#ubuntu-design 2011-11-21
<mainerror> mpt: Fixed a problem with the Ubuntu color palettes. Apparently they were not saved correctly which resulted in Inkscape not recognizing them. http://askubuntu.com/questions/80864/why-doesnt-inkscape-recognize-the-ubuntu-color-palettes/81177#81177
<mainerror> In that answer I have a link to the fixed versions.
<prokoudine_> hi folks
<prokoudine_> I'm told that the Ubuntu palette file we ship with Inkscape is outdated
<prokoudine_> I wanted to update it, but you have me at loss
<prokoudine_> I only see two small-ish .gpl files
<prokoudine_> What would you advice me to do?
<doctormon> hey prokoudine_
<doctormon> prokoudine_: The colour pallet is small, do you have upload rights to package/inkscape trunk? I forget where the pallet is shipped.
<prokoudine_> sure I have :)
<prokoudine_> it's in share/palettes
<prokoudine_> I'm not even sure it makes a lot of sense shipping such a small palette
<prokoudine_> I mean, 5 colors?
<prokoudine_> hmmm
<doctormon> prokoudine_: You could take a bunch of different os/brand pallets and stick them together if you like.
<doctormon> Although I agree in principle that shipping them in the inkscape package is a bit unhealthy.
<doctormon> It'd be nice to have them in a package, but inkscape doesn't scan the file directory for pallets yet.
<doctormon> s/package/repository/
<prokoudine_> that doesn't sound like a sensible solution to me
<doctormon> s/the file directory/place where you opened a file/
<prokoudine_> of course it does scan
<doctormon> It does?
<prokoudine_> for ages :)
<prokoudine_> sure
<doctormon> Never mind, problem solved let's go home.
<prokoudine_> since 2007 or so
<prokoudine_> :)
<prokoudine_> just to make sure...
<prokoudine_> do you absolutely want the old palette gone from the default bundle?
<prokoudine_> or kepp, but renam somehopw?
<prokoudine_> keep
<doctormon> prokoudine_: Ask the committer too.
<prokoudine_> the who? :)
<doctormon> Is this in the package or the trunk?
<prokoudine_> the palette file is in releases since 0.46 or so
<prokoudine_> timestamp: Sun 2006-06-25 21:11:16 +0000
<prokoudine_> message:
<prokoudine_>   Add ubuntu palette, closes 1510556.
<doctormon> prokoudine_: So who first committed the file?
<prokoudine_> colin marquadt
<prokoudine_> cmarqu
<YoBoY> 5 colors ? the guidelines let us use also "tints", % of the primary colors, put that in the palette too :)
<YoBoY> hi
<doctormon> Hmm I can't find that bug report.
<doctormon> YoBoY: It's 39 colours.
<doctormon> prokoudine_: So ask cmarqu, if we can come up with a better solution.
<prokoudine_> doctormon, because it's from SourceForge
<prokoudine_> doctormon, we moved the tracker, remember? :0
<prokoudine_> :)
<sladen> pleia2: now, what was it that you wanted
<doctormon> Yes, yes, I didn't think it was that old, but you're right
<sladen> sorry, I was away for the weekend and seem to have fallen off
<dholbach> good morning
<mainerror> prokoudine_: Make sure to use my fixed version of the palette files.
<mainerror> sladen: Fixed a problem with the Ubuntu color palettes. Apparently they were not saved correctly which resulted in Inkscape not recognizing them. http://askubuntu.com/questions/80864/why-doesnt-inkscape-recognize-the-ubuntu-color-palettes/81177#81177
<mainerror> Sent this message to mpt already but I just want to make sure you guys see that. It would be good if you could update archive on design.canonical.com with the fixed version.
<sladen> mainerror: oooh.  What needs uploading?
<sladen> mainerror: if I click on  http://ubuntuone.com/6Nu8txdB2qVdk2PL8mphfO  I get "Could not locate object"
<mainerror> The archive with the fixed color palette files here: http://ubuntuone.com/6Nu8txdB2qVdk2PL8mphfO
<sladen> mainerror: I'm still seeing "Could not locate object".  Is there a permissions setting that needs adjusting?
<mainerror> The original files didn
<mainerror> *didn't work because of some weird tabulator character or something. I jsut resaved them
<mainerror> Oh great ...
<mainerror> http://ubuntuone.com/2Qzs497M4URoYGBr538bcz
<mainerror> This should work.
<sladen> mainerror: could you click on  http://launchpad.net/ubuntu-branding/+filebug?field.title=Broken+Inkscape+Palette+file+on+design.c.com
<sladen> mainerror: then you'll get the credit
<mainerror> Alright. I'm on it.
<sladen> include links to   http://askubuntu.com/questions/80864/why-doesnt-inkscape-recognize-the-ubuntu-color-palettes/81177#81177  http://ubuntuone.com/2Qzs497M4URoYGBr538bcz  and  the current download location that needs replacing
<sladen> the bad file seems to be linked from  http://design.canonical.com/the-toolkit/ubuntu-logo-and-circle-of-friends/
<sladen> specifically  http://design.canonical.com/brand/Tools/colour_palettes/gimp_palettes.zip
<sladen> bkerensa: pleia2:  http://www.flickr.com/photos/ubuntu-us-ca/6087644982/  Did that get filed?
<sladen> bkerensa: pleia2 (I don't want to accidently lose it.  If not, please could you file a bug at  http://launchpad.net/ubuntu-branding/+filebug?field.title=Publish+Ubuntu+11.10+banner+layouts+as+PDF
<sladen> or similiar
<mainerror> sladen: Done. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-branding/+bug/893049
<webbugs> Launchpad bug 893049 in ubuntu-branding "Broken Inkscape Palette file on design.c.com" [Undecided,New]
<mainerror> Uploaded the archive as an attachment. Seems to be the more permanent solution. :)
<sladen> certainly sensible as it keeps the fix with the bug report itself
<sladen> mainerror: to take the Readme file, please could you complete+submit  https://forms.canonical.com/contributor/
<mainerror> Done.
<sladen> mainerror: ta
<mainerror> This feels pretty good. I mean fixing things. :)
<sladen> nuthinking: trying to upload the replacement .zip for  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-branding/+bug/893049  Am I being an idiot?  I can't find the original file in the the media library
<webbugs> Launchpad bug 893049 in ubuntu-branding "Broken Inkscape Palette file on design.c.com" [Undecided,In progress]
<nuthinking> sladen: checking....
<sladen> nuthinking: my thinking is that although the file exists, the /indexing/ of that file by Wordpress probably broke during that upgrade a few months back that caused similiar issues
<nuthinking> we need to check with steve
<nuthinking> sladen: but wait a sec, I think there is another way to upload files
<mainerror> Good god. What a pin to upload that file.
<mainerror> pain*
<AlanBell> afternoon all
<mainerror> Afternoon.
<pleia2> sladen (and bkerensa), bug created: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-branding/+bug/893200
<webbugs> Launchpad bug 893200 in ubuntu-branding "Publish Ubuntu 11.10 banner layouts as PDF" [Undecided,New]
<pleia2> sorry, I thought bkerensa was creating it
<sladen> pleia2: where do you want it uploading?
<pleia2> sladen: hmm, not sure
<pleia2> it's related to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuAtConferences/ApprovedTeamGift since it's the same banner, but that doesn't feel quite right as the place to link it
<mainerror> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-branding/+bug/893212
<webbugs> Launchpad bug 893212 in ubuntu-branding "Ubuntu animal logos should be downloadable in toolkit." [Undecided,New]
<mainerror> sladen: You're my hero! :)
<czajkowski> wendar: ello
<wendar> czajkowski: hiya
<czajkowski> wendar: you free some time this to hop on skype for a chat re some stuff that we mentioned in the CC meeting ?
<czajkowski> *week
<sladen> evening wendar
<czajkowski> sladen: ello my dear :)
<wendar> czajkowski: yup, the next hour is totally free, then have meetings for a bit, then free again
<mainerror> Hello wendar.
<czajkowski> wendar: perhaps after the meeting, dinner is being cooked for me and I'm starving!
<wendar> sladen: good morning
<czajkowski> wendar: I'm lauraczajkowski on skype add me and I'll sign in a wee bit and add you
<wendar> mainerror: hi
<wendar> I'm allisonrandal on skype
<wendar> will start it up now
<czajkowski> grand job
<wendar> (and get a refresh on coffee :)
<wendar> czajkowski: 1-2pm US Pacific is the meeting, which in UK is...
<czajkowski> um it's 18:53 right now
<czajkowski> I really need to add an applet that shows all the times
<wendar> 9pm
<wendar> 9-10pm
<wendar> too late
<czajkowski> nope that's fine
<wendar> okay, cool
<czajkowski> great talk then
<czajkowski> wendar: when ever your free later let me know
<wendar> czajkowski: free now
<czajkowski> wendar: ok
<wendar> I'll go grab my headset...
<czajkowski> wendar: sounds good
<doctormon> cjohnston: ping
<doctormon> msg bkerensa hey
<doctormon> bkerensa: hello
<bkerensa> doctormon: ping pong :D
#ubuntu-design 2011-11-22
<wendar> created a doodle poll to look for a time to catch up on ubuntu-design bits: http://www.doodle.com/tvvgx4ivru7s7hsx
<wendar> (I put it as next week, because this week is already started, and a bit messy with a holiday in the US)
<cjohnston> doctormon: im kind-of around
<dholbach> good morning
<thorwil> moin
 * thorwil wonders if a doctormon is something like a pokemon or digimon
<doctormon> thorwil: More like a mon
<doctormon> Although I can't help reading thorwil as Thor's Will.
<thorwil> heh, i approve of that :)
<AlanBell> morning all
<doctormon> hey AlanBell
<AlanBell> still one place left for the London christmas dinner
<doctormon> AlanBell: I still have my place there right?
<AlanBell> you do indeed
<AlanBell> there is still an opportunity for someone to sit next to the great doctormon
<doctormon> AlanBell: There are canonical designers who I need to have lunch with anyway, have you gotten any of themt o come?
<AlanBell> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1409/detail/
<AlanBell> they have been invited but I think popey is the only canonical employee on the list
<mainerror> Friday, 9th December. That is my birthday.
<mainerror> You guys just reminded me of it.
<AlanBell> come to London for a special birthday treat \o/
<mainerror> It's a bit too far for me otherwise I would join you for sure. :)
<AlanBell> I was talking to that venue about doing a private event at lunchtime including an in the dark installfest
<AlanBell> see if the desktop team can install their desktop on a blacked out computer
<doctormon> AlanBell: Listing Popey as a canonical employee who is coming to your loco event is like listing Mark as a debian contributor. Technicallity.
<mainerror> We have to get the wiki team introduction done.
<mainerror> Oh wow, just realized that I don't have the Ubuntu design toolkit in the resources collection. Gotta fix that.
<mainerror> Fixed.
<doctormon> thansk mainerror, you've been really great with the resource page :-)
<mainerror> This might be interesting for you as well. I'm already inscribed.http://www.hci-class.org/
<doctormon> wendar, bkerensa, mainerror, AlanBell, cjohnston: http://imagebin.org/185133
<doctormon> We now have a website project as shown in the screenshot https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-design-website
<doctormon> there is lots of work to do, any and all help would be most welcome.
<doctormon> thorwil: Do you have any ideas for what we should use for branding for the ubuntu design team?
<thorwil> doctormon: cad-style drawing / blue-print of a U, maybe half-way filled
<thorwil> though i would consider to have no symbol and not much of anything else
<thorwil> the shape-less shapers
<thorwil> hmm, a shape that, read from left to right, transforms from a blob into a geometric form
<yaili> doctormon: hi
<yaili> doctormon: where is this site going to live?
<AlanBell> cross referencing the doodle poll so far and the people sabdfl wanted involved it would be good to find out when johnlea, mika, calum, mpt are available
<AlanBell> I suspect the current popular choice of 5PM UK time might not be their preferred time
<doctormon> hey yaili!
<yaili> doctormon: hi
<doctormon> thorwil: Yes, I tried a grid and thought about a part-construction.
<doctormon> AlanBell: Unless it was at a pub?
<AlanBell> dunno if we succeeded in dragging any of them out to the pub last time
<AlanBell> next London pub meet is in Surbiton on the 8th December
<yaili> doctormon: did you see my question?
<doctormon> yaili: We don't have a site yet, when it's working, it'll maybe go to design.ubuntu.com
<sladen> doctormon: I thought the vague idea was to move  design.canonical.com  over to  design.ubuntu.com and open up the access list to the wider Ubuntu Design community in the process
<sladen> doctormon: is the  https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-design-website  more for about making tools?
<doctormon> sladen: Yes and that still might happen and work out well.
<doctormon> the design.canonical.com is static and blog right now right?
<sladen> AlanBell: people are generally in the office until ~18:00
<sladen> doctormon: it's Wordpress.  Some separately mapped static content is mapped to  http://design.canonical.com/brand
<doctormon> sladen: Sounds good
<yaili> doctormon: would this have any parallel with http://ubuntustudio.org/ ?
<yaili> doctormon: are these two projects similar in objectives?
<doctormon> yaili: No, ubuntu studio is a distro, it's more perpendicular.
<yaili> doctormon: but shouldn't there still be a shared effort? aren't both trying to attract the same kind of user?
<doctormon> yaili: One is a meta of the other and visa versa provides tools to the latter. They're not the same.
<sladen> yaili: Ubuntu Studio is something like Kubuntu, Xubuntu, Lubuntu, â¦
<yaili> sladen: I understand what you're saying
<AlanBell> sladen: thats great, I was just concerned that we might end up picking a bad time for the key people who we want to get involved
<yaili> doctormon: I know they're not the same, but they are catering for the same needs
<doctormon> yaili: No they're not.
<doctormon> The Ubuntu Design website is specifically online tools used for design. Ubuntu studio is desktop tools for any creative type.
<AlanBell> I thought studio was about audio production with a realtime kernel
<sladen> doctormon: perhaps if you share examples it would highlight the differences more easily?
<sladen> doctormon: I can certainly see why genericially "assembling tools for creative people" would get apply to many things, and so provide confusion
<doctormon> sladen: Sure. UDW is more like deviantart and a bit like the loco portal and more like launchpad.
<yaili> doctormon: calling the site Ubuntu Design seems like a really broad name for a very specific effort
<doctormon> yaili: It's not that specific an effort. This team is for all Ubuntu Design.
<mainerror> yaili: It is also called the Design Team so the name is not that specific.
<yaili> doctormon: but you just said "The Ubuntu Design website is specifically online tools used for design"
<yaili> doctormon: that's quite specific, are there any expansions planned for this site?
<yaili> doctormon: what's its structure?
<yaili> doctormon: what other type of content will it hold?
<AlanBell> http://ubuntustudio.org/Oneiric+Ocelot "Unfortunately, the Ubuntu Studio suffered an almost complete team fail during this cycle." not so good
<AlanBell> yaili: were you meaning that the design team should be using ubuntu studio?
<yaili> AlanBell: no, I'm just asking to consider what is already out there and see if it fits in any way with this new effort/project
<yaili> AlanBell: even if the answer is no, let's forget about it
<AlanBell> ok, great, it is an interesting thought
<doctormon> yaili: The website isn't even done yet and from experence this is certainly a required tool.
<yaili> doctormon: which tool?
<mainerror> The problem doctormon is trying to solve with the website is the one we discussed yesterday (I think) when we were talking about alternatives to Tumblr and Deviantart for sharing design concepts and stuff like that.
<doctormon> yaili: Collabrative image/project/comment able website plus a home of the team online (although the wp site would have done that)
<yaili> doctormon: what about brainstorm?
<doctormon> yaili: Not the right tool
<yaili> doctormon: why?
<mainerror> yaili: Does brainstorm feature an image sharing and hosting mechanism?
<yaili> doctormon: I need to pop into a meeting now but we should continue this discussion tomorrow
<doctormon> yaili: I'll be here to answer any questions
 * AlanBell makes a brainstorm account
<AlanBell> http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/28802/ has images on it
<mainerror> Personally I'd prefer a design team website.
<mainerror> Brainstorm doesn't seem right for that task.
<AlanBell> running what?
<mainerror> Didn't get you.
<AlanBell> what software are you proposing such a website should run?
<mainerror> Preferably a proven CMS. No need to totally reinvent the wheel. It should be extensible though.
<mainerror> I'm not sure to be honest. There are many good systems out there. Wordpress and Drupal are the first two ones that I could think of.
<AlanBell> that isn't very specific
<AlanBell> ok, so design.canonical.com is going to move to design.ubuntu.com and that is running wordpress
<AlanBell> so in terms of home of team online that is mission accomplished when that happens
<mainerror> I'm not arguing against that I just don't think that we should use Brainstorm. That is all I'm saying. :)
<AlanBell> dunno, I am not ready to write off brainstorm yet, seems quite appropriate in some ways
 * AlanBell waits for password to arrive
 * mainerror waits as well
<mainerror> AlanBell: There is one big issue with Brainstorm an images. Those images seem to be hosted on imageshack.us.
<AlanBell> presumably you can link to an image anywhere, probably bbcode or something
<mainerror> No brainstorm password yet. :(
<doctormon> AlanBell: I've tried now 7 different systems, some deployable code and some online services. Both for art and design workflows.
<doctormon> I can find nothing that fits what we need.
<doctormon> Or works
<doctormon> or is maintained.
<mainerror> I think we should setup a document where we can list what we need. A requirements list. That way we can prevent confusion.
<doctormon> mainerror: I think you're right. It's kind of hard to explain to the group that this isn't my first rodeo, not even my second.
<AlanBell> that would be great
<mainerror> You reckon http://pad.ubuntu.com/ would be good for that?
<sladen> from reading the scrollback, this is more like producing a domain-specific workflow site.  Eg. a la revu.ubuntu.com
<sladen> it could be that /an instance/ of that site could be used for design-tasks by some-community
<doctormon> sladen: That's exactly it!
<sladen> flowed-workings is an anagram of 'design-workflow'
<sladen> perhaps that would be the type of name that would allow /a tool/ to be created, without prematurely restricting the scope of groups that might want to deploy an instance of that codebase
<cjohnston> doctormon: https://launchpad.net/community-web-projects and https://launchpad.net/~community-web-developers
<doctormon> sladen: Is that a proposed name?
<sladen> doctormon: only something I made up to illustrate that a tool name is variable (and probably more useful) if it does not presume a target user/group/instance
<sladen> (btw, thank you for taking the initative and JFDI)
<sladen> s/variable/viable/
<cjohnston> doctormon: want to make the website teams for design members of each of those teams/projects ^^
<doctormon> cjohnston: I don't understand, can you repeat?
<cjohnston> doctormon: we have an umbrella community websites project and community websites developer team.. do you want to put the ubuntu-design project and team under them since they are community sites
<doctormon> cjohnston: Yes I do.
<cjohnston> doctormon: i invited the team
<cjohnston> i dont have access to accept it
<cjohnston> trying to remember how to add the project
<prokoudine> hi
<prokoudine> doctormon, so, we are talking about the palette thing on #inkscape
<prokoudine> doctormon, do you guys actually still have a use for the old one?
<mainerror> I'm not sure if it is worth removing it but it should be marked as the "old" one if kept in the palettes collection.
<prokoudine> one idea is to rename it to something like "Ubuntu Human"
<prokoudine> the thing is...
<prokoudine> the whole point was to simplify creating branded artwork
<prokoudine> both of the current new palettes do not provide enough shades to make them useful, IMO, and the old one is outdated
<prokoudine> so I'm curious if you actually use the new ones in real production
<mainerror> Well the official brand guideline defines some shades, I think.
<mainerror> Let me check.
<prokoudine> whether you enhance them somehow
<mainerror> http://design.canonical.com/brand/5.%20Ubuntu%20colour%20palettes%20and%20colour%20landscape.pdf
<prokoudine> http://imgh.us/ubuntu-color-tints-1.png
<mainerror> Exactly!
<prokoudine> would it work?
<prokoudine> ok, i'll make a .gpl out of that
<mainerror> I'm not speaking with authority here but I don't see any thing speaking against that.
<mainerror> sladen is the one to ask.
<mainerror> In my opinion the more predefined tints we have in the palette the less will people pick the wrong color in their projects.
<sladen> mainerror: imagine the graded palette bar in Inkscape.  Something like that would work
<sladen> mainerror: perhaps an Ubuntu palette.  And a combined Ubuntu/Canonical palette
<mainerror> Sounds good.
<prokoudine> sladen, just one thing...
<prokoudine> sladen, mentioning CMYK value without mentioning the ICC profile is evil :)
<prokoudine> sladen, it's a blessing that pantone is provided
<AlanBell> pantone is closed :(
<sladen> which is a pain
<sladen> but not even specifying colours and colour profiles can get the lanyards right at UDS!
#ubuntu-design 2011-11-23
<dholbach> good morning
<mainerror> I had such a great idea for the toolkit yesterday but I forgot it.
<nuthinking> mainerror: maybe hypnosis could help! ;)
<mainerror> heh
<mainerror> I was inspired by something I also forgot so if I manage to find what inspired me I'll definitely remember. :P
<mainerror> On a side note. I bought a nice book yesterday. "The Design of Everyday Things" by Donald Norman.
<mainerror> I was told it is a good book on user experience design.
<nuthinking> mainerror: it's a bit outdated, with Emotional Design, Norman changed a bit his opinion
<mainerror> Mhmm. I'll buy that one next then.
<mainerror> I'll probably go for a couple, if not all of those too http://www.abookapart.com/products/
<MacSlow> wendar, is there an IRC-meeting regarding "community design" later this afternoon again? Not sure if the last one was the start of a weekly meeting or just a single one on the occasion of kicking it off.
<daker> MacSlow|lunch, a doodle poll was sent to determine the best time for a weekly meeting
<mainerror> MacSlow|lunch: http://www.doodle.com/tvvgx4ivru7s7hsx
<MacSlow> daker, mainerror: thanks added my slots
<cjohnston> Could I get feedback on http://ubuntuone.com/5MsVSEBMHGebYAmi8eUByw please. It is adding the little 'chat bubble' icon to http://loco.ubuntu.com/meetings/ubuntu-us-florida/260/detail/  - I don't know that it is intuitive, but not sure what might be better.
<svwilliams> thank you cjohnston !
<cjohnston> :-)
<cjohnston> the point of the image is to link directly to the IRC logs for that particular agenda item
<svwilliams> it shows up only if the link to the log exists for that agenda item
<cjohnston> daker and pleia2 I wouldn't mind your feedback on ^^ as users
<daker> cjohnston, nice
<svwilliams> its a smaller image of the IRC image from the team page ... just so everyone knows what the image represents in other places on loco-team-portal
<mainerror> cjohnston: Looks nice but I'm not sure if that is the right choice.
<pleia2> cjohnston: as long as it has mouseover text with a little description it's fine to how my brain works
<mainerror> However I don't have a better idea so yea.
<mainerror> http://design.canonical.com/brand/Pictograms/PNG_files/HEX/UBUNTU_ORANGE_HEX/articles_orange_hex.png
<mainerror> This might be misleading.
<mainerror> Actually it is misleading.
<svwilliams> oh pretty ... yeah I was attempting to stay with an icon that already said IRC
<svwilliams> but in the portal
<svwilliams> its links to IRC channel not log so ...
<svwilliams> cjohnston, what do you think of mainerror 's image?
<cjohnston> not sure..
<cjohnston> id like to see more feedback
<mmiicc> cjohnston: I'm just an end user. ;) I'd never guess it's about IRC. Placement next to the date makes me think it has something to do with the date (maybe booking place at this event?)
<cjohnston> mmiicc: its a meeting page, not an event page, so if you look at it in context does it make more sense?
<imnichol> I don't suppose there's an icon that represents historical data or something?
<AlanBell> cjohnston: I like the icon you suggested
<mmiicc> cjohnston: well, maybe a little more. As someone said, if there'll be a hint on hover, it'll work
<cjohnston> imnichol: historical data? i dont understand
<mainerror> cjohnston: He means logs.
<mainerror> It would be awesome to have such an icon but I can't think of anything that could represent that, at least of nothing simple.
<AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/programlens.png mockup of a unity tv interface done in pencil
#ubuntu-design 2011-11-24
<doctormo> Hello everyone
<doctormo> Service will be spotty up here in VT while I'm enjoying the holy day of Thank's Giving.
<dholbach> good morning
<yaili_> good morning
<sladen> morning all.  Are there any outstanding requests for bits and pieces that I need to look for while I'm in the office today?
<AlanBell> hi sladen and all
<sladen> AlanBell: indeedy
<sladen> AlanBell: what can I do for you
<AlanBell> I have been playing with pencil for the unity on the telly project thing
<AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/
<AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/pencilfiles/
<AlanBell> created a base frame for people to sketch on designs of what unity media centre television thing might look like
<AlanBell> sladen: one last place available for the christmas meal if you or someone else in the office can make it http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1409/detail/
<sladen> AlanBell: I'm not going to book it as the penalty is too great.  But if I happen to be in London that evening and it's still unfilled, I might come along
<sladen> went to one in Berlin.  My impression was that they don't get, or feel the need for repeat customers
<sladen> it's more like a theme-park novalty ride
<AlanBell> yes, I know what you mean
<sladen> they were rude about my Brompton, managed to upset one of my dinning companions (another vegetarian + other issues, who wanted to see the menu before hand)
<sladen> I think sabdfl's story about the shellfish ties up with that
<AlanBell> yeah
<sladen> the partially-sighted community is benefitting, but other people are making the profit
<sladen> jonobacon/wendar: were you working on some governance stuff
<AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/ storyboard sketching improved
<doctormo> The web chat had limits! 6am it turns into a pumpkin, good to know.
<doctormo> AlanBell: Does ltp have a slot limit function yet?
<AlanBell> ltp?
<AlanBell> slot limit??
<AlanBell> loco team portal
<AlanBell> I don't know what a slot limit function is doctormo
<Andy80> sladen: hi! I opened a bug ( https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xchat/+bug/894036 ) for XChat about using "Ubuntu Mono" as default font for it, but I've seen that the sourcecode of the Precise version was already modified to use "Monospace". The question is: since the Terminal and all the other apps use "Ubuntu Mono", should not we use it to have UI consistency? Thanks
<webbugs> Launchpad bug 894036 in xchat (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu Mono font should be used by default in XChat" [Undecided,In progress]
<sladen> can people with Android have a look at  http://module.create3000.de/tests/test-module.html  and see if there's double-spacing happening
<YoBoY> sladen: you are evil, an url shortener is really useful on that case :D
<YoBoY> but don't know what you are looking for... the display seems identical on my android and my ubuntu
<Andy80> sladen: just replied on LP ;)
<sladen> YoBoY: d o e s   i t   l o o k   l i k e   t h i s ?
<sladen> YoBoY: or like this?
<YoBoY> looks normal :) no extra spaces
<sladen> YoBoY: interesting.  And you're definitely using the Android browser
<sladen> Andy80: can you share with YoBoY how to get the version number information or the browser
<sladen> of the browser
<sladen> so we can work out which versions are affected
<YoBoY> hum... define "android brower" ^^" i'm using the one on my smartphone, an HTC, don't know if it's the official android browser
 * AlanBell has double spacing going on
<sladen> YoBoY: the bug is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xchat/+bug/894036  It's been raised by somebody else (Andy80)
<webbugs> Launchpad bug 894036 in xchat (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu Mono font should be used by default in XChat" [Undecided,In progress]
<AlanBell> samsung galaxy s2 internal browser
<sladen> AlanBell: s p a c e d  or normal?
<AlanBell> s p a c e d
<AlanBell> version 2.3.3
<Andy80> sladen: what do I have to do exactly? how the browser is related to my bug?
<YoBoY> version 2.2, webkit 3.1
<AlanBell> YoBoY: settings-applications-manage applications-all-internet
<YoBoY> yes version 2.2
<YoBoY> thanks AlanBell
<AlanBell> sladen: fine in mobile firefox, but no surprise there I expect
<sladen> Andy80: There is a bug somewhere.  Your screenshot proves that.  And I've confirmed it on the Android device of the person next to me in the Millbank office
<sladen> Andy80: this could be either  (a) a bug in the Ubuntu Mono Font.  (b) a bug in the subsetting system used by Google in order to transmit smaller files.  (c) a bug in a particular version(s) of a particular Browser(s)
<Andy80> sladen: you're talking with the wrong person....I didn't provide any screenshot O_o I'm the one who wrote you about an XChat improvement.
<sladen> Andy80: ah, sorry
<Andy80> sladen: I proposed to use "Ubuntu Mono" as default font in XChat, that's all :D
<sladen> Andy80: yes, that's a separate bug.  For that, could you just do   bzr diff file-you-modified.something
<sladen> Andy80: with the branches deleted, I'm not able to guess what file(s) you've changed
<sladen> Andy80: if you list the commands you've type in order to get+test the source code, I can also possibly help find the difficulty with bzr
<sladen> Andy80: and in uploading the tree
<Andy80> sladen: no problem, I just need two informations.... 1) which one is the proper lp:project I've to branch from and 2) which one is the proper project where I've to push. I'll take care of the modify and of the merge request.
<sladen> Andy80: lets worry about pulling it first
<Andy80> sladen: ok :)
<sladen> Andy80: what did you type?   Eg.   bzr branch lp:   or   apt-get source xchat?
<Andy80> sladen: "bzr branch lp:ubuntu/xchat" this
<Andy80> sladen: is it the proper branch?
<sladen> bzr branch lp:ubuntu/xchat  yes
<Andy80> nice
<sladen> Andy80: and then you changed some files?
<YoBoY> sladen: ok, I can see the extra spaces on my android browser when I activate the "mobiel view", AlanBell can you check that on your browser ?
<Andy80> sladen: not yet... or better I just started from scratch... it's just one line so I can do it now... wait..
<sladen> YoBoY: how does one active/deactive "mobile" view.  Could you put that in the bug report?
<YoBoY> sladen: bug number ?
<YoBoY> don't give me again the xchat bug :p
<sladen> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-font-family/+bug/894133
<webbugs> Launchpad bug 894133 in Ubuntu Font Family "Android Webkit gives double-width spacing when Ubuntu Mono used as web font" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<YoBoY> thank you :)
<Andy80> sladen: file modified, I even did the bzr ci ......, now I need to push it somewhere
<sladen> Andy80: do bzr revert
<sladen> sorry
<sladen> Andy80: do bzr uncommit
<sladen> and then bzr diff
<Andy80> sladen: here is the diff http://pastebin.com/24hznXxx
<Andy80> it looks ok to me... but I wait for your word :P
<YoBoY> ok I'm puzzled... seems my browser don't use the right police in "normal view" (can't see the magic characters)
<YannDinendal> sladen, Andy80: shouldn't "Monospace" automatically default to "Ubuntu Mono" ?
<Andy80> YannDinendal: I don't know.... if it's true, then my patch is useless :)
<Andy80> no problem in that case ;)
<sladen> Andy80: the way it was done, for the last release was to only change it via the gsettings value and the 'ubuntu-artwork' package
<sladen> Andy80: arguably if the whole of the Ubuntu platform (Kubuntu, Xubuntu, ...) is happy with that change, then it could be chanced
<sladen> Andy80: I'm still interested in seeing the patch that Andy80 made and proposed that
<sladen> Andy80: to get the wider reaction from the Ubuntu platform people
<Andy80> sladen: my  patch just modified this line: #define DEF_FONT "Ubuntu Mono 12"
<sladen> Andy80: so, how far did you get
<Andy80> sladen: but of course it's only for Ubuntu, not for Kubuntu/Xubuntu/Debian ecc....
<sladen> Andy80: did you get as far as modifying that?
<Andy80> sladen: what you mean?
<Andy80> (excuse me, maybe my bad english :\ )
<sladen> Andy80: you did  1.  bzr branch lp:ubuntu/xchat xchat-ubuntu-mono
<sladen> Andy80: did you do   gedit xchat/some/file.c
<Andy80> yes
<Andy80> I need to commit and push now...
<Andy80> sladen: can I commit and push? if yes... where do I push exactly?
<sladen> Andy80: bzr commit -m 'Overide DEF_FONT to be "Ubuntu Mono 13"'
<sladen> Andy80: or before that, do  bzr status   and check that you only modified one file
<Andy80> yes, only that
<Andy80> btw it's Ubuntu Mono 12, not 13 (the same as Terminal)
<Andy80> sladen: do you think that this push could be ok: bzr push lp:~andreagrandi/ubuntu/xchat/xchat-ubuntu-mono ?
<sladen> Andy80: I think so.  Or if that doesn't work  bzr push lp:~andreagrandi/+junk/xchat-ubuntu-mono
<Andy80> sladen: oh no! I already tried to use "junk" url the first time and it was impossible to merge then
<Andy80> sladen: but neither this one work.... uff: bzr: ERROR: Invalid url supplied to transport: "lp:~andreagrandi/ubuntu/xchat/xchat-ubuntu-mono": No such distribution series xchat.
<sladen> Andy80: do you have SSH setup?
<sladen> Andy80: to push you need to have an SSH key registered in Launchpad
<Andy80> sladen: yes... I regularly push stuff into Unity-2D
<Andy80> sladen: the problem is this... usually the push URL would be this one: push lp:~andreagrandi/xchat/xchat-ubuntu-mono, but this will push into the upstream one, not the Ubuntu one
<Andy80> sladen: so I need to know the proper URL
<AlanBell> /ubuntu/precise/xchat-ubuntu-mono perhaps?
<Andy80> AlanBell: or maybe: /ubuntu/precise/xchat/xchat-ubuntu-mono ?
<AlanBell> maybe :)
<Andy80> ok... something was pushed :P let's see if I can merge it
<Andy80> AlanBell, sladen the branch is here https://code.launchpad.net/~andreagrandi/ubuntu/precise/xchat/xchat-ubuntu-mono
<Andy80> now I need to merge to the right one ;)
<Andy80> AlanBell, sladen ok this should be the merge request https://code.launchpad.net/~andreagrandi/ubuntu/precise/xchat/xchat-ubuntu-mono/+merge/83332 let's hope it doesn't give any diff errors like yesterday
<Andy80> nice! it worked :)
<sladen> Andy80: hopefully it may start a discussion about whether to do it that way, or change the whole lot at a higher level
<Andy80> sladen: yes.... I tried to look if there was the possibility to change this at /etc/... level, but I didn't find anything, do I ended changing it just there.
<sladen> grep -i monospace -r /etc/fonts/conf.d/
<wendar> sladen: for ubuntu-design? yes, the CC reviewed it in the last meeting
<wendar> sladen: basically, the CC is the governance as we get started, and will help us grow team leadership
<sladen> wendar: okay.  Current plan would be to work on rolling out a  design.ubuntu.com  as a planet, then progressively add people from the Ubuntu Design community has they gain recognition
<sladen> wendar: (I'm hoping that the design.canonical.com blog would qualify at some point, for anything with the tag 'ubuntu')
<wendar> sladen: you've talked with sabdfl and inayaili? they're moving design.canonical.com to design.ubuntu.com and opening it up to Ubuntu design community
<wendar> sladen: or, is this the next step on that plan?
<sladen> wendar: yes, we had another meeting today
<wendar> sladen: cool, sounds good (and quick and easy to set up, which is good)
<sladen> wendar: where the plan distilled to leaving design.canonical.com.  But moving all the perma-content to upstream (Unity guidlines -> unity.u.com;  Ubuntu stuff to design.u.com; etc)
<sladen> wendar: so the Canonical Brand Guideline stuff could live there (until it gets superceded), but the Ubuntu stuff would  live on design.u.com (or somewhere else too)
<sladen> wendar: however, I think you're way around on governance.  Clearly I've missed something proactive and productive happening there
<AlanBell> I have put together an ubuntuish/canonicalish export template for pencil: http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/
<wendar> sladen: sounds like a good distribution of content
<wendar> sladen: on governance: ah, a good start, early days yet, we're still a baby team
<wendar> AlanBell: cool!
<sladen> AlanBell: what kinds of interfaces do you imagine people using for televisions?
<AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/pencilfiles/ the .ep files are the pencil files, and the ubuntu.zip is a pencil export filter
<sladen> AlanBell: eg, would they be using a mouse/
<AlanBell> sladen: dunno, but that isn't really the point in this context
<AlanBell> the point is that the free software wireframing tool is full of awesome
<AlanBell> I am going to give that stuff to the #ubuntu-tv project to get them to do more concept wireframing stuff
<AlanBell> I suspect the TV thing will end up either going nowhere, or becomming a unity theme for xbmc
<AlanBell> so from an ubuntu-design point of view I wanted to make a wireframing/storyboard template that could be used for all sorts of things
 * sladen spots the old favicon on people.u.com
<sladen> anyone want to file that at  http://launchpad.net/ubuntu-branding/+filebug?field.title=people.u.c+uses+pre-2010+Ubuntu+favicon  and take the credit?
<AlanBell> you spotted it
<mmiicc> sladen: can you close this bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-font-family/+bug/790913 I'm not sure if I as a reporter can do that
<webbugs> Launchpad bug 790913 in Ubuntu Font Family "UbuntuBeta Mono font looks blurry in Firefox and Chromium compared to Ubuntu Regular" [Undecided,New]
<sladen> mmiicc: I think there was another bug I just bounced back to you from 18 months ago
<sladen> mmiicc: marked it a dup of bug #820493
<webbugs> Launchpad bug 820493 in Ubuntu Font Family "Mono: No hinting yet - Ubuntu Beta Mono font looks jagged in Netbeans and terrible with ClearType" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/820493
<mmiicc> sladen: yes, that way you reminded me about this bug :)
<sladen> mmiicc: would you be willing to help check an other ones that need re-testing
<mmiicc> sladen: no problem
<sladen> mmiicc: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-font-family/+bug/603049  could do with somebody firing up the font at 9pt for each of the weights
<webbugs> Launchpad bug 603049 in Ubuntu Font Family "Hinting: hinted ~9pt is 1 pixel shorter than raw outlines" [High,Triaged]
<sladen> mmiicc: and comparing the height between unhinted (the real outlines) and the fully manually hinted forms
<mmiicc> sladen: how can I add more than one attachment to bug report?
<mmiicc> sladen: nevermind, I've added zip file https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-font-family/+bug/603049/comments/24
<webbugs> Launchpad bug 603049 in Ubuntu Font Family "Hinting: hinted ~9pt is 1 pixel shorter than raw outlines" [High,Triaged]
<sladen> mmiicc: what's your analysis based on the screenshots?
<mmiicc> sladen: I see difference in width but not height
<mmiicc> sladen: but I'm not an expert :
<mmiicc> sladen: if you have more bugs to check, I'll be back tomorrow :)
<mmiicc> good night for now
<sladen> mmiicc: thank you very much
<sladen> pleia2: is there anything else needed from the office design archive before I leave the office at some point
<sladen> oh, banner SVG
#ubuntu-design 2011-11-25
<dholbach> good morning
<doctormo> good morning dholbach
<doctormo> Happy Black Friday(tm)
<dholbach> hey doctormo
<sladen> doctormo: Black Friday.  Something to do with the stock exchange?
<mainerror> Morning.
<mika_> happy Buy Nothing Day too :)
<mmiicc> I have strange colors on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Official Is this a Firefox bug? http://img6.imagebanana.com/img/4z6714ju/Zaznaczenie_066.png In Chromium and Opera orange is ok.
<mmiicc> nevermind, it's about color management
#ubuntu-design 2011-11-27
<AlanBell> yay, I am an ubuntu designer, OMG Ubuntu says so /o\ http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2011/11/ubuntu-smart-tv-discussions-begin-to-warm-up
<AlanBell> I didn't mean to design, was just creating a template for doing storyboarding on
<mainerror> :)
<doctormon> AlanBell: Your working on pencil plugins for ubuntu design?
<AlanBell> yes
<AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/
<AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/pencilfiles/ ubuntu.zip is the export filter
<AlanBell> what do you think of the storyboarding?
#ubuntu-design 2012-11-19
<pteredactyl> ello everyone
#ubuntu-design 2013-11-21
<tkamppeter> Hi, I would like to talk about the mobile print dialog with the design team in the current vUDS session, channel client1
#ubuntu-design 2015-11-17
<tkamppeter> mpt, hi
