#ubuntu-mobile 2008-04-28
<inkynoo1> In Mobiln Image Creator, what is special about the samsung-q1 (and other) targets? Is it just the kernel which has support for the device? Or are there device specific programs or something? 
<dholbach> good morning
<ulugeyik> hello
<ulugeyik> I am a newbie as far as Ubuntu-Mobile goes and I am confused about how to go about testing it on  Samsung Q1U-SSDXP. 
<ulugeyik> As far as I can tell, all pre-built binaries are for installation and not for Live-CD/Live-USB which is what Iam seeking. Should I be building that from scratch?
<inkynoo1> ulugeyik, I'm pretty new too, but I think you should be able to use the Moblin Image Creator to build a Live-USB image. I played with it a little bit last night and it was fairly straightforward
<inkynoo1> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/CreatingAnImageForUMEDevice
<ulugeyik> Thanks inkynoo1, that is as much as I got too, thanks for confirming it. I will try it out.
<inkynoo1> I tried booting the image on my EeePC, but it hung part way through the boot process. It did create the image though, and let me write it to my SD card
<ulugeyik> I am trying to make the image like inkynoo1 suggested. I can not seem to be able to create a working "target". I can only choose "core" (everything else crashes, and it seems like a known bug?0
<ulugeyik> then once the target is created, chosing "Live USB" with GUI gives an error about missing kernels.
<ulugeyik> any suggestions?
<ulugeyik> "no kernels were found" is the error message.
<agoliveira> ulugeyik: I've never used the live USB function but first you have to create the image. I suggest you use a very complete one, core only has the minimal.
<agoliveira> ulugeyik: Also, check on the console for any errors. If you find anything, open the proper bug report.
<ulugeyik> according to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/CreatingAnImageForUMEDevice 
<ulugeyik> "The image-creator has a nasty bug that makes it crash if any fset different from "core" is selected."
<ulugeyik> so does this mean I should do this without GUI?
<agoliveira> ulugeyik: This is old and has being fixed.
<ulugeyik> hmm. let me try again then. 
<ulugeyik> it gets in a cycle of "apt-get update", "apt-get install -f"  due to some missing packages. BTW, I am doing this on Gutsy and not Hardy. 
<persia> ulugeyik: You'll get much better results from hardy
<agoliveira> ulugeyik: Should not be an issue as it does it in a chroot but I higly recomend using hardy anyway. Gutsy is not supported for UME.
<ulugeyik> I assume you mean the host computer that I am using the create the image right? thanks for the advice, I did not realize that, I will upgrade my distro and then try it. 
<persia> ulugeyik: You might be able to backport the newer moblin-image-creator to gutsy, but there may be other components that also benefit from the upgrade when creating images.
<lool> ToddBrandt: Hey, any reason moblin-applets in ppa builds against moko instead of libmokoui2?
<lool> (as in hardy)
<ToddBrandt> lool: I was told to build against moko, what's the difference between libmokoui and moko?
<lool> ToddBrandt: When were you told this?
<ToddBrandt> many months ago
<ToddBrandt> moko is our moblinized version of the openmoko stuff
<lool> ToddBrandt: Ok; libmokoui2 is "new"
<lool> ToddBrandt: moko is a fork of an early libmokoui by Moblin
<lool> To add missing API etc.
<lool> libmokoui2 is downloaded from openmoko as verbatim as possible
<lool> And maintained by the openmoko people
<lool> ToddBrandt: Now would be a good time to move to libmokoui2 (before the UME release)
<ToddBrandt> If it's straight from the openmoko base then I don't know if it will work, the ubuntu-mobile ppa moko has some changes
<lool> ToddBrandt: We do need to port it to the libmokoui2 one
<lool> ToddBrandt: I think this is the case in hardy now
<lool> ToddBrandt: I would have thought you would have received the corresponding changes
<ToddBrandt> ok, Frank Li is our resident moko expert
<lool> ToddBrandt: Yes, StevenK and him worked together on this move
<lool> and with upstream
<ToddBrandt> oh
<lool> ToddBrandt: The only change in hardy is:
<lool> -PKG_CHECK_MODULES(MOKO, moko)
<lool> +PKG_CHECK_MODULES(MOKO, libmokoui2)
<ToddBrandt> I see, so basically I need to switch over the applets to use this new guy
<ToddBrandt> ok, I'll try it out
<lool> in debian/patches/mokoui-changes.diff
<lool> ToddBrandt: That'd be nice, thanks
<lool> ToddBrandt: Can you ping me when it's the case so that I archive moko from the ppa?
<ToddBrandt> yea, I can do it now gimme an hour or so
<lool> Cool, thanks
<ToddBrandt> lool: I can't get a target to build, is there a problem with libzlui-maemo or 0.8.14-1ubuntu1? The error says that it can't find these packages because of a 404 error
<lool> ToddBrandt: You need to apt-get updatez
<lool> ToddBrandt: Missing packages 404-ing are usually due to an out of date list of packages on your side
<lool> ToddBrandt: Make sure you remove rootstraps etc. as these act as caches
<lool> ToddBrandt: I usually wipe everything between MIC builds; however if you have a proxy such as squid it could be the cause as well
<ToddBrandt> lool: actually it's a mirror problem, I can build it ok now
<lool> Cool
<lool> Happens to me too from time to time when the mirror serves an old Packages or Sources.gz and I need a package which has been uploaded in the mean time
<ToddBrandt> lool: ok, I swapped moko with libmokoui2-dev in the debian/control file and PKG_CHECK_MODULES(MOKO, moko) with PKG_CHECK_MODULES(MOKO, libmokoui2) in configure.in. I ran it and it seems to work. Did you want me to create a new version and check it in now?
<lool> ToddBrandt: Sounds good!
<lool> ToddBrandt: Thanks!
<lool> ToddBrandt: Why is it that moblin-applets didn't switch to tarballs BTW? :)
<ToddBrandt> lool: I overwrote inuka's changes
<lool> Ah
<lool> ToddBrandt: You mean by mistake?
<ToddBrandt> I had to update the debian directory and I thought that was the only way
<ToddBrandt> so yea, by mistake
<lool> ToddBrandt: You can easily recover his version
<ToddBrandt> well, I included all his debian/rules changes for patching
<lool> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mobile/+archive?field.name_filter=moblin-applets&field.status_filter=any
<lool> ToddBrandt: But we want to keep the packaging separate from moblin.rog
<lool> ToddBrandt: The short reason to "why?" is exactly what happened: that you people maintain a debian/ dir which we can't update
<ToddBrandt> yea, but for instance, just now I changed the debian/control file
<lool> So when you upload yours, changes other people without commit did are lost
<ToddBrandt> what's the proper way to update a debian file?
<lool> ToddBrandt: You 1) dget -x the .dsc from the ppa
<ToddBrandt> I have 0.58 sitting here waiting to be uploaded, I might as well get this one back to the tarball strategy
<lool> 2) cd into that tree and do your changes
<lool> 3) upload
<ToddBrandt> Is this documented in a wiki somewhere that I just haven't seen?
<lool> If you have a new upstream release to prepare in 2), you can simply type "uupdate ../moblin-applets-$new_version.tar.gz"
<lool> ToddBrandt: Probably not this particularly short version in the w.u.c/MaE wiki, but it's in the main wiki.ubuntu.com wiki for sure
<lool> ToddBrandt: If you are physically near inuka_desk, perhaps you could prepare the update together?
<lool> ToddBrandt: Be sure to start from inuka_desk's version before following the previous 1/2/3 steps
<inuka_desk> ToddBrandt: the info is in our wiki, also sent an e-mail on this last week. Ping me if you have issues
<lool> ToddBrandt: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Howtos/DebianWatch
<lool> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingJam
<ToddBrandt> inuka_desk: yea I saw that, but I didn't see any info on how to change the debian files
<lool> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Recipes/DebianWatch might be the newer one
<lool> I have to leave now, see you people
<ToddBrandt> lool: so I should delete versions 0.56 and 0.57?
<lool> ToddBrandt: No need t
<lool> to
<lool> ToddBrandt: Start from inuka_desk's latest upload (wget the .dsc, .diff.gz, .tar.gz from the archived versions in the ppa)
<ToddBrandt> ahh
<lool> ToddBrandt: Then uupdate to the new version (0.58), update control and changelog for your changes
<lool> And upload
<lool> ToddBrandt: If you have any issue with this, I'm happy to help
<ToddBrandt> ok, thanks
<lool> But I have to go for tonight, I'm still jetlagged from returning from the US yesterday ;)
 * lool &
<bspencer_> after I check somthing into the PPA, is there a webpage that will show me the status of things building
<bspencer_> or do I just have to wait for the email?
<asac> bspencer_: yes, go to the +archive page
<asac> bspencer_: then you can go to view build status or something and search for your package
<asac> (with "show all states"
<asac> )
<agoliveira> bspencer_: https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mobile/+archive/+builds
<bspencer_> asac, agoliveira -- great, thx.
<agoliveira> bspencer_: BTW, I tried to create a new image today using image-creator and It's complaining about helix-dbus-server missing
<asac> ToddBrandt: could you please be more proactive when choosing versions for ume uploads?
<asac> ToddBrandt: just found that you just bumped the ubuntu revision ... which is, erm, not so good :)
<asac> ToddBrandt: usually you use the official version and append a ume suffix
<ToddBrandt> asac: I'm doing that now, I'm creating a new 0.58 version based on Inuka's original 0.55-1 version
<asac> ToddBrandt: ?
<asac> network manager has 0.6.6 :)
<asac> network-manager - 0.6.6-0ubuntu5 
<asac> network-manager-applet - 0.6.6-0ubuntu2 
<asac> thats should have been 0.6.6-0ubuntu4+804ume1
<asac> or something like that
<ToddBrandt> ok, 0.58.1
<asac> its ok now. i just have to skip the ubuntu5 version now
<asac> ToddBrandt: talking about mobile-applets?
<ToddBrandt> asac: yea
<asac> for those i don't mind;) ... but i think you should append a ume suffix as well there
<ToddBrandt> oh, if you're just talking about network-manager, you can blow those away, I only put those there because the target wasn't being pointed to the latest
<asac> ToddBrandt: ah so those are exactly the ahrdy packages?
<ToddBrandt> asac: yes, but I think they're a little out of date now
<asac> thought it was somethig with mobile patches
<ToddBrandt> nope
<asac> ToddBrandt: ok ... then it doesn't matter much. we can also keep them there
<asac> sorry for the noise ;)
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-04-29
<bspencer> kyleN, 
<kyleN> bspencer: yes?
<bspencer> to clarify the theme issues -- when you change the theme (somehow) a gconf key changes.  But the UI doesn't
<bspencer> is that correct?
<kyleN> bspencer: mildy
<bspencer> and you are expecting us to change something so that you can just change the gconf key and the theme auto-switches magically.
<kyleN> no
<bspencer> ok.  :)  We're looking through bugs here.  
<kyleN> wait
<bspencer> let me give you a URL
<kyleN> yes, when we change the gconf key, we want the theme to change properly
<kyleN> right now, some of it doesn't change but it should
<kyleN> what doesn't change is the panels in the marquee
<bspencer> https://bugs.launchpad.net/moblin-multimedia/+bug/206389
<bspencer> what /does/ change?
<kyleN> they fails to detect the gconf key change, fail to switch to the new theme dir
<kyleN> what DOES change is gtk apps. they pick up the new gtkrc files in the new theme denoted by the new key
<bspencer> even without restarting them?
<kyleN> since marquee panels are (or should be) gtk apps, they should change too
<kyleN> yes, they do it dynamically
<bspencer> coool
<kyleN> for example, go to ubuntu desktop and change /desktop/gnome/interface/gtk_theme key manually to another valid theme dir
<kyleN> and all gtk apps maigcally redraw
<kyleN> I have that working in UME
<kyleN> except the darn marquees don't redraw
<kyleN> marquee panels, that is
<bspencer> does the mobile-basic-flash change?
<bspencer> (the icon backgrounds)
<kyleN> well, it is a flash movie, so no. We will actually change our gconf key from a user action in our flash movie
<kyleN> and by the way, the hicolor icon theme dir does not seem complete
<bspencer> hm.
<kyleN> and it is the default, so if you launch a gnome app that requires a valid gnome icon theme, it borks
<bspencer> I don't remember messing that too much
<kyleN> could be a corner case, but try installing pcmanfm and you will see
<kyleN> then change the icon theme to the "gnome" one via gconf key, and pcmanfm no longer borks
<bspencer> hm.  I forget how the icon theme cascades... but I thought it would try hicolor last.  I'd have to look that up again.  So the "gnome" theme must have the icons and it doesn't fall back to hicolor
<kyleN> perhpas the fallbacks aren't configured correctly, I haven't checked
<bspencer> kyleN, did you check this bug:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/moblin-multimedia/+bug/206389
<bspencer> is it resolved?
<kyleN> looking now
<bspencer> working late?  (9:47pm) 
<kyleN> on a deadline
<kyleN> network is incredibly slow. am thinking smagoun just did something very BIG
<bspencer> and then cut and ran
<kyleN> ok i see it
<kyleN> here's the deal
<kyleN> we think moblin should provide a theme switching solution that works
<kyleN> however, that bug was erroneously pegged to moblin because it is really that our customer's flash icon for theme switching was not hooked up to anythin
<kyleN> so, I think the issue of you foks getting theme switching to work, including the marquee, and probably creating a UI for it, is still on the table
<bspencer> kyleN, yep, got it.
<kyleN> ok
<bspencer> I'll look at marquee and the UI is still pending agreement :)
<kyleN> cool
<bspencer> lool, telepathy-haze was removed from UME recently?
<StevenK> bspencer: telepathy-* was pulled out of being installed -- it drags in pidgin-data, which conflicts with pidgin-maemo, which is in the PPA.
<bspencer> true.
<bspencer> StevenK, I notice that I can still install pidgin-data manually
<bspencer> then everything works.
<bspencer> we updated the fsets to not include telepahty as it was breaking image creation
<bspencer> but... ubuntu-mobile-dev pkg depends on telepathy-devel
<bspencer> and I can't fix that.  :)
<bspencer> so it is not possible to install the developer tools fset currently, unless you first manually install pidgin-data (an obscure link)
<StevenK> Argh
<StevenK> bspencer: But pidgin-maemo-data and pidgin-data conflict
<StevenK> So you can install it since you don't have pidgin-maemo-data installed?
<StevenK> In terms of ubuntu-mobile-dev -- good catch, I'll fix that now.
<bspencer> StevenK, ah -- I don't know about pidgin-maemo-data -- but I saw something about you guys making pidgin-maemo your default chat solution
<bspencer> should be cool.
<bspencer> and they are a lot more likely to sue Nokia first and not try to go after you guys
<bspencer> asac, StevenK 
<bspencer> I'm working on the xulrunner upgrade
<bspencer> I installed xulrunner-1.9-dev, but where do I get xulrunner-gtkmozembed-embedding  ?  (configure complaining)
<bspencer> -PKG_CHECK_MODULES(MOZEMBED, mozilla-gtkmozembed >= 1.8.1)
<bspencer> +PKG_CHECK_MODULES(MOZEMBED, mozilla-gtkmozembed-embedding >= 1.8.1)
<StevenK> You don't, the pkgconfig name changed
<StevenK> bspencer: Give me a moment, I'll look it up
<bspencer> ok.
<StevenK> Hmm. mozilla-gtkmozembed-embedding should work
<StevenK> I was using libxul-embedding, if I recall correctly
<bspencer> I didn't see that as part of Hardy
<bspencer> at least the pkg name libxul-embedding
<StevenK> Ubuntu package, or pkg-config package?
<bspencer> when I grep /usr/lib/pkgconfig files, I have xulrunner-gtkmozembed... but nothing with "embedding"
<bspencer> hold on... maybe I have it..
<StevenK> (hardy-lpia)root@liquified:~# dpkg -S /usr/lib/pkgconfig/libxul-embedding.pc 
<StevenK> xulrunner-1.9-dev: /usr/lib/pkgconfig/libxul-embedding.pc
<bspencer> yep
<bspencer> so why
<bspencer> checking for MOZEMBED... configure: error: Package requirements (xulrunner-gtkmozembed-embedding >= 1.8.1) were not met:
<bspencer> No package 'xulrunner-gtkmozembed-embedding' found
<StevenK> (hardy-lpia)root@liquified:~# pkg-config --exists libxul-embedding && echo 'yes'
<StevenK> yes
<bspencer> oops -- s/xulrunner/mozilla
<bspencer> well, I ain't the sharpest marble
<asac> StevenK: awake?
<StevenK> asac: Hrm?
<asac> StevenK: mail send ;)
<asac> StevenK: got it?
<StevenK> I see it.
<StevenK> I'll test it tomorrow
<asac> thanks
<asac> maybe it didn't work for us, because there is something else broken in our packaging?
<asac> StevenK: ?
<asac> e.g. missing data files or something?
<theseinfeld> anybody tried to create menlow fset?
<theseinfeld> I mean to add
<theseinfeld> I get: Couldn't find any package matching "xf86-video-psb linux-menlow-default-2.6.22 psb-kmd-default-2.6.22 moblin-chat"
<theseinfeld> of course that xf86 is xorg-...psb
<theseinfeld> but the linux-menlow-default is definitely not in the repositories
<theseinfeld> persia lool any idea why?
<theseinfeld> this is related to MIC
<persia> For xf86-video-psb, I suspect xserver-xorg-video-psb is preferred.  I'm not sure about the others.
<theseinfeld> of course
<theseinfeld> but why don't we have the fset corrected in the moblin-image-creator.deb :)
<theseinfeld> persia do you think it makes any sense to add the moblin.org repositories?
<theseinfeld> to get the menlow kernels from intel?
<theseinfeld> :D
<persia> theseinfeld: I'm very much not a fan of mixing repositories.  It may be that the image-creator needs tweaking to support different repos in the cases where core contents differ significantly
<theseinfeld> me neither
<theseinfeld> but there is no menlow in the ume for now... persia, do you know why?
<persia> That I don't.  I'm looking at the MIC fset definitions now.
<theseinfeld> I didn't check the crownbeach
<theseinfeld> persia the poulsbo is also out :(
<ian_brasil> hey...i am looking at setting up a lpia VM image ..is there some pointers for doing this (like can i use QEMU or do i need kernel virtualisation?)..i saw lool was doing something with this?
<persia> ian_brasil: Both QEMU and kernel virtualisation will work for lpia emulation on another machine.  You are most likely to have difficulties with the default video drivers available for UME, but if you work around that, it ought work.
<ian_brasil> persia: thx a lot
<theseinfeld> lpia is pretty much i386 :)
<lool> ian_brasil: I've added support to ubuntu-vm-builder in bzr to accept --arch lpia and the like
<lool> Something like ubuntu-vm-builder qemu hardy --arch lpia should do
<lool> I really need to finish these bits
<ian_brasil> lool: you rock :)
<lool> Well you wont get UME at this point!
<ian_brasil> why not?
<lool> It just builds a regular VM
<lool> ala debootstrap
<ian_brasil> but i will get an lpia chroot so i can run tests , right?
<lool> What remains to be done is to extract the list of packages from MIC, wrap all of this in a new script and add new packages for qemu config
<lool> ian_brasil: Yes, a lpia vm even
<lool> ian_brasil: I personally use "kvm" instead of qemu and run it with a -vnc :12 or so
<lool> And then connect to it via vnc
<ian_brasil> i will have a play and write up on the wiki how i get on then.. 
<theseinfeld> persia, any ideas where the menlow are gone?
<persia> theseinfeld: ï»¿Looks to me like the current fset definitions assume the moblin repo, at least in terms of package names.  I'm not sure whether you can mix repos.
<theseinfeld> well, I mixed them in the past and ended up with dependecy hell
<persia> That would be about what I expect.  Unfortunately, I'm not sure enough of the correct package names for menlow/poulsboro to upload an updated MIC with confidence.  Maybe someone else understands it better.
<theseinfeld> I can give you the package names
<theseinfeld> linux-menlow-default linux-menlow-default-2.6.24
<theseinfeld> linux-menlow-developer-2.6.24
<persia> These are moblin names or ubuntu-mobile names?
<theseinfeld> psb-kmd-default psb-kmd-default-2.6.24 psb-kmd-developer-2.6.24
<theseinfeld> moblin names
<theseinfeld> there are no ubuntu names since they are in the fset but not in the ppa/ports repos
<theseinfeld> :(
<theseinfeld> persia what do you think is the best way forward with this menlow thing?
<persia> That's the part I'm unsure about.
<theseinfeld> I am mostly interested in getting the poulsbo video kernel modules
<persia> The brute force method is to grab from moblin, verify packaging, and push to ubuntu-mobile.
<theseinfeld> if that is not in UME we don't have the next intel platform ready, so there is no point of talking anything but the Q1
<theseinfeld> :D
<persia> On the other hand, I'm not sure if that's actually the best way to get something nice.
<persia> Well, it works on the SR8, basically (and other mccaslin devices).
<theseinfeld> yeah, old generation mccaslin devices but not the new menlow to come
<theseinfeld> :D
<theseinfeld> something that moblin guys are having now
<persia> Right.  The better way is to review the new packages, and add them selectively as one understands the integration.  This likely takes longer, and requires a bit of testing (preferably with the right hardware).  This is especially true for driver-type stuff.
<theseinfeld> how about then just getting them in as they are in moblin and later include them?
<theseinfeld> test and include them...
<persia> s/xf86-video-psb/xserver-xorg-video-psb/ is something that was done before (for 0.39), but I'm not finding lots of info about the psb stuff, and I'm very much not tempted to touch the kernel without hardware.
<theseinfeld> you don't have that hardware from Intel?
<theseinfeld> can't you get it from them?
<persia> The moblin repos ought be mostly source-compatible.  You might try a rebuild of their packages to test your hardware: if they work, that's a good argument for upload.
<persia> theseinfeld: Not I: I get my hardware retail :)
<theseinfeld> afk 30 seconds
<theseinfeld> persia i have to get something
<theseinfeld> persia, me back
<theseinfeld> Get:1 http://www.moblin.org gaston/main linux-menlow-default-2.6.24 2.6.24-11 [13.5MB]
<theseinfeld> :D
<Hobbsee> that's not a rebuild...
<persia> theseinfeld: You'll get a better test getting the source...
<theseinfeld> :D
<theseinfeld> and compile it?
<Hobbsee> yes
<theseinfeld> using chrooted?
<Hobbsee> or pbuilder, or sbuild.  that's the idea, yes.
<theseinfeld> hmm...
<theseinfeld> ok
<theseinfeld> no problem
<theseinfeld> I can do that
<theseinfeld> i have my lpia pbuilder
<theseinfeld> if it works...what then?
<Hobbsee> then take the .deb from wherever you set the results directory to be, and install it on the hardware.
<persia> And if that works, see if you can determine what patch enables the construction of that binary package, and whether it can be applied to the Ubuntu linux package,  At that point, you can file a bug :)
<theseinfeld> persia, do you think that they have a patch for that?
<theseinfeld> uhm...
<persia> theseinfeld: By "patch" I mean "change to the code".
<theseinfeld> yeah... I might end up comparing the whole kernel tree :)
<theseinfeld> lets see...
<theseinfeld> I let you know one of those days if this works
<theseinfeld> :D
<theseinfeld> and bug...etc...
<theseinfeld> so I will be back with those issues
<theseinfeld> is the next month deadline still feasable?
<theseinfeld> s/feasable/feasible/
<theseinfeld> I mean, if there is no menlow...
<theseinfeld> :D
<theseinfeld> ?
<lool> persia: poulsboro, how cute :)
<theseinfeld> bye
<theseinfeld> did I say pousboro?
<theseinfeld> poulsboro?
<theseinfeld> I must be dead tired...
<theseinfeld> good night...
 * theseinfeld out...
<ian_brasil> lool: i ran ubuntu-vm-builder kvm hardy --arch lpia and i get invalid architecture ..is there something i am missing?
<lool> ian_brasil: You need to build the package out of bzr
<lool> It wasn't uploaded (too close to release I guess)
<ian_brasil> ah ok...
<lool> ian_brasil: https://code.launchpad.net/~soren/ubuntu-jeos/trunk
<lool> ian_brasil: bzr branch lp:~soren/ubuntu-jeos/trunk; cd trunk; debuild -i
<lool> And you should get a .deb; install it and it should work
<ian_brasil> nice one
<dholbach> Â¡Â¡ agoliveira is giving a session in #ubuntu-classroom !!
<Syntux> Hi, when we will be able to install UME on Nokia N8xx ?
<wasabi> Probably never.
<wasabi> read the faq
<Syntux> okei
<persia> wasabi: You never know.  Mojo's Hasty Hippogriff ought contain many of the UME packages.  Something may occur.
<wasabi> Yeah. I know. I hope it does.
<wasabi> But I wouldn't count on it. :0
<wasabi> Bunch of closed stuff on the nXXX's
<persia> Yeah, well, it's the primary mojo target.
<pablom> QUESTION : can the "desktop manager" app (despite of the touchscreen feature) be used on common desktops?
<phoenix24> hi agoliveira! 
<agoliveira> ï»¿pablom: Sorry but what desktop manager? Matchbox? It's the one used on UME.
<pablom> thanks!
<agoliveira> phoenix24: Hi.
<pablom> and matchbox can be used with ubuntu desktop?
<pablom> sorry for the english
<rZr> agoliveira: thx will the log are published the usual place ?
<agoliveira> pablom: Yes it can but it's not very apropriate as it it has some limitations like working on fullscreen only.
<pablom> ok
<agoliveira> rZr: I gues so, it's my first time doing that :)
<pablom> what get my attention is that it is very user friendly
<pablom> thanks a lot
<agoliveira> pablom: That's the idea: to have something very userfriendly
<rZr> agoliveira: i am frustrated i came at the end, any other one planned soon ?
<pablom> I'll try it and give a look at the source too
<rZr> i am talking about  UME or embedded stuff
<mybunche> agoliveira:What about marketing? Are there efforts underway to push/assist UME to product manufactures? For example, I read somewhere that Nokia is interested.
<pablom> forgot to say, im brazilian too
<pablom> :)
<agoliveira> rZr: Not currently but you bother jcastro for it :)
<agoliveira> mybunche: There's a team called MSG that does this. I work with the cor4e team.
<agoliveira> pablom: Bem vindo! :)
<mybunche> agoliveira:thanks
<agoliveira> mybunche: No problem.
<pablom> agoliveira, valeu. I did a modification to xfdesktop to make some things more user friendly, and I think matchbox-desktop is what Im looking for
<rZr> btw do you have interessing pointer about optimizing filesystem for saving flash memories usage ?
<agoliveira> rZr: Yes, that's a good point.
<mybunche> Great work. Looking forward to the future of UME. It 2am here, work tomorrow, need some sleep. Cheers!
<rZr> i am working on this for tuning my "live system" on USB device
<agoliveira> BTW, in about 2 weeks we will have the UDS (Ubuntu Developers Summit) If you have interesting ideas, you can drop by or contact us top bring them in and have them discussed for the next release.
<pablom> ok
<rZr> mesh networking is something to be tested w/ mobile computing , any plans about this ?
<agoliveira> rZr: Not for now but it's an interesting idea.
<pablom> I know that intel have mesh working with classmatepc, another project
<rZr> it's more at the application level than the OS though
<rZr> pablom: the OLPC project has been critized about this recently too
<rZr> agoliveira: are there connections w/ OLPC project too, i know some debian friends are on it
<pablom> rZr, good to know, mesh is a great feature on these cases
<agoliveira> rZr: Not this project, no.
<rZr> pablom: let me find you this article
<pablom> rZr, thanks
 * rZr is doing archeology on his wiki :)
<rZr> gotcha : http://www.usenix.org/event/upsec08/tech/full_papers/patterson/patterson_html/
<pablom> rZr, i ll read it! thanks a lot
<rZr> you're welcome
<rZr> dinner time now
<rZr> I'll hang around
<pablom> i'm going now too, see ya
<Riddell> agoliveira: trying to run hildon-desktop I get http://pastebin.com/m3da6da93
<agoliveira> Riddell: How did you try it? Anyway DBUS is not running, you have to start it first.
<Riddell> agoliveira: clicking Terminal in image-creator, export DISPLAY=:1 (my xephyr) and running hildon-desktop
<Riddell> I did run dbus-launch, but that didn't hepl
<Riddell> help
<agoliveira> Riddell: Try ume-xephyr-start
<agoliveira> Riddell: Close your Xephyr first
<Riddell> agoliveira: did something, but not there yet http://pastebin.com/m192029c9
<agoliveira> Riddell: This is really weird. Did you run xhost + in another console to allow Xephyr to connect to the host?
<Riddell> yes
<persia> I had best results running Xephyr as my regular user, and attaching from within UME by starting dbus as root, su'ing to ume, setting the display, and launching.
<Riddell> persia: launching what?
 * persia hunts down the script name
<lool> persia: That's how I do it too
<persia> Riddell: start-hildon from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/HildonDesktopManualProcedure  This is a deprecated procedure, so it may not be ideal.
<lool> start-hildon I think
<lool> How much time would have been saved would we have a solution to build vms, I wonder
<Riddell> /usr/bin/start-hildon: line 28: /usr/sbin/mas: No such file or directory
<Riddell> is about all that does
<persia> At least days * num_developers
<persia> I thought that was fixed.  Hmmm...
<agoliveira> lool: +1
<persia> Riddell: Try /usr/share/ume-config-common/ume-gui-start
<lool> Hmm start-hildon must have been broken for a good while, wow
<Riddell> persia: http://pastebin.com/m343568c7
<persia> Riddell: And you've set DISPLAY to match your Xephyr?
<persia> What happens if you try to e.g. start kdm in the Xephyr from your regular system?
<Riddell> persia: yes (xclock works fine)
<persia> But not matchbox?
<Riddell> matchbox?
<Riddell> I've never managed to get kdm to work in xephyr
<agoliveira> Riddell: I think your KDE instincts don't let you run something based on Gnome :)
<persia> Riddell: Try stepping through the commands individually.  Perhaps starting with /usr/bin/matchbox-window-manager (with lots of options).
<persia> This might help track down the source of the issue.
<Riddell> persia: matchbox-window-manager does seem to be running
<Riddell> but nothing is showing in xephyr
<persia> Riddell: OK.  From your log, I'm fairly sure sapwood-server is also running.
<Riddell> it is
<persia> This just leaves /usr/bin/hildon-desktop   Does it work if you call it directly?
<persia> Wait.  Matchbox is running, but nothing is showing in Xephyr?  The WM ought load something.
<Riddell> running hildon-desktop  http://pastebin.com/m476b97af
<Riddell> xclock now loads full screen
<persia> xclock being full screen would be an indicator that matchbox is working.
<persia> Right.  Seems you're having trouble connecting to your dbus.  When I encountered that, I rebooted.  You may be able to just kill some processes, but I remember dbus not liking to be killed.
<lool> Well dbus itself probably doesn't mind too much, but the apps connected to it... lalala
<lool> Let's just say they share the joy
<Riddell> can't I just restart dbus in my chroot?
<persia> lool: Isn't it supposed to run a separate dbus in the chroot?  My memory of dbus not being easily killed comes from schroot 0.52, where it would leave extra dbus sessions running from every build.
<lool> persia: It should, but as I bind mount everything e.g. /tmp to access my host Xorg...
<persia> Riddell: You might give that a try.  While nm is being most talkative about it, I suspect the "WARNING: not connected" followed by the segfault is the same thing (only by less defensive programmers)
<persia> lool: Ah.  Yes.  Too much bind-mounting can cause confusion.  This is why I like virtualisation and extra hardware.
<persia> One of the devices I've never found, but want is a 5.25" bay computer: install two or three in a tower as test boxes without disturbing the primary workstation.
<lool> persia: Interesting
<lool> I think I'm more happy with vms which I can pack in my laptop
<lool> Let's run VMs on the Q1!
<persia> lool: Maybe.  The issue there is resource contention.  Depends on the use case, I suppose.  I tend to break things.
<lool> I see
<persia> Riddell: I can replicate the issue.  On the other hand, I also replicated the fumbling with the order of commands, which may be related.  I'll try a couple other things, and let you know the procedure.
<persia> lool: Did you ever have success with getting apport to work?  I can replicate, but I can't see the core, so have a little trouble figuring out why it crashes.
<lool> persia: Yes, it's fixed
<lool> persia: I've prepared a SRU
<lool> persia: naturally, retrace wont work with ppa packages
<persia> lool: OK.  It's in -proposed?
<lool> persia: Don't think it was accepted to proposed yet
<lool> persia: It's in the bzr branch though
<persia> I'm not worried about retrace.  I just want to have a core file somewhere, and I'm not getting it by default.
<lool> ~ubuntu-core-dev/apport/ubuntu
<lool> persia: The issue is with unionfs
<persia> With getting no core file?  If I turn off apport, should I just get the normal ones then?
<lool> persia: Oh, I don't know about real core files
<lool> I thought you meant crash files from apport
<lool> They might be turned off when apport is setup
<persia> Ah.  That's the thing I want.  apport is just sometimes one way to get it.
<lool> But otherwise, check ulimit -c
<lool> persia: Here, core files seem disabled by default
<lool> (0)
<lool> ulimit -c unlimited would fix it I guess
<persia> Yeah.  That was my issue.  On the other hand, It's kinda late here, so I'm not surprised to be missing things :)
<lool> -rwxr-xr-x 1 ume ume  798720 2008-04-29 19:13 core
<persia> Right.  I'm not up to digging the stack deeply on this now, but it's an issue with a bad "level" being passed to brightness_from_level in libbrightness from moblin-applets.  Be good to get an apport bug filed against it for proper investigation later.
<persia> Riddell: My apologies, but I'm not likely to get you a working recipe just now.
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-04-30
<inkynoob> What is the purpose of the ppa apt sources? 
<Mr_You> hi
<inkynoob> eg. deb http://ports.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-ports hardy-updates main restricted universe
<inkynoob> Hi
<inkynoob> er, sorry eg : deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/ubuntu-mobile/ubuntu hardy main
<Mr_You> looking forward to trying ume
<Mr_You> ahh.. v8.04.. I should try it out.
<Mr_You> excellent.
<Mr_You> desktop edition rather.
<Mr_You> and it fits on a cd, cool.
<dholbach> good morning
<inkynoob> Hoorah! I finallaly got Ubuntu Mobile working on my EeePC. My touchscreen arrived in the mail yesterday, once I get it installed, this is going to be great!
<lool> inkynoob: Cool
<lool> inkynoob: What's your touchscreen?
<inkynoob> A generic 7 inch USB touchscreen from ebay. The manual is in chinese, but I plugged it into my desktop and it worked automatically with Ubuntu Hardy
<dholbach> StevenK: why did you have to upload python-central to the PPA? was the reason something like bug 222829?
<StevenK> dholbach: For the snapshot, no other reason.
<dholbach> OK
<dholbach> it was just weird that there were outdated .pyc files
<lool> Down to 38 source packages!
<lool> in the ppa
<lool> amitk: Could you visit the ppa delete page and see why some linux-* stuff shows up there as superseded?  Anything we could drop from there which isn't actually useful anymore?
<lool> asac: Hey, it's unfortunate that we have this xulrunner-1.9 fork in the ppa ATM
<lool> asac: Could you apply the patch on lpia only?  Or apply it in all cases, add some ifdefs around its code, and only turn the flag on lpia?
<lool> asac: Otherwise, we will have to update xulrunner-1.9 in the ume stable ppa each time we update xulrunner 1.9 in hardy...
<asac> lool: the patch is too hacky. i hope the gconf component can be properly isolated and shipped as a separate package.
<lool> asac: Even if it's hacky, can't it be surrounded by #ifdef GCONF_HACKY? :)
<asac> lool: if that is done it will stay that way forever ... and lpia users cannot get  a clean xulrunner
<lool> asac: Yeah, but it's a better solution for hardy maintenance don't you think?
<lool> asac: Or do you think that gconf bit could be shipped in a separate component in the next month?
<asac> no i don't think so. we should have the proper solution if possible at all
<asac> its not rocket science ... its basically just moving the file somewhere else in the build system
<lool> asac: Ok; will it need to be a separate package?
<amitk> lool: done
<lool> amitk: Thanks!  did you remove many packages?
<lool> asac: If it does need a separate binary package, I'm a bit worried that it will be acceptable under the SRU policy
<lool> asac: Unless we can build it out of tree
<asac> lool: a separate binary package from same source tree
<lool> asac: Do you think it's acceptable for a SRU?
<asac> lool: i think so
<lool> Cool
<lool> asac: Then that'd be top notch
<amitk> lool: yeah. lots of old ones. I thought PPA got rid of superseded ones automatically
<lool> amitk: I thought so too, I wonder whether these were really old and broke some ppa machinery
<lool> amitk: You know we had issues with early kernel builds and all
<amitk> lool: perhaps
<lool> amitk: What's the plan for the kernel?  Can we drop the ppa version entirely?
<lool> amitk: Basically, what remains to be done WRT to removing packages and uploading to hardy-proposed? (based on the email exchange we had)
<cprov> lool: amitk: when you build new binary package names the old ones remain published and hold the source in the archive disk, you have to remove them manually in +delete-packages
<amitk> cprov: Thanks for the info.
<amitk> lool: a few trivial configs need to be patched into Ubuntu kernel, then we can get rid of all kernel stuff in PPA
<lool> cprov: Interesting, thanks
<cprov> you are welcome.
<lool> cprov: Do you beep on ppa? :)
<cprov> lool: yes :)
<lool> amitk: Excellent, will that land in the next hardy update?
<amitk> lool: yes, but only in July
<lool> Aha
<lool> amitk: And the final intel drivers will be in too at that date?
<lool> I guess so
<cprov> lool: lots of beeps and pidging-thinkpad-light-discotech lately :) 
<amitk> lool: if they provide it by then, yes :)
<lool> It's a plugin to blink the backlight when someone pings you?
<lool> Sounds ultimately cool
<cprov> lool: yes, a pigdin plugin to blink the thinkpad-light when some says one of the configurable words ...
<cprov> it's cool and sometimes annoying ;)
 * lool is tempted to should p p a p p a p p a
<lool> *shout
<[NO]> hey all, just had a excellent experience installing 8.04 from XP on a Samsung Q1 ultra :)
<lool> [NO]: How was it?
<lool> [NO]: You installed UME or Windows?
<inkynoob> Good morning
<lool> Hey
<inkynoob> What is the ppa repository for? 
<persia> inkynoob: It's a place to put things that aren't necessarily fit for Ubuntu proper.  This might mean newer upstreams for basic integration testing.  While the archive is frozen, it means just about any updates.  The use should decline significantly once intrepid is open.
<agoliveira> inkynoob: You can also use for your own packages. Just put there to be built and made available.
<inkynoob> If I want to be testing things and filing bug reports then, should I be using the ppa repository?
<agoliveira> inkynoob: Yes, you can fill a bug report and add your fixed package there.
<inkynoob> ok
<lool> persia: BTW, not sure you followed this, but I'd like us to push as much as possible out of the ppa in hardy updates when possible
<lool> Especially security sensible stuff
<persia> lool: Based on SRU hijacks?
<lool> Yeah, the mail I sent to ubuntu-mobile@
<lool> Naturally, we should make sure these have low impact, typically only applied for lpia or similar
<lool> persia: We will have to provide security updates and stable updates for 18 months based on this; it's best if most of it can  follow the general hardy procedure than go in the ppa
<persia> Right.  I'm presuming that new stuff should hit intrepid mostly directly once it's open, and that it's the current hardy PPA that we're draining in the SRUs.  Are we pushing more new stuff into the hardy PPA after intrepid opens?
<lool> persia: The target release date for UME is in about a month; we're pushing updates and bug fixes up to that date
<lool> persia: That's slightly earlier than hardy.1
<lool> We wont focus on intrepid until the first UME release is out
<persia> lool: OK.  Thanks for the clarification.
<lool> I think everything should happen in intrepid next cycle; no ppa-only feature shall be released
<lool> (IMO)
<inkynoob> So last night I got Ubuntu Mobile finally istalled on my EeePC. It's running very nicely, but the volume and brightness controls in the menu bar aren't working. Brightnes and volume are working with the keyboard shortcuts though. Does anyone know where I should be looking to make those work together?
<lool> inkynoob: Looks like issues with hal; you could try the gnome brightness applet to confirm
<persia> Look at the special key assignments in the ume-gui-start script as one place to start.
<persia> I have the same issue on the SR8.
<inkynoob> persia, I'll look at that. lool, it might be that only a subset of Hal got installed. I started from Ubuntu JeOS and installed UME on top of that
<persia> inkynoob: That might do it.  Check the fset definitions in the moblin-image-creator package to make sure you have the complete set of packages.  MY memory is that the metapackages don't match exactly.
<inkynoob> Are fsets a Debian package thing? I saw them when I played with Image Creator, but I just did a CD install to my computer, didn't use an image
<persia> fsets are a special image-creator thing.
<inkynoob> ok
<Zic> I heard that port of Ubuntu Mobile to the ARM arch (to work with ITT of Nokia) is still planed, the FAQ link (in the topic) is apparently outdated about this point, have you got more info ? Thanks ;)
<Zic> I know problems for this port about closed software of ITOS developed by Nokia with Maemo, and so, Ubuntu Mobile cannot use the full potential of ITT, if you have more info about "collaboration", I will glad to hear it too :)
<lool> Zic: What happened is that Nokia folks have rebuilt Ubuntu for ARM
<lool> This is not related to Ubuntu Mobile in particular
<lool> We do receive many requests about Ubuntu Mobile on ARM
<morick> so you never went bowling with goebbels either? 
<Raseel> @agoliveira : After your session yesterday, I finally manages to set a target , add Fsets (Samsung Full) and even see the UI in Xephyr
<Raseel> What next ?
<agoliveira> Raseel: Well, you tell me :) What do you want to do?
<Raseel> Well, frankly I have no idea :-) Are there any bugs I can test to reproduce an' stuff 
<Raseel> Test in Zephyr , of course
<agoliveira> Raseel: well, check launchpad. There's quite. Some of them are easy to fix like problems with dialog boxes sizes and things like that. Any help will be apreciated, of course.
<Raseel> ok. Lemme see what I can dig up
<Raseel> One thing, btw, when I tried to install the Fset for the Full Samsung with Propreitary thingy, I get an error "apt-get install" cannot find helix-dbus-server
<Raseel> Is this a known issue ?
<lool> Raseel: This package needs to be available from the APT repos your configure
<lool> Raseel: We have it in a private repo, but it relies on non-redistributable bits (helix stuff)
<agoliveira> Raseel: You can edit it out from the fset file description.
<Raseel> I already selected the samsung-full-mobile-stack (no propreitary
<Raseel> ) and it worked
<bspencer> asac, lool  despite my last email, mobile-basic-flash does not yet work with xulrunner 1.9.  Still working out the issues
<bspencer> hopefully by end of day
<bspencer> so v0.44 is the last stable release.  v0.45 has the patches for xul but doesn't work correctly.
<bspencer> fyi.
<bspencer> is there a place that identifies the licenses of all Hardy packages?
<bspencer> like GPL 2, 3, BSD, etc.
<inkynoob> Looks like each installed package has a copyright file in /usr/share/docs/<packagename>/copyright
<bjwood0> question: I just made a new project/target with MIC and when I run it in Xephyr the icons don't open up the right apps?
<bspencer> bjwood0, what apps do they open?
<bspencer> bjwood0,  in your drop-down menu (top-left), what categories to you have?
<bspencer> if you have something about system management, then you are probably reading the /usr/share/applications/*.desktop files from your system, and not your target
<bspencer> this is a common bug, fixed by running "pkill gconfd" in the target before launching xephyr
<bspencer> (just guessing)
<bspencer> shouldn't occur on the target of course.
<bspencer> s/target/device
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-05-01
<bjwood0> bspencer: I did the pkill gconfd and it fixed it, whew! :P
<bjwood0> bspencer: I also noticed I don't have to comment out the brightness line in the statusbar.conf now :)
<inkynoob> How is X supposed to start with Ubuntu Mobile? Should I be installing GDM just to have it auto login and auto start UME? 
<GrueMaster> It is part of the install.
<inkynoob> I installed on my eee with Ubuntu JeOS + the ubuntu-mobile package
<GrueMaster> Oh.  
<GrueMaster> This is part of an entire image.  Not sure how it works on a desktop image (which you have).
<inkynoob> I suppose I'll create an image tonight and pick it apart to see what it's doing
<GrueMaster> Try downloading a daily snapshot of the live usb image from http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/moblin/mccaslin
<GrueMaster> oops.  Bad link.  Try http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/moblin/hardy/mccaslin_samsungq1ultrafull/
<inkynoob> ah, that's better :-) 
<GrueMaster> Not quite optimised for the Eee, but close.
<inkynoob> thanks, I'll take a look at it
<ToddBrandt> kyleN_: can https://bugs.launchpad.net/moblin-applets/+bug/206389 be closed? 
<kyleN_> ToddBrandt: question: is there another moblin bug or other commitment to make theme switching for the  marquee panels work when the /desktop/gnome/interface/gtk_theme key changes? this is an issue we need to follow through on. framework should work. gtk-theme-switcher ui is extra credit. by the way - my internet is hit or miss now since I am not at home.
<ToddBrandt> kyleN_: bspencer is the owner of the marquee panels, I'll ping him on it. I guess it depends on how major an issue it is to fix. oh, and do you use gtk-theme-switcher instead of the gnome-control-center theme switcher? I'll try that if so since the gtk one is much lighter
<kyleN_> ToddBrandt: the main point is to change the gconf key (however) and everything else works
<kyleN_> the only part that doesn't now that I know of is the marquee panels
<ToddBrandt> ok, let me put that in the comments of the bug then
<kyleN_> thx
<kyleN_> and it is major
<ToddBrandt> high?
<kyleN_> lets take that up in the thursday bug triage with tony?
<ToddBrandt> soudns good, I'll leave it as is for now
<kyleN_> ok
<ToddBrandt> here's the comment: ok, this bug is nearly fixed. The only thing left is that the marquee doesn't seem to propagate theme changes when the gtk_theme key is changed.
<kyleN_> excellent
<kyleN_> appreciate...
<ToddBrandt> no problem
<bspencer> kyleN_, 
<kyleN_> yes bspencer 
<bspencer> per lool, apps usually don't listen to the gconf key
<kyleN_> we need to take this up with bfiller and others present
<bspencer> but your scenario should owrk
<kyleN_> all gtk apps do here changes to THIS key
<bspencer> gconf -- then ToddBrandt does something to notifiy
<kyleN_> through xsettings
<bspencer> yes.
<bspencer> ok.  so let's discuss thursday
<kyleN_> so marquee panels, as gtk apps should listen, right?
<bspencer> not necessarily to the key, but via xsettings
<kyleN_> ok. we have a talking point
<kyleN_> let's discuss tomorrow
<rolando-ve> Hi
<rolando-ve> Well I'm very newby with this
<rolando-ve> But I'll try to ask
<rolando-ve> If anyone can Help me, I will so glad
<rolando-ve> This is my case:
<rolando-ve> I have in my hands a Mini Computer Pannel, this one have a Transmeta T5500 Processor
<rolando-ve> And have 2 Gb Flash Disk
<rolando-ve> I wanna install in this Ubuntu Mobile.
<rolando-ve> It's? Possible?
<rolando-ve> Have 256 RAM 
<rolando-ve> Help?
<rolando-ve> :-D
<linx> G'day u all 
<linx> I have a htc shift upmc (or close to be a upmc :D ) from where can I download the ubuntu mobile version to test it on it ? 
<linx> I did not say that address me to download it or see the evolution of this project
<linx> I'm pretty interested in this kinda sowftware
<linx> I'm not sure if htc shift is compatible now with ubuntu mobile
<linx> In one of the links said that is ported on it but in the image creator stuff just talk about one dvice supported no the htc one
<linx> please can any one address me ? is the first time that I take in touch with this project
<linx> hi
<linx> eo
<linx> any available
<Raseel> Hi guys, I need some help with image-creator
<Raseel> After I install a target and Add Fsets (Samsung-full-moble-stack) , I tried running ume-xephyr-start
<Raseel> But I got the following error : Could not init font path element /usr/share/fonts/X11/cyrillic, removing from list!
<lool> Raseel: This is probably not fatal
<lool> Just a warning
<Raseel> @lool :  Yes, but my UI won't open up
<Raseel> @lool :  It just crashes
<lool> Raseel: Does other stuff come up in your xephyr?
<persia> Raseel: And if it comes up (xclock is a good test app), does it come up full-screen?
<lool> ppa copies are really nice
<lool> cprov: Nice ^ :)
<cprov> lool: thanks
<lool> cprov: Do you happen to know why lpia is shown as official for hardy and not for gutsy?
<lool> AFAIK, the binaries are still on ports.u.c, not archive.u.c
<cprov> lool: it's configured that way, check with some archive-admin to know if they have any reason. They can change it.
<lool> Ok, thanks
<lool> "You can now subscribe to all the bugs affecting a project group" cool
<lool> I can finally subscribe to moblin bugs
<davidm> meeting starts in 2 minutes
<davidm> looking to be a short meeting
<Zic> davidm: in #ubuntu-meeting ?
<davidm> here
<davidm> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/Meeting/20080501
<davidm> #startmeeting
<Zic> (thanks)
<davidm> Opps no mootbot
<davidm> Oh well I'll make manual logs
<davidm> bspenser is not here
<davidm> topic was: (bspencer) document status of i18n of moblin modules on Ubuntu wiki; needs discussion with asac and cwong for FF [cted] 
<davidm> I'll take that as no one has any input, I'll carry it forward then.
<davidm> next topic was: (davidm) fix links in IRC logs 
<davidm> Which I have accomplished
<davidm> Ah, hi bspencer 
<bspencer> morning
<davidm> I'll repost the query for you
<davidm> mootbot is missing this morning so I'll make logs manually
<davidm> new topic: (bspencer) document status of i18n of moblin modules on Ubuntu wiki; needs discussion with asac and cwong for FF [cted] 
<Hobbsee> ah yes, should poke to get that recreated.
<davidm> bspencer, progress?
<bspencer> posted
<bspencer> I added a link to Kyle's i18n page
<davidm> bspencer, thanks.  Great, anything that will raise issues?
<bspencer> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/I18nMobileCode/ApplicationStatus
<bspencer> issues:  2 "In progress" components
<bspencer> perhaps we can prioritize these in tony's sync-up meeting with us at 10am
<davidm> OK sounds good.
<davidm> Do I need to carry anything for next week?
<bspencer> the two in-progress will probably be tracked elsewhere, so I guess not
<bspencer> as bugs, for example.
<davidm> OK, thanks
<davidm> OK that concludes old business then
<davidm> And I don't have any new topics on the meeting page.
<davidm> Any opens from the floor?
<GrueMaster> When can we expect the next Beta snapshot?
<davidm> GrueMaster, the next one should be tomorrow morning
<GrueMaster> Ok, thanks.
<bspencer> yes, and what is our target goal for UME release?
<davidm> StevenK, is finishing it in his AM and will post.
<davidm> bspencer, target is currently WW20 for RC 
 * bspencer scrambles for decoder ring
<davidm> might slip depending on bug lists
<davidm> Week of the 11th
<bspencer> May 11-17th
<bspencer> got it
<davidm> with a final (I hope) by May 30
<davidm> We will continue to work bug fixes during UDS if need be and then go final after we are all back from it.
<GrueMaster> With that in mind, there are a few basic holes that need to get filled.  Namely, automount for USB and file management.
<davidm> GrueMaster, file management?
<bspencer> GrueMaster, for "file management" you want a file manager program?
<bspencer> like nautilus
<GrueMaster> Kind of hard to transfer files otherwise.
<bspencer> initially we tried to hide the file view to the user and make the import utilties smart enough to show the right info.
<GrueMaster> The media player doens't have one.
<davidm> That was decussed in prior UDS and decided not to have one.
<bspencer> I have some ideas here.
<bspencer> GrueMaster, I think we can solve your issues w/o a file manager per say
<bspencer> but open for debate.
<bspencer> sometimes we make things harder by trying to make them simpler.
<GrueMaster> Not looking for anything major, but the users will probably like to organise their files and documents somehow.
<davidm> We can add something but at this late date will not be hildonized
<GrueMaster> I haven't tried the import from media player, but if it just goes and grabs, I'd hate to plug a 160gb external drive to my 4Gb mid.
<davidm> This might be a UDS topic for next version
<davidm> would be interesting since it will fill flash pretty quickly.
<bspencer> GrueMaster, agree
<GrueMaster> At any rate, we still need to implement automount for usb drives.  Unless we want the user to open a terminal and manually mount drives.
<davidm> I was under the impression that it was automouting them
<davidm> But if not have you filed a bug?
<GrueMaster> It doesn't here.
<GrueMaster> I can file a bug, but I'm a bit gun shy after the last one.
<davidm> cgregan, have you come across this?
<GrueMaster> And I had reported this a long time ago, before launchpad.
<cgregan> In an interview for henrik
<davidm> cgregan, Ok
<GrueMaster> This may have been fixed in the dailies.  Last time I looked at this was 0408
<davidm> GrueMaster, I'll ask cgregan to catch up with you later to get this checked out.
<GrueMaster> ok
<davidm> I seem to remember that there was some issue but it was with MIC not making a partation that was needed.
<davidm> OK any other issues?
<GrueMaster> That may have been for the usb client.
<davidm> could be
<davidm> OK, if no other issues, endmeeting going once............................................................
<davidm> OK, if no other issues, endmeeting going twice....................
<davidm> endmeeting
<davidm> Thanks everyone.
<cgregan> ï»¿GrueMaster, davidm: I have seen this. I would expect a file manager window or some sort of wizard to come up when you insert a USB drive. But no action is taken. I believe there is some work on this in Lex.
<davidm> cgregan, the media player should import music, no file manager is expected
<davidm> that was decided last UDS.
<cgregan> Ok...lemme load a couple files to my key
<davidm> But if USB is not getting mounted that is an issue.
<GrueMaster> Shouldn't udev at least mount the drive?  When I manually mount a drive, then the media manager window pops up asking if I want to import files.
<cgregan> I see
<cgregan> What is the default device?
<cgregan> Where does the spec say it should be mounted? /media ?
<GrueMaster> default device?  It depends on if there is a partition defined on the device or not.
<cgregan> /dev/?
<cgregan> sbd?
<GrueMaster> the device shows up in /dev, but is not mounted.
<GrueMaster> could be sdb, or sdc if you have two usb devices.
<GrueMaster> could also be sdb1 if it is an original device not imaged with dd.
<cgregan> ï»¿GrueMaster: Yep..no mounted FS on my Jax device
<cgregan> Looks like we are not doing it
<cgregan> Definite bug. Please enter
<davidm> cgregan, please add it to the bug list then, thanks
<cgregan> davidm: Ok..I will file
<qense> Does Ubuntu Mobile support Blackberry?
<qense> And what sync utilities are there to sync it with your Ubuntu desktop?
<GrueMaster> qense:  To the first question - no.  Please read the FAQ.  To the second question, I'm not sure that has been addressed yet.  It is a good question, though.
<qense> thanks!
<tonyespy_> ToddBrandt, bspencer: anyone going to participate in the bug triage mtg?
<ToddBrandt> tonyespy: I'm in the bridge
<ScorpKing> hi guys. how much will image-creator download?
<ScorpKing> i'm at "I: Retrieving dpkg-dev" now. 
 * ScorpKing needs to reboot..
 * ScorpKing is back..
<adem> hello
<adem> i have a question, does port ubuntu on a pocket pc, like the htc polaris
<adem> anyone?
<GrueMaster> Apparently the FAQ doesn't cover this.  Or, you missed the link at the top of the room.  In short, no.
<persia> adem: Not currently.  There largest issue currently is CPU support: Ubuntu Mobile is only for i386 devices at this point.
<ScorpKing> how can i make the image-creator download the packages from my local repo instead of the internet?
<ScorpKing> nvm. found it in /usr/share/pdk/default_config/defaults.cfg
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-05-02
<ScorpKing> hi guys. i've created a usb image and tried to boot it with qemu but it's saying "Begin: Mounting root file system..." then "checking driver sda/sdb/sdc/sdd" and it just loops there. i think the fstab on it is empty. how do i fix it?
 * ScorpKing is wondering if anyone is around today..
<bspencer> asac, getting closer on mobile-basic-flash w/xulrunner.  It runs and loads the page, but calling javascript from  C isn't working.
<bspencer> for example:
<bspencer> 	gchar *url = g_strdup_printf("javascript:setBackground(['%s', '%s', '%s'])", 
<bspencer> 				     pic, opt, color);
<bspencer> 	gtk_moz_embed_load_url(GTK_MOZ_EMBED(context->container), url);
<bspencer> .
<bspencer> the javascript function  setBackground(...) doesn't get called.
<Asad2005> is mobile edition released or not ? Is there a place to download a beta version for HTC P3300. (sorry if this has been asked a lot)
<persia> Asad2005: Not yet released (soon).
<Asad2005> persia, thanks and how abut beta is it available 
<persia> Asad2005: Won't run on the HTCP3300 anyway (I think), as the current images are only for lpia (roughly IA32).
<persia> Given the software included in the recent images, I don't imagine it will run on an ARM9 with that little RAM anytime soon, if at all.
<Asad2005> ok thanks
<persia> I wouldn't try even an ARM port on less than 400MHz w/ 640x480 resolution and 128MB RAM, and the general minimum target is closer to 800x480, 384MB RAM, and a significantly faster processor.
#ubuntu-mobile 2008-05-04
<inkynoob> Is there a GUI tool to choose a wireless point to connect to?
<Sciri> inkynoob: Yes, nm-applet, which is the Network Manager Applet.
<inkynoob> should that be in the menu bar by default? Or shoud I need to start it myself?
<inkynoob> hmm. When I try to run nm-applet I get : (nm-applet:5568): Gtk-WARNING **: Could not find the icon 'nm-no-connection'. The 'hicolor' theme was not found either, perhaps you need to install it
<inkynoob> I did install with the ubuntu-mobile package, not with the image creator
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-04-27
<shivraj> what can you run ubuntu mobile on ?
<shivraj> I have a palm pilto tungsten e, havent used it in years need to change the battery 
<shivraj> plus I cant remember the password, will need to erase all of the memory, 
<shivraj> all I need is a python shell to use as a planner
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-04-29
<lfu> hi, dunno I'm in the right place for my questions here. so sorry for any misplaced question. I'm trying to get a customized atom board with graphic up and running, tried IEGD first, which is broken like hell. I then found the psb project, which is apparently inactive at moblin.org. I obtained some sourcpackages for the xorg and kernel driver in http://netbook-remix.archive.canonical.com/ubuntu/dists/hardy-dell-mini/main/source/, kicked i
<lfu> I supposed strongly that the segfault is somewhere in Xpsb.so, which is unfortunately binary only.
<lfu> so I'm wondering how the ubuntu people got this running. Any chance to get source code for this?
<persia> lfu, I don't believe that the psb drivers are open source.
<lfu> there're only small portion closed source
<lfu> the firmware I actually don't care since the xorg startsup also without the kernel driver
<lfu> all I'm wondering about ist the Xpsb.so
<lfu> the Ubuntu people *get* to have got it run... somehow
<persia> Well, I can say it wasn't ever part of Ubuntu proper.  There's been some out-of-archive solutions, including the archive you reference above, and the ubuntu-mobile PPA (for hardy)
<persia> I've been following some of the work that was done to try to make it work with intrepid, and I know that a whole heap of packages are affected.
<persia> But I don't know anything about Xpsb.so specifically.
<ogra> beyond the fact that you need to bend backwards until your right ear touches your left ankle to make it build
<lfu> I actually got the psb_drv compile with my toolchain ;-) You guys has already supplied some patches, I indeed had to kick it further, but it went actually through
<lfu> If I don't have the xpsb.so, the psb_drv start till the point: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//psb_drv.so: undefined symbol: psbDRIScreenInit, which seemed godd so far. After I copied the file. X segfaults with this X[974]: segfault at 2949492c eip b7e8cd28 esp 081e6038 error 4. Since I have a debug system with symbol tables. It ought to be somewhere in Xpsb.so, which is apparaentlich stripped till bone
<lfu> So I'm wondering where has the Ubuntu people get the finger on this binary. It might probably be some version conflicts with my xorg. (libX11-1.1.4, xorg-server-1.4) (my system is built from scratch with ptxdist). If I can get more information about this part, it'd be enough help
<persia> lfu, Again, it's never been part of Ubuntu proper.  I strongly suspect that the binary you found from http://netbook-remix.archive.canonical.com/ubuntu/dists/hardy-dell-mini/main/source/ was prepared under contract with Intel (as I don't know of any other means to collect it).
<lfu> persia: hmm, sounds unappealing
<persia> Yeah, that's part of why it's not in the repos.  Personally, I'd like to have it available, as I have a couple poulsbo devices, but for now I just run with VESA.
<lfu> persia: VESA ist unfortunately not enought, $CUSOMTER likes to see things rotating and blinking, ;-)
<persia> Yeah.  For that, you probably need to coordinate with the hardware vendor, unfortunately.
<lfu> the powerVR core in GMA500 is crappy like hell. I've already had a lot of fun with this in a powerpc architecture. Now it's biting me hard on this GMA500 issue
<lfu> Intel has defintively done a bad deal with it
<lfu> one more question. can I obtain the UNR hardy image somewhere in canonicals archive?
<lfu> I can only find the jaunty based current one
<ogra> http://oem-images.canonical.com/unr/
<lfu> the 1.0.1 is hardy based?
<ogra> (linked under releases on https://launchpad.net/netbook-remix)
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-04-30
<mord> neat. jaunty with lxde seems to be fast enough to be actually usable on a n810.
<Stralytic> has the ubuntu-mobile meeting happened yet?
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-05-01
<billiob> hi
<billiob> can anyone help me to find the .config of the kernel shipped with a dell-mini? it's not in the source package
<billiob> it's in the image package...
<Margraf> hey all
<Margraf> can i install ubuntu mobile on my motoQ gsm from Brazil?
<plars> Margraf: nope, not on phones :(
<Margraf> plars: do u know one that work on phones?
<plars> Margraf: there's the limo stuff (Linux Mobile), but I don't think it's a distro you can just grab and put on your phone.  More likely, something you might see released on phones in the future.  Haven't really looked into it too deeply though
<Margraf> plars: ok, thanks
#ubuntu-mobile 2009-05-03
 * NCommander is currently battle 0-2 on his question for a decent MID with bluetooth support
<NCommander> :-/
<NCommander> s/question/quest/g
<rbelem> ogra, ping
<rbelem> ogra, i made a small patch to create-image.sh http://paste.ubuntu.com/163710/
<rbelem> ogra, now the resulting image runs in kvm
<rbelem> ogra, can i be added to the mobile team to push to bzr? :-D
<dyfet> You can run this without resorting to isolinux.iso cd image to pre-boot the the usb image off a second hd img in kvm?
<rbelem> nope, you still need the iso
<dyfet> rbelem: I see mostly it adds useful and additional boot menu options.
<rbelem> dyfet, the patch fixes some errors that caused the previous script to drop down to the busybox shell in kvm
<dyfet> rbelem: I also encountered that issue :)
<rbelem> :-)
<ian_brasil> dyfet: maybe kvm allows for booting on the second hard disk now i dunno
<ian_brasil> just checked..no it doesn't so still need the isolinux.iso to boot from CD
<dyfet> ian_brasil: it is really a bochs bios limitation...so it can at least in theory be addressed there :)
<NCommander> Celtiore, ping?, I got pointed to you for help getting Ubuntu on my Jax10 to work well :-)
<Celtiore> NCommander, http://www.midwiki.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=55:ume&catid=34:aigo-how&Itemid=54
<NCommander> Celtiore, no bluetooth?
<Celtiore> no, bluetooth but no PAN network
<NCommander> Well, I'm looking for Bluetooth HID
<NCommander> :-)
<NCommander> Celtiore, and I guess the second question is how do I get the device into recovery mode :-/
<Celtiore> do you have compal img ?
<NCommander> compal image?
#ubuntu-mobile 2010-05-04
<M0DCM_Dave> any news about Poulsbo?
<davmor2> l
<persia> ?
<r00s> hi
<r00s> does window-picker-applet remove the window title bar when i maximize, or is that maximus' job?
<r00s> becaaaause i installed window-picker-applet and the title bars don't hide
<r00s> and it used to work with karmic
<M0DCM_Dave> How did Poulsbo go?
