#ubuntu-mobile 2008-04-14
<philidox> Seriously does ubuntu mobile exists or not?
<philidox> HELLO
<dholbach> good morning
<Hobbsee> morning dholbach 
<dholbach> hi Hobbsee
<asbjorn> hi guys ;) Got my hands on a htc shift the other day and would very much like to try out ubuntu mobile on it... Vista is making me sick... Has anyone tried UME on a shift yet?
<asbjorn> is it at all usable?
<amitk> asbjorn: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/FAQ  , short answer: No
<asbjorn> amitk: looking for the long one ;) thats why I'm in here...
<persia> asbjorn: Try installing an image.  The shift is at least listed at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded as a target
<amitk> asbjorn: I meant to say 'No, it isn't there yet, but some parts are usable'. You could try flashing an image.
<asbjorn> ok... I was wondering if there are any developers working on a shift image ( since the shift is listed as a target device ), and what the status was for that particular device..?! Would be nice to know a bit more before starting to frack up the thing ;)
<asbjorn> the development status that is ;)
<smagoun> asbjorn: I am not aware of anyone working with Ubuntu Mobile on an HTC Shift. Despite the wiki page, the only platforms used with any regularity are the Samsung Q1 and a handful of Menlow prototypes like Intel's Crown Beach reference platform. 
<amitk> asbjorn: I am not familiar with the HTC hardware, but if it is similar to the Samsung Q1's internals, then most stuff should just work.
<persia> smagoun/amitk: The Kohjinsha SH6 is also listed.  Should the SH8 also be an acceptable target?
<asbjorn> amitk: all I know is that it runs on the McCaslin platform... what the heck, I'll give it a go ;) Can't live with this crappy vista shit anymore anywayz... if everythig is shot to shit, I'll go for a regular ubuntu insted... anything but Vist - the hardware eating monster...
<smagoun> persia: The only Mccaslin-based device that's used for development is the Q1, so I'm not sure whether the SH6 or the SH8 will work. Most things should work, but I expect Wi-Fi and a few other components may cause trouble.
<asbjorn> so its only the q1 that will be supported upon release?
<asbjorn> is there not going to be a release in like 10 days?
<persia> smagoun: OK.  I was more worried about the SH6 being a specific target.  If it's more just that nobody is working on it, I'll go shopping (as nobody seems to sell what I want anyway).
<smagoun> asbjorn: I think that's the official answer, yes.
<annonymouse> hi just heard about ubuntu mobile,  i have a htc kaiser (1615)   is this possible to work
<amitk> persia: I think the page doesn't list those examples as official targets, more like examples of other devices using the same HW platform. So except for some special peripherals, the basic stuff should work across different devices.
<smagoun> annonymouse: Ubuntu Mobile will not work on the Kaiser. UM only supports devices with an x86 processor; the Kaiser uses an ARM CPU.
<annonymouse> pooh bears  thank you tho
<persia> amitk: Thanks for the clarification.  I thought it was a list of goals.
<annonymouse> is there a list of devices any where?
<amitk> annonymouse: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded
<smagoun> annonymouse: The only supported devices are the Samsung Q1 and a handful of Menlow prototypes like Intel's Crown Beach reference platform.
<annonymouse> ahh ok
<annonymouse> thank you
<Mariandroid> hello =)
<Mariandroid> is there a way to run ubuntu on an Asus MyPal A720 ?
<persia> Mariandroid: Not really.  You'd be better off with Debian ARM or something based on openembedded (unless you like cross-building and porting: if so, please share)
<Mariandroid> what you put between brackets I do not understand =)
<persia> Mariandroid: It is theoretically possible to recompile some parts of Ubuntu to work on such a device, but it'd be a lot of work, and nobody has done it yet.  If my comment above didn't make any sense, you likely don't want to do that.
<Mariandroid> =)
<Mariandroid> eh no =)
<Mariandroid> I've only ever recompiled one linuxthingie... and after a week of baking, it gave me something that failed =)
<Mariandroid> so I guess I best not go there
<Mariandroid> but do i understand correctly that if I manage to get that Debian ARM onthere I can use the same applications I'd normally use ?
<agoliveira> Mariandroid: ï»¿I don't know what OS this device of yours run but if it's a PDA, probably no.
<persia> Mariandroid: There have been varying reports of success, but unless it has a keyboard, you will likely be unsatisfied.
 * Mariandroid has the ThinkOutside Stowaway bluetooth keyboard
<persia> Anyway, here isn't the best place to discuss that :)
<Mariandroid> oh I'm sorry =)
<Mariandroid> someone on #ubuntu on dalnet suggested me to go here =)
<Mariandroid> thanks =)
<persia> Oh, if your device was supported, this would be the right place.  It's just that it's not compatible.
<Mariandroid> too bad =)
<Mariandroid> ah well, thanks =)
<Mariandroid> I'll try to find out how to get it to work
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-04-15
<dholbach> good morning
<ToddBrandt> StevenK: I notice that the project is building again, did you fix it?
<StevenK> ToddBrandt: Yes
<StevenK> Yesterday, in fact
<ToddBrandt> awesome!
<ToddBrandt> Did those two updates to cairo and pango I made hurt or help?
<StevenK> cairo didn't help, I had to replace it
<ToddBrandt> to 1.6.0?
<StevenK> Yup
<ToddBrandt> is there a primer somewhere that can help well-meaning individuals such as me correct problems rather than exacerbating them wrt the PPA dependencies?
<StevenK> All I did was try and install hildon-desktop, drilling down the dependancies until I figured out that pango couldn't be installed because the version of cairo that was available was too old
<ToddBrandt> yea, that's what I did, I started with cairo, and it seemed to work, but then when I installed pango it pushed the version needed for cairo up
<ToddBrandt> Where are you supposed to get the version info? From the source of the package in the debian/control file?
<ToddBrandt> StevenK: this is the latest error, it happens in the installation of the target fsets:
<ToddBrandt> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<ToddBrandt>   telepathy-core: Depends: telepathy-haze but it is not going to be installed
<ToddBrandt>   ubuntu-mobile: Depends: icedtea-gcjwebplugin but it is not installable
<ToddBrandt>                  Depends: pidgin-maemo but it is not going to be installed
<StevenK> Your version of MIC is trying to install telepathy
<StevenK> The version in Hardy doesn't do that
<ToddBrandt> yea, MIC puts more on there than canonical expects I think
<ToddBrandt> I'll try to fix those deps, at least with those I can only screw up an fset rather than the image
<StevenK> ToddBrandt: The problem is telepathy in the gnome-mobile fset
<StevenK> ToddBrandt: Remove the 3(?) telepathy packages, and it should sort itself out
<smagoun> StevenK: The telepathy problem burned us (MSG) too, it would have been nice if you had warned us about the change. 
<StevenK> They were unexpected
<StevenK> I wasn't aware telepathy dragged in pidgin-data
<StevenK> Until it blew up in my face
<ToddBrandt> StevenK: smagoun : The problem isn't with telepathy in the target build apparantly, it's ubuntu-mobile. And when ubuntu-mobile is in the list of packages it futzes up telepathy as well.
<ToddBrandt> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<ToddBrandt>   ubuntu-mobile: Depends: icedtea-gcjwebplugin but it is not installable
<ToddBrandt>                  Depends: pidgin-maemo but it is not going to be installed
<StevenK> ToddBrandt: Which is caused by telepathy. pidgin-maemo tries to install pidgin-maemo-data, which conflicts with pidgin-data
<ToddBrandt> great
<ToddBrandt> StevenK: so a tentative solution is to remove telepathy-core and telepathy-mission-control from the gnome-mobile fset?
<ToddBrandt> I'm trying to test moblin-applets so I couldn't care less about any of the apps
<StevenK> ToddBrandt: telepathy-core and telepathy-mission-control are just libraries.
<StevenK> ToddBrandt: They were used by moblin-chat, but we don't install that, and haven't for a while.
<ToddBrandt> good, thanks
<ToddBrandt> that's what I'll do then
<bouncy`> hi, i'm looking for a speaker covering ubuntu mobile
<bouncy`> it is for a scandinavian developers' conference in novemebr
<bouncy`> any suggestions on whom i can contact?
<agoliveira> bouncy`: Hi. I'm from the UME team. Can I help you?
<agoliveira> bouncy`: UME = Ubuntu Mobile and Embedded
<lool> bouncy`: Could you send an email to the mailing-list?
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-04-16
<randomperson83> is there a way to detect whether you're running inside a hildon desktop?
<StevenK> ToddBrandt: Still here?
<bouncy`> lool: sure, good idea
<bouncy`> thanks
<dholbach> good morning
<lool> bouncy`: I think I heard about such a request already, but it was quite far away in terms of dates WRT our current level of busy-ness :)
<slytherin> Who is maintaining bluez-utils these days?
<foka_> Hi!  I'd like to join the Ubuntu Mobile development process.  How should I start?
<foka_> What confuses me at this moment is that Ubuntu Mobile and Moblin are kind of one and the same, and yet not quite the same, and the mobile-related packages are currently somewhat behind in Ubuntu (reasonable, final stages of hardy freeze).
<foka_> So, is it better to work with Moblin (since that appears to be the upstream)?  Or with Ubuntu Mobile (since that's the final product, esp. that is properly packaged meeting guidelines)?
<foka_> Thanks!
<agoliveira> foka_: Hi. Well, moblin is basically UME upstream to some components and it's controlled  by Intel so it's better to start on UME so you can have access to the whole deal, including PPA, upload, etc
<agoliveira> foka_: What's used on UME core goes to moblin as well, BTW.
<foka_> agoliveira, Thanks for your advice!  :-)
<lool> rustyl__: call?
<rustyl__> lool, about to call in
<lool> Cool
 * agoliveira had to enter 31 digits to join the conference... creepy :)
<lool> rustyl__: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/PpaVersioning
<lool> inuka_desk: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/PpaVersioning
<slytherin> Can someone please sponsor debdiff attached to bug 191704? I had discussed this with Tollef sometime back, but I am not able to find him online today.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191704 in bluez-utils "hidd binary removed form bluez-utils package unable to connect as a result" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191704
<landley> Watching David's talk.  He mentioned this channel...
<lool> slytherin: I'm not in a particular position to test this, so I can't; perhaps StevenK is interested, and that's probably the only two persons around who can upload
<slytherin> lool: It is almost midnight for me. Can you bug him on my behalf when he is available?
<lool> StevenK: ^ 19:50 < slytherin> Can someone please sponsor debdiff attached to bug 191704? I 
<lool> slytherin: Done :)
<slytherin> :-)
 * slytherin hits bed
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-04-17
<virtualroadside> any thoughts on how to detect whether an app is running inside of UME or not?
<pteague> i'm guessing it'd be possible to run ubuntu-mobile under a vm?
<virtualroadside> sure
<virtualroadside> run it well? eh
<virtualroadside> lol
<virtualroadside> you can run it in a window on your desktop
<dholbach> good morning
<mboman> Hi
<mboman> hi
<mboman> I installed the UME stuff on my Ubuntu 7.10 laptop, and the mobile gui looks great. However, the standard Gnome has become ugly and almost unusable as it is missing checkboxes etc. Is there any way to run both the UME gui and standard gnome side-by-side (as different users)?
<mboman> I am running this on my Everex Cloudbook, a C7-M powered device with a 7" display with the resolution of 800x480 pixels
<prpplague> davidm__: hey, just a note, when you get back from CELF, TinCanTools will ship you a clear tube case for your Nail_Board
<mboman> I installed the UME stuff on my Ubuntu 7.10 laptop, and the mobile gui looks great. However, the standard Gnome has become ugly and almost unusable as it is missing checkboxes etc. Is there any way to run both the UME gui and standard gnome side-by-side (as different users)? I am running this on my Everex Cloudbook, a C7-M powered device with a 7" display with the resolution of 800x480 pixels, and want to be able to 
<agoliveira> mboman: The problem is that the window manager used on UME (matchbox) assumes a few different things like the applications will run fullscreen for instance and the applications are not usually designed to work on such different resolution so running a standard Gnome/GTK application on UME mostly works but you will encounter problems with useability.
<mboman> i mean that I have 2 different system accounts
<mboman> one for the UME stuff
<mboman> one for Gnome stuff
<mboman> UME stuff gets a 'mobile' user that auto-login to the system etc..
<mboman> then the other one is for more personalized usage
<agoliveir1> mboman: Ah, never tried this but you may indeed encounter problems as they share a few gconf keys IIRC. They weren't designed to work together.
<mboman> ok
<mboman> I'll try it out when I get back home
<inkynoob> Has anyone put Ubuntu Mobile on an eeePC? I'm googleing, but haven't found anything conclusive
 * Hobbsee wonders what the case is with realplayer
<agoliveira> inkynoob: It should work out of box except for a few things like the wifi. You will probably be able to use a kernel from ubuntu-eee project on it.
<agoliveira> inkynoob: But I wouldn't recomend due the lack of touchscreen.
<inkynoob> There's touchscreen kits, if Ubuntu Mobile looks like it'll work, I'd be very happy to install one :-)
<inkynoob> I installed ubuntu-mobile from the gutsy repositories, should I be running Hardy insteady? 
<Hobbsee> oh, headdesk.
<Hobbsee> is Brian Thomason here?
 * Hobbsee ponders giving a comprehensive list of why this package appears to be E, B & W, or just rejecting it outright.
<agoliveira> inkynoob: Yes and remember that UME is currently a moving target. Lot's of things are changing and fast.
<agoliveira> inkynoob: and, BTW, we apreciate any bug reports you may add, thank you very much :)
 * Hobbsee is told it's a partner thing.  never mind
<inkynoob> Thanks agoliveira, I'll try it out. I don't need stable, I just need something almost stable :-) I'll report any bugs I find
<agoliveira> inkynoob: UME is mostly stable, there's no big crashes around as it's mostly based on already stable software. You may find more things like applications that don't start due some missing configuration file, weird interface glitches, etc.
<inkynoob> cool
<smagoun> lool: any idea why alsa-base and alsa-utils aren't installed in your team's builds? Were they deliberately removed?
<lool> smagoun: I don't think they were, let me check
<lool> smagoun: They were not excluded in the seeds at least
<lool> Meeting in one minute
<lool> smagoun: if you discover how they are pulled on your side, I'm happy to mirror that otherwise i'll pull them via the seeds with a comment on why they are needed
<lool> #startmeeting
<MootBot> Meeting started at 18:00. The chair is lool.
<MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
<lool> Hi everybody; hope you're warm for the meeting!
<lool> Allow me to start with last weeks actions
<agoliveira> It's just 20Â°C right now but warm enough :)
<lool> agoliveira: Good enough :)
<lool> [topic] #
<lool> [topic] rustyl_ to assign ppa packages updates for the new tarball based release process [cted as blocked by lool last week and the week before that...][cted][cted]
<MootBot> New Topic:  # 
<MootBot> New Topic:  rustyl_ to assign ppa packages updates for the new tarball based release process [cted as blocked by lool last week and the week before that...][cted][cted] 
<lool> rustyl__: So I think yoy assigned remaining updates to inuka_desk, is that correct?
<lool> On that front, I have to send you the minutes from yesterday's meeting
<rustyl__> lool, yes
<lool> Cool, so closing this
<lool> (NB: The target date for the updates would be 20th / 22th the latest to be in the 24th build)
<lool> Moving on to next topic then
<lool> [topic] bspencer to list i18n status for Moblin project[cted][cted] 
<MootBot> New Topic:  bspencer to list i18n status for Moblin project[cted][cted]  
<bspencer> I've worked on that
<bspencer> polled all parties
<kyleN> :)
<bspencer>  there are still 2-3 projects needing attention
<lool> Cool; could you report on your findings? :)
<lool> bspencer: Could you list them on a wiki page?  What's the plan for these modules?
<bspencer> namely:  mobile-basic-flash.  Minimal dialogs (e.g. "Starting X app")
<lool> Ack
<bspencer> marquee also (clock?)
<bspencer> yes.  I'll put them on a wiki page
<lool> Ok; anything else on the top of your head?
<bspencer> applets, FF, and moblin-media should be done (per their owners)
<bspencer> one note about FF
<bspencer> carl explained to me how l10n pkgs would need to be tweaked
<bspencer> basically, MIDbrowser  is i18n, but the existing FF l10n pkgs won't work as-is
<lool> asac probably has a very good idea of this
<bspencer> they need to have a wrapper installer pkg
<bspencer> that unpacks the originally, tweaks the ID, then installs them.
<lool> bspencer: Could you discuss this topic with asac and cwong?
<bspencer> I think this is asac's idea.  Yes.  I'll talk to them.
<lool> asac has been recently working on the langpacks for firefox with the help of davidm, and I'm sure it wont be too hard to reuse this work for midbrowser
<bspencer> yes, right.  Reuse, just not completely free.
<lool> bspencer: Thanks; I guess this will all go to the wiki page; perhaps the one with the langpacks info is the one that makes sense, otherwise a moblin i18n status page is nice
<lool> bspencer: Do you want an action on it?
<bspencer> lool, ok.    I love action items
<lool> I guess you can easy do that immediately after the meeting, so not sure you need an explicit action
<bspencer> lool, doesn't hurt
<lool> But then it would be the occasion to strike it in two minutes
<lool> [action] (bspencer) document status of i18n of moblin modules on Ubuntu wiki; needs discussion with asac and cwong for FF
<MootBot> ACTION received:  (bspencer) document status of i18n of moblin modules on Ubuntu wiki; needs discussion with asac and cwong for FF 
<lool> [topic] GrueMaster file a bug on helix build missing alsa support
<MootBot> New Topic:  GrueMaster file a bug on helix build missing alsa support 
<lool> GrueMaster: What's the bug id?
<GrueMaster> Filed
<ToddBrandt> lool: what's the latest version of nm-applet in hardy? We have a few emergency bugs to fix in it and I need to pull the latest
<GrueMaster> I'll have to look it up
 * ToddBrandt oops, didn't know the meeting started already
<bspencer> ToddBrandt, lool  is on fire.  Lookout.
<lool> GrueMaster: Just open the list of bugs you filed on launchpad
<GrueMaster> Ok, the bug is 215242
<GrueMaster> Sorry, had browser issues.
<lool> <disappears-from-meeting> ToddBrandt: dpkg -S nm-applet => network-manager-gnome => rmadison network-manager-gnome </back-to-meeting>
<lool> GrueMaster: Thanks
 * ToddBrandt thanks
<lool> GrueMaster: I'm not exactly sure this is what we really want to fix
<GrueMaster> Ok.  What's your reasoning?
<lool> GrueMaster: I guess our toplevel target is "getting sound working in helix", and the ideal way would be to use its alsa support -- do you agree?
<lool> GrueMaster: In this case, I think we should change the way we build helix to enable alsa
<GrueMaster> This is true, but there are still other applications that use OSS.
<lool> if this fails, we should consider OSS, or if we have other requirements
<lool> GrueMaster: In our builds?  If they do, they should depend on it, and we shouldn't have to pull it manually
<GrueMaster> For example, say an end user wants wine support.
<lool> GrueMaster: helix could also be changed to pull it (depend on it)
<agoliveira> Is OSS is a good idea? Could introduce a series of blockings on the sound device
<lool> GrueMaster: wine depends on libasound2; that lets me think it would suppor talsa
<GrueMaster> There are a lot of applications that depend on oss outside of ume.
<lool> GrueMaster: And that we don't package and care about?
 * agoliveira thinks those should die and quick!
<GrueMaster> As to wine, it must be fairly new.
<GrueMaster> Yes
<lool> GrueMaster: Perhaps we should list a couple in some place and set this an explicit goal for UME then firs
<lool> t
<lool> "Support OSS for non packaged random apps that users will install"
<GrueMaster> The point is that we should be providing a stable base, and alsa-base doesn't take much room for the support it provides.
<lool> But just starting with the fact that these aren't packaged (or improperly) and not distributed by us lets me think we shouldn't care as our top priority
<GrueMaster> Also, I think the alsa power management tools are in alsa-base.
<lool> That's a much more motivating rationale for using more space in the builds :)
<GrueMaster> More space?  We're now kuibbling over a few K.
<lool> GrueMaster: So could you either change the bug report into two bug reports; one asking for alsa support in helix builds and one asking for alsa-base to be directly included for $rationale?
<GrueMaster> alsa-base has mainly a modprobe.conf file.
<lool> -either
<lool> GrueMaster: Do you agree that the two things are good and useful and that we can prioritize / discuss / implement them separately?
<lool> GrueMaster: Do you mind if I task you with the filing of the second bug and the update of the first?  :)
<GrueMaster> So, what you're asking me to do is file a separate bug for helix, then conjure up a justification for alsa-base, which is only a few K?  Is this correct?
<lool> GrueMaster: That's about it; concerning alsa what matters is that we have some good understanding of why we pull it so that anyone can look it up
<lool> If it helps save power, I'm all for it
<GrueMaster> That would be nice to know.  Why was it pulled in the first place?
<lool> GrueMaster: Probably as a dependency of something which moved to alsa now
<lool> But I don't really know, I would have to dig in old stuff to find out
<lool> GrueMaster: If that makes sense to you, I propose a couple of action items for this (IMO fast) bug work; fine with you?
<GrueMaster> I'm still fuzzy on the whole debian/ubuntu packaging dependancy thing.
<GrueMaster> Sure
<lool> GrueMaster: Well I think packages which only work with OSS and not alsa should depend on OSS, that's clear
<lool> Concerning support of non-packaged software, that's not something I know are in our current goals, but if it's something desirable we could discuss this
<lool> But trying to guess what might be useful is a slippery slope, so it needs discussion, motivations etc.
<lool> Ok, let's go for the actions then
<agoliveira> lool: as in now (for imediate release) or for next release?
<lool> [action] (GrueMaster) update #215242 to request enabling of alsa in helix builds (or a dependency on oss support in alsa)
<MootBot> ACTION received:  (GrueMaster) update #215242 to request enabling of alsa in helix builds (or a dependency on oss support in alsa) 
 * agoliveira means discussing at UDS as in "next".
<lool> [action] (GrueMaster) file new bug requesting addition of alsa-base to the seeds with the rationale of the power management features it provides
<MootBot> ACTION received:  (GrueMaster) file new bug requesting addition of alsa-base to the seeds with the rationale of the power management features it provides 
<lool> GrueMaster: TIA
<GrueMaster> TIA?
<lool> agoliveira: I think we should try having such discussions with "high level goals" for the images at UDSes, but then easy topics/goals/features not eating up too much time and consensual in nature can be added in the middle of our dev / release cycles IMO
<lool> GrueMaster: Thanks in advance :)
<GrueMaster> ah
<lool> Ok; I don't any additional action from last week
<lool> I'm moving to the current items now
<lool> [topic] Plans for Intel regarding UDS. agoliveira. 
<MootBot> New Topic:  Plans for Intel regarding UDS. agoliveira.  
<lool> I think this says it all
<agoliveira> Well, self explanatory: is there any yet?
<lool> Who from Intel is scheduled to come yet? :)
<lool> bspencer, GrueMaster, rustyl__, ToddBrandt, inuka_desk
<rustyl__> i don't have an answer yet... a request is going through managment
<lool> rustyl__: Cool; do you have an idea when we can expect to know who will come?
<lool> It's also a good time to submit topics if you didn't already
<agoliveira> the sooner the better
<rustyl__> i really don't know
<rustyl__> i'm not the decision maker on this
<lool> rustyl__: Ok; please tell us as soon as you know so that we can plan beer t-shirts and the like
<rustyl__> the Canonical/Intel rep is working this
<agoliveira> rustyl__: But you can post your ideas anyway, just in case.
<lool> Oh and action items naturally
<rustyl__> ok
<lool> Everyone loves action items
 * agoliveira usually runs from them :)
<lool> Ok; anything else to discuss in today's meeting?
 * agoliveira is ok
<ToddBrandt> loo: one thing
<ToddBrandt> the hardy ppa and the dependency problems
<lool> ToddBrandt: Go ahead
<lool> ToddBrandt: Oh right
<lool> ToddBrandt: I was on leave when your message arrived, I resumed work yesterday and saw that this was fixed, but kept it in my TODO to discuss it with you
<ToddBrandt> There seem to be alot of conflicts with hildon-desktop and telepathy, can we make sure everyone knows that when they upload to the PPA to upload all the dependecy upgrades first
<GrueMaster> I sincerely doubt I'll be going anywhere.
<lool> ToddBrandt: I'm happy to have a one to one to tell you the secret technique we share to fix these issues
<ToddBrandt> sweet
<lool> Just don't tell anyone
<ToddBrandt> heh, ok
<lool> GrueMaster: Prague!  In May!  If management doesn't allow it, take some holidays and join!
<GrueMaster> Need $$$
<GrueMaster> Otherwise I'd love to.
<lool> Hmm starting a night job wont work I guess
<lool> ToddBrandt: Let's have this next week together; on IRC or phone as you like
 * agoliveira whishes it was a little closer and not in wedding's aniversary :(
<GrueMaster> I already have one.  Plus I'm working on getting my degree.
<ToddBrandt> sounds good, let's do IRC next week around wednesday ish
<lool> [action] (ToddBrandt and lool) workshop on solving dependency issues in ppa
<MootBot> ACTION received:  (ToddBrandt and lool) workshop on solving dependency issues in ppa 
<lool> GrueMaster: Ah, poor you
<lool> GrueMaster: Join us over the phone then; there should be some setup for remote attendance
<lool> Lesser quality, but doable
<lool> Ok; I'm about to close the meeting
<GrueMaster> Yea, but the beer isn't as good.  :P
<lool> Anything else needing attention?
<agoliveira> GrueMaster: We can aways get some from Belgium :)
<GrueMaster> Still outside of my commute range.
<lool> Okely, then I'll close the meeting; I wish you all a nice day
<lool> #endmeeting
<MootBot> Meeting finished at 18:33.
<lool> ToddBrandt: Could you send me an email with your preferred dates for next week?  I /think/ sometime Tuesday would be good; I'm going to be on the east coast
<ToddBrandt> lool: will do, thanks
 * lool &
<mawhalen> lool: I lost my link to the minutes and never can find the darn things off UME launchpad, can you please send me the link
<ToddBrandt> asac: do you have the bandwidth to accept some patches to the 0.6.6 network-manager-applet package for hardy?
<smagoun> lool: re: alsa. We noticed alsa-base and alsa-utils are no longer included in our builds after we resynced with hardy+ppa. We thought you or StevenK might have removed it from the seed for some reason.
<lool> smagoun: From a quick look at the log, I don't see any message mentionning alsa
<lool> smagoun: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Eubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu.hardy/
<lool> bzr log mobile | grep -i alsa
<smagoun> lool: right, but StevenK deployed a new seed for the PPA
<lool> smagoun: Oh
<lool> smagoun: Don't see recently modified seeds at https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mobile nor https://code.launchpad.net/~stevenk
<lool> https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mobile/+archive?field.name_filter=ubuntu-meta&field.status_filter=published says some stuff was added
<smagoun> lool: I think the seed is here for some reason: http://people.ubuntu.com/~stevenk/mobile/seeds/
<lool> It must be pulling from somewhere, I wonder where
<lool> smagoun: Anyway, it wouldn't be a removal from your pov, would it?
<lool> Hmm unless it was dropped somewhere else than mobile
<lool> desktop: * gstreamer0.10-alsa
<lool> mobile: * gstreamer0.10-alsa
<lool> Is all I see in the normal seeds, so it doesn't look like it was pulled until now
<lool> smagoun: I suspect $random_package was pulling it indirectly; if you have an old image, you could check the rdeps of the package perhaps?
<smagoun> lool: yes, it is a removal. We had alsa-base and alsa-utils in our image until we synced with hardy+ppa on 14April. I'm trying to figure out where it wend
<smagoun> s/wend/went
<lool> smagoun: Tell me if you find out more :)
<asac> ToddBrandt: what kind of patch is that?
<ToddBrandt> asac: three bug fixes
<ToddBrandt> one to asdd a moko scroller to the AP list, and two to fix some behavioral issues
<asac> my bandwidth is fully utilized ;) for today and probably tomorrow. ... if those issues are really important and the patches are not that intrusive i can take a look if we can get an exception for that
<ToddBrandt> asac: ok, thanks
<asac> ToddBrandt: how intrusive are those patches?
<asac> doesn't really sound like its a single line patch
<ToddBrandt> asac: one other question, I have created a hardy project root with the latest hardy ppa snapshot and the network-manager-applet package has a couple errors in it. Have you seen that?
<ToddBrandt> asac: yea, the moko will be an added library and include and about a paragraph of moko insertion
<ToddBrandt> asac: the other two should be just a few lines hopefully
<asac> ToddBrandt: can't we push those changes to hardy ppa and intrepid?
<asac> i plan to do that for the risky changes i have for xulrunner+midbrowser as well
<ToddBrandt> asac: well, my plan is to build from the 0.6.6 latest, then push a version to the hardy ppa temporarily, then send you the patches for inclusion
<pmcgowan> bspencer, thanks for the response
<bspencer> hope it helps
<pmcgowan> bspencer, is there a possibility of enabling and disabling moko scrolling on a per application basis?
<bspencer> per application?  or within an application?
<bspencer> I /wish/ that it was the default for all apps, that would be cool.
<bspencer> but actually each app has to do extra work to get it.  So yes to your question.
<pmcgowan> I see, so in photo viewer I could not enable it
<pmcgowan> or only enable when zoomed
<bspencer> right.  that is how we would want it to work.  To disable moko when not zoomed somehow.
<pmcgowan> but you think that is tricky
<bspencer> just unknown.  The window gets added to a moko parent widget.  You probably don't want to reparent the window every time the user zooms in/out
<bspencer> seems cleaner to have moko understand the gesture itself, since it is already interpreting the mousemove events.
<bspencer> although that is overloading moko, which is designed for scrolling
<pmcgowan> hmmm, thinking
<bspencer> one option is add a patch to moko that forwards moues events when it isn't using them for panning (width/height of content <= width/height of screen).  Then have another component do the gestures.
<pmcgowan> right then we could just set a mode somehow?
<bspencer> yes, or moko just auto-knows
<bspencer> if no scroll bars needed, it switches
<pmcgowan> right
<pmcgowan> no scrolling to do, pass it through
<bspencer> then there is the question of bouncing on the edge.
<pmcgowan> ?
<bspencer> when you get to the edge of content currently, it kind of bounces it back
<bspencer> but when I recall, I don't think that bouncing works if there are no scroll bars.   Only when there is -- like at the end of a list.
<pmcgowan> but it knows there is more content than fits the window
<bspencer> yes.  So I think that strategy we just mentioned would work.
<pmcgowan> ok, so when can you bang that out :-)
<bspencer> as soon as mawhalen gives me the nod
<pmcgowan> darn, was just on the phone with her
<mawhalen> bspencer: pmcgowan ?
<bspencer> ha!  well she's been running the feature request through many meetings here.
<mawhalen> I haven't read the thread
<pmcgowan> bspencer, has it all worked out
<bspencer> mawhalen, np.  Just read pmcgowan's last few lines.
<bspencer> starting with "ok, so when can you bang that out"
<mawhalen> bspencer: do I need to talk to Terence?  8)
<mawhalen> no - really - do I need to do something here?
<bspencer> mawhalen,   we were trying to scope what the work would be for gestures
<bspencer> your favorite subject
<mawhalen> bspencer: I just saw the word gestures...
<bspencer> that's the extent of the discussion.
<mawhalen> bspencer: you can always scope it
<bspencer> pmcgowan, just throw bfiller on it.  We accept patches
<pmcgowan> bspencer, given we have the old code, seems like we could restore it in a resaonably short time?
<pmcgowan> bfiller took 4 days off, the nerve
<bspencer> pmcgowan, not so easy.    The old code conflicts with moko.  And it has no rotate support
<pmcgowan> it did have rotate support?
<bspencer> I don't think so.  Just left/right.    Maybe I'm wrong, I didn't spend much time on it -- just found the place we removed it.
<pmcgowan> no, I used it, worked great
<pmcgowan> thats why customers liked it
<pmcgowan> well seems like a change to photoviewer to restore the code, and a change to moko to pass through events if no scrolling is needed
<bspencer> yep.
<pmcgowan> is it easy to identify the old code in the tree, or can you extract and send the relevant file to me?
<pmcgowan> mawhalen, or can you assign an engineer to do what I just wrote?
<bspencer> pmcgowan, I can point you to the date when the code was removed.  anyone can pull the code from the git repository
<bspencer> praj, 
<pmcgowan> bspencer, mawhalen is not answering my staffing request
<bspencer> pmcgowan, she's a talented program manager
<pmcgowan> indeed
<bspencer> I can get you the info you need to get the gesture code from git, Yes.
<bspencer> via praj.
<bspencer> praj-laptop, 
<pmcgowan> bspencer, who works on the moko stuff for you?
<bspencer> frank li has done all that work.  PRC guy
<pmcgowan> so can he make the change to conditionally not consume the events?
<bspencer> pmcgowan, you still need to work with mawhalen.  Everyone is working on other things.  :-\   But he /could/ do that, if he were given that to do, yes.
<mawhalen> bspencer: pmcgowan talking to folks in my cube - 
<mawhalen> we do not have por to do gestures
<pmcgowan> that darn por again
<pmcgowan> who do I have to bribe?
<mawhalen> pmcgowan: i've had many an internal conversation
<mawhalen> bribe craig
<pmcgowan> he doesnt code
<pmcgowan> mawhalen, so are you saying its out of your hands, is there someone I should escalate to?
<pmcgowan> mawhalen, I think its less than a day of work
<mawhalen> yes, that is what I was trying to say
<mawhalen> pmcgowan: not what I hear, don't always trust Bob
<pmcgowan> we just simplified the design :-)
<mawhalen> actually - a really good starting point would be for someone to make use cases
<mawhalen> i don't want any ambigious requirements
<pmcgowan> mawhalen, what it used to do is the use case, it was fine
<mawhalen> really - out of my hands and I have a meeting in 2 minutes in another building, so must take off...
<pmcgowan> ok, later
<mawhalen> you'll have to keep talking to bspencer 
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-04-18
<chai_sangeen> hello everyone..
<virtualroadside> my icons disappeared on the last update, any thoughts?
<inkynoob> I installed Ubuntu Mobile on my eeePC and it starts when I log in, but there are no icons on the desktop. Should the ubuntu-mobile package pull in a certain set of apps? 
<inkynoob> There aren't any icons on my desktop, does anyone have any suggestions for what I should try? 
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> who takes care of bluetooth stuff?
<StevenK> dholbach: In terms of the bluez-utils sponsorship?
<StevenK> dholbach: If that's what you're asking, it's in the unapproved queue
<dholbach> oh? the --enable-pand and --enable-hidd upload?
<StevenK> Right
<dholbach> ah good then
<dholbach> cheers
<inkynoob> Good morning :-) 
<inkynoob> It looks like this is why I don't have icons on my desktop : ï»¿https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/hildon-desktop/+bug/219041 -- I didn't file the bug, but I'm Michael Moore that replied to it
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 219041 in hildon-desktop "No icons on UME desktop" [Undecided,New] 
<heno> from today's testing by davmor2: http://www.davmor2.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/20080418menlow.png
<davmor2> morning people I got issues with this mornings image in that it looks like this in xephyr link above
<heno> amitk, StevenK ^
<amitk> lool_: ^
<davmor2> sorry about that hard freeze
<davmor2> someone ask something?
<Hobbsee> davmor2: no
<lool_> davmor2: You can check what was uploaded recently in the ppa; the page doesn't load for me though
<agoliveira> lool_: You mean you can't open or PPA page? Is working fine from here.
<agoliveira> s/or/our
<lool_> I can't load https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mobile/+archive nor without edge
<lool_> But then my connection was cut multiple time this morning locally; perhaps my ISP has issues too
 * lool_ returns to building his menlow and packing
<agoliveira> lool_: Probably. Here is working nicely.
<lool_> agoliveira: Could you check what was uploaded recently?
<lool_> I don't know of an easy way to be notified of ppa uploads; all I get are build failures
<lool_> I'd actually like to know when people upload stuff
<cprov> lool_: the page works fine here.
<lool_> It works from a hosted server too
<lool_> Looks like a rooting issue somewhere
<lool_> telnet launchpad.net 443 gets stuck waiting for a connection
<agoliveira> lool_:   cairo - 1.6.0-0ubuntu2~804um1,           libdrm - 2.3.0-4ubuntu4~804um3               linux-ubuntu-modules-2.6.24 - 2.6.24-16.23+804ume1               moblin-applets - 0.55               pango1.0 - 1.20.1-1ubuntu1~804um1               ubuntu-meta - 1.101~804um1               ume-config-common - 0.10+upstream-0ubuntu1~804um2               xserver-xorg-video-psb - 0.2.8-0ubuntu1~804um1     
<lool_> cprov: while you're around, do you happen to know whether the pagination issue with ppa pages is pending resolution?   O:-)
<lool_> It doesn't respond to pings from here either
<lool_> Uhoh nor does archive.ubuntu.com
<cprov> lool_: the edge PPA overview is now paginated by default.
<lool_> That's not going to be fun
<lool_> cprov: Excellent!
<lool_> cprov: You mean with a mean to access the other pages, right?
<cprov> lool_: yes, that's much better.
<lool_> Cause at some point, the list of packages was cut, but there was no link to the next page
 * lool_ jumps on IS to check whether it's "only me"
<cprov> lool_: yes, you had to click the 'Search' button to get the pagination rendered for PPAs with more than 50 packages published.
<lool_> cprov: And that's fixed?  Cool, that's what I was wondering about
<cprov> lool_: yup, you would know if your ISP allows you to get into edge.l.n ;)
<lool_> Seems it's my ISP; traceroute ends at 213.228.29.126
<virtualroadside> yeah, launchpad has been really slow for me the last few weeks
<virtualroadside> inkynoob: i filed that bug. good thought to run that from the command line
<davmor2> lool_: sorry I was away from the keyboard
<virtualroadside> hey, you wouldn't happen to know how to tell gdb to display what module is being executed, given a memory location of the function?
<davmor2> no
<virtualroadside> hmm. 
<lool_> virtualroadside: "x" + address should give you the name of the function if the debugger knows it
<lool_> (gdb) x 0x08067e3e
<lool_> 0x8067e3e <main+14>:    0x3156ff31
<lool_> (gdb) bt
<lool_> #0  0x08067e3e in main ()
<virtualroadside> lool_: tnx
<inkynoob> Hello, did anyone else have all their icons disapear with the updates today?
<agoliveira> inkynoob: It went fine here.
<inkynoob> agoliveira, which package provides the icons? Is it hildon-desktop?
<agoliveira> inkynoob: I don't know, sorry.
<inkynoob> agoliveira, you're from Brazil?
<agoliveira> inkynoob: Yes, I am.
<inkynoob> what part? I lived in Minas for a year, and in Sao Paulo for 2
<agoliveira> inkynoob: Joinville, SC.
<inkynoob> Cool, I always wanted to visit SC, I've got a good friend in Lages
<heno> agoliveira: seems inkynoob may have reproduced this http://www.davmor2.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/20080418menlow.png 
<agoliveira> heno: Weird... let me see something...
<davmor2> heno: I confirmed bug ï»¿219041
<heno> davmor2: thanks
<agoliveira> heno: I can't confirm this. If you saw the same effect, just file a bug please.
<davmor2> I've added the link to the image on the bug report
<davmor2> agoliveira: check out bug 219041 there has been some work done on it already IIRC
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 219041 in ubuntu-mobile "No icons on UME desktop" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/219041
<agoliveira> davmor2: Oh, I've seem it. Thanks.
<doko> StevenK, lool: mobile-basic-flash contains some flash blobs without source code. how is other flash code handled in mobile packages?
<StevenK> lool: ^]
<StevenK> s/]//
<lool> doko: These are actually the files which are being opened in the GUI to edit these
<lool> doko: So this is the preferred form of modification and use and these files were made under the same license
<doko> lool: ohh, really? point taken
<lool> doko: Nobody likes the files, and they are said to have some bugs; it would be best to move to something else, but we also use the package for pure html UIs
<doko> lool: did somebody look at the source code? I can't review this :-/
<lool> doko: Consider them like .pngs
<doko> ok
<lool> Sorry about this situation; it's not easy to solve the problem of providing flash files in source form; it's really the way they are edited in the editor and all and just like data files we have to provide the license outside of them
<Adri2000> lool: re: tasks, so build log says "intltool-update: POTFILES.in not found.
<lool> Adri2000: Does it cd to po?
<Adri2000> in the source package, po/ contains a POTFILES.in
<Adri2000> I think that's the problem, because it cd to /build/buildd/tasks-0.13/debian/build/standard/po
<lool> Yeah
<lool> Probably due to DEB_BUILDDIR hacks in deed
<lool> Adri2000: Will likely affect dates as well
<Adri2000> dates?
<lool> Adri2000: dates/dates-hildon just like tasks
<Adri2000> ah
<lool> Adri2000: I'm trying to think of the proper fix, but I can hint you on the work around
<lool> Adri2000: The short term workaround would be to call intltool-update manually in a similar way
<Adri2000> the workaround I'm trying right now is to manually copy the POTFILES.in where it expects it to be
<lool> Adri2000: Would be an option
<lool> (Sorry was having a phone call)
<lool> Adri2000: Otherwise, I think flipping if grep -q intltool $(DEB_BUILDDIR)/po/Makefile* with elif [ -e $(DEB_BUILDDIR)/po/Makefile ]; then \ might work
<lool> Adri2000: I'll have to leave you now; I have other things to complete tonight and not much time left; I'm happy to sponsor a patch over the WE if it's still possible in terms of freezes and the like
<lool> Adri2000: Thanks for your work :)
<Adri2000> lool: ok, will try to get a patch working, thanks for your help
<doko> StevenK: moblin-applets is a bit messy ...
<ToddBrandt> doko: what about moblin-applets is messy?
<doko> ToddBrandt: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/moblin-applets/+bug/219087/comments/2
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 219087 in moblin-applets "MIR for moblin-applets" [Undecided,Incomplete] 
<ToddBrandt> doko: good comments, I'll take care of them
<ToddBrandt> launcher is no longer needed anyway
<doko> ToddBrandt: thanks!
<ToddBrandt> we're still waiting for Inuka to update the ppa repo, so I may not be able to push the changes til next week though, however they will be in 0.56 when it comes out
<StevenK> doko: You want libmokoui2's debian/control to be universe/<blah> for vala?
<StevenK> doko: Or just add X[BS]-PythonVersion, and you're fine?
<doko> StevenK: no, that will be done by archive admins
<StevenK> doko: Mmmmm. I didn't think it was necessary, which is why I skipped it
<doko> it *is not* necessary
<StevenK> doko: Okay, if it isn't, why do I need to add it? I've never been clear on the fields.
<doko> StevenK: you don't need it. just add the X[BS]-PythonVersion. that's the only thing to be done
<StevenK> doko: Sorry, I know about universe/, what I'm asking about is X[BS]-PythonVersion.
<StevenK> doko: The necessary bit was about X[BS]-PythonVersion too
<doko> StevenK: yes, we need it to know when we have to rebuild the binary.
<StevenK> doko: Okay, I'll sort out X[BS]-PythonVersion.
<StevenK> doko: Quite happy for vala to be universe.
<ToddBrandt> tonyespy: in bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/acton/+bug/188168 are they talking about gaston or hardy?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 188168 in acton "Wifi - cannot establish connection after cancelling dialog" [High,In progress] 
<pmcgowan> ToddBrandt, all bugs are against hardy
<ToddBrandt> ok, that's what I thought
<ToddBrandt> I'm having trouble getting the gnome-keyring manager to work on the latest hardy image
<ToddBrandt> so I can't reproduce alot of these bugs against the "Moblin Network Profile Manager"
<pmcgowan> ToddBrandt, do you have the latest UME image for CB?
<ToddBrandt> pmcgowan: I have the latest for samsung actually, are these all on CB?
<ToddBrandt> that would change things a bit
<pmcgowan> ToddBrandt, well, they are all on menlow of course
<pmcgowan> both CB and target MIDs
<pmcgowan> Q1 testing should be ok though
<pmcgowan> at least for these issues
<ToddBrandt> pmcgowan: hmm, I'm seeing behavioral differences between the menlow and mccaslin target builds with MIC
<pmcgowan> ToddBrandt, I can believe that
<tonyespy> ToddBrandt: sorry was away from my desk.
<tonyespy> ToddBrandt: yes, gnome-keyring-manager is messed up...
<tonyespy> ToddBrandt: we got around this by shipping a default.keyring that's cleartext
<tonyespy> ToddBrandt: our customer didn't like being prompted for a keyring password, so by including a default.keyring w/no password, problem solved
<tonyespy> ToddBrandt: there is a bug i gnome-keyring where the ask process crashes on Hardy.  I never quite nailed the problem, and then decided to skip it once I figured out the password-less keyring change
<ToddBrandt> tonyespy: ok, thanks
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-04-19
<inkynoob> virtualroadside: Are you running UME on an eeePC by chance?
<virtualroadside> no
<virtualroadside> its a (relatively) normal PC
<virtualroadside> just has a 7in touchscreen
<virtualroadside> carputer :)
<inkynoob> I see...nice
<virtualroadside> http://www.virtualroadside.com/carputer/ 
<virtualroadside> er
<virtualroadside> http://www.virtualroadside.com/carputer/pictures.html
<inkynoob> I'm adding a touchscreen to my eee as soon as it gets here from Taiwn, it's also got a 7inch screen
<virtualroadside> ah, nice
<virtualroadside> yeah, im liking UME so far... cept for this latest missing-icons bug
<inkynoob> I hadn't installed it ever before, so when nothing came up I wondered if I'd missed a step or a program or something
<virtualroadside> yeah, its the first really annoying bug i've found so far
<virtualroadside> granted, there are a ton of bugs, but the first really annoying one
<inkynoob> From what I understand of the bug report, this is an actual problem with hildon-desktop, not just a configuration issue, is that right? 
<virtualroadside> yeah
<virtualroadside> the daily build does it too
<virtualroadside> when i run hildon-desktop in a terminal, it complains that it cannot load libmobilehome.so
<virtualroadside> so.. yeah
<virtualroadside> that sounds important
<virtualroadside> hm
<virtualroadside> that gives me a thought
<virtualroadside> one sec
<virtualroadside> damn
<virtualroadside> well
<virtualroadside> the file exists, so thats not it
<virtualroadside> but, that seems to be the problem, whatever the problem happens to be
<inkynoob> Your carputer looks sharp, by the way. That gives me another project to look forward to...when we get a car worth modding :-)
<virtualroadside> tnx
<virtualroadside> sadly, haven't had it in the car for awhile.. due to software issues
<virtualroadside> but, with UME, im hoping to get it back in there soonish
<virtualroadside> just gotta get the GPS software working better
<inkynoob> I'm going to try this in just a sec, but something as simple as LD_LIBRARY_DIR probably won't help hildon-desktop find the lib, will it? Or maybe wrong permissions on the .so file? 
<virtualroadside> nah, like i said, the file exists
<virtualroadside> im not really sure why it can't load t
<virtualroadside> i think its a bug actually in mobile-basic-flash
<virtualroadside> i still dont know why though
<virtualroadside> i dont think it implements the right plugin interface
<virtualroadside> i have a feeling someone changed around the interfaces, and didn't update *both* hildon-desktop and mobile-basic-flash
<inkynoob> virtualroadside: I might be making some progress.  I ran ldd on ï»¿libmobilehome.so and there were some libraries it was looking for that it couldn't find. They were actually installed already, so I linked them in /usr/lib, and now I'm getting a segfault from hildon-desktop.
<virtualroadside> woo!
<virtualroadside> i haven't touched it.. been working on other stuff
<virtualroadside> what libraries?
<inkynoob> libxul and libsqlite3
<virtualroadside> ah
<inkynoob> Xulrunner just got version bumped recently I think, maybe it's related
<virtualroadside> could be
<inkynoob> Do you know what package provides libmobilebasichome.so? It doesn't seem to have debug symbols in it
<virtualroadside> yeah, i know
<virtualroadside> its mobile-basic-flash
<virtualroadside> fyi... you can do dpkg -S <filename> to find out too
<inkynoob> ah, forgot about that
<inkynoob> There doesn't seem to be a debug version of that package available :-(
<virtualroadside> nope, theres not
<virtualroadside> is that where it segfaults at?
<virtualroadside> i built mine earlier with -g -ggdb ... so i have the symbols installed for that
<inkynoob> I'm not terribly good with gdb, but it's either there or in libxul I think
<virtualroadside> so all you did was ln -s the libs into usr/lib?
<inkynoob> yeah, although the sqlite ones weren't installed. I installed one of the sqlite dev packages and that took care of it
<inkynoob> well, of that one
<inkynoob> I can't remember exactly what I did, but I dumped my shell history to a file to go over more carefully tomorrow
<inkynoob> bad practice...I know :-(
<virtualroadside> ah, the sql library is in the xulrunner directory
<virtualroadside> as is libxul.so
<inkynoob> well, more of this tomorrow I suppose. Have a good night. 
<virtualroadside> mmk, nite
<virtualroadside> i got the segfault
<virtualroadside> aha, you're right.. xul is the culprit
<virtualroadside> i'll build xul with debug symbols, and see what happens
<rhyhann> Hello
<rhyhann> I want to buy a ubuntu mobile compliant device
<rhyhann> Is there any slim one ?
<Hula> Hi there - I'm having trouble launching some apps in my newly created UM. Galculator and Firefox launches fine, but all other apps fail with "we could not read lowmem stats"
<Hula> I have not altered anything in the environment so it should be vanilla.
<inkynoob> virtualroadside: Do you know what the next step is in getting this no icons bug resolved? 
<virtualroadside> honestly, im not sure... probably need to attract some attention from someone. libxul is rather complex
<virtualroadside> but im pretty sure thats why things are borked
<inkynoob> Do you think the problem is libxul, or do you think a bad value is being passed into whatever is being called in libxul? 
<virtualroadside> i would imagine the second
<virtualroadside> but, i dunno
<virtualroadside> i tried building with symbols
<virtualroadside> however, that didn't work so well
<virtualroadside> since apparently it strips them
<virtualroadside> lol
<inkynoob> I saw that, and was going to look into if there is a way to keep them in
<inkynoob> I also upgraded Xulrunner to the nightly build, but the situation is the same
<virtualroadside> that reminds me: i was grepping for that.. 
<virtualroadside> its in toolkit/mozapps/installer/packager.mk
<virtualroadside> *reinstalling again*
<virtualroadside> btw
<virtualroadside> a shortcut to doing the ln -s stuff for the libraries
<virtualroadside> LD_LIBRARY_PATH="/usr/lib/xulrunner-1.9b5" gdb hildon-desktop
<virtualroadside> heh, after commenting out the stripping stuff its really borked ;) 
<virtualroadside> aha! 
<virtualroadside> #0  0xae157348 in EmbedPrivate::Realize (this=0x855b5b0, aAlreadyRealized=0xbf81d018) at EmbedPrivate.cpp:293
<inkynoob> I'm glad that's an 'aha!' for you :-) 
<virtualroadside> well, it just means theres a code location :)
<inkynoob> EmbedPrivate.cpp, is that XUL stuff? 
<virtualroadside> yep
<virtualroadside> no idea how to fix it, of course
<virtualroadside> mozilla/embedding/browser/gtk/src/EmbedPrivate.cpp to be more exact
<x-Dieu> runs UME on a HTC Prohet?
<virtualroadside> ?
<x-Dieu> prophet, is a TI Omap 850 cpu with 200 mhz, 128 MB ROM and 64 MB (SDRAM), the HTC Prophet is a smartphone
<virtualroadside> ah
<virtualroadside> i think UME is a little too heavy for that
<x-Dieu> ok :/
<virtualroadside> but the final version might not be
<virtualroadside> and at the moment, they only have builds for x86 compatible chips, AFAIK
<x-Dieu> yes, but not a i386 cpu in the htc prophet
<x-Dieu> there are tesing release available for smartphones?
<virtualroadside> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded
<x-Dieu> ok, I read this, thanks a lot virtualroadside
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-04-20
<imachine> Hello
<imachine> is there any devices you guys recommend for installing ubuntu mobile on?
<imachine> the samsung q1 ultra seems to be the main hardware it's been tested on, anything else?
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-04-14
<persia> Hmm.  Probably a consequence of the migration.
<persia> So, you're looking for something that calls livecd.sh, or something that is used after running livecd-sh ?
<ian_brasil> after..i ran livecd like $ livecd.sh -d jaunty -a lpia ubuntu-mid 
<ian_brasil> but running ./create-image.sh ubuntu-mid does not work in kvm
<ian_brasil> it drops to busybox initramfs
<ian_brasil> lool said yesterday it probably just needs an edit to create-image.sh for it to work
<persia> Where is create-image.sh again?
<ian_brasil> in the mobile scripts
<ian_brasil> bzr branch lp:~ubuntu-mobile-dev/ubuntu-mobile/mobile-scripts
<persia> Right.  I can see a few things.
<persia> the initrd.img belongs in casper/
<persia> The mid seed is out-of-date
<persia> there's no .disk directory
<persia> The mobile-mobile task is gone : mobile-netbook-remix is about as close as exists (and that seed is out-of-date)
<StevenK> create-image.sh likely needs a good hard fixing
<persia> I'd recommend comparing the result of a build using that to one of the official images.
<persia> There's probably 20-30 lines that need changing in one way or another.
<persia> That said, it ought still work for intrepid, it's just not been updated for jaunty ever.
<eu_> Hi!
<persia> eu, Hello.
<eu> hello
<eu> can u help me w/ a simple question?
<eu> I'm reporting a bug in Launchpad
<persia> Possibly. I've reported a bunch of bugs.  What's the question?
<eu> I need the name of the main GUI on NBR
<persia> The launcher?
<eu> is it?
<eu> :)
<persia> The thing with all the icons that you use to start applications?
<eu> yes, the full-screen menu
<persia> In Jaunty, that's called "netbook-launcher".  I'm not sure what it's called in hardy.
<eu> I was confused, because I heard something about "Maximus"
<eu> ok, that's really simple then... :)
<eu> thanks a lot! ;)
<ogra> maximus is the window manager, not the launcher :)
<eu> ok! thanks a lot for the help
<eu> I got a nasty bug on my EeePC 4G
<persia> eu, Just remember to file the bug with `ubuntu-bug netbook-launcher` to collect additional information with your report.
<eu> right
<eu> I'll also add a copy of my .xsession-errors file
<BUGabundo1> hey everyone! long time no se 
<BUGabundo1> filipegarcia: you liked it here, enh?
<filipegarcia> BUGabundo1: yeap :)
<ian_brasil> persia: i will have a look at updating create-image.sh 
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-04-16
<DingTo> hey everyone
<DingTo> i am new to ubuntu mobile, just read about it, and i want to ask if it also works on a acer aspire one netbook
<persia> DingTo, A number of people have reported success with both Desktop and Netbook Remix on that hardware.  I haven't heard of any reports running MID.
<DingTo> ok
<DingTo> i am currently running eeebuntu on it, but it gets slower and slower
<DingTo> i need a fast system on it 
<DingTo> i know the netbook remix, but i only can find the beta of jaunty, is there a stable release with intrepid core? (8.10)?
<playya> maybe someone should teach ubottu about answering yes or no if someone asks "work.*<hardwarename>\?"
<DingTo> :-)
<persia> There isn't any intrepid netbook remix.
<persia> After hardy released, some additional work was done to create the netbook remix.
<persia> Some of that was integrated for intrepid, but some of it didn't work.
<DingTo> ah ok
<persia> Everything was integrated with jaunty.
<DingTo> so better wait for that
<DingTo> thank you for the info
<persia> DingTo, If you'd like to help test (perhaps running a live session), there's still an opportunity to report any outstanding critical bugs (which can't be as easily fixed post-release)
<DingTo> sure
<DingTo> this one?
<DingTo> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-netbook-remix/daily-live/current/
<ogra> http://releases.ubuntu.com/jaunty/
<ogra> you want ubuntu-9.04-rc-netbook-remix-i386.img 
<persia> DingTo, Either works.  Yours is the daily build.  The beta is a bit more stable.
<DingTo> ok so this one
<DingTo> http://releases.ubuntu.com/jaunty/ubuntu-9.04-rc-netbook-remix-i386.img
<DingTo> ok, will download it, thanks
<persia> That's a good image to use to test, yes.
<DingTo> if i install the rc, can i upgrade to the stable version by the update system or do i need another image file?
<DingTo> i have a slow connection...
<persia> You can just upgrade.
<DingTo> ok
<persia> Be warned that you'll get more updates before release than normal, just as final fixes are applied.
<persia> And thanks for helping with the testing.
<DingTo> you're welcome
<DingTo> i as a end user benefit from a stable release
<DingTo> so its also in my interest to test
<persia> Well, sure, but not everyone does :)
<DingTo> i know
<DingTo> well i am familiar with "how open source works"
<DingTo> i do testing and small bugfixing for Blender for 1 year now
<persia> Cool.
<lool> persia: <----
<lool> :-P
<persia> lool ?
<DingTo> lol
<lool> persia: I was pointing at the channel on the left :)
<DingTo> persia: wow, you are in lots of channels
<ogra> lool, ? left ? its above not left !
<persia> DingTo, Indeed, although my IRC isn't limited to freenode.
<DingTo> nice
<DingTo> pc change
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-04-17
<jonnymac> is this the right channel to ask some questions about putting ubuntu on a mobile phone?
<jonnymac> I want to install ubuntu mid on a phone & was just wondering what the best handset was to choose
<maxbaldwin> So, what's an awesome Touch-screen/Keyboard phone that can run Ubuntu Mobile?
<maxbaldwin> Is there a list somewhere of top rated ones?
<maxbaldwin> nobody here has an awesome phone with Ubuntu Mobile on it?
<maxbaldwin> huh, strange, I thought this would be the place...
<Celtiore> hi
<Celtiore> can we install ubuntu mobile on viliv s5 ? and can we use it correctly, wifi touchscreen and the rest :p
<persia> Celtiore, Looks like poulsbo graphics, so you've that set of issues.  I'd recommend getting the 1024x600 model for resolution reasons.
<persia> I don't see any information on the touchscreen or WiFi, so can't tell you if those drivers work.
<Celtiore> ok thanks you
<persia> Celtiore, For future note, www.umpcportal.com has a nice specifications database for most of the stuff that comes out.
<Celtiore> i know, i check every week, but in france, it's very difficult to find infos about hardware and OS compatibility :(
<persia> I'm not sure why it's different in France than other places :)  But that said, it's difficult generally to find out whether some device supports Ubuntu until it's shipping and someone else tries it.
<persia> This is even true when the device ships with linux (as you must know from your experiences with the Aigo)
<Celtiore> yes
<andor_> hi
<andor_> has anybody tried jaunty lpia on a netbook?
<andor_> i can't find any reviews
<andor_> except a stupid phoronix benchmark, where they compare the power usage of unr and mid in a timeframe of 5 minutes.. with different window managers running
<broonie> Is this the place to ask about the mobile kernels?
<DingTo> hi
<DingTo> persia: just finished the download and started it on my netbook, wlan and even webcam works out of the box
<DingTo> thats nice
<persia> DingTo, Great to hear.
<jonnymac> have been looking online at reviews of mid but can't find any hardware recommendations for phones, any ideas?
<DingTo> hey
<DingTo> persia: are you here?
<DingTo> hm maybe somone else can help me
<DingTo> i installed ubuntu jaunty RC on my Netbook
<DingTo> i also installed VLC player from the repository
<DingTo> the problem is, from my desktop i know VLC is opening videos inside the main interface
<DingTo> here it opens a new (Xvideo output) window
<DingTo> dont know how to disable
<DingTo> ok got it, its impossible
<DingTo> its a bug in vlc
<DingTo> but its reported
<DingTo> so it hopefully gets fixed soon
<DingTo> thanks
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-04-18
<freeflying> hi, dose anyone get psb driver with jaunty?
<Murphy1> HI PPL
<lool> freeflying: It will probably be made available in a PPA some time after release
<netbook-one> wurde gerade gebeten den Nicknamen zu registrieren, was hat das auf sich. Ist das zwingend nÃ¶tig?
<lool> netbook-one: I'm afraid this is an English speaking channel
<lool> netbook-one: Nickname registration is required for private queries at least
<netbook-one> ahh for private queries at least.  :-)
<freeflying> lool: I see, thanks
<Tarzan^> http://www.scribd.com/doc/14385822/Full-Circle-Magazine-23  
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-04-19
<brianski> why does umpc use x86 instead of lpia?
<persia> Well, mostly because lpia for intrepid had a bunch of odd patches that were really MID patches rather than UMPC patches.
<persia> (and UNR uses x86 in Jaunty mostly because 1) lots of stuff FTBFS on lpia, and 2) lpia has somewhat experimental compilation flags, which may make things better, or may make them worse)
#ubuntu-mobile 2010-04-19
<dmart> attach ircs://irc.newcore.canonical.com/6697
<lool> lalala
<lool> ogra: How's the weather in Germany?
<lool> ogra: Good progress on the OMAP images?
<ogra> lool, weather is great, OMAP looks good so far :)
<lool> ogra: So server install worked and all?  great
<ogra> server is still running
<ogra> netinst worked so i dont expect any surprises from server
<ogra> i'm just in apt-setup 
#ubuntu-mobile 2010-04-20
<ogra> ******* reminder ubuntu mobile meeting in 5 min in #ubuntu-meeting *******
<rbelem> persia, ping
#ubuntu-mobile 2010-04-21
<davmor2> l
#ubuntu-mobile 2010-04-23
<ian_brasil> http://brunoabinader.blogspot.com/2010/04/new-kid-on-block-plasma-water-animation.html
