#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-02
<jbicha> TheMuso: do you use brltty?
<jbicha> I was wondering if there's a better page we should point people to, for bug 651707
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 651707 in ubuntu-docs "brltty refers to http://access.ubuntu.com/braille but that doesn't exist" [Medium,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/651707
<TheMuso> I don'
<TheMuso> I don't use it, but am aware of the problem, however don't know of a page that has the required info.
<jbicha> ok thanks
<TheMuso> np
<Cheri703> anyone here super familiar with orca?
<jbicha> Cheri703: sorry, I'm not but you could maybe try the new orca help
<Cheri703> ok, well, I have someone in my loco whose wife tried ubuntu a few years ago, and said orca wasn't good enough, but they haven't tried it lately. he's going to talk to her and see if she's up for trying again
<jbicha> my opinion is that it's still a bit of a pain to get going but more or less does work
<TheMuso> Cheri703: If you could give me more info on how it wasn't good enough, I may be able to help, or at least point you/them in the right direction.
<Cheri703> kk, I will talk to him further and ask for more info, thanks
<TheMuso> Ok thanks.
<fregl> hi
<fregl> how is unity 3d doing when it comes to keyboard navigation?
<fregl> and 2d?
<AlanBell> Cheri703: orca is quite good, but there is a significant learning curve to it
<AlanBell> fregl: there are keyboard shortcuts, not sure how well harmonised they are between the two
<AlanBell> fregl: unity 2d is going to be less readable to Orca for a while, however if you want to type into the unity window with onboard that works now in 2d but not 3d
<fregl> AlanBell: I work on the Qt side of things, so I know about the general issues in 2d, I am mostly wondering if there is a concept of focus for example in unity in general
<AlanBell> http://askubuntu.com/questions/28086/unity-keyboard-mouse-shortcuts
<AlanBell> so yes, basically
<AlanBell> I will try it in unity-2d later
<AlanBell> lenses and other stuff written for unity-3d work unmodified on unity-2d which is nice
<fregl> thanks
<Pendulum> charlie-tca: did that blueprint ever get done?
<charlie-tca> no
<charlie-tca> I got to do it
<AlanBell> need help?#
<AlanBell> today would be a good day to get it done and approved
<charlie-tca> yes, need help. Never done one
<AlanBell> Community a11y blueprint
<AlanBell> is what we are working on right?
<charlie-tca> right
<AlanBell> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/sprints/uds-o/+addspec
<AlanBell> so that is the form you need to fill out
<AlanBell> the project is ubuntu
<AlanBell> name would be community-o-accessibility-team
<AlanBell> Title something like "Discussion of the goals of the accessibility team in the Oniric cycle"
<AlanBell> you get to be the drafter, set jono as the approver
<AlanBell> stick a few words in the summary
<charlie-tca> Thank you
<AlanBell> detail doesn't matter much at this point, it can be edited
<AlanBell> the thing just needs to exist so jono can approve it and get it scheduled
<charlie-tca> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-o-accessibility-team
<AlanBell> I am sure the awesome jono will approve https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-o-accessibility-team in a matter of minutes
<charlie-tca> I'm thinking the etherpad from the meeting has most of the stuff in it
<charlie-tca> then I forgot to subscribe me
<AlanBell> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricOcelot/Roadmaps
<UndiFineD> thanks AlanBell 
#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-03
<Cheri703> any accessibility blueprints already set? /me is wading through the list
<maco> Cheri703: desktop-o-kubuntu-accessibility and umm... there's a desktop-o-ubiquity-accessibility i think?
<maco> and one for unity
<Cheri703> kk, thanks
<paul_h1> TheMuso: does installing ubuntu with the blindness profile still cause pulse not to be used?
<TheMuso> paul_h1: No.
<TheMuso> Pulse is used.
<TheMuso> Because espeak + pulseaudio with speech-dispatcher out of the box performs quite ok.
<TheMuso> maco: There isn't one specifically for unity a11y, although it may be worthwhile registerig one, given the number of empty spots on the schedule atm.
<TheMuso> There is one there for unity a11y though, which could be used to talk about Unity 2D.
<maco> TheMuso: what?
<maco> there isnt one for unity a11y but there is one for unity a11y?
<TheMuso> maco: Sorry. There is not one for unity 2D a11y, but there is one for unity a11y.
<TheMuso> So the one for unity a11y could be used to talk about Unity 2D.
<paul_h1> TheMuso: yeah thought so, just checking. looking at recent questions on the orca list re: synths that I think are pulse related
<maco> oh ok
<maco> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-accessibility-ubiquity
<TheMuso> Yep
<maco> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-kubuntu-accessibility
<maco> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-dx-o-unity-a11y
<maco> there's all the accessibility ones i know for oneiric
<Cheri703> I found most of those, thanks
<TheMuso> Right, and I was thinking that the unity one could be used to talk about the remainder or 3D unity and 2D unity.
<hajour> tomorrow UndiFineD  go put openmary on this laptop.
 * hajour cheers
<j1mc> hi ubuntu a11y folks. i've put together a blueprint for UDS about docs in case any of you are interested. 
<j1mc> here's the link:
<j1mc> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-ubuntu-docs-strategy
<hajour> thank you j1mc  i have put it in browser
<hajour> i go read it after i have slept a couple of hours  j1mc  :)
<UndiFineD> thanks j1mc 
<UndiFineD> subsribed
<hajour> what will go  much easier tomorrow  because then i got a speechprogram j1mc  :)
<hajour> also got subscribed j1mc :)
<hajour> i go sleep now goodnight all
<hajour> goodnight all :)
<AlanBell> the accessibility community blueprint has been approved and is currently scheduled for 16:15 on the tuesday
<AlanBell> scheduling is subject to change
<TheMuso> Sweet, will subscribe.
<TheMuso> Oh fun, I have conflicting sessions at that time.
<TheMuso> Anyway, will mark myself as essential, and will see what happens.,'
<AlanBell> this is exactly why the scheduling is subject to change! mark yourself as essential to both and they will be moved apart in an hour or so
<AlanBell> Pendulum: seen the session is approved and scheduled?
<Pendulum> AlanBell: hah, no hadn't gotten that far
<Pendulum> probably won't make it, but glad to know it's all scheduled!
<Pendulum> so how many a11y sessions are scheduled then?
<AlanBell> I think there are four blueprints, but not sure they are all scheduled yet
<AlanBell> it changes too often at the moment to keep track
<Pendulum> yeah
<Pendulum> I can think of 4
<Pendulum> \o/
<maco> AlanBell: 4? whats the 4th? unity, ubiquity, kubuntu...?
<AlanBell> the community one
<maco> oh
<UndiFineD> :)
<UndiFineD> AlanBell, did you get to do that blog ?
<UndiFineD> I am trying to get it working for hajour, but it does not work for me
<UndiFineD> spd is not complaining about a missing file
<UndiFineD> but i do not hear anything either
<UndiFineD> might it be that I am missing $VOICE variable ?
<AlanBell> not blogged yet
<AlanBell> can you do "spd-say hello"
<AlanBell> just with the default voice
<UndiFineD> yes
<UndiFineD> that works AlanBell 
<Pendulum> dunno if this has been dropped in here yet, but http://blobolobolob.blogspot.com/2011/05/blogging-against-disablism-day-2011.html for those who are interested in reading
<Pendulum> we have 2 Ubuntu related posts in it!
#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-04
<hajour> goodnight all its 4:09 in night so i need some sleep to.
<webczat> Hey.
<webczat> Is there java-atk-wrapper in ubuntu?
<hajour> great ubuntu-beginners forum is going to test out accessibility on the test forum
<hajour> charlie-tca, cprofitt maco TheMuso ^
<hajour> and everyone else
<hajour> need to help cooking now just wanted to let you all know
<hajour> and JanC  see above :)
<charlie-tca> very good
<JanC> nice
<hajour> ok back
<webczat> hey
<hajour> good news thought testing accessibility now on ubuntu test forum
<hajour> webczat, ^
<webczat> :
<hajour> and only because i had complained about it .i am a little surprised by that
<webczat> What happens with java-access-bridge on ubuntu-10.10 and 11? it's deprecated and doesn't work due to some orbit errors whh...
<webczat> errors on 2 screens of a terminal
<hajour> i don't no charlie-tca  do you now about that ^ ?
<hajour> charlie-tca,  will response but have multiple channels webczat 
<webczat> I have 6 :d had 12
<hajour> if he not know it he probably will now who do know it webczat 
<webczat> mhm
<webczat> Actually the non-deprecated thing is java-atk-wrapper.
<hajour> i am not a programmer or something webczat  i hope soon there is a usable read write program for me to learn more
<hajour> i have size 18 fonts on irc chat
 * webczat is totally and irrecoverably blind :d
<hajour> a witch program you use webczat ?
<hajour> i have been blind several times webczat 
<webczat> What?
<webczat> ah
<hajour> i need a program what read out loud with understandable voice.i got dislectic to most with reading
<hajour> webczat, 
<webczat> mmmm
<webczat> Is orca seen to you as understandable?
<webczat> I mean espeak
<webczat> Because orca isn't a synthesizer
<hajour> orca is mechanical voice not yet have get prudence voice get working with open mary webczat 
<hajour> orca do hurt my ears webczat 
<webczat> it's espeak. if you have a synth, you can probably use it with orca if it has speech-dispatcher module.
<webczat> if i understand that correctly
<hajour> i now we just have get with help from AlanBell  libopenmary get working webczat 
<webczat> I use orca and occassionally speakup.
<hajour> i am team leader from speechcontrol webczat 
<AlanBell> afternoon all
<hajour> we gor people in the team who have worked on espeak
<hajour> gor=got
<webczat> mhm
<hajour> and TheMuso  also is in our team webczat 
<webczat> Actually I now don't want to change espeak to anything else. after few months...
<webczat> Or actually... I remember I didn't need to wait few months for me to promptly use it
<hajour> speechcontrol is read write program with voicecommand webczat 
<hajour> it need to be usable to for light weight programs webczat 
<hajour> a AlanBell 
<hajour> maybe you can help webczat 
<webczat> depends in what
<AlanBell> yeah, just looking back for a question to answer :)
<AlanBell> java atk stuff
<hajour> also if webczat  is helped i would have get some help with trying to install a speechprogram on this laptop from my daughter AlanBell 
<AlanBell> hajour: I think you need to learn to use orca
<AlanBell> I do too, it is a big thing to learn
<webczat> yeah
<hajour> i think on this laptop it will be possible to put a speechprogram on it
<AlanBell> I can get the openmary synth working with orca for you
<webczat> use orca
<hajour> it was not possible to put it on my old eeepc
<AlanBell> and you can use my remote openmary install, or a local one on your laptop
<webczat> AlanBell: coding the module or wtf?
<AlanBell> webczat: I have a generic module that works
<hajour> wanted to try openmary AlanBell 
<hajour> but we cant get prudence voice working
<AlanBell> a speech dispatcher module using the generic driver that is
<hajour> a you mean libopenmary AlanBell ?
<AlanBell> nope
<AlanBell> I have no idea what libopenmary is supposed to do
<AlanBell> even having read the source code
<hajour> or was it not usable?
<webczat> AlanBell: what about java awt thing?
<hajour> UndiFineD,  can explain it to you or JackyAlcine  AlanBell 
<hajour> JackyAlcine,  ping
<AlanBell> webczat: not sure about java atk stuff
<webczat> or about jab legacy?
<webczat> I someday tested the atk thingy and it worked, but ubuntu still has this deprecated jab. and it even does not work.
<webczat> because of orbit errors. that also prevents using it after upgrading to at-spi2 if ever done
<AlanBell> !info libaccess-bridge-java
<hajour> have pinged JackyAlcine  in pm for you AlanBell 
<AlanBell> webczat: ok, I see what that is supposed to do
<AlanBell> webczat: I will have a go with that later
<AlanBell> if that one is deprecated where is the upstream we should be using?
<webczat> java-atk-wrapper
<hajour> not yet have get respond AlanBell 
<hajour> from JackyAlcine 
<AlanBell> webczat: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=537779
<ubot2> Debian bug 537779 in wnpp "RFP: java-atk-wrapper -- An ATK implementation for Java using JNI" [Wishlist,Open]
<AlanBell> looks like it is not yet packaged in debian :(
<AlanBell> I will have more of a play later, that is probably something we could bring up at UDS and get someone to package it and get it in Debian
<AlanBell> hajour: I will help you get openmary working with speech dispatcher on your laptop later
<hajour> ok AlanBell 
<AlanBell> hajour: does orca work right now for you?
<hajour> AlanBell,  danielo108 will explain it to you
<AlanBell> as in, you run orca and it talks?
<hajour> i not get a understandable voice AlanBell 
<AlanBell> yeah, that is fine
<hajour> it sounds better but it mmm looking for the right english word now
<AlanBell> but if you run it now it should say "welcome to orca" and "orca screen reader slash magnifier frame preferences button"
<hajour> going translate brb
<AlanBell> don't care if it sounds horrible, just want to know if it works
<JackyAlcine> lol
 * JackyAlcine was pinged; can't determine what exactly for.
<hajour> orca falters
<hajour> JackyAlcine,  AlanBell  wants to no where libopenmary is for to use
<AlanBell> actually I am off out to water plants now
<JackyAlcine> Lol
<hajour> so its falters then repeat the font over the next font AlanBell 
<JackyAlcine> But yeah, libopenmary was originally designed to be used the same way libespeak is.
<hajour> and then its not understandable
<hajour> AlanBell, 
<JackyAlcine> But as AlanBell brought to the team's attention; it can also be used to create a plugin to speechd to support MARY.
<hajour> needed time to explain in english
<hajour> yes i heard JackyAlcine 
<hajour> we need to organize a meeting soon again JackyAlcine 
<JackyAlcine> Indeed; as soon as I can get my home system more stabilized..
<hajour> i am switching often from pc at the moment JackyAlcine 
<hajour> i not have a own pc anymore
<JackyAlcine> But meetings would be more easier for me to attend on the weekend, as school's coming to a close and I have to please my college.
<hajour> i understand but saterday i need to go sleep early as i have to stand up at 6:00 in morning on sunday to get my plain to uds JackyAlcine 
<JackyAlcine> Oh man! UDS!
<hajour> yes
<JackyAlcine> lol, keep forgetting about that
<hajour> thats next week JackyAlcine 
 * webczat says re
<charlie-tca> I went to lunch and last minute shopping for travel
<hajour> brb need to get my kids to bed so
<webczat> charlie-tca: do you know something about java-atk-wrapper or jab?
<charlie-tca> no, I don't really. I have seen a couple of bug reports about java-bridge not working
<charlie-tca> but that is the extent of it.
<webczat> yeah. jab is deprecated, right?
<webczat> I heart it's replaced by java-atk-wrapper
<charlie-tca> yeah, to the best of my knowledge, jab is deprecated. Didn't know about the replacement.
<webczat> yes, there is :)
<webczat> I remember me testing it one time
<webczat> I think ubuntu needs to replace jab with java-atk-wrapper, I heart that it's currently completed but some things need fixing. that's better than something that doesn't work at all because of some corba things.
<webczat> It at least does not crash the whole java thing.
<charlie-tca> I defer to TheMuso for that kind of stuff. I do the testing and wiki updates when I can, but I am not a developer.
<webczat> But there's a cool and understandable error message with a backtrace. :)
<webczat> And I don't understand it cause I don't know corba.
<charlie-tca> Like I say, I have to let developers put everything together. I can test things and tell what does and what does not work, but I don't understand all the application interaction
<webczat> mhm
<Daniel0108> hi
<webczat> hi
<JanC> webczat: is there and Ubuntu bug about java-atk-wrapper ?
<webczat> JanC: I am not really sure.
<JanC> or maybe a bug about the one that doesn't work  ;)
<webczat> Probably there is. I didn't check bugs, I just like asked for advice.
<webczat> or info
<AlanBell> webczat: I don't think there is an Ubuntu bug about it, if there is somewhere then it will just be a pointer to the debian request to package bug
<webczat> I want to program in swing
<JanC> AlanBell: a bug that links to the debian one would be useful though
<AlanBell> what would it be filed against though?
<AlanBell> debian bug 537779
<JanC> probably against the old one?
<ubot2> Debian bug 537779 in wnpp "RFP: java-atk-wrapper -- An ATK implementation for Java using JNI" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/537779
<JanC> the old library, I mean
<AlanBell> ok
<JanC> seems like it's in the libaccess-bridge-java / libaccess-bridge-java-jni packages
<AlanBell> bug 429296
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 429296 in java-access-bridge "Does not work!" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429296
<AlanBell> that bug has the corba error webczat mentioned I think
<AlanBell> why do we think java-access-bridge is deprecated?
<JanC> I wonder how it's using Corba though?
<JanC> in Natty I mean
<AlanBell> at-spi stuff probably, doesn't really matter
<AlanBell> just want to file a bug against it for being deprecated
<JanC> what I mean is that it doesn't seem to use any CORBA library
<JanC> some Java stdlib implementation maybe
<AlanBell> can't find any reference to it being deprecated so I am not filing a bug against it for that
<JanC> well, maybe it's not deprecated but just not maintained...
<AlanBell> yeah, well it has the "doesn't work" bug already
<JanC> didn't Oracle tell most Sun a11y developers to find another job?  :-/
<JanC> well, and some by Sun itself and IBM before that apparently...  :-/
<AlanBell> pretty much, yes
<JanC> mayeb we need to remind them about http://www.oracle.com/us/corporate/profit/features/070609-community-143624.html  :P
<AlanBell> http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-o/meeting/community-o-accessibility-team/
 * AlanBell added it to the discussion notes for UDS
<webczat> AlanBell: jab is probably deprecated because it uses at-spi, not atk
<webczat> and it's at-spi1
<webczat> ubuntu has at-spi1 but at-spi1 is actually being replaced with version 2.
<webczat> Hmm, does oracle do something with java accessibility?
<AlanBell> webczat: I can't find a link to something saying it is deprecated
<webczat> Masaybe. I'm sure that it's, but it's better to first be sure
<JanC> well, it's still needed for systems that use ATK 1.x (with bonobo)
<AlanBell> I do understand that is uses at-spi1 and corba and thus must be deprecated, but I need something to link to if I am filing a bug against it
<JanC> which includes many LTS-style distros
<AlanBell> yeah, still might be deprecated
<AlanBell> doesn't mean it can't be used, just marks it as a strategic dead end
<webczat> yes. so at least make it work :/
<JanC> AlanBell: the lack of any developers working on it might mean nobody can mark it as deprecated of course
<webczat> It was to devs as a whole actually :d
<JanC> officially 
<webczat> If jab will be there but will work I won't care.
<JanC> webczat: you might be able to get it to work with http://rdfintrospector2.blogspot.com/2009/09/bonobo-crazy-monkeys-java-at-api.html
<JanC> but that's only a temporary solution for as long as at-spi API v1 is still supported  :-/ 
<webczat> page not found
<AlanBell> works for me
<webczat> but not for me ugh
<webczat> hmm now it doea
<webczat> s/does
<webczat> No solution there.
<hajour> sorry i had a long pm 
<MrBadWiki> Aloha ka po'e apau
<webczat> Re.
<MrChrisDruif> Re.?
<webczat> :))
<hajour> also already wondering what re meant
<webczat> Hmm, going to sleep, good night all!
<hajour> still not know what Re means
<MrChrisDruif> hajour: Might be return
#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-05
<AlanBell> http://www.theopensourcerer.com/2011/05/05/speak-to-me/
<AlanBell> hajour: ^^
<hajour> ok 
<hajour> i was busy to get bigger fonts in forum
<hajour> got now resolution 92
<hajour> by preferences font size 22
<MrChrisDruif> DPI of 92
<MrChrisDruif> *
<hajour> and in chat needed font size 24
<hajour> for to be able to read
<hajour> but
<hajour> i cant click on ok button anymore by normal klick with moused
<hajour> mouse
<hajour> <hajour> o yee whoo for further help look at compiz fusion documentation website
<hajour> <hajour> ok website you get
<hajour> <hajour> with really really small fonts
<hajour> <hajour> bodhi_zazen, ^
<hajour> AlanBell, ^
<hajour> and that is the link used for visual problems to get help
<UndiFineD> thanks AlanBell 
<UndiFineD> btw I just spoke with silver-fox about the accessibility of ubuntuforums.org , let him run it through achecker.ca , he will file a bug tomorrow about it
<UndiFineD> the problem is in vbulletin 
<UndiFineD> and so likely fixing upstream would resolve not only ubuntuforums but any other forum that uses it
<MrChrisDruif> Great :D
<hajour> great
<hajour> i have bdeen by xchat channel
<hajour> abd i will get a list from them from what is needed to be change  for accessibility ans some more to get it more improved
<hajour> and i mean
<hajour> that i can take with me to uds
<hajour> now i go sleep
<hajour> goodnight all :)
<UndiFineD> http://pad.ubuntu.com/4l7eW6J3RT
<MrChrisDruif> Making good use of the new pad I see UndiFineD 
<UndiFineD> :)
<UndiFineD> may be the best way to put some focus on it
<MrChrisDruif> Yup, just start to use it. Just like paste.ubuntu.com
<jbicha> and it's not obvious, but you can pick your own name for a pad, just go to http://paste.ubuntu.com/whatever
<jbicha> (that page doesn't exist of course)
<UndiFineD> jbicha, you mean like this ? http://pad.ubuntu.com/ep/pad/create?padId=ducksauce
<jbicha> yes
<JanC> pad.ubuntu.com doesn't seem to work very well here?
<webczat> Hey.
<AlanBell> JanC: how so?
<JanC> it always says it gets disconnect almost immediately...
<JanC> """Disconnected.
<JanC> Lost connection with the EtherPad synchronization server. This may be due to a loss of network connectivity."""
<JanC> hm, seems like restarting Firefox solved this, weird
<UndiFineD> I have no idea how to fix speechdispatcher
<UndiFineD> client: Speech Dispatcher failed to open: No such file or directory
<UndiFineD> if only i knew what file or cennection
<AlanBell> UndiFineD: what have you done so far?
<UndiFineD> i tried tried several options
<UndiFineD> unix vs inet sockets 
<AlanBell> no, start at the beginning
<UndiFineD> turning of espeak and use festival instead
<AlanBell> you had a clean install of Ubuntu 10.10?
<UndiFineD> never :)
<AlanBell> 11.04?
<UndiFineD> 10.10
<UndiFineD> but never clean
<AlanBell> ok, but it is regular gnome Ubuntu
<UndiFineD> too much missing apps
<UndiFineD> yes
<AlanBell> ok, and sound works?
<UndiFineD> not on my system, but it does on the laptop for hajour
<UndiFineD> 2 soundcards bite eachouther 
<UndiFineD> but just getting rid of this message would be great
<AlanBell> so you have broken sound
<AlanBell> it is quite possibly failing to open /dev/dsp or something like that
<AlanBell> the sound output device might be the "missing file"
<UndiFineD> ls -al /dev/dsp
<UndiFineD> ls: cannot access /dev/dsp: No such file or directory
<UndiFineD> :/
<AlanBell> forget speech dispatcher and fix sound first
<UndiFineD> ok
<AlanBell> yeah, it isn't dsp, I got that bit wrong
<AlanBell> but the principal still stands!
<MrChrisDruif> Free as in speech is a principal
<UndiFineD> removed one soundcard
<UndiFineD> but the onboard does not seem to be working
<UndiFineD> nothing wrong with alsamixer
<UndiFineD>  Card: HDA Intel PCH Chip: Realtek ALC892
<popey> UndiFineD: what do you see in /proc/asound/cards ?
<UndiFineD> cat /proc/asound/cards
<UndiFineD>  0 [PCH            ]: HDA-Intel - HDA Intel PCH
<UndiFineD>                       HDA Intel PCH at 0xfa300000 irq 46
<UndiFineD>  1 [NVidia         ]: HDA-Intel - HDA NVidia
<UndiFineD>                       HDA NVidia at 0xfa080000 irq 17
<popey> two cards then
<UndiFineD> the nvidia is my gpu
<UndiFineD> os[Linux 2.6.35-29-generic x86_64] distro[Ubuntu "maverick" 10.10] cpu[8 x Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-2600 CPU @ 3.40GHz (GenuineIntel) @ 1.60GHz] mem[Physical: 7.8GB, 79.2% free] disk[Total: 1.7TB, 90.3% free] video[nVidia Corporation GF104 [GeForce GTX 460]] sound[HDA-Intel - HDA Intel PCH1: HDA-Intel - HDA NVidia]
<UndiFineD> hdmi
<UndiFineD> i also had a creative, but recently all sound stopped
<popey> you can use pulse audio mixer to set which is default output device
<UndiFineD> yeah that is fine
<popey> and what happens when you play something with mplayer for example
<popey> a simple wav file
<UndiFineD> nothing
<AlanBell> !audio
<ubot2> If you're having problems with sound, click the Volume applet, then Sound Preferences, and check your Volume, Hardware, Input, and Output settings.  If that fails, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Sound - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SoundTroubleshooting - http://alsa.opensrc.org/DmixPlugin - For playing audio files,  see !players and !mp3.
<Pendulum> AlanBell: do we have a separate pad for the non-devel stuff that came up at the last meeting (documentation, outreach) or does that still need to be moved from pad.ubuntu-uk.org
<AlanBell> needs to be put on the pad I expect
<UndiFineD> nothing, i think its dead
<UndiFineD> went through all instructions
<webczat> AlanBell: anything new about the atk-wrapper?
<AlanBell> not really webczat, but I did put it on the list of things to discuss at UDS next week
<AlanBell> it needs to get packaged in Debian
<webczat> mhm
<webczat> I'm wondering if I should install atk-wrapper from source
<UndiFineD> oh did anyone try fennec ?
<UndiFineD> the accessible mozilla browser
<UndiFineD> still very much broken i think, but they try :)
<AlanBell> how is it more accessible than firefox?
<AlanBell> isn't that just the thing for android?
<UndiFineD> yes it is also for mobiles
<JanC> Fennec is just Mozilla's mobile browser
<MrChrisDruif> Aloha Pendulum :)
<Pendulum> hi MrChrisDruif 
<MrChrisDruif> How's it going?
<MrChrisDruif> Long time no "see"
<Pendulum> not bad
<Pendulum> am on holiday
<Pendulum> I've been around, just quiet
<Pendulum> and now I'm not so much around for this week and part of next
<MrChrisDruif> Alright, can happen :)
<Pendulum> :)
<MrChrisDruif> We all deserve a vacation from time to time :)
<MrChrisDruif> Did you go on vacation (as in going out to a camping or something) or just some time off?
<Pendulum> I'm in the UK for 10 days :)
<MrChrisDruif> Ahh, so your really close for 10 days :P
<MrChrisDruif> I'm in Holland O:-) ;)
<Pendulum> :)
<MrChrisDruif> Aloha ka po'e alua
#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-06
<webczat> Heuyy.
<MrChrisDruif> Aloha ka po'e alau
<webczat> It was hey :d
<MrChrisDruif> webczat: Aloha
 * webczat is from poland :d
<MrChrisDruif> webczat: I'm from Holland O:-)
<webczat> :)
<MrChrisDruif> But I'm trying to learn Hawaiian for when I move there (if ever)
<webczat> :d
<webczat> I tested the java-atk-wrapper
<webczat> Results are negative for java.awt, positive for javax.swing
<webczat> except some things about textbox navigation
<hajour> hi all :)
<hajour> i have test openmary out.
<hajour> first results see link http://openetherpad.org/Wbr6YE3iHx
<hajour> AlanBell, ^
<webczat> hey hajour 
<hajour> hi webczat :)
<AlanBell> hajour: what is haspering in dutch?
<hajour> stoteren
<hajour> stotteren
<hajour> sec
<hajour> first was wrong fault
<AlanBell> ok, that is stuttering in English
<hajour> ok thank you AlanBell 
<webczat> I don't know this english word. :o
<AlanBell> stammering stuttering faltering perhaps
<AlanBell> not speaking smoothly anyhow
<webczat> lol! I don't know any
<hajour> what is your language webczat ?
<webczat> polish
<AlanBell> hajour: I don't understand what software you are using
<AlanBell> is this with orca?
<webczat> probably not...?
<hajour> jÄkanie  <<< webczat 
<hajour> openmary
<AlanBell> openmary does not read web pages
<hajour> what you had linkt me AlanBell 
<webczat> mhm
<AlanBell> ok, lets start from the beginning
<AlanBell> you have followed the instructions to get speech dispatcher working with openmary?
<AlanBell> so from a terminal try spd-say "hello world"
<UndiFineD> AlanBell, I tried, but came to the same error with her
<AlanBell> that should sound like espeak does
<hajour> UndiFineD,  have done it
<UndiFineD> to read the blueprint I installed browserspek
<UndiFineD> browserspeak
<UndiFineD> and the voices it uses are a bit choppy
<hajour> orca was shut down my whole pc AlanBell 
<AlanBell> yeah, that doesn't use speech dispatcher
<webczat> lol, I just read "to read the blueprint i installed AlanBell "
<AlanBell> heh
<UndiFineD> orca still crashes and logs out the user btw
<AlanBell> I have never had orca crash on me
<hajour> and this laptop is bought in 2010
<AlanBell> however that doesn't matter
<webczat> Hmm, I've had orca crashes, but not logouts or (oh no!) pc shutdown.
<hajour> its from my 16 year daughter this laptop
<AlanBell> I want to know if you have speech dispatcher working
<AlanBell> what happens when you go to a terminal and enter
<AlanBell> spd-say "hello world"
<UndiFineD> when you quit orca, it seems to shutdown the accessibility profile which logs out the user
<UndiFineD> client: Speech Dispatcher failed to open: No such file or directory
<hajour> AlanBell, ^
<AlanBell> right, you have something broken still
<webczat> Btw, AlanBell; I just tested java-atk-wrapper. Seems to be complete but having some major bugs. For example text fields are not fully accessible, but it works and it's possible to navigate it.
<UndiFineD> indeed something
<UndiFineD> but there is no way in telling what that is
<webczat> But java awt apps aren't accessible.
<hajour> have also good news.ubuntu forums have used the accessibility link .what had given much accessibility bugs.they now go try to improve it AlanBell 
<AlanBell> UndiFineD: http://mumble.libertus.co.uk:59125/
<AlanBell> choose a voice
<AlanBell> and does it make a sound?
<UndiFineD> it works on hajour her computer, not on mine, my audio is still broken
<hajour> tested
<UndiFineD> she says the sound is a bit choppy here too
<AlanBell> ok, now download the sound file
<AlanBell> link at the bottom of the page
<AlanBell> save it as voice.wav
<AlanBell> in fact, better idea, one sec . . .
<AlanBell> go to a terminal window again and paste this
<AlanBell> wget http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/mary.wav
<AlanBell> play mary.wav
<AlanBell> does that sound choppy?
<hajour> with saving its the same results
<AlanBell> what model laptop is it?
<UndiFineD> recent hp
<AlanBell> ok, there is no way that should not be able to play sound
<AlanBell> so you can't play any music on it, use skype, do anything like that?
<UndiFineD> mine is a desktop
<hajour> same with terminal
<AlanBell> so you have a desktop which is silent, and an HP laptop with choppy audio
 * webczat is not happy, I can't use skype, it's qt ugh...
<UndiFineD> no, sound hardware seems broken, just like some sata ports
<AlanBell> you are not missing much webczat 
<AlanBell> can you try a live CD?
<UndiFineD> i did, no solution
<webczat> AlanBell: I used skype before.
<webczat> On windows.
<webczat> Until I went to text mode mini-linux in like 2005.
<AlanBell> hajour: you are bringing that laptop to UDS?
<hajour> yes AlanBell 
<AlanBell> ok, get someone to fix it there
<webczat> I still have a serial hardware synthesizer.
<AlanBell> you are not going to be able to do anything with speech programs without clean audio
<AlanBell> UndiFineD: I might be able to fix the desktop remotely
<hajour> ok AlanBell 
<UndiFineD> hmmm
<AlanBell> so the desktop has no audio at all, is that right?
<hajour> he only hears noise
<hajour> when he try to hear something
<hajour> AlanBell, ^
 * webczat is bored
<MrChrisDruif> webczat: Wanna talk about something so you aren't bored anymore?
<hajour> hee MrChrisDruif :)
<MrChrisDruif> Aloha hajour :)
<hajour> i was wondering.if i am at uds .i use a headset for to hear what is put on chat.how i can hear then the 1 who speaks on that moment ?
<MrChrisDruif> Only put one headset piece on?
<Daniel0108> hi hajour, MrChrisDruif 
<Daniel0108> hajour: check your memos ;)
<hajour> ok Daniel0108 :)
<hajour> where is that for Daniel0108 ? :)
<Daniel0108> PM please
<UndiFineD> Daniel0108, I hope you are not sending out IRC memos
<Daniel0108> UndiFineD: I am, why?
<webczat> MrChrisDruif: I'm currently trying to understand parts of a java spec
<UndiFineD> they are annoying
<Daniel0108> UndiFineD: hmm.. I don't send many Memos, just when somebody is not answering my PMs ;)
<Daniel0108> that's like my 2nd memo I think :P
<Daniel0108> or my 3rd
<UndiFineD> well, first try if the person youre sending is available
<hajour> he not mean it rude Daniel0108 :)
<Daniel0108> UndiFineD: I'm always trying to PM first ;)
<Daniel0108> hajour: I know :)
<hajour> but i oftenda need UndiFineD  to get it able to read the memo s 
<hajour> Daniel0108, 
<Daniel0108> okay
<JanC> http://blogs.igalia.com/mario/2011/05/05/webkit-contributors-meeting-sockets-plugs/ --> interresting
 * webczat sings
#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-07
<webczat> Hey.
<hajour> hi all i am not long around but just wanted to share this info.i go get help from netherlands members for the city hall project for people who are long without a job.
<hajour> need to go eat so and pack my suitcase for uds
<hajour> bye and for who go to uds till tomorrow :))
#ubuntu-accessibility 2011-05-08
<UndiFineD> alright, hajour is on her way to AMS airport
<hypatia> hey does anyone in the channel know about braille displays?
<hypatia> specifically, i'm curious about what non-alpha characters they display
<hypatia> and non-contractions
<MrChrisDruif> hypatia: Sorry, I've only come to this channel to help the team/keep a check on it. I can't help you :(
<hypatia> that's alright, thanks MrChrisDruif  :)
<MrChrisDruif> hypatia: Just letting you know this channel isn't "dead"
<MrChrisDruif> But as I understand it, you are blind hypatia ?
<Pendulum> hypatia: TheMuso might know. He'll be at UDS
<hypatia> Pendulum: yay
<hypatia> MrChrisDruif: i'm sighted, and i want to build a testing interface so that sighted devs can test braille console stuff
<hypatia> the idea is that 1) most sighted devs don't know braille and 2) braille displays are expensive
<MrChrisDruif> That would seem true
<hypatia> so i want to build a braille display emulator for sighted use
<hypatia> basically an arduino and an lcd display
<MrChrisDruif> How would that work?
<hypatia> well, right now, you boot into a brtty console and it plays braille on your braille display
<hypatia> the user who knows braille reads the braille display
<hypatia> this would emulate the braille display
<hypatia> but instead of dots, would translate the braille to letters on an LCD display
<hypatia> it came from wanting to work on a brtty bug
<hypatia> i have access to a braille display (belongs to a friend, she's happy to lend it to me)
<hypatia> but then i remembered i've forgotten braille
<hypatia> (i taught myself braille in grade 4 for reasons i don't recall)
 * MrChrisDruif never learned braille :(
<hypatia> but this resulted in the idea of a braille display emulator
<hypatia> which would cost <$100 and enable sighted users to work on brtty bugs
<hypatia> or any braille terminal related bugs
<hypatia> does that make any more sense? :)
<MrChrisDruif> So....it's an emulator/translator....for something that was originally text already?
<hypatia> hmm this brings up a good point
<hypatia> i wonder if one could just connect the output from brtty to a terminal emulator of another type
<MrChrisDruif> Indeed
<hypatia> oooh
<hypatia> http://mielke.cc/brltty/doc/drivers/index.html
<hypatia> it is likely that i need to learn more about braille displays in order to be able to spec out this project
<MrChrisDruif> Good luck with that :)
<hypatia> thanks, MrChrisDruif 
<MrChrisDruif> Your welcome :)
<AlanBell> 2/58
<MrChrisDruif> AlanBell: What?
<AlanBell> oh, sorry was just switching to window 58!
<AlanBell> hypatia: I have been talking to some of the various on-screen keyboard developers to see which ones have multi-touch and steno layouts on the roadmap
<UndiFineD> AlanBell, what about Daniel0108 ?
<AlanBell> not sure what you mean UndiFineD?
<UndiFineD> Daniel works on Touchlay
<UndiFineD> so he might something there
<UndiFineD> *have
<webczat> What things are currently ... inaccessible in unity?
<webczat> How do you get to the indicator from a keyboard?
<AlanBell> alt+f1 gets keyboard focus on the unity sidebar
<AlanBell> then you can go up and down, and right to pop out a little menu by each option
<webczat> I'm not in unity but in the gnome2 thing. Not only because I heart unity is inaccessible or not as accessible as it should, but also because I don't have 3d.
<webczat> like not yet
<webczat> No idea? using an arrow key (right/left) actually makes me unable to leave the panel at all!
<webczat> unless I click the indicator applet and escape
<hajour> UndiFineD, 
<hajour> i am arrived
<Pendulum> hajour: glad you got there safely :)
<hajour> i had delay almost mist the next plain.and they lost my bags
<Daniel0108> hi hajour! :)
<Daniel0108> I'm in budapest, hajour
<hajour> a ok :)
<hajour> great Daniel0108 
<Daniel0108> hajour: where are you?
<Daniel0108> afk, dinner :P
<hajour> in the hall
<Daniel0108> oh, I'm in the Agape Hotel :P
<Daniel0108> bye now :)
<UndiFineD> hoi hajour 
<hajour> hi ...
#ubuntu-accessibility 2012-05-02
<SeaJay> I took a quick look through the UDS-Q sessions for next week, and no accessibility related sessions jumped out at me. Will there be any accessibility related sessions next week?
<Pendulum> I keep meaning to propose one, I've just had a bunch on my plate
<Pendulum> it's on my list for today for the accessibility community team for sure
<Pendulum> TheMuso` (Luke Yelavich) is the person to talk to about a devel session
<SeaJay> OK, NP Pendulum.
#ubuntu-accessibility 2012-05-03
<Fudge> nautilus copy files window still doesnt always show the information of files that are being copied, sometimes orca just says window label, file operations, flat review content says filler
<Fudge> can anyone reproduce this?
<MrChrisDruif> Does someone here have the knowledge to help someone with drivers (etc...) to make a fingerprint reader work in 12.04?
<TheMuso> MrChrisDruif: Try #ubutu perhaps?
<TheMuso> #ubuntu even
<MrChrisDruif> Yeah, it's not for me (I don't even have one of those things). But I thought "here" might be more knowledge in that direction
<MrChrisDruif> It was for someone in #ubuntu-offtopic
<TheMuso> oK
<MrChrisDruif> Anyhow, thanks ^_^
<TheMuso> np
#ubuntu-accessibility 2012-05-04
<Pendulum> proposed for UDS: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-q-accessibility-community-team-plans
#ubuntu-accessibility 2012-05-05
<colonelqubit> Which has better orca support? Lubuntu or Xubuntu?
#ubuntu-accessibility 2013-05-03
<Fudge> anyone have any insight to Jeff's email to accessibility list
#ubuntu-accessibility 2014-04-28
<Sk1d> hi
<Sk1d> is there a why i can make the caps-lock key work like a sticky shift-key so it is possible to write special characters with caps-lock? on a German keyboard using windows this is the standard behavior. I already wrote this here: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/lubuntu-users/2014-April/007097.html
#ubuntu-accessibility 2014-04-29
<stere0123> Hi, I am trying to install "SpeechControl" on Ubuntu 12.04 but no matter what I try the PPA's don't work and I can't find any sources. Is support for that provided here?
#ubuntu-accessibility 2014-05-03
<moza> Hello
<moza> I managed to change the default police size to something bigger within thunderbird, but that only changes the police within one message, not the menus and the list of messages. Is there any way to make all this bigger?
<moza> I would like to avoid loosing resolution for the whole screen
<moza> and i am already using the option "big text" within gnome
#ubuntu-accessibility 2016-05-04
<phillw> Hi, if there is a bug that causes its window to flicker quite noticebly, does it warrant a higher rating because of the possibility of bringing on a bout of epilepsy in people who are succeptable to such triggers?
