#ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 2013-05-13
<mhall119_testing> testing, testing, 123
#ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 2013-05-14
<k_alam> join #ubuntu-uds-plenary
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305//appdev-1/ - http://ubottu.com/udslog/%23ubuntu-uds-appdev-1
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Track: App Development | App Developer Roundtable | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21820/app-developer-roundtable/
<rafaelmartinez> Isn't there supposed to be a session in here?
<nik90> rafaelmartinez: it starts in 10 minutes
<goddard> cool
<goddard> ?
<rickspencer3> o/
<rickspencer3> o/
<Mirv> \o
<CimiUDS> there's like a ground bass sound coming from one of your mics :)
<christoffer> CimiUDS yes, I hear that sound aswell
<CimiUDS> tuuuuuuuuuuuu :D
<rickspencer3> I'll join if there is room for me
<CimiUDS> ckpringle_: lol
<dpm-uds> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/383298df913cb329379b8935f835f2c8cafa0b89
<christoffer> still hear it
<CimiUDS> just mute mics
<dpm-uds> for anyone wanting to join
<CimiUDS> yep
<christoffer> yea
<CimiUDS> :)
<ckpringle_> CimiUDS: can you see my lower third?
<CimiUDS> ckpringle_: lower third? you mean your name? no
<ckpringle_> CimiUDS: now?
<CimiUDS> no, but I know who you are :)
<nik90> ckpringle_: nope
<CimiUDS> dpm-uds: I have the feeling you just have one of your jacks plugged in partly or badly
<CimiUDS> ckpringle_: yes now
<ckpringle_> CimiUDS: nik90 \o/
<rafaelmartinez> Wow!
<nik90> ckpringle_: hi
<ckpringle_> nik90: hey dude
<ckpringle_> nik90: how are you?
<rafaelmartinez> so where do we chat? on the left or on the right?
<nik90> ckpringle_: great :)
<mhall119_uds> rafaelmartinez:here
<nik90> ckpringle_: I no longer see you in our design hangouts
<ckpringle_> nik90: :( you will again now, I was in Oakland for a sprint then holiday in Portugal :D
<ckpringle_> nik90: can't you see my tan?!
<rafaelmartinez> mhall119_uds: thanks
<nik90> ckpringle_: ah ... hehe
<nik90> ckpringle_: you are a very small box in the hangout video at the moment.
<ckpringle_> nik90: small box? Smaller than everyone else?
<dpm-uds> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/CoreApps/DevelopmentGuide
<nik90> ckpringle_: not smaller than evyerone else..but smaller than the current speaker.
<csdev> why are there two chats (on the left and on the right)?
<nik90> csdev: just use the irc chat (on the left).
<csdev> nik90: thanks
<nik90> csdev: the chat on the right is just part of etherpad for collaborative editing
<nik90> QUESTION: Why cant we use quickly for other stuff like unity-lens creation or web apps template?
<nik90> I think qtcreator does not provide syntax highlight for other languages.
<nik90> yeah qtcreator is awesome!
<nik90> yeah it answered the question
<nik90> thnx
<faisal-ali> QUESTION: Will the design of the Ubuntu SDK Components change between desktop and mobile (tablet and phone)?
<faisal-ali> as in theme
<fr33r1d3> We can hear David very bad.
<CimiUDS> dpm-uds: check your mic / headphone cable jack!
<dpm-uds> CimiUDS, is my mike any better?
<CimiUDS> dpm-uds: if you're not muted, it's great now!
<CimiUDS> yes!
<GuidoPallemans> this may be not so general, but is there anyway that applications send data to each other? I'm thinking about an Intent-like structure from android
<GuidoPallemans> thanks!
<who_me> I'd be interested. I liked the intro Jono made for Quickly...
<dpm-uds> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Testing
<rafaelmartinez> so am I the only one who doesn't see any video?
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Track: App Development | SDK feedback from App Developers | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21825/appdev-1305-sdk-feedback/
<JoshStrobl> So jonobacon, when are you going to finally get around to that beer? :D
<jonobacon> JoshStrobl: when the last session is done :-)
<mhall119_uds> waiting for google to get the hangout ready...
<jonobacon> mhall119_uds: :-)
<jonobacon> drop me a URL when it is up
<rafaelmartinez2> brb
<mhall119_uds> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7bd48b7a6dc3ce9499ae52e2fb3e1e9d8f160a57?authuser=1&hl=en for anyone who wants to join
<nik90> u r live
<JoshStrobl> the hangout is live
<t1mp> yes, I see the hangout
<kaleo_> jonobacon: hangout link?
<mhall119_uds> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7bd48b7a6dc3ce9499ae52e2fb3e1e9d8f160a57?authuser=1&hl=en
<jonobacon> kaleo_: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7bd48b7a6dc3ce9499ae52e2fb3e1e9d8f160a57?authuser=1&hl=en
<Kaleo> cheers
<kenvandine> http://qt-project.org/wiki/Category:Developing_with_Qt::Performance-Tips
<kenvandine> Kaleo, ^^
<Kaleo> kenvandine: GPU programming tips https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/document/d/1L6sXEowkzpUx3gUvO_3q76h9EsMzHSnzzJedjgFzTF0
<jonobacon> Kaleo: can we get that content on developer.ubuntu.com ?
<schwarzburg> QUESTION: I would like to have more information about plans for including typical mobile needs (e.g. maps / accelerometer / compass /...) directly in the Ubuntu SDK. (The qml-mobile versions I found are mostly about Nokia stuff...)
<pmcgowan> mhall119_uds, ^^
<GuidoPallemans> So maybe this is a better place to ask if there is a way of communicating with other apps like android has intents?
<schwarzburg> mostly , yes
<pmcgowan> mhall119_uds, gps API will be available soon
<pmcgowan> for maps
<GuidoPallemans> just ignore if it isn't relevant :D
<Mirv> schwarzburg: qtsensors module is the msot ready to use at the moment, you can for example use it to get acceleration data
<schwarzburg> ok, thanks
<Kaleo> kenvandine: best performance related documentation: http://qt-project.org/doc/qt-5.0/qtquick/qtquick-performance.html
<pmcgowan> Kaleo, is there a good answer to the question about something similar to intents above?
<pmcgowan> mhall119_uds, thats the other session running right now, background tasks
<bobweaver> is this live ?
<mhall119_uds> bobweaver:yes
<kenvandine> Kaleo, ha... one of the things to avoid "calling JavaScript functions"
<bobweaver> never use guy
<bobweaver> gu *
<bobweaver> use math
<GuidoPallemans> why not let the mainview define what files or links or data the app loads? an app always has exactly one mainview, so...
<bobweaver> why not use mimetype the way unity 2d did ?
<bobweaver> so application id and Â mimetype
<t1mp> here is the bug related to the toolbar tests: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1177341
<udsbotu> Launchpad bug 1177341 in Ubuntu UI Toolkit "Need to expose custom autopilot APIs for Toolbar and Tabs" [High,Confirmed] - Assigned to Juhapekka Piiroinen (juhapekka-piiroinen)
<bobweaver> libunity
<GuidoPallemans> ok, that seems like a good solution for the intent problem, if it will be ported
<JoshStrobl> Question: Any plans for "email" echoMode / inputMask for Ubuntu SDK's TextField?
<pmcgowan> mhall119_uds, yes, it will come from the settings work
<bobweaver> why not just set via user and file a sqllight DB ?
<bobweaver> QUESTIONS ^^
<bobweaver> then users can use DB in there app
<bobweaver> like a common DB
<JoshStrobl> Questions ^
<pmcgowan> date time picker
<mhall119_uds> bobweaver:set what?
<nik90> JoshStrobl: ping
<JoshStrobl> Yes
<JoshStrobl> I am developing a two-step authenticator
<JoshStrobl> First input is email
<JoshStrobl> I'd prefer to not have to deal with validation on the software end, rather just via QML
<bobweaver> why not just use Ubuntu SSO in web view
<Kaleo> http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/ubuntu-12.10/qml/mobile/qml-ubuntu-components0-textfield.html
<Kaleo> validator property
<pmcgowan> mhall119_uds, you seem to be getting these posts quite late, maybe the webchat client?
<bobweaver> mhall119_uds: set ?
<JoshStrobl> alrighty
<JoshStrobl> figured I'd ask
<Kaleo> JoshStrobl: best is to file a bug so that we don't forget about it
<bobweaver> just a suggestion for auth
<bobweaver> mhall119_uds: ^^
<JoshStrobl> I'd prefer native over webview
<bobweaver> like a web engine
<pmcgowan> mhall119_uds, ok
<GuidoPallemans> why don't you ask the questions in irc too?
<bobweaver> not the whole webpage just a idea
<sdklfhsdlfjks> is it already possible to have for the ValueSelector an ID with Shown Text... Like a 2D array with id as value and text as what shown in valueselector?
<bobweaver> cool
<JoshStrobl> mine is specific to my startup, so SSO wouldn't apply since my startup has it's own account system and API system
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305//appdev-1/ - http://ubottu.com/udslog/%23ubuntu-uds-appdev-1
<bobweaver> great I get launch on work now and now there is not sessions
<bobweaver> lol
<t1mp> sdklfhsdlfjks: ah after some delay I understand your issue now
<t1mp> sdklfhsdlfjks: no currently not, the values have to be in the list, so you would have to generate the list from your 2d array
<t1mp> sdklfhsdlfjks: but your question makes sense. Can you request the feature by filing a bug on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ui-toolkit ? Please also describe your use case. thanks
<bobweaver> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhLuZRSOk6U
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Track: App Development | SDK Roadmap | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21767/appdev-1305-sdk-roadmap/
<rickspencer3> o/
<bobweaver> \o
<mhall119> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/84302806b13ba160f89aa1f22318111f02e1c175?authuser=1&hl=en
<rickspencer3> wow, quite a lag!
<rickspencer3> like 2 minutes
<ara> dpm, you look tired :)
<JoshStrobl> yea...
<JoshStrobl> lots of lag :\
<rickspencer3> 2 minutes :)
<dpm> We're currently discussing proposals/feedback for new widgets (in case you're affected by a long lag and you want to suggest any)
<schwarzburg_> suggestion: colorpicker
<rickspencer3> i think that's a great idea
<rickspencer3> my.* in VB
<rickspencer3> my.screen.size
<rickspencer3> my.time
<rickspencer3> etc...
<bubbly_> Embeded IRC is not working for me, had to use konversation
<JoshStrobl> rickspenser3 -> maybe phone.*
<JoshStrobl> *rickspencer
<dpm> bubbly_, sorry about that, we're aware of it and will try to fix it as soon as we can
<dobey> a gui toolkit wrapper for standard db stuff? sort of like what gnome-db has?
<dbarth> qt/qml support sqlite by default, don't they; so it seems to be already covered by the sdk
<rickspencer3> yeah! color picker ftw!
<rickspencer3> I've needed it a few times
<mhall119> dbarth: they do, but there's more setup than necessary
<dobey> dbarth: yeah, but not sure if they abstract displaying data so it's really easy to do.
<dbarth> right, so it's a matter of having the glue in between and a sample app
<rickspencer3> it's like a namespace that pulls together tons of simple stuff
<rickspencer3> yeah
<rickspencer3> so you don't go hunting around
<rickspencer3> then nevermind :)
<dobey> SysInfo doesn't tell you anything
<dobey> there are multiple things that have it, but there's no single namespace with all the basic things
<_NerdyMe_> IDEA: User Account integration with the SDK. If you make an email client you can access the user account login from there without having direct access to the password etc.... in planning or did I just miss it?
<dobey> _NerdyMe_: i think that's what the online accounts and keyring apis are for. not sure there's anything special that would fit in qtcreator for that
<kenvandine> uoa-create
<dbarth> mhall119: do you have a pointer to that api (u1 account)?
<kenvandine> lp:account-qml-module
<dbarth> ah nice
<kenvandine> lp:accounta-qml-module
<kenvandine> mhall119, oh yeah... you asked me to put together a toplevel page in the docs
<mhall119> kenvandine: oh right, did you?
<Kaleo> http://people.canonical.com/~kaleo/progressbar_design.png
<kenvandine> mhall119, no :)
<mhall119> :P
<kenvandine> Kaleo, yes please!
<dbarth> kenvandine: sorry, i'm confused, is that working with u1 as well?
<bobweaver> This is what I am talking about let the user set the data http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhLuZRSOk6U
<Kaleo> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/+bug/1129966
<udsbotu> Launchpad bug 1129966 in Ubuntu UI Toolkit "[hud] Hidden HUD instance in MainView can cause problems when developers also define their own HUD" [Critical,In progress] - Assigned to Tim Peeters (tpeeters)
<kenvandine> it would be nice if apps didn't need to import Ubuntu.HUD
<kenvandine> dbarth, not yet
<kenvandine> dbarth, that is a different topic, not sure the status of a u1 SSO plugin for UOA
<dbarth> ok
<kenvandine> Kaleo, then it would just work on platforms that didn't have HUD
<kenvandine> like windows
 * kenvandine wants app developers to be able to develop anywhere :)
<t1mp> mhall119: It is still under discussion, but currently I think it would be a good idea to do it in the same way as toolbar actions
<kenvandine> mhall119, HUD?
<Kaleo> kenvandine: I see
<kenvandine> yes
<CimiUDS> sorry guys for popping in later - I have a question on the date/time picker. Are we considering this independently with a calendar we might want in indicators?
<kenvandine> it works now
<kenvandine> with the PPA
<kenvandine> it works
<kenvandine> in the unity HUD
<bobweaver> cool kenvandine
<Kaleo> CimiUDS: you are the one working on it :)
<t1mp> :)
<kenvandine> mhall119, right... but they are parallel installable now
<bobweaver> kenvandine,  that is the unity-next branch ?
<kenvandine> no
<bobweaver> kenvandine,  what is branch ?
<kenvandine> well, daily-build-next PPA
<kenvandine> but standard unity in raring
<CimiUDS> Kaleo: calendar and date/time picker are different
<daker_> bobweaver:Â smoking can kill you and we still need you :)
<CimiUDS> date time is usually like three sliders we scroll to select day, month, year
<CimiUDS> calender is the calendar as we have in the indicators
<bobweaver> daker_,  lol
<kenvandine> bobweaver, https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-unity/+archive/daily-build-next
<bobweaver> kenvandine,  yeah I am looking at that should I start 13.04 or 13.10 minimal ?
<kenvandine> 13.04
<kenvandine> works fine
<bobweaver> thanks
<kenvandine> bobweaver, np
<Kaleo> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/sdk-new-widgets
<kenvandine> bobweaver, ok, it was working fine 2 weeks ago :)
<CimiUDS> if in the sdk we need to integrate
<CimiUDS> the date time picker
<CimiUDS> (with three sliders)
<kenvandine> bobweaver, it doesn't blow up though, just not finding anything when i search
<CimiUDS> or the calendar
<CimiUDS> or both :)
<t1mp> Kaleo: let me update the blueprint, the generic toolbar is done.
<CimiUDS> zsombor proposed having an external library with 'composed widgets'
<CimiUDS> that might be useful for other applications
<CimiUDS> but not basic enough to be considered for the main sdk
<dobey> Kaleo: yeah it would be nice if the qt5 ports of qtmobility libs were packaged up. they're not in raring
<Kaleo> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/sdk-layouting-research-and-prototype
<Kaleo> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/sdk-layouting-implemention
<CImiUDS> there's a misunderstanding here, let's put this aside
<CImiUDS> I can work on both if you need
<dobey> there's lag between the hangout and the live stream "on air" being streamed via youtube
<t1mp> Kaleo: the general idea for the tools is to make it super awesome! :)
<dpm> We're wrapping up the session, any other questions from IRC?
<bubbly> As a kubuntu user I love the fact that the SDK uses qt, as i'm much more familliar with it than gtk
<bubbly> How will SDK integrate with other flavours of ubuntu?
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Track: App Development | Growing the Ubuntu SDK Apps Collection | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21711/appdev-1305-apps-collection/
<t1mp> dpm: ^ question from bubbly
<brendand> QUESTION: Is there any plan to support python at any level in the SDK?
<mhall119> brendand: not at this time, no, but a Qt5 binding for python should give you everything you need
<brendand> mhall119, that's what i was getting at. will those bindings be packaged?
<mhall119> brendand: if somebody packages them
<dobey> does pyqt support qt5 yet?
<t1mp> dobey: http://www.riverbankcomputing.com/news/pyqt-5-snapshots
<dpm> dobey, brendand, I think pyqt supports qt5, pyside doesn't
<dobey> cool
<brendand> not sure pyside is going anywhere
<dpm> and as far as I could tell pyside is more or less dead
<dobey> would be nice to get pyqt5 packages in ubuntu then
<dpm> last thing I saw waas them planning to do a rewrite before they could port to qt5, so at this point I'd deiscard it as an option to use
<dpm> *discard
<dpm> and thanks bobweaver, nik90 and everyone on IRC for your participation
<mhall119> next session's hangout: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/d134e44963d5d5cea08a0a51328ba73889e12b5a?authuser=1&hl=en
 * JoshStrobl wonders if there'll be another 2 minute delay :D
<mhall119> probably
<brendand> dpm, we want checkbox at some point to be able to run on the phablet image
<t1mp> "and we're live" <-- now you know how much the delay is
<JoshStrobl> "ways to grow our collection..."
<JoshStrobl> not much delay it seems
<t1mp> and now you see that the video starts for us :)
<goddard> i dont have any delay
<dpm> brendand, then it might be worth assessing PyQt (and its license), how much of QML it supports.
<JoshStrobl> yea there is a video delay
<brunogirin> QUESTION: if I create an app, how do I add it to the list?
<JoshStrobl> he just said adding Work Items and that happened several minutes ago
<JoshStrobl> oh well
<faisal-ali> qml and pyside should be possible
<t1mp> NOTE: We should not only focus on NEW apps, but also porting existing apps to use Ubuntu SDK
<t1mp> ^ that means, re-writing the graphical part of the app in QML using our UITK
<dpm> brendand, but it might just be as easy to create a qml frontend for Checkbox
<brendand> dpm, thats what i was hoping to be able to do
<t1mp> brendand: what is checkbox? url?
<t1mp> is it the name of an app?
<goddard> what is the google plus community?
<brendand> t1mp - it's the 'System Testing' app
<faisal-ali> goddard:Â https://plus.google.com/communities/111350780270925540549
<brendand> dpm, i just hope we won't have problems gluing the qml to the python3 backend
<t1mp> if we add existing apps to d.u.c, they can also be used as examples/tutorials
<brendand> dpm, due to the fact that pyqt was not packaged in 11.10 we ended up having a compromise solution with Qt UI code glued to the python backend via dbus
<victorp> dpm, I didnt even know the collection existed until you mentioned
<t1mp> mhall119: there is a link to posts on the blog on https://developer.ubuntu.com/, but not a prominent link to the blog itself
<t1mp> or maybe I am not seeing it
<t1mp> mhall119: ok I can find it via community :)
<victorp> dpm, perhaps and option on the SDK where you can install the apps with onclick via QTCreator
<victorp> when I was starting finding source and what you can actually do with qml help to think about it
<t1mp> you can install on devices via qtcreator :)
<victorp> t1mp, exactly
<victorp> I meant a one-click
<popey> victorp: you can
<popey> victorp: CTRL+F12
<victorp> guys
<victorp>  I meant as example apps
<popey> ahh
<popey> yes, samples within qtcreator?
<victorp> i.e install sample apps on the phone
<popey> yes, the sdk guys are working on that actually
<popey> they want to have a "gallery" in qtcreator which is like the ubuntu software centre
<popey> has a bunch of apps which you could choose from and see the code and build upon it
<popey> which can be added to over time, more examples
<victorp> IMHO collection should eventually be a set of example/showcase app
<victorp> dpm kickstarter :)
<popey> hah
<victorp> popey, that is how I am funding dogfight v2.0
<victorp> :P
<popey> I'll pay!
 * kenvandine chips in
<victorp> will 1.0 is not even finished
<popey> Here, take 0.0000000000000000000000000001 Bitcoins
<victorp> lol!
<victorp> BB!)
<victorp> BB10 even
<brunogirin> mhall119: WebOS
<victorp> blackberry is qml based
<popey> I'd love to see a series of youtube videos from _someone_ going from Zero to Hero
<victorp> qt forums - digia
<victorp> ?
<t1mp> wow! there is an xkcd app! \o/ :)
<faisal-ali> In terms of games, there are a lot of HTML5 games. Reaching out to groups at reddit.com/r/gamedev to package their HTML5 games for Ubuntu Touch.
<kenvandine> victorp, how easy is it to find source for blackberry apps?
 * t1mp installing :)
<popey> faisal-ali: good idea
<victorp> kenvandine, easy for the developer ;)
<kenvandine> any open source ones?
<victorp> I am sure that BB is doing developer events, we should just gate crash
<bobweaver> victorp,  http://qt-project.org/forums
<bubbly> blackberry apple and android developers don't let source out to just anyone
<black_puppydog> re html5 games: get plugins/exporters out for things like construct2, just to draw people?
<kenvandine> that's what i thought
<black_puppydog> it's mostly jscript I guess...
<popey> nik90: heh, i just created the trello board before we caught up with the video where you said you'd do it â»
<popey> nik90: give me your trello ID and I'll add you to it
<nik90> popey: 1 sec
<popey> nvm, found you!
<nik90> popey: nice :)
<victorp> mhall119 this game (maroon) should be ported for Ubuntu. Greate little game https://qt.gitorious.org/qt/qtdeclarative/trees/c81d942ab0297cf894f2dd20700b4188afa07c25/examples/demos/maroon
<bobweaver> http://necessitas.kde.org/
<popey> nik90: let me know if you have a problem getting into it
<victorp> bobweaver, that looks good
<t1mp> QUESTION: If I talk with a Qt app developer, how do I convince them that Ubuntu is the coolest platform to develop for?
<kenvandine> victorp, i think i have a branch somewhere for maroon
<t1mp> or more general, a mobile app developer
<kenvandine> not finished... but i started it at some point
<popey> victorp: https://trello.com/victorpalau is you?
<victorp> popey, it is
<popey> added to trello
<bubbly> lol "...and also in the embedded world. Qt is a C++ framework, which is a plus if you don't like Java that much. "
<victorp> we were using it, but not anymore... we move to LKK because of you!!!
<victorp> :)
<popey> haha
<popey> and we left LKK â»
<bubbly> or java at ALL
<nik90> popey: if works .. no issues
<popey> win
<t1mp> mhall119: good answer :) thanks
<bubbly> all-in-one platform FTW
<t1mp> dpm, mhall119 thanks :) more good points
<bubbly> So will the mobile os reach a final version by 13.10
<popey> t1mp: also we have a spaceman, spacemen are cool right?
<popey> Yeah, we're unashamed pimps!
<bobweaver> https://plus.google.com/photos/106122674051576198224/albums/5853418872568994097/5853418876682214290?authkey=CInYtqmGocDR1wE
<t1mp> popey: of course! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxCCngdz-LY
<popey> video froze for me
<t1mp> popey: the conclusion is "nothing beats an astronaut"
<popey> haha t1mp â»
<bubbly> by final i did mean a stable release, although i consider the first stable to be the last beta :)
<JoshStrobl> Yea, I think saying "your app could be used by a former astronaut" is a pretty compelling reason to develop for Ubuntu Phone.
<goddard> what phone should I get?
<goddard> to install ubuntu on?
<mhall119_test> goddard: Nexus 4
<JoshStrobl> +1 to the Nexus 4
<popey> galaxy nexus if price is an issue
<victorp> dpm I would help on a particles tutorial :)
<popey> ooh!
<goddard> will the nexus 4 work on sprint?
<victorp> galaxy nexus is nice
<goddard> samsung galaxy nexus?
<popey> yues
<popey> -u
<dpm> victorp, excellent, I'll sign you up for that, thanks!
<victorp> goddard, a qemu image
<victorp> that will be good
<popey> bobweaver: we're currently looking at the best way to setup a VM
<bubbly> How will we convince sprint kricket vorizon etc. to support ubuntu for phones, they care alot more about money than anything
<bobweaver> thanks popey
<popey> bubbly: we dont need to, thats for commercial sales people â»
<t1mp> angry tux!
<victorp> mhall119 you can do that with particles
<bubbly> t1 mp,^ Yes
<t1mp> oh, it exists, of course :)
<popey> is the video freezing up for anyone else?
<schwarzburg_> yes, all the time
<popey> ah ok
<victorp> mhall119 you can work out gravity and physics with particles
<JoshStrobl> I don't think Google+ Hangouts can handle all the amazing sessions going on right now.
<JoshStrobl> :P
<victorp> you could easily write angrybirds with particles
<goddard> victorp: i need to buy a new phone but i am on a cdma network so trying to figure out a good phone for my network and will work with ubuntu
<goddard> i guess i can always use the qemu image
<goddard> my video is fine probably just your connection
<bobweaver> http://gitorious.org/tiled/   http://box2d.org/      http://www.mapeditor.org/
<victorp> mhall119 it gives you something like it. That is what I use to hit devices
<bobweaver> https://launchpad.net/~mapeditor.org/+archive/tiled
<bobweaver> http://gitorious.org/qmlarcade
<bobweaver> mario game I wrote with box and tiled/s http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lwc4sn_RYZk
<goddard> we can go as long as we want!
<dpm> we're wrapping up the session, any other ideas on IRC?
<popey> looks good
<victorp> mhall119 is you are interested the component to work out impact is called Affector
<mhall119_test> victorp: is that part of the Particles library?
<victorp> mhall119 yeap
<victorp> something to do maps will be awesome
<bubbly> really wish i was viewing this in Ubuntu, but right now i'm forced to use my Arch
<victorp> maps of game levels I meant
<victorp> bye bye
<popey> \o/
<popey> excellent session
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305//appdev-1/ - http://ubottu.com/udslog/%23ubuntu-uds-appdev-1
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/appdev-1/ - http://ubottu.com/udslog/%23ubuntu-uds-appdev-1
#ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 2013-05-15
<Chase993> Anyone aboard?
<omac777> test
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Track: App Development | App Developer Roundtable | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21821/app-developer-roundtable/
<bubbly193> Hear you
<brunogirin> yes we can hear you
<dpm-uds> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/d3db9679af80c3c496e285892391afe89f016a49
<brunogirin> no delay here
<dpm-uds> if someone wants to join the hangout
<mhall119_uds> ping
<gatox_> i can hear you
<goddard> no delay
<goddard> i heard you guys
<nik90> mhall119_uds: god the delay is a lot :P
<netcurli> 1-2 minutes delay
<brunogirin> on
<nik90> mhall119_uds: pong heard
<netcurli> pong
<goddard> i already heard it as well
<mhall119_uds> yeah, that's a long delay
<goddard> say ping
<goddard> say ping
<goddard> say ping
<goddard> :D
<goddard> is there an open source google like hangout?
<goddard> or free software
<goddard> holy cow that is a delay
<goddard> cool
<mhall119_uds> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21824/appdev-1305-api-website/ is the new site session he was talking about
<nik90> did the video freeze for anyone?
<goddard> this might be kind of a stupid question and unrelated, but is it possible to get an ubuntu touch virtual machine image?
<goddard> nik90: ya for a second just did a page refresh
<bubbly193> I would have joined the hangout, but have no webcam and my high-end mic broke
<bubbly193> goddard, that isn't to stupid a question, as it seam that i do 99 percent of a software testing using VirtualBox
<udit_> I am late at joining the discussion so i am not sure if it is covered, but i wanted to know is ubuntu planning to have a desktop toolkit like for mobile?
<udit_> i mean gtk and qt do exist but they are too generic. Is ubuntu planning to have ubuntu specific controls and stuff for develoeprs
<udit_> to have a unified look for the apps
<goddard> oh ok so i use unity next
<goddard> that would be awesome
<bubbly193> if the desktop was originally written for GTK+, why did you make the decision for touch to be qt based? not complaining, I'm a qt guy all the way
<udit_> i want to ask the same question
<udit_> and are you planning to have gtk support in ubuntu for mobile?
<brunogirin> QUESTION: how do you ensure the upstream Qt docs on dev.ubuntu are in sync with upstream?
<christoffer> Good question bubbly193 also interested in the background discussions for that
<goddard> bubbly193: i think because Nokia did a ton of work for their mobile plateform based on Linux, but then pretty much got paid a crap ton of money from Microsoft then abandoned it
<goddard> QT is awesome
<goddard> it makes C++ usable
<bubbly193> i'm not complaining, i'm a KDE guy, and kde uses QT
<kaliuds> the "easier" is not true technically speaking - though I would agree on the previous arguments
<udit_> yup it makes sense, because if the system is made on qt then gtk support would be an overhead i guess
<kaliuds> (gtk has the same backend modules as qt)
<mhall119_uds> kaliuds: thanks, I wasn't real sure on that point
<udit_> the problem is majority developer like me know c not c++
<bubbly193> i know all about surfaceflinger and it's almost no support for gmas and raedons
<goddard> udit_: i know PHP so I just had to learn new languages
<mhall119_uds> QML is easy to learn
<who_me> udit_: if you're going to use Qt Quick and QML it's not even C++, it's javascript
<mhall119_uds> not even that much javascript
<udit_> oh, didn't know that. never got into qt. bt i think it is time to take it for a spin now
<gatox_> QUESTION: could you explain the process to propose an app that someone does to be included in the ppa or how to distribute it?
<udit_> Question: with the latest weird development in nautilus is ubuntu planning to do something about it given we would need the same for mobile too.. I mean a new file manager or a fork of nautilus? PS: Gnome i think have even removed the desktop drawing code from nautilus
<udit_> ya, that is a good discussion. i want to take part in core dev but don't know how to
<brunogirin> QUESTION: are there bitesize tasks in the core apps that people with little time on their hands could do to contribute?
<mhall119_uds> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Collection
<who_me> QUESTION: on raring, after installing the ubuntu-sdk package, should we also add the relevant ppas to stay current (SDK Release and QT 5 Edgers)?
<dpm-uds> (and then ping mhall119 or popey)
<udit_> Question: should ubuntu do something about having android apps support, ie if it is possible. Because that will mean Ubuntu having all the apps from android to begin with.
<brunogirin> udit_: that would generate a large dependency on dalvik I suspect
<gatox_> thanks
<nik90> brunogirin: that's a really good suggestion
<dpm-uds> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-phone-coreapps/
<udit_> thanks.. I am so glad to hear that
<udit_> brunogirin: I know but don't you think it would be worth? I mean Android already has everything a mobile platform needs.
<asomething> Are there any plans to bring community developers working on the Core Apps inside the formal Ubuntu community structures?
<asomething> Will those projects eventually allow community developers the same kind of control over the project the distro developers currently have? I.e. control over commit permissions?
<dpm-uds> http://www.canonical.com/contributors
<brunogirin> udit_: true but if you just want more apps, it might be easier to support sailfish, BB10 or WedOS apps out of the box
<brunogirin> nik90: thanks :-)
<udit_> brunogirin: ya anything tbh. I mean we need something that already gives us edge and Ubuntu mobile does not need to have a journey of 4-5 years before having good enough apps. Ubuntu desktop still lacks with this problem. We need to tackle this problem.
<who_me> thanks
<asomething> maybe my question is more suited for the community-roundtable?
<udit_> hmm. Thanks.
<bubbly193> Remember, Ubuntu Touch is a desktop/phone-tablet OS not just a phone-tablet OS.
<brunogirin> QUESTION: are there things we can learn from quickly and port to the SDK / QtCreator?
<mhall119> udit_: brunogirin: porting BB10 and Sailfish apps to Ubuntu would be relatively simple for most apps
<CheesBurg> Sorry I joined. Did realize UDS started yesterday
<brunogirin> mhall119: that's what I suspected and in an ideal world, QML APIs between the 3 would eventually converge to minimise porting
<udit_> Question: Given ubuntu as a desktop has never had the best of graphics drivers from any of the major players(nvidia/ati), how will we ensure that Ubuntu mobile gets better support for the same. Or the core team would think about polish the open source drivers?
<CheesBurg> QUESTION: Once the SDK reaches 1.0, will Canonical prefer developers for desktop apps to use it? Also will the core apps have desktop versions? I think they should so other developers can could use them a reference for the own apps like how developers on OSX uses Apple's custom as guides.
<asomething> thanks guys, I'm just glad people are thinking about this...
<udit_> +1CheesBurg
<bubbly193> Sorry i was helping take care of my nephew, so i missed most of this, and I will be unable to attend the next App Developer meeting, as I'm going to the foundations meeting
<brunogirin> mhall119: my wishlist: packaging and autopilot test templates
<goddard> im not a huge fan of launch pad
<goddard> it needs an interface upgrade
<mhall119> brunogirin: packaging is already there to some extent
<nik90> goddard: I might say that launchpad interface is so much better over others like gnome bugzilla for isntance
<schwarzburg> About getting more contributors to core apps: I guess that information about the current status is hard to find. It seems as if most of the apps wait for designer input at the moment (?), and starting without these designs might be wasted time...
<udit_> I am glad to hear that Ubuntu is talkign to hardware manufacturer for this
<udit_> thnks
<goddard> nik90: true
<goddard> nik90: i guess i am spoiled with github
<nik90> goddard: :)
<CheesBurg> Core apps needs to be on all forms of Ubuntu so that developers can have a standard they can look at.
<dpm-uds> http://status.ubuntu.com/coreapps-13.10/
<nik90> CheesBurg: that's the eventual plan
<brunogirin> QUESTION: should this take inspiration from responsive HTML techniques? Some of the complicated issues in supporting several form factors are well documented with responsive designs.
<nik90> CheesBurg: There are many core apps which is currently being designed for the mobile platform. However we should expect desktop designs to land once they are done.
<bubbly193> When will Unity Next be integrated into a stableÂ release?, when will Mir?
<CheesBurg> I understand, I just want to stress it. My personal goal is to make sure that Ubuntu is developer friendly, Even more so than Android
<udit_>  Question: When Unity next be integrated with the desktop, does that mean Ubuntu going away with Native gtk apps like Empathy etc?
<brunogirin> QUESTION: what about supporting right to left languages and how it affects layout?
<GuidoPallemans> wuuuuut?
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Track: App Development | SDK Tools & QtCreator | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21768/appdev-1305-sdk-tools/
<udit_> Thanks for the clarification
<udit_> thanks guys for the session
<ne0en> Hi All. i have this bug in qtCreator 2.7 (https://www.dropbox.com/s/15afg52ngjtdugf/qtcreator.png). Any solution. I found just this. http://qt-project.org/forums/viewthread/27610
<andre_> ne0en: is that a no-webkit build?
<GuidoPallemans> we can hear you
<t1mp> I can hear you
<ahayzen> loud and clear :)
<josepht_uds> we hear you
<rafaelmartinez> All is well
<ne0en> i don't know. It's from ppa:ubuntu-sdk-team/ppa.
<rickspencer3> o.
<rickspencer3> oops
<rickspencer3> o/
<GuidoPallemans> Will it be possible to use the Library pane in the Design section of Qt Creator with the ubuntu components?
<mhall119> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/317b938809450301c770a6a40a733504a6543654 if anybody wants to join
<kaliuds> please use QUESTION, it's gonna be hard to spot all questions otherwise
<GuidoPallemans> QUESTION Will it be possible to use the Library pane in the Design section of Qt Creator with the ubuntu components?
<kaliuds> thanks
<rickspencer3> I don't hear an eco
<rickspencer3> fwiw
<fugue88> The youtube stream doesn't have echo.
<christoffer> Neither do I (watching the stream)
<Mirv> GuidoPallemans: currently there is no Design tab support, even though it's visible in the UI. support for such features is later in the roadmap
<GuidoPallemans> ok
<rickspencer3> QUESTION: what is the status of daily quality for QtCreator and the SDK?
<rickspencer3> (I noticed that regressions are common and bug reports are often languish without being actioned)
<GuidoPallemans> indeed, only very simplistic
<brunogirin> QUESTION: at the moment, you can create a new functional test project: are there plans to add the ability to add test files to an existing QML project rather than create a whole new project for your tests?
<rafaelmartinez> QUESTION, for a beginner in developing; Is the documentation and resources on the wiki etc. adequate enough for learning with the changes coming?
<Kaleo> Mirv: you could answer that :)
<mhall119> rickspencer3: do you have specific examples of regressions?
<rickspencer3> yes
<rickspencer3> I was asking about QtCreator and the plugin itself
<GuidoPallemans> FOLLOW-UP but it would be useful to be able to make the high-level structure of the app in the designer, maybe at least support for pagestack and tabs should be added?
<mhall119> rickspencer3: so the plugin itself stopped working?
<rickspencer3> mhall119, yes, often
<rickspencer3> mhall119, and then bug reports languish until I ping someone
<rickspencer3> I think we should have tests that run over QtCreator to test our plugin and that we don't tolerate regressions, basically, daily quality ... treat the SDK as a release
<Kaleo> rickspencer3: +1
<t1mp> +2
<t1mp> so, do with QtCreator what we are doing with the UITK now
<pmcgowan> Mirv is hard to hear
<rickspencer3> is it possible to treat them together as a "release"?
<rickspencer3> built in -proposed, smoke tests, etc...
<rickspencer3> QUESTION ^
<pmcgowan> Kaleo, can you ask mirv to raise his mic
<t1mp> what is the advantage of testing "together" instead of separately?
<t1mp> or: what does it mean to test together?
<rickspencer3> here's an example: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1179716
<udsbotu> Launchpad bug 1179716 in touch-preview-images "QML Scene does not reliably start" [High,New] - Assigned to Juhapekka Piiroinen (juhapekka-piiroinen)
<rickspencer3> yes, they are typically from the Plugin
<rickspencer3> I think that QtCreator is generally very useful now
<pmcgowan> I think its Qt and qtcreator and the plugin is the interesting combo
<pmcgowan> we need  use our apps to test with the toolkit and avoid regressions there
<rickspencer3> so rather than focusing on adding more features, it's time to start ensuring daily quality for what we have?
<Kaleo> pmcgowan: right
<Kaleo> rickspencer3: +1
<Mirv> we currently have JP's work separately at https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu-qtcreator-plugins , and it's manually made into a patch. having it as a separate source package would be a first step to get 'normal' plugin build process
<Mirv> and tests run (which it currently lacks)
<brunogirin> Mirv: yes, that was my next question :-)
<pmcgowan> Mirv, right, plugin needs to be separated
<pmcgowan> can we record that as a work item
<brunogirin> mhall119: more or less yes, a basic (empty) test and a way to run it
<t1mp> the examples will become larger and more complicated if tests are added to the template programs. won't that scare new developers?
<mhall119> t1mp: not if they aren't in the way
<brunogirin> tlmp: not if we keep it simple
<Mirv> pmcgowan: it's there in the etherpad now
<pmcgowan> ty
<pmcgowan> timpI dont think so, good incentive to insert test framework
<Kaleo> http://developer.ubuntu.com/get-started/gomobile/
<Kaleo> rafaelmartinez: ^
<rafaelmartinez> right
<rafaelmartinez> that's what I was referring to
<rafaelmartinez> thanks a bunch
<pmcgowan> yes its doc'd in the roadmap
<pmcgowan> which is a google doc right now, needs to be promoted to the wiki
<andre_> QUESTION: have you ever talked to QtCreator "upstream"?
<rickspencer3> small thing: would be nice if the device tab showed the current build # of Ubuntu Touch on the device
<GuidoPallemans> desired feature: like android (:D) run the app inside the actual operating system. I have run unity next* on my computer today, and it would be nice to just run the app in that (* http://unity.ubuntu.com/getinvolved/development/unitynext/ )
<GuidoPallemans> Maybe jono's remark from yesterday should be added to this sessions' pad: a seperate launcher for ubuntu sdk - qt creator
<mhall119> GuidoPallemans: good idea
<pmcgowan> I added to the items
<pmcgowan> imo we have good contacts with digia and upstream
<Mirv> just to point out, the "JP" we talk about regarding qt creator is jppiiroinen on various channels
<micah2> QUESTION: Has anyone else had problems watching global JS variables declared at the file scope in qtcreator?
<t1mp> micah2: how do you do that? and why? I always declare all my variables inside the qtquick component
<t1mp> micah2: (code example?)
<GuidoPallemans> I had a problem once where my qt localstorage was not yet initialised on a project, is there a way to reset it (this is more qt-side ofc)
<mhall119> micah2: that's better suited to askubuntu.com
<micah2> mhall119: Sorry, just wondering if that was a known issue with qtcreator that needed to be addressed.
<bobweaver> hello
<bobweaver> who's got the bird ?
<mhall119> if there are any last question, best to ask them now before we run out of time
<bobweaver> what session is this ?
<netcurli> SDK Tools & QtCreator
<t1mp> bobweaver: finishing http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21768/appdev-1305-sdk-tools/
<bobweaver> thanks
<t1mp> ah its in the topic :)
<pmcgowan> dpm-uds, there is a single doc
<bobweaver> QUESTION: wh yare you all using json for wizards and what not why  not the wizards.xml and what not ?
<t1mp> mhall119: screenshots will be a lot of work, mainly because the designs are changing a lot
<dpm-uds> thanks pmcgowan, yeah, Florian mentions the SDK tools is simply a tab in that doc
<t1mp> mhall119: I mean if we put the min there manually
<pmcgowan> dpm-uds, we have a document as well with more detail, I can work on it with bz
<pmcgowan> different detail
<denisw> http://qt-project.org/doc/qt-4.8/qcheckbox.html#details has images
<dpm-uds> great, thanks
<mhall119> bobweaver: I don't think there's enough time to answer why/why not questions :(
<bobweaver> QUESTION: why not have debian packaging set up by wizards ?
<mhall119> bobweaver: click packages are the focus going forward
<mhall119> and yes, we discussed using a wizard there
<bobweaver> seems like none of the packaging tools work under build_>ubuntu-> make deb ect
<bobweaver> none of them are working for me on 12.04 I tried last night
<mhall119> worked when I used it
<mhall119> on 13.04
<bobweaver> mhall119,  did you try the ppa that I made ?
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Track: App Development | The next Ubuntu App Showdown | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21710/appdev-1305-app-showdown/
<bobweaver> QUESTIONS: are there going to be tutorials and examples fpr qtcreator  ?
<bobweaver> dang it needed to get out of work faster
<bobweaver> why are thee not on the weeksends when people are not working ?
<bobweaver> weekends*
<dpm-uds> bobweaver, for that question, you might be interested in the last session tomorrow: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/2013-05-16/display
<bobweaver> though I work on weekends also
<bobweaver> thanks dpm-uds
<bobweaver> I thought that people well normal people work from mon-fri ?
<bobweaver> j/s
<bobweaver> anyhow I am just flustered because I missed the one that I really wanted to be at lol
<bobweaver> sorry
<kaliuds> bobweaver: a number of people from canonical need to be here and wouldn't have time on the weekend
<kaliuds> it's difficult to make it work for everyone
<bobweaver> good kaliuds yeah I was flustered
<bobweaver> that is all
<kaliuds> I can understand
<bobweaver> belive me I know all about beeing somewhere at crazy times
<kaliuds> I gotta be doing half the day work and half the extended day is uds
<bobweaver> and kaliuds hate to be devils right hand man here but they had time at non virtual uds
<kaliuds> not that great either
<bobweaver> at any rate I am sure that people see this and it might help in the future :)
<kaliuds> the physical uds was also in the week
<kaliuds> same as now
<kaliuds> you'd have taken vacation then
<kaliuds> personally if I can throw an idea out there, split the sessions in half over more days
<kaliuds> that makes it easier no matter where you are
<mhall119> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/741d3ca226a88664856631cb3360400eb437ab95 if anybody wants to join the hangout itself
<bubbly193> have to install the plugin, on a new Kubuntu install
<t1mp> mhall119: isn't it dangerous to offer potentially unlimited prize money? ;)
<faisal-ali> Considering games are a big part of a mobile ecosystem, shouldn't games be given a separate category in the showdown?
<bobweaver> QUESTION: remember how you all did a 24 hour community google hangout for charity ?  could you tie the 2 together ?
<bioevolgenec> Would a port of an already existing desktop app be acceptable?
<t1mp> what is the "lack of rotation support" blocker? THere is auto rotation in the MainView: file:///home/tim/dev/ubuntu-ui-toolkit/propagated/documentation/html/qml-ubuntu-components0-mainview.html#automaticOrientation-prop
<CheeseBurg> What have missed so far? Have the rules been set?
<bobweaver> just a idea lol
<bobweaver> comon mike !
<t1mp> bobweaver: thanks for volunteering ;)
<dpm-uds> CheeseBurg, http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21710/appdev-1305-app-showdown/
<anvil201> QUESTION: can a developer enter two different apps in the contest? secondly will you accept apps that started development before the start of the contest?
<CheeseBurg> dpm-uds: says I do not have authentication
<labsin_> Does 'No direct file access' only imply on QML?
<t1mp> dpm-uds: I don't immediately see something missing in the list
<dpm-uds> labsin_, yes
<bubbly193> Technical Dificulties
<mhall119> CheeseBurg: join https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-etherpad
<anvil201> ok thanks
<t1mp> QUESTION: are Canonical employees free to join the competition?
<bobweaver> QUESTION: you are talking about qprocess ?  david ?
<CheeseBurg> mhall119: Done. Still can't access the notes.
<kaliuds> labsin_: currently you need C++ for file access
<t1mp> dpm-uds, mhall119 yes, I was assuming apps to be developed in the spare time :)
<mhall119> CheeseBurg: try refreshing now
<CheeseBurg> mhall119: Yea ok works now. THANKS
<t1mp> I'd say if people fix the blockers for their apps, they get bonus points :)
<faisal-ali> QUESTION: Will the judging process be any different from the last showdown?
<CheeseBurg> QUESTION: So is this oonly for phablet apps?
<bobweaver> QUESTION: is the amount of money going to be 10 USD ? this is set in concrete ?
<t1mp> QUESTION: can you explain the judging a bit? Will developers have more chance of winning if they write prettier code?
<t1mp> ^ ok that's already being explained now
<CheeseBurg> IDEA: There should be themes for the next contest. Like a contest purely for games, one for social apps, utility apps, map apps, etc. I understand that this is upcoming contest is for SDK purposes BUT for the next contest, you should have a specific theme, probably in the area that you believe Ubuntu is lacking apps in.
<t1mp> bobweaver: 10 USD PER participating app
<ayr_ton> IDEA: A good enhancement could be give the ability to the editor slit in separated windows. It will improve the productivity of dual head users.
<CheeseBurg> IDEA: I think for the current contest, you should have each form factor as it's own category. Like one for phone apps, tablet apps, desktop apps, and TV apps(?).
<bubbly193> SDK is about creating one program for all Ubuntu foms
<mhall119> bubbly193: +1
<CheeseBurg> But the convergence isn't there yet
<mhall119> CheeseBurg: it's coming
<CheeseBurg> mhall119: This is true.
<faisal-ali> Will a month be enough to address these form factors within our app though?
<ayr_ton> IDEA: A good enhancement could be give the ability to the Qt creator* slit in separated windows. It will improve the productivity of dual head users.
<t1mp> CheeseBurg: I added that to the blockers list. But it will come :)
<CheeseBurg> IDEA: A good prize idea would be the Dell XPS. You can put a condition on it that it will only be available as a prize if x amount of people enter the contest, x being whatever number you want
<bobweaver> IDEA: gift cards to places local or online for prizes
<CheeseBurg> IDEA: Ubuntu swag could also make good prizes
<CheeseBurg> Then just give out nexuses as prizes
<faisal-ali> Featured app?
<bubbly193> Bragging rights
<CheeseBurg> A free add on ubuntu.com homepage
<t1mp> QUESTION: Will you add big adds for the App showdown to http://developer.ubuntu.com/get-started/gomobile/ and http://developer.ubuntu.com/ ?
<t1mp> s/adds/ads
<bobweaver> IDEA: what about Ubuntu Pens or pins for the 10 uds fee. something that will fit the margins
<CheeseBurg> but I think that isn't revelent to many developers
<CheeseBurg> they just want money or stuff
<CheeseBurg> But since the Ubuntu store is so small I figure you need a better pull to get more developers
<CheeseBurg> A month seems fine
<faisal-ali> Any rules regarding teams?
<CheeseBurg> faisal-ali: How could you stop teams?
<faisal-ali> kay
<Robotex> I late. Did theyÂ announceÂ date?
<faisal-ali> Robotex: Sometime August
<CheeseBurg> Robotex: August
<Robotex> it will be mobile apps?
<CheeseBurg> QUESTION: Only open source?
<goddard> that sucks
<goddard> ahh
<dpm-uds> any other last minute questions/feedback?
<Robotex> thank you
<bubbly193> Good day!
<CheeseBurg> I am very excited for the contest
<dpm-uds> excellent
<faisal-ali> nope, thank you
<goddard> thank you!
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/appdev-1/ - http://ubottu.com/udslog/%23ubuntu-uds-appdev-1
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Track: App Development | New API documentation website | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21824/appdev-1305-api-website/
<mhall119> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/2b865e268d0e403c41a0fd12aa4817d8eee11940?authuser=1&hl=en for those who want to join the hangout
<mhall119> we'll go live in a few minutes
<mhall119> and we're live
<mhall119> again, anybody who wants to can jump on the hangout using the link above
<ayr_ton> yes
<goddard> yo yo
<bubbly193> only html/js
<ayr_ton> I'm a web developer.
<mhall119> https://launchpad.net/~api-website-devs
<mhall119> https://code.launchpad.net/~mhall119/ubuntu-api-website/udn
<ayr_ton> We can useÂ html5boilerplate.com
<ayr_ton> for make a responsible design
<bubbly193> I'm joining
<Kaleo> bubbly193!
<mhall119> bubbly193: joining the hangout?
<ayr_ton> Well. I want to help. Which area is good for getting started?
<ayr_ton> frontend? django backend?
<ayr_ton> I could help with the layout, for start.
<bubbly193> I'm in the hangout, i have the mic problems
<bubbly193> ok, as i said, probably my slightly antiquated hardware. Â It's a relatively high end mic
<mhall119> https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.5/
<ayr_ton> I can help with mockup, html, layout and templates.
<mhall119> ayr_ton: what's your launchpad username?
<ayr_ton> mhall119: ayrton
<bubbly193> I can also help with HTML
<bubbly193> mhall119: Bubbly193
<ayr_ton> mhall119: ok. No problem. I can ping the design team later.
<bashrc> I found that the documentation for the application indicator and messaging menu API is out of date
<bashrc> ok
<ayr_ton> mhall119: Ok. Can you send me his e-mail?
<bashrc> cool
<ayr_ton> mhall119: I can help with juju charm too.
<ayr_ton> I'm doing some learn of juju charms recently.
<ayr_ton> mhall119: ayrton@ubuntu.com
<nik90> ayr_ton: you should join the hangout since you seem to be more involved in this
<mhall119> ayr_ton: yes, if you can, please join
<mhall119> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/2b865e268d0e403c41a0fd12aa4817d8eee11940?authuser=1&hl=en
<ayr_ton> nik90, mhall119: I would like it. But no camera or mic here at this time.
<ayr_ton> ;~
<nik90> too bad
<bubbly193> A working mic
<ayr_ton> one sec
<mhall119> ayr_ton: can you try saying something?
<bubbly193> is canonicalÂ requiringÂ W3C standards be kept?
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Track: App Development | Core Apps in Ubuntu Touch preview images | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21709/appdev-1305-touch-image-coreapps/
<bubbly193> having problems conecting to the youtube vidoe, very frozen
<pmcgowan> Question: mhall119 would it make more sense to pull the terminal and file manager in with other developer tools?
<thomi|uds> Why can't we run those autopilot tests on the PS hardware & setup?
<bubbly193> i'm back
<pmcgowan> no
<pmcgowan> like when we grab the dev tools for compilation etc
<pmcgowan> with qtc
<pmcgowan> and qt5 devel version etc
<pmcgowan> suggestion that we have apps ux designers review them as well
<pmcgowan> to approve their inclusion
<pmcgowan> and we should do code audit with other app devs or sdk devs
<pmcgowan> qtc loads it to the device
<pmcgowan> there is an option
<pmcgowan> for native compile now
<pmcgowan> this delay is tough
<victorp> rsalveti, +1 to installing them by default until GA
<victorp> although you could argue that 13.10 is a developer release anywya
<rsalveti> right
<rsalveti> but yeah, let's have them now
<pmcgowan> folks on apps team mhall119
<pmcgowan> olivier, ugo, guenther
<pmcgowan> right
<pmcgowan> same guidelines I would say for collection
<pmcgowan> sergiusens, some collection apps could be included by default
<pmcgowan> using same criteria
<pmcgowan> hmm
<victorp> pmcgowan, you should join the hangout
<pmcgowan> no headset
<victorp> damn!
<victorp> :)
<sergiusens> pmcgowan: I don't have one either
<sergiusens> pmcgowan: g+ does a good job at echo cancellation
<victorp> pmcgowan, agreed on the CLA
<victorp> sure
<victorp> but no CLA
<victorp> :)
 * victorp just adding a T50
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/appdev-1/ - http://ubottu.com/udslog/%23ubuntu-uds-appdev-1
#ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 2013-05-16
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Track: App Development | SDK UI Toolkit Responsive Layouting | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21769/appdev-1305-ui-toolkit-responsive-layouting/
<mhall119> will be starting momentarily, problems with the new Google+ hangouts
<ckpringle> I can't see any video?
<t1mp_> ckpringle: me neither. 16:01:39 < mhall119> will be starting momentarily, problems with the new Google+ hangouts
<mhall119> ckpringle: google hangout changes are causing problems
<mhall119> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/d90216735cd879f59d9e8f946686ba5825835887?authuser=1&hl=en for anybody who wants to join
<ckpringle> mhall119: :(
<mhall119> going live
<ckpringle> mhall119: \o/
<ckpringle> Please stand by.
<aquarius_uds> woo responsive layout!
<aquarius_uds> make it so.
<alecu> no "lower third" today?
<mhall119> alecu: working on that
<alecu> awesome!
<fugue88> mhall119: Yes, but takes a while to repaint.
<aquarius_uds> can you talk about how you propose to do this, from code? What does an app developer do to take advantage of it?
<t1mp_> QUESTION: ^
<dobey> extending on aquarius_uds's question, sill there be a signal to tell the app what form factor the app is running on, when switching between form factors for the converged device plan?
<t1mp_> aquarius_uds: here you can see how you would use it http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~gerboland/+junk/googleio-layout/view/head:/googleio.qml
<fugue88> dobey: I suppose that would be sufficient to handle screen rotation as well.  But maybe not?
<aquarius_uds> I have now seen the demo code, which I had not seen when I asked the question
<dobey> fugue88: i think qt already has a way to signal screen rotation?
 * fugue88 doesn't know
<Yotota> QUESTION : What you show is made with "item".I think we should allow the "pagestack" to easily display more than one page at the same time for tablets. On smartphone we'd have one page after the other, on tablet we could display two pages or more at the same time.
<aquarius_uds> I don't think we need rotation for this. What's the difference between "this window got rotated" and "this window got resized from 480x800 to 800x480"?
<dobey> so it will just be automatic, and the app provides N different layouts for N different device/layout types?
<t1mp_> zsombor turned into a giant tennis ball
<dobey> aquarius_uds: viewing angle
<alecu> aquarius_uds: the only difference is subpixel antialiasing, but I guess qml should handle that automatically
<netcurli> dat tennis ball
<pmcgowan> mhall119 zsombi we are not seeing the code
<pmcgowan> ok now we are
<Yotota> +1 aquarius_uds we don't need rotation, the window size is sufficient.
<dobey> i disagree
<fugue88> QUESTION: What happens when no layout's constraints match the current screen?  Or is that situation prevented statically?
<aquarius_uds> dobey: that's how I think it should work, yes: the app provides as many different layouts as it thinks are reasonable. (The same as responsive web design. You make breakpoints.)
<pmcgowan> sorry we can now
<fugue88> We can barely read the code window on youtube.
<aquarius_uds> fugue88: if no layouts match this screen, then nothing would display, right? The same as if I don't put any layouts at all :)
<alex-abreu> zsombi, that's fine it works now
<dobey> aquarius_uds: a signal is still useful though, in the event that apps want to do other things that aren't displayed, for different layouts
<fugue88> aquarius_uds: I'd consider that a bad thing.
<fugue88> I could see some devs not considering that something might run on, for example, a larger screen than the dev himself has.
<dobey> aquarius_uds: if you don't add any layouts, then you have 1 layout (or you haven't written an app)
<fugue88> Hmm.
<aquarius_uds> fugue88: what should happen if I do this: import QtQuick 2.0; Rectangle { color: "red"; Rectangle { color: "blue" } } ? I have given no indication where those rectangles should be, so they don't show anywhere.
<aquarius_uds> that's the way QML works.
<aquarius_uds> dobey: agreed that you should get a signal if your screen size changes, totally.
<fugue88> Well, that'd be good.  I don't know QML.
<aquarius_uds> but I agree with Kaleo_ and mhall119 -- people should not be saying "is this a tablet?", they should be saying "is this an 800px screen? does the list of inputs include touch?"
<dobey> Kaleo_: form factor is important for input device types, and such. it's a corner case, but still a valid requirement for apps to know about :)
<madjr> hmm
<aquarius_uds> yes. Apologies. "am I an 800px window?", not "is this an 800px screen" :-)
<madjr> I think on phablet mode, no desktop mode apps should be available
<dobey> it shouldn't matter if the screen (or window) is 800px or 1600px
<Kaleo_> Yotota: the PageStack will do that automatically in time
<alecu> aquarius_uds: "am I a 40 grid units window?"
<dobey> also not useful
<aquarius_uds> alecu: yes. One day I will remember abotu grid units. ;)
<alecu> dobey: I don't understand. why not?
<dobey> alecu: because of differences in DPI. 300dpi tablet will have more grid units than a 100dpi 23" monitor :)
<fugue88> Doesn't that defeat the purpose of grid-units?
<fugue88> dobey: ^
<aquarius_uds> dobey: that's what grid units are meant to cater for.
<Limurx> Is it planned to provide a phablet and desktop UI for every application or will one application for the one and one for the other?
<dobey> what's the url for that wiki page about the grid units?
<Kaleo_> Limurx: prefix with QUESTION
<Kaleo_> Limurx: we'll take your question next
<Limurx> k thanks
<Yotota> +1 for user-made template library
<t1mp_> dobey: not wiki, but I guess you want this https://developer.ubuntu.com/api/ubuntu-12.10/qml/mobile/resolution-independence.html
<dobey> timright, that
<Kaleo_> Yotota: generally speaking we want to have a staging/extras repository containing experimental components that people want to share but that are not ready for inclusion in the toolkit
<aquarius_uds> QUESTION: can't LayoutManager just examine all the Layouts and confirm that they are mutually exclusive, and if not, display a warning or something? That would cater for "no layouts apply to the current window" *and* "two layouts apply to the current window"
<dobey> anyway, a gu is just an arbitrary number of px. so it will vary across screens. using "am I X gu?" is equally not as useful as "am I X px?"
<Yotota> Kaleo: That's a good idea :)
<aquarius_uds> dobey: but your 300dpi screen device will have a different definition of a gu than your 100dpi device does
<aquarius_uds> dobey:that's the point. :)
<dobey> aquarius_uds: yes, but it doesn't mean that X gu is the full width of the screen (assuming full screen everywhere).
<Kaleo_> dobey: gu is compatible with something like metres
<dobey> aquarius_uds: thus it's not a useful measurement for determining layout changes :)
<Kaleo_> dobey: which means it is useful for determining layout changes
<Yotota> QUESTION: Is it plan to have a simulator to simulate different screen densities ?
<madjr> @Limurx I think all windowed apps should be tied to desktop (desktop mode = true)
<aquarius_uds> Kaleo_, mhall119, zsombi: yes. That is why I think the LayoutManager should be smart. Detect whether more than one could be true or if none could be true, and *tell the developer*.
<dobey> Kaleo_: comaptible and a constant portion of, are not the same thing :)
<Kaleo_> dobey: ok
<fugue88> I think first-match is good enough.
<Kaleo_> dobey: I'll be more precise then
<dobey> Kaleo_: the best solution is to not rely on gu or px at all, for determining layout change. so a layout change signal would obviously be best
<aquarius_uds> Kaleo_, mhall119, zsombi: so I start up my app and it says "WARNING: there is no layout available for screens wider than 80gu. WARNING: there are two layouts available when screen width is less than 15gu."
<christoffer> anyone got the link for the hangout or is it full?
<alecu> Kaleo_: on a tv, I probably want two columns instead of the three columns I get on a laptop. So I guess dobey's critique stands.
<dobey> for instance, "am i 10 gu?" doesn't tell me if my app is in the sidebar, or if i'm just on a low dpi device
<zsombi> christoffer: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/d90216735cd879f59d9e8f946686ba5825835887?authuser=1&hl=en
<dobey> mhall119: gu will have to change on fly if convergence is going to work
<Kaleo_> dobey: 1 GU always has the same visual perceived size
<Kaleo_> dobey: regardless of the device
<fugue88> dobey: Oh, now there's a good example.  I agree that "modality" would be necessary to know, but I still think gu dimensions are as well.
<dobey> Kaleo_: i have hardware that breaks that assumption :)
<Kaleo_> dobey: which?
<mhall119> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/d90216735cd879f59d9e8f946686ba5825835887?authuser=1&hl=en
<dobey> my fujitsu laptop
<fugue88> dobey: And how does your fujitsu laptop violate it?
<t1mp_> whois fugue88
<t1mp_> +/
<t1mp_> :)
<fugue88> :)
<fugue88> David Owen
<dobey> fugue88: there's no clarification of what a "retina laptop" is
<Kaleo_> dobey: join the hangout
<aquarius_uds> QUESTION: why can't I name an item to be placed in a layout by id rather than Layout.name? (When the answer is "because QML won't recognise the ID if it's in another qml file", have we thought about changing that, upstream?)
<madjr> QUESTION: you think is best not to allow traditional "windowed" desktop apps in phablet mode?
<fugue88> dobey: What's that have to do with anything?  Does your laptop have a higher DPI in one part of the screen than the other?
<mhall119> aquarius_uds: join the hangout
<aquarius_uds> mhall119: I'd rather dobey's objection was sorted out than mine :)
<fugue88> dobey: Join the hangout!  :)
<dobey> fugue88: it's only 1280x800, but it's only 5.6" screen
<dobey> i'm trying
<mhall119> aquarius_uds: which objection was that/
<Yotota> madjir  : If someone whant to use windowed apps I'd would just switch to desktop mode, but this mode should be default only when docked.
<Kaleo_> ckpringle: you can answer madjr's question :)
<Yotota> *want
<ckpringle> aquarius_uds: oh hai
<fugue88> dobey: So this is less of "I have hardware" where "1 GU always has the same visual perceived size", and more of "I have hardware that I classify as 'retina' but doesn't fit the *general* guidlines on the linked doc."
<fugue88> s/always/doesn't always/
<ckpringle> madjr: was that what you meant?
<Yotota> There are loader to load external qml file and signal to communicate between them so it's ok
<madjr> Yes like gimp or mouse oriented apps
<fugue88> (And that is exactly why I think X should go back to reporting real DPI, not the "96 dpi" lie.)   ;)
<madjr> agree they should be kept to desktop mode only
<ckpringle> madjr: right.
<ckpringle> :)
<fugue88> aquarius_uds: Another level of indirection will solve all our problems.  :P
 * aquarius_uds drops off again
<fugue88> dobey: That depends on how the size of a gu is determined.
<fugue88> Kaleo_: So, how is the gu size in pixels determined for a specific device?  Is hardware queried (like X querying EDID info), or by someone saying "I know this is a TV, so..."
<fugue88> Or by the user...
<aquarius_uds> fugue88: it should be done as part of the release of Ubuntu for that device.
<fugue88> aquarius_uds: Ouch.  So every new handheld or pluggable monitor will need custom info in a database, and some off-brand that nobody else has falls by the wayside?
<madjr> 5" laptop ? I wonder what can you do with that ?
<aquarius_uds> fugue88: a new handheld device will need to have a specific build anyway. I am not sure what the plan is on a converged device with monitors.
<fugue88> Because I can go buy a 7" device with a DPI of 100, and I can buy another right next to it on the shelf with a DPI of 250.
<fugue88> And they're basically the same platform.
<Yotota> fugue88 :yes and grid layout are here to make same the same layout
<Yotota> *grid unit sorry
<Yotota> they will both have the same amount of grid unit
<madjr> what apps do you usually run on an 5" laptop? to work on it i would usually plug it to a monitor
<fugue88> Well, right now we're getting different stories on this.  Mostly, I think the confusion is how "pixels per gu" is determined by device.
<fugue88> If we follow strictly the doc at https://developer.ubuntu.com/api/ubuntu-12.10/qml/mobile/resolution-independence.html (which I don't think the intention is), dobey's complaint stands.
<fugue88> If we query displays for DPI and calculate gu size based on that, it goes away, modulu concerns about viewing distance.
<dobey> fugue88: and broken displays
<fugue88> dobey: Yes, definitely.
<fugue88> Which might include every TV.
<dobey> there's a good reason that most every PS3 game asks me to resize/adjust screen settings when i put it in :-/
<fugue88> I wouldn't mind going through that process for a display.
<michelR> QUESTION : an Ubuntu touch app started on desktop will be full screen ? in a window ?
<dobey> michelR: up to app author but should probably be a window in most cases
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Track: App Development | Core Apps plans for 13.10 | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21817/appdev-s-coreapps-plans/
<alex-abreu> great session
<alecu> bye!
<dobey> bye
<mhall119> If anybody wants to join ghe Core Apps Plans hangout: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/9d84b48b6e659cdab7ffd5f0caa3dc2ada095f4e?authuser=0&hl=en
 * balloons waves
<CheeseBurg> mhall119: Is there a session this UDS to talk about the future of the software center or is there a person I can talk to outside UDS about it.
<CheeseBurg> Jono: I have, a couple of times lol
<CheeseBurg> Ok, makes sense
<CheeseBurg> I think one or two games in the core apps would be good to have.
<CheeseBurg> Simple games like sedoku
<thomi> Ugh - I missed the start, but I see autopilot has been mentioned - I'd suggest we push to have apps tested before we include them - is that the plan already?
<balloons> thomi, indeed
<balloons> autopilot is intended to be part of the gateway to including them in the image
<thomi> it is? awesome
<CheeseBurg> Also having similar to the newstand and bookshelf like iOS has would be very nice. An app the hold all our books/PDFs and can update with the latest issues of things
<thomi> is there anything we can do on the autopilot side to help app devs write autopilot tests?
<ppisati> just installed latest phablet img on a nexus7 but, for example, the weather app is a still image, am i missing something or what?
<mhall119> ppisati: what version of the image did you use?
<balloons> atm, we're working with the select applications that are ready to go
<fginther> mhall119, thomi getting autopilot tests to run automatically for each MP or on a package will take some infrastructure work
<mhall119> balloons: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/9d84b48b6e659cdab7ffd5f0caa3dc2ada095f4e?authuser=0&hl=en
<fginther> but it's a problem that can be solved
<thomi> fginther: what about dfaily runs?
<balloons> sadly I can't join both hangouts at once..
<balloons> stuck hosting
<thomi> fginther: right - phones are cheap
<ppisati> mhall119: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5671125/
<ppisati> uhm
<ppisati> way does it say 21 feb?
<ppisati> *why
<balloons> fginther, thomi I haven't spoken with sergio, but the goal is to get a jenkins setup for the autopilot tests
<thomi> surely we already have a jenkins machine set up, we just need more hardware?
<balloons> for the core apps that is.. martin was helping him with that, and I'll be checking on it after uds
<thomi> cool
<thomi> well, it sounds like people are on our side of things anyway :)
<balloons> hehe ;-)
<fginther> thomi, I think it's mostly tooling work to get it working. Our current tools for testing autopilot from our jenkins use libvirt, which we don't have for the core apps jenkins
<balloons> in theory the test authors will supply the ap tests, and the community will help supply the manual tests and testing
<thomi> fginther: oh, I assumed we'd run tests on real hardware
<balloons> so you want a blueprint just for these apps.. heh.. I'll revive the blueprint we had on this
<balloons> we can create a topic that includes the blueprint if you wish
<balloons> I already have a quality community topic
<fginther> thomi, hmm. There may be a reason why we don't want to use real hw, but I can't think of one at the moment.
<fginther> thomi, there is a bp workitem to solve this the autopilot testing gap
<thomi> I'm imagining a reasonably large library of hardware covering the devices we want to test against.
<thomi> fginther: got the link? or maybe you could subscribe me?
<fginther> thomi, http://pad.ubuntu.com/uds-1305-appdev-1305-touch-image-coreapps
<fginther> thomi, I guess it's not in a bp yet
<thomi> fginther: ok, thanks
<balloons> jonobacon, sure.. let's keep it on one or two blueprints if we can.. and the burndown will happen by lumping it as a topic
<balloons> i'll add a work item here on the blueprint for it
<balloons> there's about a minute or so delay
<balloons> sadly
<balloons> and don't worry thomi, I'll make sure there's some work items on there for the autopilot stuff.. making sure jenkins gets setup, docs are good and created, etc :-)
<nik90> mhall119: hi..just got home
<balloons> nik90, hello :-)
<nik90> balloons: hi
<balloons> fginther, ohh is there already some work items to track setting up a jenkins for this?
<balloons> got a link to the bp?
<fginther> balloons, just the etherpad for now: http://pad.ubuntu.com/uds-1305-appdev-1305-touch-image-coreapps
<balloons> fginther, ahh ok.. So I might just lump that existing bp for any autopilot stuff that's identified
<balloons> thanks
<Yotota> I think we should define how to access theme color asap before every dev hardcode color & backgrounds and make unthemable apps.
<balloons> ohh, could we have a big testing event for the 1.0 - final apps?
<balloons> mhall119, ^^
<balloons> ok, so build out all the tests needed, then have a big test-a-thon in sept?
<CheeseBurg> So after 13.10 will we start making the core apps have the ability to transform into desktop apps, you know the convergence idea.
<CheeseBurg> But all these phone to desktop work will be done ADTER 13.10 releases, right?
<CheeseBurg> AFTER*
<mhall119_uds> yes
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Track: App Development | LoCo Team Coding Challenge | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/meeting/21708/appdev-1305-loco-code/
<mhall119> If anybody wants to join the hangout, here's the link: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/869a0280f6d9a238644ab4d51ddadd3d7cd5a554?authuser=0&hl=en
<bioevolgenec> member of Greek loco team here
<bioevolgenec> There are a few developers in our team, but we haven't started anything about the Ubuntu phone yet.
<bobweaver> most the time at my loco events I end up helping user just set up there ubuntu/whatever flash ect. no one is dev but me. also we get people that yell about how bad unity is
<bioevolgenec> Mostly Python, a bit of Java and C++.
<bioevolgenec> Well, we have some very excited people and I believe classes over the summer will be helpful.
<bioevolgenec> Yes, exactly. Workshops on the new technologies, scope-writing, QML etc
<bobweaver> Upstate NY
<bobweaver> mhall119,  ^^
<Chris_gagnon-uds> I was hoping for a contest :P
<bobweaver> no deals around these parts mhall119
<bioevolgenec> At some point, members of our loco team had discussed on the possibility of a contest on Ubuntu contribution. Something that could be done via Launchpad, such as finding and fixing bugs, translating, writing code...
<bobweaver> mhall119,  say marco
<bioevolgenec> Just for Ubuntu-gr. I believe we would be overwhelmed with anything bigger.
<mhall119_uds> just said it
<bobweaver> mhall119,  polo
<bobweaver> that is delay
<bobweaver> pay me to write some lol
<bobweaver> hackfest at local collage's
<bobweaver> flyers at xerox and RIT MIT ect
<bobweaver> barcamp would be a good place to start
<bobweaver> hackers for hacks ect
<bobweaver> most people use apple though that thouse things
<bobweaver> just being honest
<bobweaver> yeah here they do but not in the wild
<bobweaver> truth they all use things like mac and windows '
<mhall119> bobweaver: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/9d84b48b6e659cdab7ffd5f0caa3dc2ada095f4e?authuser=0&hl=en
<bobweaver> mhall119,  that party is over
<bobweaver> yeah I will
<bobweaver> let me get dressed
<mhall119> good idea ;)
<bobweaver> mhall119,  http://imagebin.org/257853
<mhall119> bobweaver: try https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/869a0280f6d9a238644ab4d51ddadd3d7cd5a554?authuser=0&hl=en
* udsbotu changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 to: Currently no events are active in this room - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1305/appdev-1/ - http://ubottu.com/udslog/%23ubuntu-uds-appdev-1
<mhall119> dpm-uds: are you running this one?
<dpm> mhall119, yeah, setting up the hangout now
<dpm> mhall119, https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/a2144a6defbf8b6db6189cd0daa0c87de1c54b72
#ubuntu-uds-appdev-1 2013-05-17
<sharif> helo
<sharif> anyone
<sharif> Ubuntu and Canonical help me
<sharif> hello
<sharif> ubuntu firefoz is best
<sharif> firefox is best
