#ubuntu-us-ca 2011-05-23
<DarkwingDuck> sssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss
<akk> It's the famous California hissing duck! Call the Audubon Society!
<DarkwingDuck> aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
<DarkwingDuck> asxxxxxxccvvvbbmm,.'
<DarkwingDuck> kubuntuguide.infodghkkkl;'
<philipballew> ^ NICE!
<DarkwingDuck> Dang it.
<DarkwingDuck> Sorry, I should collect this and write a short book "When kids attack keyboards in chatrooms"
<MarkDude> lol
<akk> Or a twitter feed, @shitmykidstypeinirc
<MarkDude> rofl
<MarkDude> +1
 * MarkDude really likes how even the kid must type Kubuntu- give em a chance to - and we will get a KDE guide
<MarkDude> DarkwingDuck, will you punish your kid for using Gnome?
<DarkwingDuck> Nope
<DarkwingDuck> My wife used gnome till recently
<MarkDude> :)
<DarkwingDuck> Now if they start using opensuse... :P:P (Kidding)
<DarkwingDuck> Although, If I get this Canonical job...
<grantbow> gl with that
<MarkDude> Is there a meeting tonight?
<grantbow> yes
<MarkDude> ty
<Eureka> wiki: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/11May22 edited
<grantbow> scott-ian: just my opinion, but "What People Think About Unity" is a little bit too broad of a topic for the -us-ca meeting. We also have had problems in the past with last minute agenda edits so I ask that at least 24 hours warning is given so people can prepare for a useful, informed and fruitful discussion.
<akk> I agree -- sounds like a fine discussion but why make it part of a meeting?
<akk> Since it's not anything the team needs to (or could) act upon as a team.
<grantbow> logs can be dug up if necessary but it seems fairly logical to me that last minute agenda edits are less than fair though I recognize there was an invitation to do so via email for this meeting
<MarkDude> Yay Cali Team the wiki edit battleground
 * MarkDude kids
<grantbow> scott-ian: are you around?
<scott-ian> Where would one discuse such a topic?
<grantbow> how about right here right now outside the meting?
<grantbow> short meetings are not a crime IMHO
<grantbow> it's alwmost summer and people get busy
<scott-ian> Ok, what do you think of Unity?  I soon decieded to use the Gnome Shell.
<grantbow> or #ubuntu :-)
<grantbow> I think it's a bold departure.
<grantbow> as I haven't been able to run gnome shell yet I can't contrast them much yet
<akk> I don't use unity -- seems super limited compared to what I want to do -- but then I don't use gnome either.
<grantbow> so to use gnome shell you have to disable unity and vica versa I heard
<akk> No, just log in differently. My husband switches back and forth.
<grantbow> the problems I heard about were fixed? cool
<scott-ian> I found that the Gnome Shell is good.  The only advantage I can think of for unity is that it uses compiz, which is considered a bad thing to some.  Any Other advantages?
<akk> unity is a bit more flexible than gnome3, easier to customize and easier to do things like shut down. But they're really very similar. (So I'm told.)
<scott-ian> I found Unity and the Gnome Shell are very diferent.  Unity is not very customizable, but Gnome Shell extentions provide great customizability.
<akk> gnome2, or 3?
<Eureka> wiki: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/11May22 edited
<scott-ian> Gnome 3.  Gnome 2 is great, but it has reached its end.
<akk> okay, maybe the husband hasn't discovered these extensions you mention.
<akk> It took him weeks even to figure out how to shut the machine down from gnome3 (turns out you have to hold the alt key while you mouse over the logout menu).
<scott-ian> A Gnome Shell extention changes that. See http://blog.fpmurphy.com/ for details on that.
<grantbow> uh, Unity is gnome 2.32 and gnome-shell runs on gnome 3? http://blogs.gnome.org/rodrigo/2011/03/03/gnome3-on-ubuntu/
 * akk will stick with openbox
<grantbow> http://www.ubuntugeek.com/how-to-fix-common-gnome-3-issues-on-ubuntu-11-04-natty.html
<grantbow> says "Note:- This will remove unity"
<grantbow> I found these with a simple google for "natty gnome 3"
<grantbow> there were also several relevant UDS sessions a few weeks back that are worthwhile if you are interested in these things. I can dig up URLs after the meeting if you like
<akk> Turns out I was confused -- d has been doing his gnome3 testing on arch, says it works much better there than on natty.
<akk> He did install the natty version briefly, but couldn't get it to do much and gave up on it.
<akk> So maybe they don't coexist.
<grantbow> 5 minute warning
<scott-ian> I'm running it on Ubuntu.  It will work with Unity in 6 months though!
<jdeslip> Hello All :)
<icarus81> Hello
<jdeslip> Should be a short meeting tonight :)
<aaditya> Evenin', California.
<aaditya> How's everyone doing tonight?
<jdeslip> Pretty good
<icarus81> alright slow weekend
<jdeslip> OK, let's get started on the meeting
<jdeslip> ------------------ Meeting Start --------------------
<jdeslip> Raise your hand if you around for the meeting.
<jdeslip> Currently we have no agenda items
<aaditya> o/
<grantbow> o/
<akk> o/
<icarus81> o/
<jdeslip> OK - lets start with announcements.  Anyone have any?
<jdeslip> We (pliea2) got a shipment of Natty CDs and they being spread throughout the state.  If you haven't heard about that that, please check out the email list.
<jdeslip> You can request some for a good cause of your choice.
<jdeslip> Any other announcements from anyone?
<MarkDude> \o
<grantbow> http://uds.ubuntu.com/ was fun
<MarkDude> Maker Faire effin rocked
<jdeslip> In case anyone is new or lurking, I want to remind them of the ongoing Ubuntu-hour events around the state: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects/UbuntuHours
<jdeslip> MarkDude: Glad to hear it.
<aaditya> Maker Faire +1
 * jdeslip wanted to see the Android ADK stuff
<aaditya> That would have been nice. I wonder why Google didn't have much of it at Maker Faire.
<jdeslip> OK, so if there are no more announcements.  Does anyone want to bring anything else up?
<jdeslip> aaditya: I thought Google had a whole booth of it there?
<jdeslip> at least I saw lots of picks
<grantbow> Google I/O was interesting too from the videos I had time to watch
<MarkDude> Jono has a loud music show upcoming next month with the new drummer
<aaditya> They did, but didn't have much to show off there, as compared to what they had at Google I/O - e.g. a 20'x16' labyrinth powered by ADK.
<jdeslip> OK. If there are no other agenda items etc... let's call this to a close.  (Record?)
<MarkDude> June 17th https://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=188586747853015
<grantbow> sounds like no more pressing or relevant team business
 * MarkDude has nuthin'
<jdeslip> Summer is pretty quiet - we will have some more stuff to plan shortly.
<jdeslip> ------------------------------  Meeting Ends -----------------------
<jdeslip> Thanks for coming by all.
<aaditya> Awesome.
<akk> I was surprised (though shouldn't have been) that Maker Faire wasn't a great place to learn tech details of anything.
<MarkDude> The Google setup was rather meager jdeslip
<grantbow> Thanks jdeslip
<aaditya> akk: my thoughts exactly!
<akk> More stand around going "whoa, that's ... big" at things from a distance.
<jdeslip> MarkDude: ah, that is too bad.  I am going to get set on the ADK soon..
<akk> Whenever I tried to get close to anything and find out more about it, I gave up, too much noise and crowding.
<aaditya> Maybe I was overexpecting, however.
 * MarkDude saw much of it as - make mental not to check these people out online
<MarkDude> note
<jdeslip> Were than any Linux/Ubuntu related booths there?
<akk> yeah, to find out anything you really have to check online later
<aaditya> My hopes were high at the battleship arena.
 * MarkDude got covered in mentos/diet coke- that made it worth it
<akk> I wanted to see that, but it was a 2-hr wait 'til the next show.
<akk> I was surprised how many empty stages there were with nothing going on for hours.
<akk> (same with the mentos one)
<MarkDude> The battleship thing was dead- I think they were broken during the day
<aaditya> It ended with no explosions, and the game was a draw after random shipping nailing each other and then resurfacing.
<grantbow> mentos guys were there again? nice!
<MarkDude> You could not tell which ships were on which side
<MarkDude> like lack of flags was not helpful
<MarkDude> They needed flamethrowers
<aaditya> ...yes, and couldn't even spot the neutral target ship most of the time.
<jyo> So they had a battleship thing this year instead of battlebots?
<MarkDude> It should have had a flag
<MarkDude> they should have had a balsa wood ship at the end- that would have made it worth it
<aaditya> MarkDude: they could have painted the ships red/blue.
<MarkDude> It WAS more exciting for a bit - when a kid above us got nailed in the head with a 1/4 steel ball
<jdeslip> hopefully not in the eye
<akk> Shot by one of the ships?
<grantbow> drama near MarkDude? never
<aaditya> I also didn't understand why most of the ships were floating on the corner opposite to where the target was located.
<aaditya> jdeslip: we all had protective glasses, so eyes were safe.
<MarkDude> grantbow, lol
<eps> So, it was all fun and games, then?
 * MarkDude was hella tempted to get in the water- and be Godzilla - and attack the city
<akk> haha
<MarkDude> rawr
<aaditya> MarkDude: should have done that with the penguin suit on.
<akk> That would've rocked.
<akk> TUXZILLA!
<grantbow> like he needs encouragement
<MarkDude> No doubt- Noelle had her flip- and my Tux WAS actually in the jeep
<akk> I was impressed how many people were in renfaire-type costume. Didn't expect that.
<akk> "It's like ren faire ... with flamethrowers!"
<MarkDude> lol
<aaditya> They could have installed the plasma welding gun on a ship...
<MarkDude> and quite a bit of bustier and other steampunk gear- and roughly 1/2 the people had goggles of some sort
<MarkDude> The plasma welder was cool
<akk> I wish they'd had a section kinda like the "dot org pavilion" at oscon for random little electronics/computer/arduino projects.
<aaditya> yeah, electronics was what I was hoping to see there the most.
<aaditya> TechShop was bleh.
<akk> There were some of those projects, but mostly in the kiddie hall where it was hard to find them.
<akk> and impossible to get close to anything
<MarkDude> We can get some of them for East Bay Maker Faire
<akk> I couldn't even get in to TechShop -- stood at the door for a while and couldn't get past the crowds.
 * MarkDude will let people know when it will be
<MarkDude> techshop was ok
<MarkDude> they had 3d printers
<aaditya> They've been showing off 3D printers for years now.
<MarkDude> and wooden ties
<MarkDude> :P
<akk> I expected to see a lot more 3d printer type stuff.
 * MarkDude did want more robots
<eps> Wooden ties? Like on railroad tracks?
<grantbow> akk: there are three at noisebridge.net in operation if you want to use one
<MarkDude> eps, like wearable
<MarkDude> as in suit and tie
<eps> I bet someone's making ties out of bamboo these days.
<akk> I have a bamboo towel (xmas present, and it's really nice)
<akk> It's very soft, oddly enough.
<akk> And super dense.
<eps> Technically it's a grass.
<MarkDude> bamboo towel?
<MarkDude> cool
<akk> I think it's from here: http://www.bamboomoon.net/
<akk> I was also hoping I'd find out about lots of amazing maker groups in the south bay that I could join
<akk> but even the groups who were recruiting ("come take our classes!") never said where they were, so you just have to take a flyer and google later
<akk> grantbow: d is currently installing gnome3 on his natty machine, will report soon whether unity gets removed.
<akk> but it didn't *say* it was going to remove it
<akk> grantbow: Looks like you're right -- after installing and rebooting, the login fails and dumps into a terminal (because autologin to unity failed).
<MarkDude> https://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=328804572620
<MarkDude> Pi day awesomeness in 2015
<nhaines> pleia2: thanks!  http://ubuntuone.com/p/v8S/
<pleia2> nhaines: yay! :)
<nhaines> Count looks good too.
<MarkDude> Is Apple a religion? Maybe >>>http://www.sun-sentinel.com/features/religion/faith-and-values/sfl-fv-blog-apple,0,5968854.story
<MarkDude> Mri scans of Mac folks- this makes me think I need to continue with my Linux *is* a cult talks
 * DarkwingDuck waves
#ubuntu-us-ca 2011-05-24
<kdub> hello
<DarkwingDuck> Hows life?
<kdub> pretty good, yourself?
<DarkwingDuck> Can't complain.
<DarkwingDuck> Things are leveling out nicly.
<kdub> yeah, thats a good word to describe my situation i'd think
<kdub> probably past due for another SD ubuntu-hour
<DarkwingDuck> Yeah.
<DarkwingDuck> I have Natty CDs too.
<DarkwingDuck> We need to put one together.
<DarkwingDuck> You guys did it downtown last time right?
<kdub> la jolla, specifically that shopping center by utc
 * kdub feels the need for community leadership guidance on ubuntu hours... pleia2 jono  :D
<kdub> we've only been getting a paltry amount of new peeps each time
<nhaines> That's as big as they get.
<kdub> in ubuntu-mi, we'd get a fair amount more, can't put my finger on why
<kdub> i think the 'hook' for coming needs to be stronger
<kdub> like 'come on down and chat about ubuntu' isn't particularly strong. thats what we're doing here, without having to go down to starbucks :P
<akk> What was the hook in mi?
<kdub> beer :)
<kdub> that and, it tended to be a broader topics we'd get into. like tech-holy-war discussions, side projects, startups
<akk> That's true of the UHs here too.
<akk> "Come hang out with ubuntu people in person and talk about whatever, which will likely include ubuntu."
<akk> Much like IRC!
<kdub> i just feel like there's a moderately small tweak to the structure that could be made, that would attract a lot more people
<kdub> i just don't know what that is yet :P
<crashsystems> hello world
<pleia2> kdub: not much leadership guidance needed for ubuntu hours, they aren't meant to be huge affairs really, just being available and approachable
<kdub> yeah, still would be nice to draw a bigger crowd in though :P
<nhaines> Rather than trying to make an Ubuntu Hour what it wasn't designed to be, perhaps you could organize a different kind of event that would attract more people?
<kdub> yeah, thats what i'm thinking
<nhaines> kdub: oh.  I was confused because what you said was that you wanted community leadership guidance in order to make Ubuntu Hours bigger.
<MarkDude> kdub, We have had a really good turnout when we showed Creative Commons movies
<kdub> hmm, thats not a bad idea.  need a different venue for that i think
<MarkDude> Good Copy Bad Copy is a movie that explains a bit of background for some
<MarkDude> And makes it easier to understand FOSS in general
<MarkDude> We have a coffee shop that has TVs on the wall- they allow us to plug in computers for showing movies- and also playing a few games
<MarkDude> promoting Stellarium also works
<MarkDude> Good luck with it
<pleia2> kdub: hackerspaces tend to be good venues
<kdub> i like that idea
<kdub> we don't have any hackerspaces as far as i know, but we do have coffeeshops
<pleia2> and back in philly we had team members who would offer up space where they worked for installfests, but we were fortunate to have a lot of people working at places with big conference rooms that they let a bunch of strange people in to after hours :)
<pleia2> kdub: san diego?
<akk> Don't most people in hackerspaces already know about linux and ubuntu?
<pleia2> akk: it's just a venue that tends to be free
<nhaines> akk: presumably he's either looking for venue options, or looking for people who already know about Linux and Ubuntu.
<kdub> pleia2: yep
<pleia2> the hackerspace people can come too if they want :) but most of the people who came to our noisebridge installfest had never been there before
<pleia2> kdub: http://hackerspaces.org/wiki/San_Diego
<kdub> nucleon is new, when i moved here there weren't any
<pleia2> yeah, they are popping up like crazy
<kdub> maybe i'll head down and check them out today
<pleia2> \o/
<kdub> that at least sounds like a plan, looks like a place worth checking out at any rate
<kdub> its always been tricky finding a useful thing to do for the community
<kdub> crud, that space all the way out in santee :P
<MarkDude> kdub, Im telling ya- the coffee shop is a good ally- we can even get mail there- they just gave us the ok to have booze there after hours
<MarkDude> A backup might be finding someone with a 27"+ monitor or maybe a projector
<MarkDude> Also- having a laptop or 2 with a few kids games is something to let folks know ahead of time- more people come if they know their kids are considered
<kdub> sounds like you'd have to have a pretty solid connection with the coffeehouse owner
<MarkDude> kdub, it developed over time
<MarkDude> Owners are REALLY open to welcoming groups
<kdub> yeah, we've been bouncing around between starbucks, maybe picking one smaller place would be something to work towards
<MarkDude> Coffee shops have sloooow times-
<MarkDude> Even Starbucks nearby said we could use their place
<MarkDude> the trick is using the times they have free
<MarkDude> https://www.facebook.com/?ref=logo#!/event.php?eid=193922473965531 VJ Um Amel will be doing a show in SoCal
<MarkDude> She combines data and computer KungFu to make some cool visuals. I saw her at TEDxHayward
<MarkDude> Her visualization of what the world said using social media on the day Mubarak left is great
<nhaines> Ooh, Fedora 15 just released.
<MarkDude> akk, I tagged your plants on FB I have a hummingbird plant for you- it is just starting to bloom. The little start is chocolate mint- you still want them?
<MarkDude> It's name is Verne- unfortunately people did NOT vote for the other proposed name *Beefy Miracle*- it could have been epic
<MarkDude> http://blogs.fedoraproject.org/wp/fifthpillar/2011/04/13/verne-rly/ my post regarding the name shame.
<akk> MarkDude: Cool! will look when I get home, don't have FB set up on this work machine.
<MarkDude> Anyone else want any plant starts- let me know. I have some rosemary, oregano, and thyme drying - I am making Italian spices- I can give some.
<akk> MarkDude: Don't bother holding the choc mint for me ... I don't seem to do well with it.
<MarkDude> Since it weighs so little- I am even willing to send to you folks in SoCal
<MarkDude> akk, I found the trick is making sure it has moisture crystals
 * MarkDude too had it die year after year
<MarkDude> The crystals help regulate the water
<akk> Interesting, I'll try some!
<akk> How often do you water, in summer when it's hot?
 * akk prefers not to water more often than twice a week, but maybe that's unrealistic
<MarkDude> daily
<Eureka> wiki: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/ApprovalApplication2011 edited
<philipballew> Eureka anything we can do to help with this?
<Eureka> philipballew: Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<philipballew> oh.. thats right
<pleia2> philipballew: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-us-ca/2011-May/001691.html
<philipballew> awesome!
<pleia2> has all the details about reapproval :)
#ubuntu-us-ca 2011-05-25
<MarkDude> http://www.bitpusher.com/careers.php is hiring in San Francisco and Seattle
<MarkDude> aaditya, Nixie was asking about meeting up- I suggested your place
<MarkDude> BBQ and hot tub
<MarkDude> She may be moving to the City
<pleia2> san jose?
<MarkDude> We need to pick a day in June-
<MarkDude> lol
<MarkDude> pleia2, the City is always SF
<pleia2> oh :)
<MarkDude> Its ok
<MarkDude> its all part of the local ego here- like bay area
<pleia2> anywhere else it would be "the city, philly" "oh you philly twits, thinking you are the center of the tri state area!"
<MarkDude> Yep
<akk> No, here "the city" is SF even if you're in SJ.
<akk> just the local lingo for some reason
<pleia2> (fwiw, philly is the center of the jersey, delaware, pennsylvania tri state area ;))
<MarkDude> along with over the hill meaning drive thru tunnel to Contra Costa
<MarkDude> Well the city she lives in now is near Excremento
<pleia2> same tunnel as for walnut creek?
<sn9> "the city" is sf even in fresno
<MarkDude> so either SF or SJ would be upgrade
<MarkDude> pleia2, yep same tunnel
<sn9> i hear ya
<pleia2> poor sacramento :)
<MarkDude> Caldecott
<pleia2> MarkDude: does that mean I can say you're over the hill?
<pleia2> no better, jono is over the hill
<sn9> i live there, pleia2
<MarkDude> yes- in numerous ways
<pleia2> :)
<sn9> i'm in sf atm, though
<MarkDude> lol
<MarkDude> Sac-town is not my favorite place
<pleia2> I've never been
<MarkDude> on the upside- it is neither Bakersfield nor Turloc
<MarkDude> No need to go there
<pleia2> we drove through bakersfield on our way to vegas once
<pleia2> they have oil there
<pleia2> and dust
<sn9> what do you have against turlock?
<MarkDude> well the two rivers are actually way cool to float down
<MarkDude> sn9, all sorts of things
<MarkDude> sry turdlock
<MarkDude> :D
<pleia2> oh dear :)
 * MarkDude apologizes
 * sn9 drove through bakersfield on the way from vegas yesterday
<pleia2> see, now would be the time to bust on walnut creek, but it's an easy target and you'd enjoy it
<MarkDude> One issue about Cali- is that we have such cool stuff- it makes it hard to be noteworthy
<MarkDude> Walnut Creek has a big-ass bullseye on it
<sn9> and then through wasco
<pleia2> sn9: heh, we decided driving to vegas is crazy :)
<pleia2> 12 hours, aaagh
<pleia2> and I quite like airplanes
<sn9> why 12?
<MarkDude> See like Hayward- it would be a real great city were it in another state/place- but since it is near such cool places- its not that impressive
<pleia2> well, you have to stop for food and breaks
<pleia2> so ~10 hours, plus stops
<sn9> the person i live with is stuck in DFW atm and hates airports as much as i do
<sn9> connecting flight was canceled
<pleia2> ouch
<pleia2> I was stuck in frankfurt for 5 hours a couple weeks ago, but they were good about rebooking
<pleia2> I took the opportunity to have a frankfurter sausage :d
<sn9> she's been waiting in .
<sn9> she's been waiting in line to rebook for hours
<pleia2> that's awful
<sn9> she was going to bring food with her out of SFO but forgot
<sn9> she has $4 on her, total
<akk> yuck
<akk> The state of air travel is really horrifying sometimes
<akk> that you can get stuck like that
<sn9> thunderstorms
<pleia2> decent airlines will give you food vouchers when you rebook
<pleia2> all of them probably will if you get cranky at them :)
<sn9> well, she'd have to rebook to get them, then
<pleia2> yeah
<sn9> that means waiting in line
<sn9> there were no empty seats on the canceled flight, so they ALL have to rebook
 * pleia2 nods
<pleia2> I probably waited in line for 45 minutes to rebook in frankfurt, my delayed flight out of LAX caused a lot of us to miss connections
<sn9> i happen to be on hold with AA atm in case i can rebook for her before that
<pleia2> nice
<sn9> 40 min so far
<sn9> she can't get online because everybody stranded is clogging the airport connection
<aaditya> MarkDude: sounds good
<MarkDude> Hopefully I can schedule this work soon- Then we can get in a geeknic also
<sn9> [Tue 2011-05-24 09:47:43 PM PDT] <pleia2> decent airlines will give you food vouchers when you rebook
<sn9> [Tue 2011-05-24 09:48:03 PM PDT] <pleia2> all of them probably will if you get cranky at them :)
<sn9> AA flatly refuses, no matter what
<mischief> hello, does anyone here have information on Ubuntu Hour occuring in Sacramento, CA today?
<crashsystems> oh OSX, why u so buggy?
<pleia2> mischief: I haven't heard anything about one today, where did you read about it?
<akk> Nothing listed on the upcoming events page. When is that Roseville one, or has a date been set yet?
<pleia2> no date set yet
<akk> I hope the organizer doesn't get scared off by all the criticism on the ML.
<kdub> coming to a consensus on a time and place over a mailing list is like herding cats
<akk> It's been a weird discussion, because I didn't think a consensus was needed for an UH.
<akk> Isn't it supposed to be: someone picks a time and place, and hopes other people show up?
<pleia2> yeah, the guy who started it just picked a place across from where he works, I picked one in the building I live in, but it doesn't hurt to ask the opinion of others
<pleia2> ultimately it's up to the organizer and the time and place that works for them
<akk> Sure, but jumping on the guy because you don't find the time convenient ...
<mischief> pleia2, the mailing lists
<mischief> ubuntu-us-ca specifically
<pleia2> mischief: as far as I know they didn't announce a date yet
<pleia2> they're just discussing venue so far
<nhaines> akk: the conversation about lunchtime events didn't involve the organizer.
<nhaines> philipballew: regarding your UH, pick the dates and time that are convenient to you that you think will be most successful.
<nhaines> Just be regular and consistent and if it's a good time, then attendance will grow.
<nhaines> But the people who are recommending that you ignore any advice and start hosting without any planning are trying to set you up for failure. I can't imagine why.
<nhaines> akk: regarding the UH Roseville thread, the conversation about lunchtime events didn't involve the organizer.
<akk> ah, I wondered ... got confused about who had proposed it
<philipballew> nhaines ok, i think im gonna let that email sit all weekend and see if more people sign up before i advertise. how long in advance is a good time you think to set the date?
<nhaines> akk: someone else who said "lunch is convenient for me".  I just said "that's probably not a good idea."
<jdeslip> nhaines: I don't think anyone is recommending philipballew ignore your or anyone else's advice (one piece of advice was to have it a lunch). But, let's be honest hear, hosting a "failed" UH event isn't the end of world. If some group of people want to try a lunch meeting sometime, then who cares? Give it a go - have fun and don't worry about things like "success" or "failure"
<philipballew> i plan to travel to such bissness as intel and oriacle that are in this town to put flyers in their linux departments
<nhaines> philipballew: I'd say two weeks is good... they're informal get-togethers.  But less than one week isn't great.  :)
<akk> The paragraph at the end of the BAD shotgun rules applies. http://bad.debian.net/shotgun_rules.txt
 * akk loves the BAD shotgun rules :)
<philipballew> jdeslip true, but if i am going to put effort into it should't i try to have the effort  to produce results.
<akk> They have a very refreshing attitude toward scheduling things
<philipballew> nhaines a week to two sounds good. as long as its not to far out and they forget
<nhaines> philipballew: yeah, that's the other problem...  that's why regular, consistant meetings are important.  It'll probably be dead the first couple of times too... it picks up steam usually.
<nhaines> jdeslip: I'd say Mr. Andrzejak is pretty blatently recommending that philipballew ignore everyone's advice.
<MarkDude> http://whitewhine.com/  might as well be called random thoughts from Walnut Creek <<< pleia2
<MarkDude> :D
<philipballew>  Mr. Andrzejak knows what he is doing, though its different then you. he just has a different mindset about it
<akk> The arguments against lunchtime events are all valid. But there are arguments against evening ones too.
<philipballew> i like the ones i have gone to in sd on saturday mornings
<akk> Most Toastmasters clubs meet at lunchtime.
<nhaines> akk: my arguments were "just be aware of these issues as you're planning."
<akk> That's a good thing to say, but it came across (to me) a bit stronger than that.
<philipballew> nhaines its true, i'm thinking i should just see the times the people on the list can make it possibly.
<akk> Maybe I was just being oversensitive (but it seemed like some of the thread participants felt the same way).
<philipballew> then they'd invite people
<nhaines> akk: hopefully not the first two times I had to say it.
<jdeslip> philipballew - I guess I am just saying that you can define "success" and "failure" in a number of ways. One way is just answering whether you and others are having fun at the meeting. For some "events" this might be good enough (these type of casual events have a way of turning into something more later). Certainly recruiting as many new Ubuntu users as possible is a valid goal, too, for an UH - and nhaines advice is valuable here methinks.
<akk> IMHO, for an UH if there's anyone there having fun, that's good enough.
<nhaines> But "Do you have experience?  I don't have any experience so who's to say who ir right?" and then countering my "yes, actually, years of experience" countered with "Your experience invalidates your opinion" is offensive in my opinion.
<philipballew> success is a very ambiguous word
<MarkDude> UH should by definition be FUN
<nhaines> philipballew: I get anywhere from 0 - 5 visitors on each Ubuntu Hour, on average about 2 visitors.
<MarkDude> Definition of fun varies :D
<nhaines> philipballew: the good news is that although there are regulars, I do regularly get new people.  :D
<philipballew> thats what i get when i do ubuntu hours in san diego with kevin. nhaines
<philipballew> wheres the best way to get new people you think?
<philipballew> you as in anybody
<nhaines> That's a difficult problem, and I think the answer would be advertising.
<akk> MarkDude: Fun is one of those "I can't define it, but I know it when I see it" things. :)
<pleia2> and making sure the ubuntu stuff you bring is very obviously presented on the table, people who are just lurking in the coffee shop and notice you are an important audience for hours
<pleia2> might also ask the venue if you can put up a flier or some business cards somewhere
<nhaines> True!  Once or twice I've had someone come up and apologize for interrupting, and say they were curious if we were selling something or what.
<akk> Yes, some of our early Mountain View hours had people who were there for the event but didn't figure out which table it was.
<akk> Making it obvious somehow is important.
 * pleia2 tends to wear an ubuntu shirt with the biggest ubuntu logo she can find ;)
<DarkwingDuck> kdub: ping
<DarkwingDuck> XD
<kdub> pong
<pleia2> and I bring cds (burned ones with our nifty sleeves if the pressed ones are no longer available) or stickers, or magazines
<sn9> mischief: well, did anyone say anything?
<akk> It's easier in summer when you can use t-shirts. In winter it's harder unless you have a big heavy ubuntu coat.
<DarkwingDuck> akk: It's nice down here in winter. :P:P
<pleia2> I wear t-shirts all year around here
 * akk keeps meaning to bring penguins, but always forgets
<philipballew> DarkwingDuck S.D ftw!
<DarkwingDuck> philipballew: ++
<MarkDude> akk sounds like that Supreme Court opinion on porn- Know it when I see it
<sn9> philipballew: is the ubuntu hour on?
<pleia2> DarkwingDuck: cds arrive ok?
<DarkwingDuck> pleia2: Aye, thank yee
<pleia2> good :)
<akk> MarkDude: Yep, same thing, but different. :)
 * akk is off to the meego conference
<MarkDude> lol
<kdub> hello DarkwingDuck
<DarkwingDuck> pleia2: I think I want to build a wiki page with who has CDs and how many so we can have a recept of when/where the CDs were handed out.
<philipballew> sn9 it is gonna happen next week i think. need to see if anyone else replies to the email and what they want as a time and place.
<sn9> ok, so not today?
<DarkwingDuck> kdub: Since we are on the subject of UH, when do you want to do another San Diego UH?
<sn9> i'm in Sac again atm
<philipballew> sn9 not today. but next week sometime. waiting to see if people want tunch. dinner or what. if both cant decide i might do a sat morning
<sn9> i have no clue what next week may be like for me, depending on this weekend
<nhaines> philipballew: two points.  1) nobody RSVPs, ever, and if they do they're lying.  2) I'm not driving to Roseville and especially not at lunch so don't count on me.  ;)
<sn9> i may be looking for a new place to live
<philipballew> sn9 leaving sac?
<nhaines> sn9: I'll cross my fingers for you!
<sn9> i have to stay in sac for the moment
<sn9> just not in this apartment
<sn9> though, that may still change
<philipballew> sn9? i see. sac has its nice areas
<sn9> i need _cheap_
<philipballew> sn9 is it cheeper in sac or outside?
<DarkwingDuck> kdub_: Since we are on the subject of UH, when do you want to do another San Diego UH?
<sn9> i need to check
<sn9> i am in natomas atm
<kdub_> i'll set one up for 3 weeks i think
<philipballew> sn9 auburn myself
<kdub_> DarkwingDuck: we've been inconsistent about the location, maybe its time to pick&stick to one
<philipballew> kdub_ do you feel a new location to stick to, or a previous one that we can just start using?
<kdub_> eh, dunno
<DarkwingDuck> kdub_: Aye, Downtown or you want to keep it north?
<kdub_> MarkDude was talking about how he got a pretty good relationship going with a coffeehouse owner
<kdub_> might be a good goal to work for
 * DarkwingDuck nods
<MarkDude> Yep
<kdub_> that, or there's a hackerspace that might be friendly, but thats out in santee
<MarkDude> Find their slooow time
<DarkwingDuck> ewwwwww, Santee?
<pleia2> hackerspace is better for larger events
<kdub_> DarkwingDuck: my sentiments too
<MarkDude> the santee place might work for 3-4 times a year *bonus* meetings
<nhaines> The real magic is going to be consistancy.
<philipballew> kdub_  pannera worked in a lot of ways because of its location being central in all sd
<philipballew> nhaines then people dont always have to keep up on the changing dates
<kdub_> sorta, people have a real thing against going downtown after work sometimes
<DarkwingDuck> We could find someting at horton plaza... Parking is validated.
<kdub_> that, and there are a few decent small-time coffee shops in OB and PB that might be open to a more cordial relationship
<DarkwingDuck> I'm in IB. :P
<philipballew> OB has some really nice ones i have been to that would not mind us
 * MarkDude grew up in PB- that place rocks
<nhaines> philipballew: the dates, yes, but even more important is trying to keep up on the venue.
<MarkDude> or at least it did - while I was there
<pleia2> yeah, we've had to move the SF hour a week later a couple of times, but the venue and the day of the week stayed the same so it didn't really hurt attendance so far
<pleia2> plus it's super close to downtown public transit
<DarkwingDuck> kdub_: I'm not worried aobut locations... I just wnat something that is central and is easy to access. Downtown is simple because of access, parking and MTS
<philipballew> free parking with mall validation!!! DarkwingDuck
<DarkwingDuck> philipballew: Oh I know.
<DarkwingDuck> and MTS hub is like 3 blocks away
<philipballew> DarkwingDuck seemes logical. would there be a way to have a coffee house there accept us i wonder\
<DarkwingDuck> I'll head over there in the next couple days and talk to a few people.
<philipballew> DarkwingDuck, that sounds like it could work. kdub_ probably will look in ob and pb is his neck of the woods as well
 * DarkwingDuck nods
<kdub_> DarkwingDuck: there's a 'its a grind' kitty corner to nordstroms, and there's a starbucks in the mall
<DarkwingDuck> kdub_: Aye, I was thinking of setting up a booth outside the mac store. :P:P
<philipballew> i have been to that its a grind kdub_  it seemes nice and near the parking grauge. there is a microsoft store now at fashion
<kdub_> i don't want steve jobs to come and overturn our table
<philipballew> kdub_, think of the cool pictures that would make!
<iheartubuntu> do it :) i once handed out Ubuntu CDs in from of the mac store in Pasadena. Nothing out of the norm there. other people look for volunteers for free movie screening, etc
<DarkwingDuck> LOL
<philipballew> iheartubuntu, do they care?
<MarkDude> iheartubuntu, for Free Software day - Courtney pushed my wheelchair around- and we handed out Linux CDs as well as cross-platform stuff
<MarkDude> Folks did nOT know what to think
<iheartubuntu> who? people i gave the discs to? all of them had not heard of ubuntu. i recall them all being 15-25 or so
<iheartubuntu> i would think hardcore mac users probably know about ubuntu
<iheartubuntu> markdude, you are in a wheelchair??
<pleia2> only after falling off things
<MarkDude> I was
<pleia2> :)
<MarkDude> pleia2, Gravity is a MoFo
<philipballew> iheartubuntu, the guy at the mac store told me that if i have a mac buying micfosoft word is pointless because i should just download openoffice
<pleia2> MarkDude: also, bones get brittle at your age
<MarkDude> Perfect safety record was ruined by my Grandma's garden trellis
<MarkDude> Like I had the crap beat out of me by flowers :P
<pleia2> heheh
<iheartubuntu> nhaines - you have awesome and valid points about scheduling meetings, i just think people should not be afraid to experiment
<iheartubuntu> markdude must be old :)
<MarkDude> iheartubuntu, it was a very cool learning experience actually. It gave me a greater understanding of people with mobility issues- since then I try to make sure meeting spots are accessible
 * MarkDude just turned 40
<MarkDude> luckily I look much younger
 * iheartubuntu now i feel old
<MarkDude> its ok- jdeslip acts about 50-60
<iheartubuntu> ohh pleia2 did i read you went geocahcing!?
 * MarkDude kids 
<iheartubuntu> geocaching
<pleia2> iheartubuntu: sorry, I was continuing a joke from yesterday where MarkDude said that local terms call that beyond a certain tunnel here in the area was known as going "over the hill" and MarkDude lives on the other side of that tunnel
<pleia2> so he's over the hill, old jokes ensue :)
<pleia2> and yep! went geocaching for the first time, in budapest
<iheartubuntu> awesome. ive done it a bit... putting ubuntu CDs at some already created geocaches in socal :)
<iheartubuntu> most of the geocaches around me though are very very small
<pleia2> MarkDude: fun fact from our last partimus board meeting me, grantbow and christian turn 30, 40 and 50 respectively this year
<iheartubuntu> i'll put an official disc in a plastic bag nearby
<iheartubuntu> is there a geo app for android
<crashsystems> I've always thought that someone should find a way to combine geocaching, QR codes and cryptography.
<pleia2> iheartubuntu: yeah, I hear actual gpses are much better than ones on phones for geocaching
<iheartubuntu> i actually bought a handheld GPS and wasnt thrilled with it... i couldnt afford a color display... ended up getting a phone instead
<MarkDude> G and I have similar backgrounds- that still gives me pause ;)
<pleia2> I'll have to ask itnet7 what his was, it was neat
<iheartubuntu> ive even geocached by printing google maps out :)
<iheartubuntu> and u know the official site probably http://www.geocaching.com/
<pleia2> oh yeah, I should make an account
<iheartubuntu> there is an old missile silo near where i work... several geocaches around it :)
<iheartubuntu> from the cold war days
<pleia2> there
<DarkwingDuck> Really?
<iheartubuntu> what
<iheartubuntu> silo?
<DarkwingDuck> Can anyone else boot a LTS image?
<nhaines> Yes?
<DarkwingDuck> I've tried 3
<DarkwingDuck> None will boot.
<iheartubuntu> u just downloaded it?
<DarkwingDuck> Yup
<nhaines> Can you be more specific?
<DarkwingDuck> server 32 and 64 and ubuntu 32
<DarkwingDuck> vesamenu.c32 not a COM32R image
<iheartubuntu> hmm. so my LTS discs work from months ago. i'll DL one now and check it in 30 min
<nhaines> Does md5sum match?
<DarkwingDuck> Yup
<nhaines> Are you burning them to CDs or using a virtual machine?
<DarkwingDuck> It might be my vid card... this is an bad old desktop
<nhaines> What happens when you burn at 8x?
 * iheartubuntu recognizing discs on any Natty system doesnt work for me
<DarkwingDuck> it's on USB
<nhaines> What happens when you try another stick?
<DarkwingDuck> 3 sticks
<nhaines> Also are you using Startup Disc Creator for 10.04 or for 10.10 or higher?
<iheartubuntu> what about disc
<nhaines> Because 10.10+ won't properly create a USB stick for a 10.04 image.
<DarkwingDuck> ahhhhh
<DarkwingDuck> Thanks nhaines
<crashsystems> anyone else have issues with multiple monitors in unity?
<DarkwingDuck> Thats the issue then.
<nhaines> isolinux changed or something, and there's an extra keyword you have to add.  It's a quick Google search away to fix.
<nhaines> crashsystems: can you be more specific?
<DarkwingDuck> Yeah, I found it.
<nhaines> DarkwingDuck: I'm not sure why they didn't add a workaround to the disk creator but... they didn't.  :)
<crashsystems> when I'm using unity and plug in a 17" screen via vga, the resolution goes all crazy, and I can't fix it. If I log into the classic session, I can get sane resolutions.
<nhaines> crashsystems: what happens when you boot the machine with the monitor attached?
<crashsystems> crazy resolution, though I've not tried booting with it attached and subsequently logging into classic session
<nhaines> crashsystems: what video card are you using and what driver do you have loaded?
<crashsystems1> Intel card
<DarkwingDuck> nhaines: It's broken with Kubuntu USB Creator too
<nhaines> DarkwingDuck: yes, same program underneath.
<nhaines> I think.
<nhaines> crashsystems: Intel makes dozens of cards.
<DarkwingDuck> ohhh, this weekend I'll know if I made it to the Kubuntu Council
<MarkDude> DarkwingDuck, does the Kubuntu Council all wear blue robes
<MarkDude> with gears on them
<MarkDude> kinda like the council that Supermans Dad was on?
<crashsystems> I've got the newer one that is integrated with the i7
<crashsystems> the laptop is a thinkpad x201
<DarkwingDuck> MarkDude: LOL
<crashsystems> I'd give you the exact version number if the laptop was booted currently
<nhaines> crashsystems: without the exact version number there's nothing we can do.
<MarkDude> Actually DarkwingDuck its more fun to think of you dressed as Zod
<nhaines> Run 'lspci' next time the laptop's booted, and try #ayatana, they might be able to better assist you.
<DarkwingDuck> MarkDude: XD
 * MarkDude needs to GIMP that
<MarkDude> actually the 3 leads for Cali- would all make a great Superman villains pic
<MarkDude> Nothin' like satin jumpsuits
<DarkwingDuck> LOL
<DarkwingDuck> Well, when I come up there Jack Lyz and I will have to pose for it.
<DarkwingDuck> :P
<DarkwingDuck> Jack = AndroidNix Lyz = Ubuntu Girl Dave = Gears Boy
<DarkwingDuck> XD
<jdeslip> DarkwingDuck: you coming up here sometime soon?
<DarkwingDuck> jdeslip: I'm hoping to.
<jdeslip> Likes AndroidNix :)
<DarkwingDuck> Thought you might.
<DarkwingDuck> XD
<MarkDude> Let me know
<crashsystems> nhaines: btw the card is the Intel GMA HD
#ubuntu-us-ca 2011-05-26
<MarkDude> So with Unity- can you change the upper bar? Or is that not on the list?
<MarkDude> So DarkwingDuck tell me more about Kubuntu 11.04
 * MarkDude has tried Unity, would like to see what else is out there
<sn9> didn't you see him demo kde 4.6 at SCaLE?
<MarkDude> Um no.
<MarkDude> I was at Partimus booth the whole time
<MarkDude> almost
<MarkDude> I had not tried Unity til today- next up is Fedora 15- I have not heard good things about it- we will see
<nhaines> The "upper bar" is called the Unity panel.
<MarkDude> Then again - I heard horrible stuff about unity- and its not what I was expecting
<MarkDude> ty nhaines
<MarkDude> :)
<MarkDude> Better than me calling it the Start bar- lol
 * MarkDude heard the icons on the left could not be changed easily- its easy enough to add stuff to it
<MarkDude> Runs smoothly, this will most likely incredible by next release. It is waaaay farther along than I expected it to be. Everyone that worked on this should be very proud of themselves
<broder> MarkDude: i had a hard time figuring this out, but click-hold on an icon will loose it from the launcher
<broder> then you can drag it around easily
<MarkDude> The way it disembodies the top part of a window is a bit weird, but could see how the goal is to be as efficient with space as possible
<MarkDude> broder, but I cant pin it to the Unity Bar or the desktop?
<broder> unity bar == panel? you can't do that. you can put .desktop files on your desktop just like you always could, but you have to get it from somewhere other than the launcher
<MarkDude> I was hoping to have my xchat be on the upper part of my screen
<MarkDude> so to workaround this- I can use balloon notifications or sumthin' similar?
<broder> sorry, i think you've just exhausted my unity expertise
<MarkDude> No stress- broder
<MarkDude> your knowledge has helped
<MarkDude> I saw how when I did that- it held a space in the icon menu
<MarkDude> Well it appears that Unity will get at least a decent review on my blog. Not like Im late to the party or anything
<MarkDude> What IRC clients are people using to get notifications? Pidgin?
<MarkDude> Unity has found some bizarre ways to lock up
<MarkDude> How can I kill a process?
 * MarkDude is guessing that terminal is now it
 * MarkDude no likey
<kdub> i havent made the jump to unity yet
<MarkDude> Looks like it would be great on a notebook
<kdub> that was my sentiment too, when i tried it. a 26'/19' desktop though...
 * MarkDude is kinda regretting it now. Luckily it was just an extra partition
<kdub> i have like kde,gnome,unity, and xfce installed
<kdub> upgrading to unity though really did a number on my sister's gnome install
<MarkDude> I f I use the analogy of this being Vista- and the next release being Win7- in NOOO way am I implying it is bad
<MarkDude> More that this will be great when some bugs are sorted out
 * MarkDude had the bar on the left lock up- *halfway* open
<MarkDude> halfway closed
<kdub> like, its tough to drop a new desktop environment and just go
<kdub> most the other ones i can think of organically grew until someone decided its worth it to center a distro around
<broder> MarkDude: unlike win 7, at least, you won't have to wait 2.5 years for oneiric :-P
<MarkDude> lol
<MarkDude> True broder that is why I dont really like the analogy- but for my purposes- I dont see the benefit at this point
<MarkDude> So how am I allowed to look at my other partitions?
<philipballew> MarkDude, the question though, is will unity make Linux as a whole better even if some people dislike it
<broder> Disk Utility?
<broder> MarkDude: I don't feel like I'm getting any benefit out of Unity at the moment, but it also isn't really getting in my way personally, so I'll keep using it
<MarkDude> These lockups are a hassle
 * MarkDude wonders if it is Compiz and my machine
<MarkDude> Yep= disk utility works
<MarkDude> So right click appears to be being deprecated?
<MarkDude> Like its bad or sumthin'?
 * MarkDude needs to go find his one button Mac Mouse
<broder> it is? there's plenty of stuff to right click on my machine
<MarkDude> Sure
<MarkDude> there are all sorts of places I can no longer do so
<broder> i know the indicators in particular treat right/left clicks the same
<MarkDude> I mean - is there a substantive reason I cant add indicators?
<broder> but that was part of the design behind them - eliminating confusion about how to interact with the notification area, since different apps would do different things when they used GtkStatusIcon
<MarkDude> I can see VLC is not integrated so well
<broder> indicators are an application thing, not a user thing - you could modify the application in question to have an indicator :)
 * MarkDude just wants to add stuff to the Unity bar on top- I mean- what harm would that do - if I CHOOSE to do so?
 * MarkDude wants to add kill process
<MarkDude> as well as having xchat up there
 * MarkDude understands why much of this was done
 * MarkDude cant understand why much of this stuff cant be under and *advanced settings* tab
<MarkDude> So there must be a vision behind this
<nhaines> Because it runs counter to the design philosophy of Unity.
<MarkDude> personalization?
<nhaines> Random applets with no standardized interaction.
 * MarkDude got into Linux- because I could make it mine
<pleia2> MarkDude: you may be interested in the Ubuntu https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PowerUsers team, among other things they're working on Ubuntu Tweak to add such advanced preferences for users who want them
<MarkDude> ah- ok - thx pleia2
<pleia2> (they are having a meeting this very moment in #ubuntu-meeting)
<MarkDude> that makes sense- making some of this hidden but eventually accesible makes complete sense
<pleia2> yeah, there is a long battle that exists between showing users options and overwhelming them, my favorite example of this is xsane
 * MarkDude figured I was not the only one that wanted the ability to change stuff
<MarkDude> rofl- I am a power user now
<MarkDude> lol
<MarkDude> AWESOME
<nhaines> I never made any friends by showing anyone XSANE, but I made a lot showing off SimpleScan.  :)
<MarkDude> How the heck did that happen
<pleia2> nhaines: same!
<pleia2> heck, I wasn't even a friend to myself when I made myself use xsane
<nhaines> haha
<pleia2> I mean it worked, but I only ever knew what like 3 of the options meant
<nhaines> pleia2: It makes me chuckle how excited people are to create multipage PDFs.  :)
<nhaines> I knew all of the options but I didn't use them.
<pleia2> yeah, and a little sad :)
 * MarkDude assumes much of this will be sorted out by next release
<nhaines> MarkDude: if you want to make major changes to your desktop interface, don't use Unity.
<MarkDude> ty pleia2 nhaines  and broder for explaining some of this
<pleia2> MarkDude: Unity was quite the warty of UI releases, I think you'll find a lot more polish in the next release
<pleia2> or you can just come over to my house and use xubuntu
<pleia2> I never even liked Gnome :)
<MarkDude> I bet that is some of the debate happening now- what exactly is a MAJOR change
<nhaines> I don't think Unity's going to see a lot of changes as far as customability goes, and considering sabdfl's been talking about eliminating applets for two years now I don't think that's going to change.
 * MarkDude is pondering KDE- but will have to make up some crap about me being European
<MarkDude> So to customize it and use Gnome- would mean using Lucid Puppy
<DarkwingDuck> Hey guys
<MarkDude> Its all good. Unless Mark S decides to add a talking paperclip
<nhaines> Or maybe what *I* said and using gnome-panel.
<MarkDude> :D
<DarkwingDuck> KDE is a good choice
<DarkwingDuck> :P
<MarkDude> You have to that dont you DarkwingDuck
<MarkDude> or the council will remove your gears :D
<DarkwingDuck> ROFL I have to give my blueness love
<DarkwingDuck> Well, if all goes well, I'll be on the council. :P
<MarkDude> Good deal
<philipballew> DarkwingDuck, i have kde on 2 computers and have fewer problems with it then gnome. if tat supports your argument
<MarkDude> I think Fedora and Canonical had a meeting and agreed- we can sorta screw up the next release
<DarkwingDuck> philipballew: ++
<DarkwingDuck> hehehe
<MarkDude> All sorts of people are not happy with Gnome 3 and F15
<MarkDude> So the timing was good at least
<DarkwingDuck> So Gnome3 is ticking people off... Unity is ticking people off... Wonder what one makes people more upset.
<philipballew> will this blow over do you think in a few releases though...
<MarkDude> There is some dev work being done to remove Gnome sHell
<MarkDude> F15
<MarkDude> pissing waaaaaay more folks off
<MarkDude> Not even close
<DarkwingDuck> philipballew: Yes, it will blow off...
<MarkDude> It will pass of course
<DarkwingDuck> When KDE went to plasma desktop is KDE4 people revolted.
<DarkwingDuck> s/is/in
<MarkDude> DarkwingDuck, well that was like 12 people from the US
 * MarkDude kids
<DarkwingDuck> it took a while for it to sink in but, it worked out in the long run.
<DarkwingDuck> LOL MarkDude
<DarkwingDuck> 12 of the 100 who use linux in the US?
<DarkwingDuck> :P
<MarkDude> And after that KDE 3.5 crap- it could only go up
<MarkDude> 12 in total
 * MarkDude kids again
<MarkDude> Fedora is having a small rebellion
<DarkwingDuck> MarkDude: If there is something you should have learned about me by now you can't offend me.
<MarkDude> sure DarkwingDuck
 * MarkDude wants others to know that tho
<DarkwingDuck> MarkDude: :D
 * MarkDude does not see you crying over window manager
<DarkwingDuck> Ahhh, yeah, I have pretty thick skin... 7 years Navy does that to people.
<DarkwingDuck> Pfffffft Nope
<DarkwingDuck> Although, I watch LOADS of people cry over a UI on top of a Window Manager during hte Natty release cycle LOL
<MarkDude> http://k3rnel.net/2011/05/25/the-best-of-both-worlds/
<MarkDude> So it appears some work will go in to retro packages
<MarkDude> Not quite RTF- but enough to make some nervous
<philipballew> i think gnome 3 should have just made the panels look more "modern" and call it good in a lot of ways
<MarkDude> Dependencies are very weird with it
<MarkDude> http://www.linux-magazine.com/Online/News/Canonical-Chief-Designer-Hits-the-Road
<nhaines> Huh, I don't remember that happening.
<MarkDude> roadtrip
<broder> whether she will return to Canonical remains unclear> that reads to me as gross tabloid-esque speculation - there was nothing in the tone of her post to indicate that she's not coming back
<broder> (in particular, "My return date is not fixed" carries an implied "but I am coming back" in the last paragraph)
<MarkDude> true, or it could be a way for a graceful departure
<MarkDude> Rikki wrote it- she's pretty good
<akk> Yes, when I read that it usually means "leaving but don't want to say that officially yet"
<MarkDude> broder, lets bet 25 cents on it
 * MarkDude says she is gone
<MarkDude> Maybe to Google with Scott Remnat
<broder> MarkDude: sure, why not
<MarkDude> Cool
 * MarkDude shakes imaginary hands
<MarkDude> Timeframe- would be 2 weeks after next release?
<nhaines> She's not gone.  She's just going on a roadtrip and probably wanted the option to stay an extra week because it's a honeymoon.
<kdub> sounds like the thing to do for a honeymoon, or at least a work sabbatical
<MarkDude> Gentlemen's bet nhaines ?
<nhaines> Yup.
<nhaines> MarkDude: sure thing.
<MarkDude> Cool
<MarkDude> A member of the Fedora design team did the same thing
<MarkDude> I think she did not really know whether she was going/staying until during the trip
<MarkDude> Tech is a cool industry
<akk> That's often true with sabbaticals/long vacations.
<MarkDude> I like how some of us- can just be like- well I will see how my trip goes
<akk> I've seen a lot of people leave for sabbatical, then say at the end that they're not coming back.
<MarkDude> and then I will decide
<MarkDude> She prolly does not know yet
<MarkDude> Her timing was good- much of the vision will be carried to the next release, so I am sure she has a comfort level now
<MarkDude> Mabye Gentoo will give her a job offer
<MarkDude> Oh wait- they have no $
<MarkDude> lol
<nhaines> akk: have you seen Fedora 15 with GNOME Shell yet?
<akk> nhaines: Only briefly from across the room -- haven't tried using it.
<nhaines> akk: at the time I was running it on my laptop in a live CD environment but there's no MP3 support and I wanted to listen to music from Jamendo so... it ended up being a short visit.
<seidos> bueno
<pleia2> philipballew now has cds for Sacramento :)
#ubuntu-us-ca 2011-05-27
 * seidos shakes his pom poms
<sn9> i need another place to live in Sac before the month is over. craigslist has only a couple ads in my price range, and they've already turned me down
 * seidos contemplates that problem
<seidos> i don't see that there is anything i can do
<seidos> i have family in the sacramento area, but we really aren't close
<seidos> and if we were, they would probably still not be willing to help
<seidos> i *may* have a couch open here, but i have to talk to the coach
<seidos> disregard that last sentence, i'm not in sac
<seidos> sacrament-o
<seidos> interesting
<seidos> perhaps you could check with a priest/pastor/monk in the area
<seidos> sn9: ^
<sn9> like who?
<seidos> i dunno.  pick some religions, and check it out on google maps.
<seidos> there may be a zen center in sacramento, or various christian denominations.
<seidos> i dunno, it's worth checking out sn9, to see if there are any religions that will put their money where their mouth is
<seidos> i tried to stay at the SF zen center, sn9, but that didn't work out.  never got a return email from them.  maybe they had enough negative monkies already
<sn9> that's not encouraging
<seidos> well, change is encouraging
<seidos> don't be like my past self
<seidos> who i guess is now dead in a sense
<seidos> let's a mock funeral for the "last year me"
<seidos> oh drat, he came back and stole the "have"
<seidos> he = "last year me"
<seidos> get it?
<seidos> i better /usr/sbin/pm-suspend now
<kdub> what up channel
<gueriLLaPunK> not enjoying this freaky may weather... its suppose to be warm!
<nhaines> 70 isn't warm?
<sn9> 70 is friggin' hot to me
<seidos> 70 is nominal for me
<seidos> watt up kdub
<seidos> unless i exercise, but cold showers remedy this
<akk> 70 is nice. Earlier in the week they were predicting low 60s and rain today, so I'm happy with how it turned out.
<kdub> 70 is ideal. is that what its like up in LA?
<Elep> Yo yo
<sn9> welcome
<Elep> How goes it
<MarkDude> Hello Elep
<sn9> it's been quiet in the channel
<sn9> MarkDude: you're back already?
<MarkDude> Well, she had some stuff to do today
<MarkDude> So we are meeting up later
<sn9> how long do you have?
<MarkDude> It appears I may be changing my relationship status on FB
<Elep> lol
<sn9> from what to what?
 * MarkDude is no longer single
<MarkDude> :D
<Elep> :D
<Elep> Good for you
<kdemarest> MarkDude: one love, i hope it works out for the both of you
<sn9> if i used FB, i would now be changing it from "it's complicated" to "single and not looking"
<kdemarest> oh i just changed my wiki and launchpad wiki's to this name
<kdemarest> it's like, real
<sn9> kdemarest: i liked it better before
<MarkDude> real is good
<MarkDude> Dont pay attention to sn9
<kdemarest> sn9: no you didn't
<sn9> for irc, i mean
<sn9> not for e-mail and the like
<sn9> that sucked
<MarkDude> his other nick is *myspoonistoobig
<kdemarest> it did T_T
<kdemarest> it's all good though, moving forward, not backward
<sn9> we're in agreement, then
<kdemarest> MarkDude: have you been meditating or dropping acid?
<sn9> [Fri 2011-05-27 02:21:10 PM PDT] -NickServ- Nicks      : sn9 DrStrangelove DonkeyHotei danielg4 iScream MySpoonIsTooBig ANTIramisu MyHorseIsAmazing
<kdemarest> ah, i actually do have a big spoon next to me right now
<kdemarest> there is no spoon
<Elep> MarkDude made me sign into FB. Rare occurence.
<Elep> All you guys live in Cali?
<MarkDude> lol
<kdemarest> i prefer twitter
 * MarkDude is in NorCal
<kdemarest> hopefully i'll get away from it as well
<kdemarest> SoCal here
 * MarkDude thinks of himself as West Coast
<Elep> I'm from by Sacramento. Actually more by Folsom.
<Elep> I'm literally in Alaska but there's no one in that channel :/
<MarkDude> Cool Elep - we should have something in Walnut Creek soon- I know some folks drive there from Sac
<Elep> You guys hold events? That's cool.
<Elep> Good to have something to do...
<MarkDude> Well- you arfe a bit North- but you can idle in Oregon if you like
<pleia2> I'm going to canada tonight, that's kind of like alaska
<kdemarest> i think of "myself" as all of reality, but fleshly, i am west coast
<MarkDude> Canada is far more well behaved
<pleia2> haha
<MarkDude> Alaska has Alaskans
<MarkDude> Even felons can own guns there
<Elep> Is that true?
<Elep> I'm not so sure.
 * MarkDude had lots of foks from Alakska while in PNW
<Elep> That's cool. I've been thru Canada. Very beautiful.
 * MarkDude is relying on what his friends ffrom there said
<kdemarest> i watched this horrific video on the sex trade in romania, made me cry
<pleia2> I've only ever been to niagara falls
<pleia2> should be an interesting weekend :)
<kdemarest> i've only ever been to Epcot
<pleia2> I learned today that SFO doesn't count canada as international
<Elep> My friend I work with in Geeksquad lived in niagara falls
<pleia2> so flights leave out of regular terminals
<Elep> What's SFO?
<pleia2> san francisco airport
<Elep> That's a beautiful airport. I love that city.
<philipballew> Elp i'm from auburn!
<Elep> We would go walking around the city. No need for a car
<philipballew> *elep
<MarkDude> kdemarest, things like that remind me how LUCKY I am to live where I do
<pleia2> yeah, we only really use our car in the city to do grocery shopping
<philipballew> ** Elep
<Elep> Yea it worked philipballew ;)
<MarkDude> I mean south Central LA is not that bad - when you step back and look at it that way
<kdemarest> MarkDude: i don't believe in luck
<Elep> Totally. I wouldn't mind not having a car.
<philipballew> biking is where its at
<Elep> ^
<kdemarest> MarkDude: but i know what you're trying to say
 * MarkDude would rather have luck than smarts any day
<philipballew> i biked to sacramento the other day and loved it
<philipballew> 30 miles
<Elep> Wow that's a long way
<kdemarest> i suspect nowhere is very bad as long as one has friends
<philipballew> when i was in san diego i hated it for the first month untill i made friends
<pleia2> friends help
<philipballew> Elep, the climb back up th auburn was bad thogh
<Elep> I'm sure.
<Elep> Idk much about that area. I know it's a richer neighborhood I think..
<kdemarest> the presence of someone you know that cares is often enough to help
<philipballew> Elep, folsom is richer then auburn correct?
<kdub> too many bikers in san diego
<kdemarest> what's wrong with bikers?
<philipballew> kdub, critical mass is sd tonight 8pm!
<Elep> Yea I only worked in Folsom, so Idk if they were richer or not. A lot of rich people there though.
<philipballew> where you work Elep?
<Elep> I worked at Intel and there was quite an influx of rich people from certain areas of Folsom
<Elep> Past tense
<kdub> philipballew: yeah, cant make it yet again, wish it was on like a tuesday
<Elep> Right now I work at Geeksquad in ak
<philipballew> i was going to go to intel this week and give flyers for the ubuntu hour im starting in sac area
<philipballew> ak?
<Elep> That's cool
<Elep> Alaska philipballew
<Elep> I'm near anchorage
<kdemarest> i need to get a bike, i had one in SF
<Elep> But I lived in Ca my whole life so I feel the love.
<kdemarest> there's one in Downey, but it need a new chain, and i just moved (again)
<kdemarest> phew
<Elep> kdemarest have you heard of Chrome shoes?
<kdemarest> hmmm, Alaska.  i hear it's beautiful there
<Elep> It's wonderful.
<philipballew> oh swet!!!
<kdemarest> Elep: i've heard of Chrome the web navigator
<Elep> If you bike a lot Chrome shoes is in SF, great store.
<kdemarest> i wanted to go ice diving there
<kdemarest> Elep: if i go back, i'll try to remember
<kdemarest> i'm in LA now
<philipballew> kdub, then people cant get as drunk on the ride. this guy was oulling a trailer full og bud last time
<Elep> http://www.chromebagsstore.com/shoes.html
<kdemarest> have a drink!  be merry!
 * kdemarest drinks a glass of h2o
<Elep> Me too. Water is awesome.
<kdub> sounds illegal
<philipballew> kdub, they arrested him halfway through the race, but i suppect he considered it worthit
<kdemarest> Elep: too bad they don't sell tape
<kdemarest> Elep: are they affiliated with google?
<philipballew> kdub, well not really a race, more a giant party hippie ride
<kdub> thats ok, i'm not going anyways :P
<philipballew> lol. for sure!
<kdemarest> like this stuff:  http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31k8aIH14lL._SL500_.jpg
<kdemarest> i wonder if it would work like the dragons or vibram 5 fingers
<kdemarest> i should get some
<Elep> kdemarest no they're not affiliated
<kdemarest> ah, it's probably more wasteful than the 5 fingers
<kdemarest> since it isn't that reusable
<Elep> What do you need the tape for?
<kdemarest> jogging
<Elep> I'm not familiar with heavy riding so
<Elep> What do you put it on?
<kdemarest> concrete is tough on bare feet
<Elep> Ooo
<Elep> Yea that's a good idea
<kdemarest> it's a thing out here, so i was trying it out
<kdemarest> the friction is the worst part actually
<Elep> What do you mean
<kdemarest> i guess that's why the 5 fingers, well, the socks are good
<kdemarest> er, well, it's cold in alaska so i guess you shouldn't try it
<Elep> lol
<kdemarest> gotta' take care of the feet
<Elep> It's not cold right now man
<Elep> It's like 70
<kdemarest> whuh?
<Elep> Beautiful
<kdemarest> awesome, same here
<Elep> Yea people forget we have summer here too ;)
<kdemarest> except those crows...i never know what they are laughing at :/
<Elep> It's also like 20 hrs of sunlight as well
<Elep> Sun comes up around 3AM
<kdemarest> i'm going to pet them in my mind
<kdemarest> anyway, so go for a walk barefoot
<kdemarest> on sidewalk
<kdemarest> you'll see what i mean, probably after about 3 blocks
<kdemarest> well, jog it if you can
<MarkDude> Just updated FB status, feel like a little kid :)
<kdemarest> wise children
<kdemarest> precocious
<kdemarest> operation rainbow bridge
<kdemarest> disneyland and beyond
<kdub> MarkDude: for updating facebook?
<Elep> kdemarest I would just get sandles or something for walking barefoot
<Elep> Some good birkenstock sandles, which I need.
<Elep> When I was in hawaii I really wanted some of those, and almost ordered some. Some of the are really nice.
<Elep> Expensive though.
<kdemarest> MarkDude: what do you think of this song, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3KrGI3Yxd8
<kdemarest> when i was in hawaii, i should've just walked around barefoot
<kdemarest> but nooooo, i had to go to bars like a Barney
<Elep> Yea screw bars. What's a barney?
<Elep> A freakin dinosaur for lil kids I've seen.
<kdemarest> i think a mainland tourist
<Elep> Oh ok lol.
<kdemarest> haha Barney:  http://pbskids.kids.us/images/sub-square-barney.gif
<kdemarest> here's another Barney:  http://images2.fanpop.com/images/photos/6300000/The-Flintstones-Barney-Rubble-the-flintstones-6386160-350-454.jpg
<Elep> Awesome.
<kdemarest> Dhamma
<Elep> Is that a buddhist thing, my girlfriend's a buddhist
<Elep> I learned how to tie a tie yesterday. I was going thru all the youtube videos. I think my fav is the Prat knot.
<Elep> There's so many..
<akk> re walking barefoot: does anybody make something like light slippers to simulate walking barefoot while protecting against concrete and rocks?
<akk> Like the five fingers things only not so expensive and without the separate-toe part.
<kdemarest> whoa, there are live surgeries on youtube
<kdemarest> akk: you can try tai boxing tape.  might be a decent hack
<akk> Tthe non-resuable thing mentioned earlier would bother me.
<kdemarest> dang, doctors are crazy
<akk> Like that rubbery wrist-wrap stuff -- works great but I hate how I have to throw it away after a couple days.
<kdemarest> bad or good, i dunno
<kdemarest> oh, hmmm, rubberbands might work, but they can constrict
<akk> One of these days I'll try just getting a light piece of rubber and gluing stuff to it to make sandals, I guess.
<kdemarest> maybe old ide cables tied onto the foot
<kdemarest> really the issue is the sole
<kdemarest> soul pun
<akk> Long time ago I had this great pair of moccasins, thin rubber sole, suede upper, wore 'em everywhere
<kdub> did they last a long time?
<akk> 'til I ruined them slogging through high tide at stinson beach
<akk> They lasted a few years, before that
<kdemarest> man, i am way too squeamish to be a doctor.
<kdemarest> i just watched a video of a tummy tuck, it looks horrific
<kdub> akk: i like chucks. they hold up on the beach pretty ok too
<kdemarest> i have vans with little robots on them
<akk> I've read that some docs are squeamish when they enter med school, and it's possible to get over that.
<akk> Though I'm not sure why you'd aim at that as a career if your early reaction to it is ewwww.
<kdemarest> my reaction isn't "ewwww" it "owwww"
<kdemarest> *it's
<akk> kdemarest: Like Converse? Those don't seem much like being barefoot.
<kdemarest> akk: no, the slip ons.  they were $25, and i needed shoes.  i had some "water shoes" but those were a bad buy.
<kdemarest> ironically, if i had just bought the vibrams in the first place, i probably wouldn't have spent that much more
<kdemarest> i'm not even sure where to get them though, i don't see them in the ads in the paper.  maybe after my next two pair of shoes break i'll get some.
<kdemarest> i bought a pair of airwalks for $5 @ good will
<akk> I'm not finding anything googling for chucks slip-ons that looks thin-soled.
<akk> I have some "water shoes" but they have relatively beefy soles too.
<kdemarest> yeah, i gave my water shoes away.  they didn't work in the rain very well
<kdemarest> honestly, i think just save up and buy the good stuff
<akk> I got them for kayaking and they're okay for that, but really sandals work just as well.
<kdemarest> in the meantime, you can walk and run barefoot
<kdemarest> toughen up the souls, it doesn't hurt too bad if you don't over do it
<akk> And we've pretty much stopped kayaking since they imposed all the rules and costs related to zebra mussels.
<kdemarest> i <3 zebra mussels
<akk> They've really messed up anything related to boating in bay area reservoirs.
<kdemarest> why?  they're growing on boats?
<kdemarest> i cleaned yachts for a day, but it interfered with school so i stopped.  unfortunately, at the time, i didn't realize i should've just kept cleaning the yachts
<kdemarest> it was a fun job
<akk> They stick to boats, and move that way from an infested reservoir to one that they haven't colonized yet.
<kdub> so... paint the boats with poison. seems pretty simple to me...
<akk> So you have to get (and pay for) an inspection every time you put in any reservoir.
<kdemarest> hmmm, i wonder if regular boat cleaning would fix this problem
<kdemarest> boat cleaning was pricey iirc
<kdemarest> i mean, to pay a guy to dive in the water with scuba gear and a scraper...
<akk> They inspect them out of the water. Why try to do it underwater?
<kdemarest> i think they paid me $12 an hour, but the guy that was replacing zincs and stuff was making like 40 or 50k a year
<akk> Anyway, when they're in the water, mussels can still attach, so it only makes sense to inspect/clean when they're out.
<kdemarest> wait they inspect kayaks?
<akk> The rules are written for boats. There's no distinction made for kayaks.
<akk> So if d and I put our two kayaks in a reservoir, at most places we have to pay a launch fee that's double what a huge motorboat with 12 people aboard would pay
<akk> because we have, you know, two boats
<kdemarest> can you sneak past?
<akk> Crazy stupid rules.
<kdemarest> what if you bring a bow and arrow?
<akk> Yeah, usually we just find places upstream to put in.
<kdemarest> war cry?
<kdemarest> nice
<akk> But That was before zebra mussels, dunno if they're enforcing things more now.
<kdemarest> zebras have bigger muscles than me i think :(
<kdemarest> how strange, all they do is run :o
<kdemarest> maybe a lot of sprinting
<kdemarest> i hope not, kayaking is totally chill.  they should be kayaking with you
<kdub> in SD, we just plop boats down and go
<kdub> what about paddle-boarding?
<kdemarest> i went kayaking a few times in long beach
<kdemarest> brought mask and snorkel, then dove in where there were some jelly fish
<akk> In the bay we can still just plop and go, but not in the freshwater reservoirs.
<kdemarest> they didn't sting very bad
<kdub> yeah, zebra mussels are annoying. asian carp is what everyone was worrying about in MI
<kdemarest> they're just sitting there, i think big boats are annoying
<kdemarest> all polluting and junk
<kdemarest> this is an interesting picture, a shopping cart full of zebra mussels:  http://www.examiner.com/images/blog/wysiwyg/image/zebra_mussel_shopping_cart.gif
<kdub> international trade based on sailboats went out of style in the 19th century :P
<kdemarest> true, i wouldn't have this laptop if it weren't for huge cargo ships
<kdemarest> maybe i'd have a pet zebra mussel though
<kdemarest> and maybe we'd live next door, and went surfing every morning
<kdemarest> and played soccer on the weekends
<akk> I've heard speculation that huge cargo sailboats (high-tech ones) might come back, with oil prices rising and worry about global warming.
<kdemarest> whoa, that's interesting
<kdemarest> we'll probably have to wait for it to become financially feasible
<kdemarest> which means peak oil i bet
<akk> I think Jim Clark's sailboat is controlled by Irix ... probably most of that software would easily port to Linux. :)
<kdemarest> or not, it could happen sooner
<kdemarest> yeah, if you could find a developer willing to port it
<akk> You kidding? work on software for cutting-edge sailboats?
<kdemarest> ah, you mean like a j-o-b
<kdemarest> yeah, that's be cool
<pleia2> we manage some servers at a shipyard, one of which runs the database that holds all the specs for cutting giant ships
<akk> I bet lots of people would port it just to get to ride on the sailboat. But they can certainly afford to pay.
<kdemarest> working on Irix would be like asking me to work Weld.  i don't have a welder, or the space to do it.
<pleia2> going on site there is fun times, but you need to wear a hard hat on you way to the IT department and server room :)
<kdemarest> *on
<akk> I worked on Irix for years. Liked it a lot -- it was a good Unix.
<kdemarest> i read this article today that said dressing like men helps women to close the pay gap
<kdemarest> actually, welding is too easy.  it would be like asking me to perform reparative surgery for carpal tunnel syndrome
<kdemarest> what would the software be running, anyway?  communications and nav?
<akk> those, and controlling the sails (and maybe motor when there's no wind)
<akk> and maybe the rudder
<kdemarest> that does sound interesting
<akk> and things like climate controls, window shutters, lighting etc.
<kdemarest> climate controls?  window shutters?  lighting?  what's wrong with a manual switch?
<kdemarest> i guess if you can afford a huge sail boat, you're too busy to turn a light switch
<akk> oh, and the sound system. Rich people's yachts are not like an 8' sabot. :)
<kdemarest> bot?
<kdemarest> i think the yachts i saw were like 40 feet
<kdemarest> bigger ones were like 80 feet
<akk> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperion_%28yacht%29
<kdemarest> wouldn't use a yacht to ship, anyway
<kdemarest> i'm not a fan of yachts
<kdemarest> i guess a clipper would be nice, if it doubled as a house
#ubuntu-us-ca 2011-05-28
<kdub> ugh, friday 4pm. slowest hour of the week
<kdemarest> kdub: now it's time for you to get creative?
<kdemarest> work on something fun, like http://www.dwavesys.com/en/products-services.html
<kdub> if anything, its worse on this side of the country, cause i know 3/4 of it is out having fun already
<kdemarest> ah, fun
<kdub> that's sick
<kdemarest> i just did some sprints in the living room
<kdemarest> oh no, how do we heal it?
 * kdemarest gives D*Wave CPR
<kdemarest> some wolverines were let out by where i live.  i heard them while i was sitting under a tree outside at 2:30am
<kdemarest> i am considering going back out, i think someone is after me.
<kdemarest> going to go back out, i left a note just in case.
<aaditya> O.O
#ubuntu-us-ca 2012-05-21
<MarkDude> Eclipse right now
<MarkDude> Take a pair of binoculars, point the big part at the sun
<MarkDude> focus the eye part at a wall or paper
<MarkDude> you get a safe reflection to look at
<grantbow> I remember there was a big one in 1985/1986. lol http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_solar_eclipses_in_the_20th_century
<grantbow> err, a couple
<grantbow> so this is an annular. interesting. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_solar_eclipses_in_the_21st_century
<pleia2> meeting in 10 minutes :)
 * jtatum flails his arms
<DonkeyHotei> my eyes are still not 100% after watching the eclipse out the window
<pleia2> my eyeballs are ok
<DonkeyHotei> i've been staring straight at it wearing shades
<pleia2> I think that's #1 on ways not to watch the eclipse ;)
<pleia2> #2 is wearing 2 pairs
<pleia2> hehe
<pleia2> ok, meeting time!
<pleia2> #startmeeting
<pleia2> who all is here for the meeting? :)
<pleia2> not everyone at once :P
<jtatum> o/
<pleia2> woohoo
<jtatum> one guy! hehe
<pleia2> ok, so agenda: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/12May20
<pleia2> #topic UDS Wrap up
<pleia2> so, UDS in Oakland was awesome :)
<pleia2> I didn't get nearly enough "I'm a local" buttons, I ran out early on Monday
<jtatum> agree. quite busy but very nice.
<pleia2> we had lots of local folks, many of them I hadn't met :)
<scientes> dat solar eclipse is pretty cool and almost over
 * jledbetter is here too
<scientes> anyone that hasn't looked at it
<pleia2> scientes: we're having a meeting ;)
<scientes> DonkeyHotei, you need the cool-ass solar glasses
<scientes> oh well i guess im in
<pleia2> there were lots of great events that the team and other locals put on
<pleia2> Michael Paoli did a Debian Dinner on Wednesday, I took some folks out touristing in SF (the cable cars were a huge hit),
<pleia2> then on Thursday MarkDude took a bunch of people to an A's game (and I did an Ubuntu Women dinner at my home)
<scientes> I was at the debian dinner !
<pleia2> cool
<scientes> cool discussions
<pleia2> we usually have them in SF after an Ubuntu Hour, so Oakland during UDS was a nice change of pace
<pleia2> I wish I could have gone
<scientes> best topic was the Packet in Packet
<jtatum> sounds fun. all the evenings seemed quite overbooked :)
<pleia2> jtatum helped me with touristing in SF, so he couldn't go either
<pleia2> yeah, there were official events every night too, first time I've seen that at a UDS actually
<scientes> packet in packet: http://events.ccc.de/congress/2011/Fahrplan/events/4766.en.html
<pleia2> usually there are a couple nights that are free
<DonkeyHotei> gah, black on the screen still looks purplish blue to me
<pleia2> jono really liked the idea of local buttons (or stickers) so I'm hoping it'll continue to the next loco team when UDS is elsewhere
<scientes> except you needed more buttons
<jledbetter> Good idea
<pleia2> and I encouraged him to engage the loco teams more, we didn't get any real communication or feedback from canonical until after we'd done stuff (the transportation page that eps and chris helped with was very popular)
<pleia2> scientes: yeah :)
<pleia2> I was paying for them out of pocket at $2 each, so getting more than 15 would have been hard for me
<pleia2> but stickers are cheaper!
<pleia2> or if Canonical could have paid for them ;)
<geofft> I would have gladly given you $2 for a button :(
<scientes> I would have been OK with a sticker
<scientes> you could put in on the name badges and that would have been fine and worked
<pleia2> I didn't actually know how popular the buttons would be
<pleia2> scientes: yeah
<pleia2> so, thanks for everyone who was available to give directions and help out UDS folks, I think we were a pretty good host loco :)
<jtatum> agree. got and answered lots of questions about our confusing transportation system :)
<pleia2> but effective!
<pleia2> eps got me 25 clipper cards, I was able to give them all out to people who used them
<jtatum> yes, seems it worked out. must have been quite nice for visitors to be a quick trip from the city.
<pleia2> and we gave the woman at AC Transit who hooked us up with the cards a UDS t-shirt :)
<DonkeyHotei> eps got them? figures...
<scientes> ooh, i really would loved to have one of those clipper cards
<scientes> that would have helped me alot
<pleia2> I emailed the uds-announce list about them so people could track me down
<pleia2> gave out my last one Wednesday night when we went out touristing
<pleia2> that's pretty much all I had, good work everyone!
<pleia2> jdeslip ran a Linux table at Maker Faire this weekend and I know some of us went out, anyone here who made it out?
<scientes> yeah i really could have used one of those
<jledbetter> I saw the booth
 * pleia2 was mostly stuck doing work and grown up things all weekend, no Maker Faire
 * scientes thought of going
<pleia2> I dropped off some CDs with jdeslip last weekend at BerkeleyLUG though
<jtatum> worked there on saturday. it was really neat. a lot of ubuntu cds got handed out
<pleia2> jtatum: yay!
<jtatum> grantbow put in a lot of hours there and did a great job selling Ubuntu :)
<pleia2> as he does :)
<jtatum> jyo was there on Sunday in full Ubuntu garb
<scientes> ooo, that would have been a great arrangement if i could have done that
<pleia2> haha, awesome
<scientes> the cost of the Maker Faire kinda put me off...
<scientes> even though transportation would have cost about as much
<jtatum> aw. it was excellent, scientes.
<pleia2> scientes: are you on the ubuntu-us-ca mailing list? jdeslip had a couple of passes that he gave out to ubuntu california folks who could volunteer at the booth
<scientes> but it was sure fun walking about downtown here with eclipse glasses and getting reactions ;)
<scientes> pleia2, yeah ill sign up, u got a link?
<pleia2> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-us-ca
<pleia2> so, for next time :)
<pleia2> I also announce the debian dinners there
<pleia2> thanks for the details on Maker Fair jtatum :)
<pleia2> #topic any other comments, questions, announcements?
<pleia2> scientes: get the link? https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-us-ca
<scientes> ugggh, i've really gotta track down what is causing these auto-reboots
<scientes> i've meant to setup kexec-on-oops crash dumps for a while now.....
<pleia2> I should actually get a meeting bot in here so these commands mean something
<pleia2> ok, thanks everyone!
<pleia2> have a good night
<pleia2> #endmeeting
<scientes> that was quick
<pleia2> usually is
<jtatum> thanks again pleia2 :)
<pleia2> ok, off for sushi now!
<pleia2> sure :)
<jtatum> i can toss a meetingbot in here
<scientes> i got my first patch into mozilla :)
<nhaines> pleia2: oops, missed the meeting because I was staring at the sun!  Wanted to request precise CDs.  :)
<nhaines> scientes: congrats!
<scientes> nhaines, 32-bit?
<nhaines> scientes: I think that's all they come in, yup.
<nhaines> Usually the Desktop CDs are 32-bit and the Server CDs are 64-bit.
<scientes> yep
<scientes> there were a ton at the UDS
<nhaines> I'll ping her again after she has sushi.
<MarkDude> Oreilly can hook people up with tickets with an advanced warning
<MarkDude> They were half the door price if you got them ahead of time
<scientes> MarkDude, i should have known
<scientes> then i would have gone
<MarkDude> They also will send books to groups
<MarkDude> Like Ubuntu Cali for example
<scientes> oOo
<scientes> that would be nice
<scientes> i need a good C book
<scientes> and maybe C++ too
<MarkDude> They should have sumthin :)
<scientes> I should also get my parents to send me my nice Ruby book.....;)
 * MarkDude cant ask for this group. But can for Partimus, or sumthin. 
<MarkDude> Oreilly likes people to review and post books
 * MarkDude has a volunteer that has got books from them,  read, reviewed and been happy. I should call him and see what else he was hoping to read
<MarkDude> One of the triumvirate can ask for the books if I remember correctly. After that is done, a person or 2 can be made the *book person*.
<MarkDude> It would make sense to have Nor and So Cal do it as regions
<scientes> MarkDude, so what do i do to procede with a book ask?
<scientes> *solicit
<MarkDude> Well, this is my guess at how to do it and keep everyone happy.
<MarkDude> put it on next meeting or ask the 3 leads of the Cali team
<MarkDude> We had talked about it before, Im not sure what was worked out
 * MarkDude was under the understanding they were cool with the idea, but did not have time to handle logistics
<MarkDude> I wonder if there is a wiki page for the team. That would be what I would do 1st is create a page for it.
<MarkDude> with 2 headings of Nor and So Cal
<MarkDude> If So Cal wants to divide into inland Empire and San Diego or LA or whatever they can.
<MarkDude> Come up with a wishlist of books to put on the page.
<MarkDude> scientes, are you cool with wiki markup? If not I can help , Im ok with it :)
<scientes> MarkDude, i'm VERY use to wikipedia markup
<scientes> but its not very portable, even to other wikimedia sites
<MarkDude> Fair enough.
<scientes> otherwise there is the hockuspocus of other standards, like markdown, redcloth, etc
<scientes> and <html> of course
 * MarkDude tries to remind himself that some folks might be new to this. If I did not do that, I would not be sharing the spirit of Ubuntu ;)
<scientes> however i think the new wikimedia rich text editor is promising
<scientes> and look forward to using it
 * MarkDude does moin and mediawiki
<MarkDude> and thatas about it :D
<scientes> although when i tried it out it was pretty buggy
<scientes> nah its a good answer
<scientes> it might be behind the reason that 90% of wikipedia contributes are male (!!!!)
<pleia2> nhaines: same address as usual? I'll get them out in the next few days
<nhaines> pleia2: yup, should work.  Thanks!
<nhaines> pleia2: also happy sushi!
<paulproteus> scientes: I wasn't, but now I am
<paulproteus> Mostly took a weekend vacation from IRC.
<scientes> cool cool
<scientes> u see the solar eclipse?
<paulproteus> scientes: Yes!
#ubuntu-us-ca 2012-05-22
<bkerensa> http://i.imgur.com/CS7HQ.jpg <-- Such a beauty
<scientes> bkerensa, you just got it?
<bkerensa> yep
<bkerensa> System76 loves me :P
<epikvision> Hello guys
<epikvision> i need to know if partimus is available in southern california
<epikvision> or is it exclusively northern california?
<grantbow> epikvision: only five schools in SF and one in Oakland so far.
<epikvision> grantbow: how about in LA?
<bkerensa> epikvision: nope just bay area ^
<epikvision> right, as I suspected...
<pleia2> epikvision: we're a nation-wide 501c3 and have actually done a project where we shipped computers to mexico too :) so it is possible for us to work beyond the bay area, we just don't have the volunteers and such elsewhere at this time
<pleia2> I would like to see it grow though
<bkerensa> ^
<bkerensa> >.<
<bkerensa> he left
<pleia2> doh
<pleia2> we also had a grant for a program in the state of new mexico
<pleia2> http://partimus.org/projects.php
<pleia2> all our projects are detailed there ^^
<bkerensa> but you dont travel to set them up in New Mexico ;) I bet
<bkerensa> ;p
<pleia2> *I* didn't, there were volunteers who took the truck down
<bkerensa> pleia2: You should visit a Barnes and Nobles on July 6th and buy a Ubuntu User ;)
<bkerensa> pleia2: ahh cool stuff
<bkerensa> FreeGeek wont deliver stuff at all... not even locally
<pleia2> we don't have a central location (things just pile up in peoples living rooms), so we have to deliver everything
<bkerensa> hah
<bkerensa> :D
<bkerensa> distributed warehousing :D
<pleia2> bkerensa: on July 6th I'll be in Maine!
<bkerensa> :"D
<bkerensa> moose land
<pleia2> indeed, it's where I grew up
<bkerensa> Huh.... I have always wanted to go to Maine or Rhode Island someday... the photos I have seen look pretty pristine
<pleia2> http://princessleia.com/images/maine/park4.jpg is from the park I grew up across the street from
<pleia2> it's beautiful, I miss it
<pleia2> nice to be living near an ocean again though, my land-locked decade was rough :)
<bkerensa> http://www.maine.gov/dmr/rm/lobster/multilobsters.jpg
<bkerensa> :D
<bkerensa> I would have a feast :P
<pleia2> lobsters++
<pleia2> you don't eat the blue ones, they go to aquariums :)
<bkerensa> why?
<bkerensa> :D
<bkerensa> lobster museums?
<bkerensa> oh aquariums even
<pleia2> non-standard lobsters (too large, too small, wrong color) always taste weird
<bkerensa> huh
<bkerensa> Do they have Moose Jerky in Maine?
<pleia2> probably
<bkerensa> UDS-R  Augusta, Maine :D
<pleia2> venison is usually white-tailed deer up there, but I wouldn't be surprised
<pleia2> nah, Portland
<pleia2> there is seriously nothing in Augusta
<bkerensa> Portland, OR is named after Portland, ME :D
<pleia2> indeed it is :)
<pleia2> I grew up in Cape Elizabeth, just south of Portland
<pleia2> (Cape Elizabeth was named after me)
<pleia2> ((just kidding))
<bkerensa> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portland_Penny
<pleia2> huh
<pleia2> I didn't know that :)
<pleia2> crazy if it had been Boston
<pleia2> I remember growing up and in national news it was always your Portland in the news
<pleia2> always such a treat when it was our Portland
<DonkeyHotei> three uds's in the usa in a row?
<pleia2> nah, the next one actually will be in europe
<pleia2> (they haven't announced where though)
<DonkeyHotei> next = uds-s?
<pleia2> R
<DonkeyHotei> [Mon 2012-05-21 10:46:59 PM PDT] <bkerensa> UDS-R  Augusta, Maine :D
<pleia2> he wasn't being serious
<DonkeyHotei> oh.
<bkerensa> I already think I know where the next UDS will be... atleast someone who would likely know told me a city that was in the bucket :P
<pleia2> yes, it starts with a "c" and is in denmark ;)
<DonkeyHotei> i don't know what Augusta, ME looks like, but i'd strongly recommend against Augusta, GA
<pleia2> but no contracts have been signed yet, so who knows
<pleia2> Augusta, ME isn't at all practical, too far from international airports
<pleia2> people would have to fly into Boston, 3 hours away
<bkerensa> pleia2: Copenhagen yeps
<bkerensa> have fun to whoever goes :)
 * bkerensa will gladly remote participate :P
<pleia2> remote participation for us when it's in europe is horrible
<pleia2> it's like 1AM - 9AM
<pleia2> give or take
<pleia2> grantbow has done it, but he's a superhero
<scientes> i'll to it ;)
<scientes> *do
<MarkDude> There is a group that donates computers in SoCal
<MarkDude> Computers for Kids
<MarkDude> should have pinged Gar eth
<DonkeyHotei> k4rk
<MarkDude> Or Daniel :D
<MarkDude> And Dangerous G does not need sleep as near as I can tell
<MarkDude> at least a few of his clones do not
<DonkeyHotei> bkerensa: any chance in hell you could pick this up for me? http://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/syd/3021426258.html
<jyo> The solar eclipse viewers that they were handing out at the Maker Faire: http://www.rainbowsymphonystore.com/eclipse-viewer.html
<philipballew> Would I be an idiot to upgrade lucid to precise over ssh?
<jtatum> should work
<jtatum> lot of us do that kind of upgrade and don't really have access to the console
<philipballew> alright. I just would hate to have to drag a lcd and keybord to the back room to the home server. Thanks jtatum
<bkerensa> philipballew: no its fine because it will setup a bacup sshd incase the first stalls
<jtatum> i'll be doing the same updates shortly
<philipballew> bkerensa, seems legit
<philipballew> lets hope 12.04 can run on my 512 ram pentuim4 machine
<philipballew> Its a good thing my computer turned off during the upgrade :)
#ubuntu-us-ca 2012-05-23
<jtatum> philipballew: it did?
<bkerensa> winner winner chicken dinner two bugs fixed in one merge proposal :D
<DonkeyHotei> bkerensa: any chance in hell you could pick this up for me? http://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/syd/3021426258.html
<bkerensa> DonkeyHotei: I will see... I just texted the guy he said something about meeting him outside Portland? For some reason he listed it in Portland even though he doesnt live here
<DonkeyHotei> well, as long as it's convenient for both
<philipballew> jtatum, yeah. A circuit breaker thing. I might just reinstall
<wildintellect> is the mailing list archive on nabble?
<DonkeyHotei> bkerensa: did he respond?
<bkerensa> DonkeyHotei: yeah he said if i didn't meet him tonight that i c8old try to go out to beaver to meet him but he wouldn't guarantee to hold it
<bkerensa> He said he had a possible offer in morning
<DonkeyHotei> bkerensa: that was likely me
<DonkeyHotei> make sure to mention that
<MarkDude> This sounds like a Pink Panther movie....
<kdub> morning ubuntubers
<akk> Any idea what happened to the perl plugin package for xchat in pangolin?
<akk> I'm really missing one of my plugins since upgrading -- pangolin doesn't seem to have the Xchat perl module.
<philipballew> So if when I was upgrading lucid to persice, the power shut off, is it just worth it to reinstall, or is there an easy way to fix it?
<philipballew> Yeah, its kinda annoying
<akk> Even though upgrades say DO NOT INTERRUPT, I think in the download portion it might be worth trying to restart it
<akk> since it hasn't actually changed any packages yet, just downloaded files.
<philipballew> well akk it did change the sources file from lucid to 12.04 already
<philipballew> If i run do-release upgrade I do get a funky error. :)
<akk> Ah, true. Maybe if you just apt-get dist-upgrade, then?
<philipballew> Can I manually change the sources file back?
<pleia2> +1 akk, you don't want to run do-release-upgrade again, that'll try to upgrade it to quantal
<pleia2> (or fail entirely at this stage :))
<philipballew> its already saying:
<philipballew> E: Could not perform immediate configuration on 'python2.7-minimal'.Please see man 5 apt.conf under APT::Immediate-Configure for details. (2)
<philipballew> whenever I do anything with apt-get
<philipballew> I have read the man page for that as well
<philipballew> if the sources.list file has already been changed, wont it try to upgrade to 12.04 no matter what?
<akk> Editing sources.list to go back to lucid is certainly worth a try (save the current version somewhere in case the back-rev doesn't work).
<philipballew> im going to try apt-get -f install && aptitude update && aptitude -y safe-upgrade and if that does not work look for the source file.
<philipballew> maybe for kicks ill do it as root
 * philipballew gives akk a big high five
<akk> yeah!
<akk> Of course none of that would do much if you're not root. :)
<philipballew> indeed. Ubuntu is not any less stable if I run things as root. (root as in #) ?
<akk> I usually use root rather than sudo, myself.
<philipballew> yeah, both are fine. The "debian way" is root
<akk> I use sudo for apps I run a lot where I have myself listed as nopasswd in sudoers
<akk> but for things like apt-get where I'll probably have to type multiple commands, I prefer root so I only have to type my passwd once.
<philipballew> agreed, its just easier that way.
<philipballew> I just do sudo su
<akk> I have a root passwd on my own machines, but otherwise I do sudo bash (or sudo tcsh or sudo zsh).
<akk> sudo su might make more sense
 * philipballew loves zsh
<philipballew> there are so many ways to get things done on a Linux system.
<akk> Yep, the beauty of linux!
<akk> I've been pretty happy with zsh since I switched -- took a long time to turn off a few annoyances in the autocomplete
<akk> and I still haven't figured out how to get it to ignore #, that's the only real annoyance left.
<akk> so I can do things like grep whatever ~/.xchat/xchatlogs/Fre<tab>#ubu<tab>us<tab>
<philipballew> zsh is something few use, because once you learn one shell, why learn a whole new way of doing things
<philipballew> do any distros use zsh by default? not iirc.
<akk> I used csh/tcsh for <mumble really big number> years, and only switched to zsh about a year ago.
<philipballew> I like that
<akk> Tried a couple times to switch to bash, but it has some really bad history bugs that I couldn't tolerate.
<akk> But zsh seems to have most of the good features of both bash and csh.
<akk> (Along with about a gazillion other features that would take a lifetime to learn -- it's the emacs of shells. :)
<philipballew> emacs is crazy!
<philipballew> Does anyone know of a place to find a default 10.04 sources.list file?
<philipballew> hey look! http://repogen.simplylinux.ch/
<akk> Cool!
<akk> What a good idea.
<philipballew> probably a doog idea do do a dpkg reconfigure and apt get -f and what not
<philipballew> *good
<raevol> philipballew: now putting winxp on a virtual machine to run ms office
<bkerensa> >.<
<bkerensa> why run ms office?
<DonkeyHotei> bkerensa: any news on that battery?
<bkerensa> DonkeyHotei: no response this morning
<raevol> bkerensa: my work :(
<bkerensa> DonkeyHotei: apparently he does some sort of driving for a living because he told me yesterday its kind of a hit or miss thing... I have to be ready to hop whenever is good for him
<bkerensa> I think he commutes between Gresham/Troutdale and Beaverton
<DonkeyHotei> ok
<bkerensa> on another note I hear Lubuntu is dying pretty fast?
<DonkeyHotei> not what they said at uds, but then, you were there
<bkerensa> yeah this happened more recent
<bkerensa> people have resigned
<bkerensa> and there was a blow up on their mailing list and irc
<DonkeyHotei> :(
<raevol> ok virtualbox seamless mode is the nuttiest thing of my life
<DonkeyHotei> then don't use it
<raevol> no i mean that in a good way
<DonkeyHotei> oh
<DonkeyHotei> personally, i find it annoying
<raevol> it's great for me because i need to jump back and forth between tasks on my host and guest
<raevol> i would guess that a user's mileage with it would depend a lot on their use case
<philipballew> I wonder if wine runs it well
<raevol> philipballew: i intend to try to get it working in wine, but on my first try it fails terribly
<philipballew> what version of ms offics?
<philipballew> also, id try upstream wine,
<philipballew> Attemting upgrade to 12.04 again!!!
<philipballew> bkerensa, How can Lubuntu die when Its my distro!
<bkerensa> simple? Everyone gets in big fight and resigns?
<bkerensa> https://plus.google.com/117485690627814051450/posts/4fR1Xgayf5R
<philipballew> The Internet is a easy place to get feelings hurt.
 * philipballew sees his time to shine and take the lead
<bkerensa> heh
<philipballew> Maybe Ill stay on Squeeze for a while with the desktop
<philipballew> im 50 percent lxde 50 percent gnome. Though all run gtk
<philipballew> raevol, hows the vm going?
<raevol> decent
<raevol> well
<raevol> the VM is great
<philipballew> If you want, you can try cross over as well
<raevol> this order management software we are using is terribad
<philipballew> or reactos if you feel like hacking
<raevol> eh
<philipballew> vmware or virtualbox?
<raevol> virtualbox
<raevol> ose
<raevol> from the repos
<raevol> AS LAZY AS POSSIBLE
<raevol> (while not running windows)
<raevol> (on metal)(
<philipballew> I would not recommend a bare metal windows install
<raevol> me either
<raevol> thus the VM
<philipballew> What ms office program do you need to run?
<philipballew> excel or access or something like that?
<kdub> juju install windows?
<philipballew> might get some geek cred if you write tht
<philipballew> They say Charms can be written in any Language. I am still looking for a more obscure language to write one in just for kicks.
<kdub> philipballew: try golang, its my favorite 'new' language
<philipballew> funny that I had to google it to see what it is.
<kdub> great concurrency model :D
<raevol> philipballew: need to run word and excel, and then a crappy order management software that runs in access
<raevol> funny story: the order manager runs faster in WinXP in VirtualBox in Ubuntu than it did in WinXP "Mode" in Windows 7
<philipballew> Scumbag Oracle
<raevol> virtualbox-ose
<raevol> yay it's fun having pidgin and irc at work again :D
<philipballew> aint no party like an IRC party!
<philipballew> Holla!!!
<philipballew> I think im going to make a terminal pluggin to play action songs whenever I do anything cool from it.
<kdub> philipballew: did you apply for summer of code?
<philipballew> Did not make it. Next year I will be. applying as well kdub
<philipballew> not sure what project
<philipballew> kdub, Birdrock good these days?
<kdub> sure, same as always :D
#ubuntu-us-ca 2012-05-24
<philipballew> Excellent. It is a really sweet area.
<philipballew> this channel dies when I am most awake
<philipballew> We need a CA nighttime users group!
<jbermudes> philipballew: ok, but you bring the snacks
<BA707> Hello California...   Bruce in Lake County, just outside Middletown (100 mi North of Oakland) just dropping in after being away from Ubuntu for a few years.
<akk> hi, BA707
<BA707> Greetings akk...
<BA707> Where are you in CA ?
<akk> I'm in San Jose.
<pleia2> welcome BA707
<BA707> Greeting Pleia2.
<BA707> Ah yes..  where it all began... San Jose and Sunnyvale..  ;)
<akk> silly-con valley
<BA707> LOL
<BA707> exactly
<BA707> thank you
<BA707> been through there several time when I was living in West Oak.
<akk> Not quite as scenic as where you are now.
<BA707> aamof, was on my way to a concert in SJ when I got my LeBaron totaled.  Never made the concert :(
<BA707> true, very true.  But more work to be had..   It's tough to survive up here, due to the lack of jobs.
<BA707> Not much discretionary income out here for hiring a 'Computer Consultant' now days..
<BA707> But I flatly refuse to put myself in the place of the stress that comes with the corporate race.
<BA707> at 55 (err 56 in a few days), that would not be healthy for me.
<BA707> Need to do some updates.  Using v10.04 Desktop from the ISO, and having some minor problems with it.  Does anyone have advice on which updates to let Lucid do ?  Or should I just let it run-free and do them ALL ?
<BA707> no updates applied at this point
<BA707> fresh install
<akk> A fresh install of 2-year-old Lucid?
<pleia2> in general I'd just let all the updates get applied, did you just download the iso (so.. 10.04.4) or an old iso?
<BA707> yup..  that's the burn I had available.
<akk> I'd do all the updates, since they'll mostly be security updates, but why not update to Pangolin?
<philipballew> 12.04 is really nice
<BA707> d/l it a couple years ago.  started out with v8.04 LTS from the mailed CD set.
<BA707> can the update to 12+ be dome online ?  Or should I nuke and start from scratch ?
<BA707> done
<pleia2> it can be, but if it's already a fresh install it would be faster to just reinstall
<akk> You can do it online -- there's a gui upgrade manager or commandline do-release-upgrade
<BA707> As I recall that is in the Admin menu, yes ?
<akk> I'm not sure it's faster to install if you include time to download another ISO, then burn it, then install it, then get all the updates.
<akk> But it might be marginally safer (you know you get a clean install, no upgrade issues).
<pleia2> well, first you need to apply all the updates to 10.04, which is most likely a bigger download than a 700M iso
<pleia2> some of the updates to 10.04 smooth the transition to 12.04, otherwise it'll be a bit of a mess :\
<BA707> True, but I am not 100% sure about my burner at this point, I had started to have some issues with ISO burns on my last couple attempts testing other distros.
<BA707> think I'll try the update path first and see if that completes.
<akk> I probably would -- burners are a hassle. Mine seem to die every other time I try to use them.
<BA707> I'll do the scty updates first, then apply the misc, and see how that goes..
<akk> (which admittedly is once or twice a year ... apparently they don't like sitting idle.)
<akk> Doing the updates is probably a waste of time if you're about to upgrade to a different release.
<akk> Except that you do want to make sure apt-get and do-release-upgrade are as current as possible.
 * akk goes off to a meeting -- good luck, BA707!
<BA707> You got THAT right..  I even started using a head cleaner on a regular basis, but to no avail...  I'll be glad when we progress to the little crystaline 'sugar cube' for our data storage..  ;)
<BA707> Thanks akk..  I'm going to go grab a cup of tea and watch the update here..  Thanks..
<BA707> pleia2: And I thank you for your advice...  Sounds like I may have a chance..  You now have me hungry to try 12+
 * BA707 is closing apps to attempt the updates...
<Faqtotum> bkerensa: any luck with that guy?
<bkerensa> Faqtotum: Waiting on response... I told him if he comes out tomorrow to NE I will buy it from him before I leave town Saturday morning but if not I asked if he can take Paypal and ship it to California to DonkeyHotei
<Faqtotum> that's me
<Faqtotum> if you get it before you leave, are you by any chance headed this way?
<bkerensa> Faqtotum: lol not a chance :P im just going to a diff town in Oregon
<bkerensa> Faqtotum: I thought it was for DonkeyHotei ?
<bkerensa> Faqtotum: the guy says he will take paypal verified and ship?
<philipballew> raevol you made it@
<philipballew> !
 * bkerensa poofs off to run errands
 * Faqtotum is DonkeyHotei\
<philipballew> all these crazy people with so many nik's
<akk> so confusing
<philipballew> people might not like if my name was both philip and betty at the same time.
<raevol> philipballew: \o/
<pleia2> jtatum: ah, just got my alert for the -us linode migration
<jtatum> going a lot slower than I imagined :) still haven't gotten one for my second linode
<pleia2> haven't gotten one for my personal one yet
<jtatum> i suppose it's a lot of work that they don't want to do all at once
 * pleia2 nods
<bkerensa> pleia2: your migrating away? :P
<pleia2> bkerensa: no, linode is doing hardware upgrades of all their systems, so they're creating tickets and migrating hosts
<bkerensa> pleia2: ahh fun times
#ubuntu-us-ca 2012-05-25
<raevol> :o
<Faqtotum> awesome: http://us1.campaign-archive1.com/?u=bf64f1980bfce6d994beeed16&id=76fe730579&e=d58e942f1b
<philipballew> best domain name registering website?
<philipballew> best will usually equal cheep for me
<bkerensa> philipballew: I have been using NameCheap for over a decade now and LifeHacker ranked them the best
<pleia2> bkerensa: You are likely to be eaten by a grue
<bkerensa>                                               >.<
 * bkerensa is now installing DOSBox and Rogue thanks to pleia2
<pleia2> lol
<Faqtotum> was the battery eaten by a grue?
<bkerensa> the hobgoblin scored an excellent hit on you
<Faqtotum> ?
<bkerensa> Faqtotum: oh nothing im just owning some hobgoblins and snakes in a game that pre-dates the Linux Kernel :P
<pleia2> bkerensa: Dino Sourcerer
<pleia2> I spent like 2 months of my life making dinosaurs
 * pleia2 apt-get install dosbox
<bkerensa> omg this is too much... next thing im going to be playing the original oregon trail >.<
<bkerensa> http://www.dosgamesarchive.com/download/rogue/ <-- for the win
<bkerensa> ;p
<pleia2> hehe
 * bkerensa should see if QBasic can run on DOSBox
<bkerensa> :D
<pleia2> lol
<scientes> making dinosaurs?
<greg-g> so, is it really true there is no usable FLOSS voip conference call app (eg: skype replacement)?
<philipballew> Can anyone recomend a dynamic dns service thats free. noip2 was dropped from the repos
<scientes> philipballew, there is more in the repos, like inadyn
<philipballew> are any better then others?
<scientes> freedns.afraid , hurricane electric
<philipballew> ill look to see if they have software in the debian repos
<scientes> inadyn is recommended
<scientes> i'm currently just updating each time.....
<scientes> i unplug my router, but i dont recommend that
<DonkeyHotei> i use http://dns.he.net
<scientes> one of the HE guys was at UDS
<pleia2> jyo is one of the HE guys ;)
<pleia2> he was ours first though
<scientes> he gave me a penguin :)
 * pleia2 has one on her desk
<philipballew> yeah, noip2 was dropped from the repos so I need to figure another free option
<pleia2> squishy penguin
<philipballew> free as in cost
<philipballew> What are the chances of a deb packaged for 11.10 working in 11.10?
<philipballew> I mean working in 12.04
<scientes> depends
<scientes> try to install it
<philipballew> if it installs ill know
<philipballew> then ill have to see if I can remotely access it
<bkerensa> philipballew: wanna help me test something?
<philipballew> bkerensa, what is it your testing that I might?
<bkerensa> philipballew: a google+ based widget
<bkerensa> wanna make sure it works
<philipballew> alright, ill look. im in debian now though
<scientes> don't install with dpkg if it is anything important
<scientes> cause dpkg wont warn you if it wont work
<scientes> philipballew, what is the package?
<scientes> oh, no-ip
<scientes> yeah that might work
<philipballew> noip2
<philipballew> it installed. now to see if i works or not
<bkerensa> tunneling IPv4 traffic over DNS is fun :D
<scientes> philipballew, inadyn supports no-ip.com
<scientes> install that
<philipballew> sure, ill purge noip2
<philipballew> what the heck
<scientes> dont purge
<scientes> then you loose your password
<scientes> just uninstall
<philipballew> i already know my password
<philipballew> scientes, is inadyn a simple install where I just enter a few lines as well?
<scientes> yep
<scientes> dpkg-reconfigure inadyn if it doesn't ask you on install
<philipballew> well its worth a shot
<philipballew> it did not ask me anything.
<scientes> man inadyn
<scientes> try that
<scientes> there are a number of similar programs, i don't keep them all straight
<philipballew> i should have yhought of that
<scientes> http://www.inatech.eu/inadyn/
<jtatum> used to use ddclient.. will check out inadyn, seems to have some fans here :)
<jtatum> quick scan of the repos also shows ez-ipupdate
<philipballew> noip installs fine, if it fails ill need to consider switching
<scientes> ahh yes, ez-ipupdate is the one with debconf questions
<bkerensa> http://dnsomatic.com/?
<bkerensa> better yet why not use afraid.org?
<bkerensa> philipballew: http://i.imgur.com/QjBEP.png
#ubuntu-us-ca 2012-05-26
<jyo> yay, afraid.org supports AAAA but apparently nameservers don't have IPv6 connectivity. :/
<DonkeyHotei> he.net rules
<philipballew> bkerensa, I see you have conned your way into a new house yet again...
<bkerensa> ?
<bkerensa> philipballew: what new house?
<philipballew> the one in the picture bkerensa
<philipballew> I now know where to crash in Portland
<bkerensa> philipballew: thats Linus Torvalds house
<bkerensa> and Im pretty sure he would not let you within a hundred yards
<bkerensa> ;)
<bkerensa> that or the Lake Corporation's Patrols would get you ;p
<DonkeyHotei> whither battery?
<philipballew> he lives in a gated community?
<bkerensa> philipballew: no he lives in Lake Oswego which is managed by the Lake Corporation
<bkerensa> you have to pay an extra $2500 to $3500 to be a member each year
<bkerensa> which covers things like security and lobbying
<bkerensa> :P
<philipballew> I live near an irrigation canal
<bkerensa> http://www.wweek.com/portland/blog-28689-oswego_lake_access_issue_heads_to_federal_court.html
<philipballew> Lakes are nice
<bkerensa> Well in Oregon all bodies of water are public land
<bkerensa> however Lake Oswego (The City of) has given a monopoly to the Lake Corporation
<bkerensa> which is funded by the ultra wealthy
<philipballew> My family has a free cabin in Lake Tahoe. Thats about it
<DonkeyHotei> water is land? what a weird state
<bkerensa> the houses cost more then tahoe
<bkerensa> a cheap one runs for $2 million easy
<bkerensa> DonkeyHotei: yep and in fact Oregonians own the ocean in front of their property
<bkerensa> :)
<philipballew> hum, shoot. Where does everyone get the money
<bkerensa> I cant remember how far out but the beach and ocean in front of your land in Oregon is your private land
<philipballew> ca is a weird state DonkeyHotei
<DonkeyHotei> three miles?
<bkerensa> philipballew: idk... Nike? Adiddas? Intel? Yahoo? Google? Facebook? :P they are all here
<bkerensa> Xerox?
<bkerensa> :P
<DonkeyHotei> CA is an altered state
<philipballew> Navada is where its at for business.
<philipballew> They have the whole tax thing down
<DonkeyHotei> nevada is dirt-poor
<bkerensa> philipballew: what do they have down?
<philipballew> low taxes
<philipballew> they have taxes down
<DonkeyHotei> they have a sales tax, and oregon doesn't
<bkerensa> Oregon is the place for business because we create economic zones for any company who moves in which is why every tech company is trying to build datacenters here and pay zero taxes
<philipballew> down as in nothing for the buissnes
<philipballew> no sales tax there DonkeyHotei
<bkerensa> ?
<bkerensa> and?
<bkerensa> Most big business in this state doesnt have to pay property taxes
<DonkeyHotei> oregon also has no income tax AFAIK
<bkerensa> Google and Facebook dont
<philipballew> CA is the 49th most unfriendly state for companies iirc
<bkerensa> DonkeyHotei: what?
<bkerensa> We have income tax
<DonkeyHotei> what's 50th?
<bkerensa> we have one of the highest income taxes in the country
<DonkeyHotei> bkerensa: state income tax? really?
<philipballew> Apple funnels all their revenue through reno iirc
<philipballew> ny DonkeyHotei
<bkerensa> DonkeyHotei: yeah... Our income tax offsets the lack of sales tax
<bkerensa> thats how our state gets revenue
<DonkeyHotei> it's higher than CA?
<bkerensa> heh
<bkerensa> http://www.myoregon.org/oregon-taxes/
<bkerensa> http://www.oregon.gov/DOR/BUS/docs/206-430.pdf?ga=t
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-us-ca to: Welcome to the Ubuntu California Local Community (LoCo) Team! | Website: http://ubuntu-california.org (has links to mailing list, forum, and more!) | Next Meeting: Sunday, June 3rd, 7:00pm PDT | This channel is publicly logged at irclogs.ubuntu.com  |  We have an unlogged channel at #ubuntu-us-ca-offtopic
#ubuntu-us-ca 2013-05-20
<pleia2> who all is here for the meeting?
<grantbow> o/
<pleia2> I'm going to go grab a drink, then we can begin :)
<akk> o/
<eps> Anyone here?
<akk> eps: pleia2 and grantbow and I have checked in so far.
<akk> We're in the "get a drink first" stage of the meeting.
 * akk got hot cocoa
<grantbow> eps: you now, welcome
<eps> I can't seem to reach any of the west coast freenode servers.
<pleia2> #startmeeting
<darthrobot`> Meeting started Mon May 20 02:17:19 2013 UTC.  The chair is pleia2. Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<darthrobot`> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
<pleia2> hello everyone! :)
<pleia2> #agenda https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/13May19
<darthrobot`> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/13May19 - Ubuntu Wiki]
<pleia2> so we only really have one item
<pleia2> #topic Call for mailing list (and other resource) admins
<pleia2> currently myself and grantbow are the mailing list admins
<pleia2> could use more if anyone has mailman experience and is willing to log in and clear out spam a couple times a week :)
<akk> I don't have much mailman experience, but I can probably help with cleaning out spam.
<pleia2> cool, I'll drop you an email with some instructions post-meeting
<pleia2> thanks akk!
<pleia2> we also have identica, twitter, facebook and g+ resources
<pleia2> g+ isn't really maintained at all :\
<pleia2> identica posts to twitter, and we manually put links on facebook
<grantbow> akk: thanks :-)
<pleia2> while I was gone this didn't really get done, so we need some more folks active here
<pleia2> (being gone for 3 weeks was a great trial of what I need to fix the bus factor on!)
<akk> I've kinda given up on both fb and g+, they're both too hard to use.
 * pleia2 nods
<pleia2> I think I'll drop a mail to the list to see if we have any gurus out there :)
<pleia2> maybe someone who even likes social media!
 * grantbow gasps!
<akk> heh
<pleia2> #topic Raring release
<pleia2> so we had no release events as far as I can tell
<eps> Virtual and half as long. ;-)
<pleia2> uh huh :)
<pleia2> are there any events this summer that we can participate in to make up for it?
<pleia2> no picnic :(
<akk> awww :(
<eps> MarkDude hinted at something.
<grantbow> geeknic.org
<pleia2> yeah, and jono has mentioned he might be able to bbq for a picnic at some point
<akk> A series of geeknics, hopefully.
<pleia2> grantbow: not seeing one for this area
<grantbow> not yet
<pleia2> well, something to think about then
<pleia2> #topic other business
<pleia2> anyone else have anything?
<pleia2> ok, we can wrap up then :) thanks everyone
<pleia2> #endmeeting
<darthrobot`> Meeting ended Mon May 20 02:34:56 2013 UTC.
<darthrobot`> Minutes:        http://ihas.5cat.com/~darthrobot/ubuntu-us-ca/2013/ubuntu-us-ca.2013-05-20-02.17.moin.txt
<grantbow> thanks!
#ubuntu-us-ca 2013-05-21
<MarkDude> jono its rather not cool to do a public shaming post- and NOT highlight my name. Btw, I only apologized for *type* of video
<MarkDude> Nothing more.
<MarkDude>  The bug also affects *85 people*
<MarkDude> Similar to how Ubuntu did a public shaming a while ago- listed 3 names that should have maybe been there, and a fourth name that was nothing less than bs to put on
<MarkDude> You are a great CM, but man, you gotta work on the Open thing
<MarkDude> Respectful is not using a scarlet letter. This is nothing less.
<MarkDude> Most important tho, you did not ping me on G+. The moment I saw it, I said something in a logged channel, and was nice enough to highlight/notify you :)
<raevol> what's going on?
<jono> MarkDude, eh?
<jono> MarkDude, which post?
<MarkDude> https://plus.google.com/114419073019603780828/posts/689WZkpZqeF
<darthrobot`> Title: [Jono Bacon - Google+ - In my mind everything boils down to two factors, Trust andâ¦]
 * MarkDude thought a water under the bridge stance was taken, apparently not. I will follow up comment later. But I need to clarify I apologized for type of video- and also point out MORE than 2 were upset
<MarkDude> Public shaming is a rather horrible methodology, imho :(
<jono> MarkDude, two things:
<MarkDude> But par for the course from Ubuntu perspective apparently
<jono> 1. your name was not highlighted because it was a response on Valorie's blog, and I didn't know this was backended to G+, hence no +Mark Terranova
<jono> 2. this was not a "public shaming" - it was a response to a blog entry, and yes I highlighted you and Ben, but I believe the paragraph that I wrote was supportive and respective of you
<jono> I didn't just randomly post that on G+
<jono> it was a response to a blog post that specifically referenced this incident
<jono> s/respective/respectful
<Torikun> Hey jono!
<jono> also, this is not " par for the course from Ubuntu perspective"
<jono> I find it ironic that you could be so disrespectful throughout this link incident yet you come down on me for posting something that is no where near as firey as your own postsa
<jono> Torikun, hi
<MarkDude> Firey no.
<MarkDude> Naming names like Ubuntu does -? Yes.
<MarkDude> http://lmgtfy.com/?q=%22nathan+haines%22+%22neal+busset%22+ubuntu&l=1
<darthrobot`> Title: [Let me google that for you]
<MarkDude> Internet is permanent
<MarkDude> And my name is fine- as I said in call. Other folks names? Not so much, imho
<MarkDude> But my name was mentioned
<MarkDude> No need to notify me? But its cool to drop other names?
<MarkDude> Respond to post, sure, dropping names tho is #poorform, as I posted on my G+ its a habit here
<jono> MarkDude, Mark, all I did was say that I felt you and Ben felt bad about what happened, that I consider you friends, and that I am confident things will change
<MarkDude> You care - I *know* that- you just dont get it
<MarkDude> Well of course :D
<jono> I don't get what?
<MarkDude> Thats never been in doubt :)
<MarkDude> WHY folks are mad
<MarkDude> Its more than a link
<jono> hang on
<MarkDude> Val was mad BEFORE i posted
<MarkDude> BEFORE
<jono> so are you angry at me now because of the post or because of the link issue?
<jono> lets keep focused on one issue at a time
<MarkDude> So I have NOTHING to do with her being mad- thats revisionist
<MarkDude> The OTHER name #1
 * jono is confused
<MarkDude> 2 is not letting me know my name was used- thats poor form
 * MarkDude shared the video
<MarkDude> Not ben
<MarkDude> He had a provate joke
<jono> this wasn't just about the video
 * MarkDude SHARED it
<jono> I personally don't care about the video
<jono> people make private jokes, so what
<MarkDude> Ok - and you still say its 2 names
<jono> this was about conduct
<MarkDude> The video WAS funny
<jono> I referenced you and Ben in relation to the issues over the link
<jono> and you were part of that
<MarkDude> Yes, and if I was an Ubuntu Member- you could have held that over my head
<jono> no
 * MarkDude is member of Ubuntu Community
<jono> Ben is an Ubuntu member, I don't hold it over his head
<MarkDude> Its been doen
<jono> if someone wants to question Ben's membership to the CC, I will be the first to defend him
<MarkDude> But yet- you post his name on public post?
<MarkDude> One or the other
<jono> I did, because he still participated in this incident
<jono> that doesn't go away
<jono> and I was responding to this topic on the blog
<jono> so I see referencing the name as reasonable
<jono> this is the nature of consequences ;-)
<jono> if you do something, people call you on it
<jono> it happens to me *every single day*
<MarkDude> Yes, other projects like to do things in the background.
<MarkDude> Sure
<MarkDude> you are Jono
<MarkDude> You  make money here
<MarkDude> Not fair to compare to hobby people
<jono> why does me pulling a salary make a difference?
<MarkDude> You make money to do that
<jono> Ubuntu is my hobby too
<jono> people call me in posts on my hobbies too
<jono> that is how the Internet works
<MarkDude> Pay me and you can say whatever you want
<MarkDude> Sure
<jono> I don't get angry when people call me on things, I respond where I can
<jono> I could understand your anger if I deliberately went out to highlight you in this issue, but I didn't, I responded inline to a blog post
<MarkDude> Folks that post about FOSS projects on kid related posts are still asses, it should be 2 separate ares - I agree
<MarkDude> Lets go back a few years
<MarkDude> Naming names like in the Google link
<MarkDude> No heres the deal, I was ready to let this be water under the bridge, not so much now
<MarkDude> no/now
<jono> that is your decision
<MarkDude> Yes
<jono> I think you are overreacting
<jono> but as I said on the phone last week, this is the problem
<MarkDude> Possibly
<jono> as I said, the ubuntu.com link was a perfectly reasonable topic to raise, but the way it was communicated and engaged around was not
<MarkDude> Have you ever heard of my hassles in another project? NOPE. they do things in a way that values input
<jono> "Canonical piss on people and claim it is rain" is not thoughtful engagement
<MarkDude> More than a few years there- no hassles
<jono> I don't track your contributions in other projects
<MarkDude> Dude, that is my quote
<MarkDude> YEP
<MarkDude> And you cant google to see when folks get in trouble- they are grownups
<jono> Google knows everything
<jono> again, this is the nature of consquences
<MarkDude> piss comes from Canonical - its not rain
<raevol> o_o wow
<MarkDude> Again the nature of Ubuntu actions will help it be looked at in sunlight
<jono> I agree
<MarkDude> raevol: this post was OPPOSITE of pohonecall
<MarkDude> Anyway, will respond later
<raevol> MarkDude: did you make some video?
<jono> MarkDude, no worries, but just remember the context of all of this
<MarkDude> raevol: nope- I shared it
<MarkDude> Clarification; no names were used- UNTIL AFTER val posted
<jono> MarkDude, also, to be honest, if you are concerned about your name being associated with this topic, you probably shouldn't have been a part of the datamation article
<MarkDude> THAT is shaming
<MarkDude> Telling her and other\
<jono> MarkDude, it is not shaming; I didn't seek to shame you
<jono> you know me well
<jono> do you really think I would do that to you?
<MarkDude> If you speak out- others you care about will be shamed
<MarkDude> Your words up there ^^^^ said it was a response
<jono> yes, it was a response to a post
<MarkDude> So in other words, had val not posted
<jono> that is different to shaming
<MarkDude> You would have not named the names
<MarkDude> Nope
<jono> if Val had not posted I would never have written that
<MarkDude> Actions and reactions
<MarkDude> Yep
<jono> this is accountability
<jono> this is not shaming
<MarkDude> Clear message - dont speak out
<jono> there is a very definitive difference
<MarkDude> Or others will be come after
<MarkDude> Not you intent
<jono> MarkDude, not at all, you are not listening to me
<MarkDude> Thats the message
<MarkDude> Dude- this is logged
 * MarkDude <<<<< walk
<jono> I have made it *very clear* all criticism is welcome, but it has to be on a platform of respectful discourse
<jono> yes, all our official channels are logged
<MarkDude> Yep- and FOSS can deciding if naming names in RESPONSE to a critique is fair
<jono> as I said on the phone, I thought the topic of the ubuntu.com link was a valuable topic
<MarkDude> Not all
<jono> look this is the way it works as I see it:
<raevol> so you want to be able to be disrespectful, and get away with it?
<jono> actions have consequences
<jono> professionally communicated concerns are seen as a professional engagement
<jono> emotive ranting is seen as emotive ranting
<jono> people bring their own conclusions from the conduct
<jono> what I am hearing now is that you were sorry for how you engaged in the ubuntu.com issue but you don't want to be held accountable
<jono> and I get that
<jono> but it is not like I am trying to make you an example
<jono> I am not raising this with the CC, the TB, blogging about what you specifically did or anything like that
<jono> I simply responded to a blog post and mentioned that I had spoken to you, you expressed regret for your actions, that I consider you a friend, and I am confident changes will be made
<jono> I was defending you here, not attacking you
<jono> I have a call I have to take
<jono> I will be back soon
<jono> too many meetings :-)
<raevol> the kdub
<raevol> kdubdubdub
<raevol> -_-
<kdub> haha :P
<raevol> how's life man
<kdub> can't complain, how about you?
<raevol> same
<kdub> havent had a sd uh in a while... been busy
<raevol> yea :( and philililillip has been a world traveller
<raevol> well, for some value of world
<raevol> i went back to my salsa team so my availability is back to zero :(
<kdub> maybe we'll just switch to v-uh to go with v-uds ;-)
<raevol> hahahaha
<raevol> "we all live in the same city but are going to do a google hangout because we're too busy to meet up"
<jono> hey MarkDude
<jono> back
#ubuntu-us-ca 2013-05-22
<raevol> oh hello
<raevol> philipballew pleia2
<pleia2> hello twitter friends
<pleia2> +Ubuntu
<philipballew> Sorry for Tweeting too much.
<raevol> dude pleia2 ALADDIN
<raevol> alladin?
<raevol> no, aladdin
<raevol> wait
<pleia2> pretty sure I still have that movie memorized
<raevol> yes aladdin
<raevol> yea
<pleia2> you were right the first time
<raevol> it's awesome
<pleia2> still kind of want a tiger for a pet
<pleia2> or a monkey
<philipballew> Like the Hangover!
<philipballew> well, not really
<raevol> hahaha
<raevol> philipballew: do you just have one turntable? or is it a Dj setup?
<philipballew> raevol, I have one. I leave the mixing to the people who actually know what their doing.
<philipballew> :)
<raevol> ;D
<raevol> man, you and like no one else
<pleia2> haha
<raevol> ok
<raevol> it's been fun guys but i finished my food and now have to go save Dr. Vance with Alyx
<raevol> toodles!
<pleia2> I was gonna watch aladdin but it's not on netflix streaming and my dvds are all the way over in the other room
<raevol> ALL THE WAY IN THE OTHER ROOM!?
<pleia2> plus dvds I need to take them out of their box, and put them in the dvd player, which seems like a lot of work
<raevol> wait aren't you sick
<nhaines> pleia2: aww!  But... Robin Williams!
<pleia2> raevol: yeah :\
<raevol> yea :/
<pleia2> I took 3 naps today!
<raevol> that's impressive
<philipballew> I just got Netflix
<philipballew> Seems nice
<raevol> solution: philipballew donates his netflix to pleia2
<raevol> my work is done
<raevol> toodles
 * pleia2 puts on thief and the cobbler instead
<philipballew> well, its kinda my friends cousins neighbors netflix then let me use
<philipballew> Gonna use it for Arrested Development, my favorite show.
 * philipballew high fives pleia2 
<pleia2> ^5
<pleia2> new AD on Sunday!
<philipballew> SO EXCITED!!!!!!!!!!!
<philipballew> remember pleia2 , there's always money in the banana stand.
<pleia2> hehe
<nhaines> Anyone want to see the Vulcan costume I wore to see Star Trek on Friday?
<pleia2> vulcannhaines++
<MarkDude> +1
<nhaines> http://ubuntuone.com/6c8jWyJKEStnNbmps4Lr3X
<darthrobot`> Content type: [image/jpeg] Size: [118378]
<nhaines> I am happy to announce that while plan C was to shave half of my eyebrows, the crash course in eyebrow wax made that unnecessary.  Plus, that's my own real hair extending my eyebrows; they're not drawn in or GIMPed.
<pleia2> hehe
<nhaines> Plan B was creative plucking, but to be honest, I probably would have just dress as a Human before going to Plan C.  :P
<pleia2> plucking hurts more than waxing (mostly because it draws out the pain :))
<nhaines> I'm up for a little discomfort for the sake of putting a costume over the edge, but losing half my eyebrows was a little extreme.  :)
<philipballew> pleia2, hope you're feeling well today!
<pleia2> thanks philipballew :) on the mend
<pleia2> I think I ate something bad on sunday
<philipballew> Crazy San Fransisco food problems!
<raevol> hahaha...
<MarkDude> jono, I appreciate your response yesterday. Sorry for my late reply, I am planning some events. And tis budget time now :)
<MarkDude> The key part from me was later- even when I was not stoked. The article as it is now- is inline with our talking :)
<MarkDude> Ty for listening to my objections. And more than that- showing something important - dialog.
<MarkDude> :)
<MarkDude> eof
<jono> MarkDude, np
<MarkDude> Most likely not today
<MarkDude> This event planning is taking some details of fun. I am making sure a student from Mexico is gettng his flight paid for sooner - rather than later
<MarkDude> Oh- details were sorted out. There were other issues making it complicated. But I NEED to say, the phonecall was fair and legit. My concerns were listened to - and acted upon :)
<MarkDude> Sidestepping imperfections(everyone has them) the multiple ways I can reach Ubuntu or folks in charge. THings ARE improving.
 * MarkDude also suggests taking a more calm manner than say ME - lol works better :D
<MarkDude> Apologies to Jono, his intent was pure, I need to drink less coffee. I was wrong on the intent of the article :)
#ubuntu-us-ca 2013-05-23
<Torikun> Oi
<MarkDude> Who is a list moderar?
<MarkDude> moderator
<MarkDude> ml
<MarkDude> :)
<pleia2> MarkDude: list moderators are listed on the bottom of the listinfo page
<pleia2> (I'm one of them)
<pleia2> for -us-ca anyway
<pleia2> no pending moderator requests, did you have a specific question?
<MarkDude> pleia2: yes, I was gonna send the idea of bringing Ubuntu Hours to TWIT studio - they have many FOSS fans that work there
<MarkDude> This was in context of Google Glass being hacked to run Ubuntu
<MarkDude> I wanted to email the list and see if there was a volunteer to ask Lep Laporte, and some of the other TWITS
<pleia2> MarkDude: not sure I understand, have people go to the TWIT studio to have coffee?
<MarkDude> I offered to do it myself. But that would be silly
<pleia2> or were you asked to interview..?
<MarkDude> No on eperson goes there
<MarkDude> talk s during show
<pleia2> not sure how that's an Ubuntu Hour
<MarkDude> leo always asks question
<MarkDude> AT the point Leo asks about what you do-
<MarkDude> Im a geek I go to Ubunyu Hours- you are invited-0 as well as other TWITS
<pleia2> oh, I see, be a guest on TWIT to talk about Ubuntu Hours?
<MarkDude> They told me they were interested in going to events like this when I visited
<MarkDude> Well to be in the audience
<MarkDude> Leo will talk and give some time to it. Then see about another show
<pleia2> sorry, I'm not really familiar with TWIT these days, there is a portion of the show where they interview audience members? (I didn't even know they had a live audience :))
<MarkDude> They have a live audience
<MarkDude> Every time I have gone they ask  some geek question
<MarkDude> Asked me about Fedora- Beefy Miracle , etc
<MarkDude> Only 2 people there knew anything about Fedora, pretty much everyone knows about Ubuntu
<pleia2> well it's certainly on topic, want to send an email talking about your experience and how others can do the same?
<MarkDude> Sure
<pleia2> location, date, suggestions for audience members
<MarkDude> my reason asking for mod is this
<pleia2> how you become an audience member ;)
<pleia2> I didn't even realize they had a studio in CA :)
<MarkDude> Chris has been going for a while
<MarkDude> Yep
<pleia2> (or that they had a studio that wasn't someone's house)
<MarkDude> Jono was doing the FLOSS weekly show up there
<pleia2> but it's been a really long time since I've listened
<MarkDude> Yep
<pleia2> yeah, I assumed he just dialed in to skype or something
<MarkDude> No small house anymore
<MarkDude> Its a big studio
<pleia2> I listen to floss weekly, but mostly people are dialed in and the sound is lousy
<pleia2> learn something new every day!
<pleia2> and thanks for understanding re: A's tickets being off-topic, you can tell by the number of unsubscribes after a "give away free" type post how unpopular such things are
<MarkDude> Well I wont share my opinion onm FLOSS
<pleia2> just the facts, sir
<MarkDude> lol
<MarkDude> Sure
<MarkDude> I am planning a baseball day/geeknic. I am pretty sure thats relevant- as it has been in last years
<MarkDude> But a small percent taking offense- my bad :)
<pleia2> geeknics are fine, but random "give away free" posts really put people off, they subscribe specifically to hear about Ubuntu things (and foss events)
<MarkDude> Well if I send to the list, I have been told it would be less than genuine if I used another email besides my @fedoraprject
<pleia2> had 3 unsubs after your post
<pleia2> you should use whatever email you want
<MarkDude> The way you have explained this makes sense
<pleia2> not sure why it would be "less than genuine" to use something other than your fedora email, we welcome everyone, regardless of affiliation :)
<MarkDude> The 1st explanation on the tickets made me think the mention of a channel was the issue
 * pleia2 has an @hp.com address and uses it for approximately 0 public things
<MarkDude> Well I also have a Fedora mask
 * pleia2 shrugs
<MarkDude> Its more than just a small part of what i do
<pleia2> I only really use my specific addresses when I'm specifically representing in some way
<pleia2> I don't use my ubuntu address on debian lists
<MarkDude> Well its more I respect a small group says that- and I would rather move on then try to tell people how they should really feel :)
<pleia2> since I'm not representing ubuntu when I'm posting there, I'm just me :)
<MarkDude> Ok fair enough
<MarkDude> Thats sorta how I feel, and why Im thoinking its gonna be best to politely ignore those that only view linked to one project
<MarkDude> Good stuff pleia2 I will send from my regualr address :)
<pleia2> just make sure it's one that's subscribed to the list so it doesn't get stuck in the moderation queue ;)
<MarkDude> lol
<MarkDude> I remember doing that years ago then complaining, then came my apology
<MarkDude> I think I TWIT, and let folks know how much its grown
<MarkDude> I will include a little background to catch people up to what they do- and how close they are
<MarkDude> :)
<MarkDude> Thx for the help pleia2
<pleia2> sure, thanks for passing along the info
<pleia2> would be great to see some folks from the team pay them a visit :)
<MarkDude> Yep, Leo has more than a few penguins in his office, he is a friend of Tux
<MarkDude> Yay
#ubuntu-us-ca 2013-05-24
<MarkDude> Ubuntu phone on FLOSS Weekly :) http://twit.tv/show/floss-weekly/252
<darthrobot`> Title: [FLOSS Weekly 252 | TWiT.TV]
#ubuntu-us-ca 2013-05-25
 * grantbow works through https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/Debugging/Backlight
<darthrobot`> Title: [Kernel/Debugging/Backlight - Ubuntu Wiki]
<grantbow> on my 12.04 lenovo g575
<akk> I'm trying to figure out why firefox freezes on Ringtail only on Levono X201s.
<akk> I guess it's a bad day for ubuntu lenovo.
#ubuntu-us-ca 2013-05-26
<MarkDude> Oh crap, looks like my backup irc client is on a roll
<grantbow> berkeleylug.com meeting at noon today
<grantbow> oh, seems all was OK with brightness functionality but the bug was in the value not being stored between reboots. Oddly the recommended fix was editing /etc/rc.local.
<MichaelPaoli> And, Berkeley Linux Users Group (BerkeleyLUG) meeting in progress ... http://www.berkeleylug.com/
<darthrobot`> Title: [Berkeley Linux Users Group]
<MarkDude> MichaelPaoli, check PM
<pleia2> I was hoping to make it out, but I have too much personal stuff this weekend (memorial day weekend, lots of furniture sales! and I need some..)
<pleia2> enjoy :)
<MichaelPaoli> pleia2 Good to hear from you!  :-)
 * grantbow waves
<grantbow> can someone please check berkeleylug.com ?
<grantbow> odd, I had a report the site was unavailable but it loaded ok for me
<MichaelPaoli> grantbow - let me check ...
<MichaelPaoli> grantbow Looks fine as far as I can (easily) tell ... any bit(s) in particular?  Maybe issue at client or between client and server, but not more generally?
<grantbow> no worries, thanks for checking
<MichaelPaoli> grantbow Sure, no problem.  :-)
<grantbow> Anyone have any ideas for http://www.grantbow.com/irc.html ? I'm writing another berkeleylug.com blog post about IRC Customs.
<darthrobot`> Title: [Learning IRC]
<grantbow> Any suggestions for this before I click publish? We talked about <a href="http://www.berkeleylug.com/?p=1137" title="Freenode blog post">IRC</a> a couple <a href="http://www.berkeleylug.com/?p=1203" title="Internet Relay Chat blog post">times</a> already, but after you are connected, then what? Is IRC about instant gratification? Well, yes and no. It depends on who is in the channel you are talking in. I use it to talk to people about projec
<darthrobot`> Title: [Berkeley Linux Users Group Â» Blog Archive Â» Freenode]
<darthrobot`> Title: [Berkeley Linux Users Group Â» Blog Archive Â» Internet Relay Chat]
<grantbow> I alluded in the previous post to enhancing or augmenting an IRC channel by running a bot that has useful services. I'll get to that in the next post. Unfortunately the power supply of my ShivaPlug died so I need to get a new one and get my super python bot or <a href="http://www.irc-wiki.org/Supybot">supybot</a> back online. I look forward to speaking with people about <a href="http://www.grantbow.com/irc.html" title="grantbow.com IRC">gran
<darthrobot`> [404] Title: [Supybot" - IRC Wiki]
<darthrobot`> [404] Title: [404 Not Found]
<grantbow> major fail
<grantbow> http://www.berkeleylug.com/?p=1209
<darthrobot`> [404] Title: [Berkeley Linux Users Group Â» Page not found]
<grantbow> hmm, http://www.berkeleylug.com/?p=1209&preview=true
<darthrobot`> [404] Title: [Berkeley Linux Users Group Â» Page not found]
<grantbow> page not found?
<grantbow> grrrr
<grantbow> it's published, I can edit with suggestions. I have to get going
<grantbow> ugh, this internet sucks at Au Coquelet. cya later.
<MichaelPaoli> Yup, Wi-Fi at Au Coquelet is a bit hit-and-miss.  E.g. sometimes the default/assigned DNS server doesn't work, but the rest will be okay.
<lngndvs> From the BLUG, Hello
<grantphone> Oops, I can change the topic later if nobody else gets to it before I do.
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-05-19
<DalekMagnus> Hi everyone.
<nhaines> DalekMagnus: hi!
<pleia2> o/
<ianorlin> o/
<nhaines> Well it was nice of him to stop by.
<pleia2> lol
<nhaines> I realized that due to time zones my article deadline is actually tomorrow night.  Which means I'll be writing constantly until then.  :P
<nhaines> But at least it'll be finished.  :)
<nhaines> Well, I have a cold bottle of pear cider.  Time to start the meeting then?
<pleia2> #startmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting started Mon May 19 02:02:34 2014 UTC.  The chair is pleia2. Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<darthrobot> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
<pleia2> ok, who all is here for the meeting? :)
<nhaines> _o/
<ianorlin> o/
 * eps waves
<pleia2> Agenda: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/14May18
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/14May18 - Ubuntu Wiki]
<pleia2> #topic OCLUG Installfest
<pleia2> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects/OCLUGInstallFestMay2014
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Projects/OCLUGInstallFestMay2014 - Ubuntu Wiki]
<pleia2> nhaines: anything you wish to talk about?
<nhaines> Everything's rolling along logistically.  Other than pizza money, everything is all in place.
<nhaines> What's not in place are volunteers.  I've only received one email, so I assume no one else is going.
 * ianorlin needs to send email
<DalekMagnus> I can go
<DalekMagnus> I just confirmed with my fiance >_>
<DalekMagnus> she gave me a stare
<DalekMagnus> horriffying*
<nhaines> The more the merrier.  Basically we need people to help with installation.
<nhaines> And by "installation" I mean figuring out if the hardware sounds sane and then figuring out how to boot from a DVD.
<DalekMagnus> Oh that's cake, will do
<DalekMagnus> ah, more fun
<nhaines> As far as fixing scary arcade installation problems, well the more installers we have, the freer myself and a couple others will be to troubleshoot.  So don't worry about that.  :)
<nhaines> Anyone from Ubuntu California who has signed the Code of Conduct will get an Ubuntu name badge to wear, assuming the email me their full name before Saturday.  :P
<DalekMagnus> lol I hope I see an arcade build
<DalekMagnus> !
<nhaines> So email me at nhaines at ubuntu.com if you can make it.  Details are here: http://www.oclug.org/installfest.html
<darthrobot> Title: [OCLUG Installfest]
<nhaines> The most important thing is that we're featuring Ubuntu and not talking about the command line other than the very, very brief mention that *I* will give during the install.
<nhaines> Mainly so that people understand why they're given a list of commands to copy/paste when they search for answers on the Internet.
<nhaines> Other than that we're just going to stay positive, not mention other software in a negative manner, etc.  :)
<nhaines> I think that's about it.
<pleia2> great, thanks nhaines
<ianorlin> yeah not get into a war about which is best
<pleia2> #topic Any other business
<pleia2> so, do we have other stuff to talk about?
<eps> BALUG?
<pleia2> yeah, as I mentioned on list I'll be presenting on 14.04 at BALUG on tuesday
<pleia2> http://lists.balug.org/pipermail/balug-announce-balug.org/2014-May/000672.html
<darthrobot> Title: [[BALUG-Announce] BALUG meeting Tu 2014-05-20: Elizabeth KrumbachJoseph on Ubuntu14.04 LTS "Trusty Tahr"; & other BALUG news]
<eps> Actually, I do have something new:
<eps> In re https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2014/05/14/drm-and-the-challenge-of-serving-users/
<darthrobot> Title: [DRM and the Challenge of Serving Users | The Mozilla Blog]
<pleia2> I also presented at FeltonLUG yesterday, slides at BALUG will be similar, anyone is welcome to use them: http://princessleia.com/presentations/1404-whats-new-felton.pdf (and .odp)
<darthrobot> Content type: [application/pdf] Size: [94938]
<eps> I would like to propose a vote to condemn Mozilla's decision to implement DRM in upcoming Firefox releases.
<nhaines> Out of scope.
<nhaines> Besides which, of course, they're not implementing DRM.  Adobe is.
<eps> nhaines: really? We can't take a position on that?
<akk> I have questions about that and wouldn't mind discussing it after the meeting.
<pleia2> I'm not really interested in that
<ianorlin> good thing is other browsers in repos
<nhaines> akk: that sounds like a capital idea.  :)
<pleia2> anything else?
<nhaines> eps: "out of scope" is merely my opinion.
<eps> Two votes: one to determine whether it's in scope, with a second on the resolution if the first one passes.
<pleia2> #vote Should a vote to condemn Mozilla's decision to implement DRM in upcoming Firefox releases be within the scope of this team
<darthrobot> Please vote on: Should a vote to condemn Mozilla's decision to implement DRM in upcoming Firefox releases be within the scope of this team
<darthrobot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
<pleia2> -1
<darthrobot> -1 received from pleia2
<rww> -1
<darthrobot> -1 received from rww
<nhaines> -1
<darthrobot> -1 received from nhaines
<eps> +1
<darthrobot> +1 received from eps
<DalekMagnus> -1
<darthrobot> -1 received from DalekMagnus
<pleia2> anyone else?
<elky> sure -1
<elky> -1
<darthrobot> -1 received from elky
<pleia2> #endvote
<darthrobot> Voting ended on: Should a vote to condemn Mozilla's decision to implement DRM in upcoming Firefox releases be within the scope of this team
<darthrobot> Votes for:1 Votes against:5 Abstentions:0
<darthrobot> Motion denied
<rww> (Once this is done, I have a topic)
<pleia2> eps: sounds like it's an after meeting discussion for folks interested in the topic in general
<nhaines> rww: once the meeting's done?
<rww> nhaines: no, it's within scope
<pleia2> rww: go for it
<DalekMagnus> (bleh)
<rww> (second, typing)
<rww> I would like to amend section C of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Leadership to mandate that decisions on topics added to the agenda < 48 hours before the meeting or brought up during "Any other business" cannot be finalized during a meeting and must go to the mailing list for discussion.
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Leadership - Ubuntu Wiki]
<pleia2> rww: seems reasonable
<rww> I recognize the hilarity of suggesting this during "Any other business".
<nhaines> I really like the idea that we could vote on and....  yes.  :)
<pleia2> rww: can you send a proposal to the list?
<rww> yep
<pleia2> cool
<eps> Add it to the agenda for the next meeting. :-)
<rww> Good idea, I probably will.
<rww> (This will also give me a chance to use the word "agendized", which is my new favorite word since I heard it at a school board meeting.)
<nhaines> Sounds good to me.
<rww> Anyways. Other topics?
<DalekMagnus> haha
 * ianorlin can't think of any
<pleia2> alright, thanks everyone
<pleia2> #endmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting ended Mon May 19 02:22:28 2014 UTC.
<darthrobot> Minutes:        http://ihas.5cat.com/~darthrobot/ubuntu-us-ca/2014/ubuntu-us-ca.2014-05-19-02.02.moin.txt
<nhaines> Another successful meeting!  \o/
<eps> "successful" is code for _short_
<rww> anyways, as far as Mozilla and DRM goes...
 * ianorlin thinks maybe there should be something like a drm block plugin for firefox if someone wanted it
<nhaines> darthrobot: thanks for your email  :)
<darthrobot> nhaines: Error: "thanks" is not a valid command.
<nhaines> Also I meant DalekMagnus.
<DalekMagnus> :D
<nhaines> ianorlin: if you don't want the DRM plugin, why would you install it in the first place?
<akk> My question about mozilla DRM: is this basically just another adobe plug-in that won't be available on Linux? Or what?
<ianorlin> no it blocks drm
<akk> None of the doom-and-gloom articles I've seen have even mentioned that.
<rww> Firefox has had an interface to implement DRM in the browser for ages. You may know it as NPAPI, and the plugin as Flash. The major difference between NPAPI and their implementation of EME is that CSMs (EME plugins) are sandboxed.
<nhaines> ianorlin: DRM is self-blocking.
<rww> Therefore, I do not get why everyone is up in arms about this at all.
<nhaines> akk: I think people are expecting the plugin to be available on Linux although I'm not entirely sure why now that I think about it.  :)
<DalekMagnus> Can't tell what the DRM'd bits could do?
<eps> rww: I suggest you read EFF's commentary.
<rww> It's strictly an improvement over how things used to be done. It's optional. The CSM isn't shipped with Firefox, just like Flash ishn't.
<rww> eps: I have read it.
<elky> because DRM is bad and anything that mentions it is thus bad by fear uncertainty and doubt
<akk> nhaines: Didn't adobe stop shipping even flash for Linux? So I assumed any new plug-in wouldn't be available.
<akk> But I wish someone would say when they write about it.
<nhaines> akk: they stopped maintaining it but still ship it.
<akk> I hate DRM as much as the next linux gal, but I'm not clear how this changes the status quo at all.
<rww> It doesn't.
<nhaines> akk: it makes the browser more secure, that's all.
<akk> Like, the evil silverlite netflix stuff worked with firefox before, didn't it? except not on Linux.
<akk> And that's DRM.
<nhaines> akk: it does on Linux with Pipelight.  :D
<rww> https://plus.google.com/+RobertWallW/posts/SgjFAHGt53N
<nhaines> But yeah.
<darthrobot> Title: [Robert Wall - Google+ - Firefox's implementation of the W3C EME specification isâ¦]
<nhaines> Well, silverlight isn't DRM.  But that's what Netflix uses it for.
<akk> Okay, if you know what hoops to jump through you can sometimes trick it into working :)
<eps> nhaines, akk: Adobe still supports the 11.2 branch for 32-bit and 64-bit Linux.
<DalekMagnus> They had something on their roadmap to make it work on html5 didn't they? (they = netflix)
<nhaines> DalekMagnus: yes, but only if HTML5 supports DRM.
<akk> Yeah, I thought I'd heard about adobe shipping fixes for major security flaws, even on linux.
<rww> "Adobe will continue to provide security updates to non-Pepper distributions of Flash Player 11.2 on Linux for five years from its release." ~ https://blogs.adobe.com/flashplayer/2012/02/adobe-and-google-partnering-for-flash-player-on-linux.html
<darthrobot> Title: [Adobe and Google Partnering for Flash Player on Linux]
<akk> non-Pepper?
<eps> akk: with simultaneous releases on all platforms. Basically, it will show up in Canonical's partner repository the day after the Windows and OS X customers get theirs.
<rww> akk: Pepper is the plugin API Chrome/ium use
<rww> and 11.2 came out in March 2012, so flashplugin-nonfree finally goes away in 2017
<nhaines> The same time Ubuntu 12.04.5 LTS does.
<akk> It would be so nice to think that by 2017, the net will be using some other format for video
<akk> (but I'll believe it when I see it).
<nhaines> akk: I vote for RealMedia.
<nhaines> Why?  Becau--[buffering]
<akk> nhaines: lol
<akk> though that's my experience with html5 video too, generally
<eps> Much as we'd all like to see Flash die a swift and painful death, evil Mozilloids have a plan to keep it around, a/k/a Project Shumway.
<eps> Supposedly Flash minus the DRM parts, har har.
<akk> I haven't actually seen any Real video in years. (or at least knowingly seen it)
 * ianorlin doesn't understand what is great about flash
<rww> while I'm assuming that you're being hyperbolic for humor, you may want to avoid it, since someone may take comments like "evil" seriously
<rww> which will not exactly keep the channel nice and chill
<eps> ianorlin: s/is/was/
<akk> ianorlin: Only the lack of anything better to replace it for cross-platform streaming video.
<nhaines> Which is something that HTML5 tried to manage.
<nhaines> Although actually that worked.
<akk> The trouble with html5 video is the codec plethora. I'm completely confused about which codec is which, which ones are open and which ones any given browser+platform supports
<eps> What was great about Flash has nothing to do with video. Flash "peaked" around version 5, and has gone downhill ever since, as unrelated crap (like video) got added to it.
<akk> and so are all the video providers, afaict, so understandably they just use flash instead
<nhaines> akk: youtube.com/html5 is reasonable helpful about that for your current browser.
<akk> eps: The only thing I ever use flash for (as a browser user) is streaming video, sites like youtube.
<rww> akk: Yep. That wasn't made easier by Mozilla not implementing h.264 for a while.
<eps> H.264 is patent encumbered.
<akk> Isn't h.264 the one that has built-in drm and isn't available on linux? (remember I mentioned being confused about all the codecs)
<rww> eps: I'm aware of this. So are a heck of a lot of things on an average Linux system.
<rww> Welcome to the broken patent system.
<nhaines> akk: nope, it's in ubuntu-restricted-extras.
<eps> H.264 != DRM
<akk> yeah, I was probably confusing drm with patent encumbrance.
<akk> So is ubuntu paying to use it, or what? Can distros like debian and arch use it?
<ianorlin> other uses of flash are annoying
<akk> I thought patent implied no linux.
<nhaines> Software patents aren't a thing in Europe.
<eps> Cisco paid a king's ransom for a blanket license to distribute precompiled binaries. They're also supposed to publish the source code, which you can compile yourself to prove it's bit-for-bit identical, but only the binaries come with the required licensing.
<akk> nhaines: I've tried turning on google's html5 flag for youtube. It's horrible -- it takes way more bandwidth and CPU, so I spend all my time waiting for buffering, and end up switching it back off.
<akk> I'm not sure what codec that is but it makes me like (gag, cough) flash.
<ianorlin> webm uses a ton of cpu on my comp
<akk> I hate flash in theory, but in practice it works okay.
<nhaines> akk: I mainly dislike not getting resolution choices, so yeah.  But the page itself shows you what your browser does and doesn't support.
<eps> H.264 is interesting because most people have hardware decoding these days, so it doesn't impact the CPU much.
<akk> nhaines: "support" doesn't mean "can actually watch videos in realtime", unfortunately.
<nhaines> Flash is just streaming H.264 in most cases anyway I think.
<eps> mhaines: correct
<ianorlin> what cpu flag is that not sure I do
<eps> It's not a CPU flag. It's done on the GPU.
<akk> Maybe it's an issue with intel video chipset support on linux, then? Which all my machines have.
<eps> Ah. NVIDIA w/proprietary drivers here.
 * ianorlin has intel series 4 mobile chipset
<akk> I don't want the hassle of installing proprietary drivers, and I don't play games, so I stick with intel.
 * ianorlin has intel as well
<akk> The only 3d stuff I do is the occasional google earth (sigh, more proprietary binary downloads).
<nhaines> I just install the binary drivers from the repos and then forget about it.  I'm far too lazy to worry about tracking drivers by hand.
<nhaines> If I wanted that I'd just run Windows.
<rww> psh, on Windows you presumably would have Steam installed, which would track them for you :P
<eps> Intel has proprietary drivers, too. http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2014/05/intel-linux-graphics-driver-installer-1-0-5
<darthrobot> Title: [Intel Adds Ubuntu 14.04 Support to Linux Graphics Driver Installer | OMG! Ubuntu!]
<nhaines> rww: Steam says it does that but I've never noticed it helping.  :)
<nhaines> eps: I don't believe those are proprietary.
<rww> nhaines: it's popped up with notices on an AMD system once or twice
<nhaines> Hmm.  I'll have to poke it the next time I boot Windows.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-us-ca to: Welcome to the Ubuntu California Local Community (LoCo) Team! | Website: http://ubuntu-california.org (has links to mailing list, forum, and more!) | Next Meeting: June 1st at 7PM | This channel is publicly logged at irclogs.ubuntu.com | We have an unlogged channel at #ubuntu-us-ca-offtopic
<eps> Hmm... it doesn't look like Intel wants Linux users to have access to hardware H.264 decoding ("Quick Sync Video").
<pleia2> rww: you get to play chair for the June 15th because airplane http://loco.ubuntu.com/meetings/ubuntu-california/789/detail/
<darthrobot> Title: [Ubuntu California Team Meeting | Ubuntu LoCo Team Portal]
<rww> pleia2: okays
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-05-20
<jose> pleia2: hey, mind if I steal darthrobot for the LC meeting? meetingology has gone dead.
<pleia2> jose: it's jtatum's bot
<jose> oh
<jose> well, solved anyways, thanks! :)
<pleia2> :)
<pleia2> need to figure out where AlanBell went off to so we can salvage the bot
<grantbow> I like bots
<jose> pleia2: I have put up a meetingology clone but logs won't be public unless I make them so, it would only be able to help manage meetings in #ubuntu-meeting
<MarkDude> Anyone up for a retweet - or maybe a question for me to answer? https://twitter.com/TheCommunitizer/status/468837917901590529
<darthrobot> Title: [Twitter / TheCommunitizer: Any questions4 #TeamMark ? ...]
<MarkDude> Can use if desired :) #ubuntu-us-ca-offtopic
<grantbow> whoa, big news MarkDude - I pmed you
<pleia2> they're promoting internally anyway, I think it's a joke :)
<MarkDude> pleia2, yes, hopefully a very obvious, good natured joke :)
<MarkDude> Still up for folks to RT XD
<pleia2> ok, who is coming to balug with me tonight?
<pleia2> I think I'll be grabbing a cab over, have bag-o-laptops and I'm still not feeling great, the walk is a bit much right now
<pleia2> hm, crickets
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-05-21
<jtatum> jose: pleia2: I'm still lurking here if there are any bot changes you guys desire :)
<jose> jtatum: thanks for the offer :)
<jtatum> np :)
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-05-22
 * ianorlin wonders what good things to bring to an installfest when you are volunteering
<nhaines> An Ubuntu shirt, that you wear.
 * ianorlin doesn't have one but I do have my scale shirt
<DonkeyHotei> idk how many scale shirts i have
<nhaines> ianorlin: what size shirt do you wear?
<ianorlin> adult large
<nhaines> You can have an Ubuntu cloud shirt when you get there then.  :)
<DonkeyHotei> that's my size too
<grantbow> though I haven't ordered from them lately, gotta pitch: http://shop.ubuntu.com
<darthrobot> Title: [Canonical Store]
<grantbow> tahr shirts aren't very attractive to me
<Guest7782> lol the shop is still celebrating 13.10
<grantbow> you can buy 20 dvd packs now? wow
<nhaines> You *can*, but it would be a gave mistake to.
<grantbow> grave?
 * grantbow shrugs
<nhaines> Yes, one 20-pack is significantly more expensive than two 10-packs.
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-05-23
<ianorlin> i3lock <3
<ianorlin> you can make the lock screen blue
 * ianorlin is sure there might be a way to get pink to work
<ianorlin> actually really is just don't know how to get the color code right
<ubuntuuser> hello from sudoroom.org in oakland
<ianorlin> hi
<pleia2> welcome
<MarkDude> Its easy to get distracted at sudo room XD
 * ianorlin has never been there
<MarkDude> Go, its really cool
 * MarkDude has only been a few times, but really liked itthere
<ianorlin> far from Torrance though
<MarkDude> Good point ianorlin. I imagine your traffic is bad enough locally :)
<DonkeyHotei> i was there once, last week
<DonkeyHotei> fell through a glass table
<MarkDude> Are you kidding DonkeyHotei ?
<DonkeyHotei> no
<MarkDude> I think I know the table, I assume you are fine?
<DonkeyHotei> i am now
<MarkDude> Wow, sorry to hear that
<DonkeyHotei> it was a coffee table with two glass sections, one missing due to someone previously making the same mistake
<DonkeyHotei> they've likely thrown the table out by now
<ianorlin> and this is a place in California  http://fc00.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2012/229/9/e/mudkip_shimeji_by_green1706-d5bfb5y.png
<darthrobot> Content type: [image/png] Size: [594910]
<ianorlin> sorry wrong picture
<ianorlin> https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=Hurd%20peak
<darthrobot> Title: [Hurd peak - Google Maps]
<MarkDude> ianorlin, I would like to think the desktop pic was very California, if not pacific Ocean centered
<nhaines> Well, looks like I'm an Ubuntu member for another year.
 * pleia2 just renewed too \o/
<nhaines> Yay for us!  \o/
<MarkDude> +1
<MarkDude> A very nice person is helping get some laptops for a HS chemistry class https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-us-co/2014-May/007492.html
<darthrobot> Title: [[CoLoCo] Computers for a High School Chemistry Classroom]
<MarkDude> In a few weeks, someone from the school will be in Bay, I will have at least one machine to help.
<pleia2> yeah, she asked me if partimus knew of any ways to get laptops for a school
<pleia2> yay Cheri \o/
 * MarkDude can handle at least one machine- and will do an inventory- I can see what is needed- memory and decnet hard drive
 * MarkDude assumes you could forward to list?
<pleia2> hm?
<MarkDude> If not, I can lean on G, I will pretend he owes me a favor
<pleia2> I don't know what you're asking :)
<MarkDude> Oh, in a few days, the inventory of 1 or more laptops, and parts needed if any
<pleia2> for CO?
<MarkDude> Nothing- right now- just later
<MarkDude> For Ubuntu
<MarkDude> And the kids, in Co
<MarkDude> :)
 * MarkDude believes the children are our future :) Kidding aside, if its odd to post it on Cali Team- thats cool- it can be posted elsewhere :)
<MarkDude> pleia2, it looks like Cheri found a local group to help with hardware and support. She had a response this morning - yay
<pleia2> :)
<akk> How's she doing?
<MarkDude> Awesomely awesome.
<MarkDude> Amazing how cool things happen when you move to a nicer place to live
<MarkDude> Hard to reach her at times- since her social life is soooo busy
<MarkDude> UW can take a small part in this happy story, IMO
<MarkDude> Long time no talk akk :)
<akk> sure has beem, MarkDude! How goes?
<akk> I had to leave that cape gooseberry behind. :( Took a bunch of berries from it but so far they aren't sprouting.
<MarkDude> btw, before I go any further, we are gonna do a full "autopsy" on Gidget Kitchen. Unlike how most projects just move on, Im gonna make sure there is a forum for others to offer suggestions, and learn here (90% of fail was on MarkDude , btw XD)
 * MarkDude has an extra plant if you want- its 3 foot tall
<akk> Not sure it would ship very well ... but if I'm ever in the bay area ...
<MarkDude> lol- yes. I can ship spices and seeds if needed. Funded by another project no less
<MarkDude> But not likely for full grown plants XD
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-05-24
<rww> somebody's moving?
<nhaines> rww: to the beat!
<rww> oh, Cheri. Who is Cheri
<rww> nhaines: get your popular culture reference i don't understand out of here :(
 * ianorlin just made a simple script to display a random image as a lock screen using i3lock
<rww> whoo i3 \o/
<ianorlin> installfest :D
<akk> yay, where?
<jose> OC!
<akk> Any customers yet?
<ianorlin> no it is today but not happening yet not until 10am
<akk> You're there early!
<ianorlin> I am still at home
 * ianorlin got up early to watch formula 1 qualifying
 * ianorlin is back from installfest
 * ianorlin also got tablet from raffle
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-05-25
 * ianorlin2 installed an irc client on the tablet as the first new app
<nhaines> Good choice!
<akk> yay, connected to the world now
<ianorlin2> now I am on it watching hockey
<MichaelPaoli> Change of venue for today - Berkeley Linux Users group meeting at Au Coquelet, Au Coquelet, 2000 University Ave., - same block, just down the street a wee bit from Bobby G's. http://www.berkeleylug.com/
<darthrobot> Title: [Berkeley Linux Users Group]
<DonkeyHotei> MichaelPaoli: same place BUUG meets
<DonkeyHotei> berkeley unix users group
<MichaelPaoli> Yes, same place BUUG meets.
<MichaelPaoli> ... and same place Berkeley Ubuntu hour meets for odd numbered months.
#ubuntu-us-ca 2015-05-18
<nhaines> elky: you around?
 * ianorlyn is
<nhaines> ianorlyn: that's good.  I was hoping we'd have statistics though.
<nhaines> Well, meeting coming up in 7 minutes.
<lrcaballero1> Good night everyone! this is Luis
<lrcaballero1> :-D
<nhaines> Hey, Luis!  Right on time!  :D
<lrcaballero1> What's up Nathan...
<nhaines> It's meeting time, that's what's up.  :)
<nhaines> #startmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting started Mon May 18 02:01:14 2015 UTC.  The chair is nhaines. Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<darthrobot> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
<lrcaballero1> lol
<nhaines> #chair ianorlyn
<darthrobot> Current chairs: ianorlyn nhaines
<lrcaballero1> you got the right...
<nhaines> Welcome to the Ubuntu California meeting!  Today's agenda is available at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/15May17
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/15May17 - Ubuntu Wiki]
<nhaines> First up, we were going to look at how often meetings had agenda items to discuss in 2014.
<nhaines> elky was voluntold to perform the analysis, but I haven't heard from her this week.
<nhaines> Does anyone have any comments to make about our biweekly meeting schedule before we postpone this topic to next meeting?
<nhaines> Oh right, plus we have bot commands that are a thing.
<nhaines> #topic Review last year's meeting agenda activity.
<nhaines> Okay, so we'll move on and postpone a look at this topic until next meeting.
<nhaines> #topic Other business
<nhaines> Does anyone have any upcoming events or announcements they would like to mention?
<lrcaballero1> nothing here....
<nhaines> All right.  I don't have anything else to add either.
<nhaines> I've been asked to help out with some training planning which will be cool, but more on that in the future.
<nhaines> All right, in that case, we'll bring the meeting to a close for this week.
<lrcaballero1> I would like to know more about this....are you accepting volunteers for this?
<nhaines> For the training?
<lrcaballero1> yes
<nhaines> Too far out right now to tell, and I haven't joined on just yet.  But if we do need more volunteers you'll be the first to know.  :)
<nhaines> (I accepted the offer to help out, we're looking at early 2016.)
<nhaines> Our next meeting is Sunday, May 31st, at 7pm PDT.  Hope to see everyone there!
<nhaines> #endmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting ended Mon May 18 02:15:33 2015 UTC.
<darthrobot> Minutes:        http://ihas.5cat.com/~darthrobot/ubuntu-us-ca/2015/ubuntu-us-ca.2015-05-18-02.01.moin.txt
<lrcaballero1> Thank you Nathan, have a wonderful night! I will shoot you an email next time I am in Aliso Viejo maybe we can grab lunch or somehing
<nhaines> lrcaballero1: ooh, awesome.  Thanks.  :)
<nhaines> That would be pretty cool.
<lrcaballero1> See ya...
<nhaines> ianorlyn: would you do the honors for the channel topic?
<ianorlyn> oops forgot about meeting
* ianorlyn changed the topic of #ubuntu-us-ca to:  Welcome to the Ubuntu California Local Community (LoCo) Team! | Website: http://ubuntu-california.org (has links to mailing list, forum, and more!) | Next Meeting: Tonight, May
<ianorlyn>  Welcome to the Ubuntu California Local Community (LoCo) Team! | Website: http://ubuntu-california.org (has links to mailing list, forum, and more!) | Next Meeting: Sunday, May   31st, at 7:00pm PDT (UTC -7:00)
<darthrobot> Title: [Ubuntu California Team | California Team]
* ianorlyn changed the topic of #ubuntu-us-ca to:  Welcome to the Ubuntu California Local Community (LoCo) Team! | Website: http://ubuntu-california.org (has links to mailing list, forum, and more!) | Next Meeting: Sunday, May   31st, at 7:00pm PDT (UTC -7:00)
* ianorlyn changed the topic of #ubuntu-us-ca to:  Welcome to the Ubuntu California Local Community (LoCo) Team! | Website: http://ubuntu-california.org (has links to mailing list, forum, and more!) | Next Meeting: Sunday, May   31st, at 7:00pm PDT (UTC -7:00)
<ianorlyn> This channel is publicly logged at irclogs.ubuntu.com | We have an unlogged channel at #ubuntu-us-ca-offtopic
<ianorlyn> grr keeps purring second line in
* ianorlyn changed the topic of #ubuntu-us-ca to:  Welcome to the Ubuntu California Local Community (LoCo) Team! | Website: http://ubuntu-california.org (has links to mailing list, forum, and more!) | Next Meeting: Sunday, May   31st, at 7:00pm PDT (UTC -7:00) This channel is logged at irclogs.ubuntu.com | We have an unlogged channel at #ubuntu-us-ca-offtopic
<ianorlyn> finally
<elky> sorry guys, lost track of time
<elky> nhaines: stats are done. haven't sent mail because distractions
<elky> mostly because i recorded in gdocs and i don't want to hand format a .txt or deal with the "wah gdocs proprietary evil" discussion
<elky> doing dishes is more enticing than either of those options
<nhaines> elky: yay, you're alive!  \o/
<elky> yeah sorry, left dinner late and then forgot it was sunday
<nhaines> Yup, not ignoring my Google Calendar reminders has been useful this week.
<nhaines> rww removed himself as an /r/Ubuntu mod without comment, so I don't know what's up with him.  :P
<nhaines> How's the bitey monster?
<elky> nhaines: he was purging the reddit account as he is want to do
<elky> bitey monster is cuteing at the end of our bed where it was warm and sunny earlier
<elky> so, reading every. single. meeting. log this week made me think we need to reformat the meeting structure in general.
<elky> (well every single '14/'15 log)
<elky> i don't think we should be leaving "i did/will $thing next week at $place" to the end. and we should be encouraging "I installed/gave out cds/other small avocacy thing" at the start, rather than at the end before lurkers get bored and walk off.
<elky> so i think we might want to try starting with an "announcements and advocacy" bit for the first few mins each meeting.
<elky> that's the kind of thing that's getting put in AOB which is probably not the optimal place
<elky> i think if people get to boast about installing their neighbours grandma's computer, it might allow them to own the meeting more.
<elky> so we shouldnt be discouraging it, even accidentally
<nhaines> Interesting.  I like it.
#ubuntu-us-ca 2015-05-19
<Roguehorse> Good Morning!
<ianorlyn> hi Roguehorse
<Roguehorse> Well, I finally had to break down and set reminders for myself to get to the meetings
<Roguehorse> On Sundays I'm usually pushing to get homework done and miss it
<ianorlyn>  ah should get homework done earlier
#ubuntu-us-ca 2015-05-21
<ianorlyn> I am starting to hot like my dad asking to ask me a question
<nhaines> What?
<ianorlyn> I mean he keeps talking to me in ways that would get the !ask factoid in a support channel
<nhaines> Ah.
<DonkeyHotei> my standard answer is "you just did"
<philipballew> In a month, in June I am going to be doing some live demos of Ubuntu at a week long book fair in Tijuana at the Linux Users Group's booth there. We/ mostly me will be giving live talks multiple times during the week and mainly on the weekend, and if anyone wants to join, I would always love the help.
<blitz> Mexico trip?
<blitz> wow tijuana has a lot more people than SF
<ianorlyn> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G9TnZhw2bt0 this could be useful for how to get non technical volunteers
<darthrobot> Title: [2014 SouthEast LinuxFest - Deb Nicholson - How to Get and Keep Non Technical Volunteers - YouTube]
#ubuntu-us-ca 2015-05-22
<Roguehorse> ianorlyn: good one =)
<Roguehorse> Another thing to keep in mind is keep having things for your volunteers to do
<Roguehorse> Don't expect them to just do things on their own, give them projects to complete and be there for them when they have questions
#ubuntu-us-ca 2015-05-23
<philipballew> blitz, yeah, about twice as much maybe?
<philipballew> the San Diego, Tijuana region is about 4 million.
<philipballew> Also I think  am speaking at Free Software day there if anyone ever wanted to join.
#ubuntu-us-ca 2016-05-25
<nhaines> pleia2: sleep!
<pleia2> I really should
<pleia2> flying back east tomorrow night on a red eye
<nhaines> It's okay.  I'm writing.  I have 17k words to write, and I work best under pressure.  So it's going to be another couple hours tonight at least.  :)
<pleia2> I turned on my Preface today, it was my final chapter-thing \o/
<nhaines> The next time I fly, I'm just going to take the "Star Trek TNG Ambient Engine Noise (Idling for 24 hours)" from YouTube and rip the audio and stick it on my phone.
<pleia2> I suppose with noise-cancelling headphones that could work
<nhaines> Although the last time I used it, I think I did the DS9 ambient sound for 4 houres and then the spacedrive script from my phone (basically the same as the TNG sound) for 4.
<nhaines> Congrats on turning in the final chapter thing!  \o/
<pleia2> hehe
<pleia2> thanks :) I'm excited
<pleia2> just waiting to hear back on a few final rounds of reviews for some dangling chapters
<pleia2> but feedback should be pretty minimal, this being final round and all
<nhaines> I'm looking forward to seeing the final result!
<pleia2> thanks :)
<pleia2> it probably is not horrible \o/
<nhaines> Well, that's the trick.  :)
<pleia2> hehe
<nhaines> I'm currently annoyed at my publisher for late feedback.  But luckily my current project is finishing a novel a friend flamed out on.
<nhaines> I read it, created a new plot outline, shoehorned in the 24k he'd already written, and now I'm writing around it.  Which is fun because I can take the scenes that were 'finished' (he had half a first draft) and polish them a little to match the new plot.
<nhaines> So this kind of ghostwriting is fun.
<pleia2> nice :)
<pleia2> my father started writing a novel before he passed away, I have all his drafts
<nhaines> Ooh.
<pleia2> but fiction is not my forte, and it's a mystery that I don't know how he planned on ending
<pleia2> mystery is a special breed of tricky fiction
<nhaines> Oh, definitely.  I want soooo badly to write it.  But it's very tricksy.
<nhaines> This novel is a kind of pulp romance.  So it's sort of fun.
<pleia2> cool
<nhaines> Indie romance focuses a lot on character interactions, so banter is a big part of it, and I really enjoy that, because I'm pretty good at ad-libbing in real life anyway.
<nhaines> I'm in a fight with the original author about the heroine discovering the terrible lie was actually hiding a heart of gold (clichÃ©!) due to a printed email he accidentally left behind when he got kicked out.
<nhaines> He claims no one prints emails, so it's totally implausible.
<nhaines> I said "If you have an important email, you print it out and put it in a manila folder and then put that in a hanging folder so you can refer back to it in your filing cabinet if you want to look it up later."
<nhaines> But actually the idea is it has travel itinerary plans or something with some notes.  He said he's just going to change it if I write it, and I said "I'm ghostwriting, so that's a you problem, not a me problem."
<nhaines> Now that I think of it, when he asked "Why on earth would anybody ever print an email if they have a smartphone?" I should have said "You can't fax an email from a smartphone."
<nhaines> I think I'll say that the next time it comes up.
<DonkeyHotei> actually, you can
<DonkeyHotei> there are many online fax services now
<nhaines> Maybe, but he'll be upset at the idea that faxing is still a thing.
<pleia2> nhaines: hah
<pleia2> so I got a thinkpad bluetooth keyboard with a trackpoint
<pleia2> just saw my tablet go all convergence for this first time!
<pleia2> didn't do that when I had just my old keyboard paired
<nhaines> Nope, needs a mouse or manual toggle for that.  :)
<pleia2> TIL :)
<nhaines> I probably should've picked up the Logitech keyboard with a trackpad.  But the keyboard-only one I got is a really decent, chunky keyboard, and since I write so much, that's probably for the best.
<pleia2> I just don't want Yet Another Thing to charge
<nhaines> pleia2: you can use the gear menu to toggle "Desktop Mode" on or off, if you don't like the default.  :)
<pleia2> it was surprising and unsettling, haha
<nhaines> Oh yeah.  These use standard rechargable, and I have plenty of those.
<pleia2> my husband is like "I think it's a desktop now"
<pleia2> he's pretty smart
<pleia2> :)
<nhaines> Haha, "Welcome to the new Ubuntu, same as the old Ubuntu."  :)
<pleia2> alright, I should attempt sleep now
<pleia2> good night DonkeyHotei and nhaines
<nhaines> I did that at the last OCLUG meeting on a projector.  It was met with alarm and joy.
<pleia2> nice
<nhaines> In the vein of "Oh wow, that looks fantastic!  It's come so far from 2 months ago.  It's so polished now!"
<nhaines> Okay, back to writing for me, too.  Good night!  :)
<nhandler> pleia2: Still thinking ~30 people?
<nhandler> (re: release party)
<pleia2> nhandler: yeah
<pleia2> I'll bug jono to do his famous person magic promoting
<nhandler> pleia2: Doesn't look like we will be able to host an event of this size. They would like the events to be a bit larger to justify the security and overtime costs.
<pleia2> nhandler: ok, thanks for trying
#ubuntu-us-ca 2016-05-27
<nhaines> Another perfect first stage landing for SpaceX!
#ubuntu-us-ca 2016-05-29
<pleia2> I'm in Maine this weekend visiting family, not sure I'll make the meeting this eveing
<lynorian> pleia2, I thouhgt it was canceled as memorial day weekend
<pleia2> lynorian: could be! I was just going by the /topic :)
<pleia2> it wasn't announced either, so
#ubuntu-us-ca 2017-05-28
<pleia2> hopefully the lp poll closes on its own...
<pleia2> either way, I won't be around during the meeting, will be on a train going through northern Indiana, and internet access on this trip hasn't been 100% ;)
<pleia2> also, instead of the awful self-signed cert, I installed a letsencrypt one for our domain (also emailed Eric to see if he can sort out our currently messed up dns records, www goes to the wrong place...)
#ubuntu-us-ca 2018-05-25
<nhaines> Hmm... it's *probably* time to apply updates and reboot, since Livepatch doesn't seem to be applying updates.  :)
<nhaines> 3That's better!  Nice and shiny.
<pleia2> tsk, bad livepatch
<nhaines> Yup!  But it appears to be happy now.  :)
<pleia2> saw Mark today \o/
<nhaines> How's he doing?
<pleia2> sabdfl Mark, we spoke for like 30 seconds ;)
<pleia2> seems good, looks healthy
<nhaines> Haha, yeah, he's a busy guy.  Glad it's business as usual with him.  :)
<pleia2> his keynote here though :\
<pleia2> https://www.zdnet.com/article/ubuntus-mark-shuttleworth-pulls-no-punches-on-red-hat-and-vmware-in-openstack-cloud/
<darthrobot> Title: [âUbuntu's Mark Shuttleworth pulls no punches on Red Hat and VMware in OpenStack cloud | ZDNet]
<pleia2> in a sea of companies pushing collaboration, Mark..
<nhaines> Yeah, I read that one.  I found it quite amusing.  :)
<pleia2> but to his credit, it did create press
<pleia2> I was mostly like :O
<nhaines> As I said on reddit, "The trick is that if youre going to do this, you gotta be *right*."
 * pleia2 nods
<pleia2> I am in the Vancouver airport, flight is delayed :'(
<nhaines> Aww.  :(
