#ubuntu-desktop 2008-11-10
<huats> morning
<mvo> ember_: hello! thanks for your strace merge, on what arch have you test-build it? it seems to ftbfs for me on amd64
<mvo> lool: is it ok to build-dep on raiant-compat instead of scrollkeeper? or is there anything missing in it? gparted seems to be much happier with it than with scrollkeeper
<ember_> mvo: the strace merge ? that was for intrepid, it might ftfbs on jaunty, what error on amd64? include ones?
<ember_> about rarian-compat i've been using --disable-scrollkeeper as you saw on checksecurity
<mvo> ember_: strace> fails in jaunty with a error aout missind linux dentry stuff (I don't have the original error message at hand)
<mvo> ember: thanks, I noticed the "--disable-scrollkeeper", I was wondering if that should be included and raiant-compat seems to accomplish that
<mvo> ember: I sponsored the checksecurity upload already, thans for that (into jaunty) and metacity - thanks for merges!
<ember> mvo: ../file.c:41:26: error: linux/dirent.h: No such file or directory
<ember> ftbfs due this right? it's just linux/dirent.h -> dirent.h , i will have a look tomorrow
<mvo> ember: yes, that is the error
<mvo> ember: thanks, it seems that linux/dirent.h -> dirent.h is not quite enough, but we can investigate tomorrow
<geser> does somebody know why building a package with --enable-scrollkeeper works on Debian while on Ubuntu one needs the pass --disable-scrollkeeper?
<dobey> scrollkeeper is deprecated afaik
<dobey> depending on what you mean exactly by debian and ubuntu, that could have something to do with it :)
<geser> Debian == Debian sid, and Ubuntu == Ubuntu jaunty (but it also applies for intrepid)
<dobey> is scrollkeeper installed on ubuntu?
<geser> I'm talking about building a package inside a pbuilder where scrollkeeper is listed in Build-Depends
<dobey> ah. i don't know
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-11-11
<lool> mvo: Can't think of a reason not to build-dep on rarian-compat instead of scrollkeeper -- as long as the results are compatible with both implementations
<lool> Both are in main
<mvo> lool: thanks
<ottoshmidt> is it possible to record from MIDI input in sound recorder on ubuntu 8.10?
 * ArneGoetje waves
<pitti> hey ArneGoetje
<pitti> Keybuk, Riddell, ArneGoetje, mpt: half of the team is away, but let's have a quick meeting anyway
<ArneGoetje> ok
<Keybuk> indeed
<Keybuk> where's Ken?
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2008-11-11
<pitti> pretty boilerplate, too
<pitti> Keybuk: is he still officially desktop team?
<Keybuk> yes
<Keybuk> this is Ken and MPT's last week
<pitti> pinged
<pitti> Riddell: there?
<pitti> let's start with the outstanding actions
<pitti>  * Martin to upload current PPA langpacks to hardy/intrepid-proposed
<pitti> I actually did that, but removed them again, since they were still incomplete
<Riddell> hi
<pitti> I fixed langpack-o-matic to not produce broken KDE translations instead
<pitti> and ArneGoetje is producing new packages as we speak, this time with complete KDE imports
<pitti> so "delayed, but on track now"
<Riddell> anything I can test?
<pitti> PPA in a few hours, I suppose
<pitti>  *     * Jonathan to track down who is working on bug #290695, set assignee, and clarify status
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 290695 in adeptmgr "Adept allows editing filenames in Details view" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/290695
<Riddell> turned out nobody was working on it
<Riddell> I should probably assign to myself
<pitti> Riddell: it doesn't really seem an RC bug to me; WDYT?
<pitti> more like a cosmetical issue
<Riddell> well it could do something nasty if you click on the field and accidently rename an important file, but it's not a security issue (you have to be root anyway for adept)
<pitti> Riddell: so please feel free to drop the intrepid-updates milestone if it's not urgent
<pitti> Riddell: oh, it's not just an UI glitch, you can actually rename the desktop files?
<Riddell> rename the filesystem files
<pitti> erg
<Riddell> a built in feature of the widget being used that is not quite appropriate here
<pitti> ok, I nominated for intrepid/jaunty
<Riddell> I'll take a look at it for next week
<pitti> let's hope that it's just a simple property change then :)
<pitti> ok, thanks for the heads-up
<Riddell> should be yes
<pitti> merges seem to go well
<pitti> intrepid-updates SRUs seem to stall a bit
<pitti> but discussing that, and preparation of UDS/jaunty goals doesn't really make sense with just half of the team IMHO
<pitti> anything on anybody's mind which we should discuss today?
<ArneGoetje> not from me
<Riddell> where's Ken going?
<pitti> Keybuk: ^ ?
<Keybuk> Ken and Michael will be moving to the new Visual/Creative Design team
<Keybuk> that will be on Monday next week, so this is their last meeting with us
<pitti> ITYM "Matthew"
<Keybuk> I do mean Matthew
<Keybuk> sorry MPT :)
<Riddell> sounds exciting
<Keybuk> and I guess now is as good a time as any
<Keybuk> next week will be my last meeting with you
<Riddell> aww
<Keybuk> I head off on leave, and when I return (for UDS), my replacement will be already on board
<Keybuk> we're throwing him somewhat into the deep end, as he starts, heads straight to the DX sprint, FOSScamp and then UDS
<pitti> Keybuk: which city is it this time?
<Keybuk> pitti: leave?  San Francisco
<pitti> Keybuk: oh, Rick will be on the DX sprint, too?
<Keybuk> pitti: apparently so
<pitti> Keybuk: ah, so you arrive *very* early :)
<pitti> Keybuk: don't forget about the flower
<Riddell> what's the DX sprint?
<Keybuk> Riddell: Desktop Experience tam
<Keybuk> team, even
<pitti> Riddell: desktop experience team
<Keybuk> so as Martin says, the new guy's name is Rick
<Keybuk> if you'd like to know more, ask me in private - since until he joins, it's not really appropriate to talk about him in public :-)
<pitti> oh, sorry
<Keybuk> pitti: I don't think his first name constitutes much, I was more thinking in terms of who he is, etc.
<Keybuk> (that's it from me :p)
<pitti> AOB?
<ArneGoetje> not from me
<pitti> okthxhappymergingbye
<pitti> oh, just one thing
<pitti> when you have a quiet moment, please collect some ideas about what you'd like to work on for jaunty
<pitti> I think we should discuss UDS prep at length next week
<pitti> while Keybuk is still there to provide some input as well :)
<Keybuk> kwwii: you missed it
<kwwii> Keybuk: sorry, I was at the store getting groceries, didn't notice the time
<kwwii> must have been a quick one
<Keybuk> it was
<kwwii> did I miss anything important?
<pitti> sending the notes to u-desktop@ now
<pitti> kwwii: not really, half of the team is on holiday anyway
<kwwii> cool
<kwwii> sorry for missing it, I didn't forget the meeting, just what time it was
<rlaager> pitti: Given you mentioned UDS... is anyone revisiting the replacing-Pidgin-with-Empathy idea for Jaunty?
<pitti> rlaager: it's on my discussion list
<rlaager> pitti: Okay. I'm certainly interested in providing whatever useful input I can. I'm an upstream Pidgin developer and will be at UDS this year. If you guys are going to switch to Empathy, I'm not going to fight it, because 1) I can easily install Pidgin anyway, and 2) I'm hoping that one day Empathy will be as good or better. Ground-up rewrites provide a lot of opportunity for fixing things. :)
<mpt> Keybuk, sorry, I was busy with super sekrit discussions
<pitti> rlaager: ah, looking forward to meeting you there
<pitti> getting feedback from upstreams is one of the main reasons why we have UDSes in the first place :)
<rlaager> pitti: Officially, my employer is sending me (and another co-worker). So, we're also looking to do a week of bug squashing. So, hopefully my list of reported bugs will get smaller rather than bigger, at least for a week. ;)
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-11-12
<geser> does somebody know why building a package with "configure --enable-scrollkeeper" works on Debian while on Ubuntu one needs the pass --disable-scrollkeeper to configure?
<seb128> ubuntu is using rarian and debian not?
<geser> doesn't build-depending on scrollkeeper install scrollkeeper anymore?
<seb128> geser: rarian-compat is similar so any of those can be used
<seb128> lut huats
<huats> hello seb128
<seb128> geser: anyway why would you want to enable this configuration option when it's obviously not what you want? those updates should be done during the installation on the client box and not on the buildd
<geser> seb128: I was looking at a FTBFS (gossip) where the error was due to a missing --disable-scrollkeeper and I saw in debian/rules that it called configure with --enable-scrollkeeper
<geser> and looking at Debian build logs it builds there successfully
<seb128> could be a buildd configuration difference too
<seb128> doesn't really matter though, this option should not be used for debian builds since you don't want to index whatever is installed on the buildds
<geser> so I should forward the Ubuntu delta to Debian?
<geser> lool: ^^ what's your opinion on it as you are a co-maintainer of gossip?
<lool> geser: No idea why --enable-scrollkeeper was added
<lool> It's not documented why in the changelog
<lool> geser: rarian-compat provides scrollkeeper; does it fail to build under Ubuntu with rarian-compat or scrollkeeper?
<lool> or both?
<geser> lool: I don't have the build log anymore but it failed because it couldn't write in /var/lib/scrollkeeper (or similar) during the build
<lool> geser: Perpaps rarian-compat should be fixed?
<geser> I'll try later (when I'm back at home) and check if it failed with scrollkeeper or rarian-compat
<mvo> seb128: hey! what is the plan for gdm for jaunty (have we one ;) ? I ask because it would be nice if we would use hal to shutdown - then e.g. synaptic could inhibit a shutdown while its working
<seb128> mvo: I would say it's time to switch to the new gdm now
<mvo> will it use hal for shutdown?
<seb128> mvo: it does
<mvo> excellent
 * mvo recently discovered the compiz now plugin and thinks its awsome
<mvo> "snow"
 * mvo can't type
<hggdh> seb128, good morning (for me) afternoon (for you)
<seb128> hggdh: hello
<hggdh> seb128, re. bug 205999 -- latest fix has some issues on backporting to Hardy
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 205999 in evolution-data-server "Attachments names using "Ã§" are not correctly sent by Evolution (ATT<number>.dat)" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/205999
<seb128> hggdh: I read your comments, why are glade changes required to fix an encoding issue?
<hggdh> seb128, a new configuration option was added (so that the default behaviour will still be rfc2231-compliant)
<seb128> we likely don't want changes which add UI changes and new strings to stable
<hggdh> I did a make against trunk, and it works fine; I also built against Intrepid, and published it -- but I am really not sure about Hardy
<hggdh> exactly
<seb128> I would say to not bother doing an hardy backport for now, let's try to get that fixed in intrepid or jaunty first and we will see later if we want to backport the change
<hggdh> on the other hand, the previous patch will work on Hardy (in a different way, and it will create wrong attachment filenames -- but they will be usable
<hggdh> I agree, but I wanted your input on this (after all, experience counts!)
<seb128> ideally microsoft would respect the standards
<seb128> anyway we didn't get so many lts users requests for that and I'm not sure adding complex changes or half working changes is worth the trouble
<seb128> let's get that tested in intrepid or jaunty
<hggdh> I found a page on support.microsoft.com that states Outcrap 2007 will read rfc2231, but will not generate them
<hggdh> seb128, k
<seb128> thanks for your work on those
<seb128> did you get any feedback on the other bugs about the sqlite migration on upgrade?
<hggdh> welcome. I am now waiting for field feedback on the Intrepid fix, but I will check upstream if they are going to commit the fix in time for us to use it now
<hggdh> on the migration, the reporter commented upstream that it did not quite work. srag asked for the coder to look at it ASAP
<seb128> ok
<hggdh> (Sankar)
<hggdh> seb128, glad to be able to help out a bit
<hggdh> seb128, backporting to Hardy will not be a trivial change -- the glade interface was rewritten for 2.24
<seb128> I doubt we will be wanting to backport UI changes anyway
 * hggdh agrees
<mvo> seb128: I looked at the eog bug you mentioned, this particular one seems to be a packages in really bad shape and update-manager seems to be unable to fix that
<seb128> mvo: it has been duplicated since no? I think that was another case where the user sent duplicates over random packages due to an install issue
 * mvo nods
<pitti> seb128: <flamewar gauntlet>so, my gthumb patch for fixing photo import was accepted within 24 hours, while it took weeks for f-spot (and still arguing about the remaining bit); I love gthumb! :-)
 * pitti hugs seb128
<seb128> pitti: trolll!!!!
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<pitti> (no worries, I'm just happy that it's upstream now)
<mpt> Discussion in irc.gnome.org #usability about rearranging the Sound preferences, if anyone is interested
<mpt> http://www.gnome.org/~mccann/gnome-volume-control/Screenshot-Sound%20Preferences-1.png
<dobey> again?
<dobey> whee
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-11-13
<Keybuk> \o/ half way through the merges
<Hobbsee> yay!
<seb128> fta: did you look at cairo 1.8.2 for jaunty and if it can be synced?
<lool> seb128: I wanted to relay a couple of things to you on the intrepid i386 desktop cd
<lool> From a French user
<seb128> lool: hello
<lool> (Hey!)
<lool> Basically revolving around support for French
<lool> a) langpack is obviously not installed   :-/  do we care more about features or languages?  I wonder
<lool> b) menus are actually translated (upstream translations); not so much for the space savings, but for the effect it creates (top menus not translated but menus translated!), perhaps we should strip the translations in the .desktop files?
<seb128> that's not an easy one, we already drop some feature on the default install
<seb128> note that ubuntu-fr has a localized iso and they are getting cds pressed
<lool> seb128: That's interesting
<seb128> the menus items is a side-effects, I don't really care either way
<lool> seb128: I wanted to relay the complaints I heard because I think it's not an obvious choice for Ubuntu at large; perhaps it's something which deserves discussion at UDS, I don't know
<seb128> whoever is doing the comments should be joining IRC or the lists to discuss those ;-)
<lool> I don't feel too good handing out CDs to French people anymore
<seb128> well, that's things we know about
<seb128> because the language packs are not on the CD?
<lool> Yes
<seb128> right, me neither, I would recommend using the french iso
<lool> i think until hardy, french was included; I guess some other langs were dropped though
<seb128> I think hardy still has the french language packs
<seb128> right, every cycle adds new features or extra code so the CD margin are shrinking
<seb128> and the easier way is to drop language packs on the way
<seb128> the reality is that one CD is not an easy limit nowadays
<seb128> we don't have good answer to that
<pedro_> seb128: hey, may you look at bug 297223? it sounds to me like a libeel issue but not completely sure, having a second opinion would be good ;-)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 297223 in nautilus "nautilus uses gnome-terminal instead of the preferred terminal application" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/297223
<seb128> we already stopped shipping changelog, symlink duplicates files in packages, etc
<seb128> pedro_: not sure without looking at the code, just send it upstream on nautilus they will reassign if required, the people working on those components are the same anyway
<lool> seb128: Is it sensible to offer our main installer in english is the question I'm worried about
<lool> I never tried to install the langpacks from the live session though
<seb128> lool: ubiquity translations are on the CD
<seb128> lool: so the installer is localized
<lool> Ok
<seb128> lool: we don't have language packs for the livecd environment though
<seb128> but that's not required to do the install
<seb128> and language packs are downloaded transparently during the installation if you have internet access
<pedro_> seb128: ok will do it, thanks!
<seb128> pedro_: you're welcome
<lool> I suspect installing them in the live session is too big
<seb128> lool: probably not, but it would require downloading those and restarting the session, what is the goal exactly?
<lool> Anyway, glad you know about it; I know it's not easy, and I'd welcome french back ;)
<seb128> right, me too
<lool> seb128: The goal would just be allowing people to try out Ubuntu
<seb128> one way would be to drop openoffice ;-) but I don't think it's going to happen there
<seb128> lool: well, I would recommend burning the localized iso, which is what people have to do for any other distro anyway
<lool> Yup
<seb128> lool: one other way we didn't really work on yet is to split the localized documentation
<seb128> it's done for gimp for example
<seb128> but doing it for evolution too would be a good win
<seb128> it's on my list but there is just too much to do
<lool> Heh
<seb128> we could install the translations but not the localized documentation on the livecd
<seb128> I think softwares translations are what matters for demos
<lool> Yeah
<tgm4883_laptop> Why is the totem mythtv plugin no longer available?
<tgm4883_laptop> It's just gone, and from what I can tell from the changelog, for no other reason than we can use the UPNP server?
<Ng> how come the logout/restart/shutdown options in FUSA do as asked immediately with no confirmation prompt?
<mvo> Ng: there is a bug open about it
<mvo> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fast-user-switch-applet/+bug/283095
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 283095 in fast-user-switch-applet "logout needs confirmation" [Low,Triaged]
<mvo> Ng: I personally find #282403 confusing
 * Ng waits for firefox to load. I have far too many old tabs in my session ;)
<Ng> mvo: hmm yeah, that should definitely display an option to authorise and shutdown anyway. Even if you pick a "actually no just log me out" type option I don't like being punted back to gdm because afair it gives no indication that people are logged in
<Ng> we should definitely use a face browser login which shows who is logged in, and encourage the use of cheese/memaker to make user avatars, imho :)
<dobey> nooooo :)
<Ng> why not? :)
<dobey> well, "who" integration with gdm would be nice, for multi-user i guess
<dobey> i don't want to be forced to pick an avatar to use when i am the only user of the system though
<Ng> a reasonable default image and non-annoying information about customising it? :)
<dobey> no
<dobey> no image is a reasonable default
<Ng> also, I think this is in need of eplisis... http://mairukipa.tenshu.net/screenshots/2008-10-13-nm-harhar.png
<dobey> unless it's the silouhette
<Ng> dobey: it could be anything :)
<dobey> not so much ellipses, as it needs brevity
<Ng> it needs something :)
<Ng> asac: see above URL :)
<dobey> and why is it listed thrice?
<Ng> good question
<Ng> there's only one USB device
<Ng> I see ttyACM0-2
<asac> Ng: dobey: known MASTER bug
<asac> its hal issue in the beginning
<asac> and NM in the end
<Ng> ok
<asac> Ng: when you see this you can see with hal-find-by-capability --capability modem
<asac> that the modem is exporteed N-times
<asac> same for net.80211 and net.80203
<Ng> can I provide any useful information to fix it? I probably won't have access to this laptop for much longer
<MacSlow> gee ... the blender team is making quite some rounds in Hollywood ... didn't know they got screenings and talks about BigBuckBunny at Disney, Dreamworks and Rhythm&Hues during last Siggraph
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-11-15
<sainathas> how to move application from one desk to another through a c program?what functions do i need to call?
<sainathas> i want to move my application from one virtual desktop to another dynamically through a program How can i do it?
<sainathas> can anyone tell me how to do that?
<sainathas> is anyone online?
<ottoshmidt> anyone here?
<sainathas> may be
<ottoshmidt> anyone can help me with ubuntu login window settings?
<sainathas> i have installed devilspie and want to move the firefox to workspace 2  when i write set_workspace 2 it says there is no workspace 2 I have 2 virtual desktops by default
<sainathas> can any one tell me where i have gone wrong
<Hobbsee>       (set_workspace 4)
<Hobbsee>        (set_viewport 4)
<Hobbsee> i think you'll want to try the viewport version
<Hobbsee> because compiz does viewpoints, not workspaces, iirc.
<Hobbsee> (or just set them both, like i have)
<Hobbsee> so it works for metacity & compiz
<sainathas> i have moved an application from one desk to another using devilspie
<sainathas> but i am not able to focus it
<sainathas> tell me how to move to that workspace which we already moved our application in ubuntu
 * Hobbsee suggests 'man devilspie'
<Hobbsee> looks like there's a 'focus' option there too
<sainathas> focus option is there but it works only for current window
<sainathas> as our window is already moved to another view port
<sainathas> i think it is not working
<Hobbsee> then i'd say devilspie probably does'nt support it
<sainathas> can u tell me what is this workspace thing?
 * Hobbsee notes these are support questions, and hsould be in #ubuntu
<sainathas> ok
<sainathas> can u tell me any apllication which should move my aplli to another view port but can also focus it?
<Hobbsee> i don't know of one
<sainathas> ok thanks fo rur info
<Hobbsee> you're welcome
<LaserJock> why is ~desktop-bugs assigned to so many bugs?
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-11-16
<ottoshmidt> what does "orphaned library" mean?
<Asad2005> i have upgraded my hardy amd64 to 810 and now if i boot with default kernel option 2627 the system drop to built in shell with /dev/disk/by-uuid does not exists but other kernel 2.64 i think boots ok
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-11-09
<chrisccoulson> hello robert_ancell - i notice you're still assigned to bug 429322. do you want me to take this one, or do you think you'll find some time to look at it this week?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429322 in seahorse-plugins "seahorse-agent assert failure: ERROR:iop-profiles.c:606:IOP_generate_profiles: assertion failed: (obj && (obj->profile_list == NULL) && obj->orb)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429322
<chrisccoulson> gnome bug 579738 has a description of the issue
<ubottu> Gnome bug 579738 in Agent "seahorse-agent leaves behind its socket dir" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=579738
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, if you know a fix go ahead.  I haven't been able to access the bug, LP seems to have got confused.  I'll look at it today.
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell - you might need to disable edge redirection to view the bug
<chrisccoulson> i find that it times out earlier, and you end up being blocked out of bugs with lots of comments
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, thanks, that worked
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm not sure why edge times out earlier
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, how did you have seahorse-agent installed but not running in you session?
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell - it's running in my session
<robert_ancell> so when you use xtrace how did you get it to run a second time?
<chrisccoulson> i killed the first instance, and cleared GPG_AGENT_INFO from my environment
<chrisccoulson> a second instance should run ok then
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, ah, the env variable is what I needed, thanks
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that confused me for a little while
<chrisccoulson> i wasn't sure at first how it decided there was a second instance running
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, hmm, I don't get an apport crash; I run xtrace, then seahose-agent then Ctrl+C xtrace but nothing seems to happen
<chrisccoulson> that's strange - it should crash
<chrisccoulson> it does exit though doesn't it?
<robert_ancell> yeah, ps shows it was there and now isnt
<chrisccoulson> that's odd. and apport is still enabled on your machine?
<robert_ancell> I think so
<robert_ancell> where is the enable flag?
<chrisccoulson> it's in /etc/default/apport
<chrisccoulson> it should be disabled now, unless you re-enabled it again
<robert_ancell> yes it is, re-enabled.
<robert_ancell> this bug is interesting as it doesn't seem to have any side-effects and we're only fixing it to shut apport up
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that seems to be the case
<chrisccoulson> but it seems that a lot of users still have apport enabled
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, it doesn't want to reproduce for me.  If it does for you could you try the package in https://launchpad.net/~robert-ancell/+archive/ppa/+packages and see if that fixes it?
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell - mind if i try it tomorrow?
<chrisccoulson> i'm going to get some sleep in a bit :)
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, sure np! sleep is good :)
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning pitti
<fagan> Morning
<baptistemm> hello
<huats> morning
 * bryce waves
<baptistemm> pitti, hello, are you the one who used to upload fontconfig package?
<pitti> baptistemm: no, I have no idea at all about fontconfig
<baptistemm> okay
<baptistemm> karmic ships 2.6.0 where 2.7.3 is shipped in Fedora, and apparently it brings memory reduction, I looked at debian patches this week-end, and updated them
<baptistemm> perhaps someone whit more knowledge than me could look at this for lucid
<pitti> ArneGoetje: I think that would fall into your competency area? :-) ^
<baptistemm> I need to reinstall standard karmic version to see the real benefits between the 2 versions
<baptistemm> thanks pitti
<baptistemm> pitti, does Germany celebrates the fall of the Wall as much as France does?
<pitti> baptistemm: I don't know how much France celebrates it :) but the 20 year anniversary has been one of the top subjects in news magazines for weeks already
<baptistemm> here too
<pitti> it was indeed quite exciting times back then
<pitti> I was only 9, but I still remember it
<baptistemm> all day, TV news and radio are made from Berlin
<baptistemm> I was 10 I remember the fall of the wall and trial in Romania against Caucescu
 * fagan was 1 when the wall fell (I think)
<ArneGoetje> pitti: I will take a look at it
<baptistemm> ArneGoetje, hi
<baptistemm> ArneGoetje, https://edge.launchpad.net/~bmillemathias/+archive/ppa I did a package for karmic to test it, but there is some problem
<baptistemm> when I install it for instance, all GTK+ applications crashed
<baptistemm> then after all was okay
<chrisccoulson> hello everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson; had a good weekend?
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti - yes, my weekend wasn't too bad, although my girlfriend has had flu
<chrisccoulson> what about you?
<pitti> we had a nice party on Saturday evening, and had some family visit yesterday; nice and relaxing
<chrisccoulson> excellent :) i like relaxing weekends too
 * fagan is getting angry at the poor excuse for a dictionary in Empathy 
<davmor2> fagan: it's even more frustrating that you can't add words ;)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks for sponsoring the s-t-b update. i tried out the new patch-tagging guidelines, but I wasn't too sure if i did it correctly yet ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I was happy to see them in action :)
<fagan> davmor2: exactly
<fagan> Its funny it doesnt like the word management but suggests the term stage-management
<asac> pitti: hey ;)
<asac> pitti: is seb on holiday?
<pitti> hi asac! enjoyed your holidays?
<pitti> asac: no, he's travelling to Dallas today (DX sprint Wed-Fri)
<asac> oh ... so gtk+2.0 is in -proposed
<asac> with bug 393534
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 393534 in gtk+2.0 "gtkiconview issue, evolution chokes when attaching files sometimes" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/393534
<asac> however, i need to unpatch the XID collision output
<asac> there were now reports that for some it filled .xsession-errors with 3GB
<asac> seems like the 393534 didnt help ... not sure what to do now
<asac> pitti: ^^
<asac> i could remove the patch for that bug and put just the one liner for the Xid coliision warning in there
<mvo> 3GB ? impressive
<asac> or keep the current proposed patch .. but of course risk that it blocks the xid thing
<asac> mvo: ;) yeah
<mvo> almost as much fun as bug #453444
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 453444 in rsyslog "/var/log fills up with "all normal" messages @ about 575/sec fill up the available space" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/453444
<asac> "all normal" ;)
<mvo> yeah
<mvo> this is why its so ironic
<asac> mvo: you asked for me while i was away ... about some Xb- thing?
<mvo> "I'm fine"
<mvo> "I'm fine"
<mvo> "I'm fine"
<mvo> "I'm fine"
<mvo> "I'm fine"
<mvo> "I'm fine"
<mvo> "I'm fine"
<asac>  /kick mvo-troll
<mvo> asac: yeah, but I think we have a proposal ready for uds-discussion
<mvo> asac: its about adding "XB-Restart-Required: [session, system, app]"
<mvo> asac: to debain/control
<mvo> so that we can display information about reboot required *before* the user installs the update
<pitti> asac: since testing with that patch was unsuccessful, I'd say upload a new one with that patch removed, and we reattempt the former SRU later on
<asac> pitti: ok i agree. just wanted to check
<pitti> asac: just upload, I'll modify the bugs accordingly
<asac> thx
<asac> mvo: ok. but we still keep the update-notifier thing?
<mvo> asac: yeah, maybe redoing it internally
<mvo> asac: but it will warn before and after
<asac> mvo: ffox currently relies on the notifier file being put there
<asac> mvo: so just dropping that needs a valid alternative so firefox can display its "restart" button
<mvo> asac: ok, we should have a quick talk about this during uds (not necessarily in a session)
<mvo> asac: I have rarely seen the notication inside firefox, I never debugged it, might be a odd corner case
<asac> ok
<asac> hmm update-maintainer adds "asac@ubuntu.com" now as Maintainer ... thats odd
<chrisccoulson> what was the original maintainer?
<asac> seb128@debian.org
<chrisccoulson> i'm sure i saw that before when the original maintainer had a @ubuntu.com mail address
<chrisccoulson> hmmm
<asac> i think it has something to do with the fact that the package has control.in
<asac> seems update-maintainer updated control.in
<chrisccoulson> possibly
<asac> how can i tell debuild to ignore maintainer?
<asac> seems seb forced it too because it was a ubuntu1 with his debian email
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure how to do that
<pitti> asac: DEBEMAIL= debuild -S
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ^ FYI
<pitti> it only bails out if $DEBEMAIL =~ /ubuntu/
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks
<baptistemm> hello again
<baptistemm> there is some room for improvement when checkdisk fails, for a simple user getting a root maintenance shell is not enough
<baptistemm> I had this case this week-end and a graphical solution would be nice to have
<asac> k thx
<dobey> mac_v: yes i know it's filed. no i haven't really had any time to fix it yet :)
<mac_v> dobey: cool... its just that the bug wasnt confirmed and i hadnt mentioned to you i filed it , so I thought you hadnt noticed it ;)
<dobey> yeah, there's an email for it
<dobey> one of like 30K bug e-mails i have from lp :)
<mac_v> lol!
<rickspencer3> welcome back asac
<asac> hi rickspencer3 ;)
<fagan> rickspencer3: hows the plans going for the UDS?
<rickspencer3> hi fagan
<Riddell> bryce: do you think this is still an issue? bug 81686
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 81686 in qt-x11-free "SIGFPE in create_dpis() in QPaintDevice::~QPaintDevice" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/81686
<rickspencer3> you can check it out on launchpad
<fagan> rickspencer3: yep
<rickspencer3> pitti did a wonderful job getting us organized
<didrocks> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi didrocks
<kenvandine> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi kenvandine
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, ready for the trip?
 * kenvandine is hacking on a proof of concept for hooking up the indicator with MC5 instead of patching empathy
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, not really
<rickspencer3> :/
<kenvandine> :/
<rickspencer3> I have to go over blueprints today
<rickspencer3> and lots of other planning that I have to catch up on :o
<rickspencer3> Lucid is going to be exciting indeed
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> yeah, i have almost a week before i leave and feel like it isn't enough time :)
<rickspencer3> no seb128
<rickspencer3> seb128 est on un avion, n'ce'pa?
<pitti> rickspencer3: oui, Monsieur
<rickspencer3> salut, pitti
<pitti> rickspencer3: comment vas-tu?
<rickspencer3> bon, et tois?
<pitti> tres bien, merci!
<pitti> I'm down to two merges
<rickspencer3> j' suis energe
<pitti> and got the worst jockey bugs nailed for karmic-proposed now
<rickspencer3> UDS vais beacaue important
 * rickspencer3 needs to work on spelling :/
<rickspencer3> pitti, chouette
<rickspencer3> I have time blocked out today to go over all the blueprints
 * baptistemm just seens people are writing french here
<rickspencer3> (especially quickly ones)
<rickspencer3> hi baptistemm, indeed ... j'etudi francais
 * rickspencer3 has taken it for 3 weeks
<baptistemm> hÃ©hÃ©
<baptistemm> bonne chance :)
 * pitti now stops pretending that he can speak a single word in French
<baptistemm> I admit I didn't got all messages written above :)
<rickspencer3> :/
<rickspencer3> baptistemm, how do I "I feel energized"?
<baptistemm> rickspencer3, don't hesitate to ask for a translator, there is a lot of french people here :)
<baptistemm> "Je me sens plein d'Ã©nergie" I'd say
<baptistemm> "Je me sens en forme" perhaps
<rickspencer3> "je me sens foo" = "I'm feeling foo"?
<rickspencer3> baptistemm ^
<baptistemm> yep
<baptistemm> I feel tired, => je me sens fatiguÃ©
<jcastro> pitti or seb128: zeuthen maintains g-d-u correct?
<pitti> jcastro: upstream, yes
<jcastro> pitti, and policykit-gnome too right?
<pitti> right
<jcastro> thanks!
<Ng> robbiew: have you had any flashing-capslock crashes from your 301?
<robbiew> no
<and471> mvo, mpt: I have been able to do some work on the history view of software-center
<Ng> bah
 * Ng fears for his hardware
<and471> mpt: are you available to scrutinise it for 5 mins?
<and471> mpt: don't worry I shall catch you another time
<chrisccoulson> are some users still having general issues with locking the screen using the indicator-session applet?
<chrisccoulson> mac_v?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: WFM
<mac_v> chrisccoulson:  hmmm ... what did i do, now ? o.0
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, it works here too, but i seem to remember some people were having issues with it
<chrisccoulson> and i just found an issue with it
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: you mean the screen lock? i'm not having problems , WFM ;)
<chrisccoulson> if gnome-screensaver starts after indicator-user-service, then it fails to lock the screen
<mac_v> mpt: regarding notify-osd>>> * There will be a new style, yet to be decided.   << how about having 1px white line around the bubbles :)
<pitti> good night everyone!
<dobey> hrmm
<dobey> is it just me, or is anyone else seeing a fd leak with rhythmbox on karmic?
<serialorder> I am looking at some of the merges on http://piware.de/workitems/desktop/lucid/versions.html
<serialorder> there are many where like this for example  vino  2.28.1-0ubuntu2  2.28.1-1 where the debian version doesn't introduce anything new. It makes the m a fairly simple merge. Is that something that I might work on or is there other plans?
<Laney> serialorder: yes, do them if you are so inclined
<serialorder> what shoudl i doonce they are done
<serialorder> how do i get them approved?
<serialorder> like I would with a some other universe package? file a bug then add universe-sponsors or something else since they are ubuntu-desktop packages?
<Laney> main sponsors if it's in main
<serialorder> ok so there is nothing special to do because it is part of ubuntu-desktop?
<mdz> eek:
<mdz> mdz       2886  0.0 68.0 2095488 1005860 ?     Sl   Oct09   2:26 /usr/lib/evolution/evolution-data-server-2.28 --oaf-activat
<RaXOR> hi 2 all... who can say is it ubuntu soft developers room ?
<RaXOR> is anybody active here ?? thx
<chrisccoulson> hi mclasen - i saw your comment on bug 579738. i've just tested a patch which should be sufficient for a stable update in ubuntu (ie, it fixes the crash), but it doesn't remove all the atexit handlers like you suggested. would you mind taking a quick look to make sure that it still does what you *think* it should be doing when it exits?
<ubottu> Error: Launchpad bug 579738 could not be found
<chrisccoulson> oops, gnome bug 579738
<ubottu> Gnome bug 579738 in Agent "seahorse-agent leaves behind its socket dir" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=579738
<chrisccoulson> the patch is at http://people.ubuntu.com/~chrisccoulson/seahorse-plugins%20SRU/seahorse-plugins_2.28.1-0ubuntu4.debdiff
<mclasen> looks like the right idea; have you checked if any of the other uninit functions does anything relevant ? It didn't look like it to me
<chrisccoulson> mclasen - i had a quick look through, and the other uninit functions seemed to be mainly unref'ing widgets and removing gconf notifies etc
<chrisccoulson> thanks for looking. we'l probably upload this tomorrow
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-11-10
<chrisccoulson> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, hey
<chrisccoulson> how are you today?
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, happy - the dentist said my teeth were good ;)
<chrisccoulson> that's good:)
<chrisccoulson> the last time I went to the dentist, they had to drill part of my jaw ;)
<chrisccoulson> (to remove my lower wisdom teeth)
<robert_ancell> ow
<chrisccoulson> it was ok - they sedated me first :)
 * TheMuso didn't need to get wisdom teeth removed, which is a good thing.
<rickspencer3> poor robert_ancell :(
<rickspencer3> he TheMuso
<chrisccoulson> TheMuso - i wouldn't recommend having them removed ;)
<TheMuso> chrisccoulson: Well since they are causing no issues, they will stay there.
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's ok then. mine were causing issues, but i'm still not sure it was worth getting them removed
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell - i had a look at your PPA version of seahorse-plugins earlier, but there is still a call to seahorse_gconf_unnotify in the exit handler
<chrisccoulson> i've done it a slightly different way, here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/314684/
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, right.  It stopped the problem for me (I couldn't reproduce using xtrace bug killall -9 X did the trick).  I'm not convinced this patch is worth it however.
<chrisccoulson> i think that normally, the patch would not be worth it, but we've broken launchpad with all the duplicates now (it seems that nobody can view the bug any more)
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, yeah I though LP said they'd fixed the issue of unnecessarily notifying everyone of duplicates.  Apparently not
<chrisccoulson> heh, it still notifies everyone. but worse than that, we seem to have hit a hard limit that stops anyone from viewing the bug now
<chrisccoulson> (and prevents people from unsubscribing)
<rickspencer3> hi robert_ancell, hi TheMuso
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, hey rick
<rickspencer3> so, I'll be on plane during the Easter Edition tomorrow
<rickspencer3> :/
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, mgmt starting UDS early again?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, no
<rickspencer3> I'm attending the Dx sprint
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, fun :)
<rickspencer3> can't wait
<rickspencer3> so, blueprints blueprints blueprints
<rickspencer3> let's get 'em in order
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, yeah it's a real mess
<chrisccoulson> it is! so i'm not sure we'll get away without a SRU, and the update is fairly safe anyway
<chrisccoulson> i think i'm nearly done with karmic SRU's
<bryce> bleah wish I were
<chrisccoulson> i've still got a g-s-d crash to investigate, and a gnome-screensaver regression to look at, but that's about it i think
<bryce> I think I might be at a point where I should just move on to lucid, and backport stuff as fixes become available
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's probably the best way
<chrisccoulson> else you will still be working on karmic SRU's when lucid is released ;)
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, it may be easier just to blacklist this stacktrace in apport
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell - yeah, maybe
<robert_ancell> pitti, ^ can you look at this seahorse-applets problem and see if it makes more sense to ignore the crashes in apport?
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, because there will probably be people who install from CD and will keep triggering this problem even if we SRU
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's a good point. although, apport will be disabled when installing from the CD
<chrisccoulson> anyway, i've hosted the patch at http://people.ubuntu.com/~chrisccoulson/seahorse-plugins%20SRU/seahorse-plugins_2.28.1-0ubuntu4.debdiff for now
<chrisccoulson> i'm going to get some sleep in a bit:)
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, cya tomorrow
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, hi
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, hey
<rickspencer3> what exactly is moonvidia?
<robert_ancell> did I spell it like that...
<rickspencer3> and btw, looking at your blueprint additions, it occurs to me, we really only frozen bubble
<rickspencer3> Moovida
<rickspencer3> sorry
<rickspencer3> ^only half joking about fb bty
<rickspencer3> isn't there a multi-player for frozen bubble?
<robert_ancell> It's a media centre.  So it's a full screen media player that's easier to use on a tv for instance
<rickspencer3> does it do videos, music, etc...?
 * rickspencer3 installs
<rickspencer3> a bit bug?
<rickspencer3> a bit big, even
<robert_ancell> There is multiplayer for FB.  I was just looking at it then.  It doesn't integrate well into the desktop style though.  Not sure if we should be worried about that
 * rickspencer3 notes to never type after kung fu class
<robert_ancell> heh :)
<rickspencer3> well, it's a really good game
<robert_ancell> how big?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, yes, very addictive
<rickspencer3> maybe we could make it work with telepathy?
<rickspencer3> moovide required 24 megs
<robert_ancell> due to dependencies or just core stuff?
<rickspencer3> so moovid is for a media center pc?
<robert_ancell> I was impressed when I tried a mac - they have it installed by default and it's handy if you want to browse easily, or you have a remote, or your plugged into a big screen tv
<rickspencer3> yeah, but for a pc by default?
<robert_ancell> yes
<robert_ancell> on a macbook
<robert_ancell> however moovida hasn't been super stable when I've tried previously (though that could be clutter)
<robert_ancell> hmm, perhaps we should propose a webpage on ubuntu.com - "Tried Ubuntu, w
<robert_ancell> "Want more software - here are some good ideas: gimp, moovida, ... or just search yourself in the app store"
<rickspencer3> yeah
<robert_ancell> that way we can recommend some more stuff without having it installed by default
<rickspencer3> or the software center could suggest some tasty once
<robert_ancell> yeah, as long as we can show a one page advertisement of "good stuff"
<robert_ancell> kind of like a brochure
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> you should totally do that
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, you have a blog, no?
<rickspencer3> you could do "app of the week" ;)
<robert_ancell> yes, been meaning to start it up again.  I think a games survery may be the next post
<robert_ancell> survey
<robert_ancell> well, I think the "app of the week" has been done already by sites like gnomefiles.org etc.  I'm thinking more of a page that gets made for each release.  So for Lucid we recommend these apps
<robert_ancell> ...
<robert_ancell> and for M we recommend these apps
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> double hmmmm
<rickspencer3> seems very doable
<rickspencer3> gots to run
<robert_ancell> It's probably just what's on the DVD but not on the CD.  But make it easy for the CD users to see these applications
<rickspencer3> yeah
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, cool, have fun at the sprint and see you in Dallas!
<rickspencer3> thanks robert_ancell looking forward to seeing you
<rickspencer3> when do you get in?
<robert_ancell> sunday some time.  It's on the Wiki
<robert_ancell> 5pm
<rickspencer3> cool
<rickspencer3> see you then
<serialorder> Every time I build a package I keep getting this difference in debian/control
<serialorder> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/314836/
<serialorder> it is due to the @GNOME@ in control.in and I am wondering if this is something I should be concerned with or ignore?
<serialorder> oh sorry the diff isbetween the debian package and the ubuntu package I merged with it
<jmarsden> serialorder: Sounds like your package builds debian/control from control.in each time, and that doesn't seem like something to worry about to me... but you might want to ask the MOTUs in #ubuntu-motu
<serialorder> ok onto MOTU, thanks jmarsden
<jmarsden> No problem.
<pitti> Good morning
<al-maisan> moin pitti
<didrocks> hey pitti, al-maisan
<al-maisan> hello didrocks :)
<baptistemm> hello
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<baptistemm> bonjour chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hello baptistemm
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<baptistemm> fine
<baptistemm> tomorrow is a bank holiday
<baptistemm> :)
<chrisccoulson> excellent! do you have any plans?
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti - did you see the conversation i had with robert_ancell last night in the scrollback, about seahorse-plugins?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, I did; I was about to create an apport bug pattern, but someone else already beat me to it
<pitti> chrisccoulson: the main problem here was that apport did not get disabled on upgrades due to an update-manager bug (fixed in -updates now), so we got flooded with crash reports :-(
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it seems that way. so, i'm not sure if we want to fix it or not
<chrisccoulson> but i've got a patch which is fairly trivial
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'm fine with fixing it; biggest problem is that we can't use that bug any more, it keeps timing out :(
<pitti> (for communication about teh SRU)
<pitti> I used /+text :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i was wondering about that last night. it seems we broke lauchpad there ;)
<chrisccoulson> did you see the patch?
<chrisccoulson> i put it here: http://people.ubuntu.com/~chrisccoulson/seahorse-plugins%20SRU/
<chrisccoulson> seeing as i could no longer attach it to the bug ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: uploaded
<pitti> thank you!
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks:)
<Zdra> Hi
<Zdra> we have an issue in gstreamer0.10-ffmpeg: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=578160
<ubottu> Gnome bug 578160 in gst-ffmpeg "ffenc_h263 doesn't list the resolutions it actually supports" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<Zdra> it prevent MSN video call from empathy
<Zdra> and jabber video call fails too if h264 is not installed
<Zdra> the proposed patch fix the issue and is now included in debian package
<Zdra> is it possible to get that into karmic too?
<Zdra> I'm not sure were to ask such thing
<pitti> Zdra: find/create an Ubuntu bug for it and request an SRU (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates)
<huats> morning
<cassidy> Zdra, I updated the pkg to the TP PPA for now
<czajkowski> .c
<pitti> Riddell: do you want to schedule the kubuntu BPs yourself? or want me to do it?
<Riddell> pitti: I was going to look at that this morning
<pitti> ok, cheers
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it seems that there will be a fix to LP soon for the bug which makes bug 429322 time out, so we will be able to get user feedback hopefully
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429322 in seahorse-plugins "seahorse-agent assert failure: ERROR:iop-profiles.c:606:IOP_generate_profiles: assertion failed: (obj && (obj->profile_list == NULL) && obj->orb)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429322
<seb128> hello there
<pitti> Bonjour, Monsieur Bacher!
<seb128> hey pitti!
<didrocks> hey seb128, not too jet lagged? :)
<seb128> didrocks, hey, jet what?
<seb128> I slept a bit in the plane, slept at 1am local
<seb128> and the alarm clock woke me at 8am then
<didrocks> ok so, should be ok ^^
<seb128> didrocks, hey, I deal with timezones fine usually
<jcastro> hi seb128
<jcastro> seb128, I have your battery!
<seb128> hey jcastro
<seb128> jcastro, you rock! where are you?
<seb128> jcastro, coming for uds or before?
<jcastro> I don't get there until saturday
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<seb128> hello kenvandine
<czajkowski> morning folks
<kenvandine> hey czajkowski
<czajkowski> anyone want a google wave ac?
<czajkowski> have 19 more to give away
<kenvandine> i still need to figure out how to use mine :)
<mac_v> czajkowski: i'd like , one :)
<czajkowski> mac_v: just dm me @gmail.com address
<czajkowski> and I'll send it
<mac_v> czajkowski: cool , ok , thanks :)
<czajkowski> np
<rickspencer3> ccheney`, hello
<seb128> hey there
<rickspencer3> jcastro, can you let me know when you have the plenaries scheduled, please?
 * rickspencer3 needs to plan
<jcastro> rickspencer3, I was going to do it today
<jcastro> rickspencer3, I'll do them right after lunch
<jcastro> rickspencer3, you want yours all spaced out I assume?
<rickspencer3> jcastro, hmm
<rickspencer3> I think having the quickly one early would be good, because then we can have the sessions *after* it
<jcastro> right
<rickspencer3> but same with the launchpadlib one (which jml is doing)
<jcastro> rickspencer3, you can just tell me what times you want it like the others: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UDS-L/Plenaries
<rickspencer3> actually, he's traveling atm, so maybe do his a bit later in the week
<cj> hi folks
<jcastro> rickspencer3, the ARM and freescale ones are the only ones tied to a set time, after I schedule them you have the scheduling rights to move them around if you'd like.
<rickspencer3> jcastro, ok
<rickspencer3> we'll talk after desktop team meeting
<jcastro> since I have you here I sent an invite for a call with you and asac after the desktop meeting if you'd like
<cj> so... for the Appearance Preference's Visual Effects dialogue... would you accept a patch to have the effect selection activated on an "Apply" button press instead?
<jcastro> wrt. browsers
 * cj is feeling a bit of UX pain
 * ArneGoetje waves
<rickspencer3> asac, ArneGoetje, bryce_ ccheney`kenvandine Riddell pitti tkamppeter desktop team meeting now, right?
<pitti> yep
<kenvandine> cj, i doubt anyone would be offended if you attach a patch to a bug
 * kenvandine is here
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-11-10
 * rickspencer3 taps gavel
<rickspencer3> are we ready? seems quiet
 * rickspencer3 shoots pistols into air
<Riddell> hi
<asac> hi
<rickspencer3> ^Dallas reference
<pitti> rickspencer3: please rather shoot my MTA, so that it stops sending me mail
<cj> kenvandine: alrighty.  where's the source?
<cj> oh?  meeting.  sorry.
<rickspencer3> np
<pitti> <texas mode>Howdy, y'all
<rickspencer3> MTA?
<kenvandine> hehe
<pitti> rickspencer3: mail server
<rickspencer3> ah
<rickspencer3> I was thinking something like "Mother In Law" but in German
<rickspencer3> ok, moving on ...
<rickspencer3> Performance Reviews ...
<asac> "schwiegermutter" ;)
<rickspencer3> did everyone (who is a Canonical employee) see the mail from HR today?
<bryce_> morning
<kenvandine> yes
<ArneGoetje> yep
<pitti> yes
 * rickspencer3 reads
 * asac checks
<pitti> except that the current system doesn't actually allow me to do anything
<pitti> does that work for anyone else?
<rickspencer3> The deadline for completing all
<rickspencer3> evaluations (individual and manager) is Friday 20 November.
<ArneGoetje> haven't tried yet
<rickspencer3> this means that *I* have to write all of the perf. reviews by Nov 20
<rickspencer3> so .. please help me with this by getting your personal evaluation done by the end of this week
<rickspencer3> please please please
<rickspencer3> all this work overlaps perfectly with UDS, so I ask that you prioritize this so I don't end up behind the 8-ball
<rickspencer3> </begging>
<pitti> rickspencer3: any fallback? like doing the eval in prose via mail for now?
<kenvandine> will do
<rickspencer3> pitti, please follow up with Alice
<pitti> noted
<rickspencer3> if you are having trouble with the system
<rickspencer3> please note that Alice is well aware of the limitations ;)
<asac> for me the new process feels odd ... without looking it seems like a step backward ;)
<asac> but thats an unqualified comment ... just an imporession from the mails we got
<tseliot> pitti: I had to submit my evaluation twice (losing the 1st one) but then it worked
<pitti> Tasks:   0
<pitti> I simply can't do anything
<rickspencer3> oh well
<bryce_> asac, I think it's true
 * rickspencer3 looks to see if he countersigned pitti's objectives
<kenvandine> pitti, that sounds like rickspencer3's fault :)
<rickspencer3> anyway, as I say, please approach alice if you need help, and note that she is stuck working with the system for *everynone*
<pitti> the countersigning for my goals failed with an error, I sent it to Alice
<bryce_> asac, although it's still better than some systems I've used for reviews...
<asac> good ;)
<rickspencer3> it said I was done the last time I checked
<rickspencer3> nope, it's not me
<rickspencer3> okay, enough of that
<rickspencer3> let us move on to important work
 * rickspencer3 hands mic to pitti
<pitti> so, UDS/lucid
<kenvandine> yay!
<pitti> as we discussed on last week's meeting, I collected requested BPs from everyone in our team, and some outside requests, and built https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+specs?searchtext=desktop
<pitti> all of those are now also scheduled
<pitti> so I have some collective tasks for you:
<pitti> - check the list if you see anything missing which you'd like to talk about
<pitti> if you have something, please contact me
<tkamppeter> hi
<pitti> - check https://blueprints.launchpad.net/people/+me/+specs?role=drafter to make sure that you are happy with the ones that you draft
<pitti> those are the ones that YOU drive at UDS, both the session, and the specification writing
<pitti> for those, you should ensure that you put in a meaningful summary
<pitti> if you want extra bonus, already prepare a spec skeleton and put it into the wiki, and copy it into gobby.u.c. already, to avoid having to do this prep at the start of a session
<pitti> so far I could avoid having too much parallelization of our track on summit.ubuntu.com
<pitti> we still have some air left schedule-wise
<pitti> (we are already over-booked development capacity wise, of course :) )
<rickspencer3> *cough*
<pitti> </ramblings>
<kenvandine> of course
<pitti> any questions wrt. planning, schedule, blueprints, procedures?
<Riddell> I'm about to schedule our Kubuntu specs, hopefully there's room left for those?
<pitti> Riddell: yes, lots of
<pitti> Riddell: we have to parallelize with other desktop tracks, but that should work fine
<pitti> Riddell: there's lots of GNOME specific stuff there
<kenvandine> are we doing the room shuffling we did last year?
<kenvandine> s/year/time/
<pitti> kenvandine: yes, we do
<kenvandine> ok
<pitti> the current scheduler doesn't even allow me to put in two adjanced sessions of teh same track into one room
<pitti> (not that I'm entirely happy with this approach, but *shrug*)
<rickspencer3> room shuffling is a hard and fast requirement
<pitti> that has the benefit that I could pick an appropriately-sized room for the predicted audience size
 * bryce_ watches the X talks scheduled into the coat closet
<pitti> bryce_: ?
<bryce_> ;-)
<rickspencer3> pitti, to clarify ...
<pitti> bryce_: I didn't schedule the talks at all; not sure who does them
<rickspencer3> if I want to add a session, do I just create a blueprint and then let you know?
<pitti> rickspencer3: yes, just prod me on IRC with the link
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> pitti, note that I can be a back up scheduler
<bryce_> pitti, yeah just joking... we have scant few X people coming this UDS so I don't anticipate the X talks will be that exciting this time
<rickspencer3> also, dbarth has scheduling rights this time around, as does Riddell
<pitti> right, that's why the wiki page says "Tell pitti or rickspencer3 when you add a new one which needs accepting for uds-l and scheduling " :)
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, your question about the dx team having a greeter blueprint, i think that is just because it was punted in karmic
<rickspencer3> pitti, uh ... yeah, my question for didactic purposes, actually ;)
<kenvandine> i don't think that means they think they are doing it for lucid
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, ok, I need you to sort this out with them
<kenvandine> it is just cruft
<rickspencer3> and also Foundations
<pitti> so, everyone bother rickspencer3 _first_ :)
<kenvandine> hehe
<pitti> j/k
<rickspencer3> lol
<rickspencer3> I don't care, in Barcelona it seems all I did was schedule
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, you will be seeing dbarth tomorrow
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, yes
<rickspencer3> there are too many "boot" related blueprints, atm, I think we need to coordinate that better
<kenvandine> he hasn't shown up online today
<rickspencer3> robbiew is trying to boil it down, atm
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, he is sprinting all week
<kenvandine> ok, good
<kenvandine> i know...
<rickspencer3> pitti, all done?
<pitti> rickspencer3: yep
<rickspencer3> pitti, thanks for your tireless efforts getting this organized
<rickspencer3> I feel quite good about our blueprints and schedule atm
<rickspencer3> great job!
<pitti> thanks!
<rickspencer3> any other business?
 * kenvandine feels much better about this time, last UDS was new to me
<robbiew> kenvandine: rickspencer3: there are a lot of boot related blueprints to allow for tracking of work by different teams...but only two sessions on boot at UDS
<robbiew> one for performance and the other for experience
<kenvandine> robbiew, so perhaps there should be 2 blueprints
<robbiew> I figure we can then discuss the individual work items in the session
<rickspencer3> meh
<rickspencer3> robbiew, thank you muchly
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> all, see you in Dallas
<kenvandine> you too, have a good trip!
<rickspencer3> note that you will be issued boots, hat, and fringy leather jacket at customs
<asac> eom?
<robbiew> heh
<robbiew> and dip
<rickspencer3> please wear these at all times
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, what about the belt buckle?
<asac> hehe
 * kenvandine needs to get a really huge one 
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, if you do not have a buckle you will not be allowed into the country
<pitti> do I say "howdy" or "y'all" to the customs officer?
<rickspencer3> they should check this with your passport at your point of origin
<kenvandine> pitti, both
<rickspencer3> pitti, you say "yes sir" and "no sir"
<rickspencer3> ;)
 * rickspencer3 taps gavel
<rickspencer3> thanks all!
<ArneGoetje> thanks
<asac> thx
<pitti> thanks everyone
 * rickspencer3 goes to airport soon
 * kenvandine grabs a quick sandwich before working on perf review
<pitti> I just discovered today that they put me into a different plane than the other German guys :-(
<pitti> I initially thought it'd be the same plane and just a code share between AA and Lufthansa
<pitti> but apparently they are really having two flights from Frankfurt to Dallas which both land at 1435 :(
<kenvandine> wow
<pitti> is that part of a secret "don't put the entire team into one plane" strategy?
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> risk management
<bryce_> pitti, keeping the troublemakers apart
<mvo> pitti: oh? a shame :/
<pitti> what if the two planes fly so close to each other that they collide?
<tkamppeter> pitti, AA and LH do not code-share, they are different groups.
 * pitti sobs
<pitti> well, at least we can meet in Dallas to share taxis, etc.
<pitti> and you guys have the comfortable Airbus, I have a stone-old Boeing
<pitti> :)
<pitti> just wanted to say "looking forward to seeing you all again!"
<pitti> (sorry, "y'all")
<dobey> heh
<chrisccoulson> have fun everyone ;)
<rickspencer3> pitti, what's the single best link to provide for someone to see Lucid Desktop blueprints?
<asac> maybe this: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu?searchtext=lucid+desktop
<asac> pitti: afaik AA is the airline with most space per seat ;) (i read that in some test)
<dobey> i'm pretty sure that was a lie
<asac> well ... i think that was just about US airlines ;)
<dobey> or a very old test
<asac> http://www.cheapflug.de/reisetipps/beinfreiheit-im-flugzeug/
<asac> that one suggests that it varies a lot ;)
<asac> 79 cm-89 cm
<asac> i think i read those 89cm
<asac> which is indeed the highest number on that page afaict
<asac> oh air india has 91cm as top
<asac> LH has 81cm ... so changes are high that there is more space in AA ;)
<asac> assuming some kind of reasoanble distribution
<dobey> as far as i know, they're all too small
<dobey> i might have to upgrade myself for the second leg of my flight :)
<asac> yeah. but every centimeter counts ;)
<asac> i want a bed ;)
<hggdh> well, if it happens any... I fly a lot on AA. They suck on space for legs
<hggdh> s/happens/helps/
<seb128> hey again
<rickspencer3> seb128
<rickspencer3> salut!
<seb128> did I miss the meeting?
<asac> hggdh: well. everyone sucks ;) ... question is if they suck more
<seb128> anything interesting?
<seb128> rickspencer3, lut!
<dobey> asac: well, there's a reason i have a 5.6" laptop :)
<asac> i am sure UA is the worst i was on ;)
<bryce_> seb128, not really... you got a lot of action items, but besides that...
<seb128> rickspencer3, comment ca va?
<seb128> bryce_, heh ;-)
<rickspencer3> bien, merci
<hggdh> asac: my experience is most of the American companies (except for Southwest) suck more than Europeans on leg space
<asac> besides from some thailand airline which i would not put in the calculation ;)
<rickspencer3> et tois?
<seb128> toi
<seb128> bien, merci
<asac> hi seb128 ;)
<seb128> I got over jet lag in 0 day
<seb128> slept a bit in the plane, stayed until 1am
<bryce_> seb128, actually a) do perf review asap; b) let pitti know of any missing blueprints asap#2
<asac> how is sprint going? or just arrived?
<seb128> and woke up with the alarm clock at 8
<seb128> bryce_, thanks
<rickspencer3> seb128, tu n'es fatigue pas?
<seb128> asac, arrived yesterday afternoon, good so far, got only one session
<seb128> rickspencer3, non, j'ai bien dormis
 * rickspencer3 is really struggling without the book
<asac> sounds like holiday then :-P
<rickspencer3> bon!
<seb128> rickspencer3, "bien"
<rickspencer3> bien!
<rickspencer3> chouette!
<seb128> rickspencer3, seems you have a hard time between bon and bien for good :-)
<rickspencer3> oui
<seb128> rickspencer3, tu arrives quand pour le sprint?
<rickspencer3> esa sur
<rickspencer3> ???
<seb128> esa?
<seb128> when do you arrive there?
<rickspencer3> neuf heurs moins dix
<seb128> there = Dallas
<seb128> ok
<rickspencer3> ^ seb128 correct way to say 10 till nine?
<rickspencer3> REMINDER: tomorrow is US holiday!!
<seb128> yes
<seb128> you just lack a e at "heure"
<kenvandine> HuNannyYumYum, how is the hackfest?
<seb128> tomorrows is a french holiday too
<HuNannyYumYum> kenvandine: AWESOME
<seb128> but it looks like I will be working ;-)
<kenvandine> HuNannyYumYum, you coming to UDS?
<HuNannyYumYum> kenvandine: sadly no
<HuNannyYumYum> kenvandine: i got visa issues
<kenvandine> bummer
<HuNannyYumYum> but thekorn "MArkus Korn" from the zeitgeist engine side will be there
<HuNannyYumYum> so other tha missing a good time with me
<kenvandine> :)
<HuNannyYumYum> u wotn miss anything
<kenvandine> HuNannyYumYum, your always fun to hang out with
<HuNannyYumYum> kenvandine: i can only say the same abotu u
<HuNannyYumYum> :)
<asac> Riddell: do you know the suse guy who worked on those patches?
<asac> e.g. where can i meet him on irc ;)
<Riddell> asac: firefox patches?  that'll be llunak
<Riddell> asac: who will be on #kde-devel where I believe you also hang out :)
<asac> hmm ... i think i am not in there anymore since i closed my irc
<asac> let me join
<asac> oh ... i am in there indeed ;)
<asac> hehe
<asac> ETOOMANYCHANNELS
<asac_> seb128: libseed0 depending on gobject-introspection ... makes sense?
<asac_> in any case ... seems like that has recommends on a bunch of -dev packages
<asac_> which definitly feels wrong
<asac_> e.g. dyfet observed that installing epiphany pulls in a bunch of -dev packages ;)
<seb128> both seems right
<seb128> I don't think the depends are wrong
<seb128> the issue is probably in the js stack
<asac_> seb128: so you say its sane to install a bunch of -dev packages if you apt-get install epiphany?
<seb128> things are loading the .so
<asac_> for me the -dev packages as recommends definitly feel wrong
<seb128> no, I say it's because the code does dump thing
<seb128> like opening libsomething.sop
<seb128> .so
<asac_> which code does that?
<seb128> not sure
<seb128> but we had the same issue with gnome-shell when packaging it
<asac_> that should open the properly so versioned file instead
<seb128> I didn't spend time to investigate
<asac_> kk
<seb128> things in the js and introspection stack
<seb128> I think they introspect the .so
<seb128> easier than tracking a changing soname I guess there
<seb128> pitti, oh come on
<seb128> bug #393534 is an obvious upstream fix
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 393534 in gtk+2.0 "gtkiconview issue, evolution chokes when attaching files sometimes" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/393534
<seb128> and asac overwrite the change grat
<seb128> great
<asac_> seb128: i pushed for that because the comments were only negatice
<seb128> f***k
<seb128> I stop doing any SRU this cycle
<seb128> I'm really annoyed now
<asac_> come on ...
<seb128> seriously
<seb128> I'm really really unhappy about how we handle SRUs
<seb128> I worked late last week to get fixes in before traveling
<seb128> and because some user didn't confirm it was its exact issue we just drop the work
<seb128> grrrreat
<asac_> right. it was a miscommunication thing
<seb128> make me want to do work
<asac_> shit happens
<asac_> the current fix can go in quick because its a safe thing
<seb128> sru policy are getting ridiculous
<asac_> i will upload it again if that makes you happier
<seb128> the one I uploaded was a one liner
<seb128> and was coming from upstream
<seb128> and obvious too
<seb128> I'm angry enough that I should close IRC and go to something else now
<asac_> seb128: ok. so what i saw was a) its a low importance bug ... and b) no positive comments at all
<asac_> so blame me ...
<seb128> it's not how importance, it's a well known issue leading to the default mail client hanging when there is a file with an email to display
<seb128> it might not be end of the world but seems something to fix before a warning displayed in some log
<asac_> yes. but then the bug should not have been low
<seb128> right
<seb128> I tend to no bother too much with settings
<seb128> but it's not reason to drop my work on the floor while I'm travelling
<seb128> that could have waited until I show up there
<asac_> right. but it was set and made me believe it was not really important if it takes another few days. the XID thing really caused real issues for some filling up full /home partition etc.
<seb128> as you want
<asac_> no ... i agree it was maybe not the right thing to do
<seb128> I don't get why you didn't queue 2 changes
<seb128> the one liner was a non issue
<asac_> that was a misguidance by folks saying its not fixed
<seb128> alright
<asac_> i dont think the current upload needs to wait long ... i can talk to pitti and see if we can get that out tomorrow
<seb128> still pretty annoyed
<asac_> sure. understand that
<seb128> and I'm not in the best setup to do srus now
<seb128> since I'm travelling
<asac_> yes. i will do that
<seb128> thanks
<asac_> for you
<asac_> that was always the deal
 * seb128 hugs asac
<seb128> it was not the deal from the bug comment I got from pitti
<asac_> the least i can do
<asac_> oh sorry.
<asac_> we discussed that we can requeue it right after
<asac_> and of course i would just do that if you are not at home
<seb128> thanks
<asac_> but pitti usually just posts his templates
<seb128> well he said the change got superseded by yours
<asac_> so thats probably why it felt like it was ultimately denied
<seb128> and need to be "fixed" and reuploaded
<asac_> no .. thats wrong
<seb128> but I don't see what I can "fix" there
<asac_> i think thats wrong wording ... i think he meant: replaced to fast path it
<seb128> ok
<pitti> rickspencer3: I use https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+specs?searchtext=desktop
<pitti> seb128: sorry, but it wasn't about "users didn't confirm it", it was "users confirmed that it doesn't help"
<seb128> pitti, random users who might have a different issue
<pitti> seb128: well, the work isn't lost, it can always be reapplied, but what would it bring if it doesn't actually help to fix the hang?
<seb128> we have 3 bugs which look similar
<seb128> the ones asac did work on which were engine ones
<seb128> the gtk issue
<seb128> and seems there is an another one
<seb128> the fix was a one liner correct change
<seb128> it doesn't fix 3 cases
<seb128> and it's easy to get users confused and commenting on the wrong bug
<seb128> it doesn't mean the fix is not correct
<pitti> right, I didn't say that the fix was wrong, but apparently far from sufficient?
<seb128> what I'm unhappy about is that it leads to have a correct update dropped without ping before
<seb128> as said there is several issues
<seb128> theme engine, gtk and evo
<seb128> while this one is not fixing all issues it was fixes a part of the those
<seb128> that's like usb device mounting
<seb128> you have often different bugs and users commenting on the wrong one
<pitti> so, want me to reupload that bug and ask people to test again?
<seb128> because they think that's the issue they have, their usb key is not mounting either
<seb128> no that's ok
<seb128> asac will do after the current one goes in
<pitti> ok
<seb128> what I'm unhappy about is that nobody waiting for me to be around
<seb128> and just dropped the work on the floor
<pitti> I'm sorry about that; we should have handled that differently then
<seb128> that's ok I sorted that with asac
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> bugs are just getting on my nerves this week
<seb128> I've been doing almost only bug reading since karmic
 * pitti hugs back seb128; sorry again, we tried to find the best decision while you weren't online
<seb128> and I started my laptop there to have an 900 email backlog and first thing I see today is that my sru got dropped on floor
<pitti> yeah, I can feel it; I spend hours on them these days, too
<seb128> I find sru to be time sinks atm
<pitti> heh, tell me :)
 * pitti looks at gtimelog -- 9.5 hours for SRU processing last week, hmm
<pitti> must be post-release time
<seb128> we should make srus easier ;-)
<seb128> joke aside we need to fix this issue or users commenting on random bugs and undermining correct work
<pitti> we could require SRUs to be verified by QA team, but that would do exactly the opposite of "easier"
<pitti> we got some 50 SRUs through the process since the release
<pitti> of which maybe 10 or less were verified by QA
<pitti> I think we have to rely on user testing
<seb128> right
<seb128> we should not let a random user comment about the change not working as expected be enough to decline the update
<seb128> there is always cases where users didn't install the update correctly
<seb128> or comment at the wrong place
<seb128> or didn't restart their software before testing etc
<pitti> oh, it wasn't "decline", rather "postponed"
<bryce_> seb128, I share your pain.  Try working on srus for proprietary video driver issues.  Ugghhh
<pitti> I didn't take the comment as "it regresses" or so
<seb128> pitti, well you comment say to "fix and reupload"
<tgpraveen1> can someone confirm that it is a bug that if I have set up a google calendar in evolution and then each time I start my computer I get asked for my computer password by a keyring dialog so that it can access the credentials for the calendar
<seb128> tgpraveen1, it's not a bug
<seb128> tgpraveen1, you need to unlock the keyring to have those in the calendar applet
<pitti> seb128: "reupload and fix the remaining cases later" is also valid
<seb128> pitti, anyway let's not spend extra time on that
<seb128> incident closed
<seb128> next time please wait for me to be around before dropping an update I worked on ;-)
 * seb128 hugs asac and pitti
<pitti> ok
<pitti> *hugs back*
<tgpraveen1> seb128: hmm but why is it not done automatically I don't see any security issue( it wasn't like this in jaunty?) also why isn't there a always remember or something
<chrisccoulson> tgpraveen1 - i seem to remember that you asked me exactly the same question last week
<chrisccoulson> but with network manager
<seb128> tgpraveen1, if the keyring was auto-unlockable without your password it would not be secure
<pitti> tgpraveen1: I doubt that it behaved any different in previous releases
<seb128> the point of having a keyring is that unlock require an information you are the only one to have
<pitti> seb128: btw, I fixed the retracer bug about the InterpreterPath/ExecutablePath; those are just closed as invalid now
<seb128> otherwise anybody could run a program reading your passwords in a programmatic way
<pitti> ^ IOW, you wouldn't need a keyring or passwords in the first place
<seb128> pitti, oh good, I see you restarted those often during the weekend, thanks
<tgpraveen1> chrisccoulson: yes that was with NM. karmic is giving me too many probs and nagging dialogs :-(
<pitti> seb128: that, too, but on Monday I fixed it properly; they still crash due to gateway errors, etc., though
<pitti> speaking of which, they just crashed again; /me pokes
<pitti> HTTP Error 503: Service Temporarily Unavailable
<pitti> yay
<chrisccoulson> tgpraveen1 - but its the same thing, and i seem to remember that i gave you a similar answer to the one that seb128 just gave you
<tgpraveen1> seb128: could you tell me why the calendar needs a keyring at all? is calendar information considered so important that it has to be secured separately?
<chrisccoulson> tgpraveen1 - your google password is stored in the keyring
<seb128> tgpraveen1, your google account infos are considered private yes
<seb128> so they are stored in the keyring
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128 :)
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<tgpraveen1> chrisccoulson: with evolution I wasn't sure if it was a bug or not . as I still don't understand why its being done
<chrisccoulson> how was your travelling?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how are you doing? still no baby?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: !
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good thanks
<pitti> baby?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - no baby yet. my girlfriend is getting very bored now
<seb128> I managed to sleep in the plane a bit
<seb128> stayed until 1am
<seb128> and woke up at 8am
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, we have a baby on the way ;)
<seb128> thanks to my alarm clock I would have overslept
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - do you adjust well to the change in time zone?
<tgpraveen1> seb128: hmm so well I am using automatic login and I think that is the reason for all these keyring dialogs, but I don't want to enter the password so many many times is why I went for auto login. I mean I fi wanted more security I would used the login with password.
<seb128> apparently yes
<tgpraveen1> is there a way to reduce the security level or something?
<seb128> tgpraveen1, you need to unlock the keyring once
<pitti> chrisccoulson: that's wonderful! I wish you two (three) all the best!
<seb128> you can set an empty password for the keyring
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks :)
<seb128> or have several keyrings and one without password
<tgpraveen1> seb128: once for each avtivity. once when it boots up for evolution.once for NM when connecting to net.etc
<seb128> no
<seb128> you need to unlock the keyring once
<seb128> the first application requesting access will do that
<seb128> then you can use it from other desktop components
<seb128> it's unlocked
<tgpraveen1> once when mounting local hdds
<seb128> that's not keyring
<seb128> that's polkit authorization
<tgpraveen1> seb128: hmm ok I think it asks multiple times I will have to verify that
<seb128> those are equivalent to sudo prompts we had before
<seb128> they ask your user password to run priviledged actions
<seb128> not to have access to your passwords
<tgpraveen1> seb128: ok. I had this discusion with chrisccoulson before and basically in jaunty it never asked for password when mounting local hdds and now I formatted and reinstalled karmic and it asks
<kenvandine> robbiew_, i just switched to the boot ppa... the difference in I/O wait is huge
<seb128> different issue than the keyring one
<seb128> it's the polkit-1 switch
<tgpraveen1> seb128: chrisccoulson couldn't figure out the reason why.
<chrisccoulson> tgpraveen1 - the policy hasn't changed from jaunty -> karmic though, so you probably changed the policy in jaunty
<chrisccoulson> the policy has always been to require authorization to mount internal media
<pitti> kenvandine: tested the bits in karmic-proposed, too? (for SRU feedback)
<seb128> you probably use the editor to allow those without password in jaunty
<kenvandine> pitti, well i tried... but it was held back
<kenvandine> pitti, i can try that too
<tgpraveen1> seb128: ok. and why is this desired behaviour ? to ask my passwd for local media? as an eg USB drives mount automatically
<pitti> tgpraveen1, chrisccoulson, seb128: FYI, that's bug 465054
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 465054 in devicekit-disks "Do not require a password every time to mount internal disks" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/465054
<seb128> that's a pitti's question
<tgpraveen1> pitti: thanks
<pitti> it's not really a desired change, just happens to be that way right now
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks
<chrisccoulson> so the issue is exposed by the loss of checkbox to retain authorization in karmic?
<pitti> pretty much, yes
<pitti> just discussing that with davidz in #udev
<seb128> lunch bbl
<tgpraveen1> hmm about that google calendar in evolution asking for my dialog. so I gave my google password to evolution and asked to remember it. it used keyring to store it. then why does it need my permission to get the keyring now. shouldn't it automatically get the keyring and use the password. I mean if the password isn't shown to anyone, then how is it a security risk?
<chrisccoulson> tgpraveen1 - the keyring has to be unlocked
<chrisccoulson> it is unlocked by default by your log in password
<chrisccoulson> we've been through this already ;)
<chrisccoulson> if you're using auto-login, then you must unlock your keyring manually by specifying the keyring password
<chrisccoulson> unless your keyring has no password
<tgpraveen1> chrisccoulson: ii know we discussed this earlier. but I still don't get why this was designed in this manner
<tgpraveen1> don't you agree that it is a bug / badly designed mechanism
<chrisccoulson> so your passwords are stored securely?
<tgpraveen1> ? or am I the only one seeing it that way.
<chrisccoulson> i don't agree that it is badly designed
<chrisccoulson> i want my passwords to be encrypted on disk, so not everyone can read them. that's not a badly designed mechanism
<tgpraveen1> so um store it securely , then the software should retrieve it securely and not bug the user and ask him for something for which he has already said explicitly to remember the passwords and do
<tgpraveen1> eeverything automatically
<chrisccoulson> it DOES retrieve it securely, but the keyring must be unlocked to retrieve your stored password from it
<chrisccoulson> if your keyring isn't unlocked, then you have to unlock it with the keyring password
<chrisccoulson> i don't know how else to explain it any more :(
<tgpraveen1> um ok so then the ques is why lock the keyring on the user password at all. why not just make application which created the keyring ie evolution here be the only one who can access it
<tgpraveen1> ie when I am logged in then evolution can access the keyrings created
<chrisccoulson> because there is no way to verify what application is accessing the keyring
<tgpraveen1> by me . that should be the info reqd to unlock the keyring not my login password
<chrisccoulson> the keyring is either locked or unlocked
<chrisccoulson> you need to specify credentials to unlock the keyring. normally, this is your log in password. if you're doing auto-login, then that won't work
<chrisccoulson> i can't think of any other way to describe it now
<tgpraveen1> hmm ok.i guess we should leave at this for today
<tgpraveen1> thanks for trying to explain :-)
<kenvandine> pitti, ok kernel and ureadahead from -proposed seem fine here
<kenvandine> pitti, which bug should i verify that on?
<robbiew> kenvandine: you can thank Keybuk and apw ;)
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> they rock!
<kenvandine> when it hits 33s the disk goes nearly idle
<pitti> kenvandine: ureadahead: bug 432089 , kernel: 462111
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 432089 in ureadahead "performs poorly on slow HDD" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/432089
<kenvandine> before the disk was pegged right up to 65s
<kenvandine> which of course made the desktop load chunky even after xsplash hides
<kenvandine> now it is nice and smooth :)
<pitti> there, passwordless internal fs operations for admins
<pitti> chrisccoulson, tgpraveen1 ^
<tgpraveen1> pitti: you fixed it? is it released?
<tgpraveen1> thnaks
<tgpraveen1> thanks even
<pitti> http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-utopia/devicekit-disks.git;a=commit;h=2164f8212a17a3f4ed08ca64411d3cbbec5594b9
<pitti> no, not uploaded yet
<tgpraveen1> yay!
<mac_v> pitti: you rock ;) ...
<pitti> well, three weeks too late :)
<pitti> but lucid, guys, lucid!
<mac_v> pitti: can we backport it?
<pitti> technically yes, but it's not exactly a small change
<mac_v> or me now more eager to use Lucid :)
<pitti> well, it's small in terms of patch size, but it uses code paths that were never really exercised in karmic
<mac_v> pitti: if we just manually add the .pkla to the /var/lib/polkit-1/localauthority/50-local.d/ it should work on karmic too ? or , even that is not possible
<pitti> mac_v: oh, that will work just fine; it's pretty much what the patch is doing
<mac_v>  awesome...
<mac_v> heh , no restart required even ... works like a charm \o/
<pitti> yes, each change to the file becomes active immediately
<mac_v> hehe , i was having a redundant .pkla... and was wondering why it dint work ... doh! it was the wrong "Action"
 * mac_v hopes the systems get smarter in future to recognize user redundancy ;p
 * tgpraveen1 too wishes for it to available for karmic. can't upgrade to lucid for quite some time 
<mac_v> tgpraveen1: it works in karmic , just add the .pkla file and it is done
<mac_v> tgpraveen1: i just added it and i didnt have to do anything else
<tgpraveen1> mac_v: ok. thanks.will have to do that
<rickspencer3> seb128, my flight is slightly delayed
<rickspencer3> I should arrive at  the hotel around dix heure et medi
<seb128> rickspencer3, oh? when you arrived then?
 * rickspencer3 hopes he said 10:30
<seb128> demi you mean?
<rickspencer3> oops
<seb128> yes
<seb128> ok
<jcastro_> rickspencer3: your plenaries are scheduled
<rickspencer3> jcastro_ nice
<rickspencer3> note that the launchpadlin one will be presented by jml
<jcastro_> I didn't put the presenter on there
<jcastro_> there are many that are "it'll be foo, but if he's not around it will be bar." sessions
<jcastro_> also, we have 2 sessions free on friday
<jcastro_> might just do 30 minutes of lightning talks with no slids
<jcastro_> basically, me passing around the mic
<rickspencer3> jcastro_ do we have round up scheduled for Friday?
<jcastro_> since it's friday it will be a good opportunity to get people to talk about their little bit 'o lucid
<jcastro_> yep
<fagan> rickspencer3: The Opportunistic Programmer sessions are for quickly right?
<rickspencer3> fagan, yes
 * rickspencer3 flexes demo muscles
<fagan> Cool
 * fagan loves a good demo
<rickspencer3> good morning robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, hey, stuck in airport?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, yeah, flight is a little delayed
<TheMuso> Hey rickspencer3, robert_ancell.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, morning
<seb128> hey robert_ancell
<rickspencer3> good morning TheMuso
<rickspencer3> huh, guess we could have done the Easter Edition after all
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey up late again :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey, no, in Dallas already now
<seb128> joining dxteam sprint
<rickspencer3> seb128 is making crack with Dx team
<robert_ancell> seb128, sweet
<seb128> rickspencer3, sshhhhh don't ruin my reputation, I told robert_ancell I would stop crack this cycle
<seb128> ;-)
 * robert_ancell adds dallas to his already overloaded clock applet.  Need more vertical resolution
<rickspencer3> oops
<rickspencer3> d'oh, I forgot my GPS puck :(
<rickspencer3> would have been good for the geo-clue session
<seb128> I don't need we need lot of testing there
<seb128> we just need to discuss what we can do with geo-clue
<rickspencer3> but it would have been fun
<rickspencer3> sensors + computer + API = fun
<seb128> hehe
<pitti> robert_ancell: hey, good morning
<robert_ancell> pitti, hey, did you look at this seahorse-applet issue?
<rickspencer3> hi pitti
<pitti> robert_ancell: there's an apport bug pattern for it now, and a patch in -proposed
<pitti> (thanks to chrisccoulson)
<robert_ancell> pitti, excellent
<chrisccoulson> :)
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, good work!
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell - thanks:)
<pitti> good night everyone
<chrisccoulson> 'night pitti
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-11-11
<corp186> I debugged an X crash, patched it up, and got the fix pushed upstream into the xserver git repo
<corp186> It fixes bug 361489
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 361489 in xorg-server "Xorg crash when usb mouse is connected before gdm login" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/361489
<corp186> I left a comment about this in the bug
<corp186> is there anything else I can do to help get this fix released for ubuntu?
<corp186> actually, I'm going to take my question to #ubuntu-x as it's a more appropriate channel
<pitti> Good morning
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<mvo> Amaranth: hey, have you looked into packaging compiz++ yet? I wonder if I should give it a shot
<Amaranth> mvo: You mean for a PPA?
<mvo> yeah
<Amaranth> I figured I'd wait for an actual 0.9 release
<Amaranth> 0.9 is meant to be feature complete, not necessarily stable
<Amaranth> so until then features are missing :)
<mvo> Amaranth: do you have a overview how much is missing at this point?
<Amaranth> err, I mean it'll have the same features as 0.8.x minus things intentionally removed
<Amaranth> mvo: I think just the cube addons (gears, etc) and dbus
<Amaranth> mvo: But I don't know for sure
<mvo> ok, thanks
<huats> hello everyone
<asac> hi huats
<huats> hey asac
<huats> how are you ?
<asac> good ... looking forward to dallas :)
<asac> anyone has still ffox 3.5.4? does this page: http://207.154.83.202 render something for you?
<huats> asac, I can imagine that :)
<mvo> asac: hey
<mvo> asac: yes and yes
<asac> kk
<mvo> asac: installed 3.5.4+nobinonly-0ubuntu0.9.10.1 (just fyi)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - what do you think about me updating tracker to 0.7.x this cycle?
<chrisccoulson> mbiebl asked me last night if i had any plans to do that
<chrisccoulson> (now it is an external dependency of gnome)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: sounds fine; do you think there's a major risk to it?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it's quite a substantial change and the architecture of tracker changed a lot. although the 0.6.9x branch is still officially considered to be the "stable" branch, it doesn't really get any attention any more, and there's a lot of long standing issues which nobody is ever going to fix in that version (it's pretty much abandoned now)
<chrisccoulson> mbiebl has been running 0.7.x for a while now, and says its starting to get quite stable and useable now
<pitti> if 0.7 is actively maintained, that sounds like the better option then
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i think so. and it has lots of extra benefits too (like splitting the store from the indexer, which will be reflected in the new packaging too)
<chrisccoulson> and the bugs for 0.6.9x keep piling up in launchpad, and nobody knows what to do with them any more ;)
<seb128> hey there
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<seb128> hi kenvandine chrisccoulson
<pitti> howdy, seb128
<seb128> hello pitti!
<seb128> how are things in desktop land?
<pitti> quiet today, some time to do bug triage and some bug fixing, too
<seb128> cool
<seb128> bbl
<pitti> I need to leave for today, see you tomorrow!
<Keybuk> bryce: you on leave today?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, what's the deal with gwibber using desktopcouch for storing profile info?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, uh, more specifically, what's the status of it?
 * rickspencer3 realized it sounded like I had an issue
<rickspencer3> well, I suppose I have lots of "issues", but you know what I mean ;)
<gabrieleUbuntu> Hi to all. I'm unable to connect to any network using my DWL-G122 USB key. It does see networks around but it indefinitely tried to connect to them. I had this problem with Ubuntu 9.04. Now I'm on Ubuntu 9.10 having the same problem. Any suggestion, please? Thanks
<chrisccoulson> gabrieleUbuntu, #ubuntu for support
<mac_v> gabrieleUbuntu: #ubuntu is for help
<mac_v> heh ;)
<chrisccoulson> hi mac_v!
<gabrieleUbuntu> :(
<gabrieleUbuntu> ok
<gabrieleUbuntu> thenks
<gabrieleUbuntu> thanks
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: hi... looks like the baby hasnt yet arrived ;)  \o/ we will still have some bugs fixed ;)
<mac_v> while the team is busy at the UDS ;p
<chrisccoulson> heh, yeah, although i do intend to carry on fixing bugs after the baby arrives ;)
<chrisccoulson> i wish i was going to UDS!
<chrisccoulson> seems like i'm the only person not going ;)
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: i did a stupid thing... i decline an invite :(
<mac_v> declined*
<chrisccoulson> how come?
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: i cant make it at that time , so i didnt
<chrisccoulson> that's a shame. have you been before?
<mac_v> my timing *always* sucks
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: no... :( would have been my first time...
<mac_v> hopefully i'll make it next time ;)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<seb128> hum
<seb128> I've a friend trying to update jaunty to karmic
<seb128> update-manager wants 1.6G of space
<seb128> in usr
<huats> chrisccoulson, don't worry I am not going either
<huats> chrisccoulson, and my baby isn't here either... which is quite lucky since he is not supposed to arrive before end of january :)
<chrisccoulson> huats - yeah, you probably don't want him to arrive just yet ;)
<huats> :)
<huats> indeed
<chrisccoulson> my colleagues baby was 5 weeks early - so you could have a christmas baby ;)
<huats> indeed...
<huats> but I'd rather have it a bit later :D
<chrisccoulson> hopefully ours will be here by christmas ;)
<huats> but in that case I am not really the one who decide
<huats> :)
<chrisccoulson> heh, only the baby decides ;)
<TheMuso> Hey all those in Dallas. Whats the weather like, and what is it going to be like next week?
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, well ... it's a bit chilly in th air conditioning
<rickspencer3> but seems warmish outside
<dtchen_> TheMuso: 21.4C and clear now, should be partly cloudly tonight Dallas time, partly sunny tomorrow same temp, partly sunny Fri slightly warmer; next week, mostly sunny early-on, slightly cooler
<TheMuso> Ok so teens/twenties celcius, nice/.
<hggdh> next week is going to be a bit colder, with temps on 5C to 14C
<hggdh> also this is Texas. If you do not like the weather, just wait a bit, and it will change (probably to something you like even less)
<TheMuso> hggdh: Ah ok, thanks.
<seb128> robert_ancell_, hey
<seb128> robert_ancell_, how busy are you today? ;-)
<robert_ancell_> seb128, hey.  depends on what horrible job you have :)
<seb128> bug #455421 collects duplicates if you can have a look
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 455421 in rhythmbox "rhythmbox crashed with SIGSEGV in g_object_set()" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/455421
<seb128> crashing when changing volume while playing
<seb128> I expect it's a gstreamer issue
<seb128> I might try to ping slomo tomorrow about it though in case he has an idea so maybe don't hurry on it
<robert_ancell_> ech, gstreamer again
<seb128> and otherwise seems libmms has some issues an no upstream
<robert_ancell_> I'll have a look
<seb128> since you seem to be enjoy debugging things playing from the internet now working ;-)
<seb128> joke aside that's in case you don't have anything special to do, feel free to decline
<robert_ancell> I'm working on a simple scanning tool prototype :)
<seb128> I see :-)
<seb128> if you get bored we could also use a simple photo editor too apparently
<JanC> robert_ancell: something like flegita ?
<robert_ancell> JanC, yes but simpler and there were too many problems to make flegita work on Jaunty
<seb128> robert_ancell, should I assign this gstreamer bug to you then?
<JanC> robert_ancell: if you can make scanning easier, my dad will be happy  ;)
<robert_ancell> seb128, If you know someone who knows gstreamer better assign it to them and I'll have a look in the meantine
<seb128> robert_ancell, k I will ask slomo
<robert_ancell> JanC, does this look easy enough? http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/I5E3F1r1asGr1VSdh5cMKA?feat=directlink
<JanC> *ugh* stupid picasa javascripts  :P
<robert_ancell> JanC, yeah, I was trying to find an easy way to upload an image..  Hmm I should use U1
<JanC> imagebin.ca  ;)
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, did you write that scanner app?
<rickspencer3_> I designed an even simpler one
<JanC> but it might be okay, don't know exactly what he expects
<rickspencer3_> one button that says "scan" ;)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, did it yesterday afternoon.  Going to put it on LP today
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, you need to hint what sort of image it is so it can decide if it should save it as jpeg, pdf, autocrop, ocr...
<JanC> also, you need to allow people to select what they want to scan
<robert_ancell> JanC, as in cropping?
<JanC> well, the scanner shouldn't scan more than needed
<JanC> no need to scan the full A4+ area if you scan a standard photo
<JanC> plus, it might fuck up some automatic color/brightness/etc. algorhthms
 * rickspencer3_ gets ready to fork robert_ancell's code
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, did you use quickly?
<JanC> oh, and please make sure scanning still works for professionals  ;)
<robert_ancell> JanC, we should be able to autocrop photos.  My guess is 99% of scanners out there are fast enough that doing a full scan will cover their requirements.  Professionals install Flegita
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, no, there didn't seem to be python bindings for SANE
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, I thought about it though :)
<rickspencer3_> oh, I thought it was a dbus interface
<JanC> robert_ancell: python-imaging-sane ?  ;)
<rickspencer3_> WARNING: Unhandled message: interface=org.freedesktop.DBus.Introspectable, path=/, member=Introspect
<rickspencer3_> scanimage: no SANE devices found
<JanC> robert_ancell: it's an extension to PIL
<robert_ancell> JanC, oh yeah, I did see that.  Wasn't sure if we wanted to drag in PIL or not
<JanC> I don't mind ;)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, I think that may be Avahi
<rickspencer3_> ah
<rickspencer3_> dang
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, your app looks sweet
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, thanks
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, can we call it "scanny"
<rickspencer3_> j/k
 * rickspencer3_ sudo rm -r scanny
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, I was going to go for "Simple Scan"
 * rickspencer3_ dents robert_ancell's picture
<robert_ancell> does anyone know an easy way of generating pdfs?
<seb128> robert_ancell, what do you mean generating?
<seb128> robert_ancell, you can use cairo and output to a pdf
<robert_ancell> seb128, ah, that's it
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-11-12
<pitti> Good morning
<huats> morning
<fagan> morning
<chrisccoulson> hello everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti
<chrisccoulson> how are you today?
<pitti> a bit tired, I spent too much time last night on beating on DK-Disks :)
<pitti> but I managed to fix the bug that broke GUID partition handling (my test suite is "all pass" now \o/), and fixed the "blob" assertion thing which has a gazillion dupes
<pitti> so it wasn't in vain :)
<chrisccoulson> heh, i feel the same today, but with g-s-d instead ;)
<pitti> go, Chris, go!
<chrisccoulson> excellent :)
<pitti> so lucid is one upload away from a perfect dkd (*cough*)
<chrisccoulson> so there will only be 1 more dkd upload during the lucid cycle then? ;)
<chrisccoulson> it's quite tricky trying to debug crashes that i've got no way of reproducing :-/
<baptistemm> hello
<chrisccoulson> hi baptistemm
<baptistemm> hi hi chrisccoulson and pitti
<rickspencer3_> hello pitti seb128 asac
<pitti> hey rickspencer3_
<pitti> I'm off for some two hours
<seb128> good morning there
<baptistemm> hey seiflotfy
<baptistemm> s/seiflotfy/seb128/
<baptistemm> damn he's gone
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, good morning ;)
<baptistemm> hey seb128
<seb128> hi chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - good thanks, although a bit tired after a late night last night. how are you?
<asac> hi rickspencer3_
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good thanks
<baptistemm> ureadahead is replacing sreadahead in karmic?
<baptistemm> I'm surprise to see package replacement during a stable pahse
<baptistemm> +d
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i was a bit surprised about that, but i was using ureadahead already anyway
<baptistemm> not the case for me
<baptistemm> let's install it
<blackshell> how do i change grub theme to any pic?
<dobey> blackshell: i think you want to ask that in #ubuntu maybe
<baptistemm> ... or any good searc engine has the answer I guess
<dobey> yeah. like lycos
<baptistemm> :D
 * baptistemm suggests altavista or hotbot
<mac_v> hmm , chris aint around :(
<seb128> hum
<seb128> can't karmic receive a file over bluetooth?
<jcastro> Riddell, your sessions are all sorted now right?
<Riddell> jcastro: I have a couple that scott asked to be moved because they clashed with other things
<jcastro> Riddell, right but they're the right color and the things are working right?
<jcastro> Riddell, if you tell scott to mark himself as essential to the ones that are for him the system won't let you schedule them in a conflicted state
<jcastro> thus avoiding the whole problem
<Riddell> jcastro: they do seem to be sorted
<Riddell> jcastro: Kubuntu Netbook Edition talk, who's doing that?
<jcastro> cool, lmk if you have any problems
<jcastro> that's scottk
<baptistemm> seb128, do you have gnome-user-share installed ?
<seb128> no
<didrocks> jcastro: hey, we talked with rickspencer3_ about putting the two "Quickly session" one after another as the difference between the two won't be really obvious (one can take some time on the second)
<jcastro> didrocks, ok so what do you want me to do, rename one?
<didrocks> jcastro: just change the schedule of one of them so that the two can be in the same room in a two hours timeframe, if possible :)
<baptistemm> seb128, I need to go but if you have problem I can help later in the evening
<baptistemm> see you
<jcastro> didrocks, there's only 1 hour for plenaries
<didrocks> jcastro: sorry, I was speaking about the session, not the plenaries
<jcastro> oh
<jcastro> so you want one big quickly session over 2 hours
<jcastro> instead of 2 back to back
<didrocks> jcastro: exactly :)
<jcastro> not a problem
<didrocks> jcastro: thanks a lot
<jcastro> didrocks, what day is it scheduled on?
<jcastro> nm got it
<jcastro> didrocks, ok it's 2 slots now
<didrocks> jcastro: you rock!
<jcastro> didrocks, it might conflict with other sessions now and all that so just prod rick when you see him next
 * jcastro doesn't generally move things around for a track lead without asking
<didrocks> jcastro: ok, I'll ping him when he's around :)
<RainCT> hey guys
<RainCT> :)
<dobey_> anyone know where to get the "new special super duper" poulsbo driver at?
<rafferty> Internet TV? Anyone know of a desklet or program that will allow me to watch streaming TV like MSNBC, CNN, CNBC, etc.?
<Tm_T> rafferty: support questions in #ubuntu  (:
<dobey> asac: are you still around?
<fagan> rickspencer3_: Can I use a translated strings for fields in desktopcouch?
 * fagan is handling internationalization 
<dobey> fagan: i'm pretty sure the field names aren't translatable (just as they aren't in vCard for example)
<fagan> dobey: im translating them before they are made
<fagan> hmmm
<fagan> I wonder
<dobey> fagan: yes but if i put "NOMBRE: Foo" inside a vcard and sent it to you, i'm pretty sure every parser out there would not know that it should be "NAME:"
<dobey> and field names aren't translated in .desktop files
<dobey> i don't think it makes sense to translate them in the storage here either
<dobey> any translation of field names should be done on a UI level
<dobey> and not in the storage itself
<fagan> Im using couchgrid and the field name is displyed
<fagan> So I need to internationalize the displayed name
<fagan> So it would be just as easy to translate the field name
<dobey> ok
<dobey> but the translated version shouldn't get written back to the db
<dobey> it should only be translated for display
<dobey> but couchgrid might not really be written in a way to make for good translatability
<fagan> Ah either way it shouldnt matter to desktop couch
<fagan> I mean if it cant handle any language it wouldnt be any good
<dobey> it can handle langauges
<dobey> but the field names have to be the same everywhere, otherwise they're just extra field names that the user added
<dobey> evolution for example wouldn't know that nombre == name when reading the contacts in
<fagan> Ah I understand
<fagan> For the moment it doesnt matter ill sort it out before it becomes an issue ;)
<rickspencer3_> fagan, no
<rickspencer3_> fagan, those are keys
<fagan> rickspencer3_: how do I change the displayed string in the couchgrid then?
<rickspencer3_> fagan, a couchgrid is just a treeview
<rickspencer3_> so you can go something like mygrid.get_columns()[0].set_text(_(my_translated_string))
<rickspencer3_> ^look at pygtk reference for treeview
 * fagan keeps forgetting that
<rickspencer3_> :)
<didrocks> hey rickspencer3_ o/
<didrocks> rickspencer3_: going to bed now. I asked jcastro about merging our two one hour session in different days in a two hours sessions as we discussed, can you confirm this with him, please?
<TheMuso> Good morning all.
<jcastro> rickspencer3_, the quickly session is now 2 slots, you should be able to drag it wherever and it will take up 2 hours
<didrocks> hey TheMuso, good morning ;)
<chrisccoulson> hello TheMuso
<chrisccoulson> and hello didrocks
<didrocks> and hello chrisccoulson :)
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<didrocks> fine, quite busy with a lot of Quickly related stuff to do, so less time for merging packages
<didrocks> and you?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm still busy with karmic SRU's, so I havent started merging any packages yet
<chrisccoulson> although, I only have 1 more SRU on my list now:)
<didrocks> good work :)
<chrisccoulson> you looking forward to UDS then?
<didrocks> yeah, really, but that's also the cause of my work overload now :)
<chrisccoulson> heh, yeah, i can imagine ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: are you already a parent or still waiting? :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - still waiting ;)
<chrisccoulson> i hope she arrives in the next day or so, else i'll have to go to work next week, and i'll be bored with nobody to talk to on IRC ;)
<didrocks> hehe, sure! you'll just have the time to finish your last SRU :)
<chrisccoulson> next week would be a good week to have off work:)
<chrisccoulson> actually, any week would be a good week, but i'd like next week ;)
<didrocks> ahah!
<didrocks> well, it's really time to go to bed if I want to be able to do some ubuntu related stuff tomorrow
<chrisccoulson> 'night didrocks
<didrocks> thanks, good evening chrisccoulson :)
<chrisccoulson> eek, i've got 600 seahorse-agent crash mails in my inbox
<chrisccoulson> no wonder users are getting frustrated
<rickspencer3_> jcastro thanks
<rickspencer3_> hi didrocks, chrisccoulson, TheMuso
<chrisccoulson> hi rickspencer3_
<TheMuso> Hey rickspencer3_.
<chrisccoulson> bryce - i'm trying to debug a g-s-d crash that slangasek is experiencing when he presses Fn+F7 after connecting an external monitor. i've noticed from his xtrace log that he doesn't get a RRScreenChangeNotify event when connecting the monitor (so g-s-d doesn't attempt to autoconfigure it). however, he gets the event after pressing Fn+F7 and g-s-d refreshes the server information with RRGetScreenResources. this ends up trigger
<chrisccoulson> ing a wierd race in g-s-d which makes it crash
<chrisccoulson> he should see the RRScreenChangeNotify when connecting the monitor shouldn't he?
<chrisccoulson> ok, the randr documentation says the event should happen when connecting a monitor :-/
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-11-13
<gkahla> hey folks - is there a specific channel for ubuntu netbook remix?
<TheMuso> Intel need to release descrete cards, and ATI's lower end cards need to be cheaper.
<TheMuso> woops wrong channel.
<dtchen_> although it's just as true here ;-)
<TheMuso> heh true that.
<pitti> Good morning
<huats> morning
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> pretty good, thanks! how about you?
<pitti> I need to do the packing for UDS today
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm not too bad. glad it's the weekend though :)
<chrisccoulson> are you looking forward to next week?
<chrisccoulson> i think i might have to start on lucid merges today!
<chrisccoulson> at last :)
<pitti> I do, of course
<pitti> heh, have fun
<pitti> chrisccoulson: next Tuesday is the next TB meeting, I hope we can finish the ubuntu-desktop upload rights voting then, and throw the switch
<chrisccoulson> fantastic, that would be quite useful :)
<chrisccoulson> ooh, breakfast time:)
<pitti> *phew*, ubuntu inbox zero + 2 :)
<pitti> some cleanup was in order before leaving tomorrow :)
<pitti> I need to disappear for ~ 2 hours for some errands
<pitti> tseliot: congrats to your first lucid spec :)
<pitti> tseliot: I handed https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-xorg-proprietary-drivers to you, which I think kind of fits your interests and skills?
<tseliot> pitti: ok, I guess this will be part of my work for the Desktop team (for the team swap) in addition to my work on the boot process
<pitti> tseliot: ah, you already earned some other project?
<pitti> tseliot: so you'll work on the X.org side for smooth booting?
<pitti> (let's discuss the details next week)
<tseliot> pitti: yes, right
<tseliot> I won't be there at the UDS but I can participate from home
 * pitti yays at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJX8ZOMaol4
<pitti> tseliot: oh, not? what a pity :(
<tseliot> pitti: I'm buying a house therefore my presence is required here
<tseliot> pitti: yes, that's what I'm working on with Keybuk
<mvo> pitti: I remember there was a issue with g-d-u to overly agressive tell about disk failures, I wonder if bug #479086 is releated to that?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 479086 in update-manager "9.1 disk imminent crash" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/479086
<mvo> bug #438136 maybe?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 438136 in libatasmart "palimpsest bad sectors false positive" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/438136
<pitti> mvo: right, the latter is still confirmed
<mvo> ok, thanks
<davmor2> pitti: that's just magic Keybuk was on about it at the launch party :)
<Keybuk> davmor2: yes, but thanks to tseliot it works now ;)
<davmor2> nice one tseliot
<Keybuk> of course, still more bugs to fix
<Keybuk> - flashing cursor over top of the image while X starts :-/
<Keybuk> - plymouthd crashes and wipes out X (yeah, minor)
<Keybuk> - if plymouthd is started before X, you can't vt switch out of X ever again (even after X finishes)
<tseliot> yay :-P
<pitti> oh, so plymouth then? I thought that was shelved for a while
<Keybuk> actually, I think that last one is a "feature" :p
<Keybuk> pitti: yeah, it just makes much more sense
 * tseliot nods
<tgpraveen> in karmic is it a known bug that hard disks and usb disks names appears as AC30au8995C59 or some code?
<seb128> hello there
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<seb128> hi kenvandine
<seb128> how are you?
<kenvandine> good... preparing for the trip
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<kenvandine> how's dallas?
<seb128> guten tag pitti
<pitti> oh, I still need to pack, too
<seb128> don't forget your swimming short
<pitti> good point
 * kenvandine thought it was kind of chilly in dallas
<seb128> matter of perspective
<seb128> weather is good enough to hand around in tshirt
<seb128> where it's freezing in europe
<seb128> dunno how it is from where you are coming
<kenvandine> 47F
<kenvandine> but it is going to be in the 70s tomorrow
 * kenvandine is still wearing shorts :)
<serialorder> i am merging tomboy and when I test it in schroot it gives me a warning that it could not load canberra-gtk-module because it is missing. It runs fine otherwise. I am wondering if I should add a depends on canberra-gtk-module?
<seb128> serialorder, rather a recommend maybe? it's tomboy using it directly?
<serialorder> i was thinking a recommend, i am not quite sure how to check if it is using it directly. I can fumble around and try to find out unless you know where i might look
<seb128> serialorder, what is displaying the warning?
<seb128> tomboy code?
<Laney> serialorder: if you discover a problem please forward it to debian too
<serialorder> seb128, no the package built fine and installed fine, the warning came when I actually ran tomboy
<seb128> right
<seb128> but it could be due to let's say gtk
<serialorder> i mean it runs fine, i just got that warning
<seb128> tomboy uses gtk which uses ...
<seb128> right but we need to figure what call is triggering the warning
<serialorder> thats the part i am not totally clear on figuring out how to do, so I am working on that part now
<rickspencer3> hello asac
<asac> hi rickspencer3
<pitti> seb128: how's the conf center? AC madness again, or warm enough for T-shirts?
 * pitti wonders what kind of clothing to pack
<seb128> between those
<seb128> better to have a small jacket
<seb128> and it can get worse with the number of people
<seb128> re
<pitti> seb128: so, AC then?
<seb128> pitti, got my reply?
<pitti> seb128: I freeze easily, so I rather bring some pullovers then
<pitti> seb128: merci
<pitti> seb128: yes, I got it
<seb128> between those
<seb128>  better to have a small jacket
<seb128>  and it can get worse with the number of people
<seb128> I'm wearing a tshirt now but was cold yesterday afternoon
<seb128> yes AC
<corp186> I have a new package that acts as a server to accept remote input events (keyboard, mouse, joystick, etc.) from clients
<corp186> I'm looking for advocates for inclusion into lucid
<corp186> The revu page: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=7025
<corp186> Thanks for your consideration
<seb128> ok
<pitti> seb128, kenvandine:
<kenvandine> hey pitti
<pitti> http://www.wetter.com/wetter_aktuell/wettervorhersage/7_tagesvorhersage/?id=US0TX0325 says that it was quite warm this week, but next week it's going to be much colder/rainy
<pitti> :-(
<kenvandine> http://www.weather.com/weather/tenday/USTX0327?from=36hr_topnav_undeclared
<kenvandine> i bit different forecast
<kenvandine> shows mostly sunny all week
<seb128> we are going to locked inside anyway
<seb128> we are going to locked inside anyway so the weather...
<didrocks> hum, people are reporting libgtk being uninstalable on lucid against the Quickly project (not even the package O_o) Don't know how they came there :)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, bug #?
<didrocks> bug #482192
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 482192 in quickly "[Lucid] unmet dependencies in libgtk" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/482192
<hggdh> best site for weather in the US is noaa.gov
<hggdh> for Dallas: http://forecast.weather.gov/MapClick.php?CityName=Dallas&state=TX&site=FWD&textField1=32.7942&textField2=-96.7652&e=0
<didrocks> rickspencer3: are you planning making some slides for the Quickly plenary session? I would merge mine if possible
<rickspencer3> didrocks, I have them, yes
<mpt_> mvo, YokoZar suggested a UDS session on handling multiarch packages in the Ubuntu Software Center. Do you think it's important enough for a session?
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: do you have any documentation about new suspend inhibition api?
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - i don't have any
<chrisccoulson> how come?
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: well - people are complaining that transmission wasn't ported to the new API and suspend inhibition doesn't work in ubuntu 9.10/fedora 12
<baptistemm> ah yeah I seen that in the outpt of transmission
<baptistemm> I guess the new api is provided by gnome-session, no?
<kklimonda> yes
<baptistemm> it should be straightforward, rb had a smae patch few weeks ago
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - it just needs to call org.gnome.SessionManager.Inhibit()
<chrisccoulson> the "flags" parameter should be set to 4 for suspend inhibit
<chrisccoulson> or 8 for idle inhibit
<chrisccoulson> or 1 for logout inhibit
<chrisccoulson> and it needs to save the cookie for uninhibiting later on
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<seb128> how are things going?
<seb128> still no baby?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, not too bad thanks. i'm finished for the weekend now
<chrisccoulson> no baby yet ;)
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: so what's different?
<seb128> good thanks
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - different to what?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - hows dallas?
<seb128> not sure
<seb128> I've mainly seen the hotel and restaurants
<baptistemm> did you see bobby Ewing ?
<seb128> hard to judge a city from the corner where you are hanging
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: to the way now it works - was it only moved from org.freedesktop.Power... to org.gnome.SessionManager?
<seb128> but sprint is good ;-)
<baptistemm> chrisccoulson, ah you're expecting baby arrival soon?
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm - i am:)
<baptistemm> oooh oho ho
<baptistemm> you can say bye bye to your free time :)
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - the only difference is the API is slightly different, and you need to talk to gnome-session rather than g-p-m
<baptistemm> You'll be happy to go to work to have some sleep
<baptistemm> :)
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm - i already have no free time ;)
<chrisccoulson> i need the day extending to 28 hours ;)
<chrisccoulson> or only go to work for 4 hours/day
<chrisccoulson> (the latter sounds better)
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: ok, thanks
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - let me know if you need any other help
<baptistemm> kklimonda, have you the nick belegdol on GIMPnet because someone ask the same question than you on #fedora-desktop there :)
<kklimonda> baptistemm: yes - he just asked the same question on #transmission ;)
<kklimonda> baptistemm: and it reminded me about this issue
<baptistemm> k
<mvo> mpt_: a good question, I'm not sure apt will be able to handle them properly for lucid
<seb128> hey mvo
<seb128> mvo, don't forget to take your swimming short
<mvo> hey seb128
<mvo> seb128: heh :) thanks!
<mvo> seb128: is the pool nice? inside? outside?
<mvo> seb128: do I need a warm coat in general? or is the weather warm
<mpt_> mvo, it's up to you, if you think it's worth a UDS session talk to robbiew :-)
<seb128> mvo, the pool is nice yes
<seb128> outside
<seb128> but warm water
<mvo> mpt_: thanks, I will keep it in mind
<seb128> some 15 metres
<seb128> enough to swim ;-)
<seb128> weather, ac is cold sometime in the rooms
<seb128> outside is limit between tshirt and frisky
<seb128> but they announce a bit colder next week
<seb128> nothing like germany
<seb128> but still take a small jacket
<seb128> or a pullover
<seb128> take some vegetables too with you maybe ;-)
<mvo> seb128: haha
<mpt_> mvo, I'm fairly sure software-center trunk doesn't include some bug-fixes nzmm made to the behavior of the pathbutton widget
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<mpt_> mvo, specifically, it doesn't do the right thing if you drag off a segment and then back on to it without releasing the mouse button, and I think nzmm's branch had fixed that
<mvo> mpt_: hm, ok. let me check
<mvo> mpt_: merged
<mpt_> mvo, awesome, thanks
<mpt_> mvo, I'm working right now on improving the program listing design (getting rid of the right arrow button), and then on where to put non-application packages
<mvo> mpt_: ok, I will be in dallas tomorrow, I'm curious to hear your ideas
<mpt_> mvo, rather unfortunate to discover that someone installing 9.10 can't install anything with the Ubuntu Software Center unless they install updates (or run Synaptic) first :-/
<mpt_> mvo, ok, look forward to seeing you :-)
<mvo> mpt_: hm, this got tested, is it true for all situations. or only under some circumstance (like no network during install or similar)?
<mpt_> mvo, I don't know whether it's dependent on connection, but we saw it here at the sprint with sabdfl installing 9.10, and there have been a few bug reports and tweets about it too
<mvo> :(
<mpt_> mvo, bug 466321
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 466321 in software-center "After Ubuntu installation, nothing is installable until package list is updated" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/466321
<mpt_> mvo, it might actually be a duplicate of 430200, you'd know that better than me
<mpt_> bug 430200, I mean
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430200 in software-center "does not support detecting if apt cache is broken" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430200
<mvo> well, cache should not be broken after a fresh install
<mvo> :(
<mvo> mpt_: first update or first cronjob run?
<mpt_> don't know
<mpt_> but it was fixed as soon as sabdfl went into Synaptic and hit Reload
<mvo> mpt_: I find it hard to believe that this slipped through the cracks if it did not for for anyone, let me test here
<mpt_> mvo, I find it quite easy to believe, since testers would routinely install all updates before testing anything else :-)
<mvo> mpt_: do you happen to know if it was a desktop or a alternate install?
<mpt_> mvo, desktop
<mvo> thanks
<mvo> mpt_: *oh* nothing or no universe packages?
<mpt_> mvo, hmmmm, good question. It might only be for Universe.
<mvo> mpt_: because I think its actually a problem with the live cd
<mvo> mpt_: it does not have universe enabled, so there are no packages in the cache for universe on a fresh install, that is a plausible theory
 * mvo tests it
<mpt_> mvo, the packages show up in the listing, it's just the "Install" and "Website" buttons that are missing
 * mvo nods
<mpt_> ah, I see what you mean
<mpt_> The universe packages might be in app-install-data but not in the cache
<mvo> mpt_: exaclty
<mvo> mpt_: hm,hm, but then, I *think* when the langpack stuff is triggered ubiquity does a cache reload, so it might be only networkless installs
<mvo> mpt_: but this is speculation, I need to test to be sure
<mpt_> mvo, so it might not be worth fixing this until after we replace app-install-data with the archive index
<pitti> bye everyone! see you in Dallas tomorrow!
<mpt_> mvo, we can't fix it in an update for 9.10, because anyone who installs any update is no longer having the problem anyway
<pitti> (or some of you in Frankfurt perhaps)
<mpt_> mvo, and with the archive index if the bug still exists it would need to be fixed in a different way.
<mvo> mpt_: hm, right, shipping a update is no good
<mvo> mpt_: still, we need to fix it for lucid
<mpt_> yep
<mvo> and for the repo based ones, it will be a similar problem, if sources.list contains stuff but we don't have data for it we need to trigger a reload
<seb128> pitti, see you
<seb128> pitti, have a safe trip there!
<mvo> mpt_: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/livecd-rootfs/+bug/105511
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 105511 in livecd-rootfs "Universe and Multiverse not enabled by default on the livecd" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<mvo> mpt_: that is the root cause
<mpt_> waha, disk space
<mpt_> should have guessed :-)
<mac_v> seb128: around? , I'm again faced by this bug > Bug #416251 , it seemed solved for a month and now its back... other users are also reporting the same problems , could you re-open the upstream task also?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 416251 in nautilus "Nautilus does not show Desktop thumbnails" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/416251
<mvo> mpt_: I'm sure it printed something helpful like "not available in current data" :( I can reproduce the problem now I think
<mac_v> this now not restricted to desktop.. the thumbnails for images/videos dont even show up in the folders
 * mvo need to go pack his stuff
<pedro_> mac_v, comment on the upstream bug and i'll re open it for you
<mac_v> pedro_: will do... thanks :)
<pedro_> you're welcome
<mac_v> pedro_: nevermind...I just realized that i had started the upstream bug and i reopened it myself... sorry for the noise ;)
<pedro_> mac_v, no worries, i've updated the version number for you there
<mac_v> ah , right.. i forgot that :)
<seb128> re
<seb128> kenvandine, I reassigned bug #462768 to the desktop team now
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 462768 in gnome-session "gnome-session-properties should filter by NoDisplay" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/462768
<seb128> kenvandine, it's waiting in the sponsor queue and since you can't upload anyway
<kenvandine> yay
 * kenvandine needs to stop messing with mission critical boxes right before going out of town :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-11-14
<murcherson> hi folks, feel a bit of a dumbass for asking this but how do i take a right-click action in a folder that's full i.e. like paste or open in terminal. These options are all greyed out because I've right-clicked on a file not an empty space. I know I can change the view to arrange some empty space but is there an easier way to do this. Thanks and sorry for the huge post.
<Amaranth> murcherson: #ubuntu is the proper channel for support but all the stuff in the right click menu should be in the File and Edit menus
<murcherson> yeh i was just hopint there was a way to do via mouse
<murcherson> thanks though
<JanC> murcherson: it's a known bug
<JanC> murcherson: and you can use the File menu or right-click the directory button in the file hierarchy above the list
<JanC> or maybe the Edit menu, e.g. to "paste"
<murcherson> how do you mean the directory button please
<murcherson> its not so much for paste but for opening a terminal
<JanC> murcherson: hm, that doesn't work with the buttons on the location bar
<JanC> but it does work from the File menu
<murcherson> it would just be nice to be able to open terminal or other specialised right-click menu functions without having to use file menu
<murcherson> i know its not much but would be handyt for me
<murcherson> handy
<JanC> yes, it would, but there is a lot of discussion about how  ;)
<murcherson> can i set up a button that would somehow make the cursor think that it is in an unactive area of a folder
<murcherson> i.e. an empty space
<JanC> that's exactly what the discussion is about, how/what to create "empty space"
<JanC> I wish they could decide faster too ;)
<JanC> hm, maybe we could do something with nautilus extensions (but that might slow down a real solution)
<huats> morning
<baptistemm> salut huats
<huats> hello baptistemm
<UbuntuNoobester> Hi everyone.  Fairly new to linux.  I was running Raid-0 (2 SSD Drives) for my Windows 7 OS and then decided to try Ubuntu 9.10 so I installed it on a partition of my 500GB Sata secondary drive.  The install went fine but I do not get the grub option for my windows 7 operating system now nor do I see the Raid-0 volume on Ubuntu desktop.  Any ideas?
<manolo__> Hi to all. I notice there's a 1.9 GB file named uuid-0000-0F11.AOO52U and contained into the /home/manolo/.local/share/gvfs-metadata directory My problem is that I'm trying to free some hd space. Is that file useful? Can I remove it? Thanks
<maxb> I don't know exactly what it is, but gvfs is to do with mounting other filesystems, often network filesystems.
<manolo__> maxb yes, I realized it...
<manolo__> maxb: another question. I nothice I have 2 "trash" directories under my home folder. One is named .Trash-0 and the other .Trash-1000
<manolo__> are both in use?
<maxb> The numbers I think refer to uids. So .Trash-0 would be things trashed by root, I guess
<maxb> Assuming you don't have anything you need to rescue from the trash, it should be fine to delete them all, and just let an appropriate trash be recreated automatically when needed
<chrisccoulson> the gvfs-metadata folder just contains information about files/folders, and is used by things like nautilus to store information about folder-specific customizations etc
<chrisccoulson> you can delete it if you want to lose those customizations
<manolo__> chrisccoulson: do you think it's normal to have a 1.9GB customization file?
<chrisccoulson> no, it's probably corrupted in some way
<manolo__> ok, maybe it could be safer to move such a directory into my external hd and try my system of a week or two...
<manolo__> in case the system goes without problems, I'll definitely remove it
<manolo__> Well... strange things happen in this world... I've been removing sjust some files contained into those .Trash folders... that is I indirectly moved them into the (supposed to be) currently used Trash folder. Then I emptied the (current) trash and it automatically completely removed those alternative trash folders...
<manolo__> thanks for your time. CU :)
<serialorder> I was checking to see if telepathy-mission-control-5 should be synced but the unstable version now ships  accountManager.service and warns 'The AccountManager.service is inappropriate on mainstream distributions'
<serialorder> I am thinking this means it should not be synced for lucid since it is a LTS would that be correct?
<serialorder> http://pastebin.com/f64fc2729
<serialorder> anyone around?
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-11-15
<dashua> mac_v, Can you add a monochrome start-here for Humanity-Dark too? :)
<dashua> Looks good.
<mac_v> dashua: sure...
<dashua> Sweet :)
<mac_v> dashua: oh.. you'v been subscribed for the updates ? or did you catch the screenshot?
<mac_v> updates in the branch*
<dashua> Oh, I just randomly pull elementaryicons
<dashua> Saw the update
<mac_v> dashua: ;) ... hehe ... I'v been using that for long time , Didnt know it was allowed in Ubuntu... just added the icon since kwwii posted to the ML regarding that :)
<dashua> Yeah, it looks cool
<mac_v> dashua: pushed ;)
<dashua> mac_v, Awesome
<dashua> mac_v, http://www.ubuntu-pics.de/bild/30980/screenshot_004_E0q3vn.png
<dashua> Looks great
<mac_v> dashua: thanks :)
<mac_v> dashua: is the banshee icon 24px or 48px?
<dashua> 24
<dashua> Used that pack from GNOME-Look
<mac_v> dashua: hmm , odd , it looks a bit blurred.. i thought the gnome-look had only the 48px icon
<mac_v> dashua: heh , maybe i should release all the icons i have on gnome-look too ;p ;)
<dashua> I would for consistency
<dashua> The Shutter icon looks cool, but too big
<mac_v> dashua: yeah , most of the icons are not dont to size. :(  there was one icon done in 256px 0.o
<mac_v> not done*
<dashua> Yeah, I see they are all over the map
<kenvandine> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi kenvandine
<rickspencer3> are you enroute?
<kenvandine> soon
<kenvandine> downloading stuff to hack on enroute :)
 * TheMuso notes that rickspencer3 appears to be on 3G. :p
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, how is wifi in the hotel?
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, kenvandine yes, I use my 3g ;)
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, does that mean wifi isn't up yet in the hotel for us?
<TheMuso> kenvandine: Its available, but I wasn't able to connect yesterday when I tried, note that this is not Ubuntu wifi, but the hotel wifi. I am currently on ethernet.
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, there is wifi, I just like my 3g
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, when do you get here?
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, i land at 5:25
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, cool, don't forget about company dinner at 7:30!
<kenvandine> oh... i didn't know :)
<kenvandine> was there an email?
<kenvandine> when and where?
<TheMuso> kenvandine: On ubuntu-platform@.
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, yes, from jono I think
<kenvandine> oh... the thing at 8
<kenvandine> i didn't know it was a dinner
<kenvandine> and i guess we need to be there at 7:30 :)
 * kenvandine shouldn't ignore email from jono :-p
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, any idea about this http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-l/track/desktop/ ?
<kenvandine> been busted for a couple days
<Amaranth> You've got multiple agendas, very ambitious ;)
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Do you know who propsed the accessibility by default spec? I certainly didn't. Its on Friday.
<TheMuso> proposed
<Amaranth> That's probably too ambitious for lucid
<Amaranth> GNOME doesn't even turn it on by default due to issues although I hope they do for 3.0
<TheMuso> Amaranth: I agree.
<TheMuso> Which is why I wouldn't propose such a thing. :)
<Amaranth> If you think client side windows caused lots of weird problems wait until you turn that on :)
<TheMuso> Hey I'd love it if it was, since it would make doing other things so much easier, but its not a good idea right now.
<TheMuso> Particularly since at-spi will be moving to dbus for GNOME 3.
<Amaranth> Although the desktop itself works fine crazy things are sure to happen for things in universe
<TheMuso> Yep.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, that;s from mpt
<rickspencer3> he wants it on by default so that they can write some features on the desktop that are not for accessability per se
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, can you bring that feedback to the session please?
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: I;ve subscribed as being required for the session, so I'd be glad to.
 * TheMuso completes his initial scan of sessions for this week.
<TheMuso> c
 * kenvandine heads out... see ya this evening!
<rickspencer3> see ya kenvandine
<dobey> hmm
<dobey> airport living
<Zloi_> hi
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-11-15
<TheMuso> /c/c
<lifeless> in maverick
<lifeless> why does opening media (photos, movies) close the [usually nautilus] window I was browing from within?
 * RAOF doesn't remember that behaviour.
<RAOF> Urgh!  Alt-tab muscle memory is hard to unlearn; r600g is not a fan of it.
<kklimonda> oh ffs, it's the last time I've tried to write something for Android
<kklimonda> Eclipse just OOM'd..
<kklimonda> I can only hope that Nokia is going to succeed with Maemo
<lifeless> RAOF: it may be 'just me' but it hurts...
<RAOF> lifeless: Yeah, it sounds like it.  Running nautilus from gdb doesn't happen to nett a backtrace, does it?
<lifeless> oh, thinking a crash?
<lifeless> I'll have a fiddle when I'm awake and not flat out
<lifeless> the desktop icons don't go away or anything
<lifeless> so I was thinking single window closing
<RAOF> Mm, yeah.
<RAOF> I don't suppose ~/.xsession-eros has anything interesting?\
<lifeless> well
<lifeless> it has the fspot crash
<lifeless> glib.GError: Failed to open file '/usr/share/quickly/icons/quickly48x48.png': No such file or directory
<lifeless> (nautilus:2228): GConf-CRITICAL **: gconf_value_free: assertion `value != NULL' failed
<lifeless> Traceback (most recent call last):
<lifeless>   File "/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-2.0/python/ubuntudevbar.py", line 59, in get_widget
<lifeless>     bar.add_image("/usr/share/quickly/icons/quickly48x48.png", current_template)
<lifeless>   File "/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-2.0/python/ubuntudevbar.py", line 93, in add_image
<lifeless>     pixbuf = gtk.gdk.pixbuf_new_from_file(image_name)
<lifeless> glib.GError: Failed to open file '/usr/share/quickly/icons/quickly48x48.png': No such file or directory
<RAOF> Is the pastebinning of ~/.xsession-errors on the cards?
<lifeless> its 500K
<lifeless> And I'm at the caribe royale.
<lifeless> so no.
<RAOF> Why are you still there?
<RAOF> Anyway.  Hm.
<lifeless> I just got herer.
<RAOF> I'd presume nautilus is reasonable enough to not crash when one of it's python extensions backtraces, and the gconf-critical's really aren't.
<lifeless> https://wiki.canonical.com/OnlineServices/Sprints/Cassandra-Orlando-2010
<lifeless> RAOF: it may be closing its windows though
<RAOF> That's not totally unlikely, yeah.
<lifeless> trying
<RAOF> Hurray empiricism!
<lifeless> http://pastebin.com/xpX1uBSY
<lifeless> thats the new messages from when I double clicked on an image
<lifeless> anyhow
<lifeless> midnight
<lifeless> ESLEEP
<RAOF> GAH!  ALT-TAB!
<RAOF> Sleep well.
<lifeless> actually
<lifeless> nautilus is dying
<lifeless> I was thinking the panels were disappearing/reappearing for a reason
<lifeless> like a 'style' reason
<lifeless> but *boom* would explain it.
<RAOF> Heh.
<kklimonda> now that's not fair - all CouchDB APIs return JsonObjects.. but one..
<kklimonda> and if now I've found one I'll probably found another..
<kklimonda> apparently dynamic languages root your brain :/
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> He pitti.
<kklimonda> hey pitti
<pitti> hey guys, how are you?
<kklimonda> having fun trying to fit square into an oval hole.. but fine nonetheless :)
<TheMuso> lol
<nigelb> kklimonda: that's what you call fun? :p
<kklimonda> I think I'm going to cheat and enclose all arrays into a dummy object..
<kklimonda> nigelb: well, either it's fun or I'm a closet masochist.. it's better be fun! ;)
<nigelb> haha
<kklimonda> 36 files changed, 1381 insertions(+), 5418 deletions(-) now that's what I call a job well done ;)
<pitti> kklimonda: nice cleanup :)
<didrocks> nice :)
<didrocks> ogra: hey
<didrocks> ogra: how are you?
<rodrigo_> morning
<didrocks> good morning rodrigo_, how was your week-end?
<rodrigo_> hi didrocks
<rodrigo_> didrocks, fine, and yours?
<pitti> mvo: good morning
<pitti> mvo: WDYT about enabling compressed apt indexes by default in natty? I'm currently preparing an apt upload for some apt-changelog updates
<didrocks> rodrigo_: was good and relaxing after a very busy week! :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, yeah :)
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: ola
<mvo> pitti: I have no strong opinion, I would be inclined to leave them off by default as most people probably don't mind the additional space, but OTOH on a modern system the additional CPU will not hurt either (might be a issue on arm though). not everything is using the binary cache, some tools explicitely force building the index in memory (for savety when running as non-root to avoid that the bin-cache gets rebuild while running)
<rodrigo_> hi kklimonda
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: you can pull git branch - I'm done with it :P
<pitti> mvo: okay; then I'll remove the work item from the spec
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, ok, cool!
<seb128> hey
<mvo> pitti: ok
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: now the boring part - testing and writing documentation :)
<pitti> mvo: do we still need to have srcpkgcache.bin by default?
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, right, but I can merge your branch first, if you want, or do you want to keep working and have it merged when it's all done?
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: I think it's at the point where, if you like it, it should be merged
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, ok
<mvo> pitti: yes, I need to talk to david about it, he had some concerns
<mvo> pitti: but I forgot what they were :/
<pitti> mvo: do you know what it's used for? I never saw any difference without it
<pitti> ah, ok
<mvo> pitti: I think him, we have a different understanding (david and me) if its important or not, need to figure out who is right
<pitti> mvo: btw, we didn't notice a significant performance impact on arm with compressed indexes; it takes just as long to read five times the data from disk
<mvo> pitti: heh :) that is interessting
<pitti> (hence my proposal to turn it on by default)
<mvo> pitti: right, that was/is my only concern, that it slows down things on slow-cpu systems. if that is not the case I'm fine turing it on
<pitti> mvo: it's just a configuration option, so it can still be removed if necessary
<mvo> we could do it and see if someone actually finds a case where it makes a difference
<mvo> yeah
<pitti> mvo: we could give it a try, it's not hard to revert?
<mvo> sounds good
<pitti> mvo: would you prefer shipping a new explicit configuration file, or turn on the internal default?
<mvo> lets do it
<mvo> just turn the internal default
<pitti> my gut feeling is the latter
<pitti> right
<mvo> pitti: about apt-changelog, the longer term plan is to get that properly into apt-get as c++ (just fyi). but for now the script is fine of course :)
<pitti> mvo: right; I'd like to keep the script until the implementation settles, as it's easier to change
<pitti> mvo: now it's working for Debian as well, FYI :)
<mvo> pitti: yeah, I noticed the commit :)
<pitti> mvo: I'm going to propose a merge request for Debian trunk to fix the test cases to get along with a changed internal default
<pitti> mvo: would you also like an MP for enabling gzip indexes by default for Debian?
<mvo> pitti: hm, that would only be interessting for experimental at this point
<mvo> pitti: because of the debian release cycle
<pitti> *nod*
<pitti> mvo: not urgent from my side; I can propose it after squeeze
<mvo> ok
<mvo> that sounds good
 * pitti hugs mvo, thanks
<mvo> cheers
<mvo> !
 * mvo hugs pitti back
<geser> does someone know why some of my panel applets don't appear in my panel anymore in natty? do they need porting to the new libpanel-applet-3-0?
<pitti> mvo: ok, sent
<seb128> geser, no, there is a compatibility loader
<seb128> geser, which ones?
<geser> I'm missing netspeed, the tomboy applet and the session-applet in my panel
<geser> or I'm missing a package for that compatibility loader?
<seb128> can you add them back?
<geser> I don't have them in the "Add to panel" dialog
<geser> do I need gnome-panel-bonobo installed for it?
<pitti> seb128: bonjour! had a nice weekend?
<geser> seb128: it's was the missing "gnome-panel-bonobo". Perhaps I should re-think to install recommends by default again.
<seb128> geser, ok, makes sense
<seb128> pitti, guten tag, yes it was excellent
<seb128> pitti, how was yours?
<pitti> we had marvellous weather, so I went for some bicycling again, and seeing family
<seb128> great
<pitti> it was 20 degrees, like spring :)
<seb128> it's not cold there but rainy often
<rodrigo_> hey seb128
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<pitti> seb128: since natty opening URLs from terminals takes ages and hangs the terminal for some 10 seconds; do you have that as well?
<pitti> or did I break something locally?
<pitti> (could be a firefox bug, too)
<seb128> didn't try from a command line but it's doing the same from GNOME softwares
<seb128> xchat-gnome for example
<seb128> it could but I didn't upgrade firefox for a while when that started there
<seb128> seems rather a bug in the gio call or something
<seb128> I didn't have time to debug it really, I copy paste urls rather than clicking on it for some days
<didrocks> pitti: confirmed here
<pitti> seb128: that's fine, just wanted to know whether it just affects me
<pitti> cheers
<didrocks> it's gio related I think, I reproduce that in both FF and chromium
<geser> I see that too, I got even surprised that I got eog instead of firefox when I clicked on a http link to a png
<seb128> rodrigo_, bug #674824
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 674824 in gnome-media (Ubuntu) "cant install gnome-media-common: broken dependencies (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Low,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/674824
<rodrigo_> seb128, lookinh
<rodrigo_> seb128, ah, right, the sound capplet has been moved, so we need to package gnome-media in that PPA
<seb128> rodrigo_, you need at least to make your gnome-control-center, conflict,replaces gnome-media
<seb128> so people upgrading get gnome-media removed rather than a conflict breaking upgrades
<rodrigo_> seb128, well, it just replaces one part of it, so is 'replaces' the right thing to do?
<seb128> not really no
<seb128> replaces means "you can overwrite files"
<rodrigo_> ah, ok
<seb128> but if you install the new g-c-c and then remove it you get those files missing
<rodrigo_> ok
<seb128> it's just meant to be used when a file moved between binaries to avoid conflict
<seb128> you need a "breaks: gnome-media-common (<< 2.91)"
<seb128> Breaks
<seb128> to say that both need to be updated or that gnome-media should be uninstalled
<rodrigo_> right
<rodrigo_> seb128, so -> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/532248/ <- is that ok?
<seb128> rodrigo_, you need to patch the control.in
<rodrigo_> right!
<seb128> you should check what files you replace exactly
<seb128> I would not be surprised if you rather need a
<seb128> Replaces: gnome-media-common, (<< 2.91), gnome-media (<< 2.91)
<seb128> Breaks: gnome-media (<<...)
<seb128> the Replaces to say files moved between those binaries
<seb128> the Breaks to say to upgrade gnome-media
<rodrigo_> ok, testing that
<seb128> did you check what files moved between sources?
<rodrigo_> yes, all of the sound capplet
<seb128> ups
<seb128> don't ctrl-W in xchat-gnome ;-)
<rodrigo_> :)
<Zdra> seb128, is there already a package for webkitgtk3 somewhere? is it planned to push in gnome3 ppa?
<seb128> not that I know about and yes once we get one
<seb128> contributions are welcome ;-)
<Zdra> hehe, ok :)
<pitti> seb128: FYI, I packaged libnotify 0.7 into the gtk 3 PPA
<pitti> seb128: it's a new ABI, so I renamed the source and binary to make it installable in parallel; I guess it'll take some time to switch all rdepends
<chrisccoulson> seb128 / pitti / didrocks / geser - the URL handling is broken because of the x-scheme-handler changes in glib
<chrisccoulson> see mozilla bug 611953 for part of the fix
<seb128> pitti, why not pushing to natty?
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 611953 in Shell Integration "GNOME 3.0 readiness" [Normal,New] http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=611953
<chrisccoulson> we need to add x-scheme-handler/http to the firefox desktop file
<pitti> seb128: no particular reason, I can do that if you like; it doesn't depend on gtk
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> pitti, well, the cleaner the ppa is the easier we can handle it ;-)
<seb128> ideally the stack would land in natty now and the ppa would be a staging for things that need work or testing
<pitti> seb128: it will definitively move libnotify-bin to 0.7
<pitti> seb128: so far the only package I've seen that needs 0.7 is the 2.91 packagekit-gnome version, but I stayed at 2.32 since it needs other stuff as well
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - once i've updated the desktop file for firefox, we need to do a desktop-file-utils update to add the new types to /etc/gnome/defaults.list too
<seb128> GNOME 2.9n should depends on it
<pitti> seb128: okay, I'll upload it
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok great
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<chrisccoulson> then it will all start working again :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, that makes sense now
<seb128> that's why it opens files as file in applications rather than in firefox
<pitti> seb128: FYI, libnotify4 uploaded (in source NEW now)
<seb128> pitti, I can review that
<pitti> not urgent, I guess
<seb128> right, still when I've a free slot
<seb128> sorry everybody but I'm going to gnome3 spec spam you today
<pitti> don't apologize for doing work :)
 * didrocks prepares the "mark all as read" :)
<mvo> pitti: I created bzr+ssh://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mvo/apt/apt-get-changelog/ that contains a native implementation of this feature now, it should be fine because the location of the changelogs (changelogs.ubuntu.com and packages.debian.org/changelogs is pretty stable since years)
<pitti> mvo: wow, that fast?
<pitti> mvo: I had expected lots of trouble, since that'd need to call wget or link to curl, etc?
<mvo> pitti: apt as a lot of goodness that I was able to leverage, the diff is relatively small, the harded part is doing all the uri construction :/
<nessita> good morning everyone!
<pitti> hey nessita
<pitti> mvo: we should just be aware that the config option won't be configurable, as you have the entire path
<pitti> and my version just the prefix
<pitti> mvo: but if that lands within natty, it shouldn't be a problem
<nessita> hey pitti!
<mvo> pitti: it uses the internal apt download method, so that is fine (no need for wget or curl). about the config> good point, I will make sure to fix it in the merge
<rodrigo_> ${source:Version} expands to the upstream version or the package version?
<didrocks> good morning nessita
<nessita> hey didrocks, how are you?
<nessita> rodrigo_: the package source version, afaik
<rodrigo_> hi nessita
<didrocks> rodrigo_: source:Version is retrieved from debian/changelog
<rodrigo_> ok
<Zdra> seb128, is there anyone working on gnome-keyring3? :D
<didrocks> nessita: so, I had a look at your package, nice work :)
<didrocks> nessita: really really small remarks:
<didrocks> nessita: there is no need for Uploader: in ubuntu
<nessita> didrocks: ah, lintian was complaining if not
<didrocks> nessita: oh really? with --pedantic then?
<nessita> didrocks: nopes, lintian -i. But I can re check.
<nessita> didrocks: what else?
<didrocks> ubuntuone-control-panel depends on "python-ubuntuone-control-panel (>= ${source:Version}),". Do you ensure compatibilty or should it be rather (= ${binary:Version}) for both? (same Architecture: all)
<didrocks> as both comes from the same source and build on the same architecture, = is safer than >= with no additional issue because of a partial upgrade
<nessita> didrocks: it should be binary. Not sure what you mean with "Architecture: all"
<nessita> ah
<didrocks> and equals please, don't shoot in your feet :)
<nessita> didrocks: hum? not sure what that means :-)
<didrocks> "= is safer than >="
<nessita> yes!
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> apart from that, nothing do add
<didrocks> I didn't try to build yet though
<nessita> awesome
<didrocks> nessita: nice work!
<nessita> thanks!
<didrocks> nessita: this will replace u1preference ?
<nessita> didrocks: yes
<didrocks> nessita: ok, so I should work based on that for getting my login account and such for oneconf, right?
<nessita> didrocks: I think so, yes. But let me give you a few pointers:
<nessita> when you need tokens, you will need to call ussoc (ubunut-sso-client) as usual
 * didrocks listens :)
<pitti> mvo: hm, do we have any debconf integration in s-c at all? when I install xdm from synaptics, I get the fancy debconf-gtk dialog, but in s-c I don't see anything at all
<nessita> didrocks: you would need to use u1cp when you want the user to know what Ubuntu One is
<didrocks> nessita: but the tokens ensure me that the user have a u1 account (as having a sso account differs from having a u1 account, right?)
<nessita> didrocks: if ussoc provides tokens for the 'Ubuntu One' app, then the user has an Ubuntu One account
<nessita> didrocks: the u1 control panel will no handle tokens, at least not directly
<mvo> pitti: we should have that
<mvo> pitti: let me check if something broke
<didrocks> nessita: oh ok. I should paste that somewhere when I'll have some time to dive into that :)
<didrocks> nessita: of course, I'll spam you with questions as well :)
<nessita> didrocks: sure!
<nessita> didrocks: I have some feedback about OneConf, when you have some time (can be now if you'd like) I'll share
<seb128> Zdra, not yet
<nessita> didrocks: not sure how to fix the "Architecture: all", shall I remove it from every binary package but python-ubuntuone-control-panel ?
<didrocks> nessita: I'll have time to work on that seriously from A2, so if you don't mind and if that can wait, I would prefer when I'll have time for that :)
<nessita> didrocks: sure!
<didrocks> nessita: no no, it was just to illustrate that both binary packages will be published in the same time. No action on that
<seb128> hey nessita
<nessita> didrocks: ok, thanks
<nessita> hey seb128, how are you?
<didrocks> nessita: yw :)
<seb128> nessita, great, thanks, what about you?
<nessita> seb128: pretty good :-)
<nessita> didrocks: I removed the Uploaders field and now I get no lintian warning, I probably messed up something before :-D
<nessita> didrocks: so, changes would be: remove Uploadres, change (>= ${source:Version}) for (= ${binary:Version}), right?
<didrocks> nessita: exactly :)
<nessita> didrocks: fixed and pushed to the same location
<didrocks> nessita: ok, will build and sponsor (ready for natty, isn't it?)
<nessita> didrocks: yes sir
<didrocks> nessita: oh thinking about that, if that's going to replace u1preferences, should this one got uninstalled on upgrade?
<nessita> didrocks: u1preferences is not a separated package, is part of u1client
<nessita> didrocks: so we'll just remove the code...
<didrocks> nessita: ok, not packaging magic to do then, nice :)
<nessita> didrocks: both app will be "live" until we release u1cp (in natty, before freezes and all :-))
<didrocks> nessita: u1cp is "released" with this upload, right?
<didrocks> or is it something else?
<didrocks> (argh, get caught by the exception of "no @ubuntu email adress in the maintainer field and upload has an ubuntu member"
<didrocks> let me see if I can bypass the check in the code locally
<nessita> didrocks: yes, u1cp is released now, I meat the official release, like when is actually ready to replace u1preferences
<didrocks> nessita: ok, just to ensure we were speaking about the same thing, let me try it once I can build it without any checking error :)
<nessita> didrocks: sure
<didrocks> nessita: do you mind to set ubuntu developers as the maintainer and you as the XSBC-Original-Maintainer as explained in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField#Design ?
<fagan> didrocks: im getting a white screen when I start up unity (compiz) and compiz normally works and unity (mutter) worked fine. Is there any big issues that would cause that other than my computer being terrible?
<didrocks> fagan: if unity mutter works, that means that you didn't upgrade everything.
<nessita> didrocks: on it
<didrocks> apt-cache policy unity?
<didrocks> nessita: thanks
<fagan> didrocks: I meant that unity mutter worked before the upgrade
<didrocks> fagan: are you in the desktop session?
<fagan> didrocks: nope I still have panel on the desktop session. The netbook session is still the default for unity right?
<didrocks> fagan: did you look at this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/InstallationGuide ?
<fagan> didrocks: nope I just installed the ppa ill have a look
<didrocks> fagan: read that page, it will explains you how to activate unity
<fagan> its just the ccsm bit I missed
<didrocks> and the desktop session :)
<seb128> didrocks, nessita: using XSBC-Original-Maintainer for Ubuntu sources is buggy
<didrocks> seb128: how do you deal with it then? When the upload doesn't have an @ubuntu.com adress?
<seb128> export DEBEMAIL=random@email.com
<devildante> fagan: unity+compiz is very very buggy, fyi ;)
<didrocks> seb128: sounds like an hack to me and doesn't respect https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField#Design
<seb128> didrocks, the source is coming from debian?
<nessita> seb128: nopes, from me
<didrocks> seb128: nop, but if we have ubuntu changes, it's written that the maintainer should have an @ubuntu address
<seb128> ok, so XSBC-Original-Maintainer is not needed
<didrocks> which isn't the case
<seb128> why do we have ubuntu changes?
<seb128> if that's an ubuntu source
<didrocks> I think the goal of the versionning is to have it one day in Debian?
<seb128> the debian maintainer build failure thing is just stupid
<seb128> having an ubuntu source this way is just a valid usecase
<seb128> we shouldn't have the mangle the maintainer for our own work there
<fagan> yay its working :)
<seb128> the mangle -> to mangle
<didrocks> well, another solution is to hack Ubuntu.pm to get a "or canonical", but that can be controversial :)
<seb128> nessita needs to run for ubuntu membership and use an ubuntu email
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> :)
<seb128> well I just set DEBEMAIL to some email@debian.org when I sponsor things for her usually
<seb128> I consider it as a bug in the XSBC-Original-Maintainer checker
<didrocks> yeah, but seems to violate also the same wiki page :)
<seb128> you should have a flag to tell it you know what you are doing
<didrocks> but yeah, I don't care enough to argue :)
<seb128> no it doesn't?
<seb128> the goal is for packages coming from debian
<seb128> the wiki doesn't mandate to mangle ubuntu source coming from ubuntu
<didrocks> "if a source package is modified relative to Debian (this can be determined automatically by examining the version number)" -> this is what is broken, it should check if it's in debian or not rather. But that's a big hammer for small cases
<seb128> didrocks, right, me neither, you can set XSBC-Original-Maintainer or unset DEBEMAIL
<nessita> didrocks, seb128: I just read backlog and I'm not sure what to do, other than apply to ubuntu membership (link pliz?)
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, i'll unset DEBEMAL
<seb128> nessita, that turned to an Ubuntu policy discussion
<nessita> heh
<seb128> nessita, you don't really need to do anything, but you can apply for ubuntu membership if you want
<nessita> seb128: I'd like to, not sure if I gather all the requirements. Is there a list of reqs available?
<seb128> nessita, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership
<didrocks> ok, because of compiz crashing I couldn't paste the link faster :)
<didrocks> it crashes chromium as well, which soundsâ¦ ackward
 * rodrigo_ -> lunch
<didrocks> nessita: btw, is it normal your DEBMAIL/EMAIL is your gmail adress? (the one reported in debian/changelog)
<nessita> didrocks: yes, but if you need I can change it. I package more thing ourtide canonical...
<didrocks> nessita: no no, I was just wondering :)
<nessita> :-)
<nessita> things*, outside*. Drinking mate while typing makes my typing suck :-P
<didrocks> :)
<seb128> nessita, stop drinking at work!
<seb128> ;-)
<nessita> seb128: why?!?! you're just jealous :-D
<didrocks> nessita: no, it's just seb128 never stop drinking. So he's not "drinking at work", but all the day :)
<seb128> could be ;-)
 * didrocks runsâ¦
 * seb128 whip noises
<didrocks> nessita: can't start it and seems I have the latest (and greatest of the deps): http://paste.ubuntu.com/532339/
<didrocks> seb128: ahah :)
<nessita> didrocks: ah! good catch mister! I need to require natty's ubunutone-client
<nessita> didrocks: which I'm not sure there is package for
<nessita> didrocks: I'll hunt dobey
<nessita> or rodrigo_?
<didrocks> nessita: doesn't seem as the apt-cache policy seems to show I have the latest in natty
<nessita> rodrigo_: any idea who's building the natty packages for u1client?
<didrocks> I didn't apt-get update, let me check
<nessita> didrocks: yeah, but I don't think anyone packaged latest u1client for natty, since you stole^W borrowed rodrigo_
<didrocks> (to refresh apt-cache policy)
<didrocks> :)
<nessita> didrocks: I'm pretty sure we need a new package for u1client, and I need to add the version to the Requires
<didrocks> yeah, checked, there is pending one in maverick-proposed but maverick and natty currently have the same
<nessita> yes
<nessita> didrocks: I'll get back to you, I'll chase some people first :-)
<didrocks> nessita: please do, chase them! :-)
<nessita> didrocks: thanks a lot for this catch, I'm running u1 nightlies so this issue didn't come up
<seb128> nessita, rodrigo left for lunch
<seb128> let's wait for him to be back
<nessita> seb128: yes boss!
<nessita> :-P
<didrocks> nessita: yw, quite hard to catch when you have things moving and no "clean machine" :)
<seb128> ;-)
<bcurtiswx> has anyone started packaging emapthy 2.32.1?
<bcurtiswx> empathy*
<mterry> seb128, is there a reason I shouldn't try updating to gtk3-based gedit for natty?  i.e. we're going ahead with the low-hanging fruit (if gedit turns out to be such)?
<seb128> mterry, not at all
<seb128> mterry, bug #656887 is yours I guess
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 656887 in gtksourceview2 (Ubuntu) "requires a new source for GTK3 (affects: 1) (heat: 86)" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/656887
<mterry> New source?  :-/
<mterry> Oh, for gtksourceview, sure
<seb128> mterry, right
<seb128> mterry, I think I checked when I opened the bug and they support only one gtk flavor so no way to dual build
<seb128> mterry, so new source since we can't drop the gtk2 build easily it has some rdepends
<seb128> mterry, btw if you want to do some updates I think gdl and anjuta could be updated
<seb128> gdl has only 2 rdepends, anjuta and gtranslator
<seb128> gtranslator seems to be pretty much ported to gtk3 in git
<mterry> seb128, gdl?
<seb128> since anjuta is in universe there should be no issue to upload a gtk3 version
<seb128> mterry, libgdl-1-3
<seb128> mterry, it's a lib used by anjuta
<seb128> I guess you would need to update it first if you update anjuta
<mterry> seb128, gotcha, haven't run into it before
<seb128> mterry, other "easy target" should be cheese
<seb128> mterry, I guess you have enough items, just pick some in those ;-)
<seb128> let me know or update the spec though so we don't dup work
<mterry> seb128, what happened with launchpad-integration?
<seb128> mterry, I just merged it, I'm about to upload
<seb128> mterry, I had days off work on thursday and friday so I just picked up on backlog today
<kenvandine> seb128, nudge on endorsement :)
<mterry> seb128, ah, OK.  Didn't mean to be impatient  :)
<seb128> kenvandine, oh right ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, also can you look at ubuntu-geoip again?
<kenvandine> lp:~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu-geoip/ubuntu
<seb128> kenvandine, ok
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> kenvandine, hey btw, had a nice weekend? ;-)
<kenvandine> i sure did
<kenvandine> did you?
<kenvandine> i managed to play some soccer yesterday, that was fun :)
<bcurtiswx> anyone who has a free minute or two, im working on bug #675555, and building gives errors of the following, http://paste.ubuntu.com/532362/  any ideas or tips I can use to figure it out?  or would this be better for -motu ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 675555 in empathy (Ubuntu) "Empathy SRU maverick 2.32.1 (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/675555
<seb128> kenvandine, I had a great weekend, didn't play soccer though
<devildante> bcurtiswx: it seems the patch isn't working
<devildante> bcurtiswx: you should try to fix it
<bcurtiswx> devildante, i would be lying if i said i knew where to start fixing it :-X
<devildante> lol
<bcurtiswx> lieing*
<devildante> lying is correct spelling, ya know :p
<bcurtiswx> eh, i grew up speaking english and i still can't get it right.. i gave up trying to get it right :P
<devildante> lol
<bcurtiswx> to-may-toe to-mah-to.. same diff :P
<didrocks> seb128: do you think that we will get g-s-d (it handles gnome keybindings right?) to the gsettings version? It's linked to g-c-c for the capplet, isn't it?
<bcurtiswx> didrocks, back to the paste, line 57 is the additions of the libindicate but the only other option would be to remove it i  would assume.. and that doesn't seem right to me
<bcurtiswx> whoops devildante not didrocks
<bcurtiswx> sry
<devildante> bcurtiswx: try to look at configure.ac in both original and diff, at lines 57and 597
<didrocks> no worry :)
<devildante> lol
<devildante> (again :p)
<bcurtiswx> tab complete fail
<bcurtiswx> not my brain this time
<devildante> did ssh change in natty? I get a message about how my private ssh key has too much open permissions
<jcastro> didrocks: good morning!
<jcastro> didrocks: I was wondering what your schedule is like this week?
<jcastro> Laney and crew have been slimming down the packaging of banshee
<seb128> didrocks, not sure, read the email spam you got from me on the gnome3 spec
<seb128> didrocks, or read the whiteboard
<jcastro> and check this out: http://people.ubuntu.com/~hyperair/banshee-dep.png
<jcastro> seb128: you too ^^^
<jcastro> the red boxes are stuff they've removed since UDS that we don't need to ship
<jcastro> and blue is pending
<hyperair> in addition, the red boxes are the stuff already included in the calculation done in UDS. blue ones weren't included in those calculations
<didrocks> seb128: the whiteboard doesn't status on that, hence the fact I wanted to hilight it, because:
<didrocks> (jcastro: will be back to you in a second)
<seb128> didrocks, status on what?
<Laney> hyperair: is the new gdata synced?
<didrocks> seb128: compiz needs the gconf backend to read GNOME keybindings if they are in gconf
<hyperair> Laney: yes.
<seb128> didrocks, well it highlight that it's a update bundled with gnome-control-center gnome-screensaver livgnomekbd
<Laney> awe + some
<hyperair> Laney: -5, right?
<hyperair> Laney: i didn't do it, someone else must have.
<didrocks> seb128: I discussed that with smspillaz last week. In fact, the plugins needs to read, but also write them
<Laney> looks like directhex did
<seb128> didrocks, I don't think we will have a decision on g-s-d before the rally
<hyperair> Laney: i guess he did.
<Laney>  Depends: cli-common (>= 0.5.1), libmono-corlib2.0-cil (>= 2.6.3), libmono-system2.0-cil (>= 2.6.3)
<Laney> mmm slim
<jcastro> Laney: over the weekend gabaug mentioned that the only thing that uses libgdata is the youtube extension.
<Laney> yeah
<jcastro> Laney: tbh it's alot of disk space for one feature
<didrocks> seb128: ok, so no support for GNOME keybinding before the rally as well, sounds ok?
<Laney> the gdata package itself can be split up further
<didrocks> (some for ws switcher and such)
<didrocks> same*
<seb128> didrocks, let's switch to query it's noisy there
<hyperair> Laney: don't the dlls depend on each other?
<rodrigo_> nessita, there hasn't been any releases, so I haven't done any new package for natty
<rodrigo_> nessita, there should be in the nightlies, not sure if that has natty packages
<nessita> rodrigo_: thet is no natty package yet, I've just asked dobey to help us with that. Who used to do the releases?
<rodrigo_> nessita, me
<nessita> rodrigo_: ah, ok. We'll try to build the package tomorrow, if we need a hand we may ping you :-)
<dobey> i think we'll survive
<rodrigo_> nessita, yes, dobey knows how to, and he has upload rights also
<rodrigo_> but yes, ping me if you need anything from me
<nessita> dobey, rodrigo_: thanks
<didrocks> Laney: hyperair: did you check the MIR btw?
<hyperair> no i didn't
<didrocks> I think it's the latest thing before changing the seed
<Laney> we need mono -4 first
<hyperair> hm
<seb128> pitti, libnotify
<seb128> DEB_DH_MAKESHLIBS_ARGS_libnotify1 := -V "libnotify1 (>= 0.5.0), libnotify1-gtk2.10"
<seb128> pitti, wrong binary name
<pitti> seb128: oh, that's obsolete
<pitti> it'll get entirely ignored, as there is no such binary
<seb128> well you probably want the keep the line for the new soname?
<seb128> or use a .symbols
<pitti> seb128: unless you know what that libnotify1-gtk2.10 thing was all about, I don't think we need it
<pitti> seb128: but a symbols file would be better, yes; I'll upload a followup package
<seb128> pitti, I don't, I guess it was a virtual package to match a gtk abi
<seb128> gtk loader abi rather
<seb128> pitti, but that's not required with the current version
<pitti> right, it doesn't use GTK any more apparently
<seb128> pitti, ok, source accepted
<pitti> seb128: cheers; I'll upload a .symbol-ized version
<pitti> thanks for spotting
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> yw
<seb128> pitti, oh, copyright needs an update as well
<seb128> pitti, tools/notify-send.c is LGPL as well it seems
<seb128> Sat Aug 25 18:08:01 PDT 2007  Christian Hammond <chipx86@chipx86.com>
<seb128>         * tools/notify-send.c:
<seb128>           - Relicense notify-send under the LGPL in order to keep licensing
<pitti> ok, thanks; I guess I'll modify it for DEP5
<seb128> pitti, great
<kenvandine> pitti, can you look at the ubuntuone-team work items and see why some blueprints aren't showing up?
<pitti> I built that package based on lp:ubuntu/libnotify, I hope I'll get an auto-import branch soon, so that I can properly bzrify that
<kenvandine> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/appdevs-ubuntuone-n-apis
<kenvandine> that one is showing up
<kenvandine> but
<kenvandine> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/other-ubuntuone-n-shares-status-udfs
<kenvandine> isn't
<kenvandine> oh... maybe she isn't in the team... nm
<pitti> kenvandine: presumably because she is only an indirect team member
<kenvandine> yeah, so you have to be a direct member right?
<pitti> the arm guys changed the code so that transitive members work as well
<pitti> but I'm not sure how in particular
<kenvandine> ok, i'll make sure they  add all members directly
<pitti> kenvandine: ah, add it to recursive_teams dict in natty.cfg
<kenvandine> ok
<pitti> kenvandine: r195 in lp:launchpad-work-items-tracker
<seb128> kenvandine, ubuntu-geoip is gold
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, no comment from me, should I sponsor it?
<kenvandine> seb128, yes please
<kenvandine> then i'll do the mir
<kenvandine> pitti, i don't have write perms
<pitti> kenvandine: sure; sudo -u platform -i
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> kenvandine, oh, one comment, have a watch would be handy ;-)
<kenvandine> oh... forgot that one :)
<kenvandine> i'll add
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, in any case uploaded and wiki comment added for your application as well
<kenvandine> ok, cool
<kenvandine> wiki comment?
<seb128> kenvandine, to support your application
<seb128> kenvandine, so you can get proper upload rights ;-)
<kenvandine> oh that... thx
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> yw
<seb128> less work for me over time I'm sure ;-)
<lamalex> TheMuso, seb128 can we possibly get at-spi2 into main?
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> lamalex, no objection from me, ideally it would become default this cycle, we just need a mir for it
<lamalex> seb128, we may need it in unity depending on how I decide to to a11y
<seb128> lamalex, you should talk to TheMuso
<seb128> we need to settle on one at-spi version at some point
<seb128> we can't have both installed
<lamalex> he's hard to talk to, being in Australia and all
<lamalex> I emailed him this morning (my morning)
<seb128> lamalex, right, let's wait for him to reply to the email then
<seb128> lamalex, I think the plan of record was to try to get at-spi2 by default this cycle
<lamalex> I mean, we should probably move to at-spi2 anyway
<seb128> not sure how testing etc is going though
<seb128> lamalex, right, TheMuso said at UDS he needed to make sure things work with it and that the speed issues are not a stopper or can be resolved
<lamalex> yah
<mterry> seb128, whoops, sorry about launchpad-integration ftbfs.  My bad on the last minute vala-0.12 -> vala change, didn't grep for other uses of vala-0.12.  Prepping a new merge
<didrocks> (we should do a rule, 1 FTBFS -> 1 beer at UDS/rally)
<seb128> mterry, no worry, if you didn't start fixing it yet don't bother I can do it
<seb128> didrocks, stop drinking
<mterry> :)
<didrocks> seb128: I'm following nessita's advice :)
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti. do you have time to process a removal? (bug 675587) :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 675587 in pyxpcom (Ubuntu) "Please remove and blacklist pyxpcom from the archive (affects: 1) (heat: 10)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/675587
<pitti> chrisccoulson: that urgent? yes, can do
<nessita> didrocks: what did I do?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it's not really urgent as such, but i'd like to not forget about it? :)
<didrocks> nessita: just read two lines above my comment :)
<seb128> mterry, did you start on it or should I do it? it's a one liner I guess
<mterry> seb128, I did
<seb128> ok
<mterry> seb128, but it is a one-liner, easier for you to do than me to propose a merge
<mterry> seb128, just change debian/liblaunchpad-integration-dev.install
<nessita> didrocks: :-)
<mterry> to not have the -0.12 suffix
<seb128> mterry, ok, what I though, thanks
<seb128> will do that now
 * nessita will messed up the desktop team with the drinking
<nessita> mess*
<mterry> tedg, did you see the indicator-applet dbus merge?  Not sure if you got my IRC ping last week
<pitti> chrisccoulson: done
<chrisccoulson> pitti - excellent, thanks
<tedg> mterry, Yeah, I did.  I hadn't had a chance to go through it though.
<mterry> np
<tedg> mterry, Is the new GNOME panel in the Maverick GNOME 3 PPA?
<mterry> no rush, just didn't want it to get lost.  not everyone seems to get merge emails
 * tedg is worried about "going beta" early this cycle.
<mterry> tedg, the new panel is in natty
<seb128> tedg, no, we didn't start backporting the application stack and not sure we want
<seb128> it's quite some work to get right and we don't have cycles to waste
<mterry> seb128, wait a sec on that change
<seb128> mterry, the lpi one?
<kenvandine> seb128, ted made releases dbusmenu and libindicator for the gtk3 transition, what should be done with the packaging?  soname bump and build-depends, anything else?
<mterry> seb128, yeah...  I did a build just to be sure, and it failed to find /usr/share/vala as well.  something's odd
<seb128> mterry, ok, I'm installing the build-depends I was lacking as well there
<seb128> been lazy the first time
<seb128> kenvandine, do they build both versions?
<seb128> or is that a new source?
<kenvandine> i actually haven't looked at it yet, i assumed just for gtk3
<kenvandine> not new source
<seb128> ok, hold that off
<kenvandine> tedg, ^^
<kenvandine> it is blocking all of tedg's other packages :)
<seb128> it's not going to trivial work
<seb128> to be trivial work
<seb128> why?
<seb128> tedg, there?
<kenvandine> api changes, i guess... tedg ^^
<kenvandine> he didn't really explain, just that he couldn't do other releases until we got these done
<seb128> kenvandine, the configure allows to select the gtk version at build time right?
<seb128> can we build with gtk2 for now? is that enough to unblock other tarballs?
<kenvandine> i am grabbing the source now
<seb128> ok
<tedg> seb128, There's a soname bump to get reserveds back.
<seb128> let me do that as well
<tedg> We need the .pc files to start building the other libs on GTK3
<tedg> So I'd like to get the package sets figured out so that we can start building up the stack.
<seb128> ok, so you build both versions?
<tedg> I don't, I thought packaging was going to do that.
<seb128> well, configure allows to specify which one to build? and they don't conflict?
<tedg> So once with "configure --with-gtk=2" and once with "configure --with-gtk=3"
<seb128> like you namespaced the .pc .h etc
<asac> Riddell: why do we have libqtwebkit 2.0 in maverick? i am told qt 4.7 came with 2.1 ?
<seb128> or directories
<tedg> I think so, but it's really hard to verify :-/
<tedg> To be fair, mterry did all the work.
<kenvandine> hehe
<Riddell> asac: you're told wrong, Qt 4.7 came with QtWebKit 2.0, QtWebKit 2.1 is still in development
<asac> heh nice
 * mterry reads back
<kenvandine> doesn't seem to let you choose both
<mterry> tedg, seb128, kenvandine: Yeah, for dbusmenu and friends, there are namespaced pc files and such.  I did that stuff a while ago, though, so I'm hazy on details.  But they are *supposed* to be dual-buildable
<kenvandine> so we would have to do multiple passes
<seb128> kenvandine, well, we need 2 builds one for each gtk
<kenvandine> yeha
<seb128> similar to what mterry did for lpi
<asac> Riddell: you are right ;) ... thanks
<seb128> launchpad-integration
 * kenvandine remembers how much from that was with python-indicate
<seb128> kenvandine, mterry, tedg: ok, the real question is:
<kenvandine> s/from/fun
<seb128> - do we need to have all indicators on the same gtk version
<seb128> and
<seb128> - do we need to have the applet using the same gtk version than the indicators
<kenvandine> i really hope the answer to number 2 is no
<seb128> ideally the reply to both would be no, but I guess really world is not like that ;-)
<mterry> seb128, I remember tedg saying that all libindicate rdepends need to be ported at the same time (like, 2 or 3), but as long as libappindicate and such were dual-installable, indicators could be ported lazily
<tedg> seb128, Yes, but we take care of that by making two directories.
<tedg> XFCE applet will be GTK2, and Unity/indicator-applet will be GTK3.
<tedg> So we'll need to dual build all of the indicator's .so
<kenvandine> ok
<rodrigo_> seb128, hmm, if they are loaded in process, mixing GTK2 and 3 is buggy
<tedg> Applications should be fine with libappindicator though.
<tedg> They can choose which one, the only issue is the stuff we write.
 * tedg loves his use of "only" there :)
<seb128> tedg, well question 2 is the important one
<kenvandine> hehe
<seb128> tedg, I don't think we have a gtk3 applet yet and I'm not sure we will be able this cycle
<mterry> seb128, (re: lpi, continue with that one-line change.  I just had to autoreconf  to make the change I did in lib/Makefile.am move to lib/Makefile.in)
<seb128> so can we keep the applet on gtk2?
<seb128> mterry, ok thanks
<tedg> seb128, Well, I think that Unity will need to be GTK3....
<tedg> njpatel, ^
<kenvandine> tedg, but that isn't going to be an applet
<njpatel> unity compiz plugin will be gtk3
<njpatel> but the panel service can be gtk2 or gtk3
<njpatel> (panel service actually loads the indicators)
<kenvandine> i would think that could be gtk3 and indicator-applet still be gtk2
<tedg> kenvandine, Yes, we could.
<seb128> kenvandine, well that means each indicator would have to be built twice
<seb128> one for unity and one for GNOME or xfce
<tedg> I guess the question is: Do we need to have GTK3 indicator .so's?
<tedg> If we're going to use the GNOME 3 panel, we do AFAIK
<kenvandine> why?  the indicators themselves don't depend on gtk do they?
<tedg> kenvandine, The .so's do.
<kenvandine> ugh
<seb128> tedg, vuntz said gnome-panel will be able to load gtk2 applets
<seb128> gtk2 and gtk3
<seb128> he has a trick to make that work apparently
<tedg> Is there going to be a libpanel for gtk2?
<seb128> I guess there will be one to make that work
<dobey> i would imagine it would be an external process that used ~current libpanel-applet
<seb128> ok, so let's go back step by step
<tedg> Ah, that would mean that indicator-applet would still link to Bonobo....
<seb128> tedg, can we do the dbusmenu and libindicate update built with gtk2 to unblock other  updates?
<njpatel> seb128, why once for unity?
<seb128> like package the new version with gtk2 and get going?
<tedg> seb128, No, really what I need is the package names etc. for the GTK3 migration.
<seb128> njpatel, well, "once for gtk3 loaders, once for gtk2 loaders"
<tedg> seb128, We need to do GTK3 regardless for libappindicator.
<seb128> njpatel, what between unity, gnome-panel and xfce goes in each category is still not determined
<tedg> seb128, Though, if we could figure out how to do the GTK2 everything -- I'm happy not doing libindicator.
<njpatel> seb128, right, and just remember unity can be a gtk2 or  a gtk3 loader, whatever makes your guy's life easier, as the thing that deals with it is it's own binary/daemon, outside of Unity plugin
<seb128> njpatel, ok, that's useful ;-)
<seb128> njpatel, thanks
 * kenvandine hugs njpatel
 * kenvandine misses, falls on face
<seb128> lol
<seb128> tedg, ok, so let's say we dual build gtk2 and gtk3 version for those
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> those being libdbusmenu libindicate
<seb128> tedg, can we not port any indicator to gtk3?
<seb128> libindicate -> libindicator
<kenvandine> would we name the gtk3 build to dbusmenu-gtk3 ?
<seb128> kenvandine, we would name the binary to match the library
<tedg> seb128, We don't have to port any indicator to GTK 3.  The only reason to do it would be for the loaders.
<seb128> tedg, indicators no, applications using libindicator might go gtk3
<tedg> seb128, Correct.  But that's different.
<tedg> Applications only use libappindicator not libindicator
<seb128> ok, so for now I lean toward not porting any indicator
<seb128> so we just need a libappindicator dual build?
<tedg> Yes, and that one requires libdbusmenu.
<tedg> Oh, and libindicate needs to dual build as well.
<seb128> I'm fine adding dual build for those 3
<tedg> So *need* for applications: libappindicator, libindicate, libdbusmenu
<seb128> what I'm trying to understand is what we need to update up the stack once that's done
<tedg> Need for loaders: libindicator, all the indicator-* packages
<seb128> or rather if we can not update things
<rodrigo_> if libappindicator is GTK2, can we link that one to GTK3 apps? I guess not
<seb128> tedg, the applications using libappindicators only do dbus right?
<tedg> rodrigo_, No, because it'd pull in GTK2 and get symbol conflicts
<rodrigo_> right
<seb128> tedg, no direct gtk use that force them to be on the same gtk than the service?
<tedg> seb128, Correct.
<seb128> ok
<seb128> so let's dual build those 3 libs and use them nowhere yet
<seb128> we will just use libappindicator on gtk3 when required
<seb128> but not port any indicator yet
<seb128> deal?
<seb128> tedg, ^
<tedg> Sounds fine to me.
<seb128> ok, let's start with that
<seb128> kenvandine do you feel like doing that?
<kenvandine> i'll do it.... doesn't sound fun though :)
<seb128> kenvandine, start with dbusmenu and ping me for review once it's done
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> no it's not :-(
<kenvandine> will do
<seb128> you can try to use mterry's work from launchpad-integration as inspiration for example
<kenvandine> yeah, will do
<mterry> I can't take credit from lpi's packaging work. I copied the dual-build logic already there for supporting multiple python versions
<seb128> kenvandine, the binary name should just follow the library naming convention, I think mterry patches made things installable in parallel, so it's basically picking the name he picked for the libraries
<seb128> likely adding a "3" in the library name
 * mterry does love adding 3 to things
<seb128> ;-)
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> kenvandine, you can switch to dh7 if you think it will make your life easier
<mterry> tedg, did I add support for building a gir file?  I don't think I did, but it would have been a neat thing to do
<tedg> mterry, It already did, so I think it just made a versioned one.
<mterry> hot!
<mterry> that sounds familir
 * kenvandine grabs some food, bbs
<pitti> seb128: libnotify4 fixes uploaded, FTR
<seb128> rodrigo_, I already added a comment on the whiteboard about the nautilus gsd depends
<rodrigo_> seb128, ah, sorry, didn't see it
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> I've been editing the whiteboard a lot today ;-)
<fta> seb128, chrisccoulson, i see "build webkit with gtk3", what about flash?
<seb128> ?
<seb128> it's for desktop applications
<seb128> empathy for example
<chrisccoulson> does epiphany use it?
<seb128> well not now, the GNOME 3 version probably will
<seb128> fta, the work item is a "build binaries for both gtk2 and gtk3"
<fta> for chrom*, upstream says they'll stick to gtk2 because of adobe flash
<seb128> fta, it doesn't imply on what applications will use what versions
<seb128> the gtk3 build will be useful for desktop softwares
<chrisccoulson> fta - doesn't chrome run flash out-of-process?
<fta> chrisccoulson, yep, remains to be tested
<ari-tczew> could someone from ubuntu desktop review my merge patch? bug 674908
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 674908 in meta-gnome2 (Ubuntu) "Merge meta-gnome2 1:2.30+6 (universe) from Debian unstable (main) (affects: 1) (heat: 14)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/674908
<kklimonda> kenvandine: wrt to your problem with json-glib and not knowing the type of return json result - you can use JsonReader which will make it fairly easy to work around that.
<kenvandine> kklimonda, yeah i hoped that was the case
<kenvandine> i haven't looked at the API yet
<kklimonda> kenvandine: you can do something like that: http://pastebin.com/W78U1nda
<kklimonda> it's still not very high level and using JsonReader bloats your code a little (as you need two functions to get every value instead of one) but I think it's as good as it can get unless rodrigo_ thinks of something better :)
<mterry> seb128, I have a gtksourceview3 package ready.  Should review happen via NEW queue or somewhere else?
<seb128> NEW is fine
<seb128> I can review it before you upload if you want a first review
<mterry> seb128, naw, thanks
<mterry> seb128, I already pushed it once you said "NEW is fine" :)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> mterry, lpi failed to build on !i386
<seb128> it's annoying because I've no clue why
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/launchpad-integration/0.1.42
<pitti> seb128: oh, so upstream g-s-d gave in wrt. xrandr behaviour? nice :)
<mterry> pitti, I just uploaded a gtksourceview3 to NEW for ya.  But I just realized I made one change that debian may not make that would create a package name delta...  So don't review it yet.  Maybe I can talk to Debian guys and see what their naming scheme will be for 3.0
<seb128> pitti, not really, different upstream decided it was better this way
<seb128> mterry, you can ask on #debian-gnome on oftc
<pitti> mterry: okay; if that's going to take longer, want me to reject it for now, to avoid another archive admin picking it up? I know Riddell is very thorough in NEW review on Tuesdays
<seb128> mterry, I think I will just commit our gtk3 packages to their svn
<seb128> so they have a work basis and know what we do and can tweak over that if they want
<mterry> pitti, OK, safer that way
<mterry> seb128, OK, but still want to pass this by them 'in person'
 * mterry hops on #debian-gnome
<pitti> mterry: ok, done; you can reupload unmodified (same version number etc.) if it turns out to be okay
<seb128> hum, http://launchpadlibrarian.net/59165700/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-i386.gnome-settings-daemon_2.32.1-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<seb128> didrocks, ^ it's your bug :p
<seb128> (not sure to understand what's going on though)
<pitti> didrocks, seb128: hm, what was the gnome 3 staging PPA again? I want to remove libnotify4
<seb128> pitti, https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/gnome3-builds
<pitti> seb128: merci
<seb128> de rien
<seb128> ok, time for sport
<seb128> mterry, if you want to investigate the lpi build issue you are welcome
<seb128> didrocks, same for you
<seb128> on the gnome-settings-daemon one
<didrocks> seb128: not today, but tomorrow
<seb128> didrocks, ok, I might try to figure what is wrong as well
<seb128> gnome-update-wallpaper-cache.c:(.text+0x27): undefined reference to `gdk_init'
<seb128> but it has pkg-config --cflags --libs glib-2.0 gdk-2.0
<didrocks> seb128: i'm about living, I'm fed up with the /opt hack :)
<didrocks> side effects and suchâ¦
<seb128> I'm about to go for sport
<seb128> didrocks, enjoy your evening
<chrisccoulson> you might get a new firefox version in the archive this evening :)
<didrocks> seb128: thanks, you too :)
<mterry> seb128, I can look at failure after I eat some lunch
<pitti> good night everyone! taekwondo time
<seb128> 'night pitti
<seb128> time for swimming there
<didrocks> good night everyone, sport and then will work a little offline :)
<doctormo> bryceh: ping
<sense> Isn't 'libgnome2-perl' needed to make Debconf run with a GTK+ GUI? If so, why then was it removed from the desktop seed in natty?
<kklimonda> kenvandine: actually JsonReader have json_reader_is_array and json_reader_is_object
<kklimonda> and I'm getting a headache from looking at all this Json stuff already..
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: ping :)
<kenvandine> kklimonda, hehe
<doctormo> Can anyone remember the ubuntu irc channel for xorg? got some questions.
<chrisccoulson> doctormo, #ubuntu-x ?
<doctormo> thanks chrisccoulson
<kenvandine> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, hey
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, how has the gwibber stuff gone?  I noticed some new packaging in lucid
<robert_ancell> natty rather
<kenvandine> i think great, split into plugins
<kenvandine> also think we fixed the facebook problems
<kenvandine> just need to get that update out to everyone
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, can you look at the gnome-screensaver package - I'm not sure if all your patches went upstream
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, so what was the fb problem?
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell, yeah, can do, once ff-4.0 is uploaded :)
<kenvandine> allocation is API requests + DB queries
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, heh, of course!
<kenvandine> so one of our API requests, which had some nested FQL queries, ended up making 266 million DB queries per day
<kenvandine> which is what i have been asking since the beginning, do db queries count in the allocation
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey
<kenvandine> when you say "API Requests", it sounds like http calls to facebook
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey
<kenvandine> not how many db queries it ends up being under the covers :)
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, yes, exactly.  So was there a cheaper API call to use?
<kenvandine> i was able to drop it complete
<seb128> robert_ancell, how are you?
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you receive my emails last week?
<kenvandine> because i had just fixed a bug 2 weeks ago, that made that request useless
<ubot2> kenvandine: Error: Bug #2 not found.
<kenvandine> haha
<kenvandine> there is no bug #2?
<ubot2> kenvandine: Error: Bug #2 not found.
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, so i just had to back port that fix to lucid and maverick plus drop the api call
<robert_ancell> seb128, the libdmapsharing and remmina one?
<seb128> robert_ancell, yes
<robert_ancell> hmm, they're there but I seem to have skipped over them.  I'll reply now
<seb128> robert_ancell, the vinagre and applet one as well
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, btw you updated nautilus, I guess it can't load .so using gtk2?
<seb128> robert_ancell, I've updated the gnome3 spec a lot today
<robert_ancell> seb128, did you get a reply from debian about the GTK3 packaging naming?
<robert_ancell> seb128, ah, I was suprised that the standard plugins worked with nautilus, which one are you talking about?
<ari-tczew> hello robert_ancell ! I prepared a first merge to review: bug 674908 . are you able to take a look?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 674908 in meta-gnome2 (Ubuntu) "Merge meta-gnome2 1:2.30+6 (universe) from Debian unstable (main) (affects: 1) (heat: 1422)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/674908
<seb128> robert_ancell, I didn't check the upgrade yet, but things like gdu
<seb128> or file-roller
<seb128> hum, need to restart my session, brb
<seb128> re
<robert_ancell> seb128, I couldn't find anything not working with file-roller
<seb128> sorry got some issues
<seb128> ok, so it loads the .so?
<seb128> like right menu on a tar.gz has an extract there?
<robert_ancell> seb128, afaict, but it may be silently not doing so
<seb128> or right click on a drive icon as a format entry
<seb128> has
<robert_ancell> yeah, compress shows
<seb128> ok great
<robert_ancell> (and opens the dialog)
<robert_ancell> it must just be a separate app that shares window id
<seb128> nautilus is using gtk3 right?
<robert_ancell> yes
<seb128> you have the "send to"... working as well?
<seb128> it will make things easier that I though then
<seb128> so we don't have to upgrade all those with nautilus
<robert_ancell> yeah
<seb128> I'm wondering if the other way around works as well, I will give it a try tomorrow
<seb128> loading gtk3 .so with the current nautilus
<seb128> I guess it will not work that great this way
<robert_ancell> why not? It the plugin system doesn't share binary GTK+ info then it should work just as well
<seb128> robert_ancell, right, if they didn't change the interface it should work
<rodrigo_> robert_ancell, chrisccoulson: I have been rebasing the g-screensaver patches today
<rodrigo_> and pinging mccann about some others
<robert_ancell> rodrigo_, cool, thansk
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<rodrigo_> seb128, the problem, afaik, is if GTK2 and GTK3 are loaded on the same process
<seb128> rodrigo_, right, I didn't check what nautilus does
<seb128> rodrigo_, I though it would dlopen the .so
<rodrigo_> yeah, which is in the same process
<seb128> well that wouldn't work then
<rodrigo_> afaik, it compiles now with GTK3, so all plugins would need to be GTK3
<seb128> but it does work so they must do it differently ;-)
<rodrigo_> ah
<rodrigo_> they work?
<seb128> well robert_ancell says they work
<rodrigo_> and is the nautilus package in the PPA compiled with GTK3?
<seb128> he can compress files from the context menu etc
<seb128> yes, it's 2.91
<rodrigo_> hmm
<robert_ancell> rodrigo_, yes, been using the PPA version for a few days, haven't seen any problems
<seb128> robert_ancell, what naming did I say I would check?
<seb128> sorry I dropped that one on the way I think
<robert_ancell> seb128, it was libgnomekbd, but generally I think we need to know what to name the gtk3 versions of libraries
<seb128> right, we try
<seb128> mterry just checked for the update he did today on #debian-gnome
<seb128> robert_ancell, libgnomekbd I don't think we need to rename
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you read my comments on the bug about it?
<seb128> robert_ancell, I've the feeling sometime you don't read comments from bugs you are subscribed to  ;-)
<robert_ancell> no, I did read them.  it's been put in the PPA, but the naming hasn't been resolved.  Why do you think it will work with both GTK2 and 3 apps?
<seb128> it will not
<robert_ancell> oh, I see your suggested names there.  But will Debian do the same?
<seb128> but as said on the bug they didn't version the files
<robert_ancell> right
<seb128> well I decided against
<seb128> the number of rdepends is 3
<seb128> we just need to update g-s-d g-c-c and g-s together
<seb128> we did need to update g-s-d and g-c-c together anyway
<seb128> so it's just adding g-s and the libgnomekbd update to the list
<seb128> which should not be an issue
<robert_ancell> ah, ok.  I thought there were more things that used it
<seb128> robert_ancell, well, apt-cache rdepends suggests not
<rodrigo_> g-s package will come soon, although it's taking longer, since the 2.91.0 release doesn't compile with gnome-desktop-3
<seb128> robert_ancell, I've written that in the gnome3 blueprint whiteboard btw, I keep taking notes there
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok great
<seb128> 'night
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-11-16
<TheMuso> /c/c
 * TheMuso notes that at-spi over dbus is a little painful to use, performance and accessibility wise.
<RAOF> I've seen a lot of discussion about at-spi2 as an example of how to make dbus performance a non-issue by making calls suitably asynchronous.
<TheMuso> Yeah afaik its being worked on upstream.
<TheMuso> But there is more than that, as the framework has often got to iterate over a list of objects. Take the pidgin buddy list. With at-spi via dbus, its rather slow to read out every item as you arrow over them, and the further to the bottom you go, the longer it takes.
<RAOF> Ow
<TheMuso> Yeah.
<TheMuso> The CORBA framework by comparrison, is rather snappy.
<didrocks> good morning
<nigelb> Good morning didrocks :)
<didrocks> hey nigelb :)
<TheMuso> Hey didrocks, nigelb.
<didrocks> hey TheMuso, how are you?
<TheMuso> didrocks: Not too bad thanks. Yourself?
<didrocks> TheMuso: I'm fine, thanks. Some snow at less than 100m (of height away)
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> didrocks: Nice.
<TheMuso> Morning pitti.
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti
<nigelb> HOla TheMuso
<huats> morning
<rodrigo_> morning
<didrocks> salut huats
<didrocks> hey rodrigo_
<huats> hello didrocks
<rodrigo_> salut didrocks, huats
<didrocks> rodrigo_: speaking French now? :)
<rodrigo_> un peu :)
<didrocks> tu ne sais pas dans quel engrenage tu mets le doigt :)
<didrocks> (good luck to translate that)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, hehe
<rodrigo_> la mafia franÃ§aise va me couper le doigt? :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: ahah ! non, pas Ã  ce point lÃ  :) (cela veut plutÃ´t dire: Â« tu ne sais pas dans quoi tu t'engages Â»)
<rodrigo_> porquoi? parler franÃ§ais va me poser des problÃ¨mes? :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: non, tu seras juste *obligÃ©* de nous parler franÃ§ais aprÃ¨s :)
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<seb128> rodrigo_, don't worry, finger cuting is a rusian mafia thing, the frenchs have better ways ;-)
<rodrigo_> ah, pas de problÃ¨me, j'aime parler franÃ§ais, mais je ne pratique jamais
<rodrigo_> hey seb128
<rodrigo_> seb128, :D
<didrocks> seb128: that's "la classe Ã  la franÃ§aise", isn't it? :)
<rodrigo_> seb128, and how is the french way? :)
<huats> morning rodrigo and seb128
<seb128> rodrigo_, clear head cuting ;-)
<rodrigo_> ah, oui :)
 * rodrigo_ learns russian
<pitti> oh, obviously I'm in the wrong channel, bye!
<pitti> rodrigo_: ÐÐ¾Ð»ÑÑÐµ Ð²Ð¾Ð´ÐºÐ¸, Ð¿Ð¾Ð¶Ð°Ð»ÑÐ¹ÑÑÐ°!
<rodrigo_> pitti, sorry, just decided to learn russian, so will answer when I learn :)
<pitti> rodrigo_: (it's "more Vodka, please!" :) )
<rodrigo_> ah :)
<seb128> hum, here we go again, it's only 10:20 and they start drinking
<didrocks> "what a team"
<huats> seb128, that is didrocks influence...
<didrocks> what??? :)
<seb128> huats, I know, it has started since he feels comfortable there
<didrocks> huats: you should notice that seb128 always finish his beer before me at UDS, I think that means something :)
<rodrigo_> yeah, we didn't drink at all until didrocks joined the company
<didrocks> so easy, so easyâ¦ :)
<seb128> so true at the same time ;-)
<huats> rodrigo_,  and seb128 you have no idea how hard it has been to share a room with didrocks at FOSDEM where we all know beers can be found everywhere...
<rodrigo_> huats, don't go ever again to FOSDEM with him, yes :D
<rodrigo_> I can feel your pain
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
<rodrigo_> but yeah, we all like didrocks
 * rodrigo_ hugs didrocks also
 * huats is happy to share that with you all :)
 * didrocks hugs seb128
 * didrocks hugs rodrigo_ as well
<huats> (while I am giving a training :))
<didrocks> how professional it is :)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i left my laptop running 2 firefox builds last night for me to test this morning, and my laptop ran out of disk space!
<chrisccoulson> :(
<pitti> build it in the cloud :)
<pitti> (or at least in the DC chroots)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i might start doing that. i keep running out of disk space!
<chrisccoulson> i guess when i'm always running at 99%, that's going to happen ;)
<TheMuso> lol
 * chrisccoulson needs a bigger disk
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, i'm good thanks. other than losing time from my overnight builds failing ;)
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> I'm fine thanks
<seb128> seems laptops are not fit for firefox
<seb128> you should buy a solid desk config ;-)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: how much do you have?
<pitti> last time I built ffox it didn't take that much, but it might have grown a lot since then
<chrisccoulson> oh, today is going to be a fun day
<chrisccoulson> my laptop crashed about 3/4 of the way through a rebuild!
<nigelb> chrisccoulson: use *cough* PPA *cough*
<chrisccoulson> nigelb - firefox builds in a PPA is usually slower
<chrisccoulson> especially if there are build issues, i need access to the build environment to debug them
<nigelb> ah
<nigelb> looks like seb is right, time for a solid desktop :)
<nigelb> (and a netbook to ssh into it)
<pitti> as a start, an USB HD should help a lot
<chrisccoulson> yeah ;)
<chrisccoulson> i might get a USB HD :)
<pitti> you don't already have one?
<pitti> where do you store all your music and videos?
<pitti> (the backups, I mean)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i do, but it's used to mirror the contents of the disk on my desktop
<chrisccoulson> (which has all my photos and music on)
<chrisccoulson> and that's nearly full too ;)
<chrisccoulson> although, not quite as bad, that's only running at about 90%
<chrisccoulson> omg, /var/cache/pbuilder/build = 25GB!
<chrisccoulson> that's crashed build environments laying around
<chrisccoulson> instant win
<chrisccoulson> excellent, i now have *loads* of disk space
<chrisccoulson> 83% full now, that's the lowest it's been for ages
<pitti> hah
<pitti> chrisccoulson: you actually build all stuff in pbuilder?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - not normally
<pitti> isn't that maximizing pain, time, and disk space?
<chrisccoulson> only towards the end of the cycle when i need to be sure stuff really works
<pitti> h
<pitti> ah
<chrisccoulson> i usually just use debuild, which is what i'm doing now
<chrisccoulson> my home folder is 65GB
<chrisccoulson> oh, i can get rid of ia32-libs source package
<chrisccoulson> i'm never going to touch that again ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: getting more space with the rm -rf axe - always the best kind :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i've just freed up another 9GB with that axe ;)
<chrisccoulson> wow, 36GB available now
<pitti> chrisccoulson: that should be enough for how many build trees? 20?
<Mez> Hi All, it seems that the ubuntu-desktop ppa cocked up my compiz.  I've now got it close to working, but I've got no window borders. I get the error "compiz (decoration) - Warn: Property ignored because version is 20080901 and decoration plugin version is 20080529" - does anyone know how to fix this?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - that's enough for 7 build trees ;)
<pitti> ouch
<chrisccoulson> yeah, they're pretty big!
<seb128> pitti, should somebody send a meeting reminder for today?
<seb128> pitti, we didn't discuss a new time btw, we said at UDS we would no?
<pitti> seb128: Jason said he'd still be available today, so we should discuss it today
<pitti> seb128: right, I'll send one, thanks
<seb128> pitti, thanks
 * seb128 writes activity report
<seb128> dear update-manager, why does typing completion is all weird with you
<seb128> pitti, https://edge.launchpad.net/~canonical-desktop-team/+contactuser
<seb128> pitti, just for info
<seb128> pitti, it's easier than having to Cc all team members
<pitti> seb128: I have a local "desktopteam" alias here
<pitti> but I forgot Rodrigo, it seems
<pitti> seb128: rodrigo_ isn't in https://edge.launchpad.net/~canonical-desktop-team/+members either, should he?
<seb128> I guess it would make sense for the cycle
<pitti> done
<pitti> meeting reminder forwarded, too
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<cyphermox> good morning!
<mvo> seb128: what is the problem with u-m ?
<pitti> Riddell: is that known?
<pitti>  python -c 'import PyKDE4.kdecore'
<pitti> python: /build/buildd/sip4-qt3-4.11.2/siplib/siplib.c:10613: sipEnumType_alloc: Assertion `(((currentType)->td_flags & 0x0007) == 0x0003)' failed.
<pitti> Aborted
<pitti> Riddell: (breaks apport, jockey, and presumably all other python kde apps)
<Riddell> pitti: nope, I'll take a look
<pitti> thanks!
<pitti> seb128: I've got more trouble with pygi; who could I ask about this?
<seb128> pitti, #introspection on irc.gnome.org
<seb128> or you can ask there
<pitti> thanks
<pitti> seb128: ah, my initial problem is solved by installing gir1.0-gtk-3.0 (it doesn't work with 2.0)
<pitti> seb128: however, I'm quite puzzled how to tell my python code to use GTK 3 now
<pitti> moch in #introspection doesn't know either
<seb128> pitti, Gtk.require_version
<seb128> pitti, Gtk.require_version = 3
<seb128> >>> print Gtk.get_minor_version()
<seb128> 91
<pitti> hm, I add that right after the import
<pitti> $ PYTHONPATH=. python gtk/jockey-gtk
<pitti>  /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/gtk-2.0/gi/module.py:119: Warning: cannot register existing type `GtkActionGroup'
<pitti> [...]
<pitti> still seems to import the gtk-2.0 bits
<seb128> I'm not really sure but kenvandine and mterry were discussing it the other day
<seb128> mterry got it working
<seb128> he should be online in a bit
<pitti> seb128: thanks
<pitti> funnily enough, python2.7 doesn't have above GtkActionGroup problem
<seb128> pitti, try Gtk.require_version("3.0")
<pitti> seb128: right, that seems to work better
<pitti> at least it ignores ... = 4, but properly fails on ("4.0")
<pitti> now it at least doesn't crash any more, just doesn't display anything yet. that's progress!
<pitti> :)
<seb128> pitti, ;-)
<cyphermox> fta: ping?
<didrocks> hey cyphermox
<cyphermox> hey didrocks
<didrocks> cyphermox: where are you with evolution? Will be nice if we can upload it soon :)
<cyphermox> didrocks, I can't really find something obvious to fix the migration, if that's what you mean
<didrocks> cyphermox: what upstream told? if you provide all the info they are normally helpful
<cyphermox> it looks like both evo and e-d-s keep files there and try to migrate them but something fails, not sure what :/
<didrocks> weird that they didn't fix this
<cyphermox> didrocks, like I said before, mbarnes looked at the code and saw it seemed fine
<didrocks> cyphermox: did you look at the git commits?
<cyphermox> not very recently
<chrisccoulson_> wow, thanks laptop for ruining another build
<didrocks> cyphermox: did you ask him as told where the code handle that and use git blame?
<cyphermox> didrocks, didn't have to, it's pretty obvious. that's all in shell/e-shell-migrate.c for evo and in the various */libebook-*/e-*-migrate.c for e-d-s :)
<cyphermox> *unless*
<cyphermox> this would be fixed with getting things straight from git HEAD, I haven't tried yet (was busy with synaptic)
<didrocks> cyphermox: so, git blame to find if there are new commits in thse files :)
<didrocks> cyphermox: do you think you will have time this week?
<cyphermox> right
<cyphermox> yeah, I could get that done today
<didrocks> nice :)
<chrisccoulson_> Nov 16 02:20:24 chris-laptop kernel: [116946.010026] [Hardware Error]: Machine check events logged => nice!
 * rodrigo_ -> lunch
<kenvandine> pitti, i think what mterry found was that the gtk version isn't 3.0, it is 2.91
<kenvandine> actually, i think Gtk.require_version("3.0") worked, but it was confusing because when you would check for the major_version it returned 2
<kenvandine> because the real version is 2.91
<mterry> kenvandine, pitti: without the require_version, you get 2.0.  So you need the require_version.  But yeah, major_version will still be 2
<mterry> (even with require_version 3.0, because it gives you 2.91.x)
<kenvandine> no confusing at all :)
<pitti> mterry, kenvandine: ok, thanks for confirming; I think Gtk.require_version('3.0') does what I need
<kenvandine> i think it does
<pitti> now I run into tons of trouble with assertions/crashes, having to call encode('UTF-8') everywhere (because Gtk expects UTF-8 strings, not unicode), and into all other sorts of type errors
<pitti> slowly crawling through :)
<pitti> but lunch first
<chrisccoulson_> hmmm, the x-scheme-handler changes in glib are a pain. http links open in a new browser window rather than a new tab now, because it just uses the standard Exec line from the desktop file
<baptistemm> seems easy to build as I did it in jhbuild without an itch
<baptistemm> (hello)
<baptistemm> oups not the right window
<ogra_ac> seb128, didrocks, just to make sure, RB stays supported, in natty, right ?
<ogra_ac> (bansheed doesnt work on arm and the discussion came up in the meeting)
<mterry> chrisccoulson_, and I'm assuming that change is what broke ghelp: links
<chrisccoulson_> mterry, yes
<chrisccoulson_> mterry - we need to update the desktop files for all the protocol handlers, and then set the defaults in desktop-file-utils as well
<chrisccoulson_> when i upload firefox later, it will have part of the fix in
<chrisccoulson_> i'm just wondering whether to change the Exec line for firefox and add -new-tab to it
<chrisccoulson_> it doesn't seem to affect a normal startup
<seb128> chrisccoulson_, or you could add a special .desktop just for the handler
<seb128> ogra_ac, define "supported"
<chrisccoulson_> seb128 - i could do. the issue is that firefox needs to have knowledge of the desktop file so it can set itself as the default browser
<chrisccoulson_> and that's already tricky enough, as the desktop files are distro-provided
<chrisccoulson_> currently, it will just use "firefox.desktop"
<chrisccoulson_> when they've accepted my patchset ;)
<seb128> ok
<ogra_ac> seb128, in "main"
<ogra_ac> i.e. getting security attention and SRU love
<chrisccoulson_> it doesn't need SRU love - it's already perfect!
<chrisccoulson_> ;)
<seb128> ogra_ac, I don't know, I don't think rb ever had a security update
<ogra_ac> we have to ship it for arm
<seb128> ogra_ac, we do sru things in universe as well
<ogra_ac> well, i mean the canonical supported set of apps ;)
<seb128> it will stay available but help to maintain it is welcome
<micahg> seb128: 4 updates in lucid, none in maverick yet
<ogra_ac> k, thanks
<seb128> ogra_ac, it's not really clear what we support or not, we don't support everything in main in any case
<seb128> micahg, security updates?
<micahg> or rather 1 in maverick in -proposed, no security updates :)
<ogra_ac> seb128, well, unless upstream mono fixes mono on ram we dont have much choice
<micahg> in Hardy there was one
<ogra_ac> *arm
<seb128> ogra_ac, in any case those questions don't really make sense
<seb128> it's not our default player, we still like it and will try to keep it uptodate
<ogra_ac> ok
<seb128> but you know how it goes with resources
<micahg> seb128: and the hardy -security update was for the FF36 transition
<ogra_ac> indeed
<seb128> micahg, I was just trying to point that the question was rather theoric, rb doesn't have lot of security updates usually
<micahg> right
<seb128> it will get less work for sure not being in the default installation
<seb128> but it doesn't mean it will not be in a shipable state
<ogra_ac> ok
<ogra_ac> well, we'll be your testbed ;)
 * ogra_ac shakes up the pillows
<seb128> well, feel free to take over it if you want ;-)
<ogra_ac> i'll look into bugs i find
<ogra_ac> for sure
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> ogra_ac: can you try dget -x http://people.canonical.com/~didrocks/netbook-meta_2.036.dsc and build it on an armel system to ensure it's still working? (as ppa doesn't have armel, I can't test it there) please?
<ogra_ac> didrocks, just upload it, if the images break we will fix it
<ogra_ac> its not that we are close to A1 yet ;)
<didrocks> ogra_ac: ok, I just wait to make unity entering natty and then, will upload that
<didrocks> ogra_ac: I'll do the same for the -settings, just building on armel for now and ask for binary removal
<ogra_ac> thanks
<didrocks> (not sure a manual removal is needed when getting from arch:all to arch:<something> on !something btw)
<didrocks> yw :)
<seb128> didrocks, didiiiiiiiier
<seb128> <- just updated compiz to 0.9
<seb128> not a success
<didrocks> seb128: what happened?
<didrocks> (natty, right?)
<seb128> the first issue is that you didn't update the shlibs on libdecorator0
<seb128> I still had 0.8 and the deco .so bailed out on missing symbols
<seb128> (I upgraded by doing an apt-get install compiz)
<didrocks> shlibs on libdecorator0? there is none IIRC
<didrocks> let me check
<seb128> that's the issue
<seb128> upgrading compiz didn't upgrade libdecorator0
<didrocks> ok, will fix that then (a symbols file will be better and easier)
<didrocks> what else?
<seb128> the gnome compat option was not activated ;-)
<seb128> (but you know about that)
<didrocks> well, you know why it's not :-)
<seb128> is ther a way to set my desktop grid from ccsm?
<seb128> the number of workspace, lines, columns
<seb128> I don't find it in the wall options
<didrocks> yeah, I didn't find either, and didn't asked yet sam
<seb128> ok, find it
<didrocks> oh? where is it?
<seb128> it's in the first category options
<seb128> the general compiz options
<didrocks> oh, that's an entry
<seb128> ok, I'm only missing a way to set "go to workspace <n>" shortcuts now
<didrocks> well, hard to find, I was thinking it was a plugin, didn't notice it doesn't have any checkbox
<didrocks> seb128: ok, then, the only "unknown issue" was on apt-get install compiz to upgrade, no shlibs/symbols file. Fixing this then :)
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: thanks for reporting this, it got eaten in the cdbs -> dh7 transition I thing :)
<pitti> didrocks: oh, you are packaging gnome stuff with dh7 now? do we need a dh_langpacks then?
<seb128> pitti, no "GNOME" but compiz ;-)
<seb128> but yeah, having dh7 utility for the cdbs magic we have would be nice
<didrocks> pitti: Amaranth began the compiz work on dh7, so I continued with than. I'll try to have a long on dh7 vs dh_langpacks for A2
<seb128> we have a task open for that since last cycle
<didrocks> (I should have a WI somewhere for that)
<pitti> ok, that shouldn't be too hard; that would go into gnome-pkg-tools?
<seb128> didrocks, there is a debhelper bug open and assigned to our team on launchpad
<didrocks> pitti: right now, there is a manual hack in the rules for desktop files only
<seb128> if you want to claim it
<didrocks> seb128: sure, looking for it
<seb128> pitti, well ideally we would get a --with gnome in Debian and modify that one in Ubuntu
<seb128> that would avoid having to patch the rules in ubuntu to include that
<pitti> *nod*
<pitti> if the Debian GNOME guys can agree to b-dep'ing on gnome-pkg-tools for packages that they convert to dh7
<didrocks> claimed bug #595008
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 595008 in debhelper (Ubuntu) "should port the Ubuntu cdbs custom rules to dh7 (affects: 1) (heat: 20)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/595008
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yw :)
<seb128> the "shortcuts to go to workspace <n>" not working is likely to drive me crazy
<pitti> or all my other shortcuts :)
<didrocks> seb128: use the gconf backend (/!\ not tested)
<didrocks> I'm used to ctrl + alt + arrows with my ws layout, so not a crazy thing for me :)
<chrisccoulson_> didrocks, it crashed when i switched it to the gconf backend here ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: did you report a bug about it?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, not yet, i wasn't sure if it was just a transitional issue
<chrisccoulson> will try it again later once i've updated again
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, thanks :)
<didrocks> I try to not clutter my laptop before we decide on either switching the backend or not
<seb128> didrocks, oh also I get "compiz not responding" when closing the session
<seb128> you might want to activate the session option?
<chrisccoulson> shouldn't it have a GSettings backend? :)
<didrocks> seb128: session management plugin?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> where is the backend selection option?
<didrocks> seb128: I'll have a try and see if it fixes it
<didrocks> seb128: in the general options you were talking about lately
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: depends, because the backend looks the GNOME keys from the same backend
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: so, if g-s-d still store its values in gconf and we activate the gsettings backend -> fail :)
<seb128> the first pixel doesn't react to click, known issue?
<didrocks> known issue
<didrocks> seb128: if you want to workaround it, desactivate the active edge in the wall plugin
<seb128> that one will annoy me as well I think
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> it's hard to live with it for long, I agree :)
<seb128> didrocks, what option is that?
<didrocks> seb128: so, in the wall plugin -> Bindings -> Edge flipping -> desactive for all Flip Right/Up/Down/Left
<seb128> didrocks, ok, gotcha, thanks
<didrocks> yw :)
<seb128> didrocks, do you have bugs open to track those issues?
<seb128> just to make sure they don't fall off the list
<didrocks> seb128: yes, and it's even fix in trunk for the compiz main plugin (for the edge issue), but last time I tried a make dist, it wasn't stable enough
<didrocks> and as sam is reorganizing the tree, I prefer him to finish that as cherry-pick wasn't really possible (needs new code in other plugins too)
<didrocks> already lost 2 hours on that, was enough :)
<didrocks> does someone know why gsettings had both notion of path and id? seems to be redundantly the same notion to me, so I must miss something
<seb128> didrocks, ok, using gconf doesn't fix the keybinding issues
<didrocks> seb128: hum? smspillaz was pretty sure that without the gconf backend, it won't work. Not sure if something else is broken then. I'll have a look
<fta> cyphermox, pong
<fta> cyphermox, oh, i see. rm -rf /data/bot/upstream/network-manager.git  <= done
<fta> cyphermox, next respin in 15h. if you need one faster, let me know
<seb128> ok, session handling doesn't work
<seb128> enough playing with compiz, let's get back to work
<cyphermox> fta, thanks, it's good enough
<didrocks> seiflotfy: ok, that for the info (on session handling), will check as well
<cyphermox> didrocks, I may have just found out (finally) what's wrong in the migration code, checking it out now :)
<didrocks> cyphermox: oh nice, what was it?
<cyphermox> looks to me like at least views is being iterated over to get emptied (and it is empty in all cases) but using a different method than other things which doesn't remove the source directory in the end :)
<cyphermox> didrocks, there will still be figuring out what happens to .evolution/*/local though, and everything about cache is unsure.
<cyphermox> didrocks, I think I have added enough debug g_print's and stuff to see it properly though
<didrocks> cyphermox: ok, nice :)
<cyphermox> I'm just hoping that dropping my old backup in place will be enough to test migration, I'd like to avoid setting up new accounts over and over :)
<didrocks> cyphermox: well, I have another setup, but also not clean at all as I have half a migration :)
<cyphermox> didrocks, right, well, in reality, I think the migration has always worked, there's just leftovers
<cyphermox> didrocks, I don't think cache, for example, matters much. stuff will just get re-cached..
<cyphermox> didrocks, any chance you could find .evolution -print and send me the output, so I can compare with the two other runs I did?
<didrocks> cyphermox: right, but we still need to know if removing the cache live can't damage evolution process :)
<didrocks> .evolution -print ?
<cyphermox> find .evolution -print
<didrocks> cyphermox: http://paste.ubuntu.com/533061/
<didrocks> cyphermox: should be empty at the end IIRC
<cyphermox> didrocks, right
<cyphermox> but look, no cache for you ;)
<didrocks> yep
<cyphermox> anyway, thanks, I'm looking. I think at least in your case it's really views that isn't getting removed when it should, but there are other issues because I have more files around in both the attempts I did at home
<didrocks> ok :)
<seb128> didrocks, so the g-s-d issue was a gcc one?
<seb128> mterry, did you try to figure why lpi failed to build?
<didrocks> seb128: right, no --as-needed related or DSO linking though
<mterry> seb128, no, didn't get to it.  Let me check now
<didrocks> seb128: doko will look at it, I pastebin him the example and the command line, should be short enough
<seb128> didrocks, weird, did it fail locally for you?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, it failed locally too
<didrocks> not for you?
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I'm still on gcc-4.4 ;-)
<seb128> I will update gcc now
<didrocks> ok, it seems you cherry-pick natty upgrade? :-)
<seb128> well I added natty to my sources.list and I do apt-get install "things I need"
<seb128> or want
<seb128> I usually take the desktop stack but let other things
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<didrocks> waow, you get a mixed host :)
<seb128> didrocks, well I like a stable system
<didrocks> natty isn't so ackward to me (until now)
<seb128> like I should have stayed away from the new compiz, having the bugs don't bring me a lot since I don't work on it
<didrocks> well, I should reboot, but let's see tomorrow morning :)
<didrocks> apart from the session management and the keybinding, you don't have any other bug, isn't it?
<seb128> no, but that's enough to slow me in my work ;-)
<didrocks> I never used Ctrl + Alt + num, but maybe that's because my layout is 3x2 and not 4x2 (it's easy to get with arrows from the first to the last ws)
<seb128> my layout is 3x2 for some time
<seb128> but like my email client and IRC are not on workspaces next to each others
<seb128> so I'm used to hit the "go to workspace <n>" for IRC and email
<seb128> having to deal with down, left, right is not as efficient
<asac> first steps in unity for stupid asac ... i start firefox and cannot say "keep in launcher" ;) ... is that a feature?
<seb128> asac, unity on maverick or natty?
<seb128> mvo, sorry I forgot to reply to your comment about update-manager earlier
<seb128> mvo, while typing in the packages list weird things happen
<jcastro> didrocks: Is that all we have so far? https://bugzilla.gnome.org/buglist.cgi?query=product:banshee%20whiteboard:ubuntu
<seb128> like I start typing "libgtk" and it goes "lbigkt" or whatever, the cursor jump back to the previous position while it's thinking
<seb128> jcastro, we would need somebody with time to work on that to have extra issues
<didrocks> jcastro: yep, this is just the list of bugs needed to be fixed upstream (apart from other bugs "don't work", but we need a hugday for that)
<asac> seb128: maverick
<seb128> jcastro, I don't think we communicated to anybody that we need testing or feedback on those
<jcastro> seb128: upstream is willing to work on bugs for us that we tag as important for the switch
<jcastro> that list just seems "low"
<asac> seb128: does it use "StartupWMClass=Namoroka
<asac> "
<asac> to figure out which desktop file it is and if that doesnt match somehow, it doesnt offer keep launcher?
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<mvo> seb128: oh, I vaguely remember about out-of-order chars, but I can't quite remember what the cause was :/
<asac> where is chris? lagger ;)
<seb128> jcastro, well as said nobody had time to build a list yet
<mvo> seb128: but its something more generic
<seb128> jcastro, didrocks has sort of been busy getting the new compiz and unity going
<asac> chrisccoulson: ^^
<seb128> jcastro, and we didn't do any call for feedback
<jcastro> seb128: ok, what can I do to help?
<asac> chrisccoulson: unity does not offer to keep namoroka in launcher
<asac> is that WMClass problem?
<didrocks> jcastro: I really don't have the time to work on that seriously, we need maybe the QA team to get a list of important bugs. I got the "functions" we need
<jcastro> seb128: btw Laney and co got the deps split and under control, the diskspace issue isn't going to be as bad as we thought
<chrisccoulson> asac - probably. i've fixed all the WMClass issues in the 4.0 builds
<chrisccoulson> it was broken before in 3.6
<asac> chrisccoulson: whats the right WMClass i should put there?
<seb128> jcastro, not sure, what about doing a call for feedback from users on the forums on ask ubuntu
<jcastro> didrocks: ok I will work on that!
 * asac just wants it in launcher ;)
<seb128> jcastro, I've seen, great
<chrisccoulson> asac - is this 3.6 dailies?
<asac> chrisccoulson: ack
<didrocks> jcastro: nice, but you should set a hug day first, a ot of bugs are quite old to be useful
<asac> chrisccoulson: StartupWMClass=Namoroka
<asac> thats what i have
<seb128> jcastro, then we could go through the discussion and file bugs for things which are appropriate
<jcastro> seb128: well, I don't want a call for pet bugs, this is for bugs we really need.
<jcastro> ok sounds good to me, I'll talk to pedro
<chrisccoulson> asac - it's usually just the branding name, but if that doesn work, you can try running xprop on the browser window
<asac> chrisccoulson: hmm ... WM_CLASS(STRING) = "Navigator", "Namoroka"
<seb128> jcastro, well, I would do a call for them to dump what they think match on the forum discussion and then we can filter out
<asac> chrisccoulson: thats what i get with xprop
<asac> look right:((
<seb128> jcastro, I don't want them to open the bugs
<jcastro> ok
<chrisccoulson> asac - and the desktop file has StartupWMClass=Namoroka?
<seb128> jcastro, it would just be easier for us to review that discussion
<asac> chrisccoulson: ack
<asac> didrocks: any idea what unity checks to offer "keep in launcher" ?
<jcastro> I don't think a forum discussion would help
<chrisccoulson> that's weird, that should work. it must be doing some other magic ;)
<jcastro> it'll just turn into mono flamewar
<jcastro> desktop mailing list perhaps?
<mterry> seb128, figured it out.  I put the install-gtk3-version logic inside a block in debian/rules that only got run for an 'all' package, when it should be for an 'any' package.  fixing now
<didrocks> asac: no, I know there is a bug where it doesn't offer that (it's not implemented yet on the compiz rewrite), so as the code was different, I didn't check that. But it's obviously a bug
<asac> didrocks: its maverick
<chrisccoulson> asac - did you have a chance to look at the ubufox merge? :)
<chrisccoulson> (whilst you're here) ;)
<asac> chrisccoulson: yes ... half way through
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<asac> currently at meegoconf
<asac> tomorrow i will finish it i hope
<seb128> mterry, oh, great, thanks
<didrocks> asac: yeah, it's a bug that's on the list of things to fix as a SRU
<asac> didrocks: is it because we have more than one WMCLASS here:
<asac> didrocks: WM_CLASS(STRING) = "Navigator", "Namoroka"
<asac> thats what i get for that window
<asac> maybe its not checking the second string?
<didrocks> hum, ok, so bamf doesn't get the right matching
<didrocks> should be that
 * asac changes to .desktop to use Navigator
 * asac tries
 * asac thinks he has to killall mutter to trigger rereading desktop :((
<didrocks> asac: bamf-daemon
<didrocks> asac: kill that one
<asac> shit ... mutter doesnt restart :((
<asac> ok lets see
<rodrigo_> jcastro, the nautilus elementary people forked?
<asac> sigh ... didnt help didrocks ... anyway. thanks!
<seb128> rodrigo_, they sort of stopped working on it, why?
<asac> how can i add the launcher manually? only gconf hackery?
<didrocks> asac: file a bug, (and think about the .desktop file cache, if triggered or not?)
<didrocks> asac: yeah, gconf under /desktop/unity
<rodrigo_> seb128, ah, just saw a comment about it from jcastro on the blueprint
<rodrigo_> seb128, so, no more nautilus elementary?
<jcastro> rodrigo_: yeah it's called marlin now or something
<rodrigo_> ugh
<seb128> rodrigo_, what do you want to know exactly?
<rodrigo_> seb128, if they really forked
<seb128> ok, I don't know
<rodrigo_> at UDS we talked about them addressing the upstream concerns in their patches
<rodrigo_> but seems they preferred forking
<seb128> some of them replied to jcastro's email that nobody is actively working on it
<jcastro> https://launchpad.net/marlin
<rodrigo_> oh, so they forked to stop working on it? jcastro??
* You're now known as ubuntulog
<jcastro> they stopped working on -elementary
<jcastro> and now have this thing called marlin
<jcastro> which they say isn't ready so they haven't made any releases
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, i think they forked it because some of the changes they wanted to make were painful because the binary was named nautilus
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, i don't know if they want to remain forked... but they needed to not conflict with nautilus, afaik
<pitti> hm, meeting time, isn't it?
<kenvandine> yup
<pitti> no Jason apparently
<seb128> yes, meeting time
<pitti> I'm still catching up with tech board meeting, the designated chair didn't appear either
<seb128> pitti, do you want me to start the meeting there?
<pitti> seb128: need 3 more mins
<seb128> pitti, ok, as you want
<pitti> ok
<seb128> I can already ping people
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, painful because of the binary name??
<pitti> so, let's start
<pitti> bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, tkamppeter: meeting time?
<seb128> rodrigo_, they got comments because they should work with nautilus upstream rather do what they want I guess and they had enough of those, they really want to do a different application
<tkamppeter> hi
 * kenvandine waves
<didrocks> hey o/
<mterry> hihi
<Riddell> hi
<seb128> hey
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes
<tremolux> heyo
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-11-16
<chrisccoulson> hi!
<pitti> [TOPIC] Outstanding actions from last meeting
<pitti> jasoncwarner - follow up with tkamppeter about paper size bp
<pitti> didn't see activity on the BP, so let's carry over
<pitti> doko/Riddell - investigate ARM issue with kubuntu
<Riddell>  * Qt still broken on ARM, new problem found with gcc, will upload with assembly fix later today but won't work until gcc gets fixed, bug 675347
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 675347 in gcc-4.5 (Ubuntu Natty) (and 2 other projects) "volatile int causes inline assembly build failure (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/675347
<pitti> Riddell: I guess at that point we can track it in the bug report? or do you want to keep the action as a reminder?
<Riddell> bug report is fine
<pitti> ok
<pitti> didrocks - update wiki template w/ updated agenda and rodrigo
<didrocks> done  :)
<pitti> apparenlty done
<pitti> pitti - prepare initial release page
<pitti> carried over, will prepare for this Friday's release meeting
<pitti> jasoncwarner - follow up meeting w/ TheMuso
<pitti> unknown at this point
<pitti> [TOPIC] Partner Update
<pitti> kenvandine: floor is your's
<kenvandine> Ubuntu One
<kenvandine> Work item planning is taking shape, they resolved team assignment problems they had last cycle. We should be able to effectly view their status throughout the cycle. They will get all the work items in by the end of this week.
<kenvandine> DX
<kenvandine> QA has finished an initial API for automated testing
<kenvandine> and unity landing in natty this week, but i guess didrocks will cover that
<pitti> mago tests for unity?
<kenvandine> i don't think so
<kenvandine> yet
<kenvandine> this is an API for driving tests via dbus
<kenvandine> i think
<pitti> ah, so not using a11y
<kenvandine> don't know the details, lamalex did it :)
<kenvandine> not yet... a11y work is just getting started
<kenvandine> that's all i have
<pitti> kenvandine: thanks
<lamalex> pitti, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/QA/StateIntrospection
<lamalex> that's what we're doing for unity debugging on mago right now
<pitti> lamalex: ah, interesting
<pitti> [TOPIC] Kubuntu update
<pitti> Riddell: anythign worth mentioning this week?
<Riddell>  * Qt 4.7.1 and QtWebKit 2.1 in progress
<Riddell>  * Probable switch to gstreamer in the near future
<Riddell>  * Qt still broken on ARM, new problem found with gcc, will upload with assembly fix later today but won't work until gcc gets fixed, bug 675347
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 675347 in gcc-4.5 (Ubuntu Natty) (and 2 other projects) "volatile int causes inline assembly build failure (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/675347
<Riddell>  * tech board approved updates can go into -updates with sufficient testing and procedure
<Riddell> pitti: I uploaded kdebindings to fix the python-kde issue you came across
<pitti> Riddell: yay you
<pitti> wow, gstreamer in KDE?
<pitti> perhaps one day we'll just have one set of codec packages then :)
<Riddell> that's the hope
* You're now known as ubuntulog_
<pitti> seems bryceh is not online, and RAOF is tight asleep, so let's skip the X update
* You're now known as ubuntulog
<pitti> [TOPIC] Unity update
<didrocks>  * After a semi-marathon with the dx team, unity is now out in the unity ppa (https://launchpad.net/~unity/+archive/ppa) !
<didrocks>  So, if you want to try it (it's really a pre-alpha), make sure to read this: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/InstallationGuide
<didrocks>  * There are some known bugs on i386 which will be fixed this week release. We will upload it to natty on next release (Thursday probably) and kill ubuntu-netbook on arch !armel at the same time.
<didrocks>  * Some remaining bugs on compiz too, we'll dive in this week as well and talk about migration.
<didrocks> that's look good, prepare one NEWing :) nux
<mvo> didrocks: does it support alt-f2?
<didrocks> mvo: if gnome-panel is launched, yes, but a dedicated app will come (not for A1 in any case)
<pitti> so, thanks didrocks; looking forward to next Thursday :)
<rodrigo_> why would gnome-panel be launched when running unity?
<pitti> (and when do we get our compiz keybindings back..)
<didrocks> pitti: well, tricky question
<pitti> didrocks: so the configuration migration from 0.8 is still an unsolved problem, I guess?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: as it's not the default right now, it doesn't replace gnome-panel
<rodrigo_> didrocks, ah
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, it's an upstream issue, we will talk about that eow with upstream
<didrocks> pitti: about the keybindingsâ¦
<didrocks> the thing it that if we want GNOME keybindings, we have to use gconf backend (as keys are in gconf)
<didrocks> which means storing plugins settings in gconf too
<pitti> didrocks: it could be an one-time migration, too?
<didrocks> upstream wants either init or gsettings backend to be used for performance
<pitti> anyway, if that's to be discussed, that's fine
<didrocks> pitti: g-s-d will still store in gconf
<didrocks> if we don't pick the new version
<rodrigo_> didrocks, 2.91.x will store in gsettings as soon as lists are supported in gsettings
<didrocks> (that's why the normal of viewport isn't picked as well)
<rodrigo_> ah, sorry, you're talking about 2.32
<didrocks> rodrigo_: right, but we are not sure to use it AFAIK
<pitti> [TOPIC] USC update
<tremolux> hey
<tremolux>  * Ratings and Reviews:  ISD has officially kicked off server-side development this week
<tremolux>  * Work items defined for Ratings and Reviews, Donations for Free Software blueprints
<tremolux>  * Started work on tracking Software Center performance metrics through automatic testing throughout the cycle
<tremolux>  * Targeted UI code refactoring
<pitti> tremolux: you can automatically exercise clicking buttons in s-c? using atk/mago?
 * pitti is pleased to see automatic tests appear in our projects now
<tremolux> pitti: this is mainly for performance at the start (startup in particular)
<tremolux> not sure we are doing mago yet?  mvo?
<pitti> ah, I see
<tremolux> pitti: but we do have a set of automatic tests we do at build time, since maverick
<pitti> ok, thanks tremolux
<pitti> [TOPIC] work items & release status
<tremolux> pitti: welcome  :)
<mvo> pitti: not mago, but automatic
<pitti> I don't have a release status page yet, still a bit early; I'll do one for Friday, though, when we'll have our first release meeting
<pitti> wrt. natty specs we seem to be in great shape
<pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~platform/workitems/natty/canonical-desktop-team.html looks good so far :)
<pitti> does anyone have a spec which should be targetted for natty, but doesn't appear there?
<pitti> ok, seems not
<pitti> [TOPIC] AOB
<pitti> anythign else?
<seb128> not from me
<pitti> so, thanks everyone!
<seb128> thanks pitti
<tremolux> thanks everybody
<didrocks> thanks
<kenvandine> hey jasoncwarner
<rodrigo_> thanks :)
<seb128> hey jasoncwarner
<seb128> jasoncwarner, just on time to avoid the meeting it seems ;-)
<pitti> hello jasoncwarner, how's .au?
<jasoncwarner> hey guys...
<kenvandine> i think that 3g lag is tough :)
<didrocks> hey jasoncwarner :)
 * kenvandine ducks
<jasoncwarner> seriously ;)
<kenvandine> move go ok?
<jasoncwarner> I guess I am victim of google calendar again...so meeting was an hour ago?
<seb128> jasoncwarner, 30 minutes ago
<kenvandine> 30m ago
<seb128> jasoncwarner, we did wrap up a minute before you joined
<seb128> jasoncwarner, you should go back to bed ;-)
<tremolux> jasoncwarner: seen lots of dingoes?
<jasoncwarner> seb128: thanks :) wonder why my calendar says otherwise. GAH.
<jasoncwarner> tremolux: not yet, but I did eat Kangaroo last night. Interesting.
<rodrigo_> seb128, there are a couple of new packages in the PPA that don't have a LP project, so can't push to ~ubuntu-desktop branches, so should I create those projects in LP?
<tremolux> jasoncwarner: woah
<rodrigo_> hey jasoncwarner
<jasoncwarner> rodrigo_: morning!
<seb128> rodrigo_, ideally yes
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, it's librest and libgnome-media-profiles
<seb128> rodrigo_, that will be useful to open upstream bug tasks as well
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, creating them then
<rodrigo_> seb128, I do it via https://launchpad.net/projects/+new right?
<seb128> rodrigo_, yes
<micahg> rodrigo_: did you get my comments on the librest upgrade?
<rodrigo_> micahg, hmm, I think not
<rodrigo_> micahg, ah, on the bug?
<micahg> rodrigo_: yes
<rodrigo_> micahg, yes, working on fixing the issues
<bryceh> heya jasoncwarner
<rodrigo_> micahg, I'll push the branch to an ~ubuntu-desktop branch and will fix all of them there
<micahg> rodrigo_: ok, that sounds fine
<jasoncwarner>  bryceh: good morning
<pitti> seb128: FYI, I'm off today, there's a holiday in my part of Germany
<seb128> pitti, tomorrow you mean?
<pitti> erm, yes
<seb128> pitti, ok, noted
<seb128> do you need me to cover for anything while you are not there?
 * pitti -> dinner
<pitti> seb128: no, just in case someone asks
<seb128> ok
<seb128> pitti, have fun!
<pitti> cheers, you too!
<seb128> "desktop team meeting in 10 minutes"
<seb128> calendar reminder just being displayed...
<pitti> heh, ehre to
<pitti> here, too
<kenvandine> yeah... google doesn't handle UTC
<bryceh> heh
<bryceh> pitti, I'll be attending the eastern edition meetings with raof going forward
<seb128> mterry, did you tell me had you a fix for lpi and I missed the diff or did you say you were working on it?
<seb128> kklimonda, hey
<mterry> seb128, working on it, then I hit lunch  :)
<seb128> mterry, ok, fair enough, I saw that you didn't screw the meeting time this week ;-)
<mterry> :)
<kklimonda> seb128: hola
<seb128> kklimonda, how are you?
<kklimonda> seb128: great, and you?
<seb128> kklimonda, I'm fine thanks
<seb128> kklimonda, I saw you got atkmm1.6 in the debian pkg-gnome svn
<seb128> kklimonda, did somebody review or sponsor it now?
<seb128> now->yet
<kklimonda> seb128: not yet
<seb128> kklimonda, do you plan to update the other part of the gtkmm stack? would you be interested to work on glom as well?
<kklimonda> seb128: yes, I'm planning on updating whole gtkmm stack - as for glom I can't say I care about it much but I can work on it once I'm done with other updates.
<kklimonda> seb128: would you like me to just update it or work on getting it into debian ?
<seb128> kklimonda, it's your call, I don't think the debian guys would say no to have somebody helping updating those in debian as well...
<jcastro> kklimonda: upstream glom's been frustrated with the lack of love it's getting in ubuntu, even a little help would go a long way
<kklimonda> jcastro: ok, I'll do what I can - I guess the least we can do is to update it and keep it this way.
<seb128> right
<kklimonda> jcastro: should we update to 1.19.x (which is unstable) or to 1.18.x? I can see that the last release we have is from the unstable branch.
<seb128> kklimonda, thanks
<seb128> starting to go to 1.18 would be a nice start
<seb128> the issue they have is that we ship an unstable serie which is buggy and over a year old
<kklimonda> bah, their NEWS file is broken
<kklimonda> it's 1.16.1 and 1.19.1
<kklimonda> so we'll go with 1.16.1, which is stable, for now
<kklimonda> jcastro: we'll have to update gtkmm to 2.22.0 to get glom updated but I've added it to my todo list.
<seb128> kklimonda, let me know if you need review or sponsoring
<seb128> kklimonda, I can probably review atkmm to start I guess ;-)
<kklimonda> seb128: yes, that would be great :)
<jcastro> rodrigo_: ready for another one? http://code.google.com/p/yad/
<dobey> so i just upgraded to narwhal a bit ago
<dobey> and i see that links i click on are being opened in chromium now, instead of firefox (which is set as the default)
<seb128> dobey, GNOME changed the way handlers work
<seb128> we need to update the desktop files to claim new mimetypes
<seb128> they stopped using the gconf handlers
<dobey> oh, so it actually checks the file type at the other end of the link and opens stuff in appropriate applications now?
<chrisccoulson> dobey, no, it handles protocols with a x-scheme-handler mime-type now. so, if you click on a http: URI, it will open in an app that handles x-scheme-handler/http
<chrisccoulson> at least, that's my understanding of it
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, i noticed that... clicking on a link to a jpeg opens the image viewer :)
 * kenvandine rather likes that behavior
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well, what does it do when there is no handler set?
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: does it mean we can now, instead of using gconf, add x-scheme-handler/scheme to .desktop files for applications?
<seb128> dobey, I think it does check the file content because there is no handler
 * kenvandine just read  back... links open in chromium from firefox?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - not sure. i think it would fall back to the same mechanism that's used when a handler for a particular content type isn't found
<kenvandine> that isn't optimal :)
<chrisccoulson> ie, for me, it opens http links in gedit ;)
<kenvandine> i was also happy to see it open json in gedit
<seb128> kenvandine, no, I think it's when clicking on url from a desktop application
<seb128> xchat for example
<dobey> seb128: well chromium has the x-scheme-handler types listed
<kenvandine> hummm
<kenvandine> i guess i have noticed it mostly from in gwibber
<kenvandine> so yeah
<dobey> seb128: but i added them to firefox.desktop in ~/.local/share/applications and chromium still opens :(
<seb128> the browsers don't rely on the GNOME handler to open urls from webpages ;-)
<kenvandine> too bad... it would be nice :)
 * kenvandine hates browsers :-D
<seb128> dobey, weird, maybe check on #gnome-hackers
<dobey> ah, needed to update-desktop-database on .local/share/applications
<dobey> and now firefox opens
<dobey> but i suppose it's by luck that it's doing so
<dobey> kenvandine: yay! spread the hate :)
<kenvandine> :)
<chrisccoulson> dobey - we will set firefox as the default in desktop-file-utils
<chrisccoulson> there's also currently no graphical way to change your default browser
<chrisccoulson> g-c-c, firefox and chromium all update the old gconf entries :/
<dobey> gotta love upstream coordination
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> i've sent some patches upstream for firefox, but i need to work through their review comments
<chrisccoulson> but g-c-c needs fixing too
<seb128> rodrigo_, ^
<seb128> do you know what the new g-c-c do for the preferred application selection?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - it uses the x-scheme-handler mechanism and gio now
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-control-center/tree/panels/default-applications/gnome-da-capplet.c#n90
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, so basically if we go for the new g-c-c we have nothing to do
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, that would work. we'd still need to fix other things that are using the old mechanism (thunderbird, firefox, chromium, and i guess, evolution too)
<chrisccoulson> evo has a default mail client check doesn't it?
<kklimonda> yes
<chrisccoulson> so, that would need fixing too
<didrocks> goo night everyone
<chrisccoulson> oh, http links *do* open in a new tab here
<chrisccoulson> that's ok then
<dobey> chrisccoulson: well i would hope that upstream is fixing the evolution one
<dobey> chrisccoulson: and probably epiphany too
<chrisccoulson> dobey, yeah, they might already be fixed
<chrisccoulson> i didn't check
<rickspencer3> seb128, is there a blueprint for the 2d experience?
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> if only there was an engineering manager now :)
<rickspencer3> jasoncwarner, ^ ?
<jasoncwarner> rickspencer3: here
<rickspencer3> jasoncwarner, is there a blueprint for the 2d experience?
<jasoncwarner> I don't believe explicitly. I think it is part of the bigger unity one. Let me check
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: ping :)
<jasoncwarner> looks like there is. https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/other-dx-n-2d-experience-fallback (under other, not desktop)
<kenvandine> wow... gwibber was throttled by facebook only 76 minutes today... down from 968 minutes last tuesday
<bcurtiswx> and it's yes to make it to everyone :) gj Ken!
<bcurtiswx> yet*
<kenvandine> yeah... i can't believe that enough people have already gotten the fix in -proposed to make this big of an impact
<el_wholer> what happened?
<kenvandine> el_wholer, long story... :)
<bcurtiswx> i did blog/tweet about it ;) its _obviously_ because of that :P
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, haha :)
<kklimonda> kenvandine: so what has been the problem? you were misusing some APIs?
<bcurtiswx> i think it boils down to bad documentation..
<kenvandine> well, kind of
<bcurtiswx> on facebooks part
<kenvandine> yeah
<el_wholer> ok no problem ;)
<kenvandine> they give an application an allocation for "API Requests"
<kenvandine> but one call to their "fql.query" rest API
<kenvandine> would result in thousands of DB queries on their infrastructure
<kenvandine> they count DB queries as API requests
<kklimonda> huh
<kenvandine> which of course isn't documented anywhere
<kenvandine> and makes no sense at all
<kenvandine> how would anyone be able to calculate how many DB queries happen behind their web service :)
<kklimonda> true
<kenvandine> 1 of gwibber's calls to facebook was causing 266 million DB queries per day
<kenvandine> and... because of another bug i fixed right before UDS... that query was completely useless for gwibber anyway :)
<kenvandine> so i just had to backport that fix to lucid and maverick and drop the API call
<el_wholer> c'mon let's tell everyone to use gwibber ;)
<kenvandine> kklimonda, the DB query count thing was something i have specifically asked about, over and over since july and they ignored me
<kenvandine> more users is fine... the allocation grows (in theory) based on number of users
<bcurtiswx> then he had the entire country's worth of people in bangladesh come and "like" that bug report basically
<kenvandine> hehe :)
<kenvandine> those votes is what got us acknowledged!
<bcurtiswx> exactly
<mterry> seb128, fixed ftbfs and snuck in another change: https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/launchpad-integration/ftbfs-and-override/+merge/41002  (I can prepare just a pristine ftbfs fix if you'd prefer)
<kenvandine> mterry, is launchpad-integration in good shape for me to use to model the dbusmenu and libindicator changes on?
<kenvandine> i am about to start that now
<mterry> kenvandine, in that branch I linked to, I believe so, yes.  It basically builds a gtk3 version in a subdirectory and installs it into debian/tmp too
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> mterry, thx
<mterry> pitti, I've got a version of gtksourceview3 that uses a symbol file.  It's still in NEW.  Shall I wait until approval and update in universe or is it better to have it rejected and re-NEW?
<seb128> mterry, what do you mean?
<vish> mterry: hi, when can we expect the next version of gtk to land in natty? specifically the resize grip patch which has been backported to gtk2 as well?
<mterry> seb128, I took your suggestion and made a version of gtksourceview3 that used a .symbols file
<seb128> mterry, what do you mean "It's still in NEW."
<seb128> mterry, you can queue a -0ubuntu2 in new if that's what you mean
 * mterry thought it hadn't gone through yet, will check
<mterry> seb128, oh really?  didn't know NEW handled that so gracefully
<seb128> mterry, you mean "the previous upload is still in new and I've an update which uses a .symbols"
<seb128> mterry, you can upload the same version twice in NEW as well
<mterry> seb128, correct
<seb128> so your choice
<mterry> seb128, ! that's neat
<seb128> I can reject the current -0ubuntu1 if you want
<seb128> Riddell, will you do NEW review today?
<mterry> seb128, -0ubuntu2 uploaded
<seb128> mterry, great
<seb128> vish, there current gtk2 is basically what is in git
<seb128> vish, there is no grip backport pending upload
<seb128> vish, the patch is in gtk3 in natty though
<vish> seb128: but we aernt going to be updating many apps using gtk3 in natty, right?
<seb128> dunno yet how many but not a lot no
<vish> seb128: there is a workitem to get the grip in natty using the gtk2 backport : https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-dx-n-resizing-windows
<vish> maybe we need to milestone that ?
<seb128> the work item is assigned to bratsche so better to ask him about it
<vish> seb128: bratsche said to ask you folks.. :)
<seb128> bratsche, ?
<seb128> vish, it's the first time somebody ask us about that
<seb128> I only know about it being in gtk3 because I read some IRC comments
<seb128> kenvandine, ^ did bratsche or somebody from dx talked to you about this one?
<vish> seb128: yea, iirc, no one from the desktop team was in that session, most dx folk alone there..
<bratsche> The thing I wanted to find out from seb128 is about how many apps in Natty will be based on gtk3 vs gtk2.
<seb128> seems a communication issue
<seb128> bratsche, we don't know yet, we will get updates over time as we feel they are ready
<seb128> bratsche, but let's say it will be probably less than 15 using gtk3
<bratsche> Okay.
<kenvandine> seb128, i hadn't heard :)
<seb128> kenvandine, k
<seb128> bratsche, in any case is the number of gtk3 softwares changing something?
<vish> bratsche: so i guess we need a backport to gtk2 for sure if we want more apps to have the grip, and that would make it easier to backport to maverick?  you want me to file a bug for that?
<seb128> bratsche, we will still have gtk2 softwares around so it should be available for those?
<bratsche> seb128: I was trying to gauge how important it is to backport this feature to gtk2.  I think it creates a maintenance burden for things like Chromium which makes frequent releases.
<seb128> why?
<seb128> does it change gtk2 behaviour?
<seb128> or does it just add an extra api that applications are free to use?
<bratsche> Well, Chromium and Firefox are the only apps I can think of off hand which are likely affected because this grip window will be in the way of their scrollbars.  gtk's scrollbars are smart enough to avoid the grip, but Chromium's are not yet.
<seb128> hum ok
<bratsche> So in my PPA I patched Chromium, but there seem to be pretty frequent updates to Chromium and they replace what's in my PPA.
<seb128> did you talk to chrisccoulson and fta about the impact of this?
<bratsche> But maybe in a real release this wouldn't be an issue the way it is in a PPA, because we can just get the Chromium patch into the package.
<seb128> well, we can get patches in ppa builds as well
<bratsche> And evmar is aware of the feature and will deal with it in Chromium upstream, but not until they actually begin linking to gtk3.
<bratsche> Yeah, I have the patch in my ppa build.. but my ppa doesn't auto-update and apply the patch against a new version of Chromium when it gets obsoleted.  Is that possible?
<micahg> bratsche: chrisccoulson has started work on getting Firefox working with GTK3
<chrisccoulson> not yet i've not ;)
<micahg> chrisccoulson: oh, hmm
<chrisccoulson> i've got it working with other gnome 3 technologies
<micahg> just gsettings then?
<chrisccoulson> but not gtk3 yet ;)
<seb128> bratsche, not sure how you do your updates, but usually it's up to maintainer to update the patch when it fails to apply
<micahg> ok
<bratsche> seb128: Okay, nevermind then.  Maybe this is a non-issue.
<seb128> bratsche, but I would think the code you patch doesn't change every day so most of the time the patch should work
<bratsche> Yeah
<chrisccoulson> bratsche, are you going to break firefox then? ;)
<seb128> be careful, breaking firefox is chrisccoulson's job, don't steal it ;-)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> well, breaking it is everyone elses job. it's my job to fix it afterwards ;)
<bratsche> chrisccoulson: If I backport this patch to gtk2 then we'll probably need to apply a 1-line patch to Firefox.
<chrisccoulson> bratsche, what will the patch do?
<bratsche> chrisccoulson: Or if you get Firefox running on gtk3 then you'll probably need to do the same thing.
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure i'll manage that tbh ;)
<chrisccoulson> but i'll give it a go if nobody else does it
<bratsche> chrisccoulson: http://blogs.fedoraproject.org/wp/mclasen/2010/10/09/getting-a-grip/
<bratsche> chrisccoulson: That resize grip is on GtkWindow, it just needs to be disabled.  That's it.
<chrisccoulson> bratsche, wouldn't it be better to be able to use ther resize grip?
<bratsche> Firefox's or gtk's?
<chrisccoulson> bratsche, ff-4.0 doesn't have a resize grip (the status-bar is gone)
<bratsche> chrisccoulson: Then this is probably going to be more of a problem.
<chrisccoulson> heh, that's not good
<bratsche> Is Firefox's scrollbar part of gtk or is it a xul widget?
<chrisccoulson> bratsche, it's a xul widget
<bratsche> Okay, that's going to be the issue.  gtk's scrollbars are smart enough to get out of the way of the resize grip, but Firefox's won't be.  So the easiest thing to do will be to disable the resize grip on Firefox.
<dobey> it's not xul exactly
<bratsche> If it's a gtk scrollbar, maybe this will all just work.
<dobey> but it's not gtk+ either
<bratsche> Okay.. for the purposes of this discussion, anything that's not a gtk scrollbar is the same. :)
<dobey> bratsche: it just uses gtk+ off screen widgetry to paint the scrollbar
<bratsche> Right.
<dobey> bratsche: but webkit-gtk uses the exact same code (it's copied over from gecko)
<bratsche> chrisccoulson: If you want to do something really badass for Firefox 4, look at modify_allocation_for_window_grip() in gtkrange.c and try to do the same thing for Firefox's scrollbars. :)
<dobey> hrmm
<dobey> although the scrollbar widgets might be subclasses of GtkScrollable or something now
<dobey> so it might Just Work
<bratsche> That would be even better, of course. :)
<dobey> oh actually, webkit-gtk might not be an issue, because i think the embedded widget you use is actually a GtkScrolledWindow, or you get a widget that's supposed to go into one
<dobey> but that's testable with epiphany. chrome of course does something weird
<bratsche> Yeah, but I talked to evmar about it at some point.  I think he's planning to deal with it similarly in Chromium.
<devildante> is there a mailing list specially for ubiquity? or is ubuntu-devel-discuss the place to discuss it?
<TheMuso> devildante: There is ubuntu-installer.
<devildante> TheMuso: thanks :)
<TheMuso> Both mailing list, and IRC channel.
<devildante> thanks again :)
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner, hey, welcome to Australia!
 * bryceh waves
<kklimonda> is any git master on board? :)
<devildante> kklimonda: I certainly am not a master, but I know *some* basics
<devildante> decoder: I'm a n00b :p
<Amaranth> Dang, I'm never around to discuss compiz
<Amaranth> I knew the answer to everything they were talking about too :P
<jasoncwarner> robert_ancell: thanks!
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner: I am quite surprised you are sticking to PST atm. That would be difficult.
<kklimonda> devildante: fortunately I have managed to work it out myself but for the future reference - can I merge branches while omiting some commits?
<jasoncwarner> TheMuso: for now, until I can figure out what works for everyone around the world :)
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner: Understood.
<devildante> kklimonda: I think so
<devildante> kklimonda: but I never tried
<robert_ancell> rodrigo_, are you there?
<rodrigo_> hi rob
<rodrigo_> hi robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> rodrigo_, oh hey,  you shouldn't be here :P  I was wondering if you'd done anything on the new webkit - I was working on it yesterday to get the new yelp to work
<rodrigo_> robert_ancell, no, nothing on that
<robert_ancell> rodrigo_, how's things going? I've been trying to improve the versions page so we can see what's available better
<rodrigo_> robert_ancell, oh, where's the versions page?
<robert_ancell> rodrigo_, http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html
<rodrigo_> robert_ancell, the stuff we have packaged seems to work ok, except for some g-c-c issues which are being solved upstream
<rodrigo_> robert_ancell, ok
<robert_ancell> I want to put a switch at top that switches between natty and GNOME3 mode.  But my DOM+Javascript skill are a bit rusty
<rodrigo_> the upstream version column shows the very latest, either 2.32 or 2.91, right?
<robert_ancell> rodrigo_, yes
<rodrigo_> and, what are the colors for?
<rodrigo_> ah, it says it at the bottom :)
<robert_ancell> key is at the bottom, but basically it's ordered from most  out of date to least
<rodrigo_> right
<rodrigo_> robert_ancell, ok, so there are lots of stuff to package, so what are you going to work next?
<rodrigo_> if you're not, I'll work on 'platform' stuff, like gvfs, telepathy, etc
<robert_ancell> I normally just go through and grab the ones that I feel like at the time, if it's part worked on I commit the changes to bzr with "UNRELEASED".  Today I'll probably look at yelp, gdm, rhythmbox, nautilus etc
<rodrigo_> ok
<rodrigo_> robert_ancell, send me a mail when you end your day and I'll pick up where you left, ok?
<robert_ancell> rodrigo_, ok
<rodrigo_> ok then, back to the sofa now :-)
<robert_ancell> nice :)
<rodrigo_> talk to you tomorrow, I hope :-)
<rodrigo_> good night
<robert_ancell> night!
<bryceh> is there an eastern edition meeting today?
<TheMuso> bryceh: No, moved to our Thursday/your Wednesday.
<TheMuso> bryceh: One of us can probably invite you to the calendar entry for it.
<bryceh> TheMuso, ah thanks yes please
<TheMuso> Hrm google calendar is not an option for new calendar in evolution...
 * TheMuso hasn't yet set up his calendar in evolution since doing a fres install of natty.
<TheMuso> hrm... Necessary packages are installed...
<TheMuso> Hrm second time, its shown up.
<TheMuso> bryceh: Hrm doesn't look like I can add additional participants, I think you may need to poke jasoncwarner about it.
<jasoncwarner> I'll see what I can do. I do not claim to be able to do anything w/ google calendar, however!
<jasoncwarner> freakin' app has been killing me these past couple of days!
<TheMuso> Heh I think you were the one who created the event originally, so you are the only one who can invite.
<TheMuso> When I tried to add bryceh using my phone, my calendar app crashed. :)
<TheMuso> Evolution gave me the add/remove buttons, but they were greyed out.
<jasoncwarner> bryceh: you should have it in your inbox now...hopefully
<bryceh> thanks
<rickspencer3> RAOF, around at all?
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Yeah.  What's up?
<rickspencer3> RAOF, I jut dist-upgrade to natty, and my display is "blurry" now
<RAOF> What hardware?
<rickspencer3> things IRL are not
<rickspencer3> i965
<RAOF> Heh.
<RAOF> Got an Xorg.0.log for me?
<Sarvatt> sounds like a non-native mode is being used and scaled to fit the screen. got a /var/log/Xorg.0.log handy?
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, I can look
<RAOF> Sarvatt: That would indeed be my first guess, yeah.
<rickspencer3> and please excuse my ignorance of these things
<rickspencer3> as RAOF can attest, I am a bit of an xorg-nincompoop
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, RAOF: http://paste.ubuntu.com/533284/
<rickspencer3> I figured I should get this sorted before I install new unity ;)
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-11-17
<RAOF> Hm.  Looks like it's using the right mode by default; can you pastebin the output of âxrandrâ?
<rickspencer3> RAOF, http://paste.ubuntu.com/533288/
<RAOF> Is 1680x1050 the native mode of your monitor?
<rickspencer3> I honestly do no know
<RAOF> If you know :)
<rickspencer3> it sounds about right
<RAOF> It does sound about right, yeah.
<rickspencer3> I mean, it's widescreen
<Sarvatt> yeah it is
<Sarvatt> is there some kind of compiz beer goggles plugin enabled by default now in natty?
<rickspencer3> well, it's blurry without desktop effects too, if that's what you were asking Sarvatt
<Sarvatt> everything looks fine there, I'm stumped :)
<RAOF> Maybe a picture of the display would be useful?
<RAOF> The obvious answers have been exhausted.
<nisshh> rickspencer3, check to make sure you have font AA turned on after the upgrade?
<nisshh> or has that been covered already?
<Sarvatt> can you describe blurry any more? is there anything thats still sharp?
<rickspencer3> nisshh, font AA? I usuall use subpixel smoothing
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, let me look at some pictures
<nisshh> rickspencer3, ah, thats what i meant, subpixel smoothing
<rickspencer3> hmm
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, so, hi-def pictures of my dog seem clear
<Sarvatt> yeah I mean things like just fonts being blurry, are icons too big or anything? or is the whole screen just completely blurry
<rickspencer3> but fonts, not so much
<rickspencer3> and icons in nautilus look blurry too
<rickspencer3> this is all very subjective, of course
<RAOF> Maybe that's an icon theme problem?
<nisshh> rickspencer3, maybe it went crazy and munted your monitor settings?
<RAOF> nisshh: No; it looks like he's got the right resolution set.
<Sarvatt> his monitor settings are fine
<nisshh> RAOF, i didnt mean resolution, i mean his monitors built in settings, you know, the ones you access with the little buttons on the monitor?
<RAOF> Maybe.  But it seems like the problem is at a level above X, as the dog pictures look OK.
<rickspencer3> oh jeez, I just reset my monitor back to factor settings, and it looks even worse!
<Sarvatt> rickspencer3: is there a sharpness setting in the monitor options or anything?
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, yeah, I already twiddled that
<nisshh> ah ok, i was wrong then :)
<nisshh> rickspencer3, when i said "that might be the problem" i didnt mean "reset your monitor" :)
<rickspencer3> haha
<rickspencer3> ya
<rickspencer3> images are definately crystal clear
<rickspencer3> RAOF, if it's not xorg, than what can be controlling my font rendering?
<nisshh> rickspencer3, if i said "your monitor is fault" would you smash it? :)
<nisshh> faultly*
<nisshh> faulty*
<nisshh> rickspencer3, cups?
<rickspencer3> haha
<rickspencer3> it's not my monitor
<RAOF> Where shall we start? :).  Probably with gnome-settings-daemon, and the Appearence capplet.
<RAOF> That should be where font settings for GNOME are applied.
<nisshh> RAOF, could it be CUPS maybe?
<nisshh> or cupsd?
<RAOF> nisshh: How could the printer daemon be messing with display fonts?
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<RAOF> I don't see a plausible causal link.
<nisshh> RAOF, oh, thats a printer daemon? i thought it had something to do with fonts :)
 * nisshh slaps himself
<RAOF> nisshh: Well, it does indirectly.  You print using fonts :).  CUPS == Common Unix Printing Service
<rickspencer3> RAOF, it seems that desktop effects are not getting applied :/
<nisshh> RAOF, right
<RAOF> rickspencer3: So, is gnome-settings-daemon running?  Try starting it up.
<nisshh> anyway, im heading out for a while, ill see you lot later
<rickspencer3> bye nisshh
 * nisshh waves
<RAOF> Ominous.
<RAOF> That would appear to not have been a sterling success?
<rickspencer3> RAOF, haha
<rickspencer3> well, I killed compiz, and then couldn't reselect my terminal to start it again
<rickspencer3> a  bit of a self-inflicted wound
<RAOF> Oh, yeah.  Switch to VT1 and run metacity :)
<rickspencer3> anyway gnome-settings-daemon is running
<RAOF> And fonts are still weird.
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> so compiz is running
<rickspencer3> but I'm getting no effects!
<rickspencer3> maybe I need some plugins
<RAOF> You'll probably be hitting the âstill don't have 0.8 â 0.9 settings transition logicâ, there.
<RAOF> Interesting.
<RAOF> I've just started playing with AppearanceâFonts, and none of the hinting options take effect.
<rickspencer3> RAOF, you mean the ones under "Rendering"?
<RAOF> Yeah.
<rickspencer3> huh
<rickspencer3> they dramatically change for me when I switch between them
<rickspencer3> but they are all still blurry
<rickspencer3> I wonder if sub-pixel rendering is not actually being applied
<RAOF> Or, rather, Monochrome works but everything else is the same.
<rickspencer3> oh weir
<rickspencer3> d
<rickspencer3> for me, sub-pixel smoothing works, everything else is the same
<rickspencer3> wrong
<rickspencer3> Monochrome and Best shapes are different
<rickspencer3> I mean and Best Contrast
<rickspencer3> Best Shapes has no effect
<rickspencer3> I wonder if sub-pixel smoothing is not being applied
<rickspencer3> so it's essentially just turning off other options
<RAOF> Possibly.
<kklimonda> kenvandine: ping?
<RAOF> You could also go a-playin' with /etc/fonts/conf.d
<RAOF> But GNOME apps should be taking their settings from the appearance capplet.
<rickspencer3> the problem is, if I try to log a bug, it will be maddenly vague, and no one could help will be in front of my hardware :/
 * rickspencer3 plows ahead
<rickspencer3> Unity time
<RAOF> Yeah, give it a whirl.
<rickspencer3> what could possibly go wrong?
 * rickspencer3 considers backing up data
 * rickspencer3 damns the torpedos
<RAOF> Soft!
<bryceh> rickspencer3, what's your dpi set to?
<rickspencer3> bryceh, where do I see that?
<rickspencer3> Monitors?
<bryceh> System -> Appearance -> Fonts -> Details
<RAOF> In the details button of fonts.
<rickspencer3> 96
<bryceh> mm, that's what it should be
<rickspencer3> well, the subpixel smoothing is definitely having an effect
<bryceh> we have carried a distro patch that sets subpixel smoothing defaults.  If that patch got dropped it could cause behaviors like this
<RAOF> I think that patch still survives; my machines don't suffer from blurry fonts.
<rickspencer3> bryceh, the default settings seemed to be correct
<rickspencer3> I think I'll need to live with this until a domain expert hits the bug
<rickspencer3> "fonts are blurry" doesn't seem to be much go go on
<RAOF> Are the icons still blurry, too?
<RAOF> It's possible that a photo of your screen will trigger an aha.
<rickspencer3> a bit yeah
<rickspencer3> RAOF, good point, I'll log a bug tomorrow
<rickspencer3> *sigh*
<rickspencer3> apt-get is stuck on Unpacking replacement libglewmx1.5 ...
<rickspencer3> :/
<rickspencer3> not my night
<kenvandine> kklimonda, pong
<chrisccoulson_> rickspencer3, be thankful your dmesg isn't full of scary messages like "[Hardware Error]: Machine check events logged" ;)
<kklimonda> kenvandine: do you have a moment?
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson_, heh
<rickspencer3> I've been upgrading this machine since Karmic, I think
<rickspencer3> maybe I should try a clean install
<chrisccoulson_> time for a reinstall ;)
<chrisccoulson_> yeah :)
<chrisccoulson_> i'm not sure if my issue is a real hardware problem or a bug :/
<rickspencer3> oh well
<kklimonda> kenvandine: at the bottom of this document there is a (partial) desktopcouch-glib api for Vala,does it make sense: http://pastebin.com/GsMCFNBt ?
<chrisccoulson_> my laptop just can't hack the pace ;)
<kenvandine> kklimonda, sure
<kklimonda> kenvandine: actually does my idea of enforcing document type per database "connection" make sense?
<kenvandine> no :)
<kklimonda> kenvandine: I know that's how I work - putting different documents into single database have been more trouble for me then it was worth
<kenvandine> probably true
<kenvandine> but i think some people will expect it to handle different document types
<kenvandine> but i assume that is want more work to deal with ?
<kklimonda> kenvandine: they could always drop to couchdb-glib api
<kenvandine> true
<kenvandine> as long as you told them that
<kenvandine> throw an exception that it isn't supported, etc
<kklimonda> kenvandine: that's what Destkopcouch.Document.get_json_object is there for - in couchdb-glib they can do whatever they want..
<kklimonda> right
<kenvandine> oh... wait
<kenvandine> but
<kenvandine> how about dealing with things like loading design documents and views?
<kenvandine> and retrieving those
<kenvandine> those are document types
<kklimonda> the problem is Desktopcouch.Response.get_documents () "inherits" document's type from Desktopcouch.Database
<kenvandine> humm
<kklimonda> Design Documents are a pita in general :)
<kenvandine> not familiar with get_documents...i use get_records
<kenvandine> and  put_record
<kenvandine> oh... but you aren't dealing with the records api
<kklimonda> well, get_documents would return a GList of Desktopcouch.Document
<chrisccoulson_> wow, i can't believe my daughter is a whole year old in a few hours
<kklimonda> I do, in couchdb-glib :)
<kklimonda> I have CouchdbResponse.get_rows ()
<kenvandine> i almost exclusively use the records API
<kklimonda> which returns a GList * of JsonObjects
<kenvandine> you should talk to aquarius tomorrow
<kenvandine> he could probably tell you very quickly if it would be a bad idea or not
<kklimonda> will do :)
<kenvandine> thx :)
<kklimonda> the problem really boils down to the fact that CouchDB doesn't like static languages :)
<kenvandine> i am glad i am not hacking on that stuff :)
<kklimonda> thanks for your insight
<kenvandine> indeed
<kenvandine> it really is very python friendly though :))
<micahg> chrisccoulson_: congrats :)
<chrisccoulson_> heh, thanks :)
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson_, time flies man!
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson_: how the time flies :)
<kenvandine> i can't believe my oldest is almost 8
<chrisccoulson_> it does, this year has gone pretty quick!
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson_: I could swear it was yesterday ;}
<chrisccoulson_> yeah, it feels like it ;)
<bcurtiswx> not sure who to ping for SRU but https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/empathy/+bug/675555
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 675555 in empathy (Ubuntu) "Empathy SRU maverick 2.32.1 (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New]
<nigelb> bcurtiswx: I think pitti would be best bet.  He'll wake up in a few :)
<bcurtiswx> yeah, i'll talk with seb128 and didrocks.. they have been helping me out lately
<nigelb> bcurtiswx: I'm not sure if we put new upstream release into -proposed though
<nigelb> BUt then, not very familar with desktop team procedures now :)
<bcurtiswx> yeah, it would go into proposed first to be tested and verified that it works all around (after my personal testing of course)
<nigelb> bcurtiswx: no, I mean, we generally don't update new release into older release (at least most of the time)
<nigelb> err, new upstream version into older release
<bcurtiswx> nigelb, yeah.. maybe my wording was wrong.. upstreams at 2.91.2  but this is 2.32.1 a new upstream release to a stable release
<nigelb> Ahhhhh
<nigelb> I think there needs to be more documentation
<nigelb> !sru
<ubot2> Stable Release Update information is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<bcurtiswx> yeah i know about that.. lol
<nigelb> One thing I hate about Sru - documentation
<nigelb> takes more time than it takes to get the thing working ;)
<bcurtiswx> idk what to expect, as this is my 2nd SRU request
<nigelb> heh, all will be good :)
<kklimonda> good morning
<didrocks> good morning!
<jasoncwarner> late afternoon ;)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: long day for you, isn't it? :)
<jasoncwarner> didrocks: I took a break in the middle to go and buy a car in the big city. It didn't quite pan out ;)
<jasoncwarner> and now I am supposed to talk to pitti, but he keeps telling me it is one of those german vacation days... ;)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: hehe, I like this kind of break Â« taking a break to buy a car Â». Sounds so natural :)
<didrocks> oh really?
<didrocks> now so the question is: is it the kind of german vacation that seb is taking too or not :)
<jasoncwarner> didrocks: :)
<pitti> Good morning (holiday today)
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti
<devildante> Bonjour tout le monde :)
<didrocks> hey devildante
<devildante> hey didrocks :)
<pitti> hey didrocks
<mvo> its a german vacation day?
 * mvo is all ears
<devildante> mvo: I think so
<mvo> hey devildante! nice to see you :)
<devildante> mvo: right when I also have vacations
<devildante> mvo: and nice to see you too :)
<mvo> devildante: unusual at this time of day - aha, vaaction
<devildante> heh :)
<huats> morning
<mvo> devildante: there is a branch from you pending, right :) I want to get that in !
<devildante> mvo: zeitgeist-unused-applications?
<mvo> devildante: yeah! you fixed the one comment I had about it ages ago
<mvo> devildante: so I feel a bit bad for letting it slip :/
<devildante> ah
<devildante> mvo: np, cause mpt just disapproved it :p
<mvo> devildante: but now that UDS and vacation is over I will be quicker again (fingers crossed)
<mvo> devildante: oh?
<devildante> mvo: see https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ilidrissi.amine/software-center/zeitgeist-unused-applications/+merge/39236
<devildante> morale of the story: always don't do something without mpt's consent, or you might get bad surprises :p
<mvo> devildante: ok
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone!
<kklimonda> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi kklimonda, how are you>
<chrisccoulson> ?
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson, kklimonda!
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks, how are you?
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: I think I've slept of Json tonight but otherwise I'm good :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm good, thanks! And you?
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - i'm not too bad thanks. my daughters birthday today!
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: what have you bought your daughter for birthday? A mascot penguin? ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh nice :)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> we got her a smart trike thingy to push her around on outside
<chrisccoulson> although, the weather outside is hideous ;)
<kklimonda> lovely European climate ;)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, weird build failure: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/59221143/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-amd64.firefox-4.0_4.0~b8~hg20101117r57626%2Bnobinonly-0ubuntu1~umd1~hardy_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<chrisccoulson> error: #error "Architecture not supported" - ok ;)
<devildante> chrisccoulson: what does ~umd1 there mean?
<chrisccoulson> ubuntu-mozilla-daily
<devildante> ah, thanks :)
<devildante> chrisccoulson: speaking of which, when is beta7 coming to the mozilla ppa? I want my super-fast js engine :p
<devildante> (mozilla-next)
<chrisccoulson> devildante, once we've uploaded it to natty
<devildante> ah
<chrisccoulson> we've hit a snag with the new packaging layout though, which has blocked that
<chrisccoulson> abrowser uses can't upgrade properly
<devildante> chrisccoulson: so no more ppa for me, all hail natty :)
<kklimonda> I'm using dailies from mozilla ppa and I don't see much improvement :/
<devildante> chrisccoulson: thanks for the insight :)
<chrisccoulson> abrowser really needs to go away and die
<chrisccoulson> :)
<chrisccoulson> it starts faster ;)
<chrisccoulson> (much faster than ff3.6, anyway)
<kklimonda> I have it running for as long as I'm logged in so that doesn't matter to me ;)
<devildante> chrisccoulson: true
<kklimonda> and ff4 + flash x64 beta is not the best combination in the world - flash crashes al the time :/
<kklimonda> good I only use it to watch some youtube ;)
<chrisccoulson> fresh profile is about 1 second here, and a session restore is about 3seconds until fully rendered and usable tabs
<chrisccoulson> which beats the old version by many seconds!
<devildante> about flash
<devildante> I have some weird "bug" with fullscreen
<kklimonda> flash is really one big bug
<devildante> that "bug" is really a feature in my case, though
<devildante> remember when you wanted to change the sound volume, notify-osd triggers and flash reverts from fullscreen?
<chrisccoulson> yeah :)
<devildante> it seems it doesn't occur to me anymore
<devildante> weeeeeeird
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, perhaps that was fixed in flash
<chrisccoulson> but that was 100% flash bug anyway, so it must have been ;)
<devildante> chrisccoulson: but I get a white screen for 0.01s
<devildante> = blink
<devildante> but it's fixed as I see
<devildante> weeeird
<devildante> I don't think flash was updated in natty, did it?
<chrisccoulson> it was dropping fullscreen on the FocusOut/NotifyGrab event it got when pressing the volume buttons
<chrisccoulson> which it shouldn't have been doing
<kklimonda> still happening here
<chrisccoulson> i'd be surprised if it's fixed. adobe don't fix bugs, they only create them
<kklimonda> :)
<devildante> phew - it works even in metacity ; I was worried that a compiz bug would have masked that flash bug :p
 * devildante has a weird compiz config
<rodrigo_> morning
<seb128> rodrigo_, hey
<seb128> how are you?
<rodrigo_> fine, thanks, and you?
<seb128> I'm fine thanks
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128 / rodrigo_
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how are you?
<seb128> did you manage to get your laptop to build a firefox yesterday? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - not too bad thanks, just clearing up the wrapping paper mess after my daughter opened her birthday presents
<chrisccoulson> (well, after we opened them for her) ;)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i managed to get 2 firefox builds yesterday in the end ;)
<rodrigo_> hi chrisccoulson
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, 2 firefox builds as present for your daughter? :)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> they felt like a present to me yesterday with the number of failed builds i had because of my laptop crashing ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, it's your daughter birthday? happy birthday to her then ;-)
<rodrigo_> yeah, happy birthday to her, how old is she?
<seb128> I hope you got some cake ;-)
<kklimonda> o/ rodrigo_
<rodrigo_> hi kklimonda
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, I am importing your branch right now into a branch in git.gnome.org, btw
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, she's 1 today :)
<devildante> chrisccoulson: happy 1st birthday to her, then :)
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, oh, nice :)
<didrocks> hey rodrigo_, salut seb128
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
<seb128> lut didrocks
<rodrigo_> hi didrocks
<devildante> how many french-speaking people are here, I wonder...
<mvo> chrisccoulson: congrats from me as well on this :)
<chrisccoulson> mvo - thanks
<chrisccoulson> is your daughter feeling better today?
<mvo> chrisccoulson: yes, she is sleeping, that is a good sign. and much less fever
<seb128> mvo, oh, you had one of your girls not feeling well?
<chrisccoulson> that's good then :)
<mvo> seb128: yes, marie had fever (40Â°C) for two days, that was not fun
<seb128> oh ok
<mvo> seb128: but she is getting better now - its the age, kidnergarten and all that
<seb128> glad she's starting feeling better
<chrisccoulson> we've been quite fortunate with ruby, she has been ill much less than average. but i guess that will change when she starts being around other people more
<chrisccoulson> she did get my ubuflu from UDS though ;)
<pitti> seb128: btw, I got a lot further with my pygi/gtk3.0 jockey port -- I see the main window, can install drivers, and get message boxes :)
<pitti> (and I reported three upstream bugs for pygobject)
<seb128> ok, great
<seb128> let me know if they are responsive to bugs ;-)
<seb128> so porting is non trivial it seems?
<pitti> so far I have workarounds for all of them
<pitti> seb128: no, but it's not truly hard either; just a bit ugly
<seb128> how so?
<pitti> seb128: and currently I'm stuck with the unavailability of indicator and pynotify bindings for gtk3.0
<devildante> what are the key differences between pygtk and pygobject? (which, as I understood, is the drop-in replacement for pygtk in python 3)
<pitti> but kenvandine has a WI for indicator 3.0, I think
<pitti> devildante: pygtk is going away
<pitti> devildante: in the new world, pygobject uses the gobject-introspection data from libraries and makes them accessible directly
<devildante> ah
<pitti> seb128: ugly> because of things like https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=620579
<ubot2> Gnome bug 620579 in introspection "Accept unicode objects in addition to strings" [Major,New]
<chrisccoulson> oh, i just rewrote the firefox profile migrator in pygtk ;)
<chrisccoulson> i guess i need to fix that
<pitti> seb128: pygobject 2.27 helps a lot already, though (I just uploaded it)
<pitti> seb128: now I'm tracking down why the expand/fill behavior is now exactly opposite (my description box stays small, and all the labels and button boxes grow huge)
<seb128> pitti, I was going to suggest that yesterday when I read the blog post about the new version
<pitti> but once this gets done for one project, porting the next one should be a lot easier
<pitti> seb128: hellogoodbyehellogoodbyehello
<seb128> ups
<pitti> seb128: argh, seems my upload got stuck with the LP upgrade
<pitti> seb128: but anyway, it's working a lot better, message boxes and tree iters work nicely again
<pitti> it crashes right at the start, but I added a workaround and filed an upstream bug
<seb128> it's still a bit young
<seb128> but it's nice that somebody does some real porting to run into those issues, get them reported and fixed
<pitti> right; give it another half a year, and it'll rock
<seb128> let's see how responsive the upstream guys are
<pitti> jockey doesn't have that much GTK code, so it's rather easy to port
<pitti> seb128: I wondered why libnotify4 doesn't have anything to build a GIR -- do you know how hard it is to add?
<seb128> right, that's why I said at UDS that software-center will perhaps not be ported this cycle
<pitti> *nod*
<seb128> dunno for the gir but the dx guys probably know
<seb128> njpatel or ted
<seb128> it seems to not really be hard if you api is commented correctly in the code so the parser works correctly on it
<seb128> you -> your
<seb128> seems the retracers don't like having launchpad down ;-)
<seb128> hum
<seb128> pitti, do you plan to update gdu to 2.32?
<seb128> it seems we still have 2.30
<pitti> can do; I believe I already looked at it before, and there was a problem with it, but I don't remember any more
<seb128> the depends on the new libnotify?
<seb128> read the git log it's mostly translation updates and api updates for the new gtk
<pitti> seb128: ah, perhaps it was that
<pitti> seb128: I'll do it this week, just not today
<pitti> today = holiday = fun stuff :)
<pitti> we wanted to go hiking, but it's dreadful outside
<seb128> oh right, you are on holiday ;-)
<seb128> you shouldn't even be on IRC! ;-)
<pitti> meh, I have a simple test program which just opens a GtkBuilder
<pitti> $ gcc -o b `pkg-config --cflags --libs gtk+-2.0` b.c
<pitti> /tmp/cc948PC7.o: In function `main':
<pitti> b.c:(.text+0x19): undefined reference to `gtk_builder_new'
<pitti> b.c:(.text+0x32): undefined reference to `gtk_builder_add_from_file'
<pitti> b.c:(.text+0x5a): undefined reference to `g_log'
<devildante> oh god
<pitti> what am I doing wrong here? "pkg-config --cflags --libs gtk+-3.0" has all the -lgtk-x11-3.0 bits
<didrocks> pitti: try to build with gcc-4.4
<devildante> you did gtk_-2.0
<devildante> you should put gtk+-3.0
<devildante> 3 rather than 2 ;)
<pitti> ah, I tried that first
<didrocks> pitti: seems similar to the bug I had for the wallpaper cache yesterday in g-s-d
<pitti> it doesn't work with either
<didrocks> can't help you then, it did it for me :)
<pitti> didrocks: fun, that works
<didrocks> ah
<pitti> strange
<didrocks> you were answering to devildante :)
 * devildante is confused
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, I've pinged doko about it yesterday, he has no clue about it
<didrocks> pitti: I tried all the --as-needed/--no-as-needed and such, didn't see any difference
<pitti> didrocks: I answered to devildante that I tried both gtk 2 and 3
<didrocks> for me, it was even worse, gdk_init not recognized by the linker despite the -lâ¦ :}
<devildante> ah
<pitti> ok, so the "inverted fill/expand behaviour" bug is not pygobject specific, but GTK 2->3 specific
 * pitti RTFM
<njpatel> pitti, not too hard, you can probably pull the autofoo from one of the dx's library projects
<devildante> I see two pedro_ in the list :p
<pedro_> hello devildante :-)
<devildante> hi pedro_ :)
<devildante> pedro_: this is serious, I see two of you :p
<rodrigo_> one pedro_ is enough
<pedro_> rodrigo_, my mom says that too :-P
<rodrigo_> :)
<devildante> I guess empathy is tricking me
<seb128> hey pedro_, up earlier every day?
<rodrigo_> devildante, yes, I only see one pedro_
<pedro_> hello seb128! same time as always but looks like DST is in place now ;-)
<rodrigo_> pedro_, so what time is it now in Chile?
<pedro_> 8 am here
<rodrigo_> ah, only 4 hours diff, yeah
<devildante> rodrigo_: thanks for letting me know empathy is buggy :)
<rodrigo_> devildante, :)
<devildante> (that sounded funny btw :p)
<ivanka> mvo: hi
<seb128> ivanka, hey, he's at lunch I think
<ivanka> hey seb128: ah, no worries, was nothing urgent
<seb128> ivanka, if you let some context I'm sure he will reply when he's back
<seb128> or maybe somebody else can help you
<ivanka> seb128: was just going to thank mvo for helping out rhlee with screenshots.ubuntu.com
<seb128> oh ok ;-)
<chrisccoulson> right, i'll be back in a bit, taking my daughter out for lunch :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, have fun
<chrisccoulson> thanks!
<duanedesign> where is the evolution-data-server binary in Maverick?
<rodrigo_> hmm, we need a GTK3 version of liblaunchpad-integration
<rodrigo_> duanedesign, /usr/lib/evolution/e-*-factory
<rodrigo_> duanedesign, just answered to the bug
<seb128> rodrigo_, it's in natty
<seb128> lpi with gtk3
<seb128> the amd64 build failed though
<rodrigo_> seb128, oh, is it?
<seb128> I will fix that when i'm back from lunch
<rodrigo_> I need an update then
<seb128> or manually build it locally meanwhile
<pitti> rodrigo_: do you happen to know about the different dialog contents expand/fill behaviour in GTK 2.0 and 3.0?
<pitti> rodrigo_: with 3.0 resizing dialogs often just causes the dialog to get extra outer padding, instead of resizing the contents
<rodrigo_> pitti, hmm, no idea
<rodrigo_> pitti, afaik, there shouldn't be any change, but not sure
<pitti> python -c 'from gi.repository import Gtk; Gtk.require_version("3.0"); w = Gtk.Builder(); w.add_from_file("/usr/share/gnome-control-center/ui/gnome-mouse-properties.ui"); w.get_object("mouse_properties_dialog").run()'
<pitti> this reproduces it nicely; if you use "2.0" in require_version, it works correctly
<pitti> rodrigo_: it's not a python issue; I wrote a C test program which does the same
<pitti> rodrigo_: do you know who I could ask about this?
<rodrigo_> pitti, #gtk+ on irc.gnome.org
<rodrigo_> pitti, garnacho might know about it, but better ask in the channel, I guess
<devildante> pitti: but be sure to not be eaten by detractors who say Ubuntu abandoned GNOME :p
<pitti> rodrigo_: I asked there, thanks
<rodrigo_> pitti, and?
<pitti> waiting :)
<rodrigo_> ah, ok :)
<rodrigo_> let me know what answer you get, please
<pitti> yep
<seb128> pitti, not sure if you know about http://library.gnome.org/devel/gtk/2.91/gtk-migrating-2-to-3.html
<devildante> seb128: nice link, thank you :)
<seb128> pitti, there is a section which seems similar to what you ask
<pitti> rodrigo_, seb128: some part of it seems to be known, gnome bug 634592
<ubot2> Gnome bug 634592 in gtk "GtkNotebook doesn't expand (in a typical GtkDialog)" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=634592
<rodrigo_> pitti, ah, ok, so it's a bug, not a "feature" :)
<pitti> seb128: right, but if that changes stuff at all, it should expand more, not less
<seb128> right, so you probably  hit a bug
<mvo> ivanka: thanks! also I don't had to help much, rhless did a great job
<pitti> yay, it's working now \o/
<pitti> rodrigo_: so, explicitly setting the fill property to True in the topmost GtkVBox helps
<pitti> (workaround for this bug)
<rodrigo_> ok
<ivanka> mvo: that is good news :-)
<pitti> now it's just unthemed, and I get a lot of "Unable to locate theme engine in module_path: "murrine"," warnings
<pitti> but that's secondary
<pitti> I guess our murrine theme package doesn't have a version for gtk 3 yet
<seb128> pitti, install the gtk3 murrine binary
<seb128> it has
<pitti> oh
<seb128> you just have nothing pulling it in
<pitti> seb128: ah, seems we pull that in via human-theme or gnome-themes-ubuntu; so I guess at some point we'll just update that
<seb128> right
<pitti> *sniff* that's working beautifully
<seb128> well the default theme should probably recommends it
<seb128> pitti, ;-)
<pitti> the old pygtk2 and new pygi 3.0 jockey now look identical
<seb128> great, upload! ;-)
<pitti> no indicator, no notifications
<seb128> oh right
<pitti> and it still uses dbus-glib
<pitti> I didn't find any GDBus stuff in the glib gir
<seb128> well that one is not really an issue
<pitti> not sure whether that's intended or a bug
<seb128> dunno
<pitti> but right, dbus-python isn't a blocker
<pitti> sorry for being such a nuisance today, but I've got another question
<pitti> Failed to load typelib file '/usr/lib/girepository-1.0/AppIndicator-0.1.typelib' for namespace 'AppIndicator': Typelib version mismatch; expected 4, found 3
<pitti> would it be enough to rebuild gir1.0-appindicator-0.1?
 * pitti tries
<seb128> pitti, yes
<seb128> upstream handled the abi breakage in an non optimal way
<seb128> they have an abi number but didn't bump it since it's still an unstable serie
<pitti> ok, no problem
 * pitti installs 300 MB of build depends and tries a no-change build; if that works, I'll upload it
<seb128> doing a rebuild should be enough if the other typelibs it needs have been rebuilt
<pitti> that, and adding a gir to libnotify4 -> happiness
<seb128> pitti, ken is working on having a gtk3 build going on but I guess having a rebuild meanwhile makes sense
<pitti> seb128: oh, does that thing actually need gtk2? I thought it was all dbus
<pitti> well, python-appindicator apparenlty imports gtk2 (which causes the app to hang badly)
<pitti> The GObject name 'AppIndicator' isn't compatibile
<pitti> with the configured identifier prefixes:
<pitti>   ['AppIndicator']
<pitti> The class would have no name.  Most likely you want to specify a
<pitti> different --identifier-prefix.
<seb128> pitti, yes, that needs gtk2
<pitti> ok, I think I'll leave that to Ken, and do something else for now :)
<seb128> pitti, it communicates over dbus with the service
 * pitti will actually pretend he'd be on holiday then, see you later :)
<seb128> pitti, have fun!
<bcurtiswx> didrocks, I created bug #675555 would you be able to check it through for m? I read through SRU wiki but not sure if I understood it all quite right.  I'm heading to work shortly and I'll ping you again with my bcurtiswx_ account later.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 675555 in empathy (Ubuntu) "Empathy SRU maverick 2.32.1 (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/675555
<rodrigo_> I'm going to update gvfs for the GNOME3 PPA, but I think it can just go to natty (we have 1.6.4 and the new upstream is 1.6.6)
<rodrigo_> seb128, ^
<seb128> rodrigo_, why do you need to update it?
<rodrigo_> well, going over the versions page from robert
<rodrigo_> I really don't need it
<seb128> rodrigo_, don't we rather need a 1.7 from the unstable serie?
<seb128> oh ok
<rodrigo_> hmm, there's no 1.7 release yet
 * rodrigo_ relooks
<seb128> right, but maybe we need one
<seb128> 1.6.5 was from the new serie but the new 1.6 is from stable again
<rodrigo_> right, the git master one has all stuff migrated to GSettings
<rodrigo_> so, yes, better to wait for the 1.7.x release
<seb128> does that migration impact on any other component?
<rodrigo_> the gvfs migration you mean?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> rodrigo_, did you run out of task or do you just want to do easy updates for a change?
<rodrigo_> seb128, no, not out of tasks, just looking over the list and deciding what needs to go first
<rodrigo_> seb128, but do you want me to do anything else?
<seb128> not really, I just have some updates from that list pending so let me know on the channel if you start on one
<rodrigo_> ah, which updates?
<seb128> the 2.32.1 updates vuntz rolled earlier
<seb128> gnome-session, libwnck, etc
<rodrigo_> ok, I can take some, if you want
<rodrigo_> for natty?
<seb128> yes
<rodrigo_> ok, let me know which ones you want me to work on, I'll do them after lunch
<seb128> rodrigo_, you can do gnome-menus gnome-themes if you want
<rodrigo_> ok, will do after lunch, now lunch, so bbl :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, enjoy your lunch
<rodrigo_> thanks :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, sound-juicer as well
<bcurtiswx_> didrocks, get my prev. msg ?
<didrocks> bcurtiswx_: sorry, was working on something else :)
<bcurtiswx_> didrocks, not a prob, just got to work, wanted to verify :)
<didrocks> bcurtiswx_: not sure I'll give it a go before Friday though and empathy is more kenvandine's pet :)
<bcurtiswx_> didrocks, ah.  thought you were since i've seen you upload it a lot :) i will bother Ken.. he's used to it by now
<kenvandine> hehe
<didrocks> hehe :)
<bcurtiswx_> kenvandine, bug #675555 . Am I doing things right with it?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 675555 in empathy (Ubuntu) "Empathy SRU maverick 2.32.1 (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/675555
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx_, you mean in regard to SRU process?
 * kenvandine looks
<bcurtiswx_> kenvandine, yeah I got the package to build successfully on pbuilder and testing it worked fine. im just not sure exactly what SRU entails.. the wiki was confusing
<bcurtiswx_> i've been told i'm doing it wrong by -motu but I learned it the way I did it from the people here.. so i wanted to make sure I did it wrong.. weird i know :P
<kenvandine> wow... i didn't even notice there was a preference for 'disable notifications when busy or away'
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> i really want gwibber to do something like that, using IM status as a key for your general availability
<kenvandine> but i am not sure that is totally sane... opinions from others welcome
<bcurtiswx_> what would that do to benefit gwibber? tell the program not to bug you when away/busy but let the messages flow when available?
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx_, yeah, sort of like a DND
<kenvandine> like if your showing slides during a talk... set your status to away
<kenvandine> or busy, etc
<kenvandine> and gwibber stops bugging you :)
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx_, considering that it is a GNOME package, i think that is fine for a SRU
<bcurtiswx_> smart annoyances.. i like it :)
<kenvandine> generally they prefer individual bug fix SRUs
<kenvandine> bug GNOME packages we do the point releases
<kenvandine> so this looks good
<bcurtiswx_> kenvandine, great :) thx
<kenvandine> let me sponsor it and i'll let you handle getting the SRU approved :)
<bcurtiswx_> kenvandine, OK.  I think I have it all prepared for SRU except for  a testcase in the bug comments
<chrisccoulson> is gwibber really really slow in natty for anybody else?
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, slow?  like what specifically is slow?
<kenvandine> the UI doesn't feel responsive?
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, it takes a long time for it to open from the messaging menu
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> even if gwibber-service is already running?
<chrisccoulson> and i just had to re-authorize with identi.ca, and the whole UI froze for like 10 seconds after i clicked "Allow"
<kenvandine> although that hsould be fast...
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, i know about that
<kenvandine> it is waiting for the response from identi.ca
<chrisccoulson> oh, it tells my i need to reauthorize again
<kenvandine> for it to get the resulting page
<kenvandine> for identi.ca?
<bcurtiswx_> chrisccoulson, i agree, the first launch from the me menu does take a bit
<kenvandine> oh... did you hit "save" after re-authorizing?
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, oh, i might not have hit save
<chrisccoulson> that's confusing ;)
<kenvandine> yeah... i really need to fix that :/
<bcurtiswx_> kenvandine, maybe authorize should auto-save?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that has tripped me up before as well
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx_, yes... it will auto-save all changes... when i find the time
<kenvandine> we had to make it a manual process because of race conditions with couchdb
<kenvandine> but now i just haven't found the time to fix it
<bcurtiswx_> time, if i ever make a machine to go back, i'll force the gregorians to add an extra hour or two to the day
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, wow... as 12oz burger?  I am impressed!
<kenvandine> s/as/a/
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, yeah, i wish i took a photograph of it!
<kenvandine> indeed
 * bcurtiswx_ is lost
<chrisccoulson> i'll just have to go back and have another one!
<chrisccoulson> :)
<chrisccoulson> bcurtiswx_ ;)
<bcurtiswx_> chrisccoulson, would this be one of those find you on twitter/identica and see what you're talking about?
<chrisccoulson> bcurtiswx_ - it might be ;)
<bcurtiswx_> name on there? @chrisccoulson ?
<chrisccoulson> yeah
<chrisccoulson> thats my name everywhere ;)
<chrisccoulson> right, i am determined to have ff-4.0 uploaded this afternoon
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, woot
<chrisccoulson> i wonder how many times my laptop will crash before that happens though ;)
<bcurtiswx_> well, i'm officially stalking/following you now
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you have fun for lunch? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i don't normally post a lot - just usually to announce new firefox and thunderbird releases ;)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, we went to an indoor play area for my daughter, and then grabbed some lunch afterwards
<chrisccoulson> i ate quite a large lunch though
<seb128> nice
<seb128> oh, feeling sleepy now then? ;-)
<seb128> you need some coffee to fix that :p
<chrisccoulson> heh, yeah, i could do with some coffee!
 * kenvandine sips on some hot coffee, yum!
<bcurtiswx_> i wish i liked coffee.. because everywhere i go, conferences, workplaces, friends, family.. they always have a pot brewing :'(
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<seb128> kenvandine, how are the gtk3 updates from ted going?
<kenvandine> just starting that now
<kenvandine> hopefully finish today
<kenvandine> hopefully it won't be too painful now that mterry has blazed the trail :)
<kenvandine> seb128, we need to get ubuntu-geoip out of sourceNEW
<kenvandine> so we can get the MIR rolling and get indicator-datetime uploaded
<mterry> kenvandine, make sure you're looking at that latest merge (not trunk) for launchpad-integration, as trunk has a bug with how I did it for non-i386 archs
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> mterry, I'm about to sponsor that btw
<kenvandine> i was just looking to see if that was merged :)
<seb128> Riddell, hey, do you plan to do some source NEW today? ;-)
<mterry> rodrigo_, should my gtk3 apps be unthemed?  Am I missing a theme package or something?
<seb128> mterry, you probably need gtk3 murrine
<mterry> Yeah
<seb128> it's in natty
<kenvandine> ah... i just noticed that last night
<seb128> but nothing pull it in
<kenvandine> that explains it
<mterry> hrm, pulling it in
<Riddell> seb128: yo, can do, you want the gtk package in?
<seb128> I will update the theme when we start having applications using gtk3
<kenvandine> i got a bunch of errors finding murrine
<kenvandine> was doing some late night hacking on the new gtk3 vala gwibber client :)
<kenvandine> first dive into playing with Gtk.Application :)
<seb128> Riddell, kenvandine needs ubuntu-geoip, gtksourceview3 would be nice as well
<kenvandine> wish there was documentation :)
<seb128> Riddell, and launchpad-integration through binary NEW in a bit (it's there only for i386 so far but that's about to be fixed)
<seb128> kenvandine, pitti ported jockey to gi and gtk3
<seb128> kenvandine, he's just blocked on the lack of appindicator gir for gtk3 now
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> saw that
<seb128> mterry, hey
<mterry> kenvandine, library.gnome.org doesn't have your back?
<seb128> mterry, what do you work,plan to work on next?
<kenvandine> mterry, C docs
<mterry> seb128, working on gedit a bit (seems to work, need to file MIR for libpeas and gtksourceview3) and some quickly stuff.  I can take something
<kenvandine> but had to look at the vapi file to figure out the names of some flags
<mterry> kenvandine, yeah, having the vapi files open seems unavoidable with Vala
<seb128> mterry, I don't think we have anything which is important to get tackled this week so feel free to do things you want to do or quickly work
<seb128> mterry, if you are wanting to do some updates there is still gdl and anjuta to do
<seb128> having a first real application using gtk3 in universe could be nice
<mterry> yeah, that's probably better than having gedit be the flagship.  less pressure for it to be perfect on first go and I can update it directly...  /me starts looking at gdl
<seb128> mterry, great, thanks
<bcurtiswx_> seb128, are there things still blocking empathy from being updated to 2.91.2 ?
<seb128> bcurtiswx_, webkit, gnome-keyring
<seb128> at least
<bcurtiswx_> seb128, they just need to be packaged, correct?
<seb128> "just", yes
<seb128> Riddell, thanks for the NEWing ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, mterry: ^ ubuntu-geoip and gtksourceview3 newed
<kenvandine> woot
<kenvandine> thx
<Riddell> launchpad-integration in too
<seb128> great
<mterry> Riddell, thanks!
<seb128> didrocks, I think vuntz really dislikes you
<seb128> didrocks, he rolled gnome-panel 2.32.1 without considering your dso fix
<didrocks> seb128: no no, don't tell it!
<didrocks> seb128: but it still applies?
<vuntz> didn't see the bug, I guess
<seb128> he fixed http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-panel/commit/?id=d38428d78ca5a3e51e0cf472875652fd2d787ada
<didrocks> vuntz: like a cache patch *hem*
<seb128> the other parts still apply
<seb128> vuntz, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=634446
<ubot2> Gnome bug 634446 in Panel "invalid DSO linking with gnome-panel" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<didrocks> vuntz is mean :)
<seb128> didrocks, the patch is not enough as well
<seb128> libtray has an undefined gdk symbols
<bcurtiswx_> 2.92.92.is.2.31.91-0ubuntu4 <-- what's that mean?
<didrocks> seb128: the previous buid was working, isn't it?
<seb128> bcurtiswx_, it means that 2.92 was a typo for 2.29
<vuntz> didrocks: need to look at it later, but I'm not quite sure why randr is needed for the test stuff
<seb128> bcurtiswx_, so the version was tweaked to go back to the real one with an epoch over debian
<seb128> didrocks, yes, not sure why
<bcurtiswx_> interesting, lol
<didrocks> vuntz: if you can consider my wallpaper cache as well, I had to rebased it twice since last month :)
<didrocks> vuntz: normally, all your concerns were taken into account
<seb128> didrocks, in fact that might be the same issue that g-s-d
<didrocks> seb128: ok, separate issue then, all is good from our side, but the linker seems not happy about somethingâ¦
<mterry> seb128, for something like gdl that is introducing a new gdl-3.0.pc and the like, I believe best practices is to create a new source package, since otherwise we'd have to update all rdepends immediately?   With few rdepends, do we bother with a new source?
<seb128> mterry, no, don't bother, there is 2 rdepends to this one
<seb128> one being anjuta
<seb128> the other one is gtranslator which seems ported to gtk3 in git
<seb128> there was a blog post about it yesterday
<mterry> seb128, well, there is python-gdl which python-gnome2-extras-dev uses
<seb128> well, that one has no rdepends
<mterry> seb128, but no rdepends of that?
<seb128> so we can just stop building it
<seb128> what do you think?
<mterry> seb128, sure.  How do we stop building something?  Take it out of the control file?
 * mterry wonders if there is secret archive admin magic that would do the same thing
<seb128> mterry, well, the gdl you are using will change so ideally tweak the build to not try to build the gdl binding if it's not clever enough to do that
<seb128> mterry, typically it's dropping the build-depends, dropping the binary in the control, cleaning the .install
<mterry> For my purposes, seems easier to just drop the python-gdl Depends, but OK
<mterry> oh right, it builds python-gdl too
<seb128> mterry, what do you mean?
<seb128> mterry, it's likely that the source will fail to build once you land the new gdl
<mterry> I had assumed gdl provided that itself.  OK, I'm up to speed
<seb128> great ;-)
<seb128> it's the old manual bindings we are talking about there
 * mterry looks *so* forward to our new gobject-introspection overlords
<seb128> yeah
<devildante> it seems now is not the time to create new apps, with all that gtk 2 to 3 transition stuff :)
<seb128> didrocks, seems your gnome-panel patch is not required
<didrocks> seb128: the DSO link?
<didrocks> seems it was (your previous upload): http://launchpadlibrarian.net/58905743/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-i386.gnome-panel_1:2.32.0.2-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<didrocks> and I think I got the build error as well to add it :)
<didrocks> then, gcc 4.4 -> 4.5, not sure what happens, new errors, maybe this one is now vanished
<seb128> didrocks, that seems  http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-panel/commit/?id=d38428d78ca5a3e51e0cf472875652fd2d787ada
<seb128> didrocks, not sure why you added the xrandr ones
<seb128> well building with gcc-4.4 without your patch and this commit works
<seb128> gcc-4.5 has issues but that's similar to the simple g-s-d case from yesterday
<cyphermox> hey didrocks! I think I got the evo migration code fixed now :)
<didrocks> seb128: I remember to get an issue with xrandr, I didn't add it just for fun :)
<didrocks> cyphermox: awesome \o/
<didrocks> but if it builds without, nice :)
<cyphermox> I have the patch ready, just need to clean it up and I'll show it to the evo devs
<seb128> didrocks, ok, let's try without it to see how it goes
<cyphermox> it always built without
<didrocks> cyphermox: great, thanks for working on this :)
<cyphermox> oh wait.. :)
<didrocks> seb128: sure :-)
<vuntz> didrocks: ahah! You wanted me to use a patch that is wrong!
<didrocks> vuntz: that's a punishment for not commiting the wallpaper patch and force me to rebase at each release!
<didrocks> vuntz: I see, it's all your fault! :)
<bcurtiswx_> why would quilt not see patched with them existing in debian/patches?
<bcurtiswx_> patches*
<didrocks> bcurtiswx_: is it in debian/series?
<didrocks> debian/patches/series
<bcurtiswx_> didrocks, no
<didrocks> so it should be :)
<bcurtiswx_> move all patches from debian/patches to debian/patches/series ?
<didrocks> bcurtiswx_: no, I mean debian/patches/series as a file
<didrocks> bcurtiswx_: not familiar with quilt?
<bcurtiswx_> didrocks, not past basic pop push commands :(
<didrocks> bcurtiswx_: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Howtos/Quilt
<didrocks> bcurtiswx_: basically, debian/patches/series is a file listing one after the other the available patches (the order is important)
<rodrigo_> seb128, https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gnome-themes/2_32_1_release <- do I propose it for merging, or merge to lp:~u-d/gnome-themes/ubuntu and upload?
<cyphermox> quilt is so awesome :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, can you do merge requests for now?
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, no problem
 * rodrigo_ proposes
<seb128> rodrigo_, I think this one is trivial so I will approve and you can merge and upload
<seb128> rodrigo_, we just do that for new contributors to the desktop set
<bcurtiswx_> didrocks, seems weird, im taing the debian directory from the desktop team.. thought it would already have something like this in there
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, I know, that's why I ask, since this was a trivial one
<bcurtiswx_> taking* / using
<seb128> bcurtiswx_, what distro version?
<bcurtiswx_> from maverick
<rodrigo_> seb128, https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gnome-themes/2_32_1_release/+merge/41059
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok, approved ;-)
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, merging and uploading then :)
<seb128> thanks
<bcurtiswx_> im looking at gnome-keyring from lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-keyring/ubuntu
<bcurtiswx_> debian/patches has no series file in it
<rodrigo_> bcurtiswx_, there's already a 2.91.x version in lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-keyring/ubuntugtk3, just in case you are working on that
<bcurtiswx_> rodrigo_, wow, didn't know about ubuntugtk3 instead of ubuntu at the end for the new packages. :) thx
<rodrigo_> bcurtiswx_, yes, we are pushing stuff to ...ubuntugtk3, so just look for that
<rodrigo_> bcurtiswx_, also, if you are working on some package let robert_ancell or myself know
<rodrigo_> so that we don't work on the same one
<seb128> or me
<rodrigo_> or seb128 yes
<rodrigo_> bcurtiswx_, https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/gnome3-builds has the packages
<cyphermox> on that subject, what's the tag again for the bugs seb128 tagged for gtk3 migrations?
<seb128> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=gnome3-gtk3
<cyphermox> ah!
<cyphermox> I was looking for just "gtk3"
<seb128> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-gnome3 has work items as well
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx_, btw empathy is in the unapproved queue for maverick-proposed and I uploaded it to natty
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx_, i'll yet you take it from here... subscribe ubuntu-sru, etc
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx_, let us know if you have questions
<bcurtiswx_> kenvandine, Thx.. i've already subscribed ubuntu-sru added changelog to comments, and a testcase as well.. i think thats all i have to do
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx_, thx!
<bcurtiswx_> kenvandine, np :)
<bcurtiswx_> well i was going to see abotu packaging -keyring and webkit, but it's aready been done.. for both.. with the exception  being webkit FTBFS
<bcurtiswx_> AndrewKeenan__, where in Rochester?
<bcurtiswx_> where would I DL webkit3.0-1.3.6.tar.gz ?
<seb128> bcurtiswx_, I guess on the webkit website
<seb128> it's probably just named webkit-1.3.6.tar.gz upstream
<bcurtiswx_> seb128, http://www.paldo.org/index-section-packages-page-main-releaseid-136483.html ?
<seb128> bcurtiswx_, webkit download on google
<seb128> http://webkit.org/
<bcurtiswx_> haha, yes i see now.. thx ;)
<fta> bratsche, hi, i read you have some (gtk3?) patches for chromium. anything i can do to help you?
<bratsche> fta: No, it's not a gtk3 patch.  It's a patch to make Chromium work with a particular gtk3 feature that I backported to gtk2 in a PPA (and which I guess we may be distro-patching in gtk2 for Natty?)
<fta> bratsche, natty only?
<bratsche> Yes.
<bratsche> Well, I guess Natty+
<fta> bratsche, i can probably host it in my builds. but i first need to experiment with the new per-dist quilt patch stack
<bratsche> Awesome
<fta> bratsche, any pointer?
<bratsche> fta: I have it in here: https://launchpad.net/~bratsche/+archive/gtk
<bratsche> fta: But the gtk2 patch isn't in Natty yet.
<fta> btw, do you add a bar at the bottom to display the grip or something?
<bratsche> No.
<bratsche> If an app wants one of those, they should install a statusbar.
<fta> oh, if it's not in gtk natty, will it break chromium if it has your patch
<bratsche> fta: Right, it's only in my PPA so far.
<fta> hm. do you plan to land it in natty?
<fta> +soon
<bratsche> Not really.  There's a bug in the backport patch that I don't have time to fix yet.
<fta> bratsche, hm, i'm not sure what i should do then. i don't want to host a patched gtk2 in my 4 chromium PPAs and it's not in natty either, so don't see how it's of any use to carry the patch in chromium. iirc, it would only work for those who have both PPAs (very unlikely)
<bratsche> fta: So I guess if/when I can get this landed I should talk to you then.
<seb128> fta, you should delay use that until we land the patch in natty
<rodrigo_> test -z "/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages" || /bin/mkdir -p "/opt/extra/src/canonical/packages/gnome-menus/build-area/gnome-menus-2.30.5/debian/tmp/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages"
<rodrigo_>  /bin/bash ../libtool   --mode=install /usr/bin/install -c   gmenu.la '/opt/extra/src/canonical/packages/gnome-menus/build-area/gnome-menus-2.30.5/debian/tmp/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages'
<rodrigo_> libtool: install: error: cannot install `gmenu.la' to a directory not ending in /usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages
<rodrigo_> I guess it got confused by the 2 python versions I have?
<seb128> it should not, we build most things for multiple python version
<rodrigo_> hmm
<seb128> does the current natty version builds for you?
<rodrigo_> let me see
<seb128> could be a bug in the rules
<fta> bratsche, seb128: ok. just ping me when that lands in natty, i'll experiment in my daily PPA 1st, and if it's fine, land it in the next natty update
<rodrigo_> seb128, no, same thing for the current natty version
 * rodrigo_ looks at rules
<bcurtiswx_> is there a way to tell bzr bd to use 3/4 of my CPU's ?
<seb128> vuntz, do you have -as-needed by default in the opensuse gcc?
<vuntz> yes
<seb128> vuntz, and gnome-panel doesn't fail to build?
<vuntz> it built fine, yes
<seb128> hum, k
<seb128> vuntz, can you try something for me?
<seb128> vuntz, https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/676519
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 676519 in gnome-settings-daemon (Ubuntu) "link failing despite the right linking arguments are presents on command line (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> vuntz, can you try if the command and the .c on this bug builds fine for you?
<seb128> gcc -o gnome-update-wallpaper-cache `pkg-config --cflags --libs glib-2.0 gdk-2.0 gconf-2.0 gnome-desktop-2.0` gnome-update-wallpaper-cache.c
<seb128> basically
<seb128> vuntz, it fails to build but works with the .c before the pkg-config call
<seb128> I think gnome-panel fails due to a similar issue
<vuntz> I see the issue for the .c
<vuntz> but I had no issue with gnome-panel
<didrocks> vuntz: don't tell it's my code!!! :p
<vuntz> didrocks: well...
<didrocks> :)
<vuntz> didrocks: I won't say it :-)
<vuntz> can I think it? ;-)
<seb128> let me check if that's because I build with the applet no in process
<seb128> not
<didrocks> vuntz: no ice cream in Lyon!
<didrocks> that's weirdâ¦
<fta> didrocks, doko said "objects before libs on the command line"
<didrocks> fta: we try to understand why the same --as-needed on other distro doesn't have that issue
<didrocks> (for gnome-panel)
<mterry> seb128, do you know of any reason I shouldn't update devhelp as part of the anjuta situation?  anjuta is its library's only rdepends, but I'm wondering if we know of any conflict around webkit or whatever
<rodrigo_> hey vuntz
<fta> did you to swap the arguments?
<fta> +try
<didrocks> fta: that's not the issue there, read the backlog ^
<vuntz> rodrigo_: hola
<seb128> didrocks, /usr/bin/ld: /usr/lib/libgtk-x11-2.0.so: undefined reference to symbol 'XGetWindowAttributes' when building testtray.c
<seb128> your patch might be required ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: ahah!
<didrocks> vuntz: see ^^
<seb128> though that should be X_LIBS not XRANDR, no?
<vuntz> seb128: X_LIBS is in testtray_LDADD
<didrocks> indeed, that sounds more X_LIBS than XRANDR
<seb128> vuntz, I think it's the order issue
<vuntz> well, it works here
<seb128> vuntz, seems tray.la should be before the other libs
<vuntz> and that's the usual LDADD stuff
<seb128> libtray.la
<vuntz> does notification-area-applet build fine?
<seb128> libnotification-area-applet.so does
<seb128> let me try a ./configure && make with the tarball rather than a package build
<vuntz> right, but it's a .so, so it might be different
<seb128>   CCLD   notification-area-applet
<seb128> /usr/bin/ld: /usr/lib/libgtk-x11-2.0.so: undefined reference to symbol 'gdk_window_get_parent'
<vuntz> not sure why I don't see the issue
<seb128> vuntz, yeah, moving libtray.la before X_LIBS in NOTIFICATION_AREA_LDADD works
<vuntz> anyway, if moving the line works, please commit
<seb128> ok, thanks
<didrocks> I'm afraid we will have that issue with plenty of upstream
<seb128> let's see
<seb128> I didn't have it with any other tarball yet today and I did a bunch of GNOME updates
<seb128> rodrigo_, should I do the gnome-desktop update to natty?
<rodrigo_> seb128, 2.91.2 you mean?
<seb128> yes
<rodrigo_> seb128, I can do it, as soon as I finish other stuff I'm doing
<seb128> rodrigo_, you do the shemas one and I do gnome-desktop? I had some change from debian to merge in
<seb128> in gnome-desktop I mean
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<seb128> great
<rodrigo_> man, dh_scour doesn't like me
<seb128> it should not fail builds
<seb128> it might complain though
<devildante> seb128: complaining is the beginning of failures...
<seb128> well pitti said it doesn't fail build if it fails to do its job
<seb128> I think
<rodrigo_> seb128, it stops builds here, with 'too many values to unpack'
<seb128> it should just be a warning
<seb128> you are sure it stops on that?
<seb128> I've seen those as well but they are just warnings
<seb128> on what source?
<rodrigo_> seb128, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/533509/
<rodrigo_> seb128, gnome-applets
<seb128> rodrigo_, can you open a bug and assign it to pitti?
<rodrigo_> yes
<seb128> thanks
<rodrigo_> on which project on LP?
<seb128> rodrigo_, scour
<seb128> well the ubuntu scour package
<seb128> rodrigo_, is there a gnome-applets update?
<rodrigo_> seb128, no, just building it with my patch for migrating null and invest applets to not use deprecated stuff
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> did you solve the null applet question?
<seb128> the applets to list there
<rodrigo_> the null applet thing works, yes, and just waiting for vuntz to accept the patch
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, there's a BonoboId thing on the .panel-applet files
<seb128> so with your patches there is no bonoboui use left?
<rodrigo_> but not so sure about the invest applet changes, and jhbuilt panel crashes for me adding any applet, so building a package to test it for real
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, no more bonobo and libpanel-applet-2
<vuntz> rodrigo_: no no no no, I don't maintain gnome-applets, so you're not waiting for me :-)
<seb128> rodrigo_, great ;-)
<rodrigo_> vuntz, then, why did you answer on the bug??? :D
<rodrigo_> vuntz, you maintain it now, as soon as you answer on a bug :)
<vuntz> rodrigo_: well, you wrote code, you maintain it
<rodrigo_> :)
<rodrigo_> now seriously, who maintains it?
 * rodrigo_ looks at .doap
<vuntz> enrico
<rodrigo_> ah, ok
<vuntz> and desrt, obviously
<rodrigo_> you know his nick on irc?
<vuntz> he'll pretend he doesn't, but desrt likes to lie
<rodrigo_> :D
<vuntz> don't know if he's on irc
<dbarth_> pitti: hey martin, could i ask for a gentle kick of the burn down chart script before my call? ;)
<rodrigo_> seb128, hmm, there's no ubuntu scour package on LP
<rodrigo_> h yes, there is
<rodrigo_> search didn't find it
<seb128> dbarth_, today is an holiday in his part of Germany
<seb128> dbarth_, he's probably not around
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/scour/+bug/676566 will ping pitti tomorrow about it
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 676566 in scour (Ubuntu) "dh_scour stops builds on Natty (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
<rodrigo_> seb128, any way to trick it to not stop in the meanwhile so that I can build stuff?
<seb128> rodrigo_, he will probably see the pings in the IRC backlog
<rodrigo_> seb128, yeah, right
<kklimonda> DBusException: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name :1.217 was not provided by any .service files - this error is misleading, right? I don't think names like ":1.217" are provided by service files..
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, yes, that seems like a bug, although it might mean that the service has died
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, so, it tries to loook for it in .service files
<seb128> rodrigo_, you can set DEB_DH_SCOURL_ARGS
<rodrigo_> ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, I guess DEB_DH_SCOURL_ARGS := --no-act
<seb128> or -Xitemtoexclude
<rodrigo_> ok, thanks
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: if I comment on a resolved notagnome bug is my response sent to developers?
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, yes
<kklimonda> thanks
<seb128> lol
<seb128> didrocks, your cache patch fails to apply to gnome-desktop 2.91.2
<didrocks> vuntz: !!!
<didrocks> vuntz: please look at it, more than 3 times I rebase it in less than a month
<didrocks> :)
<vuntz> I blame rodrigo_ since he did that release
<rodrigo_> heh
<rodrigo_> there was some reverts since 2.91.1
<rodrigo_> so that might be the cause
<didrocks> revert? :/
<Riddell> do we have a maintainer for openoffice these days?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, what's the patch?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, yes, reverted commits that were in 2.91.1
<didrocks> I spent half an hour to adapt to the new version for them being reverting :/
<didrocks> (at midnight!)
<didrocks> snif :/
<seb128> didrocks,  rodrigo_, ok, it's easy to fix this time
<seb128> don't worry I'm doing it
<didrocks> thanks seb128 :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, yeah, changing too much these days
<didrocks> seb128: can you repost it upstream? in case they decided to have a look at it *finally*
<didrocks> vuntz: ^^
<didrocks> christmas is not that far :)
<seb128> didrocks, it's a one liner in the include but I'm lazy to git clone gnome-desktop only for that
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I didn't propose a git format patch for the last change as I was fed up rebasing it
<seb128> ok, I can attach the new patch to the bug
<rodrigo_> you might have to rebase it again, as soon as the reverted commits come back :)
<didrocks> well, if it's one line, it will be ok :)
<rodrigo_> seb128, what's the bug #?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=608419
<ubot2> didrocks: Error: Could not parse XML returned by Gnome: HTTP Error 500: Internal Server Error (http://bugzilla.gnome.org/xml.cgi?id=608419)
<seb128> rodrigo_, should I package 2.91.2 anyway or should I wait for a fixed version?
<rodrigo_> seb128, the new g-s-d would need that 2.91.2, so yes, package it if it's not too much work
<seb128> ok
<rodrigo_> bzr: ERROR: Unknown target distribution: natty
<rodrigo_> hmm, so what file do I need to edit to make bzr know about natty?
<devildante> rodrigo_: maybe you should need to wait until alpha1
<devildante> maybe :
<devildante> :p
<rodrigo_> devildante, I'm already on natty
<devildante> "maybe you should need to wait until alpha1"
<devildante> alpha1 is the key word
<rodrigo_> devildante, hmm, not sure I get it, what do you mean?
<devildante> rodrigo_: afaik, alpha1 is not out yet
<devildante> or am I stupid?
<rodrigo_> devildante, no, you're not, you're very clever, but since I'm already on natty, and I can build natty packages just fine, I guess it's bzr who's the stupid one :D
<devildante> lol
<rodrigo_> this is from bzr merge-upstream
<rodrigo_> bzr bd builds natty packages fine
<dobey> rodrigo_: weird
<didrocks> rodrigo_: you can edit /usr/share/pyshared/bzrlib/plugins/builddeb/util.py
<didrocks> add natty to UBUNTU_RELEASES
<rodrigo_> didrocks, ah, ok
<rodrigo_> didrocks, right, that made it, thanks
<rodrigo_> didrocks, but why bzr bd didn0't need that, and merge-upstream does?
<seb128> iz james_w bog
<seb128> rodrigo_, I've uploaded the new gnome-desktop
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, proposing a merge of gsettings-desktop-schemas soon
<didrocks> rodrigo_: not sure, we should patch everything (pbuilder debuild and othersâ¦) to get one reference, that would be nice :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, right
<rodrigo_> seb128, https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gsettings-desktop-schemas/0_1_1_release/+merge/41075
<rodrigo_> seb128, btw, for source package branches, is the merge proposal the correct way?
<rodrigo_> since they include all upstream changes, it makes the diffs quite big
<seb128> yes
<rodrigo_> ok
<rodrigo_> I just changed debian/changelog :)
<seb128> rodrigo_,
<seb128> - <default>'dmz-aa'</default>
<seb128> 1494	+ <default>'Adwaita'</default>
<rodrigo_> seb128, and do they need to be merged to lp:ubuntu/... branch, or that gets done automatically when the package is uploaded and accepted
<seb128> rodrigo_, do we want to revert that? or use a theme we ship at least?
<seb128> rodrigo_, it's done automatically on upload
<mterry> seb128, do you know of any reason I shouldn't update devhelp as part of the anjuta situation?  anjuta is its library's only rdepends, but I'm wondering if we know of any conflict around webkit or whatever
<rodrigo_> yes, Adwaita is a gtk3 theme, afaik
<seb128> mterry, I don't know about any reason no but I don't know really know what is happening on that
<mterry> seb128, OK, will investigate
<seb128> mterry, ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, approved
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, so do I upload it now?
<seb128> rodrigo_, we will need to make sure we tweak the gsettings default for theme etc when we start having gtk3 softwares built
<seb128> rodrigo_, yes
<rodrigo_> yes
<rodrigo_> seb128, we might need some gsettings stuff like the .gconf-defaults thing
<rodrigo_> ok, uploaded now
<rodrigo_> oh, rejected -> Rejected:
<rodrigo_> The signer of this package is lacking the upload rights for the source package, component or package set in question.
<rodrigo_> it's not part of ubuntu-desktop?
<rodrigo_> seb128, didrocks: so, when you have time, can you do the upload, please?
<rodrigo_> I need to go now, so bbl
<didrocks> ok, enough for today, see you tomorrow (rodrigo_ ping me if you fixed everything listed above tomorrow morning)
<mterry> james_w, what was the page to see if there are bzr import errors for certain packages?
<mterry> I'm going to bookmark it this time
<mterry> http://package-import.ubuntu.com/status/ !
<james_w> yep
<mterry> james_w, I'm interested in this failure: http://package-import.ubuntu.com/status/libunique.html#2010-02-22%2001:00:33.162149
<mterry> seb128, no one has claimed libunique3 right?  anjuta wants that, and it will probably need to be a new source
<seb128> mterry, no, but I'm surprised I though that was deprecated with gtk3
<mterry> seb128, arguably yes.  But it's provided as a crutch while GtkApplication stabilizes and to ease the transition
<seb128> mterry, ok, it's all yours then ;-)
<mterry> seb128, hopefully a one-cycle kind of package
<seb128> yeah
<dobey> Laney: i already added the schme handler mime types to firefox.desktop, so it correctly opens firefox; but the calling app blocks until the command has exitied, it seems.
<Laney> hmm
<dobey> and for some reason, that seems to take some time :(
<kenvandine> mterry, around?
<chrisccoulson> hurry up internet!
<chrisccoulson> :)
<mterry> kenvandine, yah
<chrisccoulson> uploading a 60MB tarball is too slow
<kenvandine> mterry, great... having a problem with dbusmenu
<kenvandine> not even gtk3 related
<kenvandine> just trying to build it for gtk2 i am getting tons of errors, conflicts of definitions between GIR and vapigen
<kenvandine> Gdk-2.0.gir:21644.7-21644.6: error: `Gdk' already contains a definition for `utf8_to_string_target'
<kenvandine>       <parameters>
<kenvandine>       
<kenvandine> gdk-2.0.vapi:2015.2-2015.51: note: previous definition of `utf8_to_string_target' was here
<kenvandine> 	public static unowned string utf8_to_string_target (string str);
<kenvandine> like that
<kenvandine> seen anything like that?
<mterry> kenvandine, yes...  In my case it was a bug with vapigen that a function like foo_new_target_name and foo_target_name were conflicting with same error.  Doesn't quite look like yours is a 'new' namespace issue though
<kenvandine> if i remove some includes from the GIR file it is quieter
<kenvandine> but of course then it can't find things it needs
<mterry> oh wait.  why is the gir aware of the vapi file?
<kenvandine> tedg, says it works on maverick
<kenvandine> it uses the GIR to generate the vapi
<mterry> well, mav was vala-0.10, I believe
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> exactly
<kenvandine> /usr/bin/vapigen --library=DbusmenuGtk-0.2 --pkg gdk-pixbuf-2.0 --pkg gtk+-2.0  --pkg atk --pkg Dbusmenu-Glib-0.2 --vapidir=../libdbusmenu-glib DbusmenuGtk-0.2.tmp.gir
<kenvandine> is what it runs
<mterry> kenvandine, I don't believe vala-0.12's gir support is 100% yet, but the goal would be that you don't need to generate vapis anymore if you have a gir.  So if you don't have active consumers of it yet...
<mterry> kenvandine, OK, I think I see what happened
<kenvandine> tedg, do you know if anyone is using dbusmenu's vapi?  unity maybe?
<tedg> kenvandine, I'm not sure.  Well, anyone using the libindicate VAPI would by inclusion.
<mterry> kenvandine, Dbusmenu-Glib-0.2 is pulling in Gdk-2.0.gir as a dependency and gtk+-2.0 is pulling in gdk-2.0.vapi
<kenvandine> yeah
<mterry> kenvandine, it looks like valac doesn't have such conflict resolution.  So it may be an all or nothing gir or vapi
<tedg> mterry, The odd part is that it did on 0.10....
<kenvandine> so dropping the Gtk include line in the GIR it is much cleaner
<tedg> So it seems that it has to be a 0.12 bug
<kenvandine> but then it fails to find one function from gtk
<kenvandine> so 900 failures in one direction, and 1 failure the other way :)
<mterry> kenvandine, if you convert the other --pkg includess to be gir includes, does that work?  (probably not, but...)
<mterry> so like Gtk-2.0 and GdkPixbuf-2.0 etc
 * kenvandine tries
<TheMuso> chrisccoulson: You have never had to upload ia32-libs then.
 * mterry suspects that valac can't handle the full glory of Gtk-2.0 yet
<chrisccoulson> TheMuso, i have ;)
<chrisccoulson> but i did that from ronne :)
<TheMuso> Ok then stop complaining. :)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<TheMuso> Oh ok
<kenvandine> much cleaner
<kenvandine> Gio-2.0.gir:35338.9-35338.8: error: `SimpleAsyncResult' already contains a definition for `take_error'
 * TheMuso has uploaded ia32-libs on a DSL line with 384kbps upstream at one point. That was an overnight job.
<kenvandine> so it is down to 1 conflict
<micahg> chrisccoulson: speaking of 60MB tarballs have you done any testing on maverick with that build?
<chrisccoulson> micahg - nope ;)
<micahg> chrisccoulson: more fun for me I guess :)
<chrisccoulson> micahg - you might want to base firefox-next on what is in the dailies atm. i had to revert quite a bit of stuff for natty :(
<mterry> kenvandine,  that's my error!  :)  there's a bugzilla bug for that one
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> sigh
<kenvandine> link?
<mterry> kenvandine, I don't know the workaround for it though
<micahg> chrisccoulson: hmm, I guess that's a good point, otherwise, I'll have to do funny upgrade magic
<mterry> kenvandine, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=634588
<ubot2> Gnome bug 634588 in Bindings "Gio-2.0.gir 'take_error' parse error" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<chrisccoulson> micahg - yeah, and firefox-trunk is what i *want* the packaging to look like :)
<chrisccoulson> it's just a shame i can't make it work properly
<mterry> kenvandine, JÃ¼rg's comment is a bit terse.  Not sure whether it's being worked on
<kenvandine> mterry, so no work around yet...
<kenvandine> i was just going to say that
<mterry> kenvandine, what's the one thing it complains about if you drop the gtk include from the gir?
<kenvandine> i have to actually remove several things to get down to the one error
<kenvandine> there are actually two errors, but just one from gtk
<kenvandine> i'll have to try again to get it
<seb128> re
<seb128> kenvandine, mterry: you can maybe try asking #vala about the issue?
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<seb128> robert_ancell, hello
<seb128> robert_ancell, there?
<robert_ancell> hey
<seb128> robert_ancell, how are you?
<seb128> robert_ancell, I didn't have time to work on rb today, what error did you get?
<seb128> I can have a go to it tomorrow
<seb128> was that a build issue or run time issue?
<robert_ancell> seb128, build issue, can't remember what it was
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I will try tomorrow
<seb128> robert_ancell, otherwise I tried nautilus
<robert_ancell> I think it was a linker issue (there have been a lot of those due to the --as-needed change) but I couldn't work out why it was occurring
<seb128> it's having issues which I think could be due to gtk version conflicts
<robert_ancell> seb128, oh, does it not run?
<seb128> robert_ancell, using .so which have gtk symbols (I think) take it down
<seb128> like try to open the properties of a video or pdf file
<seb128> those which are just adding a context menu entry seems to be ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, mterry: ^
<seb128> (if you followed that discussion the other day)
<robert_ancell> do you know if that's a plugin?
<seb128> yes, those a .so installed by totem or evince
 * robert_ancell boots his vm
<seb128> ls /usr/lib/nautilus/...
<robert_ancell> right, so we need them updated too
<seb128> ok, that's what I though
<seb128> it's difficult to know what to do
<robert_ancell> hmm, I just tried the example content and that worked ok
<kenvandine> DbusmenuGtk-0.2.tmp.gir:0.0-0.0: error: The type name `Gtk.MenuClass' could not be found
<kenvandine> DbusmenuGtk-0.2.tmp.gir:0.0-0.0: error: The type name `Dbusmenu.ClientClass' could not be found
<kenvandine> mterry, that is the other error
<seb128> robert_ancell, do you get a video tab?
<robert_ancell> no
<seb128> hum
<seb128> is totem installed?
<robert_ancell> looking
<mterry> kenvandine, well, presumably the Dbusmenu one could go away by including its vapi file as a --pkg.  I'm not sure why the gtk+-2.0 vapi file doesn't have Gtk.MenuClass?
<robert_ancell> no totem
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, install it
<seb128> or try on a pdf if you have evince
<robert_ancell> there isn't a PDF handy on this vm
<seb128> open a firefox and google for one?
<robert_ancell> right, got the crash opening a video
<seb128> ok
<robert_ancell> I'll update totem and evince in the PPA today
<seb128> I didn't debug much
<kenvandine> so we need to figure out the Gio thing... i'll try to look into that later tonight
<seb128> but I've the feeling it's the gtk version mismatch
<kenvandine> i gotta run for a bit
<seb128> kenvandine, what gio?
<kenvandine> the GIR problem
<kenvandine> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=634588
<ubot2> Gnome bug 634588 in Bindings "Gio-2.0.gir 'take_error' parse error" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<robert_ancell> I'll respond to your email, but this is the sort of thing I'm worried about if we include any GNOME3 apps, they really will drag in eachother
<seb128> kenvandine, oh ok
<seb128> robert_ancell, I've been trying to build a comprehensive list of what brings what in the whiteboard
<kenvandine> seb128, i'll be getting a late start tomorrow, parent teacher conference... in case anyone is looking for me :)
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah I've been following that
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, RAOF, meeting?
<TheMuso> Sure.
 * kenvandine waves!
<seb128> kenvandine, ok
<seb128> kenvandine, see you tomorrow!
<seb128> robert_ancell, well it makes me nervous as well, we can either go for it and deal with issues as they come
<seb128> robert_ancell, or keep things in the ppa and keep working on those sets of things which need to go together until mid-cycle
<seb128> then we need to decide
<robert_ancell> seb128, I think the latter is safest
<seb128> but we will probably have a comprehensive idea of what are the sets and the changes by then
<robert_ancell> seb128, perhaps we should encourage people to use the PPA so we get good testing
<seb128> right
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Yup.
 * robert_ancell reads the notes from the western ed.
<seb128> robert_ancell, you do your meetings one day later than us now?
<seb128> the meeting yesterday was very light in any case, jasoncwarner go screwed by the dst and calendars
<seb128> so he missed it
<robert_ancell> So I've just been working on GNOME2.32 stuff and GNOME3 stuff.  Getting GNOME 2.32.1 into natty, and 2.91 into a PPA so we can test it.  Just lots of stuff to work through
<seb128> and we didn't have lot to cover otherwise
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, not sure why we're one day late, I propose we move it back
<robert_ancell> I'm working towards getting the latest Yelp into the PPA so TheMuso can test it for a11y coverage
<chrisccoulson> excellent, i've finished all my work items for beta 1 :)
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Sounds good.
<robert_ancell> We're really keen to use it because the current yelp is not good
<TheMuso> I second the proposal to move the meeting back a day, I'll just see if Jason is able to do so...
<TheMuso> Yeah I can understand that.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, how is a11y going in general?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, congrats ;-)
<robert_ancell> (and sound)
<seb128> robert_ancell, I would say the current version is so slow it's not usable anyway
<robert_ancell> seb128, agreed
<seb128> so it's either useless for everybody or useless if you need accessiblity
<chrisccoulson> hmm, anybody know when we get the first language packs for natty?
<seb128> so I would say to upgrade even if it's an a11y regression
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you should check with dpm and pitti tomorrow but I'm not sure rosetta is open yet for natty
<chrisccoulson> that's ok then. gives me a bit of time to get the ff-4.0 translations ready
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: a11y is going ok, you may have seen my reply to Seb's mail about webkit, mentioning at-spi via dbus.
<TheMuso> I have been testing the dbus implementation, and performance is a major issue that needs sorting out.
<seb128> TheMuso, did you get any upstream reply on whether somebody is adressing those speed issues? or if at least they are known issues?
<TheMuso> seb128: Nothing yet. They are known issues, but nothing about addressing them yet.,
<TheMuso> I poked one of the devs on IRC< but I'll also send an email to the list.
<seb128> ok, let us know if,when they reply
<TheMuso> Will do.
<seb128> thanks
<robert_ancell> RAOF, how is X land?  Also, do you know about the version of banshee in natty?
<seb128> robert_ancell, 1.9 got uploaded today
<robert_ancell> oh, it just got updated :)
<TheMuso> Oh and sound wise, nothing really drastic, just status quo, pulling fixes from upstream for pulse, triaging audio bugs. :)
<RAOF> Ok, I don't know about the version of banshee in natty, then :)
<TheMuso> But since I am rotating I won't be giving as much to sound this cycle.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, cool. ok
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you try the new g-c-c in the ppa yet?
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, it needs some work
<RAOF> X land is pretty much in sync with Debian.  Major version changes are waiting on the existence of major versions upstream.
 * Laney hears banshee and pops up
<Laney> waiting for mono -4
 * Laney fades away again
<seb128> robert_ancell, how much of an improvement do you think it is?
<seb128> it's hard to balance issues and work against win in that GNOME3 story
<RAOF> I'm polishing a patch for mesa to slim the DRI drivers by 30MB.
<robert_ancell> Laney, the mono packaging seems to be well taken care of by the community, is that correct?
<robert_ancell> seb128, not an improvement until it's all there functionality wise
<robert_ancell> RAOF, nice :)
<Laney> I think so, until you hear differently ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, my gut feeling is that we should delay until mid-cycle and work in the ppa
<robert_ancell> seb128, agreed
<seb128> robert_ancell, we don't have so much to do but at some point unity work will start reaching us
<Laney> you can switch the seeds now but we have 1800k or so more of savings to come with -4
<robert_ancell> seb128, I think there may be a risk of it not being finished (like the rest of GNOME3, so I wouldn't want us to be caught in that)
<seb128> it's just taking time to get started
<RAOF> How much change is involved in the new g-c-c?
<Laney> so we thought we'd wait for that
<seb128> RAOF, quite some, they embed the different capplets in it
<seb128> like they started merging the nautilus automount dialog in it
<RAOF> Is it the near-total rewrite that it appears to be?  Because some of the multimonitor WIs touch the Monitors capplet, and so are affected by which one we pick.
<seb128> so it impacts nautilus now
<robert_ancell> RAOF, it's got some nice design changes which are good, it's just going to take time for it all to be completed
<seb128> they are starting working on getting the screen and power settings there
<robert_ancell> RAOF, it's a mix of rewriting and refactoring
<seb128> so gpm will need to be changed etc
<seb128> robert_ancell, I'm wondering if we could make your g-s-d writes the font key in gsettings at least
<seb128> g-s-d g-c-c rather
<seb128> it would unblock some of the applications updates
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, it's worth looking at - open a bug
<seb128> I will chat with rodrigo about it tomorrow
<seb128> the other option is to not bother much until mid cycle and work on the ppa
<robert_ancell> RAOF, TheMuso, ok, that's my attempt at running a meeting.  Are you guys familiar with Scrum (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scrum_%28development%29#Meetings) - I'm thinking of proposing that as a meeting structure
<seb128> until we start to get unity tasks
<TheMuso> Not familiar with it, but will have a read.
<robert_ancell> seb128, I think the PPA is our best investment.  And yes, we might just have to drop it when Unity comes :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, let's do the meeting thing and then we can go back to chatting about GNOME if we want
<robert_ancell> seb128, I think we're done, anyone else got something to say?
<RAOF> At what point will we know whether or not the new g-c-c is going in natty?  Because that'll determine whether I hack on the existing monitors capplet, or the (quite different) new one.
<seb128> robert_ancell, this scrum structure seems rather apprioriate for a team working on the same things
<seb128> by a quick glance on the wiki
<seb128> like the unity team
<seb128> it would not really fit people working on let's say, GNOME, X, firefox
 * TheMuso agrees.
<seb128> RAOF, join the list of people asking, some of the dx changes are pending on that as well
<seb128> which is one of the reasons why I would like us to decide early if we cdan
<robert_ancell> RAOF, probably mid-cycle, but it's worth hedging your bets and adding a patch to the PPA if it's a small amount of work
<seb128> can
<seb128> RAOF, I would do the patch for the new version and declare it will land next cycle if it happens that doesn't land this cycle
<seb128> lot of users will run the GNOME3 ppa imho anyway if that's not landing in natty
<RAOF> Yeah, that's the guaranteed least-work scenario.
<robert_ancell> I'm thinking scrum precisely because we practically none of our work overlaps, we just inform eachother of what's happening and if anyone can help out.  The scrum structure just seems an efficient way of communicating that
<robert_ancell> (I'm only referring to the daily scrum part on the wiki)
<seb128> that seems approriate for daily meetings
<seb128> like the dx team is doing
<seb128> they do a short summary call every morning with what they did
<robert_ancell> seb128, can you explain how they do there ones?
<seb128> what they are blocked on
<seb128> what they do next
<seb128> they go through the team members, a few minutes each
<RAOF> FWIW, I wouldn't *mind* a daily 15 minute meeting, but I don't think it'd be particularly fruitful.
<seb128> and each teach member list what he has been working on, what issue he has, and what he will work on next
<cyphermox> robert_ancell, seb128: that's more or less what we do by adding what we've worked on in the wiki for the weekly meetings
<seb128> well it's useful for dx because lot of those guys work on the same code
<seb128> it's a bit less useful if you work on X and GNOME for example
<seb128> the overlap is quite small usually
<cyphermox> I know (from speaking with mathiaz) that the server team heavily uses a lot of these techniques, it could be interesting to know more about how they hold their meetings ;)
<seb128> you also need to be in the same timezones to do that
<robert_ancell> cyphermox, do you find the wiki list useful?  I find it a little dense for reading a weeks worth at once
<seb128> robert_ancell, the foundation team used (still do?) to do something similar for their weekly meeting
<seb128> we did it for a while as well in the desktop team
<cyphermox> robert_ancell, I agree. just saying I guess it was the point, though it's missing blockers and stuff, which we'd cover in the irc meeting AOB, my guess
<seb128> (or maybe that was when there was only one distro team)
<seb128> going to the team members
<seb128> having each members giving a few bullet points of the noticable things of the week
<seb128> things that he,she worked on or that could interest other people
<seb128> we just had issues that if you give 3 minutes each and you have 10 people to go through it's taking a while and not so interesting compared to just read the activity reports
<robert_ancell> The other thing, is the eastern edition being behind the main meeting means we're not really making decisions in it.  If you accumulated a weeks worth of daily standups and brought those to the western edition it would be more useful
<seb128> robert_ancell, do you try to solve and issue or just make the meetings useful?
<Zdra> hi, any idea how I can get theming working with gtk3 app? I've backporter the gtk3 pacakge on maverick
<seb128> and -> an
<seb128> Zdra, there is nothing to do, just install a gtk3 theme
<robert_ancell> seb128, making them more worthwhile, and making sure they meet the goal of communicating to everyone (including those not at the meeting) what we're working on, what the problems are
<seb128> Zdra, you probably need the gtk engine for the theme you need built on gtk3
<seb128> Zdra, you need a gtkrc in the gtk3 path as well
<seb128> natty has both of those
<robert_ancell> Zdra, you just need to symlink /usr/share/themes/*/gtk-2.0 to gtk-3.0
<seb128> you need to build the engine for gtk3 as well
<seb128> robert_ancell, do you think we need a meeting for that?
<seb128> the issue with meetings are the timezones
<seb128> not sure if we could solve that by changing the activity report format or the weekly wiki page
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Do you mean having a daily eastern edition and then batching that up for the weekly western one?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yes
<seb128> robert_ancell, we don't really decide anything in meeting btw
<seb128> we just usually try to do a status update
<robert_ancell> seb128, the issue is also scaling - even if we were all in one timezone the meeting wouldn't be more effective.  And the weekly summary is too big I think
<robert_ancell> RAOF, note it might not necessarily be daily, but I think that's worth trying (considering it's only 15 mins)
<seb128> do you think we should have one summary for everybody?
<Zdra> seb128, robert_ancell: thx
<robert_ancell> seb128, of the most important things to keep the list digestable.  Perhaps a list of "good things" (i.e. new stuff) and "bad things" (i.e. problems to be solved)
<RAOF> What is the purpose of the summary?
<seb128> ok, so not an activity report summary
<seb128> but rather a "things other people should know"
<robert_ancell> RAOF, to communicate to the team what is going on, so we have good visibility and can help eachother out with problems
<seb128> things which will affect them or where you might need help from someone?
<seb128> like don't dump the list of GNOME point release updates we did
<seb128> but things like "gtk3 landed, we need to update those..."
 * jasoncwarner back
<seb128> hey jasoncwarner
<RAOF> Which means the "good things", "bad things" lists might be a more effective way of communicating?
<seb128> jasoncwarner, ^ you should read the few screens backlog
<robert_ancell> so, I'd expect something like this.  There is a list that everyone in the team can easily read (and including people in the community).  I contains new things you might want to know about (e.g. unity now available) and issues (like having problems with upgrading this package, and investigating)
<jasoncwarner> fwiw (catching up on conversation) that is how I used to try to run meetings ... when we had an india operation and a Phoenix one...local teams would do daily standups and send summaries to other team. summaries were things like
<seb128> jasoncwarner, it's an interesting topic, would be nice to have your opinion
<jasoncwarner> 1. we did x, y and z
<jasoncwarner> 2. we are blocked on this, need help
<seb128> jasoncwarner, ignore me, seems you did already ;-)
<seb128> well that work fine for dx for example because they have full teams working on the same things
<jasoncwarner> seb128: yup
<seb128> like the india and the phoenix team have high bandwith communication and a status on one project
<jasoncwarner> seb128: we had two teams, 12 hours apart, working on the same code base
<jasoncwarner> different here
<seb128> right
<seb128> I know I've been trying recently to keep communication going for the GNOME3 updates
<robert_ancell> here we're both working simultaneously on the same thing (ubuntu) and nothing (very little of our day-to-day work overlaps)
<seb128> but it's not easy
<seb128> I send emails on random topics and Cc people who I think are useful to have in the conversation
<seb128> usually robert_ancell, rodrigo_, mterry and sometime some others
<seb128> but I feel it's suboptimal
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, we have a mini GNOME team within desktop now it seems
<robert_ancell> I feel like it must be really hard for the community to get visibility into what we do
<seb128> yes
<seb128> I've been thinking about that and I tried to update the blueprint whiteboard regularly
<seb128> but that's still suboptimal
<robert_ancell> how about we take a meeting task to discuss this at the sprint?  I think it would be easier to plan this in a high-bandwidth environment
<seb128> robert_ancell, well, are you interested by what happens in Xorg or firefox?
<rickspencer3> the team meetings don't take of it?
<jasoncwarner> how much information is comprised in that list, seb128? for instance, like, what is useful out of your day-to-day that you would like a broader audience to know about.?
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes
<robert_ancell> seb128, because sometime what xorg does affects me (so I need to be prepared), and other times there are things in xorg that I have an opinion on (because it affects me) or I can help out with (because I might randomly have some skills/interests there).  And the same vice-versa I assume?
<RAOF> Right.
<seb128> rickspencer3, well, we have different things to covert there, weekly status update, activity tracking from a manager perspective, communication with interested people
<seb128> robert_ancell, right, but that for sure doesn't happen every day or week
<seb128> usually it's like "new xserver abi breakage will happen in 2 months"
<seb128> and there is not a lot of things in those 2 months that impact what we do
<seb128> it's just standard edger updates, merges on debian, bug fixing, etc
<rickspencer3> maybe having an Eastern and Western Edition is not quite the right factoring?
<robert_ancell> seb128, sure, and that's ok because if nothing interesting is happening it doesn't need to be in the list (or maybe we just have a placeholder - X maintenance)
<rickspencer3> like you could have a GNOME edition and an everything else edition?
<rickspencer3> are any of the GNOMEy folks based in the US?
<rickspencer3> (just an idea to throw out)
<seb128> well seems we have several communications needs
<rickspencer3> :)
<seb128> we need a way to let people have an idea of what's happening
<seb128> and we need higher bandwith talks for subteams
<seb128> like GNOME
<seb128> those are 2 different things imho
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, I think having the one meeting is useful because the meeting is about the Ubuntu product, not so much the specific technologies.  We already have informal GNOME meetings on IRC
<seb128> they don't fit in the same meeting format
<robert_ancell> seb128, agreed
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, regarding eastern vs. western - I think that's just unavoidable if we want to sleep :)
<RAOF> This makes sense to me.
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, well, Europe + Aus work, and US + Aus works, but Europe + US + Aus does not work
<rickspencer3> just saying
<robert_ancell> right
<rickspencer3> anyway, I was just throwing it out there
<seb128> I think one thing we learnt from years and meeting format is that real time meeting for status update are not the right format
<seb128> it's hard to get people together and usually it turns to be boring
<seb128> it's easier to read status updates somewhere online at your convenient time when you start your day
<robert_ancell> seb128, right, that's the idea with the fixed 15 min timeframe in scrum, but this would certainly be harder in the western edition
<rickspencer3> but meetings mean people can ask questions easy, and everyone can see the question and answer
<seb128> right, meetings are useful
<seb128> they are just not useful for status updates imho
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, and that's the downside of the meeting split, because sometimes the questions need to cross hemispheres
<seb128> they are useful to have dynamic interactions and discussions
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, right, thus my suggestion that there may be a chance that a functional split may be doable
<seb128> or we should try to have subteams meeting with interested people every now and then or when required
<Sarvatt> has anyone with an intel GPU on natty noticed any screen freezing problems?
<seb128> Sarvatt, I didn't
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, I have i965, have been running Natty for 24 hours, no freezes
<Sarvatt> RAOF: disable page flip patch might still be needed (see #intel-gfx) :(
<seb128> robert_ancell, we sort of do that in the western land
<seb128> robert_ancell, we start all around the same time, give or take 1 hour
<seb128> and we do chat a lot on IRC
<RAOF> Sarvatt: Yeah, seen that.  But it's much, much better now, 'cause everyone hasn't been screaming :)
<seb128> we tend to start the day by saying hello and checking how people are doing
<seb128> it's not a formal meeting
<robert_ancell> seb128, is it getting harder with the team getting bigger?
<seb128> but I usually know what most of the people on the chan do in the hour I join
<seb128> yes
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, but you seem to know everything that's going on anyway, you have some sort of implant ;)
<Sarvatt> thanks, if anyone does please yell at RAOF or me because we know the "fix" :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, lol
<Amaranth> Wow some of you are here rather late
<seb128> robert_ancell, but yeah, I'm spending time reading quite some channel and trying to engage people to know what's going onj
<robert_ancell> seb128, I haven't the patience for that, I need clear summaries :)
<Sarvatt> RAOF: yeah but we aren't even at A1 yet this time around so testing is kind of limited, we have exactly 0 natty bugs in the work queue :)
<seb128> I've to admit it's suboptimal
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, can we turn that in action items? ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, do you want to suggest goals and way to achieve those and get those on the agenda for the next meeting?
<robert_ancell> seb128, I'd like to see the output of the meetings being more publically useful, i.e. sites like OMG could use it to say "this is what's happening" (as opposed to some of the hearsay that occurs now) and new contributors could find out what is happening and how they could fit in
<robert_ancell> seb128, ues
<robert_ancell> I'll summarise this in email and send it to the desktop list
<seb128> robert_ancell, well, do we need meeting for that? or is that some additional?
<robert_ancell> seb128, I think I'll raise the ideas on email, and propose we discuss it at the sprint?  It's not optimal because it's not an open event, so we should perhaps also do something at the next UDS
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I'm mainly brainstorming at this point
<seb128> but I think we need different things
<robert_ancell> sure, me too
<seb128> we need a common time with people around where we can discuss things
<robert_ancell> We need to capture the list of "why are we having meetings and what do we produce from them"
<seb128> that's the main purpose of the meetings we have now
<seb128> but we also need a better way to communicate what's going on
<seb128> what are the issues
<seb128> and maybe what people could help on
<jasoncwarner> seb128: those are the two key points, which IMO are a bit distinct.
<seb128> right
<seb128> that's why I suggest the meeting is fine as it is now
<seb128> it's a common time to have people together for questions or discussions
<jasoncwarner> something else we did was have functional team meetings, like rickspencer3 said, and then have a representative present at the other team meetings so give input
<seb128> but we don't address the second part
<robert_ancell> perhaps we could define what gets written into the wiki more clearly, to increase the quality of the output
<jasoncwarner> this allowed not everyone to need to goto all themeetings, but still put the various teams together.
<seb128> we will have an hard time for that
<seb128> we have GNOME team people in europe, us and .au
<jasoncwarner> yeah
<seb128> it's hard to have me, rodrigo_, mterry and robert_ancell together
<seb128> like I usually need to come back at 11pm when I want to chat with robert_ancell
<seb128> or I would need to wake earlier
<seb128> robert_ancell, well, we should first define the role of the activity reports
<robert_ancell> yes
<jasoncwarner> something I asked robert_ancell was if there was a way to update someones IRC status to say what they were working on. Perhaps not IRC, but some other simple mechanism (simple b/c otherwise people won't do it) that says 1. what they are working on 2. if they are stuck on something and 3. if they need help on something or from someone
<seb128> they were rather meant as a way for management to track who is doing what during the week I think
<seb128> not as a way to communicate what we are doing to other people
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner, rickspencer3, so, as management, are the activity reports useful?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, they were to me, yes
<jasoncwarner> robert_ancell: I don't know enough to judge that, for me the burndowns are what I look at everyday.  The part I look for in activity reports are blockers/blockages/challenges.
<rickspencer3> but I expected they were generally useful, not just for me
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, if they were abbreviated to be easier to read, would that be a problem?
<rickspencer3> also, I think it provided a degree of transparency to the community to see specifics
<jasoncwarner> rickspencer3: good point
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, well, that would be hypothetical, it's not really in my domain anymore, it's jasoncwarner's problem now ;)
<rickspencer3> I also think they are good to write, as it keeps you cognizant about making progress on specific goals
<RAOF> jasoncwarner: Some form of status.net thing would work for that; for bonus points, hook in something like hamster.
<seb128> jasoncwarner, <jasoncwarner> something I asked robert_ancell was if there was a way to update someones IRC status to say what they were working on.
<rickspencer3> so, generally, a good practice
<seb128> jasoncwarner, I don't think IRC is the right medium
<jasoncwarner> seb128: probably not
<seb128> I was suggesting to robert_ancell to try something like etherpad last week
<rickspencer3> status.net is exactly for that kind of task, I think
<seb128> gobby like but on a website
 * jasoncwarner looks up status.net
<robert_ancell> I feel with the status reports, if you're working on maintenance then you feel compelled to list all the packages that you updated, but it's overly detailed and just fills the reports with fluff
<JanC> status.net is teh software behind identi.ca (twitter-like)
<jasoncwarner> is this like twitter but without all the 4square garbage? ;)
<seb128> robert_ancell, well I do it because I use the report as a way to tell my manager that I didn't slack during the week :p
<RAOF> There's a canonical status.net instance, isn't there?  We wouldn't want a private one, but it suggests that it wouldn't be hard to set up?
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, which is the exact sort of work that's counterproductive!
<seb128> robert_ancell, which brings back to the question of the audiance for the report
<robert_ancell> seb128, and I propose that team members and the community are the most important audience
<robert_ancell> seb128, etherpad might be a really good medium for this, in that we write the report duing the week, and edit it as we go
<robert_ancell> and post the final copy to the wiki
<RAOF> We already have weekly 1-1 meetings with Jason and a burn-down chart; does that cover all the manager-visibility required?
<robert_ancell> seb128, in this way, if you want the high bandwidth info, you follow the pad, otherwise you just read the edited wiki version
<jasoncwarner> RAOF: I don't need more, personally, if I do I will ask (I'm not shy). My feeling is that the weekly meetings were a digest for the community and other groups
<jasoncwarner> like, I'll read what is going on in the other teams just to see if something will impact our team or if I have an interest/knowledge of an area where I might be able to offer insight
 * TheMuso notes he has trouble with etherpad and orca/firefox, due to it being a live update, should be it be used collaboratively.
<seb128> robert_ancell, well I guess it's useful in a distributed environement to have somewhat a detailed view of what people do, otherwise it's hard to see who is working or not
<seb128> robert_ancell, not my call though, I will happily do what jasoncwarner asks us to do
<seb128> RAOF, right, there is a canonical one
<seb128> jasoncwarner, it seems so, I don't know enough about it to comment ;-)
<seb128> TheMuso, you have trouble with dynamic editing?
<JanC> seb128: rather Orca has issues with it
<seb128> TheMuso, the notes from our team will probably mean it will be edited a few minutes a day
<TheMuso> seb128: In a browser, because the screen reader has to refresh its knowledge of the page layout/text boxes, which usually throws one back at the top of the page.
<seb128> I guess you could open it once a day and copy paste to a text editor to read it
<seb128> I don't think it's going to be dynamic enough to be an issue to follow
<seb128> robert_ancell, jasoncwarner, RAOF: ok, so seems we have an agreement that activity report should be community focussed
<seb128> ie be useful to let people what's going on
<robert_ancell> yes
<TheMuso> seb128: yeah makes sense, that should be manageable.
<seb128> jasoncwarner, can you communicate that to the team?
<seb128> email, or next week meeting topic I guess
<jasoncwarner> seb128: sure...figured I would summarize this in an email for the team and to solicit feedback on format.
<jasoncwarner> seb128: probably both :)
<robert_ancell> I'm taking that action
<rickspencer3> status .net has a super easy API, and an rss feed
<seb128> seems robert_ancell was going to do that
<rickspencer3> so writing tools for it is dead simple
<rickspencer3> it can be done quite ..
<rickspencer3> .
<rickspencer3> .
<seb128> quickly?
<rickspencer3> wait for it ..
<seb128> ;-)
<jasoncwarner> :)
<rickspencer3> :)
<seb128> ok, so next thing to sort then is where to take note
<seb128> etherpad, status.net, ...
<seb128> I've no strong opinion there
<JanC> TheMuso: seems like it's possible to export html/txt versions of an etherpad document using a fixed URL, that might be useful for you
<seb128> I guess that can be discussed in the email discussion robert_ancell will start
<jasoncwarner> seb128: yeah
<TheMuso> JanC: yes that would.
<rickspencer3> dang, I wish the tubes API was easier to use
<JanC> e.g. http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/test --> http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/ep/pad/export/test/latest?format=txt
<rickspencer3> it would be fun to write up a collaboration app for this
<seb128> rickspencer3, don't reinvent gobby ;-)
<rickspencer3> seb128, well, I think it's not gobby
<RAOF> Unless you can make it work, of course!
<rickspencer3> haha
<rickspencer3> it would be fun to add features like being draw, put on images, in addition to text, but also have it be a timeline
<RAOF> Some of that funky diffing from UDS-M would be awesome.
<chrisccoulson> would somebody mind approving xulrunner-2.0 once it appears in the NEW queue? :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm about to go to bed but I will do it first thing tomorrow if pitti or something else doesn't beat me to it
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - cool, thanks
<seb128> something->somebody
<chrisccoulson> i think i might call it a night in a bit
<chrisccoulson> before everybody starts telling me their browser is broken ;)
<seb128> yeah, it's late enough, I'm going to bed now
<seb128> lol
<seb128> 'night everybody
<chrisccoulson> 'night!
<RAOF> Night.\
<jasoncwarner> seb128: night!
<JanC> RAOF: that was cool indeed, but would need porting from Mac OS X to Ubuntu first  ;)
<RAOF> Yeah, well.  I'm sure Rick has *plenty* of spare time to write an awesome animated timeline diff :)
<bryceh> heh
<JanC> maybe sabdfl can pay her to port it (SoC-like)  ;)
<bryceh> robert_ancell, fwiw, we did daily standup meetings on the Launchpad bugs team... it sort of made sense since we were all working on the same codebase and sometimes could share notes on issues we were stuck on... but 80% of the time it felt like we were rambling on about stuff just to fill the time.  For the desktop team, I think the amount of cross-pollenation would be minimal and the likelihood of fillage high
<RAOF> Hm, cool.  The first hail.
<robert_ancell> bryceh, how long did the meetings go on?  This is why I was proposing the scrum format - the time is limited and it's ok so say one line if that's all that is done
<robert_ancell> (I find IRC is an awful medium for meetings because it's very hard to tell who is active)
<bryceh> robert_ancell, in theory they were 15 minute meetings.  In practice, we found the meetings tended to drag out for up to an hour or more a day
<robert_ancell> bryceh, perhaps an IRC bot is needed - like the one used at UDS
<RAOF> Or we could play with something like wave until it's turned off?
<bryceh> fwiw these meetings were via mumble
<bryceh> (with the inevitable first 5 min spent waiting for everyone to get headphones straightened and mikes positioned and so on *grin*)
<robert_ancell> heh
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-11-18
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, you instigator you
<rickspencer3> rocking the weekly meeting boat, and poor jasoncwarner just started!
<rickspencer3> :)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, heh, disruption is good for industry right? :)
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, you know we frown upon taking independent steps to problem solving
<rickspencer3> if you see a problem, bury your head in the sand!
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, seriously, thanks for stepping up to move the state of the art forward
<jasoncwarner> rickspencer3: don't worry boss..I wrote down his name under the "hooligan" category
<rickspencer3> I think we'll have more and more people in the .au tzs
<rickspencer3> so, it's worth thinking about
<rickspencer3> jasoncwarner, how long have you been up man?
<jasoncwarner> rickspencer3: I get up around 3:15 or so, try to log on by 3:30, which is 9am your time (I think)
<rickspencer3> I see
<rickspencer3> so you are time shifted even earlier than I am
<rickspencer3> but I guess that gives you overlap with everyone
<rickspencer3> I hope you can keep it up without going crazy
<jasoncwarner> so I can get us/UK morning coverage in the early morning and then .au morning
<jasoncwarner> two days in and I haven't cracked yet ;)
<jasoncwarner> actually it seems ok...I'm about to take a break and take my son to the park and then get back online for when Pitti starts around 6pm
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner, do you get up at that time every day?
<jasoncwarner> chrisccoulson: just the past two so far, but since I'm old I have to go to bed around 9pm anyway...I mean...it is 11am here and I am getting ready to eat dinner and play bingo ;)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> i normally go to bed at around 3am
<chrisccoulson> i should probably sleep earlier really ;)
<jasoncwarner> I don't know how you do it with a kid, man! Those things are like freakin' alarm clocks to getting you up early. And since my wife actually leaves the house for work (unlike me), somehow it becomes my responsibility to get him up and ready for daycare in the morning...go figure !
<chrisccoulson> my daughter has started to sleep in now (she wakes up at around 730am)
<chrisccoulson> although, she did get up at 630am this morning
<bryceh> rickspencer3, the CodeReview schedule is requiring people to work during the week they're required to take vacation....  ouch
<rickspencer3> bryceh, oops
<rickspencer3> I think daniel can move that around :)
<bryceh> rickspencer3, also did you mean to have it cycle <1 month?  looks like five of us are listed to do two stints each month
<rickspencer3> bryceh, tbh, I didn't look to closely at the schedule
<rickspencer3> it was a dholbach creation
<rickspencer3> but, no, it was not intended that people do it twice in a month
<rickspencer3> I think it was probably just a clerical error
<bryceh> looks like it's assuming 28 day months, probably should assume 31 days
<bryceh> rickspencer3, since I've been doing my sponsorship time on xorg patches, if I'm going to do this instead going forward, shall I just sub ubuntu-sponsors to the still outstanding xorg patches (there's about 30 currently)?
<rickspencer3> bryceh, hmmm
<rickspencer3> it's a good question
<rickspencer3> I was hoping that things working well, like xorg sponsorhsip and #ubuntu-desktop sponsorship in general wouldn't really change
<rickspencer3> unfortunately, I need to step away right now
<rickspencer3> maybe we could talk it over tomorrow?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, sure
<TheMuso> RAOF: What hardware was xserver-xorg-video-geode for?
<RAOF> Some crazy old serverish chip, from memory.
<RAOF> Ah, yeah.  It's an integrated chip on some AMD serverish motherboards.
<RAOF> Oh, apparently used in the OLPC XO
<RAOF> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geode_%28processor%29
<RAOF> TheMuso: Why do you ask? :)
<TheMuso> Just curious, afterr seeing your SRU bug filing, no more.
<TheMuso> after
<didrocks> good morning!
<nisshh> hey didrocks
<didrocks> hey nisshh, how are you?
<nisshh> didrocks, pretty good, i have a question for you in #quickly though :)
<nisshh> and yourself?
<didrocks> nisshh: I'm fine, thanks, rainy outside but fine :)
<nisshh> hehe :)
<hyperair> mvo: pnig
<hyperair> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/banshee/+bug/629532 <-- i'm just wondering if adding an Enhances: field to debian/control would resolve this issue.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 629532 in banshee (Ubuntu) "Add-ons not listed in software-center (affects: 1) (heat: 45)" [Low,New]
<mvo> hyperair: enhances should work, yes, let me double check
<mvo> hyperair: yep, that will work, I commented in the bugreport, the enhances is nicer as it does not require touching the banshee package if a new addon becomes availalble. but a combination of the too will work too
<hyperair> mvo: okay thanks
<hyperair> mvo: i've just committed the change for Enhances:
<mvo> thanks!
<rodrigo_> morning
<seb128> hello there
<mvo> hey seb128
<seb128> hey mvo
<rodrigo_> hi seb128, mvo
<seb128> how are you?
<mvo> hey rodrigo_
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<mvo> good, thanks!
<rodrigo_> seb128, did you upload my gsettings-d-s package?
<seb128> rodrigo_, no, it was time for dinner and then I was not a natty box in the evening
<seb128> was there any hurry?
<rodrigo_> no, no
<seb128> I will do that in a bit
<rodrigo_> no hurry, just wanted to know if it was uploaded or not
<rodrigo_> so no hurry :)
<rodrigo_> btw, I read in the backlog there was the eastern meeting last night
<rodrigo_> at what time is it?
<seb128> 11pm our team
<seb128> time
<seb128> it seems
<rodrigo_> on Wednesdays?
<seb128> they do it every week
<rodrigo_> ok, added to my calendar
<seb128> yes, not sure why, it used to be the same that us
<seb128> rodrigo_, you should not bother to join it, it's made for people who can't join the main meeting because it's in the middle of their night
<seb128> well "don't feel like you have to join it"
<seb128> if you want to you are welcome ;-)
<rodrigo_> yeah, but it's a chance to talk to robert, so I'll try to join
<seb128> I'm sometime around like yesterday
<seb128> well join any evening after 10:30
<rodrigo_> of course, if I have a party, I won't be leaving the party for the meeting :)
<rodrigo_> yeah, right
<seb128> it's the time he's online usually
<didrocks1> morning rodrigo_
<didrocks1> hey mvo :)
<mvo> hey didrocks1
<mvo> "1" ?
<mvo> aha
<didrocks> mvo: yeah, I'm competing with rick and seb :)
<rodrigo_> hi didrocks
<didrocks> mvo: more seriously, it should be "2", I already had two crashes this morning :)
<mvo> haha, the numbers are not in your favour
<didrocks> right :)
<mvo> two crashes? so that is the 128? seb should not run natty yet
<seb128> lol
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok, so I think we pretty much decided with robert_ancell to not upload GNOME3 in natty before some weeks
<seb128> or months
<rodrigo_> seb128, I'm releasing g-c-c 2.32.1, so I'll propose a branch for the package in a minute, ok?
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, we feel it's really a moving target and we have low visibility
<seb128> rodrigo_, we don't risk much by just working in the ppa until we feel it's stable enough
<rodrigo_> seb128, I think having the PPA is ok, since once we're happy, we can just upload straight from there
<seb128> if we feel it would be better next cycle we can delay
<seb128> it will be easier to update the ppa after freezes etc than natty
<seb128> so it less us free to do work easily and we can decide when we feel confident
<rodrigo_> ok
<seb128> do you think it's a reasonable position?
<rodrigo_> yes, I am confident gnome3 will be in time, but I agree it's better to not risk now uploading all to natty, so yes, I agree
<seb128> great
<seb128> well GNOME3 is one thing
<seb128> we have challenging things to deal with
<seb128> like the indicator stack, if we switch it to gtk3 what happens to xfce which is on gtk2
<seb128> or to unity
<rodrigo_> is unity moving to GTK3?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> though they said the service loading the indicator can build with gtk2 this cycle if we want
<seb128> not sure about the new evolution either
<seb128> evo has an history of not being really stable in the cycles where there is refactoring
<rodrigo_> yeah, that's more risky
<rodrigo_> the gsettings port is just being started
<seb128> but if we keep evo on 2.32 what happen to the e-d-s libs
<seb128> like will that create issues because they will change abi or gtk version and have other component require the new version
<rodrigo_> well, the low level e-d-s is GTK-free
<seb128> in any case better to use the ppa until we now where we stand on those
<rodrigo_> not sure what apps link to the ui libs
<seb128> right, I'm just pointing things we need to consider
<rodrigo_> right
<seb128> we have quite some moving parts still, so let's work in the ppa
<seb128> I think having natty staying on 2.32 and a GNOME3 ppa is a correct deal
<rodrigo_> ok
<seb128> it means stability by default and GNOME3 available
<seb128> and ready to be uploaded to natty when we feel it's ready
<seb128> without risk to get screwed if anything goes wrong or if GNOME3 has some weeks delay and is after natty
<seb128> mvo, hey
<seb128> so...
<seb128> $ apt-cache rdepends python-glade2 --show-installed=yes
<seb128>   pitivi
<seb128>   checkbox-gtk
<seb128>   apturl
<seb128> basically
<seb128> mvo, can I bribe you with some tea to review the apturl merge request to port to gtkbuilder? ;-)
<seb128> or to upload
<seb128> seems it has been merged
<mvo> seb128: sure
<seb128> ;-)
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<seb128> mvo, if you upload that to natty you will get some tea from me at the rally ;-)
<mvo> !!!
 * mvo uploads now
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> rodrigo_, did you manage to build gnome-applets?
<rodrigo_> seb128, no, the DH_SCOUR thing didn't work
<seb128> we need pitti then?
<seb128> pitti, hey
<rodrigo_> seb128, btw, where is there good documentation on all those things, I couldn't find anything yesterday
<rodrigo_> and dh_scour has no man page
<seb128> rodrigo_, I grepped for scour in /usr/share/cdbs
<seb128> I don't think there is any decent documentation about that
<rodrigo_> ok, I'll wait for pitti then
<seb128> rodrigo_, is your code somewhere?
<seb128> rodrigo_, can you push to bzr?
<seb128> I can try having a go to it locally to see if I stop an error
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, 1 min
<rodrigo_> seb128, lp:~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gnome-panel/no-more-deprecated
<seb128> rodrigo_, is that gnome-applets?
<rodrigo_> ugh, yesÃ§
<rodrigo_> let me push it again
<rodrigo_> lp:~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gnome-applets/no-more-deprecated
<rodrigo_> now pushed to the correct branch :)
<sumitkv2> i installed ubuntu 9.10 alongside windows.....but m stuck with sh:grub>...
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok, trying
<mvo> hey pitti, with the native apt-get changelog, is thre a reason to keep apt-changelog? I guess no, but wanted to confirm
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> hey pitti
<pitti> seb128: oh, I'm also trying to build a gir for libnotify; so far g-ir-scanner is acting up a bit, but I'll see to taming that today
<pitti> dbarth_: sorry, was on holiday yesterday; I guess the burn down charts auto-updated now. BTW, any platform team member can do that now
<pitti> seb128, rodrigo_: dh_scour bug is on my list for today
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<rodrigo_> thanks pitti
<pitti> mvo: no, it was by and large a prototype; it can go, of course
<pitti> mvo: I just need to update the mangler to point to the new command
<pitti> mvo: are you going to upload that soon? then I'll change it right away
<mvo> pitti: thanks, I can keep a compat script for one or two uploads
<rodrigo_> pitti, any idea how to trick it in the meanwhile? seb128 suggested to use DEB_DH_SCOUR_ARGS, but that doesn't do anything, it seems
<seb128> pitti, btw if you activate the vpswitcher plugin in ccsm you should some keybindings back
<seb128> if you use the gconf backend from compiz
<mvo> pitti: I want to upload today, I'm merging with debian and looking into some corner cases currently
<seb128> pitti, I got my "switch to workspace <n>" back
<pitti> oh, cool
<seb128> rodrigo_, that gnome-applets checkout builds fine here btw
<rodrigo_> seb128, on natty?
<didrocks> good morning pitti
<pitti> hey didrocks
<seb128> rodrigo_, yes
<seb128> rodrigo_, but i386
<rodrigo_> hmm
<seb128> could be different from amd64
<rodrigo_> oh, yes, I'm on 64
<dbarth_> pitti: yeah, no worries; it's looking better now
<rodrigo_> btw, the debian/watch files that have http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/gnome/sources/.. all fail for me, and work if I change that to download.gnome.org/sources/...
<rodrigo_> it might be picking the wrong mirror?
<seb128> rodrigo_, try using -X rather than --no-act
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, either to experiment in the build dir by calling dh_scour manually
<seb128> rather than doing new builds every time
<seb128> try dh_scour -Xsvg_to_exclude
<rodrigo_> dh_scour -Xgnome-cpu-frequency-applet.svg -Xgnome-eyes-applet.svg <- this seems to not fail
<rodrigo_> trying that on the rules file
<seb128> rodrigo_, scour -i ./cpufreq/pixmaps/gnome-cpu-frequency-applet.svg
<seb128> does that end with a ValueError for you?
<seb128> or do you get another error?
<rodrigo_> seb128, fails with 'too many values to unpack'
<rodrigo_> and the rules ignored the -X arguments :(
<seb128> same here but dh_scour doesn't stop on it for some reason
<seb128> dh_scour -v
<seb128> echo $?
<seb128> -> 0
<seb128> well, let's pitti debug
<pitti> I'll start on it now
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> rodrigo_: where can I get that svg?
<pitti> I need a reproducer
<seb128> pitti, gnome-applets
<seb128> apt-get source gnome-applets
<rodrigo_> pitti, lp:~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gnome-applets/no-more-deprecated
<seb128> pitti, ./cpufreq/pixmaps/gnome-cpu-frequency-applet.svg
<seb128> pitti, or /usr/share/icons/hicolor/scalable/apps/gnome-cpu-frequency-applet.svg
<rodrigo_> right, that's the file, my branch doesn't have it
<pitti> thanks, that reproduces it nicely
<didrocks> pitti: do you want to test the /opt prefix in cdbs/python-support/python-distutils-extra or should I upload right away? (apart for python-distutils-extra where I guess, you prefer uploading to debian + sync)
<pitti> didrocks: if you could write a cdbs test, that'd be great
<didrocks> pitti: done :)
<pitti> and likewise for p-d-e
<pitti> cool!
<pitti> didrocks: go ahead then
<didrocks> not for p-d-e
<didrocks> but the switch is only in python-mkdebian, which has no test, isn't it?
<pitti> didrocks: did you already push the cdbs changes to bzr? nothing new to pull
<pitti> didrocks: ah, right
<didrocks> pitti: not yet, can do now
<pitti> didrocks: so p-mkdebian just needs to add the --prefix to debian/rules?
<didrocks> pitti: right, using DEB_PYTHON_PREFIX_ARGS
<didrocks> should be DEB_PYTHON_PREFIX_ARG btw now, fixing that
<pitti> rodrigo_: weird, I already fixed dh_scour to not break the build on scour failure in 0.25+bzr194-0ubuntu3
<pitti> rodrigo_: did you use the latest python-scour to build that?
<pitti> I'm going to build gnome-applets locally now
<rodrigo_> I think so, let me check
<seb128> rodrigo_, you probably need to make gnome-applets depends on the gir1.0-gtk-2.0 and gdkpixbuf one
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, just reviewing your diff ;-)
<didrocks> pitti: pushed if you want to have a look (python-support as most of the changes)
<didrocks> has*
<seb128> rodrigo_, dpkg -l python-scour?
<pitti> didrocks: btw, aren't these both (central, support) obsolete, in favor of dh_python{2,3}?
<rodrigo_> yes, don't have the latest one, sorry pitti
<rodrigo_> installing and trying with that one
<pitti> didrocks: still nothing new in cdbs branch
<pitti> rodrigo_: ah :) *phew*
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, we should switch in python-mkdebian, but I prefer to know do with what works today and work with the debian guy for dh_pythonâ¦
<pitti> rodrigo_: but anyway, I reported the actual crash upstream, so there was something good about it
<didrocks> pitti: really? maybe you were too fast, lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/cdbs/ubuntu isn't it?
<pitti> didrocks: right
<rodrigo_> pitti, :)
<pitti> didrocks: ah, it's there now
<pitti> didrocks: your test checks for
<pitti> +       | grep -q '/opt/share/py\(thon-support/python-cdbs-testsuite\|shared\)/testing/foo.py' \
<pitti> didrocks: that should be /opt/packagename/share/...
<didrocks> pitti: well, here I'm just checking --prefix support, it can be to whatever, so in the test, it's --prefix=/opt IIRC
<pitti> didrocks: ah, ok; looks a bit confusing
<pitti> didrocks: perhaps the test could actually use prefix=/opt/testpkg/?
<didrocks> pitti: but python-mkdebian with Quickly is doing --prefix=/opt/extras/packagename for now, but I understood that the name is still under discussion :)
<didrocks> pitti: sure, changing that :)
<pitti> didrocks: right; I think /opt/packagename/ will be fine
<rodrigo_> pitti, right, builds ok now! sorry for the alarm :)
<pitti> avoids LANANA name registration, and is what /opt is meant to be for
<pitti> rodrigo_: cool, thanks for checking
<didrocks> pitti: just retrying the testsuite with /opt/testpkg/ and pushing then
<didrocks> pitti: the thing is that it needs a particular version of python-support so that the test works, so I'll add in debian/control the version I'll upload
<seb128> mvo, https://code.launchpad.net/~damg/ubuntu/maverick/synaptic/synaptic-lp510261/+merge/40788
<seb128> mvo, not sure if you watch the merge requests or the sponsoring queue
<seb128> mvo, https://code.launchpad.net/~bryce/software-properties/rm-apt-repository/+merge/25988 as well
<didrocks> pitti: so, when you have some time, if you can do a release of p-d-e, that will be nice (no hurry though), not sure about the version you want to use (maybe a newer version than incrementing -X so that I can test if the option is available?)
<pitti> didrocks: I can do a 2.23-1
<didrocks> pitti: sounds good to me :)
<pitti> it should have been a 2.23 anyway since 2.22-3
<didrocks> pitti: what's the schema of versionning btw? I didn't get it
<pitti> didrocks: -X should just be packaging changes (debian/)
<didrocks> pitti: ok, it's logic then, I was puzzled by previous uploads :)
 * pitti chuckles at https://launchpad.net/python-distutils-extra
<pitti> "released 10 hours ago"
<pitti> no, it was 10 seconds ago
<rodrigo_> need to run some errands, bbiab
<pitti> didrocks: uploaded to sid and natty
<didrocks> pitti: thanks!
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<chrisccoulson> wow, no new firefox bugs!
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hey, that's a good way to start the day, isn't it? :)
<chrisccoulson> yes :)
<didrocks> (and no, launchpad wasn't down if that's your second question :))
<chrisccoulson> heh ;)
<mvo> pitti: will your script get confused if i output on stderr from apt-changelog that its no longer needed?
<pitti> mvo: which script?
<pitti> mvo: oh, I need to update apt-listchanges for it
<mvo> pitti: the one that is currently using it .) pkgmangler? or is it not used at all?
<pitti> but otherwise no
<pitti> mvo: pkgmangler adds a line "please see apt-changelog <package> for the full list of changes" to changelog.Debian.gz
<pitti> I'll adapt that as well
<mvo> pitti: thans, I can take care of apt-listchanges as well and upoad them together
<pitti> mvo: great, thanks
<pitti> mvo: are you an apt-listchanges Debian maintainer?
<mvo> pitti: mdz is :)
<mvo> well, used to
<pitti> once apt-get changelog lands in sid, the apt-listchanges patch could go into debian as well
<pitti> I just didn't send it to the BTS yet until apt-changelog (or equivalent) lands in Debian
<mvo> ok
 * pitti dances around happily -- there, libnotify GIR!
<didrocks> pitti: nice! :)
<pitti> it doesn't actually work yet, but that's the next problem :)
<devildante> what's that? share the awesome with me :p
<pitti> http://live.gnome.org/GObjectIntrospection
<devildante> great :)
<pitti> seb128, rodrigo_: do you happen to know if I can add a directory to the GIR search path, for using local typelibs?
<rodrigo_> pitti, g-ir-* have an argument for that, let me check
<pitti> rodrigo_: no, I mean when using it in e. g. python
<rodrigo_> ah, no idea
<pitti> rodrigo_: for "from gi.repository import"
<pitti> rodrigo_: ok, thanks
<rodrigo_> I'm in #introspection asking some other thing, so let me ask
<rodrigo_> pitti, <nacho> rodrigo, yes
<rodrigo_> <nacho> check gedit for that
<pitti> thanks
<rodrigo_> pitti, http://git.gnome.org/browse/gedit/tree/gedit/gedit-plugins-engine.c#n76
<pitti> ok, that's C
<rodrigo_> yes, the libgir-reposiroty-dev stuff, I guess it has typelibs?
<pitti> didn't find any test python script which uses the local typelib :-(
<pitti> hah!
<pitti> rodrigo_: some RTFS later.. $GI_TYPELIB_PATH=... works
<rodrigo_> ah, cool
<rodrigo_> seb128, g-c-c 2.32.1 -> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/gnome-control-center/2_32_1_release/+merge/41166
<seb128> rodrigo_, seems fine, feel free to upload
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<rodrigo_> seb128, so, apart from the undocumented dh_scour thing, where is there good documentation on deb packaging?
<rodrigo_> the python stuff in gnome-menus is giving me a bad time, because I don't really know what is wrong
<seb128> rodrigo_, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide
<rodrigo_> ok, I think that's the PDF I have, checking
<seb128> rodrigo_, http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/python-policy/
<seb128> on python
<rodrigo_> ok
<seb128> what error do you get again?
<seb128> kklimonda, hey, do you work on the glibmm update or should I do it?
<kklimonda> seb128: I have it more or less ready but it requires atkmm to build. That's why I'm looking for a sponsor.
<kenvandine> seb128, i commented on that vala/gio gir bug to get more clarification, but since i'll be out for a couple hours can you asked mterry if he can try to get someone's attention in #vala
<seb128> kklimonda, weird, glib shouldn't
<seb128> kklimonda, gtkmm does though
<kenvandine> when he shows up :)
<kklimonda> seb128: ah, I haven't read you right.
<seb128> kenvandine, ok
 * kenvandine needs to leave now, be back in ~2 hours
<kenvandine> thx
<kklimonda> seb128: I'll take glibmm
<seb128> kenvandine, see you
<seb128> kklimonda, thanks
<seb128> kklimonda, let me know when you have something to sponsor, I will do some sponsoring today
<seb128> I will review atkmm as well
<seb128> did you open a bug about this one btw? I didn't see it on the sponsoring list
<kklimonda> seb128: bug 672817 - sponsors were unsubscribed and then some random folk came buy and invalidated it ;)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 672817 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] atkmm1.6 (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/672817
<kklimonda> seb128: as for debian bug I haven't opened it
<seb128> hum, ok
<seb128> kklimonda, oh I though you did package it
<kklimonda> seb128: hmm, I did - it's in revu, in pkg-gnome
<seb128> could you give pointers on the bug?
<seb128> hum ok, http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-gnome/packages/unstable/atkmm1.6/debian/#_packages_unstable_atkmm1.6_debian_
<seb128> it should probably be in desktop/experimental
<seb128> not packages/unstable
<kklimonda> seb128: I did as pochu told me :)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> why the epoch number in the version?
<kklimonda> hum.. I have no idea - I could swear I've removed it
<kklimonda> there is no reason :)
<seb128> ok, can you fix it in the svn?
<kklimonda> yes
<seb128> kklimonda, you probably don't want to install the .la either
<seb128> kklimonda, include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/simple-patchsys.mk is to clean
<seb128> with source v3 you use quilt
<kklimonda> seb128: bummer, libpkg-guide is outdated?
<kklimonda> it's for .la files)
<seb128> well, there is not a clear reply but GNOME packages tend to clean those nowadays
<seb128> you have clean-la.mk rule in the rules
<seb128> you could as well not install it rather than using clean-la.mk
<seb128> DEB_DH_INSTALL_SOURCEDIR := debian/tmp
<seb128> not sure that is required? tmp should be the default?
<kklimonda> it shouldn't be but I've tried not to diverge from the current packaging of mm stack too much assuming it's going to be reviewed by the main maintainer :)
<kklimonda> but he's too busy
<seb128> ok
<seb128> well those are details
<kklimonda> sure, I'm going to fix them
<seb128> would be nice to use a .symbols as well
<kklimonda> less cruft the better
<seb128> well the only thing to real fix is the epoch
<kklimonda> as for symbols files I'd love to do them but the documentation on them I was able to find isn't stellar. Do you have some pointers I could use?
<kklimonda> I'd love to create them*
<kklimonda> :q!
<kklimonda> bah
<seb128> kklimonda, the tarball also needs to ship a the GPL license
<seb128> kklimonda, dpkg-gensymbols, see the manpage
<seb128> or search on the wiki I think there was some documentation
<seb128> basically run it after the build in the build dir
<seb128> and copy the output to a .symbols
<kklimonda> GPL livence because of the gendef.cc files?
<kklimonda> license*
<seb128> yes
<seb128> if it has sources under the GPL it should distribute the license as well
<kklimonda> bummer, they are only needed by Visual Studio.. so I should a) contact the upstream about it and b) repackage it for now?
<seb128> pitti, if a source include GPL files which are not used, does it need to ship a GPL license?
<seb128> mterry, hey
<mterry> seb128, hello!
<seb128> mterry, kenvandine said he would be out for some hours and asked if you could try to ping the #vala guys about the issue you had yesterday
<mterry> seb128, sure
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<seb128> mterry, how are you otherwise? ;-)
<mterry> seb128, good.  Catching up on what seems like an usually large number of email
<seb128> mterry, is that a way to tell me to stop Cc-ing you all the GNOME3 emails I send? ;-)
<mterry> seb128, :)
<mterry> seb128, the idea to port anjuta has led me down quite a rabbit hole.  I'm thinking of porting deja-dup to gtk3 just so we'd have an easier universe guinea pig.  ;)
<seb128> mterry, lol
<seb128> mterry, well if anjuta is not easily reachable yet we can delay for later
<mterry> seb128, eh, we'll see.  Just involves lots of other packages
<seb128> I'm starting to think we should just focus on the ppa for now
<seb128> it seems we will have low visibility on what the transition involves for a while
<seb128> so better to work just in there
<mterry> seb128, hey, btw.  With gsettings apps, what's the story for running gsettings-data-convert after installation?  I assume it gets run on login?  But still, should probably be run on install of first gsettings version too...
<seb128> it's easily available and as easy than working on natty
<mterry> seb128, sure
<seb128> mterry, yes on login
<seb128> we had the discussion at UDS but judged that people should restart their session after dist-upgrading between distributions anyway
<seb128> or restart the computer
<mterry> seb128, maybe we should trigger 'reboot required' then for anything that installs into /usr/share/GConf/gsettings for the first time
<seb128> we might want to get the session indicator turn ted when one of those is installed
<seb128> right, I was thinking to that as well
<seb128> I will add a wi for it
<seb128> or feel free to add it to the spec if you want
<seb128> I will do some updates later on and add it if you didn't before
<mvo> good morning tremolux
<tremolux> hey mvo
<devildante> yeah, good morning tremolux
<tremolux> hiya devildante
<didrocks> seb128: I'm quite puzzled by bug #676787 and I should miss somethingâ¦
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 676787 in compiz (Ubuntu) "package compiz-gnome 1:0.9.2.1 glibmainloop-0ubuntu2 failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/share/gconf/schemas/compiz-annotate.schemas', which is also in package compiz-plugins 1:0.8.6-0ubuntu12 (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/676787
<seb128> reading
<didrocks> seb128: I've added a Replaces: compiz-plugins (<= 1:0.8.6-0ubuntu12) in compiz-gnome in 1:0.9.2.1-0ubuntu2
<seb128> didrocks, Package: compiz-gnome 1:0.9.2.1-0ubuntu1
<seb128> didrocks, it's the revision before your fix?
<didrocks> what? bug title is "glibmainloop-0ubuntu2" ?
<seb128> weird
<seb128> didrocks, you should ask mvo ;-)
<pitti> seb128: GPL> I'd say yes, since it's part of the source
<pitti> seb128: it shoudl at least have the standard GPL header, and debian/copyright a pointer to common-licenses/
<seb128> kklimonda, I've mailed upstream about other things do you want me to email him about the GPL?
<didrocks> seb128: hum, ok :-) It's not something I'm obviousy missing then :)
<didrocks> mvo: when you get some time ^
<kklimonda> seb128: sure, if you've already talked to him it makes sense for you to bring this up.
<seb128> kklimonda, ok
<seb128> kklimonda, I will Cc you on the email
<kklimonda> k
<mvo> didrocks: eh, that is puzzling. it comes striaght from hell^Wdpkg
<bcurtiswx_> meeting going in ?
<bcurtiswx_> on*
<bcurtiswx_> guess not, lol
<seb128> bcurtiswx_, no, the meeting is on tuesday
<didrocks> mvo: ok, let's pretend it doesn't exist and see if there are new ones :)
<kklimonda> seb128: as for glibmm there has been no glibmm 2.26.x release so far - should I start packaging 2.27.x to keep it in sync with glib? If so, then it's an ubuntu-only packaging for now, right?
<bcurtiswx_> i am wondering, i've seen this bug before in earlier releases https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=635105#c1 would it be worthy of an SRU ?
<seb128> kklimonda, yes
<ubot2> Gnome bug 635105 in General "Empathy is eating all the memory" [Major,Resolved: fixed]
<mvo> didrocks: odd indeed
<seb128> bcurtiswx_, if you find a way to trigger the issue so the fix can be tested that would be useful
<nessita> pitti: hi there! quick question: if all the bugs attached to a -proposed package are already in verification-done, do I have to do anything else to make that package hit -updates?
<seb128> nessita, hey
<seb128> nessita, no you don't, you just have to wait the week delay
<bcurtiswx_> seb128, im going to leave my empathy ON for (as Guillaume states) 40-ish minutes to see if it uses that much
<seb128> bcurtiswx_, I doubt it do it for everybody or we would have noticed
<nessita> seb128: awesome, thanks! and hi :-)
<bcurtiswx_> seb128, OK i will see if i can find a set trigger, and twitter/blog/announce it for confirmation (i.e. bug report as well)
<bcurtiswx_> seb128, cassidy has 2 fixed leaks he says are going to make it into 2.32.x , i can request SRU for that once released
<cassidy> Ubuntu isn't affected by the main leak
<cassidy> but the other 2 are worth fixing (especially one)
<cassidy> I'm making a release
<bcurtiswx_> cassidy, yes, sorry i wasn't specific enough
<mterry> didrocks, I got the error "libtool: install: error: cannot install `vtemodule.la' to a directory not ending in /usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/gtk-2.0", which sounds similar to one you mentioned yesterday?
<didrocks> did I mentionned something like that? :)
<mterry> didrocks, thought so?  maybe someone else did... let me see if I have it in my logs
<devildante> didrocks: did I mention* ;)
<seb128> mterry, it was rodrigo_
<seb128> he has the same issue on gnome-menus
<didrocks> devildante: yeah, got it one pressing "enter", just note fixing all my spelling mistakes
<mterry> seb128, ah thanks.  Sorry didrocks :)
<devildante> didrocks: heh :)
<mterry> rodrigo_, did you figure the error out?
<didrocks> mterry: no worry :)
<seb128> mterry, he was still wondering about it before going for lunch it seems
<seb128> mterry, not sure if lunch helped him to think about the issue though ;-)
<rodrigo_> mterry, no, not yet, went to lunch after reading some docs on the supporting multiple pythons thing
<rodrigo_> mterry, I guess there's something broken in the dh_pysupport thing?
<seb128> rodrigo_, could you open a bug about libgnome-media-profiles?
<rodrigo_> seb128, about adding it to natty?
<seb128> yes, sponsoring one
<rodrigo_> ok, but it conflicts with the libgnome-media from the older gnome-media
<rodrigo_> so, we don't want it unless we upgrade gnome-media, I think
<seb128> oh right
<rodrigo_> well, it really doesn't conflict, it's the same lib but different naming
<seb128> rodrigo_, don't bother for now then
<rodrigo_> ok
<rodrigo_> mterry, you're working on GTK3 vte, right?
<mterry> rodrigo_, yeah
<mterry> rodrigo_, it seems that the build area for the python2.7 version still has references to python2.6 install locations
<rodrigo_> mterry, oh
<rodrigo_> mterry, so it needs to distclean or something like that before building with the other python version?
<mterry> maybe?
<mterry> looking at rules file now, trying to figure out where it gets its python info
<mterry> rodrigo_, does this sound similar to your issue?
<rodrigo_> yes, it's the same
<Zdra> Hm, gnome-keyring in gnome3 ppa is older version then the one in maverick... :(
<rodrigo_> Zdra, yes, the previous upgrade was wrong, I think, it had 2.92.92.is.2.31.91-0ubuntu4
<rodrigo_> not sure why
<rodrigo_> didrocks, do you know why that was used?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: I think the error happened in lucid or maverick version and it was to avoid an epoch
<didrocks> rodrigo_: it was in lucid: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+source/gnome-keyring
<rodrigo_> didrocks, so, do I change it to be 2.92.92.is.2.91.2... or just leave it at 2.91.2?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: nobody will be able to upgrade if you keep 2.91.2
<didrocks> rodrigo_: so 2.92.92.is.â¦
<rodrigo_> ok, changing it
<seb128> rodrigo_, why did you drop gnome-media-common?
<mterry> rodrigo_, odd.  If I manually go through the sequence of debian/rules configure-stamp-python2.7, build stamp, and then install stamp, it works fine (the most relevant being that the first configure stamp correctly identifies python2.7
<rodrigo_> seb128, because that was for libgnome-media and gnome-media, and now there's just a few binaries, nothing depends on gnome-media-common, apart from libgnome-media, right?
<rodrigo_> mterry, maybe something changed in dh_pysupport?
<seb128> rodrigo_, no, debian tends to install translations in a -common
<seb128> so they have one binary with those on the mirror and not one by arch
<seb128> it's all all not any
<seb128> spare mirror space
<rodrigo_> ah, ok
<rodrigo_> I'll re-add it then
<seb128> rodrigo_, I'm fixing some of the things there
<rodrigo_> ah, ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, don't bother I'm reviewing your updates and fixing some things on the way
<seb128> started with gnome-media
<rodrigo_> cool
<seb128> rodrigo_, I'm not sure how you managed to build it ;-)
<rodrigo_> seb128, I'm fixing librest and libsocialweb with the stuff from the bugs I filed, so don't worry about those for now
<seb128> ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, gnome-media you still build-depends on gtk2
<seb128> and use launchpad-integration gtk2
<seb128> I'm not sure how it works, the configure wants gtk3
<rodrigo_> hmm
<rodrigo_> that's wrong indeed, should be build depending on gtk3
<rodrigo_> I guess that's why lpi patch worked :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, hmm, if I change the version to 2.92.92.is..., it can't retrieve the upstream tarball, any magic I need to do?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: wget + rename :)
<rodrigo_> ah, ok :)
<rodrigo_> but that's not magic :D
<didrocks> rodrigo_: wget is magic to me :)
<rodrigo_> :)
<didrocks> you pass a string, you get a file!
<didrocks> :)
<mterry> rodrigo_, OK...  When it comes time to run the install target on python2.7, make decides to run /bin/bash ./config.status --recheck, which does not use the same PYTHON=python2.7 env var that configure did, so picks up python2.6 this time around
<mterry> not sure why it calls recheck yet
<mterry> maybe calling make with PYTHON=python2.7 is sufficient, regardless of why it calls recheck
<mvo> tremolux: I did some tweaks in the apthistory code (not the lazy loading yet). i wonder if that helps on your netbook with the statup speed
<rodrigo_> mterry, but isn't the PY_VERSIONS thing supposed to deal with that?
<tremolux> mvo: cool, I will try it  :)
<mterry> rodrigo_, well (for vte at least), PY_VERSIONS just drives a loop that runs configure/make all/make install for each version
<mterry> rodrigo_, but the make install is redoing the configure step, but without the benefit of the PYTHON env var
<rodrigo_> ah
<seb128> mterry, try without dh-autoreconf?
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok so libgnome-media some comments
<seb128> rodrigo_, you lack a compat file
<seb128> you could use the new copyright format it's easier
<rodrigo_> ah, ok, adding it as we speak
<seb128> standard-versions is control should be 3.9.1
<seb128> you should have a source/format which say for 3.0 (quilt)
 * kenvandine waves
<pitti> hey kenvandine
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<mterry> kenvandine, no progress in #vala yet
<kenvandine> i see that :/
<pitti> kenvandine: do you plan an indicator-application upload by any chance in the next time? a simple no-change rebuild is apparently not enough to fix the typelib (it breaks with a mysterious error message)
<seb128> rodrigo_, you should probably use a - before 3.0 in the library binary
<seb128> pitti, help him to fix the dbusmenu gtk3 build
<kenvandine> pitti, if it'll build...
<seb128> pitti, then we can do libindicat*
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> kenvandine: if not, I can have a look
<pitti> or that :)
<kenvandine> pitti, but i assumed it would need dbusmenu and libindicator first
<seb128> pitti, ted rolled new tarballs but kenvandine is having issue with gir and vapi it seems
<kenvandine> which is broken because of vapigen and gir
<seb128> kenvandine, it does
<pitti> ah, long dependency trail
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> and it isn't even building for gtk3 that is the problem... it is just with valac-0.12
<seb128> pitti, "it's actively being worked but there are some issues
<seb128> it's back to the eastern meeting discussion from yesterday
<seb128> we lack a status page were people write those sort of informations ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, well you can keep using valac-0.10 if that works
<mterry> rodrigo_, fixed it by adding PYTHON=$* at end of make install line, which makes sure that any subconfigures do the right thing
<mterry> seb128, except the packaging in ubuntu didn't use separate source packages!
<rodrigo_> seb128, you mean calling the package libgnome-media-profiles-3.0 instead of libgnome-media-profiles3.0?
<mterry> seb128, forced to use vala-0.12
<rodrigo_> mterry, ok, I'll see how I can fix it for gnome-menus
<seb128> mterry, it didn't? that seems a mistake
<seb128> mterry, we should perhaps reupload vala-0.10
<seb128> as vala-0.10
<seb128> rodrigo_, right
<seb128> rodrigo_, I think that's what lintian should suggest (I didn't try to build yet)
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, all fixed except the copyright file, fixing it now
<seb128> rodrigo_, great
<tremolux> mvo: some faster, from ~6.9 s to ~6.6 s
<seb128> rodrigo_, you can also probably rename ubuntugtk3 to ubuntu for this one
<seb128> rodrigo_, since there is no gtk2 version
<rodrigo_> seb128, as you want, just wanted to keep it with the rest of the gtk3 ppa packages
<seb128> rodrigo_, well we had to change the name for the others because ubuntu was taken
<tremolux> mvo: def lazy-loading will be the big win
<rodrigo_> but ok, I'll push to ubuntu as soon as I fix the copyright file
<seb128> rodrigo_, like gnome-desktop is ubuntu so gnome-desktop3 has to be an another name
<seb128> rodrigo_, oh, also please use ~gnome3 or ~build for the ppa uploads
<rodrigo_> oh, ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, don't use official version numbers
<seb128> it makes easier to know what is installed from the ppa
<rodrigo_> ok
<mvo> tremolux: hm, 0.3s, but not what I had hoped for :) lazy loading plus caching will be it I think
<seb128> and allow uploading to the archive as -0ubuntu1
<tremolux> mvo: it's something, every little bit as they say  :)
<rodrigo_> Zdra, new fixed version for gnome-keyring is now on the PPA
<seb128> rodrigo_, oh, using a .symbols would be nice as well
<seb128> I can do that if you want though
<rodrigo_> seb128, in libgnome-media-profiles? I can do it as part of this update
<rodrigo_> how do I create one?
<seb128> rodrigo_, run dpkg-gensymbols in the build dir
<seb128> after the build
<rodrigo_> ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, usually dpkg-gensymbols -p<libraryname> -Odebian/library.symbols -v2.91....
<seb128> where library is the name of the library binary
<seb128> like libgnome-media-profiles-3.0 there
<rodrigo_> ok
<rodrigo_> can I just add that in a rule in rules?
<seb128> no, why?
<seb128> rodrigo_, you just need to create it once
<rodrigo_> ah, ok
<seb128> the build call dpkg-gensymbols automatically
<seb128> if new symbols are added it prints a diff on the command line at build then
<seb128> you just need to apply the diff to update the .symbols file
<seb128> it makes easy to track api changes
<seb128> if a symbol is dropped it stops the build for you
<seb128> you just need to create the reference api when you create the source
<rodrigo_> ah, ok, now I get it
<seb128> it's usually a dump of the current symbols
<seb128> then it compares the lib to the .symbols at each build
<seb128> so it makes easy to see new or removed symbols
<seb128> the other packages will also get the depends according to the symbols they use
<seb128> like if a new symbol is added in 2.91.3 but your application don't use it the depends will stay on the version which provides what you use
<seb128> it's quite nice
<seb128> rodrigo_, you can read the man dpkg-gensymbols
<seb128> it's nicely documented there
<sumitkv2> i installed ubutu 10.10 inside  windows xp using wubi...but now when i boot into ubuntu i get a GRUB> prompt,,,,what to do?
<seb128> sumitkv2, hi, try #ubuntu
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, lp:~ubuntu-desktop/libgnome-media-profiles/ubuntugtk3 has all the fixes
 * mterry awaits today's presumed unity dump
<didrocks> mterry: building there currently :)
<rickspencer3> dang it
<mterry> didrocks, this will land in natty, right?  I'm not using the PPA
<didrocks> mterry: yeah, natty :)
<sumitkv2> i installed ubutu 10.10 alongside windows xp using wubi...but now when i boot into ubuntu i get a GRUB> prompt,,,,what to do?
<mterry> \o/
<rickspencer3> apt-get is still blocking on "Unpacking replacement libglewmx1.5 ..." :/
<rickspencer3> sumitkv2, hello
<didrocks> rickspencer3: waowâ¦ mvo ^^
<rickspencer3> this particular channel is for folks developieng Ubuntu itself
<sumitkv2> rickspencer3, hey!can you help me out!!
<rickspencer3> sumitkv2, you might get better luck in #ubuntu
<rickspencer3> sumitkv2, I can't really, sorry, and we're all working on 11.04 atm (in this channel)
<sumitkv2> okies!!
<rickspencer3> you are totally welcome to hang out, but probably no one here will be able to help you out, sorry
<mvo> rickspencer3: *ick*, could you pastebin the result of ps afx (or mail it to me)
<didrocks> mvo: just FYI, it was already the case the day before of whatever, so not just an hangâ¦
<rickspencer3> it's not a "hang" per se
<rickspencer3> apt-get just kinda gets stuck there
<rickspencer3> I was installing unity from the PPA
<rickspencer3> mvo, if it helps .. http://paste.ubuntu.com/533916/
<rickspencer3> the last command I tried was "sudo apt-get install -f"
<mvo> rickspencer3: ehhhh, something is really crazy with your locking
<mvo> rickspencer3: or rather with dpkgs locking
<mvo> didrocks: did you get this as well?
<rickspencer3> mvo, so far as I know, it's just me
<didrocks> mvo: no, I updated without any problem, but maybe I've installed it locally as I've built it, let me check
<mvo> rickspencer3: is there anything special with that machine? btrfs, arm? natty I assume?
<didrocks> mvo: yeah, I've installed it manually with dpkg -i, so not relevant
<rickspencer3> mvo, it's natty
<didrocks> mvo: (and this package is in natty, not the ppa)
<rickspencer3> but I have upgraded since Karmic, I think
<mvo> there are a whole bunch of dpkg --unpack hanging around, that shuld not happen, dpkg locks should prevent this
<rickspencer3> mvo, well ....
<rickspencer3> maybe I was being bad
<rickspencer3> I'
<mvo> rickspencer3: could you strace the most recent one
<rickspencer3> ve been deleting lock files to get it started again
<mvo> rickspencer3: hehh :)
<mvo> rickspencer3: I was about to say "this can not be possible the users fault"
<mvo> but â¦
<rickspencer3> well, apt-get started it
<mvo> lol
<rickspencer3> this happened the first time, it got stuck for like 12 hours
<rickspencer3> and then cntrl-c didn'
<rickspencer3> t work, so I closed the terminal window
<mvo> could you please run "sudo strace -p 5439" (or any of the other ones)
<rickspencer3> cleaned up the lock files, did dpkg --configure -a, and tried over and over again
<pitti> hey rickspencer3, how are you?
<mvo> and it always hangs â¦
<rickspencer3> hi pitti I'm ok
<rickspencer3> mvo, yes, it seems to have the same basic behavior
<rickspencer3> it's the same symptom, but I may have created new diseases ;)
<mvo> the strace output might be helpful at this point
<rickspencer3> mvo, sure, it doesn't seem to be doing anything
<mvo> not priting anything at all?
<rickspencer3> should I delete the lock files, dpkg --configure -a, and then run apt-get install -f under strace?
<mvo> so dpkg --configure -a returns without error?
<mvo> strace -f dpkg --unpack /var/cache/apt/archives/libglewmx1.5_1.5.2-0ubuntu1_i386.deb would be a good one
<mvo> it will generate a lot of output
<mvo> but hopefully the last few lines gives us a idea what is wrong
<rickspencer3> mvo, dpkg --configure return with no error
<rickspencer3> give me a minute, I'll run --unpack with strace
<mvo> sure
<mvo> rickspencer3: no rush, I need to go for dinner now
 * mvo is away for a little bit
<kenvandine> mterry, i confirmed that dbusmenu builds on maverick, and still fails on natty with valac-0.10
<kenvandine> as you suspected, gir related
<kenvandine> it fails to create the gir
<rickspencer3> mvo, when you get back ... http://paste.ubuntu.com/533927/
<rickspencer3> it's been stuck there for about 20 minutes
<seb128> Riddell, do you have time to do a NEW review for unity?
<seb128> pitti, ^ or you?
<pitti> seb128: can do, what?
<pitti> oh, unity
 * pitti looks
<didrocks> not unity, nux!
<didrocks> pitti: ^^
<ari-tczew> should do I drop second depends on fast-user-switch-applet ?
<pitti> didrocks: sure
<ari-tczew> I have in debian/control: gdm | fast-user-switch-applet (>= 2.24),
<seb128> you can
<seb128> it's deprecated
<pitti> didrocks: oh, you got this thing to build now? congrats :)
<didrocks> pitti: it's almost a week now :)
<didrocks> pitti: it was a mesa missing dep
<pitti> didrocks: no 3.0 source?
<didrocks> pitti: no, it's not working well with daily buildâ¦
<pitti> didrocks: oh, how so?
<didrocks> just stand with "can't upload source", the bug is logged
<pitti> wow, .tga files -- that rings a bell from ancient DOS times :)
<pitti> didrocks: please fix the tags in debian/copyright in bzr; it's "Name:", not Upstream-* (see http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep5/)
<pitti> didrocks: and the "(if not otherwise specified)" in Files: isn't documented either, it might break parsers
<pitti> didrocks: and "Copyright:", "License:" tags are missing
<didrocks> pitti: I was relying on python-mkdebian  :)
<pitti> didrocks: and the last line looks odd, too
<pitti> didrocks: oh, does it produce output like that? kick the author of python-mkdebian :)
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, he did a pretty bad job it seems :p
 * didrocks hugs pitti
<pitti> didrocks: argh, here's a rejection reason: the source doesn't ship a copy of the GPL3 (examples/ is licensed under that)
<didrocks> really? I added it last week?
<didrocks> let me check
<pitti> I see COPYING, which is LGPL
<didrocks> argh, I didn't dist itâ¦
<didrocks> I half-fixed upstream it seems :)
<pitti> didrocks: any chance you could compress changelog into one "initial release"? or woudl that disrupt something else?
<didrocks> pitti: hum, some versions have been uploaded in the natty ppa, but it's not that important I guess, can compress it
<pitti> didrocks: (not a requirement, but would look nicer)
<didrocks> pitti: more seriously, as the upstream tarball doesn't contain the gpl, what to do, a new release?
<didrocks> pitti: or I can ship one, but it will not be in upstream tarball
<seb128> repack the tarball locally to include it
<seb128> don't bother rolling a new version
<didrocks> ok
<seb128> imho
<pitti> didrocks: if you can fix it upstream, it's enough to include it in diff.gz for now
<seb128> or what pitti said
<didrocks> ok, fixing it upstream then
<pitti> (that was the general consensus last time we discussed that)
<pitti> didrocks: ok, rest looks fine
<didrocks> weird, in my memory, autotools automatically shipped COPYIN*
<seb128> didrocks, they do but it might not be the license you want ;-)
<pitti> didrocks: you need both
<pitti> or at least the GPL
<pitti> you can ship LGPL files under GPL, but not the other way around
<didrocks> my remark was only that autotools was automatically disting COPYING*, so COPYING and COPYING.gpl which are in trunk should have both been disted
<didrocks> pitti: COPYING.gpl is fine as a name, right? (as I'm at itâ¦)
<pitti> didrocks: ah, I see
<pitti> didrocks: yep, looks good
<pitti> didrocks: as seb128 says, don't bother with a new upstream release just for that; just include it into the diff.gz
<didrocks> ok, adding COPYING.gpl to extra_dist
<didrocks> yeah, but that will be there for next week :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, gnome-media-profiles tries to overwrite gnome-media 2.32's /usr/bin/gnome-audio-profiles-properties
<pitti> didrocks: rejected, please tell me when you reuploaded
<didrocks> pitti: ok, should be there in two minutes
<seb128> rodrigo_, you need a Conflicts, Replaces on gnome-media (<< 2.91)
<seb128> rodrigo_, btw what happened to your gnome-applets build?
<didrocks> pitti: just putting "initial packaging" in the changelog then
<didrocks> pitti: just a question, how to do if I don't put (if not otherwise specified), listing every directories?
<pitti> didrocks: I can't parse that, I'm afraid
<didrocks> pitti: what should I put instead of "if not otherwise specified" in debian/copyright?
<Laney> Files: *
<didrocks> Laney: it's wrong, some files are specified below and have another license
<seb128> didrocks, which is "if not specific otherwise"
<Laney> yes, more specific globs override
<seb128> specified
<didrocks> seb128: not documented either at http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep5/
<Laney> However it makes for easier reading if the copyright file lists the âmainâ license first: the one matching the âtop levelâ of the work, with others listed as exceptions. To allow this, the following precedence rule applies for matching files: If multiple Files declarations match the same file, then only the last match counts.
<Laney> :)
<didrocks> Laney: nice! thanks for the quote :)
<didrocks> Laney: ok, doing that then
<Laney> seems like you don't even need Files: * for the main license
<didrocks> Laney: yeah, let's just keep it for now
<didrocks> pitti: you should get it now
<seb128> ok, sport, bbl
<didrocks> see you seb128
 * pitti applauds didrocks for dh_install --fail-missing
<didrocks> pitti: hehe, you will everytime recognize my packages because of that :)
<pitti> didrocks: looks fine now, accepted
<didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
 * didrocks nukes now the netbook session
<pitti> \o/
<pitti> unstoppable!
<didrocks> :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - would you mind approving xulrunner-2.0 in NEW please? :)
<didrocks> pitti: hum, for the session, my plan was to only build ubuntu-netbook-default-settings on armel, then update-manager ask for removing on other archs -> no more .desktop file. But for people not removing that, should there get a transitional empty package containing nothing for other archs?
<pitti> didrocks: yes, I think there should be an empty transitional package  which just depends on ubuntu-desktop
<didrocks> pitti: but it needs to be done in another source than ubuntu-netbook-default-settings, right? as there will be already a ubuntu-netbook-default-settings containing those files for armel
<pitti> didrocks: oh, that's an arch:all package?
<pitti> didrocks: I guess you'd need to convert it to an arch:any then
<didrocks> pitti: it was, but ogra wants to keep it for now for armel
<didrocks> pitti: so a .install by arch, right?
<pitti> didrocks: I don't quite understand why?
<pitti> didrocks: I'd install in debian/rules, easier
<pitti> i. e. why is arm different?
<didrocks> pitti: apparently, they don't know what to do for arm as there will be no unity, they maybe want to keep a netbook product and a netbook session
<didrocks> pitti: I discuss it extensively with ogra, trying to convince him to change it too :)
<pitti> so, I think arch:any is it then
<pitti> and empty for !armel
<pitti> didrocks: you could use the .install file, and then only call dh_install on arm
<didrocks> pitti: nice idea :)
<didrocks> pitti: ok, will do that tomorrow then
<didrocks> then, for ubuntu-netbook, only build on armel
<didrocks> no need for transitional package I guess, as it's from the seeds and if people still have it, it's not an issue
<didrocks> (and for upgrade, unity will be already installed)
<didrocks> waow, the symbols are totally different than a local buildâ¦
 * didrocks tries rebuild nux
<tremolux> mvo: lazy loading/parsing the apthistory cuts 30% off startup time, woo  \o/
<kiwinote> tremolux: lazy loading the whole history_pane does too ;)
<kiwinote> tremolux: gtg and have dinner now, but I'll catch you either later in the evening or tomorrow
<kiwinote> (tremolux: I've pushed a few basic speed improvements to a branch)
<tremolux> kiwinote: seems like the real slowdown is the load and parse (cuts a full second out of a 3 second startup on my machine)
<tremolux> kiwinote:  lp:~gary-lasker/software-center/startup-speed
<tremolux> kiwinote: definitely ping me when you have some time
<tremolux> kiwinote: I added a small mechanism that I think will make it very straightforward to load the other views on-demand as well
<tremolux> kiwinote: see you!  good dinner to you
<pitti> seb128: pygi guys (John Palmieri in particular) are great :) got responses to all my bug reports
<didrocks> pitti: ok, got different symbols in a local build than in the buildd and as my natty pbuilder is broken, will look at that tomorrow if you don't mind
<pitti> didrocks: C++ mangling is weird
<pitti> didrocks: I'm not sure whether .symbols files work reliably with C++
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, and I don't know if you look at the doxygen docâ¦
 * pitti throws a new pygobject into natty, with 10% more love
<didrocks> pitti: you mean, I should revert to shlibs?
<didrocks> ahah :)
<pitti> didrocks: I'd check how other packages deal with this, like Qt or boost, or other C++ libs
<didrocks> pitti: ok, looks like a nice thing for an early Friday task :) (Julie is already staring at me :))
<pitti> go! go! go!
<pitti> didrocks: have a nice evening! *hug*
<didrocks> pitti: have a nice evening! see you tomorrow :)
<mvo> tremolux: *nice* work
<tremolux> mvo: thx  :)
<rickspencer3> tremolux, I've been meaning to ask you and TheMuso about how the Unity accessibility work is going
<rickspencer3> tremolux, anything you tell me about that?
<mvo> tremolux: 3.1.2 tomorrow then!
<tremolux> mvo: coolness
<tremolux> rickspencer3: I have not done much on it beside background reading and to reach out to TheMuso
<rickspencer3> tremolux, hmmm, okay
<tremolux> rickspencer3: I need to get sync'd in now that he's got the effort in full swing
<rickspencer3> that's a bit concerning
<rickspencer3> tremolux, please do
<rickspencer3> we need *everybody* to be able to use Unity
<tremolux> rickspencer3: yes, no question
<rickspencer3> thanks dude
<rickspencer3> I keep seeing changes to the software-center blueprints, which is good
<rickspencer3> but am bummed that I am not seeing anything related to accessibility (from anybody, not specifically singling out tremolux)
<mvo> a11y for software-center? we did some work on this last cycle, it should be pretty good nowdays
<tremolux> mvo: he's referring to a11y for Unity
<rickspencer3> mvo, I pasted the strace for you while you were at dinner
<rickspencer3> (if you're still interested)
<mvo> rickspencer3: thanks, and in this "sync()" its hanging forever?
<mvo> tremolux: aha, software-center
<rickspencer3> mvo, yeah
<rickspencer3> mvo, I can totally understand if this is a self-inflicted wound and you don't have time, energy, or patience to work on it ;)
<mvo> heh :) well, its puzzling, it smells like a deeper problem, if sync() is not returning
<mvo> rickspencer3: anyhting in dmesg output that looks like a oops?
 * rickspencer3 looks
<mvo> rickspencer3: something like "Call Trace" in the output or somesuch
<mvo> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dpkg/+bug/624229 <- that looks like its the one
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 624229 in dpkg (Ubuntu) "dpkg hangs while unpacking replacement (affects: 7) (heat: 34)" [Undecided,New]
 * rickspencer3 looks
<rickspencer3> hmm
<rickspencer3> I do have an external USB drive plugged in
 * rickspencer3 tinkers
<mvo> rickspencer3: is that a netbook or a desktop you run this on?
<mvo> rickspencer3: e2fsck might also be worth a try (recovery mode supports running a fsck)
 * pitti waves good night, dinner time
<chrisccoulson> pitti - re bug 606910 - yes, that would work
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 606910 in packagekit (Ubuntu Lucid) (and 2 other projects) "[lucid] mozilla-packagekit cannot be installed with firefox 3.5 (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/606910
<chrisccoulson> did you want to do it? i was going to fix it, but I'd need somebody to sponsor it anyway
<mvo> rickspencer3: please keep me updated on your findings
<pitti> chrisccoulson: please go ahead, you can test it better than me; I can then sponsor and process the SRU
<chrisccoulson> and it's probably just quicker if somebody who can upload it fixes it ;)
<chrisccoulson> ok, i can do that
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<pitti> thanks to you!
 * pitti -> off for real
<mvo> kiwinote, tremolux: I get *dramatic* speedup from your speedup branches, almost 50% - excellent work \o/
<tremolux> mvo: woohoo!
 * mvo just had to say this and will go to bed now
<mvo> \o/!!!
<tremolux> thanks, goodnight mvo
 * mvo sits there and run software-cener --measure-startup-time in a loop because he like the result so much
<tremolux> mvo: haha! I agree it's very satisfying
<mvo> but you guys stole all the thunder ,)
<mvo> lets see much much more we can push it. the lower bound seems to be 0.3s (python startup overhead)
<mvo> on my sysstem anyway
<tremolux> bah, it's the team, all the team  :)
<tremolux> cool, sounds like a target  ;)
<mvo> lol
<mvo> team> indeed!
 * mvo is really off now and stops the --measure-startup-time loop
<bcurtiswx_> when i do an apt-cache show nux , i don't get anything, but i have nux installed.. i though
<bcurtiswx_> t
<bcurtiswx_> hmm, maybe because it's from a PPA that it won't show ?
<micahg> bcurtiswx_: should still show
<bcurtiswx_> hmm, it doesn't
<seb128> bye
<bryceh> cya seiflotfy
<bryceh> er seb128.... too late :-)
<mdeslaur> hmm...auto-completion race condition :)
<ogra> pitti, thats only temporary, we dont know what to do until january
<rodrigo_> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> rodrigo_, hey
<rodrigo_> robert_ancell, how is it going? already on Friday, right? :)
<robert_ancell> sure is!  trying to get yelp to compile...  I'm trying to work out how to override parent class construct only properties
<rodrigo_> oh, right, the yelp-xsl package in the PPA is just the XSL stuff
<robert_ancell> it's the old gnome-doc-utils
<rodrigo_> ah, ok
<rodrigo_> I haven't done much on the PPA today, apart from fixing some gnome-media and libgnome-media-profiles stuff that seb pointed out
<rodrigo_> tomorrow I'll keep going with more stuff
<robert_ancell> rodrigo_, ah cool, so I can install the media -dev package now?
<rodrigo_> yes, I think so
<rodrigo_> it installed fine here, but I did it by hand, so let me know of any problems
<rodrigo_> I just submitted a fixed one, with the correct conflicts, replaces
<rodrigo_> so wait a little bit, until it builds
<robert_ancell> np
<rodrigo_> I'll submit now the new g-s-d and go back to the sofa
<rodrigo_> robert_ancell, so, after yelp, what are you working on?
<robert_ancell> I have totem built, but it crashes due to a plugin.  I think it's probably a python one using GTK2.  I need to see if PyGTK3 is working
<robert_ancell> then evince probably
<rodrigo_> yes, I ported the invest applet to use introspection, and with gtk2 gir it crashes, and with gtk3 git it hangs
<rodrigo_> so not sure it works, at least from my short experience :)
<robert_ancell> the migration really is non-trivial!
<rodrigo_> robert_ancell, if you're not going to, maybe tomorrow I'll try gedit, it should be straightforward, right?
<rodrigo_> robert_ancell, yes, right
<robert_ancell> should be :)
<rodrigo_> ok, that'll be a change from packaging only libs :)
<robert_ancell> Feel free to package anything on the list that's not already got a work item (and check in bzr if it's part done)
<rodrigo_> ok
<rodrigo_> on the versions page you mean, right?
<robert_ancell> yes
<rodrigo_> should I open a bug for each module I work on?
<robert_ancell> and if it's not on the versions page and should be then we can fix it (the bzr branch is at the bottom of the page)
<rodrigo_> ah, ok
<robert_ancell> no, we did that originally, but I don't think it's worth it now - we don't seem to be having any conflicts.  Just make sure it's in bzr as UNRELEASED or open a bug.  (we had the bug tracking before we had work items)
<rodrigo_> ok
<rodrigo_> ok, new g-s-d built, so time for eod'ing
<rodrigo_> night robert_ancell, have a good weekend :)
<robert_ancell> rodrigo_, night! see you next week
<robert_ancell> RAOF, X org crashing in natty>
<robert_ancell> ?
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-11-19
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Not for me, obviously.
<RAOF> *Unity* 's not the most stable of beasts, but on Intel that's not X's fault, and on my R5450 that's because it's only recently supported.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, it's not starting on my VM after a dist-upgrade this morning.
<RAOF> Ok.  Time for me to dist-upgrade, then.
 * RAOF doesn't *recall* uploading a break-X package, though ;)
<robert_ancell> it might be a kernel change
<RAOF> Your VM doesn't doesn't actually have acceleration support, though, does it?
<RAOF> IE: it should be using VESA?
<RAOF> aka: /var/log/Xorg.0.log would be nice :)
<TheMuso> Unity and compiz were updated overnight.
<TheMuso> I.e unity using compiz is now in natty proper.
<RAOF> I've been playing with the unity PPA, so I think my testing experience should be portable to natty proper now.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, no acceleration, just running metacity
<RAOF> So it should be moderately difficult for X to not work for you :)
<fagan> thats the way ive been doing it switching between metacity and compiz
<robert_ancell> I was suprised!
<RAOF> fagan: âItâ?
<fagan> testing the new unity
<RAOF> Ah, right.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, bottom of the log is "Screens found, but none have a usable configuration".  It appears to be trying the CIRRUS driver
<robert_ancell> http://paste.ubuntu.com/534094/
<robert_ancell> RAOF, dmesg also looks interesting http://paste.ubuntu.com/534095/
<RAOF> Hm.  What's happened to my mouse input?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, do you have an external mouse?
<RAOF> Yup
<robert_ancell> and a trackpad
<RAOF> Nope.  This is a desktop.
 * RAOF installs ls-input to see if the kernel's transmitting events.
<robert_ancell> oh, X loses the mouse for me all the time.  I have to move the trackpad to get it back
<robert_ancell> took me ages to work that out
<RAOF> Hm.  VideoRAM: 0KB
<RAOF> It's therefore quite reasonable to exclude all modes on the basis of insufficient framebuffer size :)
<robert_ancell> so the kernel has probably broken it?  Or is there an ABI mismatch between the kernel and X?
<RAOF> Ah - yeah.  It looks like X is trying to map the pci device to probe video memory, the kernel's failing to do it properly, and X is throwing its hands up.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, who do I file the bug against?
<RAOF> The kernel.
<RAOF> I'd confirm this hypothesis by trying to boot the previous kernel, though.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, hmm, don't suppose you know how to get into grub in a vm?  I doesn't want to work
<RAOF> Holding down left-shift isn't winning?
<robert_ancell> no
<TheMuso> Modify the grub config to bring up the menu and timeout.
<robert_ancell> manual grub.cfg editing should do the trick
<TheMuso> Is the best option IMO.
<RAOF> Oh, yeah.  I was thinking you couldn't boot at all.
<robert_ancell> yay, back to X!
<TheMuso> I.e in /etc/default/grub
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, I just ended up reordering the kernels
 * TheMuso is running natty on bare metal earlier in the cycle than usual, and finding its quite ok actually.
<TheMuso> A few quirks, but I'm willing to work around them.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, I find you need to dist-upgrade early or late
<robert_ancell> damn, ubuntu-bug doesn't want to report from natty.  "This is not a genuine Ubuntu package"
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, how is Unity Accessibility going?
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Still getting my head around the accessibility library design, and particularly GObject. Never worked with it before, so I am having to learn some new concepts. Starting to get to the end of that and looking at the actual API I have to use, and understanding the concepts it uses. :)
<TheMuso> I hope to start writing some prototype code, i.e to create a fake accessible app in the next week.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, bug #677277
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 677277 in linux (Ubuntu) "Can't run X in VM after dist-upgrading to 2.6.37-5.13 (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/677277
<RAOF> Looks good.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, feel free to ping me about GObject.  It's quite a learning curve but I feel I'm most of the way to the top after 5 years or so :)
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Thanks. I feel I have most of the basics down, and having good usecase code to read and understand helps.
<robert_ancell> I find that hard to find too
<TheMuso> For anyone wanting to learn gobject and needing good code to try and get an understanding, I recommend this repo: git://github.com/zorgnax/gobject-examples.git
<TheMuso> Found it whilst googling for stuff.
<TheMuso> Particularly the bank account example, is a good one to really help get one's head around how things are constructed.
<TheMuso> Because its a perfectly practicle example of an object.
<robert_ancell> at-spi should migrate to vala :)
<TheMuso> lol there are 3 pieces of at-spi now, at least for the dbus migration.
<TheMuso> Python bindings, teh atk bridge, and the at-spi core itself.
<RAOF> Hah.  Turns out removing the apple origin sticker from the sensor of the mouse makes it work again :)
<TheMuso> lol
<Sarvatt> vmware is broken too fwiw https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/676759
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 676759 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "X11 (xorg) fails to start in natty on vmware (affects: 2) (heat: 12)" [Undecided,New]
<Sarvatt> robert_ancell, RAOF http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux-2.6.git;a=commit;h=8c05cd08a7504b855c265263e84af61aabafa329
<Sarvatt> jackpot? :)
<RAOF> Looks like it :)
<robert_ancell> Sarvatt, nice
<robert_ancell> Sarvatt, are you going to update my bug or shall I?
<Sarvatt> didn't I already?
<robert_ancell> Sarvatt, oh, race condition :)
<Sarvatt> already started the search for other bugs, its pretty wide impact
<Sarvatt> robert_ancell: should be good to go now, thanks for the heads up because knowing 2.6.37-4 worked pointed me at the fix, I saw jbarnes' pull request the other day and didn't read the commit message
<robert_ancell> Sarvatt, np, thanks for tracking it down!
<robert_ancell> dobey, can you comment on https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=635134?  A lot of people have broken intlttool/gettext builds
<ubot2> Gnome bug 635134 in general "[PATCH] Can't use both IT_PROG_INTLTOOL and AM_GNU_GETTEXT" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
 * TheMuso notes that he is running the -5 kernel without issue.
 * RAOF notes TheMuso is probably using a kms driver, and as such doesn't need to do any pci probing from userspace.
<RAOF> But that is a useful distinction to make; it won't be broken for *everyone*
<hyperair> say, how does this X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain thing work for desktop files in Ubuntu?
<TheMuso> RAOF: Ah ok makes sense.
<TheMuso> Well Orca is working with firefox 4 which is a good sign.
<micahg> \o/
<RAOF> Huzzah!
<TheMuso> Yeah I am pleased about that.
<dobey> robert_ancell: why are you calling AM_GNU_GETTEXT with intltool?
<robert_ancell> dobey, I'm not, I'm filing bugs against all the GNOME packages that do (which is pretty much them all)
<robert_ancell> dobey, do you understand the reasoning behind https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=624186 - this seems to have caused even more confusion
<ubot2> Gnome bug 624186 in general "Deprecate glib-gettext macros" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<dobey> robert_ancell: there is no reasoning in that report at all
<dobey> robert_ancell: but there is https://bugs.launchpad.net/intltool/+bug/654918 also
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 654918 in intltool "intltool doesn't work with upstream gettext (affects: 1) (heat: 4)" [Undecided,Invalid]
<robert_ancell> dobey, how about http://blogs.gnome.org/jjardon/2010/10/08/use-upstream-gettext-instead-the-glib-one?
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, got a minute for a vapigen question?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, sure
<kenvandine> i am beating my head against the wall here with dbusmenu on natty
<dobey> robert_ancell: i think it is a flawed assumption and nothing more. misinformation afaict
<kenvandine> i had to patch gobject-introspection to get some glib refreshes from git master
<kenvandine> which fixed most of my errors
<kenvandine> but
<kenvandine> now i think there are namespace issues
<kenvandine> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/534143/
<kenvandine> if i drop the namespace from DbusmenuGtk-0.2.tmp.gir for MenuClass and ClientClass those errors go away
<kenvandine> which i don't know if that is the right thing to do
<kenvandine> ideas?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, can you paste the contents of them?
<dobey> robert_ancell: i don't know why jjardon is on the upstream-only for gettext kick; but it's wrong.
<kenvandine> and the other errors make me think the Gtk-2.0 and Gdk-2.0 girs are busted
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, of which?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, the .gir files
<kenvandine> well the Gtk and Gdk are stock natty
<robert_ancell> dobey, we need a GNOME goal - fix all the screwed up i18n build systems
<kenvandine> i know namespace stuff has gotten stricter
<dobey> robert_ancell: all anything using intltool needs to call is IT_PROG_INTLTOOL
<dobey> robert_ancell: if people would RTFM, they would know this already
<robert_ancell> dobey, can you give me a link to the manual?
<kenvandine> sigh... pastebin is making firefox angry
<kenvandine> oh... it doesn't like the xml format..
<dobey> robert_ancell: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~intltool/intltool/trunk/annotate/head%3A/README
<kenvandine> http://dpaste.org/tZ4G/
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, ^^ that is DbusmenuGtk-0.2.gir
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, very weird, I'm no help sorry
<kenvandine> bummer
<kenvandine> it's driving me nuts
<kenvandine> it works fine on maverick :/
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, what's the vapigen command?
<kenvandine> i haven't even gotten to trying to make it build with gtk3 too
<kenvandine> one sec
<dobey> anyway, i gotta go. night
<robert_ancell> dobey, ok, thanks
<kenvandine> vapigen --library=DbusmenuGtk-0.2   --pkg atk --pkg Dbusmenu-Glib-0.2 --vapidir=../libdbusmenu-glib DbusmenuGtk-0.2.tmp.gir
<kenvandine> but that isn't going to work
<kenvandine> you need a patched gobject-introspection
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, the thing is that MenuClass is not in the gtk+-2.0.vapi file
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> i know
<kenvandine> but it must be on maverick...
<kenvandine> oh... well
<kenvandine> the gir is generated
<robert_ancell> it's not
<kenvandine> so it must be getting it wrong
<robert_ancell> are classes exposed in vala?
<kenvandine> i think so
<kenvandine> yeah, they are
<robert_ancell> perhaps the .gir file needs to mark this as "this is a class object, so don't try and generate vala objects for it"
<kenvandine> the MenuClass and ClientClass errors i am less concerned with
<kenvandine> although i would like to understand what is up there too
<kenvandine> but all those other errors
<kenvandine> from Gdk-2.0.gir and Gtk-2.0.gir
<kenvandine> doesn't that sound like broken deps in the gir/typelib?
<robert_ancell> if you look at Gtk-2.0.gir it is marked as "glib:is-gtype-struct-for="Menu"
<kenvandine> Gtk-2.0.gir:0.0-0.0: error: The type name `GLib.TypeInterface' could not be found
<robert_ancell> but the class in DbusmenuGtk-0.2.gir it's not marked as a is-type-struct-for
<kenvandine> i can probably fix those with annotations
<kenvandine> but what do you make of those other errors?
<robert_ancell> I'd expect the interface to be the same, without annotation vala probably assumes every record is an object
<kenvandine> or do you think the failures from DbusmenuGtk-0.2.gir trigger other errors?
<robert_ancell> the others are functions..
<robert_ancell> so is DbusmenuGtk-0.2.tmp.gir automatically generated?
<kenvandine> but they aren't defined
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> during the build
<robert_ancell> which might mean the docstrings need more annotating?  Or the class macros are not in standard form or something?
<kenvandine> probably
<kenvandine> looking at the source it looks like it shouldn't be Gtk.MenuClass
<kenvandine> but DbusmenuGtk.MenuClass
<kenvandine> so a namespace issue
<kenvandine> i actually found my namespaces in libgwibber-gtk were terribly broken
<kenvandine> vapa-0.12 fixes a bunch of problems there
<robert_ancell> ah
<kenvandine> so libgwibber-gtk had stuff in the wrong namespace
<kenvandine> that was fun figuring out too )
<robert_ancell> are you building on natty?   You should be using vala-0.12 then
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> yes... i am
<kenvandine> so i am sure i can fix those 2 errors... but what about the functions that it can't find from Gdk-2.0.gir and Gtk-2.0.gir
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, in maverick GLib.TypeInterface should be Gobject.TypeInterface
<kenvandine> same in natty
<robert_ancell> has gtk and gobject been built at different times/with different options/versions?
<kenvandine> maybe
<kenvandine> my hunch was basically broken deps in the gir
<kenvandine> essentially
<robert_ancell> but it looks like they're explicitly referring to the wrong name
<kenvandine> yeah, so you see the error says GLib.TypeInterface
<kenvandine> i can't find that in the gir
<robert_ancell> oh, weird
<robert_ancell> it will be nice when we get over the introspection and vala growing pains :)
<kenvandine> yeah :)
<kenvandine> so i was thinking maybe the typelib doesn't match what the gir says
<kenvandine> since i suspect it is using
<kenvandine> that for speed reasons
<kenvandine> i guess there is a tool for generating a gir from the typelib
<kenvandine> let me do that...
<kenvandine> well that's nifty
<kenvandine> g-ir-generate  /usr/lib/girepository-1.0/Gtk-2.0.typelib
<kenvandine> but nothing about GLib.TypeInterface
<kenvandine> so must be on vapigen's side
<robert_ancell> have you asked in #vala?
<kenvandine> earlier
<kenvandine> but that was kind of the previous problem...
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, gtg, hope you sort it out!
<kenvandine> me too :)
<kenvandine> later!
<Sarvatt> hmm, opengl isn't enabled by default in compiz after upgrading to natty?
<RAOF> WFM.  I think.  I did a bunch of initial setup, care of settings not being transferred from 0.8
<Sarvatt> it was enabled but not checked in ccsm, that was odd
<Sarvatt> checked it and it enabled composite, then unchecked it and it wanted to disabled a ton of plugins that were already enabled
<Sarvatt> and didn't flicker after enabling it
<Sarvatt> .. I was set on none in appearance preferences, goes to show how much I notice compiz outside of transparency :)
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> Not hitting the button marked âunityâ yet?
<RAOF> Aaah, mklib, mklib, mklib.  Why?
<Sarvatt> where? nothing in ccsm
<RAOF> Oh.  That would be because unity-compiz doesn't seem to be in natty yet.
<TheMuso> Yes it is.
<TheMuso> At least I thought I saw it on natty-changes.
<RAOF> Maybe it hadn't built last time I updated; I see 0.2.46-0ubuntu5 in apt-cache policy
<Sarvatt> looks like it build deps on nux which only built on i386
<TheMuso> Yeah it probably didn't build. :)
<kklimonda> good morning
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<didrocks> Riddell: hey, do you have time for a small question? :)
<rodrigo__> morning
<didrocks> hey rodrigo__!
<rodrigo__> hi didrocks
<didrocks> pitti: re:nux from what I see kde libs are using symbols files as well. I really don't know why the symbols exported in the chroot is different from the one we get directly building (doesn't seem to have any optional build-dep). I will try to get a working natty pbuilder this time and generate the symbol files from there, but that will be quickly hell :/
<didrocks> pitti: ok, nux as symbols issues and they differ from arch to arch, reverting to a .shlibs if you don't mind
<pitti> didrocks: ah, arch specific
<pitti> didrocks: so KDE libs have per-arch symbol files?
<pitti> (I think that works somehow)
<didrocks> pitti: yes, they have. But as nux is really moving a lot (and they don't ensure API/ABI stability for now), I think that's just overkill as I'll have to upload to a ppa to adjust the symbols file each week
<pitti> didrocks: hm, they keep breaking the ABI very often?
<pitti> didrocks: then symbols and shlibs files don't make much sense anyway
<didrocks> pitti: sure, we we need shlibs to be able to get a versionned nux dep for unity, isn't it?
<didrocks> other it will dep on libnux-0.9 without any version and won't force people to upgrade to latest nux with latest unity
<didrocks> or is there something I miss?
<pitti> right, you'd need to bump shlibs manually or add strict dependencies to unity
<didrocks> yeah, let me look if I can do something more elegant than overriding dh_makeshlibs with dh7
<pitti> didrocks: I think you can also add a second << dependency to the shlibs
<pitti> to require a particular upstream versino
<didrocks> ok, let's have a try with libfoo1 (>= 1.0), libfoo1 (<< 1.1)
<pitti> yay, my apport GIR/GTK-3.0 port works
<didrocks> congrats pitti :)
<didrocks> pitti: can you NEW to main (the MIR is already done): https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nux/0.9.4-0ubuntu2/+build/2053778 and https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nux/0.9.4-0ubuntu2/+build/2053776 please?
<pitti> didrocks: where's the MIR? I need to promote the source as well and close it
<didrocks> pitti: bug #677136
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 677136 in nux (Ubuntu) "[MIR] nux (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/677136
<pitti> oh, "done" means "created", not "approved"
<pitti> didrocks: do we really need to ship two 0.5 MB .bmp files? we can't use png?
<didrocks> pitti: I've already discuss that upstream and there will be some changes to that, just not now
<pitti> ok
<pitti> didrocks: you shold actually subscribe ~ubuntu-mir :)
<pitti> didrocks: accepted
<didrocks> pitti: subscribed and thanks!
<Riddell> didrocks: did your small question get answered?
<didrocks> Riddell: yeah, I opened some lib{qt,kde}* to see if symbol files were ok with C++, the issue was arch related :) sorry for the noise
<rodrigo__> hmm, wth does this fail -> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/59312438/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-amd64.gnome-settings-daemon_2.91.3-0ubuntu1~build2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz ???
<rodrigo__> all the deps are ok in the package
<rodrigo__> ah, I think I found it!
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo__, bug 676519
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 676519 in gnome-settings-daemon (Ubuntu) "link failing despite the right linking arguments are presents on command line (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/676519
<rodrigo__> ah
<kklimonda> yet another source of ftbfs?
<kklimonda> good afternoon
<didrocks> good afternoon kklimonda
<kklimonda> hey didrocks :)
<rodrigo__> key kklimonda
<rodrigo__> kklimonda, did you get your git account?
<kklimonda> rodrigo__: yes - I'm planning on starting the branch tonight.
<rodrigo__> kklimonda, cool
<kklimonda> rodrigo__: I was trying to figure out how to create shiny interfaces and failed ;)
<rodrigo__> I was wondering if there was a need for a 2nd person to approve the account, but I see my influences are enough :)
<rodrigo__> kklimonda, oh, with glade?
<rodrigo__> kklimonda, oh, if you want to play with interfaces, you might be interested in https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/+junk/guton
<rodrigo__> kklimonda, a good way to test the couchdb-glib api and play with uis at the same time :)
<kklimonda> rodrigo__: well, not with glade - I don't like glade. But I was actually looking for alternatives to Gtk+ for creating "touch" interfaces - I took a look at Mx, then read about Nux, then saw that Meego is migrating completely to Qt.. and I've decided to go, look for a drink ;)
<rodrigo__> :)
<rodrigo__> "I started drinking because I didn't know what toolkit to use" :D
<rodrigo__> kklimonda, for touch interfaces, you might want to talk with garnacho, he has a gtk branch for that
<kklimonda> looks like I'm in a grumpy mood today :)
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti - would you mind processing bug 655707 for maverick please?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 655707 in pango1.0 (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 3 other projects) "Firefox crashes opening pages that use webfonts (affects: 4) (heat: 24)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/655707
<chrisccoulson> (i'm also going to fix this in lucid, but i still need to test that)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: you mean process SRU uploads? was just about to (just back from lunch)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - sort of. i can't upload pango, so it needs sponsoring :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, I see; yup, will do
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I don't see a lucid debdiff there, am I missing something?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - just testing that
<chrisccoulson> pitti - google also fixed their website, so i'm not sure how we can get users to test it :/
<chrisccoulson> (that would have been the test-case otherwise)
<pitti> perhaps there's another page for it?
<pitti> if not, why do the SRU in the first place?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - because any website that has a broken font in this way crashes firefox
<pitti> but it's hard to craft or find a demo page for this?
<pitti> bzr merge lp:~chrisccoulson/pango/maverick-proposed
<pitti> bzr: ERROR: Branches have no common ancestor, and no merge base revision was specified.
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so this is not against lp:ubuntu/maverick/pango1.0?
<pitti> but an earlier revision of lp:~ubuntu-desktop/pango/ubuntu ?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, sorry, this came from lp:~ubuntu-desktop/pango/ubuntu originally. i did the update there, and then robert updated it again to 1.28.3 and uploaded to natty before we did the SRU
<pitti> meh, there are no tags in our ubuntu branch
<pitti> use debcommit -r, folks!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'll merge this against r6 then
<chrisccoulson> hmmmm, that wasn't me who didn't use debcommit -r ;)
<chrisccoulson> (i don't think anyway)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, some funky stuff is going on with my screen
<chrisccoulson> white boxes keep appearing and obscuring parts of the screen, and then disappearing again
<chrisccoulson> nice!
<geser> didrocks: why packaging unity 3.1.4-0ubuntu1 you dropped the epoch for netbook-launcher; that's why you got now a "Failed upload" for your recent unity upload
<didrocks> geser: I know, that's an overlook when converting to dh7
<didrocks> geser: as I had to rewrite the whole debian/rules for compiz plugin
<didrocks> geser: I'm looking how to override dh_gencontrol for a package name, but can't get the var name for the current bin package to make it
<didrocks> geser: any idea how to do that?
<geser> thinking about it
<didrocks> basically, it's a:
<didrocks> dh_override_dh_gencontrol:
<didrocks> <and there detect which bin package is building>
<geser> is dh_override_dh_gencontrol run per source package or per produced binary package?
<didrocks> oh, it's per source looking at the log
<didrocks> humâ¦ that won't be easy thenâ¦
<pitti> geser: once for a build
<didrocks> let me look what cdbs does
<pitti> didrocks: cdbs calls the rules once per binary, with a -p argument usually
<geser> I might have an idea but it's really, really hacky: sed on the DEBIAN/control file for network-launcher before dh_gencontrol is called
<didrocks> pitti: ok, that's why it was easier to set the target in that caseâ¦
<didrocks> well, I can relaunch dpkg-gencontrol manually as well for netbook-launcher
<didrocks> that will be a little less ugly :)
<geser> true
<didrocks> I really find nothing in the doc or by grepping
<geser> you might need to check if netbook-launcher got build (i386) or not (e.g. amd64) before you call dh_gencontrol for it
<geser> hmm, do substvars also work in Version?
<didrocks> geser: true about version checking
<didrocks> hum, I hope so :)
<didrocks> I can get the version pretty easily otherwise
<didrocks> ok, let me a try in my ppa
<geser> didrocks: I'm really surprised how you managed to get *3* unity version published at the same time :) (see the FTBFS page before it gets updated)
<didrocks> geser: 3 unity version published? sorry not sure to follow :)
<geser> didrocks: http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs/ and look for unity
<geser> it lists the "published" versions with FTBFS
<didrocks> geser: oh right, nice :)
<geser> sometimes two versions are listed (for the same pocket) if the script fetches the data while LP publishes one version and before the older one gets superseded, but it's the first time I see three versions
<didrocks> geser: just because it's unity "3" :)
<pitti> didrocks: we are a bit behind on http://people.canonical.com/~platform/workitems/natty/canonical-desktop-team-natty-alpha-1.html, but it looks like a lot of your WIs are just about to land, right?
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, I'll close 3/4 of them
<didrocks> pitti: just finishing to deal with netbook-launcher epoch
<didrocks> 4 uploads from unity, 2 because of me, 2 because of upstream, that's equivalent :)
<didrocks> not a good day though :/
<bilalakhtar> hmm, I see that seb128 uploaded a new version of GIMP yesterday
<bilalakhtar> which has FTBFS'd now
 * bilalakhtar makes the change so that a sponsor can review
<bilalakhtar> so is anyone over here working on it or can I go ahead?
<didrocks> seems nobody is working on it
<didrocks> pitti: do you want me to close them now
<bilalakhtar> here comes seb128 :D what a timing !
<pitti> didrocks: not that urgent, but if you wish -- will give you a cozy feeling for the weekend :)
<seb128> no, I'm not working today
<bilalakhtar> seb128: Are you working on GIMP FTBFS? it is an easy fix and I can do it
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> I started IRC to say something to somebody but don't plan to stay or do any work
<seb128> hey pitti
<didrocks> pitti: ok, will do in one hour if everything is fine :)
<pitti> seb128: have a look at the planet for some good news :)
<seb128> bilalakhtar, if that's not yet another debian rules workaround as we got opened twice sure
<seb128> pitti, great ;-) I noticed the upload you did
<bilalakhtar> seb128: btw the GIM lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gimp/ubuntu
<bilalakhtar> is not updated
<bilalakhtar> *GIMP
<seb128> oh, I didn't though it would be in a vcs, feel free to update it
<didrocks> ok, got the netbook-launcher versionning with dh7, quite hackish, but wellâ¦
 * bilalakhtar makes both the changes
<seb128> pitti, just reading email, the ibus fix is in natty
<seb128> ok, I was just passing by and checking everything was ok
<seb128> time to go for some swimming
<pitti> enjoy!
<seb128> pitti, thanks!
<didrocks> pitti: well, I let this debian/rules in the "hasckish" section, if you have some idea or just cross some documentation one day, do not hesitate
<didrocks> now, ubuntu-netbook-default-settings and then I'll update the WI
<bilalakhtar> Did you people begin accepting gtk3 updates?
<didrocks> bilalakhtar: we will deal with application requiring gtk3 later in the cycle
<bilalakhtar> didrocks: hmm
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, ETOOMUCHCAKE
<rickspencer3> didrocks, hey, I'm doing a dist-upgrade
<rickspencer3> will I be getting new unity?
<rickspencer3> (I saw new compiz)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: libunity3 is not newed yet, I'm waiting for amd64 to be built to ping people
<rickspencer3> alrighty
<chrisccoulson> ooh, i'll have to upgrade later when it's newed :)
<didrocks> (it finishes building on amd64 btw)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, should I try to install the PPA again, or should I wait?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: I'll say "wait" :)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: did your issue with glew is fixed?
<rickspencer3> well, it seemed to be an apt-get bug
<didrocks> I don't think that not using the PPA will change anything, the files comes from the archives
<rickspencer3> I unplugged my USB hard drive, rebooted, deleted the lock files, dpkg --configure -a
<rickspencer3> then apt-get purged unity
<rickspencer3> and it looked like it upgraded the package
<rickspencer3> so I *think* apt-get is working again
<kenvandine> mterry, good progress on my gir/vapi woes... we need to patch gtk and friends to includes _PACKAGES for g-ir-scanner
<didrocks> will be nice then :)
<mterry> kenvandine, I don't know what _PACKAGES means, but I do know what "good progress" means, so awesome!  :)
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> well, you Gtk_2.0_gir_PACKAGES
<kklimonda> damn, I've missed Sebastien. :)
<kenvandine> you set that to gtk+-2.0
<kklimonda> ah, he's not working
<kenvandine> and it adds the right <package/> tag
<kenvandine> so we need to do that for everything that provides a gir
 * kenvandine is starting with gtk2
<mterry> kenvandine, and that's what tells valac to skip gtk+-2.0 if both are on the path?
<mterry> or rather, both in deps
<kenvandine> not skip, but that Gtk-2.0 and gtk+-2.0 are the same
<mterry> right
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> that tag seems pretty new in gobject-introspection
<mterry> kenvandine, that seems awefully vala-specific for a bit of gir metadata.  what would python do with that info?
<kenvandine> but it makes vapigen happy
<kenvandine> it isn't really the vapi pkg name
<kenvandine> it is the pkgconfig pkg name
<kenvandine> which i think vala follows
<didrocks> pitti: can you NEW libunity3 on both i386 and amd64 please?
<kenvandine> so i guess it is useful for other reasons
<mterry> ah
<rickspencer3> didrocks, so after pitti news it, I just dist-upgrade?
<rickspencer3> ubuntu-desktop gets replaces, and I am running Unity?
<kenvandine> mterry, pretty painful to get to this point... i haven't even tried to start on getting dbusmenu to build for gtk3!
<pitti> didrocks: looking
<mterry> kenvandine, I remember it building fine for me, but maybe I didn't do this vapi stuff then
<didrocks> rickspencer3: no, you have to apt-get install unity, it's not in the default seed (can't do that before it was published or it would have been a MISMATCHED COMPONENT)
<rickspencer3> I see
<rickspencer3> didrocks should I remove the PPA from my sources list, or will I get more frequent updates if I keep it there?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: depends on which ppa
<pitti> didrocks: done
<didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: https://launchpad.net/~unity/+archive/ppa will get no more update
<rickspencer3> didrocks, the unity one from the wiki documentation
 * rickspencer3 removes PPA
<didrocks> https://launchpad.net/~unity/+archive/daily is daily buildâ¦ with all that can happen  :)
<rickspencer3> I think I'll stick with main ;)
<didrocks> nice though :)
 * didrocks uploads ubuntu-netbook-default-settings and can say "UNE is dead on !armel \o/"
<kklimonda> why is it?
<didrocks> kklimonda: unity will be clever enough to say "I'm on a netbook" or "I'm on a desktop", look at https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-bringing-desktop-and-netbook-image-closer
<kklimonda> ah, I see
<didrocks> less clutter for people :)
<kklimonda> great
<kklimonda> when will be new unity ready for the daily use?
<didrocks> kklimonda: I already use it daily, it's fine for a "pre-alpha" stage as we didn't reach alpha1 yet
<kklimonda> choices, choices :)
<kklimonda> I've been upgrading my main system near a1 for few cycles already..
<kklimonda> maybe i should do it again :)
<didrocks> kklimonda: it's a compiz plugin, it can be easily activated/deactivated (and we will provide session for that) :)
<kklimonda> right, even better
<rodrigo__> mterry, did you package gtksourceview3 and gedit with gtk3?
<mterry> rodrigo__, gtksourceview3 is in the archive, I believe.  I'm running gtk3 gedit locally, but I have to clean up the packaging a bit, and I'm doing other stuff first
<rodrigo_> mterry, oh, I didn't see it, that's why I ask
 * rodrigo_ updates again
 * mterry checks
<mterry> rodrigo_, oh I believe it's in NEW
<mterry> rodrigo_, it's blocking you?
<rodrigo_> mterry, no, just that I looked for it this morning, and couldn't find it
<rodrigo_> but not blocking me, don't worry
<rodrigo_> mterry, is it on a branch somewhere?
<mterry> rodrigo_, no.  gtksourceview2 wasn't an ubuntu-desktop branch, so I didn't make this one (plus, thought we were trying to avoid new ones of those)
<mterry> rodrigo_, I don't know when lp:ubuntu/gtksourceview3 is live (I assume after NEW approval)
<rodrigo_> mterry, ah, ok
<mterry> rodrigo_, you can download it from launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtksourceview3 though
<rodrigo_> are we getting rid of the ~ubuntu-desktop existing branches?
<mterry> rodrigo_, I don't think a decision has been made about that
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i have a test case for the pango crash now
<pitti> chrisccoulson: cool!
<chrisccoulson> i have hosted a web page with the broken font in it ;)
<chrisccoulson> it crashes firefox fairly repeatably here in lucid
<chrisccoulson> time to test the patch now ;)
<didrocks> pitti: congrats on the GIR/GTK3 port :) (just had the time to read it now)
<pitti> didrocks: thanks! language-selector and usb-creator will be my next victims
<didrocks> hehe, pitti the pygiconverter :)
<bilalakhtar> I am facing a wierd problem with a merge proposal. the ~u-d branch of gimp is some old branch format, while lp:gimp is 2a . When I push, it always converts to new and stacks on lp:gimp. Now, proposing to ~u-d branch doesn't generate diff
<bilalakhtar> okay, a resubmit worked
<bilalakhtar> Could someone please sponsor https://code.launchpad.net/~bilalakhtar/gimp/ftbfs-fix-and-branch-update/+merge/41326 ?
<didrocks> FYI, commented on the merge request ^
<bilalakhtar> didrocks: Thanks thanks for the review!
<didrocks> bilalakhtar: oh you're back :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, i've attached a patch for lucid to bug 655707 as well now
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 655707 in pango1.0 (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 3 other projects) "Firefox crashes opening pages that use webfonts (affects: 4) (heat: 24)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/655707
<didrocks> bilalakhtar: no worry, I hope the example will help you
<bilalakhtar> yes, I was going to go offline when I noticed yout thing
<bilalakhtar> didrocks: but in this case, all binaries need gobject
<didrocks> bilalakhtar: right, but it should be add in configure.ac then
<bilalakhtar> okay
<didrocks> bilalakhtar: it's a patch we want to fix and report upstream
<bilalakhtar> thanks for the review, making a quilt patch out of it
<didrocks> bilalakhtar: is there a pkgcheck that are linked to every binaries?
<didrocks> (if so, you should add it there)
<bilalakhtar> doesn't seem so
<pitti> chrisccoulson: have release meeting now, but I'll sponsor it as a side thing, thanks!
<bilalakhtar> didrocks: so THAT's why seb wanted to avoid debian/rules workarounds!
<didrocks> bilalakhtar: exactly :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti, excellent, thanks :)
<didrocks> bilalakhtar: yeah, seems there is no suitable flag for that, weird, I would say add a PKG_CHECK_MODULES or copy what's done for glib
<bilalakhtar> didrocks: okay, will do that once my thing downloads the upstream tarball
<bilalakhtar> by connection is horribly slow
<bilalakhtar> *my
<didrocks> bilalakhtar: sure, no hurry :)
<bilalakhtar> thanks
<ari-tczew> bilalakhtar: bug 677133
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 677133 in gimp (Ubuntu) "gimp 2.6.11-1ubuntu1 FTBFS in natty (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/677133
<pitti> chrisccoulson: dang, pango1.0 FTBFS in maverick-proposed
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, it built here :/
<chrisccoulson> oh
<chrisccoulson> on armel and ppc
<chrisccoulson> pitti - have all the glib packages been published yet?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, glib related? haven't looked at all into it (still in meeting)
<chrisccoulson> it just looks like version skew with glib in maverick-proposed
<pitti> chrisccoulson: glib was accepted around the same time, could have been mid-air collision with them
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'll retry the builds in an hour then
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i think that's all it is
<chrisccoulson> libglib2.0-dev : Depends: libglib2.0-bin (= 2.26.0-0ubuntu1) but it is not going to be installed
<ogra> chrisccoulson, i see the same for my QT build
<ogra> but only on ppc
<bilalakhtar> :( I will let him work then, ari-tczew
<ogra> pitti, ^^^
<bilalakhtar> didrocks: bug #677133 already has BlackZ working on it
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 677133 in gimp (Ubuntu) "gimp 2.6.11-1ubuntu1 FTBFS in natty (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/677133
<didrocks> bilalakhtar: ok, thanks for the notice!
<rickspencer3> new firefox is working well for me so far
<pitti> yeah, here as well; just one crash, but otherwise behaving
<didrocks> it's just weird when coming back from chromium (the used font), but looks nice :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - bug 606910 is tested and ready to go as well now
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 606910 in packagekit (Ubuntu Lucid) (and 2 other projects) "[lucid] mozilla-packagekit cannot be installed with firefox 3.5 (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/606910
<chrisccoulson> pitti - you got a crash in firefox? did you send the crash report upstream? :)
<pitti> nto yet, sorry; was in a hurry (meeting)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: need sponsoring for PK?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i can't upload PK
<chrisccoulson> did you get the crash reporter dialog?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, I did get it
<chrisccoulson> that's ok then :)
<geser> didrocks: re the unity epoch: have you considered using "dh_gencontrol -pnetbook-launcher -- -Vcoreabiversion=20101111 -v2:$(DEB_VERSION)" instead of doing it all yourself?
<didrocks> geser: ohoh, that would have been a lot smarter, I didn't tried it (was afraid on !i386 behavior)
<didrocks> geser: will try with next upload
<didrocks> geser: I'm afraid about the arguments to be given to others or not erased, let's see
<geser> didrocks: I tried it inside the if block, just instead calling dpkg-gencontrol yourself (and the other commands after around it)
<didrocks> geser: no need from the rm, it overwrites them too?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: uploaded, thank you!
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thank you too :)
<geser> I had just the dh_gencontrol call and checked afterwards the package information for netbook-launcher (I had to comment out the if too, so it gets run for me on amd64 too when building arch-indep)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I (blindly) retried the pango build
<chrisccoulson> thanks. that should work now hopefully
<didrocks> geser: nice! will integrate in next upload, thanks :)
<didrocks> still a bit hackish, but a little bit lessâ¦
<geser> my first try to add "Version: 2:${binary:Version}" to netbook-launcher in debian/control unfortunately didn't work :(
<chrisccoulson> pitti - also, would you mind approving the xulrunner-2.0 source in NEW? (sorry to keep pestering you) ;)
<rodrigo_> ok, need to get out, so maybe bbl, if not have a good weekend everybody :-D
<didrocks> geser: yeah, I tried that some time ago (for maverick  :))
<geser> didrocks: looks like you can even skip the if check and call dh_gencontrol -pnetbook-launcher â¦ in every build. Just tried it for an arch-only build in my pbuilder and got only "dh_gencontrol: No packages to build." as response
<didrocks> geser: thanks for the notice and yeah for simplicity :)
<mterry> didrocks, are there instructions for testing the new unity?  I get that I have to use ccsm to enable it, but do I have to do something special to turn off normal gnome-panel, etc?
<didrocks> mterry: not really, you can turn it off, but it's quite hackish if you want to
<didrocks> mterry: so, keep your gnome-panel :)
<mterry> didrocks, what sort of bug reports are useful at this early stage?  I assume a lot of what I'm seeing is "known; we're on it" sort of stuff
<didrocks> mterry: not really, but thinking about it, I should file the icon bugs
<didrocks> it's almost fixed already, but well
<didrocks> one sec :)
<mterry> didrocks, icon bug?
<didrocks> mterry: if you make the panel floating, the ws switcher still appears and don't react
<mterry> didrocks, well, there's stuff like no network manager icon (presumably because intentionally dropped legacy status icon) and no expose mode when clicking on the current app icon etc.
<mterry> didrocks, I assume that's all known?
<mterry> no context menu for icons
<mterry> (well, dummy context menu)
<didrocks> mterry: yeah, no notification area, someone will file it, I'm sure, but it's on purpose
<didrocks> no expose mode when clicking on the current app icon?
<Sarvatt> shadow on the panel by default? :)
<didrocks> hum, even if you have more than one window?
<mterry> like, I have four firefox windows say
<didrocks> mterry: no context is already filed
<mterry> clicking on the firefox icon doesn't enter expose mode for the firefox windows
<didrocks> mterry: you have more than one?
<mterry> yup
<mterry> sounds like a bug  :)
<mterry> didrocks is my dup checker
<didrocks> hehe :)
 * didrocks high fives mterry
<mterry> :)
<didrocks> mterry: do you get the same behavior with others windows?
<didrocks> like multiple terminals, click on the launcher
<mterry> yeah
<mterry> same behavior
<mterry> also, i can't ctrl+alt+t...  :-/
<didrocks> hum, and you have some dots showing that you have multiple windows?
<mterry> yup
<didrocks> mterry: that's compiz
<mterry> damn it compiz
<mterry> I need my terminals
<didrocks> mterry: for that, you should reset your config
<didrocks> rm -rf ~/.config/compiz-1
<didrocks> and restart compiz
<didrocks> (it sometimes dump the config randomely, so switch to metacity between)
<pitti> so long, have a nice weekend everyone!
<didrocks> enjoy your week-end pitti!
<geser> pitti: you too
<Sarvatt> take care pitti
<didrocks> Sarvatt: whishlist btw, should be discussed on aytana ML :)
<didrocks> mterry: when you restart, you should see gconf backend in ccsm
<didrocks> and ensure you have latest compiz btw, I've made some changes for that
<mterry> didrocks, eh, I'll deal with that later
<mterry> didrocks, too busy filing bugs!  :)
<didrocks> mterry: ahah :)
<kenvandine> man i hate git, just had to get that off my chest
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> i don't mind git ;)
<chrisccoulson> but then, i also don't mind C++, so i'm already a bit strange
 * mterry adds unity project tasks to all these bugs; didrocks owes me a beer
<didrocks> mterry: hehe, thanks for spamming me :)
<mterry> didrocks, you can unsubscribe!
 * didrocks does
<didrocks> kidding :)
<didrocks> mterry: weird, I can't reproduce 2 on 3 of your bugs
<didrocks> the menu one and the expose mode
<chrisccoulson> oh, just installing the new unity now :)
<mterry> didrocks, hrm.  maybe expose could be hw related, but I wouldn't think the menu one would be
<didrocks> mterry: don't think, it's compiz expose which is used
<didrocks> mterry: do you have the plugin activated or did you change the defaults?
<didrocks> in a word, does Super + E works :)
<didrocks> mterry: nothing related, but do you know the difference in gsettings between a path and an id?
<didrocks> (conceptually speaking :))
<mterry> didrocks, path is only ever used in the UI and perhaps the backing store
<mterry> didrocks, API wise, everything uses the id
<didrocks> mterry: but the path is unique
<mterry> didrocks, I don't know why they even bother having a path, so perhaps I can't actually answer that
<didrocks> so, it's an "id"?
<mterry> didrocks, well, id is supposed to be unique too
<didrocks> desrt isn't thereâ¦
<didrocks> mterry: yeah, for me, we could have used id in the UI
<mterry> didrocks, oh!
<didrocks> as a dbus scheme
<mterry> didrocks, sorry, I know the answer
<mterry> didrocks, ID is for the schema
 * didrocks listens
<mterry> didrocks, path is for an instance of the schema
<didrocks> ?
<didrocks> not sure to get it :)
<mterry> didrocks, you can have pathless-schemas that can be used in multiple paths
<mterry> didrocks, my gsettings port of unity did this for favorites
<mterry> didrocks, because the path was not known ahead of time
<didrocks> waow, need to look for a real exampleâ¦ I don't get it at all :)
<mterry> didrocks, difference between Gtk.Window and a variable that is a Gtk.Window
<mterry> didrocks, id is unique identifier for the schema, path is unique identifier for an instance of the schema
<didrocks> oh ok, as everything needs to have a schema
<didrocks> you need to get some kind of class to describe the structure
<mterry> yeah
<didrocks> ok :)
<didrocks> but as in the API, you use the id
<didrocks> how do you get a specific instance?
<mterry> didrocks, you can also use path in the API, but if schema provides a default path, you don't need to
<mterry> so I was wrong when I said path isn't in API
<didrocks> mterry: oh ok :)
<didrocks> mterry: I should look at your unity branch to get a concrete example I guess
<didrocks> but at least, now, I get the idea :)
<didrocks> mterry: opening  https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/unity/gsettings, I'll have a look over the week-end
<didrocks> don't delete your branch!
<didrocks> thanks mterry :)
<mterry> didrocks, :) np
<didrocks> ok, time for week-end there!
<mterry> didrocks, see ya!
<ari-tczew> mterry: do you will take merge anjuta?
<mterry> ari-tczew, you mean from Debian?
<ari-tczew> mterry: yep
<mterry> ari-tczew, I was planning on updating anjuta to latest GTK+ 3.0 version, skipping over Debian, actually
<mterry> ari-tczew, I should mark that on merges.u.c
<ari-tczew> mterry: would be nice
<mterry> ari-tczew, thanks for the notice!
<mterry> ari-tczew, done!
<ari-tczew> mterry: so grabbing changes from Debian is no sense? they have added some patches
<mterry> ari-tczew, I'll do that too when I update
<ari-tczew> mterry: ok so I'm leaving case for you
<Sarvatt> oh man, enabling the unity plugin screwed up my session so bad I don't even know where to start filing bugs
<Sarvatt> http://sarvatt.com/downloads/xsession-errors.txt
<bryceh> hey anyone know, if 'debian-changelog-file-missing' warnings are just because of the change pitti mentioned where we're dropping changelogs?
<bryceh> E: wayland: debian-changelog-file-missing
<bryceh> E: wayland-dev: debian-changelog-file-missing
<bryceh> E: wayland-dbg: debian-changelog-file-missing
<bryceh> just wondering if those are expected warnings or if I forgot to fiddle something in my packaging
<chrisccoulson> jcastro, we agreed at UDS to drop the launchpad answers bookmark from firefox and replace it with askubuntu didn't we?
<jcastro> chrisccoulson: in english
<chrisccoulson> oh, not for everybody? that might be quite difficult :/
<jcastro> then don't change it, there's no localization support for it so it doesn't make sense to send non-english speakers there
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok. that's a shame
<jcastro> chrisccoulson: you deferred this right? https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-thunderbird-messaging-indicator
<chrisccoulson> i'll try and figure out a way, but i tried to do this before, and it didn't quite do what i wanted it to do
<jcastro> chrisccoulson: what happens for the forums for example?
<jcastro> do you send people to their localized forum or their english one?
<chrisccoulson> the current set of default bookmarks aren't localized at all, so, any localization will happen on the server-side
<jcastro> chrisccoulson: I see
<jcastro> chrisccoulson: since I have you here, any other information for this? https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-thunderbird-messaging-indicator
<jcastro> I'd like to send that email to the tbird list today
<chrisccoulson> jcastro, no other information yet, other than that i still plan on working on it
<chrisccoulson> i've just been trying to get the firefox stuff out of the way first
<rickspencer3> finally running Unity
<Nafallo> lol
<Nafallo> rickspencer3: natty compiz-backed version? :-)
<rickspencer3> Nafallo, natch!
<rickspencer3> it's, uh ... interensting
<Nafallo> heh :-)
<Nafallo> I just wish I could edit some blacklist of stuff not to show on the sidebar somewhere :-P
<Nafallo> I have a couple of indicators listed as started there :-/
<Nafallo> makes me sad that they take up space in two places
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-11-20
<Balsaq> good morning
<Balsaq> i would like to speak to the channel operator.
<hyperair> Balsaq: try /msg chanserv access #ubuntu-desktop list
<Balsaq> thank you hyperair
<hyperair> np
<asac> i have a multitouch netbook now ;) ... should i grab natty to get best experience out of it?
<asac> hmm ... everyone is lagging :) -> no replies from my desktop friends
<asac> oubiwann: ^^
<ari-tczew> could someone review this one and upload? pitti ? bug 546445
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 546445 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Support for lxdm in ubiquity (autologin, only-ubiquity support) (affects: 1) (heat: 10)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/546445
<pitti> bryceh: changelog-missing> no, changelogs are supposed to stay now; where did you see this?
<bryceh> pitti, nevermind I figured it out
<JanC> is there a reason why XIM input method isn't the default?
<JanC> because that solves a annoying bug in Gtk/GNOME related to dead keys & Compose...
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-11-21
<bcurtiswx> to access the ~ubuntu-desktop bzr branch specifically for maverick, what am I doing wrong here lp:~ubuntu-desktop/empathy/ubuntu/maverick
<micahg> bcurtiswx: pull or push?
<bcurtiswx> get
<bcurtiswx> so thats a pull ;)
<micahg> bcurtiswx: I don't see one
<micahg> bcurtiswx: lp:ubuntu/maverick/empathy/maverick-proposed might work
<bcurtiswx> i know if you subtract the 'maverick' it works.. and that natty is getting an ubuntugtk3  so maybe they aren't doing that for maverick?
<micahg> bcurtiswx: lp:~ubuntu-desktop/empathy/ubuntu is already working on natty
<bcurtiswx> yeah, right now i can work on that for empathy 2.32.2, but after they switch to GTK3 builds.. how do I access 2.32.2 with that repo ?
<micahg> bcurtiswx: idk about -desktop team policy
<bcurtiswx> aww, OK :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-11-14
<fosburg>  how do I find out where memory is being used?  I'm a newbe to linux and ubuntu
<bjsnider> fosburg, try top, or htop
<fosburg> thanks for the info--but I don't know what 'top' is
<bjsnider> open a terminal and type "top" and hit return
<fosburg> ok--I understand that. thanks
<fosburg> well I'm learning a little--'htop' was not installed and I installed it from the terminal
<fosburg> memory use bounces around from 2+% to 20%
<bjsnider> you can also use system-monitor
<fosburg> Is there a HELP where I can get definitions to term such as; Tasks, Load averages, etc?
<fosburg> 'system-monitor' is that entered from the terminal?
<bjsnider> sure, you can call it from the terminal with gnome-system-monitor
<bjsnider> you can also use alt+f
<bjsnider> f2
<bjsnider> i think it's one of unity's icons in the app launcher area
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> pitti: Morning. With that work item you added to the accessibility pollsih spec with regards to menus, do you know whether those menus will likely have icons in them that will need extra descriptions?
<pitti> TheMuso: I don't know much about that new menu system
<TheMuso> pitti: Right, I guess the first thing is whether we are going to get the newer GTK that uses that in the first place.
<pitti> TheMuso: might be, but it doesn't really affect that WI
<pitti> the new menu system should be designed right from the start for a11y regardless of whether it lands in precise or Q
<TheMuso> pitti: True.
<pitti> RAOF: do you have time for some SRU reviews today?
<RAOF> pitti: Absolutely.
<pitti> RAOF: I'm doing some now, too (and some sponsoring), but e. g. p-distutils-extra is my upload, so I can't review that
<RAOF> I noticed the 27-item oneiric queue, and then decided to ensure that all the blueprints that I should be interested in are ready.
<RAOF> )
<RAOF> :)
<pitti> heh
<RAOF> I'll start from the top of the queue and work down?
<pitti> RAOF: okay
<pitti> RAOF: I started from teh bottom
<pitti> RAOF: please do review p-d-extra at the bottom, though
<pitti> RAOF: moving to lucid now
<pitti> Sweetshark: uploaded; but it needs a precise upload, too (with higher version number), can you please prepare one?
<pitti> RAOF: I'll stop -proposed review now; I'll do the pending kernel SRU stuff, then doing some real work
<pitti> like unbreaking precise (grr @ gzip)
<RAOF> I'll try to finish off the rest of proposed before (or possibly after) knocking off, then.
<pitti> great, thanks
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti. How are you?
<pitti> I'm fine, thanks!
<pitti> unfortunately gzip isn't :(
 * pitti pulls his hair out on bug 889303
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 889303 in libtasn1-3 "libtasn1-3 2.10-1 32/64-bit refuses to install (11/11/2011 updates)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/889303
<didrocks> good luck :)
<hrw> hi
<hrw> pitti: I think I know why it is
<pitti> hey hrw
<pitti> hrw: the gzip unpredictability?
<hrw> pitti: no
<hrw> pitti: when we do build for amd64 we build only amd64 package and it gets docs inside. when we build i386 it also makes 'all' packages which often gets docs and i386 ones have symlinks to 'all' one
<pitti> hrw: that case got fixed a while ago in pkgbinarymangler
<hrw> pitti: I noticed that when got hit by multiarch problem some time ago
<pitti> but that's not the cause of bug 889303
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 889303 in gzip "gzip -9n sometimes generates a different output file on 64 bit" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/889303
<hrw> ok
<pitti> (I retitled the bug after adding a workaround to libtasn1-3)
<seb128> hey
<didrocks> good morning seb128
<seb128> hey didrocks
<seb128> how are you? has was the ubuntuparty?
<didrocks> I'm a little bit tired by the week-end, but the ubuntu party was really nice (not as much people as we used to have though)
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<didrocks> but 9 hours of giving conferences/lessons/classroom is quite tiring in 3 days :)
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
<didrocks> tried to attract some new contributors as well and I think it worked out, so was really nice!
<seb128> didrocks, was the feedback to unity better this cycle?
<didrocks> a little bit better, not as much as I wanted though (especially from the people coming for installing ubuntu on other computers)
<didrocks> tried to have some stats of who is using unity
<seb128> they still try to access a flat list of applications rather than trying to use searches?
<didrocks> (especially in the conference "what's new in 11.10, which attracts more users than contributors)
<seb128> that seems to be the main issue old users have with unity (that and the lack of configurability)
<didrocks> interistingly, way less than before
<didrocks> so that's a good point :)
<seb128> great
<didrocks> and in the "discovering unity" classes I gave, I really underline this point and got no objection
<didrocks> so I think we are making good progress there :)
<seb128> \o/
<didrocks> so next week-end, jdll (Friday and Saturday) and the week-end after ubuntu party in Toulouse
<didrocks> and then, finally enjoying a quiet week-end at home :-)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> don't miss the didrocks ubuntu tour!
<didrocks> ahah :)
<rodrigo_> hello
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<didrocks> hey rodrigo_
<pitti> hey rodrigo_, good morning
<rodrigo_> hi seb128, didrocks, pitti
<pitti> mvo: hey, how are you?
<mvo> pitti: good, thanks! how are you?
<pitti> mvo: I'm fine, thanks!
<pitti> mvo: who "owns" lp:sessioninstaller, glatzor or you?
<pitti> mvo: I'd like to take a stab at porting it to GTK3/GI
 * pitti just updated the "pygtk rdepends" section at the bottom of http://pad.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-desktop
<mvo> pitti: its shared, feel free to attack it
<mvo> pitti: you are part of aptdaemon-developers? if not, I can probably add you
<seb128> pitti, was it much outdated?
<pitti> mvo: oh, I can push
<seb128> I should update those lists
<pitti> seb128: onboard, s-c, and ubiquity got ported
<pitti> so I removed them
<mvo> pitti: glatzor is busy with work currently and has to do a review/merge for me before anyway, so porting should be fine :)
<pitti> gnome-codec-install seems a bit stale
<pitti> is that still being used upstream?
<pitti> mvo: ah, so I should push into a branch and wait for him to review?
<pitti> mvo: do you know why the ubuntu package's 02_no_crash_on_install_provides.patch was never merged upstream?
<pitti> (bug 762431)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 762431 in sessioninstaller "session-installer crashed with ModifyInternalError in _install_provide_files(): org.freedesktop.Packagekit.Modify.InternalError: This method hasn't yet been implemented. (dup-of: 716711)" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/762431
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 716711 in sessioninstaller "session-installer crashed with ModifyInternalError in _install_provide_files(): org.freedesktop.Packagekit.Modify.InternalError: This method hasn't yet been implemented." [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/716711
<pitti> I guess it's deliberately throwing an error upstream to remind that this is a TODO?
<seb128> pitti, gnome-codec-install is the small debian,ubuntu install-missing-codecs, I don't think it changed a lot for years but there is a recent design spec to rework it, I don't sign anyone signed to do the work though
<mvo> pitti: yeah, please branch and propose for merging, glatzor or I will review and merge into trunk
<mvo> pitti: I think we can get rid of gnome-codec-installer in favor of the session installer nowdays
<pitti> that's what I thought
<pitti> mvo: btw, I created lp:~aptdaemon-developers/sessioninstaller/ubuntu-precise
<mvo> pitti: great, thanks!
<pitti> didrocks: is "Bob The Builder" a new bot of your's?
<didrocks> pitti: no, it's the daily build that unity-2d has for a while (but not linked at all to branch autolanding, which is what I'm working on)
<pitti> didrocks: I just got four mails from it reopening "fix released" bugs to "fix committed"
<didrocks> pitti: I only have a prototype made in 3 days there, I'm waiting on the RT ticket to be processed by IS to have access to the QA machines
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, seems a question for Kaleo
<Kaleo> pitti: sorry, it went crazy
<Kaleo> didrocks: note for later, if a branch is merged that links to bugs as fix released, it will revert them to fix commited
<Kaleo> (we are talking about tarmac here)
<didrocks> Kaleo: I do that as well in my prototype, it adds the right bugs and such :)
<Kaleo> didrocks: what is that prototype?
<Kaleo> didrocks: tarmac?
<didrocks> Kaleo: it's what was discussed at UDS
<didrocks> basically, tarmac + some patches  + a jenkins plugin I wrote
<Kaleo> didrocks: ok
<Kaleo> didrocks: so if you use tarmac, beware of that bug
<didrocks> then it calls a jenkins job, which trigger a pbuilder building the package for each commits
<didrocks> running tests
<Kaleo> didrocks: yep
<didrocks> if all passes, telling "ok" to tarmac which merge the branch
<didrocks> and push to trunk
<Kaleo> didrocks: great
<didrocks> and dput the package
<didrocks> there are additional criterias like bugs linked in merge request, and other pre-requisitesâ¦
<didrocks> 3 days to build it without knowing anything about tarmac and jenkins or how to write a plugin. It handles as well autotools and autoreconf nicely (which was not that straightforward in the pbuilder) ;)
<didrocks> pitti: is there any process to put a RT ticket as a priority? it stalled for a week and that's what is blocking pushing it to production (first with only one upstream component)
<pitti> didrocks: I don't know; try asking cjwatson? He at least knows whom to poke
<didrocks> pitti: ok thanks :)
<Kaleo> pitti, didrocks:https://bugs.launchpad.net/tarmac/+bug/890161
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 890161 in tarmac "Bugs set to fix released are reverted to fix committed" [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> Kaleo: why the same bug is linked to the new merge proposal btw?
<didrocks> Kaleo: the patch is simple to do, but I want to be sure it's really needed
<pitti> it doesn't actually seem wrong
<pitti> sometimes you need to fix a bug harder
<pitti> so if a bug is fixed, and a MP claims to fix it, there's something wrong
<didrocks> indeed, I quite agree
<Kaleo> didrocks: the submitter of the MR just did something wrong
<didrocks> yeah, but I see valid cases as well, in this case, the issue is the submitter of the MR
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm a little bit exhausted by the week-end, but fine otherwise, thanks! You?
<chrisccoulson> same ;)
<chrisccoulson> i just arrived back from berlin
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: quite fine, thanks!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, what did you do in Berlin?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i went to mozcamp
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, great, had some good discussions there?
<chrisccoulson> pitti, yeah, it was quite interesting. i will write up a trip report in a bit :)
<seb128> bah, bug #889791, floppies...
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 889791 in nautilus "Clicking on floppy drive item under "devices" on the nautilus sidebar does nothing" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/889791
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, i'm not too bad thanks. still recovering from UDS though!
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<pitti> seb128: flopppies> I wish there was a LP bug status "I f***** don't care" :)
<seb128> pitti, same here! ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm fine, mostly went over my ubuflu
<seb128> it's left to small after cold side effects
<nessita> hello everyone!
<seb128> hey nessita
<pitti> hey nessita
<seb128> how are you?
<nessita> good! planning my holidays, which are next week :-)
<nessita> so, I'm very very happy
<seb128> didrocks, bug #889996 is about the unity_support_test being incompatible with remote logins (xdmcp, vnc, etc)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 889996 in nux "Automatic unity 2D fallback does not work with XDMCP logins over VNC" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/889996
<seb128> didrocks, is that something you want assigned to you?
<seb128> nessita, ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: I would prefer someone more familiar with XDMCP can have a look at it
<didrocks> not sure what it triggers or if it gives wrong result
<didrocks> and I have short echeance for two things which should already be landed previous cycle by dx
<didrocks> so trying to rush to get things moving
<seb128> didrocks, well it's basically "checking for local capability is wrong when the session connect to a different machine"
<nessita> seb128: I have a initial-packaging branch for a project, would you like to review it and if correct, sponsor it?
<seb128> nessita, I can do
<seb128> didrocks, it's an item for the cycle, no hurry to fix it
<didrocks> seb128: so, the checking should be changed by the dx guys
<didrocks> seb128: as they are the maintainer of this tool
<nessita> seb128: be as picky as you can, there is a lot about packaging I don't know and wanna learn. Branch is: https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/qt4reactor/initial-packaging
<seb128> didrocks, ok, well it's the caching logic which is buggy but I can try to see with jay
<didrocks> seb128: how is it the caching which is the trouble?
<didrocks> seb128: if it answered 0 first, nux answered 0
<seb128> didrocks, because you boot your computer, the cache is done for the local hardware but you open a distant xserver
<seb128> so the cache is wrong, it doesn't apply to the right machine, server
<seb128> but the session still read the tmp cache
<seb128> i.e on lightdm you pick a thin client login for example
<didrocks> seb128: assign it to me, but it will be for later, not now
<seb128> didrocks, sure
<pitti> mvo: ah, session-installer is mostly working now; found another Gtk bug while porting :/
<pitti> mvo: tested --install-gstreamer and --install-package now
<mvo> pitti: \o/
<pitti> mvo: I'll try to debug/fix the gtk crash after lunch, and then submit a MP
<pitti> when commenting out the tooltip, it doesn't crash, and everythign works
<mvo> pitti: is the tooltip maybe going out of scope? I had a similar issue in some other project about a menu iirc
<mvo> pitti: or is this something totally different?
<Sweetshark> eh, so what is the canonical way to SRU this? 3.4.4-0ubuntu1 for -proposed and 3.4.4-0ubuntu2 for oneiric? or something like 3.4.4-0ubuntu1~proposed1 for -proposed and 3.4.4-0ubuntu1 for oneiric?
<Daviey> Sweetshark: what package?
<Sweetshark> Daviey: libreoffice
<Sweetshark> pitti: ^^
<Sweetshark> Daviey: sorry, I wanted to ask in reply to pitti. ...
<Pendulum> pitti: are you the person to poke about pygobject?
<rodrigo_> wow, just found the 'email' option in simple-scan, definitely replacing xsane with this :)
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<pitti> mvo: I have a hunch what's going on; it's not the tooltip itself, I think it's free()ing the GtkTreeModel
<pitti> Sweetshark: yes, you can use ubuntu2 for the precise upload
<pitti> Sweetshark: but the standard way is to have ubuntu1 in precise, and for the SRU use ubuntu0.1 or ubuntu1~oneiric
<pitti> Pendulum: I'll try my best
<Pendulum> pitti: I was contacted by the Orca developers because they're about to make a change to Orca which requires pygobject 3.0.2 and they noticed that Oneiric only has 3.0.0.
<Pendulum> is there any way of backporting pygobject 3.0.2 as an update for Oneric so that the Orca update doesn't break things?
<pitti> Pendulum: oneiric-updates has a number of backported patches already which might be enough
<pitti> Pendulum: so if they need a particular one, we can backport that, yes
<pitti> http://git.gnome.org/browse/pygobject/log/ -> there aren't too many commits between .0 and .2
<Pendulum> pitti: is https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-leb/oneiric/+source/pygobject where I'd be able to show them the changes to see if what they need has been updated?
<pitti> Pendulum: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric/+source/pygobject/+changelog
<Pendulum> pitti: looks like the patches are already in that are needed. Thanks!
<pitti> yay
<didrocks> taking my train tickets for ubuntu party in Toulouse, bbiab
<pitti> mvo: ok, nailed it; working like charm now
<pitti> mvo: it suggests :i386 variants of the gstreamer packages here, but that's unrelated to my porting
<pitti> mvo: https://code.launchpad.net/~pitti/sessioninstaller/gtk3/+merge/82142 :)
<mvo> pitti: yeah, I will tweak the cache iteration
 * mvo waits for the diff to show up
<pitti> mvo: hm, if I purge gnome-codec-install, it configures /usr/bin/gst-install as alternative which is session-installer
<pitti> that looks right?
<pitti> i. e. seems we might need to do no more than unseeding it and adding a Breaks: in session-installer to clean it up on ugprades?
<pitti> I purged gstreamer0.10-ffmpeg, and totem pops up session-installer now
<mvo> pitti: yeah, that sounds correct
<pitti> nice, that'll get us rid of python-aptdaemon.gtkwidgets, and python-vte, too
<mvo> !
<mvo> nice
<pitti> seed change and C/R/P committed
<pitti> mvo: the MP is diffy now; do you have time for this or shall I ask glatzor?
<pitti> (no need to do it right now, of course, just asking in general)
<mvo> pitti: thanks, looks fine to me
<pitti> mvo: thanks!
<pitti> mvo: shall we tag a new 0.21 release upstream, or shall I just get a new bzr snapshot?
<mvo> pitti: a new bzr snapshot for now, I leave the releases to glatzor
<pitti> *nod*
<pitti> mvo: ah, no, ubuntuone control panel still pulls in -vte :(
<cyphermox> morning!
<pitti> seb128: ok for me to update GTK to 3.2.2?
<seb128> pitti, sure
<pitti> seb128: I want to do an upload for teh recent annotation fix
<pitti> and while I'm at it..
<seb128> pitti, want to sru it as well? ;-)
<pitti> do we have major bugs that it fixes?
<pitti> well, I'll find out when I do the update
<seb128> pitti, not sure about "major" but some segfault fixes, some signal not emitted fixes, some annotations fixes
<seb128> toolkits are a bit special, I guess people developing on Oneiric would welcome those to be fixed in the stable as well ;-)
<seb128> pitti, but yeah, no need to do it yourself today if you didn't plan it, we can first update and see at doing a sru later
<seb128> hey cyphermox, how are you?
<cyphermox> doing alright
<cyphermox> the vacation was fun and very relaxing :)
<seb128> great ;-)
<pitti> seb128: of all the upstream fixed bugs, exactly one is reported in LP, with 0 dupes
<pitti> so, not urgent IMHO
<cyphermox> re: blueprints, who is supposed to be the approver? Jason or pitti? I have one spec that needs to be looked into
<pitti> cyphermox: by default me
<cyphermox> so I need to fix my bp
<seb128> pitti, no, not urgent at all, as said it's rather a "would be nice", as said I'm sure that people using Oneiric to do work do appreciate if those fixes reach them but that's a bit orthogonal to SRU needs
<seb128> cyphermox, if you have time this week do you want to do the evo 3.2.2 stack updates and upload those as srus as well?
<cyphermox> sure, if it can wait until post-EST-work-hours :)
<cyphermox> in fact, it is indeed pretty important to get them in as srus at least for that annoying POP issue
<kenvandine> seb128, mind if i do gnome-keyring 3.2.2 for an SRU?
<kenvandine> fixes bug 874501
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 874501 in gnome-keyring "couldn't prepare to write out keyring" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/874501
<pitti> hey kenvandine
<kenvandine> hey pitti
<pitti> kenvandine: please remember to upload to precise first, i. e. pick the version number accordingly
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> hey kenvandine, no please don't, we like Ubuntu being buggy ;-)
<kenvandine> i am doing that now
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks! ;-)
 * kenvandine usually tried to not touch gnome-keyring
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> kenvandine, oh, too late, you touched it, it's sticky!
<seb128> ;-)
<kenvandine> :-D
<pitti> well, at some point Debian will update to 3.2 as well, then we can merge our remaining changes (if we even have any) and sync
<pitti> so it won't stick forever :)
<seb128> I don't think we have changes for the keyring stack
<seb128> which is good ;-)
<kenvandine> indeed
<dobey> there is a command to sync a package over from debian, right?
<kenvandine> dobey, yes... syncpackage
<dobey> oh neat. someone already did; apparently right after i looked at the package in debian and thought "this should be in ubuntu too"
<pitti> good night everyone!
<seb128> 'night pitti
<kenvandine> good night pitti
<dobey> meh. pbuilder-dist doesn't work for me in oneiric now; apparently the python modules changed :(
<dobey> anyone use pbuilder-dist and have a recommendation on how to fix?
<dobey> or should i just go but #ubuntu-devel?
<dobey> ah, nm. i am dumb
<kenvandine> dobey, still working for me...
<dobey> kenvandine: yeah, apparently i did a cp to pbuilder-oneiric, instead of ln -s
<kenvandine> :)
<dobey> someone moved a python module though, without providing any compat
<dobey> damn python developers. :(
<BigWhale> seb128, there are a couple of bugs in the upstream related to #61786
<BigWhale> one is closed, the other one isn't
<seb128> kenvandine, can you do the seahorse update as well? it fixes bug #876813 that slangasek reported
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 876813 in seahorse "seahorse takes forever to start up because it's checking signatures for all keys in the gpg keyring" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/876813
<kenvandine> seb128, sure
<seb128> thanks
<kenvandine> np
<seb128> rodrigo_, hey, do you think you could review the bugs assigned to you this week?
<seb128> rodrigo_, you have some g-s-d ones that didn't get any comment from you which are assigned for a while
<rodrigo_> oh, sorry, forgot about those
<rodrigo_> seb128, lookinmg now
<seb128> thanks
<glatzor> abend mvo,
<mvo> hey glatzor!
<mvo> glatzor: nice to see you
<glatzor> mvo, nice to see you, too
<glatzor> mvo, a short question, do you know if the dates for the next UDS is already set?
<glatzor> mvo, I have to plan my vacations for 2012 today :)
<chrisccoulson> w00t, my luggage has arrived now :)
<ogra_> chrisccoulson, in orlando ?
<ogra_> :)
<chrisccoulson> ogra_, no, from berlin this morning
<chrisccoulson> i had to get a connecting flight in brussels and my luggage ended up on the wrong flight
<ogra_> oh, fun
<chrisccoulson> this is why i hate flying to / from birmingham. i can't seem to get a direct flight anywhere i want to go
<ogra_> you should change your expectations then :P
<chrisccoulson> heh
<ogra_> just "want" to go somewhere they fly direct
<chrisccoulson> i should move closer to an airport that flies to destinations people actually want to travel to
<mvo> glatzor: I don't think so, but I can inquire for you - that is really really early
<glatzor> mvo, would be great!
<glatzor> mvo, Actually I am quite late. I have to send in my holiday planning on 16th :)
<Laney> manchester â orlando was quite reasonable for me
<chrisccoulson> Laney, that's why i travel to manchester to fly to orlando :)
<Laney> :-)
<Laney> I mean that I would rather take trains to another airport if possible to get a direct flight
<rodrigo_> seb128, for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/833397 , we don't need the app_indicator patch anymore, do we?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 833397 in gnome-settings-daemon "indicator power displayed twice on panel" [Medium,In progress]
<rodrigo_> seb128, since we have a indicator-power now?
<seb128> rodrigo_, ? we don't have indicator code for the power icon
<seb128> rodrigo_, the indicator patch is needed for keyboard, a11y, etc
<rodrigo_> seb128, oh, sorry, my fault
<seb128> rodrigo_, the bug there is that some users whitelist "all" in unity and g-s-d display a systray icon inconditionally
<rodrigo_> yeah
<seb128> rodrigo_, g-s-d should display a systray out of GNOME fallback I guess
<didrocks> pitti: can you approve https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-zeitgeist for precise when you get some time?
<seb128> didrocks, done
<didrocks> thanks seb128 ;)
<seb128> yw ;-)
<didrocks> which team can do that, do you know?
<didrocks> I can only pend them for approval
<seb128> didrocks, I guess the uds approvers one
<didrocks> ah, the old "ping me for changing the schedule" one :)
<seb128> I'm in there since I played pitti for one cycle when he was in rotation ;-)
<didrocks> indeed ;)
<rodrigo_> out for a bit, bbl
<mpt> chrisccoulson, hi, was it you who asked me during UDS about cleaning up the LibreOffice menus?
<hallyn> if there are like 100s of pending notify-osd's, is there a way to flush them?
<maxb> 1) Kill notify-osd
<maxb> 2) Use xfce4-notify instead :-)
<maxb> (or restart notify-osd if you insist)
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-11-15
<pitti> good morning
<TheMuso> pitti: Are we likely to update to pygobject 3.0.2 in oneiric-updates?
<pitti> TheMuso: we have the most important fixes already
<pitti> TheMuso: someone asked me yesterday because a new orca (or onboard?) needs it, and we figured that the patches were already in
<TheMuso> pitti: Hrm ok.
<TheMuso> pitti: Oh ok thanks, that helps. I was going to ask the same thing.
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<pitti> ca va?
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti! I'm fine thanks. Seems I still miss some sleep as instead of waking up at 7, I'm waking up at 8.30. But I hope to get that fixed soon :) and you?
<pitti> I'm quite fine
<pitti> went to Taekwondo the first time after UDS yesterday, feeling my muscles :)
<didrocks> heh ;) I run yesterday for the fist time after 3 weeks of no exercice. Surprinsingly, this went "ok"
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<rodrigo_> morning
<didrocks> good morning chrisccoulson, rodrigo_! how are you guys?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, I'm fine thanks, and you?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: i'm fine, thanks :)
<hrw> hi
<hrw> unity/2d session - day two
<hrw> gwibber went into nuts: http://marcin.juszkiewicz.com.pl/~hrw/shots/crazygwibber.jpg
<hrw> is there a way to enable rmb/mmb on maximize button to be maximize vertical/horizontal?
<pitti> I'm off to the dentist for a while (Â¬ \o/)
<ricotz> pitti, oh, good luck then ;)
<ricotz> Sweetshark, hi :), is there a chance to see libreoffice 3.4.4 for lucid in the ppa?
<rodrigo_> pitti: ugh, good luck
<ricotz> Sweetshark, i think you somehow planned it while seeing java-helper updated?
<ricotz> rodrigo_, hey
<rodrigo_> hi ricotz
<seb128> hey
<seb128> waouh, internet working!
<seb128> sorry got some issues to get online today
<rodrigo_> hey seb128
<didrocks> salut seb128, Ã§a va ?
<seb128> hey rodrigo_, didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, ca va bien! et toi ?
<didrocks> seb128: Ã§a va bien :)
<seb128> pitti, if I put https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-video-playback as "informational" is that enough to drop it from your list?
<seb128> oh, I already did that it seems, so I guess "no"
<seb128> how do I get it off your list? ;-)
<seb128> it was a list discussion topic, there is nothing to draft or do
<seb128> bryceh, https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/324387
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 324387 in launchpad "Support Redmine Bug Tracker for bug watches" [Low,Triaged]
<seb128> bryceh, do you think we could get that on the distro stakeholder bugslist?
<didrocks> seb128: still hating your orange ISP?
<seb128> didrocks, I didn't have to complain for a while so not really "hating" them ;-)
<seb128> but I can't really get better there anyway so...
<didrocks> yeah, too far from civilisationâ¦ ;-)
<seb128> heh
<seb128> RAOF, control uploader churn in GNOME packages is because of the auto uploaders computation from pkg-gnome, control.in -> control
<hyperair> chrisccoulson: ping
<hyperair> chrisccoulson: where do i report firefox-trunk from ubuntu-mozilla-daily bugs?
<dpm> morning pitti. Quick question: how can the trend lines for the per-user burndown charts be set? I'm trying to find out how to set mine up, and I'm wondering if it will happen automatically, or is it just a matter of asking or submitting a merge proposal to  ~wi-tracker-configurators/launchpad-work-items-tracker/ubuntu-config
<rodrigo_> hmm, what should I do to upload a package branch to precise that is already in oneiric? should I just add a new changelog entry with the precise upload, or just change the last changelog entry to be precise instead of oneiric-proposed?
<rodrigo_> seb128, pitti: ^^
<seb128> either way works
<rodrigo_> ok
<rodrigo_> and what would you suggest? :)
<seb128> they are equivalent, I usually edit the changelog entry
<rodrigo_> ok
<nessita> hello all!
<didrocks> hey nessita
<nessita> hey didrocks
<rodrigo_> hey mpt
<seb128> hey nessita, how are you?
<nessita> seb128:  pretty good! you?
<seb128> nessita, I'm good thanks!
<nessita> seb128: there is a seb24?
<seb128> nessita, seems so, nothing to do with me though
<nessita> jeje
<pitti> re
<nessita> seb128: did you have any chance to review the qt4reactor packaging branch?
<pitti> that took a while
<pitti> seb128: updated, it's "complete" now
<pitti> dpm: ignore the trend lines for now
<seb128> hey pitti, danke
<pitti> dpm: we usually reset the tracker at feature definition freeze, before that there's too much churn
<pitti> dpm: you can override it manually, but don't bother -- we don't want a hundred or so manual adjustments
<dpm> ok, gotcha, thanks pitti
<pitti> rodrigo_: common practice so far is to add a new changelog entry "upload to precise" and build with -v to include the previous changelog
<mpt> hi rodrigo_
<pitti> rodrigo_: but s/oneiric-proposed/precise/ and version bump works, too
<pitti> the former is more friendly to VCSes, though
<rodrigo_> pitti, yeah, just editing the last changelog entry didn't work, the package was rejected, as that version already existed in the archive
<pitti> yes, you need to bump the version either way
<rodrigo_> yeah
<didrocks> no, seb24 is french, seb128 is german :)
<rodrigo_> :)
<seb128> didrocks, !!! ;-)
<didrocks> that was so easy! I couldn't keep telling it, sorry :-)
 * didrocks hugs seb128
<seb24> yes i'm only a Beta-tester
<seb128> didrocks, hug back ;-)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, yeah, French joke :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: you didn't follow, French-German joke :p
<rodrigo_> oh, right :D
<pitti> rodrigo_: saw your control-center upload; I recommend uploading with -v, otherwise people on -chagnes@ don't see the actual changes
<pitti> rodrigo_: and bugs that the oneiric-proposed changelog refers to are not auto-closed
<pitti> so you now need to do that manually
<pitti> seb24: only 104 to go, you can do it!
<rodrigo_> pitti, oh, ok
<pitti> actually, I'm fairly sure that there is a Pauli principle that you can't have two developers with the same number, lest the world explodes
<seb24> pitti : :D
<pitti> chrisccoulson: do you still see any need for pkgbinarymangler to export XPI files?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - no, i don't think so. i didn't even realize it could do that :)
<pitti> we have done that all the time, but as we now build the XPIs from the firefox source, it's pretty obsolete
<chrisccoulson> yeah, you should probably kill that then :)
 * chrisccoulson hands pitti the axe
<pitti> *slash*
<pitti> thanks
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<Sweetshark> ricotz: :/ I just slashed that in WI reduction.
<ricotz> Sweetshark, oh no :(
<GunnarHj> pitti: ping?
<pitti> hello GunnarHj, how are you?
<GunnarHj> pitti: I'm ok, hope you are as well.
<GunnarHj> pitti: Wondering what happens with bug 868346
<pitti> quite fine, apart from my jar (just was at the dentist0
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 868346 in lightdm "Language selector broken in Ubuntu" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/868346
<GunnarHj> pitti: Oh, sorry. ;-)
<pitti> GunnarHj: np :)
<pitti> GunnarHj: ah, I thought that was discussed with Robert a while ago, he didn't merge yet?
<GunnarHj> pitti: Know he wanted you to take a look as well.
<GunnarHj> pitti: AFAIK, he approves.
<GunnarHj> s/Know/No/
<pitti> ok, opened tab for this, will take a look today
<GunnarHj> pitti: Great.
<GunnarHj> pitti: Also, I have started to work on bug 866062
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 866062 in accountsservice "SetLanguage(): Write ~/.pam_environment instead of ~/.profile" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/866062
<GunnarHj> pitti: Just so you know, and don't start you too...
<seb128> GunnarHj, pitti: we skipped it when we reviewed the changes for the sru because neither robert_ancell or I were confident enough with locales to review the change and be sure it wouldn't create an issue
<seb128> we wanted to get a first SRU through without issue
<pitti> GunnarHj: ah, great
<pitti> GunnarHj: not right now, I'm fighting with pkgbinarymangler
<GunnarHj> seb128: Hi Sebastien, ok, I see.
<pitti> bryceh: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-xorg is not targetted to precise, should it be? or is this one obsolete?
<dobey> pitti: hey
<dobey> pitti: so; do we have a plan wrt rb/banshee? :)
<dobey> i think pitti is ignoring me, or having a very conveniently late lunch ;)
<pitti> dobey: I'm in a call
<dobey> ah; meetings :-/
<pitti> dobey: so, we had a bunch of discussions on the ML
<pitti> dobey: but I'm not sure who would make the final call
<pitti> Personally I still prefer switching to RB, though
<dobey> pitti: switch now, and if banshee is feasibly stable on gtk3 by alpha2, agree to evaluate a switch back?
<pitti> that would WFM for sure :)
<pitti> seb128, jasoncwarner_, rodrigo_: ^ opinions?
<rodrigo_> pitti, I use banshee, but I think getting rid of mono makes a lot of sense
<dobey> really, i don't see banshee being in a supportable state on gtk3 anytime soon :(
<kenvandine> i really prefer banshee, but there are some nice pluses for switching
<kenvandine> not having to maintain mono in the LTS would be nice
<rodrigo_> yes
<dobey> well mono itself isn't that bad
<kenvandine> and their is the arm issue, i seem to recall the arm builds ending up switching to rhythmbox
<dobey> but the complete mess of a "platform" upon which banshee is built is completely crocked.
<kenvandine> dobey, but for 5 years... how confident are we that there will be active upstream maintenance for that long?
<dobey> kenvandine: banshee itself, and mono itself, will probably be fine. it's all the junk in the middle that's the problem
<kenvandine> yeah
<chrisccoulson> mvo, for the LTS, we want to provide a way for enterprise users to stick to the extended support version of firefox. we're going to provide a PPA for this, and would like people who switch to it to get their security updates from the PPA rather than precise-security (the version in the PPA will always be older). is it acceptable to ship a file in /etc/apt/preferences.d to automatically set up the pinning to do this? or do we need
<chrisccoulson>  to tell people to do this manually?
<mvo> chrisccoulson: hm, you already discussed simply to use a alternative packagename and stick it into the main archive I assume?
<mvo> chrisccoulson: one problem I can see is that unattended-upgrades will not recordnise the origin by default, you will also have to tweak that
<chrisccoulson> mvo - we don't want them parallel installable, as we have to do a lot of hacks to make that work (and hacks that are unapproved by mozilla)
<mvo> chrisccoulson: this would be nicely avoided by using the regular archive
<mvo> chrisccoulson: well, conflicts would solve that
<dobey> pitti: i'm asking, because we're nearly ready to get moving on all the u1 improvements
<mvo> chrisccoulson: unless there are more reasons
<chrisccoulson> mvo - we also want to make it clear that the extended support version is completely unsupported, and we don't really want people installing it
<chrisccoulson> it's just that some enterprise users think it's a good idea
<mvo> chrisccoulson: heh, ok
<chrisccoulson> so we just want to offer them a PPA for that, with "best-effort" maintenance
<bjsnider> dobey, what junkin the middle?
<dobey> bjsnider: gtk#, ndesk-dbus, gtk-sharp-beans (whatever that is), and the bunch of little mono binding libs for single API points
<bjsnider> gtk-sharp-beans, i had those for lunch yesterday. pretty good.
<Laney> they are all because gtk-sharp was frozen
<Laney> to bind extra bits.
<Laney> but seriously, people are out for banshee, just do it. there is no reaslistic chance of anything else happening, is there?
<pitti> if we had a working GTK 3 version and working ARM support, there would be (I don't think that 5 year LTS support of Mono itself is much of a problem)
<seb128> re
<pitti> you or Chow said that both should not be that far out any more; do you know how far?
<pitti> at least the GTK3 support
<Laney> olivier is working on the remaining bug, you could speak to him
<seb128> pitti, well if lts support of mono is not an issue I would vote to stay on banshee
<seb128> if we manage to check that the stability issues from oneiric are fixed
<Laney> regarding arm, there's not much we can do if it is unreproducible for us and the arm team refuse to support mono
<seb128> the gtk3 transition on untested bindings in a lts cycle makes me nervous though, I wish there would have been a discussion about staying on 2.2
<Laney> i don't really see how that is anything that can be solved
<seb128> but banshee already got updated
<rodrigo_> they refuse to support mono?
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: just curious: why don't you rename the version in the PPA to firefox-esv or something?
<seb128> rodrigo_, could you take on bug #884003?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 884003 in vino "The remote connection indicator is broken" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/884003
<seb128> rodrigo_, you are the one who did the upload with the patch commented and it never got added back ;-)
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes
<seb128> rodrigo_, thanks
<dobey> Laney: people aren't out for banshee; i really wish everyone would stop being so damned defensive with this whole thing.
<seb128> Laney, do you have though on how risky the switch to new bindings and new GTK is in a lts cycle and staying on 2.2?.
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, we'd still need to make it conflict with the official package. and in any case, i also want the packaging to be a snapshot of the official packaging in the archive from which it is based
<chrisccoulson> and when i start adding changes, my workload will go up :-)
<dobey> seb128: also, the gtk# building against gtk3 doesn't bring in GSettings bindings afaik (and none exist on mono yet, from what i've seen in #banshee)
<hrw> is it normal that unity/2d panel^Wlauncher stops hiding after some time?
<seb128> dobey, right, different topic, that's not likely to happen this cycle but not important either
<chrisccoulson> i want the esr packages to be pretty much zero-maintenance really
<Laney> seb128: honestly I haven't run it, if you want to know how stable it is then I would chat with olivier
<seb128> hrw, try asking on #ayatana
<hrw> ok
<dobey> seb128: and maintenance of gtk# itself seems very much up in the air
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: I don't really like the idea of PPA packages setting up pinning by themselves...
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, it's ok. i don't mind making people set it up manually :)
<Laney> I just filed a bug asking for PPAs to have NotAutomatic :-)
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: once you show all 3 users of that PPA how to do it, everything will be fine
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> i imagine that this PPA will have less users than the firefox-stable PPA :)
<ogra_> Laney, who in the arm team said we dont support mono ?
<seb128> dobey, well at the same time "support" is not well defined, in practice Ubuntu doesn't "support" things a lot out of security updates, and mono is not very much a security issue
<dobey> seb128: no, but an incomplete bindings port seems like a support risk
<Laney> ogra_: you didn't refuse, but the emails on -desktop were really rather clear that you would rather not have to deal with mono
<ogra_> Laney, well, we feel left alone with our probs by upstream and the rest of the world, its not that we dont want to support mono or anything
<dobey> Laney: "would rather not" != "does not"
<Laney> I read that upstream is working on armhf support btw
<ogra_> Laney, all probs we had over the last releases had to be solved by ourselves
<Laney> as part of their monodroid product
<ogra_> thats a good move forward and might help us a lot
<ogra_> but for ubuntu it isnt even clear if we will switch to hf in precise
<ogra_> we dont even have working builders yet
<Laney> the guy working on this, who is also one of the most knowledgable runtime hackers upstream is 'vargaz' on gimpnet
<ogra_> k
<ogra_> lets see how banshee behaves in precise at all ... i dont have any data yet
<ogra_> and afaik the bug we had at release date still persists ... while there is a workaround, there isnt a fix yet
<ogra_> i'm totally not objecting mono or banshee and i honestly prefer that the arm iamges dont differ from x86 at all ... so please dont read something like "arm doesnt want mono" into my comments :)
<dobey> sigh
<dobey> anyway, i need to get lunch.
<dobey> bbiab
<seb128> bah, those discussions suck, there is no way to discuss the default application from a pragmatic way, people always get personal and defensive
<seb128> Laney, communication was poorly done but I think you and the other banshee guys are over-reacting as well on it
<Laney> yeah sorry to be defensive
<Laney> it's a bit hard because we feel like we've put a lot of work in for ubuntu's needs
<pitti> yeah, that came as a surprise in the UDS session, we need to discuss that differently in the future; there have been some good recommendations in the thread, such as contacting upstreams beforehand
<pitti> Laney: you did indeed
<seb128> Laney, do you think the ubuntu-desktop list discussion started by jasoncwarner_ is a better basis?
<pitti> jasoncwarner, Sweetshark, bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, seb128, tkamppeter, pedro_, desrt: no topics on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-11-15, so we'll skip the official meeting; please do add your news of the week, please
<seb128> we should really try to figure what's going on with the gtk3 mono bindings and the banshee port to gtk3 and discuss if staying on 2.2 for the lts would be a better choice
<didrocks> already done :)
 * pitti hugs didrocks
<seb128> that's orthogonal to the default player discussion
 * didrocks hugs pitti back
<mterry> pitti, shoot, I clicked 'request approval' for the spreadsheet with the wrong google login again
<seb128> i.e there are 2 discussions there, one being what to do with banshee versions (similar to the discussion we had at UDS for GNOME components)
<kenvandine> pitti, cool
<Laney> I think it's a good idea, but it doesn't seem like a neutral evalutation of both applications â it feels like if Banshee doesn't come up to scratch then it will be dropped, rather than RB having to sort itself out too.
<Laney> regarding gtk3, olivier commeted on list â you should reply to him with your questions
<Laney> or give the gtk3 branch a go :-)
<rodrigo_> pitti, ok
<seb128> Laney, the issue is that we don't compare purely applications, or banshee would stay default, we include gtk stacks, mono supports, etc in equation
<seb128> banshee itself is better than rb, the issue is to know if that's worth the price we pay with CD space, support, etc
<seb128> we should maybe split the topic in 2 discussions
<dobey> "better"
<Laney> i think we're (especially hyperair) pretty good at keeping up with srus
<seb128> one about the quality issues we had in oneiric and what is planned for this cycle
<dobey> it is a matter of what you are talking about, and is a subjective argument; as an ISV, rhythmbox is much better
<seb128> the other one about the pro and con of the side arguments
 * hyperair nyans at Laney
<seb128> dobey, why?
<Laney> if you want to stay at 2.2 then we need to figure out what bugs should be fixed for precise
<pitti> I don't think we want to stay at 2.2
<seb128> well, I don't know enough about banshee to be confident having an opinion on that
<pitti> keeping that whole gtk2/gtk#2/webkit-gtk2 stack is quite a high price
<seb128> pitti, I don't think we want to transition to a new GTK using untested and unpackaged binding in a LTS cycle
<chrisccoulson> if banshee ends up using gtk3, what will be left on the CD using gtk2?
<dobey> seb128: banshee's architecture has caused me pretty much nothing but pain in having the u1ms extension in it, while in rhythmbox we never really had to do much with it as everything pretty much just works in a sane way
<chrisccoulson> (other than the obvious)
<Laney> maybe we can get some ppa builds out of the gtk3 branch
<Laney> for people to have a go on
<pitti> chrisccoulson: gtk2 is quite a lot still, but getting rid of webkit-gtk2 will already help quite a lot, and it will unblock U1 from porting to GTK3
<pitti> U1 is holding a lot of gtk2 stuff, too
<dobey> even if banshee were already gtk3; from my POV, rhythmbox is a better choice
<hyperair> because of the race condition you had?
<pitti> I like the RB UI better, too, but the usability studies say that Banshee's is better, so I trust that more than what I just happen to be used to
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it's possible to build firefox with gtk3 now, but to keep flash working, you also need to build a gtk2 libxul + plugin-container, which basically doubles the build time
<dobey> hyperair: no, because of all the other problems we have, which are impossible to fix with the way banshee is designed
<chrisccoulson> so i'd like to put that off for as long as possible :)
<chrisccoulson> seeing as there will probably never be a gtk3 version of flash
<dobey> pitti: i hate both the UIs, so that's irrelevant to me :)
<chrisccoulson> (now that flash is dead)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: HTML5 FTW?
<dobey> chrisccoulson: flash isn't dead?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: will that really die so soon?
<hyperair> is flash really dead?
<pitti> (with "so soon" being < 3 years)
<chrisccoulson> pitti, i don't think it will die overnight. but it will die ;)
<pitti> not that I'd shed a tear for it, but that seems a little optimistic?
<ogra_> blackberry will keep it alive !
<chrisccoulson> i don't expect adobe to invest anything in to it now, and especially not a gtk3 port
<ogra_> :P
<pitti> well, I guess the day youtube switches will be the day when most of us can uninstall flash :)
<hyperair> html5 by default you mean
<Laney> vimeo, iplayer, ...
<seb128> chrisccoulson, gtk2> list on the etherpad but basically: compiz firefox gparted libreoffice
<hyperair> i'm actually pretty fond of digging inside /proc to get access to the flv's that all these players have
<dobey> pitti: the usability studies are BS; they don't say that banshee is better. they say rhythmbox has some issues. and frankly, banshee has pretty much the same issues, as their UIs are almost exactly the same
<pitti> hyperair: well, even as a fallback and not by default
<hyperair> unfortunately i don't recall firefox offering a sane way of extracting videos
<chrisccoulson> seb128, thanks
<dobey> hyperair: View->Page Source
<hyperair> dobey: that's a lot more time consuming than just diggign in /proc/`pidof plugin-container`/fd/
<dobey> i am sad that all the youtube downloader quick bookmarks sites are all broken now though
<seb128> chrisccoulson, system-config-printer as well
<dobey> hyperair: well, it was much nicer when they were all in /tmp/
<hyperair> dobey: ah, that's because the file gets unlink()'d. if you LD_PRELOAD firefox to not unlink FlashXXXX files... it'll stick around ;-)
<dobey> hyperair: no, flash doesn't put them in /tmp any more.
<hyperair> dobey: yes it does. it just unlink()s them while keeping the fd open.
<hyperair> dobey: if you see the symlinks in the /proc tree, they point to /tmp/FlashXXXXX
<dobey> hmm
<seb128> kenvandine, is gwibber still using gtk2 and python-webkit a lot? is that going away this cycle?
<kenvandine> in gwibber-accounts
<kenvandine> i can look at taht
<kenvandine> that
<seb128> do you plan to switch that to gtk3 before the lts?
<seb128> kenvandine, no hurry, I'm just counting the webkit-gtk2 users on the CD
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> how many others?
<seb128> banshee, shotwell (will be fixed this cycle)
<dobey> anyway, back to banshee v rbox
<seb128> software-center
<seb128> mvo, is s-c still using gtk2? why does it depends on python-webkit?
<pitti> seb128: it doesn't, it uses gir1.2-webkit-3.0
<dobey> seb128: there are 2 software center binaries installed afaict
<seb128> pitti, well it depends on python-webkit
<dobey> seb128: one using gtk2
<pitti> seb128: where?
<dobey> pitti: software-center-gtk (rather than software-center-gtk3) i presume
<pitti> I checked apt-cache show software-center | grep webkit
<pitti> no python-webkit
<seb128> pitti, I'm still on Oneiric
<pitti> seb128: shoudl be the same
<seb128> so I guess it got fixed in precise
<pitti> seb128: your software-center package has a dependency to python-webkit?
<seb128> yes
<dobey> [dobey@lunatari:~]: apt-cache depends software-center|grep -i webkit Depends: gir1.2-webkit-3.0
<pitti> dpkg -L software-center | xargs grep -i 'import.*webkit'
<dobey> that's on oneiric
<pitti> /usr/share/software-center/softwarecenter/ui/gtk3/views/purchaseview.py:from gi.repository import WebKit as webkit
<pitti> /usr/share/software-center/softwarecenter/ui/gtk3/widgets/videoplayer.py:from gi.repository import WebKit
<pitti> /usr/share/software-center/softwarecenter/ui/gtk3/widgets/exhibits.py:from gi.repository import WebKit
<pitti> seb128: ^ it's fine in precise
<seb128> pitti, ok, it doesn't have a direct depends but "sudo apt-get remove libwebkitgtk-1.0-0" wants to remove s-c here
<seb128> so it might be one of its depends
<pitti> ah
<pitti> seb128: btw, cleaning up the pad; today's images dropped gnome-codec-install
<seb128> oh nice, what do you use instead?
<pitti> sessioninstaller
<pitti> I ported that to PyGI/GTK3 yesterday
<pitti> somethign still pulls in python-aptdaemon-gtk, though, /me checks
<pitti> ah, ubuntuone-control-panel-gtk
<seb128> pitti, hum, does sessioninstaller has special support for codecs?
<pitti> seb128: yes
<pitti> seb128: I tested it yesterday with toem
<pitti> totem, too
<pitti> seb128: it provides a gst-install wrapper
<pitti> works very nicely
<seb128> pitti, ok, great, I need to check what ui it uses
<seb128> pitti, i.e how it handles when different codecs can be installed for the same thing
<seb128> like mp3 supported by the fluendo one and the universe set
<pitti> seb128: you get a lsit of packages with checkboxes
<seb128> does it give you enough details to make an informed decision?
<pitti> seb128: you can run this:
<pitti> ./test --install-gstreamer multi
<pitti> in sessioninstaller to test
<pitti> seb128: well, it's got special cases for the gstreamer packages in bubble help
<pitti> i. e. explain what they do
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<dobey> hmm
<jbicha> no meeting today?
<seb128> jbicha, no
<seb128> <pitti> jasoncwarner, Sweetshark, bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, seb128, tkamppeter, pedro_, desrt: no topics on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-11-15, so we'll skip the official meeting; please do add your news of the week, please
<seb128> that's what we decided at UDS
<seb128> pitti, we maybe should communicate about that on the list as well ;-)
<didrocks> hey jbicha
<chrisccoulson> will do. although, mine isn't that exciting :-)
<jbicha> didrocks: howdy
<didrocks> jbicha: I've added a comment on https://code.launchpad.net/~manishsinha/gedit/enable-zeitgeist-datasource-plugin/+merge/80561
<didrocks> I fixed it for gedit (and same for totem and pushed the commit you forgot to push) :)
<jbicha> so bjsnider was interested in joining the GNOME3 team but it's not clear what the procedures are for that
<rodrigo_> jbicha, iirc, you need 2 people +1ing your request
<rodrigo_> so best thing is to have him send merge proposals for a while
<jbicha> and then ask on the desktop mailing list when ready?
<jbicha> didrocks: thanks for finishing that up
<didrocks> jbicha: no worry :)
<pitti> hey jbicha
<pitti> jbicha: do you have something we need to discuss? a lot of us are online :)
<jbicha> pitti: hi, nothing in particular except the gnome3 team question that was just answered
<rodrigo_> jbicha, yes, iirc :)
<pitti> seb128: hm, do you know why "ibus" depends on python-ibus?
<pitti> seb128: we use ibus-gtk3 nowadays, and ibus itself is just providing /etc/X11/xinit/xinput.d/ibus
<pitti> presumably it's meant to be a meta-package
<seb128> not sure no
<pitti> not on http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/ubuntu.precise/desktop.depends
<rodrigo_> need to run some errands, bbl
<pitti> desktop: * (ibus)
<pitti> desktop: * (ibus-gtk3)
<pitti> seb128: ^ aah!
 * pitti fixes
<seb128> pitti, is the indicator working with gtk3?
<pitti> seb128: I think we need ibus-gtk as well, for GTK2 apsp
<pitti> seb128: aren't our app indicators using gtk3 now?
<pitti> gosh, the dependencies on these packages are horribly messed up
<pitti> "ibus" pulls in everything, and the individual binaries like python-ibus miss a lot
<seb128> pitti, well, the indicator patch in the current source still to still be using static bindings
<seb128> still "seems to be using"
<pitti> so what part of ibus actually uses an indicator?
<pitti> $ dpkg -L python-ibus|xargs grep -i indicat
<pitti> $
<pitti> not this one at least
<pitti> ibus-gtk{,3}  just ship a GTK 3 immodule, no python
<seb128> pitti, ibus: /usr/share/ibus/ui/gtk/panel.py
<pitti> seb128: what is dpkg -S /usr/share/ibus/ui/gtk/panel.py for you?
<pitti> the "ibus" package only ships a single file here:
<pitti> /etc/X11/xinit/xinput.d/ibus
<pitti> oh dear, this ^ also looks wrong
<seb128> $ dpkg -L ibus |wc -l
<seb128> 96
<seb128> pitti, are you sure it's installed?
<seb128> seems like you uninstalled it and kept a conffile behind?
<pitti> if [ -e /usr/lib/gtk-3.0/*/immodules/im-ibus.so ] \
<pitti>    && [ -e /usr/lib/*/gtk-2.0/*/immodules/im-ibus.so ]
<pitti> then
<pitti>     GTK_IM_MODULE=ibus
<pitti> that should be ||
<pitti> seb128: ah, sorry
<pitti> seb128: that explains a lot indeed :) had a multiarch accident recently which removed half of my system
<pitti> ok, so the ibus UI is gtk2 still, darn
<pitti> soudns like another PyGI port
<seb128> right
<pitti> I'll contact them and ask about their plans, and whether they want a hand
<bryceh> pitti, desktop-p-xorg targeted
<pitti> bryceh: thanks
<bryceh> seb128, 324387 noted for escalation to launchpad, thanks
<pitti> seb128: asked on upstream list, in moderation now (it's google groups)
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> so long, have a nice evening everyone!
<didrocks> enjoy pitti!
<didrocks> bryceh: hey
<seb128> bryceh, thank you, yorba uses redmine for their bug tracking (i.e for shotwell) ;-)
<seb128> pitti, have fun
<didrocks> bryceh: there was this discussion about meta-project in launchpad, which is not exactly the same than project group
<didrocks> bryceh: we discussed a little bit with Tim at UDS about this issue (which, has a workaround, we have to add a "unity" upstream task to gather all unity bugs fixed in one release shot)
<didrocks> bryceh: the idea was to have meta-project to only have one milestone for all unity component as they are released on the same date and see "what's coming in the new release"
<bryceh> seb128, yes taskwarrior does as well, it seems to be getting more popular
<didrocks> Tim told that this project was started and some point, but got stalled because nobody requested it
<bryceh> didrocks, interesting; was there a LEP produced for it?
<didrocks> bryceh: not sure, I can maybe ask thumper about it and ping you back with this tomorrow
<bryceh> didrocks, that'd be great
<didrocks> bryceh: will ping you back tomorrow! Thanks :)
<bryceh> didrocks, great; also if you know of other projects besides unity that could potentially benefit from it, that can help up the priority on it
<didrocks> bryceh: compiz? :D (yeah, as another meta-project, not linked to unity)
<didrocks> bryceh: but apart from that, not sure TBH
<bryceh> didrocks, I'm sure it'll be clearer after reading the LEP
<didrocks> yeah, let's wait for thumper
<dobey> hmm
<dobey> so i'm not sure what to do
<bryceh> didrocks, oh also, the launchpad guys really emphasize defining the problem trying to be solved, over just requesting some specific fix, so it's possible Meta-Projects might be the right solution, but we should present it as the underlying issue that needs solved
<bryceh> sometimes there's more than one way to solve a given problem
<didrocks> bryceh: indeed, if there is a LEP, I will try to sum up to you how we workarounded it and why we needed it, I think that will address this need?
<bryceh> didrocks, yep sounds like a good plan
<didrocks> time for some exercice, see you tomorrow guys!
 * kenvandine goes to get food
<chrisccoulson> lol, i was confused for a moment that the output of "df -h" said my SSD was 537GB!
<chrisccoulson> then i realized i was logged in to chinstrap
<mterry> chrisccoulson, :)
<dobey> ugh, there are 56 packages that depend on python-xdg in my quick apt-cache rdepends poking
<jasoncwarner_> hey robert_ancell, RAOF TheMuso and bryceh ... meeting time. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-11-15
<jasoncwarner_> hey robert_ancell , just about to start meeting. RAOF bryceh and TheMuso , around?
<TheMuso> Morning jasoncwarner_.
<RAOF> Good morning all.
<cyphermox> good evening all ;)
<jasoncwarner_> Awesome, before we begin, I wanted to reinforce pitti's point about number of WI and how many people have for precise.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF TheMuso and robert_ancell , based on pitti's esimates, your WI numbers are way out of whack and need some looking at.
<robert_ancell> yup
<TheMuso> Right, will look at that this morning.
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell RAOF TheMuso could you get to those today so pitti and I can review BPs tonight?
<jasoncwarner_> thanks!
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, is there the summary page up that shows all the items per person?  what is the link?
<robert_ancell> sure
<RAOF> Mine are artificially inflated by a huge number of bug tasks that aren't actually mine.  I'll get to that today.
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: status.ubuntu.com has it.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: figured in your case...since your number was SOOOO out of whack
<TheMuso> http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-precise/u/themuso.html is mine.
<jasoncwarner_> thanks everyone.
<jasoncwarner_> ok, so why don't we go around the room now. Bryce and RAOF , care to kick us off with X?
<RAOF> We're just waking up in X land :).
<RAOF> I believe that amd have just released the new fglrx driver that's compatible with Xserver 1.11.
<RAOF> Which means that we'll soon be in a position to switch.  The other blocker there is me either (a) fixing up the forward-port of the multitouch patches or (b) dropping them until Chase has got the full upstream solution backported.
<RAOF> I'd prefer to do (a).
<RAOF> And then when that's done, we'll stage everything in a PPA and copy to the archive.  There shouldn't be any time when X is not installable/upgradable.
<RAOF> At least, that's the plan :)
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: I like that last bit! :)
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: thanks, anything else to add?
<RAOF> Precise is currently almost entirely unbroken, dive right in? :)
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: cool! thanks :)
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso: your turn!
<TheMuso> cRight. Spent a bit of time in the last day or so taking care of some oneiric SRUs for a11y, with one more to be done today.
<TheMuso> Starting to ramp up on the more invasive work needed for accessibility pollish in precise, this takes the form of extending dbusmenu for accessible descriptions for various menus in the messaging and network indicators.
<TheMuso> I still need to talk to Ted about the exact implementation, and I am hoping to have that done by the end of the week.
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso: nice...thanks.
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: what is going on with lightdm and unity-greeter?
<dobey> hey jasoncwarner_ :)
<jasoncwarner_> hey dobey
<robert_ancell> had first meeting with design yesterday, we want to try and get the precise features previewable in budapest so design can check them and try and get some user testing in late feb.
<robert_ancell> started work on the harder jobs - the user switching and the flicker on startup.  Aurelien is starting to look into where he can help
<bryceh> hi guys, sorry I have another meeting - apparently daylight savings caused them to be co-scheduled
<robert_ancell> (done)
<dobey> i'll wait until you guys are done with the meeting thing :)
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I know I've got some work items in that area - is there anything that I should be prioritising to ensure you're not blocked?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, no, I think there's nothing critical.  The flicker disabling on switch is something we should look into earlier rather than later though
<RAOF> ok.
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: thanks, anything else?
<robert_ancell> no
<jasoncwarner_> awesome...anyone ? anything else?
<RAOF> Oh, yeah.
<RAOF> You can roughly halve Banshee's startup time by AOT compiling the system libraries; I'm talking with debian-cli and mono upstream about doing that on package install.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, is there any trade-off doing that?
<dobey> jasoncwarner_: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/11/15/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t15:24
<dobey> :)
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Disc space, obviously; you need both the AOT code and the original assemblies.  You also give up some optimisation opportunities, and the code will likely have worse cache-locality.
<TheMuso> RAOF: How does that affect the live images?
<TheMuso> In terms of disk space.
<RAOF> Oh, and depending on the CPU/disc ratio it *can* slow down startup, as you need to read more.
<RAOF> TheMuso: Good question.  I'm not entirely familiar with how the live images are built.  We wouldn't want the AOT code on the live images anyway, so we need some tweakable there.
<TheMuso> RAOF: Right, I guess it would depend on whether the files we don't want are still owned by the package.
<TheMuso> If they are not, then it is certainly possible that they could be purged from the filesystem during build.
<RAOF> No, they won't be owned by the package.  They'll be generated at install time, like python bytecompiling.
<TheMuso> Oh right so you are saying that we will ship banshee as is for the live images, but on updates they will be compiled?
<RAOF> I think that's what I'm saying, yes.
<TheMuso> Hrm ok.
<RAOF> Although what we'd actually want to do is add a "trigger an AOT rebuild" step to the end of the live installer.
<TheMuso> Right, thats quite doable.
<RAOF> I was forgetting that we don't actually install packages when installing from the livecd :)
<TheMuso> Correct, we do a filesystem copy.
<TheMuso> Then things are added/tweaked/removed as appropriate.
<RAOF> Yeah.  This would just add an extra tweaking step.
<RAOF> I wonder if I should turn this into a blueprint with work items...
<TheMuso> Depends on how much you have on your plate already.
<jasoncwarner_> Ok, sounds like we are about done. thanks everyone!
<TheMuso> np
<TheMuso> brb
<robert_ancell> RAOF, Should we bump this to Q https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-xorg-wayland-something-or-other?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: That's actually supersceded by wayland-tech-preview, right?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yes, i guess so
<RAOF> Marked as such.
<RAOF> And we've punted tech-preview to Q?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yes
<robert_ancell> RAOF, I'd still like to do it, but not commit to it
<RAOF> Likewise.
<RAOF> I guess we don't really have a "nice-to-have" chart on status.ubuntu.com
<bryceh> robert_ancell, RAOF  yeah any relevant work items postponed from desktop-o-xorg-wayland-something-or-other probably should be carried over to the new blueprint
<RAOF> I don't think there are any non-duplicate work items there.
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, sorry, had a LP stakeholder's meeting with skaet scheduled for this time; usually it's later on but guess daylight savings screwed it up
<RAOF> At least, not ones that are still open.
<bryceh> RAOF, ok then
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: no worries.
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, aside from catching up on bug triage, blueprints, and emails, not much to say on the X front
<bryceh> we're having a launchpad stakeholder's meeting later this week (the first one in over a year!) so am gathering requests and ideas for launchpad improvements that we might want over the next 18 months
<bryceh> current list:  https://dev.launchpad.net/Ubuntu/InfrastructureNeeds
<bryceh> robert_ancell, RAOF for wayland, even if we don't do that blueprint, the wayland snapshots ought to be updated for P.  I can take that task.
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, one question with the work item limits; is  that the number you can do total, or just the max you can have open and assigned at one time?
<bryceh> i.e. if I finish my 7, can I take 7 more, or should I stop working at that point and just do bugs only?
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: :) you can always take on more! this was the number pitti, based on calculations of previous cycles, assumed someone could reasonably do. obviously there is some play in those numbers depending on size of WI etc
<TheMuso> How does one recalculate their WI limit if one adjusts their availability?
 * TheMuso is in the google doc.
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, ok sounds good.  I'm bringing forward old postponed tasks from O that I'd like to still track.  I'll leave them marked postponed for now so they don't exceed the work item limit, and open them up when they won't exceed the limit.
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: ^^ any idea about my questino above?
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso: not sure, what do you mean? like you have more time? less time?
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: So I looked atht the doc and saw my availability was at 0.7. I changed it to 0.8, so am wondering how to recalculate the work item limit.
<jasoncwarner_> ah, ok...I'll take a look (I didn't put it together, but since I have mad manager spreadsheet skillz, I'm sure I can figure it out ;) )
<TheMuso> ok thanks.
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso: it auto adjusts
<jasoncwarner_> changing to .8 raised your precise limit
<TheMuso> hrm ok I didn't see it change...
<TheMuso> Let me have another look.
<TheMuso> Hrm ok, I probably don't remember looking at the limit prior to making the change. :)
<TheMuso> Right, time to see if WIs can be merged/dropped.
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-11-16
<chrisccoulson> gah, i hate powerpc
<chrisccoulson> please die
<chrisccoulson> please
<TheMuso> chrisccoulson: Since its not a supported arch by Canonical, if it FTBFs just don't worry about it... Unless of course its irritating you to get the FTBFs emails etc.
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it's just a FTBFS
<chrisccoulson> i shall ignore it for now unless someone complains
<TheMuso> I'll bet you won't hear a thing.
<TheMuso> I've worked on powerpc on and off over the last few years, but can't get anybody else from the community to get involved, so I've lost interest.
<TheMuso> At least there is still debian.
<bjsnider> how many people still use ppc hardware?
<TheMuso> The #ubuntu-powerpc channel still sees a few people a week coming in and asking questions.
<TheMuso> And the debian-powerpc list is reasonably active, i.e maybe a few posts a week.
<TheMuso> Most people who I've seen using it are in 2nd-world/non-western Countries.
<TheMuso> Or whereever there is a deacent market for used hardware, whatever the form.
<TheMuso> Urgh in precise, something is preventing me from using alt key combinations to switch between channels in irssi, and no I don't have more than one tab open in the terminal window where irssi is running.
<RAOF> TheMuso: Is there an EQ overflow in your /var/log/Xorg.0.log, perchance?
 * TheMuso looks
<dobey> TheMuso: well, unity does screw up alt keybindings in gnome-terminal
<TheMuso> RAOF: no
<TheMuso> dobey: Right, but it was working in oneiric.
<dobey> although, numbers should be fine
<RAOF> Ok, not the thing that I've had happen then.
<TheMuso> Numbers are not working either.
<dobey> TheMuso: is your numlock turned off or something? laptop keyboard issue?
<TheMuso> Numlock is off, but it has to be for Orca use.
<TheMuso> Numlck was off in oneiric too and things worked.
<TheMuso> What is interesting is that in another terminal on another workspace, I can switch between tabs with alt + numbers.
<TheMuso> And the irssi I am using is actually sitting on a lucid box, going via ssh + screen.
<dobey> TheMuso: if you're using irssi in screen, you can try opening a new terminal and reconnecting to it there, and seeing if it works again
<TheMuso> dobey: I've already killed gnome-terminal completely and reloaded it.
<dobey> oh, ok; if all else fails, blame compiz? :)
<TheMuso> I'm not blaming anything at this point. I can try logging out/back in I guess.
<dobey> could try unity 2d instead of 3d also
<TheMuso> Theres a thought.
<dobey> i'm pretty much out of ideas beyond that, though :)
<TheMuso> No, not working in unity-2d either. I suspect something to do with gnome-terminal itself.
<TheMuso> Hrm maybe not, doesn't look like the version has changed since oneiric.
<TheMuso> dobey: thanks anyway.
<TheMuso> I did a fresh install but left my home dir intact, so I wonder if something somewhere in my previous config is doing something funky.
<dobey> well it's working ok for me on oneiric in that respect, and my home directory has been here since long enough that i don't remember when it wasn't. but surely since from before i even used ubuntu :)
<TheMuso> Right, it was working in oneiric for me too. No matter, I can work around it for now.
<jbicha> bug 890555
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 890555 in gtk+3.0 "Alt stopped working as Meta in gnome-terminal with gtk+3.0 3.2.2-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/890555
<jbicha> TheMuso: are you using byobu?
<TheMuso> jbicha: No I am not.
<TheMuso> Thanks for the bug link.
<jbicha> if you were, the new byobu-tmux (which will soon be default) eats the alt shortcuts by default
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> Ooh there is a proposed patch in the upstream bug.
 * TheMuso grabs and builds.
<TheMuso> Ah, the joys of being on the bleeding edge.
<jbicha> gtk 3.2.2 was supposed to be bugfixes, not bleeding edge... :)
<dobey> i have seen upstream "stable" releases of gtk+ break things too many times, to believe that ;)
<TheMuso> dobey: I agree.
<dobey> "oh you were using that public API? sorry, we fixed this bug that now makes that API entirely useless to you. deal."
<dobey> :-/
<TheMuso> Ok, I've got my eye on that upstrea bug. If that patch gets put into upstream git, I'll upload a revision of vte to precise.
<dobey> does it fix it for you?
<jbicha> TheMuso: did you see that Debian split vte into vte and vte3 ?
<TheMuso> jbicha: No I didn't.
<TheMuso> dobey: Still building.
<TheMuso> I had to install build deps first.
<dobey> ah ok
<TheMuso> jbicha: Do you mean source packages?
<jbicha> TheMuso: yes
<jbicha> http://packages.qa.debian.org/v/vte3.html
<TheMuso> jbicha: Right, I don't keep a great eye on Debian GNOME packaging, but I've touched vte a few times due to my dependance on it.
<TheMuso> Its probably worth us looking into doing the same thing.
<TheMuso> Oh and yay for the perl transition breaking sbuild just when I was going to install it. :)
<dobey> heh
<dobey> it apparently broke the world this morning, *right* as i uploaded a package to precise that needed intltool :)
<TheMuso> Lovely.
<TheMuso> I used the last daily for my install so things were not broken, at least for the install image.
<TheMuso> Ok brb, restarting terminal to see if that patch helps.
<TheMuso> Ah! Yes it works!
<dobey> nice
<TheMuso> I have my traditional workflow back again. :)
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Mind me merging libraw?  It's on my color-management-related buglist.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, no complaints from me!
<dobey> ah well, must get some rst
<dobey> rest even
<dobey> later
<jbicha> TheMuso: bummer, I just logged out and back in and now I have the broken Alt problem too!
<TheMuso> jbicha: I have a package built. DO you know if the desktop team has a PPA for GNOME stuff where I could upload it for you?
<jbicha> TheMuso: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ppa
<TheMuso> Ok, I'll throw it up there for you if you'd like. Its not versioned for a PPA though, is that a problem?
 * TheMuso never has to use the desktop team PPAs for anything.
<TheMuso> So is unsure of procedures/policies.
<jbicha> if you could add a ~ppa1 to the version, that would help
<TheMuso> No problem, will do.
<TheMuso> jbicha: Uploaded, should be available as source shortly, so you can pull it down and build it yourself if you are in a hurry. :)
<jbicha> TheMuso: I'll give it a try in the morning, it's getting late here...zzz
<TheMuso> jbicha: np
<RAOF> Yay!  Sbuild is installable again!
<TheMuso> ooo good to hear.
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> RAOF, TheMuso: if postinsts build AOT code, that will be in the live system as well, unless live-build.sh takes special measures to remove them
<TheMuso> pitti: Yeah I am aware of that, and good morning.
<RAOF> pitti: Good morning.  So, we'd need live-build.sh to take special measures to remove them.
<pitti> bryceh, jasoncwarner_: some play in the WIs> yes, of course; not complaining about 24 vs. 26, but I do complain about 5 vs. 26 :)
<pitti> RAOF: of course that might be obsolete when we switch back to TB
<pitti> RB, I mean
<RAOF> Eh, I've been wanting to do the AOT-in-postinst for a while.  It's an obvious thing to do.
<RAOF> Also, I'm not entirely clear how to mark https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lcms/+bug/885324 (which is currently showing up as almost all of my work items).  I'm happy to do some of those switches, but I don't think the entire transition should be mine :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 885324 in cups "Completely replace lcms1 by lcms2 in Ubuntu" [High,In progress]
<pitti> RAOF: I unassigned the blueprint
<pitti> RAOF: so all the linked tasks are now unowned
<pitti> RAOF: the whiteboard has explicit assignees, so that should be fine
<RAOF> Ok, great.
<pitti> however, the bug still needs some love, at  least the packages in main actually need assignees
<pitti> otherwise they'll just hang around in the air with nobody being responsible or having it on the radar
 * pitti assigns them to c-d-t for now
<RAOF> I'll claim the ones I'm happy to do, I guess.
<pitti> thanks
<micahg> pitti: is it worth setting up a transition in the tracker for liblcms?
<pitti> I don't know -- doesn't bug 885324 suffice for this?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 885324 in cups "Completely replace lcms1 by lcms2 in Ubuntu" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/885324
<micahg> pitti: well, the transition in the tracker tracks stuff that built properly everywhere as well, the bug will only track if someone has done the porting
<pitti> ah, ok; I don't know what it takes to set it up, but it's certainly a large and nontrivial one
<micahg> pitti: in lp:~ubuntu-transition-trackers/+junk/transition-tracker/ there is a folder ubuntu/monitor with .ben files in it, I can set one up next week if no one else does it first
<robert_ancell> RAOF, do you think we should move the items in desktop-q-wayland-tech-preview into desktop-o-xorg-wayland-something-or-other?
<robert_ancell> I've done that, seems simpler...
<RAOF> Ok.
<RAOF> The tech preview blueprint has a more obvious name, but eh!  It doesn't make much difference :)
<pitti> Run "gconftool --solve 'tanh 0.1'".  It will print 0.549833997, although
<pitti> the actual answer is 0.099667995.
<pitti> wow, that really freaked me out
<pitti> turns out that guy actually meant "gcalctool" :)
<broder> ha!
<RAOF> Bah.  Dear vala: why?
<didrocks> good morning
<bryceh> pitti, could you accept https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-xorg for precise?
<pitti> bryceh: done
<bryceh> ta
<rickspencer3> pitti, hi, how is the desktop team coming along wrt getting work items listed out?
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> rickspencer3: some 5 specs are still being drafted, and some people have too many WIs; I compiled a TODO list yesterday, and folks are on it
<rickspencer3> ok
<pitti> rickspencer3: our goal is to get it done by EOW
<rickspencer3> pitti, I ask because looking here:
<rickspencer3> http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-precise/canonical-desktop-team.html
<rickspencer3> it does seem like a lot of work items piling up
<rickspencer3> though, in fairness, many of them seem to be related to other teams
<pitti> rickspencer3: did you see https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AoGTYJ3uqCiMdHQzeUI5akNkS1I0ckJGNXpJbnEwLUE#gid=0 ?
<pitti> rickspencer3: that's what I'm using for planning
<pitti> rickspencer3: the numbers are from yesterday afternoon, some cleanup happened since then
<pitti> I'll update it in a bit
 * rickspencer3 looks
<rickspencer3> pitti, nice
<pitti> and nobody yell "not a metric"!
<rickspencer3> so you are shooting for < 196
<rickspencer3> ?
<pitti> yes, I consider the "precise WI limit" column a pretty hard limit
<pitti> rickspencer3: but not only the sum, also the number for everyone individually
<rickspencer3> pitti, right
<rickspencer3> pitti, I <3 u
<rickspencer3> :)
<rickspencer3> this is so awesome
<pitti> RAOF: I just updated your's, but you still have 15 WIs
<rickspencer3> is this a best practice, or something you do yourself?
<pitti> rickspencer3: The latter for now; it's a trial how well this works
<pitti> I wanted to try something new and more evidence based than the guesswork we did before
<rickspencer3> pitti, may I write a blog post about it?
<rickspencer3> well, I know I "may" ... but would you mind if I did ?
<rickspencer3> ;)
<pitti> rickspencer3: please go ahead; but we should make the document public then, if nobody objects to that
<pitti> it's taking public data sources, and is just number playing, but not sure if anyone in the desktop team considers this "private"
<rickspencer3> pitti, so long as it doesn't link to any company confidential info, I guess making it public make sense anyway
<pitti> rickspencer3: with the just updated stuff the sum is now actually reasonable
<pitti> but not for individuals
<rickspencer3> pitti, I know exactly what you mean, I've been in your current situations many times
<rickspencer3> where you have to make some weird choices
<rickspencer3> do thing 2 that is less important than thing 1, but only a certain overbook person can do thing 1
<pitti> rickspencer3: bbl, 1-on-1 with Jason now; incidentally reviewing the spec list and chopping some is on our list today :)
<rickspencer3> thanks pitti
<rickspencer3> this is awesome, you made my morning
<pitti> rickspencer3: right; in the past we only half-looked at the sum, and it hasn't worked
<pitti> rickspencer3: so, please feel free to fiddle with the permissions to allow public viewing (but not editing), it's not immediately clear to me how that works
<pitti> a google doc is not ideal for this anyway, it should eventually go into the WI tracker; but for trying the concept it's doing ok
<rodrigo_> morning
<pitti> jasoncwarner_: http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-precise/canonical-desktop-team.html
<pitti> jasoncwarner_: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise?searchtext=desktop-p-
<RAOF> -1 duplicate WI, -1 WI that's got no chance of landing in P.
<RAOF> Now, 13 is still > 5, but that's getting closer :)
<didrocks> RAOF: push harder, it will fit at some point! :)
<RAOF> Well... 1 + 3 < 5!  I win!
<didrocks> heh :-)
<seb128> hey
<desrt> seb128: good morning
<seb128> hey desrt, how are you?
<didrocks> good morning desrt
<desrt> pretty decent
<desrt> but wanting to go home :p
<seb128> desrt, stop travelling! ;-)
<desrt> at the end of this week i'll be home for ~2 months
<desrt> 2 glorious months
<rodrigo_> desrt, where are you?
<rodrigo_> hey seb128
<desrt> manchester
<rodrigo_> ah
<seb128> desrt, 2 months before a new year of nomade live? ;-)
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<desrt> seb128: platform sprint and a11y hackfest in january.  gtk hackfest in february... it begins.....
<seb128> I can see that coming ;-)
<seb128> UDS, GUADEC, holidays in Europe
<seb128> second platform sprint
<desrt> gotta do it before i get all old and cranky
<hrw> hi
<pitti> RAOF: well, 13 is actually not unreasonable
<pitti> RAOF: you just ended up with that low estimate because you just had 6 or so last cycle
<pitti> RAOF: if you are okay with the ones you have right now, and think that they are realistic, I just mark it as "confirmed" in the chart
<pitti> RAOF: I just want to avoid the situation that people collect tons of WIs in many sessions and lose track
<desrt> pitti: you're a true gentleman
<pitti> jasoncwarner_: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/df-libreoffice/+spec/desktop-p-libreoffice-lo-menubar-polish
<pitti> hey desrt, how are you?
<pitti> desrt: I lost track, which country are you in right now?
<desrt> england
 * desrt is reasonably good
<desrt> pitti: feeling good about the cycle after the WI round-up?
<pitti> desrt: I wish we had fewer, but by and large yes
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<desrt> chrisccoulson: hey
<chrisccoulson> hi desrt, how are you?
<desrt> okay
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti
<pitti> didrocks: you are still using weechat, right? do the alt keys still work for you? they broke for me on Monday or yesterday
<didrocks> pitti: I still have the precise version (I'm picking only some part of precise), and it works, do you want me to try the precise one?
<pitti> didrocks: ah, you mean "oneiric"
<didrocks> oopsss, indeed :)
<pitti> didrocks: I downgraded to 3.5 again and it was still broken, so I suspect it's in a library
<pitti> but it also stopped working in a VT, so I don't think it's gtk or so
<pitti> didrocks: but not urgent, don't break your box because of me :)
<didrocks> pitti: oh weird, still working in oneiric + all -proposed updates
<didrocks> pitti: I plan to fully dist-upgrade next Monday
<pitti> yes, it was working in precise until Monday, too
<didrocks> if alt + a breaks, I will die :)
<pitti> alt + <number> and alt+<p> is highly useful, I'm missing that now
<pitti> I moved alt+a to strg+g
<didrocks> alt + p is only to "clean the screen", isn't it?
<didrocks> I'm not using that one
<pitti> no, "previous ping"
<didrocks> ah :)
<pitti> so, open backscroll in the morning, jump through apt+p
<didrocks> yeah, as I use no more IRC server, the usage is quite limited right now :)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i really need some better lighting in here
<chrisccoulson> it's really dark this morning
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks
<pitti> rodrigo_: hey
<pitti> rodrigo_: I just reviewed https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-systemd-packagekit , can you please be a bit more detailled for the required interfaces there?
<pitti> thanks!
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson pitti
<seb128> how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<chrisccoulson> i'm good thanks, how are you?
<seb128> I'm fine thanks
<pitti> bonjour seb128!
<TheMuso> pitti: I encountered the same issue with the alt key in gnome-terminal today after ypgrading to precise. A fix proposed in an upstrea bug for vte is sitting in the GNOME desktop PPA, ppa:gnome-desktop/ppa if you want to test.
<TheMuso> Bug 890555
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 890555 in gtk+3.0 "Alt stopped working as Meta in gnome-terminal with gtk+3.0 3.2.2-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/890555
<pitti> TheMuso: oh, thanks
<pitti> TheMuso: it seems to work fine for switching tabs and opening menus, thoug
<TheMuso> pitti: Yes, my experience also.
<pitti> and it stopped working on VTs, too
<TheMuso> pitti: I use alt keys with nymbers and letters to fling myself around my several irssi chat channels.
<pitti> so I didn't suspect gtk etc.
<pitti> anyway, testing
<TheMuso> err, numbers.
<TheMuso> And https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=663779
<ubot2> Gnome bug 663779 in VteTerminal "Alt/Meta/Mod1 broken again" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<pitti> ah, not built yet, /me grabs source
<TheMuso> FWIW it works for me here.
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes, sure
<pitti> TheMuso: that partially helps indeed; some bindings are still broken, but that could be my fault; alt+number works again, thanks!
<TheMuso> pitti: np, I'm subscribed to the upstrea bug, so if upstream gives that patch the stamp of approval, I'm happy to upload it to precise.
<pitti> TheMuso: it's straightforward, so we could even upload it right now
<pitti> it mirrors the change in GTK, after all
<TheMuso> Oh ok, I'll upload right away then.
<pitti> in the sense of "don't break precise for devs" :)
<pitti> TheMuso: thanks! (NB it's in bzr)
<TheMuso> oh ok
<rodrigo_> pitti, done
<pitti> rodrigo_: oh, changing system locale? I thought we already do that in accountsservice, from language-selector
<rodrigo_> pitti, no, we don't
<rodrigo_> pitti, we just store the locale for the user there
<pitti> hm, I wonder what it uses then -- we do have an "apply system wide" option there
<rodrigo_> it uses systemd's interface
<pitti> rodrigo_: ah, nevermind
<pitti> rodrigo_: language-selector has its own root dbus backend for this
<pitti> so yes, implementing that in u-s-s sounds great
<pitti> rodrigo_: thanks!
<rodrigo_> yes, my plan is to just make it implement the systemd interface and call the current code
<pitti> rodrigo_: no, language-selector will go away, so it acutally needs to move there
<pitti> and in language-selector we'll call u-s-s instead
<pitti> (in case KDE still wants to keep it)
<rodrigo_> pitti, sorry, I mean u-s-s, it has a method for setting the system locale, doesn't it?
<pitti> rodrigo_: so far just for setting proxy, keyboard layout, and reboot
<pitti> but setting locale fits in perfectly there
<rodrigo_> yeah
<rodrigo_> right, sorry, the sys keyboard layout is part of the system locale changes
<pitti> rodrigo_: anyway, we violently agree :)
<mvo> seb128: good monring! pardon my silly question, but what packages provides the https support for gio/glib?
<rodrigo_> pitti, :)
<pitti> Sweetshark: hey Bjoern, wie gehts?
<pitti> Sweetshark: are you still working on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-libreoffice-packaging, or is that ready for approval?
<pitti> Sweetshark: (FWIW, I don't think we should enable the lo-menubar code in precise, not in its current state)
<seb128> mvo, glib-networking
<seb128> ?
<mvo> seb128: hm, I get a error here when I try to access https location with that, there seems to be something else going on (I'm debugging a odd s-c exhibit banner failure currently). but maybe I'm missing something else, I try to create a test-case. this is a xubuntu stock install fwiw
<seb128> mvo, well, define https
<rodrigo_> brb
<seb128> mvo, gvfs has a webdav backend if that's webdav
<mvo> seb128: I guess the question is what package I need to make http://paste.ubuntu.com/740079/ work :) I will check webdav now
<seb128> desrt might know better
<desrt> not likely.
<desrt> oh.
<mvo> ohh, it seems like gvfs-backends is simply missing!
<desrt> it's gvfs
<mvo> so thats it
<desrt> glib-networking is mostly proxies and ssl
<mvo> thanks, found it now, sorry for the noise!
<desrt> if you install glib in not-/usr and don't also install a gvfs in the same place then you'll hit this problem
<desrt> :)
<mvo> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, my PPA uploads seem to be disappearing in to a black hole
<glatzor_> morning mvo
<mvo> hey glatzor_, nice to see you
<pitti> hey glatzor_, wie gehts?
<glatzor_> pitti, thanks fine! yourself?
<pitti> "/window left
 * desrt walks to the left and opens the window for pitti
<pitti> glatzor_: quite fine, thanks!
<pitti> desrt: thanks; can you fix my key bindings while you are at it? :-)
 * desrt hands pitti a wrench and tells him to figure it out himself
<pitti> didrocks: ok, with TheMuso's patch all is happy again
<pitti> didrocks: so, safe to upgrade once again :)
<didrocks> pitti: excellent, thanks for the info! :-)
<TheMuso> tttttttttt/c
<TheMuso> whoops
<ricotz> hello everyone
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, hi
<chrisccoulson> hi ricotz
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, do you know about a regression in thunderbird 8 not showing specific attachments
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, i'm not aware of anything like that
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, it is a Mime-Version: 1.0 mail with Content-Type: APPLICATION/PDF, so it only includes a base64 encoded pdf
<ricotz> generated by SAP R/3
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, any chance you could send me an example?
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, hmm, i will try to strip out the private parts
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<ricotz> it works with 7.0.1 though
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, i have sent it to you
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, thanks. will take a look in a bit
<rodrigo_> pitti, hmm, you removed my name from some WIs, I guess they get assigned to the assignee for the BP?
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, thanks
<pitti> rodrigo_: yes, easier to read
<rodrigo_> pitti, ok
<pitti> rodrigo_: FYI, you uploaded g-s-d without -v, so if the previous changelog closed any bugs, you have to do that manually
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes, did it manually
<chrisccoulson> hmmmm, i really should upgrade to precise today
<seb128> chrisccoulson, is it fixed yet? ;-)
<hrw> bug 891116 is irritating - did someone got hit by that?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 891116 in unity "After switching desktops I am unable to enter data from keyboard" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/891116
<seb128> hrw, works fine here (with unity-3d)
<hrw> I just got it twice
 * ogra_ doesnt have that either
<ogra_> unity-2d though
<ogra_> and reliable arm HW indeed :)
<hrw> ogra_: I used unity/2d for 2 days and decided that it is enough.
<hrw> ogra_: 2d has things which 3d lacks and vice versa
<ogra_> sure
<hrw> nice thing in unity/2d is 'do not use top panel for maximized windows' gconf setting
<ogra_> i love the top panel integration since i use a 1024x600 screen for working
<hrw> but bug 891077 made me switch to 3d
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 891077 in unity-2d "Add vertical/horizontal maximize on RMB/MMB" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/891077
<hrw> ogra_: I use fullhd
<ogra_> even there i like to not waste space for the menu
<hrw> I do not like macos style menu - hard to reach when >1 app on screen
<ogra_> you can add RMB/MMB support easily to metacity using devilspie
<hrw> as I use 'focus under mouse' activation
<hrw> ogra_: metacity is only one wm which I used during last few years which needs extra care for it
<ogra_> me too, i got used to move the window to the top if i need the menu
<ogra_> hrw, not my fault, i only told you how to solve it :P
<ogra_> all extra functionality you want from metacity can be done via devilspie
<hrw> ogra_: I know ;)
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<hrw> bug 890283 was also ugly but thats design of unity I think
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 890283 in unity-2d "Pass mouse scroll events to systray icons" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/890283
 * zyga reports a new unity bug
<zyga> bug 891128
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 891128 in unity "Firefox download manager title bar is corrupted while download is in progress and unity is asked to show application windows" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/891128
<seb128> bah, the etherpad signing stuff is annoying
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<pitti> hello tkamppeter
<kenvandine> cyphermox, ping
<cyphermox> pong
<cyphermox> sup?
<seb128> kenvandine, don't distract cyphermox from the evo updates! ;-)
<kenvandine> cyphermox, hey... i have a weird problem on completely unsupported hardware
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> cyphermox, hey, how are you?
<cyphermox> seb128: doing alright
<kenvandine> seb128, :)
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks for doing the evo updates ;-)
<cyphermox> seb128: practically done with evo...
<seb128> key kenvandine btw ;-)
<cyphermox> eds is done, evo to be finished with soon
<kenvandine> cyphermox, so running natty it can scan wifi and connect just fine
<kenvandine> NM that is
<cyphermox> (expect that eds and evo will still need to be SRUd)
<kenvandine> however, running oneiric with the same natty kernel it can't scan
<cyphermox> ok
<kenvandine> but if i manually add the access point
<cyphermox> kenvandine: what hardware?
<kenvandine> it suddenly connects and lets you scan
<kenvandine> this is my viewsonic gtablet :)
<kenvandine> so arm
<kenvandine> i am running the linaro builds of ubuntu-desktop
<kenvandine> for the rootfs
<cyphermox> kenvandine: also, I have to ask about indicator-me, why does is show 0.2.90 in the ~desktop branch, but it only appears to be at 0.2.19 in precise (might need updates, as it ftbfs, which is why I'm asking)
<kenvandine> and a kernel someone else built
<cyphermox> kenvandine: could you give me what lspci reports for the wifi chip?
<kenvandine> cyphermox, that should just get dropped, i think
<cyphermox> kenvandine: indicator-me> ok
<cyphermox> afaics, updating it to 0.2.90 would actually fix it, I think
<kenvandine> lspci doesn't work, no pci bus :)
<kenvandine> cyphermox, ok, i'll do that for now
<cyphermox> ah, I mean lsusb maybe?
<cyphermox> kenvandine: actually ,for indicator-me it doesn't really matter, I guess I could ask the ayatana maintainers in debian to update
<kenvandine> lsusb only shows usb hubs
<cyphermox> d'oh
<kenvandine> let me get it from the log
<kenvandine> well that doesn't tell me much :)
<kenvandine> the driver is brcmfmac
<kenvandine> which is the same between natty and oneiric
<kenvandine> same for the firmware
<kenvandine> the only difference is the userspace
<kenvandine> it's mostly weird that it can scan once i configure one manually
<kenvandine> it sees a bunch and i can connect to them fine
<kenvandine> cyphermox, also, iwlist wlan0 scan
<kenvandine> worked fine before configuring it
<kenvandine> just not nm-applet
<cyphermox> kenvandine: so there has to be something special about that driver and reported capabilities or something
<kenvandine> wpa_supplicant maybe?
<cyphermox> kenvandine: could you send me syslog and I'll look at it a little later?
<kenvandine> sure... not important
<kenvandine> just an odd problem :)
<cyphermox> it could be wpa_supplicant, but in the logs you should at least see it try to associate
<kenvandine> there are errors in the logs
<kenvandine> but the same errors are on natty too
<kenvandine> cyphermox, evo updates are more important :)
<cyphermox> if it's wpa_supplicant then it's likely also caused by whatever the driver reports, which will have NM choose between ap_scan=1 or ap_scan=2 or something, that tends to break some devices, iirc
<kenvandine> ogra_, i failed miserably at building my own kernel for this last night... everything i built just refused to boot :)
<ogra_> kenvandine, well, lets look at it during the sprint :) ... also i think davidm and pgraner have such a device running ubuntu on it
<ogra_> they might be able to help out with a better kernel
<kenvandine> cyphermox, i did find some people with this problem in some forums
<kenvandine> which suggested
<kenvandine> eapol_version=1
<kenvandine> ap_scan=2
<kenvandine> in a conf file and run wpa_supplicant manually
<kenvandine> but i didn't need that, just manually configured in nm-connection-editor and all was good
<kenvandine> ogra_, i am going to buy a faster sdcard asap :)
<ogra_> kenvandine, oh, and did you say you run linaro builds ?
<ogra_> they differ from ubuntu
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> well, for the rootfs
<ogra_> yes
<kenvandine> i grabbed their ubuntu-desktop one
<kenvandine> easy base
<ogra_> they build it by installing the metapackage during image build instead of the task ...
<kenvandine> ogra_, i am open to suggestions
<ogra_> that can result in different dependency resolution
<kenvandine> i did have a couple problems... a missing file in the dbus package
<kenvandine> and wrong ownership on /var/lib/lightdm
<ogra_> right
<kenvandine> but easily fixes
<ogra_> there might be bits missing to make NM DTRT
<ogra_> not sure
<kenvandine> good point
<ogra_> one option for a rootfs would be to use the ubuntu-core tarballs
<ogra_> or use the ac100 one
<kenvandine> ogra_, where are they?
<ogra_>  http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/oneiric/release/for the ac100 one (full desktop unity-2d install)
<kenvandine> cool
<ogra_> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-core/releases/oneiric/release/ ubuntu-core (absolute minimal system to build something on top)
<kenvandine> i didn't realize those were there :)
<ogra_> well, #ubuntu-arm is next door ;)
<kenvandine> we need kinetic scrolling so bad... :)
<kenvandine> hitting these scrollbars are a pita
<kenvandine> with a laggy system
<kenvandine> not sure it would be better if it was snappy
<ogra_> you mean overlay scrollbars ?
<ogra_> well, the do the overlay part just awesome ... just not the scrolling ... but with bad IO i often have one sitting there for a few mins even though i switched the app long ago
<dobey> kenvandine: we need kinect scrolling.
<kenvandine> that too :)
<dobey> and xbox needs to unleash the system update already
<dobey> so i can watch syfy
<kenvandine> ogra_, i just have trouble getting it to raise the thumb at all
<kenvandine> if i manage to, it scrolls fine
<ogra_> ah
<kenvandine> just when i hit it, it doesn't raise
<kenvandine> so i move away... and 30s later i see it raise and hide :/
<dobey> and gwibber needs to not do the hide/show logos thing
<kenvandine> so maybe it will be fine when it is faster
<dobey> :)
<kenvandine> dobey, what?
<dobey> i'll file bugs
<dobey> just haven't gotten around to it yet :)
<kenvandine> ok... please do
<kenvandine> no idea what logos you mean :)
<dobey> kenvandine: the identica/twitter logos when you hover over the messages in the list
<kenvandine> oh that, yeah... that was a temporary widget
<kenvandine> which njpatel never got around to replacing... so this cycle :)
<dobey> i have plenty of other bugs to file too
<kenvandine> dobey, do it!
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> pitti, do you plan to do the gvfs merge on debian? (just asking, I'm reviewing the precise desktop merges list, well rather the versions yellow list)
<pitti> seb128: I'm happy to do it tomorrow morning
<seb128> pitti, no hurry, thanks
<pitti> seb128: yay syncs
<pitti> seb128: so 3.2 is landing in unstable now?
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> pitti, some bits are, but I'm also syncing stuff from experimental
<pitti> seb128: so if the dependencies are available in unstable, it's ok to upload to unstable?
<pitti> bigon: ^
<pitti> I think we can update some packages in Debian then and sync, to bring us closer together again
<seb128> pitti, I guess so
 * pitti didn't really do package updates this week, sorry
<seb128> yeah, me neither, we should get going with merges though, I plan to spend next week on that
<seb128> (this week is almost over, at least for me, I will take friday off, still quite some holidays days to use)
<seb128> pitti, btw #debian-gnome is discussing pygobject and if they can move the experimental version to unstable
<seb128> you might want to join
<pitti> I do
<seb128> kenvandine, rodrigo_, didrocks: help on GNOME merges would be welcome if you have some time in the next weeks
<didrocks> seb128: I see little hope from my side having time though
<seb128> mterry: ^ do you plan to do a few (the ones with your name on merges.ubuntu.com at least), or do the stable team exempt you of that as as well? ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, ok
<kenvandine> seb128, will do
<seb128> thanks
<rodrigo_> seb128, which merges?
<rodrigo_> seb128, from debian you mean?
<seb128> rodrigo_, yes, https://merges.ubuntu.com/main.html
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, will work on those on idle times
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> well basically version should be all green
<seb128> or at least get no yellow ;-)
<seb128> now is a good time to review our diff, send patches to upstream and debian, and rebase on debian
<rodrigo_> ok
 * pitti puts a cherry on top of bug 869970 and waves to seb128
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 869970 in apport "it would be nice to update the function name in the title after retracing" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/869970
<seb128> pitti, \o/
<pitti> the launchpad backend test suite is working again
<pitti> good night everyone!
<seb128> 'night pitti
<seb128> oh btw guys I updated version to point to GNOME 3.2 by default
<seb128> since that's we default to track for precise
<pitti> ah, thanks
<bigon> 17:21 < pitti> seb128: so if the dependencies are available in unstable, it's ok to upload to unstable? << I guess it's safer to ask to #debian-gnome
<mterry2> seb128: do they build?  :)  but seriously, i could grab some merges
<seb128> oh, a second mterry!
<hallyn> uh, where do i find the option to emulate middle mouse click?
<seb128> mterry2: if you have feel slots that would be welcome but don't feel like you have to
<mterry2> seb128: internet's been odd for me today.  this is phone-mike, nice to meet you!
<seb128> mterry2;: nice to meet you ;-)
<didrocks> ok, time to have some rest, see you guys!
<desrt_> is robert on vacation?
<seb128> desrt_, robert_ancell? I don't think so
<desrt_> or is european time even worse for syncing up with australia than american?
<seb128> desrt_, european time is worse, he's around from 11pm to 8am usually
<desrt> lol.
<chrisccoulson> hah, all the mozilla homepages have a link to http://www.mozilla.org/sopa now
<chrisccoulson> eh, www.mozilla.org
<hallyn> all right, we need for 'all settings' in the settings manager to also point to gpointing-device-settings, imo
<seb128> hallyn, gpointing-device-settings?
<hallyn> seb128: that appeared to be the only way to turn on middle mouse click emulation
<hallyn> the normal mouse settings program was no help
<seb128> hallyn, is that an utility you installed?
<hallyn> no
<hallyn> uh, myabe
<seb128> seems so
<hallyn> maybe it got installed in place of gsynaptic
<hallyn> it doesn't seem acceptable to not have 'emulate middle mouse click' in the default 'mouse settings' program, though.
<seb128> hallyn, why not?
<hallyn> because, when my wife sits down to use xfig and can't terminate a line because there is no middle click, and there's no obvious way to turn it on, that doesn' tlook good
<seb128> hallyn, is there any reason why that option should not just be on by default?
<hallyn> seb128: no
<hallyn> i would think it should be
<hallyn> where would that be done, though, now that there is no xorg.conf
<seb128> hallyn, it's funny, I can't find a request about that feature in my bugs box, I guess mouses without a middle button are almost non existant nowadays
<hallyn> seb128: also, 2 out of 3 laptops in front of me (with 2 mouse buttons) have middle click working by default
<hallyn> so i don't know why it wasn't on on the vaio f11 by default.  But it wasn't.
<seb128> well, you have installed non standard stuff it seems
<seb128> like gsynaptic
<seb128> so maybe one of those broke it?
<hallyn> no!  i jsut now installed that to frantically try to fix it
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, what happened to my monospace fonts in precise? :/
<chrisccoulson> they're ugly again!
<hallyn> it was just a unity-on-oneiric laptop
<seb128> hallyn, ok, dunno then, apparently it's supposed to be working out of the box
<hallyn> oh well, now that i know where to find it (for now), if noone else cares, then i guess that's fine
<hallyn> thx
<cyphermox> oh boy, stupid duplicate bug tags :/
<cyphermox> evolution upload, but something went wrong with my script to match bugs fixed upstream
<worpole> Hi! I was wondering if you could perhaps help with a problem I am having. I recently upgraded to the latest version "Oneric Ocelot" and after a few weeks I am having internet connectivity problems. My connection speed is now VERY VERY slow! I have tried troubleshooting the problem by disabling the WIFI connection and using an ethernet connection instead but speed is no better. Other computers in the house are acheive spee
<worpole> ds of around 5 meg but my laptop with ubuntu is getting around 0.1. And this speed is the same regardless of whether I use an wireless connection or an ethernet cable. Any ideas what the problem might be?
<worpole> oops the first bit was supposed to read "i recently upgraded to the latest version, Oneric Occleot"
<TheMuso> worpole: Please go to #ubuntu for support, this is a development channel.
<RAOF> Better to ask in #ubuntu; this isn't a support channel.  Also, no idea.
<worpole> ok cool, what would be a good support channel to try?
<TheMuso> worpole: As above, the #ubuntu channel is your best bet.
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-11-17
<TheMuso> RAOF: RAOF You're on precise correct? Did you get this error when attempting to run schroot for the first time? E: Access not authorised
<RAOF> Hm, no I don't.
<TheMuso> Hrm interesting.
<RAOF> I do however suffer from everything being unbootstrappable at the moment.  Damn perl transition!
<TheMuso> you do not have permission to access the schroot service.
<TheMuso> heh right.
<jbicha> TheMuso: I use http://wiki.debian.org/sbuild as a guide, perhaps you need to sudo sbuild-adduser and then log out and back in
<TheMuso> jbicha: see #ubuntu-devel, worked out the problem.
<TheMuso> Thanks anyway.
<TheMuso> jbicha: Oh and did that vte patch fix your keyboard issue?
<jbicha> TheMuso: yes, thank you!
<TheMuso> np
<TheMuso> It wasn't my patch, I just grabbit it and packaged it. :)
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF and robert_ancell , you guys have a few minutes for a phone call?
<RAOF> Yup.
<jasoncwarner_> thanks, RAOF , I'll wait for robert_ancell so we can get a conf call and do it all at once.
 * RAOF goes to find his headset/mic
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, hey, just came back
<robert_ancell> mumble?
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: mumble work?
<RAOF> Allow me to install itâ¦
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: :/ ;)
 * bryceh waves
<RAOF> Done.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF robert_ancell in desktop
<robert_ancell> RAOF, microphone settings wrong?
<RAOF> Urgh.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, does X do anything with SIGUSR1?  I was thinking we could hack up X to exit without clearing the screen on this signal if not to get the smooth switching working
<robert_ancell> I mean SIGUSR2
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I don't think SIGUSR2 is used, no.
<robert_ancell> Using signals is pretty yuck, but not sure what else to do
<RAOF> Weren't we going to pass a parameter on startup to make it not clear on shutdown?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yeah, but there is a risk there that when it comes to shutdown I want to you clear up as normal
<robert_ancell> or lightdm fails or something
<RAOF> Right.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, actually, do we need it at all? If I start a new X server and wait for the SIGUSR1 signal, then switch to it should there be any flicker?
<RAOF> Just whatever VT clearing X does normally.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, any idea what it does?
 * RAOF plays âempirical testingâ
<RAOF> Answer: there's is a flicker.
<RAOF> This could surely be eliminated, though.
<robert_ancell> but is it required when switching to a text terminal?
<RAOF> I'm uncertain.  I wouldn't think so.
<RAOF> At least for kms drivers.
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> bigon: yep, we discussed that a bit yesterday; most stuff will be blocked by current glib/gtk anyway, and that will land soon
<bryceh> RAOF, I've drafted https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Blueprints/LtsPointUpdatesForXorg and think it covers everything we've talked about so far.  You should probably look it over and add any noteworthy bits you can think of.
<RAOF> Good idea.
<RAOF> bryceh: That matches my recollection of the session.
<bryceh> RAOF, ok good
<bryceh> so I think the blueprints are all squared away now.
<pitti> bryceh: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-multi-monitor is still in "drafting" state, though}
<pitti> ?
<pitti> no, "discussion"
<bryceh> hmm that's not right, one sec
<bryceh> pitti, ok it's in review state now
<pitti> ah, perfect; will look at it ASAP
<pitti> ah, looks great, thanks
<pitti> robert_ancell: hey Robert, how are you?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Hm.  Hey, could you confirm this VT switching behaviour?  Switching to second or subsequent X servers involves a flash, but switching to the initial X server is seamless.
<RAOF> robert_ancell: How would I get lightdm to spawn the second and subsequent servers with â-background noneâ?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, oh, do they launch without that?  I guess I need to fix the logic then
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I'm by no means certain that's the (a?) cause of the flashing, but it's an obvious difference between VT7 and the others.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, right, I'll investigate tomorrow, we might not need anything special (except when shutting down)
<RAOF> Hm, yeah.  As long as we always log out by starting a server first, then switching to it.
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti
<pitti> RAOF: FYI, I'm looking at merging/syncing libraw; Debian experimental version uses lcms2 now
<pitti> looks fine, syncing
<pitti> bigon: I was just about to update json-glib, but now saw that you already did it in svn, but not uploaded; anything wrong with it?
<chrisccoulson_> good morning everyone
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: feeling better than yesterday. Seems even to have a clear brain :)
<didrocks> and you?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, not too bad thanks. slowly recovering from my ubuflu :)
<didrocks> :)
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<pitti> chrisccoulson: urgh, still ubuflu?
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> pitti, yeah, i've been really bad this time
<AfC> Since I've upgraded to the 3.2 set, every time I go to join a new wireless network (ie, I'm a guest in this office today), I get prompted with the "System policy requires you to authenticate in order to change wireless settings" dialog.
<AfC> I can only assume it's a policy kit thing, but I added myself to netdev and that didn't help. So I'm wondering what to poke. Any suggestions?
<pitti> does ck-list-sessions have an active session for you?
<AfC> pitti: checking
<AfC> pitti: yes
<rodrigo_> morning
<AfC> I'll try messing with pkcheck
<chrisccoulson> AfC, do you have policykit-desktop-privileges installed
<AfC> chrisccoulson: checking
<AfC> chrisccoulson: _no_
<AfC> So, installing :)
<chrisccoulson> AfC, that's probably why then :)
 * AfC disconnects and retries
<bigon> pitti: re json-glib: ENOTIME :)
<bigon> I'll have a look at that today
<AfC> chrisccoulson: that seems to have done the trick. Thanks!
<pitti> bigon: I can help with build/test/upload if you want me to
<pitti> bigon: I just didn't want to step on your toes
<bigon> I'm looking at adding ma support
<pitti> ah
<desrt> pitti: platform sprint is 2012W02, right?
<desrt> (good morning,btw)
<pitti> hey desrt
<pitti> desrt: yep, Jan 09 to 13
<desrt> thanks
<didrocks> hey bigon, desrt!
<pitti> hm, versions.html doesn't get updated
 * pitti checks
<desrt> didrocks: good morning
<desrt> being in europe makes it quite difficult to talk to robert!
<didrocks> indeed
<Laney> is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/light-themes/+bug/762167 right?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 762167 in light-themes "missing dependency on gtk2-engines-pixbuf" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> hey
<didrocks> salut seb128, Ã§a va ?
<seb128> lut didrocks, ca va ? et toi ?
<didrocks> seb128: bien, au moins, j'ai un esprit clair aujourd'hui (et plus de fiÃ¨vre ;))
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> !!!!!
<chrisccoulson> hi french people :)
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey pitti
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> how are you?
<pitti> seb128: FYI, currently debugging why versions.py stopped updating
<chrisccoulson> i'm good thanks, how are you?
<seb128> pitti, when did it stop?
<pitti> I did a couple of syncs/merges this morning, and it's out of date
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm great, thanks
<pitti> seb128: ast updated: Wednesday November 16 2011 20:22:50 +0000
<seb128> ok, weird
<seb128> didrocks, seems pitti synced dee after all :p
<pitti> sorry, was that wrong? we didn't have any more changes, and our package was in fact broken
<pitti> we had a debian/patches/debian-changes
<didrocks> pitti: can you update the vcs as well, please?
<seb128> pitti, we had the discussion a few weeks ago, the vcs is full source derivated from the upstream bzr
<didrocks> yeah, it will probably break it
<seb128> pitti, that doesn't play well with direct syncs
<pitti> ok, will update our vcs then
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> I'm still unsure what to do with those
<didrocks> if you just add the changelog, it should be fine for next iteration
<seb128> libindicate is in the same case
<seb128> libindicator as well I think
<didrocks> but if you copy the full source, we can have conflicts at next merge
<pitti> didrocks: right, and drop debian-chagnes* (I suppose that's not even in the vcs, though)
<didrocks> pitti: no, it's not
<didrocks> pitti: debian-changes is because of cherry-pick upstream
<didrocks> bzr merge ../
<didrocks> from trunk
<didrocks> so inline changes that are erased at next release by merge-upstream
<didrocks> but anyway, we told that we won't use source 3 anymore for those bzr-derived packages
<pitti> ok, sorry for stomping over this
<seb128> yeah, bzr cherrypick and source v3 lead to weirdness
<didrocks> pitti: no worry :) just update the debian/changelog and not the content itself as i'm afraid of conflicts at next resync
<seb128> pitti, thanks for all the updates in Debian and sync!
<pitti> de rien :)
<pitti> I was in the mood this morning
<pitti> currently updating libgnome-keyring
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, not quite readable for archive admins :/
<pitti> I checked libgnome, we can sync if we don't care about the changed background and sound theme settings
<pitti> the latter might still be relevant though for GTK 2 apps
<pitti> otherwise they might start producing sound effects again
<pitti> I'm not sure whether that's libgnome directly or goes through g-s-d
<seb128> pitti, I doubt we have a lot using libgnome still
<seb128> we can sync and see if somebody complains
<pitti> edubuntu still has it on their images
<pitti> I thought "let's just ignore it and have it bitrot"
<pitti> :)
<seb128> works as well ;-)
<chrisccoulson> hah
<seb128> oh, I think chrisccoulson just volunteered for a few merges with his "hah"
<seb128> chrisccoulson, right? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> oops, did i just volunteer for some more? ;)
<pitti> didrocks: pushed
<didrocks> pitti: excellent, thanks!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, no, no work for you until you get g-s-d fixed ;-)
 * chrisccoulson hides
<seb128> chrisccoulson, poke - is it fixed yet - poke -poke :p
<chrisccoulson> does that still happen in precise? i didn't try suspending since i upgraded yesterday :)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> chrisccoulson, dunno, I don't suspend a lot at home and I'm still on Oneiric ;-)
<chrisccoulson> one second, let me try
<seb128> chrisccoulson, my tb indicator still get blued when there is no unread message left though!
<pitti> I suspended yesterday, and it worked perfectly
<pitti> in fact, it was the first time ever when suspend worked correctly with unity and an external monitor
<pitti> before I had to ctrl+alt+f1 and -f7
<bigon> pitti: I've pushed my changes for json-glib, if you want to look at them :
<pitti> seb128: versions.py> ah, there we go -- LP crash
<bigon> :)
<seb128> pitti, :-(
<pitti> Getting LP bugs...
<pitti> lazr.restfulclient.errors.HTTPError: HTTP Error 503: Service Unavailable
<pitti> took awfully long, I assume timeout
<pitti>      <h1 class="exception">Timeout error</h1>
<pitti> yhep
<chrisccoulson> hmmmm, the bogus battery on resume issue is fixed in precise
<chrisccoulson> i probably shouldn't have upgraded yesterday ;)
<chrisccoulson> actually
<chrisccoulson> i could just use the old kernel :)
<pitti> bigon: building locally, to check whether M-A: same is safe for the -dbg (sometimes it isn't)
<pitti> seb128: I guess I can apply the same created_since='2011-08-01' trick that I did to apport
<bigon> pitti: ah? I was not sure actually
<seb128> pitti is on a sync frenzy ;-)
<seb128> pitti, wfm
<bigon> pitti: how can I check if -ma -dbg pkg are safe?
<pitti> bigon: if they only have binaries in /usr/lib/x86.../, it's fine
<pitti> bigon: but sometimes -dbg packages have e. g. /usr/lib/debug/usr/bin/foo
<pitti> bigon: and these will collide
<bigon> ah ok
<pitti> bigon: bug not here, that looks fine
<pitti> no /bin stuff in it
<bigon> yep
<pitti> bigon: thanks!
<bigon> I'll upload it after my meeting, if you want to give it a functional test
<pitti> bigon: seems to work fine here
<pitti> ah! http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html
<pitti> seb128: ^
<seb128> pitti, \o/
 * pitti fixes the libunique FTBFS, sorry about that
<pitti> LP is down, but the error messages have become much nicer!
<seb128> pitti, what error messages?
<pitti> seb128: try opening LP
<pitti> you see the recent status messages now
<pitti> which is really helpful
<seb128> ah right
<pitti> it's so tempting to move the Conflicts: bamfdaemon (<= 0.2.92-0ubuntu1), libzeitgeist-gio, wncksyncdaemon from libglib2.0-0 to some other package like gvfs or zeitgeist or what not, and sync glib2.0
<pitti> but oh well, I think I'll stop my update/merge/sync mania now and move to lunch and apport :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - no, don't remove those :-)
<chrisccoulson> those packages are quite disruptive if they remain installed ;)
<chrisccoulson> as i found out last cycle
<chrisccoulson> gah, launchpad, COME BACK NOW
<AfC> chrisccoulson: [not sure if you saw] yes, your solution of installing missing policykit-desktop-privileges has fixed the problem. Thanks!
<chrisccoulson> AfC, excellent :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: no, not remove -- move to some other package
<pitti> chrisccoulson: we need to keep them until after precise indeed
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ah, ok. i guess that could make sense
<hrw> unity/3d is even usable
<hrw> but bug 891116 affects my work too often ;(
<ubot2> hrw: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: HTTP Error 503: Service Unavailable (https://launchpad.net/bugs/891116)
<seb128> pitti, we will not sync glib long, we want 2.31
<seb128> hrw, seems you are the only one to get it, did you tweak your compiz config?
<desrt> AfC: stop that.  you're making me dizzy. :p
 * AfC hands desrt a glass of water
<desrt> particularly since chrisccoulson is on both places :p
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> hmmm
<seb128> desrt, stop drinking!
<seb128> or drink water
<desrt> seb128: but it's coffee
<chrisccoulson> The following packages have been kept back
<chrisccoulson>   icedtea-netx icedtea-plugin
<chrisccoulson> isn't that not meant to happen these days? :-P
<seb128> desrt, no coffee for you anymore, you had enough!
<desrt> it's only my second cup today
<seb128> then it's ok ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i haven't had any!
<chrisccoulson> but i have had nearly a whole bottle of pepsi max
<seb128> chrisccoulson, use dist-upgrade?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, that's what i'm using ;)
<seb128> not sure pepsi is better than coffee
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i don't think it's any better
<seb128> oh
<seb128> launchpad is back!
<chrisccoulson> i can feel my stomach dissolving away as we speak
<chrisccoulson> probably should go and make coffee :)
 * desrt sticks with the coffee
<desrt> seb128: still no 2.31.0?  bad hacker.
<seb128> desrt, I was sort of waiting for the eog issue to be fixed
<desrt> it is.
<desrt> did they not do a release yet?
<chrisccoulson> hah,  icedtea-netx : Depends: icedtea-netx-common but it is not installable
<chrisccoulson> E: Package 'icedtea-netx-common' has no installation candidate
<desrt> iirc they pushed my patch...
<chrisccoulson> who broke the icedtea package?? :)
<seb128> desrt, no they didn't
<seb128> chrisccoulson, doko?
<seb128> desrt, http://git.gnome.org/browse/eog/commit/?id=ee4f6b27027421ee1e7cb14948f587da83171668 ?
<desrt> yes
<chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, seems he actually fixed it already
<desrt> probably that commit should have also bumped the glib depend
<chrisccoulson> i guess i just need to wait for the publisher
<seb128> desrt, so taking that commit on glib 2.30 will lead to issues?
<chrisccoulson> actually
<desrt> yup.
<desrt> seb128: in short: i completely buggered it up
<hrw> seb128: I did
<desrt> i consider the old behaviour to be a very bad bug, and eog's previous code to be a workaround for that mistake
<desrt> now the bug is fixed and the workaround _must_ be removed in order for eog to continue working
<desrt> which sucks a lot
<desrt> but it is as it is
<seb128> desrt, I hope we don't have many applications workarounding the old bug :p
<desrt> seb128: it only happens when you use gdkthreads
<hrw> seb128: ccsm is needed even to set launcher size (32px) and amount of desktops (1x6)
<desrt> seb128: and afaik, eog is the only app that i've heard of having trouble with the new glib
<desrt> (after we fixed the 2 other actual bugs)
<seb128> desrt, yeah, right, we already had those discussions ;-)
<seb128> desrt, I'm just pondering what to do with eog and glib now, I guess I will make the new glib breaks eog << before-patch and eog depends on >> new-glib
<desrt> seb128: so i don't need to hope :p
<desrt> seb128: yes.  that's correct.
<desrt> sorry for the bumpy ride with glib lately
<desrt> fwiw, i expect it to continue to be bumpy in these sorts of ways
<seb128> no worry
<desrt> small little issues here and there
<seb128> that's less cool
<desrt> i don't go out of my way to cause problems
<seb128> I hoped we would be over the bumpy part of the road ;-)
<desrt> well
<desrt> with respect to threading, we are
<desrt> but who knows what needs to be beaten on next
<ricotz> desrt, hi
<seb128> keep working on gsettings and gmenumodel and we are fine :p
<desrt> i'm just saying that if i see a situation like this again in the future, i will probably do the same thing agian
<ricotz> seb128, hey
<seb128> hello ricotz
<desrt> and not say "we have to keep it working the broken way"
<desrt> ricotz: good morning
<seb128> desrt, right
<seb128> desrt, well I guess we are mostly fine for this cycle now
<desrt> seb128: probably.
<seb128> which is what I care about at the moment ;-)
<ricotz> desrt, seems like problem with the threading tests locking up is getting worse again
<desrt> ricotz: the one i was trying to blame on glibc?
<ricotz> hmm, the one running on a very old kernel
<desrt> maybe we can blame the kernel this time :)
<ricotz> like the launchpad builders running
<desrt> which testcase deadlocked?
<ricotz> one sec
<seb128> chrisccoulson, versions says that firefox 9 isn't buddy with armel and powerpc in precise
<desrt> i assume this is with the glibc fix already applied?
<ricotz> TEST: gdbus-threading... (pid=10533)
<desrt> heh
<desrt> i suspect that's our bug
<desrt> s/our/davidz's/
<ricotz> ok ;)
<ricotz> desrt, did you get my post in #gtk+?
<desrt> he was making some comments the other day that he's not sure if the testcases are threadsafe
<desrt> which is pretty ... unfortunate
<chrisccoulson> seb128, not sure why, but the armel build was killed 10 hours in
<chrisccoulson> and powerpc is known broken, but i don't care about that ;)
<desrt> ricotz: i did.  i didn't understand the problem.
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah, it seems like somebody rm-ed the build tree
<chrisccoulson> i wish people would tell me when they kill a build
<desrt> it's not causing glib to fail to build...?
<chrisccoulson> i have no idea why :/
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i'm blocked on https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/179038 now. perhaps this is a sign to fix seb128's bugs
<seb128> \o/
<chrisccoulson> brb, need to switch to the old kernel
<ricotz> cyphermox, hello :), do you noticed some new fallouts with iwl4965 like having a very untable wlan connection and microcode crashes
<tbf> are there chances to get old alt-tab switching behavior back for 12.04?
<tbf> the new switcher looks incredibly awesome... but...
<tbf> i constantly loose windows because i fail to notice i want to switch between windows of the same app
<tbf> also my little finger starts to hurt since the ~ key's stoke is much smaller than the tab key's stroke on my thinkpad
<tbf> so i really develop some resistance to press alt-~
<tbf> another problem: when i accidentally pressed alt-tab instead of alt-~ i now have to tab back to get the window picker to open
<tbf> since alt-tab already went to the next window
<tbf> it's just not nice.
<tbf> despite the gorgeous look
<didrocks> tbf: hey, I guess those kind of discussions should happen rather on the ayatana mailing list where designers are (I guess there is also #ubuntu-design channel now)
<tbf> didrocks: ok, another list to subscribe. :-D
<tbf> thanks you anyway.
<didrocks> yw :)
<seb128> tbf, you can re-enable the old switcher in ccsm if you don't like the modern workflow ;-)
<tbf> seb128: oh, you can? where?
<seb128> tbf, just unset the keybindings for the unity one in the unity ccsm options
<tbf> seb128: also i am not generally against change.... actually i love unity (and tell everyone)
<tbf> only think that this change was a miss step... maybe there is a reason the old alt-tab behavior got adopted quickly and then didn't get challenged for decades... ? ;-)
<seb128> tbf, you can unset the keybinding and activate the static switcher then
<tbf> ...checking
<seb128> tbf, I'm not sure to understand what your issue is with the new one
<tbf> guess i'll also loose the awesome presentation, i guess?
<seb128> yes, you will be back to the old compiz code
<tbf> seb128: first of all i don't see the use case. why do i want to distinguish at all? what's the benefit encouraging to learn this?
<seb128> what is to learn?
<tbf> seb128: second i get a huge penalty for using the wrong key
<tbf> seb128: when to press alt-tab and when alt-~
<seb128> you can use alt-tab all the time
<seb128> just pause on an icon, it will display the different instance
<seb128> the delay is a bit long, that's a known issue and will be fixed this cycle
<tbf> seb128: no, you cannot. because when you press alt-tab, the focus already went to the next application
<seb128> no it doesn't?
<seb128> I can press alt-tab, hit esc and keep typing here
<tbf> seb128: so you cannot easily alt-tab between two browser windows, mail compositor and message list, and so on
<seb128> well you couldn't before either
<seb128> the old switcher didn't sort "by application"
<seb128> I would argue it's easier to do with the new one since you get a specific keybinding for that
<seb128> note that you can change the keybinding in ccsm if you don't like the default one
<tbf> seb128: just tried again: switched to evolution. pressed reply button. once the composer appeared i press alt-tab and end in xchat, instead of the message list
<tbf> seb128: when i keep tab pressed, then also xchat gets focused
<seb128> that seems a bug
<tbf> so to select the message list i'd have to move back and wait until the view zooms
<seb128> the "by application" thing is a bit annoying sometimes yes :-(
<seb128> hum lunch is ready
<seb128> bbiab
<seb128> tbf, I'm not saying the new one is perfect btw, some things are nicer some are confusing
<seb128> there are some bugs as well that will be fixed this cycle
<tbf> maybe caused by the "bias current view port setting"?
<tbf> after disabling that setting, alt-tab returns me to the message list
<tbf> so maybe "bias current view port"Â must be done differently?
<tbf> seb128: what's the deadline for bugfixes? must decide when to look at this
<tbf> or if i'll just file a bug for now
<kamstrup> pitti: do you know which dbus version we'll ship for P?
<pitti> kamstrup: well, "know" is a strong word; but unless we have a really strong reason to go to 1.5, 1.4.x
<tbf> well... maybe let's file a bug first anyway.
<pitti> kamstrup: I don't know whether there will be more bug fix releases after .16, but I guess that wouldn't make a difference?
<kamstrup> pitti: right, it's not a huge deal - but there is some unity stuff that *might* be affected by upgrading to 1.5.6 or later
<kamstrup> because of the eavesdrop heade
<kamstrup> rr
<kamstrup> it would be nice with a heads up if it's going in at least
<pitti> kamstrup: understood
<pitti> kamstrup: but anyway, right now we have just about zero problems with dbus, so no reason for us to upgrade
<tbf> hey, should have looked there first: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/863399
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 863399 in unity "Unity needs a way to switch (tab) between windows on current workspace" [Critical,Fix committed]
<tbf> especially i like mark's outlook :-) - https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/863399/comments/25
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 863399 in unity "Unity needs a way to switch (tab) between windows on current workspace" [Critical,Fix committed]
<seb128> tbf, bug fixes can came late in the cycle
<seb128> tbf, the next unity version will do alt-tab by workspace btw
<seb128> tbf, so that deprecated the current workspace bias thing
<seb128> kamstrup, pitti: do you know if there is a 1.6 schedule?
<pitti> I don't
<kamstrup> not that I know of
<tbf> seb128: yup, mark's post sounds very encouraging
<tbf> seb128: just got confirmed feeling home in unity ;-) (sounding like a fanboy now?)
<seb128> ;-)
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<GunnarHj> pitti: Hi Martin,
<GunnarHj> pitti: Do you possibly have a few minutes to complete the bug 868346 MPs? I've updated the branch and am available on IRC now for possible follow-up questions.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 868346 in lightdm "Language selector broken in Ubuntu" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/868346
<pitti> hello GunnarHj
<pitti> ah, can take a look
<GunnarHj> pitti: Good!
<pitti> so locale -a is guaranteed to always have an .utf8 offset?
<pitti> s/offset/suffix for UTF-8 locales/
<GunnarHj> pitti: Haven't seen it documented...
<pitti> GunnarHj: sorry for being picky about the dup/free stuff, I tend to get carried away with those :)
<pitti> but there were some actual leaks which should get fixed
<GunnarHj> pitti: That's great; memory management in C is a black hole to me so far...
<pitti> GunnarHj: not only to you; it's so trivial to get it wrong, guess why we still have to live with so many crashes and memory leaks even in the the 21st century when computers are way faster than we ever need :)
<GunnarHj> pitti: As regards locale -a, we have relied on it in Natty and Oneiric (and in Lucid and Maverick backports).
<pitti> </rant about C"lapping stones together">
<GunnarHj> pitti: What you are saying, basically, is that learning C based on how others do it is not recommended...
<dobey> "Unable to send item to calendar 'Personal'.  No such interface `org.gnome.evolution.dataserver.Calendar' on object at path /org/gnome/evolution/dataserver/Calendar/10292/4" :(
<pitti> GunnarHj: no, I'm saying that writing complex software in C is impossible for a human to get right
<pitti> GunnarHj: computers are so much better when it comes to the task of counting references :)
<dobey> it's not impossible; just hard
<pitti> GunnarHj: I'm just ranting against C, don't take me too seriously
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok. No wonder why i love Perl. :)
<dobey> especially if the platform is also broken
<pitti> (or personal)
<dobey> it is much easier to write completely horribly broken software in python, actually :)
<chrisccoulson> i like C!
<chrisccoulson> but then, i'm weird
<dobey> complex software in python is harder to get right, than in C, i think
<chrisccoulson> me too. i find python harder than C
<dobey> but what do i know; i've only been programming in various forms for over 20 years :P
<pitti> well Â¬C â  Python :)
<chrisccoulson> i guess that having a hardware background means that my brain is wired that way around ;)
<dobey> chrisccoulson: ASM FTW!
<chrisccoulson> lol
<pitti> but I don't buy that developers want to/should do reference counting instead of compilers
<pitti> because they effing don't get it right
<chrisccoulson> the first bit of software i did at college was in machine code!
<pitti> it's not like computers had a counting disability or so
<chrisccoulson> pitti, yeah, that's why i like scoped pointers in C++ :-)
<pitti> right
<dobey> pitti: you're not familiar with computers, are you? :)
<dobey> "OH SORRY YOU COUNTED TOO HIGH, YOUR NUMBERS ARE NEGATIVE NOW!"
<bigon> pitti: uploaded
<pitti> \o/
<dobey> besides, Python is written in C anyway
<chrisccoulson> lol
<pitti> languages like Ocaml or Eiffel got that right decades ago
<pitti> anyway, back to work
<pitti> GunnarHj: so, I'm not quite clear about the purpose of this branch yet:
<pitti> GunnarHj: is that mean to be an SRU-only hack for oneiric, or something for trunk eventually?
<pitti> GunnarHj: (context: calling internal helper tools from accountsservice)
<seb128> vala for the win!
<pitti> that might be acceptable for an SRU, but is no-go for trunk or even precise
<pitti> seb128++
 * pitti carefully unref()'s seb129 again to be back into his olds tate
<pitti> "old state"
<GunnarHj> pitti: No, it's meant to be both for now. But I intend to get rid of that direct call during the Precise dev. cycle.
<dobey> seb128: FTL, because so many things one needs to use are not GObject-based and don't have girs and aren't bound :(
<GunnarHj> pitti: Guess it would be confusing to not upload it to trunk/Precise, wouldn't it?
<pitti> GunnarHj: it's at least against the SRU policy (fix stuff in dev release first and then backport)
<GunnarHj> pitti: Yeah, that's what you usually say. :)
<GunnarHj> pitti: How about writing a bug report about it targeted Precise?
<pitti> GunnarHj: we can use above bug
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok.
<pitti> GunnarHj: MP updated; good progress!
<GunnarHj> pitti: Did you mean MP uploaded?
<pitti> no, sent my review comments
<GunnarHj> pitti: Aha. Will look.
<pitti> pedro_: with "draft" I primarily mean "set up work items and description and flip status to pending approval"
<pitti> pedro_: it looks fine to me, so if you are done with teh blueprint, please set to review, and I'll approve it
<pedro_> pitti, ok! i'm only missing the status then, will do it
<pedro_> pitti, thanks!
<pitti> pedro_: thanks to you!
<GunnarHj> pitti: Will make those additional updates later today. Thanks!
<pitti> GunnarHj: great, thanks!
<pitti> I hope you can catch Robert at some point
<GunnarHj> pitti: Will try.
<pitti> GunnarHj: I saw your other two MPs (accountsservice/l-s), will get to them by tomorrow
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok, fine. I think they require some discussion as well, but you'd better familiarize yourself with them first.
<chrisccoulson> it's all seb128's fault
<chrisccoulson> :-)
<seb128> what what what?!
 * chrisccoulson prepares for more shoulder poking
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you should, poke poke poke, what did I do? ;-)
<seb128> is it fixed yet?! ;-)
<chrisccoulson> nothing. i just needed someone to blame :)
<rodrigo_> :)
<didrocks> stop blaming, the only one we can blame is chrisccoulson because of nvidia and firefox :p
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> that's harsh ;)
 * chrisccoulson cries
<seb128> we can blame it for tb as well!
<seb128> oh, and the fact that ubuntu has no calendar!
<seb128> didrocks, that game is too easy, it's no fun! I like the "is it fixed yet" poking game better ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, is it fixed yet? poke ;-)
<didrocks> seems it's not, or that he just ignores you now :p
<chrisccoulson> gah
<chrisccoulson> my name was character limited
<seb128> :p
<seb128> damn, I missed the opportunity to blue you :p
<chrisccoulson> lol
<rodrigo_> bug 806248
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 806248 in unity "No icons shown in Unity launcher" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/806248
<seb128> rodrigo_, yes?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: you get it?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, seb128: no, danilo was asking me about this bug, so needed the link :)
<didrocks> he has some hw having this issue?
<seb128> didrocks, seems so by reading his recent comment
<seb128> on the bug
<didrocks> oh indeed, I was stucked on the name, not the nickname :)
<didrocks> seems a nux issue, will ping jay about it
<rodrigo_> didrocks, see #ayatana, he was asking who might be intertested in some debugging
<didrocks> rodrigo_:  I pinged jay
<rodrigo_> didrocks, ok
<chrisccoulson> right, will be back in a bit
<chrisccoulson> popping out for dinner for my daughters birthday :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, have fun! ;-)
<pitti> good night everyone!
<pitti> well, will be back for TB meeting, but nothing else
<seb128> 'night pitti
<seb128> pitti, oh, I'm off tomorrow, just for info (still quite some holidays to use so I'm taking fridays)
<pitti> seb128: enjoy!
<seb128> pitti, thanks ;-)
<didrocks> see you on Monday as well pitti!
<rodrigo_> out for a bit, bbl
<chrisccoulson> ogra_, does the current firefox beta actually work on arm?
<chrisccoulson> i was just looking through the build log, and there are thousands of these:
<chrisccoulson> /usr/bin/ld.bfd.real: BFD (GNU Binutils for Ubuntu) 2.21.90.20111025 assertion fail ../../bfd/elf32-arm.c:12049
<chrisccoulson> but the builds still succeeds
<chrisccoulson> just wondering if the binary actually works :)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm
<chrisccoulson> the tests run, so i guess it does
<robert_ancell> The ubuntu-desktop package is generated from a seed right?  Is there any special process for SRUing a change to a seed?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: You would need to make the change to the seed in bzr, then ubuntu-meta needs to be refreshed and uploaded to get the change from the seed.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, so ubuntu-meta is manually generated from the seed?  And the SRU team can do this?
<robert_ancell> (and can I update the seed now, or does it need to be proposed)
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: The ubuntu-meta package has a script that refreshes the binary package dependencies from the bzr branch containing the seeds, which will need to go through proposed. THe seed change can be made in bzr at any time, but it probably still needs running past ubuntu-sru first.
<robert_ancell> I think I'll wait for pitti
<TheMuso> Ok.
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-11-18
<desrt> robert_ancell: hey!
<robert_ancell> desrt, howdy!
<desrt> you're a hard man to get a hold of from europe :)
<desrt> i just landed a bunch of changes on glib to deal with opening up the gsettingsschema API some more
<desrt> the eventual goal is that dconf-editor need not parse xml
<desrt> would be cool if i could get some info about what you need, precisely
<robert_ancell> desrt, it was always planned that way :)
<desrt> the GSettingsSchemaKey structure is planned to be opened up
<desrt> with various getters
<desrt> i wish-list in the form of a bug would be great
<desrt> no sense opening what is not needed
<robert_ancell> desrt, ok, I'll open on against glib?
<desrt> for the summary/description stuff i'm considering creating a separate cache file for those
<desrt> that is opened only if you request
<desrt> yup
<TheMuso> Ugh. Network-manager and policykit are not playing nice with each other. Just tried to join my wireless network in precise, was asked for my psasword, but authentication failed for some reason.
<TheMuso> password even
<robert_ancell> slangasek, does linux-pam have a mailing list / homepage?
<cyphermox> TheMuso: yes, noticed that too
<cyphermox> I will look into it tomorrow and  try to figure out how it can be fixed, but since NM didn't change I expect something's off in polkit
<cyphermox> and on that note, /me goes back to bed
<TheMuso> cyphermox: thought you knew already, thanks.
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> robert_ancell, TheMuso: uh, what? changing seeds in a stable release? what do you want to do?
<robert_ancell> pitti, I just noticed that ubuntu-desktop doesn't depend on unity-greeter which is a big screw up...
<pitti> lightdm does, though?
<robert_ancell> pitti, no
<pitti> Recommends: xserver-xorg, unity-greeter | lightdm-greeter
<robert_ancell> (because it doesn't require a greeter)
<pitti> that's what's pulling it into the default install
<pitti> but right, it leaves open the possibility to uninstall it; I thought that was on purpose
<robert_ancell> pitti, right, but some people are upgrading and not pulling in unity-greeter as it is only a recommend
<robert_ancell> pitti, are there people who want the ubuntu-desktop package installed but not unity-greeter?
<pitti> presumably not
<jasoncwarner_> hey robert_ancell and RAOF , I moved kickoff meeting to Monday morning b/c thumper couldn't make today.
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, ok, np
<robert_ancell> pitti, would it be hard to SRU a change like that?
<RAOF> No problem.
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell and RAOF were you able to dive in yet and see what you could do? RAOF were you able to connect with njpatel?
<pitti> robert_ancell: so, for robustifying upgrades this could be done in theory, we just never changed a seed post-release so far
<pitti> robert_ancell: technically not
<pitti> as TheMuso says, you update the precise and oneiric seeds, regenerate ubuntu-meta, and upload as usual
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: I haven't caught njpatel online yet; I have caught thumper and decided that https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-distro-priority/+bug/807921 seems like a bug that could usefully be tested.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 807921 in unity "Unity tooltips doesn't show Hebrew characters" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<robert_ancell> pitti, right.  So I know how to update the seeds, but can I generate ubuntu-meta?
<robert_ancell> pitti, bug 804171
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 804171 in ubuntu-meta "ubuntu-desktop package depends on lightdm but no greeter" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/804171
<pitti> robert_ancell: sure, apt-get source ubuntu-meta, ./update
<pitti> robert_ancell: added o/p tasks
<robert_ancell> pitti, what's the name of the seed branches again?
<robert_ancell> pitti, found it
<TheMuso> Anybody can generate ubuntu-meta, but then upload privileges apply of course.
<TheMuso> pitti: Oh one questino for you before I sign off for the weekend. Do you knwo if we are going to be adjusting GTK3 packaging for multi-arch?
<TheMuso> gah
<pitti> TheMuso: I'm not sure, it's no small task due to all the plugins
<pitti> nobody is working on it right now AFAIK
 * TheMuso nods.
<pitti> do we need it for anything particular?
<TheMuso> No, but I wanted to know if it was on the agenda, because I enabled at-spi2-atk for multi-arch, forgetting that gtk3 was not multi-arched yet, untill I installed precise the other day, and had to use a symlink to hae the atk bridge module seen by GTK3.
<TheMuso> So if its not on the agenda, I'll rever the multi-arch changes I made.
<TheMuso> revert
<broder> seems a little suckful to multiarch gtk2 and then regress that for gtk3
<pitti> oh right, gtk2 is
<pitti> so it shouldn't be that hard to apply that to 3, too
<robert_ancell> pitti, ok, so I ran ./update, then debuild -S -sa.  Do I just dput it?
<pitti> robert_ancell: you need to adjust teh changelog a bit
<pitti> robert_ancell: for -proposed, and adding the bug number
<pitti> robert_ancell: but yes, just dput; it's nothing really magical, just an ordinary source package which just happens to have a few autogenerated files
<robert_ancell> pitti, but for uploading to -proposed I need to modify the old 1.245 right
<pitti> uh, no?
<pitti> should be 1.245.1 or so
<pitti> 1.245 is in oneiric final
<robert_ancell> pitti, yeah, I'm running precise so I've pulled down all the recent changes.  I'll upload that one to precise, then I need to get the older version
<pitti> ah, I misunderstood
<pitti> robert_ancell: yes; pull-lp-source ubuntu-meta oneiric
<rodrigo_> morning
<pitti> hey rodrigo_, how are you?
<rodrigo_> hi pitti, I'm fine and you?
<pitti> rodrigo_: I'm great, thanks; had a fine hacking afternoon yesterday, continuing today
<pitti> client-side apport duplicate checking making great progress
<rodrigo_> cool :)
<glatzor_> morning mvo
<glatzor_> mvo, do you have got some minutes to discuss the mp?
<mvo> glatzor_: sure
<mvo> glatzor_: happy that you have a bit of time to look at it!
<rodrigo_> hey glatzor_
<rodrigo_> glatzor_, how's the PK API in aptdaemon going?
<glatzor_> rodrigo_, fine. it is working. I updated my system today using gpk-update-viewer
<rodrigo_> cool
<glatzor_> rodrigo_, gpk-update-viewer still doesn't support markup correctly. so the changelogs lock a little bit odd
<rodrigo_> I'll be adding a new method as soon as I'm done with its implementation in PK
<glatzor_> rodrigo_, which method do you want to add?
<glatzor_> rodrigo_, a new WhatProvides type?
<rodrigo_> InstallResource, to install languages (for now)
<mvo> glatzor_: is this in trunk already, i.e. should I upload a new aptdaemon :) ?
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<rodrigo_> hi chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi rodrigo_, how are you?
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, I'm fine, and you?
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, yeah, good thanks
<chrisccoulson> oh, no seb yet?
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, good morning
<pitti> chrisccoulson: how's your ubuflu?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: Seb is on holiday today
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti. yeah, it's better this morning. i just wish i could shake this thing off my chest now :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: is there still something missing for your two drafted specs? they have WIs, but are still in "drafting"
<pitti> chrisccoulson: (cf. my reminder mail from this morning)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - no, i don't think there's anything missing
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so, perhaps you can check again and flip them to "review" when you are done?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, done :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: "Make it possible to store collected adresses in EDS"/"Add functionality for creating addressbooks via EDS" -> will you actually work on that, or is that mconnor?
<chrisccoulson> pitti, m_conley. it could be either of us though :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: also, "Add overlay scrollbar support for Thunderbird (and Firefox):" -> I thought this was pretty much impossible, given that it's not real GTK widgets and we can't modify the sources so much?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - right, it's going to be hard, but not impossible, and we need to do it at some point
<chrisccoulson> this is why i've been careful not to give myself too many WI's this cycle :)
<pitti> ok, if you actually want to work on this, it certainly sounds like a fun project
<chrisccoulson> heh
<pitti> I mean, working on code, not just packaging all the time
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it's nice to do stuff other than packaging occasionally :)
<pitti> so, both approved, thanks!
<pitti> one to go, the default apps one
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<pitti> jasoncwarner_ said this would land on Monday
<pitti> and didrocks needs to approve one spec, but I figure he's on vac today, too
<chrisccoulson> i need to start taking some friday's off. i've got 10 days left
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i think i've figured out my "suspend on resume" issue now
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure it's the same problem as other people, as my issue is clearly caused by this empty battery exposed by the kernel
<pitti> I need to stop for today, travelling to Dresden
<pitti> have a nice weekend everyone!
<desrt> pitti: cheerio
<rodrigo_> have a nice trip pitti
 * desrt ponders turning gtkmenuitem on its head
<desrt> ...or at least its side
<rodrigo_> hey desrt
<rodrigo_> need to run some errands, bbiab
<glatzor_> rodrigo_, bzr branch lp:~aptdaemon-developers/aptdaemon/pkcompat2 and run sudo ./aptd -td -replace
<glatzor_> enjoy yourself pitti
<rodrigo_> glatzor_, ok
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<Poweris> Hi
<Poweris> yra lt ce?
<Poweris> !yra lt?
<ubot2> Factoid 'yra lt?' not found
<Poweris> +
<Poweris> AR YRA SICE LIETUVIU?
<Poweris> +
<Poweris> ! hi
<ubot2> Factoid 'hi' not found
<Poweris> ! lamex
<ubot2> Factoid 'lamex' not found
<Poweris> !lamalex
<ubot2> Factoid 'lamalex' not found
<Sweetshark> anyone knowing how the per-diems for uds work, please pm me
<desrt> Sweetshark: 27 and 16
 * desrt skips the pm to save you from getting messages about it for the next 20 minutes
 * kenvandine is really surprised that we have only had one bug filed against the clutter-gst package... like ever
<Sweetshark> desrt: thanks for the info ;)
<pitti> mterry: ah, diving into stable +1 team? (just saw your transition uploads)
<mterry> pitti, yeah, I've been doing it for a while.  Mostly ftbfs and nbs stuff.  Happy as a clam  :)
<pitti> mterry: feels good to keep a tidy house^Warchive, doesn't it? :-)
<mterry> Yeah, driving numbers down to zero is always satisfying
<pitti> bye everyone, have a nice weekend!
<kenvandine> you too pitti!
<rodrigo_> ok, out for the day, have a nice weekend!
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-11-19
<fosburg> I have been playing with 'Linux' and 'Ubuntu' on an old pc for a few months.  Now I want to buy a workstation to do video and 3d modeling. Any suggestions?
<dobey> #ubuntu is probably a better place to ask; or #blender (since people there are more certainly doing 3d modeling)
<fosburg> ok, good idea
<chronossc> I put XBMC to autostart on my xsession but how I can remove it?
<chronossc> or enable login screen
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-11-20
<OwaisL> Anyone successfully installed google-talk-plugin on Precise? It depends on ia32-libs which seems to be missing from precise
<OwaisL> ?
<seif> rodrigo_, u work on weekends too?
<BillyZ> This is my first try at using this:  How do I change the desktop to the traditional type in 11:10?
<Ampelbein> BillyZ: User support is better in #ubuntu. Short version: Install gnome-panel for the gnome3 fallback or gnome-shell for the regular Gnome3 experience.
<desrt> ogra_: around?
<jasoncwarner_> hey robert_ancell & RAOF, you guys good to call in 5 minutes ?
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, yup.  it's on the conference line righ?
<RAOF> Yup.
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: yup!
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, so we wont be able to hear eachother ;)
 * RAOF needs to work out how to call into the conference line.
<jasoncwarner_> hey RAOF , the bug you were looking at was going to involve Unity, nux and bamf? is that right?
<RAOF> No, just Unity and nux.
<jasoncwarner_> ah, ok...thanks
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-11-12
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Morning pitti.
<pitti> hey TheMuso, how are you?
<TheMuso> pitti: Well thanks. Yourself? DId you have a good weekend?
<pitti> TheMuso: it was rather quiet, the weather was rather wet; but very relaxing
<TheMuso> Is it getting cold there yet?
<pitti> some 9 degrees, that wasn't too bad
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> hey didrocks
<didrocks> bonjour pitti!
<Laney> hey
<didrocks> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> didrocks: good, nice relaxing weekend :-)
<Laney> you?
<didrocks> same for me :) short, but good! :)
<seb128> hey Laney, lut didrocks
<seb128> how are you?
<seb128> didrocks, "short", you worked on saturday?! ;-)
<didrocks> salut seb128! bien bien ;)
<didrocks> seb128: no short in term "a lot to do but not enough time" :)
 * Laney did a lot (of sleeping)
<seb128> hehe
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<philballew> so much excitement going on here
<pitti> seb128: did we get a new GTK or something recently? All my programs now say "Gtk-WARNING **: Theme parsing error: gtk-widgets.css:62:17: Theming engine 'unico' not found", and evince crashes right at startup
<seb128> pitti, hey
<seb128> pitti, seems like the multiarch fallback patch was dropped (by error?) in my recent upload
<seb128> guess the theme is still not multiarched
<pitti> /usr/lib/gtk-3.0/3.0.0/theming-engines/libunico.so
<pitti> oh, it's that?
<pitti> should we just fix that instead?
<seb128> that would be good
<seb128> can you have a look to it?
<seb128> if not I will have a look in a bit
<pitti> I'm sponsoring this morning, but in the afternoon, yes
<seb128> ok
<seb128> Laney, hum, bzr log says it's you who deleted the patch and without changelog entry...
<seb128> that's why I didn't see there was any pending change in that upload, the changelog was still on the quantal SRU
<Laney> when was it?
<Laney> I only rememeber deleting patches we said we could during UDS
<seb128> Laney, during UDS, I guess you did it during the session
<seb128> Laney, can you look at building unico with multiarch and see if that works/fixes the issue?
<seb128> bug #1077568
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1077568 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "Theme parsing error: gtk-widgets.css:62:17: Theming engine 'unico' not found " [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1077568
<Laney> wilco
<seb128> Laney, ?
<seb128> heh
<seb128> Laney, thanks ;-)
<Laney> hm, there are still a couple of other packages using that directory too
<seb128> Laney, which ones?
<Laney> gcin-gtk3-immodule gnome-themes-standard (adwaita) gtk-vector-screenshot
<seb128> do you think we should restore the patch? or just go ahead and port those?
<Laney> perhaps both
<Laney> let me see how unico goes
<seb128> right, I was going to suggest that
<seb128> let's do that one, if it works fine it's easy to just port the other 3
<Laney> seems fine here
<Laney> can someone (pitti?) check with http://people.canonical.com/~laney/unico/ please? :-)
<pitti> Laney: sure!
<pitti> you don't get that bug?
<Laney> I do
<Laney> just want some independent verification
<pitti> Laney: if you could make it 0644?
<pitti> you and your s3kr1t .debs :)
<Laney> oh
<Laney> silly sftp
 * Laney feeds lillypilly some hamsters
<Laney> done
<pitti> Laney: evince still crashes, but the warning is gone; thanks!
<Laney> huh, I don't see it crash here
<Laney> is that another bug?
<seb128> pitti, do you have a stacktrace?
<seb128> it's likely another issue...
<seb128> pitti, is that on a specific document? did it start today?
<pitti> on any documents, even when calling without arguments, I had it yesterday already
<pitti> https://errors.ubuntu.com/oops/f123ee20-2bfe-11e2-b2c9-2c768aafd08c
<pitti> uh, no stack trace?
<pitti> the trace had some unico thingy in it, hang on
<pitti> that's why I thought it was due to the unico theme
<pitti> seb128: FYI, sponsoring cairo FTBFS fix
<seb128> pitti, danke!
<pitti> (so you can delete the mails)
<pitti> ah no, not unico, it was libgrip
<seb128> pitti, bug #1077376
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1077376 in geis (Ubuntu) "Evince crashes when using the latest version of libgeis1" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1077376
<seb128> I was going to say
<pitti> right
<pitti> rather annoying
<seb128> didrocks, ^ can you get somebody from #ps to look at it
<Laney> sounds like a test case waiting to happen :-)
<didrocks> seb128: sure
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yw :)
<didrocks> so libgrip
<Laney> ok, so let's push on with moving those gtk modules then
<pitti> Laney: \o/
<seb128> pitti, is there any way we can do stuff like "nux and unity need to build fine when glew is uploaded"?
<seb128> or we don't have the infra for that (yet)?
<pitti> seb128: we could do that
<seb128> pitti, we did catch those glew issues because people were watching but ideally our infra should block those uploads
<pitti> seb128: nux and unity would need to get an autopkgtest with Restrictions: build-needed
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<pitti> and then perhaps some basic tests which don't need 3D
<seb128> didrocks, wdyt?
<chrisccoulson> i should do that with firefox so that the compiler doesn't break it ;)
<chrisccoulson> hello btw :)
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, good thanks. but quite tired. maisie decided that 3am was a good time to get up this morning
<seb128> doesn't look like a good time to me!
<didrocks> seb128: I'm all for it! Quite busy until autolanding is ready, but yeah, we'll tackle the autopackage test for X-less ones after that
<chrisccoulson> heh
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson :)
<seb128> pitti, thanks, we should definitively look to that once other stuff settle down as didrocks said
<didrocks> yep
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: NB that failed autopkgtests do not yet block the migration; but this is being worked on, and should happen in the next weeks
<seb128> pitti, we will get there ;-)
<pitti> at least it woudl appear as a red dot on https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Raring/view/AutoPkgTest/, and I'm watching that rather closely
<didrocks> pitti: ok, thanks! :)
<xnox> pitti: I see that adt has -proposed jobs now, which I had a fun experience with. the adt fails in -proposed, because the package is uninstallable there. But the same package is still migrated into -release, because it is installable in -release.
<xnox> and I am not sure how to catch / block the migration in such rare cases.
<xnox> also has it been worked out how to run adt test when the packages are installable?
<pitti> xnox: hm, not installable in -proposed, but installable in release> that's because of a broken dependency in -proposed?
<pitti> xnox: we do not yet look at adt during the migration
<pitti> xnox: for now, if a test fails in -proposed, but should succeed later, we can manually restart it
<xnox> pitti: (1) more or less. (2) I know
<pitti> xnox: right now we don't have a trigger which reattempts the test
<xnox> =(
<pitti> if this becomes more common, we'll have to work something out of course
<pitti> shouldn't be too hard
<xnox> so i had: git 1.7 in -release, git 1.8 in -proposed. & guilt in -proposed Depends: git << 1.8. guilt adt fails in -proposed, yet guilt on it's own is migrated to -release.
<pitti> we need to keep track of whether teh failure was due to uninstallability, and retry an hour later or so
<pitti> and if it was due to a test failure, retry when a dependency is updated in -propsoed (that already happens anyway)
<xnox> I think adt should exit and give the orange indication to the test in jenkins, cause that type of thing exited as failed and red.
<pitti> xnox: if britney/adt checks were already in place, it would have been held
<xnox> but I guess adt didn't tell the test why it failed.
<pitti> xnox: no, but britney knows uninstallability, so we can probably look at its output before even starting it
<pitti> or at least fail with a discernible exit code
<pitti> actually it's already supposed to
<pitti> see "EXIT STATUS" in man adt-run
<xnox> hmm...
<pitti> it usually exits with 4 for failed tests
<pitti> but for uninstallability it should fail with 12 or 16
 * xnox needs to tinker with jenkins a little to see why my job was red then.
<pitti> xnox: well, the jenkins job only looks at == 0, I suppose
<xnox> the adt onces - maybe. but jenkins does have the orange light - on e.g. iso-tests. So it can have the grey state.
<pitti> yep
<xclaesse> any idea why I can't start a clutter program inside Xephyr? it says it does not have GLX
 * pitti commits our current pango1.0 delta to Debian and will sync
<seb128> xclaesse, hum, is xephyr supposed to support 3d?
<xclaesse> seb128, yes
<pitti> meh, evince broken, totem broken; raring, stop falling apart!
<xclaesse> seb128, a colleague is running gnome-shell in xephyr without issues, on debian
<Sweetshark> n00b-question: How do I kill an restart the unity-menu process? I once knew, but forgot ...
<Sweetshark> didrocks: ^^ maybe you can give a hint
<larsu> Sweetshark, unity-menu? Do you mean unity-panel-service?
<didrocks> Sweetshark: killall unity-panel-service
<larsu> didrocks beat me
<larsu> ;)
<didrocks> \o/
<Sweetshark> thx guys!
<didrocks> yw
 * didrocks goes for some exercice now, bb ~1h
<Sweetshark> .oO(now using that knowledge to hopefully prove its-not-libreoffices-fault-but-its-the-indicator
<larsu> mhr3, libunity's `configure --enable-docs` breaks building for me. valadoc complains about an "Invalid driver version format." Do I need a newer valadoc?
<mhr3> larsu, yes
<larsu> mhr3, from jhbuild?
 * larsu has whatever quantal has packaged
<larsu> which reminds me, is it safe to upgrade to r yet?
<mhr3> larsu, even the quantal one would be good if it was properly built
<didrocks> larsu: it is, if you don't care about evince and totem
<didrocks> larsu: one broke because of PS, the other one because of us :)
<larsu> didrocks, oh, I do care about those. Better wait a week ;)  Thanks!
<mhr3> ricotz, any plans to fix valadoc?
<didrocks> larsu: vlc and google doc dude! :)
<mhr3> larsu, anyway jhbuild should work, otherwise installing from source will as well
<larsu> mhr3, will do that, thanks
<larsu> didrocks, yeah....... no
<Sweetshark> didrocks: libreoffice-pdfimport ;)
<didrocks> :)
<ricotz> mhr3, is it broken?
<mhr3> ricotz, yes, it installs just one driver, which sucks
<ricotz> ah you mean the distro package then
<mhr3> right
<mhr3> ricotz, fwiw flo said he'll make new upstream release soonish
<mhr3> but the pkg needs to be fixed as well
<ricotz> since there is no release, grabbing the snapshot from vala-team ppa should be fine
<ricotz> which builds 0.14, 0.16 and 0.18
<ricotz> https://launchpad.net/~vala-team/+archive/ppa/+sourcepub/2744950/+listing-archive-extra
<mhr3> ricotz, looking at the buildlog from the ppa, it does look good
<mhr3> ricotz, so all i want now is having the new release in raring
<mhr3> and i guess moving it to main :)
<ricotz> i see
<seb128> xclaesse, is it using 3d or falling back through llvm rendering?
<xclaesse> seb128, no idea...
<xclaesse> how could I know?
<seb128> dunno
<seb128> xclaesse, hum, I wonder if that could be http://cgit.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/commit/?id=e3903a9383351b061b1a99dfc653ca50de764ec4 or similar
<seb128> xclaesse, it's quite a recent fix, I'm not sure it made it to our xserver
<ricotz> seb128, hi, would you be fine with a valadoc snapshot to make it actually usable?
<ricotz> not sure if this is really reasonable for main
<seb128> ricotz, hey, why is there no upstream release? can we get one? but otherwise, sure, better than a broken version
<seb128> ricotz, but first I would like to understand why that's the best option
<ricotz> mhr3, did he mention an eta?
<mhr3> ricotz, the upstream release should be out soon, just bug flo a bit ;)
<ricotz> i see, i guess he will wait for 0.19.x to add its support
<ricotz> mhr3, also this kind of forces him to preserve abi/api stability which is currently absolutely no taken care of
<ricotz> not sure if there are reasonable consumers of libvaladoc0
<mhr3> ricotz, isn't that just an internal lib?
<ricotz> mhr3, so please bug him again for now
<ricotz> mhr3, no
<ricotz> it is an actual lib you can use
<ricotz> but i am not aware of any consumer
<xclaesse> ricotz, seb128: speaking of valadoc, I offer a bier to anyone who makes folks-doc package :)
<mhr3> ricotz, ok, i'll talk to him
<ricotz> mhr3, ok
<Sweetshark> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/1064962/comments/131 <- back to unity
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1064962 in indicator-appmenu (Ubuntu Quantal) "[SRU] Global menubar items do not work when opening a document directly from nautilus with no LibreOffice instance running" [High,Confirmed]
<larsu> Sweetshark, you're probably seeing bug 1075263
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1075263 in Application Menu Indicator "Items of a menubar built from GMenu do not always work" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1075263
<larsu> Sweetshark, try waiting more than 5 seconds between restarting lo, that should work
<larsu> Sweetshark, I have a fix for it, currently waiting in review
<larsu> seb128, one more reason to backport this ^^
<larsu> :P
<desrt> good morning
<pitti> hey desrt, how are you? had a nice weekend?
<Sweetshark> larsu: seems to work
<attente> g'mornin
<desrt> good enough
<desrt> attente: hey there
<larsu> desrt, morning, how is it going?
<larsu> oh hi attente!
<attente> hi larsu!
 * desrt needs coffee :)
<desrt> attente: did you do your lesson last night? :)
<attente> desrt: no, i went climbing instead
<desrt> fair enough
<desrt> find a partner yet or still just bouldering? :)
<attente> just bouldering :)
 * desrt will go some time that is not a monday night :)
<pitti> attente: ooh, you are William
<pitti> attente: hey :)
<attente> hi pitti :)
<pitti> attente: mind to set your real name in IRC?
<desrt> pitti: did you know that you have a fanclub?
<attente> sure
<pitti> desrt: https://launchpad.net/~we-love-pitti ?
<desrt> pitti: ya :)
<pitti> desrt: I tried to forget about that team :)
<desrt> pitti: i joined yesterday :)
 * pitti is honored
<desrt> i also submitted a picture for the team to warp10...  i don't think he liked it very much
<desrt> but maybe you do: http://imgur.com/UkTcn
<pitti> desrt: https://launchpad.net/~dholbach-huggers still beats me :)
<pitti> desrt: PHEAR!
<almostawake> having trouble booting 12.10
<desrt> heh
 * desrt remembers that
<almostawake> says no wubildr
<pitti> yikes, eog is broken as well (geis again)
<almostawake> ya'
<pitti> so that's eog, evince, and totem which are broken in raring
<almostawake> doesnt boot at all4
 * Laney wonders why this stuff isn't broken for me
<pitti> is that a silent effort to kill all local documents and move them into the cloud?
<almostawake> it will eventually
<Laney> s/me/him/
<almostawake> I wondered that myself
<pitti> Laney: indeed; they crash for me on any, or even no document
<pitti> Laney: I confirmed in a guest session
<Laney> weird
<Laney> is totem geis too?
<pitti> no, that doesn't crash; I just get a white video
<pitti> sound works
<Laney> ah, I am running 3.6.3 from the gstreamer1.0 PPA which works for me at least ;-)
<desrt> ricotz: hey... did you make any progress?
<seb128> the totem issues started with the new cogl/clutter rebuilds it seems for pitti
<ricotz> desrt, not yet, i think in 4 hours
<desrt> k
<ricotz> seb128, was totem not rebuilt to catch libcogl11?
<seb128> ricotz, it was, that's when it stopped rendering for pitti
<pitti> seb128: does it work for you?
<seb128> pitti, yes
<Laney> I downgraded and it still works here
<pitti> odd
 * ricotz isnt much of help while he is using totem 3.7.1
<Laney> so trying 3.6 probably isn't worth it
<seb128> but I'm not surprised, those sort of issues are often hardware dependant
<desrt> seb128: fyi: ricotz uncovered (and i suspect) a deadlock in gstreamer apps probably caused by the gtask stuff
<ricotz> seb128, pitti, yeah, probably x-driver/mesa related
<ricotz> seb128, with glib 2.35+ that is
<seb128> desrt, ok
<Laney> desrt: that make-dfsg you asked for got accepted into precise-proposed BTW
<Laney> could you confirm that you can build webkit with it on the bug?
<desrt> Laney: i saw that.  been meaning to test.
<ricotz> seb128, btw, i hope you could pick this https://launchpadlibrarian.net/121589718/gdk-pixbuf_2.26.4-1ubuntu1_2.26.4-1ubuntu1%2B13.04~ricotz1.diff.gz
<Laney> my PPA for testing it got caught up in backport hell
<Laney> biab
<ricotz> seb128, which unbreaks it gdk-pixbuf with glib 2.35
<seb128> ricotz, is that fixed with 2.26.5?
<seb128> ricotz, the new version is available since today
<ricotz> seb128, oh, i guess yes
<seb128> ricotz, ok, so we will rather update directly, but thanks ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, yeah, that would be great
<seb128> ricotz, want to do the update? ;-)
<ricotz> not currently :\, but would be nice to have asap ;)
<seb128> k, I will have a look soon
<seb128> pitti, today is not a good day for raring indeed :-(
<seb128> or today...those recents days
 * ricotz already hears angry people complaining since gdk-pixbuf was updated again in raring
<pitti> seb128: well, I worked through my lunch break instead of watching Hidden Frontier :)
 * seb128 notes to break totem more often
<seb128> neat productivity win for us ;-)
<ricotz> lol
<pitti> there, all UDS autopkgtests sponsored
<seb128> ricotz, you have many people wanting a crack of the day glib?
<seb128> pitti, well done!
<pitti> seb128: FYI, I could commit most of them to pkg-gnome or collab-maint, there were just two which are an Ubuntu delta (and I forwarded those)
<pitti> so it's not so bad after all
<ricotz> seb128, that ppas download stats suggests so, yeah
<seb128> pitti, good
<seb128> ricotz, is there other things than glib in that ppa? I guess users might rather want new gnome-shell or something?
<ricotz> seb128, glib isnt that bad currently, gtk+ was on the other hand
<ricotz> seb128, thre are other things, yes
<seb128> ricotz, yeah, we decided to update glib and be careful with gtk at UDS ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/testing/+packages?field.name_filter=&field.status_filter=published&field.series_filter=raring
<seb128> ricotz, is that new rb using gst1?
<seb128> Laney, pitti: is any of you interested to do the glib 2.34.2 update in Debian?
<didrocks> xclaesse: /usr/lib/nux/unity_support_test -p if you get "Unity 3d supported: no", you are using llvmpipe
<ogra_> well, that recent patch to the detection seems to be slightly broken
<seb128> didrocks, we was speaking about running clutters app in xephyr
<xclaesse> didrocks, Error: GLX is not available on the system
<Sweetshark> larsu: thanks for the bug 1075263 hint. And yes, that should definitely be backported IMHO. Bug 1064962 has 1056 heat already. IIRC forks and torches start showing up at 1100 ...
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1075263 in Application Menu Indicator "Items of a menubar built from GMenu do not always work" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1075263
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1064962 in indicator-appmenu (Ubuntu Quantal) "[SRU] Global menubar items do not work when opening a document directly from nautilus with no LibreOffice instance running" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1064962
<didrocks> seb128: ah, ok :)
<seb128> didrocks, do you know if those fallback to llvm as well?
<xclaesse> didrocks, that's on xephyr server, on the normal server, I have opengl of course
<seb128> larsu, Sweetshark: ok, ok, will backport
 * larsu hugs seb128!
 * seb128 hugs larsu back
<larsu> seb128, let's wait for ted's review, I'll ping him about it when he's on
<seb128> ok
<didrocks> seb128: they did last time I tried
<didrocks> seb128: I doubt it changed since 6 months ago :)
 * ogra_ even has an arm chromebook falling back to llvm here 
<ogra_> and guess what, its slow but works just fine
<ricotz> seb128, nom rhythmbox in there isnt gst1.0 yet, but there is a branch which i want to test
<ogra_> though sadly it uses llvmpipe even though tehere is full GLES support
<seb128> ricotz, ok, if you do let us know how it works ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, yeah, will let you know
<BigWhale> seb128, got a minute? I was poked about this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/brasero/+bug/658004 This is apparently still a problem and upstream is not doing a thing about it.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 658004 in brasero (Ubuntu) "brasero dvd capacity estimation is broken" [Low,Triaged]
<larsu> tedg, good morning, are you okay with https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/indicator-appmenu/lp1075263/+merge/133272 ?
 * tedg cliecks
<tedg> clicks
<larsu> tedg, thanks :)
<larsu> tedg, we talked about this briefly last week. I tested it a lot to make sure that bamf bug doesn't occur anymore
<seb128> larsu, tedg: I suggest putting that patch in raring for a few days first
<seb128> then we can backport
<seb128> BigWhale, hey, what about it?
<larsu> seb128, that's fine with me
<tedg> larsu, Cool, looks good to me.
<seb128> BigWhale, if you want to work on a patch please do ;-) we have quite some annoying bugs with no active upstream to work on those
<BigWhale> It is still an issue and it is really a single line fix.
<BigWhale> seb128, ok, I'll produce a patch tonight and attach it to the bug.
<larsu> tedg, thanks, I'll merge it, then
<seb128> BigWhale, thanks
<xclaesse> seb128, I have firefox and xchat on 2 different workspaces. I click a youtube link on xchat, the youtube webapp icon appear in the launchers, I click it nothing happens
<seb128> xclaesse, does clicking the firefox icon works?
<xclaesse> If I go manually on the other workspace, then go back to the xchat workspace, then after that clicking youtube icon brings me to the firefox workspace
<xclaesse> seb128, yes
<seb128> seems like a bug in the webapp integration, it has rough edges from its first cycle, they plan to do bug fixing this cycle
<xclaesse> seb128, so that does not sounds like known issue? I should open an lp bug then
<seb128> xclaesse, check with kenvandine when he gets online I would say then open a bug (or open a bug directly and let them dup it if it's known issue)
<attente> desrt: is it ok to have sections within sections in a GMenuModel?
<desrt> yes.  totally fine.
<desrt> RAOF: bryceh: ping
<task> Hi, since I updated to 12.10 my Gnome is very slow... I heard this might be realted to NVidia or my bumblebee setup.
<seb128> desrt, too late, too early for those
<desrt> task: sorry... forgot to mention that all of our X guys are living down under
<seb128> try #ubuntu-x
<seb128> there are a few extra x guys there
 * desrt did not know this existed
<seb128> which includes mlankhorst and tjaalton and some others awake
<task> me either... thanks :)
<seb128> yw
<attente> desrt: http://fpaste.org/P8tp/
<attente> for some reason, it's showing separators in between New Open and Save
<desrt> attente: what am i lookingat?
<desrt> attente: put new/open/save into a section together
<desrt> attente: and read the reference documentation for GMenuModel
<desrt> actually, now that i read it myself the language there could be improved
<desrt> it mentions that separators are inserted between non-empty sections
<desrt> in fact, separators are inserted between all non-empty toplevel items of a submenu -- section or not
<attente> ok
<xclaesse> seb128, FYI: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1077968 (I'll ping kenvendin if he shows up before I'm leaving home)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1077968 in unity (Ubuntu) "Clicking youtube icon does not go to firefox workspace" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> xclaesse, thanks
<desrt> man
<desrt> i love building webkit
<desrt> i could spend my whole day building webkit!
<desrt> ...and lord knows sometimes i do. :/
<seb128> not only you could but you will if you try building it
<Laney> been there
<Laney> seb128: looks like smcv is doing glib now ;-)
<seb128> \o/
<desrt> damn
<desrt> Laney: i'm meant to be testing 1ubuntu1.1, right?
<Laney> ye
<desrt> k
<desrt> i'll let you know tomorrow ;)
<attente> desrt: so if separators are inserted between non-empty toplevel items of a submenu, i should *not* expect a separator between "Recent File 4" and "Quit"?
<desrt> attente: i'm confused
<desrt> are you asking from the standpoint of the parser?
<desrt> because there are two things you can do
<desrt> the first is to find the explicit GtkSeparatorMenuItem instances in the menu and split sections at those points
<desrt> the other (which we can only do if larsu doesn't notice) is to just convert those items into explicit separator items and add support for that on the gtk side
<attente> so the way i'm doing it now is guaranteed to fail?
<desrt> i don't know what you're doing now
<desrt> but it sounds complicated :)
<larsu> desrt, I wouldn't have noticed if you hadn't pinged me ;)
<attente> i'm putting a section in a section, hoping that there would still be a separator inbetween
<attente> heh
<desrt> larsu: oh.  "oops"
<larsu> attente, don't do desrt's second suggestion. I'll notice!
<larsu> :P
<desrt> attente: no.  separators are only inserted between toplevel items
<attente> ok
<attente> desrt: so what's the motivation for having sections within sections if they're not discernable from the usual case?
<larsu> desrt, whatever happened to --with-separators? Much better than explicit separator items
<desrt> attente: merging
<larsu> s/--//
<desrt> larsu: so here's the problem
<desrt> larsu: say i have a gtkmenushell that contains 4 normal menuitems "a", "b", "c", "d"
<desrt> clearly i'd convert that like so:
<desrt> <menu> <section> <a/> <b/> <c/> <d/> </section> </menu>
<larsu> yep
<desrt> now comes some idiot who inserts a GtkSeparatorMenuItem at index 2
<desrt> what the heck do i do?
<desrt> i want to get to <menu> <section> <a/> <b/> </section> <section> <c/> <d/> </section> </menu>
<desrt> but how do i do that?
<larsu> <menu> <section> <a/> <b/> </section> <section> <c/> <d/> </section> </menu>
<larsu> :)
<desrt> drop menu items c and d and add them to a new section?
<desrt> then add that section...
<larsu> drop them from where?
<desrt> the existing section
<desrt> gmenumodel has no operation for "split a section in two"
<larsu> okay you're talking about someone dynamically inserting a separator?
<desrt> ya
<larsu> is there code out there that does this?
<attente> my hope was that it could be simplified by just putting c and d in a section at the same level
<desrt> we have to assume that there is
<desrt> because you have to make a choice
<desrt> either a) you deal with this case (which is miserable)
<desrt> or b) you just completely start from scratch every time a menu changes (which is crappy)
<larsu> c) don't support dynamic changes like that
 * larsu chooses (c)
<desrt> larsu: i'm afraid we'd have to...
<attente> heh, a) doesn't sound that bad though
<desrt> if i were to pick a real (c) it would be more like "deal with dynamic changes in a dynamic way until separators get involved, and then just start over"
<larsu> sure
<desrt> larsu: meh.
<larsu> :D
<desrt> going from semantic to presentational is great
<desrt> now we're going from presentational and deriving guessed semantics
<desrt> i'm allowed to feel uncomfortable about that
<larsu> desrt, of course, but isn't this kind of a band-aid until all apps use GMenuModel?
<desrt> larsu: in practice, this will be forever
<larsu> *sigh*
<desrt> some apps will never ever port to gmenumodel
<desrt> in the same way that some apps will never stop using gtk2 and gconf
<larsu> I guess you're right on this one
<larsu> still, I'd go with your suggested (c) and see how much of an issue it will be in practice
<desrt> attente: if you want to solve the hard problem then by all means... :)
<attente> it doesn't sound that hard... but you're probably seeing something that i'm not
<larsu> is (a) the hard one you're talking about?
<warp10> desrt: oh, was it supposed to be a picture for the team?
<attente> larsu: yes
<desrt> warp10: ya :p
<desrt> warp10: pitti in a viking hat goes well against the backdrop of all the "chuck norris has nothing on martin pitt!" talk
<warp10> desrt: ok, link please: I'm sure pitti will be delighted of it 0:-)
<desrt> http://imgur.com/UkTcn
 * pitti hides
<larsu> pitti, that doesn't fit your nick at all :P
<pitti> I blame the beer
<desrt> attente: U of T?
<ogra_> that should sooo become the product picture on https://launchpad.net/~we-love-pitti
<attente> desrt: now?
<desrt> attente: ish
<attente> sure
<desrt> k.  see you in an hour?
<attente> ok
<pitti> is that a pub?
<desrt> university of toronto
<ogra_> a big pub
<desrt> lots of nice areas for working on hard problems together :)
<warp10> desrt: done
<desrt> warp10: awesome :D
<desrt> nice crop
<desrt> attente: heading out
<warp10> desrt: yeah, despite 64x64 being so small
<pitti> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Raring/view/AutoPkgTest/job/raring-proposed-adt-cairo/lastFailedBuild/ARCH=i386,label=albali/
<pitti> et voila
<pitti> the first packaging error spotted by an autopkgtest from UDS :)
<pitti> jibel: ^ FYI
<pitti> seb128, chrisccoulson : who is the new chromium maintainer these days?
<chrisccoulson> pitti, qengho
<qengho> hi hi
<pitti> hey qengho!
<qengho> pitti: hi.  I'm trying to get it in decent shape.
<seb128> pitti, qengho joined the desktop team around UDS and will maintain chromium and webkit
<pitti> qengho: welcome, and good luck!
<seb128> pitti, be nice to him, he's still new and learning his way around ;-)
<pitti> I just assigned 27 bugs to you!
<pitti> (kidding)
<qengho> pitti: Don't *do* that!
<gema> qengho: hi, quick question for you!
 * gema thanks pitti for pointing her in the right direction x)
<seb128> pitti, speaking of bugs, do you watch bug #1048059? it's quite active
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1048059 in udisks2 (Ubuntu) "Adding ACLs to /media/$user does not work" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1048059
<gema> qengho: we are wondering if there is any chance we could get chromium webdriver packaged somehow to make our testing of webapps better
<gema> and more reliable
<pitti> seb128: I do, but I still have NFC about it
<pitti> seb128: I don't suppose all those reporters are running a custom kernel
<pitti> seb128: I guess at some point I'll just make the ACL call non-fatal
<pitti> but it still worries me why setting the ACL doesn't work
<seb128> pitti, it had some recent comments stating: "My '/' and thus also '/media' are not mounted with ACL support enabled,
<seb128> so that's why it fails to set the ACL (and why the directory it created
<seb128> gets removed again)"
<pitti> right, I saw that too, but that can hardly be the case for all those reporters?
<seb128> I doubt it is indeed...
<seb128> it's one possible case of issue though
<seb128> pitti, anyway if you watch it good, I just noticed it was quite active with user comments
<seb128> pitti, second one I wanted to ask about ... the gnome-session suspend one, do you think you will have time soon or should I steal it from you by midweek if you didn't get to it?
<seb128> pitti, (mid-week because I think I will be busy with GNOME 3.6.2 and blueprint until there, then I can have a look)
<qengho> gema: I do love testing, but my to-do list is pretty full for the near future. I don't want to claim it and let the idea languish.
<pitti> seb128: I had my hands full today with sponsoring, gnome 3.6.2, and mail, but can look at it tomorrow morning
<gema> qengho: alright, no worries, can you put it at the bottom of your list and let me know if/when it gets done?
<gema> qengho: that way we can change our automation whenever you get to it and make it more reliable
<seb128> pitti, no hurry, I will grab it on thursday if you didn't get to it by then ;-)
<seb128> pitti, deal?
<pitti> seb128: *shake hands*
<qengho> gema: I do not know anything about webdriver, but, as far as I can tell, this isn't actually tied to chromium-browser, is it? The same people write it, but the product is separate?
<seb128> pitti, ^5
<seb128> oh
<seb128> pitti, love that
<seb128> "  * debian/control: Add missing libxext-dev dependency to libcairo2-dev.
<seb128>     Spotted by autopkgtest."
<pitti> wow, and libarchive autopkgtest shows bugs on i386
<gema> qengho: my understanding was that it gets built from the same codeline
<pitti> seb128: that's what I meant with what I said 10 mins ago; je l'aime :)
<qengho> Huh.
<gema> qengho: but I will dig into it to make sure that's true
<seb128> pitti, moi aussi !
<gema> qengho: I will let you know in a couple of days, whenever I find out, now that I know who to talk to on the ubuntu side, things are easier :D
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> seb128: we run into errors like that all the time, which is why I was so eager to get lots of those simple ones
<chrisccoulson> qengho, gema, i'm pretty sure that webdriver is an entirely separate project
<qengho> gema: there may be some kind of interprocess communication here.  One part is in browswer (and I should claim that part) and another part is outside (and I'm scared of it so far).
<gema> qengho: so what is your advice?
<qengho> gema: you should look into it, definitely.  I'll peek around the source of chromium-browser and make sure I have turned on everything that should be turned on.
<qengho> gema: meet back here in a few days.
<gema> qengho: ack, thanks, will do
<pitti> j'aime duolingo; "Une deuxiÃ©me biÃ¨re?" -- c'est l'Ã©ducation pratique!
<qengho> "A second beer?"?  Gosh, my FR is rusty.
<qengho> I usually end up ordering butter.
<pitti> oh, "beurre"? :-)
<pitti> bonne nuit tout le monde!
<qengho> laters!
<Sweetshark> ohhh, I made it to computerworlduk.com: http://blogs.computerworlduk.com/simon-says/2012/11/does-rooting-your-phone-void-your-warranty/index.htm
<xnox> Sweetshark: next up you need to get an Apple II and stick the tablet inside it and run firefox.....
<GunnarHj> seb128: Bon soir, Sebastien!
<GunnarHj> Considering that you asked for the SRU of bug 1069886, could you please upload the branch I prepared to quantal-proposed? ;-)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1069886 in mail-notification (Ubuntu Quantal) "mail-notification crashes on SSL connections (patch attached)" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1069886
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey, I'm about to go for some exercice but I will have a look later or tomorrow for sure, thanks for the work!
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok. Happy exercicing!
<seb128> thanks
 * didrocks waves goodbye
<cyphermox> seb128: still around?
<cyphermox> in evolution-indicator, debian/patches/01_no_debug_spamming.patch, it's from you?
<seb128> cyphermox, hey
<seb128> cyphermox, yes, I think so, why?
<cyphermox> just checking, I'm merging the patches into evolution-indicator
<cyphermox> it's tiny though, so no worries
<seb128> cyphermox, ok
<Sweetshark> asac: ping?
<BrainPaid> helloooo
<BrainPaid> JCuber?
<BrainPaid> You don't be go!
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-11-13
<erappleman> jbicha, re your comments on webupdy, does gdm need to be running or just installed?
<jbicha> erappleman: just installed; you can use whatever dm you like but only gdm provides the new lock screen
<erappleman> thanks jbicha
<pitti> Good morning
<BigWhale> pitti, good morning.
<BigWhale> and the rest of the gang
<pitti> hey BigWhale, Ã§a va?
<BigWhale> I am trying to convince myself that I am awake .. :>
<didrocks> good morning
<BigWhale> Morning didrocks :)
<didrocks> hey BigWhale
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti!
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> quite fine, thanks!
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson!
<seb128> hey desktopers
<mlankhorst> g'day!
<pitti> hey seb128!
<seb128> hey mlankhorst didrocks pitti
<seb128> how are you today?
<didrocks> hello mlankhorst, seb128!
<didrocks> fine, thanks, yourself?
<seb128> good
<seb128> waouh, robert_ancell went on an upgrade rampage
<mlankhorst> hehehe :P
<pitti> unfortunately -proposed is stuck right now, but cjwatson is on it
 * mlankhorst needs to give this uploading thing a try
<seb128> pitti, oh, how so?
<pitti> seb128: britney crash
<seb128> hum, k
<pitti> seb128: I mean the migration is stuck
<pitti> I broke it with my cairo upload, it's crashing on a KeyError in libcairo2-dev :)
<seb128> that's what I understood
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> what did you win? ;-)
<pitti> it'll have a lot of fodder once it's back up
 * pitti crosses fingers glib will finish building on armhf
<pitti> FYI, g-i and pygobject are uploaded to experimental, will sync this afternoon when LP imports it
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<Laney> hey
<chrisccoulson> hi Laney
 * Laney is f5ing the nexus 4 page
<Laney> not looking good though ...
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, Laney, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, not too bad thanks
<pitti> hello Laney
<Laney> good good
<pitti> seb128: do you plan to SRU 3.6.2 into quantal? or just selected fixes?
<seb128> pitti, I don't plan to spend much time on quantal, will not SRU the whole GNOME for sure, we can do selected updates where the new version has a fix worth the SRU though
<pitti> ack
<BigWhale> seb128, I've attached a patch for that itsy bitsy brasero bug.
<seb128> BigWhale, thanks, did you try it? does it work for you?
<BigWhale> I'll be testing it in the next couple of days I hope. If someone else won't do it before that.
<BigWhale> On a second thought, I might just try it now ...
<xnox> did llvmpipe fallback go live?
<xnox> the raring daily looks very grey & square =)
<seb128> xnox, likely gtk3-engines-unico's being outdated
<seb128> xnox, the gtk update from monday broke the theme by dropping support for the non multiarch dir and our theme was not multiarched, that was fixed yesterday
<seb128> xnox, that would be my guess anyway
<xnox> seb128: did it propogate to release pocket yet?
<seb128> xnox, yes
<seb128> xnox, is your iso from today or yesterday?
<xnox> gtk3-engines-unico:amd64	1.0.2+r139-0ubuntu3
<xnox> http://cdimages.ubuntu.com/daily-live/20121113/raring-desktop-amd64.manifest
<seb128> xnox, ok, dunno what's the issue there... do you have anything in .xsession-errors?
 * xnox files bug against compiz ;-)
<pitti> seb128: ok, found the power button bug
<pitti> setting up my system to diagnose the bug: 10 minutes; debug: 15 minutes; fix: 30 seconds -- typical
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 10 in Launchpad itself "It says "displaying matching bugs 1 to 8 of 8", but there is 9" [Medium,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/10
<xnox> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/122916810/gray-boxes.png
<seb128> pitti, \o/
<xnox> bug 1078226
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1078226 in compiz (Ubuntu) "fails to load background picture in raring daily" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1078226
<seb128> xnox, oh, it's only the background
<seb128> xnox, it should be nautilus displaying the background ... can you pastebin your .xsession-errors?
<xnox> why did ubuntu-bug hook did not do that?! argh =)
<seb128> xnox, because apport doesn't attach xsession-errors for "privacy" reason afaik
<xnox> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1355181/
<seb128> it does add selected gtk warnings and co matching a builtin regexp, but that's often filtering out the useful infos
<xnox> but it did ask me "do you want to attach private logs?"
<xnox> =(
<seb128> xnox, is nautilus running?
<xnox> attached xsession-errors to the bug as well.
<xnox> seb128: yes there is "nautilus -n" process.
<seb128> xnox, does nautilus --quit && nautilus change anything to your background? what about selecting a wallpaper in the system settings?
<seb128> can you right click on the desktop and get a menu?
<xnox> did we not meant to not start nautilus this cycle to save on resources? =P
<seb128> xnox, not that I know about, we sort of like being able to have icons on your background
<xnox> "the background flashes black and returns to grey boxes state & a new nautilus home folder window is opened"
<xnox> that's the nautilus cycle.
<xnox> there is right click menu.
<seb128> ok
<seb128> what about changing the wallpaper in system settings?
<xnox> right click menu -> "change background" corrupted the session and threw me across ttys and then landed in lightdm login which was purple for a moment and then became grey boxes.
<xnox> hmmm..... not compiz then? since lightdm is not running compiz.
<xnox> graphics?
<seb128> xnox, seems like rather a cairo/gtk/xorg/video driver issue to me yes
<chrisccoulson> for people who are using autopkgtest in their packages, is anyone using it to run upstream tests?
<pitti> o/
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I run some upstream tests in coreutils, and all of them in apport
<pitti> libarchive also runs some, AFAIR
<xnox> chrisccoulson: yes. package guilt. Had to patch the test-suite to use data files from the source package, while testing the system installed binary.
<chrisccoulson> pitti, thanks. i think i'm going to do the same with firefox too, rather than running them in the build (where all we do currently is just write the output to the build log)
<xnox> chrisccoulson: autopkgtest is better because it runs on the $raring kernel.
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, if failed ffox tests don't fail the build, then that might make more sense
<pitti> chrisccoulson: both are useful, though
<pitti> chrisccoulson: does it take that long?
<chrisccoulson> pitti, yeah, we don't fail the build because there are some tests which fail (or are intermittent) for us, but not upstream
<chrisccoulson> but if i package the test suite and add my own test scripts to run it, it will be easier to mark known test failures without resorting to patches all over the source tree
<chrisccoulson> pitti, the whole test suite is ~1.5 hours
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so with moving them to adt it's harder to get immediate results from e. g. PPA or local builds
<pitti> (just pointing out)
<xnox> sounds like you want a regular jenkins job, as adt runs the testsuite script from within the source package, unless you upload that separately to firefox....
<pitti> you can have a separate firefox-tests package and make that depend (or test-depend) on firefox
<pitti> question is, is it worth it
<xnox> hmmm... so ubiquity slideshow (webkit) displays pictures fine, yet the world-map & background are grey boxes.
<Sweetshark> am I allowed to set bug 1064962 as verification-done as per the various comments?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1064962 in indicator-appmenu (Ubuntu Quantal) "[SRU] Global menubar items do not work when opening a document directly from nautilus with no LibreOffice instance running" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1064962
<seb128> xnox, you are sure your issue is a gtk one? did you try downgrading it?
<xnox> seb128: I am on to hacking on the installer =) the daily iso is my test-bed =/
<xnox> seb128: what shall I downgrade it to? quantal or something in-between.
<seb128> xnox, right, I'm just wondering if you did reassign the but to gtk because you determined it's the faulty component or if you took a guess at it
<seb128> but->bug
<xnox> not confirmed, so not determined =)
<xnox> it's just that the webkit pictures work, yet normal pixbufs don't.
<seb128> ok, I will try to download the daily iso and see if I can reproduce, figure what is wrong
<xnox> i can tell you that it propagates to the installed VM as well.
<xnox> note that I am running raring on my host & ubuntu in the guest, it could be that kvm graphics are borked in guest and/or host combos in raring =/ (had that last cycle once)
<chrisccoulson> w00t https://blog.mozilla.org/research/2012/11/12/introducing-the-shumway-open-swf-runtime-project/
<Sweetshark> jibel: hunting down random people because they can SRU-verify: could you verify bug 1064962?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1064962 in indicator-appmenu (Ubuntu Quantal) "[SRU] Global menubar items do not work when opening a document directly from nautilus with no LibreOffice instance running" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1064962
<xclaesse> seb128, is there a known bug that makes all app menu entries in unity to be labeled "JustifiÃ©" ?
<xclaesse> must be an issue with the macos-like menus in unity
<xnox> chrisccoulson: interesting. maybe this one will have enough money and devs to keep going.
<seb128> xclaesse, no, what do you mean? the menus is full of "justifiÃ©" labels?
<xclaesse> seb128, yep
<seb128> didrocks, ^ did you see something like that before?
<seb128> xclaesse, it happens on any app?
<xclaesse> seb128, no just one, a python gtk app that I'm running from source tree
<xclaesse> when running in gnome-shell the menu is correct
<seb128> interesting
<didrocks> never saw that one
<seb128> xclaesse, can you share the app/test case?
<seb128> larsu or charles would be the right guys to ping
<seb128> xclaesse, if you want to open a bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/dbusmenu/+filebug
<xclaesse> seb128, I'm not sure I can share the code, it's a small collabora company tool :/
<xclaesse> but I'll see if I can make a test case later :)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> xclaesse, you can run it with UBUNTU_MENUPROXY= to workaround the issue
<seb128> xclaesse, e.g UBUNTU_MENUPROXY= ./script
<seb128> should give you local menus
<xclaesse> seb128, that fix the problem indeed, thx
<seb128> yw
<didrocks> seb128: meeting report reminder btw :p
<seb128> didrocks, oh, right, thanks
<didrocks> yw :)
<attente> seb128: when/where is the meeting taking place?
<seb128> attente, oh sorry, forgot we have new members, on this channel at 4:30pm utc (e.g in 3.5 hours)
<seb128> attente, hey btw, how are you? ;-)
<attente> seb128: i'm well :) how are you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, hi
<seb128> hey ricotz
<ricotz> a small packaging question ;)
<ricotz> is there a suggested way for *optional* build-deps in debian/control
<ricotz> it is kind of achievable with "optional-build-dep-1.0 | always-available-dummy-package"
<ricotz> better "optional-build-dep-1.0 (>= specific-version) | always-available-dummy-package"
<jibel> Sweetshark, I'll do, I'll have to install a machine with quantal first.
<Laney> ricotz: no
<seb128> ricotz, what are you trying to do?
<ricotz> Laney, do you know a perfered way to do it?
<xnox> ricotz: you can regenerate control from control.in (many packages have that)
<Sweetshark> jibel: k, awesome. thanks. note that bug 1075263 is a different beast please.
<Laney> change the BDs :-)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1075263 in indicator-appmenu (Ubuntu) "Items of a menubar built from GMenu do not always work" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1075263
<ricotz> i want a generic packaging working on various ubuntu releases and the source itself conditionally enables features depending on the presence of the build-dep
<ricotz> seb128, ^
<xnox> ricotz: then at source package build time you can be sensitive.
<xnox> ricotz: do not ever do this for anything that goes into the archive.
<jibel> Sweetshark, ok, noted
<xnox> the builds must be predictable even in the "dirty environment"
<Laney> you can do that kind of thing with VCS branches
<Laney> just merge, build source package, upload
<xnox> the most horid thing is "auto-detecting openssl" and linking gpl code against it, making the resulting binary non-redistributable.... =/
<seb128> ricotz, Laney: you can do rules control.in->control through sed hackery
<xnox> ricotz: in a simple case, you can do $old-package | $ new-package
<seb128> but it's not really recommended
<xnox> if a said build-dependency has been renamed, for example
<xnox> Build-dep: git-core | git
<Laney> it's a bit grim
<Laney> I think letting your VCS take care of it is alright; for BDs you have to build a new source package anyway
<xnox> that's fine. but don't enable/disable compile/build-time options depending on the presence of packages, because  the environment can be dirty.
<ricotz> alright, the control.in generation depending on the release defined in debian/changelog should work
<xnox> ricotz: if you have time to implement it properly =)
 * xnox likes VCS for such things.
<seb128> ricotz, what feature do you want to enable on different series?
<ricotz> the package alternative in control seemed pretty easy though
<ricotz> seb128, i am force to "disable" a feature provided by dbusmenu-gtk3
<seb128> why?
<ricotz> which doesnt provide proper bindings for vala before 0.6.2
<seb128> oh
<ricotz> thanks all
<ricotz> btw any brave virtualbox users here?
<mdeslaur> Am I the only one not able to use empathy with google talk for the past couple of days?
<seb128> mdeslaur, define google talk? voice calls or jabber iming?
<mdeslaur> seb128: jabber im
<mdeslaur> I was using a jabber account, and even adding a proper google account, it won't connect
<seb128> mdeslaur, I'm using a jabber.org account which works fine
<mdeslaur> so you're not using a gmail account then
<mdeslaur> ok, back to pidgin for now
<seb128> mdeslaur, gmail works fine, just added my gmail.com account to test
<seb128> mdeslaur, that's on raring
<mdeslaur> weird
<mdeslaur> not sure why mine doesn't work anymore
<mdeslaur> seb128: thanks for testing
<seb128> mdeslaur, yw
<seb128> mdeslaur, did you have any error in .xsession-errors?
<seb128> or if you run telepathy-gabble manually
<mpt> notgary, hi. For Ubuntu Software Center bugs, we track them only in the package, not the project (as shown in <https://bugs.launchpad.net/software-center>).
<larsu> mdeslaur, it works fine for me (and has the last days and weeks). Sometimes I have to go into online-accounts and login to google again
<larsu> most of the time the session menu icon is red when that needs to be done
<mpt> notgary, that it was possible for you to add them to the project is bug 333215, and the general confusion between projects and packages is bug 76416.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 333215 in Launchpad itself "Launchpad permits tasks to be added to projects that 'do not use launchpad for bug tracking'" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/333215
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 76416 in Launchpad itself "Poor handling of a distribution being its own upstream for a package" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/76416
<mdeslaur> seb128: what's telepathy-gabble supposed to do? I launch it and it exits right away
<seb128> mdeslaur, it's the jabber provider for telepathy
<seb128> mdeslaur, you probably have one running already
<seb128> ?
<mdeslaur> it gets spawned, then dies, then get spawned again, then dies
<mdeslaur> and I get this on the empathy console:
<mdeslaur> (empathy:8884): tp-glib-CRITICAL **: tp_asv_get_uint32: assertion `asv != NULL' failed
<mdeslaur> (empathy:8884): tp-glib-CRITICAL **: tp_asv_get_boxed: assertion `asv != NULL' failed
<mdeslaur> seb128: oh crud, never mind, my HDD is dying
<seb128> :-(
 * mdeslaur prays that SSD gets delivered today
<cyphermox> mdeslaur: oh wow.
<mdeslaur> cyphermox: I like how useless SMART data is :P
<cyphermox> hehe
 * mdeslaur puts milk and cookies outside for purolator guy
<seb128> Laney, http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/rhythmbox.git/commit/?id=d9166ef4239bb2b0e95253aef8b0ec422e28c8e6 ... fun
<seb128> "Temporarly disable webkit support... to prevent mixed gst-0.10 and gst-1.0 linkage in the same process."
<seb128> (confirmation it's going to be an issue as we suspected)
<seb128> Laney, btw how is the migration going? you want to get every ported/ready before uploading?
<desrt> Laney: btw: make works nicely
<seb128> xnox, I can't confirm your background issue using today's daily in virtualbox on raring
<xnox> seb128: interesting. so kernel or kvm bug then....
<Laney> seb128: heh
<Laney> seb128: yeah, for main/universe simplicity and for that 0.10/1.0 reason
<Laney> desrt: merci
<seb128> Laney, ok, makes sense I guess
<seb128> xnox, ok, I can confirm in kvm ... doesn't happen in virtualbox though, "interestingÃ©"
<seb128> -Ã©
<qengho> Meeting?
<seb128> Sweetshark, qengho, chrisccoulson, didrocks, Laney, kenvandine, mlankhorst, cyphermox, mterry, robru, attente: hey, it's meeting time
<robru> hey seb128
<chrisccoulson> w00t
 * mterry waves
<mlankhorst> yay
<kenvandine> hey
<cyphermox> o/
<seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-11-13
<attente> hello
<didrocks> hey
<seb128> if you didn't write anything on the wiki yet please considering doing so ;-)
<seb128> does everyone has their blueprints registered correctly
<seb128> they should show on http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-raring/canonical-desktop-team.html
<qengho> My wiki save got HTTP 500.  Fun.
<seb128> :-(
<robru> seb128, yeah, not loading for me
<robru> seb128, suffice it to say kenvandine and I are doing the webapps inlining. I'm just sick as a dog so I'm going to start it tomorrow.
<chrisccoulson> seb128, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-thunderbird-enhancements didn't show earlier
<mlankhorst> yeah dead
<chrisccoulson> i wonder if i should rename that blueprint ;)
<chrisccoulson> it keeps getting recycled and is less focused on thunderbird now
<seb128> robru, oh, get some rest and get better then!
<seb128> ok, we said we would have a quick meeting
<robru> seb128, ken talked me into staying up just for the meeting ;-) going for a nap as soon as this is over ;-)
<qengho> robru: If you die, you're fired.
<seb128> let's try going through the team and everyone can drop a line on what they are working on, mention any concern or bug etc as well
<robru> qengho, LOL
<seb128> using the order from my ping list (which was the order of the launchpad team names)
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey ... quick "what you are working on, concerns, bugs, comments, etc"
<seb128> you can mention blueprints on your lists and the ones that might be missing
<chrisccoulson> is Sweetshark sleeping?
<chrisccoulson> WAKE UP!
<chrisccoulson> :)
<seb128> no Sweetshark, ok, let's move on
<seb128> qengho, hey
<qengho> chad#1) should we follow debian and rename chromium-browser to chromium?
<kenvandine> we still have a package name conflict there right?
<kenvandine> i guess not :)
<qengho> There's some virtual package.  I haven't looked around much.
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/chromium
<qengho> It may conflict in earlier, L, N,...
<kenvandine> i would be in favor, if we can
<seb128> it was a package back in hardy
<seb128> so yeah, renaming seems fine to me
<chrisccoulson> is there any actual benefit to renaming?
<Laney> seems sensible
<Laney> chromium is a better name than chromium-browser
<kenvandine> current name isn't obvious
<seb128> chrisccoulson, less confusion for users?
<seb128> on the name
<chrisccoulson> if you do rename, you'll be maintaining 2 source packages for 5 years (and having 2 source tarballs etc)
<chrisccoulson> i'm just wondering if it's actually worth it ;)
<seb128> we we have the same packaging used cross series atm?
<qengho> Other than that, I have nothing worth complaining about.  Chromium source moves fast!  Two breaking changes in automatic PPA build so far.
<seb128> do we*
<Laney> the source package name stays the same
<chrisccoulson> seb128, would we rename it in precise too?
<Laney> its just binaries
<seb128> chrisccoulson, no
<Laney> chromium-browser becomes transitional to chromium
<seb128> let's sort that after the meeting, chrisccoulson's comment is a good one based on the firefox experience where the vcs is the same accross distro series (not sure if chromium is in the same case)
<seb128> qengho, thanks
<seb128> qengho, anything else you wanted to mention?
<qengho> No.  /end
<seb128> when people are done please drop a comment saying "that's all"
<seb128> or something similar ;-)
<seb128> qengho, thanks
<robru> g'night ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey
<chrisccoulson> hi :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I've access the tb blueprint, that should be enough to have it showing on the tracker
<seb128> the series goal
<seb128> chrisccoulson, so ... anything worth mentioning from your side? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> so, i'm currently packaging the upstream firefox test suite at the moment, and writing a shim so that we can have test results appear on https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Raring/view/AutoPkgTest/
<seb128> oh, nice, will make pitti happy ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i've also basically killed off the lightning extension source package
<chrisccoulson> (we're going to be building it from thunderbird uploads, to save me time)
<ricotz> seb128, will gstreamer 1.1/1.2 be abi/api compatible with 1.0.2?
<seb128> ricotz, yes
<ricotz> ok, so upstream confirmed this
<chrisccoulson> that's it from me :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks
<seb128> didrocks, hey ;-) your turn
<xnox> chrisccoulson: i wish for enigmail uploads @ same-upload time as thunderbird
<xnox> to me the later update is useless without the former.
<didrocks> hey, so we are in good track in term of autolanding things automatically
 * ricotz will be quite now ;)
<chrisccoulson> xnox, yeah, that's not going to happen any time soon ;)
 * xnox ok....
<didrocks> a lot of IS/PS/jenkins/launchpad/bzr issues that are on track to get fixed/workarounded
<didrocks> I'm checking the details with the subteam :)
<didrocks> an other news, unity quantal/raring uploaded
<didrocks> and we'll soon switch to gcc 4.7 for raring
<didrocks> that's it
<seb128> I've been watching the progresses a bit, you guys seem well organized and on track, looking forward seeing stuff landing regularly in a smooth way ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<seb128> Laney, hey ;-)
<Laney> hey
<Laney> so i've been mainly working on gstreamer 1 stuff which is mostly landing in here https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/gstreamer1.0/
<Laney> other than that a make-dfsg sru into precise for desrt
<Laney> so if your builds there randomly start failing then ...
<Laney> also some work on the transition tracker to support -proposed
<Laney> FIN
<seb128> great
<seb128> do you need help on the gst1.0 transition ?
<seb128> is there any blocker/hard problem atm?
<Laney> if you want to poke rb upstream to find out how that's going
<seb128> I guess the main issue will be the gst1/webkit/gst0.10 one
<seb128> ok, I can do that
<Laney> yeah haven't got there yet :-)
<seb128> ok
<Laney> also I'm not sure what the deal with gnome-media is
<Laney> will look into it
<seb128> the sound recorder shouldn't be an issue
<seb128> the libgnome-media-profile situation is a bit undetermined though, but that's linked to rb
<seb128> will check for it as well
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<kenvandine> started working towards moving packaging inline for webapps/webaccounts
<kenvandine> i prepared an example and robru is going to go through them as an introduction to the set of packages
<seb128> good idea
<kenvandine> i have a few SRUs to land today
<kenvandine> didrocks, any status on my MIR?
<didrocks> kenvandine: well, days have only 24h, still on my TODO list :)
<kenvandine> just checking :)
<kenvandine> That's all folks!
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<seb128> mlankhorst, hey
<seb128> mlankhorst, joining our meeting or rather the evening one with the other xorg guys? ;-)
<mlankhorst> nothing to say much for me?
<seb128> mlankhorst, ok, that works for me, let's keep moving then ;-)
<seb128> cyphermox, hey
<cyphermox> hey hey!
<cyphermox> so I've started work on the indicator stack; so far indicator-messages is ready for review by didrocks, and indicator-sound to follow shortly
 * didrocks is reviewing right now
<cyphermox> evolution-indicator was pretty much ready for upload as well, but to do it cleanly I want to wait in case our contributor's patch can be  merged in today or tomorrow
<kenvandine> yay!
<seb128> ok
<seb128> will make some people happy to get that back
<cyphermox> also preparing an upload for the NM stack hopefully today, and some SRUs for ModemManager
<cyphermox> yup yup
<seb128> then we need pidgin-libmessaging and users will be happy again ;-)
<cyphermox> so far I've been running evo-indicator and it work well
<cyphermox> that's all for me
<seb128> nice
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks
<seb128> mterry, hye
<seb128> hey
<mterry> I've mostly just been working on unity+friends' packaging.  Been failing to reproduce the gvfs-dav memory leak...  And some deja-dup dep8 work/bug investigation.  That's all.
<seb128> efficient, I like it ;-)
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<mterry> :)
<seb128> robru, hey
<attente> he may have gone to sleep already..
<mterry> I think he said g'night above
<seb128> mterry, I was unsure if that was a joke reply to my "add a "that's all", or similar, when done"
<seb128> but he might yeah, kenvandine did a summary for him in some sort
<seb128> attente, hey ;-)
<attente> ooo my turn :)
<seb128> indeed!
<attente> still working on the unity-gtk-module
<attente> it's.. needing a lot of work...
<seb128> yeah, I expect it's going to take a while
<seb128> are you blocked on anything? I guess desrt is helping you?
<attente> i'm not blocked on anything
<seb128> ok, good
<attente> if there's something higher priority you want me to look at, i can try
<seb128> ("helping" = "available for questions")
<attente> but other than that, that's it for me
<seb128> attente, not atm, I will probably come with a few gtk+ bugs (and try to get easier ones) for you to pick in when you feel like doing something different so you have enough to alternate and not always work on the same thing
<seb128> attente, btw feel free to triage a bit https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gtk%2B3.0/+bugs
<attente> great, thanks
<attente> ok
<seb128> or go through the bug and upstream those you think that would be good upstream (check if they are already reported)
<seb128> attente, thanks
<seb128> attente, btw new gtk in raring includes the fileselectors fixes based on your work, well done ;-)
<seb128> ok
<attente> \o/
<seb128> so remaining, me :p
<seb128> I've been working on GNOME 3.6.2 updates, some merging on debian
<seb128> spent a full day doing sponsoring, please help as well on that
<seb128> and been looking to blueprints as well
<seb128> that's it
<seb128> just on time for an half an hour meeting
<seb128>  
<seb128> how did everyone find it? good to have a quick catchup like that?
<seb128> comments? questions?
 * Sweetshark bumbles in.
<mterry> A little long, after being so used to 1 min meetings  :)
<kenvandine> nothing from me
<kenvandine> indeed
<didrocks> yep :)
<attente> 1 min meetings?
<Sweetshark> sorry, picking up packets at the postal service took longer than expected.
<seb128> attente, we tried a cycle the "does anyone has anything to say"
<seb128> attente, and the meeting turned to a minute silence
<attente> haha
<seb128> followed by a "thanks everyone, see you next week" ;-)
<mterry> If we liked the shorter meetings, I suppose these more personal check-ins could be done in wiki too (in a "more verbose" section?)
<seb128> mterry, well, I just set up the format so people were typing the status update
<seb128> I guess with ready to paste status it should take some 15 min
<seb128> let's see next week
<Sweetshark> seb128: I working on: upstreaming sessioninstaller integration, upstreaming unitymenus, SRU bug 1017125, SRU bug 1064962
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1017125 in boost1.49 (Ubuntu Quantal) "[SRU quantal] boost::unordered_multimap<>::erase(iterator, iterator) broken in boost1.49" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1017125
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1064962 in indicator-appmenu (Ubuntu Quantal) "[SRU] Global menubar items do not work when opening a document directly from nautilus with no LibreOffice instance running" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1064962
<Laney> here's the weird gnome-media bug: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=679381
<Laney> so i'm not sure what's going on with that module
<ubot2> Gnome bug 679381 in Gnome-Sound-Recorder "port gsrecorder to gstreame-1.0" [Normal,Resolved: wontfix]
<seb128> Sweetshark, great, looking forward seeing the sessioninstaller bugs closed ;-)
<seb128> Laney, it's a bit unmaintained, there is only the sound recorder in there nowadays
<seb128> ok, need to run
<Laney> yeah
<seb128> be back in an hours
<seb128> thanks everyone
<kenvandine> ok
 * kenvandine waves
<Laney> do we need a sound recorder by default? ;-)
 * Laney runs
<didrocks> Laney: I won't ever be able to live without one by default!
<didrocks> Laney: because I CAN! :)
<Laney> I hear https://www.archlinux.org/ is a cool distro
<Sweetshark> Laney: thats a slippery slide. It ends in "can we kick libreoffice from the default install". I have seen it a million times ;)
<Laney> oh yeah, speaking of cruft :P
<didrocks> Sweetshark: talking about itâ¦ :p
 * Sweetshark slowly grabs for the cattlepod he always has ready for these cases ...
<Sweetshark> s/cattlepod/cattle prod/
<xnox> to be honest: py2uno, hplip, duplicity, dejadup and rdeps might be kicked out as they are all written in python2
 * Laney rewrites xnox in mips assembler
 * xnox JSON parse error "Laney: please use correct javascript syntax"
<micahg> xnox: maybe there could be a postinstall trigger for the remaining python2 stuff temporarily
<xnox> micahg: hm? what do you mean?
<micahg> xnox: you know how the installer downloads updates?  maybe it could download and install those apps as well
<xnox> micahg: that is not the point of the excercise. we are not constrained by the cd size, we actually want to port stuff to python3, not just drop it / re-download it.
<micahg> xnox: I said nothing about CD size :)
<xnox> micahg: plus existing users will simply upgrade and will get to keep python2 bits as they already do.
<xnox> micahg: I was thinking to kick stuff of the CD to shake things up. E.g. to have upstreams wake up to the python3.
<micahg> xnox: well, for duplicity and deja-dup, poke mterry and for hplip, tkampetter
<didrocks> ok gents, see you tomorrow!
<xnox> micahg: the problems are not with those packages, but with their dependencies. E.g. hplib problems are in => python-reportlab
<xnox> and similar with duplicity (the backend providers)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Hi Seb, you didn't forget bug 1069886, did you? ;-)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1069886 in mail-notification (Ubuntu Quantal) "mail-notification crashes on SSL connections (patch attached)" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1069886
<mdeslaur> kenvandine: hey, could you please find someone to test bug 967604 so it can get published? I have a security update to do and want to wait for that to go out first...
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 967604 in unity-firefox-extension (Ubuntu) "Extension does not support moving tabs between windows (activity tracking degenerates)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/967604
<seb128> GunnarHj, oh, did forgot, thanks for the reminder
<GunnarHj> seb128: No problem. :)
<cyphermox> mterry: poke
<mterry> cyphermox, hello!
<cyphermox> mterry: seb128 mentioned you managed to keep history for the packaging you merged for unity, what process did you use?
<mterry> cyphermox, I found the packaging branch, merged it into trunk, and reverted anything outside of debian/
<cyphermox> ah, yeah
<cyphermox> so that's what I thought
<GunnarHj> charles: Hi Charles!
<GunnarHj> charles: Your input to the discussion at https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=687945 would probably be helpful - provided that you are in favour of the proposed change, of course. ;-)
<ubot2> Gnome bug 687945 in i18n "Display names of days and months using the current language" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<popey> mdeslaur, kenvandine verification-done on bug 967604
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 967604 in unity-firefox-extension (Ubuntu) "Extension does not support moving tabs between windows (activity tracking degenerates)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/967604
<mdeslaur> popey: awesome, thanks! thanks kenvandine
<seb128> GunnarHj, uploaded
<GunnarHj> seb128: Thanks! See that it's stuck in that horribly long upload queue. Do you possibly have permission to approve it?
<kenvandine> popey, thx
<seb128> GunnarHj, no I don't and the delay is not that long, it usually 1.5 week I would say
<seb128> GunnarHj, there has been some backlog due to UDS but the SRU team is catching back
<GunnarHj> seb128: I see.
<seb128> GunnarHj, if you want it in you can still try to ping the SRU people on #ubuntu-devel, e.g bdmurray ScottK slangasek SpamapS infinity
<seb128> GunnarHj, well that's if you think it's an easy and import one and that it might be worth trying to "hijack the queue"
<GunnarHj> seb128: Not sure that my stuff (this one + im-switch) is more important than the rest. So I'll try to be patient. :)
<ricotz> i hope switching to vala-0.18 as default in raring would be reasonable with updating to 0.18.1 which is out soon
<GunnarHj> seb128: Is this build failure something that requires any kind of action? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mail-notification/5.4.dfsg.1-6ubuntu5/+build/3970420
<seb128> GunnarHj, no, it just needs a retry once evolution is built
<GunnarHj> seb128: Does it happen automatically?
<seb128> usually not, but you can count on somebody to retry it soon
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, thanks.
<jasoncwarner_> morning everyone
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: RAOF bryceh and TheMuso https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-11-13
<robert_ancell> morning
<RAOF> Good morning!
<jasoncwarner_> morning robert_ancell and RAOF
 * bryceh waves
<jasoncwarner_> hey bryceh
<jasoncwarner_> btw...anyone still have blueprints in need of approval? or is all set?
<mlankhorst> morning
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, I posted my 3 this morning
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, or I should say the three you asked about.
<mlankhorst> bryceh: oh time to approve https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-r-xorg-lts-updates ?
<jasoncwarner_> thanks, bryceh I saw and I assigned the one to duflu
<bryceh> great
<desrt> morning, aussies
<bryceh> mlankhorst, heh I'm the approver yet don't appear able to push the approve button
<desrt> (and kiwis)
<jasoncwarner_> morning desrt
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh mlankhorst I'll look...
<bryceh> thanks
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: Hm, I've got https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-r-hybrid-graphics-user-experience
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF looking
<attente> desrt: are we allowed to be watching for "insert" signals on GtkMenuShells? that api only exists after 3.2
<desrt> attente: yup.  i added it for exactly that reason.
<desrt> i knew that one day we would hire you and that it would make your life easier if that signal existed
<attente> lol...
<desrt> i'm a good friend
<attente> thanks :)
<mlankhorst> bryceh: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-r-hybrid-graphics very few points left, but should probably be approved though
<desrt> in all seriousness, though.. that signal doesn't exist in gtk2
<attente> yeah, isn't that bad?
<desrt> which is going to be your biggest barrier to backporting your work to gtk2 (which you should definitely do eventually)
<desrt> we can add the signal there too, though
<desrt> either upstream or by way of vendorpatch (or likely, both)
<attente> ok
<bryceh> mlankhorst, who will be assignee for that one?
<mlankhorst> probably me since I was involved anyway
<bryceh> ok
<mlankhorst> or you could copy the points to xorg general, either is fine
<bryceh> set definition to Approved.  Looks like jasoncwarner_ will need to flip the Direction to Approved
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, Priority for this should be medium or maybe low
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: approved and prioritized
<mlankhorst> bryceh: fwiw I did submit most patches I had so far, didn't get much feedback though on them yet
<TheMuso> Morning folks.
<bryceh> hi TheMuso
<mlankhorst> also good night, bedtime :)
<jasoncwarner_> night mlankhorst
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-11-14
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, are we getting pulse 3.0 for raring?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: If it doesn't majorly break the world, very likely.
<TheMuso> But we need to get a new dep for it into main first.
<TheMuso> And it hasn't even been packaged for Ubuntu/Debian yet, so that is ongoing.
<TheMuso> ...and its not even at the final release either.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, ok, thanks. Just making sure if we should be tracking 2.99 or not
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, btw my audio stopped working in raring - should I expect that / any debugging tips?
<TheMuso> GIven the dep needs packaging, I'd say not at the moment.
<TheMuso> Ok, stopped working can mean many things. Is your card still showing up in sound prefs? What happens if you change profiles?
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, no audio card shown in preferences / volume disabled
<TheMuso> Oh ok, what about if you run "aplay -l" in a terminal, do you get anything?
<TheMuso> i.e do you get anything about your card?
<robert_ancell> yes - http://paste.ubuntu.com/1357022/
<TheMuso> Oh BTW re poppler, that didn't introduce another soname change did it?
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, no, it's a stable update. We're not tracking unstable this cycle
<TheMuso> Ok, do you see any processes other than pulseaudio when you run sudo fuser -v /dev/snd/*
<TheMuso> Ok cool.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, no output
<TheMuso> Hrmmm.
<TheMuso> Ok the next step is to get a log from PulseAudio and see what is going on when it tries to work with alsa: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PulseAudio/Log has the instructions.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, I noticed that pulse is not running, and when I tried to run it manually it gave an error
<robert_ancell> "E: [pulseaudio] module.c: Failed to open module "module-esound-protocol-unix": file not found"
<TheMuso> Ok, do you have pulseaudio-esound-compat installed?
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, no, installing now
<TheMuso> Hrm Ok.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, yay, sound back! thanks
<robert_ancell> guessing it was something in the dist-upgrade that dropped it?
<TheMuso> Yeah, thats a work-around. Seems we need to add a conditional bit around the code in teh conf file that loads that module.
<TheMuso> Please file a bug against pulse, explaining the issue, and assign me to it, thanks.
<TheMuso> I will get to it after pilot duties.
<TheMuso> Or actually...
<TheMuso> Thats odd.
<TheMuso> It works for me fine here, and I didn't have the package installed.
<TheMuso> The conditional code in question is present.
<TheMuso> I wonder if something has screwed with your /etc/pulseaudio/* files somewhere, or whether you have...
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: DId you upgrade to raring from quantal?
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, yes
<TheMuso> Hrm ok, file a bug anyway, and leave it with me.
<robert_ancell> ok
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, oh, I think I know the cause. I had pulseaudio-esound-compat:i386 installed but not the i686 version. So it might be not be multi-arch safe
<TheMuso> There is actually talk upstream about dropping esound support altogether.
<TheMuso> Ohhhhhhh!
<micahg> huh? i386 is i686...
<TheMuso> I was just thinking the same thing.
<TheMuso> SO pulseaudio-esound-compat needs some multi-arch love.
<TheMuso> Ok, will take care of it after pilot duties.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, bug 1078543, thanks for the help
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1078543 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "Pulse audio failed to start; no audio present in raring" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1078543
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: No problem, thanks for the bug.
<LLStarks> anyone else noticing this phenomena with theming as of late?
<LLStarks> http://i.imgur.com/4Yij2.png
<pitti> good morning
<TheMuso> Morning pitti .
<pitti> hey TheMuso
<pitti> TheMuso: FYI, uploading a new d-conf with XS-Testsuite: autopkgtest
<TheMuso> pitti: Oh thanks, missed that.
<pitti> no worries, just saying to spread awareness
<pitti> looking forward to another green (hopefully) bullet :)
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti :)
<RAOF> didrocks: Good morning!
<RAOF> didrocks: I'd like to upload nux to fix a nexus 7 bug; is there anything I need to do to not step on your toes?
<didrocks> RAOF: no, please do :)
<didrocks> RAOF: if you can propose a MR as well againt lp:nux, that would be awesome (with the packaging change as well)
<didrocks> this is for https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1065638 I guess?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1065638 in ubuntu-nexus7 "Unity panels don't display visuals" [Critical,Confirmed]
<RAOF> Indeed.
<TheMuso> DO we have dailies for raring yet on the Nexus7?
<RAOF> Jay's working on a more proper fix, but I can easily avoid the problem we have and unblock the dailies.
<didrocks> RAOF: yeah, fine with that ;) ping me with the upstream MR. Was it reviewed upstream already?
<RAOF> didrocks: No; there's no upstream MR. I was planning to distro-patch?
<didrocks> RAOF: can we avoid that and push that upstream? Otherwise, I'll loose it at the next daily-build
<didrocks> RAOF: so having a MR upstream, approved
<didrocks> then bzr merge in the branch
<toabctl> Laney, can you merge https://code.launchpad.net/~toabctl/cheese/ubuntu/+merge/134256, please?
<Laney> toabctl: that was already uploaded - https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cheese/3.6.2-0ubuntu1
<toabctl> Laney, hm. I branched lp:~ubuntu-desktop/cheese/ubuntu and there was no upload mentioned
<toabctl> Laney, and followed the guide here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Bzr
<Laney> jbicha apparently didn't commit
<jibel> Sweetshark, so, I verified bug 1064962, globally it's an improvement and I haven"t found any obvious regression but it reveals another bug
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1064962 in indicator-appmenu (Ubuntu Quantal) "[SRU] Global menubar items do not work when opening a document directly from nautilus with no LibreOffice instance running" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1064962
<Laney> you should check the archive first just in case
<Laney> and ping him later to push his work up
<jibel> Sweetshark, the menu that is displayed when you open a document is the one from the previous LO application used.
<toabctl> Laney, shouldn't be possible to upload a package if the changes are not commited to the VCS
<toabctl> Laney, in case a VCS is used to manage the packaging stuff
<toabctl> that's not the first time I did duplicate work. that doesn't motivate.
<jibel> Sweetshark, eg open a spreadsheet, close it, open an odt or odp, the menu displayed is from localc
<jibel> Sweetshark, there is a workaround: open the document from LO not nautilus
<Laney> toabctl: well I'm afraid that the archive always takes priority; any VCS is just a convention (same in Debian too). I'm not the one who did the work here - speak to jbicha about it and hopefully he won't forget again.
<Sweetshark> jibel: yes, that seems to be the 'lets cache the menu in app-indicator' issue
<jibel> Sweetshark, overall, it's better than no menu, I'm marking as v-done
<Sweetshark> jibel: thanks
<toabctl> Laney, ok. thanks for the information!
<seb128> jibel, does the issue happen if you wait a bit before closing the calc document and opening the odt?
<AlanBell> hi bryceh, can we talk some time about how steam users should be supported on IRC in #ubuntu
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<Sweetshark> seb128: can we sync http://packages.debian.org/source/experimental/clucene-core to raring -- we will desperately need it for LO anyway, better to get it in early in the cycle?
<jibel> seb128, it doesn't. It's maybe another symptom of 1075263
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
<seb128> jibel, likely yes, we will backport the fix soon
<Sweetshark> seb128: see also http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=661703
<ubot2> Debian bug 661703 in clucene-core "clucene-core: upload latest clucene git + contrib-libs to experimental" [Normal,Fixed]
<seb128> Sweetshark, we can sync, if we do we need to rebuild the rdepends ... can you check that they all need a simple rebuild or if they need fixing?
<seb128> Sweetshark, the new archive scripts will not get the lib out of proposed until the rdepends are dealt with and we don't want to let stuff sit in proposed so we should be ready to do the transition when we sync it
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, not too bad thanks. how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks
<Sweetshark> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/clucene-core/+bug/1042192 meh
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1042192 in clucene-core (Ubuntu) "[FFE] new clucene version needed for LibreOffice" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<xnox> Sweetshark: seb128: I am Debian/Ubuntu maintailer of 2 rdepends, and I'm sure we can fix the other 3. just do it =)
<seb128> xnox, good, which ones?
<xnox> seb128: bibletime & sword. They will be pissed off not to have clucene but meh =)
<Sweetshark> xnox: oh, awesome
<Sweetshark> .oO(better no clucence in bibletime than broken LO extensions and broken LO help on ARM)
<Laney> or the rdeps could be fixed ...
<xnox> Sweetshark: just do what you need for LO and I'll fix my packages.
 * xnox thinks there is support for new clucene in svn trunks for both sword & bibletime.
<Sweetshark> xnox: I just need the sync for LO, nothing else tbd on clucene
<Sweetshark> seb128: ^^ so, go ahead, I guess?
<xnox> Sweetshark: seb128: done. happy hacking.
<Sweetshark> xnox: awesome
<seb128> Sweetshark, xnox: thanks
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, after packaging part of the firefox test suite and running the tests, i've discovered that there's a few tests which assume they have write access to the application directory :(
<didrocks> and hop! https://launchpad.net/cupstream2distro
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i thought that was something to do with cups when i saw the url ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you can also think about cups of coffee :)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> we don't use cups here
<chrisccoulson> we use mugs for coffee ;)
<didrocks> mugs? ;)
<chrisccoulson> yeah :)
<didrocks> yeah, but I can't find a funny name using mugs :p
<chrisccoulson> heh
<xclaesse> seb128, when I press alt-tab once, it focus next window. But not when current "window" is a webapp in firefox
<seb128> xclaesse, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1070714
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1070714 in unity (Ubuntu) "webapp: alt-tab gets "stucked" on the browser rather than going to the next entry" [Low,Invalid]
<xclaesse> for example in a workspace I have firefox, facebook and g+ in the alt-tab menu
<xclaesse> seb128, cool merci
<seb128> ups
<seb128> xclaesse, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1070715
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1070715 in unity (Ubuntu) "webapp: alt-tab gets "stucked" on the browser rather than going to the next entry" [High,Triaged]
<seb128> rather
<seb128> de rien
<pitti> ogra_, everyone: I just reinstalled the nexus7 ubuntu image, and now starting apps from the launcher or opening indicators with the touch screen does not work; I can select icons in the launcher, also an external mouse works
<pitti> does that sound familiar?
<seb128> pitti, is that consistant? did you try rebooting?
<pitti> yes, I rebooted
<pitti> i. e. I touch on the g-c-c icon, and I get the "system settings" popup
<pitti> but it doesn't open
<seb128> ok, I had issues before, sometime playing with indicator put xorg pointer in a lock state
<pitti> hm, indeed I tried to open an indicator first
<pitti> to connect to a wifi
<pitti> I attached an external keyboard/mouse, so it's not a biggie right now
<seb128> if it persist after a reboot that's not likely it...
 * pitti tries and reboot again, without fiddling indicators
<seb128> but it's easy to "break" left click when using indicators
<seb128> that's a known issue on the xorg side iirc
<pitti> so I guess that's what I did
<GunnarHj> pitti: Hi Martin!
<GunnarHj> A first attempt to build version 2.34.2-1 of glib2.0 failed. I could build after having modified debian/rules, but I have no idea if that change is right.
<GunnarHj> Extract from 'bzr bd' output:
<GunnarHj> http://people.ubuntu.com/~gunnarhj/glib2.0-2.34.2-1_build-failure.txt
<GunnarHj> Branch with the debian/rules modification:
<GunnarHj> https://code.launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/ubuntu/raring/glib2.0/lang-locale-for-days-months
<pitti> hey GunnarHj!
<pitti> GunnarHj: btw, you should try and build with DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nocheck, otherwise it'll take ages
<pitti> seb128: ah, works now
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-nexus7/+bug/1068994
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1068994 in ubuntu-nexus7 "button1 gets stuck after a while" [Critical,In progress]
<Laney> ?
<seb128> pitti, ok, like that indicator/xorg issue then
<GunnarHj> pitti: Yeah, it did take ages. Thanks for the tip.
<seb128> Laney, could be it yes
<pitti> Laney: well, it's not completely stuck; I can operate widgets in dialogs etc, just not in the launcher
<seb128> pitti, well, you can't e.g dnd dialogs by their titlebar when that happens
<Laney> I don't think the title is accurate
<Laney> comments explain it a bit more
<seb128> it's a bit of a weird bug
<xclaesse> can someone do a quick test for me on ubuntu? in a terminal start "Xephyr :2" then in another terminal: "DISPLAY=:2 glxinfo"
<seb128> pitti, or double click doesn't work
<xclaesse> on fedora/debian it gives glx stuff, but on my ubuntu quantal it says Error: couldn't find RGB GLX visual or fbconfig
<seb128> Error: couldn't find RGB GLX visual or fbconfig
<seb128> xclaesse, try asking on #ubuntu-x?
<xclaesse> seb128, ok, asked there
<xclaesse> thx
<seb128> yw
<tkamppeter> Seems that I have hit a ghost dependency in apt-get making it impossible to use apt-get agaui
<seb128> tkamppeter, can you pastebin the error?
<tkamppeter> again. I have installed "ia32-libs' trying to install some closed-source app and ia32-libs is uninstallable as some i386 library versions did not get built. Now "apt-get install -f" insists on installing the uninstallable libraries, even after removing all :i386 packages.
<seb128> did you try to sudo dpkg -r ia32-libs
<seb128> ?
<tkamppeter> seb128, yes, I did.
<tkamppeter> seb128, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1357764/
<seb128> tkamppeter, that log seems fine, e.g nothing uninstallable...?
<tkamppeter> seb128, it seems that the dpendencies of the (removed) ia32-libs are still held in some database, due to a bug.
<tkamppeter> seb128, so I will execute it, to reveal the error.
<seb128> ok
<tkamppeter> seb128, when I do so, I get these errors in the end: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1357780/
<seb128> tkamppeter, those packages seem to have bugs
<tkamppeter> seb128, if I repeat "apt-get -f install" I get http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1357786/
<tkamppeter> seb128, how can I get rid of the system's demand for these packages?
<seb128> tkamppeter, try asking on #ubuntu-devel
<seb128> not sure...
<tkamppeter> seb128, so seems that I have hit a bug in apt-get.
<tkamppeter> seb128, thanks anyway.
<seb128> tkamppeter, no, you have hit bugs in avahi and cairo
<seb128>  trying to overwrite shared '/usr/share/doc/libcairo-gobject2/README.gz', which is different from other instances of package libcairo-gobject2:i386
<seb128>  
<seb128> that's a packaging bug in the multiarch
<tkamppeter> seb128, but I do not need these packages and I have no dependency on them, how do I simply get rid of them?
<seb128> well, you tried to install something that pulled them in
<seb128> can you move that conversation to #ubuntu-devel where others can help as well?
<tkamppeter> seb128, that was ia32-libs and this I have uninstalled.
<tkamppeter> seb128, moved over now, let us see whether someone answers or whether I should do a fresh install.
<tkamppeter> I am reading here about a former "Remote Desktop Preferences" in System Settings. I would like to use it in Quantal. Is it completely removed or can I get it back by instakllin a package?
<seb128> tkamppeter, the remove desktop should still be there, it's part of vino, it's just not in system settings
<seb128> tkamppeter, type "vino" in the dash or run vino-preferences
<tkamppeter> seb128, found this already. Thank you.
<xnox> Since lp:~ubuntu-desktop/glade/ubuntu is stale, do I understand correctly that udd branches / the archive directly is used for glade?!
<Laney> when's the last commit there?
<xnox> Laney: april. last upload a couple of days ago.
<xnox> udd is up to date.
<Laney> probably
<Laney> you could commit the delta and use it
<xnox> meh
<Laney> it's hardly taxing
<Laney> otherwise we should delete the branch imho
<xnox> Laney: please, delete it...
<Laney> you can
<xnox> Laney: mark as obsolete?
<xnox> cause the history might be useful.
<Laney> remove all the files and put a README in?
<Laney> dunno
<xnox> I see... well rename + mark as status obsolete
<xnox> desktop should just switch to full udd branches =)
 * xnox hides
<Laney> yeah imagine if they worked with quilt
<sabdfl> ya
<chrisccoulson> ooh, INFO | Result summary:
<chrisccoulson> INFO | Passed: 1512
<chrisccoulson> INFO | Failed: 22
<chrisccoulson> down from more than 50 this morning \o/
<mitya57> Laney: do you know you're on the screenshot at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irssi ? :)
<Laney> heh
 * Laney wonders what you were doing reading that :P
<GunnarHj> pitti: Did you make a note about debian/rules in glib?
<pitti> GunnarHj: sorry, what note? (I was rather deeply involved in something else and didn't pay much attention to IRC)
<GunnarHj> pitti: I'm talking about the #ubuntu-desktop message I sent 12:22:19.
<xnox> GunnarHj: timezone?
<pitti> GunnarHj: oh
<pitti> GunnarHj: that means that some of the tests failed
<pitti> GunnarHj: but not at the end of the log, as stuff runs in parallel; grep the log for " FAIL$"
<GunnarHj> xnox: +0100
<GunnarHj> pitti: But the failure was fatal. After my modification of debian/rules it succeeded.
<pitti> GunnarHj: yes, we fail the build on failed tests; but if you run with DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nocheck, the tests get skipped
<pitti> GunnarHj: they are rather brittle unfortunately
<pitti> well, unfortunately for the "local developer" perspective, anyway
<pitti> (it's actually good that they are picky from a CI POV)
<GunnarHj> pitti: Do you mean that it's ok? What I did was adding a trailing "|| true".
<xnox> GunnarHj: the upstream unittests, test the correctness of glib, pottentially your glib is broken as all unittests did not pass.
<pitti> GunnarHj: well, for local testing that's ok, but we won't take it into our packages
<pitti> GunnarHj: DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nocheck is easier
<xnox> GunnarHj: so you can do $ export DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nocheck
<xnox> GunnarHj: and then  upon $ debuild the unittests will not be executed.
<GunnarHj> pitti, xnox: Aha, thanks. No, my glib is a fresh bzr branch, so if it's broken, the archive branch is broken as well.
<xnox> GunnarHj: not necessorely.
<pitti> as I said, they are rather timing sensitive, and one of the tests notoriously complains/fails if you run it under an active session
<xnox> GunnarHj: are you building for the same target distribution as root in sbuild?
<xnox> GunnarHj: on bare metal / headless build-farm? =))))
<GunnarHj> pitti, xnox: I'm not building as root. But I think this is above my head. Will take your advice and add export DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nocheck to ~/.profile and forget about it for now. ;-)  Thanks!
<xnox> GunnarHj: well if you do in in profile that _all_ packages you _ever_ build will not run the test-suites. Hence giving you false "successful builds".
<pitti> what xnox said
<pitti> good evening everyone! need to go
<xnox> GunnarHj: remember to take it out when you are done, or make a wrapper script ~/bin/nocheck
<xnox> GunnarHj: export DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nocheck $@
<xnox> GunnarHj: and then you have a handy way to call build without test-suite.
<xnox> e.g. $ nocheck debuild
<GunnarHj> xnox: Ok, then I drop the ~/.profile idea. The wrapper sounds good. Will try that. Thanks!
<seb128> xnox, Laney: it's annoying to deal with stuff we sync with debian at times
<seb128> the custom vcs get out of sync
<bcurtiswx> has anyone in here successfully installed ubuntu 12.10 on a macbook air 4,2 (2011 version)
<Laney> I think my girlfriend has that one
<Laney> she upgraded from precise though
<bcurtiswx> i've been following https://help.ubuntu.com/community/How%20to%20install%20Ubuntu%20on%20MacBook%20using%20USB%20Stick but it isn't able to create a partition once the USB becomes bootable with the ISO file http://releases.ubuntu.com/12.10/ for max amd64 there
<bcurtiswx> mac*
<ppppaul> hello ubuntus
<ppppaul> can i ask technical questions in here?
<desrt> ppppaul: yup
<ppppaul> i installed some kernals on ubuntu 12.10
<ppppaul> i am unable to figure out how to set the kernel to run at startup
<ppppaul> i am not presented with grub at startup :(
<ppppaul> i was grub once, though. and then never again
<ppppaul> i'm not sure what version of grub i'm running. i have grub and grub2 files
<ppppaul> also, my system is an upgrade from 12.04
<ppppaul> when i do sudo update-grub i get back a list of the kernels i installed
<ppppaul> i've looked on google a bit for how to solve this problem, but i'm a bit stuck now (it's taking up way too much time for me)
<kenvandine> ppppaul, check with #ubuntu for issues like this... this is a developer channel
<kenvandine> ppppaul, however, to see the grub menu, hold shift at boot
<ppppaul> ok, thank you
<kenvandine> i think...
<ppppaul> oh
<kenvandine> i haven't done that in ages
<ppppaul> i didn't know about shift at booot
<ppppaul> i'll try that now
<ppppaul> that's for both versions of grub?
<attente> desrt: i'm stuck; is there something i need to do before calling g_menu_model_items_changed () in order to get updates working?
<desrt> attente: you need to actually do the updates? :)
<desrt> attente: it's quite likely that in response to items_changed() (in particular in the case where items are added) you will receive calls back into the GMenuModel API (like _get_item_attributes(), etc)
<attente> unless nothing seems to be watching for items-changed?
<desrt> the exporter ought to be
<desrt> unless nobody is consuming it on the other side of the bus
<desrt> in which case, indeed, nobody will be looking.... but what did you expect? :)
<attente> ok, one sec, i'll check
<attente> debugging this is kind of painful since the breakpoints keep getting hit everytime i switch between gdb and the tester
<attente> desrt: yeah, nobody is watching :(
<desrt> attente: what if the client is running?
<attente> same deal
<desrt> huh
<desrt> something is amiss
<desrt> maybe you should try keeping it in-process
<desrt> like create a separate window (and avoid hijacking it) and then put a GtkMenuBar in there and bind it to the model from the other menu
<desrt> take the dbus crap out of the equation for now
<desrt> rip down the X properties while you're at it...
<desrt> that should prevent random stuff from happening when you're switching windows
<attente> ok
<desrt> you can probably pretty effectively avoid the hijack by just using a global variable for the window you create
<GunnarHj> charles: Are you there?
<charles> GunnarHj: howdy
<GunnarHj> charles: Hi! Did you see my message here yesterday?
<GunnarHj> charles: I asked if you would like to comment on https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=687945
<ubot2> Gnome bug 687945 in i18n "Display names of days and months using the current language" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<GunnarHj> charles: Matthias seems to be hard to convince - or not. Do you know him?
<charles> GunnarHj: I've read him, but never spoken to him
<charles> let me get caught up on the ticket here...
<GunnarHj> charles: Ok, no hurry.
<bryceh> AlanBell, sure thing.  whenever's convenient.  PM me and we can talk it over.
<GunnarHj> charles: I'm leaving for some food. Will be back in half an hour or so.
 * didrocks waves good evening
<attente> desrt: omg.... mutable means can be changed...
<desrt> attente: yes....
<desrt> did you mark your model as immutable? :)
<desrt> ...and then change it...
<attente> no.. there was literally a comment: "/* The menu can change at any time. */"
<attente> return FALSE;
<GunnarHj> xnox: This is the nocheck script I put in ~/bin:
<GunnarHj> #!/bin/sh
<GunnarHj> export DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS="nocheck"
<GunnarHj> exec $@
<GunnarHj> Works nicely. Needed exec(), or else $@ seemed to be considered arguments to export(). Thanks again for the tip.
<notgary> A question for the desktop team: what do you all think about the idea of adding audio devices to the sound menu? Comment #3 on this bug report has some details https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-applet/+bug/1061684
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1061684 in indicator-applet (Ubuntu) "Switch between HDMI audio device and Analog from the System Tray" [Undecided,New]
<cyphermox> mterry: kenvandine: robru: if it's any use, I made the two steps or taking a packaging branch (that has the right ancestry) and merging in just debian/ into an upstream branch: http://ubuntuone.com/4w1JBK3EB2Lebm0r2rZ4wh
<cyphermox> the above was missing "into a script". just pass the packaging branch as a parameter.
<mterry> cyphermox, neat
<achiang> anyone here know how to debug this from my .xsession-errors: unity-2d-shell: [WARNING] QDBusError("org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.UnknownMethod", "No such interface `org.ayatana.bamf.view' on object at path /org/ayatana/bamf/application1642573751")
<kenvandine> cool
<achiang> what is that application?
<cyphermox> so far seems to work pretty well with the indicators
<mterry> achiang, you could use d-feet to find out I bet
<robru> cyphermox, cool
<achiang> cyphermox: i'm trying to debug the broken nm-applet issue that's been plaguing us since 12.04
<mterry> achiang, to map it to an exe
<cyphermox> achiang: oh, cool
<cyphermox> that's something that comes out of the applet?
<cyphermox> what do you mean by broken?
<achiang> cyphermox: it's like, infinitely reproducible if you use unity-2d
<cyphermox> cool.
<achiang> cyphermox: basically nm-applet stops working after some time
<cyphermox> ah, right
<achiang> if you try and view more wifi networks
<achiang> the menu just goes to lunch
<cyphermox> as mentioned before, it seems to me like there are leaks, probably not just in nm-applet
<cyphermox> achiang: and I'm hoping you're working on this on quantal, because I plugged two relatively bad but hidden ones
<achiang> mterry: i have d-feet open but don't see a path to /org/ayatana anywhere
<achiang> cyphermox: i'm only poking at this for a few minutes because it reproduced again and i am super annoyed
<cyphermox> ok
<achiang> cyphermox: did you SRU the fixes to 12.04?
<cyphermox> I am too, and thankful for the help, I'm running out of ideas and it seems like you got some progress
<cyphermox> achiang: it's in progress IIRC
<mterry> achiang, it might be on the random unnamed processes near the bottom
<achiang> cyphermox: ok, are you able to reproduce it?
<cyphermox> you mean on quantal?
<cyphermox> not so much anymore
<achiang> cyphermox: on 12.04
<achiang> you know... our LTS that we support for 5 years. ;)
<cyphermox> I couldn't, but some people can if I'm to believe the bug report
<achiang> cyphermox: it's really easy. just run 12.04 and you'll 100% get it
<cyphermox> ;)
<cyphermox> I don't :/
<achiang> might come faster if you run unity-2d but that's just a theory for now
<cyphermox> as far as nm-applet is concerned unity-2d or unity is the same
<cyphermox> that's not true for the rest of the stack though, I think
<achiang> mterry: i don't see any apps at the bottom that resemble application1642573751, just random stuff ranging from 1.6 to 1.300
<bcurtiswx> if the messaging menu isn't showing up how do I bring it back?
<cyphermox> achiang: look under org.ayatana.bamf
<achiang> cyphermox: there is no org.ayatana.bamf... maybe i need to re-run d-feet as root?
<cyphermox> no
<cyphermox> are you looking at the session bus?
<achiang> hm, no, that didn't change anything
<achiang> oops, was looking at system bus
<bcurtiswx> ah nvm, apparently you need online accounts to show that
<achiang> what's the address of the session bus?
<achiang> found it
<cyphermox> don't use an address, use the File menu to choose session bus
<achiang> huh, i have a ca.desrt.dconf in there. ;)
<cyphermox> yeah :)
<mterry> achiang, no, the path is in the right pane
<mterry> achiang, the /org/ayatana stuff is on the right, and might be on any of the names in the left pane
<achiang> mterry: yeah, the window must be gone already
<achiang> i don't see it anymore
<achiang> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1358718/
<achiang> lines 70 and 73
<achiang> oh, this is better - http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1358724/
<achiang> nm-applet using 15.6MB of RSS
<jcastro_> achiang: hey have you guys memory audited all the indictors for the N7? I can't wait to see you guys swimming in Tedware. :p
<achiang> jcastro_: someone else has that WI, but yeah, it's planned to audit all the indicators for N7
<achiang> jcastro_: but if you read the last 50 lines of scrollback, you can see that i am plagued with leaks on my x86 laptop, 12.04
<achiang> jcastro_: also, i don't get the Tedware joke, but that's ok. :)
<jcastro_> achiang: I have no real science, but when my indicator memory goes out of control, it was probably written by tedg
<tedg> Hmph.
<tedg> I don't think we have that many leaks though.  Perhaps in the nm-applet, that's not mine ;-)
<cyphermox> hmm.. my computer jingles when it loses power. interesting.
<achiang> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-applet/+bug/780602/comments/47
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 780602 in network-manager-applet (Ubuntu) "nm-applet leaks memory and stops functioning after a while" [High,Confirmed]
<achiang> nm-applet uses 5x the RSS memory vs the other indicators
<achiang> and 11x the PSS
<thomi> pitti: ping?
<robert_ancell> Laney, do you know if we can update libproxy to 0.4.10?
<Laney> robert_ancell: I don't see why not - I plan to take care of it this week
<Laney> but feel free if you want to do it
<robert_ancell> Laney, not familiar with the package so I'll open a bug and assign it to you
<Laney> k, ta
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, are we going to use farstream 0.2 in raring?
<kenvandine> i haven't looked
<kenvandine> but i would assume
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, ok, I'll have a look at it
<kenvandine> awesome
<Laney> pretty sure, that's the 1.0 variant
<kenvandine> i figured it would be
<LLStarks> hi, i'm having a rather odd problem. g-c-c apps are not launching with gksu.
<LLStarks> can't edit anything
<mfisch> robert_ancell: is there a way to determine who is listening on dbus for a certain signal?
<robert_ancell> mfisch, not that I know of
<mfisch> robert_ancell: ok thanks
<robert_ancell> mfisch, there is dbus-monitor but I've never used it
<mfisch> robert_ancell: it works great for seeing signals emitted
<robru> woooo! just booted into raring for the first time!
<robru> firefox and thunderbird are taking *forever* to check my add-ons for compatibility... chrisccoulson!
<chrisccoulson> robru, network issue?
<robru> chrisccoulson, dunno, network seems fine otherwise...
<robru> chrisccoulson, I'm on IRC I mean ;-)
<chrisccoulson> can you access https://addons.mozilla.org/ ok?
<robru> chrisccoulson, it loads slooooowly
<chrisccoulson> robru, that will be why :)
<robru> chrisccoulson, oh well, seems fine now...
<chrisccoulson> ah, damn you optipng! you're the reason these tests are failing
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-11-15
<robert_ancell> desrt, yo
<psusi> is there a command line way to adjust mouse sensitivity?
<psusi> since upgrading to quantal my mouse is way too sensitive and the slider in the system settings has no effect
<bryceh> psusi, you can use xinput to do this.  xinput list identifies the input device number for your mouse.  xinput list-props should tell you what params can be tweaked.  See man xinput for more details.
<bryceh> psusi, note that any settings you change with that will not persist across sessions
<psusi> thanks
<desrt> robert_ancell: hi
<robert_ancell> desrt, what's the plan for d-conf 0.16?
<desrt> psusi: i'm sure the (persistent) sensitivity is stored as a gsetting...
<desrt> robert_ancell: in what sense?
<desrt> aday's bug?
<robert_ancell> desrt, worth getting in for raring or might pick up some dependency we don't want?
<desrt> oh ya
<desrt> it's going in raring
<desrt> but seb wants to wait for the new year
<robert_ancell> why wait, I might just upload it now
<robert_ancell> oh he said you might be taking some time off right?
<psusi> oh thank god... xset did the trick
<psusi> was driving me nuts... n v t s, nuts
<sarnold> psusi: thanks for reporting back. :)
<desrt> robert_ancell: did dconf grow a dependency on the unstable glib series yet?
<psusi> so yea... the control panel is just broken... touching the slider there in any way makes it go back to full blast... what package should a bug be filed against for that?
<desrt> robert_ancell: if it hasn't, it's only by chance...
<robert_ancell> desrt, don't think so
<desrt> robert_ancell: anyway.. we have a green-list of packages for upgrade this cycle...
<desrt> glib, gobject-introspection, pygobject, gvfs, dconf...
<desrt> so i'm sure nobody would mind
<robert_ancell> desrt, nah, I've marked 0.15 as unstable
<desrt> robert_ancell: what does that mean?
<robert_ancell> desrt, versions tracker wont report it as out of date
<desrt> cool...
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> thomi: hello
<didrocks> good morning
<BigWhale> Good morning all.
<chrisccoulson> w00t: INFO | Result summary:
<chrisccoulson> INFO | Passed: 1518
<chrisccoulson> INFO | Failed: 17
<chrisccoulson> much better than yesterday!
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<pitti> chrisccoulson: quite fine, thanks!
<didrocks> good morning pitti, chrisccoulson!
<pitti> had a nice morning, new dbusmock is out :)
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> pitti, excellent
<chrisccoulson> pitti, i had an interesting day yesterday, that turned out to be caused by optipng ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm good, thanks! yourself?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, does that break tests?
<larsu> good morning everyone!
<chrisccoulson> i was getting failures in firerfox tests that i couldn't reproduce in my build env, and it turns out it's because of some images being modified :)
<didrocks> hey larsu :)
<pitti> hello larsu
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i'm not too bad thanks
<chrisccoulson> pitti - this was one of the tests that was failing: http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/file/3692c11ce73e/modules/libjar/zipwriter/test/unit/test_asyncadd.js
<chrisccoulson> it packs some files in to a zip archive using various methods, and verifies the size of it
<chrisccoulson> and of course, one of the files had to be a png ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: can/should we fix that in pkgbinarymangler? i. e. is it in a path or so which indicates that it shouldn't be touched? something with /tests/ or so?
<chrisccoulson> pitti, quite possibly. i'm installing all tests in to /usr/lib/firefox-testsuite at the moment, although i could make that /usr/lib/firefox/tests instead
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I could also filter out all paths with "test" in it, might be easier?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, that would be fine
<pitti> chrisccoulson: of course if that is only tests, you could just build with NO_PNG_PKG_MANGLE=1
<pitti> chrisccoulson: or just disable all mangling with export NO_PKG_MANGLE=1 in debian/rules
<pitti> then none of the other stuff will jump in between
<chrisccoulson> pitti - that's what i ended up doing for now (the NO_PNG_PKG_MANGLE trick)
<pitti> ah, that sounds good
<chrisccoulson> most png's used by firefox are in a jar file in any case. i think the only one that isn't is for the desktop file
<BigWhale> Will python 2.x still be available in 13.04 on the installation CD?
<seb128> hey desktopers
<seb128> BigWhale, not sure yet, we are aiming at dropping it but there are a few difficult items remaining
<pitti> hey seb128
<seb128> hey pitti
<didrocks> hey seb128! good morning ;)
<seb128> lut didrocks
<BigWhale> Ah well, I'll just start porting Kazam to 3.0 ...
<BigWhale> seb128, ImportError: No module named xdg.BaseDirectory that's a bummer
<BigWhale> :))
<BigWhale> ok I found python3-xdg
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, I'm good, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, pretty good thanks
<Laney> morning
<Laney> my S3 comes today, ending my isolation from modern society
<chrisccoulson> do you want your own private cloud?
<chrisccoulson> http://mashable.com/2012/11/15/berndnaut-smilde-clouds/
<Laney> heh
<Laney> qengho / micahg: Got any immediate plans for webkit?
<Laney> Otherwise I'll upload 1.10.1
<Chipaca> o/
<Chipaca> are we switching to the gentoo udev fork?
<pitti> Laney: bug 1079102 looks good to me; do you want to commit this right to Debian?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1079102 in libproxy (Ubuntu) "libproxy needs a compile/link/run test" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1079102
 * pitti takes bug 1078719 and commits it to Debian/uploads to Ubuntu
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1078719 in gconf (Ubuntu) "libgconf2-dev needs a compile/link/run test" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1078719
<Laney> pitti: I'm leaving libproxy alone in Debian for now, until someone decides what they want to do with it
<Laney> but when that is resolved I'll back-sync it
<Laney> how long is it until we see it run on our jenkins? :-)
<pitti> Laney: about an hour until it gets published
<pitti> err, s/until/after/
<Laney> nice
<pitti> (at most, usually less)
<qengho> Laney: nothing this week or next, probably.
<desrt> morning folks
<attente> morning
 * kenvandine hugs pitti for python-dbusmock
<pitti> kenvandine: :)
<kenvandine> pitti, can templates be packaged along with the package that owns the service it mocks?
<kenvandine> it would be cool for maintenance
<pitti> kenvandine: in theory yes, but perhaps let's not yet until the concept stabilizes
<Laney> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Raring/view/AutoPkgTest/job/raring-proposed-adt-libproxy/ \o/
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> pitti, i love the idea, it's going to make testing libfriends much easier!
<didrocks> hey kenvandine, how are you?
<kenvandine> good
<kenvandine> and you?
<didrocks> excellent, thanks :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, got all those projects renamed :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: waow, awesome \o/
 * didrocks hugs kenvandine
<kenvandine> 13 of them :)
<kenvandine> much better now
<didrocks> kenvandine: indeed, no more issue to find the right project
<didrocks> kenvandine: and it was a little bit of a PITA to configure TBH :)
<didrocks> happy that you achieved it quickly ;)
<kenvandine> looks like the video lens has been renamed as well
<kenvandine> thanks davidcalle!
<kenvandine> didrocks, we also renamed unity-lens-gdocs to unity-scope-gdrive
<kenvandine> so i'll be renaming the package there
<davidcalle> kenvandine, thanks to czajkowski :)
<kenvandine> gdocs is a deprecated name
<kenvandine> indeed :)
<kenvandine> she did mine too
<didrocks> kenvandine: sweet :)
<didrocks> thanks davidcalle, czajkowski!
<didrocks> kenvandine: yeah, I saw the discussion on the gdocs MP
<didrocks> kenvandine: oh btw, did you see my additional comment on robru's MP?
<czajkowski> :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, not yet
<kenvandine> oh right
<kenvandine> thx
<didrocks> yw ;)
<tkamppeter> Sweetshark, hi
<micahg> Laney: not until there's a security update
<Laney> righto
<Sweetshark> tkamppeter: you have 5 minutes ;)
 * Sweetshark desperately needs some food after this call.
<tkamppeter> Sweetshark, what are the problems with the GTK print dialog in LO, what features are missing?
<robru> kenvandine, didrocks: hey, just got up. late start today, I'm still quite sick. I'll make that change to the webapps mp right away though
<kenvandine> thanks
<kenvandine> robru, good morning :)
<robru> kenvandine, good morning ;-)
<didrocks> robru: take it easy, hope you will feel better soon! :) good morning
<robru> kenvandine, also, I seem to be obligated to take my mother in law to brunch this morning, so it'll probably be a few hours before I'm officially on the clock
<kenvandine> :)
<robru> but I'm doing this mp right now ;-)
<robru> kenvandine, didrocks: mp updated. I'm out for brunch now ;-)
<kenvandine> enjoy
<kenvandine> thx
<didrocks> robru: enjoy:
<didrocks> :)
<mitya57> Does LibreOffice use Gtk dialogs? I thought it has its own ones...
<czajkowski> pitti: ping
<czajkowski> TB meeting
<chrisccoulson> awesome:
<chrisccoulson> REFTEST INFO | Successful: 54764 (54764 pass, 0 load only)
<chrisccoulson> REFTEST INFO | Unexpected: 0 (0 unexpected fail, 0 unexpected pass, 0 unexpected asserts, 0 unexpected fixed asserts, 0 failed load, 0 exception)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: \o/
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, that is a TON of tests :)
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, that's not all of them
<chrisccoulson> i'm probably only half way
<Trevinho> didrocks: are the bamf tests report somewhat still needed?
<Trevinho> didrocks: the GTester Unit Test Report I mean
<didrocks> Trevinho: need to run our for 40 minutes, will be back after that, but the answer is yes :)
<hankhendrix> hello, I'm wanting to edit the behaviour of "Change Desktop Background" on the desktop context menu. Anyone know which package contains the source?
<mitya57> hankhendrix, the menu is provided by nautilus and opens a gnome-control-center panel
<hankhendrix> mitya57 thanks
<hankhendrix> #mitya57 thanks
<hankhendrix> I've just changed the source to nautilus package...does anyone know if I can repackage and test?
<Sweetshark> tkamppeter: see http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/minutes-of-ESC-call-td4018786.html -- if you want to discuss details, ping dtardon on #libreoffice-dev (maybe tommorrow before noon?)
<hankhendrix> (I'm new to Ubuntu dev)
<sarnold> hankhendrix: some directions on setting up sbuild are here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/BuildEnvironment -- though there are portions that probably are less useful to people not on the security team...
<hankhendrix> thanks sarnold
<hankhendrix> will sbuild allow me to repackage nautilus and effectively install it on my own system?
<hankhendrix> I've read through the docs but need an expert answer!
<tkamppeter> Sweetshark, thanks.
<sarnold> hankhendrix: this _might_ be easier to use: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<hankhendrix> thanks man, do you know what IDE I could use to test source?
<hankhendrix> I'm a JavaScript and PHP dev so compiled langs is new to me!
<sarnold> hankhendrix: hrm, I just use vim. Seems a lot of people like eclipse, but I never got the hang of it.
<chrisccoulson> is it possible to disable the xscreensaver extension when running xvfb?
<sarnold> chrisccoulson: would that be 'xset s off' ?
<chrisccoulson> sarnold, yeah, that would probably do it. thanks :)
<desrt> robert_ancell: thanks for playing whitespace police :p
<robert_ancell> heh, I feel like a pedant
<robert_ancell> desrt, that GSubprocess patch is so close to landing! That has to be the longest bug thread I've ever followed
<desrt> robert_ancell: i really enjoy the improvements that it's getting as a result
<robert_ancell> yeah, you want to get it right
<desrt> the way colin just implemented g_main_send_signal() or whatever it's called is awesome
<Chucrute301> Hi guys
<Chucrute301> Anyone can help me?
<Chucrute301> ?
<TheMuso> Chucrute301: Just ask your question./
<Chucrute301> Ok
<Chucrute301> My pc have a nvidia card
<Chucrute301> But, after i install proprietary card the unity slowdown
<Chucrute301> In nouveau is fast :/
<Chucrute301> This problem is ONLY on unity
<TheMuso> But I am guessing there is a reason you need to use the proprietary drivers?
<Chucrute301> Yes
<TheMuso> I suggest filing a bug against unity in launchpad, using the ubuntu-bug command: "ubuntu-bug unity" should do it.
<Chucrute301> In proprietary i have better performance and i have colors more vivid
<Chucrute301> I will do it
<Chucrute301> After i install nvidia 310
<TheMuso> Yes make sure you have the proprietary drivers installed.
<Chucrute301> In nvidia 304 i have this bug
<Chucrute301> In nouveau i dont hav
<TheMuso> Ok, well make sure you include that information in the bug.
<Chucrute301> In nvidia site shows that 310 drivers solve opengl performance bug in unity
<Chucrute301> I will test
<Chucrute301> If this driver dont solve my problem i will make a bug report
<Chucrute301> This is a nvidia driver bug or a unity bug????
<TheMuso> I don't know.
<TheMuso> WHich is why I suggested filing a bug against unity. The problem could be there, but at the least you can get help to find the right problem area, whether it be the driver or unity.
<Chucrute301> Thanks!
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-11-16
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Would you kindly push wayland 1.0 to git? :)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, debian git?
<RAOF> Yup; pkg-xorg.
<RAOF> http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-xorg/wayland/wayland.git
<RAOF> Ah. Or you might not actually have commit access there, I guess.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, and it appears they use some sort of merge-upstream?
<RAOF> Correct.
<RAOF> Would you perhaps like me to do the merginating of your uploads?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, go for it
<RAOF> Probably time to upgrade to raring, too.
 * TheMuso upgraded to raring when he got back.
<TheMuso> RAOF: Note that there is no noverlay filesystem support of any kind in 3.7 thats in raring now, a kernel that fixes this is currently in proposed.
<TheMuso> s/noverlay/overlay.
<TheMuso> In other words, current 3.7 in raring proper has no aufs and overlayfs modules.
<RAOF> Win!
<RAOF> My suffering with btrfs finally pays dividends!
<TheMuso> Cool.
<TheMuso> I got bitten by no overlay support yesterday when attempting to use sbuild on 3.7.
<TheMuso> Its times like this when being able to keep older kernels around is useful.
<xnox> RAOF: well... i use lvm snapshots =) no btrfs suffering and pays same dividends =)
<RAOF> :P
<xnox> RAOF: also you hit my "btrfs" highlight ;-)
<RAOF> Oh, really?
<RAOF> Why do you have such a beast?
<xnox> yeah =)
<xnox> RAOF: look at the upload history of btrfs-tools ;-)
<RAOF> Hah.
<ajmitch> xnox: I'd look as well but LP timed out :P
 * xnox timesout to sleep
<didrocks> good morning
<BigWhale> good morning didrocks! :)
<didrocks> hey BigWhale!
<BigWhale> *tumbleweed*
<BigWhale> oh, you're here. :)
<BigWhale> just ^W that ... :))
<seb128> hey desktopers
<RAOF> make install
<RAOF> Heh.
<didrocks> hey RAOF ;) salut seb128!
<seb128> hey didrocks, RAOF
<RAOF> Hey all!
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<chrisccoulson> meh:
<chrisccoulson> 491871 INFO Failed: 113
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> !!
<seb128> what's that?
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, i'm good thanks. how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, firefox mochitests
<seb128> good, thanks
<chrisccoulson> although, that's a small number of failures really:
<chrisccoulson> 491870 INFO Passed: 669557
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<larsu> Friday!
<larsu> good morning chrisccoulson, seb128!
<chrisccoulson> hi larsu :)
<seb128> larsu, hey, how are you?
<larsu> seb128, good thanks. Yourself?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i like fridays :)
<seb128> larsu, I'm good thanks
<chrisccoulson> when i was at college, i always used to get a bacon and hash brown sandwich at breakfast on a friday
<seb128> hehe
<chrisccoulson> we used to call it "fattening fry day"
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<seb128> lol
<larsu> hah
<larsu> seb128, did you try the pidgin package with messaging menu integration? People are saying it works, now
<chrisccoulson> now i'm thinking about bacon :(
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you made me want one for those fattening breakfast :p
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
 * seb128 is staying at didrocks' today, the guy doesn't eat breakfast or lunch, I'm scared
<didrocks> s/scared/screwed/
<seb128> see :(
<didrocks> heh ;)
<chrisccoulson> oh, here's one of the test failures:
<chrisccoulson> http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/file/a50a77da3cf9/content/canvas/test/webgl/test_webgl_conformance_test_suite.html#l368
<chrisccoulson> i guess that ones easy to fix
<chrisccoulson> disable it ;)
<larsu> didrocks, give this guy something to eat!
<seb128> larsu, no, I wanted to do that and got carried in email backlog, giving it a try next
<larsu> didrocks, and: happy Friday morning to you ;)
<didrocks> good morning larsu, forcing feeding? what world are we living on?
<larsu> didrocks, as long as its bacon I'm sure he doesn't mind :P
<didrocks> larsu: tssssss :)
<didrocks> only at UDS
<larsu> :D
<didrocks> no chance to find bacon here :)
<didrocks> but butter + marmalade for seb128
 * larsu would much prefer that for breakfast. Sans the butter
<didrocks> this is the butter controversy
<seb128> oh, didrocks finally agrees on adding the butter with the marmalade, shame that breakfast is over
<didrocks> heh
<seb128> dammit, larsu is in the no-butter side
<didrocks> seb128: want another one? :)
<larsu> NO BUTTER FTW!
<seb128> larsu, right, wurst for breakfast in germany
<larsu> seb128, not for me either (I don't like meat in the morning). Sorry to disappoint  :)
<Laney> morning
<Laney> damn you dpkg-gensymbols
<hyperair> Laney: what's up with gensymbols?
<Laney> c++
<Laney> size_t
<hyperair> oh
<hyperair> i've had that
<Laney> yes.
<Laney> what's the solution?
<hyperair> see libmediainfo
<Laney> is it to use pkgkde-symbolshelper?
<hyperair> i didn't.
<hyperair> but some people say it helps
<hyperair> i just used regexes
<Laney> uh huh
<hyperair> it works pretty well
<hyperair> Laney: oh and i use the demangled symbols.
<Laney> yes
<hyperair> so it's sometihng like (c++|regex)
<Laney> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/123173455/buildlog_ubuntu-raring-powerpc.webkit_1.10.1-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<Laney> warning it's pretty big, maybe wget at vim it
<Laney> s/at/and/
<hyperair> ugh
<hyperair> trust webkit to be huge in everything
<Laney> shame it's a 3 hour turnaround
<hyperair> ccache should help matters
<hyperair> for local builds
<Laney> probably
<hyperair> Laney: actually i only see one size_t related symbol...
<hyperair> Laney: the rest are valid additions imo
<hyperair> size_t makes me wish it was a real distinct type instead of a typedef.
<Laney> all looks like size_t to me
<Laney> what do you see?
<chrisccoulson> so, i've added autopkgtest support to firefox now: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~chrisccoulson/firefox/firefox-trunk.autopkgtest/files/head:/debian/tests/
<chrisccoulson> is there anything else i need to do to make that run when i upload?
<Sarvatt> XS-Testsuite: autopkgtest in debian/control, unless that packaging is never going to be in debian then that doesn't matter :)
<Sarvatt> oh its already there
<mlankhorst> Sarvatt: what are you doing awake
<mlankhorst> :P
<mlankhorst> end that gaming session already >:D
<chrisccoulson> gah, why do people email me to report bugs?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, because you don't reply to IRC pings :p
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> i get enough email without people mailing me with issues ;)
<chrisccoulson> in this case, the latest upload to the firefox beta PPA completely broke the menubar thanks to a random build-ordering issue
<chrisccoulson> but nobody reported a bug to launchpad
<chrisccoulson> they just emailed me instead
<chrisccoulson> which prevents anybody else from tracking it
<chrisccoulson> ok, i added a comment to the PPA description: https://launchpad.net/~mozillateam/+archive/firefox-next
<chrisccoulson> i wonder if anyone reads that ;)
<Laney> "For questions and bugs with software in this PPA please contact Mozilla Team."
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, that sucks. and i can't change that, can i?
<Laney> not afaik
<chrisccoulson> is that displayed when you do "add-apt-repository"?
<chrisccoulson> ok, it's not. only the custom description is displayed
<Laney> it gives a link to that page
<chrisccoulson> ok, i updated the comment again ;)
<chrisccoulson> "For questions and bugs with software in this PPA please *don't* contact mozillateam."
<Laney> haha
<Laney> rename the team
<Laney> "Mozilla Team â forget what that says"
<Tm_T> Laney: that would be nice
<seb128> Laney, hey, do you plan to do SRU brasero as well?
<seb128> Laney, ignore that, the fix was already srued it seems
<Laney> hmm?
<Laney> I just copied from q-updates to r :-)
<seb128> Laney, oh ok
<seb128> Laney, I got confused, I though you did an upload which reminded me of bug #658004
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 658004 in brasero (Ubuntu) "brasero dvd capacity estimation is broken" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/658004
<Laney> ah, we could probably put that in bzr to pick it up next time
<Laney> i'll do that
<chrisccoulson> now nobody has an excuse not to read our bug reporting guidelines: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MozillaTeam/Bugs
<chrisccoulson> i added a nice little summary at the top ;)
<xclaesse> seb128, I would be very happy if devhelp 3.6.1 can be pushed to quantal. For that fix: http://git.gnome.org/browse/devhelp/commit/?h=gnome-3-6&id=d7506a2eb5ae92136a8e400561d38817784107fb
<xclaesse> the rest is only translations
<seb128> xclaesse, can do
<xclaesse> awesome, thanks :)
<seb128> yw, thanks for pointing it
<mterry> seb128, didrocks: any objections to 'unity-settings-appearance' for the package name for the appearance panel?
<didrocks> mterry: sounds good to me
<seb128> mterry, no strong opinion on the topic, works for me if you like it ... I'm not sure exposing "appearance" there is the best thing
<seb128> compared to e.g -panel
<seb128> but it's just a name and I'm not good at picking those ;-)
<mterry> seb128, you're thinking we'd have one source package for all future panels?
<seb128> if we have different unity panel why not ... which I don't think we plan to
<seb128> but yeah, no need to have one source for each panel imho
<mterry> seb128, hmm, then if we're doing a bucket package, I'd favor just "unity-settings"  (panel is too techy in my mind -- the name is never exposed to users(
<seb128> mterry, that name would mislead users to think that's an ui to configure unity
<seb128> keep the one you first suggested
<jbicha> Privacy uses activity-log-manager-control-center which isn't the most intuitive
<seb128> gnome-control-center-unity
<seb128> to follow the gnome-control-center-signon leads ;-)
<mterry> jbicha, that name is awful  :)
<mterry> seb128, if there's precedent, that's fine
<mterry> jbicha, though I guess gnome-control-center-unity isn't much better
<seb128> mterry, dpkg -l gnome-control-center-signon
<seb128> why is "picking a name" always that hard ;-)
<mterry> seb128, it's important!  anyone that doesn't think so can go stand with tedg
<kenvandine> :-D
<larsu> it's an extension for gnome-control-center, so shouldn't it start with "gnome-control-center-"?
<mterry> larsu, that's a fine point of view, but I was thinking its defining feature was that it was the settings for unity, and being a g-c-c panel was an implementation detail that might change in 20 years
<tedg> mterry, It's easy, you just try a few and the first one that gets kenvandine to drop off IRC you use.
<kenvandine> hehe
<jbicha> g-c-c-unity is a bit ambiguous; it's possible that the designers will decide on a different panel besides Appearance in the future
<mterry> jbicha, right, and then we wouldn't have to change the name.  feature, not bug, eh?
<seb128> jbicha, why would -unity confuse anyone if they rename appearance?
<larsu> mterry, right, in that case I'm for your first suggestion, without the -appearance suffix
<seb128> larsu, unity-settings?
<larsu> seb128, ya
<seb128> isn't that going to mislead users to think that's a configuration ui
<larsu> isn't it?
<seb128> ?
<jbicha> what if there's a new panel called Unity, and Ubuntu still wants to have a separate Appearance panel to set the wallpaper
<mterry> seb128, there is  :)  g-c-c
<larsu> seb128, I thought that's exactly what it is
<mterry> jbicha, that unity panel would be part of this package
<seb128> jbicha, we set we would batch all the unity panels (if there is ever extra ones) in that source
<mterry> jbicha, we're talking about having a package that will house any future panels
<seb128> we said*
<jbicha> how about ubuntu-control-center? ;)
<larsu> jbicha wins the internet!
<seb128> that would mislead people to think it's our "fork of upstream g-c-c"
<jbicha> seb128: it sort of isâ¦
<seb128> it's only one panel
<mterry> OK, I'm going with gnome-control-center-unity
<seb128> mterry, \o/
<mterry> jbicha, another reason I don't like ubuntu-control-center is that this is unity-specific, not ubuntu-specific.  I like to reserve ubuntu for project-wide things if possible
<mterry> jbicha, btw, did you see that I made separate deja-dup backends, so you can only seed the ones you want to in gnome3
<jbicha> mterry: yes thank you :)
 * didrocks waves good evening
<qengho> Oh, sweet, learned that sys.executable (which Chromium uses in build tools) can be the empty string sometimes. So much fun.
<qengho> Worked around it. So glad it's EOW.
<LLStarks> how do i reset gnome? my g-c-c settings won't unlock unless i use gksu. can't change themes or make my clock am/pm.
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-11-17
<Chucrute301> Hi putative nerds good night :D
<Chucrute301> Hi puta merda good night porra :D
<Chucrute301>  
<BigWhale> Good Morning.
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-11-18
<jbicha> gnome-photos is disappointing, mostly because it's so similar to gnome-documents which I also find disappointing
<desrt> jbicha: libgd!
<EXORCIST> FUCK
<EXORCIST> MY UBUNTU IS SLOW AS FUCK
<EXORCIST> ANYONE
<EXORCIST> HELP THIS UBUNTU
<EXORCIST> ?
<Nafallo> !op
<ubot2> Help! Channel emergency! (ONLY use this trigger in emergencies) - elky, Madpilot, tritium, Nalioth, tonyyarusso, PriceChild, Amaranth, jrib, Myrtti, mneptok, Pici,  jpds,  gnomefreak, bazhang, jussi, Flannel, ikonia, maco, h00k, IdleOne, bkerensa, nhandler or Jordan_U!
<EXORCIST> !ops
<ubot2> Help! Channel emergency! (ONLY use this trigger in emergencies) - elky, Madpilot, tritium, Nalioth, tonyyarusso, PriceChild, Amaranth, jrib, Myrtti, mneptok, Pici,  jpds,  gnomefreak, bazhang, jussi, Flannel, ikonia, maco, h00k, IdleOne, bkerensa, nhandler or Jordan_U!
<Amaranth> PM'ed him to see inform him where to go for help if he is willing to calm down
<Laney> think he got klined
<Laney> was happening in several channels
<Amaranth> Seemed like it
<Nafallo> Amaranth: he started a rage in ~7-8 channels...
<Amaranth> Oh, fun
<Laney> time to move on
<mlankhorst> that's fast
<doomlord> anyone heard of a windowmanager or anything on linux which can swap desktops per monitor independantly
<Chucrute301> Hi guys
<Chucrute301> Smspillaz
<Chucrute301> The xsync on nvidia will be more efficient on 9.9.0?!?
<Chucrute301> Compiz 0.9.9
<Chucrute301> *
<Chucrute301> :)
<Chucrute301> Hi Mark Shuttleworth
<Chucrute301> :D
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-11-11
<Laney> hey ho
<pitti> hey Laney, had a good we?
<Laney> hey pitti, was nice thanks
<Laney> made beer & wine & mead, all fermenting away now
<Laney> you?
<pitti> yummy
<pitti> we had some friends visiting, and spent much time walking, talking, playing badminton and Wizard :)
<larsu> morning guys
 * Laney googles wizard
<pitti> hey larsu, how are you?
<Laney> hey larsu, how goes?
<Laney> ha
<larsu> haha
<pitti> Laney: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wizard_%28card_game%29
<larsu> pitti, Laney: good, thanks! And you?
 * larsu feels efficient
<pitti> larsu: very well, thanks
<Laney> remembering that I left before the weekend having made a patch which crashes AS
<Laney> and not wanting to look at it any more :P
<larsu> is that why I had problems logging in this morning?
<Laney> no sir
<Laney> it didn't leave my computer yet
<larsu> hm, must've been something else then
<larsu> it worked after upgrading from a vt
<Laney> eww
<Laney> check lightdm / upstart logs
<larsu> "Failed during authentication"
<larsu> that's all lightdm had to say about that
<larsu> in a debug message, no less
<Laney> tseliot: hey, could you push screen-resolution-extra to bzr please?
<tseliot> Laney: I maintain it in git
<tseliot> Laney: I thought I had pushed it though. I can do that if you want
<Laney> Please fix Vcs-Bzr then
<tseliot> Laney: let me check
<tseliot> Laney: done
<tseliot> Laney: and thanks for making me notice ;)
<Laney> tseliot: thanks to you!
<Laney> What I was going to do is to put the change I uploaded over the weekend into bzr
<tseliot> Laney: oh, what change is it?
<Laney> I guess I can't push to the git repository, so if you could do that
<Laney> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/156207976/screen-resolution-extra_0.16_0.16ubuntu1.diff.gz
<tseliot> Laney: oh, no wonder my upload was rejected. Let me fix that
<Laney> :-)
<Laney> I tried to push it back but found that bzr was out of date
<Laney> and then here we are
<tseliot> oh, I see
<tseliot> Laney: it should all be fixed now. Thanks again
<Laney> cool, cheers
<pitti> desrt: hey Ryan, how are you? enjoyed your holidays?
<desrt> what holidays? :)
<pitti> desrt: I thought you took some days off after the sprint?
<desrt> ah.  just a couple of swap days
<desrt> one for travel and one for a missed holiday
<pitti> desrt: not sure whether you saw the recent updates on bug 1184262
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1184262 in systemd-shim (Ubuntu Trusty) "[logind] times out too early, stuck in PrepareForSleep, causing network and other services to not resume" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1184262
<desrt> didn't see it
<pitti> desrt: we need to find out how to change the timeout in -shim to not apply during method calls
<pitti> desrt: as soon as a suspend/resume takes longer than 10s, the GTimeout hits, and the PrepareForSleep False signal is never sent
<pitti> desrt: I put an experimental version into my PPA which bumps it to 10mins, which helps for most people
<pitti> but not for longer sleep cycles
<desrt> pitti: did you want to take over systemd-shim maintainership? ;)
<pitti> desrt: because of the PPA version? that was mostly to understand/confirm what the problem is
<desrt> (at this point, you have a far far greater understanding of this stuff than i do)
 * desrt really just wanted working timedated :)
<larsu> lol. "I have this problem with your software. Can you help me fix it?" -- "Do you want to instead maintain the software forever?"
<larsu> hi desrt! ;)
<Laney> haha
<Laney> patches welcome-ng
<larsu> :D
<pitti> desrt: if you want to give me commit rights, I wouldn't mind
<desrt> pitti: this is absolutely what i want :)
<desrt> pitti: also: you could just fork the project and host it elsewhere
<pitti> desrt: as for that actual bug, can you "suspend" a GTimeout source somehow?
<desrt> pitti: so that it follows real time instead of monotonic time?
<pitti> desrt: or should shim_method_call() just delete the source at the beginning, and re-create it at the end?
<desrt> ah ya.  there is no way to reset it, if that's what you mean
<desrt> other than destroy/create
<pitti> we need to replace the returns with some "goto out", but *shrug*
<pitti> desrt: destroy/creat seems safest indeed
<pitti> desrt: ok, I'll look into that
<pitti> desrt: where is the upstream git?
<desrt> github/desrt/systemd-shim
<desrt> which is why i thought that maybe you like to fork it
<desrt> i'm happy to add your git account as a committer in any case
<desrt> (if you have one on github)
<pitti> yeah, better to have one trunk IMHO
<desrt> i'd probably take mine offline if you forked it :p
<pitti> desrt: c'est moi: https://github.com/martinpitt
<desrt> k.  you're "collaborator" on the project now
<desrt> which i think means that you can push
<pitti> desrt: ack, thanks
<desrt> pitti: i'm happy to look at the patch for sanity on the timeout-use side if you explain to me what it is you're trying to do on the d-bus side :)
<dpm> hi seb128, how are you?
<Sweetsha1k> Heya seb128!
 * Sweetsha1k almost has a LO 4.2.0~alpha1 build on trusty done (plus a 4.1.3 in the PPA to be SRUed ~next week).
<seb128> dpm, Sweetsha1k: sort of yeah, today is a national holiday, just hanging around but not working (e.g better to wait tomorrow if you have stuff you want me to do)
<dpm> seb128, it can wait until tomorrow, enjoy your day off!
<pitti> desrt: I added a reproducer to the bug, I now get the issue myself; WDYT about http://paste.ubuntu.com/6400271/ ?
<pitti> desrt: that fixes it for me
<seb128> dpm, yw ... you can still ask, I'm a bit curious of what you need (I might just tell you to ping me again tomorrow then ;-)
<dpm> hahaha
<desrt> pitti: oh.  this.
<desrt> pitti: so i already had a weaker form of this...
<pitti> desrt: yes, disabling the timeout after shutdown
<desrt> pitti: did you see that the poweroff job permanently disabled the inactivity timeout?  your patch will probably have a weird interaction there.
<dpm> seb128, it's about moving sessions in the schedule. I've sorted it out by now, but it'd be good if we could swap tracks for the "Push notifications" and "Music app 14.04 development". I can do it myself for the music session, but I've got no permissions on the client track -> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-1311/2013-11-21/display
<pitti> desrt: that flag is checked in exit_on_inactivity(), not in activity_timeout()
<pitti> desrt: so while I could check in_shutdown in activity_timeout() as well, we shouldn't really have to?
<desrt> pitti: evil :)
<desrt> i was lazy....
<pitti> desrt: but poweroff isn't one long method call
<pitti> while calling pm-suspend seems to be
<seb128> dpm, done
<desrt> pitti: i have a greater understanding of the problem after seeing this patch now.  thanks :)
<dpm> awesome, thanks seb128 :)
<seb128> dpm, yw
<pitti> dpm: it's pretty much the minimum change; we can certainly arrange for moving teh in_shutdown check, i. e. if (enable && !in_shutdown)
<pitti> sorry, desrt ^
<dpm> np :)
<pitti> desrt: BTW, we recently got bug 1211514, so something there is still wrong, too :/
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1211514 in systemd (Ubuntu) "Shutdowns fail to finish if laptop lid is closed before completely shutdown" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1211514
<pitti> desrt: (but that sounds unrelated; we need to disable logind's suspend during shutdown)
<pitti> desrt: so if that patch seems ok to you, I'd look into that bug next, and release 4
<desrt> pitti: so the patch is simple and inelegant
<desrt> which fits nicely with systemd-shim's entire existence :p
<pitti> lol
<pitti> desrt: inelegant> agreed
<desrt> the only thing i'd consider changing is upping the complexity for favour of a bit more elegance:
<desrt> when we get a method invocation in, do use_count++
<desrt> then hook up a weak ref handler to do use_count--
<desrt> and don't exit when we have a positive use_count
<pitti> desrt: ref handler? not just count-- on method exit?
<desrt> pitti: that's where all your goto is coming from...
<desrt> also: this patch is kinda bogus, actually....
<desrt> so everything in systemd-shim is synchronous
<desrt> which is why your patch works at all
<desrt> but since that's the case, it means that the mainloop isn't running at all while any method is being handled
<desrt> so it's impossible for a timeout to occur in the middle of a method call
<pitti> yeah, I don't fully understandt this either; I'd expect the method return to be done before the main loop gets back and runs the timeout
<pitti> but demonstrably it does
<desrt> what's happening is surely this:
<desrt> the method call reply gets sent to the dbus worker thread
<desrt> the main thread hits the timeout
<desrt> and the program quits before the worker thread has a chance to send the message
<pitti> yes
<desrt> so we could fix this a couple of ways
<pitti> we have the while(1) g_main_context_iteration in main
<desrt> just move had_activity() to the bottom
<desrt> (keeping your gotos)
<desrt> ie: reset the timer as of when the method call stopped, not started
<desrt> and/or: flush the bus before we quit
<desrt> to make sure the reply gets out properly
<pitti> desrt: but we still need to explicitly stop it at the top, no?
<desrt> no
<desrt> the mainloop isn't running anymore, so the timeout can't possibly fire
<pitti> otherwise a timeout set by the previous call could hit in the middle of the next call
<pitti> but it would have the same race with the main loop after return as right now?
<desrt> no... because we'd always reset the timeout just before returning
<Sweetsha1k> seb128: nothing urgent here, have fun celebrating that mantle slicing weirdness!
<desrt> it really depends on your definition of inactivity timeout... in any case we should definitely be flushing the bus before we return
<desrt> this is a full-on bug right now, no matter how you consider it
<pitti> desrt: ah, I see
<desrt> that race is the source of this problem -- even if all calls were handled instantly (or if we rescheduled at the bottom instead of the top), there would still be a theoretical race there in case that sending the message took longer than 10 seconds
<pitti> desrt: how do you flush the dbus?
<pitti> desrt: sorry, phone, bbl
<desrt> that theoretical race would "never" happen of course, because 10 seconds to send a message?  seriously?
<desrt> but we should still close it
<desrt> pitti: i'll do a patch
<desrt> the flushing alone should make the bug go away but we might want to do your patch anyway (or a simplified version) to tweak our definition of 'inactivity' to be more sensible
<pitti> re
<desrt> pitti: okay.  i have a patch now.
<desrt> http://ur1.ca/g0kc0
<pitti> desrt: oh, I see
<desrt> even with your patch we should do this one
<pitti> desrt: yes, I agree
<pitti> desrt: so your's to never lose the reply, and mine to avoid immediately exiting after a (long) method call
<desrt> because the race is still there (although it would only occur if the worker thread took >10 seconds to be scheduled for some bizarre reason)
<desrt> pitti: we should do both
<pitti> desrt: yes, as I said, I agree :)
<desrt> pitti: i leave it to you to decide how you want your patch to look
<seb128> desrt, pitti: the "suspend if closing the lid for shutdown" ... I think desrt had a tentative patch for that, but it dropped from my list and I didn't upload to to distro, the commit is the current one in his git though
<pitti> desrt: but then with the modification to only set had_activity() at the bottom in success:
<desrt> descheduling at the top is strictly pointless
<desrt> because the loop isn't running
<pitti> seb128: oh, I had assumed we had that already
<seb128> desrt, pitti: though it seems like you guys are doing extra fixing there, I'm just mentioning it in case it's useful
<seb128> pitti, no we don't, I was supposed to test and backport and that slipped through :/
<pitti> seb128: thanks, but that's a different bug; I was goin to look into this one, too
<desrt> seb128: after these two patches it's worth a new upload for sure
<desrt> probably even an SRU
<seb128> pitti, I can easily reproduce the suspend on shutdown bug, I can try the patch later
<seb128> desrt, right
<pitti> seb128: yes, me too
<pitti> desrt: absolutely an SRU
<pitti> I can do the trusty and saucy uploads
<desrt> pitti: okay.  i pushed mine.  should i rework yours or do you want to do it?
<pitti> desrt: hang on, rebasing/redoing/testing
<desrt> pitti: (thanks, btw, for writing the patch in the first place -- for some reason i absolutely could not understand the problem as it was being presented to me in english... seeing the code helped)
<pitti> desrt: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6400402/
<desrt> pitti: did you type 'make'?
<desrt> @@ -51,7 +51,10 @@ had_activity (void)
<meetingology> desrt: Error: "@" is not a valid command.
<desrt> +  had_activity (TRUE);
<pitti> desrt: no, not yet; I was going to ask "is that approach what you had in mind"
<desrt> pitti: yes.  that looks fine to me.
<pitti> ah, forgot to fix the last call, erk
<desrt> except setting the timeout to 0 is pointless
<desrt> since you unconditionally reset it again just below
<desrt> +      inactivity_timeout = 0;
<desrt> +    }
<desrt>  
<desrt>    inactivity_timeout = g_timeout_add (10000, exit_on_inactivity, NULL);
<pitti> ah right
<pitti> desrt: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6400417/
<pitti> (with cleanup)
<desrt> looks good
<pitti> actualy, "before we can send
<pitti> the reply."
<pitti> isn't true any more after your patch
<desrt> true.
<pitti> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6400421/
<desrt> looks good to me.  please push.
<pitti> done
<pitti> desrt: thanks!
<desrt> assuming you didn't miss any 'return;'s in that function :)
<pitti> desrt: yes, I searched :
<desrt> this was a very silly bug
<pitti> desrt: I'll look into the suspend-during-shutdown bug now
<desrt> i'm surprised it existed for so long.  i should have known better.
<desrt> pitti: that one is already fixed
<desrt> https://github.com/desrt/systemd-shim/commit/6c65a11321fc102cacd4a9cc2189f74bb1c89ca5
<desrt> pitti: seb128 just didn't get around to packaging the fix yet
<pitti> desrt: so we already disable suspend if in_shutdown is true?
<desrt> pitti: yes.
<pitti> ah, I see it now
<desrt> the problem with the code in ubuntu today is that we disabled suspend using a global variable
<pitti> desrt: ok, verifying and then let's do a 4 release
<desrt> and if the inactivity timer hit during long shutdowns then systemd-shim would exit and when reactivated, that variable would be back to its default value and suspend would be allowed again
<pitti> desrt: right, I see src/power-unit.c:64 now which would do the trick (and understand that patch to fix it)
<desrt> (this inactivity timeout thing sure does seem to be causing us a lot of annoying difficulties.....)
<desrt> i wonder how much memory systemd-shim uses by running anyway...
<desrt> if we get any more bugs about inactivity timeout then maybe we should just let it run forever :p
<pitti> VmRSS:    2492 kB
<desrt> that includes libraries...
<desrt> writable is more interesting but it doesn't tell the whole story either
<pitti> oh, does it?
<pitti> VmData:  147708 kB
<pitti> not very useful
<desrt> !
<desrt> maybe vmrss doesn't include libraries after all?
<desrt> ~2.5MB looks largely consistent with the size of glib+gio... but what of libc?
<pitti> that's just residential memory AFAIK, I thought VmLib would include the libs
<desrt> maybe they tweak it these days
<pitti> anyway, need to AFK for a bit for testing the other fix
<desrt> k.  thanks for dealing with this.
<seb128> desrt, pitti: once you are done debugging systemd stuff, can I convince one of you to look at gnome-keyring 3.10 build hanging the buildds? ;-) (seems to be gnome-keyring-daemon not exiting when dbus activated, the test suite let on of those behind and the buildds wait for ever for the process to exit)
<seb128> well "not exiting", "not exiting when the bus it's using is going away" (which happens after the tests)
<pitti> seb128, desrt: I still get suspend during shutdown on lid close even with latest trunk
<seb128> :-(
<desrt> pitti: >:|
<pitti> and everything happens within 10 s, so it's not the timeout issue
<desrt> pitti: that's simply not possible
<desrt> try again :)
<pitti> the issue that desrt's patch fixes is certainly real as well, though
<seb128> I'm not really surprised because the "press shutdown -> close lid" time is usually under the 10s for me
<pitti> I wonder if it shuts down through some API other than logind
<desrt> pitti: maybe some other component in the system is issuing the suspend/shutdown commands?
<desrt> ya.  exactly.
<desrt> because reading the code, it's very very simple, and what you are describing is impossible
<pitti> shutdown with just the laptop is almost instant, but it always takes some 15 s for me while it's docked
<pitti> desrt: yes, I know; and yet it happens
<desrt> pitti: it's because someone is shutting (or suspending) via something other than the shim
<pitti> I don't have consolekit installed, so it's not that
<desrt> pmutils!!
<pitti> doesn't do shutdown
 * pitti wonders if we still have some suid/polkit helper in gnome-session
<seb128> pitti, weird, iirc the syslog logs suggested that shutdown was happening through systemd here
<pitti> desrt: the suspend on lid close during shutdown is logind's internal behaviour
<pitti> at that time there's no session running any more
<desrt> right... but it asks systemd to do the work
<pitti> I'll try a few more times, with G_DBUS logging
<ricotz> Sweetsha1k, oh, i didnt copy them to 4-1
<pitti> desrt: followed up to bug 1211514 with a log
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1211514 in systemd-shim (Ubuntu Trusty) "Shutdowns fail to finish if laptop lid is closed before completely shutdown" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1211514
<pitti> desrt: anyway, running out of time for today; could we do a 4 release so that I can start the SRU, and I continue on this tomorrow?
<desrt> pitti: sure.  i'm fairly certain that this problem is not inside of systemd-shim
<pitti> desrt: I guess that's not more than NEWS, tag, distcheck?
<pitti> desrt: yes, need to look at what the indicator does, etc.
<desrt> unless it's one of those "we're not returning the correct version code so someone takes a fallback path" sort of things
<pitti> desrt: I don't see any shutdown.target etc. in the log
<desrt> pitti: i'll do the release today
<pitti> desrt: ok, thanks; I'll package it tomorrow then, and do the SRU
<desrt> pitti: enjoy your evening.  thanks for the patch!
<seb128> desrt, pitti: thanks ;-)
<pitti> and you, good night!
<seb128> pitti, night!
 * desrt tries hard not to say anything on #systems
<seb128> desrt, ;-)
<larsu> desrt: ;) thanks anyway
<Sweetsha1k> ricotz: heh, that was easy to fix then ;)
<mfisch> for an experiment is there a good way to disable bamfdaemon?
<mfisch> nm, I found the dbus service file, I'll disable that
<desrt> pitti: systemd-shim is 'released'
<mfisch> robert_ancell: ping
<robert_ancell> mfisch, hello
<mfisch> robert_ancell: hey, we have a thin client demo (of all things!) and shutdown/restart is not working from the greeter
<mfisch> robert_ancell: I'm out of ideas to debug. From what I can tell its trying to use the libpower.so from gnome-settings-daemon?
<robert_ancell> mfisch, what does 'loginctl list-sessions' say?
<mfisch> let me fire up my other VM
<robert_ancell> mfisch, it's just contacting logind via dbus to do shutdown/restart
<robert_ancell> you contact upower for suspend/restart (yes, it's confusing with the split between the two services)
<robert_ancell> mfisch, ultimately it's up to logind to decide if there's anything blocking shutdown, and then it checks policykit policy
<mfisch> does it log anywhere?
<robert_ancell> mfisch, not that I know of
<mfisch> I dont seem to have loginctl installed
<robert_ancell> mfisch, ps aux | grep logind?
<mfisch> this is in precise if that matters
<robert_ancell> mfisch, ah, then it's console kit doing it there
<robert_ancell> so check ck-list-sessions
<mfisch> okay I see lightdm and my console session
<mfisch> let me kill my console session and install openssh-server
<robert_ancell> so the console session will stop the greeter from being shutdown
<mfisch> yeah I figured
<mfisch> but not ssh?
<robert_ancell> because the greeter is not running a policy kit agent to prompt for the admin password
<robert_ancell> ssh will also block shutdown
<mfisch> I see lightdm is listed as ACTIVE: false so that shouldn't block
<mfisch> and it worked
<robert_ancell> mfisch, it will, because it's still open
<robert_ancell> active just means "in focus"
<mfisch> okay so I closed my console session and it works.
<mfisch> I always have a console open to work on this
<mfisch> I wonder if the guest sessions I'm using are not being cleaned up in some cases, I'll check that too
<robert_ancell> mfisch, if you want to modify this edit /usr/share/polkit-1/actions/org.freedesktop.consolekit.policy
<robert_ancell> change the "auth_admin_keep" to "yes" in "org.freedesktop.consolekit.system.stop-multiple-users" and "org.freedesktop.consolekit.system.restart-multiple-users"
<robert_ancell> or something like that
<mfisch> that will let it work no matter what
<mfisch> ok
<robert_ancell> yes
<mfisch> its working now and so I suspect it was my console
<mfisch> although the guy who reported it should not have been using a console
<robert_ancell> yeah, I'm trying to fix that now for trusty
<mfisch> okay I see the setting, so I can override this if needed too
<mfisch> thanks robert_ancell
<ochosi> robert_ancell: hi
<robert_ancell> ochosi, hello
<ochosi> you might've read it anyway, but we release light-locker 1.1.0 yesterday/today
<ochosi> and i have a question wrt a new feature we implemented
<ochosi> (time-based locking, works with X11's screensaver extension)
<robert_ancell> ok
<ochosi> after the screen blanks, the user gets redirected to the greeter
<ochosi> so the screen wakes up again
<ochosi> i'm currently considering to make the greeter force the screensaver to keep the screen blank if the is_locker option is set
<ochosi> do you think this is a good/adviseable route to go?
<ochosi> what i want is to 1) reduce the flickering when locking the screen (stupid VTs!) and 2) make light-locker function as a screensaver-replacement
<ochosi> (without adding an actual screensaver)
<ochosi> and as i heard some folks in ubuntu are considering light-locker too, i thought this might be an interesting issue for you too (despite all the phone-focussedness)
<ochosi> robert_ancell: anyway, let me know if you still get a chance to reply, i'll read the backlog ^
<robert_ancell> ochosi, sorry, I didn't see you'd continued there
<robert_ancell> reading
<ochosi> no worries, it was intended as a kinda ping ;)
<robert_ancell> ochosi, yeah, I think blanking the screen on the greeter when locking probably makes sense. That should match what the session does
<ochosi> robert_ancell: ok, good to know! any plans on how to reduce the flickering on VT switches?
<ochosi> or: any other plans
<robert_ancell> ochosi, there is a plan for the session (greeter in this case) to be able to notify lightdm when it's ready which should mean when the VT switch is performed the greeter is already drawn correctly
<robert_ancell> other than that it's up to the drivers to switch correctly
<ochosi> robert_ancell: ok, that sounds nice!
<ochosi> robert_ancell: thanks for the answer and the heads up
<robert_ancell> no problem, thanks for the light-locker work!
<ochosi> robert_ancell: well, i hate xscreensaver and gnome-screensaver is getting too tightly integrated lately, so it's my own itch i'm scratching ;)
<ochosi> (don't get me wrong, i love how safe xscreensaver is, but i hate how it looks)
<ochosi> also kinda looking forward to seeing what direction ubuntu will take on the locking
<robert_ancell> ochosi, we're really waiting for the Mir stuff to hit desktop, then we can more reliably switch to the greeter instead of using VTs
<robert_ancell> I know the Unity 7 team were looking at putting the lock into the shell, since it's easier to grab input there
<ochosi> robert_ancell: that makes sense. i guess in that case you don't need another locker (cause light-locker is mainly there to tackle the VT-issue)
<robert_ancell> ochosi, yeah. They're running light-locker now and it works great though!
<ochosi> robert_ancell: oh, well, other than the fallback-session, right? that would still have to do vt-switching
<ochosi> cool! that's very nice to hear
<robert_ancell> ochosi, yeah, things like fallback are a pain. I'm not sure if we can cover all the cases before Mir hits the desktop
<robert_ancell> ochosi, it's annoying because for most people the experience is much better, but for the edge cases it can be worse
<ochosi> robert_ancell: well making light-locker a dependency of XMir shouldn't be too hard ;)
<ochosi> yeah, true that
<ochosi> having an nvidia card, i'm part of the edge cases group...
<ochosi> (only tried XMir though)
<robert_ancell> yes, nvidia is a big one
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-11-12
<ochosi> robert_ancell: not sure you know this, but despite my warnings, lubuntu is currently (13.10) using lightdm-only to "lock" their session...
<robert_ancell> ochosi, oh, what were the warnings?
<ochosi> robert_ancell: "you can easily access a 'locked' session with ctrl+alt+f7 if you don't use something to actually *lock* your session"
<ochosi> the typical issue
<robert_ancell> right
<ochosi> they ignored it and thought lightdm is enough
<ochosi> hope they pick up some solution for the lts
<robert_ancell> ochosi, they're running nothing in-session to do the locking?
<ochosi> nope
<robert_ancell> hmm
<ochosi> i was wondering whether a "warning label" on lightdm would help against these cases
<robert_ancell> ochosi, was there a reason why they didn't use light-locker? Perhaps because it wasn't in the archive
<robert_ancell> ochosi, where would you put the warning?
<ochosi> robert_ancell: well, yes, it wasn't in the archive by the time. but it would've been ready in time
<robert_ancell> in the non-existent docs? /me feels bad
<ochosi> robert_ancell: phu, not sure where to put the warning. maybe in the docs/help that mention the locking? :D
<robert_ancell> I must write a manual
<ochosi> yeah, that should be fine
<ochosi> there's also some api docs iirc, you could put it there as a note
<ochosi> (not really the right place, but better than nothing)
<ochosi> btw, kudos on how many fixes you backported to older lightdm versions lately!
<robert_ancell> Been trying to keep them fresh. Thanks for noticing!
<ochosi> robert_ancell: actually, does that plan you mentioned earlier (the session/greeter sending a signal to lightdm that it's ready to be displayed/VT-switched to) not a bit obsolete with Mir?
<ochosi> oops, language-fail :)
<ochosi> s/does/is/
<robert_ancell> ochosi, I'm not sure - the compositor notifies lightdm when each session sends the first frame which is a lot closer. That may not necessarily mean the session is ready though
<robert_ancell> ochosi, the main problem is there's not a good comms channel for a session to notify the daemon and no sessions in general have a good hook to tell when they think they're ready
<robert_ancell> we tried this ages ago with xsplash in Ubuntu and it sort of worked by hooking into gnome-session
<ochosi> robert_ancell: right, true that. we're also hoping to make the transition from the greeter to the desktop a bit smoother in 14.04 (right now things just pop up on the screen one after the other...)
<ochosi> (in xubuntu, that is)
<robert_ancell> ochosi, right - to do that you need to run the session in a new X server and VT switch to it. We're not doing that currently due to the VT switch problems
<robert_ancell> then the greeter could show a spinner and switch once the session is ready which would be nice
<ochosi> robert_ancell: yeah, these sort of things would be nice if VT switching were entirely unproblematic...
<pitti> Good morning
<mlankhorst> morning
<Laney> greetings
<larsu> Laney: good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<sil2100> Morning! :)
<didrocks> hey guys :)
 * pitti grouphugs Laney, seb128, sil2100, and didrocks
<pitti> #u-desktop comes to life \o/
 * didrocks hugs pitti
 * seb128 grouphugs pitti&co back
<Laney> \o/
<didrocks> pitti: well, here for some hours, just quiet catching up :)
<ogra_> very holbachy in here today :)
<pitti> yeah, just in time for dholbach to get back from India :)
 * didrocks adds the adjective to his vocabulary
<seb128> ogra_, speaking of which, I see that Daniel is back online ;-)
<ogra_> yeah
<pitti> it just takes a while to ride on an elephant from India to Berlin :)
<ogra_> probably very badly jetlagged
<ogra_> pitti, ah, did he fly elephant class ?
<Laney> seb128: can you bounce me that email about folks?
<Laney> I think I deleted it by mistake Â¬_Â¬
<Laney> WAIT, I found it
<seb128> Laney, I'm going to reply, I had eds 3.10 on my week TODO
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/~laney/+archive/gnome-transition/
<seb128> shrug
<Laney> that's a start
<seb128> Laney, good that you almost lost that email and pointed that ppa in return
<Laney> didn't do e-d-s stuff though really, mainly goa
 * seb128 does like dupping work
<Laney> I was going to reply, thought I already said about it last week
<seb128> I didn't record the info it seems ;-)
<seb128> do you still do webkit? how did the armhf build go?
<Laney> yeah it all spidered out of that, don't remember the exact path
<Laney> armhf worked
<darkxst> webkit is a mess on the ppa builders atleast
<Laney> it's a three way webkitgtk + gnome-online-accounts + e-d-s thing
<darkxst> we havent been able to get a amd64 build to succeed in weeks
<Laney> darkxst: sad, luckily I have access to a PPA which builds on the real builders
<Laney> feel free to copy the webkitgtk out of the one I just linked if you need it
<seb128> darkxst, is webkit incompatible in some way?
<seb128> ups
<seb128> Laney, ^
<Laney> don't think so, it just adds webkit2 packages
<Laney> they renamed the source to follow upstream
<seb128> ok
<seb128> so it's not linked to goa/eds updates?
<Laney> let me remember
<seb128> it would be nice to get it out of the way first
<seb128> the new evo needs it
<Laney> Perhaps it was the other way
<seb128> so it's probably a pre-required
<Laney> like one of those made me upgrade webkit
<seb128> right
<seb128> that makes sense
<seb128> which is one of the reasons I want it "out of the way"
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> I'll look at uploading that next
<seb128> thanks
 * seb128 is looking at GTK 3.10 (thanks larsu for dealing with the update) this week
<Laney> if you want to do some e-d-s stuff then you can copy things from that PPA or make one which deps on it
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I didn't start on it, but I guess from the comment/ppa that there are some soname changes :/
<Laney> or add it to a chroot or whatever
<Laney> of course
<larsu> seb128: I hope to have it ready for you today
<Laney> g-o-a too but the only source change I found was in g-c-c which I already patched in there
<larsu> depending on how much work the theming stuff will be
<seb128> larsu, once the menu and scrollbar issues are fixed we can push to the ppa for more testing I think
<larsu> cool
<seb128> Laney, I'm pondering dropping goa support from a bunch of stuff, but that wouldn't be popular with the GNOME remix I think
<Laney> certainly not
<seb128> Laney, well, we can argue that uoa is what provide online accounts in Ubuntu, the same way that upstart is what provides you an init...
<seb128> Laney, reality is that we need to make eds stop depending on webkitgtk because that brings a GNOME stack on Ubuntu Touch, and I failed to due that because of goa, not sure what to do next
<seb128> Laney, we could dual build 2 version of e-d-s and make them conflict, but that sucks as well...
<Laney> actually it might be possible to split goa
<Laney> all of the eds stuff depends on libgoa-1.0.so.0 which is not the one which depends on webkitgtk
<seb128> oh, I didn't look at the goa side, thanks for the suggestion
 * Laney will look into that
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> js> print("Hello darkxst");
<Laney> Hello darkxst
<seb128> Laney, python> python -c 'print("Hello Laney")'?
 * seb128 tries to guess the game
<Laney> js breakage on ppc
<seb128> oh
<seb128> larsu, I found another bug with the new GTK...
<larsu> shoot!
<seb128> larsu, update-manager, the list of packages doesn't resize to match the windows
<seb128> larsu, http://ubuntuone.com/6mUJidrQNJEuBjWP80bc8L
<seb128> larsu, if I downgrade to 3.8 it works as it should, e.g no shrinked list
<larsu> "oops something broke while generating thi page"
<larsu> I'll try to reproduce here
<seb128> larsu, retry, it was still uploading
<seb128> it's working now
<larsu> same problem
<seb128> k
<larsu> ah, now! took a few times
<larsu> I can reproduce. Thanks for letting me know!
<seb128> yw, thanks for working on those issues!
<Laney> darkxst: I lost your non-fatal-ppc patch - do you have it?
<darkxst> seb128, seems to just be a ppa builder issue
<darkxst> it builds fine on debian atleast
<darkxst> Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~darkxst/ubuntu/trusty/gjs/1.38.1-2
<Laney> ta
<darkxst> Laney, the "imports" stuff is gjs specific
<Laney> yeah, saw
<seb128> shrug, ports.u.c is sloooow
 * seb128 tries to install build-depends on his nexus for an hour
<seb128> it keeps hanging
<darkxst> Laney, the gnome guys only have one ppc machine left and that is used for building packages
<darkxst> ^well only one that still works
<aslan> HI, I have problem with grub the issue is I cant see the grub menu at the time of booting even after giving the grub timeout
<aslan> in grub.cfg
<seb128> aslan, hey, try #ubuntu for user questions
<aslan> seb128, ya I will
<aslan>  thankyou
<dednick> didrocks: any status update for landing ubuntu-settings-components?
<didrocks> dednick: we are relying on having the infra back
<dednick> didrocks: ok. thought it might be.
<didrocks> dednick: if you look at the ubuntu phone image, the CI guys are still working on it
<didrocks> ML*
 * didrocks autotypes image now :)
<didrocks> dednick: as soon it's in, I'll get that landed
<dednick> didrocks: cool. thanks
<ogra_> as long as it doesnt turn *all* words into image thats fine :)
<didrocks> yw ;)
<Laney> but an image is worth 1000 words
<didrocks> ogra_: did you image the image for the image thing?
<ogra_> image image image, image image ?
<didrocks> image is the new smurfs
<didrocks> ;)
<ogra_> :)
<seb128> didrocks, green is the new blue?
<didrocks> in a jenkins sense, yeah! :)
<ogra_> image !
<didrocks> ahah
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> what team should we subscribe to package bugs?
<seb128> Laney, desktop-bug
<seb128> s
<Laney> ah
<Laney> seb128: you look like the owner there - can you subscribe it to libwebp?
<Laney> bug #1186553
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1186553 in libwebp (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libwebp" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1186553
<seb128> Laney, done
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libwebp/+subscriptions
<Laney> merci
<seb128> de rien ;-)
<Laney> lunch time
<Laney> we can fiddle the archive for webkit â webkitgtk after that
<seb128> great! enjoy lunch ;-)
<didrocks> tjaalton: yeah, I will look at them probably tomorrow
<tjaalton> didrocks: thanks
<didrocks> yw :)
<tjaalton> :)
<seb128> bah, writing that email took we a solid 1h
<seb128> we->me
<seb128> (keyboard layouts handling for the LTS just sent to ubuntu-devel@)
<seb128> let's see if anyone is wanting to read that much text :/
<pitti> seb128: very nice mail!
<Laney> speed reader
<seb128> pitti, thanks ;-)
<davmor2> seb128: I've seen how fast you type, that's not an email it's a novel ;)
<seb128> pitti, do you have any opinion on the topic ?(out of "just make it work" ;-)
<seb128> lol
<happyaron> reading
<pitti> seb128: I haven't read it in that detail yet (just back from giving lighting talk, and debugging systemd-shim now); but I'll read it tomorrow in the train when I have some quiet time to think about it
<seb128> pitti, thanks ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, that should have been a blog post :)
<kenvandine> seb128, i guess ubuntu-devel is your blog
<kenvandine> :-p
 * happyaron would like to vote for reverting the behavior.
<seb128> kenvandine, lol, I don't know enough about the topic to blog ;-) and I'm interested in technical feedback/a decision, so the dev mailing list makes sense
<seb128> happyaron, because you liked the old UI/design better? or because you think we are going to still have bugs at the LTS time?
<Laney> should try to keep it on list
<larsu> I bet attente has an opinion :D
<Laney> ooh
 * Laney writes summary
<Laney> weekly summary, nothing to do with keyboards :-)
<seb128> larsu, I'm sure his opinion his "I wish I could go back one cycle and *not* take on this topic"
<happyaron> seb128: I think UI is less important than functions at this point, since old UI isn't way too bad :)
<happyaron> seb128: reverting to the old way would at least don't cause regression for those upgrading from previous LTS.
<seb128> happyaron, what is missing in the UI infrastructure (assuming we resolve we flackyness in the key handling and the grabbing issues)?
<larsu> seb128: I don't know. I think it's an awesome thing to work on. Just a bit ... complex
<seb128> larsu, yeah...
<happyaron> seb128: user cannot access settings of every IM now
<happyaron> lemme find the bug for you...
<seb128> happyaron, how did they access those before? (e.g ibus is still there and should be working no?)
<happyaron> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ibus/+bug/1188509
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1188509 in indicator-keyboard (Ubuntu) "Embedded in menu doesn't work in IBus indicator" [High,Triaged]
<seb128> happyaron, or is that because users used to access the ibus settings through the ibus keybinding, but the new system made them go through g-s-d which doesn't handle those options?
<seb128> happyaron, oh, it's an indicator lack-of-feature it seems
<happyaron> seb128: there are two kind of settings, one is for ibus (the framework), the other is for IM (like ibus-pinyin). For the second one, it's usually accessed from the embedded in menu
<happyaron> yeah
<seb128> I guess gnome-shell do expose pinyin settings from their indicator?
<happyaron> yes
<seb128> happyaron, how are things working on Kylin today? do they have indicator-keyboard and a fcitx indicator? what about keybindings?
<happyaron> seb128: fcitx and most of it's UIs support indicator directly, so no indicator-keyboard needed.
<desrt> pitti: good morning
<happyaron> seb128: keybindings are handled directly by fcitx
<seb128> happyaron, I see, the fcitx stuff is another argument for having layouts and IMs decoupled
<seb128> though it seems, from what you say, that Kylin doesn't need a layout indicator
<happyaron> yes
<seb128> qengho, Sweetshark, mlankhorst, Laney, tkamppeter_, desrt, attente, larsu: hey, it's meeting time
<desrt> pitti: you seem to have contradictory reports in your logs
<desrt> the indicator sends the request to systemd-shim but systemd-shim never receives such a request?
<seb128> qengho, Sweetshark, mlankhorst, Laney, tkamppeter_, desrt, attente, larsu: hey hey hey
<Laney> hello
<Sweetshark> seb128:o/
<seb128> better ;-)
<Laney> happyaron is here too, let him join in ;-)
<happyaron> :)
<seb128> let's get started (/me wonders if that's DST confusing people)
<seb128> happyaron, yeah, feel free to join the meetings if you want (we usually don't list people who are in tz where it's not a decent time)
<seb128> qengho, hey
<qengho> - fixed a few bugs in chromium. handed source packages to #security.
<happyaron> seb128: thanks, :)
<qengho> - getting an early start on Cr 32.
<qengho> EOF
<Laney> did the chromium autopkgtest get fixed in this one?
<seb128> qengho, thanks (good to see that chromium issues dropped from the most frequent issues, out a fglrx one)
<qengho> seb128, work calendar has this an hour later. maybe adjust it h to know if timezone.
<qengho> of
<qengho> phone keyboard.
 * seb128 looks at calendar
<seb128> qengho, what about autopkgtests? (thanks Laney for asking ;-)
<qengho> seb, new packages fix those.
<seb128> great
<seb128> qengho, thanks
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey
<qengho> thanks Laney
<Sweetshark> LibreOffice Hackfest Freiburg, finished with a bad case of ubuflu
<Sweetshark> did some LibreOffice dev mentoring with Marcos and Jose, two brazilian guests in Hamburg (sponsored by TDF)
<Sweetshark> LibreOffice 4.1.3 ppa with some more vendor patching (empty label on quicklist)
<Sweetshark> LibreOffice 4.2.0alpha1 tagged upstream and building (with some caveats) on trusty right now: https://launchpad.net/~bjoern-michaelsen/+archive/libreoffice-staging
<Sweetshark> got some requests wrt LibreOffice without Java, dunno exactly what to make of it
<Sweetshark> some mindless lp bugwrangling
<Sweetshark> stated candidacy for TDF board again: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Candidacy-for-a-BoD-seat-Bjoern-Michaelsen-tp4082608.html
<Sweetshark> EOF
<larsu> Sweetshark: ubuflu at a libreoffice hackfest? Shouldn't it be libreflu?
 * desrt votes bjÃ¶rn!
<Laney> free as in flu
<larsu> ha
<larsu> Sweetshark: in any case: get well soon!
<seb128> Sweetshark, no toolchain issue on trusty? how boring!
<Sweetshark> larsu: Im just fighting down remaining pockets of resistence ...
<Sweetshark> seb128: there will be toolchain fun. there always is. maybe those changes are not in yet ;)
<Laney> gute besserung
<Sweetshark> seb128: also Im cutting some corners with the alpha release.
<seb128> ok
<seb128> that one is targeted at the ppa only right?
<Sweetshark> seb128: yes
<seb128> ok, good
<seb128> let me know when you need sponsoring for the SRU
<seb128> oh, and get some rest until you feels better!
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
<seb128> mlankhorst, hey
<Sweetshark> seb128: last beta/4.2.0rc2 would be first for the archive IMHO ...
<seb128> right, we discussed that during the rally, agreed
<mlankhorst> hey
<mlankhorst> oh I missed the earlier ping? :P
<mlankhorst> getting some graphics patches upstream for this merge window
<mlankhorst> glamor-egl sru's, libdrm sru
<mlankhorst> working on android syncpoints, converting fence api to be compatible with it
<mlankhorst> eod :P
<mlankhorst> (last one is more kernel work, getting my own stuff upstreamed)
<seb128> mlankhorst, thanks
<seb128> Laney, hey
<mlankhorst> android had their own sync mechanisms, and by using my sync mechanism as a backend for android the dupes are removed
<Laney> hallo
<Laney> â¢ Patch pilot; some nagging about sponsor queue. Down to 52 now, well done all!
<Laney> â¢ Fix gdk-pixbuf FTBFS caused by missing some environment when running make check.
<Laney> â¢ Look at webkitgtk / e-d-s / g-o-a updates/transitions.
<Laney> â g-c-c requires a patch for new g-o-a; backported from upstream and modified to work on our g-c-c.
<Laney> â g-o-a transition is otherwise fine
<Laney> â e-d-s transition needs staging still
<Laney> â webkitgtk good to upload, doing that imminently
<Laney> â¢ Misc fixes for upgrade failures: screen-resolution-extra redshift
<Laney> â¢ Work on AS patch for vendor extension overrides.
<Laney> â¢ Some attempts at debugging gjs on powerpc, not entirely successful but provided some information to upstream.
<Laney> EOF
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<seb128> no tkamppeter?
<seb128> ok, let's move to the next one
<seb128> desrt, hey ;-)
<desrt> that's me!
<desrt> so mostly i listened to a lot of lisa loeb
<desrt> but... i also got some work done
<desrt> the desktop file efficency changes (for the unindexed case) landed, along with the search API
<desrt> and i've started reviews on the gcleanup branch that i started a while ago and stef picked up recently... that looks like it will land in the coming weeks -- basically it's a way of giving glib (and glib-based libraries) an easy way to clean up after themselves on exit
<larsu> \o/
<desrt> that's nice for valgrind-friendly reasons, but it will also let us use a counting allocation checking cheme (+1 for malloc, -1 for free) and assert on exit if they're not equal
<desrt> we'd do this from testcases, for example, so we can type 'make check' and get failures on any leak anywhere
<desrt> there are a lot of tricky issues there, though
<desrt> aside from that, i did a bunch of releases yesterday (systemd-shim, glib unstable, glib stable, dconf)
<desrt> that's about it
<desrt> uh... eof, i mean
<seb128> ;-)
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Merged CUPS-only foomatic-rip from GSoC project into cups-filters, making cups-filters the new upstream home for it.
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Cleaned up foomatic-rip code eliminating warnings, sharing colord support with gstoraster, fixing small bugs.
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Several bug fixes and clean-ups.
<tkamppeter> - CUPS SRU for Saucy to get lpadmin -m to work.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<seb128> new glib/dconf, we should probably get going on those at some point, we maybe let's clear some of the "start of the cycle" backlog first
<seb128> Laney, ^ agreed?
<seb128> like end of the month seems good to me (once we get webkit/eds/gtk in)
<desrt> seb128: new glib is a party... dconf is very very boring... the only change of consequence there was to support a glib change
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<Laney> mmm, yeah
<desrt> (the new "is this key set?" API that was requested by robert_ancell and didrocks for some time now)
<Laney> need to fix the build failures in debian before we can go to a new series really
<Laney> so would be uploading to ubuntu only
<desrt> Laney: i was planning to take a look there today
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<Laney> neat
<desrt> Laney: i'll poke you after the meeting
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<seb128> attente, hey
<Laney> there's also https://buildd.debian.org/status/fetch.php?pkg=glib2.0&arch=armel&ver=2.38.1-2&stamp=1383832557 a different failure on arm that happens some of the time only
<attente> hi seb128
<attente> just working on the input switcher
<seb128> attente, how is the compiz grabber issue going? still stucked on this one?
<attente> i uploaded a ppa, but there's one problem that prevents it from being usable
<seb128> what's the issue?
<attente> seb128, i wouldn't hesitate to advertise the ppa if only for this one issue being fixed
<desrt> Laney: damn testcases always failing on weird architectures... i almost think we should just get rid of the test suite...
<Laney> make -k check || true
<attente> when you log into unity, it always starts with the shortcuts set to super+space and shift+super+space, and doesn't read it from gsettings until it's changed
<seb128> attente, oh, so you found the other issues where you were getting the wrong event? what was it?
<attente> seb128, yeah, the other problem is a non-issue any more
<seb128> great
<attente> it was that compiz only cycled through CompOptions for checking key events
<attente> so even if you create an action and add it so that compiz can do the grab
<attente> if you're doing that manually, compiz still won't forward the events unless it's attached to a plugin option
<attente> seb128, feel free to try to ppa out
<attente> it's just that one issue i'm working on now
<attente> https://launchpad.net/~attente/+archive/modifier-only-input-switch
<seb128> attente, well done on fixing that one, I'm going to try the ppa, seems like that the dynamic update shouldn't be a stopper to play with it
<seb128> attente, thanks
<attente> seb128, it would probably frustrate users to always have to set it every time they log back in
<seb128> attente, oh, are you subscribed to ubuntu-devel@ list? I just send a (long) email there to summarize the keyboard changes, the issues, and what to do for the LTS
<desrt> 'stop shipping compiz' ;)
<attente> seb128, i saw that, but didn't read it in detail yet
<seb128> attente, right, it's probably not user friendly, but for debug testing it seems it should do the job
<seb128> desrt, gnome-shell has some of the same issues...
<attente> seb128, thanks for starting that discussion though :)
<larsu> desrt: be nice.
<seb128> attente, yw ;-)
<desrt> seb128: window managers are trouble, i'm telling you...
<seb128> desrt, xkb is the issue there
<seb128> desrt, https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=55585#c0 is the issue I'm most concerned about
<ubot2> Freedesktop bug 55585 in UI "Should check all XKB group indexes when matching key events for accelerators and mnemonics" [Normal,Resolved: duplicate]
<cyphermox> seb128: yo, I tried all I could with the ejabberd bug, but I can't reproduce the fix
<cyphermox> seb128: I'm going to try a few more minutes, but so far no luck :(
<seb128> cyphermox, hey, ok, thanks ... can you comment on the bug saying that?
<happyaron> except Kylin-related stuff, I went over almost all bugs of ibus on LP and did some triaging work, and borrow what desrt said, "input methods are touble"...
<cyphermox> yeah
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks for trying
<seb128> attente, thanks
<seb128> larsu, hey ;-)
<larsu> hi!
<larsu> - prepared and tested gtk 3.10 to be ready for prime time (updating patches and fixing the new test suite to work in tree); it's coming along nicely with only a few minor bugs left to fix
<larsu> - fixed a couple of bugs in ido, indicator-{network,messages,appmenu}, and notify-osd
<larsu> eof
<larsu> short one :)
<seb128> desrt, (not specifically only libreoffice, but eclipse and who-know-what-other-apps have the same issue and I'm not even sure they are all opensource/stuff we can fix)
<desrt> larsu: didn't see that gtk action_namespace bug yet...
<larsu> desrt: pings, meetings
<desrt> fair enough :)
<seb128> larsu, thanks, I'm waiting for the next GTK update round (hopping that gives me my menus back :p)
<larsu> desrt: I'll try to get it out before leaving
<larsu> seb128: I already have a patch for i-appmenu to fix that. It's been a ping-happy two hours
<larsu> and I have a meeting right now :)
<seb128> happyaron, did you want to do a status update with us? ;-)
<desrt> larsu: if it's really going to take too long, just commit it.... but make sure you have a good message, and stable-release backport it
<desrt> the code is obviously-incorrect as stands...
<happyaron> seb128: already said a bit, :) "except Kylin-related stuff, I went over almost all bugs of ibus on LP and did some triaging work, and borrow what desrt said, "input methods are touble"..."
<larsu> desrt: I'll file a bug
<seb128> happyaron, oh, right, thanks! ;-)
<desrt> larsu: thanks
<seb128> my turn
<seb128> * continued on desktop merges/syncs for trusty (libzip, opencc, curl, gnome-keyring)
<seb128> * some desktop updates (gdk-pixbuf, fontconfig, freetype, dbus, file-roller, evince)
<seb128> * some bug fixes and SRUs
<seb128> * looked a bit to autopilot tests for ubuntu-system-settings, they are having issues due to the new autopilot version, trying to get that merged in this week
<seb128> * spent some time thinking about keyboard layout/IMs and what to do next, wrote detailed email to ubuntu-devel@
<seb128> * reviewed GTK 3.10 update from larsu (some packaging nitpicks but it was mostly good), thanks Lars for the work!
<seb128> * tested a bit GTK, reported some issues that need to be addressed before ppa upload
<seb128> * continued looking at errors.ubuntu.com top issues and nagging maintainers about their bugs
<seb128> </week>
<seb128> ok
<desrt> seb128: thanks for the nags :)
<seb128> so, any question/comments/...?
<desrt> (none this week, but in general...)
<seb128> desrt, yw ;-)
 * happyaron is not quite familiar with this kind of status update on IRC, cuz we use phone conference call previously...
<seb128> desrt, speaking of nag, did you see my gnome-keyring one to you/pitti yesterday?
<desrt> happyaron: irc meeting is best meeting
<desrt> seb128: ya.  i hoped pitti would look at it :)
<desrt> what was the link again?
<seb128> desrt, hehe ;-)
 * desrt wanted to sort these ppc failures today
<happyaron> desrt: /me is trying to get familiar with doing updates on IRC from now, :)
<desrt> happyaron: are you new on the team, or...?
<seb128> desrt, I didn't give a link, basically gnome-keyring build never finish because the gnome-keyring-daemon spawned by the testsuit doesn't exit when the bus goes away
<desrt> seb128: some weird test-dbus interaction?
<seb128> desrt, stefw said it's a known issue and he would welcome a patch for it (to make the daemon exit when the bug goes away)
<desrt> dbustestrunner, whatever
<seb128> bug->bus
<happyaron> desrt: I joint 3months, but most of my work is for Kylin project, and we have status update meeting at that side already. But also good to do another one here, though.
<seb128> desrt, bz 708765
<desrt> happyaron: i guess you're attente's natural enemy :)
<desrt> seb128: thanks
<seb128> desrt, thank you for maybe looking at it ;-)
<happyaron> desrt: why? ;-)
<happyaron> for the keyboard related stuff?
<desrt> opposing input method frameworks
<happyaron> haha
<desrt> seb128: maybe you're welcome :)
 * desrt conducts a very important experiment
<desrt> FOILED
<desrt> (my excessively long headphone cord is not long enough to allow me to reach the coffee pot in the next room)
<happyaron> desrt: call with your phone app, and you can move around with wifi, :)
<desrt> seb128: i hate you
<seb128> desrt, did you found that gnome-keyring's bug is a glib issue or what? ;-)
<desrt> no
<desrt> i found that it's using eggdbus
<seb128> eggdbus
<seb128> lol
<larsu> what's that?
<seb128> I didn't even know that was a think
<larsu> do I want o know?
<seb128> thing
<desrt> it's not really
<desrt> it's just common copy/paste code to handle the mainloop integration between libdbus-1 and glib
<desrt> for the most part it's using libdbus-1 API directly
<Laney> ooh, that sounds like a hairy yak
 * desrt will _not_ rewrite against gdbus
 * desrt will _not_ rewrite against gdbus
 * desrt will _not_ rewrite against gdbus
<seb128> lol
<mlankhorst> desrt->override();
<Laney> mterry: please could you re-check over https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libwebp/+bug/1186553 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1186553 in libwebp (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libwebp" [Undecided,New]
<mlankhorst> works in movies! Now rewrite against gdbus. :P
<desrt> so uh.  i think i'm done
<mterry> Laney, ah an easy one!  :)
<Laney> \o/
<mterry> Laney, I like it when past-me does all the work
<Laney> unless you mean â Opinion
<Laney> :P
<mterry> heh
<desrt> seb128: so uh... how would i go about testing such a patch?
<desrt> 'cause it's a one-liner
<cyphermox> seb128: of course, because I suddenly stop being an idiot it finally works
<seb128> desrt, if you give it to me I can throw it to the builder
<desrt> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=708765
<seb128> cyphermox, ;-)
<ubot2> Gnome bug 708765 in general "D-Bus-activated keyring-daemon remains even when its bus terminates" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<desrt> https://bug708765.bugzilla-attachments.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=259673
<seb128> desrt, the bug description suggests that Stef only wants that behaviour in the case where it's dbus activated though, your patch would always make it exit?
<seb128> or is that a different codepath in the source?
<desrt> why would we want it to persist when explicitly started?
<seb128> well, I guess he has a reason, maybe better to ask him
<desrt> oh.  i see.
<desrt> ya. i'll get on that
<seb128> thanks
<desrt> meanwhile, if you could test the patch anyway...
<desrt> ie: to find out if this mechanism even works
<larsu> desrt: greyback will forward you some question from tvoss (from a mailing list) regarding the desktop file cache
<larsu> desrt: just to let you know ;)
<desrt> k
<Laney> pitti: looks like you forgot to push rhythmbox
<Laney> seb128: webkitgtk is up
<seb128> Laney, \o/
<Laney> for all your NEWing pleasure
<pitti> Laney: how do you mean? there's no Vcs-Bzr
<seb128> Laney, NEWed, let's the buildds have some fun ;-)
<seb128> jdstrand, hey, I want to update telepathy-mission-control-5 to the current stable serie (5.16) ... is that something you started on/are interested doing (I guess not)? if not, how do you usually test that the apparmor profile needs tweak? just running empathy&co and checking that everything work/the logs have no DENY?
<Laney> pitti: oh, maybe I dropped it by error?
<pitti> Laney: I didn't really look, as often packages get synced, and then UDDed, etc.
<Laney> mmm
<Laney> nm, will fix
<pitti> Laney: I'll import my upload
<pitti> Laney: ^ done
<pitti> Laney: committed Vcs-Bzr: fix
<Laney> danke!
<Laney> oh, you beat me
<Laney> sorry for dropping it
<pitti> np
<seb128> desrt, hum, patch doesn't seem to make builders happier ... I'm going to need to try to find a machine/setup where I can reproduce I guess
<larsu> seb128: this indicator-appmenu branch makes menus work with 3.10: https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/indicator-appmenu/insert-action-groups-on-menus/+merge/194901
<seb128> larsu, thanks
<larsu> seb128: I'll post a gtk patch to make the indicator-messages problem go away
<seb128> larsu, great
<larsu> didn't end up having time for the theming/scrollbar stuff today, sorry
<seb128> larsu, no worry, I count on that update to be work for the week
<larsu> desrt: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=712164
<ubot2> Gnome bug 712164 in GtkApplication "GtkMenuTracker: set action namespace correctly" [Normal,New]
<desrt> thx.  will review today.
<seb128> larsu, indicator-appmenu.c:548:2: error: 'GtkStock' is deprecated [-Werror=deprecated-declarations]
 * seb128 disables Werror
<desrt> ...
<desrt> didn't we take a '-Wno-error=deprecated-declarations' shotgun to everything already?
<larsu> seb128: see the prerequisite branch
 * larsu ran into the same issue
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> larsu, ignore me, good that I hit that, I autofinger-ed "cd indicator-appmenu; bzr bd"
<seb128> larsu, where I mean to cd insert-...
<larsu> seb128: heh, no problem
<seb128> yeah, working menus!
<larsu> seb128: gotta run now. See you in the morning!
<seb128> larsu, have fun, see you tomorrow ;-)
<larsu> desrt: take your time, I won't need it until tomorrow morning anyway
<desrt> larsu: have a beer for me :)
<larsu> seb128: thanks :)
<larsu> desrt: will do.
<seb128> larsu, don't troll too much :p
 * larsu will be drunk
<seb128> haha
<desrt> oh
<desrt> in that case, don't smoke crack cocaine and get caught on video
<larsu> okay..... I'll try
<desrt> i hear that's sometimes a problem when people get drunk
<larsu> 1 beer for me + 1 beer for desrt = 2 beers --> larsu == drunk
<larsu> desrt: only in Toronto
<desrt> :)
<larsu> that's why I got out of there!
<seb128> desrt, do you see any issue with https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-menus/commit/libmenu/desktop-entries.c?id=7d90221e27fcc72de497f45db4f3ef3c2d623fd6?
<seb128> desrt, just having a random guess at what could create https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=712161 (assuming it's an issue in gnome-menus, I had a look in the commit in 3.6->3.8)
<ubot2> Gnome bug 712161 in libgnome-menu "software-center hits segfault in cached_dir_ref()" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<desrt> seb128: pretty hard to imagine that causing a problem
<seb128> k, thanks
<seb128> oh, the full commit is https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-menus/commit/?h=gnome-3-8&id=7d90221e27fcc72de497f45db4f3ef3c2d623fd6
<seb128> I started from the file where the issue is happening and had a filter on that
<desrt> oh.  fun.
<desrt> the notify part looks suspicious
<seb128> that's where the segfault is happening :p
<desrt> this patch could possibly cause issues, indeed
<desrt> i feel like smacking jasper for writing this
<seb128> desrt, oh, speaking of Jasper, he just suggested in the bug to try to revert that commit ... ;-)
<desrt> ya
<desrt> that's my suggestion too :)
<desrt> there's all kinds of suspicious in this patch
 * seb128 tries that
<desrt> nothing overtly wrong, but a very difficult-to-read change
<desrt> his singleton management strategy is utterly unthreadsafe, as an example
<desrt> in a patch that appears to be attempting to introduce threadsafety
<pitti> desrt: I'm beginning to get a handle on bug 1211514
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1211514 in systemd-shim (Ubuntu Trusty) "Shutdowns fail to finish if laptop lid is closed before completely shutdown" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1211514
<pitti> desrt: so apparently the impossible is possible after all
<desrt> pitti: your log said that we weren't getting the call...
<pitti> desrt: both logs together say that we get both calls
<pitti> desrt: but it seems the first shim (for poweroff) immediately gets terminated again
<pitti> and then the second shim gets started for suspend
<pitti> desrt: I suspect it races with D-BUS shutdown; does the shim listen to d-bus going down and kill itself? or is that our "kill everything on powerdown" script?
<desrt> pitti: if the system dbus went down then we'd not be able to get a second message through
<pitti> well, I'll test both hypotheses
<desrt> but maybe it's the SIGTERM that shutdown sends...
<desrt> that would shut us down indeed
<pitti> desrt: not sure if d-bus would still spawn new services while it's being shut down and it is killing existing services
<pitti> so the "kill -TERM $world" during shutdown is more plausible
<pitti> I'll try with adding that to sendsigs.omit
<desrt> pitti: ya.  i'm pretty sure it's the SIGTERM
<pitti> desrt: my first theory was that logind objects that calling suspend.target doesn't actually fail
<pitti> desrt: but I monkey-patched it to actually send a D-BUS error instead of a (silent) success, that didn't help
 * pitti shelves that, in case it's still relevant after not killing the shim any more
<pitti> oh the joy of (not) being pid 1..
<desrt> :)
<desrt> i heard that having everything in pid 1 is a bad design decision
<desrt> seb128: hey... you know our weird gettext desktop file business?
<pitti> desrt: yeah, Lennart really ought to take the mail server out of it
<didrocks> seb128: do you know if we dropped the patch that desrt has done in gtk for setting alt as a shortcut in g-c-c?
<didrocks> if not, no worry, I'll checkâ¦ one day :)
<desrt> didrocks: we kept it
<didrocks> interestingâ¦ something else regressed it seems
<desrt> didrocks: larsu wanted to drop it yesterday (or get it upstream or fix the situation) and i talked him out of it
<didrocks> I'm sure it's larsu's fault then!
<didrocks> desrt: where is seb128, do you think he's drinking again? :)
<desrt> :)
<pitti> desrt: et voilÃ  !
<desrt> pitti: systemd-shim now on the no-kill list and it works?
<pitti> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6406628/
<pitti> desrt: yes, tested two times
<desrt> ugh.  we have to write our pid there?
<pitti> desrt: that's my current hack, not factored out into a function and using glibc-y calls
<desrt> pitti: also problematic from the standpoint of not erasing the file when we exit
<pitti> I suppose you'd rather want some glib-y/Gio stuff for that?
<desrt> i guess we should only write it just before we call shutdown
<pitti> desrt: we do
<desrt> oh.  unlink.  hi.
<pitti> desrt: second hunk
<desrt> sorry.  missed it :)
<desrt> pitti: i think i'll adjust it to only write just before calling shutdown
<pitti> desrt: anyway, need to run now; we can discuss the finer details tomorrow or so
<desrt> we avoid the write/unlink in the other cases this way
<desrt> pitti: thanks!
<pitti> desrt: yes, indeed
<pitti> as I said, just a first-cut "does this work?" it's not really pretty yet
 * pitti waves good night
<xclaesse> seb128, I've heard that you uploaded the empathy update to fix facebook
<seb128> xclaesse, yeah, the day you pinged me about it
<xclaesse> seb128, but I don't see update coming here... is it stuck somewhere?
<seb128> xclaesse, it's out for some weeks? what serie do you use?
<xclaesse> seb128, argh, forget me, it actually works, had another issue because I was running stuff from master
<xclaesse> nevermind
<seb128> xclaesse, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/empathy/3.8.4-1ubuntu2
<seb128> xclaesse, ok ;-)
<xclaesse> after kill the stuff running in jhbuild, and restart the distro version, all is fine :)
<xclaesse> now it is MSN that does not connect anymore
<xclaesse> SRV connect failed: g-io-error-quark:39 Could not connect to messenger.live.com: Connection refused
<xclaesse> looks like they finally removed their xmpp server for good
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> we should probably drop the UI option for it then...
<seb128> xclaesse, ^ do you what needs to happen for that?
<xclaesse> seb128, on ubuntu that should be enough I think: rm /usr/share/accounts/providers/windows-live.provider
<xclaesse> you probably want to inform the user though
<seb128> kenvandine, ^ should we do/SRU that?
<seb128> xclaesse, right ... do you plan to add something upstream for informing users?
<xclaesse> seb128, maybe we should wait to see if there is an official announce from MS, it could be just temporary failure
<seb128> yeah, let's see
<xclaesse> I don't remember the date they announced months ago
<seb128> though I'm sure they are going to close it at some point
<Laney> If you have a Mac operating system earlier than OSX or a Windows operating system earlier than Windows XP, you won't be able to update to Skype. Messenger will continue to be available on these operating systems until it is discontinued later in 2013.
 * desrt realises the symbolic beauty of the battle between systemd-shim and upstart
<desrt> systemd-shim fires the first shot: i shutdown you!
<desrt> upstart fires back: SIGTERM
<xclaesse> http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/live/en-US/44ad3195-6e7e-4192-95e5-bf5f282eab01/support-for-xmpp-ends-in-october-2013?forum=messengerconnect
<desrt> systemd-shim dies
<desrt> dbus: no!  my friend! *revives*
<desrt> systemd-shim: i'm back!  i will suspend you!
<desrt> *system suspends*
<seb128> desrt, why does it suspend it when being respawned?
<seb128> oh, I guess because the lid get closed and it doesn't have the flag telling him shutdown is happening anymore I guess?
<desrt> yup
<desrt> the SIGTERM from upstart wipes that out
<desrt> and then because it no longer exists, dbus reactivates it
<seb128> is any client trying to use it?
<desrt> ya... when the lid closes, logind sends a message
<desrt> to systemd
<desrt> which restarts the shim, with the flag gone
<desrt> it's really hilarious how complicated such a simple thing is
<desrt> due to the various processes involved
<desrt> and how 'abnormal' things are during shutdown
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> what do you think is the right fix there then?
<desrt> i'm going to do something close to pitti's fix
<desrt> instruct upstart not to kill us
<seb128> can you do that?
<desrt> yup
<desrt> that's this sendsigs.omit.d stuff
<desrt> fwiw, i don't really fully understand why this old unix style of "kill all the things" is still used
<desrt> i guess SIGTERMing world+dog does do two useful things...
<desrt> 1) reduces the use of filesystems allowing unmounts/readonly-remounts
<desrt> 2) gives everyone a chance to save state
<desrt> #1 is a bit silly in the modern day though... we could just explicitly target those processes
<desrt> since we have /proc to tell us...
<sarnold> /proc is racy..
<desrt> sarnold: so is sigterm(*)
<desrt> since soemthing could fork between you getting the list of things to kill and sending the signals
<desrt> so in any case you have to do multiple passes
<sarnold> desrt: which is why kill() and killpg() let you do some selectors themselves.. 0, -1, etc..
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-11-13
<Geo> hi, does anyone know a good code snippet manager on ubuntu ?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, what makes Vala code unreviewable for SRUs?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: The only thing I see is the generated C code, and relatively small changes to the vala code make drastic changes to the C.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, also, prepare for some serious convincing
<robert_ancell> RAOF, Don't you just ignore the .c code?
<RAOF> Do you even ship the vala code?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yes
<RAOF> It's possible that I didn't notice that because the pages and pages of C.
<robert_ancell> yeah, autotools is stupid and likes to ship the .c
<robert_ancell> I did try a hack that mterry came up with to stop it doing that, but it's a bit dodgu
<RAOF> Also, I was predisposed to reject it, as ârewrite feature X to prevent slowness caused by feature Xâ starts from a position of âthat's probably not SRUableâ :)
<robert_ancell> ah, unity-greeter doesn't ship the .c files. I'll copy that for new versions
<RAOF> Yeah, please do so.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, the slowness is critical (i.e. it easily becomes unusable after more than a page or using high res colour pages)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, so the only real option is to disable the autosave or use the new version
<robert_ancell> Given it's not a critical app and it's so broken I opted for the latter
<RAOF> Deleting the file on clean exit doesn't resolve that?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, no, it already does that
<RAOF> Ok.
<RAOF> So now you get to convince me that "all new shiny autosave code" is more appropriate than "disabling autosave" :)
<robert_ancell> Well, it can't be worse than broken autosaving code?
 * robert_ancell can't wait until we don't have to do SRU's anymore
<robert_ancell> RAOF, the main reason I want the new autosave code is it will be a better experience for users
<robert_ancell> And as the upstream, I'm happy to weather any problems that may arise from that
<RAOF> Of course it can be worse than no autosaving code! It can *crash* :)
<robert_ancell> The SANE drivers crash all the time, much more often than simple-scan. Which is why the autosave code is there
<RAOF> What does the autosave do, anyway? I've never hit it (nor the problem, obviously)
<RAOF> Ah, SANE.
<robert_ancell> errors.ubuntu.com shows all the SANE errors
<RAOF> Such a terrible name.
<robert_ancell> The API isn't bad, it's just the awful implementations
<robert_ancell> I found a char[7] code that reads from the *network* and doesn't have any bounds checking in a HP driver
<RAOF> ...!
<robert_ancell> it was getting "HTTP/1." before it crashes. Probably some proxy or something in the middle. It was expecting "n\r\n" where n is an integer
<robert_ancell> RAOF, so, what's it going to be? How many beers will this cost?
<RAOF> Let me have another look at the diff...
<robert_ancell> bbl
<RAOF> I particularly like the way Vala leaks the details of your development directory structure :)
<RAOF> robert_ancell: That's a sizeable chunk of code :/
<robert_ancell> RAOF, the autosaving?
<pitti> Good morning
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, all those u-g branches are good to land - feel free to push whenever you want
<robert_ancell> I thought I'd got u-g setup with Jenkins, but apparently not
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Yeah, the autosaving.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, the delta or the module?
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: ah, cool... thanks for the reviews...
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: I was waiting for jenkins as well, but if it's not the case, should I proceed with manual merge?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: The delta. Well, and the module :)
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, yes, go for manual
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: ok, perfect
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, are you looking after u-g now?
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: ehm, what you mean?
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, I wondered if bregma had assigned it to you or you were just fixing the dialogs :)
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: oh, no.. I did that by myself
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: I think andyrock will work on the locker side
<robert_ancell> ok, cool
<Trevinho> screensaver I mean
<Trevinho> I just saw your initial work and I put some efforts in improving it to match unity..
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, much appreciated! I wasn't sure if I could get all those features in there
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: me neither :) but I wanted to give a try, and see if everything was feasible without much time... and it was :)
<robert_ancell> bye all
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<seb128> oh,pitti is piloting
<pitti> rroooooooarrrrrr!
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> 52 -> 32 so far:)
<seb128> pitti, I unsubscriber sponsors from https://code.launchpad.net/~timchen119/gnome-settings-daemon/gnome-settings-daemon.precise.lp1055874/+merge/194661 yesterday, but it still needs reviewing ... if you feel bored (not sure how well you know that part of the gsd code)
<didrocks> seb128: he's exceeding mac2 at the moment, but still accelerating to mac3 :)
<seb128> (I subscribed sponsors because I started having a look/it seemed a desktopish one)
<didrocks> hey btw!
<seb128> didrocks, good morning, and no I was not drinking, I was doing exercice, and by the time I was back seems like you left to drink :p
<didrocks> seb128: ahah! ;)
<seb128> didrocks, what's the bug btw?
<didrocks> if you go to the g-c-c shorcuts panel
<didrocks> you can't assign alt (alone) to anything anymore
<didrocks> like "to show the HUD"
<Laney> howdy
<seb128> didrocks, I can...
<seb128> didrocks, well, it writes "mod2+alt L" but that works (e.g "alt" opens the HUD)
<didrocks> interesting, latest trusty, right?
<seb128> didrocks, for desktop components, yes
<didrocks> "disabled" hereâ¦
<didrocks> Laney: hey! mind trying assigning alt to a shorcut in g-c-c?
<seb128> Laney, good morning ;-)
<Laney> haha
<Laney> it goes to "disabled"
<Laney> I think you can't have modifiers alone
<Laney> isn't that known?
<seb128> Laney, you can, we have a GTK patch for that case
<Laney> like a known bug
<seb128> and it's working for me
<Laney> seems to be the case here
<seb128> but didrocks has the same issue than you
<Laney> unless it got lost in T?
<seb128> wfm
<Laney> hmm
<seb128> but I'm running GTK 3.10 pre packages atm
<Laney> want to share those?
<Laney> can check if it gets fixed
<seb128> Laney, well ... I've only a local build and it's i386, so don't bother, I'm downgrading GTK to see if that's fixed
<seb128> Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gtk/ubuntugtk310 has the current version if you want to build it yourself
<Laney> ok
<seb128> Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/gtk/3.10/+merge/194619 has some review comments/the list of bugs that need to be fixed before we upload to the ppa for more testing
<darkxst> Laney, should jenkins automatically pick up the autopkgtests? (in gjs)
<seb128> Laney, didrocks: wfm with gtk from trusty, so that's not this one either
<Laney> darkxst: in theory, but it doesn't always work
<Laney> darkxst: oh, that stuff might be down atm?
<Laney> there's QA lab maintenance
<darkxst> well gjs was in -proposed for more than a week, surely it should have picked it up then?
<Laney> mmm
<Laney> jibel: ^^^ is there a problem with adt job creation?
<pitti> Laney: -ENODATACENTER
<Laney> pitti: See darkxst's previous line
<Laney> was around before that was true
<pitti> darkxst: ah, was that the first version to introduce an autopkgtest?
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> ubuntu1 was
<pitti> there's a known bug that the first upload isn't being tested
<pitti> first upload to introduce a test ,that is
<Laney> unrelated: looks like indicator-application libdbusmenu ubuntu-download manager are saucy > trusty
<seb128> bah, something made my xorg unhappy
<seb128> Laney, saucy > trusty, yeah, that's thanks to trusty autolanding not happening anymore for over a week and being blocked on a touch image to be green
<seb128> I was pondering doing a pocket copy of those SRUs
<Laney> mmm
<seb128> but didrocks is going to be unhappy if I do that (or we need to merge the SRU changelog back in trunk which is a pain to do)
<didrocks> seb128: I don't think that you blocked on touch image to be green
<didrocks> are*
<seb128> didrocks, I asked on -ci-eng on monday and somebody told me that there was no landing of things that are not helping the image to be back to green
<didrocks> seb128: that's not what I wrote on the email
<didrocks> but monday is not a week
<seb128> didrocks, can we do a landing of indicator's stack today then?
<didrocks> seb128: is the CI engine back?
<seb128> dunno
<didrocks>  I didn't see any email
<seb128> didrocks, well, my "a week" is based on how long my u-s-s landing ask has been sitting without change in the landing ask table
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, blocked first on autopilot 1.4
<didrocks> seb128: you can thanks the QA team
<didrocks> and then the CI went down
<pitti> didrocks: no, CI isn't back
<didrocks> not fair to blame on other things like "we are blocking for a green image"
<seb128> didrocks, I'm not blaming anyone, but it feels like we are stucked atm to land stuff from the indicator stack in trusty
<didrocks> seb128: right
<didrocks> nothing we can do about it
<didrocks> and clearly not blocked on a green image
<Laney> could copy the packages
<didrocks> is there any urgency to do that?
<didrocks> is it blocking anything?
<didrocks> are you going to merge back with the current info?
<didrocks> exact*
<didrocks> (knowing that the commit numbers don't match)
<seb128> it's blocking high e-u-c-ranked segfaults fix to land
<didrocks> if you can answer to "yes" for all of this, I'm fine
<seb128> no
<seb128> I'm not going to bother merging thing back, I'm just going to let those segfaults in and wait, no big deal
<didrocks> ok then, no need for that discussion in the end :)
<seb128> I just never though we would see a day with SRUs either to get it than uploads to unstable series
<seb128> well, it's very frustrating to let know high visibility segfault in because our processes are so tedious
<didrocks> we should maybe revisit the rule to block to unstable series in those circumstances
<seb128> but yeah, sorry for the ranting
<didrocks> oh come on
<didrocks> don't startâ¦
<didrocks> sigh
<didrocks> ok, back to the meeting that is delayed because of that discussion
<jibel> Laney, hm, first trace of gjs in britney's logs are yesterday, nothing before that day. Has 1.38.1-0ubuntu1 been ever published?
<Laney> jibel: in proposed, didn't migrate to release
<Laney> because of ppc ftbfs
<jibel> Laney, ok
<didrocks> seb128: ev suggests that you talk with him directly about the CI shutdown
<seb128> didrocks, I've no problem with the CI shutdown, it's maintenance and needed, I've a problem with the fact that we can't pocket copy good fixes from saucy-proposed to trusty (at least without having to then do manual merging of changelog hackery)
<Laney> Those fixes are in trunk
<didrocks> seb128: you can ignore if you do the landing yourself the changelog, remember?
<Laney> You should be able to just override the changelog check
<seb128> Laney, right, but we can't land trunk because of the CI (and because there are changes to use upstart for indicator that probably need a bit more thinking/testing for landing)
<didrocks> Laney: you can
<Laney> seb128: I just mean that the copy shouldn't create any work if the fixes are already in trunk
<Laney> because they're not going to be lost
<seb128> Laney, well, last time I did that I got sil2100 and cyphermox pinging me a few hours later to get the changelog of the copy merged back in trunk
<seb128> which is not the end of the world, but it's annoying still
<Laney> right, suggesting we could be more relaxed about that
<didrocks> again, you can ignore the destination if you handle the landing
<didrocks> but seems nobody reads
<didrocks> anyway, continuing doing work, all the MP would have been done by the time we discussed it
<Laney> it's quite hard to have discussions about this if people are touchy
<seb128> Laney, yeah :/
<seb128> didrocks, let's forgot about it and wait for the CI to be back (I don't want to have to handle the next landing of the indicator stack since there is an upstart-job transition in there that I didn't follow)
<didrocks> ok, fine :)
<seb128> ok, let's move on
<seb128> didrocks, sorry about the discussion
<didrocks> seb128: no worry, we'll be better tomorrow with the CI back (I hope :))
<didrocks> seb128: we are trying to still spin images without results to dogfood if something horrible broke
<didrocks> FYI
<didrocks> (which totally destroyed ogra_'s week-end FYI ;))
<Laney> Constructively, it'd make it easy for manual uploads (from the point of view of cu2d) if all uploaders could set some flag saying 'please overwrite this archive upload'
<Laney> which the vanguard / whatever they're called doesn't need to care about
<ogra_> didrocks, not that much though, i shared the pain with rsalveti
<Laney> just happens at the next normal run
<didrocks> Laney: you think the override should be in the upload?
<didrocks> it means that the next commit can revert your fix
<didrocks> ogra_: pairing pain
<didrocks> :)
<Laney> Not necessarily
<ogra_> :)
<diwic> larsu, seb128 hi
<larsu> seb128: so diwic started implementing https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Sound#Handling_unknown_audio_jack_devices
<didrocks> Laney: ok, in CI "new world", this will be accessible by all core dev in the system FYI
<larsu> do you think g-s-d is the best place to have this? (a new plugin?)
<diwic> larsu, at least implementation planning
<seb128> diwic, hey
<didrocks> to tell "please ignore v<foo>"
<larsu> diwic: heh, ya
<Laney> yeah
<didrocks> like the hinting in britney
<Laney> that's what I'm asking for
<larsu> seb128: we were thinking indicator-sound first, bt that can't have a gtk dep anymore
<Laney> so I can do an upload, handle it in trunk, and then flag cu2d to ignroe that
<Laney> ignore the manual upload
<didrocks> Laney: yeah, that's planned in the UI
<Laney> so the pipe is unblocked as it were
<Laney> nice
<Laney> oh poop, webkitgtk migrated
<Laney> without an arm64 build
<diwic> seb128, what larsu said, do you think gnome-settings-daemon would be a good place for a "What did you plugin?"-dialog ?
<seb128> Laney, it's a new package, it never built on that arch
<Laney> yes but it makes binaries on arm64 outdated
<Laney> the old webkit1 ones
<diwic> seb128, and I've been asked to this for our pre-installs, which still ship with 12.04, so an SRU back to 12.04 will probably be necessary
<seb128> didrocks, btw found back the "can't land stuff that don't help the image to be green", that was from ogra
<seb128> nov. 08 14:28:45 <ogra_>        though the current word is, only stuff that improves the image to go gree on the dashboard is allowed to enter
<didrocks> bad bad ogra_ :)
<Laney> that's why I thought it would be stopped
<didrocks> in my email, it was:
<seb128> Laney, ok, dunno about that :/
<Laney> well, it's probably a misunderstanding on my part
<seb128> Laney, did we have webkitgtk ever building on arm64?
<Laney> yes
<didrocks>  Here is what I think we should do:
<didrocks> 1. ubuntu-ui-toolkit should their backward compatibility issue and shipping that (I heard this is already under work)
<didrocks> 2. balloons is going to coordinate the core apps team side (ubuntu-weather-app, ubuntu-terminal, ubuntu-rssreader, ubuntu-filemanager, calendar-app)
<Laney> but now it's more complicated
<didrocks> 3. bfiller is going to get his team fixing notes-app and mediaplayer-app. webbrowser-app will be fixed in image 15.
<didrocks> Please until then, refrain from merging/releasing anything that can impact those component test results. We need to ensure we are progressing quickly.
<didrocks> I don't think the indicators is going to impact ubuntu-ui-toolkit, not those apps
<didrocks> nor*
<ogra_> sorry !
<Laney> the current series looks like it'll fix it though, so I guess we should take that
<didrocks> ogra_: don't make the seb angry! :)
<ogra_> didrocks, it was what i understood from the meeting ...
<Laney> means taking a dev series which isn't the best, checking in #debian-gnome if it's going to be stable
<seb128> Laney, define "current serie", please tell me it's not the GNOME 3.12 one
<Laney> & test building
<ogra_> (though that was before CI went down)
<didrocks> ogra_: I think the written down part will help more ^
<ogra_> k
<seb128> didrocks, ogra_: ok, thanks for clarification
<didrocks> FYI 1 and 3 are done
<didrocks> so, only 2
<didrocks> (and I don't think apart from the toolkit, anything will impact 2)
<seb128> diwic, larsu: sorry, lot of discussions happening here atm, a bit difficult to keep track ... let me think
<diwic> seb128, no worries
<seb128> diwic, larsu: ideally any new code would be though with ubuntu-touch in mind, and g-s-d is not going to be available there ...
<seb128> diwic, larsu: could we get the logic/detection in the indicator and have a separate UI or would that be too complex?
<diwic> seb128, we don't want it on ubuntu touch for the foreseeable future
<diwic> seb128, all phones can successfully distinguish between headphones and headsets AFAIK
<seb128> diwic, why not? (keep in mind that touch is going to be our desktop after the coming LTS, we for sure don't want to regress that feature under unity8?)
<seb128> diwic, touch->unity8 if that helps btw
<larsu> seb128: would that mean that indicator-sound would need to show qml dialogs?
<seb128> diwic, e.g the goal is to make sure new features are made with unity8 sessions in mind, which means either have the choice of the frontend or make easy to replace the GTK bits by Qt ones
<larsu> hm, fair point.
<seb128> larsu, ^ under unity8 it would make sense
<seb128> no?
<seb128> larsu, that's not something we need to focus on for the LTS
<diwic> seb128, I've never even heard of unity8 sessions...seems I have some catching up to do
<seb128> but if we write new code I would rather to have most of it re-usable
<seb128> rather than having to throw it away and rewrite for unity8 in one cycle
<seb128> diwic, larsu: does that make sense?
<larsu> I agree, but not as long as we need to have it running on the current desktop
<larsu> which is what I focussed on when thinking about this
<seb128> right
<larsu> we could have indicator-sound have the logic an hit a name up on the bus that activates an executable which shows the dialog
<seb128> well my point is that it would be nice to do it in a way where the device detection would be in the backend
<larsu> slightly cringeworthy...
<diwic> I think most of the code here is actually dialog layout.
<larsu> seb128: I don't think there's that much detection
<seb128> ok
<diwic> sure, there'll have to be something talking to pulseaudio too, I guess
<larsu> it'll be more or less like "pulse, what kind of device is this? Ah, a shitty one. Show a dialog please"
<seb128> how much work is that stuff?
<larsu> diwic: correct me if I'm wrong^^
<seb128> I would almost recommend doing it in the indicator with a Qt dialog
<seb128> though I would prefer a GTK UI for unity7/the LTS
<diwic> larsu, I think that anything that's not GUI wise can be directly in pulseaudio.
<larsu> I'd be fine with having a separate executable though
<diwic> larsu, so if the dialog is in a separate executable, maybe PA can fire that dialog rather than the indicator?
<larsu> diwic: can it? I'm not too familiar with what you can do on pulse events
<seb128> Laney, do you suggest taking the webkit matching GNOME 3.12? how sure are we that they are not going to make change that imply apps porting?
<Laney> seb128: That's what I asked & pochu pinged kov about
<Laney> Otherwise try to backport the arm64 porting patches which sounds hairy
<diwic> larsu, well, PA modules can fire executables. I just wonder if that executable will have the right environment set etc for doing GUI stuff.
<diwic> larsu, but PA does talk to X11 at least. Maybe that is enough to do GUI stuff as well?
<seb128> Laney, another of those fun situations :/
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> hopefully we get the right answer
<seb128> diwic, larsu: that dialog seems little enough code that it should be easy to redo a qt version next cycle if needed, so do whatever is easier (might be less work to do 2 frontends that to over-engineer it)
<larsu> diwic: should be if it starts anything from inside the session. Is it smart enough to only start the executable when that type of device shows up?
<diwic> larsu, seb128 and then we try to do as much logic as possible in PA, leaving only the dialog layout to the executable
<seb128> +1
<larsu> diwic: I wouldn't like a solution where pulse always starts that binary and the binary would need to find out whether to show the dialog or not. Seems wasteful on machines with proper audio hardware
<larsu> diwic: yeah, that sounds good to me. (To be honest, that's my favorite solution so far)
<diwic> larsu, no; I'll write the PA module so that it only fires the dialog if the dialog should actually be shown
<larsu> diwic: awesome!
<larsu> seb128: I totally agree. It's a window with five buttons and a checkbox
<seb128> seems like a plan then
<seb128> larsu, diwic: thanks ;-)
<diwic> larsu, seb128 and the dialog result would be communicated back by...
<larsu> diwic: couldn't the app just use pulse's api to switch device type?
<diwic> larsu, sure, but then the dialog needs to connect to PA, which makes it more code in that app
<diwic> larsu, I'm thinking maybe one could just communicate back through reading the exit code from the executable
<larsu> diwic: right. I can't think of another clean solution though
<Laney> seb128: btw, I think webkitgtk & webp need promoting to main
<diwic> larsu, or reading stdout/stderr perhaps
<seb128> Laney, oh, right, new source ... I'm on it
<Laney> ty
<larsu> diwic: I recommend against doing that. Is it really that much hassle to connect to pulse?
<larsu> diwic: ad-hoc results on stdout sounds like a debugging nightmare down the line to me
<diwic> larsu, it is a bit of hassle, but overcomable. Could you elaborate on why you think using stdout is bad? Are you afraid something else will output there too?
<larsu> diwic: it sounds less robust to me, because now the pulse module must keep state about that application (to wait for it to return; and handle error cases)
<larsu> ideally, it would just do this over dbus
<larsu> that would also fix the case of me unplugging and replugging the cable while the dialog is up
<larsu> so that we don't show two dialogs
<larsu> (I mean using dbus would solve this)
<seb128> Laney, did you look at merging epiphany-browser (just asking because you did webkit), if not don't worry about it, I started the other day (before noticing it needed the new webkit)
<diwic> larsu, hmm, that's an interesting corner case. In that case the PA module should kill the dialog, in my scenario
<larsu> diwic: in mine, it would simply activate the same name again on the bus, but since the dialog is already running and owning the name, nothing would happen
<Laney> seb128: nope, not yet
<larsu> diwic: I just feel like having state inside the pulse module and this weird interaction between the two might get cumbersome
<seb128> Laney, ok, I'm going to do that one then
<larsu> diwic: in all fairness, you don't have to do it my way. I'm just thinking out loud :)
<diwic> larsu, you'll need to have some state inside the pulse module anyway - because you have the "remember my choice" checkbox, which is an interesting twist
<larsu> diwic: can't that be a dconf key?
<larsu> ah wait, pulse doesn't do dconf I guess?
<larsu> but it must have some way to store configuration, no?
<diwic> larsu, sure, it stores configuration
<larsu> diwic: can that be set by the public API? (i.e., could the dialog set it?)
<diwic> larsu, might require a protocol extension unfortunately - but I might have to do that anyway for sound settings
<larsu> diwic: it occurs to me, if we're separating the logic from the ui anyway, we might as well do it in indicator-sound
<larsu> diwic: it already has a gsettings schema. The dialog could just write into that
<larsu> problem solved
<larsu> the code for the dialog executable could even live inside the same source package
<diwic> larsu, I'm thinking that maybe I should start writing the backend logic and then, in a first iteration, have PA fire up a zenity dialog. In next iteration, replace the zenity dialog with something that looks more like mpt's design. Upstream might even like the zenity version and accept it
<larsu> diwic: sounds good to me :)
<Laney> oh cool, gnome-online-accounts is already split in experimental
<Laney> fatal++
<diwic> larsu, seb128  ok, thanks for the chat. Seems like we come up with a different solution every time we talk about it :-)
<seb128> mvo, hey, how are you?
<Laney> xnox: feel free to mangle imagemagick
<Laney> for webp
<seb128> Laney, ok, so epiphany-browser depwait on arm64 due to webkit not building here ... do you think we should block migration on that? (or should we just delete the old arm64 epiphany-browser binary so it can migrate?)
<Laney> Give me a bit to test build this current webkit
<seb128> ok
<Laney> btw I test built gtk and it hung in the testsuite, was giving errors about unavailable schemas too
<Laney> probably should look at that list of issues before raising things ;-)
<xnox> Laney: \o/
<seb128> Laney, the schemas errors didn't fail the build here and I didn't get the hung
<larsu> Laney: in which test? I thought I had gotten them all...
<Laney> let me see if it saved a log
<xnox> Laney: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/imagemagick/+bug/1117481/comments/3    ... and we moved webp into main =/
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1117481 in imagemagick (Ubuntu) "Imagemagick lacks support for webp" [Undecided,Opinion]
<Laney> haha
<seb128> xnox, hopefully we can move webkitgtk to universe once we have our own bindings...
<xnox> Laney: then again https://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvekey.cgi?keyword=imagemagick is not exactly stellar =)
<xnox> seb128: while webp is in main, I'd take the opportunity.
<Laney> mmm, I don't find many CVEs
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, is there any way you could use your magical powers to see if https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/1200272 is known upstream? I didn't find it in their bugzilla but I've a feeling bugzilla is not the place to check for that
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1200272 in firefox (Ubuntu) "firefox crashed with SIGSEGV" [Medium,Confirmed]
<Laney> don't have a log for gtk, will need to rebuild
<Laney> larsu: http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/gtk+3.0_3.10.2-0ubuntu1~local0_amd64.build
<Laney> large file, don't open it in your browser
<larsu> too late :D
<Laney> heh
<seb128> Laney, what's weird in it?
<Laney> nothing
<Laney> I can't remember why I called that directory weird-things
<Laney> there was probably a good reason at the time
<seb128> heh
<larsu> ah, settings schemas again
<Laney> oh yeah, they are kerrrrrrrrrrrazy
<larsu> I'm guessing my patch simply doesn't install them right
<larsu> I'll will have a more detailed look after lunch
<seb128> larsu, Laney: debian workaround it in debian/rules if we want to copy that
<seb128> they do
<seb128> # So that gsettings can find the (uninstalled) gtk schemas
<seb128> pre-build::
<seb128>         mkdir -p debian/build/glib-2.0/schemas/
<seb128>         cp gtk/org.gtk.* debian/build/glib-2.0/schemas/
<seb128>         glib-compile-schemas debian/build/glib-2.0/schemas/
<seb128> # So that gsettings can find the (uninstalled) gtk schemas
<seb128> export XDG_DATA_DIRS=/usr/share:$(CURDIR)/debian/build
<Laney> oh yeah, it's not a merge, right
<larsu> seb128: ah thanks. I've tried fixing it in the build system: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=711715
<seb128> Laney, I looked at the diff between both though
<ubot2> Gnome bug 711715 in general "gtk object tests: run under local environment" [Normal,New]
<seb128> Laney, pochu went for the workaround and larsu was trying to get those fixed upstream so I was not sure if we should take the rules hacks
<seb128> Laney, ^ see that bug
<seb128> larsu, thanks, I saw it while reviewing your changes the other day ;-)
<Laney> upstream would be ideal indeed
<seb128> larsu, enjoy lunch ;-)
 * seb128 should get something to eat as well
<chrisccoulson> seb128, in a bit. we really should find a resolution for https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=888840 though, so we can just send these back upstream again where people see them
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 888840 in General "Crash reports from Ubuntu builds of Firefox beta are not listed in aggregations" [Normal,New]
<chrisccoulson> i have about zero hours per week to spend on firefox atm ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, :-(
<ogra_> chrisccoulson, just hand it back to asac, managers have all that spare time, y'know ;)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> i don't think asac would like that ;)
<ogra_> hehe
<asac> thx :)
<chrisccoulson> asac, CONGRATULATIONS. You just volunteered to be our new firefox maintainer :)
<seb128> ogra_, well, I've been told asac is going to be active in the MIR review team again, that's a first step I guess ;-)
<seb128> asac, thanks for helping on MIR reviews!
<ogra_> lol
<ogra_> yeah
<chrisccoulson> here's a game. the next person to speak in this channel gets firefox
<sabdfl> hey guys!
 * Laney thinks about doing actions from now on, instead of speaking
<chrisccoulson> lol
 * Laney laughs
 * ogra_ giggles
<Sweetshark> pitti: the great pretender!
 * pitti innocently bats his eyelashes
<Sweetshark> ;)
 * Laney has nick changes off so didn't see that it wasn't real :P
<pitti> Laney: so have I, they are rather unnerving in public channels
<pitti> "joe is now known as joe_at_the_loo", thank you, TMI
<Laney> haha
<Laney> 13/11 13:10:52   44 *: JOINS PARTS QUITS KICKS NICKS
<ogra_> isnt the short form of at_the_loo actually _otp (out to pee) ?
<Laney> a noise free IRC experience, but it does mean that you miss when people impersonate the big boss
<pitti> ogra_: haha
<ogra_> :)
<pitti> TGIF (or actually, it isn't yet!)
<pitti> proxy + NickServ FTW!
<pitti> Laney: it would be much funnier doing that with pinging poettering in #systemd :)
<Laney> :D
<Laney> "Let's talk about job opportunities"
<mlankhorst> Laney: actually i keep parts and kicks enabled, very few people part
<mlankhorst> or get kicked :P
<pitti> weechat has some intelligent mode where it only shows parts/joins of people that recently spoke
<pitti> that filters out almost all the noise, but makes you aware that you are about to reply to someone who just talked and ran
<Laney> clever
 * Laney wonders why panel BDs on e-d-s
<Laney> for the clock applet I guess
<seb128> Laney, likely indeed
<Laney> doing test rebuilds for that now
<Laney> managed to make webkit build fail by running out of memory :|
<asac> seb128: i am not even a core-dev :)
<seb128> asac, https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mir/+members#active has you though
<mlankhorst> it has me too :P
<Laney> http://ubuntuone.com/7NFYjuZl0FCJf8rAr7ZR9R
<seb128> Laney, ;-)
<seb128> asac, ^ problem solved
<pitti> desrt: so, I had to run last night; wrt. the sendsigs.omit stuff, should I just clean up my patch a bit and push, or do you want to rewrite that somehow? I can certainly change it to use g_file_set_contents or something similar, if that's more palatable
<Sweetshark> heh, "I take an old version of a lib, monkey patch it and then inject the binary it on top of a newer version of a 10 million LOC (plus deps) project"  http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Replacing-one-DLL-from-official-build-td4082935.html
<Sweetshark> #whatcouldpossiblygowrong
<Laney> Sweetshark: reminds me of https://github.com/abock/clutter-sharp/commit/3bb49743d89f0a3f8fb4b26208735589a2a2f2a1
<Sweetshark> Laney: heh, nice.
<asac> Laney: omg... did you hit the button for real>?
<asac> ":)
 * ogra_ makes a note to assign a bunch of MIRs  mlankhorst  and asac 
<asac> i dont think he hit the button
<Laney> asac: haha, no
<asac> see
<seb128> Laney, you should do it
<seb128> ;-)
<Laney> we have been expecting an email
<ogra_> seb128, ++
<ogra_> all of ubuntu touch will have to go to main this cycle ... the MIR team definitely needs asac and mlankhorst
<seb128> asac, joke aside, MIR team is understaffed seing the number of touch component that are going to be reviewed, you are sure you don't have free slot to help there?
<ogra_> heh, snap
<seb128> asac, if you don't you are going to hit the issue from a management side and need to find manpower to do reviews before it blocks things for touch
<asac> ogra_: i really cant do it... really. if i do that i will drop the balls on many other things wehere i shouldnt do it
<asac> seb128: who sets the standards for MIR?
 * asac will chat about that with core leads today
<ogra_> a wikipage that was designed over the years
<seb128> asac, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MainInclusionProcess
<ogra_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuMainInclusionRequirements
<asac> well. lets take a step back... the MIR team is basically delegated to commit canonical to support them, correct?
<seb128> ogra_, snap :p
<asac> err
<ogra_> :)
<asac> MIR is a delegate entitled to commit on behalf of canonical that we will support it with our paid engineering force
<asac> or not?
<ogra_> yes
<seb128> asac, well, the MIR team is just made of trusted people doing review to ack that those source are maintainable
<seb128> not sure if that's Canonical supported
<seb128> I though we only supported a subset of main?
<asac> important difference
<asac> i will check with steve/colin today on my call
<mdeslaur> seb128: we support all of main
<seb128> you better talk to slangasek or cjwatson
<seb128> right
<seb128> mdeslaur, what was the archive reorg about then?
<seb128> mdeslaur, do we support everything at the same level?
<asac> mdeslaur: why do we not just auto approve everything that comes from our own engineering teams and rather fight the "quality of code/maintainability" at a different level?
<mdeslaur> seb128: we want to be able to not support everything at the same level
<asac> e.g. imo its wrong to put something in place that does a final review if we want to support software that we have put manyears of development into :)
<pitti> because we at least need to do a check for dependencies in main, and some packaging/security check
<mdeslaur> asac: because the mir process is where we audit the security saneness of code and is where we discover issues
<mdeslaur> asac: also, our stuff tends to pull in massive amounts to dependencies which we don't control
<mdeslaur> asac: so we need to make a decision on those dependencies also
<asac> mdeslaur: yeah. so in general i think it makes sense to have a check for "3rd party software"
<asac> for our software if its just about dependencies, this should be automatically done continuously elsewhere ...
<asac> e.g. before the damage is done
<ogra_> asac, what prevents us from doing bad stuff in non third party SW ?
<mdeslaur> asac: yes, that would be nice :)
<ogra_> even our own packages will have issues that will only be discovered by peer reviews of MIR and security people
<jdstrand> fyi, the archive reorg is still incomplete akaik
<asac> ogra_: nothing, but we have many other places where we should put such quality control in place
<ogra_> asac, it is also about packaging quality etc
<asac> instead of creating this big bottleneck
<asac> every core dev should be able to produce good enough packaging quality, no?
<ogra_> asac, i.e. imagine the unity team wants to be clever and switches the packages to cdbs ...
<mdeslaur> asac: so this is where, in the process, that it's decided that stuff is good enough to officially say we're going to support it
<jdstrand> much of what is requested for main is not core-dev
<asac> ogra_: every packaging change gest reviewd by core-devs
<asac> as part of CI already
<asac> we just have to tell them what rules to apply
<ogra_> asac, and ? being core-dev wont make you errorproof
<mdeslaur> asac: there's no sense in doing a security audit of v 0.0.1 of something when none of that code remains once we hit a version that's ready
<seb128> asac, well, even core dev make errors, that's the same reason we have NEW review before entering the archive
<ogra_> ++
<asac> seb128: sure, but for that we can establish a more scalable peer review system
<seb128> yeah, that would work
<seb128> we need reviews somewhere
<asac> e.g. if you want to go for main, find 1 or two other core devs that +1 your packaging
<ogra_> in fact NEW and MIR are largely the same, just that NEW is a lot looser
<seb128> I don't care much where they happen/how we call the team doing those
<jdstrand> actually, MIR assumes NEW has happened usually
<ogra_> indeed
<ogra_> but their processes are similar
<seb128> asac, well, except that most packagers don't care/are not careful about e.g licenses compatibility
<seb128> asac, we often caught errors in NEW from coredevs there
<jdstrand> NEW deals with suitability for the archive. MIR deals with supportability primarily
<jdstrand> (there is of course overlap)
<asac> for me everything that we have in CI is supportable :)
<ogra_> jdstrand, right, a new review system could offer both though ... just with more stricter rules for MIR
<mdeslaur> asac: oh geez, no :)
<asac> mdeslaur: why not? we have developed it, we will support it
<mdeslaur> asac: you wouldn't believe the security state of dependencies in universe
<jdstrand> but NEW doesn't care about security reviews and testsuites and bug subscribers for example. and MIR isn't looking at licensing unless it is in multiverse or restricted already
<ogra_> asac, what does CI do to prevent code backdoors being introduced ?
<asac> mdeslaur: ok its about new dependencies not in CI
<asac> thats beter and might reduce the set of things that need thorough review
<mdeslaur> asac: again, it's not really the canonical developed stuff that is the usual bottleneck, it's the cascade dependencies
<ogra_> (or code that obviously does silly things)
<asac> ogra_: if people introduce backdoors in our upstream code base we have a bigger problem :)
<ogra_> (which only a security person might recognize)
<asac> and MIR is probably the wrong place to solve that :)
<asac> rather random security audits of random trees
<mdeslaur> wow, it would be nice to have the manpower to do that :)
<ogra_> well, i just want to know what makes CI so much more trustworthy
<jdstrand> asac: backdoors> it is a different problem yes. cause once a MIR is ack'd there are no more security reviews
<asac> right
<asac> lets not mix things up :)
<jdstrand> but, the MIR security audit is valuable
<ogra_> ++
<jdstrand> if done at the right time. it is not hugely valuable if done too early and everything is rewritten in a month
<asac> jdstrand: right. but the value can probably also be created outside a bottleneck :)
<asac> actually should
<jdstrand> we find more security issues in our own stuff than in dependencies needing to move to main tbh
<ogra_> well, watever system you use, you need humans to do the actual audit in the end
<asac> i really what you really want is a scheduling of security audits that happens exactly once
<ogra_> which iis your bottleneck
<asac> doesnt need to be hooked up to the MIR bottleneck
<ogra_> asac, but code changes ...
<mdeslaur> so you want two bottlenecks? :)
<asac> no
<jdstrand> there are two reasons for that: a) because Canonical is on the hook and we have no other upstream help, we look harder and b) the code is newer
<ogra_> so security holes might be introduced later again
<mdeslaur> also, this is the point at which the teams in question have an incentive to fix the issues we find :P
<asac> ogra_: right. hence the MIR security audit thing doesnt really help much. I think the main value is to really look at random code regularly and then educate upstreams about wrong pattenrs etc.
<ogra_> the MIR audit is at least a stop gap so we know when a package enters the supported set it is good
<mdeslaur> asac: I disagree, this is the point at which we software is at a point where it's relatively stable, at which point the security audit is an important part of the process
<ogra_> we should definitely have more and regular audits
<jdstrand> I might also point out that if something is a 'must have' for main, we've said "go ahead, we'll do the security review later, but please address any security concerns if we find them"
<ogra_> but that will require more security staff
<jdstrand> this happened with mir for example. we knew we wanted to take a long look at it
<jdstrand> we should have more regular audits
<asac> jdstrand: rihght. thats more like the model i have ... a decoupled audit
<jdstrand> we can't do it now
<asac> that you can handle with continous flat load
<asac> if you block on this you get those awful peaks
<asac> which you cant measure and hence you cant argue for staffing
<ogra_> but you need to do an audit when it enters supported
<ogra_> or at least one thats tied to the entering
<asac> if everyone agrees that everythging needs to have 1 audit per year and you run that with constant load, then you can easily measure the overload and staff accordingly
<jdstrand> asac: there is a problem with that in the general sense though. if it is already in main, there is less incentive to fix it. I could pull out bugs from various teams that are still open
<mdeslaur> we'll end up supporting something that may have a serious design flaw, and we'll need to support it for 5 years without the major changes required to fix it
<jdstrand> we can't do 1 audit per year
<asac> jdstrand: this again is a separate problem
<jdstrand> there are thousands of packages in main
<ogra_> details :P
<mdeslaur> getting rid of the mir process isn't going to magically fix the mir team staffing issues, it just makes the whole process go away
<ogra_> which wont help the quality
<mdeslaur> then we'll end up shipping stuff with design flaws and major security issues
<mdeslaur> and libraries where upstream has stopped development years ago and which contain security flaws
<mdeslaur> and we'll end up with 15 javascript engines to support :)
<jdstrand> 1219164, 1226569, 1230091, 1236912
<jdstrand> those are from this cycle. I could find more
<jdstrand> I acknowledge there are problems
<asac> let me think a bit
<jdstrand> archive reorg is not done yet and build-deps (ie, non-runtime) are still requiring support
<jdstrand> so there is a ton of effort spent on sorting out build dependencies, when we should only be caring about runtime dependencies
<jdstrand> if we sorted that out, there would be much less wasted time for the developers and the reviewers
<mdeslaur> yes, a large quantity of MIRs are for build depends which aren't important
<mdeslaur> that would definitely lighten the load for the mir team
<jdstrand> I'm hoping that after application/webapps/scopes confinement (ie, anything we ship in the appstore) works on converged, then my team will be able to be more proactive with audits. but that is several cycles away
<jdstrand> I don't know that we have to mandate a certain number of audits a year or anything. I do think a security audit for sensitive things going in to main is useful. every major project we develop that has run across our desks has benefited from that review
<jdstrand> especially because the code is so new
<mdeslaur> it's not as if most get though without changes
<jdstrand> yes-- when they do, it is usually due to an established piece of software that has had years of production use and an active upstream
<mdeslaur> yep
<mdeslaur> one of the criteria to having the process successful is to not have a conflict of interest between the developers wanting the package in main and the team reviewing it
<jdstrand> also, I think if we are seriously considering finishing archive reorg, then we need to weigh the cost of that work and the distraction against the actual pain felt. I'm not sure where the scale will tip to be honest-- there is a lot of development effort spent on sorting out build-dep MIRs or their avoidance
<jdstrand> but the people doing the reorg would not be able to do their important work
<jdstrand> (which is why we are still where we are)
<desrt> pitti: i was going to do it myself but if you want to do it i'd recommend the following:
<desrt> 1) use g_file_set_contents()
<desrt> 2) do it just before the call to shutdown/reboot and don't bother with the unlink
<pitti> desrt: makes sense, yes
<desrt> pitti: so i'm happy to do it, but if you want to, you can :)
<pitti> desrt: might just as well finish this up myself now :)
<pitti> desrt: btw, did you put the 4 tarball anywhere? the debian/watch address disappeared, so I just ran make dist myself
<desrt> pitti: i forgot that i was publishing tarballs before :)
<desrt> i'll do a 5 release after this fix
<desrt> lemme guess; was at ~ryanl?
<pitti> desrt: yes
<desrt> my gnome account got renamed to 'desrt'
<pitti> aah
<desrt> (finally)
<pitti> so let's put the 5 tarball there once that bug gets fixed
<pitti> I'll update debian/copyright and watch next time
<didrocks> jdstrand: btw, if you have critical bugs on components we are upstream for, you can just signal them to me and we can block their release until it's fixed
<didrocks> jdstrand: this will be a good incentive :)
<jdstrand> ack, thanks
<seb128> jdstrand, did you see my ping about telepathy-mission-control yesterday?
<Laney> kenvandine: robru: Just noticed that friends fails to build in trusty :(
<kenvandine> again?
<Laney> kenvandine: http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/friends_0.2.0+14.04.20131108.1-0ubuntu1_amd64-20131113-1343.build.gz
<jdstrand> seb128: I did not
<seb128> 	jdstrand, hey, I want to update telepathy-mission-control-5 to the current stable serie (5.16) ... is that something you started on/are interested doing (I guess not)? if not, how do you usually test that the apparmor profile needs tweak? just running empathy&co and checking that everything work/the logs have no DENY?
<kenvandine> Laney, thanks... i wonder if there are GI changes that broke libaccounts
<Laney> kenvandine: hmm, looks like the build in trusty built against libaccounts-glib (and other things) from the PPA which isn't in T yet
<kenvandine> Â«BUILDDIRÂ»/friends-0.2.0+14.04.20131108.1/friends/utils/authentication.py:39: Warning: Custom constructor for class AgManager returned NULL (which is invalid).  Unable to remove object from construction_objects list, so memory was probably just leaked.  Please use GInitable instead.
<jdstrand> seb128: I've not done a merge on it. If I were, I would just test it in empathy, yes
<seb128> jdstrand, ok, do you want me to steal the merge/update from you? ;-)
<jdstrand> seb128: please feel free- I am behind on merges atm
<seb128> jdstrand, ok, I'm doing that one then, thanks ;-)
<jdstrand> seb128: I'm on trusty already if you want me to help test. thanks!
<seb128> jdstrand, ok, I might give you a ping for a round of testing once I've the update ready, thanks
<Sweetshark> anyone knows by chance if/why/how much debians git hosting is down?
<happyaron> Sweetshark: http://lists.debian.org/debian-infrastructure-announce/2013/11/msg00001.html
<seb128> hum
<seb128> Laney, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/156496401/buildlog_ubuntu-trusty-i386.empathy_3.8.5-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<seb128> Laney,  libwebkitgtk-3.0-dev : Depends: libwebkitgtk-common-dev (= 2.2.1-2ubuntu2) but it is not installable
<seb128> Laney, is that expect/a known issue?
<Laney> no
<seb128> wait, let me guess, I didn't promote some of the binaries I guess
<Laney> is that in main?
<Laney> ;-)
<seb128> Laney, empathy? yes
<Laney> the package it is complaining about
<seb128> Laney, it's empathy (cf the build log)
<Sweetshark> happyaron:thanks
<Laney> no, it's complaining about libwebkitgtk-common-dev
<Laney> libwebkitgtk-common-dev | 2.2.1-2ubuntu2 | trusty/universe | amd64, armhf, i386, powerpc
<seb128> Laney, right, as said I missed some binaries earlier, fixing it
 * Laney nod
<seb128> Laney, I wish there was a command to tell "promote only the binaries that are useful in main"
<Laney> SSSSSSSSssooooooooooooooooooo
<Laney> why do we still have evolution-indicator?
<Laney> ah, well, the port was easy
<Laney> it lives to die another day
<davmor2> Laney: incase someone install evolution :)
<seb128> Laney, because without it we wouldn't have messaging menu integration
<Laney> I see, it's not providing its own indicator
<seb128> no
<seb128> why would it?
<seb128> messages go in the messaging menu ;-)
<Laney> it's called evolution-indicator
<Laney> not evolution-messaging-menu
<seb128> yeah, the name is misleading
<Laney> sounded like some crufty thing
<seb128> it's like telepathy-indicator
<Laney> alright
<Laney> well, we should start using the upstream project again then ;-)
<Laney> Okay, everything apart from friends is built for new e-d-s
<pitti> seb128: uploading g-icon-theme 3.10, FTR
<seb128> pitti, danke!
<pitti> so that and g-i-t-symbolic should become installable again, and thus deja-dup's test should be back to green soon
<seb128> pitti, there is a new gvfs out if you feel like doing another desktop update this week btw ;-)
<pitti> mterry: ^
<pitti> if we ever get back our DC, that is :)
<pitti> seb128: not today any more, but I'll keep it in mind
<seb128> pitti, yeah, no hurry, thanks ;-)
<asac> pitti: which systems do you miss the most in the DC?
<seb128> I might get to it, but I've a bunch of others one on my list before
<seb128> larsu, btw how is GTK going?
<asac> pitti: please let ev know which ones we should prioritize to come back first for you
<pitti> asac: autopkgtest (aldebaran, alderamin, wazn, and albali), as we currently promote packages into ubuntu wihtout checks
<pitti> asac: and the upstream merge proposal machines
<pitti> asac: so I guess "half the DC" :)
<asac> pitti: any subset of the autopkttest infrastructure that would be helpful in the first batch?
<asac> pitti: or is it an either all or nothing thing?
<pitti> asac: we need at least one slave (one of these four), and 10.189.74.2 for the jenkins controller, I suppose
<mterry> pitti, ah thanks!  I was wondering why deja-dup was failing
<pitti> mterry: it's in the log, it can't install gnome-icon-theme
<mterry> pitti, I saw the log, but couldn't see which specific package was at fault.  And I was able to install things locally, so I was confused
<pitti> mterry: it runs with proposed enabled
<mterry> pitti, ah fair.  I forgot that
<pitti> mterry: see http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/testing/trusty-proposed_probs.html
<pitti> that has the deja-dup install error
<robru> Laney, hmmm, neither ken nor I can reproduce that friends failure locally.
<Laney> I just used a clean schroot
<Laney> let me upload to a PPA
<robru> Laney, I confirmed I had the same version of libaccounts-glib mentioned in that build log...
<asac> seb128: the latest X makes my system be crashy
<asac>  6209.979215] [drm] stuck on render ring
<asac> [ 6209.979217] [drm] capturing error event; look for more information in /sys/class/drm/card0/error
<asac> [ 6209.989170] [drm:i915_set_reset_status] *ERROR* render ring hung inside bo (0x30386000 ctx 1) at 0x303861d8
<asac> [ 6209.989194] [drm:i915_set_reset_status] *ERROR* render ring hung flushing bo (0x2d633000 ctx 0) at 0x303861d8
<asac> second time my system frooze today
<asac> err first time it was a hard reset
<asac> this time the X session froze
<asac> seb128: who is doing X?
<seb128> asac, mlankhorst
<asac> mlankhorst: ^
<seb128> asac, we didn't get a new xorg/intel driver though
<seb128> asac, did you get a new kernel?
<asac> what shall i do? ubuntu-bug xort?
<asac> seb128: thats odd ... it was rock solid until today when i got a hard reset
<seb128> could be https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/trusty/+source/libdrm/2.4.46-4 I guess
<asac> seb128: maybe just coincident
<seb128> though that seems for nvidia cards
<seb128> asac, what did you update today?
<seb128> dpkg.log should tell you
<asac> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6411824/
<asac> thats the package update log from yesterday and today
<asac> (term.log)
<asac> grub triggered new initramfs updates
<asac> Setting up xserver-xorg-glamoregl:i386 (0.5.1-0ubuntu4.1) ...
<asac> not sure what that is
<seb128> that's for nvidia cards/nouveau IIRC
<seb128> but your log suggest you are on intel
<asac> yeah its a nice x220 :)
<asac> thinki
<asac> so today my USB ports started to power off etc.
<asac> and i get freezes/crashes
<seb128> when did you get a kernel update?
<asac> seb128: do you know how i can figure when i last rebooted?
<asac> maybe i had a new kernel ages ago and never rebooted
<asac> is there like a "reboot" log?
<Laney> robru: did you try building friends in a clean chroot?
<seb128> asac, "uptime"?
<robru> Laney, no. should i try it in pbuilder?
<Laney> robru: yeah, see if it happens tehre
<asac> seb128: well, i surely rebooted after the hard crash :)
<Laney> if not I've just done it on a canonistack instance that you can have access to
<asac> because it just resetted
<asac> i wonder how long i didnt do that before though so i can find the kernel update
<robru> Laney, bah, gonna take a minute to update my pbuilder image
<seb128> asac, grep "/proc/kmsg started" /var/log/syslog*
<seb128> seems like that would do it
<asac> seb128: had to use zgrep :)... otherwise just one result
<Laney> robru: Ah, the messages from libaccounts-glib were correct
<asac> seems before the hard reset i rebooted on nov 8
<Laney> robru: Try building with HOME=/something/that/doesnt/exist
<Laney> well, running the testsuite I guess
<asac> seb128: i got a new kernel on nov 12
<robru> Laney,
<robru> Laney, ahhh
<asac> Preparing to replace linux-image-3.12.0-2-generic 3.12.0-2.5 (using .../linux-image-3.12.0-2-generic_3.12.0-2.7_i386.deb) ...
<asac> Done.
<asac> seb128: you think that doesnt touch intel drivers?
<Laney> I'd try the old kernel and see if it goes away
<seb128> asac, I would blame the kernel
<seb128> asac, try booting the previous one
<asac> i cant reproduce easily :)
<asac> just happens every few hours
<asac> so yeah i can go back, but then i cant get infos for ogasawara
<seb128> well, boot the previous one and see if you are still happy in a few days
<seb128> ok, keep running the new one and ask the kernel team what infos they need maybe?
<asac> ok i got the USB port powering down problem again
<asac> running ubuntu-bug linux
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> "dpkg-shlibdeps: error: no dependency information found for debian/empathy/usr/lib/empathy/libempathy-3.8.5.so (used by debian/nautilus-sendto-empathy/usr/lib/nautilus-sendto/plugins/libnstempathy.so)"
<seb128> what's going on there
<asac> recently i was ranting about windows requiring you to install mouse drivers because their "default" usb stack seems flaky
<asac> now we have a broken USB too :)
<asac> lol
<asac> never had that for ages
 * Laney waves
<Laney> uploaded webkit & blocked it in proposed for some more manual testing
<Laney> see you tomorrow
 * asac on 3.11 kernel now
<asac> so far pretty good stuff
<asac> :)
<mlankhorst> back :P
<mlankhorst> pinging me after EOD is not guaranteed to give a reply
<mlankhorst> but looks like a kernel issue
<asac> mlankhorst: dont worry. i am fully aware about the hit/miss ratio on IRC :)
<asac> in reality its much better than email though :)
<asac> hehe
<robru> Laney, looks fine in pbuilder. you were saying $HOME needs to not exist?
<robru> Laney, i'm not sure how to override $HOME inside pbuilder. pbuilder fails to even start if I do it the obvious way.
<robru> Laney, kenvandine wants to know in what kind of build environment you found this bug
<kenvandine> reading back he said in a clean schroot
<kenvandine> Laney, did you try in a PPA?
<mfisch> Is there a tool I can use to see where the icons I specify come from, as in the order?
<mfisch> Something like fc-list but for icons
<mfisch> I specify "Foo" and it's finding Foo in ~ rather than /usr/share/icons, and I'm curious why
<seb128> mfisch, wget https://launchpad.net/icon-library/trunk/lucid-release/+download/iconlibrary02052010.tar.gz; tar xvf iconlibrary02052010.tar.gz; cd iconlibrary; ./icon-library.py
<seb128> mfisch, not sure that does what you want but that's an useful tool/likely to help you
<mfisch> seb128: thanks, I'll take a look
<mfisch> seb128: I was quite surprised to see it finding icons in a random . folder in ~
<mfisch> something about my main icons unity does not like
<mfisch> unity-2d is cool with them though
<tedg> mterry, I've got deja-dup giving me a "Permission Denied" error dialog.  I can't seem to figure out what it is getting denied on.  How do I find that out?
<mterry> tedg, huh.  This is during backup?  Try: DEJA_DUP_DEBUG=1 deja-dup --backup
<tedg> mterry, Yeah, nothing there.
<mterry> nothing?
<mterry> that's crazy talk
<tedg> Nope
<mterry> tedg, that means we aren't actually getting to the point of calling duplicity
<mterry> tedg, where is the backup?
<tedg> Ha, you're just saying it's crazy because it's your bug?  ;-)
<mterry> tedg, :)
<tedg> mterry, I'm trying to back up over SSH.
<tedg> Well SFTP, but yeah.
<mterry> tedg, can you mount it in nautilus fine?
<mterry> and then try backing up again?
<tedg> Yeah, works in nautilus but not deja-dup
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: hey, I've forgot one branch of the series.. this should be the last one :P
<Trevinho> https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity-greeter/shutdown-better-bg-color/+merge/195150
<robert_ancell> ok
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-11-14
<xclaesse> I wrote a simple .desktop file that I've put in ~/.local/share/applications but unity's dash does not find it
<xclaesse> why?
<RAOF> xclaesse: Anything special about the .desktop file? The various Steam .desktops in ~/.local/share/applications work for me.
<xclaesse> RAOF, nothing special, I just want to launch my python script from unity's launchers
<RAOF> You could always try logging out and back in again. Presumably unity watches that path, but maybe reloading the scopes will fix it
<RAOF> ?
<xclaesse> RAOF, ah I understand
<xclaesse> it does not accept if the exec binary is in ~/.local/bin
<RAOF> Is ~/.local/bin in your path?
<xclaesse> RAOF, I set the path in my .bashrc for that
<xclaesse> it's probably not in unity's path
<xclaesse> ok, setting the full path to the python script and it works
<xclaesse> would be nice to have it relative though
<sarnold> did you try to use "bar" or ".local/bin/bar" or "~/.local/bin/bar" or "/home/foo/.local/bin/bar" ?
<xclaesse> sarnold, ah ".local/bin/bar" works
<xclaesse> cool :)
<xclaesse> ok, next step: add an action in the context menu
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<Laney> morning!
<seb128> Laney, good morning, how are you?
<Laney> seb128: alright thanks, although I think my arm got bruised when I gave blood last night
<Laney> so that hurts a bit
<Laney> you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks!
<RAOF> pitti: Good morning!
<pitti> hey RAOF, how are you?
<RAOF> pitti: You've got a merge request and a bug for umockdev awaiting you :)
<pitti> RAOF: thanks for your umockdev fixes
<pitti> RAOF: no, I don't :)
<RAOF> :)
<pitti> RAOF: it's all in 0.4.7, I uploaded that to Debian and it'll autosync in a few hours
<RAOF> Bitchn.
<RAOF> So, by the time I'm ready to propose this Mir branch, the valgrind tests should not fail in umockdev :)
<Laney> robru: Was using sbuild
<seb128> didrocks, btw on fully updated trusty I can still tap "alt" in g-c-c
<seb128> works in a guest session as well
<didrocks> seb128: hum, let me try today
<seb128> not sure what's the difference between our systems
<didrocks> still not working and update today
<didrocks> yeah, as Laney confirms, I'm wondering
<didrocks> I'll try a guest later
<seb128> needs debugging by somebody having the issue
<seb128> hint hint hint ;-)
<didrocks> heh, I'll have a look
<seb128> mhr3, hey
<seb128> mhr3, just as a FYI, the gvfsd-http leaks/non closing fds issues should be fixed in trusty, I would appreciate if you could verify/confirm during the cycle
<seb128> larsu, hey
<seb128> larsu, how is GTK 3.10 going?
<seb128> larsu, still working on it/on what specific issues?
<larsu> seb128: yes. I have a hard time figuring the update-manager list view issue out
<seb128> larsu, that doesn't seem a blocker ... maybe we could just upstream that one?
<seb128> larsu, and gently ping mclasen/Company saying it's a blocker to get the update in Ubuntu
<seb128> well, not a blocker for the ppa I mean
<larsu> maybe it's this one: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=712220
<ubot2> Gnome bug 712220 in GtkScrolledWindow "GtkScrolledWindow has incorrect minimal size" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> larsu, did you notice that it takes the correct space if you expend the details t the bottom?
<larsu> ya
<larsu> which is the weirdest part :-/
<larsu> seb128: okay, let me push that back. Then I'd only consider the scrollbar theme thing to be a blocker
<seb128> larsu, right, I was going to say the same
<larsu> I assume this is something that needs to be fixed in the theme though
<larsu> I'll investigate :)
<seb128> larsu, I would assume it's something to be fix in GTK/o-s code
<seb128> but let's see
<larsu> o-s ?
<seb128> overlay-scrollbars
<larsu> ah :)
<mhr3> seb128, cool, got a link to a bgo bug?
<seb128> mhr3, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=706225#c7
<ubot2> Gnome bug 706225 in general "gvfsd-http crashed with signal 5 in g_cancellable_make_pollfd()" [Major,Resolved: duplicate]
<seb128> mhr3, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=695652#c44
<ubot2> Gnome bug 695652 in HTTP Transport "Indefinite hang in run_sync_state_machine() on close()" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<seb128> mhr3, I've commented on that second bug to see if we can get some of the fixes cherrypicked in the serie used in saucy
<seb128> so we can SRU
<seb128> mhr3, the commit Dan backported to fc19 seems to be https://git.gnome.org/browse/libsoup/commit/?id=96da2df64c9dd8cc52e97ce73e54615d6b520664
<seb128> larsu, do you need help on GTK for anything? Like do you want me to spend some time to see if I can get a small testcase example of the update-manager issue?
<larsu> seb128: I've already found one: the test case in overlay-scrollbar
<larsu> convergence!
<seb128> lol
<seb128> Laney, so new webkitgtk isn't happy on arm64 :/
<seb128> ../Source/WTF/wtf/dtoa/utils.h:64:2: error: #error Target architecture was not detected as supported by Double-Conversion.
<seb128> Laney, it also made powerpc unhappy
<Laney> seb128: yeah, checking it
<Laney> I see the arm64 fix I think
<Laney> ppc test building on partch
<Laney> probably a missing #if somewhere
<seb128> mhr3, don't run away like that :p
<seb128> mhr3, did you get my reply?
<mhr3> seb128, saw the commit link as last thing
<mhr3> my internet died :/
<seb128> mhr3, ok, so you got it all, 2 bugs and 1 commit
<mhr3> using phone data now
<mhr3> seb128, when is that going to work with ubuntu phones btw? :)
<seb128> what? sharing datas?
<mhr3> yep, usb tethering
<mhr3> or wifi
<mhr3> or bluetooth :)
<seb128> mhr3, don't seem to be on the els prd list, so maybe not this cycle :/
<mhr3> strangely sharing my phone's wifi over usb is my most used feature on android
<mhr3> mostly caused bcm wifi sucks so bad
<mhr3> seb128, anyway, i'm not sure whether it's the same issue, the bug is mentioning something that got broken and is now fixed
<mhr3> afaik the fd leaking has been there since at least 12.10
<seb128> mhr3, well, Ross it's easy to reproduce the issue, so should be easy to test on trusty?
<mhr3> seb128, well, it should be easy to see on errors.ubuntu.com :)
<mhr3> last time i checked that bug was high on the list
<seb128> mhr3, yeah, it's first or second on gvfs issues for saucy, which is what made me comment upstream/ping about it yesterday
<seb128> mhr3, I'm trying to work a bit on the e.u.c list every day
<mhr3> seb128, great, it's an awesome source of data
<mhr3> makes bug prioritization a walk in park :)
<seb128> hum
<seb128> I don't trust lightdm on trusty anymore, I swear it's doing weird stuff on user switches sometimes
<seb128> I just had my session closed when logging out of a guest session
<seb128> mhr3, is that normal that dash filters change (e.g new category got added) during the session?
<mhr3> seb128, yes
<seb128> mhr3, that's weird :p
<mhr3> seb128, well, categories should be stable, sources will get added
<seb128> mhr3, I've "news" added to the categories
<seb128> e.g if I do
<seb128> - log into a guest session
<seb128> - open the dash
<seb128> - look at filters
<seb128> it starts with "aide" (help)
<mhr3> oh right
<seb128> - type something in the search entry, clean it
<seb128> -> "actualitÃ©" (news) is added to the categories
<mhr3> if a category has 0 sources it's not displayed, and since later a source is added, it becomes visible
<seb128> ok, I see
<seb128> that's a bit weird since it changes the layouting of the filters
<seb128> thanks
 * seb128 also noticed that turning the online data makes the dash snappy to return results again and is pondering to just do that
<mhr3> seb128, but if it was there all the time it'd be even worse (returning no results ever)
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> mhr3, so I set 'remote-content-search' to 'none' ... I did a query "pdf", which listed me some pdf I opened recently (great)
<seb128> mhr3, now I open the dash again, type "pdf" and it lists no file, the "files" filter is off (I didn't change), dispite having 'files.scopes' in the 'always-search' gsettings
<mhr3> sounds like a bug
<seb128> mhr3, do you think it's the same issue than the one from yesterday?
<mhr3> might very well be
<seb128> :/
<mhr3> seb128, can you get bustle log for that?
<mhr3> and attach it to the bug you opened
<seb128> mhr3, oh, it works if I see the "remote-content-search' back to 'all'
<seb128> mhr3, can you reproduce if you change the key to none?
 * mhr3 tries
<mhr3> seb128, nope
<seb128> :-(
<mhr3> anyway, the bustle log should help
<mhr3> just try to describe very precisely what you did and what you saw
<mhr3> there'll be a mismatch somewhere
<mhr3> seb128, perhaps even record a video while capturing the log
<seb128> mhr3, is that going to "leak" all my dash content? not sure I want to put all my filenames online :p
<mhr3> seb128, mark it private then
<seb128> larsu, I keep (ab)using your merge request to discuss GTK 3.10 issues, let me know if you prefer moving to a bug? (e.g should we rather use https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1171587)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1171587 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "update to GTK 3.9 and the issues to resolve for it" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<seb128> in fact that would make sense, let me comment on that bug ;-)
<larsu> seb128:  I don't mind either way
 * larsu is bisecting the o-s issue
<larsu> I hate o-s
 * seb128 hugs larsu
<Laney> talk to desrt about that
<seb128> you can always try to ping that italian guy who wrote it :p
<seb128> but I bet the reply is going to be "it was working, it's a bug in GTK"
<larsu> I'm sure he'll be happy about that :)
<seb128> to his defence that's what happened with GTK 3.8 and he was right :p
<larsu> seems like the same here
<seb128> the bug that make o-s buggy by then was an annoying one in GTK which impacted on other apps as well
<larsu> 7 steps left. If only gtk built faster :)
<pitti> -j8 FTW!
<pitti> (and build in tmpfs)
<seb128> larsu, just doing git bisect&make ought to not be that slow
<larsu> seb128: slow enough to annoy me :)
 * larsu is not a very patient person
<seb128> bregma, hey, could you get somebody assigned to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1047517? that's the most reported unity issue on e.u.c/saucy
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1047517 in unity (Ubuntu) "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in g_mount_spec_to_dbus_with_path() ... from unity::IconLoader::Impl::IconLoaderTask::LoaderJobFunc()" [High,Confirmed]
<bregma> seb128, we'll discuss it today
<seb128> bregma, thanks
<seb128> mhr3, I've added bustle and video on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-scope-home/+bug/1223933 ... let me know if you need more info or if you prefer a new bug since that's not strictly the same issue
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1223933 in libunity "sometimes the dash home list "no result matching your query" string" [Undecided,Triaged]
<mhr3> seb128, thx
<mhr3> seb128, hm, it doesn't even try to search files
<mhr3> pstolowski, the log is odd ^^
<mhr3> pstolowski, home scope sends query to apps scope, and then the same query to the scopes scope (even though that's supposed to be apps child)
<pstolowski> mhr3, oh, if it's the case then it's indeed odd, looking
<mhr3> oh wait
<mhr3> nevermind
<mhr3> it's the apps master querying its children
<mhr3> pstolowski, nonetheless, later it doesn't send the query to files (which is in always-search according to seb)
<mhr3> later == when there's an actual search string
<mhr3> seb128, btw is the files scope running?
<mhr3> pgrep unity-files-daemon?
<seb128> mhr3, I guess so, the file lens is working
<mhr3> hm, interesting
<seb128> yeah, it's running
<pstolowski> seb128, but judging from your description, gsettings get com.canonical.Unity.Lenses home-lens-default-view doesn't show files.scope now?
<seb128> pstolowski,
<seb128> ['help.scope', 'help-askubuntu.scope', 'help-texdoc.scope', 'help-yelp.scope', 'news.scope', 'news-googlenews.scope', 'news-yahoostock.scope', 'applications.scope', 'applications-applications.scope', 'applications-scopes.scope']
<seb128> which matches the filters showed active on the ui
<seb128> is it supposed to use the "always-search" ones as well? (that has apps/music/video/files)
<pstolowski> seb128, right, and you never de-selected files in previous searches?
<seb128> no
<pstolowski> ah wait, it's not surfacing
<pstolowski> so right, always-search should be used
<mhr3> seb128, just to make sure, can you paste the value of always-search as well?
<seb128> mhr3, http://paste.ubuntu.com/6415785/
<mhr3> great, thx
<seb128> yw
<pstolowski> seb128, and is this now reproducible on every search?
<seb128> pstolowski, yes, it's stucked in that buggy situation
<seb128> I've not tried to manually click on filters or restart processes though
<seb128> in case you guys need more debug infos
<seb128> but it's not going away by using the dash or typing stuff in the entry
<pstolowski> seb128, mhr3 ok, I suspect filter state handler in home scope got confused, grr
<pstolowski> seb128, i'll look at this, probably next week
<seb128> pstolowski, ok, let me know if you need more debug infos/want me to build a special versions with extra prints for example
<Sweetshark> seb128: So I checked the libs that LO brings its own copies, for the debian sync and MIR dance. libodfgen needs 0.0.3 which is not in debian exp. yet, libmwaw is uptodate in universe/just needs MIR, libmdds is outdated in universe, needs a sync of 0.9.1 from in debian experimental, libcmis needs 0.4.1 which is not in experimental yet. libenotyek and libfreehand are new with 4.2 -> lets postpone those.
<seb128> I wonder if my config is special in any regards
<seb128> Sweetshark, ok, should we do the libmdds sync?
<Sweetshark> seb128: yep, would be one thing of the list.
<Sweetshark> so on big bertha doing a release build of LibreOffice takes 30min. Building a package takes 106min. as xz compression of the result takes ages :/
<pstolowski> seb128, what would definitely help is if you run home scope with HOME_SCOPE_VERBOSE=1 env var set; and capture all the output from start till when the problem shows up (there will be lots of output, so just 2>&1 to a logfile)
<seb128> pstolowski, ok, I can do that
<pstolowski> seb128, so just kill home-scope and re-run it from a terminal
<seb128> pstolowski|lunch, mhr3: it's trivial to reproduce here
<mhr3> seb128, good, you'll be asked to send your laptop to poland then ;)
<seb128> mhr3, pstolowski|lunch: I wonder if that's a locale stuff, I restarted the home scope with the debug env, I typed "pdf" and I had files, then I did "esc" ... the filters changes with "actualitÃ©" ("news" in french) added as the first category and files&folders got unselected at the same time
<seb128> mhr3, pstolowski|lunch: http://ubuntuone.com/3tC2suxeWymsYaBbFkjGhf is the log
<seb128> see l1337
<seb128> is that normal that this query is only apps scope?
<seb128> l1321: 13:43:07.936785Z unity-scope-home: search-util.vala:180: Setting sources filter files-gdrive.scope: false
<seb128> l1318 I mean
<seb128> the files-local.scope is set to false
<Sweetshark> s/of/off/
<pstolowski> seb128, no, it got confused after esc. thanks for the log, I think I have all the needed info
<seb128> pstolowski, great, yw
<desrt> good morning
<desrt> let's drop overlay-scrollbars
<desrt> larsu tells me i get free steak if this happens... so... soon, please?
<larsu> desrt: only of you had verifiable influence on that decision ;)
<desrt> larsu: butterfly effect, dude
<larsu> heh
<larsu> not really verifiable
<ogra_> given you dont have wings, how do you do that ?
<ogra_> fart and it will change eventually ?
<seb128> desrt, good morning
<desrt> seb128: hey.  i'd be happy if you could now say "we will get rid of them, but only because desrt asked so nicely"
<seb128> desrt, let's not start trolling, new GTK is making me less happy by the day, I could start ranting soon :p
 * seb128 just opened https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=712302
<ubot2> Gnome bug 712302 in GtkFileChooser "GtkPlacesSideBar showing "Desktop" or not shouldn't be a by-application setting" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> wth GNOME
<desrt> oh.  this is fun :)
<larsu> uh oh. I guess I should stop ranting then...
<desrt> seb128: if i fix this bug, will you let larsu drop overlay-scrollbars? :)
<seb128> they made the default to be "don't show a desktop, because GNOME3 doesn't have one"
<seb128> and the solution is to patch every app
<ogra_> just use QtFilechooser ;)
<desrt> seb128: i guess you want XSETTINGS stuff here
<seb128> desrt, no dropping of anything
<seb128> desrt, yeah, but isn't xsettings being killed because it doesn't work in wayland?
<larsu> desrt: why not a gsetting? The file chooser already has a schema (and federico said so in that commit)
<seb128> larsu, because schemas are not by desktop
<seb128> larsu, e.g a xfce user wants that item, an Unity user wants it, a GNOME3 doesn't
<larsu> argh, right
<desrt> well.... in fairness, it sort of makes sense to bind this to the "icons on desktop" setting that already exists
<desrt> if the user turns off viewing their desktop then that should be the indication not to show it in the chooser
<desrt> regardless of environment
<larsu> good idea, but this is a nautilus setting, no?
<desrt> no
<seb128> I was going to say
<desrt> i think it's in org.gnome.desktop.interface
<desrt> org.gnome.desktop.background show-desktop-icons false
 * desrt was close
<larsu> is that installed on an xfce desktop?
<seb128> no
<seb128> neither on win32
<seb128> nor macOS
 * desrt already raised this point in the bug
<larsu> we need an equivalent to shell-shows-menubar
<desrt> adding XSETTINGS back to gtk seems to be popular these days....
<kenvandine> dobey, my wife is angry with you!  :-p
<kenvandine> she couldn't figure out how to buy music anymore... she's on precise
<seb128> larsu, kenvandine, charles, tedg, Laney, let's skip the settings meeting, I don't think anyone worked on this week (I didn't see any activity and CI is down), seems everybody is busy catching up with other topics/start of cycle work
<seb128> cyphermox, attente, didrocks: ^
<charles> seb128, ack
<cyphermox> ok
<attente> sure
<cyphermox> seb128: btw, looking at wpa...
<seb128> cyphermox, hey! oh, thanks ;-)
<kenvandine> +1
<cyphermox> seb128: it's that bug that failed to retrace everywhere in all cases
<cyphermox> something broke maybe in libnl
<desrt> seb128: be happy.  this problem will be solved by end of day.
<seb128> desrt, thanks a lot for dealing with it!
<desrt> seb128: so... about those overlay-scrollbars.....
<desrt> ;)
<seb128> desrt, *lalalalala*
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> geesh.  you do a nice thing, and this is what happens
<desrt> seb128: *the keg* is on the line here
<desrt> seb128: in fairness, probably larsu would treat you as well...
 * larsu confirms
<seb128> you don't want me to get fired, do you? ;-)
<desrt> 'accepting bribes'
<mdeslaur> I think getting rid of scrollbars entirely is more sane than getting rid of overlay-scrollbars :P
<larsu> mdeslaur: and how do you show how far along a document you are?
<seb128> larsu, mdeslaur: let's stop trolling, friday is tomorrow :p
<mdeslaur> larsu: oh, you leave the indication there, you just don't pop anything up over it :P
<seb128> larsu, btw I just tested on raring, seems to be that the thumb behaves/looks the same way
<seb128> larsu, the orange portion was not animated, it was just always there to show the position
 * mdeslaur suspends further trolling until tomorrow
<larsu> mdeslaur: ah, that would have been part of the "scrollbar" term for me. I totally agree then
<larsu> seb128: cool. Thank you. I guess I misremembered
<larsu> seb128: this is what I meant: http://vimeo.com/30210146
<seb128> larsu, is that the orange/grey line and the way it's displayed/fading away?
<larsu> seb128: yes, the gray one is missing for me when using 3.8
<seb128> larsu, work in a saucy vm (sorry got sidetracked while the vm was loading)
<seb128> larsu, let me downgrade gtk on trusty and see
<seb128> larsu, I'm testing with "nautilus /usr/share", works fine on trusty with the trusty GTK (you just need to aim close from the border and slowly)
<larsu> seb128: do you get the gray bar as well?
<seb128> larsu, yes
<larsu> meh :/
<larsu> seb128: thanks for testing that,
<seb128> larsu, http://ubuntuone.com/5VrE9JH4FuK1VIMIZrSvxG
<seb128> larsu, that's trusty with the trusty gtk version
<larsu> seb128: weirdly enough, I don't get that with upstream gtk 3.8. Might be one of our patches.
<seb128> larsu, I don't really see which patch in our stack could make a difference there :/
<larsu> me neither. I'll find out after I get the trough visible at all
<seb128> larsu, what application are you testing with?
<larsu> seb128: the tester inside of overlay-scrollbars source tree
<larsu> tests/test-os
<seb128> larsu, that test app is weird/buggy
<larsu> how so?
<seb128> larsu, http://ubuntuone.com/4fHJW2VMDIXLYhQDoGxlMN
<seb128> is that how it looks like for you?
<larsu> ya, it seems to be the bug that we also see in update-manager
<larsu> I patched the tester :)
<seb128> larsu, that screenshot is using GTK 3.8...
<seb128> how did you patch it ?
<larsu> then it's definitely not the same bug :D
<larsu> http://paste.debian.net/65856/
<larsu> I made it so that there's only one listview
<larsu> good enough for testing
<seb128> larsu, ok, I do get the grey bar/animation on that as well
<seb128> just wanted to rule out the test to be buggy
<seb128> I'm going to let you debug then, let me know if I can help for anything else
<larsu> yep. Thanks a lot for testing!
<seb128> yw!
<happyaron> seb128: I did some analysis on bug 1221593 (my last comment), and can only pick up it again next week cuz I'm at Changsha for the meeting from today to the weekend.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1221593 in ibus (Ubuntu) "ibus-ui-gtk3 crashed with SIGABRT in _g_log_abort()" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1221593
<seb128> happyaron, hey, thanks ... is the issue fixed in 1.5.4?
<pitti> mterry: so the icon theme uninstallability is fixed, now https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Trusty/view/AutoPkgTest/job/trusty-adt-deja-dup/14/? failed with a test failure; would you mind having a look?
<seb128> happyaron, I wonder if the error is worth asserting on, what would happen if we only g_warning there? would it pick the config once the daemon writes it?
<happyaron> seb128: I haven't tested the latest patchset ofr 1.5.4, anyway it's not fully a part of the released version of ibus, but need some patch that fujiwara apply to F19.
<happyaron> seb128: not tested yet, but that's worth to try.
<seb128> happyaron, why is fujiwara not upstream those changes? do they still have them in f20?
<happyaron> seb128: fujiwara cannot commit those changes directly, need code review from phuang (original author of ibus). So all the distros are carrying fujiwara's patches for certain features/fixes.
<happyaron> it's more obvious since gnome decides to do the integration.
<seb128> happyaron, is that because phuang is not active for reviews?
<seb128> k
<seb128> happyaron, thanks for the update
<happyaron> seb128: he's active, but not that interested on those kindia integrations.
<happyaron> he cares more about the framework
<seb128> ok
<seb128> happyaron, can you check, next week, what happens if we just return in that function instead of asserting?
<happyaron> seb128: sure
<seb128> happyaron, that might be good enough as a solution
<seb128> happyaron, thanks
<happyaron> with pleasure
 * seb128 shakes the fist to lightdm in trusty
<desrt> seb128: got patches up for the GtkPlacesSidebar issue
<desrt> testing appreciated
<seb128> desrt, excellent, thanks
<desrt> (they seem to work in my jhbuild)
<seb128> desrt, I was about to go for some exercice but I do that next once I'm back
<desrt> cool
<desrt> looks like they'll go upstream pretty quickly so i don't know if there is much value in patching them in our packages except for local testing
<pitti> desrt: hey, how are you?
<desrt> good.
 * desrt is doing job #1 today
<pitti> desrt: I pushed an updated patch to -shim, FYI
<desrt> oh.  great.
<pitti> desrt: oh, what's that?
 * desrt checked last night, didn't see it
<desrt> pitti: making seb happy
<pitti> "watch latest BBT episode"?
<pitti> ooh
<pitti> desrt: no, did it this moring
<pitti> morning, too
<pitti> some 11 hours ago
<pitti> desrt: if you are happy with it, could we just do a version 5?
 * desrt would have preferred a chance to review it
<desrt> although i suppose that's inconsistent with my previous hopes of passing off maintainership to you :)
<pitti> desrt: ah, I thought you were content with our discussion how to do it yesterday
<pitti> desrt: but it's not yet released or uploaded or anything
<pitti> desrt: it's git, so we can change it :)
<desrt> pitti: i'm pretty strong into the "no non-trivial commits without code review" mindset these days
<pitti> desrt: ok, noted for the future
<pitti> desrt: (good thing!)
<desrt> looks more or less fine, though... i'd only have minor tweaks to it
<pitti> I should try that with my projects too, I just find it hard to find someone who wants to bother with reading apport or umockdev patches
<desrt> printf("%u", getpid()) is possibly undefined, for example
<desrt> if sizeof(pid_t) != sizeof(int)
<desrt> but i guess in our case they're the same
<pitti> desrt: undefined?
<pitti> ah
<desrt> pitti: if you had a platform where pid_t was a long, for example
<pitti> so that would need an (unsigned) cast
<desrt> then passing the result of getpid() directly as the argument for "%u" would be an error
<pitti> as there's no printf macro for pid_t
<desrt> yes.  you'd normally want a cast in this case.
<desrt> i'd also have used g_strdup_printf() instead of mucking around with the static buffer
<desrt> and i'd have written 'GError *error' instead of 'GError* error'
<desrt> as i said -- all minor complaints :)
<desrt> probably not worth changing
<pitti> nah, I'll do it anyway
<desrt> i assume you tested it and it works?
<pitti> yes, of course
<desrt> awesome :)
<pitti> desrt: ah, I avoided g_strdup_printf(), mostly out of a habit
<desrt> i'll wait for your tweaks, then i'll do a release (and tarball)
<desrt> pitti: if this was some tight inner loop, i'd agree
<pitti> if I can get away without dynamic memory allocation, I do it usually; but I'm happy to change it
<desrt> but one extra malloc() _per lifetime of the entire system_.... probably not an issue :)
<pitti> no, but it doesn't actually make the code any easier, to the contrary
<desrt> pitti: it's not about making the code easier
<pitti> it introduces at least three lines more
<desrt> similar to your dynamic memory aversion i have an aversion to formatting strings into fixed-sized buffers
<pitti> desrt: heh, fair enough
<desrt> i'm pretty sure you got it right in this case, though
<desrt> but that's the nice thing with g_strdup_printf -- you don't have to convince yourself
<desrt> one more nit: your critical is probably actually a warning
<desrt> critical == programmer errors
<desrt> warning == things that should not have happened, but are not the fault of the programmer of this process
<pitti> desrt: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6416828/ (built-tested, but not yet runtime-tested; doing now)
<desrt> that said, the critical may be nice from the standpoint that we will soon be using apport to report criticals
<desrt> but ya... probably better as a warning to be more 'proper'
<pitti> desrt: thanks for the warning/critical heads-up
<pitti> desrt: err, sorry, wrong diff
<desrt> pitti: seems you could have avoided the boolean if you wanted to
<desrt> but looks good
<pitti> desrt: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6416837/
<desrt> (even if it's the wrong diff) :)
<pitti> desrt: yeah, I committed the style changes first, then --amend'ed the g_strdup_printf change
<pitti> that's the complete one now
<desrt> looks good to me
<pitti> desrt: success> I try to free it ASAP; at some point someone might have an exit path in the if() condition
<desrt> pitti: fair enough
<desrt> you know about this gcc cleanup attribute?
<pitti> desrt: I do
<desrt> we should use it more :)
<pitti> yeah, it's magic!
<desrt> in cases like this where the software will only run on ubuntu (or debian some day maybe) we could totally rely on it
<pitti> desrt: systemd upstream uses it a lot, I guess it's not really a distro thing but more like a "gcc" thing?
<desrt> ya
<desrt> my point is that ubuntu/debian are built using gcc...
<desrt> ie: we don't have to worry about trying to build with msvc or so
<pitti> hehe, yes
<desrt> or suncc or whatever
<pitti> desrt: ok, runtime-test thumbs up; good to push?
<desrt> yes.  please do.
<pitti> there
<desrt> k.  lemme do the 'release' :)
<desrt> okay.  done.
<desrt> thanks!
<pitti> desrt: mind putting the tarball to https://people.gnome.org/~desrt/ so that we have an "official" orig?
<desrt> pitti: already did
<pitti> desrt: "once and for all" -> famous last words! *cough*
<desrt> :)
<pitti> desrt: ah, cheers; reload helped
<desrt> i think i also had "should" in there ;)
 * pitti hugs desrt
 * pitti goes to package/upload/update SRU
<pitti> RAOF: FYI: [ubuntu/trusty] umockdev 0.4.7-1 (Accepted)
 * Laney gives up staring at webkit's code
<seb128> Laney, still looking at webkit? did that eat your day?
<mfisch> I just confirmed an odd bug. The screen will not lock while you have a notification menu open (like session or battery)
<mfisch> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-screensaver/+bug/941618
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 941618 in gnome-screensaver (Ubuntu) "Screen not locking when hovering mouse over notification applets" [Medium,Confirmed]
<mfisch> gnome-screensaver cannot get the focus
<sarnold> mfisch: take a look at bug 49579  -- it's probably a duplicate
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 49579 in gnome-screensaver (Ubuntu) "screen doesn't lock when some menu is open" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/49579
<sarnold> mfisch: this is something we're expecting Mir to fix for us; fixing it in X11 seems neigh-on impossible.
<mfisch> sarnold: looking, I just grabbed a log
<mfisch> a 5 digit bug # even
<mfisch> sarnold: yes, a dupe, thanks
<bschaefer> happyaron, ping
<seb128> bschaefer, it's like 3am for him, I doubt he's online
<bschaefer> seb128, thanks, ill have to try to catch him tomorrow morning
<seb128> mfisch, that's not weird, welcome to Xorg ... surprising you just discover that today ;-)
<mfisch> seb128: only discovered on our hacked up GSS that lets you send lock signals via dbus
<seb128> bschaefer, he's away for a Kylin meeting I think, back next week, you might let some ping context in case he looks at IRC in between (or email should work)
<mfisch> seb128: but "Mir fixes" works for me
<seb128> mfisch, yeah, Mir should fix it, I'm sure the security team is going to make sure of that ;-)
<bschaefer> seb128, I see thanks again for the info :). cool ill just send him an email!
<seb128> bschaefer, just curious, what's the topic? im-config stuff again?
<bschaefer> seb128, no its actually more of a question about preedit windows, more about I want to ask someone who uses IMs
<bschaefer> like, how important that box is, as im fixing up XIM in nux
<seb128> bschaefer, "preedit"?
<bschaefer> when you typing in any IM you get preedit text, thats showing you what has been typing so far but is not real text yet
<seb128> oh
<seb128> I'm sure they want that
<bschaefer> and each IM has a preedit box that shows you suggestions of the next char you want
<seb128> isn't that working in the dash?
<bschaefer> seb128, its working, but im running into problems getting it in a nice position
<bschaefer> as with XIM, it only uses the X windows position
<bschaefer> so for the dash it wont be below the text entry, it'll be at the bottom left of the Dash
<seb128> bschaefer, you are trying with ibus?
<bschaefer> seb128, as the goal is remove all the Ibus code from nux, and depend only on XIM
<bschaefer> seb128, XIM support all IMEs
<seb128> yeah, that would be nice
<seb128> Kylin uses fcitx
<seb128> that's a topic for vUDS next week
<bschaefer> yes very much, the one problem is the preeidt window wont be super nice in ibus
<seb128> ibus/fcitx for Ubuntu
<seb128> is it better in fcitx?
<bschaefer> seb128, yup it'll all work fine, XIM is an abstraction that all IMes implement
<bschaefer> X Input Method
<bschaefer> all the IMes have the XIM client code, so all of them work
 * bschaefer gets  a list
<seb128> right, sorry for the question, I'm just trying to figure out if that's ibus specific/if fcitx does better
<seb128> bschaefer, don't bother with a list, we care about ibus and fcitx ... and we need to pick one
<bschaefer> seb128, right, well the only difference between switching from IBus directly to using XIM
<bschaefer> is this preedit window box isn't in the same place
<bschaefer> but all will work fine
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I'm sure we can address that specific issue in some way
<seb128> in any case Kylin is the main user
<bschaefer> right, i've tried work arounds, but XIM is a bit old and kind of late getting into X to begin with...
<bschaefer> yup, and fcitx will work much better in Nux
<bschaefer> cause i've actually implemented the rendering of preedit text (this isn't the case atm)
<seb128> knowing that they don't use ibus, we need to switch away from requiring it
<bschaefer> yup!
<bschaefer> which as soon as I can get this branch landed we can remove anything ibus related in nux
<bschaefer> and unity
<seb128> \o/
 * bschaefer and remove those evil ibus AP tests...
<seb128> so you are saying fcitx works better than ibus UI wise in Unity?
<seb128> btw it would be nice if you can join that session next week
<bschaefer> yeah i can join in, umm right now ibus works better
 * seb128 has no clue about input methods framework (as most of the team), yet we have to pick one :/
<bschaefer> because we implemented ibus directly in nux
<bschaefer> yup
<seb128> right
<bschaefer> im not really sure, both work very well overall (in my eyes at lease)
<seb128> is that statement still true once you land the xim support?
<bschaefer> when we move to XIM, they will all look the same
<seb128> great
<bschaefer> the only difference will be the preedit window the IMe renderes
<seb128> so at least Unity is not a blocker in the decision
<bschaefer> renderers, which they are in charge of
<bschaefer> what would be a blocker?
<seb128> the UI you are talking about is e.g http://www.emacswiki.org/pics/static/IBusModeScreenShot.png right?
<bschaefer> seb128, yup that little box with the suggestions
<seb128> blocker would be: users of that framework can't use the dash
<bschaefer> oo, well they can :), so yeah thats good
<seb128> great
<bschaefer> seb128, the only thing, with the dash the preedit box in fullscreen will be outside of the screen :(
<seb128> the real solution for that is to add the prediction UI to unity...
<seb128> (sure you like that ;-)
<bschaefer> which is one question i wanted to ask, how important that suggestion is box really is to normal users
<bschaefer> seb128, well the problem, is we can't control its location
<bschaefer> only the IMe does
<bschaefer> (for some reason)
<seb128> I'm not using those input method but I guess it's a basic feature so important
<bschaefer> and its location is based on the bottom left corner of the X window
<bschaefer> yes very much so
<bschaefer> ill have to come up with a work around...
<bschaefer> so far a few have failed
<seb128> bschaefer, oh, I'm sure you can
<bschaefer> seb128, atm, its a problem in any gtk app as well, if you use XIM
<seb128> bschaefer, http://hedayatvk.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/d8b9daa9d8b3e2808cd8b5d981d8add987-d8a7d8b2-2013-01-16-021756.png
<seb128> bschaefer, that's what gnome-shell is doing
<bschaefer> if the window is maxed, the preedit box is placed outside the screen
<bschaefer> that looks nice
<seb128> bschaefer, if they can, it's technically doable
<bschaefer> seb128, it is, the problem
<bschaefer> nux doesn't have a nice IME interface
<bschaefer> the only one we really have access to is XIM
<seb128> right
<bschaefer> so, the real soultion would be to implement an IME interface for nux, and write client code in each IME
<seb128> that might be a "next generation desktop" topic
<seb128> e.g unity8
<bschaefer> well unity8 IIRC uses malit?
<bschaefer> i can't spell it :)
<bschaefer> which has all that stuff put in with QT
<seb128> don't ask me
<bschaefer> sooo hopefully when we move over to unity8 we will have no more problems with IMs
<seb128> I still don't understand how much an osk integrates/replaces IM framework
<seb128> we still need to support physical keyboard
<seb128> you can't just dynamically change the physical layout on those ;-)
<bschaefer> o right...that'll be interesting, luckly QT has an IM interface, and I know (think?) fcitx supports it at lease
<seb128> right
<seb128> one step at the time
<bschaefer> yup, having that already solidified is a huge step
<bschaefer> from there you just need to make sure each IME support that toolkit
<seb128> it would be good for the lts to put the popover dialog in the dash rather than at the corner
<seb128> not sure how easily that's to hack though
<bschaefer> hmm well with XIM the pop up will be at the bottom left corer atm
<bschaefer> im guessing the only workaround will be to hacky, and possible regression causers
<bschaefer> ie. having to re-implement the text entry to be an Xwindow it self
<bschaefer> but yeah, one step at a time, i should get it merged first :)
<seb128> right, let's get it working first, then we can do UI tweaks
<bschaefer> sounds good!
<seb128> but I guess it's not going to be trivial to get some popup on top of the dash
<seb128> e.g we would maybe need to make that UI be display by unity itself
<seb128> which starts being more work than we want for the LTS
<seb128> so yeah, maybe just having it at the corner is good enoug
<seb128> h
<bschaefer> right, im just worried about regression potential for the LTS
<seb128> check with happyaron ;-)
<bschaefer> i would much rather play it safe :)
<bschaefer> yup, ill send him an email!
<seb128> (which is what you were going to do, sorry for distracting you)
<bschaefer> no worries :)
<seb128> but yeah, play safe sounds good
<seb128> we are struggling on what to do with the indicators/keybindings as well
<bschaefer> yeah i was reading that topic...its a complicated problem...
<seb128> indeed
<bschaefer> is there also a session for this in vUDS?
<seb128> not yet, I'm pondering putting one
<seb128> we still have free slots
<seb128> there is one from the Kylin guys about ibus/fcitx
<bschaefer> wouldn't be a bad idea, as thats something to talk about worst case it'll be short
<seb128> I'm also unsure how the indicator/keybinding stuff can be resolved over a session
<seb128> right
<seb128> I was thinking about putting one
<seb128> I'm probably going to do that (setting it after the ibus/fctix one so we can discuss based on the output of that one)
<bschaefer> yeah, ill make that one, unless i over sleep haha (joking)
<seb128> ;-)
<bschaefer> that would be good, if the slots align nicely :)
<seb128> yeah, I've scheduling powers so I can make that happen ;-)
<bschaefer> :)
<desrt> seb128: any other gtk nags?
<seb128> desrt, nags, or nags for you?
<desrt> :)
<desrt> anything that i could do to make your life easier?
<seb128> desrt, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1171587 comment #3 (#4 as well)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1171587 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "update to GTK 3.9 and the issues to resolve for it" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<desrt> seb128: fwiw, dunno what the deal with u-s-d is, but you're probably going going to need to manually pick that patch at least
<seb128> desrt, I think larsu is on the other ones (out of update-manager one, but that's not a blocker)
<desrt> although the failure mode if you don't pick the patch will be for it to fail in the direction that we find favourable, ie: desktop will be shown
<desrt> but we should probably do it anyway to support people who manually disable the desktop
<seb128> desrt, yeah, I'm going to pick that patch this week. robert_ancell sent me an email that he has an u-s-d test version ready, but he's on vac for a week now
<desrt> seb128: parallel-installable with g-s-d i hope
<seb128> yeah
<desrt> neat
<seb128> we still have arguments about the details though
<seb128> he wants to rename/migrate the gsettings keys
 * desrt finds a new wishlist bug about the "...when ~/Desktop is not empty" thing
<seb128> I argue that there is enough compat that it's not needed
<seb128> not speaking about external users/internet documentation
<desrt> that's very tricky
<desrt> gsettings-desktop-schemas upstream has been less.... stable than i'd have hoped
<desrt> in general, i think ubuntu-desktop-schemas would be an extremely good idea
<desrt> for various extras we have
<desrt> instead of all of the hacking we do to check "is component X installed?  use it's gsettings, if so..."
<seb128> right, but I think in practice it's going to be less work this cycle to enforce stability there/add back keys for compat reasons if they drop them than to fork/migrate the keys
<desrt> now that we have a proper g-c-c fork, these sorts of "add UI elements if..." checks are pointless
<desrt> seb128: as long as the changes that we patch back are purely additive
<desrt> (ie: we only do it when upstream is removing settings outright)
<desrt> because otherwise we may end up causing compatibility issues for gnomebuntu
<seb128> right
<seb128> I think that in practice it should be an easy this cycle
<desrt> from that standpoint i understand why robert wants what he wants
<seb128> which makes less migration work for the LTS
<desrt> but i agree that the changes should not be too much, and they're usually strictly additive
<seb128> we can revisit next cycle if needed
<seb128> desrt, btw, we have https://launchpad.net/gsettings-ubuntu-touch-schemas
 * desrt is honestly looking forward to being able to run ubuntu again :)
<seb128> which is what you suggested, for unity8
<desrt> good
<desrt> this is how gsettings is meant to be used
<seb128> unitu7 is in sitting in the middle of 2 worlds
<desrt> ya...
<seb128> unity*
<desrt> in general, i really like the way new things are going
<desrt> it's going to be very very much cleaner
<seb128> right
<seb128> I wonder how much "different desktops on a same distro" is going to stay true though
<seb128> the GTK/Desktop stuff showing it why today
<desrt> this was a stupid change, imh
<desrt> +o
<seb128> the xsettings logic is sort of a strech
<desrt> the trivial work that i did today should have just been done from the start
<desrt> and this isn't about different desktops on the same distro
<desrt> this is about different desktops using the same toolkit
<seb128> right, they screwed other OSes on the way
<desrt> which is a problem that gtk chooses to have.... we just have to remind from time to time that this is their choice
<desrt> and showing up with patches is always the nicest way to do that ;)
<seb128> I guess it's rather the discussion" GTK is the GNOME toolkit"
<desrt> gtk is only the gnome toolkit insofar as non-gnome people don't show up offering to do work
<desrt> today a non-gnome person (me) showed up with patches.  they got applied almost straight away.
<desrt> these patches didn't benefit gnome in any way at all
<seb128> yeah, as long as they are fine taking the code to accommodates other OSes
<desrt> which, again, is a choice that gtk made
<seb128> right
<seb128> I'm pretty happy about the outcome ;-)
<desrt> it's supposed to be a cross-platform toolkit.  that includes linux-outside-of-gnome too.
<seb128> I was unsure how Bastien would respond when you asked
<desrt> seb128: you duped :p
<desrt> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=711040
<ubot2> Gnome bug 711040 in GtkFileChooser "GtkFileChooser: Desktop entry missing" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> desrt, heh, I listed it myself in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1171587/comments/3 that doesn't count ;-)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1171587 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "update to GTK 3.9 and the issues to resolve for it" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<seb128> but yeah, I should maybe have reused that one
<desrt> you were so upset that you wanted it to be two bugs? :)
<seb128> let's say that I didn't want to spam that poor-contributor's bug with my ranting :p
<desrt> the rest look like a bunch of theme issues
<desrt> (sigh)
<desrt> would be really nice if our theme was maintained...
<seb128> right
<seb128> well, it's not
<seb128> the overlay-scrollbar bugs larsu is working on is not a theme issue
<desrt> ah.  surprising.
<seb128> it's an issue with the rendering optimisation alex did
<desrt> ah.  that makes sense as well, i suppose.
 * desrt freaking loves the new alex stuff, btw
<seb128> to give some credit where it's due, the 3.8 issues we had with scrollbars turned you to be a GTK bug
<desrt> that item was on my todo list for a while (larsu and i chatted about how we'd do it when we were in copenhagen)
<seb128> and one where users were vocal about in other softwares as well
<desrt> and then alex just came with code
<larsu> desrt: which item?
 * larsu doesn't feel thrilled about alex' optimizations today
<desrt> larsu: changing how the scrolling works
<seb128> larsu, not drinking Berlin beers tonight? ;-)
<desrt> pure cairo-based.... no more GdkWindow hackery
<larsu> seb128: that was Tuesday. Can't have beer every night :)
<seb128> ;-)
 * desrt wants to drink a $22 beer...
<seb128> desrt, talk to attente
<desrt> :)
<larsu> desrt: ah, right. The thing I'm fought with is a change that leads up to that
<seb128> attente, congrats on getting the compiz key grabbing working btw, seems user feedback of the ppa is good ;-)
<larsu> I think I've found the issue, but was too exhausted to go on further earlier today
<attente> seb128, thanks
<desrt> is this the one where it only works when the user changes the keybinding after logging in?
<seb128> desrt, he fixed that!
<desrt> oh.  good
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> because that sounded ridiculous :)
 * desrt was about to offer ways to trick gsettings into reporting change notifications :)
<seb128> desrt, we seem to be on parity with gnome-shell now :p
<attente> that problem was stressful..
<desrt> attente: maybe i should buy you a $22 beer :p
<seb128> (which doesn't mean bug free)
<seb128> desrt, yeah, you should
<desrt> seb128: gnome-shell has bugs?
<desrt> weird!!!
 * seb128 would if he was in Canada
<attente> it becomes more like a $1022 beer
<seb128> huuuum, maybe I'm stepping out
<desrt> attente: because you want to buy 40 of them?
<seb128> attente, I bet you can't drink those 40 beers in one night
 * attente adds the cost of the flight
<attente> :P
<desrt> ah
<seb128> if you can I'm paying for them
<attente> at that point you might as well be in belgium i suppose...
<desrt> seb128: stop that
<desrt> seb128: we finally have a guy who knows about keyboard and input method and you want to kill him with alcohol poisoning
<seb128> yeah, that's not cool
 * seb128 stops
<seb128> attente, come to Berlin next year, we can have good beers there as well
<seb128> you can ask larsu ;-)
 * larsu confirms
<desrt> seb128: he'll be in strassbourg next year...
<seb128> \o/
<desrt> i guess the beer there is probably also okay :)
<seb128> yeah, people coming to France!
<larsu> what a coincidence: so will I!
<seb128> ;-)
<larsu> the world is such a small place
<attente> fun times :)
<seb128> ok, on that note I'm calling it a day
<desrt> seb128: good night
<seb128> thanks, you too!
<attente> nite seb128 :)
<seb128> attente, thanks, you too ;-)
<desrt> larsu: did you check that your appmenu patch works?
<seb128> larsu, you should call it a day as well, tomorrow is friday need to keep going until the W.E ;-)
<larsu> seb128: I already did. Just hanging around on irc :)
<larsu> desrt: yes
<desrt> cool.  i just ACK'd it
<larsu> thanks.
<desrt> which is meaningless since i removed myself from the product strategy team....
<larsu> you can do that now, eh?
<desrt> oops!
<larsu> I'm not on that team eitherâ¦
<desrt> you're directly in the indicators team, though
<larsu> right
 * desrt was indirectly before, via PS
<larsu> being in PS makes your inbox blow up
<desrt> ya.  this is why i left :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-11-15
<happyaron> bschaefer: replied to your email, :)
<bschaefer> happyaron, thanks!
 * bschaefer reads it
<bschaefer> happyaron, and yes, thats the unfortunate problem. Nux does not have IM module support, and implementing that would be to costly
<bschaefer> and Nux cannot use GTK/QT soo we are kind of stuck with XIM
<bschaefer> unity8 will be in QT so it wont be a problem there
<bschaefer> just unity7 :(
<happyaron> if im module isn't possible, then better thinking about preserving exising ibus code.
<happyaron> at least we don't get regression in LTs
<happyaron> LTS
<bschaefer> shoot was hoping to remove all that ibus code
<bschaefer> well at lease i can still improve the XIM code so it'll at lease render preedit for fcitx users
<happyaron> IIRC there is some IM Module-like stuff for ibus, fcitx, and hime/gcin in Unity?
<bschaefer> with IBus I wrote a while ago, where I talk directly to IBus in Nux
<bschaefer> there was a fcitx branch out there, but it never made it in
<bschaefer> other then IBus, we just use XIM for everything else
<happyaron> would be good to have, but I wonders how much the work is required for spliting them out to some kinda IM Module-like stuff.
<happyaron> fcitx's API is quite stable since 4.2.x, but anyway it's good to let imf maintain the part of code.
<bschaefer> well, the whole idea of having an IM module-like thing would be to have the client code in fctix/ibus etc, that use nux toolkit API
<happyaron> bschaefer: I think it's doable for at least ibus and fcitx at least, especially we can ask kylin people to work on fcitx if needed.
<happyaron> XIM is used only as a fallback in eyes of IM developers nowadays, it's a must but not always being used.
<bschaefer> happyaron, very true, ill have to ask if i have time to dedicate to that
<happyaron> thanks
<bschaefer> yeah, ill be happy to get that working, the fcitx code (bits of it) does exit in a branch by ccslayer
<bschaefer> by csslayer, that i can dig up and try to get land
<happyaron> I see.
<bschaefer> that way fcitx wont have horrid behavior with the preedit window in the LTS
<happyaron> yup, :)
<bschaefer> happyaron, thanks for all the info!
<happyaron> :)
<attente> did anyone run into the problem of not being able to log into a session after upgrading to T?
<pitti> Good morning
<Laney> hey
<Laney> happy friday!
<seb128> Laney, hey
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<seb128> happy friday!
<seb128> Laney, how are you?
<Laney> seb128: pretty good, looking forward to the weekend
<Laney> in which the only task is to find some sloes and then put them into gin
<seb128> you do cocktails now?
 * seb128 isn't big on gin
<Laney> not exactly a cocktail
<Laney> I don't really like gin on its own, but sloe gin is quite tasty
<Laney> and makes good presents
<seb128> do you celebrate anything?
<larsu> the weekend, of course!
<seb128> haha, good thing to celebrate!
<Laney> someone told me that you are supposed to pick them after the first frost
<seb128> larsu, good morning, happy friday!
<Laney> happened this week
<seb128> larsu, wie gets?
<Laney> hey larsu
<seb128> Laney, I see (same here, first frost this week)
<larsu> seb128, Laney: happy Friday!
<larsu> seb128: I'm very good, thanks. And you?
<Laney> so: pick, add to gin, wait a couple of months, strain, profit
<Laney> \o/
<seb128> Laney, sounds like something to try ;-) let us know how it goes
<seb128> larsu, I'm good thanks
<seb128> larsu, did you manage to not get crazy over GTK and scrollbars yesterday?
<Laney> woah
<Laney> my desktop just spontaneously rebooted
<larsu> seb128: no, I got crazy. But I think I've found the issue
<seb128> larsu, you should maybe try to nag alex a bit more with questions ;-)
<seb128> Laney, it has enough of building webkit in loop and doesn't want to spend its friday doing it!
<Laney> haha
<Laney> I've been using the Debian ppc porterbox for that
<Laney> it's actually really quite fast
<seb128> did you get any luck?
<Laney> got further, linker problem now
<Laney> It became an exercise in disabling bits of code though, so probably not the most upstreamable solution
<seb128> did you upstream the build error?
<Laney> yeah
<seb128> no reply yet I guess?
<Laney> well, pochu did then I followed up with trunk
<Laney> https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=123809
<ubot2> bugs.webkit.org bug 123809 in WebKit Gtk "[GTK] build failure when disabling JIT/Assembler" [Normal,New]
<nessita> tkamppeter_, hi there! I was wondering if you could give me a hint on how to fix/workaround an HP printer that refuses to print, cups web interface shows "Idle - "Can't feed job data into Ghostscript"", and when I send a document to print it shows "stopped  "Filter failed"". I have the latest hplip (3.13.11)
<nessita> this is on ubuntu 13.10
<Laney> slow anongit.freedesktop.org is super slow
<Laney> pitti: Looks like you installed the rb apport hook back into a different package so there's a file conflict on upgrade from saucy to trusty
 * Laney fixes
<pitti> Laney: oh, it wasn't in -data?
<Laney> seems not
<pitti> Laney: sorry; thanks
<Laney> makes sense there though
<didrocks> Laney: in a world, I wouldn't live without any other chair :)
<didrocks> with*
<didrocks> (following a g+ post for those who wonder ^)
<seb128> didrocks, (thanks, I was)
<seb128> didrocks, Laney: I've that one as well but only like it mediumly
<didrocks> seb128: what don't you like in it?
 * seb128 likes to cross legs sometimes or sit on one leg, the metal support under the armrest are in the way if you try to do that
<seb128> and the back support position can't be changed
<seb128> or it's too high for me/doesn't fit
<seb128> I guess it's good if your size fits the back thougjh
<didrocks> seb128: I can do that, but not stay that much because its hurting my back :)
<didrocks> (crossing legs)
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, it does fit perfectly for me
<didrocks> I can see not being able to reposition it can be annoying
<Laney> I could go to the ikea shop and try one
<Laney> haha, I knew someone would recommend an aeron
<Laney> the one I have now is just terrible
<Laney> there was a huge snapping noise earlier today and now I'm sitting at about a 30Â° angle to the floor
<seb128> urg
<seb128> standing desk time maybe? ;-)
<Laney> tempting
<Laney> did only buy this desk last year though, huge glass one
<seb128> mhr3, hey
<seb128> mhr3, where are the appslens filter coming from? (they are showing non translated, trying to figure if it's a code bug or missing translations)
<seb128> mhr3, the home/files/etc ones are translated
<ogra_> tkamppeter, are there any known issues with hplip in trusty ? i cant manage to set up my (networked) LaserJet 1018 (works out of the box on my raring and precise machines)
<mhr3> seb128, from home scope
<seb128> mhr3, is the app lens special in any way?
<mhr3> seb128, nope
<seb128> mhr3, what could make the same category show translated in the home lens and non translated in the app one?
<mhr3> what is a category?
<mhr3> there are not many elements that are shared in home and apps
<mhr3> if any at all
<Laney> I'm off to catch a train, have a good weekend everyone!
<seb128> mhr3, "what is a category", is that a real question?
<seb128> Laney, thanks, you too!
<mhr3> seb128, i'm not sure what you mean
<mhr3> seb128, afaict there isn't anything that's shared in both apps view and home view
<seb128> mhr3, right, they are not the same ... me checks french translations
<seb128> mhr3, in the app lens, are e.g Education Games Graphics, etc showing translated for you?
<mhr3> seb128, well, i use english... so maybe? :)
<seb128> mhr3, shrug, we should force non english devs to use their locale to dogfood translations issues :/
<mhr3> seb128, i thought that's why we employ people in france :P
 * seb128 slaps mhr3
<mhr3> worth it :D
<larsu> haha
<larsu> seb128: aren't you the one who wants French for everyone?
<seb128> larsu, yeah, we should force them, being nice doesn't work it seems :p
<larsu> seb128: :D
<seb128> mhr3, where are the categories (Education, Games, Graphics, etc) coming from?
<seb128> mhr3,
<seb128> $ grep Games unity-scope-home-6.8.2+13.10.20131003 -r
<seb128> unity-scope-home-6.8.2+13.10.20131003/data/master-scopes/applications.scope.in.in:_OptionNames=Accessories;Education;Games;Graphics;Internet;Fonts;Office;Media;Customisation;Accessibility;Developer;Science & Engineering;Dash plugins;System
<mhr3> /usr/share/unity/scopes/applications.scope
<seb128> mhr3, ^ that list?
<mhr3> yep
<seb128> mhr3, it's weird, it seems translated
<mhr3> seb128, and you're saying that files filters are ok?
<seb128> yes
<mhr3> seb128, cause that uses the exact same mechanism
<seb128> mhr3, I found an issue, the translation on the system has "Search plugins" and the source "Dash plugins"
<seb128> mhr3, I wonder if that one got renamed but the translation template didn't
<mhr3> seb128, it got updated after uife
<mhr3> i guess that's why
<mhr3> i'll make a note to ensure that we translations upstream with new scopes
<mhr3> i still don't know why they were only upstream for the past 3years
<mhr3> eh... only downstream
<seb128> mhr3, ok, so I guess the issue is outdated templates
<seb128> mhr3, well, for most of our project to avoid duplication we let the Ubuntu translators do the job
<seb128> mhr3, you want to change it to have those commited in the upstream Vcs?
<mhr3> seb128, yes
<mhr3> seb128, afaik that's what we do for unity8
<seb128> mhr3, yeah, we do it for the new projects, I don't remember why we did it the other way around but there was a reason
<seb128> mhr3, maybe for consistency between Ubuntu packages because all upstreams are not in launchpad
<seb128> mhr3, but dpm agreed, last time we discussed it, that it would make sense to have autocommit to trunk
<mhr3> we already do only autocommits to trunk, don't see why that shouldn't include translations as well
<mhr3> (meaning autolanding)
<mhr3> noone pushes to trunk manually
<mhr3> so having 1 bot pushing or 10... who cares :)
<seb128> mhr3, right
<tkamppeter> nessita, first, follow the instructions of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingPrintingProblems, especially the sections "CUPS error_log" and "Capturing print job data".
<nessita> tkamppeter, gladly!
<tkamppeter> ogra_, to my knowledge there is no problem. Note that the 1018 needs firmware loaded everytime when it is turned on. Perhaps you need to download the current plug-in (you can run the "hp-plugin" command for that or use the "hp-toolbox".
<nessita> tkamppeter, so, I filed bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cups/+bug/1251742, I attached the /var/log/cups/error_log with DEBUG info in it, my untrained eyes don't see any obviously wrong
<ubot2> nessita: Error: launchpad bug 1251742 not found
<nessita> ah, bug is private, too much personal info
<nessita> tkamppeter, gathering "print job data" now, will attach to the bug
<desrt> m_conley: ping
<m_conley> desrt: pong
<desrt> m_conley: hey.  do you know anything about the dbusmenu code for xul?
<desrt> we want to port to gmenumodel....
<m_conley> desrt: not really - chrisccoulson knows it back to front though
<desrt> m_conley: interested in helping? :)
<desrt> chris isn't really doing firefox stuff for us anymore...
<m_conley> desrt: heh, tempting. I've been tempted too many times though - I'm swamped like crazy
<m_conley> desrt: have you seen his global menu bar code?
<m_conley> that's what you're interested in porting, right?
<desrt> ya... or starting over.  who knows?
<m_conley> gotcha
<m_conley> his add-on code is not a bad starting point
<desrt> attente and i are chilling at UofT right now, btw
<m_conley> Oh, nice. :)
<m_conley> desrt: you might want to investigate doing this with jsctypes
<desrt> hm
<desrt> that gives me an interesting idea
<desrt> gjs is mozjs
<desrt> i wonder if there would be any way to get gjs into the browser....
<desrt> that would make this _so_ easy
<m_conley> indeed!
<desrt> so it is possible to get at the xul layer from js?
<desrt> is there anything that makes this a better choice that going via C?
<m_conley> desrt: all Chris's add-on did was iterate the XUL menu nodes, and create equivalent nodes for dbusmenu, and then hide the XUL menu. Then he added an observer for when things were added or removed from the menu so that his menu would update.
<m_conley> desrt: that's all quite possible from JS
<m_conley> It'd be a better choice because binary add-ons are the worst. ;)
<desrt> well
<desrt> i guess having this one shipped by the distro mitigates some of the worst ills of that
<m_conley> I suppose
<m_conley> desrt: makes it so that the add-on can be used across versions very easily?
<m_conley> without having to recompile for each?
<desrt> not sure how big of a concern that is for us
<desrt> is xul alive and well?
<desrt> i keep hearing plans to replace it with html outright
<m_conley> desrt: *shrug*, it's up to you. You're the implementor. I always veer towards js + jsctypes for this sort of stuff though.
<m_conley> those are very long-term plans
<m_conley> XUL will be with us for a while
<desrt> attente is the implementor, in fact :)
<attente> hiya :)
<m_conley> but once Australis ships and we make it all pretty and perfect, we'll take a look at what we can do to start surgically replacing some of our XUL with HTML.
<m_conley> attente: hiyo
<kenvandine> sigh... i have a content-hub branch that had failing tests when i last touched it 2 weeks ago... now they all pass, wtf!
<kenvandine> i really don't think i fixed the tests... maybe this is a sign i need the weekend!
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-11-16
<Mapley> How did the Ubuntu devs achieve a seamless transition from Plymouth to LightDM without any VT messages leaking through? [xpost]
<darkxst> pitti, any plans to update upower in Trusty?
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-11-17
<happyaron> hi, anyone knows that what's the timezone of the time shown on summit.u.c for vUDS? is it GMT?
<Ampelbein> happyaron: It says UTC for me.
<happyaron> Ampelbein: thanks
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-11-10
<pitti> Good morning
<larsu> good morning!
<pitti> hey larsu, wie gehts?
<larsu> pitti: super danke! Und dir?
<pitti> larsu: mir auch, danke; wir waren gestern mal wieder Badminton spielen und saunieren, es wird Herbst :)
<larsu> pitti: ja, es wird echt kalt langsam
<mlankhorst> Hello, desktop!
<mlankhorst> always a good start when your system dies after resume with a ton of kworkers :/
<willcooke> morning all
<larsu> morning willcooke!
<willcooke> hey larsu, good weekend?
<larsu> definitely. Did (almost) nothing for two days. Felt great :=
<larsu> how about you?
<willcooke> I went to a 20 year university reunion in Nottingham.
<willcooke> I'm still hung over
<willcooke> too old.
<larsu> haha, sounds like you had a lot of fun there ;)
<willcooke> it was great to see people again after such a long time.
<larsu> I can only imagine... :P
<willcooke> ha!
<larsu> but yeah, I had the same feeling at my 10 year high-school reunion
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<larsu> made me feel old
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> hey seb128
<seb128> hey larsu willcooke
 * larsu waves to seb128
<pitti> hey seb128
<seb128> hey pitti, wie gehts?
<pitti> seb128: sehr gut, danke! wir haben gestern das erste Mal wieder Badminton gespielt und sind in die Sauna gegangen :)
<pitti> seb128: and we've been to the stadium on Saturday, that was fun!
<Noskcaj> seb128, i'm about to offline, but can you take another look at what is being done with gnome-media
<seb128> Noskcaj, I've no real interest in gnome-media
<seb128> pitti, sounds like a fun w.e :-=)
<pitti> seb128: oui !
<larsu> pitti: setting LD_LIBRARY_PATH and GI_REPOSITORY_PATH should be enough for gir apps to pick up a local library, no?
 * larsu is doubting himself
<pitti> larsu: yes
<larsu> weird....
<larsu> but thanks :)
<Laney> yo yo
 * Laney regrets making the dentist appointment so early
<larsu> good morning Laney. Toothache?
<Laney> nope, annual check up
<larsu> good to hear :)
<Laney> good weekend?
<Laney> willcooke was in town?
<larsu> awesome, ya. Very relaxing
<larsu> you?
<Laney> not bad
<Laney> furniture shopping ...
<Laney> maybe that is bad ...
<seb128> hey Laney, wie gehts?
<larsu> Laney: lol. That's good. Could use some of this myself
<larsu> but I'm always too lazy
<Laney> I've been trying and failing to delegate
<Laney> yo seb128, prima danke!
<Laney> schÃ¶nes wochenende?
 * Laney retrieves his cold breakfast
<Laney> damn you extra 15 minute lie in
<willcooke> Laney, I went to Oceana(?) :(((((
<Laney> my god
<seb128> Laney, good w.e indeed ;-)
<Laney> you were about 1 minute from the climbing centre though ;-)
<Laney> I only went there one time, which was during freshers week
<Laney> rock city was the place for me
<willcooke> Eeeee, in maaa day it were Ritzy.  And beer were a pound a pint.  I had to pay 8 quid to be let in, and a further 4 quid to enter the coat raffle
<Laney> I hope it was everything you hoped for
<Laney> and more
<willcooke> We had planned to go to Rock City but there was a gig on
<Laney> shame
<willcooke> still, I don't have to go back in there for another 10 years
<Laney> it should have been my 10 year sixth form/school reunion this year
<Laney> but nothing happened
<larsu> seb128: apparently for some people bug #1071738 is a big issue on the LTSs (I got a personal email about this last week)
<ubot5> bug 1071738 in libappindicator (Ubuntu) "Indicator scroll event says direction UP on 12.10 even when scrolling down" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1071738
<Laney> also, for reference: http://www.nottinghampost.com/Maggots-fall-ceiling-comedy-night-Nottingham-s/story-21754325-detail/story.html
<larsu> seb128: do you think it could be SRU material?
<seb128> larsu, sounds like SRU material yes
<seb128> larsu, is that the issue you were never able to reproduce or another one?
<seb128> larsu, wasn't Trevinho_ SRUing some of those?
<larsu> seb128: no, I can reproduce it and just worked up a fix
<larsu> seb128: he was?
 * larsu saw no activity about that in trunk
<seb128> larsu, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libindicator/12.10.2+14.04.20141007.1-0ubuntu1
<seb128> I'm probably confusing things
<seb128> I was thinking about ^
<seb128> "  * IndicatorNG: Reverse the scroll delta on left scroll events (LP: #1342731)"
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1342731 in nux (Ubuntu) "Horizontal Scrolling over Indicator-ng (and sound) does not work as expected" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1342731
<larsu> seb128: ya this is different. This one is becasue of an incorrect signal definition in libappindicator and only affects app indicators
<larsu> *because
<seb128> k
<seb128> sounds like a good one to fix in the LTS yes
<seb128> larsu, thanks for working on that!
<seb128> pitti, is https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/libappindicator/lp1071738/+merge/241244 looking good to you?
<seb128> larsu, did you figure out why it was not loading your local version?
<pitti> seb128: I obvioulsy didn't test it, but LGTM, yes
<seb128> pitti, danke
<Laney> Noskcaj: If you do anything, get Debian to do the same please
<larsu> seb128: yes, I built libappindicator, not libappindicator3 (didn't know we still had gtk2 support in there which is enabled *by default*)
<seb128> larsu, I'm going to put a landing for it
<Laney> Sounds like it could go away
<seb128> larsu, then we can do a SRU
<larsu> seb128: thanks a lot!
<seb128> yw!
 * larsu likes seb128's Monday morning speed ;)
<seb128> lol
<Laney> all that spa time
<larsu> :D
<seb128> Laney, pitti: can you review https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/ubuntu-system-settings/lp1390629/+merge/241150 ? did we overlook CI results to land the upower changes (just wondering why it landed if it made a test turn red)
<Laney> I think that is required, would be nice if we can make it dynamic though
<Laney> and I would guess that people aren't looking at the tests as much any more
<seb128> why not?
<seb128> we have tests we should be looking at those :/
<Laney> I can only guess but probably once it became acceptable for them to be 'unstable' (i.e. nobody fixed them up when that started happening) then reviewers expected that status and so didn't look when they saw it
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> it's not acceptable for them to be unstable
<seb128> but point taken
<Laney> for example https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/autopilot-testrunner-otto-vivid/43/console which is linked from kenvandine's MP there is pretty bad
<Laney> and I thought there were more tests than that...
<Laney> hmm, timed out
<seb128> yeah, the CI setup had issues in that run
<seb128> usually I do a retry when that happens
<seb128> Ken seems to do the same
<Laney> You could make the policy be that the runs have to succeed before a branch can be merged
<seb128> yeah, I don't like rules for rules though
<seb128> I would prefer if people would be reasonable and checked the results of tests and applied good judgement on whether the failure is real or flakyness/can be ignored
<seb128> which I though we were doing
<Laney> me too
<Laney> when I made that branch it was right to not have it, because we were on old upower then
<Laney> I should have been explicit because later on I forgot that this was required
<Laney> or I should have done what I said in my comment and made it dynamic somehow
<seb128> yeah, no worry, mistakes happen
<seb128> but we have too many red runs recently, we should try to get back to a better state
<Laney> start with this branch
<Laney> did you retry ci?
<seb128> not on that one, on 2 others yes
<seb128> larsu, libappindicator, lcov 1.11 needs to be added to the list, want to do that as well?
<seb128> that "lcov_version_list="1.6 1.7 1.8 1.9 1.10" coded list is stupid
<larsu> seb128: ugh, right. I'll add it on the same MR, because seriously
<seb128> larsu, danke
<pitti> seb128: re; looking
<seb128> pitti, unping, Laney did comment
<pitti> ack
<mdeslaur> seb128: hi!
<mdeslaur> seb128: I got bored this weekend, and beat gtk3 xchat-gnome into submission
<mdeslaur> seb128: want to give it a try? https://launchpad.net/~mdeslaur/+archive/ubuntu/testing
<willcooke> mdeslaur, blimey! :)  attente_ is looking at this as well - I'll ask him to chat to you when he comes online
<mdeslaur> willcooke: oh, cool
<xnox> mdeslaur: ++ awesome
<xnox> mdeslaur: i need to beat xchat-indicator into hexchat submission
<dpm> hey willcooke, quick q: who's the best person to ask about issues with unity7 not loading after an upgrade to 14.10?
<willcooke> dpm, probably bregma
<dpm> ok, thanks!
<mlankhorst> oh great, I found why intel rotation failed on utopic, this is going to need a sru I guess
<willcooke> dpm, I've seen a few reports of "blank screen after upgrade" but not with enough information to help us trouble shoot - have you got the problem?
<dpm> willcooke, not sure. What I've had on 2 computers is that after the lightdm login unity won't load the launcher or indicators. I can get it to load the launcher from a terminal, but not the indicators. I can consistently reproduce it, if it's the same bug
<willcooke> dpm, humm, sounds different
<seb128> mdeslaur, cool!
<seb128> dpm, what do you have in .cache/upstart/gnome-session-Unity.log?
<czajkowski> willcooke: yup Simon Phipps was talking about that on my G+ stream recently about his upgrade not working out. think popey was going to give him some stuff to run and see if he could get more details
<willcooke> czajkowski, yeah, I think this is a slightly different issue - but let's see...
<dpm> seb128, here's the output of .cache/upstart/gnome-session-Unity.log: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/8919020/
<Laney> mvo: hey, if you have access to changelogs.u.c, would it be possible to add vivid to meta-release-development?
<Laney> also, how's it going? :)
<mvo> Laney: sure thing, let me do that now
<seb128> dpm, hum, I don't see anything obvious in there...
<Laney> cheers
<mvo> Laney: I wonder if we have a upgrader at this point :)
<mvo> Laney: not too bad, how are you?
 * Laney is porting $stuff to vte-2.91
<Laney> a bit cold
<Laney> I'm being stubborn and refusing to put the heating on
<mvo> Laney: yeah, cold here as well, I will upload a new apt soonish with lots of $stuff
 * Laney hopes the compiles warm your room up
<mvo> haha, it does
<Laney> \o/
<Laney> can you just do a trivial upload of u-r-u to get the upgrader?
<Laney> or is it more complex?
<Laney> hang on
<Laney> is that one going to be executed instead of my fixed version?
<dpm> np, thanks seb128 anyway
<mlankhorst> it would, but it's easier to run the vacuum cleaner since it can use up to 2400w :P
<ricotz> Laney, hi :), did you receive my question about vte2.91?
<Laney> ricotz: yes but you went offline
<Laney> the upgrader uses this feature
<ricotz> it would be better to adjust the "upgrade" then
<Laney> feel free
<ricotz> then please leave it to use the old vte
<Laney> no
<Laney> we're not having two versions in main
<ricotz> i ported this patch in the gnome3 too, but chpe explicitly asked me to drop it to use this library transition to get rid of this custom patch
<Laney> I would like that, don't get me wrong, I just don't think I'm going to be the one to work on it
<Laney> or at least not at the minute
<ricotz> ok, but you are currently preventing it to get "fixed"
<ricotz> while readding this patch again
<Laney> no I'm not
<seb128> that's called "not creating regressions for users"
<Laney> if someone comes with a fix for the upgrader then we can remove the patch
<Laney> I'm just not doing it, that's different from preventing it
<seb128> and having a patch doesn't prevent anyone to work on a better solution
<ricotz> alright then
<Laney> I know it's not the best but at least I'm actively working on porting software so that counts for something :)
<Laney> related: VMs on spinning rust drives are the worst
<Laney> s/VMs on//?
<willcooke> unrelated:  I had a tidy up yesterday and threw away a spindle full of blank DVDs.  I could replace them all with a cheapo USB thumb drive
<Laney> mvo: had some questions ^ up there btw, didn't highlight you
<Laney> I don't know how this downloading tarball stuff works
<mvo> Laney: ups, sorry, missed the earlier question. its slightly more complex, but not really, I commited what needs to be done and will do a final test
<Laney> basically: how do I test?
<mvo> Laney: its all part of bzr-buildpackage
<mvo> Laney: oh
<mvo> Laney: just run what is in README.devel
<Laney> oh yes
<mvo> Laney: revno with the updated version is 2841
<Laney> nice, missed that, thanks
<mvo> yw
<Laney> I guess I just run on utopic with -d
<mvo> Laney: yeah, once its uploaded and the meta-release is updated that will be fine too
 * Laney goes to try
<Laney> once the aforementioned zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzist-upgradezzzzzzzzzz finishes
<mvo> Laney: does it work for you? sorry, a bit busy with $stuff right now
<seb128> kenvandine, hey! had a good w.e ?
<kenvandine> yeah, and you?
<seb128> I did, thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, content-hub questions for you ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, do you know why nothing is associated with videos?
<kenvandine> gallery-app should
<seb128> the other way around
<kenvandine> ah, picking
<seb128> select a video in gallery, pick "share"
<seb128> you get a screen "no handler"
<kenvandine> oh
<seb128> looks like you should be able to mms/facebook, same as photos
<kenvandine> because we don't have any share handlers
<seb128> we do for photos
<seb128> shouldn't mms/facebook handle videos as well?
<kenvandine> mms probably should
<kenvandine> the facebook app would need work to support it
<seb128> k
<seb128> speaking of facebook, I'm unable to share an image with it
<seb128> picking "share" from gallery sends me to a webbrowser, that asks me for credential
<seb128> if I enter my password I end up on my wall
<seb128> but not with the image selectoed
<seb128> if I go back to gallery and do it again it goes it loop
<seb128> it->in
<seb128> is that a known issue?
<kenvandine> not that i know of
<kenvandine> sounds like an online-accounts issue :(
<seb128> if I swipe back to gallery and try to share again it fails without saying anything
<seb128> can you try on your device to see if you see the same thing?
<kenvandine> seb128, not quite the same
<kenvandine> doesn't open a browser, just see a blank screen
<kenvandine> ../../../../lib/SignOn/identityimpl.cpp 96 updateState Updating state:  "NeedsRegistration" SignOn::IdentityImpl(0xb8b5a060)
<seb128> shrug
<kenvandine> is in the facebook webapp log
<seb128> did you have fb open before?
<seb128> does it do the same if you close everything and try again?
<kenvandine> seb128, ok, it is different if i didn't have facebook open already
<kenvandine> it just starts it
<kenvandine> and doesn't load the share UI
<kenvandine> WebApps API message received: {"args":"[{\"callbackid\":\"ubuntu-webapps-api0.26988044986501336\"}]","name":"ContentHub.onShareRequested","target":"ubuntu-webapps-binding-call"}
<kenvandine> Unauthorize API call blocked: ContentHub.onShareRequested
<seb128> k
<seb128> so similar to my issue
<Laney> mvo: not tested yet, sorry, went to lunch
<Laney> will do now
<mvo> Laney: thanks, I run it now as well
<seb128> kenvandine, do you think that mms should support videos then? where should that be reported against? the messaging app itself?
<kenvandine> seb128, messaging-app
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<desrt> hi hi hackers
<seb128> hey desrt, had a good w.e?
<desrt> yup
<desrt> learned django :)
<seb128> kenvandine, https://bugs.launchpad.net/messaging-app/+bug/1325009 states that video was left out of rtm, fair enough
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1325009 in messaging-app "support sending MMS for photos and vcards" [High,Fix released]
<desrt> seb128: you?
<seb128> desrt, stop spending w.e on the computer!
<seb128> desrt, mine was good, some shopping, played tennis, went to the spa, relaxed
<desrt> seb128: i needed to make the website for mekaro (our yearly ontario/quebec esperanto conference) :)
<desrt> it's in toronto next year
<seb128> nice
<seb128> dear larsu, please make my indicator-messages clear sources once read again, thanks
<larsu> dear seb128, pretty sure I already did ?!
<seb128> I wish launchpad was sending an email to say "new commit on that branch you reviewed"
<seb128> larsu, looking ;-)
<larsu> seb128: oops, usually I comment on the MR for that reason. Did I forget?
<seb128> oh indeed, new commit
<seb128> you didn't
<seb128> I guess it's w.e backlog overlook fail
<seb128> larsu, testing that now ;-)
<larsu> thanks
<Laney> mvo: seems to be doing things which are good
 * Laney proposes the branch
<Laney> also, man, we didn't kill extras yet?
<ricotz> hmm, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cssutils/1.0-1 seems to be completely broken
<Laney> there's a -2
<ricotz> although is transitioned to "release" while it isn't installable
<ricotz> oh there is?
<Laney> also, probably more on topic in #ubuntu-motu :)
<mdeslaur> Sweet5hark: are you going to upload lo 4.3.3 to vivid?
<Laney> xnox: how do I get to the vte widget in the installer?
<xnox> Laney: boot with debug-ubiquity on kernel cmdline; press ctrl-alt-t
<Laney> hmm
<xnox> Laney: or you mean, during installation click the expander on the bottom left
<xnox> which shows current apt progress?
<Laney> it's tailing a busybox log
<Laney> so probably the first thing
<xnox> (well ubiquity progress, must use slow hardware cause the expander is only available during slideshow)
<xnox> Laney: what's the problem?
<Laney> I don't actually see where the slideshow one is done in code
<Laney> porting to new vte
<xnox> Laney: so the installer has multiple "major" sections. which are in practice "header", "main contents", and "bottom layer".
<mvo> Laney: cool, if its looking good I can upload now
<attente_> mdeslaur: i tried your testing ppa, looking good
<xnox> Laney: each are GtkNotebook, during slideshow we change main notebook to slideshow, and the bottom status bar from progress dots to progress info with the expander.
<attente_> mdeslaur: was there any patch you applied to get the server list to fill the window?
<seb128> kenvandine, Laney: is https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/generic-deb-autopilot-runner-vivid-mako/84/testReport/junit/ubuntu_system_settings.tests.test_plugins/SystemSettingsUpowerTestCases/test_battery_plugin_battery_hotplugging/ the issue with the new upower or flakyness/something else?
<kenvandine> i fixed that
<kenvandine> https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/ubuntu-system-settings/lp1390629/+merge/241150
<Laney> same thing, yeah
<kenvandine> i'm going to try to make it check at runtime
<seb128> thanks
<kenvandine> i guess i can do that with python and the gir
<Laney> mvo: best if you do your upload, need to port ubiquity / package new gnome-terminal so that we can swap the main/universe versions of vte
<mvo> Laney: happy to do that
<Laney> might not be done today
<Laney> but if you want to check it out: lp:~laney/ubuntu-release-upgrader/vte2.91
<mdeslaur> attente_: hrm, I don't recall that
<mdeslaur> attente_: in the connect dialog?
<mvo> Laney: cool, looks fine, assuming you tested it?
<Laney> yeah running an upgrade now, seems to be working
<mvo> \o/
<attente_> mdeslaur: yeah, when i was running xchat-gnome and gtk+ from master, the server list is only tall enough for showing two networks at a time
<attente_> but running your xchat-gnome against gtk master displays them all
<mdeslaur> attente_: oh, yeah, there's a patch called 01_finish_gtk3_port.patch in there
<mdeslaur> attente_: I think that fixes that particular dialog
<mdeslaur> attente_: do you have anything else to add to that package? I'd file upstream bugs and send my patches, and I'd upload it to vivid
<attente_> mdeslaur: nothing to add, could you please let me know the bug number when you upstream it?
<mdeslaur> attente_: sure. I'll file 3 or 4 of them, will update the patch headers, and will let you know
<attente_> mdeslaur: thanks!
<seb128> kenvandine, content-hub doesn't support random mimetypes atm right? (asking in the context of opening e.g a pdf from email)
<seb128> kenvandine, pitti, dpm, could one of you review review https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-ui-extras/update-translations-template/+merge/241286 ?
<seb128> it's a standard "set up for langpacks" change
<pitti> seb128: replied
<seb128> pitti, I usually do that because dh_translations do other things like adding the domain to .desktop, etc
<Laney> but you don't call dh_translations
<seb128> doh
<pitti> seb128: yeah, that ^ and I'm not sure whether unity8 can actually process the domain in .desktop files these days?
<seb128> k, so let's me change that
<pitti> I think I talked about that with some unity developer the other day, though; it should definitively be fixed either way, of course
<seb128> pitti, updated
<pitti> seb128: moi aussi
<seb128> pitti, danke :-)
<kenvandine> seb128, it doesn't support random mimetypes yet
<kenvandine> seb128, but the browser does support downloading a pdf i think
<kenvandine> if you have pdfjsviewer installed
<kenvandine> from the click store
<seb128> I've that installed
<seb128> I tried to open a pdf from dekko
<seb128> the file-manager doesn't have a "open" either
<mdeslaur> attente_: ok, filed 739895, 739896, 739897, 739898, 739901, 739902
<attente_> mdeslaur: thanks!
<seb128> bregma, hey, I noticed https://code.launchpad.net/~brandontschaefer/overlay-scrollbar/hidpi-support/+merge/214283 ... is that something you planned to land? it's hi-dpi work and approved, should probably be uploaded
<bregma> seb128, I believe there was a serious problem if scale factor >= 2, I'll have to have the work revisited
<seb128> bregma, k, maybe the status should be changed away from approved then?
<bregma> bschaefer, what was the real status of that MP ^^^ ?
<bschaefer> bregma, o, umm yeah an issue with scale factor >= 2
<bschaefer> gtk was doing something strange, layouts all messed up, event mouse detection all messed up (ie. you couldn't actually click on the scroll bar)
<bschaefer> bregma, im not sure if Trevinho_ took a look at it or not
<seb128> seems like it should be changed to work in progress then?
<bregma> bschaefer, can we do as seb128 asks and retest on Vivid?
<seb128> bschaefer trying to escape the question ;-)
<bschaefer> bregma, yeah
<bschaefer> seb128, no mir took over the tty :(
<bschaefer> and hung my machine haha
<bschaefer> seb128, yeah i would love to get that landed!
<bschaefer> soo i can test it out again
<seb128> thanks
<bschaefer> np!
<dpm> seb128, sorry, I was otp, but seems Martin already took care of the translations branch review
 * willcooke -> EOD
<willcooke> o/
<seb128> dpm, hey, thanks
<seb128> dpm, do you know what's the deal with vivid translations? is there a long backlog delaying things to be imported?
<dpm> seb128, they probably haven't been opened for imports. I'll talk to wgrant tomorrow morning
<seb128> dpm, thanks
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-11-11
<pitti> Good morning
<larsu> good morning pitti!
<pitti> hey larsu, how are you?
<larsu> pitti: good thanks! A bit tired :)
<larsu> and you?
<pitti> larsu: heh, same
<mvo> Laney: I updated meta-release-development now
<pitti> hey mvo, guten Morgen
<mvo> hey pitti, guten morgen
<pitti> Package: perl
<pitti> Priority: optional
<pitti> mvo: ^ all good now?
<mvo> \o/
<mvo> yeah, I already noticed in the system-image buildlog, really great
<mvo> thanks a bunch!
<pitti> mvo: heh, no worries -- you fixed i-s-h :)
<mvo> :)
<willcooke> morning all
<willcooke> lots of public hols today
<larsu> morning. Germany doesn't have a public holiday today
<larsu> (in response to your mail)
<willcooke> this lie to me: http://www.holidays-info.com/Holidays-Germany/2014/holidays_2014.html
<willcooke> oh, I see it's not a "legal holiday"
<Laney> yo
<willcooke> hi Laney
<Laney> what's the haps
<willcooke> whole load of peeps being on holiday
<willcooke> except Germany who are not
<Laney> who is? france?
<willcooke> France, Canada, US
<Laney> I see
<Laney> not me, no sir
<pitti> hey Laney
<pitti> hey willcooke
<pitti> oh, that explains a lot
<willcooke> morning pitti
<Laney> hey pitti, what's up?
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<larsu> hi seb128!
<seb128> hey larsu ;-)
<OrokuSaki> Anyone use 14.04 Desktop or 14.10 on Arm?
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<OrokuSaki> I cannot get gnome-flashback (metacity) to run.. And I do not have 3D Acceleration
<pitti> seb128: j'ai croiÃ© que tu as une fÃªte aujourd'hui ?
<pitti> seb128: ooh -- pas dans Hollande, je suppose ?
<OrokuSaki> I recompiled mesa.. still no go... I was getting a LibGL error
<OrokuSaki> Anyone run 14.04 on arm with fbdev (x11)?
<seb128> pitti, salut, oui mais je suis rentrÃ© en France ce w.e et j'ai fait la route jeudi, donc je rattrape un peu du travail aujourd'hui en Ã©change
<seb128> OrokuSaki, hey, I don't think any of us does that no
<OrokuSaki> Well.. if you get bored... I think it is broken
<OrokuSaki> I ran 13.10 just fine.. but 14.04 seems to have issues without 3d acceleration
<pitti> seb128: ah, pour visiter tes parents ?
<OrokuSaki> thanks!
<seb128> pitti, oui
<OrokuSaki> yeah... Fedora 21 works out of the box with freedreno.... Though I like Ubuntu's Onscreen Keyboard
<OrokuSaki> Hmmmm
<seb128> pitti, et en Allemagne vous ne fetez pas le 11 novembre ?
<OrokuSaki> Guess I could run onboard with Fedora... give that a try
<seb128> or you could try e.g xubuntu
<larsu> seb128: we do (in some parts), but it's not an official holiday
<pitti> seb128: non, mais nous mangeons beaucoup de beignets !
<OrokuSaki> Hmmm Oh yeah... Xubuntu.. thanks
<OrokuSaki> =)
<OrokuSaki> Wayland.... I think I might do that
<pitti> seb128: j'encore dois les acheter :)
<pitti> seb128: (carnaval commence aujourd'hui)
<seb128> miam
<seb128> j'aime les beignets ;-)
<Laney> "miam" is "yum"?
 * Laney likes that
<seb128> Laney, yes ;-)
<willcooke> curse you Google Talk plugin
<davmor2> willcooke: it works fine, your just holding it wrong ;)
<davmor2> you're even
<willcooke> oooohh
<willcooke> I expect Chromium has updated
 * willcooke restarts his browser
<willcooke> (s)
<willcooke> aahhhhhhh
<willcooke> it's all gone blue
<willcooke> hummmm
<willcooke> looks like "use gtk+" theme suddenly became selected for no reason
<willcooke> qengho, ^^^
<willcooke> qengho, might be nothing
<Laney> larsu: want to help with a GtkStyleContext question/issue?
<willcooke> but fyi
<Laney> :)
<larsu> Laney: sure
 * larsu was at lunch
<Laney> larsu: oops, sorry, mostly contextless, got distracted :P
<Laney> GT 3.14 doesn't get the background from the theme properly
<Laney> ...or the foreground
<Laney> if I paste the TerminalScreen {} CSS into the inspector (yay), then it does pick it up
<Laney> do you have any idea what that could be?
<larsu> what TerminalScreen css?
<Laney> in the theme
<Laney> sets the default colours
<qengho> willcooke: hrm. what's blue? the tab bar?
<larsu> Laney: ah, setting TerminalScreen from the theme doesn't work?
 * larsu is still unsure what Laney means
<Laney> right
<larsu> do you have it in its own css file?
<Laney> I didn't change the theme
<larsu> is that included from gtk-main.css?
<Laney> it works in 3.12
<larsu> oh, I see
 * larsu has a look
<Laney> I guess if you build gnome-terminal 3.14 you should see it
<Laney> if not I could put debs somewhere
<larsu> that would make my life easier :)
<Laney> kay
<larsu> ugh, gnome-terminal.css is a mess :-/
<willcooke> qengho, yeah - looks like it reverted to Gtk themes for one of my profiles, it's all ok now
<Laney> larsu: http://people.canonical.com/~laney/package-junkyard/
<larsu> thnks!
<qengho> willcooke: I haven't seen it, and I'd like to understand. Okay how? Did you have to do anything to make it okay?
<willcooke> qengho, I ran the upgrade this morning, but I still had Chromium open.  Upgrade finished, did some stuff, Gtalk plugin crashed, figured I should restart browser anyway, did that
<willcooke> qengho, then when it opened I had a blue header to the window.  I went in to settings and clicked Use Classic Theme
<willcooke> qengho, and then everything was back to normal
<qengho> Hrmpf. Weird.
<larsu> Laney: now my terminal doesn't work anymore :(
<Laney> "doesn't work"!
<willcooke> qengho, I think it was just "one of those things"  I'll see if I can recreate it...
<larsu> it installed anyway even though vte is not newest version
<larsu> and now it crashes on startup
<qengho> I don't like those things. Maybe GTK theme update at same time, judging from chatter here?
<larsu> tries to activate the org.gnome.Terminal (or similar) on the bus, but that exits with 127
<willcooke> qengho, could be, yeah
<Laney> it Depends on the vte it needs so I don't understand how that could happen
<larsu> me neither :)
<larsu> but now I can't seem to get the old version back
 * larsu tries specifying it explicitely
<Laney> apt-get install gnome-terminal-{,data}/vivid
<Laney> erm
<Laney> apt-get install gnome-terminal{,-data}/vivid
<larsu> ya, that worked
<larsu> thanks :)
<Laney> it upgraded and launched for me in a vm
<Laney> I put "deb http://people.canonical.com/~laney/package-junkyard ./" in sources.list and upgraded using apt
<larsu> oh that works? I installed the .debs manually
<larsu> ugh, now gnome-terminal crashed after trying to find something
 * larsu runs an upgrade
<larsu> Laney: how do you run the inspector? Shortcuts still don't work for me
<larsu> and starting it with GTK_DEBUG=interactive doesn't work either
<Laney> larsu: run the gnome-terminal-server with the env var
<larsu> Laney: it starts a second instance of that when I open a terminal
<larsu> weird, shouldn't it try to get the name?
<Laney> um?
<Laney> shouldn't do
<larsu> ya, shouldn't...
<Laney> how can it even do that if the first one has the name?
<larsu> I don't know, trying to find out right now
<Laney> sorry for all the yak shaving ...
<larsu> he, no worries :)
<larsu> Laney: the one I start manually doesn't seem to request the name...
<larsu> according to d-feet. Not sure if I trust that anymore :)
<Laney> certainly does here :/
<Laney> it's got quite a fast timeout though, like 10 seconds
<larsu> weird. How do you start it?
<larsu> I see it time out because the inspector closes
<Laney> GTK_DEBUG=interactive /usr/lib/gnome-terminal/gnome-terminal-server
<larsu> definitely open a terminal before tht
<larsu> and I see two server processes
<larsu> and only running the one doesn't make the name appear
<larsu> Laney: from a vt?
<Laney> terminator
<larsu> hm, starting it from xterm works indeed
<larsu> I guess the session bus doesn't get picked up correctly from the vt or something
<larsu> (I do set DISPLAY=)
<larsu> gnome-terminal-server should warn, though
<Laney> ah, you probably need DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS set
<larsu> probably, but I thought setting the display makes it do the right thing
<larsu> apparently not :)
<larsu> Laney: setting other stuff in gnome-terminal.css has an effect, so it does get sources
<larsu> *sourced
<larsu> maybe gnome-terminal overrides colors on startup?
<larsu> which would be consistent with overriding them (again) in the inspector workds
<larsu> brb
 * Laney too, lunch
<willcooke> got to head out for a bit, bbl
<willcooke> back
<Laney> pitti: could you push lp:~laney/aptdaemon/ubuntu-vivid to lp:~aptdaemon-developers/aptdaemon/ubuntu-vivid please?
<pitti> Laney: done; cheers!
<Laney> ty
<Laney> now to hunt for more reviews
<Laney> tedg: https://code.launchpad.net/~laney/libpam-freerdp/port/+merge/241309 please review quickly
<Laney> that CI is using *precise*?
<tedg> Laney, I believe there was a reason originally for that. But I imagine it's gone now.
<tedg> dbarth might know.
<tedg> I don't think they're supporting it on precise anymore.
<tedg> With the new LTS and all.
<Laney> well, surely we can make changes in trunk for vivid and re-branch if necessary :)
<Laney> xnox: https://code.launchpad.net/~laney/ubiquity/vte2.91/+merge/241310 if you'd be so kind (+ an upload, I'm scared to touch it)
<tedg> Laney, Could you look at this one? https://code.launchpad.net/~albertsmuktupavels/indicator-applet/libpanel-applet-3.10+/+merge/230851
<xnox> Laney: pwww. that looks a bit wrong (e.g. dependencies, i'll fix that)
<xnox> Laney: is spawn_sync does a fork and unblock the main thread?
<xnox> Laney: we do not want to wait for the tail_cmd to exit.
<xnox> because it doesn't.
<xnox> Laney: on _sync is because it's a dbus call?!
<xnox> right.
<Laney> xnox: Not dbus, it means wait for the process to be executed before returning I think
<Laney> there's no async API for this any mroe
<Laney> tedg: fine by me if mitya57 is happy
<Laney> you should add him to the team for -applet reviews ;-)
<Laney> tedg: you ok with me training both of these (libpam-freerdp indicator-applet)?
<tedg> Laney, Sure, go ahead!
<Laney> thanks
<mitya57> Laney, tedg: I am happy, yes.
<Laney> it is grinding through the machine
<mitya57> (though new gnome-panel first needs my gnome-menus change uploaded)
<Laney> you'll be able to do a no-change rebuild then
 * willcooke -> EOD.. o/
<brainwash> attente_: hey, do plan to backport/sru the fix for bug 1307657 to trusty?
<ubot5> bug 1307657 in xfce4-indicator-plugin (Ubuntu Trusty) "UBUNTU_MENUPROXY should not be set in Xfce" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1307657
<brainwash> if no, then you should mark it as won't fix (trusty)
<attente_> brainwash: hmm.. don't know what happened there, i guess it just needs someone to sponsor it
<brainwash> attente_: it's sru worthy I think
<brainwash> attente_: want to prepare the sru paperwork?
<attente_> brainwash: sure, thanks for letting me know
<brainwash> I guess there is no need to hurry, but it would be nice if the fix lands in trusty at some point :)
<brainwash> awesome
<ari-tczew> I've proposed a merge of gimp. Would be nice to get it sponsored :-) bug 1366560
<ubot5> bug 1366560 in gimp (Ubuntu) "Please upgrade GIMP to version 2.8.14" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1366560
<ray__> hello. i have questions about navigating between windows of an application. the logic seemed wrong to me, but I am trying to find a way to report this or suggest something so that it would be useful...
<ray__> anyone willing to discuss alt-grave behavior vs click on an app icon in the Launcher behavior?
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-11-12
<ray__> gack. crashed. if anyone responded, apologies....
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> morning
<seb128> lut didrocks
<pitti> bonjour seb128 et didrocks, comment allez-vous ? avez-vous eu une bonne fÃªte ?
<pitti> ah, seb128 n'a pas eu une fÃªte ..
<seb128> lut pitti, Ã§a va bien ?
<pitti> seb128: oui, merci
<didrocks> pitti: pluvieux, mais c'Ã©tait un bon week-end prolongÃ©, oui ! :)
<pitti> seb128: mon petit-dÃ©jeuner: deux beignets :)
<seb128> pitti, miam! :-)
<seb128> pitti, ce n'est pas la saison des beignets en France
<pitti> seb128: quand est-il ?
<darkxst> seb128, larsu gtk inspector requires libgtk-3-dev to be installed for the keybindings to work
<pitti> seb128: ici la saison est la carnival, alors de novembre Ã  fevrir
<seb128> pitti, en fÃ©vrier
<seb128> pitti, http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mardi_gras
<larsu> darkxst: are you sure? I have it installed and keybindings don't work
<pitti> seb128: mais c'est difficile Ã  dire -- on peut acheter des beignets toute l'annÃ©e (alors maintenant il y a beaucoup plus de varietÃ©s)
<seb128> larsu, is org.gtk.Settings.Debug gschema installed?
<seb128> larsu, dpkg -S org.gtk.Settings.Debug
<larsu> nope
<seb128> likely the issue
<darkxst> larsu, it works here, but I have the package form gnome3-staging
<larsu> seb128: who installs that?
<larsu> darkxst: is that built differently?
<seb128> larsu, http://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/pkg-gnome/desktop/unstable/gtk%2B3.0/debian/libgtk-3-dev.install?r1=43786&r2=43785&pathrev=43786
<seb128> http://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/pkg-gnome?view=revision&revision=43786
<seb128> larsu, we need a .install to list the file
<larsu> seb128: makes sense. I'll add that right away to my branch
<darkxst> its probably missing some of the ubuntu stuff, but otherwise just a merge from debian
<seb128> larsu, danke
<larsu> darkxst: thanks
<larsu> seb128: merci
<seb128> shrug
 * larsu was trying to fix lower hanging fruit first, like that crash :/
<seb128> would be nice if the gnome3-staging work was sent back in a way where it's useful to distro
<seb128> rather than having 2 versions with different changesets
<larsu> also, I'm trying to solve a terminal-bg-issue for Laney
<seb128> larsu, the indicator one?
<larsu> seb128: no, gtk apps crash for me sometimes, but I can't reproduce :/
<larsu> often in the file chooser
<seb128> didn't see that one
<darkxst> seb128, pretty sure ricotz forwards relevant bits to debian
<seb128> debian
<seb128> doesn't help with e.g that inspector issue
<seb128> or if the ppa version is a merge from Debian ir would help having it submitted rather than having somebody else redoing the merge
<larsu> man, I also still get that test failure when building the package locally
<darkxst> seb128, talk to ricotz, he does pretty much all the gtk updates
 * larsu makes tea
<darkxst> (on ppa)
<larsu> darkxst: what would it take for us to use the exact same package?
<darkxst> larsu, I can't easily install desktop version due to version numbering
<darkxst> but would be happy to copy desktop package across to -staging, provided there are no missing bits
<darkxst> (but bumping the version to ~utopic2 or something
<darkxst> larsu, though I am about to head out shortly
<darkxst> I'll take a closer look tomorrow,but majority of those issue sound like ubuntu theming issues and not packaging
<willcooke> didrocks, they've scheduled the UDTC meeting at the same time as the desktop Q&A
<didrocks> willcooke: you can't move the Q&A? It's the only time when I can have the community participation (or I can handle it myself, but we'll have less people attending I guess)
<willcooke> didrocks, yeah, I'll have to
<willcooke> I wanted it to be the first day
<willcooke> but meh
<willcooke> it wont let me move it now
<willcooke> argh
<willcooke> this system is very frustrating
<seb128> willcooke, you could put it a 4pm?
<willcooke> I'm out between 1430 & 1630
<seb128> ah
<seb128> 7pm then? ;-)
<willcooke> *cough*
<seb128> or another day!
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> there we go
<seb128> it's not like the schedule was packed
<willcooke> ha
<willcooke> it wont let me move it now
<willcooke> because
<willcooke> "Error: Can not reschedule this meeting"
<willcooke> geee
<willcooke> thanks
<seb128> Laney, pitti, does https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/ubuntu-system-settings/lp1390629/+merge/241150 looks fine to you now?
<pitti> seb128: ah, indeed; I should improve this in python-dbusmock too, to stop defaulting to 0.9
<Laney> hey hey
<Laney> seb128: yeah looks good
<didrocks> hey Laney!
<Laney> hey didrocks, wb!
<seb128> Laney, good morning, how are you?
<Laney> doing good
<pitti> hey Laney
<Laney> we came second by one point in the quiz >:(!
<Laney> howdy pitti
<seb128> shrug, update-manager closes when trying to install updates
<seb128> I wonder if that's a partial upgrade issue
 * seb128 upgrades with apt instead
<seb128> blaming Laney and vte
<seb128> object has no attribute set_pty_object
<Laney> debug first, balme second?
<Laney> okay, now blame!
<seb128> in /usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/aptdaemon/gtk3widgets.py
<seb128> l394
<Laney> um
<Laney> do you have the new aptdaemon?
<Laney> upgrade just that, try u-m again please
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/aptdaemon
<seb128> k, it's still in proposed only
<seb128> so no
<Laney> this is fail when you have the new vte gir installed
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/aptdaemon/1.1.1+bzr981-0ubuntu1
<seb128> depwait
<Laney> ya, needs promoting
<seb128> should it use a Breaks?
<seb128> if it fails with new gir?
<Laney> you probably shouldn't be able to install them both at once
<Laney> can you NEW freerdp? that's for this transition too
<seb128> looking
<seb128> urg
<seb128> stack of binaries
<seb128> crazyness
<Laney> yeah those come from debian
<seb128> ok, trusting Debian and just having a sanity glance ;-)
<didrocks> Laney: promoted, kthxbye
<Laney> promoted to sabdfl?
<didrocks> heh
<didrocks> next year
<didrocks> for you :)
<seb128> freerdpm NEWed on my side
<Laney> ty
<didrocks> Laney: you talked about the transition, so it will need to be in main as well or universe is enough?
<Laney> for?
<didrocks> 10:16:40      Laney | can you NEW freerdp? that's for this transition too
<Laney> yes main
<didrocks> I thought "this" was for aptdaemon
<Laney> not sure which binaries
<Laney> but the report will tell you in the end
<didrocks> I guess you are a candidate for opening a Mir :)
<didrocks> MIR*
<didrocks> "you" as "me" -> unsure :p
<Laney> it's already in main no?
<didrocks> ah, it was a binary NEW
<Laney> ya
<didrocks> so no MIR needed, just a normal bug to track
<didrocks> and tell which bins
<Laney> I think c-m will tell us once I upload remmina
<Laney> also CI train will probably stop crying https://ci-train.ubuntu.com/job/ubuntu-landing-015-1-build/57/console
<Laney> doesn't understand depwait
<Laney> larsu: did you find anything out about the terminal-bg thing?
<Laney> oh, oh, unity, are you crashing?
<larsu> Laney: let's say I have some leads... talked to Company about debugging it yesterday
<Laney> neat
<larsu> ya, crashing for me as well - not sure what triggers it
 * Laney files
<larsu> Laney: it's a tricky problem. And sadly involves deprecated functions...
<Laney> ...
<Laney> are we doing something wrong?
<larsu> in the theme? no.
<larsu> it's the same with with gnome-terminal upstream
<larsu> I don't think adwaita sets the background at all, though
<Laney> do you know what changed between g-t 3.12 and .14 to break it?
<larsu> no, I think it might be a gtk change
<larsu> because get_background_color() always returns white now
<larsu> where it didn't before
<Laney> well it works with the old gnome-terminal on the same gtk
<larsu> hm, true. good point
<didrocks> Sweet5hark: hey! libreoffice-impress suggests bluez, any idea why? is it bluez5-compatible?
<didrocks> seb128: can you create a ppa for bluez transition? Maybe we can have a devirtualized one and have a more generic naming, like for transitions?
<didrocks> so that we can BINcopy to -proposed
<didrocks> (create the ppa under ~ubuntu-dekstop, only the admins can)
<seb128> didrocks, I don't think I've the right powers to devirtualize a ppa
<seb128> didrocks, also do we want desktop to be in charge of that transition?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, but just create the ppa, I'll then ask to turn it into a devirtualize one
<didrocks> seb128: I'm fearing if we are not, nothing will happen
<seb128> cyphermox said he would do the merge and work on that
<seb128> but alright
<didrocks> seb128: there are 30 rdepends to check
<seb128> I'm just wondering if we should have it under a team more "open"
<didrocks> I'm unsure he will do that
<seb128> like somewhere the kubuntu team can upload as well
<didrocks> the ~ubuntu-desktop is opened, core-devs are part of it
<didrocks> so they can upload
<seb128> well, that's going to include universe packages as well likely?
<seb128> but ok, let's do that
<seb128> that's probably going to be low enough that we can do sponsoring if needed
<didrocks> and better than if we give motu rights to upload to that ppa, we'll have to check they don't update things being part of main
<didrocks> so yeah, I prefer that we sponsor if needed
<didrocks> even if I guess we'll just take as much as possible from debian anyway
<didrocks> (for universe at least)
<seb128> didrocks, https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ubuntu/bluez5
<didrocks> seb128: thanks!
<seb128> yw!
<seb128> didrocks, let's see if devirt works, I'm unsure what are the rules, is coredev fine or did is wanted Canonical only for those?
<didrocks> seb128: coredev is fine
<didrocks> as it's as distro :)
<didrocks> seb128: don't you think we should have a more generic name?
<didrocks> so that we keep the same devirt ppa in the future if needed
<didrocks> hum, canonical rt is down as well
 * didrocks has to wait for the request
<Laney> #webops
<didrocks> Laney: they will ask me for a RT first
<didrocks> trust me, I've been there more than once :)
<didrocks> ok, working back now
<seb128> didrocks, I can't edit the url, want me to create another ppa?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, let's do that
<seb128> didrocks, https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ubuntu/transitions
<didrocks> excellent, using that one!
<seb128> thx
<seb128> didrocks, I updated the description with "currently bluez5"
<didrocks> sweet! I think we can all update that btw
<didrocks> just not creating/decomissionning
<seb128> cool
<didrocks> Laney: on dep-wait, CI train had the logic for this
<didrocks> seems it's been broken once again with all the refactoring that happensâ¦
<seb128> happyaron, hey, can you look at bug #1390738? Some comments suggest it's due to ibus
<ubot5> bug 1390738 in gedit (Ubuntu) "Cursor disapears after CTRL+C" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1390738
<happyaron> ok
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> seb128: FYI, it's now devirt
<didrocks> we'll see on first upload :)
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yw
<Laney> whoever promoted gir1.2-vte-2.91 (thanks) missed the other binary packages and the source :-)
<willcooke> popey, are you a track lead for Users?
<didrocks> Laney: I only did this one once you talked about it:
<didrocks> 10:22:52   didrocks | Laney: promoted, kthxbye
<Laney> was that in relation to freerdp or vte?
<didrocks> vte, you talked about it at that time, hence my ack on the promotion
<Laney> ah right
<Laney> well I think the rest of the package needs to go to main too
<Laney> just got https://launchpadlibrarian.net/190178513/buildlog_ubuntu-vivid-amd64.aptdaemon_1.1.1%2Bbzr981-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<didrocks> do you have a list of the exact sources and bins you need?
<Laney> I think src:vte2.91 gir1.2-vte-2.91 libvte-2.91-0 libvte-2.91-common libvte-2.91-dev libvte-2.91-doc
<didrocks> similar to what we had in .90, isn't it?
<Laney> then once we get g-t and ubiquity the 2.90 ones can go to universe
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> doing
<Laney> â¥
<didrocks> Laney: they did break their API so that it's versionned?
<didrocks> I guess you want the -udeb as well
<didrocks> for ubiquity
<willcooke> popey, ignore
<Laney> don't think the udeb is needed
<didrocks> indeed, seems we don't use it
<Laney> those are for d-i
<didrocks> yeah, and it's not used in the server installs apparently
<didrocks> ok, done
<Laney> thanks!
<didrocks> yw
<willcooke> Sweet5hark1, hey!  This GL rendering stuff in LO.  Will that help us with Mir in the long run?
 * didrocks scratches his head on a test failureâ¦
<didrocks> ok found and pushed, grrr at commit at the wrong branchâ¦
<larsu> more unity problems. Had to hard-reboot because it spun my cpu out of control and was unresponsive
<larsu> did anyone else see this`
<didrocks> I don't get that, however bamf isn't matching anymore my weechat launcher
<didrocks> can be due to new weechat as well
<Trevinho> mh, nothing changed at bamf level, but not sure...
<Trevinho> didrocks: maybe new terminal might handle differently the -class thing?
<didrocks> Trevinho: yeah, it can be as well
<seb128> larsu, no such issue here
<seb128> didrocks, does it happen from the start? do you loose matching or just the icon?
<seb128> there is an issue with the new gtk and icons in case you test that
<larsu> seb128: it just happened once
<seb128> like firefox/tb icons get lost after a restart of the apps
<didrocks> seb128: matching and startup
<seb128> didrocks, ok, likely a different issue then
<didrocks> yep, clicking on the icon doesn't do anything, even with no terminal started
<seb128> try downgrading g-t/vte and see if that resolves it?
<didrocks> not now, but that's part of my plan
<didrocks> Failed to parse arguments: Option "--disable-factory" is no longer supported in this version of gnome-terminal.
<didrocks> ok, actually, running manually gives a clue
<didrocks> of course, it's still in the man though
<seb128> we should probably add back the option, or make it not bail out
<seb128> to support upgrades with a config like yours
<didrocks> yeah
<seb128> Laney, larsu ^
<Laney> go for it
<didrocks> well, "do not reuse an existing terminal", is there any other option for that?
<didrocks> I don't want my weechat to start in a tab of an existing terminal
<larsu> the option is gone
<larsu> need to do something like this now: http://paste.fedoraproject.org/148111/20018514/
<larsu> (courtesy of desrt)
 * larsu had the same problem
<didrocks> urgh
<larsu> I don't think running a separate process is supported anymore
<didrocks> bah for backward compatibility though
<didrocks> or transition handling
<didrocks> thanks for the pointer larsu!
<larsu> not sure what we could do. I was under the impression that not many people used this feature
<Laney> isn't --window --profile foo what you want?
<larsu> --class, actually
<Laney> maybe too
<larsu> but you also need to set --app-id
<Laney> what for?
 * Laney hasn't used this feature
<didrocks> --window isn't in the man, only in --help
<larsu> something is set that bamf (and gnome shell) pick up
<larsu> to do the window/app matching
<larsu> too bad desrt isn't here, I never fully looked how this works
<didrocks> let me try something
<didrocks> yep, seems that machine doesn't work, even with --class
<didrocks> matching*
<didrocks> but I should reload unity, just in case it didn't pick my new desktop file, one sec
<didrocks> yeah, matching doesn't work
<didrocks> WM_CLASS(STRING) = "gnome-terminal-server", "Gnome-terminal"
<didrocks> so, --class is ignored
<Trevinho> wow
<larsu> ah, starting gnome-terminal-server with --app-id does create a new process
<cyphermox> seb128: didrocks: what it is about bluez?
<larsu> but then you need a dbus service file to make gnome-terminal find that instance
<didrocks> larsu: I just do gnome-terminal --window --class
<didrocks> cyphermox: not sure what seb128 wanted, I created a ppa, but let's discuss in the session (today) at UOS
<cyphermox> seb128: didrocks: we could certainly start doing the transition in a PPA, that's a good idea
<cyphermox> didrocks: I'm just unsure what you're unsure I'd be doing? :)
<didrocks> cyphermox: no, I had a good and simple plan, which is "let's discuss at UOS" and not bikeshed meanwhile :)
<cyphermox> yeah, that's good
<cyphermox> just one thing though
<seb128> cyphermox, discussion was about "who has cycles to work on that transition"
<cyphermox> ~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/bluez can't be devirt.
<didrocks> cyphermox: why?
<cyphermox> ah, I recall there was an issue with IS re: who has upload rights to de-virtualized PPAs
<cyphermox> maybe that's changed now, but I doubt it
<didrocks> cyphermox: ah, there is no issue in ~ubuntu-desktop, it's onlly people who already can have access to distro builders
<didrocks> only*
<didrocks> already figured out with IS, and devirt
<cyphermox> ah, guess so
<cyphermox> cool then :)
<didrocks> phew, I thought it was a bigger issue :)
<cyphermox> nah
<ogra_> worst case there is always canonical-arm-dev
<cyphermox> ogra_: all is well
<ogra_> ah, i thought you got the bluez
<ogra_> :)
<didrocks> ok, going for a run outside
<larsu> didrocks: enjoy!
<cyphermox> seb128: I just don't have work cycles to work on it right now, but it needs to be done; which means waiting for pulse
<didrocks> larsu: thanks! :)
<cyphermox> ... which is all stuff we'll cover in the session
<bregma> seb128, would you be willing to join us in a UOS session in 1.5 hours?
<seb128> bregma, the testing unity8 desktop one?
<bregma> seb128, that's the one
<seb128> bregma, yeah, I planned to be there
<seb128> I noticed it on the schedule
<seb128> thanks for the ping ;-)
<bregma> I was strong-armed into doing it
 * bregma makes a note not to talk to community people while at sprints
 * bregma makes a note not to visit hotel bars while at sprints
 * bregma makes a note to avoid sprints and stay home in his cave
<willcooke> bregma stay away from a bar?  I don't think so ;p
<bregma> well, if I stay at home the pile of empties physically prevents me from getting to the drink
<willcooke> lol
<mdeslaur> seb128, attente_: I'll have a port of xchat-gnome to gsettings soon...just need to write the migration file now
<seb128> mdeslaur, you are on a mission there? ;-)
<seb128> modernize xchat-gnome!
<ogra_> who uses that anyway
<seb128> mdeslaur, thanks for the work on that
<mdeslaur> well, just want to make sure it still works :)
<seb128> mdeslaur, btw did you also have your bg color change with the update?
<larsu> mdeslaur: did you talk to the polari guys?
<mdeslaur> ogra_: I know, everyone uses facebook chat now, right? :)
<ogra_> lol
<larsu> not sure how much of xchat-gnome they're keeping (or if they're using it at all)
<ogra_> well, rather the non castrated xchat : )
<mdeslaur> seb128: change to what?
<mdeslaur> ogra_: plain old xchat is gtk2
<ogra_> it works :)
<mdeslaur> larsu: I think polari is a whole new codebase
<mdeslaur> written in javascript
<mdeslaur> ogra_: yeah, it'll work really well in unity 8 :)
<seb128> mdeslaur, it was white before and now it's grey
<mdeslaur> seb128: oh, look at that...I had not noticed it was changed to grey
<mdeslaur> seb128: on my main computer I have a custom theme, in my test vm, I had not noticed
<mdeslaur> seb128: it uses the gtk theme...
<mdeslaur> seb128: I'll take a look when I test the gconf-gsettings migration file
<mdeslaur> seb128: depending on how much time my insomnia will give me
<seb128> k
<seb128> it's a detail, just looking different
<seb128> more annoying though, it stopped clearing unity launcher badge counts
<seb128> like you just replied to me, I focussed xchat-gnome and it didn't clear out the indicator count
<seb128> it does if I focus another channel and ubuntu-desktop back though
<mdeslaur> seb128: the unity launcher badge count? I've never seen that before
<seb128> mdeslaur, do you use xchat-gnome-indicator?
<seb128> integration with unity/indicator-messages
<mdeslaur> it's installed
<mdeslaur> the count is where, on the icon in the launcher, or in the message indicator?
<seb128> both
<seb128> mdeslaur, you need something to ping/query you though
<seb128> never used it?
<seb128> the plugin might not be enabled (though I think we do enable it by default)
<mdeslaur> one sec, there are so many different plugins that are all confusing as to what they do, let me check
<mdeslaur> seb128: ah, I see it now...that one wasn't enabled
<mdeslaur> seb128: I'll add it to my list to take a look
<mdeslaur> seb128: do you have an example of a package that ships a gsettings distro override file?
<mdeslaur> or whatever those are called
<seb128> mdeslaur, ubuntu-settings
<seb128> mdeslaur, we "batch" our overrides there
<seb128> easier than distro patching packages
<seb128> it also let users opt out from the override easily
<mdeslaur> hrm, ok, thanks
<mdeslaur> seb128: so it would be appropriate to have the default xchat-gnome plugin list be in there?
<willcooke> Intro UOS session is just starting
<mdeslaur> or should the package simply ship it's own override?
<seb128> mdeslaur, that would be an option, I've no strong preference
<willcooke> (*due to start)
<seb128> mdeslaur, having it in xchat-gnome might be easier and make sense
<seb128> I doubt it's the sort of customization that is going to annoy users or derivatives
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<mdeslaur> seb128: ok
 * willcooke makes a note to use Chrome not Chromium in order to share slides
 * qengho boggles.
<seb128> doesn't work in chromium?
<qengho> willcooke: Does it need Flash?
<willcooke> qengho, hmm, dont think so.  mhall119 is having problems presenting his slides at the plenary
<qengho> :(
<qengho> I'm 99% sure it's the flash plugin.
<ogra_> larsu, i just joined the club ... hard hang of unity ... (utopic here though)
<mdeslaur> ogra_: are you sure you're not hitting the intel drm issue? I hit that once in a while
<mdeslaur> (on utopic)
<larsu> ogra_: ugh. Do you remember what brought you into this state? Seems totally random for me and doesn't happen that often, so I don't know what I would write a bug about
<ogra_> mdeslaur, i surely do ... that is what was actually on console
<mdeslaur> it's very annoying
<ogra_> i managed to get to console after ctrl-alt-f1and waiting 5min
<ogra_> then killes firefox and evo who were taking a lot of cycles ... then alt-f7 got me back to a working session
<ogra_> on console i had a bunch of intel_drm erros
<ogra_> mdeslaur, any fix pending for that ?
 * xnox looks at intel drm developer's table, they look away
<ogra_> haha
<ogra_> throw somthing
<mdeslaur> ogra_: I don't know, I fear the kernel demotivation bot, so I didn't file a bug
<xnox> mdeslaur: =))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
<ogra_> lol
<xnox> fyi http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2014/11/intel-linux-graphics-driver-installer-update?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+d0od+%28OMG%21+Ubuntu%21%29
<mdeslaur> thanks *(&$%? intel drm
<mdeslaur> ;)
<mhall119> willcooke: man, I highlight your Q&A today in the intro and you go and move it :-P
<MagicSpud> hello I need help with alacarte...it is not working on ubuntu 14.04
<MagicSpud> it took near 4 minutes to add a new menu and it is not adding new elements to it
<MagicSpud> I am using gnome-session-fallback
<willcooke> mhall119, sorry about that :)
<willcooke> clashed with didrocks session
<mhall119> no worries, if I had checked email earlier I might havehad time to update my slides
<MagicSpud> another issue...when trying to run a shell file I cant find terminal among the open with applications
<willcooke> didrocks, we should get the Arudino IDE in to UDTC
<didrocks> willcooke: I even didn't know they have an IDE
<willcooke> didrocks, I'll show you
<didrocks> willcooke: looks sweet and javaish, sure, we can support that :)
<willcooke> yeah, it's java
<seb128> mdeslaur, nice work debugging the focus issue!
<mdeslaur> seb128: hehe, yw :)
<willcooke> oh, is this the problem where we lose kdb focus in the side stage?
<seb128> willcooke, no, it was an issue with the xchat-gnome update from this week, counter was not properly cleared when focussing the win
<willcooke> ack
<willcooke> Sweet5hark1, name check from sabdfl
<willcooke> :)
<Sweet5hark1> willcooke: huh?
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, talking about clickifying LibreOffice
<willcooke> you're the go to guy :)
<willcooke> Mark also explain that it will be tricky because of the custom toolkit
<Sweet5hark> the custom toolkit is one issue. But for click packages the tricky part is that LibreOffice integrates with everything: databases (postgresql, mariadb, addressbooks in mailclients), gtk, kde, python, java (for extensions) etc.
<Sweet5hark> well, thats the other issue ;)
<willcooke> yeah
 * Laney shovels in some more fresh hot hot crack
<ogra_> wear gloves !
<Laney> I've slowly evolved asbestos hands
<Sweet5hark> willcooke: so there are the *.debs released by the Document Foundation, which are in a way "click packages" (from a dependency point of view -- they depend on very little). But those e.g. dont work with the unity menu via dbus (as they are build against an ancient glib), bring their own python. In fact, on Windows (which is also a "click package"-ish thing), LibreOffice comes bundled with building stuff from ~150 other open source proj
 * Laney runs away from the scene of the crime
<Laney> see you tomorrow ;-)
<seb128> Laney, have fun, see you tomorrow
 * mlankhorst has standalone xmir running \o/
<ChrisTownsend> mlankhorst: Sweet!
<ogra_> poor thing ... it might be lonely
<ogra_> start some apps ;)
<mlankhorst> i had xeyes and xterm sort of working :p
<ogra_> :)
<ChrisTownsend> mlankhorst: Is this based on the patch you had in the email you sent?
<willcooke> mlankhorst, awesome
 * didrocks waves good evening and good night!
<willcooke> didrocks, thanks a lot!  Plenty to do for us ;)
 * willcooke -> EOD too o/
<mlankhorst> ChrisTownsend: yeah just no glamor-egl yet :P
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: hey, I was looking at the gdk mir code, but it looks that at this line https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/tree/gdk/mir/gdkmirscreen.c#n127 screen should be passed, not display (according to the callback signature above)
<Trevinho> not sure wether that is the last code btw
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-11-13
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, which function?
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: I've fixed it...
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: was mir_connection_set_display_config_change_callback
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: a display was passed, instead than a screen
<robert_ancell> oh, I see your commit
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, was there a particular app that was querying invalid monitors?
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: no, but it might happen... I was just reading the code
<robert_ancell> Trevinho:
<robert_ancell> -      count++;
<robert_ancell> +      ++count;
<robert_ancell> ?
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: well, it's just quicker... I tend to never use postfixed++ as it also return something we don't need there... but it's mostly a paranoic thing
<robert_ancell> how is it quicker?
<Trevinho> var++ means you've to store a temp var to return, while ++var just increases the val
<robert_ancell> I'm pretty sure any compiler would optimise them to the same
<Trevinho> well, gcc might be smart enough to ignore that if the return value is not requested, though..
<robert_ancell> yeah
<Trevinho> yes, sorry.. just an habit, I can revert.
<robert_ancell> Well, kind of an odd change to throw into an unrelated commit
<robert_ancell> c8826ba8c77b25ab9bd59027e0b87fadb49f5a3b
<Trevinho> yes... commit -a got me :/
<Trevinho> ouch, also I pasted uncorrect code -_--
<Trevinho> g_clear_object should have been
<robert_ancell> Anyone want a Google Inbox invite? I have one to give away...
 * TheMuso pats his IMAP/caldav/carddav only access to google services. :)
<TheMuso> ...and thats the way it will stay. :p
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: oh, if you still have one...
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, what's your email address?
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, there you go
<Trevinho> thanks again :)
<duflu> Trevinho, still working all night?
<Trevinho> duflu: well no... I'm just hacking now :P
<Trevinho> duflu: mostly stoppped to do that, but sometimes, when my gf is not here... I'm still tempted to stay awake in the darkness :D
<duflu> Trevinho: Yeah I understand
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> morning!
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<pitti> bonjour didrocks et seb128
<pitti> comment allez-vous ?
<seb128> pitti, lut, wie gehts?
<seb128> pitti, j'ai un rhume :-( sinon Ã§a va bien
<pitti> seb128: gut, danke! Ich habe gestern das erste Mal Basketball gespielt :)
<seb128> et toi ?
<didrocks> bonjour pitti !
<pitti> seb128: ouch, get better soon then! l'automne est froid maintenant :/
<seb128> pitti, you mean first time in a team/you subscribed in a club?
<seb128> pitti, merci!
<pitti> seb128: yeah, not just for warmup, but for full two hours, and not just with the very reduced "Taekwondo" rules :)
<seb128> nice
<seb128> how did you like it?
<pitti> seb128: it was quite nice indeed, I want to do it more regularly over the winter at least
<didrocks> I imagine than first time, 2 hours of game, you are tired then :)
<pitti> it's too cold for me to run outside
<pitti> didrocks: heh, you bet; and my feet hurt, I played in my barefeet five-fingers
<pitti> je crois qu'il faut porter des vraies chaussures pour basketball
<didrocks> waow, extreme for a first time :)
<didrocks> oui, ce sera mieux avec des baskets
<didrocks> (d'oÃ¹ le nom :))
<didrocks> seb128: can you confirm this bug:
<didrocks> - open an archive with file-roller
<didrocks> - try to drag one file outside of the file-rollet window
<didrocks> - if you didn't release the mouse button, and the window != nautilus, it will error
<didrocks> (it's like if you released the drag, when you didn't)
<seb128> no, can't confirm that
<seb128> I can dnd over xchat-gnome, tb, firefox
<seb128> I just see the row moving over while being dragged
<didrocks> hum, weird
<didrocks> let me see if it's because of chrome
 * didrocks opens firefox
<seb128> I can confirm the issue with chromium
<didrocks> yeah, chromium/chrome
<seb128> so yeah, chrome/ium issue it seems
<didrocks> not sure what they are trying to do with this drag
<seb128> yeah, me neither
<didrocks> thanks for checking :)
<didrocks> I'll poke our maintainer and see
<seb128> yw
<didrocks> wtf thunderbird?
<didrocks> I have one email from the 10/11 which just disappeared between yesterday and today
<didrocks> it was set as unread
<didrocks> not in inbox anymore
<didrocks> not in trash
<seb128> imap? another client deleted it?
<didrocks> I just have one client
<didrocks> yeah, it's definitively nowhereâ¦
<didrocks> ah, let's look in archive
<didrocks> yeah, moved to archiveâ¦
<didrocks> not sure what thunderbird rules for moving things there
 * didrocks move it back and set it to unread
<seb128> didrocks, you maybe hit "a" on the keyboard while it was selected?
<didrocks> seb128: can be, weird to have a shortcut like that with just one keystroke
<seb128> yeah
<willcooke> morning
 * willcooke catches up with yesterday's videos
<didrocks> morning willcooke
<seb128> hey willcooke
<didrocks> seb128: mind accepting it for vivid? https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-v-bluez5
<seb128> didrocks, done
<didrocks> thanks
<Laney> ahoy hoy
<didrocks> it's a Laney!
<didrocks> or even, it's *the* Laney :)
<Laney> quick, catch it for our zoo
<didrocks> ahah
<seb128> hey Laney!
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> what's up
<seb128> got a cold :-/
<Laney> oh :(
<Laney> vitamin c time
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> tea + lemon time
<didrocks> and orange juice! :)
<didrocks> or banana + lemon :)
<seb128> banana against cold?! ;-)
<didrocks> banana + lemon is really great, it's cleaning your throat
<didrocks> you have the sweetness and acidity
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> my issue is more a blocked nose atm though
<seb128> thyme infusion ftw
<didrocks> wait a couple of days for it to move ;)
<seb128> yeah
<didrocks> heh
<Laney> who wants to NEW poppler and remmina? :D
<seb128> looking at poppler
<Laney> not one thing required any changes this time
<Laney> boring
<seb128> still a new soname
<didrocks> wellâ¦ poppler :)
<seb128> yeah, exactly
<seb128> they need to bump soname every single time
<seb128> didrocks, want to do remmina? ;-)
<didrocks> why did I talk here?
<didrocks> lalalalala
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> wellâ¦ ok
<Laney> just reject it
<didrocks> snif
<Laney> it'll be fine
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> ahah
<seb128> ok, poppler NEWed
 * didrocks presses and write "rejected on Laney's request"
<seb128> Laney, do you need help rebuilding rdepends?
<Laney> nope, https://launchpad.net/~laney/+archive/ubuntu/poppler/+packages http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/poppler.html
<Laney> thanks!
<seb128> great
<seb128> nice job ;-)
<seb128> libreoffice builds on vivid with the current toolchain?
<seb128> where is the fun
<Laney> don't think there were any pre-opening toolchain things this cycle
<seb128> k
<Laney> I heard gcc5 is coming though
<Laney> \o/
<seb128> lolo
<didrocks> remmina accepted
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yw
<Laney> merci buckets
 * seb128 throw some bucket to Laney
<seb128> stop mocking the french
<Laney> I'm mocking the English really :p
<seb128> :-)
<didrocks> willcooke: do you remember what was the intent on the "Dash support" in the udtc session?
<willcooke> didrocks, it was just mentioned as a new thing to include.  I dont think there was any real actions around it, just "wouldn't it be cool if...."
<willcooke> IMHO, it's not something we should spend time on at this point
<didrocks> what is it? My googling fails me
<willcooke> oh, yeah, it's probably a typo - Dart
<willcooke> either way, IMO, not something we need to care about right now
<willcooke> e.g. www is much more important
<didrocks> ahhhhh
<willcooke> also....
<didrocks> well, dart is easy, and you know I want to do it :)
<willcooke> bahhhh
<didrocks> (it's like a day :p)
<willcooke> go on then!
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> sabdfl is keen on Arduino
<willcooke> again, should be easy
<willcooke> plus I expect the upstream will be happy to help
<didrocks> yeah, a little bit more work, not sure how I would be able to test it's working though
<didrocks> do they have emulators?
<willcooke> not sure, I'll do some research
<didrocks> thx
<didrocks> willcooke: setting up a WI for you then \o/
<willcooke> :D
<didrocks> noooooooooooooooooooooo
 * didrocks pressed esc when having the WI section of a blueprint focused
<didrocks> all clearedâ¦
<seb128> :-/
<seb128> ajax for the loose
<willcooke> :(
<didrocks> seb128: mind accepting those for vivid:
<didrocks> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/udtc-prevent-library-clash
<didrocks> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/udtc-juju
<didrocks> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/udtc-new-ides
<didrocks> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/topic-developer-desktop-1504
<didrocks> willcooke: I proposed that we descoped the 2 others for this cycles seeing the number of WI
<willcooke> didrocks, agreed - that's a lot of work already
<willcooke> I just watched the U8 testing session, now I'm doing the Bluez 5 one
<Laney> "Oh yeah, I'll test and sync the new glib"
<seb128> didrocks, done
<Laney> DAMN YOU AUTOSYNC
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> thanks!
<MagicSpud> hello is there anybody knowing well how to use alacarte?
 * didrocks goes for a run
<seb128> didrocks, enjoy!
<didrocks> thanks :)
<seb128> Laney, there is a sponsoring request for g-t listed on version, not sure if you saw it
<willcooke> Laney, do you need/want me to create a hangout on air for the 15.04 release planning session?
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> wai
<willcooke> t
<willcooke> I dont think I can anyway
<willcooke> because I'm in another session and I wont be able to have 2 hangouts on air running at the same time
<willcooke> soooo, you want me to talk you through the process?
<Laney> willcooke: Umm, I was assuming slangasek would do it :-)
<willcooke> :)
<Laney> seb128: oh, that's old, should have closed it with the update
<Laney> unless you mean the one in the queue which I just commented on too ;-)
<Saviq> balloons, bregma, just watching your "testing unity8 on desktop" session, is there anything you need from us? (we're +100 on putting our autopilot and qml tests in autopkgtests, just never had the time to do so, and testing on bare metal would be something interesting too)
<bregma> Saviq, have you guys ever run the AP tests on the desktop?
<Saviq> another topic is elopio's integration test suite that should be taken into account (i.e. a lot of unity8's ap tests should actually be further up, as they're integration tests already)
<Saviq> bregma, on X11 yes, not on Mir
<bregma> X11 is soo  twentieth-century
<Saviq> I agree
<bregma> Saviq, where can I find more on this integration test suite?
<elopio> bregma: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-testcase/ubuntu-autopilot-tests/ubuntu-experience-tests
<Saviq> â
<elopio> bregma: it just has a couple of tests to get started.
<bregma> ta guys
<Saviq> adt did get "native" support for autopilot tests some time ago IIRC
<elopio> bregma: as saviq said, things like the unity8 autopilot indicators tests should be moved to this project.
<bregma> get to work on that guys
<attente_> seb128: hi, could you sponsor https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-gtk-module/+bug/1307657 for trusty?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1307657 in unity-gtk-module (Ubuntu Trusty) "[SRU] UBUNTU_MENUPROXY should not be set in Xfce" [Undecided,In progress]
 * elopio looks at charles :)
<elopio> bregma: all the work should be now in the developers backlogs. We just need managers to get the tasks to the top of the queue.
<balloons> elopio, so you are migrating tests out of unity8 project directly?
<elopio> balloons: no. Directly not.
<elopio> balloons: we need to keep on unity8 the helpers to open an indicator.
<elopio> and we need to test in isolation each indicator, so we get helpers for things like opening the clock from there.
<elopio> and then we can add a new test to ubuntu-experience-tests that starts on the indicator, jumps to the clock, and goes back to check things on the indicator.
<balloons> elopio, I ask because we wanted to achieve a couple things. First, get basic pre-seed testing for the unity8 images. But then ideally we'd add post-installation tests and running the acceptance tests was suggested
<balloons> elopio, so there is to some extent a question of the best place to run some of this stuff
<balloons> Saviq, thanks for the offer btw. I intend to sort out the discussion and work items into the old blueprint. I'm sure we'll be in touch as we tackle some thing
<Saviq> yeah, let's
<elopio> balloons: to test unity on desktop, I would make sure that the qml tests fun on Mir. Then run the unity autopilot tests. Then run the indicators autopilot tests. Then run the scopes tests. Then run the ubuntu-experience-tests.
<balloons> It seems to make sense to run everything as a post-installation test for the desktop side. And maybe we can even get the CI team to let us have some bare metal to do it
<elopio> on ubuntu-experience-tests we should have desktop-specific things, like logging in with lightdm.
<elopio> and to get things easier from the bottom up, I would push for the mir virtual framebuffer.
<elopio> but, that sequence of tests need a lot of work.
<balloons> elopio, I suppose you make a good point about MIR. Do you know there current testing story?
<elopio> balloons: they focus on low level unit tests, and are interested in the unity8 and ubuntu-experiences-tests for high level testing.
<elopio> which is good IMO.
<balloons> elopio, so in theory once we setup post-installation tests we could run things across the board
<elopio> but the vfb, I don't think that's top priority for them.
<bregma> Saviq, there isn't a lot of success running the AP tests under Unity 8 because some of them seem to be designed to start/stop the shell itself,  others seem to want to run on specific device emulators, and there are numerous errors opening /dev/fb0
<bregma> just so you know
<elopio> balloons: what do you mean with post-installation tests?
<Saviq> bregma, yeah, they have to restart the shell, but that should be fine under unity-system-compositor, no?
<Saviq> bregma, basically nowadays there shouldn't be much difference between a desktop and phone unity8 session?
<bregma> Saviq, I'm just trying to run th tests from the desktop, just like I do with Unity 7, and restarting the desktop can interfere with that
<bregma> evidently "stop unity8" is not a clever command to type in the terminal app
<balloons> mm.. I think best practice at this point would be the test leaves that to the test runner itself
<balloons> elopio, I mean tests intended to run immediately following smoke installation testing. Install the image, then perform post-installation tests on the image
<balloons> elopio, but I'm not sure if doing it there or at the distro package level is better. I assume both are needed, but integration tests probably make more sense as part of image testing?
<elopio> balloons: for ubuntu-experience-tests, I was not thinking about doing an ubiquity installation. I was thinking of adding ubuntu-desktop as a dependency, and adt to do the installation for us.
<balloons> elopio, right.
<elopio> but if you have a provisioning script that does the ubiquity installation, the adt will just start without installing anything.
<elopio> it should work.
<Saviq> bregma, right, you'd need to run from a different session
<Saviq> vt or so
<Saviq> but then you lack the upstart session details which we get on the phone
<Saviq> so yeah there's definitely work ahead
 * Laney copies libreoffice just like that
<seb128> attente_, hey, sure can do, adding to todolist
<seb128> Laney, libreoffice maintainer!
<didrocks> \o/
<didrocks> mind porting libreoffice-impress to bluetooth?
<didrocks> for bluez5
<Laney> Okay, uploaded
<didrocks> :)
<Laney> Turns out that I am hosting this hangout on air ...
<Laney> which URLs does summit want?
<didrocks> you have two to set
<didrocks> you can set your browser url as the first one (from memory)
<didrocks> and on the bottom-right one, you can copy the youtu.be url
<didrocks> it's the one for the broadcast
<Laney> got it
<ogra_> did someone just say Laney is building a click for libreoffice ?
<didrocks> ogra_: after porting to bluez5, yeah
<ogra_> ah, cool
 * ogra_ notes down
<Laney> it's already uploaded
<Laney> all of it
<didrocks> and change the UI for ubuntu touch
<Laney> don't fear
<ogra_> didrocks, you mean make it a scope ?
<didrocks> ogra_: oh right, right!
<didrocks> :)
<ogra_> :)
<didrocks> ogra_: but only after the rewrite in Go :)
<ogra_> yeah, trivial
<didrocks> couple of days at most :)
<ogra_> he can take my port to shell and zenity as a base ... i'll do it on the weekend
<Laney> the bulk of the work is still in removing the German comments
<didrocks> heh
<ogra_> removing or porting them to french ?
<didrocks> french, of course, what else?
<larsu> what a non-question :P
<happyaron> Laney: I wonder if you can partially auto-generate input-method packageset, add all ibus*, fcitx* and scim* source packages automatically?
<happyaron> or is there any concerns in the way of doing it?
<Laney> Maybe, if you want to write a script to generate it then we can look
<happyaron> great
<didrocks> with that, have a good night everyone!
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-11-14
<pitti> Good morning
<larsu> pitti: wow, you were up very early today. Good morning!
<pitti> hey larsu
<pitti> yeah, couldn't sleep any more :)
<jdrice> mhall119 I have an idea for a new hardware bios, not sure how or where to ask for help
<didrocks> good morning
 * larsu waves to didrocks
<didrocks> happy Friday larsu!
<larsu> thanks!
<pitti> hey didrocks, bonjour -- c'est tard pour toi !
<didrocks> pitti: oui, j'ai regardÃ© une Ã©mission scientifique sur rosetta ce matin :)
<pitti> didrocks: hÃ©hÃ©, comme moi hier matin :)
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey didrocks pitti
<pitti> bonjour seb128 !
<seb128> wie gehts?
<seb128> happy friday!
<didrocks> salut seb128
<didrocks> bon vendredi :)
<seb128> larsu, is your gtk/o-s scrollbar the bug Laney assigned you which has a mp up for review?
<larsu> seb128: hm, which one is that?
<larsu> btw, this is not merhed yet? https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/overlay-scrollbar/only-enable-for-supported-themes/+merge/228666
<willcooke> morning all
<seb128> larsu, bug #1386255
<ubot5> bug 1386255 in overlay-scrollbar (Ubuntu) "devhelp and many other apps crash with SIGSEGV in g_closure_invoke() due to overlay-scrollbars" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1386255
<seb128> willcooke, hey
<larsu> willcooke: morning!
<Laney> hey hey hey HEY
<larsu> hi Laney
<larsu> I mean, hi hi hi HI
<Laney> what's up
<larsu> tiredness
<seb128> hey Laney, happy friday! how are you?
<Laney> pretty alright, but my emails haven't come through yet ;-)
<Laney> only 47!
<Laney> pitti: thanks for the LO retry
<larsu> seb128: nice, that's it. No need for me to file a bug then :)
<seb128> larsu, shame that you didn't notice earlier, it has been opened/assigned for some days
<seb128> but good that it's an easy fix ;-)
<seb128> larsu, the theme enabled o-s changes didn't land no, I was unsure in what orders things were supposed to land and then got busy on other things and forgot about it
<seb128> we should land those this cycle though
<larsu> right, no worries
<seb128> theme needs to go first I guess
<larsu> let's land it now, though
<larsu> seb128: yes, otherwise light-themes won't have o-s enabled until o-s gets updated
<seb128> k, makes sense
<Sweet5hark> Moin!
<Laney> [moin]
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark
 * Sweet5hark wonders if we should play the IRC variant of a new hip game here. Rules go like this: send /me too or be kicked from the channel in 24 hours.
<Sweet5hark> probably not. Its not Friday yet.
 * seb128 tries to figure out where Sweet5hark is living
<larsu> seb128: the past
<seb128> it's like 2 hours before California, is that middle of the pacific ocean?
<seb128> larsu, or that ;-)
<Sweet5hark> seb128: hrhr
<Sweet5hark> seb128: actually I am quite close to you and didrocks right now. Sitting in a hotel lobby in Toulouse.
<seb128> south of France?
<seb128> close from didrocks then ;-)
<seb128> you are probably closer from me when you are at home
<seb128> Sweet5hark, what are you doing in Toulouse?
<larsu> seb128: probably?!
<larsu> ah wait, you're not in France right now, are you? :P
 * seb128 was waiting for this one :p
<didrocks> pffffffff
<larsu> seb128: HAHA
<larsu> seb128: still closer, you're right
<seb128> larsu, either way, doesn't make a difference
<didrocks> 5 hours by train, how that can be close? :)
<Sweet5hark> seb128: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Hackfest/Toulouse2014
<seb128> but I don't remember where Sweet5hark lives in germany
<Laney> deepest bavaria
<larsu> seb128: in the north (Hamburg)
<Sweet5hark> Laney: NO!1!!one!!eleven
<seb128> larsu, Metz<->Berlin ~ Metz <-> Toulouse
<seb128> but Bavaria is closer
<Sweet5hark> Laney: bavaria isnt even germany
<larsu> right
<Laney> :D
<larsu> Sweet5hark: ts ts
<seb128> oh
<larsu> bavaria is as german as you can get if you listen to people not living in Germany
<seb128> google maps iteneraries include flights now!
<larsu> probably more people know about oktoberfest than the existence of Hamburg :P
<Laney> haha
<seb128> Berlin-Metz = 800km
<Laney> I think it is a valued piece of German culture for lots of Brits, indeed
<seb128> Toulouse-Metz=930km
<seb128> so yeah, Toulouse is further either way
<Sweet5hark> larsu: well, probably more people now about "Hamburger" as food. Just not the origin of that word (Fischbroetchen of german immigrants in the US)
<seb128> I've been told about some "fest of the strong beer" happening also in like february
<seb128> is that a famous one as well?
<larsu> Sweet5hark: certainly :)
<larsu> seb128: it's year round. We call it "a weekday"
<Laney> ummmmmmmm february german sprint?
<seb128> lol
<larsu> Laney: I'd prefer Berlin to Germany
<Laney> ha
<Laney> you make a similar distinction as I do with London :p
<seb128> you Berlin snob!
<Sweet5hark> seb128: thats likely carnival in the rhine/ruhr area. They dont have any other reason to have fun there, so they made up a reason to get drunk.
<larsu> Laney: but the other way around
<seb128> Sweet5hark, does that have a german name?
<larsu> Laney: you like !London, I dislike !Berlin
<Laney> I think the people /in/ London are the same
<Laney> ya
<Sweet5hark> seb128: ... which actually involves people dressing up in fancy fantasy uniforms which is a tradition that goes back to making fun of the french occupation in napoleonic times ...
<larsu> I've never heard anyone that lives in London responding to "Where do you live?" with "in England"
<larsu> so yeah...
<seb128> Sweet5hark, I guess it's Starkbierzeit
<seb128> http://www.beerfestivals.org/articles/dest/munich_strong_beer.html
<larsu> beerfestivals.org. of course that exists
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> Sweet5hark, you are probably right, that page mentions Napoleon as well
<seb128> you guys just like to hate on the french!
<seb128> ever been there? ;-)
<Sweet5hark> seb128: no hate on the french from Hamburg. Napoleon gave us one of the biggest red light and party districts of europe. Not complaining.
<seb128> hehe
<larsu> psst, I don't think they really like Napoleon anymore
<seb128> you haters!
<seb128> the poor guy tried to build Europe
<Sweet5hark> seb128: thats what Merkel does these days!
<Sweet5hark> *cough*
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> good that it's friday ;-)
<larsu> :D
 * Sweet5hark is living on the edge today: Lets see if this hotelwifi kickbans me for 2 LibreOffice source uploads in a row ...
<seb128> happyaron, hey, could you review https://code.launchpad.net/~brunonova/ubuntu/trusty/ibus/lp1240198/+merge/241742 ?
<seb128> Laney, pitti, does https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/ubuntu-system-settings/rtm-lp1337200/+merge/241749 make sense to you?
<seb128> "Disconnect from upower on suspend and connect on resume"
<Laney> I commented on the other version
<seb128> that shouldn't be needed...
<seb128> hum
<seb128> I wonder why I sometime don't get those emails
<seb128> I didn't get your comment
<seb128> and I'm pretty sure I didn't delete it
<seb128> oh, found it
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> Laney, do you understand why the disconnected is needed?
<seb128> that seems like a workaround to me
<seb128> if the system is suspended the code shouldn't be running anyway?
<Laney> The application receives all of the signals when it resumes
<Laney> Although actually, I'm a bit confused
<Laney> we only subscribed to device-added and device-removed
<Laney> why are those sent so much?
<seb128> yeah, that seems like the real issue
<seb128> no such signal should happen while the device is suspended
<seb128> or in normal use
<Laney> ah
<Laney> they aren't
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1337200/comments/28
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1337200 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "High CPU due to excessive device changed signals from upower" [High,In progress]
<Laney> pitti suggested this in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1337200/comments/27
<larsu> wow, that sounds ridiculous. Why would the kernel generate that many events?
<Laney> ya...
<seb128> right
<seb128> those changes feel like a workaround, other clients are going to have the same issue
<seb128> we need to fix the kernel or driver or whatever generate the noise
<larsu> having upower filter them will already help a lot
<larsu> but it's still unnecessary wakeups (of upower)
<larsu> every 10s...
<pitti> seb128: I saw the MP, and based on ken's theory yesterday it makes sense; however, we didn't actually confirm that one
<pitti> seb128: I sent some log requests (udevadm, upower --monitor-detail, dbus-monitor) to the bug report which would prove or disprove that theory
<seb128> pitti, does it mean we need similar workaround in every single upower consumer codebase?
<seb128> that seems crazy
<pitti> seb128: however, ken then said that system-settings doesnt' actually listen to battery change events
<pitti> so that rather tends to "disprove"
<seb128> right
<seb128> we listen to added/removed iirc
<pitti> seb128: yeah, and those just don't happen often enough to explain this
<pitti> so I think we are back to "someone pretty pleeeeease collect some logs"
<Laney> does powerd use upower?
<pitti> yes
<Laney> could be this then
<pitti> Laney: it even subscribes to change signals
<pitti> as that bit required some porting
<Laney> oh yes, this was what I noticed the other day
<larsu> seb128: are you in ayatana-scrollbar-team? I reviewed and tested the patch for bug #1386255, but can't top-approve
<ubot5> bug 1386255 in overlay-scrollbar (Ubuntu) "devhelp and many other apps crash with SIGSEGV in g_closure_invoke() due to overlay-scrollbars" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1386255
<happyaron> seb128: yes I can, but I'm still hesitate with that change
<willcooke> screw this - I'm putting the heating on
<LocutusOfBorg1> Hi, I see there is a patch to fix the gnome-terminal transparency issue
<LocutusOfBorg1> bug 1292282
<ubot5> bug 1292282 in gnome-terminal (Ubuntu) "background transparency is not working on gnome terminal" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1292282
<LocutusOfBorg1> I guess if somebody can use this one https://bug695371.bugzilla-attachments.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=274727
<LocutusOfBorg1> debian/patches/0001-Restore-transparency.patch
<Laney> LocutusOfBorg1: I don't understand the problem
<Laney> can you explain it?
<LocutusOfBorg1> the 0001-Restore-transparency.patch is just a revert AFAICS
<Laney> no
<LocutusOfBorg1> so what is the difference with the patch I linked above?
<LocutusOfBorg1> following the upstream bug discussion seems the best patch https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=695371
<ubot5> Gnome bug 695371 in Profiles "Transparent option disappears in 3.7.x" [Normal,Resolved: notabug]
<LocutusOfBorg1> I'm wondering if we can replace it with a (better?) more minimal and more tested patch...
<Laney> Our patch adds proper UI back, and it's the one Fedora has.
<Laney> It's http://debarshiray.wordpress.com/2014/05/15/transparent-terminals-back-in-fedora/
<Laney> And the LP bug talks about gnome-terminal 3.6 which still had the option upstream
<Laney> Soooo I think there's some confusion
<LocutusOfBorg1> gnome 3.6 has the option, but doesn't work
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/gt.png
<LocutusOfBorg1> doesn't work on gnome-shell
<Laney> let's talk in here
<Laney> I think it's best if you work with Ubuntu GNOME guys for shell specific issues
<Laney> so, LocutusOfBorg1 meet darkxst
<LocutusOfBorg1> thanks, I wasn't aware this was a gnome shell bug :/
<Laney> no worries, it was confusing at first
<LocutusOfBorg1> moreover upstream closed it as "wontfix"
<LocutusOfBorg1> so I didn't ever try to use with unity
<willcooke> Laney, can you give me some bullet points from the release planning session for the summary plenary?
<larsu> Laney: this is the source of your g-t troubles, btw: https://git.gnome.org/browse/vte/commit/?id=cb038a92719f0c84460ceed78a4197e798633a5d
<larsu> Laney: "use color from theme" means explicitly "use @theme_bg_color"
<Laney> willcooke: release schedule https://wiki.ubuntu.com/VividVervet/ReleaseSchedule
<larsu> Laney: with a higher prio than Ambiance, because it comes from the application
<willcooke> Laney, perfect.
<Laney> larsu: interesting, can we re-override it in gt?
<larsu> Laney: yes, but we might as well in g-t, no?
<Laney> ?
<larsu> what's the issue here? We want purple, not @theme_bg_color?
<larsu> but we want that purple specified by the theme?
<Laney> right
<larsu> weird
<larsu> the theme knowing about applications is wrong imo
 * didrocks goes for a run before the rain
<larsu> we could either patch vte to not insert @theme_bg_color but something like @theme_terminal_bg_color
<larsu> didrocks: enjoy!
<didrocks> thanks :)
<larsu> Laney: I actually don't have another non-insane solution
<didrocks> â¦ or not just started to rain :(
<larsu> suck it up!
<larsu> :P
<didrocks> well, it's not a light rain though
<larsu> Laney: on second thought, vte putting this in there is stupid
<larsu> Laney: why do we want the color specified by the theme? Ambiance and Radiance use the same color...
<larsu> can't we just ship a default profile for gnome-terminal?
<larsu> seb128: ^^ ?
<xnox> i thought there was commented out ambieance/radiance themes for gnome-terminal which are different
<xnox> and there was a request to enable the other one.
<Laney> erm
<Laney> you want to disable the "Use colours from system theme" support, which is upstream?
<larsu> no, I want the "system theme" to not include colors specific to one application
<larsu> thinking about it, when I chose "system theme", I really want the bg color of the rest of the apps, no?
<Laney> It means that the "system theme" defines a default background colour for terminal windows
<larsu> Laney: meh. I'm just trying to avoid patching
<larsu> could ask chpe's opinion about this :D
<Laney> I think it should be valid, as it always has been up to now, for the theme to say that it wants a specific colour for terminal screens
<Laney> would it break if the vte one had a lower priority than the theme?
<larsu> no
<larsu> but would be a patch
<larsu> I guess you're right, though. This should at least be possible
<Laney> hahaha
<Laney> the Egmont (?) guy seems nice
<larsu> Egmont?
<Laney> other vte maintainer
<larsu> don't know him
<Laney> he's been commenting on some LP bugs
<larsu> do you know his nick?
<Laney> I don't
<Laney> This guy: https://launchpad.net/~egmont-gmail
 * Laney tries a patched vte
<larsu> Laney: install the provider with GTK_STYLE_PROVIDER_PRIORITY_FALLBACK
<Laney> exactly that
<larsu> ^5
<Laney> indeed, that fixes it
<larsu> I hesitate to file an upstream bug, as noone ever answers those
<Laney> I don't fully understand the issue the breaking change was meant to fix
<Laney> otherwise I would do it
<Laney> Adwaita removed a terminal/vte specific rule in favour of using @theme_base_color?
<larsu> apparently
<larsu> but really, vte should set the background class to get those
<larsu> instead of having its own rule
<larsu> but I guess it does all its drawing itself, without gtkstylecontext
<larsu> Laney: ya. Want to go with the PRIORIY_FALLBACK patch for now?
<Laney> larsu: Lemme think
<Laney> It's right to use FALLBACK because you actually do want to let the theme override this, and it's going to work because Adwaita doesn't have a VteTerminal rule
<Laney> 'kay, I'll submit this after lunch
<Laney> biab
<larsu> yes
<larsu> cool
<didrocks> ok, I finally risk for a run outside, wish me luck! :)
<seb128> didrocks, oh, it made you bail out earlier? ;-)
<seb128> good luck!
<didrocks> seb128: well, it was a really heavy rain :)
<seb128> I see
<seb128> south of France is not what it used to be:
<seb128> !
<didrocks> and even if I'm not made from sugar last time I checked, I prefer to avoid catching a cold :)
<didrocks> exactly !
<didrocks> It's not like Toulouse :p
<seb128> ;-)
<i-rinat> Hello, Marco, I'm here again.
<i-rinat> short introduction: I'm making freshplayerplugin, a wrapper which allow using PepperFlash from Chrome in Firefox.
<i-rinat> Recently there was a discussion on Ubuntu summit about Flash Player's EOL in 2017 and what to do with it.
<larsu> seb128: did you see my ping about the overlay-scrollbar patch earlier?
<i-rinat> So if there are questions about it, feel free to ask, I'll try to answer.
<seb128> larsu, yeah, sorry but I'm not part of that team either :/
<larsu> ok, I'll embark on the quest to become one
<seb128> larsu, https://launchpad.net/~ayatana-scrollbar-team/+members
<larsu> because really, nobody seems to be maintaining it
<seb128> right
<seb128> you can get kenvandine or didrocks or tedg to approve it, it seems
<larsu> kenvandine: hi! Can you add me to ~ayatana-scrollbar-team s.v.p.?
<larsu> didrocks: ^^ ?
<larsu> oh, he's running
<seb128> yeah
<larsu> Cimi is also an admin *cough*
 * tedg doesn't respond to French acronyms
<larsu> tedg: would've asked you, but you're not admin
<larsu> tedg: also, hi
 * tedg just added larsu
<larsu> nice! tedg has superpowers
<larsu> thanks ;)
<tedg> np
<larsu> I guess that doesn't have auto merging turned on?
<seb128> that concept doesn't exist anymore
<larsu> because ci merges when tests pass?
<tedg> larsu, Sorry, I mean: pas de problÃ©me (according to Google translate) ;-)
<seb128> tedg, how did you do that without being an admin? did you hack into kenvandine's account? ;-)
<larsu> haha :)
<larsu> omg. tedg and kenvandine are the same person!
<seb128> larsu, no, because things go through ci train when you click buttons to publish and merge
<tedg> larsu, Have you ever seen us together?
<seb128> larsu, I knew something was going on between those 2!
<tedg> seb128, I imagine I'm in a team that is admin.
<larsu> seb128: ah, but for this I need to merge manually?
<larsu> tedg: no!
<larsu> tedg: oh wait, yes I have...
<kenvandine> NO!
<seb128> lol
<larsu> :D
<kenvandine> i'm much better looking :)
<seb128> larsu, "manually"? no, somebody needs to do a train landing like for anything else
 * tedg grows a beard to be as sexy as kenvandine
<seb128> I was going to say :p
<seb128> is all the beard!
<larsu> seb128: complicated. Want to do it for me? :P
<seb128> larsu, sure can, I'm going to delay a bit though
<kenvandine> it's so much more than the beard
<larsu> seb128: ya, no worries. Just making sure it's being taken care of at some point
<seb128> larsu, trying to land the theme first so we can include the key/theme support
<larsu> makes sense
<larsu> kenvandine: it's the beard.
 * larsu is in the know now that he has one
 * seb128 is working on that as well
<tedg> kenvandine, I'm not going to say that larsu was talking smack, but he did mention that his is bigger.
<seb128> beard ftw!
<kenvandine> haha
<Trevinho> willcooke: i-rinat is the plugin guy
<larsu> seb128: oh yeah!
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho, hi i-rinat
<i-rinat> hi
<i-rinat> willcooke: Trevinho proposed to ping you for discussion. But I don't know what about particularly :)
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> He was talking to me about your flash wrapper
<willcooke> It's in a PPA at the moment, right?
<willcooke> I'd like to have a play with it
<willcooke> also, any news on the HW accel video playback?
<i-rinat> There are couple of PPA I know about, https://launchpad.net/~andykimpe/+archive/ubuntu/freshplayerplugin-daily and https://launchpad.net/~thad-fisch/+archive/ubuntu/freshplayerplugin
<i-rinat> But I don't do any packaging myself.
<willcooke> ok, no worries
<willcooke> I'll have a play with it and see if we can work out how it should fit in with our overall flash strategy
<i-rinat> I didn't touch HW accel decoding yet.
<willcooke> ok, I was getting excited when I read about it :)
<i-rinat> There are two kinds of hardware acceleration, one is HW decode, other is HW presentation.
<i-rinat> I implemented 3d interface, which is used by PepperFlash to do scaling. But it's disabled by default â there some rendering issues for offscreen EGL pixmaps.
<i-rinat> You can enable it by adding "enable_3d = 1" line to ~/.config/freshwrapper.conf
<Trevinho> i-rinat: yes, that's a little bugged now (unless you enable EGL rendering)
<i-rinat> Trevinho: if you have Gallium based driver, adding "EGL_DRIVER=egl_dri2" to environment may help.
<i-rinat> willcooke: as far as I know, desktop version of Chrome (and Chromium) have HW decode disabled.
<willcooke> ok
<didrocks> back and avoided the rain \o/
<Laney> dodged the drops one by one
<Laney> The One
<didrocks> tedg: Â« pas de problÃ¨me Â» actually
<didrocks> tedg: but, as you are coming from Texas, I guess the accent can match people pronouncing "blÃ©me" ;)
<tedg> Ha! GOOGLE!!!!!
<didrocks> tedg: maybe it's Texan Google messing up with you? Here it's translated to "pas de problÃ¨me" :)
<tedg> Oh, I probably used the compose key incorrectly.
<didrocks> what a weird keyboard layout if you need a compose key for Ã© or Ã¨â¦ </trolling> ;)
<chrisccoulson> qengho, what's happening with the chrome / chromium gpu-process startup crash I mentioned before? :)
<qengho> chrisccoulson: is it the i9xx bug?
<chrisccoulson> qengho, yeah
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hey! while you are around: is the appmenu patches for firefox an extension or just a patch?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, it's a patch
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: context: I was thinking about integration the firefox developer edition to udtc
<didrocks> but for that, I can't really apply a patch on the fly as we dl binaries
<qengho> chrisccoulson: I thought it was better. I haven't seen it lately. I'm using a Haswell i915 right now.
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, I'm sad panda then ;)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, well, they repurposed the aurora channel as the developer edition, which is packaged here https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mozilla-daily/+archive/firefox-aurora
<chrisccoulson> that does replace the stock firefox though
<qengho> brb, reboot
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you do apply the patches automatically daily?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, it's all there
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: interesting, so I should just link udtc to add that ppa and install from there I guess
<didrocks> thanks :)
<qengho> chrisccoulson: back!
<chrisccoulson> qengho, it's still broken here. If I delete my profile and restart, I see "GPU process was unable to boot: GPU access is disabled in chrome://settings" and "GpuProcessHostUIShim: The GPU process crashed!" in chrome://gpu
<chrisccoulson> "Disabled Features: all"
<chrisccoulson> I can't even use webgl, and trying to watch videos with it is painful
<mdeslaur> qengho, chrisccoulson: I hit it daily
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, it's not just every day for me - it's every time I start chrome (or chromium). it hasn't worked since I upgraded to utopic
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, qengho, interestingly, it doesn't crash if I run it with --in-process-gpu
<chrisccoulson> or --no-sandbox
<qengho> chrisccoulson, mdeslaur: That's the problem, the GPU driver tries to do more than the chrome-sandbox allows.
<seb128> chromium trigger an apport prompt every time I start it here
<seb128> not sure it's the same issue
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: I only open chromium once a day to try something out :P
<pitti> seb128: me 2
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, qengho, I'm just going to keep opening and closing chrome until google notice it (it sends 3 crashdumps each time) :)
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: oh! you can script that :)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, I was just thinking that
<chrisccoulson> lol
<mdeslaur> brute-forcing a bugfix, nice :)
<chrisccoulson> :)
<qengho> :)  They know of it. Cr team got keithp on the line. He wrote about it: http://keithp.com/blogs/chromium-dri3/
<qengho> chrisccoulson: I'll see if there's anything I can do about it.
<chrisccoulson> qengho, ah, thanks
 * didrocks waves good evening and good night
<willcooke> and we outta here
<willcooke> g'night all
<darkxst> LocutusOfBorg1, terminal transparency should work fine on gnome-shell
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-11-15
<LocutusOfBorg1> darkxst, I have two trusty amd64 machines, what I do is install gnome-shell and gdm, and I cannot make transparency work
<darkxst> LocutusOfBorg1, Ive not tested on trusty
<LocutusOfBorg1> so you mean utopic or vivid?
<darkxst> LocutusOfBorg1, yes it works on both utopic and vivid under gnome-shell
<LocutusOfBorg1> wonderful, I'll backport gnome-terminal from there then :)
<LocutusOfBorg1> thanks!
<darkxst> LocutusOfBorg1, utopic gnome-terminal doesn't have the transparency patch though
<LocutusOfBorg1> strange, trusty and utopic have the same version
<LocutusOfBorg1> ah ok, so I need to backport from vivid
<LocutusOfBorg1> thanks darkxst :)
<LocutusOfBorg1> darkxst, works nicely! thanks to you and Laney :)
<LocutusOfBorg1> I can use gnome-shell with transparent backgound on my trusty!
<LocutusOfBorg1> :D
<LocutusOfBorg1> bye!
<Steve_Jobs> any reason I can't paste stuff from xclip to a field in chromium or chrome?
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-11-16
<qengho> Steve_Jobs: There are (at least) two copybuffers in X.  Try middle-clicking, and right-click-then-"Paste".
<desrt> Trevinho: you broke the gtk-mir build :(
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Hi Robert!
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, hi
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Have you noticed the latest comments at bug #678421?
<ubot5> bug 678421 in lightdm (Ubuntu Trusty) "Error message for a faulty ~/.profile script" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/678421
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, yes, but I'
<robert_ancell> m no shell scripting expert
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Right.
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, do you think the problem will affect many people?
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: No.
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: But since it's a (small) regression and there are pending SRUs I wanted to make sure that you are aware of it.
<robert_ancell> sure am
<robert_ancell> worst case we'll pull that change out and do it in a following SRU
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: The actual issue is this: Previously, if one of the profile files tried to source a file - e.g. in /etc/profile.d/ - with invalid sh syntax, the problem was logged in ~/.xsession-errors. Currently the problem gets only logged in a /tmp file.
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, why do we need the temp file?
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Its purpose is to trigger a dialog in case of errors, and it does for other kinds of errors but syntax errors in all files, and for syntax errors directly in one of the profile files.
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Personally I don't think the issue is serious enough to interrupt the current SRUs.
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, we should just change it to "Look in ~/.xsession-errors"
<robert_ancell> Since only "experts" will be editing ~/.profile anyway
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: In that case you still need to know when to tell the user to look in ~/.xsesson-errors.
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: I'd suggest that we ask e.g. pitti for advice. Maybe there is a simple fix that I haven't been able to figure out.
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, yeah, pitti is the right person
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Ok, I'll try to catch him tomorrow.
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-11-09
<didrocks> good morning
<darkxst> hey didrocks
<didrocks> good evening darkxst, how was your week-end?
<darkxst> didrocks, crap still can barely walk and today they found a blood clot in my leg ;(
<didrocks> argh :/
<didrocks> yeah, typical issues when you can't really moveâ¦ :/
<didrocks> going to the hospital to get it extracted?
<darkxst> no, just been put on medication, and lost lots of blood for some tests
<didrocks> ah, I can something to make your blood liquid
<darkxst> didrocks, trying to finish up my gdm3 merge, but migrating settings is a mess, can't use dpkg-maintscripts-helper scripts, since the conffiles cross packages
<didrocks> darkxst: most of the time, you can force with pre-depends the orders
<didrocks> (not really indicated for general case, but for some special case like that)
<darkxst> didrocks, but the paths and packages change
<darkxst> /etc/gdm -> /etc/gdm3
<didrocks> ah, not as easy then, indeedâ¦
<darkxst> gdm -> gdm3
<didrocks> or in that case, don't care about the conffiles in the older package
<didrocks> just handle the removal in the new binary
<didrocks> (after transitioning)
<darkxst> well I don't suppose many people modify gdm configs, so just going to get annoyed corner cases
<darkxst> rm_conffile may work, since the old conffiles seem to get owned by the transitional package
<didrocks> better to handle the transition still
 * didrocks dislikes when we drop the ball on config transition
<didrocks> but you don't really care about the "owning" part for moving to one package to another one
<didrocks> you just don't install it in the "new" version of the old package
<didrocks> and then, you handle the conffile in the new package, extracting data, rming the old conffile, and filing data in the new one
<darkxst> didrocks, dpkg-maintscript-helper is was cares about owership
<didrocks> oh, interesting, in that case, you should do it the old way :)
<didrocks> you still have the scripts we used some moons ago at https://wiki.debian.org/DpkgConffileHandling
<darkxst> yeh guess I will have to
<darkxst> is there anyway to actaully test the scripts without a full package rebuild?
<didrocks> just drop the file in /var/lib/dpkg/info and run it manually AFAIK
<didrocks> (as root, of course)
<didrocks> you can as well opened your previous ar .deb package, and change the file
<didrocks> and run dpkg -i directly
<darkxst> didrocks, I did try that, and the helper scripts bailed out with "invalid package", but thats less of a problem is I don't use it
<darkxst> also debconf is dumb, suppose I have to tell it directly the new display manager is gdm3, right now it asks to choose between gdm and gdm3 (can only guess the configure script runs while both versions are unpacked?)
<didrocks> yeah, that's what happen I guess
<didrocks> as those triggers are executed on configure
<didrocks> and so, you have the unpack step first (and removal)
<darkxst> that shouldnt be a problem though, and the diff against debian is actually sane now!
<didrocks> yeah, this gdm/gdm3 has been a nightmare for too many years
<didrocks> thanks for fixing it! :)
<darkxst> yeh, there hasnt been a proper merge in maybe 10 years
<darkxst> didrocks, don't thank me yet, you will probably have to NEW it ;) and someone is going to have to sponsor the upload
<didrocks> darkxst: I prefer NEWing that reviewing MIRs TBH :p
<darkxst> yeh and I guess the NEWing bit is actually pretty simple in this case, same upstream code
<darkxst> no one is going to review the merge though, would take them all day !
<didrocks> yeah, I bet!
<didrocks> This will be more a case of "I try to install -> works -> upload"
<didrocks> like libreoffice uploads :)
<darkxst> didrocks, has only taken me a year to finish it up
<darkxst> s/to get around to finishing it up/
<didrocks> heh ;)
<darkxst> didrocks, mainly because its like impossible to get a sane diff, between the two
<didrocks> yeah, I guess anyway it's a case where testing (and early drop in the distro) is the best that we can get
<darkxst> yep, lots of time left in this cycle!
<darkxst> and 3.18 is almost done
<didrocks> nice!
<darkxst> just waiting on MIR stuff for gtk, then there are the few long standing outdated packages
<darkxst> didrocks, or should that be Mir?
<darkxst> why name a display server after a process!
<didrocks> darkxst: yeah, I know :/
<didrocks> Mir is the project
<didrocks> MIR is the process
<darkxst> didrocks, I well know that, but its still confusing!
<Sweet5hark> moin all
<didrocks> good morning Sweet5hark!
<willcooke> morning
<didrocks> hey early willcooke
<Sweet5hark> didrocks, willcooke: hey guys.
<larsu> good morning!
<darkxst> hey willcooke larsu
<didrocks> morning larsu
<larsu> morning didrocks & darkxst. How are you?
<didrocks> good, thanks! yourself?
<darkxst> larsu, broken... apparently have a blood clot in my leg, but battling with gdm3 merge was just as painful ;)
<larsu> darkxst: oh sorry to hear. Hope you get better soon!
<larsu> didrocks: good thanks :)
<darkxst> larsu, not sure I will ever recover from merging gdm3!
<darkxst> my leg however should recover soon
<larsu> haha :)
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey larsu
<didrocks> re seb128
<seb128> I just missed something funny?!
<darkxst> larsu, took my entire friday evening to just get a sane enough diff, with some rename, sed foo
<larsu> seb128: morning! how are you?
<darkxst> seb128, probably <darkxst> larsu, broken... apparently have a blood clot in my leg, but battling with gdm3 merge was just as painful ;)
<seb128> larsu, good! how are you?
<seb128> gdm fun, I see
<darkxst> <darkxst> larsu, not sure I will ever recover from merging gdm3!
<darkxst> <darkxst> my leg however should recover soon
<darkxst> seb128, merge is done, just battling with migrations now
<darkxst> I can't use the helper scripts ;(
<seb128> why not?
<darkxst> cause paths and packages changes
<darkxst> dpkg-maintscript-helper checks to see if package owns the files, but we are crossing packages and changing paths
<seb128> k
<darkxst> seb128, really migration is just a mess, but the resulting diff is so much more saner, atleast
<seb128> that's something ;-)
<larsu> seb128: great thanks!
<darkxst> seb128, atleast it only needs to be done once!
<darkxst> seb128, or twice, though my git branch from the first attempt last year proved incredibly helpful ;)
<seb128> larsu, did you see my ping on friday btw?
<larsu> seb128: notify osd icons? Working on it
<seb128> larsu, yes
<larsu> sorry, conference was more fun than I thought
<seb128> thanks, should we hold the current silo?
<larsu> and got the log spam issue fixed :)
<larsu> talking to maintainers in person helps ;)
<seb128> no problem :-)
<seb128> great!
<seb128> was it fixed in glib?
<seb128> or in dbus?
<larsu> my (amended) patch is in dbus (just the spec)
<larsu> I'll take care of pushing the glib fix today
<seb128> great
<seb128> danke
<larsu> yw!
<larsu> seb128: ya hold it if you don't mind watining the day
<seb128> k, doing that, no worry
 * willcooke -> opticians - bbiab
<Laney> hullo
<darkxst> hey laney
<Laney> sup darkxst
<Laney> I read scrollback, no need to repeat ;-)
<darkxst> Laney, too much crap
<larsu> morning Laney!
<didrocks> hey Laney!
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey larsu & didrocks & seb128!
<Laney> what a treat!
<ricotz> hey desktopers
<Laney> doing good thanks, nice relaxing weekend
<Laney> good weekends all?
<Laney> hi ricotz
<ricotz> seb128, hi, afaics bamf doesnt like those two gedit desktop-files and seems to randomly pick one as default
<ricotz> hey Laney
<ricotz> Trevinho, hi ^, regarding bamf <-> new gedit
<didrocks> morning ricotz
<ricotz> hi didrocks
<seb128> ricotz, no idea about that, it's not different from what we did with e.g totem or nautilus
<seb128> but we can revert the GNOME renames if needed
<seb128> Laney, seems like doko fixed binutils and a good part of what was stacked migrated on saturday ;-)
<Laney> yeah I saw
<Laney> good old doko
<seb128> I'm glad it did migrate
<seb128> I misread what you said on friday and though we were stucked to get x265 and other things through
<Laney> no that's gstreamer and other things
<seb128> k
<seb128> I though we ended up with everything have to go together
<seb128> anyway it's mostly good now ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, I think I see this with nautilus too, not sure about totem
<seb128> ricotz, is that a bamf bug?
<ricotz> seb128, I would not revert the GNOME renames, this would break the DBusActivatable feature?
<seb128> is that used anywhere?
<ricotz> seb128, it might be a bamf issue, maybe NotShownIn OnlyShowIn would be better to differenciate
<ricotz> not sure, but it is there for a reason and avoiding to follow the rename might just lead to problems later
<ricotz> keeping those old-named files arround is just to preserver user-settings regarding pinned application in unity?
<seb128> not only unity or pinned applications
<seb128> but yeah user settings
<seb128> it's also e.g mimetype associations
<seb128> you pick something else as your favorite text editor and then back gedit
<seb128> and you have gedit.desktop in your config
<larsu> oh we're talking about *this* again
 * larsu sighs
<seb128> larsu, yeah, we alternate between that and headerbar as favorite topics :p
<larsu> haha
<seb128> but yeah, it's another issue that we never really resolved and that GNOME completely ignored :-/
<seb128> unsure what to do about it
<larsu> write a migration tool that converts desktop file names in all the user settings
<ricotz> seb128, I see
<larsu> or put a translation thing into gli
<larsu> *glib
<seb128> the migration thing is not possible
<seb128> you can't know every user config and they storage format
<seb128> some apps could have a custom sql database with the .desktop names in it
<seb128> unsure what was the outcome of the translation thing into glib previous time we discussed it
<larsu> which apps deal with desktop files?
<seb128> good questions, I've no idea
<seb128> every sort of "launcher" we have in the archive?
<seb128> gnome-panel, cairo-dock, unity, xfce-panel, lxde-panel, kde*
<seb128> and every sort of dock I don't know about
 * larsu wonders why he even got into that debate again :)
<seb128> haha
<larsu> solution: put up a big bug, add all the things
<larsu> and fix it for unity only
<larsu> others will quickly follow if we provide an easy way to integrate
<seb128> yeah, let's stop there, I feel like we are going to go circle and just create frustration
<larsu> indeed
 * larsu makes another tea
<seb128> :-)
<larsu> much better use of these 5 minutes
<Laney> someone help me find the actual failure in ffmpeg?
<Laney> 's build log
<seb128> Laney, url?
<Laney> :(
<Laney> it's on â machine
<Laney> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/225504108/buildlog_ubuntu-xenial-armhf.ffmpeg_7:2.8.1-1build2_BUILDING.txt.gz
<Laney> slangasek tried to fix it but it didn't work
<Laney> wondering if there is some easy enough way but can't find the error
<larsu> FT_FREETYPE_H is not defined?!
<larsu> #include MACRO is ... weird
<seb128> Laney,
<seb128> gcc -I. -I./ -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2 -U_FORTIFY_SOURCE -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2 -D_ISOC99_SOURCE -D_FILE_OFFSET_BITS=64 -D_LARGEFILE_SOURCE -D_POSIX_C_SOURCE=200112 -D_XOPEN_SOURCE=600 -DPIC -DZLIB_CONST -MM ffplay.c | sed -e "/^#.*/d" -e "s,^[[:space:]]*ffplay\\.o,./ffplay.o," > ffplay.d
<seb128> ffplay.c:3217:46: error: missing binary operator before token "("
<seb128>  #if defined(__APPLE__) && SDL_VERSION_ATLEAST(1, 2, 14)
<Laney> is that breaking it?
<seb128> ?
<Laney> Test idct8x8 failed. Look at tests/data/fate/idct8x8.err for details. make[2]: *** [fate-idct8x8] Error 1 tests/Makefile:203: recipe for target 'fate-idct8x8' failed
<Laney> that one I think
<Laney> doesn't show that file though
<Laney> THANKS FFMPEG
<larsu> seb128: that one and the ones about freetype macros being empty
<Laney> no
<Laney> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/225502974/buildlog_ubuntu-xenial-amd64.ffmpeg_7:2.8.1-1build2_BUILDING.txt.gz
<Laney> because it's in there too and still builds
<seb128> Laney, https://sourceware.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=19217
<seb128> ?
<ubot5> sourceware.org bug 19217 in gas "[2.26 Regression] ffmpeg test idct8x8 (NEON) fails on ARM32 when built with binutils from the trunk" [Normal,New]
<davidcalle> willcooke, hey, sorry I'm not done with scopes patches yet, will update you on it asap
<Laney> seb128: yeah I think it was trying to work aroudn this one
<seb128> just disable that one test on armhf?
<Laney> so should be disabled in this case I guess
 * Laney looks at it
<willcooke> back
<seb128> wb willcooke
<Laney> hi willcooke
<Laney> good bonfire?
<larsu> hey willcooke
<Laney> or was the opticians related...
<Laney> don't stand too close to the fire...
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> I have to wear galsses now
<willcooke> *glasses
<Laney> it begins
<willcooke> heh
<willcooke> Being able to see things close up again will be lovely though
 * Laney is practicing staring out of the window for a bit every now and then
<Laney> oh hi HMP Nottingham
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, do you have a few mins today to catch up re: my email?
<willcooke> larsu, I want to fix this:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-themes/+bug/762349
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 762349 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "Difficult to distinguish which tab is selected" [High,Confirmed]
<willcooke> larsu, can you tell me which are the best files to edit and I'll try and scrape an MP together
<willcooke> I think it'll be something in /usr/share/themes/Ambiance/gtk-3.0/
<willcooke> and then Radiance as well
<larsu> willcooke: yep, gtkwidgets.css
<willcooke> thanks
<larsu> how do you want to color them?
<willcooke> gonna make active the same colour as it is and inactive darker I think
<larsu> ah cool stuff
<willcooke> I'll get JohnLea to check it
<larsu> please use the shade()/darker() stuff instead of hard coding a value
<willcooke> got it
<larsu> (that's also a bit hard coding, but not as bad)
<larsu> imo
<willcooke> yeah, makes sense
<Laney> willcooke: firefox looks good imho
<larsu> Laney: I agree, but that only works when the tab bar is attached to another dark widget
<larsu> like the title bar or a header bar
<larsu> looks bad otherwis
<larsu> *e
<willcooke> I'll try with darker and I think I'll be able to get close
 * larsu is looking forward to seeingthat
<Laney> such as where?
<willcooke> larsu, will I need a separate entry for the tabs in gedit too - or is there a clever way to do both terminal tabs and gedit tabs?
<larsu> willcooke: it's the same widget. If you need to do something app specific, please put it in apps/<appname>.css
<larsu> like if you want to select by GeditWindow or similar
<larsu> but I'd prefer to keep that small
<larsu> Laney: old gedit has tabs below the toolbar
<willcooke> ah cool, I think they should be the same, so a single widget is good news
<larsu> Laney: I'm sure there are more apps that do this
<Laney> I'm not doubting you...
<larsu> willcooke: there should already be quite some rules about tabs in gtkwidgets.css
<Laney> just asking for an example
<larsu> gtkwidgetfactory!
<Laney> ok, can't visualise the problem, looking forward to seeing it in action then :)
<willcooke> I've tried it with @dark_bg_color but it clashes badly with the main background of the gedit window for example
<willcooke> so that's similar to ffox
<willcooke> dont like it
<willcooke> gonna try again just making it slightly darker
<willcooke> larsu, is using shade acceptable?
<willcooke> if Ihave to
<Laney> I don't get why it's okay for FF
<Laney> eyes are hard
<willcooke> I'll do a screenshot, one sec...
<Laney> nah, I believe you :P
<larsu> willcooke: yeah, of course
<seb128> willcooke, want to look at bug #1479054 as well? ;-)
<ubot5> bug 1479054 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "Shuffle and repeat buttons pressed state does not visually differ from unpressed state" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1479054
<didrocks> seb128: quick, assign! :)
<seb128> hehe
<didrocks> welcome to our new theme maintainer, larsu is off the hook \o/
<seb128> we have a new theme maintainer \o/
<Laney> muhahaha
<seb128> :-)
<larsu> didrocks: pssst - don't let him know yet
<larsu> it has to look natural
<didrocks> ahah
<willcooke> Sure!  CSS is about my level
<seb128> he's not maintaining it, just looking at some issues
<seb128> that's fine
<willcooke> actually, I'm quote happy to do this
<willcooke> quite
<seb128> :-)
<willcooke> ok, gedit fixed
<Laney> oh cool, you can fix the big info icon in hidpi too
<Laney> THANKS!
<willcooke> daker(@bg_color) is the right one imo
<Laney> css theme comes with icon theme
<BigWhale> Hello everyone... :)
<willcooke> and since I'm not the maintainer then let's ship it
<willcooke> now
<willcooke> damnit
<seb128> hey BigWhale
<larsu> willcooke: if you're the maintainer you can even review your own patches!!!
<willcooke> \o/
<willcooke> ok, that was easy! :D
<willcooke> Now I have to work out bzr
<seb128> screenshot? ;-)
<willcooke> YOU QUESTION ME?!?!?!?
<seb128> NEVER SIR
<willcooke> haha
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> just wanted to see the beautiful outcome, going to wait for the package to land ;-)
<willcooke> actually, it's not awesome.  e.g. the close icons on the inactive tabs could do with a tweak as well I think
<Laney> teach this man about the inspector
<seb128> didrocks, see how he starts caring about detail, going to make a good theme maintainer, i'm telling you ;-)
<willcooke> http://imgur.com/4wB3zIi
<willcooke> screen shot
<willcooke> "golf facts" were for my sons homework
<willcooke> honest
<didrocks> seb128: heh, I'm actually waiting for the first theme regressions though :p
<didrocks> then, he will get the stamp
<larsu> willcooke: was about to mention those :P
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> oh, that's odd.  The close icon in gedit has no circle around in on active or inactive, but terminal does
<willcooke> ok, yeah I need to get the inspector working
<willcooke> oh, but only when the window isn't focused do the circles appear
 * willcooke decides thats a bug
<seb128> willcooke, install libgtk-3-dev and do ctrl-shift-I
<didrocks> (you probably need to restart the app after installing the -dev package)
<willcooke> thx
<willcooke> humm, that circles issues doesn't exist on 14.04
<davmor2> willcooke: yeah, yeah, blame your son for looking at golf stuff, sure we believe you ;)
<willcooke> :D
<davmor2> willcooke: oh good news at the weekend I found a non-apple compatible mini display port to hdmi so I can now play multimonitor with xps, will be looking at setting it up this afternoon.  One big question though, on the auto detect of monitors should it not ask for the dpi of the monitor?
<larsu> davmor2: should it not find it out for itself?
<willcooke> davmor2, erm, not sure I follow you, but I would expect it to do it automatically
<davmor2> willcooke: from the quick test at the weekend it looks like it was correctly getting 1080p for the resolution, but the dpi was still set to the xps 4k
<davmor2> willcooke: so the screen app on the laptop was fine, but on the monitor filled the screen and then some
<willcooke> hrm, dunno.  Question for Trevinho I think ^^
<davmor2> Trevinho: just for the record, Xps 13 4k display, scaling factor 2 set through the Screen Display section of the settings app, plugged into an acer 26" monitor at 1920x1080
<davmor2> Trevinho: I'll take screenshot/photo's later when I set it up properly
<willcooke> seb128, could you have a look at that mailing list proposed email today?
<seb128> willcooke, oh, right, sorry I started on that friday and got sidetracked with other thing, doing that after lunch
<willcooke> thx seb128
<seb128> np, sorry for not doing it on friday
<willcooke> nw
<Laney> is that the one about the seed changes?
<willcooke> Laney, more just "here are some app changes..."  brasero, empathy, g cal
<willcooke> I think we should still communicate the seed changes properly
<willcooke> this is just a heads up
<willcooke> mhall119 asked for it
<willcooke> but if you're nearly ready with the seed changes email, that will be better
<Laney> No not yet
<willcooke> oki, I will carry on with this then
<Laney> I'll do the changes this week though
<Laney> Hope we don't get some terrid discussion
<didrocks> "braserooooooooooooooooooooooooo"
<didrocks> :)
 * davmor2 pictures didrocks doing his best Darth Vader Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo! impression with that "braserooooooooooooooooooooooooo"
<happyaron> I guess I'll stuck with GNOME translations for half of the week, to get all the submissions processed...
<Laney> http://162.213.34.169/html/
<didrocks> Laney: nice! you are running it?
<Laney> ya
<Trevinho> davmor2: unfortunately you can only define a global scale value for apps, while unity can be scaled per-screen..
<Laney> just hooked it up in the stack, nothing fancy now
<davmor2> Trevinho: right so it is the scaling at fault then :(  meh
<Trevinho> davmor2: yeah... unfortunately it's not nice, but no toolkit has the concept of scaling per monitor currently
<Sweet5hark> seb128: I dont plan to SRU bug 1514195 as a backport, but with 5.0.4: sure.
<ubot5> bug 1514195 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "changing border style closes libreoffice calc in i3-wm" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1514195
<seb128> Sweet5hark, wfm
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/~laney/+archive/ubuntu/arm/+build/8279451
<seb128> Laney, well done!
<Laney> not sure skipping a test is that smart :P
<Laney> but thanks
<willcooke> argh!
<willcooke> Themes are hard
<willcooke> well, css selectors are hard
<willcooke> Seems the close buttons on Gedit tabs are specific to Gedit
<seb128> yeah, the nautilus ones seem differen
<seb128> t
<willcooke> Using the inspector and looking at the selector says it's a GeditCloseButton
<willcooke> so I will put the changes in the gedit css file
<seb128> that makes sense
<willcooke> cool
<attente> good morning!
<willcooke> hey attente
<seb128> hey attente
<attente> hi guys
<didrocks> hey attente
<attente> hi didrocks
<Laney> what up attente
<larsu> hi attente!
<attente> hey Laney, hey larsu
<desrt> good morning peeps
<desrt> attente: any reason not to use a socketpair for your dbus connection?
<larsu> hey desrt
<desrt> morning :)
<attente> desrt: i thought using pipes would be simpler
<attente> desrt: good morning
<desrt> pipes can't do everything you can with sockets
<desrt> like sending fds
<attente> oh
<attente> before i switch over to sockets, do you think it's because the object doesn't implement org.freedesktop.Properties, etcx
<attente> ?
<attente> like who is responsible for implementing that interface?
<attente> gdbus-codegen doesn't generate it
<seb128> hey desrt
<larsu> attente: it should when you have properties in the dbus xml
<attente> larsu: oh, so what about org.freedesktop.DBus.Introspectable?
<qengho> FJKong: zaoshanghao. That is not in hanzi because my input method isn't doing anything after switching from en to zh-pinyin. fcitx is running. Can you help me debug?
<larsu> attente: same (but I think register_object() does this, even)
<attente> larsu: ok, thanks
<willcooke> gtk inspector has black corners as well, that's related to the tooltips thing right?
<seb128> that's an exemple of application using the client side decoration
<seb128> you know that topic that comes back every cycle :p
 * willcooke shuts up now
<seb128> so not exactly like the tooltip (which we fixed with a gtk workaround)
<seb128> but hikiko/trevinho are working on that
<willcooke> ahhh, ok, yes
<willcooke> thx
<willcooke> larsu, css selectors make me sad.  In our 1:1 on Friday can you give me a hand with this?  The basic patch for making unselected tabs darker is very simple, but trying to get rid of the light grey circle from around the close icon on an unfocused window has me beaten
<larsu> willcooke: sure! css is a bit tricky (order matters, but more so specificity of the rules)
<larsu> and specificity is hard to grok
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, I did a first version, but hikiko one would cover more cases
<larsu> this is the year of fixed client side decorations!
<larsu> oh I guess I should say "cycle"
<willcooke> larsu,  I /think/ I need to make the selector match the Geditclosebutton but for an unfocused window, the logic is sound, but yeah, not working ;)  I'll keep playing with it in the meantime.  It's a fun learning exercise
<larsu> willcooke: I don't think you can select for unfocussed things...
<larsu> buttons are very tricky
<larsu> all the same classes, but look different in a million places
<willcooke> I'll press on :)
<attente> desrt: why is passing around fds not possible with pipes in my case? the pipes are internal to my process
<desrt> why are you speaking dbus to yourself via pipes?
<attente> it's a test case
<seb128> Laney, can you push your nautilus upload (the bg scaling fix) to the vcs?
<Laney> done
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> yw
<seb128> I'm starting looking at the 3.18 update
<willcooke> larsu, do things like Ambiance and Radiance inherit from other themes?  e.g. Should I be looking for the general button theme outside of the Ambiance directory?
<Laney> seb128: keeping the headerbar yes?
<larsu> willcooke: no, they don't
<larsu> only the icon themes inherit
<willcooke> cool, that makes it easier, thanks larsu
<larsu> but there's some stuff in -borders.css
<seb128> Laney, for now yes, same as gedit, let's see how those go
<larsu> if I haven't removed all of that yet...
<Laney> just checking
<seb128> Laney, going to need to redo the menubar patch though
<Laney> because the menu bar patch was the reason we blocked it before
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> that needs to be redone
<seb128> I would usually ask larsu but he's busy with geoloc work so I'm going to have a try
 * larsu can help out!
<seb128> larsu, want to have a look at doing the menubar patch for nautilus?
<larsu> sure
<seb128> hopefully it's easy enough, they ported their code to the modern ways
<seb128> larsu, danke
<Laney> HAHA
<Laney> that went from "I'm going to have a try" to "larsu is doing it" in about 45 seconds
<Laney> â¥
<seb128> larsu, just do that based on git, I'm going to look at the package update and refreshing the other patches, etc (based on the work robert did for 3.16 and the gnome3 ppa, though they often comment patches instead of refreshing them)
<seb128> Laney, :-)
<seb128> there is still quite a load of patches and diff for the Debian rebase
<seb128> so it's not like I was avoiding doing any work :p
<larsu> seb128: master, even?
<Laney> drop all the patches!
<Laney> ...ubuntu14
<larsu> just drop a random one every week
<larsu> I'm sure didrocks could write a script for that
<seb128> haha
<Laney> oh yeah it's still doing the wallpaper
<Laney> :( :( :( :(
<seb128> larsu, yes, I don't think 3.18.1 and master are too far
<Laney> ): ): ): ):
<Laney> backwards smileys are weirdly hard to type
<mterry> kenvandine, did you see my poke about deja-dup's no-python2 branch?
<larsu> Laney: also, read
<kenvandine> mterry, yeah, sorry i didn't respond
 * Laney reads things all the time
 * Laney is good at reading
<Laney> my mum told me so
<kenvandine> i was busy and glanced at the branch and saw i couldn't review it quickly
<desrt> attente: transfering fds with dbus is only possible on unix sockets because it is done using a control message that is specific to unix sockets
<desrt> for your testcase, though, what are you doing?
<kenvandine> mterry, i can look at it today or tomorrow, ok?
<desrt> are you creating the proxy sync or async?
<desrt> and is the 'service side' in the same thread?
<larsu> Laney: also how to read backwards smileys? d:
<Laney> C:
<mterry> kenvandine, no rush at all.  Just wanted to make sure it was on your radar
<kenvandine> yeah, that's a huge merge proposal :)
<kenvandine> i might need help setting up my desktop for running the tests, it's been ages
<kenvandine> but not this morning, meetings
<Laney> so
<Laney> gtk 3.18?
<Laney> ok, no objections, thanks guys!
 * Laney slides it in
<attente> smooth
<seb128> Laney, no real blocker for me, I hope the bg issue is not going to hit too many users/going to be hard to resolve
<Laney> ya let's file gtk318 + rls-x-incoming bugs
<attente> desrt: it's a test case for a library (maliit-glib) that talks to a stub server over dbus to make sure the library talks to it properly
<attente> i'm creating the proxy sync
<attente> service side is created with g_dbus_interface_skeleton_export on the same thread, don't know if the signal handlers are being called on the same thread or a different one though
<desrt> attente: that's the problem
<desrt> attente: proxy creation needs to talk to the service
<desrt> attente: you create the proxy sync, so the client-side waits until the service responds
<desrt> meanwhile, the service can't respond until the mainloop runs, which it can't do because you're doing a sync wait
<desrt> put the service in a thread
<larsu> or don't do sync operations..
<desrt> in a testcase?
<larsu> sure, why not?
<desrt> because sync is easier and it's just a testcase
<larsu> putting it in a thread sounds like it will bring more problems later ;)
<desrt> imho if you want to have a service in the same process as a client, for testing purposes, it only makes sense that it would be in a separate thread
<desrt> rather than the two things constantly having to dance around each other in the same maincontext
<larsu> should work fine though, shouldn't it?
<desrt> as long as you constantly sprinkle your code with (run the mainloop for a while) sections complete with termination conditions
<desrt> the way people write tests isn't normally event driven
<desrt> it's "do this, then this, then this"
<desrt> it's not particularly well suited to async, unless you're writing in vala or something like that
<desrt> also: i'm not even sure if this is really the problem.  it just sounds like it.
<larsu> well sure, it won't work if you do everything sync
<larsu> in that case threads do make more sense
<larsu> and probably you're right - in a test case this is easier
 * desrt cleans up the glib inline mess once and for all
<didrocks> larsu: what this script being in nodejs, dart, go?
<larsu> didrocks: your choice ;)
<didrocks> \o/
 * didrocks does it in perl then
<didrocks> (j/k)
<didrocks> wellâ¦ https://metacpan.org/release/Git-Raw
<larsu> didrocks: you've been pulled off this project. Effective immediately
<larsu> don't even joke about doing stuff in perl
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> I'll know next time I don't want to work on something
<didrocks> just threat doing it in perl!
<larsu> !
<attente> how do i ensure the signal handlers are called in my new thread and not the main one?
<larsu> attente: from gdbusproxy? They're called in the thread you create the proxy in
<attente> larsu: so i have to create the proxy in a separate thread? it's not enough to create the server in a separate thread?
 * attente doesn't know this stuff...
<larsu> attente: wait. what?
<larsu> you create the server in a thread, and create the proxy (which points to the server?) in the main thread?
<larsu> brb
<attente> oh i need two non-main threads?
<larsu> attente: don't know what you talked about with desrt, but I'd assume you only need the one for the service and do the rest from the main thread
<attente> :(
 * Laney 's fingers slipped
 * Laney is off to catch a train - ttyl!
<didrocks> see you Laney!
<didrocks> and see you guys, time to go off!
<willcooke> Trevinho, andyrock, hikiko-lpt  -  I'd like to have our first Agile sprint planning and kick off this week.  andyrock is there a morning which works better for you this week?
<willcooke> Wednesday morning is pretty good for me
<Trevinho> willcooke: that's fine as well, not sure about andyrock (who maybe prefers afternoon)
<hikiko-lpt> hello I just arrived home
<hikiko-lpt> fosscomm :d
<hikiko-lpt> wednesday is fine for me as well :)
<seb128> hum
<seb128> what cursor themes are using other distributions?
<seb128> gedit throws warnings because we don't have "progress" and "text" in our default one, but it seems the other installed ones on Ubuntu also don't have those
<willcooke> ok, I think I've just made my first ever MP
<willcooke> larsu, it's trivial I know, and I should wait until I've got all my fixes in
<willcooke> but I wanted to see if I could work out how to do it
<willcooke> so feel free to reject or whatever
<willcooke> oh, so I have to link to a bug at commit time
<seb128> you can do that with --fixes lp:<nnn>
<willcooke> but only at commit time?
<seb128> you can do it on launchpad then
<seb128> like add a branch to the bug
<seb128> the commit in bzr log isn't going to have the bug reference if you do that
<seb128> but it's good enough for the CI to have the reference in the changelog etc
<willcooke> oki, I'll delete it and do it properly
<seb128> you can "bzr uncommit" and then commit again
<seb128> and then push --overwrite
<willcooke> cool, thanks seb
<seb128> yw!
<larsu> willcooke: congrats! Off to a pub in a bit - will have a look in the morning
<willcooke> Trevinho, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-themes/+bug/1493607  <-- fixed right?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1493607 in Ubuntu theme "Dragging overlay scrollbars in gnome-terminal, causes the window to resize" [High,In progress]
<willcooke> I can close it if yes
<Trevinho> willcooke: yep
<willcooke> thx Trevinho
<willcooke> done
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> Hrm
<willcooke> I thought that once I'd put up a branch for review then I would be free to continue working in that branch on other things and commit further changes to other bugs
<willcooke> but it rather looks like the branch I put up for review earlier now includes a fix to the Gtk2 theme
<willcooke> larsu, I've asked John Lea to ack the changes so please hold off for his OK before accepting.  Or if you want to reject, then you don't need to wait :)
<willcooke> robert_ancell, when PS Jenkins Bot said "Needs Fixing" - how do I find out why it thinks that?
<robert_ancell> willcooke, it should say in a comment
<robert_ancell> what is the MP?
<willcooke> ahhh
<willcooke> I see
<willcooke> thanks
<willcooke> https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubuntu-themes/ubuntu-themes/+merge/277043
<robert_ancell> willcooke, yeah, the commit message missing - I thought so. That one is a bit confusing.
<willcooke> Yeah, because I certainly had a message
 * Sweet5hark fixed 10 crashing race conditions today.
<willcooke> \o/
 * Sweet5hark now comfortably feels yoda speaking.
<willcooke> right ho, quittin' time.  G'night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-11-10
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, Ã§a va ? pas plus malade ?
<didrocks> hey pitti, plus malade ! et toi ? tu as pu rentrer ? Ã§a semblait difficileâ¦
<pitti> didrocks: oui, j'Ã©tais en retard un jour; deux vols ont Ã©tÃ© annulÃ©, mais mon vrai vol Ã©tait bien
<pitti> didrocks: j'ai pris un jour de vacance hier pour me reposer
<didrocks> pitti: tu as bien eu raison ! :)
<didrocks> pitti: comment est Austin ?
<pitti> didrocks: en fait c'Ã©tait bon ! cette fois on a Ã©tÃ© au milieu de ville; beaucoup de bars, restaurants etc. prÃ¨s d'hÃ´tel
<pitti> didrocks: jeudi on a vu "V for Vendetta" -- c'Ã©tait le vrai jour, 5 novembre
<pitti> et courir Ã  rive de Colorado est bien aussi, j'ai y couru deux fois
<pitti> les autres matins il y avait du brouillard, on ne peux rien voir
<pitti> ("on ne peux voir rien" ?)
<didrocks> cool que vous ayez eu un sprint Ã  un endroit sympa :)
<pitti> err, "on ne peux pas voir rien"?
<didrocks> "on ne peut rien voir"
<pitti> ah, prÃ¨sque :)
<didrocks> oui, presque :-)
<pitti> uh, "prÃ¨s de.." vs "presque", sans l'accent?
<didrocks> es -> "Ã¨ss" en terme de son
<didrocks> donc oui, pas d'accent
<didrocks> for "prÃ¨s", you don't pronounce the final "s", I guess that's why you need the accent for the "Ã¨" sound
<larsu> good morning!
<didrocks> morning larsu :)
<larsu> hi didrocks :) How are you?
<Trevinho> Morning
<Trevinho> Hi larsu, didrocks!
<didrocks> hey hey Trevinho!
<didrocks> larsu: good, thanks! how are you?
<larsu> morning Trevinho!
<larsu> didrocks: good thanks!
 * larsu goes to get some breakfast
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<pitti> bonjour seb128, comment vas-tu ?
<pitti> hey larsu!
<pitti> morning Trevinho
<pitti> it's good to be back :)
<seb128> salut pitti, Ã§a va bien, et toi ?
<seb128> pitti, tu as rÃ©ussi Ã  rentrer en Allemagne ?
<seb128> I read your g+ post about your rebooked flight cancelled as well
<pitti> seb128: oui, j'ai rentrÃ© bien dimanche
<pitti> seb128: j'ai pris un jour de vacance hier pour me reposer
<seb128> tu as bien fait
<seb128> comment va ton jetlag ?
<pitti> larsu: as-tu Ã©tÃ© Ã  systemd.conf ?
<pitti> seb128: en fait bien ! j'ai me levÃ© Ã  3h hier, mais ce matin Ã  6h; donc je suis retour Ã  la normale
<seb128> :-)
<pitti> pas d'ubuflu, qui aide :)
 * pitti pats sil2100
<larsu> morning pitti!
<larsu> back home?
<larsu> the conference was great! Lots of nice people and good talks
<larsu> I liked yours especialy ;)
<larsu> morning seb128!
<seb128> hey larsu!
<larsu> how are you?
<seb128> doing good :-)
<seb128> what about you?
<larsu> great thanks! Just got myself some breakfast :)
 * larsu should make tea to go wit hit
<larsu> *with it
<seb128> hehe
 * seb128 is drinking coffee
<willcooke> morning
<larsu> morning willcooke
<willcooke> hey larsu - I've asked for the +1 from design for those theme changes
<larsu> I saw
<larsu> no reply yet?
<willcooke> I'm meeting with John in an hour or so
<willcooke> I tweak the gtk2 theme as well for the scrollbar trough
<willcooke> http://imgur.com/a/RHfU7
<Laney> hey hey
<willcooke> after at the top, before at the bottom
<willcooke> morning Laney
<willcooke> strangely it looks quite different on a machine than a screenshot
<seb128> hey willcooke
<seb128> hey willcooke
<larsu> willcooke: darker trough?
<seb128> how is u.k today?
<larsu> morning Laney
<willcooke> larsu, yeah
<willcooke> seb128, warm and windy :)
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<larsu> willcooke: hehe - does look better I think
<didrocks> morning Laney
<willcooke> larsu, full screen the old is really hard to spot the scrollbar in the trough IMO
<willcooke> anyways - I think John will be fine with it
 * larsu nods
<willcooke> ahah!
<willcooke> I have the slow shutdown on W again
<willcooke> A stop job is running for monitor and control system power state (17s / 1m 30s)
<willcooke> it's now stopped ticking up
<willcooke> pitti, anything to worry about?  ^
<willcooke> This hasn't shown up for ages and now I have a USB drive plugged in, it's back
<willcooke> Seems I can reproduce it now
<seb128> willcooke, you probably want to follow /usr/share/doc/systemd/README.Debian.gz it has a section for debugging shutdown issues
<willcooke> thx seb128 I'll take a look
<seb128> Laney, seems like libgtk-3-dev should depends on libmircookie-dev now
<seb128> gdk-3.0.pc lists it
<Laney> check bzr
<Laney> ...check xenial-changes :)
<seb128> didn't get an email on xenial-changes
 * seb128 refreshes
<seb128> nop
 * Laney shrugs
<seb128> but I guess it means you are on it ;-)
<didrocks> speaking of the devilâ¦ ;)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> nettle-dev?
 * didrocks gives http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/u/ubuntu-make/xenial/ppc64el/ to pitti :-)
<seb128> I wonder if it's normal that building on x11 pulls in mir requirements?
<Laney> yes
<seb128> why? (just curious)
<seb128> well the depends is right, I just wonder why it has to be this way
<pitti> didrocks: wohoo!
<didrocks> was annoyed by a "always failed" on one arch :p
 * pitti donne une accolade Ã  didrocks
 * didrocks donne une accolade en retour
<didrocks> (and no, I didn't disable the test ;))
<pitti> willcooke: hm, what's that? powerd?
<seb128> Laney, I retried the pygobject builds btw, they seem alright now
<seb128> maybe that unblocks libpeas and gedit :-)
<pitti> willcooke: is that still starting on desktop? last time I looked at it it was doomed to fail without android
<pitti> willcooke: so that's saying it tried to stop (SIGTERM) powerd and it doesn't go down on that; it gets SIGKILLed after the timeout
<pitti> willcooke: so: if powerd has been fixed to work without android, then it needs to be fixed to terminate on SIGTERM, or get an ExecStop= to say what otherwise one must do to stop it
<pitti> willcooke: if it has not been fixed to work without android, it shouldn't start in the first place, and its unit should grow some conditional
<Laney> ask attente?
<Laney> thanks
<willcooke> pitti, only upowerd is running on my W machine
<pitti> willcooke: ok, so I guess someone fixed it for non-android
<willcooke> ah, upowerd == powerd
<willcooke> humm
<pitti> willcooke: right, upower is harmless and expected to run; talking about powerd
<pitti> that's the ubuntu phone specific thing
<willcooke> having said I could recreate it, guess what....
<willcooke> now it's working fine again
<Laney> hey pitti
<willcooke> I thought I had a way to make it fail,  guess not
<pitti> hey Laney, how are you?
<willcooke> it's back
<willcooke> wtf
<Laney> pitti: good, went out for cuban tapas last night which was yummy :)
<pitti> willcooke: can you try this without rebooting: just "sudo systemctl stop powerd" and see if it hangs
<Laney> you? good journey back?
<pitti> willcooke: if not, start it again, stop, wash, rinse & repeat?
<pitti> Laney: a day late, but the flight that actually did fly was fine
<Laney> wait, I saw a post about... that
<pitti> and I adjusted to the jetlag rather well
<pitti> the swap day yesterday was really helpful
<pitti> and I worked for < 10 mins :)
<Laney> \o/
<seb128> hum, bug #1514427 ... does anyone can try that on xenial/amd64? works fine on i386
<ubot5> bug 1514427 in inkscape (Ubuntu) "Cannot open inskape undefined symbol: _ZN6Magick5Image4readERKNSt7__cxx1112basic_stringIcSt11char_traitsIcESaIcEEE" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1514427
 * pitti apt installs
<pitti> WTH, this installs libgnomevfs2 -- is that *still* a thing
<pitti> seb128: it was reported on amd64
<pitti> hm, but it starts fine here
<seb128> pitti, yeah, which is why I'm asking if anyone using amd64 can reproduce
<seb128> since my install is i386
<pitti> oh, it works for you
<seb128> yes
<seb128> k, so local issue I guess
<seb128> maybe an old lib in /usr/local or something
<seb128> pitti, tahnks for testing
<pitti> libmagick++-6.q16-5v5 8:6.8.9.9-6
<pitti> libmagickcore-6.q16-2 8:6.8.9.9-6
<pitti> that at least seems current
<pitti> yeah, local imagemagic install could do that
<Trevinho> seb128: it seems there are some troubles with gtk dependency in xenial...
<Trevinho> configure: error: Package requirements (libwnck-3.0 >= 3.4.7) were not met:
<Trevinho> Package 'mircookie', required by 'gdk-3.0', not found
<Trevinho> This is for bamf, for example... But also Unity fails
<seb128> Trevinho, hey, yeah, Laney just uploaded a fixed gtk, see backlog
<seb128> Trevinho, just do a retry once the new gtk is published, should be soon enough
<Trevinho> seb128: ah, ok... rebuilding now is fine (in ppa)?
<Trevinho> ok
<seb128> Trevinho,
<seb128> $ rmadison -s xenial-proposed libgtk-3-0
<seb128>  libgtk-3-0 | 3.18.2-1ubuntu1 | xenial-proposed | amd64, arm64, armhf, i386, powerpc, ppc64el
<seb128> so not yet
<willcooke> pitti, sorry for the delay.  So I did a systemctl stop powerd and it took ~ 15 seconds to stop.  Retrying....
<seb128> need another publisher
<Trevinho> seb128: ok, thanks
 * Trevinho waits...
<Laney> it's not finished on armhf yet
<pitti> willcooke: ah, so you can reproduce that without having to reboot, good
<Trevinho> you damn armhf... You're always late.
<Trevinho> (it looks something more related to an Italian technology than a British one :P)
<pitti> oh, no Sweetshark?
<willcooke> pitti, systemctl start powerd -> Failed to start powerd.service: Unit lxc-android-config.service failed to load: No such file or directory
<pitti> LibO started to fail with "configure: error: gtk3 libraries of the correct versions, not found"
<seb128> pitti, cf what we just said
<seb128> pitti, gtk+ fix is building, another 1 or 2 publisher cycles and it should be good to retry
<pitti> seb128: ah, thanks
<willcooke> larsu, +1 from desig
<willcooke> n
<larsu> \o/
<seb128> Trevinho, you can retry your gtk builds now
<seb128> pitti, ^
<pitti> seb128: thanks; the new gtk+3.0 already re-triggered the tests
<seb128> good
<Trevinho> seb128: thanks
<seb128> Trevinho, I think you said that https://code.launchpad.net/~sethj/ubuntu/wily/unity/fix-for-1445595/+merge/276074 was wrong, can you comment on it?
<Trevinho> seb128: yep
<seb128> Trevinho, thanks
<Laney> LP/archive is being super slow for me
<Laney> same for anyone else?
<willcooke> Laney, testing
<willcooke> Laney, seems the security repo is slow, others OK
<seb128> Laney, lp works fine for me
<Laney> ok
<didrocks> same here, fine
 * Laney needs to get round to running ethernet
 * Laney orders a reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeel
<qengho> good morning.
<seb128> hey qengho
<andyrock> morning
<Trevinho> hey andyrock
<Trevinho> andyrock: you know there's a big review queue for you? :-D
<andyrock> yeah
<Trevinho> ð
<andyrock> that does not make me happy
<Trevinho> It's a nice mail, come one!
<Trevinho> on*
<willcooke> hey andyrock - how are you fixed for a meeting tomorrow around 10am UTC?
<Trevinho> Ah, and the Kylin guys proposed their lockscreen shield... Works well, there are some code changes needed, but from a first look it seems nice.
<willcooke> andyrock, this will be our inaugural agile sprint kick off
<andyrock> willcooke: if it's on IRC it's fine for me
<willcooke> andyrock, it will need to be a HO I think, sorry.  Do you have any mornings which work?
<willcooke> I guess we can try IRC, but I think HO will be better/faster
<andyrock> willcooke: can I do that on the phone? just for the days I'm not home at that time
<willcooke> andyrock, there will be one of these about every 3 weeks, plus a review at a similar schedule
<Trevinho> But, doing it on afternoon is not feasible?
<andyrock> ok I'll make it for tomorrow
<willcooke> Sure, we can do that.  My afternoons tend to be busier, but we can find a slot I'm sure
<willcooke> andyrock, when is a good time for you?  I think 1 hr will be plenty
<willcooke> happy to fit around your schedule
<Trevinho> Ok, then we can decide everytime when's better..
<willcooke> +1
<andyrock> my schedule is a mess, it's no fixed
<andyrock> I'll try to adapt my schedule to the meetings
<andyrock> the opposite is impossible
<willcooke> hah
<andyrock> i'll do it for tomorrow :D
<Trevinho> Since we're just 4 people, I think we can be easily flexible
<willcooke> plus seb128 at least for the first one
<Trevinho> ah, ok sure
<Trevinho> seb128 is always there :)
<willcooke> ok, how about we sync tomorrow on IRC and try and find a slot
<willcooke> hikiko will be back tomorrow as well
<Trevinho> Fine
<seb128> tomorrow is a french holiday but I should be online at least in the morning between 10 and 12
<willcooke> oh yeah, forgot
<willcooke> maybe Thursday then
<seb128> let's see tomorrow morning?
<willcooke> sure, oki plan is then try and sync tomorrow morning and if we can't do it then try again on Thursday
<Trevinho> seb128: don't do that... We can move this on Thursday
<tseliot> willcooke: hi, do you know what version of gstreamer we are planning to use in 16.04?
<seb128> tseliot, whatever is stable by feature freeze, looks like 1.6 from where we stand at the moment
<tseliot> seb128: ok, thanks
<seb128> tseliot, why?
<Laney> 1.8
<tseliot> seb128: somebody asked ;)
<seb128> http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/gstreamer-announce/2015-October/000359.html
<seb128> in fact 1.8 likely I guess
<seb128> tseliot, do you know why they ask? they want/need a new version?
<tseliot> ah, ok
<tseliot> seb128: I'm not really sure. I will ask them
<seb128> thanks
 * Laney was here you know
<seb128> Laney, here?
<tseliot> Laney: sorry, I didn't see you
 * seb128 waves to Laney
<tseliot> Laney: thanks
<seb128> Laney, sorry when I replied I was unsure if you were around or at lunch or if you knew/tracked upstream gstreamer work
 * seb128 knows for next time that Laney masters gstreamer's schedule ;-)
<Laney> no worries :P
<Laney> I usually assume these days that we'll track it like glib
<seb128> k, I though you mostly did merge from Debian
<seb128> I didn't know you were tracking upstream as well
<Laney> slomo is fast there
<seb128> yeah
<Laney> happy to let him do that
<seb128> I for one had no idea when 1.8 was coming
<seb128> now I know
<Laney> ya, trying to get on the 6 month train
<seb128> they failed in the past
<seb128> so I don't trust much their schedule
<seb128> but let's see ;-)
<willcooke> didrocks, heard back from Fritzing too.  They are +1
<willcooke> larsu, thanks for the approval!  Do I need to do anything now or is it automatic?  Will it be part of 16.04?
<larsu> willcooke: used to be automatic; these days we need to ping seb128 or Laney
<larsu> there's a spreadhseet involoved. And a silo. And something about a train
<seb128> larsu, no spreadsheet anymore
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> things improve!
<seb128> willcooke, need a landing through https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/
<larsu> oh indeed?
<larsu> ah, right
 * larsu shuts up
<larsu> the part about pinging someone was corrct
<seb128> I'm unsure you wouldn't be able to do a landing yourself
<seb128> if you are not we could for sure arrange to have it fixed
<seb128> same for willcooke :p
<didrocks> willcooke: great! do you mind opening bugs with links and references?
 * seb128 hands a "rebuild master" badge to Laney ;-)
<Laney> didn't test build that lot
<Laney> and there were some sed build depends replacements
<Laney> sooooo, no badge just yet :)
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> more transition coming
<seb128> I noticed the new "glew" upload earlier
<seb128> there are some 60 rdepends
<Laney> ffs
<Laney> better not get entangled
<seb128> we might want a transition tracker for that one
<Laney> just got a proper dialog from e-d-s
<Laney> for team meeting reminder
<Laney> :(
<willcooke> seb128, I'm not authorized to add a new request.  What should I do?
<seb128> Laney, why ":("?
<willcooke> didrocks, Sure.  Still need to finalise the legal side, but I will create a couple of bugs anyway
<seb128> willcooke, unsure what group has the rights to do landing. If you are interested to figure that out/get it work ask on #ubuntu-ci-eng, otherwhise jut delegate the landing to somebody in the team I would say
<willcooke> probably not something I need to do very often.  seb128 would you mind doing the honours?
<willcooke> it's not urgent of course
<seb128> willcooke, adding to my list
<willcooke> thx!
<seb128> but probably not for before thursday
<willcooke> nw
<seb128> yw!
 * willcooke feels a disturbance in the force
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Nov 10 15:30:05 2015 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic:
<didrocks> hey
<seb128> hey
<willcooke> Roll call: andyrock, attente, desrt (hols),  dgadomski, didrocks, fjkong (maybe out), happyaron (maybe out), hikiko (hols), laney, larsu, qengho, seb128, sweet5hark, themuso (out), tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<andyrock> hey
<dgadomski> hey
<Sweet5hark> hey
<Trevinho> HEy!
<FJKong> =ã=ï¼
<happyaron> hey
<qengho> hejhej
<larsu> \o
<willcooke> Let's go.....
<willcooke> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: andyrock
<andyrock> Nothing that much last week
<andyrock> TreviÃ±o is too fast to write code
<andyrock> faster than me reading his code
<Trevinho> not true...
<andyrock> btw this week I'll try to review all the MPs
 * Laney is getting ALL the build failures now
<willcooke> oki, thanks andyrock
<willcooke> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: attente
<desrt> o/
<attente> hi, not a whole lot to say
<attente> finished https://github.com/maliit/framework/pull/19 and https://github.com/maliit/inputcontext-gtk/pull/1, merged upstream
<attente> need to figure out why clicking on the maliit keyboard double taps keys in gtk apps
<attente> backlog: single-surface mode for gtk-mir
<attente> (eof)
<willcooke> thx attente
<willcooke> desrt, are you really here?
<desrt> ya
<desrt> i didn't email my report, so i can give it now :)
<willcooke> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: desrt
<desrt> did a release last week and used the chance to do a lot of long-overdue cleanup tasks in glib
<desrt> simplified the docs build
<desrt> also simplified our handling of "inline" (which exploded as a result of the recent overflow-checked math ops work)
<desrt> also general bugs/patches/etc.
<desrt> eof
<willcooke> thanks desrt
<willcooke> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: dgadomski
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> * I've been off for 2 days last week
<dgadomski> * fixed bug #1337873, reported upstream bug with attached patch (https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=92886), will work on debdiffs for SRU
<ubot5> Freedesktop bug 92886 in daemon "PolkitAgentSession incorrectly handles multiline PAM_TEXT_INFO output" [Normal,New]
<ubot5> bug 1337873 in ifupdown (Ubuntu Vivid) "Precise, Trusty, Utopic - ifupdown initialization problems caused by race condition" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1337873
<dgadomski> * got more feedback for fix to bug #1337873, pitti will upload the fix to xenial for testing before SRU
<dgadomski> * working on a wiki page with information about debugging policykit
<dgadomski> EOF
<willcooke> thanks dgadomski
<dgadomski> thank you
<seb128> dgadomski, what's the url of the page?
<dgadomski> seb128: I'm working on a draft, going to paste it to wiki, not sure what would be the best place to put it
<dgadomski> seb128: I still have it as a google doc
<seb128> dgadomski, probably https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingPolicyKit or something
<seb128> that would be consistent with others
<seb128> e.g https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingApparmor
<dgadomski> seb128: thanks, will do that
<willcooke> great, thanks chaps
<willcooke> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: didrocks
<didrocks> Ubuntu Make:
<didrocks> * Release work from previous week as 15.11. Good feedbacks so far.
<didrocks> * Review and merge Netbeans IDE support (and added/cleaning tests for it) by Fabio Colella!
<didrocks> * Review and merge Jared Ravetch rust support (and added/cleaning as well tests for it) by Jared Ravetch.
<didrocks> * Review and merge Unity3D updates support by Eldar Khayrullin (welcome to our new contributor).
<didrocks> * Review and merge Sebastian Schuberth fix for Android NDK.
<didrocks> * Fix webstorm icon renamed upstream.
<didrocks> * Ship version file as part of the install (Now --version really works on packaged flavor as well) + stamp generated binary with correct version.
<didrocks> * Fix BaseInstaller to not crash when all downloads assets are 404 + add medium tests for this.
<didrocks> * Ensure -r global option behave like --remove.
<didrocks> * Some style, refactoring and formatting tidy up for recent merges and changes.
<didrocks> * Add medium assets, certificates and additional failure test cases for netbeans and rust.
<didrocks> * Update docker container for medium tests with new certificates.
<didrocks> * Readd Travis CI integration running pep8 and small tests (with badge status and updated wording in README). New pushes and pull requests are now automatically tested on those 2 kinds of tests.
<didrocks> * Fix and updates dependencies for package and pip virtualenv deps.
<didrocks> * Standardize the test environment so that people running tests using for instance zsh are not impacted.
<didrocks> * Finish up shipping static files support for future frameworks.
<didrocks> * Using scala framework for loading tests and making autopkgtests pass on armel64 (android not available on this arch).
<didrocks> * Improve releasing script and migrate gbp config to new headers.
<didrocks> Misc:
<didrocks> * Watched and followed some UOS sessions (still some to catch up though)
<didrocks> * Some Archive Admin duties
<didrocks> .
<willcooke> nothing else?
<larsu> did you sleep?
<willcooke> :D:D
<willcooke> thanks didrocks, amazing stuff
<willcooke> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: FJKong
<seb128> you guys read fast
<didrocks> larsu: not enough ;)
<larsu> haha
<FJKong> dmesg| less
<FJKong> hi
<Trevinho> didrocks: has a bot to generate random changleogs :P
<FJKong> things about sogou IM :
<didrocks> Trevinho: damn, need to change my strategy now! :)
<FJKong> processing sogou skin picture with libpng,
<FJKong> modify Imageprovider to load image
<FJKong> made a demo to display animate picture
<FJKong> pinyin search
<FJKong> wirite README and guide to help testing
<FJKong> test gui configre tool
<FJKong> eof
<willcooke> animated gifs ftw
<willcooke> thanks FJKong
<willcooke> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: happyaron
<happyaron> ok
<happyaron> not long this week
<happyaron> 1. Continued testing/improving of (my) zfs package
<happyaron> 2. Mass updates to Chinese translations (still working on those stuff atm)
<happyaron> EOF
<happyaron> just be time consuming
<willcooke> thanks happyaron
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: Laney
<Sweet5hark> Trevinho, didrocks: http://whatthecommit.com/ and https://github.com/lwe/whatthecommit
<Trevinho> :D
<Laney> oops
<Laney> â¢ glib2.0 -> unstable, exp, wily, xenial (+ poking tests to get things in)
<Laney> â¢ (finish?) set(ting?) up appstream server running on http://162.213.34.169/html/ (temporary home)
<Laney> â¢ re-poked at libphonenumber after being asked to by pocock, made another Debian upload, should be syncable now after a fix in telephony-service (submitted)
<Laney> â¢ gtk+3.0 -> xenial (currently poking tests, should go in today [just did!])
<Laney> â still need to file a couple of bugs
<Laney> â¢ poke for gnome-desktop3/cheese(?)/e-d-s/other things transition, went in after doko fixed binutils and webkit2gtk built
<Laney> â¢ poke lots and lots of things for poppler/ffmpeg/ocaml/gsl/soundtouch/x264/x265 transition, still ongoing
<Laney> â¢ gstreamer 1.6.1 updates
<Laney> â¢ some UOS things and discussions about desktop iso testing
<Laney> â
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<willcooke> #topic larsu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: larsu
<larsu> random bug and review work this past week, still not on top of everything (sorry)
<larsu> went to systemd conf and had some good discussions
<larsu> got the dbus spec amended while there
<larsu> and a bug fix for dbus-monitor
<larsu> (which is broken right now)
<larsu> also finished up the gsettings-qt stuff
<larsu> and worked on geonames localization in between
<larsu> I think that's it. </larsu>
<willcooke> reviewed my awesome mp
<willcooke> thanks larsu
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: qengho
<larsu> willcooke: awesome work ;)
<willcooke> :D
<larsu> easy to review
<qengho> * Releasing Cr 46.0.2490.71 today. Translations and default-browser bugs worked out.
<qengho> * Preparing distro bug fix for xdg-utils.
<qengho> * Not much on cr-ozone-mir this week.
<qengho> * Exploring apparmor hats for Chromium to punch smallest possible holes for sandbox.
<qengho> EOF
<willcooke> thanks qengho
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> qengho, speaking about xdg-utils, it needs merging on Debian, if you want maybe to do that ;-)
<seb128> oh
<seb128> â¢ keep looking at incoming bugs and errors, triaging and picking some
<seb128> â¢ updated gedit to 3.18 including CSD, quite some changes, thanks Lars for doing most of the work previous cycle!
<seb128> â¢ backported rhythmbox fix for sync dialog have a null height
<seb128> â¢ joined some UOS sessions
<seb128> â¢ debugged/fixed nautilus trash segfault (was due to glib)
<seb128> â¢ started nautilus update (3.18) + debian merge, quite some work, still ongoing
<qengho> seb128: Will look.
<seb128> â¢ did a patch pilot shift
<seb128> â¢ load of desktop updates&merges
<seb128> â¢ some work on current xenial britney issues/transitions
<seb128> (also another reminder that help on debian merges would be welcome ;-)
<willcooke> desktoppers: ^^ please help
<seb128> thanks :-)
<willcooke> thx seb128
<willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: Sweet5hark
<Sweet5hark> - finished 5.0.3 update for docviewer and related issues
<Sweet5hark> - CVE-2015-4551 CVE-2015-5212 CVE-2015-5213 CVE-2015-5214 for precise/trusty/vivid (good riddance finally)
<Sweet5hark> - some UOS stuff
<Sweet5hark> - upstream code review
<Sweet5hark> - added some assertions on threading issues upstream, fixed some 10 API entry points without mutex locking issues that might cause spurious crashes
<Sweet5hark> - peeked a look at 5.1 alpha1/xenial for prereleases ppa (not more yet)
<Sweet5hark> - some tender review/TDF leadership/event coordination
<Sweet5hark> EOF
<willcooke> bosh!
<willcooke> thanks Sweet5hark
<willcooke> good news on the CVEs
<willcooke> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: TheMuso
<willcooke> * Updated Orca to latest stable, 3.18.2 in xenial.
<willcooke> * Updated at-spi2-core in Debian pkg-a11y git, waiting for upload to Debian so I can merge into Xenail.
<willcooke> * Started making preparations to upgrade to xenial.
<willcooke> * Almost got my Orca gsettings backend code working, but Orca is not speaking, and not executing commands. Investigation continues.
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> - Phone: Did more testing with level-1 and level-2 printing stacks. For level 1 I got everything working. Level 2 seems to have some problems with filters to be run on ARM.
<tkamppeter> - cups: Fixed the problem of sub-processes not starting, after investigation of the CUPS source code I have found that the problem is the binary package splitting, as some small helper program was missing in the level-1 printing stack.
<tkamppeter> - Communication with a printer manufacturer because of IPP-over-USB problems.
<tkamppeter> - Discussion with Ghostscript upstream about XPS support.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<willcooke> thanks tkamppeter
<willcooke> good work on the phone
<willcooke> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: Trevinho
<seb128> tkamppeter, good work on figuring out the missing helper issue!
<Trevinho> Â· Meeting with kylin guys: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Ubuntu Kylin/Meeting/2015/20151105
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed a panel menus flickering issue, caused by a nux change (and a nux workaround inside unity)
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed drawing of prelighted state of the indicators
<Trevinho> Â· Added upstart support to BAMF
<Trevinho> Â· Show warning also when numlock is enabled in lockscreen
<Trevinho> Â· Proposed the new overlay scrollbars for the dash so that they're like the gtk ones
<Trevinho> Â· Re-enabled the unit tests on arm64
<Trevinho> Â· Removed python2.7 dependency on unity packages that are in main (kept for unity-autopilot that is in universe)
<Trevinho> Â· Initial review of the Ubuntu Kylin lockscreen shield
<Trevinho> Â· Prepared a new landing of the stack
<Trevinho> Â· Attended desktop UOS session, joined others, watched someone else
<Trevinho> î¿î¿î¿
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho
<willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<seb128> Trevinho, good work :-)
<willcooke> - Xenial updates
<willcooke> - XMir packaging
<willcooke> - GNOME Software work
<willcooke> - Found a lightdm-webkit-greeter maintainer!
<seb128> oh, nice for lightdm-webkit-greeter
<willcooke> yay!
<seb128> thanks for helping with updates Rob ;-)
<Trevinho> seb128: :-)
<willcooke> #topic Any other business
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-11-10 | Current topic: Any other business
<willcooke> Anyone got any topics?
<willcooke> Nothing from my side at this point
<seb128> did I mention Debian merges? ;-)
<seb128> :p
<willcooke> :))
<willcooke> going in 10...
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently while updating the bug list for release http://pad.ubuntu.com/6aWG0SagNg
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Nov 10 15:55:22 2015 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2015/ubuntu-desktop.2015-11-10-15.30.moin.txt
<willcooke> thanks everyone, nice and efficient today
<willcooke> good turn out too
<seb128> thanks!
<attente> thanks
<larsu> thanks!
<didrocks> thanks!
<Sweet5hark> thanks guys
<willcooke> oh, could someone take a look at Byran's email to the desktop list Gnome Calendar?
<willcooke> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-desktop/2015-November/004755.html
<willcooke> as and when
<Trevinho> Sweet5hark: another good one from your site: Â«Removed test case since code didn't pass QA Â» :-D
<Sweet5hark> Trevinho: lets be honest: we have all seen that one (if only with more decorum)
 * Trevinho has a recent branch with that :-D
<Sweet5hark> hrhr
<seb128> willcooke, i've that on my todolist, I need to try/play with the tb one
<willcooke> thx seb128
<pitti> nice, gtk+3.0 propagated without a hitch
<willcooke> \o/
<Laney> without?
<Laney> I retried a few tests for it
<seb128> pitti, wait to see the runtime result :p
<pitti> Laney: oh, did you? bah
 * seb128 pinned gtk+3.16 meanwhile
<pitti> Laney: cloud trouble again, or flaky tests?
<Laney> pitti: at least https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-xenial/xenial/i386/s/software-properties/20151110_151705@/log.gz
<pitti> seb128: trust your work!
<pitti> Laney: ah sorry, that was my doing
<pitti> the test was hung, and I killed it as I wanted to roll out a new worker
<pitti> but I thought I already retried it
<seb128> pitti, i tried it, the bg flickering is giving me headaches
<seb128> I hope I'm not the only one to see that and that we manage to get upstream/somebody to look at it
<willcooke> Parents evening at the school, back in 30 mins
<seb128> pitti, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/gtk.ogv
<pitti> that'll be a really short evening
<seb128> pitti, the first part of the video is with the new gtk then it's the old one
<qengho> When I have those, I have to bring the teacher a bottle of scotch and dry her tears for two hours.
<pitti> seb128: I think the video loses the effect somewhat, but I think I know what you mean
<pitti> uh, so empathy/telepathy are dead for good? what a pity
<pitti> (reading willcooke's 16.04 change proposals)
<seb128> they are unmaintained at least
<pitti> TBH I've been using pidgin for a while as empathy still doesn't do OTR (encryption)
<seb128> telepathy is used as a framework on the phone so I think it's still a thing
<qengho> exit empathy. enter tor messenger
<pitti> but yeah, the world moving back from XMPP is really sad
<seb128> yeah :-/
<seb128> pitti, Xavier submitted patched for OTR on https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16891#c46
<ubot5> Freedesktop bug 16891 in tp-spec "Telepathy should support OTR encryption" [Critical,New]
<seb128> but those didn't get merged (yet)
<pitti> I know, it's already quite old
<seb128> tjaalton, what do you mean in bug #1514908? what sort of support do you expect from a file-manager?
<ubot5> bug 1514908 in nautilus (Ubuntu) "add support for non-root X sessions" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1514908
<Laney> larsu: is https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=748498 a bug you could add to your list?
<ubot5> Gnome bug 748498 in .General "Black background appears briefly before window gets drawn" [Minor,New]
<Laney> some people are complaining about it ;-)
<tjaalton> seb128: oh man :)
<seb128> tjaalton, you meant lightdm right? ;-)
<tjaalton> yes, changed it
<seb128> thanks
<tjaalton> had a nautilus bug page open, clicked report a bug and then changed the package name, but apparently it's too late at that point
 * willcooke back
<seb128> wb willcooke
<larsu> Laney: I can have a look, but I sense this is a Company question..
<seb128> larsu, I think Laney just tried to get the ball rolling on it because I complained about it and the bugzilla seems to sit there ignored
<larsu> seb128: ok :)
<larsu> makes sense
<seb128> larsu, it might be my fault for having a laptop old and slow enough that it's quite visible
<seb128> larsu, unsure if you saw the video, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/gtk.ogv
<larsu> seb128: just testing it - I can see it as well (but very briefly)
<seb128> I wonder if it's another CSD frame extent issue
<seb128> it's not a theme one at least
<larsu> maybe a frame clock thing?
<larsu> the bug report mentions this not happening on composited wms
<larsu> could be that unity misses somethign
<didrocks> good evening everyone, see you on thursday! (tomorrow is off in France)
<larsu> didrocks: enjoy!
<didrocks> thanks larsu!
 * larsu wanted to try on gnome shell, but guest session seems to be broken
<seb128> yeah, indeed, I noticed that as wel
<seb128> you can switch to another user though
<larsu> can also relogin myself
<willcooke> dinner.  bbl
<jono> hey folks
<jono> my Unity8 session is still not starting
<jono> using the container version on 15.10
<jono> any idea how I get it working?
<qengho> jono: pastebin "dmesg |tail" ?
<jono> qengho, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/13218010/
<jono> I tried this too:
<jono> jono@forge:~$ sudo unity8-lxc-setup --rebuild-all --redownload
<jono> usage: unity8-lxc-setup [-h] [--rebuild] [--test SECONDS] [--destroy]
<jono>                         [--update-lxc]
<jono> unity8-lxc-setup: error: unrecognized arguments: --rebuild-all --redownload
<jono> which seems odd
<jono> it seems odd as dpm got it working in this pastebin: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11724558/
<davmor2> jono: try --rebuild all
<jono> davmor2,
<jono> jono@forge:~$ sudo unity8-lxc-setup --rebuild-all
<jono> usage: unity8-lxc-setup [-h] [--rebuild] [--test SECONDS] [--destroy]
<jono>                         [--update-lxc]
<jono> unity8-lxc-setup: error: unrecognized arguments: --rebuild-all
<jono> oops
<jono> unity8-lxc-setup: error: unrecognized arguments: all
<davmor2> jono: remove the all all together
<jono> so just --rebuild ?
<jono> it seems to be working now
<davmor2> jono: seems to be the thing listed
<qengho> That "usage" line says so.
<jono> it is updating it now it seems
<jono> downloading a bunch of packages
<jono> davmor2, how often is this container updated?
<davmor2> jono: it might be that you are on a different version than dpm so his might of had rebuild-all whereas your version didn't
<jono> with the most recent unity8 trunk?
<jono> ahhh
<qengho> ....or one of you is on some PPA.
<davmor2> jono: one for someone else I'm afraid I don't use it
<jono> davmor2, np
<jono> how you doing davmor2?
<davmor2> jono: Good thanks, busy as hell, How about you, you git......hub person you ;)
<jono> davmor2, good pal
<jono> just off for a week before I start :-)
<davmor2> jono: man holidays before you start, weirdo ;)
<davmor2> jono: looking forward to the excitement of the tech world again?
<jono> davmor2, indeed, I am glad to be back in the thick of things :-)
<czajkowski> jono: you're just happy to not use a mac again :)
<jono> czajkowski, yeah - well, I think I will dual boot
<jono> I like Ubuntu, but I also need some Mac things - e.g. GitHub Desktop
 * czajkowski hugs her X1
<czajkowski> jono: ah fair point I've mostly been able to get away with other tools except goto meeting, doesnt view camera but other than that :D
<jono> ok folks, I get some errors: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/13218192/
<jono> when I ran: sudo unity8-lxc-setup --rebuild
<jono> czajkowski, you use Ubuntu?
<czajkowski> jono: yes, asking me to do stuff on a mac took me a lot longer
<jono> ahhh
<czajkowski> jono: to be fair I'm the only one on my team that refused the mac :) the rest use a mac or windows.
<czajkowski> for our .net sdk workings
<jono> czajkowski, I think that is pretty normal
<willcooke> right, g'gnith
<willcooke> night
<zmaj> hello, anyone here?
<davmor2> yes
<zmaj> I am looking into building a Ubuntu based distro with i3wm, do any of you use i3wm?
<zmaj> I guess I will ask it in #ubuntu instead
<zmaj> close
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-11-11
<hikiko> hello :)
<pitti> Good morning
<hikiko> Trevinho, thanks for the review, I've fixed it: https://code.launchpad.net/~hikiko/unity/unity.fixed-tests-wwarnings/+merge/275801 could you get another look? :)
<hikiko> +good morning pitti :)
<pitti> hey hikiko!
<happyaron> morning hikiko and pitti, :)
<hikiko> morning happyaron :)
<Trevinho> Morning
<Trevinho> hikiko: sure
<willcooke> morning
<hikiko> hello willcooke
<darkxst> hey willcooke, hikiko
<hikiko> hi darkxst
<willcooke> french holiday today
<darkxst> Ive had a holiday all week with my bung leg ;(
<willcooke> :(
<willcooke> "holiday"
<darkxst> yeh, more like detention, can't really even walk
<willcooke> oh man, that sucks
<willcooke> hope you're feeling better soon
<pitti> darkxst: erk, what happened? get well soon!
<hikiko> get well soon darkxst
<darkxst> pitti, though it was a strained calf muscle but doctors decided it was a blood clot in my
<darkxst> ^my leg
<darkxst> atleast that is what the ultrasound said
<hikiko> :/
<darkxst> now waiting on like 20 blood tests, because they don't know what caused it
<pitti> darkxst: argh, thrombosis? my wife had that twice, it's rather rangerous
<Laney> morning
<hikiko> hi Laney
<darkxst> pitti, yes, dad died from it
<pitti> hey Laney, how are you?
<darkxst> pitti, though the dr's arent so concerned about the existing clot, but more, why its seemingly unprovacoted
<pitti> darkxst: yeah, it's really hard to find the cause, this is usually just guesswork; can't blame it on the pill for you either
<darkxst> pitti, I suppose I will find out from the blood tests if it was hereditary
<darkxst> Laney, larsu, any more progress on gtk?
<Laney> what kind of progress are you after?
<Laney> hey hikiko pitti darkxst!
 * Laney is going good, got coffee AND tea :)
<Laney> pitti: how are you?
<pitti> Laney: quite fine, thanks! I'm getting better and better fighting jetlag in this direction :)
<Laney> \o/
<pitti> Laney: btw, yesterday I worked a bit on better tmpfail handling
<Laney> you already had a quite effective method, I recall
<Laney> oh?
<pitti> Laney: if a worker now gets a tmpfail three times in a row, it kills itself, mails us, and the request gets back into the queue
<pitti> Laney: this will (1) avoid tests actually failing with tmpfail permanently and thus us having to rm pending.txt
<pitti> Laney: (2) automatically dial down the number of workers if we keep hitting quota issues
<pitti> and finally, (3) tell us immediately if some cloud has gone bonkers again, as the mailed log should now have reasonably sufficient information what went wrong
<pitti> Laney: i. e. the test log for the third tmpfail now goes into the worker log (as it's not on swift any more anywhere)
<pitti> Laney: i. e. over night we saw three workers die with "no machine available", so the other 5 just happily went on
<pitti> Laney: I also taught the worker to stop on SIGTERM (upstart job won't auto-restart) and restart on SIGHUP (through upstart job); I'll document that on the wiki
<darkxst> Laney, like landing? needed for gnome-session \
<Laney> darkxst: have you tried rmadison -s xenial libgtk-3-0 lately?
<Laney> pitti: Ah nice, I like the auto re-queuing
<Laney> shame the cloud is a bit wobbly still for this workload
<pitti> Laney: yeah, was a bit pointless having to manually requeue them, but it made sense in the beginning to better see what goes wrong instead of silently papering over it
<pitti> Laney: lcy01 is dead, lgw01 acted up on Monday (but sent an RT, got fixed)
<pitti> lgw01 and bos01 seem to behave, except that on bos01 I often get these "not enough available machines" thingy
<darkxst> Laney, no, Ive been incapictated most of the week ;(
<Laney> pitti: I learned about "nova absolute-limits" the other day - I wonder if we could use that to dynamically scale the number of workers
<pitti> Laney: but let's hope the worker is now robust enough to deal with this; so we now mainly need to react to workers going down, and restart them to get back to full capacity (unless the cloud is permanently broken)
<Laney> Not sure if there's a corresponding thing for available instances
<pitti> Laney: absolute-limits shows curr/max instances too
<pitti> yes, it's rather useful
<Laney> available -> cloud capacity
<Laney> not my quota
<pitti> Laney: yeah, that'd be useful
<pitti> oh, right
<Laney> both things would be good probably
<pitti> Laney: ATM the autopkgtest-worker-launch upstart job just launches 8, and I manually launch ppc64el instances 9 to 15
<pitti> using quota/absolute-limits for that would be much better indeed
<pitti> although that won't help on bos01
<pitti> while we have 25 instances, we must split them between ppc64el (max 15) and i386/amd64 (max 10)
<pitti> it doesn't show us the instances per arch
<pitti> Laney: so I guess starting $lots workers and let the right number of them auto-die on quota limit works reasonably well ATM
<Laney> true
<pitti> perhaps we could give them some "try auto-respawning after 6 hours" gimmick
<pitti> the badge of reincarnation
<Laney> the phoenix award
<pitti> "I'm not quite dead yet!" â© âª
<pitti> ok, retries for last night's flood of uninstallability failures are looking good
<darkxst> pitti, is there a branch for the autopkgtest instances somewhere? we eventually want to be able to run them against the ppa
<pitti> darkxst: we actually can run tests against a PPA now; the main issue is that someone/something needs to trigger them, and there's currently no results browser for those
 * Laney wades into the libgsl swamp again
<pitti> darkxst: all the code is public, yes; what do you mean in particular with "instance"?
<Laney> seb128: can we do some demote-to-proposed for this later maybe?
<darkxst> pitti,  the bit that runs all the tests
<seb128> Laney, sure, give me a list and I can do it
<Laney> seb128: thanks, don't have it yet but I think there will be some
<seb128> Laney, I'm having a look at libimobiledevice and glew
<Laney> more transitions?
<Laney> oh also, hi ;-)
<seb128> hey ;-)
<seb128> yes...
<darkxst> pitti, I know I can use adt-run and craft some scripts, but apparently that is already done!
<Laney> blerp
<pitti> darkxst: so what can be done today is "run test for package gnome-foo against this PPA", and results will appear in swift (publically accessible)
<pitti> darkxst: the worker and juju charms are on https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-release/+git/autopkgtest-cloud?h=master ; debci is its own repo (http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=collab-maint/debci.git), and autopkgtest is http://anonscm.debian.org/cgit/autopkgtest/autopkgtest.git
<pitti> darkxst: and docs of the whole thing are on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ProposedMigration/AutopkgtestInfrastructure
<darkxst> pitti, what
<Laney> what
<darkxst> Laney, new keyboard is retarded
<darkxst> what
<pitti> darkxst: I'm happy to point you to more specific bits if you have more specific questions
<pitti> *chuckle*
<pitti> darkxst, Laney: so for robru's CI train or more generally for PPAs we'll eventually need to install custom britney instances
<darkxst> pitti, so i just want the autopkgtests running against gnome3-staging ppa, to warn of test failures, because right now, we don't find those out until upload most of the time\
<pitti> darkxst: i. e. essentially you want/need http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html running against the PPA
<darkxst> pitti, well more or less, but definately non-blocking though
<darkxst> although actually it would be pretty sweet to have the -proposed migration on the ppa
<pitti> darkxst: it can't be blocking anyway, as PPAs don't have a concept of "-proposed" themselves; it'd be advisory
<pitti> darkxst: i. e. it would run your PPA as "unstable" and consider either devel or devel+devel-proposed as "testing"
<pitti> darkxst: depending on whether your PPA builds against devel or devel-proposed
<pitti> (there's an option for which pockets to use in the PPA config)
<darkxst> pitti, -proposed
<pitti> darkxst: right, so you'd want a britney instance which tries to land the PPA ("unstable") onto devel-proposed ("testing")
<pitti> darkxst: robru, slangasek, and I started discussing how we could make it easy to set up per-PPA britneys, as we need it for the CI tarin
<pitti> train
<pitti> darkxst: once that's done, it should be simple to create another instance for the gnome PPA
<darkxst> pitti, not ecactly more just want autopkgtests running againts the ppa
<andyrock> morning
<pitti> darkxst: right, and britney would trigger the right ones and show you the results
<pitti> darkxst: it wouldn't actually promote packages for you
<pitti> darkxst: i. e. it would work like for stable releases (e. g. http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/trusty/update_excuses.html)
<pitti> where it runs installability and autopkgtests, but not move packages
<darkxst> pitti, yes that is fine, if want packages to actually be promoted into the archives we need a seperate ppa for that
<darkxst> but then could just use the ci train, one day
<darkxst> when the ci train supports git, and we actually have packaging branches
<seb128> hey andyrock
<willcooke> hey andyrock, seb128.  Is Trevinho online yet?
<seb128> hey willcooke
<seb128> no idea
<andyrock> willcooke yup
<willcooke> sorry, that was a question for Trevinho, I shouldn't have tagged it on the hello line :)
<andyrock> it was online one hour ago
<andyrock> can you give me 5 more min?
<willcooke> sure, no hurry
<willcooke> andyrock, are you able to go a HO this morning>
<willcooke> ?
<andyrock> yup
<andyrock> at university
<andyrock> but I'll find a spot somewhere
<willcooke> sure?
<andyrock> yup :D
<willcooke> oki, then we can try and keep it short
<willcooke> hikiko, are you free for a HO in about 10 mins?
<willcooke> Trevinho, you free as well? ^
<seb128> in 10min wfm, let me make some coffee
<darkxst> pitti, eventually we will have git branches on alioth, but its taking forever
 * willcooke <--- tea
<darkxst> pitti, well I could push them now, but doesnt make a whole lot of sense until pkg-gnome team switch over
<darkxst> probably still beter than having no packaging branches though I guess
<larsu> good morning! (later today because I was at the gym)
<Trevinho> willcooke: oh yeah sorry
<Laney> larsu: gym!!!!
<Laney> I had you as a "the world is my gym" person :P
<larsu> Laney: did you? I noticed I go running less and less due to the weather. But need to move
<larsu> actually feel quite nice now
 * larsu wonders if he should become a member
<Laney> intriguing
 * larsu wonders if Laney is sarcastic
<Laney> (climb not gym) (climb not gym) (climb not gym)
<larsu> haha
<larsu> you know they call it a climbing gym as well ;)
<Laney> not here :P
<Laney> we usually call it a "climbing centre"
<larsu> of course
<Laney> but actually they often have some training equipment
<Laney> like olympic rings and stuff
<seb128> hey larsu
<larsu> morning seb128
<Laney> sometimes even their own gym
<larsu> Ã§a va?
<seb128> oui, et toi ? ;-)
<andyrock> HO link?
<willcooke> andyrock, just sent an invite
<larsu> seb128: bien, merci
<andyrock> k
<willcooke> seb128, andyrock, Trevinho - just waiting for hikiko to confirm she can make it and then we can start.  Just a few more minutes....
<Trevinho> ok
<seb128> k
<hikiko> yes
<willcooke> great
<willcooke> oki, seb128 Trevinho andyrock hikiko:  https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/canonical.com/sprint-kickoff?authuser=0
<willcooke> anyone who wants to see how our Agile sprints are going to work, feel free to join ^^^
<willcooke> oops, sorry andyrock - I dropped but I heard you speaking...
<willcooke> Trello import tool now added to:  https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/+junk/bugtools
<willcooke> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/+junk/bugtools/view/head:/import_to_trello.py
<seb128> Laney, so calligra depends on glew gsl and poppler
<seb128> transition combo validated!
<Laney> oh god!
<seb128> :-/
<Laney> but it actually built
 * Laney is in gsl hell
<seb128> should we hint britney to try those together?
<Laney> isn't it already?
<seb128> Trying easy from autohinter: boomaga/0.7.1-1build1 cups-filters/1.1.0-1 gdal/1.11.2+dfsg-3ubuntu4 ipe-tools/20150406-3build1 libreoffice/1:5.0.2-0ubuntu4 pdf2djvu/0.9.2-3build1 pdf2htmlex/0.14.6+ds-1build1 poppler/0.37.0-0ubuntu1 popplerkit.framework/0.0.20051227svn-7.1build7 texlive-bin/2015.20150524.37493-7build1 xpdf/3.03-17ubuntu3
<seb128> is the most bottom poppler mention
<Laney> you probably want the first one
<seb128> but maybe I still don't grasp that log :p
<seb128> k, I though the most bottom one was the one to look at
<Laney> i think it starts with the biggest
<seb128> k
<flexiondotorg> Laney, I'd like to reintroduce gir1.2-wnck-1.0 into libwnck because there is a new MATE component that requires it.
<flexiondotorg> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libwnck/+changelog
<flexiondotorg> Laney, Shall I just provide a debdiff for libwnck in Ubuntu?
<flexiondotorg> And file a sponsorship request?
<Laney> Is this component going to go into Debian?
<flexiondotorg> Yes.
<flexiondotorg> I have to do it in Debian also.
<Laney> You know the answer. :P
<flexiondotorg> But libwnck doesn't sync from Debian does it?
<Laney> It probably could/should do
<Laney> I guess there was just no benefit or motivation
<flexiondotorg> Benefit or motivation for what?
<Laney> syncing/merging
<flexiondotorg> OK, I'll do the work in Debian and request a sync/merge.
<Laney> Basically, get it reintroduced there and then we can merge the package
<flexiondotorg> Laney, Thanks.
<Laney> Can help you sponsor it if you need that (e.g. if sunweaver doesn't want to)
<flexiondotorg> sunweaver will upload the mate-dock-applet but isn't able to help with libwnck.
<Laney> or whoever
<qengho> howdy, y'all.
<pitti> Laney: epic worker breakage> oops, I think that was me sending in a broken package name, I'll fix that and restart
<willcooke> another theme fix:  http://imgur.com/a4dTPWw
<willcooke> in the works
<willcooke> but notice that the close icons don't have a light background when the Gedit window isn't focused anymore
<willcooke> like they do in the terminal window
<willcooke> I found the :backdrop selector after a lot of searching
<willcooke> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/tree/gtk/gtkcssselector.c?id=3.6.4#n428
<willcooke> \o/
<Laney> hey qengho
<robski> tkamppeter, I was given your name by Laney in #ubuntu-motu
<robski> You would be the person looking after the CUPS package for Ubuntu ?
<robski> hi all
<robski> anyone here who is somehow dealing with the CUPS package in Ubuntu ?
<willcooke> robski, tkamppeter is your man, looks like he's just timed out.  He'll be back
<Laney> robski: You could email him if you don't manage to get on at the same time too (till.kamppeter@gmail.com it seems to be)
<robski> thx again Laney ;-)
<willcooke> larsu, how can I start the inspector in gnome-terminal?
<willcooke> larsu, actually, ignore.  I'm going to install X on my test machine where i expect it will just work because terminal is newer
<willcooke> Can someone on X do:  In Terminal: Edit -> Preferences -> Profiles -> Highlight Unnamed -> Edit
<pitti> Highlight?
<willcooke> click on, make sure it's selected
<willcooke> it should be anyway
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> but before you do
<pitti> in which tab is this?
 * pitti tries to find it in the German translation
<willcooke> if it's the same as mine it will crash
<willcooke> I guess Edit any one will do the same
<pitti> in Colors?
<willcooke> For me Edit -> Prefs -> Edit crashes the termianl
<pitti> I have Profiles â {Unnamed, profile settings}
<pitti> unnamed is already selected, profile settings brings up a dialog which works
<Laney> This works on 3.16
<Laney> Maybe it broke in the update
<pitti> willcooke: do I need two profiles for this?
<pitti> I only have one "Unnamed" one
<willcooke> pitti, same here, only one.  But its opening the edit window which causes the crash
<pitti> ah, I have gtk 3.18, but presumably I haven't restarted my session yet today
<Laney> I mean gnome-terminal 3.18
 * Laney is upgrading to check
 * pitti tries in a guest session
<pitti> 2015-11-05 06:25:15 status installed gnome-terminal:amd64 3.18.1-1ubuntu1
<pitti> nah, that's ancient, over a week old already
<pitti> so that's not it
 * Laney isn't on it
<pitti> I thought you meant gtk
<Laney> and I am on gtk 3.18, been running that since october already :P
<pitti> eh, guest session crashes
<willcooke> same here, guest session crashes
<Laney> yeah seb128 said that
<Laney> assuming he is looking into it ... :)
 * Laney runs
<willcooke> :)
 * willcooke looks to see if there is already a bug
<pitti> there, freshly booted with xenial dist-upgraded 5 mins ago
<pitti> with gtk 3.18
<pitti> willcooke: so, I can't reproduce your terminal edit bug; in the "Profiles" menu there's a selector for the profile which is completely inert (as there's only one profile), and the "Profile settings"
<larsu> willcooke: you can also always start an app with GTK_DEBUG=interactive set, which pops up the inspector immediately
 * Laney feeds dpkg some hamsters
<larsu> willcooke: (sorry for the long time to reply, had no net)
<Laney> larsu: not for gnome-terminal
<willcooke> erk, now my terminal menu has vanished :)
<larsu> Laney: not even for gnome-terminal-server
<larsu> ?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> yes I mean I assume that works
<willcooke> larsu, yeah I tried that, as laney said didn't work
<Laney> but the instruction to just start an app is misleading in this case
<larsu> indeed
<larsu> can't even start it from the preferences window
<Laney> [1]    25554 segmentation fault (core dumped)  /usr/lib/gnome-terminal/gnome-terminal-server --app-id=com.foo
<larsu> is g-t doing something speciual again???
<Laney> ROBERT UNDERSCORE ANCELLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
<larsu> what crashes?
<willcooke> http://www.imgur.com/42lXbWH
<willcooke> If I click Edit there it crashes terminal
<Laney> I'll look
<pitti> wow, how do you get there
<Laney> this definitely broke in the 3.18 update
<willcooke> Shall I open a bug?
<Laney> no
<pitti> great, now I have two "unnamed" profiles
<pitti> how do I get the profile editor?
<Laney> Edit -> Preferences -> Profiles
<pitti> oh, in the menu
<pitti> thanks
<pitti> yep, got it
 * pitti waves good evening
<willcooke> o/
<willcooke> larsu, those theme changes are nasty on X
<willcooke> fixing....
<robski> hi tkamppeter, I did sent you an email regarding CUPS package , could you pls have a glimpse ?
<Laney> gnome-terminal is uploaded
<larsu> I think we do have found a new maintainer for the theme :D
<willcooke> it's making me sad now
<willcooke> :)
<larsu> haha
<willcooke> I guess I'll get faster as I learn more, but right now it's taking me a looooong time to find the right selectors
<willcooke> Presumably I only need to make sure it works on 16.04 right?  Like, if it breaks 15.10 then we just don't include it there?
<tkamppeter> robski, found it, will have a look.
<robski> thx
<Laney> seb128: I think this is the list of stuff to remove/demote http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/13228592/
<Laney> some of the things are in xenial-proposed already and FTBFS... I guess in that case just remove from xenial release?
<Laney> that's packages which ftbfs and reverse-depends src:pkg ; reverse-depends -b src:pkg
<Laney> but please do check I didn't mess it up
<seb128> Laney, k, going to have a look tomorrow morning
<Laney> thanks!
<seb128> yw!
<Laney> going to get this one done
<Laney> if it kills me >:|
<czajkowski> Laney: awww we don't want that to ever happen
<Laney> I was imagining a scene in 70 years time (!!!)
<Laney> me on my death bed
<Laney> phone goes off
<Laney> [ubuntu/85.04] gsl 2.0+dfsg-1ubuntu1 (Accepted)
 * Laney dies happy
<czajkowski> Laney: we need to work on your death bed scene!
<czajkowski> if that;s the final think you think of you need to ge tout more
<Laney> Make sure you get my number of uploads engraved on my headstone
<czajkowski> am sure many of you are going to FOSDEM, just a reminder a lot of the CFPs close this month
<Laney> Here lies Laney, core-dev, DD, <tiny> father, husband </tiny>
<czajkowski> Laney: lost for words!
<Laney> oh and include my GPG key on a USB stick
<Laney> need to upload from the next world
<czajkowski> Laney: burried with laptop bike and usb stick, sorted
<Laney> :)
<ogra_> heh
 * ogra_ would have expected Laney to be the type of guy who puts "HTTP: 410" on his headstone
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> ARGH!!!!!!  Gtk's css is driving me up the wall.  CSS which works in the inspector then stops working when loaded from the theme
<Laney> :D
<willcooke> It must be some specificity thing
 * Laney has dodged it so far, mostly
<willcooke> gedit on X crashes quite a lot when I poke at it with the inspector as well which isn't helping
<willcooke> hey ho, it's all good fun
 * Laney is off now, ttyl
<willcooke> cya Laney
<Laney> have fun willcooke
<willcooke> Laney, fixed!!!!!!!!!!!!one six
<willcooke> son of a....
<willcooke> *now* I've fixed i
<willcooke> t
<willcooke>  /* XXX temporary */  <--- who was this?!??!
<willcooke> desrt, attente - are you guys off today as well?
<attente> i'm here
<willcooke> Isn't it a public holiday for you too?
<attente> i don't believe so
<willcooke> kk
<desrt> no holiday for me
<desrt> (afaik)
<willcooke> ah,  I see now.. except ON - which is what you guys are right?
<desrt> there was some talk of it last year around this time, i think
<attente> yes
<desrt> some provinces have it, but it's not a federal thing
<willcooke> That seems awfully unfair
<desrt> it's actually OK with me
<attente> i think it evens out in the end
<desrt> all of the green-team ingress players who work at the government buildings around here have the day off
<willcooke> XD
<desrt> so the neighbourhood is nice and blue for a change
<attente> except they're out in the rest of the city changing other things green
<desrt> not my concern :)
<desrt> during the normal 9-5 weekdays, i swear these people never actually work
<willcooke> Ingress hasn't really caught my attention.  I think because I live in the sticks there is no action around me
<desrt> ya.  it's tough if there is nothing to do
<desrt> but i have the opposite problem
<desrt> i live in a constant war zone.  it sucks.
<willcooke> Do you guys have any ideas as to why the CSS I put in the inspector works fine but when I load it from the theme is doesnt work at all
<willcooke> ?
<desrt> precedence?
<willcooke> So I should try and load it as late as possible?
<desrt> the inspector has very high precedence
<willcooke> Can I help that with being more selective in my selectors?
<attente> does the theme need to be re-compiled?
<desrt> are you doing it via a custom-loaded .css file or the theme, proper?
 * desrt isn't super-familiar with css rules on this stuff
<willcooke> I'm copying it in to the theme's gedit.css file and then reloading gedit
<desrt> gedit.css is a resource, right?
<willcooke> yeah, it gets included
<willcooke> lemme see where
<willcooke> gtk-main.css imports it
<desrt> gtk-main.css imports gedit.css?
<willcooke> I could try and move gedit to the end, see if that helps...
 * desrt raises eyebrow
<willcooke> ya
<willcooke> line 61
<willcooke> /usr/share/themes/Ambiance/gtk-3.0/gtk-main.css
 * desrt feels ill
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> hold on
<willcooke> oh, no ignore
<willcooke> \o/
<willcooke> I had to use a very long selector but now it works
<willcooke> Alright - I am fairly victorious
<willcooke> but now I'm not happy with the colour scheme
<TheMuso> Oh hey willcooke. :)
<willcooke> hey TheMuso!
<willcooke> I'm learnding
<willcooke> I'm going to call it a day now and carry on playing in the morning
<willcooke> ta ta
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-11-12
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, tu as te levÃ© tÃ´t ! Ã§a va ?
<didrocks> pitti: bonjour ! Ã§a va bien ! (oui, je me lÃ¨ve de plus en plus tÃ´t j'ai l'impressionâ¦) et toi ?
<andyrock> morning all
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> hey andyrock, hello seb128 :)
<didrocks> finally the channel starts to be active :p
 * didrocks felt alone
<pitti> didrocks: je vais bien aussi, mais j'ai me couchÃ© Ã  1:30
<pitti> aprÃ¨s basketball, donc c'est normal :)
<pitti> j'ai regardÃ© deux videos de systemd.conf
<pitti> bonjour seb128!
<pitti> hey andyrock
<didrocks> pitti: je n'en n'ai regardÃ© qu'une :)
<didrocks> pitti: ah d'accord, donc aprÃ¨s s'Ãªtre couchÃ© Ã  1h, bon score! :)
<pitti> didrocks: that means "I watched only one", right?
<pitti> or "I didn't watch even one"?
 * pitti ne connais pas le double "ne"
<didrocks> pitti: "only one", yeah
<seb128> hey andyrock didrocks pitti
<pitti> i. e. "n'en n'ai"
<TheMuso> Hey desktoppers. :)
<didrocks> pitti: you can say as well (maybe more commonly): "j'en ai regardÃ© qu'une"
<pitti> didrocks: ah, c'est que je sais, merci :)
 * seb128 just spent half an hour figuring out why its boot is taking ages for a week
 * seb128 grrrr at systemd
<pitti> qu'est-ce qu'est cassÃ© ?
<seb128> ma partition swap a changÃ© et le fstab est faux
<seb128> mais systemd de dit rien
<seb128> j'ai juste le logo plymouth avec les points qui bougent pendant 1 minute
<seb128> trÃ¨s frustrant
<seb128> pas d'erreur, pas de message, rien, Ã§a bloque et d'un coup Ã§a dÃ©marre
<pitti> seb128: ah, you have some failed swap unit in systemctl --failed?
<seb128> I guess I would have, I used the debug-shell to list-job, saw the swap job was the only running, figured out it was the issue and coimmented the line from fstab
<pitti> hm, you get a rescue shell for broken / or /home or so; not sure whether you are supposed to get a rescue shell for broken swap too (or whether that's preferable to just continue booting wihtout swap)
<seb128> now the system boots normally again
<seb128> booting without swap is fine
<seb128> the 1 minute delay is not
<seb128> what is it waiting for? it's an internal partition that doesn't exist anymore
<seb128> error out or keep going
<pitti> on systems where you actually do want swap it wouldn't be "fine", it would just silently ignore an error
<seb128> no cookie for you systemd
<pitti> maybe the right thing would be to put these "waiting for these units" warnings to plymouth
<didrocks> IMHO, the issue is not the waiting, but more on the "no error message/telling I'm waiting on this"
<seb128> that would be nice
<pitti> you see those on a VT, but not without ply
<seb128> not even in a vt
<seb128> I had to debug-shell and list-jobs
<didrocks> pitti: if communicating with plymouth was something that would interest upstream (hem :p)
<pitti> ah yes, quiet eats that as well
<pitti> that sounds like somethign to fix for 16.04, this is ugly
<Trevinho> Morning!
<didrocks> morning Trevinho
<Trevinho> Trevinho: hey!
<Trevinho> didrocks: hey
<Trevinho> Ouch ð
<didrocks> speaking to yourself? :)
<seb128> hey Trevinho
<seb128> pitti, what would be the proper fix? proxying the "wait for disk UUID=...." on plymouth?
<Trevinho> seb128: Hola!
<Trevinho> didrocks: yeah, it happens sometime :-D
<pitti> seb128: showing a blocking unit in plymouth and with quiet sounds helpful
<pitti> seb128: also, do you know what broke your swap?
<seb128> +1
<seb128> me
<seb128> I needed a partition to try something in gnome-disks
<seb128> I used the swap so I unswapped it and created a swap back later on
<seb128> but the UUID changed I guess
<pitti> yes, every mkswap will change it; ok, so that's at least clear
<TheMuso> Morning willcooke.
<willcooke> morning TheMuso just off to do the school run, bbiab
<TheMuso> np
<Laney> hey!
 * pitti does a jump to the left -- it's a Laney!
<pitti> Good morning!
<Laney> hey pitti!
<larsu> bonjour
<pitti> larsu: Moin moin!
<larsu> hi pitti!
<didrocks> hey hey hey LaLaney! :)
<didrocks> morning larsu
<larsu> hey didrocks! Had a good day off?
<Laney> hey didrocks
<Laney> nice sauna/spa day?
 * Laney knows how french people spend their free time
 * Laney is going to get kicked off this network in 3 minutes
<Laney> come on greylisting
<didrocks> larsu: Laney: yeah, it was a nice day. Stayed at home mostly, but did some nice cooking :)
<Laney> did it involve cheese and/or cream?
<Laney> if not: try harder please
<Laney> :)
<didrocks> neither of those!
<didrocks> but meat and lentils
<Laney>  A sign reading "Don't touch the water" can be seen near the river
<Laney> oops!
<Laney> middle click paste...
<seb128> oh, a Laney
<Laney> hey seb128
<seb128> hey Laney ;-)
<Laney> unmute the telegram :P
<Laney> what's up?
<seb128> haha
<seb128> oh, larsu is alive as well
<seb128> good :-)
<seb128> I missed out with this muted on
<Laney> oh FFS
<Laney> the gnome-terminal reverted my upload from last nighth
<Laney> did I forget to push? but even so...
<seb128> rooooobbbb
<Laney> :|
<Laney> and that one was also because one of the previous uploads had reverted my change
 * Laney take three
<larsu> hi seb128 :)
<larsu> did some errands this morning
<seb128> hey larsu
<Laney> seb128: seems slangasek processed some of the removals for gsl last night
<Laney> can you look at the remaining packages http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/html/gsl.html ?
<seb128> Laney, yeah, I was just about to look at that
<Laney> i.e. forget my list now, it's out of date
<seb128> k
<Laney> not sure why he didn't do all of them
<Laney> maybe they are ones with rdeps or something?
<Laney> but let's just kill those too IMHO
<Laney> if you give me the list I can block them in proposed
<seb128> block them? you mean?
<seb128> I though we just wanted to demote-to-proposed them?
<Laney> demoted things can go straight back in
<Laney> if they have old binaries which work in release
<Laney> you should check if I already uploaded these and they FTBFS in proposed
<seb128> they wouldn't if they fail to build no?
<Laney> in which case just remove from release IMHO
<seb128> makes sense
<Laney> only if it's a rebuild, demote copies the old successful binaries
 * Laney really bzr pushes g-t this time
<willcooke> didrocks, can we do anything with Fritzing without MD5, "latest" link and HTTPS?
<willcooke> also:  who knows the most about Ubiquity here?  tvoss is having a problem with resizing partitions and it seems to have hung.  How can he find out what;s going on?  Where are the good logs?
<Laney> #ubuntu-installer
<Laney> & /var/log/ubiquity or /var/lib/ubiquity?
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<seb128> Laney, "asymptote" has a --disable-gsl, might be a better option than removing it?
<Laney> dunno
<jibel> willcooke, there was a bug in wily, the "resize" widget sometimes doesn't receive the focus
<Laney> if you want to try that go ahead
<Laney> otherwise we get the fix via sync
<seb128> k
<seb128> shruug
<seb128> calendar reminder, apparently I've a meeting in 10 minutes
<jibel> willcooke, if it's a bug with the UI
<jibel> otherwise there were others with partman itself in some configurations
<jibel> willcooke, bug 1447600
<ubot5> bug 1361951 in partman-ext3 (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1447600 Ubiquity freezes while reformatting occupied partition" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1361951
<jibel> should be highre than medium
<seb128> seems like a good one to fix for the LTS
<pitti> seb128: btw, I see that flickering on new windows too, like the window first appears black for a split second and then is drawn
<seb128> pitti, ah, I'm not alone or crazy yet!
<seb128> pitti, thanks for confirming
<Laney> larsu already started asking about it
<pitti> and, what happened with gedit
<Laney> seems he knows what is likeliy to be the fix
<Laney> HAHA
<Laney> yesssssssssss
<pitti> I mean, it's not actaully bad, but it's so different from everything else
<seb128> pitti, welcome to new GNOME style
<seb128> we are giving in a try to see how it fits/works
<Laney> I like it apart from the double controls
<Laney> oh and linked buttons are themed badly
<Laney> probably fixable though
<Trevinho> willcooke: I'll be in meeting in 1 min
<pitti> linked buttons?
<Laney> also, is it me or does escape not close file choosers any more?
<seb128> I opened bug #1513856 about that
<ubot5> bug 1513856 in gedit (Ubuntu) "[3.18] 'save changes' dialog button style is wrong" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1513856
<Laney> did it before or am I going crazy?
<pitti> Laney: works here
<Laney> pitti: try in gedit -> save as
<pitti> and yes, esc not closing dialogs â really bad things happen!
<seb128> pitti, try to close gedit with unsaved work
<seb128> the dialog has buttons concatenated in a row together
<seb128> doesn't look good
<pitti> seb128: eww, yes
<pitti> Laney: oh -- esc doesn't work right away, but after clicking into the file tree it does
<pitti> it does not work in the name input line
 * Laney nods
<pitti> but in the left bookmark bar or the tree selector
<pitti> so, thanks guys! *finally* I have the feeling I'm on an 31337 unstable developer series!
<pitti> this got way too boring
<pitti> seb128: and you can use your old saying again at last!
<pitti> come on, say it
<seb128> lol
<seb128> nothing to say, people are going to say I'm old and grumpy :p
<seb128> (but boring is good!)
<pitti> seb128: pleeeease, for old time's sake! :-)
<seb128> iz gtk bog!
<pitti> \o/
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti back
<seb128> is somebody seeing bug #1515461?
<ubot5> bug 1515461 in gedit (Ubuntu) "Open menu dropdown is 'compressed' & unintelligible " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1515461
<pitti> Ã§a marche bien ici
<pitti> oh no, confirmed
<pitti> iz gtk bug!
<seb128> yeah, I think so
<seb128> I'm still on 3.16 and doesn't see it
<seb128> might be a 3.18 regression
<seb128> Laney ^
<pitti> could it be that a lot of this (button space, compression, etc.) is because our theme didn't get updated to 3.18 yet?
<seb128> my workflow might be not standard but the open button behaviour really annoys
<seb128> +me
<pitti> I can't imagine that this happens with Adwaita
<seb128> I never open old documents, but I almost always open things from the same dir
<seb128> I don't think it's a theme 3.18 update
<seb128> at least the linked button is not
<Laney> it doesn't happen with adwaita
<seb128> it's just new app style
 * Laney assigns to theme maintainer :)
<seb128> shall name write his name!
<seb128> Mr W* C*
<Laney> nah, not that one :P
<seb128> name->not
<Laney> larsu: assigned you a couple of bugs if you can look in the medium term
<Laney> just pinging incase you miss the mail ;)
<Laney> or delegate to your co maintainer of course
<seb128> we we like linked buttons now?
<seb128> I though we patched them out of GTK previous cycle
<Laney> we patched more things out before
<Laney> like headerbars...
<Laney> if we like gnome we should try it imho
<seb128> yeah, let's see
<seb128> I'm having an hard time to get used to the new gedit, it doesn't fit well with the rest for me atm
<Laney> the adwaita ones look nice
<seb128> it looks better indeed
<larsu> Laney: "thanks"
<Laney> :)
<larsu> ;)
<Laney> keeping you in green tea
 * larsu gets more
<seb128> poor larsu
<Laney> swap for gsl/poppler/glew/ocaml transition?
<Laney> actually don't, I like it
<Laney> slangasek has been wielding the delete hammer hard
<seb128> larsu, how did you priority sort your todo between geolocation new_nautilus_menus and bugs?
<larsu> seb128: whenever someone pings me they have prio
<larsu> which might not be the best idea...
<seb128> yeah, you need to put them in a queue and reorder the queue as you see fit :-)
<Laney> stupid laptop
<Laney> need to us fn to access the function keys
<Laney> but for print screen fn is the wireless kill switch instead
<Laney> even though it's written in the same place as Fn
<larsu> haha
<Laney> this network blocks the git protocol
<Laney> annoying
<larsu> git can do http
<larsu> but you know this...
<Laney> haha
<Laney> thanks!
 * Laney populates https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=gtk318
* Laney changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks
<Laney> larsu: should that frame clock one go to compiz after your chats yesterday?
<Laney> ...is that going to be hard to fix?
<larsu> hahahahaa
<larsu> yes.
<Laney> ._.
<larsu> I don't even think we can work around this tbh
<Laney> better get it agiled into someone's plans then
<larsu> agile is a verb now?
<larsu> I wonder why we're only seeing this now though
<larsu> maybe we need someone to ...
<Laney> everything can be verbed
<larsu> *puts on sunglasses*
<larsu> ... bisect
<seb128> hum, do we have anyone in the team good at that?!
 * seb128 looks around
<Laney> might need to hire someone
 * larsu helps seb128 looking around
 * larsu looks 7000km west
<Laney> because I don't know anyone with that kind of skill
<larsu> a bit south
<Laney> nuh uh
<larsu> maybe we should go through all members of this team alphabetically and ask if they could do it?
<seb128> yeah; let's start with a ... attente? ;-)
<seb128> Laney, ruby-gsl had a leftover amd64 binary in xenial-proposed, just deleted that
<seb128> should make http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/html/gsl.html clean
<Laney> nice, thanks
<seb128> yw
<Laney> finding some more random transitions in there now
<Laney> ode, dcmtk
<seb128> is glew ready?
<seb128> seems slangasek has been picking it up after I start yesterdy
<Laney> dunno
<Laney> just going through the list in turn
<Laney> seb128: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=804728 <- drop soya + rdeps completely?
<ubot5> Debian bug 804728 in src:soya "FTBFS: libode-sp-dev has been dropped" [Serious,Open]
<Laney> * balazar3-3d                   (for python-soya)
<Laney> * balazarbrothers               (for python-soya)
<seb128> Laney, but it built yesterday https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/soya/0.15~rc1-10build2 ?
<seb128> or what's the issue?
<Laney> not against the right thing
<Laney> see the first comment in that bug
<seb128> but build log says it picked glew1.3
<seb128> or are you looking at another transition?
<seb128> oh
<seb128> you look at "ode"
<Laney> I'm looking at all of them that are in this block
<Laney> but yeah, in this case it is ode
<seb128> done
<seb128> balazar3-3d doesn't exist though
<seb128> oh, it's balazar3
<seb128> ignore that
<Laney> there's also a recommends from some metapackage
<Laney> will fix that
 * willcooke finally gets caught up on scroll back
<willcooke> themes!
<willcooke> I'm fixing (IMO) the Gedit theme atm
<willcooke> It's funny, I have something that I think looks nice on the laptop screen
<willcooke> and then when I connect to an external screen and make the windows fill the screen I don't like it anymore
<willcooke> I'd like to make the header bars shorter(?   less vertical height)
<willcooke> and the header bar buttons could do with a bit more contrast
<willcooke> and then there's the text in the open dialogue which is all screwy
<willcooke> it's never ending :)
<willcooke> Once all of that is "ok" then I will go and speak to Design about header bars
<willcooke> but for now... lunch
<willcooke> oh, one more thing
<willcooke> </columbo>
<willcooke> cyphermox, is this bug on your list for 16.04?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/partman-ext3/+bug/1361951
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1361951 in partman-ext3 (Ubuntu) "Ubiquity freezes while reformatting occupied partition" [Medium,Triaged]
<willcooke> hit and run.  Now lunch.....
<didrocks> willcooke: it's hard to maintain a robust product, if Fritzing people are intested into shipping for us, they should make our life (and so, their experience) better
<didrocks> willcooke: also, I feel really uncomfortable downloading executable code without having any way to check that the code is legit from upstream
<didrocks> willcooke: any reason they can't do it?
<davmor2> willcooke: you on xenial? do you have dual monitors?
<davmor2> Laney, seb128: Either of you too on a dual monitor xenial setup? I'd like a confirm on a issue
<seb128> davmor2, I do
<seb128> shrug, am I the only one having unity eating cpu after user switch/unlock?
<seb128> on xenial
<davmor2> seb128: awesome, could you set one monitor below the other in Screen display, then on the lower monitor open an app full screen and put the mouse on it is it the resize up icon rather than the the normal pointer
<seb128> davmor2, it's not but I didn't restart my session for a while so might not be using the current unity, going to restart in a bit
<davmor2> seb128: it may actually be more specific to hexchat I'm trying other apps though
<attente> lol. you guys...
<Laney> oh hi attente!
<attente> hey hey
<Laney> what's up?
<desrt> good morning
<desrt> what did i miss?
<seb128> hey .ca desktopers ;-)
<desrt> desktop.ca
<willcooke> o/
<attente> good morning
<qengho> good morning
<larsu> hi qengho and attente!
<larsu> and desrt :)
<didrocks> hey desrt
<desrt> good morning, all
<cyphermox> willcooke: it's on my radar for every release, the difference is just that now we're more likely to actually fix it and understand why it's fixed
<willcooke> cyphermox, ack.  thx
<qengho> seb128: I have never merged packages from Debian before, but I'm happy to help. What should I do to get xdg-utils merged? Is there launchpad machinery, or is it downloading and uploading?
<seb128> qengho, you can find some details on https://merges.ubuntu.com/x/xdg-utils/REPORT
<qengho> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging  This seems useful.
<qengho> seb128: thanks.
<seb128> qengho, but it's basically "take the current Debian version, review the Ubuntu delta and re-apply what is needed on top of Debian"
<qengho> Ah.
<seb128> qengho, https://merges.ubuntu.com/x/xdg-utils/
<seb128> shrug, guest session fails on xenial here
<seb128> but if I edit /usr/sbin/guest-account to change from -e to -x and get debug info, it works :/
<larsu> seb128: -e means "stop on error"
<seb128> doh, I wanted to add x
<seb128> larsu, thanks ;-)
<larsu> ;)
<seb128> there are all sort of fails with guest session/user switch/unity
<seb128> - guest session fails to start
<seb128> - it bounces me back to unity-greeter which fails to display my custom user bg
<seb128> - login back to the session shows the unlocked session, then lock fade in then unlock
<seb128> - then compiz uses 100% cpu with a thread in pam code
 * seb128 shrugs
<seb128> andyrock, did you get anywhere with the session not being locked when it should? (e.g screen showing unlocked for a second after suspend/resume)
<seb128> also I can't believe nobody else is having the cpu use/pam issue
<seb128> ok, at least I figured out the issue with guest session
<seb128> I'm going for a footing since it's still sunny and nice out there
<seb128> be back in ~1h
<willcooke> larsu, how fond of the gradients between tabs in GtkNotebook are you?  With the new darker/lighter tabs the gradient looks meh, and I think a solid line is more effective
<willcooke> cyphermox, fixed already!?  Thanks!
<cyphermox> willcooke: yeah, it was already fairly obvious what was needed, I just wanted to better understand exactly why
<willcooke> cool
<cyphermox> I think we've reached that now
<willcooke> well thanks for turning it around so quickly
<Laney> tall chairs without a cross bar to rest your feet on need to be banned
<Laney> in the meantime, /me burns this cafe down
<Laney> (GCHQ: that was a JOKE)
<willcooke> :D
<cyphermox> you caught me early, before I got to start on other things ;)
<willcooke> Laney, simply carry a step with you
 * willcooke makes a note to bother cyphermox in the mornings
<Laney> I kicked off and now the owner is crouching on the floor in front of me
<Laney> the customer is always right
<willcooke> damn straight
<Laney> actually the chair next to me appears to have one
 * Laney swaps
<desrt> first. world. problem.
<Laney> ahhhhhhhhhh
 * willcooke wonders if the new cafe down the road has wifi
<qengho> Laney: I heard you wanted to ASSASINATE THE PRESIDENT of Ikea.
<desrt> i have to assume that nsa/gchq/etc. have developed pretty good troll filters by now
<qengho> Maybe. Add "LOL" to escape Bayes flagging.
<willcooke> imgur.com/sd6iYay
<willcooke> http://imgur.com/sd6iYay
<willcooke> err
<willcooke> http://imgur.com/sd6iYAy
<willcooke> there we go
<willcooke> what do you think folks?
<willcooke> the mouse would be over the close button on the middle tab
<willcooke> that's a solid border instead of the gradient
<andyrock> seb128: sorry missed the ping (irccloud :()
<andyrock> nope, i can't actually reproduce it
<andyrock> i created a ppa for pat
<andyrock> with a possible fix but the problem is still there
<andyrock> at this point I'm not sure the problem is in unity
<larsu> willcooke: not at all - but that's more of a design question
<larsu> I mean, for design
<Laney> Mirv / mitya57: can you help me with https://launchpadlibrarian.net/225697670/buildlog_ubuntu-xenial-amd64.phonon-backend-vlc_0.8.2-1ubuntu2_BUILDING.txt.gz please?
<willcooke> larsu, I *am* design now ;)
<larsu> ooooh
<larsu> well then, go ahead please
 * willcooke gets his crayons out
<willcooke> oooh, Red Arrows just went over my house
 * ogra_ checks on google maps
<ogra_> lies !
<Laney> willcooke: I don't reaally rate the small gap at the top of the tabs :(
<Laney> man, this wifi
<willcooke> Laney, ack.  I think it's always been there, but because of the colour of the tabs it wasn't noticeable.  But yeah, looks off
<Laney> willcooke: maybe so
<davmor2> willcooke: much as I love all the things that Laney complains about (high chairs all round) I have to admit the little gap is weird
<Laney> willcooke: GTK_THEME=Adwaita gedit to see how gnome has it btw
<willcooke> thx
<Laney> oh you can change that from the inspector too, I forgot
 * didrocks waves good evening and good night!
<willcooke> cya didrocks
<didrocks> atom is building and working from trusty to wily, nice way to EOD :)
<didrocks> see you willcooke
<Laney> bye didrocks!
<didrocks> bye Laney!
 * Laney got in in time!!!
<willcooke> \o/
<Laney> today is a good day
<pitti> Laney: won the didrace for once!
<seb128> back
<seb128> that sunny weather is quite nice for exercice ;-)
<seb128> start being night now though
<Laney> hope you footed well
<seb128> I did ;-)
<seb128> ok, quick shower and I'm back to get some work done
<seb128> (how are the transitions going?)
<Laney>  * amd64: phonon-backend-vlc, phonon-backend-vlc-dbg, phonon4qt5-backend-vlc, phonon4qt5-backend-vlc-dbg, python-pyepl, python-soya, python-soya-dbg
<Laney> I tried pinging about phonon but nobody stepped up yet
<Laney> some more stuff on other arches
 * Laney looks
<Laney> seb128: can we demote insighttoolkit4 elastix ginkgocadx itksnap plastimatch?
<Laney> insighttoolkit4 is a 3 day build on amd64...
<seb128> k
 * desrt watches Laney use seb128 as a commandline tool
<seb128> you checked if they have rdepends?
<Laney> those are the rdeps
<seb128> I mean they don't have anything depending on them?
<Laney> nah just a recommends from some package that won't block anything
<seb128> what I mean, is should I check that or did you
<seb128> k
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> the last 4 are rdeps of the first one
<Laney> did you do the soya stuff?
<Laney> we can DO THIS! COME ON!
 * Laney self motivates
<seb128> balazar3-3d and balazarbrothers ?
<seb128> I did
<seb128> +soya itself
<Laney> when?
<Laney> ah I seee it
 * willcooke . . o O ( Balazar Brother = Lion tamers)
<Laney> seb128: I think python-soya too
<Laney> or pysoya or whatever it is
<seb128> when you pinged
<seb128> so like 5 hours ago
<Laney> hmm
<seb128> for what transitions are the ones you just gave?
<Laney> what's britney playing at?
<seb128> needed for the demote message ;-
<seb128> ;-)
<Laney> libdcmtk
<Laney> I could probably fix it but the build is too long
<seb128> k
<seb128> we can bring those back
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> Laney, new demotion round done
<Laney> ty!
<seb128> yw!
<mitya57> Laney, let me look
<Laney> mitya57: ok, slangasek just pinged Mirv in #ubuntu-devel about this too FYI
<Laney> so maybe he's also looking
<Laney> thanks
<Laney> I tried turning the flag off from PhononInternal.cmake but that didn't work
<Laney> can't tell where this is coming from
<Laney> seb128: think there are ginkgocadx binaries on arm64 ppc64el still
<Laney>  ginkgocadx | 3.7.1.1573.41+dfsg-3 | xenial-proposed/universe | arm64, ppc64el
<Laney> for the old version
<seb128> hum
<Laney> delete them? :)
 * Laney pew pew pew
<seb128> I don't understand what's going on
<seb128> Rejected:
<seb128> ginkgocadx 3.7.1.1573.41+dfsg-2 in xenial (version older than the ginkgocadx 3.7.1.1573.41+dfsg-4 in xenial published in xenial)
<seb128> the demote-to-proposed failed
<seb128> it tried to upload an old version
 * seb128 doesn't understand
<Laney> hmm maybe this isn't the problem actually
<Laney> perhaps it just needs to catch up
<Laney> oh yeah it's gone away now
<seb128> 32271 seb128    20   0  381440 163640  47796 S 296,6  4,1 194:45.73 compiz
<seb128> come on compiz
<seb128> or unity
 * Laney wibbles
<Laney> guess I don't get to see this go through today :P
<seb128> be careful, slangasek might steal the last bit of the puzzle and put in place while you sleep
<Laney> it's going to be mitya57
<Laney> just that phonon thing
<seb128> good :-)
 * Laney gives you a different and better present
<Laney> righty ho, ttyl!
<Laney> seb128: you should swoop in and steal it
<seb128> lol
<seb128> nice try but no thanks ;-)
 * seb128 tries to clean some red lines from version
<Laney> restart the vino work? ;-)
<Laney> byeeeeeeeeEEEEEeeee
<seb128> haha
<seb128> Laney, have a nice evening!
<seb128> climbing tonight?
<seb128> ah, Laney just missed gtk -3 from debian with a regression fix from .3 having an api change for bindings
<willcooke> g'night
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-11-13
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Morning pitti. :)
<pitti> hey TheMuso!
<pitti> Laney: FYI, I sent an RT for bos01 which burst into flames
<hikiko>  hello
<didrocks> good morning
<hikiko> Good morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey hikiko, how are you?
<darkxst> hey pitti, didrocks hikiko
<didrocks> good evening darkxst
<darkxst> didrocks, not really, spent the afternoon fighting with gdm3, but it is done now ;)
<darkxst> the migration stuff was a pita, but should work
<didrocks> darkxst: I guess you will be happy once this is really built and tested on a wider scale :)
<darkxst> didrocks, well I would be more happy if I could find a graceful way to upgrade gdm daemon without breaking the lock screen, but that seems to be a general issue, not related to the merge
<hikiko> hey pitti darkxst
<didrocks> did I missed pitti? I didn't see him saying hi here :p
<didrocks> ah, it was before I joined :)
<didrocks> darkxst: how are you breaking the lock screen?
<darkxst> didrocks, pitti is always up early!
<pitti> hey hikiko and darkxst!
<pitti> Ã§a va didrocks !
<didrocks> yeah, 6:30 is already early
<darkxst> didrocks, the auth channel between gdm and gnome-shell is quite fragile
<didrocks> I don't want to get up at 5:30 just to beat him :)
<darkxst> I suspect that is part of the reason fedora forces updates to delay until reboot
<didrocks> pitti: Ã§a va, et toi ? :)
<pitti> oui, je ne pouvais plus dormir, j'ai me lÃ©ve Ã  4:30 Ã  nouveau :(
<pitti> didrocks: je vais bien, merci !
<didrocks> pitti: argh :/
<didrocks> darkxst: ah, you meant, breaking for the session until reboot?
<didrocks> darkxst: or then, for each gdm update?
<darkxst> didrocks, after a gdm update, you can't unlock it
<darkxst> and yea just until reboot
<didrocks> argh, but for each update?
<didrocks> that's quite ackward, indeed
<darkxst> didrocks, I don't know if it happens on 100% of updates, but its been happening atleast sometimes for a while now
<darkxst> and sometimes its gnome-shell loosing the auth channel, which is recoverable, but not by a normal user
<didrocks> pitti: waow, I didn't know that python gettext was assuming ascii for encoding
<pitti> didrocks: ?
<pitti> didrocks: neither did I, and it certainly shoudln't?
<pitti> >>> gettext.gettext('Ã§a va â¥')
<pitti> 'Ã§a va â¥'
<didrocks> https://docs.python.org/3/library/gettext.html
<didrocks> "If the charset encoding is specified, then all message ids and message strings read from the catalog are converted to Unicode using this encoding, else ASCII encoding is assumed.
<pitti> or do you mean for matching strings in .mo files?
<didrocks> "
<didrocks> pitti: I have some _("") returning in a language that returns me some UnicodeEncodeError
<didrocks> the typical *** UnicodeEncodeError: 'ascii' codec can't encode character '\xe3' in position 5: ordinal not in range(128)
<pitti> uh, so this would be lgettext() then or bind_textdomain_codeset()?
<pitti> why on earth doesn't that default to $LC_CTYPE
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, seems that's what I need, I would like to understand exactly what's going on before adding it though
<didrocks> (I just bind_textdomain for now)
<pitti> do you have a small reproducer for this?
<pitti> $ python3 -c 'import gettext, locale; print(locale.setlocale(locale.LC_ALL, "")); gettext.textdomain("gtk30"); print(gettext.gettext("Add a class"))'
<pitti> de_DE.UTF-8
<pitti> Eine Klasse hinzufÃ¼gen
<didrocks> pitti: no, wellâ¦ I can reproduce it in one command in Ubuntu Make
<didrocks> but yeah, I should do something wrong I guessâ¦
<pitti> if I run this under LC_CTYPE=C it indeed fails with UnicodeEncodeError, but that's to be expected
<didrocks> yeah
<pitti> with LC_CTYPE=C.UTF-8 it works
<didrocks> can be as well the .mo file which is wrong for that lang
<didrocks> "Eu nÃ£o aceito" is what it doesn't like in PT_br
<pitti> .po files specify their own content encoding, but if it's wrong it might not match indeed
<didrocks> but "Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8\n"
<didrocks> so sounds goodâ¦
<didrocks> I initialize gettext in https://github.com/ubuntu/ubuntu-make/blob/master/umake/__init__.py#L32
<didrocks> and the failure is when I print the "I don't accept" pt_BR translation set in https://github.com/ubuntu/ubuntu-make/blob/master/umake/__init__.py#L32
<pitti> didrocks: your setlocale() call is someplace else?
<didrocks> pitti: I never called setlocale
<didrocks> it's using LANGUAGE=, right?
<pitti> didrocks: if set, yes
<pitti> $  python3 -c 'import gettext; gettext.textdomain("gtk30"); print(gettext.gettext("Add a class"))'
<pitti> Eine Klasse hinzufÃ¼gen
<pitti> indeed that works too
 * didrocks reads http://www.wefearchange.org/2012/06/the-right-way-to-internationalize-your.html
<pitti> I thought one had to call setlocale(); one must do in C, but perhaps python does it automagically
<didrocks> yeah, I never needed to in python contrary to C
<didrocks> (and the doc list the env variables that it's using)
<pitti> $ python3 -c 'import locale; print(locale.getlocale())'
<pitti> ('de_DE', 'UTF-8')
<pitti> indeed
<pitti> $ python -c 'import locale; print(locale.getlocale())'
<pitti> (None, None)
<pitti> hah
<pitti> so that's new in py3
<pitti> $ python -c 'import gettext, locale; print(locale.getlocale()); gettext.textdomain("gtk30"); print(gettext.gettext("Add a class"))'
<pitti> (None, None)
<pitti> Eine Klasse hinzufÃ¼gen
<pitti> so that works only because py2 blissfully ignores all the encoding stuff
<didrocks> after reading barry's blog post, seems like I'm doing the right thing in python3â¦
<didrocks> as gettext is returning unicode thereâ¦
<didrocks> pitti: ok, I have a small reproducer, are you on xenial?
<pitti> didrocks: yes; is there anything else? :-)
<didrocks> ahah :)
<didrocks> so apt install ubuntu-make
<didrocks> (to get the .mo file)
<didrocks> LANGUAGE=pt_BR python3 -c "import gettext; gettext.textdomain('ubuntu-make'); print(gettext.gettext('I don\'t accept'))"
<pitti> so I'll install ubuntu-make and language-pack-{gnome-,}pt in a schroot
<didrocks> pitti: I don't think you need other langpacks, but yeah
<didrocks> hum
<didrocks> LANGUAGE=pt_BR python3 -c 'import sys; print (sys.stdout.encoding)'
<didrocks> ANSI_X3.4-1968
<pitti> $ LANGUAGE=pt_BR python3 -c 'import sys; print (sys.stdout.encoding)'
<pitti> UTF-8
<pitti> on my desktop
<pitti> in the schroot it says ANSI_X3.4-1968 (i. e. "ascii")
<didrocks> getting that on my clean shell
<didrocks> when changing only LANGUAGE
<pitti> because my other LC_* are unset in the schroot
<didrocks> ahah
<pitti> didrocks: what does your "locale" say?
<didrocks> LANG=pt_BR.UTF-8 LANGUAGE=pt_BR python3 -c 'import sys; print (sys.stdout.encoding)'
<pitti> for LC_CTYPE in particular
<didrocks> pitti: ^
<pitti> LANGUAGE does not set any LC* or encoding, it's just for picking a language
<didrocks> (well, I just use env variables, so locale returns the french LC="fr_FR.UTF-8")
<pitti> unlike LANG which is an entire locale
<didrocks> LC_ALL is empty though
<pitti> that's fine
<pitti> if you have $LANG it's the defualt for LC_*
<pitti> most people have only $LANG or $LANG+$LANGUAGE
<didrocks> yeah, so the issue happens when I set LANG= in addition to LANGUAGE
<didrocks> LANG=pt_BR.UTF-8 LANGUAGE=pt_BR python3 -c 'import sys; print (sys.stdout.encoding)'
<didrocks> ANSI_X3.4-1968
<pitti> $ LANG=pt_BR.UTF-8 LANGUAGE=pt_BR python3 -c 'import sys; print (sys.stdout.encoding)'
<pitti> UTF-8
<pitti> in my schroot
<didrocks> pitti: http://paste.ubuntu.com/13245981/
<pitti> didrocks: oh! may it be that you don't actually have the pt_BR.UTF-8 locale?
<pitti> didrocks: locale -a ?
<didrocks> oh right, I don't have it installed
<pitti> there you are :)
<pitti> language-pack-{gnome-,}pt
<didrocks> so, you think that issue happens for people not installing the locale?
<didrocks> and so, sys.stdout.encoding returns ANSI_X3.4-1968
<didrocks> instead of UTF-8
<didrocks> (there is a default encoding by locale?)
<pitti> right; "LANG=pt_BR.UTF-8 locale" should complain loudly
<pitti> locale: Cannot set LC_CTYPE to default locale: No such file or directory
<pitti> etc.
<pitti> $ LANGUAGE=pt_BR LANG=pt_BR.UTF-8 python3 -c "import gettext; gettext.textdomain('ubuntu-make'); print(gettext.gettext('I don\'t accept'))"
<pitti> Eu nÃ£o aceito
<pitti> didrocks: but that shouldn't be possible to do with the GUI -- you can only select locales if you installed the langpack
<didrocks> pitti: I still don't get why python doesn't take thus the encoding from LANGâ¦
<pitti> so perhaps people who manualy set it
<pitti> didrocks: because it doesn't know which encoding that is
<pitti> if the locale isn't installed
<didrocks> isn't what the .UTF-8 from LANG= is about?
<pitti> the ".UTF8" is just part of a name
<didrocks> ah
<pitti> an identifier for humans
<pitti> e. g. aa_ET is also UTF-8
<didrocks> ok, so a way to avoid crashing on those condition would be to force my own encoding?
<didrocks> as I know my .mo files are UTF-8 encoded
<didrocks> ah no, the issue is in the print()
<pitti> correct
<pitti> didrocks: I'd suggest calling locale.setlocale()
<pitti> $ LANG=pt_BR.UTF-8 python3 -c 'import gettext, locale; print(locale.setlocale(locale.LC_ALL, ""))'
<pitti> locale.Error: unsupported locale setting
<pitti> and only if that succeeds you set a text domain
<pitti> that might be the most elegant way
<pitti> if the env specifies an invalid/broken/missing locale, it just uses C
<didrocks> yeah, so fallbacking to Câ¦
<pitti> so:
<pitti> try:
<pitti>     locale.setlocale(locale.LC_ALL, '')
<pitti>    gettext.textdomain(...)
<pitti> except locale.Error:
<pitti>    # maybe print some warning
<pitti>     pass
<didrocks> yeah
<pitti> yay for my perfect indentation this morning!
<didrocks> ahah good enough :)
<didrocks> let me still confirm that's the issue on the bug report
<didrocks> but I'll add that anyway, good way of protecting myself
<didrocks> thanks a lot for looking at it pitti!
 * didrocks hugs you
<pitti> didrocks: je t'en prie !
 * didrocks is quite happy that wasn't so straightforward :)
<hikiko> Trevinho, unity has compile errors...
<hikiko> bamf_matcher_get_application_for_xid_matcher
<hikiko> Trevinho, first error: /home/eleni/canonical/staging/unity/unity-shared/BamfApplicationManager.cpp: In member function âvoid unity::bamf::Application::UpdateWindows()â:
<hikiko> /home/eleni/canonical/staging/unity/unity-shared/BamfApplicationManager.cpp:427:43: error: âbamf_view_â is not a member of âunity::bamfâ
<hikiko>    for (GList* l = bamf_view_peek_children(bamf::bamf_view_); l; l = l->next) :s
<hikiko> sorry
<hikiko> wrong paste
<hikiko> /home/eleni/canonical/staging/unity/unity-shared/BamfApplicationManager.cpp: In member function âvoid unity::bamf::Application::UpdateWindows()â:
<hikiko> /home/eleni/canonical/staging/unity/unity-shared/BamfApplicationManager.cpp:427:53: error: âbamf_view_peek_childrenâ was not declared in this scope
<hikiko>    for (GList* l = bamf_view_peek_children(bamf_view_); l; l = l->next)
<hikiko> that's the 1st error
<hikiko> mmm now I look at it I should use a pastebin :p
<willcooke> morning all
<didrocks> morning willcooke
<Laney> hey hey
<Laney> pitti: bos01> oh dear
<darkxst> hey willcooke, Laney
<Laney> hi darkxst
<Laney> oh man, still no phonon fix!
<didrocks> hey Laney! :)
<didrocks> Laney is up before seb128, this guy is really back on his French schedule after a week :p
<pitti> hey Laney
<pitti> Laney: pitti, the breaker of all clouds..
<willcooke> qengho, For the last couple of days Cr. has added another icon to the launcher when running and the original just launcher yet another Cr.
<willcooke> *launches
<Laney> howdy didrocks
<didrocks> good good, had some nice interesting python encodeissue this morning :)
<didrocks> and fixed bad translations in pt_BR, making Make failure
<didrocks> failing*
<didrocks> + my first Atom.io contribution \o/
<didrocks> and it's Friday :p
<willcooke> congrats didrocks
<didrocks> thx ;)
<Trevinho> Ouch, irc didn't connect... But morning
<willcooke> qengho, but removing the old icon and readding sorts it
<willcooke> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> hi willcooke
<willcooke> Trevinho, sounds like the can find us some real hardware for U7 testing on Intel, nVidida, AMD
<willcooke> \o/
<Trevinho> willcooke: this is cool!
<seb128> re desktopers
<Trevinho> willcooke: even just intel would be fine for me... But still
<willcooke> :)
<Trevinho> the more the better
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1512290/comments/8
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1512290 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu Wily) "gnome-screenshot produces very low quality blurry screenshots" [High,Fix committed]
<Laney> this guy is CORRECT!
<seb128> FAIL
<seb128> laarrsssuuu
<seb128> do we tag bug #1515810 as a gtk 318 issue?
<ubot5> bug 1515810 in gedit (Ubuntu) "Doesn't merge into unity panel when maximized" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1515810
<seb128> it's not really
<seb128> but I think we said we need to teach gtk to have a flag for that?
<Laney> that or rls
<Laney> should triage the -incoming bugs btw
<Laney> does anyone plan to do that?
<willcooke> Seems like something that needs more that just one person to go through it
<willcooke> so, hangout on Monday?
<pitti> Laney: meh, they fixed bos01 this morning, but seems it's just dying again
<Laney> pitti: oh I just assumed it wasn't fixed yet
<seb128> well, we need one person to approve nominations
<seb128> seems a job for a manager ;-)
<Laney> willcooke: are you in the right team to do bug nominations?
<seb128> but I'm happy to help triaging the list
<willcooke> how do I check Laney?
<pitti> Laney: at least it held up for some two hours which reduced the queue quite a bit
<seb128> willcooke, you try to nominate a bug
<Laney> willcooke: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-greeter/+bug/1286878
<Laney> do you have "Nominate for series"?
<seb128> "Target to series"
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-greeter/+bug/1286878/+nominate
<seb128> do you have access to ^
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1286878 in unity-greeter (Ubuntu) "Doesn't scale well on a hidpi display" [Medium,Triaged]
 * seb128 bets he doesn't
<Laney> well that's what you need to triage the list
<willcooke> I can nominate
<seb128> right, I'm not saying he shouldn't
<seb128> you can? good !
<Laney> nominate but not approve
<seb128> well, can you approve nominations ? or just suggest those ?
<Laney> or target but not nominate
<Laney> whatever the stupid terminlogy is
<seb128> Laney, bug #1512290 should be verification-failed if there is a regression, no?
<ubot5> bug 1512290 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu Wily) "gnome-screenshot produces very low quality blurry screenshots" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1512290
<Laney> probably if it makes the thing crash
<willcooke> seb128, Laney  - Don't think I can approve
<Laney> willcooke: are you in bug control?
<Laney> can't remember if that lets you actually approve them
<seb128> no it doesn't
<Laney> what does then?
<seb128> you need to be in ubuntu-drivers I think
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-drivers
<seb128> or https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-release-nominators
<seb128> that's part of the drivers
<willcooke> qengho, but now "open link in browser" from xchat opens a new Cr. window and doesn't load the page
<seb128> infinity is admin of that group
<seb128> willcooke, maybe ask to be added there?
<seb128> ~ubuntu-release-nominators that is
<willcooke> seb128, will do. thx
 * Laney checked with #launchpad, but probably
<willcooke> oki, so Laney seb128 - you guys (and others) will nominate and then I will approve them?
<seb128> +1
<willcooke> Guess I can nominate too right?
<seb128> yes
<willcooke> cool
<seb128> I usually do approve things as well
<willcooke> great
<seb128> I think I'm going to keep doing that for obvious things
<seb128> but let me know if you prefer be doing those
<Laney> wait what?
<willcooke> oki, I will take a pass of the list on Monday, or once I am a member, which ever is later and then we can sync up afterwards
<Laney> I can't only nominate, it approves them right away
<didrocks> yeah, if you have rights (that every ubuntu core devs do), it will approve right away
<seb128> didrocks, I don't think it's coredevs
<seb128> it's ubuntu-drivers afaik
<didrocks> seb128: well, I can approve for sure, and I'm not in any of the 2 teams
<Laney> nah it's uploading permissions + drivers
<Laney> I think
<didrocks> yeah
<seb128> didrocks, you are not in https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-drivers ?
<didrocks> nope
<seb128> I'm in through UDS organiser
 * Laney not
<seb128> k
<Laney> that is some magic team
<seb128> launchpad permissions are weird
<didrocks> yeah
<seb128> and ~ubuntu-release-nominators is misleading then
<Laney> it's an extra group on top of the uploaders
<Laney> for this kind of case
<didrocks> funny that some people are in that team where they are less involved in ubuntu than uploaders btw :p
<seb128> yeah, that can makes sense though
<seb128> people defining quality and goals and not all doing technical work
<didrocks> random canonical upstreams?
<didrocks> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-release-nominators/+members#active
<seb128> like Pat is driving the touch product and dealing with bugs and targets but he's not packaging
<didrocks> that list is really weirdâ¦
<seb128> yeah, agreed on that
<seb128> but like having QA might make sense
<seb128> if we trust them to define the quality goals
<seb128> random individuals less so
<didrocks> for those yeah, not telling everyone in that list doesn't make sense
<didrocks> but a good part of individuals is weird
<Laney> that "Will" "Cooke"
<Laney> who even is he?
<didrocks> exactly!
<seb128> but we don't even know if that team is actually used
<seb128> since we are not member of it and have access to the nominations
<seb128> so it is a least not a direct mapping
<Laney> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~launchpad-pqm/launchpad/devel/view/head:/lib/lp/bugs/model/bugnomination.py#L120
<Laney> uploader + driver
<seb128> k
<seb128> thanks Laney!
<Laney> np!
<Laney> seb128: what do you think about demoting phonon-backend-vlc auralquiz?
<seb128> does it mean mitya57 and slangasek failed at getting at the bottom for the phonon issues?
 * seb128 reads IRC backlog from the night
<Laney> some patches but he didn't upload...
 * Laney tries them
<seb128> them? the patches?
<Laney> ye
<seb128> I was about to do the demotion
<seb128> should I still hit enter? ;-)
<seb128> we can fix up things later on
<Laney> I assumed silence was no :P
<Laney> do it if you're happy
<willcooke> Laney, seb128 - is this the list I should work from?  http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-x-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<Laney> yep
<willcooke> thx
<seb128> +1
 * willcooke blocks out some hours
<Laney> probably wait until you're in the team so you don't have to do get us to pres butan
<seb128> Laney, sorry I was in another discussions so delayed the demotions a bit
<Laney> willcooke: rls-x-notfixing is the "we don't commit to this" tag
<willcooke> got it
<willcooke> ta
<Laney> so either way they get out of the incoming list
<seb128> Laney, ok, demoted
<willcooke> oh, good news... seems my details weren't amongst those lifted in the TalkTalk hack
<seb128> eventually we are going to hit the other side
<seb128> Rejected:
<seb128> phonon-backend-vlc 0.8.2-1ubuntu1 in xenial (version older than the phonon-backend-vlc 0.8.2-1ubuntu2 in xenial published in xenial)
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> I don't understand the demote tool
<seb128> why does it try to upload non current versions?
<Laney> seb128: new package in proposed, just remove from release
<seb128> done
<Laney> nice
<Laney> you (maybe) got to do the last action
 * seb128 takes a bigger hammer in case it's needed
<Laney> we have the "force" hint ;-)
<seb128> transition weeks are so much fun
<Laney> that gets you sacked from the release team though
<seb128> haha
<seb128> would be nice to get that done today
<Laney> indeed
<Laney> ah good job gtk is blocked
<Laney> seems .3 broke some stuff
 * Laney looks at .4
<seb128> yeah, cf my comment yesterday evening just after you left :p
<seb128> binding booog
<Laney> looks like it all happened at the same time
<Laney> like the upstream commits were after I made the package and -3 was just around the same time I uploaded it
<Laney> doh doh doh dohd ohdodhodh
<czajkowski> Laney: happy friday eh :)
<seb128> hey czajkowski! how are you?
<seb128> Sweet5hark, hey, could you have a look to bug #1515761 ?
<ubot5> bug 1515761 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "Libre office writer reports error when opening MS Word files after running recent trusty update." [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1515761
<seb128> just to check if it's a regression or just a local/one user thing?
<Sweet5hark> seb128: /me reads
<seb128> thanks
<larsu> Laney: is bug #1512290 the one you mentioned in the tg group?
<ubot5> bug 1512290 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu Wily) "gnome-screenshot produces very low quality blurry screenshots" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1512290
<seb128> larsu, hey again ;-) and yes
<Laney> larsu: yeah, I assigned it to you
<Laney> sorry :(
<Laney> and hey!
<Laney> good gym?
<seb128> how was the gym today ?
<larsu> exhausting!
 * larsu feels very good now :)
<Laney> sweet
<larsu> pitti: ugh, that MR is the worst
<pitti> larsu: the unbreak-my-desktop brightness thing?
<pitti> yeah -- this is a kernel/driver issue, not a "let's bikeshed with user settings between off and low"
<larsu> ya. Thanks for taking a strong stance against it
<pitti> userspace should use the brightness range that the driver offers
 * larsu will pile on
<larsu> pitti: clearly
<larsu> pitti: also, that MR doesn't add the key to gsettings?!
<larsu> or is that in deskto-schemas or similar?
<pitti> larsu: maybe, I didn't bother to read that far
<pitti> this is conceptually wrong, I see little point in discussing the implementation
<larsu> ya, of course
<Laney> this person works for us...
<larsu> no point in reviewing
<larsu> old habit
<larsu> "oh ... a diff"
<Laney> why not come to ask before writing code?
<pitti> well, feel free :)
<pitti> but if anything we already have too many settings..
<seb128> why is the mr emailing the desktop list?
<Laney> haha
<Laney> so many avenues for discussion
<pitti> I set ubuntu-desktop as a reviewer -- bad/wrong team?
<pitti> I nacked the patch, but said I'm not the ultimate naysayer, and that it's the desktop team's decision
<seb128> unsure we have a team better fit
<Laney> it caused people to notice it
<pitti> sorry for the spam then
 * Laney stabs publisher
<seb128> no worry
<Laney> hurry up
<seb128> it might be good in fact
<seb128> getting some activity on the list ;-)
<pitti> I think as soon as anyone in the team acks or nacks the team reviewer goes back to that individual
<larsu> seb128: lol
<seb128> pitti, be +1 your nack in this case, good call! :-)
<seb128> larsu, btw how high is the nautilus menus thing on your todo? we should probably get that and the new geo lib landed in the next weeks if we can
<seb128> big changes early in the cycle
<seb128> then we can collect feedback and deal with bugs
<seb128> wdyt?
<larsu> highest on my list is wording a comment that doesn't sound too harsh
<larsu> seb128: but seriously: yes.
<seb128> cool
<seb128> larsu, sorry it feels like you got quite some pings/stuff dumped this week
<larsu> no worries
 * seb128 hugs larsu
 * larsu hugs EVERYONE
<seb128> almost the w.e don't worry, we can all relax ;-)
 * Laney is going to a big family party for Rosie's family
<Laney> not sure this is going to be relaxing :P
<pitti> Laney: uh, I don't like these much
<seb128> Laney, well, maybe entertaining then? :p
<seb128> in any case good luck!
<Laney> it's some kind of wedding party but not an actual wedding
 * Laney doesn't really know
<Laney> maybe free food & wine :)
<Laney> and I get to go to Norwich which is always nice
<Laney> also it appears I have 3 more days of holiday to burn before the end of the year
<Laney> BYE GUYS!
<seb128> oh, I should probably look at those as well
<seb128> I've been good and took 15 days to go to Scottland but I still have like 8 days left
<Laney> ya so 8-5 = 3
<Laney> Henry Days
<seb128> hehe
<pitti> the hr.c.c one probably tries to be clever, but the accrual still confuses me a lot
<seb128> I don't really understand what thas is about
<seb128> they add you a fraction of the yearly count every month?
<Laney> I just look at the year end total or whatever it says
<Laney> that seems to be right
<seb128> yeah, that's what I do
<pitti> I'm just not sure if that includes holidays which got approved, but weren't taken yet
<pitti> e. g. the christmas ones
<Laney> it's not like we actually build up days in that way
<Laney> no, it says 8 for me now
<willcooke> pitti, same
<Laney> which includes the Christmas ones
<Laney> I mean, which accounts for them
<larsu> hm I don't count as ubuntu desktop :(
<Laney> in what sense?
<larsu> team on lp
<larsu> because upload rights
<larsu> but I just noticed it when disapproving that mr
<Laney> ah right
<Laney> well u-s-d is a different team anwyay
<Laney> so you can set the status which matters
<larsu> indeed
<czajkowski> seb128: not bad thanks at a database conference - which are a little intense but god. Beside us is IBM running rapsberry Pi on Ubuntu hooked into couchbase as their demos so it's nice to see different people doing cool things
<seb128> nice
<seb128> where is that?
<seb128> larsu, don't feel left out :-(
<larsu> I don't ;)
<seb128> good :-)
 * Laney gets 83 emails
<czajkowski> seb128: all your base in London today
<seb128> Laney is ZE MAN
<seb128> Laney, well done!
<czajkowski> Laney: oh so what you're saying is you want an even 100
<czajkowski> I can send you some more to help you out
<Laney> hey czajkowski
<Laney> only if they say "here have some free pizza"
<Laney> pizza-over-ethernet
<seb128> Laney, man, you have been busy
<seb128> I only got 23 emails
<seb128> still better than nothing ;-)
<Laney> I got another 47 just now
<Laney> no change rebuilds YEAH!
<seb128> haha
<Laney> actually quite a few of them were real
<Laney> this took up like 3-4 entire days
<Laney> :|
<Laney> oh, got phonon-backend-vlc to build
<seb128> nice!
<seb128> I'm 2 uploads ahead of you still :p
<Laney> wtf
<seb128> 2695 vs 2693
<Laney> I was like 18 behind the other day
<Laney> before all these rebuilds
<Laney> what is this sorcery
<seb128> I'm playing tricks :p
<Laney> you need to add https://launchpad.net/~laney/+synchronised-packages on too
<Laney> :) :) :)
<seb128> that's cheating!
<Laney> that's the real stuff
<seb128> shrug
<Laney> wait what
<seb128> the real master is pitti it seems
<seb128> he wins fairly in each category
<Laney> oh yeah ffmpeg was indeed a copy
<Laney> true
<Laney> destroyed in +uploaded-packages even
<seb128> one day, one day...
 * Laney goes to make tea before phononing
<Laney> then really doing gtk .3
<Laney> .4
 * seb128 thinks about getting some food
<seb128> huuunnngrrry
 * larsu sympathizes with seb128 
 * Laney might actually get to some merges today!
<Laney> got some scary things on my list
<Laney> mdadm, lintian, dbus, bzr
<seb128> speaking of dbus, it's red of version, needs a merge from debian ;-)
<seb128> lunch, bbiab
<Laney> yes exactly
<larsu> seb128: enjoy!
<larsu> Laney: not sure what to do about the black window problem... maybe Trevinho can help
<larsu> ebassi commented on the bug, but not really helpful
<Laney> did you think bisecting would really be helpful?
<Laney> if so, might be good to do it
<larsu> yeah :'(
<Laney> but might have to suck it up and get the sync request work on the compiz team's schedule
 * larsu checks if this is happening in 3.16
<andyrock> a friend of mine is experiencing some issues on 15.10 with his trackpad
<andyrock> basically sometimes the pointer jumps in the top left corner
<andyrock> he's using a thinkpad
<andyrock> do you know something about it?
<larsu> Laney: same problem
<Laney> larsu: It sounded to me like it always existed but got more pronounced or something
<larsu> I don't see a difference on my machine
<Sweet5hark> seb128: issue seems unrelated.
<Laney> seb128 said he went back to 3.16 because of it
<larsu> hm I'll ask him when he's back from lunch
<Laney> I could imagine that the effect varies depending on hardware
<Laney> because I certainly see it but I wouldn't describe it as that annoying
<Laney> I notice it more on dialogs
<Laney> like open a file chooser in gedit
<larsu> right, me too
<larsu> but about the same on 3.16 and 3.18
<desrt> good morning desktop people
<Laney> definitely worse here
<seb128> larsu, Laney, see http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/gtk.ogv
<Laney> I don't see any black flash on 3.16
<seb128> it's 3.18 then ld_preload 3.16
<Laney> I see some resizing/drawing effect but it's not black
<Laney> hey desrt
<Laney> happy friday
<desrt> happy friday to you too, Laney
<desrt> also to hikiko :)
<Laney> the chosen
<seb128> hey desrt!
<desrt> (she always used to say happy [day])
<seb128> Sweet5hark, good
<hikiko> hi desrt :)
<hikiko> happy friday!
<desrt> :D
<desrt> s/used to say/says/
<hikiko> haha
 * desrt heats water for coffee and listens to music through speakers playing through a $30 chipamp bought from amazon hooked up to an ancient (1st model) eeepc running pulseaudio network streaming
<desrt> this is nice.
<larsu> seb128: :(
<larsu> morning desrt and hikiko
<hikiko> morning larsu :)
<desrt> hello seb128 and larsu
<seb128> larsu, sorry :-/
<larsu> seb128: it'd be fine if I could reproduce at least
<seb128> you don't see it at all?
<larsu> I see it in both 3.16 and 3.18
<seb128> :-(
<larsu> most notably when opening multiple windows at once
<larsu> or while compiling and then opening a window ;)
<Laney> lemme bizezt
<larsu> Laney: do you not have it in 3.16?
<Laney> no
<seb128> our bisect master didn't pick up the challenge?
<larsu> weird!
<larsu> how am I seeing this then
<seb128> larsu, weird that you see it in 3.16 :p
<larsu> indeed :)
<seb128> nobody reported that on launchpad from wily
 * Laney just jhbuilt the gtk-3-16 branch to check
<larsu> that's what I did
<Laney> then jhbuild run gedit -> ctrl-o
<Laney> w33rd
<larsu> AHHHH
<larsu> nice
<larsu> 3.16.0 doesn't have it
<seb128> ?!
<larsu> gtk-3-16 does
<seb128> you just said it did
<Laney> haha
<Laney> did you build .0?
<larsu> now I did
<Laney> confused
 * larsu bisects like attente
<seb128> weird
<seb128> gtk 3.16.n didn't have it for me either
<larsu> Laney: I built the branch, saw the same bug, then built 3.16.0 and don't see it anymore
<seb128> can I suggest you built the wrong thing (tm)? :p
<larsu> you can, but you'd probably be wrong
<Laney> oh snap
 * Laney noms czajkowski 
<czajkowski> Laney: :)
<seb128> larsu, try me! bet is on ;-)
<larsu> hehe
<czajkowski> Laney: context is a wonderful thing or it does look a tad odd in here :P)
<Laney> urgh 10 steps
<Laney> czajkowski: it's good to me mysterious
 * Laney swooshes off
<larsu> you're doing it as well?
<Laney> 13/11 12:36:25 <Laney> lemme bizezt
<larsu> 6 steps :P
<Laney> didn't sound like you managed to get it the same way we do
<larsu> Laney, seb128: https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?id=9da241b2d0251cafa30a9da13d0299e496a9bded
 * larsu makes sure this is actually it
<seb128> doesn't make sense
<seb128> that was commited for 3.16.1
<seb128> but I don't have the issue with 3.16.7 from wily
<larsu> whatever I'm seeing is a bug as well though
<larsu> anyway, grabbing food now :)
 * Laney carries on with le bisect
<Laney> this is fun, I see why attente loves these so much
<Laney> bisect win!
<Laney> 74f2d9448f24bbfdaf32ae6b328ed3e126700afe
<Sweet5hark> <- huge fan of bisecting (or bibisecting)
<willcooke> Laney, once I've targetted for X, should I remove the rls-x-incoming tag too?
<Laney> I guess so
<willcooke> *nominated
<willcooke> thx
<willcooke> seb128, you ok for me to do that ^^^  Or should I leave it as it is for now?
<seb128> +1 to do it
<Laney> have to keep track of which ones to approve then
<seb128> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?id=74f2d9448f24bbfdaf32ae6b328ed3e126700afe then?
<seb128> seems easy to revert ;-)
<seb128> though there are equivalent commits for different widgets
<Laney> probably ought to understand it...
<qengho> Good morning!
<willcooke> hey qengho!  See scroll back a Cr issue I'm having today.  Basically, old launcher icon went "funny".  Would launch Cr but a new icon was create on the launcher which shows the pips etc..  Plus when I try and open a link from xchat I get a new window and no link copied over
<qengho> willcooke: Hrm. Thanks.
<willcooke> qengho, hey, any time :)
<qengho> :(
<qengho> THAT'S WHAT I FEAR
<willcooke> qengho, what can I do to debug?  I'm afraid I removed the original icon
<qengho> :)
<willcooke> :D:D
<willcooke> Did the icon change recently?  It looks to be a slightly different colour?
<qengho> willcooke: I think I can figure it out. I have an idea where to look.
<willcooke> qengho, ah cool, thanks
<willcooke> this is on my 14.04 box
<qengho> willcooke: the happyaron was asking about snaps at my 1AM. What did you want us to do?
<willcooke> qengho, let's take this to /query
<qengho> I didn't have much to tell him, even if I was awake.
<larsu> Laney: cool!
<larsu> I wonder what bug I'm seeing here
<davmor2> larsu: if it has 8 legs it's a spider and the don't appreciate being called bugs ;)
<gQuigs> I'm happy to make a pull request to remove software-center, empathy, and brasero..  or is there a reason to wait?
<seb128> I'm not in favor of removing software-center until we sort out the impact on unity dash and other things using it
<didrocks> +1
<seb128> also until we have at least packagekit 1.0 and a building gnome-software
<seb128> like at least swap it out for something that is pushed and likely to replace it
<larsu> +2
<gQuigs> seb128: yea, installing software on the dash breaks if you remove software-center
<seb128> so don't
<qengho> zing
<gQuigs> ok :)
<jcastro> c'mon seb128, let 'er rip!
<seb128> jcastro, stop hating!
<jcastro> no one opens up the dash and is like "man I can't wait to install things from the software center."
<flocculant> not everyone using usc actually has a dash ...
<mdeslaur> jcastro: so you'd rather not have it work? :)
<davmor2> jcastro: There's an airport down the road don't make me get on a plane!
<seb128> flocculant, that comment is irrelevant to the discuss though, we are speaking about changing the Ubuntu Desktop seed
<seb128> flocculant, which is including Unity and such a dash
<flocculant> ok :)
<jcastro> seb128: I am half joking, but half want to see a flamethrower burning down some things early in the cycle.
<seb128> jcastro, let's burn juju
<seb128> that's a thing :p
<jcastro> :)
<mitya57> Laney, thanks for phonon & phonon-backend-vlc uploads! I have been too busy in the last days that I didn't even have time to read IRC logs :p
<gQuigs> heh'  juju can install software and has a gui..
 * gQuigs runs away
<Laney> mitya57: np, I just nicked some stuff from Debian
<Laney> but we also removed them from xenial to make the other stuff transition :P
<Laney> it would have been cooler to fix them instead
<Laney> bregma: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=757261 seems to be waiting for you btw
<ubot5> Gnome bug 757261 in g-ir-scanner "g-ir-scanner fails incorrectly on systems linking with --as-needed by default" [Normal,Assigned]
 * didrocks waves good evening and good week-end
<didrocks> going to catch a train
<Laney> bye didrocks!!!
 * Laney tries to type really fast these days
<Laney> happy SNCF
<Laney> enjoy the tune
<didrocks> Laney: merci ! ta da da :)
<Laney> he always misses out one note
<larsu> argh this commit is killing me
 * seb128 is away for some errands
<seb128> be back in some hours to deal with another round of emails and backlog before calling it a week
<seb128> see you in a bit or have a good w.e if you are off by then!
<seb128> willcooke, I played a bit with https://trello.com/b/FQgY4lpN/gnome-work but it imported things under your name because the script has your key, using mine returns a lack of permission error, need to figure out why later on
<seb128> (it does the same on a test board I created/owned)
<seb128> bbl
<willcooke> oki
<willcooke> thx seb128
<cyphermox> has anyone else noticed this? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/1516078
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1516078 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "pulseaudio fails to load modules" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> I don't even have any pulseaudio messages in my syslog
 * pitti waves good bye, have a nice evening!
<Laney> see you pitti, happy weekend!
<larsu> happy weekend pitti!
<pitti> o/
 * Laney vim ubuntu.xenial/desktop
 * qengho afk.
<Laney> seb128: back?
<Laney> I have a bit in my seed diff dropping gcc and make
<Laney> forgot why... do you remember?
<Laney> I suppose because dkms?
<willcooke> quittin time
<willcooke> l8r sk8rs
<seb128> Laney, back now...
<seb128> Laney, unsure, but dkms seems likely
<seb128> cyphermox, no such error here
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-11-14
<willcooke> qengho, just to let you know, my Cr. icon issues have resolved themselves
<willcooke> no idea why, I'd rebooted etc a few times yesterday
<willcooke> but suddenly today, it's working again
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-11-14
<TheMuso> What is the environment variable to use with Qt apps to use Mir?
<duflu> TheMuso: The binary ubuntu-app-launch does it for Unity8
<duflu> TheMuso: In Mir demo shells it is mirrun
<duflu> The set of environment variables is nonobvious because one of them you have to take away rather than add
<TheMuso> duflu: Ok thanks. Thought it was easy as an env variable like it is with Gtk.
<duflu> TheMuso: Yeah it's not that easy. Qt requires a variable which exists in Ubuntu gets undefined, plus Unity8 requires extra setup above and beyond the environment before it is willing to run an app (which I think is unreasonable and something we will need to eventually fix with public outcry)
<duflu> -gets +be undefined
<duflu> We have the ability to just run native apps without any special setup, so we should make it that easy
 * duflu glares at Unity8 people
<TheMuso> duflu: Thanks.
<pitti> Good morning
<flexiondotorg> MOrning TheMuso pitti duflu
<duflu> Morning flexiondotorg
<hikiko> heh, morning desktopers
<flexiondotorg> hikiko, Morning
<duflu> God exceptions are evil
<duflu> Sigh
 * TheMuso waves hello.
<hikiko> use error messages and perror etc :)
 * hikiko doesn't like exceptions either :p
<hikiko> hi willcooke
<willcooke> morning hikiko
<hikiko> flexiondotorg, good morning!
<seb128> the channel is waking up it seems!
<seb128> good morning desktopers ;-)
<flexiondotorg> seb128, Morning
<willcooke> hey seb128 flexiondotorg
<flexiondotorg> willcooke, o/
<Laney> hi!
<willcooke> g'morning Laney
<seb128> hey Laney
<Laney> hi willcooke, hi seb128!
<Laney> how are you?
<Laney> good weekend?
<seb128> did you all have a good w.e?
<seb128> doing good, though it's grey cold and rainy today
<seb128> w.e was quite busy doing some house-work (changing an old phone plug to an eth one in the living room, fixing a drawer in the kitchen that had lost its handle, fixing a new shelf, etc)
<seb128> you?
<Laney> you grown up!
<Laney> umm, went to the pub ...
<seb128> lol
<seb128> pub sounds nice
<willcooke> lol
<Laney> then on saturday went to the allotment, did some tidying and harvesting (cavolo nero, jerusalem artichoke, celeriac, nasturtium seeds)
<Laney> and yesterday -> climbing and then coffee and cake
<Laney> #notgrownup
<seb128> I did manage my days well, those small fixups still take longer that you though
<seb128> I wanted to go to get some coffee and appletart yesterday but failed at it
<davmor2> Laney: When you say you grown up! for some reason I thought the next line was gonna be me tarazan ;)
<seb128> but tonight tennis!
<seb128> (I hope at least, looking outside makes me unsure we are going to be able to play :-/)
<davmor2> Morning all
<seb128> hey Dave
<Laney> davmor2: good idea, /me moves to the jungle
<Laney> seb128: it's the super moon tonight too
<hikiko> hi seb128 Laney davmor2
<Laney> hoping the clouds go away
<Laney> hey hikiko
<Laney> how's it going?
<seb128> hey hikiko
<davmor2> Laney: there's a caravan park called Ebury Hill in shrewsbury you get some awesome night skys during the summer there as there are only a couple of Farms near it so no street lighting and the site lights are on top of the electric posts so next to know contamination from them either
<TheMuso> Laney: Hope you have better luck. Its cloudy here at the moment, so no super moon, at least for my part of Sydney.
<seb128> Laney, just reading about that, it's going to be at the closest around lunch time, I don't think it's going to work out from here with that weather
<davmor2> TheMuso: no no no we've seen the films there are only clear blue skys in Australia you're not blagging us with that one ;)
 * pitti returns and sees a lot of action in this channel -- good morning desktoppers!
<seb128> hey pitti, wie gehts?
<seb128> pitti, how was the show on friday? had a good w.e?
<pitti> seb128: gut, danke! Apparently you've been the most productive of us all this weekend :)
<TheMuso> davmor2: Well I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but whatever material/media you have seen from/about Australia is greatly mistaken. :p
<pitti> seb128: absolutely, yes! nice headbanging on Friday, another piano concert Saturday (what a contrast), and apart from some housecleaning mostly idling and avoiding the bitter cold :)
<pitti> (well, we did a two hour walk, but brrrr)
<Sweet5hark> moin
<pitti> Laney: sounds nicer than household stuff anyway :)
<pitti> moin moin Sweet5hark
<Sweet5hark> heya pitti, seb128, laney, all!
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark
<seb128> pitti, sounds like a nice w.e, I should have one of those next week ;-)
<davmor2> TheMuso: but but but, crocodile dundee, prescia queen of the desert, mad max, and even strictly ballroom all sunny neighbours home and away I can go on :P
<Laney> hey pitti Sweet5hark & TheMuso ;-)
<TheMuso> davmor2: Well sorry to disappoint you. :)
<flexiondotorg> Morning Laney davmor2
<flexiondotorg> And Sweet5hark o/
<davmor2> TheMuso: no don't go shattering my illusions ;)
<TheMuso> davmor2: :)
<seb128> flexiondotorg, how is your back btw? do you feel better now?
<flexiondotorg> seb128, Much improved. I walk from Poole to Bournemouth and back yesterday. Really helped.
<seb128> great
<seb128> glad you are doing better!
<flexiondotorg> Also amazing views of the moon at perigee :-)
<seb128> you found clear sky in the u.k? ;-)
<flexiondotorg> Yep.
<flexiondotorg> Last night was it.
<seb128> nice
<flexiondotorg> Although it is closer tonight, will be cloudy.
<flexiondotorg> Was complete clear sky at the coast yesterday.
<pitti> indeed, here too -- nice full moon, but bitterly cold at night
<flexiondotorg> Thousands of photographers there on the beach.
<flexiondotorg> http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/newS/14885281.PICTURES__Not_quite_a_supermoon_lights_up_Dorset_skies/
<flexiondotorg> I think they were a bit too ficused on the moon, but this is what it looked like facing west - https://plus.google.com/+MartinWimpress/posts/A9QVQfchhPS
<seb128> nice view indeed
 * flexiondotorg nips out to buy milk...
<seb128> Sweet5hark, hey, did you see the "[yakkety/libreoffice] Possible Regression" emails? could you check those/reply to Brian?
<seb128> they don't seem likely to be due to the SRU change from a non-libreoffice-maintainer eye
<seb128> just non frequent issues that had some 5.1 reports but no 5.2 yet
 * duflu goes to find the moon
<seb128> duflu, good luck and enjoy the view ;-)
<duflu> Hmm, the moon is so super it's got powers of invisibility
<duflu> Too low probably
<pitti> Laney: FYI, I have a PR now for bug 1637758; I'll wait for Robert's review before uploading, though (and it seems he's currently landing a new upstream release too)
<ubot5`> bug 1637758 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "lightdm greeter session not properly shut down at login" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1637758
<Laney> pitti: nice
<Laney> do you know why usd doesn't go down with the session?
<Laney> what tells it to die in a normal user session?
<Laney> and why did that unified hierarchy patch fix it? :-)
<pitti> Laney: I at least know for nm-applet -- unity-greeter just Process.spawn_command_line_async()s that without ever cleaning it up
<pitti> i. e. there's nothing on closing the unity greeter session that would stop it
<pitti> Laney: I think before it was upstart shutting down the session dbus on session closing
<pitti> and nm-applet/u-s-d died  with that
<pitti> now it's lingering as it's PAM/systemd which closes it
<pitti> Laney: as for the unified hiearchy, I don't have the slightest idea how that influenced that ..
<Laney> me neither
<Laney> it's all voodoo to me
<Sweet5hark> seb128: @yakkety regressions: only discussed the first one with brain (right at the sprint). havent rechecked or redicussed them since.
 * Sweet5hark is having a look now
 * Sweet5hark curses at the fancy javascript-foo on errors.u.c. Just gimme the damn data.
<Sweet5hark> seb128: so looking at https://errors.ubuntu.com/?package=libreoffice-core&period=week I see nothing in the Top20 with "First seen: Ubuntu 16.10".
<Sweet5hark> seb128: and looking at one of the crashers that I got spammeed about (64e3163cddff439ffdde7cbe5bf031a0d3412ae3), has 35 events on Ubuntu 15.10, 15 events on Ubuntu 16.04 and _4_ events on Ubuntu 16.10.
<Sweet5hark> seb128: IOW, the detection algo there is nuts and just triggers on noise: something happening 15 times on the LTS is noise anyway. And in this particular case the regression detection freaks out about 4 events on 5.2.2-0ubuntu2 because accidentally there werent any events on 5.2.2-0ubuntu1.
<Sweet5hark> so: 5.2.2-0ubuntu1 had the defect too, but wasnt deployed enough to show it. absence of evidence isnt evidence of absense and all that jazz: assuming 5.2.2-0ubuntu1 was more healthy is nonsense.
<seb128> Sweet5hark, right, what I think as well, let's just tell Brian to unblock it
<seb128> Sweet5hark, good suggestions in the email, indeed their "need to manual check for regression" is a easy to trigger
<andyrock> muktupavels: hey
<andyrock> gtk/window-decorator/gwd-settings-storage.c:208:36: error: âMETA_THEME_TYPE_GTKâ undeclared (first use in this function)
<muktupavels> andyrock: hey
<andyrock> I'm on xenial
<andyrock> would be nice to add a check to be sure that metacity 3.20 is installed
<andyrock> to keep supporting xenial
<muktupavels> what metacity version has in xenial?
<andyrock> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/VPvPBiBZ/
<andyrock> 3.18
<muktupavels> then metacity support should have been disabled.
<muktupavels> andyrock: is not USE_METACITY set to 0?
<happyaron> pitti: hey, would you mind to have a look at n-m in git when you have time?
<pitti> happyaron: oh, nice! sure
<pitti> happyaron: anything in particular you want me to watch out for, or just a general "looks OK and works"?
<pitti> happyaron: you dropped Read-system-connections-from-run.patch, but that isn't upstream yet
<happyaron> pitti: just the patch set
<happyaron> let me check
<pitti> happyaron: Read-config-from-run.patch was indeed accepted (not sure if it's already in 1.4.2, but that's easy enough to find out)
<pitti> happyaron: dinner now, will look in ~ 3 hours
<happyaron> ty
<happyaron> I'm going to bed.
<andyrock> muktupavels: i get the error if I disable metacity andccm decorator plugin at configure/cmake time
<muktupavels> andyrock: what error?
<dmj_s76> Trevinho: andyrock: Had a chance to think about the HiDPI scaling issue in unity/u-s-d?
<muktupavels> andyrock: just tried with -DUSE_METACITY=OFF and got error...
<muktupavels> andyrock, trevinho: https://code.launchpad.net/~albertsmuktupavels/compiz/fix-build-with-use-metacity-off/+merge/310793
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-11-15
<pitti> Good morning
<Sweet5hark> moin
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark pitti
<pitti> bonjour seb128 !
<pitti> moin Sweet5hark
<seb128> how are you today?
<pitti> I'm great, thanks! how about yourself?
<seb128> good as well, thanks!
<seb128> didn't get to see the moon yesterday
<seb128> it's grey&rainy since sunday
<pitti> oh, too bad
<didrocks> same here
<didrocks> (hey Sweet5hark, pitti!)
<pitti> clear sky and bitter cold since Saturday or so
<pitti> Ã§a va didrocks ! comment vas-tu ?
<didrocks> pitti: throat infection since yesterday. Feeling a little bit better today (no more fiever/headaches), but can't speak at all
<didrocks> and you?
<pitti> didrocks: eek, get better soon then! :(
 * Sweet5hark is still doing all "exciting" backporting to trusty ...
<didrocks> pitti: thx! it's warm green tea for now
<pitti> didrocks: so far I evaded the current plague (*knocks on wood*) -- everyone around is sneezing and coughing
<didrocks> could go to grog TBH, but unsure in a work context :p
<didrocks> sneezing/coughing was last week for me :)
<didrocks> then, I felt better
<didrocks> for the week-end
<Sweet5hark> didrocks: get well
<didrocks> thanks Sweet5hark :)
<pitti> didrocks: you misspelled it: "desinfectant" :)
<didrocks> ahah
<willcooke> morning all
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<Laney> morning!
<willcooke> how goes Laney?  Any super moon action up your way?
<pitti> hey hey Laney!
<pitti> *howl*
<seb128> hey willcooke Laney
<seb128> how is u.k today?
<willcooke> quite nice
<willcooke> little sunshine peeking through the clouds
<willcooke> the leaves are all golden
<willcooke> and it's not raining yet
<Laney> it's #888888
<Laney> did see the moon for a minute in a brief gap
<didrocks> hey hey Laney
<TheMuso> Hey willcooke. Hope you're feeling better.
<TheMuso> Hey desktopers.
<willcooke> hey TheMuso - yes thanks!
<flexiondotorg> Morning everyone
<Laney> hey didrocks
 * Laney feeds you ice cream
<seb128> hey flexiondotorg
 * Laney scratchesssssSSSSsssssSSsssSSSSss
<Laney> bleddy mosquitos @ allotment
<willcooke> come on you frost
<Laney> true
<Laney> nothing left that would be harmed by it
 * Laney thinks about buying some garlic to put in now
<flexiondotorg> Laney, GtkToolButtons clip/overlap in Xenial and Yakkety.
<flexiondotorg> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-themes/+bug/1641915
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1641915 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "GtkToolButton styling clips and overlaps" [Undecided,In progress]
<flexiondotorg> I've got a branch that fixes this for Xenial.
<flexiondotorg> Zesty is not affected. Yakkety is.
<flexiondotorg> Do you this this is worth SRU'ing to Yakkety?
<Laney> do you know how to fix it for 3.20?
<Laney> I would if it's easy enough, otherwise - not that bothered
<Laney> but up to you
<flexiondotorg> Laney, I can fix for Yakkety, is a debdiff OK for Yakkety?
<Laney> flexiondotorg: Sec, I'll push a Y one
<flexiondotorg> Laney, stop :-)
<flexiondotorg> No fix required for Y
<flexiondotorg> Just retested in a clean VM.
<flexiondotorg> Y is already fixed.
<Laney> 'k
<Laney> I made it anyway for next time
<flexiondotorg> Laney, Can you accept the Xenial nomination on LP: #1641915 please
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1641915 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "GtkToolButton styling clips and overlaps" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1641915
<Laney> it is done
<Laney> going to lunch now, byes
<hikiko> gawd I had that bright idea to highlight the word "question" on irc
<hikiko> hexchat blinks non-stop since then :p
<flexiondotorg> Thanks Laney
<pitti> the question is, was that a good idea? :-)
<hikiko> hahahaha
<hikiko> I thought it would be good for the uos sessions
<hikiko> but I guess all the text will be highlighted there
<flocculant> hikiko: iirc people should QUESTION - so search and match case
<hikiko> cool :) I am going to change the regexp
<flocculant> I could be wrong though :p
<Laney> stupid cold dark days
 * Laney should get one of those SAD lamps
<seb128> bike incident?
<Laney> nah
<Laney> just lame and grey
<willcooke> 1kW LED
 * Sweet5hark is blinded by the light.
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Nov 15 15:30:15 2016 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic:
<willcooke> Roll call: andyrock, attente, desrt,  dgadomski, fjkong, flexiondotorg, happyaron (out), hikiko, laney, qengho, seb128, sweet5hark, themuso (out), tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<Sweet5hark> arent we supposed to have sharks with lasers by now?
<desrt> hihi
<Trevinho> o/
<hikiko> oh noed
<hikiko> no
<seb128> Laney, do you have a fireplace in your house?
<hikiko> I forgot the bullets
<flexiondotorg> Coey
<Laney> seb128: yeah, 5!
<seb128> hey
<Laney> (hi)
<willcooke> hikiko,  you got time
<seb128> Laney, use them! ;-)
<andyrock> Hey
<seb128> it makes grey days much nicer
<willcooke> Laney, get the Christmas tree up early :)
<attente> :o
<desrt> L G S!
<Laney> seb128: the office room doesn't have one :-/
<Sweet5hark> Laney: burn the christmas tree in the fireplace!
<Laney> could be downstairs though I guess
<seb128> :-(
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, lol
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> laptop ftw!
<willcooke> ok, looks like we have everyone, let's begin
<willcooke> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: andyrock
<andyrock> #1 working on the copy dialog branch to sru it as It m seems like there are some issues
<andyrock> # reviews
<andyrock> # eow
<willcooke> thanks andyrock
<willcooke> looking forward to that branch
<willcooke> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: attente
<attente> fixed some test flakiness in content-hub-glib
<attente> fixed an issue with the gtk-mir copy-paste implementation
<attente> uploaded a new fixed version of the glade snap (menus working now, also properly confined), published to the store
<attente> discussions and ideas about banners in mir
<attente> (eof)
<willcooke> excellent, thanks attente
<willcooke> nice work on the glade snap
<willcooke> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: desrt
<desrt> hey
<desrt> not a lot to report this week.  work is continuing.
<desrt> sitting here with larsu, though :)
<desrt> (eof)
<willcooke> hey larryprice
<willcooke> err sorry larryprice ignore
<willcooke> larsu, hey!
<seb128> :-)
<larsu> morning!
<willcooke> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: dgadomski
<attente> larsu!
<larsu> happy meeting :)
<dgadomski> hey, I sprinting with my team, hence nothing to share this time, thanks!
<willcooke> thanks dgadomski
<willcooke> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: FJKong
<willcooke> guess he's not around, we'll come back
<willcooke> #topic flexiondotorg
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: flexiondotorg
<flexiondotorg> Hello
<flexiondotorg> - Submitted a merge proposal to fix deja-dup scrolled windows (LP: #1623835)
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1623835 in deja-dup (Ubuntu) "Scrolled Windows in backup/restore progress are too small to read" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1623835
<flexiondotorg> - Researched this weeks candidates for the Snap Upstream Blitz and updated their Trello board.
<flexiondotorg> - Reviewed the existing StartUp Disk Creator docs and behaviour in preparation for LP: #1558139
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1558139 in ubuntu-website-content "Please update http://www.ubuntu.com/download/desktop/create-a-usb-stick-on-ubuntu" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1558139
<flexiondotorg> - Testing Unity 8 Desktop snap - https://code.launchpad.net/~unity8-session-snap-team/unity8-session-snap/snap
<flexiondotorg> - Also tried on Unity 8 on Dragonboard 410c but ran into LP: #1625805
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1625805 in linux (Ubuntu) "arm64 kernel panic for l2 mmu with unity8 session snap (& deb as well)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1625805
<flexiondotorg> - Initial research for hiding snaps in GNOME Disks (LP: #1637984)
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1637984 in gnome-disk-utility (Ubuntu) "Disks shows all mounted snaps" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1637984
<flexiondotorg> - Submitted GtkToolButton fixes (Disks and Ubiquity) merge proposal for Xenial (LP: #1641915)
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1641915 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu Xenial) "GtkToolButtons clip and overlap" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1641915
<flexiondotorg> - Currently dropping all Firefox "hacks" from my recent ubuntu-themes merge proposals.
<flexiondotorg> - Will be raising bugs upstream regarding the incorrect use of top-level selectors
<flexiondotorg> ð¬
<willcooke> :) thanks flexiondotorg !
<Laney> flexiondotorg: You should get yourself CI train access if you don't have it
<Laney> then you can do theme stuff (mostly) by yourself
<flexiondotorg> Laney, OK. I don't have.
<Laney> go ask a trainguard in #ubuntu-ci-eng
<flexiondotorg> Thanks.
 * Laney can assist the first few times
<flexiondotorg> Perfect!
<sil2100> o/
<Laney> that's not to say that MPs don't need reviewing, but the upload part you can do yourself
 * Laney eyes sil2100 
<sil2100> Ok, let me see what can be done here
<Laney> (over there ->, in meeting here ATM)
<willcooke> thanks chaps
<willcooke> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: happyaron
<willcooke> 1. Resynchronize n-m with Debian for 1.4.2 in zesty, one more patch to
<willcooke> be updated before upload
<willcooke> 2. Bugs in ucimf
<willcooke> 3. Bugs in libopencc2
<willcooke> 4. Review of netcat-openbsd update
<willcooke> #topic hikiko
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: hikiko
<hikiko> hey
<hikiko> I dont remember everything...
<hikiko> - fixed some branches that were under review
<hikiko> (no commit yet but they appear on the video!)
<hikiko> - made some fixes in low gfx (like resizing)
<hikiko> where I noticed that there were minor issues
<hikiko> oh
<hikiko> the ordering in alt+`
<hikiko> the shadow-border
<hikiko> the video :p
<hikiko> eof
<hikiko> I cant remember
<hikiko> sorry
<willcooke> thanks hikiko, good luck with the session
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: Laney
<Laney> â¢ Fixing tests to get gtk, glib, other things to migrate; just happened
<Laney> â¢ Bootstrapping of ldc for Z, x-backports, y-backports (silos are good for this)
<Laney> â¢ New gspell (test fix) @ Debian, sponsor & sync libproxy
<Laney> â¢ asgen: Bugfixes for addon-suite-only mode, improvements to the charm to support this, running in this mode in staging now. next: import old data, see if it's all served up properly
<Laney> â¢ autopkgtest babysitting and random admin with p_itti's guidance
<Laney> ð
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> â¢ nov 11th was an holiday so one less day working this week
<seb128> â¢ some archive admin work (new binaries reviews, helped with some transitions)
<seb128> â¢ UOS
<seb128> â¢ looked at the ubiquity tz selection returning a wrong name for montreal, turned out to be a bug in the service db
<seb128> â¢ tweaked old desktop snaps to be compliant with current standards/use shared launchers
<seb128> â¢ spent some time catching up with recent snap work and poking around with others have been doing to get some inspiration
<seb128> â¢ launchpad bugs triage
<seb128> </week>
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: qengho
<qengho> * in-progress: emergency Cr 53 backport to kill upstream's far-too-optimistic deadline for disabling some kinds of TLS certificates. Symantec certs broken. Mostly done.
<qengho> * to-do: Chromium 54 fixing and testing, still.
<qengho> EOF
<qengho> Also, weeping hot tears into my keyboard. ðº ð¸
 * Sweet5hark feels left out.
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> err
<willcooke> I messed up the order some how
<willcooke> thanks qengho
<willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: Sweet5hark
<Sweet5hark> - boring week:
<Sweet5hark> -- backporting
<Sweet5hark> -- bug triage
<Sweet5hark> -- usual ESC call
<Sweet5hark> -- some watchful eye on Munich situation
<Sweet5hark> EOF
<willcooke> :) thanks Sweet5hark
<willcooke> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: TheMuso
<willcooke> * Tested Orca under Mir with Gtk and Qt apps. Things are mostly working fine with Gtk apps when running under miral-shell. I can also use Orca keyboard shortcuts. Unfortunately these do not work under Qt apps, so some work will be needed on that front, we may have to add something to Mir or Unity to handle keyboard events after all.
<willcooke> * Set up an environment with Qt on Wayland to see if the same thing occurrs, i.e no Orca keyboard shortcuts when using a Qt app under Wayland. Haven't got to testing this yet, something for the coming days.
<willcooke> * Helped with validation of pulseaudio currently in xenial/yakkety-proposed, should be entering updates some time soon.
<willcooke> * Started looking into writing interfaces for accessibility and text to speech related components, thanks to some useful posts on one of the snappy mailing lists... Can't remember which one right now.
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<willcooke> I've got to go to another meeting, so moving on...
<willcooke> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: Trevinho
<Trevinho> 16/45
<Trevinho> Â· Released compiz 0.9.13.1
<Trevinho> Â· Prepared an SRU for unity in yakkety (fixes indicators after lockscreen)
<Trevinho> Â· New landing for unity and compiz in zesty
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed various unity8 flacky tests causing autopkg to fail in my silo
<Trevinho> . Fixed some issues of the new unity8 calendar
<Trevinho> Â· Some work in toolkit indicators (sni-qt, libappmenu-qt, libappindicator) to make icons to be visible when snapped
<Trevinho> Â· Improvements to the Remmina snap (some fixes merged upstream)
<Trevinho> Â· snapcraft pull request to apt-mark auto all the newly installed packages (from build-packages list)
<Trevinho> Â· snapcraft pull request to support FTP sources
<Trevinho> :::: That's all folks
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho
<willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<willcooke> - lightdm 1.21.0 released
<willcooke> - snapd-glib 1.3 released
<willcooke> - Work on ligthdm / unity8-system snap
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-11-15 | Current topic: AOB
<willcooke> I got to go to another meeting, so I'll wrap now.  If anyone has anything, carry on once it's ended
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Nov 15 15:49:22 2016 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2016/ubuntu-desktop.2016-11-15-15.30.moin.txt
<willcooke> thanks everyone
<seb128> I've random questions on specific items but it's just for me so after meeting is fine
<seb128> thanks willcooke
<seb128> attente, hey, just curious but was the issue with glade/menus?
<gQuigs> I've also got a question :)... is it still the plan to drop i386 for Ubuntu-desktop for 17.04?
<flexiondotorg> Trevinho, regarding "Some work in toolkit indicators"
<flexiondotorg> Is that specific to snaps or does it address the way icon are passed via dbus that we discussed?
<gQuigs> *the i386 image
<attente> seb128: just that they weren't popping up in the old snap
<seb128> attente, right, you showed me at the sprint, I'm just curious to know what the technical issue was/how you fixed it
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: I plan to make the indicator to ge the proper icon paths from the snap, so all snap-based
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: not sure I can succeed yet :-D
<flexiondotorg> Trevinho, OK. Thanks :-)
<Trevinho> I've got some good results with qt... But only for non-themed icons
<attente> seb128: i actually don't know, the new glade snap is built using the jhbuild plugin that i changed to stop using lxc
<seb128> attente, k, good job anyway! ;-)
<attente> seb128: it uses bubblewrap now which is the only big difference from what i can tell
<attente> seb128: :)
<attente> seb128: thanks
<seb128> I need to read about bubblewrap
<attente> it's really nice
<seb128> I've seen it mentioned a couple of times
<attente> desrt loves it
<seb128> it's used by flatpak right?
<desrt> yup
<attente> i'm not sure the relationship there. they're both a part of project atomic
<desrt> that's not really true...
<attente> oh. it's not?
<desrt> it basically lets you do some really really cool stuff, but sets no-new-permissions
<desrt> so you can't "escape" in any real sense
<desrt> afaik, flatpak is not 'part of' project atomic
<flexiondotorg> seb128, What desktop snaps did you update? I was thinking of doing something similar, but don't want to duplicate effort.
<desrt> ostree is....
<seb128> k
<desrt> (and bwrap really has nothing to do with ostree, other than the fact that both flatpak and atomic use both of them)
<seb128> flexiondotorg, some old ones I used as playground, ghex gnome-dictionary gucharmap
<attente> ah ok
<seb128> Trevinho, speaking of indicators, are you looking at the issue with qt indicators using /tmp to share icons?
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, I've moved them to .cache for now
<Trevinho> seb128: although /run/user would be preferrable imho
<Trevinho> but not yet accessible
<seb128> Sweet5hark, being curious but what is going on in Munich? changes in their opensource use?
<seb128> Trevinho, .cache wouldn't work, would it?
<Sweet5hark> seb128: nah, not per se. just severe lobbying from microsoft by proxy (accenture)
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, since ~/snap/$SNAP_NAME/$SNAP_REVISION/ is readable...
<Sweet5hark> seb128: http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-partner-claims-munich-should-switch-from-linux-to-windows-10/
<seb128> Sweet5hark, k, I was wondering, read some news about brazil and some part of italy going back to msoffice
<seb128> Sweet5hark, I see
<seb128> Trevinho, oh, then the desktop side needs to look at different directories for every indicator
<Sweet5hark> seb128: brazil yes. italy -- not those on libreoffice, just some that stayed with Apache OpenOffice and the idiots that thought that was a good idea. Would have been preventable if they'd chosen LibreOffice.
<seb128> well apparently from what I read they wanted a cloud based solution
<Sweet5hark> seb128: the major italian migrations (military, upcoming city of rome) are still on track
<seb128> easier than keeping installs updated
<seb128> k
<Sweet5hark> seb128: nah, never trust the "official reasons", because "official reasons" dont allow for "we fscked up".
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, that we already do...
<seb128> Trevinho, since when?
<Trevinho> seb128: I mean, when an indicator set its custom icons path, then we add that path to the icon theme dirs
<Trevinho> seb128: it's just about using some readable place
<seb128> Sweet5hark, right... still the moving to the cloud for easier management is an argument that can make sense, futur is going to be fun with people getting locked down with big providers :-/
<seb128> Trevinho, oh, ok
<seb128> Trevinho, the path is shared over dbus?
<Trevinho> Sweet5hark: yeh, i've been reading that italy news too :-/, however... yes it was OpenOffice. Although, I think a libreoffice cloud is really really more and more needed :-)
<Trevinho> seb128: ye
<gQuigs> we discussed dropping the i386 ISO previously and said it's likely to drop, but we should revisit at UOS or for 17.04..  which is now scheduled - http://summit.ubuntu.com/uos-1611/meeting/22714/architecture-discussions/
<Trevinho> seb128: see gdbus call --session --dest com.canonical.Unity.Panel.Service.Desktop --object-path /com/canonical/Unity/Panel/Service --method com.canonical.Unity.Panel.Service.GetIconPaths
<seb128> Trevinho, well, that's different from qt using /tmp to send custom icons though?
<Trevinho> seb128: not much... well...
<Trevinho> seb128: it depends on the case
<seb128> gQuigs, hey, yes, thanks for the reminder (saw in on the schedule and the email to the list)
<Trevinho> seb128: qt4, creates an icon theme path...
<Trevinho> in /tmp/qt-sni...
<seb128> oh ok
<Trevinho> qt5 has that tmp icon, so that's actually easier I think... I've been blocked by some u8 indicators stuff today, though... So I didn't go too much into the deep
<seb128> k
<seb128> I just wanted to know if you were looking at it
<seb128> Trevinho, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/snapd/+bug/1600136
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1600136 in snapd (Ubuntu) "App indicator does not show icon for Qt apps" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Trevinho> seb128: but for example running a qt4 app you get /tmp/sni-qt_appname_7224-seB6cg/icons as new icon theme
<seb128> I see
<Trevinho> seb128: and..... I've just tried what I was thinking it would have worked... and.... It really had :-D
<Trevinho> seb128: so for qt-sni, things are working like a charm
<seb128> welldone!
<Trevinho> seb128: there's just one thing that now I don't like too much, basically there are qt apps that define an icon from theme name, others have their own icon... For the 2nd case it's where the /tmp/  thing was used... And right now I hacked it to use ~/.cache/temporary-path to create their own icons... However probably, in that case it would just better to give
<Trevinho> them the access to their ~/.local/share/icons and write them what they want... Don't you agree?
<Trevinho> in this way we cover also the case where an QIcon points to a themed name...
<Trevinho> withouth having to worry about what theme dir to provide to the indicator, as it always will be ~/snap/$SNAP_NAME/x1/.local/share/icons
<seb128> Trevinho, well, the custom icons are a temp thing, I wouldn't store them in .local
<Trevinho> seb128: it's true, but... At the same time it's also a .local that is only valid for that snap...
<seb128> still you don't want to clutter it with temp files
<seb128> or you need to clean behind...
<Trevinho> and doing this would allow to cover a case where a window has both a themed and a custom icon
<Trevinho> that was my first intention eh... But now seeing that I could make things simpler this way...
<Trevinho> well, I'll continue following the nicer path..
<Trevinho> hoping there won't be problem for both custom and normal icons
<seb128> good luck!
<Trevinho> it shouldn't be too hard, but... let's see
<tedg> Trevinho: On the U8 side we're treating $SNAP like an entry of in XDG_DATA_DIRS, so they can throw an "icons" on that and use names.
<Trevinho> tedg: mh, ok that could be a solution too... But I can't depend on that. Also qt-sni is qt4 so, probably it would run inside xmir anyway, isn't it?
<Trevinho> as for qt5 one, I'll see... However probably that component has to be rewritten too.
<tedg> Well, there's some discussion of what we'll do with sni. But no clear answer for sure.
<tedg> I'm sure that come April it will be a panic must have and we'll be filling out freeze exceptions :-/
<Sweet5hark> Trevinho: as for cloud, there is collabora office (based on libreoffice) being exactly that.
<Sweet5hark> ironically, the push for cloud might be an lobbying attempt to still squeeze it in before the real impact of "Trump is president" sets in on european policy.
 * flexiondotorg take a break to clean the kitchen before the next UOS session.
<willcooke> rock and roll :)
<seb128> should probably step away for a bit as well
<seb128> though it's early for dinner
<seb128> Sweet5hark, TheMuso, is bug #1584795 known by you?
<ubot5`> bug 1584795 in at-spi2-atk (Ubuntu) "Severe lag in LibreOffice Draw due to /etc/X11/Xsession.d/90atk-adaptor" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1584795
 * Sweet5hark looks
<attente> kenvandine: hi! here's the gtk with the copy-paste support: https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/gtk/mir-copy-paste. could you please use this to test the content-hub-glib branch?
<seb128> in fact doesn't seem to make a difference unsetting the env/without at-spi here
<seb128> opening that example and moving things with the keyboard is slow though
<kenvandine> attente, sure
<Trevinho> Sweet5hark: yeah, I knew it... Wondering it is already something usable in real world
<kenvandine> attente, can you get me a branch that builds on xenial?
<kenvandine> i need to test it on mir/unity8 on xenial
<kenvandine> Unmet build dependencies: libglib2.0-dev (>= 2.49.4) libwayland-dev (>= 1.9.91) wayland-protocols (>= 1.7)
<attente> i'll try
<dmj_s76> Trevinho: andyrock: Had a chance to dig into the HiDPI scaling issue in unity/u-s-d?
<attente> seb128: is there a udd branch for xenial gtk?
<seb128> attente, udd isn't really maintained/recommended anymore afaik
<attente> oh. ok. i guess i'll dput to a ppa then
<seb128> if you are talking about team packaging vcs, I don't think we did one
<seb128> but that would be easy
<attente> yeah, that's what i meant, i assumed that was the same as udd
<seb128> no, udd is the autoimport of packages uploaded to the archive
<seb128> but I guess we could branch from the version uploaded to xenial
<seb128> then push that a /xenial
<seb128> need to go for a bit now but I can help you with that tomorrow if you want
<attente> is it worth doing or too much trouble?
<seb128> it's easy enough to do
<attente> seb128: ok, no worries
<attente> seb128: i'll do a ppa instead
<seb128> if it makes work easier we should do it
<seb128> k, let's talk again tomorrow
<seb128> bbl
<attente> thanks seb128 :)
<seb128> yw!
 * flexiondotorg returns
<attente> kenvandine: can you try the gtk from here: https://launchpad.net/~attente/+archive/ubuntu/gtk-mir?field.series_filter=xenial
<attente> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/LmX9CTVx/
<kenvandine> attente, sure, but i need to finish up some other stuff first
<attente> i also have that in ~/.local/share/applications/ ^
<attente> kenvandine: sure, no hurry
<attente> kenvandine: thanks :)
<kenvandine> no problem
<kenvandine> i'm just in the middle of working on the trust session stuff... need a different build of content hub on my laptop at the moment :)
<kenvandine> attente, so i should test with gedit using that desktop file?
<attente> kenvandine: yes
<attente> kenvandine: it just has the added X-Ubuntu-Touch: true line
<attente> kenvandine: but when testing it, you might want to use ctrl+x/c/v instead of the menus since the window management is still pretty broken
<kenvandine> attente, yeah
<flexiondotorg> Night desktopers
<willcooke> night flexiondotorg
<popey> night john-boy
<willcooke> night pa
<willcooke> morning robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> willcooke, hi
<willcooke> just heading off now UOS is finished for the day
<willcooke> night all
<TheMuso> seb128: Saw it in bug mail, haven't tried to reproduce yet, honestly not familiar enough with libre office enough to work out what might be going on.
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-11-16
<CosmicTwitch> this is unbelievable. HOW MANY versions does it take to fix this keyring issue
<CosmicTwitch> every single time i open chrome the focus is lost and you cant switch to the query window
<CosmicTwitch> unless you click on it
<CosmicTwitch> is there a channel for gnome-keyring
<CosmicTwitch> perhaps I should try #gnome
<hikiko> hi
<FJKong> after building firefox, it takes 15G, aho
<Sweet5hark> moin
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning pitti!
<Sweet5hark> g'morn pitti didrocks
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, moin Sweet5hark!
<didrocks> hey Sweet5hark
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<pitti> goedemorgen seb128
<seb128> pitti, guten tag!
<seb128> wie gehts?
<pitti> prima, danke!
<seb128> still having the nice weather?
<seb128> seems it's going to be rainy all week here :-/
<pitti> seb128: FSVO "nice" -- it's been clear but ice cold since Saturday
<seb128> I take cold over wet any day
<pitti> actually today it started drizzling
 * seb128 needs to go for an appointement, back in an 1h
<willcooke> hi all
<flexiondotorg> Morning FJKong Sweet5hark pitti didrocks seb128 willcooke
<didrocks> hey flexiondotorg
<didrocks> @desktoppers: I think the design team needs some feedback on the convergent terminal replacement, do you mind giving your thoughts on https://insights.ubuntu.com/wp-content/uploads/d0de/16.10-terminal-and-browser-desktop-4.jpg ?
<meetingology> didrocks: Error: "desktoppers:" is not a valid command.
<didrocks> (I have mine, but don't want to influence you :))
<flexiondotorg> didrocks, I will.
<didrocks> thx :)
<flexiondotorg> I took part in a UX study in March and the terminal was something we discussed then.
<flexiondotorg> didrocks, How are you feeling?
<didrocks> flexiondotorg: coughing less and less, but I got my voice back! thanks! :)
<flexiondotorg> :-)
<didrocks> (well, still weak, but some sounds are out now ;))
<flexiondotorg> didrocks, Are you well enough to discuss a snap issue in #snappy?
<Laney> multipass
<flexiondotorg> 4th fav film ^
<flexiondotorg> Laney, morning.
<willcooke> Leeloo
<didrocks> flexiondotorg: sure!
<Laney> KORBEN DALLASSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
 * Laney nods flexiondotorg didrocks willcooke 
<didrocks> hey Laney
<willcooke> bzz bzzz bzz bzz
<davmor2> Morning all
<willcooke> howdy davmor2
<davmor2> willcooke: I'm assuming this is a mix of foundations and desktop on a uefi securebooted system aptd keeps locking up and using 100% of the cpu turns out it is because it isn't showing the you are installing a dkms package please set password for disabling secureboot :(  I;ll file a bug under update-manager but feel free to share the love with foundations
<willcooke> hm
<willcooke> thanks davmor2
<willcooke> odd
<seb128> back, took a bit longer than expected :-/
<willcooke> hey seb128 how goes?
<seb128> hey willcooke! good, bit tired though, alarm clock at 7am was not a good idea
<willcooke> ha
<seb128> well at least I got some work done before going for that appointement
<seb128> how are you?
<seb128> good convergence session yesterday?
<seb128> I watched a good part of it but had to go and missed the end
<willcooke> bit tired, was a late finish in the end, another hour past the end of the session
<willcooke> probably take off early on Friday
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, qengho do you know if Let's Encrypt is an included CA Cert in Firefox / Chromium?
<seb128> oh
<seb128> lot of questions?
<willcooke> I think it must be, but just want to make sure
<willcooke> seb128, nah, I had some more meetings
<seb128> oh ok
<chrisccoulson> willcooke, I'm not sure
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, np, I'll do some testing
<chrisccoulson> willcooke, https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/about/governance/policies/security-group/certs/
<chrisccoulson> There is a link there to the included ones
<chrisccoulson> (and ones pending inclusion)
<davmor2> willcooke: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/1642215
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1642215 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "Zesty updating a package that uses dkms is not triggering mokutil and causing aptd to use 100% cpu" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> davmor2: update-manager is still bdmurray, FWIW
<Laney> a full process list would be useful I'd reckon
<davmor2> Laney: Yeah I'll have to await the next set of updates as soon as I do and it locks up again I can add it
<Laney> you could probably downgrade something dkmsish
<Laney> stupid fifth element
<Laney> it's because I was looking at this package called 'asis'
<seb128> Laney, I was wondering about your aziz light on fb yesterday ;-)
<seb128> speaking of which, I wonder why some fb post have bigger text
<Laney> seb128: yeah I was shouting it all day
<Laney> I didn't understand why until I looked at excuses.html :P
<seb128> lol
<willcooke> flexiondotorg, not wishing to put yet another themeing problem on your plate, but how would you feel about looking at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-themes/+bug/1479054
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1479054 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu Xenial) "Shuffle and repeat buttons pressed state does not visually differ from unpressed state" [High,In progress]
<seb128> that would be a good one to fix indeed!
<willcooke> with a view to SRUing too
<flexiondotorg> willcooke, Added to my list.
<willcooke> flexiondotorg, merci
<rvr> Hi
<rvr> I am running unity8 on Xenial with the overlay, but I can't see the Store
<rvr> Is it available for installation?
<rvr> Yeah, available, installed but it's not showing up :-/
<seb128> rvr, hey, try asking on #ubuntu-unity that's where the unity8 team is, most of them don't read the desktop channel
<rvr> seb128: Ack
<tjaalton> anpok_: hi, how's libinput patch update doing?
<qengho> willcooke: Let's Encrypt works fine in Chromium, modulo the current cert bug.
<anpok_> tjaalton: each.. not yet tested..
<willcooke> thx qengho
<xnox> seb128, given there will not be 18.04 LTS for ubuntu desktop i386, are you going to continue built lts hwe xorg stacks and use them in the point releases?
<xnox> e.g. how would 16.04.5 i386 desktop image release will look like?
<seb128> that's a good question
<seb128> I don't know, we need to talk about that
<seb128> but I guess we do, the archive is not going away
<xnox> seb128, https://docs.google.com/document/d/1PrWnEF1wSmy5J85bJ2UJYDIx0fsvoYdBTWefUuDp5TQ/edit
<seb128> xnox, k
 * flexiondotorg goes to play Lego with my daughter during the UOS break...
<seb128> enjoy!
 * seb128 goes for sport
 * flexiondotorg returns
<willcooke> night all
<flexiondotorg> Night desktopers
<xnox> seb128, i shall not be publishing that draft now; or will reduce it to just down to i386.
<xnox> seb128, but maybe it needs further discussion on ubuntu-desktop
<xnox> mailing list
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-11-17
<duflu> robert_ancell: When you get time could you please put a fresh Xmir build on your todo list? Only one bug fix
<robert_ancell> duflu, for zesty?
<duflu> robert_ancell: zesty yes but it was reported on xenial overlay I think
<duflu> (arm64 frieza)
<robert_ancell> tjaalton, do you know the status of xfont2 into zesty?
<tjaalton> duflu: hi, have you tried porting xmir for xserver 1.19?
<duflu> tjaalton: Nope, sorry. Just reacting to a bug report from xenial overlay
<tjaalton> was looking at the git log
<tjaalton> robert quits irc too soon for me :)
<tjaalton> early i mean
<tjaalton> i have a patch that fixes some of the build errors, but not all
 * duflu goes for fresh air (but won't abandon you too)
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<duflu> Morning pitti, seb128
<duflu> Afternoon too
<seb128> hey duflu
<didrocks> hey pitti, duflu, re seb128!
<duflu> didrocks, good morning
<seb128> re didrocks
<pitti> bonjour seb128 ! je vais bien, merci ! bon basket hier soir; et toi ?
<pitti> salut didrocks !
<pitti> hey duflu
<hikiko> hey didrocks duflu seb128 pitti
<duflu> Morning hikiko
<pitti> hello hikiko, how are you?
<seb128> salut pitti, je vais bien aussi, bon tennis mais on a dÃ» arrÃªter Ã  20h30 Ã  cause de la pluie
<seb128> hey hikiko
<didrocks> hey hikiko
<hikiko> i am good :) making coffee :p
<flexiondotorg> Morning pitti seb128 duflu hikiko didrocks
<duflu> Hey flexiondotorg
<seb128> hey flexiondotorg, how are you?
<hikiko> hey flexiondotorg :)
<flexiondotorg> seb128, I am fixed :-D
<seb128> great!
<hikiko> :D
<didrocks> hey flexiondotorg
 * flexiondotorg is just nipping out for supplies...
<willcooke> o/
<hikiko> hi willcooke
<willcooke> morning hikiko!  How did the session go?  I saw OMG reported on it already!   Good job!
<TheMuso> Hey willcooke.
<hikiko> thank you :)
<Laney> meow
 * Laney just bagged a discount with virgin media
<willcooke> woot
<Laney> the woman on the phone said to phone every year and ask for a discount
<Laney> Â¬_Â¬
<hikiko> ?!
<hikiko> they can't make a discount automatically?
<Laney> they rely on people not wanting to ask and therefore paying the increased price
<davmor2> hikiko: they can but they get more money if they don't
<davmor2> Laney: virgin or sky is this?
<seb128> hey Laney willcooke davmor2
<seb128> how is the island today?
<willcooke> raining!
<seb128> stating the obvious!
<Laney> not here
<Laney> clear and nice
<davmor2> seb128: sunny here thank how's the continent
<Laney> hey seb128 & hikiko & willcooke & davmor2, how are you?
<Laney> davmor2: VM
<Laney> davmor2: this is my price journey https://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/vm.png
<Laney> same speed the whole time
<davmor2> Laney: the best results are achieved by calling the leaving line and saying you are moving to sky
<Laney> haha
<hikiko> there's something wrong in my city this year. we should have had temperatures like 6degrees right now, but we have like one cold day and then 6 sunny days with 15 degrees! and not much rain.. (we should have frequent rains during the winter!) /me likes the prolongued summer :p
<davmor2> Laney: I'm sadly serious we got the same package with a Â£32 discount to match sky's which meant I had more with them than sky for the same price as sky
<hikiko> Trevinho, here?
<Laney> davmor2: guess you have more leverage if you take TV too
 * Laney doesn't
<davmor2> Laney: ah yeah we have the full package and are thinking of moving our mobiles over if they can beat the data levels for a similar price other wise I'm off to giffgaff
<hikiko> Trevinho, "Please use MoveOptions::Mode::ModeNormal instead of 0." this doesn't compile :S
<hikiko> (moving windows review)
<Laney> hikiko: beach time?
<hikiko> hahaha almost :)
<Laney> I heard on the radio that 2016 is on track to be the warmest year ever, beating... 2015
<hikiko> it's funny the shops have winter clothes, christmas stuff and fake snow, and we still don't wear jackets
<duflu> hikiko: Indeed commercial Christmas started months ago here. The theme is sometimes fake snow, meanwhile summer is about to begin
<duflu> But whatever Hallmark says must be right
<hikiko> hahaha yeah! there you have summer now :)
<hikiko> isn't it super weird?
<duflu> Only for you it is
<hikiko> xmas spirit with that sun
<hikiko> not the summer
<hikiko> the christmas decorations
<hikiko> in the summer
<duflu> It's illogical but not weird when it's been that way for 100 years or so
<hikiko> :)
 * duflu is still waiting for a white Christmas
<hikiko> hahahahha
<duflu> Although if you count the blinding glare off beach sand, that's every year
<hikiko> yeah white christmas is rare in my city as well, we usually have snow on jan/feb
<hikiko> sand balls instead of snow balls :d
<duflu> Mud? Happy holidays!
<duflu> Hmm, actually we've probably been celebrating backwards Christmas for longer. Since 1788
<hikiko> Trevinho, ping :)
<Trevinho> hikiko: hey
<hikiko> hi :)
<hikiko> how are you?
<Trevinho> hikiko: ah, I read your ping before... But I forgot to reply afterwards :-P
<Trevinho> sorry
<hikiko> I have a question
<hikiko> yeah fixed that
<Trevinho> hikiko: good, yesterday morning was just a quick bad moment :)
<hikiko> cool :) glad you are fine now!
<hikiko> I have a question
<hikiko> on the upstart script
<hikiko> well
<hikiko> if you export the UNITY_LOW_GFX
<hikiko> or edit the config
<hikiko> the startup script will load the profile
<hikiko> but if you go to ccsm and check low gfx mode
<hikiko> you will have the old settings right?
<hikiko> or not?
<hikiko> It doesn't load the profile
<Laney> night homies
<flexiondotorg> Night.
<willcooke> night all
<Laney> ximion: THE POWER
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-11-18
<FJKong> morning desktop
<duflu> Morning FJKong
<FJKong> duflu: Mo
<hikiko> hello
<pitti> Laney: http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/running> wow, it's rare to see armhf outperform x86 :)
<pitti> there's been huge queues due to the glibc x/y SRUs and lots of new lowlevel libs in zesty
<Laney> morning!
 * Laney starts early today
<pitti> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey pitti
<Laney> very good, thanks!
<Laney> night in with fire + book last night, feeling relaxed
<Laney> how are you?
<pitti> oh, that sounds great
<pitti> Laney: my wife was away last night, so I watched Interstellar and ordered Pizza ;)
<Laney> hah
<Laney> not a bad way to spend an evening either
<pitti> Laney: are you doing much admin on the lxd slaves? I don't
<Laney> pitti: no, not seen any problems
<pitti> Laney: just checked, and all 8 are up and running, and only very few orphaned containers
<pitti> suspicious!
<Laney> meh
<Laney> how can glib go from sliding in with no forces to quite some regressions in a couple of days
<pitti> nplan is unrelated/my fault/flaky
<pitti> gnatcoll, that's still the unresolved ada bits -> ignore, no?
<pitti> duplicity certainly looks weird
<Laney> oh yeah, gnatcoll didn't migrate
<Laney> ubuntu2 works
<pitti> ah, so retry with &all-proposed=1 should work?
<Laney> I requeued with gnatcoll as an extra trigger
<pitti> ah, or that
<willcooke> morning all
<willcooke> TGIF
<pitti> hey willcooke
<willcooke> how goes pitti?  Are you going to Ubucon?
<pitti> willcooke: good, and no
<willcooke> :)
<pitti> too many sprints
<pitti> so I'm actually looking forward to a quiet weekend :)
<willcooke> very wise indeed!
<seb128> hey willcooke Laney pitti
<davmor2> Morning all
<seb128> sorry, went to get coffee after the morning email&co catchup
<seb128> and staying a bit longer than usual, reading news&politics ;-)
<pitti> you are totally not allowed to have coffee! it's bad for your health!
<seb128> I got orange juice as well!
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> reading news&politics? that's even worse for your health, pray go back to coffee :)
 * pitti donne une accolade Ã  seb128
<Laney> company news and company politics
<Laney> seb128 climbs the corporate ladder
<seb128> haha
 * seb128 hugs pitti back
<Laney> seb128: can you destroy deja-dup on zesty/s390x please?
<Laney> apparently u-c-c got deleted there without its rdeps being so
<seb128> do we know why u-c-c has been deleted?
<Laney> yes of course, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-control-center/15.04.0+16.10.20161003.1-0ubuntu2/+build/10993190 and https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/yakkety/s390x/libunity-control-center-dev
<seb128> hum
<seb128> that's still due to upstart missing I guess?
<Laney> probably comes down to that
<seb128> the situation is really suboptimal :-/
<seb128> but oh well, it's not likely to change
<seb128> so alright, I can delete one more thing
<Laney> like indicator-datetime -> ual -> upstart
<seb128> right
<Laney> upstart's going to be removed for 17.04 anyway ;-)
<seb128> I still think it would have been easier to fix upstart to build on s390x
<seb128> rather than dig ourselft down that hole
<seb128> but yeah, we might get there this cycle ;-)
<Laney> given the amount of hacks
<Laney> probably true
<xnox> seb128, two sides of the same coin - when there was upstart on s390x, loads of touch-unity things built, and then started to regress on big-endian, causing pain.
<xnox> dropping upstart all together would be my preference.
<seb128> xnox, I don't understand the link from building to regressing on big-endian
<xnox> oxide builds on s390x, passes adt tests, migrates, two weeks later, new oxide builds on s390x, fails adt tests, bogs down everything.
<xnox> that's kind of why steve started to remove upstart on s390x.
<xnox> we ain't gonna support it there, and it's not used on that architecture at all.
<xnox> we should not have built upstart in the first place on s390x, at first everything built, then created mess, and back-paddling out if it - is also very messy =/
<seb128> xnox, well, endianness bugs are valid issues and should be fixed and not papering away by deleting binaries...
<seb128> that hasn't to do with upstart
<xnox> there is that too.
<willcooke> tjaalton, hey, do you know if we have anyone officially maintaining AMD video drivers?
<willcooke> cc jcastro ^
<davidcalle> willcooke: cf your email: unity7 or 8?
<willcooke> davidcalle, 7
<willcooke> I found the online music and the video one so far - others go directly to the servers of those services
<willcooke> so videosearch.u.c and productsearch.u.c
<davidcalle> willcooke: can you see this file? https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~curucu-hackers/curucu/scope-runner-v2/view/head:/configs/scopes-py3.yaml
<willcooke> davidcalle, yes! thanks
<davidcalle> Should be it, but let me check if that's all
<willcooke> thanks davidcalle
<davidcalle> willcooke: curl https://productsearch.ubuntu.com/smartscopes/v1/remote-scopes | jq
<willcooke> Rick Astley!!!
<davidcalle> willcooke: that's the correct list :)
<davidcalle> Ahahaha
<willcooke> nice one, thanks davidcalle
<tjaalton> willcooke: tseliot
<willcooke> thanks tjaalton jcastro ^
<anpok> tjaalton: hi
<anpok> tjaalton: so I have built libinput 1.50.1 with rebased patches..
<anpok> looks good on mx4
<anpok> I think the bugfix for the mx4 button events is still necessary
<tjaalton> anpok: ok cool, email me the patch
<Trevinho> pitti: hey, for autopkg it seems there are some problems when using ftp sources as ftp_source env var is not set... Not sure is something only related to snapcraft tho.
<Trevinho> Can you see the discussion here please https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/900 ?
<pitti> Trevinho: I don't think our data center proxy allows ftp
<pitti> you must use http
<pitti> also, /me on way out, sorry
<seb128> hey Trevinho
<seb128> how are you?
<Trevinho> seb128: hey, sorry.. I had to leave just after the question :-D
<Trevinho> seb128: good, I'm just back from the store where I got 6kgs of meat... Tomorrow night, I'm organizing a dinner with friends, and lots of sous-vide cooked meat :-D
<seb128> nice
<seb128> sounds like a fun party
<seb128> is there a special occasion? or just feeling like cooking for lot of people? ;-)
<Trevinho> yeah, we'll see...
<Trevinho> No, was... Hey let's do this meat dinner. And it was supposed to be for 5-6 people... Then  they become 8, then 12... Now they're 17.
<Trevinho> So need even more meat... :-D
<Laney> right this is where early start and short lunch pays off
<Laney> happy weekend! ;-)
<Trevinho> you too Laney !
<seb128> Laney, to you too! any fancy plans?
<Trevinho> In theory a friend of mine should have done the mushrooms based first meal, but we're so many that the mushrooms he picked aren't enough  :-/
<seb128> Trevinho, good luck with the cooking :-)
<seb128> you can tell us all the fun stories on monday!
<Trevinho> hopefully :)
<Trevinho> seb128: any plan for you?
<seb128> relaxing and some "house" work tomorrow (connecting some new equipement for living room and getting some furnitures set) and going to France on sunday
<willcooke> night all, have a good one
<seb128> have a good w.e desktopers!
<qengho> o/
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-11-20
<ivo_> Can you help me with setting up the system locale. I want to use German Date Format but English words.
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-11-13
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> re seb128
<seb128> re :)
<willcooke> morning
<thumper> o/ willcooke
<thumper> o/ seb128 and didrocks
<didrocks> hey willcooke, evening thumper :)
<seb128> hey willcooke thumper
<seb128> how are you?
<thumper> good
<thumper> spending my time tonight looking for a resource leak
<thumper> just found it
<thumper> running test suite with the fix to see if I broke anything else :)
<didrocks> thumper: juju was mentioned on the 8 year celebration blog post of Go ;)
<thumper> oh?
<didrocks> https://blog.golang.org/8years
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers!
<didrocks> hey hey oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, Ã§a va?
<didrocks> Ã§a va bien, et toi ?
<seb128> lut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<oSoMoN> bien
<oSoMoN> pas trÃ¨s reposÃ©, mais bien :)
<oSoMoN> didrocks, seb128: when you have a moment, please add a word of support or two to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OlivierTilloy/PPUApplication
<Laney> hey hey
<oSoMoN> hey Laney
<seb128> oSoMoN, oh, sure
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you? good w.e?
<seb128> oSoMoN, le w.e c'est fait pour s'amuser et la semaine pour se reposer non ? ;-)
<didrocks> morning Laney
<oSoMoN> seb128, Ã§a câest la thÃ©orieâ¦ :)
<seb128> :-)
<Laney> hey oSoMoN didrocks seb128
<Laney> seb128: great!
<Laney> family visiting, went for walks / beer / meals
<Laney> you?
<oSoMoN> I had a gargantuan raclette for lunch yesterday, that was the highlight of the week-end :)
<Laney> :D
<oSoMoN> seb128, so LO in bionic is still failing to build because linebreak functionality is broken with ICU 60. There's an upstream bug report (https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113705) but they don't seem to be in a hurry to address it. Do you reckon IÂ should invest time in fixing it myself, or do we skip the corresponding unit test temporarily to allow the package to build, knowing that actual functional
<oSoMoN> ity is broken?
<ubot5> bugs.documentfoundation.org bug 113705 in framework "linebreak unit test failure when building against libicu 60.1" [Normal,Assigned]
<seb128> oSoMoN, do we need the update to migrate now? or is it fine to keep it in proposed for a while?
<oSoMoN> seb128, it's fine to have it in proposed, but it's blocking the 5.4.2 SRU for artful
<seb128> oSoMoN, do you know what user visible impact it has? like what is not working correctly in libreoffice?
<oSoMoN> linebreak is not going to work correctly
<oSoMoN> this will be most visible in writer
<seb128> oSoMoN, SRUs don't require to have the change out of proposed, just to have it uploaded so it doesn't get forgotten
<oSoMoN> seb128, ah that's a good point, then I'll ping the SRU team to unblock it
<ricotz> oSoMoN, seb128, hi, lo is the last item blocking the icu transition to complete
<seb128> oSoMoN, thanks
<oSoMoN> yeah, I know
<seb128> ricotz, well, somebody who cares about icu needs to fix that bug then
<seb128> and hey :)
<ricotz> oSoMoN, I got the impression it is "just" an behaviour change, e.g. icu/unicode allows breaks on "/" to wrap url or the like
<seb128> oSoMoN, but in any case we are not forcing in buggy softwares so that option isn't a valid one
<seb128> oSoMoN, I would keep it in  proposed for now until somebody who cares enough investigate/fixes it
<ricotz> oSoMoN, but this is better to be investigated by upstream
<seb128> (which might end up being us, but I wouldn't drop everything else for that yet)
<ricotz> I would assume upstream bumps to icu 60 with lo 6.0 which will result in a more pressing need for them to fix it
<oSoMoN> ricotz, I agree, but it doesn't look like they're very interested in fixing it, given that they ship an older copy of ICU with LO
<oSoMoN> ricotz, is there any strong indication they intend to bump to 60 with 6.0 ?
<oSoMoN> or just an assumption?
<ricotz> oSoMoN, right, especially for the 5.4 branch, but the fix should be backportable
<ricotz> just an assumption
<oSoMoN> what IÂ can do is test writer in an i386 VM and see the extent of the linebreak issue
<oSoMoN> if it's not too bad then we can just skip the unit test temporarily
<ricotz> I agree
<ricotz> oSoMoN, fyi, I will copy 5.4.3 to the main PPAs later today
<andyrock> seb128: hey regarding gnome-disk-utility showing snap squashfs
<seb128> hey andyrock
<andyrock> gnome-disk-utility maintainers agreed to accept the patch to skip devices marked as UDISK_IGNORED
<andyrock> but we still need to add an udev rule somewhere
<andyrock> maybe inside the snap deb package?
<seb128> andyrock, oh, nice
<seb128> andyrock, do you have an idea what the udev rule would be already?
<oSoMoN> ricotz, ack, thanks
<andyrock> seb128: I've already a working one. Let me check if I can make it less generic
<andyrock> making sure it will filter just snap squashfs
<seb128> andyrock, right, I'm asking because it might make sense in different packages according to what is in the rule
<seb128> andyrock, if you have a way to flag snaps mount only the snapd package makes sense imho
<Laney> indeed
<andyrock> mmm skipping ignored devices is not an option anymore
<andyrock> we could filter for devices mounted in /snap
<andyrock> but does snapd mounts always in /snap in all ditros?
<seb128> andyrock, that's a question for #snappy or the snapcraft forum
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, hi, do you have a moment?
<bigon> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1713457 << an idea about this?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1713457 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "DNS search domain not removed from resolv.conf on disconnect" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<bigon> this is quite annoying
<seb128> bigon, I don't think we have much n-m people around, maybe cyphermox or xnox on #ubuntu-devel would know
<zhaoqiang> hi
<seb128> bigon, you might want to report it upstream, more chance to get a reply there
<Laney> andyrock: out of interest, why is not an option?
<seb128> didrocks, uploading https://launchpadlibrarian.net/344786398/gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock_0.8.1_source.changes to artful was an error right? (it's in the queue, asking before rejecting)
<seb128> Laney, willcooke, do you if robert plans to do a gnome-software SRU to 17.10 and when? https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-software/ubuntu-artful has quite some segfaults & other issues fixed, it would probably make sense to do an upload now
<Laney> not sure but 3.26.2 came out the other day
<seb128> he was waiting on that?
<jbicha> bigon: do you experience that NM bug on Debian too?
<Laney> I don't know, but it would be sensible to upload that
<bigon> jbicha, seb128 it's the laptop of a coleague
<bigon> IIRC I don't see that on debian
<bigon> could be a problem with resolvconf
<ogra_> resolvconf is dead and gone (well ... to universe)
<seb128> systemd-resolved?
<ogra_> yeah
<andyrock> Laney: there are other partitions marked with the HintIgnore that should be shown
<bigon> it's not installed by default in 17.10
<bigon> ?
<bigon> mmh
<bigon> vpnc is pulling it on that laptop
<bigon> 13:57 < ogra_> resolvconf is dead and gone (well ... to universe) << uninstalling resolveconf is fixing the probleme here
<ogra_> do-release-upgrade or update-manager should have removed it actually
<bigon> it's pulled by vpnc
<bigon> (or vpn-scripts)
<koza> willcooke, hey man, what are the chances PA 11 lands in bionic? rmadison shows v10 packaged as of today
<ogra_> bigon, ah, that should be fixed then
<willcooke> koza, pretty good, duflu was looking at it before hols.  1 sec
<willcooke> koza, https://trello.com/c/2Cy6kdqt
<koza> willcooke, sweet
<ricotz> oSoMoN, fyi, https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/#/c/44665/
<willcooke> restart, brb
<Trevinho> Hola desktoppers!
<Trevinho> I'm back to the digital world....
<willcooke> hey Trevinho!  How you doing :)
<seb128> hey Trevinho! welcome back! how are you?
<seb128> still in America?
<Trevinho> Hi willcooke and seb128...
<Trevinho> Yeah, MÃ©xico
<Trevinho> But I had great time in Cuba
<seb128> did you have good holidays? did you manage to really stay away from the keyboard? :)
<seb128> nice!
<Trevinho> A place to be
<Trevinho> Yes
<Trevinho> No laptops with me... No connection a part in some public parks where it's 1$/hour
<Trevinho> And not really reliable
<seb128> nice
<Trevinho> So... Lots of social interactions, using the great social network they have there in human relationships
<Trevinho> Basically what we have here with airbnb and uber, there exists for years just using the word of mouth
<ogra_> uuh ... VoA protocol .. scary
<oSoMoN> welcome back Trevinho
<Laney> hey Trevinho
<Laney> happy email day
<oSoMoN> ricotz, interesting. I don't see changes related to linebreak though
<Trevinho>  Hi oSoMoN and Laney
<ricotz> oSoMoN, yes, not part of it and this is blocked by your bug report of course, but there is movement
<didrocks> seb128: ok, I'm having a dÃ©ja-vu impression, I thought I removed it (and yeah, grrrr dch -r "")
<didrocks> seb128: deleting it, I have the page opened
<seb128> didrocks, k, thanks
<didrocks> thanks for noticing :)
<seb128> np!
<didrocks> ah
<didrocks> Rejection comment required.
<didrocks> probably why it didn't remove (I'm only adding them for others ;))
<seb128> "do what I say"
<seb128> :p
<didrocks> heh
<didrocks> so, I wasn't dreaming I tried to remove it already :p
<seb128> I've probably got bitten by that a few times as well
<oSoMoN> ricotz, that's encouraging
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, ping
<ricotz> see pm
<seb128> ricotz, you maybe better ask on channels, other might be able to help?
<ricotz> seb128, it is a very-specific firefox packaging problem which also hit the current 57 build due some late cherry-picking
<seb128> k
<ricotz> thanks, but honestly you can't help here
<seb128> well we are trying to get out of Chris being the only one to look at firefox
<seb128> that doesn't work if people ping him only directly
<ricotz> I know, this part is more trial and error for me still
<ricotz> regarding distro-specific searchplugins patching
<ricotz> is there some mass-rebuilding of snaps going on?
<ricotz> seb128, ^
 * Laney doesn't know of one if there is
<kenvandine> ricotz, i've been building a bunch of snaps today :)
<kenvandine> all done now though
<seb128> ricotz, k
<ricotz> kenvandine, ah, I see
<chrisccoulson> hi ricotz
<chrisccoulson> yeah, I'll take a look at that issue
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, I have reverted the corresponding changes https://paste.debian.net/plain/995512
<ricotz> but I guess a proper fix to deal with those would be nice
 * kenvandine just realized that "snap refresh" will refresh all installed snaps
<kenvandine> wished i had discovered that sooner :)
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, is this the only change you made compared to the beta branches? https://paste.debian.net/plain/995518
<jbicha> robert_ancell: good afternoon
<jbicha> we were wondering today/yesterday whether you were going to be doing a gnome-software/artful SRU soon since 3.26.2 was released recently
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-11-14
<robert_ancell> jbicha: I was waiting on jibel doing a QA run on it
<jbicha> good idea
<robert_ancell> jbicha: it's all in ppa:ubuntu-desktop/gnome-software
<robert_ancell> and the packaging branches
<jbicha> do you intend to update it with 3.26.2?
<robert_ancell> jbicha: I was expecting that in a following release, but it could be rolled in. I'll email jibel and check where he's at with it.
<robert_ancell> jbicha: was there anything in particular to take from 3.26.2?
<jbicha> I wasn't looking for anything particular, just wondering how far along QA was
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<oSoMoN> good morning seb128
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, Ã§a va ?
<Laney> hey hey
<didrocks> hey oSoMoN, morning Laney
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<oSoMoN> hey didrocks, hey Laney
<oSoMoN> seb128, Ã§a va, et toi?
<willcooke> morning all
<seb128> oSoMoN, Ã§a va bien !
<seb128> salut willcooke
<oSoMoN> mornin' willcooke
<Laney> hey didrocks seb128 oSoMoN willcooke
<Laney> seb128: yeah i'm alright
<Laney> downstairs lights started tripping the circuit though
<Laney> i just opened it up and it's a bit wet in there :|
<Laney> how about you?
<seb128> be careful
<Laney> it's off at the main switch
<Laney> annoying though
<Laney> must be coming through from the bathroom above
<_amano> https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=GNOME-Shell-4-Proposals --> both proposals will take ages to inplement. Can MIR be hacked to do what they want? To sit between Wayland and GNOME Shell?
<_amano> Maybe Andrea can hack a prototype/proof of concept for next GUADEC. It would be a nice conclusion to the whole MIR drama/story arc ;)
<willcooke> alan_g, Saviq  ^ might be up your alley?
<seb128> that sounds like a weird idea
 * alan_g takes a look
<alan_g> RAOF: maybe we should add ^ to the agenda this morning? (Although on a quick reading it is just re-inventing Mir)
<RAOF> ???
<alan_g> https://wiki.gnome.org/Initiatives/Wayland/GnomeShell/GnomeShell4
<RAOF> Ah, yay!
<RAOF> A link, rather than a click-capturing summary!
<alan_g> _amano> Maybe Andrea can hack a prototype/proof of concept for next GUADEC. It would be a nice conclusion to the whole MIR drama/story arc ;)
<RAOF> Heh. Yeah.
<oSoMoN> didrocks, thanks for the endorsement :)
<didrocks> oSoMoN: yw! ;)
 * pitti bids good morning to the fine Ubuntu desktoppers
<pitti> Laney: ah, having fun with the lxd runners again? (just saw your wiki edit)
<didrocks> hey hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> I'm  great, thanks! wrestling with chrome-headless for testing.. yourself?
<didrocks> I'm good, thanks! Funny to navigate in the Shell between C and javascript :p
<Laney> hey pitti
<Laney> nice to see you keeping an eye ;-)
<Laney> tests are hitting ENOSPC so I'm reducing parallelism a bit and adding another couple of instances
<pitti> didrocks: heh, sounds like my life :)
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, that's what I reckon when seeing your Cockpit work :p
<pitti> Laney: yeah, I still like that baby of mine :)
<Laney> we have arm64 and s390x clouds now
<pitti> yeah, I noticed s390x; great to see progress there!
<pitti> arm64 already existed during my time, but we didn't run that arch in britney yet due to capacity issues
<Laney> right, it's a full cloud now
<oSoMoN> chrisccoulson, thanks for the endorsement!
<oSoMoN> chrisccoulson, oh, and thanks for publishing chromium 62.0.3202.89, too!
<jibel> cannot upgrade to 18.04 under wayland. the release upgrader crashed :/
<ogra_> jbicha, time to add it to the list on bug 1713313 ? :)
<ubot5> bug 1713313 in xdiagnose (Ubuntu) "Unable to launch pkexec'ed applications on Wayland session" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1713313
<jibel> ogra_, slightly different failure mode, it segfaults
<ogra_> ouch
<xclaesse> Hm, totem in 17.10 cannot play any video on wayland session :/
<xclaesse> seems caused by vaapi
<willcooke> xclaesse, we're just about to start our meeting, would you mind logging a bug and we can take a look.
<willcooke> (in the meantime, I'll do some testing here)
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Nov 14 14:31:08 2017 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic:
<kenvandine> o/
<willcooke> Roll call:  andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu (hols), jbicha, jamesh (out), jibel/heber, kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<oSoMoN> ð¸/
<andyrock> o?
<andyrock> o/
<didrocks> hey!
<jibel> hi
 * didrocks decided to crash the Shell just *NOW*
<seb128> hey
<willcooke> Just going to give people another minute and we can get started
<Laney> meow
<kenvandine> woof
 * willcooke kicks off a big buck bunny download 
<willcooke> ok, let's go
<willcooke> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: andyrock
<andyrock> 1) WIP: Livepatch - Software Properties integration
<andyrock> 2) WIP: Removing snaps loops devices from gnome-disk-utilities.
<andyrock> 3) WIP: Properly scaling appindicator icons in gnome-shell
<willcooke> thanks andyrock
<willcooke> andyrock, eof?
<andyrock> yep
<willcooke> ta
<andyrock> not much this week
<willcooke> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: dgadomski
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> * fixed regression in cups - bug #1729910
<dgadomski> * did some tests regarding python TLS1.2 support on Trusty - looks like it's all supported thanks to underlying openssl, but it's not possible to force TLS1.1 or 1.2 from Python - one needs to depened on the other endpoint or openssl
<dgadomski> * analysed what does pcp needs libpapi for (bug #1700827 and bug #1704130) - looks like it's really useful and should be included in main as well
<ubot5> bug 1729910 in cups (Ubuntu Artful) "lp ignores ~/.cups/lpoptions in 17.10" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1729910
<ubot5> bug 1700827 in pcp (Ubuntu) "[MIR] pcp package" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1700827
<ubot5> bug 1704130 in papi (Ubuntu) "[MIR] papi" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1704130
<dgadomski> eof
<willcooke> thanks dgadomski
<willcooke> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: didrocks
<didrocks> hey!
<didrocks> * GNOME Shell:
<didrocks>   - got some initial feedback on extension vs mode (but needs them to check with design), mode some first modifications and post them on https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=789852#c8
<ubot5> Gnome bug 789852 in general "Ensure extensions parts of a mode are from system, report back correct status for g-s-extension-prefs" [Normal,New]
<didrocks>   - Work on design's volume level override proposal. Patched gsettings-desktop-schemas, gnome-settings-daemon, gnome-shell (will need to patch g-c-c once I get a design for it). More info on https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=790280, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=790281 and https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=710424.
<didrocks> * Dash to Dock:
<ubot5> Gnome bug 790280 in general "Volume up key sets volume back to 100%, if volume previously surpassed 100%" [Normal,New]
<ubot5> Gnome bug 790281 in general "Volume up key sets volume back to 100%, if volume previously surpassed 100%" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<didrocks>   - Work on enhancing Dock transparent behavior, got some feedback upstream on how to change it.
<ubot5> Gnome bug 710424 in media-keys "Volume up key sets volume back to 100%, if volume previously surpassed 100%" [Normal,New]
<didrocks> Community theme announcement, both on a blog post and on the hub: https://didrocks.fr/2017/11/09/welcome-to-the-ubuntu-bionic-age-a-new-ubuntu-default-theme-call-for-participation/
<didrocks> * More discussions on the hub and french forum
<didrocks> .
<willcooke> thanks didrocks
<willcooke> #topic jbicha
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: jbicha
<willcooke> guess jbicha isnt around today
<willcooke> #topic jackpot51
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: jackpot51
<willcooke> damn it, sorry jackpot51
<willcooke> #topic jamesh
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: jamesh
<willcooke> jamesh, please let me have your update by email
<willcooke> and set yourself a reminder to send it last thing on a Tuesday
<seb128> that's a recurrent issue :/
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> #topic jibel
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: jibel
<willcooke> or heber
<jibel> - Deployed installer tests for Bionic.
<jibel> - Upgrade tests from xenial to bionic are passing, adding more tests.
<jibel> - Review of gnome-software in desktop PPA in preparation of the SRU to artful.
<jibel> - Maintenance of the testing infrastructure / Re-organize / clean-up jenkins jobs.
<jibel> - Added "launch a snap" tests in ubuntu-system-tests.
<jibel> ...
<willcooke> thanks jibel
<willcooke> good stuff
<willcooke> #topic kenvandine
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: kenvandine
<kenvandine> * Updated some of the GNOME snaps to the latest stable release
<kenvandine> * More work on the contacts-service and calendar-service interfaces, namely creating a simple test snap that can be used for testing.
<kenvandine> * Continued updating the gnome-contacts and gnome-calendar strict snaps for local testing
<kenvandine> * gnome-calculator snapcraft.yaml accepted upstream.  I setup an automated snap build from master to publish to the edge channel and switched the stable series to publish to the candidate channel.  I think this is the model we'll use for the rest of the GNOME snaps as well.
<kenvandine> https://imgur.com/a/85Hta
<willcooke> congrats on the upstreaming, and thanks GNOME Calculator devs
<kenvandine> gnome-calculator 3.27.2 (master) built in the edge channel :)
<willcooke> nice
<seb128> great
<kenvandine> we'll keep edge bleeding
<Laney> nice
<kenvandine> never promote to stable
<Laney> how does the automated build work?
<Laney> git mirror in launchpad?
<kenvandine> git mirror
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> simple
<Laney> like me
<kenvandine> yup!
<kenvandine> that's it for me
<Laney> :((((((((((((((((((((((
<kenvandine> :))))))))))))))))))
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: Laney
<Laney> o
<Laney> â¢ Debugged & fixed a britney crash in the email sending policy
<Laney> â and a separate logic error when deciding who to email when packages are promoted from universe to main while in proposed
<Laney> â¢ Otherwise, continuation weekâ¢
<Laney> â¢ Worked a lot more on the kernel hang bug in lcy01 with the kernel team
<Laney> â¢ Feedback on in-progress gnome-software PRs, required some refactoring
<Laney> â Richard wants some larger restructuring on the shell extensions plugin to support my work there, not sure how much time I should spend on that
<Laney> â¢ snap seeding - germinate now parses snaps in seeds and outputs them to a foo.snap file, need to fix up some small issues and then submit that to get review
<Laney> ð¤·
<kenvandine> yay
<willcooke> nice one, thanks Laney
<seb128> Laney, those PRs are on gitlab?
<willcooke> lets talk about the g-s stuff later
<seb128> I tried to have a look the other week but couldn't find them
<Laney> yes sir
<seb128> k
<Laney> i think it's private or something
<seb128> weird :-/
<Laney> you can ask to get added
<seb128> "open source" people? ;)
<kenvandine> lol
<Laney> well I think that it's because it is a mirror only to allow PRs and it'd be confusing to have it there while git.g.o is still the canonical source
<Laney> they have that with the github mirrors already
<seb128> anyway not the place/time for that discussion I guess
<willcooke> nod, lets move on
<Laney> I can push my branches to gnome git if you want to see them
<seb128> no it's fine, I just find it weird to keep things behind closed door for GNOME
<Laney> ya
<Laney> there was some reason they couldn't just move over to gitlab completely
<Laney> forgot what it was though
<Laney> ENDS
<willcooke> #topic oSoMoN
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey
<oSoMoN> â¢ chromium
<oSoMoN>   â updated chromium dev to 64.0.3253.3 then 64.0.3260.2, updated snap and published to edge channel
<oSoMoN>   â updated chromium beta to 63.0.3239.40, and updated snap in the beta channel
<oSoMoN>   â updated chromium stable to 62.0.3202.89, now published in -security and -updates for all supported series (thanks Chris), and updated snap in stable channel (with a short staging period in the candidate channel)
<oSoMoN>   â currently updating chromium stable to 62.0.3202.94
<oSoMoN>   â investigated bug #1714244 and lowered its importance
<ubot5> bug 1714244 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "[snap] apparmor denials on /etc/chromium-browser/policies/" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1714244
<oSoMoN>   â fixed bug #1652110 in PPA tracking the beta channel, will reach users with the next major update (63), in about 3 weeks from now
<ubot5> bug 1652110 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "Chromium 55+ doesn't support Widevine library" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1652110
<oSoMoN>   â got my PPU application endorsed, added myself to the next DMB meeting's agenda (next Monday) for review
<oSoMoN> â¢ libreoffice
<oSoMoN>   â build failure in bionic due to transition to ICU 60 (https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=113705), verified that disabling that one failing unit test makes the build succeed, poked upstream and waiting to see if they fix it soon before going with the disabled test
<ubot5> bugs.documentfoundation.org bug 113705 in framework "linebreak unit test failure when building against libicu 60.1" [Normal,Assigned]
<oSoMoN>   â SRU of 5.4.2 to artful accepted by SRU team, but need to re-upload with a tweaked version number
<oSoMoN> â¢ other
<oSoMoN>   â tested tracker and wrote my experience on the hub
<oSoMoN>   â added my feedback to the thread about guest session
<oSoMoN> â
<willcooke> excellent, thanks oSoMoN
<seb128> oSoMoN, sorry about the version number thing for the SRU
<seb128> I should have hinted to change it before upload
<oSoMoN> no worries, that's my mistake
<seb128> though technically the one they rejected is not used so they could have accepted it
<oSoMoN> hopefully I learn from it
<seb128> :-)
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> â¢ had 2 vac days
<seb128> â¢ most of the rest of the week spent reviewing the 17.10 feedback and recent bugs reports still (activity is slowing down on that front now)
<seb128> â¢ reviewed work for next cycle/trello
<seb128> </week>
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> - cups/ups-filters snap: Continued work on creating the snap. Without restrictions it works perfectly now, on a Ubuntu Desktop classic system (Bionic) in parallel to the system's CUPS and cups-browsed (system on port 631 and snap on port 10631). Both CUPS instances are sharing their printers to the other. Printing (with filters) works. PDF interpreter is Poppler, as there are some features of cups-filters only working with Poppler.
<tkamppeter> - cups/ups-filters snap: Started working on confinement. Asked for help and discussed on https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/snapping-cups-printing-stack-avahi-support-system-users-groups/1502. Planned is a snap with strict confinement to work on both Classic and Core and also auto-detect whether there is already a system CUPS to automatically decide whether the snap's CUPS should run on port 631 or 10631. This snap should then serve both as the printi
<tkamppeter> ng stack for core and as a platform for snapped drivers on both Core and Classic.
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Added more patches for braille embossing.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<willcooke> Good work on the snap tkamppeter
<seb128> +1
<Laney> man I've love to see one of those braille things
<willcooke> I bet they make an excellent noise
<willcooke> lots of clacking
<willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<willcooke> - Helped Fedora diagnose snap installs not working in F27
<willcooke> - Updated snapd REST API documentation
<willcooke> - Implement new snapd APIs in snapd-glib
<willcooke> - Investigate work required for guest sessions in 18.04, asked on Community hub for feedback on usefulness.
<willcooke> - snapd-glib 1.25, 1.26 releases
<willcooke> - simple-scan 3.27.2 release
<tkamppeter> Laney, they are in the cups-filters package, so simply connect an embosser to Ubuntu. You can even emboss photos so that blinds can see/feel them.
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: AOB
<willcooke> Anyone got anything else?
<Laney> simply buy this 10k piece of hardware!
<tkamppeter> Laney but do not expect 50 MPixel for that.
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> gnome-software
<seb128> there was a SRU mentioned earlier?
<seb128> but it's not in Robert's summary
<seb128> and launchpad bugs haven't been updated for one yet
<seb128> does anyone know if we plan to do one and when?
<seb128> there is a stack of issues which have available fixes
<Laney> he's waiting for QA to sign off
<seb128> is that the one in https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ubuntu/gnome-software/+packages ?
<jibel> seb128, Robert plan to do the SRU with the content of the PPA once it's reviewed
<jibel> which I finished today
<seb128> k, so not 3.26.2 as Laney suggested?
<jibel> the ppa is ubuntu-desktop/gnome-software
<seb128> k
<seb128> well I guess .2 can be another round later
<seb128> thanks guys
<Laney> that could be more visible
<jibel> yeah, the idea is to release what is already fixed and do another one afterwards
<seb128> (the bugs could be SRU compliant already with an hint that there is a ppa)
<Laney> how does he request that you test it?
<seb128> but that's feedback for Robert
<jibel> Laney, by email
<seb128> right, I was going to say, seems suboptimal that only QA was asked to test
<Laney> could there be a card or something?
<jibel> he should just do the SRU and ask for a review once it's in the queue
<Laney> fair enough, maybe you can give that feedback
<Trevinho> Oh, I wasn't pinged...
<seb128> hey Trevinho :)
<Trevinho> not really much to report about this week though, but I had some for the one I was leaving
<willcooke> sorry Trevinho, I figured your feedback was "on holiday"
<Laney> awkward...
<Laney> :D
<seb128> still time to fix it
<willcooke> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: Trevinho
<willcooke> "on holiday"
<seb128> :-)
<willcooke> anything you want to add Trevinho?
<seb128> he's trolling us :p
<didrocks> clearly :p
<willcooke> PUT DOWN THE COCKTAIL
<willcooke> meh, he's gone swimming I think.
<seb128> lol
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team weekly meeting - 2017-11-14 | Current topic: AOB
<seb128> yeah, let's wrap then?
<willcooke> Anyone got anything else
<seb128> I don't
<willcooke> #endmeting
<willcooke> #endmeteing
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Nov 14 14:59:20 2017 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2017/ubuntu-desktop.2017-11-14-14.31.moin.txt
<seb128> #tryagain
<willcooke> ffs
<willcooke> thanks all
<seb128> thanks!
<willcooke> I need a bigger font, or better glasses
<didrocks> thanks!
<didrocks> question to native speakers (Laney, willcooke?): how do you name when you are above maximum level (like sound > 100%), "Override" has been rejected, I want to use it for things like SetFooLeve, FooColor and suchâ¦
 * willcooke ponders
<Laney> didrocks: sorry, don't understand the context you want to use it in
<jibel> didrocks, "up to eleven" ;)
<didrocks> Laney: for volume above 100%, how do you name that, the zone between 100% and the max_max_level ?
<oSoMoN> LOUDER
<didrocks> well, some are on a slider
<didrocks> on a generic bar
<Laney> but you need to use it in variable names or something?
<didrocks> (so not only for volume)
<didrocks> yes
<didrocks> https://raw.githubusercontent.com/gnome-design-team/gnome-mockups/master/shell/volume-overdrive-status.png
<didrocks> like here
<didrocks> the "red zone" :)
<didrocks> overdrive? :p
<Laney> meh
<Laney> maybe?
<Laney> is this word ever used in the UI?
<didrocks> no, only code
<didrocks> well, it's in the theme
<didrocks> so, OverdriveColor?
<didrocks> overdrive-separator-width
<didrocks> and suchâ¦
<didrocks> sound decent for you?
<Laney> meh maybe
<kenvandine> overmax?
<Laney> it's not very clear what it is
<kenvandine> over_max ?
<Laney> does it have to be short? volume-over-100 ...
<didrocks> kenvandine: but over-max < max_level
<didrocks> Laney: no, but it's not volume specific
<didrocks> it's a generic bar
<kenvandine> didrocks, then no
<didrocks> which can have that red zone
<jibel> volume boost?
<Laney> haha
<Laney> this is a weird element
<Trevinho> willcooke, seb128: sorry, black out here... And neither 4g worked for a bit.... I'll paste things later, once net is back
<didrocks> I think let's go for overdrive, it seems the less confusing to you?
<Laney> just call it the overdrive area and document what it is
<didrocks> sounds good! thanks guys :)
<seb128> Trevinho, yeah yeah yeah
<seb128> Trevinho, no problem :)
<Trevinho> seb128: and... Back and out again. Uff.
<seb128> Trevinho, for how long are you staying in that place? ;)
<Trevinho> seb128: last week, but it used to be stable before... Just all the condo went out. And it's sunny, weird
<seb128> Trevinho, ok, don't worry too much about it, I'm sure you have things you can work on even without a stable internet right? ;)
<Trevinho> Anyway back again, let's see how long it lasts now... Then moving to the coworking.... But no pool or cocktail time. I don't like get wet in the "early" morning :-)
<Trevinho> Ok, so the list was...
<Trevinho> Â· Not much to report for this week, just back from holidays and syncing with backlog
<Trevinho> Â· Last things done before leaving (and not reported in the subsequent meeting) were:
<Trevinho>  Â· Debugged and fixed https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=788931
<Trevinho>    (needs cleanup I'm doing now)
<Trevinho>  Â· Sent fractional scaling branch for review after fixing some missing parts
<Trevinho>    and scaling properly loaded images
<Trevinho>    (https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=765011)
<ubot5> Gnome bug 788931 in general "Crashes when setting the label of invalid StLabel objects" [Critical,Reopened]
<Trevinho>  Â· Fixed crash in the shadow pipeline codepath
<Trevinho>    https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=788908
<Trevinho>  Â· Snapped clangd (you can get your smart completion in vim/emacs/$EDITOR with it)
<ubot5> Gnome bug 765011 in wayland "support fractional scaling" [Normal,Assigned]
<ubot5> Gnome bug 788908 in st "gnome-shell crashed with SIGSEGV in clutter_actor_get_allocation_box (from _st_create_shadow_pipeline_from_actor)" [Normal,New]
<Trevinho> and maybe more that I don't remember :)
<seb128> thanks Trevinho
<seb128> brb, changing location
<jbicha> oops, time change again
<kenvandine> :)
<Laney> gcal gets it right for me
<Laney> (H)
<Laney> anyone on bionic?
<jibel> i am
<Laney> ah yeah, I found a jibel bug
<Laney> never mind
<jbicha> bionic soon, I have some more artful SRUs to help verify first
<Laney> just discovered gnome-shell-calendar-service is crashing over and over
<Laney> but jibel reported it, hero
<Laney> bug #1731910
<ubot5> bug 1731910 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "gnome-shell-calendar-server assert failure: *** Error in `/usr/lib/gnome-shell/gnome-shell-calendar-server': free(): invalid pointer: 0x0000559ef762f960 ***" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1731910
<jbicha> Laney: oh, I guess I need to upload evolution-data-server 3.26.2.1 to fix that
<Laney> ya, it's gnome bug #789677
<ubot5> Gnome bug 789677 in Calendar "[ECalClient] Incorrect free call in process_detached_instances()" [Major,Resolved: fixed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=789677
<jbicha> done, but it will be blocked on icu transition https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution-data-server/3.26.2.1-1ubuntu1
<Laney> cheers
<Laney> looks like that entangles haskell
<Laney> le fail
<oSoMoN> seb128, new LO SRU with updated version number available at https://people.canonical.com/~osomon/libreoffice-5.4.2/artful2/
<seb128> oSoMoN, 'ci
<Trevinho> Laney: hey, can you give a look at https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu-themes/headerbar-maximized-destructive-suggested-actions/+merge/332619 it's the only one I'm missing to release the silo...
<Trevinho> which at this point I should move to bionic
<Laney> Trevinho: oh yeah, ok
<Laney> Trevinho: a bigger screenshot would have been nicer :P
<Laney> approved, and goodnight!
<jbicha> jackpot51: could you or dmj look into verifying the proposed SRU for LP: #1724024?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1724024 in mutter (Ubuntu Artful) "can't set usable scale for hidpi internal display if when using external display less than 1600x1200" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1724024
<jbicha> good morning
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-11-15
<RAOF> I'm skeptical that gnome-shell should be using 2.0 GiB of memory.
<didrocks> good morning
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN, Ã§a va ?
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, Ã§a va et toi?
<didrocks> Ã§a va bien, merci :-)
<willcooke> morning all
<oSoMoN> good morning willcooke
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<Laney> hey buddies
<willcooke> morning Laney
<oSoMoN> morning Laney
<Laney> hey willcooke and oSoMoN
<didrocks> morning Laney!
<Laney> hey didrocks
<Laney> how's everyone?
<didrocks> good good, but it's quite freezing outside, yourself?
<Laney> can't complain too much!
<Laney> ok, just a bit
<Laney> been hoping for a dry morning for a while so I can finish re-oiling outside but there hasn't been one, grrrrr
<Laney> #shouldhavedoneitinsummer
<chrisccoulson> oSoMoN, oh, another chromium update?
<oSoMoN> chrisccoulson, yes, I'm validating it now
<jbicha> seb128: hi, btw, the gtk3/artful SRU might be held up by http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/s/software-properties/artful/amd64
<jbicha> it doesn't look like it's gtk3's fault though
<Laney> jbicha: are you debugging that?
<Laney> I just saw it on excuses/bionic
<jbicha> not really :|
<Laney> right
<jbicha> the bionic failure is a different arch (i386 on bionic, amd64 on artful)
<jbicha> dbus timeout? maybe too much load on the machine? I feel I'm not very good at troubleshooting this kind of issue
<Laney> same problem though
<Laney> IOError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: '/tmp/autopkgtest.yAzi54/build.9aF/software-properties-0.96.24.17/tests//tmp/autopkgtest.yAzi54/build.9aF/software-properties-0.96.24.17/tests/data/sources.list'
<Laney> that path looks weird eh
<willcooke> andyrock, you froze in the HO :)
<andyrock> yeah reconnecting
<andyrock> any idea why I get this in bionic
<andyrock> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/MPwQDzU5/
<andyrock> the ".1" seems to broken other packages too
<ricotz> andyrock, try to run "apt update"
<andyrock> I did
<andyrock> btw proposed seems to fix this
<ricotz> I see, I am using -proposed here, but I don't see a package with 234-2ubuntu12.1
<andyrock> i don't know but it got fixed someway
<andyrock> :D
<ricotz> $ apt-cache policy libudev1
<ricotz> -proposed has systemd 235 already
<ricotz> https://paste.debian.net/plain/995896
<andyrock> that can be the reason
<ricotz> so no 234-2ubuntu12.1 here, maybe check your sources.list which apt-cache policy will tell you
<jbicha> andyrock: I think you can fix that by enabling artful-security, see https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/systemd
<andyrock> jbicha: solved thanks
<jackpot51>  Yes jbicha, we could look into verifying the change in proposed for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mutter/+bug/1724024. Could you take a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-desktop3/+bug/1731318 ?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1724024 in mutter (Ubuntu Artful) "can't set usable scale for hidpi internal display if when using external display less than 1600x1200" [Medium,Fix committed]
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1731318 in gnome-desktop "NVIDIA systems will not suspend with lid close and no external monitors" [Medium,Confirmed]
<jbicha> jackpot51: could you ping GNOME about your proposed patch? it looks like hadess is the gnome-desktop maintainer
<jackpot51> Will do
<oSoMoN> good night desktoppers
<willcooke> night all, few days off now, see you next week
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, ping?
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, could you take a look at the trunk packaging branch and check if I forgot any of your changes
<robert_ancell> kenvandine: howdy new manager
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, hey there!
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-11-16
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> good morning
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, Ã§a va?
<didrocks> Ã§a va bien oSoMoN, et toi ?
<didrocks> malgrÃ© un nuit agitÃ©e, et rÃ©veillÃ© plusieurs fois :p (rah, ces dentsâ¦)
<oSoMoN> Ã§a va, merci
<oSoMoN> dormi peu, mais en une seule fois :)
<didrocks> hÃ©hÃ©
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> re seb128
<seb128> re didrocks :)
<Laney> ho ho ho
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> doing good thanks, what about you?
<Laney> good day off?
<seb128> I'm good but tired
<seb128> yes, mostly, but looking after a kid takes more energy than working, happy to sit down at the computer today :p
<didrocks> hey Laney ;)
<Laney> heyyyy didrocks
<oSoMoN> snapd 2.29 released, let's remove fonts from snaps!
<Laney> cool
<Laney> that seems like a faster release cycle than last time?
<oSoMoN> dunno, to me it seems like I've been waiting for that one forever :)
<seb128> oSoMoN, btw I uploaded the artful libreoffice with fixed version
<oSoMoN> seb128, I saw that and was about to thank you when you disappeared. Thanks!
<seb128> yw!
<seb128> sorry, I changed location ... would be nice of we had a company IRC proxy :-/
<oSoMoN> seb128, I use znc on a canonistack instance, but indeed it would be nice if we had a generic solution
<Saviq> ooh ugly square Firefox tabs ;P
<Saviq> but feels faster :)
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, I'll take a look at those packaging changes today, thanks
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, thanks, note that the current i386 failure (58 and 59) on xenial is probably a rustc problem, maybe even OOM
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that doesn't surprise me. The rustc build hits OOM on i386 too
<ricotz> also only on xenial?
<chrisccoulson> trusty, but if that's the case then it's marginal everywhere
<ricotz> I see, reducing the parallel builds could help since g++ is pretty heavy too
<chrisccoulson> it's not strictly a OOM either - it's running out of address space, so reducing parallelism won't really help
<ricotz> ok
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, btw, I disabled the unity patch for 58+ again, does this patch has any future?
<ricotz> jbicha, this seems to be something to look forward for bionic -- https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1283299
<ubot5> Mozilla bug 1283299 in Widget: Gtk "Implement titlebar rendering on GTK 3.20+" [Normal,Assigned]
<Laney> going to cafe for lunch, back in a bit
<mvo> hey, silly question - I had to restore a backup on my laptop (long story) using deja-dup and this worked great (yay). however it seems like my window settings (focus-follow-mouse, mouse buttons) and keybindings for e.g. gnome-terminal are not restrored. is that a known issue? did I do anything wrong? or a known issue?
<didrocks> mvo: hey, this is stored in dconf normally, are your other values stored in dconf restored?
<didrocks> mvo: the file is ~/.config/dconf/user
<didrocks> however, restoring it while dconf is runningâ¦ I don't think that works
<didrocks> (and maybe dconf-service will erase it with what it has in memory)
<mvo> didrocks: aha, that would make sense. I restored it while dconf was running (from a normal user sessoin)
<mvo> didrocks: I will poke around, maybe I can temporarly suspsend dconf or something
<didrocks> mvo: just a thoery :) I'm afraid that dconf-service may be respawn as a dbus activated service in a graphical session, maybe shut down your session and restore from a tty?
<didrocks> theory*
<mvo> didrocks: hm, thanks. I'm too lazy to learn how to restore using cli :/ I will experiment a bit
<didrocks> mvo: the clean way of course is to mv dconf-service dconf-service.disable, kill the process, restore the file and mv back ;)
<mvo> didrocks: indeed, let me poke at it a little bit
<mvo> didrocks: thanks for your help!
<didrocks> yw! keep me posted :)
 * mgedmin would hope a user-friendly backup program would know how to do dcomp dump + dcomp load properly ...
<didrocks> mgedmin: dconf* you meant, but yeah, agreed, it should be a simple patch even ;)
 * mgedmin kan't sple
<amano> ricotz, chrisccoulson: can you build the firefox 58 betas with csd and wayland enabled? The code for that should be now available in the official codebase.
<amano_> Not in the official builds but on the firefox-next ppa
<amano_> And just for artful and bionic?
<ricotz> amano_, hi, no, I won't treat the beta builds different since this is what will land in the archive after the beta cycle has finished
<ricotz> if those features are tested upstream and enabled by default it should be be avaible already or will be when upstream decides to
<ricotz> _amano, I guess you didnt get any of my messages
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey, could you have a look to https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/request-autoconnection-of-cups-control-for-libreoffice/2517 and reply to the pending questions there?
<mgedmin> I'm not getting any notifications about available security updates in ubuntu gnome 17.10, why is that?
<mgedmin> sometimes I get a gnome-software notification about updates, but when I click I get a screen saying everything's up to date
<mgedmin> hitting Refresh sometimes shows me flatpak platform runtime updates, nothing else
<mgedmin> (sudo apt-get update; sudo apt-get upgrade -d in a terminal shows me there are available security updates for e.g. webkit)
<Laney> Software doesn't tell you about deb package updates, that's the job of Sofware Updater
<Laney> and that's supposed to notify daily if there are security updates iirc
<mgedmin> is that the new name of update-manager?  I've got it installed, but never saw any notifications
<mgedmin> oh, I see I set it to download and install security updates automatically at some point
<mgedmin> maybe it actually does?  strange that I never noticed
<Laney> ISTR that maybe unattended-upgrades is installed by default now
<tkamppeter> seb128, I have answered there.
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<Trevinho> hi guys
<Trevinho> anyone can publish this for me https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3039 ?
 * Trevinho survived to the upgrade to Firefox Quantum.... Enhoying the new speed with less extensions :)
<seb128> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> hi seb128, allright?
<seb128> yes!
<seb128> you?
<seb128> andyrock, you said you would update the SRU description according to Brian's comment on bug #1703046?
<ubot5> bug 1703046 in indicator-printers (Ubuntu) "indicator-printers-service crashed with SIGSEGV in __GI_____strtol_l_internal()" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1703046
<seb128> Trevinho, I published your silo
<Trevinho> seb128: thanks...
<seb128> yw!
<Trevinho> seb128: and yes.. I'm good..
<B01> Hi
<B01> i am using GNOME and could not reduce the SIZE of my Desktop Icons.
<B01> i have many file and folders on my Desktop and ICON Size is very Huge.
<B01> I've tried many ways and could not reduce the ICON Size.
<B01> Could someone help / point out on what i am missing here ?
<Trevinho> Laney: hey, what are you using now with quantum instead of vimfx or other similar extensions?
<Trevinho> I've been using saka-key so far, but there are some missing things (due to the webext arch I guess)
<andyrock> seb128: didn't I?
<andyrock> ah
<andyrock> i forgot the errors.ubuntu.com link
<andyrock> done
<andyrock> sorry about that
<gQuigs> B01: I also think I have that issue randomly.. right now the icons are huge on the desktop - last boot I swear they weren't
<gQuigs> I haven't had time to debug it at all though
<seb128> andyrock, np, thanks
<gQuigs> B01: open up Files/Nautilus and do Ctrl and "-" to reduce both sizes...
<B01> @gQuigs, it is on my Desktop
<B01> where there are many files.
<B01> not in other directories.
<gQuigs> hmm, for me it shows the consistent size from Files/Nautilus (guess I could have accidentally Ctrl and + in a directory)
<jbicha> the icon size is supposed to be global now; there is no per-directory icon size option any more
<B01> @jbicha, i would like to reduce the size of all the objects / icons on my desktop.
<B01> i could not do that somehow.
<jbicha> B01: open the Files app, open the â°  menu, click the - icon. The lowest it goes is 50%
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-11-17
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> salut didrocks
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<seb128> lut oSoMoN
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<Laney> moop
<Laney> happy friday!
<Laney> Trevinho: one called Tridactyl, but it's nowhere near as good
<didrocks> happy friday Laney!
<Laney> and to you didrocks!
<Laney> frosty start today
<Laney> must be nearly christmas
<oSoMoN> happy Friday folks
 * oSoMoN can almost hear the Christmas carols already
<Laney> hey oSoMoN
<Laney> pitti: hey, I'm getting weird emails about https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-artful/artful/s390x/s/systemd-upstream/20171117_085431_1c1b9@/log.gz (git request ending up in autopkgtest-artful)
<Laney> did you mean to drop the semaphore ppa?
<Trevinho> hi guys
<Trevinho> Laney: hey... since you're here :)
<Laney> late night Trevinho
<Trevinho> Laney: when you've a sec can you approve https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity-control-center/grouped-compiz-gsettings-support-x/+merge/326789 and publish https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2841
<Trevinho> yeah, i was about to go to bed in fact...
<Trevinho> Laney: my main issue is that some keybindings can't work in pages with no extensions enabled :(
<didrocks> Trevinho: ahah, go to bed dude! :-)
<didrocks> I wasn't expecting you to reply to the hub MP, and I was like "what, still awake? :p"
<Trevinho> Laney: saka is quite nice, but saka key has its flaws... but I guess with chrome is the same
<Trevinho> ahah
<Trevinho> eh, I was about to finish a patch, and you know...
<Trevinho> and waiting a build
<didrocks> btw, it's annoying that the hub is sending you an email with noreply@
<didrocks> on MPs
<Trevinho> I thought it was earlier to be fair :o
<didrocks> I first answered directly
<didrocks> and no email sent back to tell you "you are WRONG" ;)
<Trevinho> didrocks: yeah, i pointed this to will some days ago, he told he would redirect to popey
 * popey ears prick up
<didrocks> heh
<Trevinho> in the emails I don't like much the so long tagged titles too...
<didrocks> I think if noreply@ubuntu.com was telling you "bad destination", that would be enough
<popey> didrocks: wanna file an RT?
<popey> (for the noreply issue)
 * Trevinho thinks it's the very right moment to go to sleep :D
<Trevinho> see you later gentlemen!
<pitti> Laney: argh; I dropped it because we don't really need backports any more, but I now remember that we need a PPA to attribute the results somewhere in swift
<Laney> Trevinho: alright, I'll look later on
<Laney> pitti: right
<didrocks> popey: sure!
<didrocks> Trevinho: see you!
<pitti> Laney: I put it back in the webhook now
<Laney> merci!
<pitti> merci Ã  toi !
<Laney> does it have a Packages file for artful?
<didrocks> <3
<Laney> otherwise the test will be sad
<pitti> Laney: yes, I did that yesterday
<pitti> copied a package, let it publish, removed it again (i. e.  empty, but present)
<Laney> okey dokey
<Laney> I should kill the pending requests off I guess
<pitti> yes please; let me know, then I'll requeue them
<Laney> huh, interesting, why's this only on s390x?
<pitti> Laney: each arch has a separate webhook, and I managed to only screw up that one
<Laney> ah
<pitti> i. e. all "Queued tests for upstream artful s390x"?
<Laney> that's the one
<Laney> https://paste.debian.net/996202/
<pitti> the one for 7373 is right, but just mass-flush them, that's easier
<Laney> oh yeah it did hit 7373, must have raced in
 * Laney tries to move the bad ones manually
<pitti> Laney: as I said, just mass-flush it
<pitti> I'm preparing a command  to requeue them with PPA
<Laney> pitti: sorry, I meant the swift bits with the last comment
<pitti> ah, did they actually succeed?
<pitti> I suppose the workers shoudl just reject build-git ones without a PPA
<seb128> hey Laney Trevinho pitti, happy friday
<seb128> Trevinho, what are you doing up at this time? :)
<pitti> seb128: bon vendredi Ã  toi aussi, comment vas-tu ?
<seb128> pitti, trÃ¨s bien merci !
<Laney> yeah, https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-artful/?format=plain&prefix=artful/s390x/s/systemd-upstream/
<Laney> hey seb128!
<seb128> Trevinho, oh, I see you went to bed, night :)
<pitti> Laney: requeued them: http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/running#queue-upstream-artful-s390x
<Laney> nice
<Laney> now I've got to go and look at the acid rain in the s390x cloud
<pitti> Laney: btw, impressive queue size on  arm64 -- you are running the entire artful plus bionic goodness there?
<Laney> Steve queued every package with a test
<Laney> to get a baseline
<Laney> you can see on http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/statistics :-)
<pitti> Laney: wow, even on xenial
<Laney> it's even not the worst arch in terms of pass rate
<Laney> swift fixed up, hopefully I'll stop getting moaning emails now
 * Laney goes to hassle IS
<Laney> pitti: just deployed a change to require a PPA for git requests, let me know if you run into any trouble
<pitti> Laney: cool, thank you! this has always been the intent anyway, and I even documented it in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ProposedMigration/AutopkgtestInfrastructure#Web_hook_setup
<Laney> nod
 * Laney stares into the livecd-rootfs void
<Laney> * livecd-rootfs stares back
<jibel> didrocks, can you have a look at bug 1730406 when you have a minute, the OP says it is not fixed in bionic
<ubot5> bug 1730406 in gnome-shell-extension-appindicator (Ubuntu Artful) "icon are too small with some tray icons such as Telegram" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1730406
<didrocks> jibel: oh, interesting, that was the backport of the upstream fix, I'm going to answer to check upstream
<jibel> didrocks, it is fixed with the version in artful-proposed. I'll check on bionic
<jibel> ... if I can have indicators on my machine running bionic of course ...
<didrocks> jibel: oh, interesting, that was the backport of the upstream fix, I'm going to answer to check his upstream report
<didrocks> jibel: it's only "some" indicators
<jibel> i tried with telegram
<didrocks> like clementine doesn't hae that issue
<didrocks> it's telegram desktop, never used it
<jibel> which is the indicator mentioned in the bug report
<jibel> yes, it's the app I tried
<didrocks> jibel: the upstream fix is trivial, they just add 2 so the icon size
<didrocks> to*
<jibel> didrocks, I attached a screenshot and you can clearly see the difference with artful proposed
<didrocks> jibel: he reporter filed the bug upstream telling to rebase and backport that commit
<didrocks> ah
<jibel> didrocks, I'll pass the verification and see what's happening on bionic
<didrocks> you meant, artful-proposed work?
<didrocks> not bionic
<didrocks> oh
<didrocks> let me check
<didrocks> maybe the rebasing didn't go as well as expected
<jibel> yes, but I have not confirmed whether bionic works or not
<jibel> i'll do that now but need to switch to wayland
<didrocks> jibel: let me first do a quick check before you bother
<didrocks> * commit 87db22dccf3a762c3c1ad86ca5e87bda39fbd731 (tag: v22, tag: v21)
<didrocks> the commit is in the bionic branchâ¦
<didrocks> let me look at the source tarball
<didrocks>         this._iconBox = new AppIndicator.IconActor(indicator, Panel.PANEL_ICON_SIZE + 2);
<didrocks> yeah, the bionic tarball has that line ^
<jibel> i need to switch to wayland anyway. biab
<jibel> didrocks, which version in bionic does not have the fix
<jibel> ?
<jibel> in order to downgrade and compare
<jibel> 17.10.2
<didrocks> jibel: yeah, 17.10.2 doesn't, 18.04 is the rebase from latest master
<didrocks> (which has the fix)
<jibel> didrocks, I confirm that it is fixed in bionic too
<didrocks> ah, great!
<jibel> I'll attach a screenshot to the bug report.
<didrocks> I would have been surprised
<didrocks> I bet the reporter did install, but didn't restart his session
<didrocks> thanks jibel :)
<jibel> didrocks, with the counter displayed over the telegram indicator the difference is not obvious
<didrocks> indeed
<jibel> if only the translators could use characters that exists on a French keyboard for french translations ...
<seb128> ok, enough for this week
<seb128> have a nice w.e desktopers!
<didrocks> see you seb128!
<seb128> didrocks, enjoy the w.e! :)
<oSoMoN> have a good one seb128
<seb128> oSoMoN, thanks, you too
<Laney> BYE SEB!
<didrocks> you too! /me goes as well
 * oSoMoN EOW too
<oSoMoN> have a great week-end everyone
<Laney> my turn, see you
<Trevinho> hello gnome-shell 4 :)
<Trevinho> https://wiki.gnome.org/Initiatives/Wayland/GnomeShell/GnomeShell4
<Trevinho> [still just a wiki page, but...]
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-11-19
* BrownShitNuggets changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: i shit my pants.  lol dongs
<lucifer_lin> i heard gedit is unmaintained ? what text editor is shipping with ubuntu 18.04 or Ubuntu 17.10 ?
<jbicha> gedit is still the default text editor
<jbicha> a lot of software is undermaintained, but gedit's development looks reasonably active to me:
<jbicha> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gedit/log
<jbicha> oh I guess I'm talking to myself ð
* dax changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help
<el> can the ops for here please consider setting +t
<flocculant> thanks dax :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-11-12
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> Salut didrocks
<didrocks> salut jibel, bon week-end?
<jibel> didrocks, w-e calme, matchs basket et hand samedi (en tant que spectateur :)) et repos hier
<jibel> didrocks, et j'ai fixÃ© mon rÃ©seau
<jibel> didrocks, et doi?
<jibel> toi
<didrocks> jibel: week-end passÃ© chez des amis, c'Ã©tait sympa aussi :)
<duflu> Hi didrocks, jibel
<didrocks> hey duflu
<jibel> Hi duflu
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Hi seb128 and oSoMoN
<seb128> lut oSoMoN
<seb128> en forme ? bon w.e ?
<seb128> hey duflu! how are you today?
<duflu> seb128, sore from lifting many things. You?
<seb128> I'm good, happy to be sitting at my desk today, w.e are exhausting :)
<oSoMoN> heh
<oSoMoN> IÂ was away 4 days and I don't remember what this whole software engineering thing is about
<oSoMoN> so yeah, week-end was good :)
<seb128> :)
<andyrock> good morning!
<Laney> hi
<Laney> happy monday to you
<Laney> and your kin
<duflu> We wish you a merry Monday, Laney
<oSoMoN> and a happy new week
<Laney> HO HO HO
<seb128> hey hey Laney, how are you today? good w.e?
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> I'm good thanks, looks like a nice day :>
<seb128> lucky you, it's grey and rainy here
<Laney> weekend was nice, we went to cambridge to hang out
<Laney> there was a big storm on saturday though /o\
<Laney> what about you?
<seb128> I'm good, w.e was nice, we have lunch/spent the affternoon with friends on saturday and when to visit a mini-farm for kids yesterday/had lunch there. It was a bit exhausting though, the baby had a very active w.e and wouldn't play alone nor want to sleep :-/
<seb128> andyrock, hey, had a good w.e? It looks like you didn't push the update-notifier error check tweak you did on thursday, can you do that? Then I can finally upload that one
<Laney> :/
<andyrock> seb128: I forgot I was on holiday on Friday
<andyrock> :/
<andyrock> I'm doing that now
<seb128> andyrock, hey :) no worry, there was no hurry, but we had enough review rounds, now is time to get that uploaded :p
<seb128> thx
<Laney> there's never enough review!
<seb128> :)
<seb128> speaking of reviews, my systemd/hwdb PR for that airplane mode issue just got merged :)
<Laney> win
<andyrock> seb128: done!
<seb128> andyrock, thx!
<andyrock> Laney: https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~azzar1/update-notifier/fix-lp-1800862/revision/945
<andyrock> that should be readable enough
<Laney> yep
<andyrock> didrocks: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock/+bug/1769383/comments/19
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1769383 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu dock/launcher is shown on the lock screen" [High,Confirmed]
<andyrock> I think you linked the wrong MR here
<andyrock> corrected
<seb128> Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/update-notifier/fix-lp-1800862/+merge/358309 is +1 from you now?
<Laney> sure
<Laney> andyrock: that's the same link?
<seb128> thx
<andyrock> Laney: :(
<andyrock> damn
<didrocks> yea, it's mr1
<seb128> didrocks, andyrock, so we are confident that this issue is hitting people who tweak the extensions?
<didrocks> seb128: no, I wonder if this comment was pasted on the wrong bug report or if title/description change (which doesn't seem so)
<didrocks> so clearly not the lockscreen issue
<didrocks> however, I saw this morning some movement on the screenlock issue upstream
<didrocks> one sec
<didrocks> ah, this was just a duplication to https://github.com/micheleg/dash-to-dock/issues/762
<gitbot> micheleg issue 762 in dash-to-dock "Dock persists on lock screen" [Open]
<didrocks> some people commented "thanks, it works fine", but no solution was given in duplicates :p
<andyrock> seb128: didrocks I'm working on it
<andyrock> it's somehow related to the 'transparency" feature of dash-to-dock
<andyrock> it loses track of the tracked window
<andyrock> *windows
<andyrock> not sure because gnome-shell fails to send an 'actor-removed' signal
<andyrock> trying to find a reliable way to reproduce it
<tomreyn> hi. would you say it is generally useful for users to report the (often many) stack traces logged by 'journalctl --user' on a fully patched 18.04? are those better ignored for now unless they seem to be results / side effects of major malfunctions?
<seb128> andyrock, k, good, thx
<seb128> tomreyn, hey, that would probably be annoying to users and prompt them to report issues when not strictly needed, we already got negative feedback from the quantify of error nagging without that
<tomreyn> seb128: i didn't mean whether these stacktraces should be reported to users via (G)UI, but whether users, such as myself, should spend time on reposrting those stacktraces to the bug trackers.
<tomreyn> seb128: i ssupect your answer also suggests there is no use in such reports at this time, would you agree there?
<seb128> tomreyn, reporting to the bug tracker is always useful, it might be that people are too busy and those just sit there though
<tomreyn> ok, maybe i'll do a few and see what happens (if anything), thanks seb
<Trevinho> Morning
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-11-13
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Hi didrocks
<duflu> First as always
<duflu> usual
<didrocks> yes :)
<didrocks> duflu: answered on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1789356/comments/14. I still need to focus on the installer work, so I gave you details of where to tweak the values
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1789356 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu Cosmic) "Dark purple (noise) background flashes up briefly during the login animation since Yaru was introduced" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<didrocks> duflu: can be that the setGradient with GDesktopEnums.BackgroundShading.VERTICAL isn't the same as background-gradient-direction: vertical;?
<didrocks> as you didn't mention the gradient to be inverted (which could have happened between top/bottom) and start in the middle of the screen, have different distribution, could be internal to GNOME Shell and thus more worry
<duflu> didrocks, thanks. If I can get the yaru patch(es) working in git then I can definitely test and fix things quickly
<didrocks> but as the screen only appear for a split second here, it looked similar enough to me
<didrocks> duflu: it's not a yaru patch, it's just a patch in GNOME Shell (look at the commit)
<jibel> Good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel
<duflu> didrocks, yes (un)fortunately gnome-shell often skips so many frames that users don't see the faulty ones there :)
<didrocks> yeah ;)
<duflu> For me it's 50% of login attempts
<duflu> Hi jibel
<didrocks> duflu: the Shell doesn't pick anything from the theme itself for that background, hence the patch itselfâ¦ I added the yaru css part which it should match for reference
<didrocks> hope that's enough info :)
<clobrano> good morning all 0/
<didrocks> hey clobrano! Trying some golang from what I saw? :)
<clobrano> hey didrocks, yes, tried and the dropped :D
<didrocks> oh?
<clobrano> didrocks: at the end, convert was all I needed
<didrocks> yeah, no need to reimplement what already exists :)
 * clobrano can't find a way to use golang :(
<clobrano> didrocks: but, yeah, I'm quite happy with the results so far
<didrocks> clobrano: yeah, it looks quite good :)
<seb128> back, good morning desktopers
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> duflu, technically I joined first earlier :p I just tend to not talk but do my email backlog before my morning erands :)
<duflu> Morning seb128. You win
<seb128> :p
<seb128> morning!
<oSoMoN> good morning deskoppers
<oSoMoN> *desktoppers
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, en forme ?
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, didrocks
<oSoMoN> la forme, et vous?
<seb128> en forme !
<Laney> yo
<didrocks> la forme aussi :) hey Laney
<duflu> lo Laney
<Laney> hey d*
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> doing good :.
<Laney> :>!
<Laney> made a whole load of green tomatoes into salsa last night
<seb128> nice
<Laney> could have made it a bit spicier
<Laney> you?
<seb128> I'm good! It' sunny today :) I didn't do much from evening though, gf had sport and baby didn't want to sleep so I had to keep him busy and then clean around :/
<Laney> /o\
<andyrock> morning all!
<Laney> is he quite active?
<seb128> hey andyrock, how are you
<Laney> hey andyrock
 * seb128 ponders upstreaming bug #1794292
<ubot5> bug 1794292 in plymouth (Ubuntu Cosmic) "plymouthd crashed with SIGSEGV in /sbin/plymouthd:11 in ply_renderer_set_handler_for_input_source -> ply_keyboard_stop_watching_for_renderer_input -> ply_keyboard_stop_watching_for_input -> ply_device_manager_deactivate_keyboards -> on_deactivate" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1794292
<Laney> how's london?
<seb128> we are getting little downstream traction despite having a reporter who seems to understand a bit what's going on
<Laney> I saw in the foundations meeting that c_yphermox was working on that
<andyrock> seb128: good drinking some tea
<Laney> not much activity on the bug though
<andyrock> you?
<Laney> :| |: :| |:
<seb128> Laney, do you have an opinion on that? e.u.c started receiving report with 0.9.3-1ubuntu10 which was an upload from you (with some upstream backported patches from Hans)
<andyrock> Laney: not sure, I still have to open the windows to check ð
<seb128> andyrock, I'm good, done drinking my coffee, I might do another one in a bit
<Laney> seb128: what part of it?
<Laney> it's known to not be fixed but he was supposed to be working it
<seb128> you mean?
<seb128> I'm just saying that https://errors.ubuntu.com/problem/d811a3a23b60315368e94d8d6ee10fb908e90d92 shows the first report from -1ubuntu10 so I wonder if that's a problem in one of the patches included in that upload
<seb128> or the signature changed and it was there before
 * seb128 checks errors
<seb128> also good to know that Mathieu is looking at it, would be good if he updated the bug as well
<Laney> the bug you linked was pre-existing
<seb128> ah, right, https://errors.ubuntu.com/problem/6aa06f1bc51946c787a01d38e58bc76114555334
<seb128> it's not the same error though
<seb128> sigsegv vs assert
<Laney> there's a 0.9.5 now, would be good to get that instead of these millions of patches
<Laney> 4*
<seb128> right
<seb128> ok, well I did upstream it now, so let's see
<seb128> jamesh, hey, weekly summary? ;)
<didrocks> seb128: duflu: so, I'm not that crazy, my patch is good, unsure if the backport to cosmic matches though? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1789356/comments/16
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1789356 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu Cosmic) "Dark purple (noise) background flashes up briefly during the login animation since Yaru was introduced" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<seb128> heh
<duflu> didrocks, seb128, no I just found the problem. The texture coordinates are off by 0.5, which for a texture that's only 1x2 pixels is a big deal. This doesn't seem to be a bug in mutter though. It's a bug in the Ubuntu patch. I'm not yet sure how to fix it since mutter is rendering the 1x2 texture correctly, just different to how it is rendered on the login screen
<duflu> I mean the top of the gradient is 25% down the screen and the bottom is 75% down the screen. Because if it was a proper wallpaper that's the correct calculation
<duflu> The login screen uses 0% and 100%
<duflu> didrocks, seb128, in summary, I got it and will need more time to find a fix
<duflu> Another day because it's already dinner time
<seb128> k, doesn't sound like a regression though, unsure what we should do about the SRU but we shouldn't block it long
<seb128> so either declare it's fine as it is and we can fix that issue later, or re-upload without the change for now
<duflu> seb128, it's a regression in that the original bug is not fixed, and the new behaviour is worse. Not sure what to call that but regression wouldn't be inaccurate
<seb128> k, well as I said we need to not sit on tha SRU
<duflu> seb128, you can keep the bug open, release the SRU and I can generalise the bug description to cover the new behaviour :)
<seb128> so let's see tomorrow
<seb128> well, if the SRU introduces a worth user experience we shouldn't release it
<duflu> I would agree. And I know enough to be able to fix it fully... this week
<seb128> but let's see if we maange to fix or if we should revert the change
<seb128> k
<seb128> more news tomorrow then
<seb128> duflu, enjoy dinner!
<seb128> early lunch here!
<seb128> jamesh_,  hey, weekly summary? ;)
<andyrock> seb128: ptomato released gjs 1.53.3 \o/
<seb128> andyrock, nice :)
<andyrock> so we don't need to upload our version with 10 cherry-picks :D
<andyrock> I'll prepare the upload (so I can distract a little bit from the lock issue)
<seb128> k, good
<seb128> k, it's meeting time!
<seb128> Roll call: andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu (out), jbicha, jamesh (out), jibel, kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out), tjaalton, tseliot
<didrocks> hey
<kenvandine> o/
<jibel> hi
<andyrock> o/
<tseliot> o/
<oSoMoN> o/
<Laney> nod
<seb128> thx for those who included their rls bugs status in their summary
<seb128> kenvandine, do you know if jamesh is around this week? He didn't submit his summary and I pinged him here today without result
<kenvandine> he should be around
<seb128> k, oh well
<seb128> let's get started witht he bugs review
<tjaalton> yo
<seb128> #topic rls-bugs-review
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> one item https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/transmission/+bug/1758459
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1758459 in transmission (Ubuntu) "Getting transmission 2.93 in Bionic" [Low,Confirmed]
<seb128> jbicha, why did you nominate that one?
<seb128> I guess he's not around
<jbicha> .
<seb128> I've been keeping an eye on that one for a while but there is no duplicate nor example that can be used as a testcase
<jbicha> uh, it says that bionic's transmission can't be used for some torrent trackers/servers/things
<jbicha> yeah, no test case :(
<seb128> based on the fact that there has been almost no user reporting and that we can't do a SRU without a way to test the issue/fix I vote -1 for the nomination
<seb128> it doesn't seem an important issue for our users
<seb128> opinions?
<Laney> yep
<Laney> jbicha or someone could still upload it if they wanted to though
<Laney> maybe falls under the gnome ffe
<Laney> srue
<seb128> right, I would do the update if I had a testcase :)
<Laney> whatever you call it
<Laney> so you don't need one for that
<seb128> I don't think it is, it's not even hosted on the GNOME infra
 * Laney shrugs
<Laney> you could argue
<Laney> or don't do it, that is up to you
<seb128> I think the spirit of the GNOME ffe is that they have freezes aligned, etc
<seb128> but yeah, let's not discuss that here/now
<seb128> rls-not-fixing it
 * Laney shrugs again
<seb128> sorry :p
<seb128> shouldn't have started argumenting
 * seb128 shuts up and moves to cc bugs :)
<jbicha> I've got to do some other stuff so let me add that I dropped the #1775329 task for bionic. I still want to do an Epiphany upload but not this week
<jbicha> bug 1775329
<ubot5> bug 1775329 in gnome-terminal (Ubuntu) "Feature request: Add a handler for CVE URLs" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1775329
<seb128> jbicha, k, thx
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-cc-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> that has no desktop item
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock/+bug/1769383
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1769383 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu dock/launcher is shown on the lock screen" [High,In progress]
<seb128> I vote +1, that seems like an important issue
<andyrock> +1
<andyrock> I'm already working on it (without major progress)
<seb128> thx
<seb128> targetted
<Laney> cc too no?
<seb128> I guess yes
<andyrock> it got the that but was not in the list
<seb128> done
<Laney> lame, that page didn't update since 0831
<seb128> it was not tagged rls-cc-incoming
<seb128> oh it was
<seb128> anyway, targetted for cosmic
<seb128> thx for raising that
<Laney> thx
<kenvandine> i've seen bug 1769383 on CC
<ubot5> bug 1769383 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu Disco) "Ubuntu dock/launcher is shown on the lock screen" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1769383
<seb128> next https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1725384
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1725384 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "On touch screens, the apps icon in the dock does not open when touched" [High,In progress]
<seb128> that seems an important issue for touch usage which oems care about
<seb128> so I +1 to nominate for D
<seb128> (we might also want to backport the fix to C or B then)
<kenvandine> +1
<seb128> k, nominated
<seb128> next, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock/+bug/1730765
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1730765 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu) "Mounted external devices do not appear in dock" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<seb128> seems like a feature wishlist
<didrocks> whishlist?
<didrocks> yeah, doesn't really go under "nominate"
<seb128> you disagree?
<seb128> or was that cross posting of "loos like wishlist"?
<didrocks> cross posting
<seb128> :)
<seb128> anyway, it's non trivial work, we didn't get official/oem requests about it and we are already booked on features
<seb128> so -1 from me
<didrocks> -1 as well
<seb128> thx; rls-not-fixing it, willcooke can raise it by other ways if he cares :)
<seb128> I'm still unsure how to handle the -tracking lists best, but if those are listed in the weekly summaries I think we can skip talking about them, unless specific questions are raised
<seb128> which can be done by the meeting lead or in ABO
<seb128> AOB
<seb128> wdyt?
<Laney> should look for unassigned ones there
<seb128> good point
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-cc-tracking-bug-tasks.html is in good shame
<seb128> all fix commited but 3 which are assigned
<seb128> hum
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ibus-m17n/+bug/1674089 bypassed the process
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1674089 in ibus-m17n (Ubuntu) "Tamil 99 keyboard layout" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Laney> O_O
<seb128> does anyone want to own it?
<seb128> I guess not, I'm going to Cc Gunnar to get his input and add it my list meanwhile
<seb128> the other one is
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1796622
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1796622 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "NetworkManager IPv6 DAD lifetime behavior introduce security risk" [Medium,Confirmed]
<seb128> which also bypassed the proces
<seb128> does anyone want to look at that?
<andyrock> happy to help with this
<seb128> thx, assigning to you
<seb128> I'm happy to help landing a fix, we should also perhaps talk to security if they consider it as a security fix
<andyrock> kk
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> k, basically I need to tide up the unassigned items with the feedback I got from the email discussion we had one that list
<seb128> I think we are good for rls?
<seb128> #topic AOB
<seb128> any other topic?
<seb128> shrug, I forgot to #startmeeting :/
<Laney> probably put to update on rls status in the first post of the threads from now on
<kenvandine> lol
<kenvandine> whoops
<seb128> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-11-13
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Nov 13 14:58:50 2018 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-11-13 | Current topic:
<seb128> still doing that
<Laney> #topic rls-bb-incoming
<Laney> ;-)
<seb128> sorry, forgot the bot start the meeting, read the log on https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2018/11/13/%23ubuntu-desktop.html if interested
<seb128> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-11-13 | Current topic: AOB
<oSoMoN> this is gonna be the shortest meeting ever :)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> Laney, what did you mean by rls-status for the first post?
<seb128> the urls from the different reports?
<oSoMoN> a reminder for everyone to update on their rls bugs assigned IÂ guess
<Laney> or in the weekly reminder
<Laney> experience is that people "forget"
<seb128> right, good point
<oSoMoN> I now have it in my weekly update template, to avoid forgetting
<seb128> will do for the next one
<seb128> ok, on other topics, just few/trivial notes
<seb128> - for those who didn't pay attention, the new ubuntu serie is called "disco"
<seb128> - it's open of uploads now (good time to do your debian merges if you have some to do, see https://merges.ubuntu.com/main.html)
<seb128> - I made version track GNOME 3.30 still for now, I think we should wait a bit before looking at 3.31
<seb128> especially that nautilus and some others are having talks about gtk4
<seb128> which we probably are not going to want by default this cycle, or not before having more confidence it's going to turn ok by the end of the cycle
<seb128> </notes>
<seb128> any other comments/topic?
<seb128> seems not, it's a wrap then!
<seb128> thx desktopers
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Nov 13 15:04:38 2018 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2018/ubuntu-desktop.2018-11-13-14.58.moin.txt
<andyrock> thx
<oSoMoN> thanks
<didrocks> thx
<didrocks> seb128: do you mind having a look at the ubuntu-meta NEW binary packages? We are blocked with j_ibel until ubuntu-desktop-minimal is published in the RELEASE pocket and it's in the new fresh disco!
<Laney> what's all those removals in ubuntu-meta?
<didrocks> because they are all added in the new ubuntu-desktop-minimal
<didrocks> and the script doesn't mention it, so I mentionned it manually in d/changelog :)
<Laney> how come it doesn't say added for those though, that's weird
<seb128> didrocks, k, I can try having a look though I might want to try to get some input from foundations just to check they are fine with the name/change
<Laney> there's some script inside Launchpad that needs to be editied btw if you want the Task field to be generated for the new task
<seb128> do you know who can do that?
<didrocks> Laney: didn't write the d/changelog generator, so I guess they didn't take into account creating new name
<Laney> anyone
<seb128> do you know where it is in launchpad?
<Laney> nope
<Laney> I forgot, sorry
<seb128> no worry
<didrocks> would be great if all that was documentedâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, you want to investigate/ask on #ubuntu-release about that?
<Laney> suggest #launchpad or #launchpad-dev
<seb128> or that
<didrocks> done, we'll see
<didrocks> really annoying you can't try everything locally and have to hack on the production directly to advance (with all the blockers)
<didrocks> jibel has the task published in the archive though
<Laney> are you together or something?
<didrocks> ok, it's only for taskel to know how the task
<didrocks> yep
<Laney> maybe it was for something else
<didrocks> HO, like if we were at an office, for days :p
<Laney> just weird to see him talking through you
<Laney> I see
<jibel> Laney, you want to jkoin the HO?
<jibel> -k
<didrocks> we need help on the installer :p
<Laney> no thanks, I'm naked
<andyrock> ð
<Laney> ð§
<Trevinho> Morning... Ouch alarm didn't work well for the meeting :'(
<seb128> good morning Trevinho, got hit by DST? ;)
<Trevinho> seb128: nope just the phone vibrated only instead of actually ringing
<seb128> I can't believe android phones manage to sell, those are so crap. Alarm was not reliable in ringing in my previous s3 mini, but it was getting old and I though that it sucked by ok
<seb128> same issue on my new phone :/
<seb128> shrug, pep8 is annoying
<seb128> "W504 line break after binary operator"
<seb128> it's not ok to wrap a line after a "or" now
<seb128> but neither it's ok to have it too long :/
 * seb128 wonders how to fix/change
<seb128> "            if not (depcache.marked_install(pkg) or
<seb128>                     depcache.marked_upgrade(pkg)):"
<seb128> ah, put the or on the new line?
 * seb128 tries
<seb128> "W503 line break before binary operator"
<seb128> you are kiding me right?
<andyrock> seb128: is this for update-notifier?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> it's blocked in disco-proposed due to that
<andyrock> why did it start failing now?
<seb128> because pep8 got updated
<seb128> and that warning is new in disco
<andyrock> ah right
<seb128> I'm just going to add W504 to the ignore I think
<seb128> that's just stupid
<andyrock> seb128: I guess you need to wrap the only thing inside parenthesis
<seb128> you mean?
<seb128> if not (depcache.marked_install(
<seb128>           pkg) or depcache.marked_upgrade(pkg)):"
<seb128> like that?
<seb128> that's not nice
<andyrock> seb128: https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0008/#multiline-if-statements
<seb128> well that's how the current code is no?
<seb128>  "            if not (depcache.marked_install(pkg) or
<seb128>                      depcache.marked_upgrade(pkg)):"
<andyrock> you need a ( before no
<andyrock> to satisfy the 4 space rule
<seb128> andyrock, want to mp the fix so I can approve/upload? ;)
<andyrock> seb128: sure
<seb128> andyrock, https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-disco/disco/amd64/u/update-notifier/20181112_105721_60823@/log.gz has the 4 errors, in case you work on cosmic
<seb128> look for W504
<andyrock> seb128: I'll use sbuild with disco
<andyrock> should be enough right?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> but in case you don't want to bother
<seb128> you can probably just fix them without testing
<seb128> I can test before uploading
<seb128> if you know what needs to be done, I mean it's not tricky to test
<andyrock> kk should not take long
<andyrock> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/f1fJVHBU/
<andyrock> seb128: ^^^
<andyrock> a little bit ugly because continue is aligned with the conditions
<andyrock> we can make it more readable doing this:
<andyrock> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/YQNc6ULn/
<andyrock> moving the comment
<andyrock> I would suggest the 2nd option
<seb128> andyrock, wfm
<andyrock> mmm it's also complying here: package_data_downloader.py:163
<andyrock> and this looks fine
<seb128> andyrock, well, it's the same issue no?
<seb128>         if (os.path.splitext(relfile)[1] and
<seb128>                 os.path.splitext(relfile)[1].startswith(".dpkg")):
<Laney> ignore W503
<Laney> that's what we did in update-manager
<andyrock> seb128: ^^^
<andyrock> Laney: 504 maybe?
<Laney> we did 503 in update-manager
<andyrock> seb128: but that line already has two parenthesis
<seb128> andyrock, that's what I was suggesting, just ignore 504
<Laney> would suggest being consistent with that one, it's a related project
<Laney> but up to you in the end
<andyrock> seb128: I wanted to fix it properly but sbuild fails here and I don't want to dig that much into the problem now
<seb128> andyrock, you can probably dpkg -i the disco pep8 on your cosmic and test there
<seb128> Laney, well, I mean we don't have 503 errors atm so no point ignore that ... or you mean you would put the "and" at the start of the second line and ignore 503?
<Laney> right, those two warnings are the opposite of each other
<didrocks> let's see if the package is out of NEW tomorrow
<didrocks> time to enjoy the evening
<andyrock> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/WsNmykoB/
<andyrock> seb128: ^^^
<andyrock> this should work
<andyrock> let me know if you prefer a MR
<seb128> Ran 1 test in 0.009s
<seb128> OK
<seb128> andyrock, yes please, better for the record/tracking
<seb128> but confirmed it works, thx!
<andyrock> seb128: if you got it already you can take care of it :)
<Laney> hahah
<andyrock> I'm having fun with clutter
<andyrock> and sadly is not a clutter of spiders
<seb128> andyrock, k, I can deal with update-notifier landing, thx for fixing it!
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: i see your re-upload of gnome-software was rejected
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, which one?
<kenvandine> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/bionic/+queue?queue_state=4&queue_text=gnome-software
<kenvandine> on friday
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, I uploaded a .7 just after that one
<kenvandine> i couldn't find it in the queue
<robert_ancell> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/3.28.1-0ubuntu4.18.04.7
<kenvandine> oh, it was just accepted :)
<robert_ancell> yup
<seb128> kenvandine, robert_ancell, it failed to build on ppc64el and s390x it looks like :-/ also when an upload is rejected you can reuse the same number, no need to bump to the revision
<robert_ancell> seb128, oh, you can use the same number?
<seb128> kenvandine, robert_ancell, also unsure it was a good idea to bundle the autoremove change to that follow up, now instead of fast tracking the old fixes in we need a full/proper round of testing for that new feature and risk having it failing verification and holding the other fixes
<seb128> robert_ancell, yes, queue doesn't care, you just can't re-use numbers that have been accepted
<robert_ancell> seb128, are we using GNOME 3.32 in disco?
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: did you ever get a chance to test the confined simple-scan snap?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, yes, I sent you the results via email
<kenvandine> oh... i vaguely recall that :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, read the meeting log :) but I recommended staying away from now
<seb128> we usually don't start so early, also we want to make sure components don't add a depends on gtk4
<seb128> which nautilus is talking about
<robert_ancell> seb128, do you know when gtk4 will be packaged in Debian/Ubuntu?
<seb128> robert_ancell, it's in Debian https://packages.qa.debian.org/g/gtk+4.0.html
<robert_ancell> nice
<seb128> we didn't include it in Ubuntu because there is no point having a dev serie so early
<seb128> it would be having an outdated snapshot
<seb128> it's rather creating problems than solving some
<robert_ancell> I want a packaged version to see how hard it is to compile things with it, so when the transition happens we can help push everything over the line at the same time
<jbicha> robert_ancell: there's chance we'll rename the source to gtk4 since GNOME is talking about dropping the +
<robert_ancell> jbicha, ah, the + so much fun with mistyping things
<jbicha> the + is annoying for URLs sometimes
<jbicha> packaging is at https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/gtk4 but we haven't uploaded it since the switch to meson
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: so double clicking the page should open the app registered for the mime type right?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, correct
<kenvandine> that's going to be tough in the snap
<kenvandine> well, firefox has some magic for that
<kenvandine> but it's a pain
 * kenvandine didn't even know double clicking the page did anything :)
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, right, it's a pretty minor feature. I don't think you should worry about it.
<kenvandine> i'd rather it not display an error though
<kenvandine> the driver issue is a bigger deal
<kenvandine> i'll probably have to build libsane-hpaio from source in the snap
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: are there any other cases like that?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, right, so we just need to disable that for snap builds.
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, what cases?
<kenvandine> other sane drivers that are packaged separately
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, the hpaio is the only one I know of as all the others are propietary
<seb128> good night desktopers
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, do you think it is possible to allow access to system drivers?
<kenvandine> ok, so i can't do anything about the proprietary drivers
<kenvandine> i don't think we can
<kenvandine> willcooke has a scanner that looks on the filesystem for proprietary drivers
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-11-14
<jibel> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<seb128> hey didrocks, duflu
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> hey seb128
<duflu> Hi seb128
<clobrano> hi all 0/
<Laney> moin
<Laney> WOH
<Laney> ok that's better
<Laney> got some new and exciting graphics corruption then
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<didrocks> hey Laney
<didrocks> Laney: seb128: do you know how ubuntu-session and others have been removed from ubuntu-meta from s390x by Ken? http://launchpadlibrarian.net/391700885/ubuntu-meta_1.424_1.425.diff.gz ubuntu-session is arch:all, so I don't see how ubuntu-meta didn't pick it up in 1.425 for that arch
<Laney> hey seb128 didrocks
<Laney> yes it depends on gnome-shell so you can't install it there
<didrocks> do you think this was hacked by hand?
<Laney> doubt it
<Laney> what's the problem?
<didrocks> ubuntu-session has been readded automatically for s390x in 1.426
<didrocks> which is normal, it's in the archive and arch: all (was already arch: all in cosmic)
<seb128> hum, I've no idea about those changes, sorry
<didrocks> I wonder thus how it was removed in last ubuntu-meta upload
<didrocks> (apart from "by hand hacking")
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, doesn't make sense, right?
<seb128> its weird indeed
<didrocks> (this is what holds 1.426 in proposed)
<Laney> it probably wasn't arch: all when that upload happened
<seb128> that was changed in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-session/3.30.0-0ubuntu4
<didrocks> ah, it was hold in proposed at that time
<didrocks> uploaded before, but stuck there
<didrocks> so yeah, not present in the release pocket
<didrocks> I guess we need to make it arch-specific again
<Laney> just exclude it in the seed
<didrocks> yeah, good idea as well
<didrocks> does [!s390x] works? (I don't see any negative syntax in the seed)
<didrocks> work*
<didrocks> or you need to list all arch "in"? (which doesn't seem a big advantage compared to have ubuntu-session mentioning the arches itself)
<Laney> yes it works
<Laney> try something like "git log -p -S !s390x"
<didrocks> with a \, indeed, there are some examples
<Laney> :3
<didrocks> Thx!
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> Added ubuntu-session to desktop [s390x]
<didrocks> grrrr
<didrocks> I blacklisted it in desktop-minimal
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN, Laney, world
<didrocks> but as there desktop -> desktop-minimal
<didrocks> it includes it without blacklisting it seems
<didrocks> do we really want ubuntu-session to be arch:all ?
<didrocks> it's not installable on s390x anyway, so why making it available for it?
<Laney> that's normal for arch:all packages
<Laney> it doesn't mean installable on all architectures, it means a build on one architecture can be installed on all of them
<Laney> hey duflu
<didrocks> so, I have to duplicate in 2 seeds, just this one package, which doesn't sound right to me
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, en forme?
<oSoMoN> seb128, bien, et toi?
<seb128> nickel!
<seb128> oSoMoN, do you know how to flag bugs like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ibus-unikey/+bug/1803270 so we have them on our backlog to triage? (unsure if it's a real issue or not, I guess maybe we need to bundle more ibus-* to solve it?)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1803270 in ibus-unikey (Ubuntu) "Support for Snap Apps" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> didrocks: I get
<Laney> Removed ubuntu-session from desktop [s390x], desktop-minimal [s390x]
<Laney> isn't that right?
<didrocks> Laney: this is because of my last commit
<didrocks> where I doubled the removal in desktop seed
<didrocks> try without it, you will see
<Laney> I pointed it at my local branch
<didrocks> you specified the arch blacklist yourself?
<didrocks> only in desktop-minimal?
<Laney> top commit is 1aa52ff97feb1d1a2b8cc6db0c7baa74318a7666
 * Laney reads the log
<Laney> maybe it cloned it anyway
<didrocks> weird, I'm on cosmic and this wasn't what I gotâ¦ are you sure it didn't pull from the server?
<Laney> * Cloning branch disco of file:///home/laney/dev/canonical/release/seeds/ubuntu/
<didrocks> humâ¦
<didrocks> I clearly had Removed ubuntu-session from desktop-minimal [s390x]
<didrocks> + Add on desktop
<didrocks> before the commit in HEAD
<oSoMoN> seb128, not sure how to ensure this kind of bug doesn't slip through, a "snap" tag maybe?
<didrocks> Laney: cosmic as well, I guess?
<Laney> yeah
 * didrocks puzzled
<seb128> oSoMoN, k, let's do that, I was asking in case there was a process for triaging those already
<didrocks> Laney: at worst, we can try reverting the last commit, see this is a no-op
<didrocks> (doesn't impact ubuntu-meta)
<oSoMoN> seb128, not a formal one, no
<didrocks> but I pasted the exact output above :(
<Laney> :<
<oSoMoN> seb128, I asked the reported for more info
<seb128> oSoMoN, thx
<didrocks> well, if the hack isn't needed in the end, would be for the betterâ¦
<Laney> it would be really weird, probably a germinate bug, if that was needed
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> Laney: not related, but all those removals are listed because there is only one deep dep taken by germinate (so all desktop-common packages are unlisted)
<didrocks> then, we have the dep between ubuntu-desktop -> ubuntu-desktop-minimal which fullfills the deps
<Laney> I probably would have expected -minimal packages to have Task: ubuntu-desktop too
<Laney> but dunno if that's a legitimate expectation
<didrocks> we want to install the minimal tasks independently though, no?
<Laney> like apt install ubuntu-desktop^ to select every desktop package directly
<didrocks> this would still work, no? as we have the metapackage depâ¦
<didrocks> (but I might be wrong, feel free to do the changes you feel are necessary)
<Laney> I know it *works* because of the dependency, I'm saying that I would have probably expected them to still also be in the full ubuntu-desktop task
<didrocks> so you mean: ubuntu-desktop: ubuntu-desktop-minimal desktop-common
<didrocks> correct?
<didrocks> (but we could argue the same for minimal and standard, no?)
<didrocks> as desktop-common deps on those
<didrocks> and were never included on ubuntu-desktop
<Laney> those get Priority fields to match, so seem a bit different to me
<Laney> I think ubuntustudio did a 'core' split or something in the way I'm talking about
<didrocks> I'm not opposed to readding desktop-common as well
<didrocks> noting it down
<Laney> probably not a very big deal
<didrocks> I have no clear opinion TBH, the benefit is that the diff between ubuntu-desktop and ubuntu-desktop-minimal would only show what's in addition for ubuntu-desktop
<Laney> you'd still be able to look for packages that have Task: ubuntu-desktop and *not* Task: ubuntu-desktop-minimal
<didrocks> yeah
<Laney> grep-aptavail -sPackage -FTask ubuntustudio-desktop --and --not -FTask ubuntustudio-desktop-core
<didrocks> yeah, just not as trivial than pure apt :p so ok, we can add the dep (probably later, once the image thingy would be more advance, keeping a note)
<didrocks> reverted HEAD here, let's see
 * didrocks puzzled, no change found as well nowâ¦ It's not even like it took a commit in between as I had Add/Remove
<didrocks> anyway, let's revert this, and see if someone else triggers it, net benefit: one less hack :p
<didrocks> adding desktop-common while I'm at it
<doko> mozjs60 ftbfs with test failures on s390x. would you terribly mind if I remove the binaries? or do you want to have a look at fixing that?
<Laney> neither of those, why not leave it?
<Laney> (what binaries?)
 * Laney cries at nautilus
<seb128> Laney, what's the issue?
<Laney> patch rebasing is a pain
<doko> Laney: blocking icu, so if you're ok with the removal ...
<Laney> doko: it failed to build everywhere?
<doko> no, just s390x
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mozjs60/60.2.3-1build1
<doko> and there's also texlive-bin uninstallability which would require two MIRs
<jbicha> doko: I think the texlive problem for transitions is just Debian bug 913542
<ubot5> Debian bug 913542 in src:teckit "teckit: Fails to build on Ubuntu's ppc64el (symbols)" [Important,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/913542
<doko> mozjs looks like a rounding error
<doko> jbicha: I fixed that already
<jbicha> oh, are you going to NMU it then?
<Laney> I should make a card for this nautilus stuff
<doko> no, you could do these NMUs the same as I can do
<Laney> a bit more civility would be nice
<dgadomski> seb128: hey, re: bug #1755490 - sorry, my filters ate the notification about your reply and I noticed it today, provided the information you requested
<ubot5> bug 1755490 in unity-settings-daemon (Ubuntu) "Incorrect information about display shown in unity-control-center" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1755490
<seb128> dgadomski, hey, thx
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-11-15
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<duflu> Hi seb128
<seb128> hey duflu
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<jibel> Good morning
<oSoMoN> salut jibel
<jibel> Salut oSoMoN, Ã§a va?
<oSoMoN> jibel, bien, et toi?
<jibel> oSoMoN, bien, il fait beau et le w-e est proche :)
<clobrano> good mornig all o/
<oSoMoN> good morning clobrano
<clobrano> hi oSoMoN :)
<clobrano> seb128: could you schedule some time to reply on this Yaru issue? https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/issues/925 it seems that gnome-initial-setup uses a different icon when launched soon after ubuntu installation than when launched lately
<gitbot> ubuntu issue 925 in yaru ""Welcome to Ubuntu" icon isn't squared" [Icon Theme, Info-Needed, Open]
 * Laney nods solemnly
<seb128> clobrano, adding to my backlog
<clobrano> seb128: thanks!
<seb128> didrocks, I don't really "use" github actively, but I've an account (and I PRed a systemd change that got merged on friday :p)
<seb128> should be enough to Cc me :)
<didrocks> I tried @seb128
<didrocks> other handle?
<didrocks> or just github which didn't find you?
<seb128> I don't know how github works
<seb128> https://github.com/seb128/ is my page
<seb128> maybe I need to enable some option to be CCable?
<didrocks> weird, @seb128 should have worked though
<didrocks> I don't think so
<seb128> k, no idea then
<didrocks> maybe because you never commented on the project and there is a "no spam" option?
<didrocks> unsure
<seb128> yeah, on a systemd PR it autocompletes for me
<seb128> so I guess github has some smartness
<seb128> likely to limit errors/long&useless completion list
<Laney> you only get completions for people that are known in that project yeah
<seb128> hey Laney!
<Laney> hi there
<Laney> what's up
<didrocks> makes sense
<Laney> bug: "this bug will crash your desktop" laney: "ooh, let me try"
<Laney> /o\
<Laney> (https://bugs.launchpad.net/snapd/+bug/1795279)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1795279 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "18.10 Wayland session closes when using Slack and possibly other Electron snap app" [High,New]
<seb128> Laney, so you confirm the bug? ;)
<Laney> I just commented.
<seb128> thx
<seb128> looks like it's known as  bug #1754693
<ubot5> bug 1754693 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "Xwayland/Xorg crashed with SIGSEGV in st_renderbuffer_delete() from _mesa_reference_renderbuffer_() [often when running Skype or Slack snaps]" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1754693
<seb128> ah, I see you just tagged that one
<seb128> Laney is one step ahead :)
 * seb128 goes back to updating poppler
 * Laney is watching the govt fall apart
<kenvandine> jamesh: thanks for the fontconfig patch!
<kenvandine> I'll get that uploaded today
<jibel> didrocks, lp:~jibel/livecd-rootfs/seed_snap_on_layered_squashfs proposed for review
<jbicha> seb128!
<jamesh> kenvandine: it was a bit of a pain getting things together, given how the changes were all applied via rebase and interspersed with other work.  I think I got everything needed though.
<kenvandine> jamesh: great
<kenvandine> yeah, it looked kind of nasty :)
<jamesh> SRU'ing 2.13 kind of feels less risky
<seb128> hey again, good afternoon desktopers!
<seb128> quiet day from seeing the backlog
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<seb128> hey kenvandine, how are you?
<seb128> kenvandine, jamesh, I'm going to state it again, but I think the fontconfig SRU is the wrong approach/solution to that problem, it also feels risky as a SRU and abusing our position of snap upstream to change something in the distro which is not needed by the distro itself
<kenvandine> seb128: good
<kenvandine> seb128: we are out of ideas :/
<kenvandine> it is useful in the distro those, we do have seeded snaps effected by this
<kenvandine> s/those/though
<seb128> you are using the distro to workaround a problem in the snap/tech imho
<seb128> I already pointed that in the email discussion, but you are not going to get away the same way on other distros
<seb128> Debian isn't going to do a stable-serie-upload of the new fontconfig to sort that problem
<kenvandine> yeah, it doesn't help other distros
<kenvandine> we know
<kenvandine> but at least it helps ubuntu
<kenvandine> seb128:  but... this is going to bite us again too
<seb128> I know what you do it, that SRU is a strach though imho ... but I'm not in the SRU team so let's see what they say about it
<seb128> kenvandined, I guess flatpak didn't solve that problem either? might be worth talk to alex about what he thinks a solution would be
<kenvandine> they did solve it with the uuid change
<kenvandine> that makes the cache relocatable
<kenvandine> but i don't think that helps us
<seb128> how is our situation different from theirs?
 * kenvandine tries to remember
<kenvandine> actually that isn't solving the fontconfig version mismatches
<kenvandine> we do allow the snaps read access to the cache, the problem is the cache version mismatch
<kenvandine> we can access them via path or uuid
<seb128> but I though they had different filenames?
<seb128> for the different versions
<kenvandine> they do
<seb128> so we basically need one cache or each version?
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> we need to generate caches for each
<kenvandine> or
<seb128> we could basically have an helper that static build/include the other fontconfig version that that does a cache generation on the client
<kenvandine> there was a problem with that... but i can't recall what
<seb128> like on bionic have a fontconfig-cache-cosmic which includes libfontconfig from cosmic and LD_PRELOAD that to do the fc-cache
<seb128> oh well
<kenvandine> we would need it to be bundled with snapd
<seb128> let's see how the SRU goes then
<seb128> well, since you want a distro hack you could do a distro hack
<kenvandine> seb128: well your idea could help make it more future proof :)
<seb128> like add that helper/lib to gnome-session
<kenvandine> we would prefer not a distro hack :)
<seb128> rather than changing libfontconfig for all users
<seb128> you do distro hack by doing a SRU
<kenvandine> i know
<seb128> that would be a less risky SRU
<kenvandine> nobody is happy with that :)
<seb128> well that's a suggestion in case the fontconfig SRU feels like not SRU material
<seb128> do SRU a generate-new-cache hack in some component (or new package)
<seb128> but yeah, ideally snapd would do that
<kenvandine> i think that might be the longer term solution
<seb128> also if the cache needs to be generated once
<seb128> does it mean it's the first start of the first app?
<seb128> I guess not since the snap can't write to a system location, so it doesn't benefit others...
<kenvandine> right now it's per snap
<kenvandine> but if snapd did it
<kenvandine> or snapd's userd could do it in the user's session
<kenvandine> then it would just refresh the cache for the user and all snaps run by that user would benefit
<seb128> right
<seb128> anyway, I know it's not an easy problem, thanks for looking at it
<seb128> sorry for being negative about the SRU, it's just the backlog comments that made me feel again that this SRU was a strech and a bit risky
<jbicha> there is one package (maybe fontconfig?) that can cause annoying issues with missing letters in apps when it is updated to a new version until you log out or restart
<seb128> that's the sort of problem that SRU testing should hopefully catch if that's an issue
<jbicha> I saw a Debian user yesterday complaining about the "Kelp" and "dd or Remove Software" menu items he was seeing
<seb128> I've the sort of corruptions without package updates on my old laptop, just after suspend/resume sometime, it can also be video drivers issues
<jbicha> unfortunately, that kind of bug also shows if we try to SRU a UI font like Cantarell or Ubuntu
 * kenvandine hates touching fontconfig
<jbicha> kenvandine: Seb touched it last so he's responsible for it now! ð¸
<kenvandine> :-D
<seb128> well seems like now kenvandine is touching it \o/ :)
 * Laney takes baby steps
<Laney> distro patches DIE DIE DIE
 * Laney missed the change to make a Sideshow Bob reference
<Laney> chance*
<Laney> for shame
<seb128> lol
<bcurtiswx> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/8Gx3ZzRkXX/ and https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/rnJfMzTqq9/ im looking for duplicates in launchpad currently
<seb128> bcurtiswx, what is in the make.log?
<bcurtiswx> the 2nd link is the tail of that log
<seb128> tseliot, ^
<bcurtiswx> its a just updated disco on Linux Neon 4.18.0-10-generic #11-Ubuntu SMP Thu Oct 11 15:13:55 UTC 2018 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
<bcurtiswx> not just dist upgrades but a daily package update
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-11-16
<RAOF> Ahem. I appear to have just managed to crash the GNOME Shell lock screen back to my session.
<RAOF> I thought that wasn't meant to be possible.
<duflu> RAOF: I would not have imagined so. Can you try looking for evidence? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses#Missing_a_crash_report_or_having_a_.crash_attachment
<jamesh> Just noticed I've got the dock displaying over the top of the lock screen
<jamesh> which is useful to start or stop applications without restarting
<sarnold> that might be 1769383 or 1803595
<sarnold> maybe both
<duflu> Yes... jamesh: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock/+bug/1769383
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1769383 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu Disco) "Ubuntu dock/launcher is shown on the lock screen" [High,In progress]
<jamesh> I'm pretty sure I haven't installed dash-to-dock
<jamesh> just have ubuntu-dock installed
<duflu> jamesh, that's an Ubuntu dock bug
<jamesh> duflu: the reproduction instructions seem to be about having both installed
<duflu> jamesh, I am correcting that user now :)
<duflu> jamesh, herding cats... where those "cats" are people who install gnome-shell extensions and break their machines in countless other ways
<RAOF> Oh, that's right.
<RAOF> The lock screen is provided by gnome-shell, so if it dies you're back in the session.
<RAOF> duflu: I don't have a crash file (it might have auto-submitted), but if there's code that tries to ensure that GS comes back as a lock screen if it crashes while being at the lock screen, that code is buggy :)
<duflu> RAOF: I agree with that statement but do not know the details
<RAOF> Hm. I don't think âbaby mashing keys at the lock screen crashes GS which then restarts into the sessionâ is a particularly actionable bug, sadly. I don't seem to have an apport dump for that.
<jamesh> duflu: I found a GJS stack trace related to ubuntu-dock in the journal.  That could be related.
<jamesh> attached to the bug now
<sarnold> you'd think every screenlocker author would know that a five year old is mandatory testing equipment..
<RAOF> The good thing here is that switching to Wayland fixes it (by making every gnome-shell crash kill every process in the session âº)
<duflu> jamesh, can you find an error message that was above the stack trace?
<jamesh> duflu: there are a number of ones like: gnome-shell[5626]: ../../../../gobject/gsignal.c:2641: instance '0x560d42322850' has no handler with id '6357714'
<jamesh> andyrock: gnome-shell[5626]: Object Meta.WindowActor (0x560d5092bb
<jamesh> 00), has been already deallocated â impossible to access it. This might be cause
<jamesh> d by the object having been destroyed from C code using something such as destro
<jamesh> y(), dispose(), or remove() vfuncs.
<jamesh> stupid autocomplete.  that was just "and:"
<jamesh> It's not obviously connected to the stack trace
<duflu> jamesh, that second one is what I would expect to see associated with stack traces
<duflu> Although its unclear if any of this is really related to the bug
<jamesh> yep.  I see multiple occurences of it.
<jamesh> does gnome-shell attempt to disable extensions when locking the screen?
<duflu> No idea
<jamesh> duflu: it is definitely disabling and enabling extensions during lock/unlock.  So failing to disable the extension leaves it active on the lock screen
<duflu> jamesh, do you mean disabling or just hiding?
<duflu> I mean they would still be resident most likely
<jamesh> duflu: I think they stay resident, but their disable() function is called on lock, and enable() on unlock
<duflu> OK. So there are two definitions of disable for extensions :S
<jamesh> it's probably the same code path that gets run when you toggle them in gnome-shell-extension-prefs or the website
<duflu> That makes me more concerned in general. It means any buggy extension that is installed and disabled could still break the shell
<jamesh> yep.
<jamesh> Despite being written in an interpreted language, they've got a similar ability to corrupt the application state as C code would
<duflu> jamesh, I don't think "disable" is the right way to expect shell elements to be hidden under the lock screen though. That should be a simple paint ordering issue
<duflu> But that's just my expectation and maybe not how it works
 * duflu glares at the Unity launcher he spent so many hours fixing the paint ordering for
<jamesh> well, elements like the top panel are the same on the lock screen.  The different session mode just turns some elements like the app and settings menus on and off
<jamesh> I guess ubuntu-dock looks like a similar screen element
<duflu> I mean that gnome-shell comes with a dock of its own. We should be able to hide the ubuntu-dock in the same way as the default one gets hidden. That's not an extension
<duflu> Damn, /Summer is Coming/
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Hi didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<ricotz> good morning
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning ricotz and oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu, ricotz
<ricotz> oSoMoN, duflu, hi
<Laney> fwoop fwoop
<duflu> ð¢ Hi Laney
<Nafallo> hi!
<duflu> Hi there Nafallo
<duflu> and with that I shall prepare to weekend
<Nafallo> :-)
<Nafallo> had I known I was your indicator I would have said hi sooner ;-)
<tjaalton> no seb?
<Laney> not today
<tjaalton> ok
<tseliot> bcurtiswx: I have just uploaded nvidia-graphics-drivers-390_390.87-0ubuntu3 . That will fix the problem with linux 4.18.0-10-generic
<ricotz> Laney, hi, could you sync vala 0.42.3-1 from debian?
<Laney> ricotz: it will autosync
<ricotz> oh, I see, I expected this would have happened already, that is why I asked
<Laney> I think it's off atm due to ongoing transitions, but should be back soon
<ginggs> tseliot: works for me, thanks!  btw, is 410 planned for 19.04?
<tseliot> ginggs: yes, I have it in a ppa for testing
<tseliot> ginggs: https://launchpad.net/~albertomilone/+archive/ubuntu/nvidia-glvnd-temp
<ginggs> tseliot: thanks, i'll give it a spin with cuda 9.2 and 10 soon
<tseliot> ginggs: thanks
<jibel> Good morning
<oSoMoN> have a good week-end desktoppers!
<popey> kenvandine: I'm getting that popup in firefox snap again telling me it can't update :(
<kenvandine> popey: yeah, oSoMoN filed a bug about it
<kenvandine> popey: I'll probably have him work on it after he finishes some other stuff
<kenvandine> If nobody else fixes it first
<popey> surely there's some build-time flag we can set?
<popey> because the deb surely doesn't do this
<kenvandine> Nope
<popey> The deb pops this up?
<kenvandine> Not sure
<kenvandine> This is a new thing in Firefox
<kenvandine> There might be some logic in the code for those packages
<kenvandine> That isn't honored in the snap
<kenvandine> Oh right, because Firefox isn't built just for the snao
<kenvandine> So even if there is a build flag, it wouldn't help for the snap
<kenvandine> The snap is built from the same binary they release
<popey> ah
<kenvandine> popey: so we need some runtime logic to disable this
<popey> https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/questions/1197474
<kenvandine> Which Mozilla has done for some other things in the snap
<popey> https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/questions/1233924
<popey> seems other (enterprise users) have also made noise about this
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-11-11
<jamesh> robert_ancell_: I'm not sure if you'll run into it yourself, but snapd-glib really doesn't like running in an app linked to libjson-c due to symbol conflicts with libjson-glib
<robert_ancell> jamesh, oh really?
<robert_ancell> Do you know which symbols?
<jamesh> robert_ancell_: if you ever run into weird errors where json_object_get_type() is returning something it couldn't possibly be, check if the right one is being called
<jamesh> in snapd-glib, I was hitting a line "if (json_node_get_value_type (node) != JSON_TYPE_OBJECT) {" where get_value_type() was returning the GType for JsonObject, but JSON_TYPE_OBJECT was returning 0
<jamesh> and adding some debug prints caused the app to crash (since the two json_object_get_type functions take different arguments)
<jamesh> I don't think there is anything you can realistically do about it though.
<robert_ancell> jamesh, is this because snapd-glib is linking to one version and the app using snapd-glib is linking to another?
<jamesh> robert_ancell: yeah.  The old version of Pulse Audio in xenial was linking to libjson-c
<robert_ancell> oh, libjson-c and libjson-glib. I missed  that.
<jamesh> so when it dlopened a module linking to libsnapd-glib, the libjson-c symbols took precedence
<robert_ancell> Right, there's probably no solution if both libraries are using the same symbols :/
<robert_ancell> Unless there's some linking flags to fix this.
<robert_ancell> Is libjson-c deprecateD?
<jamesh> robert_ancell: lucky for me, this had caused problems for other GNOME apps linking to libpulse, so they switched to an internal json parser library
<jamesh> so I ended up backporting that
<robert_ancell> nice.
<jamesh> libjson-c isn't associated with GNOME or any other big project.  I think it still makes releases
<vicky> jbicha: Okay.. I already filed a bug https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gdm/issues/507
<gitbot> GNOME issue 507 in gdm "gdm3 login screen is blank and does not show greeter" [2. Needs Information, Opened]
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<marcustomlinson> morning oSoMoN
<marcustomlinson> oSoMoN: I noticed that chromium's drm is a little broke. Is this known?
<marcustomlinson> Widevine is detected here but I get a DRM_NO_KEY_SYSTEM error: https://bitmovin.com/demos/drm
<marcustomlinson> oh it might be that I've downloaded the wrong version of widevine
<marcustomlinson> do you know how to determine which version is for your chrome?
<oSoMoN> good morning marcustomlinson
<oSoMoN> I'd recommend downloading the chrome deb matching the version number of chromium, and extracting libwidevinecdm.so from there
<marcustomlinson> Ok cool Iâll try that sometime today
<marcustomlinson> thx
<marcustomlinson> oSoMoN: I assume there are legal implications to us shipping widevine in our snap?
<oSoMoN> yes, basically we can't do that
<JanC> chromium can't download it itself?
<oSoMoN> JanC, if you're referring to widevine, there's no built-in mechanism in chromium to download and enable it like there is in firefox
<Laney> moin
<Trevinho> hey Laaaney
<Laney> yo Trevinho
<oSoMoN> hey Laney, Trevinho
<Trevinho> hey oSoMoN
<Laney> o/ oSoMoN
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-11-12
<jibel> morning all
<marcustomlinson> morning jibel
<jibel> Hi marcustomlinson
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> salut didrocks
<didrocks> salut jibel, Ã§a va ?
<jibel> didrocks, Ã§a va et toi?
<didrocks> Ã§a va :)
<marcustomlinson> morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson
<didrocks> didn't feel too lonely yesterday? :)
<marcustomlinson> Haha was quiet. I donât mind it ;)
<didrocks> ;)
<tkamppeter> I posted here about keyboard problems, I think last Wednesday, a Lenovo technician came and fixed it, is all OK now and not a Ubuntu (desktop) bug.
<marcustomlinson> tkamppeter: good to know :)
<dupondje> Are there plans to upgrade network-manager to 1.20.6 ?
<dupondje> On Eoan
<marcustomlinson> tkamppeter: ^?
<tkamppeter> dupondje, no, there was no talk about this and also Eoan is not an LTS, so the work of such an high-impact change is not worthwile and the time until it is tested and regressions are fixed can be too long for the 9-month live time.
<dupondje> tkamppeter: ok np :) Just wanted it to have it working fine with iwd 1.0. But I'll build my own then :)
<seb128> goood morning desktopers
<marcustomlinson> something is up with the clipboard in ubuntu: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mutter/+bug/1852183
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1852183 in mutter (Ubuntu) "copy/paste (clipboard) is broken in Ubuntu 19.10" [Undecided,New]
<marcustomlinson> it's not a wayland thing, I see this on X
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: mh, weird, I can have a look though
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: have you seen if there's something gnome issues upstream?
<marcustomlinson> thanks Trevinho, I've done a bunch of googling there was one bug somewhere about performance but not this
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: is there an easy reproducer?
<marcustomlinson> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/issues/824
<gitbot> GNOME issue 824 in mutter "Clipboard issue with virt-manager/spice-gtk" [Opened]
<Trevinho> as reading the bug I dind't encounter a clear way
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: if you watch my screencasts you'll see it's pretty easy to produce
<marcustomlinson> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mutter/+bug/1852183/comments/2
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1852183 in mutter (Ubuntu) "copy/paste (clipboard) is broken in Ubuntu 19.10" [Undecided,New]
<Trevinho> carlos mentioned a change in https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/issues/824 that is just wayland only though
<gitbot> GNOME issue 824 in mutter "Clipboard issue with virt-manager/spice-gtk" [Opened]
<marcustomlinson> right, but that bug doesn't really sound related
<Trevinho> in arch they say it just works when disabling the clipboard manager, so indeed related (see https://bugs.archlinux.org/task/63881#comment182271)
<seb128> marcustomlinson, you should report it on gitlab, the clipboard management was moved out of gnome-settings-daemon this cycle so it's possible the new implementation has issues
<marcustomlinson> seb128: though it looks like weâre on the same version of mutter as Debian (unstable) and itâs not broken there
<Smaug> hey all -- I'm on 16.04.  a python pip package I want to install requires CMake 3.6, while 16.04 only has 3.5.    So I am considering purging cmake and building it from source (either 3.6 or a more recent version).  What I want to know is, could having a later version of cmake cause problems with installing other programs in the future that except no later than 3.5?
<Smaug> *expect
<davidkrauser> Smaug: if you're worried about that, you can install CMake somewhere outside the system PATH (like $HOME/.local/bin for example)
<ogra> Smaug, sudo snap install cmake --classic
<ogra> (brings you 3.15.x ...)
<seb128> marcustomlinson, you are sure it's not broken there? also Debian defaults to wayland
<marcustomlinson> seb128: if you see my Debian sceencast in the last comment, can't reproduce the issue
<marcustomlinson> regardless of whether I'm on wayland or x11 (I didn't make that clear)
<marcustomlinson> seb128: oh damn, wait you're right
<marcustomlinson> I didn't switch to X properly...
<marcustomlinson> The same issue can be seen on X in Debian, sorry, I will report this upstream
<seb128> thx
<marcustomlinson> thank you
<Smaug> davidkrauser: ogra: thanks for the suggestions will look into! :)
<Smaug> davidkrauser: but another question I have is -- *should* i be worried about it?
<Smaug> i don't know enough about package installation to say
<Smaug> assuming that in general I am using apt-get for things
<marcustomlinson> alright, I'm out. Have good evening everyone
<davidkrauser> Smaug: that's a hard question to answer. Really just brings to mind more questions: what changed between CMake 3.5 and 3.6? Were any of those breaking changes? Were there any bugs introduced in 3.6 that weren't in 3.5?
<davidkrauser> We can also ask ourselves questions like: What will go wrong if there is an incompatibility with 3.6 and some other package? And how can we fix it?
<davidkrauser> These sorts of questions are asked whenever a package is updated in an Ubuntu  stable release: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<Smaug> davidkrauser: thanks
<davidkrauser> Smaug, I think in your case, you may be fine. But every setup is different, and I haven't looked at all into what changed
<Smaug> i appreciate it!
<davidkrauser> but worst case scenario, you can always remove the new version of CMake and go back to the old
<Smaug> ogra: how do I make ubuntu use the snap installed cmake?  doing `cmake --version` on command line after installation shows old snap.  specifically, how would I make a pip-installer use it?
<davidkrauser> Smaug is this the first snap you've installed?
<davidkrauser> may need to log out/log in if so
<Smaug> on this computer?  not sure
<Smaug> seems so
<Smaug> really?
<JanC> marcustomlinson: does it happen with all types of text or only with special text like e.g. file paths & URLs & such?
<davidkrauser> Smaug: actually, do you still have the old cmake installed? If you look at `echo $PATH` you'll see that `/snap/bin` is at the end of the list. If the `cmake` command shows up earlier in a folder in that list, it will use that version
<davidkrauser> Smaug: you can temporarily get around that in your terminal by setting your PATH to something like `export PATH=/snap/bin:$PATH`. Then if you run `cmake --version` you should see the right version
<Smaug> ah thank you!
<Smaug> that is perfect
<Smaug> so now I can have both cmakes but use the appropriate version by changing PATH
<marcustomlinson> JanC: see my screencasts on the Ubuntu bug. Was just plain text
<marcustomlinson> Easy to reproduce
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: mh, not sure I can't reproduce it... -_-
<Trevinho> just copy and paste a cell works fine here
<Trevinho> using the archive version though
<Laney> this is the clipboard bug that I was aware of, happens if you're running VMs: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1755038
<ubot5> bugzilla.redhat.com bug 1755038 in spice-vdagent "VM clipboard integration wipes clipboard contents randomly and frequently (X11 host)" [Unspecified,Assigned]
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho, just reproduced it on native Eoan, no vm
<marcustomlinson> Just keep copy and pasting over and over
<marcustomlinson> It can happen on the 3rd time, it can happen on the 30th time.
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-11-13
<Laney> laney@nightingale> snap run gedit                                                                                                                                                                                                 ~
<Laney> /bin/bash: warning: setlocale: LC_ALL: cannot change locale (en_GB.UTF-8)
<Laney> (org.gnome.gedit:22673): GLib-GIO-WARNING **: 00:35:05.530: Error creating IO channel for /proc/self/mountinfo: Permission denied (g-file-error-quark, 2)
<Laney> (org.gnome.gedit:22673): Gtk-WARNING **: 00:35:17.517: Calling org.gnome.SessionManager.Inhibit failed: GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.AccessDenied: An AppArmor policy prevents this sender from sending this message to this recipient; type="method_call", sender=":1.256" (uid=1000 pid=22673 comm="/snap/gedit/368/usr/bin/gedit " label="snap.gedit.gedit (enforce)")
<Laney> interface="org.gnome.SessionManager" member="Inhibit" error ...
<Laney> ... name="(unset)" requested_reply="0" destination=":1.20" (uid=1000 pid=1564 comm="/usr/lib/gnome-session/gnome-session-binary --syst" label="unconfined")
<Laney> I feel like that method call should have been allowed
<Laney> that's what lets gedit block shutdown until you decide to save the document or not
<Laney> (IIRC)
<Laney> kenvandine: jamesh: any opinion?
<kenvandine> Laney: i'd think that would be allowed by connecting the desktop interface
<kenvandine> Laney: i don't see that output from gedit in my X session though, so maybe wayland related as well?
<Laney> desktop                   gedit:desktop          :desktop                         -
<Laney> does that mean it's there?
<kenvandine> not sure, but I think we should allow access via that interface
<Laney> it only denies once you've typed something btw
<kenvandine> ah... i am seeing that
<Laney> nod
<kenvandine> jdstrand: ^^ thoughts on the allowing inhibit session via the desktop interface?
<Laney> that's gtk_application_inhibit() https://developer.gnome.org/gtk3/stable/GtkApplication.html#gtk-application-inhibit
<jamesh> Laney: there is an inhibit interface in xdg-desktop-portal, so I suspect the main API is more powerful than is ideal
<Laney> ah I see
<Laney> jamesh: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gtk/blob/gtk-3-24/gtk/gtkapplication-dbus.c#L436
<Laney> so I would guess that we can see gnome-session on the bus, which means we're trying to use it
<Laney> does that sound plausible?
<Laney> no
<Laney> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gtk/blob/gtk-3-24/gtk/gtkapplication-dbus.c#L271
<jamesh> Laney: try running the app with GTK_USE_PORTAL=1
<kenvandine> jamesh: doesn't help
<kenvandine> jamesh: probably the gtk version in the platform is too old?
<Laney> ah if it's bionic's version that would make sense (271 isn't there)
<jamesh> perhaps? gnome-3-28-1804 looks like it contains 3.22
<kenvandine> that's what i'm thinking
<kenvandine> i can verify by building gedit with gnome-3-34-1804
<jamesh> which doesn't have the gtk_should_use_portal() short circuit
<jamesh> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gtk/blob/gtk-3-22/gtk/gtkapplication-dbus.c#L175
<Laney> indeed
<Laney> need 3.24.0 for that
<jamesh> I do wonder if the gtk_application_get_proxy_if_service_present() call to get the inhibit portal proxy is going to work or not though
<jamesh> i.e. will the calls it uses to determine if the name is available be blocked, since they'd allow enumerating any bus name
<Laney> D-Bus using clients are going to have a bad time if this stuff (GetNameOwner / NameOwnerChanged) doesn't work
<Laney> btw (slightly different topic)
<jamesh> they're allowed by desktop-legacy
<jamesh> the main problem is that the AppArmor dbus integration is too low level for the type of filtering we usually want to do
<jamesh> but then we need desktop-legacy anyway for a11y and input methods
<jamesh> (those APIs leak like a sieve as far as confinement goes)
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> we found that if a gsettings key is at its default value, and the value is overridden in the host by a gsettings override, you don't see that overridden value inside the snap
<Laney> I guess we're only getting things which are set in the user's dconf database?
<jamesh> we've got settings mostly worked out for the case where portals are enabled
<jamesh> the desktop wide settings required by the Wayland GTK backend are accessed via a D-Bus portal API that provides read-only access to theme name, font name, etc
<jamesh> application settings are stored in a keyfile local to the app
<jamesh> no need to talk to dconf at all
<Laney> it's about reading where the host's default differs from the snap's
<Laney> but indeed it was for the cursor theme in this case, which will be covered by that portla
<jamesh> right.  we get the host default theme names because the xdg-desktop-portal service is running outside of confinement
<jamesh> for application settings, the confined app never sees host settings: default or otherwise
<Laney> I guess I can see that this makes sense
<jamesh> and since the settings end up in a keyfile in $XDG_CONFIG_HOME (which will be in $SNAP_USER_DATA or $SNAP_USER_COMMON), they get managed with the rest of the confined app's data
<jamesh> so e.g. you won't end up with stale settings in your dconf database after uninstalling a snap
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> salut didrocks
<didrocks> salut jibel, Ã§a va ?
<jibel> didrocks, bien et toi?
<jibel> trying to reproduce bug 1848856
<ubot5> bug 1848856 in grub2 (Ubuntu Focal) "Upgrade from 19.04 to 19.10 with zfs on root fails with grub syntax error" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1848856
<jibel> I don't know where this cr charachter comes from
<didrocks> jibel: Ã§a va. Didn't way say that it could come in a mirror disk situation?
<jibel> didrocks, yeah I created the same setup mirrored disk + cache and log devices on another partition
<didrocks> interesting, we got 2 people at least getting it IIRC, so unsure
<didrocks> I think we just adapt the mock to return it
<didrocks> and ensure it's fixed
<jibel> yup
<jibel> didrocks, I cannot find 10_linux_zfs in grub's vcs. where is it?
<didrocks> the guy fixed it himself that way, so, we shouldn't be far :)
<didrocks> jibel: .in ;)
<jibel> didrocks, right but I cannot find it
<didrocks> hum, oh, you need to checkout the patched branch
<didrocks> git dpm checkout-patch
<didrocks> (or patch*ed*)
<jibel> ok
<didrocks> with ed, indeed
<didrocks> (btw, sorry for the email github action failing spam, but as it's working againâ¦ ;))
<didrocks> phew, passed!
<marcustomlinson> morning didrocks and jibel
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson
<jibel> morning marcustomlinson
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: hey, still trying to get that bug happen, what kind of vm was reproducible?
<Trevinho> low-powered one maybe?
<Trevinho> so that it might look like a race
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: the VM's I was testing on had 8GB RAM, 8 cores
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: so not really bad
<Trevinho> kvm or what?
<marcustomlinson> no, but I don't know at this point, perhaps a slower machine will trigger it more
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: kvm yes
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: uff, trying focal daily kvm, again I'm still getting the normal text pasted... -_-
<Trevinho> ok, got it now
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: mh, so it looks that mutter uses the png format as default for saving data when there are various possible types...
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: nice catch
<marcustomlinson> that would make sense
<Trevinho> although, not sure why we're then pasting it in the way to ignore the actual type, this might be because when doing multiple requests we ignore the FORMAT request from the client
<Trevinho> as the client asks us the type to paste, then we should give it the one required
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: I'm not sure LibreOffice would strictly specify type at the time of pasting. I mean, either text or an image is acceptable in a spreadsheet
<marcustomlinson> and the same would go for pasting into an email
<marcustomlinson> My guess is that it's just the copy end that is broken
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: I might have misunderstood what you meant. I think we are in agreement anyway.
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: well the copy end by default marks such copy as image....
<Trevinho> However, libreoffice should then require the actual type (like when you do "ctrl+shift+v" and you can choose the type to paste)
<Trevinho> so by default a cell can be also an image
<Trevinho> what could be wrong is both libreoffice choosing the type or mutter not doing the required conversion sometimes
<seb128> goooood morning systems
<seb128> hey marcustomlinson, Trevinho, how is it going?
<Trevinho> seb128: hey, good... Got an house :)
<seb128> oh, nice, congrats! :
<seb128> :)
<marcustomlinson> hey seb128, good thanks, how's things there?
<didrocks> hey seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, en forme?
<didrocks> Ã§a va, et toi ?
<seb128> Ã§a va bien :)
<seb128> hum, does anyone here remember how to change the nick completion mode from hexchat? (I assume it's working the same as under old xchat)
<Trevinho> no idea
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: I'm beginning to believe this may actually be LibreOffice's fault. While there's been 2 reports of "other apps doing the same thing", I fear there may have been a misunderstanding. Some people were saying sometimes the paste doesn't work or pastes something old
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: i'm thinking there could be some faulty thing there as well, but still in debugging
<marcustomlinson> I haven't reproduce this on anything other than LibreOffice yet
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: have you tried somwhere else that create a multi-type selection?
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: I've tried gnumeric, calligrasheets and abiword so far
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: you can see the possible of conversions for the selection you copied via `xclip -o -target TARGETS -selection clipboard`
<Trevinho> LO has also image/png for those
<Trevinho> and bmp
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: also the way I have to reproduce it is hitting ctrl+c/v quickly many times.. Not really a way I can reproduce with an exact schema, so not the easiest to debug
<marcustomlinson> https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/p/YPzTh6dPRy/
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: so no image/*, no way it could be misunderstood
<marcustomlinson> yeah...
<marcustomlinson> I see
<Trevinho> not sure if gimp has something doing similar things
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: abiword: https://pastebin.ubuntu.com/p/F4wpCXYQyF/
<marcustomlinson> that was from copying the text "hello"
<marcustomlinson> so let me see if I can reproduce then
<Trevinho> all this depends if the target supports svg I assume
<Trevinho> as last image type is picked iirc
<marcustomlinson> can't reproduce it from the copy in abiword
<marcustomlinson> tried by hitting ctrl+a/c/v over and over
<Trevinho> ok, I got some useful logging maybe
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: abiworld and paste to lo?
<marcustomlinson> will keep trying that
<marcustomlinson> oh wait
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: anyways, forgot to ask, there was not a bug reported upstream yet, right?
<marcustomlinson> I get "contents could not be pasted"
<marcustomlinson> when copying text from abiword and pasting into LO
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/issues/919
<gitbot> GNOME issue 919 in mutter "Copied text from rich text editors seems to be stored in the clipboard as a bitmap in X11" [Opened]
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: ok, thanks
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: don't know why I didn't think about this earlier: I ran the exact same version of the LO snap on Eoan (mutter 3.34) and Disco (mutter 3.32), reproducible on Eaon, not reproducible on Disco
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: sure, sure this indeed involves the new mutter
<marcustomlinson> just triple checking
<Trevinho> it's even true that mutter could be still right, and LO not doing all the things properly
<Trevinho> as now mutter puts itself in the middle
<marcustomlinson> I see
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: it's true that when this happens, is because LO asks mutter the TARGETS types we supports
<Trevinho> but we return only the bmp...
<vicky> Trevinho: ping
<Trevinho> vicky: pong
<vicky> Trevinho: I'm trying to get some help/pointers on a gdm issue. Do you have some time to discuss. Thank you.
<Trevinho> vicky: tell me
<vicky> Trevinho: The details are in https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gdm/issues/507
<gitbot> GNOME issue 507 in gdm "gdm3 login screen is blank and does not show greeter" [2. Needs Information, Opened]
<vicky> Trevinho: From my analysis it looks to be a gdm issue. Or the kernel update breaks the userspace application.
<Trevinho> vicky: mh, it's a bit generic, could be many things
<Trevinho> vicky: does it work in x11, at first?
<vicky> Trevinho: Do you mean uncommenting 'waylandenable=false'?
<vicky> Trevinho: Uncommented 'WaylandEnable=False' in /etc/gdm3/daemon.conf and tried. The issue is still seen. If i use lightdm then the greeter appears
<Trevinho> vicky: do you get any jouranlctl issue related to gnome-shell/gdm?
<Trevinho> vicky: also in that file enable debugging
<Trevinho> and then put all this in the bug you opened
<vicky> Trevinho: yes enabled debug in that file and took journalctl logs
<vicky> Trevinho: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gdm/issues/507#note_641344
<gitbot> GNOME issue 507 in gdm "gdm3 login screen is blank and does not show greeter" [2. Needs Information, Opened]
<Laney> why does firefox believe that I've launched an older version after upgrading to focal O_O
 * Laney runs firefox --allow-downgrade
<sarnold> Laney: I'm going to guess it's because eoan's -security firefox was built 2019-11-05 and focal's -release firefox was built 2019-11-02
<Laney> interesting theory!
<Laney> looks like it could be correct
<Laney> https://github.com/mozilla/gecko-dev/blob/master/toolkit/xre/nsAppRunner.cpp#L2442
<Laney> and the build ID for me is 20191031000133
<sarnold> I thought we had a local patch to disable that check or similar after this happened in *released* firefox versions
<sarnold> Laney: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/1830096
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1830096 in firefox (Ubuntu) "Firefox 67 in Ubuntu 18.10 thinks it's an older version" [High,Fix released]
<Laney> sarnold: aha
<Laney> might need to poke Olivier again
<Laney> i'm glad that has managed to pass me by until now :>
<sarnold> same :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-11-14
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> salut didrocks
<didrocks> salut jibel
<marcustomlinson> morning didrocks and jibel
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson
<jibel> hello marcustomlinson
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: hey, yesterday I went a bit deeper in the issue... So while it might be that mutter is envolved (as it keeps saved only images when multiple clipboard types are available), but also LO seems to ask to mutter the image type, even when multiple are available
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: if I create a bug in LO could you add a comment explaining how LO is involved?
<Trevinho> ok
<marcustomlinson> k let me do that now
<marcustomlinson> thx
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=128803
<ubot5> bugs.documentfoundation.org bug 128803 in Calc "Copy / pasting text in Calc sometimes pastes as an image" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<marcustomlinson> if you could best explain how you understand the problem
<marcustomlinson> thanks Trevinho I really appreciate all the help
<cyphermox> jibel: hey
<cyphermox> jibel: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1847785  < should we close as Invalid?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1847785 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "eoan: zfs install option - don't install on systems less than 4GB of memory" [High,Triaged]
<jibel> as opinion, it's true that it doesn't install on systems less than 4GB that's why we recommend 4GB on the download page.
<jibel> cyphermox, ^
<cyphermox> agreed
<jibel> we could enforce it in ubiquity though since it expected to fail
<seb128> gooood morning desktopers
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<kenvandine> :-D
<marcustomlinson> hey seb128
<marcustomlinson> and kenvandine
<seb128> hey kenvandine , marcustomlinson , how is it going?
<marcustomlinson> seb128: not bad thanks, you?
<seb128> I'm good thx
<didrocks> hey seb128, kenvandine
<seb128> lut didrocks, en forme aujourd'hui ?
<didrocks> seb128: fatiguÃ©, mais Ã§a va, et toi ?
<seb128> un peu pareil :)
<kenvandine> seb128: are you still using the thunderbird snap?
<kenvandine> if so.. can you please test the new version?
<seb128> kenvandine, k
<kenvandine> the latest release is in edge
<Trevinho> marcustomlinson: I think the easiest test case to check this (not dependent by LO in this case), is just open LO, copy a cel, restart it, the cell is pasted as image.
<marcustomlinson> Trevinho: could you share whatever you learn on that bug report?
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-11-15
<jibel> morning all
<didrocks> good morning
<marcustomlinson> morning jibel and didrocks
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson
<jibel> morning marcustomlinson
<jibel> it's been a quiet day :)
<ogra> vancouver ftw :)
<marcustomlinson> BOOOOOOOOOO!!
 * didrocks is scared
<didrocks> even not that many github action failure email to spam j_ibel :)
<didrocks> oh, one on the way! :p
<jibel> not even scared by spam
