rb code example
<seb128> 		/* ask the notification server if it supports actions */
<seb128> 		caps = notify_get_server_caps ();
<seb128> 		if (g_list_find_custom (caps, "actions", (GCompareFunc)g_strcmp0) != NULL) {
<robert_ancell> seb128, thanks, that's just what I was looking for
<seb128> yw
<robert_ancell> Laney, the "set org.gnome.software require-appdata false" action - is that just an override file in the gnome-software package?
<seb128> robert_ancell, we tend to use ubuntu-settings for overrides that are ubuntu choices
<seb128> rather than patching the source
<robert_ancell> ok
<seb128> easier to maintain and let derivatives opt out
<robert_ancell> yep
<robert_ancell> seb128, do you know what the require-appdata option is for/does?
<robert_ancell> I'm guessing that shows all apps, even those with broken data?
<seb128> I don't, but that seems it could be that
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-02-20
<monster> I want to help in fixing the appstream issues. I am a new developer and would love to lend a hand before xenial release. Can somebody give me pointers what to do and what are currently hot items to be fixed soon ?
<tjaalton> Trevinho: I've pushed a fixed gtk+3.0 to the staging ppa, i want to test if it also fixes nvidia prime :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-02-13
<hikiko> hi
<happyaron> hikiko: hey
<happyaron> how are you
<hikiko> hi happyaron :-)
<desrt> morning, all
<seb128> hey desrt, had a good w.e?
<desrt> yes, but also a very difficult one
<desrt> how was your weekend?
<seb128> quite good, though a bit disappointed that we couldn't play the special tennis day on saturday due to the weather
<desrt> did you get the snow side of it, or the rain?
<seb128> snow
<seb128> you?
<desrt> both :p
<desrt> woke up to snow on saturday and watched the rain clear it away in the afternoon
<seb128> was it what created the difficult part of the w.e?
<seb128> it sticked for most of the w.e here, just started being warmer yesterday afternoon
<desrt> just some personal things to work through
<willcooke> morning all
<desrt> hi willcookie  (i caught the typo, but i'm just gonna let that one stand)
<desrt> happy monday :)
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> hey desrt
<desrt> willcooke: cool email :)
<willcooke> desrt, yay!  Glad you liked it :))
<Laney> meow
<desrt> *pat pat*
<willcooke> morning Laney
<davmor2> Morning all
<seb128> hey Laney & willcooke
<seb128> hey davmor2
<willcooke> morning davmor2 seb128
<Laney> hey willcooke davmor2 seb128 desrt
<Laney> how's it going?
 * Laney has cold hands
 * desrt gives laney some hand warmers
<Laney> :3
<desrt> can someone explain :3 to me?
<desrt> i don't get it
<desrt> the intarwebs says that it's supposed to look like a cat.
 * desrt very suddenly feels old
<davmor2> Laney: cold hands, warm heart......that or you are a zombie
 * Laney gnaws on davmor2 
<Laney> desrt: SHOCKED that you didn't immediately see it
<Laney> it means cosy
<Laney> hygge
<davmor2> that or you have a handlebar Moustache you've been keeping quiet
<Laney> :3)
<Laney> looks more like I've been punched in the nose
<desrt> or are a clown
 * desrt tries to filter change signals, becomes unhappy
 * davmor2 pictures Laney as an evil mastermind twirling his handlebar Moustache and laughing maniacally 
 * desrt considers that maybe she shouldn't try to do that
<Laney> notify::president
<desrt> there's a really beautiful duality here
<desrt> and i think i'm resisting it a little bit too much
 * desrt deletes a bunch of code
<davmor2> desrt: :o) is obviously a clown
 * desrt sees partial orders everywhere
<davmor2> and this is the famous song in one emoticon :'o( â tears of a clown
<flexiondotorg> Morning Desktopers
<davmor2> flexiondotorg: hey dude how's things down Sowff
<davmor2> willcooke: we had snowmeggedon Saturday Morning we must of had more than 10 flakes /me still wants the Thundersnow his was promised by weathermen
<willcooke> :D
<davmor2> willcooke: there is a nice pic on G+ of white roves and everything very wintry 30 minutes later ofcourse it started to rain and that was the end of that :)
<Laney> back in a minute, got to head to the sorting office to get something before they chuck it in the furnace
<Laney> if it turns out to be junk mail
<Laney> arhghghg
<jbicha> Laney: what do you think of gnome-software 3.24 for zesty?
<Laney> Haven't thought about it a lot
<Laney> I think installing .debs by double clicking them may be broken atm
<Laney> why do you ask?
<Laney> also I have a branch on my laptop of a rebase of our stuff against master but I don't think I pushed it
<Laney> which is to say that it'll be quite untested
<jbicha> because I think we'll get nearly all the rest of GNOME 3.24 in and Feature Freeze is this week
<jbicha> I'm keeping Evo at 3.22 and nautilus and gnome-terminal are still stuck at 3.20
<jbicha> yes, it looks like the Install button for local .debs doesn't do anything
<jbicha> I updated the gnome-software packaging locally against git master ( Refreshed 0001-Download-changelog-information-on-demand-this-stops-.patch and dropped 3 obsolete patches)
<Laney> Pushed wip/ubuntu-master
<Laney> Feel free to fix that bug if you want
<Laney> 4e36b420bcae79543d4e7f506f5a39bd518e1d9d is what robert did for the snap one
<Trevinho> Laney: could you please ACK package changes in https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2464 and.... At that point also follow the SRUing of it? :-)
 * Trevinho has big requests
<Trevinho> Hey all btw :-)
<seb128> hey Trevinho!
<Trevinho> hey seb128
<Sweet5hark> heya all
<Trevinho> do we have any move on that runtime thing?
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark
<seb128> Trevinho, not sure, I got lost in the middle of your arguments about renamings on friday
 * Sweet5hark is drowning a bit in various battles because of the Linux in Munich story.
<seb128> but Didier said he would pick it up for you
<jbicha> Sweet5hark: LO 5.3 built, but the autopkgtests are failing :(
<seb128> Sweet5hark, next chapter to that story?
<Sweet5hark> jbicha: thanks for the upload!
<Sweet5hark> jbicha: I will look at the autopkgtests ...
<seb128> Trevinho, btw I don't know why you insist on getting your reviews from Laney only for packaging diffs, there are other people would could do that as well here...
<Trevinho> seb128: cause I love to bother Laney :-D
<seb128> lol
<ricotz> hey desktopers
<ricotz> Sweet5hark, hi, https://paste.debian.net/plain/914123 :(
<Trevinho> seb128: but.... feel free to do it if you feel ignored :-P
<seb128> Trevinho, if I was to review it I would probably say it's not fine for a SRU, the changelog should explains the debian/control and debian/rules changes so the SRU team knows if they are wanted or errors
<flexiondotorg> o/
<seb128> hey flexiondotorg ricotz
<Sweet5hark> seb128: yeah, FWIW the city council just took the decision on it of the scheduled meeting on wednesday. seems like the signs of corruption are way to obvious for the party to support their mayor. but punted is not yet called of. some investigative journalists are waking up to the story though and smell blood in the pool, which is good.
<flexiondotorg> davmor2 Sunny dahn saff.
<Trevinho> actually those changes were neither needed for xenial. I just cherry-picked upstream
<Trevinho> but let me check
<flexiondotorg> seb128 o/
<seb128> ricotz, why do you add a transitional for an empty/useless package? do upgrades get put on hold without that?
<ricotz> seb128, yes, and there is still a Recommend on it
<seb128> Sweet5hark, what did they decide to do?
<seb128> ricotz, do you have a bug with an apt log showing why it thinks holding on the upgrade is a safer choice than removing an useless package?
<seb128> that seems a bit weird to me
<seb128> the transitional shouldn't be needed there
<jbicha> Laney: do we still want https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-software/commit/?h=wip/ubuntu-zesty&id=5a39527fed
<ricotz> seb128, the superflous Recommends causes it, so dropping this might make it work without a transitional
 * ricotz is a bit annoyed while having this pointed out last week already
<seb128> ricotz, that makes sense, let's try to do that and see if anyone still get upgrade issues
<seb128> ricotz, you pointed it but I discussed it with Bjoern and none of us understood the rational of why you wanted to add a transitional
<seb128> ricotz, explaining why changes are needed helps
<ricotz> seb128, I mentioned the superfluous Recommends too
<seb128> I'm sure Sweet5hark is going to drop that one
<seb128> he's just busy with lot of things so changes take a bit of time
<seb128> jbicha, what is "kudo"?
<Laney> jbicha: Dunno, it's not meant to be a fully formed proposal, you kind of sprung this on me
<Sweet5hark> seb128: they decided nothing yet (except underfunding the existing linux project). they had paid for a study by accenture (microsofts best buddies) hoping it would say "burn it down and use windows". except even accenture could bring themselves to write that, they most wrote "you main problem is that your organisation structure really sucks. also you have some technical issues (but not worse than other public admins on wi
<Sweet5hark> seb128: the mayor then ignored the summary cherry-picked some quotes out of context and asked for a vote to go back to windows by 2020 on wednesday
<Sweet5hark> seb128: that vote was just cancelled as some politician might either have discovered their conscience or realized this will backfire at them tainting them as corrupt.
<Laney> I would update the wip/ubuntu-zesty branch if it were me
<seb128> Sweet5hark, I see, "fun"
<Laney> Trevinho: will look soon if nobody else does
 * Laney lunch
<Trevinho> Laney: thanks
<Sweet5hark> seb128: and yeah, of course totally unrelated: MSFT recently moved the Germany HQ from a tiny village outside of Munich inside city borders (which is relevant for tax reasons).
<Sweet5hark> the mayor was at the ceremony when they were laying the first stone.
<ricotz> Sweet5hark, yeah, that is some story! :\
<jbicha> seb128: it's the stuff under Details on the left: https://bicha.net/i/gnome-software-322-kudos.png
<seb128> jbicha, oh, right, it should be easy to test for you by reverting the patch but I don't think any of that changed
<Laney> Trevinho: what did you do
<Laney> there's no packaging diff
<seb128> Laney, I reviewed it saying that the debian/control|rules changes should be explaining in the changelog and he said those were not required, so I guess he did a respin without
<Laney> seb128: nice
<Laney> 2017-02-13 13:45:46 +0000 (bileto-bot) Currently building
<Laney> would have been good to unping me :P
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> or to just ask on the channel rather than pinging specific people
<Laney> indeed so
<Laney> jbicha: I pushed that commit as a cherry-pick
<Laney> I didn't put it on my proposed branch since it doesn't make sense for upstream
<Laney> and if they reject it then I probably want to talk about us dropping it at some point
<Laney> but not right now
<jbicha> sure, that makes sense
<seb128> jbicha, do the kudos work in Debian?
<Laney> sure, just as they would work here
<Laney> They mostly come from as-glib
<Laney> Some of them can be specified in the appdata directly and some are computed
<Laney> I think they were considered to be not that high quality / useful before. Maybe that's changed, would need to have a look
<seb128> Laney, the concept is a bit fuzzy to me, what does "translated" mean, especially in the context of langpacks
<seb128> I think that's part of what we had issues with
<Laney> I don't know, I'm deliberately not trying to have this discussion again now since nobody is proposing bringing them back atm
<seb128> k, I saw you were saying they just work(tm)
<seb128> which made me curious
<seb128> saw->though
<Laney> No, they would "work" here in the same way they "work" there
<Laney> In saying that I mean there's no magic support anywhere
<Laney> i.e. no specific enablement work required
<Laney> it's "just" some UI and code
<seb128> right
<seb128> well at least I learnt that they come from as-glib
<seb128> I didn't know if that was coming from the backend
<Laney> it could also do
<seb128> like maybe packagekit does things we don't in the aptd one
<Laney> that's the plugin architecture of g-s
<Laney> the apt plugin could so kudo related stuff if it wanted to
<seb128> right
<Laney> like if we enabled them then the snappy plugin would do something like this---
<Laney> src/plugins/gs-flatpak.c:       gs_app_add_kudo (app, GS_APP_KUDO_SANDBOXED);
<Laney> depending on the interface or whatever
<seb128> right
<seb128> anyway to reply to jbicha, we commented it because e.g translations were never showing as "true"
<seb128> dunno if it works in the packagekit backend
<seb128> or in other distros because their packagking format provides extra details
<jbicha> I don't have a problem with continuing to hide the kudos; I only brought it up to make sure that we weren't dropping the patch to hide them (since it wasn't in the master patch queue)
<seb128> k
<seb128> seems everybody is fine with the current status then
<jbicha> :)
<seb128> can we me on then, good :-)
<seb128> ups
<seb128> can move on*
<Laney> I wonder how it knows the percentage
<Laney> probably don't need to find out right now :P
<seb128> :-)
<willcooke> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EB0Zpr91qiA
<willcooke> attente, ^ \o/
<Laney> totally looked
<Laney> it needs generator support
<Laney> if that were the only issue we could hide just that kudo, fyi
 * Laney moves on with life :P
<attente> willcooke: :o
<Laney> nice video
<Laney> controls on the right!!!!
<seb128> I was going to say!
<seb128> how could they
<willcooke> so hot right now
<seb128> Laney, yeah, staying out of the discussion about those "kudos", I'm not sure how pertinant the "system integration" and "activity" badges are, but the "sandboxed" could be nice, probably a low priority item though
<attente> is gtk still blocking builds because of the ubuntu-app-launch upstart depends?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> ted_g_ has been pinged multiple times
<attente> ok, thanks Laney
<ksamak> Trevinho: hi. i have a question, what mutual exclusion lock mechanism would one use inside compiz, say in ezzom module? XD
<ksamak> andyrock: same if you have insight
<ksamak> s/ezzom/ezoom
<willcooke> Laney, tedg_ is looking at the u-a-l work.  It's going to take some time, he's interested to know what the gtk timelines look like.  We're what, 10 days from beta 1?  A month or so from final beta right?
<alecu> willcooke: also we'd like to know if there's any other option for this, in case a clean solution in UAL takes too long. tedg_ mentioned that it might be possible to make the gtk dependency on contenthub be optional
<alecu> but not sure if that's a lot more work
<dobey> i think it would be far easier to just make the contenthub dep be optional in gtk+
<tedg_> To be clear, we're not talking months. I think that end of the week is optimistic, but probably next week is possible. But we didn't know how much of a problem gtk blocking is.
<Laney> It's not the end of the world right now - the only change being held out is attente's recent work on the Mir backend - but it means we can't do any further fixes if we need to.
<Laney> And yes, of course we could implement a hack to turn off the Mir backend on s390x, but that would be a hack
<Laney> Enough of those in the archive already due to lack of upstart there
<tedg_> Sure, it'll be interesting to see what things break once UAL lets a bunch more build on s390x ;-)
<tedg_> Okay, so it sounds like removing it correctly from UAL is the right solution. So we'll get started on that, it's just not gonna be quick.
<dobey> interesting as in "may you live in interesting times" perhaps
<Laney> It's been easier every time to work around the problem
<Laney> but now we're in a state where there's a wobbly tower that's been constructed
<Laney> Thanks for working on it. :)
 * dobey doesn't live in italy ;)
<attente> i'll make gtk -> content-hub optional in the mean time
<Trevinho> ksamak: mh, since we've c++11 there now, I'd go for std::lock
<alecu> Laney: willcooke: thanks for bringing it to our attention.
<Laney> attente: We'll end up with some ugly "if not s390x" or "if not upstart" thing in gtk if you do that
<Laney> alecu: thank *you* for helping it along!
<ksamak> Trevinho: i find out that when cloning the mousepoll plugin, i have problems calling a callback
<ksamak> and i get segfaults in operator() :-S
<ksamak> i don't really know what to make of that
<Trevinho> ksamak: mh, that might be much generic.. But in general that could happen because of loops around?
<Laney> Saw a big queue in town on Friday night (7pm)
<dobey> Laney: why would that be? i disagree. it would be "if not libcontent-hub-glib" no?
<Trevinho> like you call something that triggers an x events that brings you there
<Trevinho> or...
<Laney> ... http://www.nottinghampost.com/sneaker-heads-finally-get-their-hand-on-kanye-west-s-yeezy-boost-trainers-after-queuing-for-days/story-30128812-detail/story.html
<dobey> Laney: ie, if pkg-config can't find the library, don't built the support.
<ksamak> hum... that's really frustrating, if i put the exact same logic in the mousepoll plug, it works, but not with changing the name to focuspoll XD
<ksamak> well, i'll continue looking for things...
<Laney> dobey: Ok, it'll be an arch-specific build-dep in the package and an ifdefed codepath in the code and an arch-specific runtime dependency in the -dev package
<Laney> All to let something that we want to remove not be removed right this second
 * Laney is happy it's being worked on rather than that
 * dobey wonders if anyone has even run any gtk+ application ever, on s390x
<dobey> anyway
<dobey> i don't think it's to avoid removing right this second. i think it's more about finding the smallest set of changes to keep everything moving forward
<dobey> but eh
<Laney> Increasing the technical debt ceiling
<dobey> politics :)
<dobey> anyway, need to get lunch here
<xnox> dobey, no, but there are src packages that have gtk+ build-deps and build command line utils.
<xnox> and that makes dependency graphs sad.
<b4n> andyrock: around?  I get that you probably didn't get much further on the a11y shortcuts since the other day, but if I can do *anything* to help, please tell me :)
<andyrock> yep
<andyrock> I'm afraid if you want to see that fixed you need to work on it alone
<andyrock> i'm blocked on other stuff
<andyrock> i'm blocked on other stuffi told you before it's going to be very very difficult
<b4n> do you have anything I could strat off?
<b4n> or your research didn't yet yield any useful code, even as a start?
<b4n> (which I'd get given the complexity I'm sensing)
<andyrock> not really I was able to use xi2 to get the events
<andyrock> but using another display connection
<andyrock> but using another display connection
<andyrock> not really I was able to use xi2 to get the events
<andyrock> not the one from screen->dpy()
<b4n> andyrock: and this had race problems then, that's it?
<andyrock> b4n: yep
<andyrock> it's not a good idea to have two dpy connection inside compiz
<willcooke> night all
<seb128> good evening desktopers
<jbicha> Sweet5hark: nacc pointed out that libreoffice/zesty isn't using the system orcus
<jbicha> and the autopkgtest isn't picking up ant
<jdstrand> desrt: hey. I'd like to play with the v4 dconf patches on the apparmor mailing list. do you have a dconf in a ppa or patches or something so I can test kernel w/ aa userspace w/ dconf?
<desrt> there's no aa part of dconf yet, so not much to test there
<desrt> attente was going to write it once he got an API to write against
<desrt> is it possible to do that at this point?
 * desrt was just about to run out to the bar
<attente> jdstrand: desrt: haven't written that yet, but j_johansen already sent the patches to the ML
<jdstrand> attente: curious on the timeframe for that? I'm asking because I've been asked to review those patches considering how it might be used in snappy policy
<jdstrand> attente: I'd be happy with poc code or really anything where dconf is using libapparmor to mediate/log/something I can look at the results of
<attente> jdstrand: i can look at it today
<jdstrand> attente: if that isn't available or timelines don't match up, I'll do my review from a different perspective
<jdstrand> attente: ok, that would be handy. thank you :)
<jdstrand> attente: I can't look at it today and likely not tomorrow, so not a huge rush (would like to midweek though, if that works for you)
<attente> jdstrand: good to know, thanks
<attente> jdstrand: it might be delayed anyways since d_esrt is already eod and i might have questions for her...
 * jdstrand nods
<dobey> desrt: hey. is there any way to get the summary/description of a gsettings key, with the cli tool?
<jbicha> dobey: gsettings describe
<dobey> jbicha: is that hidden? or only in a newer version of gsettings?
<jbicha> it's new for 16.10
<dobey> yeah, i need it to work in 16.04 too :(
<TheMuso> dobey: Probably the API was there previously, and since 16.10 there has been a CLI UI to do so.
<TheMuso> Since dconf-editor has been able to display that stuff for ages afaik.
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-02-14
<jbicha> the command is from glib2 2.50
<jbicha> robert_ancell: hi, if you've got time, could you look at sponsoring bug 1664288 ?
<ubot5> bug 1664288 in gdk-pixbuf (Ubuntu) "Update gdk-pixbuf to 2.36.5" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1664288
<robert_ancell> jbicha, ok
<jbicha> robert_ancell: could you retry gdk-pixbuf? it built on amd64 in my PPA earlier today so maybe the tests are just flaky
<robert_ancell> jbicha, retried. It's both 64 bit arches though... looks suspicious
<jbicha> ok, it worked on arm64 this time, so let's try amd64 again! :)
<dobey> TheMuso: yeah. the problem is that i need cli to do it, for a simple test, that also needs to work on 16.04, which doesn't have the cli option. i'd prefer not to have to write a separate tool for it, but i guess i might have to
<Sweet5hark> jbicha: heya, so I readded ant, ant-optional deps for the autopkgtests and checked vs. some older version that had those if we lost more.
<desrt> Sweet5hark: uh.  good morning.
<Sweet5hark> jbicha: found libarchive-zip-perl, libcommons-logging-java, libglew-dev, libhsqldb1.8.0-java have gone missing, but I think that is justified by changes for all but libhsqldb1.8.0-java. and hsqldb is apparently installed by the autopkgtests if I read the log right.
<Sweet5hark> desrt: heh, yeah: moin ;)
<Sweet5hark> jbicha, seb128: http://people.canonical.com/~bjoern/zesty/5.3.0/libreoffice_5.3.0~rc3-0ubuntu2_source.changes
 * Sweet5hark goes to fetch some four ours of sleep or so ...
<sarnold> heh, just when I was wondering if you were still up or up early..:)
<robert_ancell> jbicha, gdk-pixbuf really doesn't want to compile on amd64 :(
<robert_ancell> I'll give it one more chance
<Sweet5hark> moin!
<Sweet5hark> seb128: http://people.canonical.com/~bjoern/zesty/5.3.0/libreoffice_5.3.0~rc3-0ubuntu2_source.changes -- I made the Recommends: on -sbdc-firebird go away when we dont build firebird. I did _not_ add a transitional too as doing both didnt seem to make sense to me.
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark, how are you?
<Sweet5hark> heya, a bit underslept, gt away here at 4:45 yesterday. but beyond that: up and ready for a fight ;)
<seb128> Sweet5hark, +1 on no transitional ... the other part of the changes should fix the autopkg issues right?
<seb128> Sweet5hark, urg, you should get a bit more sleep :-)
<Sweet5hark> seb128: yes, I hope so. I didnt remove the "Breaks:" from https://paste.debian.net/plain/914123  as I didnt yet check what the reason for them was and they should hurt. can remove them either later (after ff) or on the next LTS+1 (if that will ever be).
<Sweet5hark> seb128: can sleep when Im dead. ;)
<seb128> Sweet5hark, that diff has the transitional you said you didn't add?
<ricotz> Sweet5hark, seb128, morning
<seb128> hey ricotz
<ricotz> Sweet5hark, what is the point for a new l10n package?
<Sweet5hark> ricotz: new l10n package likely not needed, was just autogenerated by my tooling.
<Sweet5hark> ricotz: thus havent shared the -l10n link with seb128
<ricotz> Sweet5hark, I see, better don't upload it to safe cycles ;P
<willcooke> morning all
<desrt> hihi willcooke
<seb128> hey willcooke desrt Laney
<Laney> yo
<Laney> happy iraqi communist martyrs day
<desrt> poor communists :(
 * desrt has a feeling that, today, rosie is receiving nothing more than a history lesson
<Laney> actually I can't find much about the communist martyrs of iraq
<Laney> :(
<Laney> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yusuf_Salman_Yusuf
<davmor2> Morning all
<flexiondotorg> Morning desktopers
<seb128> hey flexiondotorg, how are you?
<flexiondotorg> seb128 Very well thanks.
<flexiondotorg> Working with some "interesting" organisations on the road to snaps.
<flexiondotorg> Going is good now, the snappy team put in a huge effort before Christmas and early in Jan.
<flexiondotorg> It is really paying off now.
<flexiondotorg> Snap support in electron-builder is reliable now too. They been a willing upstream :-)
<seb128> nice
<Laney> arhgioahgaoih
<Laney> I forgot to rebuild the thing I was bisecting
<Laney> good good good good "hmm, this is suspicious, oh well" good good good
<Laney> /o\
<Laney> attente would never make such a mistake
<seb128> it's an art
<Laney> yeah I was never any good at art
<Laney> that's better
<didrocks> pro-bisecter Â©
<jbicha> do emojis count as art?
<jbicha> good morning
<Laney> hi jbicha
<Sweet5hark> seb128: anything missing for http://people.canonical.com/~bjoern/zesty/5.3.0/libreoffice_5.3.0~rc3-0ubuntu2_source.changes -- ff is tomorrow, right?
<jbicha> Sweet5hark: LO 5.3 is already in zesty for feature freeze purposes
<Sweet5hark> jbicha: hmm, true. admitted having something struck by autopkgtest on ff is just a cosmetic issue. But its MY cosmetic issue ;)
<Sweet5hark> jbicha: of course seb128 will say in a second, I should just get my uploader rights and he would be right.
<jbicha> Laney: did you see that gdk-pixbuf fails to build on amd64 on zesty? I went ahead and reported it: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/778600
<ubot5> Gnome bug 778600 in general "cve-2015-4491 test fails on Ubuntu" [Normal,New]
<Laney> Nope
<jbicha> robert_ancell sponsored it for me and retried it several times :(
<Laney> It's probably the MALLOC_PERTURB patch that was dropped though
<jbicha> it's causing all its rdepends to ftbfs on non-amd64 :(
<Laney> Someone keeps retrying it
<tsdgeos> jibel: Laney: can we maybe remove it from proposed? it's blocking unity8 silos for example
<tsdgeos> until we get that fixed
<davmor2> cyphermox: I'm going to do a fresh flash but can you check amd64 xenial.2 releases slides for me sometimes they trigger sometimes not but only on amd64 testing on xps13
 * Laney bins a whole load of old notes / todo lists
<Laney> stuff from the u-s-s days
<seb128> Sweet5hark, looks good to me, I'm going to sponsor it in a bit, and right you are, you need to apply for ppu for libreoffice ;-)
<Sweet5hark> seb128: thanks and yeah! ;)
<ricotz> Sweet5hark, any chance for the 5-3 ppa?
<jbicha> Laney: I'm surprised you used bileto for gdk-pixbuf
<Laney> Ok?
<jbicha> I guess for the ephemeral PPA? I can't push directly to those PPAs so that wouldn't work for me to push like that
<Laney> I wanted to know that it would work before uploading it
<jbicha> it makes sense, I just expected bileto to only be used by packages with those long version numbers ;)
<Laney> Nah, it has source package support
<Laney> Just need to get into the team that owns the archives
<Laney> I think bileto enforces upload permissions for copies for them
<flexiondotorg> jbicha Thanks for discussing the UKUI request package bugs.
<flexiondotorg> Sorry it took me a day to review the situation, but I've commented now - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntukylin/+bug/1663477/comments/6
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1663477 in Ubuntu Kylin "[needs-packaging] UKUI desktop environment" [Critical,New]
<flexiondotorg> UKUI and MATE do co-exist.
 * flexiondotorg goes back to snaps...
<jbicha> thanks, yeah it's complicated; it looks like they are now trying to fork less packages than they originally proposed
<jbicha> it would have been nice if they had communicated with others in Ubuntu or MATE sooner, since they are unlikely to meet their Beta1 goal
<GunnarHj> seb128: I'm a bit concerned about bug #1655782, since FF is soon. Can you please revisit it?
<ubot5> bug 1655782 in xkeyboard-config (Ubuntu) "Elfdalian layout + merge with Debian 2.19-1" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1655782
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> GunnarHj, I'm not the only sponsor around ;-)
<seb128> and I'm not sure that is concern/feature impacted by ff or an important issue for the majority of our users
<seb128> GunnarHj, but sure, I'm going to try to have a look, weeks just tend to be busy
<seb128> GunnarHj, btw I set up a new role account for langpack uploads and generated a new key on friday, https://launchpad.net/~langpack-uploader ... but we should have got a new set of xenial langpacks in the ppa yesterday and it seems that didn't work out, so I need to investigate
<GunnarHj> seb128: Thanks for the update on the langpack update. The reason I keep asking you about that bug is that you had a look already. Maybe not the most important thing around, and maybe FF does not apply, but it would be great if you could sponsor it.
<seb128> yeah, I'm going to have a look again don't worry
<GunnarHj> seb128: Great!
<davmor2> cyphermox: looks like it might of been a bad copy to pendrive seems to be fine after a re-copy I'll keep an eye out fir it happening again though incase it is a race of some sort
<willcooke> ohh
<qengho> Oh man.
<willcooke> that came round quick.
<desrt> yup
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Feb 14 15:31:19 2017 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic:
 * desrt always has trouble remembering if it's winter that's +2 and summer +1 or the other way around
<willcooke> Happy valentines day lovelies
<willcooke> :)
<desrt> :D â¥
<willcooke> Roll call: andyrock, attente, desrt,  dgadomski (out), fjkong, flexiondotorg (out), happyaron(out), hikiko (might be sick), laney, qengho, seb128, sweet5hark, themuso (out), tkamppeter (hols), trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<qengho> Is that the "pink killer"?
<FJKong> full house
 * desrt appears confused
<Sweet5hark> hello all! â¥
<willcooke> One more minute and lets start
 * didrocks waits and wants his VIP table :)
<hikiko> hi
<willcooke> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: andyrock
<andyrock> hey
<andyrock> * updated to some u8 branches after review
<andyrock> * chromium on mir
<andyrock>   - spent some time studying chromium, ozone, etc.
<andyrock>   - had a chat with chromium developer to understand the state of chromium/ozone/wayland
<andyrock>   - setup our git repositories
<andyrock>   - start to implement the first classes
<andyrock> * reviews
<willcooke> thanks andyrock
<willcooke> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: attente
<attente> hey
<attente> content-hub drag and drop discussion
<attente> was hoping to land the gtk package soon, but blocked by u-a-l
<attente> testing the new revision of apparmor dconf patches
<attente> (<3)
<willcooke> thanks attente
<willcooke> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: desrt
<desrt> hey
<desrt> refactoring work to prepare for apparmor stuff now that the API is available to us
<desrt> basically, turning stuff into gobjects and adding change signals to everything to support dynamic policy changes
<desrt> eof.
<willcooke> thanks desrt
<desrt> oh.  right.  â¥ as well
<willcooke> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: happyaron
<willcooke> 1. netcat-openbsd out-out bug, LP: #1656785
<willcooke> 2. spl-linux & zfs-linux 0.6.5.9
<willcooke> 3. GNOME translation bunch review
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1656785 in netcat-openbsd (Ubuntu) "nc -d -l does not return data (only empty strings)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1656785
<willcooke> err
<willcooke> oops
<willcooke> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: FJKong
<FJKong> hi
<qengho> Man, we're fast today.
<FJKong> * merge gedit 3.22.0-1ubuntu2 from debian #1664529
<ubot5> Error: Debian bug 1664529 could not be found
<FJKong> * [SRU] gnome-calulator: give more Test Case info #1633408 #1648992
<FJKong> * redo merge subversion #1662787
<FJKong> * redo merge pygtk fix changelog as format requested.
<FJKong> * keep working on avahi-daemon crash
<FJKong> eof
<willcooke> thanks FJKong
<willcooke> #topic flexiondotorg
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: flexiondotorg
<willcooke> hold tight, big copy & paste coming
<willcooke>  Time appropriate greetings!
<willcooke> - Joined the Dell webcast: "Ubuntu Linux | Basic functionality and
<willcooke> Installation" to see what they had to say. "Huge interest and demand
<willcooke> in Ubuntu from our customers"
<willcooke>     - They even explained how to install/configure dual booting UBuntu
<willcooke> and Windows on computers sold by Dell that shipped only Windows.
<willcooke>     - Advised to disable SecureBoot.
<willcooke> - Identified ~400 Electron apps for snap outreach.
<willcooke> - Talked to upstream electron-builder to get some remaining issues
<willcooke> squashed when making snaps.
<willcooke>     - electron-builder (used widely for building cross-platform
<willcooke> electron apps) is now making snaps reliably.
<willcooke> - Created PoC snap for Brave.
<willcooke> - Created a PoC snap for Skype for Linux Alpha.
<willcooke>     - In touch with the Skype team.
<willcooke>     - They attempted snapping Skype last year and ran into issues.
<willcooke>     - They've sent over the issue list and I'm seeing if any issues
<willcooke> still remain.
<willcooke> - Tested snapd and snapcraft on Ubuntu 14.04, bugs raised.
<willcooke> - Tested Kubuntu, Lubuntu, Xubuntu, Ubuntu Studio, Linux Lite,
<willcooke> elementary, Linux Mint,Zorin,KDE Neon and Arch Linux for snap
<willcooke> compatibility, bugs raised and distro maintainers contacted where
<willcooke> required.
<willcooke> - Raised a bug regarding Media Key support in strictly confined snaps.
<willcooke> Thanks to _didrocks and _seb128. FIxes committed last night by
<willcooke> _jdstrand.
<willcooke> - ISO Testing
<willcooke> - Had a call with Hyper, an electron terminal application.
<willcooke>     - Snapped Hyper by enabling snaps in their electron-builder configuration.
<willcooke>     - Pull request submitted upstream.
<willcooke> ð¬
<willcooke> #topic hikiko
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: hikiko
<hikiko> hi
<hikiko> chromium on mir with andyrock:
<hikiko> - we now have a git project on lp, a mir platform (empty, but we compile with mir classes) and we are adding code
<hikiko> eof
<willcooke> thanks hikiko
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: Laney
<Laney> sup
<Laney> let's just take a breath
<Laney> in and out
<Laney> ok, that'll do
<willcooke> :D
<Laney> â¢ Debugged / fixed a 'no password' bug in unity-control-center, uploaded that (& a branch for Robert)
<Laney> â¢ Fixed emacs24 build failure which was blocking stuff. Forwarded that to Debian. 25 is still broken differently & others are looking at that
<Laney> â¢ Fixed gst-libav regression in x-updates & upstream, waiting in -proposed now
<Laney> â¢ Tried to push on u-a-l switching to upstart, hopefully being worked on now
<Laney> â¢ Shared my work on gnome-software 3.24 & made a proposal about branch organisation
<Laney> â¢ Debian updates: gdk-pixbuf & glib2.0
<Laney> â¢ No big work on autopkgtest or appstream this week, just babysitting
<Laney> â¢ Some sponsoring reviews
<Laney> â¢ Found out `nova boot' doesn't work on Zesty (at least against Canonistack) - bisected and filed a bug.
<Laney> â¢ ð
<Laney> ð­
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<willcooke> <bunch of flowers>
<willcooke> #opic qengho
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: qengho
<qengho> * RPi Cr patches. Light discussion with Cr upstream; they're receptive. Patch feedback to J@Foundation.
<qengho> * Cr beta updates.
<qengho> * Cr stable, fixing assert heap-freeing crashes on one machine. Not present on same-architecture other machine. Weeird.
<qengho> * â¥
<qengho> EOF
<willcooke> thanks qengho
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> sorry just wiped out my notes instead of copying
<seb128> can we go back to me in a minute?
<willcooke> :) sure
<willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: Sweet5hark
<Sweet5hark> - that Munich thing
<Sweet5hark> - some TDF admin wrt to contractors
<Sweet5hark> - 5.3.0 upload for zesty before ff (thx jbicha and seb128)
<Sweet5hark> - autopkgtests fix for zesty, fixed the firebird issues
<Sweet5hark> - some upstream refactoring
<Sweet5hark> EOF
<willcooke> thanks Sweet5hark, good luck with Munich
<willcooke> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: TheMuso
<willcooke> * More testing pulse in xenial with latest bluez from zesty, various patches added/removed, etc. I am unable to consistantly use the bluetooth earbuds I have on hand. Both devices support multiple profiles, and neither profile always works, adn things behave differently again if I use different bluetooth controllers. Still not at the point where I feel I have a set of patches that can be backported from pulseaudio upstream to help
<willcooke> with bluetooth matters.
<willcooke> * Managed to sort out the race condition I was seeing with unity-panel-service and at-spi. The solution I've gone with for now is similar to what was used back when we used upstart for user session management, in that I added a service for at-spi for the unity 7 systemd target.
<willcooke> * Spent time testing an at-spi patch from usptream which is attempting to resolve a crash that can occur when exiting an app like GEdit. Its intermitant, so not sure if the patch has done the trick yet.
<willcooke> * Found some possible issues with my gsettings backend for Orca, so spent time tracking those down. Fixes not yet worked out, so that is next.
<willcooke> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: Trevinho
<seb128> he's out today
<willcooke> ah yeah, thanks seb128
<willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<willcooke> - Chasing up snapd features / bugs for desktop use-cases
<willcooke> - Releases: snapd-glib 1.7, lightdm 1.21.4, simple-scan 3.23.90
<willcooke> - gnome-software 3.20.1+git20170208.0.a34b091-0ubuntu1~xenial1 SRU
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> â¢ quite some work trying to fix the langpacks
<seb128> â created a new role account for ppa uploads
<seb128> â generated a new key since launchpad doesn't let you move keys to another account
<seb128> â hit a launchpad bug, rt-ed to get a new email alias
<seb128> â¢ reviews and sponsoring (u-c-c, libreoffice, xkeyboard-config)
<seb128> â¢ iterated on the gnome platform snap with Tre_vinho and did_rocks
<seb128> and looked at some bugs
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<seb128> like the autologin one that Laney fixed (I was trying changing another user which is different codepath)
<seb128> </week>
<seb128> sorry :-)
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: AOB
 * seb128 grrrrs at keeping notes in a unsaved document :p
 * dgadomski is waving
<willcooke> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: dgadomski
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> * recovered from flu
<dgadomski> * was busy with non-desktop stuff, but still plan to look closer into bug #1646585 and #1654696
<dgadomski> eof
<willcooke> hey!  I thought you were still out this week
<ubot5> bug 1646585 in Nvidia "oem-config replaces /etc/resolv.conf symlink with a hard file" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1646585
<ubot5> bug 1654696 in Nvidia "Ubuntu 16.04 Desktop ubiquity documentation is lacking" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1654696
<willcooke> thanks dgadomski
<dgadomski> I managed to fix myself ;)
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2017-02-14 | Current topic: AOB
<willcooke> dgadomski, glad you're feeling better :)
<willcooke> Anyone got anything for AOB?
<willcooke> going....
<willcooke> going
<willcooke> gone.  We can talk after this if needed.
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Feb 14 15:47:29 2017 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2017/ubuntu-desktop.2017-02-14-15.31.moin.txt
<willcooke> thanks everyone
<willcooke> that was fast
<desrt> :D
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> efficient one!
<Sweet5hark> \o/
<ricotz> Sweet5hark, "(re-)add ant and ant-optional" doesnt point to any changes in the diff?
<ricotz> Sweet5hark, and again could you create the 5.3 version-specific ppa?
<Sweet5hark> ricotz: https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ubuntu/libreoffice-5-3 done. not yet resized for 8GB
<ricotz> Sweet5hark, thanks, better make it 10GB
<ricotz> Sweet5hark, what is up with the diff?
<willcooke> Message from clan - who ever made dragging attachments from one email to another in Thunderbird is a superstar
<willcooke> *work again
<seb128> lol, likely upstream in that case
<flexiondotorg> seb128 I've just read the backlog.
<flexiondotorg> What changes were made to the platform snap?
<willcooke> night all!
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-02-15
<Laney> yo
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<seb128> you beat willcooke this morning!
<willcooke> :) morning all
<willcooke> Boy #3 just said his first couple of words.... "egg hole" when talking about an egg box.
<seb128> hey willcooke
<seb128> nice
<Laney> nice!
<seb128> how old are they now?
<Laney> better than "a hole"
<seb128> :-)
<Laney> seb128: good, went to a talk about worm composting last night
<Laney> rock and roll!
<Laney> you?
<davmor2> Morning all  willcooke Laney beat me to it
<willcooke> seb128, 18 months now.  #2 is chatting away and won't stop, but #3 listens but doesn't say very much.
<seb128> I'm good, had a relaxing evening watching a movie
<seb128> today is really nice and sunny
<willcooke> hi davmor2
<davmor2> Laney: you might want to think about composting stuff using worms rather than actually composting worms just a heads up on that one ;)
<seb128> willcooke, they are the same but not quite the same then ;-)
<willcooke> :) very different
<davmor2> seb128: what movie?  and was it good?
<willcooke> seb128, Laney - if FF is "tomorrow" - what time of day does that kick in?  i.e happyaron is going to sync ZFS from Debian.  If he does it tomorrow morning his time does that still count as FF?
<seb128> willcooke, whenever somebody feels like pressing the buttons, usually it's in our afternoon I think
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<seb128> but even if it's synced after I think it's not going to be difficult to persuade them to let it in
<seb128> just need to ask nicely
<flexiondotorg> Morninf seb128 willcooke davmor2 Laney
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> hey flexiondotorg
<flexiondotorg> seb128 I'd like your help with something today if you can spare the time
<seb128> davmor2, "The double" with Richard Gere, sort of thriller/action, it was entertaining enough
<seb128> hey flexiondotorg, sure
<seb128> flexiondotorg, sorry I saw your question yesterday evening but just when reading the backlog after dinner and gf was waiting to watch the movie so I didn't reply
<flexiondotorg> I've snapped an application. Currently devmode, but working towards strict.
<seb128> flexiondotorg, we renamed "runtime" to "platform"
<seb128> in the gnome framework
<flexiondotorg> Thanks ^
<seb128> also the desktop launcher creates the mountpoint for you now
<seb128> so one less thing to do in the consumer snap side
 * happyaron noted platform to his vocabulary of snap
<flexiondotorg> Ah, nice.
<flexiondotorg> seb128 So the snap I have has a feature to "Laucnh at Login"
<flexiondotorg> *Launch
<flexiondotorg> Work correctly place a desktop file in ~/snap/<snap>/rev/.config/autostart
<seb128> does that work?
<seb128> (I guess not)
<flexiondotorg> Well, I'm just about to test in a VM. I'm guessing not.
<flexiondotorg> We'll see.
<seb128> I don't see how that could work
<seb128> it needs to be in a xdg path from the session
<flexiondotorg> If not, do you think symlink to locations in the desktop helpers is the correct way to handle this?
<seb128> that seems hackish
<seb128> is that a dynamic option?
<flexiondotorg> Is XDG_CONFIG_DIRS the right env to poke?
<seb128> like can you check/uncheck a box in the preferences to create/delete the desktop?
<flexiondotorg> seb128 Yes ^
<seb128> XDG_CONFIG_DIRS yes
<flexiondotorg> This application is closed source, so I've not idea if they honour XDG_*
<flexiondotorg> It could be hardcoded.
<seb128> it's easy to test
<flexiondotorg> Yeah.
<seb128> but that env is a list of dirs
<flexiondotorg> Ok, you've given me some food for thought.
<seb128> so it doesn't help you much
<flexiondotorg> I'll do some testing and get some more details.
<Trevinho> hi friends
<Trevinho> willcooke: I forgot to send my notes yesterday morning, sorry.... :-(
<willcooke> blimey, it's Trevinho before noon :)
<willcooke> Trevinho, np
<Trevinho> eheh, well... he's IRCing before noon...
<Trevinho> I'm the kind of person that doesn't like to speak in the morning :-D
<willcooke> XD
<seb128> hey Trevinho!
<seb128> hum,  my firefox doesn't like the update_excuses page, it freezes on it for a while
<flexiondotorg> Morning Trevinho
<flexiondotorg> Trevinho If you have the time later, I think I need some help :-)
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: sure, also now if you want
<flexiondotorg> I just need to complete some testing, so I can be sure of my facts.
<flexiondotorg> Trevinho While I create my Zesty VM, perhaps we can start the conversation :-)
<flexiondotorg> I have snapped a closed source application.
<flexiondotorg> I'm testing this on 16.04.
<flexiondotorg> I've got Indicators "working".
<flexiondotorg> But like the Indicators in Sergios Telegram snap, the icon is a broken image.
<flexiondotorg> I've just installed your updated libappindicator* from the ci-train.
<flexiondotorg> No changed on 16.04 :-(
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: is that qt or gtk?
<flexiondotorg> GTK
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: is that using a themed icon?
<flexiondotorg> GTK2+ infact. It's an Electron app, which are linked against GTK2+
<flexiondotorg> Closed source, so I can't be sure.
<flexiondotorg> There are icons in hicolor and pixmaps
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: I've not tested much the electron case with indicators, but it shouldn't be much different
<Trevinho> seb128: as per discussion with didrocks (https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/pull/36#issuecomment-276000741); want me to add the indicator-gtk3 thing in the runtime again (i.e merging my branch with your changes)?
<seb128> Trevinho, I don't know, as said before when we discussed it in DenHaag we said that the runtime would be a GNOME one, not include unity integration bits
<seb128> we could change that but maybe we should have a meeting/team discussion about it first
<seb128> is there many apps that would benefit from including the indicator in the gnome runtime?
<seb128> and if we do that why don't we include libunity as well to integrate with the launcher?
<Trevinho> seb128: sure, I'd include both in fact... But, libunity is really just for unity... appindicator is also used by mate, kde and elementary
<seb128> right, but it's not part of the GNOME platform
<seb128> we didn't include poppler or external GNOMEish libs so far
<seb128> k, need to go for lunch we can rediscuss it later, as said I don't feel strongly about it, just need to decide how we define that runtime, but also that part/lib is easy to bundle for apps if needed
<didrocks> yeah, I guess it should be from package (hence my comment)
<jbicha> seb128: I'm impressed that the excuses page *doesn't* freeze up chromium (I still use Firefox most of the time)
<jbicha> good morning
<flexiondotorg> jbicha o/
<Laney> I remembered last night (while I was in bed...) that I had wanted to revert https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-session/3.20.2-1ubuntu6
<Laney> but I forgot to do it earlier in the zesty cycle
<Laney> worth another go now, or too late?
<jbicha> this is another time where I wish Ubuntu had an implementation of Debian's codesearch tool
<jbicha> speaking of gnome-session, is it safe to drop the upstart parts there?
<Laney> is /etc/upstart-xsessions empty?
<Laney> only unity8 stuff, I think they don't use gnome-session
<Laney> I would like to say we can drop all the upstart session stuff
<Laney> but the truth is I'm not completely sure
<jbicha> that directory doesn't exist on my zesty computer
<Laney> it's a file
<Laney> upstart: /etc/upstart-xsessions
<jbicha> ok, I see the unity8 stuff there; no other desktops still use upstart?
<Laney> I don't think it's on any more images
<Laney> if it were me I'd wait until upstart itself is removed
<jbicha> ok, it's not really hurting anything there :)
<Trevinho> didrocks: sure, it has to be from package... SRU is in progress
<Sweet5hark> moin
<flexiondotorg> jbicha I've replied to the UKUI bug to hopefully provide some more information that can reduce the number of forks required.
<seb128> flexiondotorg, what is UKUI?
<jbicha> seb128: http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/02/ukui-linux-desktop-environment-ubuntu-kylin
<jbicha> bug 1663477
<ubot5> bug 1663477 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] UKUI desktop environment" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1663477
<jbicha> like I've been saying, Kylin sure didn't communicate about this to anyone else in Ubuntu (at least before this weekend)
<seb128> jbicha, thanks, I fail to understand what's the issue with that though?
<jbicha> the issue with UKUI or the issue with communicating?
<jbicha> originally they were forking a lot more packages than they needed
<seb128> with UKUI
<seb128> it's opensource, if they want to diverge and create their things it's their choice
<happyaron> they still have regular meetings with ypwong about ukui
<jbicha> we don't have a file manager that is designed to resemble Windows Explorer so that's ok if they want to do that
<happyaron> but neither I or FJ_Kong is involved more that giving overall suggestions.
<seb128> the most recent comment from flexiondotorg has a good summary
<happyaron> s/more that/more than/
<jbicha> I'm not sure that they have a record of being able to maintain their forks so that's a possible concern for acceptance into the archives
<seb128> oh come on
<seb128> we never blocked things to be uploaded to Ubuntu because upstream has not a good record of maintaining a project
<seb128> like new stuff are new you can't even know that
<jbicha> actually MATE took a while to be accepted into either Debian or Ubuntu
<jbicha> and this is what they have to show for the file manager
<jbicha> https://github.com/ukui/peony/commits/master
<flexiondotorg> jbicha seb128 One of the devs has joined #mate-dev and we're talking.
<flexiondotorg> I'm ok with the fork.
<flexiondotorg> I just don't want them to make more work for themselves.
<jbicha> I don't think I'm blocking them (the opposite actually) but it's quite a bit of a work to review and sponsor these packages for initial upload
<flexiondotorg> And ideally rebase from master so they get the latest fixes improvements.
<flexiondotorg> Which ^ will also help the review.
<jbicha> if flexion has time to sponsor them, he's the most familiar with the MATE stack
<flexiondotorg> I only have upload power for the MATE stuff.
<flexiondotorg> I can help with the review though.
<flexiondotorg> ANd my last comment explains what I think we be the best approach.
<flexiondotorg> They've already reduced the fork from 20 to 10.
<flexiondotorg> I think we can get that to 7, perhaps 5.
<jbicha> yes if you sign off, I think it will be relatively easy to find a MOTU to sponsor based on that
<flexiondotorg> OK, sure thing.
<flexiondotorg> jbicha The UKUI guys are optimistic that my mate-panel suggestion will work. They are going to give that a try.
<flexiondotorg> I understand why forks of ukui-screensaver, ukui-control-conter are required now.
<flexiondotorg> Aesthetics that upstream won't accept.
<flexiondotorg> They are on a deadline for 17.04.
<flexiondotorg> So now time to rebase the forks now, but they have agreed to do so at the start of the 17.10 cycle.
<flexiondotorg> Which is good enough for me.
<jbicha> from the bug, it looks like they wanted to get their stuff in by beta1 which is probably not going to happen but there's still time for 17.04
<jbicha> probably the wrong channel, but it's a bit unclear if a Feature Freeze Exception is needed for stuff that only affects one non-Canonical flavor
<jbicha> I updated the gtk3 packaging for zesty to 3.22.8; don't know whether I should upload to zesty now or wait for content-hub/s390x
<xnox> jbicha, upload without mir/content-hub build-deps on s390x.
<xnox> jbicha, or upload; and i will followup with mirless build on s390x.
<xnox> jbicha, content-hub/u-a-l will take longer than we thought (there is further porting work required, not just packaging/build changes)
<xnox> hm, i wonder if i can build click-less and upstart-less u-a-p on s390x
<tsdgeos> anyone knows what would be the best way for the distro to default to evdev driver instead of wacom driver for the Yoga 460 touchscreen?
<tsdgeos> so that it actually works as a proper touchscreen
<tsdgeos> i changed /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/70-wacom.conf to use evdev for
<tsdgeos> MatchIsTouchscreen "true"
<tsdgeos> but that seems like a bit backwards since the "wacom" conf file would be loading the "evdev" driver
<seb128> tsdgeos, tjaalton might know
<tsdgeos> tx
<tsdgeos> seb128: now that you're here https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/geonames/more_liberal_city_search/+merge/316102 ;)
<seb128> lol, oh right, that one ... sorry got sidetracked, I do it this afternoon for sure
<tjaalton> tsdgeos: why not wacom?
<tsdgeos> tjaalton: because wacom doesn't send touchevents, just emulated mouse events, so with the wacom driver i can't do 3 finger touch for example, while with the evdev driver i can
<tjaalton> -evdev is in universe btw, -libinput replaced it
<tsdgeos> right, libinput should probably work too
<tsdgeos> let me try it
 * tsdgeos reboots back in a minute
<tsdgeos> tjaalton: yes, libinput is fine too
<qengho> Many of you will be happy to learn Chromium and Google Chrome are switching from Gtk2 to 3.
<seb128> they should wait for the next gtk to be out :p
<ogra_> GTK5 !
<tsdgeos> aren't they at GTK200 by now?
<tsdgeos> or they scrapped that let's increase the number every release thign?
<Sweet5hark> seb128: -0ubuntu2 build did hang due to locking issues(?) and was canceled. looks like an infra hickup, can you retry?
<seb128> Sweet5hark, yeah, I cancelled it earlier but it was taking time and didn't go back to retry yet
<seb128> somebody else did it apparently
<Sweet5hark> seb128: k, thanks.
 * Laney <-
<Laney> before the request, actually
 * Laney was browsing excuses for problems
<Sweet5hark> Laney: hugs
<Laney> hugs to you
<Laney> the changelog made me excited
<qengho> Well that's upsetting. My chromium memory-freeing bug went away after rebooting.
 * qengho boggles.
<flexiondotorg> qengho o/
<flexiondotorg> Did you hear anymore from RPF?
<qengho> flexiondotorg: not very recently. J is cleaning up things he's not happy about.
<qengho> flexiondotorg: I split apart the grand patch and that made the warts more visible.
<flexiondotorg> Thanks. Yeah, the last I saw he wanted to cleanup.
<willcooke> night all!
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-02-16
<willcooke> morning all
<davmor2> Morning all
<seb128> hey willcooke davmor2 Laney
<seb128> how is u.k today?
<Laney> sup
<Laney> i like this anticipation thing
<Laney> it's nice!
<Laney> blue sky
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> we had that yesterday, very nice day, 13Â°C
<seb128> rain in the evening and colder/grey today now
<Laney> did you get out in it?
<seb128> no, but tennis tonight, weather should be good to play, looking forward the exercice!
<davmor2> seb128: ditto on blue sky and sunshine it's like we are in the tropics if it wasn't for the chill in the air
<flexiondotorg> Morning Laney seb128 davmor2 willcooke
<seb128> hey flexiondotorg
<seb128> how are you?
<davmor2> flexiondotorg: Morning dude
<flexiondotorg> seb128 All good here, mostly due to Trevinho being awesome yesterday :-)
<seb128> he fixed your indicator issue?
<seb128> what was it?
<flexiondotorg> Yes and complicated.
<flexiondotorg> Trevinho has a silo and some SRUs being lined up.
<flexiondotorg> Sec...
<flexiondotorg> https://github.com/3v1n0/snapd/commit/694a27e413de09e0aa4ffb25cf3b3196566d22c7
<flexiondotorg> https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2477
<seb128> oh, nice
<flexiondotorg> Chroimum is a edge case, is the TL;DR.
<flexiondotorg> ANd I ran into an issue Trevinho had seen a couple of days previous and already prepared a fix for.
<flexiondotorg> However, current snap I'm working on.
<flexiondotorg> I have clean logs, nothing on stdout.
<flexiondotorg> And audio doesn't work.
<flexiondotorg> At this moment, you realise, closed source is deeply inconvenient.
<flexiondotorg> seb128 I was thinking about our conversation yesterday, exposing ~/.config/autostart to snaps.
<seb128> yeah
<flexiondotorg> https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/blob/master/common/desktop-exports#L134
<seb128> right, something similar would work I guess
<flexiondotorg> That link to a file in "real" user home. Could we not use the same tedhnique to link the ~/.config/autostart directory?
<seb128> easy to try
<flexiondotorg> Just wanted a second opinion.
<flexiondotorg> OK, I'll give that a go later.
<seb128> sounds like a good option to me yes
<seb128> great
<seb128> let me know how it goes
<flexiondotorg> Wilco.
<Laney> that should probably check XDG_CONFIG_HOME first
<Laney> wait
<Laney> what is /home/$USER/?
<Laney> the real home directory?
<JanC> AFAIK /home/$USER/ would be the default but not necessarily the real home directory?
<seb128> Laney, wdym?
<Laney> https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/blob/master/common/desktop-exports#L140
<Laney> is that trying to symlink from your real home directory into the snap thing?
<seb128> Laney, I don't think the snapd interface allows for re-allocatable userdir
<seb128> same issue with that apparmor profiles
<seb128> that with*
<seb128> so it only works in the standard case, which is not universal yes
<seb128> re-allocatable->relocatable
<Laney> if it used $HOME then could you set /etc/apparmor.d/tunables/home and get it working?
<seb128> no idea
<seb128> feel free to try and submit a patch for the launcher if it does :-)
<Laney> riiiiiiight
<seb128> but yeah, you probably have a point
<seb128> worth a bug
<seb128> but probably not enough of a priority that I'm going to look at it this cycle
<seb128> but maybe Didier or other would pick it up
<seb128> Laney, https://bugs.launchpad.net/snappy/+bug/1577472 is sort of an issue with relocated userdir
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1577472 in Snappy "The remapped $HOME directory shows as read-only to applications running in a snap" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> or maybe not, comments are bit confusing
<Laney> :-)
 * Laney filed an issue for now, thanks!
<happyaron> wonders who to ask about NEWing packages?
<happyaron> got this one... https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/zesty/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=zfs-linux
<Laney> Usually you would wait for a bit before asking :P
<Laney> especially syncs are processed regularly
<happyaron> sure, :)
<Laney> oh I forgot, happy feature freeze day!
<willcooke> cking, hi!  Hopefully you can see in the scrollback happyaron's comment on the NEW queue ^ that's your ZFS sync
<cking> willcooke, yep, very grateful for this! kudos to happyaron
<Laney> happyaron: well done on making it be synced again
<cking> yep, that is a heroic piece of work
<ximion> Laney: hey :) Is libmo usable already?
<ximion> looks pretty good to me, tbh
<Laney> ximion: It works
<Laney> I think it wants a _new_from_bytes thing
<ximion> yeah, that would be nice for asgen
<Laney> exactly
<Laney> that should be not too bad to implement
<Laney> *also* I fuzzed it and it has some crashes
<Laney> needs to check file lengths and stuff
<Laney> so I would do those fixes before making a release, but you can work against it now if you want
 * ximion always wanted to fuzz AppStream - so farthis is still on my todo list
<Laney> afl is pretty easy to use
<Laney> oh also it has no testsuite of course /o\
<ximion> Laney: a release of libmo would be nice
<Laney> sure, just need to do the crash fixes
<Laney> could call that 0.1 then
<Laney> ah, I saw that the submodule bug in meson was fixed too
<ximion> well, asgen is also pretty light on tests... :-/ (but it's also one of those harder-to-test cases)
<ximion> jup
<Laney> so you could have it as a submodule for now if you wanted
<Laney> i.e. the outer meson.build should (if it is really fixed) be able to set libdir and so on
<Laney> to put libmo in a private directory
<ximion> Meson is getting so much better lately - they now have fixed all issues I complained about in the past
<ximion> yes, maybe I'll do that
<Laney> otherwise, I want to get to those bugs within a week or so
<ximion> I also want to submit patches to the Git-to-D tool to make it possible to invoke it as part of the build process and also to switch between dynamically loading libraries and linking to them directly
<ximion> basically get my changes upstreamed
<Laney> s/git/gir?
<ximion> but I need to finish my review essay first
<ximion> yes, GIR
<ximion> as in Invader-Zim-GIR
<Laney> GrrrrrrRRRRrrr
<Laney> ximion: what are you planning with mo files? :-)
<Laney> the languages thing?
<ximion> yes - the languages thing was the original reason for me wanting libmo
<ximion> although reading out that information from .mo files is trivial even without libmo
<ximion> but if we are going to have it anyway for the Ubuntu part, we can just as well use it for more
<ximion> btw, the D language situation is also getting better - Red Hat has a guy working on things with D upstream, and kalev recently made the Fedora side work well
<ximion> some guy wrote a NixOS backend for asgen
<ximion> things look good
<ximion> except for the RAM usage, which is still insane
<Laney> nice
<Laney> what are redhat using it for?
<ximion> I think at time it's just a general "we want to have all languages work well" thing, paired with GNOME developers looking for alternative languages to recommend people when developing for GNOME (C and JavaScript both have disadvantages to newcomers, and Vala isn't very healthy)
<ximion> so, no formal company-wide interest, but some people doing stuff I assume - either way, it already massively improved things
<Laney> nod
<ximion> Laney: I recently played around with the D-based web framework vibe.d, which is - unlike the standard library - really well designed and has very useful features
<ximion> if I really add a MongoDB or SQL backend to asgen one day, maybe depending on the whole web framework wouldn't be a terrible idea
<ximion> (e.g. its logging facilities are good, it has a nice streaming interface, sane JSON serialization, async I/O, etc.)
<hikiko> fatal error: error in backend: IO failure on output stream.
<hikiko> has anyone seen this error before?
<hikiko> I upgraded to zesty
<hikiko> and tried to build something
<JanC> I think D is more common for game programming than for desktop programming...
<happyaron> :)
<happyaron> was at dinner
<Sweet5hark> seb128: urgh, ricotz was right about the changes for the autopkgtests missing. They are in git (https://git.launchpad.net/~libreoffice/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/commit/?h=ubuntu-zesty-5.3&id=fa92df6e10606bfb020872121bbf8e7011a4a852), but somehow not in the upload. Must have messed up my jenkins here  ...
 * Sweet5hark investigates.
<Sweet5hark> arrrgh
<Sweet5hark> lets have generated files in git, it will be awesome
<Sweet5hark> like, when was that actually ever a good idea?
<Sweet5hark> the good news is: there is nothing wrong with my CI ...
<seb128> Sweet5hark, you might want to ask on #ubuntu-release if they can skip the autopkg for that one, explaining that following upload is going to fix things but that we might get the new version in zesty before waiting for another build/infra round
<seb128> Sweet5hark, you might want to mention what package/issue you are talking about in addition of the text copy ;-)
<Sweet5hark> seb128: heh, yeah, done. http://people.canonical.com/~bjoern/zesty/5.3.0/libreoffice_5.3.0~rc3-0ubuntu3_source.changes <- has the proper change, SCM diff is here: https://git.launchpad.net/~libreoffice/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/commit/?h=ubuntu-zesty-5.3&id=f4b5ece6b1783202ed286e1f149ab60c3471f180
<seb128> Sweet5hark, k, I'm waiting a bit to see if they want to move the current version over before sponsoring the new one
<GunnarHj> seb128: Hi Seb, what about the langpack update? Should we postpone it again?
<seb128> shrug
<GunnarHj> seb128: Sorry to be a nuisance. ;)
<Sweet5hark> seb128: k, thanks
<seb128> GunnarHj, next you are going me to re-review xkeyboard-keyconfig aren't you? ;-)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Well, ... yes
<GunnarHj> seb128: Saw that wgrant will open zesty translations soon. At least one good news.
<seb128> GunnarHj, I plan to have another look to that one ... langpack I'm going to try to have a look this afternoon if I see what's the issue, as said I set up the new account/key but somehow it's not working and I don't really know how to debug so need to sit down and learn more about that stack
<seb128> GunnarHj, right
<GunnarHj> seb128: I see. Probably only you and I know about that schedule, so it's not a big deal. Please let me know when we are ready to go with the call for testing.
<seb128> GunnarHj, k, I let you know when I figure things out
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ack.
<andyrock> qengho: hey do you know if chromium uses a custom version of mesa?
<andyrock> there is a mesa in third_party but it looks old
<qengho> andyrock: Er, I didn't think it used mesa at all.
<qengho> andyrock: I have never noticed, is a better way of saying that.
<andyrock> i think it does and we need include the mir patches there
<qengho> andyrock: I guess you can tell easiest by running "find pathtolocalmesa -type f -exec touch {} \;" and  if running "ninja" needs to build anything new, then it does.
<andyrock> or maybe not (maybe they're using it just for chromeos not sure)
<attente> desrt: do you remember how to get the ipc_dir and app_id for snaps in your proxy?
<desrt> you have to give them to me
<desrt> it's part of what the security backend is supposed to do
<desrt> for snaps i think ipc_dir is xdg_runtime_dir + "snap.snap-name".  take a look at what directory gets added to the apparmor stuff there.
<attente> yeah, i was trying to remember the location, but actually i don't know how to get the app_id through apparmor
<attente> desrt: i can give you the context/label but i don't know if this corresponds to an app_id correctly
<desrt> i pass you that gvariant with the dbus peer credentials
<desrt> the apparmor label is inside of that
<desrt> ah.  talk to snap people about that :)
<desrt> but i guess it does, no?
<attente> no clue. i remember seeing some labels like usr.bin.firefox so i thought that was just a re-write of the path of the binary...
<desrt> ya.. but snaps follow some sort of scheme, don't they?
<desrt> like confined:snap.whatever
<attente> actually, the context is the binary location it seems like
<desrt> well, it is surely possible to that that into a snap id
<tyhicks> hey
<tyhicks> we're mixing two different things here
<jbicha> Laney: for Feature Freeze, are you ok if I upload onboard 1.4 later this week so that we can merge from Debian experimental or should I just upload to zesty now?
<tyhicks> the apparmor label can be anything and is defined at the top of the AppArmor profile
<tyhicks> traditionally, we've used the path to the binary and substituted '/' chars for '.'
<tyhicks> snap confinement does things differently
<tyhicks> it uses the following pattern: snap.<snap>.<app>
<Laney> jbicha: Ok, if you test it properly
<attente> tyhicks: that isn't necessarily the same as the app id is it?
<tyhicks> attente: it is in the case of snap confinement
<attente> but we can't rely on this in the case of non-snaps, right?
<tyhicks> attente: correct
<attente> ok
<tyhicks> attente: do you have a need to differentiate between snaps and non-snaps?
<attente> tyhicks: also is the ipc directory location standardized?
<tyhicks> attente: hmmm... ipc directory? are you talking about a location in the filesystem that the snap can create named socket?
<attente> tyhicks: i'm just trying to think of a situation where i might end up passing the apparmor label to desrt's proxy and it doesn't correspond to an appropriate app id
<desrt> tyhicks: there is a feature in snappy that happened a while ago where there is a hole punched in the xdg runtime dir
 * tyhicks reads https://bugs.launchpad.net/snap-confine/+bug/1620442
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1620442 in Snappy "snap fails because XDG_RUNTIME_DIR is set to /run/user/1000" [High,Fix released]
<desrt> oh.  you found it before me :)
<tyhicks> looks like XDG_RUNTIME_DIR is now set specifically for snaps running under confinement
<tyhicks> but note comment #9 :/
<desrt> ya
<desrt> imho they messed things up
<desrt> BUT
<desrt> the /run/user/1000/snap.qt5-systray/ thing being created and shared is absolutely correct
<desrt> and that's what we set ipc_dir to
<tyhicks> attente: remind me what piece of code are you're referring to when talking about passing the apparmor label to the proxy
<attente> tyhicks: it's a small function in desrt's proxy that obtains the dconf paths using libapparmor with the added patches jjohansen sent to the ML
<desrt> tyhicks: basically, i need two things
<desrt> 1) a place to put a file, and 2) a unique identifier
<desrt> from a really practical standpoint, i actually only need 1
<desrt> since that could act as a unique identifier
<attente> desrt: but it seems like all we can really obtain is the apparmor label
<attente> and i don't even think that's enough to get you the correct ipc dir
<desrt> can't you parse the apparmor file or something?
<desrt> and is it really the case that the label can be just anything?
<desrt> doesn't snappy force it to follow the expected format?
<tyhicks> all snappy profiles followed the expected format
<desrt> so that's the answer
<tyhicks> yes
<attente> desrt: does it matter for non-snaps?
<desrt> well
<desrt> as long as non-snaps aren't called with something that looks like a snap id...
<tyhicks> it is common for things in userspace that deal with apparmor confinement to look for the "snap." prefix and treat those profiles/processes specially
<desrt> yes.  exactly that.
<tyhicks> as a distro, we won't ship an apparmor profile that looks like a snap id unless it is for snap confinement
<desrt> attente: do you have everything you need to know, now?
<tyhicks> a system admin may make the mistake of creating a local apparmor profile that begins with "snap." but it is highly unlikely
<attente> sorry if i'm being obtuse guys... but how exactly do i go from apparmor label to /var/snap/${snap_name}/current
<desrt> you rather go to /run/user/xxx/snap.${snap_name}
<desrt> that's the ipc dir
<desrt> and the apparmor label is snap.${snap_name}... so it's pretty easy
<attente> so the reason i'm not seeing the directory is that it hasn't been created by anything yet?
<desrt> ya... that's arguably a bug
<desrt> i think someone opened a new one fort hat
<attente> desrt: and you don't really care if the app id is an app id, as long as it's a unique id?
<desrt> what case are you imagining?
<attente> well i was just thinking of throwing the apparmor label in there
<desrt> attente: if i understand tyhicks correctly, then this is always correct
<desrt> just make sure it starts with "snap." and you're good
<attente> and we don't care about confinement of non-snaps, right?
<desrt> correct.
<tyhicks> hmm?
<attente> ok :)
<tyhicks> we're not going to be mediating dconf/gsettings access by non-snap processes?
<tyhicks> attente, desrt: ^
<attente> tyhicks: how does dconf know the difference? by checking if the label starts with "snap."?
<tyhicks> attente: yes, that's how you would know the difference
<jdstrand> snappy is going to be the main consumer, but I would hope that this wouldn't be a snapd only thing. it should be possible to craft your own policy for something outside of a snap that uses this mechanism
<tyhicks> attente: however, I feel like we still want to mediate non-snap processes that are confined
 * jdstrand notes he hasn't been following terribly closely to the conversation
<tyhicks> I agree
<jdstrand> I mean, upstreamableness alone makes it that we want to make it not snap-specific, but yeah, there is still a lot of software in the distros and from 3rd parties that people might want to apply policy to
<tyhicks> what we may do is add a rule to /etc/apparmor.d/abstractions/dconf to grant blanket access to the confined apps that are already using dconf
<tyhicks> the typical flow is to get the apparmor label of the connecting process
<tyhicks> if it is "unconfined", grant full access
<attente> if it starts with "snap.", then the ipc directory is /var/snap/${snap_name}/current
<attente> if it doesn't, then the ipc directory is just /run/user/1000
<tyhicks> that'd work but I don't if that's the best ipc directory for the snap case
<attente> and always use the apparmor label as the unique identifier that desrt needs
<tyhicks> yes
<tyhicks> and always query apparmor about what to do unless the label is "unconfined"
<attente> tyhicks: which directory is best? it pretty much has to be something standard and easily derivable from the label
<jdstrand> tyhicks: well, in the past this is where we introduced -strict. eg, dbus abstraction got rules to connect to all of the system bus, but a new dbus-strict was added that only allowed a few things. that way existing policy doesn't break and people can use the stricter abstraction as the desire
<jdstrand> snapd would use -strict and build up what it needs
<tyhicks> jdstrand: yeah, that'd work
<tyhicks> jdstrand: do you have a suggestion for where attente should create a file for IPC in the case of snap confinement?
<jdstrand> I need to read backscroll for full context
<tyhicks> attente: the proxy is creating this file on behalf of the app?
<tyhicks> jdstrand: we still need to gather full context because I don't know all of the details regarding who is creating the file and what it is used for
<tyhicks> jdstrand: don't worry about backscroll
<attente> tyhicks: i don't know, desrt ^?
<desrt> ...
<desrt> like, just use the xdg runtime dir subdirectory
<desrt> this is already decided and supported
<tyhicks> that seems reasonable to me but I wasn't sure why attente settled back on /var/snap/${snap_name}/current
<desrt> i have no idea either.  it's xdg_runtime_dir + "/snap." + snap_id
<desrt> there's only one option
<attente> ok
<desrt> so it's all clear now?
<attente> yes
<tyhicks> cool
<Laney> jbicha: can you push gnome-session please?
<jbicha> Laney: done
<Laney> merci
 * Laney breaks all the things
<ogra_> Laney, dont steal davmor2's job !
 * davmor2 break Laney 
<davmor2> ogra_: that was easy to fix
<ogra_> hah
 * Laney keeps davmor2 in a job
<Laney> now someone else gets to put me back together
<Laney> then davmor2 gets to verify that they did it right
<Laney> and so on
<davmor2> \o/
<ogra_> :)
<jdstrand> tyhicks: fyi, that was what I thought we all agreed to as well
<tyhicks> jdstrand: are you talking about using a subdir under xdg_runtime_dir?
<jdstrand> yes
<tyhicks> good
<Laney> night!
<willcooke> nighty night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-02-17
<willcooke> morning all, happy Friday
<Laney> morning
<davmor2> Morning all
<willcooke> lo Laney davmor2
<Laney> what a nice day!
 * Laney has been outside tending to the worms this morning
<willcooke> Laney, did you get a wormary?
<Laney> yeah, got it last year
<willcooke> woo
<Laney> I can't tell if any of them are still alive
<willcooke> ha!
<Laney> they don't do much in the winter
<Laney> quite a lot of unwormed food ...
<Laney> ...
<Laney> when I can unwrap it in a month or so I'll dig down to the middle and see
<Laney> I went to a talk by the worm lady on Tuesday
<Laney> she said she puts hers indoors for winter
<seb128> good morning u.k
<willcooke> hey seb128
<willcooke> Laney, have you got a shed?
<Laney> hey seb128!
<Laney> willcooke: nein
<Laney> well, there is one at the allotment but that's not helpful :P
<willcooke> . . o O (UK comes online and talk turns to sheds immediately)
<Laney> it doesn't atually smell, so would be ok in the kitchen
<Laney> not the most attractive object ever though
<Laney> :D
<willcooke> :)
<Laney> what a life
<Laney> seb128: how's it going?
 * desrt is thinking about getting a shed
<seb128> good, it's friday!
<desrt> you know... to put stuff in
<desrt> maybe like, to go and hang out in... drink a beer...
<willcooke> I was going to buy a gold fish for my water butt - it could eat all the insect larvea, but the pet shop man said a) I was mental and b) you can't put a gold fish from the shop outside in winter, need to wait for summer
<desrt> (i've never had a shed.  am i doing this right?)
<seb128> though my back is a bit blocked, woke up yesterday with it
<willcooke> desrt, a shed is a wonderful thing
 * Laney gives seb128 some hot stones
<seb128> thanks!
<Laney> shed at the allotment contains tea making facilities
<didrocks> hey desktoppers! :)
<willcooke> morning didrocks
<willcooke> didrocks, getting any sleep yet?
<didrocks> willcooke: yeah, we are quite lucky, baby only wakes up when hungry
<desrt> omg it's like all the favourite people
<didrocks> and we finally got him to eat every 4h \o/
<desrt> :D
<desrt> * dadrocks continues training
<desrt> *** level up!
<didrocks> yeah, clearly in progress training :)
<didrocks> I don't declare victory yet, it seems you can level down quite easily :p
<jbicha> good morning
<Henster> whoop whoop
<flexiondotorg> Morning desktopers. I'm in Blue Fin today.
<flexiondotorg> Out this afternoon talking to some organisations about snaps.
<davmor2> Laney, seb128: latest round of zesty upgrade have left me with no working ethernet and no work vpn
<Laney> it would be good to know what you upgraded
<davmor2> Laney: yeah just getting it from history.log
<davmor2> Laney: http://paste.ubuntu.com/24013034/
<jbicha> davmor2: you use NM right? do you have -proposed enabled?
<davmor2> jbicha: yes the NM, no to proposed
<didrocks> Laney: just answered you on https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/issues/53 FYI
<didrocks> I'm tempted to close it, or do you have any better idea to reach the real $HOME?
<didrocks> I even asked upstream to export an env variable to us, was said needing considering
<Laney> hey didrocks ;-)
<didrocks> happy Friday! :)
<Laney> can you have a label saying that it's blocked on upstream?
<Laney> well, up to you
<jbicha> davmor2: 2 things that changed yesterday are network-manager and systemd
<Laney> it's not that important
<Laney> happy friday to youuuu
<didrocks> Laney: let me see if I can create that
<didrocks> done! :)
<Laney> davmor2: I would ask happyaron and/or cyphermox about network stuff
<Laney> didrocks: â¥
<davmor2> jbicha: I see nm1.4.401ubuntu1 got installed as did openvpn 3.23.90-0ubuntu1 so that could well be my issue
<davmor2> Laney: will do
 * Laney upgrades to experience this pain too
<Laney> huh, how did glib get in?
<Laney> I was going to investigate the test failures
<Laney> meh, skipped
<jbicha> Laney: I uploaded gobject-introspection to zesty for you since it should be updated alongside glib
<Laney> "for me"
<jbicha> well if you update one, you should update the other, right?
<davmor2> Laney: that was why I had to reboot half my apps wouldn't open due to incompatibility
<jbicha> willcooke: snap://moon-buggy works for me on zesty, did you kill gnome-software first (or log out and log in)?
<willcooke> jbicha, hey!  Yeah, I reboot as well just in case
<willcooke> This is on X
<willcooke> well, correection, this is on my X desktop - which maaaaaybe I've fiddled with
<willcooke> I'll try it on a vanilla install
<greyback> desrt: hey, could you spare me a minute to help me with a problem I'm having with gtk apps: http://imgur.com/a/vbpJe
<greyback> seems there are widgets which have a background color set as fully transparent
<greyback> I've no idea how that could have happened however. I've not messed with any theme afaik
<willcooke> greyback, which release are you on?  I think we still have some theme issues on Z
<greyback> willcooke: yep, am on zesty
<willcooke> I also notice that they're not the tabs with the dark and light tabs (where light is the currently selected one)
<willcooke> I think this is probably "just" a theme bug
<jbicha> greyback: what app is that?
<greyback> willcooke: Correct. Yeah probably theme, I just wasn't sure if I had done that or not
<attente> terminator?
<greyback> jbicha: terminator
<attente> which is gtk2 iirc
<jbicha> and try setting the theme to Adwaita before blaming light-themes
<willcooke> that explains the dark/light tabs then
<jbicha> maybe try terminix?
<greyback> jbicha: correct command? gconftool-2 --set --type string /desktop/gnome/interface/gtk_theme Adwaita
<greyback> I also see it in gcalc
<greyback> just for the input widget, making it hard to use
<jbicha> uh, can't you just use System Settings>Appearance to change the theme? (which uses gsettings) for Adwaita, you need to install gnome-themes-standard for gtk2 support
<jbicha> honestly, I don't think I use any gtk2 apps any more (I don't think chromium-browser really counts here)
<greyback> jbicha: adwaita theme does fix the issue, thanks. But I'm not a fan of the theme :)
<qengho> FWIW, the Chromium coming up in ~10 weeks switches to GTK3.
<jbicha> greyback: thanks, that confirms it's probably light-themes then
<greyback> for the record, I'm using the default ubuntu "Ambiance" theme
<jbicha> qengho: say hi to Trump tomorrow, he's campaigning in Orlando to be President of the US I here
<greyback> ah, light-themes supplies Ambiance. Ok, now I follow
<jbicha> I hear
<qengho> Don't troll me.
<cyphermox> davmor2: Laney: on upgrade for zesty; you get a new openvpn which gets rid of an old deprecated option that we use for the Canonical VPN
<cyphermox> you'll want to replace tls-remote with verify-x509-name in the config if you use openvpn directly (along with the relevant changes to its value), or in the NM openvpn config, change a drop-down in the advanced window
<cyphermox> under TLS Authentication, the first drop-down should now be "Verify name exactly", and you want to remove "/CN="
<cyphermox> ^ this is relevant to anyone who upgraded openvpn or is about to, really.
<davmor2> cyphermox: that might be a good one to send out to allhands maybe
<seb128> k, I'm dropping from IRC a bit earlier today, going to a weeding this w.e so taking the train, going to work offline a bit there (or might be back online if they have wifi working)
<seb128> have a nice w.e desktopers
<willcooke> see ya seb128 !
<cyphermox> davmor2: yeah, IS is supposed to.
<desrt> have fun seb128 !
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> greyback: terminator became gtk3
<Laney> try this: https://code.launchpad.net/~laney/terminator/gtk3.20-embedded-css/+merge/316094
<Laney> I should probably upload that
<greyback> Laney: cool, let me try that
<greyback> Laney: works! Thank you
<Laney> no worries
<attente> desrt: hey, how do you test your proxy?
<Laney> cyphermox: thx for the tip
<Laney> actually the config had it in already but commented out
<desrt> attente: i get a shell inside of a confined app and i send messages
<Laney> with a note saying that NM wanted the old thing :)
<desrt> attente: but you can also get the dconf library built in the branch and set an envvar to tell it to talk to the proxy
<attente> desrt: does that mean you have multiple running instances of dconf-service?
<desrt> no
<desrt> the proxy is a separate process
<desrt> i use the proxy from the tree against the system dconf service
<desrt> you always have one system dconf and one proxy
<desrt> wanna duo?
<attente> desrt: sure
<desrt> "william hua is unavailable"
<desrt> i wait for you to call me :)
<attente> duo needs camera and microphone access o.O
<desrt> ! those assholes
<Laney> funky song funky song
<Laney> 1) just saw a man shouting at a pigeon for flying too close to the main road
<Laney> 2) going to take off a few minutes early to catch a choo choo
<willcooke> LOL
<willcooke> Have a good one Laney
<willcooke> jbicha, installed a vm with Xenial and still broken here
<willcooke> right, night all, hope you have a good weekend.
<Henster> hey guys is there a official ubuntu server general chat?
<sarnold> Henster: there's #ubuntu-server but it's perhaps more focussed than most people would associate with "general chat"
<Henster> @sarnold sweet thanks
<meetingology> Henster: Error: "sarnold" is not a valid command.
<flocculant> :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-02-12
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers!
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<didrocks> good morning
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<oSoMoN> how was the week-end?
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN, week-end was uneventful, visited a place where we could build a house though and it looks nice :)
<didrocks> and you?
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, re didrocks
<didrocks> re seb128
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<oSoMoN> didrocks, nice!
<flexiondotorg> Bonjour desktopers
<seb128> hey flexiondotorg
<oSoMoN> hey flexiondotorg
<didrocks> hey flexiondotorg
<duflu> Morning didrocks, seb128, flexiondotorg
<oSoMoN> I had a really good week-end, went to the theater on Saturday and cycling with my daughter and cooked tartiflette for friends yesterday
<seb128> nice
<didrocks> hey hey duflu ;)
<seb128> you like cheese-based meals on sunday :)
<didrocks> sounds nice oSoMoN!
<seb128> hey duflu
<flexiondotorg> duflu: Morning
<oSoMoN> seb128, I do :)
<oSoMoN> good morning ricotz
<willcooke> morning all
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<seb128> hey willcooke, had a good w.e? how is u.k today?
<willcooke> hi chaps.  Chilly but sunny
<willcooke> So pretty nice
<seb128> nice
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<didrocks> https://community.ubuntu.com/t/call-for-participation-an-ubuntu-default-theme-lead-by-the-community/1545/477
<didrocks> "I think it was a very good decision to lock some threads to designers only" -> Yes! especially from some people frowning upon it at first :p)
<seb128> haha
<ricotz> hey desktopers
<ricotz> oSoMoN, hi
<seb128> hey ricotz
<GunnarHj> Good morning seb128!
<willcooke> ogra_, thanks for replying to that dude who had desktop file issues.
<ogra_> np :)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Your eyes on bug #1707898 would be much appreciated.
<ubot5> bug 1707898 in systemd (Ubuntu) "systemd translations are not synced with upstream" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1707898
<seb128> hey GunnarHj
<seb128> GunnarHj, yeah, you said so on friday :)
<seb128> I'm going to have a look, I've just been busy (and sick/a bit slow on friday)
<willcooke> Anyone know which airport I want for easy transfers to downtown Berlin?
<willcooke> Tegel looks like the closest
<doko> both work
<willcooke> cool, thanks doko
<Trevinho> hey guys
<Trevinho> anyone with multi-monitor setup can verify this SRU bug (one of the latest remaining): https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1671432
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1671432 in unity (Ubuntu Xenial) "Global application menu does not follow mouse move for displaying submenus in multi-monitor setups" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<willcooke> Trevinho, trying now via a VM...
<Trevinho> oh thanks, let's hope it ueses multi-monitor correclty
<willcooke> bah, it doesnt
<willcooke> no good, sorry Trevinho, I'd have to reinstall Xenial to test
<Trevinho> willcooke: no worries, let's see if someone else can do it
<willcooke> Trevinho, maybe a post to the hub and we can share on socials
<seb128> Trevinho, willcooke, I can give it a try
<seb128> Trevinho, good morning btw :)
<willcooke> HI!
<willcooke> :D
<seb128> lol
<duflu> Hi and bye
<duflu> Hi and bye, Trevinho
<Trevinho> hi and bye duflu :)
<Trevinho> hi seb128
<Trevinho> thanks
<oSoMoN> ricotz, have you pushed all your changes to ubuntu-bionic-6.0 ?
<oSoMoN> I'll run autopkgtests for 1:6.0.1~rc1-0ubuntu0.18.04.1~lo1 in a VM
<ricotz> oSoMoN, yes
<oSoMoN> excellent, thanks!
<oSoMoN> and thanks for figuring out that missing translations bug, that was nasty
<ricotz> yeah buried deep in the buildsystem :(
<tkamppeter> oSoMoN, hi
<tkamppeter> oSoMoN, I talked with you in NYC about the print dialog of LibreOffice.
<oSoMoN> tkamppeter, ack, I'm having lunch now, I'll ping you when I'm back at the desk to chat
<tkamppeter> oSoMoN, OK.
<oSoMoN> tkamppeter, I'm back
<oSoMoN> can you refresh my memories of the print dialog? I remember you talking to me about it, but quite vaguely tbh
<oSoMoN> tkamppeter, is it https://trello.com/c/TxIN7fGQ/1-make-all-print-dialogs-use-current-printing-technologies-via-common-backends-cpdb ?
<tkamppeter> Yes, exactly this. the backend libraries and the backends are now packaged and in Universe and MIRs are posted.
<tkamppeter> This would mean that if you let LO build-depend on the backend libraries (cpdb-libs) the need of the MIR will get evident.
<tkamppeter> oSoMoN, ^^
<oSoMoN> tkamppeter, so what's needed exactly? a simple additional build-depend is enough, or also patches to LO ?
<ximion> Laney: for when you're back, what is needed to update appstream-generator / libappstream to refresh the data for Bionic? Newer generators are able to be a bit more relaxed when finding icons, which might be very beneficial to find new apps
<ximion> they also support fonts a bit better and add support for webapps
<seb128> ximion, he's back on wednesday
<tkamppeter> oSoMoN, you need to check whether said change is already in the LO version which you are usinng. If not, yoiu need to backpoort the change as distro patch. In addition, you need to build-depend on cpdb-libs so that ./configure will setup for building with cpdb-libs support.
<seb128> tkamppeter, do you have an upstream bug reference?
<tkamppeter> seb128, upstream bug reference for what?
<seb128> tkamppeter, well, were those print dialog changes proposed upstream? if so there must be a bug report/merge request?
<oSoMoN> tkamppeter, when was it merged upstream? do you have the commit ids ?
<jbicha> tkamppeter: you shouldn't add the Build-Depends until the MIR is approved since it will just cause LO to get stuck in bionic-proposed
<seb128> jbicha, he said was was needed to build with it, not that it needs to be done now
<seb128> jbicha, hey btw
<jbicha> howdy
<tkamppeter> oSoMoN, seb128: Here we go: https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/#/c/40565
<seb128> tkamppeter, do you know if any distribution is enabling that backend yet? can it be split into a new binary that is installed only why those who want to test it?
<tkamppeter> seb128, do not know about adoption by other distros.
<jbicha> seb128: yet another MIR needs a bug subscriber :| LP: #1748905
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1748905 in libdazzle (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libdazzle" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1748905
<tkamppeter> seb128, the principle is that on the system backends for each print technology (currently CUPS and Google Clkoud Print) will get installed separately.
<tkamppeter> seb128, by a D-Bus broadcast call the print dialog finds the backend and listed the printers supplied through each of them so that the user can use them.
<tkamppeter> seb128, Immediate advantage for LO user is:
<tkamppeter> 1. Google Cloud Print support just out of the dialog.
<tkamppeter> 2. Support for the newest CUPS printing technology, especially CUPS' ability to auto-create queues for network printers.
<tkamppeter> Future advantages will be:
<tkamppeter> 1. All apps (GTK, Qt, LO, ...) will use these backends, so they will all have complete printing supports.
<tkamppeter> 2. Modifying one backend, for example for advances in its print technology, security fixes, ...  will make the changes available for all apps immediately.
<tkamppeter> seb128, ^^
<seb128> jbicha, did you notice that n-m hit failing autopkgtest issues?
<jbicha> seb128: yes but I'm hoping someone else can look into those autopkgtests :|
<tkamppeter> oSoMoN, still any questions?
<seb128> jbicha, lol, that's why I asked
<seb128> tkamppeter, sorry I was in an hangout
<seb128> tkamppeter, I know the advantages of the common backend, but it's new and not well tested and might have crashes and bugs that the current libreoffice backend doesn't have
<oSoMoN> tkamppeter, so I checked and your code is in 6.0, which will make its way to bionic this week, but until that MIR for cpdb-libs is approved it is premature to add a build-depends in libreoffice
<seb128> tkamppeter, which is why I'm asking if it can be optional/installed as an extra file
<oSoMoN> if no new backends are installed by default, and LO falls back graciously to cups as it works today, that should be fine
<seb128> so those are extra files?
<seb128> which means you could build-depends on it even if it's universe as long as the result deb is in universe
<seb128> if you create a new binary for it I mean
<jbicha> seb128: I'm not exactly a network guy, I just have helped with updates since I guess I cared more about NM than others :(
<tkamppeter> seb128, AFAIK the student has also put a fallback that if there are no backends installed on a system that LO will use the old method, but for the automatic change support LO needs to get built with cpdb-libs.
<seb128> jbicha, yeah, thanks for that, no problem, it's just than now we need to find somebody who is wanting to figure those issues out
<seb128> we are a bit all busy atm
<oSoMoN> tkamppeter, and that fallback mechanism has been well tested I assume?
<gQuigs> for nm, where do I see autopkg test failures for dev?
<seb128> gQuigs, people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html#network-manager
<seb128> gQuigs, http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html#network-manager
<gQuigs> ty
<jbicha> gQuigs: congratulations on becoming the new NM maintainer ð
<gQuigs> lol
<seb128> :)
<seb128> pitti, hey, do you still work on systemd packaging? Do you have any opinion on https://launchpadlibrarian.net/356559238/systemd-translations-2.debdiff ?
<seb128> the polkit part seems hackish domain one probably makes sense and maybe xgettext as well
<seb128> wdyt?
<seb128> GunnarHj, ^
<seb128> GunnarHj, I don't really understand the sed hack for the actions files but that should probably be fixed upstream and not in a rules hack
<seb128> jbicha, oh, and for libdazzle / subcribed, ack
<seb128> kenvandine, do you know what's up with https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/snapd/+bug/1746710 ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1746710 in snapd (Ubuntu) "Snap creates redundant duplicate directories in home folder" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> some snaps seems to create untranslated xdg dirs
<pitti> seb128: I forgot whether the gettext support for polkit was something ubuntu specific or actually in debian/upstream
<seb128> hum, good question
<pitti> seb128: if it's upstream, then this should just be done upstream
<pitti> I don't understand the --gettext-package=systemd bit
<seb128> I think gettext upstream learnt to do that
<pitti> it's not explained in the changelog
<seb128> pitti, the bug claims the build is currently generating an untitled.pot
<jbicha> pitti: policykit-1 changelog says the gettext support is a backport from master
<seb128> which intltool-update usually does if you don't give it the domain to use
<seb128> pitti, systemd-237/po$ intltool-update --pot --verbose
<seb128> ...
<seb128> Wrote untitled.pot
<pitti> static void get_localized_data_for_challenge()
<pitti>   gettext_domain = polkit_details_lookup (details, "polkit.gettext_domain");
<pitti>   message_to_use = polkit_details_lookup (details, "polkit.message");
<pitti> right, so the .policy file needs to specify the gettext domain
<seb128> pitti, it was working/generating the right filename in 229 from xenial though, unsure what changed
<pitti> and it seems they don't, and that patch doesn't add it there either
<pitti> oh, it actually does
<pitti> so I'd suggest to instead file a systemd upstream PR that does this (replace translations with the gettext-domain="systemd" attribute
<GunnarHj> seb128, pitti: I built the patch successfully locally. Just bothered by the hackishness.
<pitti> the first hunk seems fine for Debian as well at first sight
<seb128> pitti, that makes sense to me
<pitti> I'm happy to review/land it upstream
<seb128> pitti, should it be send to the BTS for review?
<seb128> the first hunk I mean
<pitti> (the second part, I mean)
<seb128> right
<seb128> pitti, danke!
<pitti> for the first hunk, I'm okay with committing it directly
<seb128> nice
<seb128> GunnarHj, ^
<pitti> it just seems a  little too borad
<seb128> GunnarHj, does that sounds good to you?
<pitti> broad
<pitti> the explicit xgettext is only meant to extract translatable bits from the .policy files, right?
<pitti> as the rest should be done by intltool-update?
<seb128> I guess
<seb128> GunnarHj, ^
<GunnarHj> pitti, seb128: Is the "first hunk" equal to the first patch I submitted to the bug report? Yes, xgettext is there only to include the strings from .policy files.
<pitti> GunnarHj: right; I wondered if that can be called on src/*/*.policy.in instead of everything?
<pitti> just to avoid second-guessing the build system too much and extracting it twice
<pitti> GunnarHj: no, a "hunk" in a patch is a part that is separated by @@
<pitti> i. e. the smallest "atom" of a patch
<pitti> GunnarHj: i. e. in https://launchpadlibrarian.net/356559238/systemd-translations-2.debdiff
<pitti> GunnarHj: the first hunk is the --gettext-package=systemd/xgettext part
<pitti> the second the mangling of the .policy files
<pitti> which should be fixed in the upstream build system rather -- there's little point in  having them work against each other
<pitti> and this is useful for other distros too
<GunnarHj> pitti: Right, I got that, just mentioning that the bug report includes a first debdiff  with only that.
<pitti> GunnarHj: right; just wanted to clarify what "hunk" means, as you asked
<pitti> . o O { takes a while to revive memory of all this âº }
<GunnarHj> pitti: Would you suggest that I change the xgettext call to include "called on src/*/*.policy.in" instead of pointing to POTFILES.in?
<pitti> GunnarHj: oh, nevermind me - POTFILES.in is already just the "extra" files
<pitti> so that part is fine, I'll commit it now
<GunnarHj> pitti: Actually it includes one .c file (two after the patches have been applied.) OTOH it ignores those.
<GunnarHj> s/it/xgettext/
<pitti> GunnarHj: right, but that's acceptable noise :)
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok, that was the main reason for my concern.
<pitti> so I figure meson figures out the bulk of *.c files to look at automatically
<GunnarHj> pitti: Actually I don't think other .c files include translatable strings.
<GunnarHj> pitti: At least no such strings appear in the .po files.
<pitti> GunnarHj, seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/systemd/+bug/1707898/comments/18
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1707898 in systemd (Ubuntu) "systemd translations are not synced with upstream" [Medium,In progress]
<pitti> thanks!
<GunnarHj> pitti, seb128: So, if I understand it correctly, you would suggest that I file an upstream bug, where "gettext-domain="systemd" is added to the .policy files instead of the translations?
<pitti> right
<pitti> as support for that is in polkit, I see no reason to not fix that upstream
<GunnarHj> pitti, seb128: Ok, got it. Thanks for helping out with this!
<pitti> I'm happy to immediately backport that afterwards
<pitti> to avoid having to wait fort 238
<pitti> GunnarHj: thanks to you for spotting and fixing!
<seb128> pitti, thx! :-)
<GunnarHj> pitti: Just one problem: I'm not able to provide a patch for that change. Don't know how to make meson do what we want.
<tjaalton> should I have squashfs/nsfs mounts active per every snap installed?
<pitti> GunnarHj: let's discuss that on the upstream issue; Zbigniew might actually know
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok. Just file a verbal issue for now.
<seb128> tjaalton, likely yes but that's rather a question for #snappy
<tjaalton> alright
<kenvandine> seb128, i actually thought all snaps created untranslated xdg dirs :)
<kenvandine> i have a branch for the helpers to try to address it
<seb128> kenvandine, if they do it's buggy see the launchpad bug reports and screenshots
<kenvandine> but it didn't work :/
<seb128> good
<seb128> less good :(
<seb128> I can help you debug later if you want
<pitti> GunnarHj: please mention me with @martinpitt somewhere, so that I get  mailed
<seb128> but for now I need to step out for a bit
<GunnarHj> pitti: Will do.
<kenvandine> seb128, https://github.com/kenvandine/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/commit/9be256f76362a4f109890e033d9fc5467144f715
<kenvandine> seb128, if you have ideas
<xnox> didrocks, gnome-shell fails to start, if one has upstart removed, but in "rc" state with config files not purged =( i think maybe gnome-shell / ubuntu-session or some such should force remove things.
<didrocks> xnox: is that due to gdm?
<didrocks> like, does the gdm "gdm" session even starts?
<didrocks> (maybe, let's try to find the root cause rather than forcing purging)
<xnox> didrocks, gdm starts, but I am failing to login. There may have been a couple of issues 1) somehow my login got reset to "GNOME" instead of "Ubuntu" session -> changed that by hand
<xnox> 2) in .xsession-errors I saw that /sbin/upstart is being executed by /etc/X11/Xsession.d/ scripts, but is not there, noticed that upstart is removed, but not purged (hence the left over config file)
<xnox> so I purged upstart, and then logging in started to work.
<xnox> it should be reproducible by installing upstart, removing it, but not purging, and trying to login.
 * xnox think upstart Xsession.d scripts are not designed to work sensibly when upstart is uninstalled....
<didrocks> xnox: the "GNOME" reset is due to wayland transition, but it's only cosmetic, the fallback default is ubuntu
<xnox> ack
<didrocks> for the session part, it sounds like more an upstart integration issue for user session
<tsimonq2> tjaalton: Ping, did you see my ping from Friday?n
<tjaalton> tsimonq2: and replied, but didn't have time to fix that yet
<oSoMoN> ricotz, FYI, IÂ just pushed https://git.launchpad.net/~libreoffice/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/commit/?id=cb98b45509c8fe810daba893e56df2003466e02a
<GunnarHj> xnox: We have made some progress on systemd translations (bug #1707898). p_itti committed one part to Debian, and I have files an upstream issue about the rest.
<ricotz> oSoMoN, I noticed :), make sure to request a cherry-pick to libreoffice-6-0 branch
<ubot5> bug 1707898 in systemd (Ubuntu) "systemd translations are not synced with upstream" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1707898
<oSoMoN> ricotz, where do IÂ request a cherry-pick?
<ricotz> oSoMoN, there is a button in gerrit for it
<oSoMoN> ah, right, I needed to log in to the gerrit webui to reveal it
<czajkowski> ello, does anyone here use Zoom for video conferencing ?
<gQuigs> czajkowski: occasionally.. why?
<mdeslaur> oSoMoN: I'm going to need a 5.4.5 LO package for artful to fix CVE-2018-6871...is that available somewhere?
<oSoMoN> mdeslaur, not yet, 5.4.4 just made its way to artful-proposed today, I'll prepare 5.4.5 tomorrow
<mdeslaur> oSoMoN: ok, let me know when you have it, I'll release 5.4.5 directly as a security update over 5.4.4
<mdeslaur> I need to build it in the security pocket
<oSoMoN> ok
<mdeslaur> oSoMoN: thanks! :)
<oSoMoN> mdeslaur, what about xenial and trusty, should we cherry-pick the fix for the CVE and SRU just that?
<mdeslaur> oSoMoN: I grabbed the backported fixes from debian, and am preparing trusty and xenial updates now
<oSoMoN> excellent, thanks!
<czajkowski> gQuigs: not working on 17.10 so filed a bug with them but wondered was anyone else running into the same issues. cannot screen share
<seb128> czajkowski, do you use an xorg or wayland session? screen sharing isn't going to work under wayland (dunno if that's your issue)
<gQuigs> I use it on 17.10 on Xorg
<gQuigs> but not for screen share
<czajkowski> seb128: yes it's wayland is the issue,  but when I flip over to xorg or unity on login, I still am only able to screen share on Chrome not on FF
<czajkowski> so debugging with the zoom folks
<seb128> k
<seb128> could be a firefox bug if it's only in that webbrowser
<czajkowski> seb128: they ack over wayland being the issue and know it's an issue.
<seb128> czajkowski, right, reason for https://community.ubuntu.com/t/xorg-will-be-the-default-in-18-04-lts/3623 as well or at least one
<czajkowski> seb128: ah so maybe if I upgrade...
<czajkowski> seb128: thanks for the link
<czajkowski> we only just switched from GoTo meeting where it just worked
<seb128> czajkowski, no need to upgrade to change the session, you can pick "Ubuntu on xorg"
<seb128> it's just the default that changed
<czajkowski> seb128: seems to really muck about with my display when I change things about, it could just be this laptop. plus nice to have things just working. Will point the zoom folks at the link you pasted, thank you though
<seb128> yw!
<willcooke> hey robert_ancell!
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, even after reboot gnome-software isn't showing anything :/
<tsimonq2> tjaalton: ack, thanks
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-02-13
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> re seb128
<seb128> re didrocks
<willcooke> morning all
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<seb128> hey willcooke, how are you?
<willcooke> Got a bit of a headache this morning.  Not drink related either :(
<didrocks> argh :/
<willcooke> crap.  late for a meeting already
<Trevinho> Holas...
<willcooke> hey Trevinho
<seb128> hey Trevinho, how are you?
<willcooke> seb128, I'm doing that MIR for xrdp at last. Do we need to be a bug subscriber to it?
<seb128> willcooke, yes, desktop-packages, I can do it
<willcooke> seb128, thanks, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xrdp
 * didrocks is MIRed bombed :p
<seb128> though the process is a bit backward, need to discuss with the MIR team at some point
<willcooke> ha
<Trevinho> Hi willcooke
<seb128> they make us subscribe the team before the MIR is accepted
<Trevinho> seb128: hey, all good thanks... You?
<seb128> which means we might end up being subscribed to things that get refused
<seb128> Trevinho, I'm good thanks!
<willcooke> yeah thats what I was thinking as well, subscribe before I file the MIR
<willcooke> but then....
<willcooke> I guess we remove ourselves again?
<willcooke> seems odd
<seb128> yeah, if we don't forget :p
<didrocks> same with demotions TBH
<didrocks> the team isn't removed
<seb128> k, need to step out for a bit, I've my phone if needed
<seb128> right
<seb128> we need to clean out that(those) list(s) at some point
<seb128> k, bbl
<didrocks> ttyl seb128
<willcooke> does someone have a handy script to check if the build-deps of a package are all in main?
<didrocks> willcooke: check-mir
<didrocks> willcooke: however, you don't need build-deps to be in main, only deps should be
<willcooke> bah - I did a "apt-rdepends --build-depends --follow=DEPENDS xrdp" to get a list of the build depends, and xrdp depends on "nasm" which is in universe
<willcooke> didrocks, ahh
<willcooke> oh, so similar problem then I think
<willcooke> $ apt-cache rdepends xrdp
<willcooke> Reverse Depends:
<willcooke>   xrdp-dbgsym
<willcooke>   guacamole
<willcooke>   guacamole
<willcooke> and guacamole is in universe
<willcooke> am I reading that right, didrocks? ^
<didrocks> well, the list could be wrong
<didrocks> it suggests it, at least on artful
<didrocks> not a dep
<willcooke> ohh
<didrocks> check-mir should be more correct
<didrocks> have you tried it?
<willcooke> where can I get check-mir
<willcooke> got iut
<willcooke> it
<willcooke> k, so I did apt-get source xrdp, then I ran check-mir on it
<willcooke> and it says
<willcooke> Checking support status of build dependencies...
<willcooke> Checking support status of binary dependencies...
<willcooke>  * xorgxrdp binary and source package is in universe
<willcooke> Please check https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MainInclusionProcess if this source package needs to get into in main/restricted, or reconsider if the package really needs above dependencies.
<willcooke> .
<willcooke> But that's not really clear to me.  Is that good?
<didrocks> xorgxrdp is coming from the same source package?
<didrocks> if so, you are good
<didrocks> $ apt-cache show xorgxrdp
<didrocks> Source: xrdp
<willcooke> yeah, so that's good
<willcooke> I think?
<didrocks> yep ;)
<willcooke> woo
<willcooke> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> yw! /me goes back to ubiquityâ¦
<doko> oSoMoN: lo migrated now
<oSoMoN> doko, ack, thanks
<oSoMoN> I finish preparing 5.4.5 for artful and I switch back to 6.0.1
<willcooke> didrocks, am I expected to fill out the [security] section as well?
<didrocks> willcooke: yes, checking for CVE and such
<didrocks> and important bugs reported in the upstream project and launchpad
<willcooke> didrocks, ack, thansk
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xrdp/+bug/1749148
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1749148 in xrdp (Ubuntu) "[MIR] xrdp" [Undecided,New]
<willcooke> Half way there now, still need to do some more checking on things though
<willcooke> like, does it open a port by default
<willcooke> :/
<willcooke> Should be fixable with config though
<didrocks> willcooke: yeah, and imagine I'm redoing the exact same work with the MIR hat. That's why I want to limit the number of MIRs to review each week
<willcooke> yeah, its loads of work.  You have to become an expert on each package
<didrocks> jibel: do you know if the latest images are working? I've nothing after plymouth. Note that it could be gnome-boxes as well
<jibel> didrocks, yes, i just verified this morning
<jibel> didrocks, it's vry slow to boot the the live session
<didrocks> slow like, more than a minute ? :)
<jibel> didrocks, yes
<didrocks> jibel: ah, ok, trying then! Thanks :)
<jibel> one my machine which is not very powerful
<jibel> on*
<didrocks> we'll see. I'm booting ubiquity mode this time
<popey> What triggers update manager to popup and tell me there are updates? Do I need to logout/login? i see an entry in /etc/xdg/autostart for update-notifier which implies I do
<popey> (I have a machine which has not pinged me about updates, but its been up for a week (not logout/login))
<jibel> popey, update-notifier
<jibel> popey, by default it launches update-manager if it has been launched more than 7 days ago
<didrocks> jibel: confirmed! Just really slow, thanks
<popey> But only on logout/login, right jibel ?
<jibel> popey, no, it should run in the background
<jibel> and periodically do the check
<jibel> popey, check the value of the key /apps/update-manager/launch-time and set it to now - 7days if you want to test the notification
<popey> I don't want to change anything on the system - I want to see what a user sees
<jibel> you'll have to logout/login to reload the latest update-notifier that landed yesterday then otherwise you won't run the fixed version of update-notifier
<popey> aha! ok.
<jibel> or reboot
<popey> Ok, will do.
<jibel> popey, you can still check if latest update-notifier has been installed by unattended-upgrades
<popey> Another machine hasn't receiived the update yet, are they staged? Do only a subset of users get it?
<popey> yes, two machines have the update, two don't.
<jibel> popey, they all use the same mirror?
<popey> yup
<popey> how often does unattended-upgrades wake up?
<jibel> popey, daily
<jibel> popey, logs are in /var/log/unattended-upgrades/
<popey> hm, one of them didn't wake today
<popey> oh, it happens at different times of the day, not the same time each day
<jibel> popey, systemctl list-timers will tell you when it ran and will run
<popey> oh, thanks :)
<jibel> it's called apt-daily something
<popey> interesting
<popey> 16.04.0, 16.04.1 and 16.04.2 have apt-daily. 16.04.3 has apt-daily *and* apt-daily-upgrade
<willcooke> jibel, do you know the difference between those two? ^ Could the missing one be dependent on the new update that went out for update manager?
<popey> Bear in mind I haven't logged out or restarted any of these systems since they were installed some days ago. I could certainly do that now, and see what happens.
<popey> willcooke: on another note, could a non-free video player be added to the "Give me non-free goodness" tickbox in ubiquity? If it was the deb that was installed, that seems like an "easy fix"?
<popey> (not sure how you'd do the snap with that tickbox without significant work)
<jibel> willcooke, I don't know the difference
<popey> jibel: ok, rebooted 16.04.0, it has latest update-notifier and update-manager and on login I got a notify-osd that there were updates, and a crash in appstram-cli
<willcooke> popey, I expect it could, but I dont think that's the right approach.  I'll continue with my queries
<popey> willcooke: ok
<popey> jibel: wheee, update manager has popped up in my launcher
<willcooke> popey, so that appstream crash is /probably/ the one which will be fixed if you can upgrade everything
<jibel> popey, without changing naything?
<willcooke> popey, but you're saying it doesnt stop the update notifier popping up?
<jibel> willcooke, the double free is fixed in recent version of appstream-cli
<popey> correct
<popey> no changes, just rebooted
<popey> I have done _nothing_ to this machine other than boot it, and reboot it just now
<popey> (well, i installed libllvm3.8 because 16.04.1-16.04.2 can't be installed in virtualbox without it, but no other changes, honest) :)
<jibel> hmm, session doesn't start after an upgrade from xenial, super
<willcooke> jibel, for Bionic?
<jibel> yes
<willcooke> popey, so is your machine updated sucessfully now?
<popey> willcooke: I will press the button on it and see what I get
 * willcooke sits on the edge of his seat
<Nafallo> what could possibly go wrong ;-)
<didrocks> jibel: have you tried a full install? ubiquity is segfaulting for me on the current image
<jibel> didrocks, yes, I did
<jibel> didrocks, running xorg?
<didrocks> hum, could be gnome-boxes this time :p
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> it doesn't segfault right away
<didrocks> I can select the options, and such
<didrocks> it's after fscking that it seems to segfault
<didrocks> at first, I was blaming my changes, but just tried on a bare machine
<didrocks> let me try on virtualboxâ¦
<jibel> didrocks, when does it crash exactly?
<didrocks> jibel: I'm finishing up user data, then, I see ubiquity creating the partitions
<didrocks> I think it's just after that that it segfaults (and no python stacktrace)
<didrocks> even with --debug
<jibel> didrocks, you mean python segfaults?
<didrocks> looks like it
<didrocks> jibel: seems to work on virtualbox, can be a virsh driver issue, maybe?
<jibel> didrocks, i'm using libvirt and it works fine
<jibel> didrocks, you're on bionic?
<didrocks> jibel: artful
<jibel> i'm on bionic, it might be the difference
<jibel> upgrade!
<didrocks> yeah, I'll do this, but I have some features to finish before holidays and FF is close :)
<jibel> then what? bionic works fine
<didrocks> still something that I can't do right *now* (maybe tomorrow morning), and I can workaround testing in virtualbox
<didrocks> we got quite some last minutes requirements on component we don't really own, so I need to be effective
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, good morning! I have LO 6.0.1 ready for bionic at https://people.canonical.com/~osomon/libreoffice-6.0.1/bionic/, could you please upload it for me?
<kenvandine[m][m]> oSoMoN: sure
 * kenvandine wonders why my matrix bridge has a double [m]
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, in the future, would you mind creating a single tar of that entire directory?
<kenvandine> much easier to download :)
<kenvandine> i guess i can wget recursively
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, nevermind... wget -R is my friend :)
<popey> jibel / willcooke 16.04.0, .1 and .2 all updating now. https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/i7SJlwAS/update%20all%20the%20things
<seb128> popey, was update-manager autoopened for you on all those installs?
<popey> seb128: after a reboot today, yes.
<seb128> good
<seb128> seems the fix works!
<popey> happy days
<seb128> :)
<popey> Yes, well done.
<seb128> thanks for setting up that testing grid
<popey> np
<willcooke> nice one, thanks all
<jibel> popey, great, that closes this case :)
<jibel> is anything still using upstart on bionic?
<jbicha> jibel: I'm pretty sure upstart doesn't exist in bionic
<seb128> it was removed from Ubuntu post xenial
<jibel> yes and should be removed on upgrade
<jbicha> and it was removed from Debian before Stretch
<jibel> cf bug 1749199
<ubot5> bug 1749199 in upstart (Ubuntu) "Session fails to start after an upgrade from Xenial to Bionic (leftover from upstart, uninstall it on upgrade)" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1749199
<seb128> that's the one xnox was mentioning yesterday
<seb128> upstart needs to clear out its conffiles on removal
<seb128> seems like a packaging fix to do in upstart/xenial
<seb128> and maybe the dist-upgrade to cover users upgrading without having the fixed version installed first
<kenvandine> meeting time!
<willcooke> o/
<kenvandine> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Feb 13 14:31:03 2018 UTC.  The chair is kenvandine. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic:
<jbicha> o/
<kenvandine> Roll call:  andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu (out), jbicha, jamesh (out), jibel/heber, kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<didrocks> hey
<andyrock> o/
<jibel> hi
<Trevinho> hello
<seb128> hey
<oSoMoN> o/
<kenvandine> Happy Tuesday everyone!
<kenvandine> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: andyrock
<andyrock> 1. Gnome-disks and snaps:
<andyrock>    1.1 Proposed a workaround to hide snaps already installed
<andyrock>    1.2 Proposed a debdiff for xenial too
<andyrock> 2. Gnome-online-accounts:
<andyrock>    2.1 Discussing with upstream regarding the UbuntuSSO provider
<andyrock>    2.2 Built a ppa to test goa + ubuntusso
<andyrock> 3. Reviews:
<andyrock>    3.1 https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/bamf/snap-exec-matching-fix/+merge/337249
<andyrock>    3.2 https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/libunity/desktop-use-snap-namespace/+merge/337252
<andyrock> 4. Ubiquity:
<andyrock>    4.1 Writing the Online Account step page (using goa!)
<andyrock> 5. eow
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: dgadomski
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> * fix for bug #1644662 merged upstream, ready to be sponsored for Bionic
<dgadomski> * found cause for bug #1746482, it wasn't a bug, but change of mount.cifs requirements
<dgadomski> * fixed bug #1748122 and upstreamed fix
<ubot5> bug 1644662 in gnome-themes-standard (Ubuntu Bionic) "Icons missing when appearance setting is "high contrast"" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1644662
<ubot5> bug 1746482 in linux (Ubuntu) "mount.cifs stopped working with protocol version>1 and sec=ntlm" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1746482
<ubot5> bug 1748122 in open-vm-tools (Ubuntu) "incorrect tools.conf template is shipped with Ubuntu" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1748122
<dgadomski> eof
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: didrocks
<didrocks> * Session: transition our main ubuntu session to Xorg (https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-session/3.26.1-0ubuntu9)
<didrocks> * GNOME Shell: the date alignement (centering on remaining space) when having any dock is finally merged upstream! https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/3
<didrocks> * Crafted and tested a jhbuild config for aday to test. Found an issue with upstream overamplified icon fixed. Then, got the +1 from GNOME design after testing the overamplified patch set.
<didrocks> * Added a new "reset to 100% at max when overamplificatoin key is set to false" behavior on Allan's request. Rebased the submitted g-s-d patch for this.
<didrocks> * Following this, got a first global GNOME Shell review on overamplification icon: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/2. Rework the patch set as requested (commit order and logical merge/split). Waiting since then for another review.
<didrocks> * MIRS reviews: libfprint (bug #1745454), fprintd (bug #1745455), woff2 (bug #1742743), brotli (bug #1737053)
<didrocks> * Had another look at splitting the minimal install as separate seeds. After giving it some testing and seeing the number of components implied, the work for this don't match our remaining timeline for 18.04. We'll use some shortcuts for this release.
<ubot5> bug 1745454 in libfprint (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libfprint" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1745454
<ubot5> bug 1745455 in fprintd (Ubuntu) "[MIR] fprintd" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1745455
<didrocks> * Continue discussion and feedbacks on the hub & bug reports with the communitytheme team.
<ubot5> bug 1742743 in woff2 (Ubuntu) "[MIR] woff2" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1742743
<didrocks> .
<ubot5> bug 1737053 in brotli (Ubuntu) "[MIR] brotli" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1737053
<kenvandine> didrocks, thx
<kenvandine> #topic duflu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: duflu
<kenvandine> * Totem+Xorg+VAAPI corruption regression (https://launchpad.net/bugs/1747744)
<kenvandine>   - Debugged, bisected (https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=105013)
<kenvandine>   - Now just waiting for a simple patch that reverts the commit that caused it. The offending commit was a needless cleanup that was just trying to remove unused code (which it turns out is not unused).
<kenvandine> * Gnome Shell performance work (https://trello.com/c/Q6JYXPPs)
<kenvandine>   - Multi-monitor frame scheduling: Getting closer to ready-for-review this week. Interestingly the same fix will benefit single monitor setups too, slightly. (https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/issues/3)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1747744 in Mesa "[regression] Video playback in totem is corrupted in X11" [Medium,In progress]
<ubot5> Freedesktop bug 105013 in GLX "[regression] GLX+VA-API+clutter-gst video playback is corrupt with Mesa 17.3 (but is fine with 17.2)" [Normal,Assigned]
<kenvandine>   - Clutter master clock smoothness (https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/issues/25)
<kenvandine>     . Turns out this old experimental fix I already had is now required to make multi-monitor perform properly. The old blocking calls being removed for multi-monitor were accidentally providing a workaround for mutter/clutter's dodgy clock.
<kenvandine>     . Fix awaiting upstream review (https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/21)
<kenvandine> * Daily bug management across gnome-shell, mutter, gdm3, ubuntu-themes, bluez, pulseaudio, dkms, mir, wayland, totem, mpv, libinput.
<kenvandine> * Fun with charts: Something I've been meaning to do for a long time (using the best information I can find):
<kenvandine>   - https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vRDHPxGBHqM6XkT_S8ggtYfD0xchKSUD_z9PopNVE3G1rU05fVSnxDGcDsEstl7gu7N-tzCU6mLUp2V/pubchart?oid=254968654&format=interactive
<kenvandine>   - Obviously it would be better if we could just automate charting of historical data from Launchpad somehow.
<kenvandine> * HELP: Fixes still awaiting sponsorship:
<kenvandine>   - https://code.launchpad.net/~vanvugt/gtk/fix-1698270/+merge/331846 (actually the same fix as proposed for mutter this week)
<kenvandine> #topic jbicha
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: jbicha
<jbicha> â¢ NetworkManager 1.10 in proposed. The autopkgtests needs to be updated for new version, thanks gQuigs for initial look there LP: #1734586
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1734586 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "Merge NetworkManager with Debian 1.10.0-1" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1734586
<jbicha> â¢ Completed vala 0.38 transition
<jbicha> â¢ Lots of work preparing GNOME 3.27.90
<jbicha> â¢ Prepared 4 transitions in PPAs (evolution-data-server, gnome-desktop3, libgweather, vala 0.40)
<jbicha> â¢ Sponsored fontmake into Debian. This is important because it is needed to build many newer open fonts
<jbicha> â¢ Filed LP: #1748905 (needed by gnome-calendar 3.28)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1748905 in libdazzle (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libdazzle" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1748905
<jbicha> â¢ Also packaged psautohint, needed to build the redesigned Cantarell font.
<jbicha> By the way, the GNOME Release Team currently uses Debian as its base to prepare releases with BuildStream so they needed psautohint too.
<jbicha> â¢ upstreaming GNOME bug 737362 is blocked on a "clear rationale" and use cases ð
<ubot5> Gnome bug 737362 in Privacy "Privacy panel is missing switch to disable captive portal detection" [Normal,Reopened] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=737362
<jbicha>  (and a Freeze Exception now)
<jbicha> ð
<kenvandine> jbicha, thx
<kenvandine> #topic jamesh
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: jamesh
<kenvandine> * snapcraft:
<kenvandine>   - finishing work started at the Snapcraft Summit, I landed a PR to use
<kenvandine>     pyelftools to process libraries/executables instead of readelf:
<kenvandine>     https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/1913.  This first step is
<kenvandine>     simply a performance improvement, but opens the way for other
<kenvandine>     improvements: making sure executables match the stated architecture of
<kenvandine>     a snap, better detection of required libraries (and warning when
<kenvandine>     they're missing), reducing the use of patchelf for classic snaps, etc.
<kenvandine> * snapd:
<kenvandine>   - at the Snapcraft Summit, jdstrand reviewed the user-mounts branch,
<kenvandine>     and he requested some sanity checks due to the fact it involves
<kenvandine>     working with mount points and sources owned by the user.  These turned
<kenvandine>     out to be more difficult than anticipated (reconstructing the mount
<kenvandine>     source from /proc/self/mountinfo has a lot of corner cases).  I've
<kenvandine>     been working with Zygmunt to try and solve these.
<kenvandine> * xdg-desktop-portal:
<kenvandine>   - Alexander Larsson took my initial snap support PR and improved it to
<kenvandine>     make the portal service a bit more agnostic to confinement systems.
<kenvandine>     He's also going to move the document portal from the flatpak
<kenvandine>     repository to xdg-desktop-portal, which should also simplify things a
<kenvandine>     bit (previously both services had independent implementations of the
<kenvandine>     confinement detection code).  I've been chatting with him on IRC and
<kenvandine>     promised to provide some testing feedback for the snap side.  The big
<kenvandine>     takeaway here is that we've got upstream buy-in for all this, so this
<kenvandine>     support will eventually be in all distros that provide
<kenvandine>     xdg-desktop-portal.
<kenvandine> #topic jibel/heber
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: jibel/heber
<jibel> - Review of installation and upgrades to bionic. Upgrade from 16.04 fails: session fails to start (bug 1749199), some upgrades are failing with dpkg triggers looping (bug 1747717 for example)
<jibel> - Continued searching the cause of the excessive memory consumption of gnome-software but cannot reproduce the issue after instrumenting the code and upgrading to 3.26.6-0ubuntu1
<jibel> - Itâs been reported that update-notifier was not installed by unattended-upgraded on 16.04.0 to 2. Triaged the case and followed its resolution. Update-manager has been published yesterday to xenial-security and next run of unattended-upgrade should pull update-notifier and -manager, finally notifying users that upgrades are available.
<jibel> - In progress: trigger gnome-software end user tests when a new version is in proposed.
<jibel> - General bug triaging.
<ubot5> bug 1749199 in upstart (Ubuntu) "purge conf files on removal of upstart (was session fails to start after an upgrade from xenial to bionic)" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1749199
<ubot5> bug 1747717 in gnome-menus (Ubuntu) "package gnome-menus 3.13.3-11ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: triggers looping, abandoned - gnome-menus -> ufw" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1747717
<jibel> ...
<kenvandine> jibel, oh i hit that last night in my bionic vm, the gnome-menus bug
<kenvandine> jibel, thx
<seb128> those trigger bugs suck
<kenvandine> yeah
<jibel> it's pretty common, easily recoverable bug annoying
<oSoMoN> been hit by it too
<seb128> Laney usually understand them :)
<jibel> but*
<seb128> he's back tomorrow
<kenvandine> #topic kenvandine
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: kenvandine
<kenvandine> * snapcraft still doesn't have support for building for multiple bases, so I've refocused on building gnome-software snap based on core 16.
<kenvandine> #topic oSoMoN
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey
<oSoMoN> â¢ chromium
<oSoMoN>   â 64.0.3282.140 published to {artful,xenial,trusty}-security
<oSoMoN>   â promoted 64.0.3282.140 snap to stable channel
<oSoMoN>   â updated beta to 65.0.3325.51
<oSoMoN>   â updated hw-accelerated video decoding PPA (https://launchpad.net/~osomon/+archive/ubuntu/cr-vaapi-test/+packages) with latest patch from intel, successfully tested and provided feedback on CL (https://chromium-review.googlesource.com/c/chromium/src/+/532294)
<oSoMoN>   â prepared test PPA for my WIP a11y/osk patch (https://launchpad.net/~osomon/+archive/ubuntu/chromium-osk/+packages)
<oSoMoN> â¢ libreoffice
<oSoMoN>   â fixed bug #1696250
<ubot5> bug 1696250 in libreoffice (Debian) "Please hide Start Center and Math" [Unknown,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1696250
<oSoMoN>   â managed to build 6.0 snap on 16.04, built it on launchpad and pushed to candidate channel, then updated to 6.0.1
<oSoMoN>   â issued call for testing (https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/call-for-testing-libreoffice-6-0-1/3917)
<oSoMoN>   â filed bug #1748151 uncovered while testing
<ubot5> bug 1748151 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "[snap] cannot load hsqldb driver" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1748151
<oSoMoN>   â started thread to identify missing features in LO snap (https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/libreoffice-snap-missing-features-and-known-bugs/3920)
<oSoMoN>   â prepared 5.4.5 SRU for artful (bug #1748999) and handed over to security team, this will be pushed directly to artful-security because of CVE-2018-6871
<ubot5> bug 1748999 in libreoffice-l10n (Ubuntu) "[SRU] libreoffice 5.4.5 for artful" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1748999
<oSoMoN>   â prepared 6.0.1 packages for bionic and asked Ken to sponsor
<oSoMoN> That's all folks ð°
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, i'm still downloading that package... people.canonical.com must be connected to the internet with a string
<kenvandine> usually faster than this
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, thx!
<oSoMoN> uploading was fast on my end
<kenvandine> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> I usually just download the dsc/changes and sign those and then push to people.ubuntu.com
<seb128> then wget the other files and dput from there
<kenvandine> last time it only took a few minutes to download all of it
<seb128> more efficient
<kenvandine> on my gigabit connection :)
<seb128> sorry, sidetracking
<kenvandine> but it's slow today
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> k, so this week
<seb128> â¢ helped Gunnar fixing some translations issues (remmina, util-linux, pkgbinarymangler, systemd)
<seb128> â¢ discussed xorg-synaptic/GNOME/upgrades, posted on the community hub about it
<seb128> â¢ debugged pkgbinarymangler failing to build on bionic (due to dpkg changes)
<seb128> â¢ joined some HR presentations for new managers
<seb128> â¢ usual load of meetings, trello updates, chassing status update for some of the work, ...
<seb128> â¢ some bugs triaging
<seb128> </workweek>
<kenvandine> seb128, thx
<kenvandine> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> - Common Print Dialog Backands: Informed oSoMoN about the availability for LibreOffice.
<tkamppeter> - New laptop: Another 3 years have passed and I have set up my new Lenovo X1 Yoga 2 now. So far everything is working. Need to use X instead of Wayland, need to turn on virtualization and F1-F12 standard function in BIOS.
<tkamppeter> - ippsample: started to package it. These IPP utilities got spun out of the CUPS package.
<tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2018: The Linux Foundation is accepted as mentoring organization. Invited the first mentors. Continued mentoring Sahil Arora.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<kenvandine> tkamppeter, thx
<kenvandine> #topic trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: trevinho
<Trevinho> Â· unity xenial SRU verification (couple of bugs to check, please help)
<Trevinho> Â· BAMF improvements for matching SNAP and Flatpak applications
<Trevinho>   - https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/bamf/snap-exec-matching-fix
<Trevinho>   - SRU'ed at
<Trevinho>     - https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/bamf/snap-exec-matching-fix-x
<Trevinho> Mh, what did arrive?
<seb128> you flooded
<seb128> paste in chuncks?
<Trevinho> Yeah
<seb128>    - SRU'ed at
<seb128>      - https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/bamf/snap-exec-matching-fix-x
<seb128> <-- Trevinho a quittÃ© (Excess Flood)
<seb128> that stopped here
<Trevinho> Â· Libunity .desktop file matching (for gnome dock and unity launcher emblems)
<Trevinho>   improvements:
<Trevinho>   - https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/libunity/desktop-use-snap-namespace
<Trevinho>   - SRU'ed at:
<Trevinho>     - https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/libunity/desktop-use-snap-namespace-x
<Trevinho> Â· Telegram snap published to stable and announced:
<Trevinho>   - https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/call-for-testing-telegram-desktop/3954
<Trevinho>   - https://github.com/3v1n0/telegram-snap/
<Trevinho>   - Ubuntu desktop environment support
<Trevinho>     - https://github.com/telegramdesktop/tdesktop/pull/4398
<Trevinho>   - Fixes for building it on ARM:
<Trevinho>     - https://github.com/grishka/libtgvoip/pull/40
<Trevinho>     - https://github.com/telegramdesktop/tdesktop/pull/4399
<Trevinho>  Â· nautilus search provider for searching in recent files in progress
<Trevinho>  Â· nautilus search provider for locate and studying how to get better matchings
<Trevinho>  Â· Some proposal in how to better implement xdg-open for file:// protocol
<Trevinho>    in a secure way:
<Trevinho>    https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/allowing-xdg-open-to-open-files/3789/5?u=trevinho
<Trevinho>  Â· Some more fingerprint tests
<Trevinho> ð¦
<kenvandine> Trevinho, thx for the telegram snap, it's great!
<Trevinho> :)
<kenvandine> Trevinho, thx
<kenvandine> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<kenvandine> - Worked on GNOME Software channels patch and uploaded to Bionic
<kenvandine> - Backported GNOME Software channels patch to Xenial (not yet SRUd)
<kenvandine> - Investigated GNOME Software memory usage
<kenvandine> - LightDM 1.25.2 release
<kenvandine> #topic aob
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-02-13 | Current topic: aob
<jbicha> last week, willcooke suggested we talk about plans for GNOME 3.28 for bionic today
<willcooke> yes! Let's.  Although, Laney is out
<willcooke> So let's talk about it a little bit, and then carry on next week if needed
 * kenvandine wants 3.28 because 3.28 > 3.26 :)
<willcooke> jbicha, how are you feeling about it?
<willcooke> kenvandine, ditto
<jbicha> ok, I've built quite a bit of GNOME 3.28 but I haven't got the important core pieces done yet (g-s-d, g-c-c, mutter, gnome-shell)
<kenvandine> personally i haven't seen anything scary in 3.27
<seb128> I think we should have different steps there
<jbicha> there are 4 transitions so far (mentioned earlier) but they seem to be smooth enough
<seb128> like I think everybody is going to agree on updating now to 3.27 the components that got no major changes
<seb128> like no UI redesign/big new features/old features that might be useful dropped
<seb128> right?
<willcooke> +1
<seb128> +1
<kenvandine> indeed
<seb128> ok, then it gives us the "what do we do with components where the update is less trivial"
<jbicha> for instance, I'm hesitant on uploading Cantarell to bionic since it regresses some languages
<seb128> jbicha, do you have a list of components in that category?
<seb128> I saw a list of things that need a transition
<seb128> I think we should discuss the more-problematic ones on a case by case
<jbicha> and obviously, we decided earlier that we're sticking with Nautilus 3.26
<seb128> on cost/benefit/work involved
<seb128> right
<seb128> cantarell ... can you open a bug with the status and maybe we can get familiar with it and rediscuss during the week or at the next meeting?
<jbicha> so far things look pretty smooth now except for those core pieces I haven't gotten to yet
<jbicha> there is a proposed Backgrounds Settings panel redesign, I haven't looked at that yet either but that might be too late for 3.28 (just mentioning for completeness)
<seb128> is that the one removing the lock screen background selection?
<kenvandine> i thought that was for sure going in for 3.28
<didrocks> kenvandine: still not in
<kenvandine> at least tobias thought so :)
<didrocks> they started to rediscuss it a week ago
<seb128> some people looked like they were trying to get it landed
<didrocks> to get finallly things moving
<jbicha> it might do that, removing lock screen background selection is controversial even in GNOME so that's one of the issues with the redesign
<seb128> I would suggest that we do the easy components for now, seems we have consensus on that
<seb128> and that should keep us (= jbicha? ;-) busy for most of the week
<seb128> and log bugs with the summary of the big changes/transitions for the ones that need discussion
<kenvandine> would that include all the libs?
<seb128> and review those next week
<jbicha> yeah, the transitions take some time :)
<seb128> kenvandine, no gtk4 by default!
<seb128> if that's what you have in mind :p
<kenvandine> no... definately not :)
<seb128> unsure what libs
<kenvandine> i think we already have latest gtk
<seb128> but any which doesn't involve a complexe transition we better avoid
<seb128> if somebody change lots of APIs we should discuss it
<seb128> something*
<kenvandine> i was thinking libgweather, gnome-desktop, etc
<seb128> that sounds fine, unless they reworked their API
<kenvandine> things i might have in the gnome platform snap :)
<seb128> I didn't look at the specific of the changes from the cycle
<jbicha> (still nothing uses gtk4, honestly I was going to propose we remove gtk4 from bionic before release and re-introduce it in "Chaotic 18.10" to not confuse people a year or two from now who try to build gtk4 apps)
<seb128> that makes sense imho
<kenvandine> +1
<jbicha> kenvandine: I have rebuilt all the rdeps for those libraries so those seem fine
<seb128> no point shipping a static snapshot on a thing being under active work
<kenvandine> jbicha, great
<jbicha> g-s-d is a more complex transition that we can discuss later
<kenvandine> i have a gnome-3-28-1804 snap registered
<seb128> so that's what I suggest, re-stating
<seb128> "I would suggest that we do the easy components for now, seems we have consensus on that
<seb128>  and log bugs with the summary of the big changes/transitions for the ones that need discussion
<seb128>  and review those next week
<seb128> "
<jbicha> seb128: +1 from me :)
<seb128> +1/0/-1?
<kenvandine> great
<kenvandine> +1
<seb128> k
<willcooke> +1
<didrocks> +1
<seb128> sounds like a plan then
<seb128> :)
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<kenvandine> any more aob? :-D
<seb128> thx jbicha for driving that topic forward as usual
<seb128> jbicha, I'm going to try to make some time to help with transitions and reviews
<jbicha> one more thing
<seb128> let me know if you want me to write some of the bugs/summaries or something else
<jbicha> GNOME docs team would appreciate if someone could rebuild the getting-started videos for GNOME bug 791419
<ubot5> Gnome bug 791419 in general "Produce VP9 videos instead of VP8" [Normal,New] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=791419
<jbicha> (that's all from me)
<willcooke> jbicha, I looked at running that last night but fell short
<willcooke> it said "you need the build environment set up" or something like that in the bug
<willcooke> and thats where I gave up
<willcooke> if someone can talk me through getting stuff installed, I will happily leave it running here
<willcooke> Although, the real work is getting the env set up I expect
<willcooke> so perhaps not much help
<jbicha> let's discuss after the meeting then?
<willcooke> kk
<seb128> +1
<willcooke> one thing from me
<kenvandine> great
<willcooke> top tip: crtl-shift-prtscr copies a screen region to the clipboard.
<seb128> the #gnome-fr people were discussing blender, I dropped the bug reference in there to see if any of them maybe want to do that :)
<kenvandine> thx all
<seb128> haha
<seb128> thanks kenvandine!
<kenvandine> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Feb 13 15:03:43 2018 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2018/ubuntu-desktop.2018-02-13-14.31.moin.txt
<oSoMoN> thanks!
<didrocks> thx
<willcooke> thanks
<jbicha> willcooke: did you figure out how to connect to GNOME IRC?
<willcooke> urgh, I'll have to edit a flie
<willcooke> file
<jbicha> I'm thinking we might want to ask jimmac for help with that task since it looks like he did the work before
<seb128> jbicha, that doesn't hurt to at least try asking him how he did it
<willcooke> jbicha, oki, I've got some stuff to finish up here, I'll try and get to it today
<jbicha> great, thanks :)
<jbicha> willcooke: my guess is that the maintainer just didn't want to take the several hours it takes to render the videos
<jhodapp> willcooke, do we have a set schedule for doing stable point releases of an LTS, e.g. 16.04.1, 16.04.2, etc?
<seb128> jhodapp, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseSchedule
<jhodapp> seb128, thanks!
<seb128> yw
<jhodapp> seb128, is that a set cadence that's consistent from version to version, e.g. from 16.04 to 18.04?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> well, there might be some small shifts
<seb128> like don't count exact same days
<seb128> it depends of other factors, upstream, holidays, etc
<jhodapp> seb128, ok yeah, but roughly
<seb128> yes
<jhodapp> perfect
<jbicha> didrocks: the GNOME gsettings key for volume-above-100% is different than Ubuntu's right? how do you plan to handle that?
<didrocks> jbicha: depends, if we get our patches upstream this cycle, I'll handle the transition
<ogra_> probably by dropping that sillyness altogether ?
<ogra_> :P
<didrocks> which sillyness?
<seb128> ogra_, what
<ogra_> "volume more than 100%"
<seb128> what didrocks said
<didrocks> you should have followed the discussion
<seb128> ogra_, stop trolling please
<ogra_> thats one of the greatest nonsense things ... if your amp is at 100% it is at 100% ... fix the drivers if that isnt the case but dont add an option to make the slider go to 200%
<didrocks> thanks, now, try on affected hardwares and fix all the drivers for them
<didrocks> then, we can drop it
 * jbicha recommends that ogra_ watch "This is Spinal Tap" ;)
<seb128> didrocks, step out and focus on useful things  :)
<didrocks> yeah, will do
<seb128> thx
<didrocks> I have enough work than someone dowplaying on hard work we have done pushing it
<didrocks> focusing on*
<ogra_> well, thats not my job and yours neither ... :) i'm just ranting about that silly workaround :)
<seb128> stop ranting it doesn't help
<ogra_> (that iirc was invemnted initially by vlc even ... others just copied in a sheepish way)
<seb128> value the work done here to build a system that users can rely on
 * ogra_ shuts up now 
<seb128> thx
<jbicha> didrocks: I have gsettings-desktop-schemas 3.27.90 packaging, do you want me to push it somewhere for you to work on? (the Ubuntu packaging isn't VCS maintained)
<didrocks> jbicha: I won't work on the transition tright now
<didrocks> right*
<didrocks> jbicha: I have a lot of other stuff to deal with feature-wise. Maybe I'll get to that, but until upstream takes it, there is little value to transition to that key
<jbicha> didrocks: so do you want me to hold off on uploading the new g-d-schemas package? (it's not actually needed in bionic yet)
<didrocks> jbicha: nothing prevents to upload the new g-d-schemas, it's orthogonal
<jbicha> ok
<didrocks> jbicha: so, I would say, just upload it, and we'll see how/when gnome shell upstream review the patches to get that + g-s-d in
<didrocks> until then, we'll keep our patches
<jbicha> GunnarHj: hi, so yelp-xsl is a bit fun
<jbicha> yelp-xsl 3.27 has made incompatible changes that shouldn't be a problem for yelp but will probably be a problem for generating the html for help.ubuntu.com
<jbicha> until someone updates the stylesheet for the new version
<GunnarHj> jbicha: I see that we still have yelp-xsl 3.20. We (usually dsmythies) can build the HTML on e.g. a 16.04 machine, if we don't figure out what needs to be changed. Any hint about the nature of the changes?
<jbicha> yes, that's what I would suggest: that we update yelp-xsl in bionic and just be sure to use 16.04 LTS for building the HTML for now
<jbicha> upstream NEWS says "Massive backwards incompatible updates to stylesheets"
<jbicha> shaunm indicated that it's a problem for help.gnome.org too
<jbicha> but I don't really know specifics more than that
<GunnarHj> jbicha: So probably we'd better wait until they have sorted out help.gnome.org, and start updating our stylesheet after that.
<jbicha> yes, I'll ping you again after I've actually packaged the new version so you can try it out before pushing to bionic
<GunnarHj> jbicha: But I saw that you uploaded 3.20 just recently. Are you about to jump to 3.27 in unstable/bionic now?
<seb128> what's the rationnal to do the update if it creates issues? can we hold on it until next cycle?
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, in case you didn't notice, i've sponsored those packages
<jbicha> seb128: it doesn't cause issues in the Ubuntu archive itself. Only a few people build html from yelp-xsl stylesheets
<jbicha> but yes, it's one of the more complex cases
<GunnarHj> jbicha: There is one reason to wait with the upgrade of yelp-xsl: Nowadays we build the desktop guide HTML from the installed package files, not from the source packages. For that reason it's most natural and convenient to be on a 18.04 machine when building the HTML for 18.04 etc.
<jbicha> ok
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, you suggested olivier provide a single tar for https://people.canonical.com/~osomon/libreoffice-6.0.1/bionic/ to make it easier to download all of the bits, but haven't you used dget before?
<chrisccoulson> eg, dget https://people.canonical.com/~osomon/libreoffice-6.0.1/bionic/libreoffice_6.0.1-0ubuntu1_source.changes
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, oh... great idea
<kenvandine> never used dget :)
<kenvandine> but i have heard of it before
<chrisccoulson> it'll make your life easier :)
<kenvandine> just never think of it
<didrocks> waow, I wouldn't have been able to live so long without dget, even for downloading older sources on launchpad, or other releasesâ¦
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, thanks!
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, have you seen https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/snaps-officially-supported-by-canonical/1719/8 ?
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, oh... i hadn't seen the request for bug tracking
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, thx
 * kenvandine wonders what to put for gnome-3-26-1604
<willcooke> seb128, we did the MIR for xrdp: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xrdp/+bug/1749148
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1749148 in xrdp (Ubuntu) "[MIR] xrdp" [Undecided,New]
<jbicha> willcooke: what's the UI for this feature?
<willcooke> jbicha, UI?
 * oSoMoN EOD, have a good evening everyone
<willcooke> night oSoMoN
<willcooke> too slow
<jbicha> willcooke: do you plan to install xrdp by default in Ubuntu Desktop? if so how would someone turn the feature on?
<willcooke> jbicha, gotya, I thought that was what you meant, but I wasn't sure :)  So there won't be any UI at this point, because I dont think we have time to add anything, and it would be quite complex.  The idea is to make it "easier" for people to enable remote desktop sharing where Ubuntu is a guest as a VM on a host
<willcooke> RDP seems to be the most widely available client on most platforms.
<willcooke> Obviously it's out of the box on Windows
<willcooke> which is the main target
<jbicha> my opinion is that we don't need to add it in the default install if there's no UI for it
<willcooke> so this is just one less step people have to do, i.e. drop the apt install
<jbicha> You could add it to the 'supported' seeds if you just want it to be in main though
<willcooke> interesting idea, hadnt thought of that
<jbicha> I of course can't decide what Canonical wants to support, that's just my input though :)
<willcooke> good to have it, thanks jbicha
<willcooke> I'll read up some more
<willcooke> and with that, good night!
<seb128> jbicha, ideally we would have a switch in control-center for that, but that's not going to be this cycle
<jbicha> seb128: do you think it should be installed by default this cycle?
<seb128> jbicha, I don't really know, there was some talk about having to maintain a custom image if we don't
<seb128> jbicha, I suggested that maybe having it enabled through a cmdline grub option would remove the need for the custom image
<seb128> it's not really the most user friendly thing but would do the job
<jbicha> the nice part about no UI is that "what I don't see doesn't affect me" ;)
<seb128> right, it would be a bit of disk space used
<seb128> but trivial to enable for people who need it through a boot option
<seb128> or similar
<seb128> it doesn't hurt to file the MIR in any case, it's probably going to be installed with an UI to turn on at some point
<seb128> even if it's not this cycle
<jbicha> so GNOME doesn't really support RDP very well (both Boxes and the experimental mutter remotedesktop thing do VNC but not RDP)
<seb128> right
<jbicha> I don't think they are intentionally choosing against RDP; I think they just started with what was easiest
<seb128> which is one of the reasons we went back to default to xorg
<seb128> kenvandine, it looks like the gnome-platform case deserves creating an upstream project in launchpad and using that, there is no ubuntu package fit
<kenvandine> seb128, yeah
<kenvandine> seb128, although users aren't likely to file bugs against it.  they would file bugs against the apps using it
<kenvandine> but app developers could file bugs
<seb128> right
<seb128> the other option is to put e.g the community hub as a link
<kenvandine> i'd rather LP bugs :)
<seb128> then new project :)
<kenvandine> seb128, so what do you think, gnome-platform? gnome-snap? gnome-snap-platform?
<kenvandine> we'll have different names in the store, versioned
<kenvandine> like gnome-3-26-1604 and gnome-3-28-1804
<seb128> kenvandine, gnome-platform-snap?
<kenvandine> better
<seb128> :)
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, i submitted a simple-scan PR
 * kenvandine loves gitlab :)
<seb128> kenvandine, btw on that forum page, does the maintainer needs to be a person?
<kenvandine> it can't be a team :(
<seb128> kenvandine, it seems like it would be better to share the snaps maintainance that having you to handle them all
<seb128> why not?
<kenvandine> well, i guess on the wiki page it could be
<kenvandine> but the store doesn't
<seb128> the store takes an email?
<seb128> or is that linked to the account used for uploads?
<kenvandine> under the store those are published by "canonical"
<kenvandine> on the wiki we are using a forum user
<kenvandine> it would be nice if it was @ubuntu-desktop
<seb128> right
<kenvandine> i guess they don't have to link to users :)
<seb128> the idea is that one can "ping" the maintainer?
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> I see
<seb128> they need to add aliases
<seb128> or groups
<kenvandine> but it sucks being individuals
<seb128> I guess we could create a "desktop-snaps" user and share the crendentials :p
<kenvandine> lol
<kenvandine> that's so 90s
<seb128> heh
<robert_ancell> yay for one click merging
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, thx
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, it was also cool to see the checkbox to delete my source branch when merged
<kenvandine> should keep my tree tidy :)
<kenvandine> that's a real handy feature
<seb128> hey robert_ancell, how are you?
<jbicha> it helps encourage me to use named branches for merge proposals
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, oh btw, something fighting with right now
<kenvandine> something in the snapd-glib build seems racy, at least in snapcraft
<kenvandine> i'm build snapd-glib as a part in gnome-software
<kenvandine> after a clean, it fails to build once
<kenvandine> with
<kenvandine>   ITMRG  io.snapcraft.SnapdLoginService.policy
<kenvandine> snapd-login-service.c:17:27: fatal error: login-service.h: No such file or directory
<kenvandine> compilation terminated.
<kenvandine> but then succeeds on the next try
<kenvandine> if i don't clean
<kenvandine> seems ridiculous to me
<robert_ancell> seb128, hi!
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, hmm, autotools... I should probably just kill snapd-login-service now since snapd doesn't need it.
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, are you building from git?
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, yes
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, i suppose that isn't something i can easily disable?
<kenvandine> nope
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, I'm killing it now
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, oh cool
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> i'm building it stripped down, no qt, api docs, etc
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, btw willcooke is also seeing empty results when selecting categories in gnome-software on bionic
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, just like i was seeing
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, ack, will investigate
<robert_ancell> jbicha, if you could spin out a new snapd-glib that would be handy! (branch is updated)
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, i kicked a new build after you pushed
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, new issue
<kenvandine> config.status: error: cannot find input file: `po/Makefile.in.in'
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, you need to remove that from configure.ac
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, oh... ignore me
<kenvandine> looks like maybe you removed it after i started a build :)
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, yeah, I did a git push -f. I should probably do proper MRs...
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, no worries :)
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, i had just did a cleanbuild when i saw you pushed
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, the good news is this fixed the problem i was having :)
<Sweetshark> guys, any ETA on a CVE-2018-6871 fix? due to irresponsible disclosure this nightmare has been public since a week, yet no updates for ubuntu whatsoever so far?
<sarnold> Sweetshark: some builds are in progress https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-security-proposed/+archive/ubuntu/ppa/+packages
<Sweetshark> sarnold: thx, just saw it in the team meeting log in backlog too.
<Sweetshark> (thx to oSoMoN and chrisccoulson too)
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-02-14
<jbicha> Robert! where'd you go? :)
<duflu> Oh, Mesa 18 is in bionic proposed. Fun times ahead
<tjaalton> not before it goes past NEW and compatible nvidia is there
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<duflu> tjaalton, did 10-bit support make it in? I couldn't find commits
<duflu> (new) commits
<oSoMoN> good afternoon duflu
<duflu> tjaalton, Sorry. Yes it seems it did. I was searching for the wrong string
<tjaalton> yup
<didrocks> good morning
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, Ã§a va?
<didrocks> Ã§a va oSoMoN, et toi ?
<oSoMoN> didrocks, pas beaucoup dormi parce que Gaia a eu de la fiÃ¨vre, mais Ã§a va Ã  peu prÃ¨s
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<didrocks> oSoMoN: oh :( hoping she gets better soon!
<oSoMoN> she's already much better, fever is gone already, but she stays home today just in case
<didrocks> good :)
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<duflu> Morning seb128
<thumper> o/ duflu seb128 didrocks
 * thumper is back in his office for 10pm call
<thumper> yay
<duflu> Hello thumper. I was going to say...
<thumper> :)
<seb128> hey duflu thumper
<didrocks> hey thumper
<didrocks> 10pm call, urgh :)
<seb128> better than 3am!
<thumper> true
<thumper> wouldn't go to that
<seb128> reminds me of the old times where we rotated team meetings by 6 hours every week to not be unfair to anyone
<Laney> OHHHHHHHHHHHHH YEAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
<seb128> seems that Laney is back! ;)
<seb128> Laney, oy oy oy, how are you?
<seb128> had fun during your holidays ?
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> yes thanks, was good to hang out with desrt and see all the cool stuff
<Laney> also get a bit better at snowboarding, was a bit painful though ;-)
<Laney> how are you?
<seb128> I'm good, have been sick again with fever/shivering/etc this w.e though
<seb128> but it was shorter this time
<Laney> :(
<Laney> sick128
<seb128> I'm better now though :)
<didrocks> wb Laney ;)
<Laney> hey didrocks!!!
<Laney> how's it going?
<Laney> ah, and happy valentines day ?
<didrocks> Laney: I'm good, thanks
<didrocks> glad you enjoyed your holidays :)
<Laney> merci merci
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<oSoMoN> welcome back Laney
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, en forme ?
<oSoMoN> pas beaucoup dormi, mais on fait aller :)
<seb128> oh ? qq de malade chez vous ?
<oSoMoN> Gaia a eu de la fiÃ¨vre cette nuit, mais Ã§a va dÃ©jÃ  mieux
<Laney> NSA level encryption
<Laney> moin oSoMoN
<didrocks> ;)
<oSoMoN> :)
<seb128> oSoMoN, ok, bon ben c'est dÃ©jÃ  Ã§a
<seb128> Laney, sorry :)
<oSoMoN> gotta practice my French, or I'll forget completely
<didrocks> ubiquity minimal install is almost done, however the langpacks for thunderbird and libreoffice keep them installedâ¦ Hum, need to think about it
<seb128> hum, annoying
<didrocks> I'm afraid that even if we list them, they will be reinstalled anyway as marked "manually installed"
<didrocks> or maybe not, if it's only a purgeâ¦
<didrocks> hum
<didrocks> worth a try
<seb128> we could change those packages to not pull into tb/libreoffice which is a bit hackish...
<seb128> into->in
<didrocks> yeah, anyway, let's try this first attempt already with explicit listing for now
<didrocks> but something to keep in mind with the various rootfs mounts as xnox wants in the future
<willcooke> duflu, koza - Confirmed your theory.  After reboot, BT Speaker needs to be initiated from the PC *or* if I press the magic button.  Keyboard (K480) reconnects when I hit enter to start logging in (which I assume is the same as "pressing the special button")
<willcooke> seb128, jibel ^
<willcooke> So for me that's a pass.
<willcooke> (the good kind of pass)
<willcooke> hi Laney!
 * duflu is still testing
<seb128> willcooke, thanks for testing, let's see how duflu's testing goes and we should be good to go
<willcooke> ohhhhhh. fiddle.
<willcooke> I reinsalled this machine with Artful yesterday.  Ignore that
<seb128> lol
<duflu> Argh. Broken device. Let me fix that first
<Laney> mfphfp
<Laney> hey willcooke
<duflu> seb128, willcooke, koza, jibel: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bluez/+bug/1747354/comments/9
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1747354 in bluez (Ubuntu) "Update bluez to version 5.48 in bionic" [Wishlist,In progress]
<seb128> duflu, sounds good, thanks for doing the round of testing
<seb128> duflu, and enjoy your evening :)
<willcooke> thanks duflu
<willcooke> My B iso is nearly downloaded
 * willcooke curses wifi
<willcooke> I should do one of those Lunduke style "everything is wrong" videos about wifi and how terrible it is.
<duflu> Yeah. I have speeds working up to 700Mbps or so, and yet the latency is still too high for nice ssh typing. Still need ethernet
<willcooke> duflu, on 5 or 2.4 ghz?
<willcooke> 2.4 is a swamp these days
<duflu> willcooke, 5GHz (which is implied by 700Mbps I think)
<willcooke> oh, that's on wifi!?!?
<willcooke> I figured gigabit ethernet
<duflu> willcooke, no that would be 1000Mbps (exactly)
<duflu> willcooke, time for a new router then? It will improve your life
<willcooke> Not if you use cheap ass CCA cat5 it won't
<willcooke>  /furtive
<duflu> No, but it was hard finding CAT6 in white, to minimize ugliness
<willcooke> duflu, my router is awesome:  https://www.whizzy.org/2015/05/multipathrouting-rasppi2/
<duflu> willcooke, maybe retask it to be awesome without wifi responsibility?
<duflu> willcooke, because your new-ish laptop will have Intel 8260/8265 or similar. That should get near 866Mbps easily
<willcooke> duflu, Wifi issues are just because of where I move my office and the wifi AP while we had the builders in.  I'll be back on cat5(ish) in the next few months
<duflu> Or 867Mbps
 * duflu is still in the habit of assuming things are multiples of 66MHz
<duflu> Or sounding like it
<willcooke> erm.  We're missing the map selector on the installer in Bionic.  Maybe that was removed because of the change around in orders of the screens so that the keyboard settings came before the encryption settigns?
<willcooke> didrocks, relevant to your interests?
<willcooke> ignore, there it is
<willcooke> as expected, moved later in the process
<jibel> willcooke, keyboard has been moved earlier
<willcooke> I think map has also been moved later
<willcooke> but what evs :)
<jibel> it's right after the partitioning
 * duflu falls off chair
<didrocks> pfff, the ppas build are really slow today, doesn't help testing things quicker
<willcooke> seb128, konrad11901 jibel - FWIW - My testing of the PPA is complete, and it's at least as good as 5.46 IMO.  Same re-connection story, So LGTM.
<willcooke> I didnt do the full test, but I did test audio and keyboard)
<k_alam> jbicha: Can this be merged ?
<k_alam> https://code.launchpad.net/~khurshid-alam/unity-settings-daemon/lp-1747154/+merge/337121
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<seb128> Laney, do you know if there any easy way to get into an autopkg bionic/armhf env to try debug an issue?
<Laney> does it need to be armhf or just lxd?
<seb128> dunno, it's to try to debug dconf being blocked due to notify-osd/armhf failing
<seb128> which I can't reproduce on a porter box
<seb128> well that's artful
<seb128> there is no bionic chroot
<seb128> so trying to find another place/way to poke at it
<seb128> I mean the porter only offers artful, not bionic
<Laney> alright, well yeah I'd try running on lxd locally
<Laney> autopkgtest-build-lxd and then autopkgtest ... --- lxd autopkgtest/ubuntu/bionic/amd64
<seb128> Laney, thx
<Laney> if not then maybe we need to ask for bionic chroots there
<seb128> right
<seb128> thx Laney
<Laney> gl!
<seb128> thx
<seb128> well I guess it doesn't hurt to ask for a bionic chroot in any case so still going to that as well
<jbicha> k_alam: uh, it looks like seb128 was already working on that merge proposal?
<jbicha> good morning
<seb128> k_alam, jbicha, I've be asked to review and did that, I don't plan to roll updates for unity components
<seb128> I can do sponsoring if needed though
<k_alam> jbicha: Yes, seb128 approved it but merge is still pending
<k_alam> jbicha: I also asked you review this: https://code.launchpad.net/~khurshid-alam/unity-control-center/uoa-panel/+merge/337618
<jbicha> k_alam: please use the "set commit message" field in those merge proposals. It's required by bileto
<jbicha> bileto's not required for Unity stuff any more, but if you're asking me to merge stuff, I'll probably use bileto :)
<k_alam> jbicha: Ok. Done. :)
<tjaalton> uh, launching snaps seem to recreate Documents etc directories under LANG=C in my $HOME
<tjaalton> already filed, bug 1746710
<ubot5> bug 1746710 in snapd (Ubuntu) "Snap creates redundant duplicate directories in home folder" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1746710
<willcooke> lunchtime ALREADY?!  What's going on todya
<seb128> yeah, same here
<seb128> trying to wrap enough things to be able to eat something
<didrocks> jibel: hey! if you can review/pass that to ubiquity active members: https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/ubiquity/minimal-install/+merge/337698 and https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/ubiquity/minimal-package-list/+merge/337700
<didrocks> jibel: this is an intermediate solution, still flexibale, but not the best. Looking at when the request was made and how much time we have for this cycle with other work, knowing we'll move to something completely different when transitioned with subiquity, I think this is our best shot
<jbicha> Laney: Seb was wondering why we haven't updated glib in bionic to the 2.55 series yet
<Laney> Needs merging afaik
<jbicha> Laney: ok if I do it then?
<seb128> jbicha, do you plan to do the recent gtk update btw?
<seb128> jbicha, just in case you do please can you include https://code.launchpad.net/~vanvugt/gtk/fix-1698270 ?
<Laney> jbicha: If the owner of the merge agrees, no objection from me. :-)
<Laney> we should put that gtk commit into the gtk3 branch too so that it gets in the next release
<Laney> who is brave enough to commit it? :P
<jbicha> I'm fearless, sometimes :)
<Laney> jbicha: & funnily enough I was just building glib
<willcooke> now it really is lunch time, bbiab
<jbicha> Laney: I have the bionic glib merge upload ready if I'm not interrupting youâ¦
<Laney> I meant 2.55.2
<jbicha> ok, let's do that first. btw, https://qa.debian.org/cgi-bin/vcswatch?package=glib2.0 doesn't like it when you have a newer version in experimental than in git HEAD
<jbicha> one way to handle that is just to push new releases (experimental or not) to debian/master, the other is to change the "default branch" in gitlab
<jbicha> a 3rd way is to add " -B debian/experimental" to the end of the Vcs-Git line
<Laney> probably that one, I don't like making unstable not the development focus
<Laney> but I've never used that syntax, where is it documented please?
<Laney> and hmm, glib.git upstream looks a bit weird
<Laney> like the release didn't happen
<jbicha> yeah, at a minimum, it's missing a 2.55.2 release tag
<Laney> there's a commit missing to bump the versions too I think
<Laney> that's probably not going to be fun to fix
<jbicha> I don't know of the -B syntax being documented. It works though (with the theory that you can just paste that line at the end of "git clone "
<jbicha> suggest that mclasen just do a 2.55.3 release instead?
<Laney> i'll let him deal with that
<jbicha> -B is used for https://qa.debian.org/cgi-bin/vcswatch?package=webkit2gtk
<Laney> wonder what's going to happen when we get the next 2.55 now
<Laney> this tag's commit isn't on master
<Laney> fun :>
<jbicha> I'm hoping it will work out ok
<jbicha> I have to use the "git fetch -t" option for situations like this since "git fetch" won't pull tags like that by default
<Laney> yeah because it doesn't point at the branches git fetch will fetch
<ricotz> hey desktopers
<ricotz> could someone cancel/retry  https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/1:6.0.1-0ubuntu1/+build/14345799
<ricotz> it seems to be stuck
<ricotz> the corresponding armhf build deserves a retry too imho (since it built in the ppa) https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/1:6.0.1-0ubuntu1/+build/14345798
<kenvandine> wb Laney!
<kenvandine> Laney, no crutches? :-D
<didrocks> ricotz: done for both
<ricotz> didrocks, thanks
<Laney> kenvandine: :D no, just a bruised bum
 * Laney started doing linked turns
<Laney> falling there can be fast ;-)
<kenvandine> Laney, awesome
<Laney> just in time for the winter olympics
<Laney> #goldmedal
<oSoMoN> ricotz, I'd swear the i386 build was complete when IÂ checked earlier this morning, has it been re-tried?
<seb128> Laney, do you know what's the right way/place to request that porter box update? #is ? RT? other channel?
<ricotz> oSoMoN, it built for 22 hours and was stuck
<oSoMoN> ricotz, I was looking at the armhf failure but I'm not seeing anything obvious, so I'm +1 for a retry
<oSoMoN> ah nevermind it's already been retried
<oSoMoN> thanks didrocks
 * oSoMoN reads backlog
<Laney> seb128: I'd file an RT ticket
<seb128> Laney, that's what I was thinking, #is isn't working, thx!
<oSoMoN> didrocks, my default session is "Ubuntu", and when I reboot my machine and click the sessions dropdown at the login screen, the first one ("GNOME") is selected (although if I don't change anything and proceed with login, it actually logs me into the "Ubuntu" session)
<oSoMoN> known bug?
<seb128> oSoMoN, yes
<oSoMoN> good
<didrocks> indeed, it sounds like GDM has multiple lists :/
<didrocks> if you want to have a look, that happened because it fallbacked to the default session
<didrocks> which is "ubuntu"
<oSoMoN> seb128, didrocks : is there a bug report already, or should IÂ file one?
<didrocks> but gdm doesn't match the dropdown (UI part)
<didrocks> I didn't file one, please feel free :)
<seb128> somebody mentioned it the other day
<oSoMoN> ok, will do now
<didrocks> I did before uploading
<didrocks> not sure if this is what seb128 remembers of :)
<seb128> oSoMoN, it sounds similar to bug #1738389 to me but I don't know if it's the same code defect
<ubot5> bug 1738389 in gdm3 (Ubuntu) "Adding a second user and logging in to the Ubuntu session gives the GNOME session" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1738389
<seb128> didrocks, no, I know you mentioned it, but I think somebody asking about it here as well
<didrocks> as it doesn't impact the default session selection, no reason to push back on setting back Xorg as default
<didrocks> ok
<oSoMoN> gotta handle LO backports for xenial and trusty so IÂ can't look into fixing it now, but IÂ can pick it up later if it's still up for grabs
<didrocks> oSoMoN: yeah, no hurry I think, the correct session is still selected if you don't click the gear menu (and even if you click it and don't select anything)
<didrocks> the reproducer is really easy: select a session, remove it & reboot
<didrocks> crazy that the selected session backend and frontend aren't in sync :/
<seb128> seems it was x_nox on monday
<didrocks> seb128: I think bug #1738389 was the same issue. it's not valid now as I set the default to "Ubuntu" though
<ubot5> bug 1738389 in gdm3 (Ubuntu) "Adding a second user and logging in to the Ubuntu session gives the GNOME session" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1738389
<seb128> didrocks, right, might be the same code issue behind both I meant
<didrocks> yes, just telling that you won't reproduce the exact same scenario due to my patch changing the default
<seb128> right, good point
<seb128> oSoMoN, anyway, your choice to open a new bug or update that existing one/repurpose it
<oSoMoN> seb128, not the same bug, if I read it correctly, as it doesn't involve a second user and the correct session is used, it's only the list display that doesn't reflect it
<oSoMoN> I'll file a new one
<seb128> k
<seb128> oSoMoN, I don't think the second user is a factor in that bug, it's just that it's a fresh state
<didrocks> yes, no valid session selected and never clicked on the dropdown to select one is the bug IMHO
<oSoMoN> didrocks, bug #1749481
<ubot5> bug 1749481 in gdm3 (Ubuntu) "Wrong session marked as selected in session dropdown on login screen" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1749481
<didrocks> sweet! thx
<seb128> oSoMoN, thx, bonus point if you upstream it :)
<oSoMoN> seb128, will do in a moment, gotta file another couple of bugs in the LO snap first
<seb128> oSoMoN, thx
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, would you mind confirming bug #1749484 ?
<ubot5> bug 1749484 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "[snap] fail to launch after logging in to a wayland session then back into an X11 session" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1749484
<GunnarHj> jbicha, seb128: There is still a problem with gnome-sudoku translations:
<GunnarHj> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-sudoku/+bug/1734545/comments/4
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1734545 in gnome-sudoku (Ubuntu) "Translations not updated from upstream" [High,Confirmed]
<seb128> GunnarHj, that sounds like a launchpad question, maybe wgrant on #ubuntu-devel is a better to ask about why the .po didn't make it to the import queue
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, I'll ask him.
<oSoMoN> seb128, didrocks : https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=793456
<ubot5> Gnome bug 793456 in general "Wrong session marked as selected in session dropdown on login screen" [Normal,New]
<seb128> GunnarHj, thx
<seb128> oSoMoN, great, thx!
<didrocks> oSoMoN: I've linked the downstream report to the upstream one FYI. Thanks!
<didrocks> oSoMoN: FYI, it's "also affect projects" -> enter the bugzilla url
<seb128> GunnarHj, https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/bionic/+source/gnome-sudoku has " This source package is sharing translations with GNOME Sudoku stable series. " which I wonder if that's the issue
<oSoMoN> didrocks, thanks, I knew that but I forgot to do it
<GunnarHj> seb128: Yeah, I thought about that too, but syncronization is not enabled. Do you think that removing that upstream link completely can make a difference?
<seb128> who knows
<GunnarHj> :)
<seb128> if wgrant doesn't reply I can try that
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, in a bit
<kenvandine> can't logout right now :)
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, what happens if you reboot?
<kenvandine> and what is $XDG_SESSION_TYPE set to?
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, it's fixed with a reboot
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, let me capture the full env before and after to compare
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, XDG_SESSION_TYPE hasn't changed, it's "x11"
<oSoMoN> potentially relevant changes (before/after): https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/gVYj5mQ2Mj/
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, interesting
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, so some env variables are being appended too?
<kenvandine> replication there :)
<oSoMoN> yes
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, do you see a wayland socket in /run/user/`id -u`/
<kenvandine> when in the x11 session
 * kenvandine is wondering if things aren't being cleaned up
<kenvandine> although that wouldn't explain the weird env variable replication
<oSoMoN> $ ls -l /run/user/`id -u`/wayland*
<oSoMoN> srwxrwxr-x 1 osomon osomon 0 fÃ©vr. 14 16:54 /run/user/1000/wayland-0
<oSoMoN> -rw-rw---- 1 osomon osomon 0 fÃ©vr. 14 16:54 /run/user/1000/wayland-0.lock
<oSoMoN> indeed
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, so the helpers are seeing the socket and trying to connect to wayland
<oSoMoN> and sure enough, removing those files "fixes" the issue
<GunnarHj> seb128: No quick reply from wgrant. Trying without that link appears to be worth a try. I can remove the link, but I can't re-upload...
<kenvandine> seb128, ^^ have you seen issues with the wayland socket being left around?
<seb128> kenvandine, I didn't no
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, you are on bionic right?
<seb128> GunnarHj, right, I can do another upload to see how it goes
<kenvandine> i can't logout right now, i have a cleanbuild running :)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Great! Link gone.
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, yes, that's on bionic
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, the helpers should probably check for the existence of the socket and XDG_SESSION_TYPE
<kenvandine> just to prevent this sort of issue
<kenvandine> but that's not the actual problem
<kenvandine> that socket shouldn't be left around
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, when you're done with your cleanbuild, please try and reproduce, I'd like to know if it's a general problem or only my setup that's busted somehow
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, will do
<oSoMoN> cheers
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, sorry, i haven't forgotten... had a tweak and building again
<kenvandine> almost done though :)
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, no worries
<oSoMoN> I'll very soon be EOD, I hope to catch up with sleep tonight, please comment on the bug
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, will do
<oSoMoN> that's it for today, have a good evening everyone!
<willcooke> ok, I'm off too, night all
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, i've got a build of gnome-software as a snap now
<kenvandine> that works well with categories
<kenvandine> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ken-vandine/gnome-software_git_amd64.snap
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, if you'd like to play with it :)
<kenvandine> currently only has snap and apt backends
<kenvandine> i disabled fwupd
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, and i've requested classic confinement for the store https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/classic-confinement-request-for-gnome-software/4015
<robert_ancell> kenvandine \o/
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, not in the store yet?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, also did you decide not to call it ubuntu-software?
<kenvandine[m][m]> robert_ancell: the current plan is to leave it gnome-software and build it with a bunch of backends
<robert_ancell> kenvandine the backends are different snaps?
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-02-15
<duflu> Hi seb128
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you?
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<duflu> seb128, alright.. you?
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<seb128> duflu, I'm good, not fully awake yet, working on it though!
<seb128> lut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<oSoMoN> good afternoon duflu
<duflu> Good morning oSoMoN
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Hi didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> anyone knows what's up with autopkgtests? the queues are suspiciously empty, and they're neither running nor queued for packages recently built in bionic-proposed
<oSoMoN> like https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/chromium-browser/64.0.3282.167-0ubuntu1 or https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/1:6.0.1-0ubuntu1
<oSoMoN> jibel, ^
<jibel> oSoMoN, hi, no idea
<jibel> Laney, ^
<jbicha> oSoMoN: libreoffice needs to make it through the new queue first. Chromium just finished building on armhf so its autopkgtests should be triggered soon
<oSoMoN> right, the "(New)" suffix should have been a hint
<oSoMoN> thanks jbicha
<popey> I upgraded from 16.04 (Unity) to 18.04 (Unity) and lost CTRL+ALT+T for terminal, is this expected?
<oSoMoN> I'd never seen the queues so empty
<didrocks> jbicha: hey! Do you mind commenting/helping on https://github.com/Ubuntu/gtk-communitheme/issues/135#issuecomment-365672257?
<jbicha> it's a symbolic icon I believe
<willcooke> morning
<didrocks> jbicha: mind answering to them?
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<Laney> hi
<didrocks> hey Laney
<didrocks> thanks jbicha
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<Laney> moin didrocks
<duflu> And morning Laney
<Laney> moin duflu!
<Laney> how goes?
<jbicha> didrocks: can I interest you in doing some binary NEW processing for bionic? specifically libreoffice and libgweather
<didrocks> jbicha: if I new libgweather, I won't review the MIR
<didrocks> so your pick
<duflu> Goes well
<seb128> I can have a look to libreoffice
<didrocks> I don't want to NEW and MIR the same package, that's lacking a double check
<jbicha> libgweather is already in main
<didrocks> ah, it's only a bin NEW
<didrocks> can do in a while
<jbicha> cool, thanks
<jbicha> binnew is usually processed pretty quickly, but since I wanted to do multiple transitions without intertangling them I've been a bit impatient :)
<didrocks> jbicha: libgweather NEWed
<GunnarHj> Good morning seb128! Is there a way to see a generated .pot file when building in a PPA? Asking because of this:
<GunnarHj> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/systemd/+bug/1707898/comments/22
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1707898 in systemd (Ubuntu) "systemd translations are not synced with upstream" [Medium,In progress]
<slashd> o/ desktop, I'm facing a situation where a GCE instance running Ubuntu server doesn't shutdown (when pressing the stop webconsole button) when the nvidia_drm is in use by Xorg and managed by lightdm. The only thing we see in the log at the moment of the stop action is "Power key Preseed" and then nothing mre happens.We have notice that lightdm handle the keypresses. Any idea why the shutdown doesn't complete when lightdm is started ? Is it
<slashd> because it is awaiting for user input within the xorg session maybe to complete ?
<jbicha> ninja: error: unknown target 'gweather-3.0-pot', did you mean 'libgweather-3.0-pot'?
<jbicha> yeah I guess I did mean that ð³
<jamesh> jbicha: I noticed you've been working on packaging pipewire for Debian.  How confident are you in what you've got so far?
<jamesh> (just noticed that latest xdg-desktop-portal depends on it)
<jbicha> jamesh: not confident at all, that's why it got stuck a few months ago
<jamesh> ah
<jbicha> the packaging is at https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/pipewire
<jbicha> I got stuck in figuring out how we want to split it into different packages
<jamesh> ah.  looks like I can disable it
<jamesh> so we can put that off for another release or so
<jbicha> jamesh: are you aware that xdg-desktop-portal 0.10 is already in bionic?
<jamesh> jbicha: I was building from source to test out a not-yet-landed feature
<jamesh> rather than making the support conditional on whether pipewire is available, you need to use --disable-pipewire
<jbicha> kenvandine: good morning
<jbicha> jamesh: I just filed LP: #1749672 but you're going to need xdg-desktop-portal-gtk too, right?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1749672 in xdg-desktop-portal (Ubuntu) "[MIR] xdg-desktop-portal" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1749672
<jamesh> jbicha: yeah.  xdg-desktop-portal without xdg-desktop-portal-gtk doesn't do much
<jamesh> (or xdg-desktop-portal-kde, but that's not so interesting to the main Ubuntu flavour)
<kenvandine> jamesh, yeah i disabled pipewire
<kenvandine> jbicha, oh you filed the MIR, you are awesome!
<jamesh> jbicha: at this point, it mainly gets interesting once we have the snap support working (which is what I'm still working on)
<jbicha> kenvandine: do you want to file the -gtk MIR then?
<kenvandine> and smcv already updated xdg-desktop-portal in debian... i did that yesterday because i didn't think he'd get to it quite this quickly :)
<kenvandine> jbicha, i can
<kenvandine> jamesh, how's that snap support coming?
<jbicha> kenvandine: so um, there's an issue with your Flatpak update in bionic
<kenvandine> what's that?
<jbicha> smcv was surprised you packaged 0.11 since 0.10 is supposed to be an LTS series
<kenvandine> hmmm
<kenvandine> but 0.11.1 was the version that split out the document portal
<kenvandine> that would conflict
<jbicha> we figured that was it and that you were unaware that Alex appears to have backported that to 10.4 that he released yesterday
<jbicha> https://blogs.gnome.org/alexl/2018/02/14/moving-a-portal/
<jbicha> smcv is usually pretty prompt at updating flatpak and xdg-desktop-portal(-gtk)
<kenvandine> ugh
<kenvandine> i didn't see 0.10.4 :(
<jbicha> Alex also backports quite a lot to his LTS series (at least he did for 0.8)
<kenvandine> 0.10.4 doesn't say anything about remove the permission store
<kenvandine> but i guess it must
<jbicha> is "--disable-document-portal" not sufficient? (I haven't looked)
<kenvandine> i haven't looked
<kenvandine> but in 0.11.1 release it specifically says it removed both the document portal and permission store
<jbicha> so we might end up wanting to use a "really" version number here but you can ask Alex what he thinks
<kenvandine> jbicha, indeed it looks like disable-document-portal does suppress build the permission store
<kenvandine> ugh... i hate really versions :)
<kenvandine> jbicha, do you know if smcv is actively working on xdg-desktop-portal-gtk now?
<jbicha> he probably will be soon. You can find him in #debian-gnome on OFTC
<jamesh> kenvandine: I've got most of my test setup for the new xdg-desktop-portal set up.  Just trying to get my portal-test snap rebuilt (partly bitrot, partyl that it doesn't build on straight xenial)
<jbicha> anyway, it's really cool that Snap & Flatpak are working together on some common standards & tech
<kenvandine> jbicha, i might end up distro patching the snap support patch in our xdg-desktop-portal package
<kenvandine> for the short term
<kenvandine> until it's in a released version
<kenvandine> jbicha, just so we can get a head start testing it as feature freeze is quickly approaching
<kenvandine> jbicha, it is really cool
<jbicha> kenvandine: smcv likes collaborating on these packages (even though hardly anyone has shown up to help him yet), so he may be willing to cherry-pick the patch in Debian too
<kenvandine> jbicha, that would be great
<jamesh> on the snap side, niemeyer was against maintaining long term Ubuntu-specific patches, so it is great we've got upstream support
<kenvandine> grrr, the flatpak 0.11.1 release notes really should have mentioned something about the stable series.  i didn't know he uses the even/odd versioning
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<jbicha> kenvandine: it was mentioned way back in the 0.10.0 release notes. I think he just assumed everybody knew :(
<seb128> kenvandine, but you should know better than updating random projects to new series without wondering first how they are handled :)
<kenvandine> seb128, indeed :)
<kenvandine> it works fine though :)
<kenvandine> i actually installed some flatpaks yesterday :)
<jbicha> the version number is confusing, 0.11 isn't obviously a new series compared to 0.10 :(
<kenvandine> yeah
<jbicha> I believe Debian & Ubuntu were the only distros who stayed on the previous 0.8 "LTS" series while everyone else used 0.9 stuff
<seb128> Laney, do you know where one can view the results of autopkgtests triggered against a ppa?
<tjaalton> signal flatpak works, while signal-desktop .deb from signal.org segfaults :P
<tjaalton> on launch
<jbicha> seb128: they are hidden at a URL like
<jbicha> https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-bionic-jbicha-temp20171026/
<jbicha> for PPA jbicha/temp20171026 for bionic
<seb128> jbicha, how do you find out the url?
<seb128> I kicked some yesterday
<seb128> they were on the main page so I know that worked
<seb128> but I would like to see the results/logs today
<seb128> but can't figure out how
<jbicha> just use that URL but replace the part after autopkgtest- for your ppa name
<seb128> or the digits don't change?
<seb128> how weird
<jbicha> once you have the page load, it should show your several names, just add the name to the end of the URL like
<jbicha> bionic/amd64/f/flatpak/20171029_131527_d6930@/log.gz
<jbicha> becomes
<jbicha> https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-bionic-jbicha-temp20171026/bionic/amd64/f/flatpak/20171029_131527_d6930@/log.gz
<seb128> thx
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> that notify-osd/dconf/armhf issue on bionic is over me
<seb128> it seems indeed to fail with the proposed version of dconf
<seb128> but the tests/same script doesn't fail with bionic-proposed and the new dconf on a porter box
<seb128> I tried to rebuild old dconf to see if that's a rebuild with the current toolchain creating the issue
<seb128> but tests are working
<jbicha> seb128: the disturbing part to me about that notify-osd/armhf issue is that basically the only change was:
<jbicha> https://git.gnome.org/browse/dconf/commit/?id=701d19d1
<seb128> yeah, I though maybe it was not an new issue since https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/notify-osd/artful/armhf doesn't have dconf entries
<jbicha> if it were up to me, I'd like to just ignore that test failure ð¤·
<seb128> but seems it is :/
<seb128> at the same time there is no reason we need the new version now
<jbicha> it is a bit of a problem since we are trying to rename d-conf source package to dconf
<jbicha> that doesn't really have to be done for bionic, but â¦
<seb128> you could upload a rename of .0
<seb128> like we delete was is in proposed
<seb128> upload that
<seb128> and sync back the new version then
<mdeslaur> is there a way to show multiple times (timezones) in GNOME?
<seb128> mdeslaur, install gnome-clocks
<seb128> then add locations in there
<seb128> then they should show up in the panel calendar dropdown
<mdeslaur> awesome, thanks seb
<seb128> yw
<jbicha> seb128: I could do the opposite and just revert the new dconf commit with a patch and see if that passes autopkgtest
<gsilvapt> hello all
<gsilvapt> jibel, you around?
<Laney> seb128: btw it's documented at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ProposedMigration/#Testing_against_a_PPA
<jibel> gsilvapt, Hey
<seb128> Laney, DOH, that's the page I used to figure out the url to do the querie, I should have read more :p
<seb128> Laney, thx
<gsilvapt> jibel, how are you doing? I have some questions regarding autopkg so when you have a couple of minutes you could spend with me, that would be great :)
<jibel> gsilvapt, i'm good, thanks! sure, just ask your questions.
<jibel> and I'll try to answer the best I can
<seb128> jbicha, what doesn't make much sense to me is that it works on a porter box :/
<gsilvapt> The thing regarding adding snaps functionality to autopkg. So I want to add a new argument to the command line options like --snap and --snap-channel so it knows it is a snap, it needs to get that snap from the store
<gsilvapt> I found a couple of arguments under autopkg_args.py but I'm not sure how to work with that. I can see some options allow to simply write the bash commands but there are some arguments I have no idea what they represent and where I can read more about it
<gsilvapt> jibel, ^
<jibel> gsilvapt, I can understand why you'd need a 'channel' argument, but why a snap? you know it is a snap because the packaging format is snap. I don't think you need to explicitly mention it.
<gsilvapt> You think? Hum. I thought that would be better so autopkg already knows how to handle instead of having to search the package directory to ensure whether it is a snap or not
<jibel> gsilvapt, also it'd be useful to run from a local snap too. So the dev doesn't have to upload to the store to test his package and it simplifies the workflow
<gsilvapt> So, if --snap command is called, a couple of different methods are called to take care of things.
<gsilvapt> jibel, you can do that without calling any channel command, no?
<seb128> jbicha, oh, I debdiffed dconf versions, that's interesting :)
<seb128> jbicha,
<seb128> -/* dconf.c generated by valac 0.30.0, the Vala compiler
<seb128> +/* dconf.c generated by valac 0.37.1, the Vala compiler
<seb128> jbicha, between .0 and .1, there are lot of code changes in the generated .c due to the change of vala version
<seb128> jbicha, so could be that vala 0.37.1 generated buggy code on armhf
<jbicha> thanks, let's do a rebuild then since ricotz says newer vala fixes several bugs
<jbicha> he suggested rebuilding packages but I believe bionic will be getting an archive rebuild for spectre mitigation so I thought we'd wait for that
<ahayzen> Hey everyone, the minimal install option in the desktop installer looks really cool. I was wondering if the list of removed packages will be documented somewhere? Eg in the release notes or on a file on the disk after install? As it would be nice to know which packages I may need to reinstall to get X feature working, Eg names like vino, remmina, baobab are not as obvious as thunderbird, rhythmbox.
<willcooke> mdeslaur, but you might need to log out and back in
<mdeslaur> willcooke: yeah, that's what I figured
<willcooke> took me a while :)
<seb128> jbicha, rebuild doesn't help, but the package is building from the generated .c no? what we would need is to generated the .vala->.c no?
<jbicha> hmm, we can force it to rebuild from the vala sources
<seb128> or somebody needs to do a new upstream release
<jbicha> 0.27.1 was converted to meson which doesn't have the problem of generated source files in the tarball
<seb128> jbicha, update, maybe that fixes it :)
<jbicha> ok
<seb128> jbicha, in any case I spent half a day on that, I need to go back to other work, sorry I didn't figure it out
<seb128> but yeah I suggest we try regenerating the .c with a newer vala
<seb128> though I still don't understand why it works on a porter box then
<seb128> maybe overriding the autopkg is right :)
<seb128> Laney would probably disapprove of that though
<Laney> I just tried the test using autopkgtest-build-lxd here and it fails like on autopkgtest.u.c
<Laney> so that might be a way to go poke at it if you wanted to
<seb128> Laney, k, thanks, I guess I just need to make some disk space to be able to do that, it just felt more tedious than using the porter box
<seb128> but would have been the right choice
<seb128> now I wasted half a day trying to get porter chroots to reproduce the issue and doing ppa rebuild tries
<Laney> :(
<seb128> it might be easier at this point to rebuild with a newer vala first
<seb128> just to see if that resolves it
 * oSoMoN leaves early to visit a makerspace, have a good evening everyone!
<willcooke> night all.  Long weekend of decorating for me, back Tuesday
<willcooke> ping me on Telegram etcs
<Laney> long enough
<Laney> I'll be on later tomorrow as I've got an appointment
<Laney> so long!
<seb128> Laney, have a nice evening
<jbicha> seb128: regenerating with new vala didn't seem to help :(
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> I guess it needs proper debugging
<seb128> I'm off tomorrow but I can try to have a look next week
<seb128> or maybe Laney wants to help, he said he has a setup to reproduce, he could maybe at least get a bt
<seb128> jbicha, oh, you didn't include the change from https://code.launchpad.net/~vanvugt/gtk/fix-1698270 in the gtk upload :(
<jbicha> seb128: I squeezed it into 3.22.28 upstream :) https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gtk/commits/gtk-3-22
<seb128> oh nice, I see now that it's listed in the Debian changelog entry :)
<seb128> great, duflu is going to be happy
<seb128> on that note calling it a day (and a week, I'm off tomorrow), have a nice evening/friday/w.e desktopers!
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, popey was testing my gnome-software snap on his kde neon install
<kenvandine> and gets an empty catalog
<kenvandine> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/8mMXBQJmWb/
<kenvandine> is the console output
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, it works fine for me in gnome on bionic, 17.10 and debian as well as 16.04 with unity
<kenvandine> seems odd to me that it could have anything to do with the desktop session
<popey> robert_ancell: lemme know if there's anything I can do to help debug this :)
<kenvandine> popey, maybe gnome-software has some if KDE then > /dev/null :)
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, popey empty-catalogue means not apps at all show?
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, "No Application Data found"
<kenvandine> is all his screenshot showed
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, do you have the screenshot handy?
<popey> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/7qNraUNo/Screenshot_20180215_210219.png
<popey> ^
<kenvandine> i just forwarded it via telegram
<kenvandine> but popey was faster :)
<popey> :D
<kenvandine> 14:46:21:0081 GsPluginPackageKit ignoring /usr/share/metainfo/org.gnome.Software.Plugin.Snap.metainfo.xml as does not exist
<kenvandine> interesting paths
<robert_ancell> popey, does running 'appstreamcli search test' from the command line show anything?
<robert_ancell> actually, I'll just spin up a VM - popey, what image are you using for Neon?
<popey> https://pastebin.com/1JNZ9XWN
<popey> eek
<robert_ancell> so there's something provided...
<popey> pastebinit has a bug, i think IS changed our pastebin implementation from serial numbers to unique random characters
<popey> oh, it did work
<popey> ignore me
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, I guess the snap includes appstream-glib? I wonder if there's different paths on KDE Neon
<kenvandine> perhaps
<robert_ancell> a strace might show something
<kenvandine> yes, it's bundled in the snap
<robert_ancell> popey, user edition from https://neon.kde.org/download ?
<popey> i think they made the iso harder to find
<popey> for some reason
<popey> I'm using user lts I THINK
<kenvandine> great marketing
<robert_ancell> https://files.kde.org/neon/images/neon-userltsedition/current/
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, gnome-software snap is in the edge channel now
<popey> lemme find the iso i used to confirm
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, nie
<robert_ancell> nice
<robert_ancell> I am the programmer who says nie
<kenvandine> :)
<popey> NI!
<popey> Also, a shrubbery.
<robert_ancell> nice shrubbery!
<kenvandine> NaN
<kenvandine> :-D
<popey> :D
<popey> the iso is on my phone and the file manager only shows me the first few characters (yay android)
<popey> neon-userlts...
<kenvandine> oh... a linux iso on your phone
<kenvandine> that seems odd :-p
<popey> (I downloaded the ISO over 3g in the USA at the gate while waiting to get on a plane)
<popey> It was quite an adventure
<kenvandine> insane... there i said it... popey is insane
<popey> https://twitter.com/m_wimpress/status/960120216616423424
<kenvandine> oh my, those bottles of ketchup freak me out
<popey> hah
<robert_ancell> I'd never tried as many distributions as I have now we work on snaps.
<popey> Neat huh?
<kenvandine> indeed
<robert_ancell> bing. Downloaded.
<flocculant> jbicha: not sure if gvfs made it out of -proposed yet, but I grabbed it there - all good here on the mtp front for me :)
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, my gnome-software in kde neon just crashes on startup :/
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, that's probable better than what popey was seeing
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, it seems to be crashing in the profiling code
<robert_ancell> hits an assertion
<kenvandine> i just tested it on solus, it crashed at the end of installing quadrapassel
<kenvandine> which seemed to be related to not having the platform snap installed
<kenvandine> i installed gnome-3-26-1604 and now it all works :)
<robert_ancell> oh, I don't have that
<kenvandine> that didn't effect startup though
<kenvandine> just installed a snap that needed it and something crashed
<kenvandine> not sure why
<kenvandine> does snapd auto install the default providers now?
<robert_ancell> don't know
<kenvandine> that could have been the trigger there
<kenvandine> i know that was planned
<kenvandine> anyway... kdeneon is the only real problem one so far
<kenvandine> could that have anything to do with being in a VM?
<kenvandine> maybe graphics related ?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine the crash I'm getting?
<kenvandine> yeah
<robert_ancell> It shows the UI for a split second, but it's just failing to make a profiling object for some reason
<kenvandine> maybe you aren't getting as far as popey because it chokes on graphics
<popey> i am on intel
<kenvandine> yeah, and robert_ancell is in a VM
<kenvandine> should be fine though... i run this in virtualbox
<kenvandine> oh... i gotta go get the kiddo... bbl
<robert_ancell> bye
<robert_ancell> it seems to be refining two apps with a NULL id and hitting an assertion on that. Not sure what's going on there...
<jbicha> robert_ancell: hi, why do you need a transitional package for snapd-login-service? Can't we just have the package be auto-removable?
<jbicha> or in other words, is there anything outside of Ubuntu that should be depending on or recommending snapd-login-service?
<robert_ancell> jbicha, there's nothing that I know of that would have depended on it
<robert_ancell> jbicha, I just thought that's what had to happen. You probably know this stuff better than me.
<jbicha> I think we might want to do some kind of maintscript to remove the /etc/dbus-1/ file, but I'm not very good at maintscripts
<jbicha> robert_ancell: have you ever done maintscripts?
<robert_ancell> jbicha, I think I might have and found them to be terrible...
<jbicha> lol
<robert_ancell> oh damn. We have an /etc file.
<jbicha> yeah
<jbicha> so I have this bad idea of adding a maintscript to libsnapd-glib to remove that conf file
<robert_ancell> I think that would mean there has to be a transition package - because you can't really put the maintscript into another package
<jbicha> you might be right
<jbicha> I'm going to need some other opinions on how to handle this since I've never dealt with this situation beore
<jbicha> before
<jbicha> I used to just ignore conf files but it's nice to clean up after oneself :)
<flocculant> that'd be nice :p
<flocculant> not that things you do in here affect me much ;)
<tsimonq2> Hm, I'm seeing bug reports come in that unity is uninstallable on xenial
<popey> eh?
<sarnold> tsimonq2: and upgrades are busted
<tsimonq2> popey: Since bug numbers are cool, bugs similar to bug 1749840
<ubot5> bug 1749840 in compiz (Ubuntu) "apt-get install ubuntu-desktop doesn't work" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1749840
<sarnold> tsimonq2: I understand it was being discussed in #ubuntu-release but I don't have logs, and this doesn't look like it's updated yet to include the converation https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2018/02/15/%23ubuntu-release.html
<tsimonq2> sarnold: Join #ubuntu-release ;)
<tsimonq2> So it looks like phased-updates was set to 0%
<tsimonq2> Anyone got a bug number I can mark new incoming bugs as dups of?
<sarnold> tsimonq2: and we just have to hope that folks have scripted apt-get upgrade rather than dist-upgrade ...
<tsimonq2> sarnold: Right...
<tsimonq2> Looks like Steve's on it though, so that's Good News.
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-02-16
<tjaalton> duflu: libinput 1.10 is in unstable
<duflu> tjaalton, thanks
<tjaalton> also, trackpoint on this t470s is still hardly usable
<duflu> tjaalton, I have no idea about trackpoint, but saw upstream reports about similar
<tjaalton> yeah I'm subscribed
<tjaalton> playing with hwdb settings, nothing seems to work too well
<duflu> tjaalton, at a guess, try hacking libinput to force the acceleration profile = flat
<duflu> Although that may be a particularly bad idea for trackpoints, not sure
<duflu> Oh. I forgot I have one on my bionic desktop (Lenovo SK-8855)
<duflu> tjaalton, I'm seeing jumping on at least one model of touchpad, like it's missing resolution still. Is that what you get with trackpoint?
<duflu> (this trackpoint feels a bit jumpy too)
<tjaalton> insensitivity with small movements, and acceleration ramps up way too quickly
<duflu> tjaalton, yeah I see the former
<tjaalton> the first can be fixed by moving the slider all way down
<tjaalton> more or less
<duflu> tjaalton, the latter I feel has always been true for all trackpoints, IMHO
<tjaalton> I use a thinkpad usb keyboard on my desktop
<tjaalton> hardly ever touch a mouse
<duflu> heretic
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<jibel> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut jibel
<doko> oSoMoN: please see update_excuses for the new binaries
<doko> lo
<doko> no on openjdk-9
<doko> libreoffice-kde4 libreoffice-sdbc-firebird demoted
<doko> libboost-locale1.65.1 promoted
<doko> oSoMoN: and libebubgen needs a MIR
<ricotz> and fonts-liberation2
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> morning didrocks
<oSoMoN> doko, ricotz: so on i386 we want to relax the version requirement for openjdk-8-jre, right?
<doko> oSoMoN: everywhere, we are unlikely to ship openjdk-8 at all
<doko> oSoMoN: everywhere, we are unlikely to ship openjdk-9 at all
<doko> so not shipping 9
<oSoMoN> ok
<oSoMoN> as it happens a version requirement is specified only on i386, other arches just depend on an unversioned openjdk-8-jre
<oSoMoN> doko, what's up with openjdk-9, is it going to be removed from the archive?
<doko> it's a release which is only supported for six months
<oSoMoN> ricotz, does that look correct? https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/jzqHVfW6Cj/
<Nafallo> morning
<didrocks> hey Nafallo
<oSoMoN> doko, ricotz: bug #1749920
<ubot5> bug 1749920 in libepubgen (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libepubgen" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1749920
<Nafallo> oooh. duflu causing notifications again ;-)
<duflu> Nafallo, yep, but now it ends
 * duflu -> weekend
<oSoMoN> hey Nafallo
<oSoMoN> have a good one duflu
<duflu> o/
<Nafallo> it was a good one at that :-)
<Nafallo> hi oSoMoN :-)
<Laney> ah!
<Nafallo> hi Laney :-)
<doko> oSoMoN: ta. did the new lo drop visio support (libvisio)?
<oSoMoN> doko, not that I know of
<ricotz> oSoMoN, https://paste.debian.net/plain/1010568
<ricotz> bbl
<oSoMoN> thanks ricotz
<oSoMoN> ricotz, https://git.launchpad.net/~libreoffice/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/commit/?id=696b9409c73a1d02c2527dde5ab411ea4c85d4a7
<jbicha> good morning
<jbicha> tjaalton: what's up with packages depending on libgel1 which is in universe?
<jbicha> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/bionic/update_excuses.html#gnome-session
<jbicha> libegl1
 * Nafallo stops trying to finding out what libgel does ;-)
<Nafallo> no automatic smoother experiences then :-)
<jbicha> sorry I type too fast some times :(
<Nafallo> no worries. it was fun :-)
<oSoMoN> good morning jbicha
<tjaalton> jbicha: libglvnd MIR filed, but it still needs nvidia packages updated before it all can land
<jbicha> tjaalton: thanks. Are you working on the nvidia packages for that? tseliot?
<tjaalton> tseliot is, one to go
<tseliot> jbicha: yep
<tseliot> they're almost ready
<jbicha> cool
<jbicha> I'm unhappy with Unity. It totally built a few days ago in my test PPA but now it doesn't want to build :(
<jbicha> https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/3156/+packages
<GunnarHj> Hi Laney, any doubt about
<GunnarHj> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/policykit-1/+bug/1707898/comments/27 ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1707898 in systemd (Ubuntu) "systemd translations are not synced with upstream" [Medium,In progress]
<Laney> GunnarHj: Didn't follow the issue closely - you want to avoid build-depending on PK or something
<Laney> not sure if those things are useful at runtime
<Laney> why were they in the main pkg in the first place?
<Laney> don't tell me I did it
<GunnarHj> Laney: You did it. :)
<Laney> mmm can't remember the details
<jbicha> lol
<Laney> that was last year!
<GunnarHj> Laney: See comment #24 in bug #1707898.
<ubot5> bug 1707898 in systemd (Ubuntu) "systemd translations are not synced with upstream" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1707898
<GunnarHj> Laney: I'm pretty sure those files are not needed at runtime.
<Laney> righto, please file it at Debian then (don't forget Breaks+Replaces)
<Laney> you'll need to fix anything else which Build-Deps on policykit-1 for these rules
<Laney> fwupd I think
<GunnarHj> Laney: Is there a command to figure out which packages include policykit-1 in Build-Depends?
<Laney> reverse-depends -b policykit-1
<Laney> (ubuntu-dev-tools)
<GunnarHj> Laney: Thanks. That list wasn't too long; I'll check them out. Can we use the LP bug as a base for the coming Debian commit?
<jbicha> Laney: btw, the vcs-git -b thing is documented at https://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/#version-control-system-vcs-fields
<Laney> GunnarHj: You can link to it but I think that a bug in the BTS should explain the problem on its own
<GunnarHj> Laney: Ok.
<Laney> Probably write a short bug explaining and ask if the PK maintainers want to make this change first
<Laney> Then if they say no, it's not worth making other packages do this change, you haven't spent time writing patches/bugs that aren't needed
<GunnarHj> Laney: Thought you were a PK maintainer. ;) This is a pure Debian/Ubuntu thing, right?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> and sure, but if it were me I'd add the pk-1 [!stage1] build-dep to systemd and move on with life. :-)
<Laney> jbicha: nice one
<Laney> and ... when did the policy get CSS?
<GunnarHj> Laney: I wrote on the bug report about a less intrusive change: Create the package policykit-1-gettext with only those two files, and let policykit-1 depend on it. Then systemd could add policykit-1-gettext to Build-Depends, and we wouldn't need to bother with other packages.
<jbicha> Laney: that was last year!
<jbicha> GunnarHj: some Debian Developers try to avoid the NEW queue
<Laney> I woudn't make a package for such a tiny amount of data
<Laney> plus that
<jbicha> one reason for that is that the ftpmasters sometimes reject packages for incomplete debian/copyright files even if the package is already in Debian
<jbicha> so sometimes it's not less intrusive at all :(
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Thanks for you comment on the bug report about other packages depending on policykit-1. I think I'll await Martin's response before proceeding with a possible move of polkit.{its,loc}.
<mvo> Laney: hey, you did all the work for the integration of Components-$(ARCH).yml - for some time I was wondering what it would take to do something similar for the command-not-found data, i.e. create a indexfile with the binaries<->pkgs mapping (a subset of Contents-$ARCH essentially plus data from update-alternatives). whats your estimate about the amount of work?
<mvo> Laney: the background is that there is a desire to show version information in c-n-f but that requires a bit more dynamic approach than we use now
<Laney> hey mvo
<Laney> It's not that hard --- there's something in lp:ubuntu-archive-publishing (I think) for the appstream stuff
<Laney> basically launchpad rsyncs it from us and serves that up via the archive
<mvo> Laney: and the lp bits are in the lp repo I presume?
<Laney> there's no LP bits, just the publisher step
<mvo> Laney: I actually have the data already extracted daily, it would probably just take a small converter then
<mvo> Laney: is the publisher not part of lp?
<mvo> Laney: I mean, where could I look at how its integrated into the Release file :) ?
<Laney> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-archive/ubuntu-archive-publishing/trunk/view/head:/finalize.d/30-appstream
<mvo> Laney: \o/
<mvo> Laney: ok, that looks nice. do you have hints about how this gets into http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/bionic/InRelease?
<Laney> nope, I think that's just part of the magic due to it being put into $STAGINGROOT
<mvo> Laney: woah, thats even better
<Laney> Colin would know more, but this side wasn't hard
<mvo> Laney: great, I will talk to colin I think, this might actually be (much) simpler than I anticipated
<Laney> Guess you'll want to check if they are happy pulling from your current server or if you need to get a special one set up
 * mvo hugs Laney (with extra enthusiasm)
<Laney> appstream.internal is a dedicated box (in the cloud) for generating this
<mvo> Laney: yeah, moving things around is probably needed but not a big deal
 * Laney hugs mvo - good luck!
<Laney> and the apt side for getting it onto the system is easy enough too
<kenvandine> jbicha, could you please subscribe desktop-bugs to xdg-desktop-portal-gtk?
<jbicha> kenvandine: you have to ask Laney or seb128 (xdg-desktop-portal needs subscribed too)
<kenvandine> jbicha, ok
<kenvandine> it's the last thing i need to do on the MIR
<jbicha> go ahead and file the bug, the subscriber can be added later
<jbicha> have a good weekend!
<kenvandine> jbicha, you too
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-02-17
<jbicha> Trevinho: what happened with https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3138 ? can we rebuild (for gnome-desktop3 transition) and publish?
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-02-18
<Donnut> Could someone tell me what the difference is between Ubuntu Unity and Gnome desktop environment is?
<jbicha> robert_ancell: hi, are you going to work on the gnome-software 3.27.90 update for bionic?
<robert_ancell> jbicha, I'm not sure if we're switching to 3.28 or staying on 3.26. Was waiting for kenvandine[m][m] to decide.
<jbicha> have you been using the new version yet?
<robert_ancell> jbicha, I've been developing against master
<jbicha> what are + and - of the new version?
<robert_ancell> Not sure, haven't really been involved in the version discussions.
<robert_ancell> But I'm happy to do the update
<jbicha> if you have time, it might be useful to try it out in a PPA
<jbicha> I just packaged the update for Debian experimental
<fossfreedom_> jbicha, just threw a PR at budgie-desktop to adapt to the latest gnome-settings-daemon that's in the staging PPA. From the comments on the issue you raised Ikey may not be in a hurry to merge until 3.28 goes stable.
<fossfreedom_> if you want we can patch this in sooner rather than later.  let me know.
<jbicha> sorry, I didn't ping you yet that it was in the PPA
<fossfreedom_> no worries - I was browsing and I noticed you had pushed it in. So was playing.
<jbicha> there will be another mutter soname bump
<jbicha> I hope it will land and there will be a tarball release really soon
<jbicha> it's really bad that mutter & gnome-shell haven't released a tarball since October
<fossfreedom_> I haven't been keeping track with mutter development - any NEWS links or similar that summarised what's in for 3.28?
<jbicha> mutter is related because I don't think it makes sense to update gnome-settings-daemon without mutter (my understanding is that the dropped g-s-d plugin was implemented in mutter)
<jbicha> there isn't much of a NEWS file yet since they haven't been doing releases! :(
<jbicha> maybe it's a Red Hat conspiracy so that Ubuntu won't get the latest GNOME before Fedora ð
<fossfreedom_> hehe
<jbicha> like last week, gnome-settings-daemon 3.27.90 was released
<jbicha> but it wasn't buildable. Once you cherry-picked the fix for that, you'd be left wondering why GNOME won't start after rebooting
<jbicha> you need another cherry-picked patch to fix that
<jbicha> a distro developer complained about that on Friday and was told the g-s-d maintainers were too busy fixing bugs to make releases
<fossfreedom_> hmm - time pressures I imagine - trying to make the release date
<jbicha> cynically, it looks like the g-s-d maintainer is wasting the time of other distros thoughâ¦
<jbicha> on the other hand, the guy doing releases isn't supposed to be doing releases as he turned over responsibility to someone else (who got a different job or something)
<jbicha> and Red Hat is hiring someone to basically be the gnome-control-center maintainer instead
<fossfreedom_> sounds like very good news.  They seem to have deep pockets at the moment.
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-02-11
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> Salut didrocks
<didrocks> salut jibel, Ã§a va ?
<jibel> didrocks, Ãa va bien et toi?
<didrocks> Ã§a va, le temps alterne entre beau et mauvais :p
<Laney> yo
<didrocks> hey hey Laney
<Laney> hey didrocks, are you well? nice weekend?
<Trevinho> Ya!
<didrocks> Laney: Was a good week-end, indeed, between 2 rain drops! How about you?
<didrocks> hey Trevinho
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<Trevinho> didrocks: hey! :-)
<oSoMoN> hi Trevinho, Laney
<Laney> didrocks: good, went out for some drinks with some new friends
<Laney> also had "beef aorta", but let's not talk about that ...
<Laney> hey Trevinho oSoMoN
<didrocks> let's not talk about the beef thus ;)
<Trevinho> Laney: so lampredotto is better I guess :-P
<Laney> yes
<Trevinho> ð
<Laney> that was physically edible
<Trevinho> ahahah
<mitya57> Trevinho: hi! Did you see my question about compiz? https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2019/02/09/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t12:46
 * Laney the fixer of tests
<Trevinho> mitya57: ah, yeah... I saw, let me start that
<mitya57> thanks!
<Trevinho> mitya57: have you already a branch?
<mitya57> I have it locally, I can try to push it somewhere.
<Trevinho> mitya57: you can push it in compiz itself, although the time I did I think I had a patched bzr importer to add some references
<Trevinho> so let me retry that
<mitya57> That should be better, I just used plain `git clone bzr::lp:compiz`.
<mitya57> Anyway here is what I got: https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/compiz/+git/compiz
<Laney> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/tracker/commit/63c0a5d4413e53cb76089fda6f56b2d623c5de15
<Laney> andyrock you BEAST
 * Laney enjoys it when he doesn't have to do work
<jibel> which snaps are installed by default on bionic?
<Laney> jibel: https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/ubuntu.bionic/desktop.snaps
<jibel> thanks, I was surprised to see just some of them but it was obviously their installation that was slower than it uses to be
<jbicha> Laney: what do you suggest we do with https://github.com/ruby-gnome2/ruby-gnome2/issues/1272 ? it's probably pretty easy to rewrite the upstream test so that it passes
<gitbot> ruby-gnome2 issue 1272 in ruby-gnome2 "test failures with glib 2.59.2" [Open]
<Laney> Fixing the test sounds sensible
<jbicha> but I'm unsure how to do it so that it is um elegant
<Laney> regex?
<jbicha> I've not worked with Ruby or Ruby tests before so this will be interesting
<Laney> me neither really, except I think I once fixed a test in that thing too
<jbicha> yeah I saw your name in the commit log
<Laney> Presumably the glib_{major,minor} version constants are exposed too
<jbicha> jibel: does today's simple-scan/disco upload fix your crash issue?
<k_alam> jbicha: Hi, please increase the importance of this bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-greeter/+bug/1815493
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1815493 in unity-greeter (Ubuntu) "Disable mlockall() call for systemd-240" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<jibel> jbicha, I didn't try
<k_alam> jbicha: Thanks
<jibel> jbicha, latest version of simple-scan in disco fixes the crash, thanks.
<fossfreedom> hi all - just checked todays Ubuntu Budgie iso and for some reason it is pulling in gdm3 as a default.  Any ideas why?  Nothing that I've done!
<fossfreedom> ... 19.04 that is
<jbicha> jibel: speaking of ISOs, do you know why http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/ to http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/pending/ increased from 1.6G to 1.9G?
<jbicha> fossfreedom: I believe I triggered that with https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-applet/1.8.18-2ubuntu4 or https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/1:19.04.3
<jbicha> so I'll take a look
<fossfreedom> ah - thx.  does that network-manager-gnome changelog mean that UB should seed policykit-1-gnome to stop gnome-shell being pulled in?
<jbicha> no, you shouldn't need it
<jbicha> (read the package description for policykit-1-gnome, if it's wrong, let Debian know)
<jbicha> fossfreedom: can I change my answer to yes? :)
<jbicha> $ apt-cache showpkg polkit-1-auth-agent
<jbicha> Budgie doesnt' provide that virtual package so it needs to either provide it or yes you need policykit-1-gnome
<fossfreedom> ok - thx
<jbicha> so try uninstalling everything that provides that polkit package and see if you still get the authentication popups when you do polkit stuff
<jbicha> I'm glad that the answer here is pretty simple, sometimes dealing with these alternate dependencies gets messy
<jbicha> fossfreedom: you might have the same problem with notification-daemon. For instance, I have a libnotify upload stuck in disco-proposed
<jbicha> sorry for the inconvenience. I had been looking at ISOs this weekend to see if gnome-shell popped up unexpectedly but I hadn't checked today yet
<fossfreedom> no worries - thx for the advice will have a play now that I know what to look out for
<jbicha> Seb tried demoting notification-daemon to universe in cosmic so I'm just finishing the job :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-02-12
<RAOF> Wow. gnome-shell is really leaky on disco on (at least) the nvidia drivers at the moment.
<RAOF> Also really slow :(
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> good morning
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<jibel> Bonjour tout le monde
<didrocks> salut jibel, Ã§a va ? Besoin d'aide pour l'iso testing ?
<jibel> didrocks, Ã§a va.
<jibel> didrocks, I need tests on real hardware with nvidia or i915
<jibel> didrocks, and uefi + sb
<jibel> with nvidia
<jibel> I covered other tests on vms
<didrocks> hum, I can a live session on nvidia, but I don't have partitionned for my main machine to have dual install
<jibel> didrocks, okay, so don't waste your time on this. I need a real installation to verify that the drivers are enabled after installation
<didrocks> oki, that's what I guessed
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<Wimpress> o/
<didrocks> hey Wimpress, re seb128
<seb128> re didrocks :)
<seb128> hey Wimpress jibel
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, en forme ?
<oSoMoN> salut jibel, hey Wimpress
<oSoMoN> la forme oui, pas beaucoup dormi mais ici il fait un temps de printemps et Ã§a donne de lâÃ©nergie
<oSoMoN> et toi?
<seb128> Ã§a va, un peu fatiguÃ© aussi mais j'ai bien profitÃ© du w.e :)
<Laney> hark
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> I'm alright thx, seems like a nice pre-spring day!
<Laney> you? good day off?
<seb128> yeah, we went to the spa, that was nice
<Laney> cucumber on the eyes and all that
 * Laney pictures it
<didrocks> hey Laney
<Laney> ð didrocks
<k_alam> seb128: We have some issue with systemd-240, first one is this....https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-greeter/+bug/1815493
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1815493 in unity-greeter (Ubuntu) "Disable mlockall() call for systemd-240" [Critical,Confirmed]
<seb128> I saw that in the backlog yesterday evening
<seb128> did you try to grab Robert about it?
<k_alam> yes, I couldn't reach him.....in the issue he said he is prepared to remove those...
<k_alam> 2nd issue is we can't logout with gnome-session
<k_alam> reproducible with flashback session as well
<seb128> why not?
<seb128> since when?
<k_alam> since systemd-240
<seb128> "fun"
<k_alam> ystemctl --user start --wait gnome-session-flashback.target just hangs and can't reach greeter after logout.......do u know anything similar ?
<k_alam> *systemctl
<k_alam> same for unity-session.target
<seb128> I've no idea about that one
<k_alam> muktupavels pointed out this but reverting that didn't help.....https://github.com/systemd/systemd/commit/109b0cbf24443b54109a1b6dac010bdf3b96d93c#diff-69ea3a0848eb29638bc663cf16af1b2d
<k_alam> loginctl terminate-session <id> works though
<seb128> it needs debugging
<seb128> unsure about the mlockall thing, I don't understand enough why that was added
<seb128> but it looks like neither Robert not mterry remember
<seb128> so it's probably fine to drop, I would still like to have the security team opinion on it
<seb128> I asked them for feedback
<k_alam> journalctl -f doesn't show much....https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/6hFYcKbVKn/......the issue is systed doesn't print anything even with LogLevel=debug when --wait fails
<andyrock> good morning!
<didrocks> hey andyrock
<jbicha> seb128: hi, is it time to open up translations in LP for disco?
<seb128> jbicha, we should yes, thx for the reminder, I will take care of that
<mitya57_> Trevinho: hi, any news about compiz?
<didrocks> jbicha: thanks for making the modifications! dh-sequence-* are interesting, didn't know they existed
<didrocks> jbicha: are you planning to sync it? Maybe I'll wait for that upload to promote, wdyt?
<jbicha> it will autosync
<jbicha> the dh-sequence is very new, it will only work in disco https://manpages.debian.org/unstable/dh#OPTIONS
<didrocks> interesting, quite puzzling to have an unexisting package in build-deps :)
<jbicha> it does exist :)
<jbicha> the dh provider has to manually add a Provides: to enable the feature, see https://launchpadlibrarian.net/409834438/pkgbinarymangler_143_144.diff.gz
<jbicha> so you could do that for dh-migrations if you wanted
<didrocks> yeah, so it's a virtual package, not a real one, correct?
<jbicha> yes
<didrocks> (that was my "it doesn't really exists" ;)
<didrocks> ok, we agree
<jbicha> :) :)
<didrocks> yeah, good idea for dh-migrations, adding on my list
<didrocks> oh, I missed Go 1.12 RC1 is out! \o/
<jbicha> it technically needs debhelper 12 to work too (although it could use a lower compat level)
<didrocks> (RC means that Google is running it internally by default)
<didrocks> jbicha: ah, you didn't bump dh build-dep though?
<didrocks> like build-dep on debhelper 12, even if keeping compat level 11
<jbicha> yeah, oops
<jbicha> yes
<didrocks> not a biggie, I think just stage it
<jbicha> practically, it's unlikely to have a system with an older debhelper and the new provides, but people do weird things with ppas and such
<didrocks> exactly, hence only staging it
<jbicha> I generally avoided bumping debhelper compat to 12 for library packages just to be extra cautious until Buster is released
<jbicha> didrocks: btw, for Debian GNOME packages, you'll need to manually run dh_gnome_clean (or otherwise update debian/control) if you switch to dh-sequence-gnome
<didrocks> ah, the hook doesn't do it for you?
<jbicha> it doesn't know how
<jbicha> if you drop --with gnome and ** debian/control ** doesn't yet say dh-sequence-gnome, it won't run the dh_gnome stuff
<didrocks> okidoki
<jbicha> so that's just the first time to bootstrap stuff, after that things work well
<didrocks> gotcha
<seb128> ok, meeting time!
<seb128> #startmeeting Desktop Team Meeting 2019-02-12
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Feb 12 14:30:28 2019 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Meeting 2019-02-12 | Current topic:
<seb128> Roll call: andyrock, didrocks, duflu (out), jbicha, jamesh (out), jibel, kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<andyrock> o/
<didrocks> hey hey o/
<tseliot> o/
<kenvandine> \o
<Trevinho> helloo
<oSoMoN> ð½/
<seb128> tseliot, tjaalton, sorry, I copied the list from previous week and seems that didn't include you
<seb128> k, look like we have most of the team, let's get started
<seb128> #topic rls bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Meeting 2019-02-12 | Current topic: rls bugs
<seb128> the incoming lists
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-cc-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> bb has no desktop entry (also good to see that page small, is that a bug or a result of foundations finally dealing with their tagged bugs?)
<seb128> cc has no desktop entry
<Trevinho> I think bug 1772811 is already targetted
<ubot5> bug 1772811 in OEM Priority Project "different behaviors for switch display mode between xenial and bionic" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1772811
<seb128> that's the disco one
<seb128> Trevinho, can you assign it to yourself?
<andyrock> it's because it's not assigned in mutter
<seb128> right
<Trevinho> ok
<seb128> easy to fix, thx Marco
<seb128> tracking lists
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> so same one we just discussed
<seb128> bug #1767660
<ubot5> bug 1767660 in libinput (Ubuntu Bionic) "Regression 16.04 LTS to 18.04 LTS: Contour Design RollerMouse double click button no longer results in a double click event" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1767660
<seb128> tjaalton, ^ opinion on that one?
<seb128> to be it doesn't seem important enough to use team tracking
<seb128> it doesn't prevent people to work on it/SRU
<seb128> I vote -wontfix
<seb128> other opinions?
<seb128> -notfixing I mean
<Laney> sure, don't know if that works for accepted bugs though, might have to won't fix the task
<seb128> right, that's a bit annoying
<seb128> do we still have that launchpad bug that if I delete the bionic line we can't add it back ever?
<jbicha> you can add it back
<Laney> dunno
<seb128> k, let me delete the line then and tag
<Laney> no opinion on whether that's better or worse than closing the bug task
<Laney> seems you prefer that, so fine
<jbicha> it's annoying that LP doesn't show fixed bugs in search results by default so it makes it tough for people to find bugs that still affect them on the LTS release
<seb128> bug #1777994
<ubot5> bug 1777994 in libxcb (Ubuntu Bionic) "the header xcb/xinput.h is missing" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1777994
<seb128> that one has been uploaded apparently, so setting fix commited
<seb128> bug #1799614
<ubot5> bug 1799614 in snapd-glib (Ubuntu Cosmic) "Use new media API" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1799614
<seb128> assigning that one to Robert
<seb128> that's it for bionic
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-cc-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> that has the same snapd-glib one for Robert and that's it
<kenvandine> seb128: robert knows about that and said he would ask about it.
<seb128> kenvandine, he should assign himself targetted bugs so they don't end up having to be reviewed
<kenvandine> snapd has an exception and this is to track snapd changes
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> thx
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> that has bug #1772811 which we already discussed
<ubot5> bug 1772811 in OEM Priority Project "different behaviors for switch display mode between xenial and bionic" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1772811
<seb128> and that's it
<seb128> #topic update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Meeting 2019-02-12 | Current topic: update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<seb128> Laney, your turn :)
<Laney> k
<talx> hello folks, any preseeding guru here ?
<Laney> The following packages have unmet dependencies.
<Laney>  emacs-common : Breaks: edb (< 1.32) but 1.31-3 is to be installed
<Laney> good old emacs
<seb128> talx, hey, we are in the middle of our weekly team meeting, please stand by 10 min or so (or use #ubuntu-devel or #ubuntu-installer)
<seb128> I can have a look to emacs/edb
<talx> seb128, okay would you pme if you can when its over?
<seb128> talx, sure
<Laney> there's some archive admin stuff
<Laney> gnome-control-center/gvfs
<Laney> and the others need looking at basically
<seb128> I can deal with the archive admin things
<seb128> k, let's quickly review/find owners for the other ones
<seb128> jbicha, gnome-desktop3 ftbfs, are you getting anywhere with that?
<seb128> or do you need help?
<seb128> it has been there for almost a week
<seb128> (imho dealing with breaking from existing uploads should be higher priority than stacking more updates)
<seb128> tjaalton, is the mesa/armhf ftbfs on your list? (impacts Debian as well I think)
<jbicha> seb128: gnome-desktop is a brand new test so technically not a regression
<seb128> network-manbager/ppc64el is annoying, I can try to have a look
<seb128> jbicha, regression or not it failed to build so that's not going to work
<seb128> we can't hint/skip ftbfses
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-desktop3/3.31.90-1ubuntu1
<tjaalton> seb128: yes, upstream knows
<jbicha> I was implying we could temporarily skip that broken test until we figure out what's going with Hebrew stuff
<seb128> tjaalton, ok, thx
<Laney> is "until" ever going to happen?
<seb128> jbicha, did you upstream that failure?
<seb128> do you need help debugging?
<seb128> let's discuss it here after the meeting
<seb128> but best to fix rather than skip
<Laney> yes, I'd like to argue with the notion that tests are OK to ignore just because they're new
<seb128> +1
<didrocks> especially if coming to cover a new feature IMHO
<seb128> k, that's consensus to not skip
<didrocks> or an experienced regression
<seb128> let's discuss it in a bit with those interested
<Laney> I'll look at udisks2 a bit, annoyed that is so bad on ppc64el
<seb128> librsvg seems like it's green on http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html#gobject-introspection so I guess outdated report
<seb128> thx Laney
<seb128> tracker is faiing on armhf/64 , who wants to have a look to that one?
<seb128> 'Aborted (core dumped)'
<seb128> looks like a real issue
<jbicha> seb128: gobject-introspection is very new, I think it may pass if retried
<seb128> ah, librsvg dropped now after a reload, good :p
<seb128> jbicha, that isn't on the list?
<seb128> ah, it's under foundations
<seb128> well the tracker issue on arm looks real
<Laney> I retried g-i
<seb128> hum, in fact from the history seems sometime it's ok
<seb128> thx Laney
<Laney> tracker could do with someone looking, yeah
<seb128> I can try to at least get a bt of that abort and upstream that
<Laney> could be me but maybe somebody who doesn't normally take these issues might want to look :-)
<seb128> k
 * Laney coughs
<seb128> so I think we reviewed the list?
<seb128> no-one seems to want to step up for tracker :(
<seb128> maybe we need to start more direct assignements, going to discuss that with willcooke
<seb128> anyway
<Laney> team topic for next week
<seb128> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Meeting 2019-02-12 | Current topic: AOB
<didrocks> thx
<seb128> yes, good idea
<Laney> if you're not at the meeting you get to avoid those assignments
<jbicha> (tracker might just be flaky)
<seb128> flaky is something worth fixing :)
<Laney> some people are never at the meeting
<Laney> indeed
<seb128> k, 30s for AOB topics
<seb128> seems not, let's wrap then
<seb128> thanks team!
<kenvandine> thanks!
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Feb 12 15:06:01 2019 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2019/ubuntu-desktop.2019-02-12-14.30.moin.txt
<didrocks> thx
<oSoMoN> thanks
<Laney> ty
<seb128> jbicha, so can you can give some more context on that hebrew test?
<kenvandine> zyga: i've merged that gtk-common-themes fix
<jbicha> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-desktop/tree/master/tests
<kenvandine> zyga: i'll get it in candidate today and let hang out there a couple days for testing
<jbicha> so there is https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-desktop/commit/f3ca0e4d794
<jbicha> but there is also https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-desktop/merge_requests/27
<gitbot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 27 in gnome-desktop "WIP: po: Update Hebrew translation" [8. Translation, Opened]
<jbicha> I talked with the tracker maintainer yesterday and he expects to do a tracker 2.2 release in the next few days (perhaps a bit beta-ish)
<jbicha> I wouldn't spend too much time on tracker 2.1 now since 2.2 had a lot of improvements (thanks Andy!) with tests and some code reorganization
<andyrock> I'm still waiting for review on some tracker changes
<andyrock> also I forgot to push the port to python3 for functional test
<andyrock> I'll try to do it asap
<andyrock> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/tracker/merge_requests/54
<jbicha> andyrock: he was talking about releasing this week, thanks :)
<gitbot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 54 in tracker "Fix several memory leaks and memory corruptions" [Opened]
<seb128> jbicha, k, makes sense
<andyrock> jbicha: if that MP is not merged we need to distro-patch at least this commit https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/tracker/merge_requests/54/diffs?commit_id=a7be8e9cc19bb53867d28e323fd2da32073e48cf
<gitbot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 54 in tracker "Fix several memory leaks and memory corruptions" [Opened]
<seb128> andyrock, maybe you can nag Carlos about reviewing it?
<zyga> kenvandine: thank you
<kenvandine> zyga: it's in edge now if you want to try it
<kenvandine> Trevinho: hey, have you been involved in the Remmina snap?
<seb128> kenvandine, he did write the yaml iirc
<jbicha> hmm
<kenvandine> i heard they've been getting bug reports and have some issues they need help with
<kenvandine> seb128: i've offered to help
<kenvandine> but wanted to see if Trevinho had any insight into the issues, they were vague
<kenvandine> and i heard they've talked to Trevinho already
<seb128> kenvandine, thx
<k_alam> didrocks: Hi, the mps we talked about for ubuntu-themes and settings ?
<jbicha> seb128: btw tracker passed on retry
<seb128> k
<Laney> if at first test don't succeed, (re)try, (re)try again
<Laney> good motto eh
<jbicha> some tests seem to pass better when the autopkgtest infrastructure isn't heavily loaded. That means that uploading a heavy package like g-i will get more failures on first try :|
<jbicha> for gnome-desktop, there's also https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-desktop/blob/master/.gitlab-ci.yml so it looks like the test does work on Fedora Rawhide
<jbicha> the Hebrew isn't being translated properly, you can see the .png's in the meson-logs/ in your build directory
<Laney> real systems are often heavily loaded
<didrocks> k_alam: yes, what about them?
<didrocks> and we only talked about ubuntu-themes AFAIK
<zyga> kenvandine: thank you! :-)
<k_alam> didrocks: I have assigned you for ubuntu-settings too...
<k_alam> is this ok ?
<jbicha> k_alam: assigning specific people probably isn't necessary
<didrocks> k_alam: interesting, if you have just done it, I didn't receive the LP email yet
<jbicha> unless you don't want anyone else to look at it :)
<didrocks> but yeah, I can give a look at the same time than -themes
<didrocks> k_alam: you didn't assign it: https://bugs.launchpad.net/~didrocks/+assignedbugs
<k_alam> didrocks: no I mean, as a reviewer
<didrocks> seb128: are we going to get rygel & co dealt by security this cycle? I think I'll unassign until it's OK ;)
<didrocks> k_alam: got it
<k_alam> jbicha: ha ha but no
<didrocks> I didn't receive any email
<didrocks> but found it
<jbicha> andyrock: maybe LP: #1815317 is for you?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1815317 in gnome-online-accounts (Ubuntu) "Update gnome-online-accounts to 3.31.90" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1815317
<andyrock> jbicha: kk
<k_alam> didrocks: And one more if didn't not get mail for that as well...https://code.launchpad.net/~khurshid-alam/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-settings/+git/ubuntu-settings/+merge/362989
<didrocks> oki
<k_alam> didrocks: Thanks.
<seb128> didrocks, I doubt it's going to be this cycle at this point
<didrocks> ok, I'll unassign from those bugs to clean up my list
<seb128> wfm, I still have on my todo to do the multiarch thing
<seb128> but yeah, security is taking a while, I mention that at fosdem
<didrocks> yep, the multi-arch is still pending ;)
<seb128> I keep saying "this week" but I hate those paperwork tasks :p
 * seb128 should really do that
<seb128> also I'm unsure to properly test that I'm not breaking something by doing it
<seb128> oh well, next week I do it :)
<seb128> andyrock, btw I think you commented on a bug like that one before, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1810382 ... do you know how the code hide the "write a review" button for snaps? it's clearly not working for that user but I don't know what debug info would be useful, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/410601843/Screenshot%20from%202019-02-09%2020-39-05.png
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1810382 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Gnome software error posting a review for snap app " [Low,New]
<andyrock> seb128: let me check
<seb128> thx
<andyrock> seb128: mmm maybe the problem is that since https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-software/commit/e54b31cc85ddef6f9579cb85bbdf53dbb9d9091d are no longer NOT_REVIEWABLE
<andyrock> from the journal logs linked in the bug it looks like ubuntu-reviews plugin is still in cosmic and odrs plugin is disabled
<andyrock> seb128: I'll comment on the bug, asking robert to confirm this
<andyrock> seb128: commented
<andyrock> let's see if robert answers
<gQuigs> anybody feeling need for anacron/cron these days with systemd timers?
<jbicha> gQuigs: Debian GNOME is removing anacron from default install for Buster
<gQuigs> jbicha: linky?  my search foo is failing me
<jbicha> gQuigs: https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/meta-gnome3/commits/debian/master
<jbicha> we would have uploaded by now but the gjs/s390x removal is still being annoying in Debian
<gQuigs> ty!
<gQuigs> will start a thread on -dev-discuss...
<jbicha> seb128: I'm close-ish to a fix on gnome-desktop, it's environment variables that were interfering
<seb128> jbicha, @gnome-desktop, great :)
<seb128> andyrock, thx, indeed we use odrs only in disco atm, but I though that in cosmic when I tested on friday I didn't have the review button for snaps :/
<seb128> kenvandine, can you make sure Robert sees https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1810382/comments/8 ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1810382 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Gnome software error posting a review for snap app " [Low,Triaged]
<kenvandine> seb128: sure
<seb128> thx
<seb128> kenvandine, btw I read from your weekly summary that you/Olivier made progress on debugging the gtk build issue, what was it?
<kenvandine> gdk-pixbuf-pixdata built in the snap was linked against the system libgdkpixbuf
<kenvandine> not sure what the actual fix was, oSoMoN is still working on it
<oSoMoN> seb128, there are in fact multiple issues and I haven't finished addressing them all, the gdk-pixbuf-pixdata one was the first error, I solved it with https://gitlab.gnome.org/Community/Ubuntu/gnome-3-28-1804-sdk/commit/49d40114626a6788d83e3e4cba28913b42126c8f
<Trevinho> mitya57: done https://code.launchpad.net/compiz
<seb128> jbicha, did you see my comment on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1815504 btw?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1815504 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Coordinate Yaru sound theme with GNOME 3.32 Alert Sound feature" [Low,Confirmed]
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-02-13
<mitya57> Trevinho: thank you!
<mitya57> I am going to make a new official compiz release today or tomorrow, hope you don't mind. It would be useful for other distributions like Arch.
<didrocks> good morning
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<ricotz> good morning :)
<ricotz> oSoMoN, see pm
<didrocks> hey ricotz
<Laney> b0b0b0
<didrocks> hey Laney
 * Laney pats didrocks 
<Wimpress> Morning desktoppers o/
<didrocks> hey Wimpress
 * Laney nods gravely towards Wimpress 
<Wimpress> :-)
<Laney> ("take him away")
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks, en forme ?
<talx> morning folks
<talx> I'm looking for assitance with preseed installation
<didrocks> seb128: Ã§a va, et toi ?
<talx> trying to figure out what I'm doing wrong for the third way in a raw
<seb128> Ã§a va :)
<jbicha> seb128: do you want to try demoting notification-daemon again? I've added some alternate dependencies so maybe it will stick this time
<jbicha> also, we already got the first review of the libhandy MIR LP: #1815483 (I wasn't expecting that so soon, thanks!). There's a question there about whether we want Glade in main
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1815483 in libhandy (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libhandy" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1815483
<seb128> jbicha, can do for n-d
<seb128> jbicha, @libhandy, we don't want glade in main no, the -dev can stay in universe, also I'm not sure we want that lib at all in main until it's somewhat stable
<jbicha> they claim to be releasing a "stable" 0.1.0 next month: https://source.puri.sm/Librem5/libhandy/wikis/home
<seb128> I'm still not sure why that lib exists/is needed, outside of being a playground with the goal to merge those widgets in gtk
<jbicha> because it might not be practical to merge those improvement in until gtk4
<seb128> other experimentals widget libs like egg are usually included as copies
<seb128> and?
<seb128> egg has been around for years
<seb128> still it doesn't need to be an external lib
<seb128> what's GNOME r-t position on libhandy?
<seb128> do they plan to add it to the core set?
<jbicha> it's already there (gnome-contacts is part of GNOME Core and uses libhandy without embedding it) https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-build-meta/tree/master/elements/core-deps
<jbicha> ð¤· some Fedora guys were saying the same thing that they want it to be an embedded library, but that's not really how it's being used right now
<seb128> mclasen's comment on #gnome-hackers the other days suggested that he didn't think it should be a core lib for GNOME
<seb128> I'm not sure how they decide to accept or not new depends as part of their platform though
<seb128> anyway -1 from me to use as a lib until it's somewhat stable, sharing a moving target playground is just asking for problems imho
<seb128> if some wonder why retracing are failing recently in disco, bug #1815774
<ubot5> bug 1815774 in binutils (Ubuntu) "binutils 2.32 update breaks debug symbols in disco" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1815774
<seb128> (I was wondering why the recent report from the g-c-c segfaults failed to retraced and ended up chasing it down to binutils)
<seb128> we are going to need to rebuild $things once binutils is fixed
<Laney> good find
<seb128> thx
<seb128> doookooooo
<Laney> binutils is crazy stuff
<seb128> we should have some autopkgtest testing that dbg still work when a binutils lands
 * seb128 adds to his would-be-nice-to-add part of his todolist
<Laney> using libunwind or something?
<seb128> good question, I didn't give it much thinking yet, I was thinking maybe building a small package with a buggy .c example, install it/the dbgsym, start the buggy example under gdb and get a bt/check that it's in a debug format
<seb128> but looks like libunwind would be good in that scenario, thx for the hint!
<Laney> :>
<seb128> does anyone know an example of a package that rebuild itself in an autopkgtest?
<seb128> d_idrocks suggests doing that for rygel as part of the MIR to ensure that vala updates don't break it
<Laney> that's a weird requirement, autopkgtests usually test runtime breakage really and archive rebuilds are used to detect ftbfs
<Laney> you can do it with Restrictions: build-needed and a no-op test but like I say I wouldn't advise that
<seb128> well, I can see the value of blocking vala updates is they break things
<Laney> why doesn't it apply to any library?
<seb128> but maybe that should be done fromt he vala side
<Laney> autopktest isn't meant to be a general keep-the-archive-buildable service
<seb128> you have a point there
<seb128> we also don't fully archive rebuild to validate gcc updates :p
<Laney> right, and these almost always do introduce a few failures
<seb128> that was an optional suggestion on the MIR, I'm going to skip that for now
<Laney> now a test in vala itself which builds a few programs (Restrictions: superficial probably) would be a nice thing
<Laney> same for all libraries/compliers
<seb128> right
<seb128> Laney, thx for the input
<Laney> you're welcome
<andyrock> jbicha: https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/ubuntu/+source/gnome-online-accounts/+git/gnome-online-accounts/+merge/363144
<mdeslaur> seb128: do you have a curl merge planned?
<seb128> mdeslaur, no, but I can look at it tomorrow
<mdeslaur> seb128: awesome, thanks
<seb128> yw!
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-02-14
<jbicha> fossfreedom: gnome-shell/gdm3 is back on your iso because of notification-daemon this time
<RAOF> /msg robert_ancell Hey, could you kindly ping me on telegram? I'd like to make sure I can actually receive messages before arriving at the sprint :)
<sarnold> /msg RAOF I'm not sure your irc client is your friend :)
<RAOF> sarnold: The perils of bridging to Matrix âº
<sarnold> RAOF: curious, I didn't expect that..
<RAOF> It's possible that a more mature client than Fractal would have picked the /msg up and translated it.
<JanC> is matrix or any matrix client supposed to interpret IRC commands at all?
<ahayzen> https://riot.im/app does interpret some commands
<RAOF> Riot has its own set of commands.
<RAOF> Yeah,
<JanC> I mean, the fact that matrix bridges to IRC doesn't mean it has to have the same UI
<jbicha> lol
<jbicha> I'm just glad that it wasn't anything more sensitive!
<RAOF> I'd be checking more thorourgly for something more sensitive than âgive us a ping to test my notification settingsâ âº
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> Salut didrocks
<didrocks> salut jibel
<didrocks> good semi-off day? :)
<jibel> didrocks, I don't think that driving to Paris can be described as "good" :) Kids were taking the train for holidays
<didrocks> oh, indeed :p
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> hey seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks, en forme ?
<Laney> sup
<didrocks> seb128: Ã§a va, et toi ?
<didrocks> Laney: hey hey
<seb128> Ã§a va bien
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, en forme ?
<seb128> hey Laney
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, fatiguÃ© mais ce soir je suis en week-end
<oSoMoN> et toi?
<seb128> bon courage alors :)
<seb128> Ã§a va, mais un peu mal Ã  la gorge depuis hier
<Laney> hey didrocks seb128 oSoMoN
<seb128> j'espÃ¨re m'en dÃ©barrasser avant dimanche
<oSoMoN> hey Laney
<Laney> omg someone's encrypted the channel again
<oSoMoN> seb128, en effet il vaut mieux Ãªtre en pleine forme pour attaquer un sprint
<seb128> Laney, the key is public, you can decrypt!
 * seb128 hands Laney un dictionnaire de la langue franÃ§aise
<Laney> if it comes with croissant, I'm happy
<seb128> au chocolat?
 * seb128 hides from Didier
<Laney> :D
<didrocks> pfffff
<didrocks> pffffff
<didrocks> pfffffff
<didrocks> pffffffff
<didrocks> pfffffffff!
<didrocks> Laney: how did you decipher what seb128 told btw? That was encrypted as well :p
<seb128> lalala
<Laney> $ gpg --list-secret-keys
<Laney> [ tasty food here ]
<jibel> the UX of the new version of control-center is terrible
<jibel> and it crashes when I click on details
<jibel> then I cannot launch it again meh :(
<Laney> the second part is https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-control-center/issues/285, which is fixed upstream and the bug also contains a command you can use to be able to run it again
<gitbot> GNOME issue 285 in gnome-control-center "crash in the info panel" [1. Crash, 6. Component: Info, Closed]
<seb128> bug #1814949 on the launchpad side
<ubot5> bug 1814949 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "gnome-control-center refuses to open if you try to open the Details panels" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1814949
<seb128> what's the problem with the UX?
 * Laney wonders what the point of rls-dd-incoming on that is when jbicha has the ability to fix it
<jibel> main panel is almost empty until you resize the window depending on the panel, when you go to applications you cannot go package, sound panel has too many items, that's 2 min of using it before it crashes and I cannot open it anymore
<jibel> go back*
<seb128> I'm not sure ot understand the resize thing, applications is a new panel and probably not that useful atm for us since it's flatpak centric (though Robert has a card o make it work iwth snaps)
<seb128> the crash is an unfornate regression from the new glib, those happens in the unstable cycle
<seb128> & it's being handled
<seb128> if you find the new sound panel design too 'busy' please report upstream, I'm sure they welcome feedback
<seb128> it fits better than the old design imho, doesn't mean it's perfect
<jibel> in this case the release should have been postponed until glib is fixed
<jibel> or whatever is broken between glib and g-c-c
<seb128> it's not like the "details" panel was an essential feature and worth revertingglib over
<seb128> we don't block stabilization of important OS pieces over things noone really needs
<seb128> like I don't think arguing that glib should be blocked over/revert because the info panel of settings is having an issue
<seb128> + makes sense
<seb128> it would be detrimental to the release quality imho and conterproductive
<seb128> you loose days/weeks of important testing for a panel which has no issue, come on
<jibel> the problem is not the panel, you cannot launch g-c-c again after it crashes
<seb128> the workaround is easy
<seb128> "gnome-control-center sound" for example
<andyrock> do you know if it's possible to make read-only a page on wiki.ubuntu.com ?
<jibel> nope, it doesn't work
<seb128> andyrock, I dont know, maybe popey does?
<seb128> jibel, ?
<jibel> the workaround doesn't work
<seb128> what does it say?
<jibel> j-lallement@sark:~/Downloads$ gnome-control-center sound
<jibel> Segmentation fault (core dumped)
<jibel> just try on disco
<seb128> can you get a bt?
<seb128> I can confirm that info crashes
<Laney> that's not the workaround from the bug
<Laney> it's a gsettings reset
<seb128> opening another panel should work though no?
<Laney> apparently not
<seb128> it worked for me, weird, maybe timing or something
<seb128> jibel, gsettings reset org.gnome.ControlCenter last-panel
<seb128> then?
<jibel> this works
<seb128> good
<seb128> let me cherry pick that upstream patch also
<seb128> so we can stop arguing for good
<seb128> can you please give details on the reiszing issue and report the "sound panel is too busy" on https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-control-center/issues as well?
<jibel> yeah but still, things should be tested before begin uploaded and hold the release if there is an obvious crash. It was simple-scan last week, g-c-c this week and it took less than 2 min to make them crash
<jibel> being*
<seb128> come on
<seb128> things are tested
<seb128> the problem is coming from the glib update and not the g-c-c update
<seb128> even if do one hour of starting everything I can think of using glib I might not think about going to the settings->info panel
<jibel> simple-scan crash last week?
<seb128> different case
<jibel> same case, most basic tests have not been done
<seb128> bah, I don't understand git again :/
<Laney> seb128: want help or?
<seb128> Laney, no, thanks, I was about to ask but decided to try on a fresh checkout and then back in my working tree and now it works
<seb128> I had
<seb128> gnome-control-center$ gbp pq rebase
<seb128> ...
<seb128> CONFLIT (contenu) : Conflit de fusion dans panels/mouse/gnome-mouse-properties.c
<seb128> but it went away
<seb128> maybe I was in the wrong branch or something
<Wimpress> jibel: Just doing some 18.04.2 iso testing.
<Laney> okey
<seb128> then pq export would fail saying I had unstashed changed but I figured it out
<Wimpress> Neither virtualbox-guest-x11 or virtualbox-guest-x11-hwe can be installed.
<seb128> I needed to rebase --continue after resolving the conflict
<seb128> anyway, thanks for asking Laney :)
<Laney> if someone else has done the rebase before (if you're just pulling and adding a patch for e.g.) you can also drop/import
<Laney> np
<seb128> Laney, I was trying to follow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/git#Pick_some_upstream_commits
<seb128> instead of just dumping a .patch in debian/patches manually (would have been easier)
<Laney> ok, just wanted to give you a tip
<seb128> thx, I'm not sure ot understand git/gbp enough to understand the tip though
<seb128> if I don't use 'gbp pq rebase', then what command does the job?
<Laney> rebase rebases the branch
<seb128> oir you meant to just copy the .patch the old way?
<Laney> but you can re-create it
<Laney> if you just want to add a patch, that is what drop and import does
<seb128> ah, right, I remember now, Marco mentioned that in the past :)
<seb128> thx Laney
<seb128> (also tried, indeed it works and avoid some of the 'noise' rebase is creating)
<Laney> that recipe is also not going to make a patch with dep3 headers ;-)
 * Laney edits it to add '-e' at least
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> gbp push fails with
<seb128> gbp:error: Error running git push: To git+ssh://seb128@git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center
<seb128>  ! [rejected]        b3ab4d31841d2009c9d8930437acd3c6eeb63f0e -> pristine-tar (non-fast-forward)
<ubot5> seb128: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<seb128> hint: Updates were rejected because a pushed branch tip is behind its remote
<seb128> but git branch -v/git pull tell me pristine-tar is up-to-dat
<seb128> I can just ignore that gbp push error since I don't need to push anything at this point
<seb128> but it's puzzling :/
<Wimpress> tseliot: The doesn't appear to be a HWE nvidia driver for 18.04.2 in the archive.
<jbicha> Laney: I didn't want to step on your toes by cherry-picking the g-c-c patch if you were planning to do it today
<jbicha> jibel: I don't have a scanner so I wasn't able to do the basic simple-scan test. It did run without a scannerâ¦
<jbicha> good morning
<Laney> jbicha: Alright, it was mostly that rls-dd-incoming seems like an unusual way to express that (you could have asked me)
<Laney> anyway, seb128 did it so all good
<jbicha> I was probably going to ask today. Silly timezones :)
<Laney> feel free to ping me any time, I'll just reply when I get online next
<jbicha> ok
<Laney> :>
<jbicha> I guess the most useful part of the new g-c-c Applications panel is that you can now disable file associations
 * Laney likes that
<jbicha> the rest is like an alternative way of browsing the Search and Notifications panel (this way you navigate by app instead of by feature)
<Laney> jibel: I just filed https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-control-center/issues/377, not sure if that's what you were trying to describe but it seemed worth reporting to me
<gitbot> GNOME issue 377 in gnome-control-center "Sound panel shows duplicate and irrelevant entries" [6. Component: Sound, Opened]
<jibel> Laney, thanks for reporting it, it's the issue and the main input and output volumes are not visible
<jibel> you have to scroll
<Laney> right, the order of the components is in the design
<Laney> it's a bit weird when there are a lot of streams
<jibel> Laney, do you see this too https://i.imgur.com/g53CLAd.png ?
<jbicha> seb128: the new g-c-c patch isn't listed in d/p/series :(
<Laney> jibel: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-control-center/issues/375
<gitbot> GNOME issue 375 in gnome-control-center "Some panels (Background, Sound, Printers) cause the sidebar to disappear when visited" [Opened]
<jibel> it's slightly different, in this case only the sidebar is visible with a wide empty space
<jibel> and another issue is this where you cannot go back from applications https://i.imgur.com/R7WCZLC.png
<Wimpress> tjaalton: nvidia driver are uninstallable in 18.04.2. Is this a known issue?
<Laney> first part is part of the same bug, watch the screencast
<tjaalton> Wimpress: you mean tseliot? I think it's being fixed
<Laney> didn't see the other thing, please file it
<Wimpress> Yeah, I pinged tseliot earlier. Thank for the update.
<ricotz> hi, g-c-c 1:3.31.90-1ubuntu2 is not working -- $ gnome-control-center
<ricotz> gnome-control-center: symbol lookup error: gnome-control-center: undefined symbol: gnome_get_all_languages
<ricotz> ah, never mind, although it still crashes
<ricotz> seb128, Laney, hi, the udisks patch in g-c-c is not applied aka not in the series file
<jbicha> seb128: I'll go ahead and do this g-c-c upload since I have another fix to add
<ricotz> jbicha, thanks
<seb128> jbicha, thx for pointing that out, I got bitten by the gbp workflow again :/
<tseliot> Wimpress: yes, I'm working on it.
<seb128> ricotz, that symbol issue is weird, can you give a ldd of the binary?
<seb128> jbicha, k, thx
<seb128> jbicha, also do you review the diff of every upload others do?
<Laney> just got a usb bluetooth adapter
<Laney> hoping for ZERO BUGS!
<Laney> let's try ;-)
<seb128> haha
<Laney> ok it's recognised by the kernel, good first step
<ricotz> seb128, seems some intermediate problem, the root cause was the missing patch as said
<seb128> ricotz, k, good
<ricotz> seb128, I tend to look at the diff if I got bitten by a bug myself
<seb128> yeah, makes sense
<Laney> k managed to pair with my phone and send a file, good start
<seb128> woot
<Laney> now let me try the headset
<seb128> tseliot, is there a bug about the nvidia problem? is #r-t aware of the problem?
<Laney> k, close but no cigar, it paired fine but they're not listed in the sound panel as an output
<tseliot> seb128: I don't think so, I noticed yesterday, and I asked tjaalton (who uploaded the new hwe stack)
<seb128> tseliot, tjaalton, can we get a bug tracking and r-t notified?
<jbicha> tseliot: since you're here, did you see bug 1815374?
<ubot5> bug 1815374 in screen-resolution-extra (Ubuntu) "Please adjust dependencies so that policykit-1-gnome can be demoted to universe" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1815374
<tseliot> jbicha: no, but I promise I'll have a look soon, thanks
<tseliot> seb128: sure
<seb128> tseliot, thx
<tseliot> seb128: it seems that we already have a bug report about it: LP: #1815579
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1815579 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-390 (Ubuntu) "Broken dependencies with nvidia-driver-390 and xserver-xorg-hwe-18.04 in bionic" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1815579
<seb128> tseliot, thx
<seb128> kenvandine, jbicha, so we got a stack of snap failing to build errors in the moderation queue from the desktop list around jan 30, is that something you know about? can I just discard those or is the info useful?
<seb128> things like
<seb128>  	[Snap build #447603] amd64 build of gedit snap package in ubuntu bionic-backports
<seb128> Store upload failed for gnome-calculator-candidate
<jbicha> seb128: those have generally been taken care of
<seb128> [Snap build #447889] i386 build of gnome-clocks-master snap package (gnome-clocks) in ubuntu bionic-updates
<seb128> k
<kenvandine> discard ;)
<seb128> thx
<seb128> I'm always unsure if those reach the uploader/right people as well
<seb128> or just the list
<jbicha> there are probably a few that will still ping until the Snap Store manual reviews are done for changed D-Bus app id's for GNOME 3.32
<seb128> k
<kenvandine> jbicha: do you know which ones haven't been ack'd yet?
<kenvandine> i can chase them down
<seb128> there was a few ' 	Store authorization failed for ...'
<seb128> unsure what those are
<kenvandine> i fixed those already
<kenvandine> well
<kenvandine> jbicha made sure i did :)
<jbicha> some of those emails are because Launchpad periodically requires reauthorization for it to automatically upload to the Store
<seb128> k
<kenvandine> the token expires from time to time
<kenvandine> annoying :)
<jbicha> it's a bit annoying for what we do :(
<jbicha> kenvandine: it looks like glade is the only one I see with the dbus rename now
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> jdstrand: can you look at that?  glade is stuck in review because of the dbus slot
<jdstrand> kenvandine: r32 - r35 (the latest) are all approved. they need to be released though (I did this yesterday or sometime). am I missing something?
<kenvandine> jdstrand: oh... they are :)
<kenvandine> sorry about that
<kenvandine> jbicha: ^^ all good
<jdstrand> np
<cyphermox> hey, on the desktop daily-live, I see the icon for ubiquity changed to some kind of weird circle and line thing, anybody know whether that's on purpose?
<kenvandine> jbicha: i've released glade-master to edge and glade to candidate
<kenvandine> jbicha: they have a fix for the gedit git mirror, just waiting for a sysadmin to roll it out
<kenvandine> been in their queue for a couple days now
<tomreyn> hey, i installed using the desktop daily-live, kept the default setting of "install updates during installation", chose minimal install, and ended up with 297 pending upgrades.
<tomreyn> (maybe this is already known or even expected at this time)
<kenvandine> tomreyn: that's not surprising.  The latest daily-live is nearly 2 weeks old now.
<kenvandine> tomreyn: there are newer ones in pending
<k_alam> jbicha: Hi, in nm-applet dependency can it be "policykit-1-gnome | gnome-shell" instead of "gnome-shell | policykit-1-gnome" ?
<tomreyn> kenvandine: i see. but isn't it more of a conceptual issue then? being just a dumb user i am i would assume that keeping the "install updates during installation" option would, whether the installer is old or new, make me end up with exactly 0 pending updates after the install is done.
<tomreyn> kenvandine: anyways, i don'T want to delay any work, or waste anyone's time, just thought this may be relevant.
<kenvandine> tomreyn: generally that number should be small.  With the current development release there are quite a few packages updated every day
<kenvandine> and the goal is to have a new daily live image everyday, something is holding that back right now
<kenvandine> not the norm
<kenvandine> tomreyn: no worries, it was worth mentioning :)
<tomreyn> we seem to be discussing different things. my point is that i'd expect the installer to check for and install any pending updates, no matter when the installer was generated.
<kenvandine> oh...
<kenvandine> no it doesn't do that
<kenvandine> it downloads them though
<kenvandine> so when you first boot up they can be applied if you wish
<kenvandine> without needing to download them
<tomreyn> that was not the case here
<seb128> kenvandine, tomreyn, that's sort of bug #1802337
<ubot5> bug 1802337 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Please apply security updates during Ubuntu install" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1802337
<seb128> the option/description is a bit misleading also
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> oSoMoN: looking at your diff it surprised me to see we still have a meson part.  I thought I had removed that now that snapcraft can fetch the latest meson with pip
<tomreyn> thanks seb128. maybe that's a dupe of  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual-tests/+bug/1798992 then
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1798992 in Ubuntu Manual Tests "Fresh desktop installation has packages pending autoremoval, pending updates" [Undecided,New]
<tomreyn> (and thank you as well, kenvandine)
<kenvandine> tomreyn: no worries
<kenvandine> oSoMoN: in theory you should be able to just remove that part
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, I'll try that
<seb128> kenvandine, bug #1815941 is interesting, from the screenshot on https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-software/uploads/ce3b0d852457daa6b03ec06d6015c462/Screenshot_from_2019-01-16_16-09-40.png gnome-software can display sources, would be nice to have that enabled for snaps. What's the best way to have that on the backlog for this cycle? trello board card?
<ubot5> bug 1815941 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Show the source field in overview for snaps and debs" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1815941
<kenvandine> seb128: that is interesting
<kenvandine> seb128: i think gnome-software now has a selector on the app page when the same appId is available from multiple sources
<kenvandine> or at least there is a recent design for that
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-02-15
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks, en forme ?
<didrocks> seb128: je suis en train de tomber enrhumÃ©
<seb128> :(
<didrocks> et toi ?
<seb128> moi Ã§a fait 2-3 jours le rhume
<seb128> j'espÃ¨re que Ã§a sera passÃ© d'ici dimanche
<seb128> (et que ton virus c'est le mÃªme ou que je vais pas le chopper :p)
<seb128> en fait pas trop aujourd'hui, repose toi
<didrocks> ouais, bonne idÃ©e
<Wimpress> o/
<Laney> ahoy
<seb128> hey Wimpress Laney, how is u.k today?
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> looking GREAT, blue skies all the way
<seb128> same here!
<didrocks> hey Wimpress, Laney
<Laney> hey there didrocks
<Laney> hope you have a blue sky too
<Wimpress> seb128: It grey today. Looking forward to Malta :-)
<seb128> weather in malta looks nie, 16Â°C sunny
<Laney> add another 10 to that and I'll be happy
<seb128> sad Laney it is
<seb128> sorry :(
<Laney> :(((((((((((((((((((((((((((((
 * didrocks wouldn't complaing with 16Â°C
<didrocks> especially, not really getting cold at night
<Laney> sorry, I have a consitutional obligation to complain about any weather
<Laney> Everybody gets a stack of forms at birth, and they have to be filled in at least once a day
<andyrock> it's 10Â°C in London today \o/
<andyrock> looks like spring
<seb128> hey andyrock, nice :)
<seb128> it's nice & sunny here too
<Laney> fixed the udisks2 test I think
<Laney> like all good fixes it's one line
<Laney> hey andyrock
<seb128> Laney, wooooot, well done
<seb128> Laney, btw did you figure out if your bluetooth sound device not listed was a g-c-c bug or other?
<seb128> tjaalton, bug #1816004 might be something for you?
<ubot5> bug 1816004 in libglvnd (Ubuntu) "GLVND: AARCH64 : Fix address passed to clear cache " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1816004
<tjaalton> seb128: yes
<seb128> tjaalton, well, I crossed it while looking at daily reports and wanted to mention so that's done :) it's probably not that important since it's arm64 only
<Laney> seb128: yeah it's buggy, dunno exactly how
<tjaalton> seb128: there's another update waiting in -proposed, this will wait until it's in updates
<seb128> tjaalton, yeah, as said I don't think it's important, I just wanted to mention it
<jbicha> seb128: new webkit doesn't build on armhf https://buildd.debian.org/status/package.php?p=webkit2gtk&suite=experimental
<seb128> jbicha, is upstream looking at that?
<jbicha> I can ask bertoâ¦
<seb128> thx
<mitya57> Trevinho: hi again, can you review 4 more my compiz MPs? I want to make a new release tomorrow, but want your approval first.
<seb128> jbicha, btw component-mismatch still list libnotify as wanted to pull n-d to main
<kenvandine> jbicha: i just released gedit from the gnome-3-30 branch automated build to stable
<seb128> andyrock, did you see my comment on https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/update-notifier/livepatch-notification-button/+merge/362478 ?
<andyrock> yup one sec
<seb128> andyrock, so clicking on the notification bg is supposed to do the same as clicking on the button?
<jbicha> seb128: yes I saw the component-mismatch so I tried something else :)
<jbicha> these alternate dependencies are annoying
<seb128> indeeed
<jbicha> https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/+git/ubuntu/commit/?id=2f639d44 is what I tried this time
<jbicha> oh I wonder if s390x might be part of the troubleâ¦
<jbicha> I wasn't thinking about that ð¢
<jbicha> * ubuntu-session [!s390x]
<seb128> :/
<jbicha> I guess we could have libnotify4 recommend gnome-shell [!s390x] | notification-daemon [!s390x]   it's a bit ugly but maybe it's the right thingâ¦
<jbicha> we'd have to do that for the other n-d rdepends in main too: update-notifer and network-manager-gnome
<jbicha> kenvandine: thanks, it's a nice upgrade :)
<mitya57> Trevinho: thanks a lot :)
<Trevinho> mitya57: np
<seb128> k, enough work for today
<seb128> enjoy your w.e desktopers, safe travel for those flying on sunday
<jbicha> seb128: maybe no desktop IRC meeting next week?
<seb128> probably not
<Trevinho> mitya57: can you also include https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/unity/+git/unity/+merge/363124 in the landing please?
<Trevinho> so we can start the SRU process
<kenvandine> anyone here running disco + wayland that can test something for me?
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-02-16
<mitya57> Trevinho: I have just uploaded compiz 0.9.14.0 tarball! One last thing: can you please change Development focus on https://launchpad.net/compiz/+edit to 0.9.14 series?
<tomreyn> had you considered to raise the hardware recommendations listed at? https://www.ubuntu.com/download/desktop
<tomreyn> 2 GB RAM is really little, especiall since there is only 64-bit now.
<tomreyn> we just had someone in #ubuntu whose mid 2010 macbook pro formally matches these specs, and who was annoyed that (paraphrased) 'it still doesnt work'
<jbicha> tomreyn: please start a topic at https://community.ubuntu.com/c/desktop
<jbicha> that way it can be discusssed easier across timezones and schedules (most of the team isn't actively online here right now)
<tomreyn> yes, makes sense.
<tomreyn> hope it'll have the team's attention.
<tomreyn> https://community.ubuntu.com/t/please-raise-hardware-recommendations/9814
<tomreyn> thanks, and have a nice weekend
<jbicha> thanks
<jbicha> no, 8GB is too much
<jbicha> close some browser tabs ð
<tomreyn> 8 GB isn't too much for a *recommendation* IMO, it is too much for *minimal* specifications.
<tomreyn> so far the *recommendation* is 2 GB, making people think this will give you a good experience, which is just wrong.
<tomreyn> but hey, just comment on the post ;)+
<jbicha> there is a number between 2 and 8 ð
<jbicha> all I'm saying is: I liked your first draft better
<tomreyn> and i'm glad to know your POV there.
<jbicha> ok, fair enough
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-02-10
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<jibel> bonjour oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut jibel
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN, jibel, ricotz and pieq
<pieq> hey duflu !
<jibel> hi all
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> salut pieq
<oSoMoN> morning ricotz
<ricotz> hey desktopers
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> could someone release https://code.launchpad.net/~canonical-platform-qa/autopilot/+git/autopilot/+ref/master ?
<jibel> it removes the last bits of deps on Qt4
<jibel> xnox, ^
<marcustomlinson> morning oSoMoN jibel duflu pieq ricotz didrocks
<Laney> helloooooo
<marcustomlinson> morning Laney
<duflu> Morning marcustomlinson and Laney
<oSoMoN> morning marcustomlinson, Laney
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson, Laney, duflu
<Laney> wooooooooo
<Laney> hi marcustomlinson duflu oSoMoN didrocks!
<Laney> how's it going?
<marcustomlinson> distracted... watching the snow outside my window
<marcustomlinson> :)
<oSoMoN> going ok here, like a Monday with tons of things to do this week
<didrocks> good, and you?
<Laney> alllllllllllllrigggghhhtttttttt
<Laney> enjoyed watching the storm yesterday
<didrocks> it was 13Â°C at 8am, crazy!
<Laney> summer time kids
<RikMills> jibel: unity-autopilot from src:unity also deps on window-mocker. are you intending to drop that as well?
<jibel> RikMills, no I didn't plan to do that, but any maintainer of unity can do it. I don't have upload rights, it's a single line to remove from the control file and the tests are skipped if window-mocker is not installer
<jibel> installed*
<jibel> OOC why qt4 is not removed from windowmocker instead of removing windowmocker from all the packages that depend on it?
<RikMills> jibel: apologies. I thought you were core-dev or otherwise had rights. regards where in the chain to drop the dep, I think there have just been a few conversions that didn't quite 'join up' in their conclusions. the qt4 window-mocker dep has to go if window-mocker stays in the archive
<xnox> jibel:  tah, will upload in a second.
<xnox> jibel:  the question i have is if unity-autopilot is used at all by anything, or even run anywhere.
<jibel> xnox, it's the functional test suite of unity, so I don't think it's used anywhere outside of unity.
<jibel> that's a question for the current devs of unity
<Laney> that's enough yak shaving on eds
<diddledan> bald yaks?!
<diddledan> http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-5nl7XXD7cS4/Ta1gB9T8e5I/AAAAAAAAAKQ/sXMLuqIfG8s/s1600/gangri+norbu.JPG
<Laney> nicely coiffured hipster yaks
<Laney> actually you probably couldn't call anything about e-d-s hipster in any way
<Saviq> didrocks: Hey, I've to set up my laptop fresh, was wanting to use your guys' zsys work, is there a way to have it with encryption yet?
<Saviq> jibel: you may know, too? ^
<jibel> Saviq, Hi, we won't enable encryption this cycle. We noticed some performance issues and don't have enough confidence to enable it by default for all the datasets.
<Saviq> jibel: that's subvolume encryption? How about full disk?
<jibel> Saviq, however you can still encrypt your home datasets for example by creating a new dataset with encryption on then export/import your data
<jibel> that's for full disk, we won't enable encryption when the main pool is created
<jibel> but you can still to it for individual datasets
<Saviq> jibel: any way to tell zsys to do its stuff on luks-encrypted volumes?
<cpaelzer> didrocks: can you add the desktop team subscription to fonts-urw-base35 for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fonts-urw-base35/+bug/1862048 ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1862048 in ghostscript (Ubuntu) "[MIR] fonts-urw-base35" [High,New]
<jibel> Saviq, no, if you want to use luks + zfs you have to do it manually
<Saviq> Ack, thanks
<Saviq> Let's see if the focal installer works :)
<diddledan> doing ZFS on top of another technology like LUKS or the BSD equivalent is usually advised against by ZFS upstream IIRC
<Saviq> Sure, makes sense :)
<diddledan> it's best to let ZFS use the drive directly :-)
<diddledan> having an extra layer means ZFS doesn't know the true topology so it can't optimise correctly, possibly causing issues
<Saviq> Home dataset would work, too, would I need to unlock manually before logging in?
<didrocks> Saviq: yes, there is no integration yet AFAIK
<didrocks> Laney: mind subscribing desktop-packages to fonts-urw-base35? Only you and seb are admin for this team
<didrocks> cc cpaelzer ^
<tkamppeter> didrocks, exactly this I wanted to say here.
<tkamppeter> And I have a MER for gsfonts now.
<tkamppeter> See bug 1862048.
<ubot5> bug 1862048 in ghostscript (Ubuntu) "[MIR] fonts-urw-base35" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1862048
<didrocks> tkamppeter: please get the team subscribed as well before filing the MIR
<tkamppeter> didrocks, OK, sorry that I forgot it. Now it's ACKed at least. Hope this did not break something. I have subscribed the team at least after the fact.
<didrocks> good, thanks tkamppeter
<Laney> okey dokey
<Laney> done
<tkamppeter> didrocks, can someone report a bug on libwmf and python-reportlab to move from (unmaintained) gsfonts to (maintained and current) fonts-urw-base35?
<didrocks> you? :p
<Laney> indeed
<tkamppeter> I tried but Launchpad oopses and deletes everything what I wrote.
<Laney> there's no reason that would be better for anyone else though
<tkamppeter> OK, I will edit externally and then cycle until LP accepts.
<Laney> Wait ten minutes; there's a known LP bug in this area and that's the remedy
<tkamppeter> Laney, and what is this known bug?
<Laney> Something about postgres
<Laney> don't know the details, sorry :(
<tkamppeter> Laney, but what will happen in 10 minutes?
<Laney> That's how long the bug usually persists for, if it's the same one
<Laney> imagine if it's some maintenance task which takes that long to run
<tkamppeter> Laney, I tried to report s new bug.
<tkamppeter> Or does it mean that it takes these 10 minutes until my account gets unblocked from the postgres bug?
<GunnarHj> bluesabre: Hello Sean, do you have time to sponsor the debdiff at bug #1861481?
<ubot5> bug 1861481 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "language-options causes live CD sessions to be untranslated" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1861481
<Laney> tkamppeter: Just wait ten minutes and try again, and if you still can't then maybe ask #launchpad to look at the OOPS ID you get
<tkamppeter> Laney, I succeeded now: bug 1862641
<ubot5> bug 1862641 in python-reportlab (Ubuntu) "Please replace the dependency on gsfonts by fonts-urw-base35" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1862641
<Laney> great
<Laney> You might be better off filing those at Debian, and attaching patches
<Laney> to have the best chance of success
<Laney> TIL about F-strings in python
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers
<hellsworth> i'm trying to reproduce a bug locally but it requires a working kerberos environment. is there a kerberos server somewhere I could use or should I actually go through with setting up a kerberos server/client?
<hellsworth> it looks like setting up a kerberos server is a bit of a pain so though i'd ask before committing to that
<Laney> tseliot: can I flag https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers-440/+bug/1862499 to you please?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1862499 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-440 (Ubuntu) "package nvidia-compute-utils-440 440.59-0ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: installed nvidia-compute-utils-440 package post-installation script subprocess returned error exit status 1" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Laney> it should be using /usr/sbin/nologin
<Laney> hey hellsworth
<Laney> no idea about kerberos I'm afraid
<hellsworth> ok thanks anyways
<didrocks> hey hellsworth
<Laney> possibly #ubuntu-server would
<hellsworth> ok thanks for the tip. i'll go ask there :)
<Laney> tseliot: btw nologin is the default, so you can leave that out altogether
<oSoMoN> good morning hellsworth
<hellsworth> o/ oSoMoN !
<tseliot> Laney, sure. I wonder why it started failing now
<Laney> I used ubuntu-drivers
<Laney> suspect maybe it removed the -435 package including the user and then -440 tried to recreate it
<tseliot> I'll have a look, thanks
<hellsworth> man, a single mesa change really starts the domino effect of usn rereshes
<diddledan> _eeeverything_ depends on ligGL.so.1 :-p
<diddledan> libGL, too
<hellsworth> yeah i mean makes sense
<kenvandine> hellsworth: you should try building epiphany with the gnome-3-34 extension.  You can probably drop all the parts other than epiphany and snapcraft-preload
<kenvandine> the build failures are gtk
<hellsworth> ok
<hellsworth> thats like 130 lines removed :)
<kenvandine> yup
<diddledan> wait, gnome-3-34?! :-o
<diddledan> and there I am still using gnome-3-28!
<hellsworth> diddledan: we're still working on merging it (https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/2794) but you can go ahead and give it a shot. it's in the store under stanpcraft edge/pr-2794
<gitbot> snapcore issue (Pull request) 2794 in snapcraft "Add gnome 3 34 extension" [Open]
<diddledan> aha
<diddledan> thanks :-)
<hellsworth> if you build stuff with the gnome-3-34 extension and have any issues at all, i'd love to hear about them :)
<hellsworth> kenvandine: epiphany is having the same issue as drawing (can't run snapcraftctl set-version $(git describe --tags --abbrev=10)) but in epiphany's case adding git to the build-packages section doesn't fix it
<kenvandine> hellsworth: log?
<hellsworth> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/3pP7vfTwPH/
<hellsworth> kenvandine: why isn't epiphany part of snapcrafters?
<kenvandine> It's more like the gnome snaps
<kenvandine> hellsworth We should probably start treating it like the other gnome snaps
<hellsworth> but the other gnome snaps (mostly) have the snap included in upstream
<hellsworth> ok but i think i see your point. since epiphany is more "official" than the projects in snapcrafters, it should not be in snapcrafters
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I've got a heaptrack trace of gnome-software idling at ~700MB uploading to that gnome-software bug. Hopefully it's helpful!
<robert_ancell> RAOF, thanks!
<ideopathic> Hi all... I'm building a cross platform application that is intended to be installed in the user space.  I've been looking at the XDG documentation for recommendations for installation paths.  It appears that ~/.local/share is the desired location, however, it's unclear if I install a help app if that should be installed in ~/.local/share/app/bin/helperapp or if this should be something like
<ideopathic>  ~/.local/bin/helperapp.  If someone could point me to an appropriate document or discussion, it would be appreciated.
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-02-11
<amurray> GunnarHj: we had some folks enquiring about the ibus CVE-2019-14822 update - this is still blocked on the glib2.0 SRU in LP: #1844853 - is this still being worked on?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1844853 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu Eoan) "IBus no longer works in Qt applications after upgrade" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1844853
<GunnarHj> amurray: The eoan SRU is being worked on; see bug #1850932. As regards the other releases I'm not sure. Laney may be able to shed more light on it.
<ubot5> bug 1850932 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu Eoan) "[SRU] Backport 2.62.4-1" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1850932
<amurray> GunnarHj: ok no worries - can you please let me know when the eoan (and others) go through so I can push out the ibus updates?
<GunnarHj> amurray: Sure, will do.
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<didrocks> good morning
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<duflu> It must be time to water some garden
<ricotz> good morning
<duflu> Hi ricotz
<didrocks> hey duflu, ricotz
<Wimpress> Morning o/
<RikMills> xnox: polite nudge on that outpilot upload if you have time...
<RikMills> *autopilot
<didrocks> hey Wimpress
<duflu> Morning Wimpress
<marcustomlinson> morning oSoMoN duflu didrocks ricotz Wimpress
<oSoMoN> good morning ricotz, Wimpress
<oSoMoN> morning marcustomlinson
<Laney> hello
<duflu> Morning marcustomlinson and Laney
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson, Laney, still having snow?
<Laney> hey duflu didrocks
<Laney> there's a bit left on the ground
<Laney> enough to be annoying but not to look nice or be fun to play on
 * Laney grumpy
<Laney> what's going on in france?
<didrocks> yeah, the grey dark dirty snow in cities :p
<didrocks> nothing special here
<Wimpress> Back in Bluefin. It's not the same with didrocks and the Yaru team.
<Wimpress> *without
<Laney> moin Wimpress
<Laney> what's going in in ldn?
<Laney> condolences for having to commute
<Wimpress> Selling a kidney for train ticket and having standing room only is objectionable.
<didrocks> Wimpress: we were part of all the fun! :)
<didrocks> you have a second one for the way back at least :p
<Wimpress> Laney: Working on bootstrapping the appliances images work. Group of us here.
<oSoMoN> hullo Laney
<Laney> oic
<Laney> hey oSoMoN
<Laney> bet you've not got any snow :>
<marcustomlinson> hey didrocks, I was just about to say no, but it just started up again now :P
<didrocks> ahah
<Laney> didrocks: is there a preferred way to contact the MIR team? or just email?
<Laney> or cpaelzer ^-
 * Laney has an MIR exception ready to discuss, as pre-discussed :-)
<didrocks> the meeting time is the best place/time IMHO, but if it's urgent, it can be discussed beforehand
<Laney> not really, but I would have expected it to be something to read at leisure and not during a meeting
<Laney> as you wish
<didrocks> I guess we have empty enough content meeting to discuss it there. Otherwise, just open a MIR, set it as incomplete and write the details there
<didrocks> the advantage of the meeting is that it's more interactive and we have more than one person on it
<didrocks> (hopefully :p)
<Laney> ok!
<didrocks> see you in a few hours then ;)
<cpaelzer> Laney: ack to "if not urgent then at the meeting"
<Laney> I was going by e.g. what the TB do
<Laney> email -> get on agenda -> discuss at meeting
<Laney> so people can prepare beforehand
<jibel> xnox, RikMills so, window-mocker has been developed specifically for unity tests with autopilot. If unity doesn't run the functional tests anymore windowmocker can completely be removed from the archive.
<RikMills> jibel: and it does not? if so, very much agreed
<jibel> RikMills, windowmocker is used by the search tests and last update is from 2013. I doubt these tests are still running but it'd need a confirmation from the current devs of unity. Besides if windowmocker is removed it'll skip these tests but won't completely break the test suite.
<jibel> Trevinho, ^ do you know if the autopilot tests of unity are still used?
<jibel> Trevinho, we'd like to remove python-windowmocker which depends on qt4 from the archive and it's only used by these tests
<Laney> xnox: can you remind me what the status of uploading the oem archive keyring is please?
<xnox> Laney:  i am yet to do it. Are you after the package name?
<xnox> or like the key file name?
 * xnox should do it today, such that it sits in the new queue
<Laney> package name, I don't really care about the keyfile name
<Laney> UNLESS
<Laney> we ship it outside of trusted.whateveritis.d and use [deb signed-by=/path/to/oem-...]
<Laney> in the oem-foo-meta packages
<Laney> which might be sensible? in which case yes, since I'll specify that in the MIR template
<Laney> s/template/exception/
<xnox> ooooh deb signed-by sounds interesting => does it only use the one key for that archive?
<xnox> i was thinking to simply ship it in trusted.gpg.d
<Laney> yeah
<xnox> like dbgsyms / cdimage / archive keys are
<Laney> see sources.list(5)
<Laney> right, perhaps those pre-date this concept but it's probably sensible to use it where possible?
<xnox> Laney:  i guess you can still use that, even though the signed-by=/etc/apt/trusted.gpg/oem.... ?
<xnox> Laney:  i guess you can still use that, even though the signed-by=/etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/oem.... ?
<Laney> presumably
<Laney> but then it would let *other* repos be signed by that key
<xnox> right, those that are not scoped
<Laney> would be cool for e.g. add-apt-repository to use this too
<xnox> But then where should the keys be placed?
<Laney> dunno
<Laney> /usr/share/ somewhere?
<xnox> add-apt-repository is system config so should be like /etc or /var
<xnox> (most of them are)
<xnox> /etc/apt/sources.d/foo.list & foo.asc ?
<xnox> /etc/apt/sources.list.d/foo.list & foo.asc ?
 * xnox fails at typing
<Laney> or /var/lib/
<Laney> presumably Julian would have some opinions here ...
 * xnox opens a bug report
<Laney> anyway, what is the package name? oem-archive-keyring?
<xnox> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-properties/+bug/1862764
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1862764 in software-properties (Ubuntu) "add-apt-repository should use signed-by" [Undecided,New]
<xnox> Laney:  ubuntu-oem-keyring (which matches ubuntu-cloud-keyring which is for ubuntu-cloud.archive.canonical.com)
<Laney> ok!
 * Laney makes a fake oem package which works inside qemu for testing in VMs
<RikMills> jibel Trevinho; lovely, unity FTBFS in focal ppa with cmake not being able to find compiz. so dropping window-mocker dep might need work
<Laney> have you guys tried talking to k_alam about unity?
<Laney> email or discourse might be best for that
<mitya57> RikMills: do you have a link to build log?
<RikMills> mitya57: https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ppa/+archive/ubuntu/experimental/+sourcepub/10990496/+listing-archive-extra
<RikMills> seems I can't spell unity.....
<mitya57> RikMills: thanks. I am on a meeting at job now, will take a look later.
<mitya57> RikMills: ah, compiz-dev ships /usr/share/cmake-3.15/FindCompiz.cmake. Looks like it needs a rebuild against cmake 3.16 to update the path.
<mitya57> RikMills: I am building it in https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/3924/+packages now. If you make a MP against unity I can test-build it in the same PPA.
<RikMills> mitya57: its not a done deal on dropping the dep yet. need to hear back from unity devs
<mitya57> Ok
<sergiusens> kenvandine: hey, btw, I have the "Reminders" window popup with Online Accounts (calendar) and Gnome Calendar
<Trevinho> RikMills: I'm all fine with that, as per the testing side can probably all be removed safely
<Trevinho> RikMills: as for the cmake thing, may be because of some compiz cmake macros not working anymore?
<RikMills> Trevinho: thanks. yeah, sounds like compiz needs rebuild for cmake in -proposed
<Laney> whoops, found my weekly update un-submitted!
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers
<kenvandine> good morning hellsworth
<hellsworth> hi kenvandine
<kenvandine> hellsworth: i've got epiphany building anr running :)
<kenvandine> minor tweak
<hellsworth> oooh what was it
<kenvandine> LD_LIBRARY_PATH
<hellsworth> aaah
<kenvandine> hellsworth: probably needs a tweak in the extension
<hellsworth> can you show me what path you used in epiphany?
<kenvandine> hellsworth:  this needs to be add to LD_LIBRARY_PATH:
<kenvandine>  $SNAP/gnome-platform/usr/lib
<marcustomlinson> that's odd
<oSoMoN> good morning hellsworth
<kenvandine> some of the libs in the platform snap aren't installed in the arch path
<marcustomlinson> I would've expected that path to have been carried over from dekstop-helpers
<kenvandine> me too
<marcustomlinson> https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/blob/af0979e1e810732f75c39dbf85f8b6c32e3991e4/common/desktop-exports#L63
<marcustomlinson> must have been missed
<kenvandine> meeting time!
<kenvandine> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-02-11
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Feb 11 14:30:07 2020 UTC.  The chair is kenvandine. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-02-11 | Current topic:
<kenvandine> Roll call:  didrocks, duflu (out), jamesh (out), jibel, kenvandine, laney (out), marcustomlinson, oSoMoN, seb128 (out), tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out), Wimpress (out), hellsworth
<marcustomlinson> \o
<hellsworth> o/
<kenvandine> oh, i'm not sure if seb128 is out :)
<oSoMoN> o/
<jibel> he is
<didrocks> hey
<kenvandine> ok
<marcustomlinson> meanwhile seb128 watches from the bushes fighting the urge to speak and give away his location
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> let's get started
<kenvandine> #topic rls-ff-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-02-11 | Current topic: rls-ff-bugs
<kenvandine> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ff-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<kenvandine> oh weird... i can't open the bug links in firefox
<kenvandine> i get a dialog asking to download it
<oSoMoN> file a bug :)
<hellsworth> :)
<marcustomlinson> I see a lot of duflu on those open bugs
<kenvandine> restarting the browser fixed it
<oSoMoN> turning it off and on againâ¦
<kenvandine> yeah, lots of duflu
<marcustomlinson> oh I see, these are mostly champagne additions
<marcustomlinson> all actually
<Laney> Daniel seems to be adding champagne to lots of bugs
<Laney> not sure that's how this is supposed to work
<kenvandine> indeed
<Laney> de-tag those and follow up with a mail to the team(s) explaining it?
<kenvandine> it might still follow the spirit of champagne
<kenvandine> let's discuss this again in the leads meeting
<kenvandine> before de-tagging
<Laney> seriously hope it doesn't
<kenvandine> well, these could have been tagged by finding the same issue and tagging the existing bug instead of filing new
<kenvandine> looks like tracking is fine
<kenvandine> moving on
<kenvandine> #topic rls-ee-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-02-11 | Current topic: rls-ee-bugs
<kenvandine> nothing desktop in incoming
<kenvandine> bug 1853768 is in tracking but not assigned
<ubot5> bug 1853768 in yaru-theme (Ubuntu Eoan) "Qt apps, like kid3-qt, which uses legacy icons "document-*.png", show them as normal document icon under Yaru theme" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1853768
<hellsworth> says its fixed in focal
<kenvandine> yeah, but eoan needs the SRU
<kenvandine> that's the only one not assigned
<kenvandine> besides the NM bug
<RikMills> Trevinho: https://code.launchpad.net/~rikmills/unity/+git/unity/+merge/378891
<mitya57> kenvandine: I wanted to take care of SRUing it, but I'm waiting for the current yaru-theme in eoan-proposed to migrate.
<kenvandine> mitya57: can we assign it to you?
<mitya57> Yes
<kenvandine> thanks
<kenvandine> moving on
<kenvandine> #topic rls-bb-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-02-11 | Current topic: rls-bb-bugs
<kenvandine> nothing for desktop incoming
<kenvandine> only un-assigned bugs in tracking are NM
<kenvandine> #topic update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-02-11 | Current topic: update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<kenvandine> Laney: you're up
<Laney> Don't have super much to say, could someone take a look at the regressions underneath gobject-introspection maybe?
<Laney> and there's a libreoffice regression noted there, not sure if that's something to be concerned with
<Laney> otherwise python3-defaults is making it look sad but that's not on us to handle
<hellsworth> marcustomlinson: libreoffice shouldn't be blocking python3 anymore since the LO ubuntu4 deb is in proposed?
<marcustomlinson> yeah fingers crossed that'll be sorted out soon
<marcustomlinson> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html#libreoffice
<marcustomlinson> tests running
<kenvandine> no volunteers for gobject-introspection?
<marcustomlinson> here's a rubbish suggestion, how about we just hit retry on all the failures
 * marcustomlinson runs away
 * marcustomlinson is sort of serious though
<hellsworth> i'm full with LO and gnome snapcraft extension
<hellsworth> i wish i could help but i'm already trying not to drown
<kenvandine> ok, moving on
<kenvandine> #topic aob
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-02-11 | Current topic: aob
<hellsworth> nothing from me
<Laney> gnome updates
<Laney> it would be good if people could volunteer to do a couple of these to spread it around a bit
<kenvandine> i guess we didn't make good progress since last week?
<Laney> https://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html not really
<hellsworth> Laney what has to be done with these to update them?
<Laney> wrangling the packaging
<hellsworth> i need more specifics
<hellsworth> i see libreoffice in that list. what do i need to do to that to "wrangle the packaging"
<Laney> yeah sorry, but it's hard to be specific
<oSoMoN> I'm late on feature work and trying to stay afloat, but I'll make some room for some updates this week
<Laney> basically get the package, check what changed between the version we have and the new one, and adjust accordingly
<Laney> adding / updating build-dependencies, stuff like that
<Laney> https://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/gnome.html maybe that's a better one to look at
<hellsworth> is there any documentation on this process?
<oSoMoN> dropping or rebasing ubuntu-specific patches on top of upstream/debian
<marcustomlinson> hellsworth: we don't follow rc releases from Debian in libreoffice, so ignore it
<hellsworth> oooh these packages are out of date with respect to debian and you're asking for them to be updated
<Laney> the high level goal is to get gnome 3.35.90 into focal
<kenvandine> debian or upstream
<kenvandine> working towards the gnome RC
<hellsworth> all of these packages have gnome 3.35.90 in the debian or upstream package?
<Laney> there's some documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/git https://wiki.debian.org/Gnome/Git https://honk.sigxcpu.org/projects/git-buildpackage/manual-html/
<hellsworth> Laney: thanks but i think i understand now
<kenvandine> ok, moving on
<Laney> usually it's us (& endless folks, & some others) who do the update in Debian too
<kenvandine> any more aob?
<Laney> (thanks oSoMoN!)
<hellsworth> i'll try updating one sometime in the near future
<kenvandine> well that's a wrap
<kenvandine> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Feb 11 15:09:39 2020 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2020/ubuntu-desktop.2020-02-11-14.30.moin.txt
<kenvandine> thanks all
<hellsworth> thanks
<oSoMoN> thanks
<marcustomlinson> thanks
<Laney> yeah it's one of those 'core' things that it'd be good to have more people able to participate in
<Laney> thanks
<hellsworth> makes sense
<Laney> Trevinho: did you say you were working on mutter & shell 3.35?
<didrocks> thx
<Trevinho> Laney: I started preparing yeah, although I had to go back at some MRs
<Trevinho> but ideally I want to do it this asap
<Laney> ok greaT
<RikMills> language-selector build depends on pyqt4-dev-tools! can this be dropped please?
<gQuigs> chrisccoulson: any thoughts on Flash for 20.04? https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/ubuntu-20-04-and-flash/13814/2
<gQuigs> also (only slightly related as they both let me write a cleaner apparmor profile) - is the shell script still needed? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/1860734
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1860734 in firefox (Ubuntu) "Drop firefox.sh shell script" [Undecided,New]
<oSoMoN> gQuigs, IÂ need to look into that one
<hellsworth> when a user contacts the team members for a package (libreoffice in this case), their email presumably goes to several people besides myself. In my email it looks like this one person emailed me so there's no reply all. so how should i respond so that the other team members see the response (and know it's already been responded to)?
<marcustomlinson> hellsworth: good question, as far as I know there's no way to do this. The sender may receive multiple replies to the same question. oSoMoN is this correct?
<marcustomlinson> I mean, you could manually cc everyone from here: https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+members#active
<marcustomlinson> the admins I mean
<hellsworth> yeah i thought about manually cc'ing folks but i thought there might be a better way or maybe the other team members were already somehow alerted
<hellsworth> ok i'll manually cc in the future
<hellsworth> marcustomlinson: oSoMoN I've already responded to Hildo (subject: Ubuntu 16.04)
<doko> yes, everybody gets the email, appearing to be sent directly to you
<hellsworth> fyi, i plan to respond to all of the libreoffice inquiries as they come in. i don't want you two to worry about them unless I need help answering a question
<hellsworth> doko: yes but then no one knows that it's been responded to already by one of the other team members
<marcustomlinson> thanks hellsworth
<marcustomlinson> hellsworth: when people ask about newer versions of libreoffice on previous releases of ubuntu (as is 90% of these messages), you can punt the snap
<doko> that's LP ...
<doko> or CC the list on your replies
<hellsworth> marcustomlinson: yup that's what i'm seeing/doing so far :)
<hellsworth> but i will start cc'ing the list
<oSoMoN> hellsworth, that sounds like a good plan, thanks for taking this on!
<hellsworth> my pleasure
<marcustomlinson> hellsworth: https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html#libreoffice
<marcustomlinson> \o/
<marcustomlinson> finally libreoffice should start unblocking stuff
<hellsworth> woo!
<hellsworth> yeah i had this tab pinned, waiting for the results :)
<hellsworth> why does it say armhf passed when the tests were skipped?
<hellsworth> it looks like the tests on armhf actually ran
<marcustomlinson> hellsworth: "ran"
<hellsworth> well they "ran" for 5 hours
<marcustomlinson> hellsworth: oh yeah the tests ran, I just disabled 3
<marcustomlinson> all the others ran as normal
<marcustomlinson> there's something up with extensions on armhf
<marcustomlinson> hellsworth: you have a todo for this right?
<hellsworth> oh i see
<hellsworth> i do. i created a trello card
<marcustomlinson> cool
<marcustomlinson> thanks
<hellsworth> do you want me to add you to it?
<hellsworth> i figured not
<hellsworth> marcustomlinson: i just learned about https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ubuntu/ppa
<hellsworth> how can i update it?
<hellsworth> i would like to be able to update the description
<hellsworth> or is this maintained by rictoz?
<marcustomlinson> hellsworth: yes that's ricot_z
<marcustomlinson> hellsworth: you can contribute if you wish of course
<hellsworth> ok thanks
<marcustomlinson> okidokes, I'm off. good evening all
<kenvandine> hellsworth: epiphany in the candidate channel was built with the gnome-3-34 extension
<hellsworth> wat that's awesome!
<hellsworth> i still haven't worked my way back to epiphany yet today
<kenvandine> automated builds will of course fail...
<hellsworth> sure
<kenvandine> i triggered a build with the right version of snapcraft
<hellsworth> oh also gnome-3-34-1804-sdk in candidate has mm-common and gtkmm in it
<kenvandine> hellsworth: so it is built on LP
<hellsworth> nice!!!!!
<kenvandine> hellsworth: oh... awesome
<hellsworth> i intend to try snapping gnome-system-monitor with it to try it out
<hellsworth> maybe today
<hellsworth> idk
<hellsworth> too many things to do
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> :)
<hellsworth> :)
<kenvandine> hellsworth: did you look at tweaking LD_LIBRARY_PATH in the extension?
<kenvandine> to add $SNAP/gnome-platform/usr/lib
<hellsworth> no. i made a note to do it.
<kenvandine> cool
<hellsworth> been looking at LO bugs, usn refreshes, responding to LO queries, trying to dig through email
<kenvandine> understood
<kenvandine> good progress though
<hellsworth> thanks
<hellsworth> little by little :)
<ricotz> hellsworth, hi :), please leave those backport to me
<hellsworth> ricotz: okey dokey :)
<hellsworth> thanks
<hellsworth> i was more just trying to make sure i wasn't missing something that i was supposed to be doing
<hellsworth> still learning the LO land :)
<hellsworth> kenvandine: i built snapcraft with the added LD_LIBRARY_PATH, installed it, and am building epiphany now. fingers crossed :)
<hellsworth> i'm also building gnome-system-monitor with the gnome-3-34 extension too :)
<kenvandine> hellsworth: cool
<hellsworth> turns out that gtkmm is not actually in the build snap because i still had snapcraftctl build still commeted
<hellsworth> ð¤¦
<rodicio> test
<rodicio> Hi. Anyone speak Spanish?
<doko> marcustomlinson: libreoffice-gtk still depends on libreoffice-gtk2 which isn't built anymore
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-02-12
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> good morning
<pieq> salut les desktoppers :)
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, pieq
<didrocks> salut pieq, oSoMoN
<pieq> a friend of mine (running 19.10) saw that Firefox 73 was released and was wondering why he didn't have it in the repo yet. I told him to be patient :) but I was wondering what was the process from the desktop team
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN, didrocks, pieq
<jibel> pieq, he could use the snap. 73 is in the candidate channel
<jibel> bonjour BTW
<pieq> jibel, merci, je transmets. But I was just curious about the current debian packaging process.
<oSoMoN> pieq, the process is the following: I push the new version to the current devel series (currently focal) and IÂ prepare backports for all supported releases in a PPA, which IÂ then validate and hand over to the security team for publication
<oSoMoN> the security team does their own validation and verifications, and then publish to the -security and -updates pockets
<oSoMoN> firefox 73.0 is ready for publication as far as I'm concerned
<oSoMoN> it should hit {bionic,eoan}-{security,updates} very soon
<oSoMoN> (xenial is a different matter this time, blocked on bug #1856861)
<ubot5> bug 1856861 in firefox (Ubuntu) "Firefox 73 require C++17, not available in xenial" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1856861
<pieq> oSoMoN, thanks a lot for the explanation!
<oSoMoN> you're welcome
<marcustomlinson> doko: on it
<marcustomlinson> morning desktoppers
<oSoMoN> good morning marcustomlinson
<Wimpress> Morning o/
<marcustomlinson> hey oSoMoN and Wimpress
<oSoMoN> morning Wimpress
<didrocks> hey Wimpress, marcustomlinson
<marcustomlinson> hey didrocks
<duflu> Morning marcustomlinson and Wimpress
<duflu> My scrollback failed again
<marcustomlinson> morning duflu
<marcustomlinson> well my morning at least
<duflu> http://www.total-knowledge.com/~ilya/mips/ugt.html
<marcustomlinson> :)
<oSoMoN> :)
<oSoMoN> salsa.debian.org is down, that's untimely
<Laney> greetings!
<marcustomlinson> morning Laney
<ricotz> good morning
<marcustomlinson> hi ricotz
<Laney> hey marcustomlinson ricotz
<duflu> Morning Laney
<didrocks> hey Laney
<Laney> hey marcustomlinson ricotz duflu didrocks
<tkamppeter> Some core dev around here? Could you have a look at bug 1862926? It updates SANE to make the scanning in nearly all modern multi-function printers work and hopefully also stops users from mucking around with HPLIP (bug 1766020).
<ubot5> bug 1862926 in sane-backends (Ubuntu) "Request for update: SANE 1.0.29" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1862926
<ubot5> bug 1766020 in hplip (Ubuntu) "package python3 3.6.5-3 failed to install/upgrade: installed python3 package post-installation script subprocess returned error exit status 4" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1766020
<ogra> oSoMoN, my chromium madly spams my journal with denials recently ...
<ogra> ogra@acheron:~$ journalctl |grep chromium|grep -c DENIED
<ogra> 142918
<ogra> apparmor="DENIED" operation="open" profile="snap.chromium.chromium" name="/home/ogra/snap/chromium/1005/.config/chromium/Default/Cookies-journal" pid=16571 comm="ThreadPoolForeg" requested_mask="wc" denied_mask="wc" fsuid=1000 ouid=1000
<ogra> (i assume an issue with the "refresh awarenes" ? )
<sil2100> jibel: hey! You around today?
<jibel> sil2100, hi
<GunnarHj> Wimpress: Do you possibly have time to sponsor the debdiff at bug #1861481?
<ubot5> bug 1861481 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "language-options causes live CD sessions to be untranslated" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1861481
<oSoMoN> ogra, that sounds like it, indeed. Do you have experimental.refresh-app-awareness set to true?
<ogra> let me check
<ogra> nope, only hotplug in the output ...
<ogra> should i set it for next update ?
<oSoMoN> ogra, IÂ highly recommend it
<oSoMoN> I've had it on for a few months and it works nicely
<ogra> ok ...
 * ogra will watch the logs after next update ...
<Wimpress> GunnarHj: Let me take a look.
<GunnarHj> Wimpress: Sure. I'm here if you need any clarifications.
<Wimpress> Looks sensible to me, sadly lightdm is not in my package set :-(
<GunnarHj> Wimpress: What?? it's in the ubuntu-mate packageset, and I took for granted that you were one of the uploaders.
<GunnarHj> Wimpress: https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/packagesets/focal/ubuntu-mate
<Wimpress> lightdm is in the ubuntu-mate packageset? #TIL
<Wimpress> OK, leave that with me. I'll take a look later.
<GunnarHj> Great. :)
<oSoMoN> Laney, fyi, I'm working on the gnome-initial-setup update
<oSoMoN> SÃ©b already updated it in debian, so I'm doing the ubuntu part only
<Laney> sweet
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers
<marcustomlinson> hey hellsworth
<oSoMoN> good morning hellsworth
<hellsworth> hi yall!
<didrocks> hey hellsworth
<hellsworth> hi there didrocks :)
<kenvandine> good morning hellsworth
<Wimpress> Hello hellsworth o/
<hellsworth> good morning indeed
<hellsworth> hi everyone. hugs all around :)
<oSoMoN> gnome-initial-setup done: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-initial-setup/3.35.90-1ubuntu1
<hellsworth> nice!
<hellsworth> i'll use this as an example when i do one :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-02-13
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<didrocks> morning duflu
<duflu> Hi didrocks
<Wimpress> Morning o/
<Laney> hi de hi de ho
<didrocks> hey Wimpress & Laney
<Wimpress> Laney: You're a DD right?
<Laney> hi didrocks Wimpress
<Laney> Yes
<Wimpress> When we're in Frnkafurt, would you mind signing my gpg keys?
<Wimpress> After 6 years of maintaining stuff in Debian I've been asked to pull my finger out and seek DM status.
<Laney> Aye, no worries
<Wimpress> Cheers.
<Laney> should be some others you can seek out there too
<Laney> get nestled into that cosy web of trust
<Wimpress> I "think" I need one DD to sign. But yes, more would be better.
<Laney> Just need something with your key fingerprint on it, i.e. the Canonical business card if you put it on there
<Wimpress> I need to order new cards, so I'll include that.
<Laney> Need to do the same for Trevinho
<Laney> I want him to be uploading GNOME stuff to Debian without me :>
<Trevinho> :*
<Trevinho> Laney: speaking of which...
<Laney> exactly
<Wimpress> Exactly what my DD sponsor has said to me.
<Trevinho> Laney: do we have a trello card for the 3.36?
<Laney> Trevinho: nope, I'm not doing much on it atm, feel free to make a board or something like we did before
<Laney> think that worked quite ok
<Trevinho> Laney: accck
<Laney> I'll try to pick up a few after I've done some more on this ubiquity work
<Trevinho> Laney: I get an error as that I can't create anymore boards for the group...
<Trevinho> ok done https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336
<Trevinho> Laney: feel free to reorganize the columns, maybe we can just use tagging for the ubuntu/debian uploads/syncs
<tjaalton> jibel: would you mind verifying bug 1792932 for bionic
<ubot5> bug 1792932 in xorg-server (Ubuntu Xenial) "Desktop fails to boot in vbox: Xorg assert failure: Xorg: ../../../../dix/privates.c:384: dixRegisterPrivateKey: Assertion `!global_keys[type].created' failed." [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1792932
<Laney> Trevinho: cheerssssssssss
<Laney> Hey there! Marco Trevisan invited you to join the GNOME 3<span>.</span>36 board on Trello
<Laney> thanks trello
<jibel> tjaalton, sure, I'll have a look.
<Trevinho> spannn
<tjaalton> jibel: thanks
<didrocks> Laney: worse for me:  Ciao! Marco Trevisan ti ha invitato a unirti a GNOME 3.36 bacheca su Trello:
<Laney> :D
<Laney> I was also complaining about the html tag in the plain text email :p
<Trevinho> didrocks: finally you got some proper greetings in your inbox, be happy! ð
<didrocks> Trevinho: "proper" "proper" "proper", let me pownder that :p
<duflu> tjaalton, I was tracking bug 1811023 for that. But also need to go make dinner. Would you mind merging them?
<ubot5> bug 1811023 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "Xorg aborts with ../../../../dix/privates.c:384: dixRegisterPrivateKey: Assertion `!global_keys[type].created' failed." [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1811023
<tjaalton> duflu: ok
<duflu> Ta
<duflu> So good morning and good night
<tjaalton> duflu: although, it says it was last seen with 1.20.3 while the original bugfix was included in 1.20.2
<tjaalton> meaning it's not the same
<marcustomlinson> morning desktoppers
<oSoMoN> good morning marcustomlinson
<Laney> oSoMoN: if you wanted another update to work on, mozjs68 might be up your street (dependency of gjs)? https://mail.gnome.org/archives/distributor-list/2020-February/msg00000.html
<oSoMoN> Laney, I've never looked at gjs, can do but definitely not this week, and probably not next week either
<Laney> right, never mind then
<oSoMoN> Laney, I've started on gedit (and its tepl dependency) though, I'll finish that before IÂ switch back to feature work for the rest of the week
<Laney> it's going to be too late, feature freeze
<Laney> that is *mozjs* not gjs though, which comes from Firefox which is why I pinged you
<oSoMoN> yeah, IÂ got that. I'm not particularly familiar with the subtleties of mozjs, but given time IÂ don't mind looking at it. But again, feature work and I'm lateâ¦ :/
<Laney> ok
<Laney> forget about it
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers
<marcustomlinson> hey hellsworth
<hellsworth> hey marcustomlinson !! are you getting excited :D
<hellsworth> i'm excited for you :)
<marcustomlinson> hellsworth: :) yes very excited. and scared :P
<hellsworth> sounds about right :)
<hellsworth> i wish i could give your family a big hug
<marcustomlinson> thanks :)
<oSoMoN> good morning hellsworth
<hellsworth> ho oSoMoN !
<GunnarHj> Hi robert_ancell, I merged that old !507 g-c-c MR with upstream, and thus triggered a CI run. Still complaining about the gnome-desktop version. But I got the impression that the CI problem has been fixed. What's the status? Anything I can do to help getting it in?
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-02-14
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<oSoMoN> happy Friday!
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN and didrocks
<duflu> Happy Friday
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, hey duflu
<marcustomlinson> happy friday oSoMoN didrocks and duflu!
<oSoMoN> hey marcustomlinson
<didrocks> hey duflu, oSoMoN, marcustomlinson
<Wimpress> Morning o/
<duflu> Morning Wimpress
<didrocks> hey Wimpress
<marcustomlinson> morning Wimpress
<duflu> Hi marcustomlinson
<jibel> tjaalton, I cannot verify bug 1792932 in bionic. .4 already comes with xorg 1.20 and is not affected by this bug
<ubot5> bug 1792932 in xorg-server (Ubuntu Xenial) "Desktop fails to boot in vbox: Xorg assert failure: Xorg: ../../../../dix/privates.c:384: dixRegisterPrivateKey: Assertion `!global_keys[type].created' failed." [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1792932
<jibel> and I cannot install the packages from proposed
<jibel> it removes the entire hwe stack
<jibel> and if I try to force the version in proposed I get a conflict with xserver-xorg-video-modesetting
<tjaalton> modesetting? it's a virtual pkg
<tjaalton> hasn't been a real pkg in years
<tjaalton> should be able to downgrade to the GA stack by apt install xserver-xorg
<tjaalton> then enable proposed and install the update
<tjaalton> but assuming you install from scratch, using the .0/1 image is still possible
<jibel> tjaalton, right, I proceeded with the replacement of xorg-.*hwe* packages and it's all working fine with proposed
<tjaalton> cool
<tjaalton> and thanks!
<jibel> tjaalton, I tried with .0 too on which I could observe the bug and it's fixed with proposed
<Laney> moin
<duflu> Morning Laney, and jibel and tjaalton
<jibel> afternoon duflu
<tjaalton> heya
<tjaalton> I'm planning to upload mesa 20.0.0-rc3 today, final should arrive next week
<tjaalton> scratch that, next week is just as fine
<Saviq> xnox: hey, got a secure boot question for you: I've installed 20.04 fresh on my laptop and I _think_ I failed to enroll the MOK (I got scared of the menu when it rebooted - I wasn't sure what to do, maybe I didn't read the dialog properly when installing)
<Saviq> since then it seems I'm stuck with two "ubuntu" boot entries, one of which is SecureBoot-enabled, the other is notâ¦
<Saviq> efibootmgr says https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/Mrc88j9PGG/
<Saviq> `update-secureboot-policy --enroll-key` says just "Adding '/var/lib/shim-signed/mok/MOK.der' to shim:" and nothing's there after reboot
<Saviq> xnox: whatever I do via `efibootmgr` (delete, reorder), I'm then back with the two entries and the order is "broken; working" - I can reorder in System Setup and that seems to work, at least for now
<xnox> Saviq:  i wonder what their values are.
<xnox> Saviq:  also i wonder if you can delete bogus entries in System Setup
<Saviq> xnox: how do I get their values?
<xnox> Saviq:  also do you need Mok? most popular drivers are now signed by us and need not a MOK enrolled key
<Saviq> VBoxâ¦
<xnox> signed by us
<xnox> in linux-ristricted-modules
<Saviq> So o should install something else than -dkms?
<xnox> maybe our depenendencies are wrong?!
<xnox> re: variables
<xnox> i use $ bootctl
<Saviq> xnox: it's grub and shim
<xnox> i mean bootctl can print status of uefi variables irrespective of which bootloader is in use
<xnox> hm
<xnox> maybe we only do guest modules and not host
<xnox> $ apt show linux-image-5.4.0-14-generic  | grep virtualbox
<xnox> Provides: aufs-dkms, fuse-module, ivtv-modules, kvm-api-4, linux-image, redhat-cluster-modules, spl-dkms, spl-modules, virtualbox-guest-dkms, virtualbox-guest-modules, zfs-dkms, zfs-modules
<Saviq> xnox: ok can confirm removing the grubx64 one and rebooting just makes it come back again, and default
<Saviq> xnox: but even though it tells me I'll need to enroll the MOK, nothing happens on reboot
<xnox> Saviq:  can you add an entry for mokmanager and boot that? and see if you can complete the mok enrollment?
<xnox> also maybe juliank might be better to help with this, but he is not in this channel
<Laney> o ubiquity
<kenvandine> Laney: did you see the email to desktop-devel-list about the proposed release schedule changes?
<kenvandine> https://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2020-February/msg00042.html
<Laney> kenvandine: yeah, I made a note to reply but don't think it'll be today
<Laney> thanks for pointing it out!
<Laney> and morning
<kenvandine> Laney: thanks!
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers!
<oSoMoN> good morning hellsworth
<hellsworth> hola!
<marcustomlinson> \o
<hellsworth> o/
<oSoMoN> having fixed an 8-year old bug (bug #887079), I'm calling it a week. Have a good week-end everyone!
<ubot5> bug 887079 in software-properties (Ubuntu) "Software Sources shows codenames not version numbers" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/887079
<hellsworth> oh man nice oSoMon!!
